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Division III basketball (Posting Up) => Men's Basketball => Region 7 men's basketball => Topic started by: WoosterFAN on January 27, 2005, 10:51:56 AM

Title: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 27, 2005, 10:51:56 AM
1/26 Games
No. 3 Wooster 90, Allegheny 57  
No. 11 Wittenberg 75, Earlham 48  
Wabash 72, Ohio Wesleyan 46
Denison 76, Oberlin 56

No. 15 Baldwin-Wallace 93, No. 4 John Carroll 81
No. 6 Albion 74, Kalamazoo 63
No. 16 Hanover 72, Mt. St. Joseph 71
No. 23 Calvin 90, Tri-State 82  
Capital 83, Heidelberg 69
Hope 79, Alma 59
Otterbein 83, Ohio Northern 82
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 27, 2005, 06:57:42 PM
1/29  
Wabash @ Oberlin     WABASH  
Kenyon @ Allegheny   GATORS  
Denison @ Wittenberg WITT (And it could be ugly)  
OWU @ Hiram          OWU  
Earlham @ Wooster    WOOSTER  

2/2  
Wooster @ Kenyon     SCOTS  
Wittenberg @ Wabash  TIGERS  
Denison @ Earlham    EARLHAM  
Oberlin @ OWU        OWU  
Kenyon @ Hiram       LORDS  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: W. H. Harmon on January 27, 2005, 11:21:57 PM
How can Kenyon be playing twice in the same night? The schedule is 2/2 Allegheny at Hiram, so here are my picks:

1/29  
Wabash @ Oberlin- Wabash
Kenyon @ Allegheny- Allegheny
Denison @ Wittenberg- Wittenberg  
OWU @ Hiram- Hiram (sooner or later they will win a tough game, might as well be this one. I guess Terrier fans can only hope)
Earlham @ Wooster- Wooster  

2/2  
Wooster @ Kenyon- Wooster
Wittenberg @ Wabash- Wittenberg  
Denison @ Earlham- Earlham
Oberlin @ OWU- OWU  
Allegheny @ Hiram- Hiram  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scott Fendley on January 28, 2005, 12:04:12 AM
1/29  
Wabash @ Oberlin- BASH
Kenyon @ Allegheny- GHENY
Denison @ Wittenberg- WITT
OWU @ Hiram- HIRAM
Earlham @ Wooster- WOO

2/2  
Wooster @ Kenyon- WOO
Wittenberg @ Wabash- BASH
Denison @ Earlham- EARLHAM
Oberlin @ OWU- OWU  
Allegheny @ Hiram- GHENY
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2005, 10:03:09 AM
I think that's what we get for not waiting for Greg.  I'm holding out for his "official" slate of games, especially since he'll give us the non-conference game of the week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on January 28, 2005, 02:05:36 PM
Well, I can't wait.

1/29
Wabash at Oberlin - Wabash
Kenyon at Allegheny - Allegheny
Denison at Wittenberg - Witt
OWU at Hiram - OWU
Earlham at Wooster - WOO

2/2
Wooster at Kenyon - WOO
Witt at Wabash - Witt
Denison at Earlham - Earlham
Oberlin at OWU - OWU
Alleghey at Hiram - Hiram
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 28, 2005, 03:02:42 PM
DC - In case Greg is MIA or sick/shut in - I nominate the following non-NCAC regional game of the week (I could not find a better match up):

2/1
#23 Calvin at #6 Albion

Albion is 1a in MIAA and Calvin is 1b.  Each have one loss.  Calvin lost by 3 at home to Albion three weeks ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 28, 2005, 03:06:57 PM
Not trying to steal your thunder, Greg. :-)

My pick (Just in case):
2/1  
#23 Calvin at #6 Albion   ALBION
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 28, 2005, 03:20:46 PM
1/29
Wabash at Oberlin - Wabash
Kenyon at Allegheny - Allegheny
Denison at Wittenberg - Witt
OWU at Hiram - OWU
Earlham at Wooster - WOO

2/2
Wooster at Kenyon - WOO
Witt at Wabash - Witt
Denison at Earlham - Denison
Oberlin at OWU - OWU
Alleghey at Hiram - Hiram

Calvin at Albion - Calvin
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on January 28, 2005, 04:45:39 PM
Sorry, Greg. It's going on 5pm on Friday, and I need to make my picks. I hope all is well.

1/29
Wabash at Oberlin - Wabash
Kenyon at Allegheny - Allegheny
Denison at Wittenberg - Wittenberg
OWU at Hiram - OWU
Earlham at Wooster - Wooster

2/2
Wooster at Kenyon - Wooster
Witt at Wabash - Wabash
Denison at Earlham - Denison
Oberlin at OWU - OWU
Alleghey at Hiram - Allegheny

Calvin at Albion - Calvin
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scott Fendley on January 28, 2005, 04:59:41 PM
I'll take Albion in that regional game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooScotsFan on January 28, 2005, 11:42:40 PM
1/29  
Wabash @ Oberlin = Wabash  
Kenyon @ Allegheny = Allegheny  
Denison @ Wittenberg = Wittenberg
OWU @ Hiram = OWU
Earlham @ Wooster = Wooster, Go Scots!  

2/2  
Wooster @ Kenyon = Wooster, Go Scots!  
Wittenberg @ Wabash = Wittenberg  
Denison @ Earlham = Earlham  
Oberlin @ OWU = OWU  
Allegheny @ Hiram = Hiram  

Calvin @ Albion = Albion
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2005, 11:28:39 AM
The inmates are running the asylum...me too, I guess!

1/29  
Wabash at Oberlin...Wabash has had trouble in Oberlin in the recent past; plus, nobody else is calling the upset  
Kenyon at Allegheny  
Denison at Wittenberg...by a lot  
OWU at Hiram...why not  
Earlham at Wooster...completing the home-team sweep

2/2  
Wooster at Kenyon  
Wittenberg at Wabash  
Denison at Earlham  
Oberlin at OWU  
Alleghey at Hiram  

Calvin at Albion
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scots Hoops Fan on January 29, 2005, 12:54:14 PM
What happened to GT?

1/29  
Wabash at Oberlin - Wabash  
Kenyon at Allegheny - 'Gheny  
Denison at Wittenberg - Witt  
OWU at Hiram - OWU - The way the Bishops have been going lately I am almost tempted to pick the Pups.  
Earlham at Wooster - COW - GO SCOTS!!!

2/2  
Wooster at Kenyon - COW - GO SCOTS!!!
Witt at Wabash - Witt  
Denison at Earlham - Earlham  
Oberlin at OWU - OWU  
Alleghey at Hiram - Hiram  

Calvin at Albion - Albion
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 04, 2005, 12:58:17 PM
It is FRI afternoon so....GT - Really, I am not trying to step on your toes but are still keeping the standings before they scroll off the board?

2/5  
Wabash at #3 Wooster
Hiram at #9 Wittenberg
Allegheny at Denison
Earlham at Ohio Wesleyan
Kenyon at Oberlin

2/9
#3 Wooster at Allegheny
#9 Wittenberg at Earlham
Kenyon at Hiram
Denison at Oberlin
Ohio Wesleyan at Wabash
 
Regional game of the week (at least my choice, GT's could trump)
2/9
#8 John Carrol at Capital for 1st place in OAC
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greg Thomas on February 04, 2005, 01:30:02 PM
My apologies, guys.  I've simply been too busy this season to stay on top of the pick 'em like I have in the past.  I'm afraid that 2004-2005 NCAC pick 'em has stalled.  I'm very sorry for dropping the ball this season.  I have every intention of coming back strong for the 2005-2006 season.  

I do appreciate everybody playing along and, again, I'm very sorry for not being able to stay on top of it this year for you guys.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on February 04, 2005, 04:27:33 PM
2/5
Wabash at Wooster - Woo
Hiram at Witt - Witt
Allegheny at Denison - ALL
Earlham at OWU - OWU
Kenyon at Oberlin - Ken

2/9
Wooster at Allegheny - WOO
Witt at Earlham - Witt
Kenyon at Hiram - Hiram
Denison at Oberlin - Den
OWU at Wabash - Wabash

Regional Game:

John Carroll at Capital - Capital
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2005, 04:50:57 PM
No sweat, Greg, we all understand.  I'm only glad it happened this year when I'm trailing the pack, rather than...rather than...well, okay, I stink at this. :-)

With nobody keeping score, I'll just use my space to opine on certain games.
2/5:  Wooster comes to life and thrashes Wabash.  Denison stays on course.  I like the Earlham/OWU game; OWU needs it more.
2/9:  Earlham keeps it respectable but Witt prevails; Wabash needs this win to finish third.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scott Fendley on February 04, 2005, 06:55:55 PM
Wabash at #3 Wooster - WOO by a nose
Hiram at #9 Wittenberg - WITT
Allegheny at Denison - DENISON
Earlham at Ohio Wesleyan - OWU
Kenyon at Oberlin - OBERLIN

2/9  
#3 Wooster at Allegheny - WOO
#9 Wittenberg at Earlham - WITT
Kenyon at Hiram - HIRAM
Denison at Oberlin - OBERLIN
Ohio Wesleyan at Wabash - WABASH

Regional game of the week (at least my choice, GT's could trump)  
2/9  
#8 John Carrol at Capital for 1st place in OAC - CAPITAL
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CMHScotsFan on February 04, 2005, 07:19:28 PM
2/5  
Wabash at Wooster - Wooster in a much easier game that the one at Crawfordsville.
Hiram at Witt - Witt by 40
Allegheny at Denison - Big Red at home
Earlham at OWU - OWU at home
Kenyon at Oberlin - Kenyon

2/9  
Wooster at Allegheny - Wooster continues its domination over the Gators.
Witt at Earlham - Witt.  Earlham doesn't have enough 'decent' players against the tough Tiger D.
Kenyon at Hiram - Hiram at home.  
Denison at Oberlin - Denison
OWU at Wabash - Wabash at home  

Regional Game:  

John Carroll at Capital - Capital as the Streaks seem to be fading.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 04, 2005, 09:24:39 PM
Greg - No problem.  I had to take a hiatus at one point as the military had me "otherwise occupied".  No worries.  If you don't mind, I'll continue to post the games weekly but running totals are OBE, I think.  

And now that the pressue is off:

2/5  
Wabash at Wooster   WOO
Hiram at Wittenberg WITT, duh!
Allegheny at Denison DENISON
Earlham at Ohio Wesleyan OWU
Kenyon at Oberlin KENYON

2/9  
Wooster at Allegheny WOO (Witt tune-up)
Wittenberg at Earlham  WITT (pre-Woo road test, could be close)
Kenyon at Hiram  KENYON
Denison at Oberlin DENISON
Ohio Wesleyan at Wabash WABASH

2/9  
John Carrol at Capital - JCU
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2005, 09:30:02 PM
Order of the British Empire?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 05, 2005, 04:33:58 PM
Overcome By Events!! LOL. Military term.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 09, 2005, 11:36:29 PM
2/5  
#3 Wooster 76, Wabash 52
#9 Wittenberg 106, Hiram 60
Denison 88, Allegheny 75  
Ohio Wesleyan 71, Earlham 62
Kenyon 67, Oberlin 46

2/9  
#3 Wooster 97, Allegheny 61  
#6 Wittenberg, Earlham 54
Denison 70, Oberlin 47
Kenyon 78, Hiram 69  
Wabash 60, Ohio Wesleyan 53  

Key GL Regional game
No. 15 John Carroll 73, Capital 69
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 11, 2005, 02:27:40 PM
2/11
#3 Wooster at #6 Wittenberg
Earlham at Kenyon
Hiram at Oberlin
Allegheny at Ohio Wesleyan
Wabash at Denison

2/16
Oberlin at Allegheny
Kenyon at Denison
#3 Wooster at Hiram
OWU at #6 Wittenberg
Wabash at Earlham

Key GL Regional Game
2/12
Otterbein at #15 John Carroll -  
- Otterbein started 3-4 but has gone 13-3 since and is second in the OAC with 1 loss to JCU among 4 league losses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scott Fendley on February 11, 2005, 02:32:40 PM
2/12 (They ain't playin' tonight!)

#3 Wooster at #6 Wittenberg - WITT
Earlham at Kenyon - EARLHAM
Hiram at Oberlin - OBERLIN
Allegheny at Ohio Wesleyan - OWU
Wabash at Denison - BASH

2/16
Oberlin at Allegheny - GHENY
Kenyon at Denison - DENISON
#3 Wooster at Hiram - WOO
OWU at #6 Wittenberg - WITT
Wabash at Earlham - BASH

Key GL Regional Game
2/12
Otterbein at #15 John Carroll - JCU
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 11, 2005, 11:39:50 PM
2/11  
#3 Wooster at #6 Wittenberg WOO Gotta do it
Earlham at Kenyon  EARLHAM
Hiram at Oberlin  OBERLIN??
Allegheny at Ohio Wesleyan OWU
Wabash at Denison WABASH

2/16  
Oberlin at Allegheny  GATORS
Kenyon at Denison DENISON
#3 Wooster at Hiram WOO (let's hope we're #3 still)
OWU at #6 Wittenberg WITT
Wabash at Earlham EARLHAM

Key GL Regional Game  
2/12  
Otterbein at #15 John Carroll - JCU
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CMHScotsFan on February 12, 2005, 07:40:36 AM
2/12
#3 Wooster at #6 Wittenberg Wooster - gotta stick with the Scots
Earlham at Kenyon Earlham, in a close one
Hiram at Oberlin Hiram?
Allegheny at Ohio Wesleyan OWU
Wabash at Denison Denison at home

2/16  
Oberlin at Allegheny Gators
Kenyon at Denison Denison
#3 Wooster at Hiram Wooster by a ton
OWU at #6 Wittenberg Witt
Wabash at Earlham Wabash

Key GL Regional Game  
2/12  
Otterbein at #15 John Carroll JCU in a close one
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on February 12, 2005, 04:07:25 PM
2/12
Wooster at Witt - Witt
Earlham at Kenyon - Earlham
Alleghey at OWU - OWU
Wabash at Denison - Wabash

2/16
Oberlin at Allegheny - AC
Kenyon at Denison - Denison
Wooster at Hiram - Woo
Wabash at Earlahm - Wabash

Regional Game
2/12
Otterbein at John Carroll - Otterbein
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 12, 2005, 08:13:34 PM
2/12  and WOO/WITT at half Tigers up 4

Wabash 93, Denison 83  
OWU 83, Allegheny 65
Hiram 74, Oberlin 71
Earlham 66, Kenyon 57
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 12, 2005, 08:14:46 PM
For those who picked JCU....Congrats.

#15 John Carroll 86, Otterbein 73
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: C.M.L. on March 01, 2005, 02:08:58 AM
Wooster v Baldwin-Wallace   Wooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on May 12, 2005, 08:37:38 AM
Thank you Billy for starting a conversation about basketball.  I realize that Wooster has a very good baseball team but I would much rather talk hoops.  Just my opinion!!  I was just starting to get curious about incoming recruits from around the league.  Does anyone have any info? Except for Wooster and Witt the rest of the league really needs some help.  Hopefully the rest of the league, including OWU, can get some guys that will be able to contribute and make the league more competitive.  Man I can't wait for November!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on May 12, 2005, 11:16:08 AM
I have been told they will show up in Springfield in a few months.

You never say directly that these are basketball recruits.  Are they, or are you just assuming that they are?  Could it be that these are three kids who just want to attend Wittenberg, for whatever reason, just like hundreds of others each year?    

Another interesting schedule for the Scots, with a heavy presence of teams coming off good-but-not-great seasons, including high finishers in three of the toughest conferences in D3 hoops.  
Van Wie: Figure UST (17-9, 2nd place MIAC) to take on Stout (13-11, t4th WIAC) in the first round, with Wooster meeting K'zoo (7-18).  UST was at the Van Wie two season ago, losing to Wooster by 12.  Scot fans will recall losing at Kalamazoo 3 season back, one of just 3 losses (Witt, Williams) in the run to national 3rd place.  Don't be lulled by Stout's ordinary record; any upper-division WIAC team is a threat to beat anybody, anywhere, anytime.
E&H Invite:  Methodist was 20-8, and won the USAC regular season and tournament titles.  Shenandoah, who played Wooster close in January, finished 3rd in that conference.  Thomas More (7-18) is joining the PrAC this year, and might be moved into the GL Region by the NCAA.  If so, this could be one of a maximum six non-conference regional games for the Scots.  E&H was 10-15 but is always a threat under legendary coach Bob Johnson; they beat ODAC champ VWC in January, when VWC was 11-0.
Mose Hole: We all know about B-WC (20-9), who will have Tori Davis back.  Lycoming went 17-8 and will doubtless face the Jackets in the first game.  Thiel (8-19) gets the traditional first-round thumping this year, the spot that used to be CWRU's.
W&J Classic:  The hosts (10-18) were terrible last year, and SUNY-Maritime (3-22, 1-13 in the abysmal Skyline Conf.) was worse.  New Jersey was 17-9 and finished 2nd (to Ramapo) in the NJAC, and I'd expect them the be the Scots' first round opponent.

And Wittenberg before Christmas?  Wow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hopefan on May 12, 2005, 01:32:04 PM
Dave : ???legendary????? coach Bob Johnson  -  because I knew him long ago, I guess I'm wondering what has qualified him as "legendary"?????  (ok, I know he's been at E&H for over 20 years)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on May 12, 2005, 02:34:00 PM
Wooster has a trip to VA and a trip to PA.  Should we plan on another trip east in MAR2006?
What do we need?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on May 12, 2005, 06:49:20 PM
Yes, recruits...as I said, I don't know of any Lutheran background for any of the three (though I'm fairly certain in saying that Coleman is not).

Oh, and before anyone accuses me of being sour over Earlham not getting any of the three, the Quakers only showed moderate interest in one (Beck).

In fact, it was such lack of interest that led me to shake my head upon seeing intending to play for the Tigers. I don't think Bill Brown has found diamonds in the rough. I guess I'm just amazed that he has that much money with which to mine.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on May 12, 2005, 10:10:35 PM
I'm fairly sure that there are students at Witt who are neither Lutheran nor basketball players, but I guess you mean to say definitively that they are basketball recruits.  In which case I'd guess that they see something in them that you don't, or vice versa.

Bob Johnson may not be the most successful coach in D3, but he's well-respected for having made so much lemonade from so many lemons over the years.

I wouldn't plan on a March trip east, Fan, but I wouldn't rule it out either.  I'm sure that's the goal of this team.  The only graduation losses were Matt Schlingman, Blake Mealer, and Isaac Ward.  Each will be hard to replace in his own way, but if Cody Drake is the post-playing stud he's reputed to be, that will go a long way towards salving the wound.  The Scots will return 4 starters and 10 players that averaged at least 5 minutes, and be led by all-conference performers Kyle Witucky and Tom Port.  And that's before we know what new faces will arrive this fall.  I'd say that the goals for this team are sky-high, or at least as high as the Blue Ridge Parkway! :-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scots Hoops Fan on May 13, 2005, 10:03:24 AM
David, what's the story on Cody Drake?  Was he injured last year?  I don't remember seeing him even in any JV action.  Just curious, because I would have thought that if he was as good as advertised, he would at least suit up and possibly see some PT as a frosh like Bradley and Stevens did their freshman seasons. Maybe I just wasn't paying close enough attention.

As for Wooster's goals for the upcoming season, I would say that Salem is definately a goal of this team.  Once again they have a ton of talent back with only a couple of key losses.  And that doesn't include the newbies either, of which you can always count on Moore & the rest of his staff to bring in at least a couple of studs.

Sorry Bishopsfan, but I have to give props to the Fighting Scot Baseball team as well.  They swept all of the major conference awards this past season.  Congrats to:

Luke Ullman - Player of the Year  
Jon Oliver - Picher of the Year
Pat Christensen - Newcomer of the Year

Good luck to the Scots as they represent the NCAC in the Regionals and hopefully on to the DIII World Series for the first time since 1997!

GO SCOTS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on May 13, 2005, 05:37:34 PM
Cody was out last year rehabbing an injury he suffered in a pre-season car accident--it was his foot IIRC (but I often don't RC, so corrections and amplifications are welcome.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scots Hoops Fan on May 14, 2005, 09:32:21 AM
Thanks for that DC.  I would imagine Cody should still have 4 years of eligibility left.  It will be interesting if he will use them.  I have also heard that Tom Port is going to use his 2 remaining years of eligibility.

GO SCOTS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scott Fendley on May 16, 2005, 12:33:42 AM
Does Wooster have a grad program or something? Wouldn't Port have graduated in four years?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scots Hoops Fan on May 16, 2005, 10:00:03 AM
When Port transferred in from Miami of Ohio he had 4 years of eligibility to play basketball at the College of Wooster if he chose to use them.  From what I've heard he is going to use all 4 years.  As for the question of graduating in 4 years, there is no rule that states that you have to graduate in 4 years.  It took me 5 years and I had some friends that we used to joke were on the 10 year plan.  They were professional students.

Here is some baseball news to pass along:

Wooster gained the #1 seed in their regional which will be held at a neutral site this coming weekend.  Rose-Hulman will be hosting the regional that includes the following teams:

#1 - The College of Wooster (Ohio) 33-7  
#2 - Manchester College (Ind.) 30-12  
#3 - Otterbein College (Ohio) 28-14  
#4 - Webster University (Mo.) 24-11  
#5 - Millsaps College (Miss.) 29-15  
#6 - Adrian College (Mich.) 26-14  

GO SCOTS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on May 16, 2005, 10:55:12 AM
SHF, there's a baseball chat started over in the Midwest Region.  It is pretty much dormant, but if you were looking to find people who actually wanted to discuss the upcoming playoffs, you might try posting there.

Ryan Snyder was a fifth-year senior for Wooster last year.  He had transferred to Kent State after his plebe year (for personal, not basketball, reasons) but transferred back the following season, so he still had three years of eligibility left.  He arranged it so that he was still a matriculated student in that fifth year.  For most D3 players who have an opportunity to play as a fifth-year senior, I think the issue is less about academic credits and more about finances.  At least Snyder and Port spent their extra years at state universities, which lessens the bite a bit.  If Drake was indeed redshirted (no reason to suspect otherwise), he (or his folks) are looking at five years of Wooster tuition for him to play four years of hoops.  I know zilch about Cody or his family, but that would be a mighty big hit on the pocketbook of Average Joe.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scott Fendley on May 16, 2005, 04:57:11 PM
I know you can take as long as you want, but it's very rare here to be on the five-year plan because of the way the courses and degrees are structured.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on May 16, 2005, 08:18:56 PM
Yes, it is rare; that's why I mentioned that Snyder did it at the same school just last year.  So clearly it is do-able, at least at Wooster.  It helps when you have time to plan ahead; Snyder was a rising junior when he realized he had 3 years of eligibility left, and Port was a rising sophomore.  Drake found out even earlier, maybe before he even enrolled at the college.

Anyway, maybe it's less rare at Wooster than other NCAC schools.  I had fraternity brothers on the five-year plan.  Scions of the wealthy, all.

And oh by the way, Wooster does offer postgraduate degrees, but they are in music.  I'm guessing that this is not an option for Port or Drake! :-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scots Hoops Fan on May 17, 2005, 09:10:05 AM
Good point DC.  I would have to guess that the main reason the five-year plan is rare at schools like Wooster is financial.  If you have time to plan out how to strech out your graduation past 4 years its really not that difficult.  You could pick up a minor or two for example.  Finacially speaking, now that is another matter entirely.  This is where Drake's decision will differ from Port's or Snyder's, because Drake would be spending 5 years at Wooster which is far more than 4 at Wooster and 1 at a state school.  

Wasn't redshirting a common practice in the WIAC as well until they changed the rule?  Again, financially, it was more doable at WIAC schools because they are state run and tuition is far less than your typical DIII colleges.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scott Fendley on May 17, 2005, 10:07:12 AM
Yeah, it was much easier in the WIAC. One of those schools made the news because they had a student that hadn't graduated after 10 years or so and amassed an ungodly amount of credits.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scots Hoops Fan on May 17, 2005, 10:23:24 AM
Another one of those professional students!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on May 19, 2005, 10:34:50 AM
I am not sure what kind of "stud" Drake is. If I remember correctly, he was HM for his league and his team was 4-16 his senior year and did not average more than 7 rbs per game according to the ABJ.  So at 6-8 in high school not to average more than 15 ppg or 7 rpg does not sound like stud potential.
I actually think that Mealer will be tough to replace.  A big strong Post player in the mold of Nelson or Mealer is missing especially on defense.
We will see...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scots Hoops Fan on May 19, 2005, 04:19:43 PM
WF,

I would say that Evan Will showed me some signs last season that he will be able to step in and fill Mealer's role.  He may not be quite as bulky as Mealer, but he is definately quicker and he is still a wide body in the middle.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on May 19, 2005, 05:23:53 PM
Will played wing most of the time last year.  He'd have to grow some and learn to play back-to-basket to be a significant post presence.  I don't agree, however, that Mealer will be a big loss.  He was a very talented player, but he didn't seem to be highly motivated.  When he was "into" the game, he could be a force, but sometimes he played like he was asleep.  Schlingman will be a huge loss, but I'm fairly comfortable with a post rotation involving Bradley, Vandervaart, Drake, and any recruits.  Maybe that's not Ellenwood and Gorman, or even Russ and Borchers, but it should be good enough to win games with Port, Witucky, and company.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooScotsFan on May 22, 2005, 02:57:40 PM
Congrats to the Wooster Scots baseball team on winning the NCAA Regional this weekend!

Wooster went 4-0 in the regional as they knocked off Adrian (MI), Webster (MO) and Otterbein (OH) twice to claim the regional championship.  Wooster shortstop Luke Ullman was named the MVP of the regional tournament.

Wooster, which was #3 in the last national poll, will play next weekend in the Division III World Series in Wisconsin (8 teams competing for the national title).

GO SCOTS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WittHoops on May 22, 2005, 07:20:38 PM
I am a new poster and a Witt fan. I've really enjoyed visiting this website, especially during the basketball season when opinions flow freely. It's always good to get views from so many perspectives. I have to comment on the recent posting by Billy Pilgrim:
"Does financial aid really flow so freely from the golden streets of Springfield?"
Having a son and daughter that enrolled at Witt, I can say that their decision was based on the quality of education and reputation. We gladly pay the tuition for those aspects, and have not experienced any preferential treatment "flowing" in any direction.  
Looking forward to another exciting basketball season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on May 23, 2005, 06:40:22 PM
hey wooscotsfan,

Here's a group to talk about d3 baseball.


http://sports.groups.yahoo.com/group/3dbaseball/

They are overlooking Wooster, so you can straighten them out.

w4e

forgot to add these:
http://www.ncaasports.com/baseball/mens/brackets/viewable/doubleelim4/2005/DIII_finals
http://www.titans.uwosh.edu/NCAAChampionship/2005/



(Message edited by witt4ever on May 23, 2005)

(Message edited by witt4ever on May 23, 2005)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on June 27, 2005, 08:30:22 AM
Here is the list of Witt's Recruits:

http://www.rz.coolfreepage.com/wittbb05.html

14 players and No Big Men. 6-5 and under.

I guess Witt is going to be the next Grinnell.
New Nickname: The Tiger Bombers.

Mark Caraway is the name to remember.

w4e

(Message edited by witt4ever on June 27, 2005)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scots Hoops Fan on June 27, 2005, 11:01:11 AM
w4e,

Interesting to see that Witt has no big men in their recruiting class.  That seems to have been a strength for Brown and his coaching staff.  I have heard that Wooster hasn't been able to get any bigs either.  From what I've heard, Ohio just didn't have many to choose from this year.  I haven't heard anything difinitive on the status of Wooster's class as a whole, just that they have a nice wing player and possibly a nice PG in the mix.  
quote:

"I guess Witt is going to be the next Grinnell."

That's funny you should mention that, because I've been hearing that Wooster could be more up tempo next year as well, with the lack of big men in the recruiting class and all.  We'll see.

GO SCOTS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on June 27, 2005, 11:38:53 AM
I heard Witt has a very good class coming in, but what are they going to do with all those players? Sometimes having too many good players can be a problem.

They keys for Wooster this year to be able to somewhat neutralize Witt's strength inside will be Bradley and Stevens. Bradley has the talent, just needs to be more assertive. Stevens needs to shed some pounds so that his footwork can improve.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on June 27, 2005, 06:06:29 PM
According to the News-Sun, Brown recruited this way on purpose because of the depth already at the post position.

I guess Brown finally realizes that Witt needs the next Steve Iannarino or Tim Casey to get to the next level on the national scene.

Could be quite interesting if Barabino lives up to his hype from high school.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on June 28, 2005, 11:31:43 AM
Is this story on the Springfield News Web site? I tried to find it, but I didn't see it. Maybe it only made the print version.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on July 01, 2005, 07:07:32 PM
Financial aid article

http://www.mlive.com/sports/grpress/index.ssf?/base/sports-2/1120146365200330.xml


Wittenberg gets a brief mention.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on July 09, 2005, 11:44:00 AM
According to News-Sun, Mechanicsburg grad Tim Patten will attend OWU. This is a great catch for Wesleyan.

Patten is a 5'10" shooting guard that averaged 23.5 pts/game and over 41% from the 3line.
80% from the FT line.

He was named to the News-Sun All-Area first team and All-Ohio Heritage Conference first team.

Patten was recruited by Wittenberg, Ashland and Wolford College.

w4e
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on July 16, 2005, 03:34:13 PM
I think that the addition of Tim Patten should be a very nice addition to a lineup that on paper should be as good as any in the conference.  With Rybarczyk and King on the perimeter and Rudegair and Chojnacki on the inside Patten chould fit in nicely.  I just wish that they could get one more big guy to step up.  From what I hear they had a couple big bodies on the end of the bench last year.  It will be interesting to see if any of them step up this year.  Anyway, we are only five months from the start of the season.  I can't wait!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Scots Hoops Fan on August 14, 2005, 07:10:17 PM
Since its been so dead in here I thought I would try and stir up some chatter.  I was just wondering if any Wooster folks have heard any news on this year's incoming class.  I have heard a couple of tidbits, but not much else.  From what I have heard there are at least 2 incoming frosh who could see PT.  I have heard there is a solid wing player out of Middletown and a nice guard out of C'bus that could be even better than Cooper.  I also heard that there are no bigs in this year's class.  That's about all I've heard so far.  If anyone else has any more to add I'd be interested to see it.

GO SCOTS
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on August 16, 2005, 11:08:40 AM
Just wanted to say that the new site looks great and that all of the new features are pretty cool too!

GO SCOTS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 16, 2005, 12:16:18 PM
It certainly does look cool.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on August 17, 2005, 01:49:19 PM
Wow - - This is going to take some getting used to.  It does look cool.
So many features.  I can talk trash about OWU and WITT in different fonts and color.  Neat.

I cannot wait for DIII sports to get started.  Any word about OAC or NCAC football on ESPNU this year.  I have Direct TV so I am looking for OAC/NCAC on Fox Sports OHIO too. 

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on August 17, 2005, 10:11:02 PM
As I said elsewhere, I'm afraid this new set-up is gonna cause a flood of weirdness while we explore the new options!

WAY too many emoticons and such!  :o

[I plead guilty, your honor - this was SUPPOSED to be in green!!]

I give up (for now!) - I tried 'green' both before and after typing and both before and after printing - why am I not green??

[Actually, as an IWU grad I am of course green, but why can't I get my message to follow suit?!]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on August 17, 2005, 10:59:10 PM
Use it like a word processor. Type your text, select it, hit your formatting choice.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on August 17, 2005, 11:50:12 PM
I thought that was what I did - I'll try again.  Is this green?

Hurrah!  It may not be IWU green, but it will do!

Be prepared for LOTs of text like this as we all learn the new system (especially from us 'old farts'!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on August 17, 2005, 11:58:48 PM
Cabonney, the old system allowed one to select the exact hue of Green, using a 6 character ASCII designation.  I was able to find an appropriate shade of Maroon for my McMurry postings.

I wonder if that is possible with this program.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on August 18, 2005, 12:25:21 AM
Ralph,

If so, I haven't found it yet - but I'm sure there are LOTs of things I haven't found yet!

And, note: two consecutive posts with none of those addictive emoticons!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 18, 2005, 09:41:31 PM
I like these colors the best!  GO SCOTS!!

Pat - Nice job on the new site!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on August 23, 2005, 09:00:16 AM
Does anyone from Quaker-land know if Markous Jewett is going to play this year? I know he transferred to Ball St. last year, but I thought he was planning on coming back to Earlham this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on August 23, 2005, 10:33:32 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi23.thefacebook.com%2Fpics%2F2%2F0%2Fn64900282_5844.jpg&hash=998be683ce9185984cd52ccde93ec30d4c4ccb34)

will be back



(how's that for taking advantage of new technology??)



and an aside: I believe that picture to be perfectally representative of a major foul sometimes called and sometimes not called by NCAC officials. Without question, the defensive players arms are not vertical. Commonly referred to as "tenting", this should be a clear foul. However, in my years of following the NCAC, I have yet to see league-wide agreement on what exactly is vertical for a defender.

Since I won't be able to see many games in person this season, I just wanted to rant about the officiating (which I am sure will be inconsistent at best) well in advance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 26, 2005, 01:26:29 PM
Everything looks great, and I'm sure the site will run much more smoothly now.  Congratulations, Pat.  I only hope I'll be able to figure out how to useit before basketball season begins.   ???  I guess if other chronologically-gifted posters like Ralph and Chuck (who even seems to have changed his posting name!) can figure it out, maybe I have a shot too.

I have to know what the little left-marching "<-M" is...it does
this
...hmmm, that's an interesting effect.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on August 26, 2005, 02:08:13 PM
Hello, David!  Happy off-season!

Only 49 days to Midnight Madness!

I gave you a "Karma"! ;)

The only thing that I have not figured out is how to obtain a  scan of the recent postings like we had on the old board, "Last Day" or "Last Week" that was on the left sidebar, so I could find what subjects and which posters such as you, Sager, Mr Ypsi, and Marco, et al.,  had responded.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 26, 2005, 05:07:51 PM
A quick question: is everything just going to be a reply to one long-ago original post titled "NCAC?"  "Reply" seems to be the only posting action, at least for the techno-un-savvy like me. 

I do like having the "BBC tags."  We don't get the BBC on our local cable TV, so maybe if I click the right "BBC tag" I can finally watch The Office?  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Warren Thompson on August 26, 2005, 05:19:10 PM
DC:

My suggestion, if you want the real BBC, move to the UK  ;); I still miss the BBC coverage of rugby and soccer games (along with DAD'S ARMY) in 1973-74 when we spent a year at the University of Durham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on August 26, 2005, 06:07:57 PM
David,

"Chronologically gifted", eh?  I resemble that remark! ;D

I've been trying to figure out the 'return' policy on the gift, but so far no success. ::)

As to the name change, when both Pat and sac told me that was my new moniker, who am I to argue?! :P

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 26, 2005, 10:30:04 PM
Who will win the regular season title in the NCAC in 2005-06?

(This poll is posted mostly as a test of this new feature of the software, and is subject to deletion at the whim of the moderator.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 29, 2005, 05:46:33 PM
And it works - and thanks for including Wabash in what really should be a two-man poll.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 04, 2005, 12:33:38 PM
The Wooster Daily Record reports today that the Scots have 6 frosh on the preseason tryout roster:
Marty Bidwell (6'3", Middletown Fenwick H.S.)
Brandon Johnson (6'1", Groveport Madison H.S.)
Jay Nemeyer (6'6", Washington D.C., high school not mentioned)
Sam Dumpe (6'3", Beaver [Pa.] H.S.)
Jerrin Brindley (6'5", Urichsville Claymont H.S.)
Kevin Vargo (6'3", Gates Mills Hawken H.S.)

Bidwell was all-state in football and basketball, and reportedly turned down D1 gridiron offers.  The paper says he plays wing, although I wonder if that will change, given that he is just 6'3".

Johnson is a guard that the article says was recruited by "numerous other Ohio colleges."

The other four players are not discussed.  If anyone has information on any of these players, please don't hesitate to share.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on September 04, 2005, 03:02:45 PM
Earlham College Alumni update
class of 2002
PG  Jason Smith (Sales Manager) at some large Fitness place down in Louisville, KY.  Got married this past summer to Michelle Behler an ALL NCAC 2nd team and HM for EC. 

SG. Travis Brett (insurance agent) got married down in SHOALS, Indiana about 6 months go.


Class of 2003
SG.  Larry Hart (northern Indiana Sales Manager for Enterprise) Living in Fort Wayne Indiana.

SF. Nathan Stoops  (living and playing Semi-pro in Japan)  

C. Brady Keaton  (manager for some large Corporation in Indiana)

PF. Sean O'Reilley
[/b]
*myself   (Sales for Re-Bath *family own business/ also will be the Head Freshman Basketball Coach at my old high school Bishop Chatard in Indianapolis this coming up season.

Class of 2004
SF. Evan Ogburn (Part-time at Fed-EX and currently in Grad School at University of Cincy.) living in Newport, KY.

SG. Jon Miller (living and playing in the corn fields in Franklin, Oh)

C. Mike Bradly (living and working in Richmond, Indiana)

former Player and Student Assistant and better known as Billypilgram  Currently in Grad. School at Northwestern (and drinking to much and puking on the steps of the RCA DOME during a pre-season colts game Vs. Bears) nothing but love for you Billy..  ;D


Good Luck to the 2005-2006 Earlham's Basketball Team this upcoming season... I'll get a chance to play with them tonight and tomorrow... hopefully they take it easy on me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on September 04, 2005, 06:35:16 PM
This new format is really cool.  Great work.  Currently we are only about six weeks away from the official start of practice.  I look forward to another great season of NCAC basketball.  On a little side not....am I the only one that does not care at all what the Earlham Basketball alumni are doing?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on September 04, 2005, 07:13:42 PM
DC, I've heard some good things about Johnson and Bidwell.  Johnson is supposedly a very nice PG.  I would imagine he will be sharing time with Witucky as he is groomed to take over PG duties next year.  Don't have any of his stats from HS, but Bidwell averavged just under 20 ppg his senior year.  He must be a good athlete to be All-State in both football and basketball.  Overall, it might not be the biggest class, but it seems to be a quality class, and I will always take quality over quantity!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on September 04, 2005, 09:34:18 PM
hey Bishopfan...  i want to grow up and be just like you.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on September 05, 2005, 12:52:26 AM
Jay Nemeyer, Field School , DC
All PVAC League (Same league with Dematha and Gonzaga)
by Washington Post

Jerrin Brindley, Urichsville Claymont H.S
He was named to the First Team All-East Central Ohio League,
Second Team District 5 Coaches Association, and
Third Team All-Eastern District Team his senior year.
Brindley ended his career as the 14th leading scorer
in school history.

Kevin Vargo, HM All-Ohio Division III

Marty Bidwell, from my neck of the woods in SW Ohio,
was 1st Team All SW district as a JR and SR and
3rd team All State as a SR.  Was also award winning RB/LB.

Brandon Johnson - I found a picture of him dunking in a playoff game.
But other than that, no news.  ???

Still get used to the new site.  I hope every ones start to the football season is going well.

DC - I am still trying to get a hold of folks down in NOLA.  You got any luck? 
I hope you and yours are OK!   :-[

WoosterFAN - - "Are you from Wooster"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 05, 2005, 11:34:16 AM
I've managed to account for the people I was closest to.  Some of my acquaintances and former colleagues are still among the missing.  It's been a tremendously stressful week, watching this unfold from afar.  I wish I had something to offer besides marginal legal skills.  I simply can't imagine what it's like to be there, either as a victim or as a rescuer.   :'(

Best of luck to you, FAN.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on September 05, 2005, 11:50:39 AM
QuoteSG. Travis Brett (insurance agent) got married down in SHOALS, Indiana about 6 months go

In 16 years, his children will be jacking up threes from 40 for the Jug Rox.

Oh, you know its true!!!!

(Couldn't resist!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on September 05, 2005, 11:13:40 PM
DC - Not in NOLA anymore.  The Navy moved me up I-55 to Memphis.  I have renters in my house down there, though.

Still many friends and nieghbors unaccounted for including the renters.

I am making the trip this week and I will be taking some pics for insurance and to see if I can find renters and others.

I will stay safe and protect myself from the houligans. 

WoosterFAN
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on September 07, 2005, 10:11:54 AM
I heard Brandon Mimes from John Carroll is not at JCU anymore. If this is true (I'm 99% sure), that is a huge blow for them. He was probably the leading candidate for Region Player of the Year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on September 08, 2005, 09:21:37 AM
I also heard that Brandon Mimes is not coming back to JCU.  I also heard that he is transfering to Cleveland State.  From what I have seen, he has the athleticism to play there.  I am also not 100% sure of this information but I did hear it from a very reliable source.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on September 08, 2005, 10:57:58 AM
That's really going to hurt the Blue Steaks.  Mimes definately has the talent to play DI.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on September 13, 2005, 06:00:43 PM
David and WoosterFAN,

Just heard the first news in a long time from NO that put a smile on my face - people are swearing that there WILL be Mardi Gras in 2006!  Admittedly a bit stripped down, but it WILL happen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 13, 2005, 11:18:07 PM
Chuck, there was really never any doubt about that.  In fact, I'm told that there are already street musicians back in the Vieux Carre.  Remember, the French Quarter remained relatively dry (because it is relatively high; rule of thumb: the closer to the River, the higher the land) so there's less damage there than pretty much anywhere else in the City.  But as long as there's anyone anywhere in the Quarter, there'll be a celebration for Carnival. 

Parades, however, are another question.  St. Charles Ave. (both generally above water and relatively affluent, not unrelated concepts) should be pretty much back to normal (perhaps sans streetcars) by February, so at least the Uptown parades should roll.  But I don't know about the Mid-City parade routes, and of course a lot of the parade materials were damaged or destroyed, including the Mardi Gras Indian costumes. 

It takes more than a hurricane and catastrophic flood to keep New Orleanians from celebrating Fat Tuesday! Lassiez les bon temps roulez!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: da_man on September 19, 2005, 10:32:49 AM
Where's all my yeomen fans!!  Go Crismon and Gold ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on September 27, 2005, 04:50:31 PM
I've just noticed Wabash's 05-06 schedule posted....

First the NCAC schedule...seems pretty favorable for Wabash.  In years past Wabash has been hit with the OWU/Woo/Witt gauntlet in some order.  They avoid that this season, although they do play Wooster and Witt in consecutive games in February.  Also, the Allegheny/Hiram games are in Indiana this season. 

The non-conference schedule is pretty familiar.  Games scheduled with Hanover, Depauw, and Franklin as well as the Tipoff Tournament and the Pete Thorn Invitational.  The Tipoff Tourney brings Alma, IWU, and UT-Dallas to C'ville.  We're well aware of IWU's pedigree, Alma was in the bottom half of the MIAA last season, and UT-Dallas is the team that made the improbable run through the ASC conference tournament to qualify for the NCAA tourney. 

The Pete Thorn brings in Marian, Olivet Nazarene, and Tri-State.  Tri-State finished at the bottom of the MIAA last year, Marian and Olivet Nazarene are NAIA schools that traditionally field pretty competitive teams.  Although...if Olivet Nazarene is playin the Pete Thorn, somebody should let them know...they don't seem to have it penciled in on their schedule. 

Wabash will also travel out to Colorado for a holiday tournament at Colorado College.  Wabash played in, and won, this tournament a couple of years ago.  Along with Wabash and Colorado College will be Philidelphia Biblical University and Bethany.  Bethany is an NAIA school out of Kansas that was runner-up in the national tournament in 2003. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on September 29, 2005, 01:02:25 PM
I talked to the SID and he says there may be changes on the schedule regarding the Pete Thorn.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on October 02, 2005, 05:35:27 PM
He sent them to me a few days ago. I just haven't had any chance to update the schedule, other than removing the Pete Thorn games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on October 02, 2005, 06:25:57 PM
Hmmm...now there doesn't appear to be a Pete Thorn Invitational this year.  A home game against Tri-State has been scheduled for Dec. 9 and then a mystery opponent on Jan. 3.  That's a bummer. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on October 02, 2005, 07:09:59 PM
I believe that's Greenville.

I think there are too many schools putting together too many tournaments. So many schools want to play as many home games as they can without having to return them the next year, and not as many want to travel anymore.

I also think more coaches are getting wise to the whole concept of in-region games (finally) and I expect that any tournament that has a non-Division III team in it is going to have a harder time finding takers for an open spot than a tournament with only D-III teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 02, 2005, 09:07:04 PM
It's a shame, too, because the Pete Thorn (and it's predecesor the Cannonball Classic) have been played since the 70's. That is a traditional tourney and it's a shame it's gone this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on October 16, 2005, 01:09:28 PM
Wow...October 15th is finally upon us.  It is now time to officially start the best part of the year.  As a player I always looked forward to October 15th.  Every team has high hopes and dreams of bringing home the NCAC crown this year.  I am looking forward to an extremely competitive season this year in the NCAC.  Go Bishops!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on October 19, 2005, 08:54:03 PM
I think Earlham either had its first practice on Sunday night or last night, but here's some interesting scheduling news from Richmond.

Earlham will "play host to" DePauw at Conseco Fieldhouse in Indianapolis.

Should be a nice treat for Earlham and DePauw players (coaches, fans, and maybe even broadcasters?). I believe EC played DePauw in Hinkle Fieldhouse a few years back, too.

Any other NCAC schools played at any interesting venues in past years?

http://www.earlham.edu/~awpe/content/sports/men/basketball/2005-06/pressreleases/conseco.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 19, 2005, 09:18:55 PM
Wooster's 2005-06 Men's Basketball Season Outlook is up on their website:

http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/outlook.php

One thing that jumped out at me is there is no mention of Justin Bradley in the article.  It didn't mention him being among the big men lost, but it also had no mention of him as a key returnee.  Anyone have any info on the status of Bradley?  This would be a huge loss, from a depth perspective especially, in the post.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on October 20, 2005, 07:33:49 AM
Bradley is still listed in the student email directory... don't know why he wasn't in the write up. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 20, 2005, 11:38:19 AM
I suppose we'll just have to wait until the roster comes out to know for sure what's going on with Bradley.  With Schlingman and Mealer gone, his minutes would surely be up quite a bit so I would guess there would have to be another motivating factor for him not to come back this season.  I suppose I need to stop speculating until the roster is released and we know for sure he is not coming back to the team.  Nothing we can do until then unless someone else who frequents this board  knows something definitive.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 20, 2005, 03:58:49 PM
If there's a lurker out there (you know who you are  ;)) who knows Justin's status but would rather remain under deep cover, you can email me.  I won't reveal my source.  Judith Miller is out of prison, so there's a cell available for me!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on October 20, 2005, 07:36:55 PM
What I've heard is that Bradley has decided not to play this year.
However, the rest of the team is reportedly excited about the prospect of a quicker offensive style, and Freshmen Bidwell and Johnson are lookling good and should see plenty of playing time.

Less than a month 'till tip-off!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Clark W. Griswold on October 20, 2005, 08:58:25 PM
CMH is correct; Bradley will not be playing this year, leaving the Scots with little depth in the post.  The defensive play of Stevens and Will could be huge keys, especially against Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 20, 2005, 09:19:28 PM
Well, I wish JB well, and hope that his reasons for not playing are happy ones and not sad. 

His departure certainly changes the composition of the team, but I'm not sure that's entirely bad.  Maybe a switch to a quicker, more perimeter-oriented team will be a good one.  I've pontificated on this subject elsewhere, so I'll give the Cliffs Notes version here.  It seems to me that Wooster focuses too much on beating Wittenberg (and vice versa) and that leaves them vulnerable in the tournament to teams that play a different style, especially an up-tempo, perimeter type team like JCU.  If Wooster switches to that sort of style, it may make them--and Witt, by virtue of practicing to play Woo probably three times-- better prepared for the type of team they should see in March. 

Furthermore, I have grave doubts about how well the Scots matched up with Wittenberg in the post, even with JB in uniform.  With both teams playing an inside style (high percentage shots and strong rebounding), I think Witt would probably have had a healthy advantage.  Now it seems like the Woo-Witt games will feature teams that play different styles, with each team's strength matched up against the other's relative weakness.  This should produce both great games and good experience for both teams. 

Lastly, if the Scots have Van Horn, Witucky, Cooper, and Port bombing away from outside, that should open things up in the middle for Vandervaart, and allow room for Port to drive to the hole. 

I think there may be a good silver lining to this dark cloud.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on October 20, 2005, 09:25:01 PM
Good to know that I can still come to this site to get the info I need.
The question I was going to ask was about Bradley. ;)

Also, I wanted to report that the Street and Smith's basketball annual is out and of course Division III only get one page but they have Witt at preseason #9 and Wooster in the 'Ready to Breakout'   (of what I have no idea) cartegory.

Also Tom Port and Kyle Witucky are both preseaon HM All-American's
Dan Russ of Witt was Second team.  Pick one up.

How is going to set and run the 'NCAC pick 'em' page?

I am looking forward to great season of fun and gun, Grinnel style hoops with full court defense Steve Moore style..I bet he loses his voice by start of NCAC play!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on October 20, 2005, 09:28:00 PM
Good points as always DC...Remember Witt lost perimeter players (which was mentioned in the S&S article).  You need guard to get the ball to the bigs.

I am willing to bet PHI SIGMA ALPHA Vintage sweatshirt that Coach Moore will be focusing on full court pressure defense, no easy shots from the perimeter and sharing the ball.  Witt may have more trouble matching our style than us to theirs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 20, 2005, 09:38:49 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on October 20, 2005, 09:28:00 PMI am willing to bet PHI SIGMA ALPHA Vintage sweatshirt ...

Even Goodwill wouldn't take it, eh?   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on October 21, 2005, 02:14:30 PM
I'll volunteer to run and operate the pick 'ems once again this year.  I dropped the ball there toward the end last season, which I still feel terrible about, but the Pick 'Em will be back and as good as ever this season. 

Until then...back to football season.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on October 22, 2005, 06:15:52 PM
Dec. 21st the Earlham men's team will be playing Depauw at one of the finest venues in the country... yeah u most likely didn't guess it since most of you are from OHIO... They will be hosting Depauw at Conseco Fieldhouse prior to the Pacers' game against the LA Clippers.  I had two years to play at the historic Hinkle Fieldhouse (Butler's home where "HOOSIERS" was filmed...  Well i'm out and good LUCK QUAKERS
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 23, 2005, 12:59:12 AM
Uh, why denigrate the Ohio folks here. Certainly they would think it's cool to play at Conseco and certainly the run that Conseco has gotten has had a lot of good press all around.

Wabash played in Hinkle my senior year - actually played Butler, even.

And Hoosiers was mostly filmed at the local gyms in New Richmond and Knightstown, BTW.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 23, 2005, 10:33:08 AM
I'm an Ohioan, and I'd never heard of Conseco Fieldhouse before Billy broke this story (three days before the screaming earlhamalum; see post #104).  Now that I know it's an NBA arena, I understand why it escaped my notice.   ;)

I do think it's cool, however, that the EC/DPU game will be played before a crowd who came to see an NBA game.  One hopes that some of them will see the light in the early game; "THIS is what basketball should be!"   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on October 25, 2005, 09:03:08 PM
Any early looks at NCAC teams ahead for any posters out there via early season scrimmages?

We've read a few posts about Witt and Wooster recruits, any word on who is new in Crawfordsville this year?

And now an off topic aside to Scott Leo, who I hope still glances at this board at times: I was in Happy Valley a couple weeks ago to see your beloved Buckeyes....and I seem to recall a conversation in the McBride Stadium press box in July in which I said a certain white helmet-wearing team would have a good night on October 8. It feels good to be right for once.  ;) Congrats on the new job.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 25, 2005, 11:28:55 PM
Quote...any word on who is new in Crawfordsville this year?

Billy,  somehow, I think the only thing on the minds of the Wabash faithful at the present time is their undefeated football team.  And who would blame them?  As for me, seeing as how Wooster has lost to Kenyon and barely got over on Oberlin on the gridiron, the basketball season can't start soon enough! ;D

Wooster's roster is up and they are surely a young bunch.  One point of interest is that Port, who has 2 years of eligibility remaining, is listed as a senior.  Here's the link to Woo's roster:

http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/roster.php

Also, Wooster's Black & Gold intrasquad scrimmage is Saturday morning at 9:15 am.  I'm debating if that is too early for me or not?? ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 26, 2005, 09:54:55 AM
I do know that if we take care of business in football, we're going to have some *fun* staffing the tip-off tournament in hoops!

ah, well, what can you do?  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 26, 2005, 02:54:32 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on October 25, 2005, 11:28:55 PMOne point of interest is that Port, who has 2 years of eligibility remaining, is listed as a senior.

I wouldn't read too much into that.  Tom is a senior, academically, and should be listed as such.  I have no idea whether he plans to return for a 4th season of hoops, but I'm sure he'd be listed as a "senior" either way.

In addition to the intrasquad scrimmage, Wooster is having it's erstwhile "Midnight Madness" (now called "Halloween Hoops Madness") celebration on Friday at 8:30pm.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 27, 2005, 04:12:51 PM
Wooster #3 and Witt #10 in pre-season rankings.

The other eight...not so much....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on October 27, 2005, 08:19:51 PM
If I remember correctly, they pushed the Saturday games of the Tipoff Classic back to the evening when Wabash hosted a first round football game in '02.  I'm guessing they'd do the same this time around.  I would hope so anyway...it's not often the #1 team comes to town and I don't want to miss that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on October 27, 2005, 08:59:42 PM
Well it will certainly be a long day for you Wally to do football and hoops. Of course, I'm more than a little envious of the chance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 28, 2005, 01:54:22 AM
Actually, the Friday game will be the fun one, since the SID has to attend meetings if we host - and both days will be full o' hilarity if Wabash has to travel...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on October 28, 2005, 10:37:44 AM
I'm sure Brent would take one for the team if it meant Wabash gets to host a playoff game.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 29, 2005, 04:47:55 PM
Did anyone happen to attend the Halloween Hoops Madness last night or the Black & Gold intrasquad scrimmage this morning?  Just wondering how the newbies looked.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on October 29, 2005, 08:16:13 PM
Quick internet search, I found the following:
Kevin Vargo
HM All-Ohio DIvision III

Marty Bidwell, Fenwick
All-Ohio DIvision III Third Team
Southwest District Division III First Team

Brandon Johnson - All I could find is a picture of him dunking!!
http://www.snponline.com/NEWS2-23/2-23_cwgroveportscene.htm

Jerrin Brindley
District 5 Basketball Coaches Assn Second Team

I am really interested in the Bidwell kid.  I think he was also All-State in football.
He might be a banger!!

I, too, am interested in the how the Scots looked at "Halloween Madness"!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on October 30, 2005, 02:24:08 PM
Wasn't able to make 'Halloween Madness' or the scrimmage but saw a short write up in the Daily Record.  Jamie Yoder beat out Kyle Witucky in the 3 point contest connecting on 21 in a 45 second span.  The slam dunk contest was won by first year Brandon Johnson.

For the Black and Gold scimmage- 'Black' team won 76-63.  Yoder and Witucky lead the 'Black' team with 21 and 20, while Cooper had 17 for the 'Gold'.  Not much else in the article...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 02, 2005, 11:42:10 AM
Looking at the Scots roster, here is my guess as to who will be the starting 5 for Wooster.  I am going to guess it will be guard oriented due to the fact that they are switching to an up-tempo style of play.  So my starting 5 would be Port, Witucky, Van Horn, Vandervaart and Cooper.   That starting line-up should be lethal from beyond the arc as Van Horn, Witucky and Cooper were 1-2-3 in the NCAC in 3-pt. shooting percentage and Port was also 9th in the conference.  That's a pretty good group of shooters in your starting rotation. 

Off of the bench, it will be interesting to see how deep Moore & co. will go.  He has plenty to choose from.  Looking at the returning leterwinners you have to start with Fulk, Will and Stevens.  Newcomers who I feel could contribute could be sophomores Jamie Yoder who played JV last year and Cody Drake who missed the entire season due to injury.  I would also expect a couple of freshman to make impacts in the rotation and that would be Brandon Johnson and Marty Bidwell. 

Just from the players I have listed, that would put Wooster at 12 deep off of the bench.  The Scots went with a 9 man rotation last year in their conventional offense.  I wouldn't be surprised in the least to see Wooster go to a deeper rotation this year because of the up-tempo style they will be playing.  I, for one, am excited to see how this new style of play will work out.  Wooster definately has the personnel in place to make it a success. 

I can't remember a Wooster team this deep with shooters.  Wooster could easily have 4 guys on the floor at all times that are a legitimate threat from downtown.  Not to mention the altleticism that this team has from top to bottom.  I am very optomistic about this coming season. 

One thing for sure, we will get an idea of just how good this team is very early as they have put together one of the toughest non-conference schedules in the country.  By the end of December, we should have a real good gauge on how good this Wooster team really is.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 02, 2005, 03:02:32 PM
http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball/roster

Wabash roster is up.

Interesting that Mike Russell and Dustin Huff are on the hoop roster as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 02, 2005, 07:30:33 PM
ScotsFan,
I agree with your projected lineup and much of what you say.  However, when you say
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 02, 2005, 11:42:10 AM
That starting line-up should be lethal from beyond the arc as Van Horn, Witucky and Cooper were 1-2-3 in the NCAC in 3-pt. shooting percentage and Port was also 9th in the conference.
I feel compelled to remind you that those shooting numbers were put up by players on a team that had big bangers down low as the primary offensive option.  With Vandervaart as the lone inside player, defenses will be freed up to guard the outside shooters a bit more closely this year. 

That said, it may be that Tom Port will spend his evenings closer to the basket than he did last season.  That would take away his long jumper (except for early in the posession, on the run) but might help take the pressure off the other shooters.

I'm anxious to see Jamie Yoder, a graduate of my high school.  He won the three point shooting contest at Hallowe'en Madness, then was the leading scorer in the B/G scrimmage.  It's quite possible that he could be an offensive spark off the bench, kind of like Cooper and Snyder in recent years.

It will be very interesting to see how all this develops, especially since they'll see a quality opponent in game 2 (St. Thomas or UW-Stout).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 03, 2005, 10:37:59 AM
David,

I was thinking the same thing about Yoder and his comparrison to Snyder after I seeing how he did this past weekend.  I saw him in action a couple of times in high school taking on my alma mater (WHS) and was a dangerous shooter back then.  And he's a coaches son, which means he's probably got some good basketball smarts to go with his talent. 

As far as how Wooster will create open looks from the outside without the presense of a dominant post, I would look for a lot more penetration and kick outs.  With their guard oriented line-up, Wooster is not lacking in ball handlers who can take it to the basket.  Even Port could be utilized this way.  At least that would be one way they could be effective at getting open looks from the perimeter.  I too agree in your assessment that Port will be utilized more with his back to the basket, even though that may not be his strength.  He is a versatile player, and I think he could be looking at a big year.

Also, I wouldn't go as far as to say that Wooster's bigs were their primary offensive options.  One of them yes, but 3 out of Wooster's top 4 scorers were primarily perimeter players.  I know what you mean though, as far as the offense running around the post players.  Opponents won't have to worry about doubling down on us like in the past.  That is why I feel that dribble penetration can be almost as effective.  Not to mention the fact that it could get Wooster a lot more trips to the line.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 03, 2005, 11:33:33 AM
Coaches' Poll

1. Witt (eight) 98
2. Wooster (two) 82
3. Wabash 73
4. Denison 66
5. OWU 61
6. Earlham 59
7. Allegheny 38
8. Kenyon 31
9. Hiram 20
10. Oberlin 13
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 03, 2005, 12:12:56 PM
I find Witt over Woo mildly surprising, but the gap in votes (16) is mystifying - the coaches have voted Woo equally close to 4th as to 1st!

Rather a different perception than the voters in the d3hoops poll!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 03, 2005, 12:28:26 PM
There are a few situations where the D3hoops.com voters are/will be at odds with preseason league polls in addition to the Wooster/Wittenberg situation...

* In the MIAA, D3hoops.com has Albion #8, Calvin #24, and Hope receiving votes.  The official league poll is not out yet, but it will have Hope #1 and most likely Calvin #2.

* In the CCIW, D3hoops.com has Elmhurst #15 and Augustana receiving votes.  The CCIW Coaches Poll has Augustana #2 and Elmhurst #3 (but just about tied really).

* In the MIAC, D3hoops.com has Gustavus Adolphus #19 and St. Thomas receiving just one vote.  I believe St. Thomas will be picked to win the league.


We will see what shakes up in these leagues.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 03, 2005, 12:55:24 PM
I would guess that Russ and Borchers weighed heavily in the coaches' voting.  I am a bit surprised at the gap though.  It'll be interesting how the media will interpret things.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 03, 2005, 02:38:35 PM
and now the all-knowing media poll.....

1. Wittenberg (17) 231
2. Wooster (6) 218
3. Wabash 173
4. Denison 159
5. Ohio Wesleyan (1) 153
6. Earlham 134
7. Allegheny 98
8. Kenyon 75
9. Hiram 44
10. Oberlin 35
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 03, 2005, 02:47:13 PM
and now my Earlham post of the day:

6th in both polls.......let us remember that later in the season when posters proclaim "the media and people in various circles had high expectations for the Quakers"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 03, 2005, 03:44:46 PM
The coaches' poll looks like it is 10 points for a first-place vote, nine for second, etc., with all 10 coaches voting (that is, coaches vote for their own teams).  Based on that, Wooster's total is quite interesting.  Two coaches ranked Wooster first, accounting for 20 points.  The other 8 coaches account for 62 points, which is just slightly less than 8 per coach.  Eight is the value for a third-place vote.  This means that Wooster picked up at least one vote to finish out of the top three, and probably more than one such vote.  For example, suppose that three coaches placed Wooster second behind Witt.  That's 47 votes (including the two firsts).  The other five coaches combined for 35 points, which could mean five 4th place votes.

I'm not surprised that Witt was selected to finish first, but I am very surprised that Wooster picked up significant votes for third and below.

It looks like the media was pretty close to a Witt/Woo 1-2 finish.  If Witt had had 17 firsts and 7 seconds, their total would be 233, vs. the 231 they received.  If Woo had received 6 firsts and 18 seconds, they'd have 222 vs. the 218 they got.

I wonder if the coaches, or some of them, know something the media doesn't?  Or maybe they have some beef against Steve Moore?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Clark W. Griswold on November 03, 2005, 04:20:19 PM
Is Jewett returning to Earlham?  If so, I'm surprised not to see them a little higher in the polls. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 03, 2005, 04:26:48 PM
According to media day statements, Jewett is back...Crumby is not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 03, 2005, 04:42:05 PM
Quote from: Titan Q on November 03, 2005, 12:28:26 PM
There are a few situations where the D3hoops.com voters are/will be at odds with preseason league polls in addition to the Wooster/Wittenberg situation...

* In the MIAA, D3hoops.com has Albion #8, Calvin #24, and Hope receiving votes.  The official league poll is not out yet, but it will have Hope #1 and most likely Calvin #2.

The MIAA poll came out today, and it's Albion #2 and Calvin #3. Hope got all of the first-place votes except one, which means that Hope mentor Glenn Van Wieren voted for Albion to win the league.

I do agree with Q, though, that the MIAC poll will most likely show St. Thomas as the top team and Gustavus Adolphus as the runner-up. I posted that suspicion on the Daily Dose a few days ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 03, 2005, 05:02:51 PM
I think the NCAC didn't add up the points right in the coaches' poll. If you add up all the points, they are nine points short. If we make the assumption that they missed a second-place vote for Wooster, the final total make a lot more sense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 03, 2005, 07:00:29 PM
What I would like to know is what that media member is on to give one of the 1st place votes to OWU? 8)  Maybe they are thinking that Travis Schwab is on the 10 year plan?

Seinfeld, that would make sense.  I think it would be safe to assume that those missing 9 points would account for a 2nd place vote for Wooster making a total of 90 points to Witt's 98.

Of course, it could be Wabash's as well bringing them into a tie with Wooster??? ;) ;D

I think I'll stick with Seinfeld's scenario, but then again, I'm a Wooster homer...  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 03, 2005, 08:08:34 PM
Looks like we got ourselves a typo. I would think that Wooster got nothing lower than a second place vote.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 03, 2005, 08:18:22 PM
So, can we get a recount from the NCAC??

Or are we going to need Supreme Court intervention? I'm pretty sure (Sc)Alito would support this action....let's get him confirmed quickly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 03, 2005, 09:17:11 PM
It's not inconceivable that Wooster got lower than a second place vote; in fact, it's certain, given that Witt got 8 firsts and 2 seconds, and OWU got a first. 

Let's not forget that Wooster lost three pretty important players in Schlingmann, Mealer, and Bradley.  I hate to continue to be the wet blanket here, but I think Wooster has a lot to prove.  Not that I would have voted them lower than second, mind you... ;) 

Let's take a moment to recognize that Wittenberg starts the season as the clear favorites in the NCAC race.  And how about the respect for the up-and-coming Denison program?

Am I imagining it, or did some media joker vote for Hiram or Kenyon or somebody like that?  I think I recall a lot of discussion on here about one particularly odd-looking vote in the media polls, both men's and women's.   ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 03, 2005, 11:12:15 PM
DC - We're talking COACHES poll, not media poll, is where the mistake happened. In the coaches poll, Witt got 8 first place votes and Wooster 2 first place votes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 03, 2005, 11:20:22 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 03, 2005, 09:17:11 PMAm I imagining it, or did some media joker vote for Hiram or Kenyon or somebody like that?  I think I recall a lot of discussion on here about one particularly odd-looking vote in the media polls, both men's and women's.   ???

I forgot to add that this comment (above) was about LAST YEAR's media poll.  I assume that's what confused you, smeds.  Sorry.   :-[  I think I remember there being one stray first place vote from the media last season that went to a bizarre recipient.  Does anyone else remember that?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 03, 2005, 11:34:19 PM
David,

I remember what you are talking about.  I believe it was Kenyon who received the stray vote.  Whoever it was, it was definately one of the bottom three in the voting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 04, 2005, 08:38:03 AM
Actually, DC, you said OWU got a first. OWU got a first in the MEDIA poll. The coaches poll is where the typo is.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 04, 2005, 08:53:10 AM
Here are the results from last year's media poll. It was Kenyon and Oberlin that got votes. In my opinion, those were "gag" votes that should have been removed from the tally, but the NCAC didn't. I don't think the coaches from either of those teams after their team's best practice would say they could even finish in the top half of the conference last year.

http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2004-05/mediaday.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 04, 2005, 09:05:04 AM
And, in reality, it matters not a whit, since there are many games to be played plus a tourney...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 04, 2005, 09:52:04 AM
NCAC updated the coaches' poll. Wooster now has 91 points.

http://www.northcoast.org/bkbmediaday/05.html?pages_id=62&news_ID=2936
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 04, 2005, 10:00:59 AM
QuoteActually, DC, you said OWU got a first. OWU got a first in the MEDIA poll. The coaches poll is where the typo is.
Smeds, David wasn't questioning this year's poll.  It was last year's poll that he was bringing up and he even highlighted it in BOLD CAPS.  And Seinfeld even found you a link. 

Anywho, the typo has been rectified.  Hopefully as Billy mentioned, this won't come to a federal investigation and a recount. :P  Now  we can all move on to focus on real basketball on the court in just two short weeks. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 04, 2005, 10:46:22 AM
Thanks, SF, but smeds is right (too); I'm definitely confusing the issue.  I was trying to prove that Wooster must have received a vote for 3rd or lower from a coach by citing that OWU got a first--but that was from the media, not the coaches.  Sorry.  Again.   :-[

Anyway, it's not like I haven't been wrong before.   ::)

So Wooster's total turns out to be 91, which is 2 firsts, 7 seconds, and one third, if my math skills are better than my logic.

There is an article in the Daily Record today that suggests that the Wooster players may be "miffed" by the perceived lack of respect.  Then again, that's really just the headline writer interpreting what the reporter wrote about Steve Moore saying he thinks might occur to the players.  Not exactly a solid foundation there.

The article also goes on to say
Quote[T]he opinion that the NCAC will be stronger as a conference resonated from each of the 10 head coaches.  "I think the story of the day is the depth of each team," [Wooster Coach Steve] Moore said.  "I truly believe this is the strongest the league has been throughout in many years."
From Steve's lips to god's ears!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 04, 2005, 10:55:59 AM
Here are some random thoughts that I'll post so that I can look back at the end of the year and see how wrong I am.

-- Daniel Russ is the best player in the conference. If they played him more (he only averaged 23.5 minutes per game last year) and played with the same intensity all the time that he does against Wooster, he would be an All-American.

-- Wooster has the best player in the conference at three positions: point guard (Witucky), forward (4 spot) (Port), and shooting guard (Cooper). If you have seen Cooper play, you know why he will be the best two-guard this year.

-- Wittenberg will have one of the best frontlines in Div. III. Wooster will have one of the best perimeter players in Div. III. But the two have major questions in the other areas. Which team addresses those issues sooner may take home the conference title.

-- The gut-wrenching loss that Wooster was handed at Albion last year could provide some extra fuel in the tanks this year.

-- Wooster and Witt play in early December for the first time in a long time. Maybe Wooster can take advantage the inexperience Witt will have in the backcourt early in the season

-- The rest of the NCAC is, I think, finally making some improvements. I think anyone of Wabash, Denison, OWU and Earlham can finish third, and any one of these teams is capable on the right night of taking down one of the top two. I also think Kenyon is starting to improve.

-- I also think for the first time in a long time the NCAC is on par with the OAC, and maybe even slightly better this year. With Mimes not playing for JCU this year and one of the Davis brothers gone from BW, the top of the OAC is not as strong. And I think the depth of the NCAC may be better than the OAC this year. Too bad we don't have the challenge this year.

-- I like what Denison is doing especially. Wouldn't be surprised to see them pushing 18 or 19 wins in the next year or two.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 04, 2005, 11:28:08 AM
DC - I knew I wasn't going nuts...well, I'm already there, but still...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 04, 2005, 03:31:24 PM
I believe a Witt poster mentioned this summer to look out for a freshman named Caraway. Looking at Witt's season outlook (at the bottom), he is not listed. Any idea what the story is?

http://www5.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/preview05-06.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 04, 2005, 03:44:34 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on November 04, 2005, 03:31:24 PM
I believe a Witt poster mentioned this summer to look out for a freshman named Caraway. Looking at Witt's season outlook (at the bottom), he is not listed. Any idea what the story is?

Maybe he's gone to seed?  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 04, 2005, 04:44:59 PM
 :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 04, 2005, 04:50:30 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 04, 2005, 03:44:34 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on November 04, 2005, 03:31:24 PM
I believe a Witt poster mentioned this summer to look out for a freshman named Caraway. Looking at Witt's season outlook (at the bottom), he is not listed. Any idea what the story is?

Maybe he's gone to seed? ::)

DC, I believe that it's customary for the dunker to give post-jam props to the guy who threw him the alley-oop pass.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on November 04, 2005, 06:53:16 PM
Mark Caraway was a true catch for Witt but he decided not to play for Witt or any school for that matter. Tired of basketball. He is listed in the student directory but I do not know if he is enrolled.

Looks like also that a number of players from last year are not returning.
Players not returning, of note, Mark Balthrop, Alex Collins, Jeromy Romero and the player that I thought would have the most impact this  year, Brandan Barabino. What a waste of talent!!!  Another Chris Clark/Raymar Hampshire (football) situation? Fans still talk about the Hampshire situation.

A local player to watch out for is Matt McCurdy, a junior, Spfld. Catholic Central HS. Who knows if he will play this year as he was listed on the roster last year and never played.  Mc Curdy can shoot it deep. Sound familiar?

Another Jordan Copeland? In case anybody ever asks "Name the best Witt recruit that never played a game for the Tigers?" the answer, Copeland. The Spfld fans were really excited about Copeland coming to Witt. He was injured his whole college career (ankle) and works now for Dayton Freight in Cleveland, I believe. Copeland was a true scorer and leader at Spfld South. He was going to be the next Iannarino/Croci.

Players that were listed in the June News-Sun recruit article and are now, not on the roster:
Grant Forsythe, Casey McCoart, RT Murphy (Witt ex-football coach's  grandson from FLA), JT Thompson and the aforementioed Caraway.

Best of recruiting class :

-Trent Bailey 6' shooting guard from Portland, IN (listed in Hoosier Hoops Report as one of  Indiana's top players)


-Gregg Hill, 6' shooting guard from Redford, MI. Honorable Mention All-Michigan.

-Jace McGonigle 5'10" shooting guard from West Jefferson, OH
3rd Team All-Ohio. My pick to make immediate impact since Caraway is out of the picture.

-Kevin Murray 6'2" shooting guard from Carmel, IN. Listed in Hoosier Hoops Report as player to watch. Special Mention All-Indiana

My Outlook:

Wittenberg could be a special team on the National scene.
The Rochester Tourney will show how good or bad. Rochester was a final 4 team last year.

Wittenberg could be 3-3 or 6-0 before the Wooster game.

Dec. 10 seems too early for me for such a significant matchup.

What do I know, NCAC commissioner Collins likes the football arrangement.

------------------------------------------------------------------------


Looks like Beck is no where to be found, oh well:


http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/roster05-06.html







Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 04, 2005, 11:58:55 PM
QuoteA post player fashioned after a former Wooster player, need I say more.
I've seen quite a few post players fashioned after that certain Wooster player over the past couple of years.  That doesn't mean they have the talent to go along with that particular body type...

I do agree with you about the early matchup between Witt and Woo.  This is waaaaay to early for such a significant game.  What was the NCAC thinking when they put together the schedule??!!  It just makes no sense to me whatsoever. ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 05, 2005, 12:57:09 AM
They were thinking they need to get all the game scheduled. I would prefer all conference games after the non-conference season, but that won't happen. And since it can't happen, don't give preferential treatment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 07, 2005, 10:42:47 AM
If anyone cares, Wooster beat Otterbein in a scrimmage Friday by about seven points or so. Had a big second-half lead before nearly blowing it.

Interesting to see that Denison and Kenyon were able to schedule regular-season games with Akron and Wright St., respectively. I wonder what the spreads on these games will be.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 07, 2005, 07:48:17 PM
Wow! Denison at Akron (on Pearl Harbor Day)! I don't think Akron is that strong - I'd say about thirty.


Jan. 9 - Kenyon at Wright State. Fitty? Fitty five?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 08, 2005, 05:22:55 PM
Coming soon to a message board near you:  2005-2006 NCAC Hoops Pick 'Em! 

The only question is where we'll house such a board.  Pat put the football pick 'ems in the General Football area.  Are we doing the same thing with hoops or should we keep our pick 'em boards regional?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 08, 2005, 11:44:26 PM
Here's another tidbit to keep in the backs of your minds as the season gets underway.  Coming into the '05-'06 season, #1 Illinois Wesleyan and #3 Wooster are tied for second among D3 schools in all-time wins.  As Titan Q notes on his website devoted to the Titans (http://www.iwuhoops.com/), each has 1395 wins (IWU 1395-782, COW 1395-735), trailing only Wittenberg (1507-609).  Wesleyan looks to be the better team (I believe Wooster may be somewhat overranked at #3), but as usual Wooster has the easier schedule.  Those of us who care about such esoterica will enjoy watching this go back and forth this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 09, 2005, 12:00:21 AM
DC, we're gonna hold ya off this year, but then I'm gonna have to concede this little race.  We can't keep up!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 09, 2005, 12:12:41 AM
Q,

Since we already gave up a game against the Illini, and still face Hanover and (probably) Puget Sound, even if we win the national title this year, we MAY not hold them off!

We don't get to have two games each against Hiram, Earlham, etc.! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 09, 2005, 12:47:34 AM
Q,

Touche - but then they don't have Elmhurst and Augie twice!

Without in any way denigrating CoW, I would have to say that we have the more difficult schedule.

And, even if we hold them off for one more year, schedules suggest that they will take over soon!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Clark W. Griswold on November 09, 2005, 08:57:31 AM
David, I don't know if I would say that Wooster is overrated at #3.  They have 2 legitimate All-American candidates and I look for Cooper to have a breakout season.  Not to mention Van Horn, Fulk, and some nice freshman talent.  Also, I hear Yoder has been playing very well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 09, 2005, 10:08:34 AM
That's okay, Clark, I don't expect a lot of agreement with my statement in this room!  :)

I think Wooster will out-win IWU, both because of the softer conference schedule and because Wooster stands to play more games than IWU (before the NCAA tournament, at least.)  I believe the CCIW is starting their 4-team championship tournament this year, but that's still one round shorter than the NCAC.  Plus IWU has already burned off one of their 25 regular-season games by playing the aforementioned exhibition vs. Illinois.  That means the Titans will have a maximum of 26 games vs. the 28 the Scots are eligible for (the maxima are reached if both make their conference finals.)  I don't think Wooster will lose two more games than IWU.  I'd guess something like 23-3 for IWU and 24-4 for Wooster.  Then it would be a race to see who gets deeper in the NCAAs.

Q uses the right terminology when he says "hold ya off."  IWU has been #2 in this horse race for years, with Wooster slowly catching up.  We caught them last year and, unless the circumstances change, in all probability will pass them for good this year or next. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 09, 2005, 10:51:24 AM
This race for #2 with IWU should be a fun one this year.  Kind of like Michigan and ND in their pursuits of the all-time best winning percentage in college football.  IWU has the slightly ;) better team, but Wooster has the weaker conference.  It will basically come down to how well IWU can tip-toe through the gauntlent that is the CCIW.

In regards to Wooster's being overrated or not, you could make valid arguments for or against whether or not their ranking is a bit inflated.  When looking at the other teams in the top 10 though, I really don't see it as much of a stretch.  Yes, the Scots are implementing a new system, and they did lose depth at the post, but they are still loaded with talent.  I just want the season to start so we can actually see just how good or bad Wooster is.

Seinfeld,  I've been meaning to comment on some of your thoughts you put out last week so here they are:
Quote-- Wooster and Witt play in early December for the first time in a long time. Maybe Wooster can take advantage the inexperience Witt will have in the backcourt early in the season
Yes, but Wooster will be playing an entirely new system of basketball.  Just how comfortable will the Scots be in that new system less than a month into the season.  Although, to support your point, Witt's inexperienced backcourt could have trouble with the pressure defense that Woo will be implementing too.

Also, I wouldn't go as far as to say that the NCAC is ahead of the OAC from a depth perspective just yet.  The NCAC is definately making strides in that direction, but the OAC is still deeper than the NCAC IMHO.  It is nice to know that teams like Denison are really coming on and aren't just an automatic 20+ point victory anymore.  Wooster and Witt are still the class of the league, but the gap between 3rd, 4th, 5th and 6th is closing.  Should be a fun season to see who locks up the 3 and 4 seeds in the NCAC tournament.  I could be wide open!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Clark W. Griswold on November 09, 2005, 02:37:34 PM
I think the Scots will be perfectly comfortable in the "new system" in plenty of time for the Witt matchup, mainly because their offense won't change that much.  Coach Moore's teams have always looked to push the ball and play uptempo against most of the teams on their schedule.  Not to mention the perimeter players got most of the shots last year anyway.  Mealer and Schlingman combined didn't take as many shots as Port last year
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 10, 2005, 10:28:22 AM
I must admit, I am a bit surprised not to see Russ, Borchers, Port or Witucky anywhere on the Preseason AA team.  I really thought for sure at least one of the Witt bigs would make the list.  Oh well, I guess the list you would really want to make comes at the end of the season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Clark W. Griswold on November 10, 2005, 12:17:10 PM
I agree, ScotsFan.  It is absolutely ridiculous that Russ, Witucky, and Port all got left off the AA teams.  There is simply no better PG in D3 than Witucky and I think this season will show that.  As you said it's much better to be an All American at the end of the year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 10, 2005, 02:22:56 PM
Lunacy!  How can a player be so obviously left off of an All American team that gets voted on before anybody has played a single freakin' game.

Give me a break.  There are few things more pointless and petty than griping about who got left off of a preseason AA team.  Wooster got ranked #3 before they even played a game.  How is that not enough dap for you?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 10, 2005, 02:28:27 PM
I doubt if any of us (casual posters, I mean) are qualified to judge who should and shouldn't be on the preseason A-A team.  I follow D3 hoops on the national scene fairly closely, and I am unfamiliar with about half of the players selected.  One name I do recognize is Albion's Brandon Crawford, who you may recall began his collegiate career at Oberlin.  I've seen him play, and I've seen Dan Russ, and as much as I respect Russ, I think Crawford belongs ahead of him.  If Crawford is legitimately 4th team, then I'll accept Russ' exclusion.

As far as your statement
Quote from: Clark W. Griswold on November 10, 2005, 12:17:10 PM
There is simply no better PG in D3 than Witucky and I think this season will show that.
I'm not prepared to argue that there's a better D3 point guard than Adam Dauskas.  I hope that Kyle has the best season of all D3 PG's, and it is certainly possible, but to assert that he's clearly the best PG going into the season strikes me as pure hyperbole, as well as homerism.

Anyway, who wants to be on a team that "has [a] Titanic look?"  Talk about bad omens!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Clark W. Griswold on November 10, 2005, 04:10:13 PM
First of all, Russ is leaps and bounds better than Crawford.  And even if Dauskas is the best PG, Witucky is still among the top 3 or 4, enough to merit a spot on one of the teams.

Thanks to Wally for pointing out the obvious.  Of course these teams are meaningless, but it is something interesting to discuss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 10, 2005, 04:44:36 PM
Quote from: Clark W. Griswold on November 10, 2005, 04:10:13 PMFirst of all, Russ is leaps and bounds better than Crawford. 

Oh.  I guess I was wrong.   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 10, 2005, 09:26:08 PM
Crawford might not even start for Witt (Russ, Borchers & Brady). Russ is much better, I agree Griswold. Crawford may not have scored against Wooster last year if travelling and offensive fouls were part of the rule book for that game. Granted, that was only one game, but I didn't see anything All-American looking about him.

I don't think anyone from Wooster should have been on the team to start the year. Russ should have been on there, as well as Davis from B-W. Witucky possibly could have slipped in the last team, but Port certainly shouldn't be on it. He needs to round out his game before he can even sniff this honor.

Also, no need to pay attention to Wabash posters making assertions about Wooster basketball from a far. They were criticizing Wooster fans for complaining about the officials at Albion last year. Apparently, their interest in Div. III basketball is so great they made the drive up to see the game in person.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 11, 2005, 12:05:30 AM
Sorry Wally, but last time I checked this was a forum for discussion of D3 basketball, which would include discussion of the preseason AA team whether you feel its worthy or not. ::)  Heaven forbid we discuss something Wally thinks is petty??  Why do you care that we are being, as you say, pointless and petty?!  In case you failed to read my entire post, I did say that the list you really want to make is the one at the END OF THE YEAR!  Anyways, the basis for the preseason team is PAST PERFORMANCE.  Russ has been steadily improving in each of his 3 years at Witt, so who's to say he won't at least duplicate what he did last season.  The same could be said in defense of Witucky.  I'm not sour about the omissions of these players as you seem to suggest Wally.  I'm just throwing out my opinion in an open forum of discussion that at least one, if not both of them deserved to be listed due to their PAST PERFORMANCE as everyone else listed is there because of PAST PERFORMANCE.  Hence, the reason the list is so senior dominated!  One thing I would like to know is why do you care?!  It seems to me that Wabash supporters aren't short on opinions over on the football board.  So why can't Wooster supporters have their opinions on this board?!  I guess I just can't understand why you have to always be so down on everything that doesn't involve Wabash at the center of the universe!? ???

Seinfeld, I agree on your take about Port.  I do, however,  feel that Witucky could easily be one of the top 10 guards in Division III.  I wouldn't go as far as to say he is the best, but I don't think its much of a stretch to say he's easily top 10.  Just look at Woo's record (84-10)while he's been the floor general.  Not too many PG's could come in as a true freshman and lead their team to the Final Four.  He has been rock solid in leading Wooster to the post season in each of his 3 years.  That is quite a resume if you ask me, so that is why I feel he deserved to be listed.

As far as the Russ v. Crawford argument, I really don't know how you could compare the two.  They are both very good players.  Crawford might put up some big #'s this year, because Albion lost their two best players to graduation.  Maybe that's why he made the list, because Russ and Borchers had almost identical stats last year, which will probably be the case again this year, while Crawford should see his stats improve quite a bit as he will be the go-to guy for Albion.  Personally, I don't really know who I like better.  They are both totally different post players.  Russ has the size, but he can move.  Crawford doesn't have the size of Russ, but he can jump out of the gym, and as Seinfeld mentioned, as long as he get the NBA rules for travelling, he can be a force. ;)  (Just thought I'd point out for all of the over-sensitve readers. that last bit was sarcasm for anyone who didn't catch it)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 11, 2005, 03:47:28 AM
Just to play devil's advocate, let me remind you that Brandon Crawford was an All-MIAA first-teamer last season, and that the MIAA is generally considered to be a tougher league than the NCAC.

I'm not trying to stir up an argument or to diss Daniel Russ in any way. As I said, I'm just playing the devil's advocate here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Indiana Jones on November 11, 2005, 08:59:14 AM
Dan Russ being excluded from any AA lists is a joke.  How does one go from being a 3rd team selection after last season to an exclusion the following preseason?  Obviously, statistics are a huge factor, which hurts Witt players.  The combination of Witt's depth, Bill Brown's rotation and frequent NCAC blowouts all work against making AA lists.  Simply put, anyone who has seen DR play knows he deserves to be mentioned among any AA lists.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 11, 2005, 10:17:59 AM
I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Dan Russ was not nominated for the preseason A-A team.  Just a thought.

I don't think Wally was trying to suppress this conversation, Scots Fan.  I think he was reacting to Clark's over-the-top reaction ("absolutely ridiculous," "simply no better PG in D3.")
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 11, 2005, 10:49:44 AM
David, I think the main thing that got me going about Wally's post was this:
QuoteWooster got ranked #3 before they even played a game.  How is that not enough dap for you?
It just sounds a bit snide to me, that's all. ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 11, 2005, 11:33:15 AM
That wasn't snide, that was a serious question.  Wooster gets ranked #3 in the country before anybody has even played a game and somehow that's not enough.  It's like being handed a $100 bill and complaining because it's wrinkled. 

Frankly I could care less if you want to have a discussion about Witucky and how he stacks up to the PGs that made the AA list, but as DC has pointed out, CWG's post was over the top and flew way beyond intelligent discussion and right into senseless, homerisitic griping. 

I'd love to continue this, but for the next day and a half Wabash football actually is at the center of the universe.   ;D

I'll look forward to picking this up next week....and also stay tuned for pick 'ems next week whenever I figure out where to put it. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 11, 2005, 11:56:30 AM
Wow, it's November and Scots Fan already has the deflector shields on high.

Pre-season AA teams?? Yawn. They're just names people remember from last year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 11, 2005, 11:58:16 AM
In Division III, All-American teams are based almost exclusively on statistics.  It's not like Division I where the people picking the team have all seen everyone play and can easily compare, say, Sean May to Channing Frye. 

Statistically it is pretty hard to argue with the D3hoops.com preseason All-Americans.  I think it is pretty unfair to say things like: "Dan Russ being excluded from any AA lists is a joke" or "It is absolutely ridiculous that Russ, Witucky, and Port all got left off the AA teams."  I am quite certain the people making these statements have not seen many of the other candidates play. 

And statements like "There is simply no better PG in D3 than Witucky" are a good way to throw your Posting Up credibility out the window.  There are a whole bunch of great point-guards out there that the poster has not seen.  For example, Adam Dauksas went toe to toe with the best point-guard in college basketball last week and faired very well...

http://fightingillini.collegesports.com/sports/m-baskbl/stats/110305aaa.html

http://www.iwuhoops.com/illiniad.jpg

Dauksas is obviously enough in consideration for "best D3 point-guard" that a statement like that ends up sounding silly.


I've heard that Dan Russ is really good, but I have no idea if Russ is better than CCIW junior big men Zach Freeman and Anthony Simmons...


Daniel Russ, Wittenberg (6-9/210, Senior)
2004-05: 14.3 ppg, 6.8 rpg, 158-287 (.551)

Zach Freeman, Illinois Wesleyan (6-7/215, Junior)
2004-05: 14.2 ppg, 6.8 rpb, 107-194 FG (.552)

Anthony Simmons, North Central (6-6/225, Junior)
2004-05: 15.0 ppg, 6.4rpg, 109-187 FG (.583)


I'm not in any way suggesting that Freeman and Simmons should be on the team, but I think everyone sees my point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 11, 2005, 12:39:43 PM
It's not just Clark W. Griswold's credibility that's out the window of the Family Truckster, but maybe even his whole identity.  Suddenly he shows up as a "guest," rather than a "benchwarmer" or whatever.  What does that mean, exactly?  Maybe he's just concealing his identity in an effort to pick up Christie Brinkley?  ;D

Wally, what does "dap" mean?  I need to know so I can decide if I've had enough of it or not!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 11, 2005, 12:50:38 PM
Dap - I started hearing that on PTI, which means it probably was hip about a year ago. It means props...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 11, 2005, 01:03:16 PM
So I guess it has been established that a couple of Wabash posters are allowed to call out ridiculous posts. I will accept that as soon as they start calling out some of the ridiculous posts that are made by Wabash football fans on a weekly basis. Granted, they have been fairly modest as the season has gone on, and I give them credit for that, but we saw posts earlier in the year and in the past, and I don't remember them being called out for lack of creditibility.

Have those that are saying Russ doesn't deserve to be on the team actually seen him play? Have you seen Crawford play? If not, how can you give an opinion on this discussion?

And David Collinge, didn't you say last March after watching Crawford play that he was like Fred Astaire (however it is spelled) because of all the traveling he was doing? That doesn't mean he can't be better than Russ because of this, but it seems odd that you make that statement about Crawford then come out now and say it is clear he is better than Russ.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 11, 2005, 01:19:07 PM
I don't know exactly what I said about Crawford after the Woo/Albion game, but I did not say "it is clear he is better than Russ."  What I said was
Quote from: David Collinge on November 10, 2005, 02:28:27 PMI've seen him play, and I've seen Dan Russ, and as much as I respect Russ, I think Crawford belongs ahead of him.
Yes, Crawford got away with a lot in the playoff game, but so what?  I think he's a very talented player, and if the folks who know more than I do about D3 hoops (that is, Pat and his A-A voters) think he's better than Russ, I'm prepared to accept that verdict.

This molehill has officially become a mountain in my opinion.  Russ is a good player, so is Crawford.  May they meet up in the postseason and settle it mano-a-mano.

As far as I am concerned, anyone is allowed to call out ridiculous posts, and I thank them for doing so.  We have far too many of them as it is, on both boards. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 11, 2005, 01:24:06 PM
I've been looking at some of the early season games, which has not been easy due to the limited cooperation of some schools (OWU, Denison) in posting their schedules on this site.  Here's some early games that strike me as good games to watch:

11/19:  Wooster vs. either St. Thomas or UW-Stout; possibly IWU at Wabash; possibly Wittenberg at Rochester
11/21:  Capital at Witt; Wabash at Hanover
11/26:  Wooster vs. Methodist at EHC
11/27:  Witt at Transylvania; possibly OWU at Hanover
11/30:  Capital at OWU; Wooster at Denison
12/3:  Denison at Witt
12/7: Denison at Akron
12/10:  Witt at Wooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 11, 2005, 01:54:26 PM
Oh, Sein, there you go again...sigh...

I guess you don't read MY posts over in the football boards where I take people to task. Just ignore them because they don't fit your preconceived notions and idioms?? Hmmmm???

(Can you tell I get edgy about this - I got into arguments with about three or four Wabash posters over there this year, but all of the Wooster crowd conveniently forgets that we're not all sheep chugging down the Kool Aid. Put up the broad brush, Sein...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on November 11, 2005, 02:19:33 PM
DC- here are Denison and OWU's schedules. 


http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mbsched.html

http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1

OWU could potentially play Hanover

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 11, 2005, 02:43:42 PM
My apologies SmedIndy, you are right again. Thanks for your contributions to this discussion.

Oh, I guess I forgot about the broad strokes you were brushing last March when you jumped on the Wooster fans whining about calls bandwagon after the Albion game. Maybe you were there?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 11, 2005, 03:00:58 PM
Well, considering how many calls Wabash gets in the NCAC tourney (none, zero, zip, nada) I don't think any Woo fans has a right to complain about calls. In fact, complaining about the officials 'costing someone the game' is my #2 pet peeve, besides the broad brush painting.

It just seemed the foot was on the other hand...

We can complain about the NCAC officials all we want, it's just that in my 30+ years of serious basketball viewing, I don't think you can say an official 'cost' someone the game, when there was always another play that could have been made to win the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 11, 2005, 04:40:24 PM
Contrary to reports from last year, Cody Drake does not seem to figure into Wooster's frontline plans this year. He looks like he is the last person on the varsity bench this year.

Any other NCAC reports? I'm especially interested in what the Quake and OWU are up to.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on November 11, 2005, 04:58:12 PM
I can give a small report on the Gators, albeit nothing specific as of yet.  They actually have some big men, three of which are listed at 6'8".  I saw them during an open gym and they appeared to be fairly fluid and lithe, particularly Boni, whom I have actually played with in the past.  The only question mark is whether or not they can stay on the team, since Allegheny big men from the past five years have all seemed to disappear over time.

As far as the stars, since Majzlik and McCloskey are still on the team one can safely assume they will be taking 70 percent of the shots.  If Majzlik can stay healthy (which has yet to happen in his career) he should be a consistent 15-point scorer, while McCloskey will likely be the iron man in the point guard spot.  I also learned awhile back that Gator QB Jimmy Savage was going to play this year and from what I've heard, he's got game.  Should be a nice fill for Justin Schmitt who led the NCAC in steals per game last year and promptly transferred back to Penn State.

My plan is to attend the National City Holiday Classic on Nov. 26.  Albion, Baldwin-Wallace, and Juniata will all be in attendance, with Albion and Juniata squaring off at 6, and the Gators and Yellow Jackets at 8.  Should be a great tournament with some excellent players in the mix, including the aforementioned Brandon Crawford and Torii Davis.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 11, 2005, 05:01:41 PM
I'll get a report on the LGs next Friday. Even though it's my birthday (and a BIG one at that), I agreed to help out and work with the stat crew at the tip off Friday.

Saturday, though, it'll be a ghost town at Chadwick except for the Illinois Wesleyan fans. We couldn't move the game times because of Texas - Dallas' flights, so if we host in the football playoffs that will start at noon, with the tourney tips at 1 and 3.

oh, and parking ought to be a lot of fun!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 11, 2005, 06:18:23 PM
Sorry for the "deflector shields", it's just that I don't like to be criticized for showing a little optimism towards Wooster, just the same as you all do with Wabash football, that's all.

waterboy, thanks for the info.  Do you think your bigs could see immediate PT.  From what I remember, 'Gheny had a pretty young team last year and you didn't lose too much.  I should've gone further down the other day when I posted about the depth of the conference going 6 deep.  I should've included the Gators, as they definately have the talent to knock off some of the teams ranked ahead of them in the NCAC coaches and media polls.  Also, that is a pretty impressive bunch coming in for that Holiday Classic.  Those are some pretty good teams and it should make for some entertaining games. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 11, 2005, 06:21:53 PM
Not critcizing the optimism, just getting 'em in a bunch over pre-season All-Americans.

I get rankled with Wabash posters at the football site, if you recall, that show irrational exuberance. Please remember that, and also during hoops some people feel this is the Wooster 24/7/365 board, and it ain't supposed to be that way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 11, 2005, 06:32:59 PM
Well Jerry, since you asked:

I know Earlham scrimmaged at Transylvania last week and played pretty well...with the exception of a 9 minute stretch during one of the halves where they did not score.

I've heard Brandon Miller is healthy again. He missed the second half of his freshman year following knee surgery and played through last season with trouble in that knee. He had surgery on it again during the summer.

Markous Jewett is back...I guess he won't qualify as newcomer of the year...but it's nice to have a guy who averaged 15 per game back in the fold. LaRon Henry also missed some time with injuries last year. He'll fly under the radar, but he should provide the third big gun on offense.

Center Nick Welsh and guards Tyler Stewart and Terrel Brown are also back in the rotation. There's a freshman named Tristian Gregory who I know zero about, but I know the coaches were really excited about landing him. He was an Indiana Top 40 player.

Crumby's gone...I know not why. F Evan Ogburn and C Mike Bradley were rotation regulars who graduated.

Earlham opens next weekend in Philly with two very winnable games. The Quakers were bad outside of the NCAC last year, including a handful of really lopsided losses (Mt. St. Joe, Frankling, Rose-Hulman). They need to be better and beat some people early.

This team finished 5th, but swept #3 Wabash and handled #4 Denison two of three (including a 20-point win in the tourney opener) and they're deeper this season, so I think they'll challenge for a spot hosting. However, I'm sure all fans of teams 3-7 are realistically thinking the same thing. I really think it's a much improved league from the last two seasons especially.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on November 11, 2005, 07:17:28 PM
Quote from: Indiana Jones on November 11, 2005, 08:59:14 AM
Dan Russ being excluded from any AA lists is a joke.  How does one go from being a 3rd team selection after last season to an exclusion the following preseason? 

He was not a third-team selection by D3hoops.com, so your comparison is pretty much apples and oranges.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 12, 2005, 11:14:22 AM
Quote...and also during hoops some people feel this is the Wooster 24/7/365 board, and it ain't supposed to be that way.
And that's our fault how? ???    What would you call the NCAC page of D3football?   You could also say the same thing about the MIAA board being a Hope and Calvin forum.  Its not like we try to run off anybody that supports another team outside of the Scots in here.   Wooster has one of the largest fan bases in the conference for basketball, like Wabash does for football, so maybe that would have something to do with this board being made up of predominantly Wooster folk.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 12, 2005, 11:33:02 AM
I'm not 100% sure but is there a more experience team out there than Earlham.  I mean u have Senior Brandon Miller (6"6) who was 1st team all conference last year and a 3 year starter.  You have Senior Tyler Stewart who has been in and out of the starting rotation.  Junior Laron Henry who started his first two years.. and then Junior/senior Markous Jewett (6"6) who has started in his two years at Earlham.  Then u throw in big man Nick Welsh a (6"9) Soph. who started last year.   

Just right there is a lot of NCAC and College basketball experience... this is the year for these guys to get it done.  Freshman Tristian Gregory has a nice outside jump shot.  He may not be use to the physical play but he has a Nice stroke
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on November 12, 2005, 11:47:36 AM
Scotsfan,

Honestly, I don't know how much playing time the Gator bigs will get this year.  Judging from past experience and from what little I saw of them play, I would say they have the potential to play 15-20 each, likely in some kind of rotation.  I know Boni was just cleared to play a couple weeks ago because of illness so I don't know how much he'll factor in.  I forgot to mention 6'6" Ben Torsney as well, who played well at the beginning of last season but was hampered with an injury during most of the conference regular season.  He has good post moves and combined with Majzlik and one of the big newcomers, the Gators could get a lot more contributions from the post.  I think McCloskey, Babe, and likely Savage would be the top wing players, but I'm going mostly on athleticism on Savage because I haven't seen him play.

The Gators have a lot of potential this year to knock off one of the 3-6 teams in the league I think, but it will come down to experience and how the young guys react to playing in tightly contested games.  As far as the preseason poll, I think No. 7 is more than respectable for 'Gheny and is precisely where I would put them.  OWU, Wabash, Earlham, and Denison could be put anywhere in the 3-6 range, but I think at least one, if not more, will end up handing Witt and Woo a loss or two.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: PCCoach on November 12, 2005, 08:42:47 PM
I think the reason why Wooster fan's are around in here  is simply because we care and are interested in what's going on in D3 basketball.  Anyone who has ever atteneded the COW knows how big basketball is.  In fact, Timken is one of the finest places to ever see a college basketball game on any level.  Simply put, that place rocks when there is a big game; people show up for the showdown.  With that being said....and even being a slight homer, another reason some people don't like to post in the NCAC page is because what are they going to say?  Records speak for themselves in league play, and there isn't one better than the Fighting Scots. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 12, 2005, 11:52:24 PM
About the Preseason All_american team...  I think with all the crying about russ and whitucky not making the team...  I personally feel like it should be called.. PRESEASON "I'M ON A GOOD TEAM" All-American award.. Because everyone that reads this KNows that if anyone of those two players played for Earlham College.. they would have to pull teeth to be 1st all conference let alone all americans.  You also know if Brandon Crawford was still playing at Oberlin he would not even be a thought for preseason AA heck i doubt he would make 1st team all conference.  So for all u posters that are crying about ur player not making it... let me shed a tear with you.    *TEAR  Or you can look at Brandon Miller stats.. and compare.. thank you have a nice day..  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 13, 2005, 09:23:08 AM
I have a lot to say - and there are other fans of other teams that care about D-3 hoops as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on November 13, 2005, 12:06:31 PM
I just wanted to drop in my two cents into the conversation regarding Russ v. Crawford and who deserves preseason all-american honors.  As much as it pains me to say this being that I am an OWU fan, Dan Russ may be the best big man in the country this year.  At a legitimet 6'9", he is bigger then nearly everyone elso.  Seeing him last season and again this summer he is the real deal and has gotten progressively better each year he has been at Witt.  I truly hope to see a matchup between Albion and Witt at some point in the post-season.  On another note, the season gets rolling this weekend!!!  Is this the best time of year or what? Go Bishops
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 13, 2005, 12:08:33 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 13, 2005, 09:23:08 AM
I have a lot to say - and there are other fans of other teams that care about D-3 hoops as well.
 And the fact that this board is made up of predominantly Wooster fans is preventing you and fans of other teams from saying what you want to say?  ??? I'm not really understanding your argument Smeds...

Quote from: earlhamalum on November 12, 2005, 11:52:24 PM
Because everyone that reads this KNows that if anyone of those two players played for Earlham College.. they would have to pull teeth to be 1st all conference let alone all americans.  You also know if Brandon Crawford was still playing at Oberlin he would not even be a thought for preseason AA heck i doubt he would make 1st team all conference.
earlhamalum, first off, Brandon Crawford was Newcomer of the Year in the NCAC when he was a freshman at Oberlin.  Would he have made the preseason AA team if he were still at Oberlin is debatable and probably doubtful, but as for your assertion that he wouldn't even make 1st team all conference because he played for Oberlin, I would beg to disagree on that one.  Not only was Crawford NOY, he was also honorable mention All-NCAC and the only freshman to make the All-NCAC team.  Also, if Witucky and Russ were playing for Earlham, we'd be talking about Earlham challenging for the NCAC.  It takes quality players to make quality teams, and Witucky and Russ happen to be a very talented players on  good teams.  Are they surrounded by talent?  No question, but to suggest they would be average at best if they were playing for one of the have-nots is just about rediculous.  Your example of Crawford proves my point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 13, 2005, 12:48:56 PM
It doesn't prevent me at all - I won't stoop to the level of comments that others have made about Wabash posters on the football board. It was just a simple observation about how at times this seems to be a private Wooster domain, much like the complaints about Wabash on the football board.

There's something here about geese and ganders...that's all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 13, 2005, 01:13:24 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 13, 2005, 12:08:33 PMAnd the fact that this board is made up of predominantly Wooster fans is preventing you and fans of other teams from saying what you want to say?  ??? I'm not really understanding your argument Smeds...

It doesn't prevent Smeds (or Wally or Billy or a few others), but it does prevent a significant barrier to entry on this board.  Wooster fans not only outnumber the others, but we tend to be prickly as well.  It takes some moxie to post something that you know will draw an argument from a Wooster poster, even when it is something as inocuous as whether Dan Russ should have been an All-American.  When there is an overwhelming (and not silent) majority, it's not so easy or rewarding to offer a minority opinion.  The same is true on the football board, as well as in general society.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dark Knight on November 13, 2005, 02:39:43 PM
QuoteIt takes some moxie to post something that you know will draw an argument from a Wooster poster...

Ooo ooo can I try?

Hmmm, let's see...

Why did the wed hen cwoss the woad?

She weawy wanted the wooster?

Erm, um, She was a Wooster Booster?

She wanted to get to the other side in the Wooster way?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 14, 2005, 11:44:30 AM
For those who haven't noticed....

I've started a thread for the '05-'06 Pick 'Em.  All of the juicy details, as well as the first set of games are contained therein. 

Enjoy your tipoffs this weekend! 

A very intriguing afternoon awaits Little Giant fans on Saturday.  The championship of of the Little Giant Tipoff  Classic is set for 3:00 p.m.  Wabash hosts a first round NCAA tournament football game which is set to kick off at noon.  If Wabash can get through to the championship game of the hoops tourney, tipoff, presumably against #1 IWU, will happen very shortly after the conclusion of the football game.  Could be a very, very special day for Wabash athletics. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on November 14, 2005, 06:51:24 PM
Looking at Wooster's fisrt opponent

Have the website for K-zoo's roster for the 05-06 season.  Not sure who their starters will be, but looking at last years stats it may be ( Tim Herman, Kyle Konwinski, Phillip Weaver,Tyler Worst, Roger Garfield?).   Herman and Konwinski are  the Hornet's senior guards -"Both shot over 84 percent from the free throw line. Kyle averaged 9.8 points and 5.2 rebounds per game while shooting 42.3 percent from three-point range. Tim averaged 6.5 points and 2.1 rebounds"  (from the season preview).  As a team they don't seem to pose any height problems for Wooster.   K-zoo was picked last in the MIAA coaches poll. 


http://www.kzoo.edu/sports/mb/mb05-06/mbrstr05-06.html

http://www.miaa.org/mbb/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on November 15, 2005, 09:12:54 AM
Interesting article-  IWU guard Matt Arnold was suspended for 8 games.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051115/ap_on_sp_co_ne/bkc_illinois_wesleyan_suspension;_ylt=AmFLLiFctjfnyplb7l1zk4MkybQF;_ylu=X3oDMTBjMHVqMTQ4BHNlYwN5bnN1YmNhdA--

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 15, 2005, 12:14:42 PM
There is discussion of the IWU suspension on CCIW Chat - the consensus seems to be that it was probably technically accurate, but a great overreaction.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on November 15, 2005, 09:34:55 PM
Write up for the Al Van Wie/Rotary Tourney at Wooster.  Should be some great b-ball this friday and sat.

http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2005-06/van_wie.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on November 17, 2005, 01:30:19 AM
Be sure to head over to the Multi-Regional Topics Board and select your team for the new Survivor Pool!  :D

You might actually win something!  ;D

Deadline is Friday before the first game's tipoff
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 17, 2005, 12:20:27 PM
Both UW-Stout and St. Thomas have been selected as "Super Sleepers" for this season.
(See Mark Simon's excellent "Around the Nation" column, accessible from the front page.
The Blue Devils and Tommies tip it off at Timken Gymnasium at 6pm Friday in the opening
game of the Van Wie Classic.  Anyone in the area that has an interest in D3 hoops on the
national scene should plan to be there.  Wooster will take on one of these two teams on
Saturday evening (at 6 or 8 pm, depending on Friday's results).  It looks like a fabulous
opening weekend of hoops up on the Hill!  See you there!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 18, 2005, 12:18:08 PM
DC,  I'm hopeful to be in attendance for the Scots game.  My wife had plans of going to the tree lighting on the square in Wooster with our 3 girls tonight, but that was before winter arrived.   So maybe I can get out a bit earlier and catch some of the Stout v. St. Tommie game as well.  The opener should be a dandy.

I'm really looking forward to seeing the Scots new look style of play.  Hopefully they can hand it to Kzoo tonight.  After all, the Hornets have gotten the better of Wooster the last two times they've met.  I would guess the 3rd time won't be so much of a charm tonight for Kzoo.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 18, 2005, 01:15:27 PM
I'm also hopeful to get down to Chadwick tonight for the Tipoff.  I'm 50/50 right now as I've still got a lot of prep work to do for tomorrow's playoff tailgate.  We'll see how it plays out.  Here's hoping for a good weeked of Wabash athletics vs. the MIAA! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on November 18, 2005, 01:22:14 PM
ScotsFan-

Think I'll be following the on the same schedule,   Would like to see the Stout-Tommies game, but would love to see my daughters face when  they turn the lights on downtown.

Any ideas on how deep a rotation coach Moore will use this year?  Think that Evan Will and Fulk will see a lot of playing time and Jamie Yoder as well as it sounded like he had a good preseason.  Haven't heard too much about the freshman class and if any will see regular minutes.  Also wonder how Stevens and the other 'big men' will do with the up tempo style we've been hearing about.

Can't wait for tipoff!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 18, 2005, 03:25:51 PM
Smeds, do you know whether or not Wabash hoops is being webcast this weekend?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 18, 2005, 03:48:45 PM
No, I don't know for sure.

I would assume tonight's game will be on, but tomorrow I'm not so sure, since it's so close to football.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 18, 2005, 04:24:43 PM
I think WJBC carries all of the IWU games, either on the radio (with a web feed) or
web-only.  Try Titan Q's website (www.iwuhoops.com (http://www.iwuhoops.com));
Q is one of the IWU broadcasters.  My experience is that they are pretty professional (as
opposed to homers), so a Wabash fan listening to a prospective Wabash/IWU game on
WJBC wouldn't be retching every two minutes.  :)

(Boy, will I be glad when that mile-wide URL scrolls off!  ;))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 18, 2005, 04:38:35 PM
If there is a Wabash/IWU game tomorrow afternoon, I'll probably go ahead and take the 100 yard (or so) jaunt from my seat at Hollett into my seat at Chadwick and watch it live.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 18, 2005, 08:52:44 PM
Half-time

Earlham 42

Swarthmore  31

Not bad with 15 turnovers for Earlham.. and i think Swathmore has about 6.   Very Balance scoring so far in the first half for Earlham.  9 players scored for Earlham in the first half.  Freshman Tristin Gregory has 5 points and I believe Jewett has 7
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 18, 2005, 09:14:39 PM
I know everyone has this website up on the Computer Screens waiting on me to give you another up-date....

Earlham-      61
Swarthmore-  47

With 10:00 to go in the 2nd half

Senior Tyler Stewart leads the way with 14 Pts and Markous Jewett with 13 pts[/color][/font]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 18, 2005, 09:40:48 PM

Final

Earlham 85

Swarthmore  65
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 18, 2005, 10:41:33 PM
Final from Timken:

Wooster - 84
Kzoo - 66

They will take on Stout who defeated St. Thomas 91-90 in OT.

This game with Stout will definately be a contrast of styles.  It'll be interesting to see which style will win out.

I don't know if I'll be in attendance tomorrow.  It depends on how sober I am after the Michigan-OSU game! :P

GO BLUE!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 18, 2005, 11:07:18 PM
Finals from Chadwick:

UT-Dallas 58
IWU 71

Alma 54
Wabash 73

I didn't catch the IWU game, so I have no idea what the game story there is.  I'm sure you can find some commentary over on the CCIW board. 

Wabash is out of the gate well.  Petty is using a 10-man rotation again this season, subbing  guys in a hockey-style 5-man line change fashion.  The first unit, all seniors, looked pretty good.  Michael Woods stood out to me tonight.  He's got a nice outside shot and a good dribble and kick game that gave Wabash some great looks at open 3's.  This dribble and kick thing is something that has been a bit of a sore spot for Wabash the last few years...you can tell they want to do it, but just haven't been able to pull it off very well.  Woods did a great job tonight.  The second unit, which has three virtually new players to the varsity squad, looked iffy in their first "shift", but played pretty well over the rest of the game.  They'll get better as they get a little more game experience. 

A couple of worrisome spots....Coffey has to stay out of foul trouble.  Alma got too many offensive boards tonight, many of which they probably don't get if Coffey isn't on the bench (he only played 13 minutes tonight before fouling out).  He's got to get 20-25 minutes with the first unit if Wabash isn't going to get blown up in the paint.  Wabash also got a little careless with the ball at times...hopefully that clears up as the season goes on. 

Time for Numero Uno tomorrow afternoon.  Wabash is a great place to be tomorrow for D-III sports fans. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on November 18, 2005, 11:09:38 PM
Gators won their season opener against Grove City 73-64.  According to the write-up, 'Gheny opened the second half with a 10-4 run to take the lead for good.  Four starters were in double figures with Matt Majlik and Casey McCloskey leading the way with 20 and 13 points, respectively, while Ben Torsney contributed 10 tallies off the bench.  Next up is W&J on Sunday.

Should be an interesting game in Timken tomorrow.  One would assume that Stout would have the size advantage, however, they came out with a lineup averaging around 6'0", besides the 7-foot Nonemacher in the middle.  They have some big guys, but most of them are on the bench and the Nonemacher twins split playing time.  They played in a half court set 99% of the time tonight, which contrasts greatly from how the Scots played, as ScotsFan pointed out.  Port, Cooper, and Witucky should be able to take advantage of their match ups, and hopefully Vandervaart won't foul out.  He is vastly quicker than Stouts bigs, but I don't see him blocking as many shots tomorrow as he did tonight (4), though I could be wrong.  Anyways, I'm looking forward to the game and I hope everyone else is as well.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2005, 12:02:05 AM
Not much to say; the UST/Stout game was a much better game than the second one.  Wooster shot poorly and had what seemed to be long lapses of concentration/intensity.  The game was tied late in the first half, but Wooster finished strong to lead by 8 at the half, then came out strong to open up to a 16-18 point lead.  Then they went back on cruise control, and K'zoo closed to 10, but it was too little, too late.

I'm not sure where the new "up-tempo" offense was that I'd heard so much about.  They didn't seem to run any more than they have done in years past, and a surprising (to me) number of plays were designed to run through Vandervaart in the post.  Seems like old times... :) 

Vandervaart played great: 14 points, 11 boards, 4 blocks, 3 steals, and he got hacked whenever he got the ball underneath (just like last year, and also like last year, lost of non-calls.)  His relief was Evan Will, and he looked like he didn't know what to do in the paint.  Maybe he doesn't; I bet he hasn't played back-to-the-basket much in his life.  Tim needs to stay healthy and out of foul trouble (problematic, since he loves to slap at the ball at midcourt--he only got called once for this, but he got lucky in this regard) because right now the dropoff to an out-of-position Will or to Stevens seems huge.

The rotation was basically 8 men:  Will spelled Vandervaart, and Fulk and freshman Brandon Johnson spelled the other 4.  Freshman Marty Bidwell also saw time in both halves, and Jamie Yoder played 5 minutes in the second.  And the bench emptied at the very end.

If Wooster shoots better tomorrow, they should beat Stout.  Stout played a gambling defense, using their athleticism and pressing on every possession with almost no effect--except the tactic wore out the 6-man UST rotation, and that paid off in the end.  In the first half, UST's crisp passing led to a lot of open shots, and they knocked most of them down.  If Stout plays like that tomorrow, Wooster should win--if they hit the shots.  I doubt that Wooster will tire as quickly as St. Thomas did.

Oh and I almost forgot:  congratulations to Steve Moore, who reached two milestones tonight:
* 500th career win; now 500-164 in 25 years (or 24 + 1 game)
* 413th win at Wooster (413-99 in 17 seasons + 1 game), becoming the all-time win leader at Wooster (E.M. "Mose" Hole, 412-181 between 1927-58.)
Way to go Steve!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 19, 2005, 12:08:12 AM
Haverford 78, BISHOPS 66
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 19, 2005, 12:08:46 AM
IWU seemed unfocused early on against UT-Dallas, but they got hot shooting the three in the second half. Dallas was scrappy and didn't quit, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 19, 2005, 12:22:31 AM
More NCAC scores...

Elms 80, Oberlin 60
Witt 69, Tufts 55
Lake Erie 69, Kenyon 46

And I thnk that's it....NCAC goes 5-3 on opening night.  Could be worse I suppose. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Drake Palmer on November 19, 2005, 01:21:04 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 19, 2005, 12:02:05 AM
Not much to say; the UST/Stout game was a much better game than the second one. ...
If Wooster shoots better tomorrow, they should beat Stout. Stout played a gambling defense, using their athleticism and pressing on every possession with almost no effect--except the tactic wore out the 6-man UST rotation, and that paid off in the end. In the first half, UST's crisp passing led to a lot of open shots, and they knocked most of them down. If Stout plays like that tomorrow, Wooster should win--if they hit the shots. I doubt that Wooster will tire as quickly as St. Thomas did...

David - Thanks for your detailed summary on the MIAC board.  As I pointed out in my earlier post,  Stout is noted for that pressing style of play, & Coach Andrist has several videos out on his run & jump press.   Detractors in the WIAC say the Stout style of play works well in the 1st half of the season but in the 2nd half, conference teams tend to adjust. 

Athough you said UST handled the press well, the other objective of a pressing style of defense like Stout's is not to merely create turnovers, but to mentally & then physically wear the opponent out.  This then makes it just a little tougher to get into your offense, suck it up, & play solid D as the game reaches the final, critical stages of a closely contested game.  Sounds like it worked.

And yes, UST typically plays a fairly short rotation.

Without seeing the game I got the sense that UST was hitting their shots from the outside fairly well in the first half & as a result, they never really established a strong inside game.   When they tried to go inside it wasn't there which might account for the "reverse layups" that you said Rosefelt attempted.  That's not really a money move for him.   

Last year when UST was firing on all cylinders, Shimek & Rosefelt were able to effectively work the hi-lo game with each other.  I still contend for this team, their best option is to pound the ball inside to the post first, drop step & score (Shimek) then kick it out to a sharpshooter (Schnettler, Sweeney) if a double team comes, or hit their partner for the dunk coming from the weakside post (Rosefelt).  IMO, Shimek is the best inside closer & passer they' ve got.

Last question. I'm still amazed that Stout so thoroughly out rebounded UST.  How did they do it & how did 6-1 Greg Chaisson end up 10 boards?  Also Stout's shooting % was fairly high, which leads me to believe that their press made the Tommy defenders just a half step slow in the 2nd half.   

Thanks & good luck  to Wooster the rest of the season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2005, 11:20:16 AM
Quote from: Drake Palmer on November 19, 2005, 01:21:04 AMLast question. I'm still amazed that Stout so thoroughly out rebounded UST.  How did they do it & how did 6-1 Greg Chaisson end up 10 boards?  Also Stout's shooting % was fairly high, which leads me to believe that their press made the Tommy defenders just a half step slow in the 2nd half.   

Thanks & good luck  to Wooster the rest of the season!

Never having seen either team before, I'd say that Stout's rebounding advantage was partly because they were more athletic than UST and partly because UST was gassed in the second half.  I'd guess that the rebounding was pretty even or maybe even a slight advantage to UST in the first half.  Their technique (positioning, blocking out, etc.) was much better than Stout's.  But in the 2nd, Stout played more aggressively and St. Thomas was flagging, so Stout got most of the boards and practically all of the loose balls.

I was actually a little surprised to see (numerically) how well Stout shot in the 2nd.  My reaction watching live wasn't "gee, they can't miss" (as it was for UST in the 1st), but rather that they just were more and more in control of the game.  Their outside shooting was better, and that's probably attributable to the tired legs of the UST defense.  They also got the ball inside much more effectively in the 2nd.

Thinking back on it, the press (which resulted in 0 turnovers, I believe) was the reason that Stout won, as it did wear out UST physically (and maybe mentally as well.)  But the downside is that it probably cost them from 6-10 points (in odd-man situations and possessions where UW-S never got set up on defense), and if the opponent has a deep enough rotation to stay reasonably fresh, those 3-5 baskets could be decisive.  Maybe we'll see proof of that tonight?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 19, 2005, 05:14:24 PM
Earlham starts off the season 2-0.  Nice win for the Quakers.  They beat Haverford by 14 points.  Haverford last night beat OWU by 12.  So that should give Earlham early season confidence. 

Good to see Markous Jewett scores 25 pts in the win giving him 21 points a game after not playing all of last year.

Brandon Miller chipped in 17 pts and Laron Henry has a 13 ppg average.

Nice win Quakers... can we get over the beaver HUMP? The Beavers, Bluffton has had Coach J's number for 8 years now and I think these group of guys are going to Ruff-up the Beaver... Plenty of PUN INTENDED
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on November 19, 2005, 06:06:00 PM
Steve Moore is a great coach and a great man. Couldn't happen to a nicer guy. heres to hoping the wins keep on coming !
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash on November 19, 2005, 08:17:20 PM
It was truly a tale of two halves at Chadwick today:

Halftime score: Wabash 35, Illinois Wesleyan 34

Wabash came out firing, and IWU was slow to pick up the Bash shooters all half.

Then in the second half IWU was on us like stink on poo, and their number 22 just couldn't miss threes...last time we were close was a 53-53 tie, and then IWU pulled away.

Final score: Illinois Wesleyan 79, Wabash 67

Still, though, not a bad showing against the number one ranked team in the nation?!  We'll get better as the season rolls...Wabash Always Fights!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on November 19, 2005, 08:29:28 PM
With about 4 mins left in the Half Wooster has overcome an early Wisc-Stout lead and have pulled ahead 40-30
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 19, 2005, 09:38:56 PM
Final:  Wooster 90  Wisconsin-Stout 82

Wooster gets a nice win in the championship game of the Al Van Wie tourney beating a team from the tough WIAC conference. :)

Tom Port led the Scots with a career high 29 points including 8 three pointers (no typo!).  James Cooper had a great night with 21 points, Devin Fulk chipped in 14 points and Kyle Witucky added 11 points.  Wooster ties a team record for three pointers in a game (17 made).

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 19, 2005, 11:30:10 PM
QuoteWooster ties a team record for three pointers in a game (17 made).
They also broke the team record for three pointers attempted.  I believe they had 36 attempts tonight.  I'm sure we'll be seeing a lot more of this as the year progresses. 

Nice win for the Scots tonight over a solid UW-Stout team.  Wooster was able to build what I thought was a comfortable lead, but Stout came back like they did last night to over take the lead from Wooster.  But to the Scot's credit, they kept it together and regrouped to take control of the game to close it out down the stretch. 

Any survivors from Crawfordsville?  I would imagine they are pretty incapacitated by now. :P ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2005, 11:43:32 PM
Well, now we know that Wooster can play and beat a team that has a significant height advantage.  Stout outrebounded the Scots by a 38-27 count, and ripped down 16 offensive boards.  All those stickbacks meant that they shot 54%, but they were successful from outside as well (57% on 8-14 from the arc.)  The difference in the game came down to three areas:
* Three-point shooting:  As noted by wsf and sf, Wooster hit 17 treys in 36 attempts, and that was even with Kyle Witucky uncharacteristically cold (1/5).  Stout's defensive scheme allows open threes, and Wooster took advantage.
* Free throw shooting:  Stout was a frosty 10/20, while Wooster hit a sizzling 13 of 14.
* Turnovers:  Wooster forced 19 Blue Devil turnovers, while committing just 12 themselves.  That effectively countered the rebound margin, as Wooster ended up with two more field goal attempts despite being outrebounded by 11. 

There were a couple of personnel changes tonight.  Jeff Stevens was the first big man off the bench to spell Vandervaart, although he only played in the first half.  Last night, it was Evan Will in this role, and Will did play 13 minutes tonight, but some of that was at the 4 rather than the 5.  This might have been because of the big height disadvantage, or for some other reason; who am I to question the Master?  :)  The other change was that frosh Marty Bidwell didn't play (he had 9 minutes against Kzoo.)  The Scots played 9 men in the first half (Fulk, Stevens, Will, Johnson) and 8 in the second (no Stevens.)

Port was named the tourney MVP; he's never failed to make the Van Wie All-Tournament team, and this is his second MVP.  Tim Vandervaart was the defensive MVP, and James Cooper was also named to the all-tourney team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Drake Palmer on November 20, 2005, 12:04:47 AM
David - sounds like it was a nice win for the Scots over UW-Stout tonight.  It also seems you got a chance to witness for yourself the new high octane Wooster offense.  If I read the stats right, Wooster took twice as many 3 attempts (36) as Stout & was able to convert on 17 shots.  That's pretty impressive shooting!  

I think UST will be able to "right the ship" with a couple of minor adjustments, so it will be interesting to see how things play out between them & their conference rival, Gustavus.  In recent years their rivalry has been similar to Wooster & Wittenberg's. Lately though, Gustavus has had the upper hand over the Tommies in the battle for conference bragging rights.

It'll be fun to watch the how these teams, Wooster, Stout & UST do in their respective conferences this season. I'll pop in on your board periodically & see how things are going.  Best of luck to all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 20, 2005, 09:39:17 AM
Nice article in the on-line Wooster Daily Record today about the Scots big win over Wisconsin-Stout.  :)

Here is the link:
http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles/sports/&file=_sports1.txt&article=1&tD=
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 20, 2005, 09:47:06 AM
http://www.pantagraph.com/stories/112005/spo_20051120039.shtml

CRAWFORDSVILLE, Ind. -- Perhaps practicing with the hope of reprising the chant later, the Wabash College student section let Illinois Wesleyan hear it Saturday.

"Over-rated. Over-rated."

This was not, mind you, late in the contest with the Little Giants in control. This happened 25 minutes before the game.


With all of these "Future of Division III" discussions taking place, and all of the subsequent new legislation, I'd like to propose a new rule for our beloved division of the NCAA...

The o-ver-rat-ed chant can only be used in compliance with the conversion chart below:

(Time to play in game/required lead by chanters' team)

0:30 - 5 pts
1:00 - 8 pts
5:00 - 12 pts
10:00 - 16 pts
Halftime - 20 pts
10:00 1st Half - 25 pts
Layup line pregame: not eligible


This issue must be addressed...and the time is now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 20, 2005, 10:19:21 AM
Hmmm...let's review:

--All Male College in a small Indiana town on a Saturday night
--Crowd jacked up from afternoon playoff win by Bash football team
--Mostly male crowd had a few "brews" during/after big football win

They were probably shouting "over rated" before they walked into the Crawfordsville's gymn!   :)

Titan Q -- your Titans delivered the best possible response....by winning the game and proving that your rating is deserved!  :)



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 20, 2005, 10:22:24 AM
I do think the IWU fans were a bit puzzled on why the Wabash students stayed until the end (and even after) and continued with their chanting and support. Ah, well.

Frankly, though, I don't think IWU played like a #1 teams. That team reminded me of several Wooster and Witt teams who had trouble at Chadwick before finally getting past the Little Giants. The first half of both games the Titans looked a bit unfocused at times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 20, 2005, 10:29:38 AM
NCAC teams were 6-3 yesterday  :)

Wittenberg 52  Rochester 50 (nice road win)
Ohio Wesleyan 91  Swarthmore 68
Earlham 68  Haverford 54
Kenyon 92  Thiel 90
Allegheny 78  Wash & Jeff 77
Wooster 90  Wisc-Stout 82

Illinois Wesleyan 79  Wabash 67
Rose Hulman 73  Denison 57
St. Joseph's (ME) 66  Oberlin 54
Hiram was idle.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 20, 2005, 10:45:17 AM
smedindy, I don't necessarily think IWU played like the #1 team in the country at times either, but the Titans did show flashes of that #1 ranking and why they are so hard to beat.  On Friday, one All-American stepped up and led them to victory - Keelan Amelianovich with 24 points.  And then on Saturday, their other All-American refused to let them lose - Adam Dauksas with 22 pts and 5 assists.  IWU also had big performances from Cory Jones, who set the Little Giant Tipoff Classic record for rebounds (24 in 2 games), and 6-7 Zach Freeman (15 pts, 8 reb vs Wabash) who was IWU's second member of the All-Tournament team (Dauksas the other).  The Titans have a lot of weapons.

With the exception of the 1st Half vs UT-Dallas, I was pleased with the way IWU played this weekend...especially against Wabash.  I think the Little Giants are a good team and Chadwick Court is a tough place to play when the Wabash students are charged up like that.  When you're rated #1, you're going to get everyone's best effort and best shot, and the games in Crawfordsville were a good example of that.

The Allen Center at Wabash is really a great facility.  The overall complex is very similiar to IWU's Shirk Center and the facility at Hanover.

Best of luck to the Little Giants this year as they prepare to battle the two big giants of the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 20, 2005, 11:21:47 AM
Quote from: Titan Q on November 20, 2005, 09:47:06 AM
Layup line pregame: not eligible

Sustained.

Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 20, 2005, 10:19:21 AM--Mostly male crowd had a few "brews" during/after big football win

Let's not forget the even more relevant "before" the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 20, 2005, 11:49:53 AM
QuoteI think the Little Giants are a good team and Chadwick Court is a tough place to play when the Wabash students are charged up like that.  When you're rated #1, you're going to get everyone's best effort and best shot, and the games in Crawfordsville were a good example of that.
TitanQ makes a good point here.  I'm sure Wabash was riding high on emotion and adrenaline, with the jazzed up crowd and having the chance to knock off #1 and all, through the 1st half and into the 2nd.  But IWU just had too much and eventually pulled away.  Nice showing, nonetheless, by the Lil Giants.  They put up a fight and did the conference proud, even in defeat.



   



   

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 20, 2005, 12:30:09 PM
Here are some impressive  statistical notes for Wooster.  I know its only 2 games into the season, but Wooster's starting five are all averaging in double figures with 2 (Port and Cooper) right  at 20 ppg.  I would guess that this is in correlation with the new style of play for Wooster. 

Wooster is now off until next weekend when they travel to VA and the Emory & Henry Invitational.  This looks like another quality field for the Scots to go up against.  They will take on Methodist in the opener who have been regular season conference champions (USA Southern Athletic Conerence) each of the last 3 years and conference tournament champs in each of the last 2 years earning automatic births into the NCAA's.  They are the preseason pick to win their conference again this year as well.  So this should be a good challenge for the Scots right off the bat. 

The rest of the field includes host, Emory & Henry and Thomas More.  It looks as though E&H is running the Grinnell style and they gave JCU all they could handle over the weekend losing to the Blue Streaks 137-127!  TM is picked to finish 2nd to last in the PAC, so I would guess that E&H should get by the Saints in their opener.  Should Wooster get by Methodist, it could set up an entertaining and high scoring affair with E&H.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 20, 2005, 02:48:32 PM
After watching both games this weekend I'll add a couple of points:

Andy Vanhorn didn't score alot of points, but he worked his butt off in the Stout game, plus he came up big at the end with a key 3-pointer, blocked shot and steal. He is a gamer.

Even Will is very athletic and can contribute, but he is not a 5 position player. Jeff Stevens only played 9 minutes in the Stout game but they were quality minutes. Vandervaart needed a break and Jeff made a number of plays while he was in there. I still am nervous about the lack of height in the rotation and hope Jeff becomes part of it. I say that because while watching all those three's is exciting I am a definitie believer in "Live by three and die by the three". I just don't believe any team can go far in the NCAA without a strong post presence.

Every year Coach Moore works in at least two freshman into the rotation, which I feel is part of the reason for his continued success. Brandon Johnson looks good, playing 32 minutes in the first two games without a turnover. I haven't seen enough of Marty Bidwell to comment.

Next up - Catholic, No. 25 in the D3Hoops poll. I won't be able to attend but I will be listening...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2005, 02:51:57 PM
Wrong denomination: next up is Methodist.  In the words of Norman Maclean, "Baptists who can read."  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 20, 2005, 03:18:47 PM
Let's hope that Wooster's Presbyterian faith can overcome the Methodists!

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 20, 2005, 04:24:51 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 20, 2005, 02:51:57 PM
In the words of Norman Maclean, "Baptists who can read."
:D

Methodist is represented in the "others receiving votes" category.  They would fall in at 51st with 6 votes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2005, 04:40:26 PM
Although they are 2-0, Methodist is off to a rocky start.  They struggled to beat SUNY-Maritime, who was Caltech-like awful last year, then went to 2OT to beat and lost to Sewanee, who was mediocre last year.  I wonder if Methodist is down this year?

[note: message edited]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 20, 2005, 08:48:15 PM
Is this customary NCAC defense that you guys are putting on my boy Zach Freeman here, or what's the deal?

http://www.iwuhoops.com/wabz2.jpg

Hey, at least we have better hops here in the CCIW...

http://www.iwuhoops.com/wabz.jpg
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2005, 08:52:03 PM
You know, Q, for the past several seasons everyone in the NCAC has been trying to reach the level of performance established by Wooster's national player of the year Bryan Nelson.  Now we know that Wabash has a player that's half as good.

;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2005, 09:26:18 PM
Final from the Midway Classic in Chicago:

Denison 74
Colby 71

Denison takes home third place hardware.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 20, 2005, 10:57:52 PM
Ah, that's how real men play D. You act like you're from the ACC - here in the heartland, Big 10 country, you gotta draw blood for a foul!

Oh, you're from Illinois - that's right... ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 20, 2005, 11:21:42 PM
smedindy, IWU just played the defending Big Ten champion, and I did not see that technique used!

http://www.iwuhoops.com/ILLINI.HTM
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 20, 2005, 11:31:47 PM
Q,

Alas, the Illini were only #2 last year!  (Curse you, Tarheels!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on November 21, 2005, 02:05:29 AM
atteneded both wooster games this weekend, I was amazed with the speed the scots played with, very few turnovers or arrant passes, gotta give credit to the guards, all 6 of them who saw P.T., for controlling the game. one point in the second half of the stout game, scotties had a cold spell, and stout came back,  even taking the lead with about 5 minutes left in the second half. Just goes to show if ya live by the 3 ya die by the 3, and it makes me nervous !

on another note, Coach Moore sure knows how to get those guys fired up.

Keep up the good work this weekend scots !
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 21, 2005, 09:06:12 AM
Quote from: Ryder16 on November 21, 2005, 02:05:29 AM
on another note, Coach Moore sure knows how to get those guys fired up.
He sure does.  That little run Wooster made coming right out of the locker room to start the 2nd half of  the Kzoo game is pretty evident of that. :)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: narch on November 21, 2005, 09:40:25 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 20, 2005, 04:40:26 PM
Although they are 2-0, Methodist is off to a rocky start.  They struggled to beat SUNY-Maritime, who was Caltech-like awful last year, then went to 2OT to beat and lost to Sewanee, who was mediocre last year.  I wonder if Methodist is down this year?
dc - i think it's too early to tell if mc is down, but as a monarch fan i certainly expected them to be 2-0 after this past weekend - the maritime game was a struggle for the first half only as the monarchs were tied at half time, but opened a lead as large as 17 at points in the second half - the monarchs didn't show up defensively in the 118-115 2 ot loss to sewanee, which is not typical - mc is typically a pretty strong team defensively, especially on the perimeter - the monarchs return 3 top-flight perimeter players and defenders in seth thomas, eugene grant and robert lee, but they have to replace an all-region power forward in sam porter, who averaged a double/double last year...so far that doesn't seem to be going as well as i hoped it would - mc was out rebounded by a wide margin in the sewanee game - i still think this should be a good test for cow, because i think the monarchs are a talented, well-coached team capable of playing at a very high level, but i anticipate an "L" for the  monarchs
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: PCCoach on November 21, 2005, 12:36:58 PM
 ;D...How bout win # 500!!!   Also, how about the young Scots getting it done for the opener.  Don't forget the Hornets upset them a few years back.  Also, I hate to say it, but what a huge quality win for Witt up at the Palestra in Rochester.  That is certainly a tough, tough place to play and Mike Neer always has his crew ready to go.  Again, I hate to say it, but that is a good test before the early league game against the Scots.  Alright...2 down, 18 to go until another 20+ win season!  Woo-Witt matchup early will be a dandy!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 21, 2005, 07:45:35 PM
So far so bad for the LG's at Hanover.  Wabash has started 1-7 from the field, Hanover is 4-5 so far and the Panthers have a 10-2 lead with 15:00 left in the first half. 

Gotta pick it up Wabash. 

Hanover is rapidly getting into some foul trouble here.  Stay tuned...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 21, 2005, 08:18:24 PM
Halftime in Hanover:

Wabash 23
Hanover 32

It took Wabash about 18 minutes to figure out they were playing in a basketball game tonight.  Wabash is shooting horribly, turning the ball over a ton, and not defending particularly well.  Wabash went on a little run at the end of the half.  Simkus drilled a trey to cut the lead to 6 with about 5 seconds left, but Hanover answered with a triple at the buzzer to push it back out to 9.  Truth be told, Hanover could easily be winning this game by twice as much as they are.  Fouls hurt Hanover bad (Wabash was shooting free throws from about the 13-minute mark on). 

Wabash is in a hole, but not out of it, especially given the momentum gathered at the end of the half. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 21, 2005, 08:47:09 PM
We're about halfway through the second half, Wabash has stormed back to take a 39-38 lead.  Wabash had been down as many as 15 in this game. 

Hanover is at the line...first is no good.  Second shot is good.  39-39 with 10:56 left. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 21, 2005, 09:11:33 PM
2 minutes left, Wabash trails by a single point.  This has been a heckuva final 10 mintues. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 21, 2005, 09:15:17 PM
Wabash trails 56-53, Lytle is at the line for Wabash....first is no good.  Second is good.  56-54 Hanover, 1:19 left.

Lytle picks up a blocking foul about a mile away from the basket and has fouled out.  That ends a pretty frustrating night for Caleb. 

Hanover at the line....first shot is a brick.  Second shot is good.  57-54 Panthers.

Adonis Joseph misses his shot on Wabash's possession, now we're down to 34 seconds left.  Ball is knocked out to Hanover. 

Wabash fouls.  Hanover makes both free throws and it's a 5 point game. 

Airball by Wabash and this one is all but over.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 21, 2005, 09:23:19 PM
Final from Hanover:

Wabash 59
Hanover 62

Hanover escapes Wabash by three for the second year in a row.  Great effort by Wabash to come back from 15 down, but in the end just couldn't get over the hump.  I don't have the stats yet, but poor shooting both from the field and at the line are going to stand out big time for Wabash in this one. 

Wabash falls to 1-2 on the season (losses to #1 and #9 in the nation, but that's of little solace right now).  Next up is a Thanksgiving tourney in Colorado later this week. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on November 22, 2005, 02:17:14 PM
Wabash really has me interested right now. I feel like IWU can sometimes be a bit streaky, and I was thinking the Titans probably just weren't giving it their best opening weekend... but it has always seemed to me that Hanover pull it's success more from its consistancy, rather than sheer talent. Yeah, Wabash technically lost both games, which is no fun, but they sure have got me thinking.

I would love it if this league lost it's repuation for just being "Witt and Woo", since there are some great academic schools in this conference that tend to get a little overlooked. So good luck Wabash. ;)

David...  last night, I was feeling vegetable deprived, and for dinner made a big bowl of raw carrots, sugar snap peas, and strawberry tomatos... while munching on this rather nutritious but admittedly somewhat low calorie dinner, I read your little signature and just started laughing and laughing!  :D  :-[ ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 22, 2005, 02:57:00 PM
After looking at the boxscore, the free throws weren't really all that bad.  15-21 is better than I thought.  Wabash shot poorly from the field (20-54), but Hanover wasn't much better (22-54) despite their sizzling start. 

I think what we learned is that it's just too hard to fall down by 15 to a good team and come back and win.  Wabash had their chances, but just couldn't get over the hump...again. 

Much is made about Wabash's balance and depth and how Wabash doesn't really have one guy that stands out.  There is some merit to that but, and I raised this point last season, without a go-to scorer Wabash inevitably goes through periods of offensive ineptitude.  There just isn't any consistency on offense and I can't help but wonder if part of that is due to the fact that when Wabash really needs a bucket, there isn't one guy to go to who is going to get it.  In the first half of the IWU game, Medeiros was the man.  He took the big shots, he got the ball with the shot clock running down, and he drilled almost all of them.  The result was, for 20 minutes, Wabash was better than the #1 team in the country.  In the second half Medeiros didn't score, nobody else stepped up, and Wabash scored one field goal in an 8-minute stretch in the second half.  This sort of lull seems to happen in nearly every game for Wabash (they started with this lull last night) and if the LGs can't find some consistency on offense, the league will continue to be Wooster and Witt, much to the chagrin of Wabash fans and, apparently, our friends from the CCIW. 

Take care of business in Colorado, Wabash.  Then it's time for the biggest game of the season...Nov. 30 vs. Depauw at Chadwick.  Wabash is WAY overdue for a win against those guys. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 22, 2005, 06:48:12 PM
Here is a link to an article in today's Wooster Daily Record on the Scot's new style of play.  It's a good read:
http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles//sports/&file=_sports3.txt&article=1&tD=
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: iwumichigander on November 22, 2005, 07:17:15 PM
diehard - Wabash is interesting; yet, i got to question the merit of their five man substitution pattern which seemed to interrupt their game flow.  Another observation, in the two tournament games Wabash seemed to 'run out of gas' late in the second period - even with using ten men. Still, this is a team with potential to do better as the season progresses.

On IWU - Definitely not their best effort particularly compared to their effort in the Illini Exhibition (yes, we did go down to see it).  Titans, as a team, did look particularly good in the second half against Wabash.  And, Adam Daukas showed why he is an All-American point guard in the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on November 22, 2005, 07:32:20 PM
Larry! Hi!  :)

Wow, so you're saying you drove hundreds of miles to watch IWU play? I'm in total and complete shock!  :D ;)

Thanks for the perspectives on Wabash! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 22, 2005, 07:42:16 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on November 22, 2005, 07:32:20 PM
Larry! Hi!  :)

Wow, so you're saying you drove hundreds of miles to watch IWU play? I'm in total and complete shock!  :D ;)

Thanks for the perspectives on Wabash! :)

Compared with their treks to Bloomington, Champaign was a 'home' game! :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 22, 2005, 08:32:02 PM
I think Mac is trying to get his team ready for the conference season. He can go 11 or 12 deep, and they all deserve some minutes. Plus, this is an interchangable team, for the most part.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 22, 2005, 09:05:10 PM
Halftime
Earlham 36
Bluffton 35

Reports from Billypilgram who is at the game...  earlham was up 20-4 and Bluffton went on a 16 point run...  Jewett with 11pts, Brandon Miller with 7pts and LaRon Henry with 8 pts.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Darryl Nester on November 22, 2005, 10:18:52 PM
Final from Bluffton: BU 72, EC 62

Lots of fouls -- not a pretty game. Four players fouled out (2 on each team).  Season opener for Bluffton.

For Earlham: Jewett 18pts, Miller 15pts (fouled out), Henry 12.
For Bluffton: Bergman 28pts, Sweet 20 (fouled out).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2005, 10:36:13 PM
National scores of interest (both final):

#1 Illinois Wesleyan 87
Olivet Nazarene 68

Lawrence 82
#2 UW-Oshkosh 75
Overtime

All things being equal, Wooster stands to move up to #2 in the next poll.  There's plenty of work to do before that poll comes out, though!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 22, 2005, 10:39:39 PM
Not happy with the OUTCOME of that game.. BILLYPILGRAM will have an Update when he gets home from the Game.   O_FOUR EVer Vs BU.    I guess that kid that had 28 is an All-American...  But i feel like if you get a 20-4 lead to start the game you should be IN-CONTROL.   Sorry BILLY i was busy looking at game film and working on stats from my game today.  I think you know the out-come of it. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 23, 2005, 01:03:20 AM
Tonight's NCAC scores:

OWU 70
W&J 67

Capital 54
Witt 73

B-W 96
Oberlin 80

and the aforementioned Earlham/Bluffton score.  2-2 for the NCAC tonight, 1-1 vs. the OAC. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 23, 2005, 01:14:34 AM
Just a quick question for anyone with some viewing experience: how does men's DIII basketball compare to that of the NAIA?  

As someone who's also a big volleyball fan, my opinion (derived over the last decade or so from watching the good, the bad, and the ugly from each organization) is that the level of play seems to be very even from top to bottom; that the top DIII teams are comparable to the top NAIA teams, and so on down the line.

I've never, though, seen any NAIA basketball.  I'm curious how the northeastern Ohio teams such as Walsh, Ohio Dominican, Mt. Vernon, Malone, et al. would do against the Woosters, BW's, John Carrolls, Hirams, etc., all of whom I've seen play many times.  And, how the best teams nationally would match up.  Anyone have any idea?  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 23, 2005, 01:23:46 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 23, 2005, 01:14:34 AM
Just a quick question for anyone with some viewing experience: how does men's DIII basketball compare to that of the NAIA?  

As someone who's also a big volleyball fan, my opinion (derived over the last decade or so from watching the good, the bad, and the ugly from each organization) is that the level of play seems to be very even from top to bottom; that the top DIII teams are comparable to the top NAIA teams, and so on down the line.

I've never, though, seen any NAIA basketball.  I'm curious how the northeastern Ohio teams such as Walsh, Ohio Dominican, Mt. Vernon, Malone, et al. would do against the Woosters, BW's, John Carrolls, Hirams, etc., all of whom I've seen play many times.  And, how the best teams nationally would match up.  Anyone have any idea?  

Go to multi-regional topics, and you'll find  several boards addressing the topic.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on November 23, 2005, 10:57:41 AM
From what I've seen of the NAIA dating back to my first experience of seeing Geneva vs. Mt. Vernon Nazarene in 2000, is that they run an uptempo style of play (men and women both) that can verge on chaotic at times, at least within the local region.  Wooster has a pretty good track record against the NAIA over the last several years, including wins last season over Ohio Dominican (82-75) and St. Francis-Ill. (73-39),  and of course we can't forget about Witt's big upset of top-ranked Cedarville (77-68) to start last season.  Oddly enough, Wooster has no NAIA teams on its schedule this season.  At least in this region, the NAIA teams such as Ohio Dominican, Walsh, and Mt. Vernon, may be able to hang with Witt, Woo, and JCU, but in the end DIII would rule the day, in my opinion of course. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 23, 2005, 11:13:37 AM
I've seen a bit of NAIA ball as well.  I've seen Wabash play against a handful of NAIA teams (Marian and Purdue-Calumet come to mind).  Also, I grew up in Klamath Falls, OR, home of the Oregon Institute of Technology Hustlin' Owls and have seen several of their games over the years.  In the late 90s, Marian had a very good team and they came to Chadwick and beat a very good Wabash team.  That game ended a 40-game home win streak for the LGs I believe (that was the first home game I saw Wabash lose actually).  OIT has been one of the NAIA D-II's best teams for about a decade now. They won a national championship a couple of years ago.  Last year they fell in the championship semis to eventual winner Walsh (who I believe got major contributions by a Wooster transfer...Sistrunk I think his name is). 

Anyway, my opinion of NAIA ball is that I think NAIA teams tend to be a little more athletic and maybe a little bigger than most D-III teams, but D-III teams tend to be deeper.  The top NAIA teams have depth and can run you out of the gym....which has been Oregon Tech's M.O. for a handful of years now.  By and large though, I don't think there's a huge competitive difference between the two. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 23, 2005, 11:37:57 AM
As Mr. Ypsi intimates, this is a much-discussed topic in Posting Up.  If I may be allowed to summarize and generalize years of such discussions, I'd say that the top echelon of D3 ball is considered to be better than NAIA-2, equivalent to (or slightly behind) the top teams in NAIA-1, and competitive with mid-range NCAA-2 and bottom rung NCAA-1 teams.  The top teams in NAIA-1 can be very good, and would be very competitive in the D3 tournament.  Good D3 teams will usually beat their NAIA-2 counterparts.

Over in the Multi-Region room, a poster named Rhodes (formerly Rhodes Scholar) keeps a running tally of D3 vs. all other divisions, including the various Christian college associations (NCCAA, ACCA, etc.)  If memory serves, it usually works out that D3 goes close to 0-fer against D1, maybe .200 against D2, more like .400 or .500 against NAIA-1, about .800 against NAIA-2, and .950+ against the bible schools. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 23, 2005, 12:06:40 PM
'Bash used to play a whole bunch of NAIA schools before the ICAC formed. Of course Anderson, Franklin, Manchester, Taylor, et. al. were NAIA.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 23, 2005, 12:30:48 PM
Please note the front-page story on Steve Moore's recent coaching milestones. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 23, 2005, 12:35:32 PM
Here's Rhodes' year-end tally of inter-division games from last year:
Quote from: Rhodes Scholar on February 28, 2005, 04:30:05 PM
D3 vs. 

D1....2-61
D2....10-47
NAIA 1....16-22
NAIA 2....67-70
NCCAA....37-7
USCAA....68-7

It looks like I was a little optimistic about our record against the bible schools, and very optimistic about our record vs. NAIA-2.  One explanation for the latter is that a good number of the games vs. NAIA-2 are played by lower-echelon D3 teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 23, 2005, 01:13:12 PM
Thanks to everybody for the replies to my NAIA question.

Are any of you Wooster fans planning on making the trip to Emory and Henry for the tournament this weekend?  Looks to be about 360 miles.  I'm considering making the trip.  I don't suppose the school is running a fan bus... :-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 23, 2005, 02:16:03 PM
As promised, a quick recap of my first look at Earlham this season:

They still turn the ball over too much.......the official stats had them for 15, which seems way too low, and judging by some of the blatant errors (crediting an Earlham player who never took off his shooting shirt with five minutes and two rebounds) leads me to believe they are wrong.

Game opened and Earlham methodically built a 20-4 lead.....great defense and effecient offense. Then, Earlham really slowed to a halt...and by the end of the half, Bluffton had pulled within one.

During the second half, Earlham was stuck behind 47-44 for seemingly five minutes, but Bluffton's Bergman had a 4-point play and another 3 in transition. Quakers fought back, but never got closer than five in the final minutes.

Miller battled foul trouble the whole night, Jewett and Henry both had decent offensive nights. I'm not sure anyone played well defensively.

Difference maker was Bluffton's Eric Sweet, who had 20 and 10 off the bench and got away with throwing a punch/forearm just after the halftime buzzer. The officials had a conference for a few moments and then ruled that no action was necessary.

Only other note on officiating, which we all know is dicey at best on this level (and especially in Ohio): there are two plays that I hate that I am seeing called mroe and more lately.

1. The short, out of control point guard who drives to the basket with just seconds remaining on the shot clock and throws himself into a defensive player while throwing the ball nearly over the backboard while getting the whistle. I hate bail out calls and these seemingly always happen when one team is trying to run out the clock. Rather than run offense, the guard dribbles the shot clock down under 10 and then goes barreling toward the basket. Under no circumstances should a player be rewarded for making a stupid drive and throwing up a stupid shot.

2. The Flop: this mostly also applies for the undersized guards who find themselves matched up against post players on the low block. The larger player catches, turns to face, but the defensive player crowds underneath him and then falls to the ground. It's called a charge 75% of the time and it drives me nuts.

Sorry, hadn't watched D-3 basketball in a few months and had forgotten the showmanship that is necessary to get the benefit of a call. Rant done.

As for NAIA v. D-3: I think everyone has hit it on the head. NAIA D-1 has always appeared to be comparable to NCAA D-2........lots of fast breaks and a lot of athletes.

My opinion of NAIA II, having grown up in North Central Indiana near the MCC, has always been a bunch of 6-2 white guys shooting 3's. Since coming to D-3 basketball, I have always been struck by the nice balance of 6-2 guys shooting 3s with larger players and players who didn't all grow up near a barn. It's a much better product in my mind...not that the masses have been quick to buy (but they should).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 23, 2005, 03:37:01 PM
DC -

I think I read that last year it was a bit down for D-3 vs. NAIA - 2.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 23, 2005, 03:37:58 PM
Billy P -

What's wrong with a bunch of players that grew up near a barn? This is HOOSIERS country, after all....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 23, 2005, 04:02:20 PM
hahaha.......nothing at all

believe me, I fit the stereotype

I played on a high school team that was destined to break the Grant County records for 3-pointers made and attempted in a season......so a local sportswriter was sent our way to chronicle the story

he asked what made us so successful, I said it was because there was nothing to do but "shoot buckets once we were done with our chores"

I also said if there wasn't a 3-point line I'd have been the least valuable player in high school basketball................for the next three days after that story ran, our coach wouldn't let me shoot during scrimmages in practice

me and my mouth
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 23, 2005, 06:25:31 PM
I just wanted to wish  everyone here a safe and enjoyable Thanksgiving!!!  Safe travels to all especially given the forecast for Ohio and the snow belt.  May we all eat heartily and enjoy all of the leftovers! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 23, 2005, 08:13:55 PM
BILLY_P

    WAIT you can hit the 3 point shot.  Darn I wish I would of known that earlier in life... then maybe I would not of looked you off at the three point line and then threw it to STOOPS for 3.  ( if i'm not 100% sure he hit the shot...correct me if i'm wrong)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 23, 2005, 08:17:42 PM
Thanks Scotsfan... HAPPY THANKSGIVING  TO ALL.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 23, 2005, 10:57:02 PM
It's a damn shame Stoops graduated. He was always a fan favorite at Wabash when he shot those free throws sideways!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 24, 2005, 12:22:18 AM
I think Stoops was a fan favorite every place with that style....it was always a joy seeing the levels of reaction from the crowd

Step 1/FT 1: The puzzled looks
Step 2/FT 2: The murmur
Step 3/FT 3: The calls of one or two "baskets over there"
Step 4/FT 4: outright booing from the confused crowd

EC Alum, has Stoops' season started back up in Japan? Back with the same team?


and everyone be sure to be thankful for this board tomorrow..........
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 24, 2005, 11:47:23 AM
Billy_P

Matter of fact they won their first home game the other day in O.T.  He wrote me and said that he had 26 points and 14 Rebounds.   FYI  last season he was named FIRST TEAM ALL LEAGUE.  I wouldn't be suprised to see future JAPANESSE NBA players in the league shooting FT's Sideways becaue of him.  lol
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on November 25, 2005, 09:29:31 AM
Article in the Daily Record mentioned that Jeff Stevens couldn't practice till a few days before the Van Wie Tourney due to a torn calf muscle.  As he progresses he might be seeing some more playing time.  He and Marty Bidwell will be vying for time to rest Port and Vandervaart.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 25, 2005, 11:11:42 PM
Final from Colorado College:
Bethany (KS) 70
Wabash 63

Wabash had a 5-point halftime lead, and stretched it to 14 with about 13:00 remaining, but the Swedes outscored the LGs 35-14 the rest of the way.  Wabash led by 1 with 2:05 left, but couldn't salt away the W.  The LGs shout just 38% (23/60) and were led by Adonis Joseph with 12.

Press Release (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/home.cfm?pages_id=3&news_ID=3022)
Box Score (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/docs/basketballstats/200506/wabm1125.htm)

I'm sure our many resident Wabash posters are otherwise occupied tonight; I think there's a football game there tomorrow that interests some of them... ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 26, 2005, 12:11:53 AM
It's a disappointing loss...maybe this will be a learning experience. But yeah, Saturday at Hollett is really taking our attention away from it all...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 26, 2005, 07:45:10 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 33  Methodist 24

James Cooper had a big first half with 14 points including 3 three pointers made.  Tim Vandervaart has 6 points and 5 or 6 boards.

Wooster has missed some open three pointers but played good defense to hold Methodist to only 24 points.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 26, 2005, 07:50:37 PM
Sounds like Cooper is off to a fast start again.  He is just such a dangerous player and it looks like he is just gaining more and more confidence.  He's making it hard for anyone to defend him when he's knocking down 3's from NBA range.  He is just fun to watch, or listen to , ;) as is the case tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 26, 2005, 08:01:54 PM
Some halftime stats:

Wooster is shooting just 36%, but they are holding Methodist to just 29%.  Methodist was coming into the game shooting 50% for their 1st two games, so the Scots are doing the job defensively.  Methodist's strength was their perimeter defense, so it looks like they are having success in shutting down Wooster's shooters as well.

Wooster is also outrebounding the Monarchs 27-18.  Vandervaart is on his way to a double double.

The winner will play E&H tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 26, 2005, 08:40:13 PM
Final from VA:

Wooster 77
Methodist 63
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 26, 2005, 08:40:57 PM
Final:  Wooster 77  Methodist 63

Wooster notches a nice win at the E&H tourney.  Scots were led by James Cooper with 21 points, Tim Vandervaart with 14 points and ~ 15 boards.  Tom Port chipped in 10 points.

Should be a high scoring game tomorrow against Emory & Henry.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 26, 2005, 08:53:22 PM
Big Red Men Top Muskingum at the Buzzer

MARIETTA, Ohio-- Trailing by one with six seconds remaining in regulation, junior guard Tony Julian connected on a basket as time expired, lifting the Big Red to their second victory of the season over Muskingum College at the 2005 OAC vs. NCAC Challenge hosted by Marietta College.
Remainder of press release (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/db/site/newsreleases/mb/20051126_1648.html)
The final score was Denison 78, Muskingum 77.
In the other half of the NCAC/OAC Challenge, it was Kenyon 115, Marietta 99.
That's a nice 2-0 for the NCAC this evening!

Elsewhere, Carnige Mellon 106, Oberlin 70.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 26, 2005, 08:58:01 PM
Hopefully Wooster brought their running shoes for tommorow afternoon's game.  
E&H beat Thomas More 150-110!  

Tonight's game wasn't really as close as the final score.  Wooster maintained pretty much a 15 point lead for much of the 2nd half.  Good win for Wooster over an NCAA tournament qualifier from last year.

One area of concern is Kyle Witucky who went down mid-way through the 2nd half with a knee injury.  From the post game interview with Coach Moore, it sounds as if its a bruise to his knee.  He didn't seem too concerned about it and seems to think he will be ready to go tomorrow.  Hopefully that is the case.  Against a run & gun team like E&H, Wooster will definately need Witucky on the floor, as the Scots will need all the depth they can get to keep the troops fresh.  Should be an entertaining game to listen in to.  Could Wooster's record single game point total of 133 points set back in 1971  be in jeopardy? ::)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 26, 2005, 09:36:05 PM
any other scores from around the NCAC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 26, 2005, 10:20:41 PM
Yes...other NCAC scores:

Baldwin-Wallace 89  Allegheny 66 (home loss for gators)
Wabash 77  Philadelphia Bible 35 (consolation game at colorado tourney)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 26, 2005, 10:44:07 PM
One other score:

Ohio Wesleyan 76  Mount Union 68 (first round at Hanover tourney)

Bishops made 11 of 22 three pointers to knock off the Purple Raiders.  Bryan King had 7 of the 11 three pointers and 24 points total to lead OWU.  Ben Chojnacki added 19 points.

NCAC 3  OAC 1 in today's games!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 27, 2005, 11:11:26 AM
If my math is correct, the NCAC is a respectable 17-12 in non-conference action so far this season.  I say respectable because the NCAC is usually below .500 as a conference in non-conference play.  This could be a sign of things improving across the conference as a whole.  Well, maybe with the exception of Oberlin...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 27, 2005, 01:32:07 PM
I wish we could get that kind of improvement in our football non-con record.

I'm excited about that non-con improvement. Let's hope Wabash adds to it by beating Depauw for the first time since my senior year.  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 27, 2005, 01:47:14 PM
Wabash hasn't played bad in the non-conference games.  They have been respectable against some very good opponents and very likely could have won at least 2 of the games they lost.  For what its worth, I'm pulling for Wabash to beat Depauw as well! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2005, 03:42:27 PM
10:00 Left in the FIRST Half:    Wooster 39  Emory & Henry 16

Wooster's defense too tough for E&H and they are beating the Wasps for easy layups!

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 27, 2005, 04:01:01 PM
Wooster has already broken the record for points in the 1st  half (67) with 4:00 left in the 1st half.  The Scots could match their total for the entire game last night in the 1st half!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2005, 04:07:36 PM
At the HALF:  Wooster 80   Emory & Henry 43

Wooster rolling in this game.  Tom Port has 17 points, James Cooper has 15 points and Tim Vandervaart has 10 points, ~10 boards.

Wooster has set an all time school record for points in a half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 27, 2005, 04:08:15 PM
Halftime in VA:

Wooster - 80
E&H - 44

Wooster jumped out on the Wasps 12-0 and never looked back.  Wooster was able to easily handle E&H's press.  

Wooster broke the record of 73 points for a half set back in 1971!!!

They only need 54 points in the 2nd half to break the total points in a single game!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 27, 2005, 04:23:45 PM
Some other 1st half #'s:

Wooster, as expected, shoots lights out at 74%.

E&H was held to just 27% and only 23% from downtown.

And Wooster outrebounded E&H 38-17.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2005, 05:08:08 PM
Final:  Wooster 150   Emory & Henry 101

Wooster registers a very comfortable win and is the champion of the E&H tourney.  Wooster was led by Tom Port with 33 points (career high), James Cooper with 26 points, Tim Vandervaart with 20 points and Evan Will with 21 points.

Wooster sets an all time school record for most points in a game!

Very nice win for the Scots.  Up next is an NCAC game at Denison.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2005, 05:12:40 PM
I'd be surprised if all 4 of those weren'r career highs!

Elsewhere, Wittenberg continues their strong early-season play, going down to Lexington and upending Transylvania 61-52.  Dec. 10 looms large for the Tigers and Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on November 27, 2005, 05:26:51 PM
62-51  :o

http://d3hoops.com/releases.php?release=45236

http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/05-06statistics/transyboxscore.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 27, 2005, 05:31:02 PM
Nice weekend for the Scots as they travel to VA and pick up the sweep!  This game was never in doubt.  About the only thing that was in doubt was just how badly the Scots would beat the record of 133.  I would say that the 150 scored by Wooster should be safe at least until December 18th, when Westminster comes to town. ;)

December 10th is definatetly looming large, but Wooster can't be looking that far ahead.  They open up conference play this Wednesday at Denison, and we saw what the Big Red did to Witt last year on their home floor.  That won't be an easy win like in years past.  Then Wooster has to travel to Earlham, which will be another test for the Scots.  Wooster has plenty to keep them occupied until they can start focusing their attention onto that game on the 10th.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 27, 2005, 05:38:20 PM
Is E & H a "system" team - like Grinnell??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 27, 2005, 08:08:40 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 27, 2005, 05:38:20 PM
Is E & H a "system" team - like Grinnell??
Yes.  They were averaging over 130 ppg coming into today's game.

One interesting score to pass along...

Rochester, who lost to Witt last weekend, pounded JCU today 91-61.

Also, a day after losing to Kenyon, Marietta knocks off Denison 111-89.

Anyone have any other scores from the NCAC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: augiedad on November 27, 2005, 08:23:05 PM
Robert Morris (Chicago) 91
Ohio Wesleyan 72

http://www.hanover.edu/sports/hcmbb.htm

Robert Morris is ranked #4 in NAIA DI - they're a lot better than the other 3 teams in the Hanover tourney field.  Still not sure why Hanover chose to play them in Round 1 of their own tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on November 27, 2005, 08:24:40 PM
 :o Wow, is any team ever going to realize that the Grinnell system is junk? I guess it could be fun for the kids because they still get to score points but it just doesn't produce many wins. Congrats to the Scots on breaking the records and all!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2005, 08:54:57 PM
The Transy site said (and continues to say) 61-52.  Nevertheless I regret the error.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2005, 09:26:00 PM
The Kenyon website reports  ;) that Muskingum upended the Lords, 85-66. 

Not such a good day for the NCAC/OAC Challenge.  :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2005, 09:31:55 PM
Quote from: augiedad on November 27, 2005, 08:23:05 PM
Robert Morris (Chicago) 91
Ohio Wesleyan 72

http://www.hanover.edu/sports/hcmbb.htm

Robert Morris is ranked #4 in NAIA DI - they're a lot better than the other 3 teams in the Hanover tourney field.  Still not sure why Hanover chose to play them in Round 1 of their own tournament.

Why not?  In the eyes of the NCAA, losing to Rob't Morris is the same as not playing at all (or beating them, for that matter.)  Hanover got to play a high-quality opponent in a situation where a loss doesn't really hurt them.  It looks to me like none of the Collier teams were in-region for Hanover (MUC certainly isn't; OWU is close to the 200-mile limit, but I think it's a few miles on the wrong side), so with nothing to gain or lose, you might as well play the best team you can.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 27, 2005, 09:54:44 PM
QuoteWow, is any team ever going to realize that the Grinnell system is junk? I guess it could be fun for the kids because they still get to score points but it just doesn't produce many wins. Congrats to the Scots on breaking the records and all!

Compare where  Grinnell and Redlands were BEFORE the system and after the system.

It certainly has greatly improved both programs. Other programs are in their infancy of running it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on November 27, 2005, 10:08:27 PM
Juniata 88, Allegeny 75

Gators are now 2-2 on the season after losing both games in its Thanksgiving tournament.  They lost 89-66 to Baldwin-Wallace on Saturday.  Unfortunately, I was not able to make it to either day of the tournament to check out the teams.  Albion ended up winning the tourney over B-W 75-72, as they connected on a trey and a pair of free throws in the waning moments.  Crawford looked like he had a nice pair of games for Abion with 41 points and 30 boards and the assist on the go-ahead three in the championship, while Tori Davis was top dawg for BW with 41 points and 15 caroms on the weekend.  McCloskey had 26 against BW and 18 against Juniata to lead the Gators, who were also without Matt Majzlik for some unknown reason.  I'm guessing he's injured, as is usually the case. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 28, 2005, 12:29:45 AM
QuoteWow, is any team ever going to realize that the Grinnell system is junk? I guess it could be fun for the kids because they still get to score points but it just doesn't produce many wins. Congrats to the Scots on breaking the records and all!
[/shadow]

I'm not convinced that this sort of system is junk if you have the talent to utilize it.  Loyola Marymount, in the days of Bo Kimble, Hank Gathers, et al. made it work and thensome, because they had all the parts.

Per Stemer (who could also shoot the three) and Gathers were strong rebounders, and when Loyola was occasionally forced to play half court, Gathers was a force inside. Kimble was a great one on one player who could also shoot the ball.  Nobody has ever shot the three better than Jeff Frye. And their point guards had tremendous speed and ability, one of whom was Terrell Lowery, who went on to be a major league outfielder.

Not that I think it would produce the best results for them, but I actually believe that Wooster would do very well playing that sort of ball.  They have the speed, ballhandling, and outside shooting to make it work, along with just enough rebounding.  And, they're pretty deep, especially at guard, where it's probably more important.  I can easily see Andy Van Horn as a modern-day, DIII, Tom (the human bruise) Peabody.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 28, 2005, 01:07:20 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 28, 2005, 12:29:45 AMI'm not convinced that this sort of system is junk if you have the talent to utilize it.  Loyola Marymount, in the days of Bo Kimble, Hank Gathers, et al. made it work and thensome, because they had all the parts.

Per Stemer (who could also shoot the three) and Gathers were strong rebounders, and when Loyola was occasionally forced to play half court, Gathers was a force inside. Kimble was a great one on one player who could also shoot the ball.  Nobody has ever shot the three better than Jeff Frye. And their point guards had tremendous speed and ability, one of whom was Terrell Lowery, who went on to be a major league outfielder.

Not that I think it would produce the best results for them, but I actually believe that Wooster would do very well playing that sort of ball.  They have the speed, ballhandling, and outside shooting to make it work, along with just enough rebounding.  And, they're pretty deep, especially at guard, where it's probably more important.  I can easily see Andy Van Horn as a modern-day, DIII, Tom (the human bruise) Peabody.

David Arseneault's Grinnell system is completely different from the Loyola Marymount system Paul Westhead ran in the days of Bo Kimble, Hank Gathers, Per Stumer, etc. It's not even a modification of Westhead's system. It's something completely different and unique. For more information, check out the "Who is running the Grinnell system?" room under the General Basketball heading.

And Moneyball5144, for decades Grinnell was a losing basketball program. Since Arseneault instituted the system a decade and a half ago, the Pioneers have won three conference titles -- something that they hadn't done prior to the birth of the Arseneault system since the 1961-62 season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2005, 01:17:07 AM
I wasn't going to say it...  8)

After listening to the (albeit frantic) game on the radio, I have to wonder where to pigeonhole Bob Johnson's Wasps.  I think I recall reading that they were emulating the "System," having contacted Coach Arsenault, etc., but it sounded like they sagged into a half-court defense more often than I would expect a System team to do. 

Whatever it is they do, I wouldn't be too quick to dismiss it.  Sure, they had their heads handed to them today, but that's been the experience of System teams when they come up against top quality, athletic teams.  But less than a day before that, the Wasps hung up 150 of their own and wiped out Thomas More by 40 points.  They also beat Southern Vermont, and lost to perennial playoff team John Carroll by a scant 10 points.  E&H is not a program that's going to consistently challenge on the national scene, so if they can get 15 kids significant playing time and still beat the poor teams and be competitive against the good ones, I say more power to them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jeloesel on November 28, 2005, 07:35:43 AM
David,
Bob Johnson defies easy pidgeonholing.  He's a veteran coach who's a great teacher.  When playing "conventional" offense, his teams were always sound in executing fundamentals.  The problem with coaching at Emory & Henry is getting enough outstanding talent to come to the middle of nowhere to constitute a team that can compete at the top levels of the ODAC. 

If he's anything, Bob Johnson is creative.  He's always coming up with defensive and offensive innovations, and his decision to jump to a completely different "system" is a typical Johnson move.   I'd expect Emory & Henry to do better under this "system" than they would have done continuing with a more conventional approach.  It will get Johnson's creative juices flowing and he's such a great teacher and motivator that he'll get his kids playing well.  He'll drive the other coaches in the ODAC to distraction because they will have to prepare differently for the Wasps than any other team in the conference.  It will take him a couple years to figure out the optimum way of running his version of the "system" at E&H.  Meanwhile, he'll be having a lot more fun than the rest of us.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ODACfan1 on November 28, 2005, 12:06:35 PM
What makes Bob Johnson such a great coach is the fact that he is willing to take chances.  The team that he has this season has bought into playing the style that Coach Johnson has put in.  It is not grinnell and its not LMU either.  E&H has developed its own style of play and no matter what the outcome of the WOOSTER game it has already become a success. 
In saying that, it is still a work in progress, but their team really plays extremely hard and are going to give the ODAC fits.  Congrats again to a very strong WOOSTER team...I would love to see them play E&H again when the Wasps are clicking on all cylinders.  WOOSTER is a great TEAM.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 28, 2005, 09:01:08 PM
Greg,

You are technically correct, but even jeffp sometimes refers to it at LM/Grinnell ball - there ARE many similarities.

If Hank Gathers had not collapsed and died, I really think LM would have been AT LEAST Final Four that year.  Even without Hank they blew out #1 seed (and #1 ranked) Michigan.  I 'bleed' maize and blue (on the days I'm not bleeding Titan Green and White! ;)), but after Bo Kimble made that left handed free throw in tribute to Hank, I couldn't see the next few minutes of the game through my tears. 

I have never been LESS disappointed over a Michigan loss in my life!  (Well, except for the nearly annual occasions when Eastern Michigan kicks their butts in Cross Country or Track and Field!)  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 28, 2005, 10:25:15 PM
don't think Michigan was #1 that year.....UNLV, the eventual national champion, was the #1 seed in that regional that ended with wins over Ball State and LMU in the Oakland Coliseum.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 29, 2005, 12:07:15 AM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on November 28, 2005, 10:25:15 PM
don't think Michigan was #1 that year.....UNLV, the eventual national champion, was the #1 seed in that regional that ended with wins over Ball State and LMU in the Oakland Coliseum.

As a MAC fan, I well remember when Bonzi Wells' BSU team came closer to beating UNLV than any other team did, but I don't THINK was the same year - I'm too tired tonite to look it up, but if no one beats me to it, I'll check tomorrow.

I DO recall that UM was HEAVILY favored, but was dumb enough to try to out run-and-gun LM - no doubt fun for the players, but not a real smart strategy!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 29, 2005, 12:25:59 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 28, 2005, 09:01:08 PM
You are technically correct, but even jeffp sometimes refers to it at LM/Grinnell ball - there ARE many similarities.

Jeff does that when he's referring to the full range of uptempo, run & gun, gambling-press-defense styles, of which there are many (Nolan Richardson's old Arkansas "amoeba" defense is another) -- but Jeff is very clear about the fact that the Westhead and Arseneault systems are quite different. And having seen both of them in action, I can attest to that as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 29, 2005, 12:31:28 AM
Michigan was a #3 seed that year, Loyola was a #11 seed.  Strangely enough, Loyola won their next game in the regional semis by a score of 62-60 over Alabama.  That might have been the strangest score of the tournament. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 29, 2005, 12:32:51 AM
Check out the big brain on Wally!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 29, 2005, 12:44:27 AM
Nolan Richardson had "40 minutes of hell", Jerry Tarkanian's UNLV team, which I am about to post more about, ran the amoeba.........which always looked like a 2-3 match up to me.

Anyway, 1990 NCAA tournament was the year LMU went to the elite eight, beating New Mexico State (111-92), Michigan (149-115) and Alabama (62-60) before being blown out by UNLV (131-101).

Michigan was the defending national champion that season, but was not a #1 seed (and therefore I highly doubt the #1 team in the country). A look at CBS sportsline's tournament Final Four seeding reveals that UNLV reached the Final Four that year with the #1 seed. Obviously if Michigan were stationed at the other end of the bracket, setting up a regional final, they would've been a #2 or #3 seed.

Ball State was not led by Bonzi Wells, but rather by another Muncie Central grad, Chandler Thompson and coached by Dick Hunsaker, who later replaced Steve Alford at Manchester.  Ball State beat Oregon State and Louisville, before losing 69-67 to UNLV.

Bonzi Wells exhausted his eligibility in 1998, a year in which the Cardinals were problably the last team left out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 29, 2005, 12:46:34 AM
quick on the gun Wally.........I was too busy researching the exact scores

but I thought they were a #3 seed......it was LMU's Jeff Fryer that hit about 10 3's in that game

don't think LMU would've reached the Final Four either........UNLV was loaded, on the floor and in the pockets
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 29, 2005, 01:01:01 AM
Wow, my memory is really striking out tonite!

I'm probably mixing up the UM #1 2nd round loss with when Villanova beat 'em.  I was right on BSU coming closer to UNLV than anyone else, but I guess it wasn't Bonzi (even when I typed that, that seemed too long ago for Wells).

I tthink it must be bed time!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 29, 2005, 01:59:21 AM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on November 29, 2005, 12:44:27 AM
Nolan Richardson had "40 minutes of hell", Jerry Tarkanian's UNLV team, which I am about to post more about, ran the amoeba.........which always looked like a 2-3 match up to me.

Yeah, you're right. Brain cramp on my part. I was thinking of "40 minutes of hell" and typed "amoeba" instead. Tarkanian did run a 2-3 matchup with aggressive mid-floor pressure, but he always called it a "modified amoeba". The true amoeba defense, instituted by Fran Webster at Westminster (PA) and Pitt, is more of a 1-1-3 man/matchup. Mike Dunlap uses it at Metro State to great effect; I've enjoyed watching the Roadrunners on TV on the three occasions that they've made the D2 national championship game over the past decade because that defense is so much fun to watch when done right, and you rarely see anyone use it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2005, 09:08:10 AM
New poll out overnight; IWU gobbles up all the available #1 votes (including the one Wooster had in the preseason poll) and goes to unanimous #1.  Wooster climbs over Oshkosh to #2 (UW-O drops to #7), and Wittenberg roars up to #3 from #10.  I am very impressed with Witt's start, and have posted on that in the Daily Dose.  I'm glad the voters recognize this strong start.

The top three teams right now are the top three teams of all time...go figure!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 29, 2005, 10:02:41 AM
Break 'em up!  ;D :D

Though it's not like rooting for the Yankees! (Well, except Witt... ;) )
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 29, 2005, 05:29:31 PM
A post directed to earlhamalum, so carry on fellow NCACers.....though you are certainly welcome to read about and come to the following event

ECalum,

Did you get the email from Gail Barnes in the alumni office that explained a few packages available for the upcoming Conseco game? Namely, I guess there is going to be a dinner held after the EC game and before the Pacers game in Conseco's Pepsi Pavillion. Any interest in going to this? Or, are we still looking to go out on our own after the game? Let me know about that and about tickets. Maybe you could actually pick up your cell phone too....though I'm sure you're still lamenting your first loss as a head coach.

By the way, I thought it was funny to get an email detailing the game at Conseco from the alumni association and to "have the chance to eat dinner with Earlham Quaker players and coaches"....


Now, a non-Earlham question for Wooster/Denison followers....why is this conference opener being played so early?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 29, 2005, 06:18:46 PM
Billy,

I wouldn't exactly refer to the game tomorrow between Wooster and Denison as opening conference play early.  Technically its early, but only by 3 days over the rest of the conference openers on Saturdy. 

Denison has been Wooster's conference opener for some reason in each of the last 3 seasons and they are again this season.  It has also fallen on the 2nd Wednesday of the season which is when its being played this year.  Seeing as how this is Wooster's only meeting with Denison, I would guess they are getting it out of the way before round robin play begins with the rest of the conference on Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on November 29, 2005, 07:16:36 PM
How about the schedule maker for Denison - Wooster at home, followed by Wittenberg and Akron on the road.  Wow!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 29, 2005, 07:30:57 PM
Dear Big Red,

Have fun digging out of the hole!

Sincerely,

The NCAC!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 29, 2005, 07:32:07 PM
I have a prediction that tomorrow's Wabash / DePauw game will be LOUD!

Anyone who has been to Chadwick when the crowd was rockin' and rollin' - amp it up by a factor of five or ten.

Should be a blast, and yes the Bell will be in attendance. (See, when we win the thing it's out and proud - when the Dannies win it they hide it...just sayin'.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 29, 2005, 07:47:03 PM
ehh..........yea, nevermind.........guess I can't read a schedule

for some reason, I had stuck in my head that conference play started next Saturday (12/10)

and poor Denison......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 29, 2005, 08:20:18 PM
Boy, I guess.  I forgot who Denison had following up the Wooster game. 

Poor Denison is right!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 29, 2005, 08:32:00 PM
billypilgram-  
  Hmmm getting to meet the coaches and players... sounds so tempting.  Do you know if we can get autographs?  will they serve beer?  and the number one question of them all... will RHONDA be there? (will not disclose who's mother that is)  I would first have to find out the answer to those questions before I can make a decision.  If not Hooters and BW3s is within 2 blocks of Conceso. Pitcher of beer is 6.95 *before tax's.  I believe the running rate for a beer at the pacer game is 6.50 for 16 ounces (Correct me if i'm wrong)  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2005, 09:12:38 PM
One last thing I wanted to say about the COW/E&H game--how's this for a stat line?

                                  TOT-FG  3-PT               REBOUNDS
## Player Name            FG-FGA FG-FGA FT-FTA OF DE TOT PF  TP  A TO BLK S MIN
20 Kyle Witucky........ *  1-3        0-1       0-0    1   3    4    2    2   4  3    0   0  26

That may not line up quite right; here's a link to the boxscore. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/boxes/2005-06/emoryhenry.php)

Wooster takes 90 field goal attempts; Witucky takes just three of them.  Only Cody Drake and Brad Chisnell took fewer shots, and they played just 3 minutes apiece. 

Does this guy understand his role or what?  Can you imagine how tempted he was to get in on the fun by launching some bombs?  But that was not part of the gameplan, so he didn't do it (well, once.)   Instead, he kept the team running and let them take the spotlight.  Kyle would (or will) be a great coach if he chooses to go that way.

And I'm told he's at or near the top of his class academically.   :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2005, 09:23:29 PM
Calvin's coach Kevin Vande Streek just mentioned on Hoopsville that he's bringing the Knights to the Mose Hole Classic next season.  Mark your calendars!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 29, 2005, 09:37:53 PM
DC,

Forgive my flippancy, but what WAS Kyle Witucky's intended role in that game?

He had just 4 of their 36 assists, 4 of their 73 rebounds, 0 of their 8 steals, yet 3 of their 25 turnovers (plus, of course, 2 of their 150 points)!  Sounds to me like he just had a HORRIBLE game, not that he played his role! :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2005, 09:46:44 PM
He's the point guard.  I would have thought that was obvious.  The point guard on a team playing against a "System" team doesn't figure to get many assists; the guy he passes it to gets the assist.  The TOs are because he's the guy getting the pressure in the backcourt; 3 is a pretty low number against a system team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 29, 2005, 10:17:44 PM
Mr. Ypsi

Witucky also played the E&H game with a painful knee bruise that he got the night before in the win against Methodist.

Kyle Witucky has been the starting point guard ALL 4 years of his career at Wooster.  During that span, Wooster's 3+ year record is 87-10 including three NCAA tourney appearances with a 3rd place national finish, Elite Eight showing and a Sweet Sixteen showing.  :)

As someone noted on the Wooster website, Witucky is the "heart and soul" of this year's Wooster squad.  As DC noted, Kyle is the consummate team player and during his entire career he has never cared whether he scored 20 points or 0 points in a game as long as Wooster got the "W".  :)

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 29, 2005, 11:10:03 PM
I'm even going to back the Wooster posters - those numbers against a system team mean nothing. If this was hockey, and you gave second assists, I'm sure Witucky would have had a ton.

(Ok, I backed you guys - help a brotha out and just beat Witt...thanks!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 29, 2005, 11:11:53 PM
wooscotfan, I didn't know about the injury, but to both you and David, give me a LITTLE credit!  I'm fully aware that Kyle is one of the best PGs in the country!

Obviously I didn't see the game, but from the box score he appeared to have an (uncharacteristically) awful game.  I know that sometimes box scores 'lie' - leaving out important contributions.  But from the numbers alone (including only 23 minutes, unless that was due to either the injury or the blow-out), it just doesn't look like a 'Witucky-type' game!

Certainly no disrespect intended towards quite possibly the 2nd best PG in the country (come on - your think I'm gonna put him above Adam Dauksas? ;D).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2005, 11:30:51 PM
But that's just it, Chuck:  it was NOT a typical Witucky-like game.  It wasn't a typical game in any respect.  Evan Will scores 21; his previous career high was 8.  Tom Port drops in 33.  Tim Vandervaart goes for 20 AND 17 boards.  Typically, you'd see Kyle throw up 6-to-8 treys, dish out a half-dozen assists, etc.  But E&H says to Wooster: we're going to keep you trapped in the backcourt.  If you can get it over the half court line, you can have a layup.  So Kyle takes the inbounds pass, works against the double team trap, gets the ball over the midcourt line (with only 3 turnovers in 26 minutes), then lets the other 4 guys have the fun, and get all the stats, while he stays back on defense. 

Kyle has a very good shot at making an all-America team (besides academic all-America), and stats mean everything to those teams.  In a game when he could have easily scored 25 and had 10+ assists, he instead has a stat line that looks like he didn't contribute at all in 26 minutes.  On a bruised knee.  And Wooster won by 49 points.  He executed the gameplan, pretty near perfectly, and to the detriment of his own stat line.

Think about it: is it possible for the point guard to have an "awful game" in 26 minutes and still have his team score 150 and win by 49?  Wooster has a team offensive goal of 1.1 points per possession; on Sunday, they scored just over 1.3 points per possession.  With Witucky running the point most of the game.

And BTW, Kyle's 26 minutes were bested only by Tom Port's 27, and nobody on the Wasps played as many minutes.  It's because of the system, which requires fresh legs for both teams.  I don't think the bruised knee was much of a factor, even though the bruise occurred only about 18 hours before the start of the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 29, 2005, 11:51:46 PM
David and wooscotsfan,

I couldn't have said it any better myself... :)

Quote(Ok, I backed you guys - help a brotha out and just beat Witt...thanks!)
Thanks smeds for having our backs.  I hope that we can oblige on your request as well!  You don't know how much we want to oblige on that one!!!  I've heard about enough of Witt fan chanting "this is our house" at Timken recently! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 30, 2005, 12:24:18 AM
OK, I yield!

This was obviously one of those games where the box score DOES lie! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 30, 2005, 01:31:20 AM
 
                                      FG's   3'ts    Ft's    OR     Dr    TOT        PF    A     TO    BLK   S   MIN
Tyler Stewart 24....... g  2-4    1-2    0-1      0    1    1     5       5        3    1        0       0     33
 
Best number 24 Guard in the Conference...  I mean whomever just POSTED about a POINT GUARD stats..that looked like WHITUCKY's makes me laugh... i mean the the team scored 150 points and some of you say he is the best PG in the country.. THAT AMAZES me...   
I'd hope it looked  9-14   4-6   4-4   1 3     4    3     5   2  0   3   32   is tbest in the country in a score that was 150-101

I heard he is one of the best at HALLO for XboX... one of the best.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 30, 2005, 02:06:13 AM
Have you not been following this conversation, Earlhamalum? Wooster faced a team that presented them with a gimmick defense that completely skews a team's normal offensive approach. So Kyle Witucky did exactly what a point guard is supposed to do to combat said gimmick defense.

His team won by 49 points. He had nothing to show for it statistically as an individual. But, I repeat, his team won by 49 points, in large part because he did exactly what he was supposed to do. You're still aware that basketball is a team sport, right?

I'd say that you're having trouble seeing the forest for the trees.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 30, 2005, 11:36:49 AM
Allow me to further clarify things for you earlhamalum.  One of the main aspects of a "System" team is to force the other team into making turnovers in the backcourt and turning them into points.  Against Thomas More, E&H forced 41 turnovers.  The result.  They won 150-110.  Against Wooster, E&H was only able to force 25 turnovers!  The result.  They lost 150-101!  And just who is the main person responsible for handling the inbounds pass and and breaking the press in the backcourt?  That would be Kyle Witucky, and judging from the record 150 points dropped in by the Scots, I would say that he did a pretty successful job!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash on November 30, 2005, 11:39:09 AM
Quote from: earlhamalum on November 30, 2005, 01:31:20 AM
[I heard he is one of the best at HALLO for XboX... one of the best. [/color]

Is that anything like HALO, or are you referring to the fun German greeting game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 30, 2005, 11:43:28 AM
Congrats to Tim Vandervaart on being named NCAC Player Of The Week (http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles//sports/&file=_sports3.txt&article=1&tD=)!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 30, 2005, 01:51:20 PM
Sorry not up to date with X-box games... I just think it is amazing you think a player like KYLE is one of the best players in the country. (I think he is a solid player)

Congrats on the win, but even if wooster had 14 more T.O's that game.. say E&H  scored on 65% of those T.O's. That is 18 or 19 points more for E&H.. Wooster still wins by 25+ points.  So i don't think KYLE won them that game. 

Wooster is a VERY GOOD TEAM.. with a REALLY GOOD COACH... but i'm sorry Kyle is not one of the best PG's in that nation.  I played against him his freshman year, I watched him play at Earlham last year, I have seen his stats thanks to David.  He is on a good team with a lot of good players around him... I'd take Antwyan Reynolds any day of the week.  I'm not a wooster hater... I think Ellenwood, and Nelson were unbelievable players at the D3 level...

I also think Brandon Miller and Jewett are two players that don't get enough RESPECT in the NCAC.. it was nice to see JEWETT get the 1st NCAC player of the week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on November 30, 2005, 04:28:37 PM
I think what sets Witucky apart from other players, and thus makes him a legitimate contender as one of the top point guards on the Div. III scene, is his ability to step up in big game situations.  So what he had a mediocre game against Emory & Henry, it wasn't a big game and besides, statistics tell only half the story and not many of us on this board were at that game I believe.  Look at last year's triple OT thriller against Witt.  Witucky had just nine tallies, yet he was the reason that game kept going on when he hit that ridiculous 3-pointer at the end of the second overtime.

The fact of the matter is, Witucky plays on a great TEAM, and as the leader of that team it elevates him right to the top.  I'm not going to say he's the best or even in the top five in the nation because I haven't seen some of the other top squads such as Illinois Wesleyan and the like, but I can safely say he has been the best and most consistent player at his position through his four years in the NCAC. 

Since when don't Miller and Jewett get the respect they deserve in the NCAC?  I seriously doubt anyone on this board would deny their athletic abilities and I think every team in the conference knows who to look out for when Earlham comes to town. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 30, 2005, 04:43:49 PM
I've seen IWU - I think Dauksas is better but YMMV. Consult your local dealer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 30, 2005, 05:36:32 PM
billy_P
    Earlham game is on Team Line tonight.. and the IU/Duke game is on at 9:00... times like this I wish my computer was in a Room that had my T.V.

PS.  The dinner is in The PEPSI Square  at Conceso.. chances of having beer... slim... plus that isn't the Quaker Way
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 30, 2005, 06:32:27 PM
I doubt that anybody is going to convince Titan Fan that Dauksas isn't the best point guard in the country and nobody is going to convince Wooster Fan (not to be confused with WoosterFAN, wooscotsfan, ScotsFan, or any other iteration of Wooster, Scots, and Fan that you can come up with) that Witucky isn't the best.  The main problem with the debate is that because D-III is so localized in media coverage, nobody actually gets to see both players play a large enough number of games to adequately compare the two. 

Off to C'ville for Wabash/Depauw.  It's going to be loud.  It's going to be fun.  And, God willing, we'll finally get off the schneid against these guys.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 30, 2005, 07:03:45 PM
Here are some numbers through 4 games...

Adam Dauksas, Illinois Wesleyan (4-0)
16.5 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 6.0 apg
FG: 18-43 (.419)
3-pt: 12-24 (.500)
FT: 18-20 (.900)

Kyle Witucky, Wooster (4-0)
9.3 ppg, 3.3 rpg, 4.8 apg
FG: 12-30 (.400)
3-pt: 7-19 (.368)
FT: 6-6 (1.000)

These guys are very different players - I'm not sure those numbers really tell the story.  The statistic I like the best is...

* Career conference records
  - Dauksas: 35-7 CCIW (.833) - 3 conf titles
  - Witucky: 44-4 NCAC (.917) - 2 conf titles (regular season)


Point-guards, more than any other player on a basketball team, are difficult to evaluate by stats alone.  A great point-guard does so many intangible things that can never be reflected in a boxscore.  Those conference records above are amazing and it tells me that both Dauksas and Witucky are incredible leaders of their respective teams.

Just as I cannot possibly quantify how valuable Adam Dauksas is to Illinois Wesleyan (all I can say is that he is the most important player on a team loaded with talent), I'm sure Wooster fans can say the same about Kyle Witucky.  The bottom line is they are both great point-guards, playing for great Division III programs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on November 30, 2005, 07:28:29 PM
Another measure of point guard performance is to look at games-assists-turnovers-steals.

Here are Dauskas and Witucky by those criteria (G's-A's-TO's-S's)

Dauskas
2005-  26-145- 51-42
2004-  28-150- 69-33
2003-   28- 85- 63-20
Total-   82-380-183-95

Witucky
2005-    30-110-56-31
2004-    30- 89- 31-30
Total-    60-199-87-61

Those are very good stats! :)  (Amended to show games played)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 30, 2005, 07:45:42 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 30, 2005, 06:32:27 PM
I doubt that anybody is going to convince Titan Fan that Dauksas isn't the best point guard in the country and nobody is going to convince Wooster Fan...  ...that Witucky isn't the best. 
I don't think that we, as Wooster fans, were trying to argue that Witucky is the "best" PG in the country.  One of the best, yes ;), but not the best.  I think anyone would be hard pressed to argue against Dauksas at IWU.  I did have the opportunity to see him play 2 years ago, and he was impressive then. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2005, 07:49:18 PM
I'd amend Ralph's post to add Witucky's freshman year, in which he started every game on a team that was a hair's breadth from a national championship, but I'm not interested enough to do it.  I've never been very interested in these "who's better" debates.  Individual honors are nice, I suppose, but nothing compared to team success.  And I firmly agree with Wally that inter-regional comparisons of D3 players is very difficult and probably fruitless.

As for comparing Witucky's stats to Dauksas' (or anyone else's, for that matter), well, I began this whole discussion with a post intended to illuminate how unimportant stats can be, and how a great player (and leader) like Kyle can play a great game that disappears in the box score.

As an aside, I hope the regulars in here notice that our little discussion has attracted some of the heaviest hitters in the Posting Up nation, including 3 members of the Hall of Fame.  It's gratifying to know that our little conference can attract such well-informed attention!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 30, 2005, 07:55:32 PM
As a Wooster fan, I've seen Witucky play a fair number of games over the last few years.  He's become a favorite of mine, and of the point guards that I've seen at Wooster during the last decade or so (I moved to Wooster in '93), I consider him the best.

I appreciate his steadiness on the floor, his defensive soundness, his hustle, his sense of team, and his outside shooting ability.  Having said all of that, there are parts of his game that I think maybe aren't first-team All-American caliber.  

Although he can often break down his man with the dribble, I don't see him as a good finisher once he does that.  And, I don't see him as a great passer; I just don't remember too many times being taken aback by him making a great no-look or dump-off pass.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2005, 08:10:33 PM
At the half at Chadwick Court:

Depauw 28
Wabash 28

Go Little Giants! Wabash Always Fights!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 30, 2005, 09:03:29 PM
I'm not able to pick up the game on the internet - can someone provide a quick update on the game.

Thanks
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2005, 09:03:57 PM
Depauw 53
Wabash 57 3 minutes left
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2005, 09:14:59 PM
Final from Chadwick Court:

Depauw 57
Wabash 68

Wabash breaks a seven (!) game losing streak to the Dastardly Dannies. I don't know when the last time Wabash beat Depauw in both hoops and football in the same year was but I'm going to guess it was the 1995-1996 season. That's the most recently it could have been.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2005, 09:20:43 PM
Denison scored the first 9 points of the game, but it's been a blowout since. 

Wooster 76
Denison 50
13:19 remaining
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 30, 2005, 09:31:56 PM
MSJ-   62
Earlham- 54

Not sure what is going on with the Quakers.. they should be A LOT better and need to win these games...  They have to much Talent all this team to be playing poorly and only to score 54 points? 

Get back to the stats... Billy_P seems like the same old EC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 30, 2005, 09:35:24 PM

42% from the field.
5-13 FT                 
3-14 3pt

Brandon MIller with 16pts 8 Rebounds
Jewett with 10 pts
Gregory 9 pts a Freshman of the bench.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 30, 2005, 09:46:14 PM
Wabash held DPUs big guns down tonight.

Their leading scorer, Alex Stewart had just five. He was averaging 19 a game. Stephen Schott was averaging 16.8 and scored just two tonight before fouling out. Michael Moore was scoreless tonight - he was netting 12 a contest beforehand.

DPU shot just 34.5% for the game and hit just 13 of 23 from the line.

Coffey had 10 points and 10 rebounds in the second half. Medeiros scored 19 and Joseph added 10. Great play from Maloney off the bench, and Woods and Lytle on D. Just a great team effort.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 30, 2005, 09:47:33 PM
Final:  Wooster 109  Denison 73

Wooster made 15 three point shots tonight, after a slow start as DC noted.  Scots were led tonight by James Cooper with 19 points, Kyle Witucky with 16 points (4 three pointers), Devin Fulk with 15 points, Tim Vandervaart with 14 points and Tom Port with 13 points.  Wooster goes over 100 points again but doesn't reach 150 tonight!  :)

Nice opening NCAC road win for Wooster, considering that Witt lost at Granville last year.  Scots are now 5-0 and play at Earlham on Saturday afternoon.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 30, 2005, 09:48:49 PM
frustrating........I tried listening to the game tonight (frustrating in its own right)

This is really disheartening. I had posted way back in the preseason that these were the games Earlham needed to prove it could win. They are home against a mediocre opponent. Instead, it sounded like Earlham sleepwalked through most of the game and could never get the ball to go in the basket to get over the hump.

Even more than talent, there's too much experience for Earlham not to win these games. Rough stretch ahead with Wooster on Saturday and then at Hanover

So it goes...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 30, 2005, 09:50:11 PM
I would daresay that if Wabash can keep up this defensive intensity, they will give Witt and Wooster all they can handle, especially at Chadwick. We shall see.

Oberlin awaits, then next Friday the fun that is Tri-State.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2005, 10:05:52 PM
Elsewhere...

Alfred 86, Allegheny 76
Kenyon 67, Washington & Jefferson 66
Ohio Wesleyan 64, Capital 57
Case Western Reserve 101, Hiram 87
Defiance 82, Oberlin 51
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 30, 2005, 10:09:15 PM
Good to see Kenyon with a non-conference win!

Alas, poor Oberlin. 'Tis one of THOSE years for the Yeomen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2005, 10:57:15 PM
As noted, W&J lost at Kenyon by 1 tonight.  The Presidents drop to 0-4 on the season.  Next up for the Presidents:  West Virginia University.   ::)

At least they're catching the Mountaineers at a good time; they've started 2-3 and dropped out of the AP Top 25.   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 30, 2005, 11:34:01 PM
Nice rout for the Scots tonight!  Cracking the cetury mark for the 2nd consecutive game.  I can't recall the last time that has happened for Wooster. 

Things look only to get worse for the Big Red.  How does Coach Ghiloni keep his troops motivated through this gauntlet that Denison is running through!  Losing to Marietta looks like the snoflake that could turn into an avalance for Denison.

Quote from: smedindy on November 30, 2005, 09:50:11 PM
I would daresay that if Wabash can keep up this defensive intensity, they will give Witt and Wooster all they can handle, especially at Chadwick. We shall see.
I wouldn't go as far as to say that beating DePauw puts you on par to beat the likes of Witt and Wooster.   It was a nice win for Wabash, and definately an emotional one, but, DePauw is no Witt or Wooster.  Denison sounded like they came out fired up and ready to repeat what they did to Witt last season, and that lasted for all of about the 1st five minutes before Wooster turned up their intensity and ran Denison out of their own newly refubished gym.

Speaking of which, David, I'm surprised you didn't make the trek down to Granville to check out the newly remodeled Livingston Gym.  Breck made it sound pretty nice in his description on his radio broadcast.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2005, 11:39:10 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 30, 2005, 11:34:01 PM
Speaking of which, David, I'm surprised you didn't make the trek down to Granville to check out the newly remodeled Livingston Gym.  Breck made it sound pretty nice in his description on his radio broadcast.

Yeah, I would have liked to make the trek, both to see the game and the gym.  But it's a longer drive to Granville than you suppose; Yahoo maps makes it just over 800 miles. 

Oh, did I mention that I'm in Malvern, Ark.?   ::)  I'm in the process of moving to Los Angeles.  No more Wooster games for me   :(, at least until they make their rumored Southland Snowbird trip next season.   8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 01, 2005, 12:07:23 AM
David,

I'm sure all that moving is keeping you one step ahead of the long-reaching arm of the Wooster Alumni Association.

One day after receiving my invitation to pay $20 to eat in the prescence of the Earlham basketball team, I was forwarded a request via email to hand over money to support the beloved school in Richmond, IN....those emails coupled with a rough time finding the game broadcast on the Internet left me watching Indiana University basketball for some semblance of joy tonight. I should've just read a book.

My only prediction for Saturday's game: Wooster won't put up 150....or 101...or 100.....not sure how much lower I can safely go.

I hope the Scots fans who make the trek Saturday across the Interstates that begin with 7 have a safe trip. I'll be in Chicago, searching for better Internet radio results...but earlhamalum may be there and despite his fierce message board facade, he's a lover. Tell him that Billy sent you and the first round might be on him.

Wooster week is always fun with the number of posters on this board....hopefully Saturday's contest will prove worthy of conversation like the last couple of EC/COW games in Richmond have.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2005, 12:11:12 AM
Quotei wouldn't go as far as to say that beating DePauw puts you on par to beat the likes of Witt and Wooster.   It was a nice win for Wabash, and definately an emotional one, but, DePauw is no Witt or Wooster.

Now, now. If you have looked at the last few games at Chadwick between Wabash and Witt and Woo - Wabash has had leads in the first half only to become unglued on the defensive end in the second half.

All I'm saying is that this is a positive trend and hopefully will continue.

Against IWU, it was like a typical Wabash / Witt  or Woo game at Chadwick - 'Bash has a lead and loses it in the second half. This game was different, so it's a good trend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2005, 12:16:10 AM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on December 01, 2005, 12:07:23 AM
David,

I'm sure all that moving is keeping you one step ahead of the long-reaching arm of the Wooster Alumni Association.


Wooster's Director of Development is a BIG hoops fan and has been known to lurk here from time to time, so I don't think I'm fooling him.  But he probably has access to my academic records, so he doesn't bother to ask me for money he knows I haven't got.  :D

BTW, in his pregame radio comments, Steve Moore talked at some length about Kyle Witucky's selfless and unsung contribution in the E&H game, and how he "did the dirty work" that didn't show up in his stat line.  That's more than enough validation for me!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 01, 2005, 12:17:04 AM
A question about Wabash: I saw Wabash three times last season, each losses in close games (2 Earlham games and Witt in tourney). In each of those close losses, the Little Giants went to a different player in crunch time.

Once again this season, thanks in large part to their fierce team defense, I see that Wabash has been involved in a few close games against solid opponents. My question: has there been any consistency in finding a guy to stick with in those late game situations?

I thought Coffey played very well against Witt and Earlham (game in Richmond) down the stretch last season. But, at least in the Witt game, the ball was in someone else's hands (maybe Joseph, I can't really remember, but definitely one of the guards) for the final shot in regulation. So, can it be Coffey or is Wabash still going to struggle to find a consistent go to guy in those spots?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 01, 2005, 12:22:27 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 01, 2005, 12:16:10 AMBut he probably has access to my academic records, so he doesn't bother to ask me for money he knows I haven't got.  :D

Oh, now, c'mon, DC. You're a Tulane law grad. You don't expect me to fall for that now do you?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2005, 07:52:20 AM
Billy -

I think it will be in either Joseph's or Medeiros' hands to at least make the offense go - and if Coffey gets free that's great. But one of the senior guards, I think, will at least be the trigger in crunch time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 01, 2005, 07:56:52 AM
Billy-

Close losses against good teams has been Wabash's M.O. for the last few seasons.  Does Wabash have a designated go-to guy?  It doesn't appear so.  The no stars and/or interchangeable parts aspect of the Wabash team over the last couple of years gets touted as one of the team's biggest strengths (the theory being that teams can't gear up to stop just one guy), but I tend to think it's also one of the team's biggest weaknesses.  In almost every one of the close games against top competition that Wabash has played in recent memory, you can point to an offensive swoon that ultimately dooms the LGs.  For example already in 2005:

- vs. Bethany College: Wabash goes without a field goal for 5:50 in the second half during which time an 11-point Wabash lead turned into a 4-point Wabash deficit.  Wabash lost by 7 as Bethany salted the game away with free throws.  

- vs. Hanover: Wabash scores just one field goal in the first 6:45 of the game and digs an early hole.  Wabash did come back from 15 points down to make a game of it in the second half, but lost by three points.  

- vs. IWU: Wabash played IWU to a dead heat after 30 minutes of basketball.  Tied up with 10:05 to play, Wabash wouldn't get another field goal for the next 7:15, by which time the tie game had tuned into an 18-point rout.  

That's just this year.  If you go back to last year, you'll find similar stories in Wabash losses to Witt, Wooster, Hanover, etc. etc.  If Wabash had a guy, one guy, who could get the ball, isolate, and create a shot, draw a foul, etc. and get some points to stop the bleeding, Wabash could probably find themselves on the winning side of some of those close losses.  I'm not sure that Wabash really has the guy that can do that consistently, and it's been a problem...most notably when the offense stalls out against good teams.  

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 01, 2005, 09:26:56 AM
David, good luck with your move to SoCal.  That will be quite a change frome the quiet streets of Millersburg. ;)
Quote from: David Collinge on December 01, 2005, 12:16:10 AMBTW, in his pregame radio comments, Steve Moore talked at some length about Kyle Witucky's selfless and unsung contribution in the E&H game, and how he "did the dirty work" that didn't show up in his stat line. That's more than enough validation for me! ;D
I heard Coach Moore bring that up as well and I was thinking about you when he brought it up! ;D  Kyle did have a little better night last night as he didn't have to be quite as unselfish in dropping 16 points, making 4 treys.

One of the highlights for me last night was how well Wooster clamped down on defense after giving up the 1st 9 points of the game to Denison.  Steve Moore called a timeout and Wooster came out of that timeout a different team, outscoring the Big Red 52-27 the rest of the half.  Also, props to the effort made to shut down Denison's big two of Hern and Hodgkinson.  They entered the game averaging 19.25 and 17.5 ppg respectively and Wooster held them both well below their averages.  Hern went for 12 and Hodgkinson only tallied 7 points.  We know Wooster can light it up on the offensive end, I just wanted to give props for the nice job that was done on the defensive end as well!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 01, 2005, 11:02:21 AM
Billy Pilgrim -

If you don't mind listening to the Wooster feed, you should be able to pick up the Wooster-Earlham game from the Wooster Athletic webpage.  Go here:

http://www.wooster.edu/interactive/

Then choose the "Live Broadcast Feed (uses Quicktime)" link at the upper left side of the page.  Very good sound quality.  The Windows Media link seems to be broken.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 01, 2005, 11:09:31 AM
I'm looking forward to a fun road trip this weekend.  From Wooster to Columbus on Friday to catch first-round NCAA tournament volleyball (Ohio University vs Alabama followed by Marshall vs Ohio State) then to Richmond for Saturday afternoon's 1 PM Wooster-Earlham game.  It looks as if the Wooster women face Earlham immediately following that game, so I may even stay to see some of that.  Then, back to Columbus for more volleyball, Friday night's winners meeting at 7 PM.  Probably both Ohio teams.  Just wish I didn't have to miss Mt. Union football on Saturday...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on December 01, 2005, 01:35:06 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 30, 2005, 11:39:10 PM

Oh, did I mention that I'm in Malvern, Ark.?   ::)  I'm in the process of moving to Los Angeles.  No more Wooster games for me   :(, at least until they make their rumored Southland Snowbird trip next season.   8)

Mr Phelps, er, Mr Collinge, your mission, should you decide to accept it, to clean up the SCIAC message board. They seem to have a very bad case of "We don't get no respect-o-philia".

Your presence at a few games might give the rest of us a more accurate assessment of the quality of hoops that they really play, and in turn, soothe the savage beast! ;)

Enjoy LA!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on December 01, 2005, 04:17:51 PM
Really nice win for the Bishops last night.  Currently the Bishops are 2-0 vs. the OAC with victories over Mount Union and Capital.  The Bishops should be very pleased with themselves because Capital was picked to finish 2nd in the OAC.  The Bishops are in a very good position to go into Christmas break 7-2.  That would be a really big confidence booster going into the heart of NCAC Play.  Go Bishops!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2005, 08:22:01 PM
Thanks a lot, Ralph.  I read your post, and five seconds later my laptop exploded.   >:(

:D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 02, 2005, 05:55:27 PM
I think there will need to be a new stat in the Standings just for Denison

Team         W    L   Pct    Total # of points outscored by;
                                       Wooster,@Witt,@Akron                   

Denison...  2     6   .333            122pts             

Anyone else want to guess... we can see who was closest after the Akron game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 02, 2005, 09:57:47 PM
Quaker fans,

Any predictions on how Earlham is going to stack up against Wooster tomorrow?

I'd like to see Earlham give Wooster a run and bring them back down to Earth a little bit, or at least keep them under 90 points.  It'll take Miller and Jewett having monster games and Port and Cooper not for it to happen though.

I'm going to give Denison a little credit and say they get outscored by just 101 points - 36 by Woo, 23 by Witt, and 42 by Akron.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 02, 2005, 10:15:47 PM
Well, I predicted Earlham would hold Wooster under 100....I'm inclined to say under 90 in Richmond, too.

Not sure how big a game Jewett can have...he sat out most of the 2nd half against Mt. St. Joseph the other night with flu/death.

The last few games in Richmond have been fairly competitive (2 years ago was an absolute war) and this is the most talented team Earlham's had in those years....of course, in my mind this Wooster team might be more balanced than '03 edition.

Earlham could easily be 4-0, but turnovers/foul shooting/not finding opponents perimeter shooters has left them at 2-2. If those three areas are bad tomorrow...it could be 100 again.

I'll have faith: Quakers keep it close and prove they belong in the NCAC's top half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 02, 2005, 10:18:59 PM
I wouldn't be terribly surprised for Earlham to hang tough tomorrow.  Wooster has frequently had some relatively tough games in Richmond, and this looks to be a pretty good Quaker team. 

That being said, the Scots are obviously playing really well right now, and if they get off to a good start it could be a very long afternoon for Miller, Jewett, and friends.  In the games that I've seen, when things aren't going so well, Miller tries to do to much by himself, and one guy isn't going to beat this Wooster team.

I'll go with 128 in the Big Red pool, with Akron winning by 44 and Witt extracting a bit of revenge by 48.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 02, 2005, 10:28:40 PM
By the way, I'll take 104 in the Big Red blood pool......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 02, 2005, 10:39:21 PM
Waterboy- I really wish I could be there tomorrow in Richmond.  I was able to be there the last two years, but this year due to coaching obligation as a freshman high school coach my Saturdays are no longer an option.  

Earlham has forced opponents to shoot 38% from the field, which any team would love to have 4 games into the season. They are also shooting 49% from the field themselves.  Now they are getting out shot by 10 a game.  EC will need to take care of the ball, keep playing D, and play TOGETHER as a TEAM.

One thing that I have always liked about Coach Moore (besides working the Refs to Perfection...hmm not sure if this was a quality i liked about him when i was a player...*sorry back on track) is the way his TEAMS play TOGETHER.  Not only on the offensive end, but on the Defensive end as well.

Kyle W... if you read this I love the way you play ur a great player *(best in the country)
GO WOOSTER....
(for years i tried going for EC on this game...  has yet to work... so i'm trying a new approach)  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 03, 2005, 12:07:13 AM
Quote from: cmhscots on December 02, 2005, 10:18:59 PMThat being said, the Scots are obviously playing really well right now, and if they get off to a good start it could be a very long afternoon for Miller, Jewett, and friends.  In the games that I've seen, when things aren't going so well, Miller tries to do to much by himself, and one guy isn't going to beat this Wooster team.
Wooster didn't get off to a good start on Wednesday agaisnt Denison, and we saw how that one ended up.

Also, for the Quakers to even have a chance in this one, they need some others besides Miller and Jewett to step up offensively.  Lack of depth seems to be Earlham's biggest problem when they face teams such as Witt and Woo.  Unless EC can figure out how to get some major help for their big scorers, I forsee a long afternoon in Richmond for the Quakers.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on December 03, 2005, 01:50:28 AM
Welp, I don't know much about the BBall programs around the NCAC...except that I love Woo and hate Witt, but who doesn't (Hate Witt that is)???  This is my first time on the Hoops board, but I want in on the action.  I don't think the Big Red Freshness is goin to last at all, I take them losing by a combined 150.  What the hey, it's a nice round number.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on December 03, 2005, 09:25:08 AM
I think that the Big Red will lose by a combined 112 points which is pretty repectable considering i expect them to lose by about 60 to AKron.  Denison's Big kid is a very good player but I really have not seen anyone with the athleticism like Romeo Travis in the NCAC.  May be an eyeopening experience! Anyone know if the CAVS are off that night?  If they are, there may be a Lebron James sighting at the Denison game!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2005, 10:08:01 AM
I said Akron would be Denison by only 35 or so.

It's the Kenyon game against Wright State where I see a fitty point margin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 03, 2005, 11:26:28 AM
This combined point loss thing would have made for a good tie-breaker on the pick 'em board. ;)  I'll say 105 points combined.  I'm banking on the Witt game being around a 20 point loss and Akron being between a 45-50 point loss.  I wonder if any of the Big Red players are reading these encouraging posts??? ???

Just reading the paper and they had a breakdown of Woo's game today with Earlham and there are some pretty impressive stats being put up by the Scots through the 1st five games of the season.  Wooster is averaging 102 ppg!  That leads the league by 25 ppg. over the 2nd leading scorers (Kenyon).

Also, James Cooper (21 ppg.) and Tom Port (19 ppg) are 1st and 3rd in the league in scoring.  The Scots still have 4 players averaging in double figures with Vandervaart and Witucky both over 10 ppg. and Fulk is nearly there @ 9.6. 

Today's matchup will definately be of contrasting styles.  Wooster is a scoring machine, but they can still play solid defense!  Just ask E&H who was held nearly 40 points below their season average.  Earlham is definately defensive minded as they are 3rd in the conference behind Witt and Wabash in scoring defesne.  They are also just ahead of Witt and Oberlin and right behind Wabash in scoring offense.  Whose style will win out? 

One other thing.  If the Scots break the century mark today it will be the 1st time in Wooster's long basketball history that they've broken 100 points for 3 consecutive games!  Personally, I don't see it happening.  Earlham will be trying to slow the game down every chance they get.  I still don't see it being close unless the Quakers can get some help for Miller and Jewitt as I said earlier.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 03, 2005, 01:25:17 PM
30-26 Wooster up with about 6:00 left in a rapidly moving first half...

turnovers killing Earlham again

both teams really shooting the 3-ball well
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 03, 2005, 01:34:28 PM
Halftime in Richmond: Earlham 38, Wooster 37

Quakers can't keep playing at this pace, Wooster sounds like a keg of gunpowder.

Turnovers hurting both teams, poor foul shooting again for Earlham.

Markous Jewett has 4 3-pointers at the break....sounds like balanced scoring for the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 03, 2005, 01:51:13 PM
7-0 run to start the 2nd half for Wooster

Earlham a timeout.....my fears realized
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 03, 2005, 01:51:51 PM
Jewett was on fire in that 1st half.  Hopefully, the intermission will cool him off a bit!  Either that, or Coach Moore's halftime chat will spark a fire for Wooster defenively!  They need to find a way to at least slow Jewett down in the 2nd half, and they need to cut down on, what sounds like, silly turnovers or it could be upset city!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 03, 2005, 02:36:17 PM
Halftime in C'ville:

Oberlin 29
Wabash 39

I'll be honest...between conference championship games on tv and trying to pay some attention to the MUC/Cap football game, I've not paid very close attention to this game.  All seems well for Wabash though through the first half. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 03, 2005, 02:37:05 PM
LaRon Henry at the horn....................OT in Richmond
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 03, 2005, 02:38:07 PM
This is like deja vu of the OWU game last year!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 03, 2005, 02:43:46 PM
Vandervaart owning the OT period......still Earlham down 1, 45 seconds left
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 03, 2005, 02:50:26 PM
WITUCKY JUMPER AT THE BUZZER!!  SCOTS WIN!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 03, 2005, 02:51:43 PM
Earlhamalum's favorite player with the shot at the buzzer to win it

Wooster gets out of Richmond with an 83-81 win.........Witucky hits a runner at the buzzer to win it.

Earlham Free Throws.............!?!??!!!?!

I'm going to go vomit.......love to talk about the game later, look forward to hearing reports
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 03, 2005, 02:52:29 PM
Wow. Guess you can't mess with Earlham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 03, 2005, 02:57:13 PM
Final:  Wooster 83  Earlham 81 OT

Wooster gets a close road win in overtime.  Great shot by Witucky to win it at the buzzer.  Scots were led today by Tim Vandervaart, James Cooper and Kyle Witucky.

Wooster is now 6-0 and will play Oberlin at home on 12/7.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 03, 2005, 03:05:36 PM
First of all, let me say...   WHEWWWW! :)

Wooster escapes with a win today by a very game Earlham squad.  Leron Henry of Earlham missed 1 out of 2 ft's with just over 6 seconds left that would have given the Quakers the lead.  Witucky then took the inbounds pass the length of the floor and hit the jumper for the 83-81 win!

I haven't heard the final #'s, but Vandervaart had 8 of Wooster's 10 points in OT alone.  Earlham played real well on the defensive end and forced the tempo to go their way and took away the transition points from Wooster for the most part.  Wooster didn't have success from beyond the arc as well.  To me, that was main reason they couldn't pull away today.  EC did a great job in taking away the outside shot from Wooster and forcing the Scots to penetrate and shoot on the move.  It didn't sound like Wooster had too many open looks all afternoon.  

Coach Moore is now 35-0 in his carreer against Earlham, and this one today had to be one of the closest.  I have to admit, I didn't see it being this close.  Hats off to the Quakers on a solid effort today.  Next up for Wooster, a home date with Oberlin before the big on next Saturday.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on December 03, 2005, 03:20:35 PM
Congrats Wooster!  That was a great game.  Anyone find the final stats?  Seems like both teams had trouble shooting FT's.

Also- can anyone login for the Witt/Denison game?  Been trying and it doesn't seem to be up and running.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 03, 2005, 03:31:41 PM
Final from Chadwick:

Oberlin 59
Wabash 90

You can pretty much guess how this one went.  Wabash moves to 4-3 on the season, Yeomen drop to 0-7. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on December 03, 2005, 04:46:31 PM
Wittenberg 70
Denison 52

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 03, 2005, 05:22:56 PM
Looks like a thriller in Richmond.  I'm curious to see the stats, which should become available once the Scot women wrap up their contest with the Quakers.  How ironic is it that Witucky was the topic of much discussion this week, and appropriately, nails the game-winner?

Allegheny opens NCAC play with a 77-68 victory over Kenyon.  No statistics as of yet.  Next up:  Westminster - Gators and Titans combined for an NCAC record 263 points last season, with Allegheny coming up on the short end 135-128.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 03, 2005, 05:27:02 PM
For those of you keeping track, Denison has been outscored by JUST 54 points against Woo and Witt.  If they keep it within 50 against Akron, then we were all way off in our predictions.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 03, 2005, 05:41:03 PM
All the NCAC 12/3 Final Scores:

Wittenberg 70  Denison 52
Ohio Wesleyan 83  Hiram 58
Wabash 90  Oberlin 59
Allegheny 77  Kenyon 68
Wooster 83  Earlham 81  OT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 03, 2005, 06:11:25 PM
Numbers in from Meadville.  Gators used a 15-4 run midway in the first period to grab the lead from Kenyon and went into the locker room up by nine (43-34), which they held for the remainder.  Matt Majzlik led the way in scoring with 18, while McCloskey chipped in with 16, including 10-of-12 from the charity stripe, and a team-high five helpers.  Noteworthy, Jimmy Savage dropped 14 in his first start of the season and sophomore Ben Torsney put in 10 tallies.  Free throws look to be a key as Allegheny went 28-of-35 from the line (80%), while Kenyon was 18-of-28 (64.3%).

I wish there were more Lord posters on this board.  I'm curious as to why Matt Formato, Kenyon's leading scorer in each of the past two seasons, was limited to just 12 minutes and no points.  6'6" Bryan Yelvington, on the other hand, has emerged as the leading scorer and dropped a double-double on the Gators with 31 points and 10 rebounds.  He's also gone to the line 44 times in just six games, converting 38 attempts (86.4).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 03, 2005, 07:25:37 PM
Just back from Richmond...

The Scots have frequently had games against Earlham, mainly over there, that were much closer than expected.  In the past I had thought that most of those games were because Wooster didn't play very well.  Today, I'd give the credit to the Quakers.  I thought that was the best that I've seen them play.  They moved the ball well, played excellent defense - especially against the Scots perimeter - and worked back into the game each time the Scots looked to put it away.

Neither team shot FT very well - I think the Witucky and Vandervaart missed 2 shots each on back-to-back posessions in the 2nd half.  And a huge miss by Henry for Earlham at the end of OT, but they wouldn't have been there if not for the big 3 at the buzzer of regulation.

Vandervaart and Cooper were huge for the Scots.  Cooper did a great job of driving to the basket and making all kinds of off-balance shots.  Vandervaart had his way in the OT, especially in the first couple minues when (for some reason) Jewett wasn't in.  Also big props to the Scots D which shut down Jewett in the 2nd half.  He couldn't get an open look from outside and if he tried to post up always had someone all over him.

The only real negative about this game was the officiating.  Every year we complain about the quality, and it doesn't seem to have gotten any better.  At least they were pretty much equally incompetent at both ends of the court. 

An excellent win for the Scots, and here's to a much easier time on Wednesday before the big game next weekend!

BTW:  The stats are now posted:  http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/boxes/2005-06/earlham.php

Go Scots!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 03, 2005, 07:54:00 PM
Yeah, I'm reviewing the stats right now.

I guess I didn't realize that Wooster shot poorly at the foul line...I just remember that Witucky had the big miss at the end of regulation. Earlham was brutal...8-19. 8-19? That's worse than I anticipated.

It looks like Port was really held in check...who had the assignment of guarding him?

Earlham also didn't turn the ball over as much as I had thought. Listening, it seemed like Earlham had at least 12 in the first half.

Well, this kicked off a frustrating day for me...I needed an upset of Texas or USC to get my beloved Nittany Lions in the Rose Bowl. But, apparently conferences outside of the Big Ten don't have more than one quality team. Oh well.

One last thing, forget about Witucky for All-American..................I'm saying All-World  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2005, 08:32:46 PM
Looking at the Oberlin / Wabash stats (couldn't be there because it's the holidays and all) I wonder if the Yeomen could be o-fer the year.

They had one guy who shot lights out and it still was a game where bench clearing time was early.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 03, 2005, 09:10:26 PM
cmhscotsfan -- thanks for the first hand game report.

A few comments on the Wooster - Earlham stats:

--Tom Port had a rough game (4 of 14 from the floor) but it was more than offset by Tim Vandervaart (10 of 13) and James Cooper (8 of 13).  These two plus Witucky's clutch play got Wooster the "W" today.

--Wooster shot 52.5% from the floor and still had to go to overtime to win this game!?  Why?

--Earlham shot nearly as well 51.7% from the floor and the Quakers shot an unbelievable 61% on three point shots (11 of 18 made)

--Not sure if Wooster played less than stellar defense or if Earlham just shot the lights out?  cmhscotsfan did say that Earlham played well and the stats confirm that.

--Two other negative stats for Wooster:  They got outrebounded by Earlham 36-30 and the Scots only made 14 of 22 free throws.

As someone once said: a sign of a good team is that they don't play their best game and they still get the victory!  :)

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 03, 2005, 09:22:10 PM
QuoteAs someone once said: a sign of a good team is that they don't play their best game and they still get the victory!

Wooster shot .7 percent below its season FG %, committed fewer turnovers than it had in any other game, and shot about .6 percent below its season average on free throws.

They may not have played their "best" game, but they certainly played "their" game.

Wooster was taken to the wall and needed a fade away, contested shot at the buzzer to escape with a win. Credit where it's due. Wooster's a national title contender, but Earlham certainly proved the gap has closed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 03, 2005, 09:28:42 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 03, 2005, 09:10:26 PM
--Wooster shot 52.5% from the floor and still had to go to overtime to win this game!?  Why?

--Earlham shot nearly as well 51.7% from the floor and the Quakers shot an unbelievable 61% on three point shots (11 of 18 made)

May I suggest that your second statement answers your first statement.

Show more respect for your opponent! ;)

(I have finally learned this after being called out numerous times - I'm a fan of IWU, and have FINALLY caught on that the final result is not JUST a function of how the Titans played.  There IS another team out there that has some say in the final outcome!  Whether Woo played poorly, Earlham played great, Woo is overrated, or Earlham is underrated will become clearer over the next couple of months!))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 03, 2005, 09:48:45 PM
Billy and Mr. Ypsi -- Major Props to the Quakers because they obviously played a great game and shot the ball well!

Wooster didn't play their best game but Earlham obviously had a lot to do with that.  I think that Earlham's size advantage and hustle contributed to their rebound advantage over the Scots.  Wooster through 6 games has outrebounded their opponents by an average margin of 7 per game so it is unusual for an opponent to beat the Scots on the boards.

Wooster through its first 5 games, prior to Earlham, had made 53 three point shots so they were averaging over 10 made three pointers per game.  The Quakers obviously defended the three point shot well because Wooster was only 5 of 9 today. (please note credit being given to Earlham  :))

Once again, Major Props to the Quakers!!  Now, do us a favor and play the same way when Wittenberg visits Richmond!!   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 03, 2005, 10:12:06 PM
Well I give my team a lot of credit... now they have to build from this game and take what they did into the rest of the NCAC conference games... otherwise this O.T. lost to Wooster will not mean a whole lot if they lose games they should win. 

Second of all... i was on the phone will BILLY_P during the Timeout after Henry missed the FT, with 6 seconds left... this is how the convo. went

Earlhamalum-  "where do they get the ball at?"
Billy_p-     "Under the basket"
Earlhamalum-   "I can see it now... Kyle W with the game winner and have the wooster fans rub it in my face/ on the board."
Radio guy-   "kyle with the ball. 5, 4,3, going down the sideline the shot is up 2, 1... and it is  GOOD.. WOOSTER WINS"
Earlhamalum-  "did what i said really just come true"
Billy_P-    "i'm going to go shot myself now i'll talk to you later"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 03, 2005, 10:32:46 PM
Billy Pilgrim - I don't know if I'd jump to the conclusion quite yet that the gap has narrowed between Earlham and the top teams in the conference based on this 1 game.  For whatever reason, the Scots always seem to have a tough time in Richmond, and today was no exception.  Granted they've not been pushed to OT - at least not in the past few years - but the games are usually pretty close.

I'm not saying that Earham hasn't (or has for that matter) gotten considerably better.  One game isn't enough to say for sure either way.  But, they played a much better game today than I've seen before.  And Brandon Miller - who's got all the talent in the world - played a more controlled game than he usually does against the Scots.  He may not have shot as well as he'd like, but I think that he made a good contribution toward the team's near-upset by playing within himself, but still making things happen for his teammates.

The big difference for the Scots today was the inability to get off the 3-pointers against Earlham's defense.  In the Scots' other 4 games against traditional-style teams (not including Emory & Henry) they've averaged 31.75 3-point shots per game.  Today they took only 9!  Sure the overall FG% was about their norm, but that percentage usually includes a lot more 3's.  Without going back and checking, I'd bet that their 2-pt percentage was lower today than usual.

I'll echo wooscotsfan's plea:  Just play like that again on Feb 1 and we'll be happy!  

Go Scots!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 03, 2005, 10:41:18 PM
I would like to compliment the Earlham players on their classy behavior at the end of the game. Considering the hard fought game had just ended in dramatic fashion, each team showed nothing but respect for each other afterwards, especially Brandon Miller.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 03, 2005, 11:11:45 PM
First and foremost, it's nice to actually have an "instant classic" to rehash on this board rather than just reciting stats of another blowout Wooster win.

QuoteI don't know if I'd jump to the conclusion quite yet that the gap has narrowed between Earlham and the top teams in the conference based on this 1 game

Maybe I am a bit ahead of myself, but keep in mind that (sadly) I'm not talking about winning NCAC regular season titles. Rather, I think (and I hope) that Earlham has proven it has moved into the legitimate spoiler role along with Wabash.

I'm sure the idea remains for much of the old guard that Earlham is an Oberlin/Hiram level opponent. They were that when Justus first arrived and after his first few seasons. But, the Quakers have hovered around the 4-6 range the last few seasons. Now, it is my hope (for not only this season, but down the road) that they can solidify themselves as a #3, #4 or #5 in the league with the ability to fight the Big W's tooth and nail in games like today.

One thing about today that encourages me in that manner is the way in which the game played. Wooster played well (the stats I cited earlier prove that), but Earlham did force the Scots to adjust. In the past against Earlham (and others in the league), Wooster could not worry about adjusting and still win by 30+. What I heard today, saw in the 3-point stats today, and have confirmed with others is that Earlham really denied Wooster perimeter opportunities. Fortunately for you guys, Vandervaart had a huge afternoon and it was just enough. Still, I'm encouraged that it took some real work from Coach Moore and a monster game to sneak past Earlham. That is a sign of a good team, which I obviously believe Wooster to be. But again, I reiterate, Wooster may not have played its "best" game or its "normal" game to get the win, but they still played pretty damn well.

QuoteI would like to compliment the Earlham players on their classy behavior at the end of the game. Considering the hard fought game had just ended in dramatic fashion, each team showed nothing but respect for each other afterwards, especially Brandon Miller.

Not surprised one bit. Having been around those Earlham players, I know how they feel about Wooster....they have a ton of respect for them. I was in Timken twice last year in the hallways postgame. Both times, the players were joking with each other and acting really cordially to each other. I'm sure earlhamalum seconds these thoughts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 04, 2005, 12:13:15 PM
QuoteThe only real negative about this game was the officiating.  Every year we complain about the quality, and it doesn't seem to have gotten any better.  At least they were pretty much equally incompetent at both ends of the court. 
I was going to say something about this yesterday, but I forgot.  As I was listening to the game yesterday, during the 1st half, it seemed like the 1st foul of the game wasn't called until there was like 5 minutes left in the half and I don't know for sure, but I would guess that neither team made it to the bonus in the 1st half.  Then in the 2nd half, it seemed like the refs couldn't stop blowing their whistles, as if they had to make up for their lack of involvement in the 1st half.  It also sounded as if the refs almost lost control of the game in the 2nd half as emotions started to flare for both teams.  Even the reporter for the Daily Record described the action as reaching, "...WWE Smackdown status."  I'm not saying that the poor officiating was one sided, as I would agree with CMH in that the officiating seemed equally poor for both sides.  Its too bad DIII can't bring in more quality officiating, but I suppose this will just continue to be one of the very few detractors to the otherwise great sport that is Division III basketball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on December 04, 2005, 02:18:14 PM
In the past I have been one of the first to bash the Earlham Quakers but this afternoon I would like to praise them.  From the looks of it they game a very good Wooster team a run for their money.  Earlham is an experienced team that in my opinion will be contend with the big boys of the conference.  They have showed that they can play with wooster.  I also feel that they may give Witt a good game because of their athleticism and experience at guard.  It would be really nice if some other team would would knock off Wooster or Wittenberg this year.  I think that both Earlham and OWU have a real shot at that this year.  Big week this week for the NCAC. Go Bishops!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2005, 07:27:14 PM
I go camping for a couple of days, lose contact with the cyber-world, and look what happens!  :D

I'm reluctant to say "congratulations" to Earlham since, after all, they did not win.  I've never liked to be congratulated for coming close to my goal but not achieving it.  So I'll say "well done" or "keep up the good work" or some other platitude.  I hope this is a harbinger of a more competitive conference, top to bottom, and a stronger Earlham, which (as I told Billy last year) I secretly root for in most games.

I'm curious; will D3 (and/or NCAC) scouting rules permit Earlham to distribute a tape of this game to a conference rival?  Suppose Bill Brown wanted to see how Earlham was able to limit Wooster's three-point shooting and force them inside.  Could he call up Jeff Justus and have a copy of the game tape sent?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 04, 2005, 08:49:00 PM
Coaches definitely share tapes, so finding out how Earlham stopped the 3-pointer won't be hard for Bill Brown or anyone else to see.

But, it's also pretty easy to figure out just by reading this morning's edition of the Richmond Palladium-Item.

"We wanted to take away their three,'' Justus said (the Scots made 5 of 9 from long range, the Quakers 11 of 18).

"I kept hearing people from the stands yelling to take away their penetration but they don't understand that Wooster is the best three-point shooting team in the country.''

Attribute those two quotes to Jan Clark's Sunday morning story...I'm trying to avoid copyright laws. But, if I run into trouble, the Pal-Item still owes me money from services rendered, so we can just call it even.

I would hope Earlham will continue this strategy of denying the 3-point shot, as the Quakers have had trouble finding shooters (especially in transition) early this season as well as last year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 04, 2005, 08:51:18 PM
As for other news, still no word if LeBron James will be in attendance at the Denison/Akron game. I'm pretty sure "King" James will have just arrived back from a west coast swing, so he might rest up instead of heading to see his old high school teammate (Romeo Travis) play.

However, should he be in attendance, maybe the Big Red should try to get him to suit up. Nah, nevermind, only Oberlin would use an ineligible player.  ;)

Sorry, I've been thinking about that one for days.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 04, 2005, 11:43:34 PM
QuoteI wish there were more Lord posters on this board.  I'm curious as to why Matt Formato, Kenyon's leading scorer in each of the past two seasons, was limited to just 12 minutes and no points. 

Arlen Galloway has been reduced to a spot player as well. It looks like Kenyon may be going another direction in their game. Formato may have been sick or not playing any defense.

I have said the Lords would lose by fitty to Wright State. They may make it a 40-point game after all...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on December 05, 2005, 11:26:59 PM
Fellow Wooster and NCAC Fans - I am afraid that we are going to have to get used to games like this from Wooster.  Without the Wooster Trademark, big guy in the middle (my days go back to when Mike Trimmer and Stan Aukamp were on campus) you will see the Scots get outrebounded and high FG%.  High percentage shots are around the basket and while Darth Vandervaart is excellent defender and shot blocker, he is not exactly what you would call a "space eater" or intimidator.  So that bottom line: more teams will play close when the long range shooting is not there or the game is shortened with long possessions.

Meanwhile, I love the energy that seems to come thru the radio.  Did they change the location of the announcers becuase this year I seem to hear Coach Moore more than ever?  And I know he can yell but I hear him in TN. 

I am willing to admit that I am looking past Yoeman and looking forward to SAT night.  GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 06, 2005, 11:17:07 AM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on December 05, 2005, 11:26:59 PM
Fellow Wooster and NCAC Fans - I am afraid that we are going to have to get used to games like this from Wooster. Without the Wooster Trademark, big guy in the middle (my days go back to when Mike Trimmer and Stan Aukamp were on campus) you will see the Scots get outrebounded and high FG%. High percentage shots are around the basket and while Darth Vandervaart is excellent defender and shot blocker, he is not exactly what you would call a "space eater" or intimidator. So that bottom line: more teams will play close when the long range shooting is not there or the game is shortened with long possessions.
WoosterFAN,

Earlham didn't stay close to Wooster on Saturday because of their play inside.  It was their outside shooting that kept them in the game.  Earlham shot a scorching 61% from 3-point range against the Scots.  If you look at the box score of the EC game, Earlham's top 2 scorers were a combined 8-10 from 3-point range.  Henry was 7-16 shooting overall, but 4-6 on 3 pt. fg's.  From inside the arc, he was only 3-10.  Jewett was 4-4 on 3-pt attempts, but only 3-8 from the inside.  And Miller, who was 3rd in scoring on the day didn't hit a 3 ball, but was only 5-16 for his 15 points.  So, my point is, EC's play inside is not what kept this game close.  It was their hot shooting (and that might be and understatement) from 3-pt range and their defense which gave them a chance at the upstet.

This brings me to my next point, which is, one of Wooster's weaknesses.  To me, defending on the perimeter could be one of the Scot's major weaknesses.  Three times this season, they have allowed an oppenent to shoot over 45% from beyond the arc.  Kzoo hit 45%, UW Stout hit 57% and Earlham hit 61%.  In their other 3 games they have held their opponents to under 30%.  I think if you look at the EC and Stout games, they both had a big inside presense which makes me believe that Wooster was packing it in down low to take away the inside and giving them the outside shots.  Stout and Earlham were just knocking them down.  This could be a huge key in the game this Sat. vs. Witt as well.  As good as Witt is on the inside, they are leading the league in 3 pt fg%.  They are not shooting  alot of treys (comparably to how many Wooster is shooting), but they are obviously getting quality shots when they are taking them.  I'm sure Wooster's priority defensively will be to stop Borchers and Russ inside, and making Witt beat them from the outside, as well as dictating the up-tempo style the Scots like to run.  If Witt's shooters are hitting like Stout's and Earlham's shooters did, as much as I had to admit, it could make for another long night against Witt at Timken.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 06, 2005, 02:52:53 PM
speaking of saturday-i will not be able to be in attendance-i know you all havent heard from me in a while on here but no fear im back. We will not be able to look ahead to saturday cuz witt has a tough road game tonight at cedarville-yes they are a naia school but possess great talent. they have a post player that's been getting calls from the cavs???? mugabe thomas is his name but everytime i hear about him i think about the wide open dunk he clanged at our place last year that led to a 10-0 run by us and putaway of the game.

thoughts anyone? i'll try to keep this board up on witt stuff since we have a wooster bias on here. 2 and 3 in the country-NCAC represent
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 06, 2005, 03:34:16 PM
pennstghs,

Welcome back!!!
Quotei'll try to keep this board up on witt stuff since we have a wooster bias on here.
It's always nice to talk smack with the rivals! ;) ;D

As for Witt's game with Cedarville tonight, you are right.  Witt can't be looking ahead to Saturday because C'ville is a good basketball team.  Witt has fared exceptionally well this early season against a very tough schedule that continues on for them this week taking road trips to NAIA #5 Cedarville and then #2 Wooster.  They'll be tough to stop if they can run the table this week!

I saw this brought up on, I believe, the Top 25 board that Wooster was happy to see IWU escape Chicago with a win last Saturday because it would have meant Wooster would've more than likely moved into the #1 spot.  And we all know how Wooster being ranked #1 in the past has turned out.  Its happened twice, and each time during Witt week and each time Witt has won!  Witt must like beating top ranked teams as C'ville was NAIA #1 as well last year when Witt beat them.  At least Wooster won't have that hanging over their heads Saturday. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on December 06, 2005, 04:22:35 PM
Scotsfan,

The point of the OAC-NCAC challenge was brought up in the NCAC pick-ems.  Later this season, Dec. 29, Woo will be playing BW at the "Mose" Hole tourny.  Do you knwo if there will be other OAC-NCAC games down the road?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 06, 2005, 05:11:25 PM
NCAC/OAC Games:

Dec. 19 - Denison @ Capital
Dec. 20 - Ohio Northern @ Witt
Dec. 22 - Otterbein @ Witt
Dec. 29-30 - OWU @ Otterbein Invite (potentially on the 30th should OWU and Otterbein win)
Dec. 29 - BW @ Woo

That should just about do it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 06, 2005, 06:28:53 PM
You left out one:

Dec. 14 - OWU @ Wilmington

I'd say that of the remaining games between the NCAC and the OAC, all are winnable by the NCAC.  OWU should get by Wilmington to make them 3-0 vs. the OAC this season.  Both of Witt's games are winnable for the Tigers.  Wooster should beat BW, but that won't be an easy one.  Denison @ Cap is the one I don't know about.  Cap has been playing poorly to date by their standards and expectations.  Denison did beat Musky, which beat Cap this past weekend, so its not a stretch to say that the Big Red could upset the Crusaders.  And as for Ott and OWU, we can wait to see if that materializes.  All in all, it is very doable for the NCAC to sweep the remaing games with the OAC.  Does that mean it will happen?  I would guess its not likely going to happen.  I would, however, go out on a limb and say, IMHO, that the NCAC will finish with a winning record over the OAC this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 06, 2005, 07:00:28 PM
I've been wondering about that BW-Wooster matchup.  First of all, why would Wooster choose to meet BW on the first night of their Mose Hole Classic rather than one of the probably patsies, Lycoming or Thiel, as the home team usually does in these four-team tournaments?  I'm pretty sure they'd end up meeting BW in the championship anyway, but that would be a bit more dramatic.

Secondly, I say watch out for BW in that game, as they have only a tough loss to Albion on their record.  The next weeks will reveal more, as they have to face both Muskingum, ONU, and Capital.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 06, 2005, 08:15:28 PM
I'm not quite certain why Wooster chose to face off with BW in the first game either.  I know "in-region" games are important, but Thiel would be and in-region game as well I believe.  Had Wooster scheduled Thiel first, chances are the Scots win that one.  Then BW would face Lycoming, and I would put my money on BW.  Then the Scots would face BW in another in-region game in the finals.  Chances are, if the Scots beat BW, they won't face Thiel in the finals as they are pretty bad.  So, I don't really understand the reasoning in scheduling BW for the opener of the tournament.  Maybe Wooster was afraid of a repeat of the 2001 Mose Hole Classic when Thiel upset a ranked ONU team, so Wooster ended up slaughtering Thiel instead of getting the match-up they wanted with the Polar Bears.  That's the only thing I can think of?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 06, 2005, 08:21:35 PM
At the half:

Witt - 37
Cedarville - 33

Witt led by as many as 12, but C'ville came back to tie it at one point.  Witt scored the last 4 points of the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 06, 2005, 08:36:19 PM
A game against Thiel - win or lose - would most likely count AGAINST the Scots in the Quality of Wins Index (formerly SOSI).  Even if they lose to B-W, they will still get 6 QOWI points (assuming that B-W ends up over .667 winning percentage), only 2 less than the 8 they would get by beating Thiel (assuming that they end up below .333). 

I was kind of surprised that they were opening against B-W, but my guess is that Steve remembers ending up with a SOSI fractionally worse than Albion's last year and wants to give his team the opportunity for as high an Index as possible this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 06, 2005, 08:51:40 PM
Good point cmh.  I forgot about SOSI.  That makes some sense as to scheduling such a tough opponent in the opening round of the tournament.

Witt has stretched the lead back to 8 midway through the 2nd half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 06, 2005, 09:24:42 PM
Well then, they could have scheduled Lycoming for the first night, placing BW against Thiel.  They'd still get BW in the finals (most likely) while lowering BW's index. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on December 06, 2005, 09:52:07 PM
Looks like the Tigers won by 6 in C'ville--
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 06, 2005, 10:30:22 PM
one thing from the game tonight stuck out in my head. cedarville is almost a mirror image of wooster to be faced on saturday. hostile large crowd, good outside shooters and decent inside play. unfortunately i dont think we'll have to shoot lights out like tonight to beat wooster, cuz as history has shown russ has shown up vs wooster.

final tonight witt 65-c-ville 59-but not that close cedarville closed down the stretch but became uncomposed and started chucking up shots and then leaving the wrong man open. witt's freshman-mainly greg lee and d.j. corbett were huge and composed tonight.

stat of the game- witt outrebounds cedarville( a taller team) 38-28, but offensive rebounds down the stretch were key as they allowed witt to run the clock down and play to their advantage-cedarville was averaging 85 points a game.

looking forward to saturday-hard to top last year's 3OT game here but its possible

fyi i was formally known as wittpimp08 before
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 06, 2005, 11:37:32 PM
This Wittenberg team is looking pretty special.  I wish I could see them in person.  Wooster is going to have to play at a very high level for 40 minutes to win on Saturday.  Unfortunately, it seems to me that in the home games against Witt, the Scots tend to come out tight and press for the first 8-10 minutes before settling down.  If that happens Saturday, they may never catch up.   :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2005, 12:10:25 AM
Don't say Wittenberg and Special in the same sentence. It's enough to make a Wally drink... :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 07, 2005, 12:10:52 AM
I agree with you, David, that this Witt team is looking tough.  Witt/Wooster are classic rivals.  In the decade that I've been watching these two teams play, it seems to me that Wooster's facing a serious challenge this weekend.  Witt always has size on Wooster, and this year will be no exception.  Both teams shoot the three exceptionally well- in fact I recall Witt just killing Wooster at Wooster last year through key three pointers.  If Witt is shooting well, it might be a double-figures victory for them.

I say that as a die-hard Wooster fan, and to boost the Wooster fans out there, here's my keys to the game for the Scots:  
1) Rebound.  If Wooster can't pull down boards at least on par with Witt, say goodnight.  
2) perimeter defense- Scotsfan already noted this- if Wooster doubles down or worries too much about Russ etc and opens up the perimeter, watch out.
3)  Wooster needs an early lead- I know this sounds trivial, but I remember being there last year when the nearly capacity crowd of 3000 in Timken might as well have not existed for the majority of the first half until halfway through the second as Witt sat on an 8-10 advantage.  Wooster needs their crowd with them to feed their advantage.
4) Use the guards.  For all Witt does have, I'm not sure any team in the country can match Wooster's set of guards- if they are effective at passing and shooting from the perimeter, it could be a double-digit victory for Wooster.

All we know for sure is that it'll be one to watch, with the potential to go either way.  I'll be doing my part from the bleachers to insure a Wooster victory!  Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopsfan1111 on December 07, 2005, 01:32:30 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 06, 2005, 11:37:32 PM
This Wittenberg team is looking pretty special.

Let's not forget our Wooster Scots have the potential to have a pretty special season as well... :)

Here's to looking forward to two good victories for Woo this week (Oberlin and Witt!) 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on December 07, 2005, 11:07:04 AM
I will be very interested to see how Wooster matches up with Wittenberg inside.  Annually, this matchup has been a thing of beauty with both team showcasing all-conference post players.  This year is a little different though.  Wittenberg has three big and talented post players while Wooster has a much smaller but quicker lineup.  Does anyone have any insight into how either team plans to match up on the frontline.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 07, 2005, 11:16:05 AM
one thing i will say about our post players-cedarville had a very effective zone to shut out russ and borchers, but dont be misled by kenny brady's numbers from last night. he was mainly a wing player to try and open up the outside and the cedarville defense let him have open looks all night-if russ and borchers keep passing like last night and finding the open man for three's, watch out. i think the player to watch for wooster is cooper because it will be good to see how our young wings match up against his athleticism
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Coshocton Giant on December 07, 2005, 08:44:29 PM
Wooster is a tuff team to call. Since Coach Moore has scheduled so many patsies ( 6 wins  against teams with a combined record of 11-30) stats and claims of world beating backcourts seem unfounded to the more than casual observer.  V.P.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 07, 2005, 08:49:33 PM
Hanover-  46
Earlham- 33

10 minutes to go in second half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 07, 2005, 09:59:16 PM
Nice debut, Coshocton Giant. Why don't you try adding the wins again, since you are about six short.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Coshocton Giant on December 07, 2005, 10:29:44 PM
Math=OK KALAMAZOO 3, METHODIST 2, Emory+Henry 2, Denison 2, Earlham 2, and Oberlin 0, totals 11. In fairness I should mention Witt is also difficult to call because of their ten man rotation shorter PT leads to less big numbers but more experienced players and more wins at year end.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 07, 2005, 10:40:50 PM
Final:  Wooster 112  Oberlin 53

Wooster notches the easy win tonight with 7 guys in double figures led by James Cooper and Devin Fulk each with 15 points.  Was that a real game or just a "glorified practice" as another poster recently suggested?  :)

Scots are now 7-0 with the big Witt home game up next on Saturday!

I agree with some of the other posters that rebounding edge, defensive intensity and guard play/matchups will be key factors in the outcome of this game.  Good point was also made that Wooster should not double down on Russ and Borchers in the post and leave Witt shooters wide open for 3 point shots.  Wooster did double down the last two years in home games at Timken and the Tigers made the open three point shots.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 07, 2005, 10:49:38 PM
Allegheny 100, Westminster 98

Gators win a "low-scoring" affair at the Wise Center, thanks to a last-second layup by Casey McCloskey.  Westminster put up 48 3's, making 15, while Allegheny made 44-of-81 field goal attempts (54.3).  Matt Majzlik led the way with 28, while Ryan Hollihan and Jimmy Savage each tallied 18.  McCloskey chipped in with 14 points as well as 10 assists.

Gators pretty much held the lead for the majority of the game and all of the second half, unitl Westminster made a run to tie it late.  

As for as the game I saw tonight, Wooster was pretty much playing a high school team in Oberlin.  I almost felt bad.  Outside of Spencer and Mike Loll, all of the Yeomen were seriously outmatched.  Kind of sucks to play a team like that before playing Witt though.  The Scots missed some peepers inside and let Oberlin's "big" man, Spelich, score 14 points and he might be the worst center I've seen in this league.  They definitely can't let that happen on Saturday.

BTW Coshocton Giant,

You might want to tack on Wis.-Stout to the list of teams Wooster has wins against.  They are 6-1 overall and currently leading the WIAC, arguably one of the top conferences in the nation, with a 3-0 mark.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 07, 2005, 11:05:56 PM
Coshocton Giant:

Records of the Scots opponents prior to tonight's games:

Kalamazoo 3 - 4
Wisconsin-Stout 5 - 1
Methodist 2 - 5
Emory & Henry 2 4
Denison 2 - 4
Earlham 2 - 3

By my math, that comes to 16 - 21.  If you don't include the games against Wooster, that means that the combined records are 16 - 15.  Maybe not the best, but also far from 'patsies', IMO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2005, 11:14:28 PM
Also, Methodist is the defending champion of their conference and did not look like a "patsy" when they were scheduled. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 07, 2005, 11:37:52 PM
CG,

OOPS!  I guess you left out that one patsie that is currently #22 in the country right behind that other patsie (BW) that Wooster will be playing in the opening round of the Mose Hole Classic. ::)  The overall record of Wooster's opponents may not be that impressive, but, keep in mind that Methodist's start has to be disappointing and unforeseen to say the least.  This is a team that has been to the NCAA tournament the last 2 years!  So their terrible start hasn't helped the win-loss record of Wooster's opponents.  

As for Saturday, even though the Scots are the higher ranked of the 2, and they are playing at home, I would hardly call them the favorites.  I'm sure that anyone with any knowlegde of DIII basketball would agree.  And I'm sure that the players for Wooster know this.  There's basically 2 scenarios that could play out.  One, the players come out tight, which seems to be the trend lately (at least at Timken) and let Witt take the crowd out of the game early, or they come out loose, with the "us against the world" attitude, which seems to have worked for Witt the last couple of match-ups, and get off to a hot start and ride the wave of emotion to a much needed home win over That School Down South!!!  

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 07, 2005, 11:52:36 PM
All the 12/7 NCAC Final Scores:

Allegheny 100  Westminster 98
Bluffton 88  Hiram 75
#13 Hanover 62  Earlham 53
D1 U. of Akron 123  Denison 52
Wooster 112  Oberlin 53


Coshoction Giant:

This season, Wooster scheduled these teams:

St. Thomas/Wisc-Stout in Al Van Wie tourney -- both are strong teams from strong conferences -- MIAC and WIAC -- that perform well in postseason play.  As noted, Wooster beat Wisc-Stout in the title game.

Methodist -- winner of the USA South the last two years and in the NCAA D3 tourney the last two years.

Baldwin-Wallace -- strong OAC team and a preseason favorite to win that conference this year.  In the NCAA D3 tourney last year.

College of New Jersey -- strong team from the NJAC, also one of the top D3 conferences.

Wooster also beat Kalamazoo earlier this year.  You can label them a "patsie" but that wouldn't be accurate since K-zoo took a nationally ranked #20 Elmhurst team to double overtime before losing this evening.

Wooster can't control how every team's win/loss record plays out but clearly, the Scots scheduled strong teams this year so the facts suggest that the only thing that is "patsie" is your post!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 08, 2005, 12:00:25 AM
Hey CG,

I thought I would share these scores with you since they have some common interest with Wooster and the "patsies" they, or should I say "Coach Moore" (as you like to think) scheduled:

Kzoo lost to #20 Elmhurst tonight, but it took Elmhurst 2 OT's to get the victory as noted by WSF.

And St. Thomas, who lost to Stout in the Al Van Wie tournament in Wooster, pounded #11 Gustavus Adolphis 87-51 tonight!  Need I remind you that the Tommies only loss is to Stout, and Stout's only loss is to Wooster.  

Witt may have the superior oppenent record coming into the game on Saturday, but, you can throw all of that out the window when these teams hit the floor.  This rivalry may not have the history of a Hope-Calvin or a Williams-Amherst, but the intensity that it brings from the players and fans could put it right up there.  Wooster wants a win in the worst way.  I just hope Wooster's desire to defend Timken doesn't result in a cold start and another loss like 5 out of the last 6 contests have ended at Wooster since 2000-01!  Let's take back OUR HOUSE starting Saturday night!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2005, 12:08:06 AM
Welcome aboard, Coshocton!  You sure found a way to get under the many Wooster skins in a hurry!  :)  As a West Holmes grad, Coshocton has been getting under my skin for years.  ;D

WSF, while I agree with the thrust of your post, and many of the specifics, I'm not sold on K'zoo.  I would hesitate to call any MIAA team a "patsy," especially one that beat Wooster in the Final Four season of '01-'02, but they are not a good team.  I watched Wooster easily beat K'zoo, then the next night watched St. Thomas just humiliate them.  K'zoo taking Elmhurst to 2 OTs says to me that Elmhurst was down, not that K'zoo is better than we thought.

Not that Wooster played them, but it may be of interest to note that U.St.Thomas beat #11 and previously unbeaten Gustavus Adolphus tonight, 87-51.  These same Tommies lost by 1 in OT to (now #23) Stout, who Wooster then beat by 8.  [Edit:  Rats! SF beat me to this one!  :D]

I think the bottom line is that Wooster has scheduled a pretty good non-conference slate this year.  Not the best in the country (heck, not even as tough at Wittenberg's schedule), but by no means a cupcake festival.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 08, 2005, 12:31:14 AM
QuoteI would hesitate to call any MIAA team a "patsy"

DC -- I think that we actually agree on K-zoo.  I never said that the Hornets were a "good" team.  My only point was that "patsies" don't take CCIW teams like Elmhurst to double overtime.  I would label K-zoo as an average to below average team, but clearly not a "patsy".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 08, 2005, 01:15:54 AM
THE FINAL IT IS IN... Denison -36 vs Wooster.   Denison -18 vs Witt.  Denison -71 vs Akron

                                                  TOTAL POINTS THAT THE BIG RED LOST BY

125
[/font][/size]


PRICE IS RIGHT (STYLE)

Winner-             EARLHAMALUM       122pts       -3

OVER-                CMHSCOT                128pts       +3
                          Darkside-D              150          +25 

Way Under-             
                         BishopFan          112pts       -13
                         ScotsFan            105pts       -20
                         Billy_pilgrram      104pts       -21
                         Waterboy            101pts      -24
                                 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 08, 2005, 06:47:45 AM
Ah, Akron didn't call off the dogs like I thought they would. Sigh.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 08, 2005, 08:52:07 AM
Granted that the Wooster players certainly didn't have their normal game faces last night, but in watching the game (almost slipped and called it a contest) I thought a few scary facts were revealed.

1. As already mentioned by others, Wooster's post defense was very poor.  Some less than stellar Oberlin players did yeoman work (:)) inside.  Yes, Wooster had some blocked shots (8, overall) but they played soft inside, too easily giving up good position.

2. Wooster's rebounding, especially on the defensive end, was less than satisfactory.  I thought Oberlin had far too many offensive boards and touches.

3. How to operate the pressing defense seemed to be unclear to the guys in the backcourt.  Time and again long passes were made to men upcourt.  Oberlin, not being very talented, wasn't always able to take advantage of the numbers advantage that this produced, but Wittenberg surely will.

4. Offensively, Wooster's movement of the ball, especially around the perimeter, was too often hesitant and slow, with the exception of Brandon Johnson, who I thought did an excellent job of not just trying to get everyone involved but actually finding the open man quickly.  James Cooper, on the other hand, while very talented with the ball, spends way too much time standing around, often with a hand raised in the air calling for said ball.

5. Also on the offensive end, there were lots of unfinished plays; layups and easy shots missed.

Now, as I mentioned, surely lots of this has to do with the class of the opponent.  But if it's not cleaned up by Saturday night, a disaster will be in the making.  Here's hoping that they have the intensity, focus, and physicality that they'll need to get a win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 08, 2005, 09:17:58 AM
Earlhamalum, I must protest!!  I believe that the contest was for the 'closest', not the 'closest without going over' (ala Price is Right).  Thus I think we should call it a tie!!   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 08, 2005, 09:27:07 AM
Can somebody explain to me how getting stomped by 71 helps Denison in any way?  How do they benefit from that?  I really, really dislike D3's playing D-I's.  I just don't see the value.  I don't see what the D-I's get out of it either aside from 40 minutes worth of game time to get a player hurt.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 08, 2005, 09:36:37 AM
The ASC plays a lot of the Southland teams in non-conference and that's for the cash money. (And it's odd, too because the ASC only has three non-conference games).

I would think, though, that Denison and Kenyon's athletic department are going broke, so I don't think money is the issue.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 08, 2005, 10:22:16 AM
cmhscot- I can't beat wooster in anything...     :-[    A  TIE it is.

Looking over the stats of the Earlham game... not a whole lot seperated them from a top ten team in the nation.   Almost every stat line was the same... Well one thing was different Earlham had about 8 turnovers more, which gave Hanover about 9 more total shots for the game. 

BIlly_P i hope after these last two games Earlham can make a run at the top 4 spots in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 08, 2005, 02:05:17 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 08, 2005, 09:27:07 AM
Can somebody explain to me how getting stomped by 71 helps Denison in any way?  How do they benefit from that?  

$ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $ $


Wooster Booster......after reading your most recent post I'd have sworn the Scots LOST to Oberlin.  I think you just ripped your own team for a 59 point win.
;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on December 08, 2005, 02:30:31 PM
Denison reportedly was paid $5K to play at Akron, and no I don't think it was worth it for the beating they took.  And also, Lebron was their to witness it.  Denison actually was within about four eight minutes in to the game, Ghiloni went with a three freshman lineup, several minutes later the lead was thirty and a huge snow ball was rolling downhill.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 08, 2005, 02:52:14 PM
$5,000 to Denison is nothing, really. $5,000 to another school would be something, though, so I can see why some D-3 schools do it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 08, 2005, 03:28:32 PM
If a school needs $5,000 that bad, hold a friggin' bake sale.  There are better ways to make money than to trot your team out for 40 minutes of pure embarrassment.  Seriously...neither team gets anything useful out of these games.  What if Akron's star player broke his wrist on the rim while thunderdunking over some poor Denison freshman?  Or blew out a knee coming back to earth after said thunderdunk? 

Washington & Jefferson lost 83-33 to West Virginia last weekend.  Why?  Why do this?

Really, these games are pointless. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 08, 2005, 03:36:29 PM
Sometimes its just scheduling - both teams have a hole to fill and its convenient.

$5,000 is probably a pretty low guarantee.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 08, 2005, 06:32:21 PM
Out of curiosity did Vegas put a line on that game?

That would be tough handicapping job since the sportsbooks don't even know D3 exists.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Coshocton Giant on December 08, 2005, 08:29:18 PM
Four years ago Witt played Dayton in the dedication game of the newly renovated UD arena, Dayton was a top 25 team and with four minutes to go the game was tied. UD won by 8 tho. D3 was not embarrased.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 08, 2005, 09:13:28 PM
In looking back, since the 1990's, I found four results for Wooster against D1 teams:

1991-92: Lost to Akron, 80-71
1996-97: Lost to Akron, 72-55
1997-98: Lost to Harvard, 77-61
1998-99: Lost to Akron, 82-61

All of the above games were, of course, at the D1 school.  If I'm remembering correctly, they also played and lost a preseason exhibition at Akron the year after Brian Nelson graduated (it was Tom Port's first game, and I remember being impressed by his athleticism and skills), which would have been the 2003-04 season.  I would have liked to have seen them play an Akron-like D1 school during Nelson's senior year, mostly just to have seen how he himself would have fared.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 08, 2005, 09:59:47 PM
Wooster Booster - since you brought up the Scots results against Akron, let's give Coach Al Van Wie's teams some credit!  We beat Akron twice in the late 1970's!

1977-78  Wooster went 21-6 that season
Played Akron at Wooster and won 92-85 in OT

1978-79  Wooster went 22-6 that season
Played Akron at Akron and won 61-47

After those two years, I believe that Akron stopped scheduling Wooster because the embarassment was too great!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 08, 2005, 10:15:20 PM
I'm with Wally on this one. My law school alma mater is a D-II team that played the University of Texas this year to the tune of a 113-49 thrashing. Their next game they played New Mexico State and fared better, only losing 72-45. I don't know what the point of it is. I hope it was a lot of money but I doubt it. Do these players get something out of saying to their kids someday "I played against D-I players once."

Reminds me of Patton and shoveling in Louisiana. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 08, 2005, 10:33:28 PM
Bear in mind that many d3-d1 games are NOT total blow-outs (in fact, most years d3 WINS 1 or 2 of them).

IWU played national runner-up Illinois in an exhibition.  The game was VERY close right up to the final few minutes.  According to the box score, at least, Adam Dauksas thoroughly out-played Big Ten POY Dee Brown - think he won't be telling his grandkids about THAT game!  DC is right that it is about the money (USUALLY far more than $5,000!), but it is also about the challenge (could I have played with these guys?) and the thrill (in many such matchups they will play in front of nearly as many spectators as the rest of their season combined!).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2005, 10:45:49 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 08, 2005, 10:33:28 PMDC is right that it is about the money [...]

DC is ALWAYS right, of course 8), but he hasn't weighed in on this particular subject.  Several people have expressed the opinion you refer to, and I believe sac was first to do so here.

I don't know why D3 teams play lower-division teams; maybe for money, maybe for thrill.  I never played the game or managed an athletic department, so I'm ill-informed.  I don't particularly like it, though.  I consider myself to be in the Coach C camp, that D3 teams are prostituting themselves when they do so.

I have to think that Adam Dauskas' grandchildren are going to say, "who's Dee Brown?"  Then after a while they'll say "oh jeez, here he goes with that Dee Brown story again." :)

I think it's more likely that a player will reminisce 60 years later about how he played against someone who became famous in some other way (like became president, or invented something, or became a multimillionaire), and that person is more likely to have played for Denison than Akron, IMHO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 08, 2005, 10:55:11 PM
Sorry, David, it was sac who responded "$ $ $ $ $ $ $ $".  But you HoFers all look the same to us peons! ;)

I suppose you're right about Adam's grandkids (unless, of course, Dee ends up on the NBA top-50 lists!), but Adam can at least brag to his fellow old-farts when he reaches that status! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 08, 2005, 11:18:53 PM
Ypsi - I disagree about the spectators. In many of the contests the D-1 team in question draws in the low thousands, if that. Akron didn't have 3,000 people against Denison, and I'm sure the gym felt empty.

Meanwhile, you get a Wabash / Wooster game at Chadwick and the place is packed and electric. Heck, even 800 people for a Denison game would feel electric in Chadwick.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 09, 2005, 12:39:37 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 08, 2005, 11:18:53 PM
Ypsi - I disagree about the spectators. In many of the contests the D-1 team in question draws in the low thousands, if that. Akron didn't have 3,000 people against Denison, and I'm sure the gym felt empty.

Meanwhile, you get a Wabash / Wooster game at Chadwick and the place is packed and electric. Heck, even 800 people for a Denison game would feel electric in Chadwick.

Smed, I don't disagree with your point (a semi-packed d3 gym may generate much more enthusiasm than a d1 gym watching what most assume is a ho-hum game), but I do disagree with your numbers.  At Wabash you probably got (fairly) nearly as spoiled as I did at IWU - for MANY d3 schools, 300 is a BIG crowd.  And not all d1 crowds are Akron, where 3,000 is no doubt big.

If there were 15,000 at UI (didn't check the numbers, but don't trust 'em anyway!), that is 6 times the usual IWU turnout, though only 4 times the BIG game numbers, and probably little more loud or 'impressive'.  If IWU played a game at Akron, they would probably be very UNimpressed with the numbers or enthusiasm.  But imagine a Eureka at UI (or an Earlham at IU) - however tepid the enthusiasm might be, the sheer number of fans WOULD indeed approximate the rest of the season combined.

While sac is correct that the MAIN motivation in most cases is money, challenge and thrill should not be underestimated.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 09, 2005, 12:51:40 AM
I can understand the players thinking "can I hang?" when they find out that they're playing Akron or Texas or whoever. But that is after the matchups are scheduled. Does that really play into the actual decision behind the scheduling of those games?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 09, 2005, 01:53:09 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 08, 2005, 10:33:28 PMIWU played national runner-up Illinois in an exhibition.  The game was VERY close right up to the final few minutes.

Whoa ... easy there, big fella. The game was tied at 41-41 with 14:37 left, at which point the Illini went on a big run and built up a 63-48 lead with eight minutes and change remaining, and ended up with an eventual 22-point victory, 82-60. (Here's the Illini press release: http://fightingillini.collegesports.com/sports/m-baskbl/recaps/110405aab.html.) Your Titans made an outstanding showing that night, but let's not gild the lily, Chuck.

And I think that DC hit it on the head with his "Who's Dee Brown?" retort. Dee Brown's a fine ballplayer, but I wouldn't hold my breath on that NBA-Top-50-list thing coming to pass.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 09, 2005, 08:38:55 AM
Ypsi -

The majority of D-1 schools play in small-ish arenas. 15 conferences had average attendance under 3,000 - including the West Coast Conference with Gonzaga.

There were 27 D-1 schools that had average attendance UNDER 1,000 - with Colgate and St. Francis (NY) the bottom.

I wonder if you ask Texas-Dallas about their D-1 experience. They played two games at Chadwick with a packed house. The IWU fans came over and even watched the consolation game they were in (for the most part) and then those players hung around and watched 1,200 people cheer IWU and Wabash.

Then they played a D-1 school at Texas-Arlington and the attendance was 568.

So even if you only get 400 to 500 a game - if you get just 500 to 1000 at a D-1 school it's really no big whoopde.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 09, 2005, 09:06:50 AM
wooscotsfan -

I certainly didn't (and don't) mean to discredit those Wooster teams from the seventies.  I did mention that I just didn't bother to look back so far for results.

Was Akron a D-1 school back then, and did D1 actually exist at that time?  I can't remember.  When I was in school (long time ago, Bradley University late sixties) it was broken down quite differently, but I can't remember how, or when things changed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on December 09, 2005, 09:45:03 AM
Here are some photos from the IWU vs Illinois exhibition game this year on November 3...

http://www.iwuhoops.com/ILLINI.HTM


While I am not in that "Coach C camp" that DC refers to (I generally like it when D3 teams get the chance to play D1's in the right situation - I'm not in favor of a game that's going to be a 50 point blowout), I will concede that as far as attendance and atmosphere, this game was the exception, and not the rule, as far as D1 vs D3 matchups go.  There were 16,000+ people at Assembly Hall...it was an experience I wouldn't trade for anything as a Titan fan and I know our players wouldn't either.  It was also a competitive game...from a competitive standpoint, one that compares favorably to what Illinois has done in some of their D1 games so far this year through their 9-0 start. 

Illinois halftime/final score margins...

Illinois Wesleyan: +6/+22
South Dakota State: +14/+25
Texas Southern: +16/+24
Rutgers: +12/+20
Arkansas-Little Rock: +4/+26

IWU also got some really nice exposure from the game, like this Peoria Journal Star (a paper that normally doesn't cover IWU) piece...

http://www.pjstar.com/stories/110405/BIL_B81G6MPD.077.shtml

Again, I concede that that's not the norm in most D1 vs D3 games.  That is why I say it has to be the "right situation."  For example, I would not be in favor of IWU playing an exhibition vs Illinois next season...without Adam Dauksas and Keelan Amelianovich (guys who could be starting for a lot of D1's), it just wouldn't be competitive.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 09, 2005, 09:51:33 AM
Back in the day, they had basically a "University" division and a "College" division. I don't know about Akron, per se, but up until the mid 70's Wabash was in a conference with Butler, Evansville, and Valpo.

Of course, speaking of D-1 trips, the immortal (hah!) Snowy Simpson had Wabash start the season with Eastern Illinois, Ball State,  Houston, Arkansas and UTEP in 73-74 (they beat Eastern Illinois and went 7-18 that year) and in 74-75 played Miami (Ohio), New Orleans, Centenary (LA), Eastern Illinois and Cincinnati on its way to 4-22.

I just looked and Akron was probably D-2 at the time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: whoyawitt on December 09, 2005, 10:05:01 AM
what will wooster do to stop dan russ and the rest of the witt frontcourt?  my only suggestion would be to put in the woo assistant coach.  he's got good size and he is usually out on the floor for half the game anyway.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 09, 2005, 04:42:46 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 09, 2005, 09:06:50 AM
Was Akron a D-1 school back then, and did D1 actually exist at that time?  I can't remember.  When I was in school (long time ago, Bradley University late sixties) it was broken down quite differently, but I can't remember how, or when things changed.

As Smedindy said, the NCAA consisted of two divisions -- University Division and College Division -- when you were at Bradley. The NCAA was one huge undivided mass until 1957, when it was divided thus. This two-division setup remained in place until 1974, when the College Division was further divided into D2 (scholarship) and D3 (non-scholarship). The University Division was renamed D1. This new alignment's first season was 1974-75, and that's the way it's been ever since.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: dufan on December 09, 2005, 05:44:57 PM
Hey guys, I thought I'd come back and add a little Denison flavor to the boards.

Don't have that much to cheer about, yet. Now that the death stretch is over, maybe they can settle down and finally start to pick up for they left off last year.

Go Big Red!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 09, 2005, 05:53:10 PM
dufan, welcome!  We need more insight into Denison, that's for sure. 

As for the "death stretch," it surely is over (Bluffton is up next, no death there), but I wonder what the lasting effect will be.  Do you think the Big Red is ready to put the big losses behind them and start afresh?  What worries me in particular is not the death stretch itself, but that it began one game sooner than it should have (losing to Marietta by 22, ugh).

Also, how do you like the refurbished gym?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 09, 2005, 06:58:18 PM
Quote from: whoyawitt on December 09, 2005, 10:05:01 AM
what will wooster do to stop dan russ and the rest of the witt frontcourt?  my only suggestion would be to put in the woo assistant coach.  he's got good size and he is usually out on the floor for half the game anyway.

Sorry, but you're sadly mistaken.  Though Doug Cline ventures onto the floor occasionally, particularly in Witt games, he is normally resigned to crossing his arms or throwing them up in disgust, while sitting in his seat on the Scot bench.  However, Steve Moore spends a good deal of time around the edge of the court jawing at the refs. 

It would be nice to have Cline out there tomorrow, though, considering Wooster was 6-4 against Witt during his four years, inclulding a three-game sweep in 1994-95 (58-53, 48-44, 71-67).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoBigRed on December 09, 2005, 07:14:31 PM
I would like to comment on Denison, also.

I am severely disappointed with what I've seen out of the BIg Red, so far. But you know what, not really so much from a players standpoint.

I saw the Marrieta game (brutal), the Witt game (Brutal except for their big man), and I ventured up to Akron because I thought it'd be cool. Let me tell you guys, these guys don't have a chance because they aren't being given a chance.

Now I don't know the ins and outs of basketball strategy, but I gotta believe these coaches down there in Granville are killing this team. They play way too many guys, in the first half against Akron, when maybe they could hang around and be entertainging, all five starters were on the bench. They should never EVER do that against Oberlin, but they did it against Wittenberg too, on your so called "death stretch," and thats why they get killed.

That big guy of theirs is tremendous, Witt had no answer for him, but he isn't even their focus, apparently they hope the big guy will get the rebounds if Rob Hern misses his fade-aways. Or this freshman #30 they got, he's a liitle trigger happy, he shoots it more than the big guy. Ive never seen that good a player be such a little focus. I almost feel sorry for him. Aren't these the same Denison coaches that saw him play for two years? 

I don't get it guys, I think Coach of the Year has gone to Ghilonis head, he thinks he can play all these guys when their maybe 6 or 7 deep.  Then thay play all these freshman and sophomores who just llok scared out there to me. I'd understand it if I was new to college hoops and had to play Wooster, Witt, and Akron, but I was at the Marietta game, they don't know what their doing, they couldn't even get the ball past half-court to even give the big guy a chance.

For all you other teams, you wanna know how to beat the Big Red? Press 'em, because of the 7 guards they play, 2 are good. And don't worry about the big guy, he'll get his by picking up a loose ball or getting an offensive rebound,  they wont pass it to him, and the coaches sit there and watch it like their not dropping the biggest ball ever.

Whatever, I've griped, I'm just upset because I thought they were going to be good this year, and maybe Im wrong because I dont have the basketball knowledge that I'm hoping Ghiloni has, but "back on track" seems like a stretch at this point. I've already jumped off the Browns bandwagon and on to Cincy's I don't wanna have to change my name to GoLords, too.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 09, 2005, 07:31:38 PM
If you're going to jump off the GoBigRed bandwagon, you might want to reconsider where you land.  GoLords might not be any more satisfying!   :D

(I should tread lightly; I got in trouble with a Kenyon fan in here a couple of years ago, and I don't want that to happen again.  I have numerous relatives that went to Kenyon and others to Denison, so I pull for these teams often.  But Kenyon's bandwagon seems to pull in the general direction of the natatorium!)

Anyway, I wouldn't jump just yet.  The only really bad loss is the one to Marietta (although the Wooster loss, while not unexpected, was surely ugly.)  Who cares how they looked against Akron?  That's like comparing your prom date to Grace Kelly (oops, I'm dating myself again) Jennifer Aniston.  Let's at least give the Big Red a shot at Wabash before we send out the jury.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoBigRed on December 09, 2005, 08:00:36 PM
I agree, Dave, I'm just letting out my frustrations with what Ive seen.

I didn't expect them to beat Wooster, and I didn't think they'd win @ Witt, so we'll see how they do against the teams that, on paper, they "should" beat. Refer to my last post to get the vaildation for saying "on paper."

I'll see how they do in these two home games and I'll let you know.

Go Big Red!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 09, 2005, 08:16:06 PM
Halftime at Chadwick:

Tri State 33
Wabash 34

Wabash started hot and held a 22-10 lead in the first 10 minutes of the game.  Then the Wabash swoon hit and Tri State got back into the game.  The teams traded the lead several times over the last five minutes of the half.  Wabash has committed 6 offensive fouls.  That's not good.  I think I just heard our radio color guy tell me that there were 31 total turnovers in the first half.  Yikes. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 09, 2005, 08:18:07 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 09, 2005, 01:53:09 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 08, 2005, 10:33:28 PMIWU played national runner-up Illinois in an exhibition.  The game was VERY close right up to the final few minutes.

Whoa ... easy there, big fella. The game was tied at 41-41 with 14:37 left, at which point the Illini went on a big run and built up a 63-48 lead with eight minutes and change remaining, and ended up with an eventual 22-point victory, 82-60. (Here's the Illini press release: http://fightingillini.collegesports.com/sports/m-baskbl/recaps/110405aab.html.) Your Titans made an outstanding showing that night, but let's not gild the lily, Chuck.

And I think that DC hit it on the head with his "Who's Dee Brown?" retort. Dee Brown's a fine ballplayer, but I wouldn't hold my breath on that NBA-Top-50-list thing coming to pass.

Greg, are we gonna quibble over the definition of 'final few minutes'?! ;)

Actually, I admit I had remembered the Illini run as a few minutes later than that (damn memory!); but I still contend that if IWU had shot FTs like they usually do, and if Cory Jones had been available (the run didn't happen 'til our front court was in foul trouble - give 'em 5 more fouls to play with...), the game might have gone all the way to the wire.

OK, scratch Dee Brown - how about a d3 player being able to say he outplayed a Big 10 POY? :)

If we continue any comments on UI-IWU, perhaps we should relocate to CCIW Chat and leave these good folks to debate the big Oberlin-Hiram showdown.  [Sorry, couldn't help myself! ;D  And Woo-Witt, as usual, should be among the top games of the season.]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 09, 2005, 09:15:27 PM
Final from Chadwick:

Tri State 70
Wabash 82

22 points from Medeiros to lead the Little Giants tonight as Wabash pulled away in the second half.  Up next for the little Giants is Denison next Saturday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 09, 2005, 09:33:41 PM
Five Wabash players in double figures, three with five or more assists.

Tri-State runs and presses. They used to run a Grinnell system of sorts but now just try to press and create turnovers. It was a sloppy game with a lot of them. Wabash held their ground on the boards and shot well for the win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopsfan1111 on December 09, 2005, 11:09:47 PM
Quote

However, Steve Moore spends a good deal of time around the edge of the court jawing at the refs.


Quote

I have seen enough Witt/Wooster games in the past, to be able to say Coach Brown spends his fair share of time at the edge of and/or on the court "jawing" at the refs...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 09, 2005, 11:24:21 PM
I'll assume one of the resident Wabashians has the TSU/Wabash score correct.  The MIAA site is reported the reverse result.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2005, 07:55:25 AM
Wabash does win - as I saw it with me own eyes!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on December 10, 2005, 09:19:14 AM
Go BigRed - I totally agree with you.  Ghiloni goes way too deep.  Lets face it, they were going to have a hard time winning any of the last three but when he puts five people on the floor that can't score for an extended period of time things blow up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 10, 2005, 10:51:53 AM
Quote from: whoyawitt on December 09, 2005, 10:05:01 AM
what will wooster do to stop dan russ and the rest of the witt frontcourt?  my only suggestion would be to put in the woo assistant coach.  he's got good size and he is usually out on the floor for half the game anyway.
Um, well, FYI whoya, UW Stout had a set of 7' twins (the Nonemachers) playing for them so its not like Wooster hasn't proven that they can win against a team with a significant height advantage. ::)

I will grant you this, the Nonemachers didn't seem to be at quite the same level as Borchers and Russ.  Or at least at the same level that Borchers and Russ seem to play at every time they see a Wooster jersey! ;)  That being said, they were quality post players and they were seven footers! 

That Stout game reminds me a bit of what Wooster will be facing tonight.  Stout had a big presense inside, and they had guards that can shoot from the outside.  Having won that game should at least give Wooster some confidence that they can beat teams with height advantages like Witt will have over them.  I will say this, Wooster will have to shoot better than they did in the first matchup between these 2 rivals last year.  Witt held the Scots to under 30% for the only time in the 2000's.  Hopefully the heat is cranked up in Timken for the Scots tonight because they have to be hot from the outside to have a chance in this one!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on December 10, 2005, 11:29:54 AM
I like Wooster in the big game tonight.  It will be interesting to see who comes out on top with the two contrasting styles of play.  Witt's strong post play versus Wooster's strong perimeter play, should be fun.  At home, I just believe Wooster will be able to keep the pace of play to their advantage.
To further expand on Denison, I believe one of their biggest problems is the fact that the coach yanks a player every time they make a mistake.  The result is no sustitution pattern, the wrong combination of players on the floor most of the game, and a bunch of kids playing trying NOT to make a mistake.  It's like playing trying not to get hurt, what happens, injuries.  The other problem I see is that the players who have turned this program around over the last two years are spending way to much time on the bench watching games get out of hand.  The team doesn't seem to be having any fun or enjoying playing the game at all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 10, 2005, 01:11:07 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 09, 2005, 08:18:07 PMGreg, are we gonna quibble over the definition of 'final few minutes'?! ;)

If you're going to consider two-thirds of the second half "the final few minutes", Chuck, then, yes, we are gonna quibble. :D

Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 09, 2005, 08:18:07 PMActually, I admit I had remembered the Illini run as a few minutes later than that (damn memory!); but I still contend that if IWU had shot FTs like they usually do, and if Cory Jones had been available (the run didn't happen 'til our front court was in foul trouble - give 'em 5 more fouls to play with...), the game might have gone all the way to the wire.

Yeah, and if the Illini had wings on their backs they could've flown up to the basket and negated that extra Titans big man. Even for a diehard you're leaning a little too heavily on dreamed-for "what ifs", Chuck. You play the game with the players you have available ... and how they perform at the free-throw line is all a part of the game. Perhaps you should start a "Counterfactuals" room in Posting Up where you can offer these arguments ... and where I can finally get an answer to the questions that have vexed me ever since they appeared in a Saturday Night Live skit back in the late seventies: What if Superman was a Nazi? And what if Napoleon had a B-52 at Waterloo? ;)

Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 09, 2005, 08:18:07 PMOK, scratch Dee Brown - how about a d3 player being able to say he outplayed a Big 10 POY? :)

Now that is something he can legitimately use to bore his grandchildren.  :D

Quote from: ScotsFan on December 10, 2005, 10:51:53 AMI will grant you this, the Nonemachers didn't seem to be at quite the same level as Borchers and Russ.  Or at least at the same level that Borchers and Russ seem to play at every time they see a Wooster jersey! ;)  That being said, they were quality post players and they were seven footers!

You seem to be a lot higher on the Nonemacher brothers than are the people in the WIAC room, ScotsFan. So I looked up their stats. Jacob (the one who starts) averages 7.9 ppg and 5.3 rpg. These numbers will probably not increase much (if at all) as the year goes on, because UW-Stout will be playing mostly WIAC games from now on, so the competition gets tougher. His non-starting brother John averages 5.1 ppg and 3.3 rpg. "Quality post players" would seem to be a stretch to describe them, especially as compared to Wittenberg's Dan Russ (11.2/5.2) and Dane Borchers (8.0/5.8 ).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 10, 2005, 01:45:47 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 10, 2005, 01:11:07 PM
You seem to be a lot higher on the Nonemacher brothers than are the people in the WIAC room, ScotsFan. So I looked up their stats. Jacob (the one who starts) averages 7.9 ppg and 5.3 rpg. These numbers will probably not increase much (if at all) as the year goes on, because UW-Stout will be playing mostly WIAC games from now on, so the competition gets tougher. His non-starting brother John averages 5.1 ppg and 3.3 rpg. "Quality post players" would seem to be a stretch to describe them, especially as compared to Wittenberg's Dan Russ (11.2/5.2) and Dane Borchers (8.0/5.8 ).
I did mention the fact that I didn't feel that the Nonemachers were on the same level as Witt's bigs, but at 7.9 ppg and 5.3 rpg, Jacob isn't that far off from Russ' #'s and they look pretty even to Borcher's #'s.  I didn't refer to them as great post players.  Personally, I don't think it is much of a stretch to say that they are quality bigs (especially Jacob N.), but, perhaps the more appropriate description would have been average to above average post players.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2005, 05:59:04 PM
Folks, I've opened up a new board for in-game updates of tonight's Witt @ Woo game:
http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4130.0

Please post your in-game comments over there so this board can remain relatively devoted to the general conference.  I figure that nobody's going to want to see a post like "Wxx 53, Wxx 47, 8:58 remaining, Nnnn just hit a trey" much beyond Tuesday, so there's no need to make those interested in general NCAC topics wade through a couple of pages of updates to find their topic.   :) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 10, 2005, 06:11:12 PM
NCAC scores in the books so far today...

Hiram 68, Oberlin 57
OWU 76, Allegheny 61
Earlham 86, Kenyon 80

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoBigRed on December 10, 2005, 07:57:13 PM
Final from Granville

Buffton 76
Denison 53

Let me just share a few things I was scratching my head about as I watched this game. I'll start with the good news:

Denison's gym looks nice, I had committed to the bleachers before I noticed that the seats behind the benches were individual seats, now I know for next time.

And the bad news:

Denison has arguably the best post player in the conference, but they ran this 5 out running around thing for most of the game and the big guy couldn't play his game (I think he almost hit a 3). I'm looking at the box score, and again, 11 guys play 10 minutes or more. The complete lack of continuity is probably why they turned the ball over 26 times (watchng it I thought they had 40). That Hern kid didnt even start, he mustve been late to a practice or something. I guess Ghiloni thinks this is gym class and everyone needs to play, by doing this they're going to lose by 20 every single game, he might as well literally play everybody.

Its bad, folks. I just dont understand what goings on. They've got a week before their next game, and unless they cut the rotation in half and get the big kid on the block, Wabash is gonna kill 'em   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on December 10, 2005, 08:43:31 PM
GoBigRed - Believe it or not Hern wasn't late or something.  Just another lineup change - seems to be differnt every game.  This team is really down, all the fun has been taken out of the game.  The offensive philosophy is awful, why would you have your post player starting at the top of the key in nearly every possession?  They do the same thing every time down court, just once I'd like to see them spread the floor so they have some room to operate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on December 10, 2005, 09:18:31 PM
Woo wins 86-83!  Thanks to David Collinge for setting up the Woo-Witt game board. 

If anyone downloaded the Live Video stream, I would be interested in seeing how it turned out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on December 10, 2005, 09:20:59 PM
Listening to Coach Moore's post-game interview, it's amazing how calm he sounds.  I know he was probably going nuts on the bench
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 10, 2005, 09:45:20 PM
Wow.  That's all I have to say.

Well, not all entirely.  It pretty much played out as everyone thought.  Witt dominated on the inside, Woo on the outside.  After going down big in the first quarter (20-6), Wooster came back with a huge run to end the half, but Witt held on by one at the break (41-40).

It was back and forth the entire second half.  It came down to the wire and lucky for Woo, James Cooper knows how to handle pressure.  He scored each of the last seven, including the go-ahead trey from way out with 4.1 on the clock.  I tip my hat to the Scots.

I would also like to congratulate Dan Russ on a well played game.  He was as dominant as ever on the glass and in the paint, scoring big buckets time and time again.  There was a little scare late in the second when he blocked one of Port's layups and went down with what appeared to be an ankle sprain.  He limped off the court and came back a couple minutes later, however, retaped and ready to go.  He scored as soon as he went in and later hit the game-tying bucket at 83 all, setting up Coop's dramatics. 

Well played by all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on December 10, 2005, 09:46:31 PM
CONGRATS WOO!!! We were planning on watching the live video feed, however, were not prepared to pay the 10 dollar fee, haha. The audio was amazing though!! Another instant classic. THE TRUE QUESTION IS: WHEN IS ESPN GONNA TELEVISE THIS RIVALRY???[/b] They put on high school games, Grinnell, Trick Shot Pool, i mean it's ridiculous, this is one of the best rivalries in ALL of collegiate athletics, period. Now that they have ESPNU, this should be one of their staples. Anyway, congrats to the entire Wooster program on another huge clutch win, and to CoopDawg for the trey to win it. Hopefully I'll be able to attend at least one of the next battles this season. As for the Illinois Wesleyan vs. Wash U game...it was a "wash" as IWU won by 27. Wooster was definitely the place to be tonight!! Take care to all in Ohio...The one.....The only....Moneyball. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2005, 09:55:52 PM
Here's the box score. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/boxes/2005-06/wittenberg.php)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2005, 10:12:46 PM
When you lose by 23 I don't think the rotation enters tht much into it.

Wabash has done the five-in, five-out at times over the past few years, especially when they were younger and it did develop the younger players and gave them fresh legs. But it's not a philosophy for everyone, for sure.

It's great to have a Denison perspective, though, for a change!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 10, 2005, 10:37:58 PM
Just got back from Timken where I saw an incredible game tonight!   :)   Witt shot 52% from the floor and 22 of 23 from the charity stripe and lost this game.  The difference was Wooster forcing 15 Tiger turnovers and the Scots also made 11 three pointers to win this big game.

Great performances tonight by Tom Port with 25 points, James Cooper with 21 points including the winning three pointer (NBA range) and Tim Vandervaart with 10 points.

Dan Russ had a great game for Witt with his 33 points but Wooster negated the Witt big men by making the 11 three point shots compared to only 3 three pointers for the Tigers.

Wooster gains the early edge in the NCAC race.  ;D  Next up is Westminster on December 18th.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2005, 10:40:42 PM
Pat's already got a story up on the front page.  Since James Cooper was the last-second hero, his picture accompanies the story.  That means there's two different pictures of Coop on the front page.  I hope it doesn't go to his head! 

Dan Russ, Kyle Witucky, and Steve Moore have all also graced the front page early in this season.  Pretty cool... 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 11, 2005, 01:11:50 AM
Its nice to finally celebrate a Scots win over a Coccia House pizza again!!! ;D All I can say is that was an epic game, and more specifically, an epic 2nd half.  The first half was all Witt in the first 10 minutes and all Woo in the final 10 minutes.  But the 2nd half was nip and tuck all the way with no team enjoying more than a 5 point cusion.  I can't remember one half of basketball being so competitive where there seemed to be absolutely NO margin for error.  One stat that popped out at me, in catching Coach Moore's post game comments in the car after the game, was the fact that, not only did Wooster only committ ONE turnover in the second half, six of their seven total turnovers occurred in the first 5-6 minutes of the contest!  That means that Wooster only had ONE turnover over the last 35 minutes give or take a couple!  Pretty amazing stat, considering how strong Witt's defense is.

MoneyBall, I echo your sentiments regarding ESPNU.  I had (emphasis on the word HAD) some high hopes when ESPN launched the new channel.  But, I have since been SEVERELY disappointed.  All they showed the entire fall season were repeats of football games that aired on ABC, ESPN, or ESPN2!  I thought ESPNU might be interested in a bit more diversity in college athletics.  At the very least, they could show some other college sports such as soccer or hockey, not to mention some sports at the smaller divisions.  They didn't even televise any of the soccer playoff games, which I thought would be the least they could do.   I have come to the conlcusion that this channel is nothing more than and extra "Instant Classic" channel for ESPN to air major college football and basketball.  I think that they are missing out on a lot of REAL college atheletics stories by not covering ALL college athletics at every level.  If any fan of basketball were to watch the performance of both Witt and Woo tonight, and not walked away thinking, that was on HELL of a basketball game played at a high level, I would have to beg to differ as to whether or not you were a true fan of the game of basketball!

Oh well, enough of that tangent.  I have been meaning to vent on that subject and MoneyBall got me started.  Not like anything I say in here, or to ESPN is going to get those suits interested in anything DIII.  Hell, the only football playoff games they show round by round are DI-AA.  They did show a couple of DII games, but I don't even know if the DIII finals are going to be on the N"etwork"?!  It just pisses me off that they are missing the boat on this and there is nothing that can be done! ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 11, 2005, 01:24:39 AM
DC, you should've postponed your move to SoCal by about a week! ;)  You missed one of the best games (if not THE best game)  I have witnessed at Timken since I have been following the Scots.  Breck does a fantastic job on the radio, but, even he could not do justice to the explosion that went off when Coopers shot ripped the net!  BTW, when all the congrats were exchanged by the 2 teams, the students and players lifted Cooper on their shoulders celebrating his herorics.  I'm sure he was loving every minute of it as he is a Springfield native, and he wasn't heavily recruited by Witt!  It was pretty cool to see a Wooster celebration on the Timken floor as opposed to the other way around as has been the trend lately! 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoBigRed on December 11, 2005, 01:50:46 AM
Smedindy -

Were you in attendance? The rotation had EVERYTHING to do with it! Their big guy is their best player and one of five or six guys who could be conference POY, and they start him at the top of the key?

When you refer to Wabash's 5-out (because even though I don't have that big a bball IQ I know you couldnt possibly be serious about a 5-in, that sounds like 3sec waiting to happen), did they have a big man of this caliber who they all but disregarded for the sake of developing a freshman?

Denison has 6 talented kids, I wont name names because maybe someones parents will get their feelings hurt, but if you go 11 deep, that means theres 5 guys who shouldnt see the floor. And sure enough there were stretches in the game tonight when those excess 5 were in the game together. Im not saying those kids wont be good in a year or two, but theyre not ready. If I know that, then how come Denison's coaches dont know that? 

They need to play those 6 30 minutes a game, and if youre gonna play the other guys, switch the other 5 in two per game to fill the other 20 minutes. Maybe I just gotta stop going to their games, they were 2-1 before I started going.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2005, 01:53:54 AM
Here's a photo of Cooper's game-winning shot, courtesy of Matt Dilyard of the College of Wooster:
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fathletics.wooster.edu%2Fimages%2F0506%2Fmb%2Fcooper_witt_winner.jpg&hash=5aeeadbc2ddf549a0467cce0ceee2f9117da0c67)

Evidently Witt doesn't think Cooper has the range, as Billy Bowen is giving Cooper plenty of space.  I wonder what Steve and Doug are thinking--they look pretty sedate as they watch the shot go up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2005, 02:07:20 AM
Hugh Howard's (Wooster) press release has been added to this site, and can be accessed from the front page.  It's a very good write-up; but so is Ryan Maurer's (Wittenberg).  Since there is only one press release associated with each game, here's a link to Ryan's recap. (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/05-06gamestories/wooster.html)

Wittenberg also has an audio archive of their broadcast available here. (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule05-06.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 11, 2005, 08:29:22 AM
It looks like Hern and Hodgkinson are leading the team in minutes. Hern played 29 minutes against Bluffton, which seems OK to me.

"5 in / 5 out" is the sub pattern - its akin to a line change, which can be effective if your second unit brings a lot of energy. It can really disrupt what the other team is doing.

I think you'll find a lot of teams don't play six players 30 minutes a game, unless they absolutely had to. It would wear them down.

Tom Port only averages 29 minutes a game for Wooster.
Dan Russ only averages about 26 minutes a game for Witt.

In fact, in the HUGE game Russ only played 31 minutes. Port did play 34, but this was a HUGE game, not a non-conference game against a non-rival.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 11, 2005, 10:19:55 AM
Just some opinions on the Wittenberg-Wooster game, which was one of the most exciting basketball contests I've ever seen.  I totally agree that either ESPNU or CSTV should pick up these broadcasts; the sporting world is missing out on something very special.

Wooster's defensive effort was a sight to behold.  From Coach Moore's first timeout onward, they stepped it up to an unbelievable level.  The gameplan, obviously, was to not double down underneath, and that caused problems.  But the Wooster big men (especially Vandervaart, whose hustle was phenominal) did an excellent job considering that they had to try to handle Russ and Borchers one-on-one.  Borchers is good, but Russ is much better.  He has so many ways to score, and a terrific shooting touch.  Certainly a player who could play many minutes at mid-range D1.

On the perimeter, though, is where the defense paid its real dividends.  The ball was continually pressured, as were the off-players, and as the game went on, entry into the middle became more and more difficult.  Everyone was involved, but Brandon Johnson stood out.  I've come 180 degrees on my opinion of him as a player.  Offensively, he plays within the flow, takes what's there, and has excellent court vision.  Defensively, his quickness, hustle, and tenacity sets him apart, at least last night.

The only player who seemed not to step his game up after that first timeout was Evan Will.  At some point later in the game, after another timeout, Steve Moore was in his face, hard.  From that point on, Will was a changed player, keeping many balls alive inside and not being afraid to try to score.  Late coming, but an excellent effort.

Tom Port, after a sluggish start, had an excellent game.  As was pointed out, he's a streak shooter, but once he got it going, he was a force, both from three-point land and inside.

Kyle Witucky, offensively, was definitely off his game.  He forced some threes, and at least one other shot, a runner on the right side.  He even missed both of his free throws. 

James Cooper.  What can you say?  He drives me nuts by often standing on the wing waving for the ball when he's only half open.  He seems to look annoyed when he doesn't get it.  But then, when he GETS the ball, he nearly invariably delivers, able to score either inside or outside, despite the pressure. 

His scoring, inside, is very old school.  After penetrating, more often than not, rather than fly out of control to the hoop, he'll pull up for a very under-control short jumper.  He shoots from well back above his head, with a high arc and an occasional pump fake.  Getting shots off in a crowd when you're undersized is an art, and he's mastered it.  I've only seen him rejected twice this year (probably more, but that's all that I remember), once by a Stout seven-footer (whom he shot over a few other times to score) and last night by a second big-man coming in from the side.  Can't recall if it was Borchers or Russ.

3.  The officiating was, as usual, not up to the level of play.  There was one call where one of the refs, standing no more than 10-12 feet from a Wittenberg shooter, signalled that his shot was a three when the guy's foot was clearly on the line, visible even 60 feet away, in the stands, on the other side of the court.  Luckily, this was quickly overruled by another official.  Even the Witt victory in the JV game is tainted, as whoever threw in the half-court shot to win it took two and a half big long steps before releasing it.  And obvious travel, pointed out by everyone in the gym, but the officiating crew was oblivious.

4.  The Wittenberg crowd did have the best chant.  After a great steal by Brandon Johnson, the Wooster students broke into:

HE'S a FRESHman
HE'S a FRESHman
HE'S a FRESHman

The Witt crowd quickly retorted:

WE didn't WANT him
WE didn't WANT him
WE didn't WANT him

They may, though, wish to revise their lyrics (and/or scouting) after Johnson's performance last night.

One last comment.  I don't, at all, consider Wittenberg to be a dirty basketball team.  They play hard and physical.  They'll sometimes push and hold, and they know the little tricks.  However, that's not dirty ball; holding a player never hurt him.  It's up to the referees to watch for this kind of stuff.  Unfortunately, they tend to let too much of it go on.

However.  There was an incident last night where Dane Borchers set a hard, but absolutely legal, pick at midcourt.  One of the Witt guards ran Brandon Johnson into it at a pretty high speed.  My problem is that Borchers's elbow came up at the last second, aimed at Johnson's face.  Luckily, it appeared to not connect solidly, although Johnson hit the deck hard, mostly from the pick itself.  But that elbow WAS a very dirty play, and Borchers should be ashamed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on December 11, 2005, 11:06:17 AM
If one wants to listen to the Witt Archive broadcast of the game is it free? or does one have to pay?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 11, 2005, 11:17:13 AM
WB,

Great points all around.  I too was very impressed by the defensive tenacity showed by Wooster last night after that 2nd timeout.  Especially, the perimeter defense.  I think that Wooster learned from the Stout and Earlham games that they were leaving shooters open outside when they were trying to double down inside and they were getting burned.  Not last night, however.  Witt came into the game last night leading the league in 3-point fg percentage at nearly 44%.  Last night, they only made 3-11 and went 0-4 in the 2nd half!  

I echo your sentiments on Brandon Johnson and James Cooper.  Cooper is really proving himself to be a real special player.  And, usually, one area where freshmen seem to struggle early is on the defensive end of the floor.  Not Brandon Johnson.  That kid was all over the place, making several key steals including the biggest one with under a minute to go in the game.  Witt's fans might want to re-think their "We didn't want him" chants, because Witt let Cooper get right out from under them, and I didn't see any Witt freshmen better than Johnson's all around game last night!

The officiating was sub-par at best, and that is being generous.
QuoteThere was one call where one of the refs, standing no more than 10-12 feet from a Wittenberg shooter, signalled that his shot was a three when the guy's foot was clearly on the line, visible even 60 feet away, in the stands, on the other side of the court.  Luckily, this was quickly overruled by another official.
I think you are being generous in saying that the official was only 10-12 feet from the shooter.  It was Russ shooting, and I remember the official in question running up from behind and looking right at Russ's feet, and he still gave him the trey?!  Another official had to come from clear across the floor to over-rule him after everyone in the gym (besides the Witt folk) erupted about his foot being on the line!  Also, I thought that Russ got away with at least two charge calls as well.  On one, Russ was on a breakaway and Vandervaart beat him down the floor and looked to have established position well before Russ got to him.  Russ plowed him over and got the blocking foul and the hoop!  

And that pick by Borchers on Johnson?  I saw it on the replay last night on our cable access channel and Borchers definately threw out his elbows.  If that wasn't intentional, I don't know what you would call it? ???  

Finally, I just have to tip my hat to Daniel Russ.  I don't know what it is about Wooster, but he comes ready to play every time these two rivals meet up!  I was telling a friend of mine, their coaches ought to get a sports psychiatrist to work with Russ so that he can envision every opponent they are playing in Wooster uni's and the young man would be UNSTOPPABLE!!! ;)  He is a tough competitor and seems like a class act on and off the floor.  Maybe Kenny Brady could use a lesson or two in how to conduct yourself with class from Russ!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on December 11, 2005, 11:18:42 AM
smedindy - Denison hasn't been subbing 5 in/5 out, it's been a constant yanking of players in and out, with Hern and Hodgkinson usually getting around 28 minutes.  The problem they seem to be having is that some of the guys just aren't ready and the players that are never get in to the flow of the game.  Additionally, it seems that they never seem to have the right combination of players in the game.  They go through periods in the game where they literally have 5 players out there that can't score, which results in big spurts for the opposing team.  Then the momentum swings and they just can't get back on track.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 11, 2005, 11:45:02 AM
Not sure I can add anything new to the great set of comments made from last nights games, but I'll reinforce a few points.

First - Thanks to Mr. Collinge for typing the play by play. Even though I was there to enjoy it, it was great to be able to come back to 'relive' it through your posts. The Wittenberg site has the play by play also with the box score but its not as easy to follow.

Second - This is a classic because it played out exactly as billed, Witt's superior front court against Wooster's superior backcourt. Early on Witt had the advantage but you knew that as Witt's guard got tired it would swing.

Third - I agree with an earlier post - it would be great if Witt did not drop at all in the D3hoops poll, but the reality is they will probably be 5th or 6th on Tuesday.

Fourth - IMO this was Ports best game at Wooster. His two best games this year are now Stout and Witt - the most important games for him to step up. Brandon Johnson just continues to amaze me - he is playing like a second year Varisty player.  Vandervaart didn't put up big box score numbers, but his hustle and work effort was second to none. Coach Brown gave him credit in the Daily Record with the momentum changing play with his dunk off a Fulk assist.

Last - Even though I called out a few players above, this was a team effort. Wooster just does not lose much when the bench comes in. Last night there were several periods of time when only two starters were on the floor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on December 11, 2005, 12:02:32 PM
I know sometimes the local cable channel in Wooster sometimes re-plays the Wooster basketball games. If anyone in Wooster could tape the game I would be more then willing to pay for a copy of it. Contact me at cliverman@hotmail.com
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 11, 2005, 12:09:35 PM
I've got to second Wooster Booster's comment on Evan Will.  He had a rough time of it in the first half, made a couple of bad turnovers during the Tirger's 14 - 0 run, and looked out of place.  But, when he was given the chance to get back in the game, he turned his game around and was a completely different player.   Also, Brandon Johnson was huge with his defense, and in particular one long offensive board where he soared WAY over everyone else to grab it.

I have to admit that even though I picked Wooster in the Pick 'em, I really felt that the Tigers would win, maybe easily.  I didn't think that the Scots would be able to stop Russ (and they couldn't), but I also figured that if Earlham could shut down the Scots perimeter game that Witt would certainly be able to.  Fortunately that was not the case, and that was really the difference in the game.  The Scots guards handled the ball better, were able to score from outside or distribute the ball inside when they had position, and played better defense.  

Great game from both teams, and I'm certainly hoping for more of the same on February 4!

Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 11, 2005, 12:10:36 PM
Kramer -

The impression I got from reading the threads was that Denison was going in five at a time at some point. I'm sorry if I misinterpreted or if the posts weren't clear.

That's happened with Wabash at times, early in the seasons past with a young team. There were some combinations that were interesting. It's just a way of learning who really can play.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on December 11, 2005, 12:58:19 PM
Smedindy-
You know I remember seeing Wabash sub 5 in the past.  I've never been a big fan of that but I do recall that it seemed to work for them.  I just think Denison would be more successful if they paid a little more attention to whose on the floor at the same time.  Unfortunately, they seem to yank kids out at the slightest mistake and end up with terrible combinations on the floor.  They may be able to get away with it some of the time against a weaker opponent, but their schedule to this point hasn't given them that opprtunity very often.  They need a big turn-around if they expect to compete with Wabash next Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 11, 2005, 01:10:16 PM
A day later and I am still reflecting on a great game yesterday by Wooster and Wittenberg.  Congrats to both teams on a very well played contest!

A few more observations from the game:

1.  Kudos to Coaches Moore and Cline for not doubling down in the post last night.  Russ and Borchers got their points but they were only two pointers.  By not doubling, Wooster only gave up 3 three pointers to Witt while the Scots nailed 11 three pointers on offense.  This was one of the keys to the victory.

2.  As some others have noted, Wooster's defensive intensity especially by the guards was another key as they forced 15 Witt turnovers to only 7 for the Scots.

3.  Brandon Johnson is an impressive freshman for the Scots who came up with a couple of crucial steals last night and he scored 9 points while not forcing any shots.  I'm glad that Cooper and Johnson are Scots even if Witt did not recruit them!  :)

4.  Witt should still be ranked in the top 5 nationally in the next poll and I already posted this on the top 25 board on this site.  The Tigers played very well and almost got the win.  With Witt up 76-72 and 3:50 remaining, I was afraid that the Tigers would notch the "W" but the Scots played tough down the stretch with great play by Cooper, Port and Vandervaart.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 11, 2005, 01:49:38 PM
I was able to record the tape-delayed broadcast of the game today.  If anyone is interested, I could make copies and send them out.  My email adress is in my profile.  Just drop me an email if you are intersted.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2005, 02:55:31 PM
Quote from: goscots on December 11, 2005, 11:45:02 AM
First - Thanks to Mr. Collinge for typing the play by play. Even though I was there to enjoy it, it was great to be able to come back to 'relive' it through your posts. The Wittenberg site has the play by play also with the box score but its not as easy to follow.
Thanks.  But it was me, not my father.  ;)

Quote from: cmhscots on December 11, 2005, 12:09:35 PM
I have to admit that even though I picked Wooster in the Pick 'em, I really felt that the Tigers would win, maybe easily. 
As long as we're telling truth, that was my opinion too.  I even expressed it to a fellow poster in a "personal message," figuring that if I said it out loud (in a digital sense) it'd create a jinx.  I guess it worked!  :)

Quote from: smedindy on December 11, 2005, 08:29:22 AM
"5 in / 5 out" is the sub pattern - its akin to a line change, which can be effective if your second unit brings a lot of energy. It can really disrupt what the other team is doing.
UW-Stout did that in the first 10 minutes of each half they played at Timken.  Starting 5 then next 5 then starting 5 again, before reverting to a more conventional substitution pattern.  It seemed to work for them, but they play a full-court up-tempo game, not unlike how I imagine JCU plays.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 11, 2005, 03:57:01 PM
NCAC Standings thru 12/10 games

Team                   NCAC           Overall
Wooster                4-0               8-0
Ohio Wesleyan        2-0               6-2
Wabash                 1-0               5-3
Wittenberg             1-1               6-1
Allegheny               1-1               4-4
Earlham                 1-1               3-4
Hiram                    1-1               1-4
Kenyon                  0-2               3-4
Denison                 0-2               2-6
Oberlin                  0-3               0-10
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 11, 2005, 05:15:52 PM
This sounds like a little sour grapes from Bill Brown as he was quoted by the Wooster Daily Record after the game last night about Cooper's clutch game winning shot:

Quote from: The Wooster Daily Record"It went in and that was the only good thing about that shot," said Tigers coach Bill Brown.

And here's Cooper's take on the shot:

Quote from: The Wooster Daily Record"As long as it went in, that's all that matters," Cooper said. "I was actually looking to penetrate, but when (the defender) backed up, I knew I was going to shoot it."

I was thinking along the same lines as Cooper.  Bill Brown might not have thought it was a good shot, but when Billy Bowen was practically begging Cooper to shoot by playing off so far, Cooper just obliged and drained it! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on December 11, 2005, 06:22:39 PM
Scotsfan,

If the Record quoted Brown as you said, the Record took the quote out of context.

The complete quote is as follows, as reported in the News-Sun:

"You wouldn't expect  to shoot that shot with the score tied and you only need two and both teams are in the double bonus," Brown said. "Conventionally thinking would be to drive it for a foul, or challenge the officials for a foul. It was only a good shot because it went in".

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2005, 07:45:32 PM
IMHO, any time you do something that the defense doesn't expect and is therefore unprepared for, it's good.   

The photo below (and on the front page) provides evidence of how open Coop was.  We all know he can hit that shot, so if Brown/Bowen are going to concede an open jumper in Coop's range (albeit at the extreme of that range), it's a good idea to take it.  I figure anything goes when it's a tie game.  If he drains it, he wins; if he misses it, it's OT.  Had Witt been up by one or two, I would agree that an NBA three would have been a poor choice, but it would have been tough for Coop to pass up an open look like that under any circumstance.

I'd guess Bill Brown will be better prepared for the possibility of an NBA three from a Wooster guard at the end of the next game.  He's seen it often enough these past two seasons!   ;)

Driving the lane and hoping for the foul call is also a good strategy (just ask Travis DuPree), but at least this way the outcome was in the hands of a player and not a referee. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on December 11, 2005, 08:17:38 PM
From reading the posts here and seeing that photo, I feel like I have a great picture of that moment.  It is probably one of those shots that if he misses, we'd have people here questioning the shot selection..."Cooper was open, but not the shot we wanted there...should have been more patient..."

As IWU head coach Scott Trost always says in our postgame interviews, "Players make plays."  James Cooper made a big play and earned his team a big win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 11, 2005, 08:19:11 PM
DC, the unexpected is not necessarily the good. After all, he could've shot it from midcourt, too. That would've been unexpected. ;)

It all depends upon Cooper's driving ability, his FT shooting ability, his court vision (i.e., his ability to spot an open man and dish it off while driving), his long-range-trey shooting ability, and how tightly the refs are calling the game. All of those factors enter into the analysis of whether or not it was a "good" shot. An NBA trey attempt tends to be low-percentage for all but a handful of shooters in D3, and even if one of those players is the guy with the rock it may not be the best alternative for him in a given situation.

Brown may be at peace with the idea that the Tigers forced Cooper to choose the alternative that Brown wanted him to choose. Or he may simply be rationalizing his team's defeat. Only he knows for sure.

Quote from: David Collinge on December 11, 2005, 07:45:32 PM
I'd guess Bill Brown will be better prepared for the possibility of an NBA three from a Wooster guard at the end of the next game.  He's seen it often enough these past two seasons!   ;)

It's axiomatic in basketball that every defense gives up something. If you take away one thing, you offer up a greater opportunity for something else to succeed. Go out and guard the perimeter out to 23 feet, and you open up a greater possibility that the opposing perimeter players can: a) drive past you; b) use the extra space between defenders to make better cuts to the basket; or c) utilize the extra space between defenders to pass the ball inside.                                                                                                       
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2005, 08:26:58 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 11, 2005, 08:19:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 11, 2005, 07:45:32 PM
I'd guess Bill Brown will be better prepared for the possibility of an NBA three from a Wooster guard at the end of the next game.  He's seen it often enough these past two seasons!   ;)

It's axiomatic in basketball that every defense gives up something. If you take away one thing, you offer up a greater opportunity for something else to succeed. Go out and guard the perimeter out to 23 feet, and you open up a greater possibility that the opposing perimeter players can: a) drive past you; b) use the extra space between defenders to make better cuts to the basket; or c) utilize the extra space between defenders to pass the ball inside.   

I wasn't so much trying to give coaching advice as I was trying to give a gentle reminder of Kyle Witucky's game-tying 25 footer at the end of the 2nd OT last year in Springfield.  It's as close as I tend to come to taking a shot at our worthy rivals; hence the ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 11, 2005, 08:43:16 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 11, 2005, 08:26:58 PMI wasn't so much trying to give coaching advice as I was trying to give a gentle reminder of Kyle Witucky's game-tying 25 footer at the end of the 2nd OT last year in Springfield.  It's as close as I tend to come to taking a shot at our worthy rivals; hence the ;)

OK, then. It's not my place to step on your NCAC internecine smack talk.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 12, 2005, 12:14:30 AM
QuoteIt's as close as I tend to come to taking a shot at our worthy rivals

So us other 8 are unworthy???  ??? ???

The LGs aren't going toe be pushovers. You know that, I know that, and the American people know that...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2005, 12:40:37 AM
I'm not sure how calling Witt "worthy rivals" means that Wabash et alia are "unworthy."   ???  I also did not say, suggest, or imply that Wabash (2-17 all time vs. Wooster, 1-14 since joining the NCAC) is a "pushover."  What the American people think is irrelevant.   :)

Anyway, if Witt is "worthy," wouldn't a true LG rather be "unworthy?"  Just ask Wally if he likes being considered as worthy as Witt.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 12, 2005, 08:21:26 AM
Ah, just a little poke, and a Bob Dole callback (from a stock phrase from '96 - why I remembered that I don't know...).

I had my daughter's fourth birthday party on Sunday so maybe I was a little punchy??  :D

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on December 12, 2005, 09:45:06 AM
Wow looks like a great game saturday night!!! That is one game that I have never seen and desperately want to be in attendence for sometime.  I really wanted to give my two cents on the Denison situation.  I have seen Denison this year and have one big obersvation.  One, as a team Denison is extremely unathletic.  Ghiloni is probably trying to combat his team's overall lack of athleticism by running a different offense.  The game has changed.  A team that does not have any great athlete can not win.  Look at Otterbein in the OAC this year.  They run an old style offense but do not have the athletes that are needed to be successfull this year.    In order for Denison to get to where all the Denison fans would like to be they might want to recruit a higher caliber of athlete. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldtigerfan on December 12, 2005, 10:12:59 AM
Just to set the record strait, Bill Brown recruited James Cooper very strongly.  As the Springfield News-Sun noted on Sunday, Wittenberg's academic administrators determined that James did not meet Wittenberg's academic standards.  Apparently, Wooster's academic adminstrators felt that he met their standards.  In any event, the issue was not Bill Brown's interest in James or effort to get James to Wittenberg.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on December 12, 2005, 11:56:11 AM
Here's that Article from the Springfield Paper

Cooper sinks Witt


WOOSTER — Two years ago, South High School graduate James Cooper literally pleaded with Wittenberg officials to let him attend the university and play basketball for the Tigers, but was ultimately denied because, according to administrators, he failed to meet admission standards.
As fate would have it, Cooper was then accepted at the College of Wooster and now starts for the Scots.
Saturday night at Timken Gym in front of 3,319, Cooper got his revenge, denying the No. 3 Tigers' their seven-straight win and a seat atop the North Coast Athletic Conference by sinking a 28-foot 3-pointer with 4 seconds left to give No. 2 Wooster an 86-83 victory.
"Oh yeah, it's the biggest shot of my career," said Cooper, who prolonged the Scots' season-long winning streak, which now stands at eight, including a 4-0 mark in the NCAC. "It makes it a whole lot bigger (because it came against Wittenberg). I can't even explain it to you."
After Witt's senior post Dan Russ tied the game at 83-83 with 22.4 left, Wooster coach Steve Moore decided not to call a timeout, but held one finger while Cooper had the ball.
"He has the authority to do whatever he wants to," Moore said. "Yeah, that is a lot of responsibility to give a sophomore, but we have total confidence in what James can do with the ball."
Cooper waived off a pick and looked as if he was going to penetrate, but pulled up from 28-feet and flushed it. Wittenberg coach Bill Brown looked toward the ceiling, not believing the odds of Cooper hitting the shot.
"You wouldn't expect to shoot that shot with the score tied and you only need two and both teams are in the double bonus," Brown said. "Conventional thinking would be to drive it for a foul, or challenge the officials for a foul. It was only a good shot because it went in."
The Tigers (6-1, 1-1 NCAC) had a chance to tie when the inbounds pass from senior wing Kenny Brady found freshman Gregg Hill, whose shot hit off the backboard and off the rim as the buzzer sounded.
As the students rushed the floor to hoist Cooper on their shoulders, Moore stood near the scorers' table, stunned at what just happened.
"When you have James one on one, it's hard to stop him," Moore said. "I would have liked to see the shot a little closer, but he made it, so it doesn't matter."
Prior to the shot, Wooster's biggest moment of the game was clawing back from a 20-6 first-half deficit to trail 41-40 at halftime against a Tigers team that was allowing an average of 53.5 points in their previous six games.
"That was huge for us, but we had too many turnovers," Moore said. "I would say six of our seven (total) turnovers came there in the first five minutes of the game."
Meanwhile, Witt was not hiding its strategy of exposing Wooster's smaller post players and Russ was having a field day, finishing with 33 points and seven rebounds, the second-best scoring output of his career.
The Tigers also wore out the foul line, making 22 of 23 free throws — two off the school record of 24 of 25 set in 1954 against Hiram — and shot 51 percent from the floor.
Wooster was 15 of 21 from the foul line, but the difference last night came at the 3-point line.
Wooster made 11 of 27 (40.7 percent), while Wittenberg attempted 11, making three (27.3 percent). Brown said he knew the Scots, who have now attempted 195 threes on the season, were going to shoot from outside and thought his defense did an OK job of limiting their output.
"We did a good job, well a modest job, of containing their 3-point shooters," Brown said. "They were going to get their opportunities and they did."
Cooper finished with 21 points, trumped by teammate Tom Port's 25 points. Witt senior post Dane Borchers followed Russ with 16 points and 11 rebounds for his first double-double of the season, and Tyler Howard came off the bench to score 10 points.
The Tigers also outrebounded the Scots 37-28, but turned the ball over 15 times and had Brady and Borchers in foul trouble for most of the game.
"The place that really affected us was taking Dane out of the game," Brown said. "It really impacted us a lot. He had 16 points, so not to have them out there when we wanted to was big.
"We had our chances to win it. I don't put it down just to this, but there were two loose balls in the last two minutes that we did not come up with."
Reach Lucas Sullivan at
lsullivan@coxohio.com
WITTENBERG (83) — Denbow 1-2 0-0 2, Brady 3-9 3-4 9, Borchers 4-5 8-8 16, Russ 13-24 7-7 33, Hill 2-5 0-0 4, Bowen 1-2 2-2 5, Howard 3-4 2-2 10, Hemenway 2-4 0-0 4. Totals: 29-56 22-23 83.
WOOSTER (86) — Witucky 1-6 0-2 3, Cooper 9-18 1-2 21, Van Horn 1-3 5-5 8, Port 7-15 6-6 25, Vandervaart 4-6 2-2 10, Johnson 4-7 1-2 9, Fulk 2-5 2-4 6, Will 2-4 0-2 4. Totals: 30-64 15-21 86.
Halftime: Witt 41-40. 3-pointers: Witt 3 (Bowen 1, Howard 2); Woo 11 (Witucky 1, Van Horn 1, Cooper 2, Port 5, Fulk 2). Rebounds: Witt 37 (Borchers 11); Woo 28 (Vandervaart, Will 5). Assists: Witt 10 (Denbow, Steffes, Hill 2); Woo 16 (Vandervaart 5). Turnovers: Witt 15, Woo 7. Shooting: Witt 51.8, Woo 46.9. Attendance: 3,319.

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Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 12, 2005, 12:10:23 PM
Quote from: oldtigerfan on December 12, 2005, 10:12:59 AM
Just to set the record strait, Bill Brown recruited James Cooper very strongly. As the Springfield News-Sun noted on Sunday, Wittenberg's academic administrators determined that James did not meet Wittenberg's academic standards. Apparently, Wooster's academic adminstrators felt that he met their standards. In any event, the issue was not Bill Brown's interest in James or effort to get James to Wittenberg.
OK so the record is straight.  Even though it sounds as if Witt was Cooper's #1 choice, wouldn't that make his desire to beat Witt all the more intense?  From the sounds of it, Witt's administrators slighted Cooper and Wooster gave him a chance.  That sounds like some pretty strong motivation for James to prove himself on and off the court to stick it right back at Witt.

And as for that quote of Bill Brown being taken out of context? 
Quote from: witt4ever on December 11, 2005, 06:22:39 PM
The complete quote is as follows, as reported in the News-Sun:

"You wouldn't expect  to shoot that shot with the score tied and you only need two and both teams are in the double bonus," Brown said. "Conventionally thinking would be to drive it for a foul, or challenge the officials for a foul. It was only a good shot because it went in".
With the way the officials were calling that game, I wouldn't want to count on them calling anything if in fact Cooper would have tried to drive and draw a foul call.  Not to mention Russ and Borchers were just waiting for Cooper to come in so they could reject the shot, which they had already done on more than one occasion in that game.  Also, as was noted earlier, I don't feel it was that bad of a shot because the score was tied.  Had it not gone in, the game was going to OT.  If Wooster were trailing by one or two points, then maybe I wouldn't have been so high on the shot selection.  But that wasn't the case.  Bottom line is that Bowen was giving Cooper the shot, as evidenced by the picture, and Cooper took it, bad shot or not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 12, 2005, 01:02:52 PM
I just want to add my two cents to what everyone else has said about the Big Red.

I was at the Bluffton game and the Denison players look like they don't even want to be there.  There is no enthusiasm,  I have seen more smiles at a funeral.  What happened to this team??  Who cut our their heart??  From where I sat there is no pulse on this team.

They loose one starter from last year and they look like they have never played the game.

What kind of offense is Ghiloni trying to run??  He has guys running into each other.  They have 17 turnovers in the first half.  They play like deer in your headlights.  They are totally clueless.  It was hard to watch.

What is Hodgkinson doing on the top of the key???  And now they don't start Hern.  Can someone please explain the logic behind that move.

Then he plays EVERYONE.  He has guys on the floor at the same time that CAN NOT SCORE!!  I am very confused.  Is this gym class 101?

I was very excited for this season given the fine finish they had last year but they played the same Bluffton team they lost to by 4 points last year and this year they get blown out. 

I don't profess to know how to coach a team but I sure as heck would not have Hodgkinson on the perimeter shooting threes.  Get him under the basket and give him the ball. 

Teams don't have to worry about the Big Red.  They arel already defeated.

Wabash by 40!!  That is not meant as a joke.  That is fact.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 12, 2005, 01:15:07 PM
I only saw the shot once, live, but I don't believe it was a 28-footer.  I'd guess it was more like 24 or 25.  And, he was basically wide open, the defender having backed off to guard against a penetration attempt.  The old chastity belt defense.

I'd bet that Cooper (or any very good outside shooter) would make that shot no worse than 1 in 3, and probably closer to 40 or 45 per cent of the time, given the open look that he had.  I'll take that any time under the tie game circumstance for the following reasons:

1. On a miss, there was enough time left for a possible offensive followup, aided by the increased chance of a long rebound due to the long shot.

2. Also on a miss, Wittenberg would have had to clear a very clean rebound, very quickly, to even throw up a bad shot for the win.

3. With the make, Wittenberg could only hope for a tie, unless a Wooster player had been silly enough to foul a three-point attempt.

Plus, going to the hoop in the final seconds is a very risky procedure.  Most referees seem to shrink from the idea of calling even legitimate fouls at that point, adhering to the ridiculous adages of "let them play" or "let the players determine the outcome".  The rules of the game should not change due to the amount of time on the clock, but in my experience they all too often do.  Probably better to take the open shot if it's offered to you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2005, 01:21:12 PM
Quote from: blindwatchmaker on December 12, 2005, 11:56:11 AM
Here's that Article from the Springfield Paper

Cooper sinks Witt


WOOSTER — Two years ago, South High School graduate James Cooper literally pleaded with Wittenberg officials to let him attend the university and play basketball for the Tigers, but was ultimately denied because, according to administrators, he failed to meet admission standards.
As fate would have it, Cooper was then accepted at the College of Wooster and now starts for the Scots.
Saturday night at Timken Gym in front of 3,319, Cooper got his revenge, denying the No. 3 Tigers' their seven-straight win and a seat atop the North Coast Athletic Conference by sinking a 28-foot 3-pointer with 4 seconds left to give No. 2 Wooster an 86-83 victory.

First, I think that first sentence stinks.  Whether James Cooper's application met Wittenberg's lofty admissions standards  ::) is irrelevant to the analysis of the game.  It's just a cheap way to play the academic card, and it's bush league.

Second, now the shot is 28 feet?  It just keeps getting longer and longer.  Maybe Greg Sager's comment --
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 11, 2005, 08:19:11 PM
DC, the unexpected is not necessarily the good. After all, he could've shot it from midcourt, too. That would've been unexpected. ;)
-- will turn out to be right after all.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 12, 2005, 01:44:55 PM
QuoteFirst, I think that first sentence stinks.  Whether James Cooper's application met Wittenberg's lofty admissions standards   is irrelevant to the analysis of the game.  It's just a cheap way to play the academic card, and it's bush league.

Agreed, 100%.  I was going to comment on that in my last post, but forgot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopsfan1111 on December 12, 2005, 02:02:13 PM
Quote from: blindwatchmaker on December 12, 2005, 11:56:11 AM

WOOSTER — Two years ago, South High School graduate James Cooper literally pleaded with Wittenberg officials to let him attend the university and play basketball for the Tigers, but was ultimately denied because, according to administrators, he failed to meet admission standards.




"Literally pleaded with"...according to who??? Bill Brown?? It sure does look better for Coach Brown if he lost such a great person and basketball player like Coop to Wooster because of "academics/admissions" rather than any fault on his part.  Maybe Cooper did actually WANT to attend Wooster. I am not really sure what this has to do with this Wooster/Witt game anyway, and in my personal opinion it was in poor taste for the paper to print it.  The issue is that Witt didn't get Cooper, too bad for them ;) Lucky for Woo  ;D  The reasons why are not important, especially when it might come down to something personal like grades, etc.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on December 12, 2005, 03:00:19 PM
Wonder if the Daily record caught wind of Springfield article as they have a recruiting blurb on Brandon Johnson that states:

"A graduate from Groveport Madison High in the Columbus area, Johnson was heavily recruited by both the Scots and Tigers.  He not only burned Wittenberg on Saturday night, but during the recruiting process as well. 'Wooster has more genuine people' he said.  'There's a great tradition here. I just like it better'."

Daily Record- page C4, 12-12-2005

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on December 12, 2005, 03:07:08 PM
I know its early in the season but I wonder what Wooster's SOSI would be compared to some of the other top 10 teams.  The likes of Oberlin and Westminster, along with potential future games with Suny Maritime and W&J won't help.  The Stout game along with Witt, and future games against BW and College of NJ will... any thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 12, 2005, 03:12:04 PM
I never, ever, would have thought Witt would play the academic card over Wooster or anyone else in the NCAC!

(I think it's ludicrious to play the academic card amongst the NCAC itself - it's not like the schools admit anything with a pulse and a jump shot.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 12, 2005, 03:52:21 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 12, 2005, 03:12:04 PM
(I think it's ludicrious to play the academic card amongst the NCAC itself - it's not like the schools admit anything with a pulse and a jump shot.)

Certainly not at Oberlin!  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on December 12, 2005, 04:27:06 PM
   "Bill Brown recruited James Cooper very strongly.  As the Springfield News-Sun noted on Sunday, Wittenberg's academic administrators determined that James did not meet Wittenberg's academic standards. " Bill Brown's comment sounds like sour grapes and was bush league as others have pointed out.
   In the US News rankings of America's Best Colleges The College of Wooster comes in at #68 in the First Tier behind Oberlin, Kenyon, Denison, and Wabash in the NCAC. Wittenberg isn't ranked. They do not  recieve a ranking until the Third Tier.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 12, 2005, 04:33:08 PM
I disappear for a day and look at all the fun I miss.

Nice article by the Springfield paper.  Is there seriously a paper that reports the facts?  What a joke!  What are the chances that reporter has any idea what he's talking about in reference to Coop "pleading" to be let into Witt?  And I thought the Daily Record was bad.

Sorry, DC, but the picture of Coop's trey was not courtesy of Matt Dilyard either, just to let you know.

I think it was actually a good shot and it caught everyone by surprise, which was a good thing.  Witt's defense had no time to react, because everyone in the gym thought he was going to drive it.  BTW, I'm sure all the Wooster fans can vouch that Coop has pulled up before from deep when he had a one-on-one opportunity and nailed the shot.  He did it against Wis.-Stout shortly before the first half ended I believe.

One last thing, the NCAC Player of the Week came out, and lo and behold, neither Woo nor Witt gets the nod.  Hiram's T.C. Spencer gets it for 33 points on 14-of-19 shooting from the floor in a loss to Bluffton and a win over Oberlin.  Huh?

Russ goes for 44 points on 18-of-32 shooting in a win over Cedarville and a loss to Woo and he doesn't get it?

Coop connects on the game-winner against Witt and hits for 36 points on 15-of-28 shooting in the Scots two wins and he doesn't get it?

And finally, Matt Majzlik paces Allegheny with 46 points on 22-of-39 shooting and 20 boards in a win over Westminster and a loss to OWU and he doesn't get it?

I'm all about sharing and the like, but what's the point in having an award when the most deserving people don't have a shot at receving it?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2005, 04:53:23 PM
Quote from: waterboy on December 12, 2005, 04:33:08 PM
Sorry, DC, but the picture of Coop's trey was not courtesy of Matt Dilyard either, just to let you know.

I didn't feel it was right to use the photo without attribution.  I took it from the Wooster website, where the photo was uncredited; but the site's general photography credit was to Matt.  If Matt was not the photographer, and you know who was, I wish you'd post it.  Why keep it a secret?

Another thing from the News-Sun article caught my eye;
Quote from: blindwatchmaker on December 12, 2005, 11:56:11 AM
After Witt's senior post Dan Russ tied the game at 83-83 with 22.4 left, Wooster coach Steve Moore decided not to call a timeout, but held one finger while Cooper had the ball.
"He has the authority to do whatever he wants to," Moore said. "Yeah, that is a lot of responsibility to give a sophomore, but we have total confidence in what James can do with the ball."
This isn't the first place I've seen reference made to Steve's not calling a timeout.  I wasn't keeping track personally, but based on Mike Breckinridge's call of the game on WQKT, I don't believe Wooster had any timeouts left to call.  To me, that makes the final play even more remarkable.  Here's Cooper with the ball, knowing that there will be no timeout to draw up a play, and Steve Moore telling the team to more or less stand back and let Coop do "whatever he wants."  I and others have mentioned that it was a no-lose situation (hit the shot and win or miss it and go OT), but that's not true.  With 20+ seconds left and the game entirely in Cooper's hands, any number of things could have gone wrong.  It seems to me that he kept his head, decided what his best option was (drive the lane), then correctly diagnosed that the defense would not allow that, adjusted, got an open look, and won the game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on December 12, 2005, 05:15:20 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 12, 2005, 03:12:04 PM
I never, ever, would have thought Witt would play the academic card over Wooster or anyone else in the NCAC!

(I think it's ludicrious to play the academic card amongst the NCAC itself - it's not like the schools admit anything with a pulse and a jump shot.)

Couldn't have said it better myself, smedindy--nothing more than Brown trying to justify a loss of both a player and a game with a less than "genuine" comment.  Interestingly, you've never heard Woo, or any other NCAC school for that matter, pull the "academic" card after losing to Witt--

So you're saying James Cooper couldn't get into Witt, and somehow snuck into Wooster.   Maybe it's time to contact certain people in Springfield about this nice piece of property I've got for sale in Florida ;)

As Brandon Johnson told the Wooster paper--"People are more genuine here [at Woo]"--hmm ???  What would drive him to make a comment like that?  

It brings into focus why players like Brandon Johnson and James Cooper choose Woo over Witt.  And I for one am glad that Witt will see Cooper AT LEAST 5 more times in his career and Johnson 7.


Great game Sat--great rivalry--can't wait until Feb. 4th--

GO SCOTS!!!!





Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2005, 05:30:24 PM
FWIW, the News-Sun article does not attribute the he-wasn't-admittable quote to Bill Brown; instead it is unnamed "administrators."  I both hope and believe that Bill Brown would not say something like that to the media.  Despite the rough time he sometimes gets in here, I believe he is a class act. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 12, 2005, 06:05:24 PM
If I read much more about Wooster and Wittenberg I think I might consider myself an expert at a game i wasn't even at.   ;)   

BillyPilgram-  U alive out there?

Billy just sent in our tickets to the Depauw game on Dec 21st at Conseco looks like we will be rolling 7 deep.  I highly suggest anyone near by to make the trip to indy.

Second of all... what are you're out takes on Earlham Season so far... Seems to be a little rocky, but stable. 

Nice to see the starting backcourt for Earlham... Tyler Stewart and LeRon Henry  23 out of 37 from 3-POINT LAND.  That is an outstanding 62% from beyond the arc. 

I think it is time for Brandon Miller and Nick Welsh to Step it up going into the NCAC games. (and if they do lets hope Jewett,Henry, and Stewart keep doing what they are doing)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 12, 2005, 06:19:23 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 12, 2005, 05:30:24 PM
FWIW, the News-Sun article does not attribute the he-wasn't-admittable quote to Bill Brown; instead it is unnamed "administrators." I both hope and believe that Bill Brown would not say something like that to the media. Despite the rough time he sometimes gets in here, I believe he is a class act.

DC,

I agree in that I highly doubt  Bill Brown was behind that rediculous statement regarding James Cooper pleading with the academic administrators of Wittenberg to let him attend.  I too find it laughable that is the excuse being given as to why Cooper didn't attend Witt?!  As if Witt's academic standards are now suddenly more strict than those of Wooster, because, heaven forbid, a star athlete would actually choose Wooster over Wittenberg!!! :o  And especially when that star player is from right there in Springfield! 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldtigerfan on December 12, 2005, 06:36:22 PM
Thank you David Collinge!  I also think it is highly unlikely that Bill Brown was the souce for the News-Sun.  I was not trying to embarass James Cooper or insult Wooster's academic reputation.  All I was trying to do is to defend Bill Brown against those who claimed that he did not try to get James Cooper to attend Wittenberg.  It was a fantastic game in a series of fantastic games between two good schools and great coaches.  Why do people have to turn it into a personal attack on Bill Brown.  James Cooper is at Wooster not because Bill Brown failed; that is my only point in my recent post.

Bill Brown and Steve Moore are great coaches, good recruiters, and quality human beings.  Wittenberg wishes some players that go to Wooster would come to Witt; I assume Wooster would love to have some of Wittenberg's players.

Saturday's game was a very interesting matchup between a team with great post play and a team with great outside play.  Why not talk about that rather than try to run down coaches who deserve better.  Once again, thank you David Collinge and you other Wooster fans who stick to the game.  I enjoy reading what you have to say.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 12, 2005, 07:21:52 PM
I do think that often rivalries extend beyond just the game, so I understand the desire to comment on matters such as how the papers covered it, etc.

I don't know who took the photo of Cooper that has come to define his shot- I'm a good friend of the student photographer who was at the game shooting pics for the college student newspaper, and he said that Matt Dilyard wasn't in a position where he could've taken that shot.  My friend guesses that it was The Daily Record photographer who shared the photo with our Sports Info Director.  I have not seen any atribution of the photo.

I think it goes without saying that Wooster and Wittenburg are going to recruit some of the same basketball players- Witt wins some, Woo wins some.

I also want to go on record, as a Wooster fan who was at the game, of giving credit to Coach Brown and his players for their conduct at the end of the game.  Russ in particular walked out into the court, weaving his way through some of the mob even, to reach Wooster players and congratulate them on a well-played game.  I hope the Wooster guys made sure to congratulate him, as well, for his top-quality performance.  Russ really impressed me as a class-act with that gesture at the end the game, especially since he must have felt dejected to lose after the quality effort he put in.

One thing more- when we get around to tournament time, here's to hoping that these two teams aren't placed in the same region as they were last year- having been to the final four with the Scots three years ago, I know the game I watched on Saturday was easily of a NCAA regional or Final Four caliber.  Seeding these two such that a matchup would happen in the first two rounds would be a mistake, and would lead to deserving teams being eliminated too early from the dance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on December 12, 2005, 07:53:20 PM
I'm sorry fellas.  I have been laughing my ass off ever since I read the post about Coop not gettin into Witt, and had to comment.  I think this is the first time ANYONE has ever claimed witt to be higher academically than Woo!  Amazing, especially since I know some people that went to Witt to play athletics who didn't make the cut for Woo.  Apparently Witt holds its bball program to higher standards than its other teams and/or rest of the student body.  I can't help but think there just may be some kind of truth behind the favorite Wooster Band chant, "It's all right, It's okay, You're gonna work for us someday!" ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 12, 2005, 09:44:23 PM
"One thing more- when we get around to tournament time, here's to hoping that these two teams aren't placed in the same region as they were last year- having been to the final four with the Scots three years ago, I know the game I watched on Saturday was easily of a NCAA regional or Final Four caliber.  Seeding these two such that a matchup would happen in the first two rounds would be a mistake, and would lead to deserving teams being eliminated too early from the dance. "

I have already been thinking about this. Why limit this arguement to Wooster and Wittenberg. Look at the latest poll, (IWU, Wooster, Witt, Albion, and Hope )all in the top eight. There is going to be second round killer matchup no matter how the NCAA positions these teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 12, 2005, 09:49:07 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on December 12, 2005, 07:21:52 PM
.......  Seeding these two such that a matchup would happen in the first two rounds would be a mistake, and would lead to deserving teams being eliminated too early from the dance.


That NEVER happens in the Great Lakes Region.......nope  never!

Seeing Wooster/Albion in round 2 last year........then JCU, Calvin and Albion in the Sweet 16 all on one court.  Its ridiculous to even think there is more than one quality team in this region capable of reaching Salem.     >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 12, 2005, 09:50:08 PM
Yes, Earlhamalum....I am alive, just arrived back from Evanston to visit the family for the holidays.

I've been out of touch with the Quakers of late...I haven't been able to listen, because Teamline won't work on my sister's computer. Thankfully, Al Gore's greatest innovation will stretch out from James Dean's grave through the corn fields to my parents' home. I never could have read about James Cooper's 22, 24, 26 or 74 foot shot without.

Wooster/Witt games tend to overshadow all else on the board (and for good reason), but the most interesting posts I've reviewed have been those about Denison. Oh my, a great deal can change in one year. With all the Big Red bashing, I'm surprised no one has mentioned what in my mind was the major problem for Denison (last year, and I'm assuming on into this season)....namely, they can't play a lick of defense. Until that ever gets resolved, they can play all 15 of their rotation at once and they still aren't going to compete with the upper tier of the league.

It's a little bit of a slow stretch ahead for Earlham with finals ending and a gaggle (isn't that four?) of non-conference games ahead, highlighted by the DePauw game at Conseco. I'm definitely looking forward to the Indy trip and I'm recommending BW3's between the game, rather than the customary owl infested spot. Remember....at least one fiancee will be present. ;)

As for fretting about the play of individuals, I'm least worried about Brandon Miller. I'll take 18 and 11, like he had against Kenyon, every night. Plus, his numbers always seem to be up against conference opponents. I don't think Welsh like Tomisch Arena, as evidenced by his 2/11 on Saturday. Last season, he was ejected for a flagrant foul in the final minutes of Earlham's win there. Maybe he'll have better luck in Gambier next season.

Earlhamalum, what are you doing on the 19th? Any thoughts of heading to Richmond together to catch up and watch the game against Franklin?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 12, 2005, 10:28:11 PM
New Top 25 D3Hoops poll is out this evening.

We have to give the Top 25 voters some credit because they did not penalize Witt for their close loss to Wooster.  :)

Top 5 teams are unchanged this week with Wooster at #2 and Witt still coming in at #3 in the poll. :)  Wooster received one #1 vote this week, Amherst also got one #1 vote and the remaining 23 #1 votes went to Illinois Wesleyan.

Wisconsin Stout, now 7-1 with their only loss to Wooster, moved up 10 spots to #12 in the poll.  Baldwin-Wallace, a future Wooster opponent at the Mose Hole tourney, moved up 3 spots to #18.

John Carroll is back in the Top 25 this week at #24 and the Blue Streaks are now 6-1.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bigkrapper on December 12, 2005, 10:56:15 PM
A few comments about the academics
-- The whole academic card, seriously amazing that a newspaper would write garbage like that.  Of course, i have little faith in most newspapers!  However, it is kind of convenient that the source is just a "university official."  Don't you think if you wanted to add credibility to your point/story you would want to have a named source, unless there was reason you couldn't be named (For example, Deepthroat)...HMMMMM it has gotta make you wonder though.  And let's be careful about the whole giving Coach Brown credit for being so respectful after the game.  He does have a bit of a track record of displaying a completely different behavior (rather disrespectful) to Wooster players, coaches, scorekeepers, and fans. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2005, 11:03:44 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 12, 2005, 10:28:11 PM
We have to give the Top 25 voters some credit because they did not penalize Witt for their close loss to Wooster.  :)

I give the voters a lot of credit.  Witt acually slipped by about one position on the average ballot (-24 points), but they had a 50-point edge on #4 Amherst last week and the Lord Jeffs were not able to close the gap (now 6 points).  The average voter has Witt in the #4 position.  Wooster's gain was just 10 points, but there wasn't a lot of upside available.  The Scots are now a near-unanimous #2, appearing at that spot on at least 21 of the 25 ballots.

Another big gainer this week was Van Wie Classic invitee St. Thomas, who gained 62 points and are just 3 points off the bottom of the poll.  This gain was the result of their demolition of then-#11 Gustavus Adolphus, which lost a whopping 269 points and 16 places in the poll.

The Great Lakes Region now claims 4 of the top 8 positions, and has three conferences with two teams each in the top 25.  Not bad.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 13, 2005, 12:04:58 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 12, 2005, 11:03:44 PM
The Great Lakes Region now claims 4 of the top 8 positions, and has three conferences with two teams each in the top 25.  Not bad.  :)

Don't go getting overly modest on us - the Great Lakes has 4 of the top 7!

And if the GL and Midwest get paired again, they have 6 of the top 8, and 11 in the top 25!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 13, 2005, 12:16:30 AM
Mr. Ypsi -- good point.

If the NCAA tourney selection committee once again uses the need to minimize travel costs as the key factor for setting brackets, we could have an absolutely brutal sectional this year (example: Illinois Wesleyan, Wooster, Wittenberg and Hope all in the same sectional)!  >:(

Let's hope that they balance the sectional brackets better this year but I am not counting on it!  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2005, 12:34:53 AM
Keep in mind that the tournament field has expanded to 59 teams.  I think the days of having a sectional with Wooster, Wittenberg, Albion, and JCU all crammed together are gone.  Now we can look forward to a sectional with Wooster, Wittenberg, Albion, JCU, Hope, B-W, Calvin, Bethany, Behrend, ....   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 13, 2005, 12:52:17 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 13, 2005, 12:34:53 AM
Keep in mind that the tournament field has expanded to 59 teams.  I think the days of having a sectional with Wooster, Wittenberg, Albion, and JCU all crammed together are gone.  Now we can look forward to a sectional with Wooster, Wittenberg, Albion, JCU, Hope, B-W, Calvin, Bethany, Behrend, ....   :D

Just as long as IWU isn't in there!  I think we're on our way to earning a sectional with CalTech, Maine Maritime.... Or at least with Dewey, Cheatam, and Howe!

PLEASE no more second round games with #2 Hanover or #2 WashU (it's usually just not fair to Hanover or WashU!! - though Hanover certainly put the kibosh to that LAST year - perhaps the problem was they weren't ranked high enough). :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 13, 2005, 09:35:42 AM
Just posing a question.

Does anyone really know if Cooper even applied to Witt?

You can't get rejected if you don't apply.

It'd be pretty funny if everything everyone has argued about over the past couple days was not even an issue to begin with.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 13, 2005, 10:28:49 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 13, 2005, 12:16:30 AM
If the NCAA tourney selection committee once again uses the need to minimize travel costs as the key factor for setting brackets, we could have an absolutely brutal sectional this year (example: Illinois Wesleyan, Wooster, Wittenberg and Hope all in the same sectional)!  >:(
Until the NCAA proves otherwise, I'm not going to hold my breat and think that it will be any different.  BTW, those 4 you listed would make for an epic FINAL FOUR, and yet we might have to settle for an epic SECTIONAL. ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 11:12:59 AM
This poll is a joke.  We crushed witten****.  Their guards are terrible, thats why they never go far in the tourny, and never will.   There #20 at best
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on December 13, 2005, 11:18:06 AM
QuoteA few comments about the academics
-- The whole academic card, seriously amazing that a newspaper would write garbage like that.  Of course, i have little faith in most newspapers!  However, it is kind of convenient that the source is just a "university official."  Don't you think if you wanted to add credibility to your point/story you would want to have a named source, unless there was reason you couldn't be named (For example, Deepthroat)...HMMMMM it has gotta make you wonder though.  And let's be careful about the whole giving Coach Brown credit for being so respectful after the game.  He does have a bit of a track record of displaying a completely different behavior (rather disrespectful) to Wooster players, coaches, scorekeepers, and fans.

Well, well, well, nothing like a good Witt-Woo game to get things stirred up.  First of all, whoever wrote that post has never been in a heated rivalry before.  Have you never said something you didn't mean?  Ever gotten lost in a competitive moment?  And what are this track record you speak of?   I played in 11 Witt-Woo games and don't really remember anything horrible, outside of an isolated shouting match.  Either something happened that I don't know about or someone has some very thin skin.  I know Coach Brown can get fired up, but he has the utmost respect for Wooster's program.  How could you not? 

The big question to me is why was it played so early in the year?  What made the schedule change.  In years past the first Witt-Woo game wasn't played until late January.  I think that playing the game this early adversly affected the Tigers, because of their lack of ecperience at the wing.  Wooster is very deep on the perimeter, and Witt is playing with a new group of people.  Witt had trouble  dealing with the pressure Wooster's perimeter players were putting on them.  We couldn't even look to throw the ball inside because the pressure was so good.  But when it did get inside, Russ and Borchers had a field day.  I can't wait until Feb. 4th.

You also have to give credit to Wooster's players for playing so hard.  Not that Witt didn't play hard, but the loose balls that Woo came up with late in the game were what lead to Cooper's bomb.  That kid has some serious stones to can a shot like that.  That was incredible.   

Another observation: watching a Witt-Woo game in unbearable.  I thought I was going to have an aneurysm.  Playing wasn't anywhere close to being as stressfull.  I don't know if I'll be able to handle another one of those. 

Well, thats all from my end.  My first Witt-Woo game as a spectator didn't go as I would have liked it, but thats why we play twice.  Oh and to the kid who sits behind the scorer's table, your suits will never even come close to looking as good as Coach T's.  GO TIGERS!!   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on December 13, 2005, 11:20:59 AM
Quote from: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 11:12:59 AM
This poll is a joke. We crushed witten****. Their guards are terrible, thats why they never go far in the tourny, and never will. There #20 at best

Wow, what class.  I also like the "Sh*t on Witt" cheer. I thought it was clever.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 11:29:25 AM
At least we cheered. Your fans looked asleep. Maybe that is why your team couldn't get anything up besides your big guy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 11:34:30 AM
witt hasn't fielded a decent team in the last 5 years.  They act like there a premier program but every year they choke.  There coach dress's like a clown, and there players are about as atheltic as wooster dance team.  Also, any retard could get in their school, that is why they all make subs for a living after they graduate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 13, 2005, 11:48:03 AM
Wow, Wooman, you make Witt sound like Hiram (no offense Terriers).

You may want to touch up the spelling and the grammar, lest you be proof that Wooster is lowering its academic standards recently.  ;)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 13, 2005, 12:11:55 PM
Wooman,

I think you need to chill out.  Witt is a premier Div. III program.  No one with any genuine basketball knowledge would deny that.  You don't get 1,500-plus wins by magic chief (which is also 200 more than Wooster I might add). 

They haven't fielded a decent team in 5 years, eh?  Well, that's funny considering they beat Wooster twice last year and have practically owned the regular season series over the past five years, not to mention beating numerous ranked teams and making the NCAA Tournament year in and year out. 

BTW, I doubt Pete Walker is making subs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 12:30:33 PM
pete walker, ha.  I remember that joker.  Your right, he's probably picking up my recycle bin every Tuesday, since his fellow alumni could not get him on at subway.  Witt makes the tourney then proceeds to lose in the first round year in and year out. Yeah, it's a real stellar program.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2005, 12:38:41 PM
If you look at WooMan's email address, I think you'll see he has some issues he needs to work out.   ::)

I wish those of us who look at this great rivalry with mutual respect for its participants could drown out those who refuse to leave the well-worn, tiresome (and generally inaccurate) academic card alone.

Pete, always good to have you here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 13, 2005, 12:48:09 PM
I'm starting to feel the love in here.  Maybe with Wooman1 around my post will get some Positive Karma.  :)

Petewitt54- I don't think scheduling has anything to do with it.  Both those teams circle those dates when the schedule comes out.  Heck I never liked playing Wittenberg Two Wednesday in a RoW (exception when we took TWO from Witt 99-00), but I believe we played them back to back Wed. all four years.

Try to say PETEWITT four times really fast... starts to sound like BEAT WITT.

Billypilgram-  I will keep in mind about going to Richmond on Monday the 19th.  If all works out i'd love to make the trip with you.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 12:51:47 PM
David, is skinny dick Pete your idol.  That kid may have been the weakest player I have ever played against in my life.  A pathetic excuse for a big man.  Also, I am glad you appreciate my email address, feel free to email any time.  I love being amused by the dim wits at Wittenberg. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 12:55:11 PM
I forget, when was the last time witt made the final four?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 13, 2005, 01:09:19 PM
Wooman#1 do you have issues you want to talk about... we as a board can help you through this tough time.  Grow up and stop acting so Ignorant.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 13, 2005, 01:35:40 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 12, 2005, 12:40:37 AM
I'm not sure how calling Witt "worthy rivals" means that Wabash et alia are "unworthy."   ???  I also did not say, suggest, or imply that Wabash (2-17 all time vs. Wooster, 1-14 since joining the NCAC) is a "pushover."  What the American people think is irrelevant.   :)

Anyway, if Witt is "worthy," wouldn't a true LG rather be "unworthy?"  Just ask Wally if he likes being considered as worthy as Witt.  :D

Sorry...I'm a little late to this dance.  While I have a sizeable loathing for all things Wittenberg (although not to the extent that I'm going to register expletive-laden email addresses about them), it isn't necessarily bad for Wabash to be compared to Witt with respect to basketball.  Witt's been a top-tier team nationally for a few years running now...it would be nice for Wabash to get back to that level. 

While on the short end of the scoreboard more often than not, I think Wabash has represented themselves well against Witt and Wooster in recent years.  If Wabash can keep from getting slaughtered on the boards, I think they'll have a decent shot to knock Witt off.  Beating Wooster will have a lot to do with whether or not the Scots are shooting well.  If the Scots are draining threes, nobody can beat them.  If not, everybody has a chance.  That's the nature of a perimeter team. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on December 13, 2005, 01:38:52 PM
Wow Wooman.  You really must take a chill pill and relax.  Do you know ANYTHING about the Woo-Witt rivalry?  Here is a nice little link that the good people at woo have prepared for people like you:

http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2005-06/woo-witt_rivalry.pdf

Is it not interesting that Wittenberg is printed under the Win column a number of times?  Better yet, at the bottom of the list, it gives the records.  I will type them out for you, in case your ignorance prevents you from using the link:

Witt leads the series at 47-38
At woo its tied, 20-20
At Witt, witt leads 26-16
Woo leads at neutral sites 2-1
The longest winning streak against the other is tied, at eight years each.

On the wins list, Witt is #1 with 1505 and woo is second with 1395.

I went to Witts web page and they finished third in 1994 in the DIII tourny, just as Woo did in 2003.  Of course, Witt HAS won a national championship.  Woo has not, though this will hopefully be remedied in the near future.

Wooman, these are just a few facts that apparently, you never thought of.  I am a Wooster fan.  And I HATE Wittenberg.  But I do give credit where it is due.  For you to say Witt is a **** program, shows just how smart you are.  Also, you may want to pay attention to who you are calling out on this page.  I don't know, maybe you can't read well.  But I think if you could you would realize that David Colligne is a Woo fan.

Also, an interesting note at the bottom is that Coach Moore was best man to Coach Brown.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 01:45:08 PM
I remember when Walker was a senior. In the alternate universe he lived in, he thought he was Jordan, when in reality he was a glorified Shawn Bradly. D'oh!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 01:48:44 PM
just like shawn bradley, skinny and worthless
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 13, 2005, 01:55:50 PM
Most local Wooster people probably already know of this, but I just found out.  This Saturday and Sunday, The College of Wooster will be hosting a high school basketball festival.  It will be culminated on Sunday with COW vs Westminster.  Ticket prices are $7 for a single-day pass, and only $10 for a two-day pass. The schedule follows as copied from The Daily Record:

On Saturday, the schedule will feature Wooster vs. Medina (1 p.m.), Northwestern vs. Lutheran West (2:45), Dalton vs. Clear Fork (4:30), Waynedale vs. CVCA (6:15) and Triway vs. Mentor (8).

On Sunday, fixtures will include Orrville vs. Loudonville (2 p.m.), Zanesville vs. Lakewood St. Edward (3:45) and The College of Wooster vs. Westminster (6).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 01:59:34 PM
I hear Wittenberg hosts an annual Wabash sausage fest with Walker as the hostess.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on December 13, 2005, 02:01:06 PM
Are you in self denial there Wooman?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on December 13, 2005, 02:01:27 PM
Or are you just upset you weren't invited?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 02:05:44 PM
As much as I like a goodlooking man. Walker is not on my list. Yum Yum!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 13, 2005, 02:11:53 PM
I know this is off topic, but will ask anyway.

I'm seriously considering a trip to Fort Meyers, FL in mid-March to watch the Wooster baseball team on their spring trip.  I've never been to Florida, let alone Fort Meyers, and was wondering if any of you Wooster posters have ever made the trip.  If so, what did you think of it, and can you tell me anything about inexpensive accomodations?

Reply here on in private to my email address.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2005, 02:12:20 PM
The tournament WooBoo mentions is being held in honor/memory of legendary Orrville HS coach Steve Smith, who passed away this spring (I'm doing this from memory, as the Daily Record webpage seems to be down.)  He also served as an assistant at the College and was close to many of the players.  Among the high school teams participating, besides (obviously) Orrville, are the alma maters of three of Wooster's current players, Wooster HS (Brad Chisnell), Loudonville (Andy Van Horn), and Zanesville (Kyle Witucky.)  It should be a great two days of hoops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 13, 2005, 02:13:42 PM
ok. well obviously its pretty pathetic that you cant find anything better to do in your spare time than post onhere all day. pete walker may be whatever you "think"he is but the facts are that witt has been competitive with wooster as proven by us beat them numerous times-if we're so ****ty how do we come into your gym and beat you guys-yeah i guess you're right we are ****-but then what does that make you guys-witten'****s ****?    you must have nothing to do all day besides waiting for your 5-10 shift at the local kroger as a cart boy-pushing the ppl who actually have good jobs during the days carts back in the building

sorry i was so late with my response to the game-i know you all missed me. i unfortuantely was not in attendance and regret it. yet another classic game-hands off to witt and wooster for winning the game, this shows the epitamy of division 3 basketball.

on to the cooper issue. i do have to wonder about witt supposedly turning down cooper. if he was turned down by witt, then why would he get in wooster. i think as rumored last year on this forum that he wasn't even recruited by wittenberg AT ALL!!!!!!!! look at some of the ppl that get into witt that are in my classes and its laughable to suggest that a star athlete couldnt get in here. but then again u look at the springfield city schools and then second guess yourself.

thoughts are welcome on comments (except wooman cuz no one cares what he thinks)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 13, 2005, 02:26:43 PM
Thank you pennstghs.  Good points from all around and I concur with every one of them.  From what I've heard from RELIABLE sources, Coop didn't even apply to Witt, so therefore, he had no need to plead to be let in.  Frankly, the Springfield paper should be held liable for their article which demeans both Wooster as an academic institution and Cooper as a student-athlete.  If there is no retraction or formal apology, I believe it may allow a party to sue, though I am not entirely sure of the legal implications.

Second, Wooman, you're an idiot.  There is no way you could have played at Wooster because of all the former players I've met, none of them were as big as pricks as you.  Pete Walker was an All-NCAC honoree and 1,000-point scorer for a reason-he was damn good.  I'm not saying he was outstanding and I wouldn't say he is as good as I think Russ is, but he was a quality player and he gave his heart to each and every game.  You obviously have no idea what you are talking about and should leave the D3 post up board to the grown ups.

Thirdly, the high school tournament at Woo should prove to be quite entertaining this weekend.  There are several big-time recruits, including a 6-10 kid from Lutheran West who is headed to Illinois.  All the games appear to be good match ups and judging from last year's event, will prove to be excellent games. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 13, 2005, 02:33:25 PM
It's too bad that we don't have some sort of Terms of Service agreement in place to keep the posting somewhat reasonable...oh wait.  We do.  Cut it out already. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 02:48:30 PM
Okay okay okay, Witt is good and so is Wooster and we all feel bad that Pete can't get a job at Subway, but that is what you get for smelling urinal cakes all through college. If a player or former player is going to post on D3hoops, he posts at his own risk. That is the way it has always been.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on December 13, 2005, 02:59:18 PM
For the last time, it wasn't Subway.  Taco Bell turned me down.  If you're going to make fun of me at least get it right. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 03:06:06 PM
Yeah Pete, I have heard that Taco Bell is the only company that will send representatives to Witt Career Fairs. Bummer you didn't get hired. I hear you get a great discount on the Nacho Supreme!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 13, 2005, 03:23:13 PM
Pete -

I wouldn't feel so bad about being turned down by Taco Bell. But it could have been worse, you could be WooMan's proofreader! Low pay, long hours!

The smarmy one would remind folks to stop playing academic cards within the NCAC, because there are plenty of other nearby conferences that we can annoy with our academic cards.

;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 03:58:59 PM
We must have an NCAC nerd on the board. You realize this isn't D3debateclub.com. Plus, this is basketball. Most of these guys have to remind themselves to breath. Except at Wabash because guys at Wabash do it harder.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 13, 2005, 04:02:56 PM
Ah, but this is a discussion board, and it would be nice if discussions were had, and not insults rife with misspellings, poor grammar, and the lack of a cohesive arguement.

If you want to sling insults, create your own site. Some of us would actually like to talk basketball here, ya know.

And when you can have Wabash and Wooster posters recoil from your treatment of Wittenberg, then you know you've gone way too far.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 04:19:43 PM
Smedindy,

Let's talk basketball! I read an article that Wabash fans started to chant "over-rated" when they played Illinois Wesleyan earlier this year. The problem was it was 25 minutes before the game and when the dust had cleared, IWU had solidly defeated Wabash. This is definitely showing superior intelligence. Here is the link. Enjoy!

http://www.pantagraph.com/stories/112005/spo_20051120039.shtml

This is just embarressing. No wonder fans in the CCIW and the IVY don't give us much respect.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2005, 04:29:55 PM
Quote from: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 04:19:43 PM
This is just embarressing.

It certainly is that.  ::)

We need to get this guy together with Coshocton Giant.  Preferably in Coshocton.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 13, 2005, 04:37:13 PM
Forget about Subway,

if we're going to talk about delightful deli sandwiches in Springfield....let us not forget that little place with all the sports memrobillia just acrosss from the Witt campus.

What was that place called? It was always salve on the thrashings that I witnessed on my last couple of trips to the HPER.

Pete, have you tried getting a job there? They always seem like friendly folks ;), unlike the flames that we've seen here over the past hours.

And Earlhamalum, your Karma will always remain the lowest. Remember, no matter the stupidity, his name still has Wooster in it.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2005, 04:39:58 PM
Give us time; we can only smite once every 12 hours!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 13, 2005, 04:42:21 PM
Billy_pilgram... after 6 stops at the place in my life-time i can't think of the name either...  I could get their from HPER if i had too.. :)   can anyone help us?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 13, 2005, 05:01:22 PM
For the win................Mike and Rosy's


mmmmmm.............when does Earlham play at Witt?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 13, 2005, 05:01:45 PM
I thought that 'over-rated' chant was funny. And please remember that many of those students saw IWU look mortal in besting Texas-Dallas.

Besides, it wouldn't be Chadwick without a little crazy!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 13, 2005, 05:51:15 PM
Quote from: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 12:51:47 PM
David, is skinny dick Pete your idol.  That kid may have been the weakest player I have ever played against in my life.  A pathetic excuse for a big man.  Also, I am glad you appreciate my email address, feel free to email any time.  I love being amused by the dim wits at Wittenberg. 

As anyone who isn't a drive-by trasher would know, David Collinge is a proud Wooster supporter - which is why he is SO distressed by you!  With a**holes like you, who needs Witt folks to trash Woo's rep?  I'm betting that, in fact, you are either a freshman at Witt (who MAY be bright but is incredibly immature) or a townie who had NO hope of getting in to Woo.

Quote from: David Collinge on December 13, 2005, 04:39:58 PM
Give us time; we can only smite once every 12 hours!

Yeah, it may take us time, but if this jerk sticks around, I'm sure we can get him past even Titan2000 (last I saw, -103)!  It really hurts when your 'fellow' rooters are the worst image of your school!  (Though, for the record, Titan2000 is an Oshkosh Titan, NOT IWU!) ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 13, 2005, 05:55:43 PM
BillyPilgram... don't forget Mike and Rosy's is normally the only good thing about the trip to Witt.  oh wait and the 45 minute buss drive.  Does Coach Brown get to pick the Refs for those games??  Cause he had Bo in his back pocket for years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 13, 2005, 06:03:57 PM
I always thought Bo and Mike Fox were some of the better NCAC refs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 13, 2005, 06:14:04 PM
Bo might have been one of the better NCAC refs.................which explains a whole lot


but Earlhamalum didn't exactly get off on the best foot with him  :D

I haven't seen Bo the last couple of years doing any NCAC games, though I did notice he worked the Duke/Valpo game in Chicago's United Center last December.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 13, 2005, 06:42:00 PM
smedindy... U must be a Wabash or Witt fan because he always Ref those games when we played.. and he was F-ing HORRIBLE... but if i was a wabash fan i'd think he was the 6th man... 
i ran into him (BO) in indy... those guys don't forget.. he even remembered (T)'ing me up... those losers know what they are doing half the time. I was one move away from spending a few years in jail... but like a good Earlham Grad... i flashed a Smile cause that's my style... and said "hey ONE LOVE"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 13, 2005, 06:45:47 PM
I have a game Tape my senior year First Round of the NCAC TOURNY... playing at Allegheny in O.T. with it being a 2 point game... both teams in the Bonus me getting a rebound (6'5 WHITE Senior) getting fouled and them sending a 6'0 BLACK Freshman to the line... I'm sorry but very few people would say I look like TYler Stewart.  We lost by 3 and i think he missed the front in of a one-in-one. 

Where do they find some of these guys... sorry don't want to talk about Refs.. but Basketball.. had to get that out of my system..
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 13, 2005, 06:54:14 PM
Oh, I've seen the NCAC's 'finest' and actually they're better than the refs the ICAC / HCAC trotted out, believe me.

By calling him a 'loser' you're already setting yourself up for a lifetime of bile. Refs make mistakes, but a lot of times they make the right, yet unpopular, call. Bo is one of the better NCAC refs, believe me. They have some dunderheads on the staff and they're the ones who resent having to come to C'ville from Ohio to do games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 13, 2005, 06:56:00 PM
Oh, and check the sig...

Bo was supposed to ref at Wabash when we played Tri-State but got held up because he was doing a Big 10 game and got caught in the weather.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TMAP on December 13, 2005, 07:30:46 PM
I did not realize NCAC refs did D1 games. That is interesting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 13, 2005, 10:31:23 PM
I can do you one better.......a couple years ago (or maybe last year, can't remember) the Big 10's best crew did an Adrian College game.....then the next night were in Crisler Arena for a Michigan game.

As a side note.......most of the MIAA's officials also do a lot of the D2 games in our State, including those lovely drives to Marquette and Houghton in the UP.

For as much flack as these guys take, they simply love staying involved in the game and lead incredibly busy lives.  Many of these guys are lawyers, accountants etc.....the guy who I think is currently the best in our league is also the Manager of one the Midwest League's Class A baseball teams.  We also have a guy who is the official of a Big 10 football crew.

I'd say most are more than qualified to do a D3 game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2005, 11:17:15 PM
Here's a question for Waterboy, or anyone else with knowledge of the inner workings at Allegheny.  As you've probably read, there's a new conference forming in eastern PA and environs, and there's been a lot of speculation of what the ripple effects will be on other conferences.  Allegheny's name has been raised in connection with several conferences (notably the Prexy and Allegheny Mountain conferences) in Posting Up in the past, and I've always dismissed it since AC is a charter member of the NCAC and seems to be happy and a good fit (except maybe geographically.)  Do you think Allegheny will listen to overtures made by other conferences, or worse, will seek a new alignment in this chaos, or do you think they'll stay? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoBigRed on December 14, 2005, 12:34:39 AM
Anyone see the Witt-Woo game? How'd that turn out? Geez guys.

Just commenting on statements made by DenisonFan a few days ago. I totally agree. Would someone who is more versed in basketball strategy than I, mind explaining to me why Coach Ghiloni would ever have Hodgkinson (arguably the best post in the conference) out of the post? I'm trying to rationalize it and I can't, can someone with a higher bball IQ try and explain that to me? I've determined that Hern not starting is maybe to give strength to the bench, a spark maybe, thats all I can come up with for that one.

All the players who play (all 11 of them) look dead because they know their coach hasn't given them a chance to win. These coaches must be hypnotized thinking that the 6th man down on the bench can replace one of their starters without missing a beat. But thats what they do. Mistake - sub. Turnover - sub. Its really just sad. I thought they were gonna be good, too, but I didnt see this coming.

I get trying to develop underclassman, but isnt that what JV games are for? I feel horrible for Hern, Hodgkinson, and the rest of the upperclassman on that team because Ghiloni's attempt to "develop" these younger guys is costing them games and getting them accustom to losing, it will cost them the rest of the upperclassman's careers, and if he isnt careful, wont it eventually cost him his job? I'm certainly not calling for Ghiloni's head, but he's gotta figure out that what he's doing isn't working. Right?
   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 14, 2005, 05:47:02 AM
Quote from: WooMan#1 on December 13, 2005, 11:12:59 AM
This poll is a joke.  We crushed witten****.  Their guards are terrible, thats why they never go far in the tourny, and never will.

I hate to be the one to break this to you, WooMan, but Wittenberg has won more D3 tournament games than any other school. As for never going far in the tournament, the Tigers have won a national championship (something your Scots have yet to accomplish) and made it to the Final Four six times (again, they lead D3 in that department).

There's a reason why Woo/Witt is such a great rivalry. It's called "mutual respect". Look into it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 14, 2005, 09:28:29 AM
GoBigRed,

The only explanation concerning Hodgkinson out of the paint I can fathom would be to disrupt opposing defenses and potentially make use of his ability to see over smaller guards on the perimeter.  If I'm not mistaken, Earlham put Brandon Miller at the top of the key for some of their offensive plays to utilize a similar strategy (please correct me if I'm wrong Quakers).  He is more athletic than Hodgkinson and can get to the bucket, though.  Just a thought.

DC,

In my six years of association with Allegheny, I have yet to hear anything resembling thoughts of leaving the NCAC, at least within the administration.  I'm sure there's always going to be speculation about the school joining another conference closer to home, but I think it will simply remain heresay.  I think Allegheny fits into the NCAC very well both academically and athletically.  The road trips aren't always fun (especially the trip every other year to Indiana-8 hours, ugh), but all in all the school is where it belongs, IMO.

Though, it would be nice to see the Gators dominate a conference again in something other than track & field.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 14, 2005, 09:32:24 AM
FYI,

The head coach at Juniata College, Greg Curley, is also a former Gator player and assistant coach.  Juniata is of course one of the schools involved in the realignment in central Pa.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 14, 2005, 09:35:10 AM
Does anyone else feel like these Denison Posters are Ex-players that must be holding some type of Grudge against this Coach?   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Coshocton Giant on December 14, 2005, 09:42:19 AM
D.C. Please do not put Woo Man(less) on the same post as C.G. My grammar may be lacking, but not my respect earned by quality programs and quality athletes. West Holmes eh? Perhaps an appropriate place you two to duel it out. Ha Ha
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 14, 2005, 10:16:16 AM
Earlhamalum -

I do. Mainly because the recent games were games where it was time to experiment (Wooster, Witt and Akron) and a non-conference game (Bluffton). Denison has a chance to make some noise against the other 8 in the league. Why not see who can play and where they're best at?

I remember seeing Kalamazoo at Wabash a few years ago and at every stoppage there was a sub, and 13 guys played for K'Zoo. It didn't bother them in the least, that was the rotation and how they played.

We don't know why Hern didn't start against Bluffton but he led the team in minutes anyway.

As for Hodgkinson, I've seen plenty of sets where the big man starts out on the perimeter. At times, it clears up the lane for the rest of the team and can cause matchup problems when teams play help defense on screens.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 14, 2005, 11:51:06 AM
Quote from: GoBigRed on December 14, 2005, 12:34:39 AM
Anyone see the Witt-Woo game? How'd that turn out? Geez guys.   

Sorry that a game between 2 of D3's fiercest rivals on the hard court, coupled with the fact that they were ranked #2 and #3 in the country and lived up to all the hype surrounding it resulted in talking it up a bit in here after the fact.  Its not that this board is lacking in any Denison talk either lately.   Don't get me wrong, its great  to see some opinions from some other schools representing in here.   Besides, most of that drivel that was being spewn about yesterday by wooman isn't clearly representative of true Wooster supporters in here. 

Anyways, since we're talking Denison, you guys must be extremely disappointed as to what has transpired so far this season.  You obviously had some high hopes coming into this season.  Top 2 scorers back from a team on the rise last year.  A young coach who seemed to have the program turning the corner.  Plus, the newly renovated gym.  I'm about as stumped as you all as to why the Big Red can't seem to get things going? 

I wasn't able to attend the Wooster game down there in Granville, but listening to the radio broadcast,  I can tell you those first five minutes made me extremely nervous.  It seems as though after those 1st five minutes of the Wooster game, Denison has just disappeared for some reason and they haven't reappeared since.  They did seem to put in a better effort against Witt, but the Akron game could have been the straw that broke the camel's back, especially after seeing the Bluffton result.  I had thought Denison might be able to right the ship with a solid performance against Bluffton, but now, I don't know.  There are still a lot of conference games to go, but if Denison doesn't figure things out in a hurry, (and that won't be easy considering Wabash is coming to Granville on Saturday) it will be in for another long season, especially given the high expectations coming in.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 14, 2005, 06:39:39 PM
earlhamalum,

I forgot to mention that I too was at that game where Allegheny beat Earlham in overtime in the NCAC Tourney.  It was by two, 92-90.  You guys should have won that game too.  Nick Catanzarite missed two free throws in the waning seconds that would have iced it for the Gators.  This is the guy who owns the NCAC record for percentage in a game (15-15).  But unfortunately for you guys, nothing was falling.  I was, of course, the waterboy. :)

Refresh my memory, though it may pain you, why did you get a technical in that game anyways?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 14, 2005, 08:50:47 PM
Announcing the arrival of yet another Wooster huge booster.  Gooo ... Scots!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 14, 2005, 09:42:14 PM
The call that Earlhamalum speaks of in that tourney game at Allegheny was actually of less consequence than something that happened later in the game.

Late in regulation, Brady Keaton was whistled for a foul (his 4th), but someone at the scorer's table had it as his 5th. So, with four fouls, Keaton was relegated to the bench for the remainder of regulation and overtime. He "fouled out" with 17 points and nine rebounds in his final game. Even today, if you look at the official box score from that game, it shows him with only four fouls.

It was a great game, made that much greater when a poor shooter who always padded his stats in garbage time hit the only clutch shot of his career............yes, that's correct, Earlhamalum hit a 3-pointer to send the game to overtime.

And for the record, I was money in warm-ups that night.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 14, 2005, 10:24:52 PM
The killer shot ... and the celebration ... Re-live a classic ...  All pictures courtesy of the Wooster website.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 14, 2005, 10:26:02 PM
Well, that's why the box score and the book should double check each other after the game - we make sure they jive in fouls and points and adjust the box score to match the book.

Sloppy, sloppy, people. What is it with that and the Wooster / Witt game not having the minutes balanced. Doesn't anyone care about precision anymore??  ;D :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 14, 2005, 10:43:10 PM
200 minutes just wasn't enough to contain all that excitement, I guess!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 15, 2005, 12:52:08 AM
WaterBoy- 
first of all it was not a Technical it was a  flagrant foul... :)  two different calls that end up with almost the same result (player that gets fouled HAS to shoot the Free-throw.)

  My junior year when we played Depauw who was then Ranked #2 in the nation i got a Flagrant foul with 2 minutes left in the game... We ended up winning that game in O.T.  so I figured it worked then why not try again...  as you know second time was not the Charm.  Nice memory you are the TRUE WaTeRbOy.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 15, 2005, 12:57:04 AM
BillyPilgram....

I'm hurt with that comment, but as always no hard feelings.  All I have to say is KENYON KENYON.. lol I think you should know what that means.

or

Open in the corner Billypilgram or Stoops.  I think I went with Stoops if my memory is correct.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2005, 01:04:08 AM
Quote from: earlhamalum on December 15, 2005, 12:52:08 AM
My junior year when we played Depauw who was then Ranked #2 in the nation ...

DePauw was ranked #3 that week. 
http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/02/week6.htm

My need to point that out has led to a change in my avatar and signature.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2005, 01:31:50 AM
Around the League in Ninety Seconds, I'm David Collinge...

Wilmington 70, Ohio Wesleyan 55
Grove City 77, Hiram 76 (2OT)
Allegheny 82, Thiel 74
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 15, 2005, 09:19:30 AM
Could Hiram be inching its way to being not too terribly bad?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 15, 2005, 09:22:52 AM
Gators with the "W" to move above the .500 mark on the season (5-4).  Matt Mazjlik, the NCAC's top scorer, drops 25 while Casey McCloskey goes for 24 tallies, with most of the damage coming from six trifectas.  Pretty well-rounded game for Allegheny overall and I'm looking forward to Jan. when they really get into the heart of the NCAC schedule.  

Even though they were handled by OWU last week, the young guys are coming around nicely and the veterans (namely Mazjlik and McCloskey) are stepping up like they should.  I think they may have a shot at knocking off Earlham or Wabash, though they only play each squad once which makes it all the more difficult.  The break sends the Gators to Indiana (a nice nine hour hike) for match ups with those two on Jan. 6-7, respectively, followed by a home date with Wooster on Jan. 11.  Those games should give more insight as to how Allegheny is going to stack up for the remainder of the year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 15, 2005, 10:51:42 AM
Ah, the dreaded unbalance of the NCAC schedule. Wabash and Earlham with the two home games this year, which, as always, should be a major factor in deciding which teams host. If not for a close loss at Allegheny last season, Earlham wojld have hosted Denison (not that it would have made a difference).

But, that's still two weeks away, so here's my Allegheny question for the month, WaterBoy.

Is it true that Coach Clune was a stand-up comedian prior to his coaching days in Meadville. If so, I want to know how that worked its way into pre- and post-game chats.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 15, 2005, 10:59:23 AM
Tough loss for OWU last night.  Just when you are about to give them some credit for playing well, they go and pull the rug out.  That is a game that OWU needs to win.  Wilmington is a good program, and yes they are 7-1, but they haven't been playing any powerhouses either.  Their one loss is to JCU by nearly 15.  OWU was coming into this game with a 3 game win streak, and a chance to gain some momentum heading into the holidays.  I guess they'll just have to regroup now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 15, 2005, 11:17:23 AM
And to think I got ripped for picking Wilmington in that game...I'm reminded of an old saying.  Something about sunshine and a dog's rear end.    :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 15, 2005, 12:22:48 PM
Well billy, to tell you the truth I don't know if he was an actual stand-up comedian or not, though he might be one of the funniest and care-free coaches I've ever come across.  Don't get me wrong, he takes games very seriously and wants to win, but at the same time he knows when his team is beat and he can deal with it.  His pre-game and post-game chats were always interesting to listen to and he knows how to motivate his players to play up to their potential, whether it's by screaming their heads off or making them laugh.

On a side note, he was always fun to play with on the court as well during my noon hoops days at Allegheny.  I've never heard someone talk so much smack before and then, of course, he would back up by hitting a running 3-pointer or some ridiculous hook shot.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoBigRed on December 15, 2005, 07:29:54 PM
Waterboy -

Thanks for the insight, and i certainly get where youre coming from and pulling the big guy out for a possession or two might shake it up a bit and open up a backdoor or something. The problem is that he's out there all the time. Youd have to see the games to know what I mean, but trust me, he's a first team all conference player taken out of way too many plays to try and open it up for some freshman.

Earlhamalum/Smedindy -

Sean Oreily, I remember you on your trips to Granville, you were a solid player so Ill give you the benefit of the doubt on your basketball-related comments. I was born in Granville and went to high school there, I live in Alexandria and try to frequent as many games as I can. I didnt play college hoops and have not played for Coach Ghiloni at any time. Must I be an ex-Brown to say Romeo Crannel shouldve been playnig Frye all year? I can't speak for everyone who makes Denison posts, but even if these guys are ex-players, which under Ghiloni narrows it down to like 10, does it still change the things Ghilonis doing? My posts, and posts like mine, arent personal vindictive statements, no one's said that Ghiloni and his coaches are bad people - Ive never met him, I assume he's nice - we're simply questioning his decisions in a forum that allows us to do so. I think some of the players need to knock down some open shots, Hodgkinson needs to make his free throws, Hern needs to pass, their #30 REALLY needs to pass, but they have talent. However, that talent has to listen to a coach that is so quick to replace, and having two of the conferences best players (Hodgkinson and Hern) is questionable situations (not in the post, not starting) is outrageous.

Smedindy, have you seen a Denison game yet? Are you going to the one this week? Maybe that craziness did work for Kalamazoo but at 2-6 and losing by a ton every game, it aint working for the Big Red. "Time to experiment?" What are practices and scrimmages for? Shouldn't Ghiloni start "experimenting" with trying to win games? So he waits til game 9 or 10 to get a rotation going and playing his players, getting them familiar with each other? That sounds kinda late in the year to me. I appreciate your comments on Hodgkinson at the outside, but you said "big guys start outside," implying they eventually get inside. Maybe its his fault and hes not being assertive enough, but Hodgkinson stays outside (which appears fine to Ghiloni) and is consequently removed from 10-12 possessions a game.

I have all the confidence that the Big Red can bounce back, I really do, and I kinda expect it, but the players cant do it all themselves. I'm not so dumb as to think that the starting five (when its the right five, which is another issue) needs to play all 40 minutes, I know the big guy needs a breather, but all this subbing means: 1, ...that for stretches in the game - no one can score. 2, ...the unfamiliarity and inexperience is adding to the TO total, and 3, ...that the right combination is out there for too little a time. They'll continue to struggle if they dont get the best players out there for most of the game, and players can only play with who they're on the floor with. Who determines that?

I call it like i see it guys, if I'm wrong, fine, but if I thought this was all on the players then I'd be saying that. In two months, if the 8-9 guys who should play are the only ones playing, if the set plays dont repeatedly take the conferences best post out of his area, stuff like that, and they're still losing, then I'll say Ghilonis doing all he can and I'll say Im disappointed in the players. The only thing is that if those type of things are happening, they probably wont be losing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 15, 2005, 08:28:04 PM
GoBigRed-
   Sorry you know what happens when you Assume...  I know in my days some Ex-players from Earlham would get on here and be bias about the whole situations.  Glad to know you're a fan of D3 hoops and i'll look forward to you're insight on the Big Red. 
   Second of all nice try on the spelling of my last name.
   third of all i need to find the EC-Rose-Hulman game.  Winner gets to bring home the Trophy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 15, 2005, 08:34:18 PM
Earlham-                33     
Rose-Hulman-         39

With 16:34 left in the game.  This is always a good game for the players... These two head coaches have been good friends for years.  (As a player you always wanted to bring home the victory for Coach Justus.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 15, 2005, 08:42:41 PM
Earlham- 41
Rose-    43
12:48


LaRon Henry with 13pts
Jewett  10 pts
B-Miller 9 Pts
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 15, 2005, 08:59:47 PM
EC down 10...  4 minutes to go... this team is killing me softly.  They have all the talent in the world...I played with all these seniors they have the ability to get it down?? maybe they will wake-up and want to get it done before the season is over....

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHhhhhhhhhhh
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2005, 09:14:42 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on December 15, 2005, 08:59:47 PM

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH
AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHhhhhhhhhhh
Did Earlham come back?  'Cause that sure sounds like a whole lot of relief!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 15, 2005, 09:49:16 PM
NO
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 15, 2005, 10:22:42 PM
When I mean time to experiment, I meant was that Wooster, Akron, and Witt were games they weren't going to win, and Bluffton is a game that's not really terribly important. The important games for Denison are games against the other 8 NCAC teams. Those are winnable and important for conference tourney seeding.

I never got hung up on 'starting' a game - because it's who is in there in crunch time that counts. I've seen plenty of starters average 10 to 12 minutes a game and they're non-factors in crunch time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 16, 2005, 09:12:10 AM
earlhamalum,

I have a question for you concerning coach Justus.  Over the past several years, he has had some pretty talented teams at Earlham, yet the squad has never seemed to live up to expectations.  Some of my associates and myself have questioned his coaching ability at times and wonder if this is the route of the problem with how the Quakers perform year in and year out. 

I don't think Justus is incompetent so please don't get me wrong.  I would just like a player's perspective on his coaching ability and how he has handled his teams over the years. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 16, 2005, 09:45:19 AM
Waterboy-
   Coach Justus has had a talented 5-7 players with absolutely no Depth, over the last 6 years.  Normally player 8 through whatever hardly even played high school basketball.  (normally good kids)  But usually they have no business playing on a College Basketball Team.  Recruiting is difficult for Earlham Because of location, (Top 20 most expenisive tuitions in the country), and earlham doesn't have a reputation of being a fun college atmosphere.  The two years we had a deep bench we finished 4th in the conference and 3rd with a 16-10 record.  I don't want to make excuses, but when we go up against Wooster and Wittenberg running 8-10 players in a game it makes it hard to compete.  Heck sometimes i would of traded player 8-13 just for Woosters or Wittenberg 11th and 12th players. :)   (but you can't take BILLY_Pilgram)
 
   Earlham does not make exceptions for athletes financially and academically.  I always find it odd when a college like Franklin or Wabash can offer more financial Add then Earlham.  Coach J gave a 1/100 chance of me going to Earlham, because I came from a two parent household, upper middle class and had to pay over $20,000 my freshman year...  Ball State and Indiana would of been 8,000 a year.  I was lucky my parents would make the sacrifice.
   $$$ can be a major issuse in the recrutiting process and I can go on forever about how that process does not give everyone an equal chance of playing D3 sports.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 16, 2005, 11:07:29 AM
I can see your point.  Depth is always a question mark in the NCAC save for Witt and Wooster who seem to put a better second string in than most other teams' starters.  From my recollections for past Earlham games with Wooster and Allegheny, the Quakers have always seemed to falter in the second half after playing very well in the first.

My question, however, was intended to deal more so with Justus himself as a leader and coach.  In the handful of games I've seen him coach, he has been fairly reserved and quiet on the bench, and appears to let players do what they want.  Case in point, Miller had a temper tantrum (I think that's how you spell it) in the second half of the first game with Woo last year and told the coaches to yank him, which I found very immature and suprising, given his talent level.  Any thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 16, 2005, 11:18:16 AM
The question I have with Earlham is how can they go toe to toe with Wooster, and give Hanover a good game and then take bad losses like they did last night to RHIT?  I know that EC doesn't have the luxury of going as deep as Wooster and Wittenberg without a significant drop in talent, but the way Miller, Jewett and even Henry have been playing, that should be enough to win games like last night.  To me, it seems like the Quakers have a tendency to play to the level of their opponents. They play up to the level against Woo and HC, and they play down to the level of RHIT, Bluffton, MSJ, etc.  How else can you describe it?  This also seems to be the trend not just this year, but also over the past several years at Earlham too.  I'm not trying to be critical, its just an observation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 16, 2005, 11:24:52 AM
QuoteEarlham does not make exceptions for athletes financially and academically.  I always find it odd when a college like Franklin or Wabash can offer more financial Add then Earlham. 

Were you making an accusation, there?

I know nothing of Franklin, but at Wabash we give all of our students all of the financial aid they qualify for - no matter if they are an athlete or not. Our endowment allows us to do that plus we have many long standing scholarship funds that also help in that effort.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 16, 2005, 11:58:50 AM
Waterboy-
   I consider Coach J a players coach.  When I speak lack of depth I also belive that puts coaches in a TOUGH spot.  That is something that can make teams with DEPTH a lot better, because if you're not getting it done player number 8 wants his chance.  We lost several players, during and after my Soph. year.  He cut down on minutes of players who was not doing what was in the SYSTEM...  Several players were not happy with that.  Coaching is a lot harder then it seems.  I'm the head freshman coach at my old high school and i'm seeing things in a whole nother LIGHT.  Maybe he is to much of a players coach... but I personally don't think that is possible.  These players have the experience and the ability to beat teams like Rose, Bluffton, and come up Franklin and Depauw... but coach J doesn't put on a uniform and play between the lines.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on December 16, 2005, 12:07:55 PM
What I do not understand is why over the past couple of weeks has this forum shifted from educated fans talking the game of basketball to a bunch of idiots bashing the coaches?  If it were not for the Wooster vs. Wittenberg game there would have been a smooth transition from the Denison fans bashing Coach Ghiloni to now the Earlham fans bashing Coach Justis (I greatly appologize for misspelling any of these names).  Lets be honest, all coaches have their plusses and minuses, but when it comes down to it no one who complains on a site like this could do a better job!  Perhaps you who continue to complain about your coach should take a look at what you are doing to help the situation......nothing!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoBigRed on December 16, 2005, 12:47:20 PM
Bishopsfan, your comments are preposterous. Idiots? I myself disagree with some of the systematic decisions that Denison's coaches are making, so where better than here to do put it out there and say, "this is what I'm seeing, I think this is hurting the team, can someone explain this, and so on." I would still classify inquiring about the rationale for playing 11 guys as talking about the game of basketball. So coaches are off limits because we couldn't do a better job? Can't discuss bad acting in a movie because we couldn't act any better? Can't discuss a player performance because we couldn't play any better? Would you like the only posts on this forum to be happy and positive, and no one should complain because no one can do it better? Never did I, nor anyone in any of the posts Ive read, say that they'd do a better job. Its about expressing opinions and sharing insight. Do me a favor, if you're so upbeat all the time and don't want to hear criticism, just skip my posts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 16, 2005, 01:05:40 PM
I second what GBR says. 

bishopsfan,

Namecalling is so much more along the lines of "educated fans talking the game of basketball" isn't it?  If calling people idiots is your way of adding to the discussion in here, then we were better off without you.   Since when does questioning the actions of coaches become bashing?   Last time I checked this was a forum to discuss ALL things related to D3hoops.  Are coaches somehow exhempt from that discussion?

Also, from what I've read, earlhamalum has pretty much defended Coach Justus.  A couple of us brought up some questions about why EC seems to underachieve every year and naturally, the first place to start is with the head coach.  I don't seem to recall anyone "bashing" Coach Justus.  To me, they were valid questions to bring about more discussion on other teams other than Wittenberg and Wooster. 

Its funny, people are always complaining about how there is too much Wooster and Wittenberg talk in here.  Then, there is some discussion about the problems at Denison, and questions about Earlham's inconsistencies and now we are "idiots" for bashing coaches??? ::)  So, what you are saying bishopsfan, is that you would rather we just stick to Wooster and Wittenberg talk in here to make you happy?  Personally, I can't remember anything you've contributed as far as "educated fans talking the game of basketball."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 16, 2005, 01:31:17 PM
I know that Earlhamalum wasn't bashing Coach Justus...and that will be the last thing that I do as well. I think both of us are loyal ex-Quakers who have a ton of respect for Coach Justus.

As for playing to the level of competition as ScotsFan pointed out............that's fair, and I don't disagree. But, having been in that locker room, I wouldn't say that Justus' preparation has been much, if any, different from the conference games.

Smedindy, I really don't think Earlhamalum was making an accusation against Wabash, et al., but rather stressing his dismay at Earlham's financial aid department. In my mind, Earlham strives to have a certain level of diversity each year. Now, let me see how delicate I can be with explaining this and still get my point across.

Earlham has always been, and has become increasingly, a niche Midwestern Quaker college for a whole lot of East Coast students. So, when a bunch of white guys from Massachusetts or Vermont are taking your alloted "white male" spots in both the class and in financial aid, it really doesn't leave a lot for the "white Indiana shooters" that I joked about earlier this season. Now, Earlham, through their often short-sighted recruiting methods, has chosen to recruit students (not always student athletes) from Gary, Indiana. This has been led by a couple of employees in the recruitment office who are originally from the Region. Do you see the road we're headed down here?

Now, one of those office employees is also an assistant football coach. So, you can imagine that a portion of those students from Gary are also football players.

OK, so let's recap. Admission applications are at an all-time high, spurred by Earlham being mentioned in a number of recent books about it being "a progressive education", etc. The recruiting office is focused on finding eligible students from Gary, not always a basketball hotbed. So, Coach Justus has been put in a tough situation in recruting. Earlham is bringing in only around 150 freshMEN each year...and with the aformentioned recruiting strategies and a number of other factors, it's not easy to fit in a stellar recruting class. Oh yea, have I mentioned that Earlham recently moved up its application deadline, making late-season recruiting an absolute bear.

Looking at the Earlham "regulars" now: Jewett, Miller, Stewart and Terrel Brown are all Richmond High School grads. To my knowledge, Richmond grads (and other Wayne Co.  grads) are given nice financial aid packages. I don't know the specifics of others in Earlham's rotation, but I don't think they are "hurting" to pay for a college education.

So, Earlham doesn't offer a great deal of financial aid to white Indiana students outside of Wayne County.....my checkbook shows it. Now, answer honestly, who's playing for the Little Giants, Franklin, Hanover and others?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 16, 2005, 01:48:22 PM
QuoteThe recruiting office is focused on finding eligible students from Gary, not always a basketball hotbed.

My, how times have changed. There always used to be a Gary or East Chicago team in the Lafayette semi-state, back before they ruined HS hoops in Indiana.

What I don't get is why Earlham isn't treating everyone equally after they have been admitted? Are you sure that's the case? At Wabash, once they've been accepted then everyone gets their fair share of aid. I can see wanting to hold some spots in a class open for diversity, but after they've applied and been accepted I can't believe they'd throw more money at someone than they are entitled to.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 16, 2005, 02:06:23 PM
Useless trivia

My grandfather once had an unassisted triple-play for the Denison Big Red baseball team.  Back in the 20's. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 16, 2005, 02:27:32 PM
On the eve of the Wabash crushing of the Big Red I would also like to say I agree with GBR.

It was earlier that we must be X players with a grudge.  WHAT IS THAT??  Plus, what difference would it make anyway.

As far as Ghiloni running his "freshman" gym class.  This is a team that finished last year going 8-3.  Ghiloni wins Coach of the Year riding the coat tales of Hodgkinson and Hern.  They lost one starter off of last years team.  If is isn't broken why CHANGE?

In the write up by Craig Hicks, Denison's SID, following the Bluffton even he says there is plenty of time to "RIGHT THE SHIP".  That to me implys that something is wrong with the ship or why would you want to right it. 

Earlham played Rose-Holman last night.  Both teams played 7 guys the majority of the time.  GEE I wonder why??  Could it be that those coaches put the guys out there that give their teams the best chance of winning the game???  I actually thought that was what coaches are suppose to do.  Apparently not in Ghiloni's world.

One third of the season is done and Ghiloni doesn't know who to play????  Does he go to practice??

I am sorry if this sounds like sour grapes.  But to sit there and watch a talented Big Red team go down the toilet is hard to take.

Wabash by 40!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 16, 2005, 02:38:36 PM
Quote from: sac on December 16, 2005, 02:06:23 PM
Useless trivia

My grandfather once had an unassisted triple-play for the Denison Big Red baseball team.  Back in the 20's. ;D

So I suppose if Bob Ghiloni had coached that team, the play would have been liner to Grampa Curry at 2nd (out), flip to short, toss to left, throw to catcher (out), roll to pitcher, throw to first, overthrow retrieved by rightfielder, toss to center, throw to third (out)?  :D  If you're scoring at home, that's a 4-6-7-2-1-3-9-8-5 triple play.

I agree with Bishopsfan; there's entirely too much chatter in here about subjects other than Wooster and Wittenberg.   ::)  *please note heavy use of sarcasm*
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 16, 2005, 02:54:44 PM
I think you will notice Wabash plays 10-12 per game every night, and players like Zimmer and Simkus could be starting, easily.

And yes, last year Denison finished strong but also was 3-7 at one point, after a loss to....BLUFFTON! Then they were 5-9 before their finishing kick, which coincidentally fell when they played beatable NCAC teams.

Hmmmm....much like this season's schedule works out.

And in looking at their losses, the only one that sticks out at me as truly unexcpected is Marietta. I would probably have picked them to lose to Rose Hulman and Bluffton.

I could see them at 3-10 after OWU (0-4 in the NCAC) before and then just losing three more games (maybe four) after that and finishing 12-13 before the NCAC tourney, and 9-7 in the NCAC.

Exactly the same record as last year, without the upset of Wittenberg.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 16, 2005, 03:07:07 PM
SAC- I greatly Appreciate you're  useless trivia.  I think billy_pilgram would too.

I can add to that... In 2002 Earlham Baseball Season there was a   7-3 putout at 3rd.  ? how does that happen and what 1st baseman had the heads up to do that?? :)  

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 16, 2005, 03:34:49 PM
Personally, I think there have been far too many "idiots" jumping on this board following the Woo-Witt game and not enough educational chatter about the NCAC and Div. III basketball.  If Ghiloni isn't getting the job done at Denison, then Big Red fans have every right to bash him on this board, or at least put forth educated and informed remarks.  The same goes for Allegheny, Witt, Woo, and whoever else can throw something in there.  I had a question about Justus's coaching skills and earlhamalum kindly replied with insightful remarks from the perspective of a player and a current coach himself.

I'm going to back Scotsfan on this one as well, what have you contributed to any conversation on this board?  If you don't have anything informative to add at any point, then don't bother the rest of us who do and would like to share it with their fellow basketball peers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on December 16, 2005, 04:55:10 PM
Earlhamalum- curious as to the situation of your 7-3 putout at 3rd base... my guess, a short blooper to shallow left field with runners on 1st and 2nd. Both SS and 3B drift out, pitcher is backing up home and 2B is covering 2nd for runner tagging. So the 1B had to come over and cover 3rd??? just a guess....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 16, 2005, 04:59:14 PM
jimmychitwood- aka HOOSIERs   You nailed it on the dot... but you didn't guess who the 1st baseman was..  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on December 16, 2005, 05:10:27 PM
after looking it up...sean o'reilley?

Another one for you or anyone, I remember hearing Nathan Stoopes was playing in Japan at some point last year... is he still playing or did he hang 'em up??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 16, 2005, 06:33:17 PM
Good answer!  He is still over there... after this season he might change to another team or come back to America... He'll figure that one out come June
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 17, 2005, 08:24:17 PM
Hip hip hooray for the Terriers:

Hiram 90, Thiel 79

In Granville, Wabash is up 66-59 with 10:00 left.  Wabash is in big foul trouble here.  Coffey is on the bench with 4, four other Little Giants have 3 personals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 17, 2005, 08:41:16 PM
3 minutes left in Granville...

Wabash has managed to walk the foul trouble tightrope and has extended the lead to 10.  Good clock management and adequate foul shooting should seal this one for the Little Giants. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 17, 2005, 08:51:13 PM
Final from Granville:

Wabash 85
Denison 73

Wabash turns a 3 point halftime deficit into a convincing win.  Wabash held a 7-10 point lead for most of the second half and was able to overcome some foul trouble to get the road win.  Wabash has quietly won 5 games in a row now and moves to 6-3 on the year, 2-0 in the NCAC. 

Wabash is off until Dec. 30 when the Franklin Grizzlies come to Chadwick for this annual Hoosier grudge match. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 17, 2005, 11:39:06 PM
One GL Region score of note from today:

ONU rebounds well after taking their first  loss of the year at home to BW defeating JCU in Cleveland Hts. in OT. 

The final:

ONU - 87
JCU - 75

ONU is looking like they are for real.  It could be a much more interesting game than many were expecting down in Springfield on Wednesday.

By the way, just my opinion, but  I wouldn't go as far as to say a 12 point win over Denison is a "convincing" win.  A solid win, yes.  But, convining? ::)  They just lost at home to Bluffton by 23?!  That's convincing.  Wooster beat them down there by 36.  That's more than convincing.  A twelve point win is solid, but given the current state of Denison basketball, I would call it a stretch to say it was a "convincing" win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 17, 2005, 11:55:27 PM
Also of interest
#18 B-WC 85, Capital 82
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 18, 2005, 12:03:47 AM
One thing to add about the upcoming game between ONU and Witt.  We should definately get a pretty good feel as to how the best of the NCAC stack up against the best of the OAC on Wednesday when Witt and ONU square off, given the fact that Wooster narrowly defeated Wittenberg just last week, and ONU is coming off back to back games against arguably the 2 favorites in the OAC; a narrow defeat to BW, and an OT win over JCU. 

Also, on the 29th, Wooster will meet BW in the opening round of the Mose Hole Classic and that will again pit 2 of the respective conference's best (not to mention the GL Region's best) against each other as well. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 18, 2005, 08:02:54 AM
QuoteI wouldn't go as far as to say a 12 point win over Denison is a "convincing" win.

Any double digit win on the road is convincing to me! (Well, maybe not against Oberlin).

Hmmm...I think this whole Denison thing WAS the coach preparing for the NCAC season. It seemed much ado about nothing.

Perusing the Wabash / Denison box:

Wabash played 12 players, all in the first half.

Denison did play 11, but two of them played just one minute in the first half. In the second half, they played just nine and Hern, Hodgkinson and Krantz played at least 16 minutes each in the second half.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on December 18, 2005, 08:35:26 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 18, 2005, 12:03:47 AM
One thing to add about the upcoming game between ONU and Witt.  We should definately get a pretty good feel as to how the best of the NCAC stack up against the best of the OAC on Wednesday when Witt and ONU square off, given the fact that Wooster narrowly defeated Wittenberg just last week, and ONU is coming off back to back games against arguably the 2 favorites in the OAC; a narrow defeat to BW, and an OT win over JCU. 



------------------------------

Wittenberg will probably lose against ONU since  Russ has not practiced or ran for over a week and Witt has not played for 10 days, great scheduling.

So all you pick-em pickers might want to reconsider the Witt win against the Bears.

----------------------------------

Here is the News-Sun article about Russ:


Russ day-to-day with ankle sprain



Wittenberg students had final exams this week, but the men’s basketball program’s leading scorer has an extra test to pass Monday.

Senior post Dan Russ did not practice this week after suffering what coach Bill Brown is calling a high-ankle sprain, suffered in the 86-83 loss at North Coast Athletic Conference rival Wooster last Saturday.

Luckily for the Tigers, they don’t play until Tuesday at home against Ohio Northern at 7:30 p.m.

“(Russ) is out of the walking boot that he was wearing earlier this week, “Brown said. “My best hope is that he does some light jogging by Sunday.”

After an MRI turned up nothing earlier this week, Russ has been seeing Cincinnati Reds and Wittenberg team doctor Tim Kremchek about the injury. Brown said if the ankle doesn’t improve by Monday, a second X-ray might be scheduled.

“Tim Kremchek said if Dan had any major discomfort come Monday that he will reevaluate the injury,” Brown said. “I don’t see that happening, but we will have to see. Right now he is just day-to-day.”

Russ suffered the injury with about eight minutes left in the second half when he blocked the shot of a Wooster shooter before falling to the ground. Russ sat out for three minutes before coming back and hitting three key shots, including one that tied the game at 83-83 before South grad James Cooper hit a game-winning 3-pointer.

Russ finished with a game-high 33 points, the second-best scoring output of his career.

“It just shows the toughness he has,” Brown said. “He did a lot for us that night and hit some key shots.”

If Russ, who is averaging more than 14 points a game for the Tigers (6-1), can’t go in Tuesday’s matchup with Ohio Northern (7-1), Brown said senior wing Kenny Brady will step into the forward role and junior guard Billy Bowen will start.


Reach Lucas Sullivan at

lsullivan@coxohio.com

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 18, 2005, 10:30:46 AM
I have to admit that the Big Red put on a pretty good show last night.  They lost the game but it wasn't by 40.

It seemed like they played with more energy than I have seen in previous games.

Ghiloni still played way too many guys.

He allows his freshman guard Kranz to shoot it 17 times.  That was what Hodgkinson and Hern shot combined.  HELLO??  And he was 5 of 17.  Come on Ghiloni, get it to the guys that make you baskets.

Other than that they looked pretty good.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 18, 2005, 10:36:18 AM
witt,

Thanks for the info.  I wouldn't jump to conclusions so quickly about Russ not playing.  From what I read in that article, Russ is progressing just fine with his ankle sprain and I would be surprised if he didn't play against the Bears.  He may not start, but that guy is such a competitor, it seems Coach Brown would have to strap him down to keep him out of a big game like the one on Tuesday.  Even a 70% Russ is better than no Russ.  And judging from how he played on it last Saturday when he came back into the game, I would say he will play on Tuesday.

And as for Witt not playing in 10 days, it sounds like its a good thing for them.  The 10 days off gave Russ some healing time for his ankle.  If they would've had this game any earlier, it sounds as if Russ definately wouldn't have been able to go, but with the extra time off, at least there's a chance Russ can contribute.  Also, OWU has had 2 pretty grueling games in the last week (a 2 point loss at home to BW and a win in OT at JCU).  How much will they have left in the tank?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 18, 2005, 12:19:28 PM
Can the coach make the passes to get it to the big guns, or were the big guns taken away by the defense? I think you're giving a coach way too much credit or blame. It seemed like the 26 turnovers were the key - perhaps they were trying to force it too much? Inquiring minds want to know.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 18, 2005, 12:27:34 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 18, 2005, 08:02:54 AM

Any double digit win on the road is convincing to me! (Well, maybe not against Oberlin).

I guess you're just more optomistic or I'm more of a realist.  To me, given the tough stretch that Denison has been going through, if Wooster were to only beat Denison by 12, I would hardly be calling that a convincing win. And I'm sure that others in here would question why Wooster hadn't won by a larger margin.  

Also, ONU beat JCU by 12 last night on the road.  But they won in overtime.  ONU outscored JCU 19-7 in OT to pick up the 12 point win.  Again, its my opinion, but I surely wouldn't call that a "convincing" win even though it met smed's criteria of what a convincing win is in his mind.  The Polar Bears were convincing in OT, yes,  but that was just 5 of the 45 total minutes that were played.  It was a very good win for ONU, but it was anything but convincing.

Maybe if Denison were coming into that game with Wabash yesterday on a five game win streak and not a five game losing streak, I would say your description of it being a convincing win would have more clout.  The fact is, Desison is in a funk, and they haven't played anyone close during their losing streak.  I just don't see a 12 point win over a struggling team as anything special, wheter it was a road game or not,  that's all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on December 18, 2005, 12:39:10 PM
One problem for Denison is that they lost their best ball handler this week.  The third junior that has left the team this year.  This one hurts because he clearly handled pressure defense better than the remaining guards.  I believe this was a big reason for the 26 turnovers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 18, 2005, 01:47:00 PM
Last year's Wooster - Westminster score was:  Woo 116  Westminster 79

Of course, that was a home game for Westminster.  So, any thoughts on the margin for today's game at Timken?

I will take the Scots to score 120 points or more and to beat the Titans by 40 points or more!  :)

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 18, 2005, 01:48:36 PM
Sounds to me like there are bigger problems down in Granville than just how Hern and Hodgkinson are being utilized.  That's not a good sign for the Denison program when players are leaving the team in the middle of the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2005, 01:59:32 PM
If we had never heard of Dan Russ, we'd be talking about what a solid front line Witt has with Dane Borchers and Kenny Brady.  ONU is deep (9 players averaging at least 13 minutes each) but not very big; they have a 6'8"/205 freshman center who plays 17 minutes, but averages just 2.4 rebounds.  Their starting post is listed at 6'6"/280  :o and they start 3 wings at 6'4"-6"5".  Their leading rebounder (7.2) is a 6'3"/200 wing.  Witt will still have a size advantage even if Russ sits out the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 18, 2005, 06:34:10 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 70  Westminster 51

Wooster being led by James Cooper with 23 points (5 three pointers) and Tim Vandervaart with 12 points.

Wooster has made 11 three pointers and has shot over 70% from the floor.  Scots have dominated this game which is essentially over.  :)

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 18, 2005, 07:10:48 PM
Westminster forcing me to eat my words  ??? as they nailed several long three pointers (25 to 28 feet per radio announcer) and cut the Wooster lead all the way down to 3 points.

Now 12:20 remaining   Wooster 89  Westminster 81
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 18, 2005, 07:48:33 PM
Final:  Wooster 133  Westminster 110

Wooster was led in scoring by Tom Port with 32 points, James Cooper with 28 points and Tim Vandervaart with 19 points.

Wooster made 12 three pointers in this game but Westminster made 18 three pointers to keep this game somewhat close.  Wooster shot 64% from the floor and 50% on three pointers to secure the win tonight.

Craig Hannon led the Titans with 31 points (8 three pointers) and Mark DeMonaco added 22 points.

Wooster is now 9-0.  :)  Next up is Baldwin Wallace on 12/29 in the Mose Hole Classic opener.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 18, 2005, 07:49:59 PM
Overtime is a different beast. A 12-point reg win that wasn't padded by foul shots is fairly convincing, IMHO. Y'all are sounding like Mt. Union here.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 18, 2005, 07:50:56 PM
I just can not believe that Wooster allowed these Westminster guys to score over a hundred.  Man, they gave me a scare when they pulled it to within three.  I was under the impression that Cooper was gonna have a monster second half but he still did us proud with his 28 point effort.  Kudos to Tom for the massive 32.  Nuff respect to Westminser's pair of Demonaco and Hannon for their 22 and 31 points respectively.  Overally, fair game by Westminster and below par effort by Wooster.  But then again, a win is a win.

THE SCOTS ROCK!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on December 18, 2005, 07:53:27 PM
Just final...Wooster 133 and Westminster 110.  Another good win for the Scots against the "fun & gun" style! I hope the team has a safe and happy holidays and gets ready for another quality field in the Mose Hole. One sidenote however, 4 starters STILL in the game with 1:45 left and a 21-point swell.  As a fan, you just have to hope that strategy doesnt end up burning Coach Moore as it has become quite a tradition in recent years. Merry Christmas to all in Wooster!!!! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoBigRed on December 18, 2005, 08:06:27 PM
At half-time of the Denison game i was actually thinking about the possibility of posting something positive and congratulatory, and it almost happened, but the same issues still exist, and as long as they do, Denison will continue to lose by 10+.

I agree, there was more energy and they hit some big shots, but the inexperience and system for winning will not work until maybe next year. DenisonFan is right, their #30 shot it A LOT, and didnt make that many, even a few of the ones he made were anything but in the flow of the offense. I thought he'd be disciplined at half-time for his selfishness, but he was just as trigger-happy in the second half.  I guess he shot it more than Hern and Hodgkinson combined, and to me thats inexcusable. Maybe Ive got the wrong idea, but do you guys think Witt's coach stresses getting the ball to Russ and Borchers, does Woo's coach stress getting Port involved, does OWU's coach stress getting their post player involved? Why dont these Denison coaches stress getting the ball to Hern and Hodgkinson. Dont you dance with the girl that brought you?

I say that because Ive watched these guys play for two years and have seen how good they are, and to see them be put on the back burner for some selfish freshman is disappointing. I contend that Denison goes as Hodgekinson and Hern go, so its not a surprise that as they are underacheiving, so is Denison. They're Denison's best chance at scoring, yet the perimeter players dont look inside all that much, and I dont know why.

The last thing I want to mention is that I was wondering where #23 was, he wasnt on the bench so I figured a family emergency or something. But by reading these posts am I to understand he quit? Like Kramer said, is that now the 3rd junior to outright quit? The third junior who wouldve been a big contributer, so I look at Ghiloni again on that regard. Why do impact players quit the team? From what Im watching, its because once you become an upperclassman, Ghiloni disregards you for the underclassman. He'll give you two years, and then he trades you in for a younger model.

I know I'm complaining a lot, but you just have to see the games to know what Im talking about. Inexperience is destroying this team's chances, it seems like its a repairable thing, but how many games wil l they have to lose before any repairs are made?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on December 18, 2005, 09:28:25 PM
Some thoughts on the Wooster game...

Came in mid way through the first half and Wooster was up something like 42 to 21 so I thought 'hey another blowout', but I have to say Westminster hung tough the start of the second half and cut the lead to 4 or 5 at one point mainly due to excellent 3 point shooting.  Wooster was playing good D at the perimeter but Westminster was taking and making NBA three's.  Wooster then took control with great passing and hussle. 

Port had a great dunk off a feed from Cooper in the second half which got the crowd into game.  And along those lines Brandon Johnson had an open look for a dunk but missed... yet hung on the rim...hence a foul which happened to be his 5th!  Might be hearing about that one for a bit.  ;)

I have to say the officiating was terrible for the game.  I'm not sure the overall number of fouls but both teams had 10+ with over 10 minutes to play in the game.  They were calling little ticky tacky stuff and then letting muggings go on other times.  Really took away from the game. 

Overall a better game than expected as Westminster played hard and made the Scots earn it for awhile.

Bring on BW for the Mose Hole!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 18, 2005, 09:42:11 PM
What looked as if it would be a blowout at Timken gym became an interesting game.  Wooster came out shooting lights out to open up the big first half lead, but cooled off after the break and the gap quickly closed.

Just some random, tired thoughts:

Westminster is the only DIII "system" team that I've seen, except for Grinnell on tv last year.  I did listen to the Wooster vs Emory and Henry game earlier this season (I also saw Loyola Marymount live many years ago, but of course they're not DIII.)

It seems to me that Westminster is at least somewhat different in their philosophies, both offensively and defensively.

With the ball, they don't run. Part of this is surely because Wooster scored very often and also did an excellent job of getting back on defense.  Still, I can't remember Westminster making a single hoop in transition!  What they do do is to run their offensive set at a frantic pace, setting multiple perimeter picks in order to get a shooter some space for a three.  Quite a few of these picks do not quite have time for moss to grow on them, if you get my drift.  And, their shooters don't need much space at all, are very good, and will put up a shot at the first opportunity.

They also have some quick guards who can get to the basket if you play them tightly, which obviously you must.

They also hit the offensive boards very well.  I think part of their success in this area was due to the Wooster players being so much on the move they weren't always able to set themselves to box out.

Defensively, Westminster does press and trap, but this wasn't a strategy that was going to work well against this current Wooster team.  Too many good ballhandlers who are too good at seeing the court.

The officiating.  It continues to be incredibly poor.  In their defense, when a game is played at this pace, it's nearly an impossible game to call.  But you have to make the effort, and too often heavy contact on the perimeter or in transition was ignored.  If the officials would take charge of a contest early, maybe so much of this wouldn't go on.  It was the constant story of the Westminster guards hurtling into bodies enroute to the basket, and the Wooster players trying to block them out.  As it was, maybe one in four fouls was called.  When it gets to that point, how do you know which ones to call?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 18, 2005, 10:30:44 PM
It seemed the referees were continually trying to produce "make-up" calls.  When one person blew a call, the next would return the favor.  Case in point, when Bidwell was called for a technical when he "pushed' DeMonaco over (though DeMonaco practically ran into the Wooster first-year), another referee almost immediately called a moving screen on a Titan player.  Don't get me wrong, I'm not one to complain about officiating, but those guys didn't have a clue.

I think the last 13 minutes of the game took about 45 in reality.  I've never seen a half go so quickly to the bonus before.  In total, the teams racked up 49 total fouls.  Definitely a long night from where I was sitting.

I would also like to reiterate what Wooster Booster said about the different philosophy run by Westminster.  I saw the game in New Wilmington last year when Woo won 116-79, and this Titan team was much different.  They weren't as run-and-gun as they tried to be a year ago and they were much better shooters.  That high screen was deadly for DeMonaco and Hannon, and they ran it to perfection every single time down the floor.  Their big men were very good on the offensive glass as well, IMO.  Shooting-wise, Westminster set a season-high by canning 48.1 percent of their attempts, though it went down drastically over the last 13 minutes of the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 18, 2005, 11:15:17 PM
Congrats to Wooster on the victory tonight.  Hats off also to my Alma Mater for making it somewhat of a game.  I have to say I didn't expect Westminster to get back in the game after being down 19 at the half.  But, to their credit, they battled back and tried to make a game of it.  And to Wooster's credit, they didn't panic as they saw their lead evaporate.  They kept their composure, and before you knew it the Scots were back up by 20. 

Nice showing by Port and Cooper tonight.  Cooper lit it up in the first half and Port did the same in the second half.  BTW, Tom Port became the 28th player in COW history to join the 1,000 point club.  That didn't take long.  Congratulations on the milestone.  Just think if Port decides to return for his 4th year of eligibility.  He could end up pretty high on the all-time scoring list.  Of course, I doubt anyone will be catching Tom Dinger anytime soon.

Also, I will echo the sentiments on the officiating.  It was pretty bad out there in the 2nd half.  BTW, waterboy, I thought the "T" was called on Witucky.  Witucky committed the foul and then DeMonaco proceeded to push himself into Witucky and Witucky simply moved aside and DeMonaco fell over and Witucky got called for a technical?!  I also liked when one of the refs stopped the game and gave Westminster a timeout when no one had called for one.  Coach Ondako for the Titans was just standing there with this puzzled look on his face like what the hell are you doing, or do you have a clue of what you are doing?  :D

All in all, it was a nice win for the Scots.  Notice I didn't call it convincing... ;)  I'm not happy with the fact that Wooster gave up 110 points, but when Westminster's shooters are launching 25-28 footers and making them, what can you do? ::) 
 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2005, 12:22:27 AM
As for Denison - who were those other juniors? Did they play this year? Because except for Julian, no one else that has played less than 9 games has done squat.

Did Julian make grades? To quit at the semester break seems like an academic issue more than anything, but that's just speculation, as always?

And if it was Julian, shooting just 35% from the floor and 42% from the line ain't much to lose.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on December 19, 2005, 09:47:10 AM
Julian made grades that wasn't the issue.  Most of the players on the team are not happy with the coaching staff, pure and simple.  Point to note, in their only two wins he made both game winners (Muskingham comming as game clock expires).  Believe me they'll miss his ball handling skills and ability to penetrate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on December 19, 2005, 09:49:27 AM
The other juniors at Denison left just before the season started.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on December 19, 2005, 12:07:43 PM
I'd like to make a couple more points regarding Denison, and I promise I'll shut-up after this.  I started watching this team a couple of years ago.  I live in the Newark area and watched mostly high school games prior to that.  I was thriiled to see this group of kids slowly start to turn this program around, it gave me another option in addition to the local high school games.  It seems to me their biggest problem is that the players aren't having any fun.  I just believe at any level of basketball (or any other sport) to be successful you must enjoy playing the game.  This team seems very down, just going through the motions.  They did show som signs of life in the fist half against Wabash, but it didn't seem to carry over in to the second half.  It appears to me that they just don't take advantage of the players skills.    I'm a little confused that the only comments out of the head coach in the past tend to always be on the negative side.  Additionally, I find it surprising that if you review this teams on-line media guide, there is nothing about the players (just a picture and past stats).  However, there is a detailed history about all five coaches?? 
Despite it's problems this team can still turn it around if they (coaches and players) can remember why they are there - ENJOY THE GAME.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 19, 2005, 01:36:38 PM
Hopefully Earlham Keeps up the trend of "PLAYING to the LEVEL of Competiton."  I believe Franklin College is a solid 6-1.  These games over break are sometimes hard to get up for since the student body isn't there to attend.  This is an IN-State game, which should be reason enough to be ready to play tonight.  I know these guys are excited for Wednesdays game at Conseco... but that is no reason not to come out and play tonight.  Hopefully they can come out with a (W) tonight..

HEY billy_pilgram.. any thoughts about tonights game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 19, 2005, 02:36:41 PM
Was just perusing the Massey Ratings....unfortunately, the ratings aren't broken up by division, so you kind of have to sift through all three divisions, plus NAIA to figure out where teams stand.  Wooster and Witt are the top two D-III teams on the list.  In fact, Wooster and Witt would be 4th and 5th in D-II according to Massey.  The NCAC's top two are keeping nice company in the Massey ratings...Wooster is wedged in right between Pacific and Missouri, while Witt is a little futher down with Virginia Tech (yes, the same Virginia Tech that was a 40-foot answered prayer away from beating Duke at Cameron not long ago) and Miami.  Any thoughts by Wooster or Witt in jumping to the ACC?   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 19, 2005, 02:53:39 PM
Rumor has it that both Wake Forest and Virginia applied for membership in the NCAC but were turned down.  They'll be playing in the OAC beginning in 2008-09.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 19, 2005, 04:14:06 PM
Is it too early to start handing out mid-season awards?  Is it far-fetched to see three Woo players in the conference first team (Tim, James, and Tom)?  Is it far-fetched to see the whole of Woo roster, well maybe the starters, getting recognition at the end of the year?

I have Brandon Johnson as the Freshman/Newcomer of the Year.

I might be biased but, boy, these kids are playing beautiful ball.   No disrespect meant to Witt and the rest of the followers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2005, 04:47:21 PM
Those early season Massey ratings have some irregularities in them! They start to sort out in mid-January.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 19, 2005, 06:11:18 PM
QuoteI have Brandon Johnson as the Freshman/Newcomer of the Year.

I know this is an early call, but I see Brandon Johnson as very possibly an NCAC player of the year two or three years down the road.  I really like how this kid plays the game.  He seems to be a really quick study, seeming to understand Steve Moore's system very well already.  Plays within himself on offense, very unselfish, and really sees the floor.  All that besides excellent physical skills, although he may not be the strongest kid around.

In yesterday's game he missed a dunk, due to not having much of a run at the rim.  Not only that, but he got caught hanging on it, mostly it seemed due to his embarrassment at missing the shot. 

But players have been missing dunks for years (I remember, way back in 1966, seeing Drake's Bob Netolicky throw one so hard off the back rim that it flew all the way back to midcourt) and lived to play another day.  And, I liked the way he handled himself after doing it.  He realized he'd screwed up (not so much the missing of the shot, but the rim-hanging), appeared properly chastened by himself, so much so that if Steve Moore is as smart as I think he is, the play won't even be mentioned.

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 19, 2005, 09:12:14 PM
Earlham in O.T. Vs Franklin College

EC 85
Franklin 81   

3:10 remaining in the 1st O.T.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 19, 2005, 09:21:28 PM
WoW another chance down the drain.   Franklin was up 87 to 85 when Brandon Miller Missed a front in of a one-in-one.  Then Franklin went down and hit a shot with 35 seconds left and  Jewett Missed 2 3-pointers in a row... giving Franklin the win.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2005, 09:23:18 PM
Rats.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2005, 10:10:16 PM
Capital 91, Denison 57

:P

As Bette Davis famously warned us in All About Eve (1950), "Fasten your seatbelts, it's going to be a bumpy night."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: titanfan on December 19, 2005, 10:53:41 PM
Pat Coleman,

Why are Tri-State and Oberlin considered Non-regional wins for Wabash?  It looks to me like they are all in the Great Lakes Region.  Thanks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoBigRed on December 19, 2005, 11:04:43 PM
One word for Denison's coaching strategy - bizarre.

I'm done with the posts, fellas, if ever there was a broken record...

I truly think Ghiloni and company have abandoned all attempts at winning games, and its about getting the guys to play whatever it is he's trying to do. Now they do the 5 sub line change, its just getting worse. Its like they wont mold an offense for what they have, they want what they have to conform - and I dont think he has the players to do it. God forbid he change his philosophy.

Maybe the players all got worse over the summer, but they only lost one starter. Then you have to address all these guys quitting. Ghiloni has lost his mind, it defies explanation and I don't want to rack my brain trying to rationalize what Ive determined is irrational behavior.

Coach Ghiloni, if you ever read this, will you please just run pick and rolls with Hern and Hodgekinson, get your guys to look into the post and if the big guy doesnt have it have those freshman (the ones only you see promise in) ready to shoot.

I keep saying the same thing after every game, and I dont wanna waste my time anymore.

I wish the Big Red luck the rest of the year, and I wish Coach Ghiloni luck at his next job.  

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 19, 2005, 11:10:28 PM
titanfan:

I think that Tri-State is in the 2nd year of their provisional period, thus they don't count as an in-region game.

No clue on Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 19, 2005, 11:17:00 PM
Once again I wish I could of been at this one.  4 outstanding performances tonight... but One team came out on top.  

for Franklin:
Nick Kane- 36 Pts, 17 Rebounds, 3 Blks, and 50% from the field.  

for Earlham
LaRon Henry- 33 Pts, 15-20 Fgs, 2-2 3 pts,  1-2 Fts
Markous Jewett- 21 Pts, 7-15 Fgs, 2-4 3 pts, 5-6 Fts  
Brandon Miller- 19 Pts, 9-16 Fgs, 11 Rebs, 1-6 Fts

Neil Collins off the bench came in a did a great job from a player that you don't expect a whole lot from... but Franklin's top 5, out played Earlham's top 5.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 19, 2005, 11:23:31 PM
Basically, the final Wabash and Oberlin schedules came in so late that we didn't have a chance to punch them in ourselves and had to rely on one of the schools to do it, or one of our interns, who didn't know the rules.

As for Tri-State, click on their team page and you'll find a relatively useful note regarding this.
http://www.d3hoops.com/school_info.php?school=Tri-State&team=m&year=2006
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 20, 2005, 11:54:27 AM
Capital    91
Denison  57

Another terrific defeat orchastrated by the "COACH OF THE YEAR".

I agree with GBR.  I think I am throwing in the towel.  I think Ghiloni doesn't want to win.

The game is 13-9 Capital.  He pulls out all his starters except Kranz.  He puts in two more freshman and two sophomores and Capital goes on a 10-2 run and the game is over.

Does he really believe his second string is as good as his first.  The group he put on the floor was a combined 4-16 shooting on the night.  A smooth 25%.  Now that is good coaching.

Word in the stands is that when Julian guit Ghiloni says the kid was a cancer on the team and we are better without him.  WHAT????  The only two games Denison has won Julian was a HUGE factor.  But he is the problem.  Come on Bob, pull your head out and start doing what I hope Denison hired you to do and that is to win basketball games.

The second half got even better because he would start his starting 5 and then sub 5 at a time to the second group. 

We are 0 for December with an average margin of defeat of over 30 points a game.

A "bumpy ride", this is a train wreck and everyone watching this team knows it. 

But it is a good thing to get that cancer off the team.

I feel sorry for the players.  They know Ghiloni gives them NO CHANCE to win.  How sad is that?

Merry Christmas to all and to all a good night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on December 20, 2005, 01:43:17 PM
Now that we are about 40% of the way through the season, I thought it would be interesting to get some views on how the league will finish.  It looks as if the final rankings have potetial to be dramatically different then the preseason rankings.  As of today I feel the league will look like this come February.

1)  Wooster....Playing well right now and will continue to
2)  Wittenberg.....it may come down to a tie breaker with Wooster.
3)  OWU....playing a lot better then a lot of people thought they would early in the year.
4) Earlham....led by some very athletic seniors
5) Wabash
6) Allegheny
7) Dension....I wanted to pick Kenyon ahead of Denison but I feel that the Christmas break will help Denison pick up some of its pieces and at least put some resemblence of a season together.  Is it really possible for them to finish lower then Kenyon, Hiram, and/or Oberlin.
8)  Kenyon....there are better days ahead for the Lords.
9)  Hiram
10)  Oberlin.....I heard a rumor that Oberlin is only practicing 8 players.  Can this really be true?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: titanfan on December 20, 2005, 01:58:04 PM
Thanks Pat!  I missed the Tri-State note on their provisional status.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 20, 2005, 03:34:26 PM
That's no rumor - Oberlin has only dressed eight.

I do think you are ranking Wabash lower than they should be. They played IWU pretty tough, and could have beaten Hanover, and SHOULD have beaten Bethany (KS).

Despite all of the moping here, I think Denison is in line for a 9-7 league finish and a record very similar to last years. (For some reason, the site has the Capital loss as a conference game for Denison...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on December 20, 2005, 04:31:40 PM
I agree with your assessment Bishopsfan, for the most part.

Woo-Witt are going to be 1-2, no doubt about it.

3-5 is going to be a dog-fight, because I think each team can steal a game from one another.  I'm going to go out on a limb and say Earlham edges out the other two for the three spot and Bash and OWU tie for 4th.

Gators right on the money.  Could potentially knock off 3-5 once, but will probably also lose to 7-9 once.

I'm going to go ahead and put Kenyon ahead of Denison.  By the looks of things, Kenyon at least knows what they're doing and they have some nice young players stepping up.

Despite the recent wins, Hiram wins just two in league play, both at the expense of the Yeomen, who end up without a league win on the 10th anniversary of their last 0-16 season (1995-96).

It'll be tough for Johnson to get Newcomer considering some of the other talented first-years around the league, plus the NCAC likes to spread things around a bit too much to my liking, and Port and Coop have the early lead in POTY honors.  Here are some early favorites though:

Brandon Johnson (Woo) - 7.4 ppg, 2.8 rpg, 2.2 apg, 1.1 spg
Bryan Yelvington (Ken) - 13.5 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 48.3% field goals
Jordan Krantz (Den) - 9.9 ppg, 3.1 rpg, 1.9 apg, 1.7 spg
Mike Loll (Obe) - 11.0 ppg, 5.3 rpg, 1.1 spg
Ryan Hollihan (All) - 10.1 ppg, 8.0 rpg, 1.4 bpg

Interesting to note that Johnson is far and away the best first-year among the assumed top-five teams, IMO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on December 20, 2005, 05:23:47 PM
Pretty good picks Bishopsfan.  I agree that the 3,4 & 5 spots are going to be a dog fight.  I think Earlham has the most talented starting five, but will their bench come through when needed?  Very impressive line-up though.  Kenyon may finish ahead of Denison (maybe even Hiram), the defections there may not be over.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2005, 05:38:38 PM
I'll cloak my responses in secrecy by giving what I think will be the first-round tournay pairings.  :)

Alphabetically.  :D

Allegheny at Wabash
Denison at Wooster
Earlham at Ohio Wesleyan
Kenyon at Wittenberg
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 20, 2005, 06:08:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 20, 2005, 05:38:38 PM
I'll cloak my responses in secrecy by giving what I think will be the first-round tournay pairings.  :)

Alphabetically.  :D

Allegheny at Wabash
Denison at Wooster
Earlham at Ohio Wesleyan
Kenyon at Wittenberg

David, knowing your loyalty, it is a pretty safe bet that you are picking Kenyon for 7th and Denison for 8th!  But other than 'bash and OWU for 3,4 and 'gheny and Earlham for 5,6, I don't know you well enough to decipher the order. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 20, 2005, 06:30:46 PM
QuoteIt'll be tough for Johnson to get Newcomer considering some of the other talented first-years around the league...

I agree with you here.  Johnson's problem isn't a lack of ability, but the fact that he's come into a strong program that this year has serious depth at the guard positions.  That's working against him getting the minutes he'd need to produce numbers that could match other freshmen on lesser teams.

Next year, though, with Witucky having graduated, I see Johnson running the offense and playing 30 minutes a game.  By his junior year, watch out. :-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2005, 07:23:39 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 20, 2005, 06:08:21 PM
David, knowing your loyalty, it is a pretty safe bet that you are picking Kenyon for 7th and Denison for 8th!  But other than 'bash and OWU for 3,4 and 'gheny and Earlham for 5,6, I don't know you well enough to decipher the order. :D

Be careful making that bet, Chuck.  You know what happens when you ASSUME:  You make an ASS of the University of Michigan (Eastern)!   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 20, 2005, 08:42:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 20, 2005, 07:23:39 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 20, 2005, 06:08:21 PM
David, knowing your loyalty, it is a pretty safe bet that you are picking Kenyon for 7th and Denison for 8th!  But other than 'bash and OWU for 3,4 and 'gheny and Earlham for 5,6, I don't know you well enough to decipher the order. :D

Be careful making that bet, Chuck.  You know what happens when you ASSUME:  You make an ASS of the University of Michigan (Eastern)!   :D

Brilliant variant on the traditional 'make an ASS of U and ME'!  Applause!

But I still bet I'm right! ;) ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on December 20, 2005, 09:02:09 PM
2:59 left Witt 55 ONU 52
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 20, 2005, 09:05:27 PM
Sounds like that one is going to be a DOG-Fight until the end
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on December 20, 2005, 09:07:52 PM
Witt taking control- 90 seconds left- Witt 61 ONU 52
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on December 20, 2005, 09:10:11 PM
Witt wins by 11,  65-54 Borchers and Russ lead the way for Witt with 22+ each. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2005, 09:14:38 PM
Big, BIG win for Witt, especially if Russ was playing at half speed as Witt4ever seemed to be suggesting.  This game may have ramifications for tournament seeding in March.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 20, 2005, 09:18:42 PM
Any word on who did well for Witt??  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 20, 2005, 10:25:16 PM
I listened to the first half of the game over the net.  Hard to tell with just audio, of course, but it seemed sloppy.  Witt had opened up a lead of 22-12 and seemed about to really take control when ONU ran off 9 in a row.  Still, you had the feeling that Wittenberg would win, that the tools were there if they really needed them.

It's a sorry state of affairs when you feel as if you have to root for Wittenberg so as to further the position of Wooster, the NCAC, etc. Turns the stomach a bit.  Now, if they'd been playing JCU...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2005, 10:30:51 PM
WooBoo--applause for the Diner quote.  :)

The press release from Witt suggests that it was a fairly ugly game with the turning point being ONU's foul trouble along the front line.  As I noted earlier in the week, they had a height disadvantage, and with their bigs out and Russ healthy, the Tigers were able to take advantage inside in the last 10 minutes to overcome poor shooting and secure the win.

Here's the box score. (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/05-06statistics/witm1220.htm)

Witt shot just 42%, but held ONU to a pathetic 31% on the night.  Russ had 22 on 9/13 shooting (2/2 from the arc!) in 28 minutes; Borchers had 21 (11/14 from the stripe) to go along with 11 boards.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 20, 2005, 10:56:04 PM
QuoteWooBoo--applause for the Diner quote.

Thanks!  Still one of my favorite flicks, and just saw it again recently in high def on the HDNET movie channel.

David, can you (or anyone else) please tell me how to edit posts in this forum?  I've looked and looked, but can't see how to do it.  Thanks in advance.

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2005, 10:59:38 PM
In the upper right-hand corner of your post there may be boxes labelled "quote," "modify," and "delete."  "Modify" is the one you want...except I think you need to reach a certain level of seniority to have the ability to modify.  I don't think 33 posts is enough; it's probably more like 100.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 20, 2005, 11:13:41 PM
You know, Witt played 10 players, and Russ and Borchers didn't play 30 minutes. OMG! The coach is WACK!!!  ::) ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 20, 2005, 11:46:10 PM
QuoteIn the upper right-hand corner of your post there may be boxes labelled "quote," "modify," and "delete."  "Modify" is the one you want...except I think you need to reach a certain level of seniority to have the ability to modify.  I don't think 33 posts is enough; it's probably more like 100.

That must be it; I only have the "quote" box.  That's weird, not allowing newbies the edit or delete option.  You'd think we'd have more need for them, not less, being relative bozos and all.  ;)

Jack

PS - Is there any chance that DIII baseball might be added to his forum?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 21, 2005, 12:10:40 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 20, 2005, 11:46:10 PM
QuoteIn the upper right-hand corner of your post there may be boxes labelled "quote," "modify," and "delete."  "Modify" is the one you want...except I think you need to reach a certain level of seniority to have the ability to modify.  I don't think 33 posts is enough; it's probably more like 100.

That must be it; I only have the "quote" box.  That's weird, not allowing newbies the edit or delete option.  You'd think we'd have more need for them, not less, being relative bozos and all.  ;)

Jack

PS - Is there any chance that DIII baseball might be added to his forum?

Pat had too much trouble with 'newbies' altering posts after the fact, or 'hit-and-run' deletions.

As to d3 baseball, you could of course discuss this in your thread (in CCIW Chat we discuss EVERYTHING!), but check-out Pat's end-note for the odds of d3baseball.com!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 21, 2005, 12:12:44 AM
Wow, a lot of talk in here since my last post.  First off, congrats to Witt (you don't know how hard that was for me to say ;)) on a well earned victory over ONU.  Just a note to the Wittenberg SID on the writeup for Witt.  ONU lost to defending OAC "tournament" champs BW.  Not to defending OAC "regular season champs", JCU as it states in the writeup.  But anyways, Witt gets a solid win that pitted two of the region's (and more specifically the OAC's and NCAC's) best against each other.  Nice to see the NCAC get another notch in their belt with tonight's win.

Witt4ever, I seem to recall you making the following statement:
Quote from: witt4ever on December 18, 2005, 08:35:26 AM

Wittenberg will probably lose against ONU since  Russ has not practiced or ran for over a week and Witt has not played for 10 days, great scheduling.

From which I made the following reply:
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 18, 2005, 10:36:18 AM
witt,

I wouldn't jump to conclusions so quickly about Russ not playing.  From what I read in that article, Russ is progressing just fine with his ankle sprain and I would be surprised if he didn't play against the Bears.  He may not start, but that guy is such a competitor, it seems Coach Brown would have to strap him down to keep him out of a big game like the one on Tuesday.  Even a 70% Russ is better than no Russ.  And judging from how he played on it last Saturday when he came back into the game, I would say he will play on Tuesday.

And as for Witt not playing in 10 days, it sounds like its a good thing for them.  The 10 days off gave Russ some healing time for his ankle.  If they would've had this game any earlier, it sounds as if Russ definately wouldn't have been able to go, but with the extra time off, at least there's a chance Russ can contribute.  Also, OWU has had 2 pretty grueling games in the last week (a 2 point loss at home to BW and a win in OT at JCU).  How much will they have left in the tank?
In reading the box score, I see that Mr. Russ was somehow able to play 28 minutes tonight, which so happens to be 3 minutes fewer than the 31 minutes he played in the Wooster game.  Those 31 minutes included the time he went to the bench (almost 3 minutes) to be treated for that ankle injury.  My point is, the 10 day layoff may have been just what the doctor ordered for Witt and Russ more specifically. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 21, 2005, 12:32:08 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 20, 2005, 03:34:26 PM
I do think you are ranking Wabash lower than they should be. They played IWU pretty tough, and could have beaten Hanover, and SHOULD have beaten Bethany (KS).
And lets not forget about the '"convinging" win the Little Giants had at Denison. ;)

<Just a sidenote to all the Wabash supporters, that was said with a hint of sarcasm, hense the wink.>

Seriously, regarding ranking the conference as we get ready to dive into the meat of the conference schedule, the top 2 are far and away the tops of the conference.  As far as 3-5 (which I would consider Wabash, OWU and Earlham at this point), I really have no idea until they start to play each other.  Weslyan has been playing well up until their sorry performance against Wilmington.  Earlham has shown signs that they can compete against the good teams, but they have also shown signs of ineptness against lesser teams so they are still a BIG quesestion mark?  Wabash would be my early pick to finish 3rd because they seem to be the most consistent.  They have played quality opponents and have played quite well against a relatively tough schedule. 

As for how I would rank the conference top to bottom right now, it would go as follows:

1.    Wooster
1a.  Wittenberg
3.    Wabash
4.    OWU
5.    Earlham
6.    Allegheny
7.    Kenyon
8.    Denison
9.    Hiram
10.  Oberlin

I ranked Kenyon ahead of Denison because at least the Lords are showing some signs of life.  Until Denison proves to me something, I'm not convinced that they can recover from this freefall they are currently in.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 21, 2005, 12:33:53 AM
Sheesh, Scots Fan, I think you forgot the "nanny nanny boo boo" at the end of your post.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 21, 2005, 12:46:48 AM
You're right, Just forgort...

nannny nanny boo boo ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 21, 2005, 12:51:28 AM
You know DC, the "roll eyes" smiley looks a lot like the Woody Allen pic from your avatar. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 21, 2005, 12:52:18 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 21, 2005, 12:51:28 AM
You know DC, the "roll eyes" smiley looks a lot like the Woody Allen pic from your avatar. ;)

Just not goy enough.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 21, 2005, 01:00:20 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on December 21, 2005, 12:52:18 AM
Just not goy enough.
I suppose, in that context... :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 21, 2005, 08:55:26 AM
Got nothing, really, but just wanted to make my 2,000 post in a friendly forum and away from the karma-killing OAC football dudes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 21, 2005, 10:58:43 AM
THis is the day BillyPilgram and i have been waiting for.  Going to the game with 9 or so buddies from College and it could get a little crazy downtown on a wednesday.  1st of all I hope Earlham comes ready to play... I want the drinking to be a HAPPY Drinking... not a damn why did they play like crap or well they played hard.

I will not be getting home until late, but i'll be able to give my Opinion on the game and the quakers later tonight. 

GO LUCK EC
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 21, 2005, 03:05:12 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 20, 2005, 11:13:41 PM
You know, Witt played 10 players, and Russ and Borchers didn't play 30 minutes. OMG! The coach is WACK!!!  ::) ;)

I will assume that this is a weak attempt to defend the Denison gym class.  It looks more like Russ picked up his second foul with 7:30 to go in the first half.  So he MUST sit. 

Then he picks up his 4th with 7:45 in the second half.  LEAVE HIM IN???   NO.  So gosh, he MUST sit.   Rock Science???  I don't think so.

I don't think Witt pulled their starters and played 4 freshman and a sophomore when the game is close.

Nice try, but you can not compare the two.   Not even close!!

Congrats to Witt on a quality win for our conference.

And Yes, Ghiloni is a "Wack"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 21, 2005, 03:48:42 PM
Doesn't explain Borchers or the playing of 10 players, which happens all the time to other teams.

Denison may have issues but I really don't think it's the fact he's playing a lot of his roster, since the big guns are getting the minutes over the other role players.

I also find that it was telling his pattern against Wabash was different than the non-conference games or the games against Witt and Wooster, which leads to my theories on what he was doing.

I STILL think they'll be over .500 in the conference, just because I'm a stubborn fool.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 21, 2005, 06:54:15 PM
Smed:

I guess we can agree to disagree.  I would love the Big Red to put this behind them and come out strong after break.

I hope you are right.

Time will tell.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: johnworms on December 21, 2005, 11:13:50 PM
Last week in the OAC forum, I predicted Otterbein to lose by 30 to John Carroll, and they nearly pulled off the upset against the Streaks. This week, I predict that the Cardinals will shock the nation and upset #3 Wittenberg in Springfield. Any thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 21, 2005, 11:30:18 PM
Beating anyone in Springfield is a tall order. It took a incredible shot for Wooster to do it, and I know Wooster, and Otterbein is no Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 21, 2005, 11:31:40 PM
You may want to predict Otterbein to lose by 40+.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 22, 2005, 12:55:55 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 21, 2005, 11:30:18 PM
Beating anyone in Springfield is a tall order. It took a incredible shot for Wooster to do it, and I know Wooster, and Otterbein is no Wooster.
:D
To paraphrase both Mr. Fendley and Sen. Bentsen, "John Worms, I went to Wooster.  I know Wooster.  Wooster is a friend of mine.  Otterbein, you're no Wooster."

Why do the most memorable lines belong to those who actually lost the election?

I don't anticipate that Witt will lose to Ott.  That's not the kind of game Witt loses.  When they lose, which is not often, it's usually a) to Wooster (once in a while), b) to an out-of-region opponent early in the season, c) to someone you'd never expect (like Denison last year), or d) to John Carroll in March.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 22, 2005, 09:55:11 AM
Earlham-  90
Depauw-  87   in O.T.

M. Jewett-         22 Pts, 7-11, 9 Rebounds
LaRon Henry-    18 Pts, 5-13
Brandon MIller-  18 Pts, 4-10, 5 Rebounds

3-4 of the other guys really played well for the quakers.  I think that is key for the quakers to have a good run at the NCAC. 

LaRon Henry had a jump shot at the BUZZER at the end of Regulation that would of given Earlham the win but one ref waived it off... the one thing that surprises me the most is that one ref made the call that it was NO GOOD. (I'm not saying it wasn't, it was truely to close to call)  There are 3 refs on the floor, i'm just curious why they wouldn't even talk it over to make sure they all agreed... but the other two just sat back and did nothing. 

On the other note Earlham could of let that be a let down, but they didn't and they came out ready to play scoring 20 Points in O.T.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 22, 2005, 10:28:13 AM
Great game from Earlham yesterday....it was a very well-played game on both sides. I think that sometimes in those situations, playing in an exciting environment, the game can be ragged to start. But, both teams seemed to adapt quickly to the Fieldhouse.

The teams stayed close throughout regulation, I don't think either team ever led by more than 6 points.

Aside from the 3 that Earlhamalum mentioned having nice games, Neil Collins played well in extended playing time. He could be that bit of backcourt depth that Earlham has been lacking. Freshman Tristian Gregory also played well.

As for the Henry shot at the buzzer...it was really close. The official on the far side made the call right away. That official did have the best view of the scorer's table light that is used in NBA arenas; however I don't believe that he could have seen through a gaggle of traffic to see if LaRon did in fact get the shot off. As Earlhamalum said, there was no conference at all.

Now, I don't know how many here have seen the second Bad News Bears film (I'm showing my extensive film knowledge here  ???). But, in that movie, the Bears and some Texas team are tied after a couple innings in the Astrodome. However, the officials aren't going to let them finish....leading to chants of "Let them Play". Well, it was almost the same situation yesterday. Because the NBA mandates that the floor be cleared 2 hours before gametime, there was a conference with Conseco Fieldhouse officials to decide how the overtime would be played, if at all.

Had the game gone a second OT, word was that it would have been sudden death. I kid you not.

Luckily, Earlham was able to hold on with hot shooting and one big Markous Jewett block at the buzzer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 22, 2005, 10:30:32 AM
How many people were there?

As for the refs, if the guy with the best view makes a definitive call, I don't think there would be a need for a conference. He didn't ask for help, and the other refs obviously agreed with the call - so no need to get together.

Wow! Sudden death hoops! I would have loved the NCAA and the NBA slug it out.

"Hey, you can't arbitrarily shorten one of our games. Only WE can arbitrarily make decisions about our games!"
"Can too!"
"Can not!"
"Can too"
"How big are YOUR TV ratings?"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 22, 2005, 12:29:19 PM
I did not find anything that had the offical attendence on it.  Billypilgram and I would say 750-1000.  That is including Pacers Fred Jones and Rookie Danny Granger who was there to watch the last 4:00 minutes of regulations and a 37 point overtime.     
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 22, 2005, 02:08:50 PM
Hey Smed,
Take a look at the box score of that Earlham vs DePauw game!!

What a shock......eight guys on both teams battle it out to the finish.

Why the heck didn't either coach play everyone there.  Heck, in that setting, let em play.

Or did each coach want to win!!!  I think they were going for the win.

So don't give me any more of this eleven man rotation crap.  It does not work.

Also, having Hodgkinson and Hern off the floor at the same time for extended periods is a formula for losing.  And OH!!  Denison is.  Show me ANY team in ANY conference that will pull it's starters and play 4 freshman and a sophomore..........did Ghiloni actually think they could match up against the starters from Capital.  Sad if he really thought they could.

Merry Christmas
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 22, 2005, 03:04:43 PM
QuoteHow many people were there?

I just read the Richmond Pal-Item story which said more than 1,500 were at the game.

Fans were allowed to only sit in the lower level of the side opposite the bench. Fans were also only able to exit through the gate at section 1...which involved trekking up about 40 rows of seats. Also, none of the video replay boards were working.......would have been interesting to see if D-3 officials would have gone to the tape for Henry's last shot had that been operating.

Danny Granger did watch most of the second half and then played a great game last night against the Clippers...................D-3 basketball: Inspiring to all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 22, 2005, 03:33:47 PM
DFan -

When you lose 91-57, you can't blame it on any rotation, or any time that a player is sitting out.

Oh, and I looked at the box score. It seemed both Hern and Hodgkinson were in the game when the score went from 13-9 to 30-13. At that point, the rout, she was on.

Like I have said, I have seen big rotations that DO work, and work well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 22, 2005, 03:53:00 PM
Smed:
Your killing me my man.

At 13-9 Ghiloni put in Shea, Eberst, Kranze, McMaman and Gognat.  I count FIVE.  Where is Hodgkinson and Hern.  Hodgkinson returns when it is 18-9 and Hern when it is 23-11. 

I was at the game.  Were you??  And the only reason we got blown out is because Ghiloni's second group went 4-16!!  Shooting 25% isn't going to win very many games. Ghiloni insists on playing guys that one, can't score and 2 don't look to score.

If you are so interested in the box score look at the points from that spectacular second team.  If you play 11 guys you are saying that the second group is as good as the first.  Come on Smed.  Even you know better than that.

Or maybe I missed something.  Was he not subbing 5 at a time in the second half??

Hodgikinson has 13 in the first half..........does he get the ball back??? NO   Hern has a big ZERO!!   But I am sure the this rotation thing will do great against Earlham, OW, Hiram and any one we have to face.

Please don't make comments if you were not even there.  Trust me when I tell you the subbing at 5 for 5 didn't really work out to well.

If Ghiloni was trying to find out who can play and who can't.  He has had 10 games to find out.  And believe me, he does not have 11 guys.   He actually doesn't have 8.

Plus, who knows who else will guit.  Each week they need a new roster.

Nothing says good program like having all your upper classmen guit. 

Looking around the NCAC I don't see any other program losing half their upperclassmen before Christmas.   I guess they were just having too much fun.

Unless you attend the game, you really don't know how bad it is.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 22, 2005, 04:45:04 PM
There have been games played thoughout basketball history where the cosches have thought it was good to replace players on the floor with other players from the bench.  Sometimes those bench players were fresher, sometimes they matched up well with the other team's players, sometimes the coach wanted to talk to a player without calling a timeout, and other times the coach wanted the bench players to gain experience that would be valuable to the team as well as the players in the long run.  And there were even times when these substitutions were bad ideas.

But I wasn't at all of those games, so I guess I'm not permitted to comment.

::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 22, 2005, 05:36:59 PM
Dave,

But I wasn't at all of those games, so I guess I'm not permitted to comment.

You certainly can comment.  What I  do not appreciate is when someone who was not at the game tries to make a point contrary to what actually happened. 

I am not commenting on games I was not at.  I make my statements from a fan in the stands.  Simple as that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 22, 2005, 06:31:49 PM
DenisonFAN-  What hope does you're team have for the rest of the season... Do you totally feel like this team is going to lose the rest of their games because of the coach or lack of quality players?  I just want to see the BIGRED play to see if i agree with you guys.. LOL
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 22, 2005, 06:34:54 PM
Well, when they did put those guys back in it still went to hell in a handbasket. 30-13, my man, and many coaches are looking to get a lot of people minutes. After the first half it probably was a good idea to give people a chance.

And, you fail to recognize, at all, in any of your carping and moaning, how he limited his bench against Wabash, a WINNABLE NCAC game. No, you just carp and moan about a non-conference game where they were getting blown away even with the big guns.

Of course, can you see you view is sufficiently tainted now that you won't recognize anything good he is doing.

Yes, I've seen 11, 12, 13 man rotations, and not in a Grinnell system. It's about keeping people fresh, giving the opposition new and unique looks, matching up to the other players substitutions, a myriad of things.

Oh, and Wabash has had its share of defections and transfers, even during the season, over the past few years. How many juniors are on Wabash's roster? One, that's right. Only one. The rest have quit. Four players who started at some point in the last two years aren't playing anymore at Wabash, for whatever reason.

It's not just a Denison issue, it's part and parcel for the course.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 22, 2005, 07:42:20 PM
Earlhamalum,
I know you are an X player and from what I hear a pretty good one.  I respect your opinion and your thoughts.  One 1/25 you tell me if I am full of S##T.  I will wait for your comments.

Smed:
I am obviously going no where with you.  You were not there, so say whatever you want.

The fact is....and please disagree, you do not enter a gun fight with knives.

Wabash returned 7 key players off of last years team.  Who guit??  The guy who got the third most minutes on the team?  NO   Tony Julian guit.  WHY?  You seem to know all the answers.   Tell me why guys that have busted their butts for two years for a coach.  Finally have a winning season and finish 3rd in the conference quit???  Why would you do that??

Let's enjoy the holiday and hope 2006 brings some better times for the Big Red.   Because they can use all the help they can get.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 22, 2005, 08:09:42 PM
Kids quit all the time. Like I said, we had a half-time starter quit at midseason last year, because he said basketball wasn't fun anymore. We had a part-time starter quit two years ago at midseason and he's still a student at the college. We had a couple of kids who started as freshmen and played as sophomores not return this year.

I can't get into his head. For some kids, they realize that playing basketball and being a full time student is too much for them to handle, and they want to step back and enjoy just being a student.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 22, 2005, 09:54:22 PM
Steve Moore at Wooster, this season, only plays nine guys before garbage time, and that last guy, freshman Marty Bidwell, is only averaging 10.3 minutes per game. That number would be lower, perhaps down to 4 or 5 minutes, had not Wooster already played two system teams, Emory & Henry and Westminster.  Moore is in essence really only going with eight, and Wooster plays at a pretty quick pace.

The 10th man, Jamie Yoder, is actually a pretty good guard, but four better guards are already in the rotation.  After Yoder, the talent level drops markedly.  If Moore were to try to run even one or two of those guys into the fray when the game was still on the line, he'd be asking for big-time trouble.

This is pretty much how he's done it for years, basically a seven-nine man rotation.  It seems he'd prefer eight, but if that eighth man is too much of a drop-off, then he sits.  Same for the ninth man if he has only eight good players.  Plus, the minutes aren't spread evenly among those in the rotation, the top two or three guys get more.  No one comes out just to give another player a chance, they come out only for a blow or due to foul problems. This is competitive basketball, and he's playing to win.

And, to me, this seems to be pretty much the norm in college ball. I can think of only a few reasons why a coach might go deeper into his bench on a regular basis.  One, if he's running an ultra run-and-gun system.  Two, if the talent level among his players between 5-10 is so even that it makes little difference who's on the court (even then, I don't buy this, as too many bodies, too many changes, and too many combinations just can't help but hurt).  And, three, if it's getting late in the season, his team is going nowhere, and he wants to get a real look at his kids, to see what he has for next year.

I haven't seen Denison, but will when they come to Wooster, because now my interest is peaked.  I can't imagine that playing so many players, that making wholesale five for five changes, is helping them in any way.

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 22, 2005, 10:10:33 PM
Denison isn't coming to Wooster until next season (or at least this year's NCAC tourney), IIRC.  They and Oberlin are in the once-a-year pocket for Wooster. 

DenisonFan, everything you say about Coach Ghiloni and/or the DU players may be spot on for all I know.  But it seems like you refuse to consider Smeds' POV because "he wasn't there."  This is a message board with participants from all over the US.  (I for example am in the San Fernando Valley.)  If we limit commentary on game results, strategy, and management, we effectively kill the discussion.  You may not agree with what he has to say, but I wish it were for a different reason.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 22, 2005, 10:41:12 PM
Huh. With all of the guys that Denison plays, you'd think at least some of them could come to Wooster for a split-squad game...  ;)

How'd I pick up a karma point, anyway, and what can I do to get rid of it? ;-)

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 22, 2005, 11:03:35 PM
Wooster Booster -

I've seen it all - 6 man rotations and 13 man rotations. And I've seen coaches alter their rotations to fit the sub pattern of the other team, on the fly.

Wabash did a five in, five out for a while when they had a lot of younger players and it worked because it gave energy and the second five was a different team than the first five. And, Coach Petty also subbed in a couple more guys along the way during that time.

In conference season, I think rotations do tighten, especially later on as the jockeying for positions starts. But in non-conference I've always noticed some interesting rotation patterns for a lot of teams.

You never know who can play, really, unless you play 'em in a game during some meaningful time on the court. A practice dandy could turn into a dud toot sweet.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 22, 2005, 11:05:24 PM
Oh, and there's nothing more annoying when you're working at the scorers table than a coach who subs in reaction to the other teams subs at the very last second. You have the subs entered, you're ready to go, and....HONK! Then five seconds later....HONK! 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 22, 2005, 11:37:49 PM
Time out for a story.

Ten years ago, I was coaching one of my first volleyball teams, a bunch of 8th graders at Smithville high school.  My starters weren't exactly putting on an exemplorary performance. Balls were falling all over their half of the court, so many that we were behind about 9-0 and had yet to get the ball back over the net.  I decided it was time to make a statement.

I gathered six other girls from the bench (we had a million, they wouldn't let me cut) and asked them if they could do better.  They assured me that they could, surely knowing that, mathematically, they couldn't do any worse.  I called time out, then led the six subs to the scorer's table, absolutely certain that this would create havoc as the girl doing the book was also an eighth grader.

The referree, up on the ladder on the far side of the court, was just shaking his head, sure that his day was about to be made more difficult.  Nobody ever subs more than two girls at a time in volleyball.  The scorekeeping girl just raised an eyebrow, adjusted her glasses, and said, "Just give me the player numbers one at a time and tell me where you want them on the court, coach." I blinked, did as she said, and she had all six subs in the book, correctly, in about fifteen seconds.  If I'd owned a Fortune 500 company, I'd have hired her on the spot to run it.

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 23, 2005, 01:13:07 AM
The bad news:
Ashland 77, Hiram 57
Actually not so bad, if you stop and think how hopelessly Hiram is outclassed against a -- any -- D2 team.

The good news:
Wittenberg 60, Otterbein 43
It sound like Witt was in solid control throughout.  The box score isn't up yet, but I know that Borchers led the Tigers with 18 points, 8 rebounds.  Ott was held to just 16 first-half points in what sounds like another dominating performance by the Witt 'D'.

Ryan Maurer's press release (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/05-06gamestories/otterbein.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 23, 2005, 01:53:18 AM
Here's an early preview of next week's Mose Hole Classic:

Mose Hole Classic preview, by Hugh Howard, Wooster SID (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2005-06/mose_hole.php)

The teams playing are #2 Wooster (9-0), #17 Baldwin-Wallace (8-1), Lycoming (6-4), and Thiel (2-7).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 23, 2005, 08:04:53 AM
Oh, Thiel, what have you gotten yourself into??  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on December 23, 2005, 10:20:04 AM
For Witt and OWU fans:

Wittenberg and OWU legend Frank Shannon, age 88, passed away in his sleep Tuesday morning in Delaware, Ohio.

Shannon coached at Wittenberg and Ohio Wesleyan.

He was born Nov. 25, 1917 in Parkersburg, WV

He is in the Wittenberg Hall of Honor and was the Tigers' leading scorer for 2 years and won All-Conference honors.

Shannon served as a Major in General Douglas MacArthur's G2 staff in South Pacific.

After the service, he returned to Springfield to coach basketball at Olive Branch High School, now known as Tecumseh High School. Here he coached  NBA Hall of Famer Wayne Embry and Dave Zeller, who also had a fine NBA career.

Shannon also coached at Urbana High School before finishing his career at Ohio Wesleyan. He was at OWU for 30 years as the basketball coach, retiring in 1979. He retired with 214 wins, which ranked  first at OWU and sixth in the OAC.

Shannon also is in the Ohio Basketball Hall of Fame.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 23, 2005, 10:21:40 AM
I understand that people leave the program for various reasons.

But it was the rumor in the stands that these guys left because of all the negativity that not only Ghiloni but the entire staff see to dish out.

Again, that was what I heard.  Right or wrong I think it is sad that anyone should leave.  But this is DIII ball.  It is not like they lose their scholarship should they leave the program.  Heck, IM ball can be fun.

I am sorry that I have been riding Ghiloni so hard. I just hope he has some plan B.  Because plan A doesn't seem to be working.

So I am done with my bashing.  I am glad to have this forum to vent. 

We will see what the new year has in store.  Earlhamalum, do I think Denison could lose the rest of their games.  Certainly not.  I just hope they can get their heads turned in the right direction and just do it on their own if Ghiloni insists on playing eleven guys.   

When you see us play.  I will be VERY interested in hearing what you think.   

Merry Christmas everyone!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on December 23, 2005, 01:46:01 PM
I've been reading the Denison related posts with great interest as I have seen the Big Red play a handful of times this year.  I think it is obvious that the rotation has grown because the upperclassmen haven't done what is necessary to achieve any real measure of success.

The NCAC is one of the better conferences in the country, with a number of players that have enough talent to contribute to mid-major D1 programs.  What sets the better NCAC programs apart from the rest of the conference is tradition, leadership, and EFFORT.  Denison can't do anything about their tradition, but the current group can certainly take steps to improve the other two areas.  I'm not going to name names, but I've seen very little leadership from the upperclassmen on the Denison roster.  It's no surprise that when times have gotten tough, some choose to walk away.

Effort is another matter altogether.  I'm not talking about how hard someone plays during the season.  I'm talking about the kind of effort that it takes to get in the weightroom when no one is demanding it.  I'm talking about working as hard on the defensive end as the offensive end (although even that effort is questionable - just an aside, but standing underneath the basket with your hands in the air doesn't mean you're open).  I'm talking about committing to do whatever is necessary to make your team better.

Asided from a shortage of talent relative to the conference elite, Denison's greatest weakness is the selfishness and lack of understanding from those players who have been around for three or four years.  They just don't get what it means to sacrifice.  Wooster is the perfect example (and I'll grant that they are extremely talented) - the Scots are a joy to watch because they don't care about anything other than winning.  They make the extra pass, they cover for one another, etc.

Be careful about making judgements based on "rumor in the stands."  The reality is that winners learn, improve, and overcome while losers complain to their parents and friends, criticize others, and never think to examine themselves to determine if they are doing everything necessary to be successful.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 23, 2005, 02:08:28 PM
 :o

Beware of flying gauntlets!  Looks like it may be a Big Red Christmas in here.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 23, 2005, 02:50:58 PM
CentralOH -

That was a pretty fair first post.  Now don't go resting on your laurels, keep them coming!

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 23, 2005, 03:47:59 PM
Hey, now can we get some Kenyon and Hiram fans in here to throw around some dope? What happened to our OWU contingent? Barry??? Barry???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on December 23, 2005, 04:02:35 PM
Thanks Jack.  I'll try to keep up with the big boys.  As for Kenyon and Hiram, I wasn't aware that they had any fans...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 23, 2005, 04:13:23 PM
We had some Lords fans post during football season, so SOME are out there.

All I have to say is that I remember when Denison was as miserable as Oberlin - and now they are not. That says something.

(Not counting the odd years when Oberlin is good - that happens once in a while - legally even!)

You all have a great Holiday season and I'll see you in Chadwick, hopefully!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on December 23, 2005, 04:31:11 PM
I agree that there has been progress at Denison.  They are getting better players than they once did.  That's a start, but if they want to climb from the middle of the pack, those players will have to outwork their competitors.

At some point, you need your juniors and seniors to "buy in" and show the young guys the way.

It doesn't hurt if you can also start to recruit players from winning high school programs.  Show me a good player from a bad team, and most of the time, I'll show you a guy who couldn't or wouldn't lead.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooly on December 23, 2005, 04:47:06 PM
Benn reading all the post on Denison and just could not keep quiet any longer.  Couch at Denison is the nicest coach and teacher you would want to know but simply put, could not coach his way out of a bag.  If you have ever attended a game he is usually panic stricken and looks to his Assit. for an answer way too much for a head coach to  do.  Who is in charge?  One mistake and you are toast.  On the bench you go.  Never a positive remark out of his mouth during or after a game.  If you happen to hit a game winning shot, please show no emotion or you will be asked to keep it down and will receive a good talking to.  They is no fun in the game anymore.  division 3 basketball is all about kids that just want to  play.  For the love of the game.  It is up to the coaches to make it at least alitltle more fun.  I believe those kids should work hard on and off season.  As hard as they can.  But there is a fun side to basketball and that needs to be looked at also.  I have no one playing I am just a fan that has watched this program for a couple of years and think it is now time for an inner look into the other aspects of coaching that the coach at Denison lacks.  Make it a little fun for them.  Give them a reason the come to the games.

Thats it.  I now feel better anfter venting!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 23, 2005, 04:57:09 PM
It's interesting to see how divergent these viewpoints are regarding Denison and Coach Ghiloni.  It's almost as if some of our new friends have axes to grind... ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooly on December 23, 2005, 05:05:00 PM
Axes?? no not an ax to grind.  A viewpoint.    Hopefully it will get better after the break, but I am afraid it will not.  I do not see things turning around for a while.  I know they will win a few games this year like at Obelin and possibly Kenyon, but I am afraid all the competitive juices are dried up!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on December 23, 2005, 05:24:44 PM
I'm trying to represent another side to the argument that coaching is the primary problem with the Big Red.  I'll be among the first to admit that Coach G isn't the strongest X's & O's guy in the business and I doubt anyone would describe him as an eternal optimist, but he's been a coach for quite a while and he has had some success.  That success has come while working with tough kids who will do anything to win.  I'm just not sure that this group has a winners mentality.

It's been my experience that the fun results when a group of guys commits to one another and each is willing to sacrifice for the good of the team.  Truly special teams are special before they ever win a game - you can see it during practice or when they are together away from the gym.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 23, 2005, 07:37:46 PM
You know, basketball should be fun, but even at the D-3 level, it's not high school. You need to conduct yourself a certain way, work hard a certain way, and give effort much like you give in the classroom. No, there are no scholarships but it's still a privelege to play college hoops.

Although, in Indiana, I've seen high school coaches work their kids like dogs squeezing every inch out of 'em.

Maybe what Denison needs is for Hodgkinson or Hern to step up and pull a Jimmy from Hoosiers. Do they have it in 'em?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 23, 2005, 09:45:23 PM
Jimmy from Hoosiers... NO, there is no way.   I'm sorry ya'll are from a prep lil town in Ohio... there is no Such thing as jimmy land in Ohio... i'm just not buying what ur selling.  It is X-mas time, things like that should be easy to sell, but not even Denison can sell me that... not even at this time of YEAR!   

MERRY CHRISTMAS  EVERYONE!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 23, 2005, 11:39:13 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 23, 2005, 04:57:09 PM
It's interesting to see how divergent these viewpoints are regarding Denison and Coach Ghiloni.  It's almost as if some of our new friends have axes to grind... ???


I can't recall a coach taking such a beating on this board. By anyone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 24, 2005, 12:50:56 AM
Ghiloni was the NCAC Coach of the Year last season.  I get that Denison fans are frustrated with the current losing streak, but I think Coach Ghiloni has earned a year of benefit of the doubt capital.  I'd love to see Denison turn it around and have a respectable year...but sometimes the wheels just come off during a season.  The Big Red have lost some players this year, some younger players need some court time.  Hodgkinson and Hern can't play 40 minutes every night.  Teams can't consistently run a 6-man rotation and expect not to get beat by fatigue.  It sounds to me like Ghiloni is playing the hand he's been dealt...for better or worse.  Clearly, Coach Ghiloni has been thrown under the bus here in the last few weeks...I think it might be wise to wait until January before the Big Red faithful start backing said bus over him. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 24, 2005, 08:32:13 AM
Earlhamalum -

It was a metaphor! Besides, I still think Denison will have a winning NCAC record this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on December 24, 2005, 10:12:44 AM
I agree Wally.  Here's hoping that some time away will renew the Big Red and that 2006 will be better than the end of 2005.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 24, 2005, 10:26:21 AM
smedindy- ... I KNOW   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 24, 2005, 11:09:45 AM
I LOVE ALL THE NEW FACES AND YOUR COMMENTS!!

WHAT I WOULD DEARLY LOVE IS IF GHILONI WOULD COME ON LINE AND DEFEND HIMSELF.

I KNOW THAT WILL NEVER HAPPEN BUT I SURE WOULD LOVE TO HEAR HIS SIDE OF THE STORY.

I THINK HE IS TRYING TO COACH THESE MEN LIKE HE DID THIS BISHOP READING (SPELLING) KIDS. IT'S NOT GOING TO WORK.  SUDDENLY HE HAS MEN THAT HAVE AN OPINION AND QUESTION WHAT HE IS DOING.  IF HE WANTS ROBOTS HE SHOULD GO BACK TO HIGH SCHOOL COACHING.

MERRY CHRISTMAS EVERYONE!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on December 24, 2005, 11:57:08 AM
Being an OWU alum I was extremely saddened to hear about the passing of Frank Shannon.  Thanks to witt4ever for passing along that information.  Merry Christmas to everyone. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 24, 2005, 12:08:04 PM
I agree with DenisonFan that it can be challenging to deal with "men that have an opinion and question what he is doing."  It's even harder to do that and coach their sons at the same time. ;)

As far as I am concerned, Coach Ghiloni doesn't have a "side of the story" and has no need to "defend himself."  It's the way debate seems to work in this country nowadays: if you don't like what someone is doing, throw out an ad hominem attack and keep your adversary on the defensive.  In my day we called this the "when did you stop beating your wife" approach.  Until conclusive proof is demonstrated to the contrary, I believe that Coach Ghiloni and his staff are acting in the best interests of the players, the team, and the university. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 24, 2005, 04:40:04 PM
Why should the coach defend himself? Remember the state of Denison hoops before he arrived. It was pretty dismal.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 24, 2005, 05:27:29 PM
and most importantly, why should have to explain himself to anyone on a website, who is posting anonymously, and clearly has some sort of fixation?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pupfan on December 24, 2005, 05:30:38 PM
David, you meant Hiram was "outmanned" against Ashland, as opposed to "outclassed", right?  After all, all of the NCAC schools are elite academic insitutions and are not "outclassed." Is was only a four point deficit at the half.

Quote from: David Collinge on December 23, 2005, 01:13:07 AM
The bad news:
Ashland 77, Hiram 57
Actually not so bad, if you stop and think how hopelessly Hiram is outclassed against a -- any -- D2 team.

The good news:
Wittenberg 60, Otterbein 43
It sound like Witt was in solid control throughout.  The box score isn't up yet, but I know that Borchers led the Tigers with 18 points, 8 rebounds.  Ott was held to just 16 first-half points in what sounds like another dominating performance by the Witt 'D'.

Ryan Maurer's press release (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/05-06gamestories/otterbein.html)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 24, 2005, 06:03:00 PM
Hey! A Terrier sighting! Welcome aboard - don't be shy. How does Hiram look this year compared to other years??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 24, 2005, 06:05:53 PM
I certainly have a higher regard for Hiram than Ashland as an instution of higher education.  Much, MUCH higher.  My use of the term "outclassed" was not meant to suggest anything other than the relative prowess of Hiram's basketball program when compared to D2 (i.e., semi-pro) outfits.  Let's face it; Hiram doesn't fare well even against other D3 schools, much less against players on scholarship.  I'm glad the Terriers were able to compete with the Eagles, and I'd have been thrilled if they had won.   :)

I hope everyone is enjoying a wondderful holiday weekend (even if you don't celebrate a holiday this weekend.)  Of course, what's not to enjoy, when it's brilliantly sunny and in the mid-70s?  Oh, sorry, I guess it's not like that everywhere.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 24, 2005, 06:12:36 PM
MERRY
                             
          CHRISTMAS  
                                                           
                            EVERYONE![/size]
[/b]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 24, 2005, 06:34:42 PM
Just wanted to wish everyone in here

MERRY CHRISTMAS!!!
[/b]

HO HO HO!!!
[/b]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 24, 2005, 07:04:03 PM
DC,

Yeah, it was in the 70s and sunny here in South Texas today and that's pretty typical for this time of year. Which is why I always thought "White Christmas" was some sort of KKK anthem.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 24, 2005, 10:00:59 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on December 24, 2005, 11:09:45 AM
I LOVE ALL THE NEW FACES AND YOUR COMMENTS!!

There's no need to shout. We can all hear you just fine.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 24, 2005, 11:49:07 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 24, 2005, 06:05:53 PM
I hope everyone is enjoying a wondderful holiday weekend (even if you don't celebrate a holiday this weekend.)  Of course, what's not to enjoy, when it's brilliantly sunny and in the mid-70s?  Oh, sorry, I guess it's not like that everywhere.  ;D
Now now, there's no need to gloat... ;)

Actually, today was quite pleasant here in Ohio, given the frigid temps we've been dealing with over the last month or so.  It actually broke 50 according to my car's thermometer! :o  I was almost tempted to hit the COW golf course, but it was still pretty sloshy.  I guess I'll take what I can get here in balmy Ohio??? ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 26, 2005, 12:32:48 PM
DC:
I agree that Ghiloni doesn't have to defend himself.  I was kidding.  Obviously this is not the forum he should even worry about.  This is strickly for the frustrated fans.  I also agree that he thinks he is doing what is right.  No coach intentionally tanks the program.  I just question some of his choices.  Pure and simple.

Smed:
The program sucked because they had NO players.  Ghiloni did not bring Hodgkinson, Izzo or Hern to this program.  They came on their own.  So PLEASE don't give me "he turned it around crap".  He had nothing to do with it.   When Hodgkinson, Hern and Izzo leave....then let's see how good they are!!!!

I have seen the future when he plays his all freshman and sophomore line-up and if that is an indication of what is to come it is going to be hard to watch.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 26, 2005, 02:04:49 PM
Hmmm...so two juniors came despite of the coach, not because of the coach and a senior decided to come anyway even after there was a coaching change ??? ???

I know D-3 is different recruiting than D-1 but you still would think that a basketball player is going to be influenced some by the coach and the program in general. You just don't say "I love the school but I'll be miserable playing here" and pack your bags if you are serious about playing hoops (or any sport).

The three years before he arrived, Denison won just 16 games total. Last year they won 13 and it can be said that all but the senior class was his. "Turned it around", "rebuilding" - say what you will.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 26, 2005, 02:41:14 PM
Well, I recall that Hodgkinson had an older brother that played for the Big Red.  So perhaps the recruiting credit should go to whoever recruited the older brother.  But otherwise point taken.

Here's what I don't get: according to DF, the Big Three of Hern, Hodgkinson, and Izzo don't play enough and should be left in for more minutes.  But the program's success (such as it is) is evidently due to these guys (and not the coaches), and the program is going to crash and burn when they leave. ("Ghiloni did not bring Hodgkinson, Izzo or Hern to this program.  They came on their own.  So PLEASE don't give me "he turned it around crap".  He had nothing to do with it.   When Hodgkinson, Hern and Izzo leave....then let's see how good they are!!!!")  But if you are concerned about the future of the program, wouldn't you want to play the underclassmen?  Next year in the preseason we'll be talking about how good Denison looks because they return 4 starters and 10 lettermen who each averaged at least 9 minutes per game, and only two of these guys will be seniors.  That doesn't sound too bad to me!

The coaches are playing 11 guys on a regular basis.  You might rationalize that it's not good for this year's team success, or that it's not good for the future of the program, but not both.  It sounds a little like the old Woody Allen joke where two women complain about the food service at a Catskills resort: "The food here is awful." "Yes, and such small portions!"

(*Aside*: Hodgkinson and Hern lead the team in minutes at 28.5 and 28.1 minutes each, which basically means they sit 5-6 minutes per half, disregarding time on the bench at the end of blowouts.  Izzo averages 22 mins, about the same as Krantz and Julian.  By way of comparison, Port and Witucky average 30 and 28 mins for Wooster, and Russ, Borchers, and Brady are all in the 26-27 mpg range for Wittenberg.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 26, 2005, 03:39:11 PM
Hodgkinson did have an older brother that graduated in 03" Ghiloni's first year.
Hern was a freshman in 03 and he liked it so well he left to go to Ohio State his sophomore year.  This is only his third year in the program.

How Izzo got there I have no idea.  Does Ghiloni and his band of  assistant coaches do a lot of recruiting in Chicago.  Maybe.  Let's check the roster?????????  NONE besides Hodgkinson and Izzo. So in the last two years he has gotten not one player from Illinois.  So we know how Hodgkinson got there.  Why Izzo showed up is a mystery.   So Ghiloni go lucky.  It happens.  But I don't think he had anything to do with getting anyone one of those three.

As far as minutes played.  It is not about that at all.  It's about the rotation.  He can not take and sit Hodgkinson and Hern down at the same time.  Nobody plays 40 minutes a game unless you go to Oberlin.  Other than that everyone needs a breather.   It is just how you use those sub minutes that is key.  And I think Ghiloni has done a poor job of it.

You don't sit your two best shooters down at the same time.  Stats don't lie.  Hodgkinson and Hern are your best option to score.   Find a rotation that gives them a rest and still keeps at least one on the floor.  I think even I could work up such a rotation.

Court management.  It seems when you watch Denison play Ghiloni is always looking up and down the bench.  It's like he gets confused.  Maybe some of his many assistants can help him out.

Time will tell.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 26, 2005, 03:55:57 PM
You set your best two down if:

1. They both are tired.
2. They both are in foul trouble.
3. They're not playing defense like they should.
4. They're not giving effort.

etc. etc.

I've always noticed Denison, Kenyon, Oberlin, etc. seem to have a wider recruiting berth than most of the NCAC, due to the 'name' of the school.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 26, 2005, 04:04:40 PM
Also, Hern came BACK, if you see. He didn't have to come back. But he did.

And in looking at last seasons stats - Hern and Hodgkinson each played 28 minutes a game - and 10 players averaged at least 10 minutes a game when they played.

Sounds like its kind of similar - just stretched a bit.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 26, 2005, 06:06:54 PM
Wasn't Denison's poor start being similar to last year already discussed in here?  I think what has happened is that last year's strong finish may have caused some expectations to be higher than they should have been.  From my vantage point, Denison's start is eerily similar to last year, with the exception of the shocker they pulled off in beating Wittenberg last year.  That win made them 3-7 through 10 games last year and they are 2-8 this year after 10 games.  Last season they did get some nice wins like  Witt and OWU,  but, they still  were swept by Wabash, they lost 2 out of 3 to Earlham, Witt came back to shell them in the rematch and they lost badly in their only meeting with Wooster.  Denison even lost to HIRAM last year in case anyone was wondering.  Personally, I just think this was a case of high expectations when the reality is, Denison is just a middle of the conference team.  I think Smeds brought it up about  how this is shaping up to be a repeat of last year for Denison.  Once they get into the meat of the conference schedule, the Big Red should win more conference games than they lose just like last year.  But they still won't get over on the top half of the league (Wabash, OWU and EC), just like last year. 

My question is, were you Denison fans this critical of Ghiloni last year at this time when the Big Red was 3-7?  Highly doubtful, because one of those 3 wins was against Witt, even though one of the 7 losses was to Hiram.  Things worked out though and Denison went on to have one of their most successful seasons in recent memory nearly matching the total number of wins Denison had accumulated over the previous 3 seasons combined!  Now the Big Red have basically the same start to last season and suddenly Ghiloni is on the hot seat?  I just don't get it... ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 26, 2005, 07:16:05 PM
I don't think Ghiloni is on the hot seat from those that matter at Denison. I will be watching avidly at Chadwick this year to see signs of discontent, and keeping my ears open to see if there's a rogue or two in the stands.

I've covered basketball for (sigh) almost 20 years and I've known some HS fans that would always throw their coach under a bus. One HS in this area is famous for having fans and parents be coaches in the stands and big time second and third guessers.

That, of course, is not constructive.

Scots Fan - thanks for remembering last year as well. Denison could give Earlham and OWU games at home, and definitely are the class of Kenyon, Hiram, Oberlin and possibly 'Gheny.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 26, 2005, 07:29:21 PM
There have been over 40 posts over the holiday weekend (12/23 through present) in this room, and my very non-scientific observation is that makes this the most active room in Posting Up during this period.

And practically all of the talk is about Denison.

Now, if I had told you in September that this is what would occur, how many of you would have thought I was around the bend?  :D

Now if only we can conjure a coaching "issue" in Gambier...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TheRed on December 26, 2005, 11:47:14 PM
Okay....i can't take listening to Denisonfan any longer.  You have no idea what is going on with the team, but you continue to give your insight on everything.  You jump to conclusions about Ghiloni and the team with no understanding of what is actually going on behind closed doors.  He's not a fool and if certain guys were getting the job done there would not be any of this talk about rotation or playing time or anything.  A lot of things that have happened this year were bound to happen and not due to Ghilonis coaching this year.  I don't care that any of you know who I am and I'll make it pretty easy to figure out by telling you that I played for him for 3 years and have the upmost respect for him as a person and a coach.  I don't really like message boards, nor have I ever posted on one, but people like DenisonFan drive me nuts.  Just don't go throwing out comments just to have something to say without knowing more about the game and the issues the team faces.  Do your homework.

Also, this comment is unreal..."I THINK HE IS TRYING TO COACH THESE MEN LIKE HE DID THIS BISHOP READING (SPELLING) KIDS. IT'S NOT GOING TO WORK.  SUDDENLY HE HAS MEN THAT HAVE AN OPINION AND QUESTION WHAT HE IS DOING.  IF HE WANTS ROBOTS HE SHOULD GO BACK TO HIGH SCHOOL COACHING."  I'm sure Wooster's guys don't have a bunch of "men" questioning Coach Moore.  This is college basketball.  If everyone had a say in what was going on, Coach G would be playing 20 guys instead of 10-12.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 27, 2005, 12:15:45 AM
Article:  Special Olympians appreciate simple gift from Denison Men's Basketball Team

http://www.newarkadvocate.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051209/OPINION02/512090330/1014

Just a nice article about Coach Ghiloni.  It shows the Big Red giving back to the community and giving up their time to help others.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 27, 2005, 09:12:21 AM
I bet the whole team got in on that as well! That's a great story.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on December 27, 2005, 10:46:09 AM
Kudos to TheRed for providing his perspective.  I am pleased to see that others find DenisonFan's view to be a little skewed.

It's nice to see that even through a holiday weekend, NCAC hoops is still top of mind with this crowd.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 27, 2005, 12:03:12 PM
Yeh TheRed,

Since you played and you are soooooo tight with the team.  Do me a HUGE favor and contact
Hern, Hodgkinson, and Izzo and get their take.  Because I am obviously full of crap.  I need you to hear from your x teammates about their take on what is going on this year.

Then when you are done with those three, contact Julian, Harris and Wagnor.  I am sure they will give you the "real" story of why they left the program.

Then come back here and tell be what they said.  Why do I think that you won't do this??
Because you won't like what they say??

Smed:

They are both tired at the same time???  Then you sit one down before the other.  It is all about the rotation.  They aren't playing defense???  Who is, we lose by 30 points a game.

I am sorry that I have caused such a reaction.  But guess what, isn't that what this is all about.

I really can't wait to hear back from TheRed on the "teams" veiw. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 27, 2005, 12:10:01 PM
earlhamalum,
Thanks for the tip on the artical.  That was very nice.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 27, 2005, 12:27:37 PM
I remember one game on national TV and Missouri was playing. The Tigers gave up about three or four easy baskets after halftime and Stormin' Norman Stewart pulled his starters and put in three walk ons and two scrubs. That bunch kept the Tigers pretty close.

The Tigers still lost - but by gosh the message was sent to the starters and they played hard the rest of the game.

And again, when you're playing Witt, Wooster, and Akron, the studs could have played 40 minutes and still they would have lost, big time. Same with Capital, seeing the box score aftermath.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 27, 2005, 12:33:28 PM
Oh, and the 'why don't you call X up" is pretty weak. Unless Ghiloni got abducted by aliens and his doppleganger is now coaching, based on the numbers from last year, the results of last year and this year all seems par with the course.

Why don't YOU poll coaches around the NCAC and Ohio and ask how they think he's doing with the Big Red.

PS - Several times this year Wabash has played without Medeiros and Joseph in the lineup - and sometimes with out those two and Zimmer (who comes off the bench, funny how that is..) No one averages more than 26 minutes and they seem to be doing fine.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 27, 2005, 01:06:18 PM
Smed,

I totally agree with you!!
I certainly hope that Denison does what they did last year.  Nothing would please me more than going 10-5 or better in the second half.  And I think they can.

As far as "x".  What should I have said??  Isn't that what TheRed's teammates are??  They are his X teammates.  It has NOTHING to do with Ghiloni.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 27, 2005, 07:26:38 PM
Anyone besides me getting the idea that DenisonFan is never going to be persuaded and this is going to continue on until the end of time?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 27, 2005, 07:49:33 PM
Never going to be persuaded?  Agreed.
Continue until the end of time?  No, I think he'll give up, at least as far as this forum is continued.

I hope Denison turns it around and becomes a consistently competitve team in the NCAC.  I hope that DenisonFan and CentralOH and TheRed others interested in DU hoops will still be here, watching the Big Red and reporting on them and providing insight the way Earlhamalum and CMHScotsFan and smedindy et alia do for their teams.  I hope this tempest in a teapot will result in a permanent Denison presence on this board. 

I also hope for peace on earth, an end to hunger, and a World Series title for the Cleveland Professional Baseball Club before I die.   :) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 27, 2005, 08:04:55 PM
We have hope, and we shall see. Denison definitely could be a permanently decent team. They have the resources for sure to compete. If 'Gheny, Denison and Kenyon can all be consistent, then the NCAC would be a pretty darn good league year after year and not have Wooster or Witt just annointed for the title, even with Oberlin and Hiram.

I know others have met Wooster and Witt in the conference finals in recent years, but usually it's one or t'other or both that are locks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on December 27, 2005, 09:00:43 PM
Much like TheRed, I am not typically a poster on any forum, but DF's oversimplification of the situation and unending badgering of Coach Ghiloni are more than I can take.  At the same time he has repeatedly mentioned Hodgkinson, Hern and Izzo like they are All-Americans.  They certainly have some natural ability, but how much better have they made themselves since arriving in Granville?  I'm sure that DF will see that as reinforcement of his take on Ghiloni's lack of coaching prowess, but in my opinion, it's an indictment of the big three's combined lack of a true work ethic.

As far as recruiting goes, what makes DF think the north shore of Chicago is the only place to uncover talent?  Like all major metropolitan areas there are some great players, but if heart is a factor, give me an Ohio or Indiana kid (heck I'd even take a kid from that state up north or one from western PA over some of the headcases that have found their way to DU).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 27, 2005, 10:36:14 PM
I'm surprised that more Indiana kids aren't recruited by the Ohio schools, but then there are a lot of Indiana options for players, so they tend to stay home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 28, 2005, 12:30:45 AM
Quote from: DenisonFan on December 27, 2005, 12:03:12 PM
Since you played and you are soooooo tight with the team.  Do me a HUGE favor and contact
Hern, Hodgkinson, and Izzo and get their take.  Because I am obviously full of crap.  I need you to hear from your x teammates about their take on what is going on this year.

Then when you are done with those three, contact Julian, Harris and Wagnor.  I am sure they will give you the "real" story of why they left the program.

Then come back here and tell be what they said.  Why do I think that you won't do this??
Because you won't like what they say??
DenisonFan, am I missing something here?  What could have possibly changed from last year when TheRed was on the team, to this year now that he's not there?  Suddenly the entire team now has a change of heart because they have started this year equally as poor as last year?  Do you somehow have inside information as to why the players that quit did so?  Players quit all the time in DIII athletics and its not always because they are disgruntled with the coach.  So instead of calling out former players that actually know what's going on in Coach Ghiloni's system, let's see you back up some of your statements with some facts DenisonFan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 28, 2005, 08:50:23 AM
My apologies if this has been posted here previously, but I noticed a link on Wooster's web site to an article on Kyle Witucky that was printed in the Zanesville Times Recorder on 12/20.

http://www.zanesvilletimesrecorder.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20051220/SPORTS/512200305/1006

The article mentions several of the points that were posted here a few weeks back regarding Kyle's unselfishness and how his contributions to the Scots go far beyond what you see in the boxscore.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on December 28, 2005, 10:29:12 AM
The great thing about that article is that it gives a true description of what Witucky is all about. So many times fans get so into the numbers game (driven by the media) that they often take for granted the intregal things that players bring to the team such as Witucky. I know one thing the Wooster fans are grateful that he chose to come to Wooster and will truly miss watching #20 step on the court next year...good luck this weekend SCOTS do the NCAC proud
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on December 28, 2005, 10:49:42 AM
Great story on Witucky.  He's the kind of guy you want on your team and to compete against.  A winner, plain and simple.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 28, 2005, 01:50:29 PM
On Vacation, so I put this together. (I have yet to play with tables so I hope this posts OK)

Team         Record             Opponent Record                   Opponent Record
                                          in Wins                                   in Loses

Alleghany     5-4                   11-31                                     24-12
Denison        2-8                   10-7                                       46-27
Earlham        4-6                   10-25                                     40-15
Hiram            2-6                   2-17                                       32-20
Kenyon         3-5                   5-21                                       27-19
Oberlin         0-10                  ----                                         59-28
OWU             6-3                   15-38                                      23-7
Wabash       6-3                     18-37                                     20-9
Wittenberg  8-1                     46-31                                       9-0
Wooster      9-0                      32-51                                    -----

Clearly Witt has beaten the toughest set of opponents and I would say Earlham has played a very tough schedule also, losing a number of close games. Wooster has beaten two ranked teams, Earlham away, and gets a shot at a third ranked team tommorrow, but the rest of the schedule has been relatively easy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 28, 2005, 01:57:11 PM
I am sooooooooo happy everyone enjoys dumbing on my head.
I'm a man, I can take the heat.  Believe me, if Denison starts winning some games I might go away.  But until then I will continue to question the methods being used.

As far as Chicago area kids.  My only point was that Ghiloni did not do anything to get them to
Denison.  Nothing more.  All DIII programs are on a very limited budget and can do only so much. 

As far as Hodgkinson, Hern and Izzo having no talent or limited talent is your opinion.  But since that is all the Big Red has perhaps Ghiloni should try and exploit them as much as he can.  I know, he does.  So forget that point.

As far as the ex-teammate contacting his former teammates.  Why is that so outrageous?  I just thought he would get the real story.   All I have is rumor why guys left.  Maybe they just didn't want to play anylonger.  That was not the word in the stands but that doesn't mean it is true.  So let THERED straighten it out for me.  I don't care that he loves Ghiloni.  That is great.   I don't hate Ghiloni.  And several of my fellow posters have made some very valid points.

But PLEASE remember, this is what this sight is all about.  It seems to me that many of you are taking it way too seriously.  I'm having fun and enjoy all your responses.

Let's see how Denison does this weekend in Cleveland.  I will need some new material.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 28, 2005, 03:02:11 PM
I bet Denison splits this weekend. Alfred has a winning record but looks beatable. Alma has won a few games in a row, but the competition has been weak and they looked mediocre at best against Wabash. Case looks tough. So Denison, I bet, finishes second or third.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 28, 2005, 04:10:31 PM
Speaking of Alfred, there was an article in the Wooster Daily Record today on  former Wooster HS standout Rob McCarter who attended the COW his freshman year (played JV) and decided to transfer to Alfred after his freshman year.  He is now in his junior year and is currently 4th on the team in scoring at 12.6 ppg.  Sounds like he may have been buried in the depth chart behind all of the guards at Wooster and he saw a better opportunity at Alfred and he is doing very well. 

Also, there was a nice writeup in yesterday's paper on Marty Bidwell.  Apparently he had offers to play football at some pretty good DI schools, but they wanted him to switch from RB to LB.  He was pretty set on wanting to play hoops in college so he focused on smaller schools.  Wooster was actually recruiting him to play football as well.  He contemplated playing both, but apparantly was convinced to stick with one or the other.  Personally, I'm glad Coach Moore won out over Coach Schmitz. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 28, 2005, 06:21:48 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on December 28, 2005, 01:57:11 PM
Believe me, if Denison starts winning some games I might go away. 

Suddenly I just became a huge Big Red fan. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 28, 2005, 06:28:32 PM
Final
Hiram 91
St. Olaf 88

Go Pups!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 28, 2005, 06:44:46 PM
         MY NCAC Top 10 Players in the Conference as of Today. (based on stats)


Order means nothing


All... Casey McCloskey- 16.4 PPG, 46% Fg(47-101), 47% 3pt(16-34), 30.7 MPG, 3.6 RPG, 45 Assist and 30 T.O's.

All... Mat Majzlik- 21.4 PPG, 60% Fg(65-108), 26.7 MPG, 7.7 RBG, 4 Assist, 17 T.O's.
(waterboy do u know why he hasn't played in 3 games this year?)

Den...Dan Hodgkinson- 15,1 PPG, 57% Fg(57-100), 28.5 MPG, 5.9 RPG, 1.3 SPG

Earl...Markous Jewett- 17.4 PPG, 55% Fg(59-108), 50% 3pt(13-26), 73% FTs,
5.6 RPG, 19 Assist, 23 T.O's.

Earl... LaRon Henry- 16.9 PPG, 60% Fg(63-106), 69% 3pt(16-23), 73% FTs,
3.2 RPG

Wab...Kyle Medeiros- 12.1 PPG, 48% Fg(42-88), 40% 3pt(14-35), 73% FTs,
28.1 MPG, 2.8 RPG, 23 Assist, 16 T.O's.

Witt...Dan Russ- 15.3 PPG, 58% Fg(49-84), 80% FTs, 26.5 MPG, 5.1 RPG,
26.5 MPG, 16 Assist, 13 T.O's.

Woo... James Cooper- 20.9 PPG, 54% Fg(73-136), 40 3pt(19-47), 79% FTs,
27.7 MPG, 2.7 RPG, 27 Assist, 18 T.O's.

Woo...Tom Port- 19.1 PPG, 51% Fg(64-125), 43% 3PT(20-47), 77% FTs
30.3 MPG, 5.2 RPG, 27 Assist, 14 T.O's

10th.... I'll leave this one up for debate... i'm sure people will have valid statements that will help me pick my 10th guy.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 28, 2005, 06:47:14 PM
Wittenberg, Wabash, OWU, Denison... all have deep benches. 

I think OWU does not have anyone playing more than 25.8 Minutes Per Game. 

The other 3 teams have a lot of guys in the Mid 25 MPG. Category.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 28, 2005, 06:56:25 PM
From the Zanesville article on Witucky:

"Witucky also carries a 3.6 GPA and will attend law school. Moore will certainly be sorry to see him go."

I'm not sure if Coach Moore means he'll be sorry to see Kyle leave, or sorry to see him go...to law school.  But either way I agree with him.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 28, 2005, 08:39:32 PM
QuoteFinal
Hiram 91
St. Olaf 88

Go Pups!   

Well, raise my rent!!!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 28, 2005, 09:55:03 PM
Final:  Green Quakers-   88
           Maroon Quakers- 81 

The actual score is close... Earlham was down 4 with 8 seconds left, and they were not going to foul, but a player on the Green Quakers  took a 3 point shot as time expired to make it a 7 point loss instead of a 4.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 29, 2005, 12:32:15 PM
I've created a place to discuss Division III baseball for those who are interested. If there's enough interest from NCAC fans we'll set up a separate NCAC board under the baseball board.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on December 29, 2005, 01:12:31 PM
I would have a hard time arguing with the 9 players listed, the only stat that seems to jump out on those 9 is only 4 assists for Mat Majzik from Gheny, I think there may be a new meaning for the "Black Hole". Does Dan Russ remind anyone else of Joe Dejean from Wabash a few years back??? Both are long and athletic and seem to play the best in the big games
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 29, 2005, 01:36:28 PM
Having seen only 4 of the other NCAC teams its a bit of a guess for Wabash, OWU, and Alleghany, but I have read the web site for Alleghany and I agree with DC's two picks (McCloskey and Majzlik) . They have the stats and seem to be delivering leadership on a much improved Gator team.

I would drop Hodgkinson and add Borchers. If I was playing pickup I would pick Borchers first every time.

I would also drop Kyle Medeiros and add Witucky. There have been a number of posts on Kyle's leadership. His 43-13 assist to turnover ratio just stands out.
Nobody has outstanding stats for Wabash, but they have a good record with close losses to good teams, so maybe I'll give the tenth spot to their starting lineup (i.e. - good team play).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 29, 2005, 03:29:30 PM
Well, it's hard to say for sure exactly how the two compare.  Russ plays on a very balanced team...DesJean was by far and away the primary option for Wabash during his last two or three years there.  If you look at the stats, DesJean was a much stronger rebounder than Russ is (DesJean averaged a double-double his sophomore year and very close to a double-double his last two seasons), a bit more of a shot blocker, and scored a few more points.  Russ has been playing somewhere around 25 minutes per game the last few years.  My recollection is that DesJean played more minutes than that. 

DesJean put up stronger numbers than Russ has....but Russ has been a key cog on two tournament teams.  I don't know who you'd pick there.  I think we can agree that both are/were outstanding players. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2005, 03:45:37 PM
Big matchup tonight at Timken as #2 Wooster hosts #17 Baldwin Wallace.

The Yellow Jackets currently lead the OAC at 4-0, 8-1 overall.  Wooster currently leads the NCAC at 4-0, 9-0 overall so this opening game in the Mose Hole Tournament is a dandy!

Should be some good individual matchups tonight as Wooster tries to contain Tori Davis (23.4 ppg) and the Yellow Jackets try to stop Cooper, Port and Vandervaart.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 29, 2005, 03:56:32 PM
Ought to be a good one tonight!  I can't remember all the details, but I seem to remember that the Scots had trouble with Tori Davis in the NCAA game last year. 

This is a very important game for the Scots and their QOWI.  I saw that in Pat's initial run, their's was only 9.333 because they've only played one opponent with an in-region percentage over .333!  There won't be too many chances to boost that number this season, so they need to take advantage of these opportunities!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 29, 2005, 04:17:08 PM
imderekpoe - I believe both Earlham and Witt are in region, but your point is well taken.

About ready to leave for Wooster, want to catch some of the first game.

I expect a good game with BW, I'm sure they will be pumped up.

Looking at their website, I would expect the matchups to be:

Schuler/Sekerak against Witucky/Cooper- probably in that order.
Aufmuth - VanHorn - their second bext player, shoots ~3 3FG/game
Gundert - Port - he is the bigger wing
Davis - Vandervaart - had him last year in the NCAA.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 29, 2005, 04:38:07 PM
Earlham's in-region record (the one that counts for QOWI) is only 2-7 (.222) so far!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2005, 05:44:59 PM
In regards to tonights matchup with Woo and BW, Tori did have a pretty good game against the Scots in that tournament game last year.  He went off for 25 points, but his brother Thad, didn't have his best game.  Also, BW had an off night shooting if I remember correctly.  Of course Wooster's defense was a major contributor to that.  Tonight should be a good one.  I don't expect the Scots to have as easy a time as they did last year.   Hopefully, they can get the win, not only for bragging rights over the OAC, but also for those all too valuable QOWI points as imderekpoe pointed out.  Hope to see a good crowd tonight even without the students.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2005, 05:48:18 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on December 29, 2005, 12:32:15 PM
I've created a place to discuss Division III baseball for those who are interested. If there's enough interest from NCAC fans we'll set up a separate NCAC board under the baseball board.
Thanks Pat.  That will be nice to have in here.  I think the CCIW was the place to go last season to talk D3 baseball, if my memory serves me correct.

Also, considering that Wooster is the preseason #1 ranked team in the country, there just might be some extra interest from NCAC fans.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 29, 2005, 08:12:33 PM
There's already a preseason ranking for baseball??  Dang. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on December 29, 2005, 11:33:43 PM
Nobody wants to post the final score?? I'm sure it is a sad day in Wooster after a 113-108 setback in double OT. It looks like Tori Davis was just unstoppable inside. But the Woo Crew need not worry too much because going undefeated is a nearly impossible task these days and I have no fears that we'd drop another for a long while given the schedule. So keep your heads up Scots and just learn from these mistakes tonight as these are the types of games we'll be seeing well into March I'm sure. GO SCOTS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 29, 2005, 11:47:53 PM
Some thoughts on tonight's excellent double-overtime game at Wooster, won by BW, 113-108.

Just as against Wittenberg, Wooster failed to come out of the blocks with the necessary intensity to compete and fell behind 9-0. A timeout righted the ship, they went on a run of their own to even the game at around 13, but it would be nice to see them ready to fight from the opening tip rather than have to continually come from behind against the good teams.

Tori Davis was virtually unstoppable tonight, shooting 20-29 from the floor, all on very close to the basket shots.  Vandervaart more than had his hands full, but he never stopped trying.  I thought that Evan Will fared a little better, and I'm seeing improvement in his play every game.

Port himself had another fantastic game, scoring, rebounding, and defending.  I also found out that he's definitely eligible to play next season, should he decide to remain in school.  I sure hope that's his choice.  

In the second half I kept hoping that Steve Moore would try Port on Davis, since nothing else was working, and Port had fouls to give.  I think he would have had more success, maybe providing a few needed stops.

For the most part, James Cooper had his one-on-one game taken away from him tonight by some excellent defense.  When that happens, and it's rare, he's revealed as a one dimensional player who rarely seems to contribute in other areas.  If he's not scoring, he's not doing much else, and just looks very unmotivated.  Near the end of the contest, Coach Moore was subbing Cooper and Johnson offensively and defensively.  I kept hoping that Johnson would remain in the game, as he was bringing much more to the table.

Wooster will probably drop a handful of spots in the next poll, and that's understandable.  Their inside defense will continue to be a problem.  They'll need to outscore good teams with quality big men like Russ or Davis.  Sometimes they'll be able to, and sometimes they won't.

Jack



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 29, 2005, 11:55:59 PM
Just back from Wooster...

First, congrats to B-W.  They made the plays when they needed to and the Scots didn't.  Wooster had no answer for Tori Davis tonight.  Vandervaart/Will were unable to deny him the ball and once he had it in the paint, it was pretty automatic.  For some reason, on B-W's posessions with time running out in regulation and the 1st overtime, he didn't even touch the ball!  Both times another player drove to the basket, and missed a tough shot.

The Scots could have easily won this game.  With the Scots ahead by 6 or 7 with 10:30 left, they proceeded to go 10 straight posessions without scoring, with turnovers on 5 of them.

Overall, it was a good, exciting game, but could have been a little better played.  I would have rather seen this as the championship game, after both teams had a chance to knock some of the rust off.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2005, 12:13:04 AM
Sounds like defense was an issue, or was the offense just that good?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 30, 2005, 12:14:38 AM
Another great game at Timken tonight.  Wish it could have ended on a little better circumstances, but oh well, you can't win them all I guess.  There was a nice crowd on hand, although they weren't especially loud, but that is expected when the students are gone.  There were almost 2700 which is a good crowd for a weeknight game.  Its just disappointing the outcome couldn't have been different.  

Hats off to BW and more specifically, Mr. Davis.  He is a class act.  The man dropped 42 points on Wooster and he didn't showboat one bit the entire game.  It was business as usual for him.  It was refreshing to see such a competitor go about his business without trying to show off while he was at it.  Their whole team seemed very classy to me.  I don't really remember any of their players trying to show up Wooster or the crowd.  They were all there to take care of business and that was to win the game, which is exactly what they did.

Wooster can't feel too bad in losing.  This was not their best effort by far tonight.  Yet it still took a monster game (and that might be putting it mildly) by Tori Davis and it took BW 2 OT's to finally pull off the upset.  

This was by far the poorest shooting effort by Wooster this season, especially in the 2nd half.  In the 1st half, the Scots were 6-12 from 3-point range, but they finised only 11-30, and they were getting good looks.  And it didn't just seem like Wooster was struggling from beyond the arc.  There were a lot of easy bunnies that just weren't going down for Wooster tonight.  It got to a point where you just had to say, this isn't going to be our night, and yet Wooster still almost pulled it out.  

Port had another very solid game with 30 points and 15 rebounds, I believe.  He seemed to be all over the court.   He could have probably had close to 40 if some of his easy bunnies would have fallen.  I too am hopeful of him usisng all of his eligibility.  Vandervaart finished with 15, but he missed a lot of easy shots as well.  Hats off also to Tyler Sekarak.  He drew the defensive assignment on James Cooper and did a phenomenal job!  He was on Cooper all night and you could tell James was getting a bit frustrated.  Cooper finished with only 9 points, which was another key stat that factored in this loss.  Finally, I seem to say this after every game, but Brandon Johnson just keeps getting better and better.  Tonight he finished with 15 points, and he did take an ill advised shot at the end of the 1st OT, but he just doesn't play like a freshman.  He is going to be a special player if he continues to improve like he has over the first month of the season!

Overall, a disappointing loss, but like MoneyBall said, its nearly impossible these days to go undefeated, and they lost to a very good team.  I said earlier in the season that it seemed like there were several teams in the OAC that you could consider as favorites, depending on what week it was.  After seeing BW tonight, I would think you could pencil them in as solid favorites to win that conference if they continue to play like they did tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 30, 2005, 12:24:15 AM
Smeds,

To answer your question, I'd say it was more a case of 2 really good offenses going at it.  BW was coming into the game averaging over 90 ppg. and Wooster is averaging 100+ ppg. so it was pretty predictable that we were going to be watching a track meet which is exactly what we got.  The defensive job done on Cooper by BW was very good as I said.  And as for the defensive effort by Vandervaart and Will on Davis.  I just think Davis was having one of those nights where he couldn't miss.  He was in a zone tonight and would have been hard to stop regardless of who was on him. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2005, 12:45:05 AM
So how often does Wooster play in the consolation game of that tourney, anyway? I assume it's pretty rare.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gordonmann on December 30, 2005, 01:26:49 AM
I think this is the first time it's ever happened, per the release.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 30, 2005, 01:35:32 AM
A friend told me how the unlikely matchup of BW and Wooster came to take place on the first night.  Apparently Lycoming, after initially agreeing to come to the tournament, balked at having to play Wooster on the first night.  They were accommodated.  I'd have told them to find somewhere else to play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2005, 07:49:24 AM
It's not as easy as you think to fill a tourney up, though. Wabash had to cancel it's Pete Thorn tourney when someone pulled out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on December 30, 2005, 09:34:00 AM
Congrats to the Denison Big Red for getting back in the win column after a tough stretch.  It was a pretty balanced effort with 4 guys in double figures and 9 players logging double digit minutes.  Nice to see Mike Shea and Shea McMahon with solid contributions.

Now let's hope they can string two wins together and beat Alma tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2005, 10:27:30 AM
Ah, so where's Denison Fan now??  ;)

Like I said before, Alma didn't look good in its first game of the year, but are now 7-3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on December 30, 2005, 11:03:19 AM
smed,

Did you see Alma in the consolation vs. UT-Dallas?  UTD hasn't had much success so far this year, but I'm just wondering about Denison's chances this afternoon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 30, 2005, 11:07:22 AM
Congrats to the Big Red.  I will always take the W.

Truth be told the Shea's stepped up with 19 points and 12 boards.  Hopefully they will continue to help. 

Alfred shot extremely poorly from the line and couldn't hit a three to save their lives.
Let's see what happens today against Alma who lives from the 3 point line.

Again, good job Big Red!!

Let's get another one.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 30, 2005, 12:00:52 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 30, 2005, 12:45:05 AM
So how often does Wooster play in the consolation game of that tourney, anyway? I assume it's pretty rare.

Quote from: gordonmann on December 30, 2005, 01:26:49 AM

I think this is the first time it's ever happened, per the release.
Actually, it's the first time since 1985, per the release.  The Mose Hole has been around for 43 years.  It's still been a while since the Scots lost in the opening round.  It was the 1st time that Wooster has lost the opening round of the Mose Hole under Steve Moore, however.

They also lost the opener of the Al Van Wie Classic to start the '97-'98 season to Tiffin, so that loss last night would be the 2nd time a Steve Moore coached Wooster team lost in the opener of a regular season tournament at Wooster. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2005, 12:28:49 PM
Actually, I didn't see the consolation game because I was busy doing the PA for the Wabash playoff football game against Albion. I was told they played better, a bit, but we all thought UT-D would win because they played fairly well against Illinois Wesleyan.

I think Denison has a chance if they play well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 30, 2005, 02:17:11 PM
This article on Tom Port's eligibility from the Wooster Daily Record:

http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles//sports/&file=_sports2.txt&article=1&tD=
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2005, 02:46:02 PM
Tonight Wabash begins its quasi-NBA-esque schedule stretch by playing host to Franklin. This should be a good test for both teams as they head toward conference play.

The Little Giants will play four games in eight days, hosting Greenville on the 3rd then next Friday and Saturday facing Allegheny and Hiram at home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on December 30, 2005, 07:03:14 PM
Anyone heard a Denison vs. Alma score from this afternoon in Cleveland?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 30, 2005, 07:48:22 PM
Is there any web audio for the Wabash/Franklin game tonight?  I'm having trouble connecting to the Wabash feed....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2005, 09:38:23 PM
Wabash beats Franklin 68-58. The Little Giants fell behind early in the game but roared back to take a 34-27 lead at the half, and led the Grizzlies by as much as 19 in the second half.

Nick Kane, who averages 21 a game for Franklin, left the game early with what looks to be a sprained ankle, so Wabash was able to capitalize on his absence.

Joseph had 17, while Lyttle had 10 points and 10 boards. Dustin Huff came off the bench for 7 points and 2 steals in his first action, while Ryan Stephens had seven rebounds in 15 minutes.

A good win, but the Little Giants were sloppy with the ball (21 turnovers), didn't shoot well from the line (5 of 9) and allowed Franklin 16 offensive rebounds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 30, 2005, 09:40:48 PM
Finally...a final from Chadwick:

Franklin 58
Wabash 68

I didn't get any audio on this game so I don't know how it played out exactly.  From the boxscore, it looks like Wabash won this one with defense.  Franklin was limited to 37.7% shooting for the game while Wabash shot 53.7%...one of their better offensive efforts of the year.  Franklin had a 5-point lead in the first half, but a big Wabash run to end the half eliminated the lead.  Wabash's lead ballooned to 19 points in the second half.  Franklin got some garbage time buckets in the last two minutes to make the score respectable.  

It looks like Franklin's leading scorer, Nick Kane left with an injury (I'm assuming).  He only played the first three minutes of the game.

Wabash was led by Adonis Joseph's 17 points on 6-9 shooting.  Caleb Lyttle had 10 points to go with his 10 boards.  Zimmer and Michael Woods each added 9 points for the LGs.

A couple of things stand out from the boxscore...perhaps smeds can comment (I'm assuming you were there).  First, Coffey didn't start and only played five minutes.  Injury?  Coach's decision?  Second, Dustin Huff got his first minutes of the year and scored 7 points in 10 minutes on 3-4 shooting.  Does Huff look like a difference maker for Wabash during the stretch run?  

Very good win for Wabash, regardless of whether or not Franklin's top scorer was in the game.  Franklin is never an easy game.  Wabash's win streak runs to 6 games now.  Greenville comes to town on Tuesday and then the biannual weekend series at Chadwick with Allegheny and Hiram next weekend.  It's very possible that Wabash could be riding a 9-game win streak heading into a key game at OWU on 1/11.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2005, 09:47:08 PM
Denison 68
Alma 56
Press Release (http://d3hoops.com/releases.php?release=54388)

Wooster 129
Thiel 80
Press Release (with the score reversed) (http://d3hoops.com/releases.php?release=51829)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2005, 09:51:40 PM
Wally, I think I addressed a lot of what you wanted to know earlier, but Coffey was a coaches decision. He got a T in the first half and played little in the second. Zimmer started and Stephens played well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 30, 2005, 09:56:24 PM
Thanks, smeds.  What was your impression of Huff?  He and Russell add a lot of much needed athleticism to Wabash's lineup.  Huff's first action had him 3-4 on FGs, 1-1 on 3 pointers, and two steals in just 10 minutes.  Does he look like a guy who can come in off the bench and fill it up? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2005, 10:02:13 PM
Huff can light it up from outside, definitely.

Russell didn't look that good tonight - he looked like he was pressing and not playing a natural game - but he'll help for sure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2005, 10:03:05 PM
Looks like when Denison is playing a winnable game they have a shorter rotation! 10 players saw the bulk of time tonight.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 30, 2005, 10:28:55 PM
Sweet.  That's what I was hoping to hear.  I think one real serious perimeter threat helps Wabash immensely.  I think with the way Wabash has played D all year and with the offense coming around a bit Wabash has an outside chance of throwing a monkey wrench into top of the conference.  Wooster and Witt are clearly the cream of this crop, but I think Wabash is capable of stealing a game against one or both of those teams. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2005, 11:56:14 PM
I agree. Jimmy Owens is out a month with a foot injury he suffered at Denison, but when he gets back Wabash can go 13 deep to give varying looks to opposing teams. I think Witt can be had at Chadwick. Bwah-hah-hah!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 31, 2005, 12:28:10 AM
Wooster took out their frustrations on poor Thiel in easy fashion tonight.  I would say that Thiel was basically in a no win situation after the game that transpired last night.  Had BW been on the short end last night, we would have been seeing the same results from them.  Thiel was the sacrificial lamb big time for this tournament.  Unfortunately, Lycoming had to throw a wrench into the tournament and threaten not to come unless they didn't have to play Wooster in the 1st round.  I guess they didn't like the fact that they might have to play in front of a big crowd, because they were obliged in that area for both games?!  I didn't stick around for the BW/Lycoming game, (which was won easily by BW) but, judging from the lack of attendance for the Wooster/Thiel game, I can imagine there were plenty of empty seats.  Obviously, for all intents and purposes, the finals of the Mose Hole Classic was played last night.

Now the Scots are off for yet another week before travelling to WashPA for the W&J Classic where they will be facing yet another stiff 1st round opponent in TCNJ.  They are one of several favorites to win the always tough NJAC.  It sure would be nice to get an easy game in the 1st round of these Classic tournaments, especially when they are coming off week long layoffs, but BW was coming off a layoff as well and TCNJ hasn't played a game since the 18th.  So the Scots can't really use that as an excuse.  TCNJ does play Ramapo on the 4th which is only 2 nights before their game with Wooster.  I don't know whether or not I would call a huge conference game 2 nights before another huge non-conference game an advantage or not?  We shall see.  In any case, this game is a chance to see a great intra-regional matchup pitting one of the GL Region's powers up  against one of the stronger teams from the Atlantic Region.  Hopefully Wooster can put in a good showing for the Great Lakes and back up what many would argue to be the toughest region in the country!  I would love to make the trek to WashPA to see this one in person.  I just doubt that my family obligations will allow it.  I will just have to be tuned in to Brek on the play by play I guess.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 31, 2005, 01:08:40 AM
I'm afraid I'm going to need a better source than Wooster Booster's friend on the Lycoming story.  It just doesn't ring true to me.  If Wooster didn't actually want to play B-WC in the first round, then why wouldn't the choice have been Thiel?  Thiel is the weaker of the two, but more importantly, Thiel is an in-region game for Wooster, whereas Lycoming is both extra-regional (MA Region) and outside the 200 mile limit (about 315 miles).  The "logical" (or "traditional") 1st round pairings would have been Thiel/Wooster and Lycoming/B-WC.

I'm not trying to question WooBoo's veracity, I just think this whole story is implausible enough (and, if so, libelous, in a small sort of way) to warrant verification.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 31, 2005, 01:28:24 AM
Agreed. And I had other discussions with people off the board over the preseason that lead me to believe that isn't true either.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 31, 2005, 01:44:44 AM
I'll talk to my source (who I consider very honest and reliable) and find out where he got his information regarding Lycoming not wanting to play Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 31, 2005, 09:40:41 AM
Wouldn't an extra-regional game would be better for the Scots (QOWI-wise) rather than an 8-pointer against Theil?  The game last night lowered the Scots' rating from 8.857 to 8.750, if my calculations are correct!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 31, 2005, 10:09:19 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 31, 2005, 01:08:40 AM
I'm afraid I'm going to need a better source than Wooster Booster's friend on the Lycoming story. It just doesn't ring true to me.
There was a statement about this in the Wooster Daily Record in the scouting report on Lycoming.  Here is the direct quote:
Quote from: The Wooster Daily RecordScouting report: The Warriors were a late edition to the "Mose" Hole/Kiwanis Classic and agreed to enter if they would not be paired against Wooster in the opening round.
Why would they just make somehting like that up?  Besides, the Scots did get their 2 in-region games anyway.  I don't know though.  This whole pairing thing makes no sense. 

Congrats to Tom Port and Brandon Johnson on making the All-Tournament team.  No surpirse that Tori Davis was the MVP.  Also no surprise that Tyler Sekarik was named Defensive MVP. 

Wooster broke their team record for 3-pointers in their game last night with a 20-37 effort.  They certainly could have used a couple of those for Thursday night. ::)  I'd say the Scots are well on their way to breaking their school record of 245 3-pointers made for the '02-'03 season.  Through 11 games Wooster is 125-286.  They are threatening the record for 3-point fg. percentage as well.  They are currently tied with the record of .437 set back in '89-'90. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 31, 2005, 10:47:14 AM
But this also testifies to the fact that its hard to fill out these tourneys with teams at times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 31, 2005, 11:31:43 AM
How about the Big Red???? 

Win the tournament!!  WOW!! Even the great Smed didn't see this one coming.

Either Ghilloni has figured it out or dumb luck but he has suddenly playing 9 guys.  NOT eleven.   He didn't have Hodgkinson and Hern on the bench together for 7 minutes at a time.

Stats don't lie:  He plays Hern 35 minutes, Hodgkinson on 18 because of foul trouble but the two of them along with Izzo (28 minutes) 57% of the offense.  Hodgkinson had 15 points in 18 minutes.  Koecheler gets into foul trouble in game two and plays 14 minutes and did not score.  Game one  28 minutes and has 4 points.  That is not going to win you games.

Game two: plays Hodgkinson 35 minutes and Hern 33 and the two provide 51% of the offense.   Any pattern here???

Good teams play 8 guys, 9 max.

The Shea's give them 19 an 12 in game one.  Game two, almost the same time played and you get 4 and 6.

Ghiloni has some prime time players.  The others are "role players".  Hodgkinson and Hern bring it game in and game out.  You can not count on anyone else to be consistant.

Eberst was huge yesterday!!  But he gave you 6pts in game one.

I have preached all year, you can not go 11 deep and think you can win.

Hodgkinson, Hern and Izzo should be at 34 minutes a game.  The role players come off the bench and give them a blow of 3 minutes a half.   That is the blue print to success and these past two days showed it.

Dance with who you brought to the prom.  Simple as that.

Hodgkinson:  Tournament MVP
Hern:      All-Tournament

Good way to end the year!!  Now let's hope they learned something.

GO BIG RED!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 31, 2005, 12:07:43 PM
One thing I missed in this whole pairings issue is that Coach Moore was quoted in yesterday's Daily Record as saying that it was Wooster's choice to schedule BW in the first round as opposed to playing a tune-up game in the 1st round against Hiram.  My best guess was by scheduling BW in a 1st round game, it guaranteed Wooster a quality in-region game.  Pat mentioned this in his Daily Dose blog.  RM-C did the same thing in their tounament in scheduling the 2nd best team in their field (Fisk) and they also got beat.  It's a calculated risk, but there's no guarantee that Wooster and BW would have met in the finals either.  Just look what happened in the 2001 Mose Hole.  ONU came into the tournament ranked #11 and Wooster was unranked.  It was still a highly anticipated final between the Scots and the Polar Bears until Thiel knocked off ONU in the semis.  BW was also Wooster's only OAC opponent.  Ususally the Scots face at least 2-3 OAC teams in the regular season, so maybe they just wanted that guaranteed matchup.  Of course, this doesn't prove or disprove what was said about Lycoming.

Smeds, I don't think anyone is arguing over whether or not these tournaments can be hard to fill.  It's obviously not easy, as Lycoming was already a late edition to the field, so it isn't a stretch to  say that they had some negotiating power on their side.  Either Wooster caters to their demands and have a tournament, or not cave in and have a chance at no tournament.  Seems like an obvious choice. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Darryl Nester on December 31, 2005, 12:21:13 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 31, 2005, 10:09:19 AM
There was a statement about this in the Wooster Daily Record in the scouting report on Lycoming.  Here is the direct quote:
Quote from: The Wooster Daily RecordScouting report: The Warriors were a late edition to the "Mose" Hole/Kiwanis Classic and agreed to enter if they would not be paired against Wooster in the opening round.

Did the Wooster Daily Record really refer to Lyco as "a late edition"?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 31, 2005, 12:23:03 PM
That was a direct quote from the paper.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 31, 2005, 01:57:48 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 30, 2005, 01:35:32 AM
Apparently Lycoming, after initially agreeing to come to the tournament, balked at having to play Wooster on the first night. 
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 31, 2005, 10:09:19 AM
Quote from: The Wooster Daily RecordScouting report: The Warriors were a late edition to the "Mose" Hole/Kiwanis Classic and agreed to enter if they would not be paired against Wooster in the opening round.

I hope you can see that these are two entirely different things. 

Because we are talking about a services contract, the common law applies.  The facts suggest that a valid offer to play in the Mose Hole was extended by Wooster to Lycoming.  In the first scenario, it appears that Lycoming accepted the offer, then attempted to force a contract modification.  (It is not an anticipatory repudiation, which would allow Wooster to suspend performance and sue immediately, because the language of repudiation is not unequivocal.)  Such modifications are not valid without consideration, and would be subject to the Statute of Frauds (applying the "equal dignity" rule) if the original contract was made more than one year prior to the date of the tournament.  Wooster seemingly acquiesced to the demand, and performance may be seen by the court as a substitute for consideration, making the contract modification valid.  If on the other hand Wooster's agreement was the result of fraud or duress, if for exmple Lycoming knew that its withdrawal would cause the tournament to fail for lack of participation, the court might find the modification to be unconscionable, which would be an absolute defense to enforcement.

In the second scenario, Lycoming's acceptance of Wooster's valid offer was made expressly conditional that they not play Wooster.  Because the common law applies, a purported acceptance that introduces new or different terms is treated as a rejection and a counteroffer.  If Wooster agreed to this counteroffer, as we can infer from the facts, than a valid contract was formed with the condition that Wooster not play Lycoming in the first game.  In this scenario, Wooster would not have an actionable position.

Warning to Kyle Witucky: This is what your life will be like for the next 3+ years.  It's not too late to change your mind about law school!

(I can hear Li'l Giant banging his head against the wall all the way from San Antonio.  :D)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 31, 2005, 02:17:08 PM
I guess Wabash isn't a good team because they play 11 to 12 a night, eh? They're 7-3, not shabby.

Witt has 11 players averaging in double digit minutes a night. They're not good, are they?

Puget Sound must be awful - as 11 players have played in every game for them.

Boy, Hope must stink. They used 14 players against Madonna in a seven point game.

Geez, UW-Stout is rotten. They play 11 guys nightly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 31, 2005, 02:28:29 PM
Oh, and it makes no sense to play the big guns 35 minutes in blowouts. So I still don't understand the carping about minutes against Wooster, Witt, Akron and Capital.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 31, 2005, 02:29:58 PM
David -

I've spoken to my friend, and his information came exclusively from the article in the Wooster Daily Record.  When he first told me about the Lycoming situation, either he mispoke or I misunderstood him, as I believed him to be speaking of the situation you describe in your first scenario.  Now it seems as if your second scenario is the way that it happened.

I apologize to everyone for posting information that was incorrect, and especially to Lycoming.  I see no problem at all in them being upfront about not wanting to play Wooster in the first round as long as that was done before accepting the invitation.

David, did you study under Professor Kingsley?  ;)

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 31, 2005, 02:55:32 PM
Agreeing to come on the condition that they not play Wooster is less obnoxious than threatening to quit if they have to play Wooster, but it's still not a terribly admirable position.  However, if the ultimate source for this is the Daily Record, where fact-checking, like spelling, is not exactly a hallmark, I'll continue to reserve my doubts about the accuracy of the whole thing. 

I wonder if we've got the wrong spin on this.  Maybe what Lycoming said was, "we'll come if we get to play Thiel?"  I'm sure they didn't want to come just to take double-digit losses from COW and B-WC.  Plus they might have found a 200 mile path to Thiel, making it a regional game (it looks like 210 miles to me, but I didn't try very hard.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 31, 2005, 03:10:27 PM
Do you want me to start naming teams that play 8 & 9 guys.  Give me a break.  It is so lobsided it isn't even close.

The fact that Smed can name 5 teams means NOTHING. 

Denison does not have the depth.  It is that simple.  Sitting Hodgkinson and Hern for extended time together is a mistake. 

I don't care what other teams have in a way of a bench.  Denison is not a deep team.

Sure, from game to game someone may step up.  But game in and game out the role players have not delivered.  It has been proven each and every game.

So keep naming teams with a long bench, I don't care.  I care about Denison.

Look at stats.  You still must score to win.  So that means playing Hern and Hodgkinson and Izzo 30 plus then do it.

Did Ghiloni play Hern and Hodgkinson 33 plus because his subs were so damn good?  You know the answer.

Let's enjoy the tournament victory.




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 31, 2005, 03:47:03 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 31, 2005, 02:55:32 PM
Agreeing to come on the condition that they not play Wooster is less obnoxious than threatening to quit if they have to play Wooster, but it's still not a terribly admirable position.

I would say this, too -- it's not rare for a team to ask for that kind of consideration in pairings.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 31, 2005, 04:54:27 PM
DFan -

You stated an absolute, and I refuted it. Simple as that. The fact that I named four teams in the top 10 in the D-3 poll is telling that it takes all kinds of systems and teams to win.

Also, you fail to acknowledge the fact that in WINNABLE games he's not stretching the bench - but in games like Wooster, Witt, etc. he is stretching the bench.

You can also win by playing tough D.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on December 31, 2005, 05:46:04 PM
Smed,

I totally agree with you.  Yes, D wins.  Detroit and Bullls proved that.

It is fun to spar with you my friend.

Have a Happy New Year and I will be back in 2006.

All the Best to everyone.  Drive carefullly if you are going out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 31, 2005, 05:56:49 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 31, 2005, 02:55:32 PM
However, if the ultimate source for this is the Daily Record, where fact-checking, like spelling, is not exactly a hallmark, I'll continue to reserve my doubts about the accuracy of the whole thing. 
DC,

While the Daily Record (or Daily Mistake as I sometimes refer to it as) may not be a hallmark for fact checking or spelling as you say, I do commend them on their coverage of the College of Wooster sports, and more specifically COW football, basketball and baseball, seeing as those are the marquee sports.  In saying this, I think it is a fair assessment that any facts that may have been laid out by the sportswriters for the Daily Record, i.e.  Lycoming being a late edidtion to the tournament, and agreeing to come if they didn't meet Wooster in the first round probably came from Wooster's SID.  I may be wrong, but it seems that Wooster's SID keeps a pretty good relationship with the paper and vice versa.  So the facts of this case might be more accurate than you're giving people credit for.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 31, 2005, 06:15:26 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 31, 2005, 01:57:48 PMIn the second scenario, Lycoming's acceptance of Wooster's valid offer was made expressly conditional that they not play Wooster.  Because the common law applies, a purported acceptance that introduces new or different terms is treated as a rejection and a counteroffer.  If Wooster agreed to this counteroffer, as we can infer from the facts, than a valid contract was formed with the condition that Wooster not play Lycoming in the first game.  In this scenario, Wooster would not have an actionable position.

I would argue that there was no acceptance of Wooster's original offer. That Lycoming made a counteroffer, thereby rejecting Wooster's offer, as you lay out in your second scenario.

Quote from: David Collinge on December 31, 2005, 01:57:48 PMWarning to Kyle Witucky: This is what your life will be like for the next 3+ years. It's not too late to change your mind about law school!

(I can hear Li'l Giant banging his head against the wall all the way from San Antonio. :D)

There needs to be a series of PSAs that air on college radio that warn people what law school is really like. Boy I wish there had been when I was sitting in Martindale Hall listening to WNDY. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 01, 2006, 07:46:51 PM
Wabash plays host to Greenville College on Tuesday night. On paper, it looks like a mismatch. Greenville has one just once, against a Chiropractic school at that - and it looks like their best player quit the team after four games.

As I said, on paper a mismatch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 02, 2006, 11:04:20 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 01, 2006, 07:46:51 PMagainst a Chiropractic school at that

Would have expected them to make the necessary....ahem...adjustments.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2006, 03:32:10 PM
Ugh. You gotta have some spine to make a crack like that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 02, 2006, 04:21:39 PM
Ouch!  Please don't use spine and crack in the same sentence! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BogeyMan on January 02, 2006, 09:21:34 PM
Could it be possible that BW & Wooster wanted to play a regional game instead of taking a chance of not playing any regional opponents in the tournament?  I would predict that the above scenario has a higher probability of happening than one of the other teams saying we won't come unless we play a certain team.  Most college coaches and teams look forward to playing good competition.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TheRed on January 02, 2006, 10:21:50 PM
DF,

Your comments are almost unbearable.  If u really want me to call Hern, Hodge, Izzo, Julian, Pete, and Wags I can because their numbers are in my cell phone.  But really, it's none of your business whats going on within the team.  And just because I do know doesn't mean that I'm going to come on here and tell a bunch of people that I don't know and have nothing to do with the program.  I'm just telling you that your theories about why the team is struggling are incorrect.

Also, stats aren't as important as you make them out to be.  You can't coach a team based on stats.  Many guys bring other things to the table that don't show up on a stat line and that is perhaps why they play. 

Leadership is what Denison is missing.  DF, you say Hern and Hodge bring it every night, but the other guys don't.  For one, I don't believe that.  And two, if they are so good as you think they are, they should be able to get the best out of their teammates every night.  (this is nothing against Hern and Hodge because they are very good players.  i'm jnust trying to prove a point and possibly motivate those guys if they read this crap)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 03, 2006, 08:52:10 AM
Maybe DenisonFan is playing fantasy d3hoops?  I agree with TheRed - stats don't tell the whole story...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 03, 2006, 09:38:46 PM
Wabash rolls past Greenville 82-57. The game was kind of sloppy, Wabash committed 24 turnovers and each team had 16 steals. No one played more than 21 minutes and Coach Petty did a few line changes. Wabash went on a 26-4 run in the first half to all but seal it up.

Next up - Allegheny on Friday night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 03, 2006, 10:39:41 PM
Wow.  Wooster dropped only one spot in the poll, falling behind a team that they've already beaten.  Yet, they remain 9 spots ahead of the only team who bested them, Baldwin-Wallace.  This just shows how much weight inertia carries in the polls.  A team starting in the top two or three is going to have to pick up three or four losses to leave the top ten.  And, conversely, a team beginning at the back end of the top 25 will need to run off a heck of a streak to break into the top five.

In my opinion, Wooster is a team that's capable of defeating nearly any DIII team that's out there.  But, on a cold night and given an opponent with a very good big guy, they've also got a shot at losing to someone ranked as low as 40 or 50.

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 04, 2006, 12:03:30 AM
Beat Witt by a last-second shot at home. Doesn't mean they are entitled to be above Witt for all time. Obviously not too many people want to say Amherst is better than Wooster/Wittenberg at this point in the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 04, 2006, 01:13:47 AM
Maybe they were psychic, and already took into account Amherst's fall to Oxy tonite! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 04, 2006, 10:04:47 AM
I just saw Oberlin dressed nine against Case. Will things pick up, now that Elvis Francois is back?

That game against Case had a listed attendance of 43. Wow!

I guess the other big question is when the NCAC will update their basketball site?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 04, 2006, 10:56:20 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 04, 2006, 12:03:30 AM
Beat Witt by a last-second shot at home. Doesn't mean they are entitled to be above Witt for all time. Obviously not too many people want to say Amherst is better than Wooster/Wittenberg at this point in the season.
I would say that I'm more surprised that Wooster didn't fall a couple of spots further.  I would have guessed that they would've been at least 6 behind Albion and Hope.  Now, with Amherst's loss last night, I would hope that the The Lord Jeffs lose that silly #1 vote they have been getting and also fall out of the top 5 while they are at it.  Also, I don't think that WB was trying to imply that Wooster should still be ahead of Witt.  I think he was surprised, like myself, that Wooster only fell one spot more than the fact that Witt is now ranked ahead of Wooster. 

It is nice to see four teams from the GL Region in the top 6!  Had the poll come out today it would probably 4 in the top 5!!!  It will be interesting to see how the NCAA Regional Rankings will rank these teams.  Right now, just going by records alone and not D3Hoops poll, I would have to guess that Hope would be #1.  After that, Albion would probably be #2, although they do have a nice win over BW and their only loss wouldn't count against them, so you could arguably flip flop either one of them.  After that, its anybody's guess between Witt, Wooster and BW and you also have to throw CMU into the mix, although after their loss to Bluffton, I would say they would come in a notch below the previous 3.  We also can't forget ONU and JCU who are both very good basketball teams as well.  All in all, I think this is the deepest GL Region that I can recall.  Just looking at the top 8 teams that I mentioned, all of them would be more than capable of making a run in the tournament.  This is going to be a fun couple of months to watch how things unfold in the GL.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 04, 2006, 02:40:42 PM
QuoteAlso, I don't think that WB was trying to imply that Wooster should still be ahead of Witt.  I think he was surprised, like myself, that Wooster only fell one spot more than the fact that Witt is now ranked ahead of Wooster. 

Yep, that was my point, although I'm sure I confused it by mentioning Wittenberg.  I'd figured that Wooster would fall to about fifth or sixth.

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 04, 2006, 10:24:35 PM
Tonight's finals from the NCAC:

Witt - 80
Kenyon - 51

And Denison was unable to keep the momentum going.

OWU - 91
Denison - 58

I'm sure that DenisonFan will have something to say in regard's to the Big Red's performance tonight... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 04, 2006, 10:37:53 PM
Mighty IWU has fallen tonight!!!  NCC upsets the #1 team in the land:

NCC - 74
IWU - 70

Will this loss be enough to dethrone IWU from their lofty #1 ranking?  We will have to wait and see.  One thing this does prove is that Mighty IWU IS beatable!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 04, 2006, 10:49:30 PM
you see? you see? he's not a machine! he's a MAN!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 04, 2006, 10:56:06 PM
Apparently an underrated non-slouch that knocked them off, and did it at IWU, too. North Central is now 10-0, and until tonight their closest game was 11 points, although their opposition looks a bit suspect. They are currently ranked 31st.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 04, 2006, 11:07:11 PM
Scotsfan you bring up an interesting observation of the potential GL region poll right now.

Hope or Albion would be 1 and 2 with NO INREGION losses the most important element in the regional rankings.

But by the time the first regional ranking comes out Hope or Albion will have at least one loss since they square off next Wednesday night.

As a side note I'm very impressed with Albion considering their losses to graduation.  I said last spring they have some good players in that program and they wouldn't fall that far off, but I certainly didn't expect this kind of a start.  I thought they'd be good by years end.

I'd take a Sectional with Albion, Hope, Wittenber and Wooster in a heartbeat.  wow.

.....of course we'd have to host it in the nicest facility in d3 here in Holland  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2006, 11:09:25 PM
If we had that quartet in a sectional, we'd all blow our stacks.  That's a final four, not a sectional. 

But it'd be great... ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 04, 2006, 11:16:01 PM
I've been to the Final Four

I'm confident most years the Sectional in the Great Lakes is as good or better than the Final Four.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 04, 2006, 11:23:20 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 04, 2006, 10:37:53 PM
Will this loss be enough to dethrone IWU from their lofty #1 ranking?  We will have to wait and see.  One thing this does prove is that Mighty IWU IS beatable!!!

I haven't seen ANYONE who said IWU was unbeatable (though I, for one, was HOPING they would go unbeaten).

Since #2 and #3 also have a loss (as does presumably FORMER #4 Amherst), who knows?  To me (barring any further upsets) the top five is clearly IWU, Woo, Witt, Hope, and Albion, but I could make a case for ANY order of those five.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 04, 2006, 11:55:18 PM
Quote from: sac on January 04, 2006, 11:16:01 PM
I've been to the Final Four

I'm confident most years the Sectional in the Great Lakes is as good or better than the Final Four.

Since the Great Lakes does not include the WIAC, CCIW, NJAC, NESCAC, or ODAC (and the occasional 'stray' team), are you SURE you want to make such an over-the-top  comment?! ;) ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 05, 2006, 12:03:01 AM
IWU is in a pretty dominant position in the poll, leading #2 Witt by 59 points (a little more than 2 poll placement positions).  I expect that, all things being as they are now, they'll lose a bunch of #1 votes but maintain the overall #1 position.

Personally, I'd vote for Wittenberg. 

Sac, you're right (as always); I'd say that last year's GL sectional tournament was better than the final 4 (which I was at), and I think that might still have been true if all 4 sectional teams had lost in the sweet 16 (making the GL sectional Wooster, Wittenberg, Aurora, and Maryville of TN).  Actually, I think Final Four participant York would have struggled and probably lost in a first-round game against all but two of the teams in the Great Lakes/South bracket (those being Methodist and Bethany).

For those who may have come in late, here's the games I'm talking about:
Sweet 16:
JCU 75, at Witt 68 (2OT)
at Albion 59, Wooster 58
Calvin 71, at Aurora 59
Miss. Coll. 68, at Maryville 62

Sectional at Albion:
Albion 80, JCU 79
Calvin 75, Miss. Coll. 60
Calvin 60, Albion 52

Final Four:
UWSP 81, York 58
Rochester 65, Calvin 62
UWSP 73, Rochester 49
Calvin 98, York 84
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 05, 2006, 12:37:58 AM
No Cabs I don't believe thats over the top

I also believe the Midwest Sectional is the same in most years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on January 05, 2006, 12:40:27 AM
David, I would lament the absence of South Region appearances in the Final Four, because the South Region schools always seem to travel to the Great Lakes Sectional for the Sweet 16. :( :( :(

(The 1999 H-SC team hosted the Sectionals that year on their way to the Final Four.)

http://www.d3hoops.com/archives/mncaa99.htm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 05, 2006, 01:00:15 AM
Seeing IWU at Chadwick, I thought they were beatable.

I also think Witt and Wooster better sack up when they come to Chadwick.

But of course, Wabash needs to bring it at OWU next week - of course there's a couple of games this week that Wabash needs to take care of.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 05, 2006, 01:22:21 AM
sac,

I would certainly agree with you on SOME years, but since you're leaving out UWSP, UWEC, Amherst, Williams, HSC, RMC, William Patterson, Catholic, etc., I'm not sure I could agree on MOST years! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 05, 2006, 02:34:45 AM
Quote from: sac on January 05, 2006, 12:37:58 AM
No Cabs I don't believe thats over the top

I also believe the Midwest Sectional is the same in most years.
This is definately true.  The GL and MW are far and away the toughest sectionals to come out of year in and year out.  It seems that whomever survives out of the GL Sectional recently has run into the eventual national champs in the 1st round at Salem with the exception being last year.  Three years ago, Wooster survived to Salem, only to lose in OT to eventual champs Williams with National POY Brian Nelson basically playing on one leg.  Wooster went on to win the 3rd place game over H-SC.  The next year JCU survived the GL Sectional winning at Wooster to advance to Salem, only to lose in the semis to eventual champs UWSP.  They went on to defeat Amherst in the 3rd place game.  And last year Calvin survived winning on the road at Albion only to lose to Rochester in the semis at Salem.  They went on to trounce York in the 3rd place game.  My point is, by the time a GL representative makes it out of the GL Sectional, in most years, they are basically spent, both physically and emotionally.  It takes so much just to get to Salem out of the GL Region in most years, that once you get there, there just isn't much left. 

I'm not saying that UWSP wouldn't have won back to back titles if they had come through the GL Region.  But it certainly would have made it more difficult.  Just look at last year.  Calvin had to win on the road @ Wheaton and then they had to win @ Albion just to get to Salem.  Talk about a tough road.  Heck, all Albion had to do was host (ranked at the time) #5 Wooster whom they beat with ft's with no time left on the clock, and then host #15 JCU whom they beat on a prayer 3 pointer at the buzzer, before bowing out to #14 Calvin. 

I'm sure you could make this argument for the MW Sectional as well, but this year, moreso than in recent years, the GL Region seems exceptionally strong and deep.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 05, 2006, 02:47:35 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 04, 2006, 11:23:20 PM
I haven't seen ANYONE who said IWU was unbeatable (though I, for one, was HOPING they would go unbeaten).

Kind of thought I'd heard it on the air at some point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 05, 2006, 02:49:29 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 04, 2006, 11:23:20 PM
Since #2 and #3 also have a loss (as does presumably FORMER #4 Amherst), who knows?  To me (barring any further upsets) the top five is clearly IWU, Woo, Witt, Hope, and Albion, but I could make a case for ANY order of those five.
I would have to agree.  If Wooster can lose at home to the #17 team in the country and only swap places with Wittenberg, I could totally see IWU retaining the #1 ranking, although not with the stranglehold that they had held prior to their loss.  The top 5 is pretty clear cut, no matter how they are ranked as you said, barring any other upsets that is. ::) 

Wooster doesn't have a gimme on Friday as they take on TCNJ.  They defeated Ramapo on the road last night in a key NJAC game  55-54 to take a slight edge in that conference race.  TCNJ has not lost an OOC game yet this season.  They have also not faced an OOC opponent as good as Wooster for that matter.  Should be a good one on Friday at W&J.  I would guess there will be a fairly good Wooster following down to WashPA to cheer on the Scots for the weekend tournament.   Hopefully the Scots can make good on my Wife's birthday instead of dropping 2 out of their last 3!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on January 05, 2006, 09:36:04 AM
Remember the name Mark Caraway?

Well, he is back on Witt's roster, as of last night, and saw limited action in the game against Kenyon.



It will be interesting to see how much playing time Caraway gets since he has not been with the team all year. He replaces Matt McCurdy on the roster.

A starting lineup of Russ, Borchers, Brady, Howard and Caraway would probably be the most athletic lineup since the '93-'94 Final Four team. 

In case, Coach Taylor still reads this stuff.

;D





Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 05, 2006, 10:16:06 AM
OWU 91
Denison 58

Well at least the Big Red is consistant.  Another 30 point loss.

Besides Hodgkinson nobody stepped up.  That will give you an "L" every time.

There is no consistancy.  Hern looked like he was sleep walking. 

Hodgkinson doesn't even play half the game.  I understand when you are down by 30 who cares.  But I really did not think this team was that bad.  I may be wrong.

Oh well.  Welcome to 2006
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 05, 2006, 10:50:19 AM
Focus will be the key for Wabash this weekend.  Two games that the LGs should win...but with a team reliant upon its seniors and senior comps looming in the next day or two, you never know. 

As for the who's #1 thing...I think logically it has to be Witt.  I think Amherst would have received a lot of IWU's votes, but that won't happen now.  I'm not sure it makes a lot of sense to keep IWU at #1 for right now...they did lose at home to an unranked (albeit apparently under-ranked) opponent.  I'm not sure IWU had lapped the field here and gets the mulligan.  My guess as to who the top three will probably be next week is Witt, Wooster, IWU in what amounts to pretty much a dead heat. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 05, 2006, 11:01:43 AM
Quote from: witt4ever on January 05, 2006, 09:36:04 AM
A starting lineup of Russ, Borchers, Brady, Howard and Caraway would probably be the most athletic lineup since the '93-'94 Final Four team. 
Since when is Howard starting for Witt?  Did I miss something?  Last time I checked, Witt's starting lineup included Steffes and Bowen or Denbow. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 05, 2006, 11:44:53 AM
DenisonFan,
I didn't make it to OWU last night - were you in attendance?

It doesn't look like there was much defensive pressure from the Big Red, but I'm only going off the box score.  The offense might have a better chance if they were able to transition a little vs. always taking the ball out of the basket.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on January 05, 2006, 12:07:47 PM
The new national poll should be interesting. I for one don't think IWU should retain the #1 spot. Despite losing to an undefeated team, for some reason North Central was unranked??? Should Witt get the #1, it would be a shame since Wooster beat them, therefore it's only logical to make Wooster #1, Witt #2 and IWU #3.  And as for any other unbeaten teams left in D3...they should no longer be unranked, I don't care how soft their schedule is, if you go 11-0 or better, you should be top 25. Look at Illinois and Ohio State in D1, they got to those points and made the top 25 now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 05, 2006, 12:10:58 PM
It's not quite that easy, Moneyballs.  There are more D-III hoops teams than there are D-I hoops teams, so a D-III top 25 is a little more exclusive, relatively speaking. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 05, 2006, 12:45:55 PM
I think the pollsters have done a good job this season not succumbing the knee-jerk reactions to losses.  They're supposed to evaluate the teams each week and decided who they think the best teams are.  It's extremely unlikely that we'll have an unbeaten national champion, so losses are part of the game, even for the very top teams.

So the voters' task is, basically, to ask whether they think they were wrong about IWU.  Did NCC expose some weaknesses, or was it just a loss and these things happen?  If IWU ends up 23-1, they'll almost certainly be #1, so does it matter if the one loss was last week or last month? 

Some voters will decide that IWU's loss shows that they are not the best team.  Others will decide that they are the best, and the loss changes nothing.  No voter will drop them below #5, and maybe not even below #3.  I think on balance enough of these voters exist to keep IWU in the #1 spot.

Don't forget that there's two unbeaten (in D3) MIAA squads lurking just behind the NCAC powers.  Voters that had IWU #1 and decide to switch might find Hope or Albion mighty attractive, especially if they compare the recent tournament performances of NCAC and MIAA teams.  (Hope and Albion square off at Kresge next Wednesday, BTW.) 

As I said below, I'd probably vote for Wittenberg, who has some good quality wins, and whose only loss was on a last-second shot on the road against an archrival who was #2 at the time.  The IWU loss doesn't affect that, as I would have been voting for Witt all along.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 05, 2006, 12:55:24 PM
hey guys sorry its been a while my computer has been down so i had to wait till i was back at school to share my inquisitive thoughts.

witt has a bit of a slump in the shcedule with oberlin and earlham and i believe hiram in the next 3 games, but then we get into the juicy games. i requested off february 4th so im pumped for that.

witt could move up to number 1 but it will not be long term because illinois wesleyans conference schedule is slightly tougher coming up than witt's so that should prop them back up to number one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 05, 2006, 03:37:39 PM
CentralOh,

Yes I was there.  Why Ghiloni insists on starting Koecheler.  He does not score, he does not rebound.  Chojknacki ate him up.  With Koecheler on the floor it is like playing 5 on 4.  I have no idea who he could put in his place but it is obvious Koecheler needs to come off the bench. 

Then we go to a 2-3 zone and their perimeter shooting killed us.  When the other team is draining 3's you don't sit back in a zone.

OWU had the inside outside thing going and Ghiloni sits everyone down and the game is over at halftime.

OWU looked very good. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 05, 2006, 04:18:17 PM
If/when Ghiloni leaves his post as head coach at Denison, are you planning on applying for the gig?  Seems like you've got all the answers.

God forbid that you might actually embrace the idea that maybe, just maybe, Denison got beat by a better team.  I know...that's hard to digest.  Take your time...chew on it for a while.  I don't want hysteria here (am I too late?). 

Just FYI:  Through 13 games in the '05'-'06 season Denison is 4-9, 0-4 in NCAC.  Through the same point last year Denison was 5-8, 2-3 in NCAC.  Quite notable is that the NCAC schedule last year was much more favorable for Denison than it is this year (Denison hadn't played Wabash at this point last year, had played more home games, etc.).  So really, Denison isn't far off the course that they were on last year, and last year turned out ok for the Big Red. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on January 05, 2006, 04:59:43 PM
I agree with DC, I think Witt is the best team in the country. More quality wins and their only loss was at Wooster on a last second shot. Even though Wooster beat Witt, their home loss to BW hurts them more than their win over Witt at home. As for IWU, I see them going to #3.

witt4ever- I do not remember Mark Caraway, whats his story?

I do like Witt's front line of Russ, Borchers, and Brady...maybe the best in the country. As for Howard and this Caraway guy I'm not quite sold yet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 05, 2006, 05:22:54 PM
Wally,

I never said Denison was better than OWU.  In fact they are not.  Last year Denison won the game with 5 guys in double figures.  This year we have 2.

This year we are too inconsistant. You still have to put the ball in the basket to win.   
I do think that Denison needs to pick up the D.  Teams are always shooting it over 50% on us.  That will kill you every time.

Yes, we will win our share.  But we are not a deep team.  Some day these freshmen will be good.  But so far you don't know who is going to show up. 

And no, I am not in line to replace the coach.  All I am doing is giving my humble opinion.  Which, the last time I checked is what this is all about.

I am a Denison fan, period.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 05, 2006, 08:16:35 PM
For any Wabash fan curious, Franklin's big gun, Nick Kane, did play against Hanover. So the injury he suffered was relatively minor, yet painful as you saw at Chadwick in December.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 05, 2006, 08:21:10 PM
Surprised to see Denison get jacked up like that after two good wins. The road can be a cruel mistress, but I think Denison can right itself against Elvis Francois and the Yeomen.

Wabash will face a big road test against OWU (after these two weekend home games) so they'll have to be ready. It looks like the Bishops are going to be tough at home, as always.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Blue Russian on January 05, 2006, 09:01:30 PM
Just a question.

At the risk of looking too far ahead in the NCAC tourney.....if two teams are tied for first place in the conference, what are the tiebreaker rules for deciding who will host the tournament finals?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 05, 2006, 09:14:26 PM
Humble isn't the first descriptor that comes to mind when I think about your opinions. 

Consistency isn't a new problem for Denison.  How does a team lose at home to Hiram and then in the very next game knock off Wittenberg?  Denison did exactly that last season.  It defies explanation.  Sometimes, that's just the way basketball goes. 

By your own admission, Denison is young and lacks serious depth.  Those underclassmen aren't ever going to get any better  unless they play.  Unfortunately in college basketball, it's hard to win with a bunch of younger players unless you have the Fab Five which Denison clearly does not.  Young teams will lose.  Probably more than they win...that's the way it works.  Take your lumps, worry less about wins and losses and more about improvement and you might just prevent yourself from getting worked up into a major thrombo.  And the senseless shots at the coach can also stop since the biggest obstacle Denison seems to have is with the roster and not with game management. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on January 05, 2006, 09:49:13 PM
Amen to that Wally!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on January 05, 2006, 10:31:16 PM
I posted this on the Top 25 board...looks like there has been some poll chatter here too.  The #1 candidates...


Illinois Wesleyan (10-1)
* Loss: vs North Central (10-0), 70-74
* Wins vs D3's .500+:
- @ Wabash (8-3), 79-67
- @ Chicago (7-4), 71-67
- @ Wash U (8-3), 83-56
- vs #24 Hanover (8-4), 72-61
- (n) #8 Puget Sound (9-2), 104-87

Wittenberg (11-1)
* Loss: @ #3 Wooster (10-1), 83-86
* Wins vs D3's .500+:
-  (n) Tufts (8-2), 69-65
- @ #18 Rochester (7-2), 52-50
- @ Transylvania (10-2), 62-51
- vs #22 Ohio Northern (8-3), 65-54
 
Wooster (10-1)
* Loss: vs #12 Baldwin-Wallace, 108-113 (2OT)
* Wins vs D3's .500+
- vs #10 UW-Stout (11-2), 90-82
- vs #2 Wittenberg (11-1), 86-83
 
Amherst (8-1)
* Loss: @ Occidental (9-1), 68-73
* Wins vs D3's .500+:
- (n) Westfield St (8-5), 102-77
- (n) Pomona-Pitzer (5-4), 61-42

Albion (10-1)
* Loss: vs Michigan-Dearborn (NAIA 2, 4-8), 77-88
* Wins vs D3's .500+:
- (n) Juanita (6-6), 78-59
- (n) #12 Baldwin-Wallace (11-1), 75-72
- vs #16 Elmhurst (8-4), 74-66
- @ Adrian (6-6), 75-58

Hope (12-0)
* Loss: n/a
* Wins vs D3's .500+:
- vs #16 Elmhurst (8-4), 70-53
- vs Lakeland (9-4), 54-46
- vs John Carroll (8-4), 89-77

Lawrence (8-0)
* Loss: n/a
* Wins vs D3's .500+
- vs UW-Oshkosh (8-4), 82-75 (OT)
- @ Milwaukee Engineering (8-4), 74-53
 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 05, 2006, 10:34:41 PM
Waterboy- not sure if you're still around, but i plan on making it to the Earlham/Allegheny game on Saturday.  Looking forward to seeing two NCAC game going at it.  Hopefully Earlham can get the Terriers tomorrow night and go 2-0 this weekend in the NCAC. 

What do you think about the Match up? or anyone else for that matter.

*that and i wanted to write and be a part of a certain page # of this post
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 05, 2006, 10:59:10 PM
The all-important double weekend is here for Earlham and Wabash. In the end last season, it was an overtime loss in Meadville that derailed the Quakers' hopes of hosting.

Now, here's what I've been wondering while looking ahead to this weekend. Earlham plays host to Hiram on Friday night, before hosting the Gators on Saturday afternoon. Over the past few years, Earlham has always played Allegheny on the Friday.

I'm not sure whether this change will be advantageous or not. On one hand, the better of the two visiting teams will have to travel, get into Richmond late, and surely be somewhat worn down. Conversely, it always seems as though teams prepare more for the opening game, and rightfully so, of double weekends.

Don't confuse this, I certainly don't think that Earlham is guaranteed to win both games, or even one of the games. They haven't had back-to-back wins since the openers in Philly. I just think it's interesting that the Quakers and Little Giants have switched roles in terms of hosting the far-Easterners this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 05, 2006, 11:19:24 PM
Billy_Pilgram-
not trying to cramp your style, but Earlham is 3-1 in game 2 of the Hiram/Allegheny double-header in the last 4 years no matter what order.  I'd put the Gators in the 2nd game, because they have played better in the 2nd game. 

P.S. i'd take my chance of playing poorly against Hiram and still think i could pull out the win.

P.S.S. Correction Earlham Played Allegheny on a saturday last year

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 05, 2006, 11:34:00 PM
I'm disappointed in the continued detrimental remarks by so many people on this forum towards DenisonFan.

If he believes that Coach Ghiloni isn't utilizing players to Denison's best advantage, that's his opinion.  Disagree with it if you want, but he certainly has a right to it, and I can see no better place to express it than on a basketball forum.

I've occasionally made similar remarks regarding a couple of Wooster's players, pointing out what I consider to be their weaknesses.  Statements of that nature carry no personal rancor.  I've even mentioned once or twice that I've disagreed with a couple of Coach Moore's strategical/tactical moves, despite the fact that I consider him one of the best basketball coaches I've seen, at any level.

I don't believe that what I've posted, or what DenisonFan has posted, should be construed as "trashing" or "taking shots" at anyone.  He's not been personal in his remarks, and is an obviously passionate fan of the Denison program.  I believe he should be cut a little slack.

Jack

 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 06, 2006, 07:32:30 AM
There are no personal shots taken - many of us disagree with what he is posting and the tone of his posts. He sounds like he has an axe to grind (and he may have).

If you look back he was picking on the coach for things that statistically and realistically weren't backed up in his rants, especially since they came in games that weren't truly winnable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 10:04:00 AM
WB:
Thanks so much.  It is nice to hear someone gets where I am coming from.

Smed thinks I have an ax to grind.  For the record I have NO ax.

For you to say I complain about games we have NO CHANCE of winning.   It seems to me that the Big Red beat Witt a year ago.  What has changed??  Other than the fact that 4 juniors have guit off that team.

If I have a complaint is that we should not be losing each and every game by 30 points.  They need to play better defense.  They have to take care of the ball.  The Red average like 20 turnovers a game.  That is NOT a good thing.   

I feel, and again, this is MY OPINION, that Ghiloni does a poor job of rotations in the game.
It is like he forgets who is on his bench.  Be it Izzo, Hern, Hodgkinson.  They sit for too long.

They are not a deep team. ( In my opinion)  When you play 11 guys you are saying the second five is as good as the first.  On this team they are not.  (In my opinion)

Again Smed........just my opinion.   You say what you want, I will still say what I want.



Thanks again WB!! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 06, 2006, 10:33:05 AM
Quote from: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 10:04:00 AM
For you to say I complain about games we have NO CHANCE of winning.   It seems to me that the Big Red beat Witt a year ago.  What has changed??  Other than the fact that 4 juniors have guit off that team.

4 juniors quit?!?!?  You lost almost an entire court full of upperclassman and you want to just blow that off?  That's a HUGE loss and a HUGE change.  It turns a team with experience and adequate depth into a team that is young and shallow. 

You're still hanging your hat on that Witt win and using it as the reason why Denison should be winning all of their games.  Not with the casualties the roster has suffered.  Your expectations are too high and taking it out on the coach is simply wrong. 

Quote from: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 10:04:00 AM
If I have a complaint is that we should not be losing each and every game by 30 points. They need to play better defense. They have to take care of the ball. The Red average like 20 turnovers a game. That is NOT a good thing.

They're young....they're going to make mistakes.  They're going to get smashed by better teams.  They're going to struggle on defense, particularly early in the season.  That's what young teams do.  In '03-'04, Wabash entered the season with a whole boatload of fresh faces after graduating a sizeable senior class the year before.  Most of Wabash's key players were sophomores and freshmen during that season.  Wabash struggled their way to 12-15 that year.  Wabash didn't play good defense, turned the ball over a lot, got totally crushed in most of their losses...heck, that team even lost to Denison.  But they were young...most of those players getting their first varsity experience from that team are now seniors this season and Wabash is playing pretty good basketball.  Sometimes, it just takes some time.  Denison seems to be in the same boat....right now I would argue that getting the younglings game experience is more important than making sure Hodgkinson or Hern or Izzo get 35 minutes every game.  Next year, Denison will have Hodgkinson and Izzo as senior anchors with a nice cast of experienced young players.  If you play Hern and Hodgkinson and Izzo 35 minutes every game this year, Denison is going to be in the exact same boat next season.  Use a little forward thinking...there's a bigger picture here that you're completely missing. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 06, 2006, 11:24:38 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 06, 2006, 10:33:05 AM

4 juniors quit?!?!?  You lost almost an entire court full of upperclassman and you want to just blow that off?  That's a HUGE loss and a HUGE change.  It turns a team with experience and adequate depth into a team that is young and shallow. 

I don't think DF is blowing off the fact that 4 juniors have quit.  I think this has a lot to do with some of his questions about Ghiloni and his coaching staff.  Why are so many upperclassmen suddenly quitting when things seemed to be turning in the right direction?  DF had brought this up before Wally.  I think its funny that DF seems to be a pretty reliable source when it comes to Denison basketball, as he seems to follow them quite closely, and yet his biggest critics are Wabash fans who can't be nearly as close to what is going on around the Denison program as DF.  Why do you care if DF wishes to express his criticisms of Denison and the coaching staff there?  I didn't know you were only allowed to post positive sentiments in this forum on all things relating to DIII athletics?  Did I miss the memo that you can't be critical of a coach or a player every once in a while???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 11:33:00 AM
Wally:
You make some very valid points. 

Yes, having 4 juniors guit was HUGE.  Not only from a talent standpoint but also leadership for the younger guys.  I have said what was said in the stands for the reasons they left.  I don't need to say it again.  Do I think it hurt the team.  Absolutely.

As a coach on any level in any sport is it not your first and formost responsibility to the team to give them the BEST chance of winning the game?  Isn't that what they are hired to do?  Win games??  Or is it gym class?  Play everyone and lose by 30.

Don't Hern, Izzo and Hodgkinson deserve to play the most?  They are the upperclassmen.  They have put in the time.  They have some talent.  Are they just suppose to sit back and let this coaching staff lose games so the freshmen can play.  What is that??

Dension does not have nearly the talent that Wooster, Witt, Earlham, Wabash or even OWU has.  But they don't need to be embarrassed each and every time they play.

Does Ghiloni want a program where you play two years and quit.  Because by the time you are a junior you won't be playing because he has to give the freshmen experience.  Regardless of the fact that you are going to get killed in the game. 

I am sorry, but it is MY OPINION that is not what the coach should do.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 06, 2006, 11:45:28 AM
ScotsFan -

I'm just looking at it all objectively. Is there any reason that YOU have an issue with a give and take about a program, except that it's from Wabash posters instead of an all-knowing Scots poster?

Fact is - many programs have a lot of players leave the program. Wabash has just one junior this year. It's not an unusual problem that one class washes out for one reason or another.

Fact is - Denison's PT and stats were quite similar to last year's squad, when there was no carping about PT for the big studs.

Fact is - the criticism started during a hellacious stretch for Denison when they basically should have just played the young guys to give them experience.

Fact is-  Denison is on track to repeat, basically, their same record last year.

Fact is - before Ghiloni showed up they were awful, and now they're respectable, at least.

I was looking at his posts from another angle, a detached observer, if you will. There have been people backing up Ghiloni as well.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 12:05:05 PM
Smed:
If you feel that losing each game by 30 is repectable....so be it.  Let's see what Denison does in the next couple of weeks.  They certainly have some games they should win.  What are you going to say when they don't?

Yes, kids leave the programs.  DIII players play because they like to.  It is not like they are being paid to play. 

Last night Illinois beat Michigan State.   I am just curious how long Bruce Weber would have a job if he told Dee Brown he would have to sit out because we are going to give the freshmen some experience.  Especially before the conference games start.  Doesn't matter if we win or lose, it will be good to give the freshmen some much needed experience.  How long????  Not very I would think. 


Come on.  Give me something better than....Denison was going to lose anyway.  That certainly has to motivate the team when they are told:  "The team has no chance so we will play the freshmen."   That certainly would get me fired up to play.   

Question Smed?  Have you even seen Denison play.  If so, when?  I am just curious where you are coming from.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 06, 2006, 12:12:35 PM
What you hear in the stands and a buck will get you a cup of coffee.  

I think there are more important things for college coaches than winning basketball games.  College coaches, especially those coming into situations where there isn't a ton of winning history (cough, Denison, cough) have to build a program.  Build a program, and the wins will take care of themselves.  Sometimes program building isn't pretty to look at.  It's not always fun and it's anything but easy.  Ghiloni could play Hodgkinson and Hern and Izzo 35+ minutes every game...the scores would look a little better, Denison might even win an extra game or two, but at what cost?  The younger players don't get the court time to step in and be effective next season and Denison is in the same boat that they're in this season.  

You can't have four upperclassman unexpectedly walk and expect to win.  Would you rather see Denison go 12-13 this year (which is the area they're headed) and be prepared to have a 17 (or more)-win season next year...or would you rather see Denison win 14 or 15 games this year, finish in the middle of the pack, and do the same again next year...and the next...and the next...That's where this is headed.  Ghiloni is giving the younger guys time because he's not just in it for one year at a time, he's trying to build a program.  Isn't the cost of a lean year or two worth the payoff of having a winning program annually?  

The reality is that Denison isn't going to win this year with just Hodgkinson, Hern, and Izzo which is what you're advocating.  They won't win next year with just Hodgkinson and Izzo.  They need the other players.  Next year, Denison can win with Hodgkinson, Izzo, and a cast of experienced players and there's only one way to get that experience.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 12:23:08 PM
Wally:
I agree.  There must be some reason sooooooo many guys guit.  What I heard...you're right I have only rumors and so be it.  The fact is that perhaps Ghiloni and his staff should have done a better job of keeping those guys on the team and then he wouldn't have to worry about playing so many younger guys.

Denison is a 500 ball club.  But if you are going to build a successful program you better do a better job of keeping the upperclassmen you have or you will be building forever!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 06, 2006, 12:51:06 PM
From what I have seen, when the starters were pulled the games were getting out of hand. I do not think that any coaching staff says, "we're going to get killed" to the players, but come on, against Akron what did Denison expect? Why not allow the kids to play and work together as a unit when they're down 25 or 30 and there's no real pressure?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 06, 2006, 01:18:45 PM
I did some digging on Denison's web site, since we're talking about players that left.

Last year, they listed seven sophomores. On the current roster there are three juniors, though one (Champ Rawls) has not played varsity this year. (Last year, Rawls played 6 minutes of varsity).

The juniors that left:

Tony Julian - left at mid-season this year. Was averaging just 4.9 points per game and shooting under 50% from the line when he left.  Last year averaged 6.7 per game.

John Wagner - averaged 12 minutes and 3.9 ppg.

Pete Harris - averaged 5.5 points per game and dished out 47 assists off the bench.

Dan Kellogg - played just 13 minutes with basically no stats. Now listed as a student assistant.

Sure, it hurt their depth - but one could say that Gognat and Eberst are filling the slots OK. And giving PT to Ward, Krantz, McMahon and Shea can't hurt in the long run, even in the long run this season. I would bet those four freshmen will be better players in the second half.

Losing Julian hurt because it hurts to lose a player at midseason.

Wabash actually has two juniors, but Dustin Huff didn't play before this season. Ryan Stephens is the only survivor out of six in that class that played varsity over the past two seasons, including two part time starters at some point in their career (Shook and Koch). Wabash also has lost two would-be seniors that also started during their careers.

And I guarantee you that of the five of six would-be juniors that left - almost all have a different story.

It happens.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 01:35:19 PM
Smed:
Down by 30 play the cheerleaders if you want.

I will give you Akron, Witt and Wooster.  But not the other blowouts.

I was there.....we are in the game and it seems like Ghiloni will substitute just to do it.
The other teams don't pull their starters, why does he?  They are tired, they are not in foul trouble.   

Last game.......Hodgkinson plays 19 minutes and is 11 of 12.   23 of the 58 points.  40% of the offense and he sits him??????  So what if he has 2 fouls.  What are you saving him for?  Nobody else was doing anything.  So why not leave him in the game?  Instead he sits and the team goes down by 25 and the game is over.  So play the cheerleaders because we have NO chance anyway.   What is wrong with that picture?

Why is this so hard for you to understand?

Again, what games have you seen?

Then we dig ourselves a hole we can't get out of.

My biggest complaint is his rotation.  He can have 5 guys on the floor that don't even look to score.   You can certainly find a way to keep 3 starters on floor at all times. 

Play freshmen because you were going to lose anyway??  What kind of statement is that?
I have to think that would get the team motivated.  We pulled you out because we have no chance so let's play the freshmen.   Why does that not seem like a real good idea.

Illlinois played Michigan State last night.  I wonder how long Bruce Weber would have a job if he told Dee Brown that in those first 14 games he was going to sit him down so his freshmen can get some experience.  I have to think he would be gone.

To build a successful you best find a way to keep your upperclassmen on the team or you will be rebuilding FOREVER!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 06, 2006, 01:46:49 PM
Please for the love of all things holy don't tell me that you're trying to draw a comparison between Dee Brown and Dan Hodgkinson.  You're positively delusional if you think the two situations are even remotely related. 

What's better for the greater good of Denison basketball?  Hodgkinson getting 35 minutes and as many shots as he wants every game or developing the players that Hodgkinson is inevitably going to need support from to actually win games? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 06, 2006, 02:23:42 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 06, 2006, 01:18:45 PM
I did some digging on Denison's web site, since we're talking about players that left.

Last year, they listed seven sophomores. On the current roster there are three juniors, though one (Champ Rawls) has not played varsity this year. (Last year, Rawls played 6 minutes of varsity).

The juniors that left:

Tony Julian - left at mid-season this year. Was averaging just 4.9 points per game and shooting under 50% from the line when he left.  Last year averaged 6.7 per game.

John Wagner - averaged 12 minutes and 3.9 ppg.

Pete Harris - averaged 5.5 points per game and dished out 47 assists off the bench.

Dan Kellogg - played just 13 minutes with basically no stats. Now listed as a student assistant.

Sure, it hurt their depth - but one could say that Gognat and Eberst are filling the slots OK. And giving PT to Ward, Krantz, McMahon and Shea can't hurt in the long run, even in the long run this season. I would bet those four freshmen will be better players in the second half.

Losing Julian hurt because it hurts to lose a player at midseason.

Wabash actually has two juniors, but Dustin Huff didn't play before this season. Ryan Stephens is the only survivor out of six in that class that played varsity over the past two seasons, including two part time starters at some point in their career (Shook and Koch). Wabash also has lost two would-be seniors that also started during their careers.
We all know that losing players is inevitable, especially at this level.  I can't remember off hand, but I know for a fact that Kyle Witucky wasn't the only recruit brought in his freshman year.  Yet he is the only true senior on Wooster's roster.   They all quit or transferred but not all at the same time.  Not to mention the fact that Wooster has the luxury of finding one or two stud freshman every year that can step in and contribute immediately.  You act as though Denison losing these juniors could actually help them in the long run because its giving experience to the freshman that they might not have gotten otherwise?  Yes it's true to a point, but these juniors would be seniors and I would rather have a core of players playing with 3 years experience as opposed to one.  I, for one, would rather be building a program knowing that I have a solid core of upperclassmen returning rather than counting on unproven, inexperienced freshmen to suddenly step up.  I don't know the situation at Denison, but when there is a mass exodus, like what happened with over half of the juniors at Denison, questions and rumors are sure to follow.
Quote from: smedindy on January 06, 2006, 11:45:28 AM
ScotsFan -

I'm just looking at it all objectively. Is there any reason that YOU have an issue with a give and take about a program, except that it's from Wabash posters instead of an all-knowing Scots poster?
Not really, it's just ironic to me that it is Wabash posters though... ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 06, 2006, 02:33:56 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 06, 2006, 02:23:42 PM
Not really, it's just ironic to me that it is Wabash posters though... ::)

I'm missing the irony...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 06, 2006, 02:35:22 PM
It would be nice to have a core of players, sure, but it's not like what happened to Dension with its junior class hasn't happened to another team in the NCAC even in this time frame. Except for Julian, the players that left were role players, and they were replaced by sophomore role players with freshmen coming off the bench. It's making the best of the situation. Denison has a lot of players on its roster, which is good because it is building depth.

I looked at that OWU - Denison box score. Looks like OWU has a lot of depth and plays a lot of players. 12 players have played 9 games or more. No one plays more than 25 minutes a game. A good, well rounded team.

Here is a question, was Hodgkinson or Hern loafing on defense? The two main post players for OWU were 8-9 and 8-10 respectively. That's one thing I can see leading to a benching, even if you were lighting it up yourself. Some coaches just cannot abide defensive breakdowns.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 06, 2006, 02:59:12 PM
I'm sure Ghiloni would also rather prefer to have those four kids coming back next season and have a team loaded down with seniors.  Who doesn't want that?  But those kids walked, for whatever reasons, and now he has to play the hand he's been dealt.  Denison won't win by playing three man with Hern, Hodgkinson, and Izzo as DFan seems to think they should do.  Gotta have five guys on the court, and chances are you're going to need three or four or five more to play when those first five get tired, get some quick fouls, etc.  What's clear is that Denison isn't going to contend this year.  With all of the upperclassmen...maybe.  But that isn't our reality.  The reality is that Denison might be able to contend next year, but to do so the young kids have to learn how to play and we learn by doing.  But if the role players on this team don't get significant, meaningful time this year they'll be no better prepared to support the big guns than they are right now and Denison will have blown an opportunity before it even really got started.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 03:47:53 PM
Wally:
Did I say I'm comparing Dee Brown to anyone????  I asked how long Weber would keep his job?  Please go back and read what I said.

As far as getting guys playing time we have no choice.  Jullian was a HUGE loss.

As far as Eberst and Gognat stepping in.  Let's compare some numbers:

Wagner:  3 point percentage  .449
Harris:  3 point percentage .372.  Assist to Turnover ratio  2.1

Eberst:  3 point percentage .333
Gognat  3 point percentage .250   Assist to Turnover ratio a terrible .59

You really think they have replaced those guys?????????

Smed: I could have sworn that Koechler was on Chonacki??  Maybe I was at the wrong game.  And if someone is not playing hard you call a time out and ream them out.  You don't sit the kid when he is the only one doing anything on offense.

So if it were up to you, you pull them out, let the game get out of hand because the players you put in can not score and so you end up playing the cheerleaders.   

See, I have to say I do not agree with that.  Just my opinion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 06, 2006, 03:53:05 PM
It was a question, you don't have to get snide about it. Who was on Jean then?

I also say the best way to get a player to play D is to sit his butt down on the bench and get someone in there who is trying to play D. It's worked many a time. The pine really communicates the coaches message loud and clear.

Replacement is the term to use - not a total fill in. Remember, it's been just a half season and Denison hasn't played the dregs yet, really. Playing Oberlin, Hiram, et. al. can really help the stats.

'Bash - Gheny in just a few hours, and for some dang reason I can't get the song by Pilot of out of my head with a twist in the lyrics, "Oh, ho, ho, it's Majzlik, you know..."


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 06, 2006, 04:03:37 PM
The inference here is that Bruce Weber would be an idiot for sitting Dee Brown for no good reason the same way you feel Gholini is an idiot for sitting Hodgkinson or Hern or Izzo.  The difference here is that Dee Brown means WAY more to his team than Hodgkinson does to his.  Illinois wouldn't be undefeated without Brown, but I'm sure Denison could be 4-9 with or without one of those three guys.  The situations are completely different and trying to draw parallels between the two is asinine. 

More and more you sound like a guy who is less concerned with the long term well being of the program and more like a guy who is pissed because his friend or family member isn't getting the minutes/shots/points you think he deserves (a heinously erroneous belief....as soon as you start believing that one guy has statistical quotas to meet and then blame everybody else when said quotas aren't met, you're no longer a team player and you're hurting the squad).   This may or may not be the case....but I think it's time I fill you in on how you're coming off here to me. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 04:07:28 PM
Sit his butt down.  OK....for some reason I have never seen teams get points for defense.  So are you saying that those two guys scored all their points when Hern and Hodgkinson were in the game and the replacements shut them down.   NOOOOOOOO  that didn't happen.  So by sitting them down you just took your best chance of scoring off the court.

Interesting philosophy. 

I agree, these next games will tell alot of what this team is made of.

Rotation, rotation, rotation.   Not one freshman has been consistant from game to game.
For that reason, you leave the upperclassmen in to work with them.  Pulling everyone and leaving them to fend for themselves does not work.  You still have to put the ball in the basket to win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 04:16:50 PM
Wally:
Smed said that Denison should sit the upperclassmen in games they were obviously going to lose.  I totally disagree.  That is not why you play them.  That is why you have JV games. 
Your first unit has to play together as much as possible. 

Watching Wooster was like looking at a Rolex watch.  This does not come from playing with 11 other guys.  They have their starters and they have the roll players.  Those roll players work hard and replace those starters when they are juniors and seniors.  End of story.

Illlinois has some very talented freshmen.  I don't see Weber playing them just to give them "experience".  If you disagree with that, then there is no need for any further discussion.

As for my reasons for writing should be of no concern to you.  What I have in this forum is a place to vent my frustration.  I have not been 100% negative.  I will say I am about 70-30 but when you are 4-9 I don't have much on my highlight reel.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on January 06, 2006, 04:47:50 PM
I have sat back and read all these posts regarding Denison over the past several weeks.  I have refrained from posting because I knew that people away from Denison would not understand the downward direction this program is headed in, and would assume this year is similar to last.  While I agree with a lot of what DenisonFan is saying, I think there is a point that should be made.  Forget playing time, rotations, x's & o's; forget everything but this - the players in the program are miserable and are not enjoying their experience as players at Denison.  It's not only the upperclassmen, it's the majority of the players.  It started last year but they managed to win some games in spite of it.  At any lavel, to be successful you must enjoy what your doing and want to be there.  That is not happening at Denison.  Maybe you can't blame the coaching staff for all of it, but they don't seem to be doing anything to fix it.  Getting playing time for underclassmen can be a positive thing.  However, it won't help if the majority of them aren't there in the years to come. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooly on January 06, 2006, 05:48:58 PM
Kramer is finally someone who gets it.  That is exactly the problem at Denison.  It  does not hinge on playing time, just that the situation there is a bummer.  The program offers no excitment win or lose.  Way to go Kramer, you hit the nail on the head
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on January 06, 2006, 05:49:27 PM
Wooster plays College of NJ tonight in the opening round of the Washington & Jefforson Classic. Any thoughts on the College of NJ? How well do the teams match up?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 06, 2006, 05:59:57 PM
For someone like me who's been around this board a few years  ::)......

Reading all these posts about Denison is pretty amusing, considering all the talk about Wooster in here.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 06:05:05 PM
Kramer:

THANK YOU VERY MUCH!!

If I said that they would just say I have an ax to grind!!  That I am full of *#@*. 

Nice to see I am not alone.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 06, 2006, 06:22:10 PM
Again, you're comparing apples and oranges.  Denison isn't Wooster.  Wooster has been a dominant basketball program for a long, long time.  It isn't easy to get the point where Wooster is and trying to get a program to that point isn't a cakewalk.  

I don't think smeds nor myself are saying that Denison should be sitting the upperclassmen to get the younger kids experience.  What we are saying is that it doesn't make a lot of sense looking forward to keep them on the bench while the upperclassmen eat up all of the minutes in the game.  Denison is going to need those kids to perform, and with the exodus of the junior class this season, there really isn't time to baby them with JV games (and JV games are a different animal than varsity games anyway).  It might look ugly at times and Denison might end up on the wrong end of some serious beatdowns, but if Denison is going to be prepared to bounce back next year it needs to happen.  The freshmen have to play because after Hern,  Hodgkinson, and Izzo, Denison doesn't really have much else other than underclassmen.  They play by necessity.  Denison will be far better off next year because of this, even if it looks ugly at times presently.  

The point is that Coach Ghiloni doesn't have a choice.  Key players left and a bunch of kids who probably weren't expected to play significant roles this season are having to step in.  That's a tough spot for both coach and player.  Teams like this that are building or rebuilding need support, not backseat coaches.  

Now, if players continually leave the program in years to come, the team has no roster stability, and Denison finds itself in a perpetual state of rebuilding then spew forth the accusations of faulty management.  Right now, the gripe is that Denison is getting blasted by better teams which really isn't unexpected given Denison's youth. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 06:35:19 PM
Wally:
Very well said.
Let's hope these underclassmen can become more consistant in the remaining games.  If they don't, it is going to be a very long year.

Have a good weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 06, 2006, 07:11:42 PM
Enough of this non-Wooster talk.  ;)

With 7:22 left, Wooster leads TCNJ by 6, 46-41.  Vandervaart has 16, Cooper has 14.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 06, 2006, 07:22:45 PM
Scots are slowly pulling away, despite the fact that Tom Port has just 2 points (both on free throws.)

Wooster 59
TCNJ 50
1:34 left

Port steals and dunks, as if in response to my post.  61-51 Scots, 1:15.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on January 06, 2006, 07:30:21 PM
 62-53 over College of New Jersey moves on to
championship
game of W&J Trny.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 06, 2006, 07:30:37 PM
Final from W&J:
Wooster (11-1) 62
TCNJ (8-3) 53

Scots play the winner of SUNY-Maritime and W&J at 8pm local tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 06, 2006, 07:33:59 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 05, 2006, 11:34:00 PM
I'm disappointed in the continued detrimental remarks by so many people on this forum towards DenisonFan.

If he believes that Coach Ghiloni isn't utilizing players to Denison's best advantage, that's his opinion.  Disagree with it if you want, but he certainly has a right to it, and I can see no better place to express it than on a basketball forum.

I've occasionally made similar remarks regarding a couple of Wooster's players, pointing out what I consider to be their weaknesses.  Statements of that nature carry no personal rancor.  I've even mentioned once or twice that I've disagreed with a couple of Coach Moore's strategical/tactical moves, despite the fact that I consider him one of the best basketball coaches I've seen, at any level.

I don't believe that what I've posted, or what DenisonFan has posted, should be construed as "trashing" or "taking shots" at anyone.  He's not been personal in his remarks, and is an obviously passionate fan of the Denison program.  I believe he should be cut a little slack.

Jack

 

I encourage you to click on DenisonFan's name, which takes you to his profile; then scroll down to click on "show latest posts of this member," then go back and review the first few posts he put up regarding Coach Ghiloni.  These posts struck me, and others, as personal attacks on the coach, rather than valid criticisms.  That's how he got off on the wrong foot with some of the regulars in here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 06, 2006, 07:37:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 06, 2006, 07:30:37 PM
Final from W&J:
Wooster (11-1) 62
TCNJ (8-3) 53

Scots play the winner of SUNY-Maritime and W&J at 8pm local tomorrow.

Think it's safe for Woo to start preparing for W&J?! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 06, 2006, 07:41:29 PM
After returning to my posh suburban Chicago apartment, and its high speed Internet, I excitedly awaited returning to closely following the Earlham men tonight.

But, Teamline has not agreed. Apparently the site is down, so it's Seinfeld reruns and laundry on a Friday night for this 20-something.

Don't fret though NCAC fans, mostly earlhamalum, I will continue to refresh my browser in any attempt to get the Teamline connection to work.

Oh, how I miss the Quakers............
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 06, 2006, 08:07:12 PM
Halftime in Richmond:

Hiram 33,
Earlham 29


Finally got the Teamline site to load..........eh
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 06, 2006, 08:19:47 PM
Halftime in C'ville:

Allegheny 28
Wabash 34

Wabash has led most of the way here with a few lead changes.  Allegheny is hanging in with some very good 3 point shooting.  Allegheny did hold a 5-point lead with about 8:30 minutes left in the first half, but Wabash finished very strong to stretch the lead.  Wabash is staring to get in the habit of finishing the first half strongly...let's hope this trend doesn't break anytime soon.  Another trend Wabash is establishing is taking away a team's leading scorer...Majzlik has just two points in the first half for the Gators. 

Interestingly enough, Dustin Huff apparently isn't the only NCAC quarterback who has decided to try his hand on the hardwood this season.  Allegheny's Jimmy Savage is also getting singificant minutes tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 06, 2006, 08:41:38 PM
9:49 left in Richmond.......

Earlham 55,
Hiram 45

Quakers shot just 29% from the field in the first half.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 06, 2006, 09:09:02 PM
Final from Richmond:

Earlham 75,
Hiram 61

Hiram never came closer than nine in the final 10 minutes....

Sounded like Earlham knocked some of the rust, both of their own team and off the rims. Quakers shot the ball much better in the second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 06, 2006, 09:23:29 PM
Final from Chadwick:

Allegheny 63
Wabash 70

Game ball to Ryan Stephens for Wabash tonight.  Career high 14 points, a boatload of big rebounds and a couple of blocks.  Easily the best game Stephens has played in a Wabash uniform.

Wabash led by as many as 15 in the second half, then it got chilly for the LGs and Allegheny was able to chip away and widdled the lead down to 4 late in the game.  Wabash was able to hit enough free throws to keep the Gators at bay. 

Wabash's streak goes to 8 games in a row...Hiram comes to Chadwick tomorrow. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 06, 2006, 09:32:07 PM
I think we can safely call it a 9 game winning streak!  (Oops, that's why they play the games!) ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 09:32:32 PM
DC:

Go back and read everything I said. 
Apparently I am not entitled to an opinion. 
Apparently I have some ax to grind.
Apparently everything anyone else said about the program means nothing.
I will take the heat.  I don't mind.  I enjoy the forum.

I have to think Ghiloni has much better things to do than read this.  But I would love it if he did.  Maybe he would see that the program is not exactly headed in the direction that he would like. 

If he has to play freshmen and sophomores for the rest of his coaching days at Denison I think he may be hearing more than what I am saying.

I admit I have been less than kind on occasion.  But if the shoe fits!!

Again, let's see where the team is at the end of the month.  I will be the first to eat my words.  I would like nothing more than say "I AM SORRY BOB!!"

But I will wait.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 06, 2006, 09:44:08 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 06, 2006, 02:35:22 PM

Here is a question, was Hodgkinson or Hern loafing on defense? The two main post players for OWU were 8-9 and 8-10 respectively. That's one thing I can see leading to a benching, even if you were lighting it up yourself. Some coaches just cannot abide defensive breakdowns.

Here is the answer - Yes.  I have admitted that I was not at the OWU game, but I feel confident that if Hodgkinson or Hern were sitting it was due to their absolute disinterest in participating at the defensive end of the floor.  I have seen enough Denison games this year to know that neither really "gets it."  How in the world can they take so little pride in their games?  It's an embarrassment to allow another team's post players to go 16 for 19 from the field - that tells me that there was no effort whatsoever.

My frustration as I read DenisonFan's posts is the repeated elevation of Hodgkinson, Hern and Izzo.  Do you really think if Coach Ghiloni was pleased with these three that he would sit them for such extended periods of time?  Clearly they are not willing or able to do what he is asking them to do.  Coaches don't forget who is sitting on the bench - usually players who play regularly and find themselves on the bench know exactly why they are sitting.  Hodgkinson probably sits because he'll only start fighting around people in the post when he figures out how to get credit in the box score...oh wait, they count rebounds in the box and he obviously doesn't care about those (see OWU).

Losing programs don't turn into winners overnight.  It takes time and along the way, you may have to put up with some guys that (you hope) in 5 years you wouldn't welcome into your program.  That's where the Big Red seem to be right now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 06, 2006, 09:50:25 PM
Billy_Pilgram- this is your last chance to be able to drive all the way to indy from Northwestern (1.2 hours away)   
*in a plane


and i'll drive the rest of the way to Richmond.  If not then i guess i'm going SOLO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 06, 2006, 09:54:09 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 09:32:32 PM
DC:

Go back and read everything I said. 
I have.
QuoteApparently I am not entitled to an opinion. 
You are, and so are all of the rest of us.
QuoteApparently I have some ax to grind.
Yes, that is apparent.
QuoteApparently everything anyone else said about the program means nothing.
Huh?  ???
QuoteI will take the heat.  I don't mind.
But you'll whine about it, all the same.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 09:57:41 PM
Central:
Hodgkinson was 11 of 12.  Apparently OWU doesn't give a damn on defense either.

DC:
Let's talk at the end of the month.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 06, 2006, 10:05:41 PM
Perhaps they don't, but that's really beside the point.  Why do you constantly go back to his offensive numbers?  Have you ever given any thought to his defense?  Does his offensive ability excuse him from playing at the other end?

He should have picked a different sport - maybe he could DH for the baseball team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 06, 2006, 10:06:30 PM
And looking at the minutes for OWU starters, he may have yanked some fannies around as well.

Back to today's action, Wabash played well for about a 25 minute stretch, then let 'Gheny creep back into the game.

Savage was a pretty hard nosed kid that missed some looks inside when he was amongst the giants. 'Gheny is a good team that could wreak some havoc in the league if their shots fall.

The Majzlik man was a non-factor, had some foul trouble but Zimmer, Lytle and Stephens really clamped down on D in the post.

Stephens, wow, what a game. Our best free throw shooter as well.

The guards better start hitting their foul shots or it will be a long week next week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 06, 2006, 10:07:34 PM
As a TOTALLY neutral observer, I would so far score it:

DC: 1
DF: 0

Have the cornermen cleared both fighters for the next round? ;D

Though DF's supporters make a good point (except it cuts both ways): IF playing for Denison is no longer a pleasurable experience, that would undercut the team (which would seem to go against the coach, but not ALL of such blame is necessarily the coach) - I simply don't have the knowledge to say up or down on the coach, per se.

WHY the hell did I get into this fight??!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 06, 2006, 10:09:54 PM
Quote from: Kramer on January 06, 2006, 04:47:50 PM
Forget playing time, rotations, x's & o's; forget everything but this - the players in the program are miserable and are not enjoying their experience as players at Denison.  It's not only the upperclassmen, it's the majority of the players. 

Winning enough games will cure even the worst case of player misery...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 06, 2006, 10:25:56 PM
Hey hey.......how about another Earlham/Hiram post

Stats are finally available: LaRon Henry had 23 to lead Earlham, while Brandon Miller had 20 and 13. LaRon is quietly having an excellent season and Miller seems to be rounding into form. I'm sure the time off (only two games in the last two weeks) have been good for his bad knee(s).

Quiet, and balanced, night for other Earlham players. It seems Earlham has also found a true point guard to help push this team too in Neil Collins. The freshman who spent nearly all of last year, and the first 5 games of this season, on the bench, has been getting a few starts lately and playing pretty well. Nice to have a little more depth from a previously unknown spot. Agree earlhamalum?

Three players in double figures for the Terriers: Rick Baldwin (12), T.C. Spencer (11), and Emeka Mbanefo (10).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 06, 2006, 10:30:37 PM
If you had done what DC told you to do.  You would have gone back and reviewed ALL things I have said.

If I am not mistaken I clearly said "D" wins games.  Look at the good Bulls teams or the Pistons today.  But I have also said that you must score to win the game. 

So cut the BS.  Hodgkinson and Hern are all conference players.  If the coaching staff wants to sit them down because they aren't playing defense.  OK  That is their choice.  If the effort is not their they should sit down.  I just didn't see it that way.

I just think before you make comments like neither play any defense.  Look at what the other team did.  Apparently not much.   11 of 12 in 19 minutes.  Either Hodgkinson is REALLY that good or OWU did the same as Hodgkinson and Hern.

And by the way....do you know who Hern was covering?

Do you put the blame on them when Denison goes to a 2 3 zone??

If you are not at the game.  Please don't tell me what happened.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 06, 2006, 10:32:11 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 06, 2006, 10:07:34 PM
As a TOTALLY neutral observer, I would so far score it:

DC: 1
DF: 0

Have the cornermen cleared both fighters for the next round? ;D

Though DF's supporters make a good point (except it cuts both ways): IF playing for Denison is no longer a pleasurable experience, that would undercut the team (which would seem to go against the coach, but not ALL of such blame is necessarily the coach) - I simply don't have the knowledge to say up or down on the coach, per se.

WHY the hell did I get into this fight??!

Thanks, Chuck.  The thing is, I agree with you.  According to Streets & Trips, I'm 2296.7 miles from Denison; I don't have an opinion on the situation at Denison, if there even is a situation at Denison and not just in this room.  I don't think DF understands that.  I don't take issue with what he says; I take issue with how he says it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 06, 2006, 11:07:04 PM
Yea a little suprising i'd say, but Neil has played well for EARLHAM this year when given a chance.  I personally thought Freshman Tristin Gregory was going to have solid freshman year.  Off to kind of a slow start, but hopefully with the early season experience, he'll be a factor during the second part of the season.  Looking forward to seeing my first NCAC Vs. NCAC game tomorrow since last year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 07, 2006, 12:19:53 AM
Just thought I would bring back some much needed Wooster talk to this board!!!  After all, it's been over a page now since Wooster has been mentioned!!! ;)

It looks like TCNJ won the tempo battle tonight over Wooster.  Although, when you are taking up most of the entire 35 second shot clock on every possession as TCNJ seemed to do, it will hurt your chances of reaching your scoring average when you are avereging triple digits.  It was still a nice win over a team that many consider one of the favorites to win the always competitive NJAC. 

What a job TCNJ did on Tom Port tonight holding him to 1 field goal and 4 points total.  His lone field goal was a dunk BTW late in the game.  Port did manage to lead the team in rebounds and assists with 7 in each category, so he did help out in other ways tonight.  I'm sure that he will try and overcome his lack of offensive production, as will the rest of the Scots tomorrow night against W&J who was the unfortunate winner that gets to face Wooster in tomorrow night's final. 

One plus for W&J, in judging from their average home attendance barely breaking 200, they should be over that tomorrow night when you consider Woooster and TCNJ drew nearly 200 for their game in WashPA tonight, and I would have to bet that the majority of those were Wooster supporters. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: phil on January 07, 2006, 08:51:00 AM
ScotsFan
I was actually surprised that TCNJ was able to dictate the tempo and stay close the entire game. The Lions are far from being an NJAC favorite as they were picked ninth out of ten teams in the preseason coaches poll (but then again the men's soccer team was picked 9th of 10 teams as well and ended up winning the conference and advanced to the Elite Eight).

TCNJ graduated their second all-time leading scorer and basically returned only Findlay and their entire bench for this season. Last year they got off to a fast start, romped over Amherst of all teams, earned a top ten ranking and then played sub-.500 ball the rest of the year. Nobody thought they'd be competitive this year. Instead they've taken a page from Princeton's book and have played an extremely deliberate style to make the most of the personel they have. The reason for this is that eight teams in the NJAC are more athletic than TCNJ – at the very least, this style should keep them in just about every game. The downside is that if TCNJ ever gets down by double digits a comeback is very, very difficult.

At any rate, good luck to the Scots the rest of the way. They seem to be able to beat you a number of different ways, and as last night shows, they can win in a half court game as well. When it comes to the NJAC, I think you'll see NJCU, Stockton or Ramapo in the NCAA tourney – but I don't think this is a vintage year for the NJAC.

BTW, whomever did the pairings for the tourney did a nice job of scheduling the finals as a 6 PM Friday night game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 07, 2006, 08:58:02 AM
Whether or not you agree with Denison Fan's take on things (or how he expresses his take on things), he should at least be thanked for attempting to keep this room from being All-Wooster-All-The-Time.

That's not a slap at Wooster, nor is it a slap at the fans of the Scots. They're entitled to post as much as they want about their team, and they do those of us who follow the national scene a favor by keeping us abreast of one of the top programs in the country. But the unbalanced tilt of this room really keeps it from being one of the better ones on Posting Up. There's a couple of solid Wabash posters who give good game reports on their Diminutive Colossi, and Billy Pilgrim and Earlhamfan do a good job representing the Quakers, but that's about it. In a ten-team league, that's a shameful percentage of representation. F'rinstance, I will never for the life of me understand why Wittenberg does not have regular posters who cover the team in this room the way that the Wooster guys do for the Scots. How does the D3 program with the most wins (both overall and in the D3 tourney), a program that's just as strong today as it ever was, not get any steady representation on Posting Up? That just baffles me.

I can understand the indifference towards schools with downtrodden programs such as Oberlin, Hiram, and Kenyon. But Allegheny's been good from time to time; why no steady reportage on the Gators? Ohio Wesleyan's always a first-division NCAC team; why no steady reportage on the Bishops? Where have you gone, Barry Robinson? A conference turns its lonely eyes to you.

Woo woo woo.

It's nice to see Phil break out of his NJAC posting ghetto, BTW.  ;) If you're looking for an example of a fan who faithfully follows his team every season, whether they're up or down, and informs us on them in a comprehensive and interesting manner, TCNJ's Phil is one of the best examples in all of Posting Up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: phil on January 07, 2006, 09:27:39 AM
Gregory,
I'm blushing behind my Mac.

The NJAC room has grown quiet, and I've grown frustrated at watching TCNJ football and basketball slide towards mediocrity while every other sport at TCNJ contends for a national title. Last year the Lions had their best team on paper since the Greg Grant era (which now seems so, so long ago), and the lack of a true point guard and strong defense rendered a team that wanted to run, fair game for any team that pressured the ball and played a half court game. Losing to Rowan in the NJAC playoffs after beating the Profs by 20+ tells me the formula for beating TCNJ was pretty darn simple. Now this year they don't add a single impact player, they play the kids that spent the better part of last season on the bench and they emulate a style of play from an Ivy League school up the road ... and they're playing competitve basketball! Seems to me they might have gone a lot further last season if they didn't wait until this year to play this style!

Alas, the women's Lax team is favorite to win yet another title this spring and I still have a VHS of Greg Grant scoring a zillion points in the '89 Semis and finals...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 07, 2006, 09:48:12 AM
You need your Rowan foils to return, Phil. Those Profs fans kept you on your toes. Life gets a whole lot less interesting when you lose your nemeses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: phil on January 07, 2006, 10:12:25 AM
How right you are. The Rowan foils are relegated to the football realm as their basketball prospects have dimmed – even then, the Rowan folks are a group of good guys (many of whom I met), save one mean spirited SOB who it isn't even worth wasting my "A" material on.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 07, 2006, 11:09:27 AM
I did some homework on the "Dynamic Duos" of the NCAC.  I looked at the two top players on each team and their impact for the team.  Here is what I got.

I am sorry for Earlham it was very difficult to choose Miller over Jewett.  Either guy would do.  Wabash is just so balanced it was hard to pick two so I am sorry if you disagree with my choices.

Allegheny:  Majzlik & McCloskey    36 pts    10.3 Rpg   48% scoring   29% rebounding

Denison:  Hodgkinson & Hern    28.7 pts   14.4 Rpg   43% scoring  38% rebounding

Earlham:   Henry & Miller    32.2 pts   11.4 Rpg    44% scoring   35% rebounding

Hiram    White & Spencer     25.5 pts  11.3 Rpg    35% scoring    33% rebounding

Kenyon   Formato & Yelvington  25.8 pts  11.9 Rpg  37% scoring  31% rebounding

Oberlin    Spencer & Loll  24.6 pts   14 Rpg      41% scoring   45% rebounding

OWU   Chojnacki & Rudegeair   25.4 pts   12.4 Rpg   34% scoring  33% rebounding

Wabash   Medeiros & Joseph   22.6 pts    4.8 Rpg     31% scoring   13% rebounding

Witt     Russ & Borchers    26.4 pts    12.1 Rpg     39% scoring   34% rebounding

Wooster   Port & Cooper   29.3  pts   8.9 Rpg    28% scoring    20% rebounding


What this shows me is that Oberlin and Denison rely heavily on their duos in order to score and rebound.

I really don't see how you are not hurting your team in a game situation to sit these two guys down at the same time for extended periods of time.   This "pine time" crap does not cut it.  It directly impacts the game.  You hurt the teams chances of winning.  What lesson are the coaches trying to teach? 

In the case of Wabash, Witt and Wooster, they are very deep and their two guys do not have the impact as it would at Allegheny, Denison and Oberlin.

I just found it interesting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 07, 2006, 12:53:49 PM
Seeing 'Gheny last night, Savage and Hollihan could definitely step up, as Majzlik had just 9 points in 24 ineffective minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 07, 2006, 02:46:24 PM
Last night Port guarded Findlay and Vandervaart guarded whoever the #4 guy was. Considering Findlay was listed at 245 and Tom is stronger than Tim I think it was a good move. It might explain some of Port struggles with shooting.

Another good move was Wooster would double down on Findlay whenever he was passed the ball (I wish Coach Moore had done some of that in the BW game). Given that the TCNJ guards hit no 3's during the game, it was very effective.

The only other consistent threat TCNJ had was Stallworth driving the lane. But given his lack of long distance shooting, Witucky just backed off in the second half and took that away.

With NCJU only two threats contained, even though they hung 4-6 points behind most of the second half I don't think Wooster ever lost confidence they would win, ( the rest of TCNJ shot 8-26).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 07, 2006, 03:09:48 PM
After an 0-5 start, Wabash has gone nuts.  A 12-0 run has Wabash up 12-2 over Hiram with just over 16 minutes left in the first half...good start for Wabash. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 07, 2006, 03:41:21 PM
Halftime at Chadwick:

Hiram 18
Wabash 36

Medeiros got off to a great start for Wabash with 13 points pretty early on.  Otherwise, the game has sounded about as one sided as the score would indicate. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 07, 2006, 04:38:32 PM
Quote from: phil on January 07, 2006, 08:51:00 AM
I was actually surprised that TCNJ was able to dictate the tempo and stay close the entire game. The Lions are far from being an NJAC favorite as they were picked ninth out of ten teams in the preseason coaches poll
phil,

I wasn't aware that TCNJ was picked so far down.  I was basing my statement on what I have heard about them on Hoopsville.  Before the Holiday Break, they were talking them up quite a bit about what a nice surprise TCNJ was.  And the fact that they beat Ramapo who was #1 in the coaches poll (I looked it up after reading your post), I would say that the NJAC is a bit more competitive top to bottom than your average league like the NCAC for instance.  TCNJ may not have been a favorite to start the season, but they are certainly still in the mix right now, that's all I was saying.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 07, 2006, 04:39:52 PM
Final from Chadwick:

Hiram 52
Wabash 76

Not a whole lot of explanation necessary here.  Wabash shot very well from the floor (somewhere around 50%) and the defense was typical Wabash defense.  The streak goes to 9, 7 in a row at Chadwick court.  

Boxscore standouts for Wabash this afternoon include:
Kyle Medeiros - 13 points
Caleb Lyttle - 8 points
Gary Simkus - 10 points
Andrew Zimmer - 11 points

Wabash's individual stats won't ever knock you off your feet, but this is the kind of effort Wabash gets from four or five guys every game.  

Off to Delaware on Wednesday in an attempt to run the streak to 10 games.  

I think it's important to note here that this streak that Wabash is on shouldn't be particularly surprising.  Beating Depauw early in the streak was big for Wabash and then knocking off Franklin at home was also big.  But Wabash has played almost all of these games in Crawfordsville against teams that Wabash should be beating.  Confidence is high right now, Wabash is playing well, and will need this momentum as they get into the guts of of the conference schedule.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 07, 2006, 04:47:22 PM
Halftime in Richmond:

Earlham 32,
Allegheny 20

Tristian Gregory with a nice game so far off the bench, somewhere in the 12-point range.

Sounds like Earlham was a little more prepared to play the first half of this one than last night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 07, 2006, 05:12:01 PM
and Earlhamalum himself has made his first play-by-play appearance on Teamline

I will never let him live this down........

Earlham up 16 with about 12 minutes or so to go.........
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 07, 2006, 05:41:40 PM
Final in Richmond:

Earlham 69,
Allegheny 53

I'll let earlhamalum handle the details on this one; he was there. Sounded like good balance...led by double digits the entire second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on January 07, 2006, 08:00:17 PM
ha ha according to the W&J broadcasters, Wooster is wearing thier dark "blue"  ::) away unis.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2006, 09:32:08 PM
Final:  Wooster 97  Washington & Jefferson 72

Wooster wins the Wash & Jeff Tournament beating the Presidents on their home court.  :)

Wooster was led tonight by Evan Will with 20 points, James Cooper with 17 points, Tom Port with 12 points, Devin Fulk with 11 points and Andy Van Horn chipped in 10 points.

Wooster got off to a slow start in the 2nd half but then nailed several three pointers to stretch out the lead.  Scots made 13 three pointers this evening.

Wooster is now 12-1.  :)  Next up is road game at Allegheny on 1/11.

GO SCOTS!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 07, 2006, 09:44:12 PM
Good win against Hiram. Stephens against impressed with his effort.

Huge tests next week - with a trip to see the Bishops and then Wooster at home.

But since a tough OWU squad is in the way, there will be no squwaking at the Scots yet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 07, 2006, 10:45:50 PM
Does anyone know what the record is for the number of game appearances in D3 basketball is?  Witucky at Woo I believe hasn't missed a game and must be close to breaking that record, especially given the fact that Woo is gonna go deep in the post season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 07, 2006, 11:13:53 PM
Kyle Witucky has now played in 106 games for Wooster (starting them all, I believe.)  As far as game appearances go, that's not even top 15 at Wooster...yet.  The all-time leader for the Scots is Blake Mealer, who appeared in 121 games in his career ending last season.  If he continues his games played streak, Kyle would tie that record 3 games into Wooster's postseason, which many of us assume will be the NCAC championship game.  Kyle could play in as many as 127 games, if the Scots reach Salem.  I'm not sure how that stacks up nationally;  it's probably pretty high, but I'd guess that the record is probably held by a recent Williams player, perhaps Crotty.

UPDATE:  not Crotty or any other Eph.  Crotty played in 120 games, starting them all, which is tops for Williams, but Blake's got him by one game.  I'll keep looking...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 07, 2006, 11:27:01 PM
Thank you very much Mr. DC.  Big fan of trivia I am.  Wait I will to see if he gets to the record.  That said, I'd like to take this oppotunity to congratulate my Fighting Scots for winning the tournament at Washington & Jefferson.  I'm just surprised that they made Cooper the MVP. 15 and 17 aren't exactly MVP numbers but ummm ...?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 07, 2006, 11:29:33 PM
According to the NCAA record book the record is indeed held by Crotty, but at 122 games. But my experience with this record is either the NCAA isn't getting all the updates in or schools are not informing the NCAA of records in this category. The person listed in the book before Crotty was not the person who held the record -- at least two record-setters were unrecorded.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2006, 12:17:55 AM
Hmmm.  Well, the Williams website is pretty specific on the point.  This is from the story on Crotty's hiring by the Boston Celtics, taken from their website (http://www.williams.edu/athletics/sport.php?sport=3):

"At Williams Crotty was a two-time All-American and was named to the NCAA All-Tournament team in both 2003 and 2004. He started every game of his four-year career and set an Eph record for games started and played, 120. [...] Crotty's Class of 2004 is the winningest class at Williams with an overall mark of 104-16 (.867)."

104+16=120.  So I'm guessing 120 is the right number for Crotty. 

I couldn't find "games played" in the record book I downloaded (from ncaa.org), but I haven't tried hard yet.  If they have Michael Crotty at 122, do they have Blake Mealer at 121, some other number, or not at all?  I wonder if Mealer's 121 is in fact the record?  [UPDATE: found it.  It says in its entirety "Games Played--Career: 122--Michael Crotty, Williams, 2001-04"  Swell.  Thanks, NCAA.]

UPDATE:  UW-Stevens Point says that Jason Kalsow played in 121 games in his brilliant career.
UWSP record book (http://www.uwsp.edu/athletics/mbb/program/indvrecords.htm#MostGamesPlayed-Career)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 08, 2006, 12:26:45 AM
North Park's Michael Thomas and Jim Clausen played in 121 games for the Vikings from the 1977-78 season thru the 1980-81 season. Thomas started every game of his four-year career as a Viking (Clausen was the first big man off the bench as a freshman and then a starter for the next three years), and for the first three of those years North Park played 31 games and won national titles. Their senior season North Park was eliminated in the regionals, so they played 28 games.

D3 teams were allowed to play 26 regular-season games back then, as opposed to the current 25. Of course, the CCIW did not have a postseason conference tournament to pad the games-played totals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2006, 12:35:23 AM
Yeah, I thought of North Park, as the record is probably held by someone on a team that made several deep tourney runs.  That says "North Park" to me.  But neither North Park's nor the CCIW's website had a "games played" part of their record books.  Thanks for the assist. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2006, 01:42:10 AM
While looking at the D3 record book, I came across this interesting item:

Quote from: NCAA Record Book, page 103POINTS SCORED WITH NO TIME ELAPSING
Game
24—Rob Rittgers, UC San Diego vs. Menlo, Jan. 16,
1988 (made 24 consecutive free throws due to 12
bench technical fouls)

I bet that was a fun game, huh?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 08, 2006, 01:53:05 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 08, 2006, 01:42:10 AM
While looking at the D3 record book, I came across this interesting item:

Quote from: NCAA Record Book, page 103POINTS SCORED WITH NO TIME ELAPSING
Game
24—Rob Rittgers, UC San Diego vs. Menlo, Jan. 16,
1988 (made 24 consecutive free throws due to 12
bench technical fouls)

I bet that was a fun game, huh?

Nice find!

And (belated!) congrats to Rob Rittgers for making all 24 - any note on his game totals for FTs?  Must have been CLOSE to a record.

And what in tarnation could Menlo have done to get 12 bench technicals?!  Even Indiana didn't get that for the 'Malice at the Palace' riot!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2006, 01:55:50 AM
Here's another fun game from the record book:

Quote from: NCAA Record Book, page 104
FEWEST POINTS ALLOWED
6—Dickinson (15) vs. Muhlenberg, Feb. 3, 1982
FEWEST POINTS ALLOWED IN A HALF
0—Dickinson (2) vs. Muhlenberg (first), Feb. 3, 1982
FEWEST FIELD GOALS
3—Muhlenberg vs. Dickinson, Feb. 3, 1982 (11 attempts)
FEWEST FIELD-GOAL ATTEMPTS
11—Muhlenberg vs. Dickinson, Feb. 3, 1982 (3 made)

Ypsi, Rob Rittgers went 30/30 from the stripe that day, which gave him three more entries in the record book (most FTs attempted, most FTs made, best FT %).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 08, 2006, 02:05:09 AM
David, great stuff!

Were you able to track down what could possibly lead to 12 bench technicals?! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 08, 2006, 02:09:12 AM
I don't know if I read this somewhere or just always assumed it was for some sort of brawl where 12 people left the bench.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 08, 2006, 02:22:52 AM
Pat,

Sounds plausible, but unless it was a mugging rather than a brawl (or UCSD had a much shorter bench or a much worse FT shooter!), why the disparity?  I was thinking more along the lines of the whole Menlo bench chanting F*** Y** at a ref!  I[E]nquiring minds want to know!

BTW, had a chance to check your email?  Let me know if there is NOT a message from me there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 08, 2006, 02:35:40 AM
The NCAA record book can be spotty...I've noticed in the football records book (which has a nice photo of some kid wearing a #7 Wooster jersey on page 2  :)) that Jake Knott's career yardage numbers are absent from the all-divisons lists.  By my count he should be 19th in total career yardage, 28th in career passing yardage, and 9th in career touchdown passes.  Then again, I don't know how many other people's stats the NCAA is missing...

At least we know where our players stand in the books.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2006, 02:58:08 AM
121 games in a career is a pretty big number.  Even if the NCAA record book can't be trusted (and, obviously, it can't), we ought to be able to intuit who might be a candidate to have 121+ games.  To beat it you'd need to play every game all four years, and average more than 30 games per year (which, these days, means 5+ postseason games per season for all four years.)  The single-season record appears to be 34 ('90 EauClaire and '04 Stevens Point), so to get to 121 you'd need to be talking about a team with sustained excellence.  We've covered Williams, North Park, Wooster, and Stevens Point.  I just looked up Platteville, and their record is 118 (T.J. Van Wie, 1898-93, and Ernie Peavy, 1991-95).  I'm sure there are other candidates (Rochester comes to mind), but it's too late to chase this hare any further tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 08, 2006, 03:39:30 AM
Catholic's Pat Maloney and Tim Judge played in all 121 possible games of their four-year careers, which is how the error came to my notice.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 08, 2006, 11:46:23 AM
Dave:
Great facts!!
Thanks
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lancer98 on January 08, 2006, 03:11:41 PM
http://www.newarkadvocate.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060108/SPORTS/601080327/1006
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 08, 2006, 04:05:10 PM
Excellent article lancer thanks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 08, 2006, 04:23:20 PM
That is a great article. Thanks, Lancer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 08, 2006, 05:47:08 PM
I'll echo the previous sentiments.  Thanks for that great article lancer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 08, 2006, 09:56:37 PM
Back from Richmond and some insight on the Earlham Allegheny game yesterday.  Earlier this week I was hoping for Freshman Tristin Gregory to step up and he ended up leading Earlham in scoring with 15 points. (12 first half point)
Brandon Miller had a solid 2 games this weekend for Earlham.  Yesterday's win was a Team effort and that is what they will need to do to finish in the top 4 of the NCAC.

Majzlik ended up coming out of the game with a head injury.  Looked like he got an Elbow to the head while going for a Rebound, and didn't play the last 5 minutes of the game.  I really liked the way PG McCloskey plays the game for the Gators.  Freshman Hollihan could be a solid player for them if he hits the weightroom and works on finishing around the basket.

Big week for EC, playing at Wittenberg on Wed. and then going to OWU on saturday.  I think they will win at least 1 out of 2, but i'd love to steal one from WItt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 09, 2006, 09:13:56 AM
We would all love Earlham to steal one from Witt.  Go Quakers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 09, 2006, 09:40:31 AM
The last time Earlham beat Wittenberg was the 1999-00 season.  The Quakers didn't just beat Wittenberg at home in Triple-O.T. in one of the best D3 games I've either seen or been apart of, but EC the following week went into Springfield and won again. 

I'll never forget the article in Wittenberg's hometown paper after our O.T. win.  (Wittenberg played down to the level of competition.)  I'll tell you that was in our locker-room all week before we went to Springfield.  Anyone that would of watched that game in a non-bias point of view, would of said Earlham Played up to the level of competition.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 09, 2006, 11:04:47 AM
i dont think witt will have any problems as blunt as that sounds. we have no opponents to look ahead to and our starters have gotten some rest with our bench producing heavily over break, even though ohio northern was the only top quality opponent. we'll see the next three wednesdays leading up to wooster again as we have vs earlham, vs wabash, and then vs owu.

anyone else besides me think that denison isnt worth wasting all this space on here- i mean come on no one cares
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopsfan1111 on January 09, 2006, 11:30:42 AM
Hey DC...do a check on who coached that Muhlenberg team...I think you will be surprised to find who the coach was  ;D :) ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 09, 2006, 11:49:28 AM
Nice catch hoopsfan.  That would have been Steve Moore's 1st season at Muhlenberg I believe.  I thought he inherited a down program when he arrived at Wooster, but the Mules must have really been awful when Moore took over the reigns there.  He did turn things around in a hurry.  From his bio, he won the MAC South COY in '83 and led the Mules to back to back MAC titles in 84-85 and 85-86 as well as helping Muhlenberg to it's first 20 win season in over 40 years in the 85-86 season.  That would be right before he decided to come to Wooster in 1987 and the rest is history.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 09, 2006, 01:33:49 PM
This is an NCAC board and the regulars around here actually want more input from other teams, not less. So the Denison talk is a refreshing change from the pattern of Woo, Woo, Woo, 'Bash, Woo, Woo, Witt, Woo, Woo, Earlham in the past.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 09, 2006, 01:52:51 PM
i never said the talk was bad-i just said i was getting tired about hearing the same subject being pointlessly discussed over and over again
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 09, 2006, 02:06:32 PM


anyone else besides me think that denison isnt worth wasting all this space on here- i mean come on no one cares


I care!! :-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on January 09, 2006, 02:50:33 PM
I agree I think that the talk about Denison is refreshing and interesting.  I just objected to the constant blasting of Coach Ghiloni but since I vented I feel a lot better and have found the conversation very entertaining.   Lets be realistic, the Big Red are an inexperienced team.  Inexperienced teams do not win.  Why should Coach Ghiloni play his upperclassmen all the time, that will not solve the problem of their inexperience at every other position besides the post.  Perhaps Coach Ghiloni is looking toward the future.  By playing more people this year they will be more battle tested and ready to compete next year.  Just a thought.

On another note, this is a big week for the Bishops.  I would love to see them 2-0 at the end of the week.

Go Bishops!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 09, 2006, 03:15:49 PM
pennstghs-  Reason 1000 why I can't stand Wittenberg.  "i dont think witt will have any problems as blunt as that sounds. we have no opponents to look ahead to"

Well for all i care, WiTT can look forward to the Wooster game and EC will come knock'n hard on Wittenberg Door on Wednesday.  GO EC
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 09, 2006, 03:19:16 PM
Oooo...that would be a fun game to play.  "Reason #XXXX Why I Can't Stand Wittenberg".  We might have the most active board on the site if we tried that.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 09, 2006, 03:20:46 PM
i'd be willing to give it a shot!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 09, 2006, 03:50:59 PM
I think Wabash and OWU will also give Witt something to look forward to...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 09, 2006, 03:57:12 PM
bishopsfan:
Maybe you should read the article that was posted in the Newark paper.

DIII players pplay because the "love the game".   So you are saying those juniors and seniors who have busted their buts for 2 1/2 and 3 1/2 seasons should sit down so some freshman can play? 

Come on?  I think there has to be something said for those guys that stick it out.  And if they are good enough they deserve the playing time.  And when those freshman are juniors and they are good enough they will be getting the playing time.  And hopefully the coach won't sit them so he can "build for the future".

I am pretty sure that is what should happen.   Ghiloni has no choice but play the younger guys.  4 juniors left.  That doesn't leave very many upperclassmen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 09, 2006, 04:07:07 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 09, 2006, 01:33:49 PM
This is an NCAC board and the regulars around here actually want more input from other teams, not less. So the Denison talk is a refreshing change from the pattern of Woo, Woo, Woo, 'Bash, Woo, Woo, Witt, Woo, Woo, Earlham in the past.


When does Wittenberg ever get talked about?

From what I've seen only when they play Wooster.  ;D 8)

Reason #1 I don't like Wittenberg.......its in Ohio!

Reason #2 I don't like Wittenberg.......ummm, I really don't since the last time Hope played Witt we turned the HPEC into a Hope home game by outdrawing their own fans and went to Salem in 1998  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 09, 2006, 04:39:21 PM
reason #3-   their Sh!t never stinks
reason #4-   W
reason #5-    I
reason  #6-   T
reason  #7-   T
reason  #8-   E
reason  #9-   N
reason  #10- B
reason  #11- E
reason  #12- R
reason  #13- G
reason  #14-  to many letters
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2006, 04:40:10 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 09, 2006, 01:33:49 PM
This is an NCAC board and the regulars around here actually want more input from other teams, not less. So the Denison talk is a refreshing change from the pattern of Woo, Woo, Woo, 'Bash, Woo, Woo, Witt, Woo, Woo, Earlham in the past.

True, but as sac points out

Quote from: sac on January 09, 2006, 04:07:07 PM

When does Wittenberg ever get talked about?

From what I've seen only when they play Wooster.  ;D 8)

...which is true, and a real shame, in my view.  Then again, we don't exactly roll out the welcome mat for the Tiger Up folks:

Quote from: wally_wabash on January 09, 2006, 03:19:16 PM
Oooo...that would be a fun game to play.  "Reason #XXXX Why I Can't Stand Wittenberg".  We might have the most active board on the site if we tried that.   ;D

Love 'em or hate 'em, they're the likely #1 team in the country as of today.  That alone is worth discussion.  We should be embarrassed to be the home board of the #1 ranked and winningest all-time program and have them come up in conversation usually in the context of how much we hate them.  I'm not laying blame here; I hardly expect fans of another program to take a conversational interest in Witt (if I did, I'd do it myself.)  And the few Witt posters who do show up from time to time are usually here and gone in a sentence (I'm thinking of Witt4Ever here.)  But we don't do much to encourage their participation, and I think that's too bad.

Just my 2c.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 09, 2006, 04:54:53 PM
Reasons why I like Wittenberg:

1. Mike and Rosy's Deli.....discussed at length earlier in the season

2. Easiest, and shortest, NCAC trip from Richmond

3. (Former?) radio personality Scott Leo
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 09, 2006, 07:31:30 PM
I think the lack of participation by Witt fans in this forum is just one of life's great mysteries. ;)

Quote from: David Collinge on January 09, 2006, 04:40:10 PM

Love 'em or hate 'em, they're the likely #1 team in the country as of today. That alone is worth discussion. We should be embarrassed to be the home board of the #1 ranked and winningest all-time program and have them come up in conversation usually in the context of how much we hate them. I'm not laying blame here; I hardly expect fans of another program to take a conversational interest in Witt (if I did, I'd do it myself.) And the few Witt posters who do show up from time to time are usually here and gone in a sentence (I'm thinking of Witt4Ever here.) But we don't do much to encourage their participation, and I think that's too bad.

Just my 2c.
DC, I was just curious as to what you propose we do?  Personally, I don't look at it as an embarrassment to this board that we don't discuss Wittenberg.  It's more of an embarrassment to Wittenberg and their fans that they aren't discussed on here more.  I, for one, can't think of too many things I want to discuss about them, except negative things.  And my guess is that many followers of other NCAC schools feel the same way.  Maybe if some more Tiger fans were to join in and start up some topics regarding Witt basketball and some stories on their players, I would be inclined to comment out of respect for their program.  But, I'm not going to go out of my way to throw out compliments to Wooster's archrival just because they are likely the next #1 and they have no support on this board.  You can sing their praises all you want DC, but I doubt that too many others in here will join in the chorus.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2006, 07:41:40 PM
I'm not asking you or fans of any other program to start conversations about Witt, as you can see in the section of my post that you quoted.  I'm not really proposing anything, just giving an opinion;  although I would like to see a less hostile environment for would-be but absent Witt posters.  I don't think we can legitimately complain about being overly focused on Wooster and Wabash, and have a "why I hate Witt" discussion at the same time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on January 09, 2006, 07:46:58 PM
The Kenyon/WSU game can be viewed here:

http://www.teamline.cc/pay_video.html?teamcode=1101&eventcode=0021

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 09, 2006, 07:59:26 PM
I have been steadily participating on this board for a while, and do keep up to date reading the posts even if i have nothing worthwhile to say about the subject. IN my opinion we could play the reasons why i hate any team game all night long.

as for mark caraway i dont see how his presence has affected the team beacuse i have yet to see him play in person but i dont see him impacting the now 10 deep team all that much
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 09, 2006, 08:00:58 PM
by the way witt did receive the honor of being the top ranked team in the country at this point in time- i dont know how this will affect our team, personally i hope we dont get too over confident
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2006, 08:06:36 PM
Witt is indeed the new #1, garnering 8 first place votes and edging out Hope (9) by 18 points.  Wooster (2) slides in at third, just 2 points behind the Dutchmen, with Albion (2) fourth and former #1 IWU (4) fifth.

In case that doesn't resonate, let me point out that the top four teams are all from the Great Lakes, representing just two conferences.  Wow!  :o

Baldwin-Wallace is #13, Carnegie Mellon #16, and Wilmington debuts at #17, giving us 7 GL teams in the top 25.  #2 Hope plays at #4 Albion this week.

I believe this it the first #1 ranking for Wittenberg in the history of the D3hoops.com poll. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on January 09, 2006, 08:29:51 PM
Oh wow.  PennStghs, what are you talking about?  Where have you been?  Are you lost, sick, nuts?  I don't know how you can even THINK to say that Witt has no challenges ahead.  Night in and night out, we take people's best shots.  Now, being the #1 team in the d3hoops poll, as little as that means, people want to us even more.  The bullseye just got bigger my friend.  I can remember numerous times, teams playing their hearts out and taking us to the wire or just flat out beating us.  I can remember an over time game at Hiram and a loss at OWU when I was a frosh, a loss at Wabash as a sophomore, two losses to Allegheny my junior year.  Thats just off the top of my head.  So for you to say that there are no challenges is maybe the most outrageous thing I can think of.  Each game is a challenge and I can GUARANTEE you no one in the program is thinking of ANYTHING other than Earlham on Wednesday.  Man, think before you speak, please. 

And as for the lack of Witt posters, I read this forum on a daily basis, but beacuse I don't write anything, you think I'm not there.  I know of many people like me, who choose to lurk rather than post.  Is that a big deal? I don't think so at all.  When people stop supporting the program, then thats a problem.  Witt fans not posting on a message board is really of no consequence. 

GO TIGERS!   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 09, 2006, 08:46:34 PM
Congrats to Wittenberg!  Believe it or not when I speak of D3 Basketball to anyone outside of this board I have nothing but good things to say about Wittenberg and Wooster.  Those two programs put the NCAC on the map.  I will say I have more Respect for Wooster and Coach Moore then i'll ever have for Wittenberg and Coach Brown.  Not speaking bad about Wittenberg, it just speaks volumes for Coach Moore and Wooster. :) 

Petewitt54- I agree with you.  Teams are going to try to bring their (A) games against Witt.  2001-2002 Earlham beat #2Depauw who was (13-0) and playing at home, in O.T.

Granted this team doesn't have Travis Brett, but i wouldn't mind someone going 10-15 from 3 point land and ending up with 38 points.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2006, 08:55:42 PM
It's true...you know it's true!   ;D  (Had to try to beat smeds to this!)

Pete, I'm glad you're out there reading, as well as maybe hundreds of thousands of Quiet Tigers.  And that may suit some others who'd just as soon not hear about Witt.  But I'm interested in all of the teams in the NCAC, and all of the top teams nationally in D3, and I wish there were people who know what's going on with Witt who would contribute.  I feel well-apprised of Wooster, Wabash, Earlham, and (now) Denison, but as for Witt we get the occasional (and very welcome) musings of pennstghs, the rare (but usually valuable) posts of W4E, and your very rare contributions, and that just leaves me hungry for more.

I'd also love to hear more from pupfan, bishopsfan, any of our now-vanished Allegheny colleagues, anyone lucky enough to be associated with Kenyon College, and even Oberlin.  Call me greedy!  ;)

Speaking of Witt4Ever, you don't seriously expect anyone to PAY to watch video of Wright State vs. Kenyon, do you?  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 09, 2006, 08:58:28 PM
CCIW Chat had the same problems, with the twist that the school dominating the postings was also the one who was most reviled by the others (IWU in both cases).  

I don't go back far enough to know if it was a pre-existing problem, but I suspect it arose from the 'out-of-the-blue' disastrous season of 2001-02 (Scott Trost's first season after Dennie Bridges 'retired').  After 3 final fours in six years, we went 12-13 overall, 6-8 in conference - the first losing season in either category in essentially forever.  When we returned to championship status the next year, there were some of us who were overly defensive about being the 'kings' - I think a couple of students were worse than me in that regard, but they had the excuse of youth.  I long-since apologized to the board for 'rubbing-their-noses-in-it', but have NO excuse.

This year, both sides have greatly changed attitudes.  IWU IS a nationally-dominant team - we're now secure in it and the rest of the conference is proud of it (without ceding a thing - CardinalPride predicted nearly two months ago that NCC would beat us AT Shirk, and was widely mocked even by his fellow Cardinal fans, but, dang, they done do'd it!).  With the sole exception of Millikin (from which we still get occasional posts), we now have good representation from EVERYONE.

Mutual respect is the key - be proud of your school, but be respectful when they are up, and be proud of your conference when YOU are down.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 09, 2006, 09:03:23 PM
QuoteIt's true...you know it's true!   

Damn you, DC!  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scott_leo on January 09, 2006, 09:08:39 PM
You're right David, this is Witt's first #1 ranking in the D3hoops.com poll.

Final from Dayton:
Wright State 88
Kenyon 47

Quote from: billy_pilgrim on January 09, 2006, 04:54:53 PM
Reasons why I like Wittenberg:

1. Mike and Rosy's Deli.....discussed at length earlier in the season

2. Easiest, and shortest, NCAC trip from Richmond

3. (Former?) radio personality Scott Leo

Billy, I'm only 3rd?!?! I guess I can't compete with Mike & Rosy's or a trip across I-70. I'll be calling Wednesday's game... are you making the trip?

Also, congratulations on your Nittany Lions having a great year... you called it!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 09, 2006, 09:12:50 PM
Mr. Ypsi- I think that was deap!

As for anyone else.  I believe the Heartland Conference is better than the NCAC this year overall.

Teams like Hanover, Bluffton, Franklin, Transy, Defiance are overall better than.  Witt, Wooster,Earlham,OWU, Wabash.  I would like to see Witt Vs Hanover, Bluffton Vs Wooster, Earlham Vs Transy, Wabash vs Defiance, and OWU Vs Franklin.

Where is the NCAC Vs Hearland Conference
kind of like   Big Ten Vs  ACC

It's true..... YOU Know it's true!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Indiana Jones on January 09, 2006, 09:14:56 PM
I could not agree with Mr. Walker more.  As if being the 'evil empire' (seemingly) of the conference doesn't garner each team's best shot night in night out, attaching the #1 in front of Wittenberg should do the trick.  Would some of you insiders shed some light on the evil empire status?  Why doesn't Wooster qualify?


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 09, 2006, 09:15:31 PM
Billy_pilgram, Please tell me there is something out there better then Earlham's Teamline... Rumor had it Earlhamalum was on there and made it better... that isn't saying much about what we have to listen to now.  Tell me I can listen to something better on Wednesday.  Show me the link that i can go to for the EC Vs Witt. game, other than Earlham's Teamline.   Thanks
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2006, 09:20:37 PM
EA, how about Witt 62, Transy 51, at Transy (Nov. 27)?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 09, 2006, 10:35:42 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 09, 2006, 08:00:58 PM
by the way witt did receive the honor of being the top ranked team in the country at this point in time- i dont know how this will affect our team, personally i hope we dont get too over confident

Hmmmm....

Quote from: pennstghs on January 09, 2006, 11:04:47 AM
...we have no opponents to look ahead to....

I think it's too late for that. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on January 09, 2006, 10:46:31 PM
I happened to catch the Wright State / Kenyon score on the ESPN bottomline tonight...again it makes me beg the question why the D3 vs. D1 blowout games get publicity on television but the marquis matchups still go unnoticed!!! I'm sure the NCAA nation would love to see how the top-25 matchups go each week in Division 3 way more than the routs!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 09, 2006, 10:51:01 PM
w_w,

I'm PRETTY sure that pennstghs was only meaning the NEXT game would not interfere with that game, despite his clumsy wording.

OK, I've tried to do my job as NCAC peacemaker - I'm gone! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 09, 2006, 10:55:27 PM
QuoteBilly, I'm only 3rd?!?! I guess I can't compete with Mike & Rosy's or a trip across I-70. I'll be calling Wednesday's game... are you making the trip?

That's a respectable 3rd...it's one spot higher than your Buckeyes ended up in the final polls.

No, I won't be there Wednesday...I'll be watching a Big Ten battle for #1(0) in Evanston as my beloved Nittany Lions come to town.

Do you guys have a free Web cast though? If so, post the link. I'm sure earlhamalum would be grateful.

QuoteBilly_pilgram, Please tell me there is something out there better then Earlham's Teamline... Rumor had it Earlhamalum was on there and made it better...

Hey, you made it marginally better. I was able to actually follow the score when you were on board.

Let's be honest though, we all knew that the quality of broadcast would suffer without my smooth, sometimes smart ass, voice.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 09, 2006, 11:02:47 PM
I like the NCAC vs. HCAC thing.  I know you old time NCAC folks like the NCAC/OAC angles.  Most Wabash people still have a soft spot for the ICAC/HCAC...that was a helluva hoops conference in the late 90's.  

So...how did we do vs. the HCAC this year?  The results:

Bluffton 72, Earlham 62
Bluffton 76, Denison 53
Defiance 82, Oberlin 51
Franklin 91, Earlham 88
Wabash 68, Franklin 58
Hanover 62, Wabash 59
Hanover 62, Earlham 53
MSJ 66, Earlham 54
MSJ 79, Kenyon 69
Witt 62, Transy 51
RHIT is also 2-0 vs. the NCAC

So that's 8 up and 2 down (10 and 2 if you count RHIT) for the HCAC.  Ouch.  I almost wish I hadn't bothered with that.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 09, 2006, 11:16:02 PM
Also notice.. Earlham 0-4 not helping the NCAC at all..

SHHhhhhhh
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 09, 2006, 11:57:16 PM
guys i didn't mean that witt has no challenges ahead as i also stated that we have three tough wednesday nights ahead of us at home earlier if you would have read (earlham, wabash, ohio wesleyan).  i have gone to games for years and by far know teams give their best shots against witt.

petewitt54 i didnt mean to disrespect you at all-we t hink along the same lines i think

also, didn't i also say jsut because i dont post something to a subject i dont have enough information about doesn't mean im not on here reading about it. come on guys show me some love

david collinge-i am a diehard penn state fan and have had to put up with crap for too long so this year was awesome to finally have something to talk about-especially after we beat ohio state with all of the "diehard" ohio state fans around here-we can share stories.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 10, 2006, 12:01:37 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 09, 2006, 11:57:16 PM
so this year was awesome to finally have something to talk about-

0-7 vs the team up North as these Ohioans like to say.  ;) ;D 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 10, 2006, 12:06:08 AM
Thing #4 I like from Wittenberg:
Quotei am a diehard penn state fan

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 10, 2006, 12:07:35 AM
Quote0-7 vs the team up North as these Ohioans like to say.


3 of those games are still under review ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 10, 2006, 12:32:19 AM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on January 10, 2006, 12:07:35 AM
Quote0-7 vs the team up North as these Ohioans like to say.


3 of those games are still under review ;)

I SURE as hell hope they are not under review by Alamo Bowl officials!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2006, 12:41:20 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 09, 2006, 11:57:16 PM
david collinge-i am a diehard penn state fan and have had to put up with crap for too long so this year was awesome to finally have something to talk about-especially after we beat ohio state with all of the "diehard" ohio state fans around here-we can share stories.

I'll defend my conference, even those schools deep down actually I dislike (I'll leave you to guess at which those are  ;)), because I love my conference.  I love the Big Ten (that's Big TEN), too, but I draw the line at Penn State.  Ick.  I have to go wash my hands after typing those foul words.   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 10, 2006, 12:41:28 AM
or better yet Big TEN (11) officiating crews... which is worse?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 10, 2006, 01:16:30 AM
QuoteI'll defend my conference, even those schools deep down actually I dislike (I'll leave you to guess at which those are  ), because I love my conference.  I love the Big Ten (that's Big TEN), too, but I draw the line at Penn State.  Ick.  I have to go wash my hands after typing those foul words.   

Oh.......that hurts. Well, I'm going to take my 30 undergraduate credits from PSU and my Big Ten Champion T-shirt (not co-champion, only an Ohio State fan could think up that crazy co-championship idea) and head to bed.

(Mumbles incoherently about boosters at Michigan and Ohio State)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 10, 2006, 01:20:59 AM
Wittenberg fans!

D3hoops.com needs you. In danger of being the quietest No. 1 team since Amherst in 2004, Wittenberg basketball (and football, shoot) needs more representation on our message board.

Please register for the board via the link at the top of the page, if you have not done so already, and join in the conversation. Your team needs your posting support.

(ducks)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 10, 2006, 01:45:47 AM
Now, Pat,

They're only renting the space for a week anyway - the winner of the Albion-Hope game is next week's #1 (I've already promised that on several boards, so I sure hope you guys won't let me down)! ;D*

*assumes no other upsets!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 10, 2006, 01:48:47 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 09, 2006, 08:58:28 PM
CCIW Chat had the same problems, with the twist that the school dominating the postings was also the one who was most reviled by the others (IWU in both cases).  

I don't go back far enough to know if it was a pre-existing problem, but I suspect it arose from the 'out-of-the-blue' disastrous season of 2001-02 (Scott Trost's first season after Dennie Bridges 'retired').  After 3 final fours in six years, we went 12-13 overall, 6-8 in conference - the first losing season in either category in essentially forever.  When we returned to championship status the next year, there were some of us who were overly defensive about being the 'kings' - I think a couple of students were worse than me in that regard, but they had the excuse of youth.  I long-since apologized to the board for 'rubbing-their-noses-in-it', but have NO excuse.

This year, both sides have greatly changed attitudes.  IWU IS a nationally-dominant team - we're now secure in it and the rest of the conference is proud of it (without ceding a thing - CardinalPride predicted nearly two months ago that NCC would beat us AT Shirk, and was widely mocked even by his fellow Cardinal fans, but, dang, they done do'd it!).  With the sole exception of Millikin (from which we still get occasional posts), we now have good representation from EVERYONE.

Mutual respect is the key - be proud of your school, but be respectful when they are up, and be proud of your conference when YOU are down.

I don't agree with your synopsis at all, Chuck.

1) Illinois Wesleyan has never been "dominating the postings" on CCIW Chat. The Titans have gotten the most pixels lately, but that's a function of their success rather than their support; plenty of fans of other schools chime in with their two bits about them. It's a tendency that is not exclusive to the greenies; when Carthage was all that and a bag of chips back during the Wiertel/McDaniel/Garnes days, they were the ones who were the prime topic of conversation on CCIW Chat. It's simply natural for the discussion in a room to focus more upon the best team at the time than upon any other team. (This room is anomalous in that regard, what with Woo fans being so voluble and Witt fans being so taciturn.)

The Titans do have more supporters among the room's regulars, numerically speaking, but they're not even close to being a majority ... and they're hardly a dominant cadre.

2) Most of the regulars on CCIW Chat are long-time fans rather than students or very recent alumni. Believe me, the alliances, animosities, and affections of most of us who appear in that room on a daily or semi-weekly basis were established long before Scott Trost arrived in Bloomington to take the reins. Wesleyan's 2001-02 season and subsequent success really changed nothing in that regard.

3) I think you're overstating the case of what motivates us, Chuck. Your alma mater's program is the most disliked in the conference for a lot of people, but "reviled" might be a little too strong a word. The essential point, and I think that this is what is really healthy about CCIW Chat, is that almost all of us are motivated primarily by our love for our teams rather than our hatred of someone else's team. In that respect, I tip my cap to the Wooster fans here, who follow that same philosophy. No matter how heated and how high-stakes their rivalry with Wittenberg gets, they never let their feelings towards the Tigers obscure their basic motivation, which is their love of the Scots. My negative feelings towards Wesleyan are infinitesimally insignificant compared to my positive feelings towards North Park, and I'm sure that Kenosha Mark would say the same thing about Carthage, Hiker Jim would say the same thing about Wheaton, etc.

4) In spite of that, "pride" might not be the right term to describe how a lot of us feel about Wesleyan's success. We all want to see the conference be nationally recognized as strong, of course, and the success of our current top dog has a lot to do with that. But we all know that the conference is strong by virtue of its top-to-bottom strength, rather than the success of only one team. Putting all of our eggs into someone else's basket in terms of the pride thing wouldn't sit right with a great many of us, I suspect. Yes, most of us band together and root for whichever CCIW team(s) makes the tournament each March because they're the ones who're carrying the flag for the rest of us, but it's just human nature for there to be limits to how much vicarious pleasure you can derive from a rival's success.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 10, 2006, 09:19:53 AM
Wittenberg's apathy aside, we've got some big games tomorrow night.  Certainly worthy of some pregame chatter. 

Wabash @ OWU is a critical game for both teams.  Almost always a good game when these two teams get together (save last year's 26-point Bishop loss at the Branch).  Can Chojnacki get enough support to beat Wabash's balance?  Is there enough room on the bus for Wabash's momentum?  This is only Wabash's second road game in the last nine played for Wabash, dating back to the Colorado Thanksgiving tournament.  The winner here gets a leg up on the third seed in the tournament, the loser is playing catch up for the rest of the season. 

Earlham @ Witt is another critical game.  Witt has the bullseye on their backs now and Earlham tends to play to the level of their competition, so we could be in for a good game.  Earlham's near miss vs. Wooster surely has the Quakers believing that they can pull this off. 

Also we'll have one less winless team in the NCAC after Denison and Oberlin square off.  We'll get a pretty good measure of how far off the deep end (or not) Denison has gone after tomorrow night. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on January 10, 2006, 09:51:13 AM
Quote from: earlhamalum on January 09, 2006, 09:15:31 PM
Billy_pilgram, Please tell me there is something out there better then Earlham's Teamline... Rumor had it Earlhamalum was on there and made it better... that isn't saying much about what we have to listen to now.  Tell me I can listen to something better on Wednesday.  Show me the link that i can go to for the EC Vs Witt. game, other than Earlham's Teamline.   Thanks

Witt/Earlham game broadcast:
http://secure.stretchinternet.com/live.php?user=wit&id=5244

All Witt broadcasts can be reached from this page, with present, future and archived broadcasts:

http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/broadcast/

Most BB games are done by Scott Leo.

He does Witt games, along with Urbana University, produces the Wright State games, was the voice of the Richmond Roosters (Frontier League baseball), and now the voice of the Columbus Clippers (NY Yankees AAA franchise).







Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 10, 2006, 10:15:59 AM
Congrats to Witt for making it to the top. 
Having #1 and #3 says volumes for the NCAC.

I said earlier I thought, having played them both, Wooster is the stronger team.
But you never know, on any given Wed or Sat, anything can happen.

If you can catch them on an off night you can give them a run for their money.  But if they bring the A game, you don't have a chance.

Both are very, very, good.

Congrats again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 10, 2006, 10:18:38 AM
Quote from: earlhamalum on January 09, 2006, 09:12:50 PM

As for anyone else.  I believe the Heartland Conference is better than the NCAC this year overall.

Teams like Hanover, Bluffton, Franklin, Transy, Defiance are overall better than.  Witt, Wooster,Earlham,OWU, Wabash.  I would like to see Witt Vs Hanover, Bluffton Vs Wooster, Earlham Vs Transy, Wabash vs Defiance, and OWU Vs Franklin.

EA,

I'd take the NCAC in each one of those matchups except, sorry to say this, Earlham.  Bluffton might be a tough one for Wooster and that would be a game I would like to see, but Hanover is a bit down this year and I don't think they would be any problem for Witt.  I would take Wabash over Defiance and depending on which OWU team showed up, I like them over Franklin as well.  I just don't see the HCAC as better than the NCAC this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 10, 2006, 10:32:21 AM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on January 10, 2006, 12:07:35 AM
Quote0-7 vs the team up North as these Ohioans like to say.


3 of those games are still under review ;)
Please, I think JoePa blames the officials after every loss?! ::)

Quote from: David Collinge on January 10, 2006, 12:41:20 AM
I love the Big Ten (that's Big TEN), too, but I draw the line at Penn State. Ick. I have to go wash my hands after typing those foul words. :D
Amen, DC!!!  They are like the illigitimate stepchild of the Big TEN.  I usually root for every other Big Ten team in the bowl season EXCEPT PSU and that even includes OSU.  I just can't  bring myself to do it.  Especially when every time Michigan beats PSU there is always some excuse about the officiating as evidenced by Mr. Pilgrim. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 10, 2006, 10:37:43 AM
Hey, congrats to Kenyon. They kept it under fitty last night.

I'm sure the announced crowd of 3,503 were all giddy with excitement.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 10, 2006, 11:03:44 AM
In the spirit of competitiveness, it will be nice to have Earlham post an upset of over Witt.  Boy, how that will cause case havoc on next weeks Top 25?!  I know they have it in them!  Go Quakers!  Show the same spirit that displayed when Woo came to town!

While we are talking about the perennial sluggers, I will be disappointed if my Scots fails to beat the Gators by at least 20 points.  This game is by far different from the Quakers/Tigers encounter because while the Quakers have some glimmer of hopr for an upset, the Gators have none.  Its only a matter of how much damage the and how many missiles Woo will fire from beyond.

I hope to go nuts tomorrow night.  Help Quakers!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on January 10, 2006, 11:52:31 AM
As a recent Witt alum and casual observer, I completely agree with petewitt, Witt always has a target on their back and always will. Reason being, they are good! Like them or not, they are good.

Coach Brown does an extraordinary job getting his kids to play hard night in and night out. All I read about is the great job Coach Moore does, which he really does an equally extraordinary job with his kids as well, but please give credit where credit is due. I do not understand why the lack of respect for Coach Brown, as voiced by some recently.

It is quite obvious this board is dominated by Wooster fans, which is great that they choose to show their support by posting on this forum. Just b/c Witt fans choose not to chime in or even look at this website shouldn't take away from their program. Again, I agree with petewitt, that I'm sure there are plenty of Witt fans that check this board out and simply opt not to get involved.

Congrats to the Tigers, as insignificant as this poll really is but I do believe they have the best front line in the country in Russ, Borchers, and Brady. Whether they stay atop the "list" will remain to be seen but count on them being around come tourney time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 10, 2006, 11:54:53 AM
So is everyone trying to say we had some people pulling for FSU last week?

Thanks Witt4ever
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 10, 2006, 12:02:17 PM
I will always defend the Quakers and, though this is not the normal spot, I will also always defend the Nittany Lions. So, just a few words before I never mention the Big Ten again in this place.

QuoteQuote from: billy_pilgrim on Today at 12:07:35 AM
Quote
0-7 vs the team up North as these Ohioans like to say.


3 of those games are still under review

Please, I think JoePa blames the officials after every loss?!

Hardly every loss. I don't think I heard him complain once about officiating during the 2004 season as instant replay had been implemented. However when, in the 2002 season, one sideline official disallows two catches in two separate games that directly impact the finishes of those games, I'd say there is room for a complaint.

I'd also encourage any Big Ten fan who didn't closely watch this season's Michigan/Penn State game to do so when it later appears on ESPN Classic or some other such network. Aside from Lloyd Carr asking and receiving exra time to be put on the clock in the closing seconds, there was a Michigan fumble and a close sideline catch by a Wolverine player that were not ever reviewed by the Big Ten replay booth and a series of nearly comical spots given to Michigan ball carriers on close 3rd down plays. My personal favorite involved an official doing his worst straight line field sobriety test while marking the ball in front of the Penn State sideline.

As for other proof of the incompetance of Big Ten officials in games involving Penn State. Enjoy this video sample of the clutch 3rd (or maybe 4th) down "catch" that kept alive Ohio State's go-ahead drive in the 2003 game in Beaver Stadium.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4678399642098629171&q=Penn+State

Yes, that really was called a catch.

Quote from: David Collinge on Today at 12:41:20 AM
I love the Big Ten (that's Big TEN), too, but I draw the line at Penn State. Ick. I have to go wash my hands after typing those foul words.

Amen, DC!!!  They are like the illigitimate stepchild of the Big TEN.  I usually root for every other Big Ten team in the bowl season EXCEPT PSU and that even includes OSU.  I just can't  bring myself to do it.  Especially when every time Michigan beats PSU there is always some excuse about the officiating as evidenced by Mr. Pilgrim.

God forbid that Penn State should come along and add an Eastern flavor to the research universities that most comprise the Big Ten. Similarly, God forbid that a successful football program enter the fray and break up the "Big 2, Little 8" mentality that had consumed the conference.

I've never quite understood the arrogance of Michigan or Ohio State fans. I guess that 1/2 of a mythical national title in the last 50 years in Ann Arbor and one tainted BCS title for those in Columbus can lead to those big heads.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 10, 2006, 12:10:17 PM
Yeah Bill_pilgram-  I guess i'll route for the NCAC... but not WABASH... cause they were the last team added... I guess i'll just hate Wabash now.. Thanks for the insight!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2006, 12:23:31 PM
Funny thing is, the "successful football program" that is Penn State did nothing but lay eggs in the Big Ten, prior to this season.  The Big 2/Little 8 is a memory, but credit for that belongs (primarily) in Madison, with assists from Iowa City, West Lafayette, and even (ugh) East Lansing. 

I may be an arrogant Michigan fan (who, BTW, can't STAND Lloyd Carr), but my distaste for Penn State and Mr. Paterno goes back much farther than the dark day that they soiled the Big Ten.  ;)

But no, I wasn't rooting for Florida State Penitentiary.  There isn't a circumstance I can concieve of where that would happen.  (Anyway, that evening I was rooting for Occidental to beat Amherst.)

All in good fun, of course.  :-*
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 10, 2006, 12:52:49 PM
That's right, Penn State laid an egg their second season in the Big Ten.......that egg was in the loss column. The 1994 Penn State Rose Bowl team (12-0) became the first Big Ten team in nearly 30 years to finish unbeaten. Included in that season was a 63-14 thrashing of Ohio State. Days after that game, Penn State dropped from the #1 perch to #2. At the end of the season, Penn State finished behind a 12-0 Nebraska team. Penn State did not have the support of Big Ten writers. Imagine if the same situation happened with Michigan or Ohio State getting the shaft of the hometown writers.

Aside from the four dreadful years that have recently haunted Penn State football (2000, 01, 03 and 04), Penn State has finished no lower than a tie for the fifth in the Big Ten and no lower than 16th in the final season polls. They've also won a Rose Bowl, Fiesta Bowl and Orange Bowl since joining the Big Ten. A little better than doing nothing but lay eggs?

With the retirement of Barry Alvarez, the Big Ten has now completely turned over its coachs (aside from Saint Paterno) since 1993. Similarly, many of the programs have spent millions of dollars renovating facilities. I may be in the minority, but I believe this arms race was triggered by Penn State, and its legendary coaches and facilities, joining the league.

Finally, I'm curious to know how anyone can really despise Joe Paterno. Jealous, as most University of Pittsburgh fans are, I am able to understand. However, how can fans of D-3 sports, where athletics are a distant second to academics, hate a man who has won at college football's highest levels without NCAA infractions or Marcus Vick-like mercenaries?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 10, 2006, 12:56:54 PM
It's nice to see a little Big Ten football talk being mixed into the NCAC basketball chatter.  As a relative newcomer (at least newposter) to the forum, I too am surprised that more of the Springfield constituency doesn't participate.

Go Big Red and Go Bucks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 10, 2006, 01:04:03 PM
Witt people are being defensive.  Their reasons for their limited participation on this forum; that they read what we write but chose not to "chime" in does not hold water.  Who does that?  Even in the face of all that is said about their program, both the good and the bad, they choose to stand by the sidelines and watch.  I don't know of any Tigers who does that.  Where is your fighting spirit?  Where is your competitiveness?  You'd rather we argue for and against you while you chose not to defend or support your stance.  Ohh please!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 10, 2006, 01:30:24 PM
Whoa!  Easy earlhamalum...was Wabash the last team added?  It may have been Hiram.  We came into the NCAC during the same season.  I'm not sure which school was unofficially added first. 

I would still advise you to focus your animosity toward Wittenberg.  They are far more deserving than your fellow Hoosiers.    ;)

I don't think the Great Witt Silence takes anything away from their program, per se, but it certainly doesn't do anything to add to what little knowledge we can mine from press releases.  I think that's the point more than anything else. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 10, 2006, 01:49:38 PM
What ever happened to Greg Thomas?  Is his username something different?  I look at Earlham and Wabash as the I.U.  &  Purdue.  But even as an IU fan i go for Purdue deep down inside.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 10, 2006, 02:36:25 PM
Hiram I think was the last one, after Wabash accepted. 

Actually, you need to hate DePauw. Everyone should hate DePauw!

And Penn State, they're pussycats in hoops. My real Big 10/11 antipathy lies with Michigan and Purude.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gatorgrl on January 10, 2006, 03:33:11 PM
Gatorgrl here.  I know a small bit about about what's going on with the Gators -- enough to know that, yes, in a previous life Coach Clune was indeed a stand-up comic in New York City.  He claims that's as hard a job as he's ever had.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 10, 2006, 03:36:22 PM
Psst...Gatorgrl....come join us over on the NCAC board.  We're desparately looking for some input from Allegheny fans!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 10, 2006, 03:53:17 PM
Greg has always been Wally Wabash - during the board transition he smooshed his user names together (like I did!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 10, 2006, 05:19:45 PM
And let's not even mention DC. He's had more name changes than Mellencamp.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 10, 2006, 06:58:43 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 10, 2006, 05:19:45 PM
And let's not even mention DC. He's had more name changes than Mellencamp. :D

As long as he sticks to name changes, I'm fine with him. ;-)

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 10, 2006, 08:39:39 PM
Whatever happened to MemphisDave?  He used to post alot.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gatorgrl on January 10, 2006, 08:52:26 PM
Gatorgrl here.  Having been a two-sport Gator athlete, albeit pre-Title IX, I still have some connections at Allegheny.  Wanna know anything besides the fact that indeed, Rob Clune WAS a stand-up comic in the 80s? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 10, 2006, 09:57:22 PM
Billy,

My distaste for PSU began in '94 when they won their 1st Big TEN title.  You would have sworn that PSU was on the verge of taking over the Big TEN?!  OOPS!  Sorry it only took ELEVEN years to get Big TEN title #2!  You would think the long layoff between titles might have humbled some of the PSU fans, but no, it's like '94 all over again.   Congrats to PSU.  I guess a Big TEN title a decade is really something to be proud of.  Too bad it's also almost been a decade since you've beaten Michigan! ;) 

BTW, Northwestern had won more Big TEN titles than PSU during the Nitany Lions drought.  How's them eggs?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 10, 2006, 10:00:05 PM
Quote from: sac on January 10, 2006, 08:39:39 PM
Whatever happened to MemphisDave?  He used to post alot.  ;)
I must've come around here too late for MemphisDave.  I only remember Memphis... :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 10, 2006, 10:32:54 PM
You shouldn't be so hard on Penn State fans.  Years of independent status and being the biggest and baddest program in the east allowed them to gain a false sense of superiority.  Joining the Big Ten has been good for them - they've come to understand their true place in the world.  We only have to put up with their arrogance once each decade... that's not much of a price to pay for a sure W most years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2006, 10:37:27 PM
Memphis hasn't been around in a long, long time.  He was last seen with Dennis Prikkel, of all people.  His passing, if indeed he has passed, went largely unnoticed and unmourned.   :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Indiana Jones on January 11, 2006, 08:20:30 AM
Quote from: WooMix on January 10, 2006, 01:04:03 PM
Witt people are being defensive.  Their reasons for their limited participation on this forum; that they read what we write but chose not to "chime" in does not hold water.  Who does that?  Even in the face of all that is said about their program, both the good and the bad, they choose to stand by the sidelines and watch.  I don't know of any Tigers who does that.  Where is your fighting spirit?  Where is your competitiveness?  You'd rather we argue for and against you while you chose not to defend or support your stance.  Ohh please!


Fighting spirit??  Competitiveness??  This is a message board.  To go a step further, it is a message board that is largely comprised of SID/statistician types who analyze a lot of stats and exchange banter, which is what a sports related board typically is.  It is a TERRIFIC resource for D3 info, but it cannot be taken so seriously.  Case in point:  one Sunday morning I happened to catch the D3 football playoff selection show on ESPN2/ESPNnews featuring Pat Coleman (my introduction to this site).  For crying out loud, he mispronounced 'Monon Bell', one of the most intense and famous rivalries in all of college athletics.  To me, that put this board in perspective.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Coshocton Giant on January 11, 2006, 08:40:48 AM
Been gone. Past post mentioned 12 consecutive technicals... could have been incorrect uniform numbers in the score book. I saw something short of that in a high school game once.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 11, 2006, 08:58:22 AM
Oh relax.  I was on campus for a good two months before I finally started saying "Monon" correctly.  We're not all native Hoosiers, you know. 

What kind of perspective do you get from the fact that the publisher of this website is asked to come onto the Worldwide Leader and discuss the championship bracket?  ESPN has a ton of top notch college sports analysts, a ton of top notch researchers to aid said analysts, yet Pat Coleman is their best option for D-III championship bracket analysis.  I think THAT puts this site in a completely different perspective. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2006, 09:08:00 AM
I bet those 12 techs were a uniform violation of some sort. Now, I recall that in a high school JV game they started with five technicals because of a uniform mixup, but the visiting team was allowed to correct the book on the players who haven't played yet. In college, I don't know if that's an option.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 11, 2006, 09:14:43 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 11, 2006, 08:58:22 AM
Oh relax. I was on campus for a good two months before I finally started saying "Monon" correctly.

Heck, anyone who's seen the movie Hoosiers knows how to pronounce that word and knows that the Monon line is for running unwanted coaches out of town. :-)

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 11, 2006, 10:06:07 AM
tonight we've got some good matchups to look forward to as we get back into the swing of things. i am interested to see how far earlham truly has progressed as a nice turnout should be expected for the game here at witt. hopefully witt wont suffer from the number 1 curse as wooster did last year against us. at least it should only last one week as either albion/hope will gain it next week i'm guessing since the will have beaten superior opponents.

wooster fans. remember when we were being knocked for having no depth or bench like you guys? well i think we've progressed slightly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 11, 2006, 10:35:31 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 11, 2006, 10:06:07 AM
tonight we've got some good matchups to look forward to as we get back into the swing of things. i am interested to see how far earlham truly has progressed as a nice turnout should be expected for the game here at witt. hopefully witt wont suffer from the number 1 curse as wooster did last year against us. at least it should only last one week as either albion/hope will gain it next week i'm guessing since the will have beaten superior opponents.
The timing for Witt getting the #1 ranking isn't exactly the same situation or circumstances as the #1 Curse with Wooster.  Witt isn't playing Wooster this week.  Every time Wooster has had the unfortunate honor of being the #1 team in the country, it has always fallen on the week of the Witt game for some reason??  I guess the basketball gods just don't want Wooster hanging on to the #1 ranking for more than a week???  Witt might suffer the same fate though, but not for suffering a loss.  Just the fact that, as you mentioned, the Hope/Albion winner will probably vault to #1 next week.

Quote from: pennstghs on January 11, 2006, 10:06:07 AM
wooster fans. remember when we were being knocked for having no depth or bench like you guys? well i think we've progressed slightly.
I'm not sure I remember anyone knocking Witt for not having a bench or depth?!  Maybe you could refresh my memory?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Indiana Jones on January 11, 2006, 10:58:42 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 11, 2006, 08:58:22 AM
Oh relax.  I was on campus for a good two months before I finally started saying "Monon" correctly.   

Wally, are you serious??  I cannot believe that a high school senior heading off to C-Ville to become a full-fledged caveman is not fanatically aware of the Monon traditions-- regardless of era or direct involvement in athletics at Wabash.  It is undeniably a huge part of the Wabash culture.


I do agree with you that it is a tremendous credit to Pat Coleman and this site that ESPN brought him as the D3 expert.  That one gaffe really stuck out to me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 11, 2006, 11:04:40 AM
I came to Wabash from Oregon....I still have friends that don't correctly pronounce Oregon even after years and years of my beating it into their brains.  Mispronouncing Monon is an easy mistake...especially for somebody removed from the region who doesn't see or it say it very often. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 11, 2006, 12:12:46 PM
It's "Ore-uh-gone" right?  ?? ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 11, 2006, 12:45:51 PM
Ugh...I'm cringing, LG. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on January 11, 2006, 01:00:34 PM
Jack- great reference to Hoosiers! They will "hide-strap your a$$ to a pine rail  and send you up the Monon Line"

I don't think it's too much to ask to know how to correctly pronounce the Monon Bell match.

Woomix- I don't think I have ever heard of measuring competitiveness or fighting spirit by the number of posts on a forum. We'll let our on court performance and support in the stands speak for our competitiveness and spirit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 11, 2006, 01:06:46 PM
Quote from: Indiana Jones on January 11, 2006, 08:20:30 AM
For crying out loud, he mispronounced 'Monon Bell', one of the most intense and famous rivalries in all of college athletics.  To me, that put this board in perspective.

I tripped over the word. I knew it at the time. On live TV, **** happens.

I KNOW how to pronounce it. I just botched it. Sheesh.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 11, 2006, 01:11:12 PM
Hey Indy, pronounce Cortaca Jug for me.

Now do it on live TV, with a prompter, a producer in your ear, while trying to remember your stage direction and throwing out extra info to compensate for the fact that Wabash is the only top seed on which ESPN doesn't have video.

That's what it's like, man. It ain't as easy as it looks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 11, 2006, 01:34:24 PM
i guess what i was implying was that the knock on witt in the early parts of the year is that they have no backcourt or depth besides their big three but they have slowly established that i think. brown has said the main goal of the season to get tournament ready is to try and develop his backcourt
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2006, 02:05:06 PM
It's funny, though, because the darn Monon Bell game was on DirecTV, for cry-ay-ay!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 11, 2006, 03:41:53 PM
In Pat's defense I watched the show and didn't catch it. I didn't know that he had mispronounced it until I read it here.

Guess it wasn't so big a flub.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 11, 2006, 03:55:11 PM
I don't think people were "knocking" Witt for lack of depth.  I do recall people questioning Witt's backcourt, but not knocking it.  The questions also mainly had to do with the Wooster game and whether or not Wooster's depth in the backcourt would hurt Witt's relatively young and inexperiened backcourt because the game was being played so early in the season.  I agree that Witt's backcourt has seemed to improve, but you can't deny the fact that there were questions coming into the season regarding the play of the guards.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 11, 2006, 04:02:36 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 11, 2006, 02:05:06 PM
It's funny, though, because the darn Monon Bell game was on DirecTV, for cry-ay-ay!

Yeah, they had to have the video cuts done by Friday for some reason. I don't pretend to understand how they work, so I didn't question it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 11, 2006, 04:15:35 PM
Some thoughts on the Earlham/Witt match up tonight.

Earlham is Scoring 72.4 PPG.
Witt.                       68.3 PPG.

Granted Witt. is holding their OPP. to 53.2 PPG.  I think this style of game will help EC.  If Earlham scores 70 points I have a good feeling Earlham will have a chance at beating the #1 team in the Nation.

Witt. has more depth then Earlham.  6'9 Soph. Nick Welsh who has been coming off the bench as of late for EC will need to step up his game tonight.  EC will need LaRon Henry, Markous Jewett, and  Brandon Miller to have their Typical outings.

I also think EC will need to shoot .45% from downtown and keep Witt. off of the boards which is no easy task.

Witt. over that last four-years is a combined  43-7 at home.   The good news is they have lost 2.33 games at home a year over the last 3 years.  They are 7-0 at home so far this year.  So they need to lose to another team at home other than Wooster... So why not EARLHAM!  

GOOD LUCK EC.  KEEP another NCAC team on the front-page of D3hoops.com.
I can see it now.    
           
HEADLINES:     EARLHAM UPSETS #1 Wittenberg.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2006, 05:25:28 PM
I don't know how to pronounce "Monon."  I do, however, know how to pronounce "I don't care." :)

This went over like a lead balloon on the Top 25 board, so I'll try it again here.  This week's men's poll is the 100th men's poll produced by D3hoops.com.  Congratulations to Pat & co. on this achievement.  Wooster is the only team that has received votes in all 100 of these polls.  That streak greatly outdistances the next-longest streak, 69 by UW-Whitewater.  Wooster has the second-longest active streak of appearances in the top 25, having appeared in 53 consecutive top 25 polls.  Amherst, at 55 weeks, is the longest.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 11, 2006, 08:03:40 PM
Wow... no wonder it's taking so long to get around to compiling that list of all-time No. 1 teams.

A list which I bet David has squirreled away somewhere. We have three seasons' worth in the database and I ran through 1999-2000 myself earlier in the week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2006, 08:19:43 PM
All-time list of #1 teams?  I'm almost there, just have 1999-00 to enter into my database (really just a big spreadsheet.)  I should be done by the end of the game.

Which, by the way, is being led at the half by Wooster by just two points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 11, 2006, 08:20:37 PM
MEN
1999-11-01   UW-Platteville
1999-11-23   UW-Platteville
1999-11-30   UW-Platteville
1999-12-07   UW-Platteville
1999-12-14   UW-Platteville
2000-01-05   Hampden-Sydney
2000-01-11   Hampden-Sydney
2000-01-18   Hampden-Sydney *
2000-01-25   Hampden-Sydney *
2000-02-01   Hampden-Sydney *
2000-02-08   Hampden-Sydney *
2000-02-15   Hampden-Sydney *
2000-02-22   Hampden-Sydney *
2000-02-29   Calvin
2000 Final   Calvin *

Unanimous picks with asterisks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 11, 2006, 08:56:31 PM
Final:  Wooster 102  Allegheny 71

Nice road win for Wooster tonight as they cruised past the Gators in the 2nd Half.  :)  The Scots opened the 2nd Half making 11 of 14 shots and 7 of those were three pointers!  Wooster made 15 three point shots total in tonight's contest.

Wooster had several players in double figure points tonight:

James Cooper 17
Devin Fulk 17 (career high)
Tom Port 16
Tim Vandervaart 16

Wooster is now 13-1, 5-0 NCAC. :)  Next game is Saturday AT Wabash.

GO SCOTS!! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2006, 08:57:36 PM
Wooster wins:

Wooster 102
Allegheny 71

Obviously, all Wooster in the 2nd half.

Thanks, Pat; but I'm adding all the teams and all the votes, not just the #1s, to my database.  Time-consuming, but big big fun!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: augie_superfan on January 11, 2006, 09:16:24 PM
What sort of offense does Wooster run to consistently score near 100 pts?  Obviously, it can't be a Grinnell type offense but is it similiar to what a team like Puget Sound runs?  Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 11, 2006, 09:19:57 PM
We've got a barnburner in Delaware.  Game is tied at 48, just under 6 minutes to play.  Wabash was down six early, then up six at halftime.  OWU came back to tie and it's been back and forth (assist to LG for getting me up to speed). 

Oooh...Chojnacki is cut.  Blood over his right eye...obviously he'll have to sit.  We'll see if he can get back before they get the blood up off the floor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 11, 2006, 09:31:05 PM
Chojnaki checks back in (with a new jersey) at the 2 minute mark...OWU up by two.

Wabash forces a turnover.  Wabash uses most of the shot clock and turns it back over to OWU.  Sounds like turnovers are killing Wabash tonight. 

OWU turns it right back over in their half of the court.  Another Wabash turnover...sigh. 

Down to 25 seconds to play, Medeiros fouls.  Both teams are well under the bonus.  It's going to be foul city here until OWU gets to the line. 

Rybarczyk will go to the line...he's a 62% shooter.  Huge free throws here.  First one is good.  Second is also good.  Wabash is in trouble now. 

Joseph drives to the hoop and misses the layup.  OWU rebounds and Chojnaki gets fouled.  Shot is no good.  Wabash misses their shot.  1.3 seconds left, OWU rebounds.  Wabash's streak will end tonight. 

Final scores is 61-55 for the homestanding Bishops.  Wabash's nine game win streak is over....Wooster comes to town on Saturday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 11, 2006, 09:41:09 PM
Witt-75
Earlham- 57
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 11, 2006, 09:51:07 PM
augie_ superfan:  Wooster runs an up tempo opportunistic offense that tries to capitalize on what the opponent gives them!  :)

Wooster shoots a lot of three pointers if they are open when the Scots run and also when they swing the ball in the halfcourt but they do NOT run the Grinnell system and in some games Wooster will not shoot a lot of three's if easy baskets are available.  Against Emory & Henry (they run a Grinnell system style), Wooster made only one three pointer all night because they kept beating E&H inside for layups.  Wooster still scored 150 points that night!

A big difference with Wooster is that they play tough defense and also try hard to outrebound their opponents.  If Wooster gets a defensive rebound they often run the ball up the floor and go for either a layup (3 on 2 or 2 on 1) OR someone will spot up on the break for a wide open three point shot.  In the half court, Wooster also plays inside/out with Vandervaart kicking the ball out of the post to a shooter for a three pointer.

Wooster has 5 guys that make a lot of three point shots including Tom Port who is built like a NBA two guard (he is 6'5", jumps well and can shoot the three ball even with someone guarding him).  The other four big shooters are Kyle Witucky (4 years starting at point), Devin Fulk (shooting over 55% from three range this year), James Cooper (nailed a big three ball to beat Witt in the last 5 seconds of the game) and Andy Van Horn.

While these 5 guys have made the majority of the three pointers, Wooster has 3-4 other guys off the bench that can also shoot the three pointer.

Average Stats through 14 games:
Wooster is shooting 53% from the floor
Wooster is shooting 43.8% on three point shots
Wooster is outrebounding opponents 43.1 to 37.4 per game
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 11, 2006, 09:52:33 PM
Thanks wally_wabash for that great commentary.  I cud see the action from what you wrote.  I'm sorry your boys lost.  It doesn't even get better for you.  Woo comes to town on Saturday.  Another tough one for your boys!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 11, 2006, 10:31:18 PM
my inquisitive thoughts about tonights witt-earlham game.

first and foremost the NCAC refs for tonight's game and every other game i should add are TERRIBLE-no calls were abundant tonight and when the refs did blow the wh istle it was a missed call as well-i dont know how some fouls got called or not called. brandon miller was taken out of the game by the refs. the refs calling magic fouls on witt in the second half allowed earlham to sneak within 13 but witt pulled away.

the rebounding differential, as always, was the main difference-witt's defensive tenacity and rebounding led them to the win with their low post dominance also present. any other thoughts
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 11, 2006, 10:40:43 PM
Tough loss for Wabash. It was a great game. Lots of back and forth action. OWU made a good run at the end and closed it out. Sounded like it was a great crowd. Hopefully Wabash can put the disappointment behind them and bring it for Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 11, 2006, 11:03:25 PM
Thanks for the recap Pennstghs.

I was just getting back to the board and was wondering how the game went down. I glanced at the box score and it was evident that Witt's front line dominated.

Earlham just hasn't matched up with those guys at all in the last few years. It was good to see that Earlham put some points on the board tonight...they've been stuck around 45 or less the last few games against the Tigers.

It's actually good to hear complaints about officiating from the conference front runners...it reminds me that I'm not just a crazy whiner from a middle-of-the-pack team. I can never get over how physical games are in the NCAC. I just got back from a D-1 game that was really fluidly played and officiated well. But sometimes, there are scrums that just go uncalled in the paint in NCAC action with certain officials.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 11, 2006, 11:31:36 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on January 11, 2006, 11:03:25 PM
I can never get over how physical games are in the NCAC. I just got back from a D-1 game that was really fluidly played and officiated well. But sometimes, there are scrums that just go uncalled in the paint in NCAC action with certain officials.

Billy -

I totally agree, although I have a sneaking suspicion that OAC games are even more physical, based on how some of those teams tend to play when visiting Wooster.

I kind of equate NCAA DI men's officiating to that of boys's high school.  Usually, the rough stuff is kept under control.  DIII men's reffing, though, reminds me of the DI women's game without the hair pulling, where almost anything goes underneath.  Girls's high school games are usually even worse, and the problem there is that most girls don't have the offensive skills to overcome the level of defensive physicality that is allowed.

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2006, 11:39:14 PM
Actually, in Indiana they call the girls game pretty tight.

Tough one for Wabash tonight, but Wooster shouldn't be complacent about coming into Chadwick. The students are back, the joint will be rockin' and the team will want to put a tough road loss behind them.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2006, 11:41:36 PM
Wooster won't be complacent.  Not after trailing most of the first half in Meadville.  Despite running away with the game in the 2nd half, in the postgame radio interview Coach Moore was still hoarse.  They won't be complacent.  That doesn't mean they'll come out of the chute with keen focus, though, which seems to be a problem.  It should be a great game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 12, 2006, 12:13:01 AM
Chadwick is never an easy place to get a win...much to Wooster's credit, they've managed to leave C'ville victorious in every trip they've made to Wabash since Wabash came to the NCAC.  It won't be easy for Wooster Saturday, but they surely know that.  If Wabash turns the ball over 20+ times Saturday, Wooster will turn the trick again. 

Turnovers were critical in tonight's game at OWU.  Wabash turned it over 21 times, OWU just 15 and only 4 times in the decisive second half.  Wabash thrives on D and if they're not turning the other team over, they'll struggle.  Gotta tip your cap to OWU for taking care of the rock in the second stanza. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 12, 2006, 01:37:50 AM
Billy-   I'm not hundred Percent sure if Penn State @ Northwestern really consitutes as a D1 Game?  Someone on here might agree with me.  Did Penn State finally get a ROAD win tonight, for the first time since 2001.  WoW how about those LIONS, they must hold down the Fort.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on January 12, 2006, 09:26:02 AM
Sounds like it was a great game and a great win by the Bishops!  I was extremely happy to see Rybarzyck come up clutch down the stretch.  That is senior leadership at its best.  Making plays when it counts the most.  Hopefullly the Bishops will carry this momentum through the rest of the NCAC.  Go Bishops!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 12, 2006, 09:28:31 AM
In other scores around the NCAC:

Denison bests Oberlin 82-74. Hern goes for 22 and 10 in 37 minutes.  Krantz scores 18 off the bench. The Oberlin gang of seven tied the game at 72 with 3:23 left but Denison then took control.

Tonight is the epic Kenyon / Hiram matchup. Hiram gave a good effort against Wabash. The Terriers could get this one!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 12, 2006, 10:03:46 AM
penn state does suck at basketball, but yes they did pick up a win tonight. they should not be competitive at all this year in the Big Ten in basketball. but if you're using that card i could say that are earlham and half of the NCAC teams even qualified as basketball teams? it goes both ways
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 12, 2006, 10:53:12 AM
No way Wooster is complacent about this Saturday's contest against Wabash.  That would be, what you call "wishful thinking." ;)

Quote from: David Collinge on January 11, 2006, 11:41:36 PM
That doesn't mean they'll come out of the chute with keen focus, though, which seems to be a problem. It should be a great game.

DC, you brought up a good point.  This seems to be a trend with the Scots this year.  It seems that they come out in every game without much purpose, no matter who the opponent is.  They fell behind early to Witt and BW, two of the better teams they have faced.  They also fell behind early to Denison and Allegheny last night.  It would be nice to see the Scots come out with a purpose like they did to start the 2nd half last night.  Maybe part of it has to do with Wooster  getting a team's best efforts so those other teams are riding on pure adrenaline and emotion to keep games close for a half. But adrenaline and emotion can only carry you so far, which could explain why the Scots are able to pull away from teams in the 2nd half.  I'm not citing this as the sole reason as to why Wooster struggles to start games, but this could definately be a partial explaination. 

One thing for sure is I'm sure it's driving Moore and his staff crazy.  It might not bite you to fall behind to some of the lower teams in the league early, but against teams like Wabash and OWU, it just might.  And especially, on the road.  If Wooster comes out flat, like has been their pattern all year, and let the crowd feed Wabash, the Scots could be in for a long day!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 12, 2006, 11:15:49 AM
Go Big Red!!

I am afraid I was not at the game.  Maybe I should stay away more often.

I talked to a fan who said it was obvious that Oberlin was going to stop Hodgkinson at all cost and double and triple teamed him all night.  It seemed to work.  Hodgkinson only had 6 points.

The other guys stepped up and took care of business.  Hern was terrific and the team was 14-23 from 3 point land.  61% from down town will win you a lot of games.

With Denison up by one with 2 minutes to go Spencer missed two free throws.  Could have been a game changer.

A win is a win is a win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on January 12, 2006, 12:15:13 PM
ScotsFan- It's not how you start but how you finish!!! If your biggest complaint right now is coming out of the gates a little slow, take that in stride with the game winning shots from Witucky (Earlham) and Cooper (Witt). Sometimes you have to take the bad with the good and here the good vastly outweighs the bad. AND you still have majority of the season to fix the problem!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MWCSID2005 on January 12, 2006, 12:22:33 PM
The Midwest Conference will webcast four contests with live audio and video free of charge on Friday, January 13.

The matchups feature Grinnell College at Lawrence University and Lake Forest College at Ripon College. The women's contests tip-off at 5:30 p.m. with the men's contests to follow at 7:30 p.m. Links to the webcast are available at www.midwestconference.org and on the athletic websites of each participating institution.

The release linked below gives more information on the webcast, as well as previews for each contest.

http://www.midwestconference.org/wbasketball/WebStreamJan12.pdf
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 12, 2006, 01:07:04 PM
Quote from: jimmychitwood15 on January 12, 2006, 12:15:13 PM
ScotsFan- It's not how you start but how you finish!!!

jimmy, this is very true.  Wooster has been fortunate to be able to finish in all but one of their games this year.  The main point I was getting at points directly to last night's 1st half performance (or lack thereof) by the Scots and this weekend's matchup with Wabash.  In last night's contest with Allegheny, the Gators were actually still up 22-14 eight minutes into the game and were only down 2 at the half.  Wooster was able to utilize their depth and talent in the 2nd half to run away with it.  But, let's take a look at one of those last second wins you mentioned.  Wooster allowed EC to hang around in the 1st half just like they did with the Gators.  Difference is, EC is more talented overall than Allegheny and the more the Quakers hung with Wooster, the more they started to gain confidence. The result was Wooster wasn't  able to put the Quakers away in the 2nd half and needed a last 2nd shot in OT to win. 

I could see this same thing happening on Saturday at Wabash if Wooster doesn't show up from the opening tip.  Only, Wabash is even more talented than EC.  If they dig themselves a hole at Chadwick, they may find it pretty difficult to climb out of. 

Funny thing, after my first post on this subject earlier today, I read the writeup on the game in the Daily Record and here is what Coach Moore thinks about Wooster's failure to always show up at the beginning of each game:
Quote from: Wooster Daily Record quoting Wooster Coach Steve MooreThe Scots' next game is on Saturday at Wabash, where the Little Giants will look to expose Wooster's weakness from the opening tip.

"Tonight was a lesson for our players," Moore said. "We have to be ready at the beginning of the game. If we aren't, it will come back to get us."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 12, 2006, 01:23:19 PM
DF,
I agree that 60% plus from behind the arc will win a lot of games.  Oberlin's strategy was sound - they weren't going to let Hodgkinson carry the load offensively.  I'm happy to see 23 attempts from 3 - previous highs were 19 attempts (Witt, Alfred, Alma), but Denison only hit 3, 6, and 7 respectively.  If the Big Red can get some offensive contributions from the perimeter, they'll gain some confidence and not have to rely so heavily on Hodgkinson.

Go Big Red!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 12, 2006, 03:12:46 PM
I totally agree Central.

If the Big Red can get a consistant inside outside game teams can't pack the paint.  They must respect the other guys on the floor.

That is why Witt, Wooster, Wabash are so good.  They can kill you in sooooo many different ways.

Congrats to OWU.  I would have picked Wabash.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 13, 2006, 03:34:21 AM
So earlier today i was looking at all the regions and all that Jazz... I would say the NCAC is one of the top 5 (posters) in the nations.  Now granted this is just based on the most (pages) not quality of the Post.  I'd say besides (DF) there is a lot of quality Posting in this Conference. 

*by the way DF i'm just kidding about you're lack of quality POST.  Any input is good!   Just giving you a hard time. 

I know a lot of D3 players read this board.  I think the success of D3 sports; come from not just Fans, but Ex-players and family members.  So I highly encourage Fans/Ex-players/and family members to post on this board.  It will benefit everyone in the long-run.  So thank you to everyone that keeps this Board interesting now and in the future. 

So pennstghs-  You don't need to hate on every other team in the conference besides Witt and Wooster, because if i'm not mistaking... in the last 6 years... Wooster and Witt have lost to teams such as, EARLHAM (2), WABASh (3-4), OWU (1), Denison (1), Allegheny (2)...  so let's not act like these teams can't win on any given night... actually if i take Wittenberg out of this i could only put one out  of 5 of these teams up here.. SO THANK YOU WITTENBERG.  So don't act like the TIGERS are all and mighty.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 13, 2006, 12:02:35 PM
Good points EA all around.

Regarding who Witt and Wooster have lost to in the last 6 years, you could say that Wooster has had a lot of close calls. ;)  OWU has given Wooster a couple of close games including the OT game last year.  EC took Wooster to OT this year.  It seems that every game Wooster plays at Chadwick over the last 6 years has been a tight one.  It's funny that Wabash is the only team to beat Wooster other than Witt in conference play over those 6 years, and the did it at Wooster and not at Chadwick.  Wooster can just keep that streak alive as far as I'm concerned this weekend!!! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 13, 2006, 01:56:39 PM
Forgot to mention that it was a nail-biter last night in Hiram as the Lords slew the Terriers (yea, verily did the mangy curs go down to defeat) 68-65 on a last second three by Korey Haddox.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 13, 2006, 04:16:36 PM
Earlhamalum,

I think you are just jelous of my "insight" to the game!! :-)

No offense taken.

Big Red at the Gators.  Could be interesting if the Big Red can bring the outside shooting they showed at Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2006, 02:42:20 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 45  Wabash 37

Wooster had a scoring drought for several minutes in the first half but the Scots are still holding the lead at the half in Crawfordsville.  Witucky hit a three pointer right before the buzzer to end the half!

Wooster being led by Tom Port with 8 points and Devin Fulk with 8 points.  Kyle Medeiros has 7 points for Wabash but he also has 3 fouls.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 14, 2006, 02:43:46 PM
Halftime at Chadwick:

Wooster 45
Wabash 37

Dammit.  Witucky hits a long three pointer at the buzzer.  

Wabash trailed by as many as 11 early on...Port missed a dunk that would have put the Scots up 13 and then momentum turned.  Wabash trimmed the Wooster lead down to one point on a couple of occasions.  Wabash is getting killed with second chance points...if Wabash can do a better job of limiting Wooster to just one shot per possession, they've got a chance.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 14, 2006, 03:03:08 PM
Mederios picks up his fourth foul pretty early here in the second half...this could be huge. 

Port picks up his third foul on the next Wabash possession. 

54-46 Wooster early in the second half. 

Vandervaart gets a dunk to put Wooster up 10, then Port picks up his fourth!  Dueling foul trouble right now at Chadwick. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 14, 2006, 03:10:09 PM
I think Wabash are getting beaten by the Scot's speed?  Is that correct wally_wabash?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 14, 2006, 03:18:17 PM
WooMix,

It sure sounds like Wooster is the quicker team.  It seems that Wooster's guards are beating Wabash guards off the dribble at will.  Maybe it has to do with Wabash defending the perimeter too much.  It seems like Wooster's guards are faking 3's and blowing right by Wabash defenders.

Wooster now leads 74-58!!!

Since Port sat with his 4th, Wooster's lead has expanded.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 14, 2006, 03:20:16 PM
Brandon Johnson nails a three ball.  Timeout Wooster:

Wooster - 77
Wabash - 59

Under 10 to play.  Things looking bleak for the Little Giants!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 14, 2006, 03:22:11 PM
Wooster's speed isn't helping anything.  Johnson has burned Wabash a couple of times...Wabash isn't doing themselves any favors from the free throw line either.  I believe Wabash has missed 10 of their 21 free throw shots so far.  

Wooster takes a timeout as they take their largest lead of the game.  77-59 in favor of the Scots right now.  Wabash is also getting killed on the glass today.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 14, 2006, 03:22:25 PM
With the way the 1st half ended, I thought this was gonna be a competitive game for the Scots but its turning out to be just another one of those.  Looks like its gonna be at least another 20-point margin slaughter?  If not, the Little Giants are lucky.  Do they have an answer for Tim?  I think not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2006, 03:28:11 PM
~6:30 left  Wooster 87  Wabash 65

Lil Giants can't stop Vandervaart and Cooper.  Combined, they have 29 points so far in the 2nd half!  Medeiros just fouled out for Wabash.

Amazing, Port has sat on the bench while Wooster has stretched the lead to 20+ points.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 14, 2006, 03:35:23 PM
I believe Wabash is by far a better team than Allegheny.  Is this one of those nights for the Lil' Giants?  30 points and counting my goodness!  And we didn't even need Tom for that?  Woo is just amazing.  Its good to be a Scot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 14, 2006, 03:35:41 PM
Quote from: WooMix on January 14, 2006, 03:22:25 PM
With the way the 1st half ended, I thought this was gonna be a competitive game for the Scots but its turning out to be just another one of those.  Looks like its gonna be at least another 20-point margin slaughter?  If not, the Little Giants are lucky.  Do they have an answer for Tim?  I think not.
Now it looks like another century game for the nation's 4th highest scoring team!  Looks like Wooster will extend it's team record for century games to 8!  That's about the only drama left in this one.  That and how many times Wabash will be T'd up as they already have 2 Technicals called with just over 5 minutes to go and Wooster up 30!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 14, 2006, 03:38:20 PM
Quote from: WooMix on January 14, 2006, 03:35:23 PM
And we didn't even need Tom for that? .
We didn't need Devin Fulk either who missed most of the 2nd half with some sort of knee injury.  Hopefully nothing serious.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 14, 2006, 03:38:51 PM
I think it's pretty clear that Wooster has superior talent here, especially at the guard positions.  Medeiros fouling out is evidence that Wabash is just a half step slow against the Scots today.  

Wooster has owned the glass and has a huge advantage on field goal attempts thanks to Wabash turnovers and Wooster's offensive rebounding.  Wabash is shooting a good percentage, but they just aren't limiting Wooster's offense to one shot per possession.  

Sometimes against high octane teams things can avalanche, especially when said high octane team isn't missing many shots.  That's what's happening here...not much you can do about this one.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 14, 2006, 03:42:42 PM
Things have gotten completely out of control for Wabash...Petty picks up a technical foul. 

I'll be glad when this one is over...Wabash doesn't often get beat like this.  Even less frequent is Wabash losing composure.  That seems to be happening this afternoon.  What a nightmare. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 14, 2006, 03:43:05 PM
Half-Time

Earlham-       43
OWU-            48

Earlham-
SR.  Brandon Miller  16 points 6 rebounds, 10-14 (FTS)
JR.  Markcous Jewett  10 points

OWU-
SR.  Andy Warnock16 points, 3-4 3pts,
JR.   Ben Chojnacki 9 points 2 rebound
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 14, 2006, 03:43:45 PM
Technical #4 and counting on Wabash.  Can this game end already please???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 14, 2006, 03:44:44 PM
Finally we have a solid Player of the Week in Tim.  What's with Wabash and the technicals wally_wabash?  The game is over already?  What's the point?

Now we got the second string in.  Lets see how this group plays.  Looks like our second string is gonna blemish our neat turnover number in the second half.

Overally, another impressive one!  Tough luck Lil' Giants.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2006, 03:49:03 PM
Final:  Wooster 111  Wabash 76

Wooster rolls easily in the 2nd half to beat the Little Giants on their home floor.  A very nice road win for the Scots!  :)

James Cooper led Wooster with 25 points.  Tim Vandervaart had 24 points, 13 boards and 6 assists as he dominated the paint.  Combined, Cooper and Vandervaart scored 40 points in the 2nd half as Wabash couldn't stop either one of them.

Tom Port only played ~3 minutes in the 2nd half before he fouled out but the rest of the Scots picked him up.  Kyle Witucky chipped in 13 points and Brandon Johnson added 11 points.  Devin Fulk injured his knee and let's hope that it is not a serious issue.

Wooster is now 14-1, 6-0 in the NCAC.  ;D  Next game at Hiram on 1/18.

GO SCOTS!!


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 14, 2006, 03:50:08 PM
No idea.  This is totally uncharacteristic of Wabash.  I don't know if the frustration in the second half has just completely boiled over, if these refs have unbelievably short fuses.  No idea.  We'll have to wait for the smeds report on that.  

What's the point?  The point is that Wabash is still competing.  Would you rather Wabash pack it up and leave after Wooster gets up by 20?  Call the game early?  Gotta play the full 40 minutes.  Why didn't Wooster stop scoring once they got to 100?  They didn't need to score any more.  What's the point?  

Give me a break.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2006, 04:03:53 PM
On the radio postgame show, Coach Doug Cline said that he thought the injury to Devin Fulk was not serious.  His best guess was that Devin's injury was only a "knee bruise".  Let's hope that Coach is correct!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 14, 2006, 04:08:03 PM
Ohh I am sorry if I struck a wrong cord there wally_wabash.  I didn't mean that Wabash shud haved stopped playing/competing.  I was just questioning the technicals.  I'm sure tempers do flare when the plot is lost like in games like this and its perfectly expected but nonetheless recommended.  Another one on the 11th of February.  Seven more games ahead for you before then.  Good luck till then.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 14, 2006, 04:44:28 PM
Tied: Earlham 75
         OWU    75       Earlham has the ball 5.1 seconds left Brandon Miller Foul OUT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 14, 2006, 04:45:33 PM
There were only two technicals, one of them was a joke because all Petty did was count out loud (1-2-3-4-5) on an inbounds play. The other one, I believe, was due to the magic word being said on the Wabash bench.

There really should have been one on Port as well. He was whining and crying after his fifth foul and the ref almost gave one to him (it was deserved with his mocking body language) but the coach got to the ref.

Wooster had 19 offensive rebounds, Wabash had 27 total rebounds.

Wabash hit 19 of 35 from the foul line.

They couldn't stop Vandervaart or Cooper in the second half

Wooster is a flat out better team than IWU, for sure.
.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 14, 2006, 04:46:46 PM
Henry Missed a game winning shot... game going into O.T.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 14, 2006, 04:54:16 PM
The refs were also maddeningly inconsistent. For a while, you needed a severed limb in order to get a foul, then they'd call ticky-tack stuff. Combine that with a second half wipeout and the refs almost let it get out of control. Fortunately, it was substitution time at that stage.

The thing is, the refs were inconsistent for both teams. Michael Woods basically committed defensive pass interference on one play, and no call, and then Wooster also hacked a couple players to bits on rebounds with no whistle. But then they call a hand check on Joseph 20 feet away from the play. Yikes.

Anyway, this Wooster team is amongst the best I've seen.

Wabash now needs to get right and come out strong against Earlham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 14, 2006, 05:11:06 PM
WoW this was the game of the week. 

OWU missed the 2nd free-throw attempt with 9.1 seconds left with a 2 point lead.  Junior Markous JeWett gets the rebound goes the length of the court, drove middle to Collins who kicked it to Senior Tyler Stewart in the corner for THREEE!! as time expiered.  Earlham Wins by 1!  Nice Win EC. 

I'm just wondering if COOPER for WOOSTER had 4 fouls, would the NCAC Ref's call 5 on him with 3 minutes to go in a tight game?  This is twice in a row getting in foul trouble and doesn't get the Respect he deserves. 

But EC played real well together, and other guys stepped up big in O.T.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 14, 2006, 05:54:21 PM
Congrats to the Big Red - they pickup up a W this afternoon at 'Gheny.  81-78 after leading by 16 in the second half according to the Allegheny website.

Way to go Big Red.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 14, 2006, 05:57:55 PM
Interesting game summary of the Wabash/Wooster game on the Wabash website.  Least informative piece I have seen in a while.  No mention of any Woo players.  Interesting reporting I must repeat.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 14, 2006, 06:04:54 PM
Witt crushes Hiram 83-41... ouch.  No write up as of yet.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 14, 2006, 06:12:18 PM
Woomix -

That's the usual kind of writeup on our site. It's for our alumni base, and really, there wasn't much to say about the game. IT seems rather par for the course when I check at other sites around the NCAC. 90% of the commentary, or more, is about their particular school.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 14, 2006, 06:21:55 PM
GO BIG RED!!!
Two road wins in a row!!

Hodgkinson had 23, Hern 21. 

Again we got some good looks from the outside shooters.  That opened things up.

Great win on the road.  The Gators can be tough on their home floor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 14, 2006, 06:32:03 PM
Witt won the battle of the boards by 40 (62-22).  Poor pups.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 14, 2006, 06:34:27 PM
Smeds-

Is Wabash always that loud at home games?  Not a huge venue but it sounded like the place was rocking even when Woo was strating to run away. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on January 14, 2006, 06:38:19 PM
Quote from: blindwatchmaker on January 14, 2006, 06:32:03 PM
Witt won the battle of the boards by 40 (62-22).  Poor pups.



3/4 of the Tigers' rebounds were their own shots.  :'(

Kenyon 89
Oberlin 52
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 14, 2006, 07:41:02 PM
Denison played 8 guys double figure minutes and 7 played 20+.  Also nice to see solid contributions from Shea McMahon and Jordan Krantz with 15 and 11 pts. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 14, 2006, 08:17:40 PM
Not to be negative at all.
But if I am Chris Eberst I would be pissed.

Last game he plays 13 minutes and goes 3 of 3 from down town.

Today, 1 of 2 and only plays 4 minutes in the first half and never gets back in the game.    Excuse me, what does a guy have to do.  I feel bad for Chris.

Instead, Ghiloni plays John Ward who does nothing.   

That is poor bench management.  Period.  Eberst is a very good shot.  PLAY HIM.

Hodgkinson is 9 of 10 in the first half and the second half they never give him the ball.  Again, what do they do at half.  Seems to me that you may want to stick with what is working.  Instead, they do a 180 and go a different direction.  Hodgkinson is 2 of 4 in the second half.   I will say Hodgkinson sat most of the second half but it is just confusing when you sit and watch what this coaching staff does.

Just my opinion everyone.  Don't jump all over me. 

WE WON!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 14, 2006, 08:28:01 PM
Just back from my first-ever trip to Crawfordsville...

First of all, what a great game by the Scots.  They had the usual long stretch in the first half where they couldn't buy a bucket, but besides that they played a phenominal game.  I was surprised that the Scots had such an easy time of things.  I'm guessing that wasn't Wabash's best game, and it was made worse by the outstanding effort that the Scots put forth.  The 2nd half was easily one of the best of the season for the Scots.  Cooper and Vandervaart especially were unstoppable, as Wabash just didn't have an answer for anything that the Scots threw at them.

While the crowd wasn't huge, the acoustics of Chadwick really enhance the crowd noise.  And kudos to the Wabash student section for staying for the whole game - and on their feet cheering.  However, there were also several poor taste comments coming from the same students as Fulk was down on the court.

Things looked bad for Fulk as he was helped off the court putting no wieght at all on his right knee.  He spent most of the 2nd half at the end of the bench by himself several seats away from the rest of the team.  However, with a few minutes left he was walking around with barely a limp, so I'm guessing that he'll be OK, but might take Wed off.  Its unlikely that he'll be needed against Hiram.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 14, 2006, 08:30:33 PM
And I've gotta agree with Smeds - the refs were down to the usual NCAC standards.  Not that the game was called unfairly, but because they were so inconsistent you had no idea what was going to be called and what wasn't.  Not that I'm expecting every call to be correct at this level, but you'd think that they could at least be fairly consistent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 14, 2006, 09:44:49 PM
It's not normally THAT loud - against Kenyon the stats crew won't need headsets. But it can rock and roll even with just 500 people in there.

Against DePauw, Wooster and Witt it gets very loud.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 14, 2006, 10:46:20 PM
For those of you who are interested in the top of the rankings, you may be interested in the following scores from today's action:

Losses in the top 15:
at Elmhurst 72, #5 IWU 64
Trinity (Ct) 88, at #8 Amherst 85 (OT)
at Roanoke 72, #11 Hampden-Sydney 63
at Millikin 59, #12 North Central 58
Virginia Wesleyan 78, at #14 Randolph-Macon 65

Close wins in the top 15:
#4 Albion 74, at Alma 71
#10 Augustana 73, at Carthage 70
#15 WPI 73, at Springfield 67

Blowout wins by #1 Witt, #2 Hope, and #3 Wooster, as well as #6 Lawrence, #9 York (Pa), and #13 B-WC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 14, 2006, 10:56:26 PM
IWU has really hit a rough stretch...

So I'm guessing that the top 4 teams will remain the same in this week's ranking, but the order will be scrambled a bit.  Maybe Witt, Albion, Wooster, Hope?  If everyone holds the course, Feb 4 could be the biggest day recently in DIII hoops non-tournament play.  Wooster at Witt and Albion at Hope!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 14, 2006, 11:11:10 PM
I suspect that Lawrence will go past Hope, and have NO CLUE as to the order of Albion, Witt, and Woo.  Before today I would have predicted that Albion would jump to the top of the pile, but with them narrowly beating a so-so Alma team, while Witt killed (admittedly terrible) Hiram and Woo beat up on very respectable Wabash (IN Crawfordsville), it may be dart-board time. ;D

I'm sure that Albion, Witt, and Woo are the top three (in whatever order).  I'll guess Lawrence 4th and Hope 5th, but it gets real dicey after that.  While I'm not sure IWU deserves to stay as high as 6th, what is the alternative?  They decisively beat Puget Sound head-to-head, Amherst lost again, York looks very good but their schedule is not even half what IWU's has been, Hampden-Sydney lost twice this week and will be praying to even STAY in the poll, new Cinderella North Central lost - perhaps they will fall behind Augustana, but I'm not sure who else.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 14, 2006, 11:13:41 PM
By Feb 4 I think we get the first Great Lakes Regional Poll as well.

I'm sure the top 4 in the Region will be squaring off that day.

Probably #1 Albion, #2 Witt, #3 Woo, #4 Hope

Would it shock anyone if these were the first or second round pairings in the dance?  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 14, 2006, 11:22:11 PM
I'm guessing that the combination of Wooter's big win at Wabash and Albion's close game at Alma, and the fact that Wooster has a 38-point lead on Albion in this week's poll, will keep the Scots north of the Britons in the poll.  My guess would be
1. Witt
2. Woo
3. Albion
4. Lawrence
(fairly big gap)
then in 5-9, in some order
Augustana, Hope, IWU, Puget Sound, York

Quote from: sac on January 14, 2006, 11:13:41 PM
By Feb 4 I think we get the first Great Lakes Regional Poll as well.

I'm sure the top 4 in the Region will be squaring off that day.

Probably #1 Albion, #2 Witt, #3 Woo, #4 Hope

Well, maybe, but if there were a region poll taken today, based on the criteria the NCAA uses, I'm pretty sure that Carnegie Mellon would be #1.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 14, 2006, 11:35:25 PM
This coming week's poll is going to be very interesting.  For the top three teams, I wud agree with DC but I am really not sure about having Lawrence ahead of Hope.  My top five teams are:

1. Witt
2. Woo
3. Albion
4. Hope
5. Lawrence
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2006, 11:35:30 PM
NCAC Standings (thru today's games)

6-0  Wooster (14-1)
5-1  Wittenberg (14-1)
5-1  Ohio Wesleyan (10-5)
4-2  Wabash (10-5)
4-2  Earlham (7-8)
2-4  Denison (6-9)
2-4  Kenyon (5-10)
1-5  Allegheny (5-9)
1-5  Hiram (3-12)
0-6  Oberlin (0-14)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 15, 2006, 02:47:59 AM
Anyone else find it funny that the league standings is a mirror-image of itself?  That is, one team is 6-0, one 0-6, two teams are 5-1, two are 1-5 and so on.  Sorry, just a random observation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 15, 2006, 10:48:21 AM
I realized that the Scots had a good 2nd half yesterday, but I didn're realize how good.  According to The Daily Record this morning, the Scots scored 66 points on 33 posessions!  Not too shabby!

http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles//sports/&file=_sports3.txt&article=1&tD=
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 15, 2006, 10:48:50 AM
Looks like the Earlham VS. Wabash is going to be a BIG game for both teams.  Games like these can come back and bite you when the final NCAC Tourny starts.  Those tie breakers at the end of the season gets a little tricky, for final standings in the NCAC.

It always amazes me in RANKINGS.  I see two teams with the same record.  Looks like Wooster and Wittenberg are both (14-1).  I wonder who the better team is.  *OH WAIT they played eachother already and WOOSTER won.  So to me, that means Wooster is the better team and should be ranked Higher than WIttenberg.  It's true you know it TRUE!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 15, 2006, 11:01:55 AM
Quote from: earlhamalum on January 14, 2006, 05:11:06 PM


I'm just wondering if COOPER for WOOSTER had 4 fouls, would the NCAC Ref's call 5 on him with 3 minutes to go in a tight game?  This is twice in a row getting in foul trouble and doesn't get the Respect he deserves. 


Why wouldn't they???  Besides, it looks like Miller drew his fair share of fouls as well.  From the stats, 16 of his 28 points came from the charity stripe!  Tom Port got rung up for his 3rd and 4th fouls in the 1st 3 minutes of the 2nd half yesterday, and I believe it was still only a 6-8 point game at that point.  I think that is about as rediculous a statement as I have read in here for a while.  What, are the NCAC officials scared to call fouls on Cooper???  That's just silly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 15, 2006, 04:24:21 PM
Earlhamalum -

It all depends on who lost last.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on January 15, 2006, 05:49:01 PM
I agree Smed, even though it will look kind of funny that Witt will be ranked #1 in the poll but in the NCAC standings they are in 2nd. Polls really do not mean anything anyways as we all know, its what is taken care of on the court and personally I would rather not be ranked #1 as a loss at #1 is a guaranteed way to end up on the front page of D3hoops for the wrong reasons!! Congrats to the Scots on an impressive win at Chadwick which is in my opinion probably the toughest place to play in the NCAC with Witt a close second.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on January 15, 2006, 09:12:30 PM
 A noteworthy fact about the poor officiating at Wabash...one of the refs (Scott McLoughlin) just "happened" to be one of the same refs who allowed one of the worst officiating blunders in history to occur last season at Albion. Conspiracy??? Could very well be since he called 4 or maybe all of the 5 fouls on Port, most of which were of the "ticky-tack" variety. : ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 15, 2006, 09:29:10 PM
Quote from: MoneyBallSTL on January 15, 2006, 09:12:30 PM
A noteworthy fact about the poor officiating at Wabash...one of the refs (Scott McLoughlin) just "happened" to be one of the same refs who allowed one of the worst officiating blunders in history to occur last season at Albion.

Oh, boy.  Do we really want to start THAT again?  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 15, 2006, 10:07:58 PM
Port's fouls were definitely NOT ticky tack. He deserved them and should have received a "T" for his actions.

The refs weren't great - they were inconsistent - yet Port's fould were all justified. He's no saint and he proved it Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 15, 2006, 10:08:50 PM
Since we've sort of migrated to the topic of DIII officiating, and I have a question, I'll ask it of those of you who might know:

Do officials sort of "apply" to be college referees, and take some sort of exams before taking the court?

Or, hopefully, are they recruited from the high school ranks, college level "referee scouts" plucking the best officials that they can find and more or less promoting them if they're interested, only taking those that they want?

I'd hope it was the latter, but somehow I doubt it after seeing what we have.

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 15, 2006, 10:18:23 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 15, 2006, 10:07:58 PM
Port's fouls were definitely NOT ticky tack. He deserved them and should have received a "T" for his actions.

I wasn't at the Wooster-Wabash game, and only listened to it on the radio, but to hear it from the admittedly somewhat biased Wooster broadcast, at least two or three of Port's fouls had the announcer wondering.  I'm not saying he's a saint, but I don't think he's a bozo either, and if I'm remembering right a couple of those fouls he received after just re-entering the game when you'd think he'd be playing a little carefully.

And exactly what did he do to deserve a technical?

I've seen JCU players dispute every single call against them even when using their machetes and nobody ever T's them up.

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 15, 2006, 10:32:15 PM
From what I saw, he mouthed off all the way to the bench and gave an overtly dramatic gesture or three as well that definitely was 'showing up' the ref.  The ref was just about ready to blow the whistle when he was intercepted.

I do remember at the time thinking that he was definitely going to get rung up.

If the ref gave Petty a technical for merely counting to five, then Port deserved one. One ref had rabbit ears, for sure, but if you're going to hand out the "T's" be consistent.

Alas, they were not, like they were not all game. Had it not been bench clearing time the last four minutes could have gotten out of hand. I did find it funny that they were calling some minor stuff in the late stages of the game when in the first half at times it seemed you needed assault and battery to get a foul, then on the next trip not much.

I can see getting frustrated about the fouls, because the refs were inconsistent, yet the game was well in hand. The only glory left for Port was personal, since Wooster was well in control of the game. He should have just slunk to the bench to fight another day.

For sure, the refs didn't give up 111 points, either. And if McLaughin was on an NCAA crew he must have gotten high marks somewhere down the road.

;D Hmmmm...maybe I should get into this reffin' bizness...  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 15, 2006, 10:53:38 PM
Smeds, we must have been at different games on Saturday!  Port was a couple feet away from the play when his 5th was called.  (I do think that the shooter was probably fouled by Vandervaart.)  When he was whistled, he did storm off the court, but never said a word to any of the officials, which is the difference between his actions and those of the Wabash bench.  Yes he was mad (because he had done exactly what you said and avoid the foul), and yes he made a couple of gestures, but nothing that I thought worthy of getting rung up.  Clearly we're looking at things from different perspectives, but I didn't see anything out of line.

My biggest question was why was he put back into the game with the Scots having the game in hand?  One look at the end of the bench where Fulk was sitting with a banged-up knee should have been enough for Moore to keep Port on the bench!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 15, 2006, 11:10:03 PM
consistency   that isn't hard to do... refs are consistently BAD... period.  If refs didn't have EGOs like they all do the game of basketball would be a lot better.  I know we are all humans and are not perfect, but CONSISTENTCY is all we should ask for.  If the refs want to be consistently bad, do it for BOTH teams.     
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 16, 2006, 07:09:21 AM
I was at the scorers table. He definitely got the call and he definitely said some words.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on January 16, 2006, 11:34:13 AM
I believe applicants apply to be an NCAA official rather than being promoted for good remarks and/or performance in the high school level but I'm not too sure. And don't get me wrong, not all officials are bad, there's just that handful that have too much pride and/or ego to call a consistent game. These are the ones that we tend to find sometimes in the NCAC, perhaps they think that they should make a statement being an "NCAA" official and that'll help springboard them to the Division 1 Final Four someday, I think that's hardly the case. The bottomline is they should keep their emotions out of the game and not hold grudges for past events, as might have been the case at Wabash. I for one would love to see some of the great high school officials move up in Ohio someday. For instance Jay Carter has done over 20 years of phenomenal work in Ohio high school games.  I'm sure he would be great in some college games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 16, 2006, 11:42:07 AM
the refs in the league seem to try and control the game as much as they can by swaying calls to promote a style of play. For example, by calling ticky tack fouls on the post players such as russ, borchers, brandon miller, tom port-they try to distract from their style of play and almost make it seem as if their job is a little easier because everyone is afraid to make contact.

on the other hand the other night against earlham i saw plenty of non calls against earlham defenders elbowing russ while guarding him with no calls

ONE major point-despite all the bickering by coaches on these refs night after night it is surprising that hardly any technicals have been called. bill brown has been in refs faces quite a bit this year and i am sort of surprised he hasnt been called for one
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WallyFS4 on January 16, 2006, 12:58:22 PM
Wabash got thier a$$'s handed to them.  The key to the game was the turnover we had with around a minute before half when we could of turned it into an 1 point game, and it ballooned to 8.  Cooper is the real deal.  Johnson is a great point guard.  We will have to deal with the 2 for the next 2 years and Johnson for 3.

I heard the reason Copper left Springfield was he wasn't admitted to Witt.  Very hard to believe he would be admitted to CoW and not Witt.  Any truth to this rumor.

Smed

I agree.  He should have been T'd.  He overreacted to every call against him.  As we all know "good" and "offical" can not be used in the same sentence.


WABASH ALWAYS FIGHTS!
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Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 16, 2006, 01:21:54 PM
WallyFS4- Please don't answer that can of worms.  Go back to the post when Witt. and Wooster played... Had about 20 post on that subjects.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 16, 2006, 02:22:38 PM
Well, I'll still disagree with the foul call - but maybe I was looking through my Black and Old Gold colored glasses!!  ;)

And if his comments were such that he may have deserved a 'T', at least he was smart enough not to say them in the refs faces...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WallyFS4 on January 16, 2006, 03:02:55 PM
Earlhamalum,

Sorry to pick at that scab.  First time posting D3hoops.  More into the D3football.  Was very impressed with CoW.  Can't wait to go to the Witt game.  I have only seen a couple Bash games this year CoW and Illinois Weslyan.  As good as Illinois Weslyan looked.  I was more impressed with CoW.  I wish I could see more Bash games, but involved with our local HS team.  Does not give much time to go to Bash games.  As always.

WABASH ALWAYS FIGHTS!
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Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 16, 2006, 03:14:49 PM
Just another Wittenberg fan here trying to get into the mix.

pennstghs, I completely agree with you on Coach Brown.  I thought for sure he was going to get a technical on Saturday against Hiram - he was to the point where Coach Taylor actually had to make him sit back down and get away from the refs.  It was actually quite a humorous sight when I think back on it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 16, 2006, 04:44:35 PM
For the first time in poll history, there are now two NCAC teams atop the D3hoops.com top 25 poll:

1. Wittenberg (15)...610
2. Wooster (3)...592
3. Albion (7)...590
4. Hope...531

Witt consolidates their hold on #1, picking up an additional 7 first-place votes.  Wooster clings to a 2-point edge on Albion, despite Albion having 4 more first-place votes than the Scots.  Great Lakes squads continue to occupy the top 4 positions, 5 of the top 10 (B-WC is #10), and seven of the top 25 (#11 Carnegie Mellon, #25 Ohio Northern.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 16, 2006, 06:43:05 PM
Just an interesting fact.  Tyler Stewart who hit the game winning 3 pointer against OWU on Saturday is the Son of Avis Stewart, who played for Earlham. His brother, Tyler's Uncle is 13th on the all-time scoring list for Earlham.  All Three of them played at Earlham College.. and i think Avis Stewart  played for Earlham when Del Harris was coaching. 

Brandon Miller will need 13 more points to pass Ken Stewart and become 13th on the all-time scoring list for Earlham College.  I also believe he will need to average about 12 PPG to pass Nathan Stoops (8th) all-time. *Stoops missed 9 games his senior year, because he was studing over in Japan.  Brandon Miller also has a chance to crack the top 6 if he can average what he is now.

Also, Markous Jewett is 80 points away from becoming the 23rd player in Earlham's history to Score 1,000 points in his career.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 16, 2006, 08:44:21 PM
It's a darn shame the NCAA won't split up those four. That could be the final four!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 16, 2006, 09:06:46 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on January 16, 2006, 06:43:05 PM
*Stoops missed 9 games his senior year, because he was studing over in Japan.

Now, I'm sure this is a typo.  But on the long shot that it's not, I have to say that I can't disagree with Stoops for taking some time off to pursue his "education" in the far east.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scotty on January 16, 2006, 09:11:12 PM
off the record, can anyone explain why Wooster is so
dominate in baseball and basketball while not in football...is it coaching, tradition, or something else...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 16, 2006, 09:28:24 PM
it could be the same reason wittenberg has been successful in basketball and football and not baseball-every school has its ups and downs.

if i remember right wooster had a very decent year in football last year, so maybe u need a little history check

congrats to witt and wooster for the top 2 spots-now we have to prove our worth with games against wabash and owu the next two weeks-we'll assume denison will be a cakewalk
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 16, 2006, 09:30:40 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 16, 2006, 08:44:21 PM
It's a darn shame the NCAA won't split up those four. That could be the final four!

Actually smed recent history suggests the NCAA will.  Now assuming these 7 GL teams make the tournament........Carnegi-Mellon is far enough East they could be paired against some Mid-Atlantic or East Region schools.

Hope is far enough West that they'll likely have to play and Illinois or Wisconsin school.  Both of Hope's past two appearances in the NCAA drew games against St. Norbert/Carthage and the UW-Oshkosh.  I think Hope will probably be sent that way again.  

Last year Calvin had to beat Aurora and Wheaton to make it to the Sweet 16.

Albion, Witt, Woo and BW are stuck I'm afraid, although I can see Wooster also getting some more  Eastern matchups such as a couple years ago.

With the new first and second round matchups being at one-sight I'm hopeing the NCAA will be more liberal with pairing teams across Regions..........but I'm not counting on it.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 16, 2006, 09:45:14 PM
sac,

For heaven's sake, don't be sending your overload of top teams WEST!  The CCIW alone has 3 teams in the top 13, and the WIAC has, what, four (five?) teams at least receiving votes.  Send 'em all EAST!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 16, 2006, 09:53:17 PM
scotty -- the answer is both great coaching and tradition

Basketball
-Wooster has had 3 coaches who all won over 300 games
-3 coaches were Mose Hole, Al Van Wie and current Coach Steve Moore
-Coach Steve Moore has been at Wooster 18+ years
-13 of the 18 years, Wooster has been in the NCAA tourney
-Moore's record at Woo entering this season 412-99 (win % of 80.6%!)
-Moore is #6 in Total Wins among all active D3 Coaches

Baseball
-Head Coach Tim Pettorini has been at Wooster 24 years
-During that span, 10 conference championships and 15 NCAA tourneys
-In the NCAA's, Wooster has made it to the final 8 team Series 4 times
-Pettorini record at Woo is 761-294-6 for a win % of 72.0%
-Prior to Pettorini, Coach Bob Morgan's record was 209-48-2 (81.1%)
-Ranked #1 nationally this year in the preseason poll!  Go Scots!

Football
-Wooster struggled for a number of years due to poor coaching
-Current Coach Mike Schmitz has turned the program around
-Coach Schmitz in 11 years has a win% of over 70%
-Wooster won the 2004 NCAC championship, made it to 2nd round of NCAA's
-Wooster is now competitive in football but not dominant like basketball and baseball
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 16, 2006, 09:55:47 PM
Wittenberg could conceiveably go south (or south-ish), with teams like Transylvania, Maryville, Mississippi College, the SLIAC champ, and perhaps Hanover and/or Rust (if they get their acts together.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 16, 2006, 09:58:37 PM
Wooster Booster-  No,  Nathan Stoops went of campus to study in Japan 1st semester his Senior Year.  Now he is playing Semi-Pro over there.  Actually one of the same leagues the Brian Evans from Indiana University, just retired from.  

The good news I'll be going to Japan March 17-28 to visit Stoops... I know, i know during the first week of March Madness.   I'll be in JAPAN.  *what will i get myself into over there?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 16, 2006, 10:09:39 PM
Ok, so maybe they will split 'em up. But we shall see, because I think we all learned in football this year you can't count on the NCAA to be sensible.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 16, 2006, 10:32:33 PM
Of course, Smed, if the NCAA had done what you wanted them to the Stagg Bowl matchup might have happened two weeks earlier.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 16, 2006, 11:13:55 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 16, 2006, 09:53:17 PM

Football
-Wooster struggled for a number of years due to poor coaching
-Current Coach Mike Schmitz has turned the program around
-Coach Schmitz in 11 years has a win% of over 70%
-Wooster won the 2004 NCAC championship, made it to 2nd round of NCAA's
-Wooster is now competitive in football but not dominant like basketball and baseball
wsf,

Actually, Jim Barnes was the coach to turn the Wooster football program around.  He took over in '95 and led the Scots to a .500 record after Wooster went 1-9 in '94.  He led Wooster to it's first NCAC championship in football in 1997.  Schmitz took over the reigns in 2000 and led the Scots to their first post-season appearance 2 years ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 16, 2006, 11:22:37 PM
Scotsfan -- good catch about Jim Barnes.  Coach Schmitz has been with the football program 11 years but 5 of those years were as the offensive coordinator under Barnes.  So, Schmitz can only claim 1/2 credit (offense) for the turnaround!  :D

Mea culpa -- is it obvious that I pay more attention to Scots basketball and Scots baseball than the gridiron?  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on January 17, 2006, 08:12:03 AM
Scotty,

At one time, a long long time ago, Wooster was dominate in Football.  But as others have stated, interest in the sport on the part of the administration led to poor coaching appointments.  Recently though, under Jim Barnes, that changed.  Before Barnes came to Woo, Football only had one, maybe two football coaches.  The rest of the staff was made up of other team coaches, such as Pettorini.  I can only imagine the problems that resulted from lack of interest in the recruiting department once football season ended.  I doubt the other team coaches spent much time recruiting football players when they could either be coaching their own sport, or recruiting athletes for their own team.   I have even heard a story of an HS all american (perhaps only all state) D-end who came to Wooster, not to play football, but another sport who's head coach was an assistant for the football team.

Since Barnes, Wooster has a real staff that is dedicated to football, and that can recruit football players in the offseason.

While support for Woo football has grown within the administration, there are still some who feel football holds too much importance on campus.  Case in point, the partial reason for Jim Barnes' departure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 17, 2006, 09:00:42 AM
Huge game tomorrow in Richmond. Can the Little Giants right the ship and beat the pesky Quakers on the road? I say they can, but I'm not betting the farm.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 17, 2006, 09:18:36 AM
DC - I saw that in the poll about 7 teams in the top 11.  I would love to hear from Pat about how that could affect playoff selection, seeding and placement.  It is a controversey every year and not jsut about who gets left out and who goes where but how the seeding is done.

Even if they move 4 of those teams, Wooster, Witt and Albion could all be in the same bracket.  If the season ended today, I would like the to think that NCAA would want WOO, WITT, ALBION and HOPE in the final four. Since they are the four "best teams" but we all know that it will very very different and maybe at best we can expect these teams to eliminate each other for a spot to the VA.  Simply an injustice!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 17, 2006, 09:25:37 AM
And on the issue of Football vs Basketball vs Baseball. All were big at Wooster while I was there and the staffs for Football were thin with "graduate assistants" and other coaches.  You could tell that football was not a primary sport due to the number of kids that left the program because they did not get the attention they thought they needed or the number the migrated to other sports like lacrosse, baseball and even golf while I was there.  As a point of reference, this was during Craig Lombardi, Karl Penn, Brock Jones and Coach Bob Tucker (who is not even mentioned on the Scot Football History) era.
    Athletes were different then, remember that Matt Hiestand was 3 sport athlete at Wooster but did not even mess with the football team and I consider him the greatest athlete in Wooster History.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 17, 2006, 09:44:57 AM
Just wanted to correct something about one of the T's in the Wabash / Wooster game. No 'magic word' was spoken - it was another case of rabbit ears on the ref and not any profanity. Sorry about the allusion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on January 17, 2006, 10:10:37 AM
wooscotsfan, I was going to correct the Barnes thing too, but he beat me to it. From what I understand, COW football was so bad in the years right up until Barnes' arrival that they would get cheers of "put the band in!" because the band figured they couldn't look any worse. By the time Barnes left, that cheer would come out because COW was good enough that they were blowing out the bottom half of the NCAC so they might as well let everyone get some playing time in those games.

Barnes can't compete with the original dominant period of COW football though, under undefeated coach Kinley McMillan who actually beat Ohio St. 64-0. Of course half of his wins came against Denison and his 7-0 record all took place in just a two year career while his players were wearing leather helmets... but impressive nonetheless. Just shows another gap in the athletic programs: the football team has to go back 90+ years to talk about beating OSU while the COW baseball team can claim that just a few years ago. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 17, 2006, 10:35:10 AM
There's a nice article in The Daily Record this morning on the Scots high-scoring offense, currently ranked 5th in DIII in total points (101.5 ppg, behind Grinnell, Redlands, Emory & Henry, and Westminster), and 1st in scoring margin at 22.3 per game.

http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles/sports/&file=_sports1.txt&article=1&tD=


Another semi-interesting (at least to Scot fans) tidbit:  Devin Fulk is ranked 18th nationally in FG percentage at 65.5%.  That's a pretty amazing stat considering that 2/3 of his shots are from behind the arc!  (Note that he dropped to 61.6 % overall since the last NCAA stats were published.)

Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 17, 2006, 10:46:56 AM
How many times do we have to go over this.....

The NCAA doesn't care one whit about who goes to the final four.  They care, especially at the D-III, about putting on the least expensive championship tournament possible.  Of the following: Witt, Wooster, Hope, Albion, IWU....only one can win a national championshp this year (not to say that any of those teams will win the national championship only to say that just one of them can do so in any given year).  Whether Witt has to beat Hope or Albion or Wooster or IWU or B-W or JCU in the sectional or in Salem, it doesn't matter at all to the NCAA.  I think it's best to not delude oneself into thinking that this is the year that the NCAA will toss geography out the window in order to balance the brackets.  They won't.  These teams in the GL and MW regions will all end up in the same sectionals and regionals like they do every year.  It doesn't do anybody any good to gripe about it, because it isn't going to change.  

And also, just because all of these highly ranked teams are going to end up in the same quadrant of the bracket doesn't necessarily mean that the bracket is unfairly balanced.  This year's football bracket is a great example.  People screamed bloody murder when the West Region was announced...it just wasn't fair!  As it turned out, the West region was the least competitive of the four regions and the national champ didn't even come from the West region.  

Make that half-empty glass half-full...be thankful that you're in a region where you've got a good chance to see final four quality hoops without having to trek all the way to Virginia for it.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 17, 2006, 10:47:49 AM
Darkside, I thought the primary reason Barnes left was the opportunity to coach at his alma mater, Augustana.  I'm sure there were other extenuating circumstances that went into his decision, but I thought coaching at Augie was his primary motivating factor for leaving.

WoosterFAN, probably the main reason Bob Tucker isn't mentioned in the Scot Football History is because the Scots weren't very good during the Bob Tucker era.  Their overall record during his tenure was a measly 29-66-1.  That's not so good.

As for why basketball and baseball have a more rich history at Wooster than football, I'd have to agree with wsf, in that it stems back to consistency in coaching.  Like wsf said, Wooster basketball has basically had 3 coaches over it's rich history.  Wooster hit a bit of a lull in the few years in between Moore's arrival and Van Wie's departure.  And in baseball, the Scots have only had 2 different coaches since 1976.  Bob Morgan, who really got the program on the map, was here from '76 to '81.  Tim Pettorini then took over the reigns and has kept Wooster baseball as one of the premier programs in DIII.  Football, on the other hand, has had a fairly consistent coaching carousel for years.  Hopefully, Schmitz can establish himself as one who brought Wooster football to consistent prominence.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 17, 2006, 10:55:36 AM
Looking further into the NCAA Stats, every NCAC team except Allegheny is listed in either the team or individual rankings (natl rankings in parentheses):

Wooster: Scoring Offense (5), Scoring Margin (1), FG % (4), 3-pt FG/gm (10), 3-pt % (7), Rebound Margin (70), W-L % (7), Fulk - FG % (18), Witucky - Assists/gm (74).

Witt: Scoring Defense (11), FG % (64), FG % Defense (3), 3-pt % (39), FT % (12), Rebound Margin (52), W-L % (7), Borchers - FT% (8).

Wabash: Scoring Defense (19), Scoring Margin (27), FG% (94), FG% Defense (7), W-L % (53).

OWU: Scoring Margin (100), 3-pt FG/gm (29), Rebound Margin (87), W-L % (97).

Earlham: FG% (59), 3-pt FG% (21), Henry - FG% (66).

Kenyon: FT% (62)

Hiram: FT% (74)

Denison: Hodgkinson - FG% (44), Hern - Rebounds/gm (69)

Oberlin: Godwin - 3pt FG/gm (35), Godwin - 3pt FG % (51), Spenser - Steals/gm (53)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 17, 2006, 10:56:58 AM
Amazing, Wabash is still 7th in FG percentage defense after getting lit up by Wooster.

Let's hope for more clanging from Earlham and Kenyon!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 17, 2006, 11:15:23 AM
I think those stats are from a week ago.  It will be interesting to see what the game against Wooster does to those figures.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tyrone on January 17, 2006, 12:07:53 PM
Curious--what is the all-time record between Woo/Witt, broken down by games at each place (i.e. Witt is 12-1 vs. Woo at home, while 1-14 vs Woo at Woo)?

Have they ever met at neutral sites, or in non-conference tournaments?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 17, 2006, 12:26:21 PM
After the Wooster debacle, Wabash's FG% defense is up to 38.7% which would rank them somewhere between 20 and 30 this week.  Still not shabby. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 17, 2006, 12:47:30 PM
D'oh! The cold medicine is getting to my brain.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on January 17, 2006, 12:54:12 PM
I could be wrong but I thought I remembered seeing that the tournament was being expanded to 48 teams this year??? If that is so it would make those matchups being discussed occur farther down the bracket although like Wally mentioned geographically either Woo, Witt, Albion, or Hope will have to win against each other in order to get to Salem. Is this the year the field is expanded or am I out in left field??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 17, 2006, 01:08:33 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 17, 2006, 12:47:30 PM
D'oh! The cold medicine is getting to my brain.

You didn't pick that stuff up from Doc Baird did you?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on January 17, 2006, 01:34:13 PM
Re: Wooster-Wittenberg Rivalry

Wooster keeps track of this somewhat, but the latest version I found dates back to January 2003. I've updated from there:

Overall: Wittenberg 47-39
@ Wooster: Wooster 21-20
@Wittenberg: Wittenberg 26-16
@Neutral: Wooster 2-1

The three neutral site games were conference (2x OAC, 1x NCAC) tournament title games.

In the NCAC, Wooster is 4-2 against Wittenberg in conference tournament title games. The schools split two OAC tournament title games in the 1970s.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 17, 2006, 01:55:45 PM
It's 59 teams. There's info in the FAQ or from an Oct. 15 notables story (go to Notables, click on Oct. 15 in the calendar).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 17, 2006, 02:34:35 PM
Well, Massey and Wolfe have calmed down a bit, so it's time to trot out my D-3 power rating amalgamation.

Here's where the NCAC stacks up. There are 394 teams rated:

1. Wittenberg
4. Wooster - Scots' SOS not that great, comparatively (#67)
98. Ohio Wesleyan
104.  Wabash - LG's don't have a great SOS this year (#203)
146. Earlham - meanwhile, Quakers SOS is #32
200. Denison
295. Kenyon
296. Allegheny
359. Hiram
373. Oberlin (yes, Virginia, there may be 20 teams worse than Oberlin)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on January 17, 2006, 02:39:48 PM
Thanks Pat I feel better about my sanity now...Smeds not sure how long it takes you to whip up those numbers but I think it would be interesting to see how Albion and Hope stack up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 17, 2006, 02:50:35 PM
They are 9th and 10th - the power ratings aren't that high on them (relatively) and their SOS is a bit worse than Wooster. But it's still early, yet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on January 17, 2006, 02:57:14 PM
Smeds- is an entire list of power rankings and SOS rating out there? or did you do this on your own? I am curious to check it out...if such a comprehensive list exists....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 17, 2006, 03:11:31 PM
This is my creation, an amalgamation of both Massey and Wolfe with a factor of my own thrown in. I just keep it as a spreadsheet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 17, 2006, 03:12:10 PM
Here are the top 25 DIII schools from the Massey website through games of January 16th.

http://www.masseyratings.com 

Categories, left to right, are: Ranking (among all colleges), Name, W, L, Rating, SOS, SOS Ranking.

163  Lawrence              12   0   1.065   -0.04 ( 791)
207  Wittenberg            14   1   0.923    0.23 ( 659)
221  Wooster               14   1   0.880   -0.15 ( 848)
247  Carnegie Mellon       13   1   0.830   -0.06 ( 801)
263  Hope                  14   1   0.808    0.06 ( 736)
288  Baldwin-Wallace       13   2   0.776    0.30 ( 636)
289  Occidental            11   1   0.771   -0.48 (1025)
313  Albion                13   1   0.727    0.05 ( 740)
316  IL Wesleyan           12   2   0.719    0.53 ( 546)
321  Augustana IL          14   1   0.715    0.01 ( 756)
350  NYU                   12   1   0.655   -0.36 ( 968)
355  N Central IL          12   1   0.649   -0.05 ( 795)
380  Puget Sound           12   2   0.606   -0.02 ( 770)
388  Carroll WI            11   1   0.585   -0.25 ( 903)
391  Mississippi Col       12   1   0.582   -0.38 ( 983)
406  St John Fisher        11   2   0.561   -0.06 ( 800)
407  Coe                   11   2   0.561    0.11 ( 710)
408  WI LaCrosse           13   3   0.560    0.12 ( 702)
427  Bluffton              13   2   0.534   -0.17 ( 860)
436  Hamilton              10   1   0.529   -0.28 ( 924)
437  WI Oshkosh            12   4   0.528    0.32 ( 628)
439  Wartburg              12   2   0.521   -0.09 ( 823)
440  Ohio Northern         11   3   0.518    0.24 ( 653)
443  WI Whitewater         11   3   0.515    0.19 ( 675)
444  Maryville TN          14   2   0.515   -0.11 ( 830)


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 17, 2006, 03:43:04 PM
The one I use is the D-3 rankings only and I use the Massey ratings with MOV enabled.

http://www.mratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&sub=III&mid=1
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on January 17, 2006, 04:06:58 PM
tyrone and Pufin,

Here is a link for Wooster's archive of the Woo-Witt Basketball rivalry.  It is up to date, as of this year, minus this year's game.


http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2005-06/woo-witt_rivalry.pdf
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 17, 2006, 09:32:51 PM
Hey folks, Great Lakes talk coming up on Hoopsville, so now's the time to tune in if you haven't already.

http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 17, 2006, 10:29:48 PM
Wow, that Woo-Witt summary really brings back some memories!  The recent games were great, but the 2 OAC championship games were classics!  I remember the one at Otterbein, when the Scots played a great first half, but went cold in the 2nd.  They went 4-corner with the game tied at about the 10:30 mark in the 2nd half, then threw it away with about 1:30 left.  Witt then played for the last shot and hit it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2006, 10:40:07 PM
The new weekly stats (thru 1/15) are out, and I thought I'd take a look at how the top 4 national teams compare:

Scoring Offense:
4.  Wooster 102.2
76. Hope 77.9
Albion, Wittenberg not in top 100

Scoring Defense:
1.  Wittenberg 52.6
22. Hope 61.3
74. Albion 66.0
Wooster not in top 100

Scoring Margin:
1.  Wooster +23.7
7.  Wittenberg +17.1
8.  Hope +16.7
59. Albion +9.4

FG% offense:
3.  Wooster 53.4
25. Albion 49.7
63. Wittenberg 47.7
Hope not in top 100

FG% defense:
2.  Wittenberg 35.3
24. Hope 39.2
89. Albion 41.9
Wooster not in top 100

3PFG per game:
8.  Wooster 11.2
Albion, Hope, Wittenberg not in top 100

3PFG%:
4.  Wooster 43.9
25. Albion 40.9
43. Wittenberg 39.1
Hope not in top 100

Free Throw Percentage:
13. Wittenberg 75.9
Albion, Hope, Wooster not in top 100 (egad!)  :o

Rebound Margin:
16. Wittenberg +8.9
20. Albion +8.7
39. Wooster +6.5
53. Hope +5.6
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2006, 10:52:27 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 17, 2006, 10:35:10 AM
Another semi-interesting (at least to Scot fans) tidbit:  Devin Fulk is ranked 18th nationally in FG percentage at 65.5%.  That's a pretty amazing stat considering that 2/3 of his shots are from behind the arc!  (Note that he dropped to 61.6 % overall since the last NCAA stats were published.)

"Derek," I think this is a screw-up on the part of the NCAA. They are confusing Devin Fulk and Tim Vandervaart, for some reason.  Vandervaart is shooting at .682 clip (90/132), but those stats show up as Fulk's in the NCAA ranking.  Fulk is actually hitting .616 (53/86), pretty good for a perimeter shooter, but his  approx. 3.5 FGM/game is below the threshold for NCAA ranking (need 5 FGM/g.)  Vandervaart qualifies, and would be ranked 8th nationally if the NCAA could figure out who he is.  (Tim's also ranked 71st nationally in rebounds, at 8.7/game, under his pseudonym.)

Wooster season stats (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/stats.php)
NCAA statistics website (http://web1.ncaa.org/stats/StatsSrv/rankings?sportCode=MBB&rpt=wkly)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 17, 2006, 11:07:30 PM
David - I'm sure that you must be correct (as usual!) about the Vandervaart/Fulk mixup.  I also noticed in your stats post that the Scots are now listed 4th in scoring offense.  However, Redlands was omitted from the NCAA stats and is averaging 119.2 ppg which would put them 2nd behind Grinnell (and move the Scots down to 5th).

The FT% stat also got me wondering what difference that would make in the average game between Witt and Wooster.  Based on a bunch of calculations, I am figuring that if the Scots shot 75.9% from the stripe (instead of 68%) they would score about 2.4 ppg more.  Not too much in an average game, but I'm sure they'd love to have those points come Feb 4 in Springfield...   (or Dec 30 against B-W!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 18, 2006, 12:21:43 AM
You would really have to think that the Scots should be shooting a higher percentage at the line.  Maybe much higher.  Port and Cooper cannot be blamed, shooting .822 and .808 respectively.  But you'd like to see Witucky (.625), Van Horn (.654), and even Johnson (.697) dropping more shots, considering that they're perimeter players.  Especially surprising is Witucky, who I would expect to be around 80% from the stripe.

Vandervaart's .603 is no surprise.  He has more backspin on his free throws than Tiger Woods has on his pitching wedge.  Great for holding a slick green but not for shooting a basketball with consistency. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 12:31:21 AM
The free throw problems certainly caught my eye as well.  If one of these teams makes it to Salem (and it's not Witt), they'd better practice those charity tosses, as they could be critical.  I think this gives Witt a BIG advantage.

A couple of other things stood out for me as well.  Although ranking 16th in the nation in rebound margin is nothing to complain about, I expected better from Witt's big front line.  On the opposite side of that coin, how about 39th nationally for Wooster and their shrimpy lineup?  Just goes to show that technique is at least as important as size.  Wittenberg's FG% defense (35%) is downright scary, as usual.  Overall, I think Albion's numbers are underwhelming, compared to the other three.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on January 18, 2006, 09:38:38 AM
Although Witucky is only shooting around 62% there is no other player I would want at the line if the game is on the line. Throughout his career he has consistently hit the big free throws. Interesting that in past years Wooster has always shown up in FG% defense and this year they are not even in the top 100 I realize a quicker pace would lead to giving up more points in a game but I am a little surprised that they do not appear in the top 100
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2006, 09:56:55 AM
To Wooster's defense, they seem to be improving as the season goes along from the charity stripe.  In their last 4 games they are averaging around 72% from the line.  To me, signs of improvement are more important than the overall percentage for the season.   They started out the season dreadful from the line, so if things continue to progress like the last four games, I think the Scots will be fine.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 18, 2006, 09:59:52 AM
A couple of reasons why Wooster has a better-than-expected rebounding average:

- Wooster shoots a very high percentage...doesn't leave a lot of opportunity for defensive rebounds.  

- Wooster has the E&H game in which the Scots missed about 4 shots all game and E&H missed about 120.  The rebound margin in that game alone was huge.  Wipe out Wooster's games against system teams (E&H, Westminster....games which, by the design of the coaches, are statistical outliers) and Wooster's rebound margin becomes a bit more pedestrian.  Still good, but not top 50 good.  

- Teams like to overplay Wooster's guards.  Maybe they don't like to, but they kind of have to otherwise they'll pick you apart with three pointers.  Because teams have to pay so much attention to Wooster's perimeter players, the inside opens up quite a bit for offensive rebounds for Wooster.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: albionbritfan on January 18, 2006, 10:22:58 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 12:31:21 AM
Overall, I think Albion's numbers are underwhelming, compared to the other three.

DC-
I think Albion's numbers are reflective of their possession-oriented style of play, as indicated by FG defense and rebounding margins.  Albion typically does not run teams out of the gym.  Case in point:  Albion's winning margin against Tri-State was nearly halved when Coach Turner took his starters out of the end of the game and Tri-State jacked a couple of 3s.  The free throw shooting, I agree, is pathetic and has to improve in order to contend.  Alma had a chance to take it to OT against Albion on Saturday for that very reason.

My guess is that, if you looked at last year's numbers, Albion would be ranked similarly, and I think we can agree that Albion had a pretty good team last year.

So does a true correlation exist between and across these statistics and the top programs?  No regression analysis necessary, but I do wonder in each category, who is in the top 10, and what is the teams' records or where do the rank with say Massey (since that gets you a full field of rankings)?  If I get chance I will try to check out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on January 18, 2006, 12:33:03 PM
What a tough week the Bishops have this week.  Going to the number one team in the country on wednesday and going to the number two team in the country on saturday, respectively.  Has any team that anyone can remember at any level ever had to do that?  The interesting point of this is that both teams play styles that are polar opposites this year.  Witt being a team that will pound it down low all day while Wooster wants to get out and run and shoot three's.  It will be interesting to see how the Bishops matchup with both teams.  Personally I think that the Bishops match up better with Wooster because of both teams want and ability to shoot the three.  Good luck to the Bishops I will be there to root you on at both games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 18, 2006, 12:50:21 PM
Wooster also does a good job of blocking out, and their guards have a nose for the long rebounds. Those long rebounds killed Wabash last Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 18, 2006, 01:12:18 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 18, 2006, 12:50:21 PM
Wooster also does a good job of blocking out, and their guards have a nose for the long rebounds. Those long rebounds killed Wabash last Saturday.

I think that Wooster has improved in this area as the season has progressed.  Especially Johnson and Cooper.  I used to love to watch Rodney Mitchell back down into the paint to help on the boards.  5'9" or so and skinny, he still came away with more than his share of rebounds.

By the way, Smedindy, thanks for showing me the easy way on the Massey site.  It had been a while since I'd been there, and I'd completely missed that they had a separate DIII section.

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on January 18, 2006, 01:50:10 PM
Bishopsfan - hang in there, it wll be tough but your boys will make it thru the week.  Think about what Denison went thru earlier this year: Wooster, at Wittenberg and at Akron.  Whew!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 18, 2006, 02:17:36 PM
They don't have a choice about Witt and Wooster, but I can't feel at all sorry for Denison for scheduling Akron.  That embarrassment is completely their own fault. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on January 18, 2006, 02:29:25 PM
I agree Wally, wasn't wort the money they received.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on January 18, 2006, 02:31:46 PM
Wasn't worth the money - sorry.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on January 18, 2006, 03:07:05 PM
The thing that made Rodney Mitchell so good at offensive rebounding was his athleticism. Not only was he quick to the ball but he was quick off the floor and he could jump. Rumor has it he could snatch a quarter off the back iron...pretty impressive for a sub 6 footer. Bishopfan, a few years back if you would have asked me how OWU matched up against Woo and Witt I would have said they matched up better with Witt as they consistently played Witt to the final few possessions but always struggled (as compared to the Witt games) with Woo and Nelson but present day with their ability to fill it from the outside I would agree that they match up well with Woo and it should be a very exciting game from a spectator's point of view as well as a player's.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 18, 2006, 07:56:04 PM
Scots up by 14:  43-29  Cooper is starting to light it up.  just over 6 left in the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 18, 2006, 07:57:18 PM
Anyone else have some scores throughout the NCAC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 18, 2006, 08:00:33 PM
Wabash 29
Earlham 25

less than 3 to go first half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 18, 2006, 08:01:19 PM
Port with his second two hand dunk with a foul to go laong with it.  Port getting up slowly though... have to wait and see.  Wooster up 55 -37.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 18, 2006, 08:02:12 PM
Port walked off and immediately went to see Tom Love...  don't know whats up
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 18, 2006, 08:03:35 PM
Wooster cranking it up 63-39.  Starting to run away with it... on target for another 100+ game
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 18, 2006, 08:07:40 PM
Halftime in Richmond: Earlham up 2 (33-31)

Neil Collins hit a pair of 3's and Tristian Gregory added another as Earlham overcame what was once a 7-point Wabash lead.

Miller playing well for Earlham with 10 or so...but was hit with a technical.

And for the love of God...will someone please tell Earlham's announcer that Wabash is not nationally ranked.

Early in the contest, he said that the Little Giants were No. 3 in the nation and just seconds ago said that Earlham would need to "keep playing solid defense to pull off another win over a nationally ranked opponent" (???)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 18, 2006, 08:08:26 PM
Halftime- Woo 65-Hiram 45.  Woo started off cold, and were down by three with 12+ minutes left in the half and then just went on a run and never looked back.  Som esloppy play right before half and no word yet on Port.  He took a hard foul while going up for a dunk.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 18, 2006, 08:11:59 PM
65-45??

Did Hiram break out the "system" for this one tonight?

Hope Port's ok....he's one of my favorites to watch in the league, plus I've always liked punters for some reason
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 18, 2006, 08:12:25 PM
Trying to listen to two games here and doing a lousy job.

I had the Wittenberg game on and now all I'm hearing is something that's a cross between music and static.  It seems like it's halftime and the announcers just walked away, leaving the mike open.  I'd expect nothing less from Wittenberg.  At any rate, earlier, they were leading OWU 28-18.

That foul on Port in the Wooster game sounded dirty, again.  It's at least the second time that he's been fouled hard by a trailing player while leading the pack and going up for a dunk.  You'd expect that crap in the NBA but not in DIII.

Yep, that's what it was with the Wittenberg announces.  Bush league (no pun intended) at it's worst.  Just walked away from the mike...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 18, 2006, 08:14:50 PM
Wittenberg leads by 14 at the half.  They don't seem inclined to give the actual score.

Finally, 46-32.

Russ, 11.  Borchers 9.

Shires for OWU leads them with 7.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 18, 2006, 08:15:11 PM
Let me say that I am very much impressed by the play of Brandon Johnson.  13 points in the half at Hiram I believe.  He is listed as 6' 1".  How about him blocking the shot of the 6' 5" TC Spencer?  Have heard nothing but great things about this young fella.  Glad we gonna have him for the next three years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 08:15:24 PM
It's 46-32 Witt.

Aside to WooBoo:  that's Captain Hilts.  (And Flying Officer Ives.)  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 18, 2006, 08:20:42 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 08:15:24 PM
Aside to WooBoo: that's Captain Hilts. (And Flying Officer Ives.) :D

Well, I thought that was a given.  Besides, you didn't give Annie's rank in your quote.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 18, 2006, 08:22:19 PM
Just quickly, I don't think announcers walking away from the mic during the half is that big of an issue.

Unfortunately, most NCAC schools don't have the halftime programming that I know exists on Wooster's broadcasts. Similarly, it's often a one man production and ad-libbing throughout the entire 15 minutes.

Finally, I can't tell how many times I've seen announcers have to chase down their own statistics. It's not the easiest gig...especially when there's no studio to kick it back to or no pre-arranged halftime entertainment or interviews.

Meanwhile, Earlham up 4 early in the 2nd half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 18, 2006, 08:23:08 PM
Geeze.  Port not expected to play in the second half, with two sprained wrists!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 18, 2006, 08:23:54 PM
Denison 64  Kenyon 61

GO BIG RED!!

That's five out of the last six!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 18, 2006, 08:31:03 PM
Is that the Denison/Kenyon halftime score?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 18, 2006, 08:47:52 PM
No, that is the final score.  I know we don't score a 100 pts a game but
a win is a win is a win.

How about this:
Hern   38 minutes
Hodgkinson 35 minutes

Gee has Ghiloni started reading my posts??

He played 8 guys in double digit minutes.  AND WON THE GAME!!!  How about that?

GO BIG RED!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 18, 2006, 08:49:31 PM
4:15 to go in Richmond:

Earlham 64,
Wabash 51
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 18, 2006, 08:50:52 PM
Wooster can't hit a thing second half up82-75 with 6:28 to play
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 18, 2006, 08:52:08 PM
scots are only 6 of 23 from teh field second half!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 18, 2006, 08:53:16 PM
Cooper trrying to take control with back to back baskets. Hiram has hit 6 straight from the field.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 18, 2006, 08:55:47 PM
Witt wins by 17,

final score 77 to 60
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 18, 2006, 08:59:25 PM
Wooster by 11
2:35 to go
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 18, 2006, 09:02:30 PM
Hiram only down 7 with 1:30 to go
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 18, 2006, 09:03:53 PM
Final from Richmond....Earlham wins its third straight against Wabash

71-59
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 18, 2006, 09:09:11 PM
Wooster wins 102-91

Pups put up a valiant effort in the second half.  They played Wooster tough last year too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 18, 2006, 09:10:31 PM
The Woo/Hiram ended up being interesting in the second half.  I'm glad the Terriers kept me on my seat.  I had anxious moments here and there.  Overally, great second half display by Hiram.  Congratulations to Hiram for taking it up to Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 18, 2006, 09:21:01 PM
Another Wooster game that I wish I had seen, if only to understand why it played out as it did.  But I refuse to take that trip to Hiram, undoubtedly the most remote location in the U.S. outside of anywhere in Texas.

The importance of Tom Port was made perfectly clear with his absence. Even when not scoring, he's a threat to do so, plus he's such a factor in other areas: rebounding, running the floor, and defensively.

The Scots interior defense really suffered in the second half, which led to them not being able to run, and so on.  It just snowballed.  Port isn't an All-American for nothing.

Steve Moore is saying that Port's right wrist doesn't seem too bad but that the left one is giving him lots of pain.  It'll be x-ray'ed tomorrow.  If Port is out with a broken bone, I'm gonna be really pissed.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 18, 2006, 09:30:02 PM
If Port's wrist is broken things will get awful interesting for Wooster.  All this for a foul that was out of line.  I understand not wanting someone to dunk on your home court etc, but potentially seriuosly injuring someone is uncalled for.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 18, 2006, 09:55:51 PM
Probably not the platform for this but how about them lady Scots?

Wooster Women's Basketball (3-12, 1-6 NCAC)
Kenyon 59, Wooster 30

A complete departure from the men's team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 18, 2006, 09:59:41 PM
Man, that's a tough one for the Little Giants. Can they bounce back against the Lords? The LGs need a lot of support on Saturday.

DenisonFan - It was like I said, in the non-conference games or the Witt and Wooster games, he was spreading the time around so that he knew what he had in the winnable games.

Wooster Booster - I seem to recall Wooster doing just dandy on Saturday sans Mr. Port. Couple other fellas stepped up there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 18, 2006, 10:03:16 PM
Was the foul really out of line, or is that what you just heard or inferred on the radio? Don't accuse someone of dirty play without an eyewitness. Now if someone can corroborate, then that's fine. I just want to be sure we're not here on a witch hunt against Hiram for a dirty play when it wasn't as bad as all that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 10:21:46 PM
Probably it comes from the radio call.  Mike Breckinridge didn't like the foul, and he liked it even less when he saw that Port was hurt.  I think imderekpoe was at the game (certainly his dad was), maybe he or pupfan can corroborate.

WooBoo, I like your taste in films.  Did you know that the real-life model for Dill was Truman Capote, Harper Lee's childhood friend?  Of course you did!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 18, 2006, 10:29:01 PM
Thanks. I hate to see Port get hurt too, but let's not get the torches out quite yet.

One of Hiram's reserve center flys around and can leap pretty well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 18, 2006, 10:47:16 PM
I was not at the game tonight, but I'll see what my dad has to say and pass it along.  Its too much of a trip from here in Columbus for a weeknight game against Hiram.  Although as pointed out earlier, this is the 2nd year in a row that the Terriers have given the Scots all they could handle!  Maybe I'll have to reconsider next year!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 18, 2006, 10:56:18 PM
Port got the ball on a break away and had a clear path to the basket. As Port stop, elavated and slammed the ball through the hoop the Hiram player (Pfouts) flew into him from behind, sending Port to the floor. He must have sprained his wrists bracing his fall. The player had no chance to block the shot, he should have been ejected.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on January 18, 2006, 11:01:06 PM
There you have it.  Light the torches.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on January 18, 2006, 11:03:14 PM
BTW,

For those of you looking for stats, it appears Hiram's computer had a malfunction, so they'll be along shortly I think.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 11:06:24 PM
My internet was wigged out for the whole second half (and beyond...DSL sucks, period >:(); since nobody has brought it up, can I assume that Coach Moore did not address this in his post-game interview?  (I see from WooBoo that he talked about the injury, but the foul itself?)

Most of the rest of the top 8 had nights like Wooster (not including the injury), or worse:
#8 York lost to Catholic in OT
#3 Albion beat K'zoo by 6 at home
#5 Lawrence beat Carroll by 5 (but Carroll is good)
#6 IWU beat Wheaton by 6 in OT at home

Of course, #1 Witt rolled up a big win over a pretty good team; so did #4 Hope.  No word from #7 UPS yet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 18, 2006, 11:08:48 PM
Hmm, an interesting night in the NCAC.

No need to light the torches in Richmond, but I've heard from multiple Earlham sources that there was a similarly hard foul on LaRon Henry's dunk attempt late in the contest.

Fortunately for Henry, he was not injured. No intentional was called on the play, but I was told there were quite a few words between the teams following the foul.

Here are some stats: 4 Quakers in double figures led by Brandon Miller's 22 and 12. Tristian Gregory (13), Neil Collins (10) and Henry (11) were other big scorers.

For Wabash: Zimmer and Woods both had 15.....Woods seemed to get most of his early as Wabash led for most of the first half.


A question for Wabash posters: what has become of Kyle Coffey? No minutes tonight? I thought he was Wabash's best post player a year ago and played mighty well in the NCAC semifinal loss to Witt. Injuries? Emergence of someone I don't know about?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 18, 2006, 11:32:39 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 18, 2006, 08:12:25 PM
Trying to listen to two games here and doing a lousy job.

I had the Wittenberg game on and now all I'm hearing is something that's a cross between music and static.  It seems like it's halftime and the announcers just walked away, leaving the mike open.  I'd expect nothing less from Wittenberg.  At any rate, earlier, they were leading OWU 28-18.

Yep, that's what it was with the Wittenberg announces.  Bush league (no pun intended) at it's worst.  Just walked away from the mike...

Sorry that the Wittenberg broadcast wasn't up to your "standards."  Just like a Wooster supporter to bash anything Wittenberg.  I'd expect nothing less.

The fact is, the Witt men's game was on at the same time the women were, and with the women being away from Springfield, they got the radio billing, and therefore the better set-up.  And with the mic - would you rather have dead air than background noise?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 18, 2006, 11:50:46 PM
Wooster will take a big hit if Tom Port's injury is serious and he misses playing time.  IMO, he is Wooster's best overall player and the stats support that point:

For Wooster, Tom Port is:
#2 in Scoring at 17.3 ppg
#2 in Rebounding at 6.5 rpg
#1 in Free Throw Shooting at 82%
#1 in Total Three Point Shots made with 35
#2 in Total Blocked Shots with 11
#2 in Total Assists (behind Witucky) with 48
also making 43% of his three point shots this season

Most importantly, he is a big time mismatch for other teams trying to guard him.  He posts up smaller players and drives by guys that are as tall as him.

Let's hope that the injury is not serious and just a bad sprain.

On a slightly more positive note, it was good to see Devin Fulk back in action tonight after banging his knee last Saturday vs. Wabash.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 11:58:18 PM
Next five games for Wooster:
vs. OWU  :P
at Kenyon   8)
vs. Earlham  :-\
vs. Allegheny  :)
at Wittenberg   :'(

Get well soon, Tom!   :-*
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on January 19, 2006, 12:14:43 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 11:58:18 PM
Next five games for Wooster:
vs. OWU  :P
at Kenyon   8)
vs. Earlham  :-\
vs. Allegheny  :)
at Wittenberg   :'(

Get well soon, Tom!   :-*

best use of smileys ever!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 19, 2006, 12:20:42 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 11:06:24 PM
...since nobody has brought it up, can I assume that Coach Moore did not address this in his post-game interview? (I see from WooBoo that he talked about the injury, but the foul itself?)

No, Coach Moore made no mention of the foul.  I would have been surprised if he did.

Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 11:06:24 PM
No word from #7 UPS yet.

Brown has a team in DIII and Fedex doesn't?

Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 10:21:46 PM
WooBoo, I like your taste in films. Did you know that the real-life model for Dill was Truman Capote, Harper Lee's childhood friend? Of course you did! ;)

I had no idea that Dill was modeled after Capote.  Now that you mention it, though, I can picture the grownup Dill evolving into old Truman.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 19, 2006, 12:28:20 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on January 18, 2006, 11:32:39 PM
Sorry that the Wittenberg broadcast wasn't up to your "standards."  Just like a Wooster supporter to bash anything Wittenberg.  I'd expect nothing less.

The fact is, the Witt men's game was on at the same time the women were, and with the women being away from Springfield, they got the radio billing, and therefore the better set-up.  And with the mic - would you rather have dead air than background noise?

Considering what was coming over the air during halftime, I'd rather have had dead air.  Geeze, a basketball game is only two hours long.  Maybe Witt should have their announcers do a few wind sprints so they can go the duration.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 19, 2006, 12:57:36 AM
Hey billy_pilgram i didn't know if the Wabash/Earlham game brings back any memories.  If i'm not wrong that game helped you get on the front page of d3hoops.  A few years back there was a player for  wabash named Jeff Espino.  One heck of a story.  He came back from major brain surgery and played his first game against Earlham in the 2002-2003 season.  He hit a pull up jump shot late in the game giving him his first points of his college career.  If i'm not mistake'n that pull-up was on Billy_pilgram!  It is amazing some of the thing you'll remember over the years.

3 players that stick out in my mind for Wabash... J. Estelle, B. Lathom, and Joe DesJean.  It is nice to see Earlham getting the best of WABASH... 3 games in a row. 

Actually in the last 6 years Earlham is 6-5 overall Vs. their in-state rivals.  That speaks volumes for what Coach Justus has Done with Earlham, since he has arrived in 1998.  He took Earlham From Oberlin status to a top 4 NCAC team.  That hands down isn't easy to do.  I give Coach Justus all the respect in the world.  Anyone that follows NCAC basketball knows that before 1998, Earlham was a team that you could walk all over... but since then, Earlham is a team that can beat you on any given night!

Congrats EC.   

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 19, 2006, 01:05:25 AM
Is there an error on the Woo/Hiram stats sheet?  Who is the Calistus Onyiuke guy who supposedly started for Woo today?  I see him on the roster on Woo's basketball homepage but I have never heard his name mentioned in all the games I have listened to this year.  I'm thinking maybe this error, if it indeed is one, got to do with the system failure the stats computers at the Hiram game suffered today?  Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2006, 01:17:41 AM
Maybe that's Tim Vandervaart's new pseudonym, now that I've blown his "Devin Fulk" nom de plume.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 19, 2006, 01:23:52 AM
earlhamalum,

You sure I was guarding him? I don't ever remember playing defense in my life. I've blocked most of those plays where I didn't have the ball in my hands.  ;)

I think that was the game I wore the throwback Reebok Pumps....leading to the greatest exchange between a student section and player in history. Unfortunately, that conversation can't be repeated here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2006, 01:25:46 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 19, 2006, 12:20:42 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 11:06:24 PM
...since nobody has brought it up, can I assume that Coach Moore did not address this in his post-game interview? (I see from WooBoo that he talked about the injury, but the foul itself?)

No, Coach Moore made no mention of the foul.  I would have been surprised if he did.

I suppose that's right.  I wouldn't have been surprised if Mike B. had brought it up, though.

Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 19, 2006, 12:20:42 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 11:06:24 PM
No word from #7 UPS yet.

Brown has a team in DIII and Fedex doesn't?

No FedEx team in D3.  I should know, since I worked there for 15 years.  8) 

As for UPS, this just in:  they didn't play tonight.  D'oh!  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 19, 2006, 02:18:18 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 08:15:24 PM
It's 46-32 Witt.

Aside to WooBoo:  that's Captain Hilts.  (And Flying Officer Ives.)  :D

Are all American officers so ill-mannered?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 19, 2006, 07:03:25 AM
Back in the OAC days - maybe when Balser and Dixon were at Wooster - it seemed as if every game the Scots would get a breakaway and a guard named Lapenta (Ron?, Mike?) would submarine the Scot player as he went up for the layup.  These plays more than once resulted in ejections.  That was the comparison that my dad used to describe the foul committed by Pfouts on Port last night.  Of course, last night they didn't even call an intentional foul on Pfouts (but did call one later in the game.)

In the Daily Record article this morning, Steve Moore does not say that the foul was intentional - just "ill-advised".
http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles//sports/&file=_sports2.txt&article=1&tD=

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2006, 08:36:28 AM
Ok. Glad that's settled.

As for Wabash, the emergence of Stephens and Maloney has caused Coffey's playing time to decrease.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2006, 08:39:22 AM
Oh, I think sometimes that stats program can go crazy-go-nuts and move peoples stats without warning. Geez.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: big red x on January 19, 2006, 08:44:42 AM
I was at the Denison-Kenyon game last night and had a couple of questions.

1. Is Ghiloni always that intense?

2. Can two teams actually score less and make a game more boring?

3. After the game I was talking to a couple of assts. from Denison and is Rodich always that negative. I mean come on man your team just won. But, he was like that at Lakewood, I figured it was because he was head coach. I guess some things never change.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 19, 2006, 09:23:44 AM
Just as Curly was the most indispensable stooge, Tom Port is Wooster's most indispensable player.  Without him, Wooster simply cannot compete on the national stage.  Wittenberg would be well out of reach.  The Scots would join OWU, Earlham, and Wabash in the second echelon of the NCAC.

It's not just Port's ability, but where he fits in on the Wooster roster.  A Witucky, Cooper, Johnson, or Fulk would be sorely missed, but I'd still give Wooster a puncher's chance against a top team without any of them simply because of the depth at the guard position.  Everyone could move up a slot, a pretty darned good Jamie Yoder would get some minutes, and the Scots would still be tough.

But no one on Wooster would be able to fill in for Port.  Vandervaart would be nearly as difficult to replace.  If he were gone, again Wooster would be plain out of luck.

From the Wooster Daily Record:

Pfouts admitted he was too late to block Port's dunk, but he said he was just adhering to a code so many basketball players follow.

"I've always been taught that you don't let someone dunk in your house," he said.

This "Nobody dunks in our house" garbage is really dangerous bull****.  It's time that the country's basketball coaches stepped up and shut this philosophy down.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on January 19, 2006, 09:41:40 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 11:06:24 PM
Of course, #1 Witt rolled up a big win over a pretty good team; so did #4 Hope. 

Correction: Hope rolled up a big win over a pretty ugly team that appears to be having a meltdown. It opened 13-0 with a 45-15 halftime score, and it was only the first half in which there was an effort put forth by either team (or the officials, apparently they had a show to watch at 10:00). Adrian is 0 for the MIAA and looks to be having an ugly year. Only thing to note about Hope last night was that Andy Phillips appears to have the touch on his shot back so if he can maintain that, hopefully Albion-Hope pt.2 looks very different.

Bad news on Port and hopefully no information comes out implicating John Chaney, but it is fortunate that Witt is 5 games off at the moment. Not enough time to heal a major break, but time to recover from possible milder injuries.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2006, 10:08:47 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 19, 2006, 09:23:44 AM

From the Wooster Daily Record:

Pfouts admitted he was too late to block Port's dunk, but he said he was just adhering to a code so many basketball players follow.

"I've always been taught that you don't let someone dunk in your house," he said.

This "Nobody dunks in our house" garbage is really dangerous bull****.  It's time that the country's basketball coaches stepped up and shut this philosophy down.


Quote from: smedindyWas the foul really out of line, or is that what you just heard or inferred on the radio? Don't accuse someone of dirty play without an eyewitness. Now if someone can corroborate, then that's fine. I just want to be sure we're not here on a witch hunt against Hiram for a dirty play when it wasn't as bad as all that.
Hey smeds, I'd say Pfouts' quote constitutes dirty play?!  I agree with Wooster Booster on this.  If this is the attitude being taken by some of the thugs that want to call themselves basketball players, and the refs do nothing more than call a personal foul, this type of thing will go on.  I wasn't at the Wabash game, but it sounded as if Port's missed dunk in that game should have been a foul that wasn't even called.  And then to here that Wabash put a hard foul on Henry last night doesn't surprise me in the least.  These officials need to step up and start dishing out some accountability.  And I'm not talking about intentional or even technical fouls.  I'm talking ejections!  Something's got to give.  Wooster lost arguably their best player last night for who knows how long because of what?!  No one dunks in Hiram's house???  Are you kidding me??!!  I thought this was DIII basketball, not hockey!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 19, 2006, 10:13:33 AM
Agreed WooBoo.  It's one thing to challenge an opponent who is going hard to the basket, but another thing entirely to go after someone when you know you can't get there in time to legitimately contest the shot/dunk.

You see this kind of thing regularly, whether in a pickup game, high school game, etc.  It's surprising that more injuries like this don't occur.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2006, 11:04:55 AM
Calm down, Scots fan. I said I wasn't advocating a rush to judgement, which I think is a reasonable course based on hearsay. Now the facts are in, and the foul probably did cross the line.

I do think there may have been contact on Port's dunk at the Wabash game, but it wasn't a malicious contact at all.

And to draw the line from contact on Port's dunk to the foul on Henry - a bit disingenuous I believe.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 19, 2006, 11:05:47 AM
I was at the Wabash game, and I know that Port (and Moore) were upset that there wasn't a call on his missed dunk, but from what I saw he just missed it.  I didn't think that there was a foul at all - certainly not a flagrant one. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2006, 11:09:22 AM
Oh, and ScotsFan did you miss it when I said "I'm glad that's settled."

Geez....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopsfan1111 on January 19, 2006, 11:16:50 AM
WooBoo, Scotsfan, (and others),
I wholeheartedly agree that the foul was dirty, it is unfortunate that the player who committed the foul will probably never get what he deserves for being so vengeful and purposefully hurting another person. (I say this based on the quote from the player himself, he admitted it, which is outrageous!)  I am one to try to be optimistic though and hopefully it won't result in Port being out for very long...he is a pretty tough guy and if there is any chance he can play (injured or not) I am sure he will be out on the court.

Also, lets not jump the gun here, no one has even reported that Port's wrist is in fact broken and if he will miss any games or how many he will miss.  Also, I would tend to give the rest of the Wooster Scots a little more credit.  Is Port a huge factor for the Fighting Scots? Yes, no one would argue that...but I have a feeling that Wooster would be able to hold their own without him.  You don't get to be as good as Wooster is without being able to adapt and without more than one 'star player'.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 19, 2006, 11:50:33 AM
First of all Hard Fouls are part of the game.  Period.. it is sad that a player got hurt.  Nobody goes after someone and says I hope he gets hurt.  You said he STOPPED.. if i'm running hard to get to someone and he stops.. that gives just a little bit of hope that you might get there to affect the shot.  The object of basketball is not to let someone score (NOT AT ALL COST) but you can't fault someone for effort.  I see to many people at the D1 level get out of the way, because they do not want to be on a (POSTER).

No one could fault me for effort and I know plenty of times I committed hard FOULS.  Out of all teams Wooster brings AGGRESSIVE D to the table night in and night out.  It is outrageous to me that people think this player wanted to  HURT Tom Port.  Like I said it sucks that he is hurt and I hope he get's Well fast and gets back on the court ASAP.  You have split seconds to re-act to a play and i'm sure MOUT, didn't him to score a lay-up either. 

If you watch Basketball on a 1-1 fast-break with two people running the floor HARD, how many times to fouls occur?  A LOT.  It is the nature of the game, and I really don't want to hear people FAULT Mout for his effort, when BUSTING your ASS off two people can get in a bad situation that can make a Foul look real UGLY.     
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scott_leo on January 19, 2006, 11:53:24 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 18, 2006, 08:12:25 PM
Trying to listen to two games here and doing a lousy job.

I had the Wittenberg game on and now all I'm hearing is something that's a cross between music and static.  It seems like it's halftime and the announcers just walked away, leaving the mike open.  I'd expect nothing less from Wittenberg.  At any rate, earlier, they were leading OWU 28-18.

That foul on Port in the Wooster game sounded dirty, again.  It's at least the second time that he's been fouled hard by a trailing player while leading the pack and going up for a dunk.  You'd expect that crap in the NBA but not in DIII.

Yep, that's what it was with the Wittenberg announces.  Bush league (no pun intended) at it's worst.  Just walked away from the mike...

Wooster Booster,

I'll explain the Wittenberg radio situation since it was brought to my attention that you are so concerned. jscwittfan is right about the women's game and the scheduling conflict. The "background noise" was because of a technical issue we were resolving with the studio. Considering we produce ALL men's and women's games (nobody else in the NCAC does both) and often use wireless microphones for halftime/post-game interviews, there is bound to be an issue every once in a while.

To call it "bush league" offends some people that put their time into making the broadcast possible. To imply that we're lazy and just "walked away from the mic" is simply not accurate.

Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 18, 2006, 09:21:01 PM
Another Wooster game that I wish I had seen, if only to understand why it played out as it did.  But I refuse to take that trip to Hiram, undoubtedly the most remote location in the U.S. outside of anywhere in Texas.


However, that statement could be mean someone is lazy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 19, 2006, 12:04:56 PM
EA,
Your points are well made - except that the guy admitted he couldn't get there in time to legitimately contest the dunk.  No one is saying that hard fouls aren't part of the game.  Guys sometimes lose control because they are playing so hard, but there is a line that should never be crossed.  That line is crossed when (in a split second) a defender makes the decision to stop another player from scoring at all cost.

When a guy admits after the fact that he was motivated to stop someone from dunking in his "house," that's dirty.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2006, 12:15:23 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on January 19, 2006, 11:50:33 AM

If you watch Basketball on a 1-1 fast-break with two people running the floor HARD, how many times to fouls occur?  A LOT.  It is the nature of the game, and I really don't want to hear people FAULT Mout for his effort, when BUSTING your ASS off two people can get in a bad situation that can make a Foul look real UGLY.     
It's one thing to foul someone to prevent an easy basket.  But when the player comes out and says that he was abiding by a code to not let anyone dunk in their house, that is completely different.  To me, that doesn't fall into the category of busting your ass off.  It falls into the category of being a thug.  Also, ususally when a HARD foul occurs in an uncontested situation, an intentional foul is called at the very least.  All I'm saying is if the officials let this to continue without at least dishing out intentional fouls or tecnicals, it is only going to get worse.
Quote from: smedindy on January 19, 2006, 11:04:55 AM

I do think there may have been contact on Port's dunk at the Wabash game, but it wasn't a malicious contact at all.

And to draw the line from contact on Port's dunk to the foul on Henry - a bit disingenuous I believe.
Fair enough.  I can accept that.  Like I said, I wasn't there.  Just going by what I heard from Wooster's radio broadcast.  It just irks me that an injury like this occurred when it was very preventable.  And like hoopsfan said, the real shame is that Pfouts didn't really learn anything from all of this except that the next time he is in a similar situation he will probably do the same thing because all it will cost him is a personal foul!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 19, 2006, 12:16:09 PM
When did he Realize he was to LATE?  Obviously after it was over he said he was to late... was that going though his head as he was trying to get to PORT?  I Just think as Port stopped to go up for the Dunk, gave MOUT enough time to (think) he had a chance at stopping the Dunk... and he didn't.  Sounds like he took out his legs.  You could ask Bill_pilgram... if Nathan Stoops, Brandon Miller or Jewett would try to dunk in practice... I can tell you it wasn't going to be on ME!  You know why? Cause that wasn't going to happen if I was playing D on them.  If they were going to try... they were going to be willing to pay the price... Not (dirty) but not on me!  
This is why I don't think he meant to be DIRTY and i think what he siad is taken out of content.  Like i said before.. I hope Port injuries are not bad and he'll be on the court soon!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 19, 2006, 12:17:34 PM
SCOTSFAN-  This is new to me... but i guess baby I'm A THUG.

I love waking up everyday and learning something new.. thanks for the insight ScotsFan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 19, 2006, 12:39:14 PM
earlhamalum -

I can't believe that you're defending this player and the philosophy that nobody dunks on me or in my house no matter what.

Tells me alot about you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 19, 2006, 12:47:56 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 19, 2006, 09:23:44 AM
This "Nobody dunks in our house" garbage is really dangerous bull****.  It's time that the country's basketball coaches stepped up and shut this philosophy down.


Maybe we can get John Chaney to do a PSA.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2006, 12:55:11 PM
I think there's a difference in two people being close to each other on a fast break with a legit chance to stop a break and one person having to catch up and having no chance to stop a break. In the former, yes, hard fouls can occur and it may look ugly. In the latter, it's not called for.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopsfan1111 on January 19, 2006, 12:59:17 PM
Smeds, I agree with you...

Just some food for thought-

EA, as a former player you know for sure that, yes there are hard fouls quite often during fast breaks...however this play seems to be a little different.

The player knew he was "too late" by his own admission.   The fact of the matter is that it shouldn't have been a case of "I was trying to stop him because no one  dunks in our house" it was a case of, "I have already been dunked on"  Port's dunk was down and through the hoop before the foul was committed and his legs were taken out from under him.  Maybe it was a split second decision or an agressive mistake, but as a college athlete you should know better.

If Port truly is out for some time, that is what makes it sad; because like others said it was preventable.  Okay, so maybe he didn't "WANT" to hurt Port, but he sure wasn't trying very hard not to.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on January 19, 2006, 01:31:42 PM
It is pretty bad when a guy comes out in the postgame and basically admits he knew he could not stop it, no one dunks in their house, and that he was frustrated. To me this all translates into intent whether he meant to injure or not no one knows but apparently he knew as he came down the court that if Port dunked he would pay the price. I have to believe that if the hiram player were close enough to contest the shot, Tom would have simply laid the ball in and taken the 3 point play. The games I have seen him dunk have all been pretty much breakaway plays where the chances are slim of someone stopping him. There is a fine line between fouling someone hard to prevent an easy open basket and fouling someone out of frustration of being down by 20. Either way the Scots will find a way to get things taken care of if Port is out, let's just hope that it is a mild sprain that may force him to miss some practice time and maybe just a game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2006, 01:49:09 PM
EA, as Wooster Booster said, I guess you are showing your true colors the more you try and defend a player like Pfouts and the so called "code"?? ???  Just to add another quote taken "out of context," as EA likes to defend, here is some more on what Mr. Pfouts had to say about the incident:

Quote from: Ian Pfouts in the Wooster Daily Record"I went up and tried to block the ball. I know it was late and some of it was frustration. We were down 20 at the time."

I really don't know how you can defend this?  I mean he clearly stated he was LATE and it was partly out of FRUSTRATION.  What part of hustle and busting your ass did I miss in there?!  I think smed's description pretty much summed it up. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 19, 2006, 01:54:08 PM
I would like to read the article in which Mout was " ".  I know that you can take 1 or 2 sentences and totally Skew what he said.  Not saying that is the case.  I never said i'd take out someone legs on purpose.  I can say it has occurred a few times, because I DID give 100%.  I would just like to hear or watch the play and give a NON-BIAS view on the situation!  
By the way WoosterBooster don't ever question me as a person or a player.  A Lot (always two words  :)  
I don't think nobody dunks in my house at all cost is the right philosophy at all.  I am just saying I am going to give 100% to do everything I can (in the RULES) to stop a player from an Easy 2 at home/away/practice/pick-up game. (i can think of many Wooster players that would feel the same way) 

Scotsfan.. please send me or put of the article so i can read it all.  If that is the case then HE SCREWED up!

If it was out of frusteration and down 20 was motiviation then all I needed to do was read the whole article.  Hopefully Mout wasn't playing Dirty all game and this was the icing on the Cake.. the kid made a mistake.. he realized he was to late... (was that after the play or during, you can only assume) starting to sound like DURING, and I agree he has been taught a bad philosophy from Ohio Coaches.. (JK)      

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on January 19, 2006, 02:30:02 PM
EA, http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles//sports/&file=_sports2.txt&article=1&tD=

As a former Wooster player I have no problem with a foul to prevent an easy 2 but from the sounds of this one and the way that it appears to have happened I can honestly say that I would let the dunk go, inbound the ball and come down and try to get it back, at the same time having played for Wooster I wasn't down by 20 too many times
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 19, 2006, 02:53:21 PM
Interesting difference in coverage between the two hard fouls in the NCAC last night.

I see the Daily-Record article that Vanilla24COW provided mentions the foul in the game (as it obviously had impact with Port's injury). Conversely, the Richmond Pal-Item story today had no mention of the hard foul at the end of the Earlham/Wabash game last night.

Now, I know I'm getting my corroboration from multiple Earlham sources; but, it appears the foul was even harder, more flagrant and more dangerous than what I had initially heard on the Teamline broadcast. LaRon Henry was pulled down from behind while already in the air on a dunk attempt. No intentional foul was called on Caleb Lyttle, while Earlham and Wabash players apparently had to be separated.

Now, I will admit that I have not seen either the Lyttle foul on Henry last night or the Lyttle foul on Port's Saturday dunk attempt. Maybe others on this board were at either of those games and can provide better descriptions. But, these oft-criticized officials need to get situations like this under control before players suffer more serious injuries than bruised hips and sprained wrists and well before a brawl erupts because of the (borderline?) dirty play that apparently is being condoned.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 19, 2006, 03:10:10 PM
Why am i not suprised..

"I've always been taught that you don't let someone dunk in your house," he said. "I went up and tried to block the ball. I know it was late and some of it was frustration. We were down 20 at the time. It wasn't intentional, though."
Thanks board for all of the Quote... oh wait you only put in the part that made the Kid look bad!  Still not saying he should of done what he did.

Vanilla24COW- Check you're personal message thingy on here
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 19, 2006, 03:13:36 PM
That will really be a shame if Port is out for any length of time.   I swear some of these coaches look at a thug and say he is 5 fouls and go take someone out.   They have no b-ball skill, they just beat on people.  Refs will not call it because they think they are calling too much.  It is really too bad.

Welcome "big red x".

If I can answer your question....yes Ghiloni is always that intense.  You may get some idea why 4 juniors quit.  How would you like to practice everyday to that?  He makes it NO fun.  And you can see it rubs off on his staff.  I truely believe that.

Again, it seems like he has NO clue who he going to play.  I complained after the Oberlin game that Eberst should be pissed.  So now he goes from 4 minutes to 18 and starting the second half.      ???????????   Ward plays 6 minutes last game, this game nothing. I was told that Ghiloni doesn't announce the starting lineup until the day of the game.  Now tell me one other coach at any level who does that?  They players are totally in the dark.

Anyone who watched the Kansas Mizzu game would have heard the commentator say that Kansas has no continuety in their line up and that is part of their problem.  Believe me Denison is the poster child for that.   Nobody knows their roll on the team.   Maybe Hodgkinson and Hern do.  But after that, it is like Ghiloni is clueless about who to play and when.   You would think one of his 20 assitant coaches would say something but maybe they are just as clueless.  Or they are afraid of Ghiloni just like the team is.

But we won and so what can I say???   We beat the teams we should and get smashed by everyone else.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2006, 03:15:03 PM
Hey Billy - there was no foul on Port by Lyttle in the Wooster game. There was no foul called - and really there was contact but it wasn't bad or flagrant.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopsfan1111 on January 19, 2006, 03:26:02 PM
Well, maybe the quote wasn't posted in whole...but my feeling is that the kid's statement was pretty contradictory...

You know you are late, but you hit him anyway...sounds intentional.  I won't let anyone dunk in my house...sounds intentional. 

I am with Vanilla24COW...hopefully this kid will learn his lesson and realize that he should have let the dunk go, realize he got burned, and realize that instead of worrying about someone dunking in "his house" maybe he should worry about the 20 point deficit that he and his team are facing...

Anyway, lets all hope Port gets well soon...because no matter what team you are a fan of, he is fun to watch...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on January 19, 2006, 03:32:01 PM
Now being around basketball for many years and enduring and seeing many fouls i can tell you the one Port received last night was not one that was so bad that Pfouts should have been kicked out of the game for.  I've heard a lot about how the foul was late and he didn't have a chance to block the shot.....   However if he was that Late and the foul was that bad how come the refs didn't eject him from the game.  Its just a little food for thought for those out there who respect the little scots tradition!  I'm sorry Port went down with an injury, but little scots fans we are taking this just a tad bit over board.  I know that you have championship dreams, but as much as you are focusing on port you have a plethora of players who more than carried the load in his absence.  If this foul had have been on somebody deeper in the bench none of you would have anything to say at all and this would not be an issue.  So as the name states keep fighting little Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 19, 2006, 03:40:19 PM
QuoteHey Billy - there was no foul on Port by Lyttle in the Wooster game. There was no foul called - and really there was contact but it wasn't bad or flagrant.

My mistake.


And welcome back DenisonFan...I thought winning usually cured ails?  ;)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hiramsIve on January 19, 2006, 03:54:51 PM
I couldn't agree more you Lboogz.  Tom Port is an excellent ball player.  The fighting scots should be upset that he is injured at the time.  But what many of the scot fans fail to realize is that people get hurt everyday playing  the game of basketball.  Its the risk you take everytime you step on the court.  I hate dirty play just like everyone else.  But I love it when two teams are battling and giving 100 percent of their effort.  I believe that Tom Port gave 100 percent of his effort when he took the ball to the basket, and I believe Ian Pfouts gave  100 percent of his effort when he tried to stop him.  I weap for Port, I really do, its his senior year and hopefully Port will be able to play the rest of the season, but don't fault him for giving his best effort.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 19, 2006, 03:55:38 PM
Boy, Hiram is showing its class. A current player gets on the board and mocks Wooster's nickname. Real classy. I guess we can at least say that he did see the play, since he is a player. Based on the picture on Hiram's Web site, there may have been about five Hiram fans at the game. It's a good thing that Pfouts protected his house for those five fans.

I love the "it wasn't intentional line." Because he prefaces what he said or did by saying he didn't mean it, it makes it alright.

Based on his comments, it appears Pfouts suffers from immaturity or ignorance, or both. This is not a video game, or that shoe commercial where the Ray Lewis look alike yells out "you must protect this house."

And Billy Pilgrim, it's too late for the refs to do anything for Port, as he has a fractured wrist. Not sure the details of how long he will be out, but I think it is safe to say he will miss a few weeks, maybe more.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2006, 04:00:36 PM
DFan -

Of course you remember those KU teams where Williams went 10, 11, 12 deep, though.

They have no continuity at KU because no one can be counted on to play consistently game after game. That's what happens with young players.

Perhaps practice effort dictates game play at Denison.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 19, 2006, 04:08:02 PM
Smed:  After 16 games you start who played well that week in practice??  Come on?

Billy-P.. We beat Oberlin by 3 and Kenyon by 3.  That doesn't leave me feeling all warm and fuzzy.  Infact, had Spencer made his freethrows we lose.  There isn't a team including Kenyon who hasn't beatin Oberlin by at least 20.  (sorry Oberlin) 

I think Ghiloni is a poor bench coach. MY OPINION!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 19, 2006, 04:39:47 PM
This is what it's come to? Smack from Hiram fans but #1 Wittenberg's fans are silent. ???

I hear a trumpet and some hooves in the distance....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 19, 2006, 05:02:50 PM
I have to give it to you DenisonFan; if nothing else, you are consistent.

After 6 games or 16 games you absolutely start the guys who played hard and smart that week in practice.  Is he supposed to reward poor effort or lack of preparation?

The up side is that the Big Red have won 5 of 6 and three straight.  Here is hoping for another win on Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 19, 2006, 05:28:25 PM
CentralOhio:
Let's take a quick look at Witt and Wooster.  Last time I checked they were #1 and #2 in the NATION.  Now let's look at who starts for them.  OH WHAT A SHOCK.. the same 5 guys each and everygame for the ENTIRE SEASON. 

So those 5 guys must practice like mad week in and week out for that to happen.  OR, do the players know their rolls and accept them and want to WIN as a team.

I don't know??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 19, 2006, 05:58:31 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 19, 2006, 04:39:47 PM
This is what it's come to? Smack from Hiram fans but #1 Wittenberg's fans are silent. ???

I hear a trumpet and some hooves in the distance....

It is a shame, isn't it?  The majority of Wittenberg fans are silent.  There are numerous people, including myself, who try to get them excited, but to no avail.

Just take a look at the game last night against OWU.  1037 is the recorded attendance, according to our game box score, and I would venture to guess that at least 150-200 of those were there for the Bishops.

I have no logical answer as to why this is the case.  Any other Witt fans here (and I know that's few as well) care to offer their opinion?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on January 19, 2006, 06:20:20 PM
Seinfeld if we want to talk on the issue of class let's discuss how class-LESS your surroundings are as pennies were thrown in Wooster after being called the Hiram College little Terriers. I think that its really funny that this is the issue that comes up as you have something bad happen to you. I hope that Port does get better and he is a key part of your team however we've beened mocked a h*ll of a lot more than you have and sometimes you have to know when to let it roll off. I'm sorry i forgot you haven't hit too many holes in the road winning and all. I can say that playing ball at hiram has enlightened me to how crazy the real world can be and how to take the goods as few as they may be with the bads.  Maybe lost between all of the winning being done out there you haven't seen that or realized how much of an a$$hole you and yours can be too! Sometimes it takes a lump in the road to show your true colors and it hurts at times, but just as a fractured wrist it will heal with time.  And for you to attempt to joke about the size of the crowd even further shows how class-Less you are as well (just to mention)  So i can expect when we come to wooster that you will be at the game and cheering your scots on! Hopefully Port will be back and i'll even pray for him, but don't think for one minute that the fans in wooster are in any way more classy than us.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 19, 2006, 06:42:14 PM
I can start to feel the love in here today... "Can't U feel the LOVE TONIGHT"  Hey this is a board where we can all say what we feel.  God love America.. Freedom of Speech or in our case.. Words. 

Hey Hiram I have been down that road... i believe just 2 years ago Earlham was consider THUGS too, little quackers.. all that good jazz.  So don't feel to bad.  You just have to work hard and good things will come to you nice to see you guys make it a game on Saturday!   

I am wondering where the talk of Wabash has gone? and OWU?  Does this board feel like Earlham is a contender this year... or just a pretender?  I do have to say i'm Proud of my team this year.  They seem to be finally playing well as a TEAM.  I believe Earlham controls it's own destiny if they want to finish 3rd this year!  They have played one of the toughest Schedules in the country, which could give them a lot of experience down the road.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2006, 07:22:10 PM
Denison Fan -

There's a big difference between Wooster and Denison.  Denison has a young team and needs to have effort rewarded, whether it be from game 1 or the last game of the year.

Wooster is a veteran team where everyone knows their roles. Denison doesn't have that luxury.

However, Wabash also has tended to reward players who practice hard with starts and playing time. This season is a good example.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2006, 07:36:30 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 19, 2006, 02:18:18 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2006, 08:15:24 PM
It's 46-32 Witt.

Aside to WooBoo:  that's Captain Hilts.  (And Flying Officer Ives.)  :D

Are all American officers so ill-mannered?

'Bout 99%.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 19, 2006, 08:19:43 PM
I'm not going to sink to your level Lboogz15, but what I can gather from your post, you guys, at least somewhere in the back of you mind, were looking for a little payback for some disrespect you have received from Wooster. Seems to go against this whole unintentional, just part of the game stuff.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 19, 2006, 08:29:25 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on January 19, 2006, 05:28:25 PM
Let's take a quick look at Witt and Wooster.  Last time I checked they were #1 and #2 in the NATION.  Now let's look at who starts for them.  OH WHAT A SHOCK.. the same 5 guys each and everygame for the ENTIRE SEASON. 

I want to see Denison continue to improve and ultimately compete with the conference elite, but please don't compare the Big Red to Witt and Woo just yet.  Upperclassmen in established programs set the tone and teach the youngsters how to be successful.  When you're building a program from the bottom up, you have to reward behavior that you want to see repeated.

If Denison had the talent that the number 1 & 2 teams in the nation enjoy, Coach Ghiloni would probably be happy to settle in with a regular rotation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2006, 08:56:19 PM
I finally got a chance to read the Daily Record (online edition) this afternoon, and thought I'd add a little more to the context of the now-famous quote of Ian Pfouts:

Quote from: Joe Vardon, the Wooster Daily Record, 1/18/2006Wooster fans pleaded for Pfouts' ejection or at least an intentional foul to be called, but got neither. They insinuated Pfouts' intent was to undercut Port, which the Hiram freshman denied.

"I wasn't going to hurt the kid," Pfouts said. "I didn't even realize I hit him with my body. I'm not that kind of guy. I'm aggressive, but I'm not dirty." Scots coach Steve Moore actually exchanged words with Terriers boss Tim Rice at halfcourt. While Moore didn't believe the foul to be intentional, he expressed to Rice that he thought the play was ill-advised. "I just think it was a poor choice on that guy's part," Moore said. "I don't think he meant to hurt Tom. He just had no chance to block the shot, therefore it was a dangerous play."

Pfouts admitted he was too late to block Port's dunk, but he said he was just adhering to a code so many basketball players follow.

"I've always been taught that you don't let someone dunk in your house," he said. "I went up and tried to block the ball. I know it was late and some of it was frustration. We were down 20 at the time. It wasn't intentional, though."

In my line of work, we'd say that Pfouts did not have the necessary mens rea for a specific intent crime (such as assault or battery,) and everyone (Moore, the refs, Pfouts) seems to agree on this.  It was an accident.  He may have been negligent, but that's very common in basketball.  You might even go so far as to say he was reckless, but that requires that you discount his statement that he wasn't trying to undercut "the kid."  (That's my favorite part of the whole article.  :)) 

It seems to me that it was an ill-chosen, overly aggressive, perhaps immature thing to do.  But I don't know about "dirty," and I don't think crucifixion is in order.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on January 19, 2006, 08:58:34 PM
There's no level to be stooped to contrary to popular belief Seinfeld.  We all go out to play a game and in that game people get hurt. There is nothing in the back of my mind that would drive me or any of my teammates to deliberately hurt another person in the confines of the game (get it right)  I think its crazy that you insist it was some grudge we hold in the back of our minds! We are in these institutions to learn first and be an athlete second. I understand that you have a strong backing for Port as i do for my boys and i wish the best for him, however i don't think his draft status for this junes NBA draft has been challenged much! Trust me no hard feelings!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 19, 2006, 09:13:57 PM
My problem is more with this rediculous code and the underlying message that players have to protect their turf - you don't allow someone to disrespect you by dunking in "your house."  I hated that attitude when I played and the older I get, the more I hate it.  To be fair I also hated the guys who would step out of a play to avoid getting dunked on.  If you're able to legitimately challenge the shot, then do it.  Fatigue and frustration sometimes lead to bad decisions.  Let's hope that's all Pfouts is guilty of.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 19, 2006, 09:15:55 PM
Basketball used to be a game.  The lessons learned from it, and other sports, were good ones, important ones, lessons that would do one well to follow in other aspects of life.

Somewhere along the line, and it's happened not as a revolution but an evolution, that has changed.  This "sport" that we love is more and more treated as though it's a war.  The lessons that are taught are no longer all good, no longer all based in sportsmanship and respect.  They're now too often the tenets of war.  Win at all cost, defend the homeland, treat the opponent as the enemy.

This has been detrimental to our society as those going through this process emerge as different sorts of people than athletes (and fans) of an earlier generation.  Once a nation has gone down that road, it's an uphill battle to get back to where it was.  

The team in the different colored jerseys isn't the enemy, but just kids of the same age who happen to go to different schools.  They should be treated with respect until and unless their actions cause them to no longer deserve it.

The whole concept of the "hard" foul is bad news.  To me, by definition, giving a hard foul means that the defensive player had no chance to correctly defend the play, either by blocking or stripping the ball, which is what he's supposed to be going after.  Instead, because he's late or way out of position, he decides to throw his body at the shooter, who is often in a precarious position, especially if's he's gone up for a dunk.  The person issueing such a foul rarely gets hurt because he's generally lower to the ground and more prepared for the contact.  When one risks injury to an opponent without the same risk to one's self, I consider that a cowardly act.

Aside to DC:

Got you on this one, huh?  Think Paul Newman movies...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 19, 2006, 09:16:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2006, 08:56:19 PMIn my line of work, we'd say that Pfouts did not have the necessary mens rea for a specific intent crime (such as assault or battery,) and everyone (Moore, the refs, Pfouts) seems to agree on this.

I went out with this chick in law school and she gave me a scorching case of the mens rea. But at least it wasn't the per stirpes.

Seriously, DC, you need a study break.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2006, 09:31:11 PM
If the real objection is with Pfouts' "no dunking in our house" credo, then I suggest that Pfouts may not be the right target of your venom.  Perhaps Coach Moore had the right one (please reread article clip), or maybe it's his high school coach that's to blame.  Remember, Pfouts did say
Quote from: Ian Pfouts, emphasis added"I've always been taught that you don't let someone dunk in your house[.]"

Although I still advocate a course of moving on.

LG, I need no more study breaks when I come back from the bar prep class to find THREE new pages of discussion in here (and FOUR in CCIW Chat) in about 16 hours!  I just hope "small college hoops" is tested on the bar, since that's where most of my study time goes.  ;)

WB, oh come on, that's a Patricia Neal movie!  Or as we used to say, PaTREEEEEsha NEEEEEEal!  :D  Great line from Melvyn Douglas, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2006, 09:36:27 PM
I'm very sorry to see Seinfeld's post (1/19, 3:55 pm) that Tom Port has a fractured wrist.  >:( :(

hoopsfan1111 quote:
"I have a feeling that Wooster would be able to hold their own without him (Port)."

lboogz15 quote:
"You (Wooster) have a plethora of players who more than carried the load in his (Port's) absence."

Sorry guys, but the stats don't lie so I will post them again and maybe this time you will actually read them!

For Wooster, Tom Port is:
#2 in Scoring at 17.3 ppg
#2 in Rebounding at 6.5 rpg
#1 in Free Throw Shooting at 82%
#1 in Total Three Point Shots made with 35
#2 in Total Blocked Shots with 11
#2 in Total Assists (behind Witucky) with 48
also making 43% of his three point shots this season

Most importantly, he is a big time mismatch for other teams trying to guard him.  He posts up smaller players and drives by guys that are as tall as him.

The difficulty of defending Port was apparent earlier this year in the Witt game at Timken.  The Tigers tried to defend Port with several players, including 6'9" Dan Russ and they were unsuccessful (Port was too quick and drove by Russ and he posted up/jumped over smaller defenders).   YOU DON"T REPLACE THIS ABILITY OR THE STATS LISTED ABOVE WITH SOMEONE ELSE.  How many 6'5" guys with good vertical jumps shoot 43% from 3 point land....in D3 basketball??

The Scots will take a big hit the rest of this season if Port can't get back on the floor.  Basically, Wooster can kiss goodbye any shot of going deep into the NCAA tourney without Port and it will take an incredible effort from the rest of the Scots to have a shot at winning the NCAC (regular season or post season tourney) this year.

From all the facts presented, it is pretty clear that Pfouts should have received an intentional foul (dunk already completed, no chance to block the shot, knocking Port off his feet from behind) and perhaps, he should have received an ejection.  Officials need to call intentionals and ejections so players don't continue to commit hard fouls in future games when it is too late to contest a shot.

It is probably a longshot but let's hope that somehow Port can play later this season with a light brace/wrap on his left wrist.  He does shoot with his right hand.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 19, 2006, 09:50:17 PM
Wooster Booster,

EXCELLENT post.  To the earlier poster (the board has scrolled so fast I can't even find who anymore!) who said they would expecct such a foul in the NBA but not d3 - for the near future you may be wrong.  This sounds VERY reminiscent of the 'Malice at the Palace' - Ron Artest did a ridiculously unnecessarily hard foul on Ben Wallace when the Pacers were already hopelessly out of it, risking serious injury.  Admittedly the circumstances then diverge: Ben was not injured,  took serious exception to the foul, but probably still nothing serious would have happened if some idiot fan hadn't thrown a beer at Artest, who went into the stands and mugged the WRONG fan, etc..

But I think 'hard fouls' (what a euphemism!) are not likely to occur very often during blow-outs for a while in the NBA!

David, your legal analysis is no doubt correct (I'll support you whatever the California bar says! ;), but Pfout is not charged with a crime.  IF the majority retelling on the board (and Pfout's own words) are to be believed, I think he did commit an action deserving of a suspension.  (That hockey player, whose name I refuse to remember, but whose mugging ended a competitor's career, deserved prison time; Pfout is NOT a criminal, but he should be suspended if the accounts are reasonably accurate.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 19, 2006, 09:51:19 PM
woosterbooster--- are you talk'n about COOL HAND LUKE?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2006, 09:53:52 PM
You know, there's some old fogeyisms creeping up here.

By all accounts, some games in the 60's and 70's and before were just as rough, or even rougher, than they are now.

Does anyone not recall the infamous Minnesota / Ohio State game which really started to expose the violence hidden in basketball?? Luke Witte basically had his NBA career ruined by some senseless thuggery.

And if you recall the ABA of the 60's - Cliff Hagan (an old school NBA / ABA players) used to fight on a daily basis. Fights happened all the time with tough guys like John Brisker. That stuff happened in the college game too. Not daily but it happened once in a while. Hard fouls, too. They weren't gentlemen under the glass.

Heck, I recall in 1985 where little Houston Mills of Wabash got into a brawl with big bad Fred Amos of Washington of St. Louis - all in the name of 'protecting turf'.

So this concept isn't new - and actually its rarer now than it has been because the NCAA has proper penalties for altercations and fisticuffs and leaving the bench.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 19, 2006, 10:09:36 PM
QuoteRon Artest did a ridiculously unnecessarily hard foul on Ben Wallace when the Pacers were already hopelessly out of it, risking serious injury


Just for the record, it was actually the Pistons who were hopelessly out of the game. Pacers were up by 15 or so with just a minute to go and Rick Carlisle shouldn't have had Artest, O'Neal, et al. still in the game at that point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 19, 2006, 10:19:36 PM
The advent of the 3pt shot way back 20 years now made the college game less physical.  Keeping more players on the perimeter.  Smedindy is correct the game is no less physical than it was a couple decades ago.

The shorts are longer and the players are more physically developed but they aren't more physical.

The art of posting up is almost completely gone from the D1 game.  Everything comes off motion now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 19, 2006, 10:22:35 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 19, 2006, 09:50:17 PMThat hockey player, whose name I refuse to remember, but whose mugging ended a competitor's career, deserved prison time

I'm going to assume you're talking about Vancouver All-Star forward Todd Bertuzzi, who quite literally broke Colorado rookie forward Steve Moore's neck in 2004.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 19, 2006, 11:02:50 PM
earlhamalum -

No, Hud.  A really good old black and white flick with Patricia Neal (and some nobody named Paul Newman).

Smedindy -

Sounds like you've read Terry Pluto's great book, Loose Balls.  Funniest sports book of all-time.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 19, 2006, 11:12:33 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on January 19, 2006, 10:09:36 PM
QuoteRon Artest did a ridiculously unnecessarily hard foul on Ben Wallace when the Pacers were already hopelessly out of it, risking serious injury


Just for the record, it was actually the Pistons who were hopelessly out of the game. Pacers were up by 15 or so with just a minute to go and Rick Carlisle shouldn't have had Artest, O'Neal, et al. still in the game at that point.

You're right - I knew it was 'garbage time', but mis-remembered which way.  In one sense, that's even worse.  If the losing players get frustrated and do that, I have a LITTLE sympathy, but for a winning player to do that...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 19, 2006, 11:14:32 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 19, 2006, 10:22:35 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 19, 2006, 09:50:17 PMThat hockey player, whose name I refuse to remember, but whose mugging ended a competitor's career, deserved prison time

I'm going to assume you're talking about Vancouver All-Star forward Todd Bertuzzi, who quite literally broke Colorado rookie forward Steve Moore's neck in 2004.

Thanks a lot about Bertuzzi - I told you I don't WANT to remember the thug's name! :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 19, 2006, 11:27:01 PM
Smed,

I never said things were getting worse; unfortunately they don't seem to be getting any better either.

I well-remember the Witte mugging - I saw it live and on MANY replays.  For viciousness in bball, it may rank second only to when Kermit Washington VERY nearly killed Rudy Tomjanovich (he was given last rites, but eventually recovered and coached the Rockets to 2 NBA titles). 

Despite your 'old-fogeyism' crack (that would rather inevitably include me!), I like you, and have no clue why your karma is so low.  Allow me to restore a bit of it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2006, 11:38:29 PM
Quote from: Lboogz15 on January 19, 2006, 08:58:34 PM
I understand that you have a strong backing for Port as i do for my boys and i wish the best for him, however i don't think his draft status for this junes NBA draft has been challenged much! Trust me no hard feelings!
I don't think anyone is concerned about Port's status for the NBA draft in June geinus!  What has been challenged is Wooster's standing as a legitimate contender to get to Salem in March!

Quote from: Lboogz15 on January 19, 2006, 03:32:01 PM
Now being around basketball for many years and enduring and seeing many fouls i can tell you the one Port received last night was not one that was so bad that Pfouts should have been kicked out of the game for.  I've heard a lot about how the foul was late and he didn't have a chance to block the shot.....   However if he was that Late and the foul was that bad how come the refs didn't eject him from the game.  Its just a little food for thought for those out there who respect the little scots tradition!  
It's funny, many, including Coach Moore werre wondering why the officials didn't act differently as well??  Did you not catch the qoutes from your teammate himself??  He was late and acting in frustration of being down by 20 and he was "taught" to never let anyone dunk in his house, but, at least the foul was not intentional?!  Whatever makes you sleep better at night I guess? ::) ???  Maybe, if it truly wasn't intentional, Pfouts should have left out those other tidbits prior to him saying it wasn't intentional. :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 19, 2006, 11:41:29 PM
as for you quoting and assuming witt fans are silent, that could be for a good reason. you guys were bashing anyone who was assuming things about the foul and game that wasnt in attendance at the game or didnt know the "context" of the quotes in the newspaper. unfortunately things like this do happen, like russ spraining an ankle every once in a while. good teams adapt and hopefully wooster will adapt-it does make our matchup a little more tipped in our favor.

as for witt fán's participation. i resent that because i do keep up to date heavily, but i will agree. the games at the HPERC minus wooster are almost silent half the time with hardly any student participation. i guess they're all worried about their gay halo or something. when the games matter though the fans come out so i dont know.

hopefully witt doenst let up this weekend against allegheny- a dangerous place for our team because we hate playing there. bad vibes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 19, 2006, 11:43:23 PM
I called The Wooster Daily Record's sports desk earlier to ask if they had an information about Port's injury.  They said he has a fractured wrist and will be out for two to three weeks.  That sounds very optimistic to me, but I hope they're right.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2006, 11:48:18 PM
I'm not orthopaedist, but I'd guess that for a non-shooting hand, all you need was the injury beginning to heal, plus a cast that can keep it stable without being a weapon.  He might not be able to do too much with his left (so no two-handed dunks, probably on balance a good thing :D),  so how effective he'll be is a question.  But if there's any way he can get into the Witt game on 2/4, rest assured he'll do it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopsfan1111 on January 19, 2006, 11:48:56 PM
WooScotsFan-

I agree with you that Wooster will take a huge hit without Port, I never said I disagreed with that.  I don't think I ever disagreed with the fact that you can't replace him. I disagree with the fact that you think the Scots' season is practically over if he can't play...

Each and every year Wooster losses a player to graduation who was the MVP of the team...Trimmer, Cline, Paris, Fernandez, Gorman, Ellenwood, Nelson, the list goes on and on...all I was stating earlier was that the Scots are good because they are able to adapt to these losses and come back just as strong as ever.  I think with the talent Wooster has they are capable of doing just the same mid season.  I stand by my statement that Wooster would be able to hold their own without Tom.

Listen, we are supporters of the same team, and I am sure we are both quite anxious to see how the team will do without him.  Let's just have some faith and wait and see how the team pulls together before we say that they have no chance of going anywhere without him.  

Hopefully, Tom's fracture is small, won't take long to heal and he will be back before we know it.  I like to be optimistic...and...

Believe me, I DO read the stats,

But lets not count our Fighting Scots out just yet...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2006, 12:39:20 AM
hoopsfan1111 - "you think that the Scots' season is practically over if he can't play"

I didn't say that.  Those are your words, not mine!

I said that Wooster will not go deep into the NCAA tourney IF Port can't play.  That's a very reasonable statement and I notice that ScotsFan has the same perspective (his post about Woo's chances to reach Salem, VA).  I also said that it will take an incredible effort from the rest of the team to win the NCAC title/tourney if Port misses the rest of this season's games.  Let's wait and see if the rest of the team can rise to that challenge!  :)

...and let's hope that the prognosis outlined by Wooster Booster with Port perhaps able to play in 2-3 weeks is correct.  If Port is back in ~3 weeks, then Wooster may be able to win the conference title/tourney and then make a run in the NCAA's.  :)

Good luck to Tom for a speedy recovery!

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2006, 12:47:37 AM
The last -- and only -- time that Wooster has made it to Salem, their best player was playing on a severely sprained ankle.  He was mighty good, too, better than Tom Port, I think most would agree.  A fellah called Bryan Nelson.

Losing a player as good and valuable as Port is a handicap for any team, of course.  But Wooster has a deep and talented bench, a great coach, and a solid gameplan.  The parts aren't entirely interchangeable, but they're closer than the vast majority of D3 teams.  Even if Port won't be playing at anything like full speed for weeks, I have confidence that Coach Moore and the Scots will find a way around the problem and continue to play at the highest levels.

The only thing that worries me is that this makes a height problem that much worse.  Dan Russ could be looking at 40+ on Feb. 4.  I just hope the gunners (including Fulk, who'll see a lot more time, and Van Horn, who'll get a lot more looks) are up to the challenge.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 20, 2006, 12:53:48 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 19, 2006, 11:41:29 PM
as for you quoting and assuming witt fans are silent, that could be for a good reason. you guys were bashing anyone who was assuming things about the foul and game that wasnt in attendance at the game or didnt know the "context" of the quotes in the newspaper. unfortunately things like this do happen, like russ spraining an ankle every once in a while. good teams adapt and hopefully wooster will adapt-it does make our matchup a little more tipped in our favor.

as for witt fán's participation. i resent that because i do keep up to date heavily, but i will agree. the games at the HPERC minus wooster are almost silent half the time with hardly any student participation. i guess they're all worried about their gay halo or something. when the games matter though the fans come out so i dont know.

hopefully witt doenst let up this weekend against allegheny- a dangerous place for our team because we hate playing there. bad vibes.

If your comment on fan participation was based on what I said, believe me - I know that there are many people who do come out and support Witt heavily and on a consistent basis.  And if you are one of those people, you should be commended.  However, I don't think calling students' other interests 'gay' is going to encourage any additional students to come out to a game.

However, I completely agree with you about the silence on this board.  I've responded to a few of the Witt-related posts in the past few days, but I'm not going to get involved in things that I have only a slight idea about, or restate things that others have already said numerous times.

If Witt plays like they did Wednesday night against OWU, the Gators should not be a problem.  But, let us not forget that this IS their first road game as the number one team, and that's something that cannot be overlooked as well.  It should make for an interesting game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 20, 2006, 06:51:53 AM
I'm not so quick to write off the Scots against Witt (or anyone else.)  There's no doubt that Port is an excellent player and will be sorely missed, but I think they'll adjust pretty well.  And I won't argue that without Tom, their odds of winning the NCAC or going to Salem decrease somewhat. 

What this does do is to give Marty Bidwell a chance to step up and show what he can contribute to this team.  My guess is that Bidwell's minutes will increase significantly, and that we'll see more of Van Horn and Fulk in the game together, or maybe even Cooper, Witucky, and Johnson all in at once.  I would hate to be the team trying to guard those 3 at the same time!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 20, 2006, 07:06:13 AM
Here's the link to this morning's article in the Daily Record:
http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles//sports/&file=friportupdate.txt&article=1&tD=

Looks like we'll find out more over the next couple of days and some more tests are run, but the article reports that he'll be out "at least two-to-three weeks."  It would be great if he could be back for the Witt game, but it sounds unlikely.  I would be more optomistic that he could return for maybe the last game or two of the regular season, then be available for the NCAC and NCAA tournaments. 

It sounds like Evan Will will start, which I find interesting as he has been the one that's been in when Vandervaart's resting.  I guess that means that Jeff Stevens will also need to significantly pick up his game - and I do mean significantly!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 20, 2006, 09:08:16 AM
Ypsi -

Old fogeyism is a phrase I use in baseball discussions all the time when people lapse into the "the players today only are in it for the money...they don't have the loyalty...blah, blah, blah" rant.

I've done readings where players in the past have said that about players that succeeded them in the game, oh, in the 1890s and before.

I think the first creeping old fogeyism was a letter I saw to a "base ball" journal in the 1860's about how the players in Wisconsin have gone soft and are playing the game differently than the rugged sport he played.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 20, 2006, 09:16:59 AM
Quoteyou guys were bashing anyone who was assuming things about the foul and game that wasnt in attendance at the game or didnt know the "context" of the quotes in the newspaper.

This I don't understand. I asked for a little temperance until we had eyewitness accounts. At the time, all we had were radio reports from the Wooster station, which will always be slanted towards Wooster no matter how professional the broadcaster is (it's human nature).

The newspaper quotes could be taken out of context but I thought we did a reasonable job of discussing it all even if people disagreed. Anyway, there has been no lynch mob set upon Hiram.

And I do think Wooster can survive, if not thrive, without Port, based on seeing their team against Wabash when Port was a non-factor during their huge run.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 20, 2006, 09:28:36 AM
For all you guys who think Port can be replaced are full of #@*$.  He gets my vote for player of the year.  He is the glue that holds that team together. 

You don't replace him, you just hope you can get the other starters to step up.  Obviuosly Cooper is the real deal.  But know they have to dig deep.  It is just a shame but injuries are part of all sports.  It is just magnified when it is a top player.

I said earlier that they run their offense like a Rolex watch.  That watch now needs repair.

Here is to a speedy recovery.

Advantage Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on January 20, 2006, 09:48:22 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2006, 12:39:20 AM

I said that Wooster will not go deep into the NCAA tourney IF Port can't play. 


Sadly this year looks like another one where the Great Lakes region is going to have Salem level opposition throughout the bracket starting from the first weekend so saying Wooster has a tough chance of "making it to Salem" or a tough chance of "winning any tournament games" are not too far removed from each other. Fortunately there is more than a month for Port to recover and the field has been expanded so that Wooster can probably assume a tourney berth barring a complete meltdown from this point. A couple non-Witt losses might mean fewer chances to play the tourney games in Timken or at least close to home, but then of course that might give me a chance to catch them in the tourney again this year.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 20, 2006, 10:45:37 AM
From this morning's Wooster Daily Record:

"Replays showed the ball was all the way through the hoop by the time Pfouts collided with Port and knocked him to the floor."

Fine work, Pfouts.  Brace yourself when you come to Timken.

The following is a listing of the minutes per game for Wooster's significant players thus far this season:


James Cooper     27.1
Tom Port         29.9
Tim Vandervaart  24.2
Kyle Witucky     28.3
Devin Fulk       18.9
Brandon Johnson  19.7
Evan Will        15.5
Andy Van Horn    21.7
Marty Bidwell    10.9
Jamie Yoder       5.6


Nearly 30 minutes need to be given to the remaining players to make up for Port's absence.  I see Coach Moore as being between Iraq and a hard place in the allocation.  Playing Evan Will more, which he certainly will do to some extent, will help to maintain the post defense and rebounding levels but almost certainly hurt the offense, especially the running game.  The offense would probably operate with a double post, Will playing around the foul line.  He has a nice touch, and can step outside if needed.

When only Vandervaart or Will are on the floor, but not both, as has been the usual situation so far this season, I foresee Brandon Johnson gaining the most minutes in the reallocation.  The interior defense will suffer with this four guard lineup, but, if they can board, the offense may be able to continue to put up points.

Estimate of new player minutes, without Port:


James Cooper     30
Tim Vandervaart  26
Kyle Witucky     30
Devin Fulk       20
Brandon Johnson  28
Evan Will        25
Andy Van Horn    22
Marty Bidwell    15
Jamie Yoder       5.8




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 20, 2006, 10:50:44 AM
Wooster Booster:  Just curious as to how you estimate an additional 12 seconds per game for Jamie Yoder??   ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2006, 11:37:24 AM
I think smeds makes a good point about Wooster without Port.  He basically didn't factor at all in the 2nd half of the Wabash game because of foul trouble.  The rest of the Scots picked it up big time and balooned a 6 point lead when Port picked up his 4th foul to over 30 by the time Port re-entered the game, only to shortly thereafter pick up his 5th foul.

There is, however, a big difference in the other players mindsets when a player is on the bench with foul trouble as opposed to a player on the bench with an injury.  James Cooper said the following in that article that Wooster Booster had mentioned in the Daily Record:

Quote from: James Cooper by the Wooster Daily Record"I think it got us down a little," said Scots guard James Cooper, who leads the NCAC in scoring at 19.4 ppg. "Of course, everyone wants Tom to be here and we were down a little emotionally, but we should've played better than that."

I think there was a bit of an emotional letdown during the  Hiram game after Port's injury which allowed the Terriers to get back into the game.  Now that the players for Wooster know the extent of Port's injuries, they can move on and know that they are going to have to get it done without Port.  Maybe Port's getting into foul trouble against a quality opponent like Wabash was a blessing in disguise, because it showed the rest of the Scots that they CAN still be productive without Port in the lineup.  This team is still loaded with talent.  What it all boils down to is that some of the Scots are now going to be challenged to step up in a big way until Port gets back.  Guys like Evan Will and Marty Bidwell and maybe even Jeff Stevens.  The good thing is, I'm pretty sure that they will do just that with the coaches they have behind them!

On a side note concerning Port, does anyone think this injury might sway Tom into coming back for his 4th year of eligibilty even more?  Depending on how serious the fracture is, and how long he is out, I think it could sway him into coming back, if he was still on the fence about his decision.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 20, 2006, 11:49:13 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 20, 2006, 10:50:44 AM
Wooster Booster:  Just curious as to how you estimate an additional 12 seconds per game for Jamie Yoder??   ???

Heh.  I thought it would be obvious that to optimize the team's results that Yoder should get an additional 12 seconds; no more, no less. ;)

After making that earlier post it came to me that some of the marginal players's minutes (those beyond Yoder on the bench) might actually go down because the games might be closer hence less garbage time available.  That would mean the regulars would go up, probably another 1-3 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on January 20, 2006, 12:29:22 PM
Although the loss of Port is a big blow, the Scots will be able to function without him. There have been instances in the past in which important players missed games (Nelson, Thompson, etc) and the rest of the Scots stepped up. I see this being the same sort of deal. It will be hard to beat Witt with an extra guard but at the same time Witt will have to find a way to defend the extra guard, I don't see Borchers or Russ being able to reach step beside Witucky, Van Horn, Cooper or Johnson, lets just hope the 3's are plentiful in that matchup. Best wishes to a speedy recovery for Port and once he gets back into the lineup the team will be that much better as other guys will have had to step up their games a bit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 20, 2006, 12:41:43 PM
My reliable sources at Wooster just confirmed that Tom will be out 3-6 weeks instead of the 2-3 reported in the press.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 20, 2006, 12:43:11 PM
Quote from: WooMix on January 20, 2006, 12:41:43 PM
My reliable sources at Wooster just confirmed that Tom will be out 3-6 weeks instead of the 2-3 reported in the press.

Shoot.  But I'm afraid that sounds much more realistic to me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 20, 2006, 12:47:45 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 20, 2006, 11:37:24 AM
On a side note concerning Port, does anyone think this injury might sway Tom into coming back for his 4th year of eligibilty even more?  Depending on how serious the fracture is, and how long he is out, I think it could sway him into coming back, if he was still on the fence about his decision.

I was wondering that same thing.  I wouldn't be too surprised that if his injury ends up being a season-ending thing that he might decide to come back.  Assuming, of course, that family finances and life plans don't get in the way of college hoops!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 20, 2006, 12:51:54 PM
Just a sidebar to coming back.
Hern also has another year if he wants.  But he must be a full time student to play.
Hern graduates in May and so I am pretty sure he is done. 
If there was a graduate school he could but I don't think his family is going to pay HUGE money so he can shoot hoops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 20, 2006, 01:03:29 PM
Quote from: WooMix on January 20, 2006, 12:41:43 PM
My reliable sources at Wooster just confirmed that Tom will be out 3-6 weeks instead of the 2-3 reported in the press.

Note that the press said "AT LEAST" 2-3 weeks this morning!

In any case, its a big loss for an extended period of time.  But I agree with Vanilla24COW that they should be OK.  Sure, there's no one person on that team that can replace Port, but I'm guessing that Coach Moore will have the other 8 in the rotation buckle down that much harder and do what it takes to get the job done.  We should be able to better judge the effect on the rest of the season after Saturday night.

Looking at the remaining schedule, the tough games (IMO) will be:
   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 20, 2006, 01:14:19 PM
If Wittenberg were to win it's next game against Wooster, and both teams won all of their others, giving them each one loss in conference play, where would the tournament be held?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 20, 2006, 01:36:29 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 20, 2006, 01:14:19 PM
If Wittenberg were to win it's next game against Wooster, and both teams won all of their others, giving them each one loss in conference play, where would the tournament be held?

I'm thinking that they have abandoned using overall record as a tiebreaker.  Rather there would be a coin flip and the winner would get to choose either to be the #1 seed or to host the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 20, 2006, 02:20:16 PM
If I recall some super-secret tiebreakers I once heard about, I think the next tiebreaker may be how they did against the rest of the conference, in ascending order of finish.

For example, if Witt and Woo both lose another game, and Witt loses to OWU and Wooster loses to Allegheny (for example), then Witt would host because Wooster's other loss was to a team that finished lower in the conference.

But if they both have one loss, to each other, then I got nothin' there....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 20, 2006, 04:42:08 PM
 In the event of a tiebreaker that  cannot be broken, the NCAC Final Four will be held in Zanesville, OH.

We're sorry, very, very sorry. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2006, 06:59:15 PM
WooBoo, you've got me stumped on the new footer.  Off to IMDB for me!  :)

Back from IMDB:  Ah.  Never saw it; not my genre. :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2006, 07:18:50 PM
I think "derek" is correct in that if Witt were to beat Wooster and neither team had any other conference losses, it would go to a coin flip.  However, I believe smeds is right if they happen to take on losses other than to themselves, it goes to who lost to the better teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 20, 2006, 07:37:20 PM
DC -

You've never seen The Hunt for Red October?  Submarine movies aren't among your genres?  It's the best of them, IMHO, followed by Run Silent, Run Deep.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2006, 07:49:26 PM
I have always thought of the Tom Clancy movies as cold war/espionage/action movies, which don't really interest me.  I could be wrong, since I never saw it, or any other Tom Clancy movie, and never read any of the books either.  :P

My favorite submarine movie, by far, is The Enemy Below, with Robert Mitchum and Curt Jurgens.  Destination Tokyo is pretty good for a long-winded propaganda flick.  Then there's Operation Petticoat.... :D

The dates of release of these three pictures are 1957, 1943, and 1959, respectively.  What does that say about me?  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Warren Thompson on January 20, 2006, 07:59:58 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 20, 2006, 07:49:26 PM
I have always thought of the Tom Clancy movies as cold war/espionage/action movies, which don't really interest me.  I could be wrong, since I never saw it, or any other Tom Clancy movie, and never read any of the books either.  :P

My favorite submarine movie, by far, is The Enemy Below, with Robert Mitchum and Curt Jurgens.  ... Then there's Operation Petticoat.... :D


The Enemy Below has that great scene wherein Mitchum and Juergens salute each other after the former's destroyer rammed the U-boat. Operation Petticoat has some great comedic scenes and one-liners uttered by Cary Grant (e.g., when informed by his XO that the Tony Curtis character, a genuine pain in the butt, is returning to the boat, he simply remarks, "war is hell").
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 20, 2006, 08:06:18 PM
I'd be surprised if you didn't like The Hunt for Red October.  Good story, excellent cast.  It's by far the best of the Clancy movies (the others do get too "actiony", even Patriot Games which is good until the last half hour), although maybe not the best book.  I like Without Remorse.

I agree with you on The Enemy Below.  Don't think I've seen Destination Tokyo, will look it up.  What's the one with James Garner, where he swims from a sub into a Japanese base and blows it up?

Ok, I'll give you another one...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 20, 2006, 08:20:09 PM
David,

You've surely seen Das Boot?!  And it couldn't make your top 3?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2006, 08:22:07 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 20, 2006, 08:06:18 PMWhat's the one with James Garner, where he swims from a sub into a Japanese base and blows it up?

Uhm, Murphy's Romance?  No, in that one he blows up Sally Field, not an airfield. :)  I think you mean Up Periscope.

Chuck, actually I haven't seen Das Boot.  I don't know why; so many films, so little time.  I'm working my way through the Bergman and Ozu catalogues right now.

I suppose everyone else is getting tired of this sidebar.  If you are, just whistle.  You know how to whistle, don't you, Steve?  You just put your lips together and blow. :-X

8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 20, 2006, 08:32:45 PM
David,

I understand.  I'm not really much of a movie fan (my wife gets frustrated that [often] 15 minutes into a rented movie I'll wander off to read, check out d3hoops, or whatever.

But DO watch Das Boot - a definite winner.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2006, 10:15:15 PM
Quote from: sac on January 20, 2006, 04:42:08 PM
In the event of a tiebreaker that  cannot be broken, the NCAC Final Four will be held in Zanesville, OH.

Sac -- lol, Wooster would love that scenario!

Zanesville is Kyle Witucky's hometown so the Scots would have a nice local contingent and a "neutral homecourt"!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 20, 2006, 10:46:59 PM
Ah, submarine movies are all wet!  ;D

Give me the Caine Mutiny any day of the week - by the way where in blazes are those strawberries???  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2006, 10:50:46 PM
The mess boys ate them!  There is no key!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 21, 2006, 01:13:40 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 20, 2006, 07:37:20 PM
DC -

You've never seen The Hunt for Red October?  Submarine movies aren't among your genres?  It's the best of them, IMHO, followed by Run Silent, Run Deep.

I made a quip about The Hunt For Red October on the MIAC board last week. Someone asked why Carleton waited until the last minute to send in the end of the bench in a blowout win over St. Olaf, and a Carleton fan replied that it was because Knights coach Guy Kalland always sticks to a sub chart. Someone else asked, "What's a sub chart?", and I jumped in and replied, "It's what Scott Glenn used to track down Sean Connery in The Hunt For Red October."

Crickets chirped.

The moral of the story is: Know your audience. Movie trivia doesn't work in the MIAC room. It's more of a make-crazy-bets and a crack-wise-about-the-local-pro-sports-teams kinda room.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 21, 2006, 01:17:09 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 20, 2006, 10:46:59 PM
Ah, submarine movies are all wet!  ;D



Actually... you can't spell  JEWETT... without WET

Let's go EC.   

BILLY_PILGRAM....this is going to be one heck of a weekend... thanks for letting me come up to Chicago... to visit.... We should think about going to a U. of CBasketball game while I'm here... I did start my NCAA career at U of C.  I mean back in the days I believe they were part of the BIG TEN.. Well the big 11 now. .
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 21, 2006, 01:31:31 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 21, 2006, 01:13:40 AM
I made a quip about The Hunt For Red October on the MIAC board last week. Someone asked why Carleton waited until the last minute to send in the end of the bench in a blowout win over St. Olaf, and a Carleton fan replied that it was because Knights coach Guy Kalland always sticks to a sub chart. Someone else asked, "What's a sub chart?", and I jumped in and replied, "It's what Scott Glenn used to track down Sean Connery in The Hunt For Red October."

Crickets chirped.

Shome thingsh in here don't react well to bulletsh.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 21, 2006, 01:32:05 AM
Quote from: earlhamalum on January 21, 2006, 01:17:09 AMWe should think about going to a U. of CBasketball game while I'm here... I did start my NCAA career at U of C.

I was there tonight to see a game, Brandeis @ Chicago. Great crowd for the U of C, too. It was Beach Night. They had a halftime limbo contest. Even the Chicago coaches wore luau shirts.

As the t-shirts say, the University of Chicago may indeed be "where fun goes to die." But at least tonight they were making an effort to disprove it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 21, 2006, 03:36:52 PM
CMU helped everyone out in the GL Region last night losing to Case.  That should take them out of the running to be ranked #1 in the initial GL Regional Poll in Feb.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 03:37:49 PM
Halftime at Meadville:

Allegheny 35
Wittenberg 26

Wittenberg leads the nation in scoring defense, at 52.6 ppg, but except for a 5-minute lull in mid-half, the Gators have had their way offensively, leading by as many as 13 points.  Dan Russ sat out twelve minutes of the first half with 2 fouls. 

McCloskey and Babe lead the Gators with 12 and 11, respectively.  Borchers tops the Tiger Beat with 13 on 6 of 8 shooting.  Witt shot just 35% (despite Borchers) and missed all ten three point attempts.  Gheny is shooting a phenomenal 52% (14/27) and 5/8 (63%) from the arc. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 21, 2006, 03:41:57 PM
Halftime in C'ville:

Kenyon 34
Wabash 40

Wabash has led for the majority of the half and has been up by as many as 13.  A late rally by the Lords cut the lead to six.  Wabash's Andrew Zimmer was helped off the floor at halftime with an apparent ankle injury.  We'll see how serious this is after halftime.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 21, 2006, 03:49:48 PM
Earlham- 40
Oberlin-   34
       
Half-time

B. Miller 18 points 6 rebounds
Jewett   11 points 3 rebounds
LaRon Henry had a quiet first half with 4  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 21, 2006, 03:52:40 PM
Dang, didn't realize there was afternoon action!  Sticks in my craw to root for Allegheny, but a fan's gotta do what a fan's gotta do.  35-26, alright!

Oops.  After giving some stats, the Wittenberg broadcast is off the air again.  That certainly doesn't seem to me like technical difficulty.  It's a choice.

Top four submarine movies:

The Hunt for Red October
Das Boot
Run Silent, Run Deep
The Enemy Below
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 21, 2006, 03:59:50 PM
I don't know what it is, if it's a very poor microphone, low bandwith, or what, but the Witt netcast is really hard on the ears.  The sound is stacatto, or to compare it to light, strobish.  Somewhere between there and here, it goes south.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 04:00:18 PM
Man, you're a tough customer.  I'm perfectly satisfied with the Witt broadcast, considering it's a student-run venture.  It's not the smooth professional operation of WQKT, but very few D3 schools have that luxury.  Witt's broadcast is better than a vast sea of other D3 radio (listen to Oberlin sometime :)), and I'd just as soon listen to dead air at halftime than commercials for "Hometown Hardware" or "Scott Kapek Insurance."

Allegheny leads 41-30, 15:00 remaining.

Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 21, 2006, 03:59:50 PM
I don't know what it is, if it's a very poor microphone, low bandwith, or what, but the Witt netcast is really hard on the ears. The sound is stacatto, or to compare it to light, strobish. Somewhere between there and here, it goes south.

I don't have any of these problems.  I wonder if it's your connection?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 04:08:12 PM
7-0 run for Witt; 41-37, 9:44 left.

You'll notice that 'Gheny has just 6 points so far this half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 04:20:59 PM
Witt cuts it to 3, then McCloskey hits a big three for the Gators.  A couple of free throws from Borchers (who is automatic), and a jumper from McCloskey and it's 49-43 Allegheny with 7:00 to go.

The 'Gheny students keep chanting "U-S-A, U-S-A" which has the Witt announcer perplexed.  I assume it's aimed at Borchers, who is from Russia, after all.  Pretty clever.

Update:  a layup cuts it to 49-45, 6:26 left.

Update: 5:00 left, 51-45 'Gheny.  Borchers back to the line.  Borchers hits two (of course), has 27 of Witt's 47 points, and it's 51-47.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 21, 2006, 04:26:24 PM
Yes, it does sound like the 'Gheny fans are looking for a "Miracle on Hardwood" with their "USA" cheer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 21, 2006, 04:26:50 PM
Tie ballgame- 51-51 with 3:50 to go
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 04:27:13 PM
Russ inside for two, 51-49.  3:30 left.
Foul on Tyler Howard (Witt), but just Witt's 5th team foul.  However, it was in the act.  Whoever the shooter was missed both, Howard misses a layup, Bowen with the stickback to tie the game 51-51 3:15 left.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 04:29:35 PM
Witt takes a 52-51 lead, McCloskey misses, Russ rebounds, but a steal from 'Gheny gets the Gators back on the offense.  Loose ball, Howard gets it and misses another layup.  Gator ball, down 1, 1:30 or so left.

Some confusion as to whose ball it should be.  Timeout Witt.  53-52 Witt 1:33 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 04:32:54 PM
Babe misses a 3, Borchers rebound.  Another Witt timeout.  1:03 left.  Borchers is keeping Witt in this game almost single-handedly. 

Denbow a big 3 as the shot clock runs out.  56-52 Witt :38 left.  McCloskey fouled by Denbow.  McCloskey hits both, has 23.  56-54 Witt.

Quick foul, :36.3 left, Steffes goes to the line.  Steffes hits the first, misses the second.  Still a one-possession game.  Blocked shot, Witt ball, timeout, :26.4 left, 57-54 Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 04:40:13 PM
Steffes fouled again, Witt in the double bonus.  Hits the first to make it a two-possession game with :23.7 left.  Hits the second, 5 point lead.   

Babe and McCloskey miss threes, Borchers rebounds and is fouled.  Witt will pull this one out on the shoulders of Dane Borchers. 

Borchers ends up with 29 of Witt's 61 points, as the Tigers prevail 61-56.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 04:46:20 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 19, 2006, 11:41:29 PM
hopefully witt doenst let up this weekend against allegheny- a dangerous place for our team because we hate playing there. bad vibes.

Quote from: jscwittfan on January 20, 2006, 12:53:48 AM
If Witt plays like they did Wednesday night against OWU, the Gators should not be a problem.  But, let us not forget that this IS their first road game as the number one team, and that's something that cannot be overlooked as well.  It should make for an interesting game.

We can't say we weren't warned. 

Note to the Witt silent majority:  it's posts like these two that demonstrate why the rest of us want to hear more from you folks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 21, 2006, 04:47:54 PM
The benches are clearing at Chadwick...the final score is:

Kenyon 68
Wabash 88

Lyttle had a huge game for Wabash with (at last check) 19 points, 6 assists, and 4 rebounds.  Not much of a struggle for Wabash in the second half as the Little Giants methodically pulled away from the overmatched Lords.  The win snaps Wabash's 3-game skid.  Wabash goes to #1 Witt on Wednesday.  


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on January 21, 2006, 04:49:03 PM
Thank God for Borchers.

And thank Borchers for another year, next year.

He was hurt (redshirted) his freshman year.

This really shows who the MVP really is for the Tigers.

Steffes stepped up  big with  the FTs at the end.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2006, 05:34:04 PM
Petty shakes up the lineup - with Medeiros and Owens coming off the bench. The LGs respond in the second half after a spotty first half.

Formato is a player. 24 points and 9 rebounds and he's just a gamer.

Lyttle was huge today. That is a career high for him.

Zimmer did not return in the second half.

Wabash still has porblems shooting free throws (15 of 24 today).

Next up, Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 21, 2006, 05:52:41 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 04:20:59 PM
The 'Gheny students keep chanting "U-S-A, U-S-A" which has the Witt announcer perplexed.  I assume it's aimed at Borchers, who is from Russia, after all.  Pretty clever.

Yes, Borchers is from Russia . . . but Russia, Ohio, not the country!  So either the Allegheny students were confused, misinformed, or felt like chanting USA anyway just because of the relation.

I was worried there for a while, thought Allegheny was gonna pull it out.  I'm from the same hometown as Casey McCloskey, and since he played for the "golden school" of our local media, he got a LOT of exposure.  He's a very good player, and Witt needs to find a way to shut him down when the Gators come to Springfield for the regular season finale.

Now we get to the next interesting game of the day.  Wooster - Port Game 1.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on January 21, 2006, 06:05:12 PM
I'll go with scotsbrod explanation concerning the USA chant.

Even the Gator fans knew deep down it would take a miracle.

:-*


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 21, 2006, 06:05:51 PM
Man, I thought the Gators were going to pull out the upset.  Oh well.  Witt's composure down the stretch won them that game.  There was no panic.  They just chipped away until they finally took the lead.

Still, even though Witt avoided the upset bug, Albion wasn't able to as they were upset by Calvin 69-66!!!  They have been anything but impressive since their blowout win over Hope.  They barely beat Alma and K-zoo and they lost today.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on January 21, 2006, 06:42:16 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 21, 2006, 03:59:50 PM
I don't know what it is, if it's a very poor microphone, low bandwith, or what, but the Witt netcast is really hard on the ears.  The sound is stacatto, or to compare it to light, strobish.  Somewhere between there and here, it goes south.

I, too, find the coverage of Wittenberg sports embarassing.

The last game was not  even on the radio, WUSO 89.1. They decided to broadcast the women's game on the radio and put the men's game on the internet only. Politically correct, I guess.

Also, the coverage is  by numerous people. Scott Leo, his brother  did the game today (Allegheny), Dave Williams and Sean(?) Golden and no Marty Bannister.

WIZE 1340 used to broadcast Witt games before WBLY took over. WIZE, still a station in Springfield, but a clone(same broadcast content) of WONE (Dayton) now carries Wright State games. Real exciting listening to Wright State games.  :'(

Marty Bannister was the prime broadcaster until A.D. Purnell pissed WBLY (WULM)off and stopped carrying Wittenberg sports.
Marty had a daily noon sports show on and a weekly Saturday morning show on WBLY.

Wittenberg claimed that WBLY breached their contract because they refused to carry Wittenberg's women basketball.

Numerous people at Witt have quit or been fired because of Purnell.

Something has to be corrected pretty soon, I hope the new university president steps up and corrects this obvious glaring problem(s).

The WIZE signal goes about 30 miles, the WBLY signal about 10 miles, and the WUSO signal barely 5 miles. I know a person that lives 1 mile from campus and can't pick up the signal. I live 5 miles from the signal and have to listen to the internet to listen to  the games. If I attempt to listen on the radio, the signal bleeds with Central State radio. 2 games for 1.  ;)
I can only imagine the internet broadcasting quality if a person does not have DSL or Cable.

In case, Witt officials see this post.

Combine the coverage of Cedarville University's network (about 10 stations throughout the Midwest) and the MWC's videostreaming that was presented last week (Wheaton College is a close second in the videobroadcasting quality) but the MWC(midwest conference) quality was unreal with no breakups (DSL here). It was like watching tv.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 08:16:37 PM
Halftime at Wooster

Wooster 52
OWU 42

Torrid shooting on both ends: Wooster is 22/36 (61%) and 5/8 (63%) from the arc; OWU is 17/31 (55%) and 6/13 (46%), respectively.  OWU has a 15-14 edge on the boards, but has turned the ball over 9 times (to just 4 for Wooster.)  James Cooper leads all scorers with 15 on 6/10 shooting.  Dustin Rudegeair leads the Bishops with 10.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 21, 2006, 08:17:13 PM
Well, a late final update from Oberlin....and the Yeodome (does anyone really call that crappy gym by this name?).

Earlham cruises 82-63. Oberlin had no answers for Brandon Miller (26 and 9) or Markous Jewett (25-9) as Earlham opens up what was once just a 6-point halftime lead.

Quinton Spencer goes for just eight for Oberlin. Tyler Stewart has put him on lock for the last two years.

For some reason, I always get nervous when Earlham plays at Oberlin. It probably dates back to the upset loss that Earlham took two seasons ago on the final day of the NCAC regular season.

Another highlight....Bronson Lickliter scores 2 points, completing the strangest gap ever between college baskets. After playing two years for Earlham in the late 90s, Lickliter became a volunteer student assistant. After graduation, he became a volunteer assistant. After spending some time working in Hawaii, he became the graduate assistant. After leaving his job and getting married, he came back to the Earlham Masters program to earn his teaching certificate. While in the program, he joined up with the team and started working out with them, later pracitcing and now on the team as the 12th man. Hey, it worked out....two points for my good friend Bronson. Congrats buddy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 08:21:09 PM
Elsewhere, Denison downs Hiram 80-72.

Wooster has run out to a 15 point lead early in the 2nd half.

That's a great D3 story, Billy.  Thanks for posting it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 21, 2006, 08:41:44 PM
Nice win for Earlham today.  Now we have to focus on Denison.  I hope to make it up to the game on Wed. (DF) 

It looks like Brandon Miller may have NCAC player of the week.  2-0
In two games.  25 PPG, 10.5 RPG, 4.5 SPG, 2.5 APG, 1.0 BPG  If anyone can find someone with a better stat line then that... feel free to Post. 

Congrats EC
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 08:51:55 PM
OWU is hanging tough, trailing by 10 with about 2:30 left.  It's 99-89.

I'm listening to Wooster, playing Scrabble, and watching NBC Nightly News (remember, I'm in the West) where my brother-in-law is about to appear to discuss movies.  Too many balls in the air!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2006, 09:00:02 PM
Final:  Wooster 103  Ohio Wesleyan 94

In their first game without Tom Port, Wooster was led tonight by James Cooper who scored a career high 37 points.   :)  Tim Vandervaart had 15 points, Kyle Witucky had 11 points and Evan Will chipped in 9 points.

Kudos to James Cooper who really picked up the scoring load in Port's absence.  Marty Bidwell (8 points) and Brandon Johnson (8 points) both got more minutes tonight and they played well.

Wooster is now 16-1, 8-0 in the NCAC.   ;D  Next game at Kenyon on 1/25.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2006, 09:39:05 PM
Updated NCAC Standings thru Today's Games:

8-0  Wooster (16-1)
7-1  Wittenberg (16-1)
6-2  Earlham (9-8)  Quakers have won 3 in a row, sole 3rd place
5-3  Wabash (11-6)
5-3  Ohio Wesleyan (10-7)
4-4  Denison (8-9)  Big Red have won 4 in a row, beating #7 thru #10
2-6  Allegheny (6-10)  Gave the Tigers a scare today
2-6  Kenyon (5-12)
1-7  Hiram (3-14)
0-8  Oberlin (0-16)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 21, 2006, 09:43:20 PM
Wooster players really stepped up to plate tonight.  Cooper was fantastic and Will, Johnson and Bidwell played extremely hard.  Some of Cooper's shots were pretty amazing to watch.  He has some great moves that make your jaw drop at times.  

Have to say Wooster was playing pretty good D but OWU was able to get their shots to fall.  They have a couple of shooters on that can hit from downtown.  

Was a fun game to watch, close enough to keep it interesting but never really in doubt.

Kudos to Woo for coming out and playing hard.  They deserved the win tonight.

Also a shout out to Rummy who was the guest coach tonight!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Marty Bannister on January 21, 2006, 09:44:26 PM
"Witt4ever"........my not doing the Wittenberg games has nothing to do with
Garnett Purnell.....i have taken on the duties as play-by-play announcer for the
Ohio State women's basketball games and simply do not have time to devote to Wittenberg mens games as in the past. I found it not fair to the listeners and to myself  to do half the Witt schedule, and have someone else step in to do the other half. I'm sure your concerns re: the broadcasts are being addressed, Scott Leo is handling that and I'm sure whatever problems that are occuring will be corrected. The radio station situation is also not Purnell's fault, that blame falls on the current management team at WULM (formerly WBLY). Moving the games to the student station ensured they would
stay on the air in some form. Efforts were made to work out an agreement with WONE,
but numerous attempts failed. I hope this helps you in some way
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 21, 2006, 09:48:46 PM
Some thoughts on Wooster - OWU:

A very solid performance by Evan Will who, especially early on, found himself defending away from the basket (in Port's role) and did a commendable job.  He gets tougher on the boards every game.

The man who, to me, unexpectedly stepped up his game was Marty Bidwell.  He picked up both his defense and rebounding, which wasn't that surprising, but it was his offensive play that caught my attention.  He made a number of really nice moves to get to the basket, and finished.  Plus, he handled the ball on the break a few times, kept it until the right moment, and then dished it off nicely.  A really solid game tonight.

What can you say about James Cooper?  He scored from everywhere, in every fashion, including a double-pump underhand fling shot from close in on the right side.  Had anyone else thrown that thing up I'd have been yelling and swearing, sure that it would never draw iron.  Cooper's attempt didn't draw iron, either.  It went straight through the hoop, just as I expected it to.

I've been trying to figure out who to compare him with, and still can't really put a finger on it.  Except that there's a little bit of Dick Barnett (going way back here) in him.  Barnett, from mid-range and in close, had a little fadeaway on his jumper, which enabled him to get it off in traffic.  Cooper does, also.  And you can almost imagine Cooper yelling "Fall back, baby!" after he drains those long threes.

OWU shot the ball extremely well.  The made a bunch of mid-range jumpers with hands in their faces and quite a few long range threes.  I didn't expect them to keep that up, but they did.  If that's their normal accuracy, I can see how they can be a pretty tough opponent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2006, 09:51:14 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on January 21, 2006, 08:41:44 PM
It looks like Brandon Miller may have NCAC player of the week.  2-0
In two games.  25 PPG, 10.5 RPG, 4.5 SPG, 2.5 APG, 1.0 BPG  If anyone can find someone with a better stat line then that... feel free to Post.

NCAC Player of the Week has to be James Cooper!!
In 2 wins:  64 points, 25 of 38 shots made, 7 of 11 three pointers, 6 assists ;D

His 37 points tonight vs. Ohio Wesleyan was a career high and Cooper scored 22 of those points in the crucial 2nd half as he led Wooster to the win.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 21, 2006, 10:00:23 PM
Something interesting

Attendance at the Wooster game was 2321.  I looked up most of the other NCAC games today and don't think they would reach that if even you combined them all together! 

Witt/Gheny - 623
Earlham/Oberlin - 121
Wabash/Kenyon- 685
Denison/Hiram- 333
Total = 1762
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 21, 2006, 10:19:10 PM
Its kind of funny but Hope students cheer USA USA for one of their own, Steve Cramer.

Cramer went to Unionville-Sebawaing Area Schools over in the thumb of Michigan.  U-S-A.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 21, 2006, 10:21:24 PM
That James Cooper is such an obvious choice for NCAC Player of the Week almost assures that he won't be. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 21, 2006, 10:42:02 PM
Is there anyone (else) who bettered Cooper this week?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 21, 2006, 10:42:12 PM
Quote from: sac on January 21, 2006, 10:19:10 PMIts kind of funny but Hope students cheer USA USA for one of their own, Steve Cramer.

Cramer went to Unionville-Sebawaing Area Schools over in the thumb of Michigan.  U-S-A.


Now *that* is funny.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2006, 11:17:52 PM
If the way they handed out the football player of the week is any indication, it'll be given to Formato for a nice effort.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2006, 12:33:54 AM
For those interested, here's today's minutes played for the Wooster players, compared to their averages prior to today:

Player: mins today [season avg.]
Kyle Witucky: 29 [28.4]
James Cooper: 32 [27.4]
Andy Van Horn: 22 [21.7]
Tim Vandervaart: 29 [24.2]
Evan Will: 26 [15.8]
Brandon Johnson: 19 [19.8]
Marty Bidwell: 21 [11.1]
Devin Fulk: 18 [19.2]
Jeff Stevens: 4 [4.6]
Tom Port: 0 [28.8]
Everyone else*: 0 [3.9]
*Jamie Yoder, Brad Chisnell, Cody Drake; all three got into today's game, but each recorded "0+" minutes.

Port's 29 minutes were more or less divided by Will (10), Bidwell (10), Vandervaart (5), and Cooper (5).

Edit:  I really hate that "cool guy" smiley!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 22, 2006, 12:37:12 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 21, 2006, 09:48:46 PM
What can you say about James Cooper?  He scored from everywhere, in every fashion, including a double-pump underhand fling shot from close in on the right side.  Had anyone else thrown that thing up I'd have been yelling and swearing, sure that it would never draw iron.  Cooper's attempt didn't draw iron, either.  It went straight through the hoop, just as I expected it to.

I've been trying to figure out who to compare him with, and still can't really put a finger on it.  Except that there's a little bit of Dick Barnett (going way back here) in him.  Barnett, from mid-range and in close, had a little fadeaway on his jumper, which enabled him to get it off in traffic.  Cooper does, also.  And you can almost imagine Cooper yelling "Fall back, baby!" after he drains those long threes.

Great commentary WooBooster.  Here's what I think on Cooper:  He already drives the lane as well or better than Rodney Mitchell did, who I consider the best Wooster penetration guard that I've seen––and with Mitchell on the bench as a coach, you know that he can only keep learning from him.

Cooper clearly has a full arsenal:  3-pointers from anywhere at any time and the ability to drive past any D-3 defender- but I think what seperates him from anyone else I've seen play in D-3 (and even in higher divisions), is his art of the pullup jump shot.

It's a shot you don't see anymore- Cooper shakes his man, drives, but holds up and shoots a clean shot from 10, 12, 15, 18 feet, and he's undefendable because he could drive the lane, so the defender is assuming he'll keep driving.  Think of his stats on his career night tonight- 4-6 from 3; that means he was 10-14 elsewhere, and a lot of those weren't layups, they were those 10-18 footers.

With Port out, Cooper is going to be a bonafide All-American canidate by the end of this year...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 22, 2006, 01:28:02 AM
Agreed about Rodney Mitchell.  But I think, already, that Cooper has gone well beyond him offensively.  It's not often that you see a guard who combines the ability to penetrate, and do it well, with an exceptional long-range shot.  And add to that the old school pull-up jumper, and you have one heck of a threat.

And while Cooper is certainly a very good athlete, there are better guards out there, athletically, even at the DIII level.  Brandon Johnson, for one, appears to be quicker and a better leaper.  Cooper is quick, but not exceptionally so.  He can jump, but he's not a real leaper.  He's just developed his scoring skills, all of them, to a incredible degree.

Lots of guards can beat their man and get into the paint area.  It's what he does from that point on that sets him apart.  He's all head fakes, arm pumps, and deception.  He's a three-card monte game on hardwood; now you see it, now you don't.  His game is so nuanced, no Bush-Republican could ever guard him. ;-)

I'd love to see he and Brandon Johnson play one-on-one.  I doubt that Coop could handle Johnson, who is bigger, quicker, etc.  But it's the other matchup that would be fun, when Cooper had the ball.  Could the excellent defense of Johnson bother him?  I'd like to be a fly on the wall if they ever went at it in practice. :-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 22, 2006, 03:21:06 AM
I agree with you that Cooper isn't the fastest or quickest guard even on Wooster's squad- but I think he's the most dangerous.

But since you mentioned Brandon Johnson, and in the interest of comparison, watching his defensive abilities tonight started to remind me of Wooster's all-time steals leader, Antwyan Reynolds.

You're right- Cooper/Johnson would be a marquee matchup in practice.  I'd also want to see how the Faulk/Van Horn matchup would play out. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 22, 2006, 04:24:02 AM
Quote

NCAC Player of the Week has to be James Cooper!!
In 2 wins:  64 points, 25 of 38 shots made, 7 of 11 three pointers, 6 assists ;D

Okay I kind of like that... But come on... once again Wooster fans you forgot basketball is more than scoring... wait let me help you out

Brandon Miller  21-31 from the field.   Cooper had 6 assists in 2 games.. Brandon Miller had 2.5 that equals 5 assists.  Oh wait lets not forget about Coopers 3 Rebounds.  Wait again I believe Brandon Miller had 22 Rebounds Cooper had 2 steals, ooopss once again B. Miller had 9 steals... that equals 4.5 Steals a game. I'm sorry but both teams went 2-0 but in a non-bias View anyone looking at these stats has to say Brandon MIller Player of the week.  A drunk'n Billy_pilgram right now says Brandon Miller  POY.  A sober EarlhamAlum says.. POY also. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 22, 2006, 08:07:08 AM
The verdict is in:  Port will only miss 2 - 3 weeks!  That timeframe means that he may be available for the game in Springfield on Feb 4!
http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles//sports/&file=_sports2.txt&article=1&tD=

I don't really have anything to add on Cooper's exploits last night.  It wasn't just the number of shots that he made, but the variety of drives, pull-ups, mid-range jumpers, 3's and NBA 3's that he hit that was amazing. 

I thought that Marty Bidwell and Evan Will both did a great job last night.  Both play good all-around games, and it seemed that Bidwell did a good job keeping Chojnacki from being the domimant force like he was last year down at OWU against the Scots. 

On the OWU website, it notes that the last time that the Bishops gave up 100 points to a DIII team was Nov 21, 1993 to Geneseo St.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 22, 2006, 09:21:13 AM
Denison WINS AGAIN!!!

Good all around game by the Big Red.  They put up 51 pts in the first half which sealed the deal.

But look.........how many guys in double digit minutes.....EIGHT  not eleven, not twelve, EIGHT.  As I have said all year, Denison is not a deep team.  When they try and play eleven guys they lose.

Hodgkinson  37 minutes
Hern             32 minutes
++++++++++++++++
Put them together and they spell victory!!  I rest my case.

Cooper did have a great game.  But Miller does it on both ends.  I give my nod to him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gatorgrl on January 22, 2006, 09:45:31 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on January 21, 2006, 05:52:41 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 04:20:59 PM
The 'Gheny students keep chanting "U-S-A, U-S-A" which has the Witt announcer perplexed.  I assume it's aimed at Borchers, who is from Russia, after all.  Pretty clever.

Yes, Borchers is from Russia . . . but Russia, Ohio, not the country!  So either the Allegheny students were confused, misinformed, or felt like chanting USA anyway just because of the relation.

I was worried there for a while, thought Allegheny was gonna pull it out.  I'm from the same hometown as Casey McCloskey, and since he played for the "golden school" of our local media, he got a LOT of exposure.  He's a very good player, and Witt needs to find a way to shut him down when the Gators come to Springfield for the regular season finale.

Now we get to the next interesting game of the day.  Wooster - Port Game 1.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gatorgrl on January 22, 2006, 09:45:48 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on January 21, 2006, 05:52:41 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 21, 2006, 04:20:59 PM
The 'Gheny students keep chanting "U-S-A, U-S-A" which has the Witt announcer perplexed.  I assume it's aimed at Borchers, who is from Russia, after all.  Pretty clever.

Yes, Borchers is from Russia . . . but Russia, Ohio, not the country!  So either the Allegheny students were confused, misinformed, or felt like chanting USA anyway just because of the relation.

I was worried there for a while, thought Allegheny was gonna pull it out.  I'm from the same hometown as Casey McCloskey, and since he played for the "golden school" of our local media, he got a LOT of exposure.  He's a very good player, and Witt needs to find a way to shut him down when the Gators come to Springfield for the regular season finale.

Now we get to the next interesting game of the day.  Wooster - Port Game 1.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 22, 2006, 10:59:03 AM
That quote must have really made an impression on you gatorgrl?

Just wanted to echo the accolades being thrown Cooper's way.  He is just flat out a pleasure to watch.  Some of the moves he makes and the shots that follow make you just shake your head and smile and wonder how in the world he does that!  I can't imagine what the guys trying to guard him are thinking.  In listening to the Coach Moore Show before the game last night, Moore was implying that OWU might try to focus more attention defensively on James now that Port isn't on the floor.  Well, maybe they will try again next time, because whatever OWU did last night didn't work!  I too, was very impressed with what I saw from Marty Bidwell.  He made some real nice moves and showed signs that he can be a pretty good scoring threat.  These extra minutes that he's going to get over the next couple of weeks in Port's absense could prove to be real valuable come tournament time.  Not only is his experience level going to increase, but his confidence level will increase dramitically!

Overall, I was very impressed with how Wooster played last night.  I would say that they seemed more focused from the opening tip than any other game this year.  They looked like a team on a mission.  Yes, OWU was able to keep the score close, but, as someone pointed out a couple of pages ago, this game never seemed in doubt. 

Quote from: Wooster BoosterOWU shot the ball extremely well.  The made a bunch of mid-range jumpers with hands in their faces and quite a few long range threes.  I didn't expect them to keep that up, but they did.  If that's their normal accuracy, I can see how they can be a pretty tough opponent.
I doubt OWU shoots the ball as well as they did last night or their record would be much better.  On the season they are only shooting 36% from 3-pt range, and last night they shot 50%.  They shot better from 3-pt range than they did at the charity stripe?!  This game sort of reminded me of when a close game turns into a 10-15 point final margin of victory because of ft's at the end.  You describe it as being closer than the final score indicates.  Well, IMO, last night's game was not as close as the final score indicated.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 22, 2006, 11:57:19 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 22, 2006, 10:59:03 AM
This game sort of reminded me of when a close game turns into a 10-15 point final margin of victory because of ft's at the end.  You describe it as being closer than the final score indicates.  Well, IMO, last night's game was not as close as the final score indicated.

I couldn't agree more.  Although OWU was usually within 3 or 4 posessions the last few minutes of the game I never had any feeling that this one might slip away.  I don't know if it was because the Scots seemed to be able to score at will, or maybe just the fact that they've been in that situation many times, but I wasn't too concerned.  However, if OWU shoots like that down in Delaware next month, it might be a different story.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 22, 2006, 12:11:57 PM
Forgot to add that I am very relieved to hear that Port's injury turns out to not be as severe.  I think I can live with 2-3 weeks as opposed to 4-6 weeks.  His right wrist didn't seem to be too bad from what I could tell.  He didn't have it taped or anything.  I thought it was funny towards the end of the game when Chojnacki dove into the Wooster bench, the Wooster coaches were helping out wiping up the floor and Port helped out as well.  After he was done, he was getting high fives from the bench for his effort on the clean-up crew!   He still got on the court one way or another last night! :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 22, 2006, 01:50:26 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on January 22, 2006, 09:21:13 AMI rest my case.

We're going to hold you to that.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 22, 2006, 03:21:52 PM
Another win for the Big Red - that's 6 out of 7.  Denison is showing that when they play teams with similar levels of talent, they can compete.  They're also starting to develop a little confidence as a group.

It's also been fun to watch Steve Koecheler's continued development - he did a really nice job of defending the post and was active around the basket yesterday.  I have to believe that his improved play is a result of experienced gained early in the year.  Izzo contributed nicely yesterday with 13 and 7, and the two Shea's were solid.  That's the kind of balance that Denison is going to need the rest of the way - and again, is return on the experience they picked up at the start of the season.

Much improved ball movement (compared to November and December) resulted in better looks from the perimeter and 8 of 14 from three - 57%.

Wednesday evening is going to be a tough one, but it would be great to see the Big Red surprise Earlham to keep things going...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 22, 2006, 04:51:49 PM
I totally agree Central.  They had an extremely balanced attach.

I thought Izzo played a terrific game.  He also had 6 assists to go along with his 13 and 7.

I am not sure I am too crazy about Hodgkinson shooting 3's.  :-)  Next he will want to bring the ball up the floor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 22, 2006, 09:43:10 PM
well i know you all have been awaiting my point of view. i believe i did address that allegheny would have potential to pull off the upset-as i have seen this before-its as if allegheny is witt's upset waiting to happen every single year no matter what. witt showed that they have the caliber to pull through in close games, so a tough road environment shouldn't be too devastating. the allegheny students appeared to be roucous but i checked the attendance expecting a big crowd-700????????? come on i know there really isnt that much to do in meadville.

big 2 weeks ahead for witt- vs wabash wednesday night in which should be a good game. then at denison, at earlham, and vs wooster-i cant wait
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 22, 2006, 10:14:44 PM
Somewhere, either on this forum or at the Wooster-OWU game, there was talk about Kenyon having a new athletic facility.  Word is that it will be open and in use for the first time Wednesday night (6 PM) when Wooster comes to Gambier.

So, I checked out the Kenyon website.  The new facility, which is all-purpose including not only a basketball/volleyball arena but a pool, tennis courts, and an indoor track capable of handling meets, looks spectacular (although the seating capacity for basketball/volleyball is only 1,500, which isn't much at all).

However, a side note saddened me.  I found out that their old fieldhouse, in which I had coached teams in a few volleyball tournaments, has been demolished.  That place was old as dirt (built maybe in the twenties or thirties?), but that was the beauty of it.  Poorly lit, full of girders and odd corners, it just reeked of history and charm.  I suppose they really didn't need it anymore, but I'll miss it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 22, 2006, 11:37:29 PM
Penn -

623 is over their average by about 200 or so. And if they were raucous, then alls the better.

Many D-3 programs would die for 600 people at their games!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 23, 2006, 12:22:18 AM
yeah i guess i did underestimate the presence, even with witt's sometimes slacker crowds-we do turn out a huge amount compared to other schools
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on January 23, 2006, 08:37:53 AM
WooBoo,

Yeah, some of us have been talking about Kenyon's new facility, both on the bball page and the football pages.  Being from Gambier myself, I can tell you it is a pretty impressive complex.  They also revamped their football field (field turf) and added a new press box to the football stadium.

http://www1.kenyon.edu/athletic_images/05%20KAC%20Photos/Jan.%2016/index.htm

For those of you who are interested, here is a link to some pics of the complex.  As a Woo alum, it pains me that Kenyon will have the best sports facility in the conference.  I wish Wooster was the proud owner of this bad boy (of course, woo would have to have a larger gym  ;) ).  Kenyon is fortunate to have this building, I hope it pays off and brings a turn around to kenyon athletics, and brings more compitition to the conf.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 23, 2006, 10:00:57 AM
Kenyon's facility looks mighty impressive.  From what I can tell in the pictures, it's right up there with the Allen Center/Knowling Fieldhouse at Wabash. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 23, 2006, 10:05:12 AM
A while ago, somebody asked the following question:

QuoteIf Wittenberg were to win its next game against Wooster, and both teams won all of their others, giving them each one loss in conference play, where would the tournament be held?

I asked the question to  NCAC Assistant Director, Keri Alexander Luchowski, and the response was:

QuoteThey would each host a quarterfinal game, depending upon how the tiebreakers worked out.  The highest remaining seed after the quarterfinals would then host the semis and championship game.

I hope this helps.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 23, 2006, 10:36:54 AM
Quote from: WooMix on January 23, 2006, 10:05:12 AM
A while ago, somebody asked the following question:

QuoteIf Wittenberg were to win its next game against Wooster, and both teams won all of their others, giving them each one loss in conference play, where would the tournament be held?

I asked the question to NCAC Assistant Director, Keri Alexander Luchowski, and the response was:

QuoteThey would each host a quarterfinal game, depending upon how the tiebreakers worked out. The highest remaining seed after the quarterfinals would then host the semis and championship game.

I hope this helps.

I'm pretty sure that the tiebreakers are as follows, but I may be missing one or two:

1)  Head-to-head record
2)  Comparitive record of conference losses
3)  Coin toss with winner getting to pick either #1 seed or hosting rights if both #1 and #2 make it to the semis.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 23, 2006, 10:48:01 AM
Well I guess it pains me to say, but Congrast to Cooper for POW.  I'd just have to say Brandon Miller had the wrong uniform on this week, because I know if it said Wooster on it he would of been POW.  (and everyone's arguement would be there is more to basketball then scoring) *don't ask Kobe!
Big two games for Earlham this week.  The Big Red @ home and Wooster on the road!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 23, 2006, 11:10:58 AM
Quote from: DarkSide-D on January 23, 2006, 08:37:53 AM
As a Woo alum, it pains me that Kenyon will have the best sports facility in the conference. I wish Wooster was the proud owner of this bad boy (of course, woo would have to have a larger gym ;) ).

I believe that plans have been made to renovate Wooster's sports facilities, in particular the Armington Physical Education Center and the start date is somewhere around 2010 or so.  I think there was an article in the Daily Record about this over the summer.  I don't know what all the renovations would include, but it sounded pretty substantial.  I know that field turf for Papp was mentioned and a facelift for Timken and the nautatorium was also mentioned.

Here is a link to that article I mentioned:

Armington P.E.C. Facelift (http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=archive/03142005/sports/&file=_sports1.txt&article=1&tD=03142005)

From the article, it sounds like it is going to be a very nice complex when it is done.  It just won't be done for a while...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 23, 2006, 11:38:12 AM
But are they going to improve the golf course?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 23, 2006, 11:48:05 AM
From what I heard when I was there (2005), they are going to move everything in the direction of the baseball field.  Its going to be a megacomplex.  That will mean that the golf course is likely going to suffer some major size reductions because all the fields will have to be moved too.  Maybe we'll lose a few holes or so but that will be fine I guess becasue we have another golf course right by the Gault's residence.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on January 23, 2006, 11:57:59 AM
Thanks for the article Scotsfan.  Its an interesting read.  The PEC is definately in need of renovation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 23, 2006, 02:29:01 PM
Quote from: sac on January 23, 2006, 11:38:12 AM
But are they going to improve the golf course?
LOL sac!!! :D  My guess would be that the golf course will be untouched, although it could use a bit of a facelift.  The college golf team doesn't use LC Boles as it's home course.  They play on the Wooster CC golf course, so there really isn't any need to make improvements to LC Boles.  It's really not that bad of a course to tool around on, plus it's convenient for many of the locals.  If it's a nice day and I'm in the mood for a quick 9, LC Boles can't be beat.

What I gathered from the article was that the addition of the field turf at Papp would allow soccer, lacrosse and field hockey to be played there as well as football, allowing the addition to Armington to be done where the field hockey and soccer fields are now as well as into the hill between Papp and the soccer field.  I would guess that the baseball field would go untouched. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 23, 2006, 03:11:53 PM
"To accomplish all of these goals, the college is planning on building onto the east end of the P.E.C.  Adding onto that end will enable Wooster to keep its field hockey fields and maintain the aesthetics of the campus' north end."

To me, it seems as if they plan to leave the current field hockey and soccer/lacrosse fields intact, building only directly eastward down the hill into that wooded area.  I hope that's the case, as part of the campus's ambiance is all of that grassy space.  Besides, if the soccer/lacrosse field wasn't in its present location, we left-field line baseball fans would lose a pleasant between-inning diversion, even if we only barely understand the rules.

Aside: One of the most hilarious things in all sports is when a foul is commited in women's (not men's) lacrosse.  The referee gives the ball to the lady who was slighted, placing it in her stick.  Then, she and ALL of the women in the surrounding area are placed in the supposed exact positions that they occupied when the foul ocurred.  The ladies then strike Heisman-like action poses, frozen like statues, until the whistle is blown and play continues.  Always gets a grin out of me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 23, 2006, 04:01:09 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 23, 2006, 03:11:53 PM
Aside: One of the most hilarious things in all sports is when a foul is commited in women's (not men's) lacrosse.  The referee gives the ball to the lady who was slighted, placing it in her stick.  Then, she and ALL of the women in the surrounding area are placed in the supposed exact positions that they occupied when the foul ocurred.  The ladies then strike Heisman-like action poses, frozen like statues, until the whistle is blown and play continues.  Always gets a grin out of me.

I agree.  I've worked some of our women's lacrosse home games for 2 years now, and I still have no idea what the point of that is.  We always say it looks like "freeze tag with sticks."  It is one of the funniest things to watch, just because everything has to be perfect.  Silly women's lacrosse.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on January 23, 2006, 04:43:06 PM
I would just like to say the attendance for the Witt-Allegheny game (623) is probably about 500 more than a usual game, no joke.  For some reason, games with Witt always tend to draw much more of a crowd than usual on "campus."  Campus is in quotes because there is a lack of a following from the community at large.  Meadvillians don't exactly show up in force like the Wooster or Witt faithful.  I would also like to point out half of the attendance is usually from the visiting team.  That was always one of my gripes while I attended school there, particularly because I went to every single game.

earlhamalum,

Don't worry, Miller will get his POW.  Maybe the NCAC is just saving it for next week pending the result of the Woo-Earlham rematch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on January 23, 2006, 07:07:28 PM
Yeah it is pretty sad about the lack of fans that Allegheny brings out to gym on game day. But the fact of the matter is that if big Dane Borchers doesn't give a yeoman effort in this game you could've gone ahead and put a clinch next to the good old boys from Wooster in the division standings.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 23, 2006, 09:57:11 PM
Below are the current NCAC attendance figures taken from the NCAC website.  Can those numbers for Earlham possibly be correct?  Averaging 51 souls per game?

ATTENDANCE

Team          Home Games   Total   Avg
----------------------------------------
Allegheny         8        3328    416
Denison           5        2117    423
Earlham           6         304     51
Hiram             7        2240    320
Kenyon            5         992    198
Oberlin           7        2107    301
Ohio Wesleyan     5        2162    432
Wabash           12        7160    597
Wittenberg       10        7759    776
Wooster           8       13831   1729
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 23, 2006, 10:30:56 PM
I doubt that's right. Some schools are not good about putting attendance in their box scores at all. We had no reported attendance when Wabash traveled to Wooster, nor did we have attendance when Wabash went to Hanover, either.

I think we need to fix a game earlier. At Colorado College, they had one of the tourney games there a home game for us, which is dragging the Wabash average down.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 23, 2006, 10:41:45 PM
Once upon a time I strode across the fairways of LC Boles.  We played each hole twice to make 18, using different tees each time.  All I remember is it was cold, rainy and Ohio Wesleyan was sweet.

The next day we played Wooster CC and were delayed an hour or so because of frost, it never got above 45 but at least it was sunny.

This may have been the year we had exactly one snow free week in Michigan to prepare for our annual attempt to qualify for Nationals.  Which consisted of 4 or 5 trips to Indiana and Ohio.  That year we played at Muskingum, Wooster, Tri-State and Ball State.  Needless to say with one week of practice we didn't make it.

The bonus is I got to play the Scarlett course at Ohio State and Eagle Sticks in Zanesville.

Some day when I'm in a better mood I'll let you in on the time the Hope golf team traveled 4 hours in pouring rain to a tournament we weren't entered in.   Ooops! ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 23, 2006, 10:53:45 PM
Earlham nearly never puts in attendance figures for its basketball games...and when they do it is far from an official number.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 23, 2006, 11:11:48 PM
Quote from: sac on January 23, 2006, 10:41:45 PMSome day when I'm in a better mood I'll let you in on the time the Hope golf team traveled 4 hours in pouring rain to a tournament we weren't entered in.   Ooops! ::)

Now, I just gotta ask you this.  Why would a team drive 4 hours in the pouring rain to play in a tournament even if they were entered in it?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 23, 2006, 11:33:32 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 23, 2006, 11:11:48 PM
Quote from: sac on January 23, 2006, 10:41:45 PMSome day when I'm in a better mood I'll let you in on the time the Hope golf team traveled 4 hours in pouring rain to a tournament we weren't entered in.   Ooops! ::)

Now, I just gotta ask you this.  Why would a team drive 4 hours in the pouring rain to play in a tournament even if they were entered in it?  ;)

That brings up a whole other set of issues, lets stay on topic.

Something silly about no lightning, no standing water your good to go.  They actually played that day.........thankfully we just turned around and headed back home.......for 4 more hours.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 24, 2006, 06:27:55 AM
OK - I gotta guess.  Hope.  4 hours.    Bowling Green area?  Or maybe I drive too slow.  Dayton.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on January 24, 2006, 12:02:03 PM
Dayton in 4 hours, now that's some speed. Dayton is 5 hours flat for me. Given this was presumably in a slow van, BG/Toledo area probably isn't a bad guess.

As for the Boles, I don't know that there is any hope for that track. That course was only in good enough shape to play it because it was free. It also had some of the silliest putt-putt shaped greens I've played, there aren't many more rediculous greens than #3 at Boles. Warming up for Wooster CC by playing Boles must have felt like night and day.

It will be interesting to see how far they can really take the PEC to the east. It's not far before you get to the wooded slope. There isn't much flat ground to work with so I wonder how much earth shaping will be needed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 24, 2006, 03:54:40 PM
Billy_Pilgram-  Do you want to talk about the Fine Golf course in Richmond, Indiana.  Nothing like a 9 hole course that you have to play twice to get to 18 (Glen Miller).  Even though they do have a nice course off of US 27 and I-70, Billy you ever play there?  Markous Jewett and I were 4 under, but it was for a football gold outing! (best ball scramble)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 24, 2006, 04:05:55 PM
Never played Glen Miller.

Did play that course you speak of....I think it's called Highland. That was the first time I'd ever played golf.....so let's not speak of scores. Open would be the word to describe that place.

When I took golf class with the esteemed professor Jon Mires, MJ and I played a few times at Elks. That was a pretty nice course, but always intimidating when the RHS golf team (consistently one of the top two programs in the state) is out there next to you.

We also played down in Liberty once.....my first ever par there....ask Markous about that celebration.

But hey, I only play a few times a summer and you know how bad I am...usually getting progressively worse as the afternoon (or extremely early morning) gets later.

I'm still not ready to play Saddlebrook again...I don't think I can afford to buy 18 new balls at the turn.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 24, 2006, 04:10:38 PM
Warning: Actual NCAC hoops question!

What happened to Jordan Beard at Oberlin. He played in their first game, started even, played 20 minutes, and then nothing since. Did he hurt his knee again?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 24, 2006, 09:38:40 PM
Quote from: goscots on January 24, 2006, 06:27:55 AM
OK - I gotta guess.  Hope.  4 hours.    Bowling Green area?  Or maybe I drive too slow.  Dayton.

Angola, Indiana at Tri-State's Invite played on the Zollner Golf Course.  Thats Zollner of the Zollner Pistons if your into NBA history.

Andersdy is correct, slow college owned vehicle and slick wet roads.....slow drive but I may have exagerated.  Angola I believe is around 2 1/2 hours from Holland.

Best part of the trip was staying in the van while our coach checked us in.  We sat and watched our fellow MIAA friends warm up in the cold rain and then quietly drove away when we found out we weren't entered.

I can only imagine the look on the face of the TSU coach when our guy shows up and says, Hey I'm here to check in Hope........I'm sure the look on our AD's face was pretty priceless when he found out too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2006, 08:40:16 AM
Well, aside from the obvious (Wooster / Kenyon and OWU / Oberlin) there is intrigue tonight:

Can the 'new look' Little Giants hang tough against #1 on the road?
Can the streaking Big Red continue their roll at the Quakerdome?
Can Hiram get one on the road in a quest to qualify for the tourney?

Tune in tonight!

(Perhaps they don't publish attendance at Earlham because everyone is silent during the games, just like at a Quaker meeting? (Thanks to Six Feet Under for the knowledge to drop that line))  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 25, 2006, 09:05:42 AM
I think the Big Red will have it's hands full tonight.

If they come out and play like they did the first half against Hiram they will win the game.
If they play like they did in the second half they will lose.

The Big Red had ONE turnover in the first half against Hiram.  That has not happened all year.  They then follow up with 16 in the second half.  The Big Red has to do a better job of holding on to the ball.  Way too many unforced errors.

Earlham is VERY athletic.  They are difficult to match up against. 

It should be a good game.  The Big Red is playing much better of late.

GO RED!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 25, 2006, 09:29:32 AM
I agree with DenisonFan.  My guess is that the Big Red are still a notch below Earlham/Wabash/OWU.  They could pull the upset, but its not likely to happen over in Richmond.

Smeds - I think that Hiram is home against the Gators tonight.  Still, its a big game in the battle for the #8 spot in the tournament and the right to play Wooster or Witt in the opening round.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on January 25, 2006, 09:37:18 AM
I also agree that the Big Red will have their hands full tonight not necessarily because they are a step behind Wabash/Earlham/OWU looking at talent alone but because of Earlhams athleticism.  Earlham is arguably the most athletic team in the conference and Denison is arguably the most unathletic.  In today's game athleticism is an evermore important part of the game and watching Denison is like watching a teama from the 1950's.  Also Earlham is ususally very difficult at home just ask all of the Scot fans who no longer have any fingernails.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 25, 2006, 10:33:02 AM
This might be odd, but I feel like this is the game of the week for the Quakers.  This game will show the maturity of a team willing to make a run at the NCAC, if Earlham can come out and take care of business Vs The Big Red.  Both teams have been hot as of late, and if i was able to go to the game tonight, I would make a sign that said, WITTENBERG,[WOOSTER, and AKRON just to bring them Nightmares and bring back memories of earlier in the Season. ;) 

I do feel if Earlham wants to be a part of the top 3 in the NCAC this is a game they MUST win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 25, 2006, 10:56:56 AM
Quote from: earlhamalum on January 25, 2006, 10:33:02 AM
This might be odd, but I feel like this is the game of the week for the Quakers. 
Yeah, I'd say that is odd considering where EC has to play on Saturday. ;)  I understand your point though, EA.  This is a big game for the EC.  One thing that hasn't been brought up that I think could play an important factor is Earlham fighting the temptation of looking ahead to Wooster.  As was pointed out, Denison seems to be playing much better of late, and I'm sure the Big Red would love nothing more than to steal one away tonight.  I don't look for this to happen, but it is always a possibility when a big game is on the horizon.

As for Saturday's game, I just found out I won't be able to attend.  I get the honor of babysitting my 3 girls while my wife attends a baby shower.  Guess I'll just have to catch it on the tape delay if I can force myself not to listen to the game live.  Yeah right???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2006, 11:02:12 AM
Sorry, I misread, I think. At the TerrierDome, Hiram could pull it off...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 25, 2006, 11:12:16 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 25, 2006, 10:56:56 AM
As for Saturday's game, I just found out I won't be able to attend.  I get the honor of babysitting my 3 girls while my wife attends a baby shower.  Guess I'll just have to catch it on the tape delay if I can force myself not to listen to the game live. Yeah right???

Bring 'em to the game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 25, 2006, 04:41:39 PM
Here's hoping Wabash gets in the lead article on D3hoops.com for all the right reasons! 

Go Wabash!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2006, 04:52:27 PM
Oh, that would be so, so sweet to spoil Witt's #1 ranking on their own turf.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 25, 2006, 05:09:19 PM
oh that would be so sweet if i could see a close game for once at home besides against wooster. oh wait that is too much to ask for.

wittenberg 69, wabash 50 is my prediction
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2006, 05:23:05 PM
Here's a look at the national rankings in statistical categories for the top GL teams, from the NCAA stats website (through games of 1/22):

Scoring offense:
Wooster #5
Baldwin-Wallace #10
Carnegie Mellon #13
Hope #75
Albion, Witt not in top 100

Scoring defense:
Wittenberg #1
Hope #22
Albion #73
B-WC, CMU, COW not in top 100

Scoring margin:
Wooster #1
Hope #5
Wittenberg #6
Baldwin-Wallace #24
Carnegie Mellon #34
Albion #69

Field-Goal percentage:
Baldwin-Wallace #1
Wooster #3
Albion #38
Carnegie Mellon #39
Wittenberg #51
Hope not in top 100

Field-Goal percentage defense:
Wittenberg #3
Hope #17
Albion #88
B-WC, CMU, COW not in top 100

Three-point field goals per game:
Wooster #10
Albion, B-WC, CMU, Hope, Witt not in top 100

Three-point field goal percentage:
Wooster #2
Baldwin-Wallace #35
Wittenberg #46
Albion #56
Carnegie Mellon #64
Hope not in top 100

Free-Throw percentage:
Wittenberg #11
Baldwin-Wallace #18
Carnegie Mellon #94
Albion, Hope, COW not in top 100

Rebound margin:
Carnegie Mellon #6
Baldwin-Wallace #14
Albion #18
Wittenberg #23
Hope #39
Wooster #50
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 25, 2006, 06:02:12 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 25, 2006, 11:12:16 AM
Bring 'em to the game!

Easier said than done with 2 year old twins and a 6 month old.  Needless to say, I think I would have a better chance following the game on the radio than chasing the twins around Timken. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scotty on January 25, 2006, 06:11:37 PM
ScotsFan, are you sure your wife is coming back from the baby shower?...by the way, what will Wooster's tuition be in 16 years?...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 25, 2006, 06:52:46 PM
Scots up 43-30 at the half.  Missed the action as I just got tuned in.  Anybody have the rundown?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2006, 06:57:12 PM
Not much to tell, sounded pretty much like a yawner to me.  (Then again, I'm studying contract law while listening, so that might be having an effect.)  Doesn't sound like Wooster is shooting very well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 25, 2006, 06:58:51 PM
Thanks DC

Contract law huh...  sounds about as fun as havings ones wisdom teeth pulled  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 25, 2006, 07:06:47 PM
Sounds like Wooster is having an off night.  Sloppy play so far in the second half. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 25, 2006, 07:15:21 PM
Scots up 59-49 with 12+ to play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 25, 2006, 07:20:47 PM
Scots starting to heat up and are now up 75-56.  Vandervaart and Johnson are playing well right now- lots of steals leading to points.

Wooster is playing a more pound it inside game... not many 3's
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 25, 2006, 07:38:25 PM
Wooster up 76-60 with 2+to play. 

Wooster NOT having a good FT shotting night...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 25, 2006, 07:41:31 PM
Wooster wins an ugly game.  76-63
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scotty on January 25, 2006, 07:46:43 PM
no such thing as an ugly win as its like sex...some is just better than others...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 25, 2006, 07:46:49 PM
(If you enjoy women's basketball, don't read the following)

And now my rant.......

No broadcast for the Denison at Earlham game tonight as instead there is a Teamline broadcast of the Denison/Earlham women's game. I've kept my dark secret for too long....the truth comes out now. There is nothing in this world (war, crime, taxes) that I hate more than women's basketball. I get sick of seeing jump balls, whistles every five seconds and most of all watching mostly unskilled people ruining the game I love most. And now, on a night that I scheduled all of my activities around listening to Earlham try to continue its hot streak and move to 7-2 in league play, there is a Denison/Earlham women's game on instead.

Really, I'd love to see the radio ratings for Teamline between Earlham men's and women's games. Let me say, hardly anyone but Earlhamalum and Billy_Pilgrim ever listen to men's games......but as the lone D3Hoops.com posters for either EC men's and women's basketball, we need this coverage. I apologize for this rant and I apologize for not being able to provide any insight to a fairly important NCAC game tonight.

But I will not apologize for my hatred of women's basketball....and I go on record tonight in saying that I couldn't care less about what happens to the Earlham women's basketball team from this point on. I mainly hope they don't qualify for the NCAC tournament so that a similar such situation happens on quarterfinal night and Earlham feels compelled to broadcast a certain loss on that Tuesday.

Would be nice to follow a school like Wabash in this situation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 25, 2006, 07:50:49 PM
Witt smoking from the field in first couple of minutes 5-5 from the floor so far
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2006, 07:53:03 PM
It's funny - I like watching women play. When I did stats for the Women's Big 10 tournament I was quite impressed with the skill level, the hustle, and the flow of the women's game. I like that a lot better than the NBA for sure.  

I like covering girls' basketball as well - they show a lot of moxie and spirit that boys' teams sometimes don't have, and there are some very talented girls around here. Billy, I think you're hanging out in the wrong gyms.

And as a father with two daughters who are still young but may choose basketball as a path (well, one is just seven months old and the other likes dance but likes watching girls play basketball and watching college women on TV with me) then I thank God for Title IX so they have an opportunity to play sports and I have an opportunity to watch them!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on January 25, 2006, 07:54:11 PM
As us Wooster alums know, it's tough to get jacked up when you travel to Gambier for an early game...I'm assuming the girls played the "main event" tonight, haha. Anyway, I wondered what the new arena is like there??? During construction, the word was it was going to be pretty amazing, just wondered how big, how nice it really was. Good win Scots and get some rest before the Quakers...a sidenote...is Rehm & Galloway ever going to graduate??? Seems as if they've been there for 6 years.  I'm enjoying Joe Tait following up the broadcast on the web though!! GO CAVS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2006, 08:19:13 PM
I like D3 women's basketball becasue I like the enthusiasm.  The relative lack of skill (especially at Wooster this season) doesn't bother me much; if I were looking for the highest quality hoops I probably wouldn't be a D3 hoops fan in the first place.  But, to each his own. 

As I'm sure several folks will tell us, Witt leads Wabash at the half 32-21.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2006, 08:20:06 PM
Wabash 21
Witt 32  Halftime

Witt is beating Wabash the way the #1 team in the country should. It was as much as 17.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 25, 2006, 08:26:17 PM
Contacts coming through for me: Earlham up 31-25 at the half.

Smeds,

My hatred of women's sports is limited to basketball. My fiancee was a high school volleyball player and I went to watch her way back when often. I've always enjoyed watching women's swimming, and track and field in the Olympics. I also love women's tennis...but what man doesn't?

But my hatred of women's basketball goes way back. I think it mostly started when I was in high school and our conference (the Central Indiana Conference) became one of the leaders in gender equity. They set up the schedules so that all conference games (boys and girls) were played on weekend nights. This eliminated, for the most part, the classic double weekends that were so popular.

Similarly, my high school was one of the first to play girls games before boys games on a few occasions. The most annoying thing about playing in those situations was that our routines were thrown off...most notably, no boys were allowed on the floor before the girls varsity game. So, my customary pre-JV game shooting workout could not be completed. Once, awaiting the start of our varsity game, a few of us chauvanists decided to count all of the whistles (out of bounds turnovers, jump balls, fouls) during the first half of the girls game. There were 103 of them in 16 minutes of play.

I have other favorite stories, but I'll share just one more. One Saturday morning, our coach had other obligations so he sent me to sit in on his Saturday morning coaches show. For some reason, another high school's girls coach was there for the same show. He is the father of a current Purdue women's player and coached the area's most successful girls program (who regularly won games by scores of 75-19 and such). During the course of his interview, he said that he had always found girls games to be more entertaining and more fundamentally sound than boys games in the area. I did not know that the microphone placed in front of me was still turned on...I was later informed that my chuckle and "Are you kidding me?" comment was heard by more than just the coach sitting to my right.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 25, 2006, 08:42:06 PM
I have to agree with smeds.  I have a 2.5 year old, while she's not so much into sports yet (its all about dancing!) I'm glad she'll have lots of opportunities in teh future.

Have to say when of my fav womens' sprts to watch while at denison was women's rugby...  quite entertaining that!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2006, 08:42:53 PM
I like softball. But, then again, watching Cat Osterman all the time, who wouldn't?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 25, 2006, 08:45:57 PM
Any other updates around the NCAC? 

Witt is up by 13 with 12:19 left
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 25, 2006, 08:47:16 PM
50-47 Earlham with about 9 minutes left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 25, 2006, 08:59:05 PM
Was looking at the stats for the Woo-Kenyon game and Wooster only hit 19 of 35 FT's!  for 54.3 %   :-[

They were doing better in that department as of late but just couldn't knock'em down tonight.  They really need to improve, especially with some big games coming up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 25, 2006, 09:00:16 PM
What's happening with Earlham?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 25, 2006, 09:01:30 PM
Keep the updates coming Billy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 25, 2006, 09:06:40 PM
Hey, I'd love to have them.....and for the record, Earlham's women were down about 30 points with five minutes to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 25, 2006, 09:13:10 PM
Non- NCAC score but BW beat JCU 78-56.  Always like to see JCU get beat...  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 25, 2006, 09:14:05 PM
Good choice to broadcast the EC/DU women...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 25, 2006, 09:18:09 PM
Tremendous.

Denison rallies to beat Earlham, 72-66.

Still waiting on more details...but apparently Brandon Miller was injured and had to leave the game. Preliminary reports said he will be fine, but I'll work on getting more details later.

Losing a home game against Denison cost Earlham the #4 spot last year. Now this puts them back in that same #3, 4, 5 logjam. Wow, what a bad night....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 25, 2006, 09:21:20 PM
Wow - I was happy to hear that it was a 3 pt. ballgame inside 10 minutes.  Didn't see this one coming.  Any details are appreciated.  Huge win for the Big Red!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoBigRed on January 25, 2006, 09:26:18 PM
Miller is fine.

Hodgkinson fouled him out. Great game by Hodgekinson and an excellent win for the big red. Can you say bandwagon for GoBigRed and the Big Red. At 2-8 if you told me they'd be .500 at some point I'd laugh hysterically.

Good game fellas - let see how the momentum does against the Tigers.

Go Big Red!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 25, 2006, 09:31:09 PM
An UGLY game in Gambier tonight.  The Scots were awful from the field and from the line, didn't take many 3's and often seemed to be somewhat uninspired.  There were some streaks of good play, but not for any extended period of time.  Vandervaart looked especially good with 3 or 4 steals out front from the Kenyon guards, which he converted into a dunk, a missed dunk, and several missed FT's.  Once again the Scots were the victim of an intentional foul when Vandervaart had a breakaway, went up for the dunk only to get a 2-handed shove in his back.  They called the intentional, but that guy should have been out of the game.  If not by the refs then Croce should have done it.

Kenyon has a couple of good players.  Formato, of course, can shoot lights out.  Bediako, their center, had 7 blocked shots - several of the spectacular variety, but he didn't contribute much offensively.

Overall, I'm not too disappointed that the Scots struggled tonight.  I was afraid that with a big win that they might start to feel a little overconfident without Port and that Saturday's game would be a real danger.  Hopefully they'll keep their mind on the game, remember the OT game in Earlham, and make it a long ride back to Richmond for the Quakers.

Go Scots!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 25, 2006, 09:43:35 PM
Any Witt update?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2006, 09:45:50 PM
Witt won by 15, I forget the exact score.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 25, 2006, 09:46:31 PM
Witt 63  Wabash 48
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2006, 09:48:44 PM
Yeah.  Here's the box score (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/05-06statistics/witm0125.htm).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2006, 09:49:04 PM
Billy -

I seriously think you were in the wrong gyms - there are an awful lot of good girls high school players in Indiana where I live and they're a joy to watch.

I love the girls / boys doubleheaders. i think they're a neat way to showcase the programs and sometimes the girls outplay the boys, especially in hustle and verve. And I've seen a lot of sloppy boys games with plenty of turnovers this year - the girls don't have a monopoly on that.

Go watch Lebanon play - Maggie Boyer is a player and they are a true team that hustles from start to finish. Crawfordsville has a lot of great sophomores and freshmen. North Montgomery is really good. Attica has a player that could be better than Stephanie White. Twin Lakes has a great sophomore, Benton Central has a super freshman, and as always the Lafayette area has a great bunch of teams and players.

I think whatever your perception you had from your HS days isn't reality. The fans have really warmed to the girls / boys doubleheaders. And Southmont is actually featuring the girls on Friday and Saturday nights at times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2006, 09:50:06 PM
Now WHO was the one who said the Big Red would rise up to the level of last year???  ??? 8) :D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2006, 09:54:35 PM
The Wabash big men just vanished, it looks, and we needed them to compete with Witt.

Earlham's loss, though, helps Wabash in its quest to host an NCAC tourney game. With OWU and Earlham coming to Chadwick, I think that helps Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 25, 2006, 09:56:19 PM
Wooster 76, Kenyon 63

An ugly win by any measuring stick.  Kenyon's game plan, defensively, was to play tough and tight defense on the perimeter.  To a great extent it worked well, as they limited the Scots to only 15 three-point attempts, most of them not good open looks.  Wooster only made three, one each by Witucky, Cooper, and Johnson.

Wooster, though, thanks to this defensive scheme, was able to score inside, both with the post players and on penetration.  If they'd been able to make their free throws, they'd have won by 25.  However, they were a horrific 19-35 from the line.  Vandervaart and Will a combined 4-15. If Evan had put up a few more bricks, he might have broken the front of a spanking new rim.

Geeze, I just took another look at the boxscore. Wooster had only six (!!!) assists for the entire game!!!  That's hard to believe.  Don't you get any assist if you dish it into the postman and he scores?  Does the home bookkeeper get to determine what an assist is?

Kenyon's Formato (25 points on 10-16 shooting) is a nice player, much more than the jump shooter that I expected.  He's strong and quick, can get to the basket, and gave even Brandon Johnson some trouble.  But, he sure got away with lots of pushing off to clear space for himself, none of which was called until 10 minutes to go in the game.

Another cheap shot by an NCAC player as Vandervaart was going up for an open layup on a breakaway.  You could just see it coming, and I was really happy that he didn't go up for the jam as he could have.  Luckily, he was on his was up for the shot, pretty much under control, when he was shoved from behind.  For a change, the intentional foul was called.

To the referreeing crew, just on the off chance that you're able to read:  

You were pathetic.  Players were mauled going to the hoop, on both sides, and you stood there in silence.  A Kenyon player was literally run over at midcourt as the Wooster defender took the ball, and you ignored it.  Not calling these big collision fouls is preposterous.  The skills of the players on the court exceed your meager abilities tenfold.

On a positive note.  Seeing the new Kenyon College athletic facility alone was worth the trip.  It's spectacular, and real.  ::)  Almost all glass, inside and out, as you walk along the corridors and inside open spaces you can see all of the action on the tennis courts, track, basketball courts, or in the pool.  The gym where the varsity games are played is small, but state of the art.  And the game was even free, which almost made up for the $8 in gas for the round trip.  :)

PS - Just read imderekpoe's post which was posted as I was creating mine.  Really similar, but I'll post this anyway.  :)  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2006, 10:03:08 PM
If the glass walls extend to the locker rooms, I might become a big fan of Kenyon women's swimming!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2006, 10:17:59 PM
WooBoo -

The home stats crew determines the assists. Now yes, you get an assist if you pass to the postman and he scores without making any kind of move. But if he has to shake and shimmy, or do some fancy stuff - it's no assist. The pass must directly lead to a basket - without much of a move at all.

Except on a fast break - you can give an assist to the outlet man on a fast break if the man you pass to scores off the outlet pass. That's in the NCAA rule book, too.

And definitely it's not an assist if you get fouled in the act of shooting off of a pass and hit two free throws. I think the NCAA came down on a team in the NCAC for padding its assist totals a few years back.

Since I do the computer entry at Wabash, I have a pretty good idea that we do assists the right way. I know some schools give out assists like they were lollipops at a bank, and that's not right - but some schools are so tight with assists it's ridiculous. I know coach Petty had our SID look at the tape at least once this year to try to get assists corrected.

So stats crews out there in NCAC land - do your job. Get the assists right - don't give out gift assists but give the opponents their propers.

(I used to be the official scorer for the Indianapolis Ice in the IHL and CHL - now minor pro hockey players are the WORST when begging for unwarranted assists).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 25, 2006, 10:40:37 PM
Finally some stats from EC/Denison.

Big Red win the second half by 12, scoring 47 points in the final 20 minutes. That seems a lot like last year's game in Richmond when Denison rallied from a halftime deficit.

Hodgkinson was the story, scoring 27 and grabbing 11 rebounds. Denison was also 20/24 at the foul line.

Meanwhile, bad shooting for Earlham all around tonight. The big three (Jewett, Miller and Henry) combine 48 points. However, they shot 16-45 combined....ouch. Also causing major problems for Earlham....1/14 from 3-point land and 10-16 from the line in the second half.

So, Earlham still in 3rd place....but the dreaded Wooster and Wittenberg swing awaits. Again, second year in a row where Earlham loses a game at home to Denison with major hosting implications.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 25, 2006, 10:45:27 PM
Smed -

I've always wondered about parents who didn't consider the ramifications of the names that they gave their kids.  The nicknames that would inevitably be delved from them.  Geeze, if I'd known that I'd become WooBoo...  :-[  :)

Wooster certainly did a lot of one-on-one stuff tonight, and almost whenever they send the ball into the post Vandervaart or Will runs through fifteen seconds of moves before shooting.  Still, I'd have thought they had more than six assists.

DC - Better be careful with those comments.  Who knows if the NSA is monitoring DIII basketball forums these days...  ;)

Seriously, the whole pool area (but not the locker rooms, sorry), including the outside wall, is glass.  Olympic size, of course.  The whole thing really is beautiful.  

Steve Moore came over to talk to me before the game and our conversation drifted to the new facility.  I asked him what he knew about the possibility of Wooster adding to or improving theirs and he said that fund-raising would probably begin in 2007.  One thing he said that needed to definitely be done was to replace the bleachers in the gym as they're 30 years old and becoming difficult to move in and out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2006, 10:52:54 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 25, 2006, 10:45:27 PMDC - Better be careful with those comments.  Who knows if the NSA is monitoring DIII basketball forums these days...  ;)

Well, if you were to believe the Bush administration (heh) then unless your name was "WooQaeda" it wouldn't be monitored.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2006, 10:55:23 PM
Believe you me, I'm already on THE LIST.   :-\  And damn proud of it.  ;D

Other scores from around the conference, if that's of any interest to the NSA:

Allegheny 86
Hiram 76

Ohio Wesleyan 90
Oberlin 51
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on January 25, 2006, 11:13:36 PM
WooBoo,

You should be happy with your nickname, I have been called DD and even Double D.  How would you like to be called Double D?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2006, 11:14:32 PM
Quote from: DarkSide-D on January 25, 2006, 11:13:36 PM
WooBoo,

You should be happy with your nickname, I have been called DD and even Double D.  How would you like to be called Double D?

That makes me think of Kenyon's swim team again.... ::) :P :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on January 25, 2006, 11:25:01 PM
Ahhh, girl swimmers.  That reminds me of the day I went into the weight room and there was a girl swimmer who benched more than some of our DB's.   Yeah, those guys never lived that one down!! :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 25, 2006, 11:52:56 PM
tonights game vs wabash was pretty much in control after the first couple of minutes when witt went up by 10. from that point it seemed as if any wabash hope went up in flames and witt just pretty much cruised from there

one point of concern-witts big men and shooters did have a very off night, so if an off night causes them to still win by 15, watch out.

another revenge game coming this saturday-denison watch out witt will be out for blood
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2006, 12:45:25 AM
Wooster-Kenyon box score (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/stats.php).

I see that freshman guard Sam Dumpe (6'3", Beaver, PA) saw his first action of his career tonight picking up 3 mintes of statistic-free action.  I presume this was garbage time.  Jamie Yoder and Jeff Stevens also got into the end of the game, as usual but their normal last-act compatriots, Brad Chisnell and Cody Drake, never left the bench (if indeed they were present at all.)  Should we read anything into this? 

Just in case any lurkers are wondering, here's the composition of Wooster's team by role and class (note: I count Tom Port as a 'starter' and Evan Will as a 'key reserve'):
* Starters:  2 seniors (1 of whom has another year of eligibility remaining); 2 juniors; 1 sophomore
* Key reserves:  2 sophomores, 2 freshmen
* End of the bench:  1 junior, 3 sophomores, 1 freshman (Dumpe)

Three starters (or four, depending on Tom Port), and seven (or eight) from the 9-man rotation, should return next season.  And there's always a freshman or two in the mix.

This Wooster program is really a machine with no glaring weaknesses.  There's just never a let-up.  I don't know if I've mentioned it in here, but since D3hoops.com has run a poll (beginning with the 1999-00 season), Wooster has received votes in every poll, and has been ranked (25th or higher) an astonishing 94 times (in 102 polls.)  They've been in the top ten 72 times, including the past 32 weeks in a row.  All of these statistics are tops in the D3 world. 

We Wooster fans really have an incredible team to cheer on.  The only thing missing is the banner.  But who knows, maybe this is the year for that, too!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on January 26, 2006, 01:10:09 AM
DC, that's a crazy stat!! It really shows how far this program has come at Wooster, of course, none of that would have been possible if it weren't for the huge successes to the "pre-D3hoops.com" era. As for all of the reserves not playing tonight...I can see no logical explanation except for maybe that they were at a JV contest instead. Sometimes that occasionally happens during some lesser-quality NCAC contests. I just don't see Cody & The Blade being in the doghouse for anything, both quality guys. I never heard Breck mention Dumpe's name on the broadcast, it must've been statistic-free action, but good luck Sam...represent for the gray team!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 26, 2006, 01:28:10 AM
DC -

I'm going to go out on a limb and guess that the boxscore is wrong about Dumpe's playing.  I sat right behind the bench and was paying even more attention to the subbing than I normally do.  Not that I would recognize him, or even know who he is, but I'm thinking that I'd at least recognize an unfamiliar face on the court; or even on the bench.  :) 

But I don't believe that anyone got in during the short period of garbage time except for Jamie Yoder.  Stevens got his two minutes earlier, when the game was still being semi-contested.  Not sure when, exactly, but probably around the middle of the second half.

There wasn't a JV game (afterwards there was a women's game between Kenyon and Hiram), and Chisnell, Drake, et al were in their normal positions at the end of the pine.  Garbage time was very limited tonight.  Although the outcome was never really in doubt, even when the lead was cut to seven at some point in the second half, Wooster never could quite shake Kenyon as you would think that they should have.  Port's absence was felt, the free throw shooting was awful, and the game was just downright sloppy, aided by the officiating which was moreso.

I think that Coach Moore was just not happy with the team's performance, so he kept the regular rotation on the court for nearly the whole game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 26, 2006, 08:14:36 AM
For what its worth, my QOWI calculations for the top 6 teams in the region, after last night's games:

1.  Wittenberg - 10.643
2.  Albion - 10.750
2.  Baldwin-Wallace - 10.750
4.  Wooster - 10.643
5.  Carnegie-Mellon - 10.545
6.  Hope - 9.900
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 26, 2006, 10:46:41 AM
GO BIG RED!!

Oh look again.......played 8 guys and OH what happened?  They won again.

I am sad it took Ghiloni soooooo long to figure it out.  But I will be the first to give him credit.  He did!!

Hodgkinson stepped up and had a HUGE game.  Hern was in the tank and was a non-factor. 

I found Coach Justus's quote interesting...He said " they didn't respond to their physical defensive play".   Now come on...when was the last time Denison out musseled anyone??  Big bad bullys from Granville!!  I like it!!

Great win for the team and certainly makes home field advantage in the playoffs a possibility.

Witt next!!!  I am not taking any bets on that one.

GO BIG RED
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2006, 12:00:50 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on January 26, 2006, 10:46:41 AM
Oh look again.......played 8 guys and OH what happened?  They won again.

I am sad it took Ghiloni soooooo long to figure it out.  But I will be the first to give him credit.  He did!!

Actually, you're about the last to give him credit.  While you were busy spending December dumping on Ghiloni because he wasn't giving your preferred player(s) enough minutes, most others figured that Denison was playing a schedule out of their league and after NCAC play got into full swing, they'd be about where they are now (smeds was on the forefront of this point).  There's not much surprising to see Denison where they are currently.  I don't think people saw last night's result coming, but Earlham was due for one of those games where they play down to a team they should beat easily and come up short. 

Quote from: DenisonFan on January 26, 2006, 10:46:41 AM
Great win for the team and certainly makes home field advantage in the playoffs a possibility.

It's still early, but I think Denison is on the outside looking in for the fourth seed.  Denison needs one more win either at Wabash or against Earlham the second time around to place themselves in a good tiebreaker situation.  Should they lose to Wabash, Denison will be dominated by both OWU and Wabash in the tiebreak and will need to finish a full game ahead of both to get a home game, which won't likely happen.  If, however, Denison can sweep Earlham and beat Wabash at home, they'll be looking at 11-5 and have some favorable tiebreaks should they slip against another team.  But that's a tall task.  I'd take solace in having finished high enough to to avoid Witt/Woo in the first round and at least having a chance to advance to the semis. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 26, 2006, 12:40:18 PM
And Memphis is back.  :o

I guess my joke about DC having more name changes than Mellencamp was a bit premature.  :D

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 26, 2006, 12:44:47 PM
A little late but some comments on Kenyon-Wooster

The new facility is going to be a great recruiting tool for Kenyon. There were a large number of loyal Wooster supporters there last night and I could see the envy in their eyes. I think that whatever upgrade plans Wooster has will be pressured to be speed up.

While there are always specific calls (or no calls) in a game that frustrate fans, I agree with an earlier post that as a whole this was about the poorest called game I have seen all season. First, no call maulings as guards drove to the baskest, then ticky tack fouls in the post. Also saw numerous times when the referee who was in position to make a call didn't but the one on the other side, with a supposedly blocked view did.

Finally, but most important is the break away intentional foul I saw last night. Fortunatley Vandervaart didn't attempt a dunk on that play or he could have been seriously hurt.  The Kenyon player (#23 Jolson) pushed Vandervaart in the back with BOTH hands as he went for the layup. This can not be tolerated. Is there not a method for the league to review these plays a hand out post game suspensions like the NFL does?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 26, 2006, 12:57:53 PM
Excuse the poor spelling... the word is muscled not musseled.  :-)

Either way, I didn't know Denison players were such thugs!!  I LIKE IT!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2006, 01:50:39 PM
Isn't the real crime here that the NCAC even makes Wooster go play at places like Kenyon and Hiram?  Not only do the Scots have to take time out of their schedules to make the bus trip to the far reaches of northeastern Ohio, but then they actually have suit up to play against these teams and put their health at risk...nonsense.  There needs to be an investigation.   ::)

I'm sensing some hypersensitivite reactions to hard fouls here...likely because of what happened to Port.  Hard fouls happen.  Sometimes basketball is a physical game.  Sometimes players get injured because of this.  I won't deny that shoving a guy in the back as he's shooting a layup (if that's an accurate description of the play...sometimes we homers have a tendency to make a hard foul sound like attempted homicide) is probably not necessary, but calling for the league to suspend a player because of it is a bit much.  Was there intent to injure?  I'm doubting it.  More likely is that the kid was playing hard and got a little too aggressive.  I'm sure a Wooster player has never committed a hard foul. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 26, 2006, 02:00:59 PM
Wally - this was a 2-handed push in the back while the player was in the air.  There was absolutely no effort to block the shot or steal the ball at all, and the ref didn't hesitate in making the intentional call.  I don't think that I'd go so far as to say that he was trying to hurt Vandervaart, but the kid has to be aware of the potential ramifications of that kind of play, and needs to pull off when there's no chance of making a play on the ball.

IMO, there is no place in the game for this type of play or the player that would make it.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2006, 02:14:30 PM
I've seen similar plays in high school this year - sure it's an intentional foul - but put the torches down. It happens.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 26, 2006, 03:45:12 PM
I was sitting about thirty feet from this foul.  Only a couple of players on the court and those players on the Wooster bench had a better view.  The foul was deliberate.  That means the player did it on purpose, it was a conscious decision.  He knew he had no chance to stop the shot, yet chose to shove Vandervaart in the back while he was in the air.  And this wasn't a split-second decision.  He'd been chasing Vandervaart for a few strides, realized he couldn't contest the shot, and chose to do what he did.  You could almost see it coming, see his thought process.  Whether or not he hoped to injure Vandervaart (and I'm sure that he didn't) is completely irrellevant.  He could have.

When you say that these types of fouls "happen" it appears as if you're apologizing for the player's behavior.  Accidential hard fouls "happen" and we understand that.  Deliberate, conscious, on-purpose fouls don't just "happen", they are the result of deliberate behaviour, and they shouldn't be tolerated.

I'm not saying this guy should have been ejected or that he should be suspended.  He was lucky, in this situation, as Vandervaart was able to mostly keep his balance.  But had Vandervaart been higher in the air, been attempting to dunk, and this kid had made the same conscious decision, he then should have been barred for the rest of the season.  And if I was his coach, I would condone that decision.  Or toss him from the team myself.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2006, 04:01:16 PM
Kick the kid off the team?  This is way over the top.  The kid made a dumb foul.  He got called for an intentional foul, Wooster probably got about 18 foul shots out of the deal (not that Wooster was making foul shots last night anyway) and got the ball right back.  Isn't that plenty of penalty for a dumb foul? 

"But Tim could have been seriously hurt..."  Tim could get seriously hurt by any number of things in the game of basketball including but not limited to: diving around on the floor for a loose ball, jumping around for rebounds, jockeying for post postions....I've seen players get hurt under all of these scenarios, none of which are particularly nefarious.  Should players clear away from Wooster's post men when balls are in the air to be rebounded?  I'd hate for a Wooster player to come down on somebody's foot and badly twist or sprain a knee or ankle. 

It sounds to me like Kenyon's player made a stupid foul.  Why come down so hard on him like this?  Until there's evidence that there was intent to injure, this goes down as a stupid foul (and I'm guessing that he's been told as much, several times, by somebody on his coaching staff). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2006, 04:02:21 PM
I'm not condoning anything - and your inference that I am is disturbing. I'm just saying that I see a type of contact like this a few times a year - and it's not malicious in nature. It looks bad because of the circumstance or happenstance, but the player may be honestly trying to prevent an easy two - and gets a little carried away with adrenalin.

Or the player on defense does think he can contest the shot, and really can't, and his effort and momentum carries him into the player from behind. Lots of players have hubris that they can get there when they can't.

In fact, the high school game I covered on Friday a player went up for a layin and was pushed from behind. There was an awkward landing, but all was OK. The ref was too chicken to call an intentional foul against the home team.

The correct call is an intentional foul. That's why they have the intentional foul rule in the book. Two shots, ball out of bounds. Everyone shakes hands. No need to get draconian on the kid -  again it happens and it's usually not malicious.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 26, 2006, 04:26:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 26, 2006, 03:45:12 PM
I'm not saying this guy should have been ejected or that he should be suspended. He was lucky, in this situation, as Vandervaart was able to mostly keep his balance. But had Vandervaart been higher in the air, been attempting to dunk, and this kid had made the same conscious decision, he then should have been barred for the rest of the season. And if I was his coach, I would condone that decision. Or toss him from the team myself.

Read what I wrote, Wally.  I said that he shouldn't have been ejected or suspended for yesterday's foul.  I said that he should had it been of a more serious nature.

Quote from: wally_wabash on January 26, 2006, 04:01:16 PM
"But Tim could have been seriously hurt..." Tim could get seriously hurt by any number of things in the game of basketball including but not limited to: diving around on the floor for a loose ball, jumping around for rebounds, jockeying for post postions....I've seen players get hurt under all of these scenarios, none of which are particularly nefarious. Should players clear away from Wooster's post men when balls are in the air to be rebounded? I'd hate for a Wooster player to come down on somebody's foot and badly twist or sprain a knee or ankle.

I simply can't understand how you can't see the difference between the normal rough activity in the game (as you describe above) and the type of deliberate foul that I've described.  If the former leads to injuries, so be it, it's an intrinsic part of the game, and it "happens". The latter, despite what you seem to think,  does not have to be part of the game, it should be better controlled, and those players who chose to continue to deal out that sort of deliberate and dangerous foul should be punished.

Smedindy -

Quote from: smedindy on January 26, 2006, 04:02:21 PM
Or the player on defense does think he can contest the shot, and really can't, and his effort and momentum carries him into the player from behind.

I was there.  The player's momentum and effort did not carry him into the shooter.  He deliberately shoved him.  Was it malicious?  No.  Does that matter?  HELL no, because that doesn't make what he did any less dangerous.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 26, 2006, 04:40:44 PM
WooBoo/Wally/Smeds - I said that he should have been tossed, and I still think so.  I think a suspension could be proper after careful review of the tapes and that kind of a decision shouldn't be made just after watching it live.  He probably should only be suspended if it looks like there was intent to injure, which I don't think was the case here.

I agree with WoosterBooster that there's a huge difference between agressive play that's part of the game, and deliberately shoving someone in the back.  People do get hurt as part of the game.  Bryan Nelson's ankle injury a few years ago may have cost the Scots a national championship, but that's part of the game and so be it.  Just because Vandervaart didn't get hurt doesn't change the play or make it in any way more acceptable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2006, 04:49:57 PM
Realistically, you could call intentional fouls all day in the last stages of a contest, for shoves, pushes, and all kinds of things.

WooBoo - I think you're chopping my thoughts up too much and taking things way out of context. Please read my entire posts and not cherry pick and quote things to dispute. I was also talking in hypotheticals. We don't know what the true intent was, but to denigrate a kid for something that I see every so often in the course of a basketball season is a little extreme.

And yes I know you were there but I was at a lot of games too where similar things happened, and a lynch mob didn't break out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 26, 2006, 05:15:38 PM
If only we could get a quote from the Kenyon player to clarify the situation ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 26, 2006, 06:21:57 PM
Does no one have anything to say about those physical bullys from Granville??
Talk about the Charles Oakley of the NCAC.  :-)  They just maul teams!!

If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen.  (just kidding)

In the heat of battle players do dumb stuff.  It happens.  It is part of the game.  It doesn't make it right, but it happens.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 26, 2006, 06:35:57 PM
DF,

I think you're taking Justus' quote way out of context.

I hardly think he was saying that Denison's players were thugs.....we've had those thug discussions on this board in the past.

In fact, let's look at it lifted straight from the SID release.

"Denison came ready to play," Earlham coach Jeff Justus said. "We didn't respond to their physical defensive play."

I think saying a team is ready to play and playing physical defense is quite a compliment. Knowing Justus pretty well, I'm sure he was inferring that Denison didn't back down on the defensive end and forced Earlham to run its offense farther away from the basket.

Again, that's a compliment. But, make of it what you will. You've let known your half-brained assertions and conclusions throughout the season, so I'm sure you'll keep on with this one.

But I restate, in no place did anyone say Denison played like thugs...just that they played physical defense, something they haven't played any of over the course of the past three seasons against Earlham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2006, 06:51:25 PM
There's a yawning chasm between physical defense and thuggery.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 26, 2006, 07:21:17 PM
Anybody who defends the type of foul that Jolson committed as something that is "just part of the game" is not a true basketball fan. It was never part of the game.

In soccer if you take out a player from behind with no intent to play the ball - you are gone. Its in the rules. In high school the suspension is two games. That sport has it right.

Giving the fouled team an extra possesion for a dangerous foul is not enough.  A team could be down twenty points (as was the case at Hiram) and there is little cost. There needs to be more personal accountability and a suspension is appropriate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scotty on January 26, 2006, 07:41:38 PM
got an idea...lets all wait until a player gets really hurt, lets say paralyzed or so...then we can have an honest discussion...guys, this aint the NBA its college and more importantly its D3...you can be aggressive without being aggressive...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2006, 07:49:12 PM
There seems to be a big rush to judgement, though, on the part of Wooster fans, to tar and feather a kid for what has been described, as I read it, a foul that I've seen a few times a year in various games at all levels.

The intentional foul penalty works just fine. It seemed to be different than the Pfouts foul. We have jaundiced-eye views of it.

Bodies fly through the air - someone is trying to stop points from being scored - it happens. Like I said, the same thing happened seemingly at a high school game Friday night and no intentional foul was called. The ref said he tried for the ball, even though he had to go through a players' back for it. I sure thought it warranted an intentional foul, yes, but a suspension? Come on.


And of course, it's a long way from 'it happens' to 'it's a part of the game and should be sacrosanct' - some of you are really stretching things out of context.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on January 26, 2006, 07:53:08 PM
How bout we get down to business. Only 2 good games happen in the ncac every year and one is about to go down at the HPER center in less than 10 days. As a Wooster fan I have to admit that I am a little apprehensive about this game. Witt is a solid team from top to bottom and near impossible to beat at home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2006, 07:59:50 PM
Ahem.

Better watch that provincialism there. It's disingenuous to say the other 8 teams aren't capable at all of creating 'good' games.

I would contend, that while it does not feature top teams, that the Kenyon - Hiram game this year was a 'good' game. A close contest, with 12 ties and 10 lead changes, decent shooting, and not many turnovers, plus a game winning shot at the buzzer. Now that's a 'good' game and would be good no matter who was playing.

A friend of mine who refs says that he sometimes likes doing games with two struggling teams because they're close and both teams think they can win so they really try hard.

And lest we forget the many battles that Wabash has had (Ok, not this year) with Witt and Wooster in the past at Chadwick. Mind you, they've always gone to the visitor, but the games have been tight, taut, and well played.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 26, 2006, 08:07:43 PM
Quote from: WoosterBNel on January 26, 2006, 07:53:08 PM
How bout we get down to business. Only 2 good games happen in the ncac every year and one is about to go down at the HPER center in less than 10 days. As a Wooster fan I have to admit that I am a little apprehensive about this game. Witt is a solid team from top to bottom and near impossible to beat at home.

I agree with Smeds.  Lets not be so quick to write everyone else off.  There are many good games every year, just not many for first place.  But as pointed out, Wabash, Earlham, and Allegheny have given both Wooster and Witt all they could handle from time to time.  And lets not forget that Denison beat Witt just last year. 

Lets also not forget that both Wooster and Witt have 2 games to play before the big one next weekend.  The Scots play Earlham, who took them to OT earlier this year.  And this time the Scots probably won't have one of their best players in the lineup. 

While I'm as anxious as anyone for next Saturday, I'll hold off getting too excited until both Wooster and Witt have knocked off Earlham (if they do!) this week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 26, 2006, 08:20:36 PM
Smedindy -

You certainly have a strong opinion on something that you didn't even see.  You keep comparing it to a foul, or fouls, that you have seen.  How on earth is this possible?

I don't know how to describe the foul that I saw better than I already have.  It WAS intentional.  It was NOT accidental.  It was NOT malicious.  It WAS possibly dangerous.  Bodies were NOT flying through the air, only Vandervaart was airborne.  The Kenyon player pulled up behind Vandervaart, and while on the ground, shoved him.

Three or four guys on this forum alone saw it, and all have basically the same take on it.  Yet you, who did not, continue to say that we're wrong.

I don't ever dispute what you've seen at Wabash games.  Why won't you take our word about what we saw and understand that maybe this was NOT similar to the incidents that you've been seeing.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scotty on January 26, 2006, 08:27:33 PM
Wooster Booster, it is the fraternity of Brotherhood that binds him...it seems like anything successful is a rallying point...

by the way, whats up with the Juco Amish/Nazarene baseball transfers at Woo...ESPN is waiting for the story...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 26, 2006, 10:24:39 PM
Until there is a rule for "malicious foul" then we're going to have to accept that "intentional foul" is as good as it gets. No one has disputed that this foul was "intentional". The contact is intentional, the injury isn't. I think that's intuitive.

Intentional fouls get called, there's two free throws, you get the ball back, but no one gets sent to Death Row.

This foul almost, and certainly could have, caused a serious injury. But it didn't.

There are all kinds of instances where "almost" doing something is treated completely differently from actually doing something.

If I take my trusty .38 and shoot at a cop and miss I will go to prison. If I shoot at the cop and kill him I get The Needle. "Almost" and "did" are two completely different things with two completely different consequences.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 26, 2006, 10:46:13 PM
I just have to wonder if a Wooster player committed the same type of foul if all of the Wooster people would be calling for ejections and suspensions for that player.  I highly doubt it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 26, 2006, 10:50:48 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 25, 2006, 11:14:32 PM
Quote from: DarkSide-D on January 25, 2006, 11:13:36 PM
WooBoo,

You should be happy with your nickname, I have been called DD and even Double D.  How would you like to be called Double D?

That makes me think of Kenyon's swim team again.... ::) :P :D

Too much drag DC.

Women's swimming makes me think of Summer Sanders.  :o :P :-* ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 26, 2006, 10:56:34 PM
"I'm sensing some hypersensitivite reactions..."

From Wooster folk......nah never happens, they handled the Albion/Wooster game with............ah well nevermind.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on January 26, 2006, 10:57:57 PM
Weighing in belatedly on last weekend's Witt-Allegheny game.  POW considerations for Dane Borchers were largely ignored, probably due to lack of Wittenberg involvement on this board, but 29 points, 10 boards (6 offensive) and 9-for-9 from the charity stripe can hardly be disregarded.  This kid carried Witt on his back in a game where the hosts came out hungry for respect against the #1 team in the nation, and Dan Russ was never a factor (although he had one of the most amazingly athletic moves for a bucket I've ever seen a 6'9" D3 player make.)  It was an incredibly physical game, and Allegheny came up big, with great 3-point shooting in the first half, and forcing Witt to miss numerous lay-ups and gimme's.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2006, 11:04:22 PM
Quote from: drt on January 26, 2006, 10:57:57 PM
Weighing in belatedly on last weekend's Witt-Allegheny game.  POW considerations for Dane Borchers were largely ignored, probably due to lack of Wittenberg involvement on this board, but 29 points, 10 boards (6 offensive) and 9-for-9 from the charity stripe can hardly be disregarded.  This kid carried Witt on his back in a game where the hosts came out hungry for respect against the #1 team in the nation, and Dan Russ was never a factor (although he had one of the most amazingly athletic moves for a bucket I've ever seen a 6'9" D3 player make.)  It was an incredibly physical game, and Allegheny came up big, with great 3-point shooting in the first half, and forcing Witt to miss numerous lay-ups and gimme's.

I don't think the Week for which Borchers might be the Player (of) has finished yet; I think he's a candidate for this go-'round (although his stat line against Wabash might knock him out of contention--the NCAC seems to like back-to-back big stat line games.)  But I was all over Borchers in my commentary of the Witt/'Gheny game, so it's not really accurate to say he was 'ignored' in here.

Or am I just being another hypersensitive Wooster fan?  ??? :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 26, 2006, 11:13:45 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on January 26, 2006, 10:46:13 PM
I just have to wonder if a Wooster player committed the same type of foul if all of the Wooster people would be calling for ejections and suspensions for that player.  I highly doubt it.

Screw you, too, Wittenbastard.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2006, 11:17:47 PM
Whoa, big fella!  Let's see if we can keep the flagrant fouls confined to the gymnasium.  We don't want any ejections or suspensions in here!  :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 26, 2006, 11:20:50 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 26, 2006, 11:13:45 PMScrew you, too, Wittenbastard.

I'm thinking there's an answer to jscwittfan's question in there somewhere.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 26, 2006, 11:23:44 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 26, 2006, 11:13:45 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on January 26, 2006, 10:46:13 PM
I just have to wonder if a Wooster player committed the same type of foul if all of the Wooster people would be calling for ejections and suspensions for that player.  I highly doubt it.

Screw you, too, Wittenbastard.

Well, I think that proves my point.  You guys can feel free to gang up and dump the criticism on everybody else when something bad happens to your players and anyone who even tries to defend those "bad" actions, but anytime somebody brings up even a question about something that would put Wooster in a negative light, we get responses such as this one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2006, 11:27:37 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 26, 2006, 08:20:36 PM
Three or four guys on this forum alone saw it, and all have basically the same take on it.  Yet you, who did not, continue to say that we're wrong.

Those three or four guys saw the incident through Black and Gold colored glasses.  Anybody who sees a player from their team take an intentional foul of any kind, particularly of the kind described, and even more particularly in the immediate wake of having another one of the team's players hurt by a similar foul is going to see the thing as being way more underhanded, dirty, and malicious than it actually was.  That's just human nature...and that's the point I'm making.  When you apply the correction factor for homerism, the end result is a dumb, hard foul that deservedly received the intentional foul call.  I would guess that the offending player got an earful about using his head in the future.   Just as likely is that the player knew he screwed up as soon as it happened.  There's no need to pile on.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 26, 2006, 11:40:49 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on January 26, 2006, 10:46:13 PM
I just have to wonder if a Wooster player committed the same type of foul if all of the Wooster people would be calling for ejections and suspensions for that player.  I highly doubt it.

Your remark insults my integrity.  I'd have been exactly as upset if a Wooster player committed such a foul.  Not that I'd expect someone who would make a remark such as yours to believe that.

So, again, screw you.

And screw you, too, Wally, and the rest of you Wabash idiots.  You have no ****ing idea what you're talking about.  NONE of you were there, period.  You didn't see what happened, yet you all have a complete ****ing understanding of exactly how it went down, and exactly why I (and others) feel as I do.  All that proves to me is that you're a bunch of loudmouth assholes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 26, 2006, 11:44:00 PM
Quote from: sac on January 26, 2006, 10:56:34 PM
"I'm sensing some hypersensitivite reactions..."

From Wooster folk......nah never happens, they handled the Albion/Wooster game with............ah well nevermind.  ;)


Sac -- Given your tasteless post, I now would love to see Hope make the NCAA tournament, play a tight ball game on the road, go down to the very end of the game and then have your beloved Dutchmen lose the game on an atrocious call by a referee with several guys all jumping together for a rebound in the last 3 seconds.

When that happens....guaranteed, I will post a big hypersensitive note to all the screaming Hope fans on the MIAA board, with a dumb wink included!!!  ;D ??? :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2006, 11:46:24 PM
I think somebody needs a nap. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2006, 11:48:33 PM
Remember what I have said, because some people are not reading along.

1. This kind of foul happens in games. Not all of the time, not some of the time, but it happens - that's a fact.
2. This kind of foul warrants an intentional foul call. And that call was made.
3. This kind of foul does not warrant a suspension - nor is it a blight on the game.

I don't understand the commotion - unless people are reading into what I'm saying that's different? WooBoo - you act like I'm condoning it - I'm not. These fouls happen and you all acted like it was the Hiram foul all over again.

However, because some people can't read and infer into my posts - and now they feel they must denigrate and insult people - that's caused me to lose respect for a couple of people that I before now I had valued and treasured their insight - all because they chose not to read the words I was posting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 26, 2006, 11:50:41 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 26, 2006, 11:40:49 PMAll that proves to me is that you're a bunch of loudmouth assholes.

Let me get this straight....you tell jscwittfan "screw you", twice. Tell Wally, "screw you" and the rest of us "idiots", throw in a couple of f-bombs, and then call us assholes.

And WE are the loudmouths?

Man, I wish it was OAC vs. NCAC in football again. Those conversations seem productive by comparison.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2006, 11:51:52 PM
Oh WooScotsFan -

"Here you go again."

Can't even take a joke? Yeesh!

Remember, that game was not lost on one play, and, gasp, even other Wooster fans admitted it. Because any play made in another direction can change the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2006, 11:52:47 PM
QuoteMan, I wish it was OAC vs. NCAC in football again. Those conversations seem productive by comparison.

Ah, the thing is we KNOW that enemy, and know what buttons to push with those maroons!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 26, 2006, 11:54:25 PM
Well, apparantly there's another button labeled "intentional fouls".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2006, 11:58:59 PM
Well, intentional fouls, on the road, versus an overmatched opponent, against a star player, committed by a scrubnee.

Alas, though, when Wabash goes to the NCAC tourney, it needs a compound fracture to draw a foul. But I don't want to be perceived as hypersensitive, nor bring anything up from the past... ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 27, 2006, 12:04:30 AM
Yes, Wooster fans tend to be somewhat sensitive about their team.  We think our team is the best, finest, smartest, cleanest bunch of All-American Boys this side of Hudson High.  And that's good.

Where the problem comes in is what I think of as the "echo" effect.  Someone will make a point, generally civilly and within reasonable bounds, but as others reinforce it, they tend to push it out towards the extreme.  This is only human nature; there's no point is just repeating what someone else has already said.  With so many Wooster fans posting in here, this sort of effect is bound to happen.

Then when the inevitable counter-comment comes in, it just forces the Wooster folks to gird their loins and vigorously defend their position, which causes the non-Wooster commentators to step up the rhetoric, and back and forth we go until, sometimes (like tonight, or more particularly after the Albion game) it goes over the line.

Here's where this argument was yesterday evening:

POINT:
Quote from: imderekpoeOnce again the Scots were the victim of an intentional foul when Vandervaart had a breakaway, went up for the dunk only to get a 2-handed shove in his back.  They called the intentional, but that guy should have been out of the game.  If not by the refs then Croce should have done it.

This was followed by posts by Woster Booster (who called it a "cheap shot") and goscots ("Vandervaart...could have been seriously hurt. [...] This cannot be tolerated.") that basically reinforced imderekpoe's point, but pushed it out a little further.

COUNTERPOINT:
Quote from: wally wabashI'm sensing some hypersensitivite reactions to hard fouls here...likely because of what happened to Port.  Hard fouls happen.  Sometimes basketball is a physical game.  Sometimes players get injured because of this.  I won't deny that shoving a guy in the back as he's shooting a layup (if that's an accurate description of the play...sometimes we homers have a tendency to make a hard foul sound like attempted homicide) is probably not necessary, but calling for the league to suspend a player because of it is a bit much.  Was there intent to injure?  I'm doubting it.  More likely is that the kid was playing hard and got a little too aggressive.  I'm sure a Wooster player has never  committed a hard foul.
A little snippy, perhaps, but a reasonable response.

This brings an immediate response from imderekpoe, which includes this line: "IMO, there is no place in the game for this type of play or the player that would make it."  He probably meant that the player should have ben ejected, which was his original point, but it was immediately read to as "suspension."  Smedindy immediately replies that "t happens" and we should "put the torches down."  I'm not sure where the "torches" came from, but this post certainly lit a fire, and the rhetoric began to escalate even more rapidly.

Then we get to the entirely unhelpful observation that Wooster fans never complain when their own players commit hard fouls.  Well, duh!  Do Witt fans complain about their players?  Who does do this (besides DenisonFan?)  This post was clearly intended to pour gasoline on the fire, and it sure worked.

I guess my point here is that there is blame to go around, including blame that can be assigned to the environment of this chat room.  And maybe we all need to take a step back and take a breath.

Please note that I haven't taken any position on the foul itself (or the previous foul at Hiram), since I was not there to see it myself.  I see no reason to doubt the initial observations of the folks who were there, tempering them a bit due to the Wooster bias and open wound inflicted at Hiram.  In other words, he shouldn't oughta have done it, he deserved the intentional foul call, and I'm glad nobody got hurt.  End of story.

Of course, in the time it took me to write this, another nine posts or so have come up.   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 27, 2006, 12:04:49 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan
I just have to wonder if a Wooster player committed the same type of foul if all of the Wooster people would be calling for ejections and suspensions for that player.  I highly doubt it.

It's real easy to act high and mighty when your best player didn't go down as a result of a dirty play. Let's play hypothetical and say this same thing happened to Russ or Borchers?  I highly doubt that Witt fan's reaction would be much different than how Wooster fan's have been reacting!

Quote from: wally_wabash on January 26, 2006, 11:27:37 PM

Those three or four guys saw the incident through Black and Gold colored glasses.  

Actually, according to smedindy, I believe they were the more popular jaundiced-eye view. ::)

Quote from: wally_wabash on January 26, 2006, 11:27:37 PM

Anybody who sees a player from their team take an intentional foul of any kind, particularly of the kind described, and even more particularly in the immediate wake of having another one of the team's players hurt by a similar foul is going to see the thing as being way more underhanded, dirty, and malicious than it actually was.  That's just human nature...and that's the point I'm making.  When you apply the correction factor for homerism, the end result is a dumb, hard foul that deservedly received the intentional foul call.  I would guess that the offending player got an earful about using his head in the future.   Just as likely is that the player knew he screwed up as soon as it happened.  There's no need to pile on.  

I do have to agree with Wally here.  I think this foul, was more a result of bad timing, more than anything.  I'm not condoning the foul by any means, but, these things do happen and I would bet that if the injury to Port hadn't occurred, this foul would have gone unnoticed.  But since the Port incident is so fresh in our minds, now every flagrant foul will be looked at with extra animosity.   I'm sure the player that committed the foul did get an earful from his superiors.  And the refs didn't hesitate to ring up the intentional.  At least they got that part right this time around.  

As for the use of  "hypersensitive" to describe Wooster fans, I didn't see any "hypersensitive" behavior from Wabash fans during and after the football playoffs after several OAC fans made some negative comments towards Capital's playoff win over Wabash??? ???

Of course, I'm sure that they have some sort of spin to explain that away as well??? ::)




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 27, 2006, 12:10:26 AM
Hypersensitive, Smeds? Its not like Wabash had zero free throws in a postseason game or anything.

Quote from: ScotsFan on January 27, 2006, 12:04:49 AMAs for the use of  "hypersensitive" to describe Wooster fans, I didn't see any "hypersensitive" behavior from Wabash fans during and after the football playoffs after several OAC fans made some negative comments towards Capital's playoff win over Wabash??? ???

Of course, I'm sure that they have some sort of spin to explain that away as well??? ::)

I think it was DC that accurately made that comparison at the beginning of this season.

And, I've, on more than one occassion, made mention to Wally that there is the same tendency to bluster (Wooster) and goad (the rest of us) on the hoops board as there is with Wabash and the rest of the league on the football board.

But the "well, they do it, too" defense isn't very persuasive. And I don't recall anyone prior to this breaking out f-bombs and "a-holes" on the board in the 6+ years I've posted in NCAC rooms.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 27, 2006, 12:11:18 AM
Scotsfan -

The Capital fans were gracious and really were supportive of Wabash. We liked them. The normal OAC meatheads were saying Wabash didn't deserve a #1 seed, mainly because their beloved Purple didn't get it. So we called them out for that, and I backed up with some data on #1 seeds throughout time and space.

Totally different my friend. Totally different.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 27, 2006, 12:13:54 AM
DC -

The 'torches' comment was that I was afraid the call for 'suspension' or 'ejection' was going to lead to another lynch mob against a player that committed a foul similar to one that I've seen many a time in my 20+ years of covering hoops (much less watch - but when you cover a game you tend to be neutral).

And since the play was fairly accurately described, at first, I thought it was germaine to compare to other situations that I have seen. I mean, we're not talking an Artest-level of foul here. Just an ill-thought out push.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 27, 2006, 12:17:53 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 27, 2006, 12:10:26 AM
Hypersensitive, Smeds? Its not like Wabash had zero free throws in a postseason game or anything.

Quote from: ScotsFan on January 27, 2006, 12:04:49 AMAs for the use of  "hypersensitive" to describe Wooster fans, I didn't see any "hypersensitive" behavior from Wabash fans during and after the football playoffs after several OAC fans made some negative comments towards Capital's playoff win over Wabash??? ???

Of course, I'm sure that they have some sort of spin to explain that away as well??? ::)

I think it was DC that accurately made that comparison at the beginning of this season.

Whu'd I do?  If you mean I have seen and commented on similarities between the Wabash-dominated football board and the Wooster-dominated basketball board, that's probably true; I don't recall doing so, but I have had that thought.  But I had dropped out of the football board (which I frankly find intolerable) long before the playoffs, so maybe you're thinking of someone else?  ???

Quote from: smedindy on January 27, 2006, 12:13:54 AM
DC -

The 'torches' comment was that I was afraid the call for 'suspension' or 'ejection' was going to lead to another lynch mob against a player that committed a foul similar to one that I've seen many a time in my 20+ years of covering hoops (much less watch - but when you cover a game you tend to be neutral).

And since the play was fairly accurately described, at first, I thought it was germaine to compare to other situations that I have seen. I mean, we're not talking an Artest-level of foul here. Just an ill-thought out push.

In this context, especially when nothing worse than ejection had been suggested at that point, I think the terms "torches" and "lynch mob" are unhelpful bits of hyperbole.  Them's fightin' words!  Just my opinion.  :)

Anyway, everyone is entitled to their opinion.  I just wish we'd all stand down from our Fail Safe points and return to the negotiation table.  Wooster fans who were there thought it was a dirty play, and have said so; some others think it might not have been as dirty as all that, and have said so.  Let's at least agree to disagree and move on before everyone loses the respect of everyone else. 

On the bright side, at least someone's finally talking about Kenyon in here!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 27, 2006, 12:20:57 AM
DC, I seem to recall a conversation where you pointed out that there is a tendency for this board to be Wooster v. everyone else as the football board is Wabash v. everybody else. It was in the context of trying to be welcoming of other schools fans into the board.

I could very well be mistaken as to whether it was you or if that is even the proper context.

I certainly don't mean to put words in your mouth.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 27, 2006, 12:22:56 AM
I remember a comment like that too, DC. And the football board isn't that bad, really, as long as the riff-raff is kept on a leash.

I was also calling back to the comment I made after the Hiram game, where I also used that phrase. I guess callbacks don't work as well here as they do in sketch comedy. Sigh... ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 27, 2006, 12:23:29 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 27, 2006, 12:11:18 AM
Scotsfan -

The Capital fans were gracious and really were supportive of Wabash. We liked them. The normal OAC meatheads were saying Wabash didn't deserve a #1 seed, mainly because their beloved Purple didn't get it. So we called them out for that, and I backed up with some data on #1 seeds throughout time and space.

Totally different my friend. Totally different.

I was referring to some of the comments made after the Cap/MUC game in the OAC room where it was inferred that Cap played down to Wabash and that, had they played as hard as they did vs. MUC, they would have blown Wabash out?!  Ring any bells???  That seemed to get the Wabash nation up in arms if I do recall.  Not so different my friend...

And Lil Giant, I'm not trying to be persuasive.  I'm just saying that Wooster fans aren't the only "hypersensitive" fans on this board.  I'm not condoning the use of 4 letter adjectives, but, as you said, if this was the 1st time you can recall it happening in the NCAC rooms, it doesn't really make it indicative of us all now does it so I guess you could say it isn't very persuasive???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 27, 2006, 12:24:27 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 27, 2006, 12:22:56 AM
I guess callbacks don't work as well here as they do in sketch comedy. Sigh... ::)

I'm going to guess you're a fan of the Kids in the Hall...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 27, 2006, 12:25:18 AM
Geez, people, stop and take a breath. I don't have any smiting authority left for anyone in here. But I'll be back to re-read Wooster Booster in 18 hours, that's for sure.

That performance is unacceptable, WooBoo.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopsfan1111 on January 27, 2006, 03:18:57 AM
While I don't in any way think WooBoo should have reacted the way he did (it was WAY out of line), I can understand why he was upset.  Someone made a good point when they said that many people come to this board and post about games that they have attended without people questioning what happened at the game and the analysis. 

It was his opinion about the foul (along with many others who said they saw the same thing)--maybe eventually it was a little over the top in description, but that doesn't mean it was wrong...lately it seems that anytime a Wooster poster has any kind of complaint or says one wrong word everyone else is jumping down their throats...lets just take it easy and all relax a bit (this includes some Wooster fans too!!!).  This board is supposed to be a fun place to talk about our favorite teams!

Also, maybe what some people are calling hypersensitive is really just having an intense passion and support and team-spirit...instead of calling people hypersensitive why not take a second and reflect on how you would feel if there had been a bunch of intentional fouls against your OWN favorite team and a star player had been hurt recently, you might react and be upset...it is easy to see how that could happen.

To whoever asked if Wooster fans would call for one our own to be ejected from the game for committing a foul like those in question (sorry I can't remember who posted it, maybe jscwittfan??) I would have to say, that we probably wouldn't have to worry about that, because I doubt Coach Moore would stand for that type of play from his team.  As a Wooster fan who as seen at least 17 years of Woo vs. Witt games and Woo vs. Whoever else games... Woo (and I would include Witt, and many other teams in the NCAC) just wouldn't commit absolutely blantant fouls like that (has it happened once or twice in the past years, oh possibly, but never one to stand out in my mind)...some programs/kids just don't do that kind of thing. (In saying that I am not pointing any fingers and accusing any one program of committing intentional fouls on purpose all the time, I am just saying some teams do it, some teams don't)

And finally, Sac, there wasn't a need to make a comment like that about the game from last year...putting a wink behind it doesn't make it funny, it was a painful and controversial loss...I doubt you would be joking about it now if it had been your team who had been on the losing end of that game, a game which I don't need to remind you could have EASILY gone the other way. 

All that being said, hopefully we can all move on...lets talk about this weekend...how will Woo do against EC without Port?  Any other thoughts on this weekends games?  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 27, 2006, 08:31:19 AM
Wow!  There has been a flurry of activity since I last checked the board.

Couple of things that I thought about while reading....

Let me preface this by saying I was NOT in attendance at either the Hiram or Kenyon games so I can't speak of the actual fouls.  I will say this though, I have to agree with some of the posters (too many posts to quote from!)  that hard fouls are a part of the game.  But I see them falling into maybe three categories- 1.)  Where the defensive player actually has a good chance at the ball; 2.)  The gray area in between where one may or may not have a chance and 3.) Where there is no chance at ALL to make a good defensive play besides fouling.

I feel in the later two categories if you're going to foul someone, a player should make the effort to help himself and the other player land.  That's called good sportsmanship and should be part of the game.

There's a huge difference between shoving someone while they are up in the air and grabbing them/preventing the shot and making sure you and they land as safely as possible (at least prevent a fall as much as you can for both players). You see this all time with a lot of fouls.  The defensive players helps break the fall then helps the other player up.  It's when a player fouls with no real chance for the ball and doesn't even try to prevent a potential injury that grates me.  Injuries are part of the game, but lets try and make it as safe as we can so the players get to play not sit on bench and watch.

Also- you have to wonder when it's worth the foul.  Is it better to give up an easy bucket sans foul for 2 points, or should the person foul with the chance the ball could go in anyway, add a FT and maybe give the ball back to the other team (potential 5-6 points).  Just some thoughts...

Back to up coming games.  I think the Woo/Earlham match up should be a good one.  Woo def. needs to step up to deal with the athleticism of the Earlham players. 

In terms of scheduling, o see Witt having a little harder second half in the NCAC (as compared to Woo who has some more home games) with away games at Denison, Earlham, Wabash and OWU. 

The race for 3-4th seed in the tourney is heating up to... haven't looked at all the schedules but who do you think are the front runners based on the games left to play?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 27, 2006, 08:46:09 AM
Clearly, some people need to freakin lighten up a bit.  My goodness.

Apologize for ruffling any feathers, something that appears to be extremely easy.

The fact that this whole conversation takes up nearly 5 pages and is still going on..........well uh yeah. (no winky smiley faces here)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 27, 2006, 08:46:28 AM
This weekend seems to have a game that is a foregone conclusion (Wabash at Oberlin - though I'd better shut up about that lest I eat some words), a couple that are most likely (OWU over Hiram and Witt over Denison on the road), a game that could be intriguing due to Port's injury (Wooster over Earlham) and a good battle for 7th place (Gheny at Kenyon).

If all goes according to plan, then the middle of the conference will be:

OWU 7-3
Earlham 6-4
Wabash 6-4
Denison 5-5

OWU has a tough schedule with four road games (Wabash, Gheny, Earlham, Oberlin) and Wooster and Witt at home. I'm going to peg them at 2-4 for that stretch.

Earlham has four home games (Witt, Kenyon, OWU, Oberlin) and two road games  (Wabash, Denison).  I'll say 4-2 with the revenge factor against Dension.

Wabash has four home games (OWU, Denison, Earlham and Witt) and two road games (Wooster, Kenyon). I'll say 4-2.

Denison has three home (Oberlin, Gheny, Earlham) and three away (Wabash, Kenyon, Hiram). They could go 4-2 even with a loss to Earlham.

That would leave Earlham and Wabash with 10 wins and OWU and Denison with nine wins.

Of course, a lot could happen, for sure, but it looks like the 3 vs. 6 and 4 vs. 5 games in the tourney will be quite competitive.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on January 27, 2006, 09:17:09 AM
billy_pilgrim,
In Denison Fan's defense, I think he was just joking about the "thug" comment.  It certainly was a compliment by the Earlham coach referring to Denison playing physical defense.  I must say that result surprised me somewhat (being on their home floor, althogh it happend last year as well).  I am curious about Earlham, I wasn't at the game.  Do you think Earlham was looking ahead to Wooster?  They seem to have so much talent, but seem inconsistent.  Is a lack of a deep bench part of the inconsistency?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 27, 2006, 10:27:54 AM
Quote from: sac on January 27, 2006, 08:46:09 AM
Clearly, some people need to freakin lighten up a bit.  My goodness.

Apologize for ruffling any feathers, something that appears to be extremely easy.

The fact that this whole conversation takes up nearly 5 pages and is still going on..........well uh yeah. (no winky smiley faces here)



Sorry we don't have the always not so hilarious SupersSweetness HOF or male cheerleaders to talk about like on the MIAA board.  Or how about some Ketchup and Mustard if you please?  Here's my brand of choice:
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.stadiummustard.com%2Fimages%2F1999_Jar.gif&hash=5b55812a96edd5a8f66d7bf28b1d0c45a768a69f)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 27, 2006, 10:36:38 AM
Kramer-  It's hard to say they were looking ahead to Wooster.  You don't look ahead to a team like Wooster when you have a GREAT chance of winning at home against a team like Denison.  It seems as if (the denison game) a lot of  (I) was in team.  Selfish play and not playing as a team!  The was the receipt for Earlham a lot in the past.  I feel like this team is mature enough to getting back to Team Basketball.  3 assist in the game Vs Denison.  Granted Earlham College stats maybe the WORST assist keeping Stats Crew in the NATION!

Like i said in another post before the game... that game scared me!  I know Earlham to well... those are the type of games they lose, and then come Conference Tourny Time and (seeding)... U remember that one game where u kicked urself in the Balls!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 27, 2006, 10:40:45 AM
Lost in yesterday's hubbub was the fact that Wooster beat Kenyon by 13 points...a little light by current Wooster standards.  A journey into the boxscore shows three things that directly contributed to the final score:

- Wooster shot terribly from the foul line
- Wooster shot terribly from the 3-point line
- Wooster committed 20 turnovers (roughly 7 more than their season per game average)

This got me thinking about Wooster's NCAA tournament this March...and it raised some flags.  Against tougher competition, it's no stretch to think that if Wooster piles up the percentages that they did on Wednesday, that they'll lose (on the assumption that any tournament team is going to be much, much better than Kenyon).  When Wooster shoots well, they can outscore just about anybody.  When they don't, it's anybody's game.  How realistic is it to think that Wooster can play 5-6 games against the nation's toughest competition without an off shooting night?  I think that there are fundamental differences between teams that are great regular season teams and teams that are great tournament teams.  I'm interested to hear some other thoughts on this idea of the differences between great regular season teams vs. great tournament teams.  We see it every year in the hoops tournaments at each level...what kinds of symptoms do we see from teams that dominate their regular seasons only to regularly disappoint in the postseason?  Are Wooster and Wittenberg teams that fit the description?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 27, 2006, 11:00:36 AM
But I do think we need to lighten up at times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 27, 2006, 11:09:25 AM
Several factors could be attrubuted to Wooster's relatively poor performance against the Lords on Wednesday.  1)  The most obvious of all, they were without their best player, Tom Port.  Remember him Wally?  2)  They were playing in a brand spanking new gym against an inpired Kenyon team that was playing in front of more people at home than they have had in who knows how long.  And 3)  Do you seriously think that Wooster's mental state would not be a little sharper preparing for an NCAA tournament game as opposed to a weeknight jaunt to Gambier in a game they proved they could almost win with their eyes closed?  

Those were some pretty awful stats that Wooster put up on Wednesday and they still won by 13 and it could have easily been 20 or more! I'm not too worried about this type of performance by Wooster come post-season time.  Yes, they may have an off shooting night, but to go totally brain dead like they seemed to do against Kenyon isn't likely to happen against a better opponent.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 27, 2006, 11:17:58 AM
Having watched Wooster quite a bit this year I have to say I'm not sure how they would do in the big dance.  You are right when you say when they are hot, you better watch as I don't see many teams running with them.  But they have had some off nights (Kenyon/Hiram) and large cold spells in games that won't cut it against upper echelon teams.  For example I think Wooster could have beat BW as they were up midway through the second half (forget how much) and could have put the game away but they just went totally cold which allowed BW to storm back and push it to overtime.  They've had these lulls all season which has been frustrating at times.  In the Witt game they started out cold to the point I was thinking they wouldn't be able to make it up.  That's when Port and some others really stepped up and got them back into the game.  If they do that at the HPER it could make for a long night. 

Defense is the thing that is standing out this year for Wooster IMO.  It hasn't been up to par compared to the last few years.  If they can improve on that and everyone is healthy I think they can make a decent run.

Have to get by Earlham and the rest of the NCAC first though!


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 27, 2006, 11:45:12 AM
Quote1)  The most obvious of all, they were without their best player, Tom Port.  Remember him Wally?

It's comments like that - from everyone (and I'm guilty too at times) that we really need to rein in.

Anyway, I also disagree with this:

QuoteDo you seriously think that Wooster's mental state would not be a little sharper preparing for an NCAA tournament game as opposed to a weeknight jaunt to Gambier in a game they proved they could almost win with their eyes closed? 

Because I've seen it too many times that teams in the tourney slip against a lesser opponent because they don't take them seriously enough.

Last year - in the D-1 tourney - you saw that with Kansas vs. Bucknell and definitely with Syracuse against Vermont.

Back to Wooster - again to the Wabash game - the huge run was made without Port, who had foul trouble, and that was an almost flawless second half performance by Wooster. Hiram and Kenyon can be scrappy teams, but ultimately the talent of Wooster, even with one player out, should really shine through. So perhaps a mental edge is missing, and that could give one pause.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 27, 2006, 11:50:21 AM
Earlhamalum:  Man are your right about the "assists".  It is very sad because both teams had many more than are recorded.  That is too bad.  I was told the assists are kept by the "official scorer".  That guy has to pay a little more attention to the details.

My take on the Earlham/Denison game.  Earlham 1/14 from behind the arc.  And the lone three coming right at the end of the game.  Had they made just 3 more they win.

Earlham is very good.  They are going to give Woo all they can handle.

There is no way they were looking beyond the Denison game.  They just couldn't put the ball in the basket.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 27, 2006, 12:11:17 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 27, 2006, 11:45:12 AM

Because I've seen it too many times that teams in the tourney slip against a lesser opponent because they don't take them seriously enough.


If Wooster or any other of the top teams in this Region don't get shipped out somewhere, I don't think there will be a need to worry about facing a lesser opponent.  For all intents and purposes, if the brackets are set up the way they have been in the past, the team coming out of the GL Region could possibly face a top 25 opponent each and every game on their way to Salem.  So the possibility of Wooster facing a lesser opponent equivalent to Bucknell knocking off Kansas isn't likely.

I do have to agree with blindwatchmaker in that I think the problem that could really derail this Wooster squad is it's lacking on the defensive end of the floor, especially in the low post.  Wooster will definately run into  a team with a quality low post player sooner than later in the post season, and as has happened on more than one occasion so far in the regular season, opposing big men have thrived against the Scots.  Unless Wooster figures out it's problems on defense, especially in the low post, I don't see them making it deep in the tournament. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 27, 2006, 12:13:47 PM
Billy_pilgram... would know more about how they do the stats at Earlham... but i believe it is a work study-related... where students help keep stats.  I believe it is only $6.50 a hour... and u know u can't get good help for that price!  :)  

Wooster on the other hand seems to keep assist like the NBA... okay maybe not... but that is one thing they always do well!  Or at least that's what the stats say!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on January 27, 2006, 12:28:17 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 27, 2006, 10:27:54 AM
Sorry we don't have the always not so hilarious SupersSweetness HOF or male cheerleaders to talk about like on the MIAA board.  Or how about some Ketchup and Mustard if you please?  Here's my brand of choice:
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.stadiummustard.com%2Fimages%2F1999_Jar.gif&hash=5b55812a96edd5a8f66d7bf28b1d0c45a768a69f)

Certainly no NCAC school has created any strange fascination with a food product...
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.candy2you.com%2Fimages%2Fproducts%2Ftootsielg.jpg&hash=74130851bf09f893a6056e34793abd216d6e78ef)
(Not that I can talk, I do have mine still)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 27, 2006, 12:32:55 PM
Kramer,

I'm with Earlhamalum, I don't think Earlham looked ahead to Wooster. Denison is not a bad team, though they are one that Earlham has matched up with well over the past few years (especially evident in last year's NCAC tourney game). But, I'm sure Denison made defensive adjustments (as mentioned by the physical play on the defensive end) and on top of that Earlham couldn't hit any perimeter shots and, according to the Pal-Item story with more Justus quotes, didn't play smart basketball.

I've always thought depth had a great deal to do with not consistently playing smart basketball. First, there is no question that a player's decison making suffers when he's tired. Secondly, I've always thought that, at least subconsciously, players are more prone to turn the ball over if they know (or don't think) a coach can afford to take them out of the game. So, when a guy turns the ball over or takes two bad shots in a row for Bob Knight or Steve Moore, he's on the bench. Conversely, if a guy does the same for Ed DeChellis (kudos to anyone who knows who that is) or Jeff Justus, he probably won't even look over the sideline to see if his coach is mad.

Now, having said all of that, Earlham has a bit more depth this season and I think that's part of the reason they've had a nice conference season (Wednesday aside) so far. Neil Collins has moved from deep down the depth chart to the starting lineup. Tyler Stewart and Terrel Brown are pretty interchangable. Miller and Henry are constants. Jewett is back. Tristian Gregory is some firepower off the bench. Now, if Earlham could only get Nick Welsh out of his sophomore slump.

So, as you can see, it's not Witt or Wooster depth (or even maybe Wabash or OWU depth), but it's a definite improvement over two years ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 27, 2006, 12:37:50 PM
Earlhamalum,

Is work study even worth $6.50?

It is students....but Tinch and company are quite an improvement over some other places I've been.

Earlier in the year at Bluffton, the stats had an Earlham player who never took off his shooting shirt with a couple rebounds and minutes played.

As for so few assists, mostly that's a product of Earlham's style of offense. A good number of assists come from penetrating guards dishing off for open looks from 3. You don't see that too much in Earlham games....hey, you don't see too many 3's, as evidenced by the 1/13 performance on Tuesday.

If you set up your offense to get the ball to Miller, Jewett and Henry in the post and let them work, those two or three dribbles and pump fakes are going to negate assists.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 27, 2006, 12:46:35 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on January 27, 2006, 11:50:21 AM
Earlhamalum:  Man are your right about the "assists".  It is very sad because both teams had many more than are recorded.  That is too bad.  I was told the assists are kept by the "official scorer".  That guy has to pay a little more attention to the details.

Sounds like you guys missed a great rant a couple weeks ago.
http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/?p=112

Often there are interesting things on the front page. Make sure not to miss those on your way to the message board.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 27, 2006, 01:02:35 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 27, 2006, 10:40:45 AM
I think that there are fundamental differences between teams that are great regular season teams and teams that are great tournament teams.  I'm interested to hear some other thoughts on this idea of the differences between great regular season teams vs. great tournament teams.  We see it every year in the hoops tournaments at each level...what kinds of symptoms do we see from teams that dominate their regular seasons only to regularly disappoint in the postseason?  Are Wooster and Wittenberg teams that fit the description?

I think over the past two years, Wittenberg has unfortunately fallen into that category.  In each of the past two seasons, we have seen Witt play a great regular season, only to not win (or have to squeak out victories) in the postseason. 

In 2003-04, they went 24-5 (16-0), but then got destroyed by Wooster in the conference tourney finals and then by John Carroll in the NCAAs.  Last year, they went 25-4 (14-2) in the regular season, but then struggled in the NCAC tourney (OT win over Wabash, 2 point win over Wooster) and then, again, got beat by John Carroll in the NCAAs (this time in 2OT).

I can't really explain why this happened.  It's not like those Witt teams didn't have experience or the talent.  My only hope is seeing the improvement from 03-04 to 04-05 will lead to a stronger run in the 05-06 postseason.  However, until they actually do it, and win a game in the NCAAs, those questions will always linger over their heads.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 27, 2006, 01:11:43 PM
Pat:
Thanks for that artical.  It is excellent.  So many stats are screwed up.  Even to the point of giving baskets to the wrong guy.
Thanks again.

GO BIG RED!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 27, 2006, 01:17:43 PM
Pat Coleman- Thanks... my knowledge for basketball is exactly what I thought it was.  That article is everything I thought about assist/T.O/Steals. 2 things.

1.) What about a pass a shot and a FOUL.. no bucket?  Meaning a pass that would of been an assist if it went in, but the player got Fouled?  I heard that in the NBA if they hit a free-throw... never heard of such a thing in the College level?

2.) Can I look at all my game film and change my career stats.... Oh wait I'm not sure if that would help or hurt me.. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 27, 2006, 02:03:18 PM
As a statistician, I can say that at Wabash, we don't give out cheap assists, and I do know of one NCAC school that was reprimanded for giving out the assists like they were Halloween candy.

In the NBA, assists are NOT awarded if a person is fouled in the act and makes the free throws.

As for Earlham, the stats against Wabash were a joke. Minutes were all wrong, and assists were criminally low, so says some people in the know. The SID needs to pay attention and get the kids head in the game.

I do know that we check our stats (fouls and points) with the official scorer, write down every play to make sure we don't miss anything, and I, in my job of running the program, always make sure we get everything right. The SID has the ownership, though, and it looks bad on him or her if things are wrong and the minutes don't balance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on January 27, 2006, 02:12:18 PM
Woo's assists may seem high at times, but trust me, they are right where they should be.  It attests to their style of play and continuous ball movement. 

If you don't believe me, just check out the Scot women's statistics.  They are near the bottom of the NCAC in assists, yet the same people keep tally for both men and women.

Speaking of which, anyone going to stick around for the Scot women against Earlham following the men's game tomorrow?  Should be a good one;  Wooster trying to end an 11-game losing streak against the last team it beat on Dec. 3.  You know you don't want to miss that.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 27, 2006, 02:45:16 PM
After reading Billy_pilgram earlier I believe he might drive to Wooster just for the woman's game!  I heard he has a Strong desire for Woman's Basketball... :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 27, 2006, 02:45:28 PM
Oh, I know Woosters assists are right, at this present juncture, having seen them played.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 27, 2006, 07:55:12 PM
Wow.  I thought my week of classes was busy, and then I come back to the board to learn that I've missed 8 pages of commentary on the Scots and Kenyon?!?

On Wooster's tournament fortunes:

Wooster is an offensive make-or-break squad.  As many people have noted, on a good night Wooster will more than live up to its #2 in the country billing (remember, on a good night it beat the current #1 squad).  As DC listed here, Woo is #10 in made 3-pts per game, and #2 in percentage.  That's a deadly shooting team.

But the question, for the tournament, in my mind, isn't what Woo does on a good night, but what they can accomplish if they have an off-night.  Here's my take:

Offensively, an off-Wooster night means something like the 76 pts scored at Kenyon.  This is a respectable figure, and means that even on an off-night Woo should have enough offensive to stay with most teams.

Defensively, I think too many people forget that Wooster is leading the country in winning margin, at 22.1 pts per game.  I agree that Woo has no commanding inside player of the like of Player of the Year Bryan Nelson to control low post defense, and so of course Wooster has been challenged to stop the likes of Witt's Russ and Tori Davis of BW.  But, to say that Wooster's defensive intensity is lacking seems like a weak argument to me, especially because defensive intensity is THE focal point of Steve Moore's coaching. 
Rather, Wooster has the same defensive intensity they have had in past years, but the pace of their game has significantly changed.  Compare Woo year-to-year:
This year through 18 games, average per game (04-05 season total in 30 games, average per game):

Steals:  182, 10.1 (193, 6.4)
Turnover forced: 307, 17.0 (363, 12.1)

In fact, the current squad's averages here are better than the '03 final four team (or indeed any recent Wooster squad):
'02-'03 steals: 242/33 games= 7.3
'02-'03 turnovers forced:  465/33 = 14.0

The reason Wooster doesn't get national ranking for defensive categories isn't because they aren't playing defense- it's because teams are averaging 79 ppg against them, which is must too high to be considered among the top in defense (while Woo averages 100).

Does anyone know if a turnover margin stat is kept at the national level?  So far as I can tell, Wooster's opponents have committed 307 to Wooster's 237 this year, a +70 margin and a rate of +3.8 per game.  This looks better than previous Wooster teams have done, as well.

And, after saying all this, I do hope I was reading/interperting the Woo stat page correctly!   8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 27, 2006, 09:34:01 PM
Another busy day in here, lots of catching up to do but very little time to do so.  Three comments, however.

1.) Scots Fan, you do realize that I am the source of all that "ketchup and mustard" nonsense in the MIAA room, right? ::)  Can't blame that one on sac and co.  I take no responsibility for the Super Sweetness silliness, however; I don't even bother to read it.  :)

2.) I think Wooster has defensive issues, especially in the low post, but it doesn't mean these are fatal.  After all, Dan Russ had (another) career game against Wooster, but Wooster still managed to win that game.  And Tori Davis had the game of a lifetime against Wooster, and it still went to two OTs to decide that one.  I guess the thinking is that, if you don't match up well in the low post, you defend everything else as well as you can and hope that your five can outscore their one. 

Also, Wooster doesn't do well in defensive rankings partly because there are issues, but mstly because of their style of play.  Wooster's goals are to score 1.1 points per possession, and to allow no more than 0.8 points per possession on defense.  Even when they manage to hold teams to 0.8 ppp, as they did vs. Kenyon, that still translates to a lot of points, since Wooster's offense generates a lot of possessions for the other team.

3.) Wittenberg has not been a very good tournament team lately, and I think it's mostly because they depend so heavily on the play of Russ and Borchers down low.  While that works in the NCAC, it doesn't always work against teams that can exploit the perimeter (like JCU) or otherwise counter the big men (who didn't seem so big when compared to some other non-NCAC post players.)  The difference this season is I think both are playing better and stronger, especially Borchers.  They compliment each other better, and with the one-two punch more effective it opens up more options on the perimeter.  Add that to the fact that Witt is the best defensive team in D3 (again) and is also hitting free throws (especially Borchers, who is something like 10th nationally), and I think they're going to Salem this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on January 27, 2006, 10:31:33 PM
DC,

I apologize if this has ever been covered or if I'm breaking some forum rule by questioning another poster's identity, but I must ask: what is your background?  Did you play? coach?

I'm too new to be able to award karma, but if i could, you'd get points from me for 50%+ of your posts.  I really enjoy your insight and the level of understanding you bring to the discussion.

I've only been around for a few weeks and I don't frequent other forums outside the NCAC page (well, I read, but never post), but I have to say that the "regulars" are a pretty knowledgeable group.

I'm an equal opportunity fan when it comes to basketball - I love high school, D1, D3, etc. - everything except the NBA - and the comments and opinion that I get in here are top-notch.

Now on a more important note - Go Big Red - here's your chance to knock off number 1.  Wish I could be there...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 27, 2006, 10:36:19 PM
DC is our lead pontificator - and as my D3hoops.com attorney he advises me to say nothing and act casual. (HAH!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 27, 2006, 11:03:05 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 27, 2006, 10:36:19 PM
DC is our lead pontificator - and as my D3hoops.com attorney he advises me to say nothing and act casual. (HAH!)

I thought Li'l Giant was your attorney.  He's my attorney!

Quote from: CentralOH on January 27, 2006, 10:31:33 PM
DC,

I apologize if this has ever been covered or if I'm breaking some forum rule by questioning another poster's identity, but I must ask: what is your background?  Did you play? coach?

I don't think there's any harm in asking questions, as long as you don't expect answers from those who wish to remain anonymous.  My carefully-crafted screen name suggests that anonymity is not high on my priority list.   :)  (Leaving aside my brief trip down Memphis-memory lane earlier this week; "Memphis" was my screen name when I started posting however many years ago.) 

Did I play?  As a Wooster undergrad, I attended most of the basketball games, and played nearly every time.  Of course, what I played was the trombone, in the pep band...  ::)  (For that matter, I played at EVERY football game.  Hey, where's my varsity letter?  :D)

I appreciate the compliment, however undeserved it may be.   :-[ :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 28, 2006, 12:09:39 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 27, 2006, 11:03:05 PM
I thought Li'l Giant was your attorney.  He's my attorney!

You need a chiropractor? I know a mediocre one I can send you to.  :D And about that retainer....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 28, 2006, 12:23:54 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 27, 2006, 09:34:01 PM

Add that to the fact that Witt is the best defensive team in D3 (again) and is also hitting free throws (especially Borchers, who is something like 10th nationally), and I think they're going to Salem this year.

DC - quite often we agree on points but I'll take the opposite view here  :)
because I don't see Wittenberg reaching Salem this year for several reasons:

1.  Witt doesn't shoot a very high field goal percentage.
NCAA Stats thru 1/22 (Field Goal %)
Baldwin-Wallace 55.3%
Wooster 53.6%
Bethany 52.1%
Albion 48.9%
Carnegie Mellon 48.8%
Wittenberg 48.2%

If any of these teams shoot well, they stand a great chance of beating Witt and I just listed a few potential Great Lakes opponents.  Many tournament teams shoot better than 48% from the floor.

2.  Witt doesn't have the guard play to go deep in the NCAA tourney.  Guards are critical come tourney time because they must take care of and distribute the ball.

Witt actually has a team Assist to Turnover ratio below 1.0 this year (0.98).  In big games, this tendency to have more turnovers than assists really seems to hurt the Tigers.  In nearly all of the Tiger's losses the last 2+ years (JCU, JCU, Woo, Wash U., etc.) they have had far more turnovers than assists.  Witt is averaging 14.2 turnovers per game this season and that number will likely rise against good tournament teams.

3.  Witt doesn't shoot the three pointer particularly well.  Tigers average 6.7 made three pointers a game.  This leaves them very susceptible to any opponent that makes 8 or more three pointers a game.  In nearly all of the Tigers losses the last 2+ years, their opponents have made more three pointers which has been a big factor in Witt losing those games.  It doesn't take too many three pointers to offset all the two pointers being made by Russ and Borchers.  Wooster won earlier this year when they made 11 three pointers against Witt.

Final note:  I am not predicting Wooster either to go to Salem this year.  IMO though, the Scots have a better shot (pun intended  ;D) at making a tourney run than Witt because Wooster has great guards, strong three point shooters and lots of recent tournament experience that could help them in some tight games.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 28, 2006, 12:32:54 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 27, 2006, 09:34:01 PM

Also, Wooster doesn't do well in defensive rankings partly because there are issues, but mstly because of their style of play.  Wooster's goals are to score 1.1 points per possession, and to allow no more than 0.8 points per possession on defense.  Even when they manage to hold teams to 0.8 ppp, as they did vs. Kenyon, that still translates to a lot of points, since Wooster's offense generates a lot of possessions for the other team.


I think Coach Moore is referring to it as defensive efficiencey rating (DER).  There was an article that discussed this in the Daily Record and  how this has been a sore spot with Coach Moore all season because he feels that Wooster's DER has been too high in too many games.  Here is a link to the article if anyone is interested:

The Daily Record article on Wooster's DER (http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/archive/01242006/sports/&file=_sports3.txt&article=1&tD=01242006)

This seems to be Coach Moore's main area of concern with the defense.  He is not so much worried about giving up so many ppg as has been mentioned by scotsbrod and DC, but the DER has consistently been over the .8 ppp that is Wooster's goal.  It has even been over 1 ppp in several of Wooster's games which definately has Coach Moore's attention.  This topic seems to come up after every game in the post game comments as Coach Moore is quick to point this out.  Even if the Scots gave up a lot of points, Moore is only concerned about one thing and that is whether or not the DER was at 1 or lower.  If that is the case, he will more than lilkey be in a better mood.  At least the Scots had that going for them in the Kenyon game.  One of the few things they did well in that game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on January 28, 2006, 01:03:04 AM
Witt doesn't have any guard play? Denbow, Steffes, and Bowen not only can shoot the three but are three of the hardest nosed guys in the ncac. Sometimes the gauge of a guard is not the numbers they put up but the refusal to lose and these three have those intangible qualities. It is just like a Wooster fan to point at our guards and try to ignore the best two post men in the country standing below the basket. However I think we are leaving out the most important factor in this mix. Without Port, Kenny Brady poses HUGE matchup problems for Wooster. Superior post play with the ability to drain the 3 ball with consistency. If there is one thing I know about these guys from Witt is that they take a lot of pride in their homecourt and the HPER will be ROCKING come Witt v Woo at the HPER Feb. 4. Who You Witt!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BogeyMan on January 28, 2006, 12:10:49 PM
DC,
I couldn't agree with you more on the possibility of a weakness in Wooster's low post defense.  Like you said Tori Davis had his way against Wooster and won.  I believe Davis had 42 or 44 points that game.  BW beat Wooster with average or just a bit above average guards.

Albion beat BW because Crawford (20 pts., 17 rebs.) could compete with Davis (22 pts., 8 rebs.)

Just a side note, I have seen both Davis and Crawford twice and they maybe the two best post players in the GL Region and possibly the country. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 28, 2006, 01:32:10 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 47  Earlham 33

Wooster being led by James Cooper with 16 points and Tim Vandervaart with 14 point.  Brandon Miller has 20 points for Earlham.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 28, 2006, 01:35:05 PM
all about tempo it sounds like...Wooster is really pushing it and Earlham hasn't had any answers

good thing Miller is playing well or this one would really be ugly

Earlham was down 12 in the second half in Richmond before rallying...will be a much tougher task today
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 28, 2006, 01:44:39 PM
BNel, are you having a bit of an identity crisis??? ::)  
Quote from: WoosterBNel on January 26, 2006, 07:53:08 PM
How bout we get down to business. Only 2 good games happen in the ncac every year and one is about to go down at the HPER center in less than 10 days. As a Wooster fan I have to admit that I am a little apprehensive about this game. Witt is a solid team from top to bottom and near impossible to beat at home.



Quote from: WoosterBNel on January 28, 2006, 01:03:04 AM
It is just like a Wooster fan to point at our guards and try to ignore the best two post men in the country standing below the basket.

I thought you said you were a Wooster fan??? ::)  That is sooooo hilarious to act like a Wooster fan and then actually be a Witt fan!  Man, you sure did pull one over on us??? ::)   Good one BNel!!! ???

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 28, 2006, 01:59:46 PM
65-41 Wooster up now.................guys just never let up

someone asked me about depth for Earlham the other day...this is where it shows up most......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 28, 2006, 02:24:23 PM
I am not too sure about previous games but o-boy, this will go down as one of the saddest days in Brandon Miller's history at Earlham.  After that terrific performance, he gets no support from his team-mates.  C'mon Quakers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 28, 2006, 02:24:41 PM
I mentioned the story of Bronson Lickliter last week....going about five or six years between baskets. Well, once again, Bronson will do something very interesting today.

He just hit a 3 in garbage time in what has become an absolute rout. Well, in about 20 minutes, Lickliter will broadcast the women's game for the Teamline newtwork. And for the record, Lickliter is the nephew of Butler head coach, Todd Lickliter.

Miller with 32 today...that's a career high and the lone non-opaque spot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 28, 2006, 02:26:15 PM
Final:  Wooster 99  Earlham 63

Wooster was led today by Tim Vandervaart with 26 points, 12 boards, 6 assists and 4 steals.  :)  James Cooper had 20 points and freshman Brandon Johnson added 15 points.  Earlham was led by Brandon Miller with 32 points.

Wooster shot a very high percentage today (63%) and made 8 three pointers as well.  The Scots also outrebounded the Quakers by 23 boards.

Wooster moves to 18-1, 10-0 NCAC.  ;D

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 28, 2006, 02:38:43 PM
On the post game radio show, Coach Steve Moore indicated that Tom Port might get his cast off this coming Monday.  :)  Let's hope that Coach is right and good luck to Port with the rehab!

GO SCOTS!! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 28, 2006, 03:28:28 PM
The Scots did much better defensively today and were able to play their up tempo style game.  Besides Miller (who made some great moves today, he's a player), no one from Earlham stepped up or was much of a factor.  The first few minutes Wooster attacked the basket and were able to get some layups/short jump shots.  Earlham hung with them by making some three's.  Then Wooster took over and never looked back.  Overall, much better all around play by Wooster than the last few games.  Brandon Johnson had a really good game both on offense and defense.

Refs were better than usual I thought till the last 6-7 minutes when things got a little sloppy etc.  At one point a ref took aside Vandervaart and Miller and told them to calm down as they were jockeying for an inbounds pass.  Helped control the game a bit without calling needless fouls.

Wooster looked tough today and as was mentioned, Port may be back by the Witt game.  I think the extra Time Will, Bidwell and others have gotten will really help this team down the stretch.  You can tell they are playing with a lot more confidence.

Great win today, lets keep it up!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 28, 2006, 03:33:07 PM
Witt up 27-13 with 2+ to play in the 1st half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 28, 2006, 03:36:54 PM
Witt 31-13 at the half... not looking good for the Big Red
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on January 28, 2006, 03:51:54 PM
O MAN, you blew my cover. Your instincts were correct, I have an undying hatred for the gold and black. BUT the tigers are still the best team in the country. WYW
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 28, 2006, 04:10:14 PM
Halftime from Phillips Gymnasium:

Wabash 46
Oberlin 34

Wabash started slowly here for the LGs.  After trailing 16-10, Wabash started forcing some turnovers and finding some easy shots.  If Wabash doesn't get careless in the second half, they should be able to close the deal and win convincingly here. 



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on January 28, 2006, 04:29:22 PM
Final from Granville: Witt 74 Denison 49
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 28, 2006, 04:45:49 PM
Any more updates Wally?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 28, 2006, 04:47:01 PM
Wabash is methodically pulling away...up 26 now with under 10 minutes to play. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 28, 2006, 04:48:15 PM
Thanks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 28, 2006, 05:02:04 PM
Final from Oberlin:

Wabash 91
Oberlin 66

Wabash was in control of this one after about the first five minutes.  Plenty of boxscore standouts today as you would expect with so many points being scored.  Six Little Giants reached double figures in this one. 

Wabash needs to bring this effort back home to Chadwick for the Wednesday's game vs. OWU. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 28, 2006, 05:11:22 PM
Glad to see that Wittenberg won, but here's a scary stat:

Witt FT: 4-14 (28.6%)
Borchers: 0-3 FT
Russ: 1-5 FT

As a Wittenberg fan, that worries me a LOT.  Let's hope it's just a one-game slip-up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 28, 2006, 08:07:29 PM
Witt was very good.  Don't worry about them. 
Denison had no way of matching up with them.

I do have to say these refs SUCKED!!  OK you play the #1 team.  That does not give them cart blanche to foul our guys.  Denison was not going to win this game but you must call obvious fouls.

My only question is WHY DOES DAN IZZO PLAY 18 MINUTES?????  I got the impression Ghiloni forgot who was on the bench.  He pulled both Hodgkinson and Hern at the same time.   MISTAKE  He has a lineup on the floor that has NO chance of scoring.  It was the same crap I saw in the 2-8 run.   

Trust me, we were not going to beat WiTT.  But at least play the guys who can at least give us a chance.   

Congrats to Witt.  They are very good.

The Big Red has some HUGE games coming up.  And I have to say I think they are ready to run the table.  But let's play the guys who can win!!!

Izzo is soooooo much better than 18 minutes.  Mike Shea plays more??? HELLO!


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 28, 2006, 08:27:42 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on January 28, 2006, 08:07:29 PM
OK you play the #1 team.  That does not give them cart blanche to foul our guys.  Denison was not going to win this game but you must call obvious fouls.

You must be new to the NCAC.  I'm not sayin' Witt and Wooster get the benefit of the doubt a lot....I'm just sayin'.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 28, 2006, 08:39:18 PM
Wally...
You are just saying what??
If there is a foul call it.  I don't care who you are.
These refs were terrible.   I really thought Coach G was going to be t'ed up.

Hodgkinson was killed!!  Beat up and spit out.  NO CALL.

Witt is good.  We have complained about the refs all year.   Call the game both ways.

Again, Ghiloni plays 12 guys and we had no chance.  End of story.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 28, 2006, 08:59:12 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on January 28, 2006, 08:39:18 PMWally...
You are just saying what??
If there is a foul call it.  I don't care who you are.
These refs were terrible.   I really thought Coach G was going to be t'ed up.

I'm quite sure he's not defending it. He's just saying it's not a surprise to anyone that Witt would get the benefit of the calls against Denison.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2006, 09:37:01 PM
(Sigh...here we go again...)

Why wouldn't he play 12 against Witt?

Hern played 33 minutes and Hodgkinson played 36, in a 74-49 game. I mean, that's a lot for a blowout, especially since Borchers and Russ played a total of 49 minutes between 'em. What was it, stat padding time?

Hern played 17 minutes in the first half and Hodgkinson played 20 and it was 31-13. After first halves like that, I've seen coaches yank the entire starting five and get players in there who want to play. 13 points seems like a sad effort, even against Witt.

From the looks of it, no one except Danny Boy did diddly-poo, anyway, so why not play who ever is giving effort.

Looks like Borchers and Russ had their way with anyone and everyone, anyway. Oh, and Witt played 11 players in the first half and it looks like they did alright.

Again, nothing to worry about. In my analysis, this was a loss for Denison - and i still peg them at 9-7 in the conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 28, 2006, 09:39:19 PM
Maybe if Denison could have figured out a way to get all 12 of those players on the floor at the same time....nah. It wouldn't have mattered.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2006, 09:44:27 PM
The Gators rise up and bop the Lords 80-72, and OWU tunes up for its big clash at Chadwick with a 121-70 trouncing of the evil Hiram Terries (oh, only Pfouts is evil, I forgot!  ;) )

For Gheny - the Majzlik man had 16, and they had good balance, with four others in double figures and Hollihan added nine as well.

Formato had his usual good game (23 points) and Allen Bediako had 10 points, 18 rebounds and 8 blocks (hello, POW?? He's got 15 blocks in two games), but alas it was not enough. The Lords are really missing Yelvington.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2006, 09:47:13 PM
Hey, OWU, can you put a box score on your site? Thanks.

For the Bishops, no one played more than 21 minutes, 11 players played more than 10 minutes, and only four players hit double figures. They outrebounded the Terriers 55-39. Kyle Holliday had 20 and 9 rebounds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 28, 2006, 10:18:10 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on January 28, 2006, 08:39:18 PM
Ghiloni plays 12 guys and we had no chance.  End of story.

C'mon, dad, you had no chance if he'd played just five. Or if he'd played your son all 40 minutes.

Your axe-grinding is getting old. I don't have to let you do it here, you realize. I'd be fully within the Terms of Service.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 28, 2006, 10:22:57 PM
Okay WoW Wooster really kicked OUR Butt's today.  I was looking at the Field Goals % for Wooster's top 3.  WoW 24-30 (Johnson, Cooper, Vander.)   Another Stat that jumps out at me... How do you shoot 63% from the Field... and still get 14 OF Rebounds!   Wooster you amaze me!

Okay now that a lot of these posters have seen Brandon Miller play for 4 years... and this season watching him play twice.  Does he have a chance at being POY?  Now I know the rule of having to Finish in the Top 3 in the NCAC to get it!  I was just wondering what you guy's thought of him as a player and his chances for ending his Great NCAC career with Individual awards?  

Sorry I was talking to Former New Comer of the Year for Earlham College, Brady Keaton on the phone earlier today and he said he thought he was one of the better indivual player in d3.  (* not NCAC)  I thought that might be pushing it, but i wonder what all of ya'll think!  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2006, 10:27:31 PM
I think he'll be in the conversation, for sure, but there are some excellent players on Witt and Woo that could get some consideration as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2006, 10:49:31 PM
Oh, and I think we have a record set today.

Freshman Brian Maloney got credit for TWO games played by the Oberlin stats crew. Congrats to Brian! It must have been that hard work in the research labs this summer. Thank goodness the Campaign initiative for more faculty / student research collaboration was funded  :D

That way we can have two-two-two Brian Maloneys out there. Geez, now if we could only have done that for Josh Estelle and Joe DesJean!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 28, 2006, 11:09:29 PM
Smedindy-  Josh Estelle, I have not heard that name for a while, I couldn't think of his first name for the life of me.  That kid could score, he had a Sweeeeet Shot!  I liked that 99-00 season squad, and Seniors Josh Estelle, Brian Lathom, and I believe DesJean would of been a freshman with Brady Claxton. 

SPeaking of Poor Stat taking... go to this site, http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=260128004 (http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=260128004)find out what is wrong with it.  *hint James Thomas   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 28, 2006, 11:22:42 PM
Earlhamalum

I like Brandon Miller and have been impressed each time I have seen him play. His talent, athleticism and size allow him to play just about any position. He certainly should receive consideration, but with the second round of the NCAC just starting I might be a bit early to start the POY talk. I would like to see a few players once more.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 29, 2006, 12:09:28 AM
Earlham alum - I didn't notice anything except he got one minute and one rebound. They must have fixed it. What was the issue??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 29, 2006, 01:33:21 AM
Oh my...if we could have had two Estelles we might have been able to get by Chicago in '97 and '98.  That would have been fun! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 29, 2006, 02:47:30 AM
Quote from: DenisonFan on January 28, 2006, 08:39:18 PMAgain, Ghiloni plays 12 guys and we had no chance.  End of story.

I bet Oberlin would love to have the luxury of having 12 players available in a blowout loss. Get some perspective, man.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 29, 2006, 02:51:25 AM
EA,

In response to your post regarding Brandon Miller, after seeing him on tape tonight against Wooster, I wouldn't object to having Miller at least in consideration for NCAC POY.  With that being said, with what you said about your boy Keaton regarding Miller as possibly one of the best D3 players in the country, I would have to defer to 2 players in our own region who I would vote ahead of Miller in Brandon Crawford from Albion and Tori Davis from BW. 

As for NCAC POY, James Cooper is making it pretty hard not to put his name as a frontrunner for that award so far this season.  I mean, all Coop did for Wooster tonight was score 20 points while going 9-11 from the field! 

Miller's a nice player, but the fact that he plays for the EC might hurt his chances in getting the NCAC POY, especially if Cooper continues to produce like he has the past week or so.  You would think that since Port's injury, teams would focus more on Cooper, making his shot selection more difficult.  Instead, he has seemingly thrived as the focal point of Wooster's offense.  In the 3 games since Port has gone down, Cooper is an incredible 31-44 from the field which is over 70% shooting from the field!  These #'s would be impressive from a low post player, let alone a shooting guard that Cooper is!  Of course, this is whithout arguably Wooster's best player on the floor, which almost makes his numbers even more impressive.  Those numbers have to warrant some consideration for NCAC POY.  Not to mention the fact that Cooper the current league leader in ppg.  Miller is a nice player, but from what I've seen, Cooper is the better candidate for NCAC POY so far this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 29, 2006, 08:30:08 AM
BrandonMiller had a great game yesterday, but what happened to the rest of the team?  I've usually been critical of Miller for playing too selfishly, but it seemed that yesterday there was no choice.  It looked like nobody else wanted to have anything to do with playing Wooster and Miller was forced to play 1 on 5 just about every trip down the court.  That he put up 32 points with no help speaks volumes about the talent that kid has.

Another unbelievable performance by James Cooper.  He seems to be getting better and better each week and had been just about unstoppable since Port went down.  The biggest surprise yesterday seemed to be when he finally missed a shot about halfway through the 2nd half!  Also note that he had as many rebounds as anybody from Earlham did!

And another solid performance by Marty Bidwell.  While he didn't score much, he made some great assists and rebounds, and played solid defense. 

And finally - maybe the best fast break of the year with Brandon Johnson and Evan Will making great passes to each other down the court resulting in a sweet reverse layup (with a foul) for Johnson.

The Scots should have a relatively easy time on Wed (home against the Gators), then the big one next weekend in Springfield!

Go Scots! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 29, 2006, 09:48:30 AM
Reported attendance figures from yesterday's NCAC games:

Wabash at Oberlin: 121
Allegheny at Kenyon: 225
Hiram at OWU: 391
Wittenberg at Denison: 875
Earlham at Wooster:  1422
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 29, 2006, 09:56:56 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 29, 2006, 08:30:08 AM

And finally - maybe the best fast break of the year with Brandon Johnson and Evan Will making great passes to each other down the court resulting in a sweet reverse layup (with a foul) for Johnson.


What made even better was how it started.  Miller was breaking out for a possible breakaway and what looked to be a possible dunk, when Johnson came out of nowhere to streak behind Miller and intercept the pass.  He then turned back up the floor and derek described the rest of the play pretty well. 

That was a pretty nice crowd at Timken considering it was an afternoon game and it was as nice as it was yesterday.  I was surpised the attendance was as high as it was.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 29, 2006, 10:28:42 AM
another good win for witt yesterday at dension. i admit i was feeling a little timid about that game but once i heard witt was ahead big at the half i was at ease. a big game this wednesday at earlham because the game before the wooster game is alwayas a tough one, but with this game being on the road i think its even tougher. hopefully witt can take what they learned the first time and cause more havoc for earlham.

earlham guys? is the game environment going to be worth my "long" journey over to richmond? or should i not even bother.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 29, 2006, 12:10:46 PM
smedindy- yeah they changed it... they had him listed twice.. 1) as DID NOT PLAY COACHES DECISION! then 2) his name again right above it as ZERO across the  stat line with 1 minute being played.   I was suprised by seeing a NBA Box Score wrong... but it looks like they fixed it! 

NCAC never good at picking awards.. LOL  just saying that because I think Brandon Crawdford was NCAC new comer of the Year over Brandon MIller... At least one Brandon Stuck around in the NCAC for four years!  :)   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 29, 2006, 04:46:28 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 29, 2006, 02:47:30 AM
Quote from: DenisonFan on January 28, 2006, 08:39:18 PMAgain, Ghiloni plays 12 guys and we had no chance.  End of story.

I bet Oberlin would love to have the luxury of having 12 players available in a blowout loss. Get some perspective, man.

What are you talking about?  Is it my fault Oberlin has 8 guys.
Ghiloni went deep into his bench and when the smoke cleared  it was game over.  If the first string is having problems stopping Witt.  Why would he think the third string can do better?

Get some perspective.......that doesn't even make sense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2006, 04:50:50 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on January 29, 2006, 04:46:28 PMIf the first string is having problems stopping Witt.  Why would he think the third string can do better?

Get some perspective.......that doesn't even make sense.

Wow, it's a good thing you're not the coach. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 29, 2006, 05:49:28 PM
Well, to be honest, he could have played five players and when the smoke cleared they were out of it.

It seems like when Witt went on the 20-4 run over the last 13 plus minutes of the first half, Ghiloni tried his usual suspects.

Is it his fault Gognat, Izzo, Eberst, Krantz, Shea and McMahon did nothing, whilst Hern and Danny Boy led Borchers grab six boards and Russ score 11?

Funny, Witt played 11 guys in the first half and they did just dandy.

BTW - Minnesota shook things up and started two walk-ons against IU today. That worked out - if I was coaching and we scored just 13 in the first half I'd probably banish everyone in the second half and play the kids that worked hard in practice - or just play the freshmen to get them 20 good minutes of experience. What do you have to lose, you certainly couldn't do worse than 13 in the first half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on January 29, 2006, 06:01:11 PM
No the trip to earlham is not worth the trip. Nice gym, pretty disappointing fan base. Most likely will be a blowout also. The opening line is most likely Witt -19.5. Unless Del Harris shows up the trip is a waste of gas, and Del Harris has about the same odds of showing up as Brandon Miller does.
Del Harris to show up: 25/1
Brandon Miller to go for more than 20: 20/1
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on January 29, 2006, 07:42:42 PM
I would say Miller is definitely going to be considered for POY, but Earlham is so inconsistent it really hurts his chances of having a legitimate shot.  I think Cooper and Russ are the frontrunners at this point, primarily because of the way they play in pressure situations and big games.  Out of those two, I like Coop to take it because he's been so dominating at his position, even more so than Russ, IMO.

I think Miller and Chojnacki will be up there too, and possibly Hodgkinson if Denison can do anything down the stretch.  The way the NCAC selects awards anything can happen, though.

This is probably a good discussion to bring up now that we're past the midway point in the season.  Anyone else have any opinions on Newcomer and Coach of the Year, or maybe the All-NCAC teams?

It'll be nice to see the Gators on Wednesday.  I haven't had a chance to see them play at all this season so my opinions and details have been fairly limited.  Hollihan looks like a nice player, and it'll be interesting to see how he fares against Vandervaart in the post.  BTW, Hollihan was recruited by Wooster last season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on January 29, 2006, 07:51:58 PM
Is it just me, or has Witucky just looked bad this season at times?  His 3's are all over the place and his shooting percentages have plummetted.  Out of the regular members of the rotation, his shooting percentage (.421) is by far the lowest and is free throw numbers are scraping just above 60 percent.  I realize he's still leading the NCAC in assists with over four per game, but it seems like the rest of his game has taken a turn for the worse.  Any insightful explanations from the Wooster posters?

It is slightly ironic that one of the discussions before the season began was about Witucky being one of the best guards in the region, which I agreed with on several levels.  What would be his status now in region?  I'd put him second team All-NCAC at best.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 29, 2006, 07:57:35 PM
I think his all-around play is at his normal level, but he's definitely having a down season shooting the ball, both from behind the arc and at the line.  I've no idea why this has been going on for such an extended time, especially at the free throw line.  One the other hand, he seems to be getting to the hoop and finishing better than ever, although he doesn't do it often.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 29, 2006, 08:53:26 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 29, 2006, 05:49:28 PM
if I was coaching and we scored just 13 in the first half I'd probably banish everyone in the second half and play the kids that worked hard in practice - or just play the freshmen to get them 20 good minutes of experience. What do you have to lose, you certainly couldn't do worse than 13 in the first half.

And that's kind of the point I thought I was making. After scoring 13 they ought to go find the IM studs and give them a shot. But Denison has a luxury that Oberlin doesnt: 12 guys who want to and can play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2006, 09:04:40 PM
Furthermore, if the starting five aren't even remotely getting the job done on either end, why keep them in?  You might think that the scrubs can't do any better, but it looked like they couldn't do any worse, either.  It might be that the opponent is very well prepared to face the guys they think they're going to face, but are blindsided by someone from the end of the bench that has some attribute that they didn't expect to see. 

As the old saw goes, the definition of insanity is to do the same thing over and over and expect different results.  Or maybe the more appropriate joke is
Patient: Doctor, it hurts when I do this.  What should I do?
Doctor: Stop doing that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 29, 2006, 09:31:20 PM
Quote.  It might be that the opponent is very well prepared to face the guys they think they're going to face, but are blindsided by someone from the end of the bench that has some attribute that they didn't expect to see

Exactly. That's definitely what happened to IU today. Minnesota started a big ol' walkon (former TE at Harvard, no less) that basically could bang with Killingsworth and they couldn't react to it, at all. They scouted one Minnesota team, and another one, with two guys that hardly played, showed up and whopped 'em.

LG - You are right, too. Even Hiram has really good numbers this year and has a JV. I do hope Oberlin can get some numbers in the program. Tell Happy to go scout in Indiana and ask each coach who your smartest kid is, no matter how much he plays, and try to get them to go to school at Oberlin. I mean, it can't hurt, can it?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 29, 2006, 09:37:15 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 29, 2006, 09:31:20 PM
Tell Happy to go scout in Indiana and ask each coach who your smartest kid is, no matter how much he plays, and try to get them to go to school at Oberlin. I mean, it can't hurt, can it?

Oh yeah. Because they clearly aren't running that program to win NCAC titles. But they ought to be able to run it to avoid injury and embarrasment. These kids work hard. Way too hard to be put into that kind of meat grinder. I hope they can turn it around and get competitive again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 30, 2006, 02:16:43 AM
Quote from: waterboy on January 29, 2006, 07:51:58 PM
Is it just me, or has Witucky just looked bad this season at times?  His 3's are all over the place and his shooting percentages have plummetted.  Any insightful explanations from the Wooster posters?

Waterboy, I was wondering the same thing after seeing the Earlham game- what has been up with Witucky?  I looked at last year's stats, and actually his overall shooting precentage isn't that far off last year (.421 vs. .443 last year).  But it doesn't explain the 13% drop in FT % (60% vs. 73% last year) or the 9% drop in 3-pt % (37.6% vs. 46.7%).

On the perimeter I think Witucky has been forcing more shots than he did before.  It seems like he's hustled up a couple shots where he used to send the ball on for the one extra pass.  Last year I would have said that I wish he would shoot more from the perimeter, but Wooster has so many perimeter weapons that now I wonder if he should re-focus on making the extra pass.

I do think that Witucky is a big-game player, though.  His focus and determination and level of control always seems to go up in big games (career high in the Witt game last year), so I would expect that he will improve as Wooster plays the big games on the remainder of its schedule.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 30, 2006, 09:24:57 AM
Denison was not going to win the game from the tip.  My only point is that why not let the guys try and fight through it.  Why pull em as soon as something goes bad.  It is great experience to play against a good team.  Why not let them battle it out?

Nobody on the Big Red played well.  They just do not match up against Witt's size.

Again, I don't think it is a good idea to sit Hodgkinson and Hern at the same time.  Stats don't lie.  Those two guys are your best chance of getting the ball in the basket.  Sit them together for any length of time and you are making a huge mistake.

When you score 13 points in a half you won't beat too many teams. 

Hopefully they can right the ship and get back on the winning side on Wednesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 30, 2006, 10:24:25 AM
Off topic...

I meant to mention that leaving Wooster after the game on Satuday I drove down Palmer and the LC Boles was packed!  There was a group waiting on the 4th tee, a group on the 3rd green, and a solo waiting to hit his approach to the green.  His location - right next to the road - brought back many fond memories of playing there when I was a teenager just learning to golf.  If any readers here live on Palmer by #3, I apoligise for the times that I hit your house - or maybe even your dog in the backyard!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2006, 11:36:37 AM
QuoteAgain, I don't think it is a good idea to sit Hodgkinson and Hern at the same time.  Stats don't lie.  Those two guys are your best chance of getting the ball in the basket.  Sit them together for any length of time and you are making a huge mistake.

It's obvious from the stats that the only time they did that was in garbage time, since Hodgkinson played the entire first half and almost all of the second.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 30, 2006, 01:15:59 PM
Very unofficial QOWI for the GL Region after the weekend's games:

CMU: 11.077
BW:  10.647
Witt: 10.643
Woo: 10.200
Hope: 10.182
Albion: 10.000
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 30, 2006, 01:21:49 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on January 30, 2006, 02:16:43 AM
Quote from: waterboy on January 29, 2006, 07:51:58 PM
Is it just me, or has Witucky just looked bad this season at times?  His 3's are all over the place and his shooting percentages have plummetted.  Any insightful explanations from the Wooster posters?

Waterboy, I was wondering the same thing after seeing the Earlham game- what has been up with Witucky?  I looked at last year's stats, and actually his overall shooting precentage isn't that far off last year (.421 vs. .443 last year).  But it doesn't explain the 13% drop in FT % (60% vs. 73% last year) or the 9% drop in 3-pt % (37.6% vs. 46.7%).

On the perimeter I think Witucky has been forcing more shots than he did before.  It seems like he's hustled up a couple shots where he used to send the ball on for the one extra pass.  Last year I would have said that I wish he would shoot more from the perimeter, but Wooster has so many perimeter weapons that now I wonder if he should re-focus on making the extra pass.

I do think that Witucky is a big-game player, though.  His focus and determination and level of control always seems to go up in big games (career high in the Witt game last year), so I would expect that he will improve as Wooster plays the big games on the remainder of its schedule.

I haven't seen Witucky (or any other Scots) since the Stout game, so I'm going entirely on mental impressions formed from radio coverage, stats, and discussion in here.  But (leaving aside the free throws, a bug that seems to have bitten the whole team), when trying to compare stats from last season to this one, you need to keep in mind how very different these two teams are.  Last year, Witucky's role was to run the half-court set, engineering a way to get the ball into Schlingman, Mealer, Vandervaart, or Bradley with the best position to score, or to get it inside for a kick out to Port or one of the other shooters for the open look.  His role was not shooting, which meant he had more open looks as the game went along. 

This year, he's running a more hurry-up offense, and is less that he's running it than he's a part of it.  The offense more or less runs itself.  It seems to me that one important aspect of this offense is that Vandervaart has a decided quickness advantage on the folks guarding him, so the quicker the ball get up court and shot, the better chance he has for a rebound.  That might explain why Witucky shoots in situations where last year he might have passed.  The "extra pass" is always important, but with this offense it's less important.  Every player in the rotation has the ability to shoot, even to shoot 3's.  Considering that, I think there is an emphasis on shooting whenever you have a good look, especially early in the possession, when Wooster's quickness advantage will help offset its relative lack of height.  That mindset will lead to more shooting and less passing from a player like Witucky.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 30, 2006, 01:28:12 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 30, 2006, 01:15:59 PM
Very unofficial QOWI for the GL Region after the weekend's games:

CMU: 11.077
BW:  10.647
Witt: 10.643
Woo: 10.200
Hope: 10.182
Albion: 10.000


Nice work, anyone else surprised to see CMU's so high.

The winners of this weekends witt/woo  hope/albion clashes should get a big boost.  Those will be 14 or 15 point wins for someone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 30, 2006, 02:25:03 PM
Check out the records of the UAA teams.  They all have in-region records of over .500 except for Emory.  They've only had 3 games this year that resulted in a QOWI of less than 10 points - a win against Oberlin and the losses to Case and Chicago.   (Compared to 8 for B-W, 4 for Witt, 8 for Woo, and 5 for Hope and Albion.)


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 30, 2006, 02:35:51 PM
Earlhamalum and Billy_p,

I as reading the game story from EC's game against Witt and it mentioned that Brandon Miller was dealing with foul trouble and had to sit out quite a bit since he had the task of guarding Witt's big men. 

What do you think Earlham will do differently this time around? Since Miller is your best offensive weapon, seems like they need to assign the task of gaurding the twin towers to someone else?  Just curious...



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 30, 2006, 02:49:04 PM
BlindWatchmaker- That is one heck of a question!  I'm sure Coach J is thinking the same thing.  As for me; you just can't zone these guys.  They are to discipline of a team.  They will work the ball around and get great shots and it is hard to rebound defensively in a 2-3 zone... So that Axe's that out of the picture.

I think Nick Welsh needs to have the game of his life!  *this is bad if i'm hoping on Nick to show up.  The rest will have to be Defense by Committee.  I think Markcous Jewett needs to play big.  *he can pose a problem for Wittengberg's 4 guy!  They need to hit the 3 Ball consistently.  I'd like to see Brandon Miller score 18pts 12 Rebounds and 5 Assist, 3 Steals... (is that asking to MUCH?) WoostBNEL- You can screw u and ur 1/20 odds on B-Mill scoring 20.  I'd also like to see LaRon Henry and Tyler Stewart to put up better then Average numbers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2006, 02:51:01 PM
Earlhamalum -

Whoa there! I think WoostBNel is kind of a troll (and that screen name is false pretenses anyway) but no reason to get all nasty.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 30, 2006, 02:57:11 PM
do you guys honestly think the hour drive is worth it on wednesday because otherwise i'll be forced to do studying for a test thursday

ticket news today on the witt wooster game

ticket sales will be going on sale starting on saturday at noon instead of the 5:00 time as believe before. there will be 2,000 tickets to the general public available with the other 1000 going to the wittenberg community that needs to tickets for admission. it will quite an atmosphere like always-much hype
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 30, 2006, 03:00:29 PM
I know Woo generally has a couple of buses that will head down to Witt, with tix opening up that early its going to be hard to get tix for those traveling there.  Do they reserve a certain number for away visitors?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on January 30, 2006, 03:36:38 PM
DC,

If you haven't seen Witucky play since Stout, then you have no idea what I'm talking about.  He gets the same shots as he did last year and he is simply off target.  If anything, he is pasing the ball more often this season than last, and not being forced to heave up desperation shots.  I've seen him barely draw iron on two very open 3's in each of the last two games.  I don't mean to be rude, but you'd have to see it to understand precisely what I mean.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 30, 2006, 04:28:23 PM
No offense taken, waterboy.  I was just stating my opinions, based on observations from afar.  Nobody is required to agree with them.  Anyway, I was responding to scotsbrod, whose analysis was more of a this year vs. last year look.  You are quite correct that I have little to go on when considering January vs. December. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on January 30, 2006, 04:39:16 PM
If I had to guess what the difference is I would guess it to be confidence. It may sound funny but shooting a basketball is much more mental than physical, once you miss a few shots that can really snowball on a player. Knowing Kyle as well as I do I know he will bounce back and hit them when it counts. I wouldn't pay too much attention to FG% as an indicator of his play though, what he brings to the table stretches much farther than his FG%. That kid could shoot 20% from the arc and I would pick him first on my team...unless Nelson was still available. Good luck this week and on Saturday...hopefully the Scots will be able to "shoot the lights back on" in the HPER
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on January 30, 2006, 06:21:59 PM
I actually just had a similar discussion with an associate about Witucky's confidence.  He's passed up a few open shots the last couple games, but I'm sure he'll come around.  I'd like to see him take it to the rack and get his game started.

Since there hasn't been an overwhelming reply to my question about All-NCAC teams, here are my picks as of right now, based on what I've seen and the numbers themselves of course: 

First Team
Brandon Miller, EAR
Dan Russ, WIT
James Cooper, WOO
Tim Vandervaart, WOO
Ben Chojnacki, OWU
Dan Hodgkinson, DEN

*Pretty much same as last year, except for Wooster.  I think Vandervaart and Cooper have outplayed Port and Witucky at this point, although if Port lights it up when he comes back he should still receive first team consideration.

I have to think about the other teams and Newcomer before I make my guesses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on January 30, 2006, 07:38:34 PM
For Newcomer of the Year, my picks would by Yelvington (Ken), Hollihan (All), and Johnson (Woo).  I would have said Yelvington is ahead of the other too, but his recent injury may hurt his chances if he isn't able to come back.  I could be wrong though.  Hollihan will be at Wooster on Wed. so we'll see how it actually stacks up against some real competition.  Johnson has been far and away the most impressive that I've seen play so far this year and he just gets more impressive as the season progressess. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 30, 2006, 08:07:44 PM
I know the lack of TV coverage for high level and high ranking regular season Division III matchups has been well documented on this board. 
A couple of weeks ago I sent emails out to Fox Sports, ESPN and CSTV (all on my DirecTV).  And I finally got a response.  Now the reponse was basically a dismissive: "Thanks, your comments are noted.  Check your listings."  But I got a actual person's email address.  (I apologize in advance, Pat but I did not see anything in the Terms of Service).
   A Ms. Erica Melton emailed back to me and I am asking that everyone on this board that would enjoy watching Division III sports (especially, basketball since it is season) shoot her an email and express yourself.  Can you believe that SAT Night ESPNU had not one but two High School games!?!?!  Shameful.  The CSTV Email address is: emelton@cstv.com.  Good luck guys and be polite
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 30, 2006, 09:23:29 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 30, 2006, 01:21:49 PM
...But (leaving aside the free throws, a bug that seems to have bitten the whole team), when trying to compare stats from last season to this one, you need to keep in mind how very different these two teams are.  Last year, Witucky's role was to run the half-court set, engineering a way to get the ball into Schlingman, Mealer, Vandervaart, or Bradley with the best position to score, or to get it inside for a kick out to Port or one of the other shooters for the open look.  His role was not shooting, which meant he had more open looks as the game went along. 

This year, he's running a more hurry-up offense, and is less that he's running it than he's a part of it.  The offense more or less runs itself.  It seems to me that one important aspect of this offense is that Vandervaart has a decided quickness advantage on the folks guarding him, so the quicker the ball get up court and shot, the better chance he has for a rebound.  That might explain why Witucky shoots in situations where last year he might have passed.  The "extra pass" is always important, but with this offense it's less important.  Every player in the rotation has the ability to shoot, even to shoot 3's.  Considering that, I think there is an emphasis on shooting whenever you have a good look, especially early in the possession, when Wooster's quickness advantage will help offset its relative lack of height.  That mindset will lead to more shooting and less passing from a player like Witucky.
Quote
David, point taken on the year-to-year comparison for Woo...but...
I think my point is that even with every Wooster gaurd able and willing to shoot the 3, and with the up-tempo offense centered on "shooting whenever you have a good look" is that Witucky's shot selection has sometimes seemed forced and awkward to me.  That is, he's not taking good shots.  It's just my opinion, but I feel that he was more effective last year when he passed up more shots in favor of another pass- and then only shot when he clearly was open.  He let the offense come to him and didn't try to press it.  Still, he's so good with the ball and with controlling the offensive flow for Wooster that his value is far beyond his shooting stats.

And I think he will be stellar this weekend because I still think he's a player that rises to the occasion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on January 31, 2006, 09:18:50 AM
All of these recent conversations are great....but OWU scored 121 points on Saturday!!!  I was not able to make it to the game.  Could anyone update me on this game.  Did OWU just shoot the lights out or is Hiram really that bad?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 31, 2006, 09:26:13 AM
Quote from: bishopsfan on January 31, 2006, 09:18:50 AM
All of these recent conversations are great....but OWU scored 121 points on Saturday!!! I was not able to make it to the game. Could anyone update me on this game. Did OWU just shoot the lights out or is Hiram really that bad?

I'm guessing the answer is 'YES' to both!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 09:31:16 AM
Hiram isn't that bad, really, because they had a good defensive effort against Wooster and when they were at Wabash they played hard. I think OWU was just 'en fuego', as it were. One of those days.

About five pages ago I posted a blurb about the game.  Hiram was outrebounded 55-39 and OWU shot 52.7% from the floor while Hiram shot just 30.8%.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 31, 2006, 09:34:21 AM
Tom Port Update:

The cast is off!  Tom practiced yesterday with a splint which apparently did not affect his catching or shooting.  He will not play against Allegheny and is listed as 'Questionable' for the game on Saturday.

The article from the Daily Record: http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles//sports/&file=_sports3.txt&article=1&tD=

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 31, 2006, 10:35:22 AM
I wouldn't characterize Hiram's defensive effort against Wooster as "good" per se.  After all, they did give up 102 points.  To their credit, they did step up their defensive effort in the 2nd half after allowing 66 in the 1st half.  But still, any time you give up triple digits to the opposing team, you can't call it a good defensive effort.

Here is a quote that I found amusing.  It is from the Wittenberg Basketball page regarding ticket sales for this Saturday's game:

Quote from: Ryan Maurer write-up about Witt/Woo TicketsWhile the Tigers are averaging less than 1,000 fans per home game so far in the 2005-06 season, the game against Wooster is expected to be a sellout, meaning that all 3,000 seats in the arena will be filled.

So that is what a sellout is?  I guess it needs to be explained when you are averaging less than 1,000 a game. ;) :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 11:44:33 AM
In the context of Wooster's point totals - for Hiram it was a good defensive effort. It's all about the context.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 31, 2006, 12:37:22 PM
Wooster has given up point totals of: 101, 110, 113, 91, and 94 this season.  Are they a rotten defensive team?

People in glass houses....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 31, 2006, 01:10:33 PM
Why is it that you two feel compelled to jump on, usually in tandem, any comment that's made by a Wooster poster?  It really gets old.

Hiram's defensive effort was abyssmal.  They gave up 65 first half points, allowing Wooster to shoot it at 63.4%.  They would very likely have given up a like number of points in the second half had Tom Port not been knocked out of the game, this having the dual effect of removing one of the best players on the court but also taking much of the starch out of the Wooster team.

If you really want to talk about wondrous defensive efforts, how about that of Wabash when they hosted the Scots?  An obvious good job in the first half, but then it sure seems like they folded up their tent in the second stanza, as Wooster went for 66 on 25-37 shooting.

Normally, I wouldn't comment to this extent on a game that I only heard on the radio, but as it's already been established on this forum that sitting in the stands with a bird's eye view is not a prerequisite to being an expert, I'll just follow suit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 01:26:01 PM
Now just hold on a cotton pickin' minute here.

I was the one who originally stated that Hiram had a 'good' defensive 'effort' against Wooster.

Not great - not fab - but good.

Did I denigrate the Scots' defense or their offense?

No.

Did I say anything bad about the Scots?

No.

Did I make any claim about Wabash's defense, at all?

No. In fact, if you would have cared to go back, I think the general consensus was that Wabash's second half performance against Wooster was one of stink, stank, stunk. (But that would involve reading old posts).

I just said Hiram had a good defensive effort. Someone claimed otherwise, and I countered with a mere plea for context. In looking at a defensive performance, you need to gather a baseline of how the other teams offense normally performs.

Let us consider that game vs. the game against Ohio Wesleyan.

Wooster averages almost 97 points a game. Hiram gave them 101, which is close to their average, well within an expect result.

OWU averages 79 points a game, even with that Hiram score.

Thus, the conclusion is that based on the contexts of the two games, the fact that Hiram only allowed Wooster a scant few points over its average, while allowing OWU to score nearly at will, led me to believe that the effort was good against Wooster, and poor against OWU.

There was no intended slight of Wooster, at all, and if you read that into it then that's sad.You sir, are twisting things way out of context, and reading way too much into things. It was my comment originally that started this discussion, and I replied in kind with my thoughts. Kindly read the entire discussion, and think about your replies.

You know, I had liked your insight and posts earlier, but now I fear you are becoming as nettlesome and irrational as some of the Wabash football posters many Scots complain about.




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 01:35:02 PM
Oh, and obviously I can't attend every game here on D3hoops.com, nor see every team. But I know how to read and parse out box scores, study the power rankings and know my way around how good (or not) each team and conference is, in a general sense.

I also have learned that partisans eyes can decieve (having had to remain neutral when covering games, you tend to see things differently when you're rabidly rooting) and that radio descriptions, especially from hometown announcers, aren't always 100% bias free. So I try to suss out the real stories, instead of parroting the 'party' line.

(Again, read what I post on the FB site about Wabash - I'm not a kool aid drinker there...)

Besides, you should focus your bile and derision on Wittenberg. Who's the real enemy?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on January 31, 2006, 01:36:07 PM
It is hard for me to believe that chojnacki, vanderfart, and hodgy will make first team ahead of one of the best players in the conference (The Great Dane).  However you are entitled to your opinion even if it is biased (3 Wooster players on first team). While we are on the topic of Witt v. Woo, Bill Brown will have a scheme to slow down Cooper, and have a good post defense plan. This is up for dispute but im setting the opening line for Witt v Woo.

Witt  -4.5
O/U  175.5

Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 31, 2006, 01:10:33 PM
Why is it that you two feel compelled to jump on, usually in tandem, any comment that's made by a Wooster poster? It really gets old.

wah  :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 31, 2006, 01:40:43 PM
Children (adults) Children (adults) Children (adults) can't we just all get along!

Bottom line Wooster scores and they score a lot!  I bet that Wooster/Wittenberg game is going to be a battle. *They usually are.  Witt. Always known for their D, and Wooster this year scoring at will.  When is that game?  I want to take the day off from all prior commitments and go to Springfield!  (Did I really just say that)  

I am not all the knowledgeable about other conferences, but this has to be one of the top 3 showdowns in all of D3 basketball... dare I say all of college basketball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on January 31, 2006, 01:49:18 PM
Defensive Ranking in the NCAC (rank in  all of D3):

1. Wittenberg (1)
2. Wabash (77)
3. Earlham (122)
4. OWU (228)
5. Denison (239)
6. Allegheny (264)
7. Kenyon (278)
8. Wooster (297)
9. Hiram (353)
10. Oberlin (369)

Out of 396 schools.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 31, 2006, 01:55:41 PM
Don't look now but guess who the guest coach will be on Hoopsville tonight! 

No curse please!

Witt4ever- wonder what the NCAC list would look like if you did one for Offense?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on January 31, 2006, 02:14:14 PM
Quote from: blindwatchmaker on January 31, 2006, 01:55:41 PM
Don't look now but guess who the guest coach will be on Hoopsville tonight! 

No curse please!

Witt4ever- wonder what the NCAC list would look like if you did one for Offense?

  1. Wooster (7)
  2. OWU (50)
  3. Earlham (168)
  4. Wittenberg (178)
  5. Denison (182)
  6. Allegheny (184)
  7. Wabash (199)
  8. Hiram (209)
  9. Kenyon (290)
10. Oberlin (371)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 31, 2006, 02:14:23 PM
These next 5 games for Wabash could be VERY interesting.  They have one tough road ahead.  They drop 5 straight they are toast.

First Team All-Conference:
You must have two from Witt and two from Wooster.
If Port comes back, which it looks like he will, don't you have to put him on 1st team?

I think both Borchers and Brady are equally deserving.   

I think everyone else mentioned should be there as well.  So it could be interesting.  A lot will depend on the final standings in the conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 02:21:14 PM
DFan -

Fortunately, four of the five are at home, where only IWU and Wooster bested the LGs. Now, while I'd be a dang fool to predict a win over Witt, at home I feel confident against OWU, Earlham and Denison.

However, a poor effort could definitely lead to some losses and a road trip in the NCAC tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 31, 2006, 02:22:35 PM
Quote from: blindwatchmaker on January 31, 2006, 01:55:41 PM
Don't look now but guess who the guest coach will be on Hoopsville tonight! 

No curse please!

Witt4ever- wonder what the NCAC list would look like if you did one for Offense?

There hasn't been any curse talk all season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 31, 2006, 02:39:43 PM
WooBoo!  Given the lack of expletives in your most recent post, it would appear that you've been released from the ward and are back on the meds.  Great to see...keep up the good work. 

I'm not sure what Wabash had to do with the Wooster/Hiram game.  In fact I'm quite certain that Wabash had nothing to do with that game.  I'll check the box score, but I don't think even the NCAC's scorekeepers this season would have stuffed a Wabash player or two into that game.  I wish I could say that with absolute certainty...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 31, 2006, 03:56:33 PM
Pat,

the only reason I brought that up was that when I clicked the Hoospville link from the front page, you have a curseshirtfront.jpe that it said it was opening which brought it to my attention!  Then i looked down and saw who the guest coach was going to be :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 31, 2006, 05:50:39 PM
According to my calculations, there is some bozo who's garnered national network time at 9 p.m. in order to attempt to upstage Steve Moore.  I'll stick to Hoopsville, where I'm sure I'll hear some intelligent remarks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on January 31, 2006, 06:03:19 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 31, 2006, 02:39:43 PM
WooBoo!  Given the lack of expletives in your most recent post, it would appear that you've been released from the ward and are back on the meds.  Great to see...keep up the good work. 



Looks like he is off them again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on January 31, 2006, 06:52:41 PM
Interesting news for Wooster fans,

http://www.wooster.edu/news/0506/HalesAnnouncesPlans.php

I can't help but wonder what this will mean for Woo's athletics.  I remember when I first reported to Wooster for camp.  It was clear at that time that President Hales was pro athletics all the way.  I remember seeing him at most, if not all, athletic events I have attended (even when he seemed a bit blury to me). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 09:06:32 PM
You know, even Wabash fans know enough not to go that low against DePauw, WooBoo. Everyone knows the Dannies are sissified mama's boys, but at least we know they're not criminals (well, at least convicted - they're rich enough to hire the best lawyers).

Wittenberg is a fine school - and we as NCAC members should not play the academic card amongst us - save that for the OAC  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 31, 2006, 09:12:24 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 09:06:32 PMEveryone knows the Dannies are sissified mama's boys, but at least we know they're not criminals (well, at least convicted - they're rich enough to hire the best lawyers).

I'd practice FAMILY LAW before I'd defend a Dannie in a court of law.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 31, 2006, 09:35:27 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 31, 2006, 06:44:57 PM
I wonder exactly how they deal with admissions at Wittenberg, anyway? I mean, it's clear that first of all if you have above a C average or your SAT's exceed 800 total you're immediately shown the door.

But it goes further than that, doesn't it?  I mean, there are plenty of people in the world who aren't too bright, but are still really nice guys.  So, there must be other, more detailed, criteria.  Personal histories must be poured over in order to determine if the applicant ever commited an act of human kindness.  Certainly, you wouldn't want students with that sort of background, it could alter the reputation of the whole student body.

An early criminal background would definitely be a plus.  Why, someone coming directly from a juvenile detention center would have a large advantage over the normal high school graduate, even if the latter had a solid D+ average.  A history of vandalism and hazing might even propel such an applicant immediately into his sophomore year where he could jump into such courses as Ill Manners 201 or Trash Talk 211.

A world of opportunity must be open to the graduates of such a school, though.  But digging those ditches, while fun for a while, eventually gets old.

Wow.  Someone is a little moody after his tirade last week.

And if a C average or higher and higher than 800 SAT scores aren't allowed at Witt, then I just happen to wonder how my A- average and 1260 SATs got me in . . . hmmmmm.  That statement had NO relevance, and was only a way to try and degrade a school just because your precious little Wooster has a rivalry with it.

I'm not even going to say anything more.  You're a joke.  And, quite frankly, idoitic comments such as these don't deserve it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 10:16:22 PM
QuoteI'd practice FAMILY LAW before I'd defend a Dannie in a court of law.

If it please this body, may I revise and extend my remarks to state that the best non-Wabash lawyer. Thanks.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 31, 2006, 10:18:06 PM
Quote from: witt4ever on January 31, 2006, 06:03:19 PM
Looks like he is off them again.

You got that post because you made the above remark.  If you stop making personal comments like that, then I'll obviously have no reason to reply.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 10:21:02 PM
Pot - meet kettle.  :o

And with that, I'm ignoring WooBoo's diatribes, because I'm afraid that if I post something on the Earlham / Witt game tomorrow as an observer it'll be a slam against the Scots, somehow. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2006, 10:57:38 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 10:21:02 PM
Pot - meet kettle.  :o

And with that, I'm ignoring WooBoo's diatribes, because I'm afraid that if I post something on the Earlham / Witt game tomorrow as an observer it'll be a slam against the Scots, somehow. 

I don't see how this is helpful.  :(

Let's all agree that we hate each other, and hate each other's schools, and that every player is a goon, and stop pouring gasoline in here and get back to normal, okay?   :D  PLEASE?   :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 11:00:36 PM
Sorry, it's been a very trying night elsewhere in the Smed ranch. My vitriol is spilling over.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 31, 2006, 11:03:45 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 31, 2006, 10:57:38 PMstop pouring gasoline in here and get back to normal, okay?

I thought that was  normal.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 11:18:48 PM
And I do apologize to WooBoo for being overtly sarcastic and snide in my 'pot - kettle' post. It HAS been a night, of little things, big things, and annoying things here.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 31, 2006, 11:22:53 PM
This has been a rough couple of days. But a couple of gin and tonics and an episode of The Shield and I'm all good.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 11:24:14 PM
I wish it were that easy. I mean, I can deal with losing a glove, and losing an IM game to the Phi Delts (and they didn't even cheat), but a couple of other things at home have really burned my fern.

Anywho - back to the hoops!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 31, 2006, 11:28:10 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 11:24:14 PMand they didn't even cheat

.....this time.... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 11:28:47 PM
The OWU - Wabash game at Chadwick Wednesday is h-u-g-e. I know Witt / Wooster will take the lions share of attention, but this game has great implications for the first round of the tourney and the seeding thereof.

While they will be underdogs, of course, both OWU and Wabash have the ability to put quite a scare into Wooster or Witt during the NCAC tourney. Of course, it would be best if they caught one of them on a neutral court, instead of the home court, so the #3 seed is key. However, a #4 seed is key as well as you want to have that home game to give you and edge to GET to the final four and have a chance at Wooster and / or Witt.

The loser is likely going to have to scramble to see if they can get to #4. OWU has a rough road schedule upcoming, so this may be as close to a must win as you can have right now for them. And it is for Wabash as well, as they should not squander the home court.

With Earlham and Denison lurking in the high weeds, this is a crucial game for both teams and it should be a good one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 31, 2006, 11:30:23 PM
I'll go on record as saying that I don't hate everybody else's schools (lest it be Depauw).  I have a very strong distaste for Witt, I have a strong respect for Wooster (even WooBoo hasn't sullied that), and I'm relatively benevolent toward the rest of the conference.  And it's not just hoops...it's all sports and other things institutionally related.  

Just so you know where I stand.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 31, 2006, 11:32:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 31, 2006, 10:18:06 PM
Quote from: witt4ever on January 31, 2006, 06:03:19 PM
Looks like he is off them again.

You got that post because you made the above remark.  If you stop making personal comments like that, then I'll obviously have no reason to reply.

Let me officially say that your response far exceeded the supposed injustice.

If you are only here to rabble-rouse, WooBoo, then we're going to rethink your posting privileges.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2006, 11:40:22 PM
It sounds like there's some exciting things going on at Kenyon.  Their palatial new facility seems to be helping their recruting in all sports, including men's hoops.  The current seven-man first-year class, including Yelvington and Bediako (who leads the NCAC in blocks), were attracted at least in part by the new facilities and the commitments they evidence.  Today's Daily Record quotes Kenyon men's hoops coach Matt Croci at length. 
Quote from: Wooster Daily Record"At Kenyon, we're certainly proud of our academics and our reputation that way. For a long time, people were nervous about a building like this taking away from some of our focus on the academics. I think we now have enough people on board that are starting to understand that you can balance the two. "We're never going to turn into Wooster or Wittenberg in terms of that kind of a commitment
(to athletics), but I think it's gotten a lot better."

I know I am not alone in hoping that this is the start of something big at Kenyon, and a return to competitiveness for the Lords.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 11:46:29 PM
That's great. I was also encouraged by the size of the classes at Denison and Hiram, which had been numbers shy as well in the recent past. (Denison in the Lee era, for sure).

It's funny, though, that Kenyon would not claim a commitment to athletics like Wooster or Witt when they have probably two of THE most storied D-3 program of all time, making the Mt. Union domination of football seem ordinary in comparison!

You don't get that good at something without SOME commitment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 31, 2006, 11:48:31 PM
Smedindy -

Apology accepted, and you have mine also.  Here's hoping we can start fresh.

David -

That big guy Bediako is a first-year??!!  Holy cow!  He's gonna be scary after they teach him how to play.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on January 31, 2006, 11:50:29 PM
So I'm at work (State Farm corporate HQ) and meet a new executive in my division who I'll be working with.  In an introductory meeting he says, "You probably haven't heard of my alma mater...I went to College of Wooster."  Within 30 seconds I had thrown out "Fighting Scots", "Timken", "Moore", and "Wittenberg Saturday."

I'm quite certain he was both shocked and impressed.  Ah the value of D3hoops.com!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 11:55:20 PM
Ah yes. Even though I work in the 'industry' as it were, I dumfound people (who mainly work on the computer systems or behind the scenes in the advancement office) when I see what school they're from, and I know how they did in basketball or football, and they seem to be indifferent about it all?

Nothing like congratulating someone who works at Capital on the good playoff win against Wabash and be met with a semi-blank stare! (Though I did find that Wooster and the U. of Dayton folks knew about their hoops teams, though a colleague at Washington & Jefferson professed ignorance that they even played basketball there.)

Now if only the national mediots would understand what a great game Witt and Wooster will be on Saturday...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2006, 11:58:06 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 11:46:29 PM
It's funny, though, that Kenyon would not claim a commitment to athletics like Wooster or Witt when they have probably two of THE most storied D-3 program of all time, making the Mt. Union domination of football seem ordinary in comparison!

You don't get that good at something without SOME commitment.

Yeah, Kenyon's commitment to sports is a narrow stream, but where it runs, it runs very deep indeed.  And the opposite end of the scale isn't Wooster and Wittenberg, it's Denison, at least as far as I can tell.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 01, 2006, 12:03:36 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 11:55:20 PMNow if only the national mediots would understand what a great game Witt and Wooster will be on Saturday...

I don't know why I thought it would happen, but when ESPNU was announced I had hopes that they would show games like this rather than a Sun Belt matchup. It would be a lot better channel if they did.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2006, 12:05:08 AM
That's true - Denison does have the all-sports lead and has won eight in a row (though there is some derision because of their performance in football and hoops, but mind you that's not the be all and end all of athletics, you mooks!)

Hiram has issues with the all sports, but they are quite small, compared to the rest of the NCAC. (The same size as Wabash, but co-ed. That affects things).

Earlham is the school that needs to get in gear. (And Wabash needs a lacrosse program, but that's another time and place...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2006, 12:06:14 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 11:55:20 PM... though a colleague at Washington & Jefferson professed ignorance that they even played basketball there.)

In a way, they don't.  :D

Quote from: smedindy on January 31, 2006, 11:55:20 PMNow if only the national mediots would understand what a great game Witt and Wooster will be on Saturday...

Well, at least ONE national media outlet will be in attendance, covering this game with the fervor it deserves... :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2006, 12:14:49 AM
Aside from the big Wabash / OWU clash, three other games on Wednesday seem foregone conclusions (sorry Earlham, love to see the upset but I can't call it) - the Kenyon / Hiram matchup is important for the #8 seed in the tourney.

Many may scoff but that is an important goal for those schools. They get to play at least one additional game and have a little more practice time. And for players like Formato and Rehm of Kenyon, or TC Spencer of Hiram one additional game in their college career is gravy. Besides, you never know in basketball. Curry did beat Trinity (CT) and Nazarene beat St. John Fisher this year. And 3-15 Augsburg beat 14-4 St. Thomas as well.

(Though in Vegas, it would be Kenyon +25 1/2 against Wooster in the NCAC tourney)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 01, 2006, 12:20:26 AM
QuoteEarlham is the school that needs to get in gear. (And Wabash needs a lacrosse program, but that's another time and place...)

#1. We're in Indiana.
#2. We're on D3Hoops.com

#1 + #2 = complete apathy to all other sports...

In fact, it's my greatest dream that Earlham will drop all sports except for men's basketball...freeing up funds for the basketball program and grand success might therefore arrive.

Eh, I suppose we can keep around the women's basketball program too....I need a mortal enemy.

And women's soccer....it can stay as well. (That was for you Mrs. Lickliter and Mr. Watts.)  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2006, 12:28:34 AM
Ah, but some of us are also on D3football.com as well!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 01, 2006, 12:32:55 AM
QuoteAh, but some of us are also on D3football.com as well!

We're was some sort of third person, plural refrence to myself...Billy_Pilgrim

ah, playing with persona........only on a D-3 message board and Mary Lacey's creative writing class (the highlight of any liberal arts college curriculum)

Where were those earlier posts about SAT scores? Come on, we're all educated...earlhamalum excluded......

seriously, tomorrow night (and the actual games) can't get here soon enough...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 01, 2006, 12:39:13 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 01, 2006, 12:05:08 AM
And Wabash needs a lacrosse program, but that's another time and place...)

Is there still a club team?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 01, 2006, 09:16:12 AM
billy_pilgram-  I got my four-year degree in Procrastination... doesn't that count for me Edumucation?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2006, 10:09:29 AM
Oh, Billy, you missed a heck of a girls game on Friday.

The final score was 72-65 - it was well played with not many turnovers, no jump balls. Whilst it wasn't a packed house, and of course it hasn't been since the IHSAA became idiots and foisted class basketball on us,  it was the largest crowd of the season and they all came pretty early, too. Crawfordsville scored six points in 51 seconds to cut a 9-point lead to three and kept that momentum.

That game was much better than the boys game, BTW...

Try it, you'll like it! (Of course, if you go see Riverton Parke play North Vermillion, then all claims are off the table!)  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 01, 2006, 10:28:44 AM
With their new facility, and hopefully a new commitment to improving their teams, I can foresee Kenyon becoming sort of a DIII Stanford or Duke, an academically excellent school that also excels in a variety of sports.

The Kenyon student body, including the athletic teams, comes from all over the country.  The word is obviously already out that it's an excellent school.  It's my suspicion, too, that since the campus is so isolated that they must have something else going on for them, a strong cohesiveness among the students.  This new athletic facility will only further that.  I'd say, watch out for them over the next few years, especially in hoops.  They may find themselves wishing they'd have built a gym with more than the current 1,500 seats (it didn't seem possible, given it's setting, to add more seating, except possibly a couple of rows of low bleachers at court's end).  A very positive dilemna.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 01, 2006, 11:10:18 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 01, 2006, 12:03:36 AM

I don't know why I thought it would happen, but when ESPNU was announced I had hopes that they would show games like this rather than a Sun Belt matchup. It would be a lot better channel if they did.


It's not the Sun Belt matchups that ESPNU airs that irk me.  Well, they do a little bit. It's the High School Hoops matchups they seem to be airing on a nightly basis that really irritates me.  I had high hopes for this channel when it was announced, and not just for the possibility of showing some high profile DIII games, but also for the possibility of seeing some other NCAA sports as well.  Instead, we get high school phenoms.  I can't see those ratings as being very high for those games.  And speaking of ratings, how about Fairfield vs. Rider or Delaware St. vs. S. Carolina St. on the docket this weekend.  I don't know about anyone else, but I can't wait for those matchups?! ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2006, 11:11:32 AM
One thing, though, is that Kenyon relies on full-pay students more than some other NCAC schools.  While that doesn't hurt in swimming, where the athletes may be more affluent, that does hurt in some areas.

However, that hasn't stopped Witt (who has the lowest endowment per student of anyone in the NCAC) from competing. But it is a factor to consider. If you are a moderate income family, and you have to pay more to go to Kenyon rather than another school, it's a choice you must make.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2006, 11:12:28 AM
Scots Fan -

I'm all for those games being televised. I troll my dish to see the small D-1 conferences - so bring 'em on! They're better, I think, than watching the mediorce big conference teams slog it out.

Besides Delaware St. vs. South Carolina St. is an important MEAC game, and Delaware St. has a good team that could upset someone in the D-1 tourney. If you recall, they gave Duke all they could handle last year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 01, 2006, 12:03:11 PM
I think the game tonight vs Earlham all depends on the start of the game. Basically, if Witt gets off to a good start on the road and proves that they're not looking ahead to Wooster, its all over. Sorry Quakers, you just don't have the experience to come back against us.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 01, 2006, 03:10:53 PM
Kenyon's new facility can only help!  I didn't think their old gym was that bad... I could think of a handful I'd update before Kenyon's.  OBERLIN, HIRAM, DEN,OWU. *okay i didn't complete the whole hand. 

If you look at where Earlham was PRE-1999 (basketball related) and 1999-current, there is a Huge change.  The Wellness Center Open it's doors in 1999.  (My freshman year).  I only heard stories about the old TRUEBLOOD Field House, but I'm not sure if you could have talked me and my parents into Spending 20+ thousand a year to go there and play in a poor facility.  I could have gone to I.U. for under 8 thousand and have a better work-out area for the Students!  Well that wasn't true when Earlham Built the Wellness Center and that is one thing that Coach J  used in recruiting.  So Kenyon could be the next Ohio team in years to come competing for the Top 4 spots.  Does Chad Ploke (sp?) have any eligibility  left?

Pennstghs- It did take Witt. two tries to get their first win,  at Schuckman Court in the Wellness Center!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 01, 2006, 03:33:51 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 01, 2006, 03:10:53 PM
Kenyon's new facility can only help!  I didn't think their old gym was that bad... I could think of a handful I'd update before Kenyon's.  OBERLIN, HIRAM, DEN,OWU. *okay i didn't complete the whole hand. 


You can take Denison off your list because Livingston Gym was newly renovated this season.  You make a good point about facilities making a difference in recruiting.  Earlham was not a very good program before the Wellness Center came into fruition.  Coach Justus in combination with the new facilities has really made Earlham into a competitive program in the conference. 

The problem is, Wooster will be getting some new digs in a few years, so that advantage of having nicer facilities will be out the window.  Not that Wooster's current facilities hinder their recruiting in any way.  ;)

And Smeds, to each his own.  Personally, I don't find much interest in the MEAC or any other obscure DI conferences.  I do like to see some of those obscure teams cause some havoc come March.  But until then, unless it involves Michigan (who happens to be tied for 1st in the Big 10 I might add :)) I really don't have much interest in DI until March.  I would much rather enjoy seeing some good CCIW or WIAC contests over Fairfield and Rider any day though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 01, 2006, 03:35:28 PM
Earlhamalum,
Have you been to Denison since they added the bleachers?  Very nice!! 

They are also taking the entire entrance to the gym down and redoing it as well.  New offices, new entrance to the gym.  It will be very nice when it is all done.

Good luck to everyone tonight!!

It is a bummer that the season is coming to a rapid conclusion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2006, 03:36:24 PM
QuoteIt is a bummer that the season is coming to a rapid conclusion.

Not rapid enough for Oberlin and their 8-man gang.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 01, 2006, 04:14:26 PM
Your probably right about that.  Not to jinx Denison but I hope their streak goes at least one more game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 01, 2006, 04:21:52 PM
How extensive was the Denison renovation?

That was probably my favorite NCAC gym....it just needed new bleachers.

It always reminded me of a mini-Hinkle Fieldhouse.

Have I posted this before? Strange feeling of deja vu.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 01, 2006, 04:43:26 PM
They took out those old bleachers from when Christ carried the cross and put in real nice ones.  The seats on the home side are all individual seats with padding and armrests.  It really makes a huge difference.

Lou Mitchell who played for Denison back in the 50's paid for the whole thing.  He is also the "Mitchell Center".  It is also Lou who is doing the new entrance.   

People who have seen the plans say it is going to be awesome.

Nice to have alumni with major cash!!  Or in Lou's case, alum period.

Lou lives in the Granville area and comes to many of the games.  Very cool man.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 01, 2006, 05:39:51 PM
Scotsfan

Two words from the distant past.....

Farleigh Dickinson
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 01, 2006, 06:49:52 PM
sac,

I'll assume that you are talking about the 1985 NCAA Tournament where FDU nearly knocked Michigan out in the 1st round?  Michigan then lost to Nova in the next round.  Michigan was the first giant to fall to the hands of the Wildcats on their improbable run to the national championship.  Wasn't Michigan ranked pretty high that year?  I thought they might've been #1 in the country heading into the tournament.  They were a #1 seed at the very least if I remember.  Ahh, what could have been for the Wolverines that year...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 01, 2006, 07:56:40 PM
Early update from Richmond:

Wittenberg 25
Earlham 20
5:04 left in the 1st Half

-Brandon Miller and LaRon Henry have picked up 2 early fouls each.
-8 different players have scored for Witenberg, 5 for Earlham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2006, 08:06:25 PM
Halftime from Wooster:

Scots 55
Gators 35

Scots were on fire from the arc early on.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 01, 2006, 08:08:12 PM
Halftime Score:

Wittenberg  30
Earlham  27

Brandon Miller now has 3 fouls (including a technical for screaming an obscenity in front of an official)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 01, 2006, 08:08:31 PM
Got a ballgame....halftime in Richmond:

Witt 30,
EC 27

Miller had two fouls and then picked up a technical after he thought he was fouled on a lay up attempt by Russ. Witt, who led by as many as 13 early, then scored 5 quick points to go up 30-20.

Earlham actually closed out the half with a prolonged 7-0 run.

Russ has 7 to, I think, lead Witt
Jewett and Gregory with 8 apiece for Earlham
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 01, 2006, 08:10:26 PM
For the record, sounds like a classic case of NCAC officials losing control....

I've been listening to the Witt broadcast and Scott Leo has mentioned a few times the contact that is going uncalled all over the floor

Things evened up toward the end, but I believe Earlham was whistled for 8 fouls, while Witt had fewer than 7
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 01, 2006, 08:18:22 PM
Denison up 30-19 at half over Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 01, 2006, 08:25:24 PM
Miller fouls out a minute into the second half....

picked up his fourth......EC didn't get the sub to the table in time, Witt attacked him again and got his fifth

don't like where this one is headed......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 01, 2006, 08:25:44 PM
Update:

34-27 Witt

Brandon Miller has fouled out just over a minute into the 2nd half.

I guess the 5th one wasn't that good of a call.  Scott Leo even thought it was a clean block, but then the refs called it a foul.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 01, 2006, 08:46:43 PM
44-44.......8 left in Richmond
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 01, 2006, 08:49:41 PM
I am liking what is going on in Earlham right now.  Lets see how it ends.

Now branching off to the Woo/'Gheny game, is Allegheny supposed to be that bad or we are just too good?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 01, 2006, 08:50:25 PM
6 quick ones for Witt

50-44....about 6:30 left
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 01, 2006, 08:51:53 PM
Not sure what the Woo announcers are smoking, but they just said something about flipping a coin if Woo and Witt were to tie for the regular season.  I can only hope it wont come down to a coin toss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 01, 2006, 08:58:45 PM
I fear there is gonna be massive ticket sculping in Springfield on Saturday for the Woo/Witt game.  It am not too sure how you car rationalize the ticket arrangement that Witt has made for the game.  Its seriously illogical.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 01, 2006, 09:08:39 PM
It's easily rationalized...Witt wants to pack the gym with their fans.  Sell the tickets early before the Woo crowd shows up and they'll do just that...assuming there are enough Witt fans to scoop up all of those tickets. 


From Chadwick...OWU and Wabash are tied at 68 with less than one minute to go. 

OWU gets a steal and Chojnacki socres a layup.  OWU up two. 

Wabash burns two timeouts after the layup...Little Giants are now out of timeouts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 01, 2006, 09:09:47 PM
how is that illogical of a plan? it makes sense instead of having a huge attack on the campus at 5:30 to get tickets to start selling them at noon. most schools would sell before gameday. you go a little early. 2/3 of the tickets are open to the general public-that's how it goes in any circumstance. the season ticket holders get their seats-in this case the 1000 up for witt students and general family, and the other 2,000 are up for grabs.

and if it is illogical it is in witt's favor; why would we want a gym full of gold and black in our own gym?

and come on-who the heck scalps tickets for a d3 game-think logically
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 01, 2006, 09:11:37 PM
Final:  Wooster 121  Allegheny 88

Wooster had 6 players in double figures tonight led by James Cooper with 25 points, Devin Fulk with 17 points, Tim Vandervaart with 15 points and Marty Bidwell also at 15 points.

Wooster shot 56% from the floor tonight and made 15 three pointers.  The Scots also outrebounded the Gators 42 to 27.  Good win for the Scots.

Wooster is now 19-1, 11-0 NCAC.  :)  Next up is the big game at Witt!

GO SCOTS!!


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 01, 2006, 09:12:36 PM
Wabash gets an opportunity with a shot under the basket, the shot caromed off the rim, OWU rebounds.  7 seconds left, OWU is shooting free throws.  

First shot is no good.  Wabash is sitll alive.  Second shot is good.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 01, 2006, 09:12:56 PM
by the way, Witt did pull away to win by 12, 61-49

Russ turned it on in the final minutes...ended up with 17

Earlham ran out of gas...not having Miller the whole 2nd half and getting pounded on the glass cost the Quakers a shot at the upset

waiting for stats......interesting to see FT numbers and rebounds
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 01, 2006, 09:14:57 PM
Wabash gets a three point attempt to tie at the end, the shot is short and no good.  OWU gets out of Chadwick with a 71-68 win.  

Wabash is in big big trouble for a home game in the tournament.  

Apparently Wabash was 6-15 at the free throw line.  I'm not sure how much farther in the boxscore you need to go to find causality here.  

Tough, tough loss for Wabash.  Wabash will pretty much need to steal a win against Witt or Wooster to get back in the thick of home game talk for the first round.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 01, 2006, 09:19:17 PM
Did the Hoopsville Jinx get the Scots...only a few minutes for Evan Will?  I was not able to listen to the game...Did he get injured?  We need full strength for the trip to Springfield!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2006, 09:24:31 PM
Evan Will has a sinus infection.  He started, out of pride, but only played 5 minutes.  He was not needed tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 01, 2006, 10:02:14 PM
Evan should be fine for  Witt .  He made a nice 3 pointer to start the game tonight.

Also- Tom Port was dribbling and taking some shots during the halftime warm-up which was nice to see.  He may be able to play some on sat. He always steps up for Witt games (Like Russ against Woo) so I hope he gets his chance.

Wooster dominated the game from the start tonight.  Their first 4 shots were three's and all hit nothing but net.  Was great to see them come out of the gates like that as they have had several very slow starts in the past.  Hopefully they can do that at Witt on Sat. 

AC's coach was fired up in the first half which lead to technical.  He wasn't happy with some calls/no calls.  He was lucky he didn't get called a second time.  Refs were same as usual...  I didn't think the calls were terrible but at the same time left a lot to be desired.

On another note- did they have Brandom Miller guarding Witt's big men tonight?  Is that why he fouled out so early?  A friend of mine came into the Woo game at half and told me EC was only down by three which got my hopes up...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 01, 2006, 10:11:14 PM
Also have to say Wooster had some great assists tonight as they continue to pass the ball well.  They played very unselfish b-ball which makes it fun to watch.  Saw a great 3 on 1 play where the AC player was in great defensive position but the extra pass (the third) was just too much.  Brandon Johnson, Marty Bidwell and the rest of Woo's younger players continue to impress me.


Kyle W hit several three's tonight.  Seemed to find he shot a little bit to go along with all those assists.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 01, 2006, 10:17:28 PM
Of regional interest- Albion loses to Tri State 77-72 tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 01, 2006, 10:29:43 PM
A history of the Wooster/Witt games...

http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2005-06/woo-witt_rivalry.pdf
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 01, 2006, 10:41:02 PM
Finally have some stats on that Witt/EC game.....

here's the key one: Witt wins the rebounding battle 39-20

both teams were made from the foul stripe tonight: Witt 11-23, EC 6-11.......that old Bob Knight rubric, make as many foul shots as your opponent shoots.......shouldn't happen on the road, right?

Russ had 17 and 8, Borchers had 11 boards and Bowen had a knockout 3

Gregory had 14 off the bench to lead Earlham, Jewett with 8.......Miller with foul problems had 5

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 01, 2006, 10:43:38 PM
Some additional notes on the Wooster game:

Tim Vandervaart was all over the boards at both ends.  Good offensive rebounding, especially, requires desire and brains, plus some luck, and he had all of them working for him tonight, as he was continually in the right place at the right time.

While I often think that Wooster gets the worst of the officiating at Timken because they're not as physical as some teams, tonight I thought that Allegheny was the victim of a few non-calls on players going to the hoop.  Their coach got hepped up about it, but I thought he had a case.  On the other end, lots of bumping and holding fouls were called on Allegheny, fouls that are often ignored when some teams commit so many of them, but tonight they were called, and most looked justifiable.

Witucky didn't make several threes, but did hit 2-4.  Devin Fulk, besides going 3-3 from behind the arc also went to the basket a few times which is uncommon for him.  The first couple of times he didn't finish, but then he put a few in.  He may have a second career in line as a post player after his eligibility at guard is used up.

Cooper's shooting was, as usual, phenomenal.  There are so many parts to his offensive game that no defender is able to take all of them away.  I keep wondering how he would fare on a larger stage such as the Big Ten.  If he was a little bigger and stronger...

Wooster is shown in the box score as having only 8 fast break points.  Somebody help me out here on this: What officially constitutes a fast break?  Can there still be a defender between the scorer and the basket, or not?  Must the shot be scored from in the paint?  It sure seems to me like they had quite a few more than 4 baskets when running.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 01, 2006, 10:54:49 PM
I don't see anything wrong with Wittenberg putting the tickets on sale at noon on Saturday.  As was mentioned, if they waited until 4 or 5 PM they'd have block-long lines beginning at noon or earlier anyway.  They could have put them on sale Thursday or Friday, but I don't see how that would help Wooster fans, I can't imagine anyone making a separate trip to Springfield just to buy their tickets.

I talked to the Wooster athletic department today and they said they do not have any tickets.  Apparently it's not their policy to sell tickets for road games (except maybe tournament games, I don't know about that).

However, I was told that there will be a Wooster student bus or two.  Now, certainly they must have prepurchased tickets, otherwise it's a risky trip unless they leave in the morning.  The Wooster Downtown Rebounders apparently also have a bus going down.  I don't know if they've managed to cop some tickets, are leaving very early Saturday, or are just hoping for the best.

I with Clear Picture cable would go down there and televise this game.  But then, that wouldn't do me any good since I dumped them for Dishnetwork a year ago.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 01, 2006, 10:55:45 PM
I wouldn't trust fast break points in a box score. The mechanics of noting that in the stat software means you have to hit a key right after the basket to get it denoted and it's often forgotten, especially considering the rush statkeepers are in after a fast break.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 01, 2006, 10:59:30 PM
Programming note

Saturday's game between No. 1 Wittenberg and No. 2 Wooster will be broadcast live (http://www.d3hoops.com/audio/) by D3hoopsNet on Broadcastmonsters.com.

Pat Coleman and Lenny Reich will be on the call. Pregame show at 7:15 p.m. ET.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 01, 2006, 11:00:35 PM
Quote from: blindwatchmaker on February 01, 2006, 10:17:28 PM
Of regional interest- Albion loses to Tri State 77-72 tonight.

Note that as Tri-State is year 2 of the 4-year NCAA provisional period, they do not count as a regional opponent for Albion.  As such, this game is not considered in any was as a primary criteria for rankings, selection to the tourney or for seeding purposes!  (It would count only as a secondary criteria in overall w-l percentage.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2006, 11:06:07 PM
Pat's right about fast break points, you have to remember to hit a "Z" instead of a "G" in order for it to count as a fast break.

Many D-1 schools don't even do it. Heck, when Purdue's mens team had a home game at the same time they went to the Rose Bowl, the Wabash stat crew went up to work the computer, and our SID used the fast break code, and the Purdue SID had never heard of it before!

Also, we're pretty persnickety about fast break points. Wooster plays at such a fast pace at times, it seems like they may get a lot of breaks, but fast breaks, to me, are odd man rushes (hockey term) that result in hoops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2006, 11:07:17 PM
Lyttle and Zimmer had foul trouble, which hurt big time. Yes, some calls were questionable, but others were not. The free throw shooting hurt Wabash, and the fact that most of their 17 turnovers were unforced (OWU had just four steals).

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2006, 11:12:48 PM
About the Witt / Earlham refs - well it was Chuck Docken's crew.

You know what, if a crew of Docken, Vitt and Trout ever officiated an NCAC game together - I'd go down and dress the entire JV because you may need them. Either everyone will foul out or everyone would get hurt from no calls.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 01, 2006, 11:19:22 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 01, 2006, 10:59:30 PM
Programming note

Saturday's game between No. 1 Wittenberg and No. 2 Wooster will be broadcast live (http://www.d3hoops.com/audio/) by D3hoopsNet on Broadcastmonsters.com.

Pat Coleman and Lenny Reich will be on the call. Pregame show at 7:15 p.m. ET.

Got out of that trip to Williamsburg I see.  ;)

Quote from: imderekpoe on February 01, 2006, 11:00:35 PM
Quote from: blindwatchmaker on February 01, 2006, 10:17:28 PM
Of regional interest- Albion loses to Tri State 77-72 tonight.

Note that as Tri-State is year 2 of the 4-year NCAA provisional period, they do not count as a regional opponent for Albion.  As such, this game is not considered in any was as a primary criteria for rankings, selection to the tourney or for seeding purposes!  (It would count only as a secondary criteria in overall w-l percentage.)

You Sir earn brilliant observation of the night.  I hadn't even considered this.........but your right in the D3 tournament eyes this is almost a non-game for Albion. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2006, 11:32:28 PM
And right there, along with the NESCAC shennanigans, is what is totally wrong with this current system. Why shouldn't a loss to a weak opponent in February hurt you?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 01, 2006, 11:43:27 PM
Because they aren't D3 smeds
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2006, 11:45:37 PM
It still should hurt - it still is a 'bad loss'. I feel the NCAA does this 'system' to make it easy on them - so they don't have to look at the D-3 contenders more than 5 minutes on what the printout says and the regional numbers. Argh!

Anyway, the Wabash game has caused me to become less than gruntled - double Argh!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 01, 2006, 11:46:13 PM
I think these bad losses and close wins are all starting to catch up with the Brits.  It's still a loss to a weak opponent.  Even though the NCAA might not recognize it, the psyche on Albion's team can't be too good at the moment.  They still have games at Hope and at Calvin.  I say they will be lucky to split given the way Albion has been playing since their 1st meeting with Hope.  I wonder what excuse the Albion supporters are using for this loss?  They can't use the 1st game of the year excuse that they used for using to UM-Dearborn.  This does stink that this bad loss will basically not even show up in the eyes of the selection comittee though?! ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 01, 2006, 11:49:32 PM
The NCAA released its first round pairing today.

Games played at Calvin College

Wooster vs Albion 6pm

Bluffton vs Calvin 8 pm.



I can see the pages of rants now  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2006, 12:18:55 AM
Back to the matters at hand.

Denison beats Oberlin just 74-65.

Kenyon solidifies 8th with a 72-63 win over Hiram. Formato leads the way with 30. Just think if he played for a top team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 02, 2006, 01:30:06 AM
Quote from: sac on February 01, 2006, 11:19:22 PM
Got out of that trip to Williamsburg I see.  ;)

That and $39 each way on Southwest Airlines makes this trip possible.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 02, 2006, 09:51:55 AM
overall decent effort by witt last night after fighitng off some road woes. i am not too concerned as wooster had troubles at earlham earlier this year as well. something about that place gives us trouble.

one question for anyone at the game-why did the fan get ejected late in the second half? i was listening and no one knew why just that he said something he shouldn't have.

get ready for saturday guys-a packed gym with "excited" students(excited cuz we've had some fun earlier in the day) lol.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 02, 2006, 09:54:48 AM
GO BIG RED!!!  Back to .500 at 10-10.  After starting 2-8 they have gone 8-2. 
But OH LOOK....how many guys did he play???  EIGHT  and what happened..they won!!

It is just too bad Ghiloni and company could not have figured it out before the start of the season.  I am not going ot say we beat Witt, Woo, or Akron.  But the others were certainly games we should have been in.

And look.........the upperclassman..........major minutes and victory.  Wasn't I saying this way back when???

Hodgkinson had another monster game with 29 and 14.  But I think the guy who has really picked up his game is Dan Izzo.  The guy is doing it on both ends.   Leave him in the game.

He goes from playing 18 minutes to 30+.   LEAVE HIM IN COACH!!!!  Let him play.

Last night was another game where it proved the freshman are not consistant enough to play long periods.   

I have said all season, Denison has 8 guys who can play.  After that it drops off considerably.   

The only negative I can say about last night is the Big Red gave up way too many points in the second half.  They hold Oberlin to 19 in the first half and give up 46 in the second.  If they play D like that against anyone else in the conference they will get beat. 

Other than that..........GREAT WIN!!!

Makes Saturday's game at Wabash very interesting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 02, 2006, 10:05:34 AM
Unofficial updated GL Region QOWI after last night's games:

CMU: 11.077  (unchanged from Monday)
Witt:  11.067 (up from 10.643 with an 11-pt win over Earlham and wins by Kenyon and Denison)
BW:   10.444 (down from 10.647 with a 9-pt win over Heidelberg and a loss by Muskingum)
Woo:  10.438 (up from 10.200 with a 10-pt win over 'Gheny and wins by Kenyon and Denison)
Hope: 10.167 (down from 10.182 with a 10-pt win over Olivet)
Albion: 10.000 (no change with the non-regional loss to Tri-State)
Lake Erie: 9.500 (I didn't calculate theirs earlier)

Note that even if the Scots win on Saturday, by my calculations their rating will still be below Witt's (10.750 - 10.706).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 02, 2006, 11:04:23 AM
Quote from: DenisonFan on February 02, 2006, 09:54:48 AM

GO BIG RED!!!  Back to .500 at 10-10.  After starting 2-8 they have gone 8-2. 
But OH LOOK....how many guys did he play???  EIGHT  and what happened..they won!!


Enough with this rotation thing already!  Denison beat who last night?  Oh yeah, it was Oberlin !!!  And it was a lot closer than I would have guessed!  Especially after reading your post about how great the vaunted 8 man rotation works at Denison.  If it works so great, shouldn't the Big Red be beating lowly Oberlin by more than 9?!  After all, Oberlin's entire bench only consists of 8 players total.  Maybe Denison was just trying to play fair by only going 8 deep themselves.  Or maybe if those 8 had played better, Ghiloni might have been able to get some more players some PT in garbage time which most teams get when they are playing Oberlin!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 02, 2006, 11:50:24 AM
While I am a fan of basketball, and the Scots, I am new to the basketball rules and lingo.  What is the "QOWI" stand for?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 02, 2006, 12:20:40 PM
Quality of Wins Index, which was previously called the SOSI and is used by the NCAA to determine rankings and is the primary consideration for Pool 'C' bids to the tourney.  You should be able to find the D III Basketball Handbook on the NCAA site which gives all the details on this and the whole tournament setup.  There's also a link to it (I think) in a post in the Multi-Regional Topics/2005-06 Mens Basketball Tourney board.  If you can't find it I can e-mail it to you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 02, 2006, 12:39:19 PM
For any ref in the NCAC that may come to this board to read... YOU GUYS ALL SUCK!

It is a shame that refs play such a large part in the game of basketball game.  I can honestly say I wasn't at the game, but I have talked to a few students that I keep in touch with that was.  First of 5 fouls with 18 minutes to go is pathetic.  I know the way Brandon Miller plays D, he is quick and long, not overpowering.  No disrespect to Nelson or Travis Swab... but those guys could get away with MURDER, and they might get A (1) foul called on them. 
I have showed game film from past games (NCAC) to one of the head officials around the Indianapolis area,(IHSAA) and he was amazed, about some of the calls they make and didn't make.  He really liked the one with a 6'5 white guy got fouled... and while in the BONUS.... they put a 6'0 black guy to the Free-Throw line.  That is elementary.(granted video and being there is two different things)  I'm not saying High School refs are the greatest, but hands down the NCAC is horrible.  They are all EGO-tical Pricks that holds grudges and Favorites Period.  On the 5th foul.. can you say ALL BALL! 
I give EC credit for hang'n in there even with Brandon MIller on the bench for the whole 2nd half... they had it tied at 44-44... at that point they were out manned and out Ref'ed.... Thanks guys for taking a good game away from kids that deserve more than that...  If two teams give 100% why can't those Zebra over-weight old worthless people with whistles can't too?  Thank god I wasn't there I might of been with that Fan that got kicked out! :)

Sorry had to get that off my chess... or finger-tips... I feel better now!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on February 02, 2006, 12:48:10 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on February 02, 2006, 09:54:48 AM
But OH LOOK....how many guys did he play???  EIGHT  and what happened..they won!!

It is just too bad Ghiloni and company could not have figured it out before the start of the season.  I am not going ot say we beat Witt, Woo, or Akron.  But the others were certainly games we should have been in.

So in your distorted world, do you believe that Coach Ghiloni sacrificed those early games just to give the end of his bench some experience?  That is absurd.  The much more logical explanation is that the upperclassmen and starters were not doing what they were asked to do.  You are a broken record and you don't make any more sense in February than you did in December.

Hodgkinson has been better as the season has gone on - and I'm not talking about his numbers.  He'll never be a great defender, but his effort on that end of the floor has improved tremendously.

Izzo's play has improved too - again, largely because his effort has improved.  He's committed to defending and getting on the boards.  The offense that he provides is a bonus.  His scoring last night came from a number of backdoor cuts and moves to the basket.

Hern continues to be an enigma.  I'm not sure I've ever seen someone with his ability care so little about defending - and he's supposed to be providing senior leadership!  The second half last night was embarrassing.  He might be the easiest guy to screen in the country.

The bottom line is you have to beat the teams you're supposed to beat, so it was good to see the Big Red pick up another win and get back to .500.  This team and program, like many others, continues to be a work in progress.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 02, 2006, 12:57:15 PM
No I totally agree with DenisonFan...........................................................................................................
..................................................................................you play eight you win...........................................
...............................................................................................................................................................
.....okay you guys can all laugh now... I'm only kidding!   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 02, 2006, 01:01:13 PM
Central:
No I am not saying Ghiloni threw games just to play people.  What I am saying is that he and his staff should have made this evaluation in pre-season.  He should have known they are not a deep team.   He obviously watches them in practice EVERY DAY.  Is it not the job of the coach and his 20 assistant coaches to determine who can and can not play at this level.   

I will agree with you about Hern.  He is sooooooooo talented and yet it seems his head is not in the game.  When he wants to play he can bring it.

As far as senior leadership.  There is NONE.  Never has been.  Hern is captain by default.  Just because he is a senior that makes him captain?  Both Hodgkinson and Izzo have as much Denison basketball experience as Hern.  Why didn't he make all three captains.  God only knows.

Yes, the Big Red have to defend better.  And yes, Hodgkinson will not ever be Bill Russel on D but you MUST have someone who can put the ball in the basket.  It looks like he does that pretty darn well.

Izzo has picked up his game.  That is why I want him at 30+ a game. 

And yes, Denison is a work in progress.  But at least I think they are going in the right direction.

By the way Central...........It's just my opinion OK.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on February 02, 2006, 01:14:18 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 02, 2006, 12:39:19 PM
They are all EGO-tical Pricks that holds grudges and Favorites Period.  On the 5th foul.. can you say ALL BALL! 
I give EC credit for hang'n in there even with Brandon MIller on the bench for the whole 2nd half... they had it tied at 44-44... at that point they were out manned and out Ref'ed.... Thanks guys for taking a good game away from kids that deserve more than that...  If two teams give 100% why can't those Zebra over-weight old worthless people with whistles can't too? Thank god I wasn't there I might of been with that Fan that got kicked out! :)




I really hate it when fans complain about reffing of a game first of all, second of all I despise fans who complain about refs who WERE NOT EVEN AT THE GAME. Don't worry about the refs so much please. Witt can let Brandon Miller call his own  fouls and still beat them 99 out of 98 times. Lets get to the business at hand Witt v Woo. In Vegas Witt is coming off at a 4.5 point favorite. What do you guys think
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 02, 2006, 01:28:34 PM
Quote from: WoosterBNel on February 02, 2006, 01:14:18 PM
Lets get to the business at hand Witt v Woo. In Vegas Witt is coming off at a 4.5 point favorite. What do you guys think

I think that 4.5 points is a good number.  The last couple games have been so great that I hope we're not going to be disappointed.  I really think that this could go either way.  If the Scots (namely Cooper) are hot, it might be tough for Witt to keep up.  But, the Scots will have a tough time containing Russ and Borchers.  If Vandervaart has any foul trouble it could spell real troubles for Wooster.

The unknowns are how well Port will come back from injury and the status of Evan Will, who didn't play much last night do to a sinus infection (at least I think that's what it was.)  The plusses for the Scots are how Bidwell and Will have stepped up since Port went down.  I think that Steve Moore will have a lot more confidence giving those guys some minutes in key situations on Saturday that he did back in December.

It should be another good one!  Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldwittfan on February 02, 2006, 02:18:47 PM
1.  While the refs could be criticized at last night's game with Earlham, I think Wittenberg has as much to complain about as Earlham, Dane Borchers in particular.  Fans always criticize refs?

2. Brandon Miller did commit the technical for number 3.  He still came out at the beginning of the second half contesting every shot at the basket.  That runs a high risk. Refs will sooner or later call one of those a foul. Why he did not sit after the fourth foul at least to kool down some is hard to understand.

3. Neither Miller nor James Cooper are likely to be POY. Miller is a very talented player but he just self destructs too often. James Cooper is a talented player and a great shooter, but as some of you Wooster fans noted a couple of weeks ago he has a way to go defensively. Steve Moore will probably change that in the next two years. Also, if he is not shooting well it effects the rest of his game. Apparently he has been shooting so well lately that that has not been a problem.

4. If Tom Port comes back at anything like his previous level, he or Dan Russ will probably be POY depending upon which team is most successful.

5. I hope Port is back for Saturday. Not only is the match between the outside game of Wooster and the inside game of Wittenberg great to watch, but the matchup of Port and Russ is classic. At Wooster Russ looked uncomfortable guarding Port out on the court, and Port had trouble stopping Russ inside.  It should be fun.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 02, 2006, 03:35:07 PM
One thing regarding Cooper.  I've heard that he has become a lot more comfortable with his role as a scorer since Port went down.  Before Port's injury he was more tentative at times because he didn't want it to look like he was taking too many shots.  Since Port's injury, Wooster has relied on Cooper's production in a larger capacity, making him feel more comfortable in his role as a scorer.  The thing with Cooper is he is so efficient.  I mean he was 9-12 last night!!!  Those are really good numbers from a post player, let alone a shooting guard.  I just hope that his comfort level continues after Port's return. 

Another thing on Cooper concerning last night's game.  He was pretty unstoppable again.  No matter who 'Gheny tried to put on him.  My favorite Cooper moment was at the end of the 1st half.  Cooper starts his drive, and I think Savage was on him for Allegheny.  He literally was on him as he grabbed Cooper not once, but twice and Cooper still drove by him into the lane and hit a floater at the buzzer!  The kid is fun to watch.  That's all I have to say about it.  And oldwittfan, right now, I feel like Cooper is definately in the conversation in a big way for POY. 

One other thing concerning Allegheny.  Wooster has had Matt Majzlik's number for at least the last 2 seasons.  In the 4 regular season games, Majzlik has averaged only 6.7 ppg against Wooster.  And this season, it's like he hasn't even made it into the game.  Last night he only played 8 minutes and only scored 4 points.  And in their 1st meeting, he only went for 6 points in 13 minutes.  I would've thought, given the problems the Scots have had at times defending the low post, that Majzlik would be posting some better numbers against the Scots, especially seeing how his is averaging nearly 16 ppg over the season.  Go figure I guess??? ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 02, 2006, 04:13:42 PM
Brandon Miller impressed me when Earlham played here.  He played hard on both ends, and scored from both inside and outside. What I didn't understand was the coaching decision that put him at the top of the key defensively. Sure, his wingspan made it tough for Wooster to throw up threes from that area, but they just put the ball inside and scored from there.  And with Miller so far from the hoop, Earlham's rebounding was nonexistant. 

Is he the POY? No. But (and this is just my opinion from watching one game) I feel that no other team would lose more if they lost one player than if Earlham lost Miller.  Wittenberg without Russ or Borchers would still be very good, maybe even a top ten team. I think the same can be said if Wooster were to lose Port (and we've been able to see this scenario), Cooper, or Vandervaart. But an Earlham without Miller, in my opinion, is suddenly battling the Hirams and Kenyons to get difficult wins.

I think the POY rests with Russ, Port, or Cooper. If Wittenberg comes out on top in the league, and Russ plays at his normal level throughout the tournament, I believe he'll get it.  If Wooster wins, it'll be either Port or Cooper.  Port, obviously, would need to come back and play as he has before.  A longshot is Tim Vandervaart, who has been playing extremely well lately.  Possibly Borchers is in the mix also, if Witt wins it all.

I'd thought that Vandervaart, not Port, was on Russ in the first Wittenberg-Wooster game, but I might be misremembering.

Cooper's defense, and his defensive effort, have improved steadily. I'd say that he's now about an average defensive guard, which is to say that he was somewhat below that at the season's beginning.  Offensively, he always wants the ball; doesn't seem to know what to do without it.  That bothered me for a while, until I saw that when he got the ball he was so good at putting it through the hoop.  He talks the talk (figuratively), but can walk the walk.

One of the most interesting things about this upcoming game is that Wooster now has two more quality players, those being Evan Will and Marty Bidwell.  Port's injury has had at least that one upside, giving those two extended minutes to show what they can do. 

Will has turned out to be a strong rebounder with very good hands, who can show you an occasionally brilliant offensive move. Bidwell has been even more surprising, which just shows how hard it is to stand out when playing only garbage time. Since getting quality time, he's shown the ability to get to the basket, play excellent defense, and to rebound. And, he can run like hell and even lead the break, seeing the court very well and intelligently.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 02, 2006, 05:37:58 PM
Nice Post WB

I also think player of the year is between Port and Russ. There are (potentially) eight games left to swing my opinion between the two. I also agree with your point on Earlham losing more without Miller. But I believe that scenario decribes an MVP, not POY.

At the start of the first Woo-Witt game it was Vandervaart who was guarding Russ. Port had Borchers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2006, 07:01:06 PM
I don't know. It wasn't his fault, but Port will have missed a lot of conference games. I can't endorse someone for POY who misses those games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 02, 2006, 07:11:34 PM
That's a fair point.  Port might not just have to come back, but excel, even in the Wittenberg game, to get serious consideration. 

Some questions:

Is the POY chosen based on full-season stats or just NCAC game stats?  Do they also look at NCAC tournament games?  And what about NCAA tournament games?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2006, 07:11:51 PM
Yeah, that's my thinking too.  But here's food for thought; suppose Wooster wins the regular season title.  If you don't give POY to Port, since he missed too many games, and you don't give it to Cooper (or Vandervaart), because Port was just too valuable, then you end up giving it to a player who was not on the championship team.  *Gasp!*  Maybe that opens the door for someone like Brandon Miller or Matt Formato.  Wouldn't that be something? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 02, 2006, 07:36:14 PM
Every other year since '97 the POY was not from either Wooster or Witt.  Since Russ won last year, it must be Miller's turn!  Actually a Woo or Witt player has only won it 4 times in the past 11 years.   

Both the Scots and Tigers are usually deep and don't necessarily have a true dominant player - as is the case this year.  My guess is that Russ repeats, unless the Scots win out and Cooper continues to play the way he has the last few weeks.  Of course, much could change in the next couple of weeks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 02, 2006, 08:34:58 PM
Kyle Witucky of Wooster has been chosen as one of 16 finalists for the Bob Cousy award, which is given to the best point guard in the nation.  The article from the COW website:

http://www.wooster.edu/athletics/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on February 02, 2006, 09:59:51 PM
So you're saying neither Coop nor Russ is dominant in this league? 

They can both do pretty much what they want, when the want, at least as far as I've seen.  It helps having some pretty good players around them like Borchers, Vandervaart, and Witucky, but they are pretty much the centers of attention for opposing defenses at this point in the season.  If they aren't "true" dominant players, then please enlighten everyone else on who is?

FYI, Witucky has the best winning percentage among the point guards up for the Bob Cousy Award.  The next closest is Dee Brown, who I would consider the early favorite for the award.  Nevertheless, congrats to both Witucky and Dauksas on representing DIII.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2006, 10:09:13 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 02, 2006, 07:36:14 PM
Every other year since '97 the POY was not from either Wooster or Witt.  Since Russ won last year, it must be Miller's turn!  Actually a Woo or Witt player has only won it 4 times in the past 11 years.   

As smeds might say, well raise my rent!  That's what I get for talking about individual awards, when I haven't paid any attention to individual awards in years upon years.  I should just go back to ignoring them.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 02, 2006, 10:10:19 PM
That's odd. I used to be on the Cousy committee. Wonder who they had from D-III this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 02, 2006, 10:13:10 PM
Waterboy -

Did you see the bottom of that article?  Beginning tomorrow, if you go to the following site, you can vote for the finalist of your choice.  We should start a campaign on D3hoops to elect Witucky, although Dauksas of IWU is also a finalist.

www.cousyaward.com
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on February 02, 2006, 11:21:40 PM
The campaign for Witucky is going quite well so far...as of 11:15 eastern (10:15 central) Witucky has 2282 votes!!! That's more than the entire Wooster campus!!! As for the "favorite" Dee Brown, he has only 63 votes...sounds like the nation isn't as impressed, haha. Kyle is 4th out of 16 as I head to bed tonight...hopefully he'll be at that point or higher in the morning!!! Sidenote, Adam Dauksas has a meager 58 votes as well, he never impressed me as a soph in that meeting with Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 02, 2006, 11:47:25 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 01, 2006, 10:55:45 PM
I wouldn't trust fast break points in a box score. The mechanics of noting that in the stat software means you have to hit a key right after the basket to get it denoted and it's often forgotten, especially considering the rush statkeepers are in after a fast break.

I know it's been a couple of pages since this discussion took place but you'll have to forgive me; I've been driving all over Texas the last two days.

I had the pleasure of listening to a very entertaining game between Concordia and Howard Payne as I drove back from Lubbock tonight. The radio crew was running down the stats at halftime and was incredulous that there were only 2 fast break points at the half. For a game that had a combined 221 points I think it's clearly like Pat is saying here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on February 02, 2006, 11:47:36 PM
I think Dauksas and Witucky are probably very different types of point-guards.  Current stats...

Dauksas, Illinois Wesleyan 16-3
14.2 ppg
6.6 apg
2.4 A:TO
2.6 rpg
.431 FG (81-188)
.452 3-pt (47-104)
.769 FT (60-78)


Witucky, Wooster 19-1
9.1 ppg
4.3 apg
2.6 A:TO
2.9 rpg
.424 FG (61-144)
.382 3-pt (34-89)
.605 FT (26-43)


Both are great players who play for top Division III programs.  Maybe they'll get a chance to face each other before they're done.


Dee Brown, Illinois 20-2
15.1 ppg
5.9 apg
2.1 A:TO
3.1 rpg
.379 FG (111-293)
.338 3-pt (54-160)
.740 FT (57-77)


A pic of Brown guarding Dauksas from earlier this year...

http://www.iwuhoops.com/illiniad.jpg
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 03, 2006, 12:20:40 AM
QuoteI know it's been a couple of pages since this discussion took place but you'll have to forgive me; I've been driving all over Texas the last two days.

So THAT's why my karma has improved.  :D ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 03, 2006, 12:22:56 AM
Seriously it does take an effort for the stats crew to do that - and D-1 stats crews don't take the time to do it either (I was trolling around the dregs of D-1 for no good reason the other day).

I think it's just a matter of training.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 03, 2006, 12:27:16 AM
I worked CYO games as a scorekeeper when I was in high school. I did ONE hoops games and then stuck to keeping score for baseball games. I'm waaaaay too slow to do hoops. You guys that do that get serious props.

Quote from: smedindy on February 03, 2006, 12:20:40 AM
QuoteI know it's been a couple of pages since this discussion took place but you'll have to forgive me; I've been driving all over Texas the last two days.

So THAT's why my karma has improved. :D ;D


That stings....you cut me deep, smeds.....deep.  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 03, 2006, 09:06:06 AM
DC:
Formato for POY????????  Come on.  I sure hope that was a joke.

My vote still goes to Port if he can return and they go deep into the tournament.
Russ is my next choice.  The swing vote goes to which team goes further. 

Have they every had co winners??  Something to consider.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on February 03, 2006, 09:13:22 AM
Strangely enough, no, there have never been any co-winners in the NCAC.  The only co-anything was COY in 1998-99, shared by Steve Moore and Jeff Justus. 

That's nice Witucky is getting so much support in the online voting.  Maybe it will sway the committee when they actually select the winner at the Final Four.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 03, 2006, 09:36:36 AM
Why not Formato?  He's really coming on strong, lately.

Though I think Cooper or Brandon Miller or Russ are right up there and probably will get the nod, but Formato has had to be a one-man band since Yelvington got hurt. Without him, Kenyon is Oberlin, basically. That's a good endoresement for POY.

Still a lot of hoops to be played, though, before we settle this.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 03, 2006, 10:07:33 AM
I am pretty sure the POY will come from a top team.  Not one that is 6-14. 
Like someone said earlier, Formato is MVP material on his team not POY.

Speaking of MVP's.  Does anyone know why since Ghiloni showed up there has not been an MVP on any of his teams??  That seems strange to me seeing they had them for 100 years before he showed up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 03, 2006, 10:20:20 AM
Maybe he thinks that singling out an individual player isn't best for the TEAM as a whole. Anyway, I've seen teams go with 'mental attitude' or 'spirit of the XXXX awards' as their big awards to players instead of an MVP.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on February 03, 2006, 10:55:09 AM
Coach Ghiloni isn't one for individual awards, I believe he feels that takes away from the team concept.  I may disagree with a lot of things he does but that seems okay as long as he's consistent in that approach.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 03, 2006, 11:13:14 AM
Smed & Kramer,
OK, that works for me. 
I wonder if he gave back his "Coach of the Year Award"?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on February 03, 2006, 11:49:17 AM
DF, got me there, good comment!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 03, 2006, 12:40:18 PM
well as an added nicety to wooster fans-i would plan on arriving at witt early like for the JV game as witt's student body should be strong and early in attendance-the hype for the game has reached a strong level today, with mentions and headlines in the local paper.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 03, 2006, 02:31:39 PM
Congrats to Kyle Witucky on being one of two PG's selected from DIII as a Cousy finalist.  Sounds like it is quite an honor just to be named a finalist. 

Also, there was an interesting article in the Daily Record today regarding that Springfield Sun report about James Cooper "pleading" to be admitted to Wittenberg following Wooster's win over Witt back in December.  Here's an excerpt from the article:

Quote from: The Wooster Daily RecordCooper, angry over the report, denied it and said it won't ruin his homecoming on Saturday. He also said it's not something he will soon forget.

"It was low class to do something like that," Cooper said. "Most people knew it wasn't true, but I can't worry about that. It will just make me want to play even harder."

Maybe that reporter for the Springfield Sun  might want to think a little bit before he does any more reports on James Cooper.  It's not like Cooper needs any extra motivation when it comes to beating Witt, but it sounds like he's gotten some from that Springfield Sun article to say the least!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 03, 2006, 02:35:29 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 03, 2006, 12:40:18 PM
well as an added nicety to wooster fans-i would plan on arriving at witt early like for the JV game as witt's student body should be strong and early in attendance-the hype for the game has reached a strong level today, with mentions and headlines in the local paper.

Glad to see the game is getting attention in Springfield, too.

Here's a question for Witt people:  Will there be any changes in strategy for Saturday following the loss at Woo?  The first Woo-Witt game was by far the highest scoring game Witt has played- do you think Witt will focus even more on working the half-court game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 03, 2006, 03:01:28 PM
Just for fun, using an Excel-based basketball game called Above the Rim (derived from the old Statis-Pro board game), I simulated Saturday's upcoming Wooster-Wittenberg game.  Players are rated based upon their actual stats.  Teams are also rated based upon team defense, rebounding, tempo, strength of schedule, etc.

Wooster opened up a big early lead, mostly based upon the inside play of Tim Vandervaart.  Scoring the Scots first 9 points, he propelled them to a lead of 22-12 at the 12 minute mark of the first half.  The teams traded baskets, Wooster able to maintain a quick tempo, and the Scots went into the locker room leading 50-39.

Wittenberg came out strong to open the second stanza, closing to within 5 with 16 minutes to go.  It was nip and tuck for a few minutes, the Tigers getting as close as 3.  But that was all she wrote.  Wooster begin to score quickly, often from behind the arc, and with 8 minutes to go had extended their lead to 16 points.  At one point, it reached 29.  Final score, Wooster 106, Wittenberg 81.

Wooster shot 64% from the floor to Witt's 53%.  The Scots were 12-22 from behind the arc (James Cooper 4-5, Kyle Witucky 3-5) while Witt was only 4-15. Wittenberg had a narrow 27-23 edge on the boards, but lost the turnover battle, 17-9.

For Wooster, Cooper led the way with 24 (10-15) while Tim Vandervaart poured in 23 (9-11).  Witucky contributed 11 points and 8 assists.

Wittenberg's Russ had 22 on 10-16 shooting while Dane Borchers posted 20 on 8-10 from the floor.

To see the complete boxscore, go here:
http://arkski.com/~jwood/2006%20Wooster.html

I held Tom Port to around 9 minutes on the court because of his undetermined condition.  Of course, this was only one game.  If I have the time this evening, I might give it another go to see how different the result might be.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 03, 2006, 04:16:41 PM
 Indeed the hype machine running full bore in Southeastern (the best corner)  Wink Ohio...articles from the Dayton Daily News:
link and this article sindicated by Cox News Service and appeared in the Springfield News-Sun newspaper
http://www.daytondailynews.com/sports/content/sports/daily/0203wittenberg.html

another nugget:
http://www.daytondailynews.com/sports/content/sports/daily/0203wittenbergbox.html

And from the Springfield News-Sun:
http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/sports/content/sports/stories/2006/02/03/snssp0203brownmoore.html

and this story about Tom Port's injury: http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/sports/content/sports/stories/2006/02/03/snssp0203tomport.html

And from the hometown 'fishwrap' Wooster Daily Record:
http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles//sports/&file=_sports3.txt&article=1&tD=

And you thought Superbowl coverage was comprehensive!!

Go Scots!!

(edit: fixed URLs)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on February 03, 2006, 04:53:20 PM
Congrats to Kyle on being named, that is a huge honor and well deserved. Good luck to the Scots and hopefully this game will be as exciting as the last couple that have been played down here in the HPER and the one in Wooster earlier in the year. I wouldn't read too much into Cooper playing harder due to the report in the Springfield Sun, if a player can't get up for Witt without needing extra inspiration then something is wrong. Looking forward to seeing BJ Harris courtside.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldwittfan on February 03, 2006, 05:33:49 PM
Bill Brown basically believes in the strategy that Witt has used.  He thinks his guards have developed a greater capacity to defend out on the court. They will not help the big guys inside very much.

Offensively he probably thinks they were a little quick at times at Wooster.  However, Wittenberg does run the court if they think they can. Clearly he wants the big guys to get touches almost every time down the court. Obviously, it is not easy to dictate tempo to Wooster.

I assume he would like a lower score this time. We will see.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bigkrapper on February 03, 2006, 05:36:03 PM
Great point VanillaCow24,I only wish I will be there to see Wittenberg alum (he did graduate right?) BJ Harris leading the Wittenberg Student Section, and of course the great game that will be played.  ;D I know it will be another classic Woo-Witt game and I will definitely be listening to it on the radio.  I just can't wait till the replay it on ESPN 8 "the ocho" Good luck scots
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 03, 2006, 08:43:53 PM
Quote from: bigkrapper on February 03, 2006, 05:36:03 PMI just can't wait till the replay it on ESPN 8 "the ocho" Good luck scots

We should start creating a list of quality D-III games that ESPN is missing, then send it to them at the end of the year.  

Does anyone know if Witt will have TV coverage/anyone taping the game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 03, 2006, 09:14:18 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 03, 2006, 08:43:53 PM
Does anyone know if Witt will have TV coverage/anyone taping the game?

No TV coverage, but we always have the basketball team's student manager tape the game.  So, there will be a copy on tape somewhere (and who knows if Wooster will bring someone either).

I'm assuming that the local news stations will be there, as they were here for the 3OT game last year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 03, 2006, 10:45:33 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 03, 2006, 08:43:53 PM

Does anyone know if Witt will have TV coverage/anyone taping the game?


I don't know who was taping the 3 OT game last year, but Wooster's Clear Picture Cable had a showing of the game with Hugh Howard (Wooster's SID) and Coach Moore doing commentary with the game.  I haven't heard whether or not  CPI is sending a crew down to Springfield, but, they have done it before.  I think a couple of years ago they sent down a crew to cover the conference finals between Witt and Woo in Springfield so it is a possibility.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2006, 10:54:34 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 03, 2006, 02:31:39 PM
Also, there was an interesting article in the Daily Record today regarding that Springfield Sun report about James Cooper "pleading" to be admitted to Wittenberg following Wooster's win over Witt back in December.  Here's an excerpt from the article:

Quote from: The Wooster Daily RecordCooper, angry over the report, denied it and said it won't ruin his homecoming on Saturday. He also said it's not something he will soon forget.

"It was low class to do something like that," Cooper said. "Most people knew it wasn't true, but I can't worry about that. It will just make me want to play even harder."

You know, it's funny.  I was about to quote from that very same article earlier today, but in the midst of typing the post I got called away from my computer, and didn't get back until just a short while ago.  Here's the section of the article that I was going to mention:

Quote from: Wooster Daily RecordThe morning after that game, a Springfield Sun report indicated Cooper, a Springfield native, had "pleaded" with Wittenberg officials to attend the university and play basketball during his senior year at Springfield South. The paper only cited "administrators" as its source.

Tigers coach Bill Brown condemned the report, saying he didn't think the issue was for public print and had nothing to do with the basketball game. He declined further comment.

I recall Bill Brown being lit up pretty good in here over this incident, and I never thought he actually had anything to do with it.  I see that is now confirmed; in fact, his attitude about it matches mine exactly (that it was not something that should have been reported, regardless of it truth or falsity.)  I greatly admire his statement.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 03, 2006, 10:58:22 PM
"Administration" could mean some student worker in an office who heard something from someone who swore they heard something from someone who saw it in a file in admissions - they swear to God.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 03, 2006, 11:04:02 PM
Reporters should know better than to write something like that, but the real blame lies with the editors that let it get into print.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 03, 2006, 11:51:23 PM
Wasn't this tacked onto a game story? If so, the editors probably had little time to fact check before deadline. Especially at a smaller paper like the one in Springfield. Sad, but true.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 04, 2006, 07:57:57 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 03, 2006, 11:51:23 PM
Wasn't this tacked onto a game story? If so, the editors probably had little time to fact check before deadline. Especially at a smaller paper like the one in Springfield. Sad, but true.

I agree with David, though.  That whether there was truth to the story or not, it's not something that belongs in a newspaper.  In which case the editor wouldn't need to fact check to squash it, just to read it then apply some common decency.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopsfan1111 on February 04, 2006, 09:29:16 AM
I am going to hold off on all that admiration for Coach Brown just yet...he didn't say the rumor was false (as it obviously was based on Cooper's statement)...all Bill did was say it shouldn't have been printed.  I would have more respect if he had stated the rumor was false AND shouldn't have been printed.  The way it stands he makes it seem like he still believes it is the truth...and it was poor taste to print it...

Not that it matters now...

We will let the playing speak for itself!  GO SCOTS!!! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 04, 2006, 10:04:36 AM
Let's go Scots, Sh!t on Witt!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2006, 10:56:18 AM
I don't get that at all hoopsfan. It's rather beneath him to comment on such spurious accusations - why should he? It shouldn't have been printed - period - was all that needed to be said.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 04, 2006, 11:08:06 AM
And, Coach Brown may have in fact said the rumor was false, but the writers could have just decided not to print that, as it would have made their angle look bad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldwittfan on February 04, 2006, 11:25:54 AM
I do not quite get the reaction of some of you Wooster fans to Bill Brown.  Those who know him know he would not be the source of the original story.  If anything he is too strait and narrow.  What has he ever done to lead you to be so critical of him except coach teams that beat Wooster about half of the time? 

By the way, there was a good story in today's Springfield News-Sun about James Cooper's relationship to one of his high school coaches and his academic success in college.  After all, that is what D3 is supposed to be about.  Perhaps the paper is doing a little penance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 04, 2006, 01:10:23 PM
Just got back from the HPER Center . . . it is NUTS.

For anyone who has been there, and know the layout of the HPER, you'll know how long this is.  The line for tickets started in the main lobby, went up the ramp, wrapped around the old gym, up the stairs, and around the corner back to where the football and lacrosse offices are.

And, much like we speculated, people said they were buying tickets just to resell them.  Insanity all around!

Thank goodness I'm working the games tonight . . .
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 04, 2006, 01:22:12 PM
yes the HPER Center is nuts i jsut got back as well. THe line is long and isn't slowing down anytime soon. Even if there are nowhere near 2,000 people the majority of the people in line are buying multiple tickets. This is unfortunate for Wooster fans because i honestly don't see how there are going to be any seats leftover for the crowd that they'd want to be in attendance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2006, 01:43:06 PM
It'd be unfortunate if Wooster fans made the long drive and were turned away; for that reason, I think it's good if are some scalpers getting involved.  But I wonder if that will happen. 

Last season, diehardfan drove out from the DC area and rendezvoused with me at Denison, where we attended the Wabash/Denison game (which also went into double OT; we saw 5 overtimes that day).  We then drove to Springfield, hoping that we'd be able to get tickets even though it we didn't get there until about a half hour before gametime.  There wasn't anything else we could do, since I couldn't get advance tickets at Wooster (just like this year, and every road game every year, or so they told me).  I spent a lot of time being worried and frustrated-in-advance that we had done all that driving and still might be shut out.  But as it turned out, there was no problem;   the line was short, I got the tickets, and even though the game was reported as a sellout, there were empty spaces in the bleachers all around us.  Of course, there weren't noon ticket sales last year, and Wittenberg wasn't #1 (the matchup was #1 Wooster vs. #5 Wittenberg), so it could be different this year.

I'm just glad this game is in a 3,000 seat arena and not in some traditionally dinky D3 gym. 

Looking forward to another great game tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 04, 2006, 02:02:23 PM
Yesterday I talked to a Mr. Frank Knorr, who is a member of the Wooster Downtown Rebounders, an organization that supports Scot basketball.  He told me that after two phone conversations with the Wittenberg athletic director, he was eventually told that they would be setting aside 300 tickets for Wooster people.

The Rebounders bus, which is sold out, is leaving Wooster at 2 PM. Their plan is to stop around Columbus for a meal then continue on to Springfield.  Frank told me they expected to arrive around 6 PM.

I'm not sure how they arrived at the number 300, as they only have one bus going down.  But, there is also at least one student bus making the trip, maybe more.  I'm imagining that those people will also be able to get tickets from the Wooster allotment.

For the sake of the people making the bus trip, I certainly hope that this agreement works out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 04, 2006, 02:18:33 PM
To any Witt fans (or Scots fans),

How is the ticket situation handled when Woo plays host?  Does Witt get a select number of tickets to sell to their students, or is it like today's game, drive to the gym and hope like hell you get a ticket?

Given the implications of the game every year (even when it's not about #1 and #2 nationally), I would think the AD's would work together and sell some tickets at both schools.  Of course, that is in a perfect world.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on February 04, 2006, 02:29:03 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 04, 2006, 02:02:23 PM
Yesterday I talked to a Mr. Frank Knorr, who is a member of the Wooster Downtown Rebounders, an organization that supports Scot basketball.  He told me that after two phone conversations with the Wittenberg athletic director, he was eventually told that they would be setting aside 300 tickets for Wooster people.

The Rebounders bus, which is sold out, is leaving Wooster at 2 PM. Their plan is to stop around Columbus for a meal then continue on to Springfield.  Frank told me they expected to arrive around 6 PM.

I'm not sure how they arrived at the number 300, as they only have one bus going down.  But, there is also at least one student bus making the trip, maybe more.  I'm imagining that those people will also be able to get tickets from the Wooster allotment.

For the sake of the people making the bus trip, I certainly hope that this agreement works out.

They better eat fast, as the snow is moving in fast.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 04, 2006, 02:31:40 PM
I don't know how it works at Wooster; wish I had asked when I spoke to them a few days ago.  I do know that the visiting fans always seems to sit in the area behind the visitors bench (except during the preseason four-team tournaments, when it's a free-for-all), which is on the side of the court where the seats are reserved (numbered) seats.  But whether a certain number of tickets have either been sent to the opponents box office or are held at Wooster especially for them, I don't know.  I would hope so.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 04, 2006, 02:48:46 PM
#1 vs. #2 for the first time ever!  Should be a great game tonight.  A few key factors will probably determine the winner.

1. Which team shoots the higher percentage from the floor?
2. Which team wins the rebounding battle?
3. Which team makes more three pointers?
4. Which team has the fewest turnovers?

My guess is that tonight's winner will probably execute better in at least 2 or 3 of the 4 areas that I listed.

For Wooster, let's hope that Tom Port can play some significant minutes tonight and help Vandervaart defend the lane/rebound against Witt's strong front line.  The Scots will also need to nail some three pointers if they hope to come out on top this evening.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on February 04, 2006, 02:52:58 PM
While listening to the Wittenberg women's game at Allegheny, Sean Golden, the announcer for the game, just said that the tickets for tonight's game sold out in 30 minutes.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 04, 2006, 03:01:37 PM
I know they sold out fast, but it wasn't in a half hour.  I was in line for a half hour, and I got there at 12:15.  I could see an hour, but not 1/2 hour.

Side note - they just announced they will broadcast the game on TV on Witt's campus (Witt has a little-used TV feed for channel 4 on campus).  It will only be available on TV to the dorms and some of the apartments, and will use WUSO's radio feed for commentary.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 04, 2006, 03:05:27 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 04, 2006, 03:01:37 PM
Side note - they just announced they will broadcast the game on TV on Witt's campus (Witt has a little-used TV feed for channel 4 on campus). It will only be available on TV to the dorms and some of the apartments, and will use WUSO's radio feed for commentary.

Dang.  I wish they were sending the video feed out over the net.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldwittfan on February 04, 2006, 03:26:39 PM
We must buy our tickets at Wooster when we get their.  I believe some tickets are saved for parents at each location.  Anyone can ask for a ticket in the visitors section at Wooster.  The area available to visiting teams has become smaller with less good seats each year.

By the way, I would expect that we will see Wittenberg's athletic director control fans a lot more than is true at Wooster where the students seem to get uglier and more profane each year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2006, 03:28:23 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 04, 2006, 02:31:40 PM
I don't know how it works at Wooster; wish I had asked when I spoke to them a few days ago.  I do know that the visiting fans always seems to sit in the area behind the visitors bench (except during the preseason four-team tournaments, when it's a free-for-all), which is on the side of the court where the seats are reserved (numbered) seats.  But whether a certain number of tickets have either been sent to the opponents box office or are held at Wooster especially for them, I don't know.  I would hope so.

Last year (at least), Wooster hosted a pre-game luncheon/mixer for fans of both teams.  They did this for both the football and basketball games.  The football shindig was in a tent on the back patio of Lowry, and was decorated partly in Black and Old Gold and partly in Red and White.  Those in attendance got little knicknacks (like little footballs) in the colors of their team.  It was surreal; kind of like trying to make the Jets and Sharks socialize at the dance, and equally as successful.  The basketball mixer was in the auxiliary gym, but I didn't go to that.

In order to get into these events, you had to preregister and pay in advance.  The admission included a ticket to the game.  So at least to that extent, Witt fans could obtain tickets in advance for the football and basketball games.

The section of lower stands behind the Witt bench were reserved for Witt patrons, with signs indicating as much.  The rest of the lower seating on that side of the gym is the where the season ticket holders sit.  The lower seats opposite the Witt seats were designated for Woo students.  The rest of the gym was, I believe, general admission.  I didn't notice anyone trying to enforce any of these seating restrictions, although compliance probably wasn't a problem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 04, 2006, 03:33:07 PM
not saying anyone cares... but   

Earlham 26
Kenyon  24

with 4:20 to go in the 1st half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 04, 2006, 03:41:02 PM
Equally irrelevant considering the Witt/Wooster matchup looming.

Denison 28
Wabash 40 Half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 04, 2006, 03:59:28 PM
more irrelevant as wabash game? maybe maybe not?   18:29 left in the 2nd half

Earlham 38
Kenyon  29   

Li'll Giant just let me know if Denison has played more then 8 players... because if so then just put down a Win for Bash!  At least i think that is the scouting report DF gives us!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 04, 2006, 04:10:05 PM
That's funny, I was going to make a remark about the number of players Denison has played but I missed the halftime stats because I was paying attention to the Texas/A&M game. I have no idea how many Denison has played.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 04, 2006, 04:19:02 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 04, 2006, 03:28:23 PM
It was surreal; kind of like trying to make the Jets and Sharks socialize at the dance, and equally as successful.

LOL, I love it.  A dangerous, maybe not so wise, attempt, though. 

I can see an event like that turning into a sort of Fort Sumter, with a full-fledged civil war ensuing somewhere around the campus of a very surprised OWU as the forces of The Confederacy of Springfield and The Northern Army of Wooster meet in arms.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 04, 2006, 04:29:58 PM
Last post about this game... i'm sure tomorrow or later tonight when i get back... this post will be 3 pages away.

Earlham 59
Kenyon- 47

with 4:44 left in the 2nd half.   This isn't on Team-Line again, because of the Darn Girls game, i would go on a woman's basketball hatred like Billy_pilgram, but I do actually enjoy watching Women's Basketball.  *granted I usually hope for the cute girls to do well. *sexiest pig (maybe) but I still enjoy good basketball no matter what level.   Plus I have Bill_pilgram on Speed dial and he's at the game. :)

Lil'Giant, i think this weeks Earlham/Wabash game is going to be a BIG one for one of these teams to Host a tourny game!  I also could go on for a while about Rude fans... Wabash student body is always using foul language, I hope those kids don't kiss their moms with those mouths.  On the other hand I give them credit for being there!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 04, 2006, 04:34:55 PM
EA,

I'm not going to defend the foul-mouth Wabash students (because it does look bad) but I'm not going to condemn them either (because I was one of them in the late 90s).  ;)

Wally and/or others can confirm that it would be awfully hypocritical for me to point out any fan language that crosses the line.

That being said, the game will be HUGE.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on February 04, 2006, 04:43:11 PM
Anyone have a final from Crawfordsville?  It didn't look too good for the Big Red at the half, but maybe they made a run...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 04, 2006, 04:46:09 PM
Denison did go on a run but Wabash fended them off.

Wabash is up 91-80 in the waning moments.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 04, 2006, 04:46:51 PM
And it's final.

Denison 80
Wabash 92
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 04, 2006, 04:46:56 PM
I would only let you point out said language if you did so from Neal Fieldhouse in Greencastle with a mic and an amp.    :D

Oh what fun that trip was.  Ah, the memories.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on February 04, 2006, 04:49:19 PM
Thanks LG.  I thought it would be awfully tough for Denison to sneak in there and steal one - I'll be interested to read the recap.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2006, 04:49:27 PM
Score of regional interest from Holland, MI:

#4 Hope 74
#6 Albion 55
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on February 04, 2006, 04:58:26 PM
As Hoopsville Great Lakes regional reporter Jared Rosenbaum said Tuesday on the show, "This is one of those days I wish there were two of me."  I think Jared opted for the Hope/Albion game today.

I'm glad I'll be at the Shirk Center tonight to see IWU face a very good Elmhurst team in a big CCIW game, but I wish I could see Wittenberg and Wooster go at it too.  Best of luck to all in the big 1 vs 2 clash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2006, 05:25:08 PM
Just back from Chadwick. Wabash led 19-2 at one point but Denison came back. Funny enough, they did it in a stretch where either Hern or Hodgkinson were sitting out (but not both).

When Hodgkinson was subbed for the first time it was 24-10 with 9:59 to go in the first half. Later Hodgkinson came in for Hern. When they both played together again, it was 28-24 at the 4:29 mark. It later became 40-28 at the half.

So Wabash outscored Denison 36-14 when both Hern and Hodgkinson were in the first half!

Denison seems to have an aversion for defense at times. They have some good offensive talent, but seem to do a lot of one-on-one stuff.

They played nine, but they needed to. Koechler gives them the little things (screens, etc.) but no scoring. Izzo and Gognat didn't play well. I was impressed by Shea and Krantz off the bench.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CentralOH on February 04, 2006, 07:04:17 PM
Thanks for that recap, smed.
 
Quote from: smedindy on February 04, 2006, 05:25:08 PM

Denison seems to have an aversion for defense at times. They have some good offensive talent, but seem to do a lot of one-on-one stuff.


I think your observation is dead-on re: DU's interest in guarding people.

Also, a very quick glance at the box revealed 12 Big Red turnovers from two guys:  Hern and Gognat (six each).  That's going to be tough to overcome no matter who you're playing against.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 04, 2006, 07:37:59 PM
Anyone giving Wooster/Wittenberg up-dates?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2006, 07:38:52 PM
Yes, there's a separate board.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 04, 2006, 07:38:57 PM
EA,

If you go to the main post up page for the GL region...there is a page set up just for the game
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 04, 2006, 08:07:38 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 49  Wittenberg 40

Wooster made 9 three pointers in the first half to outscore the Tigers.  Wooster is being led by James Cooper with 15 points and Andy Van Horn with 11 points.  Daniel Russ is leading Witt with 12 points.

The pace of this game seems to be in Wooster's favor but there is a lot of time left.  Cooper hit another long three pointer right before the half ended!

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 04, 2006, 09:13:39 PM
Final:  #2 Wooster  86  #1 Wittenberg 77

HUGE win for Wooster as they beat the Tigers on their home floor in a sold out building!  ;D  Wooster has virtually clinched the NCAC regular season title with a 2 game lead and only 4 games left in the season.

Wooster was led by James Cooper with 24 points, Tom Port with 13 points, Tim Vandervaart with 12 points, Andy Van Horn with 11 points and Brandon Johnson with 11 points.  Wittenberg was led by Daniel Russ with 22 points and Dane Borchers with 22 points.

Wooster won this game by shooting a higher field goal percentage than Witt and by making 12 three pointers!  :)  What a sweet road win!

Wooster is now 20-1, 12-0 in the NCAC!!    ;D

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on February 04, 2006, 09:14:21 PM
SCOTS WIN 86-77!!! CONGRATULATIONS TO THE NEW #1 TEAM IN THE LAND...Can't wait to be at the NCAC Tourney back in Woo!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on February 04, 2006, 09:28:43 PM
Quote from: MoneyBallSTL on February 04, 2006, 09:14:21 PM
SCOTS WIN 86-77!!! CONGRATULATIONS TO THE NEW #1 TEAM IN THE LAND...Can't wait to be at the NCAC Tourney back in Woo!

I think that he typed that in Size 24 font. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 04, 2006, 09:30:00 PM
Congratulations to Wooster...what a great win on a night showcasing the NCAC's best to the D3 community at large.  

Quick poll talk...this will almost assuredly move Wooster to #1.  If I had a vote, Witt would only drop to #2, but I don't have a vote and I don't know how much longer 19-0 Lawrence can be denied.  Is Lawrence the second best team in the country?  I don't know.  In fact I'd probably doubt it, but as the last undefeated team in the universe it's hard to argue against putting them there.  

Quick formatting note....the preview button.  It rocks.  Use it.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2006, 09:35:22 PM
I dunno; Witt lost at home, and they were never any closer than about 4 or 5 after the first few minutes.  Everytime they'd make a run and get it to 4 or 5, Wooster would answer and push it back to 10.  Losing by 9 at home is not helpful, no matter who you lost to.  I think Witt falls to #4 or #5, behind Lawrence, Hope, and perhaps Augustana.

I quickly point out that there's absolutely no shame in being #5 in the country!  And I'd still make Wooster and Witt co-favorites in the NCAC tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 04, 2006, 09:41:53 PM
hmmmm.....

definately Woo #1

I'd move Lawrence and Augie up a notch each to #2 and #3.

I'd give real serious consideration to Hope at 4 ahead of Witt.  But Witt doesn't really deserve to drop more than 3 spots to #5.  Its a toughy.

Maybe I'll have to delve into the schedules more.

oh and congrats to COW
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 04, 2006, 09:43:35 PM
If anyone hears about a televised replay of this game on Clear Picture or elsewhere, please don't be shy about letting us know!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on February 04, 2006, 09:56:40 PM
Wow, I really must apologize for my formatting blunder...I don't want to shame any Wooster grads by my D3hoops posting ability. I am still fairly new, haha. Anyway, vanillacow wanted me to ask about the mysterious exit of the Wittenberg student section leader BJ Harris out the back door of the HPER center tonight. It's a shame that BJ doesn't want to hang around and talk with the fans or media after a loss, haha. I'm sure vanillacow, candyland, "attapep", and myself, as well as other wooster alums that attend games would gladly converse with the public.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2006, 09:58:37 PM
I'd say Witt probably falls to fifth, but there's no shame in that. Four great teams ahead of them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 04, 2006, 10:09:56 PM
Wooster won 3 of 4 critical stats categories in tonight's game:  :)

-Wooster had the higher shooting percentage at 56% FG
-Wooster made 12 three pointers to 6 for Witt (52% shootng on three's by Woo!)
-Wooster only had 9 turnovers vs. 10 for Witt
-Witt outrebounded Wooster 30 to 25

Basically, the extra three pointers and the higher shooting percentage were the difference in this game.  Free throws were essentially even until the last 2 minutes when Witt had to foul and Wooster then made 6 or more in a row.

Great effort tonight by Tom Port who had his first full speed practice just yesterday!  :)  He played tough "D", made 3 of 7 three point shots and pulled down some key rebounds.  Coach Moore was very impressed with the way Port played tonight given the games he missed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2006, 10:20:26 PM
Here's the points Wittenberg has allowed in the 21 games they've played this year:
55, 50, 54, 51, 52, 59, 86, 54, 43, 36, 49, 51, 51, 57, 41, 60, 56, 48, 49, 49, 86

Can anyone pick out the two Wooster games from that lineup?    ;)

I'm mighty impressed with Wooster's effort tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2006, 10:23:51 PM
Around the NCAC:

OWU beats Allegheny 77-67. Chojnacki had a double double with 19 and 12.

Oberlin knocks off Hiram 102-100 in 3OTs. Oberlin had an 18 point lead in the first half and almost coughed it up.

The Yeomen's Quiton Spencer goes for 47 (47!) and plays all 55 minutes. Godwin has 23 and also plays all 55 minutes for Oberlin.

AJ White plays 52 minutes and scores 26. TC Spencer added 22.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2006, 10:25:42 PM
Earlham bests Kenyon 70-60. Brandon Miller scores 20 off the bench. This sets up a H-U-G-E game Wednesday at Chadwick. The winner likely hosts in the first round - the loser goes on the road.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 04, 2006, 10:31:45 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 04, 2006, 10:20:26 PM
Here's the points Wittenberg has allowed in the 21 games they've played this year:
55, 50, 54, 51, 52, 59, 86, 54, 43, 36, 49, 51, 51, 57, 41, 60, 56, 48, 49, 49, 86

Can anyone pick out the two Wooster games from that lineup?    ;)

I'm mighty impressed with Wooster's effort tonight.

David,

That is one of the most impressive comparisons I've ever seen!  In 19 other games NO one came within 25 points of scoring as much against Witt as Woo did!  WOW!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 04, 2006, 10:39:36 PM
Why didn't Brandon Miller start?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 04, 2006, 10:40:55 PM
NCAC Standings through today's games:

12-0  Wooster (20-1)
10-2  Wittenberg (19-2)
9-3  Ohio Wesleyan (14-7)
7-5  Wabash (13-8)
7-5  Earlham (10-11)
4-8  Allegheny (8-12)
3-9  Kenyon (6-15)
1-11  Hiram (3-18)
1-11  Oberlin (1-19)

Congrats to the Yeomen on their first win.  4th place (and the home court in the first round of the NCAC tournament) is a tight race between Wabash and Earlham.  These two teams match up next Wednesday.  OWU still has home games remaining vs. Witt and Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2006, 10:50:27 PM
I don't doubt that we'll have some guests in our little room tonight.  For those guests, here's some links:

Game story by Wooster's SID, Hugh Howard (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/recaps/2005-06/wittenberg2.php)

Game story by Wittenberg's SID, Ryan Maurer (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/05-06gamestories/wooster2.html)

Box score, including play-by-play, from Wittenberg's website (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/05-06statistics/witm0204.htm)

Enjoy your stay!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2006, 11:07:13 PM
Forgot Denison at 6-6 and 10-11 there. They're still in the mix for fourth, but it will be a tall order now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 04, 2006, 11:14:34 PM
Great game by the Scots tonight.  Between the play-by-play on the other boards and what's already been posted here, there's not too much to add (but of course, I'll still put my 2-cents in!)

Another great game for Cooper.  24 pts (8 for 12 from the floor, 3-5 on 3's), 4 boards, 5 assists, and a steal.  I was concerned that he might be too hyped up for the game, but he came out under control, scored the Scots 1st 5 pts, and hit the HUGE 3-pointer at the half.  

Brandon Johnson was super down the stretch with some good ball-handling and clutch foul shooting.  This guy is so athletic and has got a ton of talent.  

Evan Will didn't do much in the first half, but the 4 or 5 minutes that he played in the 2nd were great.  He made several big buckets at a time when the Scots really needed someone to step up.

Port was a little cold at first, and maybe pressing a bit on offense.  He did get more into the flow in the 2nd half and was his usual self with several huge rebounds.  There didn't appear to be any ill effects from the injury.

The sweat on the floor was really a problem - guys were slipping all over the place.  The problem was that the refs seemed to be stopping play every time the Scots got the ball, which disrupted the tempo of their offense.  It seems that the officials at Witt should have been able to do something in preparation for the game to better regulate the temp of the gym.  Sure, you put 3100 people in that space its gonna get hot.  So turn on the A/C!.  Open the door!  There's gotta be a better answer than having the AD and his assistant constantly wiping the floor.

The other (minor) thing that bugged me was the seating arrangements.  We got there about 5:30 and I wanted to sit in the top row behind the Scots bench.  The assistant AD was blocking the aisle, saying that they wanted all the Wooster fans in the 300 seats directly behind the bench.  Were the seats higher up reserved? No!  But any time someone from Wooster tried to sit higher up, they kept trying to move us down.  I never really understood what the point of that was.  But I guess we shouldn't have to worry about that again this season!!   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 04, 2006, 11:18:07 PM
Remember Smeds, Wabash still has games left with Witt and Wooster.  Earlham is free and clear of the heavyweights for the duration of the regular season.  The game is absolutely must win for Wabash.  Earlham can lose Wednesday and still win out (toughest game is OWU at home for the Quakers...not easy, but winnable) to beat Wabash out for fourth place.  The LGs are going to need to win Wednesday and get an assist from the Bishops...or hope to find lightning in a bottle against one of the other Ws.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 04, 2006, 11:24:14 PM
I'm curious to hear what Pat and Lenny had to say about the game on their broadcast.  Did anyone here listen to them??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2006, 11:25:36 PM
Oh, Wally, I know that for sure. But what I don't know is how the tiebreakers will work out if they both finish 9-7.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2006, 11:27:35 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 04, 2006, 11:24:14 PM
I'm curious to hear what Pat and Lenny had to say about the game on their broadcast.  Did anyone here listen to them??

I had WQKT on.  I started out with Pat, but the sound quality just wasn't as good, so I switched to the old reliable.  I also would have liked to hear their take.  Maybe it'll be available in archive form.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 04, 2006, 11:32:25 PM
I think Earlham has the edge on Wabash right now in the "who did ya beat" tiebreak by virtue of their win over OWU. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2006, 11:37:24 PM
I was thinking it was 'who did you lose to' instead of 'who did you beat' - but I could be wrong on that.

Earlham still has to travel to Denison, too, and that may not be easy for them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 04, 2006, 11:57:08 PM
Question for anyone who was at the game: Did Wittenberg adjust their defense in the second half, maybe giving the Scots a little less room on the perimeter and fewer good looks from out there?  Or did Wooster just come down to earh on their own?

After this game, my vote for POY has to go to James Cooper.  He's now pretty certain to play on the league's championship (although not necessarily the tournament winner, by a long shot) team, and he's definitely proved his worth with two big games, especially this one, against Wooster's only serious rival.  Again, awesome (8-12, 3-5, 5-6) shooting, plus he led the team in assists with 5 and added 4 rebounds which was only one behind the lead.  I know Russ and Borchers also had excellent games, but winning should count for something.

Evan Will (9) and Marty Bidwell (6) had their minutes reduced drastically with Port's return, but what can you do?

Can anyone who was there give me a take on Witucky's play?  Took only one shot (a three that he made) and had only one assist.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 05, 2006, 12:12:44 AM
Wooster has now won 20 or more games for 10 consecutive seasons:

2006:  20-1
2005:  27-3
2004:  26-4
2003:  30-3
2002:  21-7
2001:  24-4
2000:  26-3
1999:  25-4
1998:  22-6
1997:  23-6

Congratulations to Coach Steve Moore and the rest of the Wooster program on a tremendous decade of excellence!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2006, 01:10:01 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 04, 2006, 11:27:35 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 04, 2006, 11:24:14 PM
I'm curious to hear what Pat and Lenny had to say about the game on their broadcast.  Did anyone here listen to them??

I had WQKT on.  I started out with Pat, but the sound quality just wasn't as good, so I switched to the old reliable.  I also would have liked to hear their take.  Maybe it'll be available in archive form.

There's a link to an archive of the D3hoops.com broadcast on the front page.  I'm going to go try and cue it up now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 05, 2006, 01:15:52 AM
witucky was a non factor the entire evening. he had a turnover that was not typical of him. doesn't sound like the best point guard in d3 guys sorry.
ill comment on the game later im too drunk right now
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 05, 2006, 01:18:43 AM
I wish we could put out a 20K or 32K stream but we're limited by what we can dial up and in an old gym like Wittenberg, 10K was what we had to settle for. Usually I'd go 12 or 16.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 05, 2006, 01:41:29 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 04, 2006, 11:57:08 PM
Question for anyone who was at the game: Did Wittenberg adjust their defense in the second half, maybe giving the Scots a little less room on the perimeter and fewer good looks from out there?  Or did Wooster just come down to earh on their own?

Evan Will (9) and Marty Bidwell (6) had their minutes reduced drastically with Port's return, but what can you do?

Can anyone who was there give me a take on Witucky's play?  Took only one shot (a three that he made) and had only one assist.

On Witt's D:  I didn't see much of a change- Wooster shot 9-12 3s in the first, only 3-10 in the second (but really, 3-3 and then 0-7 to end it).  I thought Port took a couple threes that he wasn't quite set up for(after being off three weeks), Faulk missed a wide-open one...so I think they just didn't fall as much.  I don't think Witt's defense kept Woo from shooting threes.

Yea, Will didn't get many minutes, but his contributions were key.  9 pts in 9 minutes- and 8 quick points when wooster couldn't find the bucket after Witt had cut a 13 pt lead to 5 at 60-55.  He's still playing with a confidence that will only help Wooster as a team down the road.

I didn't think there was anything wrong with Witucky.  He played good, close defense on several Witt gaurds.  Witucky doesn't need to score for Wooster's offense to succeed, especially when everyone around you is draining the threes.  I agree it was a little strange to not see more assists, but he as usual contributed a couple boards.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 05, 2006, 09:20:01 AM
My unofficial GL-Region QOWI based after last night's games:

1:  Carnegie-Mellon 11.429 (will go up to 11.467 if they win at home against Chicago today.  Down to 10.933 of they lose.)
2:  Wittenberg 10.800
3:  Wooster 10.706
4:  Hope 10.615
5:  Baldwin-Wallace 10.421
6:  Albion 9.900
7:  Calvin 9.625
8.  Lake Erie 9.333
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 05, 2006, 09:47:07 AM
Denison played well.  They dug themselves a hole going down 19-2 to start.  But made a game of it.  And they traded baskets in the second half.  Give Joseph his due, he played a whale of a game.

Big crowd, and again the refs did a terrible job.  And I am not just saying that because Denison lost.  If I was from Wabash I would be just as pissed.  THEY STUNK!!!  For some reason it seems this season the officials have done a very bad job.  I have no answer.

Hodgkinson played well and so did Hern.  Its apparent that Krantz hasn't seen a shot he won't take.  The first Wabash game he is 5-17 and last night he is 7-18.  Do you really want a freshman who is shooting 34% trying to get you back in the game.  If you have the hot hand that is one thing........but let's learn to pass it once in a while.

I think Krantz is a very good player, don't get me wrong.  He deserves to be out there.  That is not my problem.  I just question his shot selection at times.  I believe he will settle down and be a very good player for the team.

HATS OFF TO OBERLIN!!!  Spencer with 47pts.  Wow.

And what a huge win by Wooster.  They are the real deal.  Nice to see Port back on the floor.  But everyone says, it is real hard to beat a team 3 times in a season and it looks like they are headed for a tournament show down. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 05, 2006, 10:36:28 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 05, 2006, 01:15:52 AM

witucky was a non factor the entire evening. he had a turnover that was not typical of him. doesn't sound like the best point guard in d3 guys sorry.
ill comment on the game later im too drunk right now


I'm sorry penn, but your opinion on Witucky doesn't really carry much weight.  I guess one uncharactersitic game in which Witucky is basically a non-factor and he's suddenly not the "best point guard in d3?"  Give me a break penn!  What was the final score again???  Witucky might not put up the glamorous stats of some of the more high profile guards like Adam Dauksas at IWU, but all he does is lead his team to victories.  His intangibles like his leadership on the floor are what separate him from other good guards.  Like scotsbrod said, Witucky doesn't need to score for Wooster to win as evidenced last night.  If everyone wearing black and old gold is on fire, why mess with success?  Witucky did play solid D and just sat back and allowed everyone else who was feeling it get it done. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on February 05, 2006, 10:53:26 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 05, 2006, 01:18:43 AM
I wish we could put out a 20K or 32K stream but we're limited by what we can dial up and in an old gym like Wittenberg, 10K was what we had to settle for. Usually I'd go 12 or 16.

23 year old facility old? I'm ancient then. :'(

What accounts for Wooster's crystal clear broadcast?

Luck?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 05, 2006, 12:06:16 PM
I think the main issue with the NCAC refs this year is a lack of consistency. It seems that often times, you need to spit out teeth to get fouls in one half, and in the other half you just need to breathe on someone to be called for one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 05, 2006, 12:10:07 PM
It may have seemed that Krantz was just chuckin' it up there, but Wabash's defensive scheme was to collapse on the middle and limit the touches of Hern and Hodgkinson in the paint. Zimmer and Lytle were always in the area around those two, and they couldn't get looks a lot of the time. Hern did a nice job with the assists, but that D also forced him into a lot of turnovers.

So Denison had to shoot from the outside, and Krantz was able to get open.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 05, 2006, 12:23:39 PM
Late night but my observations

1) Maybe the game won't be regarded as a classic, but what a great atmosphere.  I think both team should be commended for such a well fought game. Each team played to they strength but in the end Woosters advantage in the backcourt was greater than Witt's advantage in the frontcourt.

2) Russ should still be in serious contention for the POY. He is just a complete player. Very classy also. His quotes in the papers are always show great respect for the game.

3) The moisture issue on the court did take away from the game a bit. I feel part of the problem was that there was significantly more than 3100 people in the gym. The students admitting people into the game did not rip tickets, just mearly stamped your hand. That meant someone could go back out and hand their ticket to someone else.  There were alot of people standing court level.

4) I think Brandon Johnson has locked up Newcomer of the year. There are a number of good freshman in the league this year, which is great to see, but Brandon has consistently played at a high level.

5) No kudo's to the Witt student section. Their second half chant should be an embarassment to the Wittenberg administration.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 05, 2006, 01:20:24 PM
The superbowl is in 5 hours and I have Pittsburg!!
But here is some Sunday Wooster-Wittenberg coverage:
From the Wooster Daily Record:
http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles//sports/&file=_sports1.txt&article=1&tD=
From the Springfield 'fish wrap':
long link (http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/sports/content/sports/stories/2006/02/05/SNSsp0205WittmainWeb.html)

Now we have possible NCAC Tourney match up to look forward to and obsess about.  When is the last time the Scots beat Witt three time or vice versa?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2006, 01:40:20 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on February 05, 2006, 01:20:24 PM
Now we have possible NCAC Tourney match up to look forward to and obsess about.  When is the last time the Scots beat Witt three time or vice versa?

Wittenberg won all three meetings in the 2001-02 season.
http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2005-06/woo-witt_rivalry.pdf
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 05, 2006, 01:46:51 PM
Quote from: witt4ever on February 05, 2006, 10:53:26 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 05, 2006, 01:18:43 AM
I wish we could put out a 20K or 32K stream but we're limited by what we can dial up and in an old gym like Wittenberg, 10K was what we had to settle for. Usually I'd go 12 or 16.

23 year old facility old? I'm ancient then. :'(

What accounts for Wooster's crystal clear broadcast?

Luck?

Hey man, I tried four times to connect to the internet and the best I got was 33.6. Considering one of the times I got 9800 (which was state of the art in 1992) I had to go with what I could get.

You'd be surprised what a difference old phone lines makes, seriously. A few crackles on a line doesn't have much impact on the radio but on a dial-up internet connection it's a huge deal. Up until about the mid-1990s phone lines didn't have to meet that kind of standard so it's not surprising that buildings from that era don't.

What accounts for their broadcast is different equipment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2006, 01:54:44 PM
The D3hoops.com/Broadcast Monsters broadcast might not have been as "crystal clear" as WQKT's, but it is very listen-to-able (I'm inventing this word right now, and may use it later in Scrabble. ;))  I don't imagine that Witt fans are looking to relive the experience right about now, but Wooster fans who attended the game or listened to WQKT should definitely check out the archival broadcast by Pat and Lenny.  It is very good.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on February 05, 2006, 02:15:02 PM
My reaction to the game
1.) Witt had no plan for the pick and roll, which i was personally embarassed about. There is NO excuse for setting one high screen and getting Tom Port among others a wide open three from the  top of the key.

2.) 9-12 from three in the first half silenced the crowd and did not let Witt get off to a good start and have Wooster on its heels. Witt plays best with a lead being able to take the air out of the ball and feed it to Russ and Borchers.

3.) Cooper is good

Lets not get rediculous here. 9-12 from 3 in the first half is crazy/something that  won't happen again this year. As a Witt fan I am really not scared about possibly facing this team in the NCAC and NCAA tourney. Hopefully coach brown will get some kind of solid defense plan from this tape and be ready to pull out a win at Wooster for the conference tourney.


PS. Live by the 3, Die by the 3





PSS. I just thought I'd like to let everyone know that a lot of gambling websites are giving out free money today. Just put some money in an account and put it all on Seahawks +4 today. Bryan Nelsons lock of the day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 05, 2006, 02:19:44 PM
No wonder I can never win at Scrabble, I've never drawn a hyphen from the letter bag...

The D3hoops.com broadcast was fine.  I did have trouble with the pregame talk, as there was lots of loud background noise/static.  During the game, that was gone.

I've been checking out the undefeated team, Lawrence, who while ranked #3 on D3hoops is the top-rated team at Massey, by a long shot.  Their rating of 1.465 tops second-place Wooster's 1.003.

Lawrence is a forward-oriented team, with a preseason All-American in Chris Braier who scores 15.7 a game, grabs 12.9 boards, and in addition leads the team with 78 assists and 42 steals.  Their second-best player is the other forward, Kyle MacGillis, at 14.2 ppg.  They seem to play center by committee, and also give four guards lots of minutes.  

Playing the 16th toughest schedule in DIII (according to Massey), they score 80.8 and give up 65.3.  Defensively, they're very tough against threes (.299), maybe a little susceptible in the middle.

I've created them for a computer simulation and have them going against Wooster.  At the half, Wooster leads, 40-32, but hasn't controlled the tempo as they were able to do against Wittenberg. I foresee a close finish.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 05, 2006, 02:48:55 PM
Quote from: WoosterBNel on February 05, 2006, 02:15:02 PM

Lets not get rediculous here. 9-12 from 3 in the first half is crazy/something that  won't happen again this year. As a Witt fan I am really not scared about possibly facing this team in the NCAC and NCAA tourney. Hopefully coach brown will get some kind of solid defense plan from this tape and be ready to pull out a win at Wooster for the conference tourney.

PS. Live by the 3, Die by the 3


Well, Coach Brown had the chance to come up with some kind of solid defensive plan after the 1st meeting when they gave up 34 points above their defensive average.  Whatever he came up with didn't work last night as Wooster again matched that effort putting up 34 more than the 52 Witt gives up on the season.  Witt hasn't come close to slowing Wooster down in the 1st two meetings, so what makes you think, if they happen to meet up again down the road, that things will be any different?  And don't give me the 9-12 excuse.  Wooster cooled off big time in the 2nd half and yet they were still able to keep Witt at bay.  One thing that can't be overlooked is that Witt has shot the ball extremely well in both meetings as well.  They have played about as good as they can from the offensive end, and they still can't get over on the Scots.  Something to think about...

Quote from: oldwittfanBy the way, I would expect that we will see Wittenberg's athletic director control fans a lot more than is true at Wooster where the students seem to get uglier and more profane each year.

I wasn't able to attend last night, but judging from goscots' 5th observation, it sounds like the Witt students can be taken off the pedastal that you put them on owf.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 05, 2006, 03:41:55 PM
Using MOV, Lawrence is first, but with a .975 rating, compared to Witt's .961 (which will change, not doubt when the new ratings come out). Lawrence's SOS was 22nd.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 05, 2006, 03:43:28 PM
I think I may have a speculative guess on why Miller did not start for Earlham. He got a "T" in his last game.

Some coaches yank the "T" offender out of the game immediately. I remember one high school coach had a rule that if you got a "T" you had to sit for a full quarter. His son got one and his butt was on the bench for the next eight minutes.

Perhaps that's Justis' rule, you get a "T" - you don't start (or you miss your first sub rotation in).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bigkrapper on February 05, 2006, 04:37:43 PM
Out of curiousity since i was not able to , Anyone want to let me know what the Witt fans were chanting in the second half that has a few of the posters a bit upset?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 05, 2006, 04:50:14 PM
Quote from: WoosterBNel on February 05, 2006, 02:15:02 PM

PS. Live by the 3, Die by the 3

Actually, Wooster is the #1 three point shooting team in D3 through 2/4 games.  ;D

Wooster has made 225 of 504 three pointers for a terrific 44.6%.

What makes this stat so impressive is Wooster's depth in 3 point shooting.  The Scots have 6 guys (including 4 of their starters) who have made 20 or more three pointers each this year.  4 of the 6 shooters (Cooper, Port, Witucky, Fulk) have each made 35 or more three pointers this year.  Van Horn and Johnson are the 5th and 6th players each with more than 20 made.

It is very hard for an opponent to defend the three point shot when Wooster usually has 3 or 4 players on the floor at any time who can hit the shot.  Moreover, the Scots are so unselfish that they swing the ball to whoever is open for the best shot.

WoosterBNel -- everyone on this board knows that you are a Witt supporter so you might want to change your poster name.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 05, 2006, 05:01:48 PM
Speaking of three's:

I thought the ref's as good a job as any crew I have seen in a league game this year. The only really blown call was the 3 from Brady in the corner in the second half. The shot clock had clearly hit "0" before Brady even cocked his arm for the shot. Maybe because it was so loud they ref's didn't hear the horn, but the official in front of the scorers table should have seen it.

The stat's also show Vandervaart as missing a three. Umm, I don't think he has taken a shot outside the lane all year.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 05, 2006, 05:12:04 PM
Every shot that I've seen Vandervaart take has been from under the shadow of the basket.  When the Scot radio broadcast mentioned him putting up, and making, a seven-footer, I was in shock.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 05, 2006, 05:20:28 PM
Quote from: bigkrapper on February 05, 2006, 04:37:43 PM
Out of curiousity since i was not able to , Anyone want to let me know what the Witt fans were chanting in the second half that has a few of the posters a bit upset?

During the longest drying-the-floor break the student section broke out into "F___ you Wooster".  At the end of the game they were giving the one-finger salute as the filed past the Wooster crowd.  Very classy. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2006, 05:23:12 PM
Wow!  :o That's mighty low.  I wonder what would have inspired such a display?  I certainly hope that Wooster students don't behave that way when Wooster loses to Witt at home. 

It's good to have an intense rivalry, but that's too intense.  It's just a game, after all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 05, 2006, 05:24:58 PM
Quote from: bigkrapper on February 05, 2006, 04:37:43 PM
Out of curiousity since i was not able to , Anyone want to let me know what the Witt fans were chanting in the second half that has a few of the posters a bit upset?

imderekpoe is correct, but to add context it came after the Woo Students chanted "We can't hear you"--

Great game last night--the Scots' can hit 3s like most teams can hit layups--and the continued emergence of the next "Big Game James" to wear the Black and Old Gold made this victory especially sweet!

Sorry you couldn't be there BigKrapper--you're fellow former mates were there strong in number.  A potential rematch will be closer to home--

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldwittfan on February 05, 2006, 05:26:32 PM
I have no doubts that Wittenberg student fans can be just as much jerks as the Wooster students.  Wooster students have been similarly obnoxious in recent years.  Neither school can be very proud about it.  We recruit from the same pool, and such behavior is tolerated way too much these days.  What I said was that Witt's Athletic Director would act.  He did try to set the tone before the game.  He happened to be out of the gym getting more towels when the Witt students turned ugly.  If he had been there he would have acted as he has during earlier games this year.  My apologies for our students.

That was a great game by Wooster's team.  They were shooting 80% from the 3 point line for the first 25 minutes or so.  I know they are good but doubt they are that good.  Billy Bowen got right in Cooper's face when he guarded him and that seemed to work.  I assume he and teams who see the tape will adopt that approach again.  Obviously, we hope we get another shot at Wooster.  Both Wooster and Wittenberg seem to have played better at the other team's gym in recent years.  We can only hope so.

The value of athletics is not just learning how to win.  It is also learning what to do after you lose.  I think this Wittenberg team has the character to do that well.  We will see. Again, congratulations to Wooster and hope to see you down the road.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 05, 2006, 05:37:45 PM
I hardly think the "We can't hear you" chant deserves that response.    I don't think you can get much uglier and profane than that eh oldwittfan??? ::)  And to say that it just so happened that the AD was out getting towels and that's why they got away with it?  Like he wouldn't have heard about it when he came back to the floor?  Why wouldn't he have done something then if he doesn't tolerate it unlike you say Wooster's AD does? ???

On another note, here is a quote I found a bit amusing from the Springfield fishwrap:

Quote from: Springfield News-SunTwice now the Tigers have held the nation's fifth-best scoring offense (100.7 ppg) to 86 points with the nation's best defense that allows an average of 52.7 points a game.

They act like the Tigers did well to hold Wooster to 86 points?!  Let's see, Witt's D gave up 34 points above their average, while they held Wooster to just 14 points below their average.  And, in reality, Wooster helped Witt out by slowing things down at the end of the game, or they might have hit their average.  I just thought it was funny to say that Witt held Wooster to 86 points like it was some extraordinary effort by Witt's D to hold Wooster under the century mark. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 05, 2006, 06:00:37 PM
I thought that Witt's fan section may have been saying "Buck you Wooster" to try to be cute...to my ears it didn't really seem like an "F" sound to start it-but maybe I'm just trying to give them the benefit of the doubt.  Either way, Wooster's students aren't innocent- we seem to like saying "S&$t on Witt."  Both sides were guilty of "Bull S&$t" chants when officials' calls didn't go there way.

Personally, I wish we'd just play the basketball game and have more inventive/interesting cheers, which would reflect better on our schools' academic reputations, anyway.

I give credit to both Woo and Witt's ADs, though, as they at least tried to talk over the PA to control the crowd.  I don't know where Witt's AD spent most of the game, but Woo's (Keith Beckett) was right at the Wooster bench and thus right at the student cheering section.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 05, 2006, 06:05:37 PM
On a different note, one of the Witt students had a sign saying "You've got a TOWNIE," which I assume referred to Cooper.

To the Witt people, is being a student at Witt and coming from Springfield looked down upon?  Does Witt not have many students from the area?  Or was this just a student who was trying to make hay out of something that didn't really matter?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2006, 06:11:09 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 05, 2006, 06:05:37 PM
On a different note, one of the Witt students had a sign saying "You've got a TOWNIE," which I assume referred to Cooper.

To the Witt people, is being a student at Witt and coming from Springfield looked down upon?  Does Witt not have many students from the area?  Or was this just a student who was trying to make hay out of something that didn't really matter?

I gather from your footer that you're still a student at Wooster.  Can I infer from your post that there's no more "town and gown" (or "uphill/downhill") issues at Wooster?  In my day, there was nothing worse than being a "townie."  I kept my local resident status a closely guarded secret until my fraternity was stuck with me, then turned it to my advantage (as a place we could go for off-campus parties.)  But I wasn't a true "townie," either, since I was from Millersburg and not Wooster. 

The Scots have their own "townie" in Brad Chisnell.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 05, 2006, 06:31:09 PM
Old Witt Fan:

Quote from: oldwittfan on February 05, 2006, 05:26:32 PM
 I know they are good but doubt they are that good.  

1)  Doubt if you must, but Wooster is THAT good

Quote from: oldwittfan on February 05, 2006, 05:26:32 PM


Billy Bowen got right in Cooper's face when he guarded him and that seemed to work.  I assume he and teams who see the tape will adopt that approach again.  


2)  Were you there?  As has been recently posted, Brown's had 2 opportunities to try and stop Cooper, along with coaches in 19 other games vs. the Scots, to no avail--he faces teams #1 defenders in every game, and continues to light up the sky. 

One of Springfield's finest, in Black and Old Gold, hoisting daggers at the rim from 28 feet, won't be stopped by Bowen should they meet again--I'm guessing Brown tried everything to prepare for Cooper yesterday, and I'm also guessing that today he still has the same hopeless feeling about how to defend him that he did after he drained the game winning 3 in Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 05, 2006, 06:43:34 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 05, 2006, 06:11:09 PM
I gather from your footer that you're still a student at Wooster.  Can I infer from your post that there's no more "town and gown" (or "uphill/downhill") issues at Wooster?  In my day, there was nothing worse than being a "townie."  I kept my local resident status a closely guarded secret until my fraternity was stuck with me, then turned it to my advantage (as a place we could go for off-campus parties.)  But I wasn't a true "townie," either, since I was from Millersburg and not Wooster. 

The Scots have their own "townie" in Brad Chisnell.

I won't say there aren't issues with town-gown (the school's too liberal; town's conservative/parties in the town's backyard etc.) but I think the overall relationship is pretty positive.  

I am a real "townie," (lived in Wooster since age 7  :o ) which I certainly do get called from time to time, but it doesn't carry the same negativity that you recall from your student days.  There are a good number of "locals" that seem to do just fine at Woo, and students don't seem to really care one way or the other.

My surprise at the sign was that I didn't think it would be the type of sign Wooster students would have made if at a Woo home game if Witt had a player that was a Wooster local.  I guess I just interperted the Witt student's sign as saying, "We don't need a townie/local player to win- you can have him...in fact, we don't even want him, because he's a townie."  I just was trying to figure out if that was an accurate interpertation of the sign, because I couldn't figure out what else the student was trying to say.

"Uphill/downhill": only problem with that now is that Wooster the city has grown out to the north...so Wooster the college is now downhill from a lot of the town/newest development.  We still sing about the "school we love on top of the hill" in our fight song, "Are you from Wooster?" though.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 05, 2006, 07:02:12 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 05, 2006, 05:23:12 PM
Wow!  :o That's mighty low.  I wonder what would have inspired such a display?  I certainly hope that Wooster students don't behave that way when Wooster loses to Witt at home. 

It's good to have an intense rivalry, but that's too intense.  It's just a game, after all.

Sounds about as nasty as our rivalry with Depauw is. Maybe it's not a good thing. Just saying.

As far as the "townie" thing that was quite an insult at Wabash among the students when I was there. I hope it's different now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Warren Thompson on February 05, 2006, 07:24:27 PM
Just out of curiosity ...

Why the hell should it matter if a student is a "townie" (except to ignorant non-townie students with an infantile sense of self-importance)?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 05, 2006, 07:26:33 PM
Some would say you answered your own question, Warren.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Warren Thompson on February 05, 2006, 07:29:29 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 05, 2006, 07:26:33 PM
Some would say you answered your own question, Warren.  ;)

Yes, evidently I did .... :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 05, 2006, 07:32:05 PM
Quote from: Warren Thompson on February 05, 2006, 07:24:27 PM
Just out of curiosity ...

Why the hell should it matter if a student is a "townie" (except to ignorant non-townie students with an infantile sense of self-importance)?
It shouldn't, so that's why I didn't understand the sign the Witt student held up.  Regardless, it was Cooper, with a game-leading 24 points, who showed that it didn't matter to him what Witt's cheering section said or held up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Warren Thompson on February 05, 2006, 07:35:44 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 05, 2006, 07:32:05 PM
Quote from: Warren Thompson on February 05, 2006, 07:24:27 PM
Just out of curiosity ...

Why the hell should it matter if a student is a "townie" (except to ignorant non-townie students with an infantile sense of self-importance)?
It shouldn't, so that's why I didn't understand the sign the Witt student held up.  Regardless, it was Cooper, with a game-leading 24 points, who showed that it didn't matter to him what Witt's cheering section said or held up.

Never underestimate an undergraduate's ability to act like the south end of a northbound horse.    :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 05, 2006, 07:40:25 PM
Quote from: Warren Thompson on February 05, 2006, 07:35:44 PM
Never underestimate an undergraduate's ability to act like the south end of a northbound horse.    :(

I'm quite sure they were aided by Jim Beam and some other "friends".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scotty on February 05, 2006, 08:05:10 PM
basketball...baseball...what do you say, let's do it in
football...go Scots...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 05, 2006, 08:19:10 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 05, 2006, 06:00:37 PM

I thought that Witt's fan section may have been saying "Buck you Wooster" to try to be cute...to my ears it didn't really seem like an "F" sound to start it-but maybe I'm just trying to give them the benefit of the doubt.  Either way, Wooster's students aren't innocent- we seem to like saying "S&$t on Witt."  Both sides were guilty of "Bull S&$t" chants when officials' calls didn't go there way.

Personally, I wish we'd just play the basketball game and have more inventive/interesting cheers, which would reflect better on our schools' academic reputations, anyway.


scotsbrod,  I totally agree with your take.  I wasn't trying to infer that Wooster's students were innocent.  Far from it.  That S&$t on Witt chant does nothing but fire up Witt's players even more in my opinion.  I was just making a point to oldwittfan in referrence to his earlier post  when he acted like Wooster's students were basically classless and that Witt's AD does a much better job of controlling Witt's students.

I don't find anything wrong with opposing student sections jabbing at one another with different chants.  It adds to the fun atmosphere of rivalry games.  But when profanity has to be brought in, I think that crosses the line.  I will say though, it sure seems like there are a bunch of innocents in here.  For me, as an undergrad at Westminster, football was our sport and we had some wild tailgating going on during my days there.  As I said though, there is a point where things can cross the line and I think we are seeing that at campuses all over more and more which can be a bit disturbing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2006, 09:13:43 PM
Warren, do the students at LebVal not invent ways to feel superior?  When I was a student, it seemed like more time was spent inventing and acting upon imaginary class stratification than any other activity.  It was the very essence of the Greek system.  In a caste system such as that, "townie" tends to be the "untouchable." 

I'd be thrilled to learn that that's not the case anymore.  I'd also be surprised.  And let's face it; it's not like college students are the only people creating wholly fictional class divisions and then organizing their lives around those fictions.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 05, 2006, 09:43:18 PM
Many years ago when I was a student at Bradley in Peoria, Illinois, the Greeks ruled the campus, or at least thought they did.  To the Greeks, anyway, everyone else (including me) was a GDI, a Goddamned Independent.  And the lowest of those were the townies.  In my opinion, the system succeeded only in inflating the egos of a few thousand kids.

I had no interest in rushing any houses, but a few weeks later, two Jewish guys from my high school back in New York invited me to dinner at their frat house.  They tried to talk me into joining, to become the first non-Jewish guy in their frat.  I think what they really wanted was a quarterback for their flag football team.  I said no, although if I had been inclined to go Greek, it would have been with them.

And once in a while we GDIs kicked some Greek butt.  In my second year I put together an independent intramural basketball team that, after winning our league, won the campus championship.  We had four former all-state high school players (two who had played on the Bradley freshmen team the) and were pretty darned good.  Probably could have given Oberlin a good game...  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldwittfan on February 05, 2006, 10:26:45 PM
I stand by my earlier posts  The Wittenberg Athletic Director has acted in the past to stop ugly behavior.  He would have in this case too.   If you knew the Wittenberg Athletic Director and had seen him in action, you would know that.  You do not know but feel free to criticize anyway.  Maybe you have seen the Wooster Athletic Directors do something when their students yelled vulgar stuff.  I have not.  The adults need to exercise some leadership.  This kind of vulgar stuff is not necessary for fans to have fun and support their teams.

By the way as someone who lives in Springfield, I too was insulted by the homie sign.  James Cooper is a good young man and an outstanding player.  Springfield is proud of him and wishes him well.  Of course we Wittenberg fans just wish he would not do quite so well against Wittenberg.  Most of Wittenberg's students do good things in the community, but some are jerks.  I stated that early on.  Could we just agree that this behavor is stupid and urge both Athletic Departments to try to control it..   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 05, 2006, 10:40:02 PM
QuoteWhy the hell should it matter if a student is a "townie" (except to ignorant non-townie students with an infantile sense of self-importance)?

It helped me - my pledge brothers knew where they could go for good Sunday night grub! La Casa de Smed!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 05, 2006, 10:48:57 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 05, 2006, 09:43:18 PM
Many years ago when I was a student at Bradley in Peoria, Illinois, the Greeks ruled the campus, or at least thought they did.  To the Greeks, anyway, everyone else (including me) was a GDI, a Goddamned Independent.  And the lowest of those were the townies.  In my opinion, the system succeeded only in inflating the egos of a few thousand kids.

I had no interest in rushing any houses, but a few weeks later, two Jewish guys from my high school back in New York invited me to dinner at their frat house.  They tried to talk me into joining, to become the first non-Jewish guy in their frat.  I think what they really wanted was a quarterback for their flag football team.  I said no, although if I had been inclined to go Greek, it would have been with them.

And once in a while we GDIs kicked some Greek butt.  In my second year I put together an independent intramural basketball team that, after winning our league, won the campus championship.  We had four former all-state high school players (two who had played on the Bradley freshmen team the) and were pretty darned good.  Probably could have given Oberlin a good game...  :)

Small world!  I grew up in Peoria, and my mom taught (part-time) at Bradley!

IWU was also totally dominated by the greeks; we independents didn't call ourselves 'goddamned independents' - it was a more subtly nuanced  Gamma Delta Iotas!!

My guess is that your intramural team would not simply have given Oberlin a good game - you probably would have finished 4th or 5th in the NCAC!  I'm not sure when 'many years ago' might be, but Bradley was once a national power in d1, and their recruited freshmen would likely be d3 all-conference players.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 05, 2006, 10:57:17 PM
QuoteBy the way as someone who lives in Springfield, I too was insulted by the homie sign.  James Cooper is a good young man and an outstanding player.  Springfield is proud of him and wishes him well.  Of course we Wittenberg fans just wish he would not do quite so well against Wittenberg.  Most of Wittenberg's students do good things in the community, but some are jerks.  I stated that early on.  Could we just agree that this behavor is stupid and urge both Athletic Departments to try to control it..   

I second that.  Good one oldwittfan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 05, 2006, 11:20:59 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 05, 2006, 10:48:57 PM
My guess is that your intramural team would not simply have given Oberlin a good game - you probably would have finished 4th or 5th in the NCAC!  I'm not sure when 'many years ago' might be, but Bradley was once a national power in d1, and their recruited freshmen would likely be d3 all-conference players.

I was there in the late sixties; my freshman year was the fall of 1965.  That was the year after Bradley, led by future ABA player Lavern (Jelly) Tart won the NIT.  My first year we got an NIT invite but the board of directors turned it down due the legal problems of our center, Joe Allen.  The board was hung in effigy in a protest by the students.  :)

My intramural team had Allen Goode, basketball all-state from New Hampshire and also that state's record holder in the shot put.  He was 6'5" and also a tackle on the football team.  Our other big guy was named Don Canfield, also about 6'5".  I loved it.  The defense would collapse on those guys and I'd just throw up twenty foot jumpers from the perimeter.  Once in a while, they even went in, but if they didn't, we generally got a stick back.  :)

Goode was a moose, bigger than Brian Nelson.  He lived two rooms down from me in the dorm my first year.  We got brave one day, and when he wasn't there got into his room and stole his mattress.  Actually, we tied a rope around it, shoved it out the window and lowered it to the ground from our fourth floor.  Trouble is, when we went down there to get it to hide it somewhere, it was gone!  Some jerks who lived on the first floor snagged it, and hid it on us!  For a while, Goode was intent on kicking all of our asses, but we eventually calmed him down with promises of pizza and beer...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 06, 2006, 12:29:43 AM
Woo Boo,

I was IWU 66-70, so wasn't paying attention during MOST of your Bradley time.

Nonetheless, I woud take it as a safe guess that  (assuming your intramural team had two RECRUITED freshmen) they would finish high in the NCAC!  In those days, Bradley was a national power.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2006, 12:39:22 AM
I don't think you are actually trying to insult our conference, Mr. Ypsi, by comparing our midrange teams with intramural teams at other schools, but it sure comes off like an insult.  Our girls may not be as pretty as the Rockettes, but we love 'em anyway, and we don't appreciate being told to our faces that other girls are prettier--even if they are.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 06, 2006, 01:13:49 AM
Since I've been busy trying to catch up with work after being at the HPER from 12-1 and 4-10 yesterday, just now getting back to the boards.  Figured I'd address some of the issues that have been brought up.

On "Townies": Yes, for the most part, there is somewhat of a hostile relationship between Wittenberg students and Springfield residents.  I guess there is a perception in the Springfield area that Wittenberg students are spoiled little rich kids, and a perception among Witt students that people who live in Springfield but not on the Witt campus, called "townies", are idiots and criminals.  It's pretty sad, but I guess it has been like this for a while.

On the Witt Students' "F U Wooster" chant: Scotsbrod, I thank you for trying to give Witt students the benefit of the doubt, but that was indeed the chant.  As a Wittenberg student (and a very active member in the athletic department), I was embarassed.  Not only because of what was heard in the arena, but the fact that so many people were chanting it, it actually was able to be heard (from what I've been told) in the background of our radio broadcast (was it audible in the Wooster/D3 broadcasts as well?).  Ryan Maurer, our SID, started yelling at the students from the press box to knock it off, but Garnett was nowhere in sight to do anything (which, given a few other events throughout the night, wasn't surprising).  Now, I know Witt fans know about the "S*** on Witt" chant, and were probably trying to "one-up" that chant, but it is still uncalled for.

On the Witt Fans in General: Make no mistake about it - the majority of students at the game were trashed.  I think it was easily the highest attended JV game in Wittenberg history, and the students were just as rowdy then as they were during the varsity game.  However, for as much focus is put on the expletive-laced chant later in the night, one of my favorite chants was right before the game.  Wooster started a chant of their own (which, I couldn't hear, as I was on the other side of the building), and the Witt crowd responded with "Sit Down, Shut Up!"  See, there's an example of a great chant that gets at your opponents but doesn't stoop to the level of swearing.  Of course, I was disappointed to hear rumors of fights almost breaking out between Witt and Woo fans as well, and, as was mentioned earlier, both sets of fans can be at fault for different events at different times in the game.  Doesn't make it right though.

On the Game Itself: Again, a game that was pretty close, not a blowout, and a fun game to watch.  Of course, nothing like the 3OT classic last year, but how often do we really see that?  Wooster lit it up from 3 - we all knew they were a good 3-point shooting team, but 9-12 to start the game?  NOBODY could have called that, and if they did, it would have been a lucky guess.  Wide open, hand-in-the-face, almost at half court (Cooper's 3 at the end of the half - incredible) - they couldn't miss.  And that was really the story of the game.  Russ and Borchers were close to unstoppable, but when you're trading 2s for 3s in the first half, you just dig yourself into a hole (and that was indeed the difference, as the two teams tied in the second half).  The officiating wasn't too bad - sure, a couple missed fouls or travels here and there, but nothing too extreme (except the constant stoppages to wipe up the sweat, which was out of control for a while there).  I knew what Witt's players could do, having watched them all year, but James Cooper was impressive, and Tom Port coming off of injury was stellar.  At this stage of the year, I put Cooper as my POY, with Russ 2nd, then any combination of Port, Borchers, and Brandon Miller at 3-4-5.

All-in-all, it was a fun game.  Unfortunately, if there's a rematch in the tournament finals (which I imagine there will be), I won't be able to head up, as our women moved one step closer yesterday to hosting their NCAC tournament, and I would have to be there for that.

Congratulations to Wooster, both on the win and the impending #1 slot.  I know Witt may be down about the loss, but 19-2 is still nothing to be ashamed of.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 06, 2006, 09:40:11 AM
First in my days at Wooster the definition of townie was:  "College age resident of Wayne county that did not attend COW. i.e. There are some townies trying to get into our Phi Sigma Alpha party!  or There is a townie that is dating a freshman."  I also had frat brothers from Rittman and Orville and home cookin' came in handy on peppersteak night at Lowry!!

On the game, looking at Wooster you would have to think the biggest weakness would be against bigger, taller teams.  Wooster has basically neutralize the nation's best big team.  We are perhaps athletic enough to runa nd gun with anyone.  EVevn if there is a loss in the NCAC tourney this team could be poised for run in the post season.  Witucky not scoring, Port not health or in sync and Wooster still comes away with a win on the road.  I cannot imgaine a game where all the shooters will be off and they still can take it to basket (port and johnson).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 06, 2006, 09:54:13 AM
Another note on townies and I will promise to let this rest.  I never thought that it was a derogatory term just a identifier.  "I am from Wooster and you are a townie" or "He is from Wooster and I am from Cincinnati going to Wooster".  I'd much rather say the former!

Also, one of best friends and frat brother named his first band after graduation: The Townies. The band had two Wooster grads and they put out three CDs in the 90s.

Does the band still play the "Are You from Wooster?" song?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 06, 2006, 10:17:48 AM
The difference between my days at school and the way things are now is that we occasionally got trashed after the games but never before or during.  Clearly, that's why you see lots of the behaviour that exists today, and it's infested many schools, not just Wittenberg.

Among the worst are Allegheny students at their home baseball games.  A large group of them stand down the right-field line, right at the fence, stocked up with coolers of beer.  If they're not ripped upon arrival, they certainly are by the end of the first contest, and remember that they play doubleheaders.  They spend the whole few hours hurling every kind of epithet imaginable at the opposing right fielder.  The last time I was up there (three years ago, I think) they also took over the area behind home plate and yelled at the Wooster catcher for five hours, mentioning, among other things, his sexual orientation and heritage.  Real classy.

The sad thing is that this is a trend that is going in the wrong direction.  It didn't exist long ago, but has come upon us mostly through kids imitating the crass behaviour of athletes on tv.  Not DIII athletes, but mostly the pros, those clowns who generally serve as the worst available role models.  I'm afraid I don't see this getting any better in the near future.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 06, 2006, 11:25:22 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 05, 2006, 04:50:14 PM
Quote from: WoosterBNel on February 05, 2006, 02:15:02 PM

PS. Live by the 3, Die by the 3

Actually, Wooster is the #1 three point shooting team in D3 through 2/4 games.  ;D

Wooster has made 225 of 504 three pointers for a terrific 44.6%.

What makes this stat so impressive is Wooster's depth in 3 point shooting.  The Scots have 6 guys (including 4 of their starters) who have made 20 or more three pointers each this year.  4 of the 6 shooters (Cooper, Port, Witucky, Fulk) have each made 35 or more three pointers this year.  Van Horn and Johnson are the 5th and 6th players each with more than 20 made.

It is very hard for an opponent to defend the three point shot when Wooster usually has 3 or 4 players on the floor at any time who can hit the shot.  Moreover, the Scots are so unselfish that they swing the ball to whoever is open for the best shot.


Quote from: WoosterFAN on February 06, 2006, 09:40:11 AM
Witucky not scoring, Port not health or in sync and Wooster still comes away with a win on the road. I cannot imgaine a game where all the shooters will be off and they still can take it to basket (port and johnson).


I think wooscotsfan and WoosterFAN touched on something very key regarding this Wooster team.  It is their depth with guys that can light it up from the outside.  To have 4 guys in your starting lineup to have hit 20 or more 3's on the season goes a long way in spreading out opposing teams defenses.  And to have 6 total players with 20 or more 3's, it's rare that there aren't at least 3 players on the court at the same time who can dial it up from long distance. 

Another key stat that wooscotsfan pointed out is the percentage of 44.6% that the Scots are hitting from beyond the arc.  That is nearly a full percentage point better than the record season percentage at Wooster  of 43.7% set back in 89-90.  And they are hitting at this unbelievable percentage while they are on their way to breaking the record for 3 pointers made in a season which is 245 in 02-03.  Incedentally, that year Wooster also set the record for attempts at 610.  That number will certainly fall as well, but Wooster will have been far more efficient than they were 2 years ago.

Lastly, a lot has been made about how uncanny it was that the Scots came out scorching hot (and that might be an understatement) last Saturday.  I'm sure that we're not likely to see a performance quite that good again, but with the number of good shooters that Wooster has on this team, I'll echo WoosterFAN's sentiments in that we're also not likely to see all of them be ice cold at the same time either.  And also WoosterFAN, you mentioned that Port and Johnson have the ability to take it to the basket when their shot might not be falling from the outside.  I think you forgot someone else who has that ability in James Cooper.   I'd say it's pretty safe to include him in that category as well. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2006, 12:19:03 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 06, 2006, 01:13:49 AM
On the Witt Students' "F U Wooster" chant: Scotsbrod, I thank you for trying to give Witt students the benefit of the doubt, but that was indeed the chant.  As a Wittenberg student (and a very active member in the athletic department), I was embarassed.  Not only because of what was heard in the arena, but the fact that so many people were chanting it, it actually was able to be heard (from what I've been told) in the background of our radio broadcast (was it audible in the Wooster/D3 broadcasts as well?). 

I listend to both the Wooster (live) and D3hoops (archived) broadcasts, and I did not hear this chant (lucky for me.)  I did hear the "we can't hear you" chant which came from the Wooster fans.  If I remember the configuration of the HPER center, the Wooster fans would have been yelling towards the broadcasters (but from across the gym), while the Witt students were below the broadcasters and yelling away from them.  That might account for why I didn't hear it.  It also might be my bad hearing... :D

Outstanding post, jscwittfan.  Thank you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Warren Thompson on February 06, 2006, 12:31:09 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 05, 2006, 09:13:43 PM
Warren, do the students at LebVal not invent ways to feel superior? 

Of course they do (stunted development isn't limited to certain NCAC institutions).
And one wishes they would always be as inventive in class.  :'(


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 06, 2006, 12:31:58 PM
Wooster's three-point numbers are as follows:


Kalamazoo                 11-30
Stout                     17-36
Methodist                  9-29
Emory and Henry            1- 3
Denison                   15-32
Earlham                    5- 9
Oberlin                   13-29
Wittenberg                11-27
Westminster               12-24
BW                        11-30
Thiel                     20-37
New Jersey                 6-17
Washington and Jefferson  13-25
Allegheny                 15-34
Wabash                     9-21
Hiram                      9-24
OWU                       10-18
Kenyon                     3-15
Earlham                    8-14
Allegheny                 15-27
Wittenberg                12-23


While they've had only one outing that I'd call poor from behind the line (Kenyon at 3-15), there are certainly a few others that, if they came against top-notch opponents, would put them in a difficult position to win the game.

They've shot over .500 from behind the line in 7 of their 21 games.  Their average mark is 10.7 for 24.  Their totals in the two games against Wittenberg are 23-50 or 11.5-25 per game, which is .460, only slightly higher than their season average of .446.

This only indicates to me that, very probably, game three will be more of the same, a very tight and competitive game.  Should Wooster falter from behind the arc, they might be in trouble.  But their numbers show that it's unlikely they'd fall very far, and even at 40% against Wittenberg, that might be enough to do the trick, as in game 1 they were only 11-27.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 06, 2006, 01:27:32 PM
I think that one of the interesting things this points out is that the percentage has been trending up throughout the season and is currently at its highest.  While I'm not saying that Wooster won't have an off night the rest of the season, I think that it would be a huge mistake for any team to pin their hopes on the Scots being cold from long range.  Four of the last 5 games have been over 50% (56%, 57%, 56%, and 52%)!  I'm not a big stats junkie, but those seem like pretty remarkable numbers when you're putting up over 20 attempts per game.

For the most part, when the Scots haven't hit from outside they have been able to get scoring inside from Vandervaart, Will, and as mentioned earlier from Port, Johnson, and Cooper.  It looks like what it takes is for the Scots to be cold from long range, and for the opponent to have a dominating inside game.  Can you say Baldwin-Wallace? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 06, 2006, 01:58:43 PM
Quote from: Warren Thompson on February 05, 2006, 07:35:44 PM
Never underestimate an undergraduate's ability to act like the south end of a northbound horse.    :(

How did you think we pass our classes?   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 06, 2006, 02:04:19 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 06, 2006, 01:13:49 AM
Figured I'd address some of the issues that have been brought up.

I know DC already said this, but thanks for an excellent post about the game/side issues, jscwittfan.  If I could award karma, I would have given you a point.

Also, good point that Witt is still 19-2, and has only lost to one opponent (albeit twice) all season.  That's a great year in the making, and I expect that Wooster and the Great Lakes region isn't done hearing about Witt yet this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 06, 2006, 02:10:44 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on February 06, 2006, 09:54:13 AM
Does the band still play the "Are You from Wooster?" song?

But of course!   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on February 06, 2006, 03:01:27 PM
As a Witt fan, that was the most frustrating game I have ever watched. It was a classic game of Wooster's backcourt vs. Wittenberg's frontcourt. As jscwittfan stated earlier they were simply trading 3s for 2s in the first half and that was the difference as they tied the 2nd half. I do give credit to Wooster for not letting Witt pull closer than 5 points for the entire 2nd half.

My question: Why in the world isn't the ball going inside to Russ or Borchers EVERY single possession before anyone even THINKS about shooting?? (except maybe Kenny Brady) If they kick it out after being doubled for a 3, great, but the ball NEEDS to start inside! There were a couple VERY questionable shots at crucial times in the 2nd half by underclassmen. Those younger kids need to realize how powerful and downright unstoppable their post game is...

As far as defending Wooster's 3s... the on ball screens and penetrate and kick really hurt the Witt guards in the 1st half. Too many times the guards over committed on Wooster penetration giving up wide open looks, which resulted in the 9 for 12 shooting from the arc in the first half. I give Wooster credit for making the shots but more often than not there was little to no shot contest on many of those 3 attempts.

The on ball screens were caused a confusion as well. All same size ball screen should be switched. The big-on-small screens... the smalls needed to work hard to get over the top of the screen, thus forcing the ball handler farther away from the basket, while the big hedges with a hand in the shooter's face until his teammate recovers. Yes, easier said than done and I'm SURE this wasn't from a lack of a defensive game plan from Coach Brown but more of a lack of execution on game night.

All just game night observations, would love to see game film on that one...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 06, 2006, 03:49:09 PM
Jimmy:
I can agree with you more about getting it to the guys who can shoot the damn ball.
Russ: .569   Boarchers  .653  and his free throws approach JJ numbers.

Same with Denison:
Hodkinson .603 and Hern .479

Give the ball to the guys who are the best shooters on the team.  Instead we have Krantz a freshman taking 18 shots and he is at a hard .368.  WHAT IS THAT??

I blame the coachs.  Your twin towers should be the first and second and third option with every time the court.  Who is going to stop them?

Same with Denison.  Instead they have guys that maybe shoot it in the low 400's on a good night. 

Obviously you have to have some kind of inside outside game.  But when you need to have a basket.  Who is your best chance?  I would think it is the guys who shot it best.

Very confusing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 06, 2006, 04:26:26 PM
Of course, though, with Denison, the issue is that everyone knows who option #1 and #2. Wabash went zone to stop them, and that's why Krantz HAS to shoot.

So, instead of forcing the ball inside, and causing turnovers, why not then move the ball around for the open look. Hern had six turnovers because he was trying to force it in when Hodgkinson was doubled by Zimmer and Lytle (see my post a while back on the game). Hodgkinson only had four shots in the first half because he never had a chance to get the ball thanks to the D. Gognat had four turnovers trying to force it inside in the first half.

I'm sure that's not a rare game plan, either, by Big Red opponents.

I don't recall Krantz being a total ball hog tail gunner. I typed in every shot and never said "man, he's shooting a lot". He took four long ones late as they were shooting the three balls then. Other than that he took shots after 15, 20 seconds of a posession, maybe more, because nothing was happening inside. The offense seemed stagnant and some of the players weren't working to get open and away from the double teams.

So it's not coaching, it's execution - though it may be coaching if he can't motivate some kids to play defense and not worry about their points and stats.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 06, 2006, 04:55:34 PM
Smed:
I agree with you.  If the guys are not executing the offense there is nothing any coach can do.

So shouldn't the coach call a time out and ride herd on his team to run the offense and get open??

Instead just do nothing and let the team go down the tubes.

What does points and stats have to do with anything.  The best shooters should shot the ball the most in any game.  So it is your contention that any team should just give it to freshman to shot it 18 times a game??  Come on.

If the team isn't doing what the coach wants them to do.  Sit em down.  But at Hodgkinson at 37 minutes and Hern at 35.  Ghiloni couldn't have been to upset.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 06, 2006, 06:45:53 PM
Two more computer simulations:

Wooster 73, Lawrence 70.  Played on a neutral court.  Wooster, trailing 40-32 at the half, came back to win a thriller.

http://arkski.com/~jwood/Wooster-Lawrence.jpg

Wooster 121, BW 112.  Played in Wooster.  BW didn't relinquish the lead until late in the second half.  Torii Davis went for 40, but in the end the Scots three-point shooting prevailed.

http://arkski.com/~jwood/BW-Wooster.jpg
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 06, 2006, 07:09:49 PM
Wooster and B-W played in reality already. What do we learn in a simulation?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 06, 2006, 07:55:36 PM
Well, if the simulation engine is accurate, and you could run off multiple replays, you'd be able to see if the actual game result was a fluke or not.  :) Given only one replay of the game, and with a simulation that is good but suspect in some (such as it doesn't deal with individual defense except in the area of steals and blocks) areas, it's basically just for fun.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TheRed on February 06, 2006, 08:28:15 PM
DF,

You are an idiot.  You have no idea what you are talking about and I think I speak for most when saying that we are sick of hearing your ridiculious comments about the games.

"If the team isn't doing what the coach wants them to do.  Sit em down."

In that case, Hern and Hodge would never play because their defense has been very questionable all year.  You have even said that yourself.  You contradict yourself all the time and I'm tired of hearing it.  Next you are gonna say "well somebody has to score some points and that is why those two should play."  If thats the case, then you shouldn't have said the comment above. 

This is a team game and no the two best shooters don't have to shoot the ball the most every game and I feel that the explanation for most people on here would be pretty obvious, but for you I'll go ahead and explain.  Since they are the best two shooters most teams will plan their defensive scheme around them and take them away as it sounds Wabash tried to do.  Therefore, at some point other guys are going to have to step up and make some shots if the team is going to be succesful.  If not, the two are going to end up forcing some bad shots and turning the ball over more than normal.  I'm not saying  Krantz should have shot 18 times, but I do like that he wasn't afraid to step up and take the shots he was given.  You must take what the defense gives you and some nights that may mean Krantz and Izzo take 15 shots while Hern and Hodge take 8.  It all depends on the situtation and that seems to be something you don't understand.  Things aren't the same every single game like you want them to be.  If Denison got beat by Witt by 35 and played 12 guys you would blame Ghiloni for playing too many people when it really had nothing to do with it.  Just please get a clue.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 06, 2006, 08:28:43 PM
Boy-o-boy!  The voters were purely brutal on Witt this week.  We all knew they weren't gonna be on top but to slide all the way to 6th I thought was kinda harsh.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 06, 2006, 09:08:35 PM
I created Earlham on a video-game  NCAA 2003 one year and didn't lose a game?  WoosterBooster Does that count for anything???   I believe I beat Duke in the Championship... I was the MVP.  (sadly i'm being serious) but just trying to throw some humor out here.

On the other hand this week is HUGE for Earlham.  They play Wabash on Wed. and OWU on Saturday.  I'd love to see them win both, but I'd take 1 out of 2.  On the other hand... how about OBERLIN with the first WIN of the season... nice to see them Drop the Goose Egg at the hands of HIRAM in a TRIPLE-O.T. game.  That was most likely the best/worst game of all time. :)   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 06, 2006, 09:18:49 PM
I am also sorry to see Witt slide down to 6th but I can understand the logic of the Top 25 voters.

There are very few games between Top 25 teams during the course of the year.  Witt won't play #2 Lawrence, #3 Augustana, #4 Hope or #5 Baldwin-Wallace unless the Tigers meet those teams in the NCAA tourney.

Since the voters have very few head to head game results, they place a significant weight on the number of losses by each Top 25 team.  The additional factors that voters seem to consider are the strength of the conferences (WIAC, CCIW, MIAA, OAC teams, etc. rank higher with multiple losses than teams from other conferences), the strength of each team's schedule and the quality of their losses.

It is important to note that Witt is now the 2nd highest ranked team in the nation with 2 losses.  The only higher ranked team than Witt with 2 losses is #5 Baldwin-Wallace.....and the Yellow Jackets beat Wooster (which Witt hasn't done) and BW also plays in a deeper (stronger) OAC conference (than the NCAC).

So upon reflection, I think that Witt's ranking at #6 is understandable...even if NCAC fans, like me, would prefer to see them at #3, #4 or #5.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 06, 2006, 09:54:47 PM
I don't think Witt would of fell down so far if it was on the ROAD.  (don't forget guys/gals they were the HOME-team) It did sound like Wooster was in control the entire game.     
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 06, 2006, 09:57:52 PM
Congrats to James Cooper on being named NCAC Player of the Week (again).  :)

Cooper had 25 points vs Allegheny and 24 vs. Witt.  James shot 17 of 24 from the field in 2 games (70.8%!!) including 7 of 9 three pointers made!  He was also 8 of 10 combined on free throws.

One other note -- a very nice photo on the D3 home page today that shows Andy Van Horn giving up some skin as he dives in an attempt to knock the ball away from a Wittenberg player.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2006, 10:01:14 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 06, 2006, 09:18:49 PM
There are very few games between Top 25 teams during the course of the year.  Witt won't play #2 Lawrence, #3 Augustana, #4 Hope or #5 Baldwin-Wallace unless the Tigers meet those teams in the NCAA tourney.

...and the way the NCAA does things, those could be Witt's first four opponents in the tournament!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 06, 2006, 10:12:42 PM
now i know you guys have awaited my responses to the game saturday. very frustrating game to watch for witt fans as it felt like we were never in control (we weren't). several times we would be in position to cut the deficit to one possession and a tacky foul call or stupid freshmen shot from 3 5 seconds into the shot clock would arise. one time jack hemingway, who was having a good game, was taken out of the game with two poor foul calls within 30 seconds-looked like he was brandon miller with those calls. witt had no answer for the 3 barrage from wooster all night.

one observation. nothing was going witt's way at all in the game except the low post game and yet we still moderately were in the game until the very end. it's unlikely wooste can have another game where everything goes their way and plus for some odd reason witt plays better up at wooster so that holds a glimmer of hope.

witt dropping to 6th is disappointing, but in the grand scheme of things doesnt carry much weight as the selection committee doesnt seem to care about rankings anyways as proven in years past.

finally, i was embarassed of the cheer of our students during the game. i sat on the railing behind our bench because i was forced to move because i was in a restricted area, even though it wasnt marked like everywhere else that was restricted (another case of bull****). i cringed when i heard that cheer and was disappointed in the fans overall. the creativity of cheers lacked i thought. the townie sign from our fans was stupid and the person who created it isnt from springfield and is part of a not so intelligent group of people so dont buy in to that too much.

p.s.-no more denison talk about how many people they play, once and for all no one really cares
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scottiedawg on February 06, 2006, 10:55:19 PM
I don't want to sound like I'm whining, but could someone explain Augustana moving from 5th to 3rd?  They beat unranked Carthage and North Park by small margins, while Hope beat 6th ranked Albion (at Home) and stayed at 4th.  I did think think Wittenberg would stay ahead of Hope, but I had no idea Hope would get passed.  Any explanations. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2006, 11:01:29 PM
Scottiedawg, there is a room devoted to discussion of the top 25 in the "multi-regional topics" room.  Since your question doesn't directly involve any NCAC teams, most of the denizens of this room won't be willing or able to answer it.  I suggest you take up your question in the top 25 room, where lots of folks may be eager to discuss it.  Here's a link to that room==> Top 25 Talk (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4097.new#new)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 06, 2006, 11:07:16 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 06, 2006, 09:57:52 PM
One other note -- a very nice photo on the D3 home page today that shows Andy Van Horn giving up some skin as he dives in an attempt to knock the ball away from a Wittenberg player.  :)

Not to mention fouling the Witt player!!   :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 06, 2006, 11:07:25 PM
Quotep.s.-no more denison talk about how many people they play, once and for all no one really cares

Once and for ALL, this is an NCAC board, and yes people do care about Denison. That provincial attitude has to go. I would LOVE to have discussions about all 10 teams in the board, not just the front runners. So stuff that attitude in a sack, and let's talk about them ALL.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 06, 2006, 11:54:16 PM
You're both right....we need talk about all 10 teams in here.  It makes for a better board.  We need to get off the topic of Denison's rotation, specifically as it pertains to the use of Hodgkinson and Hern.  There's not a speck of dirt left in that rug. 

The reality is that in 21 games, there isn't one real surprising result on Denison's schedule.  The only two that approach surprising are the loss to Marietta and the win at Earlham...and those esentially cancel each other out.  Why does Denison win the games they win and lose the games they lose?  It has nary a thing to do with how Ghiloni uses the H's.  It has everything to do with quality of Denison's opponent.  Put simply, Denison has to get better by quite a bit before it makes much sense to nitpick at the coach's strategy as a reason why Denison loses to OWU and Wabash and Witt and Wooster. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on February 07, 2006, 12:06:09 AM
WHAT IF.... Hiram came into Wooster and upset the number 1 team in the land?  We have nothing to lose and whatever statements are placed on here will be in the locker room! Just a question the games have been close as of late.  WHAT IF....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2006, 12:16:46 AM
That would be incredible. Far-fetched, but incredible.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 07, 2006, 12:17:08 AM
IF I had a dime for every time someone used the word IF and IF I could find someone to give me that dime i'd be RICH!  Don't you have books to read, papers to write and test to study for? IF you don't mind me asking
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on February 07, 2006, 12:20:30 AM
This is the word of choice used for all of you on here, because we do not feel threatened by Wooster.  As much as you may think we don't, we match up well with them and that is why the games have been so close.  Oh yeah the paper is done, as well as the studyin!
Peace, Lboogz15
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 07, 2006, 12:24:19 AM
Quote from: Lboogz15 on February 07, 2006, 12:06:09 AM
WHAT IF.... Hiram came into Wooster and upset the number 1 team in the land?  We have nothing to lose and whatever statements are placed on here will be in the locker room! Just a question the games have been close as of late.  WHAT IF....

I will sell all my posessions and move to higher ground, for armageddon is upon us.

Hiram lost to Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2006, 12:28:05 AM
Hiram beating Wooster in Timken would probably be THE story of the regular season.  It would make North Dakota State beating Wisconsin seem ordinary.  Yet somehow, I don't think Pat is losing any sleep coming up with catchy headlines for such a story.  

It ain't happening.  

Quote from: sac on February 07, 2006, 12:24:19 AM

I will sell all my posessions and move to higher ground, for armageddon is upon us.

Hiram lost to Oberlin.

Perhaps they were looking ahead to the Scots?   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2006, 12:28:49 AM
Quote from: Lboogz15 on February 07, 2006, 12:20:30 AM
[...]we do not feel threatened by Wooster.  As much as you may think we don't, we match up well with them and that is why the games have been so close.
Quote from: sac on February 07, 2006, 12:24:19 AM
I will sell all my posessions and move to higher ground, for armageddon is upon us.

Hiram lost to Oberlin.

Maybe they didn't match up well with Oberlin.   ::)

Will being on the high ground help us at armageddon?  What do you know that we don't, sac?  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 07, 2006, 12:32:34 AM
Quote

Quote from: sac on Today at 12:24:19 AM

I will sell all my posessions and move to higher ground, for armageddon is upon us.

Hiram lost to Oberlin.


I almost did this after Saturday's Kenyon/Earlham game in Richmond. I think I may have seen a well-officiated NCAC game.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 07, 2006, 12:33:39 AM
Armageddon brings about irrational think DC, yeah I guess I've gotta rethink that one...........shoot there go my plans.  To think I wasted all that money on land in Idaho.

Did you know Idaho is shaped the way it is because the governors of Washington, Oregon, Utah, Wyoming and Montana didn't want any of the land.  True story.


Here's another tid bit of info.......Wooster is 113-11 over the past 4 years including this one.  FIVE of those 11 losses are to Wittenberg.  3 others came in the NCAA tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 07, 2006, 12:34:31 AM
I'd donate money to Hiram for them to get a new gym if you guys beat Wooster...  Heck I'll drive to Hiram and personally deliver it myself.   ::)   I'm not trying to pick on Hiram, but if you can't get by Oberlin  ;D I don't think you have a chance in this WORLD to beat Wooster.  By the way
QuoteHiram came into Wooster and upset the number 1 team in the land?  We have nothing to lose
 yeah you do they call it another loss, but it will look better than the one  last Saturday.[/color]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on February 07, 2006, 12:36:18 AM
Armagedon was a h#ll of a quote it was funny! However I'm lovin what i'm seein.  I hope you have your tickets! It isn't a Wooster vs. Witt. just history in making!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on February 07, 2006, 12:44:07 AM
The game before Wooster last time, 41 points were scored.  This past game we lost to the worst team in the land.  What does that make us?  If we are the worst why not come and witness the two extremes that we claim.  I'm lovin this!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on February 07, 2006, 01:32:57 AM
I think its unfair that we mention armagedon. Hiram fans are all awaiting the moment when the Wooster Scots basketball team runs out of LUCK against the Terriers!  It's amazing to me, that one of the lower teams in the country has battled Wooster until the last two minutes of the last two minutes of the last two meetings of these two teams.  It seems to me, that Wooster has been very fortunate that the Terriers have not exposed them on a country wide grand stand!  One question that perplexes most Hiram fans: What does it take to be considered the #1 TEAM IN THE COUNTRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!     PLEASE come to the game! Port is back and so is Pfouts! This doggies not just barkin! Feel me!   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 07, 2006, 02:18:19 AM
Quote from: WooMix on February 06, 2006, 08:28:43 PM
Boy-o-boy!  The voters were purely brutal on Witt this week.  We all knew they weren't gonna be on top but to slide all the way to 6th I thought was kinda harsh.

I think two shots at Wooster and two losses meant voters felt they had to be below Baldwin-Wallace because of the common opponent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 07, 2006, 09:12:56 AM
come on we are talking about hiram remember.....if witt cant beat wooster at home while not catching any breaks what makes you think hiram is going to have everything go their way in front of the timken crowd. sorry hiram doesnt have the experience such as a witt to go in front of that hostile and revengeful crowd to win
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: big red rooter on February 07, 2006, 09:29:57 AM
This week is potentially very big for the Denison Big Red. I hope Ghiloni is on top of his game. Hopefully he lets his offensive coordinators call the plays this week. That way he can stand and yell about moving and screenig and just yelling in general. The finish for Denison is important because this is a freshman class that needs to take the next step. They are not your typical Denison kids.

The only reason I got a username and password is because I saw an earlier post about some of the Denison assts. I know that they are young and don't have a lot of experience in coaching at the college level, but I have never met a more prepared staff than the one in Granville. I understand that they can be a bit rogue, especially that short balding one, but they are knowledgeable and smart about the game.

An aside, I know Mike Rodich, there is not a more dedicated individual to the school than him. I know that he can be very negative, but there are some people who are just that way. It is part of his personality and I hope he never changes. I for one see him as Ghilonis possible successor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 07, 2006, 09:31:25 AM
Oh I get it now....it is OK to bitch about Witt guys not getting he ball.  Or Wooster without Port and all the other crap you guys write.

But I throw my 2 cents in about what I think about my team and everyone jumps all over my s@#T.  Excuse me..........I did think this was for all teams in the NCAC.

It is my opinion guys.  THAT IS IT!!!

So let's everyone relax, take a deep breath and count to 10.

I agree that Denison is not one of the top teams in the conference.  But that doesn't mean I can not voice an opinion on why I think that.  Big f-ing deal. 

Like Ghiloni is going to do anything differently because I said something on D3Hoops.  You guys are amazing.

I guess I might as well support Wooster.  They seem to do no wrong.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2006, 09:44:02 AM
D Fan - I got your back. We can disagree about Denison but we should talk about them. Some misguided fool ran his yap - that's all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2006, 09:44:48 AM
Quotecome on we are talking about hiram remember.....if witt cant beat wooster at home while not catching any breaks what makes you think hiram is going to have everything go their way in front of the timken crowd. sorry hiram doesnt have the experience such as a witt to go in front of that hostile and revengeful crowd to win

I think someone missed the boat...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 07, 2006, 09:50:54 AM
I agree with DF - We complain every off-season that we need more school represented.  I, for one, would like to see Oberlin chime in with some Hiaku trash talk!!

Denison Fan - Keep your Big Red talk coming.  I enjoy your perspective and I respect that you have high expectations for your team and its coaches.

And back in the day, Denison did have the best looking girls in the NCAC!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on February 07, 2006, 09:54:00 AM
Booger15, you might be able to stick quite a few quotes up in your locker room, but have you thought about the fact that you are you basically pouring gasoline onto the WOO fire. It's easy to play terrible at Hiram since the gym was built in the 1900's and has girl blue all the way around. It used to be possible that Woo could possibly overlook the lowly Terriers this week but with all the garbage that you have posted, not much of a chance now. If I had to guess I would say that you will be busy this game taking the stats and filling water bottles. Good luck
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 07, 2006, 09:57:12 AM
On another note, Kyle Witucky is falling behind in Bob Cousy Award tallies.  Remember, he has as many final fours as Dee Brown and is a senior four year starter with a 3.6 GPA!!

Please do not hold it against him that he is going to be a lawyer!!

You can vote only once per day!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on February 07, 2006, 10:05:25 AM
big red rooter -  I'm a little surprised by your comment about Coach Rodich at Denison being somewhat negative, although I've seen that posted here before.  Actually, from what I've heard he has been one of the more positive coaches along with Whiteman.  Foe better or worse they seem to be the coaches with the best relationship with the kids.  They need to hold on to those two, but it appears they are becoming somewhat frustrated in their roles.  Here's hoping they stick around.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 07, 2006, 10:10:05 AM
Thank you!!

You won't shut me up that easily.

I just want everyone to know.  I am a HUGE Big Red Fan and have suffered for years.  I think we finally have some talent and can compete.  We didn't beat Witt last year because Witt didn't show up.

Earlham is a very good team. 

If we don't go down 19-2 against Wabash we may have taken them out.

I just think Ghiloni plays guys he shouldn't in critical situations.
Against Wabash he plays Krantz 26 minutes when the kid with the hot hand was Eberst.  Eberst hits his second three and Ghiloni pulls him out.  HELLO!! 

It is crap like that that drives me nuts.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 07, 2006, 10:12:52 AM
For those unfamiliar lets break down the Hiram/Wooster matchup just a little bit:

Wooster is #1 in the country at 20-1 scoring 101.0 ppg and holding oppenents to 78.7 ppg.  Previous game 1/18 at Hiram was a SCOTS win 102-91.  Terriers scored 20 point over their average!! The Terriers are 0-fer away from home.
Hiram has not won this year (last win 12/28) and recently allowed 120 @ OWU and 102 @ OBERLIN.

But TC Spencer was a NCAC Player of the week and is 3rd in the NCAC in FG% and AJ White is 4th in the NCAC in APG and 2nd in 3FG per game.

And of course this is the revenge game as it was the Hiram game where Port got hurt and only played 13 minutes.

All of that said, if the Terriers were to pull an upset, you think it would get a mention on FoxSportsOHIO?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 07, 2006, 10:32:50 AM
Denison Fan - I have been looking closer at Denison and I think you should be encouraged.  First of all you give your coach a hard time (I love the passion).  But he was NCAC coach of the year last year right?
  Also, you guys have won just about every game you should have won and won @ Earlham, no easy task.  You had won 5 in row and I think you will win out for the rest of the year and maybe sneak into the #4 spot.  I know the loss at Wabash was tough but man, you guys are getting there.
    Your coach may have a funky rotation of nine guys but you only lose one senior of those nine and return your leading scorer and 2nd leading rebounder.  So I think your future is bright.  You will definitely challenge OWU, WABASH and EARLHAM for a top spot in the NCAC in the future.  WOO and WITT are hard to catch. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2006, 11:26:45 AM
While I think it's great that Witucky has been nominated for the Cousy Award, is there any real logical argument for him to win that award?  Does anybody seriously think that Witucky is a better guard than Dee Brown?  I think we do a great disservice to these awards by simply voting for the D-III guy.  I could go off on a huge rant about how much I despise fan/internet voting for awards, all star games, etc., but I think I'll save it for another time. 

And just so you know that this isn't about me dumping on Wooster, I felt the same way about the Brett Elliott for Heisman campaign during football season.  Great player, not the best in college football...not even close.  Celebrate that your player and team is represented as a finalist, but don't bastardize the award by casting blatantly wrong votes. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 07, 2006, 11:33:34 AM
Quote from: Lboogz15 on February 07, 2006, 01:32:57 AM
Hiram fans are all awaiting the moment when the Wooster Scots basketball team runs out of LUCK against the Terriers!  It's amazing to me, that one of the lower teams in the country has battled Wooster until the last two minutes of the last two minutes of the last two meetings of these two teams.  It seems to me, that Wooster has been very fortunate that the Terriers have not exposed them on a country wide grand stand!  One question that perplexes most Hiram fans: What does it take to be considered the #1 TEAM IN THE COUNTRY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!     PLEASE come to the game! Port is back and so is Pfouts! This doggies not just barkin! Feel me!   

It's amazing to me that you have such a big mouth especially given the fact that you're coming off a loss to previous winless Oberlin?!  You can cover your locker room with bulletin board material and it won't be enough my friend!  You may have played Wooster tough up in the sticks of Hiram, but let me remind you of the scores the last 2 years the Terriers have ventured into Timken:

2004 - Wooster 95-50
2005 - Wooster 97-70

So, in case you have forgotten, you haven't exactly given the Scots a scare when Hiram has visited the friendly confines of Timken.

Quote from: Vanilla24COW on February 07, 2006, 09:54:00 AM
It used to be possible that Woo could possibly overlook the lowly Terriers this week but with all the garbage that you have posted, not much of a chance now. If I had to guess I would say that you will be busy this game taking the stats and filling water bottles. Good luck

Vanilla, this is especially true given the actions of one Mr. Pfouts as the Booger15 so kindly reminded us of his presense.  Let me ask you Mr. Booger, do you not think that the Scots will not be fired up to have you all come in so that they can open up a can of Whoopa$$ on the Terriers?  Because that is exactly what is going to happen.  The difference is, Wooster won't stoop to the levels of thuggery to get their point across like seems to be Hiram's method of choice.  They will just prove it on the court by putting this game out of reach by halftime!

Your posts have been good for one thing though.  You have brought a lot of humor to this forum!!! :D  Maybe you have a future in stand-up!!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2006, 12:40:46 PM
Scots Fan -

Ya think those postings could be humorous? Don't have a cow, man.

DFan -

Wasn't Eberst the one Joseph was torching on D for a while?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2006, 12:49:57 PM
Everyone -

I just updated my power rating almagamation thang, and here they are for the NCAC:

3. Wooster
4. Wittenberg
86. Ohio Wesleyan
123. Wabash
153. Earlham
183. Denison
261. Allegheny
320. Kenyon
371. Hiram
377. Oberlin

There are 395 teams rated.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 07, 2006, 12:58:32 PM
Smedindy -

Massey ranks 396 teams.  Who are you leaving out?  If it's John Carol (add an "r" or "l" where necessary, I can't remember how they spell it and refuse to look it up), I've got your back.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bigkrapper on February 07, 2006, 01:02:42 PM
For Wooster's sake I hope Hiram brings a lot of fans.  I can't totally speak for Vanilla24COW but as a former player it was always fun to have a decent crowd for weekday games so when we sat the last 15 minutes of a blowout we had people to look at, I am only kidding.   :) The reason the games at Hiram were always close is not only was the gym not the best facility in the conference as Vanilla24COW mentioned but I was always tired just getting from the locker room on the other side of the field house all the way to the gym.  That was a long jog,  :D.  Those were some great times hustling through the cold field house, ;) down the long hall way, and into the gym.   :D  

OK I am just in one of those moods, in all seriousness, CONGRATS to the SCOTS on a great weekend and looking forward to a trip to Wooster the 24th and 25th of February!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2006, 01:04:13 PM
Chowan, CSU East Bay and Menlo are listed by Massey as D-3.

I add in Green Mountain and Minnesota Morris.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on February 07, 2006, 04:03:21 PM
If I had to guess I would say that you will be busy this game taking the stats and filling water bottles. Good luck -VanillaCow

Actually to answer that question for you, I have been known to put a hell of a care package together with water and towels.  ;)  Although it has not been by choice, when you get hurt you make lemonade outta lemons right! 

I've also heard about alot of compaining about our facilities, and the trip to the boon docks d@mn it i know they're bad you don't have to remind me!lol!  But guess what the trip goes both ways, last I checked you didn't exactly live in New York City!   ;D

However, last year if you were present at the game, you would know that the lead was down to 7 points with 8 minutes to go until Yes they did pull away.    Keep the feedback coming, ya'll are very entertaining as well!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on February 07, 2006, 04:24:32 PM
That's pretty ironic that Wooster fans are ragging on Hiram for poor facilities.  Outside of Timken Gym, which is a pretty sweet basketball court, what good is the Armington PEC?  Everything is out of date and there's no room to do anything.  I mean it's awesome trying to shoot hoops around yoga people and try to find somewhere to lift among the grunts in the weight room.  Facilities have nothing to do with a game, unless the rims are crooked and floor boards are sticking up, which I don't believe is the case. 

I'm pretty sure Wooster just didn't play well in the second half, but having not seen the game, this is just my honest opinon.  I doubt it's going to reoccur in Timken tomorrow night.  As a matter of fact, I'd put the spread somewhere in the 30s, as long as the Scots can contain T.C. Spencer and his myriad of post moves (that's sarcasm in case you couldn't tell).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on February 07, 2006, 04:46:17 PM
No question that the PEC is outdated, but it doesn't have the appearance of an airplane hangar and you also don't have to run a marathon to get back and forth from the locker room to the gym. The best part of that jaunt is the nets that are up right outside the locker room, I have seen a body or two get stuck in that thing, would hate to see one of Woo's shooters get a hand caught in that net coming from or going to the locker room
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 07, 2006, 04:56:25 PM
Even though some of us might not agree with the methods used by a particular coach, I think it is always nice to address them (the coaches) respectfully.  I think its classy to be respectful and then offer an alternative view to what you think might be improved or implemented to better the team.  I have noticed that (some) Denison fan(s) tend to address their coach as Ghiloni.  Would it really hurt to say "Coach Ghiloni" ...?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 07, 2006, 05:04:04 PM
Holy Cow that is a long walk. (can't believe I forgot about that)  I tore my ACL my soph. year and I think I opted to stay out on the court, during half-time... didn't have the energy to make it to the locker-room.  I wish I was only kidding.  The good news Earlham only has to travel their twice in a 4 year career.  The bus parked in the parking lot was closer then the locker-rooms.  ??? hmmm...  just had an idea.  What are the Vegas odds on this game.  1-1000

I say Wooster wins by 36 points. (i feel like that is being nice)

I would address Coach Justus as either Coach J or Doc J, since he did give up is career as an E.R. Doctor to become a D3 coach at Earlham (I'd hate to see the difference in Paychecks)... that speaks volumes for the type of man he is and the passion he has for the game.  Also not saying there is anything wrong with being a stand up comedian... (earlier post of Allegheny's coach)  :)  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 07, 2006, 05:19:52 PM
Now why would a man with that surname choose either a career in medicine or coaching when his obvious path should have been into law?  He could have eventually ended up on the bench as Judge Justus.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 07, 2006, 06:11:09 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 07, 2006, 12:40:46 PM
Scots Fan -

Ya think those postings could be humorous? Don't have a cow, man.


I'm assuming there was no pun intended smeds??? ;)

Also, where would I be if I didn't have your criticism after seemingly every one of my posts?  I just don't know what I would do with myself?!  I seem to recall a mentioning of how the boogeyman did bring some humor into this forum.  Oh well, I guess this will warrant some more criticism from the high and mighty smedindy.  I'll be looking forward to it. :-*
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 07, 2006, 06:28:37 PM
There's a link on the Woosters Men's page to a featured article on Tim Vandervaart.  Its about the progress he has made from a high school player with limited experience due to a serious injury to his current play at Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on February 07, 2006, 07:10:39 PM
36 pt spread with 1-1000 odds!  Any other spreads for this game? ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scotty on February 07, 2006, 07:21:19 PM
just a thought...why attend Hiram...am i missing something...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on February 07, 2006, 07:47:11 PM
why attend your school?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 07, 2006, 07:51:52 PM
Since mention was made of Hiram, I thought I'd put out my quick impressions of the NCAC towns.  I've never been to Wabash or Earlham, so their towns are not on the list.

1. Granville: I really like this place.  Everything; the shops, the homes, the roads, are all so well kept up.  It's as if someone built a town in the middle of the woods.  Neat restaurants, bakeries, whatever, much more than you would expect in such a small village.  Plus within a shout of Columbus if you feel the need for more.

2. Wooster: I live here, so I'm probably biased, but I'm not sure in which direction.  For a small town, I suppose it's not bad, but I'm not really a a small town guy.  Wooster could sure use some more and better restaurants, and maybe a newspaper that had the courage to speak out.

3. Oberlin: Taking third place in this field is no real accomplishment.  Actually, not a bad little town, and if the many shades of hair on the girls were more natural, it could possibly move up a spot.

4. Delaware: Been there, but only to some baseball games, and haven't seen much of the town.  But this looks like a good place for it.

5. Gambier: Seems to barely exist, but what is there is kind of cute.

6. Hiram: Makes Gambier look like a thriving metropolis.  Who was it, in referring to Oakland, that said "there is no there there?'  He should have seen Hiram, if he could find it.

7. Springfield: Seems to have more bars per square whatever than anywhere I've ever been to except maybe Peoria and definitely Koza, Okinawa.  This might not be a bad thing, except most of them seem too low class to even warrant the description "seedy".

8. Meadville: Gives new meaning to off-the-beaten track.  Robby Benson, in the old basketball movie "One on One", wasn't referring to Meadville when he said "We have all the finer restaurants at home.  Burger King, McDonalds, Taco Bell..."  But he could have been.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 07, 2006, 08:09:38 PM
and Indiana's representatives:

Crawfordsville: It's within an hour of Indy and Lafayette....campus still lacks females, but I've met plenty of Wabash guys who have made their way up to Butler to check out the selection. And aren't rivalries what college is all about? None bigger than Wabash v. DePauw.

Richmond: Really, the finest metropolis in the entire NCAC. Easy access to I-70 and the wonders of SW Ohio. While, an hour to the west, it's the paved streets of gold of Indy. And the improvements that have come to Richmond in the past few years are countless....including East Central Indiana's finest sports bar opened within the last 18 months, Chuck's. I won't comment on the other bars in Richmond, except for saying that they have local flavor. Girls at EC....well, luckily most of us are able to find women from outside the brick buildings of the quaint, yet eye-catching, central campus.

Other highlights of Earlham: the coffee shop where you can order the city's best grilled cheese from Pam, the always friendly manager. Then, there's WECI, the campus radio station that used to have the greatest Saturday midnight-4:00 a.m. show when yours truly used to play a few tunes on it. What else? Well....umm.....my diploma looks nice.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 07, 2006, 08:12:15 PM
and for the record, Meadville and Springfield are much higher on my list.

Springfield solely for Mike and Rosi's.

Meadville had that 500-item (or whatever) Chinese buffet.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scotty on February 07, 2006, 08:13:00 PM
just always wondered about Hiram...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2006, 08:22:33 PM
When I think of Richmond, I think of Tom Raper RVs.  A lovely image to project to the world, or at least every over-the-road trucker and cross-country driver.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 07, 2006, 08:36:56 PM
Just interested in the discussion about Hiram's facilities.  I know they recently renovated their phys. ed. center.  Vanillacow, I know it has been some time since you left Woo, but is Hiram's facility still as bad as it was then?

WooBoo,

Obviously you have never been to Delaware in the summer months.  I used to commute there when I was still in school for a summer job.  While driving west bound on 36, there is a distint odor that rises from the water treatment plant (just south of Shelby Field on 23).  This would definately drop Delaware down on the list.  And let's be honost, Gambier isn't that bad!!  I mean, there is fun in the sun Mount Vernon just down the road...home of Chewing Gum and "Dixie"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 07, 2006, 08:52:18 PM
FYI, from the Scots' website:

Replays of the Wittenberg-Wooster game from this past Saturday night, featuring commentary from Coach Moore, will be broadcast locally on Clear Picture Channel 22 Wednesday and Thursday at 8:30 p.m., Friday at 8 p.m., and Saturday at noon and 3 p.m.

Get those VCR's rollin'. . .

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on February 07, 2006, 08:57:29 PM
I know its not the Wooster vs. Witt matchup, but what can i expect to see and hear from the crowd tomorrow?  

And somebody else posted earlier comments about our brand of ball being thuggery.  What?  You see one foul that may have been warrented and now our brand of ball is thuggery, come on!  

I can't wait to see the environment out there tomorrow.  I hope you scots fans will be in attendance.  If you win you win. But if you lose, you will definitely hear from me on here again. We know calls will not go our way at all, but then again when have they every really.  I just think this game is going to be more suprising then people think.  

Just questions
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2006, 08:58:07 PM
Most NCAC towns/campuses are pretty nice per my experience.  I've not been to Oberlin, Hiram, Gambier, or Allegheny.  All are a far piece away from me in western Indiana and three of the four offer matchups that don't quite justify the trip (I do most of my traveling during football season, but the matchup issue still exists for hoops).  My takes on the towns I've been to (in no particular order of preference)...

Denison - I had a college roommate from Granville, so I've been a few times but not for sporting events (I think that changes when Wabash goes Denison this fall).  Granville is a great little town for all of the reasons already mentioned.  Very quaint...seriously, the place is right out of a book.  

Earlham - I don't know how I've been to Richmond and not left with an RV.  Maybe next time...I'm weakening to the power of the billboard.  Earlham has a nice campus, and a horrible football facility.  They should play all of their games at the high school.

Springfield - Springfield is nice save the whole Wittenberg thing.  I remember going to the BW3 after the 2002 Wabash/Witt OT classic to celebrate and having the bartender look on in disbelief when we told him that Wabash beat Witt.  His response "Wittenberg never loses."  I'm still not sure he think Witt lost that day.  Great wings though.  

Wooster - I'm not a huge fan of Wooster the town, but it's a stone's throw from the greatest attraction in the state of Ohio: Grandpa's Cheese Barn.  That alone is worth any trip to Wooster.  

Delaware - Come for the NCAC action, then head south to Columbus for postgaming.  Too many great spots to go in Columbus on game night to mention here.  OWU's campus also has two of the most interesting facilities I've been to in Selby and Branch Rickey.  Cool places, even if it is a little dark in the gym.  

Crawfordsville - Having spent four years there, it grows on you a bit.  You learn to find your fun in C'ville, even if it takes a couple of years to figure it out.  There are definitely worse places (cough, Greencastle, cough).  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 07, 2006, 09:05:01 PM
Earlham has a new football facility under construction. There is rumor that it may even be complete by next season.

I'll see if I can find blueprints for it online. They were in the most recent alumni magazine and also on display outside of the football offices last weekend.

A new grandstand and press box would go on what is now the visitor's side at M.O. Ross Field. A new locker room facility would be built on the east end of the field. I'll see what I can find.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 07, 2006, 09:30:58 PM
BP,

Are you telling me that half the team wont have to stand outside while the other half dresses?   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 07, 2006, 09:51:07 PM
How can you visit Woo and NOT get a pizza at Coccia House!

DC, I know that will get your thoughts drifting--
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2006, 09:57:49 PM
You know, I love quaint little college towns. I'll take it anyday of the week of some boring blah strip malled suburbia.

Hey Scots Fan - just doing DC's light work. I'll let him take care of the heavy stuff!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 07, 2006, 10:17:52 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 07, 2006, 08:58:07 PM
Wooster - I'm not a huge fan of Wooster the town, but it's a stone's throw from the greatest attraction in the state of Ohio: Grandpa's Cheese Barn.  That alone is worth any trip to Wooster.  

I always see that sign on my way home, and I always want to stop, but never do . . . if not just because that's a great name.  C'mon, who doesn't laugh when you say "Grandpa's Cheese Barn"?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 07, 2006, 10:45:25 PM
Playing both Basketball and Baseball for 4 years I've seen a lot of the campuses on a number of occasions.  Spent the night at (Granville, Delaware, Crawfordsville, Wooster, Oberlin, Hiram, Allegheny)  Here is what I think of the NCAC schools and towns.

Granville- Has a nice little historic town with older houses and businesses.  Never like the wooden bleachers, but rumor has it they updated the gym a little.  Baseball field was pretty nice.  I just like the hills and all the trees.  It looks real nice during the fall and winter months. (2nd hottest locker-rooms in the NCAC)

Springfield- You know the Earlham people love Mike's and Rosie.  I think Springfield/Dayton/Richmond would put up one heck of a fight for the best DIVE Bars in the Region.  I felt like their Baseball field was in the middle of no where. (Is the visiting locker-rooms right next to Wittenberg's locker-rooms????)

Wooster- Might have the best Town support in the NCAC.  I think Wooster and Springfield would be 1 and 2 in Town crowd support.  They have some nice chain restaurants   and I always enjoyed the view of Wooster. (I think I'm a sucker for hills)  Plus that little hill outside the back entrance where people Sled all the time when it snowed made me jealous.  :)

Hiram-  Some of the Hiram posters might help me out here.  They had a Bar/ restaurants that we went to.  You had to go down Steps to get in and had some GOOD PiZZA, With an old school Bowling game (i believe).  Not sure of the damn, but that was a nice little joint.  Other than that i can't remember seeing that the Town had much to offer. (hands down the farthest locker-rooms in the NCAC)

Meadville-  For some odd reason I liked that town. (hands down the Closest Locker-rooms in the NCAC.)  Never saw much of the campus, but I loved the DQ/Gas station near the Hotel we stayed in.

Oberlin-  Not a bad little town.  I actually really liked the campus and the business around the campus.  Doesn't offer a lot, but OBERLIN COLLEGE have been around for a Long-time.  If I'm not wrong they had the First Black Female attend there and Graduate.

Kenyon- We always played them on Wednesday night and they always came to Richmond for a Double-Header during the week.  So I can't say a lot about Kenyon, plus my Opinion about basketball would be out-dated, since they have a whole new facility.  I can say I saw the Worst injury ever at a Kenyon game.  Stoops crossed over a kid at the top of key and his ankle broke in the other direction. (STILL can't get that nasty image out of my head.)

Delaware-  Still my least favorite gym... yes even behind Hiram (Only had to play at Hiram Twice)  I always felt like they built it to be a church and changed it into a GYM.  (Hottest Gym in the NCAC)  I hated those Stairs.  Baseball field was nice, but right by an Inter-State.  Has a nice little stretch of momma pop restaurants and older businesses.

Crawfordsville- Seem to have a decent relationship with the town.  They updated the front entrance a few years ago and a pretty good gym.  The town has a lot of older houses, but A LOT more updated then in Richmond. (FYI- I do bathroom remodeling for a family business)  So wally_wabash and any other Posters from Crawfordsville looking to remodel their bathrooms let me know... I got to that city about 3-4 times a month. :)  They also have a nice little baseball field near a river and near a house with a lot of Wabash students, that cook out and support the Lil Giants on Saturday and Sundays.

Richmond- Don't give me started, I think the EC basketball has to think Richmond.  The Wright Brothers (Curtis and Jamar) came from Richmond High School along with, Mike Bradley, Tyler Steward, Markous Jewett, and Brandon Miller.  When it comes to the town the average family income is only about 17,000 dollars.  The town is built for 60,000+ and I believe they have around 35-40 thousand now.  A lot of huge Factories have closed or moved out of Richmond in the Last 20 years.  I guess Richmond is still thankful for TOM RAPERS.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2006, 10:53:23 PM
My house was built in 1872, but we really need a kitchen upgrade, because it's a very Brady kitchen (the previous owners didn't get to it, but upgraded everything else).

However, it would take a big pile o' money falling from the sky to get that done.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2006, 11:11:00 PM
jcswitt -

Stop by the Cheese Barn.  Say hi to Grandpa.  Get some gouda.  It's great. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2006, 11:17:10 PM
I've lived in or had connections to the Holmes/Wayne County (i.e. Wooster) area for almost 40 years, and I've never heard of Grandpa's Cheese Barn.  Where is it?  Sounds tasty!

As for the Coccia House...well, suffice it to say that I once drove in a blizzard all the way to Dover, following a snowplow all the way down 250, just to get my mouth around one of Mama Zifer's pizza.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 07, 2006, 11:33:03 PM
Can't say I've ever driven through a blizzard, but some little known facts about Richmond's culinary delights.

1. The east side Steak n' Shake, which one comes dangerously close to slipping into Ohio while driving to, is the only Steak n' Shake that begins serving breakfast at 11:00 p.m. The good from this: you can get steak, egg and cheese bagel sandwiches for a late night snack. The bad news: 15 extra pounds.

2. Sunshine Cafe...the smoke filled diner just down the road from Earlham always had very generous, and very cheap, omelletes, hashbrowns and toast for late night cravings. The bad news: 5 extra pounds.

3. Domino's Pizza was within walking distance of campus and the guys that worked there were regular listeners of the radio show I co-hosted on Saturday nights (with current and former Quaker Bronson Lickliter). We would throw in some free advertising for them and they, in turn, would always drop off some food in the wee hours of Saturday mornings during their last deliveries. The bad news: 5 extra pounds.

I've heard there were actually some good restaurants in Richmond, too. Unfortunately, I never made it to any of them....I was too busy eating at Steak n Shake.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2006, 11:38:35 PM
The Cheese Barn is right off of the 250 exit (toward Wooster) on I-71 at Ashland.  It's right off the ramp.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 07, 2006, 11:47:04 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 07, 2006, 11:33:03 PMSunshine Cafe...the smoke filled diner just down the road from Earlham always had very generous, and very cheap, omelletes, hashbrowns and toast for late night cravings. The bad news: 5 extra pounds.

The SunShinE (as the sign read) Cafe in C-ville had this big stuffed bear sitting in a chair up front by the door. That poor creature had the hard crust of years worth of slobber of local children all over it. That thing had more germs than the monkey in "Outbreak". I hope that bear didn't have a long lost brother in Richmond.

C-ville's best food, in my humble-boy-am-I-a-fat-bastard opinion is at Digger's Cafe. I'm going to be back up there in a couple of weeks and Diggers is on my list right behind the Bookstore for mandatory visits.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 07, 2006, 11:53:22 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 07, 2006, 08:22:33 PM
When I think of Richmond, I think of Tom Raper RVs.  A lovely image to project to the world, or at least every over-the-road trucker and cross-country driver.  ::)

When I think of Richmond, I think of school buses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2006, 11:55:12 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 07, 2006, 11:38:35 PM
The Cheese Barn is right off of the 250 exit (toward Wooster) on I-71 at Ashland.  It's right off the ramp. 

Oh.  Ashland.  Well, no wonder.   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 07, 2006, 11:56:39 PM
I've never been to Granpa's Cheese Barn but will have to check it out.  There's another one somewhere on Route 30 as you head towards Canton, and I've never been in there either. :-)

Talking down Coccia House in Wooster is akin to blasphemy and they take that act seriously around here.  But after trying their pizza a few times when first moving here, I realized that they were killing my stomach and I didn't like the smell either.  To me, they almost smelled rancid.

Believe it or not, my favorite area pizza is at the outlet mall up where 83 meets 71. That little Italian booth in the food court has real New York style thin crust pizza with real cheese.  Good stuff.  I've never been to the place in Millersburg, but will check it out.  I've heard there's a good ice cream place down there, too.

This is out of NCAC territory, but if anyone ever finds themselves up near JCU there's a great Jewish Deli real close by on Chagrin Boulevard called Corky and Lennie's.  Incredible corned beef sandwiches.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2006, 12:06:10 AM
The Sunshine Cafe in Cville closed and it's another restaurant now. And I think it's actually good food in there!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2006, 12:08:13 AM
Oh, and I guess we should say this:

Wabash vs. Earlham - Wednesday - huge game for both teams. Winner has a decent shot at hosting - loser will need miracles if they want to avoid a first round bus trip on that Tuesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 12:10:46 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 07, 2006, 11:56:39 PMI've never been to the place in Millersburg, but will check it out.  I've heard there's a good ice cream place down there, too.

Pizza place in Millersburg?  Millersburg has nothing but chain pizza places (read: :P).  If you're referring to Mama Zifer's (from my blizzard story), that's in Dover, not Millersburg. 

And the ice cream place (the Grocery Bag) closed this past fall.   :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 08, 2006, 12:11:58 AM
Sorry, I meant Dover.  But aren't they the same place?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 12:26:20 AM
The first set of regional rankings comes out tomorrow.  We're never quite certain what hocus pocus is applied by the regional committee, but it seems that the only important factors in determining which teams get ranked are the regional winning percentage and the QoWI.  From there, they use head-to-head and records against other ranked teams to break ties. 

Along those lines, here's the 8 Great Lakes teams that have win %s at .800 or above, ranked by their regional records:

Team--Reg. rec.--Reg. %--QoWI--(national ranking in QoWI)
1. Wooster 16-1 .941 10.706 (14)
2. Hope 12-1 .923 10.615 (16)
3. Baldwin-Wallace 17-2 .895 10.526 (18)
4t. Wittenberg 14-2 .875 10.500 (19)
4t. Calvin 7-1 .875 9.625 (48)
6. Carnegie Mellon 13-2 .867 11.000 (9)
7. Lake Erie 13-3 .813 9.438 (61)
8. Albion 8-2 .800 9.900 (36)

If I had to guess, I'd guess that the rankings come out like this:
1. Wooster
2. Hope
3. CMU
4. Baldwin-Wallace
5. Wittenberg
6. Calvin

The top 100 national teams in terms of QoWI have been posted by Pat Coleman in the QoWI Chat room (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=2910.90).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on February 08, 2006, 01:27:47 AM
The bar you are talking about is called CJ's and the pizza is good! 

Hiram itself doesn't have much to offer, however Cleveland and Akron are 35 minutes away and easy access to clubs or whatever.  He do have Garrettsville as much as i hate to say it, 3 miles down the road. There is a movie theatre, which i wouldn't recommend, a few gas stations, movie gallery, rite-aid and bowling alley, which is ok since its mostly students that go. I'm not usually a small town person either, but you can make do for four years out of your element.  I'm from SC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 08, 2006, 01:44:29 AM
Lboogz15- Do you sleep?  Yeah CJ's I had a feeling that was a popular place for the Hiram students that like to make it ouside the dormroom and into a place with BEER.  I'm not going to lie, it took everything in me, NOT to order a Beer.  If i have to drop of that donation to Hiram if for some odd reason in the Devils name that Hiram pulls off the UPSET, I'd even meet you and any 21 Year Old Hiram basketball player for some Drinks. (once the season is over... of coarse)    :)   I'd even think about buying a Hiram T-shirt while I was there and Feel bad for Every Wooster Fan in the country.  I'm start'n to get a *SMALL bad feeling about this game... NAh not really, but I wouldn't mind stop'n at CJ's again!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 08, 2006, 10:48:55 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 07, 2006, 08:22:33 PM
When I think of Richmond, I think of Tom Raper RVs.  A lovely image to project to the world, or at least every over-the-road trucker and cross-country driver.  ::)

Ah, yes, poor Tom Raper. Is there anyone who should have tried harder than Tom Raper to find a job which did NOT require him to put his name in big letters on a billboard? I suppose it could be worse: he could have opened Tom Raper Windowless Conversion Vans...

Quote from: fighting_scots on February 07, 2006, 09:51:07 PM
How can you visit Woo and NOT get a pizza at Coccia House!
DC, I know that will get your thoughts drifting--

The pizza there is good, but from my one experience at the Coccia House, the reason not to go there on a visit would be that you might wait half of your weekend for the pizza to come. That was just on one try for me though, so not sure if that is a common occurrence.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 08, 2006, 11:41:05 AM
Speaking of Pizza, Nice to see D3 Basketball on ESPN2's Cold Pizza today.

They had Josh Hinz and Beloit's College Head Coach on today.  Beloit College beat Grinnell college last week 120-114.  Josh only had 50 points on 18-27 from the field, 14-19 Ft's, and 36 Rebounds.  Yeah those are some pretty unbelievable numbers. 

Nice to see D3 getting some love on ESPN.  (if high school gets some love on ESPN maybe there will be a Wooster/Witt game years down ther road???  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 12:35:12 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 08, 2006, 11:41:05 AM
Speaking of Pizza, Nice to see D3 Basketball on ESPN2's Cold Pizza today.

They had Josh Hinz and Beloit's College Head Coach on today.  Beloit College beat Grinnell college last week 120-114.  Josh only had 50 points on 18-27 from the field, 14-19 Ft's, and 36 Rebounds.  Yeah those are some pretty unbelievable numbers. 

Nice to see D3 getting some love on ESPN.  (if high school gets some love on ESPN maybe there will be a Wooster/Witt game years down ther road???  :)

Maybe, but this is pretty typical for ESPN.  They're not interested in good basketball, they're just attracted by the shiny toy. When it comes to D3, the only thing that grabs their attention is the ridiculous numbers put up by Grinnell (or, more usually, Grinnell opponents.)  High quality, hard-fought, intense sporting competitions don't interest ESPN; they're all about the sideshow.  Why else would they employ Dick Vitale and Chris Berman?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on February 08, 2006, 12:50:36 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 12:35:12 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 08, 2006, 11:41:05 AM
Speaking of Pizza, Nice to see D3 Basketball on ESPN2's Cold Pizza today.

They had Josh Hinz and Beloit's College Head Coach on today.  Beloit College beat Grinnell college last week 120-114.  Josh only had 50 points on 18-27 from the field, 14-19 Ft's, and 36 Rebounds.  Yeah those are some pretty unbelievable numbers. 

Nice to see D3 getting some love on ESPN.  (if high school gets some love on ESPN maybe there will be a Wooster/Witt game years down ther road???  :)

Maybe, but this is pretty typical for ESPN.  They're not interested in good basketball, they're just attracted by the shiny toy. When it comes to D3, the only thing that grabs their attention is the ridiculous numbers put up by Grinnell (or, more usually, Grinnell opponents.)  High quality, hard-fought, intense sporting competitions don't interest ESPN; they're all about the sideshow.  Why else would they employ Dick Vitale and Chris Berman?

Now, if Tom Port had put up 50 on Wittenberg after being out with a broken hand, would ESPN have interviewed him and Steve Moore?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 08, 2006, 12:51:01 PM
~ Here goes a not so exciting in-train story ~

Every gameday, I wear some form of Woo clothing, not necessarily related to basketball, but just something that identifies me as a Woo alum.  Today I got the Scots in Spirit T-shirt from this year's volunteer activity.   :)   I ride the Metro to and from downtown DC.  So on Saturday, I was in seating down in the middle seats in a crowded Metro train car when this gentleman shoved his way from the front of the car to where I was sitting.  He had a grin on his face and immediately I was like, "Here we go again" coz I had a Steelers jersey and some people liked to give me a hard time about it (in a good way!) that day.  In fact what had caught his attention was my yellow Woo baseball cap.

He told me that he was an alum of Hampden-Sydney and that he vividly remembers Wooster from the 2003 Final Four and most importantly that he was a big fan of d3 hoops.  I was like, "sweet!"  He said he has been following Woo since we defeated them in Salem.  As it turned out, the gentleman knew more about my school and Witt and our conference than I did.  Unfortunately the same cud not be said about my knowledge of his school and its conference.

Anyways, the point I'm trying to make here is that the gentleman echoed every other d3 sports fans' sentiments.  We need more national coverage.  We need the networks to start showing us some respect.  We indeed talked about how high school is deemed to be more important than our d3.  He told me that he has been talking to some people in Bristol City about having ESPNU and ESPN Full Court cover some of our games.  Not that this hasn't been done before, as in people asking the major networks to look at us, but I thought how this whole conversation started and how it went was very interesting.  My ride from the Dupont Circle to Silver Spring was over before I knew it.  Had I not needed a bathrrom break, I wud've gone all the way to Glenmont.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 08, 2006, 12:59:30 PM
Some nice reading for Scots' fans:

It's official--Port is coming back next year:

http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles//sports/&file=_sports3.txt&article=1&tD=

And Terry Pluto had a nice article today on the Scots in the Akron Beacon Journal:

http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/sports/13818773.htm

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 12:59:54 PM
Quote from: WooMix on February 08, 2006, 12:51:01 PMMy ride from the Dupont Circle to Silver Spring was over before I knew it.  Had I not needed a bathrrom break, I wud've gone all the way to Glenmont.   :)

Oh come on, the subway doesn't go anywhere near Glenmont.  It doesn't even reach Killbuck!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 08, 2006, 01:14:50 PM
That's terrific news about Port, the result of which is that next season should be as exciting as this one!

Terry Pluto is such an excellent writer and a class act.  The subject matter of his articles runs the complete gamut from pro sports through DIII and high school.  And his book on the old ABA, Loose Balls, is the best sports book that I've read.

And, by the way, I've been impressed with Joe Vardon's writing from his first day on the job at The Daily Record.

Now, come on guys.  There's only one real subway, and it goes from Coney Island to the Bronx... :-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 08, 2006, 01:17:34 PM
The issue with national exposure for D3 probably has to do with the lack of connection to pro sports. D1 football and basketball get huge coverage, likely because these are essentially all the future pro football and basketball players. I'm sure any high school action getting national publicity is chosen for the instances where that high school contest involves a Lebron or Mello so everyone is getting a preview of a pro athlete. While the actual competition from D3 is hard to surpass (see last Saturday at Witt and Hope and tonight at Calvin...) there isn't as much of a commercial story out of "well, this is the final game for both these opposing point guards, he's going to sell commercial real estate next year while the other will be working on his teaching certificate."

As with anything, we're in a capitalist country so the issue is to get the word out amongst the consumers. Only the lucky few D3 teams have an average of even 2000 or more people come to a game so right now ESPN does not see a fanbase of millions demanding coverage. If there is a way to create that demand and interest in D3, the supply of coverage would follow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 01:28:09 PM
I for one don't want the TV exposure.  I'd like to see the occasional Hope/Calvin or Woo/Witt game televised, because these are significant events.  But I think that the regular broadcasting of a "D3 Game of the Week" on ESPN8 ("the Ocho") would do more harm than good.  First, you get all of those awful media timeouts.  Then you get some wiseass like Vitale.  Then you get players trying to do something -- anything -- that will get their highlight on SportsCenter.  Then you get the fans acting in a ridiculous way to get on TV.  In the end you have the goofy sideshow atmosphere that ESPN cultivates and celebrates.  I like our game just the way it is (Grinnell et alia excepted) and I don't want the Bristol Stomp to change a thing.

Now, more coverage from the likes of Terry Pluto in publications like the ABJ or Bill Plaschke in the LA Times (he did a feature story on Caltech the other day) is a VERY good thing.  I especially like how Pluto emphasized the academic achievements of the team in general Kyle Witucky (which I knew) and Tom Port (which I did not know--huzzah, Tom!) specifically.  I think Terry Pluto gets what D3 is all about.  I'm certain that Dick Vitale does not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 08, 2006, 01:30:51 PM
DC- I understand about ESPN only interested in Stats.  I was just happy to see anything about D3 sports and hoops on the national stage. (Sadly they didn't have any footage of the game to show just a handful of Action Pics) *I'm not even sure if they were from that game or not.  Any good PUB is good for the Average D3 sports fan.

After reading your last post I guess our views are different.  The sad thing is I don't think kids at Wooster and Witt would play any differently if Espn broadcasted the game nationally like at the D1 level.    
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2006, 01:39:29 PM
DC -

First off, when ESPN was in its infancy, Vitale and Berman were great. Now they're caricatures.

Second, Vitale off camera is way different than on camera. He knows the importance of D-3 and all that - he's kind of boxed into a corner.

Third, you're sounding like the fans of indie rock bands that become famous. I remember when "Slanted and Enchanted" by Pavement came out - many of their long-time fans were disgusted that they were getting great press now and were going to sell more than 5,000 records. They thought the band was 'just for them'.

Like D-3, they're for everyone. The more publicity, the better.

But I agree about the media timeouts. But if it ever happens, and it helps in the general financial aid of a school by being on TV - then that's great.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 08, 2006, 01:40:45 PM
While I'd like to see more tv coverage of DIII games on ESPNU or CSTV, it would only be so that I, and other DIII fans, could enjoy them.  The idea that this is necessary to validate DIII sports, to give them "respect" is not something that I buy into.  DIII sports exist as they are, they need no validation by anyone else for me, and I believe other DIII fans, to appreciate them.

I think this new definition of the word respect isn't necessarily a good thing.  Kind of like people who say they went to a place or event "just so I could say I was there".  What kind of reason is that?  All that shows is that you don't have much of an opinion of your own judgement.  If something attracts your interest, go to it.  If it doesn't, then don't.  I've learned to really enjoy DIII sports rather late in my life and if much of the country doesn't agree with my take on them, I really could care less.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 08, 2006, 01:43:12 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 12:59:54 PM
Quote from: WooMix on February 08, 2006, 12:51:01 PMMy ride from the Dupont Circle to Silver Spring was over before I knew it.  Had I not needed a bathrrom break, I wud've gone all the way to Glenmont.   :)

Oh come on, the subway doesn't go anywhere near Glenmont.  It doesn't even reach Killbuck!  :D

Hahaha ...  I live here man.  I know where the Metro goes.  Check out the Metro map at this link:

http://www.wmata.com/metrorail/systemmap.cfm

Unless there is another Glenmont somewhere that I don't know about or maybe when you we here last, the Metro didn't go that far?  You know how they keep extending the lines and adding new ones?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 01:47:55 PM
Oh, one thing I forgot, then I promise I'll let my anti-ESPN rant go.  These guys are in television programming for a living, and that means they have to have something to show at all times of the day or night.  The D3 games will be their lowest-drawing product, so we'd get the worst possible timeslots.  They have wielded their enormous power over conferences like the OVC and MAC to get them to do idiotic things like 11pm tipoffs of basketball games and the relegation to Tuesday night of the Bowling Green/Toledo football game (which was a great and storied rivalry until ESPN, with the MAC's full cooperation, destroyed it).  If they started signing contracts with the NCAC and MIAA and CCIW for broadcast rights, as sure as I'm sitting here they'd try to force us into strange days and start times for our games.  I like to think the NCAC would resist ::), but do you suppose the OAC would have any objection to a regular 1pm Wednesday tip for the "OAC Game of the Week Brought to You By Marathon (Best in the Long Run)?"  It turns my stomach just to think of it.

Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2006, 01:39:29 PM
Third, you're sounding like the fans of indie rock bands that become famous. I remember when "Slanted and Enchanted" by Pavement came out - many of their long-time fans were disgusted that they were getting great press now and were going to sell more than 5,000 records. They thought the band was 'just for them'.

Like D-3, they're for everyone. The more publicity, the better.

Well, of course, indie rock references are completely lost on me, an opera buff.  But if Pavement changed their musical style in order to appease the masses (or, worse yet, the label), then their fans have a right to be disgusted.  If, on the other hand, the masses just discovered whatever it was that Pavement had to offer, then that's great.  If ESPN could display the D3 game that we know and love to the world, without changing it, that'd be wonderful.  But I don't believe it's possible.  Their very presence wold change the game; it's the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle as applied to mass media.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 01:49:17 PM
Quote from: WooMix on February 08, 2006, 01:43:12 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 12:59:54 PM
Quote from: WooMix on February 08, 2006, 12:51:01 PMMy ride from the Dupont Circle to Silver Spring was over before I knew it.  Had I not needed a bathrrom break, I wud've gone all the way to Glenmont.   :)

Oh come on, the subway doesn't go anywhere near Glenmont.  It doesn't even reach Killbuck!  :D

Hahaha ...  I live here man.  I know where the Metro goes.  Check out the Metro map at this link:

http://www.wmata.com/metrorail/systemmap.cfm

Unless there is another Glenmont somewhere that I don't know about or maybe when you we here last, the Metro didn't go that far?  You know how they keep extending the lines and adding new ones?

I was referring to Glenmont, Ohio; a tiny hamlet in Holmes County, more or less halfway between Wooster and Gambier.  Not my best joke, I grant you. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2006, 01:59:15 PM
It's funny though, I though those crowds at those Midnight Friday games were among the most spirited and rocking in the OVC. It sure looked like everyone had a good time.

DC - the point was that Pavement were signed on an indie label, and just released and album the press picked up on. The fans were insular and did not want them to grow. Sure, I would hate to have the schedules all messed around to accomidate TV, but if TV wants to come to the party, on the D-3 terms, then why complain?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 08, 2006, 02:07:35 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 01:28:09 PM
Then you get the fans acting in a ridiculous way to get on TV. 

Granted I haven't been to a game in Timken in 4 years, but unless the student section has cut back severely, I'm sure they already employ theatrics enough to attract a camera crew if there happened to be TV coverage of the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 08, 2006, 02:08:29 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 01:49:17 PM
I was referring to Glenmont, Ohio; a tiny hamlet in Holmes County, more or less halfway between Wooster and Gambier. Not my best joke, I grant you.

Not a bad joke at all, for an opera fan...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 08, 2006, 02:15:15 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 01:49:17 PM
Quote from: WooMix on February 08, 2006, 01:43:12 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 12:59:54 PM
Quote from: WooMix on February 08, 2006, 12:51:01 PMMy ride from the Dupont Circle to Silver Spring was over before I knew it.  Had I not needed a bathrrom break, I wud've gone all the way to Glenmont.   :)

Oh come on, the subway doesn't go anywhere near Glenmont.  It doesn't even reach Killbuck!  :D

Hahaha ...  I live here man.  I know where the Metro goes.  Check out the Metro map at this link:

http://www.wmata.com/metrorail/systemmap.cfm

Unless there is another Glenmont somewhere that I don't know about or maybe when you we here last, the Metro didn't go that far?  You know how they keep extending the lines and adding new ones?

I was referring to Glenmont, Ohio; a tiny hamlet in Holmes County, more or less halfway between Wooster and Gambier.  Not my best joke, I grant you. 

Ahhh, that must be one of those small towns.  My favorite small Ohio town in Fredricksburg.  I drove through it one day when I was checking out the Amish people.  Thats how I discovered Millersburg too.  As it turned out, Millersburg has some nice restaurants too. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 02:40:35 PM
Smeds, I think we may be arguing past each other to a large degree.  Let me put it this way:  If D3hoops.com started a television network and broadcast D3 games, I'd be it's first subscriber.  If TV came to D3 on D3's terms I'd be ecstatic.  But that is (emphatically) not how I see ESPN doing things. 

Those late-night crowds at OVC games might have been spirited and rocking, but that's not supposed to be the point of D3 athletics.  It's academics first, and conducting a college-sponsored event that is guaranteed to go into the wee hours of a weekday morning is not what we're supposed to be about.  (I grant you, the students take on this initiative themselves; I myself skipped many a class because of late night indiscretions--but I put myself in the way of that harm, the college did not put me there.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Salem, VA on February 08, 2006, 03:04:29 PM
I agree with Dave ESPN is not going in that direction at all.  If D3 hoops had a TV network I would be right behind Dave
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 08, 2006, 03:05:58 PM
My worry wouldn't be that we'd get a jackhole like Vitale, it's that we'd get someone like Pam Ward who while broadcasting a game at "Texas State" this year called them "Texas Southern". How long would it take you to hear them call you guys "Woo-ster" ("uuu") before you got upset? Or like the one that jacked up Allegheny in 2003 for the football selection show.

I'd be less worried about the potential for sideshow than the potential that they'd look like they were just humoring us; which they would be doing.

Showing high school games over DIII games isn't about the relative talent/competition levels; It's about watching the "next" King James (praise be his name!); which isn't likely to happen in a DIII game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2006, 03:35:29 PM
That aside, I think Pam Ward is a great broadcaster. I've been quite impressed with how she calls the college game.

And if they did more D-3 games they'd have to get with the program. The 'Gheny thing was a malaprop, that happens to all broadcasters.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 08, 2006, 04:24:01 PM
A quick aside on Pam Ward first. Really, I don't hate women as some of my posts my lead people to believe. Two of my favorite professors (one in journalism and one in English) were women. Three of my favorite teachers from high school were women. My favorite professor thus far in grad school is a woman. And I love my mother and my fiancee very much.

Having said that, Pam Ward is simply the worst major college football announcer that I've ever had to endure. Having my beloved Nittany Lions relegated to the noon ESPN2 games for the better part of three years, I have listened to plenty of Pam Ward. No one gets more names wrong. Ever. Even as Penn State was climbing the Big Ten standings this season, she never could get Derrick Williams, JUstin King, Deon Butler and Michael Robinson (PSU's top 4 skill players) straightened out. To top off the obvious problem, she never shows one bit of excitement. She absolutely deadpanned a 3rd and 15 touchdown that gave Penn State a final second win at Northwestern. Just imagine her treatment of James Cooper's 3-point shot a month back against Witt.

"Here's Conley out front. He shoots. (Crowd cheers for 11 seconds as Pam tries to remember who's playing). Justin Cooper sends the Tiger fans home happy."

I can't take it anymore. Musburger, Vitale, Mike Patrick, Spielman and a host of others tempt me to hit the mute button. Pam Ward nearly leads me to rip my ears away from my head.


I can live with high school basketball on ESPN. Especially if it involves Greg Oden and LN. Watching the defenseless charade known as the New York public league a couple of years ago on ESPN was ridiculous. However, high ranking high school teams with legitimate star players are always welcome on ESPN original or the deuce. Now, I do have a major problem with ESPNU showing anything other than college sports. I really thought this channel would bring D-2 and D-3 basketball to the forefront. Nope, nothing yet.

However, even more than showing a Grinnell game or some bitter rivalry, I'd rest easy just knowing that some of the national tournament were to be shown on live television. Not just the Final Four from Salem, but some of the earlier rounds. I know that regular ESPN and the Deuce are worrying about the men's NIT and that God forsaken women's tournament. Does anyone know what's been committed to ESPNU for that same time period?

And again: I love women and kittens. I just hate Pam Ward's voice and girls dribbling.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 08, 2006, 04:42:27 PM
See it's not just Wabash guys...

That thing about Pam Ward misidentifying Texas State really got my goat. It's all over the stadium. How do you miss that? You're in San Marcos, Texas. Texas Southern is in HOUSTON! Quite a difference. Nice small town in Central Texas compared to the 9th Circle of Hell.

I think they send her to the games that they really don't want anyone to watch. Or at least listen to.

That being said, I know its not an easy job, and she's not the only announcer that annoys me. I really wish they would just run an alternate audio like a DVD does with languages so you could just listen to the crowd noise, band, and PA announcer without the commentary.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 08, 2006, 05:28:35 PM
Pam Ward... I'm sorry, but when I'm watching sports the last thing I want to hear is a Woman's Voice.  I could careless if she was so damn good at it, and got every name right.  I hear her and I feel like I'm only seconds away from my G/f or Mother telling me what to do.  Heck even on my navigational system in my car it is a woman's voice... so I opt to put both on MUTE!

Does anyone know if Wabash has an internet broadcast of the game?  I'm not sure if I can take another night of Earlham's Teamline... Assuming they are not at the Woman's game or last Saturday when they didn't do either!   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 08, 2006, 05:36:26 PM
I wonder if Pam knows she's being ripped on D3hoops.com.

I'd take her over Mushmouth in a second.

Face it D3 is only interesting to ESPN if its a novelty like that crap for basketball they play at Grinnell.

But I do applaud their efforts televising the D3 football title game..........maybe someday they'll pick up basketball game as well.  But since the D3 Final coincides witht the first round of the NCAA tournament every year......not likely.

We'll have D3 basketball all to ourselves.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 08, 2006, 05:54:42 PM
Heck, I wouldn't even mind watching a good DIII game after the fact.  Hope is playing Calving tonight, and it's being televised locally on one of their regional PBS stations, KTVU.  I asked them if they could possibly archive it, but they're not.  It would be great if some Hope fan could record the video and get it up on the net.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2006, 07:01:59 PM
I'm sorry, but a lot of the other clowns are much, much worse than Pam Ward. She does the ESPN 2 Big 10 games which draw a big rating. Some of the other idiots are, well, idiots, but she is not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2006, 07:03:55 PM
Yes, the Wabash student station is broadcasting the game and it should be live on the air via the web.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 08, 2006, 08:12:01 PM
Halftime in Crawfordsville:

Wabash 32,
Earlham 30

I've been listening for about 10 minutes, neither team has led by more than 5.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2006, 08:15:43 PM
Halftime from Chadwick:

Earlham 30
Wabash 32

This has been a very good back and forth game so far.  I'm not keeping track of ties and lead changes, but there have been enough that it if I knew that number it would illustrate how good the game has been so far.  Wabash went on a little run at the end of the half to get a 5 point lead, but Henry drilled a 3 for Earlham with under 10 seconds left to stop the Wabash momentum and make it a two point game at halftime.  

Should be a great second half.  Go Wabash!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 08, 2006, 08:29:48 PM
Wooster 104
Hiram 43

10:00 minutes to go!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2006, 08:29:54 PM
7-2 Quaker run to start the second half...EC up 37-34 early in the second  half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 08:31:39 PM
I'm surprised nobody has reported this.  I just got back from my day at the library to find Wooster being absolutely merciless on Mr. Pfouts and co.  The present score is 104-43 with 10:00 left.  It was 68-27 at the half.  Wooster has at least 6 players in double figures (Will has 9 unless he's scored any of the last 5 points): all of the starters except (amazingly) Cooper, plus Fulk and Johnson.  Wooster has made 20 three-pointers.  I think revenge must be a factor here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 08:34:08 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 12:26:20 AM
The first set of regional rankings comes out tomorrow.  [...]
If I had to guess, I'd guess that the rankings come out like this:
1. Wooster
2. Hope
3. CMU
4. Baldwin-Wallace
5. Wittenberg
6. Calvin

This is in fact the GL regional rankings, as released today. 
See the post in the Daily Dose (http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/?p=125).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2006, 08:34:44 PM
Does beating Hiram by 80 points get Port his three weeks of missed games back?  Nope.  Seems a bit senseless to me....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 08:38:12 PM
Well, for whatever it's worth, the scrubs are in the game.  THey started coming in at about the 10:00 mark.  I think this is what happens when a great team with focus and determination plays as hard as they can against a terrible team. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2006, 08:46:29 PM
It's been all Earlham so far in the second half.  48-38 Quakers...Wabash has been ice cold in the second half.  Not sure how much time is left, but we have to be around 10 minutes left.

48-41, 7:43 left in the game.  Wabash made a line change at the last timeout and have come out energized...the LGs might not be dead just yet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 08:51:55 PM
Final from Wooster:

Scots Many
Terriers Few

Actually that was 129-67.  Seven Scots in double figures, two others with 9, everyone in uniform scored, Scots hit a school and conference record 22 treys.  Cooper had just two points, in play limited by the omnipresent "flulike symptoms."  62 point MOV without the team's leading scorer?  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2006, 08:52:28 PM
Final:  Wooster 129  Hiram  67

Wooster got some revenge tonight because Hiram was the team that undercut Tom Port on a dunk when he broke his wrist.  :)

Wooster made 22 three pointers in this game and had 7 players in double figure points including Devin Fulk with 21, Andy Van Horn at 16, Kyle Witucky at 15 (5 three's), Tom Port with 15, Tim Vandervaart with 13, Marty Bidwell with 12 and Brandon Johnson with 10.

Wooster shot 57% from the floor and 50% on three pointers.

Wooster is now 21-1, 13-0 NCAC.  ;D

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 08, 2006, 08:53:31 PM
Sounds like the Little Giants have gone Giant.....could be tough match ups with Nick Welsh out with an injury and Joe Rihm in some foul trouble
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2006, 08:56:21 PM
Wooster has to feel like they let one get away tonight.  They totally could have doubled Hiram up.   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2006, 09:00:44 PM
Under 5 minutes to go, Earlham leads 48-46.

Earlham stays cold as Jewett misses a three.  Wabash rebound to Stephens.
Wabash misses a three, but Simkus gets the rebound and the stickback.  Tie game.  Simkus is owning the offensive glass in the second half.  The crowd is going insane. 
Earlham ends their 3-minute drought with a basket.  50-48 Quake. 
On the other end, Coffey gets the entry pass in the paint and draws the foul.  He'll shoot two.  Makes the first.  Misses the second.  50-49 Earlham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2006, 09:05:08 PM
To the other end now...Earlham draws a foul on Coffey.  Henry will shoot a pair.  He gets them both and gives Earlham a three point lead.  2:45 left to play.
L'il Earl Rooks hits a BIG three pointer for Wabash to tie the game!
Earlham answers with a three of their own.  HUGE shot.  Earlham back up by three.
Jimmy Owens fakes a three and drives to the hoop for Wabash.  He draws the foul.  Free throws coming.  Good and....no good.  Wabash trails by two.
Wabash plays a solid defensive possession here, gets a block but can't corral the ball.  Earlham gets fouled going back up with the loose ball.  Free throws are forthcoming.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 08, 2006, 09:07:51 PM
Wally we need quicker updates 53.9 left 57-53 Earlham leading..
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 08, 2006, 09:09:09 PM
45 sec 58-56 Earlham leads and ball
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 08, 2006, 09:10:08 PM
29 secs left Miller shooting two earlham up 2.  Simpkins fouled out...very exciting...Gotta luc NCAC hoops, baby..challening Dickie V there for sec.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2006, 09:12:09 PM
1:12 left.  Earlham hits both free throws and leads 57-53.  

Wabash loses the ball on an over and back violation.  Ball goes to Earlham.
Wabash fouls Collins.  First free throw is no good.  Second is good.  58-53 Earlham.  
Jimmy Owens drives to the hoop, gets the reverse layup and is fouled!  Huge play.  The free throw is good.  58-56 Quakers.  
Simkus commits his fifth personal foul on Brandon Miller at the other end.  That's a huge foul for Wabash as Simkus has had a huge second half.  
Miller's free throws are good and no good.  29 seconds left.  Earlham leads by 3.
Wabash runs down and gets an easy layup.  Wabash down just 1 now.  
Wabash fouls immediately.  Henry will shoot two free throws.  Henry's first shot is NO GOOD!  Wabash has serious life right now.  Timeout Fightin' Justus's.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 08, 2006, 09:13:58 PM
Any particular reason why James Cooper played 11 mins for Scots.  I missed broadcast...Was that just a rest situation or did the Terriers take another Scot out? ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 08, 2006, 09:16:20 PM
Cooper had the flu.

Wooster 129, Hiram 67
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 08, 2006, 09:17:37 PM
No excuses. This team has ZERO focus at the foul line. It's cost them games this season........none bigger than tonight.

OT all the momentum heads to Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2006, 09:17:44 PM
That's my boy from the home state of Oregon Jimmy Owens drillin' the triple to send this game to OT!!!  Go Wabash!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2006, 09:18:24 PM
Final:  Wittenberg 66  Ohio Wesleyan 54

Tigers pick up a nice road win.  Daniel Russ had 24 points, Kenny Brady had 13 points and Greg Hill chipped in 12 points for Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 08, 2006, 09:18:32 PM
Ore-uh-gahn? right? Am I closer, Wally?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 08, 2006, 09:18:38 PM
I wish I had live stats to check box score and check foul situation both teams in double bonus!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2006, 09:21:38 PM
Miller charges and picks up his fifth foul!  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 08, 2006, 09:21:51 PM
Ec missing FTs and Wabash fighting hard and really wants it. Charge on Earlham and Wabash bring it back down with a chance!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 08, 2006, 09:23:33 PM
How many missed FTs for EC in the second half and overtime?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 08, 2006, 09:23:56 PM
Li'l Earl with a large shot
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 08, 2006, 09:24:12 PM
Gregory for 3... No Good... Wabash with the Rebound.. down 2
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 09:25:10 PM
This is why we had a separate board for the Woo/Witt in-game updates.

If anyone is looking for the regular discussion, it left off on page 154.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 08, 2006, 09:26:05 PM
Earlham down 68-64 with 30 Sec.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 08, 2006, 09:26:29 PM
Sorry D.C. just got home... i'll stop
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 08, 2006, 09:28:35 PM
Earlham needs a guy to work stats for their broadcast...need specifics and box score reset every once in awhile.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 08, 2006, 09:29:07 PM
Sorry, DC we got worked up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2006, 09:29:15 PM
I'm not asking you to stop, just letting folks know where the main thread is.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 08, 2006, 09:30:43 PM
I'm throwing in the Towel... Earlham missed a lay-up after Coffey Missed his 2nd Free-throw...  Gzzz we gave this game to wabash... well not gave just didn't have the BALLS to hit the shots to win the game  WABASH WINS
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 08, 2006, 09:31:40 PM
Great game. What a huge win by Wabash. Earlham fought hard. Man, what happened to their freethrows? Those missed FTs were huge. Great win by the Little Giants. Wabash Always Fights!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 08, 2006, 09:32:42 PM
I'm so frusterated right now...  We gave Wabash this game.  I wasn't there... but it sounds like if we had the balls to hit some FREE-Throws Wabash isn't in this game... AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH AHHHHHHHHHHhhhhhhhhh ahhhhhhhhhhh ahhh...  I'll check the Stats later... But i'm Angry... BY THE WAY HIRAM... I liked my ODDS, and the out-come wasn't even close agaist WOOSTER
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2006, 09:34:19 PM
What a great comeback for Wabash.  Wabash trailed by 10 in the second half.  Then Simkus took over, Wabash got a series of stops and worked their way back into it.  Earlham missed just enough free throws to allow Wabash to tie and then Wabash controlled the OT.  Not the prettiest win, but easily the biggest win of the season for Wabash.  

Earlham still controls their own destiny for fourth place.  Win out, and they'll edge Wabash by a game for fourth place (assuming Wabash is unable to knock off Wooster or Witt).  If Wabash can beat either of other W's, Wabash will host Earlham on the 21st.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 08, 2006, 09:35:21 PM
The more things change.......

Earlham has absolutely blown a great opportunity to finish 3rd in this league this season. Free throws alone cost them games against Wooster and Wabash. 2nd half collapses cost them games against Denison and Wittenberg.

Tonight may have been the most disheartening of all. They took control, led the entire second half and then just couldn't hit a shot (especially free throws) with a chance to win it.

Credit to Wabash, they do always fight. Once it went to OT, it was over. Hmm....Kyle Coffey. I had this strange gut feeling that he would come back and kill us in the end.

Blah. You're in the hole now EC....you better win out if you even want a chance to host.

I can't even get upset. They have zero audacity, so why should I get upset?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2006, 09:55:37 PM
In other NCAC action....

Allegheny 86, Oberlin 55

And Denison/Kenyon have not posted a score yet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 08, 2006, 10:13:53 PM
I thought the Wooster-Hiram game was at least cleanly played.  Pfouts (the guy who injured Port) actually started, and was of course boo'd, but it really didn't seem that bad.  He was boo'd for the rest of the game whenever he checked in, but it never got distasteful.  Maybe that was partially due to a smaller than normal crowd.

At the end of the game, when the players shook hands, I was watching to see what would happen with Pfouts.  He was near the back of the Hiram line, tapped a few coach's and player's hands, but before he got anywhere near Port, who was near the back of the Wooster line, he was gone.  Disappeared into the locker room. That was disappointing. 

A couple of apologetic or at least sympathetic words from him and both he and Port would have immediately felt better, and I'm sure that Port would not have given him any grief, considering that he's now playing again and Wooster got a big win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 08, 2006, 10:33:48 PM
Another note on the Wooster game:

With the 22-44 record-setting effort from three tonight, the Scots also set a new team mark for three pointers made in a season.

On the year, the Scots are now 247-548 (.451)  The old mark was 245 made three pointers, set by the '02-'03 final four team.

The Scots are also on track to set a new 3 FG percentage mark.  Their previous high was .437 (100-229) in the '89-'90 campaign.

Additionally, the Scots now have four players with 40! threes or better:
Faulk (46)
Cooper (44)
Port (41) (3-4 vs. Hiram)
Witucky (40) (5-8 vs. Hiram)
and two more with over 20:
Van Horn (27)
Johnson (24)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2006, 10:40:42 PM
One last final....

Kenyon 82, enison 70.

That's not a typo.  Kenyon shot 58.5% in this game...there is officially no D in Denison. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2006, 10:42:02 PM
Quote2 point game... Henry Shooting 2... Why was that not an Intentional FOUL?

Because Owens pert near stole the ball.

Also, the fifth foul on Miller was a charge called a split second before he was fouled on a shot. He charged into Lyttle (or so my caller says) and it was a good call (so my caller says - I had my head down for a second).

Miller is also a bit of a flopper on occasion, and perhaps that's why he doesn't get the benefit of the doubt by the refs.

The refs were OK (I think because no Ohio team was playing they didn't have a bias  ;) ) but Earlham needed to hit the FTs.

The key was at the 9:25 mark - Mac puts in a whole new five and they storm back for the win. Jimmy Owens owns C'ville now - swishing the three with two ticks left.

Earl Rooks comes up huge and Coffey plays big, as does Stephens when he's in there.

Still, Wabash wins when Medeiros, Jospeh and Zimmer are bascially non-factors.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2006, 10:45:16 PM
No one does crap for Denison except for Hodgkinson. Hern has 14 but five TOs. Krantz has 10.

But my gosh, look at this.

Formato has 22, no big shock - and Rehm has 15.

But Klingler with 23? On 7-10 shooting and 9 free throws? And no three attempts?

Jolson with 13 in 18 minutes and not missing a shot?

Kenyon tried just nine threes. Man, if Kenyon only takes nine threes then you are soft as a baby's heinie.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 08, 2006, 11:00:34 PM
just got back from delaware-not too bad of a drive except for the retard shining his brights on me the whole way back.

Witt 66 OWU 54

really sloppy game on witt's part with a lot of bad passes and just overall physical game. coach brown was very heated on the sideline and showed signs of frustration as witt let owu sniff a chance at coming back in the second half but then witt responded like always with nothing better than a dan russ 3 ball.

one stat of note- witt (the conference leader in free throws) shot 14-27 (51%)

russ had a big game and it seemed the only time owu could stop him was by a sloppy entrance pass or a no call by the ever popular and excellent NCAC refs.

tough game coming saturday-at hiram-haha
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2006, 11:02:33 PM
Ok, let's look at the NCACs hunt for the post season:

Given: Wooster and Witt will host and Kenyon will travel to Wooster.

OWU 9-4
Wabash 8-5
Earlham 7-6
Denison 6-7
Gheny 5-8

The OWU / Earlham game is key. A Quaker loss makes them 7-7 with a roadie to Denison left.

From all signs, it looks like Wabash and the Quakers could be facing each other again soon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 08, 2006, 11:21:08 PM
An amazing game to watch tonight. Not just because of the number of threes taken and made, but the passing was incredible. Wooster had 21 assists on 25 baskets in the first half.

Coming into the game, Wooster needed 20  3 pointers to tie the season record. What that means is that the same basket that broke the single game record also set the season record. I think that 3 was made by Jamie Yoder. I think today's game was the first time I saw Jamie Yoder play in the first half.

The individual season record for three's is 67 by Matt Smith of the Final Four team. Could it be possible that all four (Coop,Port,Witucky, and and Fulk) could pass that mark?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 08, 2006, 11:54:22 PM
For the game, goscots--35 assists--Fulk with a career high 21--hitting 3's like layups!

Now, down to business:

Quote from: Lboogz15 on February 07, 2006, 12:06:09 AM
WHAT IF.... Hiram came into Wooster and upset the number 1 team in the land? We have nothing to lose and whatever statements are placed on here will be in the locker room! Just a question the games have been close as of late. WHAT IF....

I'm sure the Scots appreciated your bulletin board material--after a game is over, even though you thought you were injured, you should AT LEAST bother to shake the opposing teams hands--WEAK effort all the way around tonight, Lboogz15--except for giving the Scots additional inspiration to put up 100 in the first 29 minutes.

You may not have feared Wooster before the game, but if you are able to come back after your "injury", you might think twice about your pre-game posting rituals--

Bash, with a great victory tonight, travels to Timken for a rematch--Mac back to his stomping grounds--should be a great game--

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 08, 2006, 11:56:54 PM
Well driving back from Grand Rapids tonight I was sure armageddon was upon us.

Thankfully the Scots took care of that and I can sleep well tonight knowing full well the sun will shine tommorrow.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 09, 2006, 12:10:57 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 08, 2006, 08:34:44 PM
Does beating Hiram by 80 points get Port his three weeks of missed games back?  Nope.  Seems a bit senseless to me....

Maybe it doesn't get his three weeks back, but I'm sure he's going to bed a lot happier tonight than after their last meeting! ;D  If Mr. Pfouts thought he was frustrated in the 1st half of their first meeting, imagine what he was thinking tonight.  At least the Pups prevented Wooster from throwing any dunks down.  That could be a silver lining I guess.  But then again, the dunking thing only applies to their house as Mr. Pfouts informed us.  

This game has been a target not just for the Port incident.  Wooster played a pretty bad 2nd half and squandered a 24 point lead to the Pups back in Janurary.  The rest of the team wasn't too happy about how they performed in that 2nd half, and tonight's senselss performance  was how Wooster chose to make their statement!  How about giving some props to Wooster's players.  They could have easily taken the hockey approach and responded physically (which we all knew was highly unlikely with a Steve Moore coached team, but still possible).  Instead,  they responded on the court and the result was the lopsided final on the scoreboard and a long bus ride back to Hiram for the Pups.  I guess Hiram learned tonight not to play with matches.  Because sometimes you might get burned!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on February 09, 2006, 12:17:35 AM
I'm glad to see that you were in attendance.  As far as not shaking the hands goes, i was sitting on the bench and the coaches shook my hand however, none of the players bothered to.  Your boys put on a great show tonight.  I'm just glad you paid that much attention to all of the things outside of the game. You should have came over and spoke, maybe cracked a joke or two.  On that foul I did however tweak my knee which as been surgically repaired from acl, mcl, and lcl tears.  So to talk about the game is one thing, but to discuss whether i was hurting or not is completely different.  Its cool though, your boys played a great game.  You can't take that away from them!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on February 09, 2006, 12:21:48 AM
Like i stated to begin with the question was what if?  That question was answered in many ways.  I figure why not hype something up you only get to play the number one team in the land, but once in a blue moon why not.  It had many people talking about it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 09, 2006, 12:29:27 AM
Quote from: Lboogz15 on February 09, 2006, 12:21:48 AM
I figure why not hype something up you only get to play the number one team in the land, but once in a blue moon why not. 

I think your boy Pfouts did a pretty good job of hyping this game up way more than your typical Wooster-Hiram matchup would have been.

Quote from: Lboogz15 on February 09, 2006, 12:21:48 AM
Like i stated to begin with the question was what if? That question was answered in many ways.  It had many people talking about it.

That it did, my friend.  That it did... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 09, 2006, 12:33:40 AM
Never thought I'd see the day when the #1 team in the country felt that they needed to make a statement against Hiram.

But in all seriousness....what does this prove?  What do we know about Wooster right now that we didn't know yesterday?  Nothing at all.  Lost amongst all of the stats and numbers being tossed about here is probably the most important piece of information in the boxscore:  The opponent was Hiram.  That's 3-19, 0 for 2006 Hiram.  Let it go.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2006, 12:40:16 AM
Well, if there was a statement being made, I feel sure that it wasn't for OUR benefit. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 09, 2006, 12:53:02 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 09, 2006, 12:40:16 AM
Well, if there was a statement being made, I feel sure that it wasn't for OUR benefit.

I think that was what I was trying to get at.  It was a statement for the guys out on the court, not for us.  They had something to prove to themselves more than anything after letting Hiram come back and not only make a game out of what should have been another blowout, but they also let Hiram drop 91 points on them.  I think that game left a negative imprint on all of Wooster's players for a lot more reasons than the Pfouts incident.  That only fueled the fire.

Although, I will add, it was to our benefit for those of us who were in the stands watching a team that is a pure pleasure to watch, no matter the opponent.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 09, 2006, 01:24:43 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 09, 2006, 12:53:02 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 09, 2006, 12:40:16 AM
Well, if there was a statement being made, I feel sure that it wasn't for OUR benefit.

I think that was what I was trying to get at.  It was a statement for the guys out on the court, not for us.  They had something to prove to themselves more than anything after letting Hiram come back and not only make a game out of what should have been another blowout, but they also let Hiram drop 91 points on them.  I think that game left a negative imprint on all of Wooster's players for a lot more reasons than the Pfouts incident.  That only fueled the fire.

I didn't get a chance to see the game tonight (grrr homework), but did Wooster really look like they were after a statement?  I seriously would doubt that Wooster felt a need to "make a statement" to Hiram, even with Port getting injured there., and even with their poor play- they still won the game at Hiram.  Was it really clear that Wooster's attitude was anything more than wanting to insure a win against a team that had made it closer than it should have been in their first meeting?

I'm probably gonna be knocked by Wooster fans for agreeing with Wally Wabash (esp. with the game coming up...) that nothing really could be gained by a "statement" from Wooster- and I personally would have been surprised to see such behavior motivating a very well coached and disciplined basketball team.

Also, if Hiram was some big "statement" win, what were the other 8 games Wooster has won by more than 30 points this season, including at least one 30+ win over six different conference opponents?

Over Stout by 49, Denison by 36, Oberlin by 59, Thiel by 49, Allegheny twice by over 30 (33,31), Wabash by 35, Earlham by 36, and now Hiram by 62.

And, of all those, I honestly think the two wins I would call "statement" wins were decided by a total of 12 points: 86-83 and 86-77 over Witt.

Again, I wasn't at the game, but it just felt like this "statement" conversation was a bit much; beyond that, I feel that it's a bit immature to play for the purpose of embarrassing an opponent, and if that is the reason the Scots went for the 62 point margin tonight, I'd find that unfortunate.    :-\  :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 09, 2006, 02:02:22 AM
Beat Stout by 8.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 09, 2006, 05:43:01 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2006, 01:39:29 PM
DC -

First off, when ESPN was in its infancy, Vitale and Berman were great. Now they're caricatures.

Second, Vitale off camera is way different than on camera. He knows the importance of D-3 and all that - he's kind of boxed into a corner.

Third, you're sounding like the fans of indie rock bands that become famous. I remember when "Slanted and Enchanted" by Pavement came out - many of their long-time fans were disgusted that they were getting great press now and were going to sell more than 5,000 records. They thought the band was 'just for them'.

Like D-3, they're for everyone. The more publicity, the better.

But I agree about the media timeouts. But if it ever happens, and it helps in the general financial aid of a school by being on TV - then that's great.

Vitale "gets" D3 -- or at least he used to. I've seen a tape of his broadcast of the 1980 D3 championship game between North Park and Upsala, back when ESPN was in its infancy (I was at the game, so I didn't see his performance as it aired), and he made frequent enthusiastic references to the "they play for the love of the game" spirit of D3. But that was a long time and a lot of dollars ago, and although he had the same general over-the-top broadcasting style he was not nearly the human hype machine then that he is today.

Slanted and Enchanted is a good album, but like most of their fellow bands in the '90s lo-fi movement Pavement could've used a good producer to edit their material, and they didn't really employ a strong outside ear until they had Mitch Easter engineer Brighten the Corners and Nigel Godrich produce Terror Twilight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 09, 2006, 09:44:54 AM
First things first........what a terrific facility Kenyon has.  Very very very nice.  70 million well spent.  I think that would certainly turn some head of some recruits looking to come to the school.

Now to the game..........Kenyon just came out and shot lights out in the second half.  They were on fire.

Kenyon had no answer for Hodgkinson but other than him nobody did anything else.  Once again, Hern is no where to be found.  He has 14 pts but played with NO excitement.  I don't get it. 

Krantz found a way to shoot it 12 times, making 4. 

Denison looked like they were confused in the second half.  Either they stopped doing what Ghiloni wanted or they just choked.   At one point Kenyon went on a 20-4 run.  Game over!!

Now 4th place in the conference is history.  Oh well. 

Again, beautiful facility.  If you get a chance you should go see a game there.

Can we have a show of hands that think Port should graduate????  PLEASE move on!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 09, 2006, 10:02:24 AM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 09, 2006, 01:24:43 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 09, 2006, 12:53:02 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 09, 2006, 12:40:16 AM
Well, if there was a statement being made, I feel sure that it wasn't for OUR benefit.

I think that was what I was trying to get at.  It was a statement for the guys out on the court, not for us.  They had something to prove to themselves more than anything after letting Hiram come back and not only make a game out of what should have been another blowout, but they also let Hiram drop 91 points on them.  I think that game left a negative imprint on all of Wooster's players for a lot more reasons than the Pfouts incident.  That only fueled the fire.

And, of all those, I honestly think the two wins I would call "statement" wins were decided by a total of 12 points: 86-83 and 86-77 over Witt.

Again, I wasn't at the game, but it just felt like this "statement" conversation was a bit much; beyond that, I feel that it's a bit immature to play for the purpose of embarrassing an opponent, and if that is the reason the Scots went for the 62 point margin tonight, I'd find that unfortunate.    :-\  :-[

I think I would throw the EC game in there as the Quakers did manage to almost beat the Scots the first time around bowing to Wooster in OT on a Witucky jumper at the buzzer.  Wooster then came back and thumped the EC, as you stated, by 36.  Also, I would include the Wabash game in there as well.  Wabash always plays Wooster tough at Chadwick, and the Chadwick crowd was ready for Wooster that day.  Wooster responded with a 35 point rout.  

As for the game last night, I stick by what I said.  I don't think Wooster was out to prove anything to anyone but themselves.  They came out with the same focus they have been bringing since after the Kenyon game.  As far as playing not to embarrass the opponent, that's pretty difficult to do when the game is such a mismatch like last night.  Especially, when Wooster allowed the Terriers to turn a 24 point laugher at halftime into a 7 point game with possession to make it a possible 4 point game.  Wooster executed very well in nearly every facet of how the game is supposed to be played. They shot the ball well (57%), they were unselfish (35 assists on 47 made fg's),  and they played strong defense (forcing 23 to's and holding Hiram to under 40% shooting).  

When all of these things are clicking like they were for Wooster, the result is more than likely going to be a Wooster rout against a team like Hiram, or against a team like Wabash.  What would you suggest, Wooster's players to let up a bit after the lead got to 30 or so?  Wooster did have most of their bench cleared at the 10 minute mark of the 2nd half.  

This all reminds me of the old addage, "You're damned if you do and you're damned if you don't."  Wooster wins in a closer than expected game on the road at Hiram, and everyone wonders what's wrong with Wooster that they can't even put a team like Hiram away.  And then last night they win going away and it becomes senseless?!  All I know, is after watching how well Wooster played last night, it would have been a major feat for them to not win by as many as they did.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldwittfan on February 09, 2006, 10:15:42 AM
There was a nice story in the Springfield News-Sun about Bill Brown yesterday. It noted that he is approaching the winning record of Larry Hunter, Wittenberg's winningest coach, probably next year or the year after.  What it described was a good human being who knows a lot about basketball and who really likes to win but also cares a lot about the rest of his players' lives.

Those of us who know Steve Moore, who is also a product of the Wittenberg tradition, know him to be a good human being who knows a lot about basketball and who really likes to win but also cares a lot about the rest of his players' lives.

We are lucky to be able to watch the result of the hard work of these two men.  You Brown bashers might want to think about that.

Wittenberg got back to winning last night against a good OWU team.  Two of the teams ranked above us lost to teams they should not have.  There are games yet to play before we might get to see game number three between Wooster and Wittenberg.  I know there are teams who would love to prevent that matchup, but it would be fun.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 09, 2006, 10:27:34 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 09, 2006, 02:02:22 AM
Beat Stout by 8.

Yup, sorry.  I meant Emory and Henry.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 09, 2006, 02:09:22 PM
I am truly sorry DenisonFAN.  I really thought that the BigRed coudl win out and sneak into 4th place but I as I said early, your future is bright.

As for Wooster, our future is bright, too.  Now that Port has announced that he is coming back.  Here is next year's roster forecast (assuming everyone else comes back/never a certainty):
8 of top nine scoreres return including top 5. Top 5 rebounders and the rotation will include 3 seniors.  two freshman seeing minutes will be sophomores and have a full year for conditioning and coaching (read get better!).

This season is not even close to over and I am already looking forward to next year!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 09, 2006, 03:16:56 PM
Wooster is scary now.  Bring everyone back with another year under their belt.  Nobody can touch them. 
Heck, they crush everyone now. 

Has anyone ever won back to back championships??  Did North Park do it?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 09, 2006, 03:30:03 PM
DF,

UW Stevens Point just did it the last 2 years so they would be the most recent.  North Park has done it as well.  They actually 3 peated in 78,79 & 80.  UW Platteville also won back to back titles in 98 &99.  They actually won 5 titles in the 90's!

Here is a link to the D3Hoops Archives where you can check out the National Champs from 1975 to present:

National Champs (http://www.d3hoops.com/archives/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 09, 2006, 03:36:16 PM
Only 4 titles for Platteville in the 1990s actually (yeah, only...). I saw the 1998 championship game and that team was a wrecking crew. Not sure about the earlier titles, but the last two came under Bo Ryan, who of course is now at the big UW doing quite well still.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 09, 2006, 03:37:12 PM
Not only has somebody won back-to-back championships, it happened over the last two years.  Here's a link that lists past D-III champions:

http://www.ncaasports.com/basketball/mens/history/diviii

I'm not ready to crown Wooster national champions yet...this year or next.  Wooster has the textbook makeup of a team that can't go all the way.  That is to say, I don't think Wooster can win a game against a quality team where they don't shoot 45%+ on 3-point field goals and the score stays reasonable, say in the 70s.  It's very, very hard to play six games in a row where you don't have an off night, especially against the kind of competition Wooster will see in the NCAAs.  When you live and die by that three point shot, as Wooster does, more often than not you get tripped up in the tournament.  

Wooster can afford an off night against Kenyon or Hiram or even Earlham.  But against the teams they'll likely see in the tournament (Hope, Witt, Albion, B-W, etc.) they won't have the luxury of a mulligan.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 09, 2006, 03:39:37 PM
Thanks for that.  Doesn't UW Stevens Point have like 12,000 kids.  That is really fair for them to be D3 to begin with.  Doesn't seem right.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 09, 2006, 04:05:48 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on February 09, 2006, 03:39:37 PM
Thanks for that. Doesn't UW Stevens Point have like 12,000 kids. That is really fair for them to be D3 to begin with. Doesn't seem right.

I used to believe that way, that those Wisconsin schools sure had a big advantage because of their large enrollments.  Then someone pointed out to me that no one (anymore), chooses their athletic teams from their student bodies.  There are no such things as tryouts these days, except to maybe add a couple of walk-ons. The Wisconsin schools, just like everyone else, recruit their athletes from the high school populations.

Now, they may have some advantage in that there might be fewer colleges in Wisconsin in proportion to the state's population.  And, if the local kids mostly decide to stay in-state to go to school, that would aid the colleges there.  But I don't know if this is true, and there's certainly no reason why Ohio colleges (or those from any other state) can't go up that way to Badger kids to play at the various Buckeye State schools.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 09, 2006, 04:20:00 PM
It been beat like a deadhorse on here over the years but the UW schools clear advantage is difference in tuition.

.......that and the longstanding ability to redshirt which they can no longer do.




Does anyone really believe Wooster made or had to make a statement against a team that just lost to Oberlin?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopsfan1111 on February 09, 2006, 04:34:06 PM
Quote from: sac on February 09, 2006, 04:20:00 PM
Does anyone really believe Wooster made or had to make a statement against a team that just lost to Oberlin?

I don't believe Wooster was concerned with making a 'statement'.  Maybe we can put this 'statement' discussion to rest...Wooster is better than Hiram, Wooster played hard, played focused, and played well last night...they were doing what they are supposed to do as a basketball team, regardless of the opponent.  I don't think they were trying to make an example of Hiram, if they had wanted to make an example, the starters would have been left in and the margin of victory would have been even greater than 64...the only statement made was probably one that has been in the making the entire year, Wooster is an outstanding basketball team. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on February 09, 2006, 04:40:23 PM
This is a change of subject. While I was intoxicated at the Witt Woo game I was getting to my seat and overheard a kid say that his high school team (North College Hill) could beat Wooster. Despite how much I hate Wooster I had to stop and call this kid a clown and slur together an argument about how Wooster or Wittenberg would not only beat North College Hill they would trounce them by 30 to 35 points. Which got me thinking outside the box a little bit about how Witt or Woo would fare against top 25 D1 teams. Lets  face it, what Woo did from behind the arc in the first half might have been one of the nastiest things I have ever seen and would put a hammer down on a lot of D1 teams, and Witt's big men could easily put double doubles on some D1 frontcourts. Is there any opinions on this?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 09, 2006, 04:45:03 PM
Wooster wouldn't have been able to get over half of their 3's off vs a top 25 D1 team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 09, 2006, 05:09:48 PM
A top D-1 team? No chance.

Against the middling D-1 teams - if they have a matchup advantage and don't have a corresponding matchup weakness.

Against the bottom 100 or so? Yep.

Oh, and as far as the UW schools (or a lot of the NJ schools) - as long as they play by the rules of D-3, I have no problem with them in D-3. D-3 is probably the ideal for college athletics. It's about competition, and not about championships (which are gravy but not the be all and end all).

If a school is worried about filling up its trophy cases instead of allowing student athletes the opportunity to get the best education possible while competing in their sport then they need to go to D-1 or D-2.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 09, 2006, 05:33:49 PM
Hmm, I'm thinking about that Wooster v. North College Hill argument...win, yes....trounce? Not so sure.

While I know of NCH and Mayo/Walker, I have not seen them play. However, having seen Lawrence North a number of times the last few years, I think a game would be competitive.

Now, I love D-3 basketball....which I will get to more in a few moments. But, keep in mind last year's Lawrence North team with Greg Oden (national player of the year and best prep center in at least the last 15 years) and Mike Conley (soon to be D1 starting point guard). So, you have two of the top D-1 recruits in the entire nation teamed with I believe 3 or 4 other players who signed D-1 scholarships. Factor in a few bench players who probably have the skill, but neither the grades nor money to play in college and that's a fair basketball team. Now, in my mind, Wooster would certainly have an advantage on that team with better coaching (Keefer's just a recruiter  ;)), better depth and obviously would be stronger and more experienced.

An interesting battle I'm sure. I'd still take Wooster, but not by much. And LN would finish at least 3rd in the NCAC in my mind. I'd be intrigued to hear what others say who have seen that particular high school team play.

Now, one last comment (I swear) on women's basketball. My hatred of ESPN's Stuart Scott arises from an ESPN Magazine Q + A from a few years back when UCONN's women were undefeated national champions. Stu said that team, led by Bird and Taurasi, could beat ANY men's D-3 team. I'm sure Stu was quite a player in the IM leagues of North Carolina, but I lost all respect for him as a rational sportscaster after reading that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 09, 2006, 05:47:49 PM
Back in the eighties, when I regularly played in doubles volleyball tournaments in California, there were various levels of play.  AAA, AA, A, etc.  The general feeling was that if a team finished in around the top 20% of a particular level they were as good as the mid-range teams at the next higher level.  The reverse, of course, was also true.  If you finished in the bottom 20% of a AA, you were in truth about an average A team.  In other words, there was quite a bit of overlap.

I don't know exactly where the numbers would fall between DI, DIII, and high school, (nobody ever mentions DII, so I won't either) but I've often wondered.  There are certainly some DI schools that the Woosters and Wittenbergs could beat on a regular basis, but probably not too many.  But there are quite a few more that they could compete with and occasionally eek out a win over.

A few years ago, I wondered how Wooster would have fared against Akron St. Vincent St. Mary with Lebron James.  I'm not at all sure, but I think the extra couple of years experience and maturity would have pulled a Wooster or Witt through against them.  But they'd probably have handled the rest of the NCAC.  In the OAC?  Maybe middle of the pack.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 09, 2006, 06:08:26 PM
Well, considering that those women's teams at UCONN had impeccable fundamentals, and the height adavantage wouldn't be that big, if at all, then that's not as an outlandish statement as you would think. Don't let the hate cloud you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 09, 2006, 06:10:25 PM
An ultra good high school team with some blue chippers and excellent role players would probably beat a lot of D-3 teams, but not the top 1/2 or top 1/3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2006, 06:12:36 PM
The Academic All-District teams (sponsored by ESPN the Magazine) have been selected by CoSIDA, the College Sports Information Directors of America.  In District IV, Congratulations go out to Wooster's Kyle Witucky (3.62, Poli Sci) and OWU's Andy Warnock (3.93, Economics Mgmt) for being selected to the College Division first team.  By being so selected, Andy and Kyle will be on the ballot for Academic All-America honors.  OWU's Ben Chojnacki (3.50, History) was named to the second team.  Congratulations to these outstanding student-athletes!

Men's Academic All-District Teams (http://www.cosida.com/formpdfs/mb06acad.pdf)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 09, 2006, 06:39:37 PM
QuoteDon't let the hate cloud you.

No. Really, I'm trying to look at the objectively. I know much of this is hypothetical, but let's reason.

QuoteWell, considering that those women's teams at UCONN had impeccable fundamentals, and the height adavantage wouldn't be that big, if at all

QuoteAn ultra good high school team with some blue chippers and excellent role players would probably beat a lot of D-3 teams, but not the top 1/2 or top 1/3.

So, wait. A team with less athleticism, at least a little smaller at every position and certainly weaker at every spot would beat Wooster, while a team probably bigger at every position, with as much or more athleticism and a team that plays unparalleled defense would lose to the Scots?

Fundamentals mean a lot. But there's certainly a reason that Lawrence North spanked Muncie Central (the most fundamental team that I saw all year) in the title game last season.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 09, 2006, 06:57:47 PM
One interesting note for a discussion of D1-D3, it's been tried this year:

Illinois 82, Illinois Wesleyan 60

That was played at Illinois' place which isn't a friendly environment, but the box score indicates Dee Brown was the only starter with more than 20 minutes played and the starters only had 43 of those 82 points, so Illinois wasn't doing everything they could for a blow out.

Just one trial and that was the opener for IWU, so take it for what it's worth.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 09, 2006, 07:21:39 PM
I think that if a DIII men's team of Wooster's caliber played the best DI women's team ever (and you can take your choice who that would be), and the DIII men's was able to stay motivated for 40 minutes, the final would be in the neighborhood of 140-15.  Maybe worse.  The ladies would have a heckuva time getting the ball upcourt, getting off shots, and getting any boards.  If Wooster played their own women's team, it might be a shutout if they could avoid fouling.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 09, 2006, 08:22:36 PM
OldWittfan

I haven't looked back at old posts, but I really can't recall anyone bashing coach Brown this year. Is there still a link to the coach Brown article?  I'd like to read it.  I think Wittenberg and Wooster are very lucky to have their current coaches.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on February 09, 2006, 09:02:03 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 09, 2006, 05:33:49 PM

An interesting battle I'm sure. I'd still take Wooster, but not by much. And LN would finish at least 3rd in the NCAC in my mind. I'd be intrigued to hear what others say who have seen that particular high school team play.



Our intramural team would finish 3rd in the NCAC  :-*
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2006, 09:04:02 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 09, 2006, 08:22:36 PM
OldWittfan

I haven't looked back at old posts, but I really can't recall anyone bashing coach Brown this year. Is there still a link to the coach Brown article?  I'd like to read it.  I think Wittenberg and Wooster are very lucky to have their current coaches.



I completely agree with you, goscots.  Steve Moore and Bill Brown are both credits to this conference.  While the Brown-bashing in here has been less prominent this year than in years past, he did take some unwarranted heat over the James Cooper/Witt Admissions thing.  That discussion started right about here. (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4200.600)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 09, 2006, 10:01:16 PM
You can take Uconn Woman's ALL-Time best and I don't think they would be a half decent D3 team.  I respect Women's basketball and the way they have improved over the years.  LOBO, BIRD, Taurasi,Cash couldn't even come close to Wooster... heck has much as it pains me to say I think Hiram would even have a shot at beating them.   

(speaking of Hiram.... where is the talk from the little puppies... are they in their Cage?)

Earlham Controls where they play on the 21st...  If they Beat OWU, DEN, Oberlin... They host... bottom line, cut a dry.

Billy_pilgram.. what are the Vegas ODDS?     
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 09, 2006, 11:22:22 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 09, 2006, 10:01:16 PM

Billy_pilgram.. what are the Vegas ODDS?     

I thought WoosterBNel was the source for getting Vegas odds in here??? ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 09, 2006, 11:27:18 PM
Quote
I thought WoosterBNel was the source for getting Vegas odds in here??? 

Is that Wayne Gretzky, Janet Jones or Rick Tocchet?


And come on Earlhamalum, you know Quakers don't gamble.......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2006, 11:53:01 PM
Hmmmm.....Gretzky wore #99...and now Janet Jones is laying odds....coincidence?   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 10, 2006, 01:19:26 AM
WooBoo, Billy -

I vehenemently disagree - having seen the Big 10 women's tourney live and in person. Some of the women are quite physical and athletic and play with a passion and a heart that is unmatched. It really opened my eyes.  They want to play basketball the RIGHT way.

Billy Pilgrim -

I hope you have six daughters and they all want to play basketball. That would be your just reward!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 10, 2006, 02:15:27 AM
Quote from: andersdy on February 09, 2006, 03:36:16 PM
Only 4 titles for Platteville in the 1990s actually (yeah, only...). I saw the 1998 championship game and that team was a wrecking crew. Not sure about the earlier titles, but the last two came under Bo Ryan, who of course is now at the big UW doing quite well still.

Bo Ryan coached all four of UW-Platteville's titles. He's D3's all-time leader in titles won as a head coach, because North Park's five national championships were split between Dan McCarrell (three) and his successor Bosko Djurickovic (two), although Djurickovic was the assistant coach for the first three.

I'm with Billy Pilgrim on the UConn vs. D3 men's teams thing. I remember Stuart Scott saying that, and my first thought was that Scott had probably never watched a D3 game in his entire life.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 10, 2006, 03:39:44 AM
Between me and everyone else (now) I hope those Six daughters come soon, because that would just increase my pool of women to pick from.  * you know I got nothing but love for you Billy-  The longer you wait the older I get  :)    On the  other hand Me and Brady had a BLAST at PT's... I would of went to Brad's if I was picking the Establishment of Choice. :)  Okay I need to go to Bed... *I swear to God I do.. (bob and tom)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 10, 2006, 07:34:02 AM
Smedindy -

I enjoy and respect women's basketball.  I appreciate how hard the women go at it and the generally unselfish way that they play the game.  I also think that, in a good way, that all levels of women's college basketball can be compared to men's DIII in that they're playing for the enjoyment of the game, the competition, and the camaraderie.

But I just don't believe that, on the court, any women's team could in any way compete with any of the DIII men's teams that I've seen, even Hiram or Oberlin.  I'd make either of those teams very heavy favorites over any UCONN, Tennessee, or Stanford team that ever took the floor.  And, in saying that, I don't wish to disparage women't basketball in any way, although I can see how it's hard not to get that impression.  It's just a different game.

I try to picture good women's post players matched up against DIII guards such as Kyle Witucky or Brandon Johnson.  I see them as having a very hard time getting the ball or scoring if they managed to do so.  And that's if you had guards on them.  What are they going to be able to do against guys like Tim Vandervaart or Evan Will; let alone a Russ or Borchers of Wittenberg?

I see the men being able to virtually dominate the boards, and moreover, to get out on the break nearly everytime, beating the women down the court with heavy numbers, getting layup after layup.  The more I think about it, I can see a Wooster scoring 200 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 10, 2006, 07:51:08 AM
I love that seventh-grade girls basketball cheer, WooBoo. I'm going to have to teach that one to my 12-year-old basketball-playing niece.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 10, 2006, 09:06:43 AM
It's a different game, yes, but what I saw was shooting ability and fundamentals and an understanding of the game - and it's only improved. Plus, I think the women have more of an espit de corps, as you will, which I love.

So maybe I am wishcasting a little bit - but I do think the women play a fab game and I'd rather see them than uninterested men running around doing nothing. (Which is mostly the NBA - not D3!!!)

I have to cover a girl's sectional tonight, and I can't wait to look at a 6'6 junior from Brebeuf plus Maggie Boyer of Lebanon, who may be the best sophomore in the state.

DF - you've just said a lot about yourself, right there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 10, 2006, 09:44:55 AM
Quote from: DenisonFan on February 10, 2006, 08:38:15 AM
They all should be on the end of the court with pon poms.  Period.quote]

NO NO NO NO.  Please tell me you are kidding.  If I ever have a daughter I'd rather her be the worst basketball, Softball, Golfer in the world before I'd rather have her pick up Pon Poms.  If anything cheerleading should be out-lawed!  R-E... R-E-B... R-E-B-O-U-N-D... REBOUND... REBOUND THAT BASKETBALL.... See i'm scarred for life
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 10, 2006, 09:45:26 AM
Once again.  That is my opinion.  My opinion only.

What that says about me is that I don't like girls basketball.  I also hate hockey.  So shoot me.

I am sure if I had a daughter who played I would see the game differently. 

I just think it is slow.  They don't jump.  I just don't like it.

I am sorry if I upset all the dads out there with gals playing.  It is just not my cup of tea.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 10, 2006, 09:46:36 AM
There are many reasons to think Stuart Scott sucks. But that asinine jab at DIII was the tops. And what's up with that eye? It's going to be on his left shoulder soon.

Everyone seems to be in agreement, except Smed, that the DIII men would defeat the DI women. I've NEVER seen a live women's hoops game so I can't say for sure. But the arguments by Billy_P, EA, Gregory Sager, and WooBoo make sense.

DF was blunt, but, then again, isn't he always?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on February 10, 2006, 09:55:58 AM
Witt v National Championship Uconn team------Witt -26.5
Woo v National Championship Uconn team------Woo -23

Witt v All time Womens Uconn team--------- Witt -22.5
Woo v All time Womens Uconn team--------- Woo -21

All time Witt v. All time Woo--------Witt -7
Ryan Taylor goes off for 48, and Brad Baldridge goes for 26 eats 27 boards
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 10, 2006, 10:04:11 AM
Ryan Taylor for 48 that's funny,  Who is going to stop Elenwood, Nelson, Reynolds?  BJ  Harris???   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 10, 2006, 10:54:05 AM
You didn't say that you didn't like girls' or womens' basketball. You said they shouldn't play the game, period. Choose your words wisely.

Talk like that is the reason Title IX exists, and I'm grateful for it.

L'il Giant - you may want to reread my last post, especially the term "wishcasting".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 10, 2006, 11:09:22 AM
That is exactly what I meant to say.

They shouldn't play hockey either.  But they do. 

A top high school guys team could beat Duke's gals.

I am not saying they don't deserve the same rights as guys.  I just think they play a totally different game.  Give the guys the ball they with.  Everyone would be dunking it.  If the game is the same.  Make the rules the same.  Someone must think they play a different game or the rules would be the same. 

It is an apples to oranges debate.  There is NO comparison between the two games except they shoot to a 10 foot basket. 

Obviously there are people out there that love it.  I just wouldn't walk across the street to see gals play if you gave me court side seats.  And paid for my hot dogs and beer!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 10, 2006, 11:48:41 AM
Hmmmm

Free beer and food?  Heck, I'd take it in a heart beat!!  I'd go to a cheerleading compitition for free beer and food.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 10, 2006, 12:16:30 PM
I'd go to a women's hoops game for a free hot dog and beer. Hell, I'd go see "Brokeback Mountain" for a free hot dog...oh wait..... :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 10, 2006, 12:19:22 PM
I wouldn't be dunking it, that's for sure. People on campus hear legendary tales of my mad hops.  :D

And why not make the rules same for high school, college and the NBA? Why do the JV and varsity play different quarter lenghts? Why not have everyone play international rules? So that arguement is invalid. Every level of play has different rules!

And how can you say that they shouldn't have the same rights as guys then say they shouldn't play??  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 10, 2006, 12:23:58 PM
Man, I think we are really off the reservation here with this discussion.  Maybe there should be a separate board to compare women's and men's hoops??

Let me preface this by saying that I have coached both women and men.  Women are, first of all, much more 'coachable'.  They listen and they execute.  Men are more athletic and head strong.

Division I women can flat out play ball.  They can shoot and can be quick.  Some of the rules are different and ball is smaller but it is a good game.  All-Time great UCONN vs Scots..who knows and who cares.  Scots versus North College Hill from my hometown of Cincinnati.  Again, dunno know and I couldn't care less.  NCH doe shave 3 high level Div I signees.  And some say OJ Mayo would be lottery pick right now if eligible, Lebron II.

My last comment on this string and then maybe we can get something going about    I coached an adult women's team in Florida. To get ready for the regional tournament, I scheduled a scrimmage against the city fire department team (former high school and some college players).  I asked them to play us 5 on 6 to get ready for competition of the tourney.  We only lost by 10 and he had the lead at halftime.  Fundamental skills, game plan execution and team play can trump athleticism sometimes...See Princeton, Pete Carill era.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 10, 2006, 12:26:14 PM
What about the Earlham/OWU and SCOTS/Wabash matchups??  And NCAC Tourney seedings? Can we talk about that instead?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 10, 2006, 12:33:31 PM
Quote from: DarkSide-D on February 10, 2006, 11:48:41 AM
Free beer and food?  Heck, I'd take it in a heart beat!!  I'd go to a cheerleading compitition for free beer and food.

I'm there...The beer doesn't have to even be free... just free flowing!!!

Second of all do you ever think they will use a MAN'S ball down the Road?

Third of all I like EC on Saturday.  I like EC in the NCAC Tourney, I just hope they make their ROAD easier by hosting the 1st round.  They have the ability to play with the Top Teams in the Country.  Took Wooster in O.T., 44-44 agaist Wittenberg with 10 minutes to go in the game, and Brandon Miller only playing 19 minutes (fouled out with 18:42)  They took a solid Franklin College (16-6) Team into O.T. 

fouth of all this is the type of team that can make a run at the Big Boys in the NCAC Tourney... they have the talent/experience/ability... the question is will they come to play in the final games of the seasn and in Post season PLAY???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 10, 2006, 12:47:00 PM
Amen WoosterFan!!  Let's talk MEN'S NCAC Basketball.

If Earlham brings their A game they can play with anyone.  Miller can not lose his cool.  When he does he tends to foul and has to sit.  He seems to take every head fake given him.

With the crazy officiating, who knows what may happen.   

I must say that I think the refs favor Witt and Wooster when they play at home.  I just think top teams get that respect.  It is too bad but they do.  Makes it that much harder to beat them.  As if they need any help.

I don't see anything coming replacing a Witt, Wooster championship.   With Port back and healthy on their home floor, it is Wooster by 6.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 10, 2006, 12:47:35 PM
They did use a man's ball back in the primordial day of the sport.

Earlham is in a must win situation, but I didn't like the way they closed out Wabash. That to me spells trouble. I say Bishops in a close one.

It will be interesting to see who Petty starts tomorrow. Will it be the usual five or the five that closed out the Earlham game?

I see Earlham and Wabash at 9-7, and if I recall, the NCAC will break the tie by seeing which team had the worst losss in conference (at least, that was one of the super secret tiebreakers for football that was bandied about a few years ago). Right now Earlham would be fifth in that scenario, with their loss to Denison.

But of course, this being the NCAC, they may just rock-paper-scissors for the tiebreaker.

And of course, to be 9-7, Wabash will need to lose to the W's and beat the Fightin' Formatos (TM). Now if we can just slip one to Wooster or Witt (at home) that would be excellent!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2006, 12:52:09 PM
I've often wondered how Wittenberg or Wooster would fare against a team of Chinese acrobats, or against the champions of the Bipedal League on Planet Zzygxz.  But I guess I'll never find out, since they'll probably never play.  Just like they won't play North College Hill or any women's team (to say nothing of playing the "gals" ::).) 

At present, I'm wondering about how Wooster will fare against Wabash, in a game that actually will be played.  I'm hoping that Wooster has not let their win over Witt, subsequent #1 ranking, and 62-point drubbing of Hiram go to their heads.  I'm afraid they might think they are invincible, which could get them into early trouble against a quality team like Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 10, 2006, 01:10:21 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 10, 2006, 10:04:11 AM
Ryan Taylor for 48 that's funny,  Who is going to stop Elenwood, Nelson, Reynolds?  BJ  Harris???   

And of course Ellenwood could be reunited with Ryan Gorman, so they'd have to stop both of that pair along with BNel up front.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 10, 2006, 01:12:10 PM
DC:
Wooster beat Wabash by 35 at Wabash.  Come on.  It won't even be close.  Wabash is an OK team but Wooster at home?  They are just way to good.   

They can look beyond anyone but Witt.  Period
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 10, 2006, 02:04:14 PM
You know I was reviewing the Wooster Hoops website and I noticed that Senior Day is tomorrow and Joe Agler will be recognized.  I think that is great.  One of the things that mark this program and is how well they take care of people.  Wooster kids stick around with just a couple of exceptions lately: G Robert Sims, F Randy Sistunk and G Ryan Snyder.  And Snyder came back.
    I am sure there are some players that come to Wooster to play and do not get much playing time and then leave but if you make the rotation and even many of those that don't make the rotation stick around the campus and the program.
   It shows how much class the Coach Moore has to recognize Joe Agler for his contributions to the program.  I know that I would appreciate it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 10, 2006, 02:12:38 PM
DF - Also note that the last non-Wittenberg NCAC team to beat the SCOTS was Wabash on 09FEB2002 in Wooster. 

They could be riding high from the Earlham OT win.  They are still fighting for seeding.  And those dang lil' giants always fight!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 10, 2006, 02:19:54 PM
Speaking about the fluidity on the Wooster team, the guy who clearly showed the world how closely knit the Woo team players are was Isaac Ward.  I wud call him the ultimate team player.  He was a star in high school and had every hope playing but once he saw what was available, he gladly accepted his role.  Very impressive.  No doubt that Coach Moore does a great job bringing the kids together.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 10, 2006, 02:25:37 PM
That 35 point loss was an unharmonic convergence of Wooster playing at their absolute best and Wabash pretending they were Oberlin for about 10 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 10, 2006, 02:27:52 PM
OK, a whole lot on the plate.

My last response to the women's v. men's team discussion, though I remind everyone that I was much more interested in hearing how Lawrence North would fare against these teams.

#1. Back in my first year of college, when I attended Penn State, I attended a fare number of D-1 women's games. Mostly, it was to stare at Kelly Mazzante, who Earlhamalum knows personally (but I'll let him share that story at the appropriate time). You see, if you follow Rene Portland and her fanatical ways, you know her stance on lesbians on her squad. So, I figured maybe I'd have a shot with Kelly.

Anyway, Kelly was at least a 2-time (maybe 3-time) All-American guard who ended up as the leading scorer in Big Ten basketball (which is a whole other argument for another time that included Bob Knight's thoughts on women's basketball). But, I would cheer for Kelly and the Lady Lions and they were good. However, in that entire time, I never thought that Mazzante, the leading scorer in the nation, would never get a shot up against a more physical, quicker and stronger male defender.

#2. A few years later, I saw this played out on the open gym floors of Schuckman Court at Earlham. Former Indiana Miss Basketball April McDivitt, of Connersville, was preparing to try out for the New York Liberty. McDivitt played three years as a starter at Tennessee before having a falling out with Coach Summitt and transferring to Long Beach State. So, McDivitt would play against some of the Earlham guys, and other former Richmond players, who were still in the area. Often, McDivitt was matched up against Tyler Stewart, the senior guard for the Quakers. She held her own handling the ball against him, but was never able to penetrate or get good shots off with him guarding her. Now, I agree that Tyler is one of the more underrated perimeter defenders in the NCAC, but this was the former starting point guard at perennial power Tennessee. Conversely, Stewart, who averages about 5 points a game this year, was able to post up McDivitt at will and score whenever he chose. That was the clearest indication to me that D-3 men would destroy D-1 women.

#3. Six daughters............don't joke like that. My fiancee, who played volleyball in high school, has four sisters. Smeds, you're not the first to pull that joke with me, but each time I heart it I get a little more nervous. Luckily, my future wife hates women's basketball. However, she's been a member of the Dawg Pound at Butler for four years and regularly watches the best program in the Horizon League led by Coach Lickliter.

#4. Earlham can play with everyone on its schedule. That's the bad thing. I guess I wouldn't be too concerned if Earlham slipped to 5th and played at Wabash. The Quakers have proven that they matcu up well with Wabash. But, if things don't pick up, they could slip to 6th and a road game at OWU would certainly be a whole lot tougher.

#5. Sounds great about Coach Moore and senior day at Wooster. Sometimes people have to give up playing for various reasons. But, if you stick around and graduate, your contributions most certainly should be noted.

#6. Earlham is honoring its seniors tomorrow. I'm not sure why. They close at home against Oberlin next Saturday. But, Miller, Stewart, Lickliter and Jewett (who is facing a Tom Port-like decision) are being honored. Those guys are four of my favorite Quakers ever...and four of my good friends. I hope they can find some focus and go down fighting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 10, 2006, 02:28:23 PM
WooMix:
I could not agree more.  Do you want to be part of a championship team or not.
25 years from now and he tells his kids he played on a kick-ass team that won it all.
No one will ask how much he played.  The rings are the same for everyone.

I think Denison has some ego issues.  If the players are not willing to park them at the door you are going to have problems.  You can only play with one ball at a time.

I said early on that I thought Wooster offense was a Rolex watch and nothing they have done will change my opinion.  Very well coached and everyone knows their roles and accepts them.  You don't win 20 + games a year for the last decade because you just happen to get lucky.  One year maybe, 10, I don't think so.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 10, 2006, 02:31:22 PM
Now Billy, you're not going to stand in the way if one of your six pack o' daughters wants to play hoops, are you?  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 10, 2006, 03:44:10 PM
My brother has two teenage daughters and is a short trip from crazy. I can't imagine a "six pack". Yikes.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2006, 08:00:40 PM
I just want to clarify Joe Agler's status, which some readers may find unclear from the earlier posts.  Joe is an undergraduate assistant for the Scots.  He was a varsity letterwinner each of the past two seasons; in fact, he was the starting off-guard at the beginning of the season last year.  His playing time dwindled, and by the end of the season he was the last player off the bench.  Joe plans to pursue a career in coaching, and opted this year to serve as a student assistant rather than see the occasional garbage-time action.

I think it's great that he's being recognized as part of Senior Day.  I have to wonder why (or if) the same honor is not being accorded to senior Jeff Clapacs, who (according to the media guide) is also serving as an undergraduate assistant.  Jeff played for two seasons but was mostly on the JV squad and never earned a varsity letter.  Still, he is and has been part of the "team" and has contributed to the success the program has enjoyed.  I hope Jeff also receives some sort of recognition; it don't cost nuthin'!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2006, 08:16:18 PM
Updated (thru games of Thursday 2/9) QoWIs for GL teams (source: Pat Coleman, QoWI Board, Multi-Region Topics (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=2910.105)):

1 (7 overall) Carnegie Mellon    11.000    13-2 (regional record)
2 (13) Wittenberg    10.765    15-2
3 (18) Wooster    10.556    17-1
4 (21) Hope    10.500    12-2
5 (23) Baldwin-Wallace    10.400    18-2
6 (29) Calvin    10.111    8-1
7 (45) Albion    9.727    9-2
8 (48) Lake Erie    9.706    14-3
9 (74) Wilmington    9.273    16-6
10 (75) Bethany    9.250    16-4
11 (78) Muskingum    9.158    13-6
12 (92) Ohio Northern    9.000    12-5
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 10, 2006, 08:30:24 PM
DC

Jeff Clapacs is a junior.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2006, 08:46:13 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 10, 2006, 08:30:24 PM
DC

Jeff Clapacs is a junior.

I see.  Well, then, the media guide is incorrect.  Thanks for the correction.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 10, 2006, 09:04:29 PM
DC - Looked in the media guide and your correct in that it is an error - at least from an athletic eligibility perspective. Maybe Jeff has taken accelerated classes and is a senior academically.

Tommorrows game with Wabash is an important one because I believe is locks up the NCAC tournament hosting if the Scots win, ( I believe the first tie breaker is head to head which gives it to Wooster).  Wabash is a good, deep team. They can put several players into the game with no drop off in competitiveness. I'm sure the Scots are not looking past them.

As the regular season draws to an end I have been thinking about the league honors. Looking on the NCAC site I see that they have put 18 players on the list in each of the last two seasons (6 - 1st,  5 - 2nd,  and 7 - HM). Right now I have 15 players on my list and the Scots games against Wabash and OWU should help me fill out a couple more.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 10, 2006, 09:30:15 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 10, 2006, 02:27:52 PM
Those guys are four of my favorite Quakers ever...and four of my good friends. I hope they can find some focus and go down fighting.

WoW I hate to object to that, but I believe I am going to!  It's okay BP I understand you thought it would of sounded funny to type... Those guys are four of my 2-6 favorite Quakers ever.   I think Grad. School is getting to your head >:)

The sad thing Billy is the fact that this Earlham team is Below .500  With that talent and experience they should be a few games above .500.  Let's hope they can make a late season run to make the season worth wild.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2006, 09:53:10 PM
Regional #3-ranked Carnegie Mellon (owners of the highest QoWI in the region) lost at home tonight to NYU.  That counts as an in-region game for the Tartans, so they'll get just 6 QoWI points for this loss (and only that many because NYU has a regional winning percentage of >.667).  This might help Wooster retain the regional #1 ranking next Wednesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 10, 2006, 10:14:42 PM
Was there a doubt DC?

If anything Carnegie-Mellon possibly just blew a golden opportunity to host a game or two in the dance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 10, 2006, 10:18:46 PM
QuoteLooked in the media guide and your correct in that it is an error - at least from an athletic eligibility perspective. Maybe Jeff has taken accelerated classes and is a senior academically

I had read that many schools, at least at the D-1 level, were becoming more regular in listing true academic standing rather than athletic standing. I remember reading in the Indy Star that this had caused some confusion for some fans. Purdue's football team had started doing such and Purdue's beat writer (Michael Pointer) wrote briefly about this. Of course, I'd be shocked to find that any of Purdue's football players would ever reach upperclass standards academically  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 10, 2006, 10:20:12 PM
CMU had 11.000 for 15 in region games. Assuming  no other changes, a 6 point game drops them to 10.688, with a potential 12 point game tommorrow (10.705).

If Wooster wins at home against Wabash they get 12 points, which would raise them to 10.632 (again assuming no other changes).

If it plays out that way, I would assume Wooster would stay in 1st.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2006, 10:41:55 PM
Quote from: sac on February 10, 2006, 10:14:42 PM
Was there a doubt DC?

If anything Carnegie-Mellon possibly just blew a golden opportunity to host a game or two in the dance.

Well, first, anything is always possible with the NCAA.
But even outside the psych ward, CMU had a good margin in QoWI which only would have gone up with a 14-point win over NYU.  I think it would have been a close decision.  But its a moot point now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 10, 2006, 10:55:39 PM
The UAA is a tough conference, especially with the travel, so losing a home game for C-M is rough.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 11, 2006, 10:33:31 AM
Can any of you Wabash guys tell me if they are sending a JV team over to Wooster to play today?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 11, 2006, 10:48:52 AM
The Wabash site doesn't publish the JV hoops schedule like they do the football games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 11, 2006, 11:48:53 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 10, 2006, 03:44:10 PM

My brother has two teenage daughters and is a short trip from crazy. I can't imagine a "six pack". Yikes.


I guess this is what I have to look forward to???  I have half a "six pack" of girls!  I plan on converting our attic into a Panic Room when my girls hit their teens so I can escape when things get out of control... ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 11, 2006, 11:54:25 AM
:)

We have two girls, one eight years old and one nine months old. A 3-1/2 year old son in between.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 11, 2006, 12:14:09 PM
Pat -

Looks like your boy is in a no-win situation.  His big sister will always be able to beat him up, and if he complains, he'll likely hear the reply, "Son, she's just a girl, what are you talking about?"  And if he retaliates by going after his younger sister, he'll catch heck. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 11, 2006, 12:36:54 PM
Well, we'll see, I guess. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 11, 2006, 02:00:56 PM
Question for the Woo crowd or those who've been to games in the Timken Gymnasium.  Do the WQKT announcers sit facing Lowry their backs to the hockey fields?  In other words, are they on the same side as the scorers table?  I am trying to understand what Ron and or Mike mean when they say that Woo is playing from left to right - if it means that they are attacking the Beall Avenue end or the locker room end.  Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 11, 2006, 02:05:45 PM
I know not the exact geography of Timken or what streets are at either end. But, I can say that announcers/media sit opposite the scorer's table. I've worked broadcasts of two games there, including last year's NCAC tourney. The Wooster guys were on my right side during the regular season game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2006, 02:07:46 PM
Yes, Mike's "line to the left" is on the Beall Ave. end of the court.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2006, 02:36:36 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 59  Wabash 29

Wooster dominated the Lil Giants in the first half by shooting a higher percentage and making 8 three pointers.  :)

Wooster being led by Tom Port with 14 points, Devin Fulk with 9 points, James Cooper with 9 points and Tim Vandervaart with 7 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 11, 2006, 02:43:22 PM
Halftime at Wooster

Wooster  59
Wabash  28

... thats according to the halftime news gentleman.  Not that it makes any difference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2006, 02:53:56 PM
I'm pretty sure its 29, Rooks hit a half-court shot at the buzzer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 11, 2006, 02:55:49 PM
Billy_ since you hate girls basketball... I find it odd that you have a pic. of a woman playing basketball.. Granted she is no Normal Woman... That girl was a gunner.

You going to listen to the Earlham game today?  I'll need you to give me up-dates.  Please don't give up on them, they need this one today.  I'll be work'n, but I'll step out to give you a call now and then. (if your going to listen to the game)

PS.  I don't Believe in Senior day when you have another regular Season home game.  Why is Earlham so Stupid at times...   The true Senior day (as a Senior) is your Last regular season game at home...  Just ask Kenyon!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 11, 2006, 02:57:32 PM
I'm sorry but WOOSTER is FLIPP'N GOOD.  They will hit you from all angels at anytime.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 11, 2006, 03:06:40 PM
You know I'd never give up on them.

I got to thinking, I think senior day is today because next week is mid-semester (really 1/3 semester break) and there is a chance for a better crowd. I think there is some other community day thing going.

I'll start some updates in a bit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2006, 03:13:20 PM
It's Senior Day at Wooster, too (as discussed earlier), even though the Scots have a home game remaining (oddly, it's Tuesday against Kenyon; I'm not sure why.)  The reasoning is that the families of the seniors (Witucky and Agler) have a better chance of getting to a Saturday game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 11, 2006, 03:28:53 PM
Woo took the foot off the gas or Wabash played well in the 2nd half?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2006, 03:34:26 PM
Final:  #1 Wooster 95  Wabash 71

Wooster had 6 players in double figures today led by Tom Port with 17 points, Devin Fulk with 14 points, Tim Vandervaart with 13 points, Kyle Witucky with 12 points, James Cooper with 10 points and Andy Van Horn with 10 points.  Scots made 13 three pointers today.  :)

Wabash was led by Andrew Zimmer with 15 points and Gary Simkus with 13 points.

Wooster is now 22-1, 14-0 NCAC.  ;D  Wooster wraps up the host team advantage for the NCAC tournament.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2006, 03:41:48 PM
Quote from: WooMix on February 11, 2006, 03:28:53 PM
Woo took the foot off the gas or Wabash played well in the 2nd half?

It sounded to me like both teams took their foot off the gas in the 2nd half, and just played 20 minutes of glorified scrimmage without much intensity.  I wonder what the Wabash take is on this question.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 11, 2006, 03:50:16 PM
Halftime in R-Town:

Earlham 32,
OWU 25

Earlham playing inspired, before a larger than normal EC crowd. OWU led 23-19 when I got a phone call. No real idea of what happened other than Earlham pulled ahead.

Two notes:

Markous Jewett surpassed the 1,000 point mark, while Brandon Miller passed board favorite Nathan Stoops for 9th place in all-time scoring.

Matt Shirer leads OWU with 9.
Jewett with 8 to lead Earlham. Miller has 7 and 4 rebounds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on February 11, 2006, 04:02:37 PM
I guess Wabash Doesn't always Fight!! :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 11, 2006, 04:14:41 PM
Well, they at least fought more than Hiram . . .
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 11, 2006, 04:17:22 PM
The Wabash players never quit trying, never quit fighting.  They just don't have the talent to compete with Wooster at this point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 11, 2006, 04:19:40 PM
8:11 left in Richmond...

Earlham 53,
OWU 47


Earlham led by as many as 17 early in the 2nd half.....but OWU has slowly crept back into it
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 11, 2006, 04:24:44 PM
I'd say DC's take on the 2nd half was about spot on.  Both teams were pretty much going through the motions in the 2nd half.  I wouldn't necessarily say that Wabash played better.  

One thing for sure, Wooster played about flawless in the 1st half.  It went from a tight game (12-10 or somewhere in that vicinity) to double digits in what seemed like an instant.  And before you knew it, the lead was 30!  I guess it was another unharmonic convergence.

One other thing I thought I would mention, since Kyle Witucky's poor shooting was brought up in here recently, I think he is finding his touch again.  He has hit 9 treys in the last 2 games on 15 attempts.  Not a good sign for opposing defenses...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 11, 2006, 04:33:07 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 11, 2006, 04:24:44 PM
One other thing I thought I would mention, since Kyle Witucky's poor shooting was brought up in here recently, I think he is finding his touch again.  He has hit 9 treys in the last 2 games on 15 attempts.  Not a good sign for opposing defenses...

I agree ScotsFan.  As someone who was critical of his shooting earlier, it's been great to see him making more shots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 11, 2006, 04:43:26 PM
Oh no.........


Deja Vu all over again

Earlham hits only 1/2 FTs up by 2

OWU hits a 3 with 10 seconds to go......tie game

EC misses two shots just before the buzzer

OT in Richmond: 65-65
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2006, 04:45:55 PM
Kyle Witucky is 44/105 (.419) from beyond the arc this season.  His free throw percentage (.605) sucks, but his long-range shooting is statistically just fine.  (Even prior to his recent 9/15 run, he was at .389, which is good if not great.)

As a team, Wooster is shooting a blazing .451 on three-point attempts this season.  Devin Fulk is hitting an unreal .551 (49/89) after going three for three today.  Andy Van Horn went 2/2 today to push him over the 50% mark (29/57, .509), and James Cooper is closing in on it (45/93, .484), despite going just 1 for 3 this afternoon. 

There's been a fair amount of hand-wringing about what will happen to Wooster in a game where the shots aren't falling.  When you have three regulars hitting with that kind of frequency from the arc (plus Witucky's .419 and Tom Port at .427), I'd say you're pretty well insulated from a complete collapse in three-point accuracy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 11, 2006, 04:47:46 PM
I just got home.. should i listen to the game... they are 0-3 IN O.T. games when i listen???? what do i Do????
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 11, 2006, 04:50:05 PM
Jewett just missed two free-throws... i think i should turn this off right now... Earlham Down two with the ball.. Jewett missed a pull up jumper... 67-69 with 2:00  to go... OWU hit his first free-throw... and hit the 2nd.  Earlham down 4
Miller fouled shooting 2... i have a feeling i know the outcome... Wait he hit the first one.  2nd free-throw is good too.  King hit a 3 for OWU giving them a 5 point lead... then Henry hit a 3 to make it a 2 point game under 1 miniute to go
Earlham down 4 with 30 seconds and the ball... Henry turned the ball over.. OWU's ball..
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 11, 2006, 04:57:37 PM
Just back from Timken--the starters were out for the Scots at about the 8 min mark--obviously a sign of respect for Mac and the Little Giants.  

Kyle is getting his stroke back--and Port is really stroking it right now as well.  I was impressed with the Scots' defensive effort on the Bash big fellas, and their rebounding intensity (26-12 in the first half).  

Not only Kyle, but Andy Van Horn is really shooting well right now--like he's hitting 300 yd drives down the middle.  Also Devin Fulk is like instant offense--send him out and he makes 3's--add it up with Big Game James and. . .

One observation:  Wooster is stronger now thanks to Port's injury--Brandon Johnson, Marty Bidwell and Evan Will, who got more PT after the injury, are playing with more confidence, and Johnson and Bidwell don't play like freshmen.  Bidwell has really made strides, and both he and Johnson have unmeasurable agressiveness and desire--something that can't be seen in the box score.  

There is also a great flow between the players, with the first 9 capable of great shots and defensive plays at any given time--I'm really impressed with the TEAM attitude--they all believe in each other, and play smart basketball.  That, in my opinion, is their formula for success.  

Two games left to run the table in the NCAC--

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 11, 2006, 04:58:03 PM
I'd say something about focusing enough to hold a double-digit second half lead and a two possession lead with under a minute to go.......but instead, I'm just going to finish cleaning.

I'd love to know what would happen if this team actually played 40 minutes of basketball. I think they'd be pretty decent.

Looks like it's a road trip to Crawfordsville or Delaware. I still like their chances in both of those games.......well, maybe I liked their chances in those games two weeks ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 11, 2006, 04:58:40 PM
75-78 OWU with 11.4 seconds Jewett Fouled out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 11, 2006, 05:02:12 PM
78-78....
Earlham gets a steal.. with 7 seconds hits a 3 to TIE it... 2nd O.T.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 11, 2006, 05:02:48 PM
Refs saying this is a two... WAIT A SECOND....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2006, 05:04:26 PM
Final from Granville:

Allegheny 77
Denison 61

Oh, my.   :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 11, 2006, 05:04:38 PM
Are you kidding?????????

Are you kidding????????

Terrel Brown steals an inbounds pass, hits a shot just before the buzzer....initially ruled a 3, the refs confer AFTER THE FINAL BUZZER......and call it a two


speechless, actually speechless at this point
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 11, 2006, 05:07:30 PM
The Earlham broadcast is still running.

You can actually hear a number of people from EC (including the SID and college vice president) discussing the call as they watch a replay of it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 11, 2006, 05:07:39 PM
Earlham says Replay shows he was behind the LINE... can they contest it they are viewing the tape.. bu the refs Left the Gym????
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 11, 2006, 05:07:49 PM
It never rains for the Quakers.  It pours!  Tough one to stomach.  You have my sympathy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 11, 2006, 05:10:18 PM
Sounds like the REF behind Terrell Brown calls it a TWO from the TAPE.  How does he call that one!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2006, 05:11:03 PM
I think the rule is when the refs leave the floor, the game is over.  Tough break, but I'm not sure if they had the power to consult the replay to get the call right (if it wasn't) anyway.  It seems like there was something similar to this in the MIAA a few years ago, but I don't recall if video has subsequently been added to the rules. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 11, 2006, 05:31:35 PM
Welp... it is only 5:20... and this game as made me drink my first beer of the day.  I will start with this one (if it was a bad call)  I will pass on info. from people that was there first hand.  I want it to be un-biased and the tape reviewed if it shows Terrell behind the arc.  The SID for Earlham just said he thought he was behing the arc, taking off behind the Arc and landing in front of the 3 point line.  A student watched the tape being reviewed... but had the same angel the REF behind Terrell had that made the call... and the other ref with another ANGEL called it a 3 at first.  AVIS STEWART a very calm and Honest Man... who is Son of Tyler Stewart had one of the best angels on the 3 point attempt... and said IT was in fact a Three.

Granted this game shouldn't of got'n to that point, but it is a crying Shame that Refs that most likely didn't want stay another O.T. because they wanted to go home made a call and took this game away from being a classic... Crying shame...  I'm on my second beer.. for another bad call from that past
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 11, 2006, 05:41:58 PM
One last milestone from the Earlham/OWU game: LaRon Henry also surpassed the 1,000 point mark.

So, if you're keeping track, that was two Earlham players in the same game going over 1,000 for their careers.

Meanwhile, I'd given up long ago on NCAC games being well officiated. However, I never actually thought a game would literally be decided by a bad call from a trailing official.

And before we get to this point, save all of the "Earlham had other chances to win, there were many more missed opportunities, referees don't decide games".

I posted an hour ago that Earlham should have won this game in regulation. Credit OWU for never quitting and finally tying the game just before regulation ended. This second half was almost a carbon copy of Wednesday's game at Wabash.

However, this game was absolutely decided by an official missing a call on a play that should have extended the game for five more minutes. Now, should Earlham send this tape to Dennis Collins, et al. and the NCAC admits that an error was made, would the official face any suspension? Doubt it, he'll probably just get slotted into the conference semifinals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2006, 05:42:59 PM
Man, that's a tough one Quakers. Who was the crew?

Alas, poor Big Red, I knew them well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2006, 05:46:50 PM
Looks like Oberlin still has some fight in it - as they pop Kenyon.

http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x22758.xml
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2006, 05:48:33 PM
If the tape shows that the shooter was behind the arc, I would absolutely send it to the conference office.  It won't change the outcome of the game, but there's no harm in it, and if it was a blatantly wrong call from an out-of-position official, the league should know about it. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2006, 05:49:58 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 11, 2006, 05:46:50 PM
Looks like Oberlin still has some fight in it - as they pop Kenyon.

http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x22758.xml

Oberlin should try for a schedule next season where everyone they play has to go to Wooster next.  That seems to be the formula for success for the Yeo.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2006, 05:54:11 PM
I can't say much about the Wabash game, as I was covering a boys' HS game this afternoon. I do wish Wooster would post a play-by-play along with the box.

Yes, Wabash always fights, but the fight is relative when you're down 30 to a team that owns you. Last night, I had the pleasure to write a game that was 49-9 at the end of three quarters, and the team that was losing basically mailed it in.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 11, 2006, 05:57:16 PM
What do they call their women's teams up at Oberlin?  The Yeochicks or Yeobabes?  That could give new validity to some wannabe stud yelling across a crowded bar to some cute target of a lady volleyball player, "Hey, Yo, Babe!"

Not my best joke, and I don't have the excuse that I'm an opera fan...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 11, 2006, 06:00:43 PM
I do think they call themselves the Yeowomen. Ever been to a game at Oberlin? It's an experience.

Personally, I think Oberlin should just call of its athletic teams "The OC".

You know, play off the popularity of Fox Television's teen drama. It would also give them that sort of international soccer flavor.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2006, 06:09:00 PM
What, with the 7 or 8 people there?

I remember doing radio for a game at Earlham (I think '86 or '87) when I was a student at Wabash. That was a trip.

1. All the women in the crowd wore peasant skirts, it seemed, and no makeup.

2. The ref, during a stoppage, went to the out of bound line, and called out a FAN, BY NAME, to tell him to quit yelling at him. It seems they had a history. I was dumbfounded.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2006, 06:37:03 PM
Hiram is involved in another nailbiter today:

Wittenberg 91
Hiram 52
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 11, 2006, 10:12:06 PM
DC---the MIAA game with video controversy involved Olivet and Kalamazoo.

It related to a last second shot inwhich the clock was in dispute.

The controversy involved the use of a video replay which was brought in after the fact.....after the officials had left.

It took about a week to sort out the winner......I don't recall who won.

But it was a mess.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 11, 2006, 10:23:51 PM
I am sorry to say that the Big Red is going in reverse.

I have said all year long that we are not a deep team and yet Ghiloni insists on playing guys that are not ready to play.

With Hern leaving hurt that left only Hodgkinson.  Hodgkinson had another big game but he can't do it alone.

Once again Krantz can't buy a basket.

Ghiloni starts Pat Sullivan in the second half???????????  WHY????  Pat Sullivan is the best we can do?  Where is Eberst???  Eberst has the best outside shot on the team and yet Ghiloni plays John Ward and Pat Sullivan.

Denison looked terrible.  For some reason they can not win at home. 

They need Hern back and let's play guys who at least can get the ball over half court. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2006, 10:35:19 PM
NCAC Standings through 2/11 games:
14-0  Wooster (22-1)
12-2  Wittenberg (21-2)
10-4  Ohio Wesleyan (15-8)
8-6    Wabash (14-9)
7-7    Earlham (10-13)
6-8    Allegheny (10-12)
6-8    Denison (10-13)
4-10  Kenyon (7-16)
2-12  Oberlin (2-20)
1-13  Hiram (3-20)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2006, 10:56:08 PM
Maybe Eberst's defensive issues cost him again. Or maybe his 3 TOs in 5 minutes. With that production, I'd sit him.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 11, 2006, 11:38:50 PM
It wasn't only Eberst.
I swear, the Big Red can not bring the ball over half court. 

Can someone tell me why Jordan Krantz has now shot it 6 more time than Rob Hern on season?? 

I blame the coaches.  Once again, Krantz goes 2-11 and I guess that is OK. 

I agree with Smed.  Turnovers have killed the Big Red all year.  And the defense.  They shot 3's at will.   And once again Denison can't hit a three.

I like McMahon.  But not to be my #1 3 point shooter.  20% isn't going to win any games. 

It is too bad they have to out like this.  I think they are a better team than they have been showing. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 12, 2006, 12:17:50 AM
Negative. The officials had not left when the video review began. Where the MIAA ran afoul of the NCAA is when the commissioner decided to overturn the result of the game at a later time based on the usage of the videotape. As the NCAA reminded the MIAA, the game is final once the officials leave.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2006, 01:33:57 AM
Quote from: DenisonFan on February 11, 2006, 10:23:51 PM
Ghiloni starts Pat Sullivan in the second half???????????  WHY????  Pat Sullivan is the best we can do? 

Hey, at least Pat Sullivan has a Heisman Trophy; I bet Eberst doesn't!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 12, 2006, 09:43:19 AM
Tough loss for EC.  Wow.  Two games in a row.  They can not be a happy bunch.

Interesting stat on the Big Red machine.

For shots taken per minutes played Krantz leads the team.  Now why does this bother me?
Here is a freshman shooting .359 from the field and .329 from behind the arc and he is your "go to guy".  HELLO!!  Am I missing something?

Is this OK in Ghiloni's world?  If that doesn't bother him, then we as fans are in for a real long couple of years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan2 on February 12, 2006, 10:37:18 AM
DF,
If the Big Red are so painful to watch, why do you continue to attend games?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 12, 2006, 10:52:07 AM
DF2:
I also like hitting my fingers with a hammer!!  What kind of question is that?

All I am saying is I don't think it is smart basketball to have someone who has trouble shooting the basket ball shoot it more than your two all-conference players.

If you really think Krantz is better than Hern or Hodgkinson.  Then you are the one that needs to be hit in the head with my hammer.

Krantz is a player.  He is going to get better.  But someone must settle him down and if that isn't up to the coaching staff then so be it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 12, 2006, 10:56:36 AM
What's up with the EC's inability to finish a game?  That is 2 games in a row where they have blown double digit leads in the 2nd half.  Looks like they need to be spending a little more time at the ft line during practice.  Their ft shooting, or lack thereof, is a big reason they are losing these games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 12, 2006, 11:15:10 AM
It sure looks like EC is going to get another shot at either Wabash or OW in the first round.  Maybe they can finish the deal when it really matters in tournament play.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 12, 2006, 11:35:43 AM
good easy win for witt yesterday, as if that wasnt expected. witt was able to get a lot of players some playing time, and rest up players. 

witt should move up this week in the polls and regional rankings as carnegie mellon lost.

also, augustana lost as well last night
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 12, 2006, 12:10:06 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 12, 2006, 11:35:43 AM

also, augustana lost as well last night


Not only did Augie lose last night, that was their 2nd consecutive loss in the week.  They lost to Wheaton on Wednesday.  With Hope losing as well to Calvin on Wednesday, Witt could move up to 4th.  That would put 3 Ohio schools in the top 5 with B-W probably moving up to 3rd! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan2 on February 12, 2006, 12:25:32 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on February 12, 2006, 10:52:07 AM
What kind of question is that?

I'd say it's a pretty simple question.  I think it is funny that you've presented yourself as just a "fan" of Denison, yet you've made trips to Cleveland and Crawfordsville to watch a team that, by your own admission, doesn't do things very well.  That just seems very loyal to me.  Meanwhile, you've criticized almost everyone in the program at one point or another, except for one player, who seems to do no wrong in your eyes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2006, 12:57:35 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan2 on February 12, 2006, 12:25:32 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on February 12, 2006, 10:52:07 AM
What kind of question is that?

I'd say it's a pretty simple question.  I think it is funny that you've presented yourself as just a "fan" of Denison, yet you've made trips to Cleveland and Crawfordsville to watch a team that, by your own admission, doesn't do things very well.  That just seems very loyal to me.  Meanwhile, you've criticized almost everyone in the program at one point or another, except for one player, who seems to do no wrong in your eyes.

You've just answered your own question...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on February 12, 2006, 01:32:26 PM
Oh I like where this rivalry between Denison fans is going!!!  Should provide some entertaining reading over the next couple of days.

On a different note,  sounds like a great win for the Bishops.  They won a game when they needed to make plays to not only get themselves out of a funk early but to win the game in the end.  I was unable to be in attendance but it sounds like a game when both teams were hitting big shots.  Earlham has always been a tough place to play and the place a that OWU historically plays the worst.  I have no idea why.  Anyways, great win but I have a feeling that we are going to see the Quakers again in the tournament. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 12, 2006, 02:06:05 PM
DF2,
Where have you been all year?

It is OK to name names.  You have something to say, say it.
That is what this forum is all about.

I have NEVER criticized players.  I have criticized the coaching decisions on who is on  the floor.  I have critcized all season long that we are not a deep team.

I have said all year long that Hern, Hodgkinson and Izzo should be 30+ minutes a game.   

It is the coaches job to reign guys in and get them to play together.

Tell me where I have criticized a player.  It drives me nuts that guys like you come in when the season is over.  Who cares where I have been, games I have seen.  What difference does that make.

I am a DENISON fan.  So shot me.

Honestly, if you have an opinion then give it to me.  Remember DF2, this is MY OPINION, PERIOD. 

As I have said many times.  I am sure that Denison's coaches will not change a thing they do because I have a comment to make.  So if you have an opinion, say it.

But don't give me some song and dance crap.  Either you support the team or you don't.  I am a big fan.  I like all the players.  It is just my opinion about what can be done, or should be done.

Plus, it is always very easy for me to sit here after the fact and be critical.  Hindsight is always 20/20. 

If you want, tell me what you think.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 12, 2006, 02:34:31 PM
Excuse me for taking the bull by the horns, but I feel that it's time that we got this out in the open so that perhaps we can move on past it.

DenisonFan -

I'm pretty sure that what DenisonFan2 is implying is that you're not just a fan but the father of one of the players.  If that's the case, I think that you should be upfront about it and say so.  If it's not true, then please let us know.

Personally, if you are not a player's dad, I really don't have much of a problem with your complaints about the Denison program, although you do tend to become pretty repetitive.  Having not seen Denison play, I have no opinion as to whether you're correct in your beliefs.

However, if you are in fact the father of a current Denison player, I think that your comments on here have been in rather poor taste and should be toned down considerably.  I would suspect that your son might agree with my opinion on that.

DenisonFan2 -

I really hope that you're not another D3Hoops poster having taken on a second identity.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 12, 2006, 03:31:46 PM
I am a former player!! 

I get upset when people lose what I am trying to say.

I actually think Ghiloni has done a very good job.  I am sure that everyone out there has got some opinion about the coach of their teams.  It doesn't mean we don't like the guy.

I am not sitting here calling for the firing of Ghiloni.

I just get upset when I think they poor coaching decisions in critical situations.

I don't sit here and repeat rumors that I hear in the stands at all games.  I am not into second hand comments.

As a former player, I think I am entitled to my opinion.

As far as who DF2 is.   Why would anyone change their name.  Who cares?

I was turned on to this sight for the first time this year and I really enjoy it.
I am sorry if I have offended anyone with my comments.

If the concensus opionion by my fellow posts feel I should sign off for good.

Please, run a quick poll.  Let me hear from you guys.  Simple stay or sign off and I will go with the majority.  And I promise I will not return under some other name.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2006, 05:08:35 PM
It's just that what you think are critical decisions by Ghiloni are said with spite and malice, at times, and seem puzzling based on circumstance and happenstance.

Having seen them play - I say play the kids - play defense, and play a team game. Izzo is a nice player, but he hasn't played well of late and can be supplanted by the kiddie corps a lot of the time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 12, 2006, 05:26:53 PM
DenisonFan-  It is hard to understand your perspective, because I think very few people in here really believe that you are a formal player.  Speaking of hitting your hand with a hammer... you have been hitting us with the same thing all year.  You have been blaming the Coaches all year long.  As an "Ex-player" you should understand there are a lot of factors that decide the out-come of a particular game. (Not one player shooting 2-11 or 11 players playing 16+ minutes)  You are not at practice and for all you know that Freshman could hit every shot he takes.
I played with a kid name Travis Brett... (some of you may remember him scoring 38 points against #2 Depauw a few years ago)  He was 10-15 from 3 point land.  He did that everyday in practice no matter who guarded him.  There were games where he went 1-8 from the field and didn't perform like that every game his senior year. 
I'm sure there are many factors that play into the fact he has Shot the ball 6 more times than Hern.  Coaches are no more perfect then players, and at the D3 level coaches can often be it Tough situation with their hands tide behind their back. (Not Brown of Moore..  ;D  

I honestly don't think you are an Ex-Player... I also don't think you're a father, but maybe a brother or Friend of one of the players.  Regardless I do not care, but if you are not an Ex-player don't be coming around here claming to me.  I have been around the NCAC now for 7 years, and spent 4 years working my ass off with tears, sweat, hard-work, and during those years I have tried to help build a program with Coach Justus being the front runner of Earlham success.  There are still a few guys on this team that I have played with. 
You are often very critical of players and Ghiloni.  Just a year ago they hosted a NCAC tourney game.  A few years ago they were going through coaches and players left and right.  Charles DeLacey was their only player.  I encourage you to stick around, I'd also encourage you to be a little bit more positive on your insight.  I think a lot of us feel like you can be a broken record... put the hammer down.  Sounds like after he weeded out certain players he has a nice group of kids that play hard.  :D     
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 12, 2006, 05:41:17 PM
Earlhamalum:
Thanks for the post.

I admit my delivery needs some work.

With that in mind I think I am going to sign off for this year.  Does it really matter if I am an alum or a friend or a dad or just a fan with some crazy opinions.

I will be back next year to spread more joy around the league.

I wish the best of luck to both Witt and Wooster and hope that one can carry the NCAC flag to Salem.

It's been fun.  See ya next year!!!

Bye Bye for now. 

GO BIG RED!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 12, 2006, 07:55:32 PM
I don't think anyone said you have to leave. I think it does matter who you are; it impacts the perception and understanding of your opinions. It's one thing to be a fan with opinions. It's quite another to be someone with an axe to grind.

Again, I can't speak for anyone else, but I don't think you should leave. It's not like anyone else comes on here regularly to talk about Denison. Just be honest with us.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 12, 2006, 08:42:41 PM
witt,woo,hope and bw would make a great sectional.
wonder where it would be held at?
devos?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 12, 2006, 10:21:06 PM
QuotePosted by: Li'l Giant  Posted on: Today at 07:55:32 PM
I don't think anyone said you have to leave. I think it does matter who you are; it impacts the perception and understanding of your opinions. It's one thing to be a fan with opinions. It's quite another to be someone with an axe to grind.

Agreed. Couldn't be said better.

Look, I love reading about Denison. I love hearing reports from every game. It adds much more than stats. I wish you'd give a report from Wednesday's Earlham/Denison game.

However, rather than hearing any simple report on what Dension did or did not do well, it's just another rant against Ghiloni or some random bench player.



And in other news, I have taken to shooting free throws every day in hopes that the basketball gods might recognize my sacrifice and smile upon the Quakers. Today was my fourth day of my ritual. 94/100 for those scoring at home.

Actually Earlham shot better on Saturday at the line (16-22), but the one miss at the end of regulation and two big misses in OT cost them the win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 12, 2006, 10:36:16 PM
DenisonFan -

Me, too, I agree, don't leave.  Nobody wants you to do that, and we'll all feel badly if you do.  Maybe you can follow Billy Pilgrim's example of shooting free throws for Earlham by instead shooting some threes in your yard for Denison.  ;)

If Denison happens to make it to the final four of the NCAC tournament, and it's in Wooster, and you make the trip (as if you wouldn't), please come by and introduce yourself.  Do it anyway, even if Denison isn't one of the four teams.

PS - Maybe you Wabash guys can also follow Billy's ritual except to make it three-pointers.  Wabash's outside shooting looked awful against Wooster.  What I say is backed up by the numbers, but it was more than just that, the misses were mostly not too close. Inside, they did well, and would have done even better if they'd had some semblance of a perimeter game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 12, 2006, 10:41:02 PM
zosobob - your very first post on D3Hoops and you are asking about Hope's new gymnasium (Devos) in a NCAC room??  Hmmm....

Are you by any chance a big Hope supporter posting under a second (new) name?  :)

A sectional of Witt, Woo, Hope and BW would be a great weekend of basketball but I don't think Hope will host unless the other three teams each pick up another loss or two.  In the NCAA regional rankings this week, Wooster was higher ranked than Hope (before Hope's loss to Calvin this week) so the Scots would probably get the home court for the sectional instead of Hope IF both teams made it that far.  Check next week's regional rankings also because Witt and BW may jump ahead of Hope?

Other reasons why this sectional may never happen:

1.  Any one of these 4 teams could be moved to another sectional in the national bracket just to balance out the draw.   As an example 3 years ago, Wooster was placed in an east coast section of the bracket and beat Ramapo (NJ) in the sectional final to go to the Final Four.

2.  Any of these 4 teams could also get beat in the first or second round and not even make it to the sectional.  It would not surprise me to see any 2 of these teams having to play one another in the first or second round.  Either Wooster or Witt will be a Pool C at large team so that team could be placed almost anywhere in the bracket.  Even Hope and Baldwin-Wallace could be Pool C teams if they don't win their conference's automatic Pool A bid.

3.  IF 3 Ohio teams are all left in the NCAA tourney when the sectional sites are being set, look for the sectional to be held in Ohio.  It is hard to imagine that the NCAA would make 3 Ohio teams travel all the way to Hope for a sectional....but I am assuming that the NCAA is rational and that is rarely the case!  :D

Overall, this question about who hosts the sectional seems premature.  Hope, Witt, Woo and BW all have several games left to play including their conference tournaments which will play a large factor in determining the actual NCAA tournament bracket.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2006, 10:49:22 PM
Funny, at some times all Wabash has HAD this season is a perimeter game. Live by it, die by it, I suppose.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 12, 2006, 10:53:03 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 12, 2006, 02:34:31 PM
DenisonFan2 -

I really hope that you're not another D3Hoops poster having taken on a second identity.

I only have one person who has posted on from this person's IP address, for what it's worth.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 12, 2006, 10:55:03 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 12, 2006, 07:55:32 PM
It's quite another to be someone with an axe to grind.

Indeed. And I have warned this particular person twice about this axe, to which he appears not to respond.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 12, 2006, 11:08:41 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 12, 2006, 10:53:03 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 12, 2006, 02:34:31 PM
DenisonFan2 -

I really hope that you're not another D3Hoops poster having taken on a second identity.

I only have one person who has posted on from this person's IP address, for what it's worth.

That's good news, I'm glad to hear that.  Apologies to DenisonFan2.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 12, 2006, 11:28:23 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 12, 2006, 10:41:02 PM

3.  IF 3 Ohio teams are all left in the NCAA tourney when the sectional sites are being set, look for the sectional to be held in Ohio.  It is hard to imagine that the NCAA would make 3 Ohio teams travel all the way to Hope for a sectional....but I am assuming that the NCAA is rational and that is rarely the case!  :D

Way to premature to talk about sectional pairings..........geez man we don't even know who's in the tournament yet or who they're playing in round one..

(but I know Hope will be playing a Wisconsin school)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 13, 2006, 12:00:03 AM
Quote from: DenisonFan on February 12, 2006, 03:31:46 PM
If the concensus opionion by my fellow posts feel I should sign off for good.
Please, run a quick poll.  Let me hear from you guys.  Simple stay or sign off and I will go with the majority.  And I promise I will not return under some other name.

DF- I think the poll says stick around for the rest of the season.  I am not going to beg you to come back, but it seems like you would be missed around here!

Billy_Pilgram- I think I'll stay way from the Free-Throw line, for the Good of the Quakers!

ScotsFan- You can practice Free-throws all you want.   You can't Simulate the Situation at the end of a game.  The pressure, the fans, the situation is something you have or don't.  You can learn from your mistakes... hopefully they are getting the Bad out of the way now... Hopefully waiting to step up come tourney time.  (Hope is for the weak.... but i'm still going to HOPE)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on February 13, 2006, 09:31:20 AM
I would also like to ask DenisonFan to come back.  We need perspective on the other teams in the league or this forum becomes nothing more then a Wooster post board.  My only thing is that this entire year you have stated that your comments are just "your opinion."  Well many of the comments that have made you so upset are just someone elses opinion.  They are really not personal shots at you.  Just a few thoughts. 

Again great win for the Bishops.  That win pretty much locked up a home tournament game probably against Wabash or Earlham.  Should be an interesting week though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 13, 2006, 09:43:28 AM
Would it be farfetched or just my wishful thinking to conclude that (either) James Cooper and (or) Devin Fulk could be (or are) as great college basketball shooters as is JJ Redick right now?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 13, 2006, 10:11:52 AM
Devin Fulk is as good a spot-up (or catch and shoot, take your pick) three-point shooter as I've seen, at any level.  When he gets a decent look, I'm always surprised when he doesn't bury it.

Cooper is, in my opinion, just a small notch behind Fulk as a pure outside shooter, but of course has many more weapons in his offensive game.  The fact that many teams are now so aware of his abilities and either try to deny him the ball or double-team him (or both) has helped the Scots other shooters to become free.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 13, 2006, 11:05:07 AM
I'm about 90% sure if Earlham wins out for the rest of the Season they will Host the NCAC Tourney Game as long as Wabash does not beat both Witt!!  After tough breaks the last two games they still control their own destiny.  *as long as Wabash doesn't beat Witt... LET's GO WITT. LET'S GO WITT.  GO WITT GO WITT...


BILLY_P  Let's go WITT.  I might even change my user name to LetsgoWITT.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 13, 2006, 11:14:23 AM
Quote from: WooMix on February 13, 2006, 09:43:28 AM
Would it be farfetched or just my wishful thinking to conclude that (either) James Cooper and (or) Devin Fulk could be (or are) as great college basketball shooters as is JJ Redick right now?

I think Wooster could give the Pistons a good game.  In a best of seven, I'd take Detroit in seven games, but only because they'd have the home court advantage.  The Scots would make it respectable. 

Seriously...you're drowning in the kool aid right now. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on February 13, 2006, 11:54:51 AM
You can't even compare Fulk and Coop to Redick.  Redick does more running around while the play is developing than anyone in college basketball today.  He reminds me a lot of Reggie Miller's ability to use screens to get open and hit off-balance treys.  Coop and Fulk are great shooters, don't get me wrong, but they don't compare to Redick at all, which is why they play DIII and J.J. is the creme de la creme of DI.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 13, 2006, 12:05:33 PM
I wasn't comparing Fulk or Cooper to anyone as "players", only regarding their shooting abilities.  Fulk is a very nice DIII player but could not play DI, he just doesn't have the game.  Cooper, I think, could play mid-level DI, although he'd have to improve his defense to get much playing time.

But I still say, just as an outside shooter when he has a good look, that Devin Fulk isn't far behind anyone and Cooper isn't that far behind him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 13, 2006, 01:12:23 PM
i love it how someone on this board actual cheers for witt besides the 2-3 witt fans on here.

lzboogz or whatever ur name is-if hiram has the potential to upset teams dont they need a more hostile environment than 176 people-come on thats nearing the womens games-ba dum ching
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 13, 2006, 01:52:19 PM
pennstghs-  I only have one reason and one reason only to be a Witt. Fan right now... and it will be short lived.   :) But Earlham needs to take care of business First of all at Denison.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2006, 01:59:30 PM
Earlhamalum -

I don't think so. I think it's based on the rankings of the teams you lost to, so Wabash would win that tiebreaker. At least, that's how I remember it a few years ago. The NCAC may have changed its mind.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 13, 2006, 03:55:45 PM
Holy COW

Does anybody realize how much more difficult it is to get a 3 point shot off at the D1 level vs D3.?

Kool Aid.........some have gone straight for the bottle of Scotch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 13, 2006, 04:18:11 PM
Quote from: sac on February 13, 2006, 03:55:45 PM
Holy COW

Does anybody realize how much more difficult it is to get a 3 point shot off at the D1 level vs D3.?

Kool Aid.........some have gone straight for the bottle of Scotch.

Are you referring to me?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 13, 2006, 04:20:44 PM
Actually I don't know.........I just saw the comment of two Wooster's playing being on par with Reddick in 3 point shooting.

Its just a whole nother level at D1
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2006, 04:25:58 PM
I'm sure the best D-3 shooters could compete at some level in D-1. Heck, Bobby Riddell is playing minutes at Purdue (well, mostly out of desparation as the #9 player ).

However, even if you're playing in the Southern Conference or Atlantic Sun you have stronger and faster players on the entire roster than most of D-3 (save for walk ons and projects).

Dregs of D-1, yeah, sure, but for the top 300 teams or so probably there's no way they could help much more than a 3-point shooter you put in when you're down 12 with a minute to go and hope that miracles happen, if that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on February 13, 2006, 04:26:36 PM
Comparing Cooper and Fulk to Redick is one of the funniest things I have heard for a while. What are  these Wooster fans going to come up with next.......
-Is Cooper a lottery pick?
-Can Vandervart guard Shaq?
-Could Port be in the NBA dunk contest?

NO........

ps. Witt is coming off at a 7.5 point favorite at Wabash
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 13, 2006, 04:29:01 PM
Smedindy-  Actually i'm about 99% sure if both teams are split with the head-up.  It goes to who beat the Highest Seed in the NCAC.  Earlham's Win against OWU would allow them to Host.  If Wabash Beats Wittenberg on Wed. and for some odd reason lose to Kenyon and Earlham Wins out... Wabash would host assuming Witt. Finishes 2nd.  So Wabash could host for sure if they win on Wed. and Earlham will host if they beat Denison and Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2006, 04:35:23 PM
see - that's not what I heard in football, though. It goes the reverse - who you lost to, not who you beat.

I'll email the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 13, 2006, 04:38:08 PM
The more I think about it, the more I think smeds is right here.  While the "who did you lose to" tiebreak favors Wabash, I really don't like it as opposed to a "who did you beat" tiebreak.  I think the team with the most significant accomplishment should be rewarded ahead of the team with the less lackluster loss.  

Either way, Wabash and Earlham are probably playing on the 21st for the right to get throttled by Duke Uni...er...Wooster in the semis.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 13, 2006, 04:44:20 PM
I talked to a reliable person on Saturday...  Coach Justus and he informed me if they win out and Wabash does not beat Witt.  They will Host.  But feel free to email the NCAC.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 13, 2006, 06:26:51 PM
Great Lakes teams in top 100 QoWI (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=2910.105), and my prediction for this week's regional rankings:

1. (6th nationally) Carnegie Mellon    10.938    13-3
2. (11) Wooster    10.737    18-1
3. (14) Wittenberg    10.667    16-2
4. (19) Baldwin-Wallace    10.333    19-2
5. (21) Hope    10.267    13-2
6. (26) Calvin    10.200    9-1
7. (41) Albion    9.833    10-2
8. (74) Lake Erie    9.278    15-3
9. (77) Bethany    9.250    16-4

Projected rankings:
1. Wooster
2. Wittenberg
3. Baldwin-Wallace
4. Carnegie Mellon
5. Hope
6. Calvin

Actually, 2-6 looks like a crap shoot to me, and any/all of them could be tied.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 13, 2006, 06:31:56 PM
I don't think it's at all an off-the-wall or outlandish statement to say that any terrific DIII shooter, such as a Devin Fulk, is comparable, as a shooter, to someone in DI.  I was, and am, talking only about shooting.  Not the ability to get off one's own shot, which Fulk has only limited ability to do even in DIII.  But the ability to drain the ball if the opening is there.  After all, as was made clear in the movie Hoosiers, the basket is still only ten feet high in DI, and the arc is the same distance from the hoop.

Basically, I'm talking about a game of long-distance horse.  In my opinion, Fulk could hang with almost anyone from out there.  He may not win, but he'd be competitive. There are almost certainly a fair number of other shooters of that ability lurking around in the DIII ranks.  That's not at all to say they're anywhere near being DI ballplayers, or could get off a shot without lots of help in DI.  But they can shoot the ball, period.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 13, 2006, 06:45:06 PM
Billy_P... a game of horse (please repeat convo. from earlier today, having to do with horse)... Come on WoosterBooster.. PLEASE do not go there.  A lot of people including myself could hang with great shooters... Granted I wouldn't put myself right there now, a game of long range horse...  I mean I have some unbelievable shots in HORSE that I would love to see J.J. hit.  You just can't compare apples and oranges.  I could see many High School players that could hang with them in Horse... New topic Please.   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 13, 2006, 07:00:13 PM
Quote from: WooMix on February 13, 2006, 09:43:28 AM
Would it be farfetched or just my wishful thinking to conclude that (either) James Cooper and (or) Devin Fulk could be (or are) as great college basketball shooters as is JJ Redick right now?

Okay, some of you thought WooMix was asserting that Fulk and Cooper were as good players as Redick, and have had lots of fun ridiculing this notion.  Of course, that's clearly not what he said, and drawing that meaning from this question is at least as ridiculous as the question you think he asked. 

The only reasonable interpretation of WooMix's question is that he is comparing their pure shooting ability, which is what he actually asked.  Now earlhamalum asserts that "a lot of people," including himself, are as good at pure shooting as Redick.  Now, I don't know Redick (or EA) from Adam, but if that's true, than WooMix's question isn't all that far-fetched, is it?  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2006, 07:18:23 PM
Oh, you know it's true that some past Quaker could light it up!

I'd take Josh Estelle over anyone in horse, though, but I think almost every D-1 team has a couple like him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 13, 2006, 08:22:21 PM
wow uconn is outrebounding everyone lately-just like wittenberg-maybe witt can compete in the big east because they are a really good rebounding team.
yes i am being sarcastic.

how can anyone compare wooster to duke-it wouldnt even be close. d1 shooters have the ability to create their own shots, not saying wooster doesnt, but not at as high of a level
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 13, 2006, 08:35:39 PM
QuoteNow earlhamalum asserts that "a lot of people," including himself, are as good at pure shooting as Redick.  Now, I don't know Redick (or EA) from Adam, but if that's true, than WooMix's question isn't all that far-fetched, is it?   

That is in fact my assertion. I think that Devin Fulk, James Cooper or Billy_Pilgrim could beat J.J. Redick in a game of HORSE on a good day.

Actually I don't think that Wooster Booster's claims was that far fetched...in fact, I think he understated. Back in my playing days at Earlham, several players and I would play hour long games of HORSE that would eventually lead us to make rules such as made shots that hit the rim counted as misses.

There are plenty of great stand still shooters who could make 25 or so straight 3's or 50 straight FTs playing at various levels of basketball. So, in fact, I think that assertion is true. However, I'm just not certain of how impressive being as good a stand still shooter as J.J. Redick.

The story earlhamalum alludes to is the aforementioned games of HORSE that would go on for hours (because of made shots, not because we sucked). Oh, and for the record, it was only 93/100 at the line for me this afternoon. Maybe I'm getting Earlham's week worth of misses out of the way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 13, 2006, 09:41:10 PM
I realize that I am time late on this string.  I also enjoy the posts from DenisonFAN.  Sure the tone wasat times harsh but I was very fondof the passion, especially for a team that has not been traditional NCAC power and has not enjoy any significant discussions on this board.

So if you are reading this DF, come back to the board.  Just like you do not want the Big Red to mail it in for the rest of the year, neither should you.

Do not let the comments/hard questions of a few send you packing.

As for the rankings, I think that BW (1-0 vs WOO) should move ahead of Witt (0-2 vs WOO) and leader of tough OAC.  And of course it goes without saying that I want to avoid BW in the tourney!!  I think they pose the biggest threat in the region.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 13, 2006, 09:54:42 PM
Is the Wooster Website coorect that the Lords of Kenyon visit on TUE instead of WED.  In my days of writing for the VOICE, I would have loved a TUE game to get ready for the THU deadline for FRI's paper!!

Kenyon's website says the same thing, 14FEB and as near as I can tell no one else is playing on Valentine's Day.  At least I am out of town on business so I can listen to the game in peace!!

Does anyone know why TUE instead of WED?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 13, 2006, 10:21:39 PM
I don't know why Tuesday, but the game definitely is on Tuesday.  Surprised me, too.

Aside: I picked up a like new Wooster Baseball windbreaker for $10 at their sports clothing sale during and after the Wabash game on Saturday.  Pretty darned good deal.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 13, 2006, 10:21:54 PM
WoosterFan- That is one heck of a question... ANYONE have the answer to his Question?  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 13, 2006, 10:31:28 PM
yes i know i have a biased opinion, but witt has good stance on hosting a first or second round game i believe if it is at all possible. yes witt has two losses but they are two the top ranked team in the country. the witt, wooster, bw triangle is going to go all around and back and forth up until the selection sunday. the NCAC tournament champ will get upper hand in hosting i believe, yes even if wooster wins out and loses i believe that hurts them. baldwin wallace is going to be nervous because i believe a strong john carroll push could knock them off their pedastol.

pretty much what im syaing is nothing is being decided until the last game has been played so we need to see what happens.

good luck to witt wednesday night. carry on the tenacity we've shown the last two road games and we'll be fine.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 13, 2006, 10:38:41 PM
Quote from: sac on February 12, 2006, 11:28:23 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 12, 2006, 10:41:02 PM

3.  IF 3 Ohio teams are all left in the NCAA tourney when the sectional sites are being set, look for the sectional to be held in Ohio.  It is hard to imagine that the NCAA would make 3 Ohio teams travel all the way to Hope for a sectional....but I am assuming that the NCAA is rational and that is rarely the case!  :D

Way to premature to talk about sectional pairings..........geez man we don't even know who's in the tournament yet or who they're playing in round one..

(but I know Hope will be playing a Wisconsin school)

Sac -- try reading someone's entire post before you quote them out of context (above) and then feel the need to advise them that it is "way to premature to talk about sectional pairings....geez man..."

In my post, I was only responding to a presumed Hope supporter (zosobob) who asked which team would host if Hope, Woo, Witt and B-W were in a sectional?  This was zosobob's hypothetical scenario and question -- not mine!

The last paragraph of my original post yesterday was:
"Overall, this question about who hosts the sectional seems premature.  Hope, Witt, Woo and BW all have several games left to play including their conference tournaments which will play a large factor in determining the actual NCAA tournament bracket."

Sac -- clearly I posted initially that it was a "premature" discussion so your "geez man" exclamation was not justified.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 13, 2006, 10:41:43 PM
Well maybe I'll just quit using quotes........it was just a general response to a general question.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 14, 2006, 09:33:23 AM
I believe Wooster is playing tonight because the Wooster women would not play the early game in a scheduled doubleheader Wednesday night. Which seems silly, considering the women have played the second game of at least a couple of home doubleheaders this year, including just this past Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on February 14, 2006, 09:49:36 AM
...And the Wooster women deserve a say in scheduling because.........????? I mean, come on, they are 7-16 and 4-10 in the conference. Which to my knowledge is WAY below expectations at the beginning of the season. Until they start playing to their potential and practicing like they want to win, which although I haven't been there this year to witness it, I'm sure it hasn't improved, they should play in a doubleheader and at least they'd get more fans that way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on February 14, 2006, 09:58:50 AM
Also, on the topic of sectional hosting, I think the NCAA would be smart enough to host it at one of the Ohio schools, regardless of who given the trouble of officiating in Michigan lately. Given the MIAA overturned game this year and need I bring up the Albion disaster last post-season. Let's just not go north of the border, because who knows what could go wrong next for any team up there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 14, 2006, 10:08:21 AM
In some fairness to the Women's team, they have been playing most of the season without two of their better players.  I know one of their better players was lost early in the season due to injury and Beth Besancon, one of their best shooting guards quit the team for personal issues.  At one point, they only had 7 players dressed and healthy because of the rash of injuries.  I thought I would just throw that out there as to why they haven't quite lived up to expectations this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2006, 10:16:08 AM
MoneyBall -

Some here in the NCAC room would claim that Ohio officials have as many *issues* as Michigan Officials.

Witness the clusterflop at Earlham on Saturday. Oy!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on February 14, 2006, 10:32:08 AM
AHH, smedindy you may be correct, I by no means said Ohio officials were invincible, I've seen them blunder on more than one occasion, haha. Anyway, back to the women's program, I guess I should rephrase a little, the last thing I want to do is upset girls on Valentine's Day :'( haha. I suppose the injuries do have a little to do with the season, but was Barone injured or did she quit because I didn't even see her name on the roster. just wondering. And injuries can't be the sole reason, because if I recall correctly, the women's b-ball team is usually the closest resemblance to a M*A*S*H unit year in and out in Tom Love's training room. But it's actually probably good that the men don't have to wait another day to play Kenyon, the scout team will surely tell you that the days of simulating Tyler Rehm and Matt Formato are longer than any other during the season, knowing that the game situation won't be as tough as the practice days. haha. Good luck tonight fellaz and try not to drain a 3 at the buzzer for good measure.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bigkrapper on February 14, 2006, 10:42:31 AM
Hey i know this is slightly off topic but it is always nice to see some NCAC Alumni out and about.  I was lucky enough to see recent Woo grad Matt Schlingman play in a men's basketball league last night and he has not lost his touch.  Matter of fact he even hit a couple threes.  He had a nice post game in college but he must have been working on his perimeter game in recent weeks.  Shame he didn't have one more year of eligibility, With Witucky graduating, Schlingman could be a nice addition to the perimeter of the Scots, a 6'8" guy that can shoot the three!  (maybe even better than JJ Redick)  Good work Matt! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 14, 2006, 10:49:25 AM
Bigkrapper- Funny you say that... i happen to be in a sunday night league in Indianapolis that Brady Claxton and Joe DesJean (Wabash Alum) also play in.  They have not lost to many steps themselves.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2006, 11:34:34 AM
Ah, I have the tiebreaker scenarios.

Wooster has basically clinched first.
Witt loses the tiebreaker with Wooster if they tie, but has the tiebreaker with OWU if they tie - so they're second.
OWU has the tiebreaker with Wabash if they tie.

If Wabash and Earlham tie - then Earlham would host based on that win against OWU. I think I remember a three-way tie scenario or something, or maybe it's different for football. Anyway - if Earlham wins out and Wabash goes 1-1 then it's a bus ride to Richmond for the LGs.

Denison could still finish fourth but loses all tiebreakers with Wabash, but gains tiebreakers with Earlham. So they'd be fifth if those three teams finished 8-8.

Gheny could also be 8-8 but loses all tiebreakers. Warm the bus up.

If Kenyon beats Wooster and Wabash they have a chance for seventh. Yeah, sure.

If Kenyon  loses twice, and Oberlin wins twice, then Oberlin is in the tourney.  Mind you, that involves Oberlin beating Earlham and OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2006, 11:39:42 AM
So basically:

If Wabash loses to Witt - they must root for Denison over Earlham - and pray the Fighting Formatos don't sting them. (Hopefully, they won't need a Medeiros Miracle this year).

Earlham needs to beat Denison and not fall asleep against an Oberlin team that is actually playing better now.

Does Denison want 5th or 6th? They could slide to 7th, ostensibly, if they continue to play poorly.

Gheny will want to try to avoid Witt if they can.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 14, 2006, 11:47:22 AM
Smedindy- kind of hard to believe Earlham still controls their Desinty with Two O.T. loses in a row.  They can't ask for anymore chances... since they still have a chance to Host and finsh FOURTH.  Unless Wabash pulls off the win Tomorrow!  Should be an interesting WEEK!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 14, 2006, 11:48:19 AM
Quote from: MoneyBallSTL on February 14, 2006, 09:58:50 AM
Also, on the topic of sectional hosting, I think the NCAA would be smart enough to host it at one of the Ohio schools, regardless of who given the trouble of officiating in Michigan lately. Given the MIAA overturned game this year and need I bring up the Albion disaster last post-season. Let's just not go north of the border, because who knows what could go wrong next for any team up there.

I have certainly had occasion to gripe about MIAA refs quite regularly, but thought I should at least set the record straight, the Kalamazoo review debacle is actually a 5 year old issue, so that isn't some recent question mark hanging over the officiating in Michigan this year:

http://www.d3hoops.com/notable/01/videotape.htm

As for the Albion foul at the buzzer, I was as angry as anyone leaving that game last year (and would be happy to avoid seeing COW play in that gym ever again) but, looking back with an attempt at neutrality, that was just a close call at an unfortunate time. Most of us would much prefer that refs save a whistle in that situation for a blatant foul, but a (rather ticky-tack) foul probably did occur. That call certainly ticked me off, but I wouldn't put it on the Sun-Belt Conference Refs in the Alamo Bowl level of incompetence which requires some sort of review of the situation. From what I've read here, the NCAC certainly isn't all sunshine and lollipops in the officiating department either.

In a perfect world, I'd wish that D1 refs could come in to handle the all-important tournament games, but I'm guessing that's not a possibility either.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2006, 12:00:17 PM
That's Wabash's penance for letting the home OWU game slip away, and playing poorly at Earlham.

Though the don't totally control their destiny - they need Witt to beat Wabash.

Wabash does have bodies they can throw at the Witt big men - but Maloney, Stephens, Coffey, Lyttle and Zimmer need to step up and play well to give the Chadwick Crazies another home game.

BTW - if worst comes to worst - I'll go to Richmond and run the computer for the playoff game, if need be, so that the box score will be accurate! That's the least I can do for the NCAC!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 14, 2006, 03:55:44 PM
Quote from: MoneyBallSTL on February 14, 2006, 09:58:50 AM
Also, on the topic of sectional hosting, I think the NCAA would be smart enough to host it at one of the Ohio schools, regardless of who given the trouble of officiating in Michigan lately. Given the MIAA overturned game this year and need I bring up the Albion disaster last post-season. Let's just not go north of the border, because who knows what could go wrong next for any team up there.

As Andersdy pointed out the overturned game was several seasons ago now.  I know all you Wooster fans still can't live with last March but the officials from the Wooster/Albion game were NOT from Michigan.......the MIAA  or the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 14, 2006, 08:01:41 PM
Wooster score anyone?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 14, 2006, 08:10:17 PM
Halftime score

Wooster 55
Kenyon 33

Coop leading all scorers with 16
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 14, 2006, 08:15:20 PM
Witucky goes over 1000 points for his career with his first three point shot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 14, 2006, 08:29:42 PM
13:08 to go at Wooster.  They got 72 and are up by 30.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 14, 2006, 08:32:06 PM
Evan Will is having a career game - 13 points, 10 rebounds in just 12 minutes of play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 14, 2006, 08:50:24 PM
Final:  Wooster 97  Kenyon 72

Wooster clinches their 11th NCAC regular season title!   :)

Wooster had 5 players in double figures tonight led by James Cooper with 21 points, Tim Vandervaart with 13 points, Evan Will with 13 points, Tom Port with 11 markers and Brandon Johnson with 10 points.

Wooster is now 23-1, 15-0 in the NCAC!  ;D  Next game at OWU on 2/18.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 14, 2006, 08:55:29 PM
Just another win for us.  Now I have to look for small things in order to be excited about the game.  Two things that excited me about the Woo/Kenyon game:

1.  Congrats to Kenyon for holding Woo under their average or rather below 100 points
2.  Joe Agler played!  Did he like just come out of retirement?  :)

Congrats to Woo for winning the NCAC regular season title.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 14, 2006, 09:11:27 PM
Congrats to Kyle on joining the 1000 point club!

and congrats to the Scots- NCAC Regular Season Champs! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 14, 2006, 09:24:57 PM
Smeds and Wally-

Wabash has played Witt tough at home the last few years- couple of fairly close games and some overtimes- what do you think their chances are tomorrow night? I know Wabash started off cold in the first meeting, but playing in front of the 'crazies' willl hopefully get them jump started this time around.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2006, 11:24:53 PM
They have a chance if the post players come out ready to play, and the guards can shoot well. Wabash hung tough against IWU, and played Wooster tough for 20 minutes before impersonating Hiram in the final 20. It will be tough, but there's a chance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 12:19:24 AM
Wabash has a better chance against Witt than they do Wooster because Witt's style of play is more conducive to keeping Wabash in the game...that is to say Witt likes lower a slower, lower scoring game.  It's tough for Wabash to keep up with Wooster's pace. 

I agree with smeds.  Wabash has a chance if the guards play well.  Wabash has and will struggle in the paint against Witt (but who doesn't really).  Medeiros and Joseph have to hit some shots.  Jimmy Owens has been playing well lately for Wabash and can also shoot.  Look for Mac to rotate the guards early and often trying to find a hot hand.  Wabash is also going to have to defend the perimeter better this time around.  Witt killed Wabash with the three point shot the first time around.  I know Witt's post is strong, but if you're going to give up the 3 point shot to them, the Tigers have the players to burn you with it. 

The Crazies will help for sure, but the number one key is that Wabash has to shoot better.  38% won't ever beat this Witt team.  If Wabash can get that number up a little, they'll have a good chance.  But again, that's all going to have to start on the outside with the guards. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2006, 02:31:56 AM
All the talk this week about what a great pure shooter Devin Fulk is, such as ...
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 13, 2006, 10:11:52 AM
Devin Fulk is as good a spot-up (or catch and shoot, take your pick) three-point shooter as I've seen, at any level.  When he gets a decent look, I'm always surprised when he doesn't bury it.

...has taken its toll.  Here's Fulk's line from tonight's game against Kenyon:
Quote24 Devin Fulk..........    2-11   0-4    0-0    2  2  4   1   4  0  1  0  0  20

Two for seven inside, and aught for four outside.  Zounds.   :o

Y'know, them fellers for OWU sure can shoot that durn ball!  In fact, they do purt near ever'thing well: dribblin', shootin', reboundin', and passin' too.  I don't know how in tarnation we're ever gonna stop 'em on Saturday!   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 15, 2006, 03:24:07 AM
Quote from: bigkrapper on February 14, 2006, 10:42:31 AM
Hey i know this is slightly off topic but it is always nice to see some NCAC Alumni out and about.  I was lucky enough to see recent Woo grad Matt Schlingman play in a men's basketball league last night and he has not lost his touch.  Matter of fact he even hit a couple threes.  He had a nice post game in college but he must have been working on his perimeter game in recent weeks.  Shame he didn't have one more year of eligibility, With Witucky graduating, Schlingman could be a nice addition to the perimeter of the Scots, a 6'8" guy that can shoot the three!  (maybe even better than JJ Redick)  Good work Matt! ;D

Every former college basketball big man turns into a perimeter shooter once he's worn the mortarboard and is relegated to rec leagues, church leagues, and park district leagues. It's as much of a given as the sun rising in the east.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 15, 2006, 10:15:43 AM
I love the honesty in the game summary headline on Kenyon's main athletics page about the game last night.  Couldn't have been more candid.

No. 1 Wooster whips Kenyon, 97-72
Its not that I marvel or celebrate at the demise of others, but its really eye catching when people are very accepting.  I'm sure y'all know what I'm saying.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 15, 2006, 10:26:14 AM
I'll look at Fulk's struggles last night from a positive.  Given that he is shooting over 50% in his career at Wooster, I think it's safe to say that Devin doesn't go into too many shooting slumps.  Given Fulk's 0-fer performance last night from outside the arc, it is probable that he will turn around and have a pretty good night down in Delaware on Saturday.  

*Disclaimer* Never did I say in my post that Devin Fulk is better than JJ Redick or any other DI players, nor did I compare the Scots to the Pistons or any other NBA franchises.  My post was just an attempt to put a positive spin on an uncharacteristicly bad shooting night by Devin Fulk. 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 11:54:59 AM
What's positive about a 2-11 shooting night?  Why not just call it as it is...Fulk stunk last night.  There is no silver lining to 2 for 11.  Not to worry, even Redick has an off night now and then.  I'm sure Fulk's legacy won't be forever tarnished by the bad game he had in a 25 point win over Kenyon. 

At least it's nice to see Kenyon paying proper homage to the Scots on their webpage...Lord knows the rest of the conference isn't pulling their own weight in this endeavor. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 15, 2006, 12:45:11 PM
witt hasnt exactly gotten whooped by wooster-yes they've lost to wooster twice but 3 points in a game decided in the last 30 seconds and 9 points isnt exactly whooped.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2006, 01:01:46 PM
I guess Wooster has risen to the top of another poll: NCAC teams that Wally dislikes the most.  I never though Wittenberg would be dislodged from that lofty perch.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on February 15, 2006, 01:03:31 PM
I don't think its fair to say that Fulk "stunk" last night. Maybe his shots didn't fall (guess there's no maybe they didn't fall) but in watching him play a few times he brings quite a few intangibles to the game such as great passing and defense. So while maybe his shooting touch was off last night is accurate I don't think you could classify his overall game as stinking unless he didn't play as hard and fundamentally as he usually does. I think often times too fans look at shooting stats and scoring stats but fail to realize the importance of a player who provides the intangibles....he will bounce back. Congrats to Witucky on 1000 pts and I do believe with his 200th 3 pointer he becomes only the 5th or 6th player in NCAC history to acheive that (could be wrong) and that leaves him only 216 behind JJ
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 15, 2006, 01:08:52 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 15, 2006, 01:01:46 PM
I guess Wooster has risen to the top of another poll: NCAC teams that Wally dislikes the most.  I never though Wittenberg would be dislodged from that lofty perch.  :D

I don't think Witt has been dislodged. I think it's more that they have company.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2006, 02:27:39 PM
It's time again for my power rating amalgamation. Out of 395 teams.

1. Wooster
3. Wittenberg
79. Ohio Wesleyan
115. Wabash
187. Earlham
220. Denison
224. Allegheny
317. Kenyon
363. Hiram
371. Oberlin
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 15, 2006, 03:27:33 PM
According to the media guide Witucky's 200 3's would place him second on Woosters all time list, 21 behind Matt Smith.

Can Witucky pass Matt Smith? 

First of all I am certain it is not a priority with him.
Second, since he is averaging just under 2 made 3's a game, Wooster would have to reach the final four to give him a realistic shot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 15, 2006, 03:56:35 PM
One nice touch from last night.  At the beginning of the second half, Witucky and Formato passed by each other while taking the court.  They exchanged friendly handshakes and warm smiles.  Two classy guys who've been beating up on each other for four years.  Really nice to see.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 15, 2006, 04:27:17 PM
Regional rankings: http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/?p=128
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on February 15, 2006, 05:57:15 PM
It's suprising that no Wooster fans have pointed this out, but the Scots defensive effort has really picked up since Port's return.  Each of Wooster's last three opponents (Hiram, Wabash, Kenyon) have been held to about 40 percent shooting overall in each contest.  That number is even lower in the first half, when Wooster's top-nine predominately play. 

Last night, the Scots were up 88-49 when Moore pulled the starters, and the score was very similar against Wabash when the bench was emptied.  I'm sure someone will point out the quality of competition is lacking (though Wabash is hardly low-quality), but I just thought I'd throw out what I've seen, not just from what one can gather from the numbers themselves.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 15, 2006, 06:30:37 PM
You're right Wooster Booster, it was nice to see the handshake between Kyle and Mr. Formato. Indeed two classy young men.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 07:47:44 PM
I don't dislike Wooster's team.  Quite the contrary.  I have become a little annoyed with some of the posts here concerning the all-encompassing greatness of Wooster Men's Basketball.  We've seen posters raise eyebrows about how much coverage Wooster's greatness gets (or doesn't get is more like it) on the websites of other NCAC schools.  We've seen posters try to loft Wooster's players into basketball stratospheres that they aren't even close to.  We've seen posters throw tantrums because Wooster players get fouled too hard.  The thing is that the rest of the NCAC isn't obligated to sit and marvel at Wooster's program.  They're good, we all know they're good but they aren't entitled to anything which is often the tone that a lot of posts take here. 

In far more important news....Chadwick sounds nuts tonight.  Wabash is holding their own on the boards and in the post so far against Witt.  The score is 9-8 in favor of Wabash with about 10 minutes left in the first half. 

Update...Russ just picked up his third foul.  This is something I forgot to mention in my keys to the game earlier.  Keeping Russ off the floor is a big big plus for Wabash.  Wabash has had some success as far as not letting Russ go off.  He's on the bench for the rest of the half...Wabash will need to take advantage here.  Tied at 12 with 7 minutes left in the first  half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 15, 2006, 07:50:51 PM
Tied 12-12  8+ to play.  Think Russ might be in some foul trouble... just tuned in so i'm not sure...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 15, 2006, 07:51:24 PM
Russ just picked up his third
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2006, 07:52:14 PM
Earlham-  26
Denison-  18

8 minutes to go
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 15, 2006, 07:55:10 PM
Don't think either Witt or Wabash has hit a three yet...

Refs seem to be calling a lot of charges.

Witt now up 16-14

Who's leading the way for Earlham?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 15, 2006, 07:56:48 PM
Jewett playing really well, has 9 now.

Henry and Gregory also playing well offensively.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2006, 07:57:37 PM
I believe Jewett has 12, LaRon Henry with 10 and D.H for Denison has 10

Earlham 34
Denison 23 

3+ minutes in 1st hafl
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 15, 2006, 08:01:18 PM
Adonis J hits the first 3 of the game and Bash up 19-17.  Less than 3 in the half

Witt 24 Wabash 21 at the half.  Shots aren't dropping for either team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2006, 08:06:08 PM
Earlham- 42
Denison-  25

Under a minute to go in the 2nd half
Denison just put in 5 new guys.. I bet DH's Dad isn't happy with that one.. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 15, 2006, 08:08:46 PM
Now Now EA  ;)

Earlham seems to have this game under control.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 15, 2006, 08:10:52 PM
Halftime in Granville:

Earlham 44,
Denison 29


Nothing is comfortable.......we've learned that. Still, EC doing what it wants offensively.

Only concern is Brandon Miller in a bit of foul trouble (2); luckily not having him on the floor didn't allow Denison to crawl much closer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 08:14:53 PM
Of note in C'ville is that Witt reached the double bonus in the first half.  A big change from last year's NCAC semifinal in which Witt was whistled for exactly 9 fouls in 40 minutes of regulation plus one overtime period...which led to zero foul shots for Wabash in the game. 

Keep up the D, Wabash!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 15, 2006, 08:18:31 PM
Stats from Granville:

Earlham with just 2 TOs, shooting 59% from the field (71% from 3)

Henry with 12,
Jewett with 11

Denison's turned it over 10 times

Hodgkinson with 10,
Shea with 8
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2006, 08:22:28 PM
Witt 24
Bash 21...

Half.

EC about to Start the 2nd Half
Come on Witt... Come on Coach Brown... get your team to play better in the 2nd Half.. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 08:23:18 PM
Wabash gets the first five points of the second half.  Make it the first seven points.  Wabash up 28-24.

Check that...first 10 points.  31-24 Bash.  Timeout Witt.  Chadwick going berserk.

It's a 14-0 Wabash run to start the half.  35-24 Bash about 15 minutes left.

Witt finally wakes up and gets 5 quick points.  35-29 Bash leads. 

Witt is getting a lot of second chances here.  Wabash can't buy a rebound with Russ and Borchers both on the floor.  Wabash will get a timeout here and hopefully come up with a strategy to force Russ into a fourth foul.  Gotta either get him off the floor or make him play matador defense to stay on the court. 

Joseph hits a big three to stop Witt's run.  38-31 Wabash here.  The Dane Train is on the bench getting a breather. 

If Russ is the question, Wabash has no answer.  Russ is dominating the paint here in the second half.  38-35 Wabash still leads.  Just under 9 minutes to play.

Finally Wabash drives the ball right at Russ and he picks up a fourth foul.  This is happening about 10 minutes too late.  Hemingway subs in for Russ and picks up his fourth foul on the inbound pass.  Wild play.  Wabash immediately turns it over.  Bad timing.  Russ won't be out long...now is the time.  Wabash has to make their push right now. 

Witt regains the lead 39-38.  Wabash is going to have to get a couple of big shots from their guards.  It's time for the seniors to step up and get this done.  Ask and I shall receive...Lyttle gets a layup for Wabash.  40-39, under 6 to go. 

Oh this is big shot basketball right now.  What an exciting game!  Just after Witt takes the lead, Wabash comes right back down.  Senior Michael Woods passes up a three to drive baseline and get a bucket plus a foul.  Wabash up one pending the free throw.  Free throw is good, Wabash is up 2.  We're down to around 3 minutes left here.

Right back on the other end Borchers gets his own bucket plus a foul.  The Dane Train is money at the line...foul shot is good.  Witt back up 1. 

Teams trade misses...under two to play.  Russ steps in front of a Coffey drive and picks up a charge!  What a gutsy play with 4 fouls.  I guess that's why he's an all-american.  Witt will have the ball and the lead after the Tiger timeout. 

Wabash forces a Wittenberg turnover after the timeout.  That's Witt's 21st turnover of the game...Wabash has NOT done a good job of getting points off of Witt turnovers.  1:03 left, Wabash uses a timeout to set up this huge possession.

Medeiros buries a triple with the shot clock going off!!!!  46-44 Wabash!!!  In the words of the great Bill Raftery...Onions!  Witt takes a timeout.  Chadwick is LOUD tonight.  What a huge huge shot. 

Russ takes a jumper and misses.  Rebound to Medeiros!  It's getting hard to hear the broadcast over the crowd.  15 seconds left in the game.  Two big free throws for Medeiros here.  First shot is good.  47-44.  Second shot is....good.  48-44 Wabash. 

Witt takes all of five seconds to drive the floor and get a layup.  Timeout Witt, down 2 with 10 seconds left.  Inbound the ball and make your free throws Wabash. 

Wabash gets the ball in.  Coffey gets the foul.  He's got one and one here.  First free throw is good.  Second shot is good.  Back to the four point advantage for Wabash. 

Witt misses the layup!!!  Wabash gets the rebound and fouled with 2 seconds left!!!!!!! Wabash is going to win!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2006, 08:37:13 PM
Earlham up 60-44...

Earlham doing thier part right now.. I guess Wabash is up 11 right now... COME ON TIGERS... Don't LEt me Down NOW...  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 15, 2006, 08:43:21 PM
Wabash 38   Witt   35  8:45 left
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 15, 2006, 08:44:04 PM
I am not a Lil' Giant by boy-o-boy they are giving me the chills.  They went on an impressive 14-0 run to begin the half and I was going nuts!  8:45 to go now and Wabash has 38 up by 3.  Its hard to forsee and upset at this point.  I say Witt gets a close one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 15, 2006, 08:44:59 PM
Russ just picks up foul number 4

6:38 to play Bash up 1- 38-37

BP nice quote! :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2006, 08:49:58 PM
Let's Go TIGERS Lets GO... Let's go Tigers Let's Go...    Denison Coach just got a T.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on February 15, 2006, 08:51:05 PM
What an upset the Bash could pull.... :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 15, 2006, 08:55:24 PM
Caleb lyttle (sp?) just fouled out.  Tigers shoot 2 from here on out.

Witt 44
Wabash 43

Borchers just put witt back up
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2006, 08:58:22 PM
EC- 80
Denison- 59

GO TIGERS... STop Fight'n Wabash
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 15, 2006, 09:00:06 PM
1:03 left to play same score

Greg hill travels and turns the ball over.  Bash Time out

21 turnovers for Witt to 16 by Bash
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 15, 2006, 09:05:21 PM
Wabash hits a off balance three to take the lead!  46-44

Shot closk is off...

48-46 Wabash up and with the ball...

9 seconds left- bash at the line hits the first, hits second
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 15, 2006, 09:11:53 PM
and I thought I hated Witt before..........

congrats to Wabash though, they didn't back in

should be a fun one next week in Crawfordsville.........
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 15, 2006, 09:11:57 PM
Wabash Wins 51-46
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2006, 09:12:03 PM
I hate WITT.. Never in my life will I ever hope they win a game... I hate them... I hate them... I hate them
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 15, 2006, 09:12:41 PM
Congratulations to Wabash for the big one today over Wiit.  51-46.  Who wud've thought.  Impressive (Big) Giants!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 15, 2006, 09:14:28 PM
great game in crawfordsville, congrats wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 09:16:12 PM
What a great win for Wabash tonight.  This is so special on senior night and with the win Wabash will stay home for the first round of the tournament.  

Wow...I'm a little emotional right now.  It's so great to see Wabash get this win.  Huge shots by seniors late in the game...Joseph, Medeiros with the three and two huge free throws and Coffey with big free throws.  This is just awesome.  Just awesome.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 15, 2006, 09:42:42 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 15, 2006, 09:12:03 PM
I hate WITT.. Never in my life will I ever hope they win a game... I hate them... I hate them... I hate them

That's what you get for rooting for them.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2006, 09:58:23 PM
The big shot was by Wabash with :35 left. Medeiros hits an off balance 3 that I have no idea how it went in, but it did. The shot clock was going off, too.

Kyle Coffey hit some big free throws as well.

Witt was just sloppy with the ball, 21 turnovers, and just 1-13 from 3-point land. It was a very uncharacteristic game for them.

Sorry to spoil the Earlham party - have a nice trip over next Tuesday!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2006, 10:11:39 PM
You know what... I know I should of been a Wabash fan... Cause i had 1000-999 odds the team i was going for would of LOST.  Why you may ask?  Cause i'm that big of a loser... Give me the Worst Karma ever... I'm Ready for it!  My basketball life sucks so bad... I was hoping IU would beat PSU... once again.. i should of been Routing for PSU... I'm done.. NHL for Life
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2006, 10:15:40 PM
Thanks for the play-by-play, Wally; EXEMPLARY use of the "modify" button.  I "applaud" you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 15, 2006, 10:58:47 PM
Wow, what a night-- The Bash comes up BIG vs. Witt--a fitting night to honor the senior Lil' Giants with a win they will likely savor for a long time--

And the region has gone officially gone wild with BW upset by ONU at home--

It must be getting close to TOURNEY TIME!!


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 11:05:21 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 12:19:24 AM
Wabash has a chance if the guards play well. 

Medeiros, Joseph, and Woods got the bulk of the guard minutes.  Comibned they shot 10-24 which isn't great but they were 5-12 on 3-point field goals which is way better than they did in the first meeting.  

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 12:19:24 AM
Wabash has and will struggle in the paint against Witt (but who doesn't really). 

Offensive rebounds: Witt 16, Wabash 7.  Hammer, nail, head, bang.  Witt actually had 21 second chance points to Wabash's one second chance point.  That's an amazing stat.

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 12:19:24 AM
Medeiros and Joseph have to hit some shots. 

Boy did they.  Joseph had a huge three to end a Witt spurt in the second half.  Medeiros hit three triples, none bigger than the shot in the last minute.  These guys stepped up big tonight.

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 12:19:24 AM
  Wabash is also going to have to defend the perimeter better this time around.  Witt killed Wabash with the three point shot the first time around.  I know Witt's post is strong, but if you're going to give up the 3 point shot to them, the Tigers have the players to burn you with it. 

Witt was 1-13 from outside tonight.  

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 12:19:24 AM
The Crazies will help for sure, but the number one key is that Wabash has to shoot better.  38% won't ever beat this Witt team.  If Wabash can get that number up a little, they'll have a good chance.  But again, that's all going to have to start on the outside with the guards. 

Wabash ended 39.1%.  Not much better than 38%, but better.  The biggest key was keeping Witt's three pointers out of the basket and making just enough shots.  Witt shot just 32.7% tonight.  

And the Crazies were huge tonight.  They almost drowned out the broadcast on a handful of occasions.  

All in all not a bad pregame analysis.  The bottom line is that if you can play great defense against Wittenberg, you'll have a shot because the score will be low.  Hit a few big shots, and you can steal a win.  That's what Wabash did tonight.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2006, 11:11:46 PM
Here's the updated Regional Rankings (http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/?p=128):
Great Lakes
1. Wooster 18-1 22-1
2. Baldwin-Wallace 19-2 21-2
3. Wittenberg 16-2 21-2
4. Carnegie Mellon 14-3 18-4
T5. Calvin 9-1 18-5
T5. Hope 14-2 21-2

Here's a recap of tonight's scores involving NCAC and regionally ranked teams:

OWU 73, Oberlin 53
Allegheny 81, Hiram 72
Earlham 80, Denison 59
Wabash 51, #3 Wittenberg 46
ONU 72, #2 Baldwin-Wallace 68
#5 Calvin 78, Albion 66
#5 Hope 90, Alma 46

#1 Wooster and #4 CMU idle
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 15, 2006, 11:31:11 PM
Well clearly after tonight 18-5 CMU deserves the #2 spot ahead of 22-2 Hope.  >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2006, 11:52:28 PM
I'm guessing that OWU is wishing they hadn't lost that one-point OT game to Earlham in January right about now.  Still, if they beat Wooster on Saturday (possible) and Allegheny beats Wittenberg (not possible), OWU would finish tied for 2nd (but lose the tiebreaker to Witt.) 

OWU is fairly quietly putting together a very nice season.  They're sitting at 16-8, with their losses coming to #1 Wooster, #4 Wittenberg (x2), a very good Robert Morris-Chicago team (ranked #2 in NAIA-II), Wilmington, Otterbein, Earlham, and Haverford; these teams have a combined record of 137-51 (the first five are collectively 104-15).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on February 16, 2006, 12:09:55 AM
If any one doubted Coach Ghiloni has lost control of this team look at the stats.  They are oficially done.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on February 16, 2006, 12:13:08 AM
soory - should be OFFICIALLY
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2006, 12:16:58 AM
I looked at the stats - and it just seemed again they wre disinterested in playing D or rebounding. Some players are just unreachable - and selfish - at times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on February 16, 2006, 08:40:27 AM
kramer,

Look at Denison's turnovers and Earlham's points off turnovers.

Same as Witt last night.

Here's a proposition for you, I'll trade you Brown for Ghiloni and throw in Hemenway and Huelsman.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on February 16, 2006, 10:36:24 AM
Whoa, witt4ever, you might want to take a step back there.

Have you ever heard of an off night? 1-13 from 3pt land couple that with 21 TOs that's a deadly combination for any team.  You're awfully quick to throw Coach Brown under the bus. Witt never has an easy task at Chadwick.

Take a glimpse at Brown's numbers: In his 13th season at Witt...

-Overall record of 296-69 (.810)
-10 of 13 seasons with 20+ wins
-18 wins fewest in any season
-6 NCAC Reg. Season Titles & 3 NCAC Tourney Titles
-4 time NCAC Coach of the Year
-Led the Tigers to 8 NCAA Tournament appearances

That's pretty damn good.

I am curious to find a coach with better numbers in DIII, I don't know exact stats but I bet there's not too many. I'm sure Coach Moore and maybe a handful more but not many.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 16, 2006, 10:51:26 AM
First of all, congrats to the Little Giants on the upset of Wittenberg.  What a great way to send those seniors off on senior night.  Now, just make one more memorable occasion and duplicate it if (when) the two of you meet up again in the conference semis!!!

On another note, it looks like someone forgot to take their bitter pills yesterday???  

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 11:54:59 AM
What's positive about a 2-11 shooting night?  Why not just call it as it is...Fulk stunk last night.  There is no silver lining to 2 for 11.  Not to worry, even Redick has an off night now and then.  I'm sure Fulk's legacy won't be forever tarnished by the bad game he had in a 25 point win over Kenyon. 

At least it's nice to see Kenyon paying proper homage to the Scots on their webpage...Lord knows the rest of the conference isn't pulling their own weight in this endeavor. 

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 07:47:44 PM

I don't dislike Wooster's team.  Quite the contrary.  I have become a little annoyed with some of the posts here concerning the all-encompassing greatness of Wooster Men's Basketball.  We've seen posters raise eyebrows about how much coverage Wooster's greatness gets (or doesn't get is more like it) on the websites of other NCAC schools.  We've seen posters try to loft Wooster's players into basketball stratospheres that they aren't even close to.  We've seen posters throw tantrums because Wooster players get fouled too hard.  The thing is that the rest of the NCAC isn't obligated to sit and marvel at Wooster's program.  They're good, we all know they're good but they aren't entitled to anything which is often the tone that a lot of posts take here. 


Thank God Wabash beat Witt, or who knows how far you would have fallen Wally?  My gosh, do you always have to be so critical???  Maybe angry is a better word to describe it.  Or maybe better yet, blowing things completely out of proportion and not letting things go.  You've become a little annoyed?  If this is a little annoyed, I'd hate to see you when you are totally annoyed.  Your problem is, you take things waaaaaay to seriously in here.  That's obvious by how you have brought up things that happened weeks ago.  Try letting go!  Another thing, why do you care so vehemently about Wooster's fans' opinions of things in here?  Maybe some of the things that come out are a bit far fetched, but Wooster is enjoying, arguably one of it's best regular seasons in the school's storied history, so if a few of us want to get excited, so be it.  Why don't you come down off of your high horse and try not to take everything so seriously.  I know I for one will start to take you less seriously the more you come out with your own annoying posts like the two I highlighted.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on February 16, 2006, 10:53:47 AM
I agree Jimmy, I'd take him in a minute.  Great win for Wabash though.  It's good to see another team step up and beat one of the Big Two.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 16, 2006, 11:07:23 AM
One question I had regarding Witt is why don't they force the tempo a bit more?  By them slowing the game down to a crawl, it seems to allow decent teams like Wabash to stick around.  Sooner or later it'll bite you as it did last night.  I know Witt had an off night, but their talent level should be able to overcome off nights.  We know that Witt can play more up-tempo than they show almost nightly as evidenced by their 2 games with Wooster.  I know that Wooster's style dictates why Witt chose to up their tempo in those 2 games, but, I just think Witt allows too many teams to stay close, and eventually, it will bite you as it did last night.  I've always heard, the longer you let a team stick around, the more they start to believe they can, not only hang with you, but they might actually be able to beat you.  Witt let 'Gheny hang around way too long, and it nearly cost them that game.  Last night Witt allowed Wabash to hang around, and it did cost them.  I just think Witt would be better served if they opened things up a bit more.  Not to the point of what Wooster is doing, but at least more than they did last night and in most games. 

Also, with regards to the question about Coach Brown vs. Coach Ghiloni.  I think the numbers that jimmy posted are pretty darn convincing.  There should be no doubt, Brown is a no-brainer IMO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2006, 11:27:35 AM
Though Brown has had a LOT more to work with than Ghiloni.

I think Wabash and Witt would play in the finals, so Scots fan you better not wish for that! Wabash will be #4 and on track for Wooster in the semis.


As for Witt's tempo - I don't think their guards could really handle an up-tempo game that well. And with Borchers and Russ being more low post players, it's best to grind it out. Borchers had five turnovers yesterday, and the Witt guards were really sloppy, especially against Wabash's press.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 16, 2006, 11:36:27 AM
While I agree that good teams in low-possession games stand some risk if they have an off night, I think that Wittenberg keeps the pace down, mostly, to play into their strengths, that of having two very good big men.   You need to let those guys get downcourt and set up, otherwise what good are they doing you offensively?

And, against Wooster, it's not as if Wittenberg is accelerating their offense.  They're just along for the ride.  There are more possessions, hence more scoring, when Wooster plays anyone because when they have the ball they often shoot so quickly.  I don't think that when Witt plays Wooster their average time of possession increases, they just get more possessions, therefore score more points.

Actually, those are basketball stats that I'd like to see.  Average possessions per game, and average time of possession.  I don't know if the latter could be delved from existing stat packages, but it would be interesting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2006, 12:04:55 PM
I do know that on the site The Mid Majority - they use the system Ken Pomeroy has developed to track approximate posessions, and tempo, of a game.

As far as time of posession, that could be estimated, but there are enough clock shenannigans with the computer system that it may not be that accurate. I sometimes lose five to seven seconds or more when I think I hit the space bar to stop the time clock but I don't (or vise versa). Many times I don't fix it - I just hold the clock (or keep it running) to catch up. Only in the last three to four minutes of a really tight game do I make sure the clock is exactly accurate, as that PBP will probably be faxed to the news outlets.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 16, 2006, 12:49:45 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 16, 2006, 11:27:35 AM

I think Wabash and Witt would play in the finals, so Scots fan you better not wish for that! Wabash will be #4 and on track for Wooster in the semis.


Oops, you're right smeds.  Guess I don't want to hope for a rematch of Witt and Wabash. ;)

Also, thanks for the replies on Witt's tempo issues. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2006, 01:18:20 PM
Quote from: witt4ever on February 16, 2006, 08:40:27 AM
kramer,

Look at Denison's turnovers and Earlham's points off turnovers.

Same as Witt last night.

Here's a proposition for you, I'll trade you Brown for Ghiloni and throw in Hemenway and Huelsman.   ;D

I think the sarcasm meters of some of you are malfunctioning.  Did you think the "grinny face" means he's excited about making such a trade?  ???

;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2006, 01:43:45 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 16, 2006, 11:07:23 AM
One question I had regarding Witt is why don't they force the tempo a bit more?  By them slowing the game down to a crawl, it seems to allow decent teams like Wabash to stick around.  Sooner or later it'll bite you as it did last night.  I know Witt had an off night, but their talent level should be able to overcome off nights. 

Last night, Witt had practically nothing to play for, or as close to nothing as you can get in a conference game.  They were out of the race for the #1 seed, but had the #2 seed locked up.  Their position in the NCAA tournament is secure, either via Pool A or Pool C.  Another regional loss probably doesn't jeopardize their chances of hosting the regionals, while they weren't a good bet to host sectionals anyway.  They were playing in a hostile environment against a team with nothing to lose who had made this game a focal point of their season.  I'm not terribly surprised that they came out with a performance, the stats of which suggest that they played without much energy or focus.  It sounds to me like thay basically took the night off.  They'll be back; I'd expect the traditional Wittenberg post-loss hammer to fall heavily on the heads of the Gators on Friday, and then they'll probably play quite well in their run to the tourney final at Wooster.  At least, that's my prediction.

Now if they had only had Coach Ghiloni to motivate them last night.... ::) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 16, 2006, 02:19:40 PM
I've been out of the loop for the last week or so.  Are there any games of significance on Saturday?  Who wins a tiebreaker between Denison and 'Gheny??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2006, 02:27:19 PM
Denison would, based on their win against Earlham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 16, 2006, 03:25:03 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 16, 2006, 10:51:26 AMThank God Wabash beat Witt, or who knows how far you would have fallen Wally?  My gosh, do you always have to be so critical???  Maybe angry is a better word to describe it.  Or maybe better yet, blowing things completely out of proportion and not letting things go.  You've become a little annoyed?  If this is a little annoyed, I'd hate to see you when you are totally annoyed.  Your problem is, you take things waaaaaay to seriously in here.  That's obvious by how you have brought up things that happened weeks ago.  Try letting go!  Another thing, why do you care so vehemently about Wooster's fans' opinions of things in here?  Maybe some of the things that come out are a bit far fetched, but Wooster is enjoying, arguably one of it's best regular seasons in the school's storied history, so if a few of us want to get excited, so be it.  Why don't you come down off of your high horse and try not to take everything so seriously.  I know I for one will start to take you less seriously the more you come out with your own annoying posts like the two I highlighted. 

I don't think any of that refutes Wally's description of the general perception of certain Wooster posters and their attitudes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 16, 2006, 03:30:27 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 07:47:44 PM
I don't dislike Wooster's team.  Quite the contrary.  I have become a little annoyed with some of the posts here concerning the all-encompassing greatness of Wooster Men's Basketball. 

Kind of reminds me of a certain NCAC football team on another set of pages nearby ...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2006, 04:01:45 PM
That's why I was staying out of that l'il fray... :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 16, 2006, 04:08:21 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 16, 2006, 03:30:27 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 15, 2006, 07:47:44 PM
I don't dislike Wooster's team.  Quite the contrary.  I have become a little annoyed with some of the posts here concerning the all-encompassing greatness of Wooster Men's Basketball. 

Kind of reminds me of a certain NCAC football team on another set of pages nearby ...

Please don't think I haven't noticed the uncanny sameness of the two situations.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2006, 04:09:46 PM
And the cold reality is the same that Witt is relatively silent on both ends. Hmmmm...you'd think they'd want to "Tiger Up" once in a while.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 16, 2006, 04:11:20 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 16, 2006, 03:30:27 PMKind of reminds me of a certain NCAC football team on another set of pages nearby ...

Wally and I have had that discussion recently. We noticed it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on February 16, 2006, 07:14:04 PM
An easy way to track team's "tempo" if you will, or how much time they have the ball on each possession would be to sit in the stands with 2 stopwatches and start and stop one for one team when they have the ball and the same for the other team, then take the total time at the end of the game for each time and divide it by the # of possessions which is a stat kept by at least Wooster on their Offensive & Defensive efficiency charts. I dont know how many other teams keep track of possessions though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2006, 07:31:54 PM
Here's Pomeroy's stats explained:

http://kenpom.com/blog/index.php/weblog/stats_explained/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 16, 2006, 08:30:00 PM
DC - I gotta disagree with you (does not happen very often).  But any basketball team has something to play for this time of year and a veteran team with a likely two-time NCAC POY should not have let-downs like that.
     While a berth in the expanded NCAAs is just about locked, by no means is home court/seeding locked up.  The GL region is just oo deep and too many things can happenin conference tourneys in the OAC and MIAA to rest on laurel this early in the year.
     WITT and WOO always get everyone's best shot a victory there can make a season.  WITT had tons to play for.
    As for the style of play.  Let's not forget that the "deliberate" style has long been the WITTENBERG Way and Wooster when they had the bigs from Aukamp to Nelson were a deliberate team on offense that played lock down defense.  Coaches (and I am one of those) often preach do what we do best and the do the stuff that gives you the best chance to win.  That is WITT does and it work for 95% of NCAC games of the past 15 years!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 16, 2006, 09:14:13 PM
Pomeroy's page is interesting, to say the least.

After thinking about it a little more, I believe that while you can certainly measure offensive (or defensive) efficiency in basketball based upon points per possession, attempting to measure pace or tempo by possessions/game might be another matter.

First of all, how do you deal with possessions that are ended by turnovers?  If you count them, a ballclub that commits a lot of these will have a shorter average time of possession, as some turnovers come soon after a team gets the ball. 

And what about missed shots that end in offensive rebounds, or several of them in succession?  Is that one possession, until the team either scores or gives up the ball?  Or is it numerous possessions?  It would be possible, from just looking at a stat sheet, to confuse some lousy-passing, double-dribbling but great offensive rebounding team with Grinell when actually it was the St. Mary's sixth-grade B team.

Who ever invented this stupid game, anyway? (I know, Naismith did.) 

Can you imagine the first nerd sitting in those nineteenth-century bleachers who blurted out, while watching an early contest, "See that there?  Where O'Riley intercepted that pass?  Let's call that a 'turnover' on Simmons 'cause he, well, turned the ball over to the other team.  Lemme write that down.  That's one turnover for Simmons, who now leads the league.  You know what a league is, don'tcha, Henshaw?  We just invented that concept last week... And Riley, for the interception, we'll call that a 'steal'.  First time that Irishman every stole anything without getting thrown in the clink... 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2006, 09:20:08 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 16, 2006, 09:14:13 PM
Can you imagine the first nerd sitting in those nineteenth-century bleachers who blurted out, while watching an early contest, "See that there?  Where O'Riley intercepted that pass?  Let's call that a 'turnover' on Simmons 'cause he, well, turned the ball over to the other team.  Lemme write that down.  That's one turnover for Simmons, who now leads the league.  You know what a league is, don'tcha, Henshaw?  We just invented that concept last week... And Riley, for the interception, we'll call that a 'steal'.  First time that Irishman every stole anything without getting thrown in the clink... 

I think what happened was a group of baseball fans went to a basketball game and got bored stiff when they realized that the only stats being kept were points and fouls.  No true baseball fan can watch a game without keeping copious statistics on every possible or theoretical action.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 16, 2006, 09:47:57 PM
I am still upset about Witt... Actually how can I be.  If Earlham wins One of those O.T. games in the NCAC this year, they HOSt.  BASH,OWU,WOOSTER... ouch that hurts to type and think about.  I really want to go to Bash on Tuesday so I can be one of the 10 Earlham Fans at the game.  Ahhh I'm up in the air, I should work... Or i Could take the Evening OFF... HMMMMmmm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2006, 09:49:34 PM
For derek poe's reference, here's where we are with one game remaining (Saturday's games in parentheses):

1. Wooster 15-0 (at OWU)
2. Wittenberg 12-3 (vs. Allegheny)
3. Ohio Wesleyan 11-4 (vs. Wooster)
4. Wabash 9-6 (at Kenyon)
5. Earlham 8-7 (vs. Oberlin)
6. Allegheny 7-8 (at Witt)
7. Denison 6-9 (at Hiram)
8. Kenyon 4-11 (vs. Wabash)
9. Oberlin 2-13 (at Earlham)
10. Hiram 1-14 (vs. Denison)

Wooster has locked up the top seed.  Wittenberg has locked up the second seed, by virtue of a season sweep of OWU.  OWU is therefore the third seed.  Wabash is the fourth seed, by virtue of their victory over Witt.  Earlham is 5th by virtue of having defeated Allegheny in their only meeting.  Allegheny is sixth if they win or if Denison loses; but in the event of a tie, Denison would be sixth by virtue of having beaten Earlham.  In that case, Allegheny is seventh.  Kenyon owns the eighth seed.  Hiram would win a tiebreaker with Oberlin for ninth by virtue of beating Denison; otherwise Oberlin is ninth and Hiram tenth (and no matter what, both Oberlin and Hiram miss the tournament.)

Here's those tiebreakers, as I see them; anyone with superior knowledge, please correct me:
Witt and OWU for 2nd: Witt swept OWU
Wabash and Earlham for 4th: They split, so I go to "best win:" Wabash over #2 Witt beats Earlham over #3 OWU.
Earlham and 'Gheny for 5th: Earlham won the lone meeting.
'Gheny and Denison for 6th: They split, so "best win:" Denison beat #5 Earlham, 'Gheny didn't beat anyone ahead of them (so their best win was #6 Denison) (of course, if 'Gheny beats Witt, that's a better win, but then they wouldn't be tied with Denison)
Oberlin and Hiram for 9th: They split; for Hiram to force a tie, they have to beat Denison (#6 or 7) which is a "better win" than Oberlin over #8 Kenyon.

Therefore the only Saturday games that can impact the tournament seeding are 'Gheny at Witt and Denison at Hiram, and the tourney looks like this:

#8 Kenyon at #1 Wooster
#7 Allegheny (probably) or Denison (maybe) at #2 Wittenberg
#6 Denison (probably) or Allegheny (maybe) at #3 OWU
#5 Earlham at #4 Wabash

I say Denison is "probably" #6 because I assume that Witt will beat Allegheny (by at least 35) and that Denison will pull it together enough to beat Hiram.  Maybe that's not so safe an assumption, especially with the PupDogs playing for the pride of finishing out of the outright basement.  But I'm willing to go with it for now.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 16, 2006, 10:01:41 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on February 16, 2006, 08:30:00 PM
DC - I gotta disagree with you (does not happen very often). But any basketball team has something to play for this time of year and a veteran team with a likely two-time NCAC POY should not have let-downs like that.
While a berth in the expanded NCAAs is just about locked, by no means is home court/seeding locked up. The GL region is just oo deep and too many things can happenin conference tourneys in the OAC and MIAA to rest on laurel this early in the year.
WITT and WOO always get everyone's best shot a victory there can make a season. WITT had tons to play for.

I agree with WoosterFAN.  If Witt were to have won out, they would have had a great shot at garnering the #1 ranking in the GL Region at season's end.  They were 3rd in this weeks GL rankings.  With BW losing, that would have put them in 2nd.  Which means that by running the NCAC tournament, it would have virtually locked up the #1 ranking in the GL region.  Now, they have no shot.  Sure, they are a lock to gain a post-season birth, either automatic or Pool C, but to say that they had basically nothing to play  for last night and that could be partially to blame for their sub-par performance is a bit of a stretch IMO.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 16, 2006, 10:12:49 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 16, 2006, 03:25:03 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 16, 2006, 10:51:26 AMThank God Wabash beat Witt, or who knows how far you would have fallen Wally?  My gosh, do you always have to be so critical???  Maybe angry is a better word to describe it.  Or maybe better yet, blowing things completely out of proportion and not letting things go.  You've become a little annoyed?  If this is a little annoyed, I'd hate to see you when you are totally annoyed.  Your problem is, you take things waaaaaay to seriously in here.  That's obvious by how you have brought up things that happened weeks ago.  Try letting go!  Another thing, why do you care so vehemently about Wooster's fans' opinions of things in here?  Maybe some of the things that come out are a bit far fetched, but Wooster is enjoying, arguably one of it's best regular seasons in the school's storied history, so if a few of us want to get excited, so be it.  Why don't you come down off of your high horse and try not to take everything so seriously.  I know I for one will start to take you less seriously the more you come out with your own annoying posts like the two I highlighted. 

I don't think any of that refutes Wally's description of the general perception of certain Wooster posters and their attitudes.

I didn't realize that I was trying to refute Wally's description of the general perception of certain Wooster posters and their attitudes?  Where did I say that he was false in his accusations?  I can't seem to find anything in my post that shows I was attemting to refute anything Wally said.  What I was attempting to point out was basically that I feel0 he needs to take a chill pill.  Like I said, why does he have to take such an abrasive stance on anything relating to Wooster's fans and how we express our enjoyment in yet another successful basketball season, no matter how over zealous it may get at times.  Sometimes, no response is the best response...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 16, 2006, 10:29:56 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 16, 2006, 10:12:49 PM
Sometimes, no response is the best response...

That axe swings both ways you know...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 16, 2006, 10:39:18 PM
DC - thanks for the update.  I did manage to sign on and get scores while in Jamaica, but kind of lost track of how everything was shaping up!

I agree with your concern about Denison.  They've not been playing very well, but nobody in the conference is playing as poorly as Hiram has for the last couple of weeks.   It certainly is a big game for Denison, since a win would keep them from having to play Witt until the 2nd round.

That makes me think....  Given the assumption that one of the 3 - 8 seeds would have to beat both Witt and Woo to win the tourney, would it be better to play one of them in the first round or have to beat both teams back-to-back over the weekend?  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 16, 2006, 10:58:34 PM
Not necessarily true, imderekpoe.  Should Wooster or Witt lose in the first round and then the other lose in the semis, there is a path to the NCAC tournament championship that doesn't involve having to beat either team.  For example, Let's say Allegheny beats Wittenberg in the first round and OWU wins their game vs. Denison.  OWU then plays Allegheny in the semis. In the second semi, the Earlham/Wabash winner knocks off the Scots.  If OWU wins their semifinal, they move to the championship game vs. Earlham/Wabash and can get a pass to the dance without having to beat either Wooster or Witt. 

Now, I'd put the odds of Allegheny beating Witt at the HPER at somewhere around 150-1 and the odds of Earlham/Wabash beating Wooster at Timken in the semis at somewhere around 50-1 (that's a generous estimate I think).  Combined you end up with about a 7500-1 chance of that scenario playing out per the odds I've stated here.  We could haggle about those numbers, but I think we can agree that it's a near impossibility. 

To answer your question about whether it's best to play Witt/Woo on Tuesday and then get the other in the final as opposed to playing them on back to back days next weekend...I'm not sure it matters.  You  have to beat them both and whether  you play those games one right after the other with a 5 minute breather inbetween or six weeks apart, it's hard.  I don't see any real advantage one way or the other. 

Realistically speaking, this tournament will be won by the winner of Witt/Woo III, barring an unbelievable weekend by either OWU or the Wabash/Earlham winner. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2006, 11:06:42 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 16, 2006, 10:39:18 PM
DC - thanks for the update.  I did manage to sign on and get scores while in Jamaica, but kind of lost track of how everything was shaping up!

If you mention that trip to Jamaica one more time, I'm going to start smiting!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 16, 2006, 11:29:20 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 16, 2006, 10:12:49 PMWhat I was attempting to point out was basically that I feel0 he needs to take a chill pill.

I understood that to mean that the sole reason for his comments are his "taking things too seriously" or his "anger" or "critical" nature. If that's not what you meant, then, I'm sorry. That's how I read your comment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 16, 2006, 11:39:03 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 16, 2006, 10:29:56 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 16, 2006, 10:12:49 PM
Sometimes, no response is the best response...

That axe swings both ways you know...

Touche... ;)

I know I've said things in the past that would have been better left unsaid.  At least I can admit it.  What can I say, I like to stir things up a bit.  I just felt that you were going a bit overboard lately in your negativity towards Wooster and it was getting a bit old.  Hopefully that nice win by your Little Giants put you in a little better frame of mind. ;)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 16, 2006, 11:39:57 PM
I've kept a stat formula on D3 for several years now.  I use it for my own amusement, and today was the first time since early Dec that I updated it.

It uses alot of the basics of  team efficiency, and I throw in my own biases.......mostly relating to wins and losses.  Usually by mid Dec I can pick out the teams that will be in the hunt for NCAA bids and confernce titles.  just not this year.

Here's what I have for the Great Lakes (MIAA, OAC, NCAC)

Wooster 246.02
Hope        222.02
Baldwin-Wallace 217.45
Albion 180.86
Calvin 170..30
Wittenberg 168.77
Ohio Northern 148.09

I didn't do Carnegie Mellon, but I think they fit right around  160-170 range.

I would look at this and say playing Calvin is similar to playing Wittenberg.

Don't get caugt up in the wide range of numbers, win % has a lot to do with that, but I look at is grouping teams within ranges.  I tend to think of this as a measurement of quality of play.

Right now it looks like Woo, Hope and BW are the class of the GL  followed by a nice pack of 3.

Historically teams that rate 175 or above have done well in the NCAA tournament.  

Woosters is one of the highest, if not the highest I've seen in some time.  Hope's is the highest they've ever had.


There are also raw numbers that don't take into account win %, and they breakdown offense/defense or efficiency

Offense Top 6 in Region
Wooster 103.33
Bald-Wally 95.08
Hope 89..98
Albion 82.12
Calvin 80.63
Wittenberg 71.50

Defense Top 6 in Region
Wittenberg 32.71
Albion 47.05
Hope 47.93
Bald Wally 49.49
Wabash 51.04

Then I have what I think of as a power rating
Wooster 46.06
Bald-Wally 45.29
Hope 42.05
Wittenberg 38.79
Albion 35.07

I can also rate conferences and compare them to years past, The OAC is the top conference in this region this year after the MIAA held that spot for 3 years......convincingly.  The NCAC is right around its average.  The MIAA is at its lowest rating since I started about 5 years ago.

In case anyone's curious the 3 worst teams in the region statistically

Marietta -56.64
Oberlin -48.86
Hiram -28.55

.500 teams usually rate around the 75-90 range.

Its all interesting in its own way.  Thought I'd add my little stat world to the topic of efficiency.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 17, 2006, 12:06:59 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 16, 2006, 10:58:34 PM
Realistically speaking, this tournament will be won by the winner of Witt/Woo III, barring an unbelievable weekend by either OWU or the Wabash/Earlham winner. 

Who knows what will happen the weekend of the 24th.  It  maybe Witt/Woo III, or an Unbelievable weekend by another NCAC Team.  That is the Great thing about the game of Basketball... Both Team's Lace up their Basketball shoes,  and play at least 40 minutes of Basketball!  I have a feeling the next week of NCAC Basketball is going to be an Enjoyable One!  Let's Sit back and ENJOY the RIDE.......  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 17, 2006, 12:28:38 AM
Just remember that the last non - Witt team to beat Wooster at Wooster was Wabash. So it CAN happen.

Just make sure we get the Indiana refs and the Ohio refs are locked in the closet....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 17, 2006, 12:31:04 AM
http://www.earlham.edu/~awpe/content/sports/men/basketball/2005-06/pressreleases/f021606.html  (http://www.earlham.edu/~awpe/content/sports/men/basketball/2005-06/pressreleases/f021606.html)

Nice Article on 3 Earlham Players that have been playing together since they were 9 years old and will soon end their playing days together in the next few weeks.  Brandon Miller, Tyler Stewart and Markous Jewett started playing organize basketball together at the age of 9.  Jewett will have enough Credits to Graduate in May and faces a similar situation as Port.  They also give credit to upper-classman when they were freshman... (Sorry Billy_ trying to float my own boat there.)  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 17, 2006, 12:36:20 AM
I think what you meant was the last non-Witt NCAC team to beat Wooster at Wooster was Wabash...several non-Witt teams have won at Timken since Wabash pulled it off in '02 (Kalamazoo, Capital, John Carroll, and B-W have done it).  

I'm not saying that it can't be done.  I know it can be done...I'm just acknowledging that given the sizeable gap between Wooster/Witt and the rest of the conference, it's going to take a truly extraordinary weekend by either OWU, Wabash, or Earlham to get the NCAC's bid to the tournament.  Either of those three teams pulling off the Witt/Wooster double would be one of the biggest and most unexpected stories of the D-III season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 17, 2006, 11:20:59 AM
Thanks for sharing Earlhamalum. Jewett had mentioned to me that Tinch was working on such a piece. It is sad when any group of seniors who has lasted four years in college and on a basketball team.  It takes quite a sacrifice to pull that off and still graduate on time. But to be going through those times with two of your best friends from early in life is even more special. Though these may be the last few times that Jewett, Miller and Stewart lace 'em up together for the Quakers, I'm sure you'll see those guys playing together again at Clear Creek or the YMCA.

I'll be there tomorrow in Richmond and I'd bet there will be a little bit of emotion on display.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 17, 2006, 11:31:05 AM
Quote from: sac on February 16, 2006, 11:39:57 PM
Albion 180.86
Calvin 170..30

Is that actually still the case after Calvin winning on Wednesday? Makes me a little skeptical, but I'm assuming your numbers weight the season equally and don't account for how a team is playing right now. Calvin sure seems to be improving while Albion is not, I would have to think they are the more dangerous team right now.

Quote from: sac on February 16, 2006, 11:39:57 PM
Woosters is one of the highest, if not the highest I've seen in some time. Hope's is the highest they've ever had.

I like the sound of both of those leading into the national tourney, but big giant -sigh- for the fact Hope couldn't turn such on-paper talent into even a share of the MIAA.

It is interesting in your numbers that Wittenberg falls just behind the big three of the MIAA since they seem hard to compare; Hope/Calvin/Albion tradeoff games between each other while Wittenberg is basically expected to own their conference other than the couple showcases with Wooster. Wittenberg seems to be having a season similar to Albion as they were expected to be one of the two contenders, but haven't gotten the job done against the other top team (teams in Albion's case) and got stung once by a more middle-of-the-conference team. Of course while they both seem to be limping into the post-season a little, their inside games could still be a potential matchup nightmare for upcoming opponents in the national tourney (though assuming Albion is in the NCAAs isn't as safe as Witt right now).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 17, 2006, 04:22:40 PM
Andersdy, your correct my number aren't weighted.  I'd guess if I'd done the number two weeks ago, Albion would have been around 190, and Calvin 160.  Calvin's poor start took a long time for them to climb.

Using a weighted formula would consist of entering stats from each individual game rather than the season stat totals.  Thats too much work for someone employed. ;D.......but it would maybe give a better read on teams.

After I posted those #'s I noticed a small error in the MIAA stats......hehe small as far as you know.  Hope actually came in at 198.03, Albion 156..34 and Calvin and 147.27

That changes the Region rank
Wooster 246.02
Baldwin-Wallace 217.45
Hope        192.99
Wittenberg 168.77
Albion 156.34
Calvin 147.27
Ohio Northern 148.09


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 17, 2006, 07:46:39 PM
I know this is very, VERY unlikely, but if Wooster were to lose on Tuesday in their opening round game, would the semis/finals still be at Wooster?

Again, I know it's probably not going to happen, but I was just curious.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 17, 2006, 07:58:23 PM
I heard from a reliable source (it might have been DC) that if Kenyon were to knock off Wooster that both the NCAC and NCAA tournaments would be called off and that Kenyon would be proclaimed both the conference and national champion.  They would also be given an expansion slot in the NBA for the 2006-07 season, and would be know as the Lords of Gambier.

Seriously, I was just thinking about your question the other day.  I believe that the highest remaining seed, Witt, would then host the remainder of the tournament, but I'm not at all sure about that.  I'm wondering about Kenyon, that they might have been playing a little possum last Tuesday.  Formato played only 20 minutes.  Their shot blocker, the freshman Bediako, played only 12 despite being 4-5 from the floor.  He was in some foul trouble, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 17, 2006, 09:34:12 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 17, 2006, 07:58:23 PMI believe that the highest remaining seed, Witt, would then host the remainder of the tournament,

That's my understanding of the rules.

Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 17, 2006, 07:58:23 PM
I heard from a reliable source (it might have been DC) that if Kenyon were to knock off Wooster that both the NCAC and NCAA tournaments would be called off and that Kenyon would be proclaimed both the conference and national champion.  They would also be given an expansion slot in the NBA for the 2006-07 season, and would be know as the Lords of Gambier.

That's not my understanding of the rules.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 17, 2006, 11:26:19 PM
Pat has updated the national QoWI standings (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=2910.132) through games of yesterday.  Tonight, Carnegie Mellon was upset at Emory, but the Tartans retain their control of the UAA Pool A bid by virtue of Rochester and NYU also losing (to Case and Chicago, respectively.)  CMU is now tied with WashU. atop the UAA, and the Tartans swept the Bears so they own the tiebreaker.  NYU, Rochester, and Chicago are all a game back with two games left.  In other words, all bets are off regarding how (and if) CMU is getting to the Big Dance.  In the data that follows, I've updated CMU's QoWI.

So here's the Great Lakes teams in the top 120 of national QoWI, along with their regional record:
Legend:  Team -- Regional Record and win % (ranking w/in region for win %) -- QoWI (national/regional rank)

Wooster -- 19-1 .950 (1) -- 10.700 (11*/1)
CMU -- 13-4 .765 (9) -- 10.556 (13*/2)
Wittenberg -- 16-3 .842 (5) -- 10.368 (17/3)
Calvin -- 10-1 .909 (2) -- 10.182 (21/4)
Baldwin-Wallace -- 19-3 .864 (4) -- 10.136 (23/5)
Hope -- 14-2 .875 (3) -- 9.750 (47/6)
Albion -- 10-3 .769 (8 ) -- 9.462 (59/7)
Bethany -- 17-4 .810 (7) -- 9.333 (73/8)
Lake Erie -- 15-3 .833 (6) -- 9.278 (74/9)
Ohio Northern -- 14-5 .737 (11) -- 8.947 (102/10)
Wilmington  -- 18-6 .750 (10) -- 8.875 (106/11)
Ohio Wesleyan -- 15-6 .714 (12) -- 8.810 (108/12)

*I've approximated where Wooster and CMU would be based on CMU's loss tonight, which was only a 3-QoWI-point game for them).  The other national rankings may be slightly off, due to the other UAA results tonght, but should be close.

I think we can officially strike OWU, Wilma, and ONU from any further Pool C consideration; it's win or go home for these teams next week.  Lake Erie and Bethany are hanging on to a tattered fringe of Pool C at the very best; Bethany still looks fairly solid for a Pool B bid, and LEC can still get in by winning the AMCC tournament.  The top 7 then shape up this way, as I see it:

1. Wooster
2. Calvin (beating Albion on Weds. was a big boost to their QoWI, while Hope's QoWI actually fell in beating lowly Alma)
3. Baldwin-Wallace
4. Wittenberg (mostly because B-W beat Wooster, who beat Witt twice)
5 (tie). Hope
5 (tie). CMU (a cop-out, but CMU's QoWI is still 0.8 higher than Hope's, offsetting the poor win %)
7. Albion (and Albion's QoWI will go down this weekend, win or lose vs. lowly Olivet)

Pool C prospects: 
NCAC: Woo and Witt are both in regardless of what happens.  So if OWU wins the tournament, NCAC gets three bids.  :o
MIAA:  Calvin is in regardless; Hope is in if they reach the MIAA final.  Albion likely needs to win the MIAA to earn a berth.  All three suffer from playing QoWI-damaging first-round games in the MIAA tournament (against Olivet, Alma, and Adrian, all with win %s below .333 and therefore just 8-point QoWI wins).  Plus Albion has a season-ending game with Olivet that will hurt them even more, QoWI-wise.
OAC: Baldwin-Wallace is in regardless; anyone else has to win the OAC tourney to get in.
AMCC: Lake Erie's last two games are worth 11 and 15 QoWI points if they win, so a trip to the conference tournament final may put them in the running for one of the last pool C bids.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2006, 12:30:48 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 17, 2006, 07:58:23 PM

Seriously, I was just thinking about your question the other day.  I believe that the highest remaining seed, Witt, would then host the remainder of the tournament, but I'm not at all sure about that.  I'm wondering about Kenyon, that they might have been playing a little possum last Tuesday.  Formato played only 20 minutes.  Their shot blocker, the freshman Bediako, played only 12 despite being 4-5 from the floor.  He was in some foul trouble, though.

You are correct in that the highest remaining seed would host if the top seed is knocked out in the opening round.  Does anyone know if  this ever happened in the NCAC tournament?

As for the Lords playing possum, if that's what they want to think they were doing, more power to 'em.  I didn't attend the game, but listening to the broadcast, Bediako was saddled with foul trouble which would explain his lack of minutes.  And from the write-up in the local fish wrap, it sounded as if Witucky and co. did a number on Formato defenively.  Of course, they are clearly biased in their writing, but, I wouldn't count on anything less than what we witnessed last Tuesday.  Unless, Wooster would go over the century mark. That wouldn't be less now would it. ;)

As for the regular season which wraps up, lets see now,  later today, does anyone see this OWU game as a possible hickup for Wooster like the Wabash game was for Witt?  OWU kept the game within reach the last time they played, although, I never really felt like the Bishops were ever much of a threat the entire game.  And, it was Wooster's first game without the services of Tom Port.  I would look for this one to be somewhat close again, unless Wooster comes out blazing like they have been doing since Port's return.  OWU needs to stay with Wooster early to have any chance.  If the Bishops can keep it close through the 1st half, they could make a ballgame out of it.  I just feel, with Port in the lineup this time around, it'll be too much for the Battling Bishops to handle.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 18, 2006, 12:34:37 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 17, 2006, 07:58:23 PM
I heard from a reliable source (it might have been DC) that if Kenyon were to knock off Wooster that both the NCAC and NCAA tournaments would be called off and that Kenyon would be proclaimed both the conference and national champion.  They would also be given an expansion slot in the NBA for the 2006-07 season, and would be know as the Lords of Gambier.

Just think of the ticker-tape parade to celebrate when the Lords come home to the bustling metropolis of Gambier!  It would be complete with poetry readings and staged Greek dramas on floats... ;D ;D

Seriously, though, would Kenyonites (do they call themselves that?) even know how to celebrate a national championship in a sport that doesn't use meters?   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 18, 2006, 12:51:32 AM
I ran a one-game computer sim of the Wooster-OWU matchup yesterday and the Scots won, but only by 6.  I'm going down there tomorrow, and don't know what to expect.  At Wooster, OWU shot the lights out, making some difficult threes ala JCU.  But maybe that's normal protocol for them; we'll see.

Kenyonites.  Sounds like something Superman should be wary of.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2006, 12:56:47 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 18, 2006, 12:30:48 AM
As for the regular season which wraps up, lets see now,  later today, does anyone see this OWU game as a possible hickup for Wooster like the Wabash game was for Witt? 

Yes, I do.  I wouldn't bet on OWU to win, but I won't be surprised at all if it happens.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 18, 2006, 01:01:36 AM
But I don't think OWU will have what Wabash had against Witt - a well-oiled fanbase with visceral hate and loathing of their opponent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on February 18, 2006, 08:36:42 AM
There is no possible way, no matter how much I would like to see ut, that if OWU wins the NCAC tourny the NCAC will get three teams in the tournament!  That would be the equivolent of the Big East getting 10 teams in.  I understand that the DIII tourney has expanded this year but it is still not at the necessary 64 teams so there will not be three NCAC teams.  The NCAC will get there usual two teams whether it is  Wooster/Witt, OWU/Witt, or OWU/Wooster.

If OWU wins the tourney I am sorry to say that I believe that Wittenberg, no matter how nice of a season they have had will be left out.  They have lost to Wooster twice.  That fact alone will leave them out if OWU wins the tourney.  If you really do not believe this reference the year (I believe it to be the 2001-2002 season) when Capital only had five losses, and three of them were to the eventual national champion Otterbein, on the year and did not get in.  I have a feeling that if OWU wins the tourney Wittenberg will find itself in the same boat. 

Big game today for the Bishops.  I really do feel that the Bishops matchup very well with the Scots.  Both teams love the three ball.  Being that it is in Delaware, it is senior day, and there have been a rash of upset this week, I feel good about this game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 18, 2006, 08:53:04 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 18, 2006, 12:30:48 AM
As for the regular season which wraps up, lets see now,  later today, does anyone see this OWU game as a possible hickup for Wooster like the Wabash game was for Witt?  OWU kept the game within reach the last time they played, although, I never really felt like the Bishops were ever much of a threat the entire game.  And, it was Wooster's first game without the services of Tom Port.  I would look for this one to be somewhat close again, unless Wooster comes out blazing like they have been doing since Port's return.  OWU needs to stay with Wooster early to have any chance.  If the Bishops can keep it close through the 1st half, they could make a ballgame out of it.  I just feel, with Port in the lineup this time around, it'll be too much for the Battling Bishops to handle.

I think there's a big chance of an upset today in Delaware.  The Scots have traditionally had close games there (last year they won in OT after Chojnacki missed a FT to win in regulation), the Scots are #1 in the country and have a huge target on their backs, they've clinched the NCAC regular season title, and they're basically assured a spot in the NCAA tourney.

That being said, the Scots have been playing very well since Port has returned.  I'll think they'll handle the Bishops, but it may be close.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 18, 2006, 09:46:20 AM
Quote from: bishopsfan on February 18, 2006, 08:36:42 AM
There is no possible way, no matter how much I would like to see ut, that if OWU wins the NCAC tourny the NCAC will get three teams in the tournament!  That would be the equivolent of the Big East getting 10 teams in.  I understand that the DIII tourney has expanded this year but it is still not at the necessary 64 teams so there will not be three NCAC teams.  The NCAC will get there usual two teams whether it is  Wooster/Witt, OWU/Witt, or OWU/Wooster.

If OWU wins the tourney I am sorry to say that I believe that Wittenberg, no matter how nice of a season they have had will be left out.  They have lost to Wooster twice.  That fact alone will leave them out if OWU wins the tourney.  If you really do not believe this reference the year (I believe it to be the 2001-2002 season) when Capital only had five losses, and three of them were to the eventual national champion Otterbein, on the year and did not get in.  I have a feeling that if OWU wins the tourney Wittenberg will find itself in the same boat.

Apples and oranges, Bishopsfan. The year that Capital got left out in the cold, there were only six Pool C bids available nationally. This year there are 18. Wittenberg's currently ranked third in the region, which means that they have something of a cushion should they falter before the NCAC title game. Their in-region record (16-3) and their QOWI (10.368, good for 17th nationally) are both sterling qualifications. Witt is not going to get left out ... and if OWU (or Wabash or Earlham) does achieve the seemingly impossible and wins the NCAC tourney, there will indeed be three NCAC teams in the big dance this March.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 18, 2006, 10:40:34 AM
I agree with Gregory. With the expansion, both Wooster and Witt are 'locks'. Of all the elite GL teams, only Albion is on the bubble, i feel.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 18, 2006, 11:06:52 AM
Smeds I think Dave's thorough analysis suggests Albion MUST win the MIAA tournament to get in...........geez it even looks like a 22-2 team might have to MUST win their conference tournament to get it????

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 18, 2006, 11:19:41 AM
In the next week I am sure a number of posters will begin listing who they think should receive all league honors. I have a proposal that mirrors how high school leagues select those honors: Coaches have to nominate players that other coaches can vote on (they usually do this team by team - anyone who doesn't make the first team after the coaches vote is dropped to second team nomination and more are added).

I would ask that the posters who loyally follow their team nominate players from that team, add the league team they think the player should be on and provide a short one sentence reason why. For players destined for the first team this may seem like a trivial exercise, but I am having difficulty with the back end of the selections. Even though I have seen most teams twice it may not be a representative enough. Nominations whould help.

If others think this is a good idea, I'll post mine later
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 18, 2006, 12:59:38 PM
Sac - I think that Albion is hurt by the fact that the back half of the MIAA stinks, and they didn't do enough work in their non-conference schedule, unlike Wooster and Witt.

I do think it's silly to not have games from adjacent states count as regional games though. I'll run that up a flagpole somewhere and see if people salute.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2006, 02:30:41 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 18, 2006, 11:19:41 AM
I would ask that the posters who loyally follow their team nominate players from that team, add the league team they think the player should be on and provide a short one sentence reason why. For players destined for the first team this may seem like a trivial exercise, but I am having difficulty with the back end of the selections. Even though I have seen most teams twice it may not be a representative enough. Nominations whould help.

I don't think there's enough of us to go around to do this.  We'd not have anyone to nominate Matt Formato, or Matt Majzlik, or Quinton Spencer, for example.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 18, 2006, 03:26:45 PM
Early at OWU:

12:00 to play, 20-17 OWU

Both teams shooting well, and doesn't sound like there's been too much defense.  Up tempo style
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 18, 2006, 03:52:46 PM
At the Half:  Ohio Wesleyan 50  Wooster 50

Both teams shooting very well.  Andy Warnock has been unstoppable and has 20 points to lead the Bishops.  Kyle Holliday has added 8 points for OWU.

Kyle Witucky has 13 points and Tom Port has chipped in 9 points to lead Wooster in the first half.

Scots will need to play better defense in the 2nd half if they want to get the road win this afternoon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 18, 2006, 03:55:26 PM
I agree wooscotsfan, Wooster's going to have to up the defensive effort to cut into the shooting barrage of OWU.  But that goes both ways- it sounds like Wooster gaurds have gotten a lot of easy layups driving down the middle of the OWU defense (most of why Witucky has 13).

If OWU stays close on their home floor, it could be dangerous at the end.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Hoops MacPherson on February 18, 2006, 03:59:52 PM
Matt Majzlik doesn't deserve to be all-league; his lack of conditioning has hurt the Gators as much as he has helped them. Gators are getting better (led Witt by 9 at half and were tied with Wooster at half at home), because Hollihan and Torsney give them two athletic big guys, and Babe started hitting some perimeter shots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on February 18, 2006, 04:23:11 PM
Anyone have a score from Denison at Hiram?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2006, 04:23:44 PM
TO Wooster.  OWU is up 9, 67-58  with 12 minutes to go.  Wooster is ice cold in the 2nd half.  Only one made fg so far and they are only 2-12 from outside the arc.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2006, 04:34:17 PM
Game stuck at 69-62.  Wooster called for back to back offensive fouls.  OWU is giving Wooster chance after chance to cut into the lead, but Wooster isn't taking advantage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2006, 04:36:13 PM
Wooster finally gets a bucket.  69-64 with just over 6 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2006, 04:37:29 PM
Now a 3 point game.  69-66 with mo shifiting towards Wooster.  T.O. OWU
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2006, 04:41:18 PM
So much for mo.  OWU back up 9 with just over 4 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2006, 04:43:15 PM
This ones just about over.  OWU now up 11. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2006, 04:44:22 PM
Here's the answer to the question "what happens to Wooster when the shots don't fall?"  Wooster has missed every three point attempt in the second half and now trails by 11.  Of course, it's not just bad shooting; porous defense and horrendous rebounding seem to have contributed as well.  As has the outstanding play of OWU, as well as the loud and boisterous home crowd.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2006, 04:45:34 PM
Yep, Wooster's only 5-17 on fg's for the 2nd half.  That's only 29%.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 18, 2006, 04:45:53 PM
Don't ya love February basketball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 18, 2006, 04:48:58 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 18, 2006, 04:43:15 PM
This ones just about over.  OWU now up 11. 

Don't kill your chickens before they're hatched... or something.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2006, 04:51:57 PM
Chojnacki hits a three, and the chickens die unhatched.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 18, 2006, 04:52:50 PM
I'll need text updates. The broadcast crashed on me in OWU's timeout.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2006, 04:56:27 PM
Well, let's see.  Wooster cut it to 5, then got called for a block on a three-point attempt play; the call sounded like it could have gone either way.  Chojnacki made two of 3, pushing the lead to 84-77.  Witucky answers with a 3, 84-80, :18 remaining. 

Wooster steals the inbounds pass, Port steals and hits a three, 84-83.  Foul on Wooster, :11.3 left, Warnock at the line.  Hits the first (has 26), and the second.

Witucky misses a 3, held ball, possession Wooster 0:01.4 left.

Port three is in and out at the buzzer, and OWU wins 86-83.  Congratulations to the Bishops!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 18, 2006, 04:57:41 PM
OH MAN!! Turnover and made three!  One point game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 18, 2006, 05:00:51 PM
Wabash 81, Kenyon 63....if anybody cares.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 18, 2006, 05:00:58 PM
Sounds like it would have been fun to listen to down the stretch.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on February 18, 2006, 05:03:30 PM
Witt 87
Gheny 58

Tigers shoot 71% in the 2nd half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 18, 2006, 05:03:39 PM
Congrats to OWU as the Bishops played a great game and upset Wooster today.  OWU was led by Andy Warnock, Ben Chojnacki and Kyle Holliday all with double figure points.

Kyle Witucky, James Cooper, Tom Port and Tim Vandervaart had double figure points for the Scots.

Wooster is now 23-2, 15-1 NCAC.  Next up is Kenyon in the NCAC tourney.

Hopefully, Wooster will take this loss as some motivation and play an inspired NCAC tournament this coming week.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on February 18, 2006, 05:06:49 PM
Hiram 82
Denison 80

With the loss, Denison will face Wittenberg Tuesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2006, 05:12:27 PM
Wow, I turned the game off and look what I missed!  I should have known Wooster would start draining 3's to make it a game.  I just figured the way OWU was scoring at will, there just wasn't enough time.  Congrats to OWU.  They came out ready to play today!  They did a great job of keeping their composure and matching Wooster basket for basket until they were able to make the key run midway through the 2nd half.  This win snaps a 19 game win streak for Wooster over OWU.  It was also Coach DeWitt's first win over the Scots in his 7 years at the helm at OWU. 

When the schedule first came out, and I saw the last game being at OWU, I thought to myself, I sure hope there aren't any conference title implications heading into that game, because it could be a dangerous game.  As it turns out, thankfully, the Scots had already shored up the conference title, but the Bishops proved it to be a dangerous game nonetheless.  

Now, its onto the conference tourney and poor Kenyon.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on February 18, 2006, 05:18:09 PM
Guys, I'm in FL.  The computer feed crashed with about 1:50 left--what was the final score of the COW-OWU game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on February 18, 2006, 05:22:40 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 18, 2006, 04:56:27 PM
Well, let's see.  Wooster cut it to 5, then got called for a block on a three-point attempt play; the call sounded like it could have gone either way.  Chojnacki made two of 3, pushing the lead to 84-77.  Witucky answers with a 3, 84-80, :18 remaining. 

Wooster steals the inbounds pass, Port steals and hits a three, 84-83.  Foul on Wooster, :11.3 left, Warnock at the line.  Hits the first (has 26), and the second.

Witucky misses a 3, held ball, possession Wooster 0:01.4 left.

Port three is in and out at the buzzer, and OWU wins 86-83.  Congratulations to the Bishops!



86-83
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 18, 2006, 05:24:00 PM
Wabash was down seven at the half, but blitzed Kenyon 50-25 in the second half for the win. Looks like Zimmer had a great game off the bench!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on February 18, 2006, 05:27:16 PM
Thanks Witt4ever. ND
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 18, 2006, 06:08:58 PM
OWU played great defense against the Scots guards today.  I don't think that I've seen anybody that's been able to deny the outside shots they way the Bishops did today.  The Scots had several chances to cut into the lead when it was 69 - 92 for what seemed like 4 minutes or so, but just couldn't get the job done.  There were a couple of questionable calls at the end, but the Scots lost this one by not converting when they had open shots, and by giving up way too many offensive boards.

Congrats to the Bishops on a great game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on February 18, 2006, 06:12:25 PM
I made a tourney bracket. Is it correct?

http://www.rz.coolfreepage.com/ncac.pdf
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2006, 06:13:39 PM
Looks correct to me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on February 18, 2006, 06:16:44 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 18, 2006, 06:13:39 PM
Looks correct to me.

ok, thanks
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 18, 2006, 06:17:12 PM
Earlham beats the gang of eight 81-60.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on February 18, 2006, 08:29:21 PM
What a win for the Bishops!!!!!  It was great to see them make plays down the stretch and beat a very good team.  This is just the momentum that they need to make a run in the conference tourney.  Congrats to Andy Warnock on his tremendous game.  What a great team win!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 18, 2006, 08:39:37 PM
Congratulations to the Bishops. They came out and played hard and shot very well.

Wooster had their chances in the second half when the score was at 69-62 for about 4 minutes, but they just could not hit any shots. To Woosters credit though, their did not give up and still had a chance to tie at the end.

Hopefully the Scots will take this game and use it to their advantage in the upcoming tournaments.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 18, 2006, 09:12:50 PM
Back from Delaware and hat's off to Mike DeWitt and the Bishops.  OWU played a perfect 1st half--Warnock was unstoppable--he even hit a couple of 3's that were called off because of a foul before the shot.  Woo in turn played a horrible 2nd half, scoring 18 pts in the 1st 17 min!  Woo couldn't buy a bucket for much of the 2nd half.  Port's shot at the buzzer was 1/2 way down--an unbelievable shot, as he was behind the basket as far as you can go in the corner--I thought OT was in the air, but for naught. 

I am happy for Coach DeWitt--he's a class act.  And I'm equally impressed with Andy Warnock today--he couldn't have asked for a better performance on senior day.

Tough loss for the Scots, but nothing that a few beers won't cure--We live to play another day--

It's TOURNEY TIME!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 18, 2006, 11:19:09 PM
This afternoon a highly motivated - and highly intelligent - performance by OWU did more than reveal the obvious shortcomings of the Wooster basketball team.  OWU showed that those deficiencies, when attacked with understanding, might just be large enough to sidetrack the Scots chances to go very far in the NCAA tournament.  Or even to take their league affair, on their home court.

Wooster's major problems are two:

1) An inability to defend on the inside, not only against superior post players such as Russ, Borchers, and Torii Davis, but against merely good ones such as OWU sports. 

2) Their reliance, offensively, too much on the three-point shot.

Their liabilities are no state secret.  An opposing coach, even one lacking a prior contest against the Scots, or somehow finding himself without video, has only to immerse himself in the posts on this forum to determine Wooster's ailments.  But that's only step one.  Not every team, even knowing the situation, has the wherewithall to take advantage of this knowledge.  OWU does, and did.

Defensively they took a page from the Scots's playbook and played Wooster exactly as Wooster plays Wittenberg. Wooster, this season, has generally chosen not to help inside against Borchers and Russ, but to remain on the perimeter and take away the rest of Witt's offense.  It's worked out well, giving the Scots two wins. 

OWU, unfortunately for the Scots, had similar success.  They never gave Wooster good looks from the outside, leaving Wooster without a necessary scoring dimension.  What outside looks the Scots had were not good ones, and only Port and Witucky were even able to get those.  The other Scot players on the perimeter never seemed involved in the offense unless they had the ball.  When guarded tightly, they stood around, one of them even throwing his hands up in the air time after time, as if to say "Take it yourself, I'm out of it, I don't know how to get away from this guy." 

The first fifteen seconds of Wooster's offense, almost on every set, consisted of a pick at the top of the key, and it never amounted to anything.  The good ball movement that had been in evidence for weeks disappeared entirely.  Wooster never had a fast break, not one, due mostly to being unable to stop OWU from scoring, rebounding very poorly, and OWU making a concerted effort to get back quickly.

And when they had the ball, OWU was tenacious about sending it into the post.  Their inside players would then just back down the Wooster defenders until they too often had little 'gimme' shots.  Aside: no offensive fouls were ever called on them, and certainly some should have been.  And when the Scot defenders offered resistance, they were whistled for the indiscretion.

I'm tired, still a bit pissed about the home town officiating, and beginning to ramble.  Wooster will come back and play better in the next couple of games.  But will it be a mirage, coming against lesser opponents, or can the Scots somehow learn something from this game, somehow find a way to defend inside and to also get more movement away from the ball offensively?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2006, 12:36:26 AM
Quote from: Wooster BoosterCOW coach Steve Moore (possibly, after OWU loss): Gentlemen, we start the war from right here. The reinforcements will have to find us wherever we are. Move inland.

I thought that was Lt. Gen. Theodore Roosevelt, Jr., or possibly Henry Fonda, but I frequently get these three guys mixed up.  ;)

Nice recap.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 19, 2006, 08:17:56 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 15, 2006, 11:11:46 PM
Here's the updated Regional Rankings (http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/?p=128):
Great Lakes
1. Wooster 18-1 22-1
2. Baldwin-Wallace 19-2 21-2
3. Wittenberg 16-2 21-2
4. Carnegie Mellon 14-3 18-4
T5. Calvin 9-1 18-5
T5. Hope 14-2 21-2

I guess the good news for the Scots is that besides Wooster, the 2, 3, and 4 teams have also lost this week (B-W twice), and the Scots loss was the best one QOWI-wise.  Without delving into the numbers, I would think that its likely that the Scots might hold on to the #1 spot in the region. However, I would think that they will now need to win the NCAC tourney to have a chance to keep that ranking and possibly earn a first-round bye in the NCAA tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramer on February 19, 2006, 09:22:43 AM
Am I the only one on here that would love to read DenisonFan's comments on their loss to Hiram yesterday?  Come on, you know it would be interesting.
Congtats to OWU, great regular season.  Hopefully they'll make some noise in the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 19, 2006, 11:11:01 AM
well one thing that i gained from yesterday's upset is now witt has a tough semifinal game against a confident owu team. witt winning at owu after losing to wooster should provide us with some needed momentum going into that game.

denison has a chance to prove that they're not totally horrible if they win against witt on tuesday-chances of happeneing-none
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 19, 2006, 11:58:47 AM
Penn -

No thoughts on Witt's loss to Wabash?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 19, 2006, 12:51:39 PM
I agree WOOSTER BOOSTER nothing was going the Scots' way.
They couldn't make the easy shots,box out on rebounds or move the ball enough to get the open three.(again kudos to the Bishops)

As far as the officiating, it WAS terrible (especially one ref who always called his fouls AGAINST the Scots). What was a blocking call at one end was a charge at the other.

But, all in all the Scots looked frustrated. Period. Simple as that.

One other thing, hopefully the Scots can use this game as a learning experience.
As i have noticed similarities between Kyle's freshman and senior years.

In the '02-'03 season: first loss Dec. 29th, record 9-1
In the '05-'06 season: first loss Dec. 29th, record 9-1

In the '02-'03 season: second loss Feb.15th, record 21-2
In the '05-'06 season: second loss Feb.18th, record 23-2

In the '02-'03 season: record after NCAC Tourny 26-2
In the '05-'06 season: record (could be) after NCAC Tourny 26-2

Does this mean anything? NO. But, i thought it was interesting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2006, 01:29:50 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 19, 2006, 08:17:56 AM
I guess the good news for the Scots is that besides Wooster, the 2, 3, and 4 teams have also lost this week (B-W twice), and the Scots loss was the best one QOWI-wise.  Without delving into the numbers, I would think that its likely that the Scots might hold on to the #1 spot in the region. However, I would think that they will now need to win the NCAC tourney to have a chance to keep that ranking and possibly earn a first-round bye in the NCAA tournament.

I don't think there's any doubt that Wooster holds on to the regional #1 for another week.  Calvin is the only other top team whose numbers improved, and they're still well short of Wooster in QoWI and equivalent in win %.  Hope won both their games, but one--Tri-State--doesn't count to the NCAA, and the other--Alma--is a sub-.333 team and so hurt their QoWI.  Everyone else lost at least once.

Furthermore I think Wooster will only drop to #2 in the national poll, behind unbeaten Lawrence.  The #3 and #4 teams lost (#3 twice), and I don't see Hope making up a 128-point gap on the strength of home wins over Alma and Tri-State.

Wittenberg should end up somewhere between #3 and #5 in the region poll, and somewhere in the #6-#9 range in the national poll.  Their regional numbers are comparable to Hope (slightly lower win %, somewhat better QoWI), and it's hard to guess what happens to CMU, whose QoWI is much better, relatively speaking, than their win %.  My guess of the regional rankings, pending CMU's game today at Case, is that Witt is third and Hope 4th, with CMU tied with Hope if they win today, and 6th (behind B-W) if they don't.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 19, 2006, 01:49:38 PM
Outstanding analysis, DC--I always look forward to your thoughts.

One question--isn't the Feb. 22nd regional rankings the final one? 

I think the loss yesterday did put a lot of things in perspective for the Scots--OWU is a tough place to play, given their gym size and eccentric decor, and add senior day and you've got a problem.  I think DeWitt's quote in the DR this morning was a true reflection on the game--OWU played as well as they could, which is what it takes to beat a team like Wooster.  I still can't get over how well they played in the 1st half--

I also think that Witt will have their hands full on Friday if OWU plays as inspired as they did yesterday--assuming, of course, that the top seeds advance.

Let the games begin--

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 19, 2006, 02:04:16 PM
Yesterday was my first experience in taking in a game at OWU.  Although I wasn't happy with the result, I loved the facility.  A good-sized crowd, although definitely not a sellout, produced much more noise than I've ever heard at Wooster's Timken gym. Certainly the smaller space, and possibly the uneven configuration of the roof contributed to this.  It did seem to me that it could have been a little better lit.

I caught the last ten minutes of the women's game between Denison and OWU and was impressed with the play.  I'd only seen Wooster's women play before, DIII-wise, and didn't find them very entertaining.

My only mistake was in choosing a seat directly behind the Wooster bench.  With Coaches Cline and Moore almost constantly on their feet, I rarely had an unobstructed view at the near basket.  Still, I was able to see more than the officials...

 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 19, 2006, 03:26:17 PM
Quote from: fighting_scots on February 19, 2006, 01:49:38 PM

I also think that Witt will have their hands full on Friday if OWU plays as inspired as they did yesterday--assuming, of course, that the top seeds advance.


It's a good thing OWU has a game in between their possible showdown with Witt on Friday.  Against 'Gheny, they can afford a bit of a  "letdown" game, after their emotional win yesterday.  Wouldn't that be something if 'Gheny came into the Branch and pulled the upset?  It has happened before with teams coming off of huge emotional wins coming out flat and uninspired in their next contest.   ::)  Just something to ponder.

If the Bishops can avoid the "letdown" against the Gators and Witt gets by Denison, I wonder who the partisan home crowd will be cheering for on Friday in the 1st semi-final?  Will they cheer for a team that is fresh off a win over the Scots, or for the arch-rival whom the Scots have already beaten twice.  I think I'll put my OWU sweatshirt for that one.  The old cliche about how hard it is to beat a team 3 times in a season usually rings true.  And like DeWitt said, OWU probably couldn't play much better than they did yesterday, so I would take our chances with a rubber match with the Battling Bishops in the finals. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 19, 2006, 03:50:48 PM
Quote from: fighting_scots on February 19, 2006, 01:49:38 PM

I think the loss yesterday did put a lot of things in perspective for the Scots--OWU is a tough place to play, given their gym size and eccentric decor, and add senior day and you've got a problem. 


Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 19, 2006, 02:04:16 PM
Yesterday was my first experience in taking in a game at OWU. Although I wasn't happy with the result, I loved the facility. A good-sized crowd, although definitely not a sellout, produced much more noise than I've ever heard at Wooster's Timken gym. Certainly the smaller space, and possibly the uneven configuration of the roof contributed to this.


It said in the DR that is was not only Senior Day yesterday at OWU, but it was also Community Day meaning the game was free to the public.  That added even more to the frenzied atmosphere at the Branch.  It wasn't a sellout, but it was close according to the box score.  They had 2025 in attendance and the Branch holds 2300.  I'm sure that was about as loud as that place has been since they won it all back in '88. 

Speaking of Timken not being loud enough, it reminds me of an article in the DR the week following Witt/Wooster II.  It mentioned how Witt's AD was trying to quell the enthusiasm of the crowd by asking that everyone in the stands remain seated during the game.  Here is a quote from that article:

Quote from: Joe Vardon, Wooster Daily RecordPurnell's second request was one better suited for a symphony than a basketball game featuring the fiercest rivalry in small college hoops.

He literally asked that everyone watch the game SITTING DOWN!

Thankfully, neither school's students obliged and stood for each of the game's 40 minutes.

Joe later made light of this by commenting that the exact opposite usually takes place at Timken where you usually have to encourage everyone to  STAND UP. ;)  Hopefully the fans at Timken won't be afraid to make plenty of noise this week for the conference tournament games!!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2006, 05:10:15 PM
Quote from: fighting_scots on February 19, 2006, 01:49:38 PM
Outstanding analysis, DC--I always look forward to your thoughts.

One question--isn't the Feb. 22nd regional rankings the final one? 

Thank you.  I may not have many thoughts to share over the coming days, as I have the bar exam looming on Tuesday.  :-\

The final poll that will be released to the public will be Wednesday, but there will be a final unreleased ranking done prior to the selection of Pool B and C teams, and that ranking is the only one that counts.  We can guess as to that final ranking, based on the 2/22 poll, but we'll never actually see it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 19, 2006, 05:16:05 PM
I first attended a game at Timken about 11 years ago when I was 47.  My first impression was that the crowd seemed to consist of a high percentage of senior citizens.  It still seems that way to me, even as I'm now 58 and will soon be a bonafide member of that group (cringe).

I suspect that's one of the reasons the crowd isn't as loud.  Another might just be the size of the place, as maybe the sound doesn't funnel down towards the court as in a smaller arena.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 19, 2006, 08:16:42 PM
I don't think any Wooster fan will EVER root for Witt.
And vice versa.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 19, 2006, 08:23:31 PM
Us old people do come out for the games and i wish the students would come out more often, instead of just the Witt games.

But, we do come out for the away games too.

Chadwick is the loudest for home support, i think.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 19, 2006, 08:39:21 PM
I caught the ODAC semi-finals on streaming video today.(Great games)
The final is on tomorrow(Monday) at 7, if anyone is interested.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Hoops MacPherson on February 19, 2006, 09:24:58 PM
I am amused that some Wooster fans are complaining about "hometown officiating" at OWU. OWU shot 28 foul shots, Wooster 27.

Now you know how the bottom eight of the league feels most every time they play witt or woo; coach moore comes out of the coaching box to protest a call at the end of the earlham game (he was down past center court), doesn't get a technical, and they win; he carps at refs, even when he's up 30.

these things happen on the road. get over it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopsfan1111 on February 19, 2006, 09:33:40 PM
Quote from: Hoops MacPherson on February 19, 2006, 09:24:58 PM

Now you know how the bottom eight of the league feels most every time they play witt or woo; coach moore comes out of the coaching box to protest a call at the end of the earlham game (he was down past center court), doesn't get a technical, and they win; he carps at refs, even when he's up 30.

these things happen on the road. get over it.

I have to say you are off base about Coach Moore here.  He does no more talking to the officials than any other coach in the NCAC, and I have seen every single coach this season.  As for "he carps at refs" when up 30...why should a team not get calls they deserve just because they are up by 30 points.  I don't recall ever seeing a rule that says that if you are winning by a certain amount that officials should stop calling the game fairly and correctly according to the rule book.  Just something to think about...

Also, I think the amount of complaining about the officials at OWU was within reason, no over the top comments like those that can occur at times.  In my opinion, the Wooster fans did a nice job of giving an accurate description of the game and also gave a fair amount of congratulations to OWU for the win. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 19, 2006, 09:38:58 PM
Wooster and Witt fans don't get to gripe about the officiating in this league.  Period.  It may have been bad yesterday for the Scots.  It may have been fair.  I don't know.  What I do know, is that in the majority of games, Wooster and Witt get the benefit of the doubt.  The iffy calls go their way more often than not.  That's a fact of life in the NCAC.  

Why worry about it so much anyway?  Yesterday's game was 100% meaningless to Wooster.  Losing that game won't affect their seeding in the NCAC tournament and it won't affect their seeding in the NCAA tournament.  Wooster was playing for absolutely nothing yesterday.  I'm actually quite surprised at the number of minutes Wooster's heavy hitters played yesterday...especially given Wooster's brushes with injuries during the regular season.  I don't think I would have risked having the guys that will make or break my NCAA run playing 30+ minutes in a game that meant zip.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 19, 2006, 09:43:11 PM
Hey Hoops--welcome to the board.

Win over 500 games, and you can feel free to criticize Coach Moore.  I don't think there is a single poster on this board that will criticize him--he's a great coach, and a class guy.

With that being said, he does the talking for his team--a consummate team leader.  Down by 2 or up by 40, his men are on the floor giving the effort that he expects--100% all the time.  And when those bench players who are playing hard are fouled, and the refs play the "sympathy" card and don't call it, he get's upset--like any great team leader would.  And he let's the officials know about it.

This is a place where the fans call it the way they see it.  Your shallow comments only reflect upon your understanding of the game.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Hoops MacPherson on February 19, 2006, 09:57:45 PM
you got it; i disagree with you, therefore i am shallow and don't understand the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 19, 2006, 10:22:32 PM
I think Moore and Brown get a little more room with the NCAC refs on arguing with them because of who they are and who they coach. Just the way it is...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 20, 2006, 12:39:32 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 19, 2006, 09:38:58 PM
Yesterday's game was 100% meaningless to Wooster.  Losing that game won't affect their seeding in the NCAC tournament and it won't affect their seeding in the NCAA tournament.  Wooster was playing for absolutely nothing yesterday.

I agree with you Wally, on every point except one.  Wooster did have one thing to play for: only the third perfect NCAC season in Wooster's history.  Now, most will say things like this are trivial, but you know it has to be at least in the back of everyone's minds.  Plus, Wittenberg and Wooster both have 2 perfect NCAC seasons, and you know the Scots would love to pull ahead of Witt in that category.

As for Wittenberg, they looked as sharp as I have seen them all year on Saturday.  They shot over 70% in the second half, and their free throw shooting was better than it has been in recent weeks as well (12-16).  A nice rebound from the loss on Wednesday.  If they can keep that level of play up, I see no reason they can't win the conference tournament.

That said, I think Tuesday will be a bit of a blowout victory for the Tigers (but only because of the home court advantage) and Wooster (poor Kenyon having to play them after a loss...), and then things get fun over the weekend.  After what we have seen in the past week (with Witt's loss to Wabash and Wooster's loss to OWU), I think that the top four seeds all have a realistic shot at winning.  However, Wooster and Witt still have to be the favorites, as for either Wabash/OWU to win, they would most likely have to knock off both teams, and I just can't see that happening.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 20, 2006, 03:49:27 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 19, 2006, 03:26:17 PMThe old cliche about how hard it is to beat a team 3 times in a season usually rings true.

On the contrary, it makes no sense at all ... and the fact that it's been repeated so often that it has become a cliche doesn't make it any more true.

If you beat a team twice, it's a pretty good bet that you have their number, and that you are and should be the favorite going into the third game. A sweep tends to identify a talent gap between two teams more often than not, especially if there's a substantial MOV involved in at least one of the games. Plus, it's more likely that the two-time victim enters the third game psychologically intimidated than that the two-time victor enters the game nervous about having to pull it off for the third time.

If the wins were exceptionally narrow, it's different. F'rinstance, Illinois Wesleyan faces Augustana in the first round of the inaugural CCIW tourney this coming Friday. Augie swept Illinois Wesleyan in the CCIW's double round-robin, but they won the first game by only three points and the second game went into overtime. If Illinois Wesleyan manages to beat Augie in the third game between the two, it won't be because of that silly "it's hard to beat a team three times" cliche. It'll be because the margin between the two teams is already so narrow that it's quite possible Illinois Wesleyan can win on their own merits.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 20, 2006, 06:05:20 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 20, 2006, 03:49:27 AM
If the wins were exceptionally narrow, it's different.

Exactly.

That's the problem with so many cliches and general statements, they oversimplifiy.  If a team has beaten another twice, and by substantial margins each time, you can pretty much bet the farm that they'll do it again (see Wooster-Kenyon).  But if the games were very close, such as the two between Wooster and Wittenberg, that only indicates the relative equalness of the teams, and that the third game is very likely to be a nail-biter as well.  I'd make the Scots the narrowest of favorites if they meet Wittenberg in the NCAC finals, but only due to having the home court advantage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 20, 2006, 06:26:38 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 20, 2006, 06:05:20 AMI'd make the Scots the narrowest of favorites if they meet Wittenberg in the NCAC finals, but only due to having the home court advantage.

Agreed. But Scots Fan used the cliche as commentary upon a possible Wittenberg vs. Ohio Wesleyan semifinal. It seems to me that such a matchup would be a clear illustration of why the cliche isn't valid. The Tigers won their two games against the Bishops by margins of 17 points (@ Wittenberg) and 12 points (@ Ohio Wesleyan). The first game was never even close; the Tigers had a double-digit lead for all but the first six minutes of the game, and they extended it to as much as 20 in the second half. The second game was somewhat closer, no doubt because it took place on the Bishops' home floor, but nevertheless the Tigers were in the lead for all but the first three minutes of the game, led by as many as 15 in the second half, and never let the host Bishops get within two possessions of them in the final 15 minutes of the game.

All the available evidence points to Wittenberg being a clearly superior team to Ohio Wesleyan, and a possible semifinal between the two would most likely be a perfect illustration of the hollowness of the "it's hard to beat a team three times" cliche.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 20, 2006, 06:44:07 AM
And there's also the match-up consideration. 

OWU matchs up pretty well against Wooster in that they were able to post up inside and score against the Scots.  I haven't seen them play Witt, but I'd suspect that the Russ-Borchers combination would make that tactic a much tougher go.  Still, OWU-Witt three is a game that I'm interested in seeing since OWU has impressed me twice with their poise and shooting ability.  Witt is surely a clear favorite, but I give OWU a puncher's chance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 20, 2006, 07:06:31 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 20, 2006, 06:44:07 AMWitt is surely a clear favorite, but I give OWU a puncher's chance.

Yeah, "a puncher's chance" sounds to me like a much more apt way to characterize the possibility of a Bishops upset of the Tigers than the "it's hard to beat a team three times" cliche.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2006, 11:15:31 AM
Sorry to get you all riled up Sager, but I guess my explaination of that old cliche wasn't clear enough, and after going back and re-reading it, I can see how it would've easily been interpreted as you did. 

What I was trying to explain was the reasons as to why I would be pulling for OWU over Witt if they happened to meet up on Friday.  My reference of using that old cliche was in regards to Wooster beating Wittenberg 3 times, not Witt beating OWU 3 times.  I am sorry that I didn't do a better job in  clarifying that point. 

Also, its just a cliche.  It's not like I would stake my life to it.  I was just merely commenting on how hard it is to beat a team that you are fairly evenly matched up with 3 times in a season.  I don't really find it that difficult to buy into.  You mentioned:

Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 20, 2006, 03:49:27 AM

If Illinois Wesleyan manages to beat Augie in the third game between the two, it won't be because of that silly "it's hard to beat a team three times" cliche. It'll be because the margin between the two teams is already so narrow that it's quite possible Illinois Wesleyan can win on their own merits.


You may be right, but that silly cliche will ususally be the first thing that comes out of the mouths of everyone after the fact no matter how much you hate it.  I would wager a bet that if IWU pulls out the win over Augie on Friday, you will find a quote somewhere from a player or a coach, or a reporter will ask about that silly cliche.  And the same goes for Wooster and Wittenberg if they happen to hook up again for a 3rd time Saturday.

Sorry again for the confusion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on February 20, 2006, 11:37:10 AM
vegas odds are in for the conference tournament outright title.

Wooster-----------2/1
Wittenberg--------2.5/1
Ohio Wesleyan---15/1
Wabash------------17/1
Field-----------------501/1

I imagine these lines will change as some more bets roll in.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on February 20, 2006, 12:44:04 PM
So your saying there's a chance!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 20, 2006, 02:43:49 PM
I have a question for any Wooster fans that would like to share their insights with a Witt fan?

1-what are the good bars in town for a little pre-gaming?

2-is there any early or previous knowledge about the ticket situation for the tournament this weekend? particularly the witt/wooster showdown that WILL happen this weekend. i know everyone will jump my case but i've been right with every prediction this year. i predicted the let down against allegheny and the close game at wabash, along with the easy wins against OWU. i didnt predict against wooster because anything can happen
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2006, 03:09:17 PM
Wow, with your prediction skills you should hang out your shingle.

Jeez, who WOULDN'T predict that stuff??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2006, 03:20:29 PM
penn,

There aren't really a whole lot of "good" bars in Wooster.  Probably your best bet would be at the local Applebees which is on the north end of town.  There is also a steakhouse up there called Jakes that has a nice bar area too.  There is also a local favorite downtown called the Olde Jaol Tavern.  They have the best selection of beers IMO.

As for the ticket situation, I don't believe tickets for the finals go on sale until after the semi-finals.  They should be available at certain times on Saturday as well.  Hope this helps you out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2006, 03:38:15 PM
penn,

There is also a Buffalo Wild Wings on the north end as well that I forgot to mention, but for good reason.  If you like partying with what amounts to be a bunch of young white trash, than this is the perfect place for you.  Personally, I would steer clear of it though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 20, 2006, 03:45:26 PM
Jakes?  Is that a new place, I've never heard of it.  Is it any good?

Wooster isn't exactly a partying, happening town.  At my age, I'm fine with that, but if I was younger, I'd go crazy living here.

I'd agree with Scotsfan on the Olde Jaol Tavern.  Kind of a standard sports bar with decent food.  I also agree with him about the BW3.  Tried it once, never been back.




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scotty on February 20, 2006, 04:06:02 PM
Olde Jaol Tavern gets my vote...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopsfan1111 on February 20, 2006, 04:08:36 PM
Penn-

I think BW3 (North end of town) is just fine (and I don't think I am white trash  ;))...it is more of a 'bar' atmosphere than Applebee's and Jake's which are more of a restaurant (also on North end of town).  BW3 is often really smoky, just a warning.  The Olde Jaol Tavern (Downtown) is a great spot, earlier in the day though it is more of a restaurant style and later in the evening turns into more of a bar atmosphere...one of my favorite places to go.  They have great LIT's too!

There is also "Decades" formerly called Diggers.  This is another bar, but not one I would recommend unless you want to get in a fight with a local :D Just kidding, it can be fun, they have pool there as well.  

I guess it just depends what type of place you are looking for...

Hopefully that helps...:)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2006, 04:13:56 PM
I'm going to go out on a limb here and make my NCAC first round predictions:

Wooster will win by double digits over Kenyon.

Wittenberg will win by double digits over Denison.

Ohio Wesleyan should win by double digits over Allegheny, but if the Majzlik man, McCloskey and Hollihan have good games it could be close.

Wabash and Earlham will play a close game that may be decided in the last five minutes or so. Whatever teams hits its free throws will win.

How's that??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on February 20, 2006, 04:33:04 PM
Smeds,
I would agree with each of your picks. The "final 4" of the NCAC tourney should be a very exciting few games. Tournament time is finally here which is good (drama, excitement, close games, magical runs) but bad (season over, careers over). Good luck to all the teams especially the Scots and here's hoping that the NCAC teams that get into the National Tournament make some noise.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 20, 2006, 04:38:58 PM
Alright, why don't we get specific here, if ya know what I mean.  :)  Let's pick the actual point differential and see who comes closest, overall, for the four games on Tuesday night.

In this contest, you get 25 points if you pick the correct winner of a ballgame.  You lose a point for every point that you're off on the differential (in either direction).  If you don't get the winner right, you get nothing no matter how close your differential was.  So, if you hit all four winners, and have the exact margin of victory in each, you'll have 100 points.  Anybody does that, I'll buy 'em beer all night, anywhere in Wooster.

Examples:

If you pick Wooster by 3 over Kenyon and Kenyon wins by 1, you get no points, even though you were only 4 points off on the margin.  You had the wrong winner.

If you pick Wooster by 10 and they win by 40, you get no points, as the 25 you earned for the correct winner is negated by being off by 30 in the differential.  You can't get minus points for a game.

If you pick Wooster by 10 and they win by 16 (or 4), you earn 19 points for that game.  For you Hiram guys, that's 25-6=19.  :)

My picks:

Wooster by 22 over Kenyon.
Wittenberg by 23 over Denison.
OWU by 17 over Allegheny.
Wabash by 4 over Earlham.

By the way, who is coming to see the semifinals/finals?  Who is coming, no matter what?  Who is coming if their team is playing?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 20, 2006, 04:48:14 PM
thanks for all the advice on pre gaming areas around Wooster-i and my roommate will be headed up only if witt advances friday night as i have to work friday night so i wont be in attendance, so hopefully the fierce witt squad shows up to play
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on February 20, 2006, 04:58:14 PM
Wooster by 32 over Kenyon
Wittenberg by 19 over Denison
OWU by 9 over Gheny and last but not least
Quakers by 2 over Bash

I will be up Saturday for the championship game barring a scot's upset before then
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2006, 05:01:42 PM
Actually, my picks were supposed to be 'satirical'. Sigh... :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 20, 2006, 05:06:55 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 20, 2006, 05:01:42 PM
Actually, my picks were supposed to be 'satirical'. Sigh... :(

I know they were; that's why I wanted to see you have to actually scratch your cranium.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2006, 05:11:02 PM
I think Allegheny is going to upset OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on February 20, 2006, 05:14:30 PM
Wooster by 39 over Kenyon
Wittenberg by 35 over Denison
OWU by 19 over Allegheny
Wabash by 4 over Earlham
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on February 20, 2006, 05:22:06 PM
wooster by 35
witt by 21
OWU by 7
bash by 3

(looks a little like football picks in hindsight..)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 20, 2006, 05:26:09 PM
longtime, no Quaker talk:

Earlhamalum and I were in Richmond to watch Earlham's easy win Saturday. We also decided that we are both traveling to Wooster together if Earlham wins Tuesday at Wabash. Then, we are staying for the finals on Saturday no matter the results on Friday.

Obviously the #4-5 game is supposed to be the most spirited and competitive of the quarterfinal contests. Well, I think tomorrow night will be more than spirited. Earlham, despite the final minute collapses against Witt, Wabash and OWU, has been playing well over the past 3 weeks. Although Denison is fading fast, I was impressed with the way Earlham never let up in the easy win last week. Saturday was similar. Oberlin only once made a small run, cutting a 10-point lead to three midway through the first half. After that, Earlham dominated play on both ends and led by 20+ the entire second half. More encouraging news: Earlham has actually shot the ball fairly well at the line. I know there's been more work put in on that end, it's starting to show.

The last three games in Crawfordsville have all been low-scoring, defensive affairs. Honestly, we could probably just put five minutes on the clock and save both teams a lot of trouble. I'm with you Smeds, it's going to be a close game and free throws/turnovers/second chance points will decide this game in the final minutes. Wish I could be there....but I'm hoping like crazy Earlham pulls this one out so I can see them at least once more this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on February 20, 2006, 05:37:07 PM
Woo by 24 over Ken
Witt by 18 over Den
OWU by 8 over Gheny
Bash by 5 over Earl

Woo Boo I will hold you to your offer of a night of free beer if the basketball gods let these predictions to follow thru!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2006, 05:48:17 PM
Wooster by 33 over Kenyon
Wittenberg by 24 over Denison
Allegheny by 2 over OWU
Wabash by 5 over Earlham

I will miss the conference semis and finals, as I am scheduled to be on days 2 and 3 of my post-bar exam bender those days.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 20, 2006, 05:51:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 20, 2006, 05:48:17 PMI will miss the conference semis and finals, as I am scheduled to be on days 2 and 3 of my post-bar exam bender those days.  :D

I only have a vague recollection of that week following the bar. And what I do remember is awfully painful. Good times.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2006, 06:32:23 PM
Ok...

Wooster by 29
Witt by 26
OWU by 9
Wabash by 4
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 20, 2006, 06:48:41 PM
here's my winning picks

Wooster by 33
Witt by 23
OWU by 13
Wabash by 3

Witt drops to 6th in the top 25 today and wooster drops to 3rd-significance in selection committee's eyes, nothing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 20, 2006, 06:49:26 PM
Wooster over Kenyon by 28
Witt over Denison by 21
OWU over Gheny by 13
Wabash over Earlham by 7
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 20, 2006, 07:03:04 PM
WHAT? We all get FREE BEER if we come within 50 points of the differential!!!
Start lining 'em up bartender!!!

I be at Timken for all four games. (Hopefully)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2006, 07:08:50 PM
The d3hoops top 25 means NOTHING to the selection committee. Because a ranked team or two may be left out this year, anyway.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Hoops MacPherson on February 20, 2006, 07:34:08 PM
1st round predictions:

Wooster 92, Kenyon 59 (Coach Moore gets technical with Scots up 35, giving Kenyon the cover)
Wittenberg 73, Denison 46 (Big Red stopped caring weeks ago)
Ohio Wesleyan 76, Allegheny 68 (Gators a year away)
Earlham 95, Wabash 94 (Can't pick a school with no women)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 20, 2006, 07:34:58 PM
Wooster over Kenyon by 37
Witt over Denison by 26
OWU over Allegheny by 9
Wabash over Earlham by 4

I won't be at any of the games, as I'll be in Springfield, working the women's tourney . . .

Which leads me to this question - any video broadcast of the men's final being talked about anywhere?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 20, 2006, 08:09:05 PM
Wooster by 42
Witt by 18
OWU by 14
Wabash by 11

I figured I'm so bad at picking that I'll be Right by being Wrong!  It is Official I'll be in the lovely city of Crawfordsville tomorrow evening with Brady Keaton!  If Earlham can get the win tomorrow then i'll be off to Wooster on Friday.  I have never been to a Wooster/Wittenberg game and I'm hoping that Earlham will pull off the Upset tomorrow night so I'll be in the lovely confines of Timken Gym on Friday and Saturday!  God I love this game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 20, 2006, 08:32:26 PM
By the way, I'm taking a break from my Sports and Society course (yes, I'm getting graduate credit at Northwestern for taking such a class) and reading all of these predictions.

We've just spent the last two hours discussing Pete Rose and his gambling habits as evidenced by the Dowd Report. I must say, I'm feeling a little quesy reading about lines, pools and free beer.

Only God and George Fox can save you. Follow the Inner Light says the Quaker  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 20, 2006, 08:37:16 PM
billy us penn state fans have to stick together. i hope earlham pulls it out as i think they match up better with wooster than wabash-too contrastive of styles for them as opposed to an earlham or  OWU as referenced saturday
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 20, 2006, 08:51:55 PM
With 12 predictions in so far, here's the consensus:

Wooster over Kenyon, 12-0, by an average of 32.
Wittenberg over Denison, 12-0, by an average of 23.
OWU over Allegheny, 11-1, by an average of 10.
Wabash over Earlham, 10-2, by an average of 4.

Vanilla24COW has the average Wooster margin right on the money.
Wooster Booster and pennstghs have the average Witt margin exactly.
Wooster Booster, bishopsfan, Smedindy, and jscwittfan all have the average Wabash margin exactly.

I'll take predictions up until around 6 PM tomorrow evening before heading over to the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 20, 2006, 09:15:39 PM
Ya know I really can't believe there isn't a single mention about the new poll in here.

I just wondered what everyone thought about Hope being #2 and Wooster #3.

My personal feeling is ........well shock, I didn't think Wooster would drop past #2 with seemingly the best resume of the 2 loss teams.  I didn't expect Hope to move up that much with two wins over mediocre competition.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on February 20, 2006, 09:28:01 PM
I think this is a case of whose loss in most recent in the memory of the voters.. Wooster JUST lost saterday and its been longer than that since hope lost.. hopefully things will shake out when NCAA tourney time comes around
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 20, 2006, 09:33:10 PM
Wooster by 33
Witt by 27
OWU by 12
Wabash by 7
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2006, 09:56:02 PM
I don't think it's a surprise Wooster moved to #3. Lawrence of course deserves to be #1 and Hope probably deserves #2 right now.

We will see though. We will see.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2006, 10:34:03 PM
Quote from: sac on February 20, 2006, 09:15:39 PM
Ya know I really can't believe there isn't a single mention about the new poll in here.

I just wondered what everyone thought about Hope being #2 and Wooster #3.

My personal feeling is ........well shock, I didn't think Wooster would drop past #2 with seemingly the best resume of the 2 loss teams.  I didn't expect Hope to move up that much with two wins over mediocre competition.

I didn't expect it, either, but Hope and Wooster are virtually tied (two points separate them), and that's perfectly fine with me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 20, 2006, 10:40:10 PM
My picks:

Wooster over Kenyon by 30
Wittenberg over Denison by 15
OWU over Allegheny by 12
Earlham over Wabash by 5
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 20, 2006, 10:53:12 PM
smed you're a little late i mentioned this earlier today-check it and you'll see im right. like i said earlier-the polls are meaningless-they're just up for bragging rights. wooster and witt being ranked lower this week wont make them try less because they're not ranked as high so the discussion of this topic is kind of pointless
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 20, 2006, 11:20:17 PM
and by smed i meant sac in that last post-my apologies
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Lboogz15 on February 20, 2006, 11:52:15 PM
What would be the starting five players you would choose to start for your team plus two reserves? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 12:04:39 AM
I was checking out the stats of Lincoln University in Pennsylvania, and came across an unbelievable line.

Kyle Myrick
25 Games
952 Minutes
38.1 M/PG
314-659 .476 
48-145 .331
143-187 .765   
101 Rebounds
4.0 R/PG 
194 Assists
119 Turnovers   
84 Steals
819 Points
32.8 P/PG

Lincoln scores 96 points a game, while giving up 82.6.  This guy Myrick (a 6'1" senior guard out of Overbrook High School in Philly, the home of Wilt Chamberlain and the somewhat lesser known Wayne Hightower) scored over 1/3 of their points, plus found the time to dish out 194 assists and to turn the ball over 119 times.  When he turned it over, he stole it back 84 of those times. ;-)  If the ball isn't in his hands, he's either just shot it, passed it, or dribbled it out of bounds off his foot.  I want to see these guys play.

After looking further at the Lincoln website, I found this:

Myrick, the nation's leading returning scorer, enters the 2005-06 season as a second-team pre-season All-American selection by Street & Smith's College Basketball magazine.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: njlincolnlion on February 21, 2006, 12:12:42 AM
Wooster Booster:

Kyle "Fase" Myrick is the real deal!, and he has a very good supporting cast.  Last year Lincoln was a "two man" team with Myrick and Jarrett Kearse.  Myrick ranks nationally in points, assists, and steals.  His backcourt mate Sami Wylie ranks nationally in 3 pointers, and Darryl White is nationally ranked in blocked shots.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 12:48:43 AM
Lincoln's power ratings and SOS are really good. I think they are legit. I voted them really high in the Poster's Poll, because the numbers worked out - it's just that they're not in a conference at the time so the schedule is all front loaded.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 21, 2006, 08:01:15 AM
It is not too late.  I can still get in.

Wooster by 33 over Kenyon (96-63)
Wittenberg by 30 over Denison (70-40)
OWU by 19 over Allegheny (82-63)
Wabash by 3 over Earlham  (71-68)

Second round could be very interesting with Wabash and OWU upsets down the stretch.  Of course these games will be in Wooster which favor WITT and WOO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 21, 2006, 10:00:55 AM
Good luck to everyone!!

I am pretty sure the home teams will rule the first round.

Though I think Earlham/Wabash will be a war!!

Best to all the seniors who gave us a terrific 4 years!!

Now if we can just get the Wabash crazys to drop the "Ohio Sucks" cheer everything should be OK.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 10:05:31 AM
A lot of us here wish the same thing, DFan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 21, 2006, 10:06:40 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 20, 2006, 10:34:03 PM
I didn't expect it, either, but Hope and Wooster are virtually tied (two points separate them), and that's perfectly fine with me.

Perfectly fine with me too   ;D

Of course as silly as the D3 tournament organization is, the MIAA board is having to discuss how the team which can get a #2 ranking in a national poll (though admittedly an unofficial one) is just one more last second 3 point miracle away from tournament bubble territory. Stupid but possible.

As long as I'm here, I might as well pick the games for the heck of it. Random guesses from someone who hasn't seen any NCAC teams play for a full year:

Wooster by 22
Witt by 16
OWU by 10
Wabash by 4
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on February 21, 2006, 10:13:51 AM
Here's hoping that the Scots meet Virginia Wesleyan in the tournament, judging from the photo on the front the cheerleaders could provide some nice scenery plus the game itself should be a good matchup. Good Luck tonight Scots
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 21, 2006, 10:52:52 AM
Here's my picks for tonight's action:

Wooster over Kenyon by 34.  GO SCOTS!!!
Wittenberg over Denison by 26.
OWU over 'Gheny by 12.
Wabash over the EC by 5.  I predict the EC to blow yet another 2nd half lead and lose again in OT.

There was one place I forgot to mention for the bar scene in Wooster.  It is C.W. Burgerstein's or C dubs as we locals like to refer to it as.  I mentioned this one especially for penn and his roomate and any other Witt fans, because they have a version of the black & tan using Great Lakes Dortmunder Gold called a "Black & Gold" for the College of Wooster. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 11:31:13 AM
Quote from: DenisonFan on February 21, 2006, 10:00:55 AMNow if we can just get the Wabash crazys to drop the "Ohio Sucks" cheer everything should be OK.

Quote from: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 10:05:31 AMA lot of us here wish the same thing, DFan.

I'm not necessarily defending it but what makes that one so bad? It's not "**** on Witt" or any of the other more vulgar taunts that have been reported on this board. And it's fairly tame by what I recall being yelled out at games when I was a student.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 11:34:42 AM
Well, for one it doesn't really MEAN anything.

For two, what if one of our players, or our top recruits, is from Ohio.

For three, it's not creative at all. Get creative, folks.

For four, no matter what was yelled when you were a student, it's imperative for Wabash men to show some class and be gentlemen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 12:03:52 PM
One of my favorites, when I first heard it and it was creative, is "Drive Home safely".  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 12:07:25 PM
I like that one!

I remember, as a kid, the Wabash smart-asses chanted:

"Repulse them! Repulse them! Make them relinquish the spheroid!"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 21, 2006, 12:20:55 PM
Okay I will have to Give a Wabash Student some Credit. 

Senior year... i think we were down 15+ at halftime.  Billy_Pilgram was in front of me with the Old School Rebok Pumps on and this is what i heard.

Hey number 14 you need to pump up your F@cking Team. 

That was Classic!  It was hard not to crack a smile!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 12:23:11 PM
When I was a kid, way back in the sixties, our high school cheerleaders were doing a forerunner of that one:

"Harrass them, harrass them, make them relinquish the ball!"

That was their only reasonably cool cheer.  The rest of them were incredibly lame.

One of my favorite chants of all-time is the one that goes "Everywere we go, people wanna know, whooo we are..."

There's a really long version of it, but I can't remember the words.  At the Ohio high school volleyball championships a few years ago, hundreds of girl students from Cincinnati's Ursuline Academy began doing chanting that one as they marched down the aisles of the Nutter Center at Wright State.  I loved it, even though Wooster was there to play them, and they stomped us.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on February 21, 2006, 12:28:37 PM
who is responsible for giving out karma and why do i look like a spread for witt v. allegheny
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on February 21, 2006, 12:36:24 PM
Wabash students were always the best to play in front of...I can remember them really giving it to MoneyballSTL44 about his "stat keeping" abilities
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 21, 2006, 12:40:52 PM
This answers your questions in general:

http://www.d3hoops.com/faq.php?question=41

In the context of the NCAC board, your karma looks the way it does because your screen name is blasphemous to the Wooster multitude here given your allegiance.  It also doesn't help that you've posted anything critical of Wooster.  That sort of behavior just doesn't fly in this little corner of cyberspace.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 21, 2006, 12:50:24 PM
 ??? :o :P ::) Oh no i'm going to run out of applaud...  My goal was to get everyone ABOVE the 0 or negative and give them + karma..... Darn it.. i think i got the Bash Fans out of trouble.. DF no chance.. I'll see what i can do BNEL if you change your name!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 12:56:00 PM
You also need people to stop cannibalizing their own posters.

(Yeah, I'm looking at YOU!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 12:57:14 PM
EA,

I appreciate the help. But I lose one point, then regain said point, pretty much every day.

That "pump" chant is pretty funny.

Quote from: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 11:34:42 AMit's imperative for Wabash men to show some class and be gentlemen.

The Gentlemen's Rule doesn't preclude having fun. There's nothing vulgar about that chant. Sure it's not creative but it's not classless or ungentlemanly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 01:04:11 PM
I think many would disagree about the word "sucks" as it pertains to gentlemanly conduct, especially used in such a pejorative cheer. In fact, some sports boards ban that word from being used as it does nothing but cause people's temper to overflow and offers nothing constructive.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 21, 2006, 01:13:40 PM
Hiram head coach Tim Rice has resigned:

http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/news/article.xsp?id=813
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 01:25:55 PM
He had the numbers increasing and they gave effort, at least for a lot of the season. It's too bad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 01:28:01 PM
Posted by: seinfeld  Posted on: Today at 01:13:40 PM  

QuoteHiram head coach Tim Rice has resigned:

http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/news/article.xsp?id=813

The worst part of that whole release? It was probably written by Rice's wife, who last I knew was Hiram's SID.

Best of luck to him. Hiram poster(s): thoughts? Here's a chance to discuss something other than an intentional foul.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 01:51:11 PM
Yes, she is the Hiram SID and Director of Sports Marketing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 03:49:06 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 01:04:11 PM
I think many would disagree about the word "sucks" as it pertains to gentlemanly conduct, especially used in such a pejorative cheer. In fact, some sports boards ban that word from being used as it does nothing but cause people's temper to overflow and offers nothing constructive.

I didn't say it was a "gentlemanly" thing to say. I said I didn't think it was "ungentlemanly". I apologize for parsing words but I'm a lawyer and I think there's a difference. Sort of like the difference between "innocent" and "not guilty".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 03:51:44 PM
But it still stands that many think it IS ungentlemanly.  In fact, a couple of us were talking about that very thing in the office yesterday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 21, 2006, 03:59:04 PM
smeds-----karma for use of the word pejorative.....even if I have no idea if its used correctly. ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 21, 2006, 04:03:16 PM
One of my favorite cheers I have heard occurred at the Ohio High School State Swimming Championships.  Upper Arlington and Cincinati St. X were battling for the title and were cheering back and forth at each other.  St. X started the ever popular "We've got spirit yes we do we've got spirit how 'bout you?" cheer, and the kids from UA responded with, "We've got girls yes we do, we've got girls, how 'bout you?"  I thought that was absolutely classic! :D  

ps, I really doubt that they care how gentlemanly or ungentlemanly they are.  They're freaking college students for crying out loud.  Cut 'em some slack.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 21, 2006, 04:09:37 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 21, 2006, 12:03:52 PM
One of my favorites, when I first heard it and it was creative, is "Drive Home safely".  :)

That's a good one for blowouts. I also haven't heard it anywhere in a while, but was anyone in Ohio capping off home-court blowouts with "warm up the bus, warm up the bus"?

Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 21, 2006, 12:23:11 PM
When I was a kid, way back in the sixties, our high school cheerleaders were doing a forerunner of that one:

"Harrass them, harrass them, make them relinquish the ball!"

By the late 90's that had been updated (at least for football) to "emasculate them, emasculate them..." which of course makes more sense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 04:11:29 PM
Quoteps, I really doubt that they care how gentlemanly or ungentlemanly they are. 

You have NO idea how often discussion of the Gentleman's Rule comes up on this campus. It is germaine to a Wabash man to discuss whether an action is gentlemanly or not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 04:30:37 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 04:11:29 PMIt is germaine to a Wabash man to discuss whether an action is gentlemanly or not.

The Germans have nothing to do with this!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 21, 2006, 04:58:29 PM
Well T-minus one hour before I depart for Crawfordsville...  Let's Go EC
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 21, 2006, 05:59:43 PM
On Hiram coach Tim Rice resigning:

To me its always a difficult time for a program when their is change at the top unless it has been planned for. He did seem to genuinely care about his players, but a 15 game losing streak can eat on anyone, espcially if their is an expcctation of improvement.  I did notice that Pfouts did not play in the last three games of the season and there was no mention of it in any of the game articles. When a starter suddenly disappears with no comment it might indicate deeper problems.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 06:08:32 PM
I didn't think Pfouts was a regular starter. He started just six games. Perhaps he was hurt?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 21, 2006, 06:10:49 PM
Maybe - I don't know. The last game he played was at Wooster and he finished that game. Its just speculation on my part.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 06:15:56 PM
I do think they threw in the towel the last few games before Denison. Which is too bad and maybe why he resigned, and of course they won one for him at the end.

With that record, I hope if he interviews again for a job they understand it's Hiram!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 21, 2006, 06:24:49 PM
Quote from: andersdy on February 21, 2006, 04:09:37 PM

I also haven't heard it anywhere in a while, but was anyone in Ohio capping off home-court blowouts with "warm up the bus, warm up the bus"?


My junior year in high school, our team was ranked in the top 5 in the state, and most of our games were blowouts to say the least.  We would start the "warm up the bus" chant for games we knew wouldn't be close during warmups. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on February 21, 2006, 06:31:27 PM
in high school we always chanted start the busses Or drive home safely... But that was of course one of the few times one of our teams won !
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 07:29:44 PM
17 Predictors at tip-off.  Here we go, and Van Horn open it up with a 3.


1) Wooster Booster
Wooster by 22 over Kenyon.
Wittenberg by 23 over Denison.
OWU by 17 over Allegheny.
Wabash by 4 over Earlham.

2 )Vanilla24COW
Wooster by 32 over Kenyon
Wittenberg by 19 over Denison
OWU by 9 over Gheny and last but not least
Quakers by 2 over Bash

3) bishopsfan
Wooster by 39 over Kenyon
Wittenberg by 35 over Denison
OWU by 19 over Allegheny
Wabash by 4 over Earlham

4) Ryder16
wooster by 35
witt by 21
OWU by 7
bash by 3

5) jimmychitwood15
Woo by 24 over Ken
Witt by 18 over Den
OWU by 8 over Gheny
Bash by 5 over Earl

6) David Collinge
Wooster by 33 over Kenyon
Wittenberg by 24 over Denison
Allegheny by 2 over OWU
Wabash by 5 over Earlham

7) Smedindy
Wooster by 29
Witt by 26
OWU by 9
Wabash by 4

8) pennstghs
Wooster by 33
Witt by 23
OWU by 13
Wabash by 3

9) zosobob
Wooster over Kenyon by 28
Witt over Denison by 21
OWU over Gheny by 13
Wabash over Earlham by 7

10) Hoops MacPherson
Wooster 92, Kenyon 59 (Coach Moore gets technical with Scots up 35, giving Kenyon the cover)
Wittenberg 73, Denison 46 (Big Red stopped caring weeks ago)
Ohio Wesleyan 76, Allegheny 68 (Gators a year away)
Earlham 95, Wabash 94 (Can't pick a school with no women)

11) jscwittfan
Wooster over Kenyon by 37
Witt over Denison by 26
OWU over Allegheny by 9
Wabash over Earlham by 4

12) earlhamalum
Wooster by 42
Witt by 18
OWU by 14
Wabash by 11

13) imderekpoe
Wooster by 33
Witt by 27
OWU by 12
Wabash by 7

14) scotsbrod
Wooster over Kenyon by 30
Wittenberg over Denison by 15
OWU over Allegheny by 12
Earlham over Wabash by 5

15) WoosterFAN
Wooster by 33 over Kenyon (96-63)
Wittenberg by 30 over Denison (70-40)
OWU by 19 over Allegheny (82-63)
Wabash by 3 over Earlham  (71-68)

16) andersdy
Wooster by 22
Witt by 16
OWU by 10
Wabash by 4

17) ScotsFan
Wooster over Kenyon by 34. 
Wittenberg over Denison by 26.
OWU over 'Gheny by 12.
Wabash over the EC by 5.
  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 07:35:19 PM
This bites. The Wabash broadcast isn't working.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 07:38:19 PM
I know it. I just downloaded RealPlayer to listen to the game.

Earlham does have free Teamline.......but I warn you well in advance, you are going to hear the worst broadcast of all time
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 07:47:26 PM
Wooster leads 13-11 with 11:20 to go.
Haddix to go to the line to shoot two.
Makes the first, then the second. 
13 all. Formato back in.
Johnson finally hits, giving Wooster a 15-13 lead,
under 10 minutes to go.

Van Horn scores on a drive, 17-13.
Aarce hits a long three, 17-17.
Travelling on Bidwell, 8:17 to go.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 07:49:04 PM
Let me know if that Wabash feed ever gets fixed.......I'd love to switch over, even if it means hearing the hometown broadcast.

Right now.....10 minutes to go in first:

Wabash up 5
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 07:49:35 PM
Never mind. Teamline is working now. I'm not so upset anymore.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 07:51:17 PM
Klinger's shot on a drive rejected by Vandervaart.  Kenyon keeps the ball. Kenyon leads on the boards, 12-8.
Bediako called for the offensive foul, his third, and he'll leave the game.

17-16, Wooster.

Vandervaart scores down low, 19-16.

Kenyon turns it over on a bad pass.
Cooper misses, but tipped in by Port, his first points,
21-16.

Aarce a miss, Port the rebound, a break and Witucky scores on the lay-in. Timeout Kenyon. 6:23 to go, Wooster leads, 23-16.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 07:58:22 PM
A Kenyon miss, Van Horn rebound, and Vandervaart scores at the other end. 25-16. Formato fouled by Vandervaart.  5:40 to go.

Formato a miss, Kenyon 5 misses in a row.
Vandervaart fouled, ball out of bounds, 6th Kenyon foul.
Port an airball, Cooper the offensive rebound, to Vandervaart who scores. 11 point lead, 10-0 run.

Haddix finally scores for Kenyon. 27-18.
Port misses another three, Wooster 1-9 from out there.

Van Horn a three after a break, 30-18. He has both Wooster threes.

Cooper the rebound, Port misses a three, so does Cooper, and a foul on Wooster, Van Horn, his second.  3:25 to go.

Vandervaart a block, the break again, Bidwell finishing on a break, and he'll go to the line to try to make it a three-point play.  Misses it, but a land violation.  Misses again.  Sheesh.  32-18.

Under 3 minutes in the half.

Cooper another rebound. Bidwell a three, 35-18. 2:15 to go, first half.

Johnson scores on a drive, and he's fouled. 37-18.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 08:02:50 PM
Johnson makes the free throw, and a 20-pt lead.
Aarce misses a three.
Will has his shot blocked, but he's fouled. 1:12 to go, Will to shoot two, and he misses the first.  Makes the second.

Johnson a steal, scores as he's fouled. 23 point lead. Makes the free throw. 

42-18 at the half, as Wooster went on a 25-2 run from 17-16.

Looks like those who picked Wooster the biggest will do well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 08:03:04 PM
Billy_P,


the Wabash broadcast is now working.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 21, 2006, 08:03:08 PM
Halftime score

Wooster 42
Kenyon 18
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 08:03:53 PM
that looks like a halftime score for the football game. Well, except for the 18 that is.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 08:08:34 PM
Halftime in Crawfordsville:

Earlham 24,
Wabash 24


No surprises: cold shooting, good defense, loud crowd.

Wabash led by as many as 7....Earlham closes with a prolonged 11-4 run.

All stats sound pretty even.


Wabash broadcast sounds good...........were those minutes listening to Teamline painful for you Lil' Giant?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 08:10:37 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 08:08:34 PMwere those minutes listening to Teamline painful for you Lil' Giant?

Yeah. The fritos and bean dip made it tolerable. And it was better than nothing. But not much.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 08:18:10 PM
OWU 65-34 all over Allegheny at the half.

Witt by only 5 over Denison, 32-27, with 2 minutes in the first half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 08:21:55 PM
54-18 Wooster, as they hit four straight threes.  Nothing more to see here, I'm gonna try to get the Witt game.

56-18, Wooster on a 39-2 run.  Kenyon finally scores on a Lawrence shot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 08:22:09 PM
Kyle Medeiros out for the 2nd half of the game against Earlham......

really feel bad for him

similar situation with Hodgkinson last year against the Quakers
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 21, 2006, 08:23:31 PM
Word from the Wabash broadcast right before the second half is that Kyle Medeiros is out for the remainder of this game with a left knee injury.  This could be a big loss for Wabash...or this could be where Mac's strategy of interchangeable parts pays off.  Time will tell...20 minutes to the semis.  This is going to be a good half.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 21, 2006, 08:27:18 PM
Someone tell the Kenyon players to quit trying to do the backstoke down the court.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 08:32:47 PM
Earlham with a big run.......Quakers lead 39-30.

BUT, LaRon Henry just missed a breakaway dunk.

If Earlham loses in OT, I may not wake up tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 08:33:41 PM
Wittenberg 42-32 at the half.  Russ 12, Borchers 10.  2 points for Hodgkinson, 0 for Hern. Wow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 08:39:26 PM
Billy_P

The way the Quakers are shooting if they lose I won't wake up tomorrow either.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 21, 2006, 08:42:09 PM
And it's officially nuts at Chadwick.  Wabash just finished off a nice run capped by a putback dunk by Zimmer and a three pointer by Jimmy Owens.  It's a one point Earlham lead and you couldn't hear a jet taking off inside Chadwick right now.  It's loud. 

Earlham works the lead back to 4.  Miller picks up his fourth foul of the game.  Zimmer makes both free throws to cut the lead to 2 and has 20 for the game.  Lyttle gets a steal and ties the game on a layup.  Earlham comes back with a layup of their own.  Quakers up 2.  Miller on the bench.  That'll be huge. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 08:43:23 PM
and now...........48-47 Earlham

Wabash with a quick 7-0 run......

I can sleep now about the Henry missed dunk, it didn't affect the momentum....Earlham built the lead back up to double digits......but now Wabash right back in it
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 08:46:23 PM
15:08 left in Springfield, Wittenberg by 18, 54-36.

Wooster 85-37.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 21, 2006, 08:49:18 PM
Does this qualify as a mail-in game for Kenyon?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 21, 2006, 08:52:33 PM
I love the Kenyon line about the backstroke... Need more BASH/EC posts.  Going to the end again?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 21, 2006, 08:53:52 PM
Are the Scots in post season gear?? Headbands?  I never liked it but if the whole team is doing it..then who cares.  Or do they reserve the headbands for NCAA play only?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 21, 2006, 08:57:46 PM
Final

Wooster 96
Kenyon 44
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 21, 2006, 08:58:54 PM
Wooster wins 96 Kenyon 44...I should get some credit since I hit the Wooster score right on 96...but Kenyon did not cooperate.  Now waiting on WABASH/EC winner for semi final round.  You think Coach Moore has gotten their attention?
Does OWU loss get classified as a good loss?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2006, 08:59:03 PM
Final:  Wooster 96  Kenyon 44

Wooster cruises to an opening game win in the NCAC tourney.  Wooster was led by Brandon Johnson with 17 points, James Cooper with 14 points, Andy Van Horn with 13 points, Tom Port with 10 and Devin Fulk also with 10 points.

Wooster will host the semi-final NCAC games this weekend.

Scots are now 24-2 on the season.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 09:00:01 PM
Earlham 66,
Wabash 60

1:45 to go........Tyler Stewart to shoot 1-and-1 for the Quakers out of the timeout
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 21, 2006, 09:00:53 PM
Wabash is down 66-60 with 1:45 left.  Wabash is going to need to pull a rabbit out of the hat here.  We've got a timeout for Wabash here.  Earlham will be shooting one and the bonus after the break.  

Zimmer is going off for Wabash tonight.  I think he's up to 26 for the game, a career high for the sophomore.  

Jewett makes both free throws.  Earlham up 8. 
Lyttle gets a layup for Wabash.  68-62 Quakers. 
Earlham turns the ball over.  Wabash will have it out of bounds. 
Michael Woods gets fouled by an Earlham player (Henry).  Woods will shoot free throws.  First one is good.  68-63.  Second shot is also good.  68-64.  1:10 left.
Earlham working the shot clock with this possession.  Wabash finally commits a foul.  Both teams are in the double bonus.  The first Earlham free throw is good.  As is the second.  70-64. 
Simkus misses a three for Wabash, but the rebound is tipped in by Zimmer.  Zimmer is out of his mind tonight.  70-66 Earlham.  Time running out.  Joseph commits a foul on Stewart.  Mac calls a 30 second timeout.

First shot is good.  History is definitely not repeating itself here.  Second shot is good.  Earlham back up 6. 

Simkus takes a three for Wabash, the shot is no good.  Lyttle fouls immediately.  Wabash is in serious trouble here.  Another timeout for Mac. 

Collins makes both free throws.  Earlham is 21-24 at the stripe.  That's how you win games. 

Wabash gets a three pointer to go and lead is 74-69.  Henry gets hacked hard going for a layup. 

Earlham hits both free throws and this one is over.  Earlham will advance to the semis vs. Wooster. 

Congrats to the Quakers...they really stepped up when Wabash brought the heat in the second half. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 21, 2006, 09:01:32 PM
Switched to BASH/EC game...these are classics!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 09:05:05 PM
70-66 Earlham

40 seconds left........Stewart to shoot two for Earlham out of the timeout
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 09:06:57 PM
No FT problems for Earlham tonight.  :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 21, 2006, 09:07:38 PM
Now I hear the "start the bus" cheer.  WABASH has resorted to missing 3's and fouling and EC is hitting all the FTs
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 09:10:01 PM
I hate that chant.  >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 09:10:13 PM
ummmmmmmmmmmm...........

Is Wabash really pulling the "you're going to work for us one day" cheer??????


ummmmmmmmm..............................ok
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 21, 2006, 09:11:01 PM
WABASH comes back with "That's alright. That's OK. You'll work for us one day" cheer.
If I was EARLHAM I would reply with "scoreboard" cheer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 09:11:08 PM
Wittenberg 75, Denison 57, 4:18 to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 09:12:03 PM
A far far dumber chant than any possible thing the Wabash crowd could come up with at that point. I really really hate that chant.

That said, congrats to Earlham. YOu guys took care of your FT problems, shot well and deserved the win. Good luck as you move on.

Here's to baseball season.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 21, 2006, 09:15:50 PM
On the subject of chants:

In football season, the Scot Marching band has a couple good ones- the "emasculate them, emasculate them, make them relinquish the ball" cheer is standard, as someone mentioned above.

Against OWU Bishops, that cheer becomes "Defrock them, Defrock them, make them relinquish their vows!"   ;)

And, last time Denison came to Wooster, a couple creative Woo brass players made a little arrangement of the theme from those old Big Red Gum commercials- you know, "that big red freshness lasts right through it, it just goes right on and on, while you chew it....etc" and we sang it at them.   :) :) :)

That's what I mean when I think of good, intelligent cheers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 09:21:07 PM
Really too bad that two Indiana teams couldn't advance to the weekend.....and these three between Earlham/Wabash this year were classics.


Great, now we get Team Buzzsaw. Whatever, Earlhamalum and I are making the trip. See you at one of the establishments on Friday night.

Just one note on the Wabash broadcast. Guy did a great job....and he only complained about the refs a couple of times despite saying he was trying to remain non-biased. But, one thing did bother me. He called out Henry, Jewett and Miller for having "bad attitudes" and continually "showboating". By the way, he also called out Tom Port for having a bad attitude earlier in the season. There's no room for that from a student announcer. We've mentioned throughout the day the fun that the Wabash students like to have at games. If players are going to respond to those students (and their sometimes vulgar chants or statements) and back it up (as was the case in a road conference tourney win with emotions high), leave it alone. Those are just college kids having fun........

Maybe not well explained, but it did bug me during the broadcast that he called out Jewett repeatedly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 09:24:44 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 09:21:07 PM
There's no room for that from a student announcer.

Does it matter that he's a student? If he'd been an adult staff member it would be okay? I don't understand that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 21, 2006, 09:29:01 PM
Wooster quietly turned in a solid performance tonight.

Kenyon shot horribly, which contributed to the lowest point total Wooster has allowed all season (next lowest, 52 against the coll. of New Jersey, which plays totally anti-Wooster's style).  But Wooster's defensive intensity was impressive- lots of forced turnovers and almost turnovers, though they were definitely burned a few times for their aggressive defensive play.

I don't want to talk about the officiating, since it really didn't matter in the overall scheme of the game- if other Wooster posters want to complain there probably were a few calls Wooster didn't get.  However, it seemed to me that on the whole the officials let quite a bit of contact go on both sides––especially early on.

Wooster took what was a surprising 42-18 advantage (since it hardly seemed like they played a good first half, shooting 20% or so from 3 pt land) and quickly put it out of reach early in the second making their first 6 or 7 threes for the half.

Kenyon came out intense- early on it looked like we were going to have a hotly contested game on our hands.  Kenyon was leading in rebounds early, and hanging with Wooster basket for basket- but it turned out to be mostly due to the fact that Wooster's offense was not producing.

We'll see how well Wooster's defensive intensity holds up against Earlham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2006, 09:29:38 PM
Elsewhere, OWU smacks Allegheny 106-67.  I wonder who that single moron was that picked Allegheny to win this game?  ::) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 21, 2006, 09:30:40 PM
He called Jewett out after Jewett was barking at the Wabash bench after he made an outlet pass that led to the Miller dunk late in the game.  The students dish it out and they can take it...in fact they feed on that (the worst thing you can do at Chadwick is try to taunt back).  Jawing at the Wabash bench is over the line.  That's what he was getting at.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 21, 2006, 09:31:38 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 21, 2006, 09:29:01 PM
Wooster quietly turned in a solid performance tonight.

There's very little thats quiet about a 52 point victory   I nominate this for understatement of the night. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 21, 2006, 09:32:13 PM
83-61
WITT wins over Denison and faces OWU in the early game at WOOSTER.
27 point from Dan Russ..can you say MVP.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 21, 2006, 09:33:22 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 21, 2006, 09:29:38 PM
Elsewhere, OWU smacks Allegheny 106-67.  I wonder who that single moron was that picked Allegheny to win this game?  ::) :D

Wow.  Even though Allegheny isn't a very good team, OWU is playing dominant basketball, with the win against Woo and the blowout win on Allegheny.

I wonder if they'll be just as fired up and driven to beat Witt on a neutral floor...wait- has anyone confirmed a Witt victory yet?

And I see Witt has won, thanks to the warning about new posts...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 09:35:20 PM
OWU is scary hot right now. Witt should beware.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 09:35:48 PM
What was the final score in the Earlham victory?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 21, 2006, 09:36:11 PM
Quote from: sac on February 21, 2006, 09:31:38 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 21, 2006, 09:29:01 PM
Wooster quietly turned in a solid performance tonight.

There's very little thats quiet about a 52 point victory   I nominate this for understatement of the night. ;D

True, on the scoreboard.  I should have said that it was quiet while Wooster was beating Kenyon by 52...because the Wooster crowd seemed pretty small and pretty calm most of the game.  The only real flourish was the early second half, and after that the game was decided.

Probably saving our energies for the weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 09:37:06 PM
I'd say this.

I could understand an 85-year old oldtimer with that old "this isn't how it used to be attitude."

But a student, probably knowing what his frat brothers are saying to those players or could at least imagine, shouldn't react the same way in my mind.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on February 21, 2006, 09:39:07 PM
Russ and Borchers got nasty with some dunks, and witt was looking a little better in the half court. Hill and Howard combine for 25. I think Hodgkinsons mom wanted a few more foul calls but what can you say.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 09:42:17 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 09:37:06 PM
I'd say this.

I could understand an 85-year old oldtimer with that old "this isn't how it used to be attitude."

But a student, probably knowing what his frat brothers are saying to those players or could at least imagine, shouldn't react the same way in my mind.

I agree with that. But the only callout I heard was in reference to Jewett saying something to the Wabash bench. If that is what happened I'd say that merits comment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 09:59:20 PM
Fair enough on talking to the bench.

Still, he also mentioned the attitudes of Henry and Miller. Really, it only bothered me a little. Broadcast was great and it sounded like a super-charged atmosphere.

But speaking of Jewett......huge game for him on the road. And those free throws........the karma was traveling south from Evanston, IL (96/100 today).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 09:59:40 PM
And, even when I was a student (mind you - it's been a while) I hated taunting and showboating, and I hate it now. It's abhorrent, and not 'fun' behavior. It's why I really can't stand the NBA.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 10:00:59 PM
Earlham turned it up big time in the second half. Geez. They repeatedly broke through Wabash's press with no problems. They shot 69.6% from the floor in the second half and hit all five three-pointers.

Wabash played a good 2nd half on offense, but gave up 54 points. Yowza!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 10:01:23 PM
B_P

I'm glad that these games between Earlham and Wabash have been good. I like the rivalry with the Indiana schools. It kind of reminds me of the old ICAC.

Smeds

Boy are you right about the NBA.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 10:14:37 PM
Ok - can anyone at the Witt game give me the Artie Taylor suit report?

Also, anyone at Wooster - please - I want daily updates on Friday and Saturday about the Artie Taylor suit.

I wish we had a regular Witt poster to give us the sartorial rundown every week!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 10:25:17 PM
The winner, by a narrow margin, and despite getting no points for the OWU game (as did many others), Vanilla24COW!

As expected, the three people who correctly picked Earlham finished at the top of the list, but earlhamalum, who picked against his own ballclub, wasn't too far behind.  DC, the only man to pick against OWU and to miss two games still managed to finish in the middle of the pack.

Actual Finals
Wooster 96, Kenyon 44. Wooster by 52
Wittenberg 83, Denison 61. Wittenberg by 22
OWU 106, Allegheny 67. OWU by 39.
Earlham 78, Wabash 69. Earlham by 9.

Quarterfinal Picks

1 - Vanilla24COW
Wooster by 32 over Kenyon (5)
Wittenberg by 19 over Denison (22)
OWU by 9 over Gheny (0)
Quakers by 2 over Bash. (18)
Results: 45

2 - Hoops MacPherson
Wooster 92, Kenyon 59 (6)
Wittenberg 73, Denison 46 (20)
Ohio Wesleyan 76, Allegheny 68 (0)
Earlham 95, Wabash 94 (17)
Results: 43

3 - scotsbrod
Wooster over Kenyon by 30 (3)
Wittenberg over Denison by 15 (18)
OWU over Allegheny by 12 (0)
Earlham over Wabash by 5 (21)
Results: 42

4 - earlhamalum
Wooster by 42 (15)
Witt by 18 (21)
OWU by 14 (0)
Wabash by 11 (0)
Results: 36

5 - Ryder16
wooster by 35 [8]
witt by 21 (24)
OWU by 7 (0)
bash by 3 (0)
Results: 32

6 - jscwittfan
Wooster over Kenyon by 37 (10)
Witt over Denison by 26 (21)
OWU over Allegheny by 9 (0)
Wabash over Earlham by 4 (0)
Results: 31

7 - pennstghs
Wooster by 33 (6)
Witt by 23 (24)
OWU by 13 (0)
Wabash by 3 (0)
Results: 30

8 - David Collinge
Wooster by 33 over Kenyon (6)
Wittenberg by 24 over Denison (23)
Allegheny by 2 over OWU (0)
Wabash by 5 over Earlham (0)
Results: 29

8 - bishopsfan
Wooster by 39 over Kenyon (12)
Wittenberg by 35 over Denison (12)
OWU by 19 over Allegheny (5)
Wabash by 4 over Earlham (0)
Results: 29

10 - ScotsFan
Wooster over Kenyon by 34 (7)  
Wittenberg over Denison by 26 (21)
OWU over 'Gheny by 12 (0)
Wabash over the EC by 5. (0)
Results: 28

10 - WoosterFAN
Wooster by 33 over Kenyon (6)
Wittenberg by 30 over Denison (17)
OWU by 19 over Allegheny (5)
Wabash by 3 over Earlham (0)
Results: 28

12 - Wooster Booster
Wooster by 22 over Kenyon (0)
Wittenberg by 23 over Denison. (24)
OWU by 17 over Allegheny (3)
Wabash by 4 over Earlham. (0)
Results: 27

13 - imderekpoe
Wooster by 33 (6)
Witt by 27 (20)
OWU by 12 (0)
Wabash by 7 (0)
Results: 26

14 - zosobob
Wooster over Kenyon by 28 (1)
Witt over Denison by 21 (24)
OWU over Gheny by 13 (0)
Wabash over Earlham by 7 (0)
Results: 25

15 - Smedindy
Wooster by 29 (2)
Witt by 26 (21)
OWU by 9 (0)
Wabash by 4 (0)
Results: 23

16 - jimmychitwood15
Woo by 24 over Ken (0)
Witt by 18 over Denison (21)
OWU by 8 over Gheny (0)
Bash by 5 over Earl (0)
Results: 21

17 - andersdy
Wooster by 22 (0)
Witt by 16 (19)
OWU by 10 (0)
Wabash by 4 (0)
Results: 19
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 10:28:45 PM
Any reason why LaRon Henry didn't start for Earlham. Not that it mattered, he played 30 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 21, 2006, 10:30:16 PM
Nice work, Wooster Booster.  Are you planning on doing the same thing for the semifinals?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 10:34:05 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 10:28:45 PM
Any reason why LaRon Henry didn't start for Earlham. Not that it mattered, he played 30 minutes.

Speculation would be that he was late for a shoot around or practice...not starting is typically Justus' punishment.

And back to the press that you mentioned in an earlier post. Seemed like a strange strategy to me. Earlham, though they may have shot well tonight, is stricken with droughts as often as third-world countries. Sounded like a big mistake to force tempo and give Earlham a number of easy shots....you would have thought keeping it in the halfcourt (where Earlham had no answer for Zimmer) would have given Wabash the better chance at winning.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2006, 10:36:38 PM
I'm not sure it would be as interesting with only two games.  Maybe I could include the OAC semifinals as well.  Let me think about it.  I've got a serious cold (that's why I missed the Kenyon game tonight) and need to see how that goes over the next day or two.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on February 21, 2006, 10:44:05 PM
Wooster will have free video of the semis and finals. ;D

http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/schedule.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 10:46:43 PM
Wabash has been successful with the press - and if I'm not mistaken when Mac brought in the bench against Earlham the first time at home they pressed and shook up the Quakers.

The killer, though, was Jewett with 19 points and 3 assists in the second half. Dang he was on it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 21, 2006, 10:52:16 PM
smed i resent your comment as i post on here regularly as a main witt representative. i wasnt at the game tonight as i had to work so i didnt provide feedback because i had no feedback.

in case anyone wants to know

I GOT THE MOST POINTS FOR  A SINGLE GAME BY PICKING WITT TO WIN BY 23(won by 22)----see i know my team
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2006, 11:03:38 PM
It just seems sporadic. And, can you give us the suit update for road games??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2006, 11:16:29 PM
I must have missed something this season. What's up with the "suit update"?  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 21, 2006, 11:25:47 PM
yes i can as i will be in attendance saturday night. even if i'm not vocal i am visible on the board as i have read every single post on here this entire season.

one thing while listening to the witt postgame show they seemed to reference that wabash would be playing wooster in the second game....a little premature
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 21, 2006, 11:27:44 PM
On the suit update, anyone that has seen a Wittenberg game knows that Artie Taylor (the Tigers' assistant coach) has some of the most stylish suits I have ever seen.  Tonight, he was pretty reserved though, wearing a brown pinstripe outfit.  This is a guy who has a lime green suit, a purple suit, a bright orange suit, and the list goes on and on and on.  Sorry we missed it on the radio broadcast tonight - when Scott's there, we usually almost get it!  I'll have to try and find a picture of one of his suits.

Anyway, on the game itself: Witt started out relatively slow, but with about 5 minutes or so left in the first half, they turned it on and never looked back.  Russ was awesome again (he had 27, moving into 10th on the all time Wittenberg scoring list, and a deep, high scoring run in the NCAC/NCAA tourneys could move him up to ninth), Borchers was his usual solid self with 16, and Gregg Hill had the best game of his career with 16.  Tyler Howard also had 11, but he is still too inconsistent of a shooter for me to have too much faith in him (case in point, at one stretch tonight, he missed a layup, missed the putback, then stepped outside and left a 3 way short).  Also, Witt's free throw shooting seems to be getting back to where they were earlier in the year (16-22 tonight).  However, 3 point shooting is still a problem (1-7 tonight), and Denison actually outrebounded Witt, 27-26.

While Witt played great basketball down the stretch, we were all stunned by the OWU score.  They are a scary, scary team right now, and matchup problems or not, they are going to give Witt a run for their money on Friday afternoon. If Witt starts out as slow as they did tonight, we may be looking at a Wooster-OWU rematch, not the Witt-Wooster rematch that everybody this time two weeks ago would have almost guaranteed.  Of course, I'm still picking Wittenberg, but I could see this being like last year's Witt-Wabash OT game in the semis at Wooster.

This should be a fun weekend of NCAC basketball (even on the women's side, where the top four teams are all very close talent-wise). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 11:31:10 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 21, 2006, 11:25:47 PM
yes i can as i will be in attendance saturday night. even if i'm not vocal i am visible on the board as i have read every single post on here this entire season.

one thing while listening to the witt postgame show they seemed to reference that wabash would be playing wooster in the second game....a little premature

Who was doing the postgame for Witt? If it was Scott Leo, he'll be getting hell from me on Friday  ;)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 21, 2006, 11:35:05 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2006, 11:31:10 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 21, 2006, 11:25:47 PM
yes i can as i will be in attendance saturday night. even if i'm not vocal i am visible on the board as i have read every single post on here this entire season.

one thing while listening to the witt postgame show they seemed to reference that wabash would be playing wooster in the second game....a little premature

Who was doing the postgame for Witt? If it was Scott Leo, he'll be getting hell from me on Friday  ;)


It was Scott and myself.  Must have been a slip, because we knew in the postgame that Earlham had in fact won.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 21, 2006, 11:36:30 PM
As promised, a picture of Coach Taylor.  Not the greatest, but the only one I can find.

http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/rotate/05rotate/coachtaylor05.jpg

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2006, 11:37:18 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 21, 2006, 11:25:47 PM
even if i'm not vocal i am visible on the board as i have read every single post on here this entire season.

That alone is worth a karma point.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 21, 2006, 11:47:00 PM
Wow, speaking of old people... Wabash had a 50 year old man, with a two year old girl in his arms, giving Earlham fans the middle finger and yelling curse words left and right.  I love the fact that so many students come out for Wabash--it's great for D3 hoops, but the fact that one grandpa could give the middle finger nearly 100 plus times and intermix that with a list of curse words worthy of "The Aristocrats" has to be embarrassing. Chanting "Bull****" a dozen plus times and telling "Fat Boy" (Coach Justus) to sit down on every contestable call is classless to say the least!  

On top of all that, Earlham had to beat at least seven guys tonight.  (Only the Steve Lavin clone seemed to be relatively impartial.)  Towards the end of the game (read as:  after the tip-off...), the guys in black and white did everything they could to allow Wabash to stay in it.  In one play, Zimmer jumped into the air to shoot the ball, came down, then went back up with it... No traveling call!!!.  Then,  Zimmer clearly knocked the ball out of bounds, but... Wabash ball.  The last few minutes had several plays like this, and I"m proud of my Earlham guys for pulling it out anyway.

Two more things... Wabash students had their shirts off and spelled WABASH ALWAYS FIGHT.  (Some of the letters were droopy, but it was spelled right.)  You'd think that more than 1 in 15 would use the weight room pre-game, since it is right across the hall(I'm talking to you "B"), but nevertheless...  Do a few laps in the pool or miles around the quad before we come back next year, OK guys?

Also, let's not forget about Brandon Miller and Tyler Stewart finishing a few plays with style tonight.  A few years ago Earlham had to win games with lay-ups.  It makes us old Quakers feel good when 6' 7" athletes like B Mill put down a reverse dunk and six footers like T Stew throw down with two hands on the breakaway.  See some of ya'll in Timken
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 21, 2006, 11:50:19 PM
First off, DC, I'm glad you're in the house with the bar looming--if you don't know it now, you won't!

OWU's victory doesn't suprise me--Gheny doesn't defend real well, as evidenced by the Scots' thrashing of them earlier this month--I think the Scots went over the century mark with about 10 min to go--

With that being said, OWU is peaking at the right time--they're playing great D, and are shooting lights out.  I still think that they don't match up real well with Witt, but if they're still hot from 3, it should be a great first game Friday night.

Should be a fun weekend of NCAC hoops--we will look forward to the arrival of Billy Pilgram and earlhamalum to the friendly confines of Timken!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2006, 11:59:03 PM
Quote from: fighting_scots on February 21, 2006, 11:50:19 PM
First off, DC, I'm glad you're in the house with the bar looming--if you don't know it now, you won't!

It's not looming any more, it's begun to collapse (today was day 1 off 3.)  But you're right; if I don't know it now, I never will.  And I don't.  :D  Aside to LG:  question 3 was on the Doctrine of Waste.  ::)

If I'm reasonably sober at 5pm Friday (2pm here), I'll be tuned in for Witt/OWU III.  I presume that Witt will be broadcasting; will OWU also do a broadcast?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 22, 2006, 12:04:47 AM
I listened to a bit of the second half of the Witt broadcast, and all of the postgame show, and I remember them saying many times that Earlham had beaten Wabash.  I kept trying to coax the score out of them, though, but had no luck.  The webcast came through very clear this time, and I thought the PBP was very good.

"Stylish" isn't exactly the term I would use to describe Artie Taylor's suits.  :)

"Wabash students had their shirts off and spelled WABASH ALWAYS FIGHT.  (Some of the letters were droopy, but it was spelled right.)  You'd think that more than 1 in 15 would use the weight room pre-game, since it is right across the hall(I'm talking to you "B")"

I love it!

DC - At the end of tonight's Wooster broadcast, they mentioned that they will be broadcasting both semifinals on Friday.  I'd guess that both will go out over the web, but couldn't say for sure.  And didn't someone post earlier that there will be free video from the Wooster website?  I'll believe that when I see it, though, as tonight Teamline wanted $20.

I just checked the Wooster website, and on their schedule it does say free video for both semis and the final.




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 22, 2006, 12:10:55 AM
Woosterbooster- are you trying to say you loved my Wabash Witt?   ;D

Do the Scots allow that?

See you Friday!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 22, 2006, 12:21:06 AM
First Team
Earlham         Brandon Miller - Smooth, has the moves to score often.      
OWU         Ben Chojnacki - Money
Wittenberg      Daniel Russ - POY
Wittenberg      Dane Borchers - Does everything well
Wooster         James Cooper - The best shooter in the league
Wooster         Tom Port - Plays big in big games, most athletic player in the NCAC

Second Team
Alleghany      Casey McCloskey   - Alleghany's best all round player
Denison         Dan Hodgkinson - The most consistent player on an up and down team
Kenyon         Matt Formato - If he only had help . . .          
OWU         Andy Warnock - A strong floor leader and deadly shooter
Wooster         Tim Vandervaart - Very active on the floor - rebounds, steals, blocks, assists . . 
Wooster         Kyle Witucky - Wooster will miss his leadership more than most realize

Honorable Mention
Earlham         Markous Jewett - Pts, RB, FT% are all good
Earlham         LaRon Henry - almost 50% from the arc
OWU         Dustin Rudegeair - strong post presence
Wabash         Andrew Zimmer - I had him on my list for weeks, the Earlham hame justifies it
Wabash         Caleb Lyttle - Good alround numbers (Pts, RB, A/T, Steals)
Wittenberg      Kenny Brady - Plays hard, hits those 3's at deadly moments

Newcomer of the Year - Brandon Johnson. My second choice is Savage from Alleghany.
Coach of the Year - Don't know yet

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2006, 12:47:16 AM
That's what I want - I want Artie's suit descriptions at home and on the road.

(I just thought of this today...so I'm racing ahead of everyone else here!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2006, 12:49:35 AM
QuoteOn top of all that, Earlham had to beat at least seven guys tonight.  (Only the Steve Lavin clone seemed to be relatively impartial.)  Towards the end of the game (read as:  after the tip-off...), the guys in black and white did everything they could to allow Wabash to stay in it.  In one play, Zimmer jumped into the air to shoot the ball, came down, then went back up with it... No traveling call!!!.  Then,  Zimmer clearly knocked the ball out of bounds, but... Wabash ball.  The last few minutes had several plays like this, and I"m proud of my Earlham guys for pulling it out anyway.

You may want to revise that - the zebras also protected Miller and allowed him to flop, missed a blatant call on Jewett that knocked down Lyttle, and missed a couple of big time travels on Earlham that the stats crew counted the steps on.

Oh, and Coffey barely touched Jewett and he flopped like Reggie Miller and got three free throws. Meanwhile, Miller can swing his elbows on rebounds and decapitate someone and not get a call, even if it IS a point of emphasis with the refs.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2006, 01:45:43 AM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 21, 2006, 11:47:00 PM
Wow, speaking of old people... Wabash had a 50 year old man, with a two year old girl in his arms, giving Earlham fans the middle finger and yelling curse words left and right.  I love the fact that so many students come out for Wabash--it's great for D3 hoops, but the fact that one grandpa could give the middle finger nearly 100 plus times and intermix that with a list of curse words worthy of "The Aristocrats" has to be embarrassing. Chanting "Bull****" a dozen plus times and telling "Fat Boy" (Coach Justus) to sit down on every contestable call is classless to say the least!  


I'm not condoning anything this individual may have said or done, but it's a bit unfair to pick this guy out as a representative of the Wabash crowd.  You can go to any sporting event at any place at any time in this country and find that guy.  That guy comes in all shapes and sizes and in ages of all sorts.  The only thing consistent about that guy is that he's at everybody's home game being an idiot.  For that one idiot there were several hundred other Wabash fans doing it the right way.  I think it's best to shake your head at that guy and hope that someday soon he realizes what a boob he is and checks the language at the door next time around. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 22, 2006, 03:57:19 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 22, 2006, 01:45:43 AMI'm not condoning anything this individual may have said or done, but it's a bit unfair to pick this guy out as a representative of the Wabash crowd.  You can go to any sporting event at any place at any time in this country and find that guy.  That guy comes in all shapes and sizes and in ages of all sorts.  The only thing consistent about that guy is that he's at everybody's home game being an idiot.  For that one idiot there were several hundred other Wabash fans doing it the right way.  I think it's best to shake your head at that guy and hope that someday soon he realizes what a boob he is and checks the language at the door next time around. 

Let's just hope that "someday soon" means "before his granddaughter is old enough to figure out that her grandpa is a vulgar buffoon."  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 22, 2006, 09:42:31 AM
anyone find it somewhat funny that witt in fact played 12 guys and beat up on denison tonight where 14 denison guys saw minutes? not that im trying to bring back the mute 3 week argument from earlier this year.

also, witt seemed to be resting our big guns a little in the second half as they should, i am slightly worried at OWU, but i was worried about them when we traveled to their place and dan russ seemed to take over as he went on a 9-0 run to start the game. MVP's have a way of showing up when needed most. We'll see that he does deserve the MVP this friday
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2006, 10:21:26 AM
Three of those Denison players just played garbage time though.

Didn't Hodgkinson have foul trouble?

Hern was out - and has been, so basically it's big man by committee.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 22, 2006, 11:14:06 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 21, 2006, 11:27:44 PM

On the suit update, anyone that has seen a Wittenberg game knows that Artie Taylor (the Tigers' assistant coach) has some of the most stylish suits I have ever seen. 


I wouldn't exactly clasify looking like a giant banana as "stylish"? ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2006, 11:23:51 AM
Oh, he was stylin' in the peach plaid here at 'Bash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 22, 2006, 11:25:55 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 22, 2006, 11:14:06 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 21, 2006, 11:27:44 PM

On the suit update, anyone that has seen a Wittenberg game knows that Artie Taylor (the Tigers' assistant coach) has some of the most stylish suits I have ever seen. 


I wouldn't exactly clasify looking like a giant banana as "stylish"? ;)

No doubt. He looks like Dick Tracy in that thing.  :D

Aside to DC: They aren't fooling around, are they? Good luck, DC, I'm sure you'll do fine.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 22, 2006, 11:34:51 AM
Congrats to the winners!!

Witt has much to much fire power.  Denison played real hard and I was proud of our team. 
No excuses.  As far as players he played.....it has been the same all year.  When we went 8-2 in the mid-season we had 8 guys getting the time.  Then Ghiloni decides to start a bunch of guys who never have played all year??  Strange.  McMahon did great.  He will be a big help next hear with Hern gone.

I am just curious, Does Wabash cheer "Richmond Sucks"? Or is that just an Ohio cheer?

And to that guy who said it is one or two guys at Wabash that are bad.  He needs to do a recount!! 

I have nothing against cheering on your team but personal attacks on an individual and a coach is flat out wrong.   GO EARLHAM!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 22, 2006, 11:51:18 AM
Wally-  You and I both know that it is more than one person at a Wabash game.   I saw so many middle-fingers from the student body I thought they were trying to tell me how much they were down or the age that they were acting!  I guess they teach them at a young age there!  JK :)  On the other hand I agree with you on the fact they have a lot of fans that are respectful throughout the game.  Is it FRIDAY YET???  GO EARLHAM
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 22, 2006, 11:55:17 AM
Quote from: DenisonFan on February 22, 2006, 11:34:51 AMI am just curious, Does Wabash cheer "Richmond Sucks"? Or is that just an Ohio cheer?

That's funny I made that comment to Wally last night that the fans should have broken out an "Eastern Indiana Sucks" chant to join the Ohio one.  ;)

Even that would have been better than the crap they pulled at the end of the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on February 22, 2006, 12:44:48 PM
If you guys think that Artie Taylor's suits aren't stylish then you guys on here are a lot older than I thought. Just because you can't get away with wearing a flashy suit don't try to knock on his. Stick to your sweater vest and try to enjoy the best dresser the NCAC has ever seen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 22, 2006, 12:47:10 PM
I'm only 29. But I work in a fairly conservative profession. Where wearing something other than a red, blue or yellow tie with your grey or navy suit is considered "making a statement".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on February 22, 2006, 12:50:01 PM
Well if you are indeed in a profession how did you have a reply to my statement 5 minutes after I wrote it at 1PM on a Tuesday.  Excuse me I have to go to CLASS.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 22, 2006, 12:50:20 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 22, 2006, 11:14:06 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 21, 2006, 11:27:44 PM

On the suit update, anyone that has seen a Wittenberg game knows that Artie Taylor (the Tigers' assistant coach) has some of the most stylish suits I have ever seen. 


I wouldn't exactly clasify looking like a giant banana as "stylish"? ;)

Yeah, the picture that I found definitely wasn't his best suit, ha ha.  Hopefully he brings out some good ones this weekend.

Quote from: smedindy on February 22, 2006, 11:23:51 AM
Oh, he was stylin' in the peach plaid here at 'Bash.

That is one of my favorites.

Quote from: WoosterBNel on February 22, 2006, 12:44:48 PM
If you guys think that Artie Taylor's suits aren't stylish then you guys on here are a lot older than I thought. Just because you can't get away with wearing a flashy suit don't try to knock on his. Stick to your sweater vest and try to enjoy the best dresser the NCAC has ever seen.

Hey, I can see why some people wouldn't like them.  I've heard people say he's trying to "show up" the other coaches, and that may lead to some hostility.  I think he looks sharp.  If others don't agree, that's cool - I never claimed to be a fashion expert, so who knows - I could be way off on my thinking.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 22, 2006, 12:55:24 PM
Quote from: WoosterBNel on February 22, 2006, 12:50:01 PM
Well if you are indeed in a profession how did you have a reply to my statement 5 minutes after I wrote it at 1PM on a Tuesday.  Excuse me I have to go to CLASS.

I'm taking my lunch at my desk. Have fun in class. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 22, 2006, 01:16:01 PM
This is almost a mirror of the team I selected about a week and a half ago.  Somebody Imed me then and told me that it was too early to start dishing out end of season awards.  So I deleted the entry.  (Is there any way of recovering a deleted entry?)   

Great selections nonetheless.  I agree with it throughout.




Quote from: goscots on February 22, 2006, 12:21:06 AM
First Team
Earlham         Brandon Miller - Smooth, has the moves to score often.      
OWU         Ben Chojnacki - Money
Wittenberg      Daniel Russ - POY
Wittenberg      Dane Borchers - Does everything well
Wooster         James Cooper - The best shooter in the league
Wooster         Tom Port - Plays big in big games, most athletic player in the NCAC

Second Team
Alleghany      Casey McCloskey   - Alleghany's best all round player
Denison         Dan Hodgkinson - The most consistent player on an up and down team
Kenyon         Matt Formato - If he only had help . . .          
OWU         Andy Warnock - A strong floor leader and deadly shooter
Wooster         Tim Vandervaart - Very active on the floor - rebounds, steals, blocks, assists . . 
Wooster         Kyle Witucky - Wooster will miss his leadership more than most realize

Honorable Mention
Earlham         Markous Jewett - Pts, RB, FT% are all good
Earlham         LaRon Henry - almost 50% from the arc
OWU         Dustin Rudegeair - strong post presence
Wabash         Andrew Zimmer - I had him on my list for weeks, the Earlham hame justifies it
Wabash         Caleb Lyttle - Good alround numbers (Pts, RB, A/T, Steals)
Wittenberg      Kenny Brady - Plays hard, hits those 3's at deadly moments

Newcomer of the Year - Brandon Johnson. My second choice is Savage from Alleghany.
Coach of the Year - Don't know yet


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2006, 01:32:03 PM
There is no way we could go out on calls to donors wearing Artie's suits. However, some of the older alums have some pretty loud red sportcoats and pants!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 22, 2006, 01:35:44 PM
Okay Board you guys are killing me.  LaRon Henry is the 4th leading scoring in the NCAC...  52.6% FG's, 48.6% 3pt. and you want him to be HM.   

Yet you put Cooper on 1st team!  Not saying Cooper doesn't belong there... but to put a kid that is 4th in the NCAC in scoring at HM on one of the top 4 teams in the NCAC?  Come on now.  Either Jewett or Henry belong on the Second team... and you can take off one of the Allegheny player, or Wooster.  Like Kyle sorry but he has been playing like a HM player all year long!  Plus McCloskey's and Formato's team finished What?  I mean that is the reason why Brandon MIller isn't player of the year... So let's not say one thing when it helps out Wooster and then in the same situation put someone like MCCloskey, Formato and Witucky in front of LaRon Henry
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 22, 2006, 01:47:28 PM
Sorry to upset you wooster fans... Billy_Pilgram and I are looking for a cheap hotel in the wooster area for Friday Night... and or if you're willing to house two Earlham Alums... I'll buy beer even if we lose!  :)  After the Concrete floor i slept on when i went to Visit BP a car sounds like a good place to sleep.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 22, 2006, 02:23:02 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 22, 2006, 01:35:44 PM
Okay Board you guys are killing me.  LaRon Henry is the 4th leading scoring in the NCAC...  52.6% FG's, 48.6% 3pt. and you want him to be HM.   

Yet you put Cooper on 1st team!  Not saying Cooper doesn't belong there... but to put a kid that is 4th in the NCAC in scoring at HM on one of the top 4 teams in the NCAC?  Come on now.  Either Jewett or Henry belong on the Second team... and you can take off one of the Allegheny player, or Wooster.  Like Kyle sorry but he has been playing like a HM player all year long!  Plus McCloskey's and Formato's team finished What?  I mean that is the reason why Brandon MIller isn't player of the year... So let's not say one thing when it helps out Wooster and then in the same situation put someone like MCCloskey, Formato and Witucky in front of LaRon Henry

I don't understand why you say "Yet you put Cooper on the first team!" because then you go on to say "Not saying Cooper doesn't belong there."  What does this statement really have to do with your argument for LaRon Henry?

I think that you might be correct about Henry, that he should be higher than HM, but those were goscots choices and it seems as if you want to contest them not only because of what you feel about Henry but because he's a Wooster poster.  That's not fair.

Personally, I'd probably switch Henry with McCloskey (or maybe Witucky) but it's a close call. I've only seen each of them once, and while McCloskey played well even in a blowout, Henry did little when Earlham was here as only Miller came to play.  However, I know he had a good game against Wooster at Earlham. I'll probably have a much better feel on this after Friday night.

Wooster doesn't have many motels, so I'd book quickly.  Here's a few:

Amerihost Inn East: 330-262-5008
Amerihost Inn North: 330-345-1500
Econo Lodge: 330-264-8883
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 22, 2006, 02:45:40 PM
There's also a Hampton Inn on the north end.  It's walking distance to a lot of the resteraunts on the north end.  And downtown, there is a Best Western.  Don't have the #'s though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scotty on February 22, 2006, 03:28:46 PM
you also might check the Amish bed and breakfasts in the area...great food, great hospitality but they get up sooooooooo early. ;)...i seem to have misplaced their 800# but i think it was 1 800 the barn  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 22, 2006, 03:53:22 PM
Thank you guys.

Woosterbooster-
  Well I'd personally say Brandon Miller stats show that he has a great chance at being POY.  But most people believe he can't because his team didn't finish in the top 3.  So most people on this board believe Russ or Cooper should be POY and should be be 1st team NCAC.  (I believe they belong on 1st team) but I also believe Brandon Miller stats show he brings more to the Table then Russ and Cooper. *my eyes Brandon Miller is the Best player in the NCAC and if you look at the STATS. (stats don't lie)  Unless you look at Assists give'n at Earlham Home games.. :)

Wooster and Witt. Players always make it on 1st and 2nd team because they finish better than everyone else. (not because their stats are better)  With that arguement either LaRon Henry or Jewett belong on 2nd team, because Earlham is one of the 4 best teams in the NCAC. 

I hope you can understand a little better where i'm coming from now.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2006, 04:02:58 PM
In my eyes, I think it's either Russ or Cooper - but I think Miller is a first teamer and Henry a second team player at least.

Frankly, Wabash was so TEAM oriented that it's hard to get anyone on a team, though Joseph, Lyttle, Medeiros and Zimmer all had great stretches.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 22, 2006, 04:09:44 PM
smedindy-  WoW Zimmer played outstanding last night.  You have a keeper and if he keeps getting better you may have a 1st Teamer in years to come!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 22, 2006, 04:26:32 PM
Regional Rankings

http://www.ncaasports.com/basketball/mens/polls/rankings/diviii

At least 2 of the top 4 from the Great Lakes will lose this weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 22, 2006, 04:42:15 PM
Looking at the records for everyone around the country, it appears only MIAA teams have issues with not playing a large majority of their games in-region. With only one D3 conference in the state and few other teams within 200 miles to the south, it sure seems like it's a bit of punishment to play home games on the "pleasant peninsula." Maybe we should petition the NCAA for a rule like: 200 miles driving, or 150 miles in a straight line (including water).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on February 22, 2006, 04:43:27 PM
While I think stats are a big part of deciding post season honors, I think you also have to factor in the intangibles that some players bring to their respective teams. If Witucky, Russ, Miller, Henry etc were to play at Kenyon or Hiram there is no doubt they would put up even better numbers than they already do. I would argue with ea here that Henry should be 2nd team, as he is in my eyes their second best player and one that you would definitely have to game scheme around. That being said I think Witucky still deserves second team honors even though his personal numbers aren't that great. He might be the best on the ball defender in the league, as he is the only guy I have ever witnessed that could cut Rodney Mitchell's drives off. If I had a vote for POY it would come down to Russ and Miller in all honesty. Cooper is a great player and carried the Scots while Port was down but when his shots don't fall he is a non factor as his defense not great, still deserves first team but I don't think POY. All in all the post season awards don't mean anything unless you are holding a piece of the net from Salem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on February 22, 2006, 04:53:46 PM
I agree that Henry should be on 2nd team but one thing to consider when only looking at stats (b/c stats don't lie) you have to look the entire stat line. Minutes played is a big factor for a lot of the players on Woo and Witt b/c of their deep benches and mop up time. And on that point, I think Kenny Brady more than deserves a spot on the 2nd team rather than HM. In my eyes I would switch Henry and Brady for McCloskey and Witucky.

Same point for Miller for POY... If we are saying it's a three man race for POY, who would you most want on your team? I know my answer without question is Russ, with Cooper closely behind and Miller not far behind him.

Good point Vanilla, intangibles are something that are invaluable for a team's success, and nobody would argue that Witucky is the leader and floor general to that team but post season honors rarely look at intangibles. Not saying they shouldn't but it's the nature of the beast. And I completely agree that all these honors mean nothing without at least a trip to Salem...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 22, 2006, 04:54:20 PM
Sorry, can't keep my boards straight. Just realized Sac screwed with my head by posting over here so I was responding like this was the MIAA chat. Since it's not, I'll just have to say Go Scots! and maybe Go OWU! so that COW can get another chance to take care of business against them.

By the way, thanks for not dipping into negative scoring on my shameful NCAC tourney predictions. Clearly I over-estimated the efforts the clear underdogs would put forth and my predictions that the Woo/Witt/OWU games would be closer than expected were way off. It really must be demoralizing sometimes to be in that giant shadow the top of the conference puts over the bottom.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2006, 05:00:58 PM
You also have to think of where those teams would be without the players. Wooster without Cooper or Witucky? Pretty good still? Witt without Russ or Borchers - they may struggle but still good? Earlham without Miller - maybe not so hot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 22, 2006, 05:17:28 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 22, 2006, 05:00:58 PM
You also have to think of where those teams would be without the players. Wooster without Cooper or Witucky? Pretty good still? Witt without Russ or Borchers - they may struggle but still good? Earlham without Miller - maybe not so hot.

Agreed.

We've struck on something interesting.....deciphering numbers from intangibles. Well, in my mind, a player of the year should certainly have both. I could make a case for Russ here without question. But hear me out for a second while I make the case for Miller.

He leads his team, a top four team in the conference, in points (16.3), rebounds (8.7), assists (68), blocks (27) and steals (58). Oh, and all of his numbers are better in conference play when the games really count.

Intangibles: He can play four spots offensively and probably guard five spots defensively. He's rebounded from bad knee injuries both in his sophomore and junior seasons. Back in 2004, Earlham was battling for a spot hosting a tourney game before Miller was injured and foced to miss the rest of the season. Following that, the Quakers slipped down to sixth and were embarassed in the first round.

I really think it's splitting hairs between Russ, Miller or Cooper. Especially Russ and Miller. Thing is, I'm sure the benefit of the doubt would go to Cooper or Russ because they're on the the #1 and #2 teams in the conference and top five teams in the nation. It's too bad. Those teams would be in the same slots if Miller were wearing their colors.

And one last thing about Miller. Earlier, I'm not going to dig back through to find the archives, there was a post hypothesizing that Miller might be one of the better D-3 players in the country. It was shot down quickly and Brandon Crawford's name came up. Well, I've seen them both play. I still think Miller was better as a freshman (playing fewer minutes on a .500 Earlham team while Crawford was racking up garbage points at OC). And, healthy again, I think Miller would still be better now.

I've stated my case.....and believe me, I know that cases could be made for Cooper and Russ. Still, I'd just once like to see the league honor a guy who overcame a lot and finished his career as an outstanding player, rather than just giving the highest personal honor to another Witt or Wooster standout/conference champion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 22, 2006, 05:31:09 PM
I think that POY is a two-man race, really, between Russ and Miller. Although Cooper is a terrific offensive player, he's not multi-dimensional, and with the right defender on him can be controlled, if not shut down (see OWU, 4 days ago).

If I were to be starting a team from scratch, and could choose between any of the players in the league, just to play one upcoming season, I don't know that I could choose between Russ or Miller. 

Now, if you were to say, which of their current teams would have missed their respective player the most, Russ/Wittenberg or Earlham/Miller, I think that's a much easier question.  Wittenberg without Russ would still be a pretty decent team, no worse than middle of the pack.  Earlham would have big, big problems without Brandon Miller.  But should that thought be a factor in choosing the POY?  I don't know.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 22, 2006, 07:26:17 PM
I also do not buy the arguement that Witt and Wooster players get voted on to the teams because they play for successful teams. I believe the proper perspective is that these are good teams because those guys play on them.

Although no one else has posted this opinion, I think the top two players in this league are Port and Russ. Cooper's game (when he doesn't have the ball) needs to improve for him to be considered for the POY.  Miller has big numbers, but he has played 860 minutes to Russ's 632, a whopping 36% percent difference, which is the same type of arguement that billy_pilgram used in comparing Crawford and Miller.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 22, 2006, 07:29:21 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 22, 2006, 07:26:17 PMMiller has big numbers, but he has played 860 minutes to Russ's 632, a whopping 36% percent difference, which is the same type of arguement that billy_pilgram used in comparing Crawford and Miller.



Not entirely.

I said that Crawford ran up big numbers playing 35+ minutes on a team that won about 3 games and finished at the bottom of the league....which was my same argument in saying that James Cooper (one and the same) should have been Newcomer of the Year instead of Quinton Spencer last year. Miller plays more minutes, of course, but with the exception of @Wooster, I'd never say Miller got garbage points, rebounds, steals, et al.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Hoops MacPherson on February 22, 2006, 07:35:00 PM
does player of year include the tournament? if so, think earlham would have to get to finals for miller to be considered. as much as i get sick of wooster/witt on this board, unless guy is going for 25 a game or dominating on boards, POY has to be from one of top 2 teams.

the balance of power in this league swung when cooper got into wooster, but not witt. he would be my player of the year.

as for Casey McCloskey being 2nd team all-NCAC, he went 1-19 in three games vs OWU; he disappears against the better teams. he puts up numbers sometimes, but isn't a solid all-around player.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 22, 2006, 07:43:38 PM
BP - point taken. 

At least no one is disputed that these guys belong on the first team.

As for McCloskey, he was the last guy I put on the my second team so it won't take much to convince me to swap him out. The player I would move up first though would have been Jewett. If you remember he shot the lights out when Wooster came to Richmond.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 22, 2006, 07:50:54 PM
The obvious problem in trying to choose any all-star team, or teams, at no matter what level, is that no one single fan, or voter, can possibly see more than a small percentage of the games, other than those of his own team.

I've seen almost all of Wooster's home games this season and two road games.  Others have seen more.  We probably have a fairly decent read on the ability of our players.  The same goes for those fans of any other teams who've seen a good number of their team's games.

But when attempting to appraise the players on other teams, I just don't have much to go on.  Numbers, yeah.  But that can be a pretty skewed resource.  I've only seen two teams, besides Wooster, twice this season, those being OWU and Kenyon. I've seen all others once, except for Denison.

So, if a guy had a bad or mediocre game when I happened to see him play, unfortunately that's my everlasting impression of him.  And, the opposite is true if they play well.  With some few good players that I've seen twice, such as Kenyon's Formato, who had one good game and one do-nothing game against Wooster, I have a better read.  But, geeze, it's still only two ballgames.

When I was coaching volleyball, choosing all-league and all-district was all about politics and the honor system.  You nominated a few of your players, the coaches all voted, and that was it.  But everyone was pretty turned off by coaches who had mediocre teams and then proclaimed that he or she had three players who should be first team all-district.  That just doesn't add up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 22, 2006, 08:02:23 PM
Wooster Booster

Excellent post. Thats is exactly why several pages ago I proposed having nominations (not votes) from the various loyal posters. They have a much better feel for their best players and where they belong. The idea didn't get any traction, probably because it was too cumbersome to manage and (as DC pointed out) some teams have no representation on this board.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 22, 2006, 09:00:56 PM
wooster fans-any ticket information for this weekend yet?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2006, 09:06:58 PM
I have practically no interest in individual player awards (except for Academic All-American), but I find it hard to believe that Dane Borchers' name has not come up in the POY discussions.  If I were forced to choose a POY, I think I'd give him serious consideration, along with Miller and Russ (but probably not Cooper, Port, Hodgkinson, et alia.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 22, 2006, 09:15:13 PM
tickets on sale thur. 9:00 - 11:00 and 2:00 - 4:00
Fri. 9:00 - 11:00 and 2:00 -Tip Off

Gates open Fri. @ 4:30 , Sat @ 5:00

Prices 8.00 Adult, 3.00 children for each night
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 22, 2006, 09:22:39 PM
so for out of towners how in the world are we supposed to get tickets if we cant just drive up to wooster to buy them ahead of time . are any tickets being reserved for wittenberg fans?????
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 22, 2006, 09:30:57 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 22, 2006, 09:22:39 PM
so for out of towners how in the world are we supposed to get tickets if we cant just drive up to wooster to buy them ahead of time . are any tickets being reserved for wittenberg fans?????

You've got a lot of nerve asking that question after the last game that Wooster played down there.

Why don't you call Wittenberg's athletic department?  I'll bet you'll find out that Wooster sent down a fair share of tickets.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 22, 2006, 09:48:39 PM
Fairly certain there will be tickets available at the door.

Last year, the semifinal crowds weren't all that awe inspiring......I seem to remember tickets going on sale right after the game on Friday night for the championship
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 22, 2006, 10:08:30 PM
$8  ? ? ?  wow

MIAA tickets are $5
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 22, 2006, 10:24:04 PM
Regular season games at Wooster are $5 now.  Not too many years ago they were only $3.  I'd guess that the tournament game prices for the semis and finals are set by the NCAC, but I don't know for sure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2006, 10:29:47 PM
That's why Wabash is the best bargain in the NCAC, possibly the NCAA, for hoops!  8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on February 23, 2006, 12:14:36 AM
Woosters Ticket prices have to jump just like tuition for next year !

Both seem way to high as is...
but I guess 8$ to see a game between some of the top schools in the NCAC, not THAT bad... Unless I can find a way to Distract the ticket takers with some Hot girls...
Hmmmm........
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 23, 2006, 12:44:02 AM
wooster booster i was waiting to see if you'd mention that. i already have inquired to garnett purnell and the athletic department about that very fact. 8 dollars a ticket is well worth the quality of basketball we'll be seeing and compared to many d1 schools, 8 dollars is an absolute bargain
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 23, 2006, 08:00:32 AM
Ticket prices are indeed set by the NCAC.

There should be tics still available before Tip-Off.

And yes, you can purchase tickets for the championship game Fri night.

But, at 8 bucks per ticket and only one game, i don't think too many wooster residents are going to buy tickets for Sat night, unless wooster is playing.

That might turn around a bite the NCAC, if it's an OWU/Witt vs. Earlham match-up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 23, 2006, 08:10:02 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 22, 2006, 10:29:47 PM
That's why Wabash is the best bargain in the NCAC, possibly the NCAA, for hoops!  8)

You're right Smed, as i've never paid to see a game at Crawfordsville. Football or Basketball.

Post season would be different though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 23, 2006, 08:11:05 AM
Come tourny time, the ticket prices are set by the NCAC or NCAA, depending on which tourny you are going to.  During regular season prices are set by the school.  I remember Wooster students used to, I'm guessing they still do, get into games free.  But come tourny, they are, technically, supposed to pay since it is in the conference's hands.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 23, 2006, 08:25:56 AM
For all those interested in NOT making the drive to woo for the games, according to the Wooster web page:

The North Coast Athletic Conference, in conjunction with Clear Picture, Inc. and TeamLine, will be providing a broadcast of live video and audio free of charge for both semifinals and the championship game of the 2006 NCAC Tournament. (Users of this service must have a high-speed Internet connection and Windows Media Player).

I tried pasting the link here, but could not get it to work.  However, you can find the link here:

http://www.northcoast.org/news/MBKBTRNYVIDEO.html?id=813

Or at the Wooster basketball page.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 23, 2006, 08:26:12 AM
Anyone travelling to Wooster- I made some maps in pdf format showing the location of some of the hotels bars mentioned earlier etc.  If you want a copy send me an email at blindwatchmaker7@yahoo.com

I'll try and get them out by late afternoon.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 23, 2006, 09:39:26 AM
Back to POY/MVP discussion:  I personally hate to say. But age and years int eh league come into play for all post season awards.  As a high school basketball coach and having voted in All-League, All-City and All-County meetings.  Seniors and previous first team selections carry a lot of wieght. 
    We can argue and discuss that in a perfect world that the best player regardless of year, team record, etc... should win but the fact is the human factor always creeps in despite the best intentions.
   The same holds true for dropping from 1st to second team or 2nd team to HM or 1st team to HM.  Once you have earned the honor, you do not have to do much but maintain in order to stay there. 
   All of that said, here are my picks:

Ben Chojnacki     OWU
Dan Hodgkinson       DEN
Brandon Miller          Earlham
James Cooper   Wooster
Daniel Russ    Wittenberg POY/MVP
Kyle Witucky    Wooster

The only change from last year is that Cooper replaces Port who falls to 2nd team due to missed games due to injury.  I don't know when the voting is but the NCAC press release last year was dated after the NCAC tourney where I imagine there is a coaching muster (military term) similiar to what happens at the Final Four for Division I coaches.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on February 23, 2006, 01:04:59 PM
Info about NCAC's plans to broadcast games:

http://www.northcoast.org/news/MBKBTRNYVIDEO.html?id=813

Link to broadcast:

http://www.teamline.cc/teampages.html?teamcode=1061
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2006, 02:41:50 PM
POY is going to be an interesting choice this season.  The league's best player is a sophomore (Cooper) and underclassmen rarely get rewarded here.  The guy that fills the boxscore better than any other player in the league (Miller) played on a team that lost 7 conference games and finished fifth.  The preseason favorite for the award (Russ) put up nice numbers (16 pts, 6 boards) but they don't scream POY.  The upperclassman stalwart from the league's best team (Port) missed enough games that it would seem improbable for him to be considered strongly.  On any other team Borchers would get some consideration, but he plays next to Russ and given Russ's previous accolades, he will have to defer to Russ.  

It's going to be an interesting pick.  If I had a vote, I'd give it to Cooper because he's the most potent offensive player in the league (has anybody been able to guard him?) and he's played big in big games...highlighted by the shot that beat Witt in December.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on February 23, 2006, 03:44:28 PM
wally- good points all around

However, I would have to say Russ comes out on top b/c he is is a very solid defender where as Cooper has been known to disappear on the defensive end. Also, Russ' numbers (16pts, 6reb) don't scream POY, yet he won it last season with less impressive numbers (14pts, 6reb). Not to mention he has to play along side Borchers, which definitely cuts into his post touches.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 23, 2006, 03:57:22 PM
All good points.

My POY vote goes to Cooper.  I don't think age should be a factor.  He is the best player on the best team.  When Port went down he didn't miss a beat.

It is between Russ and Cooper and I go with Cooper.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 23, 2006, 06:01:41 PM
As a Wittenberg fan, it pains me to say this, but if I had a vote in POY, I would have to give it to Cooper.  I have seen him once this year (and many people have talked about how their one viewing can have a large impact), and was awed by what he did to Wittenberg in Springfield.  Add to that the fact that Cooper's numbers have been outstanding, and he stepped up to another level when Port got hut and I can't see not giving it to him. 

Dan Russ is second . . . right now.  He is such a dominating presence inside that is makes it hard for anybody to stop him.  It will be interesting to see if postseason play does play a role in the vote, because if it does, and if Witt can win the tourney, I think Dan has a shot.  Look at what he did Tuesday against Denison (27 pts, 5 rebs, compared to Cooper's 14 against Kenyon), and his season numbers against the 3 teams he possibly could play (OWU - 18.5 ppg, 5 rpg; Earlham - 15.5 ppg, 6.5 rpg; Wooster - 27.5 ppg, 7.5 ppg).  He'd definitely be tournament MVP if he put up numbers like that, and you know it would influence voters on POY.

However, with that said, I still have to go Cooper.  He's 4 points a game ahead of Dan, shoots 56% from the field (which is incredible for a guard, especially considering Dan is at 57% down low shooting "high percentage shots"), is a far better free throw shooter (81% vs. Dan's 63%), and has 25 more assists than Russ.  I enjoy watching Russ, and I don't think we could complain if he was named POY, but I think it is Cooper's award unless Dan takes it away here in the tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldwittfan on February 23, 2006, 07:02:07 PM
Miller is a great talent, but he has often self destructed against Wittenberg.  Has that not shown up against other teams?  Otherwise, let this weekend decide.  I still think Port is Wooster's most complete player.  (Is scoring the only thing that counts?)  If Wittenberg and Wooster get to the final game and if Dan Russ plays as he has in the past against Wooster, it would be hard to choose someone else.

On  another topic, it is great to see Mike DeWitt's team playing so well.  If they were not playing the Tigers, I would be rooting for them.   By the way, he also started his college basketball at Wittenberg.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 23, 2006, 07:49:58 PM
I'd throw my vote in the direction of Russ.  If the numbers in the tournament are included in the vote, and given Russ' propensity to have huge games against the remaing 3 teams left that he would have to go up against, I think he's got to get it.  The arguments for Cooper have been pretty strong too.  The way he stepped up during Port's absence should go a long way in his consideration.  However, since Port's return, he hasn't seemed to have that same take over a game attitude that he seemed to thrive on while Port was injured.  I kept waiting for him to do it last Saturday, but it never happened.  Personally, I think it really could come down to who has the bigger weekend.  If Russ leads Witt to the tournament championship, POY should be his, hands down.  If Cooper comes out to lead Wooster to the championship, it will make the decision that much more difficult.  There's definately no clear cut POY that just jumps out at you for sure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 23, 2006, 08:40:01 PM
Well, I've had my share of POY talk.

But, I will say again. I can live with posters (and I know you guys don't have votes) siding with Cooper or Russ over Miller because you really think they're better players. But, I can't live with giving them awards because they play on better teams. Again, put Miller on Wooster or Witt, results are the same. Shift Cooper or Russ to Earlham.......probably still don't do better than 4th.

Anyway, enough of that, Earlhamalum and I will be at Wooster tonight......and we'll certainly be heading out after the games. Drop by and say hello if you get the chance and certainly drop by for a beer afterward. Hope everyone has a good weekend and enjoy the games.


Go, pacify, win Quakers!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 23, 2006, 09:28:39 PM
I second that, everybody have a great weekend and enjoy the games.

They should be good ones!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 23, 2006, 10:53:46 PM
i third that-hopefully witt wins tomorrow night to set up my excursion up north saturday with a carful of witt fans, so if witt is in the finals the support for the tigers will be strong. tickets for the game are not an issue any longer as i have found out some valuable information from our athletic department.

predictions for tomorrow

witt 71 ohio wesleyan 63 in game number one with witt jumping out early and owu hanging around just like in delaware

wooster 95 earlham 80 earlham hangs close in the first half but a run by the scots from behind the arc opens this game up
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on February 24, 2006, 12:43:49 AM
Vegas odds are out
Witt -7.5 against OWU
Woo -13 against Earlham

I'm not buying into this epidemic of being scared to losing to OWU. After all it is OWU. In my lifetime at Witt I don't ever remember losing to them. Although I love Chojnackis game. He reminds me a lot of myself in my prime as a ripe 17 year old ready to prove myself with a repetoire of effective post moves. If anyone is wondering I'd say both teams cover setting up a dare I say......Pick EM, even odds game ncac championship game. Should be one for the ages.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 24, 2006, 01:49:14 AM
Witt/Owu    Witt wins by 13

EC/Wooster   *3 point game at half-time... Wooster by 11

If you guys (old-timers) want to go out for Drinks/Food afterwards... Win or Lose Billy_pilgram and I are down... just let us know the way... I mean the Championship game isn't until 7 the next night!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 02:50:28 AM
Tomorrow (my time) we have two semifinal games.  In the second, most feel that Wooster will win, but most give Earlham a decent chance to pull the upset.  In the first, Witt is a slight favorite over OWU at best.  In other words, we have two potentially competitive games, and it really wouldn't be a shock if Earlham and OWU came out on top.

Now couple that with the fact that neither Wooster nor Wittenberg has spent one minute outside the national top 10 this year (in fact, Wooster has not been lower than 3rd, and Witt has not been lower than 6th since the preseason poll,) and one or the other was ranked number one in exactly half of the polls during this regular season.

Does anyone besides me this this is important?  Isn't this the beginnings of the parity so many of us have hoped for so long? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2006, 03:04:18 AM
I would suggest that we wait and see the results of the semifinal games before we jump to any conclusions about parity in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2006, 07:36:03 AM
I don't think its parity - yet - Wooster demolished 4th place Wabash handily this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 24, 2006, 09:14:04 AM
Web addy for the Internet Broadcast of the big games.  There's some more info at Wooster's Bball site.


http://www.teamline.cc/sportpages.html?teamcode=1061&eventcode=0021
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 24, 2006, 09:28:19 AM
Good luck to all four teams.

I just hope that these refs call a fair game.  Too many times have I seen these guys favor the "expected" winner.  That makes it sooooooooooo much harder especially playing on Wooster's floor. 

I just hope it is not an NCAC rule that Witt must play Wooster.

I think both Witt and Wooster will win, but I also think they don't need any help.  Let's play these games 5 on 5.

Should be a couple of great games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on February 24, 2006, 09:37:21 AM
DenisonFan:   Greak point about the officials.  I have seen the bishops on the wrong end of a few questionable calls in past NCAC tourneys.  I think the fact that it is at Wooster this year instead of Witt will be a benefit of OWU.  The officiating will hopefully remain nuetral and OWU usually shoots the ball well in Timken.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2006, 09:53:47 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 02:50:28 AM
Tomorrow (my time) we have two semifinal games.  In the second, most feel that Wooster will win, but most give Earlham a decent chance to pull the upset.  In the first, Witt is a slight favorite over OWU at best.  In other words, we have two potentially competitive games, and it really wouldn't be a shock if Earlham and OWU came out on top.

Now couple that with the fact that neither Wooster nor Wittenberg has spent one minute outside the national top 10 this year (in fact, Wooster has not been lower than 3rd, and Witt has not been lower than 6th since the preseason poll,) and one or the other was ranked number one in exactly half of the polls during this regular season.

Does anyone besides me this this is important?  Isn't this the beginnings of the parity so many of us have hoped for so long? 

If there is parity in this league, I'm not seeing it.  We have Wooster and Witt who are head and shoulders better than the rest of the league.  OWU has been strong lately, but I'd not be too quick to read much into their win over Wooster.  The game was meaningless for Wooster and was played on senior day in Delaware.  That sort of matchup sets off all sorts of red flags for an upset.  Ditto Witt's game vs. Wabash.  I just don't think you can read too much into Wooster or Witt from those games. 

As far as the semis go...I would be extrememly shocked if both Earlham and OWU won their games.  I mean extremely shocked.  In D-IA hoops if the #3 and #6 teams lost on the same day to unranked opponents, it would be the lead college hoops story of the day and the media would try to label the whole day in college hoops with some lame catch phrase like "Shocker Sunday".  It's hard to say we have parity in the NCAC until we can start talking about more than just Wooster and Witt as potential league champions when the season starts.  You have to go all the way back to 1993 before somebody other than Wooster or Witt won our league title outright.  You have to go back to 1988 to find the last time Witt or Wooster didn't win at least a share of the title.  Perhaps our ideas of parity are different, but IMHO, this isn't it. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2006, 09:55:47 AM
It's still the "Big Two" - "Middling Three" - "Tourney Filling Three" - "Terrible Two"...

Hey, don't forget to post about Artie's suit tonight! I am covering a game at Covington (oh, it's senior night and that's a 1/2 hour right there) and can't watch the cast.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 24, 2006, 10:02:18 AM
guys one point worth mentioning is that the losses by witt and wooster late in the season have made them that more dangerous because instaed of like last year with witt possibly looking ahead to wooster, they skated barely by wabash.
this year they know both teams that they'll be playing can potentially be dangerous, so that aspect of looking ahead to opponents can be avoided.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scott_leo on February 24, 2006, 10:07:32 AM
Here is the link to tonight's broadcast:

http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/broadcast.html

Complete with the Artie Taylor fashion update!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 24, 2006, 10:26:54 AM
Unfortunately DC, I have to agree with everyone else.  We do not have parity...yet  However, you might be able to say that we are more competitive league. 
Can EARLHAM, OWU, WABASH, or  beat WITT/WOO on any given night?  The answer is still NO. 
Can WITT/WOO afford to look past those teams, especially when on the road?  Answer: NOPE. 
Can WITT/WOO expect blow wins in the semis and look forward to battling each other on SAT.  ANSWER: NOPE.
But everyone in the gym and on this board expects them to win and therefore we do not have parity. But the fact that this discussion is happening means that the league is competitive now and if DENISON and ALLEGHENY can step up next year with maturing, improving teams maybe we can add competitiveness.  Only when we have 5-6 teams can beat each on any given night will we have parity in the NCAC!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2006, 10:28:47 AM
That would mean the NCAC would be just like the WIAC or CCIW, which ain't bad!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 24, 2006, 10:31:53 AM
I don't really see the parity in the league, either, except for the fact that OWU might be a closer third than I'd previously thought.  I'd give them about a 1 in 3 shot against Wittenberg tonight.  But Earlham, I think, is in for a long night.

And it seems to get worse next year.  With Wooster returning everyone except Witucky, I'd have to make them a heavy favorite to win the league.  Wittenberg not only loses Russ, but Brady and Steffes.  OWU, it seems to me, has a genuine shot at second place next season.  Earlham losing Miller, who might be the best player in the league, will hurt them big-time.  Wabash looks to be losing a lot of players who got minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 24, 2006, 10:40:58 AM
NEW TOPIC!! NEW TOPIC!! And this is multi-regional but I'll put it here.
Without the benefit of a "CHAMPIONSHIP WEEKEND" preview release somewhere, what is going to be the most contested League Tourney this weekend? 

Of course we are following the NCAC but the OAC, MIAA in our region could have some upsets as well. And what about the other regions?  It is supposed to be cold and rainy in TN so I might as well tune in on the computer and watch the fireworks in the other regions and leagues. 

Where do you guys think the fireworks will be going off?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2006, 10:41:35 AM
The fireworks have already gone off in some places. Gordon and York (PA) lost early and there go two "C" bids.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2006, 11:01:36 AM
Sorry, but I'm not going to buy the whole parity thing just yet either.  Let's wait and see the final results of tonight's games before we start serioulsly talking about that P word in association with the NCAC.  Believe it or not, I'm agreeing with Wally in his takes on Wooster and Witt both losing to the 3rd and 4th place teams in the last week of the season.  Like Wally said, both of those games showed all the signs of being upset specials, and I just don't see the red flags for tonight's games.  

As far as the 2 games go, I would say, given that OWU has been playing some really solid basketball of late, I would give them the best chance of knocking off Wittenberg.  But, like pennstghs stated, those late losses for Witt and Woo could only make them all the more focused to get the job done and get on through to the finals.  And, concerning the Wooster/EC matchup, the EC is going to need someone other than Miller to show up tonight.  That was their problem a month ago.  Miller ended up with over half of the Quaker's total points and no one else cracked double figures in the scoring column.  Miller is good, but he isn't good enough to carry the EC past Wooster by himself, and if he tries to again, the result will be similar to the one back in January.  If Miller can get some help, we could be looking at a much closer game, just like the one back in December.  It will just depend on which Earlham team shows up tonight in Timken.

Good luck to all, and hopefully everyone making the trip has safe travels and an enjoyable weekend in Woo-town.  But not too enjoyable... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 24, 2006, 11:13:12 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 02:50:28 AM

It must have been one heckuva post Bar Exam party to be posting at that time of night, DC.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 24, 2006, 11:49:50 AM
Scotsfan- great point... which Earlham Team shows up... I hope one that will play 40 minutes of good hard fought Basketball.  Miller can't do it himself and I would love to see a supporting cast tonight.  On top of losing MIller this year... i'd say Jewett has about a 5% chance of returning next year.  He will get his degree in May and I have a strong feeling this weekend will be his last in a Quaker Uniform.  That being said... I'd like to see MILLER, JEWETT,HENRY,STEWART give the Scots everything they got! 

GooD LucK to all teams and Seniors.  Off to WOOSTER for my final 4   ;D 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 24, 2006, 02:35:08 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 24, 2006, 11:13:12 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 02:50:28 AM
It must have been one heckuva post Bar Exam party to be posting at that time of night, DC.  ;)

Don't forget - it wasn't even midnight yet where David posts from!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 02:47:42 PM
Well, thanks to everyone for your input.  I was trying to point out that the possibility of competitiveness in today's games, despite the high national profiles of Woo and Witt, was a step in the right direction, which is why I used the phrase "beginnings of parity," but it seems that nobody read it that way.  Obviously there is very little parity in the NCAC; I just think that Wabash, Earlham, and OWU are closer to the top this year then the 3-4-5 teams traditionally have been.  OWU has even been mentioned on another board as a bubble Pool C candidate--they aren't, but when was the last time someone outside our conference even considered one of "bottom 8" for an NCAA berth?

Anyway, I don't mind being in the one-man minority, like am I about Dane Borchers being the league's MVP. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on February 24, 2006, 03:15:11 PM
I would agree that the league as a whole now is quite a bit more competitive than recent years, now we just have to hope that the 3-4-5 teams will continue to build on this year and not have a situation like a few years ago when Gheny had a decent year finishing as runner ups in the NCAC tournament only to come back the next year terrible. Tonights games should be exciting to say the least, here's hoping for a Woo-Owu Final tomorrow night...I also think its great the OWU is being mentioned as a possible pool C, it would be great for not only the NCAC but also for that program to gain an entry into the national tournament. A part of me almost wants them to win the NCAC tourney so that we can get 3 teams in but I don't see them knocking off the big 2 on consecutive nights. Good luck to all teams
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 24, 2006, 03:42:26 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 24, 2006, 02:35:08 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 24, 2006, 11:13:12 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 02:50:28 AM
It must have been one heckuva post Bar Exam party to be posting at that time of night, DC.  ;)

Don't forget - it wasn't even midnight yet where David posts from!


D'oh! I did forget about that. I'm used to being the westernmost poster on this board.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 04:23:19 PM
Quote from: Vanilla24COW on February 24, 2006, 03:15:11 PMA part of me almost wants them [OWU] to win the NCAC tourney so that we can get 3 teams in but I don't see them knocking off the big 2 on consecutive nights.

It's funny; a part of me hopes that too (and it'd be fine with me if it were Earlham, although that seems less likely).  But I'm just a fan, and that's my excuse.  I'm surprised to hear that from a former player on one of the teams that has to lose for that scenario to occur!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 05:42:10 PM
The video feed is pretty good so far.  I recommend it to those with high-speed connections. 

It looks (and sounds) like Witt and OWU are playing pretty much for friends and relatives.  I expect the gym will be pretty full for the second half, though.  Witt leads 12-11, midway through the first. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 24, 2006, 06:02:01 PM
Halftime score

OWU 26
Witt 25
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 06:02:25 PM
OWU is playing with a lot of confidence, despite not shooting well so far, and they lead by 1 at the half, 26-25.

I'm not sure how the Wooster folks have drawn up the seating chart, but it seems that the OWU fans are in the space I expect to find the Witt fans, behind the visitors bench.  I guess that makes sense, given that the Bishops are the visitors in this game, but it's a little disorienting! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 24, 2006, 06:23:12 PM
I have audio but no video on the feed..anyone else with the same problem?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 06:40:03 PM
Yeah, this half my video is a series of snapshots.  Which is especially unhelpful, since the announcers are describing the action with the understanding that we're seeing it ("That's Russ...no good...I think it was Jean who knocked it out, wasn't it?").

Witt is up by 10, 45-35, somewhere near the middle of the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 24, 2006, 06:51:34 PM
I was going to watch the video feed and then put on WQKT for audio but it seems like the radio is a good 30 seconds behind.  At least that was the case in the first half.  So I have to do with what CPI/Teamline is offering.

I have high speed internet and still think that the quality of the video should be better.  The picture looks like those shot by a camera with water on the lens.  I don't know if I am the only one with this problem or thinking?

Yes, moments ago they (CPI/Teamline) had a video blackout and I called it in.  The gentleman at the end of the 1-800-number wasn't even aware of the problem.

57-45 Witt with less than three minutes to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 07:03:08 PM
Witt advances, 63-46.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 24, 2006, 07:03:38 PM
Solid second half by Wittenberg gave them a 63-46 win over Ohio Weslyan University.  It was OWU's game to lose and they lost it.  My sympathy goes out to them.  Good season Bishops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 24, 2006, 07:24:48 PM
I watched the bit of pregame they showed here and it is pretty clear. I'm sure the traffic will increase at game time. This is pretty neat.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 07:43:07 PM
All I get, video-wise, is a big blue screen proclaiming that it's Earlham vs. Wooster.  Not much use to me, I'm afraid.

(update) then, when the game starts, back to the series-of-snapshots.  Grrr.  It's probably too much for my POS DSL connection (which, thankfully, I say goodbye to after this weekend, when I hit the road again.)  Back to the old reliable, WQKT and Mike Breckinridge.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 24, 2006, 07:51:19 PM
Watching the game online.  The picture is, surprisingly, clear.  I am really impressed with this set up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 24, 2006, 07:55:55 PM
If you are pro-Wooster and you wanna enjoy the game, turn on to WQKT for audio to complement the CPI/Teamline video.  Nothing wrong with the CPI/Teamline staff but having listened to Mike the entire season, I'd rather listen to him.

Surprisingly Timken looks half full/empty??? ...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 09:01:49 PM
Earlham is hanging tough, but Scots have re-opened a 10 point edge, 74-64, with 5:51 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2006, 09:19:55 PM
Final:  Wooster 84  Earlham 74

Wooster was led tonight by James Cooper with 19 points, Tim Vandervaart with 15 points and Tom Port with 11 points.  Brandon Miller had 20 points and LaRon Henry added 18 points for the Quakers.

Great to see the game on the internet video system tonight.  :)  Tomorrow, I will make the trip to Timken to see the final game vs Witt.

Wooster is now 25-2  ;D ...and it sure would be sweet to clinch the automatic NCAA bid tomorrow night.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 24, 2006, 09:39:33 PM
I guess the parity argument has been decided. I hope next year will be better in that regard.

Tomorrow night should be a good game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on February 24, 2006, 10:02:54 PM
hey what time is the game sat night and where can i listen to it  what are the chanches of witt beating wooster   what are your thoughts
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 10:28:48 PM
Quote from: hope1 on February 24, 2006, 10:02:54 PM
hey what time is the game sat night and where can i listen to it  what are the chanches of witt beating wooster   what are your thoughts

1.  7pm Eastern time
2.  Links to audio and video are available through the NCAC website (http://www.northcoast.org/news/MBKBTRNYVIDEO.html?id=813)
3.  About 50/50
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 24, 2006, 10:36:51 PM
looks like an outline to an essay answer...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 24, 2006, 10:41:08 PM
Some comments on tonight's games at Timken:

Witt-OWU:

OWU gave it their best shot, but Wittenberg is just not a good matchup for them.  If a few more of their shots had fallen in the first half, they might have opened up an 8 or 10 point lead, and things could have been different.  But Witt came out in the second half and was able to take away every scoring weapon that OWU had.  They defended the inside one-on-one and that enabled them to pressure the three-point shooters.  After that, it was just a matter of time.

Russ and Borchers are both class acts, and that irks me no end.  How is a man supposed to hate Wittenberg with the required zeal when these two guys are so likeable?  Dang it...

Wooster-Earlham:

LaRon Henry had a nice game and showed me that he's deserving of second-team NCAC.  

Brandon Miller continued gamely after turning his ankle, but I wonder about the strategy of having him bring the ball upcourt at that point when the Quakers needed some pace in their attack to try to cut into the gap.

There is no way that anyone can ever convince me that Wooster gets breaks from the officials when playing other NCAC teams.  I've watched scores of games at Timken, including all but one this season, and in my opinion, the referees lean the other way, towards the opponent.  Tonight there were dozens of non-calls on Earlham fouls or infractions (travelling) and some phantom calls on Wooster players.  The best thing that happened to Brandon Miller tonight was getting called for two early fouls because the refs then refused to call a third on him until the contest was nearly decided, despite a few golden opportunities.

And, well, I've been 'outed', 'Valerie Plame'd' if you will.  In the stands before the games tonight, Andy Van Horn's mom leaked to me that she knew I missed Tuesday's Kenyon game because I wasn't feeling well.  I was wondering how she knew that, since I had only just arrived and hadn't told her, but a later conversation with her husband revealed that they'd figured out I was Wooster Booster.  So much for secret identities.  See if I let her tell me anymore stories about chasing lawyers on the far side of the grandstand.  :)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2006, 11:06:46 PM
QuoteTonight there were dozens of non-calls on Earlham fouls or infractions (travelling) and some phantom calls on Wooster players.  The best thing that happened to Brandon Miller tonight was getting called for two early fouls because the refs then refused to call a third on him until the contest was nearly decided, despite a few golden opportunities.

A. The NCAC refs wouldn't call a travel even if a kid walked 15 steps from halfcourt to the basket.

B. Ahem, Wooster should not complain about players being protected. I've seen players like Port, Vandervart, Nelson, et. al. protected big time at Wabash. Same with Russ and Borchers, and BJ Harris.


You can't prove the Ohio bias - but there's a big time conspiracy theory about it. And now, I must change the tinfoil...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2006, 11:07:18 PM
Artie's SUIT? What was Artie wearing????
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 24, 2006, 11:14:20 PM
Nice take on the games Wooster Booster.

I agree with you on the officials, hopefully we won't see them tomorrow night.
I don't know how those Mickey Mouse clowns ever got picked to do a tournament game.

But one thing is clear: the Scots have got to play a lot better against Witt.

And hopefully there's a bigger crowd tomorrow. But then again there's a lot of High School Games going on this weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 24, 2006, 11:16:36 PM
Vandervaart fouled out tonight.

Artie had on a blue suit with a red shirt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 11:20:24 PM
Quote from: zosobob on February 24, 2006, 11:14:20 PM
I agree with you on the officials, hopefully we won't see them tomorrow night.
I don't know how those Mickey Mouse clowns ever got picked to do a tournament game.

Mike Breckinridge said that two of them were "not from Ohio."

No wonder they sucked!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 24, 2006, 11:23:39 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2006, 11:06:46 PM
A. The NCAC refs wouldn't call a travel even if a kid walked 15 steps from halfcourt to the basket.

The refs made several travelling calls tonight.  Most legit, but one mystery call on Brandon Johnson could have been a big one.  Earlham made a quick 3 after that and I thought that they might make a run, but Cooper took over for a couple minutes for the Scots and gave them a little cushion.

Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2006, 11:06:46 PM
B. Ahem, Wooster should not complain about players being protected. I've seen players like Port, Vandervart, Nelson, et. al. protected big time at Wabash. Same with Russ and Borchers, and BJ Harris.

The point is that it happens everywhere - not just to Wooster's and Witt's advantage.  Scots fans (and I'm sure Tigers fans) get tired of hearing that we always get the benefit of the calls.  Definitely NOT the case tonight, in my opinion.  Yes, there were bad calls and non-calls both ways, but Earlham got all kinds (maybe not dozens though!) of close calls tonight.

Kudos to Brandon Miller for a great career and a really gutsy performance tonight.  He looked to be in a lot of pain after turning his ankle, but did his best to keep Earlham in the game.  I thought that Justus could have taken him out in the last minute to be acknowledged by the crowd...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 24, 2006, 11:32:28 PM
Derek -

Thanks, you reminded me of something I had meant to mention in my earlier post.

Although both teams played hard and physical, good sportsmanship ran rampant throughout the game.  Miller and Port were joking a few times, as were some others.  Many times, if a player hit the deck, an opponent helped him to his feet.  And at the end of the game, while the clock was still running down, there were a lot of hugs passed across former enemy lines on the court.  Especially between the seniors and upperclassmen, from guys who had squared off against each other for quite a few contests over the last three or four years. Miller, Port, Henry, Witucky, etc.  It was great to see.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 24, 2006, 11:48:03 PM
On to tomorrow night Ladies and Gentlemen, it should be interesting.

Looking forward to Sunday night also. (selections)
And Monday. (pairings)

Good Evening
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2006, 11:55:41 PM
I'm also looking forward to those three things, but with no small amount of trepidation.  Wooster is not playing their best basketball right now.  I'm beginning to wonder if they peaked too soon.  I hope they play well tomorrow, and I further hope that they get a favorable draw in the tourney, which may only be possible if they get switched to a largely Mid-Atlantic bracket.  Probably the best we could hope for is to not get a first round bye, and host a four-team regional with the likes of Bethany, Lake Erie, and maybe Carnegie Mellon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2006, 12:26:11 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2006, 11:06:46 PM

B. Ahem, Wooster should not complain about players being protected. I've seen players like Port, Vandervart, Nelson, et. al. protected big time at Wabash. Same with Russ and Borchers, and BJ Harris.


Ahem, I guess that's why Port picked up his 3rd and 4th fouls within a minute of each other in the 1st five minutes of Wooster's visit to Chadwick earlier this year, in case you forgot?  ???  Good thing Port was being "protected" in that particular game... ::)

I will say, I echo WB's sentiments regarding opponents getting "homered" by the refs when they visit Wooster or Witt.  I can't speak on behalf of what goes on at Wittenberg, but I can say that it seems to be the exact opposite that goes on at Wooster.  Tonight, Miller picks up 2 quick fouls, and then he seems to become immune to the whistle for some reason.  It was as if the refs were afraid to blow the whistle on him again until the contest was basically decided.  He had two questionable charging calls that were never made in the 1st half alone?  Not to mention the times that he was reaching in or over the back.  Now, I can see why he fouled out so early in that Wittenberg game.  Those officials weren't afraid to call him on it! 

At least good sportsmanship still won out though in the end.  It was refreshing to see mutual respect being shown by both teams at the end of the game on a hardfaught win by the Scots.  Miller and company showed nothing but class even though the Wooster student section rode him practically the entire game chanting "Miller, Miller, Miller" everytime he did something foolish.  He, nor any of the Earlham players gave any sort of recognition towards the crowd at any time during the game.  Maybe they learned their lesson from the Wabash game.  I just wanted to say that they handled themselves with class tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2006, 12:48:18 AM
Port should have gotten 7 or 8 fouls on him at Chadwick. Geez. He was out of control and whining.

I'm also taking HISTORICAL, if you would read.

Lest we forget last year where Wabash had *zero* foul shots in the entire game - thanks to Ohio refs.

Anyway, I want DETAILS on Artie. Not just simple colors. What hue of blue? What about the shirt! My gosh, people! Details!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2006, 12:58:52 AM
Nobody thinks that the refs have enough brain power to accurately interpret the rules and call a decent game, but everyone thinks they're all part of some vast conspiracy to help or hurt various teams that nobody outside our little circle has ever heard of.  And they're so fiendishly clever that they can execute their demonic plans and make the fans of both teams feel certain that they're the ones who were targeted. 

Or maybe, just maybe, they're regular guys like you and me, except we sit here and say terrible things aout them, while they make our game possible.

::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 25, 2006, 01:08:48 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 25, 2006, 12:58:52 AM
Nobody thinks that the refs have enough brain power to accurately interpret the rules and call a decent game, but everyone thinks they're all part of some vast conspiracy to help or hurt various teams that nobody outside our little circle has ever heard of.  And they're so fiendishly clever that they can execute their demonic plans and make the fans of both teams feel certain that they're the ones who were targeted. 

Or maybe, just maybe, they're regular guys like you and me, except we sit here and say terrible things aout them, while they make our game possible.

::)

Your a real buzz kill   DC..........karma anyway
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: c-busballer on February 25, 2006, 02:19:12 AM
"Officials"

I have been able to see a number of Division III games this year without any real rooting interest.  It has been a lot of fun to go to games just to watch the game and enjoy the competition.  It is also amazing to sit and listen to some of the words and phrases that come out of fans mouths about officials and players.  Sometimes the fans are also very critical of their own teams players, not aware if that player's relatives or coach's relatives are sitting near the critisism or even insults.  I know everyone has a right to voice their opinion.  I just think more positive cheering for their team would benefit everyone.  For the most part, it is only a few people for each team.

Comment's about the officials are the worst.   This game is so fast and quick.  They are making split second decisions every time down the court.  I have seen only a few officials that seem to carry an attitude.  When you are playing or coaching, it may seem like the officials have done a poor job in a particular game.  After watching the film, you realize that they did a fair job, missed a few calls, but at the same time, you actually see that your team got the benefit of the same number if not more than your opponent.

The charge that Wooster and Wittenberg get the benefit of the calls is brought up often in here.  I just think it is a matter of Wooster and Witt being very good every year, usually on a slightly higher playing level than not only the NCAC but the majority of DIII schools.  They are very well coached and they get top quality recruits who know how to play.  They do not have complicated offensive and defensive strategies which let's their players concentrate on making plays instead of trying to run plays. 

I was able to watch John Carroll win 3 of 4 NCAA Tournament games (2 at Witt and 2 at Wooster) the last couple of years.  For those of you that think there is home court cooking, that was not the case.  And some may think that JCU got the benefit of the calls.  The team that won those four games was the team that made the most plays, not the refs.  The game that Wooster won on their way to the final 4, they made the plays.  JCU came all the way from 15 to 17 point deficits at Wooster.  The first year, Wooster made a few more play down the stretch to win the game (particularly Mitchell).  The second year, JCU made a few more plays.  At Witt, JCU just outplayed Witt the first time.  The second time, JCU made a few more plays.

Sorry for rambling.  It just amazes me how people can put so much emphasis on the officiating of the game, when they have very little influence on the game.  They will miss some calls for your team.  They are human and people just like you and me.  The most regular people, with real jobs, real families, and real problems.  Buy them a beer if you see them at a restaurant or bar and sit down with them.  To understand how quick the game is, try to officiate an elementary game.  Even at that level, you will realize that every time down the court, you probably miss a call.  I still feel that way when I have to referee games as a camp counselor. 

Good luck to Wooster and Witt. Would love to be there, but I have a 2 year old boy that can already snap his wrist on his follow-through that I have to watch.  Congrats to Earlham and OWU on their seasons. 



 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 25, 2006, 07:49:05 AM
Wow,

Will the conspiracy BS against Wabash EVER end??  I mean, you guys must really have a low self esteem to think that the entire NCAC is out to make sure Wabash never wins a game.  Come on...lets get real here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2006, 08:16:22 AM
Darkside -

A. The game last year with zero foul shots was pretty blatant.

B. The line "and now I must change the tinfoil" was meant to put it in it's proper place. Some people chose not to read and to ignored that part - and I can't help that some people get defensive and turn off their sense of humor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 25, 2006, 09:13:24 AM
come on guys who cares bout refs its CHAMPIONSHIP SATURDAY this is what we've been waiting for all season. im heading up to wooster in a few hours, so scots fans beware-i'll be the one with the sign behind the tiger bench.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 25, 2006, 09:23:39 AM
Can someone please take (a) picture(s) of Artie?  It will be nice to see what he is gonna wear for the game tonight.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2006, 12:23:06 PM
Quote from: WooMix on February 25, 2006, 09:23:39 AM
Can someone please take (a) picture(s) of Artie? It will be nice to see what he is gonna wear for the game tonight. :)

I'm guessing he'll be there in his red suit tonight.  That seems to be the suit du jour for the Witt/Woo game.  At least the games at Wooster that is...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 25, 2006, 01:22:13 PM
Quote from: DarkSide-D on February 25, 2006, 07:49:05 AM
Wow,

Will the conspiracy BS against Wabash EVER end??  I mean, you guys must really have a low self esteem to think that the entire NCAC is out to make sure Wabash never wins a game.  Come on...lets get real here.

You don't have to believe in an anti-Wabash conspiracy to see something wrong with a team getting zero foul shots in an NCAC tourney game.

There are Wooster posters on here complaining about the officiating in a game they (a) won by 10 points, and (b) had 3 more FTs than Earlham.

Do you really expect me to believe that NO ONE would complain if Wooster loses to Witt tonight and gets ZERO foul shots in the process? Please.

There are conspiracy theories and they're retarded. But zero foul shots is equally retarded.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 25, 2006, 01:30:59 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 25, 2006, 12:48:18 AM
Anyway, I want DETAILS on Artie. Not just simple colors. What hue of blue? What about the shirt! My gosh, people! Details!

It was a blue-violet hue, with a red shirt and red tie--unreal.  I'm guessing the red suit with a black shirt/tie will be the suit of choice for the Championship--

Where's the "Artie's Suit de jour" thread?  I'd love to see the results of the poster's predictions!

Should be a great Woo/Witt III tonight--

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on February 25, 2006, 01:35:39 PM
I would expect the bright red out of coach T tonight. One of my personal favorites that is usually used for the big games. I spoke to a few bookies who had differing opinions on the spread tonight. They are as follows.

Big C----- Woo -3.5
Little Mookie----- Witt -2

My money is on Witt all the way. No way we drop 3 to these guys in one season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 25, 2006, 01:36:57 PM
Seriously, does no one own a digital camera? We need some photos of this suit!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2006, 01:52:07 PM
Speaking of Championship Saturday, and Witt/Woo Part 3, there was a qoute in today's Daily Record that could be construed as some possible "Bulletin Board Material".  This comes courtesy of Mr. Russ:

Quote from: Joe Vardon of The Wooster Daily RecordWittenberg's players sat in postgame interviews following the second contest and swore they'd get one more shot. Now they say they're ready to take advantage of it.

"They got the first two on us and we don't think that's gonna happen again," said Tigers center Dan Russ. "They shot well both those games and we still think we're the better team going into this one."

I would imagine Wooster has some different thoughts as to who the better team is, seeing as how they hold a 2-0 lead in the season series... ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2006, 02:32:22 PM
Regarding the $8 ticket charge for the game sessions, this from the DR:
Quote from: The Daily RecordCASH COW — The Wooster athletic department sold 1,551 tickets for last night's games and figures to do a little over $15,000 in business this weekend. Too bad it can't keep the money.  All of the proceeds from this weekend's NCAC tournament will go directly to the conference office, which will in turn use it to pay its expenses for the year. Anything left over is distributed evenly among the NCAC's 10 schools.
------------
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 25, 2006, 01:52:07 PM
Speaking of Championship Saturday, and Witt/Woo Part 3, there was a qoute in today's Daily Record that could be construed as some possible "Bulletin Board Material".  This comes courtesy of Mr. Russ:

Quote from: Joe Vardon of The Wooster Daily RecordWittenberg's players sat in postgame interviews following the second contest and swore they'd get one more shot. Now they say they're ready to take advantage of it.

"They got the first two on us and we don't think that's gonna happen again," said Tigers center Dan Russ. "They shot well both those games and we still think we're the better team going into this one."

I would imagine Wooster has some different thoughts as to who the better team is, seeing as how they hold a 2-0 lead in the season series... ::)

How dare Dan Russ think his team is the better team!  Blasphemer!  Heretic!  Infidel!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2006, 04:40:13 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 25, 2006, 02:32:22 PM

How dare Dan Russ think his team is the better team!  Blasphemer!  Heretic!  Infidel!  :D


Wow, that's pretty impressive DC.  How you got from point A: my take on Russ' comment in today's Daily Record and how it could easily be construed as possible Bulletin Board Material for Wooster, to point B:  basically, interpreting my take as  condemning his comments is pretty impressive.  Well done indeed...

Actually, I have no problem with Witt believing that they are the better team.  I just didn't feel Russ was very wise in the timing and outwardness of his statement.  In this day and age where it seems almost taboo to say anything that might have the slightest chance to make the Bulletin Board Material cut, I'd say his statement certainly qualifies.   Blasphemous, not quite, but possible BB Material, most definately.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2006, 05:10:54 PM
Or he could have said it KNOWING it would get all bulletin boardy and have an effect that way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2006, 05:51:28 PM
This is true.  A bit of reverse psychology perhaps...

Coach Brown seems to be a master at this, so maybe it has rubbed off on some of his players?

Anyways, I'm off to pick up some half baked Coccia House pizzas before heading up to Timken.  I'm hopeful of enjoying them in celebration of another NCAC Tournament championship and NCAA automatic bid for the Scots after the game.  In any event, I can't wait for tipoff for what should be another battle between these two great rivals!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 25, 2006, 07:49:58 PM
Other GLAKES Scores:
With 9:41 left in the first HOPE over CALVIN 19-8

With about 10 mins left in the first half ONU leads BW by 11, 25-14
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 25, 2006, 08:22:52 PM
Hope up big at halftime over CALVIN 39-21!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2006, 08:59:51 PM
Congratulations to Wittenberg, the 2006 NCAC Champions!

I'm encouraged by Wooster's late-second-half play, despite the outcome.  I think they have righted the ship, and will take some confidence into the tournament.  If they can get a draw that keeps them away from teams with two dominant inside players like Borchers and Russ, they can go far. 

As for Witt, they need to work on their free-throw shooting, and get a little help from outside, but they're looking pretty good for a deep tournament run. 

Wouldn't a Woo/Witt IV in Salem be nice?  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 25, 2006, 09:02:47 PM
WITTENBERG wins over the SCOTS in another thriller in which they controlled the entire game 71-69.  Borchers and Russ go off for combined 42 points and 24 rbs.

Simple game really, you gotta make baskets and at critical times (like the start of the second half) the SCOTS did not.

Scots probably fall to #3 in the regional rankings and the road to Roanoke just got tougher.

Congrats to NCAC Tourney Champs.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2006, 10:21:33 PM
Just got back from Timken where I watched another Wooster - Witt classic game.

Congratulations to Wittenberg as the NCAC Tournament Champs!

This was a real battle that could have been won by either team.  As usual, Russ and Borchers were huge inside for the Tigers while Cooper and Vandervaart carried the scoring load for the Scots.

Wooster probably gave this game away at the free throw line where they missed 11 shots (ouch).  The other major difference was the shooting percentage.  Wooster shot 42% from the floor while Witt was over 50%.  Some of the difference was attributable to Witt's tough defense but Wooster also missed a number of open shots, including some three pointers that could have made a big difference.

Good luck to both teams in the NCAA tournament.  :)  Let's hope that the NCAA bracket doesn't match up these two fine teams until they get to Salem, as DC noted, but I am not counting on it!

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 25, 2006, 10:25:10 PM
Congratulations, Wittenberg, on winning the NCAC Tournament and good luck in the big one.

Game Notes

DC may have been on to something when he threw Dane Borchers name into the mix for NCAC POY.  He was certainly the player of this game, and according to the "Board of Whoever Decides This Stuff" he was also the MVP of the tournament.  Deservedly so.

It wasn't just his scoring, although that certainly helped Witt's cause along.  But his offensive rebounding, especially when the Scots forced Russ to miss, just killed Wooster.  Time and again he got loose on the baseline to either grab the board or to tip it deep back to a Witt guard.  Gotta box him out, guys.

And the combination of Borchers and Russ on defense presents problems that you rarely see in DIII.  I'm reminded of a statement by Hall of Fame baseball manager Earl Weaver, who lamented, after losing a world series to the Pirates, "Sometimes there are moves you can make, but you don't make them, because you know the other guy has an answer."  

Weaver was talking about batter/pitcher matchups, but his words translate neatly to basketball.  The Scots have nearly a handful of players who could have beaten their man off the dribble.  But if they did that, then they're up against a shot blocker, or two, when they get into the paint.  So, what was to be gained?

Still, there were opportunities.  But the Scots couldn't ever get over the hump, missing a foul shot here, a three-pointer there.  If a few of those fall, that game might still be going on.

The officiating

For about the first 2/3 of the ballgame, I felt that Wittenberg got away with being overly aggressive.  But then, as if a gun went off, suddenly fouls were being called on Witt, fouls that I've not often seen called at Timken on an opponent.  Holds, pushes, hacks.  Mostly, they seemed to be called by the older ref, who just stepped forward and did the right thing.  It was nice to see, and from that point on I thought it was one of the better officiated DIII games that I've seen.

The Scots made a valiant comeback effort.  A few shots fell, a few Wittenberg free throws missed.  But Wooster needed to make those shots earlier, and they just wouldn't go.  Their three attempts were mostly just misses, but so many of the free throws just lingered, tantalizingly, around the rim before falling off.  It just wasn't their night. You really don't need to play these Wooster-Witt games, you could just flip a coin.  But then we'd all miss some real entertainment.  Here's hoping that the Scots get some more home games, so the Wooster fans can again come out in force.

And I tell ya, some women just can't hold their popcorn...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on February 25, 2006, 10:43:53 PM
hope won tonight  63  to 44 over calvin  i dont think hope will get the 1 seed  i think witt will   or baldin wallace what do you think
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 25, 2006, 11:32:55 PM
Another classic tonight, and congrats to Witt on another conference title!

I only listened to the game on the radio (watched bits and pieces of the video broadcast, but Scott Leo was about 30 seconds ahead of the video, so I mainly relied just on him - way to go, partner!), so I can't offer much insight other than what has already been posted, but man was I sweating bullets at the end!

However, I will throw this into the mix - something I find to be a pretty fun stat.  Over the past 3 seasons in the Witt-Wooster match-up, the road team is 7-2!  Home court advantage has been completely thrown out the window in this series.  You think it has something to do with wanting to go in and quiet a hostile crowd?  That's just one of the many things that makes this rivalry so great.

Either way, best of luck to each team in the postseason, and here's to hoping Witt can get at least one more home game in here . . .
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2006, 11:34:59 PM
Here's how I see the final regional rankings, assuming I have recalculated the QoWI correctly:

1. Wittenberg (20-3, QoWI 10.652)
2. Hope (17-2, 10.211)
3. Baldwin-Wallace (22-4, 10.077)
4. Wooster (21-3, 10.042)
5. Carnegie Mellon (15-4, 10.474)
6. Calvin (13-2, 9.750)
---------------------------
7. Lake Erie (18-4, 9.682)
8. Bethany (20-4, 9.417)
9. Ohio Northern (17-6, 9.130)
10. Albion (12-4, 9.125)

Pool C candidates shown in boldface; Pool B candidate shown in italics.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 26, 2006, 12:04:42 AM
and a fine weekend of basketball concludes


Congratulations to Wittenberg and POY Daniel Russ (yea, I said it) and Borchers (coming up huge against the big boys) and anyone else associated with the Tigers.

Earlhamalum and I didn't stick around all day for this one, but we did have a great time last night at the semis.

Listened to the game tonight and here are the thoughts I pulled through Scott Leo's broadcast. Witt is so good defensively....and with just enough scoring, they are going to be a very, very tough out. Wooster never quits. They come at you in waves, something only teams like Witt are to offset in this league. I was surprised that Wooster had the dry stretch early in the second, especially in Timken. Just more credit to Witt's defense.

Just a final thought on Wooster/Earlham III from last night. Wooster really punished Earlham and the Quakers lack of depth by running at every opportunity. They are as good at getting from defense to offense as any team I've ever seen at any level. Glad to see Earlham didn't back down after a rough start like last year. Early, Earlham just couldn't get anything to go down and LaRon Henry was a non-factor in the first half. However, instead of going into a shell and losing by 30+, Miller and Jewett gutted out great efforts and Henry came alive. But again, Cooper (who will be NCAC POY the next two years) and the rest of the Scots always came up with a clutch play to keep the margin at 6 or 7.

Look forward to following both of the W's in the tourney...and while there's still not parity, this was a good year for the league as teams 3-5 really challenged the big boys.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2006, 12:09:01 AM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 26, 2006, 12:04:42 AM
Just a final thought on Wooster/Earlham III from last night. Wooster really punished Earlham and the Quakers lack of depth by running at every opportunity.

I should point out that Steve Moore said in the pregame show yesterday that that was part of the game plan.  IIRC, he noted that Henry, Jewett, and especially Miller pulled big minutes on Tuesday against Wabash, and he thought if Wooster ran, ran, and ran some more it would wear down the starters and expose the short bench.  I guess it worked.

I hope you guys had a good weekend in COW-town.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldwittfan on February 26, 2006, 12:12:48 AM
Why would someone feel a need to turn Dan Russ's honest statement of believe in his team into a shot at Bill Brown.  Thanks to the rest of you Wooster fans for congratulating Wittenberg.  These two teams are so evenly matched, so good and so contrasting in style, that they make being a fan fun, don't they.  

I say Dan Russ is player of the year, and it is great that Dane Borchers has decided to come back next year. Thank you to both teams for pushing each other to great play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2006, 12:42:20 AM
What did Artie wear??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 26, 2006, 12:49:30 AM
By the way, an article to pass along from Friday's Indy Star....

I've mentioned the strange saga of Bronson Lickliter's college basketball career and it finally got a little press.....

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060224/SPORTS06/602240456/-1/ARCHIVE


I had mentioned earlier in the year the story of Lickliter to the Richmond Pal-Item's sports editor, but no press. I would have mentioned the idea earlier to the Indy Star, but I just found out I lost out on a highly competitive internship at the Star. If things keep going this way, I might find myself back at Earlham in the M.A.T. program and beg for my old spot on the end of the bench back. Bronson, you're an inspiration...............and a whole lot of other things.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 26, 2006, 02:22:59 AM
now i know everyone has awaited my thoughts on the game. a late night return from wooster has kept me from posting till now, well along with a little celebrating

WHAT A GAME!!!!! these two teams put the meaning of championship game to full force. no one can criticize these teams for lack of effort as there were numerous bodies laying across the court all night. A nice turnout from both teams, as i think Witt's student body kept their presence felt throughout the night. Obviously our plan was to get the ball low often and if Wooster did finally collapse and double down dish it out for a 3.

In all actuality the game should have been over earlier, but thankfully Witt's missed free throws didn't come back to bite us. As the clock read .2 seconds i was playing out the scenario of the refs adding more time for Cooper to launch a 3. Witt did a tremendous job of guarding the perimeter all night, minus the last 2 minutes, and holding wooster below their season average attributes that to our defense

as for the tournament i think witt has rightfully earned the right to be the number one seed in the great lakes region. 2 losses to another top 5 team and one road upset shouldnt hurt them too bad, plus a conference title to go along with it.

i see witt hosting with hope, b-w, carnegie mellon, and calvin traveling to Springfield, but i wouldnt be surprised to see Hope host as they ahve the perfectly new facilities to accommodate the onslaught of fans that would be in attendance
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 26, 2006, 09:09:27 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 26, 2006, 12:42:20 AM
What did Artie wear??

As expected, Artie was wearing the red...

WooScotsFan - I just realized that you may not know that I had changed my user name and e-mail address!  This is me (formerly CMHScots!)  Hope that we get a chance to meet up again next weekend in Wooster! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2006, 12:01:38 PM
I just wanted to add my congratulations to Wittenberg on a fine performance in winning the NCAC Tournament Championship last night.  Their 2 MVP's really stepped it up in a big way last night, especially in the 2nd half. 

As for my thoughts on the game, I thougt that the run that Witt made right out of the gates to start the 2nd half was the turning point IMO.  Also, Witt was finally able to dictate tempo which also went in their favor.  If Wooster wants to point at one key stat, I would say their poor performance at the charity stripe would have to jump out at them.  Witt missed their fair share of ft's as well, but most of their misses came at the end of the game when they were trying to let Wooster almost complete the miracle comeback.  Wooster's misses were coming at key stages when makes could have pulled them to within a point or two or even tie.  I kept thinking during the game, if Wooster were to lose, they lost the game at the line which is what happened.

Not to take anything away from Witt, because they came out with their best defensive effort by far against Wooster this season, especially their perimeter defesne.  Wooster was still getting open looks, but they were also rushing their shots on those open looks, especially Port.  In the end, it was nothing short of what is expected when these 2 rivals hook up.  A game where every possession matters and it comes down to the last one.  Well worth the $8 admission!

Now we have to wait and see what the NCAA (non)brain trust decide to do.  Do they do the right thing and separate the W's so that we could have the possibility of Witt/Woo IV in Salem?  Not likely, but there is always hope I guess.  Good luck to both Wittenberg and Wooster regardless of how bad the selection committee screws the pairings up again.  Represent the NCAC well in the 2nd season!!!

One more thing:

Quote from: oldwittfan on February 26, 2006, 12:12:48 AM

Why would someone feel a need to turn Dan Russ's honest statement of believe in his team into a shot at Bill Brown. 

It wasn't a shot a Bill Brown.  It was meant as a compliment.  I have noticed in the past that Coach Brown seems to use reverse psychology very well, especially prior to games with Wooster.  Man, could you be more touchy when it comes to Coach Brown?  It's like you interprit anything anyone says about the man in a negative way? ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: dren on February 26, 2006, 12:10:20 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 26, 2006, 02:22:59 AM
i see witt hosting with hope, b-w, carnegie mellon, and calvin traveling to Springfield, but i wouldnt be surprised to see Hope host as they ahve the perfectly new facilities to accommodate the onslaught of fans that would be in attendance

I think you are going to see alot of movement to and from the great lakes...
also have to figure in Bethany who is a Great Lakes Pool B lock and Lake Erie who is a Great Lakes Pool A from AMCC.

Seeing Witt, Hope, BUU, CM and Calvin opening together in a region would be bad for D3 for basketball.  If they are going to do that they might as well bring in Woo and admit one of those 6 directly to the final 4.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2006, 12:15:54 PM
Quote from: hope1 on February 25, 2006, 10:43:53 PM
hope won tonight  63  to 44 over calvin  i dont think hope will get the 1 seed  i think witt will   or baldin wallace what do you think

Thanks for the women's final.  The Hope men also beat Calvin 68-55. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 26, 2006, 12:40:43 PM
WOW! What a game last night!

The Scots had plenty of chances, but couldn't convert on easy baskets and free throws.

Hats off to Witt and some great D.

Hopefully the Scots can get out of their funk, or their season will be over quickly.

It'll be interesting to see where they'll be playing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 26, 2006, 12:51:25 PM
I forgot to comment on Witt/Woo IV.

That would be great to see in Salem.

And it would be great for Div. III Basketball to have this rivalry meet at its premier event.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 26, 2006, 01:31:36 PM
another point from the game last night-what a display of passion for both teams by both fan bases-the witt fans and wooster fans for the most part displayed class an support of their team. it would have been disappointing for the fans to ruin the game but the roar of timken in the final minute of the game is what college basketball is all about.

the only cheers worth complaining about are the "he's a dealer" cheer directed at dan russ, with which the witt fans replyed with "MVP"
also the "he's from springfield" cheer for cooper was followed up with "ACT's" with a playful jab-no we are not discussing this topic any longer lol

great job by both teams and hopefully we will get the chance to meet again later on down the road and avoid early close losses
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 26, 2006, 01:48:03 PM
Does anybody know what time today D3Hoops is going to post THEIR Projections? I know the actual NCAA's will be at 10pm.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2006, 01:56:28 PM
Here's Joe Vardon's vote for POY:

Quote from: Joe Vardon, Woosteri]Daily Record[/i]]Russ just missed on being a repeat MVP and will likely surrender his "NCAC Player of the Year" label to James Cooper.

------------

"He's a Dealer?"  I don't get it... ???

------------

The D3hoops.com projections of who's in is already posted, although it is subject to change based on today's results.  Check out The Daily Dose (http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/) to see the projections.  Late tonight, after the teams are announced, D3hoops.com wil post it's guesses at the pairings in the same forum.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 26, 2006, 02:21:58 PM
Thanks DC.

I must've scanned over it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: realist on February 26, 2006, 02:48:57 PM
It is comforting to find this room goes off on crazy tangents just like the MIAA does.
D.C.  Dealer might imply either some sort of drug connection or perhaps a gambling episode.  Who knows what meanings these words might have for students today.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2006, 02:54:18 PM
Quote from: realist on February 26, 2006, 02:48:57 PM
It is comforting to find this room goes off on crazy tangents just like the MIAA does.
D.C.  Dealer might imply either some sort of drug connection or perhaps a gambling episode.  Who knows what meanings these words might have for students today.

Don't be modest; nobody goes off on crazy tangents quite like the SuperSweet MIAA room does.  ::) :D

I certainly hope that "He's a Dealer" was not a drug reference (which had occurred to me) or a gambling reference (which hadn't.)  I've gotta believe the Wooster students wouldn't go that low.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on February 26, 2006, 04:16:48 PM
Site's getting slow already, must be selection sunday.

I love it!

Thanks for 2nd site, might need it tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2006, 05:32:26 PM
I was looking over the projection put up by the D3hoops gurus and they have Wooster going to the Mid-Atlantic as the #3 seed behind York and Lincoln.  I don't necessarily agree with the seed, but I don't mind Wooster being moved into that section of the bracket.  Wooster would be among 4 total GL teams moved into that section which include Carnegie Mellon, Bethany and Lake Erie.  The other team is Ursinus and they have York getting a Bye.  I would guess, according to this projection Wooster would host Lake Erie in the 1st round matchup, but beyond that, I really don't know how the host sites will be determined.  Would Wooster then host a 2nd round game if they were to make it out of the 1st round?  Or would it be a 4 team regional, followed by a sectional?  Can someone help out with these questions?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2006, 05:35:22 PM
And there was NOT much rejoicing. A thoroughly mediocre DePauw team won the SCAC title - thanks to a Rhodes upset of Trinity.  >:( :( :-[ :'( :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 26, 2006, 05:36:45 PM
The way I understand it Wooster would be a part of a 4 team bracket with all games played at York.

......and it will be  cakewalk.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 26, 2006, 05:39:15 PM
Quote from: sac on February 26, 2006, 05:36:45 PM
The way I understand it Wooster would be a part of a 4 team bracket with all games played at York.

......and it will be  cakewalk.

Correction

I beleive Pat is predicting Lake Erie vs Wooster, and Bethany vs Lincoln...........probably at Lincoln.

.......and it should still be a cakewalk...........although Lincoln intrigues me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 26, 2006, 05:39:42 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 26, 2006, 05:32:26 PM
Would Wooster then host a 2nd round game if they were to make it out of the 1st round?  Or would it be a 4 team regional, followed by a sectional?  Can someone help out with these questions?

The first/second rounds consist of 11 four-team groups and 5 three-team groups.

The semis and finals of the 4-team groups are all played at the gym of one host school.

In the three-team groups, two of the teams play, one of them hosting. The winner then goes to play at the gym of the team that had the bye.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2006, 05:42:00 PM
I don't know about Lincoln being a cakewalk. Their power rankings are very good and they have a high SOS when all is said and done.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 26, 2006, 05:45:32 PM
Quote from: sac on February 26, 2006, 05:36:45 PM
The way I understand it Wooster would be a part of a 4 team bracket with all games played at York.

......and it will be cakewalk.

I would have to agree with sac--if the Scots can regain their mid-late season form.  I'd love to go East.  Lincoln looks like they play the same up tempo style that Wooster does, so it would be a trackmeet won by the team that's making their shots--

We must be mindful, however, that Pat is LOGICAL--I wouldn't be suprised to see Hope, Calvin, Witt, Woo and BW all end up in the same bracket, by NCAA (il)logic--
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 26, 2006, 05:46:13 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 26, 2006, 02:54:18 PM
I certainly hope that "He's a Dealer" was not a drug reference (which had occurred to me) or a gambling reference (which hadn't.) I've gotta believe the Wooster students wouldn't go that low.

Obviously, the Wooster chant was referring to Daniel "Magic" Russ and his ability to deal out the ball.  He made some terrific drop-off passes, especially in the semi against OWU.

I can rarely decipher what the Wooster student section is chanting. Either they're world-class mumblers or my hearing has gone south fast.  I suspect the latter.  Or, it might just be that they're generally yelling in the direction of the opposition, across the gym, rather than to their left at their own fans.  Very astute of them.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2006, 06:05:35 PM
I don't think anyone had noted this yet about last night's Woo-Witt game:  With the win, Coach Brown picked up his 300th win as head coach of the Tigers.

Congrats to the Tigers and Coach Brown on an excellent game and top-quality defense on Wooster's guards all night.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2006, 07:16:59 PM
Quote from: fighting_scots on February 26, 2006, 05:45:32 PM

We must be mindful, however, that Pat is LOGICAL--I wouldn't be suprised to see Hope, Calvin, Witt, Woo and BW all end up in the same bracket, by NCAA (il)logic--


Yes, this is very true.  If I remember last year, Pat & co. picked Wooster to be moved east, and well, we know how that didn't happen.  The result was York breezed into Salem having to face only one team ranked in the top 25, meanwhile, the Albion sectional very well could have been a Final 4.  Logical doesn't register well with the NCAA committee members.  Only penny pinching...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2006, 08:17:01 PM
My mock bracket has Wooster hosting a 4-team regional, playing Messiah and then the winner of York (PA) vs. Bethany. 

I gave Witt a first-round bye, then the chance to host the winner of Calvin vs. Lake Erie.  If Witt wins that game, they host the sectional, with the other two seeded teams (besides Woo) being Miss. College and Va. Wesleyan.

YMMV.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: realist on February 26, 2006, 08:26:54 PM
DC Hard to know at this point, but your pairings sense, and that can be the kiss of death I know.  Over the years the NCAA has loved to place NCAC/MIAA early and often.  With the splits as outlined by Pat he has BW going east literally flying over other teams.  Histoically I would put Calvin in where you have, but wouldn't give Hope as much cushion.  It may be a personal bias, but still remember Wooster, Calvin, Mc Murry and Marysville in 00.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 26, 2006, 08:27:17 PM
DC--Thanks for the post--was this logically concluded?  Or did you employ the "reverse-logic" of the selection committee? ;D

After spending last week trying to out think the bar examiners, you may have an inside track!

As much as I'd love to see the Scots host, outside of OWU (who played out of their minds) they have played very well on the road this year--a bit more focused IMO--
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 26, 2006, 09:34:53 PM
as i believe the "low" wooster fans can get that low-low in meaning the students-i respect the general wooster fans for their support of their team

they were referring to russ as being a drug dealer wherever that came from cuz they followed that cheer up with a "he smokes pot"

i would love to see witt host a game saturday as i have to work thursday so i can stilla ttend-witt has earned the right to host the sectionals i believe as well if they can advance that far
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: section7 on February 26, 2006, 10:43:10 PM
WOOSTER OUT!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2006, 10:47:29 PM
They only had 10 pool C bids listed out of 16...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: section7 on February 26, 2006, 10:48:30 PM
the NCAA is crazy why release without the total field
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2006, 10:50:38 PM
Must have been an error - they now have the whole field in and yes Wooster is there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: section7 on February 26, 2006, 10:52:30 PM
Good for Wooster, would have been a joke if they were not in
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 26, 2006, 10:53:15 PM
That had me going for a second there. Wow. I would have blamed Depauw.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 26, 2006, 10:56:00 PM
Congrats to Section 7 for giving multiple coronaries to multiple Wooster fans. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on February 27, 2006, 12:04:39 AM
 ;) Perhaps the "He's a Dealer" drug reference chant may not be that far off anyway...afterall it is the Witt fans themselves who refer to Mr. Russ as..... "The Doctor". lol. --MoneyBall's comedic 2 cents.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2006, 12:27:53 AM
The actual team selection only differed from the projections by 3 teams, but it had a dramatic effect on my brackets.  I ended up moving Wooster to a whole different region, and --alas-- taking away their home game, as well as taking away Witt's bye (that's no biggie.)

Here's my current prediction for the NCAC teams:
Wooster vs. Villa Julie at York PA
York vs. Messiah
Winner to the Hope sectional, at Hope if they advance

Wittenberg vs. Maryville MO
Bethany vs. Calvin at Witt
Winner to the Witt sectional, at Witt if they advance
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2006, 12:58:16 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 26, 2006, 10:50:38 PM
Must have been an error - they now have the whole field in and yes Wooster is there.

This was an error on our part, which was difficult to fix because of the server load.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2006, 01:29:18 AM
DC -

If your modified bracket prediction holds up (or even something similar), would you think there would be any chance of Wooster hosting the sectional if they were to still be alive and Hope wasn't?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2006, 01:37:47 AM
There's always a chance.  Quality and size of facilities is a factor in selection of host sites.  Wooster has an edge on most schools in that department (probably not over Hope, though, unless a more eastern location is preferred.)  Furthermore, sectional sites are only announced (and presumably decided upon) after the second round is complete.  So there's a chance.

Based only on how I have seeded the tournament, for Wooster to get the sectional, not only would Hope have to lose, but B-W and CMU would as well.  And I have CMU in a pretty much lose-proof bracket.  So if my delusions come true, Wooster is not likely to have another home game.

For my full bracket, check the Daily Dose. (http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/?p=148)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2006, 02:03:53 AM
Looks like a nice bracket, DC.  <chooses not to make a crack about how the NCAA will mess it up>

I hope (no pun intended) that Wooster gets a chance to host- but I agree with your analysis that York is a better geographic center.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Blue Russian on February 27, 2006, 02:21:37 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 23, 2006, 06:01:41 PM
As a Wittenberg fan, it pains me to say this, but if I had a vote in POY, I would have to give it to Cooper.  I have seen him once this year (and many people have talked about how their one viewing can have a large impact), and was awed by what he did to Wittenberg in Springfield.  Add to that the fact that Cooper's numbers have been outstanding, and he stepped up to another level when Port got hut and I can't see not giving it to him. 

Dan Russ is second . . . right now.  He is such a dominating presence inside that is makes it hard for anybody to stop him.  It will be interesting to see if postseason play does play a role in the vote, because if it does, and if Witt can win the tourney, I think Dan has a shot.  Look at what he did Tuesday against Denison (27 pts, 5 rebs, compared to Cooper's 14 against Kenyon), and his season numbers against the 3 teams he possibly could play (OWU - 18.5 ppg, 5 rpg; Earlham - 15.5 ppg, 6.5 rpg; Wooster - 27.5 ppg, 7.5 ppg).  He'd definitely be tournament MVP if he put up numbers like that, and you know it would influence voters on POY.

However, with that said, I still have to go Cooper.  He's 4 points a game ahead of Dan, shoots 56% from the field (which is incredible for a guard, especially considering Dan is at 57% down low shooting "high percentage shots"), is a far better free throw shooter (81% vs. Dan's 63%), and has 25 more assists than Russ.  I enjoy watching Russ, and I don't think we could complain if he was named POY, but I think it is Cooper's award unless Dan takes it away here in the tourney.


POY

Now that the tournament is over, perhaps we could revisit this subject. I'm not sure if the tournament statistics are even included in this process, but I think we may have a little clearer picture of the players that made it to the tournament finals.

Of the 3 most common names that seem to keep coming up, Russ, Cooper and Miller, I would like to give my limited perspective after watching them for several games.  I'm a Witt fan and the 3 games that I saw Miller play (2 vs Witt and 1 vs Wooster) I would say he probably deserves the title as the one player with the most 'raw' talent or potential in the league. The only issue I have with Miller is his antics after some fouls. There is not a player in the conference who doesn't get some good and bad call during the course of the game, you just have to deal with it and go on. When he fouled out of the Witt game, he pulled his shirt over his head at midcourt and walked off straight to the locker room. I'm not sure that I would want to bring my son or daughter to the game and tell them to mold themselves after this player. Is there more to player of the year than just talent? I don't know but I would like to think that this POY has it all.

As for Cooper, I would think that he would have to be the leader in the 'Best Offensive Player' in the league. Boy, is he fun to watch and can he hit the shots from all over the floor. Once again, looking for multiple qualities for this title, I'm know that Cooper plays tenacious defense and is very quick with a steal, but I haven't seen where he can take over a game on both ends of the court.

I'm trying not to be biased, but I believe that Dan Russ has demonstrated that he can change the outcome of the game at both ends of the court. His offensive skills has been mentioned several times in these discussions, but please also note that his shot blocking and rebounding on the defensive end, along with how he handles himself under pressure, shows that he is the complete package. There were several mentions that some other players had higher stats, but with the controlled tempo that Coach Brown is using this year, his players are not going to rack up any impressive individual numbers. This strategy finally worked in the Tournament Championship Game. Regardless, Dan is very capable of putting up some impressive stats as well.

With that being said, in my opinion ..... Dan Russ should get back-to-back POY award in the NCAC.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: c-busballer on February 27, 2006, 07:48:35 AM
Wooster Booster,

I brought this up on the OAC page and made reference to it earlier about the officiating.  I am tired of referees being brought into the equation.  Teams and players win games.  I always love when a poster says "i thought the ref's did a good job, but...".  I do not think ref's even need to be congratulated.  There always seems to be an implication when someone mentions refs. 

I had a great time Saturday night watching the NCAC final and switching to the OAC final during breaks. I wanted to watch the NCAC final because I had not seen Wooster yet this year.  Wooster Booster, I think it is great that you are passionate and loyal fan of Wooster.  Very rarely do I hear negative comments about Wooster players or coaches.  You give great insights to what is happening to the Wooster program and game analysis.  However, you seem to always have a beef with the ref's even after wins. 

"For about the first 2/3 of the ballgame, I felt that Wittenberg got away with being overly aggressive.  But then, as if a gun went off, suddenly fouls were being called on Witt, fouls that I've not often seen called at Timken on an opponent.  Holds, pushes, hacks.  Mostly, they seemed to be called by the older ref, who just stepped forward and did the right thing.  It was nice to see, and from that point on I thought it was one of the better officiated DIII games that I've seen."

I watched the game.  There were a few calls that raised eyebrows.  I know who the three ref's were and they were on top of their game.  They actually raised their level of officiating, because I thought one was definitely in over his head.  The younger shorter one earlier this year made thought a foul shot went in on a defensive rebound and blew the play dead because the rebounding team did not take the ball out.  I also tracked the fouls in the second half off of the box score.  You state that for 2/3 of the game that Witt got away with being overly aggressive.  Wooster did not pick up their first foul of the second half until 13:48 of the second half.  Witt had 4.  Wooster was shooting the bonus at the 11:28 mark while Wittenberg did not shoot the bonus until the 1:15 mark.  My thought process as a player and team would be that we (Wooster) could get more aggressive because we were not being aggressive enough, we had fouls to give, or the ref's were letting us play.  Maybe Witt just took advantage of how the game was being officiated, but they still were being called for fouls.   Wittenberg won the game.  It was the first time that I saw Wooster, but they seemed to be passive defensively for most of the second half.  Only in the last few minutes did they seem to play with some urgency.  I also think it is difficult for these teams to play each other so many times year in and year out.

Wooster Booster, your insights are great.  Forget the ref's and enjoy the games.  It is much more enjoyable that way.  I definitely enjoyed wathing the game.  I wish more DIII games were broadcast, even if it is on the internet.  Announcers were professional and did a good job. 

Good luck to Witt and Wooster in the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2006, 08:21:54 AM
Whoops. I just answered you over on the OAC page before seeing this post.

Let me just add this to what I said over there.  I'm critical of the refs because I think they could often do a better job.  Actually, I would think it sounds better coming after a win than after a loss.

You mentioned that this was the only time this year that you've seen Wooster.  The refereeing in most of their other games was considerably worse; maybe if you'd seen those, in person where it's much easier to see than on tv, you might agree with me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2006, 09:09:51 AM
Holy cow!

Wooster goes to Transylvania to play Randolph-Macon.  Transylvania gets to host, even though they're ranked 21st to Wooster's third, and their gym holds only 1,200?  This looks like a purely geographical call, and that also the size of the facility was completely overlooked.

And should Wooster win down there, their chances of hosting a sectional look nigh on to impossible.  Probably either Wittenberg or BW out of that group, Hope or Calvin, and Mississippi College from the other group.  The first three teams probably all have hosting precedence over Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on February 27, 2006, 09:14:29 AM
And look who Wooster has to beat.

NOBODY

Wittenberg will trade places with Wooster, right now.

Who cares about the hosting issue.

------------

Have a nice trip to Hope or pleasant jaunt to BW.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2006, 09:18:16 AM
Don't sluff off Transylvania - remember they took care of their business. Also, Wooster's QOWI was always lower this year than what you would expect. Transylvania was 14th and Wooster was 26th in that measure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2006, 09:21:32 AM
The NCAA cares not a whit about rankings either, as well they shouldn't. As long as Transylvania is able to host - and they are - they probably deserved it based on their location and QOWI.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 27, 2006, 09:23:19 AM
Hey, at least Woo and Witt can avoid each other until the Elite 8. Clearly the committee doesn't mind deja vu on the Hope Calvin game exactly one week later. It does seem odd that for Witt winning on Saturday, they are "rewarded" by getting a Saturday game against either CMU or BW followed by a game that'll almost certainly be the Hope/Calvin winner. Hey, at least they avoid getting on a bus. ??? I'm sure Wooster has never been happier to have to get out of town to play their first weekend slate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on February 27, 2006, 09:24:24 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 27, 2006, 09:18:16 AM
Don't sluff off Transylvania - remember they took care of their business. Also, Wooster's QOWI was always lower this year than what you would expect. Transylvania was 14th and Wooster was 26th in that measure.

Witt already has played Transy and beat them, 62-51.

So you are saying that you would rather be in Witt's bracket than Woo's bracket?

Get real.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: c-busballer on February 27, 2006, 09:32:56 AM
Wooster Booster,

We can agree to disagree.  I tend to not worry about ref's.  That is the way I played and the way I coach players.  My personal feeling is that if the team and coach's are preoccupied with ref's it will affect their game and attitude.  Look at one of your favorite whipping boys, John Carroll.  Coach and players get many technicals, and their play is affected by their perception of the officials calls. 

Good luck to Wooster.  I hope to see them play again.  I know that I did not see the other games, I just do not think ref's affect the games as much as you think.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: dren on February 27, 2006, 09:34:17 AM
Quote from: andersdy on February 27, 2006, 09:23:19 AM
Hey, at least Woo and Witt can avoid each other until the Elite 8. Clearly the committee doesn't mind deja vu on the Hope Calvin game exactly one week later. It does seem odd that for Witt winning on Saturday, they are "rewarded" by getting a Saturday game against either CMU or BW followed by a game that'll almost certainly be the Hope/Calvin winner. Hey, at least they avoid getting on a bus. ??? I'm sure Wooster has never been happier to have to get out of town to play their first weekend slate.
Quote from: witt4ever on February 27, 2006, 09:03:37 AM
Looks like Wittenberg should have lost to Wooster in the NCAC finals, to get a more favorable bracket.

What a joke. >:(


The NCAC finals don't determine the seedning.  The committee is making it clear that win or lose Wooster was going to be seeded higher than Witt.  And Woo deserved that much by being 2-0 vs Witt heading into the NCACs. All the NCACs did was assure Witt entry into the tournament.  Had Witt lost... Woo would be hosting for sure and Witt would be on the road to Hope/BUU/CM... not playing the weaker teams to the east.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 27, 2006, 09:41:03 AM
wow what a draw for witt-but it is manageable. witt defintely has the easier game friday night vs lake erie college (no offense erie fans) but saturday night should be a good game whoever witt hopefully will have to play. i guess witt can hope that both teams wear eachother out friday night. witt might be one team taht has the ability to neutralize tori davis
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2006, 09:43:53 AM
c-busballer -

Fair enough.  And I definitely do agree with you that players and coaches need to keep the referees out of their heads, although they certainly should be making adjustments in their play if the game is being called lax or tight.

Thanks lots for wishing Wooster luck, they drew some tough opponents on the road.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 27, 2006, 09:51:02 AM
One of the things that drives me crazy abou this tourney every year, is that it is not obvious who is seeded what.  If DREN's post is correct, then Wooster would have hosted TRANS, BETH and RMC if they won the NCAC instead of traveling. Are they still the top seed in that bracket or is it TRANS since they are the host.  
    As far as the WITT bracket, ohhh weee that is tough. Granted it is in your house (which sells out exactly once per year).  But CMU and BW winner is going to be brutal and then to follow that up with a possible game vs. HOPE/CALVIN (who have have an easy bracket).  Is significantly tougher than what Wooster has to face.
   Lexington, KY is about 4.5 - 5 hours from Wooster just about 90 min (max) from Cincy (the hometown).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 27, 2006, 09:53:04 AM
The Russ/Bochers matchup with Torii Davis should be very interesting.  Davis could get those guys in foul trouble with his strength, quickness and aggressiveness. Of course, that assumes that BW wins and they had to climb out of a hole to get the OAC title on their own floor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramerica on February 27, 2006, 09:56:12 AM
Wittenberg should be traveling to BW to play those 1st and 2nd round games. BW wins the league outright and the OAC tourney and has to travel? Wittenberg finished 2 games out of first and wins the one-game NCAC tourney and gets to host. Thats crap.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on February 27, 2006, 10:02:40 AM
Quote from: Kramerica on February 27, 2006, 09:56:12 AM
Wittenberg should be traveling to BW to play those 1st and 2nd round games. BW wins the league outright and the OAC tourney and has to travel? Wittenberg finished 2 games out of first and wins the one-game NCAC tourney and gets to host. Thats crap.

What happened on Feb. 15????????
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramerica on February 27, 2006, 10:16:55 AM
What? Wittenberg beat Kenyon and Hiram in the same day???????
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2006, 10:23:55 AM
Actually, according to the NCAA's criteria, Wooster is seeded below Translyvania, properly, and should be on the road.  To wit, the regional records are very similar but Transy has a higher QOWI.

Hey, you all could be Albion...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2006, 10:35:04 AM
Quote from: fighting_scots on February 26, 2006, 08:27:17 PM

As much as I'd love to see the Scots host, outside of OWU (who played out of their minds) they have played very well on the road this year--a bit more focused IMO--


I think this is an excellent point.  Wooster does seem to thrive on the road.  Maybe they put too much pressure on themselves to perform in front of the home fans?  I don't know, but I do know that Wooster has seemed to play better all season long on the road with the exception of OWU, and there were a lot of outside factors that contributed to that loss.  Also, Wooster's fan base always seems to travel well so they will be well represented there.  Why couldn't Wooster's 1st round game be on the 2nd?  I won't even be able to listen to the game as I will be in Cleveland on the 3rd to see David Gray in concert (Not that I mind, as I have had tickets since December for this show).  Should Wooster win Friday night, I might be tempted to make the drive down to Lexington on Saturday to see the 2nd round game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2006, 10:40:45 AM
Straight from the "you don't see this everyday" file...I'm going to agree with the Witt fans here.  Wooster's got the golden horseshoe logded firmly in their, well...you get the idea.  There's not a team in the country that wants anything to do with Wittenberg's regional...Wooster included.  Wooster has a much better deal traveling to Transy with their draw than Wittenberg does having to possibly run the B-W/Hope/Calvin gauntlet.  That's just brutal.  Wooster was unbelievably fortunate to get the heck away from the GL region.  By the time they potentially find a GL team to play, at least three of the four (Witt, Hope, Calvin, B-W) will be out.  

I'll say this:  Losing the NCAC championship game was the best thing that could have happened for Wooster's chances in the NCAA tournament.  Had Wooster won, they probably stay in region and host (essentially swapping spots with Witt) where they have MUCH tougher matchups.  And we know that when Wooster has a tough matchup, the home court doesn't matter much (B-W and Witt this season both beat Wooster at home).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2006, 10:43:05 AM
Quote from: witt4ever on February 27, 2006, 10:02:40 AM
Quote from: Kramerica on February 27, 2006, 09:56:12 AM
Wittenberg should be traveling to BW to play those 1st and 2nd round games. BW wins the league outright and the OAC tourney and has to travel? Wittenberg finished 2 games out of first and wins the one-game NCAC tourney and gets to host. Thats crap.

What happened on Feb. 15????????

Umm, Wittenberg lost too on February 15th Witt4ever so what's your point? ::)

At least B-W's loss was to a ranked opponent.

I would say of all the teams in this region, B-W has to feel the most screwed.  They won a much tougher conference both regular and tournament championships.  They have a win over Wooster.  Those late losses for B-W really cost them.  They had already clinched the OAC regular season title, so they were basically meaningless games.  Not so meaningless now though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2006, 10:48:44 AM
No games are meaningless, unless its a late season Hiram / Oberlin game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 27, 2006, 10:51:54 AM
First of many posts to analyze the games coming up this week.  I always start with old faithful: COMMON FOES.

RMC and WOO has two (KENYON and Emory and Henry)

WOO vs. KEN was 3-0 winning by an average of 30 points.
RMC vs. KEN was 1-0 (70-48) in consolation game @ RMC in their DEC Tourney

WOO vs. E&H was 1-0 (150-101) for the championship of E&H Invitational Tourney
RMC vs. E&H was 1-1 both home teams won.

RMC was 1-0 vs. GL region this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on February 27, 2006, 10:52:55 AM
I don't think there are too many Wooster fans crying real hard right now. We know that the Scots have dodged a bullet by getting sent away from the messy brackets in Michigan and Springfield. They lost the chance to host, and that is what they get for losing to OWU and Wittenberg. But being sent to Transy is better than havingto host Lake Erie, CMU, and BW.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 27, 2006, 10:55:19 AM
OAC tougher than NCAC??? That is debatable (I guess that is what this board is for)...How many OAC teams in the tourney?

And for the record, yes I am encouraged by the Wooster draw.  And yes we have been screwed before with the crazy loaded regional before.  Been there and done that!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramerica on February 27, 2006, 10:58:56 AM
BW got screwed! Should be hosting, not Wittenberg. Bottom line.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2006, 11:04:13 AM
Wittenberg had a better regional record AND a much better QOWI. So it's only logical Witt hosts. Sorry, B-W, don't lose those games you should have won.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2006, 11:18:43 AM
I don't see much of a difference between Wooster's play on the road and at home; they've played very well no matter where the locale.  Don't forget, they beat Witt at home and also had a good win over a stout Stout team in Timken.  The only game where I thought they played subpar was the most recent game against Earlham.  I can't fault their effort against Witt, if a couple of shots fall here or there, they win it.

I do think that BW got the worst of all of this, that they should have been hosting ahead of both Witt or Wooster (there is no doubt in my mind that the OAC is a tougher league, top to bottom, than the NCAC). Their path, and Wittenberg's, are very tough.  But Wooster gets no slouchs down in Lexington in Randolph-Macon and Transy.

Much of my disappointment was in the fact that it's a pretty long hike to Lexington and that the venue isn't overly large.  I'm hoping that Wooster can come up with enough tickets to support those fans who want to make the trip.

Early prediction, if this matchup happens: Witt knocks off BW. Torii Davis is very good, but I think it's he who will have matchup problems with Russ/Borchers, at both ends.  He's giving away just too much size, and to two very good players.  I might give BW a slight edge at the other spots, but not enough to counteract the advantage I see for Witt underneath.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2006, 11:21:06 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 27, 2006, 11:04:13 AM

Wittenberg had a better regional record AND a much better QOWI. So it's only logical Witt hosts. Sorry, B-W, don't lose those games you should have won.


That's basically what it boils down to.  B-W lost their last 2 regular season games.  They had already sewn up the OAC regular season title, but those losses cost them a shot a hosting, plain and simple.  Even winning one of those last two might have given you an outside shot, but losing those final two really hurt.

As for the debate as to who the stronger conference is between the OAC and the NCAC, top to bottom I say the OAC.  At the top, definately the NCAC which is why the NCAC has 2 teams in compared to the OAC.  The middle of the pack is better in the OAC than the NCAC.  They beat up on each other which is why only one rep is in out of the OAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2006, 11:21:20 AM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on February 27, 2006, 10:55:19 AM
OAC tougher than NCAC??? That is debatable (I guess that is what this board is for)...How many OAC teams in the tourney?

The OAC is a tougher league than the NCAC is.  That isn't up for debate.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 27, 2006, 11:26:35 AM
Long time no talk... i know this is old news.  Earlham/Wooster  EC played hard and didn't give up Wooster was just to much.  I thought Wooster was going to win on Saturday, but Congrats to Wittenberg.  

Also It looks like if both NCAC teams can take care of business they can meet up again in the sectionals March 11th.  (not going to be an easy road)  Witt. playing at home is nice, but seeing B-W in the second round should be a good one.  Transy made the transition from scholarship players (D-2) I believe, to D3 nicely about 3-4 years ago.  (also helps that they built a new basketball facility 3 years ago too)  I like wooster chances of getting to Sectionals, and believe it or not I think B-W will give Witt. a run for their money!

But as I do for the NCAC as I do for the BIG TEN, when my team is out (Earlham,Indiana) I am a fan of the teams left in the conference come Tourney time.. Good luck to Wooster and Wittenberg.

Thanks to all NCAC PLAYERS and COACHES for another great year of Basketball... good luck to all graduating Seniors!  Nothing like the Real World   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2006, 11:28:02 AM
As a whole, the OAC is better. OWU, Wabash and Earlham vs. Wilmington, Musky, Otterbein, John Carroll, et. al. It's a meatgrinder of a league, much like the CCIW and the WIAC.

If those aforementioned three can occasionally beat Wooster and Witt more than once every three seasons, and Denison, Gheny and Kenyon can step up - then the NCAC may be in line for the same title. But that may be 3-5-7 seasons down the road.

Wooster will need to do better in scheduling non-coference regional games. Kalamazoo, Westminster, W & J, and Thiel were QOWI killers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 27, 2006, 11:33:32 AM
Possible second opponets common foes:
BETHANY and WOOSTER had many in common (WESTMINSTER, THIEL, WASH&JEFF and HIRAM)
BETHANY went 8-0 vs. those teams.
WOOSTER went 5-0 vs those teams.

BETHANY went undefeated in the PrAC and won the conference tourney.  Their last loss was 10DEC @ home vs. Lake Erie and they lost to CMU and CWRU...CWRU??? You figure it out.

TRANS and WOOSTER both played WITT..We know the SCOTS record vs WITT and WITT beat TRANS @ TRANS 62-51 in NOV. 

Interesting that TRANS played two teams (Both Maryville's) in the bracket above. They went 2-1, one loss @ Maryville(TN) and win vs same team on nuetral court.  The beat MO team in MO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 27, 2006, 11:40:33 AM
And of course the OAC is better from top to bottom than the NCAC.  I think I mentioned it on the OAC board that they beat each other up during the regular season becuase they are so good top to bottom especially when almost any of those teams are playing at home.

But the NCAA selections have ranked to the NCAA eligible teams from the NCAC as better than those of the OAC (in conference record, regional record, SOSI?? whatever).  It was a "poke in the eye" to an OAC poster than vehemently alleged that BW and OAC got screwed.  I agree with SMEDINDY, if BW had won out at the end of season they they would be hosting instead. 
   At the same time, I would not have been surprised if BW had hosted as well.  Each conference winner in the region could claim that they should have been the host.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 27, 2006, 11:48:32 AM
We can sit here and debate placement all day long, but if you're Wittenberg, wouldn't you be a little happy with playing tough teams early?

Think about it - Witt will be tested early.  If they do end up playing B-W, it will be one of their toughest opponents of the year.  What better way to prep yourself for a deep run in the tournament than beating a quality opponent?  Does it hurt, in a way, to play solid teams early?  Of course it does (look at Witt the past two seasons against JCU), because you have a much higher shot of losing those early games.  But, if you're a true national championship contender, you should be able to beat the other contenders no matter when you play them - especially at home.

All in all, I'm looking forward to listening to some great basketball this weekend (darn Spring Break starting the day of the tournament and me already having set travel plans to go home  :'( . . .)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Kramerica on February 27, 2006, 11:51:05 AM
I was not aware Wittenberg was #1 in the region. I guess that makes sense that are hosting, but BW should have been somewhere else in the bracket, hosting. I agree with the person that stated that Davis' may have trouble with Witt's bigs. That was my fear that BW's bigs are 6-4 and 6-3 and Witt's bigs are 6-9 and 6-10 may pose a problem.

Davis did turn his ankle in the last 3 min against ONU in the OAC Championship and was limping the rest of the way out. Should be ok by Thursday or Friday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: dren on February 27, 2006, 11:57:29 AM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on February 27, 2006, 11:33:32 AM
CWRU...CWRU??? You figure it out.

Case Western Reserve

UAA school in a very competive was 8-3 in non league play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2006, 11:58:41 AM
I know this isn't NCAC, but did anyone notice that York College (PA) is hosting York College (NY) in a first-round game?  Apparently even the stuffed shirts at the NCAA couldn't resist this one.  And they have both Maryvilles, (MO and TN) in a first/second round regional, although they'll both have to win to be able to pull each other's hair.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 27, 2006, 12:05:57 PM
what I meant was:  go figure out how CWRU beat a NCAA team!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2006, 12:13:20 PM
One question I still can't figure out is how are the byes determined?  Our section of the bracket got NO byes, while the Midwest/West got 2 byes along with the Northeast.  Why do they get 2 teams in each of those brackets who get byes, while no one in our section of the bracket gets ONE?

Also, I was going to mention this earlier, and some have already touched on it, but it's not as though Wooster is getting a cakewalk in their section of the bracket.  It isn't as tough as Witt's road, but Wooster is facing a ranked opponent in their opening round game on a neutral floor in #25 R-MC.  And if Wooster gets by the Yellow Jackets, they will, in all likelihood face another top 25 team on their own home floor in #21 Transy.  I'm not saying I would want to trade with Witt, but, Wooster's draw is by no means a cakewalk in comparison either.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: c-busballer on February 27, 2006, 12:19:58 PM
Early predictions for Great Lakes Bracket.

Mississippi College over Maryville, MO.
Trinity, Texas over Maryville, TN
Trinity over Mississippi.

Transylvania over Bethany
Wooster over Randolph-Macon
Wooster over Transylvania

Hope over Wisconsin Lutheran
Calvin over La Cross
Hope over Calvin

Witt over Lake Erie
BW over Carnegie Mellon
Witt over BW

Sectional
Wooster over Trinity
Witt over Hope
Wooster over Witt

Happy Final Four to Wooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2006, 12:44:35 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2006, 12:13:20 PM
Also, I was going to mention this earlier, and some have already touched on it, but it's not as though Wooster is getting a cakewalk in their section of the bracket.  It isn't as tough as Witt's road, but Wooster is facing a ranked opponent in their opening round game on a neutral floor in #25 R-MC.  And if Wooster gets by the Yellow Jackets, they will, in all likelihood face another top 25 team on their own home floor in #21 Transy.  I'm not saying I would want to trade with Witt, but, Wooster's draw is by no means a cakewalk in comparison either.

Acutally, by comparison to Witt, Wooster's draw IS a cakewalk.  That's the point. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 27, 2006, 12:48:07 PM
I had a great morning filling out my brackets.  Here is how I see it:

Woo will beat R-Macon, Transy, and Miss
Hope will beat Wis. Lutheran, Calvin, and Witt

Wooster will prevail over Hope on their way to the Final Four where they will beat Amherst for a chance to play Lawrence in the final.  Lawrence will have beaten Va. Wesleyan in the other Final Four game.

Wooster will win a close one over Lawrence ultimately ending Lawrence's Cinderella season.

Only if I had it my way??? ...   :) :) :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 27, 2006, 12:50:37 PM
i for some reason doubt this but i'll ask anyways????

what is the scouting report on lake erie college? obviously they are a decent team but are they going to suffer the same fate as some other decent "lesser" teams such as penn-state behrend and tiffany last year
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scotty on February 27, 2006, 12:59:40 PM
i know im getting old...when i was in college, we used to bus the girls over from Lake Erie College or as we called it "Lake College for Eerie Girls"...oh those mixers ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2006, 01:23:07 PM
Lake Erie College has a converted Massey to Sagarin SOS rating of 56.61.  That's compared to Wittenberg's 61.95.  So, over 5 points a game in Witt's favor.  Take another couple of points, at least, for being on your home floor.  That's a 7 point differential before we even begin looking to see who's the better team.

Lake Erie scores at 75.7 and gives up 66.3.  They rebounded exactly even against their opponents at 36.6 a game.  They shoot the ball at 46%.

I'm hoping to preplay this game later today as one of the first that I do.  I'll post the result.  I predict a very, very easy Wittenberg victory.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2006, 01:34:22 PM
QuoteI was not aware Wittenberg was #1 in the region. I guess that makes sense that are hosting, but BW should have been somewhere else in the bracket, hosting.

Nope, Hope has better numbers, too. Sorry, BW's in a tough spot, but them's the berries.

The byes in other regions are due to the NCAA wanting to save money, basically, as far as I can see.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2006, 01:36:24 PM
Well, good morning everyone!  Busy morning in here so far.
Here's my first-look comments:
1) The team in our (well, your) area that really got screwed by the pairings is Carnegie Mellon.
2) If you take off your Great Lakes blinders, you'll see that Wooster's draw is every bit as tough as Wittenberg's; in fact, it may be tougher, for two reasons:
  a) Witt is at home, and Wooster is on the road (whoever it was that said that Wooster is a higher seed than Witt, and that the NCAA had predetermined that last week sometime, is just flat wrong)
  b) Wooster could very well lose their first-round game, to a very tough Randolph Macon squad, whereas Witt's JV could probably beat Lake Erie.
3) We all think very highly of the teams in Witt's very tough part of the draw (BW or CMU, then Hope or Calvin, and this sectional could well be at the HPER Center) but from the NCAA's calculus Wooster's opponents (RMC, then Transylvania, then Mississippi College or Trinity, all on the road for certain) are as tough if not tougher.

Both Witt and Wooster will have to play excellent ball to advance to the sectional final against each other, but both are capable of doing it.  They're also both capable of losing this weekend. 

As far as the BYEs are concerned, one went to Puget Sound for geographic reasons, and the other four went to the teams that appear to be the top 4 national seeds: Amherst, Lawrence, St. John Fisher, and Va. Wesleyan.  It was clear (to me) from the criteria that the first three were the top 3 seeds; and Va Wesleyan is a plausible 4th seed, under the criteria.  They have a pretty easy bracket, and if they reach Salem, they're going to be very tough to beat there.

Re: the Maryvilles, both are almost exactly 500 miles from Clinton, MS (the site of Miss. College).  The NCAA has required Maryville TN to bus that distance before ("required" means they won't pay the airfare), so I expect the same rule applies to Maryville MO.  Trinity TX has no tournament-bound neighbors within 500 miles, so they're flying whereever they go anyway.

Re: Baldwin-Wallace: I agree that their late-season struggles hurt their hosting chancs, but sending the OAC champ down to Springfield early in the draw is old-hat for the NCAA.  Lately it has worked out pretty well for them. 

Re: Transyvlania vs. Wooster:  If you look objectively at the criteria, as smedindy has, there is zero doubt that Transylvania is the higher seed.  Of course, the fact that they are hosting tips that off, but they clearly are superior to Wooster according to the numbers.  Wittenberg did beat them, a long time ago, but I took it then and still take it now as a testament to Witt rather than a knock on Transy.  They will be a tough matchup for the winner of Woo/RMC.

Re: our quarter of the draw:  It's a bear all right.  I see ten teams in there that are good enough to go to Salem.  I wish I knew where the sectional was contemplated; that is, how the teams are seeded.  The sectional is likely to be at either Witt or Hope (I still think Witt is the higher seed); Miss. College could be the highest seed in the bracket, but I doubt the NCAA would fly 3 teams there rather than just one (be it Miss. Coll. or Trninty) to the north.  If the sectional teams turn out to be Miss. Coll., Calvin, B-W or CMU, and Wooster (which is quite possible), the committee is going to have to make a very tough site selection decision.

If I could make one and only one change to the bracket, it would have been to put more separation between Hope and Calvin.  A second round matchup of these two is a disservice to their rivalry, to the MIAA, and to D3 fans everywhere.

Oh, and finally, I like my bracket better.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2006, 01:46:16 PM
Boy, you west coast lawyers sure sleep in late...  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 27, 2006, 02:06:02 PM
Stats and roster for R-MC.

http://www.rmc.edu/athletics/basketball/mens/BBstats/2006/teamcume.htm

http://www.rmc.edu/athletics/basketball/mens/2005-06_roster.asp


The starters are (Top three are their main scorers although Sutherland is a threat from outside the arc):

Wansley 6-6 F
Hawley  6-8 F
Krovic 6-3 G
Sutherland 6-0 G
Short 5-10 G
Key reserves
Carlson 6-4 G
Gill 6-1 G
Dixon 6-5 F
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2006, 02:07:19 PM
Justin Wansley will be the best player the Scots have seen since Tori Davis came to town.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 27, 2006, 02:12:04 PM
DC- Any more info on Wansley?  How will Port, Vandervaart, or Will match up?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 27, 2006, 02:14:47 PM
Info on Lake Erie...

http://www.lec.edu/athletics/mb/Games0506/teamcume.htm

http://www.lec.edu/athletics/mb/ros05.htm

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2006, 02:30:27 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 27, 2006, 01:36:24 PM
b) Wooster could very well lose their first-round game, to a very tough Randolph Macon squad, whereas Witt's JV could probably beat Lake Erie.

DC, I think we've seen that Wooster can lose to any team in this tournament.  When Wooster shoots the ball well, it's hard for anybody to keep up with them and Wooster wins games by scores of 103-84 or some such thing.  When they don't shoot well (particularly the three ball), they're in big, big trouble because Wooster can't grind a game out in the 60s or 70s.  Saturday's NCAC championship was such a game where Wooster didn't shoot well, the score was kept reasonable, and Wooster didn't have the defense to get it done.  Ditto the OWU game (Scots had just 28% on 3 point FGs).  Without the three ball, Wooster has a hard time winning.  When the Scots are hitting their 3's, nobody can beat them.  When they aren't, everybody can beat them.  The Scots will go as far in the tournament as the 3 point shot takes them and that would be the case no matter what draw Wooster got. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2006, 02:37:13 PM
Quote from: blindwatchmaker on February 27, 2006, 02:12:04 PM
DC- Any more info on Wansley?  How will Port, Vandervaart, or Will match up?

I've never seen him in person, but by reputation he's big and athletic and can pretty much do it all: shoot, create, dish, rebound.  Like someone with James Cooper's offensive skills, Brandon Crawford's size, and Brandon Miller's athletic ability.

He's a first team preseason All-American (http://www.d3hoops.com/tow/menpreallam06.htm), whereas Tori Davis, at the same position, was 4th team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2006, 02:40:36 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 27, 2006, 02:30:27 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 27, 2006, 01:36:24 PM
b) Wooster could very well lose their first-round game, to a very tough Randolph Macon squad, whereas Witt's JV could probably beat Lake Erie.

DC, I think we've seen that Wooster can lose to any team in this tournament.  When Wooster shoots the ball well, it's hard for anybody to keep up with them and Wooster wins games by scores of 103-84 or some such thing.  When they don't shoot well (particularly the three ball), they're in big, big trouble because Wooster can't grind a game out in the 60s or 70s.  Saturday's NCAC championship was such a game where Wooster didn't shoot well, the score was kept reasonable, and Wooster didn't have the defense to get it done.  Ditto the OWU game (Scots had just 28% on 3 point FGs).  Without the three ball, Wooster has a hard time winning.  When the Scots are hitting their 3's, nobody can beat them.  When they aren't, everybody can beat them.  The Scots will go as far in the tournament as the 3 point shot takes them and that would be the case no matter what draw Wooster got. 

What I meant was that Randolph-Macon was a very good team, capable of beating anyone in the draw.  I think you knew that that's what I meant. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2006, 02:50:16 PM
But almost every team in the tournament fits that description.  There aren't a lot of bad teams in the tournament. 

It's true that Witt shouldn't lose their first game, but the reality is that Wooster shouldn't lose theirs either.  Wooster being more likely to lose in the first round has as much or more to do with whether or not Wooster can make three pointers as it does with who they are playing. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2006, 03:10:27 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 27, 2006, 02:37:13 PM
Quote from: blindwatchmaker on February 27, 2006, 02:12:04 PM
DC- Any more info on Wansley? How will Port, Vandervaart, or Will match up?

I've never seen him in person, but by reputation he's big and athletic and can pretty much do it all: shoot, create, dish, rebound. Like someone with James Cooper's offensive skills, Brandon Crawford's size, and Brandon Miller's athletic ability.

He's a first team preseason All-American (http://www.d3hoops.com/tow/menpreallam06.htm), whereas Tori Davis, at the same position, was 4th team.

There's a picture of Wansley on the RMC roster page.  He looks big, strong, athletic, and as if he can do it all.

However, his stats indicate that he's a different type of player, one with more of an all-around game than Tori Davis. I don't doubt that he can muscle and score inside, but he also shoots the three, regularly and well (25-61).  I see him as more of a Tom Port type, maybe leaning a little more towards an inside game than Port, and maybe a little better at putting it on the floor.  I'd guess that it would be Port guarding him when Tom is in the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2006, 03:45:26 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 27, 2006, 02:37:13 PM
Quote from: blindwatchmaker on February 27, 2006, 02:12:04 PM
DC- Any more info on Wansley?  How will Port, Vandervaart, or Will match up?

I've never seen him in person, but by reputation he's big and athletic and can pretty much do it all: shoot, create, dish, rebound.  Like someone with James Cooper's offensive skills, Brandon Crawford's size, and Brandon Miller's athletic ability.

He's a first team preseason All-American (http://www.d3hoops.com/tow/menpreallam06.htm), whereas Tori Davis, at the same position, was 4th team.

He can also step outside and take the three.

Davis and Wansley will be on a very similar All-American team, I think, come season's end.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2006, 08:10:14 PM
I'm embarrassed to post this, due to the result.  Obviously, it makes me seriously wonder about the program I'm using.  But here it is, the simmed result of Lake Erie at Wittenberg:

Lake Erie 71, Wittenberg 68

After overtaking Wittenberg early, Lake Erie led throughout the contest, twice extending their lead to 11.  A furious last minute comeback gave the Tigers brief hope, but the clock ran out with Witt unable to throw up a final long three-pointer to tie.

Fouls and turnovers haunted Witt all night long.  Lake Erie made 20-26 shots from the line while the Tigers were only 8-14.  Witt also, uncharastically for them but harried by Lake Erie's defense, coughed the ball up 19 times.

Witt outrebounded Lake Erie 40-29.  Neither team could throw it in the ocean from three-point land, Lake Erie going 1-10, Witt 2-10.

Wittenberg was led by Dan Russ with 22.  Dane Borchers added 13 with 16 rebounds.

See the boxscore here:

http://arkski.com/~jwood/2006NCAAbasketball/Lake%20Erie-Wittenberg.jpg
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 27, 2006, 08:13:08 PM
Your stat based sim doesn't take into consideration HOW those stats were obtained.........ie  AMCC conference games.  Perhaps?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2006, 08:29:41 PM
Quote from: sac on February 27, 2006, 08:13:08 PM
Your stat based sim doesn't take into consideration HOW those stats were obtained.........ie AMCC conference games. Perhaps?

It does.  SOS is a factor, and Witt had a serious edge.  Home court advantage is also factored in.  I see the result as just a fluke, something that's probably more of a possibility when just dealing with numbers than when the actual players get on the court.  I honestly would like to see the real Witt go deep into the tournament.

Now to test out Wooster and Randolph-Macon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 27, 2006, 09:17:35 PM
yes that simulation better be a joke and no witt will not be looking ahead past any tournament team ever after they've experienced two tough losses to jcu that past 2 years. saturday night should be a barnburner if witt advances past friday. i am interested on seeing the first game on the dock for the evening.

I will remain with this point that i think Witt matches up well with Baldwin  Wallace because we not only have one guy to match up with Tori Davis, but two and we've seen big guys go off on wooster before (russ, borchers), so the key matchup will be how big of an advantage their guards have on ours, but if witt plays the defense they did saturday against wooster, we should be ok.

i know everyone thinks otherwise but maybe wooster's poor shooting night and loss had every much to do with the exceptional defense of witt-come on give the top defensive % team the credit it deserves
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2006, 09:30:02 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 27, 2006, 09:17:35 PM
i know everyone thinks otherwise but maybe wooster's poor shooting night and loss had every much to do with the exceptional defense of witt-come on give the top defensive % team the credit it deserves

Not everyone; I'm sure Witt's defense had a lot to do with Wooster's poor shooting.  I give great credit to Witt's defense; so did Coach Moore in the post-game interview.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 27, 2006, 09:45:04 PM
i wasnt referring to you DC-you always seem to see eye to eye

after some research witt and lake erie have two common opponents

Lake erie lost to capital by 13 where witt beat capital easily

lake erie beat kenyon by 23 and need i say more here
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2006, 10:13:11 PM
Of course, as someone who has done simulations in the past, and have seen actual games, you know ANYTHING can happen, and if you run it 100 times, Witt may win 97 of those, just not that one.

And comparing scores in never healthy, as Wooster whapped Wabash at Wabash by what seemed like 53,129 and what did Wabash to to Witt at Wabash???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 27, 2006, 11:03:14 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 27, 2006, 10:13:11 PM
Wooster whapped Wabash at Wabash by what seemed like 53,129

I stopped listening when they were up by 53,129...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2006, 11:06:02 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 27, 2006, 11:03:14 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 27, 2006, 10:13:11 PM
Wooster whapped Wabash at Wabash by what seemed like 53,129

I stopped listening when they were up by 53,129...  ;)

Then I guess you didn't miss anything; evidently they played even the rest of the way.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2006, 01:20:30 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 27, 2006, 08:10:14 PM
I'm embarrassed to post this, due to the result.  Obviously, it makes me seriously wonder about the program I'm using.  But here it is, the simmed result of Lake Erie at Wittenberg:

Lake Erie 71, Wittenberg 68

What I want to know is ... who won when you simmed Lake Erie against the Wittenberg JV?

(Sorry, DC. I couldn't resist.  ;))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2006, 01:37:01 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2006, 01:20:30 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 27, 2006, 08:10:14 PM
I'm embarrassed to post this, due to the result.  Obviously, it makes me seriously wonder about the program I'm using.  But here it is, the simmed result of Lake Erie at Wittenberg:

Lake Erie 71, Wittenberg 68

What I want to know is ... who won when you simmed Lake Erie against the Wittenberg JV?

(Sorry, DC. I couldn't resist.  ;))

DC, as usual, was right on.  The Wittenberg JV had no trouble vanquishing Lake Erie.  Now when I matched the Lake Erie JV against...

I'm up against it now.  I'd had visions of simming the whole tournament, but late in the second half Wooster is in big trouble against Randolph-Macon.  If they, too, go down in the first round, my enthusiasm for this project may come to a screeching (Is there any other kind?) halt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 28, 2006, 08:52:01 AM
I woke up this AM to the replay of the late night Sportscenter with 'Top Plays' and I was pleased to see the final second and the hear the radio call of the DEPAUW (Sister's alma mater) victory over CENTRE!! It even made Mike & Mike in the Morning as what is great about sports feature and why they look forward to March Madness.  The intimated that BIG TEN, ACC, BIG EAST tourneys are not a compeling as the small schools trying to be true cinderella.  I could not agree more.

Now if there was a way we could parlay this into more national coverage for Division III sports!!  Any news on if Division III Final Four will be televised?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on February 28, 2006, 09:28:57 AM
Another note on the DePauw game.  Austin Brown, who made the shot, his Dad, Dudley, played guard at Denison in the early 70's and is one of the top ten all time scorers.  To bad Austin didn't follow his Dad.

My take on the Witt/Wooster game.  In the first two meetings Wooster let the towers have their points and Wooster just out gunned them.  Same thing in this last game, the only problem Wooster had no bullets in those guns.

Good luck to each and hopefully they can meet again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on February 28, 2006, 10:02:54 AM
I too would give a lot of credit for Wooster's struggles to Witt's defense. Their guards did a good job of pressuring Cooper and even though he had 20, it was a quiet 20. They did a great job of taking away COW's 3 point shooting. I will only say this once and it did not have a bearing on the outcome of the game but the officiating for an NCAC championship game I thought was poor. Now had the officiating been good Witt would have still won the game don't get me wrong as it was bad both ways. Good luck to both NCAC teams in the tourney, I too like Witt over BW as the great Dane and the DR I think will more than neutralize Tori Davis. On a sidenote it is great to see D3 getting some pub both on Sportscenters top 10 but also on Mike and Mike in the morning, hopefully the HERD will wake up and give some props to the pure student/athletes who are out there not because of money or dreams of the NBA but purely for the love of the sport.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2006, 10:25:24 AM
The Great Dane. I love it!  And that's why they call Russ "The Doctor", because of his initials, D.R. Duh.

Playing catch-up here, WB
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2006, 10:48:58 AM
I agree with Witt having a matchup advantage over B-W.  If Witt can neutralize Tori Davis with Russ and Borchers, I think B-W will be in big trouble.  For one thing, B-W's perimeter game isn't close to what Wooster's is.  If Davis is a non-factor, Witt should win.  Also, who does B-W have to stop Witt's twin towers? In B-W's game with Wooster, they only outscored Wooster 54-46 in the paint.  And that was with Davis going for 44!  I would be very surprised to see Davis go off for half of that against Witt.   The way I see it, the only chance B-W has is to get one or both of Witt's bigs into foul trouble.  Davis certainly has the ability and quickness to draw fouls.  If he can get one or both in some foul trouble, B-W might have a chance.  But at the same time, what if Witt were able to get Davis in some foul trouble? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 28, 2006, 11:52:37 AM
lets not look ahead to saturday as of yet because both witt and bw have tough games friday night-i am remaining confident that witt will come out ready to play. lake erie is a guard oriented team-i guess u could say similar to wooster but not quite on that level

bw fans-dont look past carnegie mellon-pittsburgh has a great recruiting base and any team that can beat the princeton offense is obviously defensively astute.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 28, 2006, 11:56:32 AM
another thing if it comes down to it-hope is not a place i would like to see witt or wooster play in tournament time because the looks of the gym and support are awfully intimidating and that venue could cause major problems for road teams with an intense tournament crowd.

lets hope witt wins this weekend so witt and wooster dont have to make the trip up north because i believe witt has the best chance to host the sectionals because a potential witt, wooster, hope, mississippi foursome would make witt the central location and you know those extra $$$ count-

but then again our government doesnt seem to mind about pointless budget deficits..............................
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 28, 2006, 01:16:18 PM
It looks like Hiram, Hired a new coach.   
http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/news/article.xsp?id=820

Looks like he played and graduated from Hiram in 1994, with plenty of coaching experience aftewards.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 28, 2006, 01:23:27 PM
I finally did the final power ranking amalgamation of the year:

Here is the NCAC:

2. Wittenberg
5. Wooster
58. Ohio Wesleyan
102. Wabash
138. Earlham
230. Allegheny
256. Denison
321. Kenyon
361. Hiram
370. Oberlin

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 28, 2006, 01:25:21 PM
For those who want to know:

Wittenberg's portion of the bracket:

Witt (2)
Baldwin- Wallace (4)
Carnegie Mellon (18)
Lake Erie (73)

Wooster's portion:

Wooster (5)
Transylvania (9)
Randolph - Macon (28)
Bethany (41)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: 78rmc on February 28, 2006, 03:06:45 PM
All of this talk about Wansley?  I don't think he will hurt Wooster.  Actually, I would suggest that you not even cover him.  He's used to double and triple teams, so leaving him alone may be your best defense. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2006, 05:45:52 PM
There's something eerily similar to Wooster's 1st round matchup in comparison to last year.  Going by the latest top 25, R-MC is ranked #26.  That is the same ranking that B-W came in with last year in their 1st round meeting with the Scots.  Also, R-M and B-W both share the same mascot (Yellow Jackets).  Only difference is, Wooster will be taking on R-M on a neutral court as opposed to taking on B-W in Timken.  Just some fun observations. ;)

Anyone planning on making the trek down to the Bluegrass State this weekend?  WoosterFAN, being from Cincy, you actually have a shorter trek to Lex than you would if the games were in Wooster.  I'm still debating on whether I want to make the almost 5 hour drive if Wooster happens to get by R-M on Friday.  In case anyone was wondering about the ticket situation, they are alotting 200 tickets to Wooster.  They will be on sale at the PEC tomorrow from 2-4 and Thursday from 9-11 and 2-4.  Tickets are $6 for adults and $3 for students.  One ticket will get you into both games on Friday night.

Also, it looks like Transy's spring break doesn't start until March 10th, so their students should be there in full force.  I wonder if Wooster will try and send a bus load of students down to any of the games in Lex?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2006, 05:52:45 PM
One thing I've noticed no one has touched on, but could come into play somewhat is the long layoff between games for R-MC.  They played the ODAC finals 8 days ago.  That will be an almost 2 week layoff.  On one side, you could argue that it gives a team extra time to heal and rest.  But, with extended layoffs, also comes rust and losing that feel for real game speed.  And this could especially hurt R-MC to have to come out running with a team like Wooster following the layoff.  Just trying to keep some conversation going.  It's still a long way till Friday...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 28, 2006, 06:49:48 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 28, 2006, 05:45:52 PM
Anyone planning on making the trek down to the Bluegrass State this weekend? 

I'll be there!  I live in Columbus, but my company happens to have an office in Lexington so I made arrangements to work down there on Friday so that I could just bop on over to the game after work!  I know my parents and some of their friends are also coming down.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 28, 2006, 06:52:41 PM
man this is like last week with the wait until the weekend. i cant wait for the games to begin this weekend.

i was looking at devos, hopes home court, man that gym with its capacity could rival many d1 schools
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 28, 2006, 09:51:45 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 28, 2006, 06:49:48 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 28, 2006, 05:45:52 PM
Anyone planning on making the trek down to the Bluegrass State this weekend? 

I am hoping to motor up to Springfield to see Wittenberg in action.  I was there when they played Carnegie Mellon in the regional at Wittenberg in 1977.

As luck would have it, I live almost exactly half-way beteeen Wittenberg and Transylvania.  Witt played and beat Transy earlier in the year. 

Perhaps there is another matchup yet to happen between Wooster and Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 28, 2006, 09:54:48 PM
I just found this on the OAC thread and thought people over here might be interested as well.

Re: OAC
« Reply #296 on: Today at 04:27:15 PM »   

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Listen up B-W and OAC fans!  Tune in to "Sportsline" tonight at 10 PM on Carnegie Mellon's WRCT Radio for discussion of Friday night's CMU vs. Baldwin-Wallace matchup and a preview of this weekend's regional at Wittenberg.

Listen online at www.wrct.org.  Call 412-621-9728 to join in on the discussion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on March 01, 2006, 12:23:43 AM
Well I am very interested in seeing this torri davis guy play. He sounds like a great player but I have never seen a big man get the better of Russ and Borchers. I cant really put a line on this lake erie game because I have never seen them play. But if we drop a 3rd ncaa first round game there will be some rumblings around the springfield area. Lets get this W and see this torri guy play, sounds like a man who has a passion for the post game like i do.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on March 01, 2006, 10:32:27 AM
All Conference has been posted.
Cooper POY.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 01, 2006, 10:33:33 AM
Quote from: WoosterBNel on March 01, 2006, 12:23:43 AM

Well I am very interested in seeing this torri davis guy play. He sounds like a great player but I have never seen a big man get the better of Russ and Borchers.


I wouldn't exactly classify Davis as a "big man" per se.  He's only listed at 6'3".  That's what makes what he does so amazing.  He shouldn't be able to do what he does against guys that he's giving away anywhere from 3-6 inches on any given night.  But he does.  He's just so quick with his post moves and he's got such a nice fade away touch.  And he's got some quick hops to boot.  I've never seen a player follow up their own misses more than he does.  He's just got some great overall basketball instincts which is why he plays a lot taller than his size!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 01, 2006, 10:43:22 AM
http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mballncac06.pdf

You know, if Formato was on a better team, he'd be a first teamer.

I think DeWitt's a great choice for coach of the year. Good guy and always has top notch teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 01, 2006, 11:01:06 AM
Wow.  Congrats to James Cooper for being named NCAC POY!  I didn't think he would get it this early in his carreer at Wooster.  I figured Russ was going to win it again.

Congrats to Brandon Johnson as well on being named the NCAC Newcomer of the Year.

Also congrats to all 4 of Wooster's players to make All-NCAC:

1st Team:

James Cooper - 1st time on the all-conference team.
Tom Port - 2nd consecutive selection to the 1st team.  He was a 2nd team selection in his 1st year at Wooster.

2nd Team:

Kyle Witucky - This is Kyles 3rd all-conference mention.  He was 1st team last year and HM in 2004
Tim Vandervaart - Tim was HM last year.

Congrats to all of the fine student athletes to make All-Conference selection.  I was going to include a link, but smeds beat me to it.

The league still seems to be quite young judging from the low # of Sr.'s on the All-Conference team.  Only one senior out of five on the 1st team, only two seniors out of six on the 2nd team, and only three seniors out of seven to make HM.

Smeds, I couldn't agree more with your opinion on DeWitt being named COY.  I don't know him, but he just seems like a real class coach.  He deserves the award after a successful (although he probably would've liked it to be a little more successful) season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 01, 2006, 12:00:11 PM
I don't see the second team or HM mentioned in that release, will that be upcoming?  As a matter of fact, when going to the league website, I couldn't even find the release or any mention of the all-league teams. Weird.

I can't believe that Dane Borchers is not on that first team.  With no offense to either Chojnacki or Tom Port, I'd have definitely placed Borchers ahead of one of them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 01, 2006, 12:22:04 PM
WB, once you click on the link, you have to scroll down.  The entire listing of 1st & 2nd team and HM are on the 2nd page of that release.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 01, 2006, 12:27:37 PM
They sure are!  Thanks, Scotsfan, never should have missed that bunny. :-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldtigerfan on March 01, 2006, 01:34:29 PM
Congratulations to James Cooper.  As I have written earlier, I think Cooper is a great offensive player, but I do not think that at this point in his career he is the all around player that Dan Russ is.  However, Cooper certainly was hard for us or anyone else to stop offensively.

Congratulations to Steve DeWitt.  He is a good guy and a good coach whose team played well especially down the stretch.  I am a Wittenberg fan and believe Bill Brown is a much better coach than he usually gets credit for.  However, if anyone else deserved consideration for Coach of the Year, it is Steve Moore.  He took a look at his talect and realized that he had to change his whole approach .  He did it very successfully.  That is good coaching.  It is hard for Steve Moore and Bill Brown to get the recognition they deserve because we all expect their teams to win, but good for Steve DeWitt.

Dane Borchers deserves to be on the first team all conference.  How can the most valuable player in the conference tournament not be?  I cannot imagine that he would not be among the top five players any coach in the conference would want on his team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: John Rusnak on March 01, 2006, 01:45:51 PM
I haven't seen either team play this year, but I can't believe that Cooper is that improved from last year that he warrants POY over Russ.  Somebody made the comment about defense and my presumption is that the mindset of the voters is to pick more based on offense than anything...but with that said, I suppose congrats to Cooper...this could definitely spark Russ to elevate his game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on March 01, 2006, 01:54:04 PM
Just here to voice my disappointment of the All Conference honors released today. The big three from Witt were all a level below where they should have been.  POY was close and could've gone either way but I thought Russ was a better all around player. Borchers more than deserved to be on the 1st team, nobody will argue that. Brady is the biggest let down to me (who was 2nd team his Soph year and missed most of last year b/c injury), he has consistently been a clutch player alongside the towers.  I thought Brady deserves that spot over Witucky.

Individual honors mean nothing and I know these guys don't care. The main focus is solely winning one game at a time and making a run in the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bigkrapper on March 01, 2006, 02:05:49 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 28, 2006, 01:16:18 PM
It looks like Hiram, Hired a new coach.   
http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/news/article.xsp?id=820

Looks like he played and graduated from Hiram in 1994, with plenty of coaching experience aftewards.

In one of my only serious posts on this website I want to congratulate Steve Fleming on his return to his alma mater.  I had the pleasure of working with him for a few years at Ashland and he is a class guy with a great knowledge of basketball.  I hope Hiram truly gets behind him (build him a new airport hanger or something) and he is able to build some success there.  Good luck Coach Fleming!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on March 01, 2006, 02:37:36 PM
Well, glad to see LaRon Henry moved up to 2nd team with his performance last Friday. Also nice that Jewett gets some love.

I guess I'm just not sure about Cooper as POY though. Again, I love Cooper and his game. I thought he should have been Newcomer of the Year last season. And he hit some amazing shots the other night against Earlham, including that baseline spinning layup that proved to be a nail in the coffin.

Still, I think Russ and Miller were the better all-around players. I would have voted Cooper third behind those guys...and that's really no disrespect to James.

Oh well, so it goes.

Good luck W's..........
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 01, 2006, 03:46:45 PM
I guess I don't see how or why it's so surprising that Cooper was named POY.  He was the best player on the league's best team.  Without any other player in the league that really jumps out as a POY guy (sorry, Russ...you're a really good player, but 15/6 just aren't POY numbers).  the award is going to go to the best player on the best team. 

Perhaps the tiebreak between Russ and Cooper was the head to head matchups:  Cooper 2, Russ 0 (these awards are supposed to be based on the regular season only). 

As far as his defense goes...meh.  He plays within a structure that isn't terribly concerned with defense.  Wooster wants simply to outscore the other guy.  They aren't interested in grinding out a game in the 60s.  And it's hard to knock the success...20-something and 3 speaks for itself.  So, in cotext, Cooper played his part.  He's more than deserving of the award. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 01, 2006, 04:01:20 PM
I agree - I think Cooper was the best choice this year in a year where each candidate had their flaws.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on March 01, 2006, 04:05:35 PM
Wally, I can see your point but I wouldn't say that Wooster doesn't care about defense. While it is true that they have picked up the pace of the game I can tell you that one stat that is very important to the coaching staff at COW is DER. Basically it keeps track of the points per possessions. I would say that Coach Moore has adapted to the talent that this year's team had as far as quickening the pace and firing more from the outside but I would be willing to bet if they were able to get a few 6'7" guys or a good solid post player he would go right back to his bread and butter of pounding the ball inside and playing good tough man to man D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on March 01, 2006, 04:21:43 PM
I'm a little surprised by Cooper being POY as a Soph. with sub-par numbers besides scoring and only 1 steal a game.  I would much rather of had Russ win POY if it was not Miller.  

Maybe they changed POY this year and was just worried about OPY.  As Bob Knight said the great thing about basketball, you can't just be an offensive or defensive guy; you need to be able to do a little bit of everything in the game of basketball to be a Great player.  That is what a POY does, and as we all know Cooper does not possess an all around game.  

I sometimes wonder why kids these days just want to score.  They think scoring is everything and then when Individual awards are given they look at scoring.  (gzz I guess how can I blame the kids)  It just blows my mind that all around players get overlooked.  Sorry to Matt Formato and any other kid on HM that should have been 2nd team over Wooster's Kyle Witucky.  As my mom always say, "life isn't fair"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on March 01, 2006, 04:36:38 PM
We all know Russ can score the ball, but he blocks and changes so many shots on the other end. I don't know know how you dont give Russ the POY for the second year I thought it was a lock. I mean Cooper doesn't even rebound THAT well for his position. I guess those 2 more points per game sealed it for him. Hodgy should be a first teamer over Chojnacki for sure. Another big time snub. And whats the deal with K Brady being an honorable mention. Arguably the 3rd or 4th best scorer in the league, but gets punished because he plays a team game and doesn't get as many shots as these other 1st and 2nd teamers. The NCAC was definitely off of their rocker when putting some of these picks together.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2006, 05:16:55 PM
Congratulations to OWU's Andy Warnock, named today to ESPN the Magazine's Academic All-America Team today.  CoSIDA has selected Andy to the second team of the college division.  This is a great achievement for this outstanding scholar-athlete, who has done his school and conference proud.  Well done, Andy!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 01, 2006, 05:36:45 PM
Quote from: WoosterBNel on March 01, 2006, 04:36:38 PM
Another big time snub. And whats the deal with K Brady being an honorable mention. Arguably the 3rd or 4th best scorer in the league, but gets punished because he plays a team game and doesn't get as many shots as these other 1st and 2nd teamers.

Please.  Wabash has two or three guys that probably warrant some recognition but have no shot whatsoever at making these teams because of the system that Coach Petty has used with this group.  Let's not play the "he got hosed because of the system" game...there are lots and lots of players in this league that sacrificed any shot at all-conference awards for the betterment of their team. 

I'll tell you what...I'll give you EVERY all-NCAC slot to have and split between Wooster and Wittenberg.  You can have every single slot...we'll have the all-Witt/Wooster team.  You give me the team's slot in the NCAA tournament.  What's that?  No dice?  That's what I thought.  Enough with the sour grapes. 

Quote from: Vanilla24COW on March 01, 2006, 04:05:35 PM
Wally, I can see your point but I wouldn't say that Wooster doesn't care about defense.

Perhaps we're splitting hairs here, but these are the facts as I see them:   
- Wooster is the most talented team pound-for-pound in this conference (perhaps in the country)
- Wooster dictates the pace of every single game that they play in the NCAC (not even the mighty Witt could slow things down in two regular season games vs. Wooster)
- Wooster can pretty much do whatever they want with the majority of the teams in this league. 

With those things as fact, if Wooster wanted to win the NCAC by playing defense, they could.  They're quicker, more athletic, and have better fundamentals than any other team in the NCAC (unless we're way overstating how great Saint Moore is).  Wooster has chosen to shoot the daylights out of the ball and assume that the other team just can't shoot as well as they do.  It's worked 25 out of 28 times this year (just two teams have better FG%s for the season than Wooster: North Central and Baldwin-Wallace...hmmmm, interesting).  But the fact remains that nearly half of Division III teams hold their opponents to a lower FG% than Wooster does and a full 288 of 377 D-III allow fewer points per game than Wooster does.  Those stats don't lie...Wooster isn't playing defense and they're not terribly concerned about playing defense.  If Steve Moore were that concerned with defense, those numbers would be a lot better...he's got more than enough talent there to have a better defensive ballclub. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 01, 2006, 06:01:25 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 01, 2006, 05:36:45 PMBut the fact remains that nearly half of Division III teams hold their opponents to a lower FG% than Wooster does and a full 288 of 377 D-III allow fewer points per game than Wooster does.  Those stats don't lie...Wooster isn't playing defense and they're not terribly concerned about playing defense.  If Steve Moore were that concerned with defense, those numbers would be a lot better...he's got more than enough talent there to have a better defensive ballclub. 

Certainly Wooster isn't playing the defense that they would like to be playing. But it's a quantum leap from there to say that Steve Moore, or the players, are not concerned about it.  Of course they are, and of course they work hard on it in every practice.  I've heard Coach Moore, at least half a dozen times this season, talk about points/possession, both offensively and defensively.  He's often not happy with that defensive number, and would love to get it down.  The same with defensive field goal percentage, which of course intertwines with pts/poss.  But the fact is that Wooster's interior defense just isn't that strong, which in turn can lead to occasional breakdowns on the perimeter.  That doesn't mean, though, at all, that they aren't making the effort or aren't concerned about it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 01, 2006, 06:44:55 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 01, 2006, 05:36:45 PM

- Wooster dictates the pace of every single game that they play in the NCAC (not even the mighty Witt could slow things down in two regular season games vs. Wooster)


Wally, this is the very reason behind part of your next statement:

Quote from: wally_wabash on March 01, 2006, 05:36:45 PM

But the fact remains that nearly half of Division III teams hold their opponents to a lower FG% than Wooster does and a full 288 of 377 D-III allow fewer points per game than Wooster does.  Those stats don't lie...Wooster isn't playing defense and they're not terribly concerned about playing defense.  If Steve Moore were that concerned with defense, those numbers would be a lot better...he's got more than enough talent there to have a better defensive ballclub. 

The reason Wooster is allowing so many PPG is because teams that play Wooster are getting more POSSESSIONS per game than they normally would, not because Wooster isn't concerned about playing defense.  The more possessions, the more chances to score.  The more chances to score, the higher your point total will more than likely end up.  Wooster is not running your typical half court offense either and they are dictating the pace of the game to their favor as you stated earlier.  Wooster still had the largest MOV in the country even though they were allowing such a high ppg average.  I'm not saying that Wooster couldn't stand to play better on the defensive end.  I'm just saying that to say they aren't concerned about playing defense is a bit of a stretch. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 01, 2006, 07:54:27 PM
Wooster's high octane offense is the reason the defensive numbers are a bit off.

You can be a good defender without a plethora of steals as well - look at the work off the ball. And if they ever want to serious go into sabermetrics in hoops, you can see about measures like + / - and measuring opponent players efficiency, thingsd like that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 01, 2006, 09:17:41 PM
The nature of basketball, fortunately or unfortunately, makes it difficult to isolate an individual's value from his team's success or failure.

Put a Daniel Russ on the court with the Wittenberg "B" team against Wooster, and his +/- won't look so good.  On the other hand, if you put Russ, Borchers, Port, and Cooper on a team with even an old guy like me, we'd likely fair well against lots of DIII teams, even with me just standing in the corner or basket-hanging. :-)

Maybe, though, there are complex mathematical formulas that could adjust a player's +/- based upon who he was on the floor with.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 01, 2006, 09:40:47 PM
I'm curious if Wooster folks think Coach Moore went for the high octane offense after watching his team get bogged down by a superior defense at Albion last year.

As I recall that was a pretty high scoring Wooster team as well.  Just a theory.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on March 01, 2006, 09:46:36 PM
Congrats to all on the ALL-NCAC teams.  Proud of the Scots putting five (including newcomer of the year) on the all-conference team. 

I have to admit I am surprised a little about Cooper named POY as a SOPH.  Maybe now we know that the voting takes place before the tourney final since RUSS was not POY and BORCHERS was not first team. 

Also I thought that NCAC did a 5 player 1st team + POY for a total of six at the top.  According to the news release there were 6 players named first team last year.  Borchers should have been 1st team but I am not sure who you take off.  Maybe Port missing a few games??  Tough call in a more "competitive NCAC".

Last thing, gotta note that three WITT ALL-NCAC players will graduate and WOOSTER brings back 4 of 5 mentioned.  I know it is early but an off-season discussion will have to be: does witt reload or rebuild??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 01, 2006, 09:51:10 PM
I believe that Borchers has another year of eligibility and has chosen to return next year, ala Port.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 01, 2006, 10:15:00 PM
Quote from: sac on March 01, 2006, 09:40:47 PM
I'm curious if Wooster folks think Coach Moore went for the high octane offense after watching his team get bogged down by a superior defense at Albion last year.

As I recall that was a pretty high scoring Wooster team as well.  Just a theory.

Sac - the real reason that Coach Moore changed the Wooster offense this year was entirely due to the players that he had available.  It had nothing to do with the Albion game last year.   :)

Wooster graduated two starting big men from last year's squad (6'7" Matt Schlingman and 6'5" Blake Mealer who was a strong guy that held his own in the lane).  Coach Moore had no front court players to replace these two talented big men.

On the other hand, Coach Moore had 5 returning wings/guards who were good ball handlers, strong outside shooters and who had plenty of game experience (Port, Witucky, Cooper, Van Horn, Fulk) as well as a couple of promising freshmen who were 6'3" or shorter (Brandon Johnson, Marty Bidwell).  So Coach Moore wisely changed Wooster's offense to fit his personnel and the Scots switched this year to an up tempo team that will take the open shot quickly if it is available.

One other note, all 5 of those returning wings/guards can shoot the three pointer and when you add in freshman Johnson that is 6 players who are a three point threat for Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 01, 2006, 10:17:59 PM
Thanks for the answer  wooscotsfan........makes more sense than completely changing your offense based on a single game.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 01, 2006, 10:23:22 PM
With everybody so excited about the tournament and the All-NCAC teams, I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the new poll.

Witt moved up to 3, and Wooster moved down to 5.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on March 01, 2006, 10:27:11 PM
Quote from: sac on March 01, 2006, 09:40:47 PM
I'm curious if Wooster folks think Coach Moore went for the high octane offense after watching his team get bogged down by a superior defense at Albion last year.

As I recall that was a pretty high scoring Wooster team as well. Just a theory.

Sac--good point.  Contrary to wooscotsfan's belief (with all due respect!) Halftime at Albion was when and where the theory was developed--at least it was the first time I've seen Wooster impliment this scheme.   I watched the first half in horror-- the post play of Wooster was ineffective--no doubling down on Schlingman, no open looks on the perimeter.  16 points I recall--Then, in the 2nd half, Wooster went with their lineup that they play now, and instead of pounding in the post, they had a dribble--penetrate-kick out for the open 3 offense working like a charm.   I have to say one of the absolute best coaching jobs I've ever seen.

So yes, it had to do with the Albion game, and the rest, as they say . . .
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 01, 2006, 10:28:48 PM
I can buy that Wooster gives up more points because their opponents get more possessions.  But to rank 289 in the country?  That's a bit much for a team with as much talent as Wooster.  Possessions don't play a part in FG%, a stat which Wooster also ranks pretty low.  That number has more to do with the quality of shots teams are getting against Wooster, which means Wooster isn't doing a good job playing defense.  Wooster is defensively deficient and I maintain that defense is a secondary concern for the Scots.  They should be better than this in spite of their style of offense.  

Looking ahead to next season, Wooster is bringing back everybody.  Should this group add a decent defense to support the potent offense, I don't think anybody can beat them.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on March 01, 2006, 10:29:24 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on March 01, 2006, 10:23:22 PM
With everybody so excited about the tournament and the All-NCAC teams, I'm surprised nobody has mentioned the new poll.

Witt moved up to 3, and Wooster moved down to 5.

Who cares about the poll right now--5 or 6 games left for 2 teams--it's TOURNEY TIME!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 01, 2006, 10:40:41 PM
The characterising feature of trolling is the perception of intent to disrupt a community in some way. Inflammatory, sarcastic, or disruptive content is posted, meant to draw other users into engaging the troll in a fruitless confrontation. The greater the reaction from the community the more likely the user is to troll again, as the person develops beliefs that certain actions achieve his/her goal to cause chaos. This gives rise to the often repeated protocol in Internet culture: "Do not feed the trolls".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 01, 2006, 11:28:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 01, 2006, 10:40:41 PM
The characterising feature of trolling is the perception of intent to disrupt a community in some way. Inflammatory, sarcastic, or disruptive content is posted, meant to draw other users into engaging the troll in a fruitless confrontation. The greater the reaction from the community the more likely the user is to troll again, as the person develops beliefs that certain actions achieve his/her goal to cause chaos. This gives rise to the often repeated protocol in Internet culture: "Do not feed the trolls".

???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 01, 2006, 11:36:58 PM
the philosophy message board can be found at harvard.edu----
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2006, 12:15:17 AM
Quote from: fighting_scots on March 01, 2006, 10:27:11 PM
Quote from: sac on March 01, 2006, 09:40:47 PM
I'm curious if Wooster folks think Coach Moore went for the high octane offense after watching his team get bogged down by a superior defense at Albion last year.

As I recall that was a pretty high scoring Wooster team as well. Just a theory.

Sac--good point.  Contrary to wooscotsfan's belief (with all due respect!) Halftime at Albion was when and where the theory was developed--at least it was the first time I've seen Wooster impliment this scheme.

Fighting Scots -- we are both right in the sense that Coach Moore did adjust for one half of the Albion game as you noted.  That adjustment was made during that game because Wooster wasn't having any success inside against Brandon Crawford and the rest of Albion's front line.

My point is that Coach Moore changed Wooster's complete offensive style this season.  This fact is best evidenced by a few stats:

Last year's team (with Schlingman and Mealer starting most games):
237 three pointers made out of 565 (42% shooting)
Wooster averaged 7.9 three pointers made/game
Wooster averaged 81.7 points per game

This year's team (with 4 three point shooters in the starting lineup):
300 three pointers made out of 681 (44% shooting) - school records
Wooster is averaging 10.7 three pointers made/game
Wooster is averaging 99.0 points per game

Said another way -- if Schlingman and Mealer were on this year's team, Wooster would still be winning but they wouldn't be averaging 99.0 points per game and averaging nearly 11 three pointers per game.  Let's thank Coach Moore for correctly adjusting Wooster's style of play to capitalize best on his team's strengths (shooters, ball handlers).

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 02, 2006, 01:10:03 AM
Last season Wooster was ranked #9 in FG percentage defense.  That's ninth.  As in top ten.  This year, Wooster is ranked 191st.  That's a 182-position drop in just one season.  That's an awfully big tumble for a team committed to playing solid defense. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2006, 02:24:15 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 01, 2006, 10:28:48 PM
Looking ahead to next season, Wooster is bringing back everybody.  Should this group add a decent defense to support the potent offense, I don't think anybody can beat them. 

Not everybody, of course.  Kyle Witucky is graduating.  Furthermore, you never know who is and is not coming back.  One of the reasons Coach Moore went to the perimeter-oriented offense was because Justin Bradley, who is an academic junior, decided not to play this year.  Thus, from the four post players from last season's team, two graduated and a third did not return, leaving Tim Vandervaart alone beneath the basket.  Who is and isn't coming back next year will remain an open question until sometime in the fall semester.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on March 02, 2006, 07:39:54 AM
It will probably be called blasphemous for a first time poster to say this however; I hope Coach Moore had a big piece of Witucky's and Port's rear ends this week.  You have to expect more from your "senior leadership" that six (collective) assists and fourteen points in your conference championship game.  If the two of them don't produce it will be a short NCAA stay.  It's time for the two of them to step up.  GO SCOTS!!! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on March 02, 2006, 08:44:12 AM
With all due respect to Coach Moore, who is a great coach and a class act, the adjustment in the style of play he made from last season to this year was a no brainer. It wasn't rocket science to figure out with no post players and an overflow of shooters to change to the uptempo game. I think WAY too much credit is being given for a VERY obvious decision.

In fact (as some have mentioned) for the way their defense has fallen off some discredit should be noted as well.

Still a very dangerous team that can make a deep run in the tourney and is looking to reload next year.

Side note, Dane Borchers is returning to Witt next season for a 5th year. I think someone noted Witt graduates all three NCAC players...not so fast!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on March 02, 2006, 09:54:46 AM
OK, all this talk about Wooster defense is a little misguided.  The change in the offense did not change Wooster defensive principles that much.  I know Coach Moore and I know what he coaches.  "NO EASY SHOTS.PERIOD".  Wooster contests EVERY shot.
    You can interpert the stats anyway you want.  Here is a new one.  COW leads the country in the scoring margin.  Therefore SCOTS play the great defense holding opponents more than 20 points below what they score. Who care if you hold a team to 55 ppg but you only score 50?  Wis.Platteville was 12-14 with a defensive scoring average in the top 25.
    Another defensive stat is rebounding, Wooster is in the top 50 and although they do not post it, I would love to see national stats on 3pt FG%.  I bet Wooster is right again is in the top 50.
   Defensive pressure on the perimeter and contesting every shot is defense.  If your team plays a up-tempo game, then the opponent will get more opportunities and without a couple of shot bockers in the lane, FG% can go up.  But trading quality 3's for contested 2's has worked pretty good thus far.
    Ask the players and coaches in the NCAC, and I doubt any of them we say that Wooster has let up on defense.  Can we matchup with all the post players and stop/slow 'em...NOPE. We did not have the horses this year.  But outscoring your foes by more then 20, outrebounding them, 270 steals  (about 10 spg), forcing 450+ turnovers (about 16 TOs per game) is DEFENSE!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 02, 2006, 11:08:42 AM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on March 02, 2006, 09:54:46 AM
OK, all this talk about Wooster defense is a little misguided.  The change in the offense did not change Wooster defensive principles that much.  I know Coach Moore and I know what he coaches.  "NO EASY SHOTS.PERIOD".  Wooster contests EVERY shot.

Teams that contest every shot don't let their opponents shoot over 44% from the field every game.

Quote from: WoosterFAN on March 02, 2006, 09:54:46 AM
Another defensive stat is rebounding, Wooster is in the top 50 and although they do not post it, I would love to see national stats on 3pt FG%. I bet Wooster is right again is in the top 50.

They do post this stat and Wooster is #1. 

Quote from: WoosterFAN on March 02, 2006, 09:54:46 AM
Defensive pressure on the perimeter and contesting every shot is defense. If your team plays a up-tempo game, then the opponent will get more opportunities and without a couple of shot bockers in the lane, FG% can go up. But trading quality 3's for contested 2's has worked pretty good thus far.

We can debate till the cows come home about whether or not Wooster contests "every" shot (you'll never convince me that a team that gives up no easy shots gives up 44% shooting), but you've nailed my point right here.  Wooster has adopted the strategy of trading 3s for 2s because they have better shooters than everybody else...it's the path of least resistance.  The Scots are content to let you beat them senseless down low because they'll make enough three pointers to beat you (obviously Wooster will never admit to this, but in practice, that's what is happening).  Of course, when they don't make three pointers (vs. OWU and last weekend vs. Witt), they still get clobbered down low and they lose. 

Wooster won't get knocked out of this tournament because of their offense.  Even on a bad night, Wooster scores enough points to win a game.  They'll lose because on a bad offensive night, their defense won't be able to pick them up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2006, 11:41:45 AM
Quote from: jimmychitwood15 on March 02, 2006, 08:44:12 AM

With all due respect to Coach Moore, who is a great coach and a class act, the adjustment in the style of play he made from last season to this year was a no brainer. It wasn't rocket science to figure out with no post players and an overflow of shooters to change to the uptempo game. I think WAY too much credit is being given for a VERY obvious decision.

Yes, it was a no brainer, but making the change, and actually being hugely successful at it are two different things.  Wooster has run their offense through the post since Moore has been at Wooster.  To make this change wasn't as easy as just snapping your fingers.  To do what Coach Moore did this season could almost be like Woody Hayes changing his offesive philosophy from 3 yards and a cloud of dust, to an empty backfield and 5 wide receiver sets.  OK, maybe not that drastic, but you get my point.  The decision to change may have been a no brainer, but to actually implement it and be successful at it was a very well done coaching job by Moore and his staff.

Quote from: jimmychitwood15 on March 02, 2006, 08:44:12 AM

Side note, Dane Borchers is returning to Witt next season for a 5th year. I think someone noted Witt graduates all three NCAC players...not so fast!


Yes, you have Borchers returning, but the losses of Russ and Brady are still much more significant than what Wooster is losing.  In Russ and Brady, Witt is losing over 1/3 of their offensive scoring production for a team that didn't score that much to begin with.  Not to mention the loss that will be felt on the defensive end of the floor.  Witt can be thankful Borchers is coming back, but there are still some huge holes to fill for the Tigers going into next year...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 02, 2006, 02:21:48 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 02, 2006, 11:41:45 AM
Yes, it was a no brainer, but making the change, and actually being hugely successful at it are two different things.  Wooster has run their offense through the post since Moore has been at Wooster.  To make this change wasn't as easy as just snapping your fingers.  To do what Coach Moore did this season could almost be like Woody Hayes changing his offesive philosophy from 3 yards and a cloud of dust, to an empty backfield and 5 wide receiver sets.  OK, maybe not that drastic, but you get my point.  The decision to change may have been a no brainer, but to actually implement it and be successful at it was a very well done coaching job by Moore and his staff.

And the worship of Saint Moore continues....

He has a roster full of guys who can shoot from all over the floor.  He said "Go shoot the ball.  A lot."  This wasn't exactly wizardry. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on March 02, 2006, 02:48:25 PM
Wally - I think we agree more than we disagree.  My point about easy "points in the paint" is not that Wooster lets teams score easy two's.  My point is that Wooster cannot stop easy points in the point when you have 6'6" post with 6'5" post coming off the bench and another 6'5" wing playing defense in the post, you cannot expect to hold the likes of Torii Davis, Russ, Borchers, etc... to low FG% inside.  Wooster simply does not have the horses to man handle teams inside.  Just because you do not have Schlingman to block shots and hold down the middle does not mean that you do not play defense.  They play big time 'D'.
   But to say that they do not play defense or trade two's for three's inaccurate.  Watch Wooster, watch the pressure on the ballhandler, watch the pressure of the passing lane, watch Vandervaart and Port hustling to get in defensive position to front or side front the post.  To say that Wooster does not contest every shot or want to is inaccurate.  Trust me on this one. 
    There is nothing and I mean nothing that Coach Moore hates more than a uncontested shot from inside of 10 feet.  WoosterBNel - Can you back me up on this one?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 02, 2006, 03:47:45 PM
WoosterFAN-i believe coach moore may hate a subpar NCAC official's call more than an uncontested shot, by showing of his emotions towards the officials

also, in an attempt to form a student section tomorrow night since witt will be on spring break, the first 100 students will be getting in free. i have to work friday so hopefully a win means i can attend saturday. hopefully we will have two competitive games to watch, with the second game hopefully being less competitive if you know what i mean.

Predictions:  Carnegie Mellon 69 Baldwin-Wallace 77

Wittenberg 63 Lake Erie 54
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on March 02, 2006, 04:10:57 PM
The defensice 3pt FG% statistic is what I was looking for.  I do not think the NCAC publishes that stat.  Wooster is 2nd in the NCAC though. And 3rd in blocked shots...but no defense?? I don't think so. 

Someone please point out to me the last time or the next time, Wooster just lets someone have drive for a layup or an uncontested shot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 02, 2006, 04:21:45 PM
I'm new on these boards, so people may already be aware
of this, but there is a list of Div III schools with audio links at

http://www.ncaasports.com/broadcast/schedule/champ-audio

The list is not complete however.  For instance, Wittenberg's link is not listed.

I have found a good listing of audio feeds at

http://secure.stretchinternet.com/broadcasts.php

The Wittenberg feed can be found at
http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/broadcast.html

Also, there is a link to Baldwin-Wallace's feed at the NCAA site above.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 02, 2006, 04:24:42 PM
NCAC teams aren't involved but you'll find links to the Hope and Calvin broadcasts here.......

MIAA.org

.......the Calvin broadcast may even stick around and do the Hope game, I haven't heard for sure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: augie_superfan on March 02, 2006, 07:10:30 PM
I've got 1 extra ticket for Friday's Transy regional...if anyone is interested, e-mail or PM me.....$6

Jim
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on March 02, 2006, 07:57:37 PM
I got a chance to see lake erie's team walking into the HPER today so I think I'm ready to put a line on the game.   Witt -17.
BW -9 against carnegie mellon.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 02, 2006, 08:02:21 PM
Should be great games this weekend.

Good luck to the W's!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on March 02, 2006, 09:02:25 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on March 02, 2006, 02:48:25 PM
There is nothing and I mean nothing that Coach Moore hates more than a uncontested shot from inside of 10 feet. WoosterBNel - Can you back me up on this one?

O yea, nothing he hates more.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 02, 2006, 09:27:49 PM
Quote from: WoosterBNel on March 02, 2006, 09:02:25 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on March 02, 2006, 02:48:25 PM
There is nothing and I mean nothing that Coach Moore hates more than a uncontested shot from inside of 10 feet. WoosterBNel - Can you back me up on this one?

O yea, nothing he hates more.

Well, and when Woo can't pull down defensive rebounds...drives him crazy...had him slamming his hand into a bench chair during Woo-Witt III.

As another side note to this whole discussion, in Woo-Witt I this year, I was sitting directly behind the Wooster bench.  When it was 20-6 Wittenberg after about five minutes, Coach Moore called a timeout.

What bothered him at the time out was not that his guys had only 6 points...it was that Witt already had 20, and many of them on easy put-backs or poorly contested shots.  He got in their face about their defensive intensity, and Wooster started their come back.  He wasn't worried about the fact that they weren't scoring...he knew that would shape up.  He wanted to make sure they gave the defensive effort.

I think Moore focuses even more on defense this year than in year's past, because he knew this team would score, but he knew that every night was going to be a defensive challenge because pretty much every other team was going to play bigger, taller guys in the paint.

Wooster does give up uncontested shots, sometimes (who doesn't??).  But often, it's because a guard was trying to help out down low and credit the other team for finding the open man.  Woo's guards are very good on the dribble defenders, however, and they will pressure ballhandlers all over the court.

You're right, Wally.  Wooster is willing to trade 2s for 3s.  But why not, when you shoot 3 pointers at the same rate as your opponent's overall shooting %?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2006, 10:28:47 PM
Less than 24 hours until the Wooster - Randolph Macon tip so here are a few comparative team stats to ponder:  :)

Offensive Field Goal %
Woo:  52.9%
RMC:  50.0%

Defensive Field Goal %
Woo:  44.1%
RMC:  38.6%

Rebounding Margin vs. Opponents
Woo:  +7.3 per game
RMC:  +3.8 per game

Offensive 3 Point Shooting %
Woo:  44.1%
RMC:  41.5%

Defensive 3 Point %
Woo:  33.0%
RMC:  30.7%

Assists to Turnover Ratio
Woo:  1.68
RMC:  0.88 (that's right, more turnovers than assists each game)

RMC's top 2 scorers are their big men, Justin Wansley 6'6" at 15.7 ppg and Phil Hawley 6'8" at 11.5 ppg.

Woo's top 2 scorers are guard James Cooper at 19.4 ppg and wing Tom Port at 15.4 ppg

Wooster seems like the much better offensive team and Randolph Macon seems like the much better defensive team so which style will prevail in tomorrow's game?

Randolph Macon has the better front line while Wooster has the better guards and ballhandlers so which will play a bigger factor in this game?

Good luck to both Wooster and Wittenberg in tomorrow's games!

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: c-busballer on March 03, 2006, 07:13:41 AM
Tonights Games

Wooster vs Randolph Macon:

I have seen Macon a few times over the years.  I have seen them this year.  Those teams Reminds were similar Wooster teams before this year.  Great Inside / Outside action between post players and guards with great ball movement.  Solid Defensively.  Very well coached and play extremely hard.  My belief with Wooster is that few teams are going to beat them if Wooster gives them a top performance.  They are going to struggle and lose when they have an off night shooting the ball.  The great aspect once you get into the tournament is that you may play a couple of teams that you have not played this year, for a couple of years, or ever and teams are not familiar with your teams style, pace of the game, or the players.  I think the first 3 teams they face may be shell shocked by their offensive fire power. 

Witt vs Lake Erie:

If Lake Erie can get by all the firsts in their program's history (wins, conference championship, tournament championship, NCAA birth), get by the fact that they are playing at Witt and all of their history, and the fact that they have never seen the quality of big men in Russ and Borchers, they can make a game of it.  Lake Erie will try to make it an ugly game, similar to JCU.  They will adjust their variation pressure defense.  They can force turnovers and teams to take bad shots.  I still take Witt.

BW vs Carnegie Mellon:

CMU has some great wins this year.  Do not know anything about them.  I am an Ohio guy so I will stick with the Yellow-Jackets.

Sectional Final Predictions:

Amherst vs WPI (Amherst)
WOO vs Witt (WOO)
Whitewater vs Augustana (Whitewater)
Lincoln vs William Patterson (Lincoln)

WOO over Amherst
Whitewater over Lincoln
WOO over Whitewater
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: c-busballer on March 03, 2006, 07:21:24 AM
Sorry about my last post.  My post about RMC looks like a 2nd grader.  What I was trying to say is that I have seen RMC in the past, not this year.  Their teams in the past reminded me of a traditional Wooster team before this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 03, 2006, 08:53:18 AM
Just so you know:

My final four in the pick 'em is Wooster, Lawrence, Lincoln and Amherst

I have Wooster winning it all

So know you know who to throw things at if they lose this weekend!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 03, 2006, 10:38:40 AM
c-bus,

I have nearly the exact same sectional final and final 4 predictions. ;)  The only difference is I have VW over Lincoln.  Here are my sectional finals predictions as well as my Final 4:

Elite 8:
Whitewater vs. Augie
VW vs. York
Amherst vs. WPI
COW vs. Witt

Final 4:
Whitewater vs. VW
Wooster vs. Amherst

Finals:
Wooster over Whitewater
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 03, 2006, 11:09:19 AM
apparently everyone on the lake erie boards seems to think that they dont need to double down to stop our posts cuz they have great one on one defense and we'll be lucky to even get it down low??????

sounds like a first time tourney team doesnt know what they're getting themselves into lol.

good luck wooster and witt tonight-hopefully wont need it
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on March 03, 2006, 11:48:51 AM
Fortunately for Lake Erie, it's probably not their coaches on the message boards. I can't imagine the coaching staff for any team is ever as positive about their teams chances as the most delusional of the fan base are. I suppose when having to defend two bigs like that, you may focus on denying the post as opposed to letting the passes in and then fronting the basket, but eventually you're going to have to be ready when they are able to get the ball down to the post.

Good luck Wooster and um, yeah... Wooster  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Sturdevant on March 03, 2006, 12:20:44 PM
Not to muddy the waters, but you NCAC fans are delusional if you think there is going to be a Wooster/Wittenberg matchup in the tourney.  There are just too many good teams in the regional to have it come down to that without a LOT of good fortune.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on March 03, 2006, 12:21:28 PM
Lake Erie is going to be in for a long night if they do not respect the towers!!!

The towers are going to get theres regardless of what they try and do.  If Witt has an outside game tonight it won't even be close.  Witt has too many weapons.

I think Russ has really picked up his game and does not want this ride to end.

Good luck to both Wooster and Witt!!!   Make the NCAC proud!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 03, 2006, 12:22:24 PM
not to muddy ur waters mr. jv on this board but we have not put that in stone, in fact the only mutterings i have heard are "hopeful" matchup. Whats wrong with NCAC fans cheering on their teams in their OWN message boards.

apparently from first appearances lake erie doesnt look too intimidating of a team, as all the NCAA teams arrived here on campus yesterday
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 03, 2006, 12:23:33 PM
thanks denisonFAN for being supportive even though your team isnt involved.its nice to have the support of the conference, as we are representing the conference as a whole. witt and wooster both will be trying to overcome some devastating losses last year in the tourney. Witt in 2OT and Wooster at the last second
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 03, 2006, 12:26:35 PM
Good luck to both Wooster and Witt. Do the NCAC proud.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on March 03, 2006, 12:28:03 PM
We WILL see a Wooster Witt rematch. If we don't every poster on this page will get a free pizza compliments of Bryan Nelson.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on March 03, 2006, 12:28:24 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 03, 2006, 12:23:33 PMwitt and wooster both will be trying to overcome some devastating losses last year in the tourney. Witt in 2OT and Wooster at the last second

Don't you mean with no seconds left?  >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 03, 2006, 12:34:15 PM
true good point-but according to the refs i guess not-i havent seen as lucky and clutch of a sh ot as i saw last year in the first overtime to send it into second overtime-a rainbow shot by moran in the corner
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on March 03, 2006, 12:47:30 PM
I am just curious as to where those pizza's that Nelly is buying are going to be from? Of course that is if one of the W's get knocked off which let's hope they don't.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 03, 2006, 02:19:26 PM
I also have a Witt / Wooster matchup pegged, but it's going to be a bloodbath to get there. Meanwhile, Amherst has a bunch of schlubs to play through. Oh, well...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: realist on March 03, 2006, 02:32:35 PM
The last time I saw a team without a big man beat a team with two big men was to force the two big men to beat you, and just make sure you shut down the 1,2 & 3.   At least that strategy worked one time in the "state up north".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2006, 02:38:02 PM
Smed -

I have the same final four as you, except for Stout joining the party instead of Whitewater.  They impressed me when they came to Wooster, which granted was months ago.  Some excellent wings combined with real size in the middle in a pair of seven foot twin cowboys.

Now, a matchup that I'd love to have seen would have been Wittenberg and Stout. Stout rarely played the two big guys at the same time, but paired with Witt they just might.  It would be interesting to see how Russ and Borcher would do facing two guys considerably bigger, although not better, than them.  I think it would be a tough game for Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on March 03, 2006, 03:03:39 PM
I'm curious, how does Whitewater play D3 when they are that huge.  Heck, their senior class has as many students as Denison has total.  That to me doesn't seem real fair. 
I don't know who decides who plays what division.

Having a gene pool of 10,000 vs 2400, seems the chances are you may get a few better players from a school of 10.000.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on March 03, 2006, 03:31:04 PM
DF- good point.

Also Good Luck to the W's this weekend.  Hope both teams will be around to talk about NexT WeeK!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 03, 2006, 04:38:55 PM
Is Wooster broadcasting the game vs Macon tonight? or is thier another broadcast location on the Net?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 03, 2006, 04:40:59 PM
 I've created an updates page for Great Lakes teams.  Lets try and keep the conference pages clean.

Thanks in advance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2006, 04:44:19 PM
I just called the Wooster radio station and they're broadcasting the game on the FM station.  However, the girl who I spoke with has no idea if it will be webcast, and no one else was there who would know. I'd be surprised if it's not, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2006, 05:45:22 PM
Quote from: woolax on March 03, 2006, 04:38:55 PM
Is Wooster broadcasting the game vs Macon tonight? or is thier another broadcast location on the Net?

Wooster is on the air and on the net.  Click HERE (http://www.wooster.edu/interactive/) for the WQKT broadcast.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 03, 2006, 06:39:22 PM
Wooster is not playing well at all.  They were shooting seriously horrible in the first half.  If this kind of play continues, the second half might signal the beginning of the end for them.  Randy Macon up by 6 with 39 points.  Cooper burried one of his trademark last second shots to give us a respectable score.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 03, 2006, 06:56:31 PM
Sounds like Wooster is turning it back on NOW!! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 03, 2006, 07:11:11 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on March 03, 2006, 03:03:39 PM
I'm curious, how does Whitewater play D3 when they are that huge.  Heck, their senior class has as many students as Denison has total.  That to me doesn't seem real fair. 
I don't know who decides who plays what division.

Having a gene pool of 10,000 vs 2400, seems the chances are you may get a few better players from a school of 10.000.

Student population size is completely irrelevant, DenisonFan. UWW recruits its players, just as do NCAC teams. It doesn't select them from the student body at large.

If student population size was relevant, Duke would annually be among the worst teams in the country, and they'd lose every ACC game by 25 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 03, 2006, 07:12:40 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 03, 2006, 07:11:11 PM
Quote from: DenisonFan on March 03, 2006, 03:03:39 PM
I'm curious, how does Whitewater play D3 when they are that huge.  Heck, their senior class has as many students as Denison has total.  That to me doesn't seem real fair. 
I don't know who decides who plays what division.

Having a gene pool of 10,000 vs 2400, seems the chances are you may get a few better players from a school of 10.000.

I just accidentally found out through a bad link that Notre Dame plays Division III women's volleyball.

It's all a matter of scholorships and money, not student body size.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2006, 07:36:54 PM
Final:  Wooster 84  Randolph Macon 70

Wooster gets a first round NCAA tourney win! :)  Wooster was led by Tim Vandervaart with 23 points, James Cooper with 20 points and Tom Port with 14 points.  Phil Hawley had 20 points to lead Randolph Macon

Wooster played a much better second half after terrible shooting (37%) in the first half of this game.  Scots also hit all the key foul shots down the stretch.

Great games by Vandervaart and Cooper to led the Scots tonight.  Vandervaart got RMC's big men, Phil Hawley, in foul trouble and he fouled out with ~6 minutes left in this game.

Wooster is now 26-3. ;D  Next up is the winner of Transy-Bethany, tomorrow night!

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2006, 07:44:58 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2006, 07:36:54 PM
Final:  Wooster 84  Randolph Macon 70

Wooster gets a first round NCAA tourney win! :)  Wooster was led by Tim Vandervaart with 23 points, James Cooper with 20 points and Tom Port with 14 points.  Phil Hawley had 20 points to lead Randolph Macon

Wooster played a much better second half after terrible shooting (37%) in the first half of this game.  Scots also hit all the key foul shots down the stretch.

Great games by Vandervaart and Cooper to led the Scots tonight.  Vandervaart got RMC's big men, Phil Hawley, in foul trouble and he fouled out with ~6 minutes left in this game.

Wooster is now 26-3. ;D  Next up is the winner of Transy-Bethany, tomorrow night!

GO SCOTS!!


Listening to the post-game show on WQKT (Wooster radio) and Mike Breckenridge notes that Wooster was 21-21(!!) from the foul line in the second half.  (It should be noted it was after a 3-8 effort in the first half.)

21-21

That's how you win tournament games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2006, 07:48:25 PM
Going in, I had been pretty worried about this game.  A tough opponent in an opening game, on the road, after a tough loss to Wittenberg in the tournament.  But they pulled it out.

Wooster went 4-25 from behind the arc, yet still won. Scary, but that's  actually a really good sign if you're capable of doing that.  First half, 3-8 from the free throw line, second half, 21-21. Amazing.

I have a lot more confidence in them winning tomorrow.  It would be nearly impossible to shoot that poorly from long range again, so any improvement would be a big positive.  And you can be sure there will be.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2006, 07:50:38 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on March 03, 2006, 07:12:40 PM
I just accidentally found out through a bad link that Notre Dame plays Division III women's volleyball.

It's all a matter of scholorships and money, not student body size.



There's lots of Notre Dames out there, including one in Ohio of which you may be thinking.  The more famous Notre Dame University, of South Bend, IN, plays Div. I volleyball.  http://und.collegesports.com/sports/w-volley/nd-w-volley-body.html

Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 03, 2006, 07:11:11 PM
If student population size was relevant, Duke would annually be among the worst teams in the country, and they'd lose every ACC game by 25 points.

Duke's undergraduate enrollment (http://www.dukenews.duke.edu/resources/quickfacts.html) is 6244 (Fall 2005).  Wake Forest's undergraduate enrollment (http://www.wfu.edu/visitors/quickfacts.html) is 3857 (2004-05).  Duke would still kick Wake's butt.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 03, 2006, 07:58:18 PM
Quote
There's lots of Notre Dames out there, including one in Ohio of which you may be thinking. 
Quote

You are right, of course.  That broken link and all, I got excited and posted before thinking ...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 03, 2006, 08:01:09 PM
William Patterson beat Scranton 70 - 45.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 03, 2006, 08:37:15 PM
Wooster's game has me seriously worried about how far they are gonna go in the big dance.  Today's victory will go fown as sheer luck (at least in my books).  They shot 4/25 from beyond the arc (which I will not bother converting to a percentage out of respect) and winning the game?  With the three being our major weapon, this most certainly is cause for concern.  What really is the reason behind this cold shooting?  This seem to be a recurring thing of late.

I think Coop is showing why he won the POY award.  Great game by Tim.

Whoever we play tomorrow, I hope my insides won't collapse as they did in the first half of todays game.

Gosh!  This calls for a visit to the theaters to watch Dave Chapelle's Block Party.  Till tomorrow folks.   :) :) :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: realist on March 03, 2006, 08:45:16 PM
DC:  Lots of people mistake St. Marys in South Bend for Notre Dame.  In the old days ND was male only, and St. marys was women only.  Not sure if St. marys is still female only, but they play in the MIAA.  MIAA has 8 men's teams, and 9 women's teams.  Oops. forgot we have Wisc. Lutheraan in the MIAA for football only to get an AQ.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2006, 08:47:24 PM
Quote from: realist on March 03, 2006, 08:45:16 PM
DC:  Lots of people mistake St. Marys in South Bend for Notre Dame.  In the old days ND was male only, and St. marys was women only.  Not sure if St. marys is still female only, but they play in the MIAA.  MIAA has 8 men's teams, and 9 women's teams.  Oops. forgot we have Wisc. Lutheraan in the MIAA for football only to get an AQ.

I remember when St. Mary's provided the cheerleaders for ND football games.  Does that date me?  ??? :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2006, 08:50:39 PM
Quote from: WooMix on March 03, 2006, 08:37:15 PM
Wooster's game has me seriously worried about how far they are gonna go in the big dance.  Today's victory will go fown as sheer luck (at least in my books).  They shot 4/25 from beyond the arc (which I will not bother converting to a percentage out of respect) and winning the game?  With the three being our major weapon, this most certainly is cause for concern.  What really is the reason behind this cold shooting?  This seem to be a recurring thing of late.

I think Coop is showing why he won the POY award.  Great game by Tim.

Whoever we play tomorrow, I hope my insides won't collapse as they did in the first half of todays game.

Gosh!  This calls for a visit to the theaters to watch Dave Chapelle's Block Party.  Till tomorrow folks.   :) :) :)

WooMix...Wooster didn't win the game on "sheer luck."  They won by 14, and they deserved the win, outplaying RMC on the boards and with superior ball control throughout the game (only 8 or so turnovers).  Vandervaart was outstanding, compensating for the lack of 3s by scoring 21 down low.  Plus, in the second half, Wooster was 21-21 from the foul line- which is a very encouraging number when you're in tourney time.

Remember, Wooster didn't have their A-game offense, and shot their worst 3 pt game of the season (by percentge at least) against a team that has been ranked in the top 25 and they came away with a 14-point win on a neutral floor in the NCAA tournament.

I, for one, am not going to care if Wooster goes 0-25 from behind the arc in the tournament so long as the ending score is in their favor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2006, 08:53:45 PM
Yeah, I agree with scotsbrod.  I was already pessimistic about Wooster's chances, given their tough draw and recent mediocre play.  Today's result gives me hope.  To be able to beat a good (perhaps very good) team by a convincing margin despite terrible shooting is very encouraging to me. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 03, 2006, 08:54:23 PM
Quote from: realist on March 03, 2006, 08:45:16 PM
DC:  Lots of people mistake St. Marys in South Bend for Notre Dame.  In the old days ND was male only, and St. marys was women only.  Not sure if St. marys is still female only, but they play in the MIAA.

St. Mary's (IN) is still a women-only institution. They also have one of my favorite nicknames in college sports: The Belles.

Bing Crosby would be proud.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2006, 09:40:33 PM
Final:  Wittenberg 76  Lake Erie 40

Wittenberg was led by Kenny Brady with 23 points, Daniel Russ with 13 points and Billy Bowen with 11 points.

Tigers are now 26-3 and they play Baldwin-Wallace next

Good luck to both Wooster and Wittenberg tomorrow night!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2006, 09:56:47 PM
Final:  Transylvania 75  Bethany 56

Transy wins on their home floor and will host Wooster tomorrow night.  Transy was led by Robert Pendleton with 18 points, Bryan Howard with 17 points, Matt Finke with 16 points and Marc Bain with 14 points.

These 4 guys seem to be the big scorers for the Pioneers but you can't forget Joey Searle who was scoreless tonight.  When he gets hot, Searle is a 6'4" wing who will hit three pointers as he did a couple of years ago in a Mose Hole Classic loss to Wooster.

So, Wooster will have to beat the Pioneers on their home floor to advance.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2006, 10:13:05 PM
According to the NCAA record book, the record for most games played in a career in D3 is held by Michael Crotty of Williams, who played in 122 games from 2001-04.  Tonight in Lexigton, Kyle Witucky played in the 122nd game of his career, tying the record (if it is indeed the record; there is some doubt.) 

And all 122 games for Kyle have been starts.  And Wooster has won 109 of them.   8)

Congratulations to Kyle Witucky! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 03, 2006, 10:14:18 PM
Great games tonight!

Go W's!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: augie_superfan on March 03, 2006, 10:29:53 PM
I just got back from the Transy regional.  This was my first time ever seeing Wooster.  I was disappointed...I wanted to see the 3's rain down.  It's ok though.  That Cooper kid is one heck of a player.  I really wish he'd never shoot the ball outside of about 15 feet.  Maybe it was just tonight but his shot didn't look too good (although most from deep didn't look good tonight).  He is one of the best (if not the best) players I have ever seen when it comes to just taking your man off the dribble and getting to the rim or kicking out to your teammates.

I know many people on here are worried about Wooster b/c of the poor outside shooting tonight.  I would say that this game was a positive (atleast to me).  I came expecting a up and down the floor tempo and hitting 3's from everywhere.  Well, that wasn't working and this team found a way to win in the opposite way...taking it down low.  That is a scary thing for opponents.

As for the matchup tomorrow, Transy is not very deep at all.  I think that if Wooster plays more of their regular style, Transy wont be able to keep up.  Should be a good one tomorrow and hopefully I will get to witness that Wooster style of play that I've heard so much about.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 03, 2006, 10:32:05 PM
That's a very good point, AS. If I'm a Wooster fan, I like the fact that my team was taken out of its normal game tonight, yet still found an alternative method to beat a pretty good RMC team by double digits.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: augie_superfan on March 03, 2006, 10:37:31 PM
One more point....

I love that Wooster coach!!

He just had this great intensity on the sidelines that seemed to translate right over to his players.  I just love to see that.  At one point, when they were playing bad, he called a timeout and at the end of the timeout, he was running and pushing his players back onto the floor and going crazy.  I thought that was just amazing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 03, 2006, 10:47:20 PM
QuoteI'm curious, how does Whitewater play D3 when they are that huge.  Heck, their senior class has as many students as Denison has total.  That to me doesn't seem real fair. 
I don't know who decides who plays what division.

Having a gene pool of 10,000 vs 2400, seems the chances are you may get a few better players from a school of 10.000.

Well, then, the schools in the CUNYAC would rule D-3. Hunter has over 20,000 students.

Of course, though, they stink for the most part.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on March 03, 2006, 11:17:26 PM
Great job NCAC!

Kept rhe ride alive!!

Go Witt/Woo


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2006, 12:29:23 AM
Here is the breakdown on Transylvania for Saturday's game:

Transy is 25-4 overall and 15-1 AT HOME so Wooster will be trying to give the Pioneers only their 2nd home loss this season.  Transy's only loss at home was to Wittenberg back on Nov. 27th by a 61-52 score.  Transy lost 3 road games this season to Maryville (TN), Mt. St. Joseph and Manchester.

Transy is a team with lots of experience (4 of their starters are Seniors and the 5th is a Junior).  Transy's Coach, Brian Lane, has been named the HCAC Coach of the Year for the last 2 years.

Transy's Starters:
5'10" Marc Bain  11.1 ppg, 56 three pointers made, 88% FT
6'1" Robert Pendleton  7.8 ppg, 51 three pointers made, 3.3 apg
6'2" Bryan Howard  12.9 ppg, leading scorer
6'5" Matt Finke  12.9 ppg, 5.7 rpg
6'6" Joey Searle  10.9 ppg, 5.9 rpg, 42 three pointers made

Transy's Bench (not deep):
6'5" Joey Verax  8.1 ppg, 2.9 rpg
6'4" Stephen Gabbard  4.3 ppg, 27 three pointers made (41.5%)
6'0" Tyler Smithhart  2.2 ppg, 90% FT
 
As a team, Transy shoots 48.3% from the floor and 37.6% on three pointers.  They take good care of the ball (~12 turnovers/game) but some teams can beat them on the boards (-0.2 rebounding margin) because Transy plays a 3 guard starting lineup.

Wooster will have to play a smart game with few turnovers to get the win.  The Scots may be able to beat Transy in the paint (with Vandervaart) and outrebound them if they attack the boards.  The Scots should also have Tom Port cover 6'6" Joey Searle because he is a three point threat.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 04, 2006, 12:55:26 AM
Good win for the Scots tonight.  Clearly the outside game was not working, but tonight it was a case of just not shooting well.  Against OWU and Witt (and Earlham early in the season) I thought that the outside game was limited by good defense, but not so much the case tonight.  The Scots worked the ball well on offense creating good looks, but just couldn't get them to fall.  Big efforts by Vandervaart, Cooper, and Port, and a very good defensive effort in the 2nd half made the difference.  The Scots were not doing a particularly good job on the boards until the tirade that was so appreciated by Augie_Superfan, but after that they really hit the glass and RMC got very few rebounds the rest of the game.  Also, once Hawley and Wansley were in foul trouble RMC had no answer for Port and Vandervaart and the Scots were able to pull away a bit. 

Wansley was a non-factor in this game.  He got into foul trouble early, but even when he was in didn't seem to be able to do much offensively.  I'm guessing that he doesn't frequently have to play against someone with the athletic ability of Tom Port.

The game against Transy should be a good one.  Transy does not appear to be as deep as the Scots, so hopefully the Scots can keep the tempo up and wear them out.  That being said, Transy looked pretty good tonight and has some good shooters from downtown.  The Scots will have to play good perimeter defense and will have to convert better from 3-pt range themselves.  I do think that the Scots are the best team here, but if the Scots play their best there probably isn't anyone that can beat them.  Unfortunately we haven't seen their best for a couple of weeks now and we're at the point where they need 40-minutes of good basketball every night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 04, 2006, 12:58:11 AM
It's the nature of this tournament that teams of this caliber must meet now, but alas....so it goes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on March 04, 2006, 01:30:28 AM
when do they announce were the sectionals are going to be after the game saturday night please tell me
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on March 04, 2006, 08:43:28 AM
I think the Wooster statisticians may have fallen asleep a time or two....how do the Scots score 84 points and only have 6 assists??? Witucky with ZERO??? That can't be right. The kid makes produces more good dishes than the Lowry center dishwasher on a daily basis!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 04, 2006, 09:10:55 AM
Quote from: MoneyBallSTL on March 04, 2006, 08:43:28 AM
I think the Wooster statisticians may have fallen asleep a time or two....how do the Scots score 84 points and only have 6 assists??? Witucky with ZERO??? That can't be right. The kid makes produces more good dishes than the Lowry center dishwasher on a daily basis!

I was wondering about that number myself.  Especially since Mike Breckenridge kept pointing out that even though the their shots weren't falling, the Scots were moving the ball well.

They did, though, get lots of points inside from Vandervaart, who generally makes 42 1/2 moves before shooting, negating most assists.  And Cooper mostly scores with one-on-one action.  So, it's possible they only had 6, since so many open-looked threes missed.  Plus, Wooster scored 24 of their 84 points from the foul line.

Alright, now I'm awake and psyched about this. :-)

Wooster made 32 field goals in the game.  Vandervaart had 11 and Cooper 9, which accounts for 20 of the 32.  It's possible that of those 20, only 1 or 2 were assisted; even maybe none. 

Brandon Johnson had 3 FGs, and if I remember, one was on a coast-to-coast play and the other two he beat his man off the dribble.  Probably no assists there, either.

Hmm.  Did the statisticians actually pad the Wooster assist total?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 04, 2006, 10:18:44 AM
Quote from: MoneyBallSTL on March 04, 2006, 08:43:28 AM
I think the Wooster statisticians may have fallen asleep a time or two....how do the Scots score 84 points and only have 6 assists??? Witucky with ZERO??? That can't be right. The kid makes produces more good dishes than the Lowry center dishwasher on a daily basis!

I'm thinking that 6 is probably a pretty accurate number.  At least I'm not remembering too many assists.  As pointed out by Wooster Booster, there were many potential assists but for the most part they were followed by missed jumpers.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 04, 2006, 10:23:13 AM
Is anyone else coming down for the game tonight??  There are 400 tickets allocated for Wooster fans, but I don't know how many were sold last night.  According to the Daily Record, those tickets are available between 4:00 and 5:30 tonight at the Beck Center.  The Transy crowd was good and loud last night, so we need as many Scot fans down here as possible!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 04, 2006, 10:52:12 AM
Congratulations, derekpoe, on leading the NCAC prognosticators with 21 points and a current second place position!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 04, 2006, 11:19:36 AM
Sunday afternoon the NCAA will announce where sectionals are.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: 78rmc on March 04, 2006, 11:48:13 AM
Congrats to Wooster!  I just wish you could have seen an RMC team at full strength.  Wansley has been battling a bad knee injury.  Plus both of our backup post men did not make the trip, as Irmer and Dixon were missing for illness/injuries.  Missing those two definitely handcuffed coach in the post rotation.  Without that depth, it seems that RMC could not maintain the game in the second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 04, 2006, 12:22:33 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2006, 10:52:12 AM
Congratulations, derekpoe, on leading the NCAC prognosticators with 21 points and a current second place position!

I promise, it was pure luck!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2006, 07:35:24 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 52  Transy 45

Wooster being led by Devin Fulk with 14 points (4 three pointers) and Tom Port with 12 points.  Marc Bain with 22 points (5 three pointers) is leading Transy.

Wooster has shot well and they made 8 three pointers in the half.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: aw11 on March 04, 2006, 07:44:26 PM
Witt up big at Half!!! Brady 18pts!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 04, 2006, 07:48:47 PM
Transy on top Wooster at bottom of these halftime stats.

TEAM NCAA Division III Men's Basketball Tournament 2nd Round TEAM
TEAM PERCENTAGES CURRENT PLAY-BY-PLAY ACTION TEAM PERCENTAGES

Field Goal %:    56.3

3 Point %:    50.0

Free Throw %:   100

TEAM STATISTICS 

Turnover Points:    7

2nd Chance Points:    8

Bench Points:    8

Turnovers:    6

Steals:    2

20:00 [WC] 33 Tom Port Leave Game
20:00 [WC] 24 Devin Fulk Leave Game
20:00 [WC] 22 James Cooper Leave Game
20:00 [WC] 20 Kyle Witucky Leave Game
20:00 [WC] 10 Brandon Johnson Leave Game
20:00 [TU] 34 Brock Jones Leave Game
20:00 [TU] 22 Ryan Atwell Leave Game
20:00 [TU] 14 Adam Cole Leave Game
20:00 [TU] 4 Tyler Smithhart Leave Game
20:00 [TU] 3 Marc Bain Leave Game
0:00 Half Time
0:00 [TU] Def Rebound
0:00 [WC] 22 James Cooper 3Pt Attempt
0:05 [WC] 10 Brandon Johnson Enter Game
0:05 [WC] 30 Andy VanHorn Leave Game

Field Goal %:    54.8

3 Point %:    53.3

Free Throw %:    90.9

TEAM STATISTICS 

Turnover Points:    12

2nd Chance Points:    2

Bench Points:    24

Turnovers:    4

Steals:    3


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2006, 08:46:37 PM
Final:  Transy 91  Wooster 88

Good effort by the Scots but they couldn't beat the home team, Transy, on their floor.  Congrats to Transy on a very well played game.

Wooster was led by Devin Fulk with 23 points, Tom Port with 17 points, Tim Vandervaart with 16 points and James Cooper with 12 points.  Marc Bain led the Pioneers with 30 points.

Wooster finishes the season at 26-4.  :)

Big Congratulations to Kyle Witucky on a great career as a 4 year starter for the Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 04, 2006, 08:48:49 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2006, 08:46:37 PM
Final:  Transy 91  Wooster 88

Darn.  I was really looking forward to Witt-Woo IV.

Oh well, at least Wooster can head into the offseason knowing they will almost all be back next year.

Now, all that's left to say is go Witt!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: dren on March 04, 2006, 08:51:38 PM
witt update?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on March 04, 2006, 08:58:27 PM
Wittenberg 78
Baldwin-Wallace 60

Kenny Brady leads the Tigers with 20 pts., 18 pts in the first half.
The Great Dane adds 18pts. and  Daniel Russ 12 pts, playing only 4 minutes in the first half with 2 fouls early.

Pat Denbow and Gregg Hill both added 8 pts.
Another great night for Jack Hemenway with 7pts.

The Tigers shoot 55% from the field while holding the Yellow Jackets to 39 %.

Jackets shoot poorly from the 3pt line.

Tori Davis led BW with 26pts.
----------------------------------------------

Wittenberg                    BW
29/53 55%    FG%          20/51 39%
10/22 46%    3-pt           5/19    26%
10/15 67%    FT%           15/16  94%(Davis shoots 12/13)
-----------------------------------------------

Wittenberg's Press Release:

http://www.d3hoops.com/releases.php?release=55635
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 04, 2006, 09:07:51 PM
Is anybody out here?

I've got the fourth game in the Section on at Mississippi College vs. Maryville.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2006, 09:35:33 PM
Congrats to Transy.  I didn't think with Wooster up 7 at the break and the pace in Wooster's favor that the Pios had a chance.  They really stepped up their defensive effort in the 2nd half forcing the Scots into way too many to's in the 2nd half and Wooster allowed WAY too many 2nd chance baskets.  One question I had was coming off a missed Transy ft with under 20 seconds left, why did Wooster not burn a time out at least to get James Cooper back in the game?  I heard that Cooper and Fulk were waiting to come in barring a Transy make on the ft attempt, so I figured, after the miss and ensuing Wooster rebound, the Scots would call a t.o. to get their best offensive player back into the game to at least give a better chance to tie the game and send it to o.t.? Instead, Witucky is called for travelling and the rest is history.  Oh well, as a diehard Cubs and Indians fan, the "Wait until next year" mantra is very familiar in my vocabulary. :P  There is definately a LOT to look forward to for next season, however if everyone comes back for Wooster as I look for any sort of silver lining following yet another tough post season loss. :)  Throw in a couple of highly touted recruits that Moore seems to always get, and the future is definately bright at Wooster.  Sorry it had to end so soon this season, but as with the Cubbies and the Tribe, "There's always next year!!!" ;)

Congrats to Witt as well.  They are looking STRONG!  Good luck next week against Hope. 

Finally, congrats to Kyle Witucky on one of the finest carreers ever by someone suiting up for the Black and Old Gold!  I mean, all he did was come in as a freshman, take over the starting PG position following in the footsteps of Antwyan Reynolds (who was a pretty damn good PG at Wooster) and made every start for 4 seasons and led the Scots to an astounding 109-14 record over his 4 year carreer including a 3rd place finish in the national tournament and an Elite 8 appearance in that run!!!  By far, one of the best runs over a 4 year carreer by anyone who ever suited up in the Black and Old Gold!  You will be missed Kyle!!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2006, 09:48:18 PM
Now, in following with my love for baseball, I will be turning my attentions to the COW Baseball team which will be getting their season started next weekend!!!  Hopefully, they can live up to the hype of being preseason #1!  We'll find out soon enough as they have dates with #5 Rowan on the 15th and 18th of March on their Spring Break outing in FL.  I'll still be keeping an eye in here on how Witt is doing, but my main focus now shifts to the diamond, unfortunately. :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on March 04, 2006, 10:00:16 PM
what are witts   teams strengths  just wondering to tell the hope fans about witt and the players   witt is going to run into a really strong hope team
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 04, 2006, 10:27:46 PM
Well, there goes my pick 'em!  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2006, 10:28:28 PM
Quote from: hope1 on March 04, 2006, 10:00:16 PM
witt is going to run into a really strong hope team

I think you could say the exact same thing in reverse... ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 04, 2006, 10:29:55 PM
There may be a couple of surprises in the Sweet 16, but no one is a dog of a team that is left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2006, 10:36:31 PM
Looking back over the stats of the Wooster/Transy game, and there are 2 tell tale stats that stuck out as to why Wooster lost this game.  One is 2nd chance points.  Transy outscored Wooster 15-5 in 2nd chance points.  This was really noticable in the 2nd half.  Also of note was points off turnovers.  Transy scored 28 points off of Wooster turnovers.  Wooster played a virtual flawless 1st half, but followed it up with a pretty forgettable 2nd half which cost them the game. :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2006, 10:40:20 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 04, 2006, 10:27:46 PM
Well, there goes my pick 'em!  :o

My brackets were blown to hell tonight too btw! ;)  Although, I still have 1/2 of my final 4 still alive.  My finals participants were both ousted tonight though??? ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 04, 2006, 11:30:42 PM
Congrats to the Scots on another great season.  Too bad that it had to end tonight, but they were just outplayed in the 2nd half.  Transy really picked up the defense and the Scots didn't seem to have any kind of answer.  And nothing could stop Bain from scoring from all over the floor for Transy!

As in any close game there were so many things that could have changed the outcome, but I think that the Scots were out-hustled on the board and didn't help out enough on defense which resulted in too many easy buckets when Transy made their final run.  There were some questionable calls - most notably the travel on Witucky near the end of the game, but I wouldn't say that the refs cost the Scots the game.  Transy just did a great job of taking the Scots out of their game in the 2nd half.  If they play like they did tonight, they could go pretty far.

Thanks to Kyle for a great 4 years.  It would have been nice to see him hit the 3 to tie it at the end of regulation, but good defense by the Pioneers kept him well out of his normal range. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 05, 2006, 12:15:15 AM
I'm guessing Witt goes to Hope for the sectional.  I thought Witt might have a chance to host if Transylvania was too far away from Holland...Mapquest tells me that it's 454 miles from Lexington to Holland.  Just under the magic number. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on March 05, 2006, 03:01:11 AM
Yea I have seen both of these tourney games for the tigers and my personal opinion is we are looking at the national champs. Great offense, Great defense, KB playin without abandon, Russel Crow being dominant in the post, Borchy cleanin out the paint, Bowen drillin long range bombs,  Greg Hill placing his bid for the most athletic guard in the ncac, steffes planting his seed in the head of the competition, and Denbow and Hemenway STEPPING UP THE GAME. A lot of witt fans around here wanted to see witt woo 4 but i didnt and im glad to see them drop to be frank. Hope, Mississippi College, Memphis, Duke, Gonzaga WE AINT LOSIN BOYS. LETS GO WITT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: onefan on March 05, 2006, 11:30:18 AM
I think you may be right about Wittenberg. I have only seen them play in person twice this year and listened to them last night, but they beat two of the best the OAC has to offer...BW last night and ONU in December, and to be honest, won both going away and with some authority...Granted, both wins were on their home court, but from what I've seen they're not a "one trick pony" and if one guy is having a rough stretch there is someone else there to pick it up...and I believe that will serve them well on the tournament trail....Still an OAC fan...but now that BW has been disposed of, I'll  "grudgingly" root for a team that at least once played in the OAC. Good Luck Witt..it would be nice to see another Ohio team win it all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 05, 2006, 12:27:37 PM
Tough loss for the Scots. I think DC was right a couple of weeks ago when he said they peaked to early. From Mid January - Early February I don't think anybody could've beaten them.

Congrats to the Scots on another great year! And thanks for another thrilling ride!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 05, 2006, 12:32:37 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 05, 2006, 12:15:15 AM
I'm guessing Witt goes to Hope for the sectional.  I thought Witt might have a chance to host if Transylvania was too far away from Holland...Mapquest tells me that it's 454 miles from Lexington to Holland.  Just under the magic number. 
Is that 454 miles on the highway or "as the crow flies"? 

Now that Mississippi College is in, it makes Springfield seem like a central location.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 05, 2006, 12:36:23 PM
My Picks for Sectionals ( who will host ). And yes I know the NCAA will see it differently.

Lawrence

Virginia Wesleyan

Amherst

Hope

p.s. Is it too late to change my brackets?
    ( tongue firmly in cheek)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: dothedew on March 05, 2006, 12:47:16 PM
The Flying Dutchmen will travel to Wittenberg University in Springfield, Ohio for the NCAA Division III Sectional Tournament next Friday, the NCAA has announced. Hope (28-2) will play the host Tigers (27-3) in the second game of Friday's doubleheader at a time to be announced. The first game will pit Mississippi College (28-1) against Transylvania, Ky. (26-4). Friday's winners will meet on Saturday at a time to be announced.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: dothedew on March 05, 2006, 12:47:49 PM
this was just posted on the hope website....

GONNA BE FUN...i wish it was in Holland...but let's get it on !!!!

one game at a time...GO HOPE!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 05, 2006, 12:54:10 PM
Actually, Transy would be the central location.
But, Miss. Coll. is still well over 500 miles away.

I don't think the NCAA will award it to Transy and I don't think the NCAA will pay for three teams to fly to Miss.

It is down to Hope and Witt I think.
I think it will go to Hope because of DeVos.
But Witt does have a chance.

It's a shame Hope - Witt will be playing Fri instead of Sat.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 05, 2006, 12:55:39 PM
Wow alot happens when you go for another cup of coffee
Congrats Witt
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on March 05, 2006, 01:07:36 PM
Quote from: zosobob on March 05, 2006, 12:55:39 PM
Wow alot happens when you go for another cup of coffee
Congrats Witt

or don't read previous posts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on March 05, 2006, 01:20:08 PM
hope plays at wittt friday at 8.00
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 05, 2006, 01:23:34 PM
Should be another great weekend!
Sweet sixteen Fri night
Elite eight Sat night

Div I selection show Sun night.
Maybe I'll do better on those brackets
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 05, 2006, 01:51:18 PM
This should be an outstanding bracket.

Please post a note if you are planning on attending.  It would be fun to meet people from this board.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 05, 2006, 01:59:29 PM
I think I'll be there, I'll have to work out the work problem.  I had a great time in 96 the last time we brought the Orange to Springfield.

Should be a great matchup.  Witt allows 54 points, Hope 58.  Thats some great D.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 05, 2006, 03:05:54 PM
Quote from: sac on March 05, 2006, 01:59:29 PM
I think I'll be there, I'll have to work out the work problem.  I had a great time in 96 the last time we brought the Orange to Springfield.
Should be a great matchup.  Witt allows 54 points, Hope 58.  Thats some great D.

I hope to see you there.

Does that mean Witt wins 58 - 54?  That's their kind of score.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 05, 2006, 04:34:47 PM
With Wittenberg now getting to play at home, I'm predicting that they make a solid move through that sectional.  They'll then knock off Amherst in one semifinal and meet Lincoln in the championship game.  That's a tough call, but I think Wittenberg will win it all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Flying Dutch Fan on March 05, 2006, 05:42:01 PM
Looking forward to a war on Friday.  I posted this in the MIAA room, and thought it might be useful here as well.  Here are the OFFENSIVE stats for both teams:


Team Stats     WITT     Hope    
SCORING..................     2119   2331
Points per game........     70.6   77.7
Scoring margin.........     16.4   17.5
FIELD GOALS-ATT..........     776-1571   851-1824
Field goal pct.........     0.494   0.467
3 POINT FG-ATT...........     191-492   192-526
3-point FG pct.........     0.388   0.365
3-pt FG made per game..     6.4   6.4
FREE THROWS-ATT..........     376-527   437-637
Free throw pct.........     0.713   0.686
REBOUNDS.................     1120   1192
Rebounds per game......     37.3   39.7
Rebounding margin......     9.8   6.5
ASSISTS..................     409   400
Assists per game.......     13.6   13.3
TURNOVERS................     411   387
Turnovers per game.....     13.7   12.9
Turnover margin........     0   3.7
Assist/turnover ratio..     1   1
STEALS...................     215   280
Steals per game........     7.2   9.3
BLOCKS...................     112   112
Blocks per game........     3.7   3.7
WINNING STREAK...........     6   8
Home win streak........     4   18
ATTENDANCE...............     15833   52819
Home games-Avg/Game....     16-990   18-2934
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Flying Dutch Fan on March 05, 2006, 05:43:02 PM
And here are the DEFENSIVE stats for both teams:


Team Stats     WITT     Hope    
SCORING..................     1628   1805
Points per game........     54.3   60.2
Scoring margin.........     -   -
FIELD GOALS-ATT..........     578-1563   648-1680
Field goal pct.........     0.37   0.386
3 POINT FG-ATT...........     170-562   177-535
3-point FG pct.........     0.302   0.331
3-pt FG made per game..     5.7   5.9
FREE THROWS-ATT..........     302-437   332-500
Free throw pct.........     0.691   0.664
REBOUNDS.................     826   997
Rebounds per game......     27.5   33.2
Rebounding margin......     -   -
ASSISTS..................     270   300
Assists per game.......     9   10
TURNOVERS................     410   498
Turnovers per game.....     13.7   16.6
Turnover margin........     -   -
Assist/turnover ratio..     0.7   0.6
STEALS...................     207   208
Steals per game........     6.9   6.9
BLOCKS...................     60   81
Blocks per game........     2   2.7
WINNING STREAK...........     -   -
Home win streak........     -   -
ATTENDANCE...............     15469   21209
Home games-Avg/Game....     12-1123   9-1670
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 05, 2006, 05:50:42 PM
I agree that this will be a great game.

Those attendance figures are amazing.

how big is the DeVos Building?

I saw some pictures on Hope's web site and it looks like a great facility.

Do Hope students have to promise to be Amway distributors?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on March 05, 2006, 05:51:28 PM
dont get to kocky people this is probalby the best hope team you will see in a long time
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 05, 2006, 06:04:58 PM
Quote from: hope1 on March 05, 2006, 05:51:28 PM
dont get to kocky people this is probalby the best hope team you will see in a long time

I have a feeling that goes both ways.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Flying Dutch Fan on March 05, 2006, 06:45:45 PM
Following a great suggestion by TigerFan_1973, I created a new topic in the GL Region for discussing the upcoming games in Springfield.  Saves us from having to post in multiple places.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goodknight on March 05, 2006, 09:00:14 PM
Quote from: hope1 on March 05, 2006, 05:51:28 PM
dont get to kocky people this is probalby the best hope team you will see in a long time

A lot of people are hoping that you're right, hope1. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on March 06, 2006, 12:05:16 PM
Disappointing loss for the Scots but still a great season. Congrats to Witucky on an outstanding career, the kid is a winner through and through. Never thought I would say this but Good luck to Witt, heres hoping the Tigers can string together a nice run here, got to like the chances of getting to the Final 4 with hosting the sectional at the HPER, eerily reminiscent of the Scots run to the Final 4 a few years ago, aside from the fact that Witt has 2 dominating inside players and the Scots had a nice mix of outside threats to go with the beast in the middle.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: John Rusnak on March 06, 2006, 01:46:20 PM
Just curious to know what this board things Witt needs to do in order to beat Hope?  And on the flip side, what does Hope need to do to beat Witt?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 06, 2006, 02:01:03 PM
I think Witt needs to take care of the ball - and Russ and Borchers need to stay out of foul trouble.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on March 06, 2006, 02:40:37 PM
Witt will need to pound it to the DR and the Great Dane each and every possesion which means they need to stay out of foul trouble. The guards need to play defense and not turn it over and hit an outside shot here and there. If I were the coach for Hope I would steal a page out of Calvin's book and doube team the post each and every time they catch it. Witt normally does a good job of dumping the post to post pass so Hope will need to cover down with the guards and hope that the Witt guards miss shots. The X factor in this game is going to be Kenny Brady, he seems to be playing his best ball at the right time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 06, 2006, 04:25:21 PM
Hope doesn't double the post much, but they do help alot, but I wouldn't call it a double team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 06, 2006, 10:25:22 PM
Now that the Scots are out - Good luck to Witt and make the NCAC proud. It looks like the Hope-Witt game could be a championship caliber matchup.

Also my congratulations to Kyle Witucky on a great career at Wooster. His name will be all over the career achievement page of the media guide next year,(games played, 3-point percentage, 3 point made, assists, steals, points), but his real value was his leadership on the team, on and off the court. I wish him the best of luck with his future.

An exciting season for the Scots. I am sure they players are disappointed to be out of the tournament but if you step back and look at the how well they executed with the new style of play they should be proud.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on March 07, 2006, 12:00:58 PM
Sorry to see Wooster's season end.  They had a great year and will be back next year with a
great team.

GO WITT!!  Now we have only one!! 

Looks like Hope has the size to match up with the towers. 
Is Witt on spring break??  I hope they can fill the gym with some noise.

It most certainly has to be an advantage playing at home.

When you get this far there are no easy games!!

Best of luck!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: dren on March 07, 2006, 12:13:13 PM
I'm picking up my GF at CMH Airport in Columbus friday afternoon and heading to Springfield.  Im a michigander and directions from CMH to Springfield would be helpful.  Thanks in advance!  I also have room for 1 or 2 more if anyone in Columbus is in need of a ride.  Only problem is I won't be heading back to Columus after the games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on March 07, 2006, 12:18:37 PM
Dren:
Take 670 out oif the airport to Columbus and that feeds right into 70 and you take 70 to Springfield.  It's about 60 miles.  Springfield exits are clearly marked.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on March 07, 2006, 01:05:27 PM
Quote from: dren on March 07, 2006, 12:13:13 PM
I'm picking up my GF at CMH Airport in Columbus friday afternoon and heading to Springfield.  Im a michigander and directions from CMH to Springfield would be helpful.  Thanks in advance!  I also have room for 1 or 2 more if anyone in Columbus is in need of a ride.  Only problem is I won't be heading back to Columus after the games.

Take I-70 (West) towards Dayton/Springfield. 44 miles

Exit onto Route 68 (North) toward Urbana.  Exit52,  approx. 3 1/4 miles

Exit onto State Route 41 and turn right(east). You will pass a Marriot Fairfield Inn hotel(right) and a Meijer Superstore(left), Ferncliff Cemetery(right).

When the road dead ends(traffic light), turn right onto McCreight Avenue. You will go around a lefthand hair-pin curve.

Go straight through the first traffic light (Plum/McCreight intersection), then right on Woodlawn Ave (fraternity on corner)(across from Hospital) (2nd street past previous intersection).

Turn right (west) on Bill Edwards Dr.(Tower Hall, highrise dorm on corner)You are now approaching campus.

Parking lot on left as you go up the hill, if parking lot is full, continue up the hill to parking lot (at T intersection) on N. Plum St. or park on street.

HPER is on right as you go up Bill Edwards Drive, past Edwards-Maurer football stadium.

---------------

Or follow Wittenberg University signs  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: dren on March 07, 2006, 01:21:00 PM
thanks guys
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scott_leo on March 10, 2006, 10:15:57 AM
LIVE COVERAGE OF WITTENBERG SECTIONAL
(Friday and Saturday)

http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/news/2006releases/03_09.html

Live Video (with audio) via Teamline:
http://www.teamline.cc/sportpages.html?teamcode=1098&eventcode=0021

Live Audio only:
http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/broadcast/

All games also broadcast in Springfield on 89.1 FM

Friday coverage begins with Pre-Game Show at 5:30pm
(including interviews with coaches)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tniem on March 10, 2006, 09:51:21 PM
I posted it elsewhere, but Tiger fans, you got a heck of a team.  Good luck the rest of the way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 11, 2006, 06:21:28 PM
Anybody out here listening to or watching the game tonight?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Roughrider on March 11, 2006, 07:22:55 PM
Just as tniem did, I also posted elsewhere, but will repeat it here on your home board.

Congratulations to the Wittenberg Tigers on your win over the Hope Flying Dutchmen.  Good luck tonight and beyond.

Roughrider
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 11, 2006, 09:28:58 PM
Congratulations to Wittenberg, and good luck in Salem!  :)

I wonder if Dane Borchers will change his mind (about coming back next season) if the Tigers win it all?  Maybe he's already committed, by virtue of re-arranging his schedule so he doesn't graduate this year, but it would probably feel pretty good to go out on top!  (Don't get me wrong; I hope Witt wins it all AND I hope that Borchers comes back for his super-senior campaign.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on March 11, 2006, 09:56:32 PM
Wittenberg 74
Transylvania 61

Tigers were led in scoring by Kenny Brady and Daniel Russ with 12 pts. each.  Russ grabbing 13 rebounds and a stupid intentional foul which could have cost the Tigers.

Billy Bowen came off the bench to add 11 pts with the Great Dane adding 10 pts. To me, the most valuable player of the team.

DJ Corbett had a great game  while adding 8 pts, making a great driving lefthanded layup in crunch time.

Pat Denbow played his normal floor game while adding 7 pts.

The Pioneers were led by Brian Howard with 18pts.
Marc Bain added 15 but was held to 1/8 from the 3 line.
Joey Searle had 11 pts with Matt Finke with 7.
Tyler  Smithhard with 5.

---------------------------------------

If Wittenberg wants  to advance  further they must make their foul shots which they have not recently.

The Tigers shot 47 and only made 29. That's right, they missed 18 freebies.

Also, need Tyler Howard back. He was hurt in the NCAC championship game with a concussion and has not been with the team the past 3 games. Get well soon Tyler.

----------------
Team Stats:

Wittenberg                         Transy
20/42 48 %         FG%         20/45     44%
29/47 62%          FT%          17/25     68%
5/12   42%           3 %          4/18       22%

   40                   rebounds    23
   12                      TO            12
   13                    assists        6
   28                 Pts in Paint    24
   27               Bench Points    10

-----------------------

Boxscore:
http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/05-06statistics/ncaa6.htm

Game Story:
http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/05-06gamestories/ncaa6.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on March 11, 2006, 09:58:00 PM
Tiger Up

The Championship game will be televised by CSTV.

5pm Saturday

CSTV is available on channel 610 on Directv
and 152 on Dishnetwork.

------------------------------
http://www.odaconline.com/hoopchamp/

















:) ;) :D ;D :o :-* :-X :P 8) ::)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 11, 2006, 11:12:57 PM
Good Luck to all 8 teams next weekend. Men and Women.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 12, 2006, 12:07:24 AM
Congrats to Witt!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: patcummings on March 12, 2006, 02:24:33 AM
How bout some Witt fans actually come to Salem...screw watching it
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on March 12, 2006, 03:21:12 AM
If any Wabash fans have hung around in the off-season, maybe you can help us Hope fans out. What the heck is wrong with DePauw folks? I have never seen a spectacle like that at a D3 game, men or women, and what a game it took from our women to play through it, but what in the world? Has the NCAA ever set a precedent for denying hosting rights to a team who can't bring a civil crowd to the game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on March 12, 2006, 04:56:13 AM
when i (bryan nelson) played at wooster  i hoped i could go to the final four. dem boys from witt get straight up nasty sometimes. i (bryan nelson) also heard that russ is goin to the league. alright well im goin to bed so i can hit up hung lung tomorrow
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 12, 2006, 06:24:28 AM
ummmmm pat if you were anywhere near knowledgeable about what is going on campus you would realize that there will indeed be a whole contingent of tigers going this weekend. i will have more thoughts later on tonight guys about the weekend
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 12, 2006, 08:04:33 AM
That's funny - we usually think DPU fans are too busy having cocktails with Bitsy, Miffy and Chip to come watch the games!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on March 12, 2006, 08:11:33 AM
Quote from: patcummings on March 12, 2006, 02:24:33 AM
How bout some Witt fans actually come to Salem...screw watching it

screw you, mind your own business.

For people that can't make it , idxxx.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Spencer Beaty on March 12, 2006, 08:31:15 AM
good luck witt
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on March 12, 2006, 09:25:47 AM
good luck witt hope you win it all for the great lakes region
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on March 12, 2006, 09:42:39 AM
 
Scanned articles from Springfield News-Sun:

http://www.rz.coolfreepage.com/wittbb.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 12, 2006, 12:49:28 PM
I'm a little late to the party, but I wanted to offer congratulations to Witt for making the Final Four.  Getting through that region was no small feat.  Best of luck to Witt in Salem. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 12, 2006, 06:17:52 PM
Just got back from a trip out of town. Congrats to Witt. Good luck in Salem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on March 12, 2006, 06:40:17 PM
Some Final Four matchup notes:

http://www.iwuhoops.com/TOURN06.HTM

Looks like the marquis players are...


Perimeter
Keelan Amelianovich (6-6/210, Sr), IWU - 18.2 ppg, 90-195 3-pt (.462)
John Bedford (6-3/195, Sr), Amherst - 17.3 ppg, 45-96 3-pt (.469)
Dan Wheeler (6-5/218, Jr), Amherst - 14.5 ppg, 67-151 3-pt (.444)
Adam Dauksas (6-3/190, Sr), IWU - 14.3 ppg, 6.5 apg, 2.6 A/T.O.
Marques Fitch (6-0/165, Sr), VWC - 12.2 ppg, 25-91 3-pt (.295)
Ton Ton Balenga (6-1/190, So), VWC - 12.2 ppg, 56-131 3-pt (.427)

Low post 
Brandon Adair (6-5/205, Jr), VWC - 18.4 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 231-371 FG (.623)
Zach Freeman (6-7/210, Jr), IWU - 15.8 ppg, 7.6 rpg, 165-284 FG (.581)
Dan Russ (6-9/210, Sr), Witt - 15.0 ppg, 6.4 rpg, 189-338 FG (.559)
Dane Borchers (6-8/215, Sr), Witt - 12.6 ppg, 7.6 rpg, 152-239 FG (.636)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on March 12, 2006, 07:32:22 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 12, 2006, 08:04:33 AM
That's funny - we usually think DPU fans are too busy having cocktails with Bitsy, Miffy and Chip to come watch the games!  :D

Saturday it appeared that plenty of those cocktails were probably already downed. Hopefully that's the explanation for the garbage they were throwing at the Hope team the entire game. I know Wabash's football games with DePauw are a big deal, are they completely classless in their cheering of the football team too? The folks on the MIAA board are pretty well documenting what was put up with in Saturday's game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: auerbach on March 12, 2006, 08:46:32 PM
Anybody have a rundown on Witt..... looks like a team that likes to pound to the big boys inside. I see they beat Tufts easily and it took Amherst all they had to get by the Jumbo's. How deep is this squad ? My experience tells me the depth in the NCAC is superior to most leagues,is that still the case ? Looks like Amherst scores more but it also looks like they had a pretty easy schedule. Rebounds will go to the tigers so if they shoot to season %'s they should be in good shape. Appreciate all feedback 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 12, 2006, 08:48:33 PM
Wittenberg plays defense, Amherst likely won't come close to their average.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 12, 2006, 09:03:20 PM
this is going to be another "wooster" type matchup if i must say that ala. amherst has virtually no shot of establishing a low post game-if that is any surprise against us and the key will come down to our guard play. if witt plays defense like they have the past two weekends i am confident that we can do what we need to do to get it done.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: auerbach on March 13, 2006, 08:53:18 AM
how is witt at perimeter defense? the big fellas from witt should have an easy time. anybody out there see witt beat tufts ? would like to know what you guys think of martin, the tufts post player. he had his way with amherst
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 13, 2006, 10:18:45 AM
andersdy - I am surprised. Seriously, DPU fans are normally meek and mild, and they don't have much of a presence anywhere.

When Wabash played DPU this year here at Wabash in hoops, their crowd was lame.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 13, 2006, 11:21:52 AM
auerbach-well minus the second wooster game wittenberg has held teams to well sub par their season scoring averages as witt has the best defense percentage wise in the country. they guard the perimeter very well and if amherst has no inside presence then i think witt is going to extend their defense (usually man if not always) out to guard the perimeter even tighter
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: auerbach on March 13, 2006, 11:32:37 AM
penns, thank you for the good information. if they are the best defensive team in the country they should prevail. I think Amherst has trouble with talent that works hard. they have been challenged but not enough and they are not a very good rebounding team. Tufts out hustled them all over the floor able to gain position through box outs every set,even with less athletic boys. they shoot well but that should end against good defenders
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 13, 2006, 12:09:21 PM
It's always been my understanding that Depauw students rarely get up for any athletics event that doesn't involve Wabash. 

I've heard some nastiness tossed my way in the past from Depauw students, but I never thought that was representative of their behavior at most games...the vitriol gets turned up all the way to 11 when Wabash and Depauw get together. 

I'm all for not letting Depauw host anything in the future.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on March 13, 2006, 02:09:40 PM
Today, I am proud NCAC FAN.  I have been out of loop a little (read military obligations) and I have not had a chance to post.

I am happy and proud of Wittenberg Tigers.  I am personally routing for a IWU/WITT final.  Wittenberg is playing so well right now and I hope it continues all the way to SALEM!!  Go Tigers!! Go NCAC!! Go Great Lakes Region!

I am also excited about recent increase in media coverage.  We can only hope that this is the beginning of something new.  If you are not going to Salem, please watch and let CSTV know that you are watching so that coverage can expand in the future!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 13, 2006, 05:21:24 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on March 13, 2006, 02:09:40 PM
(read military obligations) and I have not had a chance to post.

D3Sports is the first place I have heard of CSTV.  What is it?

Also, thank you for your military service.  I think that those of us who are not serving owe thanks to those who are.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 13, 2006, 05:56:33 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on March 13, 2006, 05:21:24 PM
D3Sports is the first place I have heard of CSTV.  What is it?

CSTV is College Sports Television.  To my knowledge, it has only been around for a couple years (if that), and broadcasts college sports only (the other night, I saw men's lacrosse on it, and they show replays of old games and tons of college sports and sports-related shows).  However, I think it is very limited in circulation (it's on DirecTV, but not sure if it's part of a special package), which is probably why you haven't heard of it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 13, 2006, 07:33:46 PM
You can get it on Sports Pack from DirecTV.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on March 13, 2006, 08:41:39 PM
Since I already wrote all this for fans of another board, I thought I'd post the info on the other school boards as well. Here's the scoop on the ticket info here, in cause anyone was wondering. Hope to see many of you there!

Quote from: diehardfan on March 13, 2006, 08:36:37 PM
Quote from: Old School on March 13, 2006, 07:16:36 PM
Quote from: TitanFan12 on March 13, 2006, 06:09:20 PM
Does anyone know when tickets for Friday nights IWU game will go on sale at IWU?
You can just call the Salem Civic Center directly and order them,and then pick them up at Will Call...at least that has been the case in the past.
They won't be available at IWU, as far as I know. You can order tickets in one of two ways:

1) Order them from www.Ticketmaster.com, and pay all sorts of rediculous services charges.
2) Order them from the Box office at the Civic Center. The phone number is one of the many bizarre d3sports numbers programmed into my phone  :-[ and it is 540-894-6022. You will still pay a service charge ($2) but it is much less than through Ticketmaster (which is $6-$7).

The second option is better, even if it wasn't less expensive. because the Civic Center knows where each school's designated fans section is, and you can request to be put in the IWU section.

You will then just need to pick up the tickets the day of the game from the will call window. The line has never been very long.

I have also picked up tickets the day of the game from the ticket booth, and gotten a great seat by requesting that the put me as close to the floor and the middle as possible. Heck, I've even gotten a good sized block of tickets just for the second day and gotten great seats that were all together when my sis and a group of friends from home decided to come down at the last second for the championship two years ago.

The Final Four, as far as I can tell, has never gotten that close to selling out. It may get closer than normal this year, with VaWes and IWU there, but I wouldn't worry too much about the tickets.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on March 14, 2006, 02:15:23 PM
http://www.rz.coolfreepage.com/wittbb.html


Added Eye of the Tiger music for the appropriate viewing mood.
Upper left of page. 8)






Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: auerbach on March 14, 2006, 03:03:38 PM
lot of talk from both sides. this should be a good game strengths are opposite and weakness 's also. lot of talk about tufts but witt game was too early to take anything away from it . tuft/amherst , jeffs scored plenty against a d scheme that some say was a good one. witt doesn't want to exchange hoops at that pace .they spread it out nicely up and down the lineup but to get high 70's low 80's they'll need 2 players scoring alot more than average . they will work the ball for high % shots and that slowdown will hurt jeff tempo and try patience. will be very interesting matchup ........ witt in a close one
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on March 14, 2006, 03:05:05 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 13, 2006, 07:33:46 PM
You can get it on Sports Pack from DirecTV.

$12 a month extra.

For every premium package you have with directv, subtract $1.

http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/learn/Packages_SportsPack.jsp
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on March 14, 2006, 03:10:32 PM
Just something of note, wouldn't it be intesting to see the first and second teams of the NCAC get together and play a game against the first and second teams of the OAC, for a chance for some arch rivals to get to play together, and get to know each other, as well as a chance for The OAC and NCAC to square off...If not 1st and second teamers, maybe just Sr's  mentioned in the confrerence (1st, 2nd, or HM) I realize it is unlikely, but wouldn't it be nice to see ?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: auerbach on March 14, 2006, 04:28:36 PM
no ,not really!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 14, 2006, 07:31:29 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on March 13, 2006, 05:56:33 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on March 13, 2006, 05:21:24 PM
D3Sports is the first place I have heard of CSTV.  What is it?

CSTV is College Sports Television.  To my knowledge, it has only been around for a couple years (if that), and broadcasts college sports only (the other night, I saw men's lacrosse on it, and they show replays of old games and tons of college sports and sports-related shows).  However, I think it is very limited in circulation (it's on DirecTV, but not sure if it's part of a special package), which is probably why you haven't heard of it.

Don't forget to tune into our audio broadcast for pregame, halftime and postgame commentary from people who actually know Division III basketball.  Or if you have TiVo, watch the game on about a 30-second delay, mute it and turn up our sound.

Plus CSTV won't have the first announcement of our All-America team, or the entire postgame news conference, or highlights of the shining moments of the NCAA Tournament, etc.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on March 14, 2006, 08:22:21 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 14, 2006, 07:31:29 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on March 13, 2006, 05:56:33 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on March 13, 2006, 05:21:24 PM
D3Sports is the first place I have heard of CSTV.  What is it?

CSTV is College Sports Television.  To my knowledge, it has only been around for a couple years (if that), and broadcasts college sports only (the other night, I saw men's lacrosse on it, and they show replays of old games and tons of college sports and sports-related shows).  However, I think it is very limited in circulation (it's on DirecTV, but not sure if it's part of a special package), which is probably why you haven't heard of it.

Don't forget to tune into our audio broadcast for pregame, halftime and postgame commentary from people who actually know Division III basketball.  Or if you have TiVo, watch the game on about a 30-second delay, mute it and turn up our sound.

Plus CSTV won't have the first announcement of our All-America team, or the entire postgame news conference, or highlights of the shining moments of the NCAA Tournament, etc.

And don't forget that d3hoops.com/penn atlantic will have video of the semifinals.  thanks.

http://www.d3hoops.com/salem/06/video.htm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on March 14, 2006, 09:49:02 PM
Long time, no post....but anyway:

I'm watching the NIT with Earlhamalum....yes, we really have no  life, when we noticed that no other than BO BOROWSKI was officiating the Stanford/Virginia NIT game


Earlhamalum is now convulsing on the floor, cursing the day he ever had that guy as an official......but, there is Bo....hair slicked back.....calling palming violations on ESPN


Oh and Go TIGERS!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 15, 2006, 07:54:00 AM
Looks like a great weekend for college hoops!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 15, 2006, 10:01:49 AM
So....Dan Russ, only 2nd team all region???  I can understand Borchers getting bumped down to third, but Russ second??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 15, 2006, 10:13:37 AM
Seriously don't tell me that you're going to whine because a player from your team was ONLY second team all-region.  What an enormous slap in the face. 

Please. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Indiana Jones on March 15, 2006, 10:51:48 AM

Quote
Quote from: jscwittfan on March 15, 2006, 10:01:49 AM
So....Dan Russ, only 2nd team all region???  I can understand Borchers getting bumped down to third, but Russ second??
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 15, 2006, 10:13:37 AM
Seriously don't tell me that you're going to whine because a player from your team was ONLY second team all-region. What an enormous slap in the face.

Please.


wally--
Your post, whining about the whining, blows a simple and harmless post out of proportion.  It's a legitimate point...let it go.

jcs--
It's all about the stats...for better or worse.
 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 15, 2006, 11:04:01 AM
It's a legitimate point?  How so?  There are over 40 teams in this region.  Since most teams don't really have a center, there are probably upwards of 100 forwards in the region eligible for recognition.  D3hoops.com has determined that Dan Russ is better than all but two of them, and somehow there's been an egregious oversight. 

Are the rich not rich enough here?  Witt's in the Final Four for the first time in 12 years, and they're griping about individual placement on an all-region team.  What happened to congratulating the player for being selected to the team?  Where's the harm in that?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on March 15, 2006, 12:25:14 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 15, 2006, 11:04:01 AM
It's a legitimate point? How so? There are over 40 teams in this region. Since most teams don't really have a center, there are probably upwards of 100 forwards in the region eligible for recognition. D3hoops.com has determined that Dan Russ is better than all but two of them, and somehow there's been an egregious oversight.

Sounds as if we have a frustrated wabash fan, which is completely understandable given their lack of interaction with women. However, dont take your frustrations out on D Russ. Not only is he a better player than everyone on the first team list, but he is the most dominant player in division 3. 2 of my uncles are scouts for top 50 division 1 teams, and after seeing Russ play earlier this year said that he would be an immediate impact player/ possible go to guy.
But there is no complaining here, or from Russ I would imagine because Witt is going to be driving home from Salem with a pizza for every 2 guys, a big trophy, and a ring on their finger. It sounds like most of the complaining is coming from middle of the pack ncac teams. Rightfully so.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on March 15, 2006, 12:38:34 PM
No complaints on the all-region selections here....basketball is a team sport and individual honors mean absolutely nothing.

I guarantee Russ and Borchers do not care what team they were selected to as they pack their bags for Salem.

Congrats to Wooster having three players on the first two teams, but guess what, they are sitting at home right now. I would bet the farm that they would rather be packing for Salem right now instead.

Indiana Jones is exactly right, it's all about the stats for these honors and the only stat that really matters now are WINS.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: realist on March 15, 2006, 12:50:32 PM
I can understand why someone would be upset about one of his team's players not getting first team.  However, I would look at the player that finished ahead of my guy to determine how anyone could make that determination.  B Crawford from Albion was awesome all year.  His FG% was something like .683 (set a new MIAA standard), and he was a dominating force in every game.  Crawford may not have had the complete game, but he literally dominated the paint in a way few 5's have done in recent years.   No question D. Russ is a very good player, but he was fortunate to be on a team with other quality players.  Crawford literally was a team almost by himself.  It may just mean the voters felt one player meant more to his team than the other player meant to his respective team.  Go Tigers.  Win it for the Great Lakes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 15, 2006, 01:12:22 PM
Thanks to everyone for your insight.  I am happy that Russ was named to the team, and am in no way "whining".  I think that the first team is a solid team, and I would put Russ over Port, but since they play 2 different positions, that doesn't really matter.  I guess I missed the fact that it wasn't the best 5 players in the region (like the all-NCAC teams are the best five players in the conference), but the best 5 at their respective positions. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 15, 2006, 04:15:29 PM
Having seen Crawford 3 times and Russ once I can say I was much more impressed with Crawford.  That doesn't mean Russ isn't a great D3 player, because he is but in the one game I saw he was kept under wraps pretty well. 

Speaking of two guys I'd like to see matchup...... 8)  That would be a great matchup.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 15, 2006, 06:20:19 PM
Witt just may come home with the Walnut and Bronze. Championship Rings would be presented at a later date though. ( decided by the school )
And I hope Witt fans show up in full force for both occasions. Not just sitting at home typing on a computer and talking about how great "IT" was, when they wasn't even there.
Go support your team and Good Luck Witt!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 15, 2006, 06:52:42 PM
Quote from: zosobob on March 15, 2006, 06:20:19 PM
Not just sitting at home typing on a computer and talking about how great "IT" was, when they wasn't even there.
Go support your team and Good Luck Witt!

I'd love to be there, but it's not just gonna be possible. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 15, 2006, 06:54:38 PM
Quote from: jimmychitwood15 on March 15, 2006, 12:38:34 PM
Indiana Jones is exactly right, it's all about the stats for these honors and the only stat that really matters now are WINS.
I think "he" got that from Vince Lombardi.  Vince, of course, being a real person!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 15, 2006, 07:01:39 PM
What exactly are the "recruiting" rules in Division III?

I've never known exactly and for sure don't know what the differences are from when Witt "deemphasized" and moved out ot the OAC.

Can someone give me an overview on the recruiting rules and the differences in emphasis between the OAC and the NCAC?

Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 15, 2006, 07:12:11 PM
Quote from: zosobob on March 15, 2006, 06:20:19 PM
And I hope Witt fans show up in full force for both occasions. Not just sitting at home typing on a computer and talking about how great "IT" was, when they wasn't even there.
Go support your team and Good Luck Witt!

Oh, I'll be there.  I wouldn't miss this for anything.  And, as of yesterday afternoon, Witt had sold over 1/3 of their allotment, according to Garnett.  Let's hope that number is a lot higher after today.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on March 15, 2006, 07:38:31 PM
good luck witt this week win it all
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 15, 2006, 10:02:50 PM
first i am sick and tired of everyone thinking we will have no fans there-you dont know how many ppl witt has going-a lot actually so we will be well represented. and you know one thing-what's the point in going if we're not bringing home the trophy at the end ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterBNel on March 15, 2006, 10:27:26 PM
alright last post before i leave  for salem tomorrow, closing line on the game is witt -5.5 (which we will cover).
its saint pattys day friday and as a wise man (shamus o'toole) once said, I'm gonna get DRUNK.
GO TIGERS
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 15, 2006, 11:11:41 PM
Only amateurs get drunk on St. Patricks Day. Us pros just keep a mild buzz going from lunchtime on....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 15, 2006, 11:46:47 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 15, 2006, 11:11:41 PM
Only amateurs get drunk on St. Patricks Day. Us pros just keep a mild buzz going from lunchtime on....

Right on, smeds!  That's why New Year's Eve and St. Patrick's Day are two of the most dangerous days of the year on the highways - all those damned amateurs! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 16, 2006, 01:25:59 AM
I just read this in one of the stories on the Springfield News-Sun's webpage, and couldn't help but cracking up:

Quote from: Lucas Sullivan, Springfield News-Sun
At 6:15 p.m., the bus stopped for dinner at The Golden Corral in Charleston, W.Va.

Ever wonder what 6-6 Dan Russ eats at an all-you-can-eat buffet?

Everything.

And if it doesn't fit on one plate? They make more plates.

Pretty good line, even though Russ is not 6-6. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scott_leo on March 16, 2006, 10:56:13 AM
WITTENBERG RADIO COVERAGE

We'll be on the air at 4:30pm Friday with the "Final Four Pre-Game Show"

In addition to both head coaches, our interviews include former Tigers Matt Croci and Aaron Perry (from the '93-'94 Final Four Team).

We'll have audio highlights and player comments from Wittenberg's tournament run.

Listen live on 89.1 FM in Springfield or online at http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/broadcast/index.html



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 16, 2006, 11:01:25 AM
Oh, I forgot to ask. What color of suits was Artie wearing at the regional, and what will he wear this weekend?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 16, 2006, 11:01:34 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on March 15, 2006, 07:12:11 PM
Quote from: zosobob on March 15, 2006, 06:20:19 PM
And I hope Witt fans show up in full force for both occasions. Not just sitting at home typing on a computer and talking about how great "IT" was, when they wasn't even there.
Go support your team and Good Luck Witt!

Oh, I'll be there.  I wouldn't miss this for anything.  And, as of yesterday afternoon, Witt had sold over 1/3 of their allotment, according to Garnett.  Let's hope that number is a lot higher after today.

Well, I guess my hope wasn't answered.  We just got an email saying that due to a lack of students travelling, the student and other fan buses have been combined into 1 bus.  :(

All I can hope is that this means students are going down on their own, which, according to some, may end up being the case.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on March 16, 2006, 12:28:42 PM
GOOD LUCK WITT!!

BRING IT HOME FOR THE NCAC!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: northb on March 16, 2006, 01:37:33 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 15, 2006, 11:46:47 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 15, 2006, 11:11:41 PM
Only amateurs get drunk on St. Patricks Day. Us pros just keep a mild buzz going from lunchtime on....

Right on, smeds!  That's why New Year's Eve and St. Patrick's Day are two of the most dangerous days of the year on the highways - all those damned amateurs! ;)

Statistically, there is no increase in drunk driving arrests on new Year's Eve/Day.  I am not sure about St. Patty's day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 16, 2006, 01:48:25 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 16, 2006, 11:01:25 AM
Oh, I forgot to ask. What color of suits was Artie wearing at the regional, and what will he wear this weekend?
Now I now what you guys have been talking about.

I caught him on the video and he had on this suit that had tails, at least that's how it looked on the radio.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 16, 2006, 02:12:04 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on March 16, 2006, 01:48:25 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 16, 2006, 11:01:25 AM
Oh, I forgot to ask. What color of suits was Artie wearing at the regional, and what will he wear this weekend?
Now I now what you guys have been talking about.

I caught him on the video and he had on this suit that had tails, at least that's how it looked on the radio.

err ... the video

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on March 16, 2006, 02:30:57 PM
http://www.rz.coolfreepage.com/wittbb.html

Arte Taylor daily blog, Larry Hunter comments, comparison of 94 and 06 teams added
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on March 16, 2006, 02:33:07 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 16, 2006, 11:01:25 AM
Oh, I forgot to ask. What color of suits was Artie wearing at the regional, and what will he wear this weekend?

His red cuttin' down nets suit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 16, 2006, 02:34:34 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on March 16, 2006, 02:12:04 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on March 16, 2006, 01:48:25 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 16, 2006, 11:01:25 AM
Oh, I forgot to ask. What color of suits was Artie wearing at the regional, and what will he wear this weekend?
Now I now what you guys have been talking about.

I caught him on the video and he had on this suit that had tails, at least that's how it looked on the radio.

I have the following report on good authority:
Friday - Purple

Saturday -  long bright red suit (with tails)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 16, 2006, 02:41:35 PM
Quote from: witt4ever on March 16, 2006, 02:30:57 PM
http://www.rz.coolfreepage.com/wittbb.html

Arte Taylor daily blog, Larry Hunter comments, comparison of 94 and 06 teams added
This is a great site!

I noticed that Artie worked in a reference to his suits in the blog.

There's a lot of good reading on this site.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 16, 2006, 03:19:40 PM
As in previous years, D3hoopsNet will be broadcasting the entire Final Four, this year in conjunction with Penn Atlantic, which will provide live video coverage.

http://www.d3hoops.com/audio/
http://www.d3hoops.com/salem/06/video.htm

Airtime is 4 p.m. ET on Friday and carries through both games and the postgame news conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 17, 2006, 03:53:59 PM
Good luck to the Tigers this weekend.  I just added CSTV to the other zillion or so channels on my cable lineup, so hopefully I'll get to see them bring the championship back to Ohio tomorrow!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 17, 2006, 04:13:27 PM

Go Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 17, 2006, 05:59:45 PM
Artie is wearing a large-plaid red jacket with red pants.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: aw11 on March 17, 2006, 07:49:38 PM
Go Tigers!!! 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 17, 2006, 07:49:46 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 17, 2006, 03:53:59 PM
Good luck to the Tigers this weekend.  I just added CSTV to the other zillion or so channels on my cable lineup, so hopefully I'll get to see them bring the championship back to Ohio tomorrow!

One more game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: aw11 on March 17, 2006, 07:50:18 PM
Wittenberg WINS! Russ with 26pts!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 17, 2006, 09:18:58 PM
Good luck to Witt. One more game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 17, 2006, 09:30:31 PM
One More Witt, Great D tonight
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: northb on March 17, 2006, 09:40:27 PM
Congrats, Witt--do the GL region proud
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 17, 2006, 09:42:15 PM
Good job Witt!

And it would be neat to see IWU in the finals. Then I could say I saw both final game participants this year, AND that Wabash was 1-1 against them at home!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 17, 2006, 11:33:58 PM
2 Great Games tonight!
I would've liked to see IWU also, but congrats to Va. Wes.
On to tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ADL70 on March 18, 2006, 09:06:13 AM
Anyone know of any places in Columbus or Spfld that have CSTV?  From their web site it looks like they have internet video, but the D3 game isn't listed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 18, 2006, 09:26:52 AM
Great picture of Artie's semifinal outfit at
http://www.pictureprints.net/albums.php?gallery=713&photo=0010
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on March 18, 2006, 09:56:21 AM
Quote from: cwru70 on March 18, 2006, 09:06:13 AM
Anyone know of any places in Columbus or Spfld that have CSTV?  From their web site it looks like they have internet video, but the D3 game isn't listed.

I can't answer your question regarding particular places that carry cstv but you could call area sport bars and ask them if they carry cstv.

In the Columbus area, the channel for cstv is 580.
In the Springfield area, the channel is 149.

This is only available thru Time-Warner Cable digital service.

Directv is channel 610. Cost $12 extra/month.

Dishnetwork is channel 152.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ADL70 on March 18, 2006, 10:09:07 AM
That may help if I call around.  Thanx
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: mybleedinghands on March 18, 2006, 11:02:39 AM
Poll posted on the ODAC board about the championship game: http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4471.msg509685
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 18, 2006, 01:42:03 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on March 18, 2006, 09:26:52 AM
Great picture of Artie's semifinal outfit at
http://www.pictureprints.net/albums.php?gallery=713&photo=0010


:o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on March 18, 2006, 02:01:47 PM
GREAT WIN WITT!!!

Bring it on home!!

Go Witt...go NCAC!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scott_leo on March 18, 2006, 02:33:20 PM
WITTENBERG RADIO COVERAGE

Pre-Game Show starts at 4:00pm

Post-Game Interviews with coaches and players

Listen online here:
http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/broadcast/index.html

or on 89.1 FM in the Springfield area.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 18, 2006, 04:03:38 PM
Go Tigers!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 18, 2006, 04:30:18 PM
The Wittenberg Tigers are on the air!

Go Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 18, 2006, 07:05:15 PM
Amazing finish to a great game.

Congrats to Virginia Wesleyan on the title.

Congratulations to the Tigers on a great year!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 18, 2006, 07:05:54 PM
Congrats to VaWes, but also congrats to Witt on a great season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 18, 2006, 07:07:23 PM
What a great Final 4, all games were close nailbiters!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash on March 18, 2006, 07:09:25 PM
Sorry Witt...good game.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 18, 2006, 07:11:42 PM
Good talking to you and reading your posts TigerFan.

On to Div I Hoops and Baseball, Hope to talk to you next Fall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on March 18, 2006, 07:22:58 PM
Stunning.....
Congrats to the champs.
Thanks for the great ride, Tigers.
Thanks for the great coverage, Pat.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on March 18, 2006, 07:24:30 PM
And thanks for pumping up the mojo, TF '73.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 18, 2006, 07:39:01 PM
Congrats to Witt on a great run!  What a game.  It sounds like one of those games where you hate to see either team lose.  VWU had one hell of a run to close out the season!  They were just in one of those streaks where every game winner they were throwing up was going in for them, especially that Ton Ton guy.  Back to back game winners in the semis and finals.  He also nailed one to beat Lincoln in the Elite 8.  That guy has some serious stones.

Oh well Witt, you did the NCAC and the GL Region proud.  Again, congrats on a great run.  I'm hoping Wooster will be able to make a run like that next year... 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on March 18, 2006, 07:52:58 PM
Congrats to the Champs!!!

Great season Wittenberg Tigers.  Way to go and represent the NCAC and whole GL Region.  We are proud of you!!  I wish I could have been there but U.S. Navy Commitments come first.

Time to start looking at post season honors and next year?

The Dan "DR." Russ for First Team All-American??
What about Cooper for First Team??

Is Vandervaart going to get some help inside next year from Bradley or recruits??

How is Witt going to replace 2 key senior stars??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on March 18, 2006, 07:55:00 PM
Also, I have replay of the Division III finals at 1:00 am (0100) on CSTV on my DirecTV (channel 610).  Set the TiVO and enjoy!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 18, 2006, 08:18:01 PM
Wow.  What a disappointment.  It was a great game (in fact, a great weekend of games), but very disheartening for Witt to come up empty after leading the whole game.  Congratulations to Va. Wesleyan, who hung around and did what they had to do in the end to win.  The Tigers took it hard, especially Dan Russ and Kenny Brady, but they have nothing to hang their heads about.  Both played outstanding all weekend, as did Dane Borchers (Borchers and Russ were named to the all-tournament team) and the rest of the team.

I was sitting two rows behind Artie, decked out in every red thing I could find to wear, and was proud to cheer on my archrivals.  And I'm still proud of them: they represented themselves, their school, and our conference very well.  Congratulations to Bill Brown and the Wittenberg Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on March 18, 2006, 10:12:19 PM
Thanks, DC, you're a true fan, a gentleman and a scholar.
We always appreciate your input and insight.  Your karma is an endorsement of your value to this board.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on March 18, 2006, 11:26:16 PM
Quote from: drt on March 18, 2006, 07:24:30 PM
And thanks for pumping up the mojo, TF '73.
I'm glad I found these discussion boards this year.  I enjoyed all the discussions.

Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gordonmann on March 19, 2006, 02:53:11 AM
Thanks for your contribution, Tiger Fan_1973.

Please invite some more of your Wittenberg faithful to join the fun.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on March 19, 2006, 03:16:01 AM
Gosh it was heartbreaking to see the seniors on the floor after the game, just absolutely weeping.  :'(

I just wanted to step in and thank the Tigers for being a huge part of making this weekend more than worth the five hour plane trip from Cali for the Final Four. They played with heart, and courage, and lost to a very good team at the very last second. I hope in retrospect, the guys can look back at the season and be proud of what they accomplished... second place in all of DIII is nothing to sneeze at.

Congrats to Russ on a great career, and his All-American nod.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 19, 2006, 09:14:33 AM
Congrats to the Tigers on a great season.  It was great to have the NCAC represented in Salem (even if it wasn't the Scots!!)  I've also got the game recorded, but haven't had a chance to watch it yet.  Sounds like it was a good one! 

P.S.  Thanks to the former Scot players that I ran into last night here in Columbus for filling me in on the final from Salem. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 19, 2006, 10:27:33 AM
Congrats to Witt for making the NCAC proud!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: short on March 19, 2006, 10:43:36 AM
Tigers player and fans,

Wow! The Wittenburg Tigers made a GREAT run!  Thanks for making the NCAC and D3 proud.  Wittenburg played hard every time I saw them this past season.  Driving for loose ball and playing in your face Def.  All those player will do well for themselves long after they a done playing. 

Thanks,
Ash Short


P.S. Dan Russ, you play one hell of a game keep your head up!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 19, 2006, 10:59:00 AM
ok guys i just got back from salem and will attempt to offer another witt perspective. First, thanks to everyone for the support of witt during our tournament run, its very easy to root against rivals so they dont look better, but in this case the team played with heart and represented the NCAC well.

what a heartbreaker. i dont think i said a word for at least 2 hours after getting out of there. its almost like you expected it because it was too good to be true. i definitely dont think the better team won last night. unfortunately witt dominated the wrong half of the game and vwu did the right half. it just seemed like vwu stepped up their defense because literally in a flash of an eye our lead was gone and it was tied. the refs made several iffy calls, including one on russ that let them tie up the game but the travel call that set up the game winning shot was legit so dont blame it on that. all in all witt should be proud to say that there was only one team in the nation that was able to say that they finished higher and better than the wittenberg tigers.

this season has been a good one. what does it say that wittenberg dominated the crowd last night with vwu even being an in state school. how many people would have been there for witt if the final four was held in say cleveland. the school has rallied around this team and drawn everyone together.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on March 19, 2006, 11:29:37 AM
Hey Tiger fans,

It was a great effort and I was thoroughly enjoying watching Virginia Wesleyan struggling to score like so many NCAC teams did this year.

The D-3 final was easily the best game of Saturday that I watched, sorry it ended the way it did.

Oh, for the record, I cheered for Wittenberg twice this year while waching/listening to the game live. They were 0-2 in such efforts. Maybe I should have turned the game off at the half with the 10-point lead.

Still, congratulations Wittenberg on a fine year. Honestly, I didn't think Wittenberg had enough to win the NCAC tournament, much less make a run to Salem. And as usaul, I was wrong. Great game again and already I'm looking forward to getting this whole thing started again next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Toph on March 19, 2006, 12:19:23 PM
Congratulations to Witt on one hell of a run, and one hell of a team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 19, 2006, 11:04:01 PM
Congratulations also to Dan Russ for being named to the D3hoops.com All-America second team.  A fitting capstone to a great career for a fine young man.  I presume he'll have opportunities to play professionally overseas if he wants to; does anyone know if he wants to?

Congratulations also to Tom Port (4th team) and James Cooper (HM) for being named to the All-American teams, joining other Great Lakes honorees Brandon Crawford (Albion, 1st team), Tori Davis (B-WC, 2nd team), and Matt Drahos (Bethany, HM). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 19, 2006, 11:23:53 PM
Just got back from Salem this afternoon, and just now getting to the boards now.

Man, did that hurt.

I probably had the closest seat out of most people in the arena (being at the media table) and it was something.  Wittenberg fans, I know how you feel - but try to see that shot and then try and do the radio broadcast for the rest of the game and the postgame show.  Honestly, I have never found it harder to find words to actually be able to speak and form coherent sentences.

I heard a lot of people say that they would rather have seen it coming the whole time (like, constantly being down instead of leading the whole way and losing at the last second), and I'm not quite sure if I agree, but losing the way we did was probably the most painful way it could have happened.

We can talk about all the little things - Russ getting poked in the eye at the end of the first half (if was clearly an accident, I hold noone at fault as he was just going for a block), the inability to hit free throws down the stretch, or the little push off on Balenga's game-winner, but the fact of the matter is that Wittenberg played the second half like they were only playing to protect the lead, and they didn't.  Kudos to Va Wesleyan for playing a stellar 2nd half and for using that pressure defense to really throw our offense for a loop, and to Balenga for hitting an amazing shot.  Even though I am Wittenberg through and through, you cannot deny the great story that Va. Wesleyan gave us - not being given a shot, first trip to the final four, reeling off 28 straight wins; just unbelievable.  I went to Salem expecting to watch some good basketball, and I left Salem having watched four GREAT games.

Congrats to Russ and Borchers for all their postseason accolades - they were all well deserved.  Just wish we could have sent them out with a little jewelry.

Congrats to the Tigers, the seniors, to Coach Brown, to all the fans who supported the team (both at home and especially in Salem), and thanks for a wonderful season.  For somebody who went to a high school that didn't have athletics, this was a really special ride to be a part of, even if I only was a fan/broadcaster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on March 20, 2006, 10:36:20 AM
Congrats to Witt on a terrific year!!

It was an extremely hard loss but 30-4 is certainly nothing to be ashamed of.

I talked to with DR's Dad and he alluded to the fact that Dan was going to try and play in Europe if he can.

Again, way to make the NCAC proud!!

I am sure Denison will do the same next year!! :-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldguy on March 20, 2006, 01:16:57 PM
I was able to make it to Salem for the game and I just want to say how proud I am to be a Tiger.  Yes, the way the game turned out was tough to take, but they played hard and had a great season.  It was good to see the strong support at the game. 

I hope there is similar success next season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on March 21, 2006, 02:43:49 PM
Congrats to the Tigers!!!  You guys have so much to be proud of.  As a player, back in the day, I had an extreme hatred for Wittenberg but, looking back, it was probably brought on by the fact that they kicked our butts alot.  Now, quite a few years removed, I have developed a high level of respect for the Tigers because of the continuous string of successfull seasons they have been able to put together.  You guys have made the entire conference proud.  Now the worst part of the year.......the off-season.  Thanks to everyone for a fun and exciting season of NCAC basketball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 21, 2006, 04:18:17 PM
Noooo!  Run away from the light, bishopsfan!  It's not too late!   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 21, 2006, 06:15:47 PM
Congrats on being so high up on the pick 'em board Wally, I can tell you or Pennstghs (#20) didn't cheat off of me. As i was way on down the list.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 21, 2006, 09:07:24 PM
zoso thanks for the props-if witt woulda pulled it out i woulda been a little higher :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 21, 2006, 09:34:30 PM
The NABC has also released its All-America teams (http://nabc.collegesports.com/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/032106aai.html).  It is clear at a glance that the process is to name one player from each region to each of three teams, meaning that there are just 3 GL players among the 24 All-Americans (as opposed to 6 of 25 on this site's teams).  It is a peculiar way to select All-Americans, and they have made some peculiar choices to boot (such as naming Lincoln's Kyle Myrick, the D3hoops.com national player of the year, to the third team).  Nevertheless, these awards claim to be nominated and voted on by member coaches of the NABC, so at a minimum it shows that these players have the respect of at least some of the coaches.  (Plus, since this same organization named Bryan Nelson its POY a few years back, I can't bad-mouth it too much! ;))

With that caveat, congratulations to Wooster's James Cooper, named to the NABC All-America 3rd team!  The other GL players were Brandon Crawford (1st team) and Tori Davis (2nd team). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 22, 2006, 12:18:07 AM
Thanks zosobob.  I got lucky with Virginia Wesleyan winning it all.  They were hot going into the tournament, had a pretty favorable draw, and then had a virtual home court advantage in Salem.  That was my premise for picking them to win it all.  I had North Central, Va Wesleyan, Amherst, and Hope in my final four.  I had assumed Hope would host through the national quarterfinals...that they didn't torpedoed that pick. 

But anyway, it's all really a total crapshoot with the D-III bracket.  Without getting to actually see teams from other regions play and not knowing exactly where the sectional sites are going to be held, anybody's guess is as good as mine.  I'm just as likely to finish as close to the bottom as I am to the top. 

Now if I could only transfer some of my points here into my office pool for D-I tourney.... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 22, 2006, 08:24:03 AM
Just FYI, I don't think it's accurate to say that Va. Wesleyan had a "virtual home court advantage."  I anticipated that, too, but as it happens their crowd was no bigger (and less loud) than IWU's, and not substantially bigger than Witt's.  I think Hope would have also drawn at least as well as VWC had they been there.  It's an easier drive and a more familiar location for Marlin fans, but I don't think the passion runs as deep in the ODAC as it does for certain of the midwest teams.  Now, VWC probably did have an advantage in terms of familiarity with the arena (e.g., dead spots on the floor, sight lines, etc.), but I'm not sure how much that was worth.  I don't think the "home court advantage" played a significant role in the outcomes.

Nevertheless, you greatly outpicked me, so I bow before you!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 22, 2006, 10:41:13 AM
For anyone interested, Wooster finished the season ranked #9 in the final D3hoops.com poll.  This keeps their streak of being ranked in the top 10 intact at least until next year. 8)  I'm not sure what that streak is, I just remember DC giving us some stats on current streaks involving the D3hoops Top 25.  I wasn't sure that they would be able to keep the streak alive after their loss in the 2nd round to Transy.  I figured they needed at least one more win to keep the streak going, but to my pleasant surprise, they snuck in just barely.  And with all that Wooster has returning, I would say it is a pretty safe bet Wooster will be fairly high in the top 10 when the pre-season rankings come out next year to keep the top 10 streak going for a while.   ;)

ps,  DC, is there any chance we could get the final tallies on what streaks are going on with the poll at season's end?  ie, who's got the longest streak of receiving votes, who's got the longest top 10 streak going, etc?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 22, 2006, 10:50:41 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 22, 2006, 10:41:13 AM
ps,  DC, is there any chance we could get the final tallies on what streaks are going on with the poll at season's end?  ie, who's got the longest streak of receiving votes, who's got the longest top 10 streak going, etc?

http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4097.1416
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on March 22, 2006, 12:35:43 PM
Wally-
No need to worry I will never go completely into the light and actually call myself a Wittenberg fan but this season has helped me develop more of a respect for them.  They were a heck of a team this year, no ifs, ands or buts about it.  Congrats again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on March 22, 2006, 12:40:42 PM
one more point-
After seeing Tori Davis play earlier this year at Wooster, I think it is a crock that he was named NABC second team all-american.  Being a fan of the NCAC does not stop me from saying that Tori Davis was the best player that I saw all season and definitely deserved to be the player of the year in the great lakes region.  I think he had something like 44 points against Wooster.  That is something that just does not happen very often.  Just wondering if anyone else had any comments on the NABC all-american teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 22, 2006, 12:50:27 PM
actualy i beg to differ with two points

1-the witt crowd actually OUTNUMBERED the vwu crwod in the championship game on saturday

2-russ being left off the NABC teams is a crock-they show that they are not reliable as coaches dont get to see all the players all year
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 22, 2006, 02:09:53 PM
Quote from: bishopsfan on March 22, 2006, 12:40:42 PM
one more point-
After seeing Tori Davis play earlier this year at Wooster, I think it is a crock that he was named NABC second team all-american.

Quote from: pennstghs on March 22, 2006, 12:50:27 PM
actualy i beg to differ with two points

2-russ being left off the NABC teams is a crock-they show that they are not reliable as coaches dont get to see all the players all year

Man, with all these crocks going around, we really need something to put them in . . . like a crock pot.   ::)

Sorry, I couldn't resist.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 22, 2006, 06:32:08 PM
yeah we could prolly make a whole potful of whinings about things that didnt go right with teams this year if we wanted to
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 23, 2006, 08:20:08 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 22, 2006, 12:50:27 PM
2-russ being left off the NABC teams is a crock-they show that they are not reliable as coaches dont get to see all the players all year

While I agree with this, do you really feel it is quite possible for coaches in the NABC to take the necessary time out of their already busy schedules to look at film of all likely AA candidates.  I would imagine the reason Cooper got the nod is strictly based on the fact that he was NCAC POY and also led the NCAC in scoring.  Crawford was MIAA POY and Davis was OAC POY, so Cooper was a pretty obvious choice following that trend.  If DC's explaination of how the NABC goes about selecting it's representatives, ie, selecting one representative from each region on each team, I'd say they did a fair job.  Do I agree totally with their process or their selections?  No, I'm just saying there were a lot of worthy candidates that got left off, so ripping the NABC for not putting your guy on the list isn't exactly the fair thing to do.  It's not like it's easy whittling down players from over 400 colleges to just 3 AA teams.  To me, it seems like they go by stats more than anything in their criteria for selection, which seems to be the easiest way to go about it for the voters when they have so many selections to choose from and so little time to actually research who they are voting for.  Heck, IWU had two 1st teamers on the D3hoops AA team and niether one made it to the NABC 1st, 2nd or 3rd team.  Just be happy that Russ got the recognition he deserved from D3hoops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 23, 2006, 10:47:48 AM
true-i will credit the d3hoops.com staff for voting russ on the second team. i guess the impact russ has doesnt always show up in the stats. he led our team to second place in the nation
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 23, 2006, 04:06:47 PM
That's very true penn.  Russ may not have the stats, but he has proven his value to Witt by how he led the Tigers to within a bucket of winning it all.  He's a class act and this Wooster fan will not miss how he seemed to turn it up a notch or three every time out against Wooster.  ;)  As much as Witt will miss Russ' skills on the basketball court, they will miss his leadership even more.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 23, 2006, 05:14:54 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 23, 2006, 10:47:48 AM
true-i will credit the d3hoops.com staff for voting russ on the second team. i guess the impact russ has doesnt always show up in the stats. he led our team to second place in the nation

Against Hope I bet he tapped at least a half dozen rebounds out to teamates.........those are rebounds he doesn't get credit for even though he made the play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 24, 2006, 09:59:15 AM
Sac -

Technically, he should have gotten the rebound if it was a controlled tip. At Wabash, we always try to credit a controlled tip with a rebound. Now if he tipped it and it bounced a couple of times and a teammate picked it up, not so much.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on March 25, 2006, 01:21:26 AM
 Just thought I'd post my thoughts on the Division 1 games the past 2 nights. I can't remember the last time there were so many great finishes to games on consecutive nights and teams that were so evenly matched across the board.  Can't wait for the weekend games! BUT, I also can't remember an NCAA tourney weekend where the officiating has been any poorer. There's just bad call after bad call and despite what you may or may not think about what role officials play in basketball, any basketball fan that watched or commentated or analyzed these games has brought up the lack of quality by the officials. It really is disheartening to me to watch these college athletes leave it all on the floor for 37 or 38 minutes and the games usually be tied or 1 point either way, and then have the officials make GAME CHANGING calls in the last 2 minutes of the games that end their careers as student athletes. I feel some remorse for Duke, more for Gonzaga and even more for Washington. The only close game that was halfway decently officiated was WVU/Texas. I know from first-hand experience that officials can ruin basketball careers, so my hearts go out to the athletes that are experiencing the pain I went through last year. Let's hope the NCAA gets it right tomorrow and Sunday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 25, 2006, 08:28:11 AM
The refs in the UConn - Washington game were NCAC refs, I swear!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 25, 2006, 12:43:01 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 25, 2006, 08:28:11 AM
The refs in the UConn - Washington game were NCAC refs, I swear!

:D

*golf clap*
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 25, 2006, 01:40:53 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 25, 2006, 08:28:11 AM
The refs in the UConn - Washington game were NCAC refs, I swear!

I was going to say, jokingly and sarcastically, that they then had the best refs that money can buy.  However, that statement works much better for cars or wine than for basketball officials.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zosobob on March 25, 2006, 11:12:48 PM
2 more good games today. Half of the Final 4 set.
Hopefully 2 more good games tomorrow.




             LMAWFE.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 30, 2006, 03:32:52 PM
Hot off the press....

http://www.oberlin.edu/athletic/varsity/m_basketball/Default.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on April 08, 2006, 01:21:13 AM
Smeds, you might be interested to know that I just completed a cross-country drive (from Millersburg to LA, something like 3200 miles or so) during which I never got on a blue-signed interstate highway.  All highways and byways, no interstates.  It's harder than it ought to be to do this, especially in Arizona where it seems that a number of old US Highways (like US 66) have been subsumed by the Interstate Highway System (in this case, I-40). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on April 08, 2006, 01:24:52 AM
Wow... tell more. I've often been tempted to take the non-I routes on my various D-III trips, but am almost always in too much of a hurry. The only recent exception was that I took U.S. 40 to Washington & Jefferson for a football playoff game a couple of years ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on April 08, 2006, 02:04:54 AM
You can't be in a hurry, that's Rule #1.  Rule #2 is that you have to have a plan for the day; at least, that's true in the West.  In the East, you usually have a variety of choices of how to get from Point A to Point B, but that's not always true out here.  For example, I went to the Grand Canyon yesterday, but had to backtrack a little bit to Flagstaff to spend the night; the main highway south from G.C.N.P. leads to Williams, but from there you have little choice but to get on I-40.  From Flagstaff, I had options.

It was worth it.  This is a remarkably beautiful country.  There are beautiful stretches of interstates (Glenwood Canyon in Colorado on I-70 immediately comes to mind), but nothing to compare to roads like the Natchez Trace, or Indiana's State Route 66, or the Million Dollar Highway in Colorado, or State Route 89A in Arizona, all of which I took on this particular trip. 

It took me 9 days to get from Indianapolis (where I went to visit a friend as the first stage of the trip) to LA; it would have been 10, but I got shut out of the campgrounds at Joshua Tree National Park this afternoon and decided to just finish up.  I don't drive after dusk, and do drive the speed limit, so obviously I wasn't in a hurry.  Unemployment has its privileges!  :) :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on April 08, 2006, 02:16:10 AM
I'm with David in spirit, but admit I am not as much of a purist.  Non-expressways are nearly always more interesting, but in some parts of the country they are SO much slower that I can't resist the interstate.

Going Ypsi to Maine, it's about 50-50.  Going Ypsi to Cali, it's about 2/3 other highways (thru much of the west, there ain't much diference in the speed you can go!).

Unlike David, I go with what I'm guessing the cops will tolerate, rather than the posted speed limit. ;D  And in some areas (the Dakotas, for example), I figure the likelihood of a cop is pretty slim.  So far, I've been right (though my wife got ticketed just south of Fargo!).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on April 10, 2006, 05:28:11 AM
David, you are the William Least Heat-Moon of D3 ... without the faux Indian name, of course.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: SBell on April 11, 2006, 11:14:50 AM
Wooster recruiting the No. 8 kid on this list ...

http://www.mlive.com/weblogs/hsbasketball/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: SBell on April 11, 2006, 11:48:32 AM
Actually, No. 9, Battista.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on April 13, 2006, 02:52:56 PM
The best way to feel isolated is to drive 2 lane highways across the Great Plains.  You can litteraly drive for miles without seeing another person.

Last summer I took a trip to Wyoming, Montana and Alberta.  Once I got past Grand Island, Nebraska (neither Grand nor an Island  ;D) It was all two lane highways to Jackson, Wyo and up to Butte, Montana.

2 lane roads allow you to stop when ever you feel like it to enjoy some scenery, which is plentifull in our vast country.  But it adds a lot of time to your trip for sure.  I really don't think you can make it across Nebraska in a single day on 2 lane roads.  ;D

I  went through a town in Wyoming that had a population of.......1.


David I've done the cross country road trip 3 times now, and its better every time.  My favorite leg  took me from Flagstaff to Monument Valley  across to Cedar City Utah and Zion Naiton Park, and up to Moab and Arches NP.  Fantastic.

My next trip will hopefully be a long leisurely drive from Alaska to San Diego.

Like David said don't be in a hurry. 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on April 13, 2006, 08:48:30 PM
sac,

The two-lane roads only add time if there are a) a lot of towns to slow you down, and/or b) you pay attention to speed limits!  I'd agree that for Nebraska, there is no reason NOT to take I-80 (at least to Oglalla where, depending on where you're headed, you may wish to switch to I-76 or US 26) - it closely follows the Platte River so is as scenic as the two-lanes (did I just use 'scenic' and 'Nebraska' in the same sentence? :o)!

Elsewhere in the west, you can safely take even the unpaved 'ranch' roads at any speed you desire, since you will rarely encounter another vehicle (and as long as it hasn't rained in the last ten minutes, you will see them for miles ahead by the dust plume!), and NEVER see a cop (they would die of boredom!) - in other words, get off the e-way and see the REAL west (your choice of 20 or 80 miles an hour ;D)!

Offer void in certain 'tourist areas'! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on April 13, 2006, 09:04:25 PM
Western Nebraska is actually pretty scenic.....a drive through the sand hills with its rolling peaks of grass covered hills, with huge ranches might change your mind.

You can visit the Nebraska National Forest, which is the only planted National Forest in the US.  There is also the must see Carhenge outside Alliance.  Its a circle of old cars painted grey in the shape of Stonehenge, kind of cool actually.  There 's also a few other artsy "exhibits" there that were interesting.

I found Chadron to be an interesting place, the day I was there it was very dusty and hazy..........I later found out the dust was from the acres of wheat being harvested. :o
There are also a few Indian historical sights in the area.  There's a wild horse sanctuary just north of Chadron in South Dakota.

I would hop in my car in a second and drive West if I could.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on April 13, 2006, 09:28:28 PM
Speaking on behalf of the millions of residents of rural America, if you are planning to drive 80 mph, please stay on the interstate.  If the small towns and deputy sheriffs don't slow you down, the bends in the road, motorized farm equipment, open range livestock, and uneven road surface should do the trick.  Anyway, if the point of being on the "blue highway" is because it is more scenic, why race through it so quickly that you can't enjoy it?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on April 13, 2006, 10:41:28 PM
David,

Fear not for the 'diminishing' residents of the Plains - I do NOT drive 80 (anything over 65 is only if my visibility is AT LEAST 2 miles).  Just making the point that non-eways are not NECESSARILY much slower than eways in much of the west.  (Though the appeal is that they CAN be MUCH slower.)

sac,

Good point - I was thinking mainly of eastern Nebraska.  I can't think of ANY state that does't have SOME appealing areas, whatever it's general reputation may be.  Even New Jersey (probably the most derided state) has the extreme north (whether the Palisades in the east, or the 'mountains' to the west, not to mention the Pine Barrens which are quite appealing to some of us); Illinois is mostly not my cup of tea, but some of the areas along both the Mississippi and Illinois Rivers (not to mention much of the south) are incredibly attractive; most of Iowa is regarded as pretty bleak, but the northeast is often referred to as 'Little Switzerland' and the Okiboji area is often termed the 'Great Lakes of Iowa' region.  Even North Dakota (perhaps the second most derided state) has gorgeous areas especially in Teddy Roosevelt National Park, but also along some parts of the Missouri, and in the far east along the Red River.

And, of course, one person's 'bleak landscape' may well be another's 'wide-open spaces'.

I'll have to retract something I said above - THE most derided state has got to be Kansas.  Even 'The Wizard of Oz' trashed it: in Oz, everything is in Technicolor, but it is all black-and-white in Kansas.  I've only been through Kansas twice, and confess I haven't yet seen anything to disprove the attacks, but I bet even they have SOME areas that are well worth seeing!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on April 14, 2006, 09:03:38 AM
Back to something non-travelling related for a moment:

The Indianapolis Star has a report this morning that Rose-Hulman is leaving the SCAC to join the HCAC. What does this mean for DePauw? Will they stay with the SCAC without RHIT or will they be looking for a new home? Will they consider the HCAC, now a 9-team league, or maybe the NCAC (currently 10 teams)?

This is an interesting development.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on April 14, 2006, 10:13:50 AM
Yeah, that was official about a year ago. DePauw has said nothing about leaving the SCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on April 14, 2006, 10:35:48 AM
I knew it sounded familiar, although the Indy press is only picking it up now. Duh. I'll just go back to my work now.  :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on April 18, 2006, 09:13:39 AM
Some Earlham related news confirmed this weekend:

Markous Jewett will return for his final year of eligibility.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on April 19, 2006, 08:27:00 AM
geez....how many years of eligibility does he have.  Is seems like he has been there forever (hahahaha)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on April 19, 2006, 03:04:22 PM
Jewett's career:

02-03: Freshman season at Earlham
03-04: Sophomore season at Earlham
04-05: Spent first semester at Ball State as a transfer walk-on; attended Earlham during the second semester and did not play basketball
05-06: Junior season at Earlham (though he did participate in senior day cermonies as he was unsure of what was ahead for the next year)
06-07: Senior season at Earlham

But yea, he has been in Richmond forever....like more than 22 years
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bishopsfan on April 21, 2006, 08:54:41 AM
Any recruiting news out of any of the NCAC schools?  It has been interesting following the MIAA recruiting through their message board and it has been interesting that there has been very little chatter on this board?  I would start the conversation but I have not heard any news out of Delaware.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on April 25, 2006, 11:22:30 AM
Quote from: bishopsfan on April 21, 2006, 08:54:41 AM
Any recruiting news out of any of the NCAC schools? It has been interesting following the MIAA recruiting through their message board and it has been interesting that there has been very little chatter on this board? I would start the conversation but I have not heard any news out of Delaware.

bf,  I visited JJHuddle.com with the hopes of finding some recruiting news for any Ohio DIII schools and wasn't able to find anything.  One interesting tidbit I did come across was in regards to COW alum Erich Riebe resigning as the head basketball coach at a local high school (Applecreek, Waynedale HS).  It was rumored that he might be joining Steve Moore's staff next season.  I don't know if this is true, but he would be a great addition to the bench next season for the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on April 26, 2006, 10:37:52 AM
Per today's Wooster Daily Record, former COW guard Nate Gaubatz has stepped down as an assistant at Wooster HS to join Steve Moore as an assistant.  He should be a nice addition to the coaching staff.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on April 26, 2006, 03:09:08 PM
One wonders where these coaching vacancies on the Wooster bench are coming from.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on April 27, 2006, 11:59:31 AM
It could be the fact that Wooster had 2 grad assistants on the bench last year.  Maybe Coach Moore is filling those spots?  Just a thought...

Also, I don't believe Coach Smith's spot was filled last season either.  From the way it was rumored, Riebe would fill in like Smitty was on the bench if the rumor is true at all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on May 01, 2006, 11:11:17 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on April 25, 2006, 11:22:30 AM
One interesting tidbit I did come across was in regards to COW alum Erich Riebe resigning as the head basketball coach at a local high school (Applecreek, Waynedale HS).  It was rumored that he might be joining Steve Moore's staff next season.  I don't know if this is true, but he would be a great addition to the bench next season for the Scots.

I did hear this weekend the Reibe will be joining the Scots coaching staff next season.  With Reibe, Gaubatz, Mitchell, and Cline they've almost got enough on their staff to field a decent team.  Although, Doug may not quite be in playing shape these days!

I also heard that there were a couple of recruits down for the Rebounders golf outing this weekend, including at least 1 big man from Michigan who was also looking at Hope.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on May 01, 2006, 11:20:02 AM
RIP Derek Poe.

I have decided to lay to rest the 'imderekpoe' user name and go back to my original 'cmhscots'.  (I guess I just got tire of being referred to as Derek!)

For anyone who cares (and I can't imagine who that would be!), I use 'imderekpoe' on the the messageboard for the english rock group Muse.  'imderekpoe' is an anagram for 'pere d'emiko' which is french for Emiko's Dad.  My daughter uses 'emiko45' on that messageboard, and it seemed appropriate based on some anagram-related stuff going on there at the time that I set it up.

Mike
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: SBell on May 02, 2006, 06:41:44 AM
Dex Battista, 6-8 from Utica, Mich., to Wooster. One of the best big men in Michigan -- averaged double-double at a Class A (biggest) school.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on May 02, 2006, 07:58:39 AM
Thanks for the good news SBell!  Wooster has been in dire needs of a decent big man since the graduation of Schlingman.  I wonder if he will be able to step in right away and make an immediate impact.

Quote from: cmhscots on May 01, 2006, 11:11:17 AM

I did hear this weekend the Reibe will be joining the Scots coaching staff next season.  With Reibe, Gaubatz, Mitchell, and Cline they've almost got enough on their staff to field a decent team.  Although, Doug may not quite be in playing shape these days!


Don't forget about asst. coach Patrick Rufener.  He played for Denison.  He could round out the assistant's starting five. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: SBell on May 02, 2006, 11:49:27 AM
According to this he should make an impact ... of course, I have it on the closest authorit that the author hasn't seen Wooster play since 1996 ...

http://www.mlive.com/weblogs/hsbasketball/index.ssf?/mtlogs/mlive_hsbasketball/archives/2006_05.html#136854
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on May 02, 2006, 12:23:50 PM
Closest authority indeed...thanks to Steve for the tip, which I have reported to the recruting part of the Daily Dose (http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/) blog.

Waynedale has a senior named Ryan Besancon who (according to reports in the DR; I never saw him) had a pretty good season, leading Waynedale to a WCAL crown.  He's tallish (like 6'6" or better), and I filed him away in the back of my mind as a possible recruit, given that Erich Riebe was his coach.  Now that Riebe is a member of what has to be the largest assistant coaching staff in D3, I wonder if Besancon is headed for the Hill?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on May 02, 2006, 06:21:22 PM
I've seen Besancon and he is a pretty nice player indeed.  I haven't heard anyting on where he might be headed for college, but I'm sure Riebe has done his best to steer him Wooster's way.  I noticed this past season that he was in attendance at quite a few of the Scot's games.  This got me thinking back then that he might be considering Wooster.  Now that Riebe's going to be on the Scot's bench, that could make it all the easier for Besanson to choose Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on May 08, 2006, 12:26:41 PM
A key thing about Battista is that he played in Michigan's largest Division (class A). From the one picture that I saw, he looks a little thin but it looks like he like to rebound!!

Some more information on Dex Battista:

First Team ALL-EAST - Detriot Free Press - Stats/Comments from the coach:
Macomb Area Conference Red Division MVP. Averaged 17 points, 10.5 rebounds and had 13 double-doubles. Coach Gerry Kraemer: "He's a complete player. He plays both ends of the floor and handled the basketball a lot for us. ... Because he knew the double teams were coming, he became a great passer for us. He's one of the most unselfish people I've ever coached."

First Team ALL-EAST - Detriot News - A three-year starter, Battista was named MVP of the Macomb Area Conference Red Division. This season he averaged 17.1 points, 10.5 rebounds, 1.3 assists and one block.
      In Utica's 64-51 victory over Utica Ford in the first round of the Class A districts, Battista had 16 points and 10 rebounds. He showed consistency throughout the season.
      "He's an all-around player," coach Gerry Kraemer said. "He can handle the ball and can score inside and out."
       Battista is being recruiting by Division II and III schools, including Hope.

2006 Associated Press: Class A All-State basketball team Honorable Mention

Honorable Mention All Metro - Detriot Free Press (all divisions)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on May 08, 2006, 04:59:11 PM
WoosterFAN,

Do you have a link to that picture of Battista?  I was looking for a picture of him, but couldn't find one.

Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on May 09, 2006, 01:30:47 PM
Here is the link:
http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060323/SPORTS05/603230339/1004/SPORTS

Any other news on prospective new players?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on May 10, 2006, 07:35:15 AM
Nice article on Kyle Witucky

http://athletics.wooster.edu/spotlights/2005-06/witucky.php

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on May 31, 2006, 01:59:41 AM
I heard over the weekend that, besides Battista, the Scots have at least 2 other big men coming in the fall.  I don't remember the details, but I know that they are both from Ohio.  I think that maybe one is from the Dayton area and the other possibly from the Mt. Vernon area.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on June 02, 2006, 02:21:12 PM
Congratulations to Big John Ellenwood, named the new head men's coach at Thomas More.  Here's the full story in Notables. (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables.php)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 02, 2006, 11:23:40 PM
Another recruit for Coach Moore and the Scots!  :)

From the Pittsburgh Tribune Review newspaper:

Fox Chapel High School (PA) senior Rob Tenenini has made a verbal commitment to play basketball at the College of Wooster in Ohio.  The 6'4" swingman, who played everywhere from the point to the post, averaged 16.5 points and 9 rebounds a game for the Foxes last season.

"He's probably the best kept secret in the Western Pennsylvania Interscholastic Athletic League (WPIAL)," Fox Chapel Coach Ben O'Connor said of Tenenini, who is a high honors student.  "He's by far the best all-around athlete I've coached."

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 03, 2006, 12:43:28 AM
cmhscots -- the big man joining the Scots from the Mt. Vernon area is:

6'8" Robert Melick, Mt. Vernon High School

Selected as Academic All-Ohio Division I
3.56 GPA and averaged 14.5 PPG this past season
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on June 04, 2006, 09:52:25 AM
Sounds like Wooster is hauling in a pretty good class from what I've seen and heard so far.  This could be one of the tallest recruiting classes Wooster has had in quite some time.

Anyone have any news on any other NCAC schools and how they are fairing in the recuiting business?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 11, 2006, 11:59:16 PM
A nice tribute was held on Saturday for former Wooster head coach Al Van Wie.  Here is the article from today's newspaper.

SUNDAY  JUNE 11, 2006 

Alums return to immortalize the Dutchman
By JOHN FINN
Special to The Daily Record
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

WOOSTER - A generation of former basketball players came together at The College of Wooster's Timken Gymnasium on Saturday to pay tribute to legendary head coach Al Van Wie. The "Dutchman," who guided the Scots to 303 victories between 1961 and 1982, was immortalized with a bronze bust, which will take up permanent residence in Wooster's Armington Physical Education Center.

"It's overwhelming," said Van Wie. "To think that these guys came from far and wide to be here today. The word 'awesome' just doesn't do justice to the way I feel."

Organized by Tim Baab, a 19 71 grad, and Chuck Cooper (��), who were members of Van Wie's first championship team in 1971, the Saturday afternoon ceremony was attended by fans, friends, and former players, including Larry Shyatt (��), now an assistant coach at the University of Florida, which captured the Div. I national championship in April.

"He taught us how to carry over what we learned on the court to what we would face in life," said Shyatt of his former mentor. "As players, we all have a piece of him inside us."

Baab and Cooper expressed similar sentiments.

"A lot of us realized what he has done for us, and we wanted to honor him for it," said Baab. "It was long overdue."

Added Cooper, "He made a difference in my life, and I know he made a difference in the lives of a whole lot of others."

Tom Dinger (��), Wooster's all-time leading scorer, said that he liked Van Wie from the moment the two met and that they had a mutual respect for one another. He also expressed a common sentiment among the players when he said that most of them appreciated their former coach even more after they graduated.

"When I became a coach, I realized that I was doing many of the same things he did," said Dinger. "He has been a very special person in my life."

Sam Dixon (��), who helped lead Wooster to three consecutive 20-win seasons, said "It was an honor to play for coach Van Wie. He has done tremendous things for me. I trust him completely, and I know I can always count on him."

Reggie Minton (��), former head coach at the United States Air Force Academy and emcee for Saturday's ceremony, said that Van Wie was "singularly responsible" for getting him through school.

"I wasn't sure if I wanted to be at Wooster; I wasn't sure if I wanted to stay," said Minton. "Coach provided guidance for me. I was always treated as though I was part of the family."

Family was the focus of Van Wie's remarks/

"I am surrounded by people I truly care about and love," he said. "You are all part of our extended family. We have been very blessed."

Baab hopes the bust will become part of a new tradition.

"Notre Dame has its sign; Clemson has its rock; now Wooster has its bust," he said. "We hope to place its somewhere that athletes, coaches, and fans can rub it for good luck."



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on June 14, 2006, 12:52:19 PM
Quote from: sac on April 13, 2006, 02:52:56 PM
My next trip will hopefully be a long leisurely drive from Alaska to San Diego.

Not to make a post waaaay after the fact or anything.... but...  :D

Me too, though your idea sounds better. I was planning on hopping over to Glacier rather than going to Alaska. I just have to find someone to go with me, and figure out how to get that much time off of work. I may be able to hit Crater Lake, and Redwoods NP during a July trip for work to Portland (6 hrs? no sweat, hehe) which was an important component of that trip, but the coast drive is supposed to be so pretty, I'm probably still gonna want to do it. Incidentally, if you do come this way, and don't stop by to say hi, I'm gonna eat you. :D

On my move out to Cali, I definitely took the scenic route, to visit a friend in Missouri and Colorado Springs, and to hit a bunch of National Parks.... and then there was the trouble my car had getting over the Rockies full of my junk and the Tow back to Denver.

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.spogg.com%2Fmembers%2Fshow-image.php%3Fmember%3Daprilrainsong%26amp%3Bid%3D58%26amp%3Bkey%3D71517&hash=8f0e5d3fe083728e5e7e9bf2e010ad0c1785348f)

:D A little less than 4000 miles (or was it more?) from Lincolnton, NC to Temecula, CA.


But we did it in 6 days.  :D :o :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on June 15, 2006, 05:00:10 PM
Life's too short to not do it April

Glacier was easily my second favorite part of my trip last year, just seeing clear bluegreen water come down the mountains was enough.

If you go to Glacier you might as well go to Banff in Canada, although a little crowded and Europeanish (you'll likely be one of the few speaking English, including the Canadians ;D) its worth the trip and then some.  Is only about 5-6 hours north of Glacier and Calgary is a nice city to visit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on June 25, 2006, 12:27:22 PM
To my knowledge, Wooster has not announced their schedule for 2006-07, but at least one game snuck into today's Daily Record.  Wooster will host NAIA power and Wittenberg rival Cedarville U. on Dec. 16.  This game will be the capstone of day 1 of the Steve Smith Classic, a 7-game boys' HS hoops festival.

I don't know anything else about the Scots' schedule, except that Calvin College is coming down for the Mose Hole Classic (a fact confirmed by Calvin's schedule (http://www.calvin.edu/sports/mbasket/schedule.htm).)  If anyone else has any information on upcoming NCAC schedules, please post!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on June 26, 2006, 07:06:42 AM
The OAC-NCAC Challenge this year has Kenyon vs Capital and Muskingum vs Denison on 11/25 at Denison with the opponents switched at Muskingum on the 26th.

I also found a couple of Witt games: Home vs Transy and on the road against Capital.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on June 27, 2006, 10:45:58 AM
One thing I would love to see Wooster do with their basketball schedule is to play doubleheaders, with the women's game preceding the men's game.

The women don't draw many fans on their own, but if they were given a 5 PM start to the men's 7 PM, for one admission, I think that would give them some exposure.

I saw this done down at OWU last season when I went to the Wooster men's game there, although the Wooster women weren't involved, it was OWU vs Denision.  Still, it was enjoyable to see two ballgames in one session and I'd love to see Wooster catch on to the concept.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on June 27, 2006, 11:42:31 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on June 27, 2006, 10:45:58 AM
One thing I would love to see Wooster do with their basketball schedule is to play doubleheaders, with the women's game preceding the men's game.



Hope did this a handfull of times last year and it was a success.  Good exposure, I'd say alot of Hope fans learned their ladies could play some good basketball.....including me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on June 27, 2006, 08:16:35 PM
Quote from: sac on June 27, 2006, 11:42:31 AM

Hope did this a handfull of times last year and it was a success.  Good exposure, I'd say alot of Hope fans learned their ladies could play some good basketball.....including me.


Problem is, Wooster's ladies aren't known for playing good basketball. ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on June 28, 2006, 02:25:25 AM
all of the UAA league games are like that and its pretty sweet...definately gets attendance up and brings fans to appreciate both teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 30, 2006, 12:01:50 AM
Wittenberg has posted their 2006-2007 schedule:

Tigers open with a tournament in Philadelphia (Trinity, CT; Swarthmore, Haverford).

Witt also plays AT Capital (11/22), AT Ohio Northern (12/19) and AT Otterbein (12/21).

Witt's holiday tourney (12/29-30) opponents are: IU-Southeast, York from NY, Thiel

Wooster plays AT Witt on Saturday, December 9th

Witt plays AT Wooster on Saturday, February 3rd


I also found two more Wooster opponents this season:

Mt. Union will play in the Al Van Wie Tip-Off tourney

Along with Calvin, UW LaCrosse will play in the Mose Hole tourney

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on July 02, 2006, 10:26:56 AM
Wittenberg's recruits :

http://www.rz.coolfreepage.com/wittbbrecruits06.jpg




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on July 02, 2006, 08:01:05 PM
witt4ever,

FYI, I'm not having any luck opening the link you supplied for the Witt recruits.  A page pops up that says I don't have access to this document?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jdean on July 02, 2006, 08:47:52 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on June 30, 2006, 12:01:50 AM
I also found two more Wooster opponents this season:

Mt. Union will play in the Al Van Wie Tip-Off tourney

Along with Calvin, UW LaCrosse will play in the Mose Hole tourney

GO SCOTS!!

Mt Union?? Wooster must want to assure a fast start to their season to schedule Mount. Mount has some decent G's but with the post graduating you should kill them on the boards.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: witt4ever on July 03, 2006, 09:00:57 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on July 02, 2006, 08:01:05 PM
witt4ever,

FYI, I'm not having any luck opening the link you supplied for the Witt recruits.  A page pops up that says I don't have access to this document?

ScotsFan,

Try it now. Let me know if it still does not work. Thanks for telling me. If it still does not work, go here:

http://www.rz.coolfreepage.com/witt.html

and click the link for the recruits.

w4e
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on July 03, 2006, 01:53:46 PM
w4e,

Thanks.  Your new link worked.  Looks like Witt went for and got some bigs to replace Russ and Brady.  Seven out of twelve recruits at 6'6" or taller?  Sounds like the makings of a good class to me. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 04, 2006, 01:19:32 PM
It looks like Bill Brown may have picked Mac Petty's pocket (twice), bringing in two recruits from West Lafayette, including one (6'6" Kevin Lange) that the News-Sun is fairly high on.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on July 05, 2006, 01:07:38 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on July 04, 2006, 01:19:32 PM
It looks like Bill Brown may have picked Mac Petty's pocket...

After his petty cash, huh?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on July 25, 2006, 10:54:48 PM
Wooster appears to have lost Dex Battista as an incoming recruit as this item was posted on the MLive website a few days ago:

A late addition for Flying Dutchmen?
Dex Battista, the 6-foot-8 Utica grad, is reported to have changed his mind about going to the College of Wooster, and will enroll at Hope. This is key for the Flying Dutchmen, as Battista is the rare MIAA recruit capable of matching up with 6-8 John Mantel of Chelsea, who will be a freshman at Calvin.

Hope now has a very solid freshman class with Battista; Euro-skilled 6-1 Dustin Miller from Marshall; versatile 6-6 Steven Kratz from Ludington; and 6-10 shot-blocking project Brian Puls from Alpena.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on July 25, 2006, 11:39:55 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on July 25, 2006, 10:54:48 PM
Wooster appears to have lost Dex Battista as an incoming recruit as this item was posted on the MLive website a few days ago:

A late addition for Flying Dutchmen?
Dex Battista, the 6-foot-8 Utica grad, is reported to have changed his mind about going to the College of Wooster, and will enroll at Hope. This is key for the Flying Dutchmen, as Battista is the rare MIAA recruit capable of matching up with 6-8 John Mantel of Chelsea, who will be a freshman at Calvin.

Hope now has a very solid freshman class with Battista; Euro-skilled 6-1 Dustin Miller from Marshall; versatile 6-6 Steven Kratz from Ludington; and 6-10 shot-blocking project Brian Puls from Alpena.


That would be a big loss for the Scots.  But I've heard that he's working out with the team and has been looking good in the pick-up scrimmages.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on July 26, 2006, 10:38:46 PM
cmhscotsfan -- that is great news because your source is probably more reliable than the MLive website!   :)

Thanks for the update.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on July 26, 2006, 11:03:57 PM
I have also heard that he is still going to Wooster and has been playing well in the scrimmages.

Also I have heard that Jamie Yoder has transferred to Capital and that Jeff Stevens will not return next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on July 30, 2006, 04:52:48 PM
Quote from: goscots on July 26, 2006, 11:03:57 PM
I have also heard that he is still going to Wooster and has been playing well in the scrimmages.

Also I have heard that Jamie Yoder has transferred to Capital and that Jeff Stevens will not return next year.

Battista was NOT at this week's scrimmage, but was there as late the previous week.  I'll try to get an update this week.

Looks like the Mose Hole tourney this year should be a good one with Calvin, UW LaCrosse and ONU coming to Timkin!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on August 08, 2006, 03:45:47 PM
FYI... Former Wittenberg standout Dan Russ, recently signed to play professionally for a team in the Netherlands. This comes after a busy summer of playing in professional tryout camps in California, Florida, Mexico and Germany. A great story on a very deserving player both on and off the floor. Best of luck to him in the future.


http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/news/2006releases/08_04.html (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/news/2006releases/08_04.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on August 11, 2006, 08:25:00 AM
Russ really seemed like a class act, and I wish him the best of luck over there.  He's a player with very nice inside moves and is also an excellent interior passer.  Strength is what he needs the most, though, and I have to admit I'm a little skeptical about him being able to gain much more of it.  After all, I have to assume that he was working along those lines for the last four years at Wittenberg and he's still very much on the thin side.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on August 11, 2006, 06:26:59 PM
Congrats to Dan!

He was a really quality player whom I enjoyed watching quite a bit these last couple of years. I'm glad he got the shot to play overseas.

Quote from: Wooster Booster on August 11, 2006, 08:25:00 AM
I have to assume that he was working along those lines for the last four years at Wittenberg and he's still very much on the thin side.

Seriously! What do you guys serve in your cafeteria at Witt?  :D  ;)

Seriously though, I would imagine that eventually he has to fill out a little. Isn't that one of the effects of aging?  :)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on August 11, 2006, 08:30:46 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on August 11, 2006, 06:26:59 PM

Seriously though, I would imagine that eventually he has to fill out a little. Isn't that one of the effects of aging?  :)


:D  I can attest to that!  It came to a point a few years after I graduated when the 12 oz. curls excercise program that I was implementing to the fullest during my undergrad days just wasn't cutting it anymore?!?!? :o 8) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on August 13, 2006, 10:35:59 AM
Any final word on Dex Battista's situation?  Anyone know, for sure, if he's still at Wooster or has gone to Hope?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on August 14, 2006, 04:36:22 PM
Don't know if it means anything but if you do a directory search on the Wooster.edu site his name does come up as in the class of 2010.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 14, 2006, 10:19:03 PM
goscots -- no, that listing of Dex Battista in the Wooster class of 2010 doesn't mean much because there are no signed commitment letters in D3 sports.  In short, a D3 athlete can change his mind right up until the first day he enrolls (attends a class) as a freshman.  If Battista shows up at Hope College this fall to attend his first class, he will be a Dutchmen regardless of being on a Wooster class of 2010 list.

The class of 2010 was actually posted on the Wooster website back in June or July and Battista was on the list at that time.  The real question is whether he has since changed his mind and where does he intend to enroll when classes begin?  If someone actually sees Dex Battista on the Woo campus when freshmen orientation sessions begin, that will be the real confirmation that he will be a Scot!

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on August 15, 2006, 07:00:50 PM
I've heard that the Wooster players - including his roommate - are still expecting Battista to be at Wooster this year.  However, WooScotsFan is correct - we won't know anything for sure until Aug 23 when orientation begins.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on August 15, 2006, 07:26:04 PM
I tried to Google the Web for any new information - no luck, and the Hope site does not have a student directory.

Some non league games on the Scots schedule:

Al Van Wie  Emory&Henry vs.  Mount Union, Wooster vs. Cabrini
Mose Hole  Calvin vs. Wisconsin-Lacrosse, Wooster vs. Ohio Northern

Walsh (NAIA champions in 2005) away
Cedarville (NAIA) home
Pomona Pitzer away (SCIAC champions 6 of last 10 years)
Cal-Baptist away  (NAIA)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on August 16, 2006, 09:12:26 AM
Wow, that's an intrigueing schedule.  I was wondering, last year, how Wooster would have fared against Walsh, a team with incredible size.  I don't know if they have that size back, or who they lost, but it should make for an interesting game and only 50 minutes away.

Plus a California trip.  That one I don't believe I'll be making, but it should be a fun one for the players.  Hope they put the schedule up on the website soon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on August 16, 2006, 09:22:31 AM
Quote from: goscots on August 15, 2006, 07:26:04 PM

Pomona Pitzer away (SCIAC champions 6 of last 10 years)
Cal-Baptist away  (NAIA)


I'm sure that David is looking forward to having the Scots visit his neck of the woods out there on the left coast! :) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on August 18, 2006, 10:37:30 AM
Nov. 17   AL VAN WIE / ROTARY TOURNAMENT
      w/Cabrini, Emory & Henry, Mt. Union   6:00/8:00
Nov. 18   AL VAN WIE / ROTARY TOURNAMENT
      Consolation Game   6:00
      Championship Game   8:00
Nov. 25   at Walsh   7:30
Dec. 2   EARLHAM*   3:00
Dec. 6   at Oberlin*   7:30
Dec. 9   at Wittenberg*   7:30
Dec. 16   CEDARVILLE   8:00
Dec. 18   at Pomona-Pitzer   TBA
Dec. 20   at California Baptist   TBA
Dec. 29   "MOSE" HOLE / KIWANIS TOURNAMENT
      w/Calvin, Ohio Northern, Wis.-La Crosse   5:30/7:30
Dec. 30   "MOSE" HOLE / KIWANIS TOURNAMENT
      Consolation Game   5:30
      Championship Game   7:30
Jan. 6   DENISON*   7:30
Jan. 10   at Allegheny*   7:30
Jan. 13   WABASH*   2:00
Jan. 17   at Hiram*   8:00
Jan. 20   at Ohio Wesleyan*   3:00
Jan. 24   KENYON*   7:30
Jan. 27   at Earlham*   3:00
Jan. 31   ALLEGHENY*   7:30
Feb. 3   WITTENBERG*   7:30
Feb. 7   HIRAM*   8:00
Feb. 10   at Wabash*   2:00
Feb. 14   at Kenyon*   7:30
Feb. 17   OHIO WESLEYAN*   7:30
Feb. 20   NCAC Tournament Quarterfinals   TBD
Feb. 23   NCAC Tournament Semifinals   TBD
Feb. 24   NCAC Tournament Championship Game   TBD
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on August 18, 2006, 01:07:02 PM
Wooster at Pomona Pitzer? Yess!

I love snowbird tourneys. They make living in basketball siberia a little easier. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on August 21, 2006, 10:38:40 PM
The full schedule is now posted on the Wooster web site. The Scots picked up an away game against Georgetown, KY on November 28th.

I went to their web site and cut and pasted this about their Men's basketball team:

GENERAL Location: Georgetown, Kentucky
Founded: 1787
Enrollment: 1,400
Nickname: Tigers
School Colors: Orange & Black
Arena/Facilty: Alumni Gymnasium
Capacity: 2,500
Affiliation: NAIA Division I
Conference: Mid-South Conference
President: Dr. William H. Crouch, Jr.
Athletic Director: Eric Ward
Faculty Athletic Representative: Dr. John Blackburn


HISTORY
First Year of Basketball: 1902
All-Time Record: 1582-818-1
Ten-Year Record: 383-63 (.859)
Five-Year Record: 212-42 (.835)
NAIA Final Four Appearances: 10
NAIA Championship Appearances: 4
National Championships: 1998
2004-05: Record: 28-6
Postseason: MSC Regular Season Co-Championships, NAIA National Tournament Elite-Eight

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NW Hope Fan on August 24, 2006, 02:26:55 PM
One full day of orientation down... Question is: is Battista on Wooster's campus?

Do tell...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on August 24, 2006, 03:24:12 PM
Quote from: Bad Karma on August 24, 2006, 02:26:55 PM
One full day of orientation down... Question is: is Battista on Wooster's campus?

Do tell...

I have heard that there was a Battista sighting on campus yesterday!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 24, 2006, 10:26:33 PM
cmhscots -- Thanks for the update.  That is great news about Battista!!  :)

His enrollment will surely strengthen the Scots' frontcourt this year.  I would not be surprised to see him pick up significant playing time this season.

In the frontcourt, Woo's recruits look to be Battista, Rob Melick also 6'7" or 6'8" out of Mt. Vernon High (Gambier, OH) and Rob Teneinini (sp) 6'4" out of the Pittsburgh, PA area.

For the wings and guards, new recruits appear to be:

Nick Hershberger 6'3" out of Tuscarawas Central Catholic (New Philly)
20.5 ppg and 10.2 rpg as a Senior.  Was picked All Region First Team

Julian Mangano 6'1" guard out of Painesville Harvey High School
Was Ohio Division II Honorable Mention this year

Jason Ronyak  6'2" guard out of Burton Berkshire High School
Was Ohio Division III Special Mention this year

Nathan Luoma 6'2" guard out of Geneva High School (Ashtabula County Player of Year)
15.1 ppg, 2.6 steals'game, 2.0 apg as a Senior

Kyle Molz 6'0" out of Kettering Fairmont High School
Not sure on this guy -- is he Kenny Molz's (Witt player) younger brother??

These were the basketball players that I found on Wooster's freshmen class list so let's hope that they all have been sighted on campus!  I also may have missed a couple?

Kudos to Steve Moore and Doug Cline....the Scots have reloaded!   ;D

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on August 24, 2006, 11:02:31 PM
WooScotsFan

You missed 3--there are a total of 11 recruits.  Dustin Geitgey, a point guard from Northwestern HS (Wayne Co.), and 2 others, both of which I've heard are outstanding.  One kid is from the Dayton area, and the other is from Virginia.

And all are on campus, I'm told--

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on August 25, 2006, 09:04:34 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on August 24, 2006, 10:26:33 PM

Kudos to Steve Moore and Doug Cline....the Scots have reloaded!   ;D


I remember the days when I thought Wooster had a good recruiting class if they could land one or two special players.  Lately, it seems like they are an abundance.  This is a pretty big recruiting class and it's nice to see that Wooster got some bigs included in that recuriting class.

I'm also glad that we can put the Dex Battista recruiting saga to bed.   With the lack of size that Wooster had last year, I would agree with wsf in that I would look for him to contribute right out of the box.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on August 25, 2006, 11:16:23 AM
It's good to see Wooster recruiting out of state. I've always felt with its national reputation, both academically and with the basketball programs success, that Wooster should be looking out of state for some players, especially with all the strong Div. III and even Div. II programs in Ohio.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Fanofakid on August 30, 2006, 06:46:09 PM
Kyle Molz is Kenny Molz brother. Weird uhh :) Played Div. 1 Kettering Fairmont same High School as Bryan Nelson and P.J. McCloud. More of a 3 pt Shooter 46% last year. He has a good overall game. He played point and shooting guard and started all 3 years at Fairmont. Played in the tough GWOC and was an all conference player. Scored 19 against Trotwood D1 state runner-ups. Scored 26 against Springboro who at the time was rated number 7 in the state.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 30, 2006, 11:34:13 PM
Fanofakid -- thanks for all the good info on Kyle Molz.  I figured that he might be the younger brother because Kenny had played at Kettering Fairmount.

Kyle sounds like a great guard addition for Wooster and it is always nice to land another recruit out of southwest Ohio!  ;D

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on August 31, 2006, 09:26:05 AM
I guess Kyle's family is going to have to trade in all that Witt gear for the Black and Old Gold! ;)  Maybe they can make one of those half & half sweatshirts like they make for Michigan and OSU or Michigan and MSU. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on September 01, 2006, 06:01:04 PM
Not to rehash old news, but I recently had an interesting conversation with my cousin's daughter (I guess she's my cousin, too...) who just graduated from Wooster.   She was a varsity athlete, and knows many of the Woo men athletes, and is obviously a member of their athletic culture.  When I asked her about Witt's run in the Final Four, she told me that most of the Woo athletes were rooting against the Tigers.  What's kind of sour grapes is that?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on September 01, 2006, 09:39:16 PM
drt,

Do you know anything about rivalries? You don't like your rival, and you don't want them to do well. You think Michigan roots for Ohio State to do win a national championship? Do you think the Red Sox are rooting for the Yankees to win the World Series? This is an extremely intense rivalry with some bad blood. It's only natural since these two teams play each other so much. While it might not be on the level of Wabash-DePauw, it is pretty close when it comes to basketball. And I'm sure you are not going to find a Wabash fan who says they root for DePauw in anything.

I doubt Wittenberg players were rooting for Wooster in 2003 when they made it to the Final Four. Why would Wooster, who doesn't have a national championship in basketball, want to see its bitter rival get one, especially in the same year when Wooster beat them twice and was ranked No. 1 for several weeks?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on September 01, 2006, 10:05:44 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on September 01, 2006, 09:39:16 PM
drt,

Do you know anything about rivalries? You don't like your rival, and you don't want them to do well. You think Michigan roots for Ohio State to do win a national championship? Do you think the Red Sox are rooting for the Yankees to win the World Series? This is an extremely intense rivalry with some bad blood. It's only natural since these two teams play each other so much. While it might not be on the level of Wabash-DePauw, it is pretty close when it comes to basketball. And I'm sure you are not going to find a Wabash fan who says they root for DePauw in anything.

I doubt Wittenberg players were rooting for Wooster in 2003 when they made it to the Final Four. Why would Wooster, who doesn't have a national championship in basketball, want to see its bitter rival get one, especially in the same year when Wooster beat them twice and was ranked No. 1 for several weeks?

This is certainly the mindset at the collegiate level (and for a while after), but (in my case, at least) mellows after time to a conference loyalty.  As a '70 grad of IWU, I could not imagine rooting for Millikin in anything against anybody - in 2004(?) I was absolutely thrilled when they won the women's bball title!  I used to say that my favorite d1 teams were Michigan, and anyone playing Michigan State and Ohio State, but that now applies only to conference games - I was rooting for Ohio State when they won the title in 2003(?).

I've figured out that beating an undefeated MSU or OSU is SO much more satisfying than if they are having a bad season; likewise with Millikin - may they beat everyone until we stomp them!! ;D

Besides, if your conference mates succeed, it lifts your boat, too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on September 01, 2006, 11:54:45 PM
Yes, I know a little about rivalries.  Don't patronize me, Jerry.  Just because I don't live 24-7 in this bit of cyberspace doesn't mean I'm ill-informed. 
I think I knowa little about mutual respect, too.  When I was at Witt, we had a great rivalry in football with B-W, but would have not rooted against them (except in '78) in their playoff run, had they beaten us.   We had basketball rivalries as well, though none of them did much while we were making the Final Four in '76 and '77.  And guess what?  I'm a Yankee fan, but if we're out of it, I'll gladly root for the Red Sox.    I WAS rooting for Wooster (who doesn't have a national championship in basketball) in 2003...  It's about league, or conference, pride.
There's so much talk in these rooms about how the conference stacks up against this and the conference compares to that, but I guess that for you, when the cards are on the table, it's all about selfishness: You have yours, but I don't have mine.  Boo hoo. 
No, I don't like my rivals, but they've earned my respect or they're not worthy of being my rival.  And if my team can't be there, I'll gladly support one that I respect.
I guess maybe that's the difference between our generations.
By the way, thank you for the perspective Mr. Ypsi.  ;) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on September 02, 2006, 12:49:22 AM
Quote from: drt on September 01, 2006, 11:54:45 PM
Yes, I know a little about rivalries.  Don't patronize me, Jerry.  Just because I don't live 24-7 in this bit of cyberspace doesn't mean I'm ill-informed. 
I think I knowa little about mutual respect, too.  When I was at Witt, we had a great rivalry in football with B-W, but would have not rooted against them (except in '78) in their playoff run, had they beaten us.   We had basketball rivalries as well, though none of them did much while we were making the Final Four in '76 and '77.  And guess what?  I'm a Yankee fan, but if we're out of it, I'll gladly root for the Red Sox.    I WAS rooting for Wooster (who doesn't have a national championship in basketball) in 2003...  It's about league, or conference, pride.
There's so much talk in these rooms about how the conference stacks up against this and the conference compares to that, but I guess that for you, when the cards are on the table, it's all about selfishness: You have yours, but I don't have mine.  Boo hoo. 
No, I don't like my rivals, but they've earned my respect or they're not worthy of being my rival.  And if my team can't be there, I'll gladly support one that I respect.
I guess maybe that's the difference between our generations.
By the way, thank you for the perspective Mr. Ypsi.  ;) 

Thanks, but I think you said it better than me!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on September 02, 2006, 12:52:10 PM
Does it really matter if the Wooster athletes were rooting against Witt in their run to the finals?  Like seinfeld said, I doubt that too many Witt athletes were rooting for Wooster in their run to the Final 4 in 2003.  You say you were drt, but you are almost 30 years removed from the rivalry.  That doesn't mean that the current Witt athletes and students shared your views.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on September 02, 2006, 02:16:02 PM
Yeah, I guess my views on character and mutual respect are just downright old-fashioned.
Excuse me while I hitch up Dobbin and head to the general store for some vittles.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopsfan1111 on September 05, 2006, 06:48:21 PM
drt-

I would think that a person of strong personal character who shows mutual respect for others would not stoop to the level of getting on an internet website and accusing "many of the Wooster men athletes" of not having strong personal character and not showing respect based on the comments of one person.  I don't doubt that your cousin knows the players, and is involved in the culture of athletics at Wooster, but I think the comments she made might have gotten a little blown out of poportion here...it went from 'not rooting' for Wittenberg to not having good character in your last post?  That is a pretty big jump to make in my opinion...I too know a few Woo athletes, basketball players specifically, and they might not have been 'rah rah goooooo WITT!!' during their tourney run, but I don't think they would begrudge Witt if they had won it all, in fact, I believe the opposite.  I think they would have done/felt just as Mr. Ypsi described earlier.  I don't think for one second that just because Woo athletes didn't WANT/HOPE for a Witt championship that they don't have respect for the program that Witt has, in fact I think they would have given their congrats and moved on, using it as motivation to work harder and win themselves a championship of there own...hopefully, they will get it this up coming season! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 05, 2006, 10:37:12 PM
Re: Woo folks pulling for Witt:  FWIW, I was in Salem and rooting -- hard -- for Wittenberg.  Then again, I'm also about 25 years removed from campus life, and I don't know what I'd have done as a student.  And I confess that seeing the Witt/Capital football score from this weekend brought a faint smile to my lips.  ::) I understand that Steve Moore and Bill Brown, once close friends, now have a fairly terse relationship.  It wouldn't surprise me if the players in both programs pick up on that, adding fuel to the fire already created by the rivalry and its history of games both close and important to each team's season goals.

Re: Dex Battista:  If any of what has been posted in here about this young man is accurate, I have to wonder if he'll end up transferring back to a Michigan school.  The story reads like someone unwilling to go far from home.  I wonder what the truth is, and what his future is. 

Re: Woo's schedule:  Four NAIA opponents?  How odd.  I wonder what's going on with that.  Also, note that Wooster hosts (NAIA) Cedarville on 12/16, then has to face a pretty solid Pomona-Pitzer program in Pomona just two jetlag-filled days later.  For those who don't know, Pomona is not easy to get to from any of the Southland airports; not only is this a long 3 time zone flight, there's surely a long bus ride at the end of it.  It's going to be a very tough and tiring travel day on the 17th, and the game on the 18th looks like a big fat "L" to me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on September 06, 2006, 08:41:13 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on September 05, 2006, 10:37:12 PM
Re: Woo folks pulling for Witt:  I understand that Steve Moore and Bill Brown, once close friends, now have a fairly terse relationship.  It wouldn't surprise me if the players in both programs pick up on that, adding fuel to the fire already created by the rivalry and its history of games both close and important to each team's season goals.

DC, you bring up an excellent point here.  I find it hard to believe that the players from both schools don't pick up on how things have cooled between these 2 men who were once each other's best man in their weddings.  I also agree with hf1111 in that since when did not cheering for your hated rival become a sign of bad character as drt has seems to conclude?

Quote from: David Collinge on September 05, 2006, 10:37:12 PM
Re: Dex Battista:  If any of what has been posted in here about this young man is accurate, I have to wonder if he'll end up transferring back to a Michigan school.  The story reads like someone unwilling to go far from home.  I wonder what the truth is, and what his future is. 
DC, it seemed his choice of schools basically came down to 2:  Hope and Wooster.  If being far from home is a concern for this young man, Albion should be the obvios choice as it seemed to be the closest MIAA school.  Hope is only an hour closer than Wooster (2hrs 38mins to Holland from Utica compared to 3hrs 39mins to Wooster from Utica) according to Yahoo Maps which isn't really that big of a deal in the grand scheme of things.  And if PT is a key, he should have a pretty good shot at getting some straight off considering how vertically challenged Wooster was last season.

Quote from: David Collinge on September 05, 2006, 10:37:12 PM
Re: Woo's schedule:  Also, note that Wooster hosts (NAIA) Cedarville on 12/16, then has to face a pretty solid Pomona-Pitzer program in Pomona just two jetlag-filled days later.  For those who don't know, Pomona is not easy to get to from any of the Southland airports; not only is this a long 3 time zone flight, there's surely a long bus ride at the end of it.  It's going to be a very tough and tiring travel day on the 17th, and the game on the 18th looks like a big fat "L" to me.

These are young kids we're talking about here DC.  Maybe the coaching staff might have some difficulty with the trip.  But as for the players, they're young, they're in tip-top shape.  I have a feeling they'll be able to handle it.  I wouldn't be so quick start chalking "L's" up just yet. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on September 06, 2006, 10:02:26 AM
To my surprise, I found myself rooting for Wittenberg in the final four.  As I'd mentioned several times back during the season, I really appreciated the character of Russ and Borchers, and they being the two stars, it would have been difficult for me to root for them to lose.  Should Witt make another run this season (unlikely without Russ) though, all bets are off.  Enough is enough. :-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on September 06, 2006, 11:33:11 PM
Hoops fan, her statement was, "They were all glad Witt lost."  I guess I should have made that clear in my initial post.  I think you could construe this as "sour grapes."  I would have hoped that mutual respect would have resulted from four years of intense competition.  I didn't blow her comments out of proportion.  "You believe the opposite."  O.K. I have my opinion, you have yours.

Personally, whenever we were out of it, we would have been glad to hear that  someone who had won it all was one of the last to beat us....

Hoops Fan, you can call it "blown out of proportion" if you want, but I was merely passing along what I heard, and making a personal interpretation of it.

What are the bad feelings between Moore and Brown?  I knew Steve at Witt, and he is a person of impeccable character.  In fact, he graded a few of my papers.  I have a hard time believing that just because someone is an athletic rival that he would sever a longtime friendship.  Steve would never let a rivalry, however intense, come between him and a friend.  Comments?

DC, Woo Boo, Thanks for your support.  I have a feeling, after reading your many posts, that you, a least, pick up what I'm laying down.



 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on September 07, 2006, 01:17:19 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on September 05, 2006, 10:37:12 PM
Re: Woo folks pulling for Witt:  FWIW, I was in Salem and rooting -- hard -- for Wittenberg. 

This is true, I can attest... I think he was even wearing red and everything.

Incidentally... where the heck have you been? ???

I liked Russ and Borchers too... but I'm pretty sure I was cheering for Wheaton and not Witt at the final four.  :D ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 09, 2006, 06:14:18 PM
Quote from: drt on September 06, 2006, 11:33:11 PM
What are the bad feelings between Moore and Brown?  I knew Steve at Witt, and he is a person of impeccable character.  In fact, he graded a few of my papers.  I have a hard time believing that just because someone is an athletic rival that he would sever a longtime friendship.  Steve would never let a rivalry, however intense, come between him and a friend.  Comments?

I don't know what has happened over the years to sour this realtionship (and if I did, I probably wouldn't choose to discuss it here), but I think it was an event (or series of events) rather than just the rivalry per se.  I wouldn't be surprised if butting heads over a recruit or two played a role.  I agree that Steve Moore is a man of the highest character, and I hope and suppose that Bill Brown is as well.  But that doesn't mean they can't be at odds; it happens even among the "best" people.

Quote from: diehardfan on September 07, 2006, 01:17:19 AM
Incidentally... where the heck have you been? ???

Oh, I'm around, I just don't have much to say these days.  :)

Addendum on Wooster's schedule:  I'm sorry to see that Westminster is not on the schedule.  I hope that it is just an inability to find a mutually agreeable date rather than the end of a budding Presbyterian rivalry.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on September 11, 2006, 05:03:33 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on September 05, 2006, 10:37:12 PM
Re: Woo folks pulling for Witt:  FWIW, I was in Salem and rooting -- hard -- for Wittenberg.  Then again, I'm also about 25 years removed from campus life, and I don't know what I'd have done as a student. 

If you would've done something that had to do with vittles and the general store and doing anything -- anything -- involving ol' Dobbin, I don't want to hear about it, David.  :D

Quote from: David Collinge on September 09, 2006, 06:14:18 PMAddendum on Wooster's schedule:  I'm sorry to see that Westminster is not on the schedule.  I hope that it is just an inability to find a mutually agreeable date rather than the end of a budding Presbyterian rivalry.

When I see the words "budding Presbyterian rivalry", I immediately think of Thad and Chip getting into a frightful row over a hand of bridge at the country club.

FWIW, I see both sides of the "root for your rivals" issue. I have a very hard time doing this myself, but in matters of collegiate sports I can usually talk myself into rooting for a CCIW rival in the championships by using Chuck's "your rival's triumph lifts all the boats in the conference" rationale. In ordinary non-conference play, I have no problem whatsoever rooting for other CCIW teams.

It's different in pro sports for me, because I don't have a personal connection to them the way that I have with my alma mater and because Chuck's boats theorem doesn't apply. Thus, you'd need an electron microscope to find a sympathetic atom in my body where the St. Louis Cardinals are concerned. And I think no less of any Cards fan who feels that same way about my beloved Cubs.

Not that I could think less of a Cards fan, anyway.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on September 11, 2006, 03:04:50 PM
DC – I thought we would have gotten more a breakdown from you re: the 2006-07 schedule.  Non-Conference Schedule breaks down like this:

WALSH - 2005 NAIA Division II Champs, 2006 Ranked #3 in final poll, they return their top six scorers including a HM All-American PG, and a 6'11" Center.

GEORGETOWN (KY) – They went 26-8 last year and made it to the NAIA Division I round of sixteen.  They were rank #11 in the final poll.  And they return EVERYONE included three Division I transfers. 

CEDARVILLE – 05-06 Season: 20-11.  In the 2004-05 season, they made it to the NAIA Division II National Final Four.  They lost the leading scorer but return everyone else including Tyler Yoder from Wooster Triway.  They also carry 6'9" and 6'10" centers on the roster.

CALIFORNIA BAPTIST – Ended the year, 13-16, Conference 8-12 in NAIA Division I.  They lost four players to graduation include two of top four scorers. 

POMONA-PITZER – 05-06 Season: 16-8. They lost 3rd leading scorer to graduation and return everyone else.  They look like a donut on the roster though, nothing in the middle.  Bigs do not play a lot. They are Division III.

CABRINI – A young team that took it on the chin last year but return all but one player.

The MOSE-HOLE CLASSIC – Looks like a NCAA regional.
ONU – 21-6 and 12-4 in tough OAC. And they are bringing everyone back. 
UW-LACROSSE – 20-8 in 2005-06 Made it to the NCAA tourney losing to...Calvin in the first round.  They did lose two senior starters.  But up there, they re-load, not rebuild and they have a few Division I transfers. 
CALVIN – 1st and 3rd leader scorers lost to graduation but a deep team that had 10 players average more than 10 mins pg.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on September 11, 2006, 03:13:37 PM
Not that I am any kind of expert.  But I think the ole' ball coach at the school on the hill is setting up for a run.  That is some serious competition he has lined up.  And right now, Wooster has just a few questions marks:
(1) Can the intanglible of Witucky be replaced (good guard rotation should help that transitition)
(2) Can "Darth" Vandervaart and an undersized Will get some help under the boards?  Will the post recruits contribute right away?  And does Bradley return to help in the middle?
(3) Can Wooster survive a NCAA Tourney like stretch in DEC when they play @ Walsh, Earlham, Georgetown(KY), @ WITT, Cedarville and California trip and host a killer MOSE-HOLE Tourney??  Wow!! 

We may take our lumps early and then come out swinging for bulk of NCAC play and hopefully a NCAA tourney run!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on September 12, 2006, 01:48:49 AM
That's an excellent breakdown of Wooster's non-conference schedule, WooFan. Good research on your part. I just have one tiny nit to pick:

Quote from: WoosterFAN on September 11, 2006, 03:04:50 PMUW-LACROSSE – 20-8 in 2005-06 Made it to the NCAA tourney losing to...Calvin in the first round.  They did lose two senior starters.  But up there, they re-load, not rebuild and they have a few Division I transfers.

Other WIAC programs certainly have "reload, not rebuild" status (UWSP, UWW, and UWO especially), but it's not really true of UW-LaCrosse. Prior to 2005-06, the Eagles had posted a losing record in WIAC play in 16 of the previous 17 seasons. And the 20-8 record they posted last year was the first 20-win campaign enjoyed by the UWL program since 1982-83.

Head coach Ken Koelbl seems to be building a solid program there, but the Eagles are not reloading. They're not even really rebuilding. They're simply building, with no "re-" about it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on September 12, 2006, 09:23:30 AM
I've seen dozens of volleyball matches at Walsh (they were REALLY good just a few years ago) but never a basketball game.  Do they play in the same gym?  If so, I can't imagine it holding even close to the number of fans who will want to see the Wooster game - it's a nice venue, with comfortable seats, but tiny.  Anybody know?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 13, 2006, 08:08:08 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on September 11, 2006, 03:04:50 PM
DC – I thought we would have gotten more a breakdown from you re: the 2006-07 schedule.

I am rendered speechless by this.  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on September 13, 2006, 10:35:00 PM
DC - I am just following in your footstep my Crescent City Brother...Also enrolled in Grad School and still doing the Navy thing.

But when I saw you had not broken down the schedule, I figured you were too busy with lawyer business or the left coast had infected you.  So I rose to the task!

We'd love to hear you thoughts and observations!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on September 14, 2006, 08:31:24 PM
DC -

Thinking that a man of your stature shouldn't be stuck on 100 karma points for so long, I decided to smite you then immediately applaud you to shake things up.  Strangely, one of three possibilities seemed to have happened as after dropping to 99 you zoomed up to 101 (instead of returning to 100) after my applause.

1. I've found a bug in the karma system.
2. Someone else applauded you at precisely the same time that I did.
3. The karma Gods are fiddling with my mind.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on September 15, 2006, 02:58:16 PM
I guess there are two ways you can look at Wooster's schedule. This is clearly the toughest non-conference schedule they have played in a long time. This is probably a good thing, as if recent history is any indication, the NCAC schedule is fairly soft in comparison to what other nationally-ranked teams face during the season. This can only help toughen up the Scots for a possible post-season run.

On the other hand, most of these games are against teams either out of the region or out of Div. III altogether, which means they do nothing for their SOS index. This number has really hurt the Scots the last couple of years. Instead of playing Albion and Transylvania at home (which maybe one more win against an above .500 region team would have given Wooster), they played those games on the road, and lost. Wooster seems to be a different team in the postseason at home versus on the road.

I would imagine the coaching staff would have like to have gotten a couple of solid in-region Div. III games in place of the NAIA teams. This makes the Mose Hole Tournament even more important. Wooster needs to beat ONU, and it would also be helpful to play Calvin and beat them in the title game.

Wittenberg has been fortunate to get some yearly contests against solid in-region teams like Capital, Otterbein, Ohio Northern and Transylvania. Wooster could use games like this (Baldwin-Wallace and JCU come to mind as nearby possibilities).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on September 18, 2006, 11:23:03 PM
From Sunday's Wooster Daily Record:

Moore brings in a 'big' class

A few thoughts from the week in sports ...

While fall sports are now in full swing, The College of Wooster men's basketball team is eagerly awaiting its first official practice next month.

The Scots are in the process of getting one of their biggest recruiting classes, both literally and figuratively, in recent memory acclimated with the campus and team.

"We really concentrated on getting some size into the program and we accomplished that," said veteran coach Steve Moore, who graduated just one player from last season's 26-4 squad. "First of all, two of our tallest players are seniors now, Tom Port and Tim Vandervaart. Secondly, neither one of those guys are a true center.

"They both came to our programs as wings, so we really emphasized getting some size."

Adding players who are both tall and skilled at the Div. III level, where athletic scholarships can't be awarded, is sometimes a lot easier said than done. That even goes for a nationally respected program like Wooster's.

However, the Scots certainly came through on the recruiting trail by bringing in six players who stand 6-5 or taller.

The following is a look at the Scots' freshmen big men:

Robert Melick, 6-8, 240, Mount Vernon High School - Averaged 15 points per game, five rebounds; second-team all district.

Dex Battista, 6-8, 210, Utica H.S. (Mich.) - Averaged 18 ppg., 11 rpg. as senior; ranked among top 30 seniors in Michigan; was All-State and All-Detroit area.

Craig Elam, 6-6, 245, Dayton Carroll H.S. - Averaged 19.5 ppg., 11 rpg. as senior; bounced back from knee trouble to have stellar final prep season that saw him earn first-team all-league honors and second-team all-Dayton area.

Nick Hershberger, 6-5, 260, Tuscarawas Central Catholic H.S. - Averaged 22 ppg., 11 rpg. to top 1,000 points for career; played for former Dalton coach Dave Potopsky; Nicknamed "Big Country," Hershberger was first-team All-Ohio and also a football star at TCC.

Jake Johnson, 6-5, Loudon Valley H.S. (Round Hill, Va.) - Averaged 19.4 ppg., 6.3 rpg. as senior and finished with 970 career points; named all-state in Virginia; had a summer job where former NBA player Gheorghe Muresan, a 7-7 center, was his boss.

Rob Tenenini, 6-5, 195, Fox Chapel H.S. (Pittsburgh) - Averaged 18 ppg., 11 rpg. as senior; named his high school's top male athlete for senior class; named to all-section team.

There are also several guards who will vie for spots on the team, including local product Dustin Geitgey from Northwestern. The 6-1 Geitgey averaged 18 ppg., six rpg. and set a single-season Huskies' record with 68 3-pointers as a senior.

With starters Port, Vandervaart, James Cooper and Andy Van Horn returning, along with talented subs Brandon Johnson, Evan Will, Devin Fulk and Marty Bidwell, the freshmen will need to show some patience before making names for themselves in the program.

However, it could go down as one of the deepest recruiting classes ever for Moore.

A couple players from the group could contribute right away, but Moore said he would not discuss specific players until practices have started.

According to a person close to the program, the 6-8 Battista is considered the top player among the recruits. Although recruited heavily by Hope College in his home state, Battista opted to become a part of the COW tradition to the Scots' delight.

SCOTS' SCHEDULE LOADED - The Scots are also excited about their 2006-07 schedule.

In fact, Moore said the schedule is "probably the best we've had."

There are four NAIA teams on the slate - at Walsh (Nov. 25), Georgetown, Ky., (Nov. 28), Cedarville (Dec. 16) and at California Baptist (Dec. 20).

The season will start Nov. 17-18 with the Al Van Wie/Rotary classic when Emory & Henry, Mount Union and Cabrini visit Wooster.

Calvin, Wisconsin-La Crosse and Ohio Northern will visit for the Mose Hole/Kiwanis Tournament Dec. 29-30.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on September 19, 2006, 12:10:34 PM
Remember the Steve Moore Golden era, when Wooster produced stud post players?  Trimmer(Coach Moore's first year), Aukamp, Cline, Gorman, Ellenwood, and Nelson.

Now I love "Darth" Vandvaart but he is a wing admirably playing out of postion.  It would be great if a couple of these first year players could continue the Wooster tradition of great post players especially considering the great wings and guards we currently have on the roster.

I am concerned about the width of Battista.  Only 210 lbs?  Tom Port wieghs more than that!!  Although that is the size of Witt's Borchers and the departed Dan Russ.

Any word on whether Bradley will return to the program this year?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on September 27, 2006, 11:47:05 PM
Not sure how many people have been following Dan Russ, but it seems as though the big man is having a solid first season as a pro.

Most recently, Russ scored 14 points and grabbed 13 rebounds in a victory for his Woon!Aris team.

Their team website is http://www.woonaris.nl/ but unless you know Dutch or have a good translator, it's a bit hard to follow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 28, 2006, 11:18:33 AM
I heard that the Wooster players were rooting for ZZ Leiden in that game...   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 02, 2006, 02:25:50 PM
Pat,

In regards to the story on the front page about the Collegiate Basketball Invitational, I was wondering if you knew if this would be open to the public?

I wonder how Wadswoth, OH ended up as the destination of such an event?  Seems like quite the odd choice if you ask me.  Not that I'm complaining, because if it is open to the public it will be a good opportunity to see some quality hoops on display.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 02, 2006, 09:49:10 PM
Wow, somehow when I read that article the first time I missed the WADSWORTH, OHIO.  Thought it was being held in Florida.  This is GREAT!!  Heck, it's got to be open to the public, for a price.  It'll be interesting to see if any NCAC players, such as Borchers and/or Port, will be invited.  Certainly neither one of them are NBA caliber players, but they're among the better DIII players and also local.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on October 02, 2006, 10:03:29 PM
Maybe Wadworth, Ohio is the geographical center of D2, D3 and NAIA.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on October 03, 2006, 02:09:43 AM
Quote from: sac on October 02, 2006, 10:03:29 PM
Maybe Wadworth, Ohio is the geographical center of D2, D3 and NAIA.
Hmm... it might be, on average... maybe...

It's also just fun to say!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on October 03, 2006, 02:28:08 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on September 18, 2006, 11:23:03 PM


SCOTS' SCHEDULE LOADED - The Scots are also excited about their 2006-07 schedule.
...

In fact, Moore said the schedule is "probably the best we've had."

There are four NAIA teams on the slate - at Walsh (Nov. 25), Georgetown, Ky., (Nov. 28), Cedarville (Dec. 16) and at California Baptist (Dec. 20).  Doesn't he understand the criteria for the NCAA playoffs??

The season will start Nov. 17-18 with the Al Van Wie/Rotary classic when Emory & Henry* [*new in-(administrative  region #3)-region opponent], Mount Union and Cabrini visit Wooster.

Calvin*, Wisconsin-La Crosse and Ohio Northern* will visit for the Mose Hole/Kiwanis Tournament Dec. 29-30.

* = in-region opponents


Sorry, Wooster booster, I just had to comment! :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on October 03, 2006, 11:16:10 AM
I do think that Steve Moore does understand NCAA selection criteria. Chances are that Wooster is going to be first or second in the NCAC with a pretty impressive record. It has happened year after year after year lately. Playing a more challenging schedule, while throwing away potential SOSI (or whatever it is called now) points will prepare Wooster for the tournament better than playing the Oberlins and Hirams of the midwest. With the expanded field, I don't think Wooster has to worry too much about making the tournament unless something disasterous happens.

On the other hand, with the expanded definitions of "regions," I think that the Scots may be able to find some quality competition in the region in the coming years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on October 03, 2006, 12:02:17 PM
Wooster is more than well aware of the SOSI index and regional games, since they feel it cost them home games in each of the past two postseasons.

The problem is teams don't want to play Wooster. That is an unfortunate bi-product of becoming an elite team. You have a hard time finding Div. III region teams to play you. That's why they need to try and find yearly matchups with solid OAC teams like Wittenberg has been able to do. John Carroll and B-W are obvious fits because of their geographic location to Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 04, 2006, 07:51:43 PM
Quote from: pufin on October 03, 2006, 11:16:10 AM
I do think that Steve Moore does understand NCAA selection criteria. Chances are that Wooster is going to be first or second in the NCAC with a pretty impressive record. It has happened year after year after year lately. Playing a more challenging schedule, while throwing away potential SOSI (or whatever it is called now) points will prepare Wooster for the tournament better than playing the Oberlins and Hirams of the midwest. With the expanded field, I don't think Wooster has to worry too much about making the tournament unless something disasterous happens.

On the other hand, with the expanded definitions of "regions," I think that the Scots may be able to find some quality competition in the region in the coming years.

I agree with pufin.  My first reaction upon seeing the schedule was that the Scots must have had trouble filling out the schedule.  I still think that's probably the case; I think I recall that one of those NAIA games (perhaps Walsh?) was a last-minute addition.  I'd have to believe that Coach Moore would rather play B-W, Capital, or Otterbein than Cedarville or Walsh. 

But I don't think it hurts Wooster's shot at a tourney berth.  They'll end up playing at least 18 and as many as 22 in-region games.  Sixteen are regular season conference games, plus ONU (in the Mose Hole Classic) and either Emory & Henry or MUC in the Van Wie Classic; those are certain.  They might see Calvin in the Mose Hole, and they could play as many as three games in the NCAC tournament.  If the Scots don't win at least 15 regular season conference games and reach the tourney finals, they're not making the NCAAs regardless of their regional record or SOSI.  If they do, they'll be at least 17-4 against NCAC opponents, and a win over a quality opponent such as Calvin or ONU might be enough to ensure a berth. 

Let's say the Scots play all 22 possible regional games, and go 18-4.  (Any worse and they're in big trouble, given the probable weakness of the NCAC.)  That's a win percentage of .818.  The Scots will probably do well to split those 4 NAIA games.  If they had found four similarly tough in-region games to replace those 4 NAIA teams, and went 2-2, that would make them 20-6, or .769, and they'd probably take a SOSI hit as well (best-case scenario would be about 10.5 SOSI for those four games.)

All in all, despite my earlier misgivings, I think the current schedule provides a good balance between games that set up the Scots to qualify for the tourney, and games that set them up to be competitive in that tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 05, 2006, 10:57:26 AM
I like the additions of the NAIA teams.  Given the fact that Wooster already has 16 in-region conference games, as DC mentioned, I would feel that is a sufficient number when it comes to NCAA tournament selection criteria.  It's a matter of what the Scots do in those 16 games that will determine whether or not they warrant being selected.

As for games vs. the NAIA, I would much rather see Wooster schedule games like these against tougher competition than to go out and schedule cupcacke DIII opponents for the sake of gaining in-region opponents.  As was stated earlier, I agree that I don't think this will hurt the Scots if they happen to not gain the automatic bid by winning the conference tournament.  If by chance they don't finish 1st or 2nd in the regular season conference standings, I don't think they would be deserving of an at large bid anyways.  Not that I see that happening, but the possibililty is there. 

I think where playing these NAIA teams could hurt the Scots is when it comes time to decide who's hosting.  I think it is a must for Wooster to sweep their non-conference in-region games if they want to have a shot at hosting come NCAA tournament time.  They have to beat ONU and if they happen to face Calvin, they must win that game as well.  IMO, had the Scots beaten BW last year, they would have been hosting Transy and not the other way around.  I also feel that they can't afford more than 1 conference loss if they want a shot at hosting one or more NCAA tournament games.  Historically, Wooster has not fared well in NCAA tournament games when forced to go on the road, so they have to win as many in-region games as possible to put themselves in a good position to be a viable candidate to host some tournament games.

Quote from: David Collinge on October 04, 2006, 07:51:43 PM

If the Scots don't win at least 15 regular season conference games and reach the tourney finals, they're not making the NCAAs regardless of their regional record or SOSI.  If they do, they'll be at least 17-4 against NCAC opponents, and a win over a quality opponent such as Calvin or ONU might be enough to ensure a berth. 



DC, I'm not quite understanding your numbers from above.  If Wooster were to win 15 regular season conference games that would make them 15-1 in conference play.  If they were to make it to the finals and lose that would be a record of 17-2.  There is only a maximum of 19 conference games that could be played (16 regular season and 3 tournement games).  I agree with you in that if they were to win 15 conference games and make it to the tournment finals I think they are in.  With the expanded tournament, I think they get in regardless of the results against ONU or if they happen to meet Calvin.  As far as hosting tournament games is concerned, wins against ONU and Calvin would be a must.  Also, anything less than a one loss conference season coupled with a tournament title would hurt their hosting chances as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 05, 2006, 08:37:26 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on October 05, 2006, 10:57:26 AM
DC, I'm not quite understanding your numbers from above.  If Wooster were to win 15 regular season conference games that would make them 15-1 in conference play.  If they were to make it to the finals and lose that would be a record of 17-2. 

Oops.  I'm a lawyer; I don't do math.  :) I meant 13 regular season wins (13-3), not 15.  Add to that a 2-1 tourney record, and I arrive at 15-4 conference record as being the minimum for tournament consideration.  I don't know why I suddenly imagined an 18-game conference regular season.  Sorry.

It's possible that the Wooster braintrust has decided that, considering the low SOSI generated by most conference games, Wooster's hosting chances depend on their results vs. Wittenberg alone.  Two or three more wins against quality regional (i.e., OAC) opponents might not offset the many wins against sub-.500 teams combined with two or three losses to Witt.  (It's an even bigger Catch-22 with MIAA opponents; generally they play so few regional games, that it's not only possible that a Calvin, Hope, or Albion might slip to sub-.667 with a couple of upsets, but losing to Wooster makes that even more likely.)  So maybe the thinking is, play four tough NAIA games (2 on the road) to help prepare the team to play better on the road in the NCAAs, if it comes to that.  It's a way to better control your destiny, as opposed to trying to outwit the system.  Just a thought.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 05, 2006, 08:44:46 PM
From the Top 25 room:
Quote from: Titan Q on October 05, 2006, 06:24:19 PM
Street & Smith's Top 10 is...

1. Wooster
2. Mississippi College
3. Virginia Wesleyan
4. Baldwin-Wallace
5. St. Thomas
6. Amherst
7. Maryville (TN)
8. UW-Whitewater
9. William Paterson
10. Wittenberg

Their All-America team is:

1st
Brandon Adair, Virginia Wesleyan
James Cooper, Wooster
Tori Davis, Baldwin-Wallace
Isaac Rosefelt, St. Thomas
Tyler Winford, Mississippi College

2nd
Ton Ton Balenga, Virginia Wesleyan
Jon Krull, UW-Stevens Point
Luis Martinez, William Paterson
Tom Port, Wooster
Joe Werner, UW-LaCrosse

"Possible Breakthroughs" are:

Albright, Augustana, Bates, Bridgewater State, Calvin, Carroll, Claremont-Mudd-Scripps, Cortland, Hamilton, Hope, Howard Payne, John Carroll, Lincoln, Mass-Boston, Mass-Dartmouth, New Jersey City, New York U., North Central, Ohio Northern, Plattsburgh State, Randolph-Macon, Roanoke, Rochester, Rutgers-Newark, Scranton, St. John Fisher, St. John's, SUNY Potsdam, Tufts, Utica, Williams, UW-Oshkosh, UW-Stevens Point, UW-Stout, Worcester Poly, York

(emphasis added)

Take it for whatever it's worth.  S&S also has Georgetown (KY) as #7 in their NAIA poll; Georgetown is playing at Wooster on Nov. 28.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on October 05, 2006, 09:00:40 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on October 05, 2006, 08:44:46 PM
Take it for whatever it's worth. 

Uhm, someone from Wooster is paying of the street and smith guys??? :P ;)

Personally, with no disrespect intended toward Wooster at all, cause they're a fantastic basketball program, it baffles me how VaWes could not be the preseason #1 since they were the national champs with a very young squad last year. But oh well... I know you know this, it's still funny. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 05, 2006, 10:10:31 PM
Well, it's not terribly far-fetched.  Wooster returns their entire squad, except for PG Kyle Witucky, from a team that finished 26-4 and handed national runner-up Wittenberg two of their four losses.  Those returnees include two D3Hoops.com All Americans (http://www.d3hoops.com/tow/06/menallam06.htm) as well as the conference Player and Newcomer of the Year. (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mballncac.html)  Without doing any kind of analysis of the national scene, I anticipate that Wooster and Va. Wesleyan will both be in the D3Hoops.com preseason top 5, perhaps as the top two.

Wittenberg at #10 is a little more surprising to me, considering that they lost three key contributors (Russ, Brady, Steffes) from last seaon's outstanding team. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on October 05, 2006, 10:22:36 PM
It baffles me how the 4th best team at the Wittenberg Sectional last year can be considered #2.  I think Street and  Smiths just looked at returning rosters.




Hey DC, keep in mind the MIAA schools pick up 2 free in-region games with Tri-State games counting this year. 

14 conference games
up to 3 conference tournament games
whaterver in-region games

Calvin and Hope both have 2 potential in-region games off of memory, Albion has a couple as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on October 05, 2006, 10:36:22 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on October 05, 2006, 10:10:31 PM
Well, it's not terribly far-fetched.  Wooster returns their entire squad, except for PG Kyle Witucky, from a team that finished 26-4 and handed national runner-up Wittenberg two of their four losses.  Those returnees include two D3Hoops.com All Americans (http://www.d3hoops.com/tow/06/menallam06.htm) as well as the conference Player and Newcomer of the Year. (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mballncac.html)  Without doing any kind of analysis of the national scene, I anticipate that Wooster and Va. Wesleyan will both be in the D3Hoops.com preseason top 5, perhaps as the top two.

Wittenberg at #10 is a little more surprising to me, considering that they lost three key contributors (Russ, Brady, Steffes) from last seaon's outstanding team. 
yeah, but if it wasn't for the early fouls on justin wansley from RMC, you wouldn't have even gotten that far :P

I'm sure wooster has a shot at the top 5, beyond that I'm not speculating until I do more research... and I still think it would be absurd to pick anyone besides va was as #1.  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on October 05, 2006, 10:58:23 PM
April,

While I agree that Wesleyan should be pre-season #1, you've got the wrong state!

1996: IWU finished 3rd in the country, graduated 4 starters, leaving only junior Bryan Crabtree (soon to be POY).
1997: IWU won the national championship.

2006: IWU finished 3rd in the country, graduated 4 starters, leaving only junior Zach Freeman ( ???).
2007: IWU won  ???.

;D ;D ;D :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on October 05, 2006, 11:02:56 PM
2006: IWU finished 3rd in the country, graduated 4 starters, leaving only junior Zach Freeman ( ???).
2007: IWU won... maybe one game against NPU the entire season ;D

Remind me... in 1996 did you also lose your coach? and your #6, 7, 8, and 9 players in terms of minutes? ::)

I'm officially going to kick anyone who puts IWU in the top 25 for the preseason. They'd only be putting a recognized name in... and some recruits and jv guys who haven't proved anything yet. You don't lose 8 of your 9 contributers and your coach and start out in the top 25, I don't care what you did the season before, or how many games your school has won historically. :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on October 05, 2006, 11:10:42 PM
Aw,

Picky, picky!

You're right, of course, but how can I begin the intimidation process on any future opponents if you're gonna talk REALITY! ;D

More seriously, I've heard good enough things about the reserves and JV'ers, that I think IWU is still top half in the CCIW, and might even shock people by competing for the title (though that would shock me also).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 06, 2006, 01:16:27 AM
Just some thoughts:

How far out do DIII and NAIA teams set their non-conference schedules?  Is it just one year, or is it more?  If it's just a year or two, my first thought, simple as it is, was that Steve Moore, knowing Russ and Brady to be gone from Wittenberg and themselves to be loaded, figured that the Scots would win the NCAC's automatic bid easily so could load up on tough non-league games, whether in-region or not, to toughen themselves for the NCAAs.

I wouldn't pick James Cooper as an All-American, certainly not as a first-teamer.  The deeper into the season Wooster went last year, the more opposing teams realized they could take him out of the game by denying him the ball.  It takes determination and perseverence, but it can be done, and will be done again, until he learns to play and move better without the ball.  Maybe Street & Smiths has already talked to him about this and he's promised to do better. :-)

I ran into Coach Moore at the Case Western football game, and, no surprise, he said that Brandon Johnson will be the point guard.  I'm looking for an exceptional season from him, one in which he'll show enough that he might get some preseason All-American honors going into his junior year.  I hope that aside from all the big men recruits is a guard that can step in and get some minutes at the one spot to spell him as I don't think that Cooper or Fulk are really cut out for that role.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on October 06, 2006, 09:57:29 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on October 05, 2006, 10:58:23 PM
April,

While I agree that Wesleyan should be pre-season #1, you've got the wrong state!

1996: IWU finished 3rd in the country, graduated 4 starters, leaving only junior Bryan Crabtree (soon to be POY).
1997: IWU won the national championship.

2006: IWU finished 3rd in the country, graduated 4 starters, leaving only junior Zach Freeman ( ???).
2007: IWU won  ???.

;D ;D ;D :P

Chuck, you should just paste the original post from when you first figured this out whenever the mood strikes you to bring up this point again. I mean, heck, you're already wearing me out with it and we're still nine days away from the official start of practice.  ::) ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on October 07, 2006, 12:06:35 AM
quick, someone lookup where UW-Platteville was ranked pre-season the year after Bo Ryan became a Badger.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on October 07, 2006, 01:48:19 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on October 06, 2006, 09:57:29 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on October 05, 2006, 10:58:23 PM
April,

While I agree that Wesleyan should be pre-season #1, you've got the wrong state!

1996: IWU finished 3rd in the country, graduated 4 starters, leaving only junior Bryan Crabtree (soon to be POY).
1997: IWU won the national championship.

2006: IWU finished 3rd in the country, graduated 4 starters, leaving only junior Zach Freeman ( ???).
2007: IWU won  ???.

;D ;D ;D :P

Chuck, you should just paste the original post from when you first figured this out whenever the mood strikes you to bring up this point again. I mean, heck, you're already wearing me out with it and we're still nine days away from the official start of practice.  ::) ;)

Greg,

You seem to wear out rather quickly!

Unless you can show otherwise, I believe this was only its second iteration (at most third)  ;)

And I think its intriguing, even if you don't! :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on October 09, 2006, 11:39:43 AM
Then why does it feel as though you've been posting it all summer?

File this request under "heading off Chuck at the pass", then.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 20, 2006, 11:33:39 PM
At least Wooster won't be a unanimous pre-season #1.  According to the MIAA page, DIII News has released a pre-season top 25 and Wooster checks in at #6 with Wittenberg at #20. 

Here is the DIII pre-season top 25:

1. Virginia Wesleyan
2. Amherst
3. William Paterson
4. Baldwin-Wallace
5. Wisconsin Whitewater
6. Wooster
7. Mississippi College
8. Widener
9. St. Thomas
10. Tufts
11. Ursinus
12. Randolph-Macon
13. Scranton
14. Hope
15. Augustana
16. WPI
17. Coe
18. Lawrence
19. Claremont
20. Wittenberg
21. Lincoln (Pa.)
22. Maryville (Tenn.)
23. Occidental
24. Gordon
25. St. John Fisher

Personally, I like this one better than the S&S.  Keep that bullseye off of the Scots for as long as we can please. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on October 21, 2006, 09:08:57 AM
Does anyone know when the scrimmages are to be played?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on October 21, 2006, 10:26:46 AM
Quote from: goscots on October 21, 2006, 09:08:57 AM
Does anyone know when the scrimmages are to be played?

This is what I've got on the Scots' scrimmages:

Sunday, October 22      Intrasquad Scrimmage  2:00 p.m.
Saturday, Oct. 28         Black/Gold Scrimmage  11:00 a.m.
Friday, Nov. 3               Scrimmage @ Otterbein  6:00 p.m.  (probably only taking the upperclassman)
Saturday, Nov. 4          Freshman scrimmage vs. Lakeland Community College  10:00 p.m. (at Wooster)
Monday, Nov. 6            Downtown Rebounders Meet the Team Night. 
Wednesday, Nov. 8      Scrimmage vs. Ashland University  7:00 p.m. (at Wooster)
Saturday, Nov. 11        Exhibition Game vs. Alumni Team   7:00 p.m.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on October 21, 2006, 11:03:42 AM
Thanks for the info cmhscots.  Is the intra squad on Sunday open to the public? I could possibly swing through. I'd like to see some of the new players.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 22, 2006, 10:03:02 AM
Thanks, cmh, for that schedule.  Never gone to one of their scrimmages before, but I'm antsy to get this season underway and maybe seeing them in action will temporarily sate me. (Took 59 years for me to work the word "sate" into a sentence, so I don't care if I used it correctly or not. :))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on October 22, 2006, 10:26:08 PM
I made it over to the scrimmage today.  They spilt the squad into 3 5-man teams and 1 6-man team.  Each team played 2 16-minute games with no subs except for the 6-man team.

I thought the star of the day was Brandon Johnson.  He played great defense, ran the offense well, and provided scoring when needed.  Among the veterans Port, Vandervaart and Fulk also looked really good.  Cooper looked OK in his first game, but didn't do much in the 2nd.  I think that he needs to work a little harder on offense when he doesn't have the ball.

I'm not sure who most of the newcomers were, but some looked like they were ready to contribute.  Once of the point guards (#21 - maybe Kyle Molz) consistently hit 3's from a few feet outside the arc and was the clear leader of his team in the 2nd game.  A couple of the big guys looked OK, but still need some seasoning.  Battista at times looked a little lost in the offense and didn't contribute much, but he did nail all of his FT's. 

Overall, I thought it was pretty good for an early scrimmage.  Sloppy at times, but you could see that there is a ton of talent on this team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 22, 2006, 10:43:11 PM
cmh -

I was there, too, and would completely agree with your assessment, although I didn't stay for the fourth game.  Kyle Molz seemed to be the class of the freshmen, and Brandon Johnson was superb; he's gonna go down as one of the best Scot players ever before he's through.  All the other returnees looked sharp and played hard, except for Van Horn.  Damned kid only hit the floor about every fifteen seconds.  One of these days he'll learn to hustle. :)

Jack
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on October 22, 2006, 10:55:13 PM
Any comment on VanHorn, Will, and/or Bidwell?  Obviously I didn't get there but the initial observations from cmh sound good.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on October 23, 2006, 05:36:29 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on October 20, 2006, 11:33:39 PM
At least Wooster won't be a unanimous pre-season #1.  According to the MIAA page, DIII News has released a pre-season top 25 and Wooster checks in at #6 with Wittenberg at #20. 

Here is the DIII pre-season top 25:

1. Virginia Wesleyan
2. Amherst
3. William Paterson
4. Baldwin-Wallace
5. Wisconsin Whitewater
6. Wooster
7. Mississippi College
8. Widener
9. St. Thomas
10. Tufts
11. Ursinus
12. Randolph-Macon
13. Scranton
14. Hope
15. Augustana
16. WPI
17. Coe
18. Lawrence
19. Claremont
20. Wittenberg
21. Lincoln (Pa.)
22. Maryville (Tenn.)
23. Occidental
24. Gordon
25. St. John Fisher

Personally, I like this one better than the S&S.  Keep that bullseye off of the Scots for as long as we can please. 

I didn't think much of this poll at all. Some of these schools (UW-Whitewater, Lawrence, and Augustana all come to mind) lost most of their big guns from last season. Heck, I'll bet that Augie gets picked no higher than third in the CCIW preseason coaches poll (not that the CCIW coaches have a good track record when it comes to prognosticating). And Augie might not even be picked that high.

I also have to question the astuteness of any poll that puts two SCIAC teams in the Top 25. One, maybe. But not two. It's just not a very strong league at all, not even in the haves-and-have-nots sense of the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 23, 2006, 08:34:16 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on October 23, 2006, 05:36:29 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on October 20, 2006, 11:33:39 PM

Personally, I like this one better than the S&S.  Keep that bullseye off of the Scots for as long as we can please. 

I didn't think much of this poll at all.

GS, I wasn't saying what I said because I thought the poll overall was accurate.  I was just glad that they didn't have a bullseye on Wooster like the S&S poll does.  While it's nice to be thought of as the #1 team in the country, it does bring with it a lot of unneeded pressure.  Personally, I don't put too much stock into any pre-season polls, but the one they do here is the one that I will look to as being the most accurate.  I do agree with you in that I was questioning some of the teams in that poll.  Usually the S&S poll can be just as questionable IMHO.  Case in point, putting Wooster as the team to beat above the defending national champions who return just about their entire team as well. ::)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 23, 2006, 08:45:45 AM
Thanks for the updates from the Scot's scrimmage cmh and WB.  Nice to hear that Brandon Johnson is looking so good.  I had a good feeling about him taking over the point duties for Witucky this season.  It's hard to imagine losing a player as valuable as Kyle was to this team and not really skipping a beat, but I actually think that Brandon has the ability to bring even more to the position than Kyle did.

Quote from: Wooster Booster on October 06, 2006, 01:16:27 AM

I ran into Coach Moore at the Case Western football game, and, no surprise, he said that Brandon Johnson will be the point guard.  I'm looking for an exceptional season from him, one in which he'll show enough that he might get some preseason All-American honors going into his junior year.  I hope that aside from all the big men recruits is a guard that can step in and get some minutes at the one spot to spell him as I don't think that Cooper or Fulk are really cut out for that role.


From the sounds of it, at least early on, it looks like Kyle Moltz might be that freshman eh?  Cooper and Fulk are more of a shooting guard as opposed to point guards and I agree that they aren't really suited for that role.  I know it's early, but we already know that Kyle's brother was pretty good down at Witt, so it's not too far-fetched to think he could come in and be a contributor right away at the point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 25, 2006, 09:55:29 PM
Wooster has posted the Season Outlook on their website.

Here is a link: http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/outlook.php


GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on October 28, 2006, 03:44:37 PM
Took a peek at the Black vs Gold scrimmage today. The Scots looked very good, especially the returning letterman. Not sure of all the freshman but the Gold team was Vandervaart, Will, Cooper, Johnson, and Bidwell. The Black team had Port, Van Horn and Fulk plus what I saw as the two best freshman, Craig Elam and Kyle Molz. Pretty balanced game until the end with Gold winning something like 91-84. As written in last weeks scrimmage Johnson looked real good running the offense. Port was strong to the hoop and shooting well and Vandervaart might have had a triple double (he had a ton of assists).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 28, 2006, 06:40:50 PM
...and the defense?  ???  175-odd points in a scrimmage doesn't suggest that defense is a high priority, unless this was a for-the-fans kind of scrimmage. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on October 28, 2006, 10:41:44 PM
A couple point to consider from the scrimmage:

1. It was Wooster versus Wooster and both teams were pushing it up the floor (no walking it across mid court).

2. 12 of the 20 players were freshman and it showed at times.

3. Outside shooting was pretty good (Fulk, Cooper, Johnson, Port & Molz all hit well from beyond the arc)

but to your point DC, it will be interesting to see if the scrimmages against Otterbein and Ashland show more defensive results...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 29, 2006, 09:42:21 AM
What is the normal format for an intercollegiate scrimmage, such as when Wooster will play Otterbein and host Ashland?  Same as a game, two 20 minutes halves with stoppage of the clock, fouling out, etc.?  Do the coaches sometimes stop play to teach?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 29, 2006, 03:06:56 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on October 29, 2006, 09:42:21 AM
What is the normal format for an intercollegiate scrimmage, such as when Wooster will play Otterbein and host Ashland?  Same as a game, two 20 minutes halves with stoppage of the clock, fouling out, etc.?  Do the coaches sometimes stop play to teach?

I haven't been to many Wooster scrimmages, but I went to one a few years back when the scrimmaged Akron at the Jar.  They played it like a regular game from what I can remember.  But that was one of their final scrimmages so I'm not sure if all their scrimmages are held the same way or not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on October 29, 2006, 08:21:01 PM
I haven't seen very many scrimmages either (actually just one other) but on Saturday it was run like a real game with one exception - Coach Moore stood on the court and would speak to various players at a break in play but he never interupted the game. Coach Cline ran the Black team and Erich Riebe ran the Gold team. In the end the scrimmage did have some intensity to it as all the letterman were on the floor and wanted to win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on October 30, 2006, 03:22:53 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on October 29, 2006, 09:42:21 AM
What is the normal format for an intercollegiate scrimmage, such as when Wooster will play Otterbein and host Ashland?  Same as a game, two 20 minutes halves with stoppage of the clock, fouling out, etc.?  Do the coaches sometimes stop play to teach?

It's completely up to the coaches of the respective teams. Sometimes it'll be a full-clock 40-minute game. Sometimes it'll be two 20-minute halves, with the score reset to 0-0 at the intermission. Sometimes the clock is run continuously; sometimes the clock is run normally. It's common for teams with JV squads, or who have deep varsity rosters, to play a JV half as well, or a JV quarter. Sometimes the two coaches will agree to run specific scenarios (e.g., Team A up by two points with 30 seconds left, Team B has the ball; followed by Team B is up by three with a minute left, Team A is shooting a 1-and-1; etc.) as a supplement to the scrimmage. I've seen the full gamut of scrimmaging possibilities over the years.

However, I've never seen an intercollegiate scrimmage stopped so that a coach can walk onto the floor and make a specific teaching point, although this may be something that's seen in intrasquad scrimmages (NPU has never played intrasquad scrimmages, so I don't know this for sure). When a coach has wanted to make a teaching point in any intercollegiate scrimmage that I've ever watched, he's done it in the traditional way by calling a timeout.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on October 30, 2006, 04:09:13 PM
hey guys remember me-yes i am annoying but at times i have some substance in my responses that is worthwhile. I think Wittenberg has a shot at another good season, though it will be extremely hard to top what we acheived last season in which should have been the ultimate achievement, a national championship.

We have some good talent coming back, but i have yet to measure the success that our run last year has had on our freshman, as i have yet to see the team in person. Wittenberg and Wooster willc ompete undoubtedly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Blue Russian on October 30, 2006, 07:55:17 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on October 02, 2006, 02:25:50 PM
Pat,

In regards to the story on the front page about the Collegiate Basketball Invitational, I was wondering if you knew if this would be open to the public?

I wonder how Wadswoth, OH ended up as the destination of such an event?  Seems like quite the odd choice if you ask me.  Not that I'm complaining, because if it is open to the public it will be a good opportunity to see some quality hoops on display.



HAS ANYONE SEEN ANY MORE INFO ON THIS NEW PROGRAM?  THANKS.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on November 01, 2006, 07:52:07 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on October 30, 2006, 04:09:13 PM


We have some good talent coming back, but i have yet to measure the success that our run last year has had on our freshman, as i have yet to see the team in person. Wittenberg and Wooster willc ompete undoubtedly.

Yeh, with the addition of Michael Jordan to the team, Witt will dominate. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 01, 2006, 05:34:53 PM
The preseason poll is out, and Wooster not unexpectedly starts out as the #2 choice behind Va. Wesleyan.  I was mildly surprised that the Marlins were such an overwhelming #1 (23 first-place and 2 second-place votes), but it is richly deserved.  Wooster grabbed one of those stray #1 votes (Amherst the other), but was nearly 4 full places behind on the average ballot (538 points, or about 21 1/2 points per ballot, the equivalent of midway between #4 and #5 on the average ballot).  The Scots do have about a one-position (26 pts.) advantage on #3 Amherst.

Wittenberg starts out at a solid #10, amassing 298 points (about #14 on the average ballot).  And kudos to Ohio Wesleyan, snatching 11 votes to finish in the middle of the Others Receiving Votes field. 

Wooster's Mose Hole Classic opponents are all highly regarded:  first round opponent Ohio Northern is #5, while Calvin is #8 and UW-La Crosse is the equivalent of #26.

Besides ONU, the OAC is represented by Baldwin-Wallace at #6; aside from #8 Calvin, the MIAA is represented by #14 Hope.  Notable by their absence is Albion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 01, 2006, 07:20:25 PM
From the front page story about the preseason top 25:
QuoteNational runner-up Wittenberg lost its two top post players and comes in at No. 10[...]
emphasis added

Has Dane Borchers decided not to return after all?  Or is this a charitable reference to Kenny Brady?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Blue Russian on November 01, 2006, 09:40:24 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 01, 2006, 07:20:25 PM
From the front page story about the preseason top 25:
QuoteNational runner-up Wittenberg lost its two top post players and comes in at No. 10[...]
emphasis added

Has Dane Borchers decided not to return after all?  Or is this a charitable reference to Kenny Brady?




I can't comment on the article, but I can assure you Dane Borchers is playing for Witt this coming season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 02, 2006, 09:36:45 AM
Quote from: Blue Russian on November 01, 2006, 09:40:24 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 01, 2006, 07:20:25 PM
From the front page story about the preseason top 25:
QuoteNational runner-up Wittenberg lost its two top post players and comes in at No. 10[...]
emphasis added

Has Dane Borchers decided not to return after all?  Or is this a charitable reference to Kenny Brady?




I can't comment on the article, but I can assure you Dane Borchers is playing for Witt this coming season.

Yeah, I highly doubt Witt lands in the #10 spot losing Borchers along with Russ and Brady. 

As far as the rankings go, at least the top 2 look as I expected.  I just can't figure out the love affair with Amherst though.  According to the article on the front page, they lost 3 key contributors from last year's team, yet they are still #3.  Also, regarding Amherst and  that lone 1st place vote.  If I'm not mistaken, weren't they receiving one 1st place vote throughout the year last year?  Looks like that voter is at it again this year.  Also, I was a bit surprised to see ONU ahead of B-W.   I knew the Polar Bears were going to be good this year, but I just didn't expect them coming into the season ranked ahead of B-W.

I can't wait for the season to get started if you couldn't tell, and this preseason poll means it's all the more closer.  I'm going to try to make it to the scrimmage next Wednesday vs. Ashland to catch a glimpse of the new faces and see how the team looks. 

Just a question, but how sparse to you figure the crowd to be at the finals of the Al Van Wie, being that it will be tipping off roughly around when The Game is finishing up?  I think you can count me out as I will have probably partook in one too many Great Lakes X-mas Ales while watching The Game. :P  I'll resign to listening to it on the radio.  I will be there for the season opener on Friday night though. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 02, 2006, 11:26:40 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 02, 2006, 09:36:45 AMI just can't figure out the love affair with Amherst though.  According to the article on the front page, they lost 3 key contributors from last year's team, yet they are still #3.  Also, regarding Amherst and  that lone 1st place vote.  If I'm not mistaken, weren't they receiving one 1st place vote throughout the year last year? 
Well, Wittenberg lost 3 key contributors (Russ, Brady, Steffes) and they're #10.  There are very few programs with the sustained excellence that Wittenberg and Amherst can boast.  Amherst was an outstanding team last season, and was very nearly the national champion.  I think it is perfectly plausible that they are reloading rather than rebuilding this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on November 02, 2006, 11:39:56 AM
http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/roster06-07.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 02, 2006, 07:08:49 PM
The  NCAC Preseason Basketball Polls  (http://www.northcoast.org/bkbmediaday/ncacbkbpolls0607.pdf) were released today.

Wooster is a near unanimous choice in both the coaches and media polls.  Wooster garnered all but one 1st place vote in the coaches' poll and all but three 1st place votes in the media poll.  Wittenberg is picked 2nd in both polls followed by OWU, Earlham, Wabash, Allegheny, Denison and Kenyon.  Hiram and Oberlin swap cellar dwellar positions in each poll.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 02, 2006, 09:15:52 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 02, 2006, 09:36:45 AMI just can't figure out the love affair with Amherst though.  According to the article on the front page, they lost 3 key contributors from last year's team, yet they are still #3.

The article is misleading, ScotsFan. One of those "three key contributors" that was mentioned by name, Ray Corrigan, only played in 25 of Amherst's 32 games, and he averaged only 8.3 minutes per game. He barely made a dent in the scorebook, recording a whopping 1.4 ppg and 0.7 rpg. Yeah, perhaps he was a locker-room leader or an inspirational team motivator, but I doubt that they'll miss a player like that in terms of actual on-the-floor production.

The Lord Jeffs return three of last year's starters, three of last year's top five scorers, and three of last year's top five rebounders. Considering the fact that they, like Wooster, have been consistently ranked in the Top 25 throughout this decade, plus the fact that the folks over in the NESCAC room are giving Amherst a lot of preseason props, it's safe to say that this wasn't that big of a reach for the pollsters. Could they be this year's UW-Oshkosh? Sure, but so could your Scots, for that matter. That's the thing about preseason polls -- they're educated guesses. There are no guarantees, no matter how loaded a team looks on paper.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 03, 2006, 08:29:05 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 02, 2006, 09:15:52 PM

The article is misleading, ScotsFan. One of those "three key contributors" that was mentioned by name, Ray Corrigan, only played in 25 of Amherst's 32 games, and he averaged only 8.3 minutes per game. He barely made a dent in the scorebook, recording a whopping 1.4 ppg and 0.7 rpg.

I was just going by the article.  I figured when they mention 3 key contributors, I didn't figure one of them barely scratched out a point a game.  I didn't really look into them any further than that. 

FYI, Georgetown KY, whom Wooster hosts on Nov. 28th, nearly knocked of Louisville last night in an exhibition at Freedom Hall.  The final score was 94-92.  The write-up I read about the game mentioned that Georgetown has 7 DI transfers on their roster. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 03, 2006, 11:14:42 AM
Ha!  They can't even beat Louisville?  Another easy Wooster win coming up. ;)

Crap, that's the one game I'm probably going to miss due to being out of town.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 03, 2006, 11:42:14 AM
Blue Russian,

I'm guessing based on your username that you are familiar with Russia, Ohio and Russia high school. What do you know about a big kid that is going to be a freshman this year at OWU? Sounds like he could be pretty good.

I really think this is going to be the year that OWU puts itself into the Top-25. They have a lot of talent across the board. If they can avoid the couple of clunker losses they seem to take early in the year, I can see them finishing the regular season with just 4 or 5 losses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 03, 2006, 07:55:41 PM
Wooster has now posted its 2006-07 roster. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/roster.php)  It's not terribly enlightening, as it includes 20 players (including 12 frosh), all with uniform numbers.  I certainly can't tell who's varsity and who's JV. 

The 8 upperclassmen are the 8 who saw significant PT last year;  the end of last year's bench has gone missing (Yoder, Stevens, Drake, Clapacs, Chisnell.)  I think Jamie Yoder transferred; Jeff Clapacs is a student assistant this season, as he was last year.  Of the 12 frosh, half are backcourt players (5 guards and a G/F) and half are frontcourters (3 forwards, two F/C's, and 6'2" Jason Ronyak, curiously listed as a "G/C.")  I should also note that both Fulk and Van Horn are ambiguously listed as "G/F" (that's guard/forward, not girlfriend, I presume. :D)

All together there's seven guards (all 6'2" and under), three guard/forwards, six forwards (6'4" to 6'6"), three forward/centers (Vandervaart along with frosh Battista and Melick, both 6'8"), and one 6'2" "guard/center."  Melick has a 35 pound advantage on Battista; 6'8"/240 sounds like a return to the old Gorman/Ellenwood type of post player.  Can any of you scrimmage attenders report on Melick's game?

I also note with interest that Nate Gaubatz is listed as an assistant coach this season (so is Erich Riebe, but we already knew that.)  Welcome home, Nate!  Patrick Rufener is gone from the coaching roster, as is Rodney Mitchell; does anyone know where these gents have gone? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 03, 2006, 08:50:02 PM
I'm guessing that the 6'2" G/C is someone's typo - but maybe not!

Back in the 60s, Bradley was a d1 top 25 team with a 6'4" center (Joe Allen).  More amazingly, since Joe had a club-foot(!), opposing centers were guarded by a 6'2" jumping jack named Willie Betts.  One year Bradley played Louisville, Houston, and UCLA.  My memory says that Willie held Wes Unseld, Elvin Hayes, and Kareem Abdul-Jabbar EACH to their lowest scoring totals of their college careers!  Common sense tells me that my memory is probably exaggerating somewhat, but that guy was an ASTOUNDING defender!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 03, 2006, 10:53:52 PM
The typo'd guy was probably 6'2" freshman Jason Ronyak, now listed as a G/F.  Poor kid probably panicked when he saw the roster online and quickly, deciding he wasn't up for that inside pounding, called someone to have the correction made.

I don't remember which guy Melick was.  There was one big guy that had a Blake Mealer-like build and could shoot from the outside, but I don't know if that was him.

Joe Allen was a sophomore in my freshman year at Bradley.  Betts, I think, was also a sophomore.  That season Betts came off the bench, behind senior forwards Ernie Thompson and Eddie Jackson.  He was a leaper, though, a terrific athlete.  Allen himself was a bull underneath, although Wesley Unsled (as we called him) was bigger and stronger, if not necessarily tougher.  A fun team to watch, especially since pregame dunking was allowed back then in layup lines.  The Braves had a TON of spectacular dunkers, the best of which was Walt Slater, another backup forward.  He was doing stuff (granted, it was usually just in warmups) that wasn't seen again in college for years due to the ban on dunking.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on November 03, 2006, 11:20:02 PM
Ahhh ... Another year, another season, and yet more, another series of posts.  I'm glad to be back and hopefully we will have a fun filled season.

Quote from: David Collinge on November 03, 2006, 07:55:41 PM
I also note with interest that Nate Gaubatz is listed as an assistant coach this season (so is Erich Riebe, but we already knew that.)  Welcome home, Nate!  Patrick Rufener is gone from the coaching roster, as is Rodney Mitchell; does anyone know where these gents have gone? 

My understanding is that Rodney is now attending graduate school at Ashland University.  I am not too sure about the other gentleman.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 03, 2006, 11:26:29 PM
Woo Boo,

Small world!  I didn't realize you were a Bradley grad!  I grew up in Peoria, then went to IWU in 66, and Michigan in 70 - been here ever since.  (My mom was a lecturer in speech at BU, but not until the 70s.)

I'm guessing we must be reliving a season of roughly 64 (63? 65?)?  I KNOW that Betts held Unseld, Hayes, and Jabbar well under their averages - any recollection as to whether my memory is actually correct, or only somewhat inflated?!

I've checked everywhere I can think of to check, but no confirmation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on November 04, 2006, 12:53:44 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 02, 2006, 09:15:52 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 02, 2006, 09:36:45 AMI just can't figure out the love affair with Amherst though.  According to the article on the front page, they lost 3 key contributors from last year's team, yet they are still #3.

The article is misleading, ScotsFan. One of those "three key contributors" that was mentioned by name, Ray Corrigan, only played in 25 of Amherst's 32 games, and he averaged only 8.3 minutes per game. He barely made a dent in the scorebook, recording a whopping 1.4 ppg and 0.7 rpg.

I was going by what Amherst reported to us under the "Names of departing starters or key contributors" category.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on November 04, 2006, 12:54:48 AM
If only people knew how to use e-mail instead of posting notes on message boards. I don't read every board every six hours.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 04, 2006, 01:23:11 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 03, 2006, 11:26:29 PM
Woo Boo,

Small world!  I didn't realize you were a Bradley grad!  I grew up in Peoria, then went to IWU in 66, and Michigan in 70 - been here ever since.  (My mom was a lecturer in speech at BU, but not until the 70s.)

I'm guessing we must be reliving a season of roughly 64 (63? 65?)?  I KNOW that Betts held Unseld, Hayes, and Jabbar well under their averages - any recollection as to whether my memory is actually correct, or only somewhat inflated?!

I've checked everywhere I can think of to check, but no confirmation.

I'd thought we'd talked about this a bit last season, but maybe not.

I'm not a Bradley alum; only attended for a year and a half.  I was there for the 1965-66 season and half of the 1966-67 season.  My freshman year Bradley had a terrific freshman team that included forwards L.C. Bowen and Calvin Criddle and guard Al Smith (Peoria Manual High) who went on to play in the A.B.A.  That season, the varsity was invited to the N.I.T. but the school's board of whatever turned it down, inciting a large campus protest.  I was at the front of the march and got my picture on the front page of the Peoria Journal-Star.  I wish I had a copy of that issue. :)

My sophomore year, which ended after the fall semester due to spending too much time shooting pool (school champ, and was scheduled to play an exhibition match against Willie Mosconi but I was gone before he came to town), the basketball was again very good.  They beat a very good USC team (who had beaten Alcindor and UCLA 40-35) but lost to Louisville when Unseld and Butch Beard (52 points, probably still the Robertson Fieldhouse record) dominated.  That season, I'm guessing that Betts was a junior, but not at all sure.

That 52 point effort by Beard (later of the New York Knicks and others) was probably the best shooting performance I've ever seen.  He was a guard, and connected for 25 field goals and only two free throws.  He missed VERY few shots, and remember this was before anyone except the progressive A.B.A. had the three-point line.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Blue Russian on November 04, 2006, 07:45:06 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on November 03, 2006, 11:42:14 AM
Blue Russian,

I'm guessing based on your username that you are familiar with Russia, Ohio and Russia high school. What do you know about a big kid that is going to be a freshman this year at OWU? Sounds like he could be pretty good.

I really think this is going to be the year that OWU puts itself into the Top-25. They have a lot of talent across the board. If they can avoid the couple of clunker losses they seem to take early in the year, I can see them finishing the regular season with just 4 or 5 losses.

Wow, I'm impressed with your knowledge of all the teams and incoming freshman. Yes, OWU picked up a 6'8 freshman, Brent Plieman who will definitely help them this year. A solid big frame athlete, great hands,  and a soft touch, who used his body well. OWU only had 4 conference losses last year after splitting with Wooster, they possibly could have even less this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on November 04, 2006, 10:35:51 AM
Was at Otter last night for the scrimmage--business as usual for the Scots.  The Bein held tough for the first 20, hitting a bunch of 3's and tough shots to stay within 10.  The Scots pushed the lead to 20 in the 2nd and cruised to a victory--102-83 I think, leading wire to wire.   

A bit sloppy at times, but a solid performance by Wooster.    The only frosh that saw action was Craig Elam, a 6'6", 245 lb. forward from Dayton Carroll.   He really flowed with the offense, played decent D and can board.  I was most impressed by his natural instincts--his floor "sense" or presence.  He's got enormous potential IMO.  He's wearing #44 as well--and from Dayton--comparisons will start immediately.

The Scots look loaded and ready--

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 04, 2006, 11:04:05 AM
Is Otterbein supposed to be any good?  Is Craig Elam the grandson of Jack Elam?  Is so, he oughta be tough enough. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on November 04, 2006, 10:55:04 PM
It is late and I just came in from hunting for Bambi's Mom and Dad... I will post more later.

After a quick review of the updates on Wooster's Website and posts of course I am exciting about the season coming up!  I always am very excited.  Any team that returns 8 of top 9 players should be anxiou to get the season started.

I have not seen too many Batisistta updates.  I guess previously unheralded frosh Craig Elam will help in the post.  But I was hoping that the MI Center would live up to the hype.  And of course I am still concerned about a imposing schedule.  More to follow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on November 05, 2006, 12:56:11 AM
Just saw this weekend that Wooster opponent Georgetown out of Kentucky played Louisville tough. Yes, that's Rick Pitino's Louisville, I believe the final in an exhibition between the 2 teams was 96-92 in favor of the Cardinals. Let's hope the Scots don't take any early season matchups lightly because this could be the toughest non-conf. schedule the Scots have seen in the 2000's.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 05, 2006, 08:26:36 AM
fighting_scots,

Thanks for the update on the scrimmage.  Just a question.  You mentioned Elam as being the only frosh who saw pt.  I was wondering who the Scots rotated at the point guard position.  After hearing good things about Moltz, I thought he might be a candidate to come off the bench to give B. Johnson a rest.  Who ran the point when Johnson was on the bench?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 05, 2006, 09:11:06 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 05, 2006, 08:26:36 AM
fighting_scots,

Thanks for the update on the scrimmage.  Just a question.  You mentioned Elam as being the only frosh who saw pt.  I was wondering who the Scots rotated at the point guard position.  After hearing good things about Moltz, I thought he might be a candidate to come off the bench to give B. Johnson a rest.  Who ran the point when Johnson was on the bench?

Cooper ran point when Johnson was on the bench. 

I'm not sure that I would read too much into the fact that Elam was the only freshman that saw playing time with the regulars.  I understand that there is a rule that players can only participate in 3 pre-season scrimmages.  With the freshman scrimmage yesterday morning they have a total of 4, so the frosh were split up.  There were several other freshman that played in a 15-minute scrimmage after the main event against Ott.  I think that we'll see a more representative rotation against Ashland and the alums this week.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 06, 2006, 06:03:12 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 03, 2006, 08:29:05 AMFYI, Georgetown KY, whom Wooster hosts on Nov. 28th, nearly knocked of Louisville last night in an exhibition at Freedom Hall.  The final score was 94-92.  The write-up I read about the game mentioned that Georgetown has 7 DI transfers on their roster. 

Ah, there's nothing like the good ol' NAIA.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on November 06, 2006, 02:56:53 PM
Yes, Georgetown looked good against Louisville, giving them all that they could handle.  Georgetown is preseason #7 in NAIA Division I.
U of L played 13 players but only 7 got double figure minutes and 2 others got 9 minutes.  G'town played 9 and four guys fouled out guarding the UofL bigs.  They shot 27 3's hitting 8-16 in the second half to stay in the game.  Pitino stated that his team played lousy defense and had poor execution on offense and they did not start star freshman post player or play him much.

G'town does have seven DI transfers from Houston, Temple, Miami(OH), UNLV, S.Carolina St, Wright St and TN Tech.  Transfers also come from KY Weslyan and NKU.  Yikes, by far I think this is the toughest opponent on the schedule this year. 
At least we have them at HOME.

I am especially anxious this year over how the big men will develop.  The pressure defense and wide open full court style is not good for my hyper tension or good in the NCAA tourament so I hope our bigs will develop over the season to contribute in the half court offense and defense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 08, 2006, 03:18:32 PM
I see D3Hoops.com has posted its preseason All-American team. Cooper is 1st team. Interesting that Tom Port is not on the team. He was 4th team All-American at the end of last year, so to drop off the list this year doesn't make a lot of sense. I wonder if they missed the fact that he is back this year, since he was listed as a senior last year. Welton from Aurora was 5th team All-American last year at forward, but is now 2nd team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 08, 2006, 05:04:25 PM
Congratulations also to Wittenberg's Dane Borchers, selected as a preseason All-American, 4th team.

I can assure you that the staff at D3Hoops.com is fully aware that Tom Port will be playing this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 08, 2006, 06:31:46 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on November 08, 2006, 03:18:32 PM
Interesting that Tom Port is not on the team. He was 4th team All-American at the end of last year, so to drop off the list this year doesn't make a lot of sense.
Seinfeld, you're right, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense.  I could understand if there were a lot of underclassmen at the forward position ahead of Port, but Tori Davis of B-WC and Brandon Adair of VWU were the only non-seniors at the forward postition ahead of Port in last years post-season All-America teams.  It doesn't make much sense that Larry Welton of Aurora would go from HM All-America at the end of last season to 2nd team pre-season All-American while Port goes from 4th team All-American (ahead of Welton) to being left off the pre-season All-American teams altogether.  Oh well, it's making the post season All-America team that really counts anyways.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 08, 2006, 11:04:42 PM
Wooster played Ashland University tonight in a scrimmage. Just in case some of you don't know, AU is Division II. This was a very up tempo game with both teams running it up and down the floor. At one time in the middle of the first half I think there were about 8 possessions in one minute of play with not alot of scoring.

Wooster took a lead early (14-7) but then Ashland came back to tie it late in the first and the halftime score was 39-37 Wooster.  Cooper and Fulk were cold in the first half but the front line looked good.

In the second half it stayed close for about 10 minutes before Wooster started pulling away when AU couldn't hit from the outside and Wooster did. Lead got to about 18 before it settled at 96-81 (maybe wrong about the lower score). 

The only freshman to play in the game was Elam and he did OK.  This was a good scrimmage for Wooster because AU was bigger and very athletic but Woosters depth prevailed in the end.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 08, 2006, 11:38:08 PM
I'm pretty sure the final score was 96-84.  At any rate, I remember mentally noting that Wooster won by 12.

The Scots looked pretty much as expected.  Tom Port seems to be back to his pre-injury form, getting into the paint more with nice moves for short jumpers.  Brandon Johnson ran the point well and was able to occasionally beat his man off the dribble.  Fulk's shot was off at first but then he found the range.  Evan Will didn't do much offensively but crashed the boards hard.  Tim Vandervaart "Vandervaart'ed" defenders inside with his lateral quickness and persistent spin moves.  Andy Van Horn and Marty Bidwell were their normal pesky selves, generally running amok and creating havoc, in a good way, as only those two can do.  (At one point, Bidwell appeared to commit about four fouls in two seconds, on the same guy, had none of them called, and his man, frazzled, was whistled for travelling.)  James Cooper had some trouble shooting and breaking down his man, but on the defensive end looked much improved.

It appears, at least early on, that none of the freshmen will get many minutes in the normal rotations.  Tonight only Elam saw the floor, with maybe four minutes or so in each half.  Backup point guard responsibility seems to be in James Cooper's hands, at least for the moment.

I have it from a semi-reliable source ( ;)) that Saturday's alumni team will include former Scot standouts Bryan Nelson, Antoine Reynolds, Rodney Mitchell, and Kyle Witucky, among others.  Sounds like fun.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 10, 2006, 12:04:12 PM
I feel very out of the loop, but here's what I do know about Earlham this season. First, I thought the preseason #4 spot in both polls was a little high. I had anticipated #5 or #6. Of course, it proves that those really are, in most cases, a reflection of last year's finish.

Earlham loses Brandon Miller and Tyler Stewart to graduation. Miller's skills were very well known, while Stewart was a steady ball handler who also hit big shots now and again (OWU at the buzzer last year). Oh, and of course, Earlham also lost Bronson Lickliter...whose great story of coming back to earn his masters degree and play one last year was chronicled in the Indy Star. By the way, Lickliter is now coaching at New Castle and the Trojans are one of the finalists to be featured on MTV's Two-a-Days basketball reality show. I'd love to see Bronson on MTV...especially if he were to sing Tom Waitts tunes while inebriated (not saying I've seen it, but I've seen it).

It was a good retention year for Earlham standards. The only player not back this year is Kyle Edwards, who was very little used post player last year as a freshman. Jewett and Henry should shoulder the scoring load, while Tristian Gregory should provide the 3-point threat that EC has lacked the last couple years.

Big man Nick Welsh is also back, and hopefully healthy, after missing much of last season with a stress fracture. Terrel Brown and Joe Rihm will eat minutes once they come back from playing football.

I'm hoping for big things from Neil Collins. I've always thought he's shown promise, but has been hurt by inconsistency. He might be the starter on opening night against DePauw.

I don't know much about the freshmen, but the ones to watch are Tarell Berry and Dereck Briggs...they are both nice athletes. Briggs, at 6-8 (and he can move), could see a ton of early playing time.

Quakers open next Friday at a tournament at the University of Chicago. They'll play DePauw in the first game...it should be a competitive weekend.

Roster and schedule linked below:

http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/2006-07/roster/index.html (http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/2006-07/roster/index.html)

http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/2006-07/schedule/index.html (http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/2006-07/schedule/index.html)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: whoknows on November 10, 2006, 11:33:09 PM
OWU looked very good tonight in their scrimmage against Otterbein despite the final score. they were very physical and took OTT out of their game early, even getting up by as much as 12 but the second half was different. Ott came back and really steped it up from the inside. I think OWU getting some votes in the national poll is a little premature. Ott big man was real tough and i think will turn some heads on the national level (despite is skinny stature). I did not nottice any 6'8" kid for OWU but with their physical size and the ability of their big men to shoot from outside they will do some damage in the league. I could see them beating out Witt in the league for second place. Even though they lost tonight they really impressed me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 11, 2006, 09:36:53 PM
Now THAT was fun!

Tonight's Alumni Scrimmage at Wooster, the first that I've attended, was well worth the price - ok, wait, there was no charge - heck, it was just a great event!

Although the Alumni team dropped the game 120-80, it was much closer than that most of the way.  Spearheading the effort of the grads were Bryan Nelson and Ryan Gorman, two of the best inside players in Wooster history.  Both proved that they not only were capable of playing in this sort of contest, but could, if they had any eligibility left, return and once again be stars in the NCAC.  It was a special treat to not only see them in action, but to see their skills, if not their wind, virtually intact.

Wooster's normal halftime faire, a dance troupe called Personal Foul, was not in attendance.  A backup group began forming in the stands but saner heads prevailed upon them to not take the court...  ;)

Alright, bring on the Cabrini Canucks or whoever they are.  Let's get this special season on the road!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on November 11, 2006, 11:10:38 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 11, 2006, 09:36:53 PM
Now THAT was fun!

Tonight's Alumni Scrimmage at Wooster, the first that I've attended, was well worth the price - ok, wait, there was no charge - heck, it was just a great event!

Although the Alumni team dropped the game 120-80, it was much closer than that most of the way.  Spearheading the effort of the grads were Bryan Nelson and Ryan Gorman, two of the best inside players in Wooster history.  Both proved that they not only were capable of playing in this sort of contest, but could, if they had any eligibility left, return and once again be stars in the NCAC.  It was a special treat to not only see them in action, but to see their skills, if not their wind, virtually intact.

Wooster's normal halftime faire, a dance troupe called Personal Foul, was not in attendance.  A backup group began forming in the stands but saner heads prevailed upon them to not take the court...  ;)

Alright, bring on the Cabrini Canucks or whoever they are.  Let's get this special season on the road!

Did any of the freshmen kids play?  If they did, how good were they?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 11, 2006, 11:50:06 PM
The only freshman playing in the rotation continues to be Craig Elam. He got about 5 minutes in the first half and a bit more in the second. He continues to impress me with his shooting touch as he has a soft touch around the basket and can hit the 3.

Starting lineups tonight had Brandon Johnson against Kyle Witucky, James Cooper against Rodney Mitchell, Andy Van Horn against Matt Smith, Tom Port versus Brian Nelson and Tim Vandervaart against Ryan Gorman.  The game started slow, (something like 2 - 2 after several minutes) and the alumni stayed close throughout most of the first half, but the current Scots hit a spurt just before half and led 46-36. The second half wasn't as competitive and the freshman got in with 2-3 minutes left.

Of the returning letterman I think the most improved is Devan Fulk. His shot is off a bit but the rest of his game (especially rebounding) is very good. Tom Port looks to be the best player. He is playing with a great deal of intensity and confidence and shooting very well. Brandon Johnson has big shoes to fill but appears to be up to the task. James Cooper shot well today and his defense is much improved. Vandervaart and Van Horn continue to hustle and create plays.

If the players don't get stuck on individual accomplishments this could be a very special season indeed!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 12, 2006, 08:38:08 AM
I know that the expectations are high at Wooster year in and year out, but has there ever been expectations this high heading into the season?  I mean look at all the talent that is returning from last year's team.  I know that the loss of Witucky is huge from a leadership and talent standpoint, but I have all of the confidence in the world that Brandon Johnson will do just fine in filling the pg role.  Not to mention the fact that the guard position is by far the deepest position on this team.

One of the more telling stats was laid out in the 1st edition of "Around The Nation" which listed the starters lost from the final Top 10 teams from last season.  Only Wooster and VWU return 4 of 5 starters, but Wooster returns 7 players that saw at least 15 minutes/game compared to VWU with 5.  And when you look at points returning Wooster has 2,551 out of 2,945 total points returning.  Compare that to Witt who has only 1,075 out of 2,369.  I can't remember a Wooster team that had this much talent and depth returning from a team that spent most of last season in the top 5 in the polls! 

As goscots and WB said, let's get this show on the road!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 12, 2006, 10:58:59 AM
Here's the linescore, taken from the Wooster Daily Record.

Alumni  36  44  --  80
Varsity  46  76 --  122

Alumni 80
Witucky 2 2-2 6, Mitchell 1 1-2 3, Nelson 8 5-6 21, Smith 3 0-0 9, Gorman 8 3-5 19, Stanley 4 0-0 10, Sprang 1 0-0 2, Schlingman 3 4-4 10.  30-59 15-19 80.

Varsity 122
B. Johnson 4 4-4 14, Cooper 6 3-3 17, Van Horn 3 00 7, Port 9 2-2 25, Vandervaart 7 3-4 17, Bidwell 3 1-1 9, Fulk 5 0-0 11, J. Johnson 1 0-0 3, Will 1 0-1 2, Elam 4 2-2 12, Tenenini 2 0-0 5.  45-73 15-17 122.

3 -point goals -- Alumni 5-17 (Smith 3, Stanley 2), Varsity 17-36 (B. Johnson 2, Cooper 2, Van Horn, Port 5, Bidwell 2, Fulk, J. Johnson, Elam 2, Tenenini).
Rebounds -- Alumni 22 (Nelson 7), Varsity 38 (Van Horn 7)
Assists -- Alumni 14 (Witucky 5), Varsity 24 (B. Johnson 5, Fulk 5).
Total Fouls -- Alumni 13, Varsity 13.
Turnovers -- Alumni 21, Varsity 13.
Fouled Out -- none.
Technicals -- none.

Percentages-wise, this works out to:
Alumni 30-59 (51%), 5-17 (29%), 15-19 (79%)
Varsity 45-73 (62%), 17-36 (47%), 15-17 (88%)
Those are pretty encouraging numbers, although I hope that the FG% defense improves over the course of the season.  It is also encouraging that 9 individual varsity players sank three-pointers. 

I wonder about the first half, where 'only' 82 points were scored.  Was it played with the same or similar up-tempo style that clearly took place in the 2nd half?  Did it look to those in attendance that the team intends to play a similar style as last season?

I hope we will hear from our infrequent contributor (who shall remain nameless, unless he chooses to out himself) who actually played in this game.  His insights from having played against this varsity squad would be very interesting indeed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 12, 2006, 11:45:39 AM
I did not play in that game.  :)

However:

1.  While the defense, early on, of the alumni was excellent, as the game wore on their conditioning, or lack of it, began to tell.  They made a concerted effort to get back on defense, and gave up few quick breaks, but the problem mostly manifested itself in their being unable to guard on the perimeter.  Open threes that were not so easy to come by initially began to be readily available and the Scots knocked them down with regularity. 

At one point, with maybe ten minutes to go, Port drained four in a row, probably in a minute in a half, increasing the Scots margin lightning-like by twelve points.  After shooting and hitting another three, Devin Fulk was heard to yell out, apologetically, something like, "I don't want to shoot so much, but nobody's guarding me!"

2. The Scots will surely play in the same style as last season.  The did against Ashland, who chose to run against them with some success until they ran out of gas near the end.  They tried to against the Alumni, but those worthies were ready for it, and while they had their legs, defended very well.  As mentioned above, the legs of some of them failed to last the duration.

3. Interior defense, and to a lesser extent rebounding, against elite teams with good posts, will probably again be a problem.  The personnel is the same as last year so I wouldn't expect much of a change in that area.  The good news is that few teams that the Scots face will have post players as talented as Nelson and Gorman.  Some will be bigger, though, as is Walsh's seven foot Eder Araujo.

4. To me it's a bit of a disappointment that of this much-heralded freshmen class it appears that there might not be much of an immediate contribution.  Elam, maybe.  He has some size, but not a lot, but does seem to have a nice shooting touch and a sense of where he should be on the court.  I'd hoped, and suspected, that a freshman would step forward to gather the extra eight or ten point guard minutes when Brandon Johnson is getting a breather, but no one appears to be going to do that, at least as yet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 12, 2006, 01:03:53 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 12, 2006, 11:45:39 AM
I did not play in that game.  :)

You're not infrequent, either.  :)

Which frosh will contribute is not always apparent at the beginning of the season.  Not everyone is Kyle Witucky, I'm sorry to say.  However, with seven solid veterans, there may not be much PT available for a frosh who can't crack the rotation right from the start.  But I expect the coaches will find PT for two or three frosh, if only for the sake of continuity.  It's no surprise that the frosh who played last night are forwards, since all three seniors play in the frontcourt, while the top three guards (including Fulk in this group) will return next season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 12, 2006, 11:50:28 PM
It's officially hoops season...I see you Wooster guys have got a head start on the rest of us.   :)

A couple of quick preseason thoughts...

- Not sure what to expect from Wabash this season.  Pretty young and inexperienced.  Zimmer and Simkus are probably going to have to carry much of the scoring load.  It's going to interesting to see how quickly and how well this new group comes together.  Right now, I'm not sure I see many really easy conference games for Wabash. 

- The NCAC is Wooster's to lose I think.  The Scots are downright loaded.  They are definitely the target everybody is shooting for this year. 

- I think this is going to be a fun season in the NCAC.  After Wooster, I think we've got several teams that will be very competitve with one another...should make for a good year here. 

Wabash tips off against Rose Hulman Friday night in the Little Giant Tipoff.  Aurora and IU-South Bend play in the other game at Chadwick on Friday night. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on November 13, 2006, 03:50:14 PM
Came away very impressed with the Scots after the Alumni game...Port has elevated his game to the next level and I believe he will be the leader that leads this group back to Salem (the talent is definitely there). There was a play early in the first half that I think last year might not have been made but was made in that game and although the shot was ultimately missed in the corner should the same thing happen against the Tigers I believe it would fall. This is a much more talented group than the '03 team, let's hope that this team gels and that guys accept roles as ultimately team chemistry is a much overlooked ingredient for success. I believe if Nelson played this year that he would once again be the D3 player of the year, he has not lost any part of his game. The 1 frosh that did log minutes (when it was close) reminds me a lot of Nelson both with his build and his shooting touch time will tell if he can develop the low post skills that Nelson was able to master. Fulk and Bidwell would start at any other school in not only the NCAC but also many other conferences. It could be a special year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on November 14, 2006, 04:58:29 PM
Now this is me thinking out loud here.  Wouldn't it be nice for those fans out there who are fortunate enough to attend the games and have video cameras to record some of the action and then share it with the rest of us out here using such avenues as YouTube?  I don't know if so doing will infringe any copyrights owned by the schools but it sure is worth a try.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 14, 2006, 05:20:38 PM
Quote from: WooMix on November 14, 2006, 04:58:29 PM
Now this is me thinking out loud here.  Wouldn't it be nice for those fans out there who are fortunate enough to attend the games and have video cameras to record some of the action and then share it with the rest of us out here using such avenues as YouTube?  I don't know if so doing will infringe any copyrights owned by the schools but it sure is worth a try.

I'm not sure that they allow you to bring in any cameras unless you have a press pass.  I don't even recall seeing any of the players parents with photo cameras, let alone video cameras.  I'm not certain on this, but I surely would have thought that you would see some cameras if they were allowed.

If you're looking for some Scots' Basketball news, the Daily Fishwrap has had a couple of nice articles the past 2 days.  One was kind of a season preview and the other was a nice piece on Tom Port.  Here are the links:

"Scots look to write happier ending"  (http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/archive/11132006/sports/&file=_sports1.txt&article=1&tD=11132006)
"Port hoping fifth year is finest" (http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles//sports/&file=_sports2.txt&article=1&tD=)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on November 14, 2006, 05:56:25 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 14, 2006, 05:20:38 PM
Quote from: WooMix on November 14, 2006, 04:58:29 PM
Now this is me thinking out loud here.  Wouldn't it be nice for those fans out there who are fortunate enough to attend the games and have video cameras to record some of the action and then share it with the rest of us out here using such avenues as YouTube?  I don't know if so doing will infringe any copyrights owned by the schools but it sure is worth a try.

I'm not sure that they allow you to bring in any cameras unless you have a press pass.  I don't even recall seeing any of the players parents with photo cameras, let alone video cameras.  I'm not certain on this, but I surely would have thought that you would see some cameras if they were allowed.

If you're looking for some Scots' Basketball news, the Daily Fishwrap has had a couple of nice articles the past 2 days.  One was kind of a season preview and the other was a nice piece on Tom Port.  Here are the links:

"Scots look to write happier ending"  (http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/archive/11132006/sports/&file=_sports1.txt&article=1&tD=11132006)
"Port hoping fifth year is finest" (http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles//sports/&file=_sports2.txt&article=1&tD=)

When I was at Wooster, I did take my digital camera into the gym and took as many pictures as I wanted.  Nobody ever complained or said anything.  I don't remember reading anywhere that such actions were forbidden.  I would believe that no-one would object to anyone taking a camera into the gym, any gym for that matter.  However, sharing video is slightly different from sharing pictures.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 14, 2006, 07:22:18 PM
WooMix -

For what it's worth, check out the Wooster schedule on the website.  The have nine games listed as having live video this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on November 14, 2006, 07:35:29 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 14, 2006, 07:22:18 PM
WooMix -

For what it's worth, check out the Wooster schedule on the website.  The have nine games listed as having live video this season.

Thanks.  I am aware of that.  Last season, together with a bunch of guys, we tried Teamline but we weren't impressed enough to do it again.  Well, I guess the radio will be a just fine as usual.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 14, 2006, 08:36:49 PM
The 2007 NCAA Record Book (http://www.ncaa.org/library/records/basketball/m_basketball_records_book/2007/2007_m_basketball_records.pdf) shows Wooster in 3rd place in all-time Division III wins, behind Wittenberg and Illinois Wesleyan (page 115).

Didn't Wooster pass IWU last year?  Was there some kind of correction or is there simply a mistake in the record book?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 14, 2006, 10:08:11 PM
Wooster is 1421-739 all-time coming into this season; this record is on the Wooster men's basketball homepage (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/default.php) under the photograph and above the "Did You Know?" box.  They started last year at 1395-735 (from the '05-'06 Media Guide) and went 26-4 (from the website).  I believe I recall that COW and IWU started the season tied at 1395 wins.  IWU went 25-7, and your site (IWUHoops.com (http://www.iwuhoops.com/)) confirms that the Titans are now at 1420 wins (1420-793).  So it looks to me like Wooster starts this season with a one game edge on Illinois Wesleyan. 

Wittenberg is still way out in front (http://www5.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/records/tradition.html) at 1537 wins all-time.

The Record Book has Wooster at 1402-734, which I can only assume is wrong.  It might reflect some recount (we don't do recounts in Ohio  ;)), but I doubt that the NCAA green eyeshades care enough about D3 to bother with something like that.  Unless I see some documentation to the contrary, as far as I am concerned the top 3 is
1. Wittenberg 1537-613
2. Wooster 1421-739
3. Illinois Wesleyan 1420-793
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 14, 2006, 10:16:21 PM
116 wins behind Wittenberg?  Not a problem.  All other results being equal, all it'll take is sweeping them (figuring on 3 games a season) for 39 years to move ahead.  Let the good times roll!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 14, 2006, 10:33:28 PM
Hmmm....so Wabash would only have to go undefeated for about 15 years to catch up to Witt.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on November 14, 2006, 11:45:24 PM
WooBoo,
I don't know about you, but I'll be long gone, thank God.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 15, 2006, 10:33:53 AM
If I had to take a preseason guess on EC's biggest problem this year I would say it would have to be lack of depth on the bench.   Then again it isn't like that is the first time Depth has been a problem with the Quakers.  

Leading the way is 5th year senior Markous Jewett, followed by fellow 1,000 point member LaRon Henry.  I have a feeling this will be a nice year for Soph. Guard Tristian Gregory.  Rounding out the top 6 is Junior PG Neil Collins, 6-9 Junior Center Nick Welsh and also challenging Nick at Center will be 6-8 Freshman Dereck Briggs.
Now if have not been able to watch Freshman Briggs play, but he is an athletic big man who likes to play above the rim.  So when EC comes to town I hope you'll be ready for a few rim-rockers.   Okay I just really wanted to say rim-rocker.

EC will be tipping off the season at University of Chicago vs. Depauw on Saturday...
GO QUAKERS wish I could be there.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 15, 2006, 11:56:25 AM
I would like to say that this upcoming tourney will give us a hint of how the LGs will be, but Mac's young teams have always evolved greatly during the season. I think it'll be a roller coaster ride where they may steal a game or two that they should lose, then somehow lose one they should win because of their youth.

Stephens, Zimmer and Simkus all need to come up huge, and hopefully the Earl of Rooks can run the show at the point, while getting the freshmen ready to contribute.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 15, 2006, 12:14:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 14, 2006, 10:08:11 PM
Unless I see some documentation to the contrary, as far as I am concerned the top 3 is
1. Wittenberg 1537-613
2. Wooster 1421-739
3. Illinois Wesleyan 1420-793
I'll take that top 3 as well.  One number that I like to keep track of is more for the here and now and that is the top programs in the 2000's.  Wooster is starting to pull away in this category, at least according to their media guide.  According to the media guide, Wooster not only has the most wins among Division III with 180, it also has the best winning percentage, not only among Division III, but in all of the NCAA since 2000 at .865.  Now, if they could just get one of those National Championship banners to go along with all of these impressive numbers they've been putting up this century!  Hopefully, that will come this year!! 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 16, 2006, 11:24:08 AM
smeds-

What can you tell me about Chase Haltom?  He's starting tomorrow and comes with some pretty impressive honors (Hoosier Basketball Magazine top 40 from last year to name one).  Sounds like this kid can fill it up.  Should we expect big things from him?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 16, 2006, 04:28:40 PM
I never saw Mr. Haltom personally in HS as Crawfordsville dropped Cloverdale this past year.

However, his junior and senior years, Cloverdale went 36-9. Normally, the Clovers were a moribund program, winning 4 to 7 games a season.

I don't expect him to be Josh Estelle, but I think he'll be fine if he doesn't get rattled during his first shooting slump in college.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 16, 2006, 04:42:20 PM
Fair enough...it sounds like he could develop into the "go-to" guy that Wabash has lacked since DesJean graduated.  I love Mac's dedication to balance, but I think not having anybody on the floor be the guy who is going to take the critical shots has hurt us at times.  I'll remain cautiously optimistic that we may have found somebody to fill that role (if not this year then hopefully in the future). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 16, 2006, 08:14:36 PM
We will find out soon enough! Can the kiddie corps back up the vets and surprise the NCAC? Stay tuned!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on November 17, 2006, 04:12:09 PM
Whatever happened to the NCAC Pick 'em page?  It is that time of year and it kind of sneaked up on me.  I have only checked the WOO, WITT and OWU for opening weekend. 

Fri 17 NOV
Cabrini @ Wooster    WOOSTER (It will not be pretty in 1st half but 2nd half we'll see the kids)Swathmore vs. Wittenberg @ Haverford SWATHMORE  (Swathmore returns 5 starters and have some size, too.  Tough way for Witt to start, on the road vs experienced team.  2 leading scorers are 6'8" and 6'6" and they have senior experienced good PG.  But they will rebound on SAT)
D'Youville vs. Ohio Wesleyan  @ Penn State Behrend  OWU  (and it could get ugly)Earlham vs Depaw @ Univ of Chicago DEPAUW (sister's alma mater, Sorry Quakers)SAT 18 NOV
Wittenberg @ Haverford WITTENBERG (bounce back win)

Looking forward to another great year...Go SCOTS..Go NCAC!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 17, 2006, 04:25:15 PM
In the past I have run the NCAC pick 'ems but am going to hand over the reins to anybody else who would like to do it.  Hoops season is a hectic time for me and I just haven't had the time to properly adminstrate the pick 'ems over the last couple of years.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on November 17, 2006, 08:13:20 PM
No free audio for Wooster's game today.  Apparently they are doing high school football.  People please help with updates.  Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on November 17, 2006, 08:38:49 PM
Witt 57
Swarthmore 46

Tigers led by Dane Borchers and Billy Bowen with 12 pts each.

Not bad of a start considering that DJ Corbett, Tyler Howard and Dan McNeely did not return this year. If you recall, Tyler Howard was hurt at COW(concussion) last year and Corbett and McNeely said they were tired of playing basketball, their reason for not playing this year.

David Nowicki, freshman pt guard from Carmel, In. got significant playing time.

Also, Sam Gregory is finally getting a chance to play!!!!!!!!





Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 17, 2006, 09:03:29 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 64  Cabrini 30

This game is over at the half.  Wooster is dropping three pointers like crazy.  The Scots shot 14 of 22 three pointers in the first half for 63%.

Scots are being led by Tom Port with 17 points, James Cooper with 16 points and Brandon Johnson with 8 points.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 17, 2006, 09:06:01 PM
Halftime in C'ville:

RHIT 28
Wabash 17

Not a pretty half either way.  Rose got hot at the end of the half...Wabash needs to get some shots to fall. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 17, 2006, 10:47:56 PM
Final from C'ville:

RHIT 57
Wabash 50

Wabash played the part of a young team very well tonight...24 turnovers, 4-24 3 pt shooting.  Wabash did make a late charge in the game, but just couldn't overcome the turnovers in this one.  Wabash will play IU-South Bend in the consolation game tomorrow  afternoon. 

Simkus had a good day for Wabash with 15 points on 7-11 shooting.  My freshman to watch (Haltom) had 8 points on just 2-10 shooting.  Good to see he's not afraid shoot on the bigger stage...I think he'll come around nicely as the season progresses. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 17, 2006, 10:54:48 PM
Wooster ends up winning 128-71.  All sorts of records set, including points in an AVW Classic game (old record: 103, set by Mt. Union earlier this evening) and threes deposited in a game by Wooster (25, of 45 chances.)  Cooper had six treys and 24 or so points, Port had 5 treys (of seven) and about 17, Vandervaart had 15 points and 16 rebounds. 

Around here I tend to be the wet blanket on what I see as the sometimes irrational exuberance over Wooster.  But not tonight.  I am well and truly impressed.  Now, I grant you that the Cabrini Fighting Jane Byrnes* are not a great or even good club, but that just wasn't relevant tonight.  They never had a chance against the Wooster team that showed up tonight.  On one end, they hit 25 treys, most of them wide open as the result of crisp ball movement.  On the other end, they forced something like 26 turnovers and held Cabrini to 45% shooting.  Every Scot who dressed played, with the bench emptying with about 7 minutes left and a 50 point lead. 

Cabrini has a very good center in junior Randy Reid, who had something like 18 and 9 to go with 3 or 4 steals.  He was guarded by Tom Port most of the time, and had the better of that matchup.  But that's the whole Cabrini highlight reel.  The rest was a clinical dismembering by a team that may even be better than the hype.

Mt. Union handled Emory and Henry fairly easily in the first game.  E&H looked pretty poor, and I would not be surprised to see Cabrini beat them, even after losing by 57 tonight.

(*A joke that probably only Greg Sager will get.  ;))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 17, 2006, 11:00:33 PM
Scoreboard says:
Washington & Lee 82, Denison 71
Allegheny 78, Grove City 75 (OT)
OWU 96, D'Youville 31
Brockport St. 78, Oberlin 6 (I sure hope that's not correct...)
plus Wittenberg's win and Wabash's loss previously reported here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 17, 2006, 11:15:25 PM
David - the Yeomen had 66 points tonight so they only lost by 12.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 17, 2006, 11:25:23 PM
(*A joke that probably only Greg Sager will get.)

David,

Now don't go underestimating your audience (and I've never even lived in Chicago)! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 17, 2006, 11:30:08 PM
Thanks, WSF.  That's a relief.  :)

Wooster-Cabrini box score (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/boxes/2006-07/cabrini.php) is now posted.  Revising and correcting my remarks above, Cooper had 24 (6/9 from arc), Port had 19 (5/7 from arc), Vandervaart 15 and only 6 rebounds (not 16, duh).  Johnson added 14 (4/6 from arc) with 4 steals and 7 assists; and Fulk added 11 (3/6 from arc).  Every Wooster player who dressed played and scored, and eleven of 'em sank three pointers.   :o 

It's just one game, but it looks for now like a nine-man rotation: the 8 veterans (Port, Van Horn, Vandervaart, Cooper, Johnson, Fulk, Will, Bidwell) and frosh Craig Elam.  These nine had double-figure minutes tonight, ranging from Elam's 10 to Cooper's 25.

Ypsi--it take more than just a Chicago orientation, it also takes a certain amount of chronological giftedness, with which you and I are blessed.   ;D

Here's a question for those in the know.  Who is the mop-headed frosh who wears #54?  In the program, it's Rob Tenenini of Fox Chapel Pa., and that's also what the PA announcer said.  But CMHScotsFan's dad told me it was Jason Ronyak, and that's what the box score says as well, even though he's listed as #41 on the roster. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/roster.php)  What's the answer?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 17, 2006, 11:31:34 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 17, 2006, 10:54:48 PM(*A joke that probably only Greg Sager will get.  ;))

So a snowstorm keeping Wooster away from the gym would have saved them?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 17, 2006, 11:42:20 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on November 17, 2006, 11:31:34 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 17, 2006, 10:54:48 PM(*A joke that probably only Greg Sager will get.  ;))

So a snowstorm keeping Wooster away from the gym would have saved them?

Wasn't it Harold Washington that was done in by the snowstorm?

I think this has to do with Cabrini-Green.

Though I may have now set myself up to have credit withdrawn by David if I'm wrong! ;D

(Even though I have MORE 'chronological giftedness' than him! ;))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 17, 2006, 11:48:38 PM
One concern from tonights game was that Andy Van Horn took what I think was an elbow to the face early in the second half and never returned. He had an ice pack to his face while sitting on the bench. Hope he didn't break a nose or cheek bone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 17, 2006, 11:56:25 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 17, 2006, 11:42:20 PMWasn't it Harold Washington that was done in by the snowstorm?...

...I think this has to do with Cabrini-Green.

I don't remember who Jane Byrne beat in that election (Who remembers the losers of elections?).

And she did live in Cabrini-Green. Just not for very long.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 18, 2006, 12:10:47 AM
Jane Byrne defeated Michael Bilandic in 1979 and lost to Harold Washinton in 1983
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 18, 2006, 12:25:24 AM
I should have added that it was Bilandic that lost due looking ineffective in dealing with the heavy snowfall....it paralyzed Chicago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 18, 2006, 03:25:41 AM
Egads.   Wooster is scary.  Anything less than Salem has to be disappointing for this team, right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 18, 2006, 07:32:58 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 17, 2006, 11:30:08 PM
Here's a question for those in the know.  Who is the mop-headed frosh who wears #54?  In the program, it's Rob Tenenini of Fox Chapel Pa., and that's also what the PA announcer said.  But CMHScotsFan's dad told me it was Jason Ronyak, and that's what the box score says as well, even though he's listed as #41 on the roster. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/roster.php)  What's the answer?

David - His first score was announced as Tenenini, but later the announcer did give a correction and said that it was Ronyak.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 18, 2006, 07:51:58 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 18, 2006, 03:25:41 AM
Egads.   Wooster is scary.  Anything less than Salem has to be disappointing for this team, right?

Wooster did look terrific last night.  Great ball movement produced numerous open looks, and they certainly have the players that can take advantage of those.  They played hard and forced numerous turnovers.  James Cooper, and even Devin Fulk, when called upon to give minutes at the point guard spot, looked very capable.  Even many of the freshmen, who were on the floor for over seven minutes at the end, and about whom I'd begun to have some doubts, showed lots of promise, especially with their shooting touches.

Let me sit down in that Devil's Advocate chair for a moment.  Kind of comfortable and familiar, actually.  :)

Wooster's interior defense appeared, to me, as suspect as it did last year.  Cabrini's Randy Reid, a Jesse Jean (OWU) clone, did far too much damage on the offensive end to suit me, and I'm sure the Scots, much of it coming on the offensive boards and stick-backs.  Too often, nobody put a body on him at all.

Alright, I guess that's all of the downside that's coming to mind.  They did look awesome!  :)

They did pick up those two injuries, though.  Andy Van Horn's dad was suspecting a broken nose (on his son, not his own), although he did comment once that Andy had flipped him a "Thumb's up" sign across the gym, apparently meaning that he was ok.  Everybody hopes so, that he'll be back in action as soon as possible, buzz-cut and all.

I had the pleasure of meeting two esteemed DIII Hoops posters last night, David Collinge and cmhscots.  I loved it.  Dave, thanks for coming by and then introducing me to cmh.  Looking forward to seeing both of you guys again at future games, which for me will not include tonight's championship, unless I can race home to make the second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 18, 2006, 10:40:51 AM
I guess this publicity stunt was more memorable than I thought:

Quote from: WikipediaIn an effort to demonstrate a commitment to making the complex safer, Chicago Mayor Jane Byrne moved into a fourth-floor apartment in 1981. Backed by police and bodyguards, she stayed for only three weeks. This incident, too, contributed to public perception of Cabrini-Green as the worst of the worst of public housing.
source = http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cabrini-Green (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cabrini-Green)

Good to meet you, too, Wooster Booster.  I agree with you about the interior defense, although I attribute it to the facts that 1) Randy Reid is very good and 2) Tom Port hasn't been asked to play interior defense on a big body in years, maybe not since high school (I could be wrong about that; I only saw two games last year.)   I wonder how Tim Vandervaart would have coped with that assignment.  The defense, in general, I thought was pretty good.  They only gave up 30 in the first half on 44% shooting, and took a surprising (to me) number of fouls as a result of more aggressive defense.  And they forced 26 turnovers, which is a good night's work.

Steve Moore didn't mention Andy's nose in his post-game interview, and there was nothing in the Daily Record about it either.  I take that as a good sign.

I know it sounds pompous, but anything less than Salem is always disappointing for this team in recent years.  We might as well enjoy it while it lasts, because it can't last forever.  In fact, this year's team may be the "last best chance" for a deep tournament run for the next few years at least.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 18, 2006, 11:40:06 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 18, 2006, 10:40:51 AM
I know it sounds pompous, but anything less than Salem is always disappointing for this team in recent years.  We might as well enjoy it while it lasts, because it can't last forever.  In fact, this year's team may be the "last best chance" for a deep tournament run for the next few years at least.

It's not pompous, David, it's blunt honesty.  The Scots are loaded.  Cooper, Port, Fulk, Vandervaart (seems like he's been playing at CoW for about 9 years now, doesn't it?)...the Scots are by far and away the cream of this year's NCAC crop.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 18, 2006, 12:09:04 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 18, 2006, 10:40:51 AMI know it sounds pompous, but anything less than Salem is always disappointing for this team in recent years.

Wally and I were talking last night about Wabash's dismal record against Woo, especially at Chadwick. While I would love to finally get a win against you guys this year, that's not happening. But losing to the eventual national champ isn't too bad. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 18, 2006, 01:11:55 PM
Happy birthday to Smedindy, Wabash stalwart moonlighting this season as a Carthage rookie hoopster.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 18, 2006, 09:59:53 PM
Final:  Wooster 85  Mt. Union 60

Wooster made 13 three pointers tonight as they cruised to the championship of the Al Van Wie Tournament.

Scots were led tonight by Tim Vandervaart with 22 points, James Cooper with 20 points and Tom Port with 12 points.

Wooster is now 2-0.  Next up they play at Walsh on 11/25

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 18, 2006, 11:16:35 PM
I'm not sure "cruised" is the word I'd have employed.  Coughed, sputtered, hesitated, maybe.  Nevertheless, the outcome was never in doubt (so "cruised" is accurate in that sense), and I'll take a 25-point win over any OAC team, any time, anywhere.  That's a quality win, even if MUC ends up fulfilling their 9th-place prophecy. 

With the notable exception of Tim Vandervaart, the Scots played a lackluster, sloppy, and almost disinterested style of basketball tonight.  They turned the ball over 14 times, had two players foul out (some blame for this rests with the referees, but still...), and were the beneficiaries of some poor free throw shooting by the Grapes (20-29).  They held MUC to 40% shooting, but some of that was just poor shooting.  Mt. Union blocked six Scot shots, and at least several of these were out on the perimeter, blocks of low-trajectory lazy-looking shots. 

Wooster Booster pointed out a potential problem with interior defense last night.  It showed up again tonight, although MUC wasn't really able to take advantage of it.  Too often the Grape bigs were able to get superior positioning, but Wooster did well to deny the entry pass, and a good number of the rebounds caromed long.  Wooster won the battle of the boards, 38-31, with the hustle-rebounding of Van Horn, Fulk, Johnson, and Cooper contributing 14 of those caroms.  Raider Stu Anglum was able to record a double-double (13 pts., 10 boards) before fouling out. 

The MVP of this game, and of the tournament, was Tim Vandervaart, by a mile.  He carried Wooster in the first half, spinning and twisting for points, boxing out for caroms, and outhustling everyone on the court by a wide margin.  He's making a run at the top of my all-time favorite Scots list, although I can't see anyone displacing Matt Schlingman on this list anytime soon.  :) 

It says something about Wooster when they can have one player play very well, two or three others play at a mediocre level, and still beat an OAC team by 25.  The Scots have so many weapons and so many ways to beat you that they're going to be very hard to stop.

Here's the boxscore. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/boxes/2006-07/mtunion.php)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 19, 2006, 12:01:50 AM
First of all, there's something that needs to be pointed out.  David Collinge's research of DIII basketball, and COW basketball in particular, is first rate.  If he's talking stats, polls, history, etc., you can generally count on it being so.

However, there is this.  Dave sits well up in the seventh or eighth level of bleachers to watch Wooster basketball games.  Clearly, he's on call in case of a sprinkler system malfunction or possibly to mend holes in the roof due to inadvertent meteor showers.

My point is simply this: When he's passing along his actual observations of the games, take them with a full shaker of salt.  He speaks of low-trajectory shots.  Heck, any shot would appear to have no trajectory when your peer down upon it from 500 feet.  Unless he's disecting the Scots from long range with a telescope, any comments such as his believing the Scots interior defense to be suspect are, well, suspect.  They don't even charge admission up there, but they do rent the requisite oxygen equipment.

And I don't think they should be called Grape bigs.  I prefer big Grapes.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on November 19, 2006, 01:50:19 AM
Quote
Wooster wins the Al Van Wie Rotary Classic for the 5th-straight year.
Tournament MVP Tim Vandervaart (Woo); Defensive MVP Brandon Johnson (Woo);
All-Tournament Team: James Cooper (Woo); Stu Anglum (MUC); Chris Crawford (MUC
Antonio Leary (E&H); and Randy Reid (Cabrini).

How/Why is it that the Tournament MVP Tim Vandervaart fails to make it into the All-Tournament Team?  Doesn't the MVP award makes it automatic for the recipient to be included in the team?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 19, 2006, 09:25:19 AM
I think it is safe to assume the MVP's are part of the all tournament team. The tournament program lists alll the previous teams with the MVP's.

Personally I would have not included Chris Crawford on that team and instead placed Tom Port. Despite the obvious assignment to Stu Anglum to stick to Port like glue he still managed to be a significant contributor with 12 points, 6 assists and 6 rebounds. Crawford made 0 baskets in the championship game on 0-1 shooting, 1 rebound and 0 assists. I see from the program that in 2002 Wooster had 4 players on the all tournment team - should have happened again.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 19, 2006, 09:51:29 AM
Quote from: goscots on November 19, 2006, 09:25:19 AM
I think it is safe to assume the MVP's are part of the all tournament team. The tournament program lists alll the previous teams with the MVP's.

Personally I would have not included Chris Crawford on that team and instead placed Tom Port. Despite the obvious assignment to Stu Anglum to stick to Port like glue he still managed to be a significant contributor with 12 points, 6 assists and 6 rebounds. Crawford made 0 baskets in the championship game on 0-1 shooting, 1 rebound and 0 assists. I see from the program that in 2002 Wooster had 4 players on the all tournment team - should have happened again.

Until I read your last sentence, I was going to point out that the usual format is one player chosen from each of the semifinal losers, two from the team that lost in the final, and the rest, including the MVP, from the winner.  But if they didn't do that in 2002, then I agree with you, the team should have included Port.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2006, 10:58:36 AM
All my observations should be taken with a pitcher full of salt, of course.  I think most of the regulars know that I know about as much about basketball as your average pep band member, which I was.  My varsity basketball experience includes about 1 minute on the 5th grade team, plus being on the same freshman hall with a number of the '78-'79 Scots (including Gib Tecca, who was the only one who amounted to anything.)  As they beat me up regularly, I know a little about physical play.  :)

But let's not go overboard; we're talking about Timken Gymnasium, not the Louisiana Superdome.  Six rows from the top is still low enough to read the manufacturer's imprint on Tom Port's mouthguard.  From the nosebleed seats I can see plays developing, whereas for me sitting in Row 2 reduces the game to a confused blur of colorful bodies.  Plus, up at the top I don't have to worry about which player's mother is sitting behind me when I'm kvetching.  ;) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2006, 12:53:28 PM
Weekend results:
Allegheny: 2-0, defeating Grove City 78-75 (OT) and Washington & Jefferson 81-75.
Denison: 1-1, losing to Washington & Lee 82-71, defeating Oneonta St. 77-62.
Earlham: 0-1, losing to DePauw 85-80.  Playing the Coast Guard today.
Hiram: 0-0, opening against CWRU on Wednesday.
Kenyon: 2-0, defeating LaRoche 67-48 and Myers 83-67.
Oberlin: 0-2, losing to Brockport St. 78-66 and St. Lawrence 68-60.
Ohio Wesleyan: 2-0, defeating D'Youville 96-31 and Penn St.-Behrend 84-64.
Wabash: 1-1, losing to Rose-Hulman 57-50 and defeating IU-South Bend 56-44.
Wittenberg: 2-0, defeating Swarthmore 57-46 and Haverford 68-53.
Wooster: 2-0, defeating Cabrini 128-71 and Mt. Union 85-60.

Composite conference record: 12-5, pending the Earlham game this afternoon, and none of the losses by more than twelve points.  A good start!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 19, 2006, 05:09:56 PM
So DC, are you back in the area for good or just visiting?

I wasn't able to catch any of the action this weekend and I'm pretty much just now recovering from all of the excitement and, sigh, disappointment of yet another Michigan loss to Troy Smith and Ohio State.  This is one Michigan fan that will be very happy to see anyone under center for Ohio State as long as it's not #10!

I did catch the replays of both games on the local cable access channel.  I couldn't believe the clinic Wooster put on with Cabrini.  It sure was nice of Coach Moore and the boys to give those youngsters from Cabrini a free clinic on how to play the game of basketball! ;)

And last night against MUC, it was evident from the tip that the Grapes weren't going to give Wooster any open looks from the outside and they did a fine job of denying the perimeter.  Problem is, Wooster took advantage by feeding the ball inside to Darth Vandervaart as he exposed MUC's plan and had a big game inside.  I like how DC put it.  Wooster did look lethargic and uninterested and it's a scary notion that this team can put forth such a mediocre effort and still beat an OAC foe by 25 points! 

The competion is going to get a little stiffer the next couple of games with NAIA foes Walsh and Georgetown coming up for Wooster.  This should give us a little better gauge as to where the Scots are against equal or possibly better talent. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 19, 2006, 06:39:04 PM
I would suggest to anyone planning on attending the Wooster-Walsh game that they get there early.  I've spent a fair amount of time in that gym and by any college standards it's tiny.  There are only 7 rows of seats on one side and 8 on the other.  By my estimate, in counting seats one day, I'd say it only holds about 1,000 fans.  I don't know how well Walsh draws, but I'd suspect that there might be a fair amount of Wooster fans making the trip and I'd hate to see any of them shut out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2006, 07:25:07 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 19, 2006, 05:09:56 PM
So DC, are you back in the area for good or just visiting?

I plan to hang around Holmes Co. at least until pitchers and catchers report; after that, to paraphrase Pete Rose, all bets are off.  ;)

Earlham slips to 0-2, falling to the Coast Guard 70-57 at the University of Chicago.  Box score. (http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/2006-07/stats/erlm1119.html)  Jewett and Henry combined for 38 points and 13 boards, but they got little help and couldn't overcome double-doubles from two USCGA players.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 19, 2006, 09:38:47 PM
I believe that 'all bets are off' goes a bit beyond a paraphrase of Pete Rose!

A 'negation'?  A 'contradiction'?  'Something I would NEVER say?' ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 20, 2006, 09:04:29 AM
Wabash looked young this week. They played pretty good defense in both games but could not hold onto the ball and rushed a lot of posessions. Hanover will be a stern test, but let's hope the kiddie corps rises up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 20, 2006, 12:08:42 PM
I'm mildly encouraged by Wabash's opening weekend.  Simkus and Zimmer were pretty solid, and while the freshmen were a little erratic I think you have to be pleased with Haltom's first two starts (his shot will come) and Brock's minutes off the bench.  I think Wabash has found a couple of good players in these two. 

The Good, The Bad, and The Ugly from the Tipoff Classic in C'ville for Wabash:

The Good: Opponents shot just 31.1% against the LGs.  Nice D! 
The Bad: Wabash only shot 37.5% overall and just 20% on 3 point field goals. 
The Ugly: 46 turnovers for Wabash over the weekend.  Ouch. 

As mentioned Hanover comes to town tomorrow night followed by a road game at Depauw (insert boos here) on the 28th. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2006, 01:04:42 PM
As noted above, Kenyon is off to a 2-0 start, as both Kenyon and co-host Mt. Vernon Nazarene Univ. swept their games in the Food for the Hungry Invitational.  This is Kenyon's first 2-0 start in over a decade, and hopes appear to be high in Gambier.  A young team, Kenyon has just one senior on the roster (reserve Mike Cohen), and three sophomores join two juniors in the starting lineup.  However, these youngsters are not without experience, as the Lords return 10 lettermen and three starters.  Four more undercalssmen (Fr., So., So., Jr.) provide depth in the nine-man rotation (seven at 20+ mpg, two others at about 10 mins.)

On Friday, the Lords overcame poor shooting to defeat LaRoche 67-48 down in Mt. Vernon.  6'6" sophmore Bryan Yelvington dropped in 21 points, including 11 of 12 from the charity stripe, and grabbed 8 rebounds, leading both teams in both categories.  The Lords held the Redhawks to 41% shooting and forced 21 turnovers.  While Kenyon also shot just 41%, they got 14 more shots off, and also sank more free throws (14) than the Pittsburghers attempted (12, making just 5), allowing the Lords to extend a meagre 2-point halftime lead into an fairly comfortable 19-point final margin.

On Saturday, the teams moved up to Gambier, where Kenyon dispatched Myers Univ. by a score of 83-67.  Five Lords scored in double figures, led by 6'5" freshman Dave Knapke's 18 points and 7 boards.  Kenyon scorched the nets at a 55% clip while holding the Clevelanders to 41% and just one three-pointer.  The box score suggests a somewhat sloppy effort, as Kenyon committed 18 turnovers and 21 fouls, allowing Myers to score 22 of their points from the free throw line.  However, superior shooting and rebounding (38-24 edge to KC) was more than the 0-6 Mustangs could overcome. 

Joining Head Coach Matt Croci on the bench this season is assistant coach Travis Schwab, a name familiar to most who follow the NCAC.  I hope to be able to get down to Kenyon from time to time to follow the progress of this young but perhaps up-and-coming squad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2006, 01:25:12 PM
Speaking of Kenyon, the Lords will participate in the NCAC-OAC Challenge this coming weekend.  On Saturday in Granville, Kenyon takes on Capital at 2pm and Muskingum faces host Denison at 4pm.  Then on Sunday action moves to New Concord, with Capital facing Denison at 2 and Kenyon against the host Muskies at 4.  Neither the Crusaders not Muskies have started play yet; Capital hosts Wittenberg on Wednesday.  Muskingum and Capital are picked to finish 4th and 5th respectively in the OAC, so these should be some pretty tough games for the NCAC representatives.  I plan to attend at least the Sunday session, and perhaps the Saturday games as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 20, 2006, 01:27:37 PM
Dave -

Funny you should choose to write about Kenyon as I had already figured them to be a dangerous team.  They'll give the big boys in the NCAC all they can handle, if not this year than next year.  

One guy that you didn't mention is sophomore center Allen Bediako.  This guy is a serious leaping shot blocker (as opposed to frivolous leaping shot blockers) when he can stay out of foul trouble.  I saw him play last year when Kenyon hosted the Scots and he can jump out of the gym.  

Fouls are his Achille's heel, though, and in Kenyon's first game this year he picked up four, limiting him to 15 minutes on the floor.  He also had four fouls in the Lord's second contest, but must have gathered the last one late, as he managed 26 minutes on the court allowing him to put up 8 points and corral a game-high 8 boards.  He doesn't have a blocked shot this season, which really surprises me, but I'll still bet he ends up leading the league.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 20, 2006, 09:47:59 PM
I was perusing the homepages for both of Wooster's next 2 NAIA opponents (Walsh and Georgetown (KY) and they both look to have quite a bit of height.  Walsh returns all 5 starters from a team that reached the "Elite 8" last season as well as their top 6 scorers.  One thing I did notice is that they have only played 2 games (1-1) thus far this season which I found quite surprising because I always thought the NAIA started their seasons earlier.  They do have 2 more games they will get under their belts before they meet up with the Scots on Saturday, but I don't know if that will be an advantage or not.  When Walsh meets Wooster on Saturday it will be their 3rd game in 5 days.  Wooster will have not played in a week, so Wooster should be the fresher of the 2 teams.

Georgetown, on the other hand has gotten off to a 6-1 start to the season and has one more game before their trip to Wooster a week from tomorrow.  It was said earlier about how many NCAA Div. I  transfers are on their roster.  They look like they could cause a lot of mismatch problems inside for the Scots.

Both teams are ranked highly in the preseason NAIA top 25 with Georgetown checking in at #8 in NAIA Div. I with their only loss coming against Lambuth (TN) who is in the "recieving votes" category in the NAIA Div. I poll.  Walsh is checking in at #7 in the NAIA Div. II poll.  Their one loss was to NAIA unranked Daemen College quite handily, 88-71. 

One thing I did notice about Walsh was that they had a couple of players on their roster that aren't playing until later in the season.  One was their returning PG who won't be playing until the 2nd semester because he only has one semester of eligibility remaining.  Another is a transfer who isn't eligble until the first week of December.  I wonder if this will have any effects on thier depth and the fact that they will be playing 3 games in 5 days?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 20, 2006, 11:13:32 PM
The Walsh A.D. returned my call today, leaving a message in which he said that due to Thanksgiving break there will be plenty of available seats next Saturday when Wooster comes to North Canton.  Let's prove him wrong by bringing a large contingent of Scot fans, turning it into a home court for the black and gold!

One side of the Walsh gym has theatre-style seats, which is probably the home side and also probably away from the team benchs (that's how it is in volleyball, anyway).  The other side is bleacher-style seating, and hopefully we can fill the area behind the Wooster bench with partisans of the non-Walsh variety.

And, yep, they are big.  A legit Brazilian 7-footer that has to duck to get into the gym.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 21, 2006, 07:14:01 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 20, 2006, 11:13:32 PM
Let's prove him wrong by bringing a large contingent of Scot fans, turning it into a home court for the black and gold!

I'll be making the trek up to N. Canton from here in Columbus! 

Arujo may be a good test for the Scots interior game, but it looks like he's got the build of a D-III 7-footer as opposed to the D-I type.  He's listed as only 245 lbs - the same as Elam for the Scots.  I think that its the wide-bodies (Tori Davis comes to mind) that tend play a more physical game that generally give the Scots problems, whereas they can usually handle the tall-skinnys pretty well (except for that Russ kid!).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 21, 2006, 08:54:36 AM
EC didn't get off to the start that I was hoping for going 0-2 in the Chicago this weekend losing a close one to Depauw 80-85, and then losing to the Coast Guard as David mentioned earlier.

They got outstanding play by Senior Markous Jewett in two games going 20-40 from the field, 26.5 Ppg, 9.0 rebounds, 2.0 blocks and Center Nick Welsh played solid for them this weekend also. 

They need to work the ball around and get a little bit more team play tonight VS. Bluffton.  Coach Justus is still waiting for his 1st career when against the Beavers. (The Bluffton game has been hard for the Quakers over the years always playing them during Break.)  They need the guards to step up tonight after shooting a whopping 19-63 from the field this weekend.  Yeah that is right at .30%.  I'd say if you are a guard and you are shooting 30% from the field you might want to be a little more patient offensively. (Only an idea)

Well good luck tonight EC and Beat the heck out of that beaver
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 21, 2006, 08:58:45 AM
Quote from: earlhamalum on November 21, 2006, 08:54:36 AMI'd say if you are a guard and you are shooting 30% from the field you might want to be a little more patient offensively.

Or maybe consider passing the ball inside.  Otherwise, you might want to hang 'em up and begin selling insurance (or whatever retired guards do).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 21, 2006, 09:26:16 AM
In my experience, NAIA's will typically have a size advantage over most D-III's.  I'm sure I'll see plenty of this when Wabash hosts the NAIA Holiday Invitatational (aka the Pete Thorn Invitational) in a few weeks. 

I'm thinking Wooster will be able to handle Walsh.  Georgetown will be one of those games that sheds light on the annual debate about how good the top D-III's are compared to the top NAIA's.  Should be an entertaining matchup. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 21, 2006, 09:27:14 AM
Hey, you know...we haven't heard word one about Denison this season. I wonder if all is well up there? Looks like the roster has just three freshmen, but plenty of sophomores and juniors.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2006, 10:29:39 AM
Quote from: smedindy on November 21, 2006, 09:27:14 AM
Hey, you know...we haven't heard word one about Denison this season. I wonder if all is well up there? Looks like the roster has just three freshmen, but plenty of sophomores and juniors.

I'm headed down to Granville this evening to catch Denison's game with Lake Erie.  I'll provide a report later tonight or tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 21, 2006, 12:12:56 PM
Just don't slam the rotation, OK? I know you just wanna rip their coach one. Heh....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: RO_24 on November 21, 2006, 01:45:08 PM
I'll be making the trip to Richmond tonight to watch the Beavers play, hopefully they can contain the big guy, with them being such a small team it will be tough for them I think.  Hopefully they prove me wrong and come out on top tonight and  continue the long demise for Earlham beating the Beav...Should be a good one though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 21, 2006, 02:05:20 PM
RO_24-  Give me your thoughts on the game when you get back tonight.  No Teamline for Earlham in this game... I wonder if Bluffton has a radio/internet crew that will be making the trip to Richmond tonigh?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Darryl Nester on November 21, 2006, 02:16:53 PM
Earlhamalum: No broadcast crew from Bluffton -- most students are packing up to leave for Thanksgiving break.  (Or perhaps I should say, most have already left ...)

RO_24: See you this weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 21, 2006, 08:12:02 PM
Halftime at Chadwick:
Hanover 39
Wabash 42

A lot of ebb and flow to this one...Wabash started hot and took a quick six point lead.  Hanover used the three point shot to get back and take a quick lead before Wabash responded with another run.  Wabash led most of the half and by as many as 8.  Hanover made a run late in the half to get as close as two points.  Freshman Aaron Brock is having a great game so far with double digit points in the first half.  Andrew Zimmer hobbled off the floor with about 5 minutes left in the half...we'll hope that he's going to be ok. 

Obviously, the LGs are doing much much better offensively tonight than they did this weekend.  We're set up for an entertaining second half. 

Hanover is 8-28 on 3 pt FGs at the half.  Hanover is living the "live by the 3, die by the 3" mantra tonight.

Injury update: Zimmer is back on the floor in the second half and scored two quick buckets to start the half...good news for Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 21, 2006, 08:35:29 PM
Half-time score 
EC 31  Bluffton 37

Bluffton hit a half-court shot to end the half.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 21, 2006, 08:48:41 PM
EC 54   
Bluffton 54  

8 minutes left in the 2nd half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 21, 2006, 09:04:58 PM
It's raining threes for Hanover in the second half.  Panthers are up 7 with about 4 minutes to go.  Wabash is losing the turnover battle 23-3 at last check.  Ouch. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 21, 2006, 09:16:22 PM
Final from Chadwick:

Hanover 90
Wabash 85

Turnovers killed the LGs tonight...I'll have more after House.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 21, 2006, 10:03:58 PM
Not a good night for the NCAC... Final from Richmond  BC-81  EC-68.

From another source.  Earlham had a 6 point lead with 10 minutes to go in the 2nd half.  EC fell apart after the game was tied at 54 with 8 minutes to go.  Bluffton went on and out-scored earlham 14-3 in the next 4 minutes and that's all she wrote.

I was also told that Earlham in the last 10 minutes went back to "OLD EARLHAM WAYS"  aka One pass and shot.  *not all were "BAD SHOTS" just shots that they could of got at any point in the shot clock.

Not a start to the season that I was looking for, but hopefully they will gain valuable experience before the IMPORTANT part of the season starts... THE NCAC
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 21, 2006, 11:19:11 PM
I wouldn't call it a bad night all around...Wabash led Hanover for a good deal of their game.  I had serious concerns that Wabash would be headed for a disastrous start and it really hasn't been that way.  Tonight Wabash got very solid games from Haltom (21 points, top scoring effort for Wabash tonight) and Aaron Brock.  Wabash shot well, limited Hanover to a respectable shooting percentage...now the LGs just need to start taking care of the ball.  Wabash lost a 5-point game to a pretty good Hanover team and turned the ball over 23 times (compared to just 4 for Hanover).  The TOs will come down and when they do I think Wabash could be a pretty solid team once we get around to January basketball. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 21, 2006, 11:54:25 PM
That's a large turnover differential.  Wouldn't I love to see something like that in the boxscore of a Witt-Wooster football game!  Witt with the 23 turnovers, of course.

Not only does Wabash need to protect the ball better, but maybe a little more tenacious defense is in order, to force more turnovers from the opposition.  Seems if both of those issues improve, they'll be on the road to some wins.

Anybody notice that Oberlin lost by only TWO to BW?  Yikes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2006, 12:35:00 AM
Denison and Lake Erie battled in a tight game about 32 minutes, then LEC slowly pulled away and won by a score of 82-70.  I think this is one that Denison left on the table, for a number of reasons:

1) Poise.  LEC plays a very frenetic style.  On offense, they run on every possession and try for a quick shot.  If it's not there, they'll back it out and set up the offense, but they'll take advantage of a team that doesn't get back and get set.  DU did a good job of this in the first half, rendering Jajcen Harris (the preseason choice as AMCC POY) a non-factor, and holding LEC to just 38 points.  As the game wore on, however, more and more often LEC was able to find a man underneath the hoop with his guard out of position.  But the bigger problem was on offense.  LEC's style is a full-court ballhawking press, and it gave Denison fits all night.  Some of the Denison players (notably Dan Izzo and Karlin Tichenor, and to a lesser extent Pat Sullivan) could handle the pressure and find Hodgkinson (22 pts) or McMahon (14) for the easy hoop, primarily in the first half.  Other ballhandlers (nameless) were flustered by the press all night, and forced turnovers or bad shots.  One reserve in particular had major problems handling the pressure, and LEC took advantage by forcing the play to him and then forcing him to turn it over or at least not see the open man.  In the end, the turnover stats (17 for DU vs. 10 for LEC) don't adequately reflect how tough things were for DU ballhandlers.  The tell-all stat is shooting: DU hit 47% in the first half and just 38% in the second.  It is also worth noting that approximately half of DU's attempts were from beyond the arc (27 attempts, hitting just 8, vs. 34 two-point shots, making 18), whereas LEC only put up nine treys (all but one of them bricks) vs. 60 two-point attempts.

2) Rebounding.  Again, the stats deceive; the margin was just 36-35 in favor of LEC.  That's a little surprising; I guess DU must have had a healthy advantage in the first half, because in the second half they were doing a miserable job of boxing out and were victimized by the more athletic Storm for second and sometimes third attempts. 

3) Scoring.  I guess I'm spoiled watching Wooster so often; I'm accustomed to having five players on the court who are all scoring threats.  Not so for Denison.  Option One is, of course, Hodgkinson, and they did well to get the ball to him in the first half, when he had 12.  In the second he tallied 10 more, but he had to work like an ox on the boards to get those shots.  Similarly, Shea McMahon was able to get open inside and outside in his 12-point first half, but was completely shut down (2 pts.) in the second.  There were always one or two DU players on the floor who were either unable to unwilling to shoot.  Pat Sullivan did a pretty good job handling the defensive pressure, but in 28 minutes of ballhandling he only took two shots (missed them both.)  Forty-four of the 61 total attempts came from four players who were rarely on the court at the same time--Hodgkinson, McMahon, Izzo, and Tichenor.  These four combined for 18 second-half points (10 by Hodgkinson), when LEC turned a 3-point halftime deficit into a 12-point win.

4) Referreeing.  No, I'm not complaining.  It was Denison's misfortune that they had a let-'em-play crew tonight.  LEC's style on both ends could have been referreed at a foul-a-minute pace, but this crew only whistled them for 12 fouls.  LEC did a much better job of adjusting to the swallowed whistle than Denison.  LEC stepped up the pressure, slapping at the ball constantly, banging Hodgkinson around like a rag doll, and crashing the offensive boards, all practically without penalty.  Denison, by contrast, didn't change their style noticeably, which was a particular problem since several players seemed to be almost afraid of being whistled. 

5) Quickness.  Virtually every loose ball ended up in LEC hands all night long.  I don't think they were outhustled so much as "out-quicked" (ugh, did I just use that non-word?) 

Even with all of these problems, Denison led throughout the first half and for about the first 5 minutes of the second half, when LEC slowly began to pull away.  Even after LEC had built a seven point cushion, DU's John Ward hit back-to-back threes to cut the margin to one with about 8:30 left.  That's when all of these problems really came home to roost, with LEC scoring 18 of the game's final 25.

Denison's starting 5 were seniors Hodgkinson and Izzo, junior Brian Elder, and sophomores Shea McMahon and Pat Sullivan.  The rotation is nine deep, all upperclassmen (two more juniors, two more sophomores), but typically only one guard is on the floor at a time.  That probably wouldn't have been my choice against the press.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 22, 2006, 12:53:23 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 21, 2006, 11:54:25 PM
Not only does Wabash need to protect the ball better, but maybe a little more tenacious defense is in order, to force more turnovers from the opposition.  Seems if both of those issues improve, they'll be on the road to some wins.

I think it's a matter of youth and inexperience right now.  We saw a lot of this same sort of thing when last year's seniors at Wabash came in and played a boatload of minutes in their first full year at the varsity level ('03-'04).  The difference between that group and this, IMO, is that this group of freshmen look like they have more ability to score the basketball than the previous group.  That group started 1-5 in the '03-'04 season and it was turnovers and poor shooting that killed Wabash in the early portion of the schedule.  This year, with similar inexperience, the shooting has started a little better, but the turnovers remain.  The turnovers will drop drastically as these kids get experience. 

As I listened to the game tonight I couldn't help but think that Hanover beat Wabash by forcing turnovers and banging open three pointers...except they didn't shoot three pointers that well, they just shot enough to win.  Scary to think what might happen when we play a team (cough, Wooster, cough) that can shoot the ball. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2006, 01:01:05 AM
The Oberlin/B-WC score you saw must have been the halftime score (B-WC by 2).  The final score was B-WC 81, Oberlin 66.  Still that's a pretty good showing for the Yeomen on the home court of the nation's #6 team.    Oberlin press release and box score (http://www.oberlin.edu/athletic/varsity/m_basketball/archive/2006-2007/mbb_bw_112106.html).

Elsewhere,
Allegheny defeated Penn St.-Behrend 66-65 (Release (http://www.alleg.edu/cgi-bin/mt/mt-view.cgi/5/entry/6339/menbb_entry))
Ohio Wesleyan knocked off Washington & Jefferson 90-64 (Release (http://bishops.owu.edu/mbb1121.html))
Note that OWU beat Penn St.-Behrend by 20, and 'Gheny beat W&J by 6, over the weekend.

Here's the press release and box score (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/db/site/newsreleases/mb/20061121_2216.html) from Denison.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 22, 2006, 09:11:26 AM
Quote from: cmhscots on November 21, 2006, 07:14:01 AM
Arujo may be a good test for the Scots interior game, but it looks like he's got the build of a D-III 7-footer as opposed to the D-I type.  He's listed as only 245 lbs - the same as Elam for the Scots.  I think that its the wide-bodies (Tori Davis comes to mind) that tend play a more physical game that generally give the Scots problems, whereas they can usually handle the tall-skinnys pretty well (except for that Russ kid!).
I don't know if I'd necessarily classify Tori Davis as a widebody.  I would definately say that about his brother, but Tori is only 6'3" and 195.  The problem Tori causes for everyone is his quick jumping ability.  Plus the fact that he jumps out of the gym and that helps him play a lot taller than he acutally is.  That's not to say that he still didn't give the Scots fits.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 22, 2006, 10:00:46 AM
The problem for Wabash was not the fact that they didn't force turnovers. They let the shooters open all night long. Had they gotten out on the shooters a little more, then I think Wabash would have won. The Little Giants definitely had the inside covered.

Hanover went to a press, which caused some issues. It's a young team, but they need to get better on the press break.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 22, 2006, 12:07:12 PM
Happy Thanksgiving to all. Safe travels if you're on the road.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2006, 03:14:14 PM
On Monday, the Kenyon Lords traveled to Richmond, KY to take on Div. 1 Eastern Kentucky Univ., and promptly roared out to a 32-11 first half lead on six of eight shooting from the arc.  It was too good to be true, however, as the Colonels used a 17-0 run over the halftime break to close the gap, and held the Lords to just 16 second half points in posting a 63-52 win.  Kenyon led for the first 24 minutes of the game, and was tied as late as 5:18 remaining, but the scholarship boys were able to pull away in the end.  This was the real EKU team, too, as only one member of their usual rotation missed the game, and the starting five each played at least 30 minutes.  EKU is now 3-1, with their only loss being at D1 #4 Ohio State.  Kenyon slips to 2-1 on the season.

Kenyon shot 54% in building a 13-point halftime lead, while holding the Colonels to 38% shooting.  However, in the second half Kenyon shot just 37% (and just 1 of 6 from the three point line) while committing 13 turnovers and missing five of six free throw attempts. 

Bryan Yelvington led the Lords with 11 points and 9 rebounds, while three other Lords contributed 8 or 9 points apiece.  For the game, Kenyon had 17 assists (8 by Josh Klinger) on just 20 made baskets, and forced 13 turnovers including 9 steals (4 by Chris Willoughby.) 

Box score. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x24259.xml)  EKU press release. (http://www.ekusports.com/article.asp?articleid=82348)

Kenyon returns to action Friday at the NCAC/OAC Challenge at Denison.   

Happy Thanksgiving to all and sundry.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 22, 2006, 03:34:39 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 22, 2006, 03:14:14 PM
It was too good to be true, however, as the Colonels used a 17-0 run over the halftime break to close the gap...

Geeze.  That's just like a D1 school, to sneak back from their halftime pep talk, roust some dance troupe off the court, intimidate the refs to start the second half early, and put up 17 uncontested points while the Kenyon players were still reading Marx in the locker room.  A goddamn shame, and a trick that not even Capitol would dare try.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2006, 03:57:59 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 22, 2006, 03:34:39 PM
Geeze.  That's just like a D1 school, to sneak back from their halftime pep talk, roust some dance troupe off the court, [...]

A dance troupe at Eastern Kentucky...egad.  :P Probably cloggers, who put so many dings and dents into the court that the Kenyon players couldn't dribble in the second half--hence the turnovers.  An evil plan indeed.

Kenyon's Bryan Yelvington, on the strength of his performance this weekend, was named the first NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) for this season on Monday.  Congratulations!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 22, 2006, 04:30:22 PM
LIl'Giant- U too

Is that how you get good Karma... *wink wink
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 22, 2006, 05:45:12 PM
I was wondering if Wooster had J.V. games preceding either the Walsh or Georgetown games.  They do not.  Here is the Wooster J.V. schedule for the remainder of this semester:

Nov. 29 Away vs. Cuyahoga Community College  7:00
Nov. 30 Home vs. Mount Union                 7:00
Dec.  2 Home vs. Harmony Prep                5:30 (following Varsity game)
Dec.  4 Home vs. Notre Dame College          8:00
Dec.  5 Home vs. Columbus State              7:00
Dec.  9 Away vs. Wittenberg                  5:30
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 22, 2006, 06:28:33 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 22, 2006, 05:45:12 PM
I was wondering if Wooster had J.V. games preceding either the Walsh or Georgetown games.  They do not.  Here is the Wooster J.V. schedule for the remainder of this semester:

Nov. 29 Away vs. Cuyahoga Community College  7:00
Nov. 30 Home vs. Mount Union                 7:00
Dec.  2 Home vs. Harmony Prep                5:30 (following Varsity game)
Dec.  4 Home vs. Notre Dame College          8:00
Dec.  5 Home vs. Columbus State              7:00
Dec.  9 Away vs. Wittenberg                  5:30

I wasn't able to make it to the game yesterday, but the Scots JV's lost to Columbus State 102 - 94.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2006, 07:41:10 PM
At the half:
Capital 28
Wittenberg 26

Witt led most of the way, but Cap caught and passed them near the end of the half.  Hill leads Witt with 6; Borchers has just four on 2 of 6 shooting, but he has corralled 8 rebounds.  Witt is shooting 41% (11/27) but has held Cap to just 35% (11/31), but Cap is 5/10 from the arc.

Witt radio announcers are giving lots of free publicity to D3Hoops.com.  :)

Update:  Capital leads 41-34 with 12:00 left; it seems that Captial is hitting a lot of 3's (I say seems as I'm not listening very closely.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on November 22, 2006, 08:06:31 PM
Fashion report from the Witt - Capital game.

Artie Taylor is wearing the "salmon-colored" ensemble this evening.  This fashion report is from the Wittenberg Radio Network.

I didn't discover D3Hoops until conference tournament time last year.  It's nice to get in at the beginning of the season this year.

Capital is up 7 with about 15:00 left.

Witt just played Capital in the D3 football playoffs on Saturday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2006, 08:21:40 PM
Witt's on a 7-0 run and getting back into the game.
Cap leads 45-43 with 7:26 left.  Timeout Capital.

Glad you'll be here all season, '73!  :)

Update:  Hill converts an old-style three-point play and Witt goes on top 48-46, 6:00 left.
Update:  Three free throws and a tip-in, and Capital regains the lead 51-48, 3:57.
Update:  Two made free throws (and two missed ones), plus a Borchers low post bucket, and Witt is on top 52-51.  2:30.
Update:  Teams trade turnovers; author adds alliteration.  52-51 Witt, 1:40.
Update:  Kyser sinks two FTs; Hill responds with two of his own.  54-53 Witt, 1:13.
Update:  Niekamp misses a bunny, Bowen misses a three.  Fanning is fouled by Borchers with 0:03.8 left.  Makes the first to tie the game at 54.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on November 22, 2006, 08:43:37 PM
[
Update:  Teams trade turnovers; author adds alliteration.  52-51 Witt, 1:40.
[/quote]

Excellent literary technique.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on November 22, 2006, 08:46:46 PM
Fanning's foul fails.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2006, 08:47:06 PM
Witt calls timeout, then Cap does, before Fanning returns for his second free throw.
Fanning misses it; Hill misses from half court, and it's overtime in Bexley.

Update: Borchers blows bunny, Billy Bowen bumps on board; Capital Crusaders cash charity.  :) Cap leads 60-56, 2:22.  (Even an alliterative time!)
Update: Caraway sinks a three to pull Witt to 60-59, 1:39 (I think.)
Update: Fanning misses an open three, but so does Caraway, and Gunn rebounds and is fouled.  Gunn misfires on the first free throw, but hits the target with the second.  Borchers drives, misses, but is fouled.  61-59 Cap, 0:22.6.  Gunn fouls out (goes off prematurely?), Borchers at the line with a chance to tie.
Update:  Borchers makes them to tie.
Update:  Alge misses, Borchers rebounds, Tiger ball with 0:02.x left and tie score, and the broadcast stream craps out.  1973, help!!!
Update:  DC regains connection, and discovers that we're going to second overtime.  Maybe I should have gone to this game after all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2006, 09:05:55 PM
Hill opens the second OT with a trey.  Witt 64-61.
Update:  Alge ties it with a long range jumper.
Update:  Borchers with two FTs and a fadeaway, Witt leads 68-64, 1:41, Witt ball.
Update:  Fanning airballs a three, Witt rebound, still 68-64, 1:09, timeout Witt.
Update:  Stahl fouls Bowen, and Bowen converts both.  Witt 70-64, 1:01.
Update:  Alge layup, 70-66,  Fanning fouls out, Caraway to the line.  Miss, Miss, but Borchers saves the rebound.  Timeout Witt, 0:41.4 left, 70-66 Witt.
Update:  this time the fouler is Stolly, and the foulee is Borchers.  Hit, Hit.  72-66, then Kyser misses a three, Hill rebound & foul, 0:27.2.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on November 22, 2006, 09:16:52 PM
I lost the stream also and then got it back.

Go Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on November 22, 2006, 09:20:15 PM
I can only do a short alliteration:

Witt Wins!!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2006, 09:22:15 PM
Hill makes one.
Hemenway commits a foul at the other end, but it's too little too late for the Crus. 

Wittenberg wins wild Wednesday workout, 73-68 in double overtime.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on November 22, 2006, 09:24:36 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 22, 2006, 09:22:15 PM
Hill makes one.
Hemenway commits a foul at the other end, but it's too little too late for the Crus. 

Wittenberg wins wild Wednesday workout, 73-68 in double overtime.

Great job on the updates, David.

The Internet is truly a wonderful thing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2006, 09:29:15 PM
Happy Thanksgiving, '73.

Waiting for stats...Scott Leo is signing off, so either they didn't give stats or I missed them.  I know Borchers had 20 as part of a double-double, and HIll had 16.  I'm sure the box will be available at wittenberg.edu (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule06-07.html) before long.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 23, 2006, 03:57:15 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 22, 2006, 03:34:39 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 22, 2006, 03:14:14 PM
It was too good to be true, however, as the Colonels used a 17-0 run over the halftime break to close the gap...

Geeze.  That's just like a D1 school, to sneak back from their halftime pep talk, roust some dance troupe off the court, intimidate the refs to start the second half early, and put up 17 uncontested points while the Kenyon players were still reading Marx in the locker room.  A goddamn shame, and a trick that not even Capitol would dare try.

ROTFL, WooBoo! The idea that the Lords were reading Marx in the locker room was the crowning touch!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on November 24, 2006, 12:10:17 PM
After watching  Wabash in action against Hanover here's my observation...Coach Petty needs a point guard who can handle the ball while attacking on offense...seems like Simkus brought the ball up quite a few times and if you're gonna do that you might as well eliminate one "guard" spot, leave Simkus at the 2 and bring in another big guy....anyway they are a young team and I think the future isn't looking half bad for the Little Giants.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 24, 2006, 07:39:57 PM
We've got another big non-conference game tonight, with Ohio Wesleyan taking on '06 Final Four team Illinois Wesleyan at DePauw's tournament.  I plan to listen to the broadcast from IWU; if OWU has a broadcast, please post a link, as I can't find one on their site.  In-game updates will be posted over in the CCIW In-Game Updates (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=3989.1575) room, for those of you who may want to follow along.  Go Bishops!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 24, 2006, 08:44:28 PM
At the half, Ohio Wesleyan leads Illinois Wesleyan 39-34.  Since trailing 2-0, OWU led the entire first half, with their largest lead 9 points.  Chojnacki has 11 points, including three threes.

By Titan Q's estimate, there are about 10 OWU fans in attendance. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 24, 2006, 08:55:58 PM
On Wednesday, Case Western Reserve held on to defeat Hiram at the Terrierdome, 76-74.  The game was Hiram's season opener.  Release (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/news/article.xsp?id=1111); Box Score (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/stats/m-basketball/hirm1122.htm)  Michael McDevitt had a double-double, with 11 points and 11 rebounds for the Pups.  Kyle McKee led Hiram with 18 points, but it was on just 7/21 shooting.  Hiram forced 19 Spartan turnovers, but surrendered 50% shooting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 24, 2006, 09:43:29 PM
A nice credibility-establishing win for OWU and the NCAC, as the Bishops upend Illinois Wesleyan 87-74 in Greencastle.  OWU takes on host DePauw for the tourney title at 3pm CST tomorrow.  All will agree that this is a nice win for the Bishops; all, that is, except the NCAA, for whom it's basically a non-event.  Even with the more liberal definition of "in-region" games this season, IWU doesn't qualify as a regional opponent under any of the formulae:  same conference, same region, within 200 miles, or same administrative region.  But I'll bet the D3Hoops.com poll voters notice, and if they can beat DePauw, I'll be surprised if OWU does not find itself in the top 25 this coming week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 24, 2006, 10:37:22 PM
David -- thanks for the update on IWU and OWU.

Congrats to the Bishops on a very impressive win! :)  The IWU Titans are always one of the top teams in D3.  In fact, IWU was 3-0 going into tonight's contest and the Titans had recently beaten #4 UW-Whitewater in their 2nd game of the season.

It looks like OWU could be a real factor in the NCAC race this season.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 24, 2006, 10:43:45 PM
NCAC friends,

Ohio Wesleyan is a real solid team.  They remind me of some of the real good Hanover teams I've seen in recent years, the way they move the ball and find open 3-point shooters.  To say they're "well-coached" would be an understatement.

OWU is going to live and die by the 3 this season.  They will lose some games when the 3's are not falling and have a chance against the big boys when they are.  Overall I really enjoyed watching them play.

Illinois Wesleyan, of course, lost 8 of their 9 players from last year's Final Four team, but this is still a pretty good Titan team OWU beat.  IWU features 6-7 center Zach Freeman, who is as good as anyone in Division III around the hoop.

OWU will have its hands full with DePauw tomorrow...the Tigers are huge.

- Titan Q (from Greencastle, IN)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 25, 2006, 06:25:58 PM
DePauw defeated Ohio Wesleyan 85-79 in a game DePauw led by as much as 17 in the 2nd half...


http://www.depauw.edu/ath/mbasket/2007/stats/112506.htm

DePauw is a good team -- not a flashy team, but they have solid players at about every position.  Two legit big guys in 6-6/230 Stephen Schott and 6-7/210 Matt MacDonald, a good point-guard in Mike Moore, a nice 2 in Reid Sakel, and a really good "do it all" type in wing Austin Brown.  Also a nice bench.

The four scores from the DePauw tourney this weekend are another good example of why playing the comparative scores game is tough to do:

DePauw 88
Judson 84

Ohio Wesleyan 87
Illinois Wesleyan 74

Illinois Wesleyan 92
Judson 50

DePauw 85
Ohio Wesleyan 79


The All-Tournament team was:

Austin Brown, DePauw (MVP)     
Stephen Schott, DePauw     
Ben Chojnacki, Ohio Wesleyan     
Zach Freeman, Illinois Wesleyan     
Justen Boyd, Judson 


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 25, 2006, 07:48:44 PM
At the Half:   Wooster 48  Walsh 41

Walsh jumped out to a 14-8 lead but then Wooster ran off 19 points in a row by burying 5 three pointers plus two inside buckets by Vandervaart.
That run gave Wooster a 27-14 lead which the Scots have held through the first half.  :)

Wooster is being led by Tim Vandervaart with 15 points, Devin Fulk with 13 points (3 three pointers), James Cooper with 10 points and Tom Port with 8 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 25, 2006, 08:39:37 PM
Final:  Wooster 85  Walsh 68

Wooster notched a solid road win tonight over Walsh University in Canton.  :)

Wooster was led by North Canton native Tim Vandervaart with a career high 32 points.  James Cooper added 14 points, Devin Fulk had 13 points and Tom Port chipped in 8 points.

Wooster is now 3-0. :)  Next up is NAIA Georgetown on 11/28.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 25, 2006, 08:49:51 PM
I have the sad duty to report on the first day of the OAC/NCAC Challenge. 

In the first game, Capital understank Kenyon by a 62-52 score.  It's really a shame that anyone had to win this game.  It's impossible to believe that these two teams gave Wittenberg and Eastern Kentucky all they could handle earlier this week, because they were just dreadful this afternoon.  Midway through the second half, Kenyon broke open a close game with a 7-0 run featuring three-pointers by Bryan Yelvington and Jim Arce.  Capital immediately responded with a 15-0 run that effectively put the game on ice (where it belonged.)  Capital was led by 6'5" post Steve Kyser, whose 22 points  and 10 rebounds (4 offensive) were primarily the result of having his way down low with Yelvington and anyone else assigned to him.  Kenyon's leading scorer was 6'5" freshman Dave Knapke (14) and 6'3" sophomore Korey Haddox (10), the only players for the Lords that provided any kind of scoring threat.  Coming off his NCAC POTW performance, Yelvington (7 pts. on 2-9 shooting) was an almost complete non-factor on offense, and WooBoo's favorite Allen Bediako had a dreadful game on both ends.  Box score; (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x24272.xml) Recap. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x24273.xml)

The second game, which wasn't much better, was won by Muskingum, 79-71 over Denison.  Denison's best player, Dan Hodgkinson, didn't start the game, ostensibly because of the flu.  However, he didn't look ill to me, and he did play 29 minutes, albeit without a lot of spunk most of the time.  Taking Hodgkinson's place in the starting lineup, if not on the floor, was 6'1" sophomore John Ward, who is listed as a guard/wing and contributed nothing but two insignificant points on 1-8 shooting, including 0-5 from the arc.  Hodgkinson did come alive enough late in the 2nd half to record 18 points.  The star of the game for Denison was Shea McMahon, who had 22 including shooting 4 of 7 from deep.  Denison actually shot the ball well, hitting 55.6% (rising to 64.9% without Ward's contribution), but they turned the ball over 17 times and allowed the Muskies to get off 17 more field goal opportunities.  Add to that the woeful free throw shooting (17 of 27) and you get defeat for the Big Red.  On the other end, Muskingum has the only players that really impressed me on the afternoon.  Their point guard, 5'7" junior Brandon Todd, had a James Cooper-esque game, scoring 27 including 5 treys to go with 4 steals, 4 assists, and just 3 turnovers from the point.  Trevor Scott added 21 very quiet points, and freshman Pat Byrne added 13 points, many in very impressive fashion while Todd was on the bench with foul trouble.  In fact, it was Musky foul trouble that kept Denison in the game and allowed Hodgkinson to score almost at will in the paint in the last 5 or 6 minutes, but it was not enough for the Big Red.  Box score; (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mb/mb07/denm1125.html) Recap. (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/db/site/newsreleases/mb/20061125_2218.html)

Tomorrow the Challenge resumes at Muskingum, where Denison should have a decent chance to take down Capital before Muskingum blasts Kenyon.  Unless, of course, the Marx-reading Lords from the other night show up.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 25, 2006, 11:13:43 PM
Notes from North Canton:

Walsh tried everybody but the trainer on the Wooster center, but Tim Vandervaart'ed them all.  Spinning, unspinning, corkscrewing, well, it's hard to explain.  Try to imagine the Tasmanian Devil from Looney Tunes manning the post.  More moves than McHale had, none of them at all like those of the former Celtic, but every bit as effective, even against seven-foot Brazilians.  He was ridiculously effective, really.

It did look a little dicey early, as Walsh scored four or five easy baskets underneath.  Enter Evan Will, whose contribution might elude those who only peruse the boxscore but was there for all in attendance to see.  Evan muscled the Walsh posts, keeping them at bay during his tours, and boxed out so the little twos and threes could scoop up the defensive rebounds.  Congrats, Evan, nice performance.

And, of course, there was the blitz.  Walsh was surely told about the danger of allowing Wooster's three-point shooters to get some daylight, but they didn't have the first-hand experience that Mt. Union had last weekend, to be able to actually see them in action.  A picture is worth - well, you know.  Walsh guarded the perimeter early, then got lax after going up 14-8.  Nineteen lightning-fast points later, they again guarded the perimeter, but by then the game had a new context and a new leader.

James Cooper took his turn in the spotlight, as he usually does.  Coop just could not pass up the challenge of shooting over the big South American, first with a trey and later with a stutter-step short jumper.  Both went in, as usual.

I'd like to say it was a yeomanlike effort from everyone, but seriously, Oberlin cannot play at this level.  The Scots were excellent, on the road, against a team that is probably better than Wooster allowed them to look.

Georgetown on Tuesday will be a tougher test.  Will the Scots have a shot?  As Grouch Marx, who did not attend Kenyon, used to say, "You bet your life!"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 25, 2006, 11:20:41 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 25, 2006, 11:13:43 PMMore moves than McHale had[...]

Tries to picture Ernest Borgnine putting a spin move on Joe Flynn...  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 25, 2006, 11:31:23 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 25, 2006, 11:20:41 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 25, 2006, 11:13:43 PMMore moves than McHale had[...]

Tries to picture Ernest Borgnine putting a spin move on Joe Flynn...  :D

I think you have the wrong McHale.  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 25, 2006, 11:57:12 PM
It's always dangerous to guage a team by it's best moments, but that 19-0 run was possible the best defense I have seen by a Wooster team. I don't think Walsh knew what hit them. If you go to the box score at the Wooster website Walsh committed 4 turnovers, 3 fouls, and settled for 0-4 from beyond the arc (plus one attempted put back) in the 5 minute span between their buckets. This all happened when Woosters subs (Will, Fulk, and Bidwell) entered the game and gave the defense an energy Walsh couldn't match.

Its an old phrase that offense wins games but defense win championships. Wittenberg was a prime example of this last year and hopefully Wooster is getting there.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 26, 2006, 12:54:02 AM
As mentioned by everyone earlier - a great job by the Scots tonight!  For those who thought that the Scots might have trouble with the taller Walsh squad, that obviously was not an issue.  Not only did Vandervaart dominate the paint on offense, the Scots also won the battle of the boards.  Some of that was due to the fact that Araujo - Walsh's 7-footer - seemed reluctant to go inside, but instead preferred to shoot from long range.  I'm assuming that's their normal game plan, but its hard to figure why they wouldn't try to use their height to their advantage inside.

Also - a great turnout (as always) by the Wooster faithful!  Attendance was listed at 953, and about half of that were Scots fans! 

Should be another good game on Tuesday against Georgetown.  Does anyone know anything about their team?  They have a roster posted, but no heights or stats for this year...

Go Scots!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 26, 2006, 09:54:29 AM
In the preseason NAIA D1 poll, which is the only one out so far, Georgetown is ranked 8th nationally.  They were 26-8 last season and won their conference.  This season they've played two exhibition games against NCAA D1 opponents.  The results include a surprisingly close loss to Louisville, 94-92, and a blowout loss to the University of Dayton, 101-68.  In official ballgames, their record is currently 7-1.

Their top returning players, with last years stats, (and heights :)) are:

Brian Silverhorn (6-6, 222, Sr., G, 17.0 ppg, 5.0 rpg)
Mark Surgalski (6-8, 237, Sr., F/C, 14.0 ppg, 7.0 rpg)
Craig Schoen (5'11, 180, Sr., G, 9.0 ppg, 4.0 rpg)

Go here to find 2006-07 team and individual stats, a schedule with box scores, and a roster with heights:

http://www.dakstats.com/WebSync/Pages/Conference/Conference.aspx?association=10&sg=MBB&sea=NAIMBB_2006&conference=NAIMBB1_MSC

They are big, listing 3 players as 6-9, two as 6-8, and two others as 6-6.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 26, 2006, 10:23:41 AM
Just to add my thoughts on last night's game, it was my first taste of Scots Basketball this season and I came away very impressed.  Walsh came out quick and I thought it was, at the very least, going to be a battle and then came the 19-0 run in which the Scots bench came in and lit the fire on both ends of the court to pretty much end all doubt.  Yes, Walsh did make a small run at the end of the 1st half and managed to cut the deficit to 5 early in the 2nd half, but Wooster quickly pushed the lead back to 13-15 points and Walsh never got back within 9 the rest of the way.  I too was puzzled about how Walsh used their 7 footer.  His first basket they lobbed it inside to him for an easy 2, and that seemed to be the last time they went to him on the inside as most of his points came from beyond the arc???  Not good coaching strategy if you ask me.

Vandervaart was the man last night.  As WB said, Walsh had no answer for the wryly spin moves in the paint.  He has improved sooo much over his 4 years at Wooster.  Just a great example of the value that Coach Cline brings to this basketball team!

As for G'town on Tuesday, I heard the postgame interview with Coach Moore and he said that they might be the most talented opponent to ever step foot into Timken! :o  Of Course, I said notice he said opponent, because the team he's got right now might be the most talented team period to play in Timken! 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 26, 2006, 10:56:00 AM
Here is the Wooster - Walsh game story from the Canton Repository:  :)

Vandervaart keys Wooster past Walsh
By ANDY CALL REPOSITORY SPORTS WRITER

NORTH CANTON - College of Wooster men's basketball Coach Steve Moore knew two things could happen when Tim Vandervaart returned to North Canton — and only one of them was good.

"I figured he would either be nervous and have a rough game or be really fired up and play well," Moore said of the 6-foot-6 senior forward from Hoover High. "Fortunately, it was the latter."

Vandervaart scored a career-high 32 points despite playing with a sprained thumb Saturday night as the Scots rolled to a surprisingly lopsided 85-68 victory over Walsh University in a showdown of area small-college powerhouses.

Wooster (3-0) was ranked No. 1 in NCAA Division III in one poll, No. 2 in another. Walsh (3-2) was ranked No. 7 nationally in the NAIA preseason poll.

"I didn't want to come here and play awful," said Vandervaart, whose home is three streets away from the Walsh campus. "A lot of people came here specifically to watch me play. I didn't want to disappoint them."

Vandervaart had prepared for his homecoming by jamming his right thumb Friday when he collided with a teammate during practice.

"When you have that much adrenaline going, you don't feel the pain," Vandervaart said. "I got used to it. But at least I have something to blame for missing a dunk in the second half."

Vandervaart was 12-for-15 from the field and 8-for-9 from the line, and also led his team with seven rebounds. His big output was somewhat surprising because Wooster's offensive reputation is built on perimeter shooting. The Scots poured in 38 3-point field goals during their first two games.

"Walsh had scouted us, and they did some things to limit our shooters," Moore said. "We knew we'd probably have to go inside a bit more, and Tim really rose to the occasion."

So did Wooster guards Brandon Johnson and Devin Fulk, whose primary job description was to harass Walsh guard Corey Jones, the Cavaliers' leading scorer (19.3). Jones was able to get off just six shots in 33 minutes and finished with 14 points.

"We didn't want Jones to have too many open looks," Moore said. "His range and quick release is as good as any guard we'll see this year."

The Scots found their shooting range during a four-minute stretch of the first half in which they went on a 19-0 run to take a 27-14 lead. Fulk hit all three of his 3-point shots during that span, Tom Port converted twice from long range, and Vandervaart posted up for two buckets.

Wooster led by 14 points twice in the first half, but the Cavs rallied within 50-45 early in the second half. Vandervaart then posted up twice during a 10-2 run that widened the gap to 60-47 and sealed the outcome. Walsh was never closer than 9 points the rest of the way, and the Scots finished the game with an 11-3 run.

Eder Araujo, who missed Friday's game with a sprained ankle, led Walsh with 15 points and 10 rebounds. Brandon Weems contributed 11 points and Derek Chappell 10. James Cooper scored 14 points and Fulk 13 for Wooster.

"There is always talk about whether Division III players can hang with scholarship players, and we've always believed we could," Vandervaart said. "We do go to school. We are student-athletes. But we also play the game with a lot of heart and a lot of passion."

Reach Repository sports writer Andy Call at (330) 580-8346 or e-mail: andy.call@cantonrep.com

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 26, 2006, 11:15:09 AM
From Wooster Booster's Online Dictionary:

Vandervaart.  verb.  pronunciation: Van-der-vart 

Vandervaarted, Vandervaarting, to Vandervaart. 

1. to score at will from point-blank range against a helpless opponent using a variety of quick spinning moves while barely leaving the ground and occasionally exceeding the three-second limit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 26, 2006, 11:41:09 AM
Georgetown is one of the top small college programs in the country -- this should be a great test for Wooster. 

In my opinion, a "Final Four-caliber" Division III team should be favored on its homecourt - especially one like Timken where there is a great homecourt advantage - against an NAIA I team ranked about 5 or lower.  From what I have learned over the years in following small college basketball, it seems like the top 3 or 4 NAIA I teams are a notch above the best NCAA Division III teams.  They are much more like very good NCAA Division II teams.  For example, Robert Morris (Chicago) - the #1-rated team in the NAIA I preseason poll - is just head and shoulders above anyone in our division talent-wise.  RMC's third leading scorer, John Winchester, started for Tennessee last year.  Their best player, Reggie George, came from Iowa State.  Last year RMC had a McDonald's All-American (not just a nominee) on their roster (Jerome Harper) and he was only "Honorable Mention" All-CCAC behind their 3 1st Team selections.

http://www.robertmorris.edu/athletics/mensbasketball/chicago/

This, by the way, is not to suggest that our best teams cannot play with teams like Robert Morris.  Last year Olivet Nazarene (a team that looks and plays like a top D3 team) won the league Robert Morris is in, the Chicagoland Collegiate Athletic Conference.  Illinois Wesleyan beat Olivet Nazarene 87-68 on November 22.  The Stevens Points and Virginia Wesleyans of years past surely could have played with the NAIA John Browns and Mountain States, but they'd have to do it with good old fashioned D3 fundamental basketball -- the D3's would be giving up a lot in the athleticism and size departments.

Last year Illinois Wesleyan played highly-ranked NAIA I St. Xavier, also of the CCAC, fresh off SXU's victory over Division I Illinois-Chicago.  IWU defeated the Cougars 81-61 at home on November 28.

I have also watched over the years as Illinois Wesleyan has owned Olivet Nazarene.  IWU has played ONU in each of the last 11 seasons.  IWU is 10-1 vs the Tigers, with the one loss being in overtime at ONU during IWU's last transition coaching season (2001-02).  In almost every one of these seasons, Olivet Nazarene has been ranked in the 10-15 range of NAIA I (this year ONU is #18 in the preseason poll).  They've won the CCAC 5 times in these years and made the NAIA I tourney 6 times.  This includes a Final Four appearance in 2000, a year IWU defeated ONU 90-74.

I am glad Wooster is playing Georgetown.  Over the years as a D3hoops.com Top 25 voter I've had trouble gauging the Scots.  It seems like they only get 1 or 2 real tests in the non-conference against good D3 teams, but usually at home and usually vs "lower ranked" teams.  They win the games as they should.  Then, of course, COW gets into the NCAC where it's really difficult to evaluate game results, except when they face Wittenberg and maybe an Ohio Wesleyan or Wabash.  So I think this Georgetown game will be very helpful, and also very good for Wooster win or lose.

I recommend not approaching the game as one vs some "higher division" team, but almost like, say, D3 #1 Virginia Wesleyan, coming into Timken.  It is a game vs a great team, but one you should feel like you're a favorite in at home. We all know Wooster will represent Division III very well.


http://naia.cstv.com/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/110106aab.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 26, 2006, 12:02:35 PM
Titan Q - thanks for the good points about D3 vs. NAIA matchups.

Georgetown College is a very tall team as Wooster Booster noted.  I found the Tigers starting lineup in a recent boxscore:

C 6'9"  Donnovan Brown  8.4 ppg, played at Univ. of Houston
F 6'9"  Chris Lee  10.9 ppg, played at South Carolina State
F 6'6"  Brian Silverhorn  16.4 ppg, top scorer, senior leader of team
G 6'3"  Justin Taylor  9.0 ppg, played at Tenn. Tech University
G 5'11" Craig Schoen  6.9 ppg

Their top scorer off the bench is 6'5" Kevin Reinhardt 9.9 ppg and he was the leading scorer for Northern Kentucky University last year before he transferred to Georgetown.  They also have 3-4 other strong guys off the bench including a couple of 6'8" big men.

Georgetown should be a real challenge for Wooster.  The Scots will need to box out well so they stay close in the rebounding battle.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on November 26, 2006, 02:42:48 PM
The Wittenberg Tigers are on the air!

Witt 28 Transylvania 19 at the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on November 26, 2006, 03:36:52 PM
Tigers Take It and move to 4-0.

Witt 66 Transylvania 59

I still think they should be the Transylvania Draculas and their mascot should be Grandpa Munster.

The Tigers play next at Denison on Saturday to open the NCAC season.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 26, 2006, 04:54:31 PM
Earlham drops to 0-4 with a loss at home to Manchester. I have no idea what the final score was (spread was probably about 10) or what any statistics say (because I couldn't care less who didn't score what).

Worst start for the Quakers since 1999 when Earlhamalum was a freshman forward.

I almost drove to Richmond for this one, glad that I saved the $8,524 in gas and used the Internet to listen to the Teamline broadcast...actually that wasn't that great either.

Wooster and Kenyon are the next two opponents...no better time to start playing well than with the pre-conference conference portion of the schedule at hand.

So it goes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on November 26, 2006, 06:04:26 PM
Billy-Billy-BillyPilgram-  Don't forget that year we started 1-11 and then went on finishing 4th in the conference, Beating "THE" Allegheny Gators at home when they had a crafty Guard named----hmmm Before Nick Catanzarite.... Oh gzz i hope it comes to me... Jake Delsandro.  Right after beating Allegheny we had Wooster UP by 1 at Half-Time In Timken Gymnasium with 2,175 Fans with their jaws to the floor.   

Woosterbooster- Granted you guys still managed to win by 26.   You were talking about how efficent Tim Vandervaart is with his POST MOVES.  Celtic Kevin McHale.  (How about them Celtics beating Manchester United.  That one was for you Billy) Back to the subject at hand, don't act like outstanding Center play is anything new at Wooster.
You have Tim, Bryan, John and Stan who have all had outstanding Post moves and Careers with Wooster.  Seems to a theme at Wooster.   

Well I'm off to grab some dinner before the Colts Game!!!!   It's going to to be a late night in downtown Indianapolis, Hopefully the outcome is different then My QUakeRs!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 26, 2006, 06:20:16 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on November 26, 2006, 06:04:26 PM
Back to the subject at hand, don't act like outstanding Center play is anything new at Wooster.
You have Tim, Bryan, John and Stan who have all had outstanding Post moves and Careers with Wooster.  Seems to a theme at Wooster.   
Yeah, like I said in my last post, the theme has a name and that is Doug Cline.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 26, 2006, 08:17:38 PM
EA -

I know that Wooster has had some very good centers, a few of which were certainly better all-around players than Tim Vandervaart.  I guess what I was trying to relay was that his moves are very different than those of Nelson, Gorman, Meech, or anyone else. 

Vandervaart made 12 field goals against Walsh.  Every one of them was a layup: I've yet to see him settle for any less of a shot.  He's able, with speed, agility, and know-how, to get to one side of the basket or the other before the defender.  He goes over nobody.  He muscles down nobody.  It's all lateral quickness, feeling where the defender is, giving him a little of this, a little of that, and suddenly there's the final quick move when he knows that one side of the hoop open, and he's always there first. 

I was a Celtics fan for years, and loved Kevin McHale with his up-and-unders and dropsteps, but half the time he was forced into taking little fallaway jumpers.  I don't even know if Vandervaart has that shot in his arsenal, he's never needed it in the last couple of years.  Tuesday night will be really interesting, to see how he does offensively against probably the biggest test of his college career.  I have the feeling that he'll give their big guys all they can handle, unless they double team him.  In which case it'll be up the the outside shooters to do their jobs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 26, 2006, 09:21:51 PM
The OAC finishes off a clean sweep of the OAC/NCAC Challenge with two dominating victories in New Concord. 

In the opener, Capital played an excellent game and polished off Denison 81-68.  Junior post Steve Kyser had a career-high 31 points, giving him 53 points (and 18 rebounds) in the two-game sweep.  He was unstoppable, hitting from all over the court, including two sweet threes, and crashing the offensive boards hard.  As a team, Capital grabbed sixteen offensive rebounds (vs. 17 defensive rebounds for Denison) and had seven steals.  As a result, Capital had 18 more field goal attempts, and as both teams shot equivalently well (DU 46%, CU 48%), that spelled defeat for the Big Red.  Capital led most of the second half by anywhere from 15-20 points, and led by 17 with 4:15 remaining.  From then on, however, they had a lot of trouble with Denison's full court trap defense, and had three missed shots, two turnovers and two fouls as Denison cut the lead to 11 with 1:21 left.  At that point, with all the momentum and the game still possibly in doubt, Bob Ghiloni threw in the towel, sending in two reserves from the back end of the bench, and allowing Capital to essentially run the clock out.  Probably it wouldn't have mattered, but it was another head-scratching move by the DU coach.  Box score (http://www.capitalcrusaders.net/mbasketball/06-07mbbstats/06mbgm03.htm); Short Recap (http://www.capital.edu/internet/default.aspx?pid=10331).

I think Denison has used four starting lineups in their five games, so your guess is as good as mine as to who will start when they play your favorite team.  Denison is off until Saturday, when they open NCAC play by hosting Wittenberg.  Capital finishes up the NCAC portion of their schedule on Wednesday when they host Ohio Wesleyan.  Capital is now 2-1 against NCAC foes.

In the nightcap, as anticipated, Muskingum had no problem with Kenyon, racing out to a 15-1 lead and coasting to an 86-61 victory.  Although it sounds odd, I'd have to say that Kenyon played better today than yesterday against Capital, but nothing they could have done would have mattered against a far superior Muskingum squad.  Musky did everything well: they shot 60%, grabbed 14 offensive rebounds (despite playing a four guard set most of the day, giving up from 1-4 inches per position), dished out 20 assists, and forced 23 turnovers including 13 steals.  They were at least a step quicker and more aggressive, and Kenyon was never in the game.  Junior point guard Brandon Todd had 21 points to go with the 27 he posted against Denison, and added ten assists for the double-double.  If they gave out an OAC/NCAC Challenge MVP award, I'd give it to Todd by a whisker over Capital's Steve Kyser.  But Todd had help; four Muskies were in double figures, including frosh Pat Byrne (Todd's high school teammate who had 17 today, 30 for the weekend) and soph. Trevor Scott (Andy Van Horn's high school teammate, who had 12 today and 33 on the weekend).  Kenyon was led by Bryan Yelvington, who had a somewhat better game today than yesterday, and frosh Dave Knapke, with 13 points apiece.  Knapke had 27 of the 113 Kenyon points on the weekend (24%); I wouldn't hesitate to put him in the starting lineup ahead of Allen Bediako, who had another barely-there game.  In fact, Kenyon's starting lineup is a little odd, given that it includes two players (Bediako and Chris Willoughby) who play sparingly (between them, 16 minutes today and 20 yesterday) and contribute less (combined 4 turnovers, 3 fouls, one block and zero points on 0-1 shooting today.)  Their backups, Knapke and David Jolson, respectively, seem to be better players and play much more (52 minutes today, 64 yesterday.)  But what do I know?  ::)  Box score (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x24274.xml); Recap (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x24276.xml). 

Kenyon travels to Washington & Jefferson on Weds.  The Prexies are off to an 0-5 start, including losses to Allegheny and OWU.  Muskingum hosts Thiel on Wednesday and won't see another NCAC opponent until they run into Earlham on Dec. 20 at the Washington & Jefferson holiday tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 26, 2006, 10:33:53 PM
Our little kaffeeklatsch passed the 100,000 hits threshold this weekend.  Hooray for us!  :D 8) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 27, 2006, 02:36:04 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 26, 2006, 10:33:53 PM
Our little kaffeeklatsch passed the 100,000 hits threshold this weekend.  Hooray for us!  :D 8) :D

And you marked the occasion in high style, David. The line "Capital understank Kenyon" would've been noteworthy in its own right, but the McHale's Navy reference put you over the top as the Posting Up POTW (Poster of the Weekend).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 27, 2006, 05:56:12 AM
POTW, yeah.  But anyone who would subject themselves, on purpose, to back to back doubleheaders involving both Kenyon and Denison deserves either a greater reward than that, perhaps basketball fandom's version of the Purple Heart, or, maybe a short stay in a nearby local institution where they have men in white coats, if you get my drift.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 27, 2006, 06:18:50 AM
I just chalk it up to the fact that David's been in exile in southern California for so long that he's starved for live D3 basketball. Kenyon and Denison may not look like much, but at least they're the genuine article as far as D3 is concerned.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 27, 2006, 08:56:56 AM
I just had a question I forgot to bring up over the weekend concerning the Scot's lineup.  I noticed that Craig Elam was in street clothes on the bench.  Did he get injured or something?  Just wondering if anyone in here knew anything about it?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 27, 2006, 09:54:06 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 27, 2006, 08:56:56 AM
I just had a question I forgot to bring up over the weekend concerning the Scot's lineup.  I noticed that Craig Elam was in street clothes on the bench.  Did he get injured or something?  Just wondering if anyone in here knew anything about it?

We know that he dinged his knee in the opener and didn't play much in the 2nd game of the Van Wie tourney.  I was guessing that Coach Moore didn't want to take a chance on aggravating the injury in a game that doesn't count (in the eyes of the NCAA!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2006, 10:37:28 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 27, 2006, 05:56:12 AM
POTW, yeah.  But anyone who would subject themselves, on purpose, to back to back doubleheaders involving both Kenyon and Denison deserves either a greater reward than that, perhaps basketball fandom's version of the Purple Heart, or, maybe a short stay in a nearby local institution where they have men in white coats, if you get my drift.  :)

This from the guy that just three days ago suggested that Kenyon would be better than Wittenberg...

Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 24, 2006, 09:36:16 PM
I knew these boys [OWU] would be tough.  It's the rise of the NCAC East.  Wooster and OWU, not necessarily in that order, followed by the Marx spouting Lords of Kenyon.  All three possibly better than anyone the west can produce.

I'd go on, but Nurse Ratched says if I don't log off, I won't get my cigarettes...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on November 27, 2006, 11:15:18 AM


All tickets for the Witt-Woo game Dec. 9 will be reserved.

Tickets go on sale Dec.4 and will be available 5-7pm  in the HPER lobby.

Tickets will be $8 adults and $5 students.

No passes will be honored.

w4e
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2006, 11:26:09 AM
W4E,
Are the students in session, or will they be, for this game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 27, 2006, 11:50:15 AM
The NCAC - East? Wait, who is the west?

Looking at geography the Eastern most NCAC schools are Hiram, Allegheny, Wooster, Kenyon, and Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 27, 2006, 12:44:04 PM
Yeah, I'm questioning how OWU would be in the NCAC East?  In baseball, OWU is a part of the NCAC West, so why would they hypothetically be a part of the NCAC East in Basketball?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 27, 2006, 12:45:00 PM
Quote from: anonymous2 on November 27, 2006, 11:15:18 AM


All tickets for the Witt-Woo game Dec. 9 will be reserved.

Tickets go on sale Dec.4 and will be available 5-7pm  in the HPER lobby.

Tickets will be $8 adults and $5 students.

No passes will be honored.

w4e

I had heard (unofficially) that there would be a pre-sale in Wooster of tickets for the 12/9 game as well.  Has anyone heard anything about that?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on November 27, 2006, 01:33:13 PM
The NCAC has not produced standings yet and league play starts this SAT.

WITT      4-0
(With big win over Transylvania, that is twice 8 months and  playing mostly upperclassman?)
WOOSTER    3-0
ALLEGHENY   3-0
(but barely beat lowly PSU-Behrend at home, .444 FG% and being out rebounded..hummm??)
OWU      4-1 (see below)
KENYON      2-3
WABASH      1-2 (and about to face Depauw, the NCAC killa)
DENISON      1-4
HIRAM      0-1
OBERLIN      0-4
EARLHAM      0-4
(also narrow lost to Depauw like OWU, but on neutral court)

OWU has beaten Ill Weslyan on a neutral court and narrowly lost to the hosts, Depauw.  They look strong this year with Seniors Chojnacki and Shirer leading the way.  They are experienced squad. And in early action they are going 10 deep with 8 players getting 15 mpg or more.

I see OWU making a move on WITT this year and they may split with WOO again. My concern is that the NCAC again looks strong at the top with nothing in the middle or bottom and many of great NCAC players are moving on with graduation.  The future does not look bright.

Go Scots!! Go Bengals!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 27, 2006, 02:11:04 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on November 27, 2006, 01:33:13 PM


OWU has beaten Ill Weslyan on a neutral court and narrowly lost to the hosts, Depauw. 

WoosterFan, I probably wouldn't call that OWU loss to DePauw "narrow."  DePauw led by double digits most of the second half...

http://www.depauw.edu/ath/mbasket/2007/stats/112506.htm

It is going to take more time to evaluate the 3 Division III teams in that DePauw tournament.  Last week DePauw lost at U. of Chicago - a decent, but certainly not great team.  DePauw also just barely beat 1-8 Judson, the NAIA team Illinois Wesleyan beat by 42 the next day.  And I think everyone knows the extent that IWU is reloading, with a new coach and new players.

As I posted this weekend, I'm a big fan of OWU.  I think they have Top 25 potential and certainly the ability to challenge that 2 spot in the NCAC...just saying we need to step back and watch these teams play some more before we draw conclusions.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: uknowme2 on November 27, 2006, 02:45:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 27, 2006, 11:26:09 AM
W4E,
Are the students in session, or will they be, for this game?

The students will be in session for this one.  Will they be at the game?   ;D

GO TIGERS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 27, 2006, 04:13:07 PM
hey guys sorry its been so long since i posted. ill try not to cause problems haha but i do bring a student perspective to the table. i haven't been to any of witt's games yet this year, but i have listened to two of them. in both it seems that they are relying on their defense and timely scoring to win games. i need to see more consistent play out of the bench for this team to be great-i.e. if we can develop a few of our freshman.

yes we will be at the game december 9th and if the students aren't there, plenty of local fans will fill their void-remember guys this is the big ticket game in division 3 arguably, so it will be sold out guaranteed. its a shame it has to be so early in the season so both teams will still be feeling themselves out. wittenberg also has a tough home game against the NAIA Cedarville earlier in the week, but should prevail and set up the showdown again. hope everyone on here has a good season and we have some more diverse talking points instead of wooster/wabash chatter all season. thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2006, 08:29:51 PM
Congratulations to Tim Vandervaart, today named the NCAC Player of the week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt):

QuoteNovember 27, 2006

Wooster's Tim Vandervaart (North Canton, OH/Hoover), a 6-6, senior post,
scored a career-high 32 points while playing in his hometown and leading
the second-ranked Fighting Scots to a 17-point victory (85-68) at Walsh,
the No. 7 rated team in NAIA Div. II. Vandervaart made 12-of-15 (.800)
field goals and 8-of-9 (.889) free throws and also led the Scots in
rebounding (7) in their lone game of the week.

Congratulations also to Denison's Dan Hodgkinson, who scored his 1500th career point in the second half of their game Sunday against Capital.  Although I knew he was closing in on this milestone, I had no idea that it had been accomplished on Sunday, and noticed no reaction from those in attendance (which included his parents).  It's too bad that there wasn't some way that this achievement could have been noted when it happened. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2006, 10:09:22 PM
Final :  #1 Virginia Wesleyan lost tonight on the road to Averett 81-73.

So, IF Wooster can win their two games this week, they may secure the #1 ranking (and accompanying bulls-eye  :)) in the next D3Hoops Top 25 poll.

That is a big IF considering the challenge posed by Georgetown tomorrow.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 27, 2006, 10:29:19 PM
I'd be a lot more concerned if tomorrow's opponent had uniforms that said "Hoyas" on their shirts and Patrick Ewing and Eric Floyd came running out on the floor.  :)

Wooster's gonna take 'em, I can feel it in the air.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2006, 10:35:56 PM
Hmmmm...that's interesting.

What is implied but unsaid in WSF's post is that VWU probably will still be #1 in the poll released tomorrow, as it considers games only up through Sunday.  (I say 'probably' because their only other game was a 1-point home victory over Christopher Newport, now 2-2; it's possible although extremely unlikely that Wooster reels in the Marlins in tomorrow's poll based on results through Sunday.)

It's not out of the realm of possibility that Wooster could move to #1 even with a loss to Georgetown.  Our voters are well-informed, and they know that Georgetown is an elite-class team.  Losses to top-flight scholarship teams are not always held against teams. 

It sure makes things interesting for those among us who are poll-obsessed (like, uh, well, me.  :))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2006, 11:07:36 PM
And oh by the way....
Supposing that Wooster does move up to #1 in next week's poll, to be released on Tuesday 12/5.  Who's on Wooster's schedule that week?  I mean, besides Oberlin.  That's right: Wittenberg.  I don't need to remind any of the old-time regulars about what has happened in the past when Wooster has moved to #1 and played Wittenberg immediately thereafter.   :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 28, 2006, 09:16:43 AM
D.C. you beat me to that little observation-they say history does repeat itself----but it usually is when we're at wooster so we're gonna change the history hopefully
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 28, 2006, 10:54:44 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 28, 2006, 09:16:43 AM
D.C. you beat me to that little observation-they say history does repeat itself----but it usually is when we're at wooster so we're gonna change the history hopefully
Yes, the history will be changed alright.  Only Wooster will be the ones doing the changing! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 28, 2006, 11:33:17 AM
we'll have to wait and see-any word on if the allottment of tickets to wooster is any different then in years past? i dont think it will matter because wooster fans will get their tickets regardless one way or another.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on November 28, 2006, 01:46:22 PM
Here is another question?  If Wooster loses to NAIA Division I Georgetown, could Wooster hold on to the #1 or #2 slot? 

I, for one, am not one for the having or holding on to that ranking.  I hate to sound cliche but FEB/MAR is what counts.  The last thing SCOTS need is more motivation for OWU and WITT to overtake the SCOTS or more motivation for the MOSE HOLE tourney participants!!

Go SCOTS!!  Go Bengals!!...man did I love that win over the hapless BROWNS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on November 28, 2006, 03:46:49 PM
Quote from: uknowme2 on November 27, 2006, 02:45:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 27, 2006, 11:26:09 AM
W4E,
Are the students in session, or will they be, for this game?

The students will be in session for this one.  Will they be at the game?   ;D

GO TIGERS!

I think the Athletic Department has made a MAJOR mistake on this one.  They are saying that all seats are reserved - even students who want to attend the game have to go stand in line to get a ticket.  Unfortunately, I don't think all that many Wittenberg students are interested in standing in line to get tickets to the game - it's just this campus' apathetic nature.  They'll still get in free, but why couldn't they just do like they did last year - set a certain number of admissions aside for students and have them come into the gym via a different entrance.

I'll be there no matter what because I will be working the men's JV game and the women's varsity game beforehand, so I'll just stick around for the men's game.  But, we may see a dwindled student section at this game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on November 28, 2006, 07:36:26 PM
28-27 SCOTS over Georgetown as they have gone on a mini 10-0 run with 2:08 to go in the first half.  Wooster is shooting well but have not been aggressive on defense and have been turning the ball over 10 TOs to 5 for Gtown thus far.
No foul trouble for the SCOTS.  Wooster held an 8 point lead early and are thus far outrebounding the bigger team.  I cannot wait to hear from folks that have attended in Timken.  Details, Details.  I gonna want details.

Go SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 28, 2006, 07:37:09 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 35  Georgetown 29

Wooster played a sloppy first half with 10 turnovers limiting their offensive possessions but they still hold the lead.  Scots were led in scoring by Tim Vandervaart with 12 points and Tom Port with 11 points.

Georgetown is being led by Justin Taylor with 8 points and Brian Silverhorn with 6 points.

Wooster outrebounded Georgetown in the first half with Vandervaart and Brandon Johnson each pulling down 7 boards.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on November 28, 2006, 07:41:36 PM
I have to agree with wooscotsfan.  Certainly a sloppy first half reading by the 10 turnovers Wooster have committed thus far but a great way to finish the half.  Georgetown was stuck on 27 points for a loooong time.  Great defense by the Scots!

Cooper was silent in the first half.  What is going on?  Is he being closely guarded or he is just out of it?  Whats going on to those who are at Timken?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 28, 2006, 08:45:33 PM
Final:  Wooster 80  Georgetown (KY) 73

Wooster gets a very impressive win over a 7-1 Georgetown squad ranked #8 nationally in NAIA (I).  ;D

Wooster was led in scoring by Tim Vandervaart with 22 points, 14 boards, Tom Port with 16 points, James Cooper with 14 points and Devin Fulk with 13 points.

Wooster won this game by outshooting and outrebounding a much taller Georgetown team.

Wooster is now 4-0.  :)  Next up is Earlham on Saturday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on November 28, 2006, 09:00:10 PM
Seems like a great show-down is brewing between Vandervaart and Borchers.
USA! USA! USA!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on November 28, 2006, 09:06:52 PM
I choose a wrong time to move big furniture between apartments and as a result I missed what seems to be a great second half for the Scots versus Georgetown (Kentucky).  Based on their performance so far, count me among the believers.  The Scots are set to deliver this year.  Good luck to Earlham on Saturday.  They need it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 28, 2006, 09:07:35 PM
guys here is the matchup that will decide the wooster/witt game this year mark it down-whoever wins this battle wins the game

(insert witt defender/Jack Hemingway/ billy bown) vs tom port-if they can control port on the outside and neutralize the perimeter-which is very much easier said then done-then witt can hopefully keep this a manageable scoring game-i think hill and cooper will match up well believe it or not. they both are slashers
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 28, 2006, 09:18:20 PM
Final from Greendingle:

Wabash   82
Depauw   92

Blech. LGs were playing even until 2 minutes before halftime. Depauw called a timeout with the score 38-38. Following the timeout Wabash didn't score again in that half and the the Tigers were leading at the breatk 47-38. Depauw was up by as many as 16 in the 2nd. Wabash never got closer than 7.

2 losses in a row for Wabash, which falls to 1-3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2006, 09:48:26 PM
I'm curious where WoosterFAN, wsf, and WooMix were getting their information; I guess from the radio, or maybe the live online stats?  Because "not aggressive on defense" and "sloppy" were not words I'd use to describe any part of tonight's outstanding basketball game.  "Not aggressive on defense" is particularly incorrect.  Both teams played outstanding aggressive defense all night long.  Most of the turnovers were the result of that aggressive defense.  Andy Van Horn and Marty Bidwell took Georgetown's 6'6" All-American guard Brian Silverthorn right out of his game; on the other end, Georgetown's defense made James Cooper a non-factor for most of the evening.  Tim Vandervaart was simply brilliant on the offensive end.  Despite giving up 3 inches, he was spinning and twirling, dropping in layups, grabbing offensive rebound, and drawing fouls.  And I can't say enough about Devin Fulk, who was great in every facet, but especially from the arc, where his 3 or 4 made three-balls were simply huge.  It was a great game all the way around, and a great victory for the Scots.

Man, it's going to be hard to go back to Denison after this one!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 28, 2006, 09:49:57 PM
3 Team Stats that explain why Wooster beat Georgetown tonight:

Wooster outshot Georgetown 49% to 40% on field goals

Wooster outrebounded the taller Georgetown squad 43 to 30

Wooster made 21 of 23 Free Throws (91%) vs Georgetown 17 of 25 (68%)

These three stats show why Wooster won this game despite having too many turnovers (19 vs. only 11 for Georgetown).

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2006, 10:06:45 PM
The fact that my karma dropped instantly after I posted my game thoughts makes me think I may have been less than clear.  What I meant to impart was that the defense by both teams was better than it looks in the stats, and probably better than it sounded on the radio.  It was not intended as a criticism of anyone (except, perhaps, the radio broadcaster, if he gave the impression that it was not a well-played game), but was instead just my way of expressing how good I thought the defense was.  Feel free to disagree.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 28, 2006, 10:16:09 PM
David,

I was only able to catch about the last 10 minutes of the game on the radio tonight, but I gathered the impression that it was a well-played, hard-fought game that was one of those games won by the team that outplayed the other one on the court (as opposed to a sloppy game/not well played game that was won by the team that was less mediocre).  Coach Moore's postgame on the radio supported this as well because he felt that the turnovers were a result of the strong defensive pressure of Georgetown.

I wish I could have been there in the gym!  Oh, to be on campus again....although, I don't have to pay the 35,000 dollar admission fee just to go to some basketball games this year.  :)

Oh, and I'm glad to be back on the boards after just being an occasional reader during the summer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 28, 2006, 10:35:05 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 28, 2006, 10:06:45 PMThe fact that my karma dropped instantly after I posted my game thoughts makes me think I may have been less than clear.

That's mighty diplomatic of you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 28, 2006, 11:19:04 PM
I completely agree with DC - the high number of turnovers were not from sloppy play but rather the aggressive defense of the Tigers.  I commented on Saturday that the 19-0 run was as good a defense as I had seen from Wooster, but the 13-0 run at the end of the first half was just as impressive, showing good poise and grit.

What struck me from this game is that as highly rated as Georgetown is they did not appear very deep and really only had three players who could score. Or maybe Wooster defense has become that good.

Game ball to Van Horn and Bidwell for their defense on Silverhorn (that kid is the real deal - he could play) and Fulk for his instant offense. I said during the scrimmage season that I thought he was the most improved Scot and I haven't changed my mind.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on November 28, 2006, 11:34:03 PM
For the past two games, Wooster has been using an eight-men rooster.  The only other times they used more than that was the blowout win vs Cabrini and in the Mount Union game when Craig Elam saw only five minutes of action.  To those close to the action, what is the reason for the inactivity on the Wooster bench?  The Wooster Daily Record during the weeks leading to the season ran a number of stories, even going as far as quoting Coach Moore, claiming that some of the new guys were ready to contribute.  What then is going on?  Did Coach Moore recruit some decent ballers just to beef up the practice squad?  Maybe the previous point is a stretch but I am wondering.  This bench situation makes me wonder what will become if one of the key players gets a knock, God forbid that happens?

Either way, they are playing well and I couldn't be more happier.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 29, 2006, 12:38:52 AM
Quote from: WooMix on November 28, 2006, 11:34:03 PM
For the past two games, Wooster has been using an eight-men rooster.  The only other times they used more than that was the blowout win vs Cabrini and in the Mount Union game when Craig Elam saw only five minutes of action.  To those close to the action, what is the reason for the inactivity on the Wooster bench?

The radio broadcast mentioned something about Elam nursing a knee injury, I think.  I didn't catch too many details, but it sounded like they were being extra careful and didn't feel a need to rush him back to full action.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 29, 2006, 12:47:44 AM
My impressions of this game was that it was a game of runs for about 3/4ths of the game.  Wooster made a small run early in the game, and then Georgetown came back with one of their own.  And then Wooster made what was IMO the decisive run putting together a pretty impressive 15-2 run to end the half on much like their 19-0 run against Walsh on Saturday. Once again, the decisive run was highlighted by timely shooting and some stifling defense.  G'town came out of the break with a 9-0 run, but Wooster responded on something like a 10-2 run of their own and from there on, the game was never much in doubt. 

There isn't much this team could improve on from last year, but I  think where I have seen the most improvement over last season is on the defensive end of the floor.  They held a much bigger Georgetown team to just 40% from the field?!  That shouldn't happen when the Tigers could have and should have been having their way inside with their size advantage.  And not only that, but Wooster outrebounded G'town by a pretty significant margin.  One other area that seems to be much improved over last year is ft shooting.  Wooster goes 21-23 from the line, and you could argue that this game was basically won at the line as G'town went on a stretch of missing something like 6 consecutive ft's in the 2nd half.  For the season Wooster is shooting a very impressive 85%.  At this time last season I think the Scots were barely cracking 60% if I remember correctly.

Moving on, just when I thought I couldn't be more impressed with this team, and more specifically Timmy V, he goes and puts up a double double in what was his second outstanding performance against a team that was loaded with size!  After my questioning as to why Tom Port was left off of the D3hoops preseason AA team, I'm beginning to think my argument should have been made in favor of the Dark Lord!  He should be going into that Wittenberg game a week from Saturday with a TON of confidence after the performances that he has put up against Walsh's and G'town's bigs!  And I will echo the sentiments of praise being thrown to Devin Fulk.  This guy would be the star player of many an NCAC team and he's not even starting for Wooster!  Yet, he's embraced his role and, as he has been described, has become instant offense this year for the Scots!  Maybe that should be his nickname??? ;D

One last bit of amusement to be passed on from the game.  After the game was pretty much over, the Wooster student section began the chant, "We want Louisville, We want Louisville..."  I thought that was pretty good! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on November 29, 2006, 09:36:29 AM
DC - As usual you hit it right on the head.  I was listening to the game and tracking the live stats as I was working on a term paper.  You get out of school and I go in!!

Anyway, I saw the large number of WOO turnovers, the droughts of scoring by both teams and lack of fouls committed in the first half by the SCOTS and thought that 'aggressiveness' might have been an issue.

Thanks for the observations from Timken because I am glad to see that it was a hard fought game by two quality opponents.  These are the kinds of games that Wooster would drop in the past.  An intense game against an unfamiliar quality opponent early in the season (I point back to Kalamazoo, SCAD, Edinboro, and Texas Lutheran).   

It seems that defensive intensity and rebounding have become the focus this year and what is most pleasant is that when Cooper is not scoring 'Darth' Vandervaart is taking over inside as defenses concentrate on the perimeter.  The NCAC should be very very afraid. 

Now the next issue is that the SCOTS are definitely the number 1 team in country.  Do we want that ranking?  And can we keep it?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 29, 2006, 10:16:12 AM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on November 29, 2006, 09:36:29 AM
It seems that defensive intensity and rebounding have become the focus this year and what is most pleasant is that when Cooper is not scoring 'Darth' Vandervaart is taking over inside as defenses concentrate on the perimeter.  The NCAC should be very very afraid. 
I think you are spot on!  But it's not just Cooper drawing out the defense away from Vandervaart.  Tom Port is also a big mismatch problem for teams.  Last night, he was drawing 6'9" Donovan Brown, usually leaving Vandervaart with someone not quite as tall  guarding him.  I think it's a matter of teams picking their poison I guess.  Do they pack it inside to try to deny Vandervaart, leaving our sharpshooters open to inflict their damage, or do the defend the perimeter trying to deny Cooper and Port leaving Vandervaart down low one on one to wield his spinning moves in the post?  I think a lot of NCAC coaches will be losing some sleep trying to come up with a plan to stop Wooster's potent attack!

Quote from: WoosterFAN on November 29, 2006, 09:36:29 AM
Now the next issue is that the SCOTS are definitely the number 1 team in country.  Do we want that ranking?  And can we keep it?
Technically, Wooster has already been #1 according to Street & Smith. ;)  I know you're talking about the poll that counts though.  I just can't believe how uncanny it is that every time Wooster seems to ascend to the #1 spot in the D3hoops top 25 (assuming that the untinkable doesn't happen and the EC finds a way to pull off a great upset), who is there looming on the schedule?  None other than Witt who seems to have  made it their job to knock off the Scots from their lofty perch.  How many times has this happened now?  I'm guessing that this is at least the 3rd or 4th time the Scots will have garnered the #1 postition on a week that they play Witt.  At least last season, Wooster returned the favor by beating Witt when they were #1 and Wooster was #2.  Why couldn't VA Wes wait until next week to lose their 1st game???  Oh well, I have a feeling that history won't be repeating itself a week from Saturday down in Springfield!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 29, 2006, 10:36:56 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 27, 2006, 04:13:07 PM
hope everyone on here has a good season and we have some more diverse talking points instead of wooster/wabash chatter all season. thanks.
Hey now, it's not our faults that there aren't more Witt supporters like yourself adding to the conversation.  At least TigerFan_1973 joined us to bring in some more Witt perspective.  We've also got the Earlham regulars in here as well.  What happened to 'bishopsfan'?  I would have thought we'd have been hearing some of the happenings down in Delaware given their good start and all.  And I miss hearing from 'DenisonFan' and his critiques of how Coach Ghiloni wasn't properly utilizing his rotation by playing too many youngsters.

I too wish we had some more fans of other teams offering their perspectives, but I'm also glad we have this site even if it is Wooster dominated in Basketball and Wabash dominated in Football.




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 29, 2006, 10:47:58 AM
I'm getting old, so it took me a while to figure it out.  Just what am I seeing on the court when I watch the Wooster Fighting Scots?  Not just the talent or the skills, but the hustle, toughness, intelligence, and unselfishness?  Last night it came to me.  The Wooster Fighting Scots are the New York Knicks of the early 70s.  On wheels.

Brandon Johnson is, of course, Walt Frazier.  Probably not off the court, nobody could match the Knick's point guard in cool or the threads department.  But between the lines the similarity is definitely there.  Running the offense, getting to the basket, the pull-up jumper, and the ability to pick one's pocket, sight unseen.  Yep, Brandon is Clyde all right.

James Cooper?  None other than The Pearl himself, the great Earl Monroe.  Before Michael, before the Doctor, Earl was one of the great innovators in the game.  While he didn't invent the spin move (Jimmy Walker, Providence) he quickly made it part of his game.  The stutter step, the hesitation, all were in Earl's reportoire.  And he could shoot the lights out, period.

Tom Port is cornerman Dave DeBusschere.  Long-range outside shooter who hit the boards hard.  A tough guy underneath, who was also a major league pitcher.  Port may not be that, but at least he's occasionally seen watching Pettorini's boys. :)

Devin Fulk?  None other than Rhodes Scholar Bill Bradley.  One of the best pure shooters ever, Bradley practically invented moving without the ball.  His all-around game became superb, as Devin's is becoming.  Kid, maybe you have a career as a U.S. senator in front you. :)

The Van Horn-Bidwell combination?  Gotta be the pre-Zen wildman Phil Jackson.  All elbows and knees when with the New Yorkers, Jackson played the game in a near frenzy, coming off the bench to spell DeBusschere or Bradley by wreaking havoc all over the court.  He'd pick up fouls and bruises in abundance as do Andy and Tim, but his man always knew he was in a ballgame.  Are these two guys future NBA coaches? ;)

All right, this one is a reach, but I'm sticking with it.  Tim Vandervaart and Evan Will are, cumulatively, the great center Willis Reed.  Willis was, of course, one of the best of his era, but often, just as the two Scots posts do, had to deal with bigger players in Wilt and Russell.  He did, playing them nose to nose, and often besting them.

In what may have been the worst pregame prediction ever, I chose Georgetown to take Wooster behind the woodshed, 97-65 (or something like that).  This erroneous effort was made after watching the non-Hoyas warm up for nearly an hour.  They looked big, strong, and skilled.  How could I not pick them?  Well, at the time, I didn't realize that the Scots are those old Knicks, reincarnated, and revved up to 78 RPM. Honestly, if Wooster had had a better day shooting the ball from out, they could have won by 15.  Or more.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2006, 10:55:06 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 29, 2006, 12:47:44 AM[...] you could argue that this game was basically won at the line as G'town went on a stretch of missing something like 6 consecutive ft's in the 2nd half. 

Yes, I agree that this was a key part of the game.  When G'town went cold from the free throw line, it enabled the Scots to get out to the two-to-three possession lead that they held the rest of the way.  Had G'town made those tosses, it could have been a very different game.

The post-game handshake line was stalled a couple of times when Georgetown coach 'Happy' Osborne had lengthy comments for Andy Van Horn and for another Scot (my memory fails me...maybe Fulk?  Help!).  I wonder if anyone knows what was said?  Osborne had very positive things to say to Aaron Dorkson of the Daily Record, including that James Cooper is as good as any of the guards at Dayton, and that he thinks Wooster can "win it all in their division."  Link to the article. (http://www.the-daily-record.com/article.php?pathToFile=/articles/sports/&file=_sports1.txt&article=1&tD=)

Quote from: ScotsFan on November 29, 2006, 10:36:56 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 27, 2006, 04:13:07 PM
hope everyone on here has a good season and we have some more diverse talking points instead of wooster/wabash chatter all season. thanks.
Hey now, it's not our faults that there aren't more Witt supporters like yourself adding to the conversation.  At least TigerFan_1973 joined us to bring in some more Witt perspective.  We've also got the Earlham regulars in here as well.  What happened to 'bishopsfan'?  I would have thought we'd have been hearing some of the happenings down in Delaware given their good start and all.  And I miss hearing from 'DenisonFan' and his critiques of how Coach Ghiloni wasn't properly utilizing his rotation by playing too many youngsters.

I too wish we had some more fans of other teams offering their perspectives, but I'm also glad we have this site even if it is Wooster dominated in Basketball and Wabash dominated in Football.

This is one reason why I've spent so much time in Granville lately, and plan to go to Gambier a few times later in the season.  We don't hear much from Kenyon and Denison partisans, and both are easy drives for me.  Last night's game was played in front of 2105 raucous fans, which was fun, but I also enjoy the quieter ambiance of games between less-talented players who still work hard and only draw a couple hundred fans at best.  I think they deserve support and recognition as much as the Wooster players; to me, that's what D3 is all about.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 29, 2006, 11:09:22 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 29, 2006, 10:55:06 AMThe post-game handshake line was stalled a couple of times when Georgetown coach 'Happy' Osborne had lengthy comments for Andy Van Horn and for another Scot (my memory fails me...maybe Fulk? Help!). I wonder if anyone knows what was said?

David -

I was told one of the remarks that was said to Van Horn, and at least one of the other players, but feel that it's probably not correct to post it on here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2006, 12:42:07 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on November 28, 2006, 03:46:49 PM
I'll be there no matter what because I will be working the 2 JV games and the women's varsity game beforehand, so I'll just stick around for the men's game. 

jscwittfan,
TWO JV games?  Is there a women's JV game scheduled?  According to both Wooster's and Wittenberg's sites, the women's varsity game is scheduled for 2pm, and I have a schedule that says the mens' JV game is at 5:30 (and of course the men's varsity is at 7:30).  Does that mean the womens' JV game is at noon, or has the schedule changed? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 29, 2006, 12:58:49 PM
i do agree-we need some bishopsfan and DenisonFan perspective on here-we had some interesting posts last year.

One other point of revenge---you think Wooster's JV players are looking forward to exacting revenge on witt after that half court shot that won it for us last year? 

i still think 2nd week in december is too early for a witt-wooster game.......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2006, 01:37:15 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 29, 2006, 12:58:49 PM
i still think 2nd week in december is too early for a witt-wooster game.......

Last year the first matchup was Dec. 10 at Wooster; it was a pretty good game. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/recaps/2005-06/wittenberg.php).  Maybe this is a two-year cycle, and next year we return to a Jan/Feb rotation?

Wittenberg has posted their ticket policy for the game HERE (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/news/2006releases/11_28.html).  It is just as jscwittfan posted earlier: all seats reserved, even for students.  Additionally, Wooster says HERE (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/default.php) that they will have a presale of their ticket allotment from 1 to 3 this Saturday (during the women's game vs. Earlham) and, if any are left, after the men's game vs Earlham (tipoff at 3pm).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 29, 2006, 02:58:33 PM
I guess I'm old school, but I'd rather play all of the non-conference stuff before the conference games. But realistically, I don't think that's possible unless you want to have a long layoff at some point, then cram everything in there....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on November 29, 2006, 04:59:27 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 29, 2006, 12:42:07 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on November 28, 2006, 03:46:49 PM
I'll be there no matter what because I will be working the 2 JV games and the women's varsity game beforehand, so I'll just stick around for the men's game. 

jscwittfan,
TWO JV games?  Is there a women's JV game scheduled?  According to both Wooster's and Wittenberg's sites, the women's varsity game is scheduled for 2pm, and I have a schedule that says the mens' JV game is at 5:30 (and of course the men's varsity is at 7:30).  Does that mean the womens' JV game is at noon, or has the schedule changed? 

My bad.  Usually the Witt women have their JV/Alumni game before the Wooster game, but that is not the case this year since Wooster is in Springfield earlier in the season than usual.  I'm just so used to it being so that I assumed it was again this year as well.  But, that's what I get for assuming.  Sorry for the incorrect info, everybody.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: LUMAN80 on November 29, 2006, 05:27:20 PM
go woooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 29, 2006, 06:14:27 PM
Just curious, are tickets usually $8 at Witt??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on November 29, 2006, 06:55:53 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on November 29, 2006, 06:14:27 PM
Just curious, are tickets usually $8 at Witt??

Yes, although I think that is higher than what it was in past years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2006, 07:49:47 PM
I just saw this over at CCIW Chat:

Quote from: Titan Q on November 29, 2006, 05:38:07 PM
Zach Freeman is really a ton.  After 28 points and 10 rebounds last night, Zach is now averaging 19.7 & 11.7.  He is 46-68 (.676) from the field.  When he gets the ball down low, one-on-one, it’s a basket.  When he catches it 15 feet from the hoop, he can knock down the jumpshot or take it hard to the basket and score.  He will be one of the most dominant players in Division III this year and the reason Illinois Wesleyan will be able to compete with good teams.

Like any good Heisman campaign, it's good to make sure the voters notice your guy.  Q does an excellent job of keeping Zach Freeman on everyone's lips.  I thought it might be a good idea to start to get Tim Vandervaart's name out there as well, since if he keeps performing at the rate he's going now, he should get some All-America attention at center.  To that end, I've brought up the stats of the centers from the preseason All-America first, second, and third teams (the fourth team center, Jeff Stewart, plays for Muhlenberg, and I couldn't find a stats link for the Mules; and there was no honorable mention A-A center) in order to compare them to Tim.  I've also added Dane Borchers in this comparison (although he's listed as a post, he was in fact a preseason All-America [4th team] at forward), just for local interest.

Player-school...ht/wt...games played...minutes/game...PPG...FG%...Reb/gm (off, def)
Isaac Rosefelt, UST ... 6'9"/215 ... 2 ... 31.0 ... 19.5 ... .680 ... 11.5 ( 3.0, 8.5 )
Jason Boone, NYU ... 6'6"/257 ... 4 ... 26.0 ... 10.0 ... .579 ... 9.3 ( 2.5, 6.8 )
Zach Freeman, IWU ... 6'7"/210 ... 6 ... 34.8 ... 19.7 ... .676 ... 11.7 ( 4.5, 7.2 )
Tim Vandervaart, COW ... 6'6"/210 ... 4 ... 28.8 ... 22.8 ... .706 ... 8.5 ( 4.8, 3.8 )
Dane Borchers, WU ... 6'8"/215 ... 4 ... 30.8 ... 13.0 ... .500 ... 10.5 ( 2.5, 8.0 )

(Sorry, but I have not mastered the table feature just yet.) 

Clearly, Vandervaart is not out of place in this august assemblage, and despite being the smallest of the five, he leads the group in scoring, FG%, and offensive rebounds/game.  I don't know about the other centers, but Tim has had to face bigger, stronger centers in his last two games, and has racked up 54 points on 20/28 (.714) shooting, as well as 21 rebounds in those games. 

Tim's position on the roster is F/C, so I don't know if he'll be considered a forward or center for A-A purposes; but since he plays the center position, at least on the offensive end, I thought this comparison was apt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 29, 2006, 08:17:48 PM
I have little to contribute as Earlham travels to Wooster on Saturday, but I do have one anecdote/bit of trivia that's been bouncing around my head the last few days as I've looked at D3hoops.com.

Averett beat those pesky Marlins from Virginia Wesleyan the other day, drawing front page honors. Averett was the last team that Earlham scored 100 points against, tallying 101 in a win in the consolation game of a tournament at Roanoke. On that day, Averett held a full practice in the gym a mere 90 minutes or so before tipoff.....I couldn't believe they stayed within 20 of Earlham that day considering how hard they were working.

Anyway, I just wanted to share a pleasant thought of Earlham actually scoring some points and blowing someone out.....because I'm not sure how often it will happen this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on November 29, 2006, 08:53:28 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 29, 2006, 10:36:56 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 27, 2006, 04:13:07 PM
hope everyone on here has a good season and we have some more diverse talking points instead of wooster/wabash chatter all season. thanks.
Hey now, it's not our faults that there aren't more Witt supporters like yourself adding to the conversation.  At least TigerFan_1973 joined us to bring in some more Witt perspective. 

I believe I heard my name mentioned. :D

I didn't discover these boards until tournament time last year but I am glad to be here earlier this year.

There's not a lot of people to talk to about D3 sports in the general population.  It is good to have you guys to talk with.

Last year was a great run in the tournament for the Tigers.  Good luck to all this season.

TigerFan_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 30, 2006, 10:00:08 AM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on November 29, 2006, 08:53:28 PM
I didn't discover these boards until tournament time last year but I am glad to be here earlier this year.

There's not a lot of people to talk to about D3 sports in the general population.  It is good to have you guys to talk with.

Last year was a great run in the tournament for the Tigers.  Good luck to all this season.

TigerFan_1973
TF, that's why I like this site so much as well.  Most people don't follow DIII as closely as the regulars in here do.  Most people in and around the Wooster area wouldn't even know that the Scots are about to become the #1 team in the country if they didn't read the newspaper, and even then, they don't really follow the Scots other than wanting to know when the Witt game is and when the playoffs start.  That's one of the things that bugs me about this community is why they can't support this basketball program better?  I mean, it's like everyone in the community takes them for granted until Witt comes to town or until the playoffs start and then everyone comes out.  What I just find confusing is that you can't get a better entertainment value than dropping the $5 to go and watch a Wooster Basketball game.  I know that I shouldn't complain because the support that the Scots do get is better than over 95% of the other DIII programs in the country, but I just wish that these kids could be playing to crowds like they had the other night each and every game instead of just the ones that get the most hype.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 30, 2006, 10:28:52 AM
DC, nice job putting the comparison #'s out there.  I read TitanQ's post about Zach Freeman and I thougt to myself, he is really putting up some good #'s.  Of course I didn't even bother to look how those #'s compered to Timmy V's or any other preseason AA big men.  By looking at your breakdown, I think you can't be anything but impressed with the numbers that Vandervaart has put up early in the season.  I just can't get over how well he's done, especially in the last 2 games, against much taller competition.  If Vandervaart keeps putting up these kinds of #'s, I think it will be hard to leave him off of the AA list and I think he is making an early statement for NCAC POY consideration.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 30, 2006, 11:03:20 AM
I know this might sound silly on the face of it, and I'll reserve a serious opinion until I see the other NCAC teams in action.  But it just might be that Wooster has four of the best five players in the NCAC: Vandervaart, Port, Cooper, and Johnson.  Dane Borchers would, of course, be the other. 

I'm not argueing for this statement, or even putting it out there as my opinion, but an awful lot of the stars in this league graduated last season.  Daniel Russ and Brandon Miller from last year's first team.  Only Ben Chojnacki returns from that squad.  Would he bust into a team of  Borchers, Vandervaart, Port, Cooper, and Johnson?  Maybe, but I'm not sure. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 30, 2006, 11:18:47 AM
Congrats to Oberlin, as they beat Case last night!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 30, 2006, 12:13:22 PM
And a nice win by Ohio Wesleyan at Capital last night!  The Bishops were led by Chojnacki with 19 points and 13 boards in their 81-71 win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 30, 2006, 01:31:22 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 29, 2006, 07:49:47 PM

Clearly, Vandervaart is not out of place in this august assemblage, and despite being the smallest of the five, he leads the group in scoring, FG%, and offensive rebounds/game.  I don't know about the other centers, but Tim has had to face bigger, stronger centers in his last two games, and has racked up 54 points on 20/28 (.714) shooting, as well as 21 rebounds in those games. 

Yes, but can Vandervaart dunk with a large picture of a Tiger right in this peripheral...I think not.


http://www.iwuhoops.com/zfdunk.jpg
(IWU vs Ohio Wesleyan)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 30, 2006, 01:59:47 PM
How about a photographer looking down at him?

http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/photos/2005-06/season/pages/vandervaart_kenyon.html

I think so....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 30, 2006, 02:32:12 PM
You got me there.

What about a dunk vs Hanover though?

http://www.iwuhoops.com/zf.jpg

(Last one to run out of dunk pictures loses, by the way.  And remember, A Dunk Only Counts Two Points.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 30, 2006, 02:51:51 PM
Couple of questions that a few of the latest posts bring to mind:

1. Is there a way on this forum to have pictures show up within the posts?  Preferably as an uploaded file, but a link would be ok if it allowed the picture to appear directly within the message.

2. DC recently mentioned that he's not yet mastered the table function, and I've had trouble with it also despite lots of attempts and some skill at using tables in other venues (websites, MS Word, etc.).  I'd like to be able to post lists of stats, or boxscores, and to keep their integrity, their spacing.  I've tried tables, the code function, using fixed space fonts (Courier), and nothing works without me manually adjusting the spacing, which takes lots of time.  Anybody an expert on this kind of stuff have an answer?

Thanks,
WB
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2006, 03:10:16 PM
Pictures are easy; you just put the url of a web-based picture between IMG tags (that is, {img} and {/img}, using square brackets.)  I'll demonstrate with a randomly-selected picture from an obscure web page:

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.hope.edu%2Fimg%2Ffieldhouse%2F05ddevosconstruct145.jpg&hash=d1a934c96f39212bbf00b06760cef80c404fa8f5)

I don't know how to put an uploaded picture into the body of a post.

As for table formatting, Old School is good at it; look at his post # 132 on the National Pick 'Em League (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4534.120) board.  You can use the 'quote' feature to see the coding behing the table; I'm just too lazy to copy it for something as quickly prepared as my center comparison.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 30, 2006, 03:23:57 PM
Thanks for the help!

So, in your image, that's Vandervaart in Scots Mustard-Gold posting up Borchers in his standard Wittenberg Ketchup-Red jersey?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 30, 2006, 04:00:36 PM
TQ - you win, there are no more pictures of dunks on the Wooster web site (although there used to be one of Issac Ward punctuating Woosters NCAC tournament victory in 2004).

If non-pictures count, I'm sure most Scot Boosters remember Vandervaart's dunk against Witt last year. It was significant not just for the two points but also for its timing late in the game and the momentum shift it created.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 30, 2006, 04:26:02 PM
I was just taking a look at Wooster's next NAIA opponent, Cedarville, whom the Scots will host at Timken on December 16th.  NAIA DII, preseason 28th nationally, but sure to move up due to their 7-0 record.  Their roster includes four foreign players: a 6-8 Brazilian in Maicol Ventor and three Jamaicans, Chris Walker and Ricardo Alliman, both 6-6, and the 6-10 Daniel Rose.  Sheesh.

As a team they're outscoring their opponents by 14.6 PPG and outrebounding them by 10.3 caroms.  However, they've actually commited more turnovers than their foes, by a 2.7 margin.

They will be at Wittenberg on December 5th and then host Walsh on December 9th, so it will be a little easier to get a read on how good they actually are.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 01, 2006, 09:43:46 AM
Isaac Ward dunking:

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fathletics.wooster.edu%2Fmb%2Fphotos%2F2003-04%2Fimages%2Fwarddunkwitt.jpg&hash=421dab70091b6deb093172470a3c0731be660899)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 01, 2006, 02:38:37 PM
^^^^^^^^

That Isaac Ward dunk was against Wittenberg too if I recall!!!

Just an FYI, in case anybody didn't notice, I have volunteered my services to run the NCAC Pick 'em game over on the ' NCAC Pick 'Em ' (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4044.195)board.  I am just doing NCAC games along with, what I would consider regional and national games of the week, so to speak.  This weekends slate of conference games are going to start us off, but I did include tonight's games involving the CCIW/MIAA Challenge.  I just hope I can do justice to the job Wally has been doing the past few years!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 01, 2006, 03:39:53 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 30, 2006, 03:23:57 PM
So, in your image, that's Vandervaart in Scots Mustard-Gold posting up Borchers in his standard Wittenberg Ketchup-Red jersey?

That's funny right there . . .
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 01, 2006, 10:49:23 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 01, 2006, 02:38:37 PM
^^^^^^^^

That Isaac Ward dunk was against Wittenberg too if I recall!!!

To score points 99 & 100 in the NCAC championship game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 01, 2006, 11:29:02 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on December 01, 2006, 10:49:23 PM
To score points 99 & 100 in the NCAC championship game!
Yeah, that was a sweet ending to an even sweeter victory!!! ;D


FWIW, the CCIW swept both games from the MIAA tonight.  Calvin got beat by Wheaton in a mild upset comparitively speaking, 73-62.  I think the overrated discussions will start up if Calvin can't right the ship tomorrow vs. Carthage.  And all they did is pull off somewhat of a shocker, downing Hope 72-65.   Can the MIAA save face tomorrow night or will they be pulling out their brooms for more than sweeping away the snow in Kenosha?! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 01, 2006, 11:58:30 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 30, 2006, 03:10:16 PM


(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.hope.edu%2Fimg%2Ffieldhouse%2F05ddevosconstruct145.jpg&hash=d1a934c96f39212bbf00b06760cef80c404fa8f5)



Everytime I go to put a little mustard on my hotdog at DeVos I laugh when I think how many times those two little bottles have been displayed on the web.

People probably think I'm nuts while I'm standing there laughing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 02, 2006, 09:48:05 AM
Wooster's JV team is playing Harmony Prep from Cincinnati after the varsity game. I guess Harmony has five Div. I commits on the team, including one to Florida.

http://www.harmonycommunityschool.org/sports/bbasketball/bbasketball.asp

If Georgetown (Ky.) was supposed to be the most talented to ever play at Timken, this team might be more talented -- and they aren't even playing the varsity team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 02, 2006, 11:51:06 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 30, 2006, 03:10:16 PM(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.hope.edu%2Fimg%2Ffieldhouse%2F05ddevosconstruct145.jpg&hash=d1a934c96f39212bbf00b06760cef80c404fa8f5)

On second thought, I think that's a 2005 photo, Andy Van Horn having just bottled up Kenny Brady on the baseline.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 02, 2006, 02:38:21 PM
We've got a barnburner in Oberlin...

Oberlin is up 48-44 on Wabash, 2:00 left in the game.  Wabash has Simkus going to the line with a chance to trim the lead further.  Oberlin led by 10 at halftime.  Wabash has been back within 4 twice now in the second half. 

This is a little unsettling, but Oberlin has a habit of playing Wabash tough, especially at home.  With this year's young group, we shouldn't have expected any different.   Simkus makes one out of two...Bash trails by 3. 

Wabash goes on a fast break after an Oberlin missed shot, Holtem's layup rolls off the rim but he will go to the line.  Holtem gets one out of two (free throws have been a bugaboo in the second half).  Wabash down 2. 

Oberlin converts a pair of free throws to go up 4. 

Wabash responds with a Chase Holtem jumper.  50-48, Oberlin leads. 

LGs foul Spencer coming up the floor with 36 seconds left.  Spencer's front end misses, Wabash rebounds and gets a timeout.  Wabash can essentially run this thing out and get the last shot with a chance tie or win. 

Holtem nails a jumper and ties the game at 50-50 with 20 seconds left.  Oberlin calls a timeout, presumably setting up the final shot of the game.  Regardless of whether or not Oberlin makes the last shot, the LGs have done well to get back into this game and have a chance to win.  Wabash was dead in the water for the first 30 minutes of this thing.   

Spencer dribbles around and dribbles around and makes the jumper with 4 seconds left to give the Yeoman a 52-50 lead.  Wabash gets a timeout and will need to go the length of the floor in four seconds to get a chance to tie.

Here's the ballgame...Oberlin knocks the ball out of bounds with 1 second left.  Wabash ball with 1 second left.  Timeout Wabash.  I'm not entirely certain where on the floor the ball is. 

Let's try it again....now here's the ballgame...the ball is in the backcourt so this isn't good.  Simkus inbounds to Zimmer near the hoop, Zimmer can't get a handle on the ball and the game is over.  Yeomen win 52-50. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 02, 2006, 03:14:14 PM
 ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 02, 2006, 03:47:32 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 34  Earlham 28

Earlham actually led early in this game by a 16-10 score before Wooster went on a 16-0 run to take the lead.

Wooster is being led by Tom Port with 9 points, James Cooper with 6 points and Tim Vandervaart with 6 points.  Markous Jewett is leading Earlham with 10 points and Nick Welsh has 6 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 02, 2006, 04:38:34 PM
Final:  Wooster 84  Earlham 62

Wooster pulled away in the 2nd Half to secure the win in this game.  :)

Scots were led today by Tom Port with 19 points, Brandon Johnson with 17, Tim Vandervaart with 14 and James Cooper with 11.  Markous Jewett led Earlham with 14 points.

Wooster shot 58% from the floor which was the deciding factor in this game.

Wooster is now 5-0.  :)  Scots play next at Oberlin on 12/6.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 02, 2006, 04:45:23 PM
The Tigers take to the Wittenberg Radio Network air at 5:30 against Denison.

Here's the link.
http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/sportsnetwork/index.html

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 02, 2006, 04:49:34 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on December 02, 2006, 04:45:23 PM
The Tigers take to the Wittenberg Radio Network air at 5:30 against Denison.

Here's the link.
http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/sportsnetwork/index.html


Note the addition to the "Tiger Sports Network" header:
     "Sports Video"  Clicking on the link leads to:   
     "Coming Soon. Please Check Back. "

The Tigers on video would be a great thing, wouldn't it?

TigerFan_1973




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 02, 2006, 05:55:21 PM
Tigers up one with 7:30 left in the first half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 02, 2006, 06:18:58 PM
The mustard and ketchup shots never fail to amuse me. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 02, 2006, 07:29:42 PM
Witt 72
Den  72

End of 1st OT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 02, 2006, 07:30:23 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on December 02, 2006, 06:18:58 PM
The mustard and ketchup shots never fail to amuse me. :)

It was getting pretty old on the MIAA board, but posters are (there and here) coming up with new gags - it's 'cool' again!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 02, 2006, 07:39:58 PM
Denison and Witt are playing a nail bitter at Denison.  2nd overtime and Witt is trailing by three 82-79 with 38 seconds to go.

33 seconds to go:  Witt trails by 4

21.3 seconds to go:  Witt ties the game at 83 all with a three pointer.  Denison has the last shot (for now) to win it.

THIRD OVERTIME!

Denison is wilting.  Witt is leading by 9 with about 2 minutes to go.  What a sad conclusion to such an engaging match!

FINAL SCORE: Witt 100 - Denison 85

Denison could only manage two points in the final overtime.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 02, 2006, 07:49:30 PM
Quote from: WooMix on December 02, 2006, 07:39:58 PM
Denison and Witt are playing a nail bitter at Denison.  2nd overtime and Witt is trailing by three 82-79 with 38 seconds to go.

33 seconds to go:  Witt trails by 4

21.3 seconds to go:  Witt ties the game at 83 all with a three pointer.  Denison has the last shot (for now) to win it.
[/quote
]

Tigers hit a 3!

Going to OT #3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 02, 2006, 07:58:27 PM
suddenly, the Tigers are up 9 in the 3rd OT.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 02, 2006, 07:58:59 PM
witt by 10



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 02, 2006, 07:59:40 PM
Quote from: WooMix on December 02, 2006, 07:39:58 PM
Denison and Witt are playing a nail bitter at Denison.  2nd overtime and Witt is trailing by three 82-79 with 38 seconds to go.

33 seconds to go:  Witt trails by 4

21.3 seconds to go:  Witt ties the game at 83 all with a three pointer.  Denison has the last shot (for now) to win it.

THIRD OVERTIME!

Denison is wilting.  Witt is leading by 9 with about 2 minutes to go.  What a sad conclusion to such an engaging match!


>:( ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 02, 2006, 08:00:47 PM
98-83

Borchers with a 3
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 02, 2006, 08:03:20 PM
final

100-85
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 02, 2006, 08:12:28 PM
Borchers with 33 pts. 16 rbs.

Gregg Hill with 19 pts.

Mark Caraway 16 pts.

Kevin Murray 13pts.
Finally Murray is found again by Brown. The Tigers' Waldo.

Billy Bowen with 11 rebounds and 5 pts.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 02, 2006, 08:19:44 PM
Sounds like both Witt and Woo came out flat today.  Wooster certainly did, and never had much spark in their win over Earlham.  A win is a win, though, as I'm sure both Bill Brown and Steve Moore would attest today.

All the scores:
Kenyon 61, Allegheny 59
OWU 90, Hiram 49
Wittenberg 100, Denison 85 (3 OT)
Oberlin 52, Wabash 50
Wooster 84, Earlham 62
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 02, 2006, 08:36:38 PM
witt/den boxscore:

http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mb/mb07/denm1202.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 02, 2006, 09:17:07 PM
Had a chance to check out the Wabash-Oberlin game prior to calling the Witt women's game - I don't know if it was just me, but either Oberlin's defense looked TOUGH, or the Wabash offense just didn't have it today.  Wabash had real struggles down low - I don't know how many missed layups they had underneath.  However, Oberlin did not look like a team picked to finish 9th/10th in the conference.  Don't let the final score fool you - Oberlin dominated the game, and it was only a late run by Wabash that provided for the thrilling ending.

As for Witt/Denison . . . WHEW.  I knew Denison would play us tough since it was a home game, but 3OTs??  Witt needing 3 last-minute shots to extend the game in regulation and OTs 1 and 2?  Sounds like one of those classic games I would have loved to watch.

Cedarville for Witt on Tuesday, and then we can really start the hype!  (Reminder to all Witt fans - the first presale is Monday night, so I would suggest making a trip to Springfield if you want a chance to snag tickets!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 02, 2006, 09:31:46 PM
Pretty good stat line from Denison's senior wing Dan Izzo:  24 points, 14 rebounds, 5 assists in 44 minutes.  He went to the free throw line 15 times, which suggests to me that he played aggressively, probably slashing to the hoop on offense and crashing the boards on defense.  He seems to be the spark that makes that team go, when they go.  Denison also got 16 points and 6 assists from reserve (today, at least) winger Brian Elder, who was 3 for 3 from the arc.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 02, 2006, 10:02:45 PM
Definitely a slow start to the Wooster-Earlham game, but that was due to Earlham working for a shot and taking the clock under 10 seconds on many of their early possessions.  Earlham shot well early and Wooster didn't (even though the shot were good open looks) creating a 6 point lead for Earlham, 16-10. Wooster then runs off a 22-2 streak.

It wasn't a sloppy game (Wooster had only 4 TO's at the half), but it felt like the Mt. Union game with the Scots almost looking disinterested.

The second half was much better, good defense and shooting. Port breaks out with 19 points, 5 RB and 4 assists. Brandon Johnson also had a much better game than the one Tuesday (17 points, 3 assists and 2 steals).

With Oberlins win today maybe the Scots will prepare more diligently for their Wednesday match.

Another interesting note is that traditional MIAA powerhouses Hope and Calvin each went 0-2 this weekend in their CCIW/MIAA challenge with Wheaton and Carthage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 02, 2006, 10:32:24 PM
I should have also added the Scots freethrow shooting 5 games into the season is dramatically improved. The Scots were in the high 65-70% range most of last season but are over 85% after tonights game:

Fulk                          6-  6           1.000
Johnson                   5-  5           1.000
Will                          4-  4            1.000
Cooper                     7-  8           .875
Port                          7-  8           .875
Vandervaart           21-26           .808
Vanhorn                   4-  5           .800
Bidwell                     3-  4           .750

It's early but this is a great trend. Maybe the only drawback from this is that most are averaging only 1-2 FT's/game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 02, 2006, 11:41:56 PM
wow you work 5-11:30 and you miss a lot of things i guess. what a game it sounds like and if nothing else can go to show that no game comes easy for witt so far, which could benefit them and keep them competitive.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on December 03, 2006, 01:18:14 AM
I was at the Witt/ Denison game tonight.  It was pretty disappointing to me that Witt 1) was down to Denison the entire game and 2) played flat for long stretches and would just flip a switch and play hard.  The offensive struggles concern me as well, but it seems when they really want, the guys can score at will.  Its as if Witt does just enough to hang on and win. 

Witt's defense looked ok today, as it did against Capital, but it didn't help that Denison was hitting everything they threw up.  They play so tough at home, but lay eggs on the road.  I also can't stand some of the borderline dirty things the Denison players do.  Borchers caught a blatant shove in the back while shooting a layup late in the game that could have taken him out.  This seems to be a trend, as my junior year, I was punched in the groin by a Denison player.  Coach Ghiloni said it was accidental. 

Two tough ones for the Tigers this week.  Cedarville and Wooster.  Get your perimeter defense ready boys. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 03, 2006, 06:48:28 AM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Farkski.com%2F%7Ejwood%2Fvanhornbrady.jpg&hash=314703ab2c5d1b836d93fdfc4eeb73d4e0aa7fdc)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 03, 2006, 11:19:46 AM
Quote from: petewitt54 on December 03, 2006, 01:18:14 AM
Witt's defense looked ok today, as it did against Capital, but it didn't help that Denison was hitting everything they threw up. 

Pete, according to the box score, Denison shot under 39% (27-70).  As an eyewitness, how do you reconcile this with your statement?  Is it a case of DU hitting their jumpers but missing layups and putbacks?  I trust your judgment, so I'm curious what led to that impression.

Something tells me that it's a different Denison when Witt occupies the other bench.  Kind of like how it's a different Oberlin when they face Wabash, I suppose.  The Denison I saw earlier this season didn't play dirty, at least not so you'd notice.  But the Denison I saw would never have taken Witt to 3 OTs.  Maybe Witt really lights their fire.  A couple of seasons ago Denison beat Witt by 10 just a week after they lost to Hiram.  (Witt won the rematch by 38.)  That was the season DU went 13-12/10-6, so it could be attributed to their being somewhat better that year (Witt was 25-4/14-2), but in other years DU has often played Witt tougher than one would expect.  Three years ago, after Witt won the first game in Springfield 74-29, the rematch was tied with 3:15 left, before Witt scored 12 of the last 13 points (4 by Pete) to win by 11.  The year before that, 7th-seeded DU lost to 2nd-seeded Witt by 6 in the tourney, 3 days after Witt beat them by 24. 

I think we can count on a serious beat-down in Springfield on Jan. 27.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on December 03, 2006, 02:45:34 PM
DC:  You nailed it.  Borchers and Hemenway did a fantastic job around the rim.  Altering shots, stopping drives and so forth.  Denison would try and take it to the basket and Dane and Jack would be waiting, causing some pretty wild layup attempts. 

15 feet and out was a different story.  I can remember on multiple occasions Denison post players hitting contested threes.  Izzo too hit some pretty tough jumpers.  And give Denison credit, they play hard.  If only they played like that against teams that aren't Witt and Wooster. 

And as far the dirty play thing, I'm hypersensitive, as I took an extra cheap shot from a Denison player and had Coach Ghiloni deny anything happened. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 03, 2006, 04:47:45 PM
Lincoln 201, Ohio State-Marion 78

The above line does not look right at all.  Sometimes when Wooster thoroughly beats their opponents, I have the same feeling as I had when I saw the score above.  Coach Edwards famously said, "You play to win the game!  Hello!"  but what happens when you have won the game already and you continue to play as if its your last?  Where do we draw the line between sportsmanship and sheer selfishness?

I believe what Lincoln did was wrong.  They crossed the line and progressed beyond acceptability.  I lump their action together with that New York girl who scored 113 points and that West Virginia kid who ran for over 600 yards versus overly matched opponents in both instances.  Why do coaches still allow this to happen?  For records?  Ummm!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 03, 2006, 05:41:51 PM
WooMix -

I was about to completely agree with you, but now I've just found the boxscore:

http://www.lincoln.edu/athletics/mbasketball/osu-lin.htm

Nobody on Lincoln, including Sami Wylie, the guy who scored 69 points and made 23-44 threes, played more than 24 minutes!  Wylie played exactly that number, as did Dwight Dean, who scored 33 points off the bench!  Nine players played at least ten minutes, an additional seven players got in the game, and those guys alone totaled 43 minutes, or over a full player-game! 

The coach did indeed clear the bench.  While maybe he could have done it a little sooner and given the bench guys a few more minutes, after looking at the boxscore I don't feel quite the same way as I did last night, after only reading the article.  Once the players are on the court, I don't believe they should be held back, they're out there to play.  Apparently even Lincoln's reserves were a complete mismatch against whatever OSU-Marion put on the floor.  At some point, the weaker team just needs to realize they need to get better or schedule someone more their own speed.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 03, 2006, 06:35:11 PM
WooBoo,

It's true he (eventually) cleared the bench, but full court press when leading by 100+??!!  Taking IMMEDIATE three's rather than working the shot clock a bit (one guy made a steal when they were up by over 100 and shot a 3 when there was NO defender between him and the basket)??!!

While it would be EVEN worse if he had left the starters in, it was a totally shameful bit of coaching.

To lessen the black-eye for d3 (home of STUDENT-athletes, where sportsmanship is still deemed an actual value, rather than a quaint relic), I wish the media reports had mentioned that this is Lincoln's final year in d3.  Perhaps they were preparing for the transition by practicing d2 'sportsmanship'?! ;D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 03, 2006, 08:33:23 PM
Quote from: petewitt54 on December 03, 2006, 01:18:14 AM
2) played flat for long stretches and would just flip a switch and play hard.  The offensive struggles concern me as well, but it seems when they really want, the guys can score at will.  Its as if Witt does just enough to hang on and win. 

The Tigers have to get over this.  You might recall the same thing happening in Witt's final game (The D3 title game) last year.  Except then it didn't quite work out so well.  They have to get the killer instinct.  Playing good enough to win just won't cut it against outstanding teams.  Being tied three times "at the end of the game" and then winning by 15 in the last five minutes is pretty unusual.

They have two outstanding teams this week with Cedarville and then Wooster.  Back-to-back hard games will be good for Witt. 

Go Tigers!

TigerFan
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 03, 2006, 11:24:54 PM
yes i would agree, luckily for us if that is their current syndrom a dose of talented cedarville and wooster teams should help them remain competitive throughout an entire game. also with the first "real" home games of the season the crowds will be behind the tigers helping them. i say real beacuse against transylvania that was on our break and a lot of the students weren't back yet or in the process of returning. i see a good week coming....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on December 04, 2006, 12:49:45 AM
Hey all,
I'm jscwittfan's broadcast partner, got to watch the Oberlin-Wabash game with him. It was an interesting one to say the least. An impressive defense from Oberlin and a stale offense from Bash, not something I expected. Wabash had no low post offense although good outside shooting. Oberlin, like jsc said, wasn't amazing but good enough to edge wabash out. It'll be interesting to see how the rest of the NCAC matchups for Oberlin and Wabash play out.
Witt/Wooster is getting a lot of attention on Witt's campus, might be even more heated than last year's game at the HPER, knowing that Wooster's team hasn't lost anyone and Witt's got a chip on their shoulder with the tough loss from the NCAA finals last year and Wooster's the easiest team to peg that chip on. Gettin' really excited and can't wait to see a good game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 04, 2006, 10:27:06 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 03, 2006, 06:35:11 PM
WooBoo,

It's true he (eventually) cleared the bench, but full court press when leading by 100+??!!  Taking IMMEDIATE three's rather than working the shot clock a bit (one guy made a steal when they were up by over 100 and shot a 3 when there was NO defender between him and the basket)??!!

While it would be EVEN worse if he had left the starters in, it was a totally shameful bit of coaching.

To lessen the black-eye for d3 (home of STUDENT-athletes, where sportsmanship is still deemed an actual value, rather than a quaint relic), I wish the media reports had mentioned that this is Lincoln's final year in d3.  Perhaps they were preparing for the transition by practicing d2 'sportsmanship'?! ;D ;)
I'm going to give my two cents on this matter.  I'm leaning more in agreement of Mr. Ypsi on this one.  While I don't agree that you should hold back the players that come off of the bench and not allow them to play, there is a difference between not allowing them to play and keeping up a full court press and launching 3's at will without even working the shot clock.  IMO, this is where Lincoln's coach crossed the line.  OSU-M had only 6 guys who even dressed for this game!  I just don't think it was neccessary to continue to put full court pressure when Lincoln was on defense and not work the shot clock a little more when Lincoln was on offense when they were up 100+ already!  What does this prove??  To me, it proves nothing and it opens up the door to questions about class and lack thereof.  Lincoln's coach opened himself up to all the criticism he's receiving when he chose to keep the press on and not slow the tempo by using up more of the shot clock.  I hope getting that 200 points was worth all the 'lack of class' talk that is going with it?! ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 04, 2006, 10:38:57 AM
Wabash is really, really young.  They are going to have bad games like they did on Saturday, especially on the road.  And, as DC mentioned, Oberlin always seems to bring it against Wabash.  Don't know why, they just do. 

Quote from: tigerup07 on December 04, 2006, 12:49:45 AM
Witt/Wooster is getting a lot of attention on Witt's campus, might be even more heated than last year's game at the HPER, knowing that Wooster's team hasn't lost anyone and Witt's got a chip on their shoulder with the tough loss from the NCAA finals last year and Wooster's the easiest team to peg that chip on. Gettin' really excited and can't wait to see a good game.

How does beating Wooster this week (which isn't happening, BTW) ease the pain of pulling a wicked gak job for the National freakin' Championship against Virginia Wesleyan last March?  You can beat the Scots by 30 (still not happening) and it doesn't take the Walnut and Bronze out of the Fighting TonTon's trophy case. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: uknowme2 on December 04, 2006, 10:47:42 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 04, 2006, 10:38:57 AM

How does beating Wooster this week (which isn't happening, BTW) ease the pain of pulling a wicked gak job for the National freakin' Championship against Virginia Wesleyan last March?  You can beat the Scots by 30 (still not happening) and it doesn't take the Walnut and Bronze out of the Fighting TonTon's trophy case. 

I thought maybe the Wabash faithful would hate Wooster in basketball.  I guess they just hate the Tigers. 

But I do agree, I don't think the Tigers beating Wooster takes the sting away from losing the National Title last year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 04, 2006, 11:01:17 AM
Yep, you guys are right, full-court press all game is way over the edge.  I didn't realize, either, that OSU-Marion had only 6 players. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 04, 2006, 11:25:39 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 04, 2006, 11:01:17 AM
Yep, you guys are right, full-court press all game is way over the edge.  I didn't realize, either, that OSU-Marion had only 6 players. 

I have to admit when I first heard during a break in the football action on TV Saturday that a D3 team had scored 201 points I assumed they were playing Grinnell and only won by 5.

What I've read above is just disgusting. Only 6 players, full court press, taking that many threes. It's just wrong.

Quote from: wally_wabash on December 04, 2006, 10:38:57 AMHow does beating Wooster this week (which isn't happening, BTW) ease the pain of pulling a wicked gak job for the National freakin' Championship against Virginia Wesleyan last March?

I don't know about you, Wally, but I'd give my left one to play in the NCAC championship game, let alone a national championship game. Yeah, they blew it. I'd love for us to have that opportunity. And it's not happening to us anytime soon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 04, 2006, 11:44:13 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 04, 2006, 10:38:57 AM
How does beating Wooster this week (which isn't happening, BTW) ease the pain of pulling a wicked gak job for the National freakin' Championship against Virginia Wesleyan last March? 

I don't think tigerup07 was saying that a win would "ease the pain," so to speak.  I think what he's getting at is that Wittenberg doesn't have the chance to get "revenge" on Virginia Wesleyan, so the next best thing is beating Wooster.  I know, it's not important to avenge last year's loss, since this is a new year, but that's just how some people get psyched up sometimes.  Since Wooster is not only a rival but (probably) the soon-to-be #1 team in the nation, this is Wittenberg's chance to prove that they will be a contender again this year without Russ/Brady/etc. - hence the comment about trying to keep the proverbial chip on Witt's shoulder.

It should be a great game, and I'm looking forward to it immensely (going up to get my tickets today) - however, Witt better not look past Cedarville tomorrow.  There should be 2 pretty great games in the HPER this week, and the last thing that Wittenberg's psyche needs is to lose both of them and get an early season momentum/confidence killer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 04, 2006, 12:11:30 PM
I'm all for a team running it's offense for most of a game so the scrubs can get with the program - but full court pressing a team with just six players is just wrong.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 05, 2006, 02:50:51 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on December 04, 2006, 11:25:39 AMI don't know about you, Wally, but I'd give my left one to play in the NCAC championship game, let alone a national championship game. Yeah, they blew it. I'd love for us to have that opportunity. And it's not happening to us anytime soon.

Hey, at least you still have the Walnut and Bronze that Big Pete brought home to Wally World 24 years ago. And how many schools out there in D3 Land would give their left one to own a big doorstop just like that one Big Pete got you? I can think of one school in particular that's located in northeastern Ohio that undoubtedly looks upon your Walnut and Bronze with covetous eyes.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndOne on December 05, 2006, 03:46:21 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 04, 2006, 10:27:06 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 03, 2006, 06:35:11 PM
WooBoo,

It's true he (eventually) cleared the bench, but full court press when leading by 100+??!!  Taking IMMEDIATE three's rather than working the shot clock a bit (one guy made a steal when they were up by over 100 and shot a 3 when there was NO defender between him and the basket)??!!

While it would be EVEN worse if he had left the starters in, it was a totally shameful bit of coaching.

To lessen the black-eye for d3 (home of STUDENT-athletes, where sportsmanship is still deemed an actual value, rather than a quaint relic), I wish the media reports had mentioned that this is Lincoln's final year in d3.  Perhaps they were preparing for the transition by practicing d2 'sportsmanship'?! ;D ;)
I'm going to give my two cents on this matter.  I'm leaning more in agreement of Mr. Ypsi on this one.  While I don't agree that you should hold back the players that come off of the bench and not allow them to play, there is a difference between not allowing them to play and keeping up a full court press and launching 3's at will without even working the shot clock.  IMO, this is where Lincoln's coach crossed the line.  OSU-M had only 6 guys who even dressed for this game!  I just don't think it was neccessary to continue to put full court pressure when Lincoln was on defense and not work the shot clock a little more when Lincoln was on offense when they were up 100+ already!  What does this prove??  To me, it proves nothing and it opens up the door to questions about class and lack thereof.  Lincoln's coach opened himself up to all the criticism he's receiving when he chose to keep the press on and not slow the tempo by using up more of the shot clock.  I hope getting that 200 points was worth all the 'lack of class' talk that is going with it?! ::)

Gentlemen----

Lets just call it as we see it-----> The Lincoln coach was a complete ass----!
Playing hard--yes. Kicking the other guy when he is down---complete ass----!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wilburt on December 05, 2006, 08:06:48 AM
Good Job Lincoln...

Don't Hate - Congratulate!  Check out this article.

http://www.blackathlete.net/artman/publish/article_02355.shtml
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 05, 2006, 08:44:10 AM
Latest poll up . . .

#1. Wooster (21 1st place votes, 620 total points)
#6. Wittenberg (506 total points)

So, once again, Wooster comes into Springfield as the number one team in all the land.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 10:42:45 AM
Dane Borchers' huge game at Denison has been recognized by the conference office, which named him Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) yesterday.  Congratulations to the fifth-year senior on yet another honor!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 05, 2006, 10:46:05 AM
guys as proof of the crowds that will be at wooster this saturday-i went to pick up my ticket at a little over 6 and ended up in row Q. how in the heck does that happen? i am a little disappointed in that fact.

anyways, wittenberg has a very intriguing game against cedarville tonight. cedarville is undefeated but wittenberg should be able to handle them. the thing to watch tonight is how wittenberg handles cedarville's perimeter game because this could be a tune up as to what we may see saturday. in the past everyone has been saying why would u schedule two rivals in the same week but the styles in which they both play may be due to this little facet. comments?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 05, 2006, 12:01:20 PM
penn,  I agree with you in that playing C'ville should be a good prep game for Witt with Wooster looming on Saturday.  Also, Witt should not be caught looking past C'ville, as it is a rivalry game as well for the Tigers.  As for C'ville's style of play being similar to Wooster's, I don't know if that is totally acurate.  C'ville's offense looks to me like it runs through their big man, 6'10" Daniel Rose.  I would almost say that C'ville looks more like Witt on paper than Wooster.  One thing I will be interested in seeing is how Witt matches up with Guy Rathmell.  He looks to be very similar to a Tom Port type of player.  He's a 6'6" forward and he's leading the team in 3 pt fg % and he's 2nd on the team in made 3's.  I'm interested to see who Witt puts on this guy and how they defend him because that's likely what we'll see against Tom Port as well.

Overall, at least on paper, I'd say Wooster's guards are a better collective group than what C'ville has, although the Yellow Jackets appear to have more size off the bench with two guys at  6'6" getting some solid minutes.  I don't think it's a stretch to say that this will be Witt's stiffest challenge of the season to date and I'm looking forward to see how they come out of it.  I think we can get a better gague of just how good Witt is after tonight's contest.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 12:21:51 PM
The pick 'em crowd favors Witt tonight by a slim 7-6 margin.  Then again, this crowd was a collective 10 games under .500 last week... :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 05, 2006, 12:35:12 PM
Not having seen any official rules banning it, beginning next week I'm going to make my game picks after the fact, results in hand.  I'm expecting this will improve my weekly performance, which I'm hoping might reach hitting 8 or 9 out of the 12 games correctly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 05, 2006, 03:44:34 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 05, 2006, 12:35:12 PM
Not having seen any official rules banning it, beginning next week I'm going to make my game picks after the fact, results in hand.  I'm expecting this will improve my weekly performance, which I'm hoping might reach hitting 8 or 9 out of the 12 games correctly.

I tried that in Vegas and all I won was an invitation to leave.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 07:50:55 PM
Wittenberg is out to a 19-12 lead with 9:43 left in the 1st.  It sounds like Witt is solidly in control of the game, although Cedarville just converted a 4-point play (shot, foul, missed FT, putback), but take that for what it's worth.  I've learned a lot about how much (or little) you can rely on stats and play by play to get a real feel for the game.  It's particularly hard in this case as my connection to the broadcast keeps crapping out.  >:(

UPDATE:  Hill hits a rim-glass-rim three, giving him 10, and pushing Witt out to a 30-21 lead.  TO, Cedarville.  3:57 left.
UPDATE:  Halftime, Wittenberg leads 39-23.  I think Witt has a big lead in rebounding, and Cedarville is on the verge of foul trouble.  Sounds like a mismatch so far.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 08:18:06 PM
jscwittfan is paired up with Scott Leo on the broadcast tonight, and they're doing a fine job.  Scott is reciting the halftime stats, but I missed the first part so I can't tell you about rebounds or shooting or scoring.  I can repeat that Witt is leading in points off turnovers 11-0. 

Both Scott and Josh have also emphasized that tickets are still available for Saturday's game, for those who are interested and haven't already gotten theirs (I'm in Row I.)

Anxiously awaiting the Artie Taylor fashion update...;D
UPDATE:  Oooooh, it's the Creamsicle suit! :D
UPDATE:  Witt shot 47% in the first half, vs. 31%(?) for Cedarville.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 05, 2006, 08:22:43 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 08:18:06 PM
jscwittfan is paired up with Scott Leo on the broadcast tonight, and they're doing a fine job.  Scott is reciting the halftime stats, but I missed the first part so I can't tell you about rebounds or shooting or scoring.  I can repeat that Witt is leading in points off turnovers 11-0. 

Both Scott and Josh have also emphasized that tickets are still available for Saturday's game, for those who are interested and haven't already gotten theirs (I'm in Row I.)

Anxiously awaiting the Artie Taylor fashion update...;D
UPDATE:  Oooooh, it's the Creamsicle suit! :D
UPDATE:  Witt shot 47% in the first half, vs. 31%(?) for Cedarville.

Actually, I was just lucky enough to be here and get to do a halftime show.   ;D  Rob Lehner is working with Scott tonight.

Cedarville actually won the rebounding battle in the first half, 21-20.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 08:23:39 PM
The CreamSickle suit, white shirt, orange tie, orange suit.

As Scott Leo says, "The best-dressed coach at any level in basketball."

I guess that makes Springfield the fashion capital of the basketball world.
Whoda thunk it?

Tigers up 20.  Tuning up for Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 08:27:34 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 07:50:55 PMI've learned a lot about how much (or little) you can rely on stats and play by play to get a real feel for the game. 
[...]
I think Witt has a big lead in rebounding, and Cedarville is on the verge of foul trouble.  Sounds like a mismatch so far.

Quote from: jscwittfan on December 05, 2006, 08:22:43 PM
Cedarville actually won the rebounding battle in the first half, 21-20.

See what I mean?  Heck, I can't even get the broadcast crew straight.   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 08:31:05 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on December 05, 2006, 08:22:43 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 08:18:06 PM
jscwittfan is paired up with Scott Leo on the broadcast tonight, and they're doing a fine job.  Scott is reciting the halftime stats, but I missed the first part so I can't tell you about rebounds or shooting or scoring.  I can repeat that Witt is leading in points off turnovers 11-0. 

Both Scott and Josh have also emphasized that tickets are still available for Saturday's game, for those who are interested and haven't already gotten theirs (I'm in Row I.)

Anxiously awaiting the Artie Taylor fashion update...;D
UPDATE:  Oooooh, it's the Creamsicle suit! :D
UPDATE:  Witt shot 47% in the first half, vs. 31%(?) for Cedarville.

Actually, I was just lucky enough to be here and get to do a halftime show.   ;D  Rob Lehner is working with Scott tonight.

I just tuned in time for the fashion update and missed your halftime show.  Sorry I missed it.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 08:35:50 PM
Cedarville had been down by as much as 22 but have now cut it to 10, 52-42.  But Borchers gets the "hoop and harm," converts to put the Tigers back up by 13 with 9:47 left.  Borchers has 17.

UPDATE:  Witt by 8, 6:41 left, and I'm disconnected again (2nd time this half.)  Josh, as you're there and not dependent on StretchCast, do you have the capability to give periodic updates if the game gets close?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on December 05, 2006, 08:43:01 PM
Fo r reference purposes, CEDARVILLE (8-0) is in the receiving votes category in the latest NAIA Division II poll.  They look like they are about 30th.

FYI, Georgetown is 8th in Division I NAIA

Wooster has the current ranked team remaining on the schedule (with current ranking):

Wittenberg #6 d3hoops pool (twice)
OWU RV d3hoops poll (twice)
ONU #3 d3hoops poll
Calvin RV d3hoops poll (possibly in the Mose Hole)



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 05, 2006, 08:47:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 08:35:50 PM
Josh, as you're there and not dependent on StretchCast, do you have the capability to give periodic updates if the game gets close?

Sure thing, DC.

Witt up 63-50 with 4:15 left.
UPDATE: Witt up 63-53 w/2:58 left.  Bill Brown calls TO and brings Borchers (who now has a double double) back into the game. 
UPDATE 2: Cedarville throwing up a lot of 3s now.  63-56 with 1:40 left.  CU missed the front end of a 1-and-1, but got the offensive rebound.  However, bad pass led to a backcourt violation and Witt ball.  Timeout CU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 08:53:27 PM
The feed seems to be back now.

Go Tigers!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 08:56:34 PM
1:22 left. 63-58
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 05, 2006, 08:57:16 PM
Steal and a layup from Cedarville, followed by another timeout.  63-58 Witt with 1:22 left.Sloppy second half (at least the last 7-8 minutes or so) from Wittenberg.  They do NOT need another overtime game.

Come on, Witt - Tiger Up!

UPDATE: 58 seconds left.  Witt trying to run the clock out, ball out of bounds on Cedarville.

However, Pat Denbow is down on the court, and was holding his ankle or lower leg.  Denbow is being carried over to the bench by trainers and players.  Hopefully it isn't serious...

Cedarville 3 with 37.7 to go - 63-61 Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 08:58:39 PM
scott's talking about the Tigers not holding big leads.

They need the killer instinct.  They've got to start putting games away when they get a good lead.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 08:59:24 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on December 05, 2006, 08:43:01 PM
Wooster has the current ranked team remaining on the schedule (with current ranking):

Wittenberg #6 d3hoops pool (twice)
OWU RV d3hoops poll (twice)
ONU #3 d3hoops poll
Calvin RV d3hoops poll (possibly in the Mose Hole)

If the Scots don't get Calvin on Day 2 of the Mose Hole, they'll get UW-LaCrosse, who is also in the "receiving votes" category (equivalent to #28, whereas Calvin is would-be #29).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 09:01:19 PM
The feed just went out again with the Tigers up 2.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 09:01:50 PM
Inside a minute, Cedarville cuts the lead to 2 as StretchCast dies again.  I'm glad we have our on-site correspondent!  He might not be too glad right now, though....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 09:02:30 PM
update, please.

Go Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 05, 2006, 09:02:58 PM
Cedarville foul with 31.8.  They have 6.

No foul until 25 seconds left, and Hill will go to the line for 1-and-1.

Hill makes the first.  64-61.
Hill misses the second, offensive rebound for Witt, Hill fouled again with 19.5 secs left.

The first . . . is good.  The second . . . is good as well.

Missed 3 by Cedarville.  Foul called on Witt with 5 secs left.  Missed free throw, Witt rebound, foul.  Academic from here.  Bowen misses free throw, out of bounds on Cedarville, inbound, game over.  Witt wins another close one 66-61!!

Witt SID Ryan Maurer says anyone having trouble with Stretch, email him (rmaurer@wittenberg.edu) and he'll pass your problems along to Stretch.  Definitely want to have things in line for Saturday!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 09:07:19 PM
The feed was back and I heard "it's 66 - 6 ..."

It's out again.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 05, 2006, 09:07:52 PM
Not the prettiest of wins for Witt, but they really need to work on closing out games.  A guy can only go through so much!

Looking forward to Wooser on Saturday - DC, I imagine I'll see you there at some point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 09:08:32 PM
Thanks for the updates, Josh.  I can imagine it's not what you'd have chosen to do tonight from your lofty perch, but we appreciate it.

I'll email Ryan, but I don't anticipate having any StretchCast problems on Saturday!   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 09:11:27 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on December 05, 2006, 09:02:58 PM
Cedarville foul with 31.8.  They have 6.

No foul until 25 seconds left, and Hill will go to the line for 1-and-1.

Hill makes the first.  64-61.
Hill misses the second, offensive rebound for Witt, Hill fouled again with 19.5 secs left.

The first . . . is good.  The second . . . is good as well.

Missed 3 by Cedarville.  Foul called on Witt with 5 secs left.  Missed free throw, Witt rebound, foul.  Academic from here.  Bowen misses free throw, out of bounds on Cedarville, inbound, game over.  Witt wins another close one 66-61!!

Witt SID Ryan Maurer says anyone having trouble with Stretch, email him (rmaurer@wittenberg.edu) and he'll pass your problems along to Stretch.  Definitely want to have things in line for Saturday!

How do you add on to your post and replace the previous one on the board?  When you update it, it just replaces the old post instead of making a new one.

That's pretty cool.

Thanks for keeping us informed.

TigerFan_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 05, 2006, 09:12:47 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 09:11:27 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on December 05, 2006, 09:02:58 PM
Cedarville foul with 31.8.  They have 6.

No foul until 25 seconds left, and Hill will go to the line for 1-and-1.

Hill makes the first.  64-61.
Hill misses the second, offensive rebound for Witt, Hill fouled again with 19.5 secs left.

The first . . . is good.  The second . . . is good as well.

Missed 3 by Cedarville.  Foul called on Witt with 5 secs left.  Missed free throw, Witt rebound, foul.  Academic from here.  Bowen misses free throw, out of bounds on Cedarville, inbound, game over.  Witt wins another close one 66-61!!

Witt SID Ryan Maurer says anyone having trouble with Stretch, email him (rmaurer@wittenberg.edu) and he'll pass your problems along to Stretch.  Definitely want to have things in line for Saturday!

How do you add on to your post and replace the previous one on the board?  When you update it, it just replaces the old post instead of making a new one.

That's pretty cool.

Thanks for keeping us informed.

TigerFan_1973

On your post, click "Modify".  Then it will mark your message as edited.

In not so good stats from Tigers perspective, Cedarville wins rebounding battle by 10, 45-35.  Gotta get that fixed!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 09:14:05 PM
Whew.

It's a little more exciting when the feed goes in and out.

Tigers win.  On to Saturday and Wooster!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 09:17:16 PM
I would like to give jscwittfan  some karma, but I don't think I can.

How would I do that?  I'm only a second stringer.  Can I give karma yet?  I think jscwittfan  did a great job on the updates.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 09:18:29 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 09:17:16 PM
I would like to give jscwittfan  some karma, but I don't think I can.

How would I do that? 

You need to have 200 posts before you are granted magical karma powers.  Don't worry, I *applaud*ed jscwittfan for you (actually for me, but I can only do it once every 24 hours.)  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 05, 2006, 09:30:20 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 09:18:29 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 09:17:16 PM
I would like to give jscwittfan  some karma, but I don't think I can.

How would I do that? 

You need to have 200 posts before you are granted magical karma powers.  Don't worry, I *applaud*ed jscwittfan for you (actually for me, but I can only do it once every 24 hours.)  :)

**Wells up like someone receiving an Academy Award.**

I'd like to thank all the people who voted for me, my broadcast team, Witten---

**Cuts to commercial.**
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 09:45:34 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on December 05, 2006, 09:30:20 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 09:18:29 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on December 05, 2006, 09:17:16 PM
I would like to give jscwittfan  some karma, but I don't think I can.

How would I do that? 

You need to have 200 posts before you are granted magical karma powers.  Don't worry, I *applaud*ed jscwittfan for you (actually for me, but I can only do it once every 24 hours.)  :)

**Wells up like someone receiving an Academy Award.**

I'd like to thank all the people who voted for me, my broadcast team, Witten---

**Cuts to commercial.**

Or perhaps,

**StretchCast craps out.**  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on December 05, 2006, 09:47:29 PM
Tigers got a big win today at the HPER, and Artie was lookin good. Had a good vantage point, almost on the floor (third or fourth row) at the Northeast corner of the HPER, fulfilling my role as band leader once again.

It seemed to me that Borchers was doing as good a job as anyone can ask against Cedarville's big men, although the offensive rotation C'ville used resulted in more than a few mismatches which pitted Pat Denbow and Gregg Hill against 40 and 42 for the Yellow Jackets (not sure of their names, really). Obviously, the height difference simply ended up with Denbow and Hill outmanned.

Witt's rebounding wasn't great, as has been said. They seemed to lack the energy to go up for a lot of the rebounds. There were numerous times that the Tigers just watched the ball instead of attacking it. Definitely something Coach Brown will need to work on. Wooster's going to come in with lots of energy and Witt's gonna need to match it to have a chance.

Offensively, Witt did a nice job switching to the outside for the most part, good ball movement (not all the time), with Borchers mostly shut down inside.

Highlight of the game for me: Hemenway with a block in the second half. He's one of my favorite guys to watch on the floor. Not the most graceful or even most talented, but boy does he get fired up. Never lacking spirit, that's for sure.

Getting pumped for Wooster!!! By the way, if anyone's interested in hearing some of the best students broadcasts in all of college sports, me and jscwittfan (Josh) are at it again tomorrow night, traveling with Witt's women to Thomas More. Tip off is at 7:30 and the game will be available on WUSO 89.1 locally and as always online through the witt athletics homepage.

Tiger Up!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 05, 2006, 09:54:19 PM
David,

I'll give the karma for TigerFan - to jscwittfan, for service over-and-above while broadcasting: +k.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 06, 2006, 11:54:36 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 05, 2006, 09:18:29 PM
You need to have 200 posts before you are granted magical karma powers.  Don't worry, I *applaud*ed jscwittfan for you (actually for me, but I can only do it once every 24 hours.)  :)

What is the going rate for brokering karma?   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 06, 2006, 12:01:55 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 06, 2006, 11:54:36 AMWhat is the going rate for brokering karma?   ;D

Well, 6 karma points and 3 or 4 bucks will get you a cafe latte.  100 karma points, and the same amount of money, will also get you one.  At least that's my current opinion.  If I get up to Oberlin early I'll see if DIII Hoops karma points actually have some tangible value in their local coffehouses.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: uknowme2 on December 06, 2006, 12:39:28 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 06, 2006, 12:01:55 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 06, 2006, 11:54:36 AMWhat is the going rate for brokering karma?   ;D

Well, 6 karma points and 3 or 4 bucks will get you a cafe latte.  100 karma points, and the same amount of money, will also get you one.  At least that's my current opinion.  If I get up to Oberlin early I'll see if DIII Hoops karma points actually have some tangible value in their local coffehouses.  :)

Just be sure you stay out of the backrooms of said coffeehouses. :-*
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 06, 2006, 01:17:27 PM
For anyone that was having problems with Witt's broadcast last night during the Cedarville game:

From what I've been told, Stretch has been contacted.  Supposedly, we are going to try something a little different tonight.  If anyone is interested, we will have a Witt women's broadcast tonight (against Thomas More), and will really be a "test run" of the new way of getting the broadcast to Stretch.

If anyone happens to listen, let me know if you are having the same problems with Stretch cutting out as you were last night.  This should fix things, but we just want to make sure.

Tiger up!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 06, 2006, 05:54:39 PM
Live video of the upcoming Witt/COW game:

http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/news/2006releases/12_06.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 06, 2006, 08:18:33 PM
Wooster leads Oberlin at the half 49-34

Wooster closed out the half with a 31-4  run!!!  :o

Oberlin came out firing and built a 30-12 lead with just under 9 minutes left in the half when Wooster woke up and went on their huge run to take control of the game,
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on December 06, 2006, 08:28:31 PM
Regarding the video feed.  What is the cost?  And will it be archived somewhere for download.  Can you believe that I have the wife's job Holiday Party SAT Night??  Bummer for me.  I will want to see this game either recorded or from an archive.  I am in Memphis and do not have NE Ohio pulic access.

I wish they could get on Fox Sports Ohio!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 06, 2006, 08:56:45 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 06, 2006, 08:18:33 PM
Wooster leads Oberlin at the half 49-34

Wooster closed out the half with a 31-4  run!!!  :o

Oberlin came out firing and built a 30-12 lead with just under 9 minutes left in the half when Wooster woke up and went on their huge run to take control of the game,

Sorry to be nit-picky (the curse of being a former stat instructor)!

If Oberlin was 30-12, then Woo's run was 37-4
If Woo went 31-4, then Oberlin could not have been 30-12.

Sorry!  It IS a curse sometimes to notice numbers! ;D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 06, 2006, 09:14:03 PM
Final:  Wooster 95  Oberlin 76

Wooster had 6 players in double figure points tonight led by Tom Port and James Cooper each with 17 points.

Wooster is now 6-0. :)  Next up is Witt in Springfield on Saturday!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 06, 2006, 09:25:09 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 06, 2006, 08:56:45 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 06, 2006, 08:18:33 PM
Wooster leads Oberlin at the half 49-34

Wooster closed out the half with a 31-4  run!!!  :o

Oberlin came out firing and built a 30-12 lead with just under 9 minutes left in the half when Wooster woke up and went on their huge run to take control of the game,

Sorry to be nit-picky (the curse of being a former stat instructor)!

If Oberlin was 30-12, then Woo's run was 37-4
If Woo went 31-4, then Oberlin could not have been 30-12.

Sorry!  It IS a curse sometimes to notice numbers! ;D ;)

According to the radio, it was the latter.  Oberlin was leading 30-18, not 30-12, before the 31-4 run.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 06, 2006, 09:54:02 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 06, 2006, 08:56:45 PM
Sorry to be nit-picky (the curse of being a former stat instructor)!

If Oberlin was 30-12, then Woo's run was 37-4
If Woo went 31-4, then Oberlin could not have been 30-12.

Sorry!  It IS a curse sometimes to notice numbers! ;D ;)
Sorry, scotsbrod is correct.  I had the 12 point deficit on my brain when I was typing my update.  It was in fact a 30-18 deficit facing the Scots. 

Wooster has made a habit of going on some big runs in the 1st half of games this season.  They had a 19-0 run against Walsh.  They had a 15-2 run to close the 1st half against Gerogetown (KY).  They then had a run of 16-0 and eventually 22-2 last Saturday against Earlham.  And tonight they put together a 21-0 run on the Yeomen which they extended to the afore mentioned 31-4 run to close the half. 

Witt is going to have to seriously guard against Wooster's 'spurtability' if they want to have a chance to win on Saturday.  Witt has shown signs of being vulnerable to jumping out to big leads and letting teams back in the game late.  The Tigers can afford to do this against lesser opponents, but they can't afford it against a team like Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 06, 2006, 10:03:15 PM
ScotsFan,

I'm of the 'no harm, no foul' persuasion! ;D

After 32 years of picking out numerical errors, I just can't help myself! ;)

I enjoy your posts! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 06, 2006, 10:26:45 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 06, 2006, 10:03:15 PM
ScotsFan,

I'm of the 'no harm, no foul' persuasion! ;D

After 32 years of picking out numerical errors, I just can't help myself! ;)

I enjoy your posts! :)
Mr. Ypsi,

Thanks.  I assumed as much referring to your 'no harm, no foul' comments. :)   Besides, your a fellow Michigan fan.  How could I be upset with a fellow Michigan man? :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 06, 2006, 10:39:05 PM
My fondest wish is that OSU wins by 3+ TDs.  Michigan wins by 3+ TDs. Wisconsin wins by however much it takes to finish 3rd.

Big Ten (Official Motto: So we can't count - you got a problem with that?! :D) finishes 1,2,3! ;D

I suppose the only thing better would be OSU-UF go to OT, UM win by 5TDs, UM gets a shared national title. ;) ::) :o

But I'll take anything that makes Urban Meyer say 'OOPS!'.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 06, 2006, 11:02:31 PM
Note to anyone travelling to Oberlin from the south: check the westbound Baltimore & Ohio freight schedules.  Enroute to the game I was delayed by a somewhat lengthy train, one whose front end was probably pulling into the Chicago stockyards as the caboose (do they still have those?) was clearing Wellington, Ohio.  Held me up for almost fifteen minutes.  On my way home, somewhere further south, I came across another freight, or perhaps the same one on a personal vindictive mission, that STOPPED on the tracks while crossing Route 58, perhaps the engineer having decided to take a short nap.  Ah, northern Ohio.

Both Wellington and Oberlin were beautifully decked out for the holiday season.  The game itself would have been better had the referees also gotten into the holiday spirit a bit early and not shown up.  They were horrible, even for the NCAC, for both teams.  Well, maybe not quite so bad for Oberlin.  Wake up NCAC, and find some guys that are halfway competent.

Oberlin is much improved.  They shoot the ball nicely, have some other players who can create offensively, and they play hard and physical, although maybe a little too much so.  If they had a little more size, they'd probably end up a .500 team, or better.  Even so, they'll give a few teams heck before it's over.

Congrats to Rachel Thompson, kid sister of former Wooster shooting guard Rob, who will shortly transfer from Cedarville to Akron to finish her studies enroute to becoming an F.B.I. chick. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2006, 12:01:42 AM
Elsewhere,

Mt. Union 81, Hiram 54
Westminster 102, Allegheny 97
Washington & Jefferson 71, Denison 49

ick.  :P

And for pick'em interest:
UW-Stevens Point 75, UW-Whitewater 73.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 07, 2006, 12:04:46 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 06, 2006, 09:54:02 PM
Wooster has made a habit of going on some big runs in the 1st half of games this season.  They had a 19-0 run against Walsh.  They had a 15-2 run to close the 1st half against Gerogetown (KY).  They then had a run of 16-0 and eventually 22-2 last Saturday against Earlham.  And tonight they put together a 21-0 run on the Yeomen which they extended to the afore mentioned 31-4 run to close the half. 

Witt is going to have to seriously guard against Wooster's 'spurtability' if they want to have a chance to win on Saturday.  Witt has shown signs of being vulnerable to jumping out to big leads and letting teams back in the game late.  The Tigers can afford to do this against lesser opponents, but they can't afford it against a team like Wooster.

No worries on the numerics- I was just trying to clear it up in case anyone on the board wanted to know which way it was.  ScotsFan, I've also noted both of these trends that you mention.  I'm interested in the board's opinion on them.  Does Witt lack the "killer instinct" that would allow them to lock up sure wins (if so, do you think they can just borrow some of Lincoln's?   ::) :-\ ) I know that the Witt broadcast was worried about how Witt has not been able to hold onto their leads.

For the Scots, is the "spurtability" more a function of clamping down on defense or of showing that offensive magic that was their hallmark last season?  I haven't seen either of these teams in person, yet, so I wonder what opinion(s) people who have seen the teams this year might have. 

Personally, I still think that Saturday's game should follow the trend of a rivalry matchup before anything else- that is to say, no pre-existing trends/stats will really matter when the ball hits the floor, because the players are in it for more than just a "W".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 07, 2006, 12:48:30 AM
Definitely a game of spurts in the first half.  Wooster opens with a 10-2 lead, then Oberlin runs off 28-8 and then Wooster finishes with a 31-4 run. Even when Wooster was down 12 I knew they would come back.

The positives from this game to me are that Wooster continues to pass well to find the open man, their interior defense is much improved from last year, and their free throw shooting is exceptional at 85%+ (19-22 last night).

At the other end, 3-point shooting has been down since the AVW tournament (34-90) but I will take improved defense over reliance on the outside shot anytime.

As a final note - I agree with WB that the officials were not the best, but they didn't affect the outcome of the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on December 07, 2006, 02:22:06 AM
Bad news for Witt faithful. Starting point guard Pat Denbow suffered a "really bad sprain" (quote from Denbow himself around 2:30 PM Wednesday) in his left ankle against Cedarville on Tuesday. He said he is likely to sit out practice Thursday and will try to join the team at practice Friday. My guess as a biology major (however unqualified I may be to make such a guess) is that he will not practice Friday and, even if he does, will not play Saturday against Wooster. Just glad it's not a break.

Most likely filling in will be freshman guard David Nowicki, a 5-8, 150 pound native of Carmel, Indiana, graduate of Westfield High School. He's shown flashes of talent such as cutting down low against Cedarville's big men, who were caught off guard, for a pass and an easy layup. Good court vision and he's quick. Josh and I are excited to see him get some significant time against Wooster and are confident he'll bring his A game.

Congrats Dane Borchers for NCAC player of the week honors.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 07, 2006, 03:31:22 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 06, 2006, 09:54:02 PMWitt is going to have to seriously guard against Wooster's 'spurtability'

I would suggest butcher aprons and/or a tarpaulin, or perhaps just putting down some plastic bags on the floor will do.  ;)

Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 06, 2006, 11:02:31 PMBoth Wellington and Oberlin were beautifully decked out for the holiday season. 

They decorate this early for Non-Sectarian Winter Solstice Celebration in Oberlin?  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bigkrapper on December 07, 2006, 10:07:37 AM
I haven't posted in a while but was made aware by a good friend of mine that Rachel Thompson was transferring to Cedarville, and Wooster Booster mentioned her brother Rob. 

I remember when Rob laced up those high tops for the scots.  They were some fun teams to watch.  Just brought back some memories of cheering for the Scots when they had the likes of Ryan Gorman, John Ellenwood, Wooster Assistant Nate Gaubatz, Bryan Nelson, Matt Smtih.  Those were some exciting teams.  The won the best Mose Hole to date when defending champ (at the time) Calvin and Chicago came to Timken ranked 1 and 3 respectively.  Wooster won the tournament and ultimately received the school's first ever ranking.  Rob was lucky enough to have some great teammates and obviously great coaches.   ;D! 

Anyway, my nostalgic moment is up.  KEEP UP THE GOOD WORK SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 07, 2006, 01:37:46 PM
yeah that is disappointing news to hear about denbow, and since our bench is already at a disadvantage will have to step up big time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 07, 2006, 03:00:58 PM
Quote from: tigerup07 on December 07, 2006, 02:22:06 AM
Bad news for Witt faithful. Starting point guard Pat Denbow suffered a "really bad sprain" (quote from Denbow himself around 2:30 PM Wednesday) in his left ankle against Cedarville on Tuesday.

Thanks for the news.  I wondered how the injury would be when I heard he went down on Tuesday. (Stretch was working when he went down, but not for long  :D)

I have heard good things about  Nowicki on the broadcasts.  This would be a great opportunity for him.  By the way, when looking at the Tigers roster a while back, I noticed that they have two players from Carmel, Ind.  Do the Tigers have a connection there or is it just a coincidence?

I plan to be at the HPER Center Saturday.  The video feed will be great news for anyone who can't attend in person.

GO TIGERS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on December 07, 2006, 04:55:53 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on December 07, 2006, 03:00:58 PM
By the way, when looking at the Tigers roster a while back, I noticed that they have two players from Carmel, Ind.  Do the Tigers have a connection there or is it just a coincidence?

Indiana is the most represented state on Witt's campus behind the Buckeye State. Witt has a strong academic and athletic recruiting presence in Indiana, the breakdown on the varsity men's basketball roster coming in at 9 Ohioans, 3 Hoosiers, one Kentuckian(?) and one guy from the State Up North.

David Nowicki is from Carmel and attended Westfield High, while sophomore Kevin Murray, who is also from Carmel, attended Carmel High. Wouldn't be surprised if Murray was one of the guys that Nowicki was paired with during recruitment visits, and chances are they played against one another in high school, but it's probably just coincidence. Perhaps the recruiter for that area is just damn good. Don't know the backstory though, so sorry I can't be more specific.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 07, 2006, 07:55:47 PM
Quote from: bigkrapper on December 07, 2006, 10:07:37 AM
I remember when Rob laced up those high tops for the scots. 

Speaking of Wooster and nostalgia:

I remember Steve Moore playing for the Tigers.
Go Witt!

TigerFan_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 07, 2006, 07:57:34 PM
I have my tickets for Saturday night. 

Who else is going to be there?

Go Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 07, 2006, 08:34:27 PM
I'll be there, along with about 2,500 Wooster fans.  Got room?  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 07, 2006, 09:09:29 PM
I'm there all day long.  :)

Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 07, 2006, 08:34:27 PM
I'll be there, along with about 2,500 Wooster fans.  Got room?  :)

I think we have room.  And if not, I hear we have a pretty nice woodshed out back.

Just kidding, ha ha.  Seriously though, 2,500?  The HPER only holds 3100 - where are the rest of you going, because I know there will be more than 600 Tigers there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 07, 2006, 09:25:02 PM
ill be there in row Q-well not really cuz i dont think students are gonna care bout where they sit......denbow has a shot at playing saturday fyi as i found out from a close team source today, depends on how the training session went today
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2006, 09:43:00 PM
I'm sure those guys (the Carmel kids at Witt) knew each other even though they went to different HS and probably one convinced the other to come there. It happens at Wabash, especially in football, where one kid comes from a school or an area, and does well...and then there's another and another...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2006, 09:46:29 PM
I can't vouch for 2500 Wooster fans, but I'll be there with one Wooster booster.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on December 07, 2006, 10:43:14 PM
I will be there all day. Stat running for the women's game, watching the JV game, and playing my trumpet with the Witt Pep Band for the big show. pennstghs, I'm sure you're right about the students. And that's why I'm going to camp out to hold the Pep Band's section between the JV and the varsity game, because last year the yellow police tape and signs every two feet weren't enough to keep the students from taking our section anyway. Good to hear about Denbow. Even if he does play it'll probably be less time than usual, though.

I thought I had heard that the Wooster allocation was 1,000 tickets. But regardless, the "This is Our House" chant will be coming from the Witt student section this year!
Witt's got a real nice pre-game line up of stuff to get the students into the game this year. Be prepared for a show of force!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 07, 2006, 11:06:54 PM
A few years ago, I was told by a moderately crazy Wooster baseball fanatic (a West Virginian, so the moderately crazy part is certainly redundant) that he could make the trip from Wooster to Wittenberg in two hours.  I move pretty well on the road, but have never done better than 2:15.  Columbus usually gets in the way.  However, with Parnelli Collinge riding shotgun and navigating on Saturday, I fully intend to break the land speed record on the trip down.  Hide the women and children.

If I'm able to convince DC that we should see the women's game, we'll be on the road out of Wooster by 11:30 and walking into the gym at Witt at 1:29, the Guinness record in our pocket.  David might need some valium or at least a pint of bourbon upon our arrival, so we'd appreciate it if the paramedics or a local bartender would be available.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 07, 2006, 11:21:14 PM
From MapQuest:

Wooster, OH US to Springfield, OH US

Total Est. Time:  2 hours, 22 minutes
Total Est. Distance: 139.55 miles

Hmmmm.....140 miles in 2 hours?  That would be 70 miles per hour so it shouldn't be a problem...  ;)

...unless the Wooster police or the Springfield police don't like that speed within the city limits! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 07, 2006, 11:47:16 PM
They have police in Springfield? ;)

I think I can do it in two hours, but will have to get lucky on the lights in both Wooster and Springfield and mostly with the Columbus traffic.  A lot will also depend on the girls at Burger King processing our orders quickly during our pit stop.  If Collinge needs to go inside to use the rest room we're dead in the water.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 08, 2006, 12:17:54 AM
another thing to factor in-doesnt some weather thing-something bout the weather being crappy in ohio-always factor into things-i dont know maybe that white stuff is fake and will disolve lol
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 08, 2006, 01:23:38 AM
Another recent Wooster grad and I will be in attendance.

Woo Boo and DC, you really should be fine with Columbus traffic if you're going to be hitting Columbus around 12:30-1 pm.  Traffic volume on 270 shouldn't be an issue at that time of day- the weather/road conditions could be another story.

I came to the game at Springfield last year, too, but I wasn't driving for that.  Would a Witt fan or someone knowledgeable with campus give me parking advice?  Last year I think we parked just on the street in the neighborhood- is that the best plan?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 08, 2006, 05:59:49 AM
Wooster Booster - I'll do my part and stay off of 270 around that time!  Traffic on I-70 around the Polaris Mall might be a little busy - just stay left then get over immediatlely after the Polaris exit to get off on 270.  2 hours could be doable.  Its normally about 90 minutes from my house in the Dublin area to Wooster, and 45 minutes from my house to Springfield so with some good luck its possible, but any BK stop would kill your chances.  The quickest fast food on that trip is the Wendys at SR97 (exit 165 I think).  Easy on & off - especially coming from the north - and quick service.

I'll be there with my daughter and her boyfriend, meeting up with the rest of my family making the trip down from Woo-town.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 08, 2006, 06:34:32 AM
Out of curiosity why would you take 270 around Columbus?  Wouldn't it be easier to just take 71 down to 670 which from that direction becomes 70?  :-\

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 08, 2006, 06:45:27 AM
Quote from: sac on December 08, 2006, 06:34:32 AM
Out of curiosity why would you take 270 around Columbus?  Wouldn't it be easier to just take 71 down to 670 which from that direction becomes 70?  :-\

270 is usually the fastest way to get from the north to the west sides of Columbus, although I hadn't really considered 670.  The 670 route could possibly be slightly less mileage as it cuts a very slight diagonal, but traffic is generally slower through downtown than it is on 270.  As 270 is at least 4 lanes all the way and 71/670/70 has smaller roads and slower speed limits I think I'd still say to take 270.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 08, 2006, 09:36:10 AM
I've made that trip (usually going to Dayton rather than Witt) a number of times and have occasionally run into bad traffic problems when not using 270.  On the other hand, if the road is clear, that way is probably a little faster.

From time to time, some of you guys have mentioned a restaurant that is the place to go when visiting Springfield.  Can somebody please tell me it's name, where it is, and what kind of place it is?  Seems like it was a sportsbar and grill.  Is it Jake's?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: uknowme2 on December 08, 2006, 10:12:48 AM
Quote from: tigerup07 on December 07, 2006, 10:43:14 PM
Good to hear about Denbow. Even if he does play it'll probably be less time than usual, though.

Sometimes a bad sprain is worse than a break.  Hopefully that's not the case here, but if it was bad enough that might be the case.

Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 07, 2006, 11:47:16 PM
They have police in Springfield? ;)

I think I can do it in two hours, but will have to get lucky on the lights in both Wooster and Springfield and mostly with the Columbus traffic.  A lot will also depend on the girls at Burger King processing our orders quickly during our pit stop.  If Collinge needs to go inside to use the rest room we're dead in the water.

Oh we have police, and they are well aware of the arrival of 2,500 or so drunk people wearing Black and Gold. ;D


I'll be there.  Don't know how much home court advantage we'll have, but I'll cheer all the same.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 08, 2006, 10:15:09 AM
Quote from: scotsbrod on December 08, 2006, 01:23:38 AM
I came to the game at Springfield last year, too, but I wasn't driving for that.  Would a Witt fan or someone knowledgeable with campus give me parking advice?  Last year I think we parked just on the street in the neighborhood- is that the best plan?

This is the primary problem on Witt's campus - parking.  if you get there early enough, there should be parking on the street around the HPER.  There is also a general parking lot down across from the football field and down by two of the dorms that is open to everybody, but again is usually filled.  Don't be surprised if you have to walk a few blocks.  If the area right outside the HPER is filled, try parking on Lowry - it's the street that runs parallel to the tennis courts.  That's probably your best alternative.  However, make sure you don't park anywhere where the curb is yellow, or the crack Witt security staff will either give you a ticket, slap a parking boot on your car, or both.

Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 08, 2006, 09:36:10 AM
From time to time, some of you guys have mentioned a restaurant that is the place to go when visiting Springfield.  Can somebody please tell me it's name, where it is, and what kind of place it is?  Seems like it was a sportsbar and grill.  Is it Jake's?

I would imagine you're thinking of Mike and Rosy's.  It's a little sandwich place that is right down the street from campus (it's on the corner of McCreight and Plum).  They have also recently added a sports bar onto it, which is called "The Press Box."  While I'm not sure of what they serve in the Press Box, the original restaurant has some of the best subs you'll find anywhere.

For everyone's convenience, here is a map of Wittenberg's campus: http://www4.wittenberg.edu/about/map.pdf - hope that helps.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2006, 10:59:04 AM
With all of these regular posters planning to attend, maybe we should take steps to meet and greet.  I'm assuming that, for a brief time anyway, ardent Witt and Woo folks can set aside their mutual hatred.  It should be before the game, though, since afterward the Witt fans will probably be upset about having broken OSU-Marion's record for losing margin.  ;D

So here's a suggestion: anyone who wants meet other posters and will be in town by then should plan to go to The Press Box before the JV game (which begins at 5:30.)  I hope to meet some of you there, and I hope W.B. doesn't mind my pre-committing him in this way.  Anyway, after making a drive in 2 hours that usually takes me 3:30, I'll surely need a drink! :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 08, 2006, 11:06:04 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 08, 2006, 10:59:04 AM
With all of these regular posters planning to attend, maybe we should take steps to meet and greet.  I'm assuming that, for a brief time anyway, ardent Witt and Woo folks can set aside their mutual hatred.  It should be before the game, though, since afterward the Witt fans will probably be upset about having broken OSU-Marion's record for losing margin.  ;D

So here's a suggestion: anyone who wants meet other posters and will be in town by then should plan to go to The Press Box before the JV game (which begins at 5:30.)  I hope to meet some of you there, and I hope W.B. doesn't mind my pre-committing him in this way.  Anyway, after making a drive in 2 hours that usually takes me 3:30, I'll surely need a drink! :D

Unfortunately, I'll be doing radio for the women's game and then working the scorer's table for the JV game, so I'm out.  Maybe I'll catch some of you around inside the HPER at some point throughout the day.  I'll be in the press box during the women's game, at the scorer's table during the JV game, and then somewhere in a mass of students during the finale.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 08, 2006, 11:10:25 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 08, 2006, 10:59:04 AMSo here's a suggestion: anyone who wants meet other posters and will be in town by then should plan to go to The Press Box before the JV game (which begins at 5:30.)  I hope to meet some of you there, and I hope W.B. doesn't mind my pre-committing him in this way.  Anyway, after making a drive in 2 hours that usually takes me 3:30, I'll surely need a drink! :D

Probably you should have that drink, and maybe several, before getting in the car.  Should you forget, no matter, I'll make sure to have a flask of Jim Beam at the ready between the seats, since the crack Wittenberg security force is apparently focused on that substance rather than the more traditional diversions.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2006, 11:14:00 AM
There's going to be about a 2-hour gap between the end of the women's game (2:00) and the tip of the JV game (5:30), unless I don't understand the schedule.  Will post-game and pre-game duties eat up all of that time?  Even students have to eat sometime!  :) We'll be at the women's game too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: uknowme2 on December 08, 2006, 11:36:09 AM
A meet and greet sounds good.  Although I can hardly stand CoW, I have tremendous respect for their athletics and fans.  I'm sure we could have some interesting conversation over a sub and a few cocktails.

And for you Scot fans trying to set the land speed record, the weather looks to be just fine for your attempt.  Saturday's forcast is as follows (from the NWS):

Saturday: Mostly sunny, with a high near 39. Southwest wind between 9 and 17 mph, with gusts as high as 28 mph.

Saturday Night: Clear, with a low around 25. South wind between 8 and 11 mph.

Be safe and don't let a little cool breeze up your skirt... I mean kilt slow you down. ;)

GO TIGERS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 08, 2006, 11:46:43 AM
The picture will become much clearer after Saturday but there are two possible scenarios for a #1 vs #2 this month.  Either possibility would require that Amherst (6-0) lose to Brandeis (9-0) this weekend.

If that happens, and with Ohio Northern facing both Wooster and Wittenberg this month, it could be a #1 Wooster vs #2 ONU or a #1 ONU vs. #2 Witt if the pollsters would jump them over St. Thomas and VWU.

Of course ONU would have to continue winning ( BW on Saturday, Mt. Union on the 16th and Witt if matchup involves Wooster) which is no small task.

Just another thought to hype this Satusdays game....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 08, 2006, 12:11:26 PM
In a preplay with the AtR Excel basketball game, using stats based only upon this season's completed games and no strength-of-schedule adjustments, Wooster led Wittenberg all the way enroute to a 98-73 victory.  The game was closer than the final score indicates, with Witt having closed to within 7 points midway through the second half.  However, some cold shooting followed and the Scots won going away.

Wooster shot a lights out 15-26 from behind the arc while Wittenberg knocked down only 5-14, despite Gregg Hill's 4-5.  It was only Witt's 20-22 free throw shooting that kept them in the ballgame, as the Scots won both the battle of the boards and turnovers.  The following is a link to the boxscore:

http://arkski.com/~jwood/wooster_(98)_at_wittenberg_(73).html

I'll probably give this one another shot this evening to see if Witt can do better.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 08, 2006, 12:23:57 PM
Meanwhile, away from the glamour and excitement that is Springfield in December...the Little Giants have an important tournament tonight and tomorrow.

They draw Cincy Clermont tonight, who is having a good year, and then take on either Olivet Nazarene or Marian tomorrow. It will be a stern test for the LGs.

It will also be Gary Simkus' last home games, I believe, for the season. He will spend the winter and spring studying in Spain.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 08, 2006, 03:28:45 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 08, 2006, 10:59:04 AM
......... since afterward the Witt fans will probably be upset about having broken OSU-Marion's record for losing margin.  ;D

This is the closest thing to smack talk you'll get from Mr. Collinge :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 08, 2006, 04:09:31 PM
Quote from: sac on December 08, 2006, 03:28:45 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 08, 2006, 10:59:04 AM
......... since afterward the Witt fans will probably be upset about having broken OSU-Marion's record for losing margin.  ;D

This is the closest thing to smack talk you'll get from Mr. Collinge :D

If that's only close to smack talk, it's good he doesn't indulge in the real thing! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 08, 2006, 06:25:06 PM
Wittenberg game notes are up:

http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/06-07gamenotes(wooster).pdf

According to this, there are still some tickets remaining.  They'll go on sale at 5 p.m. on Saturday in the HPER.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 08, 2006, 07:14:36 PM
From the game notes:

"Wittenberg fans do not have to pay to listen to the internet broadcasts (video or audio), and anyone with a computer and high-speed internet connection can log on and listen or watch."

I'm assuming that Wooster fans will have their bank accounts automatically debited if they choose to tune in.  Sure wish they could at least provide us with the fee amount...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 08, 2006, 09:25:41 PM
I'm assuming that it's free to all, since it's being run through Stretch, and you don't have to pay to listen to the Stretch audio feeds.  It should be as simple to access as the audio feeds (usually) are.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 09, 2006, 07:12:56 AM
In a second AtR (Above the Rim) simulation, Wittenberg had their revenge over the Scots, 94-80.  Wooster led most of the way, even remaining up by 3 with 8 minutes remaining.  But the Tigers finished the game on a 21-4 run to provide the final margin of victory.  Borchers, Hill, and Mark (Seed) Caraway led the way with 17 points each.  Borchers dominated the boards, pulling down 14 rebounds, and once again found himself continually on the foul line where he made 11-13 shots.

Tim Vandervaart led Wooster with 21, but the Scots were only 9-24 from three-point land and were outrebounded 40-29.  The boxscore:

http://arkski.com/~jwood/wooster_(80)_at_wittenberg_(94).html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 09, 2006, 09:09:54 AM
Quote from: uknowme2 on December 08, 2006, 11:36:09 AM
A meet and greet sounds good.  Although I can hardly stand CoW, I have tremendous respect for their athletics and fans.  I'm sure we could have some interesting conversation over a sub and a few cocktails.

I can't make it before the game but I would like to meet D3Hoops people at halftime.  How about just outside the door to the gym at the end of the first half?  I will make a sign. 

I look forward to meeting you.

TigerFan_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 09, 2006, 09:13:26 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 08, 2006, 12:23:57 PM
Meanwhile, away from the glamour and excitement that is Springfield in December...the Little Giants have an important tournament tonight and tomorrow.

They draw Cincy Clermont tonight, who is having a good year, and then take on either Olivet Nazarene or Marian tomorrow. It will be a stern test for the LGs.

I have to ask about this.  I live in Cincinnati Ohio and UC Clermont is a two-year branch of the University of Cincinnati.  Does that count as a real game?

Similarly with OSU-Marion in the big blowout last week.

Thanks for any light you can shed on this question.

TigerFan_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 09, 2006, 10:35:37 AM
Are you saying that OSU-Marion is a two-year school?  Holy cow, what on earth was Lincoln doing scheduling them at all?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on December 09, 2006, 11:05:26 AM
Alright, so we know Witt-Woo is a big game. But just how big? I know this is an NCAC board, but I figured it would be an interesting perspective from this board. Is there a bigger rivalry game in all of Div II basketball, if not all of D3 sports? Not only just how much the schools get into it but the even nature of the matchup every year as well... I guess I'm saying that it's not like the Browns-Steelers rivalry has become (with the Browns not having a chance the last few years).

According to Wooster's pregame notes:
"On Saturday night, Dec. 9, Wittenberg and Wooster will go toe-to-toe once again in one of the best, if not the best, rivalry game in NCAA Div. III basketball. They are currently the two all-time winningest programs in Div. III, as the Tigers sport a 1542-613 record (.716) and the Scots stand at 1426-739 (.659). This week's game will mark the 89th meeting between the two Ohio foes, with Wittenberg holding a 48-40 edge. Incredibly, 36, or 40.9 percent of Wittenberg-Wooster games have been decided by five points or less, including 16 of the last 33, and that doesn't even include the classic triple-overtime game on Feb. 12, 2005....Also noteworthy, the Fighting Scots and Tigers have won/shared the NCAC regular season championship each of the last 18 seasons, and they've combined to win all but two NCAC Tournament titles during that span. "

And from the Witt pre-game notes:
"Also, of note, this will be the fifth time in the last seven seasons that one of the two teams has been ranked No. 1 nationally entering the game. Amazingly, the homestanding No. 1 squad has lost in each instance"

Where else can you find such a nationally important game that also has the watermark of a classic rivalry? I've never heard of it in D3 sports, but I was hoping someone else may have... honestly, I'm a little bit confounded by how this game doesn't get more front page coverage on D3hoops.com. But maybe it's just me...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on December 09, 2006, 11:07:55 AM
I can remember Witt's JV team playing OSU-Marion during one of my four seasons.  Thats why I just laughed off Lincoln's video game victory.

I can't make the game tonight, I'm in Houston, TX for work and its killing me.  I'll be watching on the internet for sure, but I would have loved to put faces with names.  I was picturing an Animal House-esque food fight as soon as I walked into Mike and Rosy's.  Makes me laugh just thinking about it.

Good luck tonight boys, I'll be getting noise complaints for you.

GO TIGERS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 09, 2006, 11:27:59 AM
Now, today being a big game day, I envy all of you who will be at the HPER.  How I wish I could be there to cheer our Fighting Scots with you all.

Once a Fighting Scot, always a Fighting Scot!  Go Scots!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 09, 2006, 11:30:27 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 09, 2006, 10:35:37 AM
Are you saying that OSU-Marion is a two-year school?  Holy cow, what on earth was Lincoln doing scheduling them at all?

Lincoln drew OSU-Marion after they lost the first game in a tournament.  Lincoln didn't schedule OSU-Marion...they played the consolation game of a tournament, and Lincoln wasn't the host for the tourney so they weren't the ones who invited OSU-Marion, either, I believe.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 09, 2006, 11:52:58 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 09, 2006, 10:35:37 AM
Are you saying that OSU-Marion is a two-year school?  Holy cow, what on earth was Lincoln doing scheduling them at all?
That's what I was saying.  This appears to be a bit of a trend (if two makes a trend) of two-year branches in tournaments with D3 teams.

Wabash is playing in that tournament with UC-Clermont which is a branch of University of Cincinnati that typically offers two-year programs.

I'm going to post a message for Ralph tomorrow to see if these games count for tournament rating purposes.

Please excuse me, now, as I am leaving for the big city of Springfield and the Wittenberg - Wooster game.

I guess this will be a homecoming for James Cooper of Wooster.

GO TIGERS!

TigerFan_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 09, 2006, 12:03:41 PM
TigerUp07-----With all due respect to Witt/Wooster I'd look into Hope/Calvin from Michigan..........untill two other schools can get 11,500 people in an arena for basketball everyone's playing for second.    ESPN did a whole show on best hoops rivalries and Hope/Calvin was #4 overall.  No other D3 rivalry made the list.

http://www.hope.edu/pr/athletics/therivalry/

http://www.hope.edu/pr/athletics/therivalry/rivalry.html

http://www.hope.edu/pr/athletics/mbb/0506hopecalvingallery.html


Woo/Witt is without a doubt a great rivalry but its a baby in terms of # of games played and length of time when compared to other rivalries.

There's Amherst/Williams, DePauw/Wabash and many many others.  It would be in the group fighting for second.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: m m b on December 09, 2006, 12:27:21 PM
Today's New York Times has a good article on the Lincoln/OSU-Marion game.  Apparently, OSU-M was invited to the tournament only three days before the game as a replacement for Wayne State, who dropped out.  So, Lincoln had no control over scheduling OSU-M and probably thought the tournament field would include a D2 school. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 09, 2006, 12:33:44 PM
Sac is absolutely correct - Hope-Calvin is #1 by a long shot. Having grown up along the eastern Lake Michigan coast line I have known and seen this intense rivalry long before I came to Ohio. Wooster-Witt is growing to a level to rival Hope/Calvin with the consistent top level of play each school performs to, along with the community support/identity they receive, but they ain't there yet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on December 09, 2006, 12:44:31 PM
Ok, that's what I was looking for. Good to know. Hope/Calvin are perennial powerhouses who (unbeknownst to me) have a heated rivarly. So they're rivalry has a huge national impact and as well the pure rivalry factor. I'd agree that Witt/Woo is developing into something big, as long as both schools can sustain the development of their programs long enough to earn the reputations that Hope and Calvin already have. But oh man is it fun watching this rivalry get bigger and bigger every year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on December 09, 2006, 01:37:07 PM
Quote from: tigerup07 on December 09, 2006, 11:05:26 AM
Alright, so we know Witt-Woo is a big game. But just how big? I know this is an NCAC board, but I figured it would be an interesting perspective from this board. Is there a bigger rivalry game in all of Div II basketball, if not all of D3 sports? Not only just how much the schools get into it but the even nature of the matchup every year as well... I guess I'm saying that it's not like the Browns-Steelers rivalry has become (with the Browns not having a chance the last few years).

According to Wooster's pregame notes:
"On Saturday night, Dec. 9, Wittenberg and Wooster will go toe-to-toe once again in one of the best, if not the best, rivalry game in NCAA Div. III basketball. They are currently the two all-time winningest programs in Div. III, as the Tigers sport a 1542-613 record (.716) and the Scots stand at 1426-739 (.659). This week's game will mark the 89th meeting between the two Ohio foes, with Wittenberg holding a 48-40 edge. Incredibly, 36, or 40.9 percent of Wittenberg-Wooster games have been decided by five points or less, including 16 of the last 33, and that doesn't even include the classic triple-overtime game on Feb. 12, 2005....Also noteworthy, the Fighting Scots and Tigers have won/shared the NCAC regular season championship each of the last 18 seasons, and they've combined to win all but two NCAC Tournament titles during that span. "

And from the Witt pre-game notes:
"Also, of note, this will be the fifth time in the last seven seasons that one of the two teams has been ranked No. 1 nationally entering the game. Amazingly, the homestanding No. 1 squad has lost in each instance"

Where else can you find such a nationally important game that also has the watermark of a classic rivalry? I've never heard of it in D3 sports, but I was hoping someone else may have... honestly, I'm a little bit confounded by how this game doesn't get more front page coverage on D3hoops.com. But maybe it's just me...

tigerup07, Pat Coleman came to Texas last weekend for 10 games and 8 schools/16 teams on 5 days, the Tour de Tejas (http://www.d3hoops.com/features/).  The attraction for this trip was that five of the 16 teams that he saw were ranked in pre-season polls.  The feature game was the intra-city rivalry between McM at Hardin-Simmons on Monday night. 

The HSU women were ranked #9; McMurry #14.  The Cowgirls and McMurry Women played before 1728 fans!  I looked at the Witt 2006 women's basketball archives and saw that the Woo and Witt Ladies played before 264 fans at Wooster and before 502 fans at Witt.  I anticipate that the return trip to McMurry in January, as the Abilene Kiwanis Club Charity Games, will draw more than 2000 fans as it did in 2005 (http://www.d3hoops.com/gallery.php?gallery=36835).   McMurry and HSU women played four times in 2000, home and home, ASC tourney and in the Sweet 16. Last year they played home and home and in the first round of the NCAA's.  How would you feel if Witt and Woo played in the first round of the men's NCAA's?

Pat commented that the fervor of the intra-city rival in Abilene is not found in Wilkes PA, New London CT or Northfield MN.  Listen to Pat's last second call of the HSU-McM men's game. (http://www.d3hoops.com/audio/06/HSUthreetowinit.mp3)  HSU and McMurry men will also compete for the ASC-West title.

The nature of the various rivalries around the country is like a closet of fine wines or a showroom of expensive sports cars.  Each is different and special for its own reasons.

Hope-Calvin is the best rivalry.

McMurry-Hardin-Simmons may be the best intra-city rivary, all sports.
Witt-Woo especially men's basketball,
Monon Bell -- DePauw-Wabash -- football
Cortaca Jug -- Ithaca and Cortland State --football
Williams Amherst -- all-sports
The various Dutch shoe games...

Witt/Woo will be on the front page later in the season.  We D3 fans loved to follow that one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 09, 2006, 02:03:22 PM
I was watching ESPN earlier this week and they were showing the 10 ten football rivalries. I can't recall the exact list and order (OSU-Michigan was #2 and Alabama-Auburn was #1). At the end of the show they showed the consolation list which included Wabash-DePauw. The narrative was "These two schools just flat out hate each other"....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 09, 2006, 03:38:20 PM
Quote from: goscots on December 09, 2006, 02:03:22 PMAt the end of the show they showed the consolation list which included Wabash-DePauw. The narrative was "These two schools just flat out hate each other"....

And you Witt guys think Wally hates you? Ha! You're like a brand-new puppy compared to Depauw.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 09, 2006, 04:31:34 PM
 Final out of Richmond
 Earlham 69 Kenyon 60   Earlham had 4 players in double-digits LaRon Henry lead the way with 23 points and both Neil Collins and Markcous Jewett played a solid game.   1st win of the year for EC  1-1 in the NCAC /color]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 09, 2006, 05:20:04 PM
Quote from: goscots on December 09, 2006, 02:03:22 PM
I was watching ESPN earlier this week and they were showing the 10 ten football rivalries. I can't recall the exact list and order (OSU-Michigan was #2 and Alabama-Auburn was #1). At the end of the show they showed the consolation list which included Wabash-DePauw. The narrative was "These two schools just flat out hate each other"....
Personally, I cant believe ESPiN would rank Auburn-Alabama ahead of Michigan-Ohio State?!  I've read several polls that rank Michigan-Ohio State as the best rivalry in all of sports, let alone college football. ::)

As far as DIII rivalries go, I'm just going by basketball here since this is a basketball forum.  Besides, most of us in here are pretty familiar with the heated rivalry that goes along with the Monon Bell.  As far as basketball rivalries go, no doubt about Hope and Calvin being far ahead of the rest.  I don't think it's too much of a stretch to put Witt-Woo at #2 on that list though.  When you bring in all of the factors:  #1 and #2 winningest programs in DIII, conference championship implications every time they meet winning or sharing the NCAC regular season championship in each of the last 18 years, and not to mention the recent national ranking implications with this being the 5th time that one of these 2 teams has come into the game with the #1 ranking in the last 7 years and in each of those games, the #1 ranked team fell (that's going to change tonight ;) ).

I wish I could be down in Springfield tonight in person cheering on the Scots to victory, but having 3 young kids running around my house makes it difficult to get away.  I will be glued to my radio enjoying several Christmas Ales by the fire though and I might check out the live video stream as well.  I wonder how well it will match up with Wooster's play by play over the radio?

Good luck to both teams tonight in what should be another epic chapter of this great rivalry!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 09, 2006, 05:21:38 PM
Final Scores:

Allegheny 73  Ohio Wesleyan 70  OT
Olivet Nazarene 75  Wabash 60
Hiram  74  Oberlin 69
Earlham 69  Kenyon 60
Denison is Idle today

Just one NCAC contest left to be played in Springfield tonight!  ;D

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 09, 2006, 06:06:23 PM
From the way the early season has gone that Allegheny  win is a pretty good and surprising upset.  :o


There are a number of hidden gem rivalries around D3, they just simply don't get any publicity.  99.9% of Ohio doesn't even know Witt/Woo are playing tonight let alone that its iimportant.  Which is to bad but all the same just fine with me.

It really is a shame that Wabash and DePauw don't play in the same conference anymore, that is a very intense rivalry.   Someday maybe DePauw will come to their senses like Rose-Hulman and come back north.  They would be an interesting addition to the NCAC.


Any links to live scoreboards or anything tonight?



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 09, 2006, 06:55:54 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 09, 2006, 05:21:38 PM
Final Scores:

Allegheny 73  Ohio Wesleyan 70  OT
Hiram  74  Oberlin 69

Just one NCAC contest left to be played in Springfield tonight!  ;D

GO SCOTS!

Wow, talk about grabbing your attention with some of those scores?!  Is Allegheny for real???  These are the kinds of losses that I thought OWU was finally putting behind them.  They can't afford to lose games like this and expect to challenge the two W's for the NCAC championship.

Quote from: sac on December 09, 2006, 06:06:23 PM
Any links to live scoreboards or anything tonight?

Here is a live internet video (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/sportsnetwork/) link from Wittenberg.

Wooster also offers live internet audio broadcast and live basketball stats.  Here is the link:  Wooster Interactive (http://www.wooster.edu/interactive/) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 09, 2006, 08:21:42 PM
At the Half:   Wooster 36  Wittenberg 34

This was a very slow paced game in the first half with lots of fouls and both teams in the bonus.

Wooster is being led by Tom Port with 10 points, James Cooper with 7 points and Brandon Johnson with 7 points.  Wittenberg is being led by Dane Borchers with 10 points and Jack Hemenway with 10 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 09, 2006, 08:35:52 PM
The two Witt announcers are doing a phenomenal job.  Thanks guys for the first half.

By the way, I was trying to listen to the WQKT commentary (and watch the Witt video) but there appears to be no audio online even though I am connecting to their servers without any problems.  Are you guys having the same problem as well?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 09, 2006, 08:44:08 PM
sac-

Wabash/Depauw back in the ICAC days was awesome.  The rivalry has been a little lopsided (in the favor of the bad guys) since they left for the SCAC.  Back in my day in the late 90s, Wabash/Depauw games were absolutely insane.  Packed gyms, loud loud loud, and pretty good basketball on both sides.  The more recent games have been tainted pretty badly by scheduling....a lot of the games in the post ICAC era have been played on or near holiday breaks which has really hurt attendance.  Wabash had great rivarly-esque games with a lot of the ICAC teams in the late 90s.  Games against RHIT, Franklin, Anderson, Hanover were always tough and were always fun to be at.  The only thing about the ICAC that I really miss is hoops season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on December 09, 2006, 08:55:08 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 09, 2006, 05:20:04 PM
Quote from: goscots on December 09, 2006, 02:03:22 PM
I was watching ESPN earlier this week and they were showing the 10 ten football rivalries. I can't recall the exact list and order (OSU-Michigan was #2 and Alabama-Auburn was #1). At the end of the show they showed the consolation list which included Wabash-DePauw. The narrative was "These two schools just flat out hate each other"....
Personally, I cant believe ESPiN would rank Auburn-Alabama ahead of Michigan-Ohio State?!  I've read several polls that rank Michigan-Ohio State as the best rivalry in all of sports, let alone college football. ::)
...

goscots, how many times have you ever seen a sign in an Ohio business establishment that counts the number of days until the UMichigan game?

Or another sign to this effect...

My 2 favorite teams are Alabama (or Auburn) and whoever is playing Auburn (or Alabama)?

Those things are very common all over the state of Alabama.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 09, 2006, 09:24:51 PM
Final:  Wooster 68  Wittenberg 65  ;D

Wooster led by 10 points in the 2nd half (54-44) but Wittenberg came all the way back to take the lead at 62-60 with ~2 minutes left.  Brandon Johnson and Tom Port then each hit big three pointers to regain the lead for the Scots.  Devin Fulk nailed two critical free throws with just 7 seconds left in the game.

Wooster was led by Brandon Johnson with 18 points, Tom Port with 13 points and James Cooper with 11 points.  Jack Hemenway led Witt with 20 points,  Dane Borchers added 18 points and Gregg Hill also had 18 points.  Hemenway narrowly missed a tying three point shot right at the buzzer.

Wooster is now 7-0. :)  Next up is Cedarville next Saturday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 09, 2006, 09:31:45 PM
What a gutsy play by Tom Port towards the end of the game!  Woo down by two with less than a minute to go, if I am not mistaken, he grabbed an offensive rebound, instead of attacking the basket, as we were all expecting him to, he took the ball out and sunk a three!  Incredible!

Once again great job by Scott Leo and Rob Lehner, the guys who called the game for Wittenberg.  Nothing but class guys.   Thank you on behalf of all those who watched your broadcast online.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 09, 2006, 09:32:52 PM
Ralph,

When Tressel was introduced as the OSU coach, he specified the number of days until the UM game!

And my favorite teams are xxx and whoever is playing yyy is absolutely standard for both Ohioans and Michiganders.  (Though personally I prefer that OSU be undefeated when we meet them - it makes the victory that much sweeter!) ;)

(I'll have to tally sometime how many times UM and OSU have knocked the other out of a national title shot - it's got to be at least 8-9, maybe more!)

'bama-Auburn is a state (or at most, regional) killer rivalry; UM-OSU is a national rivalry.  I'd say that on a national level the only comparison would be Army-Navy (back when they were good).  Or, perhaps, for a few years (but long gone now), Oklahoma-Nebraska.

And, BTW, congrats to Woo!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on December 09, 2006, 09:38:10 PM
Great win by Wooster. It was great to get the chance to watch the game as well. It seemed to me that the game was played at Witt's pace. A very good win for Wooster, at Witt played at Witt's pace. Well done Alma Mater.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 09, 2006, 10:05:46 PM
Good game all the way around - another classic from what we expected from these two.  I was lined up with the hoop on Hemenway's final three, and it went like this: backboard, front rim, backboard, front rim, out; THAT's how close we were to overtime (it should also be mentioned that the 2 JV games played a great game before the varsity game, with Woo winning by 3 in OT, so a good night of basketball all around).

Wooster made some big plays down the end, and Witt had a couple of huge turnovers in the final 90 seconds (Borchers drops a pass in the lane when he was wide open up by 2, Denbow throws the ball away down by one).  I'm looking forward to the rematch in Wooster. 

However, if Wooster wants to make a run nationally this year, they HAVE to improve their interior defense.  Borchers, Hemenway, and even Mark Huelsman pounded it at will down low - I'm just shocked the Tigers didn't go inside more than they did.

Also, if anybody from the NCAC is reading this, PLEASE find better officiating crews.  There were numerous just downright terrible calls made for/against both teams tonight, and it really left a bitter taste in my mouth after what was a great game from all the players.  No wonder as soon as Jack's final 3 went out the officials sprinted - not walked, not jogged, but sprinted - off the court.

One final note, it was nice to finally meet up with some of you today (specifically DC and WooBoo) - you guys proved that there are plenty of Wooster fans out there who are class acts, and hopefully John and myself proved that not all Witt students are a bunch of drunk, expletive-yelling students.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on December 09, 2006, 10:07:18 PM
Alright, we know the final score. My opinion, the ref's were pretty bad. Missing calls against Wooster and making up calls against Witt. I know everyone says that when they lose, but I'd like some feedback to see if I was just prejudiced. Cooper traveled more than he got called for it and he was pushing off of his defender both to get passes and to put up shots. But, to his credit, the guy's got an incredible shot... Witt could have defended him better but he's just so good.

Second, any opinions on how tonight's game affects national rankings? A game this close and hard fought in my opinion can only move Witt up in the rankings. I hope to see a spot or two improvement this week.

On the topic of game pace, I think Witt slowed it down when they could. Mostly Witt runs a slow offense and they did that tonight. But Wooster was pushing almost every offensive possession, testing Witt's speed, which isn't great with guys like Hemenway, Borchers, and Huelsman on the floor.

Great game, for the most part good sportsmanship from the student sections (the S*** on Witt chant still made an appearance) and the teams both played with pride. Can't wait to make the trip to Wooster on Feb. 3. Go Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on December 09, 2006, 10:14:19 PM
Thanks, Mr Ypsi! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on December 09, 2006, 10:16:32 PM
JSC and Tigerup,

You guys are definitely new to the NCAC if you're even commenting on the refs.  The rest of these guys stopped talking about them a long time ago, because its usually a given that they are bad.  Just don't even worry about them. 

Witt played some excellent defense.  Holding Port, Vandervaart, and Cooper to 13, 11, and 6 respectively is a great job.  They got beat on the boards.  Giving up 12 offensive rebound was key.  Also, those two late turnovers KILLED Witt.  Hill and Denbow both should have pulled the ball out in those situations.  I don't care if Borchers dropped it or not, run the clock out.  But, you can't fault them for being aggressive. 

Hell of a play by Port, burying the three from the corner.  Big shot.  Give Wooster credit for beating Witt in a low(er) scoring affair.  Wooster does such a great job of getting the ball up the floor. 

Can't wait to see what happens in February.  It'll be another classic Witt/Woo game for sure.  I'll be sick to my stomach, as usual.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 09, 2006, 10:19:06 PM
Reviewing the Woo-Witt final boxscore:

-Both teams made the same number of field goals (22)
-Both teams made the same number of free throws (16)
-Wooster shot a lower % but had more shot attempts than Witt
-Wooster's extra shots came from winning the boards by 7 and 3 less TO's
-Wooster made 8 three pointers; Witt made 5 (hence the 3 point margin)

Unfortunately for Witt, they may drop a couple of spots in the D3Hoops poll just because several other top 15 teams are still undefeated.  But #3 Ohio Northern lost today on their home floor by 17 points to B-W (an ugly loss) so they should drop below Wittenberg.

For the first time in recent memory, Wooster will hold on to the #1 spot in the poll after a Witt game.  :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on December 09, 2006, 10:26:09 PM
I looked at the results of most of the top 10 and yeah, witt will probably drop... not a fun thing when you only lose by 3 points to the number one team...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 09, 2006, 11:33:36 PM
ok guys i know you've been waiting for my opinions on the game so here they are

- first off what more can u ask for in a game between the top 2 teams in the conference-no offense- everything was included in that game-runs by both teams-big time shots-horrible NCAC refs lol i think all witt fans can agree-and another close game between the teams.

- i think witt and wooster had some big time guys step up-gregg hill, hemingway and borchers for witt played tremendous-hemingway was huge when we need him to be. brandon johnson had a good game for the scots and of course unfortunately port had to hit another big shot against us after doing little to nothing during the course of the game. great atmosphere all around for the game too, although its kinda crappy that you get kicked out of ur seat by stupid football players who think they "desrve" the front row when u were the first student there.........

one more thing-wooster fans-"**** on witt" come on why do u have to end the game on a sour note after a hard fought game between the two teams-talk about us being classy?????????
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 09, 2006, 11:36:23 PM
Quote from: Ralph Turner on December 09, 2006, 08:55:08 PMgoscots, how many times have you ever seen a sign in an Ohio business establishment that counts the number of days until the UMichigan game?

Or another sign to this effect...

My 2 favorite teams are Alabama (or Auburn) and whoever is playing Auburn (or Alabama)?

Those things are very common all over the state of Alabama.

I'll take a quick opportunity to pimp my second-favorite rivalry: Texas vs. Texas A&M. It's not just about sports. It's about culture. They are two vastly different schoos with different cultures and they represent different constituencies of the state. It's much more than a football game.

If anyone is interested in a good read about the rivalry from an off-the-field prespective I'd recommend this book (http://www.amazon.com/Backyard-Brawl-Inside-Blood-Between/dp/0609610538/sr=1-1/qid=1165725058/ref=pd_bbs_1/002-4922653-3868862?ie=UTF8&s=books).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 09, 2006, 11:36:56 PM
Just back from Witt!  

This game was all that we've come to expect the last few years.  Close, hard-fought, tense, and down to the last play.  I thought that both teams played excellent defense.  Witt did a nice job of controlling the pace of the game and forcing Wooster to slow things down.  The Scots led nearly the whole game, but to Witt's credit they fought back and took the lead and had a chance to all but ice the game.  However, good defensive pressure by Wooster forced a couple turnovers and Wooster was finally able to hit the big shots when they needed them.  

I thought the difference in the game was on the boards.  Wooster had six different players with at least four rebounds.  Witt had Borchers.  The Scots had 9 more second-chance points, including the big 3 by Port near the end.

Should be another good one in February!

Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 10, 2006, 12:08:54 AM
One other footnote given today's NCAC results....

Wooster at 3-0 is the only remaining undefeated team in the conference race.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2006, 01:23:36 AM
Just a few brief reactions before I head to bed after a very long day.

Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 09, 2006, 10:19:06 PM
For the first time in recent memory, Wooster will hold on to the #1 spot in the poll after a Witt game.

Not just recent memory, but ever.  First time in the brief history of the D3Hoops.com Top 25 poll that the team ranked #1 coming into this game won the game.

It was a great game, good defensive struggle, another stomach twisting nail biter.  How Hemenway's 3-ball stayed out of the hoop I'll never know.  Port's three was not going to be a putback, he got the offensive rebound while headed right to left along the baseline; his momentum was carrying him away from the hoop, and he was stumbling over a downed Witt player to boot.  To take the ball to the corner, then turn and drain it was amazing, and needless to say a huge shot.

Yes the officiating was terrible.  I think it's a big reason why the Witt bigs were able to be so effective down low.  In the first half alone, the men guarding Borchers drew a collective 9 fouls (2 apiece from Port, Vandervaart--the second evidently with his nose, and Bidwell, and 3 on Will) while Borchers was called for none.  Early in the game, they had Borchers pretty well neutralized.  The last 30 minutes of the game the Wooster post defenders had to sag off their man to avoid the whistle, and that gave both Borchers and Hemenway room to operate.  But what can you say?  Refs are a necessary evil, you just have to take what they give you and play on.  (The refs in the women's game, another thriller in a day of thrillers, won by Witt, were even worse than in the men's games.)

Vandervaart's bloody nose kept him out of much of the first half, and Port's quick 3rd and 4th fouls kept him out of a lot of the 2nd half, and yet Wooster was still able to pull out the win on Witt's turf--I think that's mighty impressive.

I thought Johnson's game on offense and Bidwell's game on defense were particularly impressive.  At the other end, Borchers had another good game, and Hemenway and Hill were big, especially Hill hitting some big, deep threes late.

It was good to meet jscwittfan and tigerup07, and I had a nice long conversation with the Witt SID, Ryan Maurer, as well.  Good folks all.  I apologize to 1973, who said he'd try to meet up with us at halftime.  I was so wrapped up in the game that I forgot all about it and didn't even go out at halftime--sorry.  :-\

And I apologize for the '**** on Witt cheer,'  I probably like it less than you do.  Although if there were an expletive (stronger than 'poo') that rhymed with 'Woo,' I suppose we'd have heard that too.  Classless, but not unexpected.   

Yes, Calvin/Hope is far and away the best D3 hoops rivalry.  Heck, tonight's game at Witt wasn't even a sellout, although I guess the all-reserved-seating ticket policy might have had something to do with that.  It was nearly full; attendance listed at 2920.

How about Allegheny?  Who'd have thought that the biggest news in the conference on a Witt/Woo day would come from the OWU/'Gheny game?  Big boost for Witt and Woo to have OWU pick up that loss. 

Pete--too bad you couldn't come, but we did see your honorary red folding chair, with plaque and all.  You'll be proud to know that it was occupied all night by end-of-the-bench players for Wooster.   ;D ;)

I would expect Witt to stay right about where they are in the next poll, probably ONU will drop below them.

That's enough for tonight.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 10, 2006, 09:13:34 AM
QuoteAlright, we know the final score. My opinion, the ref's were pretty bad. Missing calls against Wooster and making up calls against Witt.

19 Fouls called on each team...Witt shoots one more free throw.  You may not have liked the officiating but from North Georgia it appears pretty fair.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 10, 2006, 09:37:38 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on December 10, 2006, 09:13:34 AM
QuoteAlright, we know the final score. My opinion, the ref's were pretty bad. Missing calls against Wooster and making up calls against Witt.

19 Fouls called on each team...Witt shoots one more free throw.  You may not have liked the officiating but from North Georgia it appears pretty fair.

Wooster was shooting the one and one at the 9:34 mark while Wooster being only "called" with 3 fouls at the same time period.  Fair? I guess it only depends on your perspective.  ::)

-------

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 10, 2006, 09:42:54 AM
Also, as talked about before, where is  the modify button to change a person's post. It does not show for me.

Only buttons I have are delete and quote.

w4e
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2006, 09:57:53 AM
I think 'modify' only appears after some minimum number of posts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 10, 2006, 10:04:04 AM
Wooster Daily Record story on the game: http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1158602

Includes Port's comments about his three point shot.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 10, 2006, 10:04:43 AM
Tim Vandervaart received a bloody nose and was issued a foul for doing so.  Both Brandon Johnson and Marty Bidwell took shots to the face, in the eye.  No fouls were called on Wittenberg, as this sort of behaviour is apparently condoned on their court.

At the other end, whenever Vandervaart, Port, or Bidwell offered the slightest bit of resistance with their bodies to the incessent backing in of Borchers or Hemenway they drew a whistle.  Vandervaart and Port spent long stretches of the game on the bench because of this ridiculous home cooking which extended even into the J.V. game.

You wonder why Wooster fans and other teams hate Wittenberg?  It's because they play borderline dirty basketball, the officials allow them to get away with it, and their fans turn a blind eye.  Wooster won a basketball game, I should be happy, but even the next day my feelings are only about the whole lousy experience of watching that game in Springfield.

And there's also this.  Charging $8 as a separate admission for the women's game, which was essentially part of the tripleheader, is bull****.  I dare anyone to find another DIII school that has the nerve to ask for that much money to a women's game at all.

Congrats to the Wooster team for once again fighting through all the garbage that is Wittenberg and Springfield.  I only hope that they didn't walk out of the gym with the same bitter taste that I did.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 10, 2006, 10:15:08 AM
Witt-Woo game article from the Springfield News-Sun:
http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/s/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2006/12/09/snssp121006wittgamer.html

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 10, 2006, 11:48:09 AM
Quote from: anonymous2 on December 10, 2006, 09:37:38 AM
Wooster was shooting the one and one at the 9:34 mark while Wooster being only "called" with 3 fouls at the same time period.  Fair? I guess it only depends on your perspective.  ::)

"Fair" has nothing to do with how many fouls were called against each team or who was in the bonus.  "Fair" is calling the game the same way on both ends, and making the same calls consistently throughout the game.

In the first half Borchers was able to get the ball down low, back into any number of Scot defenders and get a foul called.  In the 2nd half, it didn't seem like Borchers was as aggressive toward the bucket, thus fewer fouls.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on December 10, 2006, 12:34:47 PM
As for Wittenberg being garbage... I don't even think I need to make a comment specifically in response to that. We all know that Wooster and Wittenberg are essentially the same school in different locations (but Wittenberg's got the edge on campus aesthetics, I think). Funny story, Wittenberg was started as a small college in the city of Wooster, Ohio, in 1845, but moved to Springfield after only a year. Even in 1845 Wittenberg students, administration, and faculty couldn't stand to be in Wooster.

And as for the fouls to the eye and the dirty play Witt supposedly used, the only times I saw anything that might be considered dirty was in scrambles for loose balls. There's a rule in the books that even the refs I don't think know about... it summarily states that loose balls are fair game for either team, and players have the right to use whatever physical means to obtain the ball, as long as those means are not specifically intended to injure an opposing player. The refs called fouls on Wittenberg during loose ball scrambles that any learned ref would've kept quiet on. Then when Wittenberg had obviously won other scrambles and a Wooster player just decides to lay his hands all over the Witt player who has the ball, they call it a jump ball... mysteriously this only seemed to happen when possession was for Wooster. Overall, the refs just didn't know what they were doing. And it hurt both teams. Once again, the NCAC has proven to have horrible officiating.... we all know it, let's leave it be.

I know I made fun of Wooster earlier in this post, but that's simply tit for tat for the garbage comment. I'd prefer that the university which has been home to 24 of my relatives including my father, mother, aunts, uncles, grandparents, greatgrandparents, and now me for 4 of the best years of my life (brief as it may be so far) be called garbage because you didn't want to pony up $8 for a game which you obviously thought wasn't worth as much as a men's game. I refer you to Title IX...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 10, 2006, 01:02:38 PM
Quote from: tigerup07 on December 10, 2006, 12:34:47 PM
We all know that Wooster and Wittenberg are essentially the same school in different locations.

Huh?  Maybe Wittenberg students would like to believe that, but you won't find a single member of the COW community who would react to that statement with anything but a loud laugh.

Quote from: tigerup07 on December 10, 2006, 12:34:47 PMFunny story, Wittenberg was started as a small college in the city of Wooster, Ohio, in 1845, but moved to Springfield after only a year. Even in 1845 Wittenberg students, administration, and faculty couldn't stand to be in Wooster.

No, after a year Wooster had had enough of them and threw them out on their ear.

I didn't want to spend $8 for the women's game because A) that's too much to charge for any DIII basketball game, men's or women's and B) it so obviously should have been considered part of the three-game package.

Few people spend more money on women's sporting events than I do, and I've never had a problem with the ticket prices at any other school.  Virtually all of them, when having a women's/men's event in the same time frame, link the two games to one admission price, that of the men's game.  In tournament situations, there is always an all-day pass of 5 or 6 bucks.  This is the first time I've ever encountered having to pay $16 in this manner at a DIII instutition, and I think it's incredibly lame.

Sorry to hear that none of your family members could get into a better school.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 10, 2006, 01:37:37 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 10, 2006, 01:02:38 PM
Quote from: tigerup07 on December 10, 2006, 12:34:47 PM
We all know that Wooster and Wittenberg are essentially the same school in different locations.

Huh?  Maybe Wittenberg students would like to believe that, but you won't find a single member of the COW community who would react to that statement with anything but a loud laugh.

Unfortunately, John, I have to disagree with you on that one.  Wittenberg and Wooster are very much different schools.  Especially academically.  Just ask James Cooper about his ACT scores and what Wittenberg thought of them in comparison to Wooster.

Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 10, 2006, 01:02:38 PM
Sorry to hear that none of your family members could get into a better school.

Whether you're just defending your school or not, that is an absolute asshole thing to say.  At least we don't go to a school where the home team for some sports trash the visitor's locker room with dirty diapers hanging in each locker and that oh-so-famous "**** on Witt" written all over the walls of the room.  Now THAT's a classy institution.  (and by the way, yes, there was a Wooster team that did that this season)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on December 10, 2006, 01:40:16 PM
Well, well, well, the truth comes out.  Mr. Wooster Booster hates Wittenberg.  ANd I thought we were all about respect for the last couple days. 

You really think Witt plays dirty?  Was this a big rivalry game?  Sure it is.  Were kids diving all over the floor?  I could see it on the internet.  I didn't see what happened do Vandervaart, but no one was trying to hurt him.  There is never, ever a word spoken of dirty play in Witt's program.  Physical play? Absolutely.  Does Wooster play physical?  Yes.  When to teams are playing hard and physical basketball, is someone going to get popped in the nose?  Most likely. 

Are you really inferring that Witt has something to do with the refs?  Honestly.  Is someone playing puppet master with D3 officials?  Do you know something I don't?  NCAC refs are notoriously bad, and don't call the game consistently.  Sometimes Witt will have and advantage, and sometimes Wooster will. 

Everything you have whined about is out of the fans control.  The ticket prices, the refs, and the "dirty" play.  Oh, and you disparaged my alma mater.  Thanks.  I love having people tell me where I came from is worthless. 

Oh and good one about Wooster throwing Witt out in 1845.  Thats an issue that EVERYONE is still talking about. 

Anyway, Witt showed me somethings last night.  1) The defense is tough.  2) they can step up in big games.  3)  Late mistakes are still a problem. 

They did a better job not playing hard the whole game.  They had been so up and down in their effort, turning it on and off, but if you can't play hard for 40 min against Wooster, then clean out your locker.  I hope Gregg Hill can keep his offensive momentum, as it relives pressure and double teams from Dane. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2006, 01:43:53 PM
I think I may take a couple of days off from this room.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 10, 2006, 02:24:50 PM
Perhaps, we should all remember that the NCAC is a great conference with 10 schools that have both strong academics and excellent sports programs. :)

The NCAC will be an even classier conference if we (all NCAC fans) show the proper respect for the other 9 schools.

Poor officiating, high ticket prices for womens' games and aggressive play on the hardwood are not good reasons to question the quality or integrity of another NCAC school.

How about some "peace and goodwill to others" during this holiday season? :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 10, 2006, 02:35:19 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi14.tinypic.com%2F2labtpt.jpg&hash=ce5441319c810004fd05ace4bdd32c8b2eae3b4e)

Can't we all just get along?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 10, 2006, 03:10:55 PM
With most everyone's thoughts and feelings being already shown, I thought I'd weigh in on some of the opinions being offered on last night's classic:

Quote from: jscwittfan on December 09, 2006, 10:05:46 PM

However, if Wooster wants to make a run nationally this year, they HAVE to improve their interior defense.  Borchers, Hemenway, and even Mark Huelsman pounded it at will down low - I'm just shocked the Tigers didn't go inside more than they did.

Also, if anybody from the NCAC is reading this, PLEASE find better officiating crews.  There were numerous just downright terrible calls made for/against both teams tonight, and it really left a bitter taste in my mouth after what was a great game from all the players.  No wonder as soon as Jack's final 3 went out the officials sprinted - not walked, not jogged, but sprinted - off the court.


I don't think it was a matter of Wooster needing to improve their interior defense.  It was a matter of the poor officiating blowing their whistles on Wooster's post players for breathing too hard on the Witt players.  Heck, Vandervaart  suffers a bloody nose and still gets whistled for a foul.  And then, after being saddled with foul trouble they basically had to lay off ginving Borchers and Hemenway free reign in the post.  I'm in agreement that the officiating was equally poor for both sides.  I don't think either team gained an advantage by the poor officiating shown last night, although Vandervaart and Port's extended time on the bench because of the whistle happy refs didn't hurt Witt in their bid for the upset.

Quote from: pennstghs on December 09, 2006, 11:33:36 PM
ok guys i know you've been waiting for my opinions on the game so here they are
- i think witt and wooster had some big time guys step up-gregg hill, hemingway and borchers for witt played tremendous-hemingway was huge when we need him to be.

Yeah, and without them stepping up like they did who knows how bad Wooster could have poured it on.  The 3 players you mentioned scored 56 of Witt's 65 points last night. :o  To say those 3 guys kept Witt in the game is the understatement of all understatements.

Quote from: pennstghs on December 09, 2006, 11:33:36 PM
one more thing-wooster fans-"**** on witt" come on why do u have to end the game on a sour note after a hard fought game between the two teams-talk about us being classy?????????
I totally agree.  I cringe every time I hear that chant being started and my thought is, can't you guys come up with a little more class and ori. than that???  Unfortunately, it's just something I'm afraid we're stuck with.

Quote from: petewitt54 on December 10, 2006, 01:40:16 PM
Oh and good one about Wooster throwing Witt out in 1845.  Thats an issue that EVERYONE is still talking about. 

Actually, pete, it was tigerup who brought up the whole 1845 thing:

Quote from: tigerup07 on December 10, 2006, 12:34:47 PM
Funny story, Wittenberg was started as a small college in the city of Wooster, Ohio, in 1845, but moved to Springfield after only a year. Even in 1845 Wittenberg students, administration, and faculty couldn't stand to be in Wooster.

One final thought, after reading the article of the game from the Springfield fish wrap, I found it funny that Witt were the ones that felt they let one slip away.  How do you think Wooster would have felt had they lost having let a 10 point lead evaporate over the last 4 minutes of the game?  Personally, Witt was more on the verge of stealing a victory than letting one slip away...

Oh and I agree with wsf in that the NCAC is a conference that was founded on academics.  Every institution in the NCAC has a proud academic heritage to stand on.  The athletic prowess of certain schools in the conference may not be equal, but academically speaking, they are all top notch.  It's not like comparing Ohio State and Michigan here... 8) ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 10, 2006, 04:19:03 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 10, 2006, 09:57:53 AM
I think 'modify' only appears after some minimum number of posts.

I guess I'll keep posting up and see where the magical number is.

And/or email Pat to restore my previous Post Up name:witt4ever

After last night more than ever,
w4e
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 10, 2006, 04:38:41 PM
Here is something to read to keep things into perspective:

http://zeke.phpnet.us/wittbb.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 10, 2006, 06:43:53 PM
Quote from: anonymous2 on December 10, 2006, 04:38:41 PM
Here is something to read to keep things into perspective:

http://zeke.phpnet.us/wittbb.html

I enjoyed this article.  It's pretty cool that they got together like that.  That seems to be what D3 basketball should be about, particularly with schools of rich tradition, including sports, academics, and religious background.

I also read the story in the NY Times about the Lincoln - OSU- Marion game.
Marion only had five guys.  I'm not sure what I think about that score now.  I read the comments of both coaches.  I suspect that the game got beyond the Lincoln coach's control at some point.  I think maybe the coach had a better sense of sportsmanship than some of his players did.

I just got out here on the board and there is a lot to go through.

The game was great.  **** on Witt was not necessary.  This is probably more upsetting from a sportsmanship view than the Lincoln thing.

I think there will be a great rematch in Wooster this winter.  Perhaps more in the tournament season ...

TigerFan_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 10, 2006, 06:47:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 10, 2006, 01:43:53 PM
I think I may take a couple of days off from this room.  :-\

Yeah, me too.  Things seem a little harsh today.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on December 10, 2006, 07:19:30 PM
Sorry for getting upset everyone. As I've said before, I have a longstanding family tradition at Wittenberg and I genuinely love the school and I am going to be extremely sad to leave after I graduate in 6 months. I felt directly provoked by a couple comments and when that happens my typically swelled pride kicks into overdrive and I tend to be easily angered. Combine that with losing at home to our biggest rival for the third straight time and that's what you get.

But anyway, on to better and brighter things. Witt has a nice long break, as does Wooster, and I can't wait to see how the rest of conference play goes before our rematch. I will definitely be in Wooster the weekend that Witt visits (and the second weekend that Witt visits for the playoffs). I will be my fraternity's Pledge Educator and I am going to make the trip to Wooster a pledge event! It will be a good game and the Athletic Director at Witt always does a good job to get students excited but he also tries to make sure the students are well behaved (and the Wooster police department gets in on that aspect too, but that's a whole 'nother can of worms).

My trips to Wooster, as much as the rivalry is heated, are always enjoyable and I really look forward to it. Wittenberg and Wooster were the two schools I was down to when college came around. They were both equally prestigious academically and both campuses were beautiful, and when you get right down to it the factors were all equal, and Wittenberg won because of my family history. My friends that went to Wooster seem to be enjoying themselves as much as we Witt students do (as well as agreeing with me that the schools are very comparable, without laughing). Both schools deserve respect, and I love the rivalry. Good luck to both!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 10, 2006, 09:11:09 PM
Any D3 school that has a golf course on campus gets the nod over any school that doesn't in my book. ;D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 10, 2006, 09:16:10 PM
Well, I see that by not posting my thoughts on this game for 24 hours means that I've already missed all the nice, respectful discussions of last night's game.   ??? ???  I understand we're involved in a fierce rivalry here, but I guess I hadn't realized that "rivalry" included "demean everything you can think of about the other school..."

Wittenberg and Wooster both have outstanding academic reputations, like every school in this conference.  It probably wouldn't hurt us all to show a bit more of that college education in our d3hoops posts, too.    ::)  Wooster fans might do well to remember that our current coach is a Wittenberg graudate, and we generally seem to think he's a pretty smart guy...so he just might have gotten a decent education somewhere along the line.

I detest with a passion the "*^#& on Witt" cheer.  I never joined it when I was a student, and it always makes me feel ashamed to be wearing Wooster colors at the game when our students/my peers decide that such a cheer was somehow in line with the notion of rooting or supporting your team.  It is unfortunate that Wooster's students can't seem to use their education either when devising anything to yell across the gym.

Now, my thoughts on the game.

Reading some of the reactions in here, I feel that at times maybe I was watching a different basketball game than some of the other posters.  Yes, there was plenty of defensive intensity.  There was certainly plenty of physical play, if not overly physical play.  My read on the officiating was that, as is typical in this matchup, there are simply too many fouls to be called for them to possibily call all of them, so there are blantent mis-calls or non-calls on both sides.  It's hard to be perfectly or even marginally consistent in a game where there's so much contact that each time down the floor you could call about 2-3 fouls.  In fact, I felt that particularly in the last 10 minutes of the first half, all we were doing was trading fouls/foul shots, and that the flow of the game had disappeared because of all the fouling and free throws.  I thought it was a gritty half, but not a particularly great half of basketball.  I felt the same way about some of the second half, as well.

I want to give credit to Borchers, Hill and Hemingway.  Obviously they came to play and performed well.  In all the games that I've seen Borchers, I feel like he always draws plenty of fouls, which, since he's usually nearly automatic from the line, means easy points for Witt.  Borchers will alwasy get the ball low and lean back into his defender, then bump him back, bump him back, bump him back while dribbling, then put on the spin move and one last bump into the defender that seems to often result in a blocking foul while Borchers is free to use his excellent touch around the hoop to attempt an old-fashioned three point play.  I've always felt that this move is unfair to defenders because it always seems that Borchers is initiating all the contact, and sometimes even seeming to really lower the shoulder in on his spin move, and yet he never appears to get an offensive foul whistled on him.

For Wooster, this was my first chance to see them in person this year, and I basically felt like this matchup and the physical play didn't allow me to get a good sense for just how good they might be this year.  Vandervaart was neutralized by injury and foul trouble, Port by foul trouble, too, and Woo played mostly at Witt's slower, half-court tempo.  Johnson brings more athleticism to the point position than Witucky did- and he is more offensively-minded, as well.

I will say this though- Wooster is as talented, or more talented than last year.  Witt is not- at least, they haven't quite replaced Russ and Brady yet.  And so I'm actually very surprised that this was a 3-point game that Wooster escaped with last night. It might be an excellent game in Wooster come Feburary, but I think Wooster shows its talent better at home and ends up winning by 10-15.

Well, I think that's enough for one post.   :) :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 10, 2006, 10:06:46 PM
Quote from: tigerup07 on December 09, 2006, 11:05:26 AM
honestly, I'm a little bit confounded by how this game doesn't get more front page coverage on D3hoops.com. But maybe it's just me...

D3hoops.com and D3football.com are run by zero full-time staffers. Each of us does this out of our own free time. On December Saturdays, our time is especially limited because we are also dealing with Division III football playoffs. Something has to give, and that's the thought of previewing any basketball games. You'll have to live with postgame coverage, sorry.

If the game were at Wooster we could've been there in person, though. Much closer to Mount Union.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 10, 2006, 10:17:11 PM
Quote from: Witt4ever on December 10, 2006, 04:19:03 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 10, 2006, 09:57:53 AM
I think 'modify' only appears after some minimum number of posts.

I guess I'll keep posting up and see where the magical number is.

And/or email Pat to restore my previous Post Up name:witt4ever

After last night more than ever,
w4e

Please use the same username and password you used to make this post.

However: I have combined your previous data in here in terms of karma (+1) and total number of posts (120). And your name will display as witt4ever. But your username and password will not change.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 11, 2006, 12:45:15 AM
UC-Clermont is actually a 4-year school, too. So it should count. AND they are transitioning to D-3 if I understand.

They play a lot of Ohio-Name Your Branch schools but seem to have also scheduled some D-3 schools in order to get ready for the switch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 11, 2006, 01:58:34 AM
wow-things have gotten a little heated on here. a few things to sum up

i agree with petewitt definitely. you cannot offend my alma mater for reasons that are beyond our control. i am living because that disgraceful school employs my father and provides our family's income as well. your coach also did somehow graduate from such a classy institution, so i guess that's kind of eating your own words.
-yes the ticket prices were a little steep for fans, BUT the students and faculty still did get in free-this does promote more witt associates to attend the game and steer support in our favor. im sure wooster has never done any tactic to try and raise their profits at all. i mean this is the reason we have the B.S. i mean BCS still-money......and as for classless and disgraceful how about the wooster students taunting us as we walked out of the gym-bet you guys are real proud you had to have 4 cops guard our students from your students.

-as for the rough play-it is a rivalry game where teams "supposedly" let everyone lay out on the court and i feel that this was the case-the refs for the most part let the teams play-and for witt getting the calls??????? i guess this is way wooster had a 1-5 foul advantage in the second half while we were getting tacky loose ball foul calls where our guys were straihgt up as well on rebounds, but witt did get some favorable callas as did wooster-we've come to expect this from the NCAC refs--we just pray that one of their no-calls dont affect the outcome severely.

-as for the game i believe i hit it straight on that if we can neutralize their 3-point shooting with our perimeter defense we will have a chance to win-and witt nearly did-we never let cooper get streaky and hot-more spread out scoring from hiim-and got port in fouul trouble early and didnt hear anything from him until the end of the game unfortunately.

-final note....come on guys this was as competitive and fulfilling of a D3 game that one could ask for. i out of all people am remaining calm about this loss and attacks on witt as anyone. it was a GREAT game and is what college sports should be about. we dont need this banter back and forth on here about who is classless and tacky and worthless. lets just focus on the games and whats to come-i mean come on we have wooster being neutralized on the scoring end, witt's turnovers at the end, big play from big players to talk about.....

comments???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 11, 2006, 03:49:40 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 09, 2006, 10:35:37 AM
Are you saying that OSU-Marion is a two-year school?  Holy cow, what on earth was Lincoln doing scheduling them at all?

OSU-Marion is a four-year school.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 11, 2006, 04:03:45 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 09, 2006, 05:20:04 PMAs far as DIII rivalries go, I'm just going by basketball here since this is a basketball forum.  Besides, most of us in here are pretty familiar with the heated rivalry that goes along with the Monon Bell.  As far as basketball rivalries go, no doubt about Hope and Calvin being far ahead of the rest.  I don't think it's too much of a stretch to put Witt-Woo at #2 on that list though.  When you bring in all of the factors:  #1 and #2 winningest programs in DIII, conference championship implications every time they meet winning or sharing the NCAC regular season championship in each of the last 18 years, and not to mention the recent national ranking implications with this being the 5th time that one of these 2 teams has come into the game with the #1 ranking in the last 7 years and in each of those games, the #1 ranked team fell (that's going to change tonight ;)

You're forgetting about Amherst/Williams. That rivalry brings everything to the table that the Witt/Woo rivalry brings -- long-standing national powerhouses, conference championship implications, a history that includes both regular-season and postseason contests (Amherst and Williams are the only two conference foes to ever meet in the D3 Final Four; the Ephs beat the Lord Jeffs in the 2004 semis). But it also bring two things to the table that the Woo/Witt rivalry doesn't -- better geographical proximity (60 miles, as opposed to Witt & Woo's 140) and a longer and more bitter history (Amherst's original faculty and student body seceded from Williams somewhere around 1820; Williams people still refer to the Lord Jeffs as "the Defectors"). Those two schools, like Hope and Calvin, have been carrying on their private war much, much longer and more regularly in all sports (but especially football and basketball) than have Witt and Woo.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 11, 2006, 04:38:20 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 09, 2006, 09:32:52 PM'bama-Auburn is a state (or at most, regional) killer rivalry; UM-OSU is a national rivalry.  I'd say that on a national level the only comparison would be Army-Navy (back when they were good).  Or, perhaps, for a few years (but long gone now), Oklahoma-Nebraska.

Army/Navy is still the best college football rivalry. Alabama/Auburn is an intrastate rivalry. OSU/Michigan is a regional rivalry (no, Chuck, it's not national -- nobody in Montana or Georgia gives a rip about the Wolverines and the Buckeyes). Army/Navy is truly international, because just about every grunt and swabbie across the globe takes time out from his or her duties to watch or listen to the game on the Armed Forces Network. The game is the classic manifestation of the age-old rivalry between the two services that flares up every time a sergeant crosses paths with a petty officer in a bar in some remote corner of the planet. It's also a true "throw out the records" rivalry, since it matters not one whit whether both teams are good, both teams are bad, or one team's up while the other team's down.

Read John Feinstein's excellent A Civil War, and you'll understand why there really is no other rivalry in sports quite like Army/Navy. It's completely unique. The hatred is as fierce and white-hot as any rivalry anywhere (for one week a year at the U.S. Military Academy and the U.S. Naval Academy, and one week only, it's permissible to answer a direct order with "Beat Navy!" or "Beat Army!" instead of "Yes, sir!" or "Yes, ma'am!"), and because both the service academies and the services as a whole are national institutions it's a rivalry that knows no state or regional boundaries. The pageantry of the servicemen and -women in full uniform filling out their sections of the stadium is pretty amazing.

But the best part of the game is the ending. No matter who wins, and no matter how badly they beat each others' brains out, at the end of the game the players from both sides intermingle in front of the Navy section of the stadium and stand at attention as "Anchors Aweigh" is played by the Navy band, and then both teams walk over to the Army section and stand at attention as the USMA Alma Mater is played by the Army band.

There's a reason for this closing ritual, and it's a big part of why this rivalry goes beyond Alabama/Auburn, USC/UCLA, Ohio State/Michigan, and all the rest: Every member of the Corps of Cadets and the Corps of Midshipmen knows that, no matter how much he or she hates the other side, those rivals will become brothers-in-arms upon graduation. They already have a common bond, because they know that few college students besides those at the other academy truly understand just how rigorous and grueling those four years really are for them from both a mental and a physical standpoint. But when you know that the people on the other sideline will be standing with you on the firing line as fellow officers when the country calls you to duty, it puts a different spin on the rivalry than you see at other places. The hatred is tempered with a mutual respect and a commonality of larger purpose that you just don't see in the more frivolous and ephemeral world of intercollegiate sports outside of the service academies.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 11, 2006, 10:36:39 AM
Quote from: scotsbrod on December 10, 2006, 09:16:10 PM
Now, my thoughts on the game.

My read on the officiating was that, as is typical in this matchup, there are simply too many fouls to be called for them to possibily call all of them, so there are blantent mis-calls or non-calls on both sides.  It's hard to be perfectly or even marginally consistent in a game where there's so much contact that each time down the floor you could call about 2-3 fouls.  In fact, I felt that particularly in the last 10 minutes of the first half, all we were doing was trading fouls/foul shots, and that the flow of the game had disappeared because of all the fouling and free throws.  I thought it was a gritty half, but not a particularly great half of basketball.  I felt the same way about some of the second half, as well.

I have to disagree here.  I was not at the game in person, but I did watch the replay on the local cable access channel and I have to say that there were many calls, especially in the 1st half, where I thought the refs should just let the play go on.  In a game of this magnitude, the players should be dictating play, not the referees.  The reason you came away feeling as though it wasn't a 'great' half  of basketball is because the referees never allowed the flow of the game to be established because they were too busy blowing their whistles.

Quote from: scotsbrod on December 10, 2006, 09:16:10 PM
In all the games that I've seen Borchers, I feel like he always draws plenty of fouls, which, since he's usually nearly automatic from the line, means easy points for Witt.  Borchers will alwasy get the ball low and lean back into his defender, then bump him back, bump him back, bump him back while dribbling, then put on the spin move and one last bump into the defender that seems to often result in a blocking foul while Borchers is free to use his excellent touch around the hoop to attempt an old-fashioned three point play.  I've always felt that this move is unfair to defenders because it always seems that Borchers is initiating all the contact, and sometimes even seeming to really lower the shoulder in on his spin move, and yet he never appears to get an offensive foul whistled on him.

This was a problem in the 1st half.  I mean Witt had 4 trips in a row where Borchers went to the line for fouls that were called against Wooster's defenders for trying to hold their ground as Borchers backed them down.  From what I could tell, they were touch fouls at best.  The fouls were being called before Borchers was even shooting?!  I didn't really notice this as much in the 2nd half.  I think it was more of a fact that Wooster's defenders felt they had to lay off down low resulting in easy bunnies for Witt's post players.  I just don't like to see the referees feel like people came to the game to watch them which is the sense I got from this officiating crew.  As I said before, the officiating was equally poor for both sides.  I just felt like they were calling far too many silly touch fouls and as a result, didn't allow the game to flow at all.

Quote from: pennstghs on December 11, 2006, 01:58:34 AM
-as for the game i believe i hit it straight on that if we can neutralize their 3-point shooting with our perimeter defense we will have a chance to win-and witt nearly did-we never let cooper get streaky and hot-more spread out scoring from hiim-and got port in fouul trouble early and didnt hear anything from him until the end of the game unfortunately.
Witt did do a good job on their defense of James Cooper, but their perimeter defense as a whole, was not the sole reason Wooster struggled from beyond the arc on Saturday night.  Wooster was getting plenty of open looks that just weren't dropping.  And as for getting Port into foul trouble early, again, I think you have the referees to thank for that because I would say that at least 2 of the fouls called on Port were questionable at best.  And it's probably too bad for Witt they couldn't get #5 called on him judging by his herorics at the end of the game and all.

Witt did do what they set out to do and that is keep the scoring down and they dictated the tempo to their credit.  They also had huge nights from, what I consider their 3 best players.  Greg Hill almost single handedly brought Witt back after they fell behind by 10 late in the 2nd half.  And Hemenway has really come a long way.  He really impressed me with his play on the inside.

When it's all said and done though, as much as Witt can be pleased in their performance, I think Wooster can be equally or even more pleased to come away with this W.  To start with the game was at Witt and that's never an easy place to play.  Then your leading scorer and best post presence gets saddled with foul trouble and is basically rendered a non-factor in the game.  As if that wasn't bad enough, Port gets into foul trouble early in the 2nd half and misses significant minutes down the stretch (just not enough minutes for Witt's liking ;)).  Wittenberg totally dictates the pace of this game which is in complete contrast with what Wooster likes to do.  If you were to tell me before the game that all of these components would factor in to the game, I would have a hard time believing that Wooster would come out with a W which is exactly what they did.  Wittenberg seemed to have everything line up the way they wanted it to and they still couldn't get it done.  Can Witt get a repeat performance perhaps with a different outcome in February at Wooster?  Personally, I wouldn't count on it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: uknowme2 on December 11, 2006, 11:06:36 AM
Saturday was outstanding.  And the bickering on here is even better.

For everyone crying about the officials, I want you all to be well aware of the fact that each and everyone of you has the opportunity to officiate.  With that being said, I don't think too many of you will be jumping in line for that gig.  Sure they weren't the best, but certainly weren't the worst. 

Ultimately it comes down to this... Wooster fans felt like they should have won by 20 and the refs prevented that from happening. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 11, 2006, 11:31:18 AM
Quote from: uknowme2 on December 11, 2006, 11:06:36 AMUltimately it comes down to this... Wooster fans felt like they should have won by 20 and the refs prevented that from happening.

This has been brought up before but bears repeating.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on December 11, 2006, 12:30:47 PM
Anyone wanna talk about OWU losing?

Some things that will never change:

(1) WOOSTER folks cannot stand Wittenberg folks and vice versa.  No one is 'better' than the other.  The rivarly must be respectful in nature.  After all, SCOTS coach is Wittenberg Alum!!

(2) Children will be children and a few will ruin it for the most.  Do not judge a whole school based on the actions a few.

(3) Let's not take any of this personally.  Because for most of us in here.  We are 'Howard Cosell":  We never played in the game!!

(4)  We agree that we hate all the schools in OAC and OWU...Right?

(5) And Wabash Always Fights.

That is all I got to say about that!!

Did anyone see how bad I did on the NCAC Pick 'em...Horrible, just horrible.

Go SCOTS!! GO BENGALS.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: uknowme2 on December 11, 2006, 01:34:44 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on December 11, 2006, 12:30:47 PM

(3) Let's not take any of this personally.  Because for most of us in here.  We are 'Howard Cosell":  We never played in the game!!


Go SCOTS!! GO BENGALS.

I played in the game (on the football side).  It doesn't mean I don't respect the program.

And we do have something in common.

GO BENGALS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 11, 2006, 02:15:00 PM
another thing-why are wooster fans all edgy and jumpy-you would think you guys were on the losing end of things-i cant wait to see what happens when you guys lose........
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 11, 2006, 03:45:29 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 11, 2006, 04:38:20 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 09, 2006, 09:32:52 PM'bama-Auburn is a state (or at most, regional) killer rivalry; UM-OSU is a national rivalry.  I'd say that on a national level the only comparison would be Army-Navy (back when they were good).  Or, perhaps, for a few years (but long gone now), Oklahoma-Nebraska.

Army/Navy is still the best college football rivalry. Alabama/Auburn is an intrastate rivalry. OSU/Michigan is a regional rivalry (no, Chuck, it's not national -- nobody in Montana or Georgia gives a rip about the Wolverines and the Buckeyes). Army/Navy is truly international, because just about every grunt and swabbie across the globe takes time out from his or her duties to watch or listen to the game on the Armed Forces Network. The game is the classic manifestation of the age-old rivalry between the two services that flares up every time a sergeant crosses paths with a petty officer in a bar in some remote corner of the planet. It's also a true "throw out the records" rivalry, since it matters not one whit whether both teams are good, both teams are bad, or one team's up while the other team's down.

Read John Feinstein's excellent A Civil War, and you'll understand why there really is no other rivalry in sports quite like Army/Navy. It's completely unique. The hatred is as fierce and white-hot as any rivalry anywhere (for one week a year at the U.S. Military Academy and the U.S. Naval Academy, and one week only, it's permissible to answer a direct order with "Beat Navy!" or "Beat Army!" instead of "Yes, sir!" or "Yes, ma'am!"), and because both the service academies and the services as a whole are national institutions it's a rivalry that knows no state or regional boundaries. The pageantry of the servicemen and -women in full uniform filling out their sections of the stadium is pretty amazing.

But the best part of the game is the ending. No matter who wins, and no matter how badly they beat each others' brains out, at the end of the game the players from both sides intermingle in front of the Navy section of the stadium and stand at attention as "Anchors Aweigh" is played by the Navy band, and then both teams walk over to the Army section and stand at attention as the USMA Alma Mater is played by the Army band.

There's a reason for this closing ritual, and it's a big part of why this rivalry goes beyond Alabama/Auburn, USC/UCLA, Ohio State/Michigan, and all the rest: Every member of the Corps of Cadets and the Corps of Midshipmen knows that, no matter how much he or she hates the other side, those rivals will become brothers-in-arms upon graduation. They already have a common bond, because they know that few college students besides those at the other academy truly understand just how rigorous and grueling those four years really are for them from both a mental and a physical standpoint. But when you know that the people on the other sideline will be standing with you on the firing line as fellow officers when the country calls you to duty, it puts a different spin on the rivalry than you see at other places. The hatred is tempered with a mutual respect and a commonality of larger purpose that you just don't see in the more frivolous and ephemeral world of intercollegiate sports outside of the service academies.

Worth repeating
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on December 11, 2006, 04:59:36 PM
I was just making my picks on the Pick 'em Board...Yes, I did some research this time instead of throwing darts.

First, Wooster has the best website by far of the NCAC schools.  The links to other schools is key.  No other website I can find has that.

But looking at the NCAC standings right now before Holiday tourney's and vegas/CA/TX trips:

Only half of the NCAC out scores its opponents.
Only half of the NCAC has a winning record...Only 3 teams more than one game over .500.   Wabash is outscores its opponets but has 2-5 record????

Eight teams have had losing streaks of more than 3 games and two started the season 0-4 and one team started 0-5.  Denison has a 5 game losing streak after starting 1-1.

Has the NCAC ever been this bad?

Do you Steve Moore saw the writing on the wall and the relative weakness of NCAC is the reason for the tough schedule this year?  The NCAC is normally weak year and year out but this year it is particularly weak.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 11, 2006, 05:25:13 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on December 11, 2006, 04:59:36 PMWabash is outscores its opponets but has 2-5 record

We really need a green and puking smiley-face.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on December 11, 2006, 05:31:08 PM
Pat - Was it my oversite or was there a D3 Hoops Pre-season All American Team this year?  If you had one, I missed it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 11, 2006, 05:36:14 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on December 11, 2006, 04:59:36 PM
First, Wooster has the best website by far of the NCAC schools.  The links to other schools is key.  No other website I can find has that.

Has the NCAC ever been this bad?



I'm not sure if your aware but the NCAC has a website

http://northcoast.org/mb/mb.html

I think you'll find your answer to your question if you poke around a little.

Its been my experience that good coaches know when they'll have a good team and they'll schedule a few tougher challenges that year.  I've always thought Wooster's out of conference schedule's were on the higher end of competitiveness every year anyway.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 11, 2006, 05:45:20 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on December 11, 2006, 05:31:08 PM
Pat - Was it my oversite or was there a D3 Hoops Pre-season All American Team this year?  If you had one, I missed it.

Sorry, I am not Pat but here is what you are looking for:

http://d3hoops.com/tow/menpreallam07.htm

http://d3hoops.com/tow/wompreallam07.htm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 11, 2006, 06:52:06 PM
Wooster is never going to get a stiff challenge from the rest of the NCAC.  Every year it seems that we all say that this is the year a couple of other teams are going to jump up and give Wooster and Witt a run and it never pans out.  Currently, the reality is that Wooster and Witt are head and shoulders above the rest of the conference and the rest of the conference schedule for those two is essentially filler between Christmas and the tournament.

Upcoming schedule for Wabash....Saturday Wabash travels to Denison.  On the surface, it's a game Wabash should probably win, but who knows how the inexperienced LGs will play on the road.  Their first couple of trips this season (to Depauw and Oberlin) haven't panned out well.  Then Wabash plays a single game at Franklin on the 18th before a New Year's Eve-ish tournament at Frankln with Alma and Lakeland.  Tough road stretch for Wabash before we flip the calendars over.  It should be a good chance for Wabash to grow up quite a bit heading into the conference season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2006, 07:14:37 PM
Quote from: uknowme2 on December 11, 2006, 11:06:36 AM
For everyone crying about the officials, I want you all to be well aware of the fact that each and everyone of you has the opportunity to officiate.  With that being said, I don't think too many of you will be jumping in line for that gig.   

This is precisely the reason I try to avoid criticizing the officials.  I'm thankful we have people willing to do the job.  Maybe they're not the greatest officials in the world, but they're a heck of a lot better than I'd be!

Quote from: WoosterFAN on December 11, 2006, 04:59:36 PM
Has the NCAC ever been this bad?

And yet, just yesterday I noticed that three of the top 15 teams in the Massey ratings (http://www.mratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&sub=III&mid=1) are NCAC teams (Wooster #2, Witt #14, OWU #15).  But you have to page down quite a long way to reach the #4 NCAC team (Kenyon at #165).

Quote from: WoosterFAN on December 11, 2006, 04:59:36 PM
First, Wooster has the best website by far of the NCAC schools. 

Wooster's website is outstanding.  Wittenberg's website is very good as well.  I think all of the NCAC schools have better websites than a lot of schools; the most recent example of a truly bad athletics webpage that I came across is Aurora (http://www.aurora.edu/athletics/bball-m/).  As in many, many areas, I think we have an above-average conference that we can be rightly proud of.

Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 11, 2006, 04:38:20 AM
Army/Navy is still the best college football rivalry.
I agree with this, but
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 11, 2006, 04:38:20 AMOSU/Michigan is a regional rivalry (no, Chuck, it's not national -- nobody in Montana or Georgia gives a rip about the Wolverines and the Buckeyes).
That's an overstatement.  I've spent a fair amount of time in Montana, and also in the south (not Georgia, but an even worse place--Alabama), and in both places there is a decent level of interest in OSU/Michigan, beyond the general level of interest you'd expect in an "important" game.  That's due in part to the fact that both are tremendously large universities with graduates all around the world.  I can't think of anywhere in America where I have been more than a casual visitor and not run into Michigan alumni and/or fans.

Anyway, you can have great football rivalries that have little or no "national interest."  Harvard/Yale, Stanford/Cal, Lafayette/Lehigh, Wabash/DePauw, Montana/Montana State come to mind.  And I know everyone is waiting with bated breath for the Central Michigan/Middle Tennessee State showdown in the Motor City Bowl!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 11, 2006, 08:12:30 PM
It's true that UM has more living alumni than any other school (or so they claim in my 'could we see some of your alumnus money' mailings!). :D

And OSU may be #2 (or at least must be top 5).

Two brief anecdotes:

I was once in a sports bar in South Dakota (close enough to Montana?) for the UM-OSU game - EVERYBODY was watching, and most had on UM or OSU sweatshirts.

The last time that I was in a sports bar during the Army-Navy game (either 2003 or 04), they were watching something else and refused my request to switch to Army-Navy.

Greg, I loved your depiction of the rituals involved in A-N, but have you checked the TV ratings for Army-Navy vs. Ohio State-Michigan for the last few years?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 11, 2006, 09:04:14 PM
i didnt know this was the discussion board for division 1 football? discussing scUM on here makes me sick haha
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2006, 09:37:59 PM
Allegheny's Ryan Hollihan is the NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) for his back-to-back double-doubles, one of which was instrumental in the Gators' upset of Ohio Wesleyan.  Hollihan is a 6'8" sophomore.  Congratulations to Ryan!  :)

It looks like the Conference Office is liking the big men this season; two of the PotW's this year have been 6'8" (Borchers was the other, last week), and the other two were 6'6" (Yelvington and Vandervaart).  Where's the love for the pee-wee guards?  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Blue Russian on December 11, 2006, 10:18:43 PM

This was a problem in the 1st half.  I mean Witt had 4 trips in a row where Borchers went to the line for fouls that were called against Wooster's defenders for trying to hold their ground as Borchers backed them down.  From what I could tell, they were touch fouls at best.  The fouls were being called before Borchers was even shooting?!  I didn't really notice this as much in the 2nd half.  I think it was more of a fact that Wooster's defenders felt they had to lay off down low resulting in easy bunnies for Witt's post players.  I just don't like to see the referees feel like people came to the game to watch them which is the sense I got from this officiating crew.  As I said before, the officiating was equally poor for both sides.  I just felt like they were calling far too many silly touch fouls and as a result, didn't allow the game to flow at all.[/color]





  Final stats show both teams were called for 19 fouls. Both teams made exactly 16 foul shots, Wooster had 21 attempts and Witt 20. Hard to believe it was this close with all the recent comments. By the way, Borchers was only at the line 8 times, only 3 more than Vandervaart......maybe not so far our of line as perceived.[/color]

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 11, 2006, 11:50:01 PM
Quote from: Blue Russian on December 11, 2006, 10:18:43 PMFinal stats show both teams were called for 19 fouls. Both teams made exactly 16 foul shots, Wooster had 21 attempts and Witt 20. Hard to believe it was this close with all the recent comments. By the way, Borchers was only at the line 8 times, only 3 more than Vandervaart......maybe not so far our of line as perceived.

I'd feel a lot better if you could at least admit the possibility that although the fouls came out about even that those called on one team could have been very marginal touch fouls while those on the other weren't, and many other fouls on that team could have been called but weren't.  I've had a few drinks, and I know that last sentence is reasonably convuluted, but so is your reasoning when you claim that the game was called fairly because the foul count was close.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 12, 2006, 12:51:04 AM
Wooster Daily Record preview article of this weekend's WQKT/Steve Smith Holiday Hoops Classic, which will include many area high school teams in addition to the Wooster-Cederville game:


http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1161822
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 12, 2006, 02:47:23 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 11, 2006, 07:14:37 PMThat's an overstatement.  I've spent a fair amount of time in Montana, and also in the south (not Georgia, but an even worse place--Alabama), and in both places there is a decent level of interest in OSU/Michigan, beyond the general level of interest you'd expect in an "important" game.  That's due in part to the fact that both are tremendously large universities with graduates all around the world.  I can't think of anywhere in America where I have been more than a casual visitor and not run into Michigan alumni and/or fans.

Agreed. I was exaggerating for effect. Yes, I'm well aware that the brobdignagian sizes of the Michigan and Ohio State student bodies means that they have plenty of alumni scattered everywhere. But that doesn't mean that the rivalry takes on the life-or-death fervor elsewhere that it takes on within a 400-mile radius of Toledo. Fact is, it doesn't. And that's my point.

Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 11, 2006, 08:12:30 PMGreg, I loved your depiction of the rituals involved in A-N, but have you checked the TV ratings for Army-Navy vs. Ohio State-Michigan for the last few years?

No. Don't care to. Doesn't matter. If we measured the intensity and the excellence of a rivalry by public consciousness, media attention, and # of eyeballs glued to television sets, then Hope/Calvin, Wittenberg/Wooster, Amherst/Williams, DePauw/Wabash, Hardin-Simmons/McMurry, Cortland State/Ithaca, etc., wouldn't even be blips on the radar.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 12, 2006, 04:06:43 AM
Michigan/Ohio State was ranked the No. 1 college football rivalry by USA Today last fall. IIRC, the rankings were based on tradition, mutual dislike and national impact.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 12, 2006, 06:39:12 AM
Not to bring up old wounds but I thought I would add my two cents in about the Wooster/Witt game.  First of all, it's interesting to hear the Witt students saying that Wooster students were egging them on after the game.  The last two years Wooster has been down there, Witt students have tried to engage them afterward in a petty fight about football scores and NCAC rings.  And for every **** on Witt cheer, last year there was a **** you Wooster chant, does anyone else remember that?  So let's just suffice it to say that both teams have done somewhat innappropriate chanting.  No one school is better than the other in that regard or more classy...

Also I would have to agree that the fouls Borchers drew were mostly touch fouls at best.  Looking at the stats, he only had two fouls called on him, and the first one was with 4 minutes already played in the second half!  Are we saying this kid is that good, that he doesn't foul?  Now maybe you can say that based on the total fouls the game had, it was called fair, but with Wooster big men in foul trouble for the first half and most of the second half, the edge went to Wittenberg. 

Is there going to be any more quick discussion about BW beating ONU on their home court?  BW, a team that was preseason ranked top 10 had falled off the top 25.  From what I have heard about the OAC, ONU seems to be the team to beat in that conference.  Wish I could have been at that game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 12, 2006, 08:58:32 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 11, 2006, 09:04:14 PM
i didnt know this was the discussion board for division 1 football? discussing scUM on here makes me sick haha
Judging from your 'WE ARE.................PENN STATE!' signature, it's clear to  see where the animosity towards UofM comes from.  It's been a pretty tough decade for the Lions when it comes to playing Michigan now hasn't it???

Oh, and regarding your signature, I prefer, 'We OWN Penn State'!!! ;)

Quote from: division3hoops on December 12, 2006, 06:39:12 AM
Is there going to be any more quick discussion about BW beating ONU on their home court?  BW, a team that was preseason ranked top 10 had falled off the top 25.  From what I have heard about the OAC, ONU seems to be the team to beat in that conference.  Wish I could have been at that game.
I'll bite considering ONU is looming as an opponent for the Scots at the end of this month.  I must admit, I was a bit shocked at the score when I first saw it.  I didn't think B-W had a chance to win, let alone almost win by 20 AT ONU no less.  So I went and looked at the box score for the 1st time and it basically was a case of B-W shooting lights out from the floor inside and outside of the arc.  B-W shot 62% from the floor and 67% :o from beyond the arc!  The Polar Bears finished shooting 45% but were only 23% from downtown.  ONU actually had more 3 pt. attempts (13-12), but had 5 fewer makes (3-8).  It's tough to beat a team with a hot shooting touch like that. 

That was really the only telling stat that would indicate why this game was won by such a wide margin by the Yellow Jackets.  In other key statistical categories, B-W only outrebounded ONU 32-29 and the Jackets actually turned the ball over 3 more times than did ONU.  The Bears even got to the line 3 more times than B-W, but had 2 fewer conversions there as well.

One other thing that kind of surpirsed me in looking at the box score is that B-W only got significant minutes from one guy off the bench.  They had 4 out of their 5 starters (including Santiago making only his 1st start) log at least 34 minutes in the game.  I thought that was a bit surprising to see such an apparant lack of depth by the Yellow Jackets. 

All in all, it looks to me like ONU was done in by a red-hot B-W.  Kind of similar to how Wooster knocked off Witt last year down in Springfield.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 12, 2006, 10:19:08 AM
Latest poll up, and, much like some of you predicted, Wooster and Wittenberg both stayed put in the rankings.  Wooster is still #1, with 22/25 first place votes, and Witt remained at #6, 40 total points ahead of ONU.  In addition, Ohio Wesleyan was t-20 in the Others Receiving Votes category.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on December 12, 2006, 10:49:50 AM
The 'Mose' Hole tourney might have gotten a bit harder as UW-Lacrosse has entered the Top 25 at #21.  They have started the year @ 6-2.

UWL's opponent Calvin is unranked and is 4-3 but all of their losses have been to ranked teams.

Of course, the Scots have to get past ONU first.  And in 2000 NCAA tourney, SCOTs first beat ONU then lost @ Calvin in round of 16.

Revenge is a dish best served cold!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2006, 11:00:09 AM
Quote from: division3hoops on December 12, 2006, 06:39:12 AM
Is there going to be any more quick discussion about BW beating ONU on their home court? 

Welcome to Posting Up, d3hoops!  I'd like to point out to you that there is a separate board for discussion of the OAC; indeed, there are boards for each D3 conference, as well as a number of boards of general interest, such as those devoted to the top 25, the Pool B teams, and the performance of D3 teams vs. non-D3 teams.  I encourage you to surf around.  As for the OAC, their room is right next to ours, and courtside seats are still available!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 12, 2006, 11:16:04 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 12, 2006, 11:00:09 AMAs for the OAC, their room is right next to ours, and courtside seats are still available!

Well, their minds are still on football at the moment. I wish we had that problem.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: uknowme2 on December 12, 2006, 11:27:31 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on December 12, 2006, 11:16:04 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 12, 2006, 11:00:09 AMAs for the OAC, their room is right next to ours, and courtside seats are still available!

Well, their minds are still on football at the moment. I wish we had that problem.  ;)
Agreed!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2006, 12:35:47 PM
I received an interesting note today from Hugh Howard, Wooster's SID.  As some of you may be aware, there is a misprint in the 2007 NCAA Record Book, which has had the effect of pushing Wooster back behind Illinois Wesleyan and into third place on the all-time wins list in D3.  (It goes without saying that Wittenberg is #1 on this list.)  Coming into last season, both Wooster and IWU were credited with 1395 wins in program history.  Last year Wooster won 26 games, and IWU won 25 (although I'd gladly have swapped their wins for our wins, especially those of the March variety!), ostensibly giving Wooster a one-game edge coming into this season, 1421-1420.

However, the Record Book records Wooster's win total as 1402.  That's a number that's both wrong and curious, as it's not a normal-looking typo of 1421.  Hugh informed me today that he's succeeded in getting the NCAA to recognize that it is a misprint, but it turns out to be a normal dyslexic typo of 1420.  As it happens, the NCAA has seemingly decided to remove a 1963 forfeit by Central State from Wooster's wins list.  That means that Wooster and IWU again started the season tied on this list, at 1420 wins.  (Well, not really 'again,' since it now appears that the Scots were at 1394 last season.)

Wooster is 7-0 in the early going, while IWU is 5-3, so it now appears to everyone's satisfaction that Wooster is indeed the #2 D3 team in all-time wins, 1427 to 1425. 

As a side note, the deduction of the win over Central State presumably reduces Al Van Wie's career win total to 302.  I certainly hope the NCAA doesn't take a similarly dim view on any more of the Dutchman's victories, as I like the distinction of being the only D3 school with three 300-game winning coaches.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 12, 2006, 07:15:23 PM
Thanks for the welcome David!  I saw there is a separate board for the OAC but apparently they don't get much discussion over there.  Since Wooster is going to be playing ONU, I wanted to see what people thought about that game looming ahead.  Of course there are more games to play until then but you have to love 2 top 10 teams playing each other.  ONU seems to be pretty tough and like I said before I have heard they are the team to beat in the OAC.  I must say this seems like it is going to be a pretty slow week with no games due to finals I believe for all the schools. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 12, 2006, 07:21:14 PM
I take that previous thought back.  I see there are several non-conference games going on this week.  I was under the impression all the schools had finals.  I didn't know that schools played during finals week...If that's the case, must be pretty tough on the athletes...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2006, 07:40:38 PM
Quote from: division3hoops on December 12, 2006, 07:15:23 PMSince Wooster is going to be playing ONU, I wanted to see what people thought about that game looming ahead.  Of course there are more games to play until then but you have to love 2 top 10 teams playing each other.   

Wittenberg gets the first shot; they play at ONU next Tuesday, also a matchup of two top 10 teams (Witt is #6, ONU is #7).  That's 10 days before the Mose Hole matchup.

I don't know when each school has final exams, but most school schedules from around the country that I have looked at have a noticeable gap (at least a week) for exams.

I'd be surprised if any of the regulars in this room have seen the Polar Bears yet this year.  Maybe none of the OAC regulars (few as they are) have either, but the likelihood seems to be a little higher.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 12, 2006, 08:42:36 PM
david you took the words righ tout of my mouth. i somehow doubt that ONu will be looking ahead to wooster and past a home game with witt....especially with the way witt has owned this series-yes owned-if anything wooster will be looking forward to this matchup because i think it will gauge just how good the polar bears are. also i think these matchup s will be interesting to see if the OAC can gain some ground against the NCAC's TOP teams. i am looking forward to seeing the results witt has next week at ohio northern and at otterbein-both of which are not gimmies
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 12, 2006, 08:44:36 PM
also since the osu-michigan debate has been brought up

A  7 year old boy in columbus ohio surprised a court room yesterday when he challenged a court ruling. After a long line of parental abuse, the court awarded his parental aunt custody. The boy claimed his entire family had a history of beating him. After much consideration, the court ruled that because of the family's history of abuse,.......
: he was awarded custody to the University of Michigan who the boy firmly believes are not capable of beating anyone from Columbus or Ohio.
hahahaha
great stuff
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on December 12, 2006, 08:58:09 PM
While I have not yet had a chance to watch ONU (plan to next Tuesday against the Tigers) I do get media coverage of them over here in NW Ohio. From what I know they lack a dominant post presence, I believe their top post player is either a sophmore or freshman and is more of a hard worker than star. Badenhop is their top player and while I don't particularly like his style of play there is no denying that he knows how to fill it up. I see the Tigers post players having a field day and I think Wooster's guards and overall team depth will be too much for the Bears, I see both NCAC teams winning by double digits. I can only hope that this year's ONU/Witt game is as entertaining as December of 02 when Bill Brown was escorted out of the gym by campus police...it was classic and is laying around on VHS somewhere
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 12, 2006, 09:10:36 PM
can u tell me that story in detail-im not sure i remember it exactly but im sure it was hilarious?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 12, 2006, 10:43:18 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fprofile.ak.facebook.com%2Fv52%2F517%2F88%2Fn64900330_4850.jpg&hash=c189461284dba278e612e2fbe40f8943d3eb7c7b)

Approves of any Michigan/OSU banter...

And says to Lloyd Carr: "Now? Now, you want a playoff?? Where were you in '94 Lloyd?"

And says to Jim Tressel: "Do you believe in graduation?"

And says to Billy_Pilgrim: "Sorry about the karma hit"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 13, 2006, 12:26:32 AM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on December 12, 2006, 10:43:18 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fprofile.ak.facebook.com%2Fv52%2F517%2F88%2Fn64900330_4850.jpg&hash=c189461284dba278e612e2fbe40f8943d3eb7c7b)

Wishes he could still play Rutgers, Syracuse, West Virginia, Boston College, Temple and Maryland instead of....

Minnesota, Iowa, Wisconsin, Michigan, Ohio State, Michigan State,  Purdue, Northwestern

........doesn't mind games with Indiana and Illinois  ;)


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 13, 2006, 08:42:37 AM
I wish I could make it to the Witt/ONU game but unfortunately have an office Christmas party that evening and am not able to attend.  I have to say that I somehow have a feeling that Witt is going to pull away with the W.  Honestly, I didn't think they would be as much of a threat this year but I was certainly impressed with their play at the witt/woo game.  I was also impressed with one of their freshman guards in the JV game...I don't remember his name but he was making 3 pointers like crazy at the end of the game.  He was on the shorter side...anyone know the name? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 13, 2006, 09:11:33 AM
Quote from: division3hoops on December 13, 2006, 08:42:37 AM
I wish I could make it to the Witt/ONU game but unfortunately have an office Christmas party that evening and am not able to attend.  I have to say that I somehow have a feeling that Witt is going to pull away with the W.  Honestly, I didn't think they would be as much of a threat this year but I was certainly impressed with their play at the witt/woo game.  I was also impressed with one of their freshman guards in the JV game...I don't remember his name but he was making 3 pointers like crazy at the end of the game.  He was on the shorter side...anyone know the name? 

Kyle Bigler

http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/06bios/kylebigler06.html

------

Pat, thanks
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 13, 2006, 10:29:27 AM
1-yeah it is kyle bigler and he is a sophomore-how he isnt on varsity i dont know-im sure there's a good reason though

2-michigan would have no complaints if they wouldnt have blown their chance at osu already-thats a whole nother horse of a different color though
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 13, 2006, 10:30:10 AM
quick question-how is one's "karma" determined
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 13, 2006, 10:34:30 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 13, 2006, 10:29:27 AM
1-yeah it is kyle bigler and he is a sophomore-how he isnt on varsity i dont know-im sure there's a good reason though

I think that he was dressed for the varsity game.  I was a little surprised that he wasn't inserted for the 3-pt attempt at the end of the game...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 13, 2006, 10:42:50 AM
Yep, I'm pretty sure, too, that Bigler dressed and warmed up for the varsity game against Wooster.  Looking at the Wittenberg stats, though, shows that he hasn't played any varsity yet this season.  Terrific shooter with great range, but in those has-to-be-a-three situations, it's usually hard for a little guard to get the shot off.  That's probably why it ended up being the post player Hemenway taking the shot, which even though he had to force it, I thought was a good move, and it almost panned out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2006, 10:47:31 AM
Also keep in mind that Paterno terminated the long-standing PSU rivalries with Syracuse, West Virginia, and Pittsburgh when they stopped being all-but-guaranteed victories.  In my book, he ranks right up there with Bobby Bowden in more ways than one.

Quote from: pennstghs on December 13, 2006, 10:30:10 AM
quick question-how is one's "karma" determined

http://www.d3hoops.com/faq.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 13, 2006, 11:29:34 AM
terminated the long standing rivalry with syracuse hmmmmm?

http://www.gopsusports.com/Football/schedules/athleticSchedule.cfm

yes the long standing traditional beatdown continues in 2008
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2006, 11:56:37 AM
You mean "resumes" in 2008.  They haven't played since 1990, having played every year but one since 1922.  And Syracuse is once again a lousy team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 13, 2006, 11:59:17 AM
i think with the new 12th game added you see hoards of these "easy" games being scheduled
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2006, 12:19:52 PM
True enough. 

Geez, exam week is a drag.   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 13, 2006, 12:25:53 PM
Easy game or not, it is a major conference vs. major conference game which is far, far better than scheduling a I-AA, excuse me, a Championship Division team for a September game.  That's a practice that I think ought to be prohibited.  

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 13, 2006, 12:26:08 PM
yeah no kidding-i have an exam tomorrow but you know its a slow week on here when we're talkin about syracuse and rutgers football haha.

here's a discussion question for everyone.....

1 - what is the best environment you have ever been in attending a college sporting event?

come on that should raise my karma lol
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 13, 2006, 12:37:05 PM
For me, hands down Witt/Woo Triple Overtime at the HPER 2 years ago.  The gym was packed - oversold. The temperature was up there and both teams put up huge plays.  That was definitely the most fun game I have ever attended in my lifetime.  If I could give you Karma pennstghs I would....Great Question!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: uknowme2 on December 13, 2006, 12:43:33 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 13, 2006, 12:26:08 PM


1 - what is the best environment you have ever been in attending a college sporting event?



The Witt/CoW overtime game was amazing.  It was everything that you want and more in a college basketball game.  Rivals, overtime, packed house,etc.  Can't beat it. 

A close second to me was the Ohio State/Michigan game this year.  Unbelievable.  And I didn't have to pay too much to enjoy it in person.  All the drama leading up to that, not to mention the mass quanities of beer before and after the game. 

But #1 Witt/CoW overtime.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2006, 12:50:33 PM
By the way, while I'm thinking of it, Wooster's James Cooper is sitting on 990 career points coming into this weekend's game against Cedarville.  If/when he scores 10 more points, he'll become the 30th player in Fighting Scot history to reach the 1000 point plateau.  Tom Port reached this milestone last season (as did Kyle Witucky), and currently has 1340 points in his career.  Tim Vandervaart (841) needs to average just under 9 ppg over the next 18 games to reach 1000 during the regular season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 13, 2006, 01:04:15 PM
Quote from: division3hoops on December 13, 2006, 12:37:05 PM
For me, hands down Witt/Woo Triple Overtime at the HPER 2 years ago.  The gym was packed - oversold. The temperature was up there and both teams put up huge plays.  That was definitely the most fun game I have ever attended in my lifetime.  If I could give you Karma pennstghs I would....Great Question!
Was that the game they had to keep stopping play to wipe up the condensation that was forming on the court because it was so hot in the gym?

pennstghs,

Are you talking DIII spoting events atteneded or just sporting events attended in general.  If we're talking in general, I'll have to go with last year's Michigan/Penn St. game in AA where Chad Henne hooked up with Mario Manningham for the winning TD with no time left on the clock.  To see the PSU fans go from celebration to sheer disbelief in just a few minutes was absolutely priceless!!!

As for my best DIII experience, unfortunately, I wasn't in attendance for that triple OT gem down in Springfield so I'm going to have to say James Cooper's game winning trey last year vs. Wittenberg has to rank up there.   But I'm going to go with the 2003 playoff game vs. JCU where Rodney Mitchell buried an off balance jump shot while driving in the lane with time running out to lift the Scots to a 77-75 win in what was the beginning of their run to Salem that season!  I think that was about as loud as I've ever heard Timken when that shot went in!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 13, 2006, 01:04:53 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 13, 2006, 11:59:17 AM
i think with the new 12th game added you see hoards of these "easy" games being scheduled
Yeah.  This just shows how the presidents of these DI institutions are all just a bunch of hypocrites.  They can add a meaninless 12th game which ends up being a glorified scrimmage for most of the 'big-time' programs, yet, they don't want to take away from the class time of their football players by having a tournament?!  I wish they would just quit using the loss of class time as an excuse and just come out and say it's all about the almighty dollar!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 13, 2006, 01:14:26 PM
well scots fan since there's nothing much else to talk about this week we can go ahead and discuss both overall and division 3

my best environment for a college sporting event would either have to be the 3OT wooster/witt game or i dont know if scots fans remember but when i was younger i attended the NCAC championship game between wooster and witt and greg rustad was fouled with little or no time remaining and made 3 free throws for the win-that was pretty cool

overall though i would have to say that the wittenberg-amherst final four game was pretty cool. just to see all the witt fans that made the 6 hour trip and have witt come back from a deficit to win in the final minute of the game and the feeling afterwards of holy crap we're playing for the national championship-we wont discuss what happened 24 hours later though.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on December 13, 2006, 02:24:40 PM
Penn...Basically the Tigers didn't show up to play early in that game and there were a few questinable calls that went against Witt and Bill, needless to say he didn't respond real well the first technical and was assessed a second and thus the campus police escort....as far as the NCAC championship game between Woo and Witt and the "Rustad Incident" that was in 2002 and I have yet to see the official that called that foul at any game (college, high school or junior high) since, for the record i believe there were 2.1 seconds left
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 13, 2006, 02:35:43 PM
Just think, if Wooster had pulled off that NCAC championship game back in '02, they'd be in the midst of an 11 year postseason streak and counting.  Would anyone happen to know who currently has the longest active post-season streak going?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 13, 2006, 02:52:58 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 13, 2006, 01:04:15 PM
As for my best DIII experience, unfortunately, I wasn't in attendance for that triple OT gem down in Springfield so I'm going to have to say James Cooper's game winning trey last year vs. Wittenberg has to rank up there.   But I'm going to go with the 2003 playoff game vs. JCU where Rodney Mitchell buried an off balance jump shot while driving in the lane with time running out to lift the Scots to a 77-75 win in what was the beginning of their run to Salem that season!  I think that was about as loud as I've ever heard Timken when that shot went in!

I wasn't there for either of those, but I think the quietest I've ever seen Timken was after a Wittenberg player ran the length of the court and banked in a game winning 3-pointer to win the conference tournament.  All the Wooster fans were just stunned- already on our feet in celebration, we were left to just stand there.  I'm guessing this game was in the mid-to-late 90s, because it was certainly well before I entered college.  Anyone able to offer further details on this (admittedly bad)memory?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 13, 2006, 02:55:52 PM
ScotsFan - That was indeed the game they had to keep stopping to wipe the floor.  Players were slipping all over and the concession stand ran out of water! There were so many people in that gym, that there was a standing room only against the wall underneath the basket.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 13, 2006, 03:05:40 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 13, 2006, 12:26:08 PM

1 - what is the best environment you have ever been in attending a college sporting event?

come on that should raise my karma lol
Can't help you with the Karma however;  In December of 1969 Wooster, led by Tom Dinger, played Kenyon, led by John Rinka at Wooster.  In the age before the 3 point line, Dinger scored 40 and I believe Rinka scored 46.  Although Kenyon prevailed 118-112 it was a great game before a packed house.  My best Division 3 experience.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on December 13, 2006, 03:55:15 PM
Scotsbrod- Matt Croci hit that bank three.  Coach Brown has the tape and showed it to us a couple times.  It was in '92 I believe. 

VanillaCOW-  In '02, Matt Smith left his feet.  We had called a 1-4 flat play, so Greg could go one on one with Smith.  As Greg was going to the hole he head faked at the three point line and Smith jumped to contest.  Greg leaned in and drew the foul.  Thats a foul 100% of the time.  I was on the floor when that happened, and Rustad's fling at the basket almost went it.  I stood at the free throw line and couldn't watch.  After he made the free throws, Wooster came down and Brian Carlisle, who I was guarding, set a ball screen on Antwaan Reynolds and I switched.  Being sure I was going to get scored on, I said some prayers.  By the grace of God, or my spectacular on ball defense, Reynolds dribbled off his foot.  The ball rolled to almost half court and he threw one up in desperation.  I swear it took 10 minutes for that ball to get to the rim.  That shot hit the front of the rim and it was pandemonium. 

As for the best game I played in, it would have to be Witt at Wooster in 2002 for the conference title.  We had lost at Wabash and Wooster had lost to us.  It was back and forth through out the game and in the second half with about 14 min to go, Wooster took an 12 point lead, Kevin Longley then dunked all over Blake Mealer, we got it to nine with about 4 min to go, and Rod Emmons hit a three and Rustad had a four point play in the corner right in front of Woo's student section.  We should not have won that game.  We ended up beating Woo three times that year.  That was an amazing season.

The bast game I have been to is a tie.  Jan 1, 1995 Louisville vs. Kentucky, Freshman Samaki Walker drops Louisville first ever triple double with 14 points, 10 rebounds, and a school record 11 blocks.  I was about 5th row behind the basket.  I was in 7th grade and remember it like it was yesterday.

The second is this years OSU/Michigan game.  I don't need to explain to anyone about that game, but before the game in the rotunda, I asked my then girlfriend to marry me (she said yes).  Best game ever.  We also got a chunk of the field after the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2006, 04:23:12 PM
Congratulations on the engagement, Pete!  :)

I'll be interested to see what response (if any) Vanilla24COW has to your account of the events of that game.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 13, 2006, 04:24:13 PM
Quote from: petewitt54 on December 13, 2006, 03:55:15 PM
Scotsbrod- Matt Croci hit that bank three.  Coach Brown has the tape and showed it to us a couple times.  It was in '92 I believe. 

Wow, that was a lot longer ago than I had thought.  Thanks for the info, petewitt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on December 13, 2006, 04:52:46 PM
Woops, did I say '92?  I meant '94.  It was Coach Brown's first year. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 13, 2006, 07:48:30 PM
The game that had to be stopped to wipe the floor was last years #1 vs. #2 game in which there was well over the 3100 capacity in the gym (it was three deep behind the basket).

The reason it was so overloaded was because Witt used simple raffle tickets and didn't tear them upon entry. All one had to do was gather a bunch of tickets from others within the gym and walk out to hand them to others. Witt used reserved seating tickets this year but still didn't tear them upon entry.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 13, 2006, 08:37:37 PM
Quote from: goscots on December 13, 2006, 07:48:30 PMWitt used reserved seating tickets this year but still didn't tear them upon entry.

That's true, they did not.  Which might go a long way towards answering why the aisles in the student sections on both sides of the stands were full of people all game long.  Not to blame Wittenberg, though.  If I were selling tickets at $8 a pop, I'd be loathe to have those valuable ducats immediately ripped in half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on December 13, 2006, 08:38:50 PM
"Greg leaned in " and "Rustad's fling at the basket" are fairly good descriptions...I will leave it at that I think....I can remember a game in '03 in which Witt dominated the first half against Woo and in the second half it was completely opposite as the Scots could do no wrong and the Tigers could do nothing, that all started with a Witucky 3 the first play of the second half...the Woo/Witt game in 99-00 at COW was pretty good too, I can remember the Scots raining in 3's in that game (Ellenwood's and Filmore's Sr years) believe that game ended up being a double digit W for Woo.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on December 13, 2006, 08:49:59 PM
Now I am going to date myself.  I covered SCOTS basketball for Wooster Voice in these days.  And Timken became a very exciting place in Steve Moore's second year.
I had the best seat in the house for every home game..end of press row right next to the bench.  It was 1988-1989 season.  Bill Brown was at Kenyon, Erich Reibe  (2nd team ALL-NCAC) and Stan Aukamp were freshman, Matt Hiestand was a junior and Mike Trimmer was a senior.  And Allegheny, with F Dagget, F Williams and G Amos, was the class of the league.
   Timken was rocking for the first time in many years when SCOTS beat the GATORS (69-63) in FEB in battle for first place in the NCAC after losing to them 73-59 (in game that was not that close) in Meadville.  The SCOTS had to go to Meadville for conference tourney championship game and lost by 2.  Man those were exciting times during the infancy of the Steve Moore era.  The SCOTS went 21-7, 10-2 but NCAA bid.  First 20 win season since 77-78!!
   For the record, Bill Brown was coach of the year in the NCAC that year but was 0-2 vs. former teammate Steve Moore and the game in Gambier was a beat down!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 13, 2006, 09:36:44 PM
Quote from: petewitt54 on December 13, 2006, 04:52:46 PM
Woops, did I say '92?  I meant '94.  It was Coach Brown's first year. 

I checked Woo's all-time results on their webpage- it was '94, but it wasn't the conference championship, just the regular season matchup at Woo.  Wooster lost that home game 64-67, Woo had already lost to Witt 62-67 in Springfield earlier that year.

Quote from: WoosterFAN on December 13, 2006, 08:49:59 PM
For the record, Bill Brown was coach of the year in the NCAC that year but was 0-2 vs. former teammate Steve Moore and the game in Gambier was a beat down!!

Looks like Coach Brown managed to exact some revenge in that '94 year...   :D

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on December 13, 2006, 09:39:13 PM
I hate to date myself, but beating Scranton by one in the semi, followed by crushing Oneonta in the final in 1977 has to be the near the top.  The revenge on Scranton was sweet.  Their coach wore turtle necks, sport coats and hippy medallions. ::)
D3 alltime was the '75 Stagg Bowl when we shellacked the Ithaca Bombers 28-0, then got happy with the Phenix City locals post game....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 13, 2006, 09:53:55 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 13, 2006, 08:37:37 PM
Quote from: goscots on December 13, 2006, 07:48:30 PMWitt used reserved seating tickets this year but still didn't tear them upon entry.

That's true, they did not.  Which might go a long way towards answering why the aisles in the student sections on both sides of the stands were full of people all game long.  Not to blame Wittenberg, though.  If I were selling tickets at $8 a pop, I'd be loathe to have those valuable ducats immediately ripped in half.

Witt needs the extra money for the new indoor track and football locker rooms.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 13, 2006, 09:55:48 PM
Quote from: goscots on December 13, 2006, 07:48:30 PM
The game that had to be stopped to wipe the floor was last years #1 vs. #2 game in which there was well over the 3100 capacity in the gym (it was three deep behind the basket).

You know, that triple-overtime game was epic, but do you remember that the other two games Woo-Witt played that year (home game at Woo and conference final at Woo) were both won by Witt by the identical score of 61-59.  Wooster only lost 3 games that whole season by a combined total of 5 points- two to Wittenberg and the NCAA tournament game at Albion, 58-59.

That's not unlike what Wooster did to Wittenberg last year- providing the national runner up with two of their four total losses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Superfoot Wallace on December 13, 2006, 10:19:31 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 13, 2006, 01:04:15 PM
If we're talking in general, I'll have to go with last year's Michigan/Penn St. game in AA where Chad Henne hooked up with Mario Manningham for the winning TD with no time left on the clock.  To see the PSU fans go from celebration to sheer disbelief in just a few minutes was absolutely priceless!!!

blasphemer!

put them in the iron maiden
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 13, 2006, 10:23:53 PM
Actually, if you list in reverse order Wooster losses in the last 4+ seasons it is full of close one possession losses: (Sorry Scotsbrod but you have some numbers transposed on the Witt score at Timken gymnasium)

2005-06   91-88 loss to Transylvania in second round of NCAA
2005-06   59-61 loss to Witt in NCAC championship game
2005-06   83-86 loss to OWU in last regular season game
2005-06  108-113 loss in double OT to Baldwin Wallace in Mose Hole
2004-05   58-59 loss to Albion in second round of NCAA (I'm still mad)
2004-05   59-61 loss to Witt in the NCAC championship game
2004-05   51-69 loss to Witt at home (easily their worst performance but countered by the 3OT win at HPER)
2003-04   64-70 loss to JCU in the Elite Eight round
2003-04   62-73 loss to Witt at home -
2003-04   62-72 loss to Witt at HPER
2003-04   71-74 loss to Capital at home (Scots trailed by 8 with 32 seconds left and still had a chance to tie this game with the last shot)
2002-03   72-74 OT loss to Williams in National semifinal
2002-03   55-61 loss to Witt at HPER
2002-03  72-79 loss to Kalamazoo in Mose Hole

14 losses in 4+ years with of them 8 one possession (including the last six if you count OT as one)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 13, 2006, 10:53:43 PM
now see i guess i did generate some discussion........

yeah i would have to agree with the wittenberg/wooster championship game at wooster in 2003-04 season. i did attend that game as well and it was a packed house. that dunk by kevin longley let the wittenberg crowd back into the game and it was pandamonium the rest of the way. the downside to that game was the ride back in a blizzard-took 3+ hours :(

also, its hard on any level of division 3 sports to keep the fans attendance in complete control unless you take reserved seating to the full limit and employ ushers checking tickets, which no school has a budget for. no one gets hurt in the games so whats the big deal.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 13, 2006, 11:47:59 PM
Quote from: goscots on December 13, 2006, 10:23:53 PM
(Sorry Scotsbrod but you have some numbers transposed on the Witt score at Timken gymnasium)

:-[  I should've double-checked that a bit better.  I think I was even at that 69-51 loss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 14, 2006, 12:34:41 AM
For me, the biggest game was when my alma mater won the national title in '01. Other than that I might have to go with last year's title game or the 1999 title game, the one won by UW-Platteville in double OT over Hampden-Sydney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 14, 2006, 04:27:57 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 13, 2006, 02:35:43 PM
Just think, if Wooster had pulled off that NCAC championship game back in '02, they'd be in the midst of an 11 year postseason streak and counting.  Would anyone happen to know who currently has the longest active post-season streak going?

It's Maryville (TN). The Scots have made the last nine tournaments; the last time that they spent March on their couches was back in 1997. I'd have to research it further, but I think that Upsala and Christopher Newport each made it eleven times in a row at one point or another over the 32-year history of the D3 tournament.

Quote from: Pat Coleman on December 14, 2006, 12:34:41 AM
For me, the biggest game was when my alma mater won the national title in '01. Other than that I might have to go with last year's title game or the 1999 title game, the one won by UW-Platteville in double OT over Hampden-Sydney.

I've been present for three of North Park's five national championship games, and while each one was special I'd have to say that the best sporting atmosphere I've ever experienced was a mid-January game between North Park and Augustana that was played in the Park's gym back in 1982. Augie was the #1 team in the country at that point, and that evening they brought two keg-equipped buses filled with fratboys across Illinois and into our gym. The North Park gym was always packed and overheated in those days, but if anything it was especially so that night -- and the distinguished gentlemen from Alpha Tappa Kegga on the other side of the gym helped bring the North Park student section to a remarkable fever pitch of intensity and made the noise level and the tension level in the building particularly high.

There must've been close to two dozen lead changes throughout what was a relentlessly defensive-oriented struggle, and if I remember correctly neither team led by more than five points the entire night. North Park won the game, 50-49, when PG Mike Gordon, who was easily the worst shooter on the entire team, heaved a desperation shot from behind the midcourt line that swished through the net just as the final buzzer started going off. All five Augie players fell to the floor in disbelief, and the stunned Augustana fratboys walked out of the building in complete silence. I'm amazed that nobody got crushed in the pileup of delirious North Park students on the floor. It was one of those unbelievable nights that no one who was there will ever forget.

Gordon, who lived across the hall from me in the dorm, was an extremely surly individual who was not exactly the most beloved member of the Vikings. But he was golden that night, and afterwards members of the student section made up business cards that identified them as members of the "Mike Gordon Appreciation Society". Embossed on the bottom of the business card, in memory of that night, were the words, "47 feet of bad attitude". I still carry mine in my wallet.

I've never experienced a more highly-charged sporting event. The hair was literally standing up on the back of my neck throughout the entire game. I was so exhausted afterwards I could've slept for a week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 14, 2006, 09:34:34 AM
Of course, for us there's the Wabash national title in 1982. Thanks Pete!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 14, 2006, 10:09:34 AM
Thanks for the answer Greg.  To think, if it wasn't for that 'lean in' (sorry, but that's how I remember it too) Wooster might be working on the longest active post-season streak in DIII. 

And since we're on the topic of that '01-'02 season, if I recall, that was Mark Borland's aka 'The Hair', last season for the Tigers.  Does anyone know what happened to him?

Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 13, 2006, 08:37:37 PM
Quote from: goscots on December 13, 2006, 07:48:30 PMWitt used reserved seating tickets this year but still didn't tear them upon entry.


That's true, they did not.  Which might go a long way towards answering why the aisles in the student sections on both sides of the stands were full of people all game long. 

Maybe this is because the students chose not to sit where their assingned ticket was located.  I remember during the radio broadcast, Mike Breckenridge kept referring to the crowd as not being near capacity and he guestimated it to be around 24-2500 at best.  When I saw the actual attendance #'s posted on Witt's website I thought to myself, how could Breckenridge be so off?  But with this talk of the student sections overflowing, I'm guessing it had to to with the students leaving their assigned seats and cramming into their respective student sections?  Just a guess on my part.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on December 14, 2006, 10:36:26 AM
scots fan, I was there and I can tell you thats exactly what happened, many of us go to our assigned seats to find we were around a bunch or older citizens... which did not bode well for chant starting... or even just talking to your friends about the game.... so we wriggled around the gym a little bit
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 14, 2006, 10:46:48 AM
There were 3 NCAC teams in action last night and they went a respectable 2-1 in thoses games.

Allegheny - 49
Thiel - 42

Hiram - 97
Grove City - 92
(2 OT)

Wilmington - 76
Oberlin - 65

'Gheny had a closer than expected result.  Hiram has surprisingly put together a 2 game winning streak and has Thiel next so it's a very real possibility that the Pups could be looking at a 3 game winning streak!!! :o  And the Oberlin loss was closer than I would have expected as well vs. an OAC opponent.  All in all, a pretty good showing for the NCAC last night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 14, 2006, 10:48:51 AM
You just beat me to it, SF!  Also there was a game on Monday:

Grove City 76, Kenyon 70
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 14, 2006, 10:59:56 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 14, 2006, 10:48:51 AM
You just beat me to it, SF!  Also there was a game on Monday:
;D

Man, what has happened to Kenyon?  The 1st week of the season there was a real buzz going on about the Lords and all of their promissing young talent.  Then they get swept in the NCAC/OAC challenge (although I wouldn't consider those bad losses).  But then they strung together 3 solid wins @ W&J (picked to finish 2nd in the PrAC), Allegheny (who has since knocked off OWU) and Case, only to now lose 2 in a row to the EC and Grove City at home?  I guess, youth will be served.  Maybe these sorts of letdowns will go away as this Kenyon team starts to mature.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 14, 2006, 12:41:13 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 14, 2006, 09:34:34 AM
Of course, for us there's the Wabash national title in 1982. Thanks Pete!

Since I was 5 years then I'll have to rely on the historical record for that one.

If I can insert a great game I was in attendance for here it would be the 1997 ICAC tournament title game at Rose-Hulman. The game was won by a last second shot by Chad Tabor. Great game all around, great result, and all in that nasty airplane hanger RHIT used to play basketball in.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 14, 2006, 03:09:53 PM
I'm a little late to the party but I'll add my favorite D3 moments.(sorry so long)

Obviously being a Hope fan, any game with Calvin is memorable, but there have been simply to many to single out one.  Last years thriller up at Calvin that was capped with a 3 pointer with 2 seconds to play by Fr Caleb Veldhouse was an amazing display of intense basketball from the tip.

My personal favorite though was in the MIAA tournament Championship of 2002.  Hope had limped into the MIAA tournament having blown the championship with back to back losses to Calvin and Albion to finish 8-4, losing out to Calvin's 9-3, Hope had led the MIAA standings for about 5 weeks.

They were wounded and down, struggled mightily to sneak by Kalamazoo in the semi-finals, winning with FT's on a controversial call at the end of the game.  Now were faced with beating Calvin on their home floor, they beat Calvin by 2 at home and had lost by 14 at Calvin just one week earlier.

Hope trailed by as many as 17 in the first half, and managed to cut the lead to 11 by the break, the Fieldhouse at Calvin was going nuts.  In the second half Hope turned the tables and ralied to out score Calvin 45-27 fueled by the emotional lift of Hope's own student section and the 50/50 crowd that day.  Don Overbeek had a monster game for Hope with 23 points and 11 rebounds.  Somewhere early in the half there was a stretch of back-to-back-to-back 3's that lit the fire.

Not many thought Hope could pull it back together to win that game.


Hope's NCAA tournament run of 1998 collectively was pretty amazing to witness.  Hope had lost their AA forward Dave Muhlenberg a few weeks earlier to injury.  They were 20-2 when the injury occured and immediately lost to Alma 66-65, Alma's only win over Hope in something like 25 years.  Hope lost the MIAA tournament Championship on their home floor to Albion, the first MIAA team to do such a thing.  They were struggling.

The NCAA tournament began and Hope was still ranked high enough within their region to get a host game and beat Allegheny 80-66.  Hope then hosted the sectional and destroyed 1 loss Christophyer Newport 81-64 leading 45-16 at the half, and handily beat John Carroll 84-66 also led big at the half in that one.  Hope did all this at home in their "backup" gym with just 1250 seats all temporary bleachers.

The good fortunes continued in Salem when they whipped Wilkes 81-61 before running into UW-Platteville who were just beginning their run of titles.  It was an unexpected run after the injury and the struggles at the end of the year but one we won't forget in Holland for a long time.  No games with drama but the determination that team showed was simply incredible......I've never seen another team more focussed on a goal than that one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 14, 2006, 03:21:55 PM
Here's one a little more relevant to this board.......

The 2005 NCAA tournament game at Albion against John Carroll.  Albion had won their midweek game over Wooster in shall we say controversial fashion (sorry to bring up old wounds) after dominating the first half and a furious Wooster rally  in the end.

John Carroll brought a lot of fans to Albion and they were loud and boisterous and combined with Albion's loud and boisterous students and the accoustical equivalent of a large closet it was a pretty charged atmosphere inside Kresge.

What makes this memorable is not what I saw but what I missed.  JCU put together a 2 minute rally at the end of the game led by Brandon Mimes that looked like they had stolen this game from the Britons.  If I hadn't seen it I wouldn't have believed it, the rally itself was enough to make it a memorable game.

With just a couple seconds remaining and trailing by two, Albion got the ball to Michael Thomas who took a couple dribbles and lauched a prayer from near mid-court............the ball bounced off the back of the iron and straight up in the air.  It was at this point that my head went down feeling Albion had lost this game........but something happened.........I looked up and people were running around the gym crazed going nuts, I was suddenly surround by people who could only mutter "Oh my God" over and over.  Mr Thomas' shot had gone in.  Albion won 80-79.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 14, 2006, 06:03:28 PM
also of note with that game-that was the year that john carroll barely survived making it that far after surviving the 2OT game against witt in the second round-i forget his name but the coaches son on jcu-made this impossible rainbow 3 to tie it with a little time to go to send it in OT-that just had to cap off our heartbreaker year after losing to wooster and then jcu in multiple overtimes.ugh.........
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 14, 2006, 06:11:29 PM
Next week, Wooster is in southern California for a two-game swing.  The second of the two, Wednesday night against California Baptist, will have live video available from the California Baptist website.  Go to the webpage below, and I was told that some time before game time the link to the video should activate.  The price for a single game is $6.95.

http://www.cbulancers.com/liveEvents/liveEvents.dbml?SPSID=37637&SPID=3077&DB_OEM_ID=8100&
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 14, 2006, 10:58:56 PM
Make it two wins for Earlham as they beat Rose tonight, 70-62 in Richmond and reclaim the Mutchner Cup.

Four Quakers in double figures, led by LaRon Henry with 15. Neil Collins had 11 points and 10 rebounds from the point guard spot.

Earlham is tantalizingly close to me at Franklin on Saturday, but I won't be going. But, someday I will actually see the Quakers play and give my full opinion on this team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 15, 2006, 12:12:00 PM
Mmmm...delicious karma...

http://d3hoops.com/releases.php?release=4392&scoreboard
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on December 15, 2006, 07:47:32 PM
Still the digs about ticket prices at the HPER.  $8 = 2 Lattes +/- .  < 2 packs tobacco products.  3 (?) beers just about anywhere, if you're lucky.  Where else can you get three quality hours of entertainment for that price.  Have you bowled lately? You remind me of the people who walk past a club saying, "$2 cover?  C'mon, the place down the street is $1."  Get real, when drinks are $3.  Tell me, are you a teacher, or perhaps a civil servant?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on December 15, 2006, 08:21:59 PM
Oh, and yeah, jump on the free video ::)
Wait, I get it, your Wooster education has given you the leg up on a minimum wage job...
Sorry for the sarcasm.  My SO says I am very talented in that area.
My point is, if you are as big a fan as you say you are, then why the gripe about what is really an insignificant amount of $'s to attend what is really a quality product?
I know, I'll be ignored, because I'm an infrequent poster.  The point is, you are whining about something for no good reason, other than to run down Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 15, 2006, 09:08:52 PM
Ah, but Wabash has the best bargain in town for hoops.

It's free to be...you and me!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 15, 2006, 09:37:03 PM
Quote from: drt on December 15, 2006, 07:47:32 PM
Where else can you get three quality hours of entertainment for that price.

On Feb 3 you can get that same quality entertainment for 5 bucks in Wooster!


Quote from: drt on December 15, 2006, 08:21:59 PM
The point is, you are whining about something for no good reason, other than to run down Witt.

I think the point was that the admission price was out of line compared to what other DIII colleges charge for men's basketball, and WAY out of line for what  they charge for women's hoops.  As Smedindy points out, games at Wabash (and many other DIII schools) are free!


I thought that we had gotten past the name calling and personal jabs...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 16, 2006, 08:48:54 AM
Quote from: drt on December 15, 2006, 07:47:32 PM
Still the digs about ticket prices at the HPER.  $8 = 2 Lattes +/- .  < 2 packs tobacco products.  3 (?) beers just about anywhere, if you're lucky.  Where else can you get three quality hours of entertainment for that price.  Have you bowled lately? You remind me of the people who walk past a club saying, "$2 cover?  C'mon, the place down the street is $1."  Get real, when drinks are $3.  Tell me, are you a teacher, or perhaps a civil servant?

You're comparing apples to oranges.  It's more like comparing one coffeehouse to another.  The first one sells a latte for $4, and they offer free refills (a free women's game when they precede the men).  The other sells their lattes for $6.40 (60% higher), with no free refills.

I still dare anyone to find a single DIII school that charges $8 for men's basketball, let alone women's.  Or, a DIII school that does not allow admission to both the men's and women's game for one price when they are in one time frame. 

Believe it or not, I'd be bothered by this no matter which school was doing it, including Wooster.  I don't smoke anymore, don't frequent clubs, don't have a Wooster education, am not a teacher or civil servant, and a basketball does not last three hours unless it goes into multiple overtimes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 16, 2006, 10:28:10 AM
drt try to make some sense in what you say first of all

come on guys i thought we were over this argument-its not like witt is gonna refund the extra 3 dollars
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 16, 2006, 11:37:51 AM
8 dollars? Look, I understand, people have kids, bills, etc. But 8 dollars? That's like what, lunch at Chili's? A quarter tank of gas? The last time I went to a movie the tickets for my girlfriend and I were nearly 20 bucks! Seriously, give it a rest. If you didn't want to pay it you shouldn't have. No one put a gun to your head and made you buy that ticket.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 16, 2006, 12:30:55 PM
I want to be clear from the outset that I was not and am not bothered by the $8 charge for either the men's or women's game.  Reasonable minds can differ on this question.  I'm only dipping my toe in this for the sake of providing a little relevant background.

Quote from: Li'l Giant on December 16, 2006, 11:37:51 AMIf you didn't want to pay it you shouldn't have. No one put a gun to your head and made you buy that ticket.

We found out about the $8 women's ticket, separate from the men's ticket that we had bought in advance, upon arrival at the HPER door.  It is true that we could have known about it in advance, had we thought to check with Wittenberg, but that did not occur to us, being that we are accustomed to free admission for women's hoops.  So the choice presented to us was either pay the $8 for the women's game, or find something to do for 3.5 hours (until the start of the men's JV game), or return to Wooster.  Not exactly a "gun to the head," but none of the choices were palatable if you don't want to pay the $8. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 16, 2006, 12:49:22 PM
See, this is the kind of stuff that can really add spice to a rivalry. Calvin fans and Hope fans find every little pretext, every little niggling detail, to be a reason to nag at the other school, and it really feeds their mutual antipathy even when they're not playing each other. The whole extra-$8-for-a-women's-game thing may just make that next Witt/Woo game extra nasty .... and therefore extra special.

A good grudge has to be fed and nurtured, just as if it was one of your children. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 16, 2006, 03:31:28 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 16, 2006, 08:48:54 AM

I still dare anyone to find a single DIII school that charges $8 for men's basketball, let alone women's.  Or, a DIII school that does not allow admission to both the men's and women's game for one price when they are in one time frame. 

Just for reference............the cushy seats at Hope ar $10, reserved $8 and general admission $6............. if you get the $3.50 orange plastic sippy cup you can return it all season for free refills.

Women's games are $5 and you can sit wherever you want.

When men and women played double-headers last season, you paid the men's game price.


The small college tournament in Grand Rapids charged $8 for general admission to everyone.

Every other MIAA school charges $5............I'm not sure but I don't think they charge for anyone but Hope and Calvin.


Look at it this way your supporting a Division 3 athletic program by shelling out $8. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goodknight on December 16, 2006, 03:40:22 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 16, 2006, 12:49:22 PM
See, this is the kind of stuff that can really add spice to a rivalry. Calvin fans and Hope fans find every little pretext, every little niggling detail, to be a reason to nag at the other school, and it really feeds their mutual antipathy even when they're not playing each other. The whole extra-$8-for-a-women's-game thing may just make that next Witt/Woo game extra nasty .... and therefore extra special.

A good grudge has to be fed and nurtured, just as if it was one of your children. ;)

Exactly, Greg!  Why, you should have heard what a major Hope donor and board member said to me yesterday at the United Center about Calvin's new arena. ::)
But I'm almost over it. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 16, 2006, 04:13:09 PM
Goodknights response:  "It's been in the master plan for years" ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goodknight on December 16, 2006, 04:41:32 PM
Quote from: sac on December 16, 2006, 04:13:09 PM
Goodknights response:  "It's been in the master plan for years" ;)

Actually...for many years...and no less than many weeks before the DeVos Fieldhouse was conceived. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 16, 2006, 05:31:15 PM
Quote from: sac on December 16, 2006, 03:31:28 PM
Just for reference............the cushy seats at Hope ar $10, reserved $8 and general admission $6.

Yes, but your $10/$8/$6 admission to DeVos buys you something you can't get at the HPER Center:

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.hope.edu%2Fimg%2Ffieldhouse%2F05ddevosconstruct145.jpg&hash=d1a934c96f39212bbf00b06760cef80c404fa8f5)

;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 16, 2006, 06:08:28 PM
In other news Earlham beats Franklin College on the Road today.   

Earlham 71
Franklin 66

Billyp- Make that 3 in a Rowwwwwwwwwwww
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 16, 2006, 08:34:39 PM
Final from Granville:

Wabash 56
Denison 52

LGs never trailed in this game starting out with an 11-2 run. Wabash lead by as many as 12 in the second half but the Big Red made a run in the final minutes getting as close as 4. Good job by Wabash to withstand the run on the road and get the win.

Andrew Zimmer led the LGs with 20 points and Chase Haltom had 16.

Next up for Wabash is a game at Franklin on Monday night. Wabash is 3-5 overall, 1-1 in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 16, 2006, 08:58:18 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 48  Cedarville 47

This was a high scoring half with both teams shooting well (over 50%).

Wooster (7-0) is being led by Tom Port with 16 points, James Cooper with 10 points, Tim Vandervaart with 7 points and Brandon Johnson with 7 points.

Cedarville (9-1) is being led by Ryan Short with 13 points, Chris Beals with 10 points and Chris Walker with 8 points.

GO SCOTS!  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 16, 2006, 09:57:29 PM
Final:  Wooster 104  Cedarville 95

Wooster went on a 28-12 run to start the 2nd half and take control of this game.  This was a nice win over a solid 9-1 NAIA squad.  ;D

Scots were led tonight by Tom Port with 29 points, James Cooper with 23 points, Tim Vandervaart with 19 points and Devin Fulk with 12 points

Cedarville was led tonight by Ryan Short with 28 points and Chris Beals with 20 points.

Wooster is now 8-0. :)  Next game is at Pomona Pitzer (CA) on Monday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on December 16, 2006, 10:15:27 PM
Wasn't able to listen to the Wooster-Cedarville game by the Wooster internet feed (quicktime or mediaplayer).  Went to plan b and got the game loud and clear via the Cedarville internet radio feed (mediaplayer).

Has anyone else had trouble with the Wooster feed this season?  If so, is there a fix?  Thanks, nd
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 16, 2006, 10:49:48 PM
Other Final Scores:

Thiel 63  Hiram 62 (Terriers fall just short on the road)
Wilmington 85  John Carroll 72 (OAC leader takes a road loss)
Ohio Northern 64  Mt. Union 51 (ONU next plays Witt)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 16, 2006, 11:00:18 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on December 16, 2006, 10:15:27 PM
Wasn't able to listen to the Wooster-Cedarville game by the Wooster internet feed (quicktime or mediaplayer).  Went to plan b and got the game loud and clear via the Cedarville internet radio feed (mediaplayer).

Has anyone else had trouble with the Wooster feed this season?  If so, is there a fix?  Thanks, nd

The audio links on the Wooster Interactive page are dead.  In order to listen to the game audio online, you have to go to the source, the WQKT website.  The games that are available online are listed on their sports page at:

http://wqkt.com/index.php?sports=true

You will need the Windows Media Player.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 16, 2006, 11:01:36 PM
Tom Port played like an All-American tonight.  In the first half, he was smooth as silk from the outside.  In the second, he drove the lane without fear.  He was big on the boards, and even played adequate defense.  He was a leader on the floor; everything you could want from a 5th-year senior All-American trying to lead his team to a title. 

Cedarville's a good team, but this game should not have been as close as it was.  After the early second-half run that wooscotsfan mentions, which was built on defense and good shooting, Wooster held onto a 17-19 point lead throughout much of the second half.  Down the stretch, the twin whammies of poor foul shooting by the Scots and light-out three-balls raining in for the YJs made it into something of a low-budget thriller.  Still it was a good win for the Scots.

Congratulations to James Cooper, who reached the 1,000 point milestone with a nice drive to the hoop late in the first half.  [gripe] This is the second game I've attended this year where a player reached 1,000.  At Denison, Kristen Sheffield scored her millenial point, and at the next stoppage, she was presented with a specially prepared basketball to commemorate the event.  She went into the stands to give the ball to her parents, and was applauded politely by the dozens in attendance.  Tonight Cooper made his thousandth on a beautiful play, very apropos of Cooper, and it wasn't recognized by anyone (but me  ;)) until there was 1:35 left in the game (and Cooper was at 1,013); and even then, it was just a PA announcement over a reasonably loud crowd.   :-\ [/gripe]

Wooster leaves tomorrow for a quick tour of some of the less interesting parts of Southern California, playing Pomona-Pitzer on Monday and Cal Baptist on Weds.  The Wooster women are also touring the eastern Southland this week, playing at La Verne on Tuesday and Whittier on Thursday.  Safe travels to both teams and to any Scot Snowbirds winging with them!   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 17, 2006, 12:00:06 AM
I wasn't able to make it up for the game tonight, but see from the box score that Cedarville led in rebounds (46-34) and assists (21-18) - the first time game this year that the Scots trailed in either of these stats.  I'll bet that coach Moore wasn't very pleased - particularly with the rebounding. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 17, 2006, 12:30:10 AM
Cedarville moves the ball very well; in my opinion they were the best offensive team that Wooster has faced this season.  In the first half they were able to get lots of open looks on threes and also had quickness at the guard positions that enabled them to get to the basket.  Well coached, and athletic.

Wooster came out in the second half with a rejuvenated defense that was determined to guard the perimeter.  It worked, propelling them to the 80-61 lead. Unfortunately, with success, complacency isn't always far behind.  Maybe a better word is boredom.  The Scots knew the game was in hand, they'd had their way on the offensive end pretty much all night, scoring in all sorts of fashions, and seemed to lose interest.  They'd been there and done that, and were ready for pizza.

Cedarville, though, wasn't ready to follow Wooster's idea of the script.  They got pumped up after making a few shots, and suddenly a rally was underway.  Wooster began playing tougher defense, but then Cedarville went into their JCU imitation, buring three-pointers from 25 feet.  They weren't lucky, either, they can flat out shoot the ball.  In the end, Wooster was the better team, at least on their home court, but I thought the final margin was more indicitive of the difference in the clubs than the 21-point lead that Wooster had at one point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 17, 2006, 12:39:03 AM
after seeing the cedarville-witt game earlier, i can relate with what happened vs wooster. witt had a 27 point lead in the second half but cedarville whittled it down and would never go away. that team has some tenacity-maybe they would be the 3rd wheel in the NCAC haha. hope all have a good holiday. i will be in attendance at ONU tuesday and possibly otterbein thursday for witt games. i will keep all updated-no fear
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 17, 2006, 12:43:08 AM
Tom Port was simply amazing tonight (yesterday). His shot was smooth and confident. If it wasn't a pull up jumper it was an unstoppable drive to the hoop. Two words - All American

Congratulations to James Cooper for joining the 1000 point club. It had been noted here that he was 10 points away coming into the game, but the first 10 minutes of the game was so fast paced I forgot all about keeping track. It was announced in the second half when Wooster had a comfortable lead (which did later shrink to 6 points).

The Scots shot well and took care of the ball ( only 8 TO's ), plus came out in the second half with another stretch of defensive intensity that essentially put the game away.  A bit of drama with the Scots first game of below par FT shooting and the guards getting in foul trouble, (Johnson, Fulk, and Bidwell all had 4 fouls with 8 minutes remaining), but Van Horn and Cooper played well down the stretch, (Van Horn had a timely steal when Cedarville could have cut it to 4), hit the FT's and kept it a 2-3 possesion game.

Good Luck to the Scots in California and come back 10-0......

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 17, 2006, 09:24:52 AM
Link to the Wooster Daily Record article on the win over Cedarville:
http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1183411

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 18, 2006, 08:50:03 AM
I know I'm late about commenting on Wooster's win, but I've been busy with holiday stuff all weekend long.  I wasn't able to make it to the game, but I did see a replay.  The first thing I noticed was the pace.  I couldn't believe Cedarville wanted to run with the Scots and they did a pretty good job of it in the 1st half.  One of the commentators on the local channel said they might as well just turn the shot clocks off in this game because niether team was coming close to using up the entire 35. 

I don't know what was said at halftime, but the Scots looked like a different team on the defensive end of the floor to start the 2nd half and key that 22-6 run that basically put the game out of reach for the Yellow Jackets.  At least that's what we thought... 

Cedarville is a nice team.  I saw both the Walsh and Georgetown games and I agree with WB in that I thought Cedarville was the best offensive team all around that Wooster has faced this season.  Maybe we caught Walsh's and G'town's shooters on off nights, but the YJ's had some kids who could fill it up from outside and that is how they managed to almost pull off a huge 2nd half comeback just like they did vs. Witt.

I'd also like to pour out some more praises to Devin Fulk.  I can't think of too many better 6th men out there in DIII land than Devin Fulk.  He could easily be starting at any other NCAC school (including Witt) IMO, but he has seemingly embraced his role off the bench for the Scots.  I know that Port had a tremendous night (like DC said it was an AA effort) and Cooper had his businesslike 22, but, even though Devin didn't shoot it quite up to his standards from beyond the arc, he made an impact in that game on the defensive end coming up with some key steals and his all out hustle and diving for loose balls really impressed me.

Good luck to the Scots on their trip to the left coast.  Here's to bringing a perfect 10-0 record back to Wooster!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 18, 2006, 06:39:42 PM
Quote from: WooMix on December 16, 2006, 11:00:18 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on December 16, 2006, 10:15:27 PM
Wasn't able to listen to the Wooster-Cedarville game by the Wooster internet feed (quicktime or mediaplayer).  Went to plan b and got the game loud and clear via the Cedarville internet radio feed (mediaplayer).

Has anyone else had trouble with the Wooster feed this season?  If so, is there a fix?  Thanks, nd

The audio links on the Wooster Interactive page are dead.  In order to listen to the game audio online, you have to go to the source, the WQKT website.  The games that are available online are listed on their sports page at:

http://wqkt.com/index.php?sports=true

You will need the Windows Media Player.

I just checked the Wooster webpage and found the audio link for quicktime to be working normally.

http://www.wooster.edu/interactive/

The Cedarville game was the only time that I have had any trouble listening in through the Woo webpage this season, so I doubt it will be a recurring problem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 18, 2006, 10:09:19 PM
Earlham win streak snapped, lose 84-74 at Anderson.

Trailed by 16 at the break....Tristian Gregory led with 22, while Jewett added 21.

Head out to the great state of Pennsylvania for a holiday tourney next, though they'll stop well west of the land of milk and honey, Centre County.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 18, 2006, 10:11:28 PM
Ugh. Wabash blasted by Franklin 82-58. The Grizzlies have now beat our ass in football and hoops in the same year. I'm going to go pour more rum now.

Is it football season yet?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 18, 2006, 10:31:05 PM
Well I just clicked on the Live feed for the Wooster game.  We will see how this goes.  Thanks Scotsbrod for the new link!  By the way - I just saw that I have -2 Karma??  Since I'm brand new to this site, I don't really understand how the whole Karma thing goes - could anyone explain to me?  I'd appreciate it.  Two good games in two days...Wooster tonight and Witt/ONU tomorrow. 

Just quickly wanted to add my thoughts about the Cedarville/Wooster game.  I was very impressed with Cedarville like everyone else.  I have to agree they have had the best ball movement of any team I have seen yet.  They really can shoot the lights out when the game comes down on the line.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2006, 10:48:36 PM
Quote from: division3hoops on December 18, 2006, 10:31:05 PMBy the way - I just saw that I have -2 Karma??  Since I'm brand new to this site, I don't really understand how the whole Karma thing goes - could anyone explain to me?  I'd appreciate it. 

http://www.d3hoops.com/faq.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2006, 11:04:40 PM
While Wooster is "schooling" Pomona-Pitzer (Scots up by 20 with 0:45 left in the 1st), I thought I'd put up a post about the interesting "school" that is Pomona-Pitzer.  As you may be aware, there is no college called "Pomona-Pitzer."  Pomona College and Pitzer College are separate institutions that share a campus in Claremont, CA.  Actually, they're not completely separate, and then again, they don't entirely share a campus.  See, I told you they were interesting!  ;)

The Claremont Colleges are made up of five undergraduate institutions (and two graduate schools) that share a campus and many common facilities (including library) and offer cross-registration, but retain separate identities.  Part of the sharing is in athletics, both intramural and intercollegiate.  Hence, from the five undergraduate institutions, we have two D3 programs, Pomona-Pitzer and Claremont-Mudd-Scripps.  That other team is made up of student-athletes from Claremont McKenna College, Harvey Mudd College, and Scripps College, which is a women's college. 

Each of the Claremont Colleges is extremely highly selective and each enjoys an outstanding academic reputation.  For more information, click here ==>http://www.claremont.edu/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 18, 2006, 11:06:21 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 47  Pomona-Pitzer 27

Wooster jumped out to a 12-0 lead and has been in control of this game.  :) Wooster is being led by Devin Fulk with 10 points, Brandon Johnson with 8 points, James Cooper with 8 points and Tim Vandervaart also with 8 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2006, 11:16:49 PM
One other interesting thing about Pomona-Pitzer:  after years of infrequent discussion on various pages of this forum, I think we've decided that the men's teams representing Pomona and Pitzer are the only ones in D3 that have a feminine nickname:  the Sagehens.  There are many gender-neutral nicknames (like Scots), there are some women's teams still playing with masculine nicknames (like Amherst's Lord Jeffs and St. Joseph's Monks--can a woman be a monk?), and there are some feminine-sounding nicknames (like the NYU Violets), but I think the Sagehens are alone in their special brand of gender confusion.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 18, 2006, 11:19:14 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 18, 2006, 11:04:40 PMWhile Wooster is "schooling" Pomona-Pitzer (Scots up by 20 with 0:45 left in the 1st), I thought I'd put up a post about the interesting "school" that is Pomona-Pitzer.  As you may be aware, there is no college called "Pomona-Pitzer."  Pomona College and Pitzer College are separate institutions that share a campus in Claremont, CA.  Actually, they're not completely separate, and then again, they don't entirely share a campus.  See, I told you they were interesting!  ;)

The Claremont Colleges are made up of five undergraduate institutions (and two graduate schools) that share a campus and many common facilities (including library) and offer cross-registration, but retain separate identities.  Part of the sharing is in athletics, both intramural and intercollegiate.  Hence, from the five undergraduate institutions, we have two D3 programs, Pomona-Pitzer and Claremont-Mudd-Scripps.  That other team is made up of student-athletes from Claremont McKenna College, Harvey Mudd College, and Scripps College, which is a women's college. 

Each of the Claremont Colleges is extremely highly selective and each enjoys an outstanding academic reputation.  For more information, click here ==>http://www.claremont.edu/

The local (San Antonio) news had a deal a couple of years ago explaining this because San Antonio Spurs head coach Gregg Popovich's first head coaching job was at Pomona-Pitzer.

Pop also has a Wabash connection (http://www2.wabash.edu/blog/pa/2006/02/popovich_nearly_a_little_giant.html) (shamless plug, I know)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on December 18, 2006, 11:27:02 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 18, 2006, 11:16:49 PM
One other interesting thing about Pomona-Pitzer:  after years of infrequent discussion on various pages of this forum, I think we've decided that the men's teams representing Pomona and Pitzer are the only ones in D3 that have a feminine nickname:  the Sagehens.  There are many gender-neutral nicknames (like Scots), there are some women's teams still playing with masculine nicknames (like Amherst's Lord Jeffs and St. Joseph's Monks--can a woman be a monk?), and there are some feminine-sounding nicknames (like the NYU Violets), but I think the Sagehens are alone in their special brand of gender confusion.   :)

Speaking of feminine-sounding nickmames, I'm just glad my alma mater switched from "Boy Beauties" to "Titans."

page 10:
http://www.iwu.edu/~iwunews/sports/07IWUMenbbguide.pdf

"Boy Beauty Q" just doesn't have the same ring.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 18, 2006, 11:29:28 PM
Quote from: Titan Q on December 18, 2006, 11:27:02 PM"Boy Beauty Q" just doesn't have the same ring.

Wow. You would win the all-time school spirit award to have a username like that. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2006, 11:43:03 PM
Wooster is up 28 with 8-something left.  I hope to start hearing names of freshmen (besides Elam) pretty soon.

UPDATE:  the jayvees (i.e. frosh) did come in a few minutes later, with the margin at 23 or so.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 18, 2006, 11:57:54 PM
Final:  Wooster 97  Pomona-Pitzer 77

Wooster actually led by 30 points in the 2nd half before the Sagehens cut the margin. :)  Wooster was led by Tom Port with 18 points, Brandon Johnson with 18 points, James Cooper with 16 points and Devin Fulk with 13 points.

Pomona-Pitzer was led by David Knowles with 22 points and Jabarri Reynolds with 21 points.

Wooster is now 9-0. :)  Next up is California Baptist on Wednesday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 19, 2006, 12:14:13 AM
I managed to catch the end of the game online.  If I am not mistaken, Mike, the radio commentator, said Wooster was 6-14 from the line.  Can somebody please confirm that?  That did not sound right to me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 19, 2006, 12:38:03 AM
They were 6-14 from the line.  I could be way wrong on this one, but this seemed to me to be another game in which the Scots got a bit bored, somewhat like the Cedarville game, although in that one it didn't happen until the second half.  In this game, they jumped out of the box quickly, shooting lights out while PP couldn't buy a hoop.  With about 11 minutes to go in the first half, they had a large double digit lead and were on a pace to score well over a hundred. 

But they cooled off, and just seemed to only get motivated in spurts.  Hard to blame them, when they certainly seemed to be the much better team and were never at all threatened.  On to California Baptist where the competition will probably be stiffer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 19, 2006, 12:58:35 AM
Here is the box score from PP's site

http://www.physical-education.pomona.edu/mens/basketball/stats/2007/wcvspp.htm

Five Scots in double figures with Vandervaart posting a double-double (15 rebounds).

Each team scores 50 points in the second half. That won't sit well with coach Moore.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 19, 2006, 09:10:33 AM
Thanks for the props Oxy.  It's always nice to get an outside perspective.

Looking at the stats from last night's game, it's hard to believe that Wooster shot better from beyond the arc than they did from the stripe but they did just that last night (52%-42%).  That's two sub-par performances in a row from the ft line for the Scots.  I'm going to attribute this to the lack of practice time this past week because of finals and the long trip to the left coast. 

Also of note, with his 13 points last night Devin Fulk pushed his average to 10 ppg giving the Scots 5 players averaging double figures. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 19, 2006, 11:25:18 AM
Anyone interested in tuning in the Witt/ONU game tonight, here is the link to the Wittenberg Webcast (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/sportsnetwork/).  I couldn't find any webcasts available on the ONU Basketball homepage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2006, 01:24:23 PM
I'm just glad Wooster pulled the starters - and that Isaiah Thomas wasn't coaching Pomona - Pitzer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 19, 2006, 01:47:12 PM
^^^^^ :D

I'm guessing Moore pulled the starters just in time.  Once the lead reached 30, I'm sure the P-P coaches started warning the Wooster players to stay out of the paint as that now seems to be the thing to do if you're a coach on the losing end of a blowout.   Or if you're Isaiah Thomas. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 19, 2006, 03:33:43 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 19, 2006, 01:47:12 PMOnce the lead reached 30, I'm sure the P-P coaches started warning the Wooster players to stay out of the paint as that now seems to be the thing to do if you're a coach on the losing end of a blowout.   Or if you're Isaiah Thomas.

I know this isn't an NBA message board, but how can Isiah Thomas not get suspended for that? It reminds me of last baseball season when Ozzie Guillen ordered a rookie pitcher to bean an opposing player. That should have gotten Guillen suspended, too.

If a coach sends a player out to hurt someone (I'm looking at you, John Chaney) they need to get disciplined. The leagues are quick to suspend the players, but they need to suspend coaches for that crap, too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 19, 2006, 05:23:20 PM
As a long-time Pistons' fan and observer, that does have Thomas' fingerprints all over it, but I haven't seen any EVIDENCE that he orchestrated it.

I must say I liked Isiah better as a player than an executive - I think he's in over his head.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 19, 2006, 07:14:47 PM
The Wittenber Tiger Radio Network is on the air.

#6 Tigers vs. #7 Ohio Northern.

Should be a great game.

Go Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 19, 2006, 08:04:24 PM
Witt down 29-19 late in first half.  I'd offer more insight, but the speakers on my home computer kinda suck.

I missed the opening of the game; who is doing the Witt broadcast tonight?

UPDATE: Ohio Northern leads 33-28 at the half.  Big 3 pointer from Mark Caraway late to cut the lead down.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2006, 08:13:52 PM
Jim and Jeff; I didn't catch the last names.  They spent a lot of the pre-game discussing how high-scoring they thought the game would be--I'm not sure why.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on December 19, 2006, 08:31:21 PM
DC- I wondered the same thing.  They commented a couple times how surprised they were hoe low scoring the game was.  They also said how Witt loves to score points.  Have they seen Witt at all this year?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 19, 2006, 08:36:18 PM
Scott Leo produces Wright State's games, they are playing Marist at the Nutter Center tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2006, 08:39:58 PM
By the way, I am not having the least problem with the Stretch webcast tonight. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 19, 2006, 08:41:31 PM
I'll say one thing in listening to these Witt broadcasters, we Wooster fans are spoiled by having a play-by-play guy as good as Mike Breckenridge doing the Scots games. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 19, 2006, 08:52:13 PM
I agree.  I had to listen for almost 4 minutes before I heard a score update!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2006, 09:02:25 PM
Well, these are the Emergency Back-up Announcers; probably they are students.  Their regular PBP man is unavailable, as W4E has pointed out.  Both Witt and Woo are spoiled in having professional broadcasters for their primary games; Woo is further spoiled by having their professional broadcaster not distracted by other jobs (I think Scott Leo works for the BlueJackets--or is it the Crew?--as well as WSU.)  Many schools have no broadcast or webcast at all, so I'm thankful for whatever I can get.

Also the Wittcasters noted at the beginning of the game that they have a miserable broadcast position, FWIW.

Witt's in a lot of trouble in this game.  Maybe Greg Hill can find some of that beyond-the-arc magic he had against Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 19, 2006, 09:04:38 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 19, 2006, 09:02:25 PM
Well, these are the Emergency Back-up Announcers; probably they are students. 

no
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 19, 2006, 09:08:08 PM
They sound older to me
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 19, 2006, 09:10:36 PM
Mark Snyder, finally!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 19, 2006, 09:15:55 PM
Final score
ONU 68
Witt 51

Wow, I honestly don't know what to say about this game but that I didn't think Witt would go down like that.  Two both great teams. 
Listening on the computer is definitely not as good as being there.  Anyone who was at the game...any comments?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 19, 2006, 11:04:54 PM
Here is the link to the Witt - ONU boxscore: http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/06-07statistics/witm1219.htm

Several factors contributed to the big win for ONU tonight:
-Witt shot only 35% from the floor;  ONU shot 56%
-Witt only made 1 three pointer; ONU made 6 three pointers
-Pat Denbow did not play due to his lingering ankle injury
-Jack Hemenway only played ~21 minutes and fouled out
-Dane Borchers was limited to 28 minutes due to fouls (he had 4)
-Greg Badenhop was unstoppable for ONU as he had 23 points

The Polar Bears should be a great test for Wooster in the first game of the Mose Hole Classic on 12/29.  Let's hope that some strong defense by Van Horn, Johnson and/or Bidwell can slow down Badenhop because that will be one of the keys to a win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: onefan on December 19, 2006, 11:31:00 PM
Went  to the ONU/Witt game tonight....Witt looked flat....especially in the second half and looked to run out of gas mid way through the second half. Northern got Witt's big man in foul trouble and they worked the paint heavy in the second half. I really thought it would be a tight game, but Witt just didn't get it done tonight. Give Northern credit...tough defense and they played with some fire and intensity that was sadly missing in the ONU/BW contest. Witt's guards didn't look very sharp tonight...has that been a problem at all for them this year? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 20, 2006, 01:19:13 AM
sounds like witt didnt have it all together tonight from what i heard on the radio. obviously our bigs being in foul trouble hurt us, as we rely on our post scoring and feed off of it for everything else.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 20, 2006, 04:59:19 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 19, 2006, 05:23:20 PM
As a long-time Pistons' fan and observer, that does have Thomas' fingerprints all over it, but I haven't seen any EVIDENCE that he orchestrated it.

I must say I liked Isiah better as a player than an executive - I think he's in over his head.

He wasn't a "BAD BOY" for no reason.

I bet Adrian Dantley has an interesting opinion of Isiah.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 20, 2006, 10:08:01 AM
Quote from: onefan on December 19, 2006, 11:52:47 PM
Got to take exception to Witt as the premier D3 defensive team in the Nation...No way to prove it, but ONU plays good defense and tends to turn it up even higher when their offense goes south. Went to the ONU/Witt game tonight and Witt got outplayed at both ends of the court. They lacked intensity and appeared to be fatigued early in the second half. Could be a game for them to build on, but they didn't play like the sixth ranked team in D3 tonight. They actually reminded me of the way ONU played against BW last week. But, a good win for ONU and a good win for the OAC.

Well, with the way Witt played last night, I think it's tough to argue your opinion onefan.  After all, Witt's supposedly stout defense allowed ONU to shoot 55% from the floor while Witt mangaged to shoot only 35% and only 26% in the 2nd half when the Tigers needed to step up. 

One other thing that caught my attention is something I mentioned after the Witt-Woo game and that was concerning Witt's lack of depth from a scoring perspective.  Against Wooster 56 out of their 65 points came from only 3 players.   Last night Borchers had his ususal strong game with 17 points, however, the rest of Witt's starters only combined for an additional 17 points.  And look at the result.  The big games that Hemenway and Hill had vs. Wooster were not there vs. ONU and they lose by 17.

With ONU taking it to Wittenberg (at home mind you) I am now even more intrigued by this matchup with Wooster coming up after Christmas.  I've never questioned whether or not the Polar Bears are a very good basketball team.  It's just that when they got blasted out of their own gym by a struggling B-W, it made be question whether they were truly that good or did they just have a bad night.  After ONU's performance last night against Witt, I'm beginning to think it was a case of the latter and we should be in for a real treat on the 29th at Timken.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 20, 2006, 10:39:21 AM
I wasn't at the Witt-ONU game last night, and didn't even listen to it, so this is pretty speculative, but it's altogether possible that, playing on the road, neither Borchers nor Hemenway (maybe especially him) were able to successfully back down opponents in the paint for easy shots.  There are just things that work better on one's home court than in a hostile environment.

Possibly, also, ONU was able to go to school on the Wooster-Witt game, and was able to especially key on those three scorers.  Borchers, certainly being the best of them, was able to still have a good game.  But Hill and Hemenway were shut down, no one else was able to step up, and ONU got a very solid win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 20, 2006, 12:40:36 PM
yes and it doesnt help when your opponent shoots 50+ % from the field as well. any team is going to be hard to beat in those circumstances.

hope to see a BIG witt rebound thursday at otterbein-this win is much needed for in-region purposes. i feel bad for otterbein going up against a motivated witt team
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on December 20, 2006, 01:21:06 PM
Was at the game last night, Witt was very flat. ONU has a guy named Michael Hunter that I don't think Shaq could back down, very big/physical guy, ONU contested shots really well and sagged into the post...Witt's spacing was bad and they were unable to find the open guy a lot of it came back to Witt being flat. Badenhop is a guy that finds ways to score, I didn't think Witt's defense on him was very good or as good as I have seen them guard Wooster. It will be a good game, there will be match up problems for both teams as the 5 starters for Northern will struggle to match up to Port, Cooper and Johnson but Woo will struggle matching up on Northern's post players. The sophmore #50 for Northern is pretty good but Hunter is more of a role player/hard worker and not real polished offensively. I see Woo winning this one but it will be close.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2006, 04:21:40 PM
Final from Gambier:
#22 DePauw 53
Kenyon 52

I logged into the KC website to see if the game was at 7:00 or 7:30, and discovered that it was at 2:00.  :(  I was looking forward to seeing the new (to me) facility, but I sure wasn't anticipating a close game.  Now I'm doubly mad that I'm such a nitwit. :-[ >:( :'(

Box score. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x24368.xml)  Kenyon shot just 31.6%, but held DPU to 39.6% shooting and outrebounded the Tigers 43-31.  Each team had 10 steals, with 37 total turnovers split 19-18 in Kenyon's favor.  Korey Haddox led the Lords with 14 points on 6/9 shooting.  DePauw's Austin Brown was 7-7 inside the arc and led all scorers with 18.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2006, 05:13:18 PM
According to a post on the SCAC board, DePauw won the game with a buzzer-beating three.   :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2006, 05:40:34 PM
Denison is out in Vegas this week, playing at UNLV in the "D3 Desert Shootout."  Last night, the Big Red hit just 3 of 14 three-point attempts (37.5% overall) and turned the ball over 22 times in losing to Scranton, 70-53.  Dan Hodgkinson led all scorers with 21 points, including 11-13 from the line, but Scranton had 4 in double figures, including a double-double (11 pts., 11 boards) from Tom Bicknell.  Attendance for this game was reported as 50; does that suggest that there's something more interesting to do in Las Vegas than watch Denison basketball?  ??? :D Box score. (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mb/mb07/denm1219.html)

Denison (1-8) takes on Clarke College (1-9), 68-61 losers to Manhattanville College, this afternoon (6:30pm EST).  The nickel slots beckon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: onefan on December 20, 2006, 06:22:01 PM
Scotsfan, Thanks for moving my post...Much appreciated. Northern did have a good shooting night. It is tough to beat a team that shoots as well as they did last night. Witt's early foul trouble added to their woes. ONU is indeed solid, and their lopsided loss to BW is still puzzling to me and I was there. My only explanation is that BW just had one of those sizzling shooting nights when everything they launched went in. I hope the next meeting is a better ballgame. As to the upcoming ONU/Wooster match-up, I look for a real barnburner. As I understand it Wooster is fairly deep and so is ONU. Very little is lost in terms of going to their eighth and ninth guy off the bench...that has been quite significant for ONU especially in the latter half of the game...opposing teams have lost a step and ONU still looks fresh...I doubt they will enjoy that advantage against Wooster. There are four very good teams appearing at the tournament...should be some good match-ups. I understand that Wooster chose to play ONU rather than either of the other two teams...I think Northern has taken exception to that decision and would like to demonstrate that this was a mistake. I guess we will find out on the 29th.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 20, 2006, 07:24:56 PM
Quote from: onefan on December 20, 2006, 06:22:01 PM
I understand that Wooster chose to play ONU rather than either of the other two teams...I think Northern has taken exception to that decision and would like to demonstrate that this was a mistake. I guess we will find out on the 29th.
I don't think they chose to play ONU because they thought that was going to be the easiest path to the championship game.  They did it to guarantee at least one in-region game against a strong in-region opponent.  If you look back to last year's Mose Hole, Wooster also chose to play B-W in the 1st round and lost because they wanted the guarantee of the in-region matchup.  Both Wooster and B-W went on to win comfortably in their respective Saturday games.  Also, in case you don't recall, I think the motivating factor in all of this stems back to ONU.  Wooster and ONU were supposed to be the marquee matchup in the finals of the 2001 Mose Hole, but ONU was upset by Thiel on Friday night so the matchup never happened.

The point I'm trying to make is that I don't think Wooster made this move to play ONU out of disrespect to the Polar Bears.  Besides, looking at the field, there really isn't an easy opponent in the field which makes the tournament all the more interesting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2006, 07:29:41 PM
(I see that ScotsFan had the same idea as me, but I'll go ahead and post this anyway.  :))

I suppose anything works as "bulletin board material," but I think Wooster's decision to play ONU in the opening round is a compliment to ONU.  Coach Moore made a conscious effort to toughen up the non-conference schedule this season, and I'm certain that he wanted to ensure that his team did not miss the chance to play ONU in this tournament.  Everyone knew that ONU was going to be loaded this season, and since Wooster has visions of a national title this season, they'll want to test themselves against Salem-caliber competition.

If Wooster had wanted a cupcake in the first round, they could have invited frequent Mose Hole participants Case Western Reserve or Thiel; instead, all three visiting teams are top-shelf and serious threats to go 2-0 on the weekend.  All four games look like close, tough affairs on paper. 

ONU's high shooting percentage last night intrigues me.  Teams just don't shoot well against Wittenberg's defense; they are just too good at contesting every shot.  To shoot 55.6% against Witt suggests to me a combination of three things:  outstanding ball movement to find the open shooter (when Wooster shoots well against Witt, this is the primary reason), slow or lackadaisical defense by Witt, and just plain hot shooting.  Vanilla24's comments suggest that Witt was a step slow on defense last night, and that might have been the difference.  Hot shooting is either there or it isn't; not much you can do about it either way.  What I'm interested in seeing next weekend is ONU's ball movement.  If ONU's ability to make the extra pass was significant last night, it should be significant against Wooster, too; but if the PBs are relying on Wooster to be a step slow on defense, they could be in for a long evening.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 20, 2006, 07:45:20 PM
I wrote a blog post along these lines last year:
http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/?p=62

This scenario actually pretty closely resembles last year's Mose Hole.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 20, 2006, 09:26:38 PM
Yes it did have a strong resemblence to last year's Mose Hole field.  I actually think that Wooster tried to pair it up as you explained in your blog, Pat.  Rumor has it, however, that Lycoming, who would have fallen into that better than average out of region opponent, only accepted to play in the tournament on the stipulation that they not play Wooster in the opening round.  That left Wooster with the choice of playing the weak in region opponent which was Thiel or taking on the strong in region opponent which they did and lost to B-W. 

Using Pat's scenario for this year's Mose Hole, there really isn't a spot for the weak out of region opponent.  Wooster basically had to choose between Calvin and ONU as who to play in the opening round.   Based on Pat's scenario, Wooster should have chosen to play Calvin in the opening round because they would the lower seed between the 2 hypothetically speaking.   I'm guessing they chose ONU because, as DC noted, they knew ONU was going to be loaded coming into this season and there is a strong probability that these 2 might meet up again come March.  Not saying that the possibility of meeting up with Calvin in March isn't there, but it's more likely the Scots would have to face the PB's before they would face Calvin come tournament time.  It's one thing to scout a team, but to be able to go head to head gives you a real good idea of what to expect if and when you happen to meet up with them again.  Of course, the ideal scenario to play out for the Scots would be for them to defeat ONU and then have the chance to face Calvin in the finals and finally have the chance to exact some revenge on what the Knights did to the Scots back in the 2000 NCAA tournament up in GR! 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: onefan on December 20, 2006, 10:16:25 PM
Come on guys, if Wooster really thinks ONU is loaded., why not meet them in the finals on Saturday and have two regional teams going head to head in the championship game? I think you are fooling yourselves if you truly believe a program is going to pick a team they think is going to give them the toughest game in the opening game of a tournament. Yes upsets do happen, and yes Northern or Wooster could lose in the first game and not get the chance to meet, but I still maintain the more plausible explanation is that they felt ONU was the weakest team in the tournament and logically chose to play them in the opener. Bulletin board material? You Betcha. But with this match up I don't think either program needs any added motivation. 1verses7 is pretty good stuff all by itself.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 20, 2006, 10:26:02 PM
Dang, the link for the live video from California Baptist still isn't working and nobody's answering the phone number that they gave me to call if I had problems.  Stuck with the radio broadcast, I guess.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 20, 2006, 10:36:21 PM
http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/2006-07/stats/erlm1220.html (http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/2006-07/stats/erlm1220.html)

Earlham Drops a close one at the buzzer 59-61 against Muskingum in the third annual Hilton Gardens Inn/Jacksons Classic at Washington & Jefferson in PA .  Markous Jewett dropped 23pts on 6-12 shooting and 10-11 from the Free-throw line, while Nick Welsh went 7-7 from the field and ended up with 15pts.


Games like these will get them ready for the 2nd half of the season and hopefully they can do well in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2006, 10:47:46 PM
Sounds like Wooster is off to a fairly crummy start tonight, trailing 23-12, 11:02 1st.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 20, 2006, 11:00:31 PM
I just have to say that after listening to the Witt/ONU game last night, Wooster fans ARE spoiled to have Breckenridge.  He does such an excellent job. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 20, 2006, 11:08:09 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 42  Cal Baptist 42

Wooster got off to a slow start trailing 23-12 before they went on a 14-3 run to knot the game at 26-26. Wooster hit 8 three pointers in the half to keep pace with Cal Baptist.  Port, Johnson and Will each have 2 fouls.

Wooster is being led by Tim Vandervaart with 8 points, James Cooper with 7 points, Marty Bidwell with 6 points and Brandon Johnson with 6 points.

Mark Roussin is leading the Lancers with 14 points and Andrew Bruckner has 6 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on December 20, 2006, 11:09:00 PM
Wooster may have some rust to shake off after flying out to Cali. At halftime the score is tied 42-42  and the anouncer did mention that it sounds like there may be a good Wooster alumni crowd in attendance
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 20, 2006, 11:11:04 PM
At the Half:
The game is tied at 42.  Vandervaart had two freethrows to break the tie but missed his first.  He got a break due to lane violation but missed the second as well.  It was rebounded by Cal but they couldn't put the shot in.  Coop took his usual 3 with the time winding down but was not able to make it go in either.  
Scots really need to step it up next half.  Sounds like they are shooting well from 3 point land.  They have made 8 3 pointers already.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 20, 2006, 11:19:08 PM
Hey, so it's tied 42-42 at the half? :)

Looking forward to Mose Hole. Just booked my trip and I am definitely going to be there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 20, 2006, 11:21:14 PM
I finally got the video to work about halfway through the first half.  Not at all intuitive, at least to me.

Wooster is playing like a team suffering from jet lag.  The desire is there, but they look a step slow, and maybe a mental step slow sometimes, too.  Still, they're right in this ballgame, tied at the half.

They're giving up too many baskets, obviously, but also too many second chances, which is uncharacteristic of them.  Since they're not consistently able to clear their defensive board, they've been unable to run.  They've tried to push it hard up the court after Baptist scores, but some poor long passes have resulted in turnovers.  It'll be interesting to see if they have more energy and alertness in the second half, or less.  They're trying, as always, but a cross country trip is fatigueing, whether you're Wooster or the Celtics.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 20, 2006, 11:21:26 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 20, 2006, 09:26:38 PM
Yes it did have a strong resemblence to last year's Mose Hole field. 

There must be a story to the name "Mose Hole."  Can someone enlighten me on this one?

Witt has another game tomorrow night that I'm hoping comes out better than last night's against ONU.  I have to give the Polar Bears credit for a good game.  

Go Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2006, 11:22:03 PM
Say, does anyone have the halftime score?  :D

Elsewhere, in Las Vegas to be precise, Denison slumps to 1-9, losing to lowly Clarke College 69-52.  Dan Hodgkinson contributed half of the offense, scoring 26 on 10/16 shooting and 6/8 free throws, but the rest of the team went just 7/27 (.259) from the field (including 1/15 from the arc, to go along with Hodgkinson's 0/1).  Denison actually led this game at the half, but allowed Clarke to shoot 50% in the second half to salt the game away.  In a word:  Yuk. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2006, 11:26:46 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on December 20, 2006, 11:21:26 PM
There must be a story to the name "Mose Hole."  Can someone enlighten me on this one?

E.M. "Mose" Hole was the head coach of men's basketball at Wooster from 1926 through 1958.  He compiled a record of 412-181 (.695) in those 32 years, and won five OAC titles.

Looking forward to seeing you, Pat.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 20, 2006, 11:36:01 PM
Kudos to the Cal Baptist announcers, who are really excellent.  Impartial and knowledgeable.  Wooster now with a 5-point lead.

But, after a Lancer timeout, they go on a 6-point run, all on silly easy baskets inside.  Brandon Johnson has been on the sidelines for a while with four fouls.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 20, 2006, 11:40:30 PM
Wooster Booster - How is the Live Video Feed???  Can you actually see clearly what is going on and who the players are??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 20, 2006, 11:47:18 PM
The video is pretty blurry, as it usually is.  I can recognize Evan Will and his red hair, but that's about it. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 20, 2006, 11:49:19 PM
HA!  That's funny.
Talking about hair, I am pulling my hair out with all of these fouls!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on December 20, 2006, 11:51:45 PM
Wooster down by 11pts with about 5 mins to go. Shots not falling for Wooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 20, 2006, 11:58:07 PM
Wooster a 6-point run, cutting the lead to 5, and they have the ball.  They're still giving up weirdly easy baskets inside, but Baptist has had what looks like a lot of nice bounces on the rim.  The Scots look energized now, though, and maybe poised to pull this one out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on December 21, 2006, 12:01:48 AM
80=84 Wooster still down with 1:20 left
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 21, 2006, 12:05:12 AM
Big 3 by Coop.  Scots down 86-83
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 21, 2006, 12:11:42 AM
90-86 Cal Baptist with 20 seconds left to go and the ball
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on December 21, 2006, 12:14:22 AM
uh oh.... looks like woo will get its firstb blemish, at least it is out of conference, out of state, out of region, out of division, almost out of the country
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 21, 2006, 12:14:31 AM
Final:  Cal Baptist 94  Wooster 89

Wooster was beaten by a big NAIA Division I team tonight.  Wooster hung in this game and only trailed by 3 points with one minute left before the Lancers made the clinching free throws.  Scots were led by Tom Port with 21 points, James Cooper with 20 points and Devin Fulk with 15 points.

Cal Baptist was led by big 6'9" Andrew Bruckner with 24 points, 6'7" Mark Roussin with 19 points, Junior Denson with 18 points and Jemell Swafford with 13 points.  6'9" Andrew Bruckner is 270 lbs and is a Division I transfer from UC Irvine.  Wooster had no answer for the big guy.

Wooster is now 9-1.  Next up is Ohio Northern on 12/29.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on December 21, 2006, 12:19:47 AM
Just watched the live stats and text play-by-play and it seemed like the Scots couldn't buy a rebound off a free throw miss. It must've happened 4 times in the final 2 minutes. It's gotta be hard to box out 6'7" and 6'9" but it sounds like there HAD to be some over-the-back calls missed. Anyway, it's tough to win 'em all, and many of the Scot teams of the past few years have faltered once around X-mas time and still managed to rack up a lot of conference and NCAA hardware, let's hope this team does the same!! Happy holidays from Bob Wilcoxen!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old_hooper on December 21, 2006, 12:27:07 AM
This was not a good loss.  Cal Bap is a middle of the row GSAC team.  It is always tough to go on the road and win  2,000 miles away from home but this should have been a Scots win.  If this was to either Concordia Irvine or Azuza Pacific which are the top of the league it would have been a difference.  Cal Bap may finish 4th or 5th in league.  Have to say this will probably not help the Scots maintain the #1 ranking.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 21, 2006, 12:38:45 AM
Old Hooper -- "not a good loss"

I completely disagree with that viewpoint.

Please explain to me how ANYONE on Wooster was going to grow in size to 6'9" and 275 lbs so they could defend Andrew Bruckner, a DI transfer who led Cal Baptist with 24 points.  Tim Vandervaart and Evan Will were physically outmatched in the paint.

For your info, Coach Moore pointed out on the post game radio show that Wooster had no way to defend Bruckner and that was a key factor in this game.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old_hooper on December 21, 2006, 01:23:33 AM
wooscot...all do respect, if that is what lost it for the Scots so be it.  All Cal Baptist official losses (4) all had smaller post players as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 21, 2006, 07:03:55 AM
A lot of factors played into last night's loss, not the least of which was the size of Bruckner and some of the other the Baptists.

Playing on the road, so far away, on the third day of the trip when the initial adrenalin rush was gone, certainly didn't help.  Wooster looked a step slow most of the night.  Although their 15 turnovers wasn't a terrible number, too many of them were on poorly planned upcourt passes that they don't usually make.  They were horrible at boxing out, usually a team strength, even on free throws, giving up way too many easy second chances.  They gave up too much penetration, and countless times their big men would then leave their own man, who would receive a dump-off dish for an easy layup or dunk.  The Scots kept the score close, but they sure looked off their game.

Point guard Brandon Johnson managed only 11 minutes on the court due to foul trouble.  He picked up his second early in the first half, even before I was able to navigate and obtain the video, and had to sit.  When he came back, he quickly picked up a third and then a fourth.  He was a non-factor, and you have to believe if he was on the court the Scots fortunes would have been at least somewhat better.

While the Baptists are a good team, this win moving them to 8-4, I think that given some better circumstances (a neutral court, or at least a road game closer to home) the Scots probably win it.

I'm not sure that I understand, or appreciate, the headline and story lead on the CB website:

http://www.cbulancers.com/SportSelect.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=8100&KEY=&SPID=3077&SPSID=37637
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on December 21, 2006, 08:21:00 AM
Quote from: old_hooper on December 21, 2006, 12:27:07 AM
This was not a good loss.  Cal Bap is a middle of the row GSAC team.  It is always tough to go on the road and win  2,000 miles away from home but this should have been a Scots win.  If this was to either Concordia Irvine or Azuza Pacific which are the top of the league it would have been a difference.  Cal Bap may finish 4th or 5th in league.  Have to say this will probably not help the Scots maintain the #1 ranking.

Below is a post I made on the Top 25 board.  I went back and checked -- that Westmont team IWU beat last year by 18 finished 11-9 in the GSAC, tied for 5th in an 11 team league (ie "middle of the row GSAC ").  I was very impressed by Westmont though -- they were not far behind the level of the 4 teams that made the CCIW conference tourney.  IWU just played great in that one.

Keep in mind how good the GSAC is when discussing this.  "Middle of the pack" CCIW last year I guess was Illinois Wesleyan -- the #4 seed in the conf. tournament.  IWU finished 3rd in Division III.  The GSAC is every bit as good (or better) as the CCIW. 



The GSAC is one to the top 2 or 3 NAIA D1 leagues.  I've seen two Illinois Wesleyan games vs Westmont College on holiday trips.  In 1997, IWU's national championship team defeated Westmont by 8.  Last year IWU won by 18 while ranked #1 in Division III.   Both times I left very impressed with the talent level at Westmont, and I believe those Westmont teams both finished middle of the GSAC pack.

I don't know anything about Cal Baptist's 2006-07 team, but on paper it was probably a game a lot like IWU's last year vs Westmont.  Going into that one I looked at it like a road game vs a CCIW contender -- it was going to be tough, but one the #1 team in the nation should win.  (Westmont was not quite as good as the 4 teams that made the CCIW conference tourney last year, but just a notch behind.)  IWU played well in that game and handled Westmont on their floor.   I am guessing Wooster had a little bit of an off-night and Cal Baptist played well.  It was probably an upset, but not anything to get too worked up over. 

Now, if Cal Baptist goes on to win the GSAC or maybe even finish 2nd, I'll change my tune to say Wooster was not really even favored to win the game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on December 21, 2006, 08:38:33 AM
PS The Westmont team that only lost by 8 to IWU's 1997 national champs finished 5-9, tied for 6th in an 8-team GSAC.

http://www.gsacsports.org/gsacmbkhistory.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 21, 2006, 10:24:56 AM
Wooster Booster,

Was your video feed good enough that you could tell wheter or not Wooster was getting their money's worth on all the fouls that were being called against them?  I mean the ft disparity was pretty large in this game with CBU getting 38 attempts from the line compared to just 11 attempts for the Scots.  To me, that's where CBU won this game.  Couple in the fact that Wooster's floor general was basically a non-factor only logging 11 minutes due to foul trouble and you have a clear recipe for defeat against a quality NAIA opponent. 

As I said on the Top 25 board, Wooster can take a couple of things away from this loss.  One is the fact that they probably won't be facing any more 6'9" 270 lb. Div. I transfers the rest of the season and two, that this loss doesn't really exhist in terms of the NCAA and when it comes time to make selections and seedings in the NCAA Tournament.   Hopefully, they can get home for the Holiday, get re-energized and re-focused and come out ready to kick some PB arse a week from tomorrow!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 21, 2006, 10:32:11 AM
Quote from: onefan on December 20, 2006, 10:16:25 PM
Come on guys, if Wooster really thinks ONU is loaded., why not meet them in the finals on Saturday and have two regional teams going head to head in the championship game? I think you are fooling yourselves if you truly believe a program is going to pick a team they think is going to give them the toughest game in the opening game of a tournament.
onefan, look at last year's Mose Hole and tell me who out of a field that included Lycoming, Thiel and B-W was going to give Wooster the toughest test?  And then tell me who Wooster played in the opening round?  I'll help you out.  It was B-W.  If ONU needs to use the fact that they were chosen as Wooster's first opponent because Wooster felt that they were the easiest opponent to beat to get to the finals as "bulletin board materiel" than they are hurting for motivation.  Think what you want, but I'll almost guarantee that Wooster's coaches and  players aren't appoaching this game as ONU being the easiest opponent in the field.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 21, 2006, 10:36:01 AM
The video wasn't clear enough, or from close enough, to get much of a read on the foul calls.  While I thought the announcers were very good and unbiased, questioning some of the calls in both directions, the picture was of typical internet streaming calibre, reminiscent of my early days of watching tv back in the snowscreen fifties, except in color.  The cameraman, also, wasn't too hot, sometimes forgetting to pan to the end of the court where the ball was.  That was mystifying in itself.

Plus, as I mentioned before, I missed the first ten minutes of the broadcast, which included Brandon Johnson's first two fouls.

Just an aside:

It turns out that one of the coaches in the volleyball club where I coach has Evan Will as a boyfriend.  Poor girl. ;)  She's a junior at Wooster, as he is, and a really nice girl who also coaches volleyball at Wooster's Edgewood Middle School.  We got to talk for a bit last night and she told me she was hoping to watch the video feed last night if her dad could help her to figure it out.  I hope she had more luck than I did. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 21, 2006, 01:31:25 PM
Quote from: MoneyBallSTL on December 21, 2006, 12:19:47 AM
Just watched the live stats and text play-by-play and it seemed like the Scots couldn't buy a rebound off a free throw miss. It must've happened 4 times in the final 2 minutes. It's gotta be hard to box out 6'7" and 6'9" but it sounds like there HAD to be some over-the-back calls missed.

I'm still waiting for Wooster to be part of a game that was refereed appropriately.  We've already seen a lengthy thread of Scots fans whining about the refs in a game that they won. And now, here's a guy, armed with a box score and the accompanying play-by-play and totally devoid of any audio or video evidence (regardless of quality), is going to claim that Wooster got jobbed by the zebras.  Absolutely must have been the case...Wooster doesn't lose unless they're playing 5 on 8.   >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 21, 2006, 01:45:49 PM
Well, even playing 5-on-8, I think we can rest assured that Wooster will once again run Wabash out of the gym twice this season.  Some things never change.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 21, 2006, 02:06:39 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 21, 2006, 01:45:49 PM
Well, even playing 5-on-8, I think we can rest assured that Wooster will once again run Wabash out of the gym twice this season.  Some things never change.

Whoa!  Why the swipe at Wabash?  Who was questioning whether or not Wooster is going to stomp Wabash this season?  What does Wabash have to do with Wooster's self-perceived inability to get a fair game out of the officials?  Let's stay on point here. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 21, 2006, 02:15:26 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 21, 2006, 01:45:49 PM
Well, even playing 5-on-8, I think we can rest assured that Wooster will once again run Wabash out of the gym twice this season.  Some things never change.

Someone points out that Wooster fans are whining about the refs and WooBoo makes it personal. Some things never change.

C'mon, WooBoo. You going to get yourself banned and the NCAC board shut down again ?

Or is it sufficient to stay on point and answer us why every time Wooster loses, or wins a close game, there has to be a problem with the officiating?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 21, 2006, 02:21:37 PM
Gee, excuse me.  Did I wander into a Wabash fan club by mistake?  You're allowed to take potshots at the Wooster fans for complaining about the officiating but I'm not allowed to point out that, once again, Wooster will wipe up the floor with your manly school?  You don't think you made it personal first?

Sorry.  It's a two-way street.  Live on it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 21, 2006, 02:50:45 PM
Ahhhh, it just wouldn't be the same in here without Wally showing his true feelings towards Wittenberg and Wooster.  I was beginning to miss it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 21, 2006, 03:03:22 PM
What I was pointing out was that the Wooster war on NCAA officials has reached comedic levels.  It was bad enough with the excessive complaining from the Witt game (the most recent example...the past is filled with many, many more), but at least most of you actually saw that game.  Today I see somebody telling me that, based solely on a box score and a textual play-by-play, Wooster must have been screwed.  How you can't see this as being the most over the top example of this increasingly prevalent behavior here is beyond me. 

Wooster has to be one of the most fun teams in the country to watch and many of you get to do so on a very regular basis...yet an overwhelming number of posts here seem to be aimed at whining about the officials after nearly every single game (particularly in any game Wooster loses and every game against Wittenberg regardless of the outcome).  It doesn't make any sense to me why you'd ever let the game be about the officials when your team is so good.  I like to believe that Wooster fans are better than that. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on December 21, 2006, 03:11:25 PM
Both sides have landed a couple punches -- points made.  I can tell you that this conversation is headed nowhere from here though.  How bout getting back to basketball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 21, 2006, 03:31:42 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 21, 2006, 02:21:37 PMGee, excuse me.  Did I wander into a Wabash fan club by mistake?

No, that's the football board. This is the Wooster Fan Club.

No one took a potshot at Wooster's team. No one disputes your team is great. We all know you'll destroy Wabash this year and probably the next 5.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 21, 2006, 03:36:02 PM
Well, this shouldn't be a Wooster fan club either - and unless your team shoots NO free throws in an NCAC tourney game - mayhaps the lips should be buttoned about fouls and refs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 21, 2006, 04:05:43 PM
For a page there I thought I was reading things posted on the woman's board... Ladies let's get back to basketball!




POTSHOT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 21, 2006, 04:19:52 PM
I've been trying to turn it into a Denison fan club, but so far I've had little success...like Denison.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 21, 2006, 04:38:19 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on December 21, 2006, 04:05:43 PM
For a page there I thought I was reading things posted on the woman's board... Ladies let's get back to basketball!


Are the refs out to get the Lady Scots as well?!?

:P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 21, 2006, 04:39:08 PM
To take Titan Q's advice and get the conversation back on basketball, anyone have any thought's on tonight's game with Wittenberg @ Ott?  This is pretty much a must win for the Tigers IMO.  A loss would make it 3 straight and all would be in-region losses.  Personally, I don't see the Cards posing much of a threat to Witt, but the way this season has gone, nothing would surprise me.

OWU is also back in action tonight and they are also taking on an OAC foe in Wilmington.  This could be a tough one for the Bishops as well as they have not played since their loss to Allegheny on Dec. 9th and Wilmington is coming off of an impressive win over JCU who had been unbeaten and leading the OAC.  Wilmington is also riding a 3 game win streak.  

For Mose Hole related games, UW-Lax is taking on #4 St. Thomas tonight.  After an impressive start of the season by the Eagles which saw them reach #21 in the polls, they have since dropped 2 straight.  One of them was a respectable 3 point loss at #5 UWSP and the other was a bit of a surpise overtime loss at 3-5 Carleton (MN).  They are in a bit of the same waters as Wittenberg.  If they lose tonight, they then have Calvin followed by a matchup of either ONU or Wooster.  They could be facing the serious possibility of easily looking at a 5 game losing streak to end the year on if they can't right the ship tonight vs. the Tommies.

Hopefully the NCAC can represent tonight and bring home a couple of wins over the OAC!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 21, 2006, 04:43:46 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 21, 2006, 03:03:22 PM
What I was pointing out was that the Wooster war on NCAA officials has reached comedic levels. 
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 21, 2006, 04:38:19 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on December 21, 2006, 04:05:43 PM
For a page there I thought I was reading things posted on the woman's board... Ladies let's get back to basketball!


Are the refs out to get the Lady Scots as well?!?

:P
Sorry to see that your attempts at humor haven't reached comedic levels though. 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on December 21, 2006, 04:52:56 PM
Wally and Lil' Giant, that was beautiful.  That's all I'll add to that.

As far as tonight goes, big bounceback game is what everybody is hoping from Witt.  Dane has already proven that he can have big games against Otterbein (he led Witt with 18 points and 8 rebounds in last season's matchup), so that is what to look for tonight.  However, how will the other Tigers respond?  Can Gregg Hill shake off 2-11 from the field?  Can Witt as a team find their 3 point shooting range after 1-9 on Tuesday?

I'm sure that Bill has his guys focused, but don't look past the fact that a lot of these guys (as are numerous other collegiate athletes around the country) may be looking ahead to a much-needed and/or wanted break from basketball for the holidays.  Especially after getting it handed to them against ONU, Witt may just be feeling like they want to pack it in and head for break.  I highly doubt this will happen, but don't be surprised if tonight is a little closer than the Tiger contingent would like.

Not only does Witt need a win, but so do the NCAC teams as a whole - the conference is taking a beating this week!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 21, 2006, 05:10:04 PM
DC -

Well, you can start complaing about rotations and playing time, right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 21, 2006, 05:12:49 PM
Wow, I just did a cursory glance at Denison's stats.

180 turnovers, just 39 steals.

Their opponents have 95 steals and just 117 turnovers.

They also have a piddling amount of blocked shots.

D-up, boys! D-up!!! Please!!!

I wonder since someone is leading in minutes played and scoring by a large margin is why the Denison fans are silent...hmmm.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 21, 2006, 05:23:18 PM
The refs have been screwing the Big Red all season... ;) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 21, 2006, 06:40:29 PM
My reply to few of the questions posted earlier:

1. Will the Scots drop from the #1 poll ranking spot? - I don't think there is any question they will, its just a matter of how far. If St. Thomas loses tonight to UW-Lacrosse it might by to only the #3 spot, but it could be as low as #6. It can't see it being any lower because the voters are pretty informed and know that Wooster has played a very tough pre conference schedule.

2. Was it a bad loss?  It would only be a bad loss if they don't take anything away from it. Wooster is a very good team but not perfect. I have noted before that they have played stretches of very good defense. But I heard in Coach Moores commentary in the post game interview that after the Scots got to a 5 point lead, Cal Baptist scored on their next 10 possessions and that was basically the ball game.

3. Officiating? - Now I can only go by Mike B's commentary and he is very good about being impartial, but I only heard him once reference a miss by the ref's. I forget the name of the CB player but Mike commented that he got a  'running start' on his drive to the basket. He also referenced a few times when Wooster bench argued for a foul not called. But all in all I don't think the ref's were the issue. Wooster had their chances but just a few too many turnovers and didn't rebound well in the second half.

To me the silver lining is that the loss should put a hunger in them for the Mose Hole tournament. It should be a great set of games and I'll be there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 21, 2006, 07:00:57 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 21, 2006, 02:06:39 PM
Whoa!  Why the swipe at Wabash? 

Probably because you swiped first.

It's not unusual to demand a somewhat more even distribution of free throws. That's why I spotlighted it on the front page.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WLCALUM83 on December 21, 2006, 07:32:03 PM
Wittenberg/Otterbein about to get underway:
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WLCALUM83 on December 21, 2006, 07:55:02 PM
Wittenberg 24, Otterbein 22, approx 9 minutes left in 1st half:
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 21, 2006, 07:56:50 PM
Quote from: goscots on December 21, 2006, 06:40:29 PM
1. Will the Scots drop from the #1 poll ranking spot? - I don't think there is any question they will, its just a matter of how far. If St. Thomas loses tonight to UW-Lacrosse it might by to only the #3 spot, but it could be as low as #6. It can't see it being any lower because the voters are pretty informed and know that Wooster has played a very tough pre conference schedule.

The next poll will not be released until after the holidays, taking into account games through Dec. 31.  I think Wooster's results in the Mose Hole games will be far more significant in determining their ranking than the Cal Baptist loss.  Also you need to consider that some of the other top teams have rugged weeks ahead, such as UW-Stevens Point playing Augustana, Amherst traveling to San Antonio to face Trinity, and (as goscots notes) St. Thomas taking on La Crosse. 

There's far too much basketball between then and now to predict what the Jan. 3 ranking will be, but I'll suggest that if Wooster goes 2-0 next weekend, they'll be no worse than #2 in that poll, and quite possibly still #1.  That's a big 'if,' though.

Quote from: goscots on December 21, 2006, 06:40:29 PM
To me the silver lining is that the loss should put a hunger in them for the Mose Hole tournament. It should be a great set of games and I'll be there.

I think this is a great point.  The only real damage done by Cal Baptist was to the Scots' pride.  They believe that they're the best team in D3, and I'm sure they're anxious to prove it next weekend and silence the doubters.  Sky-high ONU vs. Wooster with a chip on its shoulder--it should be an outstanding game next Friday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 21, 2006, 08:24:32 PM
witt was up 30-26 with 4 minutes when i lost radio feed, imagine that.  it really wasnt that bad considering the level of intelligence of the witt announcers tonight-i think every basket was followed with a "just like that" lol.

witt needs this win tonight badly
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 21, 2006, 08:35:16 PM
DC - I should have realized that there was no poll next week, so yes I agree that Wooster could keep their current ranking. But I should add that their #1 ranking has a bit of a "been there, done that" feel. Two wins in Salem should be Scots only goal.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WLCALUM83 on December 21, 2006, 08:54:35 PM
Witt up 64-59  5 minutes left--(feed restored).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WLCALUM83 on December 21, 2006, 09:11:45 PM
Witt still up, less than a minute left--Otterbein fouling late:
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WLCALUM83 on December 21, 2006, 09:18:22 PM
Wittenberg 79, Otterbein 72--final:
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 21, 2006, 09:41:10 PM
Elsewhere:

Washington & Jefferson 62, Earlham 60 *boo*
Wilmington 63, Ohio Wesleyan 60 *hiss*
Heidelberg 88, Hiram 50 *throws rotten tomato*

Outside the NCAC:
Greensboro 66, John Carroll 63
UW-La Crosse 62, #4 St. Thomas 54
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 21, 2006, 10:56:26 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 21, 2006, 09:41:10 PM
UW-La Crosse 62, #4 St. Thomas 54

That result only makes the Mose Hole tourney that much more interesting...what a weekend of basketball Timken gym should be in for!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 21, 2006, 11:04:43 PM
Yeah, but that might be misleading -- St. Thomas All-American center Isaac Rosefelt did not dress tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: onefan on December 22, 2006, 12:13:41 AM
Scotsfan, Thanks for the history lesson. We are in agreement about the lack of need for motivation. Friday night's match-up ought to be a good one, but I still maintain that standard operating procedure would be to pick the team you feel you have the best chance of beating to get to the finals in the tournament. There is no shame in that and I believe most any tournament host would do the same thing. I appreciate your position, I just disagree with it. Here's to a good ,well played and hopefully well officiated game...Unfortunately the officiating in several games I've attended this year have been disappointing....inconsistent and unable to explain when questioned as to why the foul was called and what the player did that got the whistle...very very frustrating.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on December 22, 2006, 08:29:18 AM
perhaps someone could post a link to the daily record of wooster Ohio's website with the sports section from friday, as I cannot get it to work, but coach moore had an Interesting comment on the foul ratio stating something like "to the untrained eye it would seem we were getting reamed by the refs, but we were fouling them, and it was getting called" if someone like WooBoo or someone else from wooster can access and link the article, that'd be great, it was just something I saw in passing when reading the paper this morning.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 22, 2006, 09:08:20 AM
Ryder16-

I can see the headline for the article that you're talking about, but since I'm not a paying member of the Daily Record website, I can't get to the article.  Under their new format, some articles are free to everyone, for others you must be a paid member.  Which articles are premium seems to be a somewhat random choice, as the one in question is the column of Charles Conant, which is often free.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 22, 2006, 10:02:03 AM
Quote from: Chad ConantThe Scots sent California Baptist to the line 38 times and shot just 11.

"The foul trouble with Brandon hurt," Moore said. "Someone who didn't see the game might think we were getting a raw deal. But, we were fouling and they were calling them."

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1200372
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 22, 2006, 10:11:13 AM
good solid win by witt last night-a much needed one i must add. without denbow this week hurt because our leadership from the point guard position was pinned on a true freshman and a sophomore playiing his first minutes as a varsity players. one thing the announcers kept saying that was inaccurate was that kyle bigler was playing his first varsity game ever last night. WRONG. he played minutes tuesday night at ohio northern. where's mike tirico when you need him.

otterbein must have gotten soem bad calls last night because apparently thats the only way witt and others can win games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 22, 2006, 03:45:25 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 20, 2006, 11:26:46 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on December 20, 2006, 11:21:26 PM
There must be a story to the name "Mose Hole."  Can someone enlighten me on this one?

E.M. "Mose" Hole was the head coach of men's basketball at Wooster from 1926 through 1958.  He compiled a record of 412-181 (.695) in those 32 years, and won five OAC titles.

I see why they named the tournament after him.  Why did they call him "Mose"?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 22, 2006, 05:52:47 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on December 22, 2006, 03:45:25 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 20, 2006, 11:26:46 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on December 20, 2006, 11:21:26 PM
There must be a story to the name "Mose Hole."  Can someone enlighten me on this one?

E.M. "Mose" Hole was the head coach of men's basketball at Wooster from 1926 through 1958.  He compiled a record of 412-181 (.695) in those 32 years, and won five OAC titles.

I see why they named the tournament after him.  Why did they call him "Mose"?



There you have me.  Maybe his middle name was Moses.   ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 22, 2006, 05:59:41 PM
I did some research and came up with nothing.  Whatever the E. M. stood for, he apparently didn't like it much. :)  I know a guy that went to Wooster games back when Hole was the coach, though, and will ask him during the tournament if he knows his real name and how he came about the nickname "Mose".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 22, 2006, 06:03:17 PM
Attention:  Those planning to attend the Mose Hole Classic:

Two brief announcements:

1. In lieu of admission to the "Mose" Hole/Kiwanis Classic, fans can bring in two new or gently-used clothing items for one ticket, four clothing items for two tickets, etc. The clothing items will benefit Goodwill Industries of Wayne and Holmes counties.  (This is from the Wooster web site. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/default.php)  I presume that one ticket is for one session, i.e. Friday or Saturday but not both, but I'm not sure.  Bring four gently-used items just to be sure; Goodwill can certainly use them!  :))

2.  Some of us are planning to gather at the Olde Jaol Tavern Brewing Co. downtown on Saturday afternoon, prior to the consolation game.  I hope I can persuade Pat Coleman, publisher of D3Hoops.com and D3Football.com, to join us there.  So if you want to say hello to Pat and some of your fellow posters (and lurkers), please plan to join us.  I figure I'll be there around 3pm for a late lunch.  The Olde Jaol is at 155 W. North St., at the corner of Walnut, and can be reached at 330-262-3333.  Here's a link to a Yahoo! map (http://maps.yahoo.com/index.php#mvt=m&gid1=29217420&q1=155+W.+North+St.%2C+Wooster%2C+OH+44691&trf=0&lon=-81.941228&lat=40.799387&mag=4), or you can PM me for driving directions.  Hope to see you there!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 22, 2006, 07:26:59 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 22, 2006, 05:59:41 PMWhatever the E. M. stood for, he apparently didn't like it much. :) 

The E stood for Ernest.  Hope that helps.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 23, 2006, 06:12:19 PM
Since I doubt that I will have time to check in over the next couple of days, I just wanted to take this time to wish everyone in here a safe and happy Holiday.  Hope everyone has a Merry Christmas or Happy Hanukkah or whatever you may celebrate this Holiday season, even though it won't be a white one here in NE Ohio!  I'll still be enjoying my Great Lakes Christmas Ale by a nice warm fire ;D.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 23, 2006, 06:14:30 PM
Thanks Scotsfan and congrats on your 1000th post - very appropraite....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 23, 2006, 07:41:38 PM
I'd also like to wish all and sundry a very safe and happy holiday season and prosperous, healthy new year.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: chillydigits on December 23, 2006, 07:54:24 PM
  Howdy Scots Hoop Fans... Since COW was too financially strapped to feed the football team after away games, Leaving the parents  to take up a collection for pizza to feed the team, I was wondering if the Basketball team was having the same issues on their trip to sunny California? Did the athletic dept. send along enough MRE's to last the team for the duration of the trip, Or are the parents using Western Union to send food monies to the kids???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 23, 2006, 08:32:37 PM
Quote from: chillydigits on December 23, 2006, 07:54:24 PM
  Howdy Scots Hoop Fans... Since COW was too financially strapped to feed the football team after away games, Leaving the parents  to take up a collection for pizza to feed the team, I was wondering if the Basketball team was having the same issues on their trip to sunny California? Did the athletic dept. send along enough MRE's to last the team for the duration of the trip, Or are the parents using Western Union to send food monies to the kids???

In-N-Out Burger is cheap. And damn tasty.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Henry Steele on December 24, 2006, 02:30:13 AM
Christmas wishes for this board:

1) Fans from all 10 teams to post.
2) For Wooster fans to realize, if you complain about refs after one of your rare losses, now you know how the bottom eight in the NCAC feel every time they go into your gym.
3) A conference final without either Wittenberg or Wooster.
4) Ohio Wesleyan to put boxscores on its website.
5) Some success for Oberlin and Hiram.
6) Consistency for Earlham.
7) Perimeter scoring for Allegheny.
8) A team for Kenyon that its new gym can be proud of.
9) Wittenberg needs one primetime scorer to develop, to come thru in their big moments in big games; the socialist approach to scoring doesn't work in the biggest games.
10) Coeds for Wabash.
11) For Denison, a happier 2007.

Hope everyone on in the NCAC has a Merry Christmas. Even Steve Moore.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 24, 2006, 05:04:30 AM
Henry Steele!  From that town in South Dakota where they have all the fine restaurants: McDonalds, Burger King, Arby's... :)

Haven't seen that movie in years, but always liked it.  Benson actually looked like he could play a little, too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 24, 2006, 08:05:48 PM
great post henry steele-props to you-

merry xmas everyone-see ya soon
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on December 26, 2006, 08:38:01 PM
From all lurkers and occasional posters,  wishing you the best the holidays have to offer.

We appreciate the time, energy and passion you put into this board, no matter what you partisan leanings.....

D.C.--Your insight, candor, partisanship and respect for traditional opponents is appreciated.  Keep it up, please!!!

This is not a bald-faced appeal for the big "k," but a heart-felt thank-you to those of you who are on the ground, at the games that some of us wish we could be at, but can't for geographical or other reasons.

Pat, best wishes for 2007, and the continued success of your sites.  You are #1 in D3!  And the best thing that has happened in D# sports since the Internet began.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on December 26, 2006, 08:39:55 PM
Maybe I should say, "Since Al Gore invented the Internet." :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 26, 2006, 09:39:54 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 22, 2006, 07:26:59 PM

The E stood for Ernest.  Hope that helps.  :)

I believe that E.M. Hole was short for Earnest Mose Hole.  There is some story that once appeared in the Daily Record that he was named after the family cat?

Actually, if my first name was Earnest, I would use my middle name too! :)

"Mose" Hole was not only a great basketball coach but he coached the Wooster mens tennis team as well for a number of years.

Former Wooster Coach and Athletic Director Al Van Wie created the Mose Hole Kiwanis Basketball Classic back in 1963.  At the time, there were only 3 or 4 holiday tournaments being played in the country so it was a novel idea.  I guess that Wooster helped to get the national trend going! ;D

My all time favorite Mose Hole championship game was in 1967 in the old tiny Severance gym.  Wooster played Ashland who was coached by Bill Musselman (later coached in the NBA).  Ashland was nationally ranked that year and Wooster was a big underdog.  There was no shot clock or three point shot in those days.  Wooster was physically outmatched but they played a very deliberate half court game working for the best shot and the Scots won 25-24 in overtime! :)

We won't see any 25-24 scores this weekend but it should be a great tournament with Ohio Northern, Calvin and UW Lax coming to town.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 28, 2006, 12:10:38 PM
In an AtR preplay, Wooster maintained a short lead throughout, then pulled away late in the second half to enjoy a 111-95 win over Ohio Northern.  ONU shot the ball well, and enjoyed slim leads on the boards and in turnovers, but Wooster's lights-out shooting, especially from three-point land and at the line, were the difference.

ONU's Greg Badenhop led all scorers with 25.  However, Devin Fulk, Brandon Johnson, and Tom Port combined to go 10-10 from outside the arc.  James Cooper, at only 4-7, was a sloucher.  Click on the link for the boxscore:

http://arkski.com/~jwood/ohio%20northern_(95)_at_wooster_(111).html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 28, 2006, 10:12:08 PM
NCAC Final Scores:
#14 Lawrence 69  Allegheny 57   Gators are now 5-4
Aquinas 80  Ohio Wesleyan 79 OT   Bishops are now 6-4

OAC Final Scores:
Edgewood 72  Baldwin-Wallace 64   Bad Loss by B-W to a 4-4 team
Mount Union 50  Roanoke 48
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 28, 2006, 10:19:50 PM
Looks like Gheny did pretty well against Larry.

'Bash has the tough draw with Lakeland (though they're spotty this year) at Franklin's tourney, since the hosts 'drew' the 1-7 Alma Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2006, 12:13:59 AM
Here is the Wooster Daily Record preview of the Mose Hole Classic:

Mose Hole/Kiwanis Classic a holiday treat
December 28, 2006
By CHAD CONANT

Daily Record Sports Writer

WOOSTER -- Holiday tournaments rarely get delicious matchups in the first round.

The Mose Hole/Kiwanis Classic gets two.

Calvin College (5-3) will play Wisconsin-LaCrosse (7-3) at 5:30 p.m. Friday at Timken Gymnasium in a rematch of Calvin's 79-71 win in the opening round of last season's NCAA Tournament. Both teams are just a step outside the d3hoops.com Top 25.

The second game is most likely the national game of the week, as top-ranked Wooster (9-1) plays seventh-ranked Ohio Northern (8-1) in a game dripping with postseason intrigue.

"We like to have good teams in for our tournament," Scots coach Steve Moore said. "It's really been that way over the years and I think we have an outstanding field this year."

While the Calvin-LaCrosse game will be spirited, the Scots-Polar Bears game will be the one with national eyes on it.

The Scots sit at the top of a d3hoops.com poll that's on a holiday break, but lost 94-89 at California Baptist in their last game. Ohio Northern handed sixth-ranked Wittenberg its second loss, 68-51 at the ONU Sports Center in Ada.

The Polar Bears will provide Wooster a similar challenge as Wittenberg. ONU gets potent play on the perimeter and has a bruiser in the paint in Bart Hostetler (12 points, 7.1 rebounds a game). The challenge for Wooster will likely lie in slowing guards Greg Badenhop (18.4 points a game, 37.7 percent from 3-point range) and Kyle Gehle (13.0 points a game) while finding a way to scrap with Hostetler on the boards.

"They have very good balance," Moore said. "They play 10 players and they're all very good. They play a tough man defense and are very physical. It's very difficult to score on them."

The teams have played seven times since 1993, with the Scots, who have won the last four, holding a 4-3 edge in that span.

They have met four times in the Mose Hole, with Wooster's lone win coming in the 1979 title game. Wooster leads the all-time series, which started with a 24-17 Ohio Northern win in 1915, 24-16. The last meeting was in the championship game of the 2004 Al Van Wie/Wooster Rotary Classic, a 74-69 Scots win.

If the Scots are to take their fifth-straight win over the Polar Bears, a defensive effort like the second half Dec. 16 against Cedarville might be in order. In seven minutes that night, the Scots turned a 48-47 lead into a 73-56 lead and started to run away on the back of their effort at the defensive end. With better energy and execution, the Scots held Cedarville down, blew the game open and cruised to a win.

Other than a 94-77 loss at home Dec. 9 against Baldwin-Wallace, the Polar Bears have allowed no more than 70 points in their eight wins and they held Wittenberg to 34.7 percent shooting. Before meeting the Tigers, Ohio Northern was averaging 15 offensive rebounds a game.

"We have to play good defense in this game, there's no question about that," Moore said. "They're so good defensively that if they score a bunch on easy baskets, they're going to be even harder to beat. We will have to play good defense and rebound well."

Though they're not back in class until Jan. 15, the Scots got back to a bit of normalcy this week after playing three games in five days last week with a flight to California in the middle. After taking the Christmas holiday at home with family, the players returned to campus Wednesday.

After losing for the first time while in California, the Scots players are ready for the challenge of a NCAA regional-type field before hopping into North Coast Athletic Conference play next week.

"Our guys are really excited to have this type of challenge in front of them," Moore said. "Playing a good team like this is good for our guys. These are three outstanding teams."

Chad Conant can be reached at (330) 287-1649 or cconant@the-daily-record.com

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: realist on December 29, 2006, 05:33:21 PM
Wooscot:  2 of Calvin's wins are over Aquinas.  Loses are to Hope, Wheaton, and Carthage.  Calvin is almost as young a team this year as last.  They have played tentatively at best.  They have some potential, but against this level of competition may struggle.   In each of the loses the other teams made early runs, and Calvin could not recover. If they can keep it close they can give someone a good game, but you can say that about most teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: realist on December 29, 2006, 06:59:47 PM
Sadly to say we have seen tonights game before as Calvin fans.  Look like deer in the headlights early, and then mount a fight.  Too little, and too late.  Hard lesson to learn that you shouldn't spot a good team a lead.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on December 29, 2006, 09:28:03 PM
Final from Wooster:

Ohio Northern 91
Wooster 84


Real nice job by Pat and Jared on the D3hoops.com call.  Great game to listen to. 

Sounded like Wooster did not execute well down the stretch -- some missed free throws, a couple costly turnovers, and a missed wide-open layup that just about sealed it for ONU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 29, 2006, 10:08:36 PM
Quote from: Titan Q on December 29, 2006, 09:28:03 PM
Sounded like Wooster did not execute well down the stretch -- some missed free throws, a couple costly turnovers, and a missed wide-open layup that just about sealed it for ONU.

To say that Wooster did not execute well down the stretch is being very generous.  They really stunk it up!  They missed at least 4 free throws in a row, 3 of them by Port.  When they really needed to score, Johnson first threw a pass wide of Fulk, then missed the layup mentioned above.

Credit to ONU for hitting their FT's when it counted and coming up with a couple of steals in the last minute to seal it.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2006, 10:43:22 PM
Also credit to ONU for owning the boards.  It's not often that a Wooster team gets outrebounded by a 42-30 clip.  I thought that was decisive tonight.  Wooster has some work to do in the interior defense and rebounding.  That job starts tomorrow vs. Calvin.

Wooster was also pretty cold from long distance.  All Scots not named James Cooper combined to go 3-12 from the arc.  Props to Andy Van Horn and Marty Bidwell, who teamed up on defense to make ONU's All-America candidate Greg Badenhop out of the game (he was just 3/10, and hit one of his two made treys while Andy and Marty were both on the bench), but the other Scots couldn't stop ONU's bigs (Hunter, Cannan, Hostetler) who combined for 41 pts. (on 15/22 shooting plus 11/12 free throws) and 20 rebounds. 

A great win for the Polar Bears, who I now accept as the unofficial NCAC champs this year.  Wooster will regroup and will still be a factor in March, but I think the better team won tonight.

And oh by the way, I thought the game was pretty well officiated.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2006, 11:28:21 PM
Congratulations to Ohio Northern on a very well played game tonight.  The Polar Bears outplayed Wooster and they deserved the win.   ONU shot 49% from the floor, 84% from the charity stripe and outrebounded Wooster 42-30 as David Collinge noted.  Those 3 stats will usually result in a road win.

Conversely, Wooster lost this game because:
-they gave up too many offensive rebounds to ONU for easy buckets,
-they missed 9 free throws (3 critical ones by Port as cmhscotsfan noted)
-they turned the ball over in the last 2 minutes (Wooster led 81-80)
-both Johnson and Port were largely ineffective tonight

Brandon Johnson only shot 2 of 9 from the floor and he missed a critical layup near the end of the game.  Tom Port did not play like an experienced senior as he committed some dumb fouls (before fouling out) and he was a non-factor tonight with only 6 points.

Props go to Tim Vandervaart who kept Wooster in this game with 24 points and to Van Horn and Bidwell for their tough defense on Badenhop.

Hopefully, Wooster will spend time in practice working on boxing out for rebounds.  This is critical if the Scots are going to play the smaller, quick lineup and not give significant playing time to their big freshmen (Melick, Elam, etc.).

Wooster also needs to focus on practicing free throws or this problem could hurt them in big games at the end of the season.

It was good to chat with both David Collinge and cmhscotsfan at the game this evening.  Hopefully, Wooster will bounce back tomorrow vs. Calvin. :)

GO SCOTS!  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2006, 11:29:32 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 29, 2006, 10:43:22 PM
Also credit to ONU for owning the boards.  It's not often that a Wooster team gets outrebounded by a 42-30 clip.  I thought that was decisive tonight. 
I thought the rebounding disparity was going to be worse than that!  ONU won this game with their rebounding IMO.

Quote from: David Collinge on December 29, 2006, 10:43:22 PM
Props to Andy Van Horn and Marty Bidwell, who teamed up on defense to make ONU's All-America candidate Greg Badenhop out of the game (he was just 3/10, and hit one of his two made treys while Andy and Marty were both on the bench
It was mosty Marty because of Van Horn getting into foul trouble early in the game.  I thought Bidwell played one of his best games as a Scot tonight.  Unfortunately, I think Tom Port played one of his worst games.  

The Scots also need to rediscover their outside touch.  David touched on the fact that Scots NOT named Cooper combined to go 3-12 from beyond the arc and one of those 3 treys belonged to Evan Will!  Fulk has been in a bit of a funk from beyond the arc.  He did manage double figures, but only 1-3 from beyond the arc.  I'd like to see more attempts from him.

Coach Moore put it best in the post game interview.  He basically said we'll definately find out what this team is made of tomorrow.  Unlike last year, they don't have a gimme in the consolation game.  Calvin showed a lot of heart and determination to fight back the way they did vs LAX.  We'll see exactly what Wooster is made of tomorrow night.  Hopefully this loss will re-ignite the fire that I saw in this team in games against Walsh and Georgetown because it certainly was not there tonight!  

As I told my dad after the game, I'd certainly rather lose a game like this in December as opposed to March.  Hopefully the Scots can learn from this, put this loss behind them and move forward on to bigger and loftier goals like reaching Salem and winning a National Championship!  I still think this team has what it takes.  Just not if they play like they did tonight!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 30, 2006, 12:25:26 AM
Sounds like a great game at Wooster tonight.

ONU has now beaten both Witt and Wooster.  Since the Top 25 is almost two weeks old, there will be all kinds of changes when it comes out.

The Tigers won in their tournament tonight, but I have to say that the Mose Hole definitely had the matchup of the week. 

The final tomorrow night looks pretty good with ONU against Wisconsin LaCrosse.  An opportunity exists for Wisc. LaC to make some noise but it looks like ONU from here.

TigerFan_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 30, 2006, 04:15:18 AM
Wabash handled their tough draw against Lakeland 89-71 (after trailing 13-0 in the game) and will play host Franklin tomorrow in a game where Wabash can hopefully make a better showing than they did in the pre-holiday game vs. the Grizz. 

Tough break for Wooster tonight...Scots fans, it's not how you play in December that matters, it's how you're playing in late February and March that matters.  Stay the course...you'll be fine. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 30, 2006, 06:21:35 AM
Reflections from Timken:

It was, I thought, a very uneven game from The Scots.  They'd have a couple of very good offensive possessions and then come down and take a very quick, and poor, shot.  Examples would be a long and flat three-pointer by Port in the first half and some overly-determined one-on-one penetration by Cooper that ended in forced shots or turnovers.  These particular attempts happened while Tim Vandervaart was having some real success inside and the Scots took no time to try to get him the ball.

Earlier in the year, Wooster seemed to do a much better job on the defensive boards.  Although not big and physical, their boxing out was excellent.  That's become a problem of late, as they're starting to look like last year's team in that regard.  If this doesn't change, the bigger more physical teams (which most of the good ones are) will continue to give them problems.

In looking at the boxscore, I saw that Port played 26 minutes.  That number surprised me, I'd thought he missed more time than that due to his foul trouble, an impression that came because due to his ineffectiveness it seemed like he was hardly on the floor at all.  I'd agree it was probably his worst game as a Scot.

Bidwell did play a terrific game, especially defensively.  Used his feet well, hustled, and kept his arm-windmilling to a minimum, which held his fouls down.  Andy Van Horn continues to get called for ticky-tack fouls and I don't know why.  He must be a good guy, his mom and dad certainly are.  Well, he is, anyway, she's not a guy, etc...

Evan Will had probably his best game as a Scot.  He was fanatical on defense, coming up with 3 steals and another few deflections.  He made the one three-pointer, but had a couple more open looks that he passed up, which he often does.  It almost seems as if he feels there's a quota on his three-point attempts.  I wish he'd shoot more, when they're there, as he has an excellent touch.

I don't think that Devin Fulk played poorly, or that there were more shots that he could have taken.  He took what was there, and at least a couple of times even created on short jumpers, one on an especially nice move when trapped in the corner.  He did hurt the Scots with his intentional foul when he threw that clown to the ground, but I have a hard time blaming him after seeing what led to it, something that the officiating crew obviously missed.

Wooster will get a chance to see if they're made of stern stuff, or not.  Calvin is the outclassed team in this tournament, but they'll be up for tonight's game, as there's now the smell of blood in the gym.  If they can manage to hang close early, and Wooster has not sufficiently regrouped after last night, a ballgame might develop.  I don't think this will happen (I see the Scots by 15 to 20), but the possibility exists.

I think LaCrosse will give ONU all they can handle.  The Wisconsin team looked very solid when dismantling Calvin early, and if they hadn't lost interest (who can blame them?) would have won that game by 30+.  I see a dogfight in the championship, and I hope tonight's crowd hangs around to see it.

DC, I don't know what game you were watching; maybe you're just trying to be diplomatic.  In my opinion, it was another very poorly officiated game, where ridiculously blatant calls were either missed or called the wrong way while ticky-tack calls were made left and right.  At one point, an ONU player dribbled the ball, once, in the corner, then picked it up.  Then he put the ball on the floor again in a baseline move.  An obvious double dribble, ignored.  Another time Port was moving down the lane, got smeared from behind which knocked him into an ONU player in front of him, and he was called for a charge.  Unbelievable.

These lousy calls went both ways.  Maybe some of them were makeup calls, who knows?  These officials really need to work on their game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on December 30, 2006, 10:48:10 AM
I couldn't get the Wabash game on the web last night....is that because of Christmas break?? It seems that if the Little Giants pound the paint and limit turnovers the kids will be a handfull for the better teams...I tuned into D3hoops and listened to the Mose Hole Classic....good broadcast and good basketball
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on December 30, 2006, 11:09:20 AM
I don't know what to say for Wooster but that they will definitely have to step it up.  They can't afford to play tough teams the way they played last night.  I was impressed with ONU...even though Badenhop had only 11 (thanks to some very good defense by Bidwell and Van Horn) you could tell what an athlete that kid is.  I remember watching him last year vs. Baldwin Wallace; he is quick, moves very well off the ball, and plays very good defense.  (He was on Cooper most of the game, who is very, very tough to defend). 

About the referees...I think there could have been some changes in the way they called the game.  They didn't even let the guys play.  ONU was shooting freethrows with 10+ minutes left in the second half.  They called such a tight game and it seemd to get to the players.  Fulk committed that intentional foul and at one point the refs called all the players on the floor over in the middle of the game to have a huddle.  Does anyone know for sure what that was about? I think it was to tell the guys to calm down and knock it off.  Someone had said that ONU's bench started heckling the Wooster players on the floor and vice-versa.  Regardless, the high-number of calls kept some Wooster players off the floor again tonight: Port and Van Horn.  I agree with WB in that I was surprised to see Port actually played 26 minutes.  I also thought he was on the bench way more than that. 

One more thing to add - Wooster needs to really start practicing their foul shots.  In close games like tonight foul shooting makes A HUGE difference when the game comes down on the line.  And because the refs were calling such a tight game, it makes THE difference IMO.  Props to Northern for making them when they count.

Hopefully Wooster will pull it together, shake off these 2 losses and play like the team they were against Georgetown and Walsh and pull out a great 3rd place finish in the Mose Hole.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 30, 2006, 11:46:55 AM
Prior to their last 4 games, Wooster had made 101 of 119 free throws, for a very excellent .849 percentage.  Since then, the Scots have gone 53 for 83, a horrible .639.

Cedarville: 18-27
Pomona-Pitzer: 6-14
California Baptist: 7-11
ONU: 22-31

Who knows what to make of that?  Certainly they practice free throws, but they're definitely not going in, and if this continues so will problems against tough opponents.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2006, 11:58:51 AM
I thought the officiating was practically non-observable in the first half, which is the way you want it.  There were a lot more whistles in the second half, but the play was a lot more physical as well (witness Fulk's astonishing [to me] throw-down).  After the intentional foul and the huddle, the refs called a tighter game, but I don't blame them for that.  Were there some questionable calls?  Sure, but there's no getting around that.  I thought Port's fourth foul (charging) was called the wrong way, but charging/blocking is rarely an obvious call.   The ref was right on top of it, and I defer to his judgment.  As others have noted, it wasn't Port's finest hour, so having him sit with 4 fouls was not necessarily a bad thing (although he is perhaps our most skilled rebounder, so it probably hurt in that regard.)  Vandervaart was the beneficiary on a couple of other charging/blocking calls that could have gone either way.

It was a great game between two teams that deserve their top 10 rankings.  Both teams had their chances to win, both did some things well and other things not so well.  The refs were not decisive, in my opinion.  The intensity was high, the atmosphere was great, at times I almost felt like it was another Woo/Witt game (without the unsportsmanlike conduct by the fans).  I'm glad I was there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 30, 2006, 12:27:47 PM
The pair of neutral observers at center court saw the Port charge a little differently. Hostetler only bowled into Port from behind BECAUSE Hunter stood in and took the charge, slowing Port down.

I thought it was actually a well-officiated game.

If I missed something, other than the flop two seconds earlier, that "led to" Fulk shoving the ONU player, then I also missed it on the TV tape delay airing last night, which I stumbled across on the local cable in the hotel here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 30, 2006, 01:15:37 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 30, 2006, 11:58:51 AM
(witness Fulk's astonishing [to me] throw-down). 
While I'm not defending Fulk's rather surprising throwdown of that ONU player, I think Fulk was the victim of being the retaliator in that circumstance.  That ONU player was all over Fulk right before that incident and even flopped to the floor to try and draw a foul and when he got up, he got all over Devin once again and Devin just kind of pushed him aside and the kid flopped again drawing the intentional foul from Devin.  Fulk let his emotions get in the way of better judgement in that instance. 

I will  give the Northern kids some credit.  They were good actors.  My brother-in-law coaches soccer and played at the COW and he commented on how one of the Northern players or coaches must have a soccer background because of how they came out doing soccer warmups.  When Badenhop flopped drawing that charge on Cooper I said to him, "He must be the soccer player!" ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 30, 2006, 01:41:09 PM
Pat,

With all due respect, your comment about Port's charge makes  no sense. You basically admit that he was hit from behind. So that's a foul on ONU.  How is it a foul on Port? Are you saying that it is OK to hit a player from behind while shooting because one of his teammates is  holding his ground in front of him? It matters what contact comes first, and in this case, Port was hammered from behind before the charge (which looking from the photo on the home page of this site, the guy taking the charge already starting shifting his body).

I talked to several people who all agreed that was one of the worst officiated halves of basketball they have ever seen. If that is good officiating, I hate to see what it must be like in the rest of the country. We won't even talk about the one official calling continuation baskets that might not have even been called in the NBA.

If you can predict (as I and another person I talked to did) how the officials would make a series of make-up calls after the Port foul, then you know the officials are amatuers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2006, 02:03:25 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 30, 2006, 01:41:09 PM

I talked to several people who all agreed that was one of the worst officiated halves of basketball they have ever seen.

Seinfeld - you are certainly entitled to your opinion, but I am going to agree with David and Pat on the officiating being reasonable last night and giving no advantage to either team in this game.

Take a serious look why Wooster lost -- they got outplayed:
ONU shot 49%; Woo shot 44%
ONU had 43 boards; Woo only had 29 boards (from final box score)
ONU only missed 5 free throws; Woo missed 9 throws (4 point swing right there)

As far as Port's 4th foul for charging, Tom made a big mistake by driving the lane hard when he already had 3 fouls.  ONU's big guy, Michael Hunter, was already in the lane and Port made contact with him.  Don't put yourself in that position where it is up to the ref to decide a block or a charge that results in your 4th foul.  Instead, Port should have pulled up for the 10 footer or swung the ball to a teammate.

Let's see Wooster bounce back vs. Calvin!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2006, 02:12:03 PM
Some folks think Port charged into Hunter.
Some folks think Hunter was not set.
Some folks think Hostetler was over the back before Port ran into Hunter.

The official, who I again emphazise was closer to the play than any of us and had an unobstructed view, selected one of these three possible outcomes.  I can't see how this is evidence that the officiating was poor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on December 30, 2006, 02:18:15 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 30, 2006, 02:12:03 PM
Some folks think Port charged into Hunter.
Some folks think Hunter was not set.
Some folks think Hostetler was over the back before Port ran into Hunter.

The official, who I again emphazise was closer to the play than any of us and had an unobstructed view, selected one of these three possible outcomes.  I can't see how this is evidence that the officiating was poor.

because Wooster  lost. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 30, 2006, 02:26:06 PM
wooscotsfan

I actually think Coach Moore should have benched Port for the rest of the game, so that he couldn't pick up his 4th or 5th foul. Or at least he should have told him to just hang around the 3-point line and try not to make contact with anyone.

To me, the referees recognized their bad call against Port, as they called five fouls on ONU in the next three minutes in an attempt to make up for it, including a phantom call against Gehle on a breakaway against Will.

So people don't imply, like often happens on this board, I'm not saying the officials cost Wooster the game. Poor rebounding, key turnovers, missed shots cost Wooster the game. That is a separate argument from poor officiating. Or maybe the referees never have a bad game ...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on December 30, 2006, 03:03:58 PM
Every year, I ponder the 'good loss' question.  Is there such a thing as a good loss?  No doubt that the SCOTS, Wittenberg, ONU, Va. Wesleyan are teams that will be in the mix for the national title.  Going undefeated is especially tough with a competitive non-conference schedule.  As a former high school coach and current AAU coach, loses can be good things.  They can substantiate the coach's rants. "You are good but not that good" or "You have to rebound better" or "You have to play 40 minutes" really gets thru to players after a loss, especially when you think you could have or should have won the game.
   The SCOTS have lost two in a row and the SCOTS can take those lessons learned and carry that ill feeling all the way to Salem.  A key loss to knock the ego can be good.  For the Wooster run to Salem in 2003, there were two key losses with all of those wins, the loss to K'zoo in the final of the Mose Hole and @ Wittenberg.
   Now again we have two loses and after the Mose Hole, we launch into lackluster NCAC play.  There are some key points to take into the rest of the season that we take from these loses: (1) Wooster has to find a way to win when the outside shot is not falling.  We still have Witt and two with OWU on the schedule.  (2) We need depth for offense and defense in the paint.  'Darth' Vandervaart cannot do it by himself. (Read send in the Freshman) and (3) Free throws, Free throws and FTs.
   I am not panicking.  I have been around basketball too long to panic.  But we have to take advantage of these losses, move on and take the lessons to make us a better team.  That is why the schedule was tough in the first place right?  Time to prepare to March.  Well, now we know what we need to work on!!  Let's good SCOTS!! Let's turn these losses into 'good losses'.

Let's start the drive to Salem with a win over Calvin!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 30, 2006, 03:06:52 PM
Congrats to ONU as they are a very good and deep team.

An exciting game (24 lead changes!) but unfortunately the Scots did not execute at the finish, (the turnover pass from Johnson to Fulk, the missed FT's, the in and out layup). Just too much to overcome in a tight ball game.

To me the stat of the game was second chance points (22 for ONU, 10 for Wooster). In the first half it seemed that ONU got virtually every missed shot for easy put backs. On the other end of the court some shots went up too quick and players like Vandervaart were not in position to grab a RB.

Another advantage was the speed of their guards. The Scot's guards seemed to be a half step behind in their defense which resulted in a number of fouls on drives to the hoop.

So now it is gut check time. Calvin is not Thiel so the Scots will have to show that they can put it behind them quickly and concentrate on the task on hand. Earlier games were marked by sharp passes for easy or open look shots. Last night there were only 11 assists on 28 baskets. Need to get back to their game...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2006, 09:31:44 PM
Final:  Wooster 98  Calvin 82

Wooster controlled this game from the beginning and the outcome was never in doubt.  Scots played a much better game tonight and won the battle of the boards by a 44-32 count. :)

Wooster was led tonight by James Cooper with 27 points.  He was unstoppable including a one on one play to score right before halftime (Scots led 56-40 at the half).  Tom Port played an inspired game tonight scoring 20 points plus a number of rebounds and he made his free throws (6 of 6).

Marty Bidwell played his best game ever as a Scot with a career high 20 points including 4 three pointers and overall great shooting (7 of 8 from the floor).  Devin Fulk also made 4 three pointers and added a total of 14 points.

Calvin was led by Caleb Veldhouse with 22 points (5 three pointers) and Matt Veltema with 13 points.

Wooster is now 10-2, 3-0 NCAC. :)  Next up is Denison on 1/6.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2006, 09:53:35 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 26, 2006, 09:39:54 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 22, 2006, 07:26:59 PM

The E stood for Ernest.  Hope that helps.  :)

I believe that E.M. Hole was short for Earnest Mose Hole.  There is some story that once appeared in the Daily Record that he was named after the family cat?

David Collinge and I had a nice halftime conversation this evening with Frank Knorr and he filled in the correct facts and missing pieces.  E.M. Hole was actually short for:

Ernest Main Hole

The "Mose" nickname did come from the family cat so he was known as "Mose" Hole throughout his coaching career. :)  Frank also commented that noted Boston Celtics Coach Red Auerbach once credited some of his early fast break principles to a small college coach in Ohio that he had heard talk at a basketball clinic....and that coach was "Mose" Hole who was a pioneer of fast break, pressing basketball in the 1930's. :)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2006, 10:02:21 PM
Final:  #7 Ohio Northern 73  Wisconsin-LaCrosse 70

Greg Badenhop scored a game-high 26 points and earned Tournament MVP honors as Ohio Northern defeated Wisconsin-LaCrosse 73-70 tonight in the championship game of the Wooster Mose Hole Classic at Timken Gymnasium.

The Polar Bears improve to 10-1, while the Eagles fall to 8-4.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 30, 2006, 10:11:58 PM
More "Mose" Hole:

An elderly friend of mine, Chuck McClintock, knew Mose Hole back in the thirties.  Chuck actually played basketball with Mose's son, who was called "Pudge", at Wooster High School. 

Pudge, who was not fat but actually dealt his nickname because he was extremely skinny, went on to play for his dad at COW, probably right after the war.  According to Chuck he was a very good, but not very physical player.  In order to entice him to play tougher, his dad offered him various gifts if he were ever to foul out of a game, but he never did. :) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2006, 10:53:24 PM
Mose Hole was a pioneer of the styles of play that have come to be known as "Run and Gun," "40 Minutes of Hell," and the like.  His teams shot whenever they were open, which was unusual in that day and age, and ran a defense that he described as "a stratified transitional zone with man-to-man implications."  :D

It was a good chat with Frank and wooscotsfan.  In fact, it was a good weekend altogether, even with the loss.  It's always nice to see Pat Coleman and Jared Rosenbaum in town, and we had a very nice lunch at the Olde Jaol with Pat, Wooster Booster, ScotsFan, myself, and Calvin fans Oldknight and Goodknight.  CMHScots was planning to join us, but was called away by a family emergency (best wishes, Mike!)  Plus I got to meet wooscotsfan for the first time, and got to see 4 good-to-great basketball games.  And I got to help out Goodwill Industries too.  All in all it wasa good way to spend a weekend.

Happy New Year to everyone!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 30, 2006, 11:07:16 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 30, 2006, 10:53:24 PM
Mose Hole was a pioneer of the styles of play that have come to be known as "Run and Gun," "40 Minutes of Hell," and the like.  His teams shot whenever they were open, which was unusual in that day and age, and ran a defense that he described as "a stratified transitional zone with man-to-man implications."  :D

This is a riot, especially since due to his name, the era, and the rural locale, I've always pictured Mose Hole as half basketball coach and half coon hunter, with a shotgun over his shoulder in case some unwarranted varmint happened to wander into his practices.  Now, I'll have to revamp my opinion, as he was obviously far ahead of the game, and his firing of the shotgun was more likely only to spur his charges on to get out on the break quicker.  :D 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 30, 2006, 11:12:07 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 30, 2006, 01:41:09 PM
Pat,

With all due respect, your comment about Port's charge makes  no sense. You basically admit that he was hit from behind.

AFTER he charged. Isn't that important? Did you read my post?

Quote from: Pat Coleman on December 30, 2006, 12:27:47 PM
Hostetler only bowled into Port from behind BECAUSE Hunter stood in and took the charge, slowing Port down.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 31, 2006, 12:29:02 AM
Great game for Marty Bidwell tonight with a career high 20 points. Coupled with his defensive effort against ONU's Badenhop I think he had the best (or at least most consistent) weekend for the Scots. It was also good to see Tom Port get back into the offensive flow.

The Scots return to their crisp passing resulting in 21 assists on 38 baskets (55% versus under 40% yesterday). While Calvin got it down to 12 points a couple of times in the second half there never really seemed to be any doubt about the outcome. Calvin has a good team and looking at the records of other teams in the MIAA I would suspect they will finish high in the standings.


I hope everyone has a good New Year and promising start to 2007.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 31, 2006, 10:45:38 AM
All the 12/30 NCAC Final Scores:

Wittenberg 78  IU-Southeast 47
Franklin 80  Wabash 68
Adrian 77  Oberlin 40
Kalamazoo 89  Hiram 81
Wooster 98  Calvin 82

Happy New Year to everyone on D3Hoops!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: onefan on December 31, 2006, 12:25:48 PM
Sorry this post is late but I spent the last two days in Wooster without access to a computer. Have reviewed all the NCAC followers comments regarding the Wooster /ONU game and would like to add my "two cents" worth from an OAC fans perpective....I would give the officials an overall poor rating. With a game between two teams the calibur of ONU and Wooster the officials should have been much less a factor and much less visible...Unlike some of the postings I think the stripes stunk up both halves....The oldest ref on the floor had such a bad game that late in the contest he came over to the ONU corner of the gym and threatened to eject some poor kid for heckling when the  culprit was actually some guy standing behind him in the hallway to the locker room. Several Wooster fans that sat in front of me were of the same opinion. Nonetheless, that was one great game, it's ashame the officiating wasn't the same quality as the two teams on the floor....I was absolutely dumbfounded with the intentional foul committed away from the ball right in front of the referee. I was at that end of the court and the Wooster player actually shoved Curtis Brown twice...The ref could have called it the first time but waited until he got shoved to the floor...There was no "flop" to it...Unfortunate that it happened...regarding some comments that several of the Scots had subpar games, I think the focus should be  more on the quality of the team they were playing....ONU plays a stingy defense and their opponents' offense have typically responded accordingly. Hats off to the Scots, they posted a tough 84 points, and the game could have gone either way up until the last ninety seconds. Board play and free throws were the difference...I think if these two teams played ten times they would in all liklihood split evenly....I have attended every ONU game this season with the exception of their their opening two and can tell you that even with the BW whipping that the Bears suffered on their home floor, Wooster is "hands down" the best team they have faced...I fully expect these two teams will meet again in a few months....Best of luck to the Scots for the remainder of the season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on December 31, 2006, 03:04:54 PM
I'd like to hear some thoughts on the next DIII poll.

Having beaten Wooster. Witt, and UW-LaCrosse, I think there is a good case to be made for Ohio Northern in spite of the loss to Baldwin-Wallace.

By the way, with the Monday holiday, when will the new poll be out?

TigerFan
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 31, 2006, 03:14:39 PM
Knock on wood, it will come out Wednesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 31, 2006, 03:25:03 PM
First of all, I just wanted to say it was nice to finally meet up with David, WB, Pat and a couple of calvin supporters as well yesterday.  I was also looking forward to meeting cmhscots and his father, but family comes first.  Hopefully I'll have the opportunity to meet up with you and also wooscotsfan sometime in the near future.

As for the game between Wooster and Calvin, I have to admit, I really didn't follow it all that closely as David and I were having some pretty good conversation during the game and the game itself never really seemed to be in doubt.  David had actually predicted a 20 point lead by Wooster at the half and it nearly came to fruition if not for a couple of treys and some easy layups in the final minute and a half of the 1st half.  Cooper nailed one of his deadly mid-range jumpers as the horn sounded to give the Scots a 16 point cushion at the intermission and Calvin would never get closer than 13 the rest of the way. 

I was pleased to see the Scots come out and put that 2 game losing streak behind them.  Doubt could have easily started creeping in it's ugly head.  I had noticed in the paper the day before that it mentioned this was the 1st two game losing streak by the Scots since the end of the '97-'98 season when Wooster lost in the NCAC championship game and then in the 1st round of the NCAA's.  I was wondering how far we'd have to go to see the last 3 game losing streak so I thought I'd check it out.  Amazingly, Wooster hasn't had a 3 game losing streak during Steve Moore's tenure as the head coach of the Scots!  You have to go all the way back to the year before Coach Moore took over the program (Lu Wims final season of '86-'87) to find a losing streak of 3 games or more and they actually had 3 seperate 3 game losing streaks and a 5 game losing streak in that season alone!  It's pretty impressive the consistency that Moore has brought back to this program when you think that in his 20 years as the head coach at Wooster, the Scots have never endured more than a 2 game losing streak!  And even those don't come around very often.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 31, 2006, 03:46:17 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on December 31, 2006, 03:04:54 PM
I'd like to hear some thoughts on the next DIII poll.

Having beaten Wooster. Witt, and UW-LaCrosse, I think there is a good case to be made for Ohio Northern in spite of the loss to Baldwin-Wallace.

TF,

I'd have to agree with you on making a case for ONU being #1 in the next poll.  I just think they have too much ground to make up on Amherst assuming Amherst wins today down in Texas.  That doesn't mean that I don't feel ONU is better than Amherst because in my opinion I feel ONU is the better team.  I saw that David had made his predictions over on the Top 25 board and he predicted the followowing top 10:

Quote from: David Collinge on December 31, 2006, 10:47:25 AM
1. Amherst
2. Ohio Northern
3. UW-Stevens Point
4. St. Thomas
5. Wooster
6. Whitworth
7. Mississippi College
8. Va. Wesleyan
9. Wittenberg
10. Wm. Paterson
I would agree with his top 3, however, I wouldn't slide Wooster below St. Thomas at this point.  The Tommies' body of work so far this season isn't nearly as impressive as Wooster's to date IMO.  I'd even be inclined to move Mississippi College above St. Thomas into the #5 slot.

In my mind (which doesn't count for much :P), ONU is playing like the #1 team in the country right now even though the poll will probably have them at #2 or possibly even #3. 

And as for Wooster, although it sucks to lose,  it's nice to lose the #1 ranking by losing to someone other than Witt for a change! ;)  I'm not all that upset about losing the #1 ranking right now anyways.  I'd much rather see the Scots #1 in that final poll that comes out in March than I am about seeing them staying #1 in January.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 31, 2006, 03:47:44 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on December 31, 2006, 03:04:54 PM
I'd like to hear some thoughts on the next DIII poll.

Having beaten Wooster. Witt, and UW-LaCrosse, I think there is a good case to be made for Ohio Northern in spite of the loss to Baldwin-Wallace.

Here's part of what I posted on the Top 25 board:
Quote from: David Collinge on December 31, 2006, 10:47:25 AMI think this how the new top 10 shakes out:

1. Amherst
2. Ohio Northern
3. UW-Stevens Point
4. St. Thomas
5. Wooster
6. Whitworth
7. Mississippi College
8. Va. Wesleyan
9. Wittenberg
10. Wm. Paterson

I'm not advocating for that lineup (I don't engage in that sort of advocacy), just predicting that's how it will look. 

I expect ONU to pick up some first place votes, maybe 3 to 6 of them, but it probably won't be enough to overcome Amherst (again, presuming the Lord Jeffs win today.)  Whether ONU or Amherst (or Stevens Point) should be #1 is another question, one that is being discussed in the Top 25 room (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4097.0), which is a good place to go to keep up with these kinds of discussions...and I'm not just saying that because I contribute there so frequently!  ;D

NOTE:  ha!  a cross-post!  well, I'll post anyway, so there.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 31, 2006, 05:19:29 PM
good weekend from witt-yes there are people that care-to come back from the holiday layoff fresh and motivated. the friday score was closer vs York(a NCAA team from last season)than the game actually was and saturday was just no contest against SE-Indiana.

as for the poll i think ONU gets first place votes after beating the caliber of teams that they have. the win over wooster makes the wittenberg loss a little less devastating as if there is such a category that would be a quality loss for both the NCAC teams. if they both play strong and well in conference they should both get in.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 31, 2006, 07:07:57 PM
Happy New Year Everyone!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 02, 2007, 01:58:38 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 31, 2006, 03:46:17 PMTF,

I'd have to agree with you on making a case for ONU being #1 in the next poll.  I just think they have too much ground to make up on Amherst assuming Amherst wins today down in Texas.  That doesn't mean that I don't feel ONU is better than Amherst because in my opinion I feel ONU is the better team. 

Your point is what I was getting at.   I think the case can be made that ONU is the better team right now, just not one of the last teams to be undefeated.  I don't know anything about teams outside of this region, and I am certainly not any kind of expert in the region.

I like to analyze stuff, though, often overanalyzing.  ;D

It seems that a lot of times in polls, even at the Divison I level that being undefeated can be overrated.  I think that ONU's loss to BW is not indicative of the Polar Bears' strength.  Something about "any given team on any given day" ...

I did not realized that there is a Top 25 board.  I'm off to try to find that.

Thanks.

TigerFan_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 02, 2007, 02:11:24 AM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 02, 2007, 01:58:38 AM
I did not realize that there is a Top 25 board.  I'm off to try to find that.

Thanks.

TigerFan_1973

I found it.  Thanks for pointing it out.

Part of it was the schedule and the way the Mose Hole matchups fell, but it's hard for me to see a stronger bid than ONU right now.  On the one hand, polls are meaningless in sports with a tournament (all but D1 football, I guess, NCAA take note  ;D), on the other they are interesting fuel for discussion.

As I said, I don't know enough to even comment on a national top 25.  How do people in the Great Lakes region feel, let's say, about the top 5 in the region?

I would have ONU, Wooster, Witt at 1, 2, 3 but I'm not sure from there.

Any thoughts, please?

TF
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2007, 02:17:21 AM
I have UW-Stevens Point above Wooster and St. Thomas and Amherst above Witt but all three Ohio teams mentioned are in my personal top six.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 02, 2007, 02:22:32 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2007, 02:17:21 AM
I have UW-Stevens Point above Wooster and St. Thomas and Amherst above Witt but all three Ohio teams mentioned are in my personal top six.

I was talking about just the Great Lakes region.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2007, 02:39:54 AM
Ahh, right.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2007, 11:25:49 AM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 02, 2007, 02:11:24 AM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 02, 2007, 01:58:38 AM
I did not realize that there is a Top 25 board.  I'm off to try to find that.

Thanks.

TigerFan_1973

I found it.  Thanks for pointing it out.

I hope it wasn't too hard to find.  I posted a link to it (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4097.1815) in my New Year's Eve post on this subject; perhaps you didn't notice that.  Links embedded in posts show up in blue typeface, such as the phrase "link to it" in the previous sentence.

Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 02, 2007, 02:11:24 AM
As I said, I don't know enough to even comment on a national top 25.  How do people in the Great Lakes region feel, let's say, about the top 5 in the region?

I would have ONU, Wooster, Witt at 1, 2, 3 but I'm not sure from there.

Any thoughts, please?

TF

I'd have the top 3 that way as well.  After them, I'd probably have Baldwin-Wallace, John Carroll, and Hope, perhaps not in that order, but at this point in the season I'm not enthusiastic about any of them.  And I haven't seen any of them yet, either; I have seen Capital, whose paper credentials are similar to B-W and JCU, but who was mediocre at best when I saw them.  Maybe if I'd seen B-W, JCU, or Hope, I'd be as down on them as I am on Capital.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 02, 2007, 12:24:35 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 02, 2007, 02:11:24 AM
As I said, I don't know enough to even comment on a national top 25.  How do people in the Great Lakes region feel, let's say, about the top 5 in the region?

I would have ONU, Wooster, Witt at 1, 2, 3 but I'm not sure from there.

Any thoughts, please?


Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2007, 11:25:49 AM
I'd have the top 3 that way as well.  After them, I'd probably have Baldwin-Wallace, John Carroll, and Hope, perhaps not in that order, but at this point in the season I'm not enthusiastic about any of them. 

I have not seen any of the teams listed outside of ONU, Wooster and Witt (and Witt was just a tv broadcast).  I would agree with TF and DC that those 3 would be my GL top 3 right now as well.  As for the remainder of the top 5, I think Hope could be considered right up there with Witt for maybe 3b in the GL Region although, having not seen them, I'm just going by my opinion to stick them below Witt at this point.  And as for B-W and JCU, they have just been far too inconsistent to place them ahead of Hope or Witt at this point of the season.  B-W does have the impressive win over ONU, but they also have the very unimpressive loss to 5-5 Edgewood to counter it.  And JCU has dropped 2 out of 3 to unrakned opponents.  Couple that with the fact that they haven't really been dominant in their wins over average at best opponents and I would have to say that they still have a lot to prove. 

Right now, I'd have to say that there is a pretty large gap once you get below the top 4 in the region.  Hope did lose 2 games, but they were both on the road and both were very winnable games by the Dutch.  Also, do they even count as in-region games for Hope?  I can never seem to get the criteria straight when it comes to what is considered regional and non regional for those MIAA teams.  That could prove to be pretty significant in Hope's favor if they don't have those 2 losses count against them especially considering the relative weakness of the MIAA this season.  Does anyone know if those losses count against hope as regional losses or not?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2007, 12:25:24 PM
If they have a dot next to them on our schedule and results page, they are a regional game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 02, 2007, 12:51:29 PM
scotsfan---Hope's loss to Wheaton counts as in-region.  The Carthage game doesn't exist.

FWIW---I think all of you would be correct to put Hope behind BW, JCU, Witt, Woo and ONU at this point.


Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2007, 12:25:24 PM
If they have a dot next to them on our schedule and results page, they are a regional game.

What does the dot next to Carthage on Hope's schedule mean?  That game is not in-region.  Its 230 miles to Carthage


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2007, 12:56:35 PM
Dammit, that means someone entering the score for one of the schools marked it in-region, which we all know it is not.

Feel free to drop me an e-mail with important stuff like that, thanks.

207 miles to Carthage according to mappoint.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 02, 2007, 05:08:50 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 02, 2007, 02:11:24 AM
As I said, I don't know enough to even comment on a national top 25.  How do people in the Great Lakes region feel, let's say, about the top 5 in the region?

I would have ONU, Wooster, Witt at 1, 2, 3 but I'm not sure from there.

Any thoughts, please?


I agree, and I agree that after those three there may be somewhat of a drop-off.  We'll have to keep a close eye on Ohio Wesleyan, Hope, John Carroll, Baldwin-Wallace and maybe another team or two- with the seeming lack of another strong team out of the MIAA, the entire Great Lakes region doesn't seem quite as stocked this year...

Early Regional Records:

Ohio Northern (5-1) loss to B-W
Wooster (5-1) loss to ONU
Baldwin-Wallace (5-1) loss to Capital
John Carroll (6-2) losses to Greensboro and Wilmington
Wittenberg (4-2) losses to Woo and ONU
Hope (1-1) loss to Wheaton (have they really only played 2 in-region games...yikes)
Ohio Wesleyan (4-3) losses to Depauw, Allegheny, and Wilmington

With conference play coming up, most of these teams should be able to quickly inflate their win totals.  Conference-wise, Wooster and Hope are the only teams still unbeaten in their conferences.

The first NCAA regional rankings aren't due till when?  Early Feb.??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 02, 2007, 06:05:33 PM
Here is the remaining J.V. schedule for Wooster.  (A home game with Muskingum will probably be added somewhere):

1/22/07         At Mount Union  7:30 p.m.
1/24/07         H - Lorain CC   5:00 p.m.  (Varsity vs Kenyon at 7:30)
1/29/07         At Notre Dame   7:30 p.m.
2/1/07           At Muskingum   7:30 p.m.
2/3/07           H - Wittenberg  5:30 p.m.  (Varsity vs Wittenberg at 7:30)
2/8/07           At Wayne College   7:30 p.m.
2/12/07         At Lorain CC   6:00 p.m.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 02, 2007, 07:31:40 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on January 02, 2007, 05:08:50 PMEarly Regional Records:

John Carroll (6-2) losses to Greensboro and Wilmington

Greensboro was not a regional opponent for JCU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2007, 07:38:58 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 02, 2007, 07:31:40 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on January 02, 2007, 05:08:50 PMEarly Regional Records:

John Carroll (6-2) losses to Greensboro and Wilmington

Greensboro was not a regional opponent for JCU.
It's not "regional," but it is "in-region."  According to the 2007 Handbook (page 15), both North Carolina and Ohio are in Membership Region 3, games within which count under the expanded definition of "in-region."

Membership Region 3 includes teams in the following states and commonwealths: Alabama, Arkansas, Florida, Georgia, Indiana, Kentucky, Louisiana, Michigan, Mississippi, North Carolina, Ohio, Puerto Rico, South Carolina, Tennessee, Virginia, West Virginia.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 02, 2007, 08:16:41 PM
Geez, all this regional crap is confusing. Let's just play hoops and sort 'em out!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2007, 08:27:34 PM
You've just gotta get with the program, smeds.  What's important to the NCAA is to preserve the intense academic atmosphere and not encourage the sports teams to make schedules that detract from the academics.  This new definition of "in-region" games is just an attempt by the NCAA to recognize that some out-of-region trips, like say Holland MI to Wheaton IL, are just too hard on student-athletes and should be discouraged, but other out-of-region trips, like say Holland MI to San Juan PR, can easily fit within the student-athlete's study schedule and should be encouraged.

::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 02, 2007, 09:22:56 PM
David, nice sarcasm, but a mis-chosen example.  Hope-Wheaton IS in-region; it is Calvin-Wheaton (or Carthage-Hope/Calvin) which are non-region in the CCIW-MIAA Challenge.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2007, 09:31:55 PM
Oh, well.  Comedy never was my long suit.  :-[

--------------

Meanwhile in Oberlin, the Yeomen drop a heartbreaker to the Tartans of Carnegie Mellon, 91-65, in a game that wasn't as close as it sounds.  Oberlin sprinted out to a 45-17 halftime deficit and held all but four of the Tartans to single-figure scoring in posting their fifth consecutive loss and ninth in 11 games this season.  Unfortunately, this is an in-region game for the Yeomen, and severely damages their hopes for a Pool C bid.  The Oberlin squad hopes to get back on the winning track this Saturday ... at .... uhm .... Wittenberg... :P :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 02, 2007, 09:42:16 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2007, 07:38:58 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 02, 2007, 07:31:40 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on January 02, 2007, 05:08:50 PMEarly Regional Records:

John Carroll (6-2) losses to Greensboro and Wilmington

Greensboro was not a regional opponent for JCU.
It's not "regional," but it is "in-region."  According to the 2007 Handbook (page 15), both North Carolina and Ohio are in Membership Region 3, games within which count under the expanded definition of "in-region."

Membership Region 3 includes teams in the following states and commonwealths: Alabama, Arkansas, Florida, Georgia, Indiana, Kentucky, Louisiana, Michigan, Mississippi, North Carolina, Ohio, Puerto Rico, South Carolina, Tennessee, Virginia, West Virginia.

David, where would one find the 2007 Handbook, if one were interested?  I tried to find the official regional criteria before my post earlier today and I couldn't navigate the NCAA Div. 3 pages...nor did I find the full criteria in the d3hoops.com FAQ.  Am I just missing it somewhere?!?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2007, 10:03:36 PM
I apologize -- here is the definition of a regional game.

http://www.d3hoops.com/faq.php?question=44
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on January 02, 2007, 10:18:56 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2007, 10:03:36 PM
I apologize -- here is the definition of a regional game.

http://www.d3hoops.com/faq.php?question=44

I really like your updated examples of what a regional game is!  +1
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2007, 10:22:04 PM
Thanks -- it's something we put together for the people putting schedules in.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 02, 2007, 10:31:50 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2007, 10:03:36 PM
I apologize -- here is the definition of a regional game.

http://www.d3hoops.com/faq.php?question=44

Much appreciated!   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2007, 10:50:54 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on January 02, 2007, 09:42:16 PM
David, where would one find the 2007 Handbook, if one were interested?  I tried to find the official regional criteria before my post earlier today and I couldn't navigate the NCAA Div. 3 pages...nor did I find the full criteria in the d3hoops.com FAQ.  Am I just missing it somewhere?!?

It's not easy to find; it's in the "Library" section of the NCAA.org pages, and if you were the sort of Wooster student I was, the mere mention of the word "library" sends your running for the nearest keg.  :D

Anyway, here's a link to a page where you can download the handbook:
CLICK HERE FOR CHAMPIONSHIP HANDBOOK (http://www.ncaa.org/wps/portal/!ut/p/kcxml/04_Sj9SPykssy0xPLMnMz0vM0Y_QjzKLN4j3CQXJgFjGpvqRqCKOcAFfj_zcVH1v_QD9gtzQiHJHRUUAc0tpTA!!/delta/base64xml/L3dJdyEvUUd3QndNQSEvNElVRS82XzBfTFU!?CONTENT_URL=http://www2.ncaa.org/portal/media_and_events/ncaa_publications/championship_handbooks/winter/basketball/mens/index.html)
There's lots of good stuff in it besides the regional definitions; a handy thing for the devoted D3 fan to have around.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 03, 2007, 12:13:05 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2007, 07:38:58 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 02, 2007, 07:31:40 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on January 02, 2007, 05:08:50 PMEarly Regional Records:

John Carroll (6-2) losses to Greensboro and Wilmington

Greensboro was not a regional opponent for JCU.
It's not "regional," but it is "in-region."  According to the 2007 Handbook (page 15), both North Carolina and Ohio are in Membership Region 3, games within which count under the expanded definition of "in-region."

Membership Region 3 includes teams in the following states and commonwealths: Alabama, Arkansas, Florida, Georgia, Indiana, Kentucky, Louisiana, Michigan, Mississippi, North Carolina, Ohio, Puerto Rico, South Carolina, Tennessee, Virginia, West Virginia.

Yeah, I momentarily forgot about those four new crazy-quilt administrative regions.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 03, 2007, 01:14:07 AM
That's what's just insane. I mean...most every D-3 school doesn't have the budget to fly everywhere to play hoops, and most every D-3 school do care about academics and that the hoopsters aren't on the road traveling 12 hours or more to play a game...

Meanwhile...some teams in some conferences can fatten up on nearby teams and get a high seed and waltz deep into the tourney...not that I'd name names...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 03, 2007, 03:38:18 AM
Yeah. Long trip from Indiana to Michigan or Kentucky. Man.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 03, 2007, 08:53:19 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2007, 09:31:55 PM
Oh, well.  Comedy never was my long suit.  :-[

--------------

Meanwhile in Oberlin, the Yeomen drop a heartbreaker to the Tartans of Carnegie Mellon, 91-65, in a game that wasn't as close as it sounds.  Oberlin sprinted out to a 45-17 halftime deficit and held all but four of the Tartans to single-figure scoring in posting their fifth consecutive loss and ninth in 11 games this season.  Unfortunately, this is an in-region game for the Yeomen, and severely damages their hopes for a Pool C bid.  The Oberlin squad hopes to get back on the winning track this Saturday ... at .... uhm .... Wittenberg... :P :)


Dude professes to not be funny..........then gives us one of the funniest post mortums ever. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 03, 2007, 08:56:09 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 03, 2007, 03:38:18 AM
Yeah. Long trip from Indiana to Michigan or Kentucky. Man.

99% of the options are longer than Calvin to anywhere in Chicago, Hope to anywhere in Chicago and over 250 miles.   For that matter 95% of the in-region options within the Great Lakes region are over 250 miles.  I'm buying you an atlas. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 03, 2007, 12:46:25 PM
For the Hope guy, yes. But for the Wabash guy I was talking to, not as much.

I lived for a decade in the Midwest. Drive through it all the time. I have a handle on it.

How about you send me a map and I send Hope a list of the selection criteria?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 03, 2007, 04:21:37 PM
Quote from: sac on January 03, 2007, 08:53:19 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2007, 09:31:55 PM
Oh, well.  Comedy never was my long suit.  :-[

--------------

Meanwhile in Oberlin, the Yeomen drop a heartbreaker to the Tartans of Carnegie Mellon, 91-65, in a game that wasn't as close as it sounds.  Oberlin sprinted out to a 45-17 halftime deficit and held all but four of the Tartans to single-figure scoring in posting their fifth consecutive loss and ninth in 11 games this season.  Unfortunately, this is an in-region game for the Yeomen, and severely damages their hopes for a Pool C bid.  The Oberlin squad hopes to get back on the winning track this Saturday ... at .... uhm .... Wittenberg... :P :)


well all oberlin needs to do to pull off this game is possibly use the hook and ladder and statue of liberty plays-oh wait wrong sport

anyways....wittenberg at kenyon tonight figures to be an easy win for witt but i need to see a convincing win tonight because that will prove our depth is adaquate as hill, denbow, and hemingway are nursing injuries, all should play.

we return to the theme of old wittenberg grads coming back to face their former team with matt croci as well.

go witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 03, 2007, 04:28:29 PM
I wasn't speaking from a Wabash-centric perspective, just a rational perspective. Every game counts! (OK, conference games count more...but still...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 03, 2007, 05:33:46 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 03, 2007, 12:46:25 PM
For the Hope guy, yes. But for the Wabash guy I was talking to, not as much.

Waitaminute ... isn't he a Carthage guy?! :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2007, 06:14:25 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 03, 2007, 05:33:46 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 03, 2007, 12:46:25 PM
For the Hope guy, yes. But for the Wabash guy I was talking to, not as much.

Waitaminute ... isn't he a Carthage guy?! :D

Nyuk, nyuk.  :D

I see smeds is averaging 8.6 ppg and hitting an even .500 from the arc so far this season.  He even got picked by K-Mark in the CCIW Fantasy Draft!  At 16.7 minutes per game, though, I'm not sure his world's-oldest-freshman body can hold up to a full season of CCIW hoops.     ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2007, 08:55:02 PM
Wittenberg leads Kenyon 51-48 with under 5:00 left.  Kenyon led by 3, 31-28, at the half.

UPDATE:  Kenyon 55-54, 0:47.4 remaining.  Witt ball following a KC turnover.
UPDATE:  Borchers turns it over with :03 on the shot clock.  KC ball, 0:14.8 left and a one-point lead.
UPDATE:  no update; back-to-back time outs.  Kenyon has a 37% free throw shooter in the game.
UPDATE:  But it's Bryan Yelvington who draws the foul, and he shoots 85%.  Hits the first, hits the second.  Time out Kenyon, they lead 57-54 with about 10 seconds left.
UPDATE:  Hill gets fouled, but only gets a one and one for it.  Hits both, but Kenyon still leads by 1 with 0:08.2 left, and has the ball.
UPDATE:  Knapke draws the foul with 0:07.4 left; like Yelvington, he shoots 85%.  Hits the first; hits the second.
UPDATE:  Caraway ties it with a three with 0:00.5 left, and its OT in Gambier!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 03, 2007, 09:16:36 PM
WOAH.  Does Witt/Kenyon have a live recording going?

Nevermind. Already found the recording off Witt's page.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2007, 09:17:32 PM
Yes, at Wittenberg.edu.

59-59 as we begin the overtime.
Hemenway carries the ball and turns it over to the Lords.

UPDATE:  Klinger hits as the shot clock expires, and Kenyon draws first blood.  61-59, 3:51.
UPDATE:  Missed shot for Witt, turnover for Kenyon.
UPDATE:  Denbow drains a three and gives Witt the lead.  Denbow's first points of the game.  Jolson answers with a three with :07 left on the shot clock.  64-62 KC, 2:07.
UPDATE:  Missed shot for Witt, turnover for Kenyon.  64-62, timeout Kenyon.
UPDATE:  Borchers down low ties it with 1:10 left.
UPDATE:  Caraway steals it from Jolson and feeds Borchers for the layup.  Witt 66-64, 1:00 or so left.
UPDATE:  Caraway hurt on the play.  Haddox misses a jumper, Knapke misses the putback, and there's a foul called on Kenyon.
UPDATE:  Borchers misses the first, hits the second, Witt by 3 with 0:37 left.
UPDATE:  And Klinger dribbles it out of bounds.  0:29.1 left, Witt ball, timeout Kenyon.
UPDATE:  Murray draws the foul and will shoot 2.  Hits the first to make it a two-possession game.  0:027.9 left.  Hits the second for a 5-point lead 69-64.  Timeout, Witt.
UPDATE:  Somebody (Arce?) hits a quick 3 for Kenyon.  Borchers gets fouled immediately.  69-67 Witt, now 70-67, now 71-67.  0:17.3 left.
UPDATE:  Haddox travels; I think that's 5 Kenyon turnovers in the OT alone. 
UPDATE:  Hill to shoot two with 0:04.5 left and a 4-point lead. 
UPDATE:  Hill missed one and made one.  Jolson misses at the buzzer and Witt survives 72-67 (OT).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2007, 09:33:50 PM
Another nailbiter win for Witt, who is 2-1 in the NCAC with both wins in OT (Denison, Kenyon)
Another nailbiter loss for Kenyon, who recently lost to DePauw on a buzzer-beater three.

Bill Brown is really impressed with Kenyon's new athletic facilities.  He says it might be the best facility of any college or university in America, "regardless of size."   :o  I've really gotta get down there and see this place.  (I was going to go tonight, but have been waylayed by a serious headcold. :'()
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2007, 10:18:23 PM
Ohio Wesleyan easily disposes of Denison in Granville, 72-50.  That's 9 losses in a row for the 1-11 Big Red.  OWU moves to 8-4 and 2-1 in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2007, 11:30:18 PM
Congratulations to Earlham senior Markous Jewett, selected NCAC Player of the Week for the past fortnight.  Jewett averaged 17 points and 6 rebounds in 5 games over the holidays.  NCAC Men's POTW (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 04, 2007, 12:36:07 AM
<glances above him>

<cue radio announcer voice>

...and here on page 300, David Collinge has recovered from a first-half dominated by Pat Coleman and sac fighting down low over 200-mile long rebounds to return to his dominating, Hall-of-Famer-who-recently-and-deservedly-had-his-posts-elevated-to-front-page-status player and has made the last four posts from the field, and six of the last seven...

<color commentator> that matches his season average, and with numbers like these he might just lift the NCAC board deep into the postseason in the d3hoops Board Championship Season this year.  Unfortuntely, with the stacked MIAA board and the regional focus of d3, it looks like the tournament selection committee could stiff the NCAC with a tough draw again this year...

;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 04, 2007, 02:38:38 AM
Seems like a real barn burner in Gambier. Schwab mustve had those boys ready to play. The rest of the teams in the NCAC seem to be catching up with witt woo. Nice to see some competition, could give some valuable late game situation prep for the tournament. Something that was sorely lacking last year (Witt avg win of 24 ppg). By the way pennstigs it is hemenway not hemingway.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 04, 2007, 10:12:41 AM
my bad-didnt mean to offend you willie-guess im not a perfect speller after all-
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on January 04, 2007, 12:15:33 PM
Wabash is departing for a brutal (travel-wise) roadtrip...Hiram and Gheny approx 800 mi roundtrip...nice (in conference) bus ride....and due to injuries will prob have to start 2 fresh and a soph across the front line...go for it!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 04, 2007, 01:00:50 PM
A very interesting Top 25 poll this week, with only five points separating the top three teams.

Week 5 men's poll
# Team W-L Pts. Last Week
1 UW-Stevens Point (9) 10-1 598 5
2 Ohio Northern (7) 10-1 595 7
3 Amherst (9) 9-0 593 2

Here's a question that maybe Pat could answer:
Without naming names or school affiliations, who votes in the Top 25 poll and how are those voters distributed by region?  I'm just wondering in general and not trying to relate the question to this week's results.

It seems very difficult to have a national view of Division III without the press and TV coverage that is available to DI voters and the lack of what used to be called "inter-sectional" games.  How does a voter realistically compare Amherst and UW-Stevens Point, let's say.  I took a look at the schedule for UW-Stevens Point and all their opponents start with "UW." 

That's not a shot at UW-Stevens Point but really making the point that having a tournament is the only thing that really matters.  The polls give us something to talk about in the meantime, which is certainly a good thing.

I was surprised at the closeness of Witt's game last night but there's a lot to be said for an exciting game rather than a blowout, particularly when listening on the radio.  Unfortunately, I missed listening to it.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 04, 2007, 01:02:54 PM
Quote from: roadtrip on January 04, 2007, 12:15:33 PM
Wabash is departing for a brutal (travel-wise) roadtrip...Hiram and Gheny approx 800 mi roundtrip...nice (in conference) bus ride....and due to injuries will prob have to start 2 fresh and a soph across the front line...go for it!

That is brutal.  I assume they play the same night they get off the bus?  It seems like it would take a few hours to get the kinks out of the body after that kind of a ride.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 04, 2007, 01:17:30 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2007, 10:03:36 PM
http://www.d3hoops.com/faq.php?question=44

Thanks for putting this link up.  I found it very interesting.  It answered my question about whether a game against a closely located opponent in another region counted.  The 200-mile rule answered that question.

I did find this line humorous in a bureaucratic sort of way:
2) The teams are within 200 miles of each other via the NCAA's approved mapping software.  ;D

It seems like if you get on the bus and the odometer has changed by less than 200 miles, it doesn't matter if you use the right software or not.  I guess there could be some D3 mechanic out there with one of those special odometer wrenches, though!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 04, 2007, 01:19:54 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 04, 2007, 01:02:54 PMThat is brutal.  I assume they play the same night they get off the bus?  It seems like it would take a few hours to get the kinks out of the body after that kind of a ride.

It would take me a few months to get the kinks out after a trip of that length.  College kids are made out of rubber, though, and will be able to twist their necks to peer at co-eds (now there's an archaic term) as soon as they hit the pavement.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 04, 2007, 01:21:20 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 04, 2007, 01:00:50 PM
A very interesting Top 25 poll this week, with only five points separating the top three teams.

Week 5 men's poll
# Team W-L Pts. Last Week
1 UW-Stevens Point (9) 10-1 598 5
2 Ohio Northern (7) 10-1 595 7
3 Amherst (9) 9-0 593 2

Here's a question that maybe Pat could answer:
Without naming names or school affiliations, who votes in the Top 25 poll and how are those voters distributed by region?  I'm just wondering in general and not trying to relate the question to this week's results.

It seems very difficult to have a national view of Division III without the press and TV coverage that is available to DI voters and the lack of what used to be called "inter-sectional" games.  How does a voter realistically compare Amherst and UW-Stevens Point, let's say.  I took a look at the schedule for UW-Stevens Point and all their opponents start with "UW." 

That's not a shot at UW-Stevens Point but really making the point that having a tournament is the only thing that really matters.  The polls give us something to talk about in the meantime, which is certainly a good thing.

Three people from each region, which makes 24. I am vote No. 25. The NCAC, OAC and MIAA are represented in the Great Lakes.

I go out of my way to recruit voters who have exposure to more than one region -- either someone who has recently had a job at a different school or conference, or someone whose team schedules a variety of Division III non-conference opponents.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 04, 2007, 01:27:00 PM

Three people from each region, which makes 24. I am vote No. 25. The NCAC, OAC and MIAA are represented in the Great Lakes.

I go out of my way to recruit voters who have exposure to more than one region -- either someone who has recently had a job at a different school or conference, or someone whose team schedules a variety of Division III non-conference opponents.
[/quote]

Thanks, Pat.   Your example of a person who recently came from a different school or conference is a great idea.  I didn't think of that one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 04, 2007, 01:52:40 PM
Every season during the first weekend in January, Wabash and Earlham play consecutive nights against Allegheny and Hiram.  Wabash and Earlham travel east this year...next year the eastern schools will come west for the same trip.  This has been the arrangement since Wabash and Hiram joined the conference. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 04, 2007, 02:08:29 PM
You know, it's probably an easier trip than a lot of minor league baseball teams make.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on January 04, 2007, 02:49:22 PM
I know its a trip that has to be made but to travel and play the same evening has to hurt your chances for a win....there is no way those tall boys could get comfortable in a motor coach...but they are young and what would I know about that?? Get a W!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 04, 2007, 03:10:57 PM
If my numbers are right, Wabash is 13-1 in the regular season vs. Allegheny and Hiram since joining the NCAC (6-0 in road games).  The one loss came at home, in overtime against Allegheny on the first night of the two-day sequence during the '01-'02 season.  Wabash's '01-'02 team finished 11-5 in NCAC play, which is the second best record Wabash has posted in the NCAC (after the inaugural '99'-'00 13-3 campaign).  Wabash's weaker teams since joining the NCAC have been on the road for the Hiram/Gheny games and swept the weekend in all three previous trips.  Whatever the travel arrangements are, they seem to not hinder Wabash's ability to perform in these games.  This might be the greenest Wabash team to date in the NCAC era, so we'll see how it goes this time around.  The historical record doesn't indicate that the trip disrupts Wabash's performance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2007, 04:30:25 PM
Quote from: roadtrip on January 04, 2007, 12:15:33 PM
Wabash is departing for a brutal (travel-wise) roadtrip...Hiram and Gheny approx 800 mi roundtrip...nice (in conference) bus ride....and due to injuries will prob have to start 2 fresh and a soph across the front line...go for it!

There's worse travel out there than C'vill to M'ville.  Consider this:
Quote from: Ralph Turner on January 04, 2007, 12:41:13 AM
David, the Mississippi College to Sul Ross to HPU trip is brutal.

Mappoint shortest distance, 894 miles, 14 hours 9 minutes to Sul Ross.

Sul Ross to HPU -- Shortest Distance: 323.8 miles or 6 hrs 14 minutes.
Sul Ross to HPU -- Shortest Time:  377.4 miles or 5 hrs 48 minutes.

HPU back home -- Shortest Distance:  552.1 miles or 8 hrs 41 minutes.  (Shortest time is less than 0.3 miles and 5 minutes difference.)

(It is 19 miles closer going back, shortest distance, but an hour longer.   :-\  Go figure!)

Sul Ross State U. is in Alpine, TX; Howard Payne U. is in Brownwood, TX; and Mississippi College is in Clinton, MS.  And they're in the same conference (ASC).  It's about an 1800-mile round trip--by bus.  Like Wabash et alia, I believe MC and Louisiana College make this trip one season, then SRSU and HPU make it the next.  Talk about brutal!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 04, 2007, 04:51:45 PM
Back in the day, in the early days of the ASC, of course there was no motorized travel.  All four schools, though, used the latest model Conestogas to make the long trek.  They travelled in tandem, two schools together and two wagons per school, looking for safety in numbers.  However, there was the omnipresent danger of Mexican marauders and both the Kiowa and Commanche tribes, neither of who were friendly to over-the-road hoopsters.

Strategies evolved over time.  Eventually, it was decided to load four "bigs" in the lead wagons while packing the backcourt men tight in the trailing Conestogas.  Of course, bench players did the driving, with student assistant coaches riding shotgun, and many of these poor souls were lost in the initial moments of attacks.  Those who really led the way, though, were the point guards, who rode miles ahead of the teams... 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 04, 2007, 05:30:22 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 04, 2007, 01:21:20 PMThree people from each region, which makes 24. I am vote No. 25. The NCAC, OAC and MIAA are represented in the Great Lakes.

I go out of my way to recruit voters who have exposure to more than one region -- either someone who has recently had a job at a different school or conference, or someone whose team schedules a variety of Division III non-conference opponents.

Have you ever considered expanding the voter pool, Pat ... like, say, adding a fourth voter in each region? Or are the logistics difficult enough with the 24 voters you already have besides yourself?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 04, 2007, 06:35:32 PM
Speaking of the voters, I know it's important to you, Pat, to keep those voters who would like to be nameless to stay that way, but I remember someone recently on the Top 25 board, I believe, who made the suggestion about breaking down the 1st place votes by region.  I think it would be interesting to see how often your voters stick to party lines and vote for their regional teams first.  Especially seeing how evenly dispersed the 1st place votes seemed to be distributed among the top 3 teams this week.  Not like you don't have enough on your plate already though, right??? :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 04, 2007, 11:05:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 04, 2007, 04:30:25 PMSul Ross State U. is in Alpine, TX; Howard Payne U. is in Brownwood, TX; and Mississippi College is in Clinton, MS.  And they're in the same conference (ASC).  It's about an 1800-mile round trip--by bus.  Like Wabash et alia, I believe MC and Louisiana College make this trip one season, then SRSU and HPU make it the next.  Talk about brutal!

I went to a D2 game tonight between Oklahoma Panhandle State and St. Mary's here in SA. OPSU bussed in today from Goodwell, Oklahoma, which is about 650 miles away. They'll rest tomorrow, play Incarnate Word Saturday, then bus back. That's a pretty tough trip, too.

I'll throw this tidbit in as well: The first week of December I left San Antone at 6:00 p.m. and drove to Lubbock. I got in bed at the hotel just after midnight. I woke up the next morning at about 6:00 am and drove to Amarillo. I was in Amarillo for all of 2 hours and then drove straight back to San Antone. For those keeping track at home that's about 1050 miles in 24 hours. Now, I didn't have to do anything more physical than walk a block from my car to the courthouse and pump gas a few times. But by the time I got home my brain was oatmeal. If I'd have had to do anything more complicated than make a sammich I'd have been screwed.

These kids deserve some credit for going on trips like this and playing ballgames.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 04, 2007, 11:42:16 PM
Here was the old (and I believe same as this weekend) travel schedule that Earlham has used in the past on the 'gheny and Hiram trip.

Thursday: Morning practice, team lunch, bus leaves around 2 p.m....arrive late in evening in Meadville.

Friday: Morning shoot around, lunch, game at 7 p.m.....following game, load the buses and head to Hiram, arriving late in the evening (for Big Ten football fans, Earlham arrived at the Hiram hotel just in time to see the infamous pass interference call against Miami that kept alive OSU's hopes of a national title in 2002)

Saturday: Lunch with the team and then an afternoon game at Hiram....load the bus afterward and head back to Richmond

Saturday night: beer and a couch
Sunday: more beer and a bigger couch

Honestly, it is a terribly tiring weekend for the road team and one of the great disadvantages that Wabash/EC/Hiram/Allegheny face each year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 05, 2007, 03:41:44 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 04, 2007, 06:35:32 PM
Speaking of the voters, I know it's important to you, Pat, to keep those voters who would like to be nameless to stay that way, but I remember someone recently on the Top 25 board, I believe, who made the suggestion about breaking down the 1st place votes by region.  I think it would be interesting to see how often your voters stick to party lines and vote for their regional teams first.  Especially seeing how evenly dispersed the 1st place votes seemed to be distributed among the top 3 teams this week.  Not like you don't have enough on your plate already though, right??? :P

Hmm, OK.

I voted for UW-Stevens Point.
Midwest: Ohio Northern, Amherst, UW-Stevens Point
Great Lakes: Ohio Northern, Amherst, Amherst
East: UW-Stevens Point, Ohio Northern, UW-Stevens Point
Mid-Atlantic: UW-Stevens Point, UW-Stevens Point, Amherst
Atlantic: Ohio Northern, Ohio Northern, Ohio Northern
Northeast: Amherst, Amherst, Amherst
South: Amherst, Amherst, Ohio Northern
West: UW-Stevens Point, UW-Stevens Point, UW-Stevens Point
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 05, 2007, 05:49:49 AM
Not what I would expect

Interesting the Great Lakes voters are the only one who didn't rally around their region.

Seems to be a problem in the Midwestern area with voters  (see Ron Zook, see Jim Tressel)

Thanks Pat
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 05, 2007, 09:46:18 AM
I don't think it's a problem. I think we need less regional partisanship all in all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 05, 2007, 10:43:50 AM
Thanks Pat. 

It's not really what I expected to see.  Well, from the Northeast and West it looks about expected.  But ONU fared far better in the Atlantic region than in their own GL region.  That's kind of surprising to me. 

All in all, it's a tough call no matter how you slice it.  Personally, Stevens Point and ONU would be the 2 teams I would have a hard time choosing between, but ultimately I would probably go with the Pointers as they have played as equally a tough of schedule as ONU and they haven't been beaten by a DIII opponent.  Amherst still has a lot of proving to do in my book before I'm convinced that they're even a better team than Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 05, 2007, 12:58:45 PM
The Daily Record's Chad Conant reports that Wooster is limping into tomorrow's game vs. Denison:

Quote from: Chad ConantCenter Tim Vandervaart (16.1 points, 9.1 rebounds a game) came down with a calf injury in the consolation game of the Mose Hole/Wooster Kiwanis Classic and forwards Tom Port (16.5 points, 5.7 rebounds) and Evan Will (5.8 points, 3.2 rebounds) returned from the New Year's holiday break with their own nasty cases of the flu. None of the three practiced Wednesday and were still healing as the week moved forward.

"At this point, we're not very healthy in the post," Scots coach Steve Moore said.

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1443252

You might think that 1-10 Denison is exactly who you want to see in this situation, but perhaps not.  The Big Red did demonstrate to Wittenberg that they can be competitive (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/db/site/newsreleases/mb/20061202_2236.html) if they are properly motivated.  Furthermore, they have probably the NCAC's best player on a non-contending team in Dan Hodgkinson, the current NCAC leading scorer at 19.0 ppg.  If the best defense the Scots can offer on Dan is Craig Elam or Robert Melick, Hodgkinson could go for 30+ and the game could easily come down to a question of whether the Scots can hit their jumpers. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 05, 2007, 01:24:28 PM
I'm going to go out on a limb and claim that Wooster (of course, playing their normal 5 against 8) would beat Denison even with their top three bigs sidelined.  Would Hodgkinson get 30 or more?  Possibly.  That would make the score something like 100-50.  Not that we'll get the chance to see it, but I'd even wager that Wooster's JV would defeat the Big Red, although that might be a decent matchup.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 05, 2007, 01:39:49 PM
I posted something similar on the football board but I think it bears repeating here.

I have posted three times since December 23 (about In-N-Out Burger, the Trinity/Amherst game and about the brutal travel schedules). In that time since 12/23 my karma has taken a hit nearly every day, including one today.

Whoever is doing this please click on my profile. You'll find my email address. If you go to the website for that domain you'll find my office telephone number. In addition you could PM me.

Pick one of those ways of contacting me and tell me exactly what you think of me. If you disagree with me, don't like me or would like to kill me, there are better, more grown-up ways of letting me know besides smiting me every 24 hours.

I'll be waiting for your call/e-mail/PM but I'm not going to hold my breath, you coward.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 05, 2007, 01:41:22 PM
Posters : Smiters :: Chocolate : Poop

:)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 05, 2007, 02:11:57 PM
Lil Giant -

I'm pretty sure that I deducted a karma point from both you and Wally back on December 21st.  Some Wooster fans were talking about the officiating in their game against Cal Baptist and Wally interjected a comment that I thought was unfair.  When I retaliated, you backed him up, claiming that it was I who had made it personal.  I thought you were wrong, that Wally had been the one that fired the first shot.

I've just looked back at that string of posts, and given the same events I'd take the same action.

I'm certain that I haven't reduced your karma since then.

If you want to talk about this in private, I'm more than willing, just send me a message.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 05, 2007, 02:14:20 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 05, 2007, 01:39:49 PM
I posted something similar on the football board but I think it bears repeating here.

I have posted three times since December 23 (about In-N-Out Burger, the Trinity/Amherst game and about the brutal travel schedules). In that time since 12/23 my karma has taken a hit nearly every day, including one today.

Whoever is doing this please click on my profile. You'll find my email address. If you go to the website for that domain you'll find my office telephone number. In addition you could PM me.

Pick one of those ways of contacting me and tell me exactly what you think of me. If you disagree with me, don't like me or would like to kill me, there are better, more grown-up ways of letting me know besides smiting me every 24 hours.

I'll be waiting for your call/e-mail/PM but I'm not going to hold my breath, you coward.

I've been getting it also on virtually a daily basis for a couple of weeks now despite the fact that I haven't posted hardly anything in that time and certainly nothing particularly acerbic.  I'm no Sherlock Holmes, but I'd be surprised if this isn't related.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on January 05, 2007, 02:35:44 PM
As the self proclaimed karma fairy, here's two four the Wabash posters.

I'm fairly sure my current level of karma can handle the inevitable hits I'll get from those that despise you if they withstood the Dennis Prikkel onslaught when he found out that I was the one fighting him for Greg's good karma standing over on the CCIW board!

I sorta think it's important that if you smite someone, that they know why, or it be in direct response to a post they made at the very least. Personal vendettas are sorta childish.

...And now I must go smite the people on the MWC board that were making fun of Blues Clues.  :D

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 05, 2007, 03:35:07 PM
Hey, someone keeps knocking me down too. Argh! Ah, well. I blame Maine, though (I took a hit when I discussed Presque Isle...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 05, 2007, 03:50:06 PM
Sounds like an anti-Wabash conspiracy.

*looks around*

It's not me, I swear.   ;D

I'll smite on occasion, when I think it is warranted.  A poster in another room recently described a player as "garbage," and as I have very little tolerance for that, I smited.  I figure that's what it's there for. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 05, 2007, 03:58:48 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 05, 2007, 03:50:06 PMI'll smite on occasion, when I think it is warranted.  A poster in another room recently described a player as "garbage," and as I have very little tolerance for that, I smited.  I figure that's what it's there for. 

I agree with you, DC, there is certain stuff that is universally smite-worthy. I have a pretty liberal interpretation of the rest of it. If I say something that pisses someone off, (see e.g. WooBoo's post describing my 12/21 discussion of officiating) then by all means smite me. Doing it day after day is what is weak.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on January 05, 2007, 04:04:59 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 05, 2007, 03:35:07 PM
Hey, someone keeps knocking me down too. Argh! Ah, well. I blame Maine, though (I took a hit when I discussed Presque Isle...)
smed... I noticed how low your karma was today when I responded to something on the best attendance board and went ahead and karmaed you too... it seems most definitely like there's an anti-wabash kick...

Who wouldn't like a school full of female deprived guys? :D

I incidentally, thought the officiating stuff was HILARIOUS, incidentally. Seeing as how I live 2000 miles from Wheaton, I basically almost always go to games where I am a neutral bystander these days... while I will often disagree with calls I see, seeing crowds react in extreme fashion to calls which are clearly accurate is one of the biggest perks of my attendance games as a neutral fan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 05, 2007, 04:47:13 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 05, 2007, 02:14:20 PM
...despite the fact that I haven't posted hardly anything in that time and certainly nothing particularly acerbic. 
Or you delete your posts that might fall into that category.  I seem to recall seeing a certain 5 on 8 jab that is mysteriously no longer there. ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on January 05, 2007, 04:58:09 PM
45 to go.

forewarned!!!!!!!!!

;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 05, 2007, 05:20:15 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 05, 2007, 04:47:13 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 05, 2007, 02:14:20 PM
...despite the fact that I haven't posted hardly anything in that time and certainly nothing particularly acerbic. 
Or you delete your posts that might fall into that category.  I seem to recall seeing a certain 5 on 8 jab that is mysteriously no longer there. ::)

I didn't delete that post...I'm big enough to stand by what I post and if I ever post something I'm sorry about I'll have the stones to post an explanation or some other kind of retraction instead of simply deleting myself.  In this case, I got censored...it isn't that big of a deal. 

You'll also recall the enormous smiley at the end of said post that mysteriously disappeared, indicating that the tongue was firmly planted in the cheek on that one.  It's ok to laugh at ourselves once in a while, folks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 05, 2007, 06:01:05 PM
^^^^^

It's just hard to figure out when you're trying to be funny ha ha or simply arrogant most of the time, that's all.  Smiley or no smiley. 

Maybe that explains why your post got deleted even with the smiley.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 05, 2007, 08:03:24 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 05, 2007, 03:41:44 AM

Hmm, OK.

I voted for UW-Stevens Point.
Midwest: Ohio Northern, Amherst, UW-Stevens Point
Great Lakes: Ohio Northern, Amherst, Amherst
East: UW-Stevens Point, Ohio Northern, UW-Stevens Point
Mid-Atlantic: UW-Stevens Point, UW-Stevens Point, Amherst
Atlantic: Ohio Northern, Ohio Northern, Ohio Northern
Northeast: Amherst, Amherst, Amherst
South: Amherst, Amherst, Ohio Northern
West: UW-Stevens Point, UW-Stevens Point, UW-Stevens Point

I found this very interesting.  Thanks for putting it up, Pat.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 05, 2007, 08:10:41 PM
I just checked in here and saw all (probably not really all)  the Wabash guys talking about their karma going down on a daily basis.

After reading their posts, I found myself ROTFLMAO (laughing) when I saw that my karma had gone down again.  Being a Witt fan, I guess it must have something to do with fans of teams that start with 'W'.  I guess we will have to see if there are similar complaints from Wooster or maybe even ohioWesleyan  ;)

I find that a good laugh puts me in a good mood that lasts a while.

Thanks for cheering me up!

TF_1973  :) ;D :) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 05, 2007, 09:51:41 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 05, 2007, 06:01:05 PM
^^^^^

It's just hard to figure out when you're trying to be funny ha ha or simply arrogant most of the time, that's all.  Smiley or no smiley. 

Maybe that explains why your post got deleted even with the smiley.

It's not that hard, friend.  Look.  This is my serious face:




This is an array of my not-so-serious faces:

:) ;) :D ;D :P :-*

As long as you're not predisposed to read my posts with a certain bias, it's a pretty easy code to decipher. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 05, 2007, 09:55:07 PM
A power outage in Hiram has postponed tonight's Wabash/Hiram tilt until Sunday at 2 p.m.  I'll assume that all systems are go for the game in Meadville tomorrow afternoon. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 05, 2007, 10:33:08 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 05, 2007, 08:10:41 PM
I just checked in here and saw all (probably not really all)  the Wabash guys talking about their karma going down on a daily basis.

After reading their posts, I found myself ROTFLMAO (laughing) when I saw that my karma had gone down again.  Being a Witt fan, I guess it must have something to do with fans of teams that start with 'W'. 

Same here.  I've posted only a few times in the 3 weeks since being home for break, yet somehow I've lost 7 points.  Oh well.  I guess it's just better not to worry about such things. 

Here's to a good Witt game against Oberlin after the struggles at Kenyon, and hoping that the lights stay on at all NCAC institutions tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 05, 2007, 10:59:39 PM
the oberlin game will not be a concern for any witt fans at all-if witt loses i will never  post on here again-yes im sure some people hope that will happen. the witt alumni face off against the JV prior to the main event-that should be a better and more entertaining matchup.

yeah the karma thing has me puzzled as i seem to go down every day and no one will tell me why.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 06, 2007, 12:55:38 AM
Yea there will be some former wittenberg greats in appearance tomorrow. In case anyone was wondering about what vegas is thinking about tomorrows games.

Wittenberg Alumni +9.5 (-110) vs. Wittenberg JV -9.5 (-110)

Oberlin +21.5 (-105) vs. Wittenberg -21.5 (-115)

Personally I think Oberlin will cover 21.5 and I like the Wittenberg Jv to cover the spread
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 06, 2007, 01:24:50 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 05, 2007, 02:14:20 PM
I've been getting it also on virtually a daily basis for a couple of weeks now despite the fact that I haven't posted hardly anything in that time and certainly nothing particularly acerbic.  I'm no Sherlock Holmes, but I'd be surprised if this isn't related.

Including the particularly snarky post I pulled today? Hmm ... acerbic, definitely.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Henry Steele on January 06, 2007, 03:22:53 AM
Does anyone have any opinions about how far Wooster is ahead of the rest of the NCAC? Wittenberg still seems within striking distance, but the other eight teams seem light years away.

Ohio Wesleyan was supposed to be on rise, but then they lost in Meadville; the other seven teams seem to all be able to beat each other on any given day.

The league would be more interesting with more balance, and the team that eventually won the league would fare better in NCAAs, having been tested more during regular season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 06, 2007, 03:27:26 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 05, 2007, 09:51:41 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 05, 2007, 06:01:05 PM
^^^^^

It's just hard to figure out when you're trying to be funny ha ha or simply arrogant most of the time, that's all.  Smiley or no smiley. 

Maybe that explains why your post got deleted even with the smiley.

It's not that hard, friend.  Look.  This is my serious face:




This is an array of my not-so-serious faces:

:) ;) :D ;D :P :-*

As long as you're not predisposed to read my posts with a certain bias, it's a pretty easy code to decipher. 

No offense, Wally, but even with the smiley sometimes posts are not necessary. Why must you jab?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotLass on January 06, 2007, 08:01:34 AM
I put this on the NCAC football thread, but for my "Grant Pat a Wish" campaign, it fits nicely here too.... ;)

Maybe in 2007 posters could work on granting Pat one of his wishes for 2006...

From the Dec 21, 2005 Daily Dose:

"Responsible use of the karma function on the message board. I see someone who has a minus-182 karma who hasn't posted in over two months. Yet someone has apparently been smiting this person basically once a day since. Get a grip, people. Some grudges need to be let go"

At least karma isn't linked to your ability to post....shudder, shudder....
Then we'd be like some very naughty regimes who suppress those who don't think like they do......childish behavior turned dangerous

Come on! Grant Pat a wish....  ;D

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 06, 2007, 08:59:42 AM
Pat -

I'm too lazy to search for it now, but didn't I read somewhere that there is a limit to how many times a given individual can smite another individual?  At least maybe within a certain time frame?  (Not talking about the 18-hour rule here but something else that I thought I had read.)

If this doesn't exist, it might be a good rule to implement, if it's somehow possible within the software.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on January 06, 2007, 10:04:07 AM
Henry Steele.....IMO nobody is in Woo's class this year but in bball things can change in a hurry, an injury here, academic problem there, ego's, etc. So Woo is in charge right now and while I dont think it will change, it could.

Football has the same problem, a few strong teams and many weak teams. I definitely believe it hurts the NCAC in the NCAA's and the bids (other than the AQ) received. Not to mention preparation for tougher tournament opponents.

Lastly, What is karma? How do you get karma? How do you give karma? Does it have anything to do with a chameleon? With a Ghia?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 06, 2007, 10:26:38 AM
we could settle this whole karma issue by employing this method-anytime ur karma is reduced by an individual there must be an accompanying explanation haha.

BIG games today-i almost called off work to make the wittenberg-oberlin and wooster-denison double dip but decided that id make better time at work
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Henry Steele on January 06, 2007, 12:38:39 PM
Does anyone know how much money NCAC coaches make? I mean, does Steve Moore or Bill Brown make a lot more $$ than the guy at Hiram or Denison?

Are resources close to being equal in this league? I see some teams have four assistant coaches, others have one or two.

How can one team be so much better than the other teams? Do they have lesser academic requirements, or is their coach just so much smarter than everyone else?

Inquiring minds want to know..........
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 06, 2007, 12:46:02 PM
Quote from: roadtrip on January 06, 2007, 10:04:07 AM
I definitely believe it hurts the NCAC in the NCAA's and the bids (other than the AQ) received. Not to mention preparation for tougher tournament opponents.

I'd like to think I'm not trying to start an argument, but maybe I am introducing a debating point here.

Isn't the NCAC by definition not a powerhouse Div III (no, that's not an oxymoron) conference?

Wittenberg has "deemphasized" athletics at least twice during my time as a fan.  One time cost them a great football coach at the very time he was president of the American Football Coaches Association.  It may be the only time the president of the association was not an active coach.

I think it is a good thing that from time to time good athletes fail to get into a good school and that sports does not become the tail not wagging the dog.  I rather enjoy tuning in (I'm not sure you "tune in" on the Internet  :)) to the Witt radio network when most people in Ohio are watching Ohio State on ABC.

When I was a kid, Wittenberg had a guy who "forgot" to register for classes.  They were 9-0 that year and offered to forfeit all their games.  One school, who may now be in the NCAC, refused to accept the forfeit, figuring that one offensive tackle couldn't make that much difference in a game that ended 63-0.  I though that showed some class on the other team's part.

TF_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 06, 2007, 12:59:20 PM
Quote from: Henry Steele on January 06, 2007, 12:38:39 PM
Does anyone know how much money NCAC coaches make? I mean, does Steve Moore or Bill Brown make a lot more $$ than the guy at Hiram or Denison?

Are resources close to being equal in this league? I see some teams have four assistant coaches, others have one or two.

How can one team be so much better than the other teams? Do they have lesser academic requirements, or is their coach just so much smarter than everyone else?

Inquiring minds want to know..........

Apparently, we both posted at the same time without seeing each other's posts.

The James Cooper thing might indicate different standards between Witt and Wooster but I know next to nothing about that whole thing except for what was in the papers.

If you are looking for a commonality with Bill Brown and Steve Moore, it's Wittenberg.

Wittenberg has had a long line of great coaches.  In basketball alone, the line reads Ray Mears (left Witt for Tennessee), Eldon Miller (Western Michigan and Ohio State), Bobby Hamilton (Navy), Larry Hunter (Ohio U. and Western Carolina), and Bill Brown. 

Some teams do have more assistant coaches but I believe that you will find that some will be volunteers. 

I don't know what coaches make, but I know that being employed at Wittenberg is considered a very good job in Springfield, at least by us "townies."

I don't think that D3 coaches are in it for money.  I think that to be able to spend 20 or 30 years at one D3 school, as some of the older coaches have done, could be a very nice life.  But, it wouldn't be about big money.  The last I knew a fringe benefit of working at Witt was free tuition for your kids, which sounds like a pretty good deal to me.

Tf_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 06, 2007, 01:01:02 PM
Quote from: Henry Steele on January 06, 2007, 12:38:39 PM
Does anyone know how much money NCAC coaches make? I mean, does Steve Moore or Bill Brown make a lot more $$ than the guy at Hiram or Denison?

Are resources close to being equal in this league? I see some teams have four assistant coaches, others have one or two.

How can one team be so much better than the other teams? Do they have lesser academic requirements, or is their coach just so much smarter than everyone else?

Inquiring minds want to know..........

I don't understand why some people see successful college athletics programs and immediately suspect "lesser academic requirements."  Here's news: some smart kids can play hoops, too.  Both Kyle Witucky and Matt Schlingman finished at or very near the top of their classes academically at Wooster, and they were pretty good players too.  I'm sure every team in the league can tell a similar story, and every school in this league is highly selective.  Outside the NCAC, look at the success a school like Amherst has at basketball.  Even if they did relax their admissions standards to admit good basketball players (which I doubt), that'd just mean they had 1400 SATs instead of 1500s.  Look at the current men's top 25, which includes names like NYU, Johns Hopkins, Wheaton, Brandeis, and Washington U., and tell me about "lesser academic requirements."

I'm sure that Wooster and Wittenberg invest more resources in their basketball teams than the other schools do, just as Wabash spends on football, Kenyon on swimming, etc.  They have more and better-qualified assistants, better facilities, etc.  But it's not like Steve Moore is getting rich coaching hoops at Wooster.  I think the main reason that Wooster and Wittenberg dominate men's hoops year after year is that success breeds success.  They get to recruit the kids who are pretty good players but not quite good enough to get decent scholarships, kids who want to get a good education and don't want to sit on the end of the bench at some D2 or lower-echelon D1 school.  Plus there are invariably kids who played for winning high school programs, and they like to win.  If they go to Wooster or Wittenberg, they're going to win; if they go to Hiram, probably they won't win much.  They get the top quality (for small colleges) coaching and facilities, the chance to be a BMOC, and the opportunity to play in front of decent crowds instead of the 100 or so folks that probably show up for a typical Wednesday game at Oberlin or Kenyon.  It's got to be a pretty attractive package for the type of kid that plays D3 ball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 06, 2007, 01:07:55 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 06, 2007, 12:59:20 PM
The James Cooper thing might indicate different standards between Witt and Wooster but I know next to nothing about that whole thing except for what was in the papers.

I sincerely wish that this subject would go away and never come back.  It's unfair to James Cooper for us to speculate about his academic profile and personal decision without any hard facts to base it on, and then to blow it up into some indicia of how Wooster and Wittenberg compare to each other academically.  The fact that such speculation made it into the newspaper makes it that much worse in my opinion.  The plain fact is that Wooster and Wittenberg are very, very similar academically, and each school makes individual admissions decisions based on many factors.  Some students will apply to both and be admitted by only one.  It doesn't reflect on the student or the institutions when that happens.

I don't know what James' individual situation was (it has been reported in a number of different and inconsistent ways), but primarily I think it is none of our business why he decided to go to Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on January 06, 2007, 01:10:44 PM
While we are talking about Karma, or were rather, I honestly had posted 2 times on this website and my karma went down.  I don't think I posted anything controversial in the least.  I also do not understand why this happens.  I was not aware that posts could be pulled either.  Seems I have a lot to learn.

So Wooster takes on Denison today.  I guess they will have to do it without Vandervaart.  Sources have told me that there is a good chance he will not be playing this evening due to the injury he sustained in the Mose Hole tournament...  

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on January 06, 2007, 01:23:11 PM
David -
I completely and utterly agree with you.  We have no facts about Cooper's academic standings or grades.  This is completely unfair to him and I also find it ridiculous that it was mentioned in the paper.  And somehow the "class" issue keeps coming up here. 
I remember playing basketball when I was in college and how much time went into it.  When most other students have between the hours of 3-6 to work on their studies, these athletes are all in the gym: practicing, lifting, watching films.  Weekends are spent on a bus or at team meals and shoot arounds all day long.  It is no doubt a huge committment, but thank God for it because what else would we have to do if we didn't have d3hoops to post on ;)

I also agree that success breeds success.  Look at top div 1 basketball teams like Duke and UNC, even Ohio State.  These kids want to WIN, and what better way to do that than to go to a school that has a winning record every year.
That is the good thing about both Wittenberg and Wooster.  They have winning records and do well every year.  Every kid that is on these two teams was probably one of the best, if not the best player at their highschool.  All of them are good.  I also believe that a lot of athletes want to play, not just sit on the end of the bench of a good team.  That's what so great about div 3 is that guys who probably wouldn't play in division 1, get the chance to make a name for themselves.  Division 3 schools are typically much smaller schools and the competition is not as great.  If you are a great player but maybe not good enough to play division 1, one of the best schools in division 3 looks like a good option.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 06, 2007, 01:48:02 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 06, 2007, 01:01:02 PMI don't understand why some people see successful college athletics programs and immediately suspect "lesser academic requirements."  Here's news: some smart kids can play hoops, too.

I don't understand this either. It is pervasive in our society. I see it on every message board I post on at every level of sports and from just about everyone I know.

Quote from: David Collinge on January 06, 2007, 01:07:55 PMI sincerely wish that this subject would go away and never come back.  It's unfair to James Cooper for us to speculate about his academic profile and personal decision without any hard facts to base it on, and then to blow it up into some indicia of how Wooster and Wittenberg compare to each other academically.

I agree with you on this, too, DC. It's pretty bad to speculate like has so oft been the case. It was a perplexing episode to watch as an outsider to the Witt/Woo rivalry.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 06, 2007, 01:48:56 PM
To add to the "what makes a school succesfull" debate.

Facilites can have a big influence on a school's athletic success.  In the 1970's Hope was lagging way behind the rest of the MIAA.  In 1978 Hope built an on campus wellness building complete with 3 hoops courts, indoor track, weight training, and swimming pool.  Basically before that Hope had an old gym that literally collapsed one day.

Since then Hope has won the all-sport trophy nearly every year except for may a half dozen.   That one building drastically changed Hope's athletic fortunes.  When I look around the MIAA its clear he who has the best facilites usually wins.

I'd rank the MIAA

1. Hope
2. Albion
3. Calvin
4. Alma
5. Kzoo
6. Adrian
7. Olivet......WAY behind
...........have never been to Tri-State, and I should note 4-6 are very close and there's alittle gap between 3 and 4.  1,2,3 are pretty close as well.   Calvin will probably move to #1 when their new facility is completed in the next couple years.  This is pretty close to how the all-sports award ends up every year with the exception Calvin is #2.


Also I think any school that has an athletic culture, ie a stong physical education program and department can attract better athletes for sports.  Every Hope student takes a Freshman PE class and it has a great influence on the overall athletic culture of the school.  I was immediately struck by how many people use and how busy Hope's on campus facility is on a regular basis.

I think if you looked around D3 most of the most succesfull schools in a particular conference probably have the best faciilities overall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Henry Steele on January 06, 2007, 03:13:06 PM
OK, say there is a really good high school player in Ohio; both the kid's parents went to Denison (this is hypothetical, not a real case), but, all things equal, the kid would like to play at Denison.

He is a superior student and a basketball player; he just missed out on scholarship to Patriot League school.

Now, the family doesn't have much money........they'll have to dig deep to send the kid to college. My question is this: Do any of the NCAC schools give better financial aid packages than others, or are the rules so strict that all the packages would approximately be the same?

Or do the winning teams win because their adminsitrations are more flexible in the flexible aid they offer?

Just wondering why some teams always win more than others, whether there are advantages certain teams have.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 06, 2007, 03:36:18 PM
Quote from: Henry Steele on January 06, 2007, 03:13:06 PM
OK, say there is a really good high school player in Ohio; both the kid's parents went to Denison (this is hypothetical, not a real case), but, all things equal, the kid would like to play at Denison.

He is a superior student and a basketball player; he just missed out on scholarship to Patriot League school.

Now, the family doesn't have much money........they'll have to dig deep to send the kid to college. My question is this: Do any of the NCAC schools give better financial aid packages than others, or are the rules so strict that all the packages would approximately be the same?

Or do the winning teams win because their adminsitrations are more flexible in the flexible aid they offer?

Just wondering why some teams always win more than others, whether there are advantages certain teams have.

I don't know, Henry, if there's an appreciable difference in the aid packages that schools offer to athletes.  I wonder if any of us really know, or have anything better than anecdotal evidence to support what we might think.  We have a number of ex-players who post, although they might be unwilling to discuss their own experiences as regards admissions and aid, and we have at least one poster who works in the administration of one of the colleges; maybe they can offer some insight based on solid evidence.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 06, 2007, 03:48:11 PM
You're barking up the wrong tree, Henry.  I think the overriding theory on this issue in this community is that any school can be as good as they want to be at any sport they want to be.  As has been stated, some institutions place more emphasis on having a quality hoops program, some place an emphasis on having a great swimming program, some place emphasis on football, and others place an equal amount of indifference across the entire athletics program.  it's all about institutional support...some programs get it and some programs don't. 

Focusing on admissions requirements and scholarship packages etc, etc, is a waste of time when trying to figure out why one school is better at a sport than another.  It's the obligation of the athletics department to go find athletes that fit the college's demographic.  Those kids are out there.  Wooster finds them.  Witt finds them.  They don't have any unfair advantage over the rest of the schools in the conference, they're just better at identifying high quality players that fit  into their school than the rest of us are. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on January 06, 2007, 04:48:22 PM
Witt 71
Obe 41

Alleg 72
Wab 69

Cap 68
ONU 57
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 06, 2007, 05:49:30 PM
Quote from: Witt4ever on January 06, 2007, 04:48:22 PM
Alleg 72
Wab 69

sigh....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 06, 2007, 05:49:40 PM
Also,
OWU 53
Kenyon 47
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 06, 2007, 06:31:40 PM
As my good friend LG pointed out to me, it's probably no small coincidence that Wabash's loses their first ever game on the biannual eastern swing just days after I point out that they'd never lost on this trip before.  One of these days I'll learn my lesson.   :-\

Secondarily, Wabash used just 8 players in the game, with 7 of those players eating up 198 of the 200 minutes.  With Zimmer and Stephens both out, there wasn't much experience on the floor for Wabash today.  Freshmen Aaron Brock and Chase Haltom had 20 and 23 points, respectively, for the Little Giants. 

We'll see what Wabash has left in the tank for tomorrow's postponed game at Hiram. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 06, 2007, 06:43:14 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 06, 2007, 03:48:11 PM
Those kids are out there.  Wooster finds them.  Witt finds them.  They don't have any unfair advantage over the rest of the schools in the conference,

I don't follow Witt as closely as I once did, but they were very successful over the years at getting great players from small schools.  At the time I lived in Springfield, Ohiio had three levels of high school athletics, AAA, AA, and A.

It seems like Witt was always getting the 'A' player of the year or guys who were on the 'A' all-star team.  They were from small schools but knew how to play ball and listen to what the coach wanted them to do.

A lot of what is said in conversations like this is speculation because we don't have any players, coaches, or SIDs explaining it to us.  I would have to think, though, that Mount Union has decided to "specialize", as another poster put it, in football.  Witt used to be a D3 football power before the administration(s) had other thoughts.

I believe that the NCAC was started because the schools involved did not want to be athletic powers in D3.  Some schools left the OAC for that reason.  

TF_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 06, 2007, 06:45:21 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 06, 2007, 06:31:40 PM
We'll see what Wabash has left in the tank for tomorrow's postponed game at Hiram. 

Why was that game originally postponed?  Snow?

It's been like spring all winter down here, so it'a almost possible to forget that it still snows other places.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 06, 2007, 07:01:44 PM
The Wabash/Hiram game was postponed because of a power outage (http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=4218).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 06, 2007, 07:11:10 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 06, 2007, 06:45:21 PM
Why was that game originally postponed?  Snow?

It's been like spring all winter down here, so it'a almost possible to forget that it still snows other places.
Actually, I think Colorado is the only place it snows these days?! :P ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 06, 2007, 07:48:32 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 06, 2007, 07:11:10 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 06, 2007, 06:45:21 PM
Why was that game originally postponed?  Snow?

It's been like spring all winter down here, so it'a almost possible to forget that it still snows other places.
Actually, I think Colorado is the only place it snows these days?! :P ;)

It certainly doesn't snow in South Texas.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 06, 2007, 08:06:53 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 49  Denison 31

Tom Port came out tonight on fire as he scored 17 of Wooster's first 20 points to start the game!  :)

Needless to say, Port leads Wooster with 21 points and Marty Bidwell has chipped in 7 points.  Scots made 8 three pointers in the half and Port had 3 of them.

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 06, 2007, 08:58:15 PM
Final:  Wooster 96  Denison 67

Wooster coasted in the 2nd half tonight and won this game easily. :)  Tim Vandervaart did not play tonight due to a calf injury but there is a chance he will play in next Wednesday's game.

Wooster was led by Tom Port's double, double with 26 points (10 boards), Brandon Johnson with 14 points, James Cooper with 13 points, Marty Bidwell with 13 points and Devin Fulk with 11 points.

Denison was led by Danny Hodgkinson with 25 points and Shea McMahon with 13 points.

Wooster is now 11-2, 4-0 NCAC  :)  Next game at Allegheny on 1/10

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 06, 2007, 10:30:19 PM
All the NCAC 1/6 Final Scores:

Wittenberg 71  Oberlin 41
Ohio Wesleyan 53  Kenyon 47
Allegheny 72  Wabash 69
Hiram 67  Earlham 65
Wooster 96  Denison 67

Wooster is now 4-0
Wittenberg and Ohio Wesleyan are 3-1
Hiram is 2-1 with Wabash at home tomorrow
Allegheny and Earlham are 2-2
Wabash is 1-2 and at Hiram tomorrow
Kenyon and Oberlin are 1-3
Denison is 0-4
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 06, 2007, 11:27:12 PM
Not a very interesting game at Timken tonight, as for the most part Denison seemed totally uninspired and uninterested. It was hard to believe that this team took Witt to triple overtime a few weeks ago.

Another strong performance from Marty Bidwell.  He was 6 for 9 from the floor (with 2 of the misses from 3-pt range) and the usual hustle all over the court.  Bidwell picked up about 8 extra minutes tonight as he and frosh Dustin Geitgey took up the minutes usually filled by Vandervaart.  An interesting decision by Coach Moore to go small and use Geitgey instead of Elam or Melick.  I wonder if that's any kind of hint as to Moore's thoughts on the future prospects of the freshman big men?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 06, 2007, 11:59:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 05, 2007, 12:58:45 PM
Furthermore, they have probably the NCAC's best player on a non-contending team in Dan Hodgkinson, the current NCAC leading scorer at 19.0 ppg.  If the best defense the Scots can offer on Dan is Craig Elam or Robert Melick, Hodgkinson could go for 30+ and the game could easily come down to a question of whether the Scots can hit their jumpers. 

Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 06, 2007, 08:58:15 PM
Final:  Wooster 96  Denison 67

Wooster coasted in the 2nd half tonight and won this game easily. :)  Tim Vandervaart did not play tonight due to a calf injury but there is a chance he will play in next Wednesday's game.

Wooster was led by Tom Port's double, double with 26 points (10 boards), Brandon Johnson with 14 points, James Cooper with 13 points, Marty Bidwell with 13 points and Devin Fulk with 11 points.

Denison was led by Danny Hodgkinson with 25 points and Shea McMahon with 13 points.

Wooster is now 11-2, 4-0 NCAC  :)  Next game at Allegheny on 1/10

GO SCOTS!
Looks like Wooster still found a way to coast in this game despite Darth Vandervaart being injured.  And Port & Will's flu symptomns must've worn off by game time as well.

Quote from: cmhscots on January 06, 2007, 11:27:12 PM
An interesting decision by Coach Moore to go small and use Geitgey instead of Elam or Melick.  I wonder if that's any kind of hint as to Moore's thoughts on the future prospects of the freshman big men?
That raises a very interesting point cmh.  I am finding a very hard time understanding why we aren't seeing more minutes form the Wooster frosh bigs than we have been seeing.  I mean Darth doesn't see any action tonight, so the logical assumption would be to see more of Melick and Elam?? 

Ummm, no.  It's Dustin Geitgey who played a total of 14 minutes and didn't contribute anything on the offensive end.   I did hear on the radio how he made a nice block on Hodgkinson on the defensive end. ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 07, 2007, 12:10:44 AM
Will was clearly slowed down tonight.  He was beaten easily on the defensive end by Hodgkinson several times, and was largely ineffective tonight.  And of course Vandervaart was in street clothes, and visibly limping.  But Port was absolutely lightspout on both ends of the floor from the opening tap.  According to Coach Moore, he missed two days of practice, but there were no ill effects that I could see.

And I also agree with cmhscots that Denison played like they couldn't wait to get back on the bus.  They might not have won this game under any circumstances, but playing the way they played tonight they'll have trouble beating anyone.

An informed (and anonymous) source suggested to me tonight that Coach Moore decided to take advantage of Geitgey's good practices and insert him into the rotation, bumping Bidwell to the post in Vandervaart's absence.  In other words, not so much a negative statement about Elam/Melick/et al., but a positive reward for Dustin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 07, 2007, 10:17:59 AM
Notes from Timken Gym:

Denison is the least physical team that I've seen in probably all of my trips to Timken.  They applied no pressure at all on the perimeter, allowing whoever was running the Wooster offense to penetrate and score or dish almost at will.  It was one of the rare times that Wooster outmuscled an opponent, and topping this off was the fact that little was called on the Scots (except for poor Andy Van Horn who never gets a break) as far as bumping and reaching.  I thought they got away with a lot, but the Denision coaches basically accepted it, maybe considering the game result was predestined anyway.

Marty Bidwell continues to be more offense-minded.  He's become an exciting player on that end of the floor, with his slashing semi-controlled breaks to the hoop.  He finished well last night, a couple of times in near spectacular fashion.  And, he led the team in assists (6), deservedly, as he's always looking to find an open man while flying or spinning into the key. 

There are assists, and then there are assists.  Bidwell's are usually of the second type, where it's his penetration that allows the open man to, well, become open.  Then Marty finds him for the score.  Bidwell now trails only Brandon Johnson on the Scots in assists per minutes played.

I'd like to see a baseline to baseline race between the Wooster players, just to see who would win.  They've got some fast guys, to be sure.  My money would be on Bidwell (league 200 meter champion in high school, in the Dayton area), edging out Brandon Johnson, with maybe Tom Port placing.  Oh yeah.  Bidwell is also on the Dean's list.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on January 07, 2007, 11:18:26 AM
Wally
I think Wabash will be ready to play today if for no reason other than to get rid of the bad taste left from the loss......What I'm getting tired of is we're making every team we play look like 3pt sharpshooters. How about playing some perimeter defense?? Those 3's aren't so easy when somebody is in your face. Man, I hate losing...and I'm tired of saying we"re soooo young (which we are).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 07, 2007, 12:09:01 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 07, 2007, 10:17:59 AM
I'd like to see a baseline to baseline race between the Wooster players, just to see who would win.  They've got some fast guys, to be sure.  My money would be on Bidwell (league 200 meter champion in high school, in the Dayton area), edging out Brandon Johnson, with maybe Tom Port placing.  Oh yeah.  Bidwell is also on the Dean's list.

You may be right as to footspeed, but Bidwell's hands aren't as quick as Johnson's.  There was a stretch of about 5 minutes in the 2nd half last night where Johnson seemed to steal the ball on every Denison posession.  Looking at the play-by-play, he had 4 steals in 7 posessions.  There is another steal in that sequence credited to Andy Van Horn, but I think that one was caused by Johnson, too.  I'll admit that on some nights he might have been called for a foul or two in that stretch, but I agree with Woo Boo on the refs.  I think they were as anxious to get out of Timken as the Big Red were and let the Scots get away with a lot. 

Should be a better game in Meadville on Wednesday, but I'd be surprised if the Scots are pushed too hard.

Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 07, 2007, 12:34:38 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on January 07, 2007, 12:09:01 PMYou may be right as to footspeed, but Bidwell's hands aren't as quick as Johnson's.

No argument there.  They also use their hands differently, in my opinion.  Johnson is more of a traditionalist, poking and reaching for ball when he see's the opportunity.  Bidwell is a whirling dirvish, not just his hands but his arms almost constantly swinging, obviously believing that quantity of movement trumps quality, that eventually one of his arms will contact the ball.  Watching him play defense is kind of like watching some 1930s baseball pitcher, with one of those double windups, operating over and over again at fast forward. :)

Bidwell instigated one of the best sequences in last night's game.  Near half court, he dove in on a ball and pulled it away from one of the Denison guards.  A Keystone Cops scene ensued, with four or five guys rolling around on the floor.  And while the officials looked the other way and had a sandwich, Wooster came up with the ball. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 07, 2007, 12:55:35 PM
There were a couple of plays where Dustin Geitgey lunged at a Denison player, trying to steal a pass, and slammed into his man, and on neither was a foul called.  Like the other commentors, I felt like the refs were not too interested in slowing down the game, and it was Wooster that was the primary beneficiary.

What I thought was very interesting, though, was the complete absence of any sign of objection or frustration by Denison's players and coaches.  There were times where Dan Hodgkinson was being bounced around inside like a pinball, and then there was Eberst (or Sullivan or whoever it was) practically being tackled by Geitgey, and lots of other examples, and nary a peep from anyone in red.  I'm half-tempted to go to Granville Wednesday to see if they play in as disinterested a manner at home against an opponent they have a chance to beat (Oberlin).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 07, 2007, 01:14:13 PM
I'll join the group of posters that was a little surprized that Elam/Melick didn't get more quality playing time last night. Elam got to play with the starters about one minute before the Dension coaches threw in the towel and emptied the bench. Coach quickly responded with his freshman players and the last 3-4 minutes was a JV game. I understand rewarding a player who has practiced well but the Scots are losing their entire starting front line at the end of the season. In the past several years coach Moore has always gotten 1 to 2 freshman into the rotation so that he had a significant experience returning. I had assumed that once the NCAC schedule started he would do it again but maybe the up tempo style, requiring smaller quicker players, is here to stay.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 07, 2007, 04:11:12 PM
warning to billy pilgrim-i'll be invading richmond in 3 days lol.
good win by witt yesterday as expected
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 07, 2007, 05:23:20 PM
Just before the New Year someone posted a wish list that all the NCAC schools participated on this board. I don't think its any great surprise that its only 50% in the last month. I checked about the last 15 pages and came up with this list. Maybe other can edit my errors and omissions:

Wooster - Wooster Booster, cmhscots, goscots, ScotsFan, wooscotsfan, ScotLass, scotsbrod, seinfeld, chillydigits, Ryder16, woolax, Vanilla24COW, division3hoops

Wittenberg - witt4ever, Tigerfan_1973, pennstghs, jscwittfan, Willie Brown, drt

Earlham - billy_pligram, earlhamalum

Wabash - wally_wabash, smedindy

OWU - Li'l Giant

Last year we had a poster from Denison but I can't remember any from Kenyon, Alleghany, Hiram or Oberlin.

I'm sure I have missed a few and couldn't figure out the loyalties of some.  How about others listing additions. DC - you present such a balanced view I didn't put you in the Wooster list although I believe they are your rooting interest.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 07, 2007, 05:31:31 PM
Quote from: goscots on January 07, 2007, 05:23:20 PM
OWU - Li'l Giant

:D I don't think so. 

Quote from: goscots on January 07, 2007, 05:23:20 PM
Last year we had a poster from Denison [...]

Did we ever.  ;D  I figure I'm as close to a "poster from Denison" as anyone this year; I think I've seen the Big Red more times (men 4x, women once) than anyone in here, although I bet "Denison Fan" is still out there lurking.

Quote from: goscots on January 07, 2007, 05:23:20 PMDC - you present such a balanced view I didn't put you in the Wooster list although I believe they are your rooting interest.

I take that as a compliment; thank you, goscots.   8)  Although I have family connections to Denison, Hiram, Kenyon, and Wabash, I am an alumnus of the College of Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 07, 2007, 05:50:49 PM
Quote from: goscots on January 07, 2007, 05:23:20 PMOWU - Li'l Giant

Whuh?!  ???

Wabash College Little Giants......Li'l Giant....

Oh well, I guess that means I'm not rooting for my team hard enough.

Edit:

And it's hard when I read about losing to HIRAM (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/news/article.xsp?id=1153). Yep, that's right.

Wabash 80
Hiram 83

Is it football season yet?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 07, 2007, 06:13:03 PM
Oops - I'm really sorry.  That was a cut/paste error that I didn't proofread. I should have put bishopfan there (even he hasn't posted in a while).

At the very least I have given Wabash some bulletin board material.....  "Scot's fan disrespects the Little Giants......"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 07, 2007, 06:14:19 PM
Everything here is bulletin board material....  ::) ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 07, 2007, 07:36:43 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 06, 2007, 07:01:44 PM
The Wabash/Hiram game was postponed because of a power outage (http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=4218).

I never thought of that!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 07, 2007, 07:49:38 PM
QuoteWooster - Wooster Booster, cmhscots, goscots, ScotsFan, wooscotsfan, ScotLass, scotsbrod, seinfeld, chillydigits, Ryder16, woolax, Vanilla24COW, division3hoops

I realize that I am dead last in the NCAC Pick 'em and I was a SIG and not in KX but to be left off Wooster Scots regular poster list??  Where is the love?

With all the upsets, I am afraid to see the Pick 'em tally. 

SCOTS next challenge will be at OWU in a couple of weeks (although the travel to Meadeville stinks).  Let's stay healthy and keep getting the kids some PT.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 07, 2007, 09:36:13 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on January 07, 2007, 07:49:38 PM
I realize that I am dead last in the NCAC Pick 'em and I was a SIG and not in KX but to be left off Wooster Scots regular poster list?? 

Maybe your posting name is just too ambiguous, like Li'l Bishop's.   ;D

Quote from: WoosterFAN on January 07, 2007, 07:49:38 PMWhere is the love?

You must be a "new age" Sig.  In my day, the Sigs weren't looking for love, just raw meat and the occasional stolen exam.  The Krappers were looking for love, but it was mostly self-love.  ::) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 07, 2007, 10:28:40 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 07, 2007, 09:36:13 PMMaybe your posting name is just too ambiguous, like Li'l Bishop's.   ;D

Niiiiiiiiice.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 07, 2007, 11:35:19 PM
DC - What's your Wabash family interest.

And with today's result, oooof. Losing to Hiram and Oberlin, albiet on the road...one wonders what happens when the LGs make the trip to Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 07, 2007, 11:46:29 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 07, 2007, 11:35:19 PMLosing to Hiram and Oberlin, albiet on the road...one wonders what happens when the LGs make the trip to Wooster.

Pain.

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fespn-i.starwave.com%2Fmedia%2Fpg2%2F2001%2F1206%2Fphoto%2Fclubber_lang_i.jpg&hash=fed9d5b03fe72b550bf9160720a0fbbb3ad925dc)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 07, 2007, 11:58:10 PM
Without Zimmer, it's going to be tough. Hope he gets back soon.

I noticed every Wooster fan's favorite Terrier, Ian Pfouts, scored 19 against Wabash...yikes!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2007, 11:15:05 AM
Wabash lost to Oberlin and lost to Hiram...and beat Denison.  What's that say about Denison this year?  I guess we'll find out Wednesday, when the Yeomen travel to Granville for a showdown that I'm not going to be able to resist attending.  (Although Hiram at Kenyon is pretty tempting, too. ;))

Smeds, my first cousin (once removed) attended Wabash but was killed in WWII.  His father, my grandfather's brother, then had a chapel on the Wabash campus named (or renamed) in his honor (Collinge Chapel.)  Since I can't find any evidence of this on the web, maybe you can help me verify it.  The existence of Collinge Chapel was verified by my childhood next-door neighbor, Maurice Chadwick (for whom Chadwick Court is named).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Warren Thompson on January 08, 2007, 11:20:05 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 06, 2007, 07:48:32 PM
It certainly doesn't snow in South Texas.

Agreed. But when it does, it's certainly interesting. Folks in south Texas believe the best way to control a skid is to stand on the brakes.  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 08, 2007, 12:06:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 08, 2007, 11:15:05 AMSince I can't find any evidence of this on the web, maybe you can help me verify it.  The existence of Collinge Chapel was verified by my childhood next-door neighbor, Maurice Chadwick (for whom Chadwick Court is named).


SUH-WEET! Trip to the Archives!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 08, 2007, 12:20:16 PM
Quote from: Warren Thompson on January 08, 2007, 11:20:05 AM
Agreed. But when it does, it's certainly interesting. Folks in south Texas believe the best way to control a skid is to stand on the brakes.  :o
This is why, during my years living in the D-FW area after college I would stay as far away from the roads when the snow, and more frequent, ice stroms hit!  Being a northerner, my friends would all call me to take them places and I would just say NO WAY!  I may know how to drive in those conditions, but no one else down there does!!! :o 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Warren Thompson on January 08, 2007, 12:28:08 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 08, 2007, 12:20:16 PM
Quote from: Warren Thompson on January 08, 2007, 11:20:05 AM
Agreed. But when it does, it's certainly interesting. Folks in south Texas believe the best way to control a skid is to stand on the brakes.  :o
This is why, during my years living in the D-FW area after college I would stay as far away from the roads when the snow, and more frequent, ice stroms hit!  Being a northerner, my friends would all call me to take them places and I would just say NO WAY!  I may know how to drive in those conditions, but no one else down there does!!! :o 8)

I'm a native San Antonian (in permanent exile in Pennsylvania), and I can recall busses and cars windmilling down the streets after a one-inch blizzard ....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 08, 2007, 12:32:06 PM
I just checked out the NCAC standings and Hiram is tied for 2nd in the conference with Witt and OWU at 3-1!!! :o  The fight to make the conference tournament looks like it will come down between Wabash, Kenyon, Oberlin and Denison.  That picture could get get a little clearer with Oberlin taking on Denison and Kenyon this week.  We might get to see if Denison truly is the worst team in the conference or if they actually show some heart in their 2 home games this week. 

Wabash could very easily find themselves in the cellar after this week with games vs. OWU and @ Wooster.  This is taking into consideration that Denison ends their losing skid vs. either Oberlin or Allegheny, and judging by the reports of their uninspired play on Saturday, I'm banking on the losing streak to continue.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2007, 12:41:13 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 08, 2007, 12:20:16 PM
Quote from: Warren Thompson on January 08, 2007, 11:20:05 AM
Agreed. But when it does, it's certainly interesting. Folks in south Texas believe the best way to control a skid is to stand on the brakes.  :o
This is why, during my years living in the D-FW area after college I would stay as far away from the roads when the snow, and more frequent, ice stroms hit!  Being a northerner, my friends would all call me to take them places and I would just say NO WAY!  I may know how to drive in those conditions, but no one else down there does!!! :o 8)

You don't need to go to Dallas or San Antonio, where winter weather is rare, to find drivers who can't cope with it.  I lived in the mountains overlooking Denver, at 8300 ft., for a couple of years, and every time we had a decent snowfall (which was often, to say the least), the highway down the mountain to the southwest suburbs would be littered with SUVs that had slid off the road.  Part of the reason was that so many Coloradans were recent transplants from California, but mostly it was the overconfidence that comes from having a 4WD vehicle.  I can't tell you how many times I've been passed on that road by an SUV going at least twice my speed, only to find them in the ditch within a few miles.  These morons would figure that an Isuzu Trooper made them invulnerable to any driving hazards; nobody told them that four wheels can spin on ice as easily as two. 

Which reminds me of an old joke we used to tell back in those days.  A Texan, a Californian, and an Coloradan went out into the backcountry on a hunting trip.  That night, as they were sitting around the campfire, the Texan absent-mindedly picked up a can of Lone Star, tossed it into the air, and blasted it with his shotgun.  The Californian exclaimed "what'd you go and do that for?"  The Texan smiled and said, "oh, it's just an old habit with us Texans.  You see, we have so much Lone Star Beer down there, it's everywhere.  You can't get away from it.  So sometimes we just use it for target practice."  The Californian nodded and said, "I think I know what you mean.  For us, it's wine.  We have so much wine, we don't know what to do with it."  And he grabbed a bottle of Cabernet Sauvignon, tossed it into the night sky, and blasted it.  The Coloradan then grabbed his shotgun, said "I know just what you mean.  There's something we Coloradans also have far too much of," and shot the other two.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 08, 2007, 12:52:52 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 08, 2007, 12:20:16 PMI may know how to drive in those conditions, but no one else down there does!!! :o 8)

I'm an auto accident lawyer. No one down here knows how to drive in ANY conditions. And thank goodness for that. I got student loans to pay. ;)

Quote from: Warren Thompson on January 08, 2007, 12:28:08 PMI'm a native San Antonian (in permanent exile in Pennsylvania), and I can recall busses and cars windmilling down the streets after a one-inch blizzard ....

Also a native San Antonian here and I remember the "blizzard" of 1984 which featured all of 2 inches of snow and got me 3 days off from school. Good times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 08, 2007, 12:59:08 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 08, 2007, 12:41:13 PMThe Coloradan then grabbed his shotgun, said "I know just what you mean.  There's something we Coloradans also have far too much of," and shot the other two.  :D

This story could be adjusted, of course, if said Coloradan happened to be named Kowalski or Wojohowicz.

"I know just what you mean," he would still say. "There's something we Coloradans also have far too much of."  Then he would proceed to shoot himself in the head. :)   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 08, 2007, 01:33:45 PM
They probably had a memorial chapel for him. The chapel is officially the Pioneer Chapel, and each Homecoming they have the Hollett Alumni Chapel, but I do know they may have had memorial chapel services for people back in the day...

How many semesters did he attend? I can't find him in our database, which may mean he only completed one semester.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 08, 2007, 01:37:02 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 08, 2007, 12:59:08 PM
This story could be adjusted, of course, if said Coloradan happened to be named

This is necessary?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2007, 01:54:00 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 08, 2007, 01:33:45 PM
They probably had a memorial chapel for him. The chapel is officially the Pioneer Chapel, and each Homecoming they have the Hollett Alumni Chapel, but I do know they may have had memorial chapel services for people back in the day...

How many semesters did he attend? I can't find him in our database, which may mean he only completed one semester.

Beats me; I don't even know what his name would have been.  Or that I even had such a cousin (although another of my father's first cousins is now Mrs. Otto Graham. :))  But if it were just a chapel service, as opposed to something with more permanence, why would Shang Chadwick have remembered it so many years later? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 08, 2007, 02:10:16 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 08, 2007, 12:32:06 PM
Wabash could very easily find themselves in the cellar after this week with games vs. OWU and @ Wooster.  This is taking into consideration that Denison ends their losing skid vs. either Oberlin or Allegheny, and judging by the reports of their uninspired play on Saturday, I'm banking on the losing streak to continue.

Can't deny this.  But before we start shoveling dirt on Wabash's pine box, let's keep in mind that Wabash has yet to play an NCAC game at home.  Three close losses on the road with this young team isn't completely discouraging, esepcially given the injury trouble that plagued Wabash on last weekend's roadie. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 08, 2007, 02:31:17 PM
Shang was pretty involved, I think, so he may have remembered it. Plus, Collinge isn't a last name that is...normal...I suppose.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Warren Thompson on January 08, 2007, 04:44:57 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 08, 2007, 12:52:52 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 08, 2007, 12:20:16 PMI may know how to drive in those conditions, but no one else down there does!!! :o 8)

I'm an auto accident lawyer. No one down here knows how to drive in ANY conditions. And thank goodness for that. I got student loans to pay. ;)

Quote from: Warren Thompson on January 08, 2007, 12:28:08 PMI'm a native San Antonian (in permanent exile in Pennsylvania), and I can recall busses and cars windmilling down the streets after a one-inch blizzard ....

Also a native San Antonian here and I remember the "blizzard" of 1984 which featured all of 2 inches of snow and got me 3 days off from school. Good times.

Three days off from school? I can understand that: the first day was spent wondering what that white stuff was; the second for removing all the wrecked cars; and the third wondering where all the mysterious white stuff went.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 08, 2007, 04:52:58 PM
I have a brother in Columbus who refuses to drive when it snows there, its not as if middle Ohio is much better at dealing with snow.  In fact I was there over Christmas and they had a Winter Weather Advisory for 2 inches of snow in north central Ohio.  I had to laugh because such an event would be labled "flurries" up here.

I remember when Louisville got hit with 8 inches of snow and they couldn't cope, because they only have 2 snow plows for the whole city.

When I was in High School, one year we missed 9 straight Monday's of classes because of weekend snow storms in Michigan.  This was back in the days when no one worked on Sunday's........and we used to have Winter. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 08, 2007, 09:08:54 PM
DC and Smeds:

Check this out:

http://www.wabashfirstumc.org/history_page3.html (http://www.wabashfirstumc.org/history_page3.html)

It mentions the following:

Quote
In 1948, the former women's room was redecorated and furnished as a memorial chapel by the Fred Collinge family as a double tribute to Fred's father, John, who served as a minister in the Methodist church for 38 years, and to Fred's son, Captain Duane Collinge who died in World War II.

This is a chapel but in Wabash, Indiana, and not on campus at Wabash. And it doesn't mention where Captain Collinge went to college.

Also, this snippet from Otto Graham's website corroborates the Wabash, Indiana connection.

QuotePassing on the Lions, Otto married college sweetheart Beverly Collinge from Wabash, Indiana and signed instead with Paul Brown's newly formed Cleveland Browns of the All America Football Conference.

http://www.ottograham.net/bio.html (http://www.ottograham.net/bio.html)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2007, 09:25:37 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 08, 2007, 09:08:54 PM
DC and Smeds:

Check this out:

http://www.wabashfirstumc.org/history_page3.html (http://www.wabashfirstumc.org/history_page3.html)

It mentions the following:

Quote
In 1948, the former women's room was redecorated and furnished as a memorial chapel by the Fred Collinge family as a double tribute to Fred's father, John, who served as a minister in the Methodist church for 38 years, and to Fred's son, Captain Duane Collinge who died in World War II.

This is a chapel but in Wabash, Indiana, and not on campus at Wabash. And it doesn't mention where Captain Collinge went to college.

Also, this snippet from Otto Graham's website corroborates the Wabash, Indiana connection.

QuotePassing on the Lions, Otto married college sweetheart Beverly Collinge from Wabash, Indiana and signed instead with Paul Brown's newly formed Cleveland Browns of the All America Football Conference.

http://www.ottograham.net/bio.html (http://www.ottograham.net/bio.html)



Thanks!  :) ;D :) ;D :)
I promise never to refer to you as Li'l Bishop again.  :D

That's my (Great) Uncle Fred they're talking about; Beverly and Duane were his kids (he may have had others, for all I know; we're not a tight extended family.)

I'm still a little confused about how Shang Chadwick knew about this, if it had no connection with Wabash College.   ???  (Although it does sound kinda Wabash-like to convert a ladies' room into a chapel.  ;) :D)

I'll give you bonus karma (in 24 hours) if you can tell me how Uncle Fred came into all that dough.  :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 08, 2007, 09:50:23 PM
I can't tell you where your uncle got his dinero, but (at the risk of turning this into the Long Lost Collinge board) I found some other interesting stuff.

http://www.rootsweb.com/~inwabash/wwii-mem.html (http://www.rootsweb.com/~inwabash/wwii-mem.html)

QuoteF. DUANE COLLINGE Captain in the army air corps, was presumed dead by the war
department one year after he was reported missing while flying vital supplies
over the "hump" in northern Burma.  The transport plane of which he was co-pilot
crashed Sept 29, l943 between Assam, India and China.  Born in Beloit, Wis.,
Capt. Collinge was graduated from Wabash High School, studied at Indiana and
Purdue and enlisted on Thanksgiving day, l940.  He is survived by his widow, San
Antonio, Texas, a daughter, Patricia Louise, and his parents, Mr. and Mrs. Fred
Collinge, Wabash.

It appears he didn't attend Wabash. And his wife was from my neck of the woods?

I don't know how badly you want to solve this mystery, DC, but check THIS out:

http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/read/TXBEXAR/2006-02/1138951147 (http://archiver.rootsweb.com/th/read/TXBEXAR/2006-02/1138951147)

QuoteCaptain Frederick D. Collinge of Indiana was married to a Texas girl before his unfortunate death in World War II. They had a daughter, Patricia Louise Collinge, and her mother which we do not have the name. The daughter would be between 63 and 68 years old. Our goal is to find the daughter and wife if she is still living and present them with free photos of her father's name as it is engraved on the "Tablets of the Missing at Manila American Cemetery in the Philippines.
We welcome any information that would lead us to find the family of this Indiana hero.

Oh, and according to publicdata.com there is a Patricia LYNN Collinge who lives in Texas. If you want her info send me a PM.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 08, 2007, 10:30:13 PM
I hate to post off-topic on the Collinge family tree board, but apparently Tim Vandervaart is not recovering as quickly as hoped and will miss at least a few more games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2007, 11:40:19 PM
Yeah, I apologize for the ego-hijack.  :-[

Vandervaart has a contusion in his calf.  We saw him walk across the court at halftime the other night and he was limping pretty noticeably.  Then again, and no offense intended to our worthy conference brethren, he's probably not going to be needed for a couple of weeks, and it's best to make sure he heals fully before risking anything.  No point in rushing him back into the lineup.  Plus it give us some more chance to audition the frosh (Geitgey and Elam anyway, and maybe others.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2007, 12:31:04 AM
Perhaps caught looking ahead to their conference showdown at Denison on Wednesday, Oberlin tonight was nipped at home by Anderson, 73-72.  Anderson led by 11 at the half and by 12 (68-56) with 2:38 remaining, but Oberlin hit six of their last seven shots (including three treys) to tie the score with 0:25 left.  After draining most of the clock, Anderson's Nick Cochran drove the lane, where he was fouled by Oberlin's Matt Godwin with just 0:04 left.  After missing the first free throw, Cochran sank the game winner to push Anderson to 8-6 and drop the Yeomen to 2-11.

Anderson shot a blistering 57.8% for the game and had three scorers in double figures.  Oberlin was led by junior Jordan Beard's 22 points, mostly from beyond the arc where he hit 6 of 8 attempts.  As a team the Yeomen shot 42.6% from the field and outrebounded the Ravens 25-23.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 09, 2007, 12:38:43 AM
an interesting note of this past weekend-does the 2OT "weak" win by wittenberg at capital earlier in the year appear to be a better loss because of capital's upset AT ONU?/?/?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 09, 2007, 12:47:10 AM
DC - Don't you know that Maurice "Shang" Chadwick knows all, sees all, and tells all. That's why some people call him Maurice...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 09, 2007, 01:32:50 AM
At least we now know that the pompatus of love is a Wabash man.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Warren Thompson on January 09, 2007, 08:44:39 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 09, 2007, 01:32:50 AM
At least we now know that the pompatus of love is a Wabash man.

"Pompatus of love"? Impressive. Nice to see you up to speed on pop culture.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 09, 2007, 09:58:02 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 09, 2007, 01:32:50 AM
At least we now know that the pompatus of love is a Wabash man.

It's not fair to break out songs from your prom. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 09, 2007, 11:41:07 AM
i thought we were talking about basketball guys....................jk   

i thinkw e all learned some valuable lessons last night in which underdogs are viable and can come out at any time and prove everyone wrong. i guess if you give a team enough motivation and keep telling them that they dont deserve to be here, they will rise up. at least i dont have to hear obnoxious buckeyes all day
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 09, 2007, 11:55:50 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 09, 2007, 11:41:07 AM
at least i dont have to hear obnoxious buckeyes all day
Amen to that!!!  At least there's one thing PSU and Michigan fans have in common right? ;)  K+ to you!   We might not have to hear from obnoxious Buckeyes for a while after that abismal performance last night!!! 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 09, 2007, 12:13:00 PM
Ah, but now we get to hear from obnoxious SEC fans, though...

Hey, I predicted the score right...um...just the wrong team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 09, 2007, 12:59:12 PM
Ohhh, pick me, pick me....I want to play random board trivia, too, Alex...

On Wabash, Indiana: A former conference rival of my beloved Indiana high school alma mater and the first electrically lighted city in America. There was also a statue of Abraham Lincoln in the city, I have no idea why, but my history loving parents stopped the family van there each time we went through Wabash. Young Billy_Pilgrim also leads the world in combined trips to Lincoln's home in Springfield, Illinois and to the site of the Gettysburg Address. Also, there was a great little used book store in Wabash that we would similarly stop the van at on each trip through Wabash. Two of the great treasures I found there were programs from long forgotten sporting events. The first was a Cubs/Astros program from the innaugural year of the Astro Dome. There were multiple pages of pictures showing the newest wonder of the world and its short lived transparent ceiling that was to allow grass to grow (though no outfielders to catch fly balls).

Also, I found a Penn State/Maryland program from the late-70s....going back to those days where you Big Ten lovers said the Nittany Lions played that "weak Eastern schedule" (nevermind the fact that PSU was beating SEC teams back in those days, while the powerful Buckeyes are still looking for their first win over a team from said conference).

pennstghs....enjoy Richmond, it's beautiful at this time of the year...and look out for those crazy Earlham baseball players. A recently departed guest from Indianapolis, Earlhamalum's girlfriend, was telling us about a recent argument/fight that took place between members of the Quaker starting nine. They nearly came to blows trying to decide which was the "biggest Ohio State football fan".

Trivia question: According to witnesses, it was the first time in recent memory that Earlham baseball players:
A. Showed any fight
B. Actually seemed to care about a winning program
C. Actually communicated (has a hit-and-run ever not worked against EC?)
D. All of the above


NOW, the little basketball stuff I can add....

Jewett was injured just before leaving for the two-game road trip, which fully explains why he didn't start either game and probably partially explains why he shot so poorly in both games (especially the Hiram game).

Quakers need both Jewett and Henry (who had a really nice game in leading the Quakers back to the brink against Hiram) to be healthy to hang around in that 4/5 range and avoid the big three this year.

Hiram, who I'm sure everyone here would have voted least likely to get two wins, gets the big break and the edge in the standings over Wabash/EC should life come to that down the stretch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2007, 01:12:31 PM
From an ODAC Conversation on team nicknames:

Quote from: hasanova on January 09, 2007, 08:23:24 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 04, 2007, 05:03:07 PMJust off the top of my head I can think of 3 D3 Quakers: Earlham, Wilmington, and Guilford.
David, FYI, here's J. Smargon's (the author of the nickname website) response when I asked him if Earlham shouldn't be listed under Quakers: "I have Earlham College listed as the Hustlin' Quakers."  Evidently, Mr. Smargon is a doctoral student at the University of New Hampshire.  :)

...in case any of you (Billy) care to go over there and comment (you can click on "Quote from: hasanova" to get there directly.)  I seem to recall that they were the Fighting Quakers, but when that was retired to the Oxymoron Hall of Fame, I thought they just became Quakers.  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 09, 2007, 01:30:34 PM
From an ODAC Conversation on team nicknames:


Quote from: hasanova on Today at 08:23:24 am
Quote from: David Collinge on January 04, 2007, 05:03:07 pm
Just off the top of my head I can think of 3 D3 Quakers: Earlham, Wilmington, and Guilford.
David, FYI, here's J. Smargon's (the author of the nickname website) response when I asked him if Earlham shouldn't be listed under Quakers: "I have Earlham College listed as the Hustlin' Quakers."  Evidently, Mr. Smargon is a doctoral student at the University of New Hampshire. 


...in case any of you (Billy) care to go over there and comment (you can click on "Quote from: hasanova" to get there directly.)  I seem to recall that they were the Fighting Quakers, but when that was retired to the Oxymoron Hall of Fame, I thought they just became Quakers.

I've gone over there to set the record straigh, kind of. I have not heard any adjective placed before Quakers in my time following Earlham athletics by the Earlham College athletic department/sports information department. However, I have on some road trips seen "Hustlin'" placed before Quakers. I've never actually heard anyone official use "Fightin'" before, though I've often done it in jest.

During my short stint as an editor with the Earlham Word, campus newspaper, I always hoped for one of the most grievous offenses in the Earlham handbook: Fighting (which meant automatic expulsion). I really just wanted to order the large font headline: Fighting? Quakers?

No such luck.

I think this is the point where I share the great Earlham College soccer chant:

FIGHT, FIGHT, INNER LIGHT!
KILL, QUAKERS, KILL!
KNOCK 'EM DOWN, BEAT 'EM SENSELESS!
DO IT TIL WE REACH CONSENSUS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2007, 01:36:39 PM
From Wikipedia, the infallible source of all knowledge and wisdom (::)):

QuoteThe athletics teams are known as the Quakers. They originally had been the Fightin' Quakers; although the name was meant tongue-in-cheek, it was changed in the 1980s to the Hustlin' Quakers after the college's board of regents decided that it was inappropriate for Quakers to fight. In the 1990s, the name was changed again to simply Quakers.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earlham_College

So there we have it:  they're the Simply Quakers. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 09, 2007, 01:42:29 PM
Yea, I noticed that on Wikipedia....I checked there for my chant lyrics.

Of course, if my graduate degree from Northwestern taught me anything (no jokes please), it was don't trust Wikipedia.

By the way, Earlhamalum chimes in with, "the old field house had Hustlin' Quakers on the floor, so I know it changed right about the time I got there", which would have been 1999. Maybe Wikipedia is right on this one...I think I'm going to go in and edit and add myself as a notable alum.

I mean, surely proving my knowledge of Wabash, Indiana is more impressive than running the Boston Marathon in under three hours while juggling as EC alum Zach Warren did.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 09, 2007, 02:09:10 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 09, 2007, 11:41:07 AM
at least i dont have to hear obnoxious buckeyes all day

Ahhh, they are awful silent today, are they not?  It's been wonderful. 

Maybe that'll teach all the Suckeye fans at Wittenberg that this is what happens when you constantly turn your back on your own college team to root for that of another.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 09, 2007, 02:25:31 PM
What was wrong with Hustlin' Quakers?  Is it not ok for Quakers to hustle?   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 09, 2007, 03:09:43 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 09, 2007, 02:25:31 PM
What was wrong with Hustlin' Quakers?  Is it not ok for Quakers to hustle?   :D

how are we defining "hustle"? Like Pete Rose, or like Pete Rose?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 09, 2007, 03:30:31 PM
PJ Harvey said that "The whores hustles, and the hustlers whore." So perhaps it's not kosher for Earlham to be hustlin'...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 09, 2007, 03:48:45 PM
QuoteWhat was wrong with Hustlin' Quakers?  Is it not ok for Quakers to hustle?   


how are we defining "hustle"? Like Pete Rose, or like Pete Rose?

At 4-9 but having kept all of their point spreads to a minimum, Earlham's hustle probably would refer to the latter...assuming that's Rose's latter days as a player/manager.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 09, 2007, 03:50:35 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 09, 2007, 03:30:31 PMSo perhaps it's not kosher...

Please, Smeds, one religion at a time....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2007, 05:06:37 PM
This week's NCAC Men's Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) is Mike Staley of the surging Hiram Terriers.  Staley was honored following his double-double (16 points, 10 assists) performance against Fightin', Hustlin', Kaddishin', Simply Quakers of Earlham, and becomes the first freshman to be so honored this season.  Congratulations, Mike!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 09, 2007, 05:40:55 PM
i was hoping with that buckeye comment to get some karma points haha

this recent run of close games by witt and unexpected wins by hiram makes this saturday's "showdown" in hiram a little less of a laugher perhaps???? at least bill brown wont' have to search for motivation for his players now
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 09, 2007, 05:42:16 PM
also, billy shouldi  expect a hostile crowd or do the earlham students seem to not care about basketball that much any longer?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on January 09, 2007, 06:43:41 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 09, 2007, 03:50:35 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 09, 2007, 03:30:31 PMSo perhaps it's not kosher...
Please, Smeds, one religion at a time....
:D :D :D k+
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 09, 2007, 09:46:55 PM
Quotealso, billy shouldi  expect a hostile crowd or do the earlham students seem to not care about basketball that much any longer?

Unless your name is Bill Kristol, never expect hostility from an Earlham crowd. If your name is in fact Bill Kristol, expect lemon meringue.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 09, 2007, 10:28:15 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on January 09, 2007, 09:46:55 PM
Quotealso, billy shouldi  expect a hostile crowd or do the earlham students seem to not care about basketball that much any longer?

Unless your name is Bill Kristol, never expect hostility from an Earlham crowd. If your name is in fact Bill Kristol, expect lemon meringue.

Will the pep band play merengue?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 09, 2007, 11:14:29 PM
No Earlham is not a very rowdy place to play. Great facility, but not too much fan support. Wittenberg is coming off at a 19.5 point favorite. Personally I wouldnt make the trip.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 10, 2007, 12:39:11 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 09, 2007, 12:38:43 AM
an interesting note of this past weekend-does the 2OT "weak" win by wittenberg at capital earlier in the year appear to be a better loss because of capital's upset AT ONU?/?/?
I've thought about that a few times during this season.  Maybe Capital is better than they look, sometimes.  That's why comparative scores don't always mean much.  On any given day...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 10, 2007, 01:52:58 AM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on January 09, 2007, 01:30:34 PMI think this is the point where I share the great Earlham College soccer chant:

FIGHT, FIGHT, INNER LIGHT!
KILL, QUAKERS, KILL!
KNOCK 'EM DOWN, BEAT 'EM SENSELESS!
DO IT TIL WE REACH CONSENSUS!


Billy, that chant is priceless. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 10, 2007, 02:01:26 AM
Swarthmore football could've used that.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 10, 2007, 11:13:31 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 10, 2007, 02:01:26 AM
Swarthmore football could've used that.  :-\

Good call.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 10, 2007, 01:04:10 PM
overall analysis of the game at earlham tonight-if we can get the ball down low then witt should have an easy time against the "quakers."   with the graduation of brandon miller i dont think they have anyone that can physically match up with dane borchers or hemenway-i spelled it right- so this game should not be close.

now if i were a fair-weather fan i wouldn't make the roadtrip but i am a loyal fan and will be attending tongiht.

also, if you fellow NCAC fans think we have bad officiating, you would have laughed at the refs that entertained the crowd during my little brother's JV high school game last night. they were at a loss of words when trying to explain an and-1 basket they awarded after the defender took two steps and then shot.......WORST refs ever-except for all the ones that blow wooster's losses every time
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 10, 2007, 01:17:39 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 10, 2007, 01:04:10 PM


now if i were a fair-weather fan i wouldn't make the roadtrip but i am a loyal fan and will be attending tongiht.



Theres a difference between being a loyal fan and wasting your time and money. Witt vs a middle of the pack 4-9 earlham team is on the same excitement level as watching Witt practice.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2007, 01:31:25 PM
Wittenberg has had 51 straight non-losing seasons (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/records/tradition.html).  Ergo, all of their fans are fair-weather fans.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 10, 2007, 01:38:55 PM
well if you put it that way i guess wooster is as well.

i know this is WAY too early to ask but is there any "inside" info on how the tickets will be disbursed for the rematch feb 3

also, how can you be discouraging fan attendance at an event. if everyone were to take the "oh we are going to win approach" every time witt had a home game and was expected to win we would have no fans-o wait everyone already does stay at home because of this and other reasons minus the wooster and NCAA games
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 10, 2007, 02:07:26 PM
Hey, everyone needs to show up at Chadwick tonight, as the kiddie corps battles the Bishops!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Toph on January 10, 2007, 04:26:52 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 09, 2007, 11:55:50 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 09, 2007, 11:41:07 AM
at least i dont have to hear obnoxious buckeyes all day
Amen to that!!!  At least there's one thing PSU and Michigan fans have in common right? ;)  K+ to you!   We might not have to hear from obnoxious Buckeyes for a while after that abismal performance last night!!! 8)

ScotsFan-

Those who live in glass houses shouldn't visit the land of Troy...or something like that.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 10, 2007, 06:26:27 PM
Too bad there is no more of the 'land of Troy'!!! 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 10, 2007, 08:10:11 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 52  Allegheny 47

Big offensive show in the first half as both teams shot very well from the floor.

Wooster has made 6 three pointers and is being led in scoring by James Cooper with 16 points, Andy Van Horn with 10 points and Tom Port with 9 points.  Scots also have a slight edge on the boards.

Allegheny is being led by George Raftis with 11 points and Bill Babe with 10 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 10, 2007, 08:32:33 PM
OWU      74
Wabash 50  Final

Yuck. Four game losing streak for the LGs. Wabash was led in scoring by Zimmer with 16 points. Brock and Root each had 10. Chase Haltom had 3 points, on one bucket in the early part of the 2nd half.

Wabash has to do something, reach down deep, and find some way to play better or this season is going to be a complete loss. They need to refocus and make the goal to get into the NCAC tourney.

Unfortunately, next up for Wabash is Wooster.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 10, 2007, 09:13:34 PM
Final:  Wooster 97  Allegheny 87

Wooster extended the lead in the second half :)...and took control of the game even though Tom Port sat ~6 minutes with 4 fouls.  Wooster actually led by 16 points (78-62) before the Gators hit several three pointers to narrow the lead.

Scots were led by James Cooper with 25 points, Andy Van Horn with 18 points, Evan Will with 12 points (also 12 boards), Brandon Johnson with 15 points and Tom Port with 15 points.  Tim Vandervaart did not play tonight but there is a chance he could play in this Saturday's game

Allegheny was led by Bill Babe with 26 points (6 three pointers), George Raftis with 17 points and Jimmy Savage with 14 points.

Wooster is now 12-2, 5-0 NCAC  :)  Next up is Wabash at home on Saturday

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on January 10, 2007, 09:19:20 PM
Witt 71
Earlham 60



Borchers with 16pts, Heminway 16pts, Hill 14pts, Bowen 12pts

Earlham led by Jewett with 31pts,  Gregory with 14 pts

----------------------------

MUC 84
Cap 74

Adrian 79
Calvin 75

Otterbein 83
BW 74



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 10, 2007, 09:49:22 PM
All the 1/10 NCAC Final Scores:

Denison 75  Oberlin 48
Kenyon 86  Hiram 84 (Pups were 3 points away from a 4-1 start!  :o)
Ohio Wesleyan 74  Wabash 50
Wittenberg 71  Earlham 60
Wooster 97  Allegheny 87
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 10, 2007, 10:18:02 PM
This Wabash team has talent, but right now they have no confidence and it shows. They also need to block out and rebound, as the big guys for OWU had no trouble on the offensive glass. They also need to find more shots for Root and Haltom.

I think in a year or so this will be an excellent team but right now they need confidence, and with Wooster coming up that may be another body blow to this team. But Wabash ALWAYS Fights!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 10, 2007, 10:22:34 PM
From the interesting stat category.

Wabash had 12 turnovers. OWU had 12 steals. That's right, every Wabash turnover was a takeaway by the Bishops.

Hmmm...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Henry Steele on January 10, 2007, 10:57:35 PM
A look at Wooster-Allegheny play-by-play sheet (available on most school websites, except Ohio Wesleyan (subtle hint)) shows that Scots' lead was narrowed to six three times in final minute, so while Wooster's win was not seriously threatened, they did sweat a little bit, which is progress in this league.

Cooper's stat line is totally the difference in the game; he is the MVP of the league, other teams just don't have answer for him.

Yeah, Vandervaart didn't play, but neither did McCloskey, and Allegheny still put up 87, including 6-11 from arc from kid who appears to have been shooting around 30% from arc before game, so the Mighty Scots have defensive issues, which won't be a factor until they start playing the big boys in late February.

As for the bottom eight in this league, Pete Rozelle would be proud. Parity.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2007, 11:08:39 PM
Just back from the Tour de Central Ohio.  First, I now can join the chorus proclaiming the Kenyon Athletic Center the finest small college athletic facility in America.  At least, the finest I have seen, by many miles.  It is just simply awesome.  You'd expect a temple for the pool at Kenyon, but it's so much more than that.  Olympic-sized indoor track.  Weight rooms.  More squash and racquetball courts than I can count.  Practice gym.  Gift and snack shop.  Small lounge-like seating areas.  Four indoor tennis courts, with spectator seats.  A Wall of Fame, clearly visible from the gym, 100% devoted to ACADEMIC accomplishments of Kenyon athletes over the years.  :) And the competition gym is just gorgeous; like Hanover's but even more beautiful.  I can only guess what the locker rooms must be like.  Congratulations to Kenyon for this wonderful building.  If I could give you Karma, I would.  ;)

I fervently hope that Kenyon can produce at least one basketball team worthy of this facility, as I'd love for there to be a sectional in that gym so the rest of D3 nation can see it.  Alas, this won't happen anytime soon, at least not on the men's side.  The Lords gutted out a two-point victory over the scrappy (that's intended to be polite) Hiram Terriers, 86-84.  Kenyon, which recently had both Wittenberg and DePauw on the mat but couldn't put them away, had trouble finishing off Hiram, but some clutch free throw shooting at the end outlasted Hiram.  Kudos to the dozen or so Hiram fans who made the long journey to Gambier to root on the Pups, except that the group in front of me were about 25% "root on the Pups" and 75% "curse out the Stripes."  >:(  And the funny thing is, I felt like Hiram was getting away with bloody murder all night.  At one point in the second half, when the foul count was something like 12-5 in favor of Hiram (that is, more fouls on Kenyon), a frustrated Matt Croci yelled in the nearly silent gym "they push off on EVERY PLAY!!!"  And they did.  And they undercut Kenyon players on rebound after rebound and never got called for it.  >:( Anyway, enough about the refs.  It was a great game between two pretty evenly-matched teams that both hustled all game; what more can you ask for?  Two of Kenyon's regulars, Allen Bediako and Chris Willoughby, were in street clothes for the game.  (I'm not familiar enough with Hiram to know if any of their regulars were slowed or out, sorry.) 

The Lords actually have some pretty fair players among their freshmen and sophomore classes (particularly sophs Bryan Yelvington, David Jolson, and Korey Haddox, and frosh Dave Knapke) and they could be a fairly good team in a year or two.

And such a beautiful facility!  :)

Not such a beautiful facility down the road at Denison, but at least one with some old-fashioned charm and character.  I arrived with about 17:00 left in the game and Denison thrashing Oberlin, 37-20.  Oberlin got it to 10 a couple of times, but there was never any doubt who was going to win or who was the better team.  Yes, you read that right, Denison on the right end of no-doubter.  :) The final score was 75-48.  If Oberlin was running an organized offensive gameplan, I sure couldn't tell.  Denison outrebounded the much smaller Yeomen 40-23 and turned the ball over just 8 times; consequently Denison had fifteen more field goal attempts, and that was more than enough on a night where neither team shot especially well (Oberlin 38.6%, Denison 44.1%).  Dan Hodgkinson led all scorers with 27 (10/16 shooting) in 31 minutes.  Quinton Spencer again did not dress for the Yeomen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 11, 2007, 01:52:37 AM
back from the earlham-wittenberg game in richmond-first and foremost you were right in your assesment of the crowd as i almsot think that the wittenberg faithful had the earlham faithful or unfaithful mind you matched. earlham has a nice athletic complex i will say i was impressed by that. otherwise the game wasn't as beautiful.

good game by the wittenberg post players as expected and really wasn't an 11 point game. earlham made some late 3's to make it closer than it should have ended since wittenberg took a 44-42 lead and turned it into a 14-0 run.  in the first half wittenberg could not get any shots to fall and earlham was remaining competitive. IMPRESSED by Markous Jewett as he played unworldy scoring 31 points and making some tough fade away shots. wittenberg could match him in the low post but his fadeaway fallaway shots couldn't be defended

hope to see a big turnout next wednesday at ohio wesleyan-looking forward to a good game-yes i am looking past hiram fyi-you can berate me later if needed :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 11, 2007, 03:18:31 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 10, 2007, 10:18:02 PM
This Wabash team has talent, but right now they have no confidence and it shows. They also need to block out and rebound, as the big guys for OWU had no trouble on the offensive glass. They also need to find more shots for Root and Haltom.

Nobody wins a game when they get outboarded 50-26.  I'm with you Smeds...I think Wabash has some really good talent.  Maybe as good as we've seen at Wabash in about a decade...but there's no experience here and experience is paramount in the college game.

This season is going to have games like the one tonight...it just happens when you're playing a boatload of freshmen and sophs.  They'll get it soon enough.  I think the future is very bright for Wabash hoops. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hodgistheman on January 11, 2007, 09:35:43 AM
Good win for the Big Red. Hodg had 27 to lead the Big Red. He moves to second on the all time scoring list at Denison. Cements himself as one of the premeir players in not only the NCAC but D3 as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2007, 10:01:05 AM
Good for him, and that is quite an accomplishment. But I think he (and the rest of the Big Red) need to D-up. That's what is keeping him from being an 'elite' player. From what I've seen in the past that team is pillowy soft...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hodgistheman on January 11, 2007, 10:04:58 AM
Unfortuneately you might be right. The Big Red may have to get better defensively. I don't know the talk about who might be the POY, but I have to think Hodgkinson had to be in the mix.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 11, 2007, 10:36:18 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 10, 2007, 01:31:25 PM
Wittenberg has had 51 straight non-losing seasons (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/records/tradition.html).  Ergo, all of their fans are fair-weather fans.  :)
Hardee har.

Go Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 11, 2007, 10:58:15 AM
Welcome to the board hodg.  Some new Denison flavor to add to the mix. 

I would agree that Hodgkinson is definately in the mix for POY honors.  He's leading the league in scoring at 20.1 ppg.  That said, I think it's still Cooper's to lose.  Although, Tom Port has been coming on of late and looking at the NCAC stats page, one could make a solid argument that he should be the NCAC POY and one could make a solid argument forTim Vandervaart to be in the discussion as well. 

As for Port, he is among the leaders in every major statistical category except steals.  He's currently 3rd in the league in scoring at 17.1 ppg behind Hodgkinson and Cooper (Vandervaart is 8th).  He's 12th in the league in rebounding.  Vandervaart is 2nd and Hodgkinson is 17th.  Port checks in at 5th in the NCAC in fg%.  Vandervaart is 2nd, Hodgkinson is 3rd and Cooper is the only guard in the top 10 at 10th.  Port is also 7th in assists while Cooper is 9th.  Steals is the only category Port didn't make the top 10 in the league and Vandervaart is 6th in that category.  Port is 4th in 3 pt. fg% and 5th in treys made while Cooper is 3rd and 2nd in those categories respectively. 

If POY comes down to just the top scorer in the league, Hodgkinson is your man at this point.  But, if you're looking for overall game, I think it's a 3 horse race between Port, Vandervaart and the reigning NCAC POY, James Cooper.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 11, 2007, 11:08:41 AM
of course you would say it comes down to those 3 players-they are all on wooster. i could argue that borchers deserves it as he is the hardest player to matchup with and you gamplan around stopping him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 11, 2007, 11:42:43 AM
Wayyyyy too early to be talking about poy. We haven't even gotten halfway through the conference season. However, if Wooster wins the conference its Coop, if Wittenberg wins the conference then its Borchy. I'd say Hodgy wins it if Denison wins, but its Denison..........so I wont say that.
Go Tigres
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 11, 2007, 12:32:25 PM
Quote from: WillieBrown on January 11, 2007, 11:42:43 AM
Wayyyyy too early to be talking about poy. We haven't even gotten halfway through the conference season. However, if Wooster wins the conference its Coop, if Wittenberg wins the conference then its Borchy. I'd say Hodgy wins it if Denison wins, but its Denison..........so I wont say that.
Go Tigres
I'm just trying to make some conversation, that's all.  We are over 1/2 way through the regular season as a whole, so I don't really think it's too early at all.  I will agree that if Witt ends up winning the regular season, Borchers will have to have a ton of consideration go his way for POY.

Quote from: pennstghs on January 11, 2007, 11:08:41 AM
of course you would say it comes down to those 3 players-they are all on wooster.
Well, I wasn't just making my argument based on the fact that they are all from Wooster.  I was basing my argument on the statistics which are hard to refute.  I was also making a case for Tom Port because it seems that most of the POY talk gets thrown Cooper's way, and when looking at all of the statistics, Port's presense among the leaders almost every statistical category is hard to overlook.

Quote from: pennstghs on January 11, 2007, 11:08:41 AM
i could argue that borchers deserves it as he is the hardest player to matchup with and you gamplan around stopping him.
No one ever said you couldn't make an argument for Borchers.  However, it could also be argued that Cooper could be the hardest player to matchup with and gameplan against as well.  Borchers is hard to stop down low while Cooper is hard to stop around the perimeter. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 11, 2007, 01:46:02 PM
Sorry to break up the "which Wooster player rules the most" lovefest in here, but I stumbled across a pretty good article focused on D-I to D-III Birmingham Southern University.  It's brief, and is a pretty good read.  Enjoy:

http://tinyurl.com/ymtl92
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 11, 2007, 02:55:40 PM
Thanks for linking me to that article, Wally.  I'd give you a +K if I could.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 11, 2007, 03:07:00 PM
Wally -

Just to be upfront about it, you took another karma hit from me.  When the incessant snide remarks about Wooster, and their fans, stops, so will the negative karma.  It's gotten very old.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 11, 2007, 03:45:10 PM
Dammit...I forgot you can't take a joke.  At all. 

I'm resigned to the fact that my karma is going to take a hit whenever I post in this room (or even on a daily basis regardless of whehter or not I post anything).  The karma stat on this board is meaningless.  No accountability equals abuse of the system which in turn ruins any significance that the whole karma stat might have had.  It's a shame really. 

My advice is to thicken up the skin a little, WooBoo.  Loosen up, try not taking yourself so seriously, and try to have a little fun here.  This isn't Utah...it's Posting Up.  It's ok to joke around and laugh a little. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2007, 03:47:50 PM
WooBoo - that was a joke, plain and simple. I thought it was a clever way to change up the discussion.

Thou needest a chill pill, declarest the Smed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on January 11, 2007, 04:01:30 PM
I just don't understand why it is always Wooster that the jokes are aimed at.  I don't ever hear jokes about Witt or OWU fans or anyone else from the conference.
Wally that was funny - I'll give you that.  But  maybe if you got off the "make fun of Wooster" train and changed up your style once...people wouldn't think you were so set out to smite Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 11, 2007, 04:16:55 PM
Wooster basketball, for better or worse, is the topic of conversation 99.4% of the time here.  If there was anything else topical when I post, there might be a changeup in the subjects of my satire.  I think I stumbled onto an irreverant and brief thread about Earlham earlier this week and made a Quaker joke...so it does happen occasionally when the current topic allows for it. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 11, 2007, 04:20:23 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on January 11, 2007, 02:55:40 PM
Thanks for linking me to that article, Wally.  I'd give you a +K if I could.

I, too, enjoyed the article, and I CAN and WILL give Wally the +k!

I wish Eastern Michigan would follow that route!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on January 11, 2007, 04:24:02 PM
Wally & smeds...I for one think that we have too many Wabash guys trying to fill the bucket up and not enough  trying to play D....Since the team is so young and the season isn"t looking very good I would concentrate on the D side of the ball for the rest of the season....good teams win with defense so lets start setting the table for the future.....guards, forwards, centers, the clean up guys, everybody start playing D or start pickin D splinters out of your butt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2007, 04:32:40 PM
Wooster hoop fans on this board are a target just like Wabash football fans over at that board. They're here - they're loud and they TAKE! IT! PERSONALLY! just like Benson and Stabler on SVU...

And since the needle will no doubt get a reaction - the needle is drawn against them.

Then there's me - I try to be an equal opportunity idiot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2007, 04:33:05 PM
Defense and rebounding, with a side of ballhandling, is what this Little Giant team needs right now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 11, 2007, 04:41:42 PM
Wally -

Your so-called jokes always have a bit too much bite to them, especially when they're directed at Wooster, which is almost all of the time.  Somehow, they just don't come across that funny to me.

You're correct in that a high percentage of the time the topic in here involves Wooster.  So, change it!  Write something about Wabash, or any other school.  Nobody's stopping you.

Wabash has been struggling with a young team this year.  Have you ever heard me pick on them, or the school, or the coach, or anything Wabash, except for that time a couple of weeks ago when I was retaliating to a comment of yours?  I have nothing, nothing at all against Wabash.  I don't want to have anything against any of that school's posters.  

But you especially seem to feel the necessity to direct a steady stream of sarcasm at either Wooster or its posters.  In my opinion, it's you that needs to lighten up, not me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2007, 04:51:01 PM
If the knock on a Hodgkinson candidacy for NCAC POtY is that he's soft on defense, then I don't think that Tom Port is the answer.  :) 

My main problem with Hodgkinson is that he, like all of his teammates, doesn't always hustle.  I'm not sure I can blame them too much; I wouldn't want to be in the situation they are in down there.  Also, although Dan has some good moves for a 6'6" post man, Vandervaart's are better, and neither is a great rebounder.  Borchers is not as good a scorer as these two, but he's a much better rebounder and a much better post defender, so at least for "big man of the year" I'd lean Dane's way right now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 11, 2007, 05:49:15 PM
wally-people try to change the scenery of this board by bringing up topics other than wooster-related-how much did we run up the score on denison-posts.
i continuously bring up wittenberg games and topics and many just disregard them and throw them out to the ship to dry.

as for POY i will give the edge to cooper at this point. port and vandervaart are too weak on defense to be considered at all. i think it is between borchers and cooper at this point. after seeing markus jewett last night though i would consider him a first team candidate at the very least though. thoughts?

billy? did u notice i did compliment earlham's facilities? haha. if only they had some teams or banners to go along with the singular 2 banners in the gym for cross country championships
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 11, 2007, 06:41:21 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 11, 2007, 03:45:10 PM
I'm resigned to the fact that my karma is going to take a hit whenever I post in this room (or even on a daily basis regardless of whehter or not I post anything).  The karma stat on this board is meaningless.  No accountability equals abuse of the system which in turn ruins any significance that the whole karma stat might have had.  It's a shame really. 

I agree completely with you, Wally.  If I had the power, I'd try to bring you back up.  But, then again, we're probably both going to go down further now.  Oh well.  :-\

Quote from: ScotsFan on January 11, 2007, 12:32:25 PM
Well, I wasn't just making my argument based on the fact that they are all from Wooster.  I was basing my argument on the statistics which are hard to refute.  I was also making a case for Tom Port because it seems that most of the POY talk gets thrown Cooper's way, and when looking at all of the statistics, Port's presense among the leaders almost every statistical category is hard to overlook.

Here's something to add to the whole POY topic: does the number of strong candidates on Wooster's team actually HURT their chances?  I'm not sure of how the voting works, but if you have a contingent of voters who think Borchers is the best player, and a contingent of voters who can't differentiate between the 3 Wooster guys, and all of those votes get split, doesn't that favor Dane all the way?

I'm not saying that any of the Wooster guys don't deserve strong consideration for POY, because as much as I like to root against Wooster, I can still recognize a talented player when I see him, but I would think the number of options if the players stay all about the same level would deter voters from even voting for a Wooster player, because if the top 3 are so even, how do you say that one is that much better than the other to make him POY?  The only similar situation I can think of was 2 (?) years ago in baseball, where both David Ortiz and Manny Ramirez collected votes for their stellar seasons for Boston, and in the end, Ortiz ended up losing by a small margin to A-Rod.

It would make sense for all three of the Wooster guys to make first/second-team all conference, but I myself would have a hard time giving one of them the POY if they all stay on the same level and Dane continues to, 90% of the time, carry Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 11, 2007, 06:52:40 PM
Wooster fans who have watched most of the Scots game would not agree with the observation that Vandervaart is soft on defense. You are basing you opinion on the Witt/Wooster game where he was saddled with fouls early (unfairly in most Scots fans opinion) and had be careful in the second half to stay in the game. In a typical game it is very easy to see how active he is on defense, creating steals and blocking shots

I don't think its too early to talk about POY and there have been stretches in this season when each of the top three scorers at Wooster have looked the part. Last night Cooper scored 25 on 10-16 shooting. On Wednesday Port scored 17 of Woosters first 20 points and finished with 28. Vandervaart has had several double-doubles this season, most recently in his last game against Calvin.

Besides the Scots, Borchers and Hodgkinson I think you have also think about Ben Chojnacki from OWU, but outside of those 6 players I don't think anyone enters the conversation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 11, 2007, 06:55:39 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 11, 2007, 04:51:01 PM
If the knock on a Hodgkinson candidacy for NCAC POtY is that he's soft on defense, then I don't think that Tom Port is the answer.  :) 
You're right about Port's weakness on defense.  Hense, it's not a coincidence that the only category he's not in the top of the NCAC statistically is steals.  Furthermore, it is possible to slow him down offensively by putting a big man that can stay with him on him defensively.  Wittenberg did a pretty good job on him defensively as did Ohio Northern.  Cooper, on the other hand is very difficult to stop, no matter how much you gameplan to stop him.  A team might have success for a while and then the next thing you know he's dropped in 10-15 just like that.  

Quote from: pennstghs on January 11, 2007, 05:49:15 PM
after seeing markus jewett last night though i would consider him a first team candidate at the very least though. thoughts?
I agree about your thoughts on Jewett.  He played very well in Earlham's visit to Timken.  The problem for Earlham is that they don't have much around him and I think he feels the need to do it all at times.  He seemed to run out of gas in the 2nd half as a result of this.  That's not meant as a knock btw.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 11, 2007, 06:59:43 PM
POY is an interesting topic.  My quick takes on the names that have been dropped so far:

Hodgkinson - He's got nice numbers, but I think the reality of the situation is that any player from a team in the league's cellar isn't getting POY unless his stats completely blow everybody else in the league out of water.  Hodgkinson's stats don't fit that description.  Plus you have to consider how many of Hodgkinson's numbers are coming in garbage time against the end of the other team's bench.  Honestly, I don't know the answer, but that is a perfectly legit reason to see inflated stats from a guy who's team doesn't win very often.  If I had a POY vote, it's something I'd probably at least take a cursory glance at.  When Hodgkinson gets his stats is important when evaluating his candidacy.  This is no way a slight to Hodgkinson...he's a fine player, but I don't see POY here. 

Cooportvaart - The Wooster triumerate here are all pretty legit contenders and the concern that they might be stealing votes from one another is also legit.  I think Vandervaart missing time with injury makes him a fairly easy elimination for voters who can't decide which Scot to pick.  Cooper and Port are probably a toss up, but Cooper probably has an edge by virtue of his being the reigning POY (unless Cooper got votes from people who didn't vote for Port last year because of his injury).  I think the choice boils down to which of these two really carry the team against Witt. 

Dane Borchers - The guy is completely carrying Witt right now, has POY numbers, but if he can't get over the Wooster hump I don't think he'll have enough votes to steal it from either of the Scot frontrunners.  Heck of a player for sure, but those guys up in Wooster are every bit as good and have scoreboard on Dane this year. 

Really, with only a few conference games having been played, it might be a little early to make even an educated guess at this.  It'll clear up a lot after a few weeks. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2007, 07:22:18 PM
I could be wrong, and am far too lazy (and not interested enough) to scoll back and research, but I think we had a similar conversation last year about how Port and Cooper might split the "Wooster vote" and hand the crown to the dominant (and deserving) Dan Russ, but it didn't happen.  It could be different this year (after all Russ had Borchers, and Borchers has, well, Hemenway), but I'm not sure that the possibility of vote-splitting is as big a factor as it might seem.

I realize that I sometimes must sound like I have a man-crush on Hodgkinson :D, but I don't think he benefits much from garbage time.  As has been well-documented over the past couple of years ::), Bob Ghiloni likes to use his bench.  Those who were at Wooster on Saturday saw Ghiloni empty his bench before Steve Moore did (actually, at the same timeout, but Moore seemed to be responding to Ghiloni's bench-clearing), and it's something I've seen in other DU games this year (including last night's blowout win, so it cuts both ways.)  I think the better explanation for his statistical dominance is the Borchers one, only more so:  he's just far and away the best player on the team.  There's just not many guys on the Big Red who can score, so when Dan is on the floor, they try to get him the ball whenever they can.  Opponents know that, and he's double and triple teamed, but he usually gets his points, a lot of them on putbacks.  I don't think he's POY for a number of reasons, not least of which is Wally's "cellar-dweller" reason, but I think he deserves 1st team all-conference based on his play to date.

I wouldn't say that Tim Vandervaart is "soft" on defense, but I wouldn't put him in the same class as Dane Borchers or any of the Wooster centers from the past 10 years or so.  In fact, when the opponent has two decent big men, it seems to me Tim usually gets assigned to the lesser of the two, with Tom Port taking on the stronger threat.  They're both adequate on defense, and they're both so stellar on the other end of the floor that I'm happy to take adequate defense. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2007, 07:30:39 PM
Perhaps Ghiloni uses his bench because he realizes that it's D-3 and the kids want to play, even for a few minutes at a time. Mac Petty has always used his bench liberally, and I wouldn't argue with his results.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2007, 07:35:12 PM
I do think that some love needs to be given to Chojnacki and Rudegeair (or however you spell his darn name) at OWU. They stats aren't eye popping, but I think that's due to the system OWU plays. They have a fine, fine team that I think could contend for second if another scorer steps up for them against the big boys.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2007, 07:38:11 PM
I'm sure you're right.  Personally, I haven't mentioned them as OWU is one of the three NCAC teams I haven't yet seen this season (Wabash and Allegheny being the others.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2007, 07:46:58 PM
It's a typical OWU team...they like to pop it from 3 and crash the boards.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 11, 2007, 08:20:41 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on January 11, 2007, 06:41:21 PM
Here's something to add to the whole POY topic: does the number of strong candidates on Wooster's team actually HURT their chances?  I'm not sure of how the voting works, but if you have a contingent of voters who think Borchers is the best player, and a contingent of voters who can't differentiate between the 3 Wooster guys, and all of those votes get split, doesn't that favor Dane all the way?
I think you might be on to something there jsc.  This topic comes up a lot in any type of MVP or Heisman talk.  What if there happens to be more than one MVP or Heisman candidate on one specific team.  Does it hurt those players' chances because they end up splitting up votes?  That may have been why Cooper ended up with the POY last year because Russ and Borchers split some of their votes, but you could probably argue that Port and Cooper could have caused  the same type of split.  Although, Port's missed time due to his injury may have swung enough of his votes over to Cooper.

To add to that point, if Borchers ends up winning it would probably be because of that type of scenario... ;)  Just kidding there.  If Borchers were to win POY, it wouldn't be like he didn't deserve it.  As you said jscwittfan, at least 90% of the time he is carrying that team to another hard faught win.  Whenever Witt needs a basket, more times than not, Dane has the answer.  I think it's going to come down to who actually wins the NCAC.  As was said earlier, Borchers wins IMO if Witt wins the regular season title.  Cooper wins if Wooster wins.  And as goscots said, let's not forget about OWU and Chojnacki.  He is quietly putting togeter a very impressive campaign including shooting nearly 57% :o from downtown!  And that's having made 27 treys which is the same number that Port has made so far this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 11, 2007, 08:38:38 PM
My only comment on the POY conversation is that I agree that a cellar-dweller POY better have seriously crazy numbers. I think any of the Scots or Borchers would be appropriate at this point. But who knows what the rest of the season holds.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on January 11, 2007, 08:52:30 PM
pennstghs -
Wow.  If you think POY should not go to Port or Vandervaart because you think they are too weak on defense, there is NO WAY you could give that to Cooper.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on January 11, 2007, 09:04:15 PM
I will give it to Cooper that he is most of the time unstoppable by other teams.  But he does not play defense.  I have never seen him dive on the floor for a ball, get an awesome steal, or seriously contest a shot.  I'd imagine he's not usually placed on a highly offensive opponent.  I'm all believing that Coop is one of the best offensive players I have seen but he's seriously lacking on the defensive end.  Is that something that POY could look over - due to his accomplishments on offense?  I mean, obviously they did last year, but IMO POY should go to someone who is unstoppable offensively AND stops opponents defensively.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 11, 2007, 09:43:55 PM
i would agree with coopers undefensive skills, i was trying to throw him a bone haha. its too early to tell with many games, both big and smaller, to play so we have to let the season play out and see how each big player is measured in view of his team's performance
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 11, 2007, 10:00:37 PM
I'm just thinking out loud here...I think it's unanimous that Wooster is more skilled offensively than pretty much anybody else that they play.  In the games that they have lost, at least one of Wooster's main offensive threats have been in some kind of foul trouble (please correct me if I'm wrong).  It would seem to me that if I had such an enormous advantage with my offense, I wouldn't necessarily coach my scorers to get overly aggressive on D.  If Wooster is to essentially trade jumpshots with another team, Wooster is going to win more often than not.  If those scorers collect a bunch of fouls playing aggressive D and have to sit significant minutes, Wooster loses that advantage and become a lot more vulnerable.  Maybe this alleged "softness" on D by some of these Wooster players is a calculated decision made with the thought of keeping those guys on the floor. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 11, 2007, 10:03:11 PM
My POY thoughts:

James Cooper's defense has actually improved significently this year.  That brings him up to about an average level. :)  He moves his feet much better and doesn't get beaten to the basket too much.  He's really made the effort to improve it, and deserves credit.  Still, I've yet to see him hit the floor for a loose ball.  A couple of games ago, some fan behind me yelled out "Coop's on the floor!"  Others (including me) quickly set him straight, pointing out that he'd been knocked down. :D

Last year, when Earlham came to Wooster, Marcus Jewett was a complete non-factor.  This year was completely different.  Not that I think he should be POY, but I was very impressed with his play.  He moved well, got himself open despite being the major scoring threat, and is one heck of a shooter.  There's no doubt that he'd start for Wooster.

There are some excellent players in this league, but at least at this point I don't see any of the contenders having much of an edge.  I thought it was more clear cut last year, in favor of Dan Russ, who didn't get it, so what do I know.  If Vandervaart misses another 2-3 games, or more, that might put him out of the running, as it did to Port last year.

How about who's the most underrated player in the league?  I'd say Marty Bidwell.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 11, 2007, 10:11:50 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 11, 2007, 10:00:37 PM
I'm just thinking out loud here...I think it's unanimous that Wooster is more skilled offensively than pretty much anybody else that they play.  In the games that they have lost, at least one of Wooster's main offensive threats have been in some kind of foul trouble (please correct me if I'm wrong).  It would seem to me that if I had such an enormous advantage with my offense, I wouldn't necessarily coach my scorers to get overly aggressive on D.  If Wooster is to essentially trade jumpshots with another team, Wooster is going to win more often than not.  If those scorers collect a bunch of fouls playing aggressive D and have to sit significant minutes, Wooster loses that advantage and become a lot more vulnerable.  Maybe this alleged "softness" on D by some of these Wooster players is a calculated decision made with the thought of keeping those guys on the floor. 

I honestly never thought of that. Good point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 11, 2007, 10:30:51 PM
Did anybody else notice that the new assistant coach for Alleghany is Matt Drahos, All-American from Bethany. Thats a nice addition to the program.

I think the Gators were very competitive last night. With 8 minutes to go in the game and down 16 they didn't give up. They pushed up the floor on offense and went 7-14 from beyond the arc to shrink the lead down to 6 points a couple of times. They have a freshman, George Raftis who played very well. With McCloskey out of the game the only senior playing was Savage. That should give the Gator faithful much to look forward to.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 12, 2007, 12:03:57 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 11, 2007, 04:16:55 PM
Wooster basketball, for better or worse, is the topic of conversation 99.4% of the time here.  If there was anything else topical when I post, there might be a changeup in the subjects of my satire.

Seeing as you come from a school that dominates the football board, it never ceases to amaze me how much you want to belittle the hoops board when it does the same thing -- just for another school.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 12, 2007, 01:13:16 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 12, 2007, 12:03:57 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 11, 2007, 04:16:55 PM
Wooster basketball, for better or worse, is the topic of conversation 99.4% of the time here.  If there was anything else topical when I post, there might be a changeup in the subjects of my satire.

Seeing as you come from a school that dominates the football board, it never ceases to amaze me how much you want to belittle the hoops board when it does the same thing -- just for another school.

I wasn't complaining about this.  Believe me, the similarities between this board and the football board aren't lost on me.  If there is to be more participation on both boards the onus is on the lurking fans of other institutions around the league to speak up. 

As it stands currently, this board overfloweth with Wooster supporters.  Again, I'm not complaining about this.  Some of those supporters are completely intolerant of anybody else who has a difference of opinion, anybody who might crack a harmless joke about something they've posted, or anybody who might actually have the stones to call out one of their posters for posting something baseless and wrong.  That intolerance and/or inability to laugh at oneself can result in some harsh words being needlessly flung around.  I've got nothing personal against any poster here.  Anybody reading anything personal into my posts is reading things wrong and needs to lighten up.  What are we talking about here?  It's basketball.  It's a game.  If we can't have fun with it, what's the point? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 12, 2007, 01:33:09 AM
If you are aware of this, then I beg you, stop poking a stick at the board. Take the opportunity to take the high road. The board might grow if catty comments didn't bring it into disarray every couple weeks.

Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on January 12, 2007, 08:51:18 AM
Yeah I agree that Cooper has definitely improved defensively from last year...I will give him that.  Still he is not an aggressive defender in the least.  I noticed something interesting at the Allegheny game actually regarding that.  There were two points I can vividly remember in the game where 'gheny had a 2 on 1 fast break.  One was against Cooper, the other against Johnson.  Coop took the ball handler, 'gheny passed it to the other guy...he shot uncontested for the layup.  The other time, Johnson took the ball handler, he passed it off, Johnson HUSTLED over to the other gator...'gheny shot CONTESTED...missed the layup due to great defense by Johnson.  Cooper didn't even try to stop the shot.  Just found it interesting...

Quote from: wally_wabash on January 11, 2007, 10:00:37 PM
I'm just thinking out loud here...I think it's unanimous that Wooster is more skilled offensively than pretty much anybody else that they play.  In the games that they have lost, at least one of Wooster's main offensive threats have been in some kind of foul trouble (please correct me if I'm wrong).  It would seem to me that if I had such an enormous advantage with my offense, I wouldn't necessarily coach my scorers to get overly aggressive on D.  If Wooster is to essentially trade jumpshots with another team, Wooster is going to win more often than not.  If those scorers collect a bunch of fouls playing aggressive D and have to sit significant minutes, Wooster loses that advantage and become a lot more vulnerable.  Maybe this alleged "softness" on D by some of these Wooster players is a calculated decision made with the thought of keeping those guys on the floor. 

I see what you are saying...I guess I never really thought about that but it does make sense.  Still, I love to see good defense.  It is so entertaining to watch players diving all over the floor to get to a loose ball.  Bidwell plays seriously aggressive defense and (correct me if I'M wrong) I haven't seen him in too much significant foul trouble this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 12, 2007, 09:13:06 AM
division3hoops -

Yeah, nobody will ever confuse Cooper's defense with that of Brandon Johnson.  Not to give away one of his trade secrets, but often, when defending the 2 on 1 break, Johnson will hang with or feint at the ballhandler then drop back into the passing lane to make the interception.  I think I invented this play back in 1959. ;)

Bidwell has cut down on his fouls since early in the season, although this might be due to no more than plain luck.  He's aggressive, and it seems to me that lately he's gotten away with a few bumps and hacks, stuff that Andy Van Horn seems to always get called for, even if he's sitting on the bench.  Bidwell and Van Horn usually share the same spot (at least until Vandervaart's injury), which gives Steve Moore 10 fouls to give at that position, and between the two of them they sometimes seem intent on reaching that quota. :)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on January 12, 2007, 11:34:55 AM
Both NCAC sites are dominated by schools that happen to be the best in their sport and that is the problem...I spend an equal amount of time on the NCAC sites and lurking on the CCIW sites and since the CCIW seems to have half a dozen competitive teams in each sport the banter traded seems to be lighter, even with each poster as intense as the next..so maybe if our conference competition improves the board will too.
Here's hoping that Wabash throws a scare into Woo tomorrow!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 12, 2007, 01:02:45 PM
schools that dominate both sports? as i see it right now wittenberg holds to NCAC football a nd basketball crowns as we speak
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 12, 2007, 01:59:02 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 12, 2007, 01:02:45 PM
schools that dominate both sports? as i see it right now wittenberg holds to NCAC football a nd basketball crowns as we speak

See, Wooster guys and Wally, we have at least one thing in common. Witt sucks! :)  ;) :D ;D ::)

(is that enough smileys to make sure you guys know I'm joking?)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 12, 2007, 06:25:20 PM
I've got it! Have the Sphinx Club give away free beer to everyone that come to the Wooster game tomorrow. Get 'em all nice and liquored up.

The key is for Wabash to take a lead - 2-0 let's say, and then announce that there's no more beer and everyone will need to pay a cover charge when they leave the building.

Upon hearing that - a fan riot ensues, and Wooster will forfeit to Wabash.

See, easy as cake - piece of pie!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on January 12, 2007, 06:43:09 PM
Quote from: roadtrip on January 12, 2007, 11:34:55 AM
Both NCAC sites are dominated by schools that happen to be the best in their sport and that is the problem...I spend an equal amount of time on the NCAC sites and lurking on the CCIW sites and since the CCIW seems to have half a dozen competitive teams in each sport the banter traded seems to be lighter, even with each poster as intense as the next..so maybe if our conference competition improves the board will too.
Here's hoping that Wabash throws a scare into Woo tomorrow!
None of the rivalries on the CCIW board are particularly bitter. North Park students are ingrained with a strong dislike for Wheaties, but the Wheaton students aren't even aware of any of this. There's a definitely Augie-Wheaton rivalry, but Wheaties tend to be so concerned about being a good christian that it rarely (if ever ???) gets ugly. The football board used to have a ton of just generally mean people on it, but I slapped them on the hands enough times that they stopped.  :D Maybe what you guys need on this board is a female... too much testosterone can be a seriously dangerous thing.  :P

Or, even better, you guys could stop taking everything so seriously. Yes it's annoying to have one team take over a board... ask half the CCIW board how they felt when IWU was good for several years straight and our board was absolutely plastered with greenness... but... if people aim for two things:

1) The team that is dominant and has a ridiculous amount of posters needs to conducts itself with class. There is a vast difference between the classyness of Wooster posters. This is unfortunate, because it's a great institution and deserves to be represented well.
2) Everyone needs to keep in mind that there are human beings behind each poster name. The way you conduct yourself toward people says vastly more important things than the results of basketball game and anything that is done or said to you.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2007, 07:09:36 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 12, 2007, 06:25:20 PM
I've got it! Have the Sphinx Club give away free beer to everyone that come to the Wooster game tomorrow. Get 'em all nice and liquored up.

The key is for Wabash to take a lead - 2-0 let's say, and then announce that there's no more beer and everyone will need to pay a cover charge when they leave the building.

Upon hearing that - a fan riot ensues, and Wooster will forfeit to Wabash.

See, easy as cake - piece of pie!

You've obviously never been to a game at Timken, smeds.  This plan might work better if the Sphinx club substitutes Metamucil for beer.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 12, 2007, 07:58:12 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 12, 2007, 06:25:20 PM
I've got it! Have the Sphinx Club give away free beer to everyone that come to the Wooster game tomorrow. Get 'em all nice and liquored up.

The key is for Wabash to take a lead - 2-0 let's say, and then announce that there's no more beer and everyone will need to pay a cover charge when they leave the building.

Upon hearing that - a fan riot ensues, and Wooster will forfeit to Wabash.

See, easy as cake - piece of pie!

Win a hoops game, hell. You did that you could win a war....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 13, 2007, 12:50:54 AM


Quote from: wally_wabash on January 11, 2007, 10:00:37 PM
I'm just thinking out loud here...I think it's unanimous that Wooster is more skilled offensively than pretty much anybody else that they play.  In the games that they have lost, at least one of Wooster's main offensive threats have been in some kind of foul trouble (please correct me if I'm wrong).  It would seem to me that if I had such an enormous advantage with my offense, I wouldn't necessarily coach my scorers to get overly aggressive on D.  If Wooster is to essentially trade jumpshots with another team, Wooster is going to win more often than not.  If those scorers collect a bunch of fouls playing aggressive D and have to sit significant minutes, Wooster loses that advantage and become a lot more vulnerable.  Maybe this alleged "softness" on D by some of these Wooster players is a calculated decision made with the thought of keeping those guys on the floor. 

I don't really agree (nor would any educated coach) that since you can score the ball that you don't need to bother on the other end. I will agree that Wooster is better than Witt offensively, but by no means far and beyond. Witt is very comparable athletically. However, what Witt lacks offensively they make up with defensive awareness and hustle. Talk about Coop not showing hustle or diving on the ground, try to find one Witt player that wouldn't do that in the heat of a game. I think the mindset that "we will outscore you" (Wooster) instead of "you won't score on us" (Witt) is a recipe for disaster for Wooster.
By the way I talked to Brent Musberger yesterday and he said Witt is a 9.5 point favorite at Hiram this weekend. He said that the oddsmakers were expecting some jet lag from Witt, but Borchers will prove to be too much.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on January 13, 2007, 02:10:25 AM
I think the saying Offense brings fans Defense wins championships really describes the scots the past few years, they have had the offense  to win, but sometimes lack the defensive guys on the floor ( sometimes due to being over aggresive and getting fouls) to put games away and win said championship.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on January 13, 2007, 01:02:26 PM
I would have to agree with both Ryder and Willie.  I would personally love to see Wooster play better defense.  Defense does wins championships.  Look at Woosters runs in the tournament the past few years, especially Albion...
It's no secret Wooster is mostly an offense team and when their shots aren't falling - they are in trouble.  I will never forget the Albion game where Wooster scored only 16 points in the first half of the game...kind of reminded me of junior high basketball games.  Albion's shots weren't falling either but Wooster's defense was not good enough to keep them at the same scoring margin as Wooster.  When your shots aren't falling, you had Better have good enough defense to keep the other team from scoring...if you don't, you are going to lose that game. 
Look at Witt - they play excellent defense, and most of the time are able to keep their opponents down below them or at their level.  Their offense is not the best, but it's hardly bad and they are also successful every year.  Especially last year
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 13, 2007, 02:13:14 PM
Good to see Tim Vandervaart back on the floor for Wooster today.  Evan Will still got the start but Vaart is getting minutes off the bench vs. Wabash.

Wooster leads early 15-2 vs. the Little Giants.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 13, 2007, 02:39:52 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 12, 2007, 01:59:02 PM
See, Wooster guys and Wally, we have at least one thing in common. Witt sucks! :)  ;) :D ;D ::)
(is that enough smileys to make sure you guys know I'm joking?)
There's not enough smileys to ever joke about that!

Go Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 13, 2007, 02:43:36 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 47  Wabash 22

Wooster has controlled this game from the start (12-0).  Scots are being led by James Cooper with 13 points and Brandon Johnson with 11 points.

Tom Port did pick up 3 fouls in the first half.  3 freshmen (Elam, Geitgey, Melick) all played for Wooster in the first half.  Vandervaart played ~8 minutes with 4 boards and 2 points.

Wooster made 5 three pointers in the half while Little Giants were 0-10 from the arc

Andrew Zimmer with 8 points and Chase Haltom with 6 points are leading Wabash in scoring.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 13, 2007, 02:53:04 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 13, 2007, 02:43:36 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 47  Wabash 22

Hmmmm.....did we go for 2 at some point?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on January 13, 2007, 02:56:33 PM
Woo played 3 freshmen in the 1st half....Bash started 3 freshmen and I lost count of how many played in the 1st half, not good....but the education they're getting on the floor will pay off in the future....I hope
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 13, 2007, 03:35:34 PM
Final:  Wooster 96  Wabash 52

Wooster stretched out the margin in the 2nd half to notch an easy win.  :) Wooster was led today by James Cooper with 18 points, Brandon Johnson with 16 points and Andy Van Horn with 10 points.  Scots made 13 three pointers compared to 4 for Wabash.

Wabash was led in scoring by Andrew Zimmer with 10 points and Andy Root with 10 points.

Wooster is now 13-2, 6-0 NCAC  :)  Next game is at Hiram on 1/17

GO SCOTS!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 13, 2007, 03:39:52 PM
I don't have the words to describe what happened to Wabash today. I think they need to just forget this game happened and get ready for Earlham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 13, 2007, 04:07:28 PM
Should've gotten everyone liquored up!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 13, 2007, 04:09:32 PM
Attendance 1111? Was someone using the patented Amidon/Fendley/Harris Attendance Generation Program that's installed at Wabash?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 13, 2007, 04:29:10 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 13, 2007, 04:07:28 PM
Should've gotten everyone liquored up!

It certainly would have made listening to it easier.

Quote from: smedindy on January 13, 2007, 04:09:32 PM
Attendance 1111? Was someone using the patented Amidon/Fendley/Harris Attendance Generation Program that's installed at Wabash?

I'd like to hear about this.

As an aside, I went to a game at my law school alma mater a couple of weeks ago. I did a quick rough headcount and came up with about 200. Which isn't bad during the middle of break. But the official attendance was listed at 400. Does it make that big a difference to go from 200 to 400 in a game during break?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 13, 2007, 04:35:11 PM
1111 is probably a pretty good guess, maybe a little high.  It was about 1/4 to 1/3 full, which for us is a somewhat sparse crowd.  Good thing, too, as it was as dreadful a game as the score makes you think.  Really, the less said about this game, the better IMHO.  At least Wabash's players gave a good effort the whole game, which can't have been easy under the circumstances.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 13, 2007, 05:41:09 PM
Witt prevails at Hiram, 72-50.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 13, 2007, 05:47:44 PM
Just guessing, but would the 1111 figure include the teams and coaching staff?  It doesn't say paid attendance and the players are in attendance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 13, 2007, 06:08:04 PM
Quote from: goscots on January 13, 2007, 05:47:44 PM
Just guessing, but would the 1111 figure include the teams and coaching staff?  It doesn't say paid attendance and the players are in attendance.

I know from working games here at Witt that yes, players and coaches can be (and usually are) included in attendance figures.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 13, 2007, 06:22:04 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 13, 2007, 04:35:11 PM
...as it was as dreadful a game as the score makes you think.  Really, the less said about this game, the better IMHO.  At least Wabash's players gave a good effort the whole game, which can't have been easy under the circumstances.  :)

Ditto. That was one of the worst teams that I've ever seen, and it was compounded by the fact that the Scots put forth a pretty consistent effort for 35 minutes.  However, the last 5 minutes were even more painful to watch as the Wooster and Wabash reserves attempted to out-stink each other. I did think that Robert Melick showed some potential today, but he needs to be getting more minutes prior to mop-up time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 13, 2007, 06:27:06 PM
Final:  Earlham 68  Ohio Wesleyan 65

Quakers pull off the upset in Richmond!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 13, 2007, 06:34:34 PM
All the 1/13 NCAC Final Scores:

Wittenberg 72  Hiram 50
Earlham 68  Ohio Wesleyan 65
Wooster 96  Wabash 52
Denison 87  Allegheny 67
Oberlin 63  Kenyon 62  OT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 13, 2007, 06:45:40 PM
Darn it - I could have gone 10-0 in the NCAC portion of pick'em this week except that it looks like Alleghany got blasted at Denison.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 13, 2007, 09:37:35 PM
NCAC Standings through 1/13 results:

Wooster  6-0  (13-2)
Wittenberg  5-1  (13-2)
Ohio Wesleyan 4-2  (10-5)
Earlham  3-3  (5-10)
Hiram  3-3  (4-11)
Allegheny 2-4  (6-8)
Kenyon 2-4  (6-9)
Denison 2-4  (3-11)
Oberlin 2-4  (3-12)
Wabash 1-5  (4-11)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 13, 2007, 10:37:03 PM
I can honestly say that when Wabash joined this league a few years ago, I never ever envisioned them in last place. :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 13, 2007, 10:56:32 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 13, 2007, 06:34:34 PM
All the 1/13 NCAC Final Scores:

Wittenberg 72  Hiram 50
Earlham 68  Ohio Wesleyan 65
Wooster 96  Wabash 52
Denison 87  Allegheny 67
Oberlin 63  Kenyon 62  OT

Kenyon hasn't played in a game decided by more than nine points since November.  They've gone 3-6 since then, losing two games in OT and a third by one on a buzzer-beating three.  If one shot each by Wittenberg, DePauw, and Oberlin rattle out instead of dropping in, they're 9-6, 4-2 instead of the opposite.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 13, 2007, 11:33:59 PM
Quote from: sac on January 13, 2007, 10:37:03 PM
I can honestly say that when Wabash joined this league a few years ago, I never ever envisioned them in last place. :-\

You and me both, sac.  But, last place today isn't last place at the end of the season.  And really, the writing was on the wall for this kind of a season.  No starting experience, just one senior...one of the two key juniors left for a semester abroad...It's disappointing for sure, but not entirely surprising.  I'm only going to be truly disappointed with this season if the team stops playing hard, which I don't think has happened. 

Wabash has still only played one conference game at home.  Earlham, Oberlin, Denison, and Kenyon still have to come to C'ville.  Let's let this thing play out.  The standings will shuffle some before this thing is over. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 14, 2007, 01:08:18 AM
Quote from: sac on January 13, 2007, 10:37:03 PM
I can honestly say that when Wabash joined this league a few years ago, I never ever envisioned them in last place. :-\

Me either. This has been a tough season.

Quote from: wally_wabash on January 13, 2007, 11:33:59 PMWabash has still only played one conference game at home.  Earlham, Oberlin, Denison, and Kenyon still have to come to C'ville.  Let's let this thing play out.  The standings will shuffle some before this thing is over.

Like I posted earlier I hope the team can just forget this game (or the last 5) happened and concentrate on the games ahead. I hope this group of guys learns from this season and turns that into wins down the road.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 14, 2007, 06:41:02 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 13, 2007, 11:33:59 PM
Quote from: sac on January 13, 2007, 10:37:03 PM
I can honestly say that when Wabash joined this league a few years ago, I never ever envisioned them in last place. :-\

You and me both, sac.  But, last place today isn't last place at the end of the season.  And really, the writing was on the wall for this kind of a season.  No starting experience, just one senior...one of the two key juniors left for a semester abroad...It's disappointing for sure, but not entirely surprising.  I'm only going to be truly disappointed with this season if the team stops playing hard, which I don't think has happened. 

Wabash has still only played one conference game at home.  Earlham, Oberlin, Denison, and Kenyon still have to come to C'ville.  Let's let this thing play out.  The standings will shuffle some before this thing is over. 

Even still, seeing Wabash behind perennial bottom campers Oberlin and Hiram even at this relatively early stage just doesn't look right.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2007, 11:21:31 AM
Here is the Wooster Daily Record link on the Wabash win.  Note the focus by Coach Moore and the Scots on playing better defense:

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1477492

If Wooster can sustain tough defense like they did yesterday, the Scots may have a very successful season.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 14, 2007, 12:03:31 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2007, 11:21:31 AM
Here is the Wooster Daily Record link on the Wabash win.  Note the focus by Coach Moore and the Scots on playing better defense:

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1477492

If Wooster can sustain tough defense like they did yesterday, the Scots may have a very successful season.  :)

Perhaps the improved defense was due to some new strategies suggested by yesterday's honorary coach!  :D  ;D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2007, 01:04:46 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on January 14, 2007, 12:03:31 PM

Perhaps the improved defense was due to some new strategies suggested by yesterday's honorary coach!  :D  ;D ;)


LOL - since we know that honorary coaches have only one job and that is to listen while occasionally giving a Scots player a high five.   At any rate, a very good source tells me that the word "defense" was used extensively by the Wooster coaching staff yesterday!  :) ;D ;)

To put it another way, I don't think that the Wooster coaches were very happy that the Scots gave up 87 points to Allegheny on Wednesday. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 14, 2007, 08:39:22 PM
This was expected to be a tough season, especially when it was known that Simkus was going to spend the second semester in Spain. It meant that Brock and Root and Haltom and the rest of the kiddie corps would have to grow up quickly.

There is talent - they need to learn how to play college basketball. I say they will make the NCAC tourney, but they need to get on the stick and play hard.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 14, 2007, 10:39:08 PM
I think with the hard schedule early in the year, Coach Moore probably did not ride the guys as much. Plus it is easier to get up for a defensive stop vs WITT or ONU than Allegheny or Denison.  Just calling them as I see 'em. no offense

Now that we are in the dog days of the NCAC season, Coach Moore is definitely going to narrow the team's focus and no one coaches D like Coach!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 15, 2007, 12:16:46 PM
VERY VERY interesting game wednesday night in Delaware as Witt takes on OWU coming off a disappointing looking-ahead showing at Earlham Saturday. This game could gauge how each team may fare later on in the season, but its reasonable these two teams could be playing to play Wooster in the conference tourney final later on as well.

Big matchup is whether the Bishops have an answer or matchup defensively for Gregg Hill and whether Witt can contain Rudegair and Chojnacki. Thoughts anyone?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 15, 2007, 01:13:18 PM
The NCAC men's basketball page (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) says it better than I could: [EDIT: well, at least I could point out that this is the NCAC Men's Player of the Week Award! :)]
QuoteJanuary 14, 2007

Denison's Dan Hodgkinson (Lake Forest, IL/Lake Forest), a 6-6, senior
post, paced Denison in victories over Oberlin, 75-48, and Allegheny,
87-67. The wins were the first two consecutive victories for the Big Red
this season and also snapped a 10-game losing skid. Hodgkinson scored 27
points and had four rebounds and a block against the Yeomen and returned
with 16 points, seven rebounds and two blocks versus Allegheny. He leads
the NCAC in scoring at 19.8 points per game and is just 152 points away
from becoming Denison's all-time leading scorer. If he keeps at his
current pace, Hodgkinson will pass Charlie Claggett on Feb. 10 at
Allegheny.

Congratulations to Dan! 

Here's a list of those who have won this award this season; it might be useful for those thinking of post-season awards:
11/20: Bryan Yelvington, F, Kenyon (soph.)
11/27: Tim Vandervaart, C, Wooster (sr.)
12/4: Dane Borchers, P, Wittenberg (sr.)
12/11: Ryan Hollihan, F, Allegheny (soph.)
1/2: Markous Jewett, F, Earlham (sr.)
1/7: Mike Staley, G, Hiram (fr.)
1/14: Dan Hodgkinson, P, Denison (sr.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 15, 2007, 01:26:33 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 15, 2007, 12:16:46 PM
VERY VERY interesting game wednesday night in Delaware as Witt takes on OWU coming off a disappointing looking-ahead showing at Earlham Saturday.
And then OWU plays Wooster on Saturday.  What a week!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 15, 2007, 01:31:08 PM
There seems to be a broken link to the NCAC Standings.

When I click on it, I keep getting the schedule/results.

How would I report the broken link, or have I just done so?

Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 15, 2007, 01:31:46 PM
You're talking about the page on our site?

Scroll down. The standings are there too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 15, 2007, 06:31:05 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 15, 2007, 01:31:46 PM
You're talking about the page on our site?

Scroll down. The standings are there too.

Thanks, Pat.  I thought it was all scores.  Here's an explanation of the problem.

Underneath this:
Scoreboard/Schedule
2006-2007 Men's Basketball Schedule
(* Conference; • Region; # Postseason. Home games in bold)
Game times have not been verified and may have changed, or may not correspond to your time zone. Please verify with the school before making plans to attend a game based on these times.

There is a link that says:
NCAC Standings

Since it keeps coming back to the same place, I thought it was broken.  Is it supposed to go to the standings lower on the page?

Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 15, 2007, 06:37:44 PM
I'm looking forward to seeing the poll when it comes out.

This is an interesting situation.  Last week ONU was 4 and Wooster was 5.  Since ONU lost, it will be interesting to see how ONU and Wooster rank, given that Wooster lost to ONU.

TigerFan_73
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 15, 2007, 07:13:12 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 15, 2007, 06:37:44 PM
I'm looking forward to seeing the poll when it comes out.

This is an interesting situation.  Last week ONU was 4 and Wooster was 5.  Since ONU lost, it will be interesting to see how ONU and Wooster rank, given that Wooster lost to ONU.

TigerFan_73

I think you saw that scenario play out last week.  Coming into that poll, ONU was #2 and Wooster was #4, 64 points behind ONU (64 points=about 2.5 places on the average ballot).  ONU lost at home to Capital by 11 (and won at Muskingum by 12), while Wooster won their only game by 29 over Denison.  In the subsequent poll, ONU fell to #4 and pushed Wooster down a spot to #5, with Wooster losing 28 points (i.e. just over one position per ballot).  My years of poll-watching tell me that what happened was that voters felt like they had to drop ONU, but that they had to keep ONU ahead of Wooster because of the still-fresh head-to-head result; thus Wooster loses points in week where they blasted their only opponent.  However, ONU ended up with a margin over Wooster of just one point. 

Now this week ONU splits another pair of games, winning at Wilmington by 1 and losing at JCU by 2, while Wooster wins twice over inferior competition (a bit of a struggle with Allegheny, and a massacre of Wabash).  I think the voters will have no trouble sliding ONU behind Wooster, with Wooster moving up to #4.  In fact, I think most voters will have Wooster written in somewhere in the top 5 or 6 before even considering where to put ONU.  They'll remember that the Wooster/ONU result was not decisive, and was instead a back-and-forth game all night, with ONU's final margin of 7 being their largest of the game.  In other words, a "forgiveable" loss to some extent.

This week's conundrum will be what to do about ONU vis-a-vis Wittenberg, a team the PBs beat by 17 in December.  The drop I expect ONU to take will put them in a position where the average voter will have to decide if they should keep them above Witt based on that Dec. victory.  I think that's what will happen, but mostly because Witt's recent results (OT at Kenyon, 11-point win at Earlham) don't inspire much confidence that Witt has improved since their loss to ONU.  I think many of the voters will be reluctant to push Witt up too high until they see how the Tigers do at OWU on Wednesday.  Furthermore, no matter how it all shakes out, ONU will still have two victories over top 10 teams, while Wittenberg is 0-2 against the top 10.  I think that'll be enough to keep the Polar Bears slightly ahead of the Tigers in the new poll.  But the PBs are definitely on probation!  :)

When all is said and done this week, I expect the top 10 to shake out this way:

1. UW-Stevens Point
2. Amherst
3. St. Thomas
4. Wooster
5. Va. Wesleyan...spots 3-5 very close
6. Mississippi College
7. Ohio Northern
8. Wittenberg
9. Whitworth...spots 6-9 very close
10. Elmhurst
11. Hope...spots 10-11 very close

Just one poll-watcher's opinion, and I hasten to point out that I don't have a very good track record with predictions like this!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 15, 2007, 07:22:52 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 15, 2007, 06:31:05 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 15, 2007, 01:31:46 PM
You're talking about the page on our site?

Scroll down. The standings are there too.

Thanks, Pat.  I thought it was all scores.  Here's an explanation of the problem.

Underneath this:
Scoreboard/Schedule
2006-2007 Men's Basketball Schedule
(* Conference; • Region; # Postseason. Home games in bold)
Game times have not been verified and may have changed, or may not correspond to your time zone. Please verify with the school before making plans to attend a game based on these times.

There is a link that says:
NCAC Standings

Since it keeps coming back to the same place, I thought it was broken.  Is it supposed to go to the standings lower on the page?

Thanks.


Well, I asked our tech person sometime in December to make the standings the primary component of the standings page but he did not do it. I'll ask again.

But in the meanwhile, just scroll down. If a link brings you back to the page it might behoove you to look at the whole page. The scroll bar is a wonderful thing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 15, 2007, 07:24:28 PM
There seems to be an error with the NCAC standings. Earlham should be 3-3, not 2-4, (plus the results of the OWU-Earlham game are not posted yet).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on January 15, 2007, 07:27:35 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 15, 2007, 07:13:12 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 15, 2007, 06:37:44 PM
I'm looking forward to seeing the poll when it comes out.

This is an interesting situation.  Last week ONU was 4 and Wooster was 5.  Since ONU lost, it will be interesting to see how ONU and Wooster rank, given that Wooster lost to ONU.

TigerFan_73

I think you saw that scenario play out last week.  Coming into that poll, ONU was #2 and Wooster was #4, 64 points behind ONU (64 points=about 2.5 places on the average ballot).  ONU lost at home to Capital by 11 (and won at Muskingum by 12), while Wooster won their only game by 29 over Denison.  In the subsequent poll, ONU fell to #4 and pushed Wooster down a spot to #5, with Wooster losing 28 points (i.e. just over one position per ballot).  My years of poll-watching tell me that what happened was that voters felt like they had to drop ONU, but that they had to keep ONU ahead of Wooster because of the still-fresh head-to-head result; thus Wooster loses points in week where they blasted their only opponent.  However, ONU ended up with a margin over Wooster of just one point. 

Now this week ONU splits another pair of games, winning at Wilmington by 1 and losing at JCU by 2, while Wooster wins twice over inferior competition (a bit of a struggle with Allegheny, and a massacre of Wabash).  I think the voters will have no trouble sliding ONU behind Wooster, with Wooster moving up to #4.  In fact, I think most voters will have Wooster written in somewhere in the top 5 or 6 before even considering where to put ONU.  They'll remember that the Wooster/ONU result was not decisive, and was instead a back-and-forth game all night, with ONU's final margin of 7 being their largest of the game.  In other words, a "forgiveable" loss to some extent.

This week's conundrum will be what to do about ONU vis-a-vis Wittenberg, a team the PBs beat by 17 in December.  The drop I expect ONU to take will put them in a position where the average voter will have to decide if they should keep them above Witt based on that Dec. victory.  I think that's what will happen, but mostly because Witt's recent results (OT at Kenyon, 11-point win at Earlham) don't inspire much confidence that Witt has improved since their loss to ONU.  I think many of the voters will be reluctant to push Witt up too high until they see how the Tigers do at OWU on Wednesday.  Furthermore, no matter how it all shakes out, ONU will still have two victories over top 10 teams, while Wittenberg is 0-2 against the top 10.  I think that'll be enough to keep the Polar Bears slightly ahead of the Tigers in the new poll.  But the PBs are definitely on probation!  :)

When all is said and done this week, I expect the top 10 to shake out this way:

1. UW-Stevens Point
2. Amherst
3. St. Thomas
4. Wooster
5. Va. Wesleyan...spots 3-5 very close
6. Mississippi College
7. Ohio Northern
8. Wittenberg
9. Whitworth...spots 6-9 very close
10. Elmhurst
11. Hope...spots 10-11 very close

Just one poll-watcher's opinion, and I hasten to point out that I don't have a very good track record with predictions like this!  :)

Last week I had:

1 UW-Stevens Point
2 Amherst
3 Ohio Northern
4 Wooster
5 St. Thomas

And this week:

1 UW-Stevens Point
2 Amherst
3 Virginia Wesleyan
4 Wooster
5 Mississippi College


Just one voter's ballot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lancer98 on January 15, 2007, 07:54:29 PM
I have some eligibility left.....can I try out for the Wabash basketball team?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 15, 2007, 08:25:24 PM
Those shooting stats from owu's bigs are amazing. Definitely need to get out there on them. Chojacki has never been able to score on Borchers on the blocks and I don't even know if Rudegair bothers going down on the block. Rudegair will probably be a good matchup for Hemenway who is faster and more athletic. Owu has a good team but Witt matches up too well with them. Will be a close game til the 15:00 point of the second half where the thoroughbreads separate themselves. Witt -5.5 at OWU. Borchers- 23 pts 14 rebs, Bowen 13 pts (4-6 from 3 pt, 1-4 fts) Denbow 6 pts, 5 ast, 1 to.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 15, 2007, 10:13:50 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 15, 2007, 07:13:12 PM
When all is said and done this week, I expect the top 10 to shake out this way:

1. UW-Stevens Point
2. Amherst
3. St. Thomas
4. Wooster
5. Va. Wesleyan...spots 3-5 very close
6. Mississippi College
7. Ohio Northern
8. Wittenberg
9. Whitworth...spots 6-9 very close
10. Elmhurst
11. Hope...spots 10-11 very close

Just one poll-watcher's opinion, and I hasten to point out that I don't have a very good track record with predictions like this!  :)

All is now said and done, and it shook out this way (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/):
1. UW-Stevens Point
2. Amherst
3. St. Thomas
4. Wooster
5. Va. Wesleyan...28 points separate #3 from #5
   ....so far, so good...
6. Wittenberg
7. Mississippi College
8. Ohio Northern...not close to the above two, 46 points behind MC and 56 behind Witt
9. Elmhurst
10. Whitworth...a full 105 points behind Witt
11. Hope...just 4 behind #10, but I had the wrong #10! :D 27 points behind Elmhurst

Not too bad, by my usual standards.  It looks to me like Ohio Northern is not just on probation, they're on double secret probation.  (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_Secret_Probation)  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 15, 2007, 10:17:41 PM
Quote from: goscots on January 15, 2007, 07:24:28 PM
(plus the results of the OWU-Earlham game are not posted yet).

Not every school is overly prompt about posting scores on the site. Every school has a username and password. If tey don't post scores, we'll get them eventually but since we offer schools the ability to post news releases and publicize their programs, we'd hope they'd post the scores. Only takes about 45 seconds per game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2007, 11:05:47 PM
Earlham College is not very prompt about posting scores after games....even on their own Earlham website!  Sometimes, it can be several days after a game before the final score (and boxscore) makes it on to their website.  :o

When Earlham plays a NCAC home game, I usually find the final score on that game day either by checking the opponent's website (last Saturday's result vs OWU was on the Bishops website) or on an internet national wire release listing lots of game scores.  ???  Sometimes, an Earlham poster like Billy Pilgrim helps out by posting the final score.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2007, 11:45:11 PM
Nice to see Wooster move back up to #4 in the Top 25 poll this week.  :)

While the Top 25 poll is a good discussion topic, let's not forget that a team's in-region wins/losses and their strength of schedule (QOWI) will be the most important factors in determining qualifiers, seeds and hosts for the NCAA tournament (in addition to the automatic bid at the conference tourney).

Therefore, it is very important for Wooster, Wittenberg and Ohio Wesleyan to minimize their in-region losses if they want to qualify for the NCAA tournament as an at-large team (Pool C) and to increase their chances of receiving a higher seed and/or hosting games in the big dance.

Fortunately, the OAC teams are already beating each other up so all of their post season contenders (e.g Ohio Northern, others) already have 3 or more in-region losses.

However in the MIAA, Hope looks to have the inside track on being the highest seed out of all the Great Lakes teams because they have no in-region losses to this point.  Their only two losses were to Carthage and Wheaton from the Midwest region (considered by the NCAA to be out of region games).

So if the season ended today, Hope would receive a higher seed from the NCAA than Wooster and Wittenberg despite the fact that the Dutchmen are currently ranked lower than both NCAC teams in the D3 Hoops poll.

There are still lots of games left to be played but my basic point is that the NCAA selection committee does not select and seed teams the same way that we view them in the Top 25 poll.

GO SCOTS!  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 15, 2007, 11:58:16 PM
Do NOT confuse the QOWI with an actual strength of schedule, please...thanks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 15, 2007, 11:58:55 PM
Hope/Wheaton falls within the 200-mile rule and is in-region, so Hope does have a regional loss.  At this point I would guess that Wooster, with a moderately tough schedule (according to the NCAA rules) and just one regional loss, or Lake Erie, which is 10-0 in-region, would be #1 if the regional rankings came out today.  Wooster is 8-1 in-region, Hope is 5-1, Witt is 8-2, ONU is 7-3 but would have a great QoWI, JCU 8-4, B-W 7-3, Heidelberg 10-4, Adrian 5-1, Lake Erie 10-0, Bethany 9-3, Westminster 8-1.

The team schedule pages on this site indicate regional games with a black dot.  Here is Hope's page. (http://www.d3hoops.com/school_info.php?school=Hope&team=m)

Wooster and perhaps especially Wittenberg need the OAC to stop beating each other up, IMHO.  Wooster's home loss to ONU is already very damaging, and if ONU keeps sliding, it could cost the Scots another 2 QoWI points.  Both Woo and Witt would be well-served at this point if ONU would right the ship.  Witt would benefit from a strong finish by Capital as well. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 16, 2007, 12:25:09 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2007, 11:45:11 PM
So if the season ended today, Hope would receive a higher seed from the NCAA than Wooster and Wittenberg despite the fact that the Dutchmen are currently ranked lower than both NCAC teams in the D3 Hoops poll.

Not likely to happen wooscotsfan for 2 reasons

#1 if hosting an NCAA game comes down to the Hope men or Hope women this year, the ladies will get the nod.  So yeah Hope might be a higher seed but they wouldn't be at home.

#2 Hope QOWI is going to be dreadfull, currently Hope is 5-1 in-region:

In-region records of oppents
Calvin 2-4  win away  11 points
Wheaton 5-4 loss away 5 points
Kalamazoo 1-9 win away 9 point
Olivet 1-6 win home  8 points
Albion  3-5 win home 8 points
Calvin 2-4  win away 11 points
QOWI = 8.67

Remaining MIAA opponents
Adrian 5-1
Alma 1-4
Tri State 4-2

Its not likely Hope's MIAA opponent in-region are going to improve a whole lot, and unless Wheaton gets real hot in the tough CCIW that game will never be more than 7 points.

The MIAA's getting one team and it will be the MIAA Tournament Champion, it will be very difficult for Hope or anyone else to qualify based on QOWI and in-region records as a Pool C.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 16, 2007, 12:36:05 AM
Smeds -- you're right that the Quality of Wins Index is really a power rating and not a strength of schedule.  It doesn't change my basic point though that the NCAA selection process and the Top 25 poll are two very different animals.  ;D

David -- good catch on Wheaton being within the 200 mile radius for Hope so Wooster may be ahead of them at this point in the NCAA rankings.   The OAC losses are a double edged sword as you note.  Losses by some OAC teams that have not played Woo or Witt (e.g. B-W or JCU) will push them down in the NCAA's rankings and help the NCAC teams while other OAC losses (e.g. ONU) could reduce QoWI points for Woo/Witt as you observed.

Sac -- from a Wooster perspective, it is good to hear that the Hope women are more likely to host than the Hope men.  There are still plenty of games left so it will be interesting to see how the in-region losses compare at the end of the season.  I think the Hope men have a good shot at running the MIAA schedule and finishing the season with only 1 in-region loss.  That scenario could help to offset a lower QoWI for Hope if other Great Lakes teams have more in-region losses?

 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 16, 2007, 01:14:59 AM
But the QOWI is not even a power rating, since it's all about the region and takes no differnece in between the other regions.

It's a heinous measurement...and I like measurements.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hodgistheman on January 16, 2007, 10:44:26 AM
Congrats to Denisons Dan Hodgkinson on being the NCAC Player of the Week.
He has led them to back to back wins. THey now may have a shot at being in the top 5 of the NCAC. If they do that Hodgkinson has to be a real consideration for Player of the Year.


Hodg for President
Izzo for VP

Hodgis the man out
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 16, 2007, 11:09:15 AM
here we go again.......................haha
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 16, 2007, 11:11:27 AM
Is that anything like "Grease is the word??"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 16, 2007, 02:27:16 PM
I'm assuming this is a sock of our previously dearly departed Denison denouncer?  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 16, 2007, 09:05:38 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 16, 2007, 01:14:59 AM
But the QOWI is not even a power rating, since it's all about the region and takes no differnece in between the other regions.

It's a heinous measurement...and I like measurements.

Smeds -- I share some of your frustration with the current NCAA selection process.

For the QoWI -- should we call it a "regionally constrained power rating"?  :) ;D :P

...or is the "worthless wins index" a better descriptor?  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 16, 2007, 10:01:46 PM
If I got 30 shots a game like Hodgingford I might put some big numbers too. Being very good on a bad team will ruin your chance at poy, ask matt formato. Or as i like to call him Matt "This dude sucks (5 mins later) This dude is awesome" Formato which is coincidentally the best nickname in the history of the ncac.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hodgistheman on January 17, 2007, 08:50:47 AM
Willie...

There is a big difference between a good player on a bad team and a good player on a good team. I assume you are neither, so why knock Hodgkinson because the team wasn't so hot early, they have improved recently and have a chance of being in the top four or five of the conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 17, 2007, 09:41:49 AM
Quote from: hodgistheman on January 17, 2007, 08:50:47 AM
Willie...

There is a big difference between a good player on a bad team and a good player on a good team. I assume you are neither, so why knock Hodgkinson because the team wasn't so hot early, they have improved recently and have a chance of being in the top four or five of the conference.

I'm not sure that beating Oberlin and Allegheny (both at home) points to a great deal of improvement!  If they manage to win a couple of road games this week maybe we can talk about them being improved...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 17, 2007, 09:47:23 AM
What is happening to the NCAC when Hiram and Denison players win Player of the Week in concurrent weeks? Denison has to prove themselves first before anyone is going to take them very seriously, although they did manage to scare Wittenberg earlier this year again, but if your team is basing it's success on coming close to winnning big games, you've got a little issue
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hodgistheman on January 17, 2007, 09:51:36 AM
Fellas...

It is very easy to stand back and judge anohter player or teams program. Denison, because of strict entrance guidline will never be real competitive across the board, so what is wrong when a very good player comes along and you want o support him and the team. I have not knocked Wooster or Witt or any other NCAC team, yet you seem to want to rip somebody for having an opinion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hodgistheman on January 17, 2007, 09:54:50 AM
By the way, what ever happened to Kyle McKee at Hiram?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 17, 2007, 10:29:17 AM
Quote from: hodgistheman on January 17, 2007, 09:51:36 AM
Fellas...

It is very easy to stand back and judge anohter player or teams program. Denison, because of strict entrance guidline will never be real competitive across the board, so what is wrong when a very good player comes along and you want o support him and the team. I have not knocked Wooster or Witt or any other NCAC team, yet you seem to want to rip somebody for having an opinion.

I don't think that anyone was knocking Hodgkinson.  I thought the discussion was assessing his chances of winning POY, and that they were not as good because of the quality of his team.  At least that what I was thinking...

We're always happy to see support for other teams in here.  Sorry if my comments (or others) came off as any disrespect, but if a team is bad you've got to expect some negativity...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hodgistheman on January 17, 2007, 10:33:00 AM
I understand the negativity but you can't knock a guy for going out and doing what he does on a nightly basis. Can you name anyone the has been more consistent over four years than Dan Hodgkinson.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 17, 2007, 11:03:07 AM
Quote from: hodgistheman on January 17, 2007, 08:50:47 AM
Willie...

There is a big difference between a good player on a bad team and a good player on a good team. I assume you are neither, so why knock Hodgkinson because the team wasn't so hot early, they have improved recently and have a chance of being in the top four or five of the conference.

Your instincts are correct, I am a very average basketball player who does not play for any team in the ncac. And I said Hodgy was a good player. The only thing I want to know is if Hodgkinson knows about your unhealthy infatuation with him?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on January 17, 2007, 11:07:11 AM
No one will argue Hodgkinson's consistency, but I think that is the point of the discussion. No disrespect to his career thus far at Denison but I think if he went to Witt or Woo there's no way he would've started or gotten significant minutes early in his career. In those programs, even very talented players have to 'wait their turn' b/c number of talented kids that go to those school to be a part of winning programs. This is a big factor in why those programs stay strong year in and year out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2007, 11:35:38 AM
Having seen Denison play 5 times this season, I feel compelled to disagree with four of the above statements:

Quote from: cmhscots on January 17, 2007, 09:41:49 AM
I'm not sure that beating Oberlin and Allegheny (both at home) points to a great deal of improvement!  If they manage to win a couple of road games this week maybe we can talk about them being improved...

Considering where Denison was before this week, their wins over Oberlin (by 27) and Allegheny (by 20) are unmistakeable signs of improvement.  However,

Quote from: hodgistheman on January 17, 2007, 08:50:47 AM[...]they have improved recently and have a chance of being in the top four or five of the conference.

I think that's overreaching. 

Quote from: hodgistheman on January 17, 2007, 09:51:36 AMDenison, because of strict entrance guidline will never be real competitive across the board[...]

Denison has, of course, won nine consecutive all-sports trophies in this conference, and lead in the race for the 10th.  Suggesting that admissions standards in Granville are significantly different from those in the other admissions offices is ridiculous.  Denison has been handicapped in the past by its administration's insistence on national recruiting, but that's a problem faced by Kenyon and Oberlin as well (perhaps others), so DU is not alone in this regard.  Anyway, both Hodgkinson and Izzo are from Chicagoland, so national recruiting has maybe not been such a detriment to the Big Red after all.

Finally,

Quote from: jimmychitwood15 on January 17, 2007, 11:07:11 AM
No one will argue Hodgkinson's consistency, but I think that is the point of the discussion. No disrespect to his career thus far at Denison but I think if he went to Witt or Woo there's no way he would've started or gotten significant minutes early in his career.

I've seen a lot of Wooster, and a lot of Denison, and I think Dan Hodgkinson would be a starter for the Scots, or at least a key contributor, had he gone there.  I'm less well-versed about Wittenberg, but I suspect he'd be a starter there too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 17, 2007, 11:38:28 AM
Hodgkinson has family ties, though, to Denison. I think he would have played a lot and started wherever he went in D-3, but certainly he wouldn't be amassing the stats at Wooster or Witt, and his defense would have cost him some time at those schools.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on January 17, 2007, 12:31:11 PM
The Spfld News-Sun reports that Witt's Mark Caraway tore his ACL last week against Hiram and done for the season.

The date for surgery to be determined later.

Good luck to Mark The Seed Caraway for a fast recovery.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2007, 01:01:51 PM
That's tough; he's a good player.  Best wishes to Mark for a speedy recovery and restoration to full health for next season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 17, 2007, 01:22:09 PM
Definitely a tough break for the Tigers.  Caraway was averaging 18 minutes per game, although I'm guessing that stat is a little inflated from when Bowen was injured earlier in the season.  Who is likely to see increased action in his place??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on January 17, 2007, 01:51:22 PM
DC- I guess my point was Hodgkinson would never have gotten as many minutes as a frosh or soph at Woo or Witt to retain the consistency he's had at Denison. For Woo, he would had to share minutes with Blake Mealer, Matt Schlingman, and even Port. For Witt, no way he would've played ahead of Dan Russ, Kenny Brady, or Pete Walker before that, not to mention Borchers. Again, that's just my opinion but I think Denison's overall lack in depth of talent allowed him to play more early. There's no question, at this point as a senior he would be a starter for either Witt or Woo but no way a 4 year starter all the way through.

Tough break for Caraway and the Tigers. He has been a strong perimeter player for Witt, who actually hit the last second 3 vs. Kenyon to send the game to overtime. Look for Brandon Barabino or Kevin Murray to step up in place of Caraway.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2007, 02:47:05 PM
It's all just a what-if game anyway, but my opinion is that by the middle of his sophomore season, Hodgkinson would have been ahead of Mealer as a senior or Bradley as a soph. on a hypothetical Scots depth chart two seasons ago, meaning he'd have been the first 4/5 off the bench spelling Schlingman and Vandervaart (Port started at the 3 that season).  Mealer averaged 21 mpg (started 14 before Vandervaart replaced him in the starting lineup) and Bradley about 14 mpg., so I think Hodgkinson would have seen a lot of time that season, and since.  Just my opinion, of course. 

I agree with you about Witt, though perhaps he'd have been shifted down to small forward with all of those trees ahead of him.

Smeds, just a guess of course, but I'd bet that if Hodgkinson had gone to Witt, he'd be a much better defensive player than he is today.  Clearly he wouldn't have the stats as a Tiger or Scot that he has put up as a Big Red, since he'd never have been the go-to guy that he is in Granville.  Bit I think he'd have been and would continue to be a solid contributor on either team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 17, 2007, 04:24:26 PM
Most likely Brandon White will shoulder some of the playing time with the absence of Carraway. Who is more than able to step in without much of a drop off.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 17, 2007, 07:50:50 PM
OWU 12 Witt 8 13:25to go in first half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 17, 2007, 07:55:00 PM
Now it's 17- 10 OWU. 10:17 left.

Let's go, Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 17, 2007, 08:00:07 PM
21 - 12 OWU with about 7:00 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 17, 2007, 08:17:32 PM
Witt ends the half on 6-0 8-0 run.  At the half in Delaware:

OWU - 26
Witt - 20

Wooster is all over Hiram 24-8 early in the 1st half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 17, 2007, 08:34:52 PM
OWU opens the half on a 9-2 run and are now up 35-22!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 17, 2007, 08:35:09 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 52  Hiram 23

This game is essentially over at the half.  :)  Wooster jumped out to a big lead early and has stretched the margin ever since.  Scots have made several three pointers led by Devin Fulk with 3.

Wooster is being led by James Cooper with 15 points, Devin Fulk with 9 points and Tom Port with 7 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 17, 2007, 08:36:06 PM
TO Witt.

OWU - 38
Witt - 22
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 17, 2007, 08:41:49 PM
Wittenberg's streaming broadcast page:

http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/sportsnetwork/index.html

OWU by 20, 48-28 with 13:22 to play in the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 17, 2007, 08:41:56 PM
This is amazing.  

OWU 48 Witt 28 with 13:30 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 17, 2007, 08:44:48 PM
Some folks on the NCAC pickem board were taking OWU in this game, but I was just worried that the Tigers might not have the killer instinct to put it away.

Now, OWU blocks a Hemenway shot.

Wow.

TF_73
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 17, 2007, 08:45:51 PM
I guess we are rooting for different teams, huh, ScotsFans?

TF_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 17, 2007, 08:52:27 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 17, 2007, 08:45:51 PM
I guess we are rooting for different teams, huh, ScotsFans?

TF_1973
Ya Think??? ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 17, 2007, 08:54:44 PM
Oh my golly, down 20 again.

Billy Bowen got his nose STEPPED ON!  That sounds painful.  Apparently, there was no harm, because there was no foul.  >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 17, 2007, 08:57:48 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 17, 2007, 08:52:27 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 17, 2007, 08:45:51 PM
I guess we are rooting for different teams, huh, ScotsFans?
TF_1973
Ya Think??? ::)

I believe Wooster has a date with these guys on Saturday.  That could be interesting. 

My golly, another 3 for OWU puts them up 21.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on January 17, 2007, 09:08:48 PM
The Bishops played a great game.

That tightens the standings up a little bit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 17, 2007, 09:27:30 PM
OWU website reports: BISHOPS 70, Wittenberg 48...So far my picks on the NCAC pick 'em page are coming true.  Can OWU pull off the double??

Now, will OWU have enough left on SAT for SCOTS that are coming in for a revenge game?  I say again REVENGE GAME!!  Remember last FEB.  Also SCOTS starters began rest with about 6:00 left in the game...Shoot, looks like OWU might have done the same.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 17, 2007, 09:28:43 PM
Obviously, I'm happy with the result at OWU, but considering that the Scots have a date with these guys Saturday afternoon, I don't think any gloating is in order.  OWU is obviously still very dangerous, especially at home.  The trick for Wooster is to make sure that they win the league, get to host the tournament, and somehow manage to make sure that Witt and OWU finish two/three in the standings (in any order) so one of them can knock the other off.

That's a nice doubleheader down there on Saturday.  The Wittenberg women against OWU at 1 PM, followed by the Wooster-OWU men's game at 3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 17, 2007, 09:29:38 PM
Final:  Wooster 111  Hiram 57

Wooster emptied the bench with over 8 minutes remaining as they totally dominated this game.  14 players saw playing time for the Scots tonight. :)

Wooster was led tonight by James Cooper with 21 points, Devin Fulk with 14 points, Marty Bidwell with 12 points, Jake Johnson with 11 points, Tim Vandervaart with 10 points and Brandon Johnson with 10 points.

Hiram was led by Michael McDevitt with 15 points and Brandon Pool with 11 points.

Wooster is now 14-2, 7-0 NCAC  :)  Big game at Ohio Wesleyan on Saturday!

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 17, 2007, 09:46:24 PM
Congratulations to the Bishops for the big win over the Tigers.  This victory certainly makes the NCAC very interesting and exciting.  Will OWU make it a double upset?  Only time will tell.  The upcoming game on Saturday is a must listen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 17, 2007, 10:14:05 PM
Earlham 57
Wabash 73

Zimmer went nuts with 35 points and 9 rebounds.  Nice to be back in the win column.  Wabash is on the road at Kenyon on Saturday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 17, 2007, 10:29:14 PM
All the 1/17 NCAC Final Scores:

Allegheny 93  Oberlin 68
Kenyon 73  Denison 70
Wabash 73  Earlham 57
Ohio Wesleyan 70  Wittenberg 48
Wooster 111 Hiram 57
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 17, 2007, 10:33:14 PM
NCAC Standings thru 1/17 Results:

Wooster 7-0 (14-2)
Wittenberg 5-2 (13-3)
Ohio Wesleyan 5-2 (11-5)
Allegheny 3-4 (7-8)
Kenyon 3-4 (7-9)
Earlham 3-4 (5-11)
Hiram 3-4 (4-12)
Wabash 2-5 (5-11)
Denison 2-5 (3-12)
Oberlin 2-5 (3-13)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2007, 11:30:44 PM
Final from Gambier:
Kenyon 73
Denison 70

I'll say this: Kenyon games are well worth the price of admission, and not just to enjoy that fabulous gym.  This one was another close, exciting, pretty well-played game, that came down to a three-ball from Shea McMahon that clanged off the rim to prevent overtime.  Kenyon had this one well in hand for most of the second half, but wilted in the last minute or so and let Dension up from a 14-point hole to almost tie it.  Denison was aided by some sloppy passing and inaccurate free throw shooting by Kenyon and one unbelieveably terrible call from the refs (DU guard absolutely rode his man out of bounds on a KC inbounds play with about :10 left; no foul, turnover.) 

The difference in the game from my viewpoint is that Kenyon has shooters (Arce, Jolson, Knapke, Haddox) and Denison has none (Luther hit some big threes down the stretch, and Ward and Eberst will hit a shot every so often, given enough chances).  That means that Kenyon has a chance to score whenever they have the ball, whereas Denison generally only scores if they can get the ball into Hodgkinson.  In the first half, they were successful in doing that (Hodg. had 19 first half points) and trailed by just two.  In the second, Kenyon denied the entry pass, and spent most of the half with leads of 8-14 points. 

Dan Hodgkinson had an absolutely beautiful game.  He was money in the paint (11/14, 25 pts.), grabbed six boards, recorded three blocks, absolutely shut down Kenyon's leading scorer, Bryan Yelvington (5 points, all from the line and all of them when Hodg. had been shifted over to guard Knapke), and was whistled for just two fouls.  It's too bad that the rest of the team couldn't do much of anything else.  Hodgkinson was 11/14, freshman Chris Luther, whose long-range shooting kept DU in it down the stretch, hit 5/6 for 17 pts., and the rest of the stiffs combined to shoot 12/35 (34.3%) for just 28 pts.

At the other end, with Yelvington reduced to a non-factor, Kenyon got a real balanced team effort with four players in double figures (Jolson 14 on 5/10 shooting, Knapke 13 on 6/10, Haddox 12 on 5/9, Klinger 11 on 5/7) plus nine points on three huge threes from Jim Arce.  Rebounds (KC +1), turnovers (KC +1), and assists (DU +2) were even.  It was a very good way to spend a frosty Wednesday evening, especially after having to sit through one of the worst halves of basketball I've ever seen (Wooster women didn't make a field goal until 6:08 remained in the 1st half--ick).

Box score (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x24426.xml)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 17, 2007, 11:49:15 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 17, 2007, 11:30:44 PMI'll say this: Kenyon games are well worth the price of admission, and not just to enjoy that fabulous gym.

Um, aren't Kenyon games free? :)

Quote from: David Collinge on January 17, 2007, 11:30:44 PMWooster women didn't make a field goal until 6:08 remained in the 1st half--ick.

Yikes!  I considered making that trip (among several choices that I passed up) and now I'm glad that I didn't.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2007, 11:52:01 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 17, 2007, 11:49:15 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 17, 2007, 11:30:44 PMI'll say this: Kenyon games are well worth the price of admission, and not just to enjoy that fabulous gym.

Um, aren't Kenyon games free? :)

...and worth every cent!  ;) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 17, 2007, 11:56:08 PM
I cant believe I have to root for Wooster on Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2007, 09:20:30 AM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on January 17, 2007, 08:54:44 PM

Billy Bowen got his nose STEPPED ON!  That sounds painful.  Apparently, there was no harm, because there was no foul.  >:(

Was anybody in attendance for the Witt-OWU game?  I was listening to the game when this incident occurred and from the way the radio guy called it, it sounded as if it was pretty blatant.  I could also hear Brown and Artie and the rest of the Witt bench expode after there was no call.  Either it was a culmination of frustrations letting loose on the Witt bench or it was a pretty blatant call that was missed.  Maybe if anyone was there they could share their thoughts on the incident.  Not that it would have changed the outcome of the game by any means.  It just sounded like a cheap shot by one of the OWU players, that's all.

As for OWU, I bet Mike DeWitt must be kicking himself when he sees his team perform as well as they did last night after rather surprising losing efforts to Earlham and Allegheny.   One could use the 'looking ahead' excuse for losing to the EC, but I don't buy that.  Championship caliber teams don't fall into that trap.  I mean, how does OWU lose to an Earlham team that turns around and gets it handed to them by Wabash??? 

As it is, OWU could be sitting pretty right now after that impressive win last night and instead, they are still only tied for 2nd now with Witt and still have a major hill to climb out of because of those two rather inexpicable losses.  Even with a win over Wooster on Saturday, OWU would still have to win at both Wooster and Wittenberg and then have some help along the way to hope to gain even a share of the regular season title.  And that's taking into account that the Bishops don't lose any more games they have no business losing which isn't out of the question by any means. ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 18, 2007, 09:34:18 AM
Especially when OWU kicked Wabash's kiester all over the floor a week ago. Basketball is a funny game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 18, 2007, 09:47:59 AM
ok guys, disappointing loss last night- ???i was in attendance-bout half full crowd there. the main thing is that wesleyan just showed up to play and completely put it to witt especially in the second half. As i said Ohio Wesleyan had to be contained from the 3 point line and definitely were not contained, and when Witt did have the perimeter defended OWU was able to get it inside for any easy basket. Witt just had no answer on offense as they shot horridly from the field, for one stretch they had no FG's in 5 minutes. Who would have thought that Rudegair would become a 3 point threat??

Next, in regards to that non-call on  Billy Bowen. There was a scrum under the OWU basket and what seemed to be a jump ball situation wasn't called but as Witt gained control and went downcourt a OWU player blatently stepped on Bowen and no call was received. The call that the bench erupted about was an out of bounds call which seemed to be deflectd off an OWU post player, but was called out on Borchers, and i think the frustrations of the game led to this boiling point, but Coach Brown would not let this go and called a timeout to give the official more of his thoughts and received a technical. Frustrating night all around.

As for SAturday it could be an interesting atmosphere at Delaware as there is the WItt-OWU women's game at 1 and then the Wooster-OWU mens game at 3. As i learned last night it is community night there (FREE ADMISSION), so im not sure what effect that will have on the availability of seating. thought?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2007, 10:13:53 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 18, 2007, 09:47:59 AM
As for SAturday it could be an interesting atmosphere at Delaware as there is the WItt-OWU women's game at 1 and then the Wooster-OWU mens game at 3. As i learned last night it is community night there (FREE ADMISSION), so im not sure what effect that will have on the availability of seating. thought?
They had community night last year for the Wooster game and they had over 2000 in attendance (Branch Rickey holds 2300).  I'm sure that the inflated numbers were both a result of a higher attendance of locals in addition to the high number of Scots fans that follow the team on the road.  Needless to say, I do remember it being a rather boistrous crowd and the students seemed to be really into it and they probably will be out in full force again after that big win last night.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 18, 2007, 03:27:14 PM
Given the current standings, what do you think it's going to take to get the #4 seed?  8 wins?  7? 

Who's got the advantage for that 4th seed?  I hate to admit it, but as far as the schedule goes, I think the edge for the 4th seed belongs to Denison.  Denison has but one game left against Woo/Witt/OWU (@Witt in a week or so) and 8 games against the rest of the league, all of whom are very beatable by anybody else in the league.  If Denison stays hot, they've got the inside track for a home game.  Who would have thought after Denison's start? 

Wabash may have one of the tougher remaining schedules of any of the #4 seed contenders (which is everybody, BTW).  Wabash has four games left against Woo/Witt/OWU as well as road games to Kenyon and Earlham left.  It would seem that Wabash will have to sweep the non Woo/Witt/OWU games to get to 7 wins and my guess is that the LGs will need an upset of one of the top three to get to 8 given that Allegheny and Hiram both have the tiebreak advantage over Wabash. 

7-9 or 8-8 is what we're shooting for.  It feels like we're the NFC West of D-III.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 18, 2007, 04:54:44 PM
i would analogize it with the AL East of baseball haha- you have the Yankees and Red Sox battling year after year and every once in a while you get a Blue Jays or Orioles compete and surprise and you have your Devil Rays who never seem to set their ship straight
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 18, 2007, 05:34:16 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 18, 2007, 04:54:44 PM
i would analogize it with the AL East of baseball haha- you have the Yankees and Red Sox battling year after year and every once in a while you get a Blue Jays or Orioles compete and surprise and you have your Devil Rays who never seem to set their ship straight

So who's the evil empire?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2007, 06:26:34 PM
Quote from: sac on January 18, 2007, 05:34:16 PM
So who's the evil empire?
Well, IMO, I hate both the Yankees and the Red Sox pretty evenly and I'm sure that the fans of the other AL East franchises feel the same way.  So, I'd guess the feelings were pretty much the same from fans of the other NCAC schools towards both Wooster and Wittenberg.  In other words, in the eyes of the rest of the NCAC, Wooster and Wittenberg are both the evil empire. 8)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 18, 2007, 06:34:14 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 18, 2007, 04:54:44 PM
i would analogize it with the AL East of baseball haha- you have the Yankees and Red Sox battling year after year and every once in a while you get a Blue Jays or Orioles compete and surprise and you have your Devil Rays who never seem to set their ship straight
but they always fall back in line come october
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on January 18, 2007, 06:38:05 PM
As an Oriole fan since I could walk, LOL! Man it sure has stunk to be us lately. I mean, if we could just have a winning season, that would be a start... unfortunately, we keep running against the brick walls of the two teams in the MLB that have the most money to throw at players. We haven't had a winning season in almost 10 years... which is scary, cause @ was in HS during our last playoff run! Gettin old! II guess its a good thing I didn't go to Allegheney or Kenyon (The NCAC schools I applied to) it'd be the same darn thing I've had to deal with in baseball only in my favorite sport!

So I guess the real queston is, where are Woo and Witt getting the money to throw at their players? :D :P 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 18, 2007, 07:03:17 PM
If you look at it from the perspective of post season success and curses I would think that you would liken Witt to New York and Wooster to Boston (highlighted by the ankle sprain to Bryan Nelson and the shot clock buzzer in the semi final game).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2007, 07:44:27 PM
goscots, you may be on to something.  Much like the Babe was traded to the Yankees to start the 'Curse of the Bambino',  maybe Wooster has fallen victim to the same curse due to the fact that our beloved Coach Moore is in fact an almnus of our bitter rivals to the south.  Mabye we could call it the 'Curse of Wittenberg' or something to that affect! :P :) 

With that said and all kidding aside, we Wooster folk can thank our lucky (or cursed ;) ) stars that we have Coach Moore at the helm of this program.  Even though he hasn't broken through with that elusive National Championship, the success and recognition that he has brought to the COW is definately worth it.   8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 18, 2007, 08:08:36 PM
Quote from: sac on January 18, 2007, 05:34:16 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 18, 2007, 04:54:44 PM
i would analogize it with the AL East of baseball haha- you have the Yankees and Red Sox battling year after year and every once in a while you get a Blue Jays or Orioles compete and surprise and you have your Devil Rays who never seem to set their ship straight

So who's the evil empire?


The correct answer is neither.  Both Boston and New York have won a championship in recent history.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2007, 09:32:04 PM
Let's take a closer look at this.

Remaining games for teams in 4-10 positions:
Allegheny (3-4): at Witt, Hiram, Kenyon, at Woo, at OWU, at Oberlin, Denison, at Hiram, Witt
Kenyon (3-4): Wabash, at Woo, at 'Gheny, at Hiram, Earlham, at Denison, Oberlin, Woo, at Wabash
Earlham (3-4): Oberlin, at Denison, Woo, at Witt, at Kenyon, Wabash, at OWU, Denison, at Oberlin
Hiram (3-4): Denison, at 'Gheny, OWU, Kenyon, Oberlin, at Woo, at Witt, 'Gheny, at Denison
Wabash (2-5): at Kenyon, Witt, Oberlin, at OWU, Denison, at Earlham, Woo, at Witt, Kenyon
Denison (2-5): at Hiram, Earlham, at Witt, at Oberlin, at Wabash, Kenyon, at 'Gheny, at Earlham, Hiram
Oberlin (2-5): at Earlham, OWU, at Wabash, Denison, at Hiram, 'Gheny, at Kenyon, at OWU, Earlham

Null hypothesis:  each team loses all games left with OWU, Witt, Woo, and all road games.  Result:
Allegheny 6-10
Kenyon 6-10
Earlham 6-10
Hiram 7-9
Wabash 5-11
Denison 5-11
Oberlin 5-11
So the only team with a schedule advantage, however minimal, is Hiram.

Hypothesis 1: teams lose all games to OWU, Witt, Woo; do five points better in home rematches; and split home/home with teams they haven't faced yet.  Result:
Allegheny: 6-10; compared to null hypothesis, loses to Denison at home, but wins at Oberlin
Kenyon: 6-10; loses to Earlham at home, but wins at Hiram
Earlham: 6-10; loses to Wabash at home, but wins at Kenyon
Hiram: 6-10; loses to Kenyon at home
Wabash: 6-10; wins at Earlham
Denison: 7-9; wins at Oberlin and Allegheny
Oberlin: 3-13; loses to Denison and Allegheny at home
I hope that adds up. ;D  If so, slight advantage to Denison under this method.

Hypothesis 2: Anyone who can pull off a win vs. one of the three top teams will have a leg up on the others.  That's more likely to happen at home.
Home games remaining with OWU, Witt, Woo:
Allegheny: 1 (Witt)
Kenyon: 1 (Woo)
Earlham: 1 (Woo)
Hiram: 1 (OWU)
Wabash: 2 (Witt, Woo)
Denison: 0
Oberlin: 1 (OWU)
Slight advantage to Wabash under this method, if you could call it a "method."

Hypothesis 3: On the other hand, your chances are a lot better against the bottom 7 than against the top 3. 
Games remaining with bottom 7:
Allegheny: 5 (ouch!)
Kenyon: 7
Earlham: 6
Hiram: 6
Wabash: 5 (and already a game out of 4th place--double ouch)
Denison: 8 (:o)
Oberlin: 7
So this "method" slightly favors Kenyon over Denison (because Kenyon has a one-game lead on Denison, and presently holds the tiebreaker.)

Conclusion:  I don't have any idea who's going to finish 4th.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 18, 2007, 10:22:55 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 18, 2007, 06:26:34 PMIn other words, in the eyes of the rest of the NCAC, Wooster and Wittenberg are both the evil empire. 8)

DING! DING! DING!

Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2007, 09:32:04 PMNull hypothesis:

I just had a flashback of Bert Barreto,  Frank Howland showing me JMP and Excel spreadsheets.

Wally, I need a beer.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 18, 2007, 10:49:57 PM
Made the trip to Crawfordsville last night and got nothing out of the trip.

Well, nothing except for this gem from Jeff Justus which I may or may not use as my signature for the near future.

During a timeout in the first half when Earlham had turned the ball over by being a bunch of girls on drives to the basket

"There's no energy. What is it with you guys? I don't get it. You win one game against a decent team and then you think you just have to show up to win on the road? Now I know why Bob Knight gets caught on film hitting kids on the chin!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 18, 2007, 11:17:05 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2007, 09:32:04 PM
Let's take a closer look at this.

You're too damn smart for your own good... ;D

Quote from: billy_pilgrim on January 18, 2007, 10:49:57 PM
"There's no energy. What is it with you guys? I don't get it. You win one game against a decent team and then you think you just have to show up to win on the road? Now I know why Bob Knight gets caught on film hitting kids on the chin!

Is there somewhere we can nominate this for Quote of the Year??  Anywhere?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 18, 2007, 11:31:16 PM
i think some of the quotes bill brown used during the loss last night would be considered bob knight terminology lol. he was def. not happy with the performance
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2007, 11:40:10 PM
How's this for parity:
Referring to my (for lack of a better word) "analysis" above, in the null hypothesis, a 6-10 team finishes fourth and hosts a first-round tourney game vs. another 6-10 team, which guarantees that a 6-10 team makes the semifinals.  However, in hypothesis 1, which is only slightly different (add 5 points to home teams), a 6-10 team finishes 9th and misses the tournament.   :o

8+ wins=4th place, almost for sure, but you'd have to go at least 5-4 down the stretch to get there, and that's going to be tough
7 wins=definitely in, and good shot at 4th; at least one and maybe two teams will win 7 or 8
6 wins=very probably in but probably not hosting
5 wins and below=probably going to Wooster or going home

In other words, every game is crucial for this group, and every buzzer-beating desparation heave could spell the difference between staying home to host a tourney game and just plain staying home.

In that scenario, I think I want a real horse on my team, someone who can carry a team to a victory that they maybe didn't deserve.  Denison, Earlham, and Oberlin (now that Spencer is back) each have a horse.  Kenyon and Allegheny have players who can step up.  I'm not so sure about Hiram and Wabash.

I'd also want a coach who is a good gametime strategist.  I'm not going to get into that, because I don't like to go negative ("he's a good coach and he isn't"), and besides I don't know enough about the coaches for the non-"W" teams to have an informed opinion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 19, 2007, 12:54:41 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 18, 2007, 10:22:55 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2007, 09:32:04 PMNull hypothesis:

I just had a flashback of Bert Barreto,  Frank Howland showing me JMP and Excel spreadsheets.

Wally, I need a beer.  :D

Oh man...an Econ 75 reference.  Now I need a beer.   :D

Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2007, 11:40:10 PM
In that scenario, I think I want a real horse on my team, someone who can carry a team to a victory that they maybe didn't deserve.  Denison, Earlham, and Oberlin (now that Spencer is back) each have a horse.  Kenyon and Allegheny have players who can step up.  I'm not so sure about Hiram and Wabash.

Let's not forget about Andrew Zimmer at Wabash.  He's unquestionably the go to guy for Wabash this year and as we saw from last night's 35/9 performance, he can take a game over.  We've seen some flashes of this from him in his first couple of seasons and he's starting really assert himself this season, particularly after Simkus took leave.  Zimmer is fifth in the league in scoring, third in rebounds, seventh in FG percentage, and first in blocked shots.  He's bringing it at both ends of the court and if he has the mind to put the team on his shoulders, I think Wabash can finish strong and get in the top half of the league. 

The point about parity is spot on.  Anybody from 4-10 in the league isn't safe from anybody else who is 4-10.  I think we're going to see some wacky tiebreakers pulled out to sort out the seeding for the tournament next month. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 19, 2007, 10:33:48 AM
yes it is great to get a 4 seed in the conference tournament and if you survive your first round game against the 5 seed who do you get rewarded with most likely? wooster-that doesn't sound like much of a prize if you ask me...........

It will be lame duck vs Wooster in the first semi this year and then Wittenberg-Ohio Wesleyan yet again
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2007, 10:47:01 AM
But you never know until you play the game. Every year we see a low seed in a conference tourney rise up and knock off a team that was supposed to cruise through.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 19, 2007, 10:57:34 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 19, 2007, 10:33:48 AM
yes it is great to get a 4 seed in the conference tournament and if you survive your first round game against the 5 seed who do you get rewarded with most likely? wooster-that doesn't sound like much of a prize if you ask me...........

Just getting to the semis for any of the 4-10 teams this year would be a prize.  Is drawing Wooster in the semis a good deal?  No, but when is it ever going to be a good time for one of these teams to play Wooster?  If you're going to win this tournament, you're going to have to beat Wooster at some point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2007, 11:15:59 AM
Anyway, your sole validation can't be just winning championships.  If it were, there'd be no point in having varsity swimming in any town not beginning with a G.

You play for the thrill of competition, for the pride in representing your school, and especially for the love of the game, manifested in playing the best that you can play.  There isn't a team or a player in this conference who wouldn't rather lose to Wooster and finish fourth than lose to the fourth-place team and finish fifth.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2007, 12:02:02 PM
There have been times when it's been a clusterflop between Kenyon, Oberlin and Hiram for the #8 seed, and I'm sure that each of those programs fought like hell to extend its season for one more game when all is said and done.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 19, 2007, 09:34:33 PM
With OWU defeating Witt on Wednesday they currently hold the distinction of having a winning streak against both Wooster and Witt.

So the trivia question of the night is - What NCAC school was the last team to do this? (I have the answer and it's not too hard to guess).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2007, 10:01:11 PM
Ohio Northern and JCU both have a current leg up on the W's, but thank the good lord the PBs and Streaks are not in the NCAC.  :)

As for NCAC team, I had to look it up so I won't say.  I will say that I thought it would be Team A, or maybe Team B, and it turned out to be Team B--so I didn't guess right.  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 19, 2007, 10:21:16 PM
I'm going to make a complete guess that the answer is Earlham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 19, 2007, 11:13:17 PM
Answer: Alleghany

Defeated Wittenberg  61-50 on Feb 26 1998 in the semifinal of the NCAC tournament

Defeated Wooster 66-64 two days later in the NCAC finals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2007, 11:34:57 PM
goscots -- actually, the Allegheny feat is not the last time that it was done by a NCAC team. :)

In 2002, Wabash turned the trick.  The Little Giants beat Wittenberg in Crawfordsville 77-65 on January 23, 2002 and about 2 weeks later on February 9, 2002 Wabash upset Wooster in Timken by a score of 76-62.  I attended that game and it was painful as the Little Giants completely dominated the second half.

That Wabash team included Joe DesJean, Brady Claxton and Ryan Short among others.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 19, 2007, 11:49:18 PM
Aargh - I give up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 20, 2007, 12:02:55 AM
Ha! I'd have never guessed Wabash. Maybe that's how I was lumped in with OWU fans.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 20, 2007, 12:34:37 AM
I obviously took the wrong time to go pick up my son and miss the 'contest' - I would have guessed Wabash (though, admittedly, it would have been a guess). :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 20, 2007, 12:38:08 AM
The problem with guessing Wabash is we've beaten Wooster exactly once since joining the NCAC. I didn't expect that lone victory would have come in the vicinity of a win over Witt. What were the odds?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 20, 2007, 12:45:59 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 20, 2007, 12:38:08 AM
The problem with guessing Wabash is we've beaten Wooster exactly once since joining the NCAC. I didn't expect that lone victory would have come in the vicinity of a win over Witt. What were the odds?

Well, I guess that shows that 'ignorance is bliss'!  I had no idea that was the Giants ONLY chance at the prize! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 20, 2007, 01:39:28 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2007, 11:15:59 AMYou play for the thrill of competition, for the pride in representing your school, and especially for the love of the game

I thought you played to impress the chicks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 20, 2007, 03:58:22 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 20, 2007, 12:38:08 AM
The problem with guessing Wabash is we've beaten Wooster exactly once since joining the NCAC. I didn't expect that lone victory would have come in the vicinity of a win over Witt. What were the odds?

Since we've joined, Wabash has gotten Witt/Woo or vice versa pretty close to one another on the January schedule.  Wabash has actually had decent luck against Witt at home...Wooster not so much. 

I remember that game in '02 at Timken...I was back home visiting family in Oregon and latched on to my dad's dial up in K-Falls, OR long enough to check the score and couldn't believe that Wabash won at Wooster.  Stunned would be an understatement when I read the story on the Wabash website. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 20, 2007, 08:17:43 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 20, 2007, 01:39:28 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2007, 11:15:59 AMYou play for the thrill of competition, for the pride in representing your school, and especially for the love of the game

I thought you played to impress the chicks.


No, that's why you play in the pep band.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2007, 10:12:35 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2007, 11:34:57 PM
goscots -- actually, the Allegheny feat is not the last time that it was done by a NCAC team. :)

In 2002, Wabash turned the trick. 

Yeah, I thought it was going to turn out to be Allegheny (a/k/a "Team A") but wasn't too surprised when I saw it was Wabash.  I'd have been very surprised if it had been any of the other 6, however, even OWU.

Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 20, 2007, 01:39:28 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2007, 11:15:59 AMYou play for the thrill of competition, for the pride in representing your school, and especially for the love of the game

I thought you played to impress the chicks.

excerpted from "My New Flirting Technique is Unstoppable" by Gregory Sager, available at better bookstores nationwide. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 20, 2007, 10:27:14 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 20, 2007, 10:12:35 AM
Yeah, I thought it was going to turn out to be Allegheny (a/k/a "Team A") but wasn't too surprised when I saw it was Wabash.  I'd have been very surprised if it had been any of the other 6, however, even OWU.

I thought the answer was probably Wabash (I know - easy to say now ;)), but I thought that if they hadn't done it that the answer might have been Kenyon from back in the Harless years.


Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 19, 2007, 10:21:16 PM
I'm going to make a complete guess that the answer is Earlham.

The last time that Earlham beat the Scots was in 1986 when the Scots were coached by Lu Wims.  Looking back at the all-time Scots record, I can't believe that Wims was only there 4 years.  It seemed like 10!



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on January 20, 2007, 11:16:27 AM
Here's a scan of the News-Sun article about Stomper Rozak:

http://zeke.phpnet.us/jan18.jpg

If the article appears too small to read, move mouse over the article to enlarge.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2007, 11:32:43 AM
I wonder if that official that thought Bowen was making the story up got to see the footprint on his chest after the game???  It's one thing to miss such a blatant act, but then to not have the stones to admit missing the call and turn it on the player that was stomped on saying he made it up?  That's pretty lame if you ask me! ???

I wonder just how DeWitt is going to "...deal with it" in regards to whether or not Rozak will miss any games because of this stomping incident?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scotty on January 20, 2007, 12:12:16 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 20, 2007, 11:32:43 AM
I wonder if that official that thought Bowen was making the story up got to see the footprint on his chest after the game???  It's one thing to miss such a blatant act, but then to not have the stones to admit missing the call and turn it on the player that was stomped on saying he made it up?  That's pretty lame if you ask me! ???

I wonder just how DeWitt is going to "...deal with it" in regards to whether or not Rozak will miss any games because of this stomping incident?

i see a sequel to "Stomp The Yard"...the NCAC goes uptown  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2007, 03:36:33 PM
Wooster's out to an early 8-2 lead in Delaware.  Both teams 0-fer from downtown so far.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 20, 2007, 03:41:23 PM
Halftime in Gambier:

Wabash 35
Kenyon 41

Wabash jumped out early, then got sloppy with the ball and let Kenyon get out to a decent lead.  Wabash trimmed an 11-point margin down to 6 just before halftime.  Wabash has a good shot here if they can take better care of the ball in the second half. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2007, 03:44:37 PM
Port with 8 straight and Wooster now leads 16-9 with the ball.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2007, 03:56:58 PM
Wooster has opened up their biggest lead of the game at 29-17.  Rudegeair and Jean both have 2 fouls apiece.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2007, 04:07:18 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 31  Ohio Wesleyan 25

Wooster seems to be playing good defense so far which has helped the Scots build a lead in this game.  Both teams also had a number of turnovers in the half.

Tom Port ran off 8 points in a row (2 three pointers) to extend Wooster's lead and he has a total of 12 points.  Brandon Johnson has contributed 7 points and Marty Bidwell has 5 points.

Ted Uritus and Ben Chojnacki both have 5 points for the Bishops.


GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2007, 04:12:28 PM
Not a good finish to the half for the Scots.  After opening up their biggest lead with just under 5 minutes to play, Wooster failed to make a field goal the rest of the way only converting 2 ft's as OWU finishes the half on an 8-2 run to get right back into it.  Missed ft's and turnovers helped OWU make their run at the end of the half.  As wooscotsfan noted, both teams are turning the ball over at quite a high rate which won't make either coach too happy during their halftime talks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2007, 04:19:11 PM
At the Half:  Wittenberg 34  Allegheny 22
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2007, 04:24:04 PM
For as well as Wooster and OWU shoot the 3 ball, they have combined for a sparkling 3-21 from downtown in the 1st half. :o  Wooster is 2-10 and Port has both of Wooster's makes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 20, 2007, 04:24:46 PM
Just under four minutes to play, Wabash has finally evened this thing up after getting within a bucket on a handful of occasions here in the second half.  A Kenyon turnover gives the ball back to Wabash with a chance to take the lead.  I'll keep a running log here of the remainder of the game. 

Wabash does score on their possession.  68-66 Wabash. 

Arce(sp?) rips a triple for Kenyon and the Lords go up by 1. 

Zimmer backs the ball down, scores and gets fouled.  Free throw is not good.  70-69 Wabash. 

Wabash turns Kenyon over.  Just over 2 minutes to go.  Root nails a three for Wabash.  Huge shot!  73-69 Wabash. 

Back on the other end, Kenyon gets fouled and shoots one and the bonus.  Foul shots are good.  73-71.  2:19 left.  Zimmer has four fouls which is important. 

Root drives on the baseline for Wabash and is fouled by Arce.  One and the bonus here for Root.  First shot is good.  Second shot is good.  75-71 Wabash. 

Kenyon has a look at a three pointer and misses.  Stephens rebounds for Wabash.  Wabash is working the clock here.  Andy Root nails a three for Wabash!!  78-71 with 1:09 left.  Timeout Kenyon.  Largest lead of the game for Wabash here. 

This is good time to note that Root has taken this game over for Wabash.

Back to the action....1 minute to go.  Kenyon draws a foul from Ryan Stephens.  1 and 1 for Kenyon.  Shots are good and the lead is trimmed to 5. 

Kenyon gets called for a foul trying to steal the ball away from Holtem on the inbound.  Holtem will have foul shots coming after a timeout.  First foul shot is good.  Interesting to note that Wabash is shooting free throws much better this year than I've noticed in the past.  Second shot is also good. 

Arce gets a shooter's bounce on a three pointer.  Timeout Kenyon.  80-76 is the score.  45 seconds left to go. 

Quick foul by Arce for Kenyon.  Arce, who is having a good game, now has 4 fouls.  Holtem makes the first free throw.  And he hits the second shot as well.  82-76 Wabash. 

Kenyon is unable to get a good look at the basket and shoots an airball out of bounds.  Wabash will have the basketball.  Timeout Wabash. 

Zimmer is fouled on the inbound.  Free throw makes here will seal it.  And of course as I type that, Zimmer misses.  His second shot goes down.  27 seconds left, Wabash is up 83-76. 

Kenyon pushes the ball upcourt, and draws a foul on Zimmer while shooting a three pointer.  Ugh.  Zimmer fouls out.  Three shots coming for Kenyon.  First shot is good.  Second shot is good.  Third shot is good.  83-79, 20 seconds left. 

Maloney gets fouled for Wabash on a play that looked as if the ball would be lost out of bounds to Kenyon.  Big break for Wabash there.  First shot for Maloney is good.  As is the second.  Huge free throws.  85-79, Wabash. 

Kenyon shoots and misses their three point attempt, rebound by Stephens for Wabash and he's fouled with 7 seconds left. 

87-81 is the final.  Good, good win for Wabash. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2007, 05:10:57 PM
Final:  Wooster 61  Ohio  Wesleyan 54

Great road win for Wooster as they take control of the NCAC race with a 2 game lead over Witt and now a 3 game lead over Ohio Wesleyan!  ;D

Wooster won this game with their defense :)...as they held OWU to a low shooting percentage and contained the Bishops top two scorers (Chojnacki, Rudegair) on the offensive end.

Scots were led by Tom Port with 18 points, Brandon Johnson with 11 points and James Cooper with 10 points.

Bishops were led by Ben Chojnacki with 11 points and Dustin Rudegair with 9 points.

Wooster is now 15-2, 8-0 NCAC  :)  Next game vs Kenyon at home on 1/24

GO SCOTS!  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2007, 05:23:51 PM
On the post game radio show, Coach Steve Moore described this game as Wooster's best defensive effort of the season.

Coach Moore also noted that Tim Vandervaart injured his wrist and is in a fair amount of pain.  Let's hope that the injury is not real serious and Best Wishes to Tim on a quick recovery!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2007, 05:41:52 PM
Nice win for the Scots today on the road and an even bigger win in terms of conference championship implications.  As wsf mentioned the Scots now have a 2 game cushion over Witt and 3 over OWU and they have done that by winning against them both on the road.  This win puts the Scots pretty comfortably in the driver's seat for another conference championship.

If you were to tell me that Wooster would only score 61 points, Cooper would only have 10 points on only a couple of field goals and Wooster would turn the ball over at least 19 or 20 times ( I didn't catch the final #'s), I wouldn't be thinking we would be talking about a Wooster victory, but that is indeed the case because of Wooster's defense.  Moreover, who would have ever guessed the that this game would turn into a defensive struggle like it did between 2 teams known for putting points up?

This is clearly Wooster's best defensive effort of the season holding the Bishops to just over 30% from the floor.  I had been holding out praise for their efforts on the defensive end of the floor over the past couple of games because of who they were playing, but with that effort today, I think it can be said that the Allegheny game was a turning point and Wooster has turned it up a ton on the defensive end.  I am extremely pleased by the effort put in by the Scots defensively today against a good offensive team in OWU.

Hopefully, Tim's injury isn't too severe.  It didn't sound too good from the way Coach Moore was describing it in the post game interview.  It's only two weeks until the next showdown with Witt and that would be a pretty significant loss if the Scots didn't have Tim healthy for that game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 20, 2007, 05:56:49 PM
Other scores...

Earlham 73, Oberlin 59
no word from Denison/Hiram
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2007, 06:04:09 PM
All the NCAC 1/20 Final Scores:

Hiram 120  Denison 117 (4 OT's)
Earlham 73  Oberlin 59
Wabash 87  Kenyon 81
Wittenberg 83  Allegheny 51
Wooster 61  Ohio Wesleyan 54

EDIT: to correct the Hiram - Denison score
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 20, 2007, 06:10:08 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2007, 06:04:09 PM
Denison 64  Hiram 32

Ouch!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2007, 06:11:47 PM
NCAC Standings thru 1/20 Results:

Wooster  8-0 (15-2)
Wittenberg 6-2 (14-3)
Ohio Wesleyan 5-3 (11-6)
Earlham 4-4 (6-11)
Hiram 4-4 (5-12)
Allegheny 3-5 (7-9)
Kenyon 3-5 (7-10)
Wabash 3-5 (6-11)
Denison 2-6 (3-13)
Oberlin 2-6 (3-14)

EDIT: to correct for final Hiram - Denison score
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 20, 2007, 06:12:34 PM
I think that Denison/Hiram score is from the women's game today. 

http://www.denison.edu/athletics/wb/wb07/denw0120.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 20, 2007, 06:25:05 PM
As others have said, the Scots put forth one of their best defensive efforts of the season today.  Actually both teams played very good defense as OWU smothered the Scots, particularly on the perimeter.  The Scots also worked the boards pretty well today, although they did give up some easy second-chance buckets.

I thought that Tim Vanvdervaart did not have his best game today, and maybe he just isn't back in the flow yet. He looked to be in a lot of pain leaving the court with an injury to his left wrist/forearm and I would guess that he'll be out for at least a few games.

Overall this wasn't the prettiest of wins, but they seldom are in Delaware. At the end of the day, though, the Scots now have a commanding lead and it will probably take a major upset for the Scots not to win the regular season championship again this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 20, 2007, 06:34:08 PM
Yeah you had the women's score.  Final from Hiram in four OTs:

Denison 117
Hiram 120
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 20, 2007, 08:00:43 PM
Notes from OWU:

Before the women's game started, the OWU men's coach, Mike DeWitt, wandered down from the top of the stands and began a conversation with DC and I.  At first we didn't even know who he was, it just seemed like he was an OWU fan, talking about Wooster, his team, and the Rickey Arena.  Heckuva nice guy, and the best of luck to him and his team.

Yes, Wooster put up a very good defensive effort, but a fair amount of luck was also on their side.  OWU missed lots of decent, if not great, looks from the outside (and some underneath, too).  Had just a few more of these dropped, this game could easily have had a very different result.

For the first time that I can remember in a few years, Wooster had serious trouble dealing with pressure in the backcourt.  OWU did it well, but much of its success had more to do with poor Wooster decisions.  Hopefully this was a one-shot fluke and is over and done with.

Tim Vandervaart's injury just might be pretty serious.  He was hurting, and it looks to be either a broken wrist or a bad sprain.  If they don't have him, even the road game at Earlham begins to appear a little dangerous.  And Wittenberg looms on the horizon, just two weeks away.

The less said about Devin Fulk's newly shaved head the better.  It did glisten well in the lights, although it had a spooky green tinge to it.  Who's next?  :)



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2007, 08:20:15 PM
Vandervaart was clutching an ice bag to his wrist as he progressed down the handshake line.  We'll have to wait and see how bad it is.  When he sustained the injury, trying to take the charge but getting called for his 4th foul instead, he looked more annoyed than pained, but once he got to the bench he looked like he was in pain. 

Box Score (http://bishops.owu.edu/owum0120.htm)

The defense by both teams was outstanding.  Wooster's defense has certainly improved since the Allegheny game.  They still gave up a little too much on the inside, where Rudegeair (6), Chojnacki (5), and Jean (3) were frequently in good position for offensive rebounds.  However, the Woo defenders did a good job getting a hand on the putbacks, as these three ended up with just 25 points combined despite those 14 offensive rebounds.  Besides the good defense, OWU was victimized both by some bad luck (shots rimming out) and some just plain poor shooting, primarily by Chojnacki who misfired badly on his 5 three-point attempts.  OWU ended up shooting a miserable 30.8% for the game, 12.5% from the arc.

On the other end, Wooster didn't shoot terribly well either, hitting just 40.4% (23.5% from deep), but except for Brandon Johnson's missed threes (0-6, ouch), they were the result of good perimeter defense by OWU and by good interior defense on Vandervaart and Will, both of whom need to be stronger finishers, IMHO.  But Tom Port had a great game, racking up a double-double as the game's top scorer (18) and rebounder (11).  Port scored his 1,500th career point in the first haf tonight; he's currently #5 on the Wooster all-time scoring list, and closing fast on his assistant coach Erich Riebe (1567, 1988-92).  Congratulations, Tom!  :) 

(EDIT: as noted below,) Wooster Booster and I received a surprise pre-game visit from OWU head coach Mike DeWitt.  While waiting for the women's game to start (OWU 61, Witt 51), Coach DeWitt noticed my "W" seat cushions and came over for a chat.  He didn't know who we were (other than Wooster fans), and we didn't know who he was.  We were just chatting away like fans, talking about Kenyon's gym, OWU's wins over Witt this week and Woo last year, and so forth.  It was a very interesting chat, he's a very pleasant man.  I also had the honor of sitting next to a member of OWU's 1988 national championship team for the game.  He told me his name, but it was so loud in there (and my hearing is so bad) that I didn't catch it.  I'm going to assume that it was Scott Tedder, so it can be my D3 Brush With Greatness story of the week.  :)  Whoever it was, he told me he had coached Devin Fulk in AAU ball, so maybe some lurker can figure it out and PM me with his name. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2007, 09:11:11 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 20, 2007, 08:00:43 PM
The less said about Devin Fulk's newly shaved head the better.  It did glisten well in the lights, although it had a spooky green tinge to it.  Who's next?  :)
Please tell me that this is not going to be a post-season trend like the head-bands.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2007, 09:14:21 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 20, 2007, 06:34:08 PM
Yeah you had the women's score.  Final from Hiram in four OTs:

Denison 117
Hiram 120

Sorry about the mistake and thanks for the catch Wally! :)  I have edited the final scores post and updated the post on the NCAC standings
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 20, 2007, 09:48:48 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 20, 2007, 09:11:11 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 20, 2007, 08:00:43 PM
The less said about Devin Fulk's newly shaved head the better.  It did glisten well in the lights, although it had a spooky green tinge to it.  Who's next?  :)
Please tell me that this is not going to be a post-season trend like the head-bands.

As long as its an extended post-season, I don't care how they cut their hair!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 20, 2007, 09:56:52 PM
4 OTs! WOW!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 20, 2007, 10:41:52 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 20, 2007, 06:34:08 PM
Yeah you had the women's score.  Final from Hiram in four OTs:

Denison 117
Hiram 120


so the denison hiram game...120 - 117 is that the highest scoring ncac game...if not...what is?




EDITED by dc to fix quote formatting
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2007, 11:04:16 PM
Quote from: gotigers on January 20, 2007, 10:41:52 PM
so the denison hiram game...120 - 117 is that the highest scoring ncac game...if not...what is?

Welcome to the NCAC room and D3Sports.com, gotigers!  :)

This game appears to me to be the highest scoring game of the season so far.  You can easily check for yourself using one of the many useful tools that D3Hoops.com has to offer:

Click here for composite NCAC results and schedule (http://www.d3hoops.com/conference_info.php?year=2007&team=mens&conf=NCAC)

As for whether it is the highest scoring NCAC game ever, that's a good question.  Maybe someone in here knows, or perhaps the league office will tell us in their weekly release (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mb.html) on Monday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on January 20, 2007, 11:05:59 PM
Sources have told me that Tim Vandervaart's wrist is definitely broken.  This could possibly be a career ending injury.  :'(  It is such a shame when things like this happen at the end of a career.  Let's hope for a speedy recovery for Tim and that the rest of the Scots can hang in there...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 20, 2007, 11:07:18 PM
Quote from: gotigers on January 20, 2007, 10:41:52 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 20, 2007, 06:34:08 PM
Yeah you had the women's score.  Final from Hiram in four OTs:

Denison 117
Hiram 120


so the denison hiram game...120 - 117 is that the highest scoring ncac game...if not...what is?




EDITED by dc to fix quote formatting

The NCAC website doesn't list records for just conference games, so the official conference record for the most points by 1 team and by 2 teams in a game occurred Nov 27, 2005 when the Scots beat Emory and Henry 150 - 101.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2007, 11:23:44 PM
Quote from: Kramer on January 20, 2007, 11:19:03 PM
Nice job Coach.  Another great coaching job!  Chase a feew more players away.

???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on January 20, 2007, 11:26:26 PM
Yeah I am quite confused by that remark as well....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 20, 2007, 11:41:12 PM
Quote from: division3hoops on January 20, 2007, 11:05:59 PM
Sources have told me that Tim Vandervaart's wrist is definitely broken.  This could possibly be a career ending injury.  :'(  It is such a shame when things like this happen at the end of a career.  Let's hope for a speedy recovery for Tim and that the rest of the Scots can hang in there...

This would just be too bad for Tim.  I do hope he will still be able to be a factor before this season is out.  If I saw it correctly, it was his left wrist, meaning not his shooting hand.  With a break, it seems to always depend so much on just how complicated the break was in terms of when or if the player can come back in a season.

Last year Evan Will stepped up and had solid games stepping in Port's place when he had his wrist injury.  We'll need strong efforts from him again coupled with increased time and contributions from Craig Elam to keep up the Scots' winning ways.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2007, 12:33:22 AM
Wasn't Kramer part of the "We Hate Ghiloni" axis last year?? I may be going on memory? But one of the complaints was that Denison had a lot of roster turnover, yet I looked and it wasn't really out of the ordinary for D-3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2007, 12:40:58 AM
Oh, and this is a MAN's line in the Hiram / Denison tilt:

04 Mike Staley......... *  6-14   2-3   10-11   1  3  4   2  24 15  7  0  1  59


59 minutes. 24 points and 15 assists. OK 7 TOS, but still over a 2/1 A to TO ratio.

And 59 minutes! Out of 60.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 21, 2007, 12:59:32 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 21, 2007, 12:40:58 AM
Oh, and this is a MAN's line in the Hiram / Denison tilt:

04 Mike Staley......... *  6-14   2-3   10-11   1  3  4   2  24 15  7  0  1  59


59 minutes. 24 points and 15 assists. OK 7 TOS, but still over a 2/1 A to TO ratio.

And 59 minutes! Out of 60.

If I had a vote for Player of the Week I know where it would go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 21, 2007, 02:44:35 AM
two key players from wooster and witt down for the year possibly in the same week-what did we do to the luck gods?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 21, 2007, 05:23:30 AM
pennstigs come on man. pretty weak
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 21, 2007, 09:03:59 AM
For those Scots' fans down here in Columbus that are getting their report on the game from The Columbus Dispatch - a couple of corrrections from this morning's article:
     1) Tom Port did not play center
     2) Wooster did not play zone defense

Other than that, it was a nice page-width article across the top of the main basketball page.  The article states that on Friday Coach Moore showed the team the tape of last year's loss at OWU to give them just a little more motivation.  I also agree that the key play in the game may have been Cooper's conventional 3-pt play late in the game to extend the lead back to 7.

If Vandervaart is going to be out for an extended period, or perhaps the rest of the season I would guess that the Scots will counter with Geitgey, or Elam, and Melick depending on what kind of size they want to present.  Either way somebody will need to step it up if the Scots want to make it to Salem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 21, 2007, 10:43:31 AM
After looking at the Wooster-OWU boxscore, which hadn't yet been posted when I relayed my notes of yesterday, it seems even more evident that the Scots were lucky, very lucky, to escape from OWU with their win.  They played very hard, if not always efficiently, but caught The Fighting Bishops on a night when hardly anything was dropping for them.  20-65 from the floor, 3-24 from behind the arc, and also only 11-20 from the free throw line.  Phew.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2007, 11:26:31 AM
Quote from: cmhscots on January 21, 2007, 09:03:59 AM
For those Scots' fans down here in Columbus that are getting their report on the game from The Columbus Dispatch - a couple of corrrections from this morning's article:
     1) Tom Port did not play center
     2) Wooster did not play zone defense

     1) Port does play "center" on the defensive end, but he's clearly a wing on offense.  He's almost never in the offensive foul lane unless he's driving it.
     2) Of course they don't; as "Mose" Hole might say, they play a "stratified transitional zone with man-to-man implications."  ;) :D

Quote from: cmhscots on January 21, 2007, 09:03:59 AM
Other than that, it was a nice page-width article across the top of the main basketball page. 

Here's a link to the article (http://www.dispatch.com/prep/preps.php?story=dispatch/2007/01/21/20070121-E5-01.html); I found it under "Prep Sports."  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 21, 2007, 11:49:32 AM
It would indeed be a shame if "Darth" Vandervaart is indeed out for the season.  Injuries can be tough to overcome especially when it is your most 'dependable' big that was playing so good early in the year that there was NCAC P-O-Y talk about him.  I hope he comes back...remember that SCOTS had injury issues going into the tourney during the Final Four season.

Also, good to see that Hiram and Denison made the front page of this illustrious website with an account of their four overtime thrilla ion Granvilla eventhough I picked Denison over on the NCAC pick 'em page. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on January 21, 2007, 12:53:23 PM
Witt JVs played OSU-Marion yesterday.

Marion's coach reflected about the 123 point loss to Lincoln in today's News-Sun:

http://zeke.phpnet.us/jan21.jpg

Interesting that  Marion's coach actually played in their games and that Lincoln's coach received numerous emails about the runup of the score.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 21, 2007, 01:28:33 PM
Quote from: Witt4ever on January 21, 2007, 12:53:23 PMInteresting that  Marion's coach actually played in their games

And scored 43 points in the two games! Wow.

Quote from: Witt4ever on January 21, 2007, 12:53:23 PMLincoln's coach received numerous emails about the runup of the score.

I like how he now wishes he'd never played that game. Hindsight and all...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 21, 2007, 04:12:18 PM
making an observation is weak????  at least spell my name right when you criticize me
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2007, 05:27:47 PM
As post season approaches, it is important to keep an eye on the regional win-loss records because that is one of the key stats used by the NCAA selection committee.

Top 15 Great Lakes Regional Records thru 1/20 results:

Lake Erie (AMCC) 12-0
Wooster (NCAC) 10-1
Hope (MIAA) 7-1
Westminster (PrAC) 10-2 (includes Marietta win not marked as in-region)
Wittenberg (NCAC) 9-3
Tri-State (MIAA) 6-2
John Carroll (OAC) 10-4
Bethany (PrAC) 10-4
Ohio Northern (OAC) 8-4
Baldwin-Wallace (OAC) 8-4
Heidelberg (OAC) 11-5
Penn State-Behrend (AMCC) 9-5
Ohio Wesleyan (NCAC) 8-5
Carnegie Mellon (UAA) 8-5
Calvin (MIAA) 4-4

Obviously, the QoWI rating for each team will also play a big role in the NCAA selections/seedings but I thought these regional records were interesting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 21, 2007, 07:49:24 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2007, 05:27:47 PM
As post season approaches, it is important to keep an eye on the regional win-loss records because that it is one of the key stats used by the NCAA selection committee.

Top 15 Great Lakes Regional Records thru 1/20 results:

Lake Erie (AMCC) 12-0
Wooster (NCAC) 10-1
Hope (MIAA) 7-1
Westminster (PrAC) 10-2 (includes Marietta win not marked as in-region)
Wittenberg (NCAC) 9-3
Tri-State (MIAA) 6-2
John Carroll (OAC) 10-4
Bethany (PrAC) 10-4
Ohio Northern (OAC) 8-4
Baldwin-Wallace (OAC) 8-4
Heidelberg (OAC) 11-5
Penn State-Behrend (AMCC) 9-5
Ohio Wesleyan (NCAC) 8-5
Carnegie Mellon (UAA) 8-5
Calvin (MIAA) 4-4

Obviously, the QoWI rating for each team will also play a big role in the NCAA selections/seedings but I thought these regional records were interesting.



so what is the QoWI and what does it have to do with the rankings?
also i've hard mixed reviews, i wanna hear from someone who was there, did wooster get lucky with their win or did OWU just not keep up with the scots.
i kno there not in the ncac but is ohio northerns quick start just that or have they just been a little bit of a rut lately?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2007, 08:33:59 PM
Gotigers, you've heard from several people who were at the Wooster/OWU game:  Wooster Booster, cmhscots, and I were there, at least.

QoWI is the Quality of Wins Index, a measurement (of questionable validity) attempting to add a strength-of-schedule component to the selection process.  As this is a (very) Frequently Asked Question, you can find out about it in the site's FAQ section (http://www.d3hoops.com/faq.php?category=NCAA%20Tournament).

I've done a brute force QoWI calculation for the top 7 teams on wsf's list.  (Tri-State is a provisional school and is ineligible for the NCAA tournament.)  [EDIT: added ONU per cmhscots' suggestion.]  Here's what I have:
Lake Erie 10.50...They have a 14-point win over Bethany, a 13 and 2 12's
Wooster 10.27...One 15-pointer (at Witt), two 13's and a 12
Hope 9.88...hurt by the weakness of the MIAA this year; 3 13-pointers
Westminster 9.25...weak schedule with two bad losses (2, 4) offsetting 15-point win at Bethany this week
Wittenberg 9.83...tough schedule: several good wins, and losses don't hurt so much
JCU 10.50...very tough sched. with a 14-pointer, four 13's, and two 12's; losses are 5, 6, 7, and 7
Bethany 8.71...lots of middling results, all games between 4 and 11 points
Ohio Northern 10.25...like JCU, very tough schedule, but two fewer wins.  Has two 15's (Woo, 'Berg) and a 14 (Witt)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2007, 08:53:02 PM
QoWI breaks opponents into four categories: 
* win percentage of .667 and higher contributes 6 QoWI points
* win percentage of .500 and higher contributes 4 QoWI points
* win percentage of .333 and higher contributes 2 QoWI points
* win percentage below .333 contributes bubkes

(On top of that you get a point for playing on the road, including neutral locations, and you get 8 points for a win.  That makes the maximum a 15-point win: win {8} on the road {1} over a .667+ team {6}).

Those zero-point opponents can really kill your QoWI, and have haunted Wooster over the years.  You can use these strata to take a very quick and dirty look at schedule strength. 


      Team            6-pt opps            4-pt opps            2-pt opps            0-pt opps      
   Lake Erie      1      3      3      5   
   Wooster      2      3      2      4   
   Hope      0      4      1      3   
   Westminster      1      3      4      4   
   Wittenberg      3      4      2      3   
   JCU      4      7      3      0   
   Bethany      2      2      7      3   
   ONU   5      4      3      0   
That's right; JCU and ONU have played NO 0-point opponents, and JCU has played 11 regional games against opponents at .500 or better (ONU has 9.)  On the other hand, LEC has played FIVE zeroes.  That's how JCU can have the same QoWI as Lake Erie, despite being just 10-4 in region vs. LEC's 12-0.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 21, 2007, 09:06:00 PM
thanks. i feel more knowledgable in the area of QoWI.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2007, 09:18:55 PM
So combining all of that, I'd say the regional rankings if released today would look like this:

1. Lake Erie (1.000 regional win pct., 10.50 QoWI)
2. Wooster (.909, 10.27)
3. JCU (.714, 10.50)
4. Hope (.875, 9.88)
5. Wittenberg (.750, 9.83)
6. Westminster (.833, 9.25)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 21, 2007, 09:22:46 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 21, 2007, 08:33:59 PM
Tri-State is a provisional school and is ineligible for the NCAA tournament.

To further complicate things, although Tri-State is a provisional team and not eligible for the tourney themselves, as a 3rd-year provisional games against them do count in the 'Primary Criteria' used in the NCAA selection process.

Here's a link to the DIII Men's Baseketball Championship Handbook that describes in minute detail every aspect of the tournament:  http://www.ncaa.org/library/handbooks/basketball/2007/2007_d3_m_basketball_handbook.pdf (http://www.ncaa.org/library/handbooks/basketball/2007/2007_d3_m_basketball_handbook.pdf)

David - Did you happen to calculate Ohio Northern's QOWI?  The loss to Marietta had to put a big whammy on their's.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 21, 2007, 09:33:06 PM
I heard some very bad news today, that Tim Vandervaart's wrist is indeed broken, and that he's almost certainly through for the season.  A terrible break for both Tim and the Scots.  They'll miss him badly, and will have to hope that one or two of the freshmen can step in and play maybe before they're quite ready.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2007, 09:37:13 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on January 21, 2007, 09:22:46 PM
David - Did you happen to calculate Ohio Northern's QOWI?  The loss to Marietta had to put a big whammy on their's.

I hadn't, but I added them to the above.  And you're right; their QoWI was 10.91 before they went to 'Etta.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 21, 2007, 09:37:29 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 21, 2007, 08:53:02 PM
QoWI breaks opponents into four categories: 
* win percentage of .667 and higher contributes 6 QoWI points
* win percentage of .500 and higher contributes 4 QoWI points
* win percentage of .333 and higher contributes 2 QoWI points
* win percentage below .333 contributes bubkis

(On top of that you get a point for playing on the road, including neutral locations, and you get 8 points for a win.  That makes the maximum a 15-point win: win {8} on the road {1} over a .667+ team {6}).

Those zero-point opponents can really kill your QoWI, and have haunted Wooster over the years.  You can use these strata to take a very quick and dirty look at schedule strength. 


      Team            6-pt opps            4-pt opps            2-pt opps            0-pt opps      
   Lake Erie      1      3      3      5   
   Wooster      2      3      2      4   
   Hope      0      4      1      3   
   Westminster      1      3      4      4   
   Wittenberg      3      4      2      3   
   JCU      4      7      3      0   
   Bethany      2      2      7      3   
That's right; JCU has played NO 0-point opponents, and has played 11 regional games against opponents at .500 or better.  On the other hand, LEC has played FIVE zeroes.  That's how JCU can have the same QoWI as Lake Erie, despite  being just 10-4 in region vs. LEC's 12-0.

Thanks for this post, David.  Your "strata" model helps make sense of the 15 different possible QoWI situations.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2007, 09:43:28 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on January 21, 2007, 09:37:29 PM
Thanks for this post, David.  Your "strata" model helps make sense of the 15 different possible QoWI situations.

Sixteen...don't forget there's a zero-point game as well (lose at home to a sub-.333 team).  Oberlin's been specializing in these games for years. :)
You're welcome.  :)

Tough news for Tim V.  I hate to see a career end off the floor. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 21, 2007, 09:56:24 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 21, 2007, 09:43:28 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on January 21, 2007, 09:37:29 PM
Thanks for this post, David.  Your "strata" model helps make sense of the 15 different possible QoWI situations.

Sixteen...don't forget there's a zero-point game as well (lose at home to a sub-.333 team).  Oberlin's been specializing in these games for years. :)
You're welcome.  :)

Tough news for Tim V.  I hate to see a career end off the floor. 

Yeah, I'll blame Wooster's public school system for teaching me to count starting with 1 instead of 0.   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 21, 2007, 11:28:52 PM
Nice work DC!

Lake Erie has a real shot at having an unbeaten in-region record which could bring up some interesting hosting issues.  Does the AMCC have a tournament, if so root hard for Erie, I can't imagine 2 teams from that conference makeing this region....ugly.


Let me also pass on my best wishes on a speedy recovery for VanderVaart, hopefullly he's a fast healer, and most importantly doesn't need surgery.  I imagine you might get him back with a deep run in the D3 tournament.  You've got 5 weeks of regular season and conference tournaments, thats kind of borderline for broken bone healing.......though I've never had one.

Interesting that both Witt and Woo have now lost important players, with some key games remaining.  Certainly might throw a little pepper into the NCAC stew.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2007, 11:33:44 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 21, 2007, 09:18:55 PM
So combining all of that, I'd say the regional rankings if released today would look like this:

1. Lake Erie (1.000 regional win pct., 10.50 QoWI)
2. Wooster (.909, 10.27)
3. JCU (.714, 10.50)
4. Hope (.875, 9.88)
5. Wittenberg (.750, 9.83)
6. Westminster (.833, 9.25)


David -- thanks for the good work on the QoWI calculations and your estimated regional rankings look reasonable to me.   k+

IF Lake Erie is indeed #1 when the first regional rankings are released, it will demonstrate once again the weaknesses and limitations of the NCAA selection methodology.  Lake Erie lost by 36 points (to Wittenberg) in the first round of the NCAA tourney last year and they actually lost 3 starters from that team.  Hard to believe that Lake Erie is that much better this year. :P

The AMCC is a cupcake conference and my guess is that Lake Erie would in 4th place if they played in the NCAC right now (behind Woo, Witt, OWU) and somewhere between 5th and 7th place if they played in the OAC. :o

I think that the contending Great Lakes teams better hope that someone in the AMCC knocks off Lake Erie before the end of the season or we may see Lake Erie hosting a NCAA tournament game(s). ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2007, 11:33:53 PM
This is why the QoWI is a sham and a fraud - by concentrating on records IN region, you can pile up the points by playing the decent teams of weak conferences. Heck, ask the NESCAC all about that!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 22, 2007, 03:39:01 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 20, 2007, 10:12:35 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 20, 2007, 01:39:28 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2007, 11:15:59 AMYou play for the thrill of competition, for the pride in representing your school, and especially for the love of the game

I thought you played to impress the chicks.

excerpted from "My New Flirting Technique is Unstoppable" by Gregory Sager, available at better bookstores nationwide. :D

Does that mean the ones where the patrons aren't all wearing trenchcoats?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2007, 10:56:08 AM
Lake Erie has a gym with a capacity of 750, according to the schedule page (http://www.d3hoops.com/school_info.php?school=Lake%20Erie&team=m).  I wonder if they'd qualify to host with such a small gym.

I'm not too worried about having to go to Painesville for playoff games.  Even if LEC runs the table--and they might--their QoWI may not get much higher than it is already.  They have 8 regional games left (prior to the AMCC tournament), and referencing the four strata I mentioned before, they are at these levels now: 4, 2, 2, 0, 4, 0, 4, 2.  That's 18 points, plus (8*8=)64 points for 8 wins and 4 points for 4 road games, total 90 spread over 8 games=11.25, raising their QoWI to 10.8.  That's if they win all of them, and nobody's level slips.  If they lose even one of these 8, the QoWI points slip from 90 to 82, which is 10.25 for the 8 game span--in other words, their QoWI (now 10.5) goes down if they go 7-1.

As you can see from looking at JCU and ONU, OAC teams can achieve higher QoWIs without running the table.  (Losing on the road to JCU is worth just one point less than beating La Roche at home.)  If one OAC team establishes itself, they should pass LEC in QoWI with relative ease.  Hope's QoWI will also go up, and so might Wooster's if they can keep winning without Vandervaart (as weak as the NCAC is, it's still stronger than the AMCC.)  LEC can't afford any slip-ups if they want to host a GL sub-regional.

I've actually seen Lake Erie this season, although it was quite a while ago.  They won at Denison 82-70 in late November.  I was not impressed; this is what I said on another board back then:

Quote from: David Collinge on November 27, 2006, 07:28:54 PM
Lake Erie.  An athletic team that never stops running, but plays in what seems to be an undisciplined manner at both ends.  They beat Denison but had trouble putting them away, despite a pretty pedestrian effort by the Big Red.  I'm sure the Storm is looking at another 15+ win season in the AMCC, and they did win at Rochester earlier this season, but I'm not too concerned about them as a national threat.

They're probably better than they were when they got embarrassed at Wittenberg, but I'm still not convinced they could reach the Sweet Sixteen, even with a couple of home playoff games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 22, 2007, 11:44:36 AM
David, thanks for all of the number crunching in figuring out GL QoWI's.  While that clears up a lot of questions, it also raises just as many in regards to why the NCAA can't find better means in regards to the tournament selection process and seeding.

Quote from: smedindy on January 21, 2007, 11:33:53 PM
This is why the QoWI is a sham and a fraud - by concentrating on records IN region, you can pile up the points by playing the decent teams of weak conferences. Heck, ask the NESCAC all about that!
Well said smeds! 

Quote from: David Collinge on January 22, 2007, 10:56:08 AM
Lake Erie has a gym with a capacity of 750, according to the schedule page (http://www.d3hoops.com/school_info.php?school=Lake%20Erie&team=m).  I wonder if they'd qualify to host with such a small gym.
According to Lake Erie's Athtics page, the Facilies (http://www.lec.edu/athletics/facilities/facilities.php) link also has their gym with a capacity of 750.

Quote from: David Collinge on January 22, 2007, 10:56:08 AM

They're probably better than they were when they got embarrassed at Wittenberg, but I'm still not convinced they could reach the Sweet Sixteen, even with a couple of home playoff games.
I glanced over Lake Erie's  schedule when visiting their basketball page and I was not overly impressed by any of their results.  It's not like they are manhandling inferior competition by any means.  And their marquee wins are against Rochester and Bethany.  Rochester isn't near the powerhouse they have been in recent years and Bethany is hardly anything to hang your cap on as evidenced by their less than stellar performances in the tournament the past few years. 

Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2007, 11:33:44 PM
IF Lake Erie is indeed #1 when the first regional rankings are released, it will demonstrate once again the weaknesses and limitations of the NCAA selection methodology.  Lake Erie lost by 36 points (to Wittenberg) in the first round of the NCAA tourney last year and they actually lost 3 starters from that team.  Hard to believe that Lake Erie is that much better this year. :P

The AMCC is a cupcake conference and my guess is that Lake Erie would in 4th place if they played in the NCAC right now (behind Woo, Witt, OWU) and somewhere between 5th and 7th place if they played in the OAC. :o

I totally agree wooscotsfan!  But, as it stands now,  unless some unlikely AMCC foe rises up to knock them off, the road to Salem may have to go through Painseville, unless, the NCAA deems their gym to be too small.  IMHO, I wouldn't be surprised in the least to see one of the true top teams in the GL have little trouble in laying waste to the Storm come tournament time no matter the location and exposing the QoWI for the imperfections it brings in the process.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 22, 2007, 11:45:42 AM
The topic of gym capacity for hosting got discussed a year or two ago (it may have been re: Bates hosting a women's sectional - whether or not the men's and women's standards are the same, I don't know).  The number 1,000 comes to mind as the minimum, but I wouldn't guarantee it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 22, 2007, 11:51:33 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 22, 2007, 11:45:42 AM
 The number 1,000 comes to mind as the minimum, but I wouldn't guarantee it.
I thought I had heard gyms need to be at least a capacity of 1,000 as well.  But, at the same time, I seem to remember hearing that gym size isn't a finalizing criteria.  In other words, it's taken into account, but a school with a smaller gym wouldn't be ruled out as a possible host because of the size of their gym.  I may be wrong, and I may just be making stuff up, but that seems to be what keeps coming back to me anyways.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2007, 12:01:37 PM
From the 2007 D3 championship handbook, page 7:

Site Selection
The Championships Committee has prioritized the following site-selection criteria for all championships:
1. Quality and availability of the facility and other necessary accommodations;
2. Geographical location (which may include such factors as rotation of sites, weather, accessibility and transportation costs);
3. Seeding; and
4. Attendance history and revenue potential, which shall be considered necessary to assure fiscal responsibility.
In addition, the men’s basketball committee requires each host to videotape all contests at its site, with the intent to make available to each team a copy of the contest in which it participated. The committee also prefers sites that will not host conflicting events during the championship practice and competition. Sites will also be evaluated as to the availability of appropriate practice times for all competing teams. To host first-round, second-round or sectional contests, a regulation court as defined in 2007 NCAA Men’s and Women’s Basketball Rules and Interpretations must be used. To host sectional competition, arena seating for at least 1,000 spectators is required. [emphasis added]

The 1000 "requirement" is for the sectionals (3rd/4th round) not for the sub-sectionals (1st/2nd rounds).  Painesville is well located and has ample hotels, restaurants, etc.  I don't know about the "quality" of LEC's gym, or their "attendance history and revenue potential," though.  I assume they have a regulation court, but that's not necessarily a given, as Hope didn't prior to the opening of DeVos.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 22, 2007, 12:21:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 22, 2007, 12:01:37 PM
2. Geographical location (which may include such factors as rotation of sites, weather, accessibility and transportation costs);
Painesville is also in the heart of Ohio's famed 'Snow Belt', so I wonder how much that would factor into the NCAA's decision. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 22, 2007, 12:42:40 PM
We're trying to get those early rounds referred to as regionals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2007, 01:27:35 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 22, 2007, 12:42:40 PM
We're trying to get those early rounds referred to as regionals.

I'll try my best with that, but for Ohioans it might be a little tough.  The Ohio high school hoops tournament goes "sectional" then "district" then "regional" (then state/final four.)  I had to train myself to call the weekend before the D3 final four "sectionals" rather than "regionals," and that was hard enough.  Having "regional" winners advance to "sectionals" is just counter-intuitive to me.  ;) :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 22, 2007, 01:31:25 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 15, 2007, 01:13:18 PM
Here's a list of those who have won this award this season; it might be useful for those thinking of post-season awards:
11/20: Bryan Yelvington, F, Kenyon (soph.)
11/27: Tim Vandervaart, C, Wooster (sr.)
12/4: Dane Borchers, P, Wittenberg (sr.)
12/11: Ryan Hollihan, F, Allegheny (soph.)
1/2: Markous Jewett, F, Earlham (sr.)
1/7: Mike Staley, G, Hiram (fr.)
1/14: Dan Hodgkinson, P, Denison (sr.)

Go ahead and add Wabash's Andrew Zimmer to the list as of 1/21.  Zimmer had a huge week as he led Wabash to consecutive wins for the first time this season.  35 points against Earlham on Wednesday, 22 more Saturday at Kenyon.  Zimmer shot 21-27 from the field for the week.  Worthy PotW numbers for Zimmer this week, and if you look at the list of who's won this year, it was Wabash's turn.   If you're not laying money on somebody from Oberlin or OWU to win this award next week, you've not been around the NCAC very long.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2007, 01:35:17 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 22, 2007, 01:31:25 PM
Go ahead and add Wabash's Andrew Zimmer to the list as of 1/21.  Zimmer had a huge week as he led Wabash to consecutive wins for the first time this season.  35 points against Earlham on Wednesday, 22 more Saturday at Kenyon.  Zimmer shot 21-27 from the field for the week.  Worthy PotW numbers for Zimmer this week, and if you look at the list of who's won this year, it was Wabash's turn.   If you're not laying money on somebody from Oberlin or OWU to win this award next week, you've not been around the NCAC very long.   ;)

I'm not sure if that's an announcement or a prediction, but if it was a prediction, it was a pretty good one. :)
http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 22, 2007, 01:35:49 PM
Ah, DC - here in Indiana it goes from sectional to regional to semi-state to state.

Of course, it all made sense when the world was right and true and just. Now we have class basketball and it makes me just...well...enraged...sigh...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 22, 2007, 01:51:46 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 22, 2007, 01:35:17 PMI'm not sure if that's an announcement or a prediction, but if it was a prediction, it was a pretty good one. :)

Don't encourage him. He'll keep predicting stuff.

Quote from: smedindy on January 22, 2007, 01:35:49 PMNow we have class basketball and it makes me just...well...enraged...sigh...

I've never understood this. Don't all the other states have classes too? What's the big deal?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 22, 2007, 02:00:35 PM
well if an oberlin player is to win the award they're gonna have to turn some heads. my prediction is dane borchers. two easily matchup-latent matchups this week. wabash doesnt seem to be able to matchup well and then denison in which he had a big game the first time around. him or ben chojnacki from OWU are my picks....

Lake Erie is a hard team to tell about since they dont play anyone comparitvely in our region. Kind of like the OAC in predictions huh? We had this same discussion with Lake Erie-"o we had a great year we can surprise people."

Let's see how the draw comes out first-there are way too many games to be played before we even start to talk about the tournament
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 22, 2007, 02:05:07 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 22, 2007, 01:35:17 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 22, 2007, 01:31:25 PM
Go ahead and add Wabash's Andrew Zimmer to the list as of 1/21.  Zimmer had a huge week as he led Wabash to consecutive wins for the first time this season.  35 points against Earlham on Wednesday, 22 more Saturday at Kenyon.  Zimmer shot 21-27 from the field for the week.  Worthy PotW numbers for Zimmer this week, and if you look at the list of who's won this year, it was Wabash's turn.   If you're not laying money on somebody from Oberlin or OWU to win this award next week, you've not been around the NCAC very long.   ;)

I'm not sure if that's an announcement or a prediction, but if it was a prediction, it was a pretty good one. :)
http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt

Oh yeah, I looked that up.  I've given up trying to figure out the thought process behind the NCAC PotW awards.  I'd have voted for Staley from Hiram.  I would guess that the biggest thing going against him this week was that he won just two weeks ago...the NCAC likes to spread the love with this "award". 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 22, 2007, 04:27:40 PM
The lore of Indiana basketball is that every school had a chance to win, and compete against the big boys. That's lost now. People really cared, and the sectionals were battles of pride - or watching to see if David could slay Goliath.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 22, 2007, 06:10:13 PM
I've always wondered how that change to class basketball came about.  Was it the powers-that-be at the top who made the decision on their own, or was there some complaining down below from the small schools?  Not an Indiana person, but always thought the old way was really cool.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 22, 2007, 06:40:25 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 22, 2007, 04:27:40 PM
The lore of Indiana basketball is that every school had a chance to win, and compete against the big boys. That's lost now. People really cared, and the sectionals were battles of pride - or watching to see if David could slay Goliath.

How often did David actually win those games?

I can see the point you're making. But I also see the argument that even the best of the small school teams has no realistic chance to win anything. I guess because I grew up someplace with classes it seems to make more sense.

Wouldn't that be like having one big tournament for the NCAA with D3 teams playing the DI teams? I doubt anyone would really want that.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 22, 2007, 06:52:51 PM
Actually no. L & M - so small it doesn't exist anymore - went to the Final 8. Oregon-Davis went to the final 8. Shenandoah and Argos went to the final 4. Milan won, remember. Cloverdale went to the final 4 - so did Bainbridge. It happened!

What happened is that the smaller schools wanted trophies in their cases. Oh, they SAID it was to make things fairer and reduce blowouts. Well, guess what? The good teams still win the trophies and there are just as many blowouts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on January 22, 2007, 08:02:07 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 22, 2007, 06:10:13 PM
I've always wondered how that change to class basketball came about.  Was it the powers-that-be at the top who made the decision on their own, or was there some complaining down below from the small schools?  Not an Indiana person, but always thought the old way was really cool.
My idle speculation would be about the same time they lowered the standards for the SAT. And well anything in general. Cause adversity has never helped anyone accomplish anything.  ::) :D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: realist on January 22, 2007, 08:21:10 PM
I grew up in MN.   In the early 60's (and before that) they did not have classes, but it does now.  In both 1960, and 1961 they had a team from Edgerton MN. win the state championship.  Edgerton is a town in SW MN and had a population of about 1,000.  It also had a public, and a private high school.
Yes, a school from a small town could win it all.  It didn't hurt Edgerton to have several players 6'6" plus, and the kids had played together since k-garden.  However, the point is well made it doesn't happen often.
On tourney site selection.  Think back to 05.  Albion in the MIAA hosted a sweet 16, and it had probably the smallest facility of the 4 teams.  Calvin with a 4,500 seat facility has hosted the sweet 16 once (00) in it's 4 trips to the final 4.. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2007, 08:43:10 PM
Quote from: realist on January 22, 2007, 08:21:10 PM
On tourney site selection.  Think back to 05.  Albion in the MIAA hosted a sweet 16, and it had probably the smallest facility of the 4 teams.  Calvin with a 4,500 seat facility has hosted the sweet 16 once (00) in it's 4 trips to the final 4.. 

Albion's Kresge Gym may have been the smallest of the four sectional teams, but it's big enough (1400).  I don't think site selection is ever made based on who has the best facility.  There's a go/no-go decision on the facility, and after that, the site selections are based on seeding and travel.  Anyway, Calvin (one of the teams at that sectional) was unavailable to host as they were hosting a women's sectional that weekend.

And please don't ask me to think about Albion in 2005 again!  :( :D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 22, 2007, 08:48:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 22, 2007, 08:43:10 PM
Albion's Kresge Gym may have been the smallest of the four sectional teams, but it's big enough (1400).  I don't think site selection is ever made based on who has the best facility.  There's a go/no-go decision on the facility, and after that, the site selections are based on seeding and travel.  Anyway, Calvin (one of the teams at that sectional) was unavailable to host as they were hosting a women's sectional that weekend.


Don't forget though the NCAA allowed a split session in the sweet 16 games to accomodate all the Calvin and Albion fans, both games were sold out if not darn close.  Thats not a normal NCAA operation, although I seem to remember a couple other sites getting similar treatment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on January 22, 2007, 09:36:07 PM
Is Albion's gym smaller than Alexander Gymnasium at Lawrence (a 2006 sectional site)?  That was the smallest gym I've ever seen a sectional at, and that includes Chicago's old Henry Crown Fieldhouse.  Video below...


http://europa.iwu.edu:8080/ramgen/news/IWU_on_ESPN.rm
(start player at 2:23)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 22, 2007, 10:01:24 PM
Q--they are remarkably similar, right down to the wall on the one side of the floor.  I think Albion holds a few more people though, but not many more.

http://www.albion.edu/sports/wbasketball/kresge.asp

There is no picture of the interior on Albion's site that I could find.  If you can imagine a gym in that building, you can see its a pretty small place.


Incidently the ESPN announcer at the beginning of your story is Matt Winer who spent a few years at WOOD TV-8 in  Grand Rapids.  He was assigned to follow Hope through its tournament run in 1996, possibly 98.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on January 22, 2007, 10:09:16 PM
The exteriors are even similar, sac...

http://www.lawrence.edu/about/tour/alexander.shtml
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 22, 2007, 10:36:59 PM
Of course, New Castle High School's gym seats over 9,000. Yawn....

Heh... ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on January 22, 2007, 10:59:22 PM
Kentucky still has one class.  The sixteen regional winners go to Rupp Arena in Lexington to play for the state title.  Its a really great environment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 23, 2007, 03:52:10 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 22, 2007, 01:27:35 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 22, 2007, 12:42:40 PM
We're trying to get those early rounds referred to as regionals.

I'll try my best with that, but for Ohioans it might be a little tough.  The Ohio high school hoops tournament goes "sectional" then "district" then "regional" (then state/final four.)  I had to train myself to call the weekend before the D3 final four "sectionals" rather than "regionals," and that was hard enough.  Having "regional" winners advance to "sectionals" is just counter-intuitive to me.  ;) :)

It's second nature for me, as in the old 32-team format the first two rounds of the D3 tourney were referred to as "regionals".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 23, 2007, 01:06:26 PM
Latest top 25 is out, and it's a mixed bag for the NCAC teams.  Wooster moves back up in the rankings, claiming the #3 spot.  However, Wittenberg, after their blowout loss to OWU, falls ten spots in the rankings to land at #16.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 23, 2007, 01:36:22 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on January 23, 2007, 01:06:26 PM
Latest top 25 is out, and it's a mixed bag for the NCAC teams.  Wooster moves back up in the rankings, claiming the #3 spot.  However, Wittenberg, after their blowout loss to OWU, falls ten spots in the rankings to land at #16.


but is that really a suprise? i mean i expected them out of the top ten. OWU "walked" (pun intended) all over witt

reminds me of a certain national championship game that took place on jan 8. ugh that was a horrible game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 23, 2007, 01:38:24 PM
This seems fair.  To me, Witt seemed a bit high at #6...The wins were there, but it just hasn't been all that impressive thus far for Witt.  The Tigers have needed a total of 4 overtimes to get by Denison and Kenyon this year...not exactly the stuff of a top ten team. 

As always, it's not worth using much time scratching one's head over the top 25's as the polls are pretty irrelevant in the grand scheme. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 23, 2007, 01:42:36 PM
very true

question...how do u gain karma? is that just something that somebody gives u for good comments? just wandering
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 23, 2007, 01:50:12 PM
gotigers -

You'll find the answers to all of your questions here:

http://www.d3hoops.com/faq.php?question=41
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 23, 2007, 02:20:56 PM
Witt's drop makes sense. I think a lot of people were just waiting for an excuse to downgrade Witt, because some of their wins were less than stellar. But they won, so they really couldn't penalize them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 23, 2007, 05:11:37 PM
i think the drop is rationalized certainly after their loss to OWU-after they prove themselves to be worthy again they will move up, however as we have been discussing the top 25 is somewhat irrelevant come playoff time. Their REGIONAL ranking is the one in which we should be concerned about.........

the osu beatdown is one of the top 5 greatest sports games of all time. its about time the buckeye fans were humbled a little
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 23, 2007, 06:37:26 PM
Do we have any definitive word on the Vandervaart injury?  I assume that we'll get an update at the beginning of the broadcast tonite.  I for one hope that it is not serious and that this senior can finish his last year on his terms.

Go SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 23, 2007, 06:57:03 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 23, 2007, 02:20:56 PM
Witt's drop makes sense. I think a lot of people were just waiting for an excuse to downgrade Witt, because some of their wins were less than stellar. But they won, so they really couldn't penalize them.
I totally agree.  I don't know why you would be surprised by their drop in the polls?  IMO, this was just a case of Witt being overrated, but no one could do anything about it until they took another loss.  And they not only lost, but lost in a big way making it even easier for the voters to drop them down to where they ended up.

Quote from: WoosterFAN on January 23, 2007, 06:37:26 PM
Do we have any definitive word on the Vandervaart injury?  I assume that we'll get an update at the beginning of the broadcast tonite.  I for one hope that it is not serious and that this senior can finish his last year on his terms.
WoosterFAN,

Wooster Booster posted the other day that he had word that Vandervaart did indeed suffer a broken wrist and in all liklihood is done for the season.  Also, in terms of listening for the broadcast, that would be tomorrow night as it's only Tuesday unless you enjoy listening to country music. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 23, 2007, 07:08:34 PM
Scotsfan, thanks!  I had a moment of panic there, wondering if as usual I didn't know what day it was and was missing the Kenyon game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 23, 2007, 09:13:12 PM
I think there's no doubt that Wittenberg's poll drop is reflective of not just OWU (who, BTW, did not rejoin the voting rolls this week as I had hoped they might) but of some of their close calls.  Plus their 17-point loss to ONU looks a little worse each passing week (although that doesn't seem to hurt Wooster's ranking much, but then again, nothing ever seems to hurt Wooster's ranking much.)  Wittenberg dropped further, in terms of points and poll placements, than ONU did, despite ONU going just 3-3 since New Year's Day.

Regarding Wooster's ranking, they've now been in the top 10 for 47 straight weeks, and in the top 25 for 70.  No current member of the Scots' varsity squad has ever dressed for a game in which the team was ranked lower than #14, and none of the non-seniors has ever been in a game carrying a ranking lower than #5 (they've been ranked lower than #5 twice in that span, but it was in the final polls of the last two years--#8 and #9, respectively--and they rehabilitated into a top 5 team before playing again the next season.)  Pretty amazing.  Now let's get a banner.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 23, 2007, 09:32:20 PM
The link below leads to a nice article comparing real life to reel life for the movie 'Hoosiers'. I lived in Indiana in 1966 when the local high school (Elston) won the state championship. Quite an event for the town. Back then there was only state champion, but as the article notes, Indiana switched to divisions in 1997. I lived in my current home in Ohio when the switch was made but I still remember the newspaper articles arguing pro and con for the switch.

Realistically I think divisions are a must. While it is a great story when a small public school goes deep into a tournament, I just don't think it would happen often enough.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hoosiers#Based_on_a_True_Story
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 23, 2007, 10:14:04 PM
"(although that doesn't seem to hurt Wooster's ranking much, but then again, nothing ever seems to hurt Wooster's ranking much.)"

I think part of this resilience is that fact that Wooster rarely has a 'bad loss'.

Here is the list from the past seasons:

05-06  Baldwin Wallace (Moses Hole - 2 OT), Wittenberg, @OWU (on Senior day), @Transylvania (NCAA)
04-05  Wittenberg twice (both at home), @Albion (NCAA)
03-04  Capital, Wittenberg twice, JCU (NCAA)
02-03 Kalamazoo (Moss Hole), @Wittenberg, Williams (NCAA)

You might argue that the Transylvania loss should have dropped them out of the top ten last season but we all know how big home court advantage is in the tournament (and why the Scots need to win out).

Other than that gamesI would say the double digit loss at home to Witt in 04-05 and the Capital loss are the worst. But 2 or 3 bad losses over 4 1/2 seasons is not much of a reason to drop many spots
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldknight on January 23, 2007, 11:17:48 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 21, 2007, 09:33:06 PM
I heard some very bad news today, that Tim Vandervaart's wrist is indeed broken, and that he's almost certainly through for the season.  A terrible break for both Tim and the Scots.  They'll miss him badly, and will have to hope that one or two of the freshmen can step in and play maybe before they're quite ready.

Sorry to hear about Vandervaart's injury. I was really impressed with him at the Mose Hole Classic last month. It's an especially tough pill when you have a team as good as Wooster's with a real shot at a Final Four berth. My sympathies to WooBoo, DC, ScotsFan, et. al. :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 24, 2007, 12:16:30 AM
For my two cents on this whole high school divisions talk, personally, I think they are a must.  Yes, it makes for a nice story when little David rises up to slay the giant, but in reality, how often does that really happen.  Here's a little perspective of why divisions are needed.  Last weekend in the little town of Berlin, OH (down by David's neck of the woods down yonder in Holmes County  ;) ) they have quite the basketball hotbed (especially the girls' team) at Hiland High School.  They are in the smallest division (Div. IV) in basketball.  The Lady Hawks are also the 2-time defending state champions in Div. IV and currently ranked #4 in the state in Div. IV.   Last weekend, they hosted arguably the premier girls high school basketball event in the state.  The Lady Hawks took on the role of David in challenging the #1 and #2 ranked teams in  Div. I!!! :o  And the result:  They lost by 25 to the #2 team and by 19 to the #1 team.  Even though they are clearly one of the top programs in Div. IV, it is also clear that they don't have the horses to compete with the giants of Div. I. 

The bottom line is that breaking the state tournaments down by divisions gives a heck of a lot more schools a shot at dreaming of a state title than the pipe dreams of becoming the next Milan or some equivalent of that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 24, 2007, 06:45:02 AM
Today's Wooster Daily Record has an article on Tim Vandervaart's injury.  Four to Six weeks is the call, with the Scots holding hope that he might be able to return for some of the postseason.  Click below:

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1515782
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2007, 10:50:12 AM
Alright, so who's giving Wabash a chance tonight?  I think there's two angles to play on this game:

- Witt is ticked about losing to OWU last week (although they've had a game since the loss) and won't be stopped

or

- Witt really isn't as good as we may have wanted to give them credit for, Wabash is playing much better basketball, and Wabash tends to play Witt tough at Chadwick so we could actually have a ballgame tonight

I think tonight is a big, big game for Wabash if Wabash is going to have a decent shot at getting their game back against Hiram/Gheny and getting that fourth and final home game in the tournament.  Wabash almost certainly needs to beat Woo/Witt/OWU for this to happen and tonight seems like the best chance to do so. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2007, 10:58:44 AM
Wittenberg has only won four games this season by more than 15 points: IU-Southeast, Oberlin, and Allegheny at home, and Hiram on the road.  Now, three of those were in their last five games, but still I think it's not unreasonable to expect Wabash to at least be competitive tonight.  I'll be very surprised if the LGs pull the upset, thought.

Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2007, 10:50:12 AM
I think tonight is a big, big game for Wabash if Wabash is going to have a decent shot at getting their game back against Hiram/Gheny [...] 
??? Hiram and 'Gheny are both big "L"s in Wabash's rearview mirror.  Since I know you know that, I don't understand what you are saying here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 24, 2007, 11:27:29 AM
One last thought - the attendance at the sectional plummeted when Indiana switched to classes. The gyms used to be packed, because it was neighbor against neighbor. It's all about the competition, and even the sectionals where they had one behemoth and several little teams, it was still full up because you never know, and everyone always rooted against the big boys.

It's not about winning titles or trophies. It's competing against the best. You play to win the game.

Now, not so much. Classes have destroyed the neighborhood feel. When you have to travel 60 miles for a sectional game, when the sectionals used to be just down the road a piece, it's lost a lot of luster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 24, 2007, 11:43:55 AM
I do think Wabash has a chance to win tonight. I also think Wabash has a chance to lose by 25. With the unpredictability of both Wabash and Witt, it's hard to say.

The scenario I see is that Witt allows Wabash to hang around and the Chadwick Crazies are in full force, and that will make some difference. I do think this recent winning streak by Wabash has given them confidence.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2007, 11:48:59 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 24, 2007, 10:58:44 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2007, 10:50:12 AM
I think tonight is a big, big game for Wabash if Wabash is going to have a decent shot at getting their game back against Hiram/Gheny [...] 
??? Hiram and 'Gheny are both big "L"s in Wabash's rearview mirror.  Since I know you know that, I don't understand what you are saying here.

What I'm saying here is that Wabash lost their one and only game against both Hiram and Allegheny which gives both Hiram and Allegheny the tiebreak advantage over Wabash.  In order for Wabash to overcome the tiebreak disadvantage, it will be essential that Wabash beats a team that Gheny and Hiram are going to lose twice to.  I hope that makes sense.

Quote from: smedindy on January 24, 2007, 11:43:55 AM
I do think Wabash has a chance to win tonight. I also think Wabash has a chance to lose by 25. With the unpredictability of both Wabash and Witt, it's hard to say.

The scenario I see is that Witt allows Wabash to hang around and the Chadwick Crazies are in full force, and that will make some difference. I do think this recent winning streak by Wabash has given them confidence.

Agreed, smeds.  I think Witt tends to be more susceptible to the upset than Wooster because Witt's deliberate style reduces possessions, shortens the game, and plays into the hands of the underdog.  Wabash will definitely be pumped up for this one...Witt games are always a big deal on campus and this is an exciting week on the campus of Wabash.  Hopefully Inauguration Weekend gets jumpstarted with a court storming tonight.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2007, 11:57:28 AM
I get it.  You mean "game" as in "game in the standings," while I thought you meant "game" as in "he got game."  I'm just so tragically hip, I can only think in hip lingo.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2007, 01:31:09 PM
Yeah, you've got it.  Had Wabash brought any game with them on the eastern swing, they'd not be in a position to have to try and get a game back on those schools by needing a win over Witt tonight.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 24, 2007, 04:23:37 PM
I think that Wabash senses some vulnerability in Witt, mixed with the fact that it is a long trip and is a tough place to play definitely puts this game on upset alert. Witt has struggled for these past 4 years playing at Wabash even with the very good teams (granted Wabash was better back then, and had K Coff). With all that said I still think Witt wins by 10-14 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 24, 2007, 07:46:59 PM
9-7 Witt over Wabash with around 12 minutes left in the 1st half.

Hasn't sounded too pretty thus far.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 24, 2007, 07:51:55 PM
Apparently the internet is down at the WQKT studios.  They said they are working on it.  So for now there is no online audio for the Wooster/Kenyon game.  Any updates will be greatly appreciated.  Thank you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 24, 2007, 07:54:11 PM
Quote from: WooMix on January 24, 2007, 07:51:55 PM
Apparently the internet is down at the WQKT studios.  They said they are working on it.  So for now there is no online audio for the Wooster/Kenyon game.  Any updates will be greatly appreciated.  Thank you.

According to Wooster's live stats, 6-5 Kenyon just over 3 minutes in.  But, those haven't updated in a while.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 24, 2007, 07:56:18 PM
Quote from: WooMix on January 24, 2007, 07:51:55 PM
Apparently the internet is down at the WQKT studios.  They said they are working on it.  So for now there is no online audio for the Wooster/Kenyon game.  Any updates will be greatly appreciated.  Thank you.

This surprises me because I'm currently listening to the web feed without any trouble.  Are you linking from WQKT or from the Wooster webpage?  The Quicktime link on Wooster's webpage is working for me, woomix.

Wooster is shooting lights out and it's now 41-13 Wooster 7:30 left.

Wooster's shooting 16-20, 80% for the half to this point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 24, 2007, 08:06:58 PM
Thank you guys.  I managed to catch the action at the 46-18 score.  I appreciate it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 24, 2007, 08:11:20 PM
Witt up 29-18 at half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 24, 2007, 08:11:40 PM
At The Half:

Wooster 46, Kenyon 22

Story of the game to this point has been Wooster's excellent shooting.  Unfortunately the live stats are lagging on Wooster's website, but Wooster easily shot above 65% for the half, and they also drilled 8 3-pointers.  

Kenyon has not been shooting well (10-27, 37%), so Wooster has turned in another decent defensive half, it seems.

Edit:  Wooster shoots 62% (18-29), a bit lower than I had thought.  8-16 on threes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 24, 2007, 08:12:21 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on January 24, 2007, 08:11:20 PM
Witt up 29-18 at half.

Thanks for the update jcwittfan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2007, 08:14:47 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on January 24, 2007, 08:11:20 PM
Witt up 29-18 at half.

Tight game for the first 13-15 minutes, then Wabash got pretty sloppy and Witt ended on a nice run to push the lead out to double digits.  Wabash is struggling hanging on to the ball (nothing new), is in some foul trouble, and is just 1-6 on free throws (mony of which were front ends of 1-and-1's). 

Not an impossible task, but Wabash has to play much more sound in the second half. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 24, 2007, 08:29:35 PM
It's clearly a night of runs in the NCAC.  Allegheny jumps out to an 11-0 start against Hiram (it's 40-20 now with 5 minutes left), and Ohio Wesleyan has jumped out to a 17-0 start on Oberlin (its now 34-12 with 6 remaining).  Ouch.

42-32 Witt about midway through the 2nd half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2007, 08:44:28 PM
~8:00 minutes left:  Wooster 75  Kenyon 42
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 24, 2007, 08:55:31 PM
50 Wittenberg Wabash 39 with under 10 to go

sounds like wabash is making a lot of young mistakes concerning costly turnovers and also sounds like they are mired in foul trouble
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2007, 09:00:58 PM
Final:  Wooster 89  Kenyon 54

Wooster stretched out the lead in the second half and cleared their bench with ~6 minutes left in the game.  :)  Scots made 14 three pointers tonight.

Wooster was led tonight by James Cooper with 20 points, Tom Port with 15 points, Brandon Johnson with 14 points and Devin Fulk with 10 points.

Very good to hear today that Vandervaart might have a chance to play in the post season for the Scots.  Best wishes to Tim for a speedy recovery! :)

Kenyon was led tonight by Brian Yelvington with 20 points and Korey Haddox with 15.

Wooster is now 16-2, 9-0 NCAC  ;D   Next game at Earlham on Saturday.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 24, 2007, 09:08:52 PM
Ok, Great WIN for the SCOTS tonite.  Good to see the combination of hot shooting and solid tuff defense.  I have a couple of questions.  I listened to only some of the broadcast and of course I am off campus in Memphis.

(1) Where is Dex Battista...only 3 minutes tonite?  Elam and Melick getting more minutes than the 6'8" much publized recruit.  Is he more a project?  What is the deal?

(2) Why did Elam shoot 2 three's.  End of shot clock situations.  He is 6'6" 240 lbs and should be in the lane.  Is the three pointer a legit part of his game?  Just wondering.

We need to get post play worked out before Wittenberg comes to town in a couple of weeks!!

Go SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 24, 2007, 09:12:15 PM
64-51 Witt wins at Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2007, 09:12:22 PM
Final from C'ville:

Witt 64
Wabash 51

Witt didn't play a great game tonight, but Wabash just made too many mistakes (turnovers and missed free throws particularly) to beat a good team.  Such is the life of a young basketball team.  Oberlin visits Wabash on Saturday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 24, 2007, 09:18:58 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on January 24, 2007, 09:08:52 PM
Ok, Great WIN for the SCOTS tonite.  Good to see the combination of hot shooting and solid tuff defense.  I have a couple of questions.  I listened to only some of the broadcast and of course I am off campus in Memphis.

(1) Where is Dex Battista...only 3 minutes tonite?  Elam and Melick getting more minutes than the 6'8" much publized recruit.  Is he more a project?  What is the deal?

(2) Why did Elam shoot 2 three's.  End of shot clock situations.  He is 6'6" 240 lbs and should be in the lane.  Is the three pointer a legit part of his game?  Just wondering.

We need to get post play worked out before Wittenberg comes to town in a couple of weeks!!

Go SCOTS!!

(1) Thus far there's no evidence that Battista is going to have a big impact with the Scots.  He's been a bit tentative and doesn't have the size and strength of Elam or Melick.

(2) Elam can shoot the 3-ball.  He was 2-4 from downtown coming into tonight's game, but took several 3's in the pre-season exhibition games, and hit a pretty good percentage of them.  However, with Vandervaart being out of action I'd rather see him work on his post-up game for now. They've got plenty of options from outside and need him underneath.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 24, 2007, 09:35:44 PM
Elam reminds me a lot of Bryan Nelson.  Nelson could stroke it from downtown pretty regularly as well.  I agree with cmhscots in that with Vandervaart out, I would rather see him concentrating on developing more of his inside game than lofting 3's.  I was impressed, however,  with how well he played on the defensive end of the floor tonight.  That was what impressed me the most in his game tonight.

As for the game itself, I like this defensive trend being put forth by the Scots.  For the 3rd game in a row Wooster holds their opponent to under 35% from the floor and it was the 4th game in a row they held their opponent to under 40%!  Also, Wooster held Kenyon in check from 3-point range holding them to just 20%.  The Lords came into the night shooting 35% from beyond the arc.  I'm very pleased to see this trend continuing.  Let's hope it keeps up!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 24, 2007, 09:43:08 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on January 24, 2007, 09:18:58 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on January 24, 2007, 09:08:52 PM
(1) Where is Dex Battista...only 3 minutes tonite?  Elam and Melick getting more minutes than the 6'8" much publized recruit.  Is he more a project?  What is the deal?
(1) Thus far there's no evidence that Battista is going to have a big impact with the Scots.  He's been a bit tentative and doesn't have the size and strength of Elam or Melick.

I would agree.  I saw Dex play for Wooster's JV team here at Wittenberg, and I was not impressed at all.  Maybe it's just having to adjust to the college game, but he looked, as cmhscots suggested, tentative - maybe even a little soft - and didn't have the greatest looking shot in the world either.  I'm sure that given some time to adjust he would be a decent player, but who knows how long that could take.



Solid win on the road for Witt tonight.  22 for Borchers and 21 for Gregg Hill.  If Witt can get that type of production from those two guys at the same time every night, this could still be a dangerous team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 24, 2007, 10:01:02 PM
Earlham wins like its 754th straight game at (the new and improved) Livingston Gymansium, beating Dension 80-60.

Jewett had 24 and 6, Henry added 18.

Nice to see Neil Collins back, adding 10 points. Neil missed the last couple games (including the loss at Wabash) because of a death in the family. Having a point guard makes a big difference...as does playing a team that never plays defense.

The NCAC's softest star had 20 to lead the Big Red.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2007, 10:12:48 PM
I'd say that Battista is the last big (well, tall; he's not big at all) man on the depth chart, behind Vandervaart, Will, Bidwell, Melick, Elam, Hershberger, and Tenenini.  He played extensively in the JV game today, and I didn't see anything. 

Elam's two threes were both early in the shot clock, like 30+ seconds.  I don't know why he took them, but they were decent-looking shots, and the game was pretty much out of hand anyway.  He spent most of the playing time in the paint.

Wooster played excellent defense tonight and put the game away very early.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 24, 2007, 10:24:53 PM
That was an ugly game. Both teams played sluggish in the first half, but Witt got it going behind Borchers and Hill later on. Wabash just couldn't shoot well at all, but Witt will do that to you. The foul issues were mainly fouls at the end of the game, but the refs were inconsistent, both ways. The same type of contact on one end drew a foul on the other end. Ick.

Borchers had a solid game, 22 pts, 8 boards, 3 blocks 2 steals. Hill gave the LG guards problems all night penetrating to the hoop. He had 21 points.

I wasn't that impressed with the way Witt handled the ball. They had just 7 assists (and I gave them a gift one, maybe) and seemed they just stood and waited for Hill or Borchers to get the ball and make a move. I think they're going to have issues later on in the year.

Wabash also needs to hit its free throws. 7-15 isn't going to cut it.

The good news is that Wabash crashed the boards hard.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2007, 10:31:49 PM
All the 1/24 NCAC Final Scores:

Hiram 82  Allegheny 81  (Pups rally from 22 point deficit to get win)
Ohio Wesleyan 96  Oberlin 59
Wittenberg 64  Wabash 51
Earlham 80  Denison 60
Wooster 89  Kenyon 54
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2007, 10:35:02 PM
#1 UW-Stevens Point lost at home to #8 UW-Oshkosh by 17 points tonight.

#2 Amherst has a difficult road trip to Maine this weekend, playing at Colby Fri. and Bowdoin Sat.  They'll probably win them both, but I've heard that it is traditionally very tough to sweep this trip to Maine.

If Amherst drops one of those games, and if Wooster can win Saturday at Earlham (a big 'if'), then Wooster probably would move back into the #1 spot.

And next Saturday, the would-be #1 Scots face Wittenberg.

Stop me if you've heard this one before...  ;):)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 24, 2007, 10:35:26 PM
Can I have a standings update, please?

My cubicle laziness has hit an all-time high tonight...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2007, 10:37:50 PM
NCAC Standings thru 1/24 Results:

Wooster 9-0 (16-2)
Wittenberg 7-2 (15-3)
Ohio Wesleyan 6-3 (12-6)
Earlham 5-4 (7-11)
Hiram 5-4 (6-12)
Allegheny 3-6 (7-10)
Kenyon 3-6 (7-11)
Wabash 3-6 (6-12)
Denison 2-7 (3-14)
Oberlin 2-7 (3-15)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 24, 2007, 10:42:31 PM
With Hiram's win, it's official...this is a crazy go nuts conference from 4 on back this year...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 24, 2007, 10:50:47 PM
From #4 on back???...this is the closest we've seen to parity from #2 on back since I've been following the NCAC (which has only been since '02, but anyway).

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2007, 11:08:38 PM
Paul does an excellent job keeping us posted on the conference standings here and in the OAC, but there's no need to wait for him (realizing that Billy had to wait an agonizing 2 minutes, 24 seconds this time ;)).  There is a standings page for each conference on this site, and it is updated as quickly as the schools enter their scores.  Here's the NCAC men's standings page:
http://www.d3hoops.com/conference_info.php?year=2007&team=mens&conf=NCAC

(Not a criticism, just a comment, pointing to other features of D3Hoops.com that some readers may not be aware of.  After all, I obsessively post standings updates on the NCAC women's page (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=726.msg660476#new)! :))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 24, 2007, 11:09:19 PM
Yeah, but at least you know that #2 and #3 SHOULD win over the rest. (Note: SHOULD). #4 on back...whatever!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 24, 2007, 11:14:04 PM
No, David, you really don't understand my level of laziness tonight. I would have had to put some effort into finding that, though thanks for letting me know. I usually just sift through the NCAC's terribly designed site.

How long does it take to add an 'L' to the Earlham women's record each night? Just add about six more now, they're definitely coming.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2007, 11:42:30 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 24, 2007, 11:08:38 PM
Paul does an excellent job keeping us posted on the conference standings here and in the OAC, but there's no need to wait for him (realizing that Billy had to wait an agonizing 2 minutes, 24 seconds this time ;)).  There is a standings page for each conference on this site, and it is updated as quickly as the schools enter their scores.  Here's the NCAC men's standings page:
http://www.d3hoops.com/conference_info.php?year=2007&team=mens&conf=NCAC

(Not a criticism, just a comment, pointing to other features of D3Hoops.com that some readers ay not be aware of.  After all, I obsessively post standings updates on the NCAC women's page (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=726.msg660476#new)! :))

David - you are quite right, as usual  :), but the key line in your post is....

"as quickly as the schools enter their scores."   :P

Usually when I post scores and standings, they are not all complete on this site at that point in time because some have not yet been entered on the D3Hoops scoreboard.

Like you probably do from time to time, I am pulling them direct off the individual team's websites, from wire service scores or in some cases, from webcasts that I have heard direct from the particular game.

Tonight, when I posted the OAC results on that page, 3 of the 5 game scores were still not posted on the D3Hoops site at that point in time. :)

NCAC posters should also know that David does a great job of updating the national Top 25 scores/schedules and you can read his informative posts under the "multi-regional" section, Top 25 page on this site.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2007, 11:47:06 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2007, 11:42:30 PM
Usually when I post scores and standings, they are not all complete on this site at that point in time because some have not yet been entered on the D3Hoops scoreboard.

Yeah, I have the same problem with the women's scores, and they're even slower than the men's (particularly Earlham, and Wabash hasn't reported a score yet this year. ;))

I was just thinking it'd be nice for folks to know that the standings pages do exist (and also include composite scores for the entire season), and they do update sooner or later.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 24, 2007, 11:56:57 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 24, 2007, 11:47:06 PMWabash hasn't reported a score yet this year. ;))

That would be the only undefeated hoops team at Wabash. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2007, 12:04:24 AM
Um, what???

I DO update the scores, David. THough I forgot to tonight...let me check to see if the SID did...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2007, 12:09:10 AM
I'm talking about women's hoops scores, smeds.  It's a co-ed thing; you wouldn't understand.  ;) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 25, 2007, 12:33:56 AM
i definitly picked the uw-stevens point loss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 25, 2007, 12:34:54 AM
not that it reallly matters....just thought i'd point that out.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 25, 2007, 02:43:23 AM
Any Wabash fan truly concerned about the standings this season needs a pill.  This isn't our year, it hasn't been our year from the get-go...this season is about getting experience and getting these youngsters in touch with the college game.  Holtem, Root, Brock...it's a solid nucleus.  Wabash will be okay. 

Now I'm back to watching my Niners destroy the Broncos in the Super Bowl on this NFL Films doc on the Deuce.  Greatest SB team ever by the way.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2007, 08:53:24 AM
Not concerned about the standings at all! I just find it intriguing that Hiram could host a tourney game!

DC - D'oh! Right over my head.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zu1414 on January 25, 2007, 09:02:26 AM
Long time reader, rare poster, but finally my Terriers have given me something to talk about this season! A four OT win last week and a 28 point comeback last night! The Gators led at half 53-25, which could have been worse had it not been for a late three at the end of the half. How many times do we see that shift mo?

Keep up the good work Terriers, nice road win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 25, 2007, 11:06:17 AM
A Hiram poster???????? well that's a refreshing thing to hear. Great win for them last night, maybe jscwittfan jinxed them earlier in the night......

Good win for Witt last night. As i said it would come down to Borchers controlling the paint as he did and the youthfulness of WAbash was a factor as well. Ultimately as i listened to the game online it sounded like Wabash dug themselves a hole and kept fighting to close the hole-Zimmer played well in doing that-but could never quite hurdle the hill.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 25, 2007, 11:07:26 AM
Welcome to the board zu1414!  Seeing as how you have been a long time reader, you know how much we long to have some opinions from other teams in here. :)

All I can say about that win over Allegheny is WOW!  To overcome a 28 point deficit is amazing in and of itself, but to do it on the road is quite a feat. 

It looks like that Coach Flemming is really insitilling a new attitude among his players there.  After pulling off the upset wins over Earlham and Wabash, things were definately looking up for the Terriers only to be sent crashing back to reality by losing their next 3 including their thumping by Wooster.  But, I have to say, the way Hiram has responded by reeling off 2 wins in a row and in the way they have gone about winning those games is quite impressive to say the least.  Now, Hiram is in the unthinkable position of once again challenging for that 4 seed in the NCAC tournament and actually getting to HOST an NCAC game in the post-season.  I'm sure when the season started, many would have argued whether or not Hiram would even MAKE the post-season tournament, let alone HOST a game. 

Well done job by Coach Flemming and his players and staff so far this season.  And also, once again, welcome zu1414 and I hope you become a regular contributor in addition to already being a regular reader!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 25, 2007, 11:56:42 AM
Quote from: gotigers on January 25, 2007, 12:33:56 AM
i definitly picked the uw-stevens point loss.
Dude, you should be more proud of the fact that you picked the Hiram upset in Meadville! ;)  You were the only one on the Pick 'Em Board to get that one right.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on January 25, 2007, 12:43:30 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 25, 2007, 11:06:17 AM
A Hiram poster???????? well that's a refreshing thing to hear.

Hiram is one of the three NCAC schools I visited when applying to colleges (the others being Kenyon and Allegheney). If I remember correctly they only have about 800 students? It seems unlikely with those low numbers that we'd ever get a ton of Hiram posters anyway... but it's nice to know that there is one!

A big huge welcome zu1414! Please stick around!!! Even when a team isn't in the Top 25 or the top of their respective league, the truly obsessive among us still like to know why. Your team doesn't have to be doing well for you to post at all. Some of our best known posters support teams that have been dreadfully awful in the last few years (Gregory Sager comes to mind, though obviously his team's fortunes are changing dramatically!) , but it's still interesting to read their posts! :)

Odd, I just realized that I've been to almost all the NCAC schools.... Wooster, Witt, Denison for basketball games, Wabash for football, and Allegheney, Kenyon, Hiram for perspective student visits... weird! I've seen as many NCAC schools as I've seen CCIW schools!  ??? :o :-X
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 25, 2007, 01:15:41 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on January 25, 2007, 12:43:30 PM
Your team doesn't have to be doing well for you to post at all.

I echo this sentiment, zuzu. Welcome to the board.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2007, 01:17:49 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on January 25, 2007, 12:43:30 PMOdd, I just realized that I've been to almost all the NCAC schools.... Wooster, Witt, Denison for basketball games, Wabash for football, and Allegheney, Kenyon, Hiram for perspective student visits... weird!

I've been to exactly zero. I graduated before Wabash joined the NCAC.

Quote from: zu1414 on January 25, 2007, 09:02:26 AMLong time reader, rare poster, but finally my Terriers have given me something to talk about this season!

I also want to welcome zu1414. And extend an invite to join the party when football season rolls around, too.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2007, 01:46:51 PM
I'll join in extending the cyberhand of welcome to our newest and bestest Hiram buddy.  Zu, if you have any friends in Meadville, Oberlin, Delaware, Gambier, or Granville, by all means give them a call and ask them to join us as well.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 25, 2007, 08:16:35 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 25, 2007, 11:56:42 AM
Quote from: gotigers on January 25, 2007, 12:33:56 AM
i definitly picked the uw-stevens point loss.
Dude, you should be more proud of the fact that you picked the Hiram upset in Meadville! ;)  You were the only one on the Pick 'Em Board to get that one right.

i didnt even realize i picked that win...i guess its just a gift...lol jk jk

welcome zu.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zu1414 on January 25, 2007, 10:11:09 PM
WOW! What a welcome! I will post some thoughts on the Terriers more often. Hiram's enrollment usually hovers around 900-1,000, but it has grown recently.
Coach Fleming has added new life in the program. Insiders tell me that many wish he would have suceeded Steve Minton (SUNY-Geneseo) long ago.
To host a tournament game is quit a step. If this happens I may drive up for the game from North Carolina.

I am at the mercy of SIDs, the few newspapers that cover the NCAC and word of mouth living here in the south. I love reading the board, and I promise to make a better effort posting.

As a recent alum, I remember the Terriers going on quit a run, or at least putting forth a good effort in their first season of NCAC play. I think the team went 14-11 that year and finsihed sixth, maybe through tiebreakers. I have been telling people for years Hiram could be a great program, yes the school is small, but we all know thats not all that important in bball. Football, though, seems to be a different story.

Big game Saturday! Thanks again for the warm welcome...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 26, 2007, 12:02:46 AM
That was a great welcome. I dont remember getting that kind of treatment when I came on a few weeks ago, but ya know. Go Tigers
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 26, 2007, 12:08:54 AM
Quote from: WillieBrown on January 26, 2007, 12:02:46 AMGo Tigers

I see your problem here.... :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 26, 2007, 12:29:42 AM
Quote from: zu1414 on January 25, 2007, 10:11:09 PM
WOW! What a welcome! I will post some thoughts on the Terriers more often. Hiram's enrollment usually hovers around 900-1,000, but it has grown recently.

870 full time undergrads according to the numbers filed with the federal government.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 26, 2007, 11:12:48 AM
well, this weekend bearing some unforseeable upsets seems to be just a setup for the slate of games that we have next week. Wittenberg should pull off a relatively easy win at home, as we have not been tested at home this year besides the wooster game. I still am going with my prediction if Borchers has a huge game again he gets POW honors for time number 2
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2007, 12:15:56 PM
I'm grateful to each and every one of you for posting here.  Everyone adds to the conversation and makes out support for our teams and conference that much more vibrant.  However, I'm a wee bit more thankful when we hear from a new voice supporting a school that otherwise gets no support here; hence the warmer welcome for Zu than for some of our new Witt friends.  I admit to being remiss in saying thanks to the Witt crew, who for years has been represented mostly by Witt4Ever all alone.  It's much better (IMO) to have a full-throated Witt contingent like we have finally achieved this year.  So thanks Willie, gotigers, Pete, 1973, tigerup97, pennstghs, jscwittfan, and anyone else I may have overlooked.  :)

Now if we could only get support for OWU, 'Gheny, and Oberlin, as well as Kenyon and Denison beyond what feeble support I can provide for these two neighborhood schools, I'd be truly happy.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on January 26, 2007, 04:21:37 PM
when  witt and wooster  play next week    what is the radio station  number for i could listen to the  game please
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2007, 05:08:40 PM
Quote from: hope1 on January 26, 2007, 04:21:37 PM
when  witt and wooster  play next week    what is the radio station  number for i could listen to the  game please

In the Wooster area:
WQKT 104.5 FM or via the web at WQKT.com (http://wqkt.com/) or Wooster.edu (http://www.wooster.edu/interactive/)

In the Springfield area:
WUSO 89.1 FM or via the web at Wittenberg.edu (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/index.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DenisonFan on January 26, 2007, 05:14:19 PM
Like ZU11414 I have loved reading all the various comments by the dedicated followers of the NCAC.

If David Collinge doesn't work for SI or ESPN he should.  His recaps are nothing short of amazing.

Since ZU took the plunge I would like to do the same.

I attend almost all home games at Denison and venture rarely to away venues but I would like to give my 2 cents on this season.

I think it can be somed up in three words:  Defense Turn Overs

Defense:  Denison doesn't play any..........period.

Turn Overs:  They have made it an art form.  At an average of 17 a game you don't beat very many teams.

I think they have talent.  Hodgkinson is certainly a star in this league.  He has been his whole career.  But he does not like to bang anyone.   
Izzo is a very good player.  Clearly the best defender on the team but is not consistant from game to game with his scoring. 

The entire guard crew is limited in what they can do.  Coach Ghiloni has tried every combination he can think of and nothing seems to work.

I like McMahon...I think he has an excellent shot but for some reason he started out like a house on fire and has lost it.  Hopefully he can find his stroke before the season ends.  They need him to score.

Luther, the freshman, has shown promise of late and I think he can be a huge contributer.

The problem is the outside shooting is terrible.  Teams know it and almost hope they will shoot 3's.  So all Denison sees is zone defenses hoping Denison will take the long shot.  Hitting at less than 30% odds are it isn't going in.

I don't have an answer for it.  I think defense can make up for a lot but they don't play it.  I don't know why. 

I would also like to comment on the officiating. Not as an excuse, I really think it has been AWFUL.  Most of these guys should be doing high school freshman girls games.  I have seen games that were truly unbelievable.   And it not just against Denison, every team has fallen victim to these guys and it really takes away from the game.  I know others have mentioned it and I agree 100%.  I have no answer for it but it is a shame the players have to be subjected to guys who have NO CLUE what they are doing and have determined the outcome of games.

I am hoping they can get it together and win a few games and get into the tournament.  Saturday at Witt would be a good start but I think that is a bit of a stretch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2007, 05:43:27 PM
Welcome back, BigRedFan, and thanks for the complement.  Of course, I despise ESPN and have been boycotting Sports Illustrated for about 20 years, but I appreciate the thought.  If only I could work for NBCSports.com... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2007, 05:52:20 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 26, 2007, 05:08:40 PM
Quote from: hope1 on January 26, 2007, 04:21:37 PM
when  witt and wooster  play next week    what is the radio station  number for i could listen to the  game please

In the Wooster area:
WQKT 104.5 FM or via the web at WQKT.com (http://wqkt.com/) or Wooster.edu (http://www.wooster.edu/interactive/)

In the Springfield area:
WUSO 89.1 FM or via the web at Wittenberg.edu (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/index.html)

I see from the schedule page at Wooster.edu (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/schedule.php) that there will be a free live video feed as well.  I'm not sure exactly how that's going to work, but you'll be able to access it from that page.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 26, 2007, 10:39:50 PM
Long-time no post.   Only game I have seen this year was the Wabash game, and Earlham showed up as much as the WabasH student body.  *not counting the drunk guy that the police put in the back seat of their cruiser!!  Highly dissappointed to see the WaBasH student body being fair weather fans... the fans looked like Lil' GiaNts

Needless to say I hope I'm not bad luck, because i'll be making the trip to Richmond tomorrow.   I think this might be my 20th attempt at (playing or attending) a Wooster/Earlham Men's college basketball game.   Sorry to read about TiM, but hopefully Earlham can give the Scots a run for their money.

(not like they don't have 12 deep on their roster anyways)

To all the Scot Fan's making the trip over have a safe and enjoyable experience... I hope the drive back isn't as enjoyable as the drive there!   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on January 27, 2007, 10:30:49 AM
bigredfan...I'll second your opinion on the refs in d3...Having been to a few games at Wabash and listening to different school sites playing Wabash (I like to get the enemy perspective when possible) and attending CCIW games at North Park (close to home)...IMO the refs in high school call a more consistent game and the game is just as fast (at least around here) as it is in the NCAC/CCIW.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 27, 2007, 03:48:39 PM
At the Half:  Earlham 29  Wooster 27

This game got off to a slow start as Wooster only made 2 of their first 12 shots and they trailed 14-8.  Earlham is playing a deliberate game offensively and a zone defense to slow the tempo.

Devin Fulk leads Wooster with 11 points (3 three pointers), Tom Port has 5 points and James Cooper has added 4 points.

For Earlham, Tristian Gregory has 10 points and Markous Jewett has added 8 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 27, 2007, 04:23:35 PM
9:01 remaining:   Wooster 50  Earlham 34

Wooster went on a 23-5 run to start the 2nd half and they have taken control of this game. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 27, 2007, 04:31:16 PM
Wooster struggles to a season-low 27 points in the first half (although they have taken control in the 2nd, as wsf has pointed out).  In the meantime, Wittenberg is rolling the scoreboard like a pinball machine; they lead Denison 30-18 with 7:00 remaining in the 1st.

The world's turned upside down.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 27, 2007, 04:33:21 PM
Can anyone say 2nd half adjustments??? 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 27, 2007, 04:39:22 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 27, 2007, 04:23:35 PM
9:01 remaining:   Wooster 50  Earlham 34

Wooster went on a 23-5 run to start the 2nd half and they have taken control of this game. :)

For whatever reason, it seems like the Scots just can't put together two good halves when they play in Richmond.  Fortunately one good half has been enough to win yet again this year. I don't remember the exact record, but I know that Coach Moore's Scots' teams have never lost to Earlham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 27, 2007, 04:39:27 PM
Final:  Wooster 64  Earlham 51

Wooster played solid defense in this game to pick up a nice road win.  :)  Wooster's shooting improved in the 2nd half, including 4 made three pointers.

Wooster was led in scoring by Devin Fulk's season high 16 points, Tom Port with 15 points (11 boards) and Evan Will added 10 points.  Wooster won the battle of the boards by a 41-29 count.

For Earlham, Markous Jewett had 24 points and Tristian Gregory chipped in 10 points.

Wooster is now 17-2, 10-0 NCAC  :)  Next game at home vs Allegheny on 1/31

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 27, 2007, 04:50:45 PM
NCAC Final Scores:

Wabash 66  Oberlin 61
Ohio Wesleyan 92  Hiram 86
Allegheny 70  Kenyon 65
Wooster 64  Earlham 51
At the Half:  Witt 42  Denison 27

David -- these scores are currently not available on D3Hoops. :P ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 27, 2007, 05:37:15 PM
Starting to think I'm good luck for the Scots and back luck for EC!  Didn't get to the game until half-time, and the 2nd half wasn't that great for Earlham.   Granted first time wooster 9 fouls, Earlham 1 with 1:23 left in the 2nd half.   

EC didn't get much to any help other then Jewett in the scoring department, he went 9-15 from the field and if you take him out of the equation i'd hate to see what Earlham shot from the field.  Earlham has never won against Wooster, but Coach Justus has had the lead 3 times at half-time.    1.5-20.5    Gotta take the small moral victories.   

Hope all you Scot fans have a safe trip back to lovely WOOSTER, Ohio.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 27, 2007, 05:39:14 PM
Final score:
Wittenberg 87
Denison 65
Also has not yet reached the scoreboard.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 27, 2007, 05:52:42 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 27, 2007, 04:39:27 PM
Wooster's shooting improved in the 2nd half, including 4 made three pointers.
That it did.  Wooster shot under 30% in the 1st half but rebounded to shoot 57% in the 2nd half to finish the game with a ho-hum 41%.

Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 27, 2007, 04:39:27 PM
For Earlham, Markous Jewett had 24 points and Tristian Gregory chipped in 10 points.
And all of Gregory's points came in the 1st half.  The Scots defense did well in shutting him out in the 2nd half as well as holding Henry to just 2 points on a pair of ft's.  He came into the game averaging almost 14 ppg.

I didn't hear the final fg % for Earlham in the game, but I do believe that they were at 50% in the 1st half.  That couldn't have been too encouraging for the EC going into the break with just a 2 point lead knowing that Wooster couldn't hit the broad side of a barn, shooting under 30% and Earlham was shooting 50%.  I guess things worked themselves out in the 2nd half.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 27, 2007, 07:40:14 PM
NCAC Current Standings thru 1/27 Results:

Wooster 10-0 (17-2)
Wittenberg 8-2 (16-3)
Ohio Wesleyan 7-3 (13-6)
Earlham 5-5 (7-12)
Hiram 5-5 (6-13)
Allegheny 4-6 (8-10)
Wabash 4-6 (7-12)
Kenyon 3-7 (7-12)
Denison 2-8 (3-15)
Oberlin 2-8 (3-16)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 28, 2007, 04:25:36 PM
sigh....i miss ncac basketball. im stuck down in florida rooting for embry-riddle in the naia d2 florida sun confrence...granted they are tied for 1rst with a small school called warner southern college....both teams are really good, but its nothing compared to good old wittenberg basketball (along with the rest of the ncac)

i guess im not exactly stuck in florida...but im not going home till june so ya.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 28, 2007, 06:50:55 PM
gotigers,

As I sit beside the fire of my warm house with an outside temp of 15 dgrees and watching the snow fall, my heart bleeds for you that you are stuck down there in sunny, warm FLA.  :'(  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 28, 2007, 08:42:19 PM
ya i figured that wasnt the right choice of words consdering im talking to mostly, if not all, northerners (sp?)!!! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 29, 2007, 12:37:16 PM
well guys wooster week is upon us....any word on wittenberg distribution of tickets?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 29, 2007, 12:48:55 PM
Nothing yet up on the Wooster Basketball homepage about ticket distribution.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 29, 2007, 01:01:10 PM
Ah, we've got all week to talk about Wooster/Witt.  Let's talk about something that touches all of us...the NCAC PotW award.  As promised, this week's award fell to an outstanding player from either OWU or Oberlin, largely because they are the two schools that haven't yet had a player chosen for the award.  OWU's Dustin Rudegair gets the nod this week for his role in OWU's wins over Oberlin and Hiram. 

Nine PotW awards have been given, and nine teams have been represented.  That puts Oberlin squarely in the crosshairs.  Who's got the stones to bet against Quenton Spencer this week?   :)

By the way, do these kids get anything for being named NCAC PotW?  An Applebee's gift certificate, some free iTunes downloads...anything? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 29, 2007, 01:15:40 PM
You know, when I engineered Reds games at the local station back in the 80s, I remember when the guests of those pregame and postgame radio shows used to get like gift certificates to a restaurant or a free watch or something. I think that was payment for having to sit through an interview with Joe Nuxhall.

For these kids, I think it's just a laurel and a hearty handshake.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2007, 01:48:50 PM
I think what they get is pride and a sense of accomplishment, at least until they log on here and see their accomplishment run down by Wally Wabash.  You may think this is a silly award given out in a predictable manner, but what does it hurt? 

I say congratulations to Dustin for his achievement.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 29, 2007, 02:02:10 PM
Not saying the kid shouldn't be congratulated, just saying it was hardly a surprise. 

My opinion, FWIW (which is next to nothing in this little corner of cyberspace), is that if we're going to have an NCAC PotW award, then everybody in the NCAC ought be eligible for said award every week.  That clearly isn't the case here in which case the award isn't nearly as presitgious as it could or should be.  We could do better...that's all I'm saying. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 29, 2007, 02:10:43 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 29, 2007, 01:01:10 PMAn Applebee's gift certificate

Gee, that would be some congratulations, wouldn't it? Yuck.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2007, 02:17:06 PM
The women's NCAC Player of the Week is Wooster's Beth Besancon Sidle.  That's the second PoTW for Wooster this season, while Hiram (and Wabash) have none.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 29, 2007, 05:02:13 PM
When I won a POTW a few years back they sent me a small plaque
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 29, 2007, 05:12:04 PM
Quote from: WillieBrown on January 29, 2007, 05:02:13 PM
When I won a POTW a few years back they sent me a small plaque

Just out of curiosity could you post a pic or something. I'd love to see what one looks like.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 29, 2007, 09:09:14 PM
hola. i am the same person as the last gotigers but my account got deleted or something idk. but anywho...if u wanna give me my negave 1 karma back thatd be cool. lol. but ya i wanna see a pic of your PoTW plaque.

i agree with wally that if its the ncac POTW then everybody in the ncac should be in the running for it.

this is the first witt woo game that ive missed since i was like 9 (im 20 now) i got to see the heart breaker earlier this season, very good game...even though cow won. oh how i WON"T miss the s*** on witt and f*** wooster chants.

does anyone else find it funny that woosters abrieviation is COW? i dont know about you guys but i've always had a good laugh whenever i saw a hat or shirt with that on it.

anywho...does anyone know if a live "tv" roadcast will be online of the game? that'd be sweet. i know they did it COW (snicker snicker :D) was in springfield  but that'd be nice for me and the other fans who cant be at the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 29, 2007, 09:15:58 PM
I mentioned this on the NCAC pick 'em board.  Does Wooster need to be fearful of the coming out flat since they have two game lead, playing at home and for once NOT defending #1 in the country??  In other words, WITT has more to gain than the SCOTS have to lose.

I honestly believe that if you cannot get up for this game, you might not have a pulse.  Can the home court make up the difference of Vandervaart out of the game?  I know we have about 15 fouls to use on Borchers but they could really beat up SCOTS inside.

Sorry, Do I have to wait until WED at about 10pm EST to start WITT/WOO talk?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on January 29, 2007, 09:49:58 PM
The POtW award is not handed out properly in my opinion.  Its like giving a trophy to every one in a little league.  It should be handed out to whatever player on whatever team had the best week.  My senior year I had 19 against Denison and then 18 at Wooster to all but clinch the regular season title and they gave the award to someone from Oberlin (Brandon Crawford, I believe).  Not that Crawford is a bad player or wasn't deserving, but I guarantee you, the games we won meant more than the ones he played in.  I even think they went 1-1 the week he got it.That wasn't the only case either.  I can remember numerous times when Schwab, Bryan Nelson or someone else would have a monster week and th award would go to a guard from Hiram who had 15 and 12 in two games.  NOt bad stats, but not truly deserving.    Oh well, I'm not still bitter or anything.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 29, 2007, 10:29:35 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on January 29, 2007, 09:15:58 PM
I mentioned this on the NCAC pick 'em board.  Does Wooster need to be fearful of the coming out flat since they have two game lead, playing at home and for once NOT defending #1 in the country??  In other words, WITT has more to gain than the SCOTS have to lose.

I honestly believe that if you cannot get up for this game, you might not have a pulse.  Can the home court make up the difference of Vandervaart out of the game?  I know we have about 15 fouls to use on Borchers but they could really beat up SCOTS inside.

Sorry, Do I have to wait until WED at about 10pm EST to start WITT/WOO talk?

WoosterFAN -- I hope that the Scots fully understand the importance of winning every remaining game until the NCAA tournament....starting with Allegheny on Wednesday night.

In 2004-2005, Wooster lost the NCAC tourney final and ended up on the road at Albion in the 2nd round of the NCAA's and lost on a questionable call to end their season.

In 2005-2006, Wooster lost to Ohio Wesleyan near the end of the regular season and lost to Witt again in the NCAC tourney final.  Result - the NCAA sent them on the road again and the Scots lost to Transylvania in the 2nd round again.

Given the excellent current records of other Great Lakes teams like Hope and Lake Erie, all NCAC contenders for post season play (Woo, Witt, OWU) need to win every remaining game possible.  Literally, one or two more losses by a NCAC team that qualifies for the NCAA tournament could mean the difference in either hosting a NCAA tournament game or playing on the road (a very tough challenge).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 29, 2007, 10:38:34 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 29, 2007, 10:29:35 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on January 29, 2007, 09:15:58 PM
I mentioned this on the NCAC pick 'em board.  Does Wooster need to be fearful of the coming out flat since they have two game lead, playing at home and for once NOT defending #1 in the country??  In other words, WITT has more to gain than the SCOTS have to lose.

I honestly believe that if you cannot get up for this game, you might not have a pulse.  Can the home court make up the difference of Vandervaart out of the game?  I know we have about 15 fouls to use on Borchers but they could really beat up SCOTS inside.

Sorry, Do I have to wait until WED at about 10pm EST to start WITT/WOO talk?

WoosterFAN -- I hope that the Scots fully understand the importance of winning every remaining game until the NCAA tournament....starting with Allegheny on Wednesday night.

In 2004-2005, Wooster lost the NCAC tourney final and ended up on the road at Albion in the 2nd round of the NCAA's and lost on a questionable call to end their season.

In 2005-2006, Wooster lost to Ohio Wesleyan near the end of the regular season and lost to Witt again in the NCAC tourney final.  Result - the NCAA sent them on the road again and the Scots lost to Transylvania in the 2nd round again.

Given the excellent current records of other Great Lakes teams like Hope and Lake Erie, all NCAC contenders for post season play (Woo, Witt, OWU) need to win every remaining game possible.  Literally, one or two more losses by a NCAC team that qualifies for the NCAA tournament could mean the difference in either hosting a NCAA tournament game or playing on the road (a very tough challenge).


thats a very good point. but i also hope that any team playing right now understands the importance of winning every remaining game...even if it wont help there position in the confrence tournament, it will help their confidence, and they will have a little momentum, which is very important. you go into a game defeated, you are defeated. that maybe one of the most over used phrases in sports but it carries soooo much truth in it. i remember in high school playing against good tteams, we couldnt beat tthem cause we expected to loose. confidencce plays a very large part when tourny time comes. thats where the upsets come from.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2007, 10:39:22 PM
Interesting....

Wittenberg beats Wabash (7-12) and Denison (3-15) and vaults 99 points and 5 places (from #16 to #11) in this week's poll (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/).  :o  Only Chicago had a bigger jump, and all they did was beat #25 NYU (14-4) and ORV Brandeis (13-5).

[shameless plug]
Read more in the Daily Dose (http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/). 
[/shameless plug]  ;) ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 29, 2007, 10:49:18 PM
raise your hand if you saw this weeks top three coming?

<hands all across the nation raising>
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 29, 2007, 10:53:15 PM
petewitt54 and anyone else who cares- I feel for the most part P.O.W. is given to a variety of different players and teams throughout the year.  As a former POW in the NCAC and D3hoops.com POW (sorry just figured i'd bring a blast from my past into the equation) but I was surprised that I got it, because we went 1-1 that week against Kenyon and WOOSTER *top 10 team.   It is nice to know as a player that you need to win at least one game that week to get POW in the NCAC.  I personally feel like the NCAC spreads the love in giving that reward for the most part. 

P.S.   If anyone has anything to complain about it would be the numbers Dan Hodgkinson put up his Freshman year and your Senior year.   I'd say his numbers warrent your ALL NCAC 1st team award, but he had Denison across his chest and not Wittenberg!   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 29, 2007, 11:29:57 PM
Quote from: petewitt54 on January 29, 2007, 09:49:58 PM
The POtW award is not handed out properly in my opinion.  Its like giving a trophy to every one in a little league.  It should be handed out to whatever player on whatever team had the best week.  My senior year I had 19 against Denison and then 18 at Wooster to all but clinch the regular season title and they gave the award to someone from Oberlin (Brandon Crawford, I believe).  Not that Crawford is a bad player or wasn't deserving, but I guarantee you, the games we won meant more than the ones he played in.  I even think they went 1-1 the week he got it.That wasn't the only case either.  I can remember numerous times when Schwab, Bryan Nelson or someone else would have a monster week and th award would go to a guard from Hiram who had 15 and 12 in two games.  NOt bad stats, but not truly deserving.    Oh well, I'm not still bitter or anything.   

*applause*

That's my whole point.  To me, a PotW award should be awarded to the player who had the most outstanding week in the league taking into account both sheer stats and the magnitude of the games the player was in.  If the idea behind the award isn't to recognize the most outstanding player for that week but rather to systematically recognize each of the programs around the league in a weekly press release (which the NCAC does on a weekly basis on their webpage anyway for every team every week), then maybe the "award" needs a more appropriate name.  Just thinking out loud here...

Quote from: WoosterFAN on January 29, 2007, 09:15:58 PM
I mentioned this on the NCAC pick 'em board.  Does Wooster need to be fearful of the coming out flat since they have two game lead, playing at home and for once NOT defending #1 in the country??  In other words, WITT has more to gain than the SCOTS have to lose.

If Team X is your big, hated rival then you get up to beat Team X regardless of the circumstance because the satisfaction of beating down your rival trumps pretty much everything else.  In this case, while Wooster has certainly created a cushion for themselves at the top of the league, it's still important to beat Wittenberg because everybody associated with Wooster wants to beat Witt at everything at all times.  Then of course you factor in the possible postseason hosting/seeding scenarios that could break away from Wooster with just one loss and you've got more than enough to play for I think. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 29, 2007, 11:34:46 PM
I'm not surprised, DC, as there was a lot o' losin' goin' on...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2007, 11:45:33 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 29, 2007, 11:34:46 PM
I'm not surprised, DC, as there was a lot o' losin' goin' on...

Well, Witt passed Ohio Northern, who beat conference leading Heidelberg (15-4) and won at 12-7 Baldwin-Wallace.  ONU actually lost 25 points this week.  And they do still have a 17-point pasting of Witt on their curriculum vitae.  Witt moved up 4 places on the average ballot this week, while ONU moved down one spot on that hypothetical ballot.  How exactly does that compute?

Ninety-nine points is a heck of a large gain for a team that did nothing but fail to lose to a couple of crummy opponents, even when that team is a perennial Top 25 power like Wittenberg.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on January 30, 2007, 01:33:01 AM
Quote from: earlhamalum on January 29, 2007, 10:53:15 PM

P.S.   If anyone has anything to complain about it would be the numbers Dan Hodgkinson put up his Freshman year and your Senior year.   I'd say his numbers warrent your ALL NCAC 1st team award, but he had Denison across his chest and not Wittenberg!   

Hodge just gets love from all angles. I'm guessing Hodgy gets D3hoops.com NCAC player of the century, and a statue put up in a lawn somewhere. After watching him play on Saturday I'd also like to vote him as most likely to whine about a call, and most likely to throw a cheapshot. Pretty dirty play coming down the stretch of that game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 30, 2007, 09:37:50 AM
inflates the matchup saturday if anything with wittenberg's higher rating, but witt will be out to prove they are still a player in the conference portrait.

also news out of the wooster and witt camps is no presale tickets, just tickets at the gate at wooster for witt fans-dont know how well this is oging to work out...................
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2007, 09:40:29 AM
DC - Perhaps someone made an error last week and downgraded Witt too much?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on January 30, 2007, 09:41:50 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 29, 2007, 10:39:22 PM
Interesting....

Wittenberg beats Wabash (7-12) and Denison (3-15) and vaults 99 points and 5 places (from #16 to #11) in this week's poll (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/).  :o  Only Chicago had a bigger jump, and all they did was beat #25 NYU (14-4) and ORV Brandeis (13-5).

[shameless plug]
Read more in the Daily Dose (http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/). 
[/shameless plug]  ;) ;D

Poll voters  realized the OWU defeat was an anomaly and the situation that occurred prior to the OWU game was a key factor in that loss.



Due diligence is always needed when poll voting.  ;)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 30, 2007, 09:50:53 AM
From Wooster's website

Ticket Info for Wittenberg-Wooster Game on Feb. 3: You must have a ticket to be admitted to Saturday's game. Student, faculty, and staff, as well as holders of guest passes (advertisers, NCAC), will still be free of charge, however, you must present your ID or pass to the ticket window. Pre-sale of tickets will take place at Wooster's Physical Education Center this Friday from 11 a.m. to 2 p.m. and 4 p.m. to 6 p.m., and the gates and ticket window will open Saturday at 3:30 p.m.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hodgistheman on January 30, 2007, 11:10:05 AM
Willie Brown..... I agree with you that Hodge is not toughest kid in the world of the most physical player and yeah he does whine alot. The comment that he is dirty is the dumbest comment anyone has ever made. The kid doesn't have a mean bone in his body and you couldn't find one player who has ever battled him in the post to say he is a dirty player. They might tell you he is phsically weak and whines but never dirty. He is a class kid that has gotten the most out of his limited natural ability. For a kid who can't run, jump, and is physically weak he has had  a great career. Calling someone dirty is a shot a someones's integrity and character. As for Saturday he was frustrated because Witt did on outstanding job of taking away things from him. That combined with a weak perimeter made it a long day for him and the Big Red. It has been a long year and not exactly the way he had hoped to end his career. That being said never once did he take a cheap shot at anyone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 30, 2007, 11:30:03 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 30, 2007, 09:37:50 AM
also news out of the wooster and witt camps is no presale tickets, just tickets at the gate at wooster for witt fans-dont know how well this is oging to work out...................
I may be mistaken, but isn't this almost the same thing that Witt did to Wooster last year???  I don't seem to recall Witt sending any presale tickets Wooster's way last year for their game down in Springfield.

Quote from: pennstghs on January 30, 2006, 02:57:11 PM
ticket news today on the witt wooster game

ticket sales will be going on sale starting on saturday at noon instead of the 5:00 time as believe before. there will be 2,000 tickets to the general public available with the other 1000 going to the wittenberg community that needs to tickets for admission. it will quite an atmosphere like always-much hype

Quote from: pennstghs on February 01, 2006, 09:09:47 PM
how is that illogical of a plan? it makes sense instead of having a huge attack on the campus at 5:30 to get tickets to start selling them at noon. most schools would sell before gameday. you go a little early. 2/3 of the tickets are open to the general public-that's how it goes in any circumstance. the season ticket holders get their seats-in this case the 1000 up for witt students and general family, and the other 2,000 are up for grabs.

and if it is illogical it is in witt's favor; why would we want a gym full of gold and black in our own gym?
pennstghs,

It sounds like you were cool with it when Wittenberg basically instituted the same policy.   ::)  At least Wooster is opening the sales on Friday afternoon as well as on Saturday.   I guess the old saying is true, "Kama's a bitch"!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 30, 2007, 12:11:33 PM
Well, I must say that I'm no fan of this policy; I think we should have sent some tickets to Witt for presale, the same as they did for us earlier this season.  I of course have no idea how complicated that is, so I'm willing to give the Wooster ticket office the benefit of the doubt. 

That said, I anticipate that tickets will still be available right up until gametime, at least.  There's a JV game at 5:30, and I'd encourage Witt fans and other out-of-towners to plan to attend that game to ensure that you can get tickets.  All seats (except season tickets) are general admission, so you don't need to buy early just to get a preferred seat.

Safe travels to everyone, now that something resembling winter has finally arrived in Ohio.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 30, 2007, 03:21:42 PM
I was looking for tickets on E-Bay for the Big show down this weekend... sadly I couldn't find any as of today.   Guess I'll have to go another year without ever attending a Witt/Woo basketball game.  I will one day attend the match-up in person. (Hopefully at Wittenberg.... 1 1/2 hour drive or 4 1/2)  For now I will focus on the other BIG SHOW DOWN this weekend in Southern FL where I'll have to Force myself to enjoy the warm weather for the weekend and root on one of my other loves... The Colts.   So to all you Witt/Woo fans enjoy one of the Biggest College basketball match-ups of the year, because I'll be sure to enjoy my first super bowl experience and the Weather... thank god I didn't have to buy tickets for that on E-Bay or I wouldn't have a computer to type on anymore!     Go Quake, Go Colts... and I'm routing for Wooster (not for karma purposes either!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 30, 2007, 03:58:11 PM
yes you are right we are kind of instituting the same policy that wooster is right now, BUT we did send some tickets to wooster fans for presale to ensure that there wouldn't be a huge problem. I dont think however that this game will be sold out, just hopefully that Wittenberg fans that attend all get tickets would be sufficient for me. I dont anticipate being able to make it up to Wooste runtil 6:30, so hopefully that isnt too immenant of a concern.

also, gotigers----you need to check your spelling and grammar before you post
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2007, 04:05:47 PM
For the first time, I ran my power-rating amalgamation, and there is where the NCAC stands out of 403 teams ranked by Massey and Wolfe.

3. Wooster
12. Wittenberg
57. Ohio Wesleyan
234. Earlham
248. Wabash
250. Allegheny
270. Kenyon
305. Hiram
337. Denison
346. Oberlin

It got ugly in a hurry for the NCAC.

Wash U. got #1 thanks to great SOS. Amherst is #7 because of their SOS. That also hurt Mississippi College.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 30, 2007, 06:50:07 PM
I always meant to ask this question but I never got around to it.  We have had some great players in the history of Wooster basketball - Tom Dinger, Erich Riebe, Doug Cline, and Bryan nelson, just to mention a few.  Why haven't their jerseys been retired in honor of their stellar performances?  Or maybe some of them have been retired and I just didn't notice when I was in the Timken gym?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zu1414 on January 30, 2007, 09:19:26 PM
As a Hiram fan its tough to add anything to a debate regarding a need of tickets.

This is such a big game, any chance it could ever be played at a neutral site say Akron, OSU? Now that would be fun, right? Just a thought...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 30, 2007, 09:48:54 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 30, 2007, 03:58:11 PM
yes you are right we are kind of instituting the same policy that wooster is right now, BUT we did send some tickets to wooster fans for presale to ensure that there wouldn't be a huge problem. I dont think however that this game will be sold out, just hopefully that Wittenberg fans that attend all get tickets would be sufficient for me. I dont anticipate being able to make it up to Wooste runtil 6:30, so hopefully that isnt too immenant of a concern.

also, gotigers----you need to check your spelling and grammar before you post

As should you. Try apostrophes, commas and run-on sentences.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 30, 2007, 10:18:19 PM
Quote from: zu1414 on January 30, 2007, 09:19:26 PM
As a Hiram fan its tough to add anything to a debate regarding a need of tickets.

This is such a big game, any chance it could ever be played at a neutral site say Akron, OSU? Now that would be fun, right? Just a thought...


I hate neutral sites unless early season tourneys and the Big Dance are involved. Big time conference games like this need to be played on campus. It's just not right to have it anywhere else.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 30, 2007, 10:35:12 PM
        Neutral sites take away from the atmosphere that a campus location provides. First, the venue lacks historical significance most of the time. Next, part of the rivalry is the fun of going to the away team's arena and fighting for a win. Lastly, OSU is not a place i would like to go haha. To conclude, i believe that Wooster and Wittenberg should continue their current state of affairs.

Is that better Pat? No errors for you-not that i was accusing you in the first place........
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 30, 2007, 10:39:03 PM
Both Wooster and Wittenberg have gymnasiums (gymnasia?) that seat 3000 or more spectators, and that's generally enough for these games.  Witt didn't sell out in December (about 2900), and I'll be surprised if Wooster sells out Saturday (I expect about 3000).  This isn't Hope/Calvin, where they could probably admit 10,000 if they had enough seats.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2007, 10:41:37 PM
I agree - keep neutral sites restricted to the tourney. It's funny, though, Indiana and Kentucky play their series at 'neutral sites', but the RCA Dome and Freedom Hall aren't really 'neutral' even though half the tickets go to each team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 30, 2007, 10:46:07 PM
Quote from: zu1414 on January 30, 2007, 09:19:26 PM
As a Hiram fan its tough to add anything to a debate regarding a need of tickets.

This is such a big game, any chance it could ever be played at a neutral site say Akron, OSU? Now that would be fun, right? Just a thought...


The only neutral-site games that I've seen work are the Wooster-Orrville and Wooster-Triway high school games held at Timken Gym at The College of Wooster.  They work because it provides a larger venue for the heavily-attended local interest game.  Travel doesn't really become an issue, and the game draws attention from the whole county.  However, the games themselves haven't really been that interesting recently, as Wooster's current high school basketball teams are, well, distrubingly bad.

For Woo-Witt, from seeing this rivalry in both gyms, you just have to have that defense of home court element that just adds to the underlying tension.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2007, 12:19:37 AM
Here's how the NCAC teams stack up in the latest NCAA stats (http://web1.ncaa.org/stats/StatsSrv/rankings?sportCode=MBB&rpt=wkly) update (through 1/28):

Scoring offense: Wooster #8, 90.1 ppg (#1 is Redlands, 121.2)
Scoring defense: Wittenberg #10, 60.2 ppg; Ohio Wesleyan #43, 63.1 ppg (NYU, 56.6)
Scoring margin: Wooster #2, +19.7; Ohio Wesleyan #13, +14.7; #40 Wittenberg, +10.3 (Amherst +24.0)
FG %: Wooster #7, 51.1% (Whitworth, 53.4%)
FG % Defense: Wittenberg #14, 39.1%; Ohio Wesleyan #43, 40.6% (NYU, 34.7%)
3-pt. FG per game: Wooster #12, 10.2; Ohio Wesleyan #50, 8.2 (Grinnell, 18.5)
3-pt. FG%: Wooster #10, 41.5% (Hope, 44.5%)
Free Throw %: Hiram #4, 78.3%; Wooster #17, 75.9%; Oberlin #19, 75.5%; Earlham #24, 75.0% (UW-Stevens Point, 83.6%)
Rebound Margin: Wooster #25, +6.7; Ohio Wesleyan #26, +6.5; Wittenberg #49, +5.2 (NYU, +11.8 )
Assists per game: Wooster #10, 18.8 (Emory & Henry, 21.7)
Blocked Shots per game: [no NCAC teams in top 50] (Gettysburg, 6.7)
Steals per game: [no NCAC teams in top 50] (Redlands, 19.6)
Turnovers per game: Ohio Wesleyan #8, 11.7; Wittenberg #13, 12.3; Earlham #16, 12.4; Wooster #35, 13.2 (UW-Stevens Point, 8.7)
Personal Fould per game: Earlham #15, 15.3; Wittenberg #38, 16.1 (Carleton, 13.2)

(I was going to give individual leaders as well, but the NCAA stats site has gone down >:()
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2007, 10:57:24 AM
NCAC players found among the individual statistical leaders in the NCAA (through games of 1/28):

Points per game: #43 Dan Hodgkinson, Denison, 19.8 (Mike Hoyt, Mt. St. Mary [NY], 33.3)
Field Goal %: #11 Ben Chojnacki, OWU, 64.0%; #20 Tim Vandervaart, Wooster, 61.8%; #28 Dan Hodgkinson, Denison, 60.9% (Michael Romes, Mt. St. Joseph, 68.9%)
Three-pt. FG per game: [none in top 50] (Amir Mazarei, Redlands, 6.4)
Three-pt. FG %: [none in top 50] (Steve Hicklin, UW-Stevens Point, 56.5%)
Free Throw %: #7 Jordan Beard, Oberlin, 89.5%; #26 Mike Staley, Hiram, 86.9%; #44 Bryan Yelvington, Kenyon, 85.1% (Joseph Chatman, Lesley, 94.4%)
Rebounds per game: #22 Dane Borchers, Wittenberg, 10.1 (Jeff Prebeck, Coast Guard, 12.9)
Assists per game: #8 Mike Staley, Hiram, 6.8 (David Arsenault, Grinnell, 8.4)
Blocked Shots per game: #43 Dane Borchers, Wittenberg, 1.8; #50 Andrew Zimmer, Wabash, 1.8 (Kerry Gibson, UW-Oshkosh, 4.0)
Steals per game: [none in top 50] (Elbie Murphy, St. Joseph's [Me.], 4.7)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 31, 2007, 12:57:30 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 30, 2007, 03:58:11 PM
also, gotigers----you need to check your spelling and grammar before you post

sory me tri to due beter next thyme haha lol
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on January 31, 2007, 01:20:04 PM
Witt vs. Woo Week...

What are some predictions by those that get to see these teams on a regular basis?

WillieBrown, what's the 'official' spread for this one?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 31, 2007, 01:22:32 PM
Quote from: gotigers on January 31, 2007, 12:57:30 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 30, 2007, 03:58:11 PM
also, gotigers----you need to check your spelling and grammar before you post

sory me tri to due beter next thyme haha lol


(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fz.about.com%2Fd%2Fanimatedtv%2F1%2F0%2Fl%2FA%2Fralphnose.jpg&hash=4a51e8581a169ed5cc23e756ddf5b884ad5aa637)

Me fail English? That unpossible!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 31, 2007, 01:47:16 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 30, 2007, 10:39:03 PM
Both Wooster and Wittenberg have gymnasiums (gymnasia?) that seat 3000 or more spectators, and that's generally enough for these games.  Witt didn't sell out in December (about 2900), and I'll be surprised if Wooster sells out Saturday (I expect about 3000).  This isn't Hope/Calvin, where they could probably admit 10,000 if they had enough seats.

Not only could they, they did in 1997 at VanAndel Arena in Grand Rapids.  11,200+ jammed into the arena.  Calvin moved their home game and Hope got around 1,000 tickets, Calvin sold the rest to alumni and it sold out in October.  It was a nice event, but they definatley lost their home court edge and haven't returned and probably won't.

I have doubts they could do that now, that was a one time special event in a brand new shiney arena.  We've had about 8 or 9 other chances to fill that arena with an  early season tournament but the matchup hasn't happened yet.........when it finally did this year the tournament had been moved to Calvin and there were plenty of empty seats.

The regular season matchups are sold out, usually but not always well in advance.  There's rarely a public sale of tickets, if there is its for dozens of available tickets.  This year Hope had about 50 tickets that went on sale to the public for the game at Calvin, they were gone in about 20 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2007, 03:11:05 PM
Different sport, but I wonder how much a Monon Bell game in the dome would draw in the dome in Indy. But that would ruin the campus spirit, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 31, 2007, 04:01:06 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 31, 2007, 03:11:05 PM
Different sport, but I wonder how much a Monon Bell game in the dome would draw in the dome in Indy. But that would ruin the campus spirit, though.

I could see it ending up a wash. I think some would be attracted by it and others would be turned off by it.

It totally disgusts me to think about it anywhere but on campus, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 31, 2007, 04:12:07 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 31, 2007, 10:57:24 AM
NCAC players found among the individual statistical leaders in the NCAA (through games of 1/28):

Free Throw %: #7 Jordan Beard, Oberlin, 89.5%; #26 Mike Staley, Hiram, 86.9%; #44 Bryan Yelvington, Kenyon, 85.1% (Joseph Chatman, Lesley, 94.4%)

The requirement of having 2.5 made FTs per game to be ranked is what keeps Wooster's Devin Fulk (19-20, 95%) from being listed on the nation rankings.  Fulk is often in Coach Moore's offensive/defensive substitution rotation near the end of tight games because of his skill from 3-point land and his skill at the line.  However, in his regular play, Fulk is not an overly penetrating guard, and thus doesn't draw very many fouls in shooting situations.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 31, 2007, 07:23:33 PM
for those of you that can, could you post the witt score every once and a while throughout the game? the sound on my computer isnt working tonight. thanks
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 31, 2007, 08:07:24 PM
At the Half:   Wooster 59  Allegheny 36

Wooster jumped out to a 14-0 start, made their first 9 shots of the game and has been in total control of this contest tonight.  :)

Wooster is being led by James Cooper with 16 points (4 three pointers), Tom Port with 15 points (3 three pointers, one dunk) and Brandon Johnson with 10 points.

Allegheny is being led by Trevor Coffey with 8 points.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 31, 2007, 08:16:37 PM
follow me for a second.


say that wooster were to lose tonight to 'gheny (it would probably take an act of God to do so but for the sake of the argument, lets say they do) and then on saturday loose to witt and then both teams win out and both finish the year with the same confrence record. they both lost to each other once and they both, obviously, lost to another ncac team how do they determine who gets the regular season title, and if they share, how do they determine where the tourney is played. do they jut flip a coin or do they use a strength of schedule thing or what? ive a;ways wandered that.

and to end this post...at a risj of loosing karma (not that it really matters but hey i want a lot of it for some reason...)

GO WITT BEAT THE SCOTS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 31, 2007, 08:40:21 PM
Quote from: gotigers on January 31, 2007, 08:16:37 PM
follow me for a second.


say that wooster were to lose tonight to 'gheny 

Not Likely-- Wooster with a 27 point lead with ~10 minutes left in the game! :)

I don't remember if there are other tiebreakers besides head to head results.  At some point, yes, a tie can be reduced down to a coin flip as the deciding factor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 31, 2007, 09:00:18 PM
Final:  Wooster 109  Allegheny 71

Wooster cruised in the second half and cleared the bench with about 7 minutes remaining.

Wooster was led tonight by James Cooper with 31 points (7 of 9 on three pointers), Tom Port with 15 points and Brandon Johnson with 14 points.  Scots played good defense and shot well to secure this lopsided win.  Wooster made 14 three pointers and shot over 55% from behind the arc.

Allegheny was led by Jimmy Savage with 9 points and Trevor Coffey with 8 points.

Wooster is now 18-2, 11-0 NCAC. ;D   Big home game vs Witt on Saturday!

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 31, 2007, 09:02:06 PM
Final from Springfield: Wittenberg 87   Earlham 40

Not really much of a contest from the get go. Earlham couldn't match up with Wittenberg offensively or defensively and that combined with Wittenberg's excellent night of shooting and good shots makes this Saturday's game even that more interesting. I think tonight Wittenberg had around 10 3 pointers and that was the one element missing from the first game that could have turned the tide. Balanced scoring attack all the way around too for the Tigers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on January 31, 2007, 09:04:30 PM
from the looks of it, this is coming souly from the stats from tonight, the winner of saturdays game is going to be the team who shuts down the other from behind the arch. witt had 12 and wooster had 14 from down town, im not sure if thats normal, but thats seems really good to me.

if niether team can shut the other down, or they both shut each other down, then i think the game will be decided on whether or not borchers(sp??) can stay out of foul trouble. correct me if im wrong but the guy from woo who broke his hand, his name starts with a V, he played center. if woo's backup center, now non back-up starting center, can draw the offensive fouls when dane makes a move to the basket, woosters won the game. if u take him away from witt, witt is a 1 dimensional team, 3-pointers, and i believe that any team can shut down a 1 dimensional team. thats the key for witt to win is to keep him out of foul trouble. and woosters key is to get him into foul trouble. but anywho back to my paper i have to write for tommorrow. ugh i hate psychology.   8(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerUp on January 31, 2007, 09:36:32 PM
I'm not sure which Earlham team Wooster played last Saturday, but it definitely didn't look like the same team Witt played tonight.   I thought the Witt vs. Earlham game would be a good game, but it was never even close.   

Witt's bench scored 36 of the points. 

Saturday should be a good game! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 31, 2007, 09:38:48 PM
All the NCAC 1/31 Final Scores:

Wabash 54  Ohio Wesleyan 52 (big road win for the Little Giants)
Kenyon 73  Hiram 54
Oberlin 82  Denison 76
Wittenberg 87  Earlham 40
Wooster 109  Allegheny 71
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 31, 2007, 10:09:25 PM
I've got confirmation on the Wabash/OWU score.  There was no stream on the intertron tonight so I have no idea how this played out.  What I do know is that the box score is rated R.  Seriously, parental discretion is advised:

http://www.wabash.edu/sports/docs/basketballstats/200607/owum0131.htm

Wabash shoots 36% from the field, 1-12 on 3's, and 9-20 on FTs and wins.  There's really no good explanation for this, but nonetheless Wabash gets a HUGE win on the road in Delaware. 

Aside from the ugly, ugly shooting statistics, a couple of things stand out from the boxscore.  First, Ryan Stephens (who is all of a sudden playing out of his mind) goes for 11 points and 17 rebounds.  Second, Wabash never trailed in the game.  Third, Chojnacki played just 16 minutes and it doesn't look like fouls were the problem.  Not sure what happened there...hopefully we'll know more when some game stories get posted. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 31, 2007, 10:11:41 PM
Billy_Pilgram and I were just talking about this the other day...For some odd reason Earlham goes into Wooster games with the mentality that they can play with them not the same for Wittenberg.  Ever since my freshman year when we swept Wittenberg, Coach Brown has the Tigers playing their best basketball every game since then against the EC..  (swept) That sounded just as good the second time.  I wish I could explain it, because that score against Wittenberg hasn't been that uncommon since the 99-00 season.    Maybe Coach Brown didn't like that Feeling and has his team more prepared?!?!?!?  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 31, 2007, 10:12:51 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 1/31 results:

Wooster 11-0 (18-2)
Wittenberg 9-2 (17-3)
Ohio Wesleyan 7-4 (13-7)
Wabash 5-6 (8-12)
Earlham 5-6 (7-13)
Hiram 5-6 (6-14)
Kenyon 4-7 (8-12)
Oberlin 3-8 (4-16)
Denison 2-9 (3-16)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on January 31, 2007, 10:20:28 PM
Hey everyone, haven't posted in a while. kinda took a break for what are probably obvious reasons. I see someone from Witt has stolen my nick and removed the number. Well, sorry guys but I guess you'll be confused for a bit.

Good to see DC at the Witt/Kenyon women's game at Kenyon on Tuesday. Hope you enjoyed yourself, at least for the first half when it was actually good basketball. The second half was a train wreck for everyone.

Witt/Earlham - ok, I got there late. I showed up at 8:40 PM expecting to see maybe 6 or 7 minutes of the second half. Instead I walk in and there's 1:37 left on the clock. Wow... the refs just let that one go. If the game started at 7:40 like normal, and ended no later than 8:50 (i forgot to check my watch but it was not more than 10 minutes after I got there) that means it was an hour and ten minutes of basketball, including a 20 minute halftime and 40 minutes of gameplay. That leaves an extra ten minutes, including stoppages of the clock for timeouts, inbounding, injuries, foul shots, substitutions or court cleaning.
Talk about expedient!

Witt/woo - can't wait for the game, and like my witt colleagues i was a bit surprised to hear no presale down here. Yes, it's true Witt had no presale for the HPER regular season game last year, but they realized that was not the best policy and changed it this year. So karma's going beyond being a b*tch to down right vindictive this year. Regardless, having to get there early for tickets allows me time to have some dinner with my dad at one of the fine local establishments, usually the Olde Jaol.

It should be interesting with Vandervaart out. I was hoping to see a straight rematch of the December game, kinda disappointed Darth Vaart is out. If Witt wins, everyone is going to hop right on that train of Vandervaart is out, but I have to say I have seen improvement in this team and I think that even with V in the Tigers would still be able to take the Scots this time.

Unfortunately, my brain is not in a place to decipher statistics and figures because I have contracted the form of the flu that is rifling through Witt's campus right now. My house of 12 (it's a fraternity house) has all been taken down with it. It's normally been a 12-20 hour sort of thing so hopefully I'll be fully able to make the trip Saturday.

Good luck to both sides, let's hope for a close game.

P.S. - I've seen Hodgkinson play a couple times now and I can't say that there weren't some instances where I was surprised that the fouls being called against him weren't flagrant, as well as at the Witt/Bash game... I can see how maybe some of it can be construed as victim to circumstance but I saw his elbows go all over the place. Not trying to ruffle any feathers, just reporting what I saw. I've never met him but from the descriptions on here I understand he's a nice guy and isn't mean, but being mean and playing too aggressively for the sake of the game are two different things.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2007, 10:34:57 PM
Quote from: tigerup07 on January 31, 2007, 10:20:28 PM
Witt/woo - can't wait for the game, and like my witt colleagues i was a bit surprised to hear no presale down here. Yes, it's true Witt had no presale for the HPER regular season game last year, but they realized that was not the best policy and changed it this year. So karma's going beyond being a b*tch to down right vindictive this year.

I was told by someone close to the Wooster program that Witt was offered a presale allotment of tickets and declined for logistical reasons.  In the past, Wooster has also declined similar offers from Witt, although obviously not earlier this season.  I don't know what goes into the decision-making process, and I haven't verified this information with anyone from Witt's program, but that's what I was told tonight.

I still don't think this game is going to sell out; if you come for the JV game at 5:30, that should be plenty good enough to ensure you get a ticket.  And that should be a good game too; it went to OT in Springfield! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2007, 10:43:40 PM
WOW! HUGE win for the LG's! WOW!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2007, 10:46:38 PM
Ryan Stephens is realizing that this is his last hurrah as a basketball player - so he is extra motivated. As good of a kid he is - good for him. He's a true Wabash man and will be a leader in life.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2007, 10:59:44 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 31, 2007, 10:34:57 PM
I was told by someone close to the Wooster program that Witt was offered a presale allotment of tickets and declined for logistical reasons. 

Would the person who told me this please email me?  My address can be found by clicking on my profile.  Thanks!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 31, 2007, 11:11:32 PM
Quote from: gotigers on January 31, 2007, 08:16:37 PM
say that wooster were to lose tonight to 'gheny (it would probably take an act of God to do so but for the sake of the argument, lets say they do) and then on saturday loose to witt and then both teams win out and both finish the year with the same confrence record. they both lost to each other once and they both, obviously, lost to another ncac team how do they determine who gets the regular season title, and if they share, how do they determine where the tourney is played. do they jut flip a coin or do they use a strength of schedule thing or what? ive a;ways wandered that.[/color]

Your post is a little hard to wade through (I'm sure your psych paper will be better written ;)), but I think you're asking about tiebreakers. After conference record and head to head the only tiebreaker is worst loss. 

For example, if the Scots were to have lost tonight's game and again on Saturday, and both Wooster and Witt win all of their other games they would end up tied with 2 losses each.  Assuming that OWU finishes ahead of Allegheny, then Witt would win the championship because Wooster would have the worst loss. 

However, the Scots didn't lose tonight.  But if they lose to Witt and OWU the teams would still be tied after the worst-loss tiebreaker, so they would go to a coin flip. The winner of the flip gets the choice of the #1 seed or hosting the semi's and finals.  This year that might be a tough call, as there appears to be a big drop between the #3 and #4 seeds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2007, 11:15:15 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on January 31, 2007, 11:11:32 PMThe winner of the flip gets the choice of the #1 seed or hosting the semi's and finals.  This year that might be a tough call, as there appears to be a big drop between the #3 and #4 seeds.

I dunno; the prospective #3 didn't do so well tonight!   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 31, 2007, 11:27:28 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 31, 2007, 11:15:15 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on January 31, 2007, 11:11:32 PMThe winner of the flip gets the choice of the #1 seed or hosting the semi's and finals.  This year that might be a tough call, as there appears to be a big drop between the #3 and #4 seeds.

I dunno; the prospective #3 didn't do so well tonight!   :)

Good point!  Looks like OWU might be falling back to the pack a bit. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2007, 11:29:53 PM
Not really much to say about the game at Timken tonight.  Wooster came out absolutely on fire offensively and defensively, got out to a quick two touchdown lead, and the game was all but over by the 10:00 mark of the 1st half.  The next 22 minutes saw pretty much both teams just going through the motions (although Bidwell's missed dunk gave a bit of a chuckle,) and then the last 8 minutes or so was the JV game.  That was the only interesting part for me. 

Here was the Wooster frosh rotation:
1st half, Melick came in for Will.  The next time Will came out, he was replaced by Elam.  Geitgey also played in the first.  These three seem to be firmly on the varsity now, as none of them even dressed for the JV game against LCCC last week, and Melick seems to have the edge on Elam (although I thought Will played better tonight.)
2nd half, same as above, then these three came in together at one of those "rolling timeouts" that Steve Moore likes to use when he's clearing the bench.  The next sub into the game, to my surprise (and delight) was Jake Johnson (along with Fulk), in to play the 3.  Then Molz replaced Fulk, and a bit later Tenenini came in for one of the big frosh.  Finally, Hershberger and Battista came in together for the last two minutes.  I think Geitgey was on the floor the whole last 8 minutes, suggesting (to me at least) that he's the point guard in waiting.  This rotation also suggests (to me) that Tenenini has moved up ahead of Hershberger (he was already ahead of Battista, as far as I could tell) to be the fourth big man. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 31, 2007, 11:31:30 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 31, 2007, 10:12:51 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 1/31 results:

Wooster 11-0 (18-2)
Wittenberg 9-2 (17-3)
Ohio Wesleyan 7-4 (13-7)
Wabash 5-6 (8-12)
Earlham 5-6 (7-13)
Hiram 5-6 (6-14)
Kenyon 4-7 (8-12)
Oberlin 3-8 (4-16)
Denison 2-9 (3-16)

Don't forget the Gators at 4-7 (8-11).

That fourth place spot is really up for grabs, with an outside chance that someone could challenge OWU for #3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2007, 11:34:26 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 31, 2007, 10:34:57 PM
I was told by someone close to the Wooster program that Witt was offered a presale allotment of tickets and declined for logistical reasons.  In the past, Wooster has also declined similar offers from Witt, although obviously not earlier this season.  I don't know what goes into the decision-making process, and I haven't verified this information with anyone from Witt's program, but that's what I was told tonight.

I now have verified this with Wittenberg.  This is a more complicated decision than I think many of us realize, and I hope everyone will agree that their school's generally overworked athletics staff does all that they can do within their logistical bounds, and they deserve our praise and thanks.  Just my opinion, of course.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on January 31, 2007, 11:35:30 PM
OK - Can someone explain the NCAC to me.  Man, I have been following this league since 1986 and this is driving me crazy!! ;)

How in the world does OWU lose @ home to Wabash in a critical game.
I know...I know Wabash always fights but come on!! OWU is supposed to be the up and coming rival to WITT and Wooster. 2 time 1st team ALL-NCAC Senior Forward, does not win??  You shoot 29% in your own gym to a team that has let other teams score 70 @ .434??

And Hiram coming up short should not surprise but I would love some consistency in the league right now.  No one knows from night to night what is going to happen.  This should make the NCAC tourney very very interested.  But still only 3 teams over .500!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on February 01, 2007, 12:14:50 AM
QuoteQuote from: David Collinge on Yesterday at 10:34:57 pm
I was told by someone close to the Wooster program that Witt was offered a presale allotment of tickets and declined for logistical reasons.  In the past, Wooster has also declined similar offers from Witt, although obviously not earlier this season.  I don't know what goes into the decision-making process, and I haven't verified this information with anyone from Witt's program, but that's what I was told tonight.


I now have verified this with Wittenberg.  This is a more complicated decision than I think many of us realize, and I hope everyone will agree that their school's generally overworked athletics staff does all that they can do within their logistical bounds, and they deserve our praise and thanks.  Just my opinion, of course.

Thanks for updating us. I know I had no idea that it was more complicated than just saying "here are some tickets". And yes, the Witt Athletic Staff is way overworked. For how much money they sink into sports every year and how much the administration is concerned about it, the students don't get as into it as I think they should, and the staff does way more work than their positions call for. Ryan Maurer is the SID at Witt and he is also the Director of News Services and Sports Information. Normally those are two full time jobs in their own right and he's doing both. Albeit he does a fantastic job but still.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2007, 12:44:59 AM
WooFan - It's a down year overall, but a lot of teams are young. And young teams can elate you or drive you to liver damage...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 01, 2007, 08:57:21 AM
Quote from: tigerup07 on February 01, 2007, 12:14:50 AM
QuoteQuote from: David Collinge on Yesterday at 10:34:57 pm
II now have verified this with Wittenberg.  This is a more complicated decision than I think many of us realize, and I hope everyone will agree that their school's generally overworked athletics staff does all that they can do within their logistical bounds, and they deserve our praise and thanks.  Just my opinion, of course.

Can you enlighten us on what the complications are?  I see some logistical issues for ticket sales without computers (with physical tickets, you have to get the unsold ones back to the home team in time to be sold.)  However, it seems like bringing the unsold ones back on the team bus in time for the JV game would solve that.

I have been somewhat surprised that the Witt students don't follow sports like they used to.  I was at the Witt bookstore prior to the Wooster game this year and got a blank stare when I asked a couple of students if they were going to the game.

The good thing about that is that many people go to NCAC schools for reasons other than sports and could care less.  (I am sure it's also that way at other schools, but in D1, there is a lot more of the tail wagging the dog.)

I see that Wooster will have Saturday's game on video.  I hope I can get a "seat."

Also, the game will be on the Wittenberg Tiger Worldwide radio network. 

TigerFan_1973

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 01, 2007, 10:36:52 AM
A few thoughts guys........

First-that is kind of surprising but possibly chancy of the Witt Athletic Dpt. to not take presale tickets. If this was as highly anticipated as previous games have been then maybe circumstances have changed. To counter that decision Witt is offering a student bus, but who knows how popular that could be......

Second-which brings me to my second point, i have been disappointed with the turnout at Witt games because thye are missing out on a good brand of basketball. Maybe next Wed. vs OWU will have a good turnout.

Third - Saturday i think we've hit the point hard on the fact that Witt's chances depend on how much they can take advantage of the low post. Previous years have shown that if we can handle ourselves down low and rack up points-that usually neutralizes the game and keeps it close, but with Witt's recent 3 point outburst that may give Wooster something else to think about the next few days.

fourth - wow what the heck happened to my NCAC pick em-i hopped on the hiram and denison bandwagons and was thrown off to the horses-who was it who said they didnt think oberlin would win another game?

lastly - hope to see some of you there on Saturday-ill have my red t-shirt and rally towel like always. have a good day all
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2007, 11:04:34 AM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 01, 2007, 08:57:21 AM
Quote from: tigerup07 on February 01, 2007, 12:14:50 AM
QuoteQuote from: David Collinge on Yesterday at 10:34:57 pm
II now have verified this with Wittenberg.  This is a more complicated decision than I think many of us realize, and I hope everyone will agree that their school's generally overworked athletics staff does all that they can do within their logistical bounds, and they deserve our praise and thanks.  Just my opinion, of course.

Can you enlighten us on what the complications are? 

No, I'm sorry, I can't.  Both of the people who spoke with me did so in confidence.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 01, 2007, 11:17:55 AM
Quote from: tigerup07 on February 01, 2007, 12:14:50 AM
Ryan Maurer is the SID at Witt and he is also the Director of University Communications. Normally those are two full time jobs in their own right and he's doing both. Albeit he does a fantastic job but still.

Ryan does a great job for Witt.  If you look at all the sports he keeps up with as well as general university communications, it's a huge job.  Yet I am always pleased when I look at the quality of the info on the Witt site.  There is a lot of history on the site that is interesting to look through if you have time.

I went up to the Witt-Woo game  in Springfield a couple of years ago (I believe it was an NCAA game or the NCAC tournament, it was either the third or fourth time they had played that year).  The Athletic Director was taking tickets at the door!  That's a guy who will do what needs to be done. At a small school, you wear a lot of hats. 

Witt has always done a first class job at staging events.  They have hosted a number of NCAA regional-type (quarterfinal, etc.) games.  In Div. 3, the NCAA is looking for places that can get a crowd there and do a good job, while not spending too much money.

TF_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2007, 11:25:57 AM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 01, 2007, 11:17:55 AM
Witt has always done a first class job at staging events.  They have hosted a number of NCAA regional-type (quarterfinal, etc.) games. 

In fact, Witt has been the host school for the D3 Final Four four times, from 1989-1992.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 01, 2007, 11:41:12 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 01, 2007, 10:36:52 AM
fourth - wow what the heck happened to my NCAC pick em-i hopped on the hiram and denison bandwagons and was thrown off to the horses-who was it who said they didnt think oberlin would win another game?
That would be me.  ;D  I was just basing my opinion on  the way Oberlin's been playing of late.  Coming into last night's game, Oberlin had lost 12 of 13.  This  included a 4 game losing streak coming into last night's game in which they were being outscored by more than 20 points per game. ::)  I should have known better than to pick Denison though! ???  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 01, 2007, 12:20:05 PM
Outside of the Wooster high school girls, Denison is the worst team that I've seen this season.  That includes all of the NCAC, all of Wooster's other home opponents, NAIA school Walsh, and 19 girls high school teams at the Classic in the Country at Hiland.  I'd pick Oberlin over them even on a neutral court, but probably not at Denison.

Wait a minute, I haven't seen the Wooster high school girls this year.  That makes Denison the worst, bar none.

PS to CR - C'mon, Craig, I know who you'll be rooting for on Saturday. :) That's ok, Chuck, Roger, and I won't hold it against you, after all, it's your alma mater.  Besides, Roger said that years ago you were a pretty decent shot. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2007, 12:52:46 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 01, 2007, 12:20:05 PM
Outside of the Wooster high school girls, Denison is the worst team that I've seen this season.  That includes all of the NCAC, all of Wooster's other home opponents, NAIA school Walsh, and 19 girls high school teams at the Classic in the Country at Hiland.  I'd pick Oberlin over them even on a neutral court, but probably not at Denison.

Denison 75, Oberlin 48 (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/db/site/newsreleases/mb/20070110_2264.html), Jan. 10 at Denison.  Of course, that was part of the two-game Denison Renaissance, or Denaissance, which came to a sudden and bloody end at the hands of the Medici-like Kenyon (73-70) and Hiram (120-117, 4 OT) squads
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 01, 2007, 01:32:32 PM
Didn't Walsh win a national championship or at least play for one a couple of years ago (with a Wooster transfer I believe)?  Have they really fallen off that far? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2007, 01:33:16 PM
Saturday night I'll get to see the pillowy-soft Big Red in all of their glory.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on February 01, 2007, 02:21:05 PM
From the Wabash website:

"It was the Wabash defense that proved to be the difference-maker in the game. Three weeks after giving up 55 points to the Bishops' Ben Chojnacki and Dustin Rudegeair, the Little Giants held the duo to combined 13 points. Chojnacki, the leading scorer for OWU coming into the contest, finished with only four points before leaving the game in the second half with an injury to his left knee. Rudegeair, the North Coast Athletic Conference Men's Basketball Player of the Week, was held to eight points on 1-of-5 shooting from the field."

Let's hope the injury to Ben Chojnacki is not serious.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 01, 2007, 02:34:00 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 01, 2007, 11:25:57 AM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 01, 2007, 11:17:55 AM
Witt has always done a first class job at staging events.  They have hosted a number of NCAA regional-type (quarterfinal, etc.) games. 

In fact, Witt has been the host school for the D3 Final Four four times, from 1989-1992.

Thanks for that reminder.

I forgot about that.  I didn't get to pay much attention to Witt during that period.

TF
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 01, 2007, 02:37:25 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 01, 2007, 01:32:32 PM
Didn't Walsh win a national championship or at least play for one a couple of years ago (with a Wooster transfer I believe)?  Have they really fallen off that far? 

Yes, Walsh won the NAIA II title  in 2005 with UC transfer Robert Whaley. He was selected in the 5th round of the NBA draft by the Utah Jazz and named player of the year in NAIA.

Randy Sistrunk was the player from COW.

They are currently ranked 2nd in the country.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on February 01, 2007, 02:40:42 PM
Correction: Ryan Maurer is Director of News Services for Witt, not Director of University Communications. Sorry about that. But regardless the fact remains that he has two fulltime jobs and does them both, all while being a husband and father (his kids are amazingly cute if you ever get the chance to meet them, but I'm sure they'll grow up to be stellar athletes and record breakers for Witt)

About the students at Witt, and your comment TigerFan, I know what you mean. For four years straight now, I've been explaining to people that yes, there's a game tonight and you should come, and yes, Witt has a Pep Band, its been around a couple of years now, and yes, we went to the national championship game. It gets aggravating but some students just really don't care. There's a large trichotemy on campus. You get students who are athletes or sports fans, then you have students that are wrapped up in their studies and activities, then you have students who (excuse me for this but its true) are nerds and just play video games and read comics all day.
It's good to have dedicated students but in my mind I just don't know how anyone can be so uninterested even when the team just went to the NCAA finals. Just my opinion though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 01, 2007, 03:25:52 PM
Quote from: Witt4ever on February 01, 2007, 02:37:25 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 01, 2007, 01:32:32 PM
Didn't Walsh win a national championship or at least play for one a couple of years ago (with a Wooster transfer I believe)?  Have they really fallen off that far? 

Yes, Walsh won the NAIA II title  in 2005 with UC transfer Robert Whaley. He was selected in the 5th round of the NBA draft by the Utah Jazz and named player of the year in NAIA.

Randy Sistrunk was the player from COW.

They are currently ranked 2nd in the country.

I thought that was the case...Walsh beat my hometown Oregon Tech in the semis that year I believe.  Come to think of it, Walsh knocked Oregon Tech out of the tournament last year also.  Maybe this is the year the Hustlin' Owls get a little revenge.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 01, 2007, 03:50:51 PM
tigerup07-i echo your thoughts-i have been saying this for a long time as well. in fact i made the comment last night at the game as it was the first wednesday-midweek game in a while "wow this crowd is pathetic." i guess the matchup wasnt as anticipated as some may be. i think next wednesday's game home vs OWU is going to be indicative of how the wittenberg students respond. everyone shows up for the wooster game just to say they went but generally dont care or follow the team the rest of the year as religiously as myself or others may do.

hey at least we dont inflate our attendance numbers like otterbein haha-for those of you who dont know what im talking about i reference you to the OAC board's recent discussions
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on February 01, 2007, 08:06:13 PM

Quote from: pennstghs on February 01, 2007, 03:50:51 PM
everyone shows up for the wooster game just to say they went but generally dont care or follow the team the rest of the year as religiously as myself or others may do.

Pennstigs you have some kind of crazy complex where you believe that since you are at every game that you are in some way superior to the other fans that have time commitments. I mean go to the games, enjoy yourself, waste your time driving to allegheny and wabash to see us beat them by 20, but dont come back here degrading the rest of the Witt fan base because we dont show up for a wednesday evening game against Earlham. This STILL IS the NCAC and we can take off 10-12 games a year and still win by 20. Just have a drink and relax on the greater than thou attitude.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2007, 09:25:16 PM
Quote from: Witt4ever on February 01, 2007, 02:37:25 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 01, 2007, 01:32:32 PM
Didn't Walsh win a national championship or at least play for one a couple of years ago (with a Wooster transfer I believe)?  Have they really fallen off that far? 

Yes, Walsh won the NAIA II title  in 2005 with UC transfer Robert Whaley. He was selected in the 5th round of the NBA draft by the Utah Jazz and named player of the year in NAIA.

Randy Sistrunk was the player from COW.

They are currently ranked 2nd in the country.

This post got me thinking about how the NAIA opponents of Wooster are faring.  And since I'm all about keeping the peace between the Wittfields and the MacLeods this week ;), I'll throw in Witt's NAIA opponents too.

Walsh, as noted, is 20-3 and ranked #2 in NAIA-II.  Wooster defeated Cavs 85-68 at Walsh on Nov. 25.  Walsh has won 16 straight games since losing in OT at Cedarville on Dec. 9.
Georgetown (KY) is 19-3 and ranked #6 in NAIA-I.  Wooster defeated the Tigers 80-73 on Nov. 28 in Wooster.  Georgetown has won 10 straight games, and 12 of 13 since losing to the Scots.
Cedarville is 16-6 and ranked #17 in NAIA II.  Wittenberg defeated the Yellow Jackets 66-61 on Dec. 5 in Springfield, then (after the YJs beat Walsh) Wooster beat them 104-95 on Dec. 16 in Wooster.  Cedarville then lost their next three games (two to ranked teams--#8 Huntington and #12 Mt. Vernon Nazarene,) but has rebounded to win seven of eight, their only loss coming last week at #2 Walsh by 7.  Before losing to Walsh, they got their revenge on #12 MVNU, 90-67.
California Baptist is 14-7 and in the "others receiving votes" category of NAIA-I (effective #27.)  The Lancers beat Wooster 94-89 on Dec. 20 in Riverside.  Since then, CBU has gone 6-3 in the tough GSAC, losing to third-ranked Concordia in OT, to #14 San Diego Christian by 2, and ORV Biola, and won at #12 Asuzu Pacific by 11.
Indiana-Southeast is 18-8 and in the "others receiving votes" category of NAIA-II (effective #37.)  Wittenberg beat the Grenadiers 78-47 on Dec. 30 in Springfield.  Southeast is 6-3 since then, losing by 23 at #6 Georgetown and by 7 at ORV Asbury.

This is a pretty stout collection of teams that have been very successful this season, and Witt and Woo collectively went 5-1 against them, providing nearly 20% of their collective losses on the season.  Hooray for us!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 01, 2007, 09:33:00 PM
Willie-did i say i go to every game or mention you at all? no didnt think so. i have been to a total of 5 games this year to be honest. from the past is what i was referencing the fact that most students don't seem to care all that much about what is going on. i never said that they had to drive to away games i was talking about home games, so before you start attacking get your facts straight.

o yeah u might want to spell my name right too-that just detracts from your credibility
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 01, 2007, 09:37:14 PM
Quote from: tigerup07 on February 01, 2007, 02:40:42 PM
and yes, Witt has a Pep Band, its been around a couple of years now,

Witt's always had a pep band ...

What's this about it being around a couple of years now?

I did miss a few years in there, but surely you are not telling me that there were years without a pep band?

Next you will tell me that they don't ring the bell the number of points after a score in football anymore!  It was a bit of a chore when they would get up 56-0 sometimes.

I guess I'm getting old, but I feel the urge to talk about the good old days again!

TF_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 01, 2007, 09:54:20 PM
TigerFan_1973 and others-  I enjoy the fact that 2/16/00 at HPER Center in Springfield, OH on one of those random Wednesday night NCAC game where Wittenberg was suppose to win by 20 Wittenberg rented not a pep band for that game but a BAND.  (Black college band or High School?? I can't really remember) they had to be 125+ out of the 824 in attendance that night.  They kind of heckled us (Earlham players) before the game started, but by the 2nd half we had us 125 + fan, courtesy of Wittenberg College.   Never knew how to say thank you for that!   

Oh by the way Earlham 71 Wittenberg 60          
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2007, 09:58:57 PM
DC - That's all well and good for Witt and Woo - but then there's the other 8....

Kenyon beat Myers

Ohio Wesleyan lost to Aquinas and triumphed over Notre Dame (Ohio)

Wabash beat IU-South Bend and lost to Oliver Nazarene.

Allegheny, Dension, Earlham, Hiram, Oberlin didn't play NAIA teams.

So that's 8-3 vs. the NAIA. And 1-0 against "OTHERS" since Wabash dispatched Cincy - Clermont with ease!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on February 01, 2007, 10:05:04 PM
TigerFan:
Witt did not have a pep band as recently as 2003. There was a half-a**ed attempt at a pep band run by a high school director that failed after 2 years. When I arrived on campus in 2003, myself and a student that would end up becoming my fraternity brother, who was a senior that year, started the current incarnation of the pep band. It is really hard to get a lot of people there and despite offering "refreshments" after the game we cannot convince people to come and play. So this year especially, myself a senior and trying to get the younger kids to lead the band, has not been exactly a banner year.

Also, the Music Department won't support us. they don't believe in the "kind of music" we play. It's not classical or romantic, so they don't want it. They vehemently denied that there had ever been a marching band at Witt when in fact I've seen the pictures of the band from the 50's marching on the field. Odd situation which makes it that much harder to get anything done.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2007, 10:06:17 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 01, 2007, 09:58:57 PM
DC - That's all well and good for Witt and Woo - but then there's the other 8....

Kenyon beat Myers

Ohio Wesleyan lost to Aquinas and triumphed over Notre Dame (Ohio)

Wabash beat IU-South Bend and lost to Oliver Nazarene.

Allegheny, Dension, Earlham, Hiram, Oberlin didn't play NAIA teams.

So that's 8-3 vs. the NAIA. And 1-0 against "OTHERS" since Wabash dispatched Cincy - Clermont with ease!

Thanks; I was too lazy to look up the other 8's schedules.   :P

Aquinas is 15-9 and ranked #20 in NAIA-II; Olivet Nazarene is 14-7 and ranked #25 in NAIA-I.  The others are unranked.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 02, 2007, 05:55:44 AM
Quote from: Witt4ever on February 01, 2007, 02:37:25 PMYes, Walsh won the NAIA II title  in 2005 with UC transfer Robert Whaley. He was selected in the 5th round of the NBA draft by the Utah Jazz

The NBA draft only has two rounds. Whaley was drafted in the second round by the Jazz with the 51st overall pick.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fighting_scots on February 02, 2007, 10:46:50 AM
For those that can't be at Timken on Sat, the Live Video feed info:

http://www.wooster.edu/athletics/mb/news/2006-07/teamline.php

Game day info:

http://www.wooster.edu/athletics/mb/news/2006-07/wittenberg.php

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2007, 12:15:41 PM
Ah, but back in the day, the NBA had 10 round drafts, which was weird because the rosters were 11 or 12 at most. And the ABA had a draft every two weeks or so, and they usually only traveled with 10 players.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 02, 2007, 12:33:50 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 02, 2007, 12:15:41 PM
Ah, but back in the day, the NBA had 10 round drafts, which was weird because the rosters were 11 or 12 at most. And the ABA had a draft every two weeks or so, and they usually only traveled with 10 players.

And there were fewer teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 02, 2007, 12:42:36 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 01, 2007, 10:06:17 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 01, 2007, 09:58:57 PM
DC - That's all well and good for Witt and Woo - but then there's the other 8....

Kenyon beat Myers

Ohio Wesleyan lost to Aquinas and triumphed over Notre Dame (Ohio)

Wabash beat IU-South Bend and lost to Oliver Nazarene.

Allegheny, Dension, Earlham, Hiram, Oberlin didn't play NAIA teams.

So that's 8-3 vs. the NAIA. And 1-0 against "OTHERS" since Wabash dispatched Cincy - Clermont with ease!

Thanks; I was too lazy to look up the other 8's schedules.   :P

Aquinas is 15-9 and ranked #20 in NAIA-II; Olivet Nazarene is 14-7 and ranked #25 in NAIA-I.  The others are unranked.

Aquinas is a good but not great NAIA team, not very deep and young..........the same Calvin team thats struggled with everyone beat them by 16 and 9  in November and December at home.  Hope needed a last second 3 to win in their gym.  Although Aquinas typically plays very hard and well vs their MIAA neighbors.  Aquinas could finish 2nd in this years MIAA with some luck.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 02, 2007, 02:22:44 PM
guys why are we talking about NAIA when we have the biggest game yet to date to discuss...............and we have wittenberg wooster as well
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 02, 2007, 02:28:37 PM
Quote from: fighting_scots on February 02, 2007, 10:46:50 AM
For those that can't be at Timken on Sat, the Live Video feed info:

http://www.wooster.edu/athletics/mb/news/2006-07/teamline.php

Game day info:

http://www.wooster.edu/athletics/mb/news/2006-07/wittenberg.php

GO SCOTS!


Is there a charge with Teamline?

Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2007, 02:32:10 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 02, 2007, 02:28:37 PM
Quote from: fighting_scots on February 02, 2007, 10:46:50 AM
For those that can't be at Timken on Sat, the Live Video feed info:

http://www.wooster.edu/athletics/mb/news/2006-07/teamline.php

Game day info:

http://www.wooster.edu/athletics/mb/news/2006-07/wittenberg.php

GO SCOTS!



Is there a charge with Teamline?

Thanks.

Not for this game, at least.  Click the "Live Video feed info" link that fighting_scots has provided for more information.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 02, 2007, 02:35:32 PM
Quote from: tigerup07 on February 01, 2007, 10:05:04 PM
TigerFan:
Witt did not have a pep band as recently as 2003. There was a half-a**ed attempt at a pep band run by a high school director that failed after 2 years. When I arrived on campus in 2003, myself and a student that would end up becoming my fraternity brother, who was a senior that year, started the current incarnation of the pep band. It is really hard to get a lot of people there and despite offering "refreshments" after the game we cannot convince people to come and play. So this year especially, myself a senior and trying to get the younger kids to lead the band, has not been exactly a banner year.

Also, the Music Department won't support us. they don't believe in the "kind of music" we play. It's not classical or romantic, so they don't want it. They vehemently denied that there had ever been a marching band at Witt when in fact I've seen the pictures of the band from the 50's marching on the field. Odd situation which makes it that much harder to get anything done.


To my knowledge, Witt never has had a marching band.  Can you get enough detail from the band pictures you have seen to see if it was one of the high school bands?

In the 70s and 80s, they would have local high school bands, a lot of time from Springfield North or Shawnee.

Halftime entertainment was often provided by the local "Frisbee dog."

So, do they still ring the bell after a score in the football game?

I would think that people would come and play in a pep band because they enjoyed playing whether they liked basketball or not.  I guess not, huh?  Have you thought about asking members of the local community to participate?  You might have a bit more luck with people just looking for an opportunity to play.

Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2007, 02:35:51 PM
Oh, pennstghs, why should a mundane topic about a 'game' get in the way of our mindless pontificating?

If you must - Wooster 80, Wittenberg 69.

Satisified???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 02, 2007, 02:40:10 PM
I'm not sure how "big" this Witt/Woo game is relative to some of the other Witt/Woo clashes of recent history.  Wooster is two games clear of Witt right now.  With a remaining schedule of Hiram, @Wabash, @Kenyon, and OWU, I can't see where Wooster drops another game to give Witt a chance to bring on any serious thoughts of a co-championship situation.  You could make the argument that OWU played Wooster tough the first time around and they would have a chance to beat the Scots, but I doubt seriously that Scots at home on Senior Day with something to play for would let such an upset happen.  In the grand scheme of things, this game probably isn't going to affect much of anything in the standings...perhaps that's why we're not seeing as much buzz as we usually do for these games. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 02, 2007, 02:42:18 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 02, 2007, 02:40:10 PM
I'm not sure how "big" this Witt/Woo game is relative to some of the other Witt/Woo clashes of recent history.  Wooster is two games clear of Witt right now. 

I would think that is a very big game in terms of the postseason.  There is no guarantee that they will meet in the tournamet or even that one of the two will win the tournament.

Go Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 02, 2007, 02:44:24 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 02, 2007, 02:42:18 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 02, 2007, 02:40:10 PM
I'm not sure how "big" this Witt/Woo game is relative to some of the other Witt/Woo clashes of recent history.  Wooster is two games clear of Witt right now. 

I would think that is a very big game in terms of the postseason.  There is no guarantee that they will meet in the tournamet or even that one of the two will win the tournament.

Go Tigers!

Also, pennstghs made the following excellent point over on the OAC board:

OAC fans may want to watch the Wittenberg Wooster game very closely as this game could be the difference in having just the conference tourney champ or adding another team as an at large because i think it Wittenberg wins that locks up our NCAA chances.

Call me an oldtimer, but when I think of Witt, I still think of the OAC.

TigerFan_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 02, 2007, 02:49:44 PM
I just tried to post a comment to Pat's blog/story about February and tourney time.

It told me that I had to log in and that my ID was wrong.

Does D3Hoops.com require a different login/registration than posting on these boards?

Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 02, 2007, 02:51:13 PM
I just went over 200 posts.

I noticed that I now have karma privileges.

What an awesome responsibility.  I hope to use the power wisely!  :)

TF_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2007, 02:51:57 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 02, 2007, 02:49:44 PM
I just tried to post a comment to Pat's blog/story about February and tourney time.

It told me that I had to log in and that my ID was wrong.

Does D3Hoops.com require a different login/registration than posting on these boards?

Thanks.

Yes.  At the bottom of the post on the Daily Dose (http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/), click "Register to Comment." 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 02, 2007, 02:53:39 PM
I'm thinking that Witt is one of the 19 best runners-up in the country whether or not they beat Wooster at all this year.  23-5 (Witt's record if they don't beat Wooster here or in the conference tourney finals) gets you in.  Maybe not so much before the dance expanded last year, but with 19 at-large bids, 23-5 is good enough. 

It'll be easier to make this call when the NCAA starts putting out the regional rankings. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2007, 02:56:54 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 02, 2007, 02:53:39 PM
I'm thinking that Witt is one of the 19 best runners-up in the country whether or not they beat Wooster at all this year.  23-5 (Witt's record if they don't beat Wooster here or in the conference tourney finals) gets you in.  Maybe not so much before the dance expanded last year, but with 19 at-large bids, 23-5 is good enough. 

It'll be easier to make this call when the NCAA starts putting out the regional rankings. 

Maybe, but all five of those losses would be in-region, and the regional wins are overstocked with low-QoWI teams like, well, the bottom 7 NCAC teams.  If Witt doesn't beat Wooster at least once, it'll be touch-and-go for them on Selection Sunday. 

Regional rankings are out on Wednesday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 02, 2007, 03:10:25 PM
Of course I'm assuming that the chalk holds throughout the conference tournaments and the 19 Pool C's go to the next best 19 teams.  Of course that won't happen...without crunching any numbers my hunch would be to say that 23-5 probably would have Witt watching very closely at the conference tournaments around the country...4-5 teams stealing bids could be enough to force Witt out under the 0-3 vs. Wooster scenario. 

Here's a question...would it be more damning for Witt to beat Wooster Saturday and then lose to one of the bottom 7 of the league in the tournament, or lose to Wooster and make the tournament finals?  I think there's no shame in losing to Wooster three times (twice at Timken), but tournament teams shouldn't be getting beat by the lower 7 in our league.  The QOWI numbers may not reflect that, but that would be my perception.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2007, 03:22:20 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 02, 2007, 03:10:25 PM
Here's a question...would it be more damning for Witt to beat Wooster Saturday and then lose to one of the bottom 7 of the league in the tournament, or lose to Wooster and make the tournament finals?  I think there's no shame in losing to Wooster three times (twice at Timken), but tournament teams shouldn't be getting beat by the lower 7 in our league.  The QOWI numbers may not reflect that, but that would be my perception.

Strictly analytically, it would be marginally (very marginally) better for Witt to beat Wooster and lose to a "bottom 7" team.  They'd have the same regional won/lost percentage, and they'd have the same QoWI.*  Beating Wooster would give them a boost in the "results vs. regionally ranked opponents" and "head-to-head results" categories, both among the five primary selection criteria; a win over (say) Allegheny doesn't do that.

*QoWI is misleading; I encourage everyone to break it down to component parts.  There's a home/away component, a win/lose component, and a opponent's win % component.  The home/away component is worth 1 point for away (or neutral) no matter who you play, so that part can be tallied up before the season begins.  The win/lose component is worth 8 points for a win, no matter who you beat, so that part can be tallied using only the regional record.  What's left is the opponent's regional win % strata.  It is possible that a loss to Allegheny (or whoever) will push Allegheny over the threshold of the next-highest stratum (and thus earn Witt an extra 4 points, win or lose, two for each of the home/away games), but it's equally likely that a win over that team will push them down a tier; so it pretty much evens out in the long run.  So beating Wooster and losing to Allegheny likely produces the exact same QoWI as losing to Wooster and beating Allegheny.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on February 02, 2007, 04:21:04 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 02, 2007, 02:35:32 PM

To my knowledge, Witt never has had a marching band.  Can you get enough detail from the band pictures you have seen to see if it was one of the high school bands?[/qoute]

Yeah, it's definitely a Witt marching band, W's and everything.

[qoute]
So, do they still ring the bell after a score in the football game?
Yes, yes they do. And the cheerleaders do pushups.

Quote
I would think that people would come and play in a pep band because they enjoyed playing whether they liked basketball or not.  I guess not, huh?  Have you thought about asking members of the local community to participate?  You might have a bit more luck with people just looking for an opportunity to play.
The students get bored if they're not into the game. Just a fact of life, I guess. College rules are stricter than high school rules regarding when the band can play and whatnot. So we play less than some people expect. With respect to community players, that's the reason it folded in 2001. The local high school director that was in charge of it tended to favor his students when assigning parts and chairs, and the Witt students resented that because it was the Wittenberg Pep Band, and the students stopped going and they were in fact the core of the group, so there weren't enough people left over to keep it going.

So many politics even at small schools... who'da thunk?

Thanks.
[/quote]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scotty on February 02, 2007, 06:46:44 PM
in regards to pep bands, Michigan Tech in the UP has by far the best i have ever seen at their hockey games...100 plus and well coached/rehearsed...i highly recommend the drive as the local airport only has 6 flights a day  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on February 02, 2007, 06:59:23 PM
Quote from: scotty on February 02, 2007, 06:46:44 PM
in regards to pep bands, Michigan Tech in the UP has by far the best i have ever seen at their hockey games...100 plus and well coached/rehearsed...i highly recommend the drive as the local airport only has 6 flights a day  ;)

I know one of the guys who used to play in the MT Pep Band... don't know why anyone would want to be a yuper though, lol. I have heard some recordings and seen the crazy striped coveralls and everything. Seems fun... lots more fun than Witt's anyway.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 02, 2007, 09:20:16 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 02, 2007, 02:40:10 PM
I'm not sure how "big" this Witt/Woo game is relative to some of the other Witt/Woo clashes of recent history. 

Wally - it is a "big" rivalry game every time that Wooster and Wittenberg play! ;D  .....kind of like Wabash vs. DePauw!  :P

Timken will be rocking tomorrow night and the Wooster students are encouraging all Scots fans to wear black clothing so we can welcome the Tigers with a "blackout".

Wooster needs to win all their remaining games if they want a good chance at hosting game(s) in the NCAA tourney.  As David noted, Wittenberg also could use a big win over Wooster to increase their chances of a NCAA Pool C berth if they don't win the automatic bid in the NCAC tourney.  I'll have my black clothing on tomorrow night!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 02, 2007, 09:25:03 PM
RE: Pep Bands

Wooster has fielded a pep band for the last 3-4 years now, I believe.  Since DC occasionaly speaks of his time in the pep band, it obviously existed in earlier years, too.  However, I don't believe that had been one for a number of years, since I don't recall one when I went to Woo games as a young kid.  The Pep Band plays a live national anthem (I've never really liked recorded, loudspeaker versions) and is led by Ned Brooks, the assistant band director at Wooster and a retired band director from Triway High School in the area.  Since my move prior to this season, I have not seen Wooster at a home game this year, so I don't know how the actual participation for pep band has been this season, but I always enjoyed the study break when I played in it (I was even the fill-in director a few times) and I appreciate how a pep band can add a lot to the atmosphere of a game.  (Nothing worse than a late timeout at a key moment where the energy just dies away into silence...  :'( )

I'm glad that Witt has brought a pep band back.  Hope you're able to keep it going, tigerup07!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 02, 2007, 09:28:34 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 02, 2007, 09:20:16 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 02, 2007, 02:40:10 PM
I'm not sure how "big" this Witt/Woo game is relative to some of the other Witt/Woo clashes of recent history. 

Wally - it is a "big" rivalry game every time that Wooster and Wittenberg play! ;D  .....kind of like Wabash vs. DePauw!  :P

Timken will be rocking tomorrow night and the Wooster students are encouraging all Scots fans to wear black clothing so we can welcome the Tigers with a "blackout".

My on-campus Wooster sources say that campus reaction to the "blackout" idea has been strong, and that awareness of the game in the sudent body is good.  I suspect students will post a stong turnout, and the atmosphere in the gym should be incredible.  Wow, I wish wish I could be there to see this one. 

Root extra hard for me, Scots Posters!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 02, 2007, 09:35:59 PM
Man, I would love to see the Blackout, too.  Some take and then post pictures, please!!  Thanks
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on February 02, 2007, 09:52:18 PM
Wow, I'm really disappointed in Witt's student body right now, and even more so the administration and athletic department. There was almost no publicity for this game. The only thing was an e-mail advertising a "fan bus" to Wooster... only problem is it was gonna cost every one who wanted to ride a total of $26 for the ticket and the ride. I heard from an inside source today that NO STUDENTS signed up. I'm heading up myself with a fraternity brother meeting my mom and dad, both Witt alumni, and I know that there is always a large group of Witt students that goes up themselves to "tailgate" or whatever, who don't want to ride the bus, but still no students? But I know why it happened. $26 is a lot to charge a college kid who's having trouble finding enough money to buy pizza on Saturday nights, let alone enough quarters to do laundry.

I'm disappointed that Witt didn't do more to involve the student body with this, and that they didn't at least TRY to lower the cost for the bus by paying off more of it themselves. They brought it on themselves this time. Despite all this, I still expect to see all the faithful students I've grown accustomed to seeing at home games.

Although the Witt athletic department did start a "Code Red" theme with selected home games, but it really hasn't caught on. There's just so much apathy among the students.

Can't wait to see the game tomorrow. This'll probably be my last post unless I sneak one in tomorrow before I leave. Good luck to both sides, and if you see a college student with a red wittenberg hoodie, cleveland indians hat, and beard, that's me, say hi!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on February 02, 2007, 10:40:38 PM
wow i wish i could be there...i want to see the blackout. that'd be cool to see. i'm a witt fan and that would be cool.

and i can't even listen or watch the game. im going down to the super bowl             tomorrow, leaving at 630....so i cant watch it. *sniff sniff* :'( and yes i would rather wait and watch the game and then go to the super bowl. but i've already paid for my ticket so ya. i am disappointed.


so seeing as this may be my last post before the game....let me go ahead and get some stuff out of the way


boooo - to all the bad calls that the refs may(or will) make

SIT DOWN - to moore as he is at mid court yelling at the refs

scoreboard, scorebord - to moores maniacs as they go crazy over a 2-pointer that                 brings wooster within 10 points with 1 minute left

MAYBE NEXT TIME - to the wooster fans as i exit the gym with a witt win 87 - 83

i'll miss sunday morning, waking up with out my oice from yelliing and having my hands be a little sore from all the clapping that i would do.

lets go tigers, beat them scots!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2007, 10:44:10 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 02, 2007, 09:25:03 PM
RE: Pep Bands

Wooster has fielded a pep band for the last 3-4 years now, I believe.  Since DC occasionaly speaks of his time in the pep band, it obviously existed in earlier years, too.  However, I don't believe that had been one for a number of years, since I don't recall one when I went to Woo games as a young kid.  The Pep Band plays a live national anthem (I've never really liked recorded, loudspeaker versions) and is led by Ned Brooks, the assistant band director at Wooster and a retired band director from Triway High School in the area.  Since my move prior to this season, I have not seen Wooster at a home game this year, so I don't know how the actual participation for pep band has been this season, but I always enjoyed the study break when I played in it (I was even the fill-in director a few times) and I appreciate how a pep band can add a lot to the atmosphere of a game.  (Nothing worse than a late timeout at a key moment where the energy just dies away into silence...  :'( )

I'm glad that Witt has brought a pep band back.  Hope you're able to keep it going, tigerup07!

Yes, Wooster presently has a pep band.  At the Allegheny game, they were even all dressed alike, and offhand I'd say there's about 20 of them.  I always enjoyed being in the pep band in high school and college.  Our college pep band even traveled to some away games; I remember playing at B-W when there was a Berea-wide blackout and we had to improvise just to pass the time.  But I don't know if we were any good; probably not, since I was allowed to play.  As for the current incarnation of the Scot Pep Band...well...uhm...I appreciate the effort.   :P

I'll be at the JV game with Posting Up Hall of Famer "sac" if anyone wants to come over and say hello.  If all goes well, we'll be on the south (media table) side, in the top row of the lower section, dead in the middle.  I'll be dressed entirely in black... ;D

Quote from: gotigers on February 02, 2007, 10:40:38 PM
scoreboard, scorebord - to moores maniacs as they go crazy over a 2-pointer that                 brings wooster within 10 points with 1 minute left

MAYBE NEXT TIME - to the wooster fans as i exit the gym with a witt win 87 - 83

Sounds like a great final minute, anyway!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 02, 2007, 10:49:48 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 02, 2007, 10:44:10 PM
As for the current incarnation of the Scot Pep Band...well...uhm...I appreciate the effort.   :P

Hmmm.  Sounds like they could use my saxphone talents.   :)

On a more serious note, though, just as the overall attendance will be up tomorrow, the pep band will be more in force, too.  That should help their overall sound quality.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2007, 11:00:23 PM
In defense of the pep band, they have to play in Timken Gym, which has the acoustics of an abattoir.  The PA announcer sounds like he should be teaching at Charlie Brown's school ("mwah mwah, mwah mwah mwah, mwah?")  Within 5 feet of the band, they may sound like the Glenn Miller Orchestra, but by the time it reaches me on the other side of the gym...well...let's just say I'm glad that scotsbrod has cleared up my confusion over what that noise they make is while everyone else is standing up and facing the flag.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 02, 2007, 11:08:54 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 02, 2007, 10:44:10 PM

I'll be at the JV game with Posting Up Hall of Famer "sac"

Sounds like a Hope fan on a scouting trip to me! ;) ;D :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 02, 2007, 11:11:41 PM
For some odd reason I don't believe students at Wittenberg are not attending the game because it would cost them 26 dollars.  I think the Financial Aid that Wittenberg offers would make up for the money spent to watch what I believe to be one of the biggest riveralies in college basketball.   I have been apart of the NCAC now for 8 years, and every year it comes down to Wooster/Wittenberg to determaine who will host the NCAC final 2 rounds.  I'm guessing the student body at Wittenberg just doesn't understand the importance of this game.  (Their loss.)

I'm not suppose to take the company laptop to Miami with me this weekend, but I think I'm going to do it to keep track of this Game.  Only bad news I'll down there with my boss... oh wait he is my Dad so I think i'll get away with it.

Hope it's a good one and deep down I hope Wittenberg will Host because if Earlham gets past the first round I'd be willing to make the trip to Springfield for the NCAC tourney, don't think i can make the trip to Wooster again!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 02, 2007, 11:12:46 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 02, 2007, 11:08:54 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 02, 2007, 10:44:10 PM

I'll be at the JV game with Posting Up Hall of Famer "sac"

Sounds like a Hope fan on a scouting trip to me! ;) ;D :)

who me?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 02, 2007, 11:47:55 PM
thank you tiger07 and earlhamalum for echoing my disappointments with the student turnout and involvement in wittenberg basketball.

i will not be able to attend the game after all as i got screwed and have to work and i can't lose my job, so calling off wouldnt be wise. ill be watching and listening though so go tigers, though i think we are going to show up to play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 02, 2007, 11:53:50 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 02, 2007, 11:00:23 PMIn defense of the pep band, they have to play in Timken Gym, which has the acoustics of an abattoir.  The PA announcer sounds like he should be teaching at Charlie Brown's school ("mwah mwah, mwah mwah mwah, mwah?")  Within 5 feet of the band, they may sound like the Glenn Miller Orchestra, but by the time it reaches me on the other side of the gym...well...let's just say I'm glad that scotsbrod has cleared up my confusion over what that noise they make is while everyone else is standing up and facing the flag.  :)

Lots of funny stuff here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 03, 2007, 12:28:44 AM
Quote from: tigerup07 on February 02, 2007, 09:52:18 PM
Although the Witt athletic department did start a "Code Red" theme with selected home games, but it really hasn't caught on. There's just so much apathy among the students.

A feeling I've been trying to change my entire four years here...

Best of luck to both squads tomorrow.  I'll be in Springfield calling the Witt women's game, then picking up the video broadcast and/or tuning into Scott Leo and Rob Lehner, who will have Witt's call for the game.

I know that things can usually get a little tense during Witt-Woo weeks (especially after the game), so let's just say these things once, and hopefully they won't be brought up again/lead to an all-out war:

1) Officials will make bad calls against both teams.
2) Wooster and Wittenberg people will stoop to the unnecessary levels of loud, vulgar chants directed at the other fan section.  The other section will respond likewise.  Rinse and repeat.
3) Somebody will take a hard foul that will not be as bad as it looks, but, because of the intensity of the rivalry, will generally be overreacted to by the fouled player's fan base.

Hopefully things won't get as out of hand as they did last time.  To everybody heading to Wooster for the game, enjoy yourselves.  For everyone else, have a pleasant viewing/listening experience.

GO TIGERS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 03, 2007, 12:41:23 AM
Gee, NCAC refs having issues? Say it isn't so!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2007, 12:46:37 AM
Excellent post, Josh. +K to you.  Enjoy the women's game; with four teams within a half-game of one another in 2nd thru 5th places (Denison has all but clinched the title,) it's a great race over there this season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on February 03, 2007, 11:49:10 AM
i think i will listen to the game tonight the hope game got canceld  till monday at so 7.30 so 3 games next week
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 01:32:36 PM
Quote from: hope1 on February 03, 2007, 11:49:10 AM
i think i will listen to the game tonight the hope game got canceld  till monday at so 7.30 so 3 games next week

Why is the game cancelled?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 01:37:24 PM
I just logged on to say "Go Tigers!"

This should be a great game.  I will be watching on the Wooster video feed.

Ideally, I would watch the Wooster feed and listen to the Witt call on the Worldwide Wittenberg Radio Network, but I'm not enough of a hardware guy to even know if that is possible to send one stream to the video and one stream to the audio.

If there are any hardcore hardware folks out there, that might be a good term project to work on.  Call your advisor now!

I'm not much for predicting scores, but I anticipate another close one.

TF_73
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 03, 2007, 01:39:55 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 01:32:36 PM
Quote from: hope1 on February 03, 2007, 11:49:10 AM
i think i will listen to the game tonight the hope game got canceld  till monday at so 7.30 so 3 games next week

Why is the game cancelled?

Looks like parts of Michigan are under a blizzard warning.  Check out the discussion on the conference's board: MIAA board (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4596.8055).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 03, 2007, 01:43:55 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 01:37:24 PM
Ideally, I would watch the Wooster feed and listen to the Witt call on the Worldwide Wittenberg Radio Network, but I'm not enough of a hardware guy to even know if that is possible to send one stream to the video and one stream to the audio.

It is indeed possible.  I've done it in the past, and plan on doing it again tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on February 03, 2007, 02:35:57 PM
GO TIGERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 02:57:52 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 03, 2007, 01:43:55 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 01:37:24 PM
Ideally, I would watch the Wooster feed and listen to the Witt call on the Worldwide Wittenberg Radio Network, but I'm not enough of a hardware guy to even know if that is possible to send one stream to the video and one stream to the audio.

It is indeed possible.  I've done it in the past, and plan on doing it again tonight.

Well, can you tell me how to do it?

Or do you just turn 'em both on and let 'er rip?

I just tried to get the video and nothing came across.

Thanks.  And, GO TIGERS!!!!

TF
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 03:01:35 PM

[/quote]

I just tried to get the video and nothing came across.

TF
[/quote]

Wow!  Talk about peaking too early;  I thought the game started at 3:00.  No wonder it's not on yet.

Or, maybe I was just testing the system.  Yeah, that's what I was doing.  ;D

TF_73
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 03:04:18 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 03, 2007, 01:39:55 PM
[Looks like parts of Michigan are under a blizzard warning.  Check out the discussion on the conference's board: MIAA board (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4596.8055).

We used to live in Kalamazoo and now live in Cincinnati.  We never get any good snow down here but they cancel school whenever there is an inch of snow.

I always tell my kids that nothing ever got cancelled when we lived up there.

I will check out the MIAA board.  Drive carefully anybody who is up that way.

TF
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 03, 2007, 03:12:35 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 02:57:52 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 03, 2007, 01:43:55 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 01:37:24 PM
Ideally, I would watch the Wooster feed and listen to the Witt call on the Worldwide Wittenberg Radio Network, but I'm not enough of a hardware guy to even know if that is possible to send one stream to the video and one stream to the audio.

It is indeed possible.  I've done it in the past, and plan on doing it again tonight.

Well, can you tell me how to do it?

Or do you just turn 'em both on and let 'er rip?

I just tried to get the video and nothing came across.

Thanks.  And, GO TIGERS!!!!

TF

Yeah, just fire em both up, and turn the volume down on the video.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 03, 2007, 03:21:13 PM
Some advance thoughts on the potential implications of tonight's game:

As Pat's Daily Dose (http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/?p=243) from a few days ago noted, Woo-Witt carries some interesting Pool C implications, especially for Wittenberg's tourney hopes.

Best as I can figure, these are the relevant stats for both Woo and Witt, coming into the game:

Team, Regional Record (%), QoWI

Wooster:      13-1 (.929), 10.143
Wittenberg:  12-3 (.800), 9.400

After a Wittenberg win:

Wooster:      13-2 (.866), 9.867
Wittenberg:  13-3 (.813), 9.750

After a Wooster win:

Wooster:      14-1 (.933), 10.400
Wittenberg:  12-4 (.750), 9.250

The two teams pull more even if Wittenberg wins- both probably stay in the hunt for a Pool C.  If Wooster wins again, though, Wittenberg's Pool C sheet starts looking pretty bad.  They would have to pick up another loss in the conference tourney (to be a Pool C), for at least 5 in-region losses, and they would end up 0-3 or 0-4 against (likely) regionally-ranked opponents Wooster and Ohio Northern.  Also, Witt doesn't have much left on the schedule to help their QoWI out, with (as of now) a 12-pt game vs. OWU and an 11-pointer at Allegheny countered by two home maximum 8-pt games against Hiram and Wabash.

Without a Wittenberg win tonight, they could end with an end-of-the-year line like this:

Wittenberg:  18-5, (.728), 9.391*

See last year's Daily Dose (http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/?p=146#more-146) where they projected the Pool Cs, and you'll see that such a Pool C line would be very suspect to make a March appearance.

* This is approximate, but probably even generous.  I gave Witt 10 QoWI pts. for the NCAC tourney game they would host (probably would be an 8pt. game), 12 for a semifinal on the road, and 7 for a loss to Wooster in the finals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 03:21:54 PM
I updated my spreadsheet for the last Witt / Woo game.

In the last eleven games, Witt has won 6 and Wooster has won 5.

The total score of the 11 games is Wooster 800 Witt 798.

Talk about close!

Being a numbers guy, I'd sorta like to see Witt win by 2 tonight, although I would prefer a safer margin.

Go Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 03:24:36 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 03, 2007, 03:12:35 PM
Yeah, just fire em both up, and turn the volume down on the video.

Ah, very cool.  I didn't think of that.

As I like to say, I don't have to know the answer; I just have to know someone who does.

Thanks a lot.

Go Tigers
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 03, 2007, 04:28:25 PM
I just had one thing to add before I make the trek up the hill to Timken:


GO WOO!!!  BEAT WITT!!!

And PS:

IT'S FREAKING  COLD OUTSIDE!!!  >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on February 03, 2007, 04:35:12 PM
Very excited for the game tonight and to witness the "blackout".  The key for Wooster is to neutralize Witt's big men under the basket and to rebound, rebound, rebound.  I'm hoping that Vandervaart being out won't do too much damage to Wooster's rebounding.  Here's to hoping that no Woo big men go into foul trouble.
Let's go SCOTS! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on February 03, 2007, 06:41:40 PM
woooo hooo!!!!! i get to watch the game now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

my friends car (the one we were taking to the game) brake pad went bad or something (im not a car guy) so weare leaving very early tommorrow. can't wait to watch witt beat up on them scotts. someone definitly needs to post a good picture of the black out if they can. witt needs to do a red out or something.....u know what i mean all two students wear red shirts to the game. lol

but anyway my prediction for the game

witt 87
woo 83
borchers (sp?) leading all scorers with 25

GO TIGERS!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 03, 2007, 07:39:54 PM
10-5 Witt early on.  Gregg Hill is lights out so far, 3-3 (including 2-2 from 3) for 8 points.

18-5 now with 13 minutes to go in the first half.  Poor shooting from Wooster doing them in, as they are 2-7 from the field, as well as foul trouble (6 already for Wooster, including 2 offensive).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 03, 2007, 07:42:30 PM
First, let me say it's pretty cool to have your team shown with streaming video.

Second, Witt has started out hot. Having never seen a game at Timken is this crowd normal or is it usually more rowdy than this? I think the crowd needs to get off their hands here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on February 03, 2007, 08:09:40 PM
witt  40 wooster  34 at half time
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 03, 2007, 08:11:11 PM
Fun first half. Wooster did well to cut it to 6. I'll keep watching and listening because for the second straight game there is no Wabash audio stream.  >:( >:( >:(

Seriously, no stream at home? What is this? 1996?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 03, 2007, 08:13:31 PM
Impressive first half for Gregg Hill (12 points), but Witt needs to get Borchers (1 point) going if they plan on holding this lead.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 08:19:33 PM
Quote from: gotigers on February 03, 2007, 06:41:40 PM
my friends car (the one we were taking to the game) brake pad went bad or something (im not a car guy) so weare leaving very early tommorrow.
GO TIGERS!!!!!!

The game will be over by tomorrow.   ;D

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 08:22:13 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 03, 2007, 03:12:35 PM
Yeah, just fire em both up, and turn the volume down on the video.

To get the 'A' for the semester project, you need to synch the Witt audio with the video.

So far, I've predicted every made shot since the video is about three seconds behind the audio.

TF
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 08:23:57 PM
I tuned in a little late.

Oh, it's coming in now, I didn't miss it after all.

Artie is wearing the burgundy pinstripe, "more purple than brown". according to Scott Leo.

Great update.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 08:33:26 PM
First sign of panic out of Wooster:

One of the Woo announcers just said "It's too early to panic ... "  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 08:34:50 PM
Gotta stop those 3-pointers out of the corner!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 03, 2007, 08:35:24 PM
If anyone happens to be interested I got a text message update from Wally_Wabash that the LGs are up 28-15 over Denison with about six minutes left in the first half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 08:35:53 PM
Hill replies with a 3.

That's the best response!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 08:36:33 PM
This is starting to look like a 3-point shooting contest.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 03, 2007, 08:40:44 PM
The shooting here is insane. This is going to go down to the wire after all. The crowd is finally seriously into it.

Halftime in Crawfordsville:

Denison 24
Wabash 42
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 08:42:25 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 08:36:33 PM
This is starting to look like a 3-point shooting contest.

The Tigers have to shut Fulk down in the corner.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 03, 2007, 08:54:37 PM
Shaping up to be another classic...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 03, 2007, 08:57:19 PM
On a whim I decided to try the Wabash stream again and now it works.

17:30 left in the 2nd half 44-26 Wabash
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 09:03:14 PM
Wooster takes the lead by one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 03, 2007, 09:05:28 PM
Tied with 1:11 left.

Witt by 3 with 10 secs left, and the video goes blue!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 03, 2007, 09:08:29 PM
I'm bad luck for streams. The video just took a dump.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on February 03, 2007, 09:09:35 PM
Lost the feed too with under a minute to go.... Update please!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 09:10:16 PM
The day the video died.

Tiger radio network to the rescue.

Tigers up 3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 03, 2007, 09:10:33 PM
wow what a game-witt up 3 with 11 seconds left
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 09:11:03 PM
Feed is back.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 09:12:21 PM
8 seconds left.  Tigers by 3.

Denbow falls Johnson.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 09:12:52 PM
Tigers up one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 09:14:14 PM
5.4 seconds 72-71

Hill fouled with 4.6 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 09:15:38 PM
Tigers up 3 with about 4 seconds left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 09:16:34 PM
The Witt AD is telling the students to be cool in the event of a win!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 09:18:24 PM
Tigers win 74 - 71.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 03, 2007, 09:20:05 PM
Denison cut a Wabash 22 point lead to 14.

Denison 40
Wabash 54 6:00 left
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 03, 2007, 09:20:23 PM
Congrats on the great win, Witt!

Now we just have to see if there will be a rubber match.

Speaking of a rubber match, I just remembered that these teams played a three point game the first time, too.  So after 80 minutes of basketball this season, Wooster and Wittenberg are tied at 139-139.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 03, 2007, 09:20:55 PM
Awesome game from Gregg Hill.  I must say I'm surprised that the Tigers were able to win with a low production from Borchers, bu it happened.

Can't wait to hear reaction from peple actually at the game.

GO TIGERS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 03, 2007, 09:21:19 PM
Final Wittenberg 74 Wooster 71

Wow what a game it appears-i only picked up live video coverage from the second half on, but disappointed i couldn't be there. Whoever said it depending on Gregg Hill being contained hit it dead on as he had 24 and led Witt big time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 03, 2007, 09:21:56 PM
well wittenberg has to avenge the OWU monkey now on their other shoulder now
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 03, 2007, 09:23:53 PM
We need Tim Vandervaart.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Superfoot Wallace on February 03, 2007, 09:26:46 PM
73Tigerfan, gave you a +k for the semester A project comment.

Was my first time watching a Tiger basketball game.  Thank You Woo 'W' club for the video stream.  Sad to say I was one of those silent majority lamented earlier in the thread having never gone to a Witt game during my time in Springfield.

Anyway, the Tigers never fail to impress.  Batting a thousand for Tiger viewing and success regarding basketball, maybe should go crawl back into my hole now.

On a lighter note, think number 12 (Nowicki?) and his super socks should be dubbed Herr Professor ala Andone.  That guy kills me.  Good shakes at the topof the key.

Good job Tigers, am personally not a fan of Berea and still say they didnt score that last TD in 1997.

signed,
OGHennyLo
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 03, 2007, 09:33:54 PM
Final from Chadwick Court:

Denison 52
Wabash 63
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on February 03, 2007, 09:35:25 PM
Great to see the game live. Thanks to COW, I get to register an informed opinion. Thank you again COW.  
I cringed every time I saw Huelsman guarding Cooper off a soft screen, but nothing ever seemed to come from it.  Why didn't Cooper take him to the hole?  I know, he did everything else....
Borchers was a non-combatant on offense, but a bear on the defensive boards.
Basically just a solid team effort from the Tigers, helped by good shooting in the first half, and a shortage of Tiger turnovers
Wooster never let up, though, and it resulted in another classic.
The Woo announcers were good, but the lack of a constant clock and scoreboard were a distraction.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on February 03, 2007, 10:16:49 PM
...was a distraction?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 03, 2007, 10:40:19 PM
Not sure if this has been mentioned on this board, but I've been told that OWU's Ben Chojnacki is out for the season with a knee injury.

If this is the case, that is a huge loss for OWU and could really shake thing sup come tournament time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 03, 2007, 11:02:06 PM
Your NCAC scores:

Witt 74, Wooster 71
Wabash 63, Denison 52
Hiram 82, Oberlin 74
OWU 87, Allegheny 58
Kenyon 53, Earlham 47

And our current standings are:

Wooster 11-1
Witt 10-2
OWU 8-4
Hiram 6-6
Wabash 6-6
Kenyon 5-7
Earlham 5-7
Allegheny 4-8
Oberlin 3-9
Denison 2-10
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2007, 11:03:00 PM
Usually I come away from a Wooster loss to Wittenberg shaking my head and questioning whether Wooster is really as good as they are cracked up to be.  But not tonight.  Tonight's game was a great game between two great teams, and I'm proud of the effort Wooster gave to come from 15 points down to make it another nailbiter.  I think you can count on one hand the number of teams in D3 that could have played Witt to a standstill tonight.  Both teams were outstanding, Witt (and especially Gregg Hill) was just a wee bit more outstanding. 

Sure there were problems; Wooster came out a little tight like they usually do against the Tigers; and at least part of Witt's early lead was that their shots barely went in and ours barely rimmed out, but that's basketball.  I'm sure this will be disagreed with, but I thought the officiating was as good as could reasonably be expected (did I agree with every call and non-call?  Of course not, but what's new about that) and did not materially alter the outcome.

With Witt up three and 10 seconds left on the clock, the Tigers made a smart play and then the Scots made a poor one, and that was the game.  The smart play was the foul on Johnson before anyone could set up to launch a tying three.  Johnson converted, then Witt got the ball into Hill, who icily converted his free throws.  Then with 4.6 seconds left, Wooster was in the same situation, and needed to run a play that resulted in a three point shot rather than a one-and-one foul, but they execution of that play (a baseball pass) was just poor, and Witt was able to defend it and win the game. 

In other words, just another in a long series of great games between these rivals.

The Wooster students were an embarrassment, of course, as was the evident lack of any attempt by any school officials to civilize them.  I'm ashamed that my school would permit such behavior.  "Boo on Woo."

Congratulations to Witt on a great victory.  I look forward to a potential rubber match in three weeks, and then to perhaps a fourth matchup in the sectional finals.  :)

Last note: it was great to have sac along for the ride.  I think he had a good time soaking up our atmosphere and excellent game, and he didn't even have to miss Hope at Albion.  Best of both worlds!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pointlem on February 03, 2007, 11:15:35 PM
As an MIAA/Hope fan with nothing doin' this evening I watched the Woo-Witt Internet broadcast and was quite impressed with two things:  the high calibre play (excellent shooting, tight defense, few turnovers), and the excellent Internet broadcast.  Of course, Hope is familiar with the Witt defense from last March, and Calvin with the Woo offense from last December.  Maybe some combination of these teams will have a chance to get reacquainted come March . . . by which time I gather Wooster's injured post player could return?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on February 03, 2007, 11:19:21 PM
Victory is in my eyes and I cant see...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 03, 2007, 11:21:40 PM
Congratulations to Wittenberg on the win and a very well played game tonight.

Just got back from Timken and I will second David's point that this was a great game between two very strong teams. :)

The Wooster community showed up in force tonight as Timken was full and it was virtually all black.

Wittenberg deserved the win tonight because they shot the ball extremely well as evidenced by 9 of 17 (53%) on three pointers and 49% overall.  Witt also maintained their poise and took excellent care of the ball with only 8 turnovers.

Wooster won the battle of the boards but they only made 8 of 22 three pointers which was one difference in this game.  The other difference was TURNOVERS as Wooster had 12 of them and 2 of those were at a critical point in the game.

Brandon Johnson had a turnover with 1:27 remaining in the game and then James Cooper also had a turnover with 0:44 seconds left that allowed Wittenberg to build the three point lead when Gregg Hill made his final shot.

The last play by Wooster made no sense to me either as Wooster actually tried a long pass to Port (low probability of completing it) who was inside the 3 point line.  Even if Port had caught the ball, Wittenberg could have fouled him and he would have shot only 2 free throws.   The pass should have been designed for the halfcourt line area, a couple of quick dribbles and launch the three point attempt for a possible tie.

Wooster needs to win their remaining games if they want to host the NCAC tourney.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 03, 2007, 11:22:57 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 03, 2007, 11:03:00 PMI'm sure this will be disagreed with, but I thought the officiating was as good as could reasonably be expected (did I agree with every call and non-call?  Of course not, but what's new about that) and did not materially alter the outcome.

You know, if you were sitting where you usually do, I don't know how you could even begin to venture an opinion on this.  The game appears almost sterile from so far away, just as it does when watching the televised replay.  Things look very, very different from courtside.  If you want to be politically correct with your remarks, fine. But you're dead wrong.

The NCAC officiating was, as usual, a serious embarrassment to the league and to DIII basketball in general.  I've been watching basketball for nearly 50 years and have never seen anything like what goes on in Timken Gym when a competitive physical opponent comes to town.  Invariably, any home court advantage that you would think Wooster would have disappears as the officials bend over backwards to accomodate the visiting team.  I've seen this happen over and over again during the last dozen or so years, and it was the same tonight.  Wooster got screwed, left and right, and it was a major factor in the outcome of the game.  

Furthermore, I am certain that everyone sitting anywhere near me is in agreement with my opinion.    
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 03, 2007, 11:34:18 PM
WOW - Ben Chojnacki out for the rest of his senior season. To Mr. Chojnacki and any Bishops fans who read this board you have my deepest sympathies. He has had a great career at OWU and was playing so well this season. This is not how a senior should finish. It should be on the court.

To the game tonight, I agree with DC in that the referees were not a factor.  In the end the Scots had two turnovers that just made it too difficult to overcome.

I thought Evan Will had the best defensive effort of his career tonight. He really fought to prevent the entry pass to Borchers in the low post.

The Black Out was really neat to see, especially with the yellow towels that were handed out. MAybe this can become a tradition for the Witt game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2007, 11:36:10 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 03, 2007, 11:22:57 PMIf you want to be politically correct with your remarks, fine. But you're dead wrong.   

Well, I'm entitled to my opinion, as are you, although I won't suggest that you have an ulterior motive for your comments.  I post what I actually believe, and I don't much care for it when you suggest otherwise.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 03, 2007, 11:56:48 PM
DC - what were the Wooster students doing?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2007, 12:01:13 AM
The NCAC crew at Chadwick tonight was downright heinous. Ghiloni got a T, almost a second one, and Petty was seriously questioning their eyesight.

Denison played no defense at all in the first half, but finally caught on that Zimmer could possibly drop 50 on them if they didn't get some bodies on them.

The refs didn't call a lot of physical play early in the second half, and then called Wabash for fouls on the same stuff Denison was doing with no call. This crew had no clue, though. The game almost got out of hand a couple of times with bodies flying, shoves, pushes, and all kinds of stuff from both sides.

I do find it funny that a Wooster supporter is complaining about the refs. At Wabash, we get jobbed every time we play Wooster or Witt because the refs protect their Ohio buds. At least that's the feeling around here. So, um, all in the jaded eyes of the beholder.

But I send a big thumbs down to the Denison fans that were there. All I heard were negative comments and complaints about this and that and so.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 04, 2007, 12:11:14 AM
All I have to say is that I am glad I was a part of that atmosphere at Timken tonight!  Wooster's fans turned out in full force and the  'Black Out' turned out to be a pretty cool sight.

As for the game, hats off to Wittenberg for a very well played game.  Who would have thought with the defensive effort that Wooster put forth against Borchers, that the Tigers would come away with a win in Wooster???  Greg Hill was the man.  He just made big shot after big shot as did many other key contributers to this truly team victory by Witt.  For as much as Witt didn't play team ball in the game down in Springfield, they did just the opposite tonight.  It just seemed like Witt had an answer for every big moment in the game tonight and there's nothing you can do but tip your cap to 'em.  Every time the crowd would come to their feet in a critical moment when the Scots needed to get a key stop, Witt would silence the crowd making a basket as the shot clock would be expiring. 

While I'm disappointed in the final outcome, I am happy I was able to witness some quality basketball in such an electrified environment.  I'll go on record to say that I don't think I've ever heard Timken as loud as it was tonight.  I noticed on the box score that the attendance was listed at over 3700!  This has to be close to a record considering that the capacity is only 3400.

While I wish that the Scots could have come away victorious, they were beaten by the better team tonight.  I look forward to hopefully seeing these 2 teams square off for the rubber match in a few weeks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2007, 12:55:48 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 03, 2007, 11:56:48 PM
DC - what were the Wooster students doing?

Repeating their favorite "cheer," which decorum prevents me from mentioning (I'm sure you know it without my reporting it), plus obnoxiously adding "you suck" as part of an oft-repeated pep band cheer.  >:(

By the way, either the Wooster pep band was much, much better tonight, or my plan to sit closer to them to improve my audio reception actually worked, because I thought they did a good job tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 04, 2007, 01:16:15 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 04, 2007, 12:55:48 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 03, 2007, 11:56:48 PM
DC - what were the Wooster students doing?

Repeating their favorite "cheer," which decorum prevents me from mentioning (I'm sure you know it without my reporting it), plus obnoxiously adding "you suck" as part of an oft-repeated pep band cheer.  >:(

I really hate that cheer (if you really want to categorize it as a cheer) that the Wooster students insist on continuing.  Do they really think that they rattle the Witt players by constantly repeating that childish smut???  Personally, I think it does just the opposite which is why Witt seems to play out of their trees every time they visit Timken!  I just don't know why something can't be done to quash this?!?! ???   It really is in poor taste and does not reflect well on the college or on the community!

I did see a clever sign tonight which had something to do with  'The Witt Brothers: Dimm and Nitt'.  I got a chuckle out of that one. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 04, 2007, 01:18:46 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 04, 2007, 12:01:13 AMI do find it funny that a Wooster supporter is complaining about the refs. At Wabash, we get jobbed every time we play Wooster or Witt because the refs protect their Ohio buds. At least that's the feeling around here. So, um, all in the jaded eyes of the beholder.

Keep an eye out on your karma. If Wally or I made a comment similar to this ours would end up in a free fall.

Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 03, 2007, 11:22:57 PMIf you want to be politically correct with your remarks, fine. But you're dead wrong.

I've been hanging around this board a long time. Since DC was "Memphis" and Wally_Wabash posted under his real name. I can count on one hand the number of people who have called out DC. That is totally uncalled for. It's not like he's the only Wooster poster who has that opinion. see quote below:

Quote from: goscots on February 03, 2007, 11:34:18 PMTo the game tonight, I agree with DC in that the referees were not a factor.  In the end the Scots had two turnovers that just made it too difficult to overcome.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 04, 2007, 01:36:39 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 03, 2007, 11:22:57 PM
Furthermore, I am certain that everyone sitting anywhere near me is in agreement with my opinion.   

That's not because you complained loudly, right? :)

Seriously -- I didn't see it at the ONU game and it doesn't sound like I see anyone else who sees it here.

I like it when a fan can be objective and not have to be a homer. Makes the board better. Homers could complain about officiating in probably every game in Division III, but that really takes away from the enjoyment of the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 04, 2007, 02:10:03 AM
Excellent ballgame at Wooster tonight (lastnight).  I was very impressed with the overall quality of play and of course the effort by both teams was as you'd expect in a big important rivalry game.  My hats off to both teams, they didn't disappoint at all.

Not having a dog in this race was very relaxing on my nerves in the final few moments which were incredibly tense I'm sure, but for me the game came down to 1:10 seconds and both teams would get their shot......Witt executed, Woo didn't.  As DC mentioned Witt's decision to foul with 10 secs left was near brilliance, doesn't happen enough with a 3 point lead in my opinion.  Basically Witt took the ball out of Wooster's hands at that point and put it on their own FT shooter, pressure yes but 3 pointers can't go in if the other team can't shoot one.

There were just a ton of clutch shots in this game, but Witt's gaurd #11 or #10 (can't recall) hit a 3 with no more than 3 or 4 minutes to go to put Witt up 6 which I thought was just huge.  It really meant the Scots would play from behind the rest of the way, the rally was gaining momentum at that point and it just seemed a minute or two before the lead would change........then he steps up and knocks that shot down.   Absolutely huge.

Witt wins the same way I see them everytime, they play solid D, rebound very well and just hit big shot after big shot.  They played like a team in need of a win tonight.

Wooster impressed me offensively....... Cooper, Port and Fulk are a very dangerous combo.  Many times when a team gets down big early they'll press and try to hard to make big shots.   Wooster didn't seem to do that, they sort of kept plugging away makeing play after play to get back in the game.  After the first few minutes when everything dropped for Witt, you sort of knew they'd start missing a few eventually and that allowed Wooster to start clawing their way back into it.

Inevitably I'll be asked to compare this to the Hope/Cavin rivalry......I just don't think that would be fair they are two separate animals.  I will say there aren't enough ambulances in West Michigan to handle all the cardiac arrests if either of our student sections adopted Woosters little cheer :D ;)

Some things that will stick with me is the great crowd support, very loud and generally encouraging for Wooster, the black out was nice.  I'm pretty impressed a school the size of Wooster can get 3400 people out for a basketball game, that shows great local support.  At the moment Wooster finally tied the game it was pretty deffaning and it really did remind me of so many great Hope/Calvin moments I've seen late in games when one team makes a great play.  It made me miss the way Hope fans would rally their team in our old Holland Civic Center, arena's just aren't the same.  I would love to see a sectional at Wooster, it would be a great atmosphere.......the place could use a little orange. ;).........but I'd also love to showoff our DeVos Fieldhouse to DC.


PS  You had me Wooster untill your band played 'Hang on Sloopy' and your students actually did O-H-I-O.......what on earth? ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 04, 2007, 02:29:08 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 03, 2007, 11:22:57 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 03, 2007, 11:03:00 PMI'm sure this will be disagreed with, but I thought the officiating was as good as could reasonably be expected (did I agree with every call and non-call?  Of course not, but what's new about that) and did not materially alter the outcome.

You know, if you were sitting where you usually do, I don't know how you could even begin to venture an opinion on this.  The game appears almost sterile from so far away, just as it does when watching the televised replay.  Things look very, very different from courtside.  If you want to be politically correct with your remarks, fine. But you're dead wrong.

The NCAC officiating was, as usual, a serious embarrassment to the league and to DIII basketball in general.  I've been watching basketball for nearly 50 years and have never seen anything like what goes on in Timken Gym when a competitive physical opponent comes to town.  Invariably, any home court advantage that you would think Wooster would have disappears as the officials bend over backwards to accomodate the visiting team.  I've seen this happen over and over again during the last dozen or so years, and it was the same tonight.  Wooster got screwed, left and right, and it was a major factor in the outcome of the game.  

Furthermore, I am certain that everyone sitting anywhere near me is in agreement with my opinion.    

Once again, post Woo-Witt, and you're the only one putting an incredibly negative spin on it.  Last time, you knock a kid's family history of going to Wittenberg, and now you bash the opinion of one of the most respected people around here - a primary Wooster supporter, no less - simply because you can't handle the fact that the ball didn't bounce your team's way. 

We know, every game you think Wooster gets hosed by the officials, Wittenberg plays dirty, and the Scots are never primarily at fault for what happened to them in the game.  It gets old when these are the only comments you ever bring to the table.

I'm glad that people like DC and others can step back and look at a situation and judge it fairly, not through the perspective of one of those fans who gripes about everything that goes against their team simply because it went against their team. 

Go find yourself a damn tissue, and learn how to enjoy and look back on a great basketball game without having your damn black and gold blinders on for once in your life.  You want to talk about embarrassments?  Look in the mirror.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on February 04, 2007, 03:21:05 AM
VIA NATIONAL PICK EM BOARD  :D ;) :o 8) :P

Btw, I picked Wittenberg both times!  I got faith in the Tigers! lol

Quote from: PointSpecial on February 02, 2007, 12:11:28 AM
Well, if it's a go, then I'll take Woo...

Quote from: diehardfan on February 02, 2007, 12:12:43 AM
Woooooooooooooooooooooster! (Pronounced incorrectly just to spite David) :D ;) ;D :-* :P

Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 02, 2007, 12:24:59 AM
Count me in for COW (i.e., Moooooooooooster - apologies, David! ;D)

Quote from: David Collinge on February 02, 2007, 01:05:44 AM
It goes without saying that I'll take Wooster...

Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 02, 2007, 06:44:06 AM
I pitch Woo!

Quote from: pufin on February 02, 2007, 08:06:28 AM
I'll (of course) take WOOSTER.

Quote from: Hoops Fan on February 02, 2007, 09:10:42 AM
I'm taking Wooster,

Quote from: smedindy on February 02, 2007, 09:21:36 AM
Wooster's the one!

Quote from: sac on February 02, 2007, 12:20:24 PM
I'll take Wooster over Witt

Quote from: Flying Dutch Fan on February 02, 2007, 07:40:48 PM
First - I'll take the COW (I'm from Iowa after all)



Quote from: Old School on February 02, 2007, 12:57:10 AM
BTW, I'll take Wittenberg   for fun.

;D I RULE!!!!! LOL  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on February 04, 2007, 04:55:20 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 03, 2007, 11:22:57 PM
 Wooster got screwed, left and right, and it was a major factor in the outcome of the game.  

Furthermore, I am certain that everyone sitting anywhere near me is in agreement with my opinion.    

Why can't you just tip your hat and say that you got outplayed. Come on Randy
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zu1414 on February 04, 2007, 07:31:24 AM
Sounded like an incredible game. Witt-Wooster is fun for the whole conference.

The Terriers handled the pressure to hang on for a much needed win. We need to get through a tough week (Wooster, Witt) and win the last two games (Allegheny H, Denison A). Should be interesting.

In NAIA news, Walsh goes down to arch-rival Malone yesterday with the help of a Mount Union transfer!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 04, 2007, 09:29:08 AM
What a great game.

I guess it was a "Red-out" after all.

TF_73
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 04, 2007, 09:37:12 AM
I was really impressed with Fulk. 

Cooper was impressive as well, but I was expecting that. 

I'm sorta amused with my comment yesterday that I hoped Witt won by two to tie up the score for the last 12 games.  That doesn't count as a prediction but it is as close as I will ever come. 

It was a great game to be able to watch online.  Kudos (and karma, if only it was possible) to the 'W' club for making it happen.  I thought the announcers did a great job as well.  Apparently, they do a lot of Wooster and local high school games on the cable there.

The interet is a great thing.  It would seem like a great recruiting tool if you could tell a kid's parents that they could watch all the games on cable.  I think it won't be long until we will see all home games of some schools on the net.

The feed went out near the end as several people have reported.  Did anyone else have the audio go out while still getting the video near the end?  Maybe the microphone came unplugged or something.

TF

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 04, 2007, 09:43:29 AM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 03, 2007, 09:16:34 PM
The Witt AD is telling the students to be cool in the event of a win!

Apparently, this worked.

If he can calm the Witt - Woo rivalry, perhaps he can quiet the warring parties in Iraq.  Maybe Mr. Bush will make him an ambassador!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 04, 2007, 09:46:42 AM
I looked in at the OAC and that is one competitive league! 

Copied from the OAC board:

All the 2/3 OAC Final Scores:

John Carroll 79  Ohio Northern 67
Capital 64  Muskingum 62
Heidelberg 87  Marietta 70
Wilmington 75  Baldwin-Wallace 68
Otterbein 78  Mount Union 68

So, we have a two way for first place:

JCU and CAP both at 10-4
ONU and Heide both at 9-5
Wilm, OTT and B-W all at 8-6
Musky at 4-10
Mount at 3-11
Marietta at 1-13
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 04, 2007, 09:57:06 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 03, 2007, 11:22:57 PM
[The NCAC officiating was, as usual, a serious embarrassment to the league and to DIII basketball in general.  I've been watching basketball for nearly 50 years and have never seen anything like what goes on in Timken Gym when a competitive physical opponent comes to town. 

Just stop it.  I was going to ignore your expected complaining, but I find myself commenting anyway.

No Division III ref is in it for money or glory.  I have to believe they do it because they enjoy it and you can't have a game without refs.

There used to be a guy who seemed to really have it out for Witt in the OAC days.  I won't mention his name because that would not be fair.  The radio guy would go on about him.  The crowd would boo him.

Do you know what the Tigers would do?  They would just go out and play their game and WIN ANYWAY.

It turned out that he went on to ref some important D1 games.

Stop complaining.  I know that I am relatively new on this board and not an insightful analyst.  I'm just a fan who likes to hear about D3. 

Hopefully, this will be my last comment on your complaining.  For me to do otherwise will just encourage you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 04, 2007, 10:55:39 AM
As I've had more time to reflect on last night's contest, I believe that Vandervaart's name hasn't even been mentioned as a key to last night's loss as his absense really didn't stand out as prominantly as I had thought it would.  I would never have guessed that Wooster would outrebound Wittenberg and hold Borchers to just 7 points without the services of their starting center.  The reason for those things to happen anyway was the play of Evan Will.  He played a great game on the defensive end of the floor and really did the best job I've seen any Wooster defender do on Borchers since I can remember. 

I just still can't get over Cooper losing the dribble and turning it over there in the last minute.  It wasn't even a forced turnover.  More of a lack of concentration I guess.  But can you really fault the guy who put the Scots on his back and made shot after shot all night long?  This game ended much like round one did down in Springfield.  In that game, Wooster made the big shots at the end of the game and Witt made the turnovers and mistakes.  Last night, it was Witt making the big shots down the stretch and Wooster making the mistakes. 

BTW, can't the home team defend their home court anymore in this rivalry???  ??? :P

I guess I'm off to see what I've missed so far in the 48 hours of Super Bowl pregame coverage?!?! ::)

 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 04, 2007, 11:15:21 AM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 04, 2007, 09:57:06 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 04, 2007, 02:29:08 AM
[The NCAC officiating was, as usual, a serious embarrassment to the league and to DIII basketball in general.  I've been watching basketball for nearly 50 years and have never seen anything like what goes on in Timken Gym when a competitive physical opponent comes to town.  

Now, let's not mistake who made those comments with a misassigned quote box...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2007, 11:21:35 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 04, 2007, 11:15:21 AM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 04, 2007, 09:57:06 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 04, 2007, 02:29:08 AM
[The NCAC officiating was, as usual, a serious embarrassment to the league and to DIII basketball in general.  I've been watching basketball for nearly 50 years and have never seen anything like what goes on in Timken Gym when a competitive physical opponent comes to town. 

Now, let's not mistake who made those comments with a misassigned quote box...

I fixed that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 04, 2007, 12:17:38 PM
I didn't get to watch the game, but i've been in and watched my fair share of NCAC basketball games and the refs never get any better.  *That to me is the sad thing.  I don't believe they do it all for the money, but i've always notice they love the CONTROL/Power.   I went to the Wooster/Earlham at Richmond this year and the refs were not bad... If i had to give them a grade (B to B-)   I went to a Richmond High School game later that evening (younger refs) grade (A-)  I honestly believe NCAC refs do it just to do it.  I wish they understood the amount of time and effort players and coaches put into the game ... if only they put forth the effort to get every call right!  Love it or leave it that's just the NCAC for you!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 04, 2007, 12:21:33 PM
P.S.  what else can we expect when the top level of Basketball in the United States makes a joke out reffereeing!  aka the NBA.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 04, 2007, 01:08:41 PM
I got my first look at '06-'07 Wabash last night...it was great to get back to Chadwick.  Some impressions:

- I liked the student turnout, didn't like that they were sitting on their hands for most of the game.  Come on guys...get on your feet and yell.  A lot.   :)

- Zimmer is really good.  I think his senior season is going to be special. 

- The game was really physical underneath in the first half.  It tried to be really physical underneath in the second half, but the whistles blew with regularity.  The second half was a total foulfest and had no flow whatsoever.  Unfortunate to see. 

- From my perspective, Ghiloni wasn't wrong when he blew up and got the T.  I'm still not sure how he didn't get a double T...he carried on for quite a while. 

- Why does Denison have trouble winning games?  A lot of poor decisions.  At one point in the game Denison had an offensive opportunity in transition....#33 for Denison (who is 6-5) caught Earl Rooks (who is 5-7) on his back in the low post.  Instead of recognizing the 10-inch mismatch and making the bunny, #33 tried a bounce pass across the key which was easily intercepted by Wabash.  That's Denison basketball in a nutshell. 

- Wabash had three post players foul out mainly trying to guard Hodgkinson....Hodgkinson was a bear to guard.  He went for 18 and 17...helluva night for him. 

- I'm really excited about the future of Wabash hoops.  Root and Brock didn't shoot well, but they have game.  Haltom did shoot well....seems like a real streak shooter to me.  I was lucky to catch him on a good night.  Brock reminds me a lot of Zimmer during his freshman year.  I think things are back on the upswing for Wabash. 

Next up for Wabash is a huge huge huge game at Earlham.  With Hiram at Wooster on Wednesday, Wabash could creep up into fourth place all alone.  Remember, two and a half weeks ago Wabash was in the cellar here.  Since then the LGs have ripped off 5 wins in 6 games and are in position to host a tournament game.  The turnaround is noteworthy. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 04, 2007, 01:11:15 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 04, 2007, 12:21:33 PM
P.S.  what else can we expect when the top level of Basketball in the United States makes a joke out reffereeing!  aka the NBA.

Well, it also makes a joke out of basketball, so it's to be expected. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2007, 02:11:44 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 04, 2007, 01:08:41 PM
- Why does Denison have trouble winning games?  A lot of poor decisions.  At one point in the game Denison had an offensive opportunity in transition....#33 for Denison (who is 6-5) caught Earl Rooks (who is 5-7) on his back in the low post.  Instead of recognizing the 10-inch mismatch and making the bunny, #33 tried a bounce pass across the key which was easily intercepted by Wabash.  That's Denison basketball in a nutshell. 

Having seen Denison maybe a half-dozen times this season, I agree with this assessment, and would add just one thing to the statement that this exemplifies Denison (men's) basketball: #33 is sophomore Shea McMahon, and he's probably DU's second most-skilled player.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on February 04, 2007, 03:02:04 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 04, 2007, 09:37:12 AM
The interet is a great thing.  It would seem like a great recruiting tool if you could tell a kid's parents that they could watch all the games on cable.  I think it won't be long until we will see all home games of some schools on the net.
Wheaton has broadcasted all home games on a video stream from their website www.wetn.org for at least two years... probably longer. It's great feature for alumni... helps us stay in touch to the game (and for those rich alumni out there, which obviously doesn't include me, I bet that translates into $). I had honestly not thought of it from a recruiting / parental standpoint.... good insight!

I know basically nothing about the Wheaton bb recruiting process (though I got to see the fb recruiting process first hand through my little bro) but I would suspect that our coaches, who recruit players from all over the country (we actually have a guy from overseas on our roster) this helps the parents let go of their prodigy a little more easily.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 04, 2007, 03:10:31 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 04, 2007, 12:21:33 PM
P.S.  what else can we expect when the top level of Basketball in the United States makes a joke out reffereeing!  aka the NBA.

It could be the Big Ten as well - 56 fouls in yesterday's Iowa-Indiana game.  Yikes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 04, 2007, 03:19:11 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on February 04, 2007, 03:02:04 PMWheaton has broadcasted all home games on a video stream from their website www.wetn.org for at least two years... probably longer. It's great feature for alumni... helps us stay in touch to the game (and for those rich alumni out there, which obviously doesn't include me, I bet that translates into $). I had honestly not thought of it from a recruiting / parental standpoint.... good insight!

I know basically nothing about the Wheaton bb recruiting process (though I got to see the fb recruiting process first hand through my little bro) but I would suspect that our coaches, who recruit players from all over the country (we actually have a guy from overseas on our roster) this helps the parents let go of their prodigy a little more easily.

I don't know about anyone else but I'd pay for the privilege you describe above. I have some friends who went to Texas Tech and they pay money to watch streaming video of sporting events. My recollection is that it is 10 bucks a month. I'd shell that out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on February 04, 2007, 03:43:15 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 04, 2007, 03:19:11 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on February 04, 2007, 03:02:04 PMWheaton has broadcasted all home games on a video stream from their website www.wetn.org for at least two years... probably longer. It's great feature for alumni... helps us stay in touch to the game (and for those rich alumni out there, which obviously doesn't include me, I bet that translates into $). I had honestly not thought of it from a recruiting / parental standpoint.... good insight!

I know basically nothing about the Wheaton bb recruiting process (though I got to see the fb recruiting process first hand through my little bro) but I would suspect that our coaches, who recruit players from all over the country (we actually have a guy from overseas on our roster) this helps the parents let go of their prodigy a little more easily.

I don't know about anyone else but I'd pay for the privilege you describe above. I have some friends who went to Texas Tech and they pay money to watch streaming video of sporting events. My recollection is that it is 10 bucks a month. I'd shell that out.


For the good games, I would too. But of course, the Wheaton games are free. And it's a good thing cause our current student broadcasters are brutal, bless their heart. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 04, 2007, 03:48:51 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 04, 2007, 01:08:41 PM
- I liked the student turnout, didn't like that they were sitting on their hands for most of the game.  Come on guys...get on your feet and yell.  A lot.   :)

That is a real shame.  I made my only visit to Chadwick last year.  The 'bash faithful were loud and boisterous from beginning to end at a game which was a 35-point blowout loss to Wooster and was never competitive in the 2nd half.  On the drive back to Columbus we talked about how great the crowd was and how good it is to see them not give up on their team.  Sorry that it doesn't seem to be that way this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 04, 2007, 08:57:25 PM
In case anyone is interested, I noticed that Wooster's Basketball homepage had a video link that captures a bit of the electric atmosphere last night at Timken.  For anyone that couldn't attend or missed the live video webcast, here is a link:

Video Link (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/recaps/2006-07/witt2.php)

It also happens to end with a nice Brandon Johnson dunk after a  pretty sweet behind the back pass from Devin Fulk.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 04, 2007, 09:25:57 PM
Hey, it's Tigerup07, but I'm at jscwittfan's house watching the superbowl and too lazy to login under my name...
Was at the game yesterday, a few comments:

Wooster student section:
DC - you were right on - the biggest problem was not the cheer (although it was in bad taste) but the lack of response from the 5 or so "Staff" members guarding them. Apparently they were not employed by the FCC.
Also I would like to point out (for my own personal sense of gratification, arrogance and big-headedness) that the witt student section was quite sportsmanlike, cheering for good things, booing maybe a bit for the bad, and sitting quietly in response to the poor cheers from woo. Made me proud that we've come so far from last year's awful exhibition from the witt students at home. Also, we were rather inventive... after the "s*** on witt" cheer we appropriately responded with "poo on woo". Made me laugh

Second
Reffing was probably best I've seen in NCAC. A few missed calls, but after the travesty that the JV game was, I was happier than ever that the calling was so good.

Third
Can't wait to go back to Wooster

Tigerup07
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2007, 09:39:10 PM
Quote from: tigerup07 on February 04, 2007, 09:25:57 PMAlso, we were rather inventive... after the "s*** on witt" cheer we appropriately responded with "poo on woo". Made me laugh

That made me laugh, too.

The video clip is very interesting.  Fulk drains his brilliant driving layup, but then Bowen comes back with that huge, huge three.  I turned to sac at that point and said "that's a dagger."  Then Johnson loses his dribble, falls down, and Witt takes it up the floor.  At this point I'm yelling and gesticulating that Johnson needs to get up and go play defense instead of sulking about his turnover.  But it was this sulking that left him in position to take that pass from Fulk and jam the ball, which produced the loudest roar I think I've ever heard in that gymnasium. 

After the clip ends, Borchers gets fouled and goes one for two from the line.  He was just 3 for 6 from the stripe last night; he used to be automatic, but this season he's only ("only") at 80%.  Wooster, down one with the ball and less than a minute left, is in a perfect position to win it, and I'll bet at least 3000 people there thought that's what was going to happen.  But alas, even Super-Cooperman must trip over his cape from time to time, and instead it was Gregg Hill (who may also be from Krypton) who stepped up and won the game with his clock-killing jumper at 0:10 and his two icy free throws at 0:04.

What a game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Superfoot Wallace on February 04, 2007, 09:40:37 PM
Once was a member (cough! leader cough!) of a cheering section that used the refrain,  "thats all right - thats okay - youll be working for us one day!"

Another favorite that cleared Hinkle Fieldhouse was chanting "the ref beats his wife!"  Upon readmittance amended the cheer to "the ref partakes in dubious behaviors!"

When the Carmelites would take their keychains out and shake them, signifying mommy and daddys money buying them nice cars, our student section replied with the old WallStreet Journal to the nose during announcement of their players.

Some of it was classless to be sure, but some of it was downright ingenious.

Any out there know the dollar nine cheer.

signed,
bigfatgatforthedirtymac
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 04, 2007, 09:56:24 PM
Quote from: MacLeod on February 04, 2007, 09:40:37 PM
When the Carmelites would take their keychains out and shake them, signifying mommy and daddys money buying them nice cars

Is that what that is? At Witt we use that for football on third down on defense to signify "this is a key play

Tigerup07
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Superfoot Wallace on February 04, 2007, 10:02:11 PM
They also used credit cards, just didnt make much noise.  Seeing as how I was the first (one of?) to utter the words Red Swarm in Meadville, might want to think about that, especially since there has been a Carmelite under center for Witt in the past.

signed,
KidintheHall

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 04, 2007, 10:25:17 PM
Quote from: MacLeod on February 04, 2007, 09:40:37 PM"thats all right - thats okay - youll be working for us one day!"

Blech. I always hated hearing other Wabash students yelling that one out. My absolute least favorite cheer. Even the foul, profane ones bother me less.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Superfoot Wallace on February 04, 2007, 10:27:55 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 04, 2007, 10:25:17 PM
Quote from: MacLeod on February 04, 2007, 09:40:37 PM"thats all right - thats okay - youll be working for us one day!"

Blech. I always hated hearing other Wabash students yelling that one out. My absolute least favorite cheer. Even the foul, profane ones bother me less.

Only works if its being chanted at rich folk and landed gentry.  Loses its appeal if given another context.

signed,
Loxley
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2007, 10:31:42 PM
Quote from: MacLeod on February 04, 2007, 10:27:55 PM
Only works if its being chanted at rich folk and landed gentry.  Loses its appeal if given another context.

signed,
Loxley

LOL.  That's worth a karma point, Robin of Sherwood.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 04, 2007, 10:35:37 PM
Watching that video, I could feel the inside of that gym.  Wow.  What a crowd.  I will have to make it up to Wooster for the NCAC final if these two meet again for that (and if Wooster holds onto hosting privileges!).

On cheers:  I've made my peference known that some Wooster student cheers would go to a far off place and die a quiet, unremarkable death.  I like wit (not Witt), in my cheers.  One year for the Denison-Wooster football game, some band members did an arrangement of the jingle from those old Big Red Gum commericals and we sang it at them during the game.  I thought that was funny.  Another football game, Case brought this really obnoxious air horn that they blared a chord from their sideline anytime they scored/had a great play.  By mid-game, our band would respond by playing a really loud, obnoxious chord back at them...then we kept taking the chord up a half step because we felt it was nice to point out that the air horn could only play one chord over and over.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 04, 2007, 10:36:03 PM
First, congrats to earlhamalum for the colts win in the super bowl-can't think of a team that is more deserving.

Second, the refereeing was partially fair and from what i saw yes there were missed calls maybe but they went both ways so that wasn't a factor.

Third, now to the real business. I think it is a statement game Wednesday night at home vs OWU. The bishops will be down with Chojnacki down, and Witt needs to recover and not have a hangover after the Wooster game. Also the revenge factor will be a key component.

Lastly, games like last night are perfect examples of what makes this rivarly relish and great year after year. Maybe one of these days we will be watching live video feed on CSTV or ESPNU......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on February 05, 2007, 12:08:33 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 04, 2007, 10:36:03 PM
First, congrats to earlhamalum for the colts win in the super bowl-can't think of a team that is more deserving.

Ok time for me to be a bitter Cleveland fan but I think I can think of a team that is at least as deserving as the Colts... the Browns. Or at least the Brown's fans. Last NFL Championship: 1964 (before it was even called the Super Bowl). In an ironic twist of fate, the last time the Colts won a Super Bowl before today, they were in Baltimore, which is where Art Modell took all the Cleveland players (I still hold that he did not take the team, just the players, staff and management) and then won a Super Bowl. Maybe that's a sign that it's getting closer? Hopefully.

But about the upcoming Witt-OWU game, I think it will be a different situation now with Chojnacki out. Number one, I think the Tigers have learned team play since the first meeting (judging at least by the Wooster game this weekend) and how to close a game.

For any of you interested in hearing the game, Rob Lehner, the usual color man will be replaced by yours truly. I'm making the leap from women's to men's color commentary. Hopefully the good things I've been hearing about the Witt broadcasts will continue to be heard!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 05, 2007, 01:04:26 AM
 Okay I feel for you Cleveland fan's because i can think of the early 90's as a colts fan when we SUCKED and we got a little bit of hope in the mid- 90's with CAPTAIN come back, but the COLTS are nothing less then a class act.   I am now almost the happiest INDY person in the world at this current moment.    (currently driving back to the hotel) from one of the oddest/funniest/most expensive evenings of my life.   

10 dollars a beer.   A Grant and a few to many Franklin's later turned out to be a Super Bowl Championship.  Tigerup07 for the sake of fan's every where I hope you're team makes it Sooner then later, because I have a feeling that in Super Bowl 55 beer will be $22.25.

Headed back to the Good old mid-west tomorrow!  I mean honestly i kind of miss the 5 degree weather.  I've heard the hype of the great weather in South Florida and I believe it, because it didn't rain on my parade!! 

GO COLTs........................................................... and earlham!

thanks[ pennstghs... good thing we both like Florida Bowls in 07/color]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 05, 2007, 09:22:47 AM
yeah penn state has won their last two florida bowls-maybe witt can get screwed in the draw and force me to take a roadtrip down there
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 05, 2007, 10:47:44 AM
also before it is announced today, my prediction for player of the week in the NCAC is Gregg Hill
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2007, 11:16:05 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 05, 2007, 10:47:44 AM
also before it is announced today, my prediction for player of the week in the NCAC is Gregg Hill

You, sir, are correct.
http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt
Congratulations to Gregg!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 05, 2007, 12:03:59 PM
Will this week's pick for NCAC POW meet with Wally's approval? ::)

I think Hill was a very deserving choice just for his performance against Wooster alone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2007, 12:27:02 PM
Handicapping the remainder of the season and possible/probable tournament seeds:

Wooster (11-1): Games left: Hiram, @Wabash, @Kenyon, OWU.  It's really hard to see Wooster losing any of these games, particularly now that their mulligan has been used up.  Prediction: 15-1, #1 seed

Witt (10-2): Games left: OWU, Hiram, Wabash, @Allegheny.  Witt is more prone to upsets than Wooster, but with Chojnacki out it's hard to see OWU being able to hang.  At home for three of the final four, Witt looks good to win out.  Prediction: 14-2, #2 seed

OWU (8-4): Games left: @Witt, Earlham, Oberlin, @Wooster.  Witt and Woo are right out now that Chojnacki is unavailable.  Earlham and Oberlin could pull upsets if the Bishops are particularly cold, but I doubt it.  Prediction: 10-6, #3 seed

Wabash (6-6): Games left: @Earlham, Wooster, @Witt, Kenyon.  Wabash's chances at the fourth home game in round 1 rest entirely on Wednesday's game against Earlham I think.  I think Wabash has the chops to pull it off.  Prediction: 8-8, #4 seed

Kenyon (5-7): Games left: @Denison, Oberlin, Wooster, @Wabash.  There could be a lot on the line for both Kenyon and Wabash in that finale.  Keep an eye out for that game.  Prediction: 7-9, #5 seed*. 

Hiram (6-6): Games left: @Wooster, @Witt, Allegheny, @Denison.  Tough week ahead for Hiram, then Denison on Senior Day in a rematch of the 4OT thriller.  I don't see any gimmes here for Hiram.  Prediction 7-9, #6 seed*.

Earlham (5-7): Games left: Wabash, @OWU, Denison, @Oberlin.  How huge is the game vs. Wabash.  A win there and Earlham is set up to host a tournament game.  A loss, and Earlham could find themselves heading to Witt for the opening round.  Prediction: 7-9, #7 seed*.

Allegheny (4-8): Games left: @Oberlin, Denison, @Hiram, Witt.  Really, the game against Oberlin is the biggest game left on Gheny's schedule.  Win there and the Gators are all but in the tournament.  Prediction: 6-10, #8 seed. 

Oberlin (3-9): Games left: Allegheny, @Kenyon, @OWU, Earlham.  I'm pretty sure I've picked Oberlin to lose all of these games.  It had to happen to somebody I guess.  Prediction: 3-13.

Denison (2-10):  Games left: Kenyon, @Allegheny, @Earlham, Hiram.  I don't know which one of these games Denison gets, but they get one of them.  The leading candidate is Hiram on Senior Day.  Prediction: 3-13.

*A Kenyon/Hiram/Earlham tie is troublesome.  Kenyon swept Hiram, Hiram beat Earlham, but Earlham and Kenyon split and Earlham's win over OWU would seem to give Earlham a tiebreak advantage there.  I'm not 100% sure on how this would break down, so I'm speculating here.  

I think what this shows is that there are a lot of big games for the teams jammed up in the middle of the conference and the stakes are pretty huge.  The margin for error is slim as one game could be the difference between hosting and traveling to Springfield for the opening round. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 05, 2007, 02:23:24 PM
wow good analysis and work wally-nicely done-karma to you!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 05, 2007, 04:07:10 PM
Wally_ golf clap on you're analysis of the NCAC.   Sadly I wish I could say Earlham will finish better then 7th.  (i honestly believe they can)  I don't think the game on wed. will be the final factor on whether or not Earlham will finish better then 7th... history shows if they will on Wed. then they will lose a game they should win  (oberlin or Denison)... wish i was kidding!   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2007, 04:18:57 PM
It should be noted that there is a difference between finishing seventh and being the seventh seed in the tournament.  If my predictions play out, Earlham ends up in a fifth place tie, but because we can't have three teams seeded fifth for the tournament, they'd end up in Springfield for the opening round as the seventh seed.  Also keep in mind that I pulled the tiebreak right out of left field.  The tiebreak could certainly go Earlham's way. 

Wednesday's games should help clear up a lot of this mess. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 06, 2007, 03:47:22 PM
wow slow couple of days on the board here-anyone have anything interesting to talk about?

What is everyone's favorite gym to go and play or attend a game in? Personally i enjoyed the earlham gym despite the lack of fan participation or attendance. Underrated facilities definitely
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 06, 2007, 04:15:45 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 06, 2007, 03:47:22 PM
wow slow couple of days on the board here-anyone have anything interesting to talk about?



I wonder why?  ;D :D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2007, 04:17:49 PM
I never played (unless you count the trombone), and have only been in five of the gyms in recent years, Earlham not being one of them.  Thusly limited, my favorite place to see a game, by a very wide margin, is the Kenyon Athletic Center.  It's just breathtaking.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 06, 2007, 05:10:58 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 06, 2007, 04:17:49 PM
Thusly limited, my favorite place to see a game, by a very wide margin, is the Kenyon Athletic Center.  It's just breathtaking.

Agreed.  I have photos of the place for anyone who has not been there.  Absolutely stunning.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on February 06, 2007, 05:21:35 PM
geez with how quiet this board has been you would think somebody beat wooster or something
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2007, 05:29:12 PM
Quote from: WillieBrown on February 06, 2007, 05:21:35 PM
geez with how quiet this board has been you would think somebody beat wooster or something

I think you and Witt4Ever are using the same jokewriter.  :)

If you really want to, we can start talking about the Wooster/Hiram game tomorrow, but that doesn't seem like a very interesting subject.  Let's see...what teams have really big, important games Wednesday that we could be talking about?  Hmmm....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2007, 05:53:09 PM
How about this...

The first set of regional rankings will be released tomorrow.  They of course mean nothing in and of themselves, but they do give something of a clue into the Regional Committee's thinking, and they play a role in Pool C selection and tournament seeding.

The Regional Standings page has been updated here (http://www.d3hoops.com/regions.php?region=greatlakes&team=m&view=standings), and Patrick Abegg has been tracking QoWI and regional records and posting his thoughts on regional rankings here  (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4232.840)for a while now.  Here's how Patrick sees the GL:
Quote from: pabegg on February 04, 2007, 10:43:47 PM
The rankings estimate updated for games through Sunday

Reg Conf Rank    School                    Natl Status       QOWI Reg Overall
GL  61   01 01  Lake Erie                 003  A w C        10.75 16-0 20-1
GL  62   02 03  Hope                      017  A w C        10.1818 10-1 17-2
GL  63   03 02  Wooster                   022  A w C        10.1333 13-2 18-3
GL  63   04 04  Wittenberg                036  C 10         10 13-3 18-3
GL  64   05 07  John Carroll              050  C 19         9.9444 13-5 14-7
GL  64   06 06  Ohio Northern             059  A second     9.8125 11-5 16-5
GL  90   07 05  Carnegie Mellon           064  C third      9.5625 11-5 12-7
GL  65   08 08  Westminster (Pa.)         066  B 4          8.9333 12-3 14-7
GL  61   09 00  Penn State-Behrend        077               8.7895 14-5 15-5
Reg        Region
Conf       Conference number
Rank      Regional ranking
Prior       Prior regional ranking
School
Natl     National ranking based on regional results
Status
    B + number: Pool B ranking (top 3 in tournament)
    C + number: Pool C ranking of 19 teams in tournament
    C second: second tier Pool C (spots 20-29)
    C third: third tier Pool C (spots 30-39)
    A w C: Pool A, in likely Pool C range (1 to 13)
    A bubble: Pool A, in Pool C bubble range (14 to 19)
    A second: Pool A, in second tier Pool C
    A third: Pool A, in third tier Pool C
    blank: lower level Pool C
What does anyone think of this?  How do you see the rankings coming out?  Lake Erie is clearly the #1 team, but after that arguments could be made. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 06, 2007, 06:24:24 PM
wittenberg beat wooster?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zu1414 on February 06, 2007, 06:42:32 PM
As someone who only really follows the NCAC in D-III, could someone explain to me the rise of Lake Erie as a powerhouse the last few seasons? When I was at Hiram, they played in the community center's gym.

I take it things have grown??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2007, 06:56:49 PM
Quote from: zu1414 on February 06, 2007, 06:42:32 PM
As someone who only really follows the NCAC in D-III, could someone explain to me the rise of Lake Erie as a powerhouse the last few seasons? When I was at Hiram, they played in the community center's gym.

I take it things have grown??

You could ask that question in the AMCC room and probably get a sharply different answer than you're likely to get here.  Here I'll just point out that Wittenberg beat LEC in the NCAA first round last year 76-40, and LEC was 21-6.  I saw LEC play earlier this season down at Denison, and they (LEC) managed to win, but I was not impressed.  Considering their schedule (http://www.d3hoops.com/school_info.php?school=Lake%20Erie&team=m), we might have to wait again for the NCAAs to get a good read on how good they are.  They have a better record this year, and they won at Rochester in Nov., so they're probably better this year, but "powerhouse?"  I'll believe that when I see it.

However, with an unbeaten regional record and the top QoWI in the region, there is no doubt that they'll be the #1 team in the regional ranking. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 06, 2007, 07:20:49 PM
I'll talk gyms, since Earlham hasn't done much worth while of late.

First, I too will be enjoying the Colts (my 2nd favorite football team behind the Nittany Lions), but now to the fun part about my favorite NCAC facilities.

I haven't been to Kenyon, but no matter how spectacular it may be, I doubt it would be my favorite. I'm not fond of brand new, sparkling facilities. And, to be honest, Earlham's gym is very nice, but the overall facility probably isn't in the top half of the conference.

My favorite, and it has been renovated so it might actually be better, is Denison's Livingston Gymnasium. It always reminded me of a mini-Hinkle Fieldhouse (Butler University's arena that was used for the final scenes in the movie Hoosiers for you non-natives).

After that, I'd rank the gyms I have been to in the following order:

2. Allegheny's Wise Center (love the scoreboard)
3. EC's Schuckman Court (really clean)
4. Timken (mostly because of the crowd)
5. Chadwick (hate all of the glass at the entrance end, however)
6. Witt HPER Center (love how they dim the lights)
7. OWU (crazy roof)
8. Oberlin (dump)
9. Hiram (bigger dump)
N/A Kenyon's new Tomisch Arena (old gym was somewhat similar to 'gheny's)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 06, 2007, 07:32:27 PM
billy-

Where does Chadwick fit in your rankings?  I'm almost certain you've been there at some point.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 06, 2007, 07:36:06 PM
Great catch, Wally.

I realized as soon as I posted that I'd forgotten Chadwick...which, for the record, is the only NCAC gym I've been in this season. I'm not a big fan of the glass at the entry, just as I'm not a big fan of Hanover. However, the rest of the facility is excellent, which is how I wish the rest of Earlham's would be.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2007, 07:47:17 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 06, 2007, 07:36:06 PM
Great catch, Wally.

I realized as soon as I posted that I'd forgotten Chadwick...which, for the record, is the only NCAC gym I've been in this season. I'm not a big fan of the glass at the entry, just as I'm not a big fan of Hanover. However, the rest of the facility is excellent, which is how I wish the rest of Earlham's would be.

See, I like Hanover's gym immensely.  Kenyon's gym (just the gym, mind you) reminds me more of Hanover than anyplace else.  It's a very nice gym, not overly modern, not too big, and not sterile at all (like Timken and HPER, in my opinion.)  It may not have the old-timey atmosphere of Livingston, but I think it would grow on you.

And the rest of the facility, beyond the competition gym, is just, well, :o!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Superfoot Wallace on February 06, 2007, 07:57:37 PM
Had some discussion about the old Hanover weight room versus the new on the old HCAC board.  Not the old board but the old board.  Not the new board but the old board.

Hanovers facility is really second to none, and every time Ive heard DC talk about Kenyons new facility, thought it might be like Hanovers.  Sounds like a confirmation.

Just fell in love with all those olympic platforms and the indoor track in Madison.  Agree Witts gym is somewhat sterile, though havent been since the HPER renovations.  Lets just say it was always nice to be able to find a court to chuck the ball around.  Remember on my Hanover visit playing a pickup game in an old fieldhouse and have seen a similar old retired fieldhouse at Franklin.

Hopefully Witts old fieldhouse is still part of the HPER, but preferred playing up on the stage in Springfield as opposed to the Fieldhouse planks.  Just memories of Tommy Mygrant doing impressions of the coaches and having them unbeknownst to him walk in and watch the show prior to films.

signed,
Mahoney
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 06, 2007, 08:07:19 PM
I'm a big fan of Hanover's gym as well.   The gyms at Franklin and RHIT are also nice places to see a game (the new RHIT gym...not the old hangar!).  I'm much more familiar with the gyms from the ol' ICAC than I am the NCAC gyms...most of my hoops travel happened when I was a student in the pre-NCAC days.  In the NCAC I've only seen Chadwick (obviously), Branch Rickey, and Timken.  The photos I've seen of the KAC do look very impressive. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 06, 2007, 08:12:28 PM
I have not been to Denison so I can't rate it (although I have been told it is a nice gym).

It's also hard to rank Timken and HPER because I associate the exciting games played at those locations. If a game with only 200-300 people in attendance were played there they each would be in the lower half of my list.

Of the remaining seven:
1) Alleghany because the steep angles seating brings everyone close to the game. They also have one of those scoreboards that list all 10 active players in the game (as does Kenyon and Hiram I believe).
2) Earlham - clean, modern looking and the size fits the typical attendence, making it loud
3) Wabash - great student support, the banners give it a strong sense of history and tradition.
4) Kenyon - A palace but I don't like the glass walkway behind the one board.
5) OWU - Showing some age
6) Oberlin - bland, crowd on only one side
7) Hiram - Reminds me of a blimp hanger. Ask Breckenridge where he had to call the game from.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2007, 08:18:49 PM
I didn't see anything of Hanover's building except the gym and the lobby.  I had to drive many hours just to get there; I watched the game; then drove many hours (in snow) to get home.  Not much time for anything else.  ;D

Kenyon has a fabulous indoor track, a number of indoor tennis courts (complete with stadium seating), at least three basketball/volleyball floors (but there's no markings on the floor in Tomsich for volleyball, so they must play varsity volleyball on one of the other floors), a theatre, two multipurpose (aerobics/dance class) rooms, more recquetball and squash courts than I could count, a gift and coffee shop, offices for all coaches, littel seating nooks, and a study room and a student weight/exercise facility, both of which overlook the pool.  Oh, the pool!  Who would have thought that Kenyon of all places would have a nice pool!  ;)

Quote from: goscots on February 06, 2007, 08:12:28 PM
4) Kenyon - A palace but I don't like the glass walkway behind the one board.

That may be a problem for the players, but it is a great place to watch part of the game from.  It's one flight up from the floor, so you're looking down (and into) one of the baskets.  And yes, Kenyon has the 10-player scoreboard.

I agree that Timken and HPER are different when they're full, especially since the Woo/Witt games are so exciting.  But empty, they are pretty characterless; like the Riverfront and Three Rivers Stadiums of D3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 06, 2007, 08:29:47 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 06, 2007, 05:29:12 PM
Quote from: WillieBrown on February 06, 2007, 05:21:35 PM
geez with how quiet this board has been you would think somebody beat wooster or something

I think you and Witt4Ever are using the same jokewriter.  :)

If you really want to, we can start talking about the Wooster/Hiram game tomorrow, but that doesn't seem like a very interesting subject.  Let's see...what teams have really big, important games Wednesday that we could be talking about?  Hmmm....

I'm guessing that you're referencing the OWU-Witt rematch?  I'm trying to decide if I'm going to drive out to see it...it looks like the weather will clear up before then.  Without Chojnacki, I feel like it might lose some of its drama.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 06, 2007, 08:34:45 PM
yes i would agree with scotsbrod that this game has lost some edge, BUT however this doesn't make this matchup easier at all. Chojnacki was handled by Witt in the first matchup, it was the rest of the Bishops that killed us. One may argue that we did focus on stoppping Ben, but the Bishops should not be taken lightly.......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on February 06, 2007, 08:34:50 PM
Quote from: MacLeod on February 06, 2007, 07:57:37 PM
Had some discussion about the old Hanover weight room versus the new on the old HCAC board.  Not the old board but the old board.  Not the new board but the old board.

Hanovers facility is really second to none, and every time Ive heard DC talk about Kenyons new facility, thought it might be like Hanovers.  Sounds like a confirmation.

I love Hanover's facility, but in terms of the entire facility, I think IWU's Shirk Center is a couple notches better.  A photo of the arena from this past Saturday's IWU/Elmhurst game and a few from IWU.edu of the other parts of the building:

http://www.iwuhoops.com/shirk9.jpg

http://www2.iwu.edu/sports/ActivityCenter.shtml

http://www2.iwu.edu/sports/Natatorium.shtml

http://www2.iwu.edu/sports/FitnessCenter.shtml



I really like the Wabash complex as well -- very similar to Hanover's.  I can't wait to see Kenyon's place -- sounds like it blows everything away.

In terms of the basketball arenas, Hope's place looks like #1 for now...of course, Calvin is building.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 06, 2007, 08:41:18 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 06, 2007, 05:53:09 PM
How about this...

The first set of regional rankings will be released tomorrow.  They of course mean nothing in and of themselves, but they do give something of a clue into the Regional Committee's thinking, and they play a role in Pool C selection and tournament seeding.
Quote from: pabegg on February 04, 2007, 10:43:47 PM
The rankings estimate updated for games through Sunday

Reg Conf Rank    School                    Natl Status       QOWI Reg Overall
GL  61   01 01  Lake Erie                 003  A w C        10.75 16-0 20-1
GL  62   02 03  Hope                      017  A w C        10.1818 10-1 17-2
GL  63   03 02  Wooster                   022  A w C        10.1333 13-2 18-3
GL  63   04 04  Wittenberg                036  C 10         10 13-3 18-3
GL  64   05 07  John Carroll              050  C 19         9.9444 13-5 14-7
GL  64   06 06  Ohio Northern             059  A second     9.8125 11-5 16-5
GL  90   07 05  Carnegie Mellon           064  C third      9.5625 11-5 12-7
GL  65   08 08  Westminster (Pa.)         066  B 4          8.9333 12-3 14-7
GL  61   09 00  Penn State-Behrend        077               8.7895 14-5 15-5
Reg        Region
Conf       Conference number
Rank      Regional ranking
Prior       Prior regional ranking
School
Natl     National ranking based on regional results
Status
    B + number: Pool B ranking (top 3 in tournament)
    C + number: Pool C ranking of 19 teams in tournament
    C second: second tier Pool C (spots 20-29)
    C third: third tier Pool C (spots 30-39)
    A w C: Pool A, in likely Pool C range (1 to 13)
    A bubble: Pool A, in Pool C bubble range (14 to 19)
    A second: Pool A, in second tier Pool C
    A third: Pool A, in third tier Pool C
    blank: lower level Pool C
What does anyone think of this?  How do you see the rankings coming out?  Lake Erie is clearly the #1 team, but after that arguments could be made. 

Lake Erie and Hope are huge Pool A favorites.  Witt or Woo should claim another.  Someone (Lord knows who) will win an A out of the OAC.  If I'm ONU or JCU and I didn't win that AQ, I'm praying against the likes of a Tri-State, a Calvin, a PSU-Behrend, or any NCAC team not named Wooster or Wittenberg in their conference tournaments.  It looks like any loss by a Pool C lock in the tourneys could crush those Big Dance dreams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Superfoot Wallace on February 06, 2007, 08:47:58 PM
Pennstghs is right, worst kind of dog to fight is an injured dog.  Could be argued OWU got their win after Carraway went down, so why didnt the injured dog get his, but the proximity of the game to the injury gives the Coach and staff a little preparation time.  Maybe to even work the psychology.

Dont listen to the Scot Tigers.  Lost its drama?  The only team the Tigers havent beaten yet?  Sneaky reverse psychology.

Who put you down?

The Haters

Who put you in the game?

Thought I could get in through the backdoor

Slap!

signed,
DD #33 - Castle
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 06, 2007, 08:51:27 PM
Here's a couple photo links to Hope's DeVos

http://hope.edu/pr/athletics/devoshighlights.html

http://www.hope.edu/pr/campusdev/devos.html#photos

The second link will give you way more info than you'll ever wish to know.  As competition goes its stickly an event building for basketball and volleyball.  Hope has an on campus wellness building which contains, basketball courts, pool, small track, weightroom......Dow Center.  Its a very unique place for a D3 school.


I was struck by how much Wooster and Wittenberg's gyms were similar.  I think I liked Wooster's a little better because it was brighter and the seating seemed to get more fans closer to the court.  Both are nice D3 gyms.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 06, 2007, 08:57:20 PM
Has anyone seen random game at HPER and Timken that didn't involve Wooster playing Wittenberg?  goscots you are right about wittenberg, but I enjoy Timken as you will see in my top 10 NCAC gymnasium.

1.) Wooster-  Likes: the Saturday game crowd and when they Host NCAC Tourney.  Dislikes: not much...never seeing them lose
2.) Earlham-  Likes: Simple, Clean, modern, when filled and outstanding basketball environment.  Dislikes:  not a shooters gym, empty to much.environment.  
(Wally_ you should try to make a trip to Richmond on game day sometimes!)
3.) Allegheny-  Likes: the drop down seating, Scoreboard, individual seating.  Dislikes: locker-rooms behind the baskets, final college basketball gym I played in.
4.) Wabash-  Likes: Student body (when they show up) The old Estelle Meter, the over-all size, Geographically close and located in Indiana. Dislikes  Student body, Bo always being a Ref!
5.) Wittenberg-  Likes:  size, the student couch, the dim lights.  Dislikes: Earlham never plays well there, and Bo always being a ref!
6.) OWU-  Likes: the ceiling, feels like playing basketball in a Church!  Dislikes: The candy table when you walk in, the 3 story hike to the 95 degree locker room.
7.) Denison-  Likes:  In a nice little city of Granville (2nd fav. NCAC baseball fields!!) The Glass window on the entrance wall.   dislikes: the old wooden bleachers and the half-wall on the Bench side.  
(Billy_ I just think you like the way the baskets came out... like Hinkle Field House, which was hands down my favorite d3 basketball experience!!!
8.) Kenyon *old gym-  Likes: not a whole lot to say about it, it was 2 steps up from my next gym!
9.) Oberlin-  Likes: NONE  Dislikes: Dump, Middle of nowhere, old, a dingy feel
10.) Hiram-  Likes: an old hangar Maybe???  Dislikes:  Glass light during day games, OLD, OLD, Open, locker-rooms you go through 9 doors and 1.2 miles away from the court.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 06, 2007, 09:49:08 PM
wally-unfortunately the tradition of the couch at wittenberg games that i loved and often won privileges of sitting in his disappeared......maybe we can bring it back someday.

One thing about OWU gym is that is awfully cold in there :-[

Earlham's gym is modern-but the only d3 gym i know with box seats lol (the upstairs glass room with chairs where the lockerrooms are)

Wooster's gym can get really loud, but that is kind of skewed as ive been there twice and both times playing wittenberg-cant say i would be willing to go there any other time
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 06, 2007, 10:54:38 PM
I must admit that the idea of having a couch at a hoops game is awesome and I'm bummed that Wabash students didn't come up with this idea.  Wabash students will bust out some couches for home baseball games.  Few things beat watching a double-dip at Mud Hollow kicked up on a couch with some Dari-Licious.  Good times. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 06, 2007, 11:16:47 PM
I went to the Amherst/Trinity(TX) game earlier this season and there was a couch in the corner of the floor there, too. There were a few students on it during the game. The guy that was sitting on it had some good smack. He told one Amherst player on an inbound "You're gonna wish you had gone to Williams".

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 06, 2007, 10:54:38 PMWabash students will bust out some couches for home baseball games.

The lack of actual seating at Mud Hollow makes it more of a necessity and less of a joke.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2007, 11:37:05 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 06, 2007, 08:57:20 PM
Has anyone seen random game at HPER and Timken that didn't involve Wooster playing Wittenberg? 

Well, of course I've been to tons of games at Wooster that didn't involve Wittenberg.  Still the average home crowd is about 1000, and maybe 500-700 for games during student holidays, so there's always some sort of a crowd (for men's games; the women don't draw much beyond friends and relatives.)  It's okay; big, can be loud, fairly comfortable, convenient--it just lacks character. 

I've was at Witt for the women's Woo-Witt game this year, which was sparsely attended, and I have basically the same comments as I have for Timken.  I agree with sac, though, about the lighting and the angle of the stands.  The top of the stands at Witt feels like it's a half-mile from the court.  I pity the broadcasters who have to work way up and back there.  Parking is another drawback of the HPER Center.  But the old gym is still there on the other side of the lobby.  Wooster Booster took me on a tour of it when we were there; it was pretty cool.  We also stumbled on a pre-game meeting of the Witt team with Bill Brown, and the notes we took and passed along to Steve Moore were pivotal ("they don't plan to defend Port if he happens to grab an offensive rebound and run to the corner and whirl and launch a three, so you should run that play in the final minute, Steve." ;))

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 06, 2007, 10:54:38 PM
I must admit that the idea of having a couch at a hoops game is awesome and I'm bummed that Wabash students didn't come up with this idea.  Wabash students will bust out some couches for home baseball games.  Few things beat watching a double-dip at Mud Hollow kicked up on a couch with some Dari-Licious.  Good times. 

We always had a couch for our intramural softball games when I was a student.  It was in left-center field and was usually shared by the left fielder (me) and center fielder.  We usually had a keg, or at least a pitcher of gin and tonics, out there with the couch.  When I was a senior, we used one pledge as a cocktail waitress and another as an ottoman, and if anyone hit the ball our way we'd send the pledges to retrieve it.  We didn't win many games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 06, 2007, 11:47:36 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 06, 2007, 11:37:05 PMWe always had a couch for our intramural softball games when I was a student.  It was in left-center field and was usually shared by the left fielder (me) and center fielder.  We usually had a keg, or at least a pitcher of gin and tonics, out there with the couch.  When I was a senior, we used one pledge as a cocktail waitress and another as an ottoman, and if anyone hit the ball our way we'd send the pledges to retrieve it.  We didn't win many games.

Didn't win many games? I'm shocked. I must say DC I have a ton of respect for anyone who measures gin & tonic in "pitchers". That's the kind of pitchers that softball needs more of.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on February 06, 2007, 11:48:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 06, 2007, 11:37:05 PM
I pity the broadcasters who have to work way up and back there. 
As a broadcaster who's worked from up there, it's actually not too bad. Sure, being courtside at places like Wooster can be cool, but it actually does limit the ability to comment on ball movement. Sitting up in the HPER press box gives a very good bird's eye view, but is still close enough to see numbers and track ball handling, even to notice a carry or a travel most of the time. Maybe that's just a homefield thing for me, though. In terms of nicest press boxes, they are all pretty much the same from what I've seen. And I believe now that I've seen almost all the press boxes. The only things making one press box better than another are location, carpeting, the table we work at, and access to phone and electric outlets. I can't name the nicest one (although I'm leaning towards Kenyon) but I know I can name the worst: Hiram. We had people climbing through our box the whole game, and the chairs were uncomfortable, and it was in the high corner of the gym... a better option would honestly be courtside. Not to say anything about Hiram, but the press box is lacking. But maybe I'm biased with this one as well since this is where Scott Leo and I experienced a 2 hour power outage (although our power still worked) that we sat the entire way through, only for them to call the game 5 minutes before power was restored.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 06, 2007, 11:53:53 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 06, 2007, 11:37:05 PM
We usually had a keg, or at least a pitcher of gin and tonics, out there with the couch. 

Amen.  I'm still holding out hope that I can go pro in IM softball.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 06, 2007, 11:54:08 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 06, 2007, 11:37:05 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 06, 2007, 08:57:20 PM
Has anyone seen random game at HPER and Timken that didn't involve Wooster playing Wittenberg? 

Well, of course I've been to tons of games at Wooster that didn't involve Wittenberg.  Still the average home crowd is about 1000, and maybe 500-700 for games during student holidays, so there's always some sort of a crowd (for men's games; the women don't draw much beyond friends and relatives.)  It's okay; big, can be loud, fairly comfortable, convenient--it just lacks character. 

David, I thnk Timken doesn't have any character simply because it has a few too many bare walls.  For example, I've been in Otterbein, Wittenberg, and Ohio Wesleyan's gyms this year, and all three of them were sporting a banner on the wall that would fit in just beautifully in Timken.  I heard such banners are only available in Virginia.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 07, 2007, 12:37:52 AM
I think Earlhamalum's question about who had been to games at Witt/Woo as an opposing fan in a game not involving those teams is a pertinent one. While neither gym has the same atmosphere when Earlham comes calling on a Saturday, rather than the arch rival, it is Wooster that still has a fairly nice gathering.

Wittenberg, on the other hand, is really dead. I've been to a number of women's and men's games there and, for the most part, the crowds were smaller and quiter than they were at any Earlham/OWU/Wabash home game.

Meanwhile, Wittenberg's press area is absolutely not conducive to broadcasting a basketball game. You are way too far away. While Wabash and Wooster were the best, even sitting near the top of the bleachers at Denison, Earlham and OWU was much, much closer than from the nosebleed pressbox at Witt (not to mention it was always freezing up there). For the record, the worst place to try to broadcast a game from was Oberlin, where you were perched above the basket and couldn't see a thing on a couple portions of the court.

A fun discussion....always love talking about gyms/ballparks/arenas.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerLady on February 07, 2007, 02:17:49 AM
As far as Witt vs. Wesleyan goes today....it could be interesting!  Hill sprained his ankle in practice on Monday, and may not play.  But, even if he does play, he won't be 100%. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 07, 2007, 08:22:29 AM


David, I thnk Timken doesn't have any character simply because it has a few too many bare walls.  For example, I've been in Otterbein, Wittenberg, and Ohio Wesleyan's gyms this year, and all three of them were sporting a banner on the wall that would fit in just beautifully in Timken.  I heard such banners are only available in Virginia.   ;D
[/quote]

Ouch that's harsh, coming from a Wooster fan as well.......GO  Tigers-get a much needed self satisfactory win
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zu1414 on February 07, 2007, 09:38:16 AM
Yes I know our facilities at Hiram are not the best,and Price certainly has some issues with lighting. We have made substantial improvements to the overall athletic facilities with the addition of the Coleman Sports Center, which opened in 2005.

http://admission.hiram.edu/visit/virtualtour/buildings/coleman.html (http://admission.hiram.edu/visit/virtualtour/buildings/coleman.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2007, 10:33:00 AM
Word around the intertron is that Earlham is pulling out all the stops tonight.  As this game is positively huge for both teams, Earlham is calling for both a "Pack the House" night AND a whiteout.  Underpinning the importance of fan support in Richmond is the promise of an iPod giveaway for students who comply with these requests.  This will truly be the stiffest test of the season for Wabash...Wooster and Witt are positively JV compared to the power of free iPods. 

Good luck and Godspeed, Little Giants.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 07, 2007, 11:17:09 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 07, 2007, 10:33:00 AMThis will truly be the stiffest test of the season for Wabash...Wooster and Witt are positively JV compared to the power of free iPods. 

I don't know about you, but I'd wear white and try to scam one of those iPods if I were an enterprising Wabash student.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 07, 2007, 01:25:34 PM
i would probably consider that same plan of attack. a point of concern for witt if hill cannot play, man how do we seem to be missing a key player right before OWU.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on February 07, 2007, 01:28:28 PM
Just flew back to springfield from vegas. Didnt have as good a week as Barkley did but enough to live comfortably for next few months and a new flat screen tv courtesy of the colts covering 7.  Anyways, The early line is having Witt at a 4 point favorite at home, and I'm taking the Tigers I don't think its going to be as close as the experts think. Tigers by 8-12 but the score will not show how much we dominated the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 07, 2007, 01:56:51 PM
i agree with you willie-wow that's a first haha-should be a good turnout tonight by the witt faithful i think.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 07, 2007, 04:33:12 PM
I'm looking forward to watching the video of the Witt - OWU game tonight.

Go Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Superfoot Wallace on February 07, 2007, 04:40:04 PM
Wish I could watch, but alas no internet on the homefront.  Expect Ill get a final over my cell phone, but would appreciate some updates throughout.

Thinkin bout playing some hoops myself tonight.  Could always go out to the loft of the barn and burn some free throws but havent swept the guano away lately.  Maybe its time to test the rehabbed foot and ankle a little bit in a fullcourt pickup.

best regards,
fianchetto bishop
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 07, 2007, 06:18:06 PM
If I left now, I would make it to Richmond in time for the Wabash Game, but after this weekend travels and money spent I think I'll just listen to it online.  An inside connection of mine at Earlham... okay my girlfriend who's a senior said there was some buzzz around campus today about the game.  Hopefully the White_Out and the Ipod brings some of the student body who normally wouldn't attend the game.   Hopefully Earlham can shoot about 18% better then what they did against Kenyon on Saturday.  (not like 46% is asking to much... yes as a team they shot 28% for the game... OUCH)

Good Luck to all teams tonight, and GO EC
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 07, 2007, 06:19:58 PM
The NCAA Regional Rankings are finally out and here is how the GL Region shook out:


Rank
Team
Overall RecordRegional Record
   1.        Lake Erie        20-1      16-0   
   2.          Wooster         18-3      13-2   
   3.        Wittenberg      18-3      13-3   
   4.       Hope      17-2      10-2   
   5.         John Carroll      14-7      13-5   
   6.         Ohio Northern      16-5      11-5   

Not really much of a surprise.  It still makes me ill to think that Lake Erie is going to more than likely come out of this region as the top ranked joke!  Thankfully, their gym is too small to be considered for a secional host.  Wooster and Wittenberg have got to be virtually even with one of each of their two losses being to each other.  The only difference is that Wooster's only other regional loss is to GL #6 ONU by 7 which is a bit of a better loss than 22 point beatdown Witt suffered to OWU.  And as for Hope, they just haven't played anyone of significance to get their QOWI where it needs to be.  They have to pretty much hope for another loss by Witt and then see Witt knock off Wooster again in the NCAC tournament or vice versa with someone knocking off Wooster and then Wooster beating Witt.  And then there's John Carroll who could still make some noise if they happen to win out.  They would stand to gain some big QOWI points if they were to win out and go on to win the OAC tournament as well.

Here is a link to the rest of the Regional Rankings released today if anyone is interested:

NCAA Regional Rankings (http://www.ncaasports.com/basketball/mens/polls/rankings/diviii)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 07, 2007, 06:57:46 PM
The correct regional record for Hope is 10-1, not 10-2.  If and when the NCAA corrects the error, that may alter 2-4 in the rankings.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 07, 2007, 07:33:25 PM
The Tiger network is on the air!

Greg Hill is starting for the Tigers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 07, 2007, 07:39:46 PM
Witt 13 -6
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 07, 2007, 07:54:22 PM
We've got video, but the audio has gone out.

24-20 Witt
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 07, 2007, 07:57:12 PM
OWU takes the lead 27-26.  Witt 28-27.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 07, 2007, 08:00:43 PM
Bishops 32-28.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 07, 2007, 08:11:46 PM
36-35 Tigers at the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 07, 2007, 08:12:35 PM
Hmm the NCAC Audio God's must not want me to listen to the Earlham/Wabash game tonight... my computer is getting the best of me at the current moment in time.  So you Wabash Fella's keep me up dated it would be greatly appreciated.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2007, 08:36:10 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 42  Hiram 27

Wooster stretched out the lead near the end of the first half. :)  Scots are being led by James Cooper with 14 points (4 three pointers), Devin Fulk with 7 points, Tom Port with 6 points and Evan Will with 6 points.

For Hiram, Ian McGuire has 10 points and Michael McDevitt has 6 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 07, 2007, 08:36:32 PM
53-49 OWU.  A little under 10 min left
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 07, 2007, 08:37:46 PM
Wooster ended the half on an 11-0 run to cap what was otherwise a rather sloppy half for the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 07, 2007, 08:40:05 PM
Uh-Oh.  57-50 OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 07, 2007, 08:47:29 PM
Tigers tie it up with Borchers at the line for one.  Makes it.

58-57 tigers. 4:15 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 07, 2007, 08:55:40 PM
1:20 left.

Tigers up 5.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 07, 2007, 09:01:36 PM
In other GL action, at the half in Holland, MI:

Calvin 46
Hope 35

:o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 07, 2007, 09:02:13 PM
Witt wins 71-64
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 07, 2007, 09:06:58 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 07, 2007, 08:12:35 PMSo you Wabash Fella's keep me up dated it would be greatly appreciated.

Sorry I had a work related call and had to turn away (argh!)

I come back to Wabash down 4 with under 5 seconds to play.

Wabash   67
Earlham     71 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 07, 2007, 09:09:54 PM
THAnks!!!

good thinking Li'l
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2007, 09:30:41 PM
Final:  Wooster 90  Hiram 73

Wooster actually led by 30 points until they cleared the bench and Hiram's starters narrowed the final margin.

Wooster was led tonight by Evan Will with 15 points (12 boards), James Cooper with 14 points, Tom Port with 13 points, Marty Bidwell with 10 points and freshman Robert Melick also with 10 points.

Hiram was led by Michael McDevitt with 22 points, Ian McGuire with 14 points and Ian Pfouts with 12 points.

Wooster is now 19-3, 12-1 NCAC  :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 07, 2007, 09:33:17 PM
52-52  Okay I am looking for a new g/f... only my girlfriend would leave when the game was tied....................... awtgwrhgkajkjkahkjkgfjah


Li'l   you got anything for me?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 07, 2007, 09:47:34 PM
tied at 65 with 1 minute to go

67-65 50 seconds to go
Earlham ahead
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2007, 09:48:53 PM
67-65 Earlham, just under 1 minute left.

Wabash's shot at the other end gets blocked.  Hewitt gets fouled and will shoot two.  Brock has fouled out for Wabash.  22.7 seconds left.  First shot is good.  Second shot is good.  69-65 Quakers.  Earlham calls timeout.

While the Wabash stream was out, Zimmer fouled out.  That's bad news. 

Wabash's three point attempt is no good, the ball goes over the back and Earlham has the ball.  Quick foul by Wabash and Henry will have two foul shots.  12 seconds left.

First shot is good.  Second shot is good.  71-65 Quakers.  Timeout Earlham. 

Wooster needs to give away iPods in the conference finals vs. Witt.    :)

Final score is Earlham 72, Wabash 70.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2007, 10:00:26 PM
All the NCAC 2/7 Final Scores:

Denison 68  Kenyon 65
Allegheny 74  Oberlin 69
Wittenberg 71  Ohio Wesleyan 64
Wooster 90  Hiram 73
Earlham 72  Wabash 70

Wally - thanks for the updates.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2007, 10:04:24 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 2/7 results:

Wooster 12-1 (19-3)
Wittenberg 11-2 (19-3)
Ohio Wesleyan 8-5 (14-8)
Wabash 6-7 (9-13)
Earlham 6-7 (8-14)
Hiram 6-7 (7-15)
Allegheny 5-8 (9-12)
Kenyon 5-8 (9-13)
Denison 3-10 (4-17)
Oberlin 3-10 (4-18)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 07, 2007, 10:37:46 PM
Wittenberg 71  Ohio Wesleyan 64

Average crowd, but very quiet crowd until the end-this really bugs me sometimes......

Wittenberg in the first and most of the second half seemed to have problems with OWU's screen-heavy offense and OWU was able to get matchups they needed and Shier(sp?) was making some tought shots. Jesse J. had a big game as well-tough defender and a tough body to match up with. Wittenberg got down 7 and after a timeout Hill was able to penetrate and kick out to Nowicki and that started the 21-7 run that ended the game.

Big game from Brandon Barabino as he was a spark at times and created some key baskets when we needed him to down the stretch. Another key was the disappearance of Rudegair to 2 points and heavy foul trouble the whole game.

on both sides-a lot of bad calls for witt- but generally horrible officiating i must say. A bad charging call on hemenway started the OWU run, but both ways it was bad at times.

Thoughts from anyone?     I was surprised at Wittenberg being ranked ahead of Hope, but looking at the numbers it does make sense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2007, 10:55:20 PM
Regional Final Scores of Interest:

Calvin 77  #6 Hope 71 (big upset)
Lake Erie 93  Pitt-Bradford 64 (another cupcake squashed :P)
John Carroll 91  Heidelberg 86
Ohio Northern 75  Wilmington 53
Capital 56  Mount Union 44

JCU and CAP lead the OAC at 11-4, ONU one game back at 10-5


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2007, 11:01:24 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 07, 2007, 10:37:46 PM
Wittenberg 71  Ohio Wesleyan 64

Thoughts from anyone?     I was surprised at Wittenberg being ranked ahead of Hope, but looking at the numbers it does make sense.

Given Hope's loss tonight, Wittenberg should also jump over them in the next D3Hoops Top 25 poll!  ;D
 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2007, 11:13:27 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2007, 10:00:26 PM
All the NCAC 2/7 Final Scores:

Denison 68  Kenyon 65

G@&%(#&D$@(*&^$ Denison.  I'm bad enough at Pick 'Em without their help!  :D

Anyway...

Kudos to Hiram tonight, they played hard and pretty well, despite being both overmatched and undermanned tonight.  Hiram only dressed out nine players; among the missing was starting PG Mike Staley, the conference's assists leader by a wide margin.  The remaining Terriers hung tough through the first half but eventually ran out of steam and fell out of it by the middle of the second half.  Four of the starters played over 30 minutes, while no Scot players played more than 29.  Ian Pfouts in particular had a good game, scoring 14 on 5/6 shooting and leading the Pups with 9 rebounds.  Wooscotsfan correctly notes that the Hiram starters narrowed the final margin against the Wooster freshmen (Jackson Ellis and Julian Mangano saw their first-ever varsity action tonight), but don't get the wrong impression: Hiram had nothing but regulars in uniform tonight.  It was a game effort all around by the Terriers.

Wooster played with little enthusiasm, but little was needed.  Evan Will, normally the team's biggest cheerleader, was pretty sedate tonight, but he played another outstanding game, leading the Scots with 15 points and 12 boards (7 offensive.)  He's really stepped up in Vandervaart's absence; a very good sign.  Robert Melick also had a very nice game; his scoring touch in the paint is definitely improving--he was 4 of 5 tonight.  Wooster played well on defense in spurts, but mostly in the first half.  In the second they played a little less aggressively, and Hiram shot 55%, but they couldn't overcome 25 turnovers, leading to 31 Scot points, or do much to stop the Scots inside (52-18 scoring advantage in the paint to go along with a 37-27 rebound advantage.)

The Scots got away with a W tonight with about their 'C' game.  They'd better bring at least their 'A-' game to Crawfordsville on Saturday if they want to stay in the lead in this race.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2007, 11:27:13 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 07, 2007, 11:13:27 PM
Evan Will, normally the team's biggest cheerleader, was pretty sedate tonight, but he played another outstanding game, leading the Scots with 15 points and 12 boards (7 offensive.)  He's really stepped up in Vandervaart's absence; a very good sign.  Robert Melick also had a very nice game; his scoring touch in the paint is definitely improving--he was 4 of 5 tonight.

David - thanks for the first hand report from Timken. :)  Great points made about Evan Will and Robert Melick.  IF Vandervaart doesn't get back on the floor this year, Wooster will need strong play from Will and Melick to make any type of run in post season play, especially vs. teams with big front lines.

As others have noted, Evan Will played a great game vs Witt last Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 07, 2007, 11:57:34 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2007, 11:27:13 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 07, 2007, 11:13:27 PM
Evan Will, normally the team's biggest cheerleader, was pretty sedate tonight, but he played another outstanding game, leading the Scots with 15 points and 12 boards (7 offensive.)  He's really stepped up in Vandervaart's absence; a very good sign.  Robert Melick also had a very nice game; his scoring touch in the paint is definitely improving--he was 4 of 5 tonight.

David - thanks for the first hand report from Timken. :)  Great points made about Evan Will and Robert Melick.  IF Vandervaart doesn't get back on the floor this year, Wooster will need strong play from Will and Melick to make any type of run in post season play, especially vs. teams with big front lines.

As others have noted, Evan Will played a great game vs Witt last Saturday.

I would argue, wooscotsfan, that regardless of whether or not "Darth" Vandervaart returns to the lineup in post season play, Wooster will need excellent play from Will and Melick to contend deep into the  postseason.  Even if Vandervaart returns, you can never have too much depth developed on your bench for the postseason.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on February 08, 2007, 01:18:37 AM
Witt vs OWU -
Tonight I saw something I hadn't seen from Witt in a while. A little bit of everything
Some outside shooting
Some midrange shooting
Some post play
Some good ball movement
Some good perimeter defense
Some good post defense
Some turnovers
Some blocks and steals

Not a whole lot of anything but some of everything
Nice to see a balanced team (if not completely well balanced) take the floor
OWU impressed me with a stiff defense, good ball movement and especially the play of Jesse Jean and a solid outing from Rudegair. It was a stiff game, a lot closer than the final score shows. I'm surprised at OWU's record but I think it's just that they match up so well against Witt that they've given us a hard time each meeting (especially the first one).
I expect Witt and OWU will be meeting again. Just a hunch I have before the regular season wraps up. But, I also have a feeling that Wooster and Witt will see each other again at Timken. Should be an excellent and exciting NCAC tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2007, 02:41:30 AM
Oof, with Wooster and Witt on the horizon, this loss to Earlham is trouble for the LGs if they want to host an NCAC tourney game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 08, 2007, 10:17:42 AM
I do have to argue Rudegair having a solid game-he was held in check most of the game by the seat on the bench he was occupying. He only had 2 points and didn't play much at all. He fouled out with about 3 minutes to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 08, 2007, 11:45:46 AM
Also Willie apparently im not the only one noticing that Wittenberg's attendance is kind of pathatic

from today's Springfield News Sun:

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/s/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2007/02/07/snssp020807wittnotes.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2007, 01:19:34 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2007, 10:00:26 PM
All the NCAC 2/7 Final Scores:

Denison 68  Kenyon 65
Allegheny 74  Oberlin 69
Wittenberg 71  Ohio Wesleyan 64
Wooster 90  Hiram 73
Earlham 72  Wabash 70

Hmmm.  34 total points difference, average of 6.8 per game, and four of them single-digit affairs.  That might not be remarkable anywhere else, but I wonder when was the last time in this conference we had a full slate of games with such a low total margin (and no Witt/Woo game)?

Quote from: pennstghs on February 08, 2007, 11:45:46 AM
Also Willie apparently im not the only one noticing that Wittenberg's attendance is kind of pathatic

from today's Springfield News Sun:

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/s/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2007/02/07/snssp020807wittnotes.html

Could be worse; Wittenberg could be in Italy ==>
Italians to Play Soccer With No Fans (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070208/ap_on_sp_so_ne/italy_soccer_security_7)
La Tigre su!   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2007, 01:24:33 PM
Pretty scathing article.  It's hard to find argument with the premise...if Wabash were ranked in the top 10 and coming off a Final Four season, Chadwick would be an absolute madhouse. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedAlum on February 08, 2007, 01:31:43 PM
CONGRATULATIONS TO DAN HODGKINSON ON BECOMING DENISON'S ALL TIME LEADING SCORER!!

CAREER  60% FGP
CAREER  75% FTP

Awesome numbers!!

He breaks the record that has stood for 37 years!!

And Denison won the game!!!

Way to go Dan. 
Way to go BIG RED!!!
Three more wins and punch a ticket to the tournament!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on February 08, 2007, 01:41:39 PM
Quote from: BigRedAlum on February 08, 2007, 01:31:43 PM
CONGRATULATIONS TO DAN HODGKINSON ON BECOMING DENISON'S ALL TIME LEADING SCORER!!

CAREER  60% FGP
CAREER  75% FTP

Awesome numbers!!

He breaks the record that has stood for 37 years!!

And Denison won the game!!!

Way to go Dan. 
Way to go BIG RED!!!
Three more wins and punch a ticket to the tournament!!!

congrats to Dan Hodgkinson. i always love it when a record is broken. especially a record like the all time leading scorer. and those numbers....you can't get much better than that and not be cheating. i've never seen him play, to my knowledge, but he must be one heck of a player to get those numbers. congratulations. i'm rooting for denison to get those 3 wins now. it'd be a shame for him to break the rcord and not get in the tourney. but i wont root for them over witt. lol.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2007, 02:07:55 PM
Congratulations from me to Dan as well.  :) I like the way Dan plays, and despite Denison's woeful record, I think he's a candidate for conference Player of the Year.  (Not trying to start a debate here...)

In the women's locker room down there, you'll find Denison's all-time leading rebounder and shot-blocker, and third-highest scorer, in the person of Kristen Sheffield.  You could make a pretty good argument that Denison currently is enjoying the presence of its best-ever women's and men's players at the same time.  Plus, the women's team is actually good (13-0 in conference, 19-3 overall, ranked #3 in the Great Lakes region.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 08, 2007, 02:17:27 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 08, 2007, 11:45:46 AM
Also Willie apparently im not the only one noticing that Wittenberg's attendance is kind of pathatic

from today's Springfield News Sun:

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/s/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2007/02/07/snssp020807wittnotes.html

I wonder what "Internet chat boards" are being referred to . . .  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on February 08, 2007, 02:25:01 PM
Anybody catch the slam at me? I read that and cringed... but at least I made the Springfield Newspaper during my time at Witt...
If you don't know, the line about the Pep Band is basically about me, since this year I'm a senior and I let go of the reins, trying to encourage the next set of youngin's to take over, and it never happened.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 08, 2007, 02:41:20 PM
tigerup07 i think we all got referenced as jscwittfan pointed to by "internet discussion boards"--we're moving up in recognition guys!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zu1414 on February 08, 2007, 03:23:34 PM
just curious...has a team ever finished first in a region and not met the seating requirements ?

glad to hear the Terriers played hard, which is to be expected. Moral victories won't get us a home game in the tourney though...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 08, 2007, 03:28:23 PM
Congrats to Dan, but my fav. denison basketball player to watch would be charlie DeLacey (sp?)  Anyone know where he was on the all-time scoring list??

Nice win for Earlham last night, and I want to take my hat off to Coach Justus with what he has been able to do with this team this year in the NCAC.  I look at Wabash's 17 man Roster (and they have a J.V. team) and to be able to beat a program like Wabash (after getting killed @Wabash) with the resources he has is remarkable to me.  Earlham barely has enough "Basketball players" to run practice and it's been like that for years and once again he has his team in position to finish 4th and HOST a tourney game!    Putting my hat back on.

OWU seems to be playing well as of late, and it will be a Tough task @ OWU this Saturday!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 08, 2007, 03:42:23 PM
Earlhamalum-wow you seem to be getting more and more on my goodside-Charlie Delacey is an alumnus of the same high school as me. He is famous for a very good Greenon team that lost to Roger Bacon in the state finals back in the late 90's.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2007, 03:44:35 PM
My admittedly limited exposure to the News-Sun over the years leads me to conclude that it must be a terrible paper.  Here's another misstatement, found at the bottom of the article pennstghs linked earlier today:

Quote from: Lucas Sullivan, the News-SunThe top seed in the region at the end of the regular season gets hosting rights as long as they meet the NCAA's seating requirements of 2,500-plus, which Lake Erie does not.

That's just flat wrong.  First, the Handbook says nothing about seating capacity for first- and second-round games, and sets as a sectional-hosting threshold of 1,000 seats, not "2,500-plus."  It took about 1 minute of research to discover this. 

But the more important and misleading error is where he says that the region's top seed "gets hosting rights."  There are no such things as "hosting rights," not for the top seed or anyone else.  Being the top-ranked regional teams gets you into a pay toilet (if you have a dime), and nothing else.  It doesn't even guarantee that you earn a berth in the tournament, much less the "right" to host. 

Here is what the men's handbook actually says about hosting:
Quote from: 2007 Division III Men's Basketball Championship Handbook, pp 7fSite Selection
The Championships Committee has prioritized the following site-selection criteria for all championships:
1. Quality and availability of the facility and other necessary accommodations;
2. Geographical location (which may include such factors as rotation of sites, weather, accessibility and transportation costs);
3. Seeding; and
4. Attendance history and revenue potential, which shall be considered necessary to assure fiscal responsibility.
In addition, the men's basketball committee requires each host to videotape all contests at its site, with the intent to make available to each team a copy of the contest in which it participated. The committee also prefers sites that will not host conflicting events during the championship practice and competition. Sites will also be evaluated as to the availability of appropriate practice times for all competing teams. To host first-round, second-round or sectional contests, a regulation court as defined in 2007 NCAA Men's and Women's Basketball Rules and Interpretations must be used. To host sectional competition, arena seating for at least 1,000 spectators is required.
An evaluation will be made of institutional facilities to determine if they are acceptable for championship play. Selection of host sites will be based partly upon the quality of the playing facility. A facility evaluation form must be completed online with a deadline of February 16. Instructions on accessing and completing the online facility evaluation will be mailed to the directors of athletics of all eligible Division III institutions sponsoring men's basketball. The facility evaluation is one of the tools used in determining site selection.

As you can see, far from there being any sort of automatic "hosting rights," a school has to apply to be a host site--and I can recall more than one instance when a higher-seeded team did not host because they failed to apply.  Seeding is only the third of the four "prioritized...criteria" in the site-selection process.

So, in response to zu1414, I don't know if anyone with an arena as small at Lake Erie's has ever finished the season as the top-ranked team in our region (I doubt it, but it could easily have happened in other regons), but it is not terribly important if they are.  Being #1 in the region is not a guarantee of hosting, and having a 750-seat gym is not an automatic bar to hosting in the first two rounds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2007, 03:49:20 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 08, 2007, 03:28:23 PM
Congrats to Dan, but my fav. denison basketball player to watch would be charlie DeLacey (sp?)  Anyone know where he was on the all-time scoring list??

Charlie DeLacey is ninth on Denison's all-time scoring list with 1,318 points.  He was a co-captain and the MVP of the 2001-02 team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2007, 03:59:27 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2007, 03:44:35 PM
Quote from: Lucas Sullivan, the News-SunThe top seed in the region at the end of the regular season gets hosting rights as long as they meet the NCAA's seating requirements of 2,500-plus, which Lake Erie does not.
That's just flat wrong. 

Why would he bother to fact-check that statement?  Based on the first half of the article we can gather that nobody in the greater Springfield area cares about Witt hoops anyway.     :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 08, 2007, 04:02:48 PM
Thanks David  and kudos i mean karma to you!  I know all-time records can be skewd.  I know Earlham use to be in the NAIA and played at least 30+ games a year giving the avg. 4 year player at least 16 more games a career!!!  Kind of hard for Earlham players now to top that unless they make it to the conference FINALS all 4 years.  I don't see Bluffton and Franklin College changing with Wittenberg and Wooster in the near future! ;)

P.S.  Golf Clap 4 u  Wally_W
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zu1414 on February 08, 2007, 05:31:15 PM
Charlie was a great player, just think how many more points he would have put up if he hit from the charity stripe at a higher percentage?

something sounded off about that, thanks for clearing it up David!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 08, 2007, 06:16:25 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2007, 03:44:35 PM
My admittedly limited exposure to the News-Sun over the years leads me to conclude that it must be a terrible paper. 

This is, in fact, a true statement.  The News-Sun sucks.

And, I find it funny that they complain about attendance.  While it is a problem that needs addressed, they do nothing to make it better - Witt is lucky to get anything more than a game recap in the paper unless it's Wooster week, tournament time, or, in special occasions, week-long coverage of the trip to the Final Four last year (and the women are lucky if they get anything more than a box score).  They are just as much to blame as anybody.

Maybe the folks at the SNS who cite "Internet discussion boards" as sources will see this and fix their errant ways.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 08, 2007, 06:50:12 PM
Quote from: zu1414 on February 08, 2007, 05:31:15 PM
Charlie was a great player, just think how many more points he would have put up if he hit from the charity stripe at a higher percentage?

You bring up a point that got me thinking zu.  I often wonder about how many more points Wooster's all-time scorer, Tom Dinger,  would have ended with had the 3-point line been instituted in his playing days!  I mean the guy scored 2,370 without the help of the 3 pointer which I know he could have taken advantage of.  I don't see that record falling anytime soon if ever. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 08, 2007, 07:05:26 PM
Since we're talking all-time records, I noticed when I was browsing Wooster's records pages something that I have been wondering about all season long and that is where has Andy Van Horn's 3 point range gone?  He has had an outstanding percentage the past 2 seasons checking in at .493 last season and .492 two seasons ago.  Those numbers are good enough to place him 6th and 7th on Wooster's all-time 3-point fg percentage list.  This season, Andy has barely been able to manage just over half that percentage only shooting .268 from 3-point range.  I've been thinking to myself as the season went along that he would eventually find his range again, but here we are with less than 2 weeks to go in the season and he has yet to dial it in.  I know that his primary job on the floor has been concentrating on the defensive end, but it was always nice to have that extra threat on the perimeter.  I still am holding out hope that he will suddenly catch fire from beyond the arc as we enter the most important stretch of the season and that is the post-season!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on February 08, 2007, 07:12:29 PM
as far as witt attendence goes, i think that parking plays a part in it as well. parking there sucks. there is no such thing as a good parking spot there. i think that if they can improve parking attendence should go up, not alot but it will help
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 08, 2007, 08:05:35 PM
David or to anyone else that might have an answer.  How come D3hoops.com doesn't advertise or go to AD's/Coaches and put a Banner up in D3 gymnasiums around the country?  My parents didn't know any such website was around until my senior year, and I wonder how many other D3 players families and friends are aware a website exist.  (Just a thought)  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 08, 2007, 08:46:20 PM
QuoteDavid or to anyone else that might have an answer.  How come D3hoops.com doesn't advertise or go to AD's/Coaches and put a Banner up in D3 gymnasiums around the country?  My parents didn't know any such website was around until my senior year, and I wonder how many other D3 players families and friends are aware a website exist.  (Just a thought)

First, you want to actually direct that question to Pat, who runs the site.
Second, you'd want to pitch it to SID's...which has been done.
Finally, for a long time, Earlham's Web site has provided a link to D3hoops.com. I'm sure your parents, who are probably consumed by your stats as much as you were, should have come across it every once in a while when looking to see how well you played against Kenyon. I thought your dad was deaf, not blind... ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 08, 2007, 08:49:50 PM
Speechless.................................................................... but true!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 08, 2007, 09:37:33 PM
Well, I would say first of all that we wouldn't ask the schools to cover the expense of creating a banner, and until recently, we haven't exactly had the budget to do much in the way of marketing.

We have some other projects on the front burner that we need to make sure we take care of, but marketing is something we're thinking intently about. Word of mouth and school Web site links have gotten us where we are today, but we could do more, I think.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 08, 2007, 09:59:28 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 08, 2007, 09:37:33 PMand until recently, we haven't exactly had the budget to do much in the way of marketing.

Not saying I would want it to happen but of the sports sites I go to this is the only one that isn't a pay site. I shell out $25 bucks or so a year at these other places to sling my obnoxious pendantry but do it for free here.

I'm honestly surprised, and happy, that this site is still free.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 08, 2007, 10:14:46 PM
I wouldnt prefer paying to visit this site but i would and i think you would find many of the same.

Also, jscwittfan i am also going to have to disagree with you partially. Up until this year yes the coverage has been weak but they have been fair this year as every day of the games they have tip off tips, a feature article or mention and they try to feature a different player on the team every week if they can as well. But yes up until the final four and tournament time last year we got a paragraph or so.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 08, 2007, 10:15:40 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 08, 2007, 09:59:28 PM
I'm honestly surprised, and happy, that this site is still free.

Thanks. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2007, 10:23:01 PM
I'm just the opposite. I'm all about the free baby. Keep it free, Pat.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2007, 10:33:09 PM
I get a little tingle when I think of how many of the obnoxious jerks around Posting Up would be unwilling to pony up $25 just to spew their venom or lame attempts at humor.  Heck, you'd have to shut down the NESCAC board altogether for lack of activity.  :)  I'd pay just for that reason alone.

Plus, I'm thoroughly addicted.   :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 08, 2007, 10:45:51 PM
Yeah I'd hardly say my Post are worth you guys paying $25..... I can see it now... a joint account... Billy_Earlhamalum_Pilgrim,  I'd let you guys know when it was me so I wouldn't ruin Billy's Rep. on this fine board! 

Thanks Pat for the Free-Posting........thus far!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2007, 10:56:48 PM
Pat - this seems like an opportune time to add my big THANK YOU! as well.  :)

D3Hoops is a great website because of your hard work and I also know that a signficant number of people surf/read this site even though they don't choose to post.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 08, 2007, 11:00:52 PM
I didn't know I had a reputation, earlhamalum......but I will echo the sentiment that this is a fine board.

Though I don't contribute as much as I once did, or would like to be able to, I still love coming here to freely read and post about the NCAC (and other conferences if I cared about them).

And, as a person who actually pays money to read what was once a great Indiana high school basketball message board, I am really thankful that what I get here comes as a much better price.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 08, 2007, 11:10:27 PM

Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 08, 2007, 09:59:28 PM
I'm honestly surprised, and happy, that this site is still free.

Me Too!

Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2007, 10:33:09 PM

Plus, I'm thoroughly addicted.   :P

Me Too!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on February 08, 2007, 11:32:18 PM
I would gracefully retire my keyboard before paying for posting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on February 08, 2007, 11:39:02 PM
And in response to the article concerning low attendence, who cares. Nothing is going to change from this. We are a victim of our own successes in the ncac. I would say in the past 5 years our average winning margin at home against a ncac opponent would be around 30. Big deal, it wasnt loud, i didnt see pennstigs (if i knew who he was) running around with his chest painted yelling for the crowd to get and get crazy. So in response who cares, I have better things to do then worry about why there is only 1000 at a witt owu game instead of 3500, I could care less
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 09, 2007, 12:53:09 AM
well apparently some of us do care-and yes i have been a faithful fan that has attended games. more like who cares what you think seeing as you're always negative about everything
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 09, 2007, 01:06:29 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 08, 2007, 09:59:28 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 08, 2007, 09:37:33 PMand until recently, we haven't exactly had the budget to do much in the way of marketing.

Not saying I would want it to happen but of the sports sites I go to this is the only one that isn't a pay site. I shell out $25 bucks or so a year at these other places to sling my obnoxious pendantry but do it for free here.

I'm honestly surprised, and happy, that this site is still free.

Want to support the site?  Buy the Kickoff.  I do, and will, up until such time as I find another D3 site better than this (not bloody likely in my lifetime) or lose interest (also not bloody likely).  If Pat ever decides to do a hoops Tipoff (which would only be 3-4 times the work!!) buy that too.  This site is our information source as well as our outlet.  If you can't fish out a few of your college educated dollars to support it, then you don't deserve it. 

Love me or hate me, I'll defend this site until the bitter end.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 09, 2007, 01:17:46 AM
Wabash fans have been very supportive of Kickoff in its two years, which is wonderful. Thanks. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 09, 2007, 01:45:02 AM
Quote from: WillieBrown on February 08, 2007, 11:39:02 PM
And in response to the article concerning low attendence, who cares. Nothing is going to change from this. We are a victim of our own successes in the ncac. I would say in the past 5 years our average winning margin at home against a ncac opponent would be around 30. Big deal, it wasnt loud, i didnt see pennstigs (if i knew who he was) running around with his chest painted yelling for the crowd to get and get crazy. So in response who cares, I have better things to do then worry about why there is only 1000 at a witt owu game instead of 3500, I could care less

And there's the apathy that kills the home crowds....

Of course, I'll chip in on the D3sports lovefest - this is a wonderful site, and something that I know will be here long after my days on campus are over.  Pat (and the rest of his staff) do a great job, and I know I mention this place as much as I can.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2007, 11:13:44 AM
I assume that Kickoff is some sort of D3 football preview (I admit that I have no interest in D3 football, so I almost never go to D3F.com any more).  If there were a "Tipoff" I'd certainly buy it; I'd even volunteer to work on it (hint, hint.)  In the meantime, I tried to show my support buy buying a hat and a coffee mug from the online store (http://chitwoodsports.com/cart/index.php?cPath=25&osCsid=03576bd283747de037b376852143e752), but that was 6 weeks ago and still no hat or mug....now, this is not the fault of D3Sports or Pat, rather it seems to be Chitwood Sports Media at fault, but still it is frustrating.  [/vent]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 09, 2007, 02:46:17 PM
Has anyone heard on the condition of Vandervaart's wrist and how the injury is progressing?  It's been 3 weeks since the injury and I remember hearing a diagnosis of 4-6 weeks.  If the injury is healing well, best case scenario would have him available for the NCAC Tournament Championship assuming Wooster makes it.  I was just curious if anyone had any info on wheter or not Vandervaart was on schedule to have a chance to play in the post-season or if the injury isn't progressing well and he would more than likely not be returning to action for the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 09, 2007, 02:55:22 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 09, 2007, 11:13:44 AM
I assume that Kickoff is some sort of D3 football preview (I admit that I have no interest in D3 football, so I almost never go to D3F.com any more).  If there were a "Tipoff" I'd certainly buy it; I'd even volunteer to work on it (hint, hint.)  In the meantime, I tried to show my support buy buying a hat and a coffee mug from the online store (http://chitwoodsports.com/cart/index.php?cPath=25&osCsid=03576bd283747de037b376852143e752), but that was 6 weeks ago and still no hat or mug....now, this is not the fault of D3Sports or Pat, rather it seems to be Chitwood Sports Media at fault, but still it is frustrating.  [/vent]

:-\ Sorry.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2007, 08:58:34 PM
The CoSIDa Academic All-District teams have been named, and although I can't find a single source listing for our district ("our" district being Ohio and four other non-NCAC states), I do know that at least three NCAC men's players have been named to the second team:  OWU's Ben Chojnacki, Wooster's Tom Port and Wittenberg's Pat Denbow.  If I find more, I'll add them to this list.

Congratulations to these fine student athletes!  They are what makes D3 basketball the very special game that it is.   :)

OWU press release (http://bishops.owu.edu/mb07acad.html)
Wooster press release (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2006-07/all_district.php)
Wittenberg press release (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/news/2007releases/02_09.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 09, 2007, 10:58:19 PM
I know this is dominated by Wooster and Wittenberg... just like the league, but the Race for 4th is going to be fun!    My opinion

4th  Earlham (8-8) EC has the best chance to finish 4th.  If they can win 2 out of 3 they will host.  (@OWU, Denison, @Oberlin)

5th  Wabash (7-9)  Lil Giants will have a rough time against the W's and win at home vs The Lords

5th  Hiram (7-9) Pups will be lucky to win one of their last 3 games .(@Witt, Allegheny, @Denison)

5th  Allegheny (7-9) Gators have a good chance at winning 2 out of their last 3.  Denison, @Hiram, Witt

8th  Kenyon (6-10) The Lords will Hopefully be able to beat the Yeoman tomorrow! That's it. (Oberlin, Wooster, @Wabash)

9th   Denison (4-10) Big Red they scare me... I could see them winning 2-3, but at the same time I could see them only winning ONE!  I think the Big Red could shake up the 4th spot!!  (@Allegheny, @Earlham, Hiram)

110th  Oberlin (3-13) Might Give Earlham a run for their money, but I see them ending the last 3 games with a Goose EGG. (@Kenyon, @OWU, Earlham)

I think Wooster will Lock up #1 Beating Wabash and OWU by an Avg. 9.5ppg, and Wittenberg will win out with 2 blow-outs and 1 close game!

Giving Wally_some credit I'm citing your post from a few days ago!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2007, 11:32:35 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 09, 2007, 10:58:19 PM
110th  Oberlin (3-13)

Wow :o, Oberlin's really dropped off!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 10, 2007, 01:26:52 AM
earlhamalum-

8 would seem to be the magic number for that fourth seed and Wabash dropping Wednesday's game puts that mark in serious jeopardy for the LG's.  They'll have to knock off one of the other W's in the next two games to get there.  I think the most likely culprit is actually @Witt (Wooster dictates tempo when they play Wabash and the Scots have such a huge advantage at the guard positions that Wabash upsetting Wooster is really tough...Witt plays a style and tempo that lends itself to the occasional upset).  Certainly, it is a longshot either way for Wabash to get to 8-8.  The most realistic best case scenario for Wabash would be to get the #5 seed and set up another game in Richmond, but there will likely need to be some tiebreakers that fall in favor of Wabash for that to happen.  We'll see how it plays out...Denison could definitely help Wabash's cause by finishing strong.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 10, 2007, 01:22:27 PM
Quote from: gotigers on February 08, 2007, 07:12:29 PM
as far as witt attendence goes, i think that parking plays a part in it as well. parking there sucks. there is no such thing as a good parking spot there. i think that if they can improve parking attendence should go up, not alot but it will help

Parking has always been an issue.  There used to be some parking where the HPER now sits, but it was only allowed when the ground was FROZEN because it was also the baseball field.  The ground didn't freeze that often.

Parking is not an issue for the students since they all live on campus anyway. 

Given that the nonathletes probably don't choose Witt because of its fine athletic program what would you expect the attendance to be at a small school where all the townies can watch NCAA Div I and the NBA on cable every night of the week?

The fieldhouse was always packed until the HPER center came but HPER is a lot bigger.

I just enjoy going to the games.  If it's not packed, I get a little extra room to spread out, which is a good thing.

I am not sure that DIII basketball is meant to be a growth business so attendance is what it is.  Someone asked why it is reported in all the box scores.  I think that box scores have traditionally listed certain things and one of them is attendance.  It doesn't mean it is tremendously important, it's just there.

Just my two cents.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 10, 2007, 01:36:30 PM
Congratulations to Pat Denbow and Kathy Hittle of the Witt basketball teams on their academic successes.  They both have 3.8 GPAs.  I can't imagine having a 3.8, let alone while playing a major sport.

A great accomplishment for them and other athletes named to the academic teams.

Go Tigers!  The Witt Worldwide radio network will be on the air at 4:00pm.

TF_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 10, 2007, 01:37:40 PM
How many Wabash posters will be in Springfield on Wednesday night?

I know it's Valentine's Day, but priorities, priorities.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 10, 2007, 02:24:54 PM
Halftime at Chadwick Court:

Wooster  38
Wabash  36  Halftime

A text message update from wally_wabash indicates that Coach Petty is wearing the sneakers on Coaches vs. Cancer suits and sneakers weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2007, 02:31:11 PM
5:49 left in 1st Half:  Wabash 27  Wooster 23
Marty Bidwell scored 8 points in a row for the Scots.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2007, 02:47:48 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 38  Wabash 36

Wooster started the game cold and only hit 5 of their first 18 shots as the Little Giants built a 10 point lead.  The Scots regained their shooting touch and eventually took the lead behind Marty Bidwell and Tom Port. :)

Wooster is being led by Tom Port with 13 points (3 three pointers), Marty Bidwell with 10 points and James Cooper with 6 points.

Wabash's leading scorers are Andrew Zimmer with 14 points, Andy Root with 6 points, Aaron Brock with 5 points and Brian Maloney with 5 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 10, 2007, 03:14:29 PM
New post for the second half:

Wooster   68
Wabash   63 Final

Wabash misses the shot coming off the time out and Zimmer commits his 3rd foul. Wooster drains the clock but misses the shot. Will steals the rebound from Stephens. Then a jump ball between Zimmer and Port. LGs get the ball.

Wabash shoots a 3, missed, Zimmer rebounds but stolen by Will and the LGs foul. Will missed the front end of the one-and-one but Wooster stepped out of bounds.

Wabash time out. Brock tosses into Haltom long 3 missed rebound Haltom who calls time out as he was falling out of bounds. After a lengthy discussion a full timeout awarded. There was some doubt as to whether Wabash had a time out left.

Okay, so they gave the timeout but also gave the technical foul. So this game is over.

I'm proud of Wabash for playing a close game against Wooster after the absolute annihilation that happened at Timken.

This was a good builder for the LGs but a win would have been better. Crap crap crap.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2007, 03:17:56 PM
Port and Zimmer are having quite the duel in this game.  Port already has 23 and Zimmer, not to be outdone, has 20 including 6 of Wabash's 10 2nd half points.  Wooster's lead is 7, 53-46.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2007, 03:25:52 PM
Wooster's got themselves a ballgame.  One point Wooster lead. Under 10 to play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2007, 03:33:20 PM
~5:00 remaining   Wooster 60  Wabash 54

Wooster's shooting is terrible today at less than 40% from the floor.  Scots are relying on their defense to maintain the lead in this game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2007, 03:36:47 PM
Haltom nails a trey to give Wabash the lead 61-60.

Bidwell answers with a trey and is fouled and completes the 4 point play!!!

Zimmer makes 2 ft's.

Wooster 64  Wabash 63.

Will with a layup to put the Scots up 66-63.  Time out Wabash.  1:18 to play.

17 seconds to go and Wooster is finally in the bonus with Will at the line. 

Will misses the front end.  Wabash ball with 15 seconds left.

Haltom misses an NBA trey.  Tries to save the rebound by calling Timeout which Wabash had none remaining.  Should be a technical foul.

Now the officials gave Wabash a timeout, but Wooster still gets the technical.  Fulk sinks both ft's to give Wooster a 5 point lead with 5 seconds to play.

Game over and Wooster escapes from Crawfordsville by the skin of their teeth 68-63!!!

What a game effort by the Lil Giants today.  They gave Wooster all they could handle today!



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2007, 03:36:55 PM
Wabash takes the lead 61-60 and Marty Bidwell responds with a 4 point play! :)  Wooster 64-61
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2007, 03:48:50 PM
Final:  Wooster 68  Wabash 63

Wooster escapes Crawfordsville with the road win.  Scots won this game with their defense as they held Wabash to only 27 points in the 2nd half.  :) :o

Wooster was led today by Tom Port with 23 points, James Cooper with 17 points and Marty Bidwell with 14 points.

Leading scorers for the Little Giants were Andrew Zimmer with a game high 25 points, Chase Haltom with 12 points and Andy Root with 10 points.

Wooster is now 20-3, 13-1 NCAC :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2007, 04:15:47 PM
I think if you look at this game along with the Earlham game, it shows how important it is for the Scots to win out and give themselves a shot at hosting the sectional.  Wooster has struggled mightily lately on the road shooting from beyond the arc for some reason.  Wooster only made 8-27 in their game at Earlham, and today, they were only 8-23 from 3-point land.  They were also only 4-17 at OWU.  So they are a combined 20-67 from downtown in their last 3 road games for an unimpressive 29%.   If this trend continues and they happen to not be awarded the Sectional host, they could have an early exit from the tournament if their woeful shooting on the road continues. ???  Not to mention the fact that the quality of opponent they would be facing would be a little bit better than the likes of the EC and Wabash.  Not to take anything away from those teams, but it's just the facts.

Moving on, it could be argued that Marty Bidwell should get the gameball for Wooster today as he made 3 treys including the HUGE 4 point play right after Wabash grabbed the lead for the 1st time in the 2nd half.  He and Port combined for 7 of Wooster's 8 treys made today.  Without Bidwell's hot shooting afternoon, the Scots lose this game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 10, 2007, 04:45:58 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 10, 2007, 04:15:47 PMMoving on, it could be argued that Marty Bidwell should get the gameball for Wooster today as he made 3 treys including the HUGE 4 point play right after Wabash grabbed the lead for the 1st time in the 2nd half.

I totally agree. That 4 point play was the ball game. It totally destroyed Wabash's momentum. You could hear the air sucked out of the crowd at that point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 10, 2007, 04:58:10 PM
Coach Moore even says it in the post game interview - "If Marty (Bidwell) doesn't make that shot we probably lose the game".

Wabash really has improved since that low point trip to Hiram and Alleghany. And they are doing it with youth. Does Wabash get Simkus back next year? If they do they could really challenge for the league title next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 10, 2007, 05:01:07 PM
Final:   OWU 82   EC 70
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 10, 2007, 05:32:44 PM
Final from Kenyon's website:

Oberlin 66, Kenyon 73
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2007, 06:23:15 PM
The edit feature has made reading the recaps of Wooster/Wabash a time-bending experience.  :D

Rather than make the long drive to C'ville, I settled for the short drive to Gambier to take in an afternoon of Kenyon sports.  I got to watch portions of a tennis match (men and women) with the University of Chicago, both the softball and baseball teams practicing, and two basketball games, both won by Kenyon (women 47, Earlham 39, and men 73, Oberlin 66), all within a few yards of one another inside the Kenyon Athletic Center.  (By the way, have I mentioned how nice that facility is? ;) :D)  I don't really have much to say about the games, apart from the fact that the Lords always seem to play nailbiters at home, which makes me wonder what will happen when Wooster hits town on Wednesday.

But I do have a few comments about the fans.

First, the women's game had a pretty good crowd of students in attendance.  They all looked like athletes; maybe they were there between practices elsewhere in the building, I can't say.  But they all got up and left when the women's game was over, and they were replaced by a different crowd of students for the men's game.  I found that to be a little odd, but it's good that both teams get decent on-campus support.

Second, while I couldn't discern any Earlham fans in attendance (not surprising, since it's a long drive to watch a team lose it's 20th game), but there were a small number of Oberlin fans who drove down for the game.  I think that's great, especially since the only reason I was there was because I didn't want to make a long drive to an away game muself.  Kudos to Oberlin fans who came to Gambier.  However, I had the distinct displeasure of sitting in front of OC "fans" during the first half who, between them, had about 5 positive things to say about their team.  These two, however, scarcely let a single play go by without some complaint about the refereeing--many of them absurd.  I can't understand why people would travel all that way just to carp about the officials, non-stop, and virtually never cheer in a positive manner.  It was so annoying that I packed up and moved to another seat for the second half.  This was also in front of two Oberlin fans, but these two were all about support and encouragement ("rebound!"  "block out!"  "good hustle!"), and I was glad to have them there. 

Third, I was actually picked out of the crowd by a lurker, who turned out to be a player's parent--lucky for me, the lurker's son is a player I respect a lot.  :) I'm still not quite sure what clues led him to deduce that I was who I was, but I was glad he had the moxie to come up and introduce himself.  We had a nice conversation about his son and his team, and of course about the facility that evidently I can't stop talking about.  I wish we had people from his school that would post (since we have none from either KC or OC), and told him so, but I can understand the reticence of a player's father.  He said he might come online when his son has graduated.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2007, 06:33:04 PM
Rounding out the NCAC scores:

Wtt - 78,  Hiram - 41

Allegheny - 94, Denison - 67

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 10, 2007, 07:43:50 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 10, 2007, 06:23:15 PMI can understand the reticence of a player's father.  He said he might come online when his son has graduated.   :)

What? A player's father posting would be a bad idea? That's never been a problem before.  :P

The potential problem would be worth the risk to get some Kenyon and Oberlin participation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 10, 2007, 07:47:15 PM
Some first hand observations from the thriller at Chadwick....

- Wabash played really, really hard in this one.  They never backed down or gave an inch to a far superior team. To have this kind of effort on the heels of a loss that pretty much dooms Wabash from hosting a tournament game says a lot. 

- On the other side of the coin, Wooster looked pretty uninterested to me.  For a stretch in the second half Port woke up and dominated the game then later in the second half Cooper woke up and took over for a bit.  I imagine Wooster is a lot better when those guys are in games that don't bore them. 

- If Zimmer isn't a first team NCAC selection, there needs to be an investigation. 

Quote from: goscots on February 10, 2007, 04:58:10 PM
Coach Moore even says it in the post game interview - "If Marty (Bidwell) doesn't make that shot we probably lose the game".

No doubt about it.  The three by itself was ok.  The foul on the shot is what was the killer.  The foul shot put Wooster up by three and Wabash got trigger happy on three point field goals trying to make up the deficit with one shot.  This took Zimmer out of the game in the last minute and while I love that our freshman are willing to take these kinds of shots, they got a little quick on shooting the 3.  Had the foul on Bidwell's shot not happened, it would have been a two point game and Wabash may have run the offense through Zimmer down the stretch at which point anything could have happened.

Quote from: goscots on February 10, 2007, 04:58:10 PM
Wabash really has improved since that low point trip to Hiram and Alleghany. And they are doing it with youth. Does Wabash get Simkus back next year? If they do they could really challenge for the league title next year.

I can't say for sure, but I'm assuming that Simkus comes back and plays next year.  He'll lend some much needed height to the lineup (particularly with the graduation of Stephens at the end of this year).  League title?  I'm not ready to go that far.  Wooster and Witt are head and shoulders above the rest of this league.  I don't think that one year of experience rockets Wabash up into that echelon.  I do think that it's reasonable for Wabash to be a clear cut #3 in the league next year with the ability to steal a win from one of the other W's. 

All in all it was a very fun game to watch.  I'm hoping Wabash can bring a similar effort to Springfield on Wednesday and steal one at the HPER. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 10, 2007, 08:06:13 PM
Simkus will be back next year I feel. This is all about his educational opportunities.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2007, 08:19:50 PM
All the NCAC 2/10 Final Scores:

Kenyon 73  Oberlin 66
Allegheny 94  Denison 67
Ohio Wesleyan 82  Earlham 70
Wittenberg 78  Hiram 41
Wooster 68  Wabash 63

....and the Current NCAC Standings:

Wooster 13-1 (20-3)
Wittenberg 12-2 (20-3)
Ohio Wesleyan 9-5 (15-8)
Allegheny 6-8 (10-12)
Kenyon 6-8 (10-13)
Wabash 6-8 (9-14)
Earlham 6-8 (8-15)
Hiram 6-8 (7-16)
Denison 3-11 (4-18)
Oberlin 3-11 (4-19)

5 Way Tie for 4th Place and the Home Game in First Round of NCAC Tourney :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2007, 08:24:18 PM
With Wooster's record now at 20-3, it is time to offer.....

Congratulations to Wooster Coach Steve Moore on his 11th Consecutive Season of 20 Wins or More!  :)

This is an impressive streak and the last time Wooster failed to win 20 games was in 1995-1996 when the Scots finished 19-7.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2007, 09:04:25 PM
Also, congratulations are in order for Tom Port as he moved into 3rd on the all-time scoring list at Wooster with 1,607 points.  He now only trails Wooster greats Tom Dinger and Bryan Nelson.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 10, 2007, 09:07:11 PM
Another milestone with the 20th win is that Wooster is now 200-31 in the 200's. Their program highlights the Scots as the winningest Division III men's team in this decade.  For the Seniors, they are 99-14 and woud go for win #100 on Wednesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2007, 09:18:39 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2007, 08:19:50 PM
....and the Current NCAC Standings:

Wooster 13-1 (20-3)
Wittenberg 12-2 (20-3)
Ohio Wesleyan 9-5 (15-8)
Allegheny 6-8 (10-12)
Kenyon 6-8 (10-13)
Wabash 6-8 (9-14)
Earlham 6-8 (8-15)
Hiram 6-8 (7-16)
Denison 3-11 (4-18)
Oberlin 3-11 (4-19)

5 Way Tie for 4th Place and the Home Game in First Round of NCAC Tourney :)

And, with just 2 games left, Denison and Oberlin are eliminated.  The top 8 teams have all clinched playoff berths, and the top 3 have all clinched 1st round home games, opponents TBD.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 10, 2007, 10:08:05 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 10, 2007, 06:23:15 PM
The edit feature has made reading the recaps of Wooster/Wabash a time-bending experience.  :D

I had to go back and read it all.............I couldn't figure out how Lil' Giant knew the score so much earlier than everyone else.............I was going to invite him to Vegas. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2007, 10:11:33 PM
2/10 Regional Scores of Interest:

Lake Erie 109  Mt. Aloysius 93 (a mountain of a cupcake :) :P)
Hope 84  Adrian 71
Capital 74  Ohio Northern 70
John Carroll 85  Marietta 58

All teams in the NCAA GL Regional Rankings won except Ohio Northern
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2007, 10:17:43 PM
Quote from: sac on February 10, 2007, 10:08:05 PM
I had to go back and read it all.............I couldn't figure out how Lil' Giant knew the score so much earlier than everyone else.............I was going to invite him to Vegas. :D

Yea....you have to watch those clever Wabash guys who "modify" their earlier posts with the updated scores!  :D ;)

All kidding aside, I always appreciate the updates from Lil Giant and Wally because often it is the only quick way to get an update/final score from games played in Indiana. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 11, 2007, 04:03:12 AM
yeah good and easy win today-well yesterday- for Wittenberg. Just what we needed. Hopefully the tough game vs Wabash last time and their showing against wooster will help us not look past them. im more concerned with the road game at allegheny because historically they give us problems at their place.

note to wooster fans-i did show a little class today as i saw some Wooster fans coming back from the game in Crawfordsville at work at Cracker Barrel today and went over to say hi and find out info about the game. So there is some civility in the world lol.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 11, 2007, 06:55:20 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 11, 2007, 04:03:12 AM
note to wooster fans-i did show a little class today as i saw some Wooster fans coming back from the game in Crawfordsville at work at Cracker Barrel today and went over to say hi and find out info about the game. So there is some civility in the world lol.

That was my parents and I. It was nice of you to stop by our table and ask about the Scots game.  Maybe we'll see you up in Wooster in a couple of weeks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 11, 2007, 07:17:13 AM
The game in Crawfordsville was hardly a thing of beauty for the Scots.  Wabash was an entirely different team than the one that visisted Wooster a month ago.  This team played with intensity, hustle and determination that almost got them the big upset. 

While Port had the big numbers for the Scots - 23 points and 10 boards, there were 3 big sequences in the game.  In the first half 'bash had pulled out to a 10-pt lead when Bidwell ripped 2 consecutive 3 pointers followed by a pair of FTs to pull the Scots back in it.  In the 2nd half, Cooper got hot for a stretch to help maintain the Scots 5 to 7 pt lead, then as mentioned earlier, the big 4-pt play by Bidwell after Wabash had regained the lead.

On the Scots side, game balls go to Port and Bidwell.  Marty logged 32 minutes, grabbed 7 boards and made several clutch shots.

For the Little Giants, the game ball goes to Zimmer.  He was a force inside with 25 pts and 8 rebounds.  The Scots just had no answer for him.

On to Kenyon on Wed night!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 11, 2007, 08:45:14 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 11, 2007, 04:03:12 AM
Hopefully the tough game vs Wabash last time and their showing against wooster will help us not look past them. im more concerned with the road game at allegheny because historically they give us problems at their place. .

I think you just looked past Wasbash to Allegheney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zu1414 on February 11, 2007, 10:01:24 AM
5 way tie and the Terriers seem to have an edge. If Hiram is able to gain wins at home Wed against Allegheny and at Dension on Saturday, that would put them at 8-8.

Now my understanding of tie-breakers is limited, but if it comes down to head-to-head, Hiram would have the advantage over both Earlham and Wabash, via their narrow wins in the beginning of Jan.

Big week. Go Terriers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2007, 11:11:43 AM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 11, 2007, 06:55:20 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 11, 2007, 04:03:12 AM
note to wooster fans-i did show a little class today as i saw some Wooster fans coming back from the game in Crawfordsville at work at Cracker Barrel today and went over to say hi and find out info about the game. So there is some civility in the world lol.

That was my parents and I. It was nice of you to stop by our table and ask about the Scots game.  Maybe we'll see you up in Wooster in a couple of weeks.

Small world!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 11, 2007, 12:58:07 PM
Leaving aside the weather forecast, how many Wabash posters will be in Springfield on Wednesday evening?

TF_73

P.S.  This is kind of a repost.  I asked yesterday but the post may have been missed in all the excitement of game action.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2007, 01:15:41 PM
I know this probably wouldn't interest the Wabash folks (::)), but those planning to go to the HPER Center on Wednesday should give serious thought to showing up for the 6:00 women's game between Wittenberg and Kenyon.  This is an absolutely pivotal game in the NCAC standings; Witt can clinch the #2 seed, while Kenyon can clinch a tournament home game and throw the #2-#6 positions of the conference standings into utter turmoil.  I predict that this will be an intense and well-played game (by NCAC standards); I wish I could be there myself. 

As this is a straight 6:00/8:00 doubleheader, I wonder how Witt will handle admissions: 2 x $8, or is there a doubleheader price?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on February 11, 2007, 01:52:49 PM
DC:  In the past it has been a double header price.  And I doubt that it will be $8 to get in because Wooster isn't playing.  I'll bet its $5 to see the two games.  Don't quote me on that, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2007, 02:00:27 PM
Pete, Witt has raised the gate price since you graduated; the standard price for all men's and women's games, regardless of opponent, is $8.  Witt ticket policy. (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/news/2006releases/08_29a.html)  But I imagine you're right in that there's a doubleheader price. 

IMHO this doubleheader is worth $16, but $8 would be better.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 11, 2007, 03:59:20 PM
DC i agree that it is almost assuredly going to be 8 for both games, as i doubt this will be a sell out "according to the Springfield News Sun's" wisdowm  ;D. If they charge 8 for each game i will stand up for us all because that would be ridiculous.....not that they would listen to any input from students anyways

should be a good game as well in the women's game, i wont be able to attend either as i have to work since it is a hallmark holiday and we will be busy at work.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2007, 10:08:31 PM
I looked at the five 6-8 teams and their remaining NCAC schedules to see who has the best shot at securing the #4 seed and first round home game in the NCAC tourney.  IMO, the Quakers have the best chance at the #4 seed.

Earham looks likely to finish 8-8 (Denison home, at Oberlin)
Hiram has a shot at an 8-8 record (Allegheny home, at Denison)
Wabash looks likely to finish 7-9 (at Witt, Kenyon home)
Allegheny could be 7-9 or 6-10 (at Hiram, Wittenberg home)
Kenyon looks likely to finish 6-10 (Wooster home, at Wabash)

Of course, these are only my rough projections.  The real results will be decided on the hardwood.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 11, 2007, 10:43:31 PM
well for the 5-8 seeds we could try the OAC method............flipping a coin
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 12, 2007, 06:36:53 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 09, 2007, 11:13:44 AM
I assume that Kickoff is some sort of D3 football preview (I admit that I have no interest in D3 football, so I almost never go to D3F.com any more).  If there were a "Tipoff" I'd certainly buy it; I'd even volunteer to work on it (hint, hint.)  In the meantime, I tried to show my support buy buying a hat and a coffee mug from the online store (http://chitwoodsports.com/cart/index.php?cPath=25&osCsid=03576bd283747de037b376852143e752), but that was 6 weeks ago and still no hat or mug....now, this is not the fault of D3Sports or Pat, rather it seems to be Chitwood Sports Media at fault, but still it is frustrating.  [/vent]

If Chitwood Sports Media won't mail product, it must mean that the townspeople fired Norman Dale.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2007, 10:25:41 AM
I can tell that that's a joke, and a Google search suggests that "Norman Dale" is a character from the film Hoosiers, but I still don't get it.  Perhaps that's because I hated that movie.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 12, 2007, 11:03:09 AM
Hickory High's best player, Jimmy CHITWOOD, sat out the opening few games of the season in the movie Hoosiers. When Chitwood does decide to rejoin the team, he does so only under the stipulation that Norman Dale (Gene Hackman) stays on as the coach. The small town of Hickory was ready to strap Norman's ass to a pine rail and send him down the Monon line.

So, your mug and hat are slow arriving because Chitwood Sports Media has lost its namesake, most likely "cause he transferred on over to Terhune" following Dale's dismissal.

Now, David, I've already had my eye on you because you despise Joe Paterno. But, now, you hate the greatest film ever made. While I have found countless faults with the movie Hoosiers, on subject matter alone, it goes to the top of any list of great feature films.

So, please, tell us why you cheer against the Hickory Huskers....or I may have to battle you to the death.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2007, 11:12:18 AM
DC - *snif*.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2007, 11:13:10 AM
Not being from Indiana, I have never found Indiana high school basketball to be a terribly interesting subject.  Beyond that, it's been many, many years since I saw it, so I can't remember all the things that made me dislike it, but I do recall that the acting was terrible and the direction was ham-handed.

And I don't hate the "greatest film ever made," but we're not talking about Fanny och Alexander here, are we?  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 12, 2007, 11:36:54 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 12, 2007, 11:13:10 AM
Not being from Indiana, I have never found Indiana high school basketball to be a terribly interesting subject.  Beyond that, it's been many, many years since I saw it, so I can't remember all the things that made me dislike it, but I do recall that the acting was terrible and the direction was ham-handed.

I didn't get it either.  Being a transplant from the west coast, the hooplah surrounding Indiana basketball was lost on me.  I remember one day during my time as a student, word leaked that I had never seen Hoosiers.  I was immediately forced to put down the books and spend the next 90 minutes or so getting an education on Indiana basketball.  Your critique of the film is pretty accurate, DC (Gene Hackman + Barbara Hershey = Worst onscreen chemistry.  Ever.) but you can't help but love the story I think.  Everybody loves David...unless of course you're a devout fan of Goliath.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 12, 2007, 12:14:23 PM
I loved Hoosiers, and have watched it countless times over the years from when I first saw it in the theatre in 1981.  While I don't consider it the best movie ever made, it's clearly my favorite sports film.  So what if Hackman and Hershey are an improbable couple, or if the ending is completely predictable?  It had me misty-eyed the first time and still occasionally does.

In San Francisco, where I lived during the big earthquake in 1989, I remember watching a tape of Hoosiers late that night with some friends after our power had been restored.  None had ever seen it before but all loved it.  It was the perfect film to watch after the calamitous events of that day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2007, 12:26:17 PM
My favorite sports movies are Requiem for a Heavyweight (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0056406/) (Ralph Nelson, 1962) and the documentary Tokyo Olympiad (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0059817/) (Ichikawa Kon, 1965).

The only reason I can think of that would make Hoosiers the "perfect film to watch" in the aftermath of an earthquake is that it serves as a reminder that, no matter how bad things are, they could be worse.   ;);D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2007, 12:36:16 PM
Well, DC, if you grew up here, you'd get it. Even though they ruined it when they went to classes, high school basketball still evokes passion in pockets around the state.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2007, 12:47:19 PM
Oh, I get it; at least, I understand that people from Indiana look on their high school basketball as some kind of religion.  But they also seem to enjoy watching funny-looking cars drive in circles for hours. ??? There's a lot about Indiana that I'll never understand. ;)

If I want to watch a sports movie where the underdog makes good, I'll take Major League (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0097815/) (David S. Ward, 1989) every time.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2007, 01:11:47 PM
Mind you, some of us like to watch the cars turn left AND right as well!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 12, 2007, 02:03:09 PM
Hoosiers is a great movie that showed everyone that ever watched it a remarkable basketball story.  It would be like Milian High School (Hickory) beating Indianapolis North Central today for the state chamionship!  .00001 chance of that happening even if they didn't have class basketball in Indiana.

Second... I'll never understand OHIOians.  Hands down (KY in a close 2nd) for the oddest people I've met in this fine country  I'm not saying Indiana isn't in my top 10  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 12, 2007, 02:20:49 PM
I have never understood what anyone sees in the movie Major League, unless it's just the fact that it's about the Indians.  Other than that, simply nothing, it's among the dumbest films that I've ever seen.  Not even in the top 100 sports movies; as a matter of fact I can hardly think of one that's worse.

Requiem for a Heavyweight is terrific, as was the televised 1956 Playhouse 90 version starring Jack Palance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 12, 2007, 02:42:59 PM
Here's the news hot off an email from Witt.

One ticket is good for both games on Wednesday.  The women play Kenyon at 6 and the men play Wabash at 8:00.

Also, the men's game will be on the Wittenberg Worldwide Video network.

Go here http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule06-07.html

Scroll down to Feb. 14 and click on "Watch/Listen Live".

TF_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 12, 2007, 03:21:41 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 12, 2007, 12:47:19 PMIf I want to watch a sports movie where the underdog makes good, I'll take Major League (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0097815/) (David S. Ward, 1989) every time.  :D

I'm a native Texan but even before I made my way up to Indiana I loved Hoosiers. I put it up there in my "favorite sports movies" list. Right alongside Major League, which is, in my opinion, the best baseball movie ever.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 12, 2007, 03:23:53 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 12, 2007, 03:21:41 PM
I'm a native Texan but even before I made my way up to Indiana I loved Hoosiers. I put it up there in my "favorite sports movies" list. Right alongside Major League, which is, in my opinion, the best baseball movie ever.

Li'l Giant -

Are you making the trip to Springfield?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 12, 2007, 03:27:46 PM
Pitchers and catchers start reporting on Wednesday.

Which can only mean the "Field of Dreams" marathon on TBS isn't too far away, followed by many showings of "The Natural", "Bull Durham", "Major League" and "A League of Their Own"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Superfoot Wallace on February 12, 2007, 03:31:45 PM
Have a Milan kid on my lunchtime pickup team, and Plumps last shot makes a helluva bowl a chowdah.

signed,
Ray Kinsella
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 12, 2007, 04:10:15 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 12, 2007, 03:23:53 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 12, 2007, 03:21:41 PM
I'm a native Texan but even before I made my way up to Indiana I loved Hoosiers. I put it up there in my "favorite sports movies" list. Right alongside Major League, which is, in my opinion, the best baseball movie ever.

Li'l Giant -

Are you making the trip to Springfield?


I guess I should have mentioned I'm also a current Texan as well. :) Since it's about 1200 miles or so, I'm going to have to listen on the internet. Thanks for the invite, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 12, 2007, 04:33:09 PM
Major League rules.  It just noses out Bull Durham for the best baseball movie of all time (on my personal list).  I'd put Field of Dreams on top of the list, but the more I see it, the less Field of Dreams strikes me as a baseball movie and more of a father/son movie in a baseball context.  Quick aside, if you're ever passing through Iowa, go to Dyersville and visit the Field of Dreams.  It's an awesome time for any fan of the movie...there's nothing quite like having a catch on that diamond. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 12, 2007, 05:11:15 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 12, 2007, 04:33:09 PMIt just noses out Bull Durham for the best baseball movie of all time (on my personal list).

Dude, Bull Durham isn't a "baseball movie". It's a "chick flick" with some baseball interspersed to keep the guys interested. Kind of like For Love of the Game, another Costner chick flick.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 12, 2007, 05:15:20 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 12, 2007, 05:11:15 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 12, 2007, 04:33:09 PMIt just noses out Bull Durham for the best baseball movie of all time (on my personal list).

Dude, Bull Durham isn't a "baseball movie". It's a "chick flick" with some baseball interspersed to keep the guys interested. Kind of like For Love of the Game, another Costner chick flick.

And you think you know somebody...wow.  We can agree to disagree on this point.   :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 12, 2007, 06:10:38 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 12, 2007, 05:11:15 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 12, 2007, 04:33:09 PMIt just noses out Bull Durham for the best baseball movie of all time (on my personal list).

Dude, Bull Durham isn't a "baseball movie". It's a "chick flick" with some baseball interspersed to keep the guys interested. Kind of like For Love of the Game, another Costner chick flick.

LOL, that's worth a karma point.

Alright, I'm going to have to give Major League another look.  But I've tried twice to get all the way through it and failed miserably both times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2007, 06:45:17 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 12, 2007, 06:10:38 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 12, 2007, 05:11:15 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 12, 2007, 04:33:09 PMIt just noses out Bull Durham for the best baseball movie of all time (on my personal list).

Dude, Bull Durham isn't a "baseball movie". It's a "chick flick" with some baseball interspersed to keep the guys interested. Kind of like For Love of the Game, another Costner chick flick.

LOL, that's worth a karma point.

Alright, I'm going to have to give Major League another look.  But I've tried twice to get all the way through it and failed miserably both times.

Like I have with Bull Durham, although I think I've tried more than twice.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2007, 07:08:54 PM
I thought Major League was puerile. I loved the baseball stuff in Bull Durham, but I cast my baseball movie vote for Eight Men Out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 12, 2007, 07:41:25 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 12, 2007, 06:45:17 PM
Like I have with Bull Durham, although I think I've tried more than twice.

We're in agreement on this one, I can't get through Bull Durham, either.  Eight Men Out is probably me favorite baseball movie.  Not quite as good, though, as another John Sayle's fllick that had much of the same cast, Matewan, where David Strathairn portrays a West Virginian police chief absolutely perfectly.

Police Chief: "You boys have ten minutes to get those belongings back in there."
Company Man: "You wouldn't be talking to us like that if we had all our boys here."

Pause.

Police Chief: "You had all your boys here, I'd give you five."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 12, 2007, 08:00:29 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 12, 2007, 04:33:09 PM
Major League rules.  It just noses out Bull Durham for the best baseball movie of all time (on my personal list).  I'd put Field of Dreams on top of the list, but the more I see it, the less Field of Dreams strikes me as a baseball movie and more of a father/son movie in a baseball context.  Quick aside, if you're ever passing through Iowa, go to Dyersville and visit the Field of Dreams.  It's an awesome time for any fan of the movie...there's nothing quite like having a catch on that diamond. 

Field of Dreams, unquestionably, is the leader for me.  You're right, Wally, it's a father/son movie and as the baseball playing son of a baseball playing father, it really gets me.  Also, James Earl Jones' speech near the end about baseball standing the test of time as "America has rolled by like an army of steamrollers" is magnificent.

I was in Dyersville this summer, and you're right, you feel enchanted the whole time your out on that diamond.  Very glad I made the sidetrip to visit it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 12, 2007, 08:46:16 PM
scotsbrod i def. agree with you on the fireld of dreams opinion. i looked at old pictures i have from when i visited there as a little kid as i lived in iowa for 6 years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 12, 2007, 08:51:45 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 12, 2007, 07:08:54 PM
I thought Major League was puerile. I loved the baseball stuff in Bull Durham, but I cast my baseball movie vote for Eight Men Out.

When I hear "baseball movie" I think Major League, Eight Men Out and The Natural and to a lesser extent Field of Dreams.

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 12, 2007, 04:33:09 PMQuick aside, if you're ever passing through Iowa, go to Dyersville and visit the Field of Dreams.  It's an awesome time for any fan of the movie...there's nothing quite like having a catch on that diamond.

Wally, you ought to tell them about The Ball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on February 12, 2007, 09:05:54 PM
Harry Doyle and Lou Brown are arguably the best personalites from any movie of all time
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 12, 2007, 09:22:46 PM
New Top 25 Poll is out:

New #1 is Wisconsin Stevens Point and former #1 Amherst is now #3
Wooster moves up one notch to #4
Wittenberg moves up one notch to #6

Ohio Northern, after their Saturday loss, drops out of the Top 25
No OAC teams in the Top 25 though ONU and John Carroll are "receiving votes"

Hope, after their loss to Calvin, drops to #10
Lake Erie, first in the NCAA regional rankings, is still "receiving votes" and is ostensibly #26.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 12, 2007, 10:07:25 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 12, 2007, 04:10:15 PM
[
I guess I should have mentioned I'm also a current Texan as well. :) Since it's about 1200 miles or so, I'm going to have to listen on the internet. Thanks for the invite, though.

Yeah, that "current" definitely clears that up.

TF_73
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 13, 2007, 12:28:46 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 12, 2007, 11:13:10 AM
Not being from Indiana, I have never found Indiana high school basketball to be a terribly interesting subject.  Beyond that, it's been many, many years since I saw it, so I can't remember all the things that made me dislike it, but I do recall that the acting was terrible and the direction was ham-handed.

And I don't hate the "greatest film ever made," but we're not talking about Fanny och Alexander here, are we?  ;D

Yawn.

David, as an NPU graduate I have had more than enough real-life experience with Swedes and their serotonin-reuptake issues, thankyouverymuch. Bergman films don't even let you numb yourself to Swedish angst in the accustomed manner, unless you can find a way to sneak alcohol into the theater.

Besides, any right-thinking person knows that the greatest film ever made is the Marx Brothers' A Night at the Opera.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 13, 2007, 12:38:59 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 12, 2007, 07:08:54 PM
I thought Major League was puerile. I loved the baseball stuff in Bull Durham, but I cast my baseball movie vote for Eight Men Out.

I feel the same way, Scott: Eight Men Out > Bull Durham > Major League. However, Major League isn't even close to being the worst baseball movie ever made. That would be Fear Strikes Out, the horrible biopic in which the incredibly unathletic Anthony Perkins swings and whiffs at trying to portray major-league outfielder Jimmy Piersall.

And I also second WooBoo's vote for Mattewan as John Sayles' best movie.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 13, 2007, 12:42:41 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 13, 2007, 12:28:46 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 12, 2007, 11:13:10 AM
Not being from Indiana, I have never found Indiana high school basketball to be a terribly interesting subject.  Beyond that, it's been many, many years since I saw it, so I can't remember all the things that made me dislike it, but I do recall that the acting was terrible and the direction was ham-handed.

And I don't hate the "greatest film ever made," but we're not talking about Fanny och Alexander here, are we?  ;D

Yawn.

David, as an NPU graduate I have had more than enough real-life experience with Swedes and their serotonin-reuptake issues, thankyouverymuch. Bergman films don't even let you numb yourself to Swedish angst in the accustomed manner, unless you can find a way to sneak alcohol into the theater.

Besides, any right-thinking person knows that the greatest film ever made is the Marx Brothers' A Night at the Opera.

I've often wondered how honest people are with their opinion of the "greatest movie". Like  when someone is asked what they think the best movie ever is are they really going to say "Weekend at Bernie's"? Of course not. They throw out Citizen Kane or Casablanca because being honest with yourself and saying Wayne's World makes you look like a retard. Personally, I think the greatest movie ever is The Godfather.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 13, 2007, 12:46:33 AM
Worst baseball movie ever is Summer Catch with Freddie Prinze, Jr. Luckily, most of you are too old to know that one.........never thought being to old could really benefit you, eh?

As for best baseball movies, call it what you will, but Field of Dreams is the best. And Bull Durham is #2.

Basketball....there is no #2, #3 or #4....but #5 would be Blue Chips....which was partially filmed in Frankfort's Case Arena. Plus, Matt Nover had a leading role...and his acting is on par with anyone from films about a bunch of Swedish children.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 13, 2007, 08:17:52 AM
Interesting article in the New York Times today regarding the potential splitting up of Division III.  It's a pretty good read, including a quote from Allegheny's president (it could have taken the time to look up the new #1 before mentioning it, but we'll give them a pass on that one).

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/02/13/sports/othersports/13ncaa.html?_r=1&th&emc=th&oref=slogin

NOTE: You may have to login/create an account to read the story.  If you don't have an account, they are free.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 13, 2007, 08:36:53 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 13, 2007, 12:38:59 AMHowever, Major League isn't even close to being the worst baseball movie ever made. That would be Fear Strikes Out, the horrible biopic in which the incredibly unathletic Anthony Perkins swings and whiffs at trying to portray major-league outfielder Jimmy Piersall.

Fear Strikes Out was (and is) horrible, and disappointing, because Jimmy Piersall was my favorite player when I was a kid and he was with the Indians.  At the time, I didn't even know about his mental health issues, that only came a bit later when I read Fear Strikes Out. The movie itself was extremely poorly acted, even by the father Karl Malden. Anthony Hopkins was probably the most miscast actor ever given the Piersall role. I'm sure he had to be told which end of the bat to hold.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 13, 2007, 09:46:19 AM
thanks jsc yeah that's been a subject of discussion- i dont think they should personally because then it could get difficult with scheduling and trying to determine "well they played a D3b team insteaad of an a team.

note to those of you going to the witt game tomorrow-the women's game is at 6 and is a "code red" event meaning that they encourage students to go and since that worked so well for a premier matchup against the Bishops last Wednesday and almost drew 1000 out, who knows how many will show up for the women's game...... ;D

yes i am being sarcastic
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 13, 2007, 11:35:33 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 13, 2007, 12:42:41 AM
I've often wondered how honest people are with their opinion of the "greatest movie". Like  when someone is asked what they think the best movie ever is are they really going to say "Weekend at Bernie's"? Of course not. They throw out Citizen Kane or Casablanca because being honest with yourself and saying Wayne's World makes you look like a retard. Personally, I think the greatest movie ever is The Godfather.

I'm very honest, and very serious about it.  I devote a tremendous amount of time to my DVD collection (http://www.dvdaficionado.com/dvds.html?id=dacollinge&count=title), which now numbers well over 600 films (but does not include Weekend at Bernie's or Wayne's World, or for that matter The Godfather.)  After considerable thought, I think Fanny and Alexander is the greatest film ever made, as you can see from my top 20 list at YMDB (http://www.shompy.com/dacollinge/l29296_ukuk.html).  I have enough respect for cinema and cinephiles that I'd never denigrate someone's opinion about film, even if I don't agree with it.  I may not have liked Hoosiers, Bull Durham, or Field of Dreams, but that doesn't mean they are bad or unlikeable films, and I wouldn't ridicule someone who admits they like these films.

For me, the worst baseball movie ever is probably The Pride of the Yankees (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0035211/), despite the luminous presence of the magnificent Teresa Wright.  I've never seen any of the sequels to Major League, but I'm given to understand that they'd be contenders for the title of Worst Baseball Movie.

And A Night at the Opera is not only not the greatest film of all time, it's not even the greatest Marx Bros. film.  That honor belongs to Duck Soup (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0023969/).  Hail, Freedonia!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on February 13, 2007, 12:02:07 PM
Vegas odds of Wabash making the trip tomorrow
   Wabash comes to Springfield (-4200)
    Wabash cancels game (+5000)

If you don't know what that means.... dont bet on it
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 13, 2007, 12:06:47 PM
while Wabash may show up physically, whether they show up to play will be the question
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 13, 2007, 01:00:30 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 13, 2007, 11:35:33 AMI'm very honest, and very serious about it.

I didn't mean to imply you aren't. I just wonder if there are people out there who think some crappy movies are great and if they'd admit it.

Quote from: pennstghs on February 13, 2007, 12:06:47 PMwhile Wabash may show up physically, whether they show up to play will be the question

That has been the big question this year: which Wabash team shows up? I'm hoping the team that played against Wooster last weekend shows up. But it could just as easily be the team that played against Wooster a month ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 13, 2007, 01:01:23 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 12, 2007, 08:51:45 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 12, 2007, 04:33:09 PMQuick aside, if you're ever passing through Iowa, go to Dyersville and visit the Field of Dreams.  It's an awesome time for any fan of the movie...there's nothing quite like having a catch on that diamond.

Wally, you ought to tell them about The Ball.

I'll snap a photo of The Ball and post it.  Unfortunately it won't be today as my camera is on loan and Mother Nature is busy dumping a foot or so of snow and blowing 40 mph winds...travel is a no no today. 

Wabash getting to Springfield tomorrow could be iffy.  My guess is they'll try if only because there really isn't any time to make up the game.  It might not be a bad idea to postpone until Thursday or Friday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 13, 2007, 01:18:02 PM
Here's something I've never noticed before:

According to the NCAC website (http://www.northcoast.org/ncacintropage.html), the conference champions in basketball for the 2005-06 season were the Wooster men and Wittenberg women.  However, Wittenberg won the 2006 men's tournament, and Denison won the women's.  I was always under the impression, evidently mistaken, that the conference champion was the team that won the tournament, but it turns out that it is the regular season champion that earns the title.

I bet you all knew that all along, but I didn't.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 13, 2007, 01:57:51 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 13, 2007, 01:18:02 PM
Here's something I've never noticed before:

According to the NCAC website (http://www.northcoast.org/ncacintropage.html), the conference champions in basketball for the 2005-06 season were the Wooster men and Wittenberg women.  However, Wittenberg won the 2006 men's tournament, and Denison won the women's.  I was always under the impression, evidently mistaken, that the conference champion was the team that won the tournament, but it turns out that it is the regular season champion that earns the title.

I bet you all knew that all along, but I didn't.

Interesting you mention this. Earlier today I was looking at the hoops media guide for the D-I Southland Conference (there are local schools of interest for me, UT-San Antonio and Texas State) and they do the same thing. The official conference winner of record is the regular season champ not the tournament winner.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 13, 2007, 02:15:02 PM
I know the MIAA (which, by the way, is the nation's oldest conference, dating back to 1888) does it this way, which is something I've expressed admiration for in the past.  It's always made the most sense to me to give the title and trophy to the team that performs the best over the course of the season, but give your automatic invitation to the national tournament to the team playing the best when the tournament begins.  I just didn't realize that we did it that way too.  Silly me!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 13, 2007, 02:17:42 PM
We didn't get much snow here in Cincinnati so far but ice on top of what we did get.

The storm track went north.  I talked to my sister and Springfield is getting dumped on pretty good with both snow and ice.

The interstates are in good shape so I would like to get up there tomorrow night if they do play.  My dad says that the side streets are in none too good shape though, so the last mile or so of the trip could be the toughest for anyone coming.

Wally, are you coming to Springfield if possible?  Do you go to Wabash?  Yesterday I was quite surprised to find out that Li'l Giant lives in Texas!!!  So no more assumptions about where posters might live.

Of course, the game is on the web (video as well as audio) but I would like to see it in person.  Worse comes to worse, though, there will be a tournament game Tuesday.

My apologies to the group for distracting from the movie talk!  ;D

Go Tigers!!

TF_1973
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2007, 02:46:37 PM
I am a man and I'll admit I love movies like "Manos: The Hands of Fate" and "Red Zone Cuba". That's how I roll...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on February 13, 2007, 03:31:57 PM
Seeing that it's my namesake that's started this whole movie debate I feel like I must chime in my two cents...

I will be the first to admit that I'm no movie buff but growing up in Indiana, where high school basketball is a way of life, Hoosiers, takes the cake for greatest sports movie. This movie did a tremendous job in showing how influential the basketball was to a way of life. In reality, Indiana is home to 7 of the 10 largest high school gymnasiums in the country, most of them in smaller to mid sized towns where the entire community revolved around the local high school game, from the caravans of fans following the team bus to away games to local businesses shuting down during game time. Of course, this was back in the '50s-'60s and how the times have changed! 

If you didn't like this movie then you aren't from Indiana, plain and simple, if you're a Hoosier, you love this movie.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 13, 2007, 03:45:24 PM
TigerFan-

I'm an alum of Wabash and still live amongst the Hoosiers out here in west-central Indiana.  I'll not be making the trip out to Springfield tomorrow.  I'd like to get out and catch a Witt/Wabash game at HPER sometime, but it's just really tough to pull off midweek regardless of road conditions.  I'll be relying on the a/v streams for my hoops fix tomorrow night. 

The local meteorolgist says that there is a chance of "thundersnow" here later tonight.  I don't know what "thundersnow" is, but it sounds downright apocalyptic. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 13, 2007, 03:51:23 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 13, 2007, 03:45:24 PMThe local meteorolgist says that there is a chance of "thundersnow" here later tonight.  I don't know what "thundersnow" is, but it sounds downright apocalyptic.

Oh that's priceless... :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 13, 2007, 04:13:28 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 13, 2007, 03:45:24 PM
The local meteorolgist says that there is a chance of "thundersnow" here later tonight.  I don't know what "thundersnow" is, but it sounds downright apocalyptic. 

Sounds like a great nickname for a minor league baseball team. :D.........up north of course.

Traverse City calls themselves the BeachBums or just Bums......maybe I'll suggest Thundersnow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 13, 2007, 04:26:34 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.agent007.nu%2Fthunderball2.jpg&hash=8ac78a257bd576a1865e3fd89bfdfe4e2d0580e4)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 13, 2007, 05:51:32 PM
Allegheny's Bill Babe is the NCAC Men's Player of the Week for the week ending Feb. 11.  Babe scored 50 as the Gators went 2-0 to join the cluster of 6-8 teams.

http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt

Oberlin continues to be shut out of this category.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 13, 2007, 05:58:35 PM
QuoteTraverse City calls themselves the BeachBums or just Bums......maybe I'll suggest Thundersnow

I'll still call them the Roosters....the Richmond Roosters.

After all, (former?) Wittenberg play-by-play man Scott Leo used to call the games for AM 1490 and young Billy_Pilgrim covered many of those games for the Richmond Palladium-Item.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gotigers on February 13, 2007, 07:29:19 PM
im suprised nobody has mentioned THE NATURAL as one of the greatest sports movie. thats my #1 favorite followed closely by HOOSIERS. but really, i love all sports movies.

as far as the weather in springfield goes....hahaha its nice and sunny down here in florida. but i do wish that i could be back up there for the tournament and to see the fam. u dont realize how much you want to go back after you leave. but anywho GO WITT!!!  8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 13, 2007, 11:49:03 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 13, 2007, 01:57:51 PMInteresting you mention this. Earlier today I was looking at the hoops media guide for the D-I Southland Conference (there are local schools of interest for me, UT-San Antonio and Texas State) and they do the same thing. The official conference winner of record is the regular season champ not the tournament winner.

The CCIW does it that way as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 13, 2007, 11:59:30 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 13, 2007, 11:35:33 AMAnd A Night at the Opera is not only not the greatest film of all time, it's not even the greatest Marx Bros. film.  That honor belongs to Duck Soup (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0023969/).  Hail, Freedonia!  :)

Duck Soup is a classic, and was spared the nonsense of the romantic subplot in A Night at the Opera that Irving Thalberg insisted upon when the Brothers moved from Paramount to MGM, but the latter movie has more of their classic routines -- plus, it has the climactic "A battleship in Il Trovatore!" chaos scene that is probably the funniest five minutes ever put on celluloid. A Night at the Opera ekes out Duck Soup by a nose ... and I'd still rather slit my wrists than have to sit through Bergman's autobiographical wallow of depression ever again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 14, 2007, 07:36:34 AM
How can any legitimate conversation about the greatest sports movie ever made not include CADDYSHACK.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on February 14, 2007, 07:54:04 AM
There is an interesting article in Wooster's Daily Record. I don't know the reporter, Aaron Dorkson (maybe David does?), but he says that he has been watching Wooster basketball for the last 10 years.

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1590801 (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1590801)

He refers to the NCAC as the Big Two and Little Eight, and said "What's wrong with these other teams?" He basically calls out the other programs to step it up: "It would just be a lot more fun to see them get some better challenges from someone else in the league beside Wittenberg, and OWU on occasion. It would also serve [the Scots] better for the NCAA Tourney."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 14, 2007, 08:08:25 AM
Quote from: pufin on February 14, 2007, 07:54:04 AM
There is an interesting article in Wooster's Daily Record. I don't know the reporter, Aaron Dorkson

That name is just begging for a puerile and tasteless wisecrack.

Unfortunately, I just don't have the time this morning to think one up. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 14, 2007, 08:20:27 AM
Wittenberg has announced that the University is closed for the second straight day due to the snow (which, after years of living in Erie, represents the first time in over 10 years I've had school cancelled due to weather, and the first time ever I've been off back-to-back days for weather).  Classes are cancelled, administrative offices are closed.  However, as of now, tonight's basketball games are still on.  If I hear any other updates, I will be sure to let everyone know.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 14, 2007, 08:47:35 AM
yeah honestly i think wittenberg could have gone today on their original 2 hour delay plan, but im not complaining at all. it would have taken a good half hour to clear my car of ice.

I think the game will go on tonight as the roads should be fine by later on today. If it were to be moved to tomorrow wouldn't create any problems but i dont see them moving it to Friday as Wittenberg has an away game at Allegheny the very next day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 14, 2007, 09:29:21 AM
http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/news/2007releases/02_14.html

Both Wittenberg games tonight have been postponed due to weather.  They will now take place Thursday at the same schedule times (women at 6, men at 8 or 30 minutes after the women's game).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 14, 2007, 09:38:45 AM
can i get a mulligan on my last post?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 14, 2007, 09:44:23 AM
Denison at Earlham and Oberlin at OWU are also postponed.
I haven't seen any word on Wooster at Kenyon and Allegheny at Hiram, but I'm betting they'll also be postponed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 14, 2007, 09:54:56 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 14, 2007, 07:36:34 AM
How can any legitimate conversation about the greatest sports movie ever made not include CADDYSHACK.   ;D

Didn't there used to be a guy that posted here under the name "mitchcumstein"?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 10:35:12 AM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 14, 2007, 09:44:23 AM
Denison at Earlham and Oberlin at OWU are also postponed.
I haven't seen any word on Wooster at Kenyon and Allegheny at Hiram, but I'm betting they'll also be postponed.

Allegheny at Hiram is also postponed, rescheduled for Thursday.  Denison/Earlham is also now a Thursday game.  OWU has not announced makeup dates for their men's or women's games.

http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/news/article.xsp?id=1207
http://bishops.owu.edu/

The entire women's slate of games has been postponed with Thursday make-up dates (except Wooster at OWU.)

That just leaves Wooster at Kenyon men.  Sitting here approximately halfway between these two schools, I think I can confidently predict a postponement. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2007, 10:35:39 AM
Wabash is competitive in cycles and on up cycles has given Wooster and Witt fits, though not always losses. This group at Wabash next year may be one that gives them fits, as Zimmer, Simkus and Rooks will be seniors and the kiddie corps will have one year behind them.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 14, 2007, 11:10:04 AM
Quote from: pufin on February 14, 2007, 07:54:04 AM
There is an interesting article in Wooster's Daily Record. I don't know the reporter, Aaron Dorkson (maybe David does?), but he says that he has been watching Wooster basketball for the last 10 years.

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1590801 (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1590801)

He refers to the NCAC as the Big Two and Little Eight, and said "What's wrong with these other teams?" He basically calls out the other programs to step it up: "It would just be a lot more fun to see them get some better challenges from someone else in the league beside Wittenberg, and OWU on occasion. It would also serve [the Scots] better for the NCAA Tourney."


Next up on Dorksen's hard hitting sports-op pieces: What's wrong with the "other" eight NCAC swimming programs?  I can't wait. 

Frankly, I think the article is tripe.  Let me count the ways:

- The whole piece is a statement of the obvious.  Wooster and Witt are historically better than the rest of this conference.  What's news about this?  There's no real journalism here. 

- What knowledge does he have of athletic departments at the rest of the NCAC institutions and to what degree they emphasize men's basketball?  Apparently none. 

- The problem has been identified, but what solutions are proposed?  Dorksen's blueprint is "coaching stability and better players."  It's almost like he's chanelled John Wooden himself here.   ::)

- Speaking of coaching stability, there is coaching stability around the league outside of Wooster and Springfield.  In fact, the longest tenured coach in the NCAC is Mac Petty (a Wooster native even!) at 30+ years.  Mike DeWitt has been at OWU for 8 years.  Jeff Justus is in year 9 at Earlham.  Denison's Bob Ghiloni has been around for 5 years now. Allegheny's Rob Clune has been around for 4 years and replaced a 14-year head coach so there is not exactly a revolving door there either.   

- Dorksen proclaims that Wooster gets no competition from anybody in the league outside of Witt and occasionally Wooster.  I'm guessing Dorksen missed Saturday's game when Wooster was a 4-point play away from losing to lowly Wabash. 

Probably the thing that ticks me off the most about this high-falootin' piece of trash is the overtone that Wooster's struggle to get their hands on the Walnut & Bronze is somehow partially (maybe even mostly) the fault of the rest of the conference for not providing Wooster with enough stiff competition in the second half of the season to get the Scots tournament ready.  It can't be that Wooster just isn't a good tournament team (let's face it, they haven't been).  Nope.  It must be everybody else's fault.  Give me a break. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 11:27:30 AM
I took the Springfield News-Sun to task last week for being a rag, so I guess I should point out here that the Wooster Daily Record is also a crummy paper.  It's the kind of paper you subscribe to for the obituaries.  I don't think they employ editors, since there's frequent errors of grammar and spelling, outrageous headlines, and almost never any local editorials.  However, while the Daily Record is filled with poorly-written and poorly-reasoned junk like Dorksen's article, at least it tends to avoid the factual inaccuracies that the News-Sun seems unconcerned with.  And the Daily Record does cover COW men's basketball and football in great depth; this week alone there's been a puff piece on women's player Beth Besancon-Sidle and another on the men's coaching staff, plus this bit of homer journalism.  Maybe the News-Sun does stuff like that, too; I don't know.  I wonder if there are any other local papers that cover NCAC teams in depth, even if that depth is shallow as evidenced by Aaron Dorksen's writing.

I like where he says
Quote from: Aaron Dorksen, the Daily RecordI enjoy watching the Scots so much that I've gone on my day off many times to watch them play.

Yeah, me too.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 14, 2007, 11:29:25 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 11:27:30 AMYeah, me too.  ::)

Let's not forget Denison and Kenyon, too, DC.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2007, 11:33:35 AM
The fact that Mr. Dorksen has been at Wooster's paper for 10 years says something. I think newspapers like that have people who are basically there until the next good job. When you get to papers in large cities or large college towns (like Lafayette, IN) then people tend to stick around.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedAlum on February 14, 2007, 11:39:02 AM
DC,
You are the best!!
It is nice to see that guy takes his "day off" to watch Wooster.
Now there is a fan!!

Bummer about the cancelled games but the teams should not be on the roads in this crap.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 14, 2007, 11:39:15 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 10:35:12 AM
The entire women's slate of games has been postponed with Thursday make-up dates (except Wooster at OWU.)

That just leaves Wooster at Kenyon men.  Sitting here approximately halfway between these two schools, I think I can confidently predict a postponement. 

While not yet posted on either school's website, the NCAC website lists this game as being postponed until Thursday.  

According to the same page, ALL games scheduled for tonight will be played tomorrow (including that Wooster-OWU women's game).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 14, 2007, 11:42:48 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 11:27:30 AM
I like where he says
Quote from: Aaron Dorksen, the Daily RecordI enjoy watching the Scots so much that I've gone on my day off many times to watch them play.

Yeah, me too.  ::)
I had the same thoughts when I read that article.  And I really was amused at the part you quoted above, David.  I just thougt, how generous of you to grace Timken with your presence on your day off even?! ::)  While you won't find top notch journalism from the Daily Fish Wrap or Daily Mistake or whatever you wish to call it, I can't fault them too much because of the way that they cover the   CoW's sports program.  As David said, I doubt that there is a local fish wrap that does a better job of covering the local college than the Daily Mistake does with the CoW.

Quote from: smedindy on February 14, 2007, 11:33:35 AM
The fact that Mr. Dorksen has been at Wooster's paper for 10 years says something. I think newspapers like that have people who are basically there until the next good job. When you get to papers in large cities or large college towns (like Lafayette, IN) then people tend to stick around.
It either says he doesn't want to move on to a bigger paper or he's not good enough to warrant such a move.  He is a local boy like many of the Sports staff writers are, so that may have something to do with it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2007, 11:58:09 AM
Local boy or not...if he was good enough he'd have moved or become much higher up in the food chain there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 12:09:31 PM
Aaron's the Sports Editor for the DR.  I doubt that the New York Times--or even the Canton Suppository, er, Repository--is beating down his door with employment offers.  I've already heard offline from someone who read this article and was moved to write Dorksen a letter explaining his errors in reasoning.  I expect he's reached the pinnacle of his journalistic career.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 12:27:02 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 14, 2007, 11:39:15 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 10:35:12 AM
The entire women's slate of games has been postponed with Thursday make-up dates (except Wooster at OWU.)

That just leaves Wooster at Kenyon men.  Sitting here approximately halfway between these two schools, I think I can confidently predict a postponement. 

While not yet posted on either school's website, the NCAC website lists this game as being postponed until Thursday. 

According to the same page, ALL games scheduled for tonight will be played tomorrow (including that Wooster-OWU women's game).

Kenyon confirms:
http://athletics.kenyon.edu/index.xml

I guess I'll see everyone tomorrow, even though it's my day off!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tigerup07 on February 14, 2007, 01:44:46 PM
Sorry I missed out on the movie discussion... my vote is Major League.... GO CLEVELAND!!!

Anybody know of any broadcasting jobs at any NCAC schools or anything in Sports Information Departments or anything of the sort? It's job search time!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 14, 2007, 02:20:14 PM
I guess that proves my point that journalism is just a waste of a profession... Opps  :'( sorry Billy_Pilgrim!!   Sounds like Wooster, Ohio needs you.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 14, 2007, 02:58:48 PM
Witt is closed today and the games are postponed until tomorrow.

The storm went north and we got freezing rain in Cincinnati.  Springfield got the big snow.

I am posting this from our branch library because my house has no power.  About 9:30 last night, we heard what sounded like a shot.  The transformer on the power line had blown up.  We are the only house on our street without power.  The biggest number I heard was 129,000 without power, but it is back down to "only" 65,000 now.

The streets are pretty clear because we have a topnotch snow crew in our township and county.

Stay safe out there, everyone.

On another topic, I read the interesting article in the New York Times yesterday on Division III breaking into more divisions possibly.  I recommend it to everyone.

TF_73
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 14, 2007, 04:34:52 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 14, 2007, 02:58:48 PM
On another topic, I read the interesting article in the New York Times yesterday on Division III breaking into more divisions possibly.  I recommend it to everyone.

Since it was recommended, and probably got lost in the shuffle of the movie discussion, here it is again:

Quote from: jscwittfan on February 13, 2007, 08:17:52 AM
Interesting article in the New York Times today regarding the potential splitting up of Division III.  It's a pretty good read, including a quote from Allegheny's president (it could have taken the time to look up the new #1 before mentioning it, but we'll give them a pass on that one).

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/02/13/sports/othersports/13ncaa.html?_r=1&th&emc=th&oref=slogin

NOTE: You may have to login/create an account to read the story.  If you don't have an account, they are free.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 14, 2007, 05:14:45 PM
Interesting quote:

QuoteBut rampant growth has swelled the membership to 420, making it by far the National Collegiate Athletic Association's biggest division, with enrollments ranging from 400 to 40,000.

Which D-III school has 40,000 students? Is that right? That's like Texas A&M being D-III.

The rest of the article is just a train wreck. D-IV? III-A and III-AA? Didn't they just change the nomenclature of Division I away from the -A and -AA? That will go over well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Go Quake on February 14, 2007, 05:45:07 PM
Hello Board,

I have been reading this board occassionally for a couple years now and usually love the discussion.  With the foot of snow and ice that was dumped on the Richmond area, where i reside, I decided to go ahead and register for the board since I've acquired all this "free time".  As you can probably tell I'm an Earlham College supporter.  I go to many of the home football and basketball games.  Being a major fan of Richmond High School athletics, it has been quite an experience watching so many former Red Devils continue their athletic and academic careers at Earlham.

Well enough about me!  Good luck Earlham, Go get that #4 seed!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 14, 2007, 05:46:16 PM
Welcome, Go Quake!  Nice to have another supporter not from the Ws.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 05:47:54 PM
Welcome, Go Quake.  I hope you stick around with us after the snow melts.  And ask your friend Go Quisp to join us too!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 14, 2007, 06:30:19 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 05:47:54 PMAnd ask your friend Go Quisp to join us too!  ;)

*golf clap*

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi9.tinypic.com%2F436jyxl.jpg&hash=df2e3c495109dd348bee26dffc735e6c27455881)

I haven't had Quisp in forever.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 14, 2007, 06:51:16 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 14, 2007, 05:14:45 PM
Interesting quote:

QuoteBut rampant growth has swelled the membership to 420, making it by far the National Collegiate Athletic Association's biggest division, with enrollments ranging from 400 to 40,000.

Which D-III school has 40,000 students? Is that right? That's like Texas A&M being D-III.

The rest of the article is just a train wreck. D-IV? III-A and III-AA? Didn't they just change the nomenclature of Division I away from the -A and -AA? That will go over well.

The author was technically correct, but highly misleading.  NYU has about 17,500 FT undergraduates, but their website lists enrollment as 'over 40,000', which includes grad students, 25 international branch campuses, etc.  If there is any d3 school with even 20,000 one-campus undergrads, I can't think who it would be.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 07:07:15 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 14, 2007, 06:51:16 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 14, 2007, 05:14:45 PM
Interesting quote:

QuoteBut rampant growth has swelled the membership to 420, making it by far the National Collegiate Athletic Association's biggest division, with enrollments ranging from 400 to 40,000.

Which D-III school has 40,000 students? Is that right? That's like Texas A&M being D-III.

The rest of the article is just a train wreck. D-IV? III-A and III-AA? Didn't they just change the nomenclature of Division I away from the -A and -AA? That will go over well.

The author was technically correct, but highly misleading.  NYU has about 17,500 FT undergraduates, but their website lists enrollment as 'over 40,000', which includes grad students, 25 international branch campuses, etc.  If there is any d3 school with even 20,000 one-campus undergrads, I can't think who it would be.

Chuck, how many times have you had to answer that particular question?  I think I've seen three or four of them.

LG, I'm surprised you're old enough to remember Quisp and Quake.  I figured I'd have to wait for Sager to get to work tonight to get a response.
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ftvacres.com%2Fimages%2Fquake_box1.jpg&hash=060c360b9d6f3cde969db841017c24f62e7fb2b4)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on February 14, 2007, 07:23:10 PM
Late as usual, but has anyone out there seen "The Natural?"
DC-a noir sports movie with a slightly sappy ending---the home run off the ball boy's home-made bat?   
Of course much of it was shot in Western New York/Buffalo, so I may be biased....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 07:36:37 PM
Yes, I have seen The Natural, and I like it.  It's sort of a guilty pleasure; none of my cineaste friends can tolerate it.  The book (http://www.amazon.com/Natural-Bernard-Malamud/dp/0374502005/sr=8-1/qid=1171499590/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1/002-3441653-8901668?ie=UTF8&s=books) is better, but I enjoy the movie.

The baseball movie that I'm somewhat surprised has escaped mention is Bang the Drum Slowly (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0069765/), which IIRC is sort of Brian's Song meets Of Mice and Men.  Good film.

Pitchers and catchers report to Winter Haven in about 12 hours, ready to begin the first championship season for Cleveland since the 1964 Browns.  :) ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 07:48:46 PM
http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/2007/02/14/ncaa-regional-rankings-week-2/

Wooster slips to #3 in the regional rankings, and Wittenberg dips to #4, all to make room for our old friends from University Heights.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2007, 07:53:00 PM
Hunter has a boatload of students as well, if I recall. Over 20,000 grads and undergrads.

Mmmm...Quisp and Quake. Can I have some King Vitamin, too?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 14, 2007, 08:08:02 PM
Not really a surprise to see the Blue Streaks jump to the #2 spot in the GL Region given JCU's QoWI is higher than anyone else in the region except LE even despite all of the losses.  As it looks right now, whomever wins out among JCU, Wooster, Wittenberg or Hope should have the inside track at hosting the sectional.  John Carroll probably has the most difficult shot at accomplishing the feat as they have to travel to arch-rival Baldwin-Wallace for their season finale this Saturday.  And then they have the joy of playing in what looks to be a very unpredictable OAC Tournament where any # of teams could realistically come out on top once all the dust settles. 

Wooster, Witt and Hope really arguably only have one tough game remaining.  That would be in the championship games of their respective conferences.  Of course I'm referring to the rubber matches of Hope v. Calvin and Wooster v. Wittenberg should they all happen to advance that far to set up the anticipated rematches. 

Even if LE runs the table from here on out, they would be ineligible to host a Sectoinal due to the smallness of their gym which is why I didn't include them in the discussion. 

One last thought concerning the GL Regional rankings and that is when is Capital going to get any respect??  They are currently tied for 1st with JCU in the OAC and yet ONU is still ranked in the region and Cap is nowhere to be found?!  And this is coming off the heels of Cap just beating ONU last weekend!   ::) ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 14, 2007, 08:08:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 07:07:15 PMLG, I'm surprised you're old enough to remember Quisp and Quake.  I figured I'd have to wait for Sager to get to work tonight to get a response.


You can order it online!

www.quisp.com (http://www.quisp.com)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 14, 2007, 08:11:42 PM
Well I, for one, AM surprised to see JCU above Woo and Witt in the region.  I think they are putting way too much weight on a fairly modest QOWI difference - not nearly a large enough gap to overcome 2 or 3 more in-region losses, IMO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 14, 2007, 08:25:29 PM
Ypsi - I have to agree with you.  From the perspective of balmy Memphis, TN (current temp 27 degrees with zero precip), it is difficult to move JCU in front of both WOOSTER and WITTENBERG.

Granted both in region of SCOTS loses were at home but both team are in top 6 in the regional rankings and non-NCAA schedule was as tough as you'll find in DIII.  I know that it is unfair comparison but JCU does not crack the most respected D3Hoops Top 25.  Loses include @ Wilmington, @H'berg and @ Capital.  Those are not teams that are threatening to crack the regional or top 25 rankings.  even the out of region loss to Greensboro is not impressive. 

JCU does have some tough good wins in topsy turvy OAC but the losses are not good and statistically they have the worst defense in the OAC (most points allowed and 74.7 ppg).

I am not sure how much of this will play into seeding and hosting.  We have more basketball to play with conference tourney's as SF has already mentioned so I guess we'll have to just see how this plays out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ChicagoHopeNut on February 14, 2007, 08:29:44 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 14, 2007, 08:11:42 PM
Well I, for one, AM surprised to see JCU above Woo and Witt in the region.  I think they are putting way too much weight on a fairly modest QOWI difference - not nearly a large enough gap to overcome 2 or 3 more in-region losses, IMO.

I was shocked by JCU's jump up the regional rankings. As a Hope fan I am frustrated by being jumped despite 2 few losses but at least Hope lost last week so there is some logic behind it. If I were at Witt or Wooster fan I'd be completely frustrated by being jumped in the rankings this weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 14, 2007, 08:33:42 PM
Finals:


Wooster 82  Kenyon 52
Oberlin  56  OWU   71
Wabash 57 Wittenberg 76
Allegheny 73 Hiram 58
Denison 51 Earlham 63


Okay that is my mock picks... I feel all alone on Valentine's Day with no up-dated scores on this lonely NCAC Wednesday night!

P.S Welcome GO Quake... glad to see another EC fan on this board... I was going to make the trip to Richmond to see Senior night "tonight" but due to the game being played tomorrow I will not be able to attend.  2-time senior M. Jewett Richmond Native will be one of three Seniors honored tomorrow.  (Fingers are crossed M.J. can put up the numbers on senior night that I once did... oh the good old days!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 14, 2007, 08:45:57 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 14, 2007, 08:33:42 PM
Wabash 57 Wittenberg 76

Well, I hope you got no Valentines today.  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 14, 2007, 08:49:58 PM
Almost... but once again my mom came through in the clutch, with a lovely Long-T with Indianapolis Colts Super Bowl Champs on the front, and the 53 man roster on that back!!   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 14, 2007, 09:03:33 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on February 14, 2007, 08:25:29 PM
Granted both in region of SCOTS loses were at home but both team are in top 6 in the regional rankings and non-NCAA schedule was as tough as you'll find in DIII.  I know that it is unfair comparison but JCU does not crack the most respected D3Hoops Top 25.  Loses include @ Wilmington, @H'berg and @ Capital.  Those are not teams that are threatening to crack the regional or top 25 rankings.  even the out of region loss to Greensboro is not impressive. 

WoosterFAN, I generally agree with you that John Carroll's move up the regional rankings is remarkable.  However, it is worth noting that Wooster's non-D3 schedule, regardless of how strong or weak it was, has absolutely not one iota of bearing upon NCAA regional rankings, or upon tournament selection.  In fact, it won't ever be under consideration- to the NCAA's eyes, such games never occurred.  So, while you can argue that the Scots should be getting better respect than JCU in the national poll (which they are), and you can argue that a better regional winning percentage should put the Scots above the Blue Streaks, you can't argue that the Scots' non-D-III and non-regional games should place them higher in the regional rankings.

In JCU and Capital's defense, they have each beaten Ohio Northern twice this year.  Neither Wooster nor Wittenberg has done that once.  I saw Capital last weekend; on a neutral floor, I'd take Wooster (quicker guards, more scoring threats), but I wouldn't be surprised if Capital won.  Capital is 0-2 against the top of the NCAC, losing to Ohio Wesleyan by 10 and to Wittenberg by 5 in double OT.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 14, 2007, 09:19:14 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 14, 2007, 08:11:42 PM
Well I, for one, AM surprised to see JCU above Woo and Witt in the region.  I think they are putting way too much weight on a fairly modest QOWI difference - not nearly a large enough gap to overcome 2 or 3 more in-region losses, IMO.

.4 is NOT fairly modest. .4 multiplied by a 25-game season means five games against a team at the next stratum up in record.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 14, 2007, 11:11:49 PM
scotsbrod you CAN'T use that fact against Wittenberg that they lost to Ohio Northern and Capital beat them because Wittenberg  BEAT Capital earlier in the year right before Christmas in 2OT.......Of course before that didnt i say that game might be hard to gauge because we didnt know if capital was any good but now that we look at that game we can say that Wittenberg should gain from that win....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 14, 2007, 11:35:42 PM
Another point of interest in the regional rankings;

Penn State - Behrend defeats Lake Erie @ LEC 66-60 in OT

hummm??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 15, 2007, 12:01:32 AM
and no that isnt just the wind blowing snow drifts outside-its the lake erie chances of hosting gone out the window i believe....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 15, 2007, 12:22:36 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 14, 2007, 11:11:49 PM
scotsbrod you CAN'T use that fact against Wittenberg that they lost to Ohio Northern and Capital beat them because Wittenberg  BEAT Capital earlier in the year right before Christmas in 2OT.......Of course before that didnt i say that game might be hard to gauge because we didnt know if capital was any good but now that we look at that game we can say that Wittenberg should gain from that win....

I'm well aware that Wittenberg beat Capital on the road in 2 overtimes.  I mentioned as much in my post.  Wittenberg does gain from that win, earning (currently) 15 QoWI points for it.  It's part of why Witt's QoWI is better than Wooster's, even though Wit has another loss.  I'm not trying to use Witt or Woo's loss to ONU against either of them; I was trying to point out that JCU and Capital can give teams like Wooster and Wittenberg everything they can handle.  The closest direct observations of that are Wittenberg's 2 OT victory (hardly a blowout) and Cap's loss to OWU.  The next closest I thought of were ONU's wins over Woo and Witt along with both Capital and JCU sweeping ONU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 15, 2007, 12:32:49 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 15, 2007, 12:01:32 AM
and no that isnt just the wind blowing snow drifts outside-its the lake erie chances of hosting gone out the window i believe....

Didn't we cover this?  Lake Erie isn't eligible to host a sectional round of the NCAA tournament because they don't have adequate arena seating.  Check page 7 (http://www.ncaa.org/library/handbooks/basketball/2007/2007_d3_m_basketball_handbook.pdf).

1-loss (regionally) LEC probably gets a home game in the first or second round. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2007, 12:54:13 AM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 14, 2007, 09:03:33 PM
In JCU and Capital's defense, they have each beaten Ohio Northern twice this year.  Neither Wooster nor Wittenberg has done that once. 

We tend to focus on regional win % and QoWI score when thinking about regional rankings and seedings, but those are only two of the five primary criteria the regional committee uses for ranking and seeding.  The other three are head-to-head results, results vs. common regional opponents, and in-region results vs. ranked teams.  Neither Wooster nor Witt has played JCU, so you can chuck that one for now.  But the other two break in favor of JCU vs. the NCAC powers because of what scotsbrod pointed out, which I have quoted above.

So JCU has the better QoWI, has better results than the W's against the common regional opponent Ohio Northern, and has two in-region wins over a ranked opponent (ONU) that are losses for Woo and Witt.  That's an advantage in three of the four applicable primary criteria.  Taking this into account, I am not surprised to see JCU ahead of Wooster and Wittenberg.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 15, 2007, 01:18:15 AM
billy- i guess a penn state branch had to do the dirty work and knock off lake erie haha-hey they almost b eat the buckeyes
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 15, 2007, 02:38:52 AM
5. Hope 12-3 in-region

So I take it that the magic ferry running across Lake Michigan in the dead of winter still exists for Hope/Carthage to be an in-region game?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 15, 2007, 10:10:13 AM
Quotebilly- i guess a penn state branch had to do the dirty work and knock off lake erie haha-hey they almost b eat the buckeyes

Maybe Behrend has a couple of good, young players who could transfer over to University Park for their final two seasons. Aside from the lack of talent, quickness and size that has hindered the Penn State-University Park team over the course of the last six years, they also have lacked depth.

As for the Quakers, it's Senior Night for a couple of 1,000 point scorers, LaRon Henry, and Billy_Pilgrim's former roommate, Markous Jewett. I feel bad I'm missing this one, but I am really hoping they can win the next two, earn the first round home game, and then I can make the trip to Richmond to see them play one last time.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 15, 2007, 10:50:20 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 14, 2007, 09:19:14 PM
.4 is NOT fairly modest. .4 multiplied by a 25-game season means five games against a team at the next stratum up in record.

Quote from: David Collinge on February 15, 2007, 12:54:13 AM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 14, 2007, 09:03:33 PM
In JCU and Capital's defense, they have each beaten Ohio Northern twice this year.  Neither Wooster nor Wittenberg has done that once. 
We tend to focus on regional win % and QoWI score when thinking about regional rankings and seedings, but those are only two of the five primary criteria the regional committee uses for ranking and seeding.  The other three are head-to-head results, results vs. common regional opponents, and in-region results vs. ranked teams.  Neither Wooster nor Witt has played JCU, so you can chuck that one for now.  But the other two break in favor of JCU vs. the NCAC powers because of what scotsbrod pointed out, which I have quoted above.

So JCU has the better QoWI, has better results than the W's against the common regional opponent Ohio Northern, and has two in-region wins over a ranked opponent (ONU) that are losses for Woo and Witt.  That's an advantage in three of the four applicable primary criteria.  Taking this into account, I am not surprised to see JCU ahead of Wooster and Wittenberg.

This is what I was talking about when I made my post about not being surprised by JCU's jump.  Do they have more 'in-region' losses and a lower win percentage than the W's?  Yes.  BUT, they also have more WINS than the W's over teams in the upper stratum of the criteria for figuring QoWI.

Besides, it's still too early to start panincking for the W's.  Whomever takes care of business among Witt and Woo will have an excellent shot at hosting.  But, if JCU does the improbable and runs the table winning the OAC regular season and tournament titles, I would have to say they deserve at least strong consideration to host. 

As far as Wooster is concerned, all they can do is worry about themselves.  Another loss and their hopes of hosting are gone.  Same goes for Wittenberg.  Which is why it would be nice for the W's to oblige and win out to set up their rubber match in the NCAC tournament finals for what could be a winner take all game like last year where the winner gets to host and the loser hits the road.  If you thought the atmosphere was electric at Timken back on the 3rd of February, imagine what it will be like in a week and a half if that scenario plays itself out!!! 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 15, 2007, 10:58:03 AM
yeah Scotsfan i will actually be able to go to this game because i remembered to ask off work. That game could be as electric as the 1 vs 2 matchup at Witt last year but especially of what could be on the line. That said Witt has 4 important games before then with Wabash, Allegheny, who knows, probably OWU and then Wooster. Who knows what could happen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ChicagoHopeNut on February 15, 2007, 11:08:25 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 15, 2007, 10:50:20 AM

This is what I was talking about when I made my post about not being surprised by JCU's jump.  Do they have more 'in-region' losses and a lower win percentage than the W's?  Yes.  BUT, they also have more WINS than the W's over teams in the upper stratum of the criteria for figuring QoWI.


I agree that there is no reason for the W's to panic at this point. And the more I read about QoWI the more I understand JCU's jump. But in addition to JCU's wins against some upper stratum teams they have losses to Heidelberg and Wilmington, not exactly upper strata, although they are both above .500.  That said I just think too much reliance is placed on QoWI in determining regional rankings but as long as the W's keep winning they are in so it shouldn't matter.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 15, 2007, 11:39:19 AM
Is the weather situation better today? I'm looking out my office window and seeing a bright sunny day with an expected high in the upper 40s. What's it like up there?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 15, 2007, 11:51:04 AM
Cold and clear in the Heartland today LG.  I'd expect that teams can travel today. 

Nice with the Augie Garrido quote, btw.  Augie rules. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 15, 2007, 11:56:47 AM
Same here in Springfield - cold, but nothing new falling.  However, the wind is whipping stuff around pretty good.  As far as people coming to the games tonight, be careful - there will hardly be ANY parking because of how the plows leave the snow on the road, and many of the sidewalks around campus are still covered in snow and ice (I guess only a select few get the privilege of being cleaned).  So, all-in-all, if coming tonight, be careful.

Also, this just in:

Anybody in Springfield/Clark County planning on tuning into WUSO 89.1 FM for tonight's games will be out of luck - at least on the radio side.

I just talked to WUSO's General Manager, and he told me that the station's transmitter is stored in such a "poorly-constructed building" on the top of one of our dorms, that the snow leaked through and did some serious damage.  Therefore, there is nothing being sent across WUSO right now (or probably for the next few days/weeks) until they can get things fixed.

Thankfully, that transmitter has nothing to do with WUSO's internet feed, so anybody hoping to listen to the games tonight (and watch the men's game) will have to do so strictly on the internet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 15, 2007, 12:08:49 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 15, 2007, 12:54:13 AM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 14, 2007, 09:03:33 PM
In JCU and Capital's defense, they have each beaten Ohio Northern twice this year.  Neither Wooster nor Wittenberg has done that once. 

We tend to focus on regional win % and QoWI score when thinking about regional rankings and seedings, but those are only two of the five primary criteria the regional committee uses for ranking and seeding.  The other three are head-to-head results, results vs. common regional opponents, and in-region results vs. ranked teams.  Neither Wooster nor Witt has played JCU, so you can chuck that one for now.  But the other two break in favor of JCU vs. the NCAC powers because of what scotsbrod pointed out, which I have quoted above.

So JCU has the better QoWI, has better results than the W's against the common regional opponent Ohio Northern, and has two in-region wins over a ranked opponent (ONU) that are losses for Woo and Witt.  That's an advantage in three of the four applicable primary criteria.  Taking this into account, I am not surprised to see JCU ahead of Wooster and Wittenberg.

David,

Your point regarding the other primary criteria is quite correct, but there is still one mystery: JCU's wins over (and the Ws losses to) ONU all occurred before the FIRST regional rankings.  Why JCU's sudden jump in week two?

If the committee is that sloppy in finally noticing things (and still has Hope's in-region record wrong - they're 12-2, not 12-3), it does not give one a great deal of confidence in pool C selection or game seedings!

Edit: I just realized that one (partial) explanation is that the criterion regarding record against regionally-ranked teams would not apply to the first week, since no one is yet ranked!  But if that is the ONLY reason JCU jumped the Ws, they are either giving that criterion undue influence or the three teams are SO close they could be regarded as 2a, 2b, and 2c rather than 2, 3,  and 4.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2007, 12:09:58 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 15, 2007, 10:10:13 AM
[ I feel bad I'm missing this one, but I am really hoping they can win the next two, earn the first round home game, and then I can make the trip to Richmond to see them play one last time.


Come on Billy_ hope is for the weak... but I have to say i'm hoping the same!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2007, 12:16:28 PM
I did this once before; maybe it's time for an update.

Recalling that QoWI has three components--win (8 points) or lose (0), road/neutral game (1 point) or home (0), and opponent's in-region win % (6, 4, 2 or 0 points)--a significant portion of a team's QoWI is tied into who they have played, win or lose.  Here's who the ranked teams have played, by QoWI echelon:

Tier 1: win % .667 and above (6 points)
Tier 2: win % .500 and above (4 points)
Tier 3: win % .333 and above (2 points)
Tier 4: win % below .333 (0 points)


      Team            Tier 1            Tier 2            Tier 3            Tier 4      
   LEC      3      4      7      5   
   JCU      6      8      4      2   
   Wooster      3      4      4      6   
   Witt      4      5      3      6   
   Hope      1      9      0      6   
   ONU      8      6      2      2   
This table includes Hope's game against Carthage, a Tier 2 game, only because the NCAA seems to still be counting it as in-region.

Note that from a QoWI perspective, LEC has played a tougher schedule than Wooster. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2007, 12:26:02 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 15, 2007, 12:08:49 PM
David,

Your point regarding the other primary criteria is quite correct, but there is still one mystery: JCU's wins over (and the Ws losses to) ONU all occurred before the FIRST regional rankings.  Why JCU's sudden jump in week two?

If the committee is that sloppy in finally noticing things (and still has Hope's in-region record wrong - they're 12-2, not 12-3), it does not give one a great deal of confidence in pool C selection or game seedings!

Edit: I just realized that one (partial) explanation is that the criterion regarding record against regionally-ranked teams would not apply to the first week, since no one is yet ranked!  But if that is the ONLY reason JCU jumped the Ws, they are either giving that criterion undue influence or the three teams are SO close they could be regarded as 2a, 2b, and 2c rather than 2, 3,  and 4.

First, the primary criteria (and secondary criteria, for that matter) don't include "where they were in last week's poll," so JCU's week 1 ranking is irrelevant.  If the committee starts from scratch each week, I think that's good.

Second, I don't know how close the tally was last week, but maybe it was quite close.  I'm guessing that JCU's QoWI took a significant jump this week, since both B-W and Capital moved from tier 2 to tier 1; that alone added 8 points to JCU's QoWI.  They also added a 12-point win over Heidelberg, and when combined with a 9-pointer at Marietta gives them a 10.5 week without considering tier changes.

Third, since when do you have any confidence in pool C selections or game seedings, anyway?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 15, 2007, 02:20:48 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 15, 2007, 12:16:28 PM
Note that from a QoWI perspective, LEC has played a tougher schedule than Wooster. 

Yet, if you gave Wooster LEC's schedule and LEC Wooster's schedule.........I'd put big money down that Wooster would have a far better record than LEC would have.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 15, 2007, 04:54:51 PM
I'm kinda lost in all this Quality of Wins Index stuff.

It appears that higher is better.

So, how come Lake Erie can't get enough votes to be higher than 26th? 

As a side question, did Lake Erie used to be a community college?  I never heard of them until lately.

I hope the teams all get their games in tonight, assuming that it is safe to do so.

Go Tigers!  I'll be watching the video from wittenberg.edu.  Now that our electric is back on, it's nice and toasty in here.  Gas heat is great but it seems to require electricity!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2007, 05:04:03 PM
Here's what the D3Hoops.com FAQ has to say about QoWI. (http://www.d3hoops.com/faq.php?question=35)

Yes, higher is better.

It is unrelated to the D3Hoops.com Top 25.  The biggest difference is that QoWI (and the NCAA regional rankings) only take in-region games under consideration, while the Top 25 looks at the entire schedule.

Lake Erie was for many, many years a women's seminary.  They merged with a men's college and became co-ed sometime in the 1980s.  http://www.lec.edu/cover/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2007, 07:57:33 PM
On the WQKT pregame radio show tonight, they indicated that Tim Vandervaart will have an x-ray tomorrow on his wrist.  If the results are good, Vandervaart will have his cast removed and replaced with a splint.

This would increase the likelihood that Vandervaart can play with a splint during the NCAC Tourney next week.  Good luck to Tim in getting back on the court in the near future!  :)   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2007, 08:05:11 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 54  Kenyon 29

This game is essentially over at halftime. :)  Kenyon jumped out to a 7-2 early lead but Wooster responded with a 29-4 run to take complete control of this game.

Wooster is being led by Tom Port with 16 points (4 three pointers), James Cooper with 9 points and Brandon Johnson with 9 points.

The Lords are being led by Bryan Yelvington with 11 points and Korey Haddox with 10 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2007, 08:10:12 PM
Update out of Richmond, Indiana
I have a feeling a lot of teams are pulling for the Big ReD

30  Earlham
30  Denison


half-time  I'm sure it's better then the Team-line and the students that are doing the broadcast for $6.45 a hour
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 15, 2007, 08:11:14 PM
Wabash/Witt is getting set to tip.  Kudos to Witt for putting together a really good quality video stream.  Why every school isn't doing this is beyond me (cough, Wabash, cough). 

I'll update this post with pertinent updates as things go along here....Go Wabash!

And yes, Go Denison.  :)

Your first update from Springfield....Artie is wearing a garish pink suit tonight.  Nice.

16:00 to go in the first, score is tied 8-8.  Wabash has not trailed to this point.   

And just as I post that, Bowen hits his third triple of the game.  That can't be good.  We're at 11-10 Witt right now. 

Midway through the first half, 21-18 in favor of Witt.  Not sure how we got there as my stream took a few minutes off. 

Witt's on a 9-0 run on the heels of a busted play that should have resulted in a layup to tie for Wabash.  Witt is up 35-24 late in the first half.

Halftime score : Witt 39, Wabash 26.  Wabash really went flat over the last 5 minutes or so here...it's a shame because the first 15 minutes of this game were really good.  Hopefully we can get a full 20 minutes from Wabash in the second half.

14:25 left in the game....Witt is slowly extending the lead after Wabash made a mini run.  Borchers is starting to get going...53-37 in favor of Witt.

Wabash has fallen in love with the 3 point shot...the problem is that the 3 point shot just wants to be friends.  LGs need to get back to working the ball into the painted area (had to channel Hubie Brown there).  7 minutes to go, Witt is up 64-49.

Final from the HPER: Witt 82, Wabash 59.  Too much strength down low and not enough help for Zimmer for Wabash tonight.  Senior day vs. Kenyon is Saturday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 15, 2007, 08:11:55 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 15, 2007, 05:04:03 PM
Here's what the D3Hoops.com FAQ has to say about QoWI. (http://www.d3hoops.com/faq.php?question=35)

Yes, higher is better.

It is unrelated to the D3Hoops.com Top 25.  The biggest difference is that QoWI (and the NCAA regional rankings) only take in-region games under consideration, while the Top 25 looks at the entire schedule.

Lake Erie was for many, many years a women's seminary.  They merged with a men's college and became co-ed sometime in the 1980s.  http://www.lec.edu/cover/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2007, 08:16:56 PM
That's strong, Artie!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 15, 2007, 08:38:55 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 15, 2007, 08:16:56 PM
That's strong, Artie!

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi9.tinypic.com%2F47j7qf9.png&hash=742dacea832887845510624366b3bc73202093e2)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 15, 2007, 08:43:45 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 15, 2007, 08:11:14 PM
Your first update from Springfield....Artie is wearing a garish pink suit tonight.  Nice.

Might be my new favorite suit - it was sweet to see in person.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2007, 08:44:56 PM

Earlham-    49
Denison-   49

6:30   

Wooster has to win on Tuesday first before they get to Host the NCAC tourney.... Okay nevermind I think after the article I read the other day... Wooster will host!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2007, 08:50:51 PM
Final:  Wooster 87  Kenyon 62

Wooster clinches at least a tie for the NCAC regular season title as they move to 14-1 NCAC, 21-3 overall. :) ;D

Wooster was led tonight by Tom Port with 22 points, Devin Fulk with 15 points (5 three pointers), Brandon Johnson with 14 points and James Cooper with 13 points.  Wooster has now won 27 straight games vs. the Lords.

Korey Haddox and Bryan Yelvington were the leading scorers in this game for the Kenyon Lords.

Wooster needs to take care of business on Saturday vs. Ohio Wesleyan so the Scots can host the NCAC tourney.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2007, 09:00:13 PM
Earlham's big man Nick Welsh Fouls out with 5 minutes to go... Coach J with a (T)


EC  55
Den. 56

T. Gregory is on a one man recking crew... and 1. 58-56

2 minutes left!
Henry for 3 no good!
58-59 Denison
Gregory with another and 1... Free throw is good
61-59
Dan H. gets it in the post...it's up it's Good!
61-61  Big Red Time out... under 1 minute to play in reg.
Gregory takes it to the hole and is fouled
1st one is up and good, 2nd free throw is good... 23 for T. Gregory.

Earlham up 2 with 27 seconds left... i wonder who they will go to!

Classic Earlham.. annoucer says how he is going to be late to study table... they are happy Dan Hods. is a 2 point shooter!!

Big Red with another Timeout 19 seconds left.

Another Time out by BiG Red 4.0 left. WoW I don't have a clue... what happened... but EC is going into O.T.


EC-67
DC- 68 

2:56 to go.. EC ball 

Not good... 1:17 Ec 67-71
 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2007, 09:27:36 PM
29 seconds left... Jewett shooting free-throws down 4
WoW missed BOTH!!! Denison's ball... asdljgdlgjasg;jwe glksd opj kl;ajs  ogjdkl jodgjaslogjs


72-70   Gregory with another 3... big red's ball with 16 seconds left.  Gregory they fouled a 13-13 ft on the season.. make that 14-14
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 15, 2007, 09:30:30 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 15, 2007, 09:27:36 PMasdljgdlgjasg;jwe glksd opj kl;ajs  ogjdkl jodgjaslogjs

I didn't know the Quakers did "tongues".  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2007, 09:33:47 PM
Missed the 2nd FT... 73-70 Earlham with the rebound.. 10 seconds... Gregory for 3......................................
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2007, 09:34:17 PM
MISSED

Izzo missed the first Ft.. hit the 2nd...
Jewett for a meaningless 3.. it's good

final

Denison 74
EC   73
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2007, 09:37:09 PM
Regional Final Score of Note:

Baldwin-Wallace 81  John Carroll 77

B-W gets the home win on Senior Night as Senior All American Forward Tori Davis leads the Yellow Jackets with 32 points, 10 boards.

This result will help Wooster and Wittenberg in the NCAA Regional Rankings. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 15, 2007, 09:38:06 PM
Tough result for Wabash after a really solid start to this game.  Big snaps to Witt's video stream....very smooth, very clear, very cool stuff.  It can't be stated enough that everybody in the conference needs to be doing this. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 15, 2007, 09:43:48 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 15, 2007, 09:38:06 PMBig snaps to Witt's video stream....very smooth, very clear, very cool stuff.  It can't be stated enough that everybody in the conference needs to be doing this.

No doubt. I think it's great, and hey Wabash: I'd even pay for access to it.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2007, 10:03:01 PM
Final Score:  Allegheny 79  Hiram 66

Allegheny gets the big road win and moves into sole possession of 4th place at 7-8.  George Raftis led the Gators with 21 points on 10-12 from the floor.  Allegheny as a team shot 51% FG vs. ~40% for Hiram.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2007, 10:29:18 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2007, 09:37:09 PM
Regional Final Score of Note:

Baldwin-Wallace 81  John Carroll 77

B-W gets the home win on Senior Night as Senior All American Forward Tori Davis leads the Yellow Jackets with 32 points, 10 boards.

This result will help Wooster and Wittenberg in the NCAA Regional Rankings. :)

It'll certainly help in the "in-region win % category," where JCU wasn't all that strong to begin with.

But just a reminder to everyone on the vagaries of our beloved QoWI:
JCU loses at B-WC: 7 pts
Witt beats Wabash at home: 8 pts
Not a lot of help there for the Tigers, maybe .06 QoWI points on average.  :-\

(Wooster gets 11 for winning at Kenyon, so they definitely benefit, by about .25 QoWI pts on average.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2007, 10:36:53 PM
All the 2/15 NCAC Final Scores:

Ohio Wesleyan 96  Oberlin 59
Allegheny 79  Hiram 66
Denison 74  Earlham 73
Wittenberg 82  Wabash 59
Wooster 87  Kenyon 62
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2007, 10:40:44 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 2/15 results:

Wooster 14-1 (21-3)
Wittenberg 13-2 (21-3)
Ohio Wesleyan 10-5 (16-8)
Allegheny 7-8 (11-12)
Kenyon 6-9 (10-14)
Wabash 6-9 (9-15)
Earlham 6-9 (8-16)
Hiram 6-9 (7-17)
Denison 4-11 (5-18)
Oberlin 3-12 (4-20)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2007, 10:52:02 PM
Tonight's Wooster victory drops Kenyon to 6-5 at home this season.  The Lords' prior four losses at Tomsich Arena (to Grove City, DePauw, Wittenberg, and Wabash) were by an aggregate of 18 points, and one of those went to overtime (Witt.)  Wooster beat them by 25, and it could easily have been worse.  It's only the second time this season that the Lords have lost by more than 10 points.  The other time was when they lost by 35...at Wooster.

It's not just Kenyon.  Hiram's worst loss: 111-57 at home vs. Wooster.  Wabash's worst loss: 96-52 at Wooster.  Denison's worst loss: 96-67 at Wooster.  Cabrini? 128-71 at Wooster.  Mt. Union? 85-60 at Wooster.  There may be others, but you get the point.  Sure, these are not good teams (no offense intended), but it's not like Wooster is the only good team they've played (well, it's the only good team Cabrini played ::).)

It's just too bad they don't give out trophies to the team that causes the most "worst-losses" for other teams.   :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 15, 2007, 11:36:06 PM

                                       FG's    3pts    Ft's    Reb     Tp    t.o       Mins.
Den.   Dan Hodgkinson...... * 10-16   0-1    8-13    8        28     2        35


E.C.   Tristian Gregory.... *  9-20   2-7    8-8     4          28    2         41


Players of the Game for both teams... Scholarship money will be donated to each colleges...okay maybe not.

Billy_Pilgrim and to anyone else that might care... I truely do not know how to put this into words.  Senior Guard LaRon Henry is 12-61 from the field in his last 6 games.  By the way that is 19% shooting and has 2 more Fg's then Turnovers during that stretch.   I'm talking about a guy that last year was 158-299  .53% from the field and   37-74   .50% from 3 pointers.  Earlham doesn't have much Depth and EC needs Jewett, Gregory, and HENRY to show up each and every night...

Well Billy_ if we finish 7th we can make the trip to Wittenberg... only if a Witt. Posters will pay for our meal at Rosies and... gzz I can't remember the name of the place for the life of me!


12-61
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2007, 11:55:50 PM
earlhamalum -- I am not sure that you will be going to Springfield? ;)

Given the Saturday schedule of NCAC games, #4 thru #8 could easily look like this after the Saturday game results:

Allegheny 7-9 (home loss to Witt?)
Earlham 7-9 (win at Oberlin?)
Wabash 7-9 (home win vs. Kenyon?)
Kenyon 6-10 (loss at Wabash?)
Hiram 6-10 (loss at Denison?)

Since I can't remember all the tiebreakers, I am not sure how the seeds would be determined for the NCAC tourney with this scenario?  :-\

Any other insights on tiebreakers or scenarios?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2007, 12:03:33 AM
Here's a Saturday suggestion for those of you (posters and lurkers) who live in north central Ohio.  Here's what's going on in the Kenyon Athletic Center on Saturday:

10am: Swiming and Diving (both genders)--Kenyon College Invitational
11am: Men's Tennis--Kenyon vs. Walsh
12pm: Track and Field (both genders)--Greater Columbus Championship events
2pm: Women's Basketball--Kenyon vs. Hiram

You all know about the men's and women's swimming and diving teams at Kenyon, but did you know that the men's tennis team is ranked #24 nationally?  And the women's basketball team is playing for the #4 seed in the upcoming NCAC tournament.

Those of you who have been inside the KAC know that these events will take place literally within a few steps of each other (although I suspect the tennis will be complete before the hoops start.)  It's a real lollapalooza of D3 sports in one building in one afternoon (and you can still make the tip for OWU/Wooster men's hoops at 7:30.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2007, 12:08:43 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2007, 11:55:50 PM
earlhamalum -- I am not sure that you will be going to Springfield? ;)

Given the Saturday schedule of NCAC games, #4 thru #8 could easily look like this after the Saturday game results:

Allegheny 7-9 (home loss to Witt?)
Earlham 7-9 (win at Oberlin?)
Wabash 7-9 (home win vs. Kenyon?)
Kenyon 6-10 (loss at Wabash?)
Hiram 6-10 (loss at Denison?)

Since I can't remember all the tiebreakers, I am not sure how the seeds would be determined for the NCAC tourney with this scenario?  :-\

Any other insights on tiebreakers or scenarios?

I think a tie between Allegheny, Earlham, and Wabash breaks this way on head-to-head results:
Earlham 2-1
Allegheny 1-1
Wabash 1-2

Kenyon swept Hiram, so they own that tiebreaker.

So your scenario has 'Gheny at Earlham, Wabash at OWU, Kenyon at #2 seed (probably Witt), and Hiram at #1 seed (probably Woo.)

If Witt wins Sat. and Woo loses to OWU, I think we have that "choose top seed or host school" business between them. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 16, 2007, 12:12:00 AM
Thanks DC!  So, earhamalum might even get to stay home.  :) ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 16, 2007, 12:28:06 AM
Please Please Richmond is 1 hour East of my Home... home is lovely INDIANAPOLIS, Richmond was just my second home for four years.  (love it when you can use two words with two different spellings Back to Back) 

Earlham/Chatard High School;   I'll take a birthday present a day early with a win at Oberlin, and maybe the Freshman Bishop Chatard H.S. Freshman Team that I coach can win the City Tourney in the same day!!!   With all the Snow we had in Indy my team might have to play 4 games in 3 days!   Hopefully we can win again tomorrow and  make for a busy Saturday... I LOVE THIS GAME.

GO EC
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 16, 2007, 04:31:19 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2007, 07:57:33 PM
On the WQKT pregame radio show tonight, they indicated that Tim Vandervaart will have an x-ray tomorrow on his wrist.  If the results are good, Vandervaart will have his cast removed and replaced with a splint.

This would increase the likelihood that Vandervaart can play with a splint during the NCAC Tourney next week.  Good luck to Tim in getting back on the court in the near future!  :)   
Coach Moore added after the game that if things looked good when Tim's cast was removed, there might be a strong possibility of him playing in the NCAC Tournament.  That would be a huge lift to get him back on the court for tournament time. 

On a different note, I made my first visit to the Kenyon Athletic Facility and Tomsich Arena last night and I must say that David is absolutely correct in his gushing over that entire facility.  First, when driving through campus, you can look down on it from up on the hill and it just looks fantastic all lit up.  Second of all, it's absoulutely HUGE!!!  Lastly, it was pretty awe inspiring to see all those Walnut and Bronze trophies proudly displayed in the pool area.  It's just hard to fathom that the men's team hasn't known anything but winning national championships since 1980!!! :o   And all the women have done is win 20 of the last 23?!  Slackers!!! ;)

All I could think about as I was strolling around admiring everything is how lucky those students are to have facilities like that at the Division III level.  Heck, they seemed to have about 50 different locker rooms alone.  I remember in my days at Westminster, we had to frequently clean out our Swimming lockers to make room for visiting baskeball teams and the like.  Boy would that facility spoil you in a hurry!

PS, I just wanted to add that I had the pleasure of meeting cmhscots and his father last night and it was very nice meeting both of you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Go Quake on February 16, 2007, 05:08:19 PM
Well, I'm beginning to think i'm bad luck for the Quakers.  I post one time and not only do they lose to a team they beat by 20 less than a month ago, but they lose on Senior night.

Hats off to the Big Red who played a solid game and forced the Quakers to play at their tempo.  Hodgkinson is as good as advertised, he got both Quaker big men in foul trouble early. 

Denison took Jewett out of the Quaker offense with very physical defense and double teams all night long, which seems to be what most teams are trying to do against him.  Luckily for Earlham, Gregory had a fantastic night, as noted by Earlham Alum. 

Earlhamalum, I too have noticed that Henry is struggling this year, but did not know his numbers were THAT bad.  It's a shame to see him, Jewett, and Rihm go out with a loss on Senior night.  Luckily for us, the rest of the log jam for fourth place also suffered defeats (aside from 'gheny, but they face Witt next).  Maybe there is hope after all, Hopefully I see you in Richmond next Tuesday  ;)


P.S.  Go Witt!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 17, 2007, 04:51:01 PM
Alleg 62
Witt 57

???

witt shoots 33% from the floor-18/54

1/10 from 3pt land

Allegheny runs the clock on every possession and beats Witt at their own game while shooting only 39%.

Tigers led only one time 8-7.

http://www.allegheny.edu/athletics/menbb/0607/html/allm0217.htm

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 17, 2007, 05:30:31 PM
Some more scores:

Wabash 77, Kenyon 74
Oberlin 79, Earlham 76  :o
Denison 79, Hiram 74  :o

Up to the second standings:

Wooster 14-1
Witt 13-3
OWU 10-5
Allegheny 8-8
Wabash 7-9
Earlham 6-10
Kenyon 6-10
Hiram 6-10
-------------
Denison 5-11
Oberlin 4-12

Obviously tonight's Wooster/OWU game isn't relavant to much of anything outside of Wooster's regional standing. 

Allegheny locked up a home game with their upset win today.  Wabash heads to Meadville Tuesday night. 

I'm not even going to try to unscramble the tie for 6-8. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 17, 2007, 05:37:23 PM
I think I have it.

Kenyon went 3-1 vs. Earlham and Hiram so Kenyon gets #6
Hiram beat Earlham so Hiram is #7
Congrats Earlham - you get Wooster.

So it's:

Earlham at Wooster
Hiram at Wittenberg
Kenyon at OWU
Wabash at Allegheny

Of course, I could be wrong, but that's my best guess at the 3-way tiebreaker.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on February 17, 2007, 06:35:47 PM
Wow, just like last year's game, except Witt didn't pull it out in the last two minutes.  Seniors Borchers, Hemenway and Bowen step up, but Hill was nowhere to be found.  Shooting percentages were astoundingly low for both teams.  Well, maybe not for Allegheny, given Witt's tenacious D.  Was the Allegheny D that good, or was Witt just in their Meadville mode?  Was anyone there?
I usually make it to this game, it's the closest to my home base, but couldn't due to youth hockey committments.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 17, 2007, 06:51:45 PM
Am I just minding my own business and I was preparing to log on for the game tonite and get my links up and running.  I log on the D3 Hoops headline that Wittenberg lost. 

Did I just teleport into the bizzaro world?

I am in desparate search of details!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 17, 2007, 08:32:33 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 17, 2007, 05:37:23 PM
I think I have it.

Kenyon went 3-1 vs. Earlham and Hiram so Kenyon gets #6
Hiram beat Earlham so Hiram is #7
Congrats Earlham - you get Wooster.

So it's:

Earlham at Wooster
Hiram at Wittenberg
Kenyon at OWU
Wabash at Allegheny

Of course, I could be wrong, but that's my best guess at the 3-way tiebreaker.

You nailed it, smeds.  Hiram's webiste is reporting that the Terriers are the #7 seed and will play @ Witt while Kenyon's site reports that the Lords are the #6 seed and will play @ OWU.  By process of elimination, that leaves Earlham headed to Wooster.  Our quarterfinal matchups are all set. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 17, 2007, 09:15:43 PM
Whoah!  What an upset Allegheny put on Witt today? Details please? ...

I had originally meant only to express my joy at the news of Timmy's return.  Coach Moore said at the end of the game that Timmy will be available for the tournament.  This is awesome news for the Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Henry Steele on February 17, 2007, 09:24:03 PM
Looking at Allegheny's website, it appears as if they have a veteran nucleus of juniors that is gelling at right time, winning last four games.

babe has been shooting well since the first wooster game, they have that QB playing who is a good defender, and they have three good big guys to rotate. their PG doesn't seem to score, but he is solid with ball.

so for first time since they have that good guard Catanzarite, Gators have some decent upperclassmen, so maybe not such a shock that they've improved and can challenge the upper three teams, especially at home.

i mean, except for borchers and the emerging Hill, whats so great about Witt's players?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 17, 2007, 10:30:39 PM
Witt's players are battle-tested and have Final Four experience all around-that's what's great about their players
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 17, 2007, 11:02:06 PM

Printable bracket:

http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbrkt07.pdf
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 17, 2007, 11:04:32 PM
Witt D's up this year. Hill had a rotten game against 'Gheny from what I saw of the stats. Once in a while, the bear (or gator) eats you no matter who you are.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 17, 2007, 11:27:18 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 17, 2007, 05:37:23 PM
I think I have it.

Kenyon went 3-1 vs. Earlham and Hiram so Kenyon gets #6
Hiram beat Earlham so Hiram is #7
Congrats Earlham - you get Wooster.

So it's:

Earlham at Wooster
Hiram at Wittenberg
Kenyon at OWU
Wabash at Allegheny

Of course, I could be wrong, but that's my best guess at the 3-way tiebreaker.

Its unfortunate for the Scots the way that the tiebreakers fell.  With the Quakers regional record at exactly .333, a Scots win will be worth only 8 ratings points, and will also cost them 4 more points for the regular-season games against Earlham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 17, 2007, 11:28:07 PM
I don't think there many teams in D3 that Ohio Wesleyan would have lost to tonight, but unfortunately for them, Wooster at home was one of them.  OWU played a brilliant game on the offensive end, moving the ball around crisply and finding the open shooter (they shot 53% overall and 11/19 from the arc) and crashing the offensive glass hard (11 offensive rebounds leading to 18 second-chance points.)  The shooting was even better than it looks: when Casey Teeters drilled a three to tie the game at 87 with 4:55 remaining, the Bishops were at 57.9% and 64.7 from the arc.  However, the Scots clamped down on D a bit harder and held the Bishops to just 1 of 7 the rest of the way to pull out the six-point victory.  Wooster's defense was actually reasonably good all night, despite the gaudy numbers.  OWU was just lights-out, especially from the arc.  Wooster frequently forced the Bishops down to the last 5 seconds of the shot clock, but still OWU would find a way to get the ball into the hole. 

On the other end, James Cooper (23 on 7/15 with three treys) and Tom Port were a two-man wrecking crew, with their dazzling moves and ability to find an open shot.  Port particularly was huge tonight, scoring 21 on 7/11 shooting (3/5 3's) and 4/4 FTs, with 14 rebounds (4 off.), 4 assists, 2 blocks, 1 steal, and just 1 turnover and 2 fouls.  The All-Americans were capably aided by Brandon Johnson, who exploited the middle of the OWU defense with four driving buckets and two assists in the first four minutes (he ended up with 11 pts and 5 assists in the first half, 17 and 6 for the game.) 

But it was free throw shooting that decided it.  Wooster was 13/15 for the game, including 8 of 9 after that Teeters tying three.  Port hit all 4 of his free throws down the stretch. 

It was a very exciting and well-played game, and it's just OWU's bad luck to waste such a brilliant performance on a loss to a top national team.  If they can play like this next week, I would not be surprised to see them in the championship game Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 17, 2007, 11:43:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 17, 2007, 11:28:07 PM
I don't think there many teams in D3 that Ohio Wesleyan would have lost to tonight, but unfortunately for them, Wooster at home was one of them.  OWU played a brilliant game on the offensive end, moving the ball around crisply and finding the open shooter (they shot 53% overall and 11/19 from the arc) and crashing the offensive glass hard (11 offensive rebounds leading to 18 second-chance points.)  The shooting was even better than it looks: when Casey Teeters drilled a three to tie the game at 87 with 4:55 remaining, the Bishops were at 57.9% and 64.7 from the arc.  However, the Scots clamped down on D a bit harder and held the Bishops to just 1 of 7 the rest of the way to pull out the six-point victory.  Wooster's defense was actually reasonably good all night, despite the gaudy numbers.  OWU was just lights-out, especially from the arc.  Wooster frequently forced the Bishops down to the last 5 seconds of the shot clock, but still OWU would find a way to get the ball into the hole. 

On the other end, James Cooper (23 on 7/15 with three treys) and Tom Port were a two-man wrecking crew, with their dazzling moves and ability to find an open shot.  Port particularly was huge tonight, scoring 21 on 7/11 shooting (3/5 3's) and 4/4 FTs, with 14 rebounds (4 off.), 4 assists, 2 blocks, 1 steal, and just 1 turnover and 2 fouls.  The All-Americans were capably aided by Brandon Johnson, who exploited the middle of the OWU defense with four driving buckets and two assists in the first four minutes (he ended up with 11 pts and 5 assists in the first half, 17 and 6 for the game.) 

But it was free throw shooting that decided it.  Wooster was 13/15 for the game, including 8 of 9 after that Teeters tying three.  Port hit all 4 of his free throws down the stretch. 

It was a very exciting and well-played game, and it's just OWU's bad luck to waste such a brilliant performance on a loss to a top national team.  If they can play like this next week, I would not be surprised to see them in the championship game Saturday.

This was probably the most entertaining game that I've seen this year.  OWU may have been a little lax on the defensive end at the outset, allowing Johnson to drive the lane at will.  But. as David mentioned, after that both teams played reasonably good defense but the offenses just plain shot lights out.  I haven't seen anybody else try to keep up with Wooster.  Most teams try to slow the game down and limit the Scots' offensive posessions, but OWU showed that they could play the Scots' game and play it well.  If they can approach this kind of effort next Friday, it should make for a very interesting game against the Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 18, 2007, 12:05:15 AM
I don't think Wooster's defense was there at all for most of the game, and that's probably due more to Witt's afternoon loss than anything else.  

It's rare that a Wooster team is beaten back down the court after scoring, but that happened all too frequently tonight.  These rushes didn't produce immediate baskets, but often led to forced defensive switches and/or good positioning for the OWU big men.  The Scots had no answer at all for Dustin Rudegeair who backed his way in at will, or on Will, or Port.  If he was doubled, he found the open man for a three, and OWU can definitely shoot them.  Tim Vandervaart's prescence at that end was sorely missed.

I'm at a loss as to why Jesse Jean only played 14 minutes.  It wasn't foul trouble, and I can't believe it's conditioning as he's picked up his minutes considerably since Chojnacki went down, averaging close to 30 in games that were close.  He was a force inside as usual, and his sitting on the bench only helped Wooster.

Wooster did tighten up their "D" in the last minutes and that was the difference.  I'm predicting right now an OWU win over Witt in one of the semifinals next week, and for the Bishops to battle the Scots heartily in the final before going down in a close one. I give them one chance in four to beat the Scots, odds not quite as good as Captain Ramius figured the Red October had to safely defect.  However, if Tim is able to Vandervaart again, Wooster might win going away by 10-15.

Congrats to the Wooster women for sending Wittenberg home with a loss.  When they're patient and don't throw the ball around like little leaguers taking infield, they're actually a pretty decent team.  Good luck on the road at Allegheny.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 18, 2007, 12:17:16 AM
I'm anxious to see how the region's QOWI's are shaping up.  If my calculations are correct (not necessarily a good assumption!), Wooster's rating has climbed to 10.316 this week.  However, the best that is can be is 10.182 after next week's conference tournament, and that's assuming a Wabash upset at Allegheny! 

My real question is what happens if they don't win the NCAC tourney?  If they were to lose to OWU in the finals, their rating would only be 9.636.  Last year that rating would be about 45th overall, and with only 1 win (and 2 losses) against regionally ranked teams I wonder if they would even make the NCAA tournament??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 18, 2007, 12:49:51 AM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 18, 2007, 12:17:16 AM
I'm anxious to see how the region's QOWI's are shaping up.  If my calculations are correct (not necessarily a good assumption!), Wooster's rating has climbed to 10.316 this week.  However, the best that is can be is 10.182 after next week's conference tournament, and that's assuming a Wabash upset at Allegheny! 

cmhscots,

I agree with your math.  Here's the basis of the calcuation that I used:

136 = 17 in-region wins x 8 pts per win
    8 =   8 in-region road games x 1 pt. per road game
    0 =   6 in-region games vs. sub .333 opponents x 0 (2x Hiram, Denison, Oberlin)
  14 =   7 in-region games vs. .333-.499 opponents x 2 (2x Earlham, Wabash, Kenyon; Mount Union)
  20 =   5 in-region games vs. .500-.666 opponents x 4 (2x OWU, Allegheny; Calvin)
  18 =   3 in-region games vs. .667+ opponents x 6 (2x Wittenberg; Ohio Northern)

196 QoWI points over 19 regional games = 10.316

Edit/Note:  I just ran John Carroll's.

128 = 16 in-region wins x 8 pts per win
  12 = 12 in-region road games x 1 pt. per road game
    0 =   2 in-region games vs. sub .333 opponents x 0 (2x Marietta)
    8 =   4 in-region games vs. .333-.499 opponents x 2 (2x Mount Union, Muskingum)
  36 =   9 in-region games vs. .500-.666 opponents x 4 (2x Wilmington, Ott, Heide; CNU, E&H, Albion)
  42 =   7 in-region games vs. .667+ opponents x 6 (2x Ohio Northern, Capital, B-W; Greensboro)

226 QoWI points over 22 regional games = 10.273
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2007, 10:23:34 AM
Nice work on the qowi's scotsbrod and cmhscots.  Just one question and I'll admit that I'm too lazy to do the math myself, but would anyone know what LEC's qowi fell to after their loss this week?  I really don't see any reason Wooster isn't rankesd #1 in the GL Region  this week. 

Quote from: cmhscots on February 18, 2007, 12:17:16 AM
I'm anxious to see how the region's QOWI's are shaping up.  If my calculations are correct (not necessarily a good assumption!), Wooster's rating has climbed to 10.316 this week.  However, the best that is can be is 10.182 after next week's conference tournament, and that's assuming a Wabash upset at Allegheny! 

My real question is what happens if they don't win the NCAC tourney?  If they were to lose to OWU in the finals, their rating would only be 9.636.  Last year that rating would be about 45th overall, and with only 1 win (and 2 losses) against regionally ranked teams I wonder if they would even make the NCAA tournament??
cmhscots, 

I was thinking this same thing last night about Wooster's opponents in the NCAC tournament.  They won't meet an opponent above .500 until the finals which won't help their qowi at all when you compare that to what kinds of points the OAC Tournament team will walk away with.


As for the NCAA tournament, I'm not really worried about the Scots getting in with a Pool C if they happen to lose in the NCAC finals.  I just hope it doesn't come to that because I feel that if this team wants to go deep in the tournament, they need to have as many games at Timken as possible.  A loss in the NCAC Tournament would basically eliminate the Scots' chances of hosting any tournament games.  I'm also hopeful that a win like last night can give this team some confidence and loosen them up a bit as they meet up with other quality opponents as they move into the post-season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 18, 2007, 10:49:21 AM
Congrats to Wooster on winning their 3rd straight NCAC regular season title and their 4th in the last 5 years!  :) ;D

The video feed from Timken last night was quite good and as others have noted, both teams shot very well in this high scoring game.  If OWU continues to play at that high level, the Bishops will be a real threat in the NCAC tourney.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 18, 2007, 10:57:22 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 18, 2007, 10:23:34 AM
As for the NCAA tournament, I'm not really worried about the Scots getting in with a Pool C if they happen to lose in the NCAC finals.  I just hope it doesn't come to that because I feel that if this team wants to go deep in the tournament, they need to have as many games at Timken as possible.  A loss in the NCAC Tournament would basically eliminate the Scots' chances of hosting any tournament games. 

ScotsFan -- great point about hosting NCAA tournament games.  Wooster's season ended the last two years at Albion and at Transylvania because they did not get to host 2nd round NCAA games when they lost in the NCAC tourney.

If the Scots want to avoid that scenario again, they need to focus on winning three straight in the NCAC tourney and getting the automatic bid.  Hosting games is never a sure thing (since NCAA travel expenses are a factor) but Wooster will have a much better chance if their record reaches 25-3.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 18, 2007, 11:45:31 AM
With the regular season complete, here is the case for Tom Port as the NCAC MVP using only the conference stats (16 games).

Tom Port is ranked in 9 categories, the most by any player:

-Scoring 6th (16.6 ppg)
-Rebounding 7th (6.9 rpg)
-Field Goal Shooting % 5th (56.8%)
-Assists 4th (3.19/game)
-3 Point FG Made 1st (40 total, 2.5/game)
-3 Point FG Shooting % 4th (49.4%)
-Blocked Shots 9th (1.13/game)
-Assists to Turnover Ratio 4th (2.13)
-Defensive Rebounds 3rd (5.06/game)

I'm guessing that most NCAC teams are glad that Port is a Senior! :P ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2007, 01:09:28 PM
I'm sure you all knew this was coming, sooner or later... ;D

Let's give it up for the Big Red.  Eliminated from tournament contention, suffering through a disastrous season with nothing left to play for, and they pull it all together for dramatic season-ending victories over Earlham and Hiram.  As usual, they were led by the their two seniors, the Chicagoland Dans.  Dan Izzo contributed 19 points and 12 boards at Earlham, including a big basket and assist that gave DU the lead they'd hold throughout the OT session, and followed that up with a 13 point, 5 rebound performance yesterday which included three huge free throws to seal the win in the waning moments.  As for Dan Hodgkinson, well, all DU's all-time leading scorer did was cement his first-team all-NCAC status by pouring in 53 points (19/33 shooting) and grabbing 23 boards in 68 minutes of action.  Hodgkinson finishes his DU career with 1908 points and 719 boards, and led the conference in scoring this season at 20.8 ppg with a FG% of .605 this season (3rd in the NCAC.)  He was also among the conference leaders in rebounding (11th) and minutes played (4th.) 

Congratulations to Dan, Dan, and the Big Red!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2007, 02:16:24 PM
Aaron Dorksen addressed the reaction to his recent column in today's Daily Record (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1619792).  He says that he was contacted by two coaches (one head, one assistant) from elsewhere in the conference, each expressing their displeasure at his suggestion that Woo and Witt stay on top of the league by out-working the other eight programs.  The head coach told Dorksen that he shouldn't "question my work ethic, you don't know what I'm doing."  Both coaches pointed out that each NCAC school has different obstacles to deal with, ranging from admissions standards and financial aid to resources allocated to basketball.  Dorksen says he agrees "that other factors [besides work ethic and recruiting edges] contribute," but he's not backing down from his contention that Woo and Witt have the best (and presumably hardest-working) staffs and get the best recruits.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 18, 2007, 02:28:22 PM
I'm glad those coaches saw fit to call him out on it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2007, 03:10:48 PM
With the regular season at an end, where does everyone think we stand with the all-NCAC team?  I think these four are locks for the first team:

Tom Port, Wooster (16.6 ppg [6th], 6.6 rpg [9th], .556 fg% [8th], .455 3pt. fg% [3rd], 1.74 a/to [4th]; the best player on the conference champs, and my vote for NCAC POY)
Dan Hodgkinson, Denison (20.8 ppg [1st], 6.4 rpg [11th], .605 fg% [3rd])
Dane Borchers, Wittenberg (16.9 ppg [5th], 9.8 rpg [1st], .564 fg% [6th], 47 blocks [1st])
Andrew Zimmer, Wabash (19.4 ppg [2nd], 8.2 rpg [3rd], .564 fg% [5th], 39 blocks [2nd])

Who's fifth?  Here's some candidates:
Tim Vandervaart, Wooster (14.3 ppg [11th], 8.6 rpg [2nd], .618 fg% [2nd]; missing ten games and playing ths same position as Borchers and Zimmer hurts him)
James Cooper, Wooster (18.0 ppg [4th], .522 fg% [10th, the only guard in the top 10], .873 ft% [3rd], .439 3 pt. fg% [7th], defending NCAC POY)
Quinton Spencer, Oberlin (15.5 ppg [8th], 7.0 rpg [6th], 2.57 apg [8th], 1.43 spg [5th]
Ben Chojnacki, OWU (15.0 ppg [9th], 6.4 rpg [10th], .628 fg% [1st], .522 3pt. fg% [1st], 1.85 steals [1st]. 1.55 blocks/gm [3rd]; a two-time all-NCAC 1st teamer)

I think Tim Vandervaart deserves the #5 spot, but I wouldn't be unhappy with Chojnacki or the other two I have mentioned.

If you have other candidates, let's hear it. 

I think the newcomer of the year is easily Mike Staley of Hiram, with his 6.65 assists/game leading the league by more than 2.5 apg over Kenyon's Josh Klinger, who missed half the season, and by more than 3 apg more than Wooster's Brandon Johnson, the second-place full-season point guard.  I wonder if Staley's late-season two-game suspension will hurt him in this category.

Coach of the Year--I don't see anyone but Steve Moore making a strong case here.  Possibly Steve Fleming, coach of the over-achieving Hiram Terriers, but losing the last four games won't help, or fourth-place Allegheny's Rob Clune.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2007, 03:16:49 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 18, 2007, 02:16:24 PM
Dorksen says he agrees "that other factors [besides work ethic and recruiting edges] contribute," but he's not backing down from his contention that Woo and Witt have the best (and presumably hardest-working) staffs and get the best recruits.
They also have the largest staffs by far in the conference which could also contribute to why they have the so called 'best' staffs.  Also, with more bodies on each of the staffs at Witt and Woo, it could be argued that there is actually less work to go around than say for the coaching staff at the 'Little 8'... ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 18, 2007, 03:29:19 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 18, 2007, 03:10:48 PM
I think Tim Vandervaart deserves the #5 spot, but I wouldn't be unhappy with Chojnacki or the other two I have mentioned.

I think the fifth spot will probably go to Chojnacki, but I wouldn't be surprised to see Cooper get it.

Coach of the Year: That's gotta go to Steve Moore
Newcomer: I'll agree with Staley. That suspension could be problematic, but I think that his on-court efforts were enough to distance him from the rest of the pack.
Player of the Year: Tom Port, but I wouldn't argue too much with Hodgkinson.  I just think its difficult to win POTY when your team only wins 6 games - even with that end-of-season winning streak!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Go Quake on February 18, 2007, 04:10:07 PM
Well the Quakers have absolutely ruined their chances of making it to the conference semi-finals for their 3rd consecutive year!  How disappointing it is for them to lose to the bottom two teams in the conference with a chance at hosting a first round game on the line.  Hopefully they can go up to Wooster and at least keep it close and put a scare in the Scots.  Jewett might have to go for 50 for them to have a chance.  Which brings me to my next point....

How was Jewett not mentioned in the 1st team debate.  In my opinion he was a lock for first team and a contender for POY, but with his teams awful finish, that may be out of the question.   He ranks 3rd in scoring at 18.1, 17th in rebounding, 10th in Free throw %, and first in minutes played.  I would consider those at least first team numbers considering every team's defensive game plan focused around slowing him down with double and even triple teams. 

I remember talks last year about what exactly does POY mean?  Is it the Most Valuable Player to his team, or the best player on the best team?  If it is the most valuable player to his team, I go with Jewett, Hodgkinson, and Zimmer.  Without those three players, I don't know if their teams would have won a single game.  As for the best player on the best team, I think Port was an absolute stud and would receive my pick, but an argument could be made for Borchers as well. 


My first team would go something like this...

Tom Port
Dane Borchers
Andrew Zimmer
Markous Jewett
Dan Hodgkinson
James Cooper

Yeah, I know I cheated and took 6, but I don't see who you could leave off of that team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2007, 04:39:02 PM
David, I too would agree with your 4 locks for 1st Team.  As for that 5th spot, I would have to give the nod to Cooper.  I mean, one could still make a strong argument for Cooper being POY.  I don't think that argument could be made for Chojnacki or Vandervaart.  Plus, the injuries those 2 suffered could hurt their chances of making 1st Team. 

You can definately see that this league is dominated by wings and post players by the list David compiled.  And, as Go Quake mentioned, Jewett easily merits conversation for being a 1st teamer as well and he is yet another big man/wing.  Cooper and Spencer are the only guards to make the list out of the 8 David gave mention to.  Cooper is the best guard in the league and for that I think the nod should go to him making 1st team as opposed to the 4th or 5th best big man in the league.


As for POY, my choice on this has changed quite a few times over the course of the season.  Before the new year, I would have made a strong case for Tim Vandervaart.  However, his #'s declined a bit after his hot start and I began leaning more towards  Tom Port with James Cooper not far behind.  The only thing I saw holding both Port and Cooper back was their lacking on the defensive end.  This is an area that Port has drastically improved as the season has worn on.  Cooper has improved as well, but not to the level that I have seen with Port.  Not to mention the fact that Port didn't have to come back to play this season and he and his family made a pretty big sacrifice by deciding to return for his 4th year of eligibility.  I think with all those things factored in, along with the fact that Port helped lead this team to their 3rd consecutive regular season NCAC Championship and it makes it really difficult to argue for anyone else.  Yes Hodgkinson's numbers were impressive, but he had no supporting cast.  He basically had to carry this team.  I know that part of being considered for POY is what their team would do without that said player.  Well, Desinson would've probably finished 10th instead of 9th???  I just don't think based on the fact that even with the tremendous efforts put forth by Hodgkinson, he still failed to even lead the Big Red to the NCAC tournament.  That, IMHO is a big strike against Hodgkinson to be considered for POY.

COY should go to Steve Moore for leading Wooster to their 3rd straight NCAC regular season championship.  I would agree that consideration could go to Hiram's Steve Flemming, but the late season collapse may have cost him consideration.  Had the Terriers been able to garner the 4th seed, his name would have most definately have had to of been considered.  Rob Clune is definately in the conversation after their strong finish to the season culminating in their upset of Witt.

And I would agree that NOY should go to Mike Staley.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on February 18, 2007, 05:59:45 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 18, 2007, 03:16:49 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 18, 2007, 02:16:24 PM
Dorksen says he agrees "that other factors [besides work ethic and recruiting edges] contribute," but he's not backing down from his contention that Woo and Witt have the best (and presumably hardest-working) staffs and get the best recruits.
They also have the largest staffs by far in the conference which could also contribute to why they have the so called 'best' staffs.  Also, with more bodies on each of the staffs at Witt and Woo, it could be argued that there is actually less work to go around than say for the coaching staff at the 'Little 8'... ::)


As far as Witt having a large staff, only Coach Artie Taylor is being paid.  There are two volunteer assistants and a student assistant.  What are the average sizes of the staffs around the NCAC?  I know Wooster has a few assistants, but I can only remember one or two at the other schools. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2007, 06:34:22 PM
Quote from: petewitt54 on February 18, 2007, 05:59:45 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 18, 2007, 03:16:49 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 18, 2007, 02:16:24 PM
Dorksen says he agrees "that other factors [besides work ethic and recruiting edges] contribute," but he's not backing down from his contention that Woo and Witt have the best (and presumably hardest-working) staffs and get the best recruits.
They also have the largest staffs by far in the conference which could also contribute to why they have the so called 'best' staffs.  Also, with more bodies on each of the staffs at Witt and Woo, it could be argued that there is actually less work to go around than say for the coaching staff at the 'Little 8'... ::)


As far as Witt having a large staff, only Coach Artie Taylor is being paid.  There are two volunteer assistants and a student assistant.  What are the average sizes of the staffs around the NCAC?  I know Wooster has a few assistants, but I can only remember one or two at the other schools.
I believe that Wooster has 2 assistants that are paid (Cline and Gaubatz) and 2 volunteer assistants as well as one student assistant.  I don't know of too many other NCAC schools with as many volunteer assistants as Wooster and Wittenberg have.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2007, 06:41:30 PM
Denison has three assistant coaches and a student assistant; I'd guess than one (Kyle Pottkotter) is paid and the others are volunteer.

I believe that Travis Schwab, who surely is paid, is the only assistant coach at Kenyon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2007, 07:05:44 PM
Tuesday game information:

At Springfield:
5:30 women's quarterfinal #7 Earlham at #2 Wittenberg
7:45 men's quarterfinal #7 Hiram at #2 Wittenberg

At Meadville:
5:30 women's quarterfinal #6 Wooster at #3 Allegheny
7:30 men's quarterfinal #5 Wabash at #4 Allegheny

At Wooster:
7:30 men's quarterfinal #8 Earlham at #1 Wooster

At Delaware:
7:30 men's quarterfinal #6 Kenyon at #3 Ohio Wesleyan

At Granville:
7:30 women's quarterfinal #8 Oberlin at #1 Denison

At Gambier:
7:30 women's quarterfinal #5 Ohio Wesleyan at #4 Kenyon

There will be live audio and/or video available for some of these games, and LiveStats for others.  Click here (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/multimedia.html) for more information. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 18, 2007, 10:47:45 PM
I think Chojnacki's the one for the 5th spot. And next year, I think Zimmer could definitely be POY, and that's not a homer call. After Simkus left for Spain, and his injury, he's elevated his game. Next year, with Simkus and Rooks and the kiddie corps having another year of experience and some new recruits, watch out for Zimmer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 18, 2007, 10:55:59 PM
Feh on Dorksen - the ink stained wretch knows not of what he talks about. For my money, the job that Matt Croci is doing at Kenyon is just as good, if not better, than Witt or Wooster, because he has a totally different set of obstacles and expectations.

I am ASSUMING Klingler was hurt and didn't just quit the team. If he's back, then they could be really good next year. Yelvington and Knapke are good players, and the guards are getting better, so Kenyon could be a contender to host a game next year.

Of course, Mac Petty once again guides a young team to improvement over the course of the year, with a great building block for the future. Coaching success isn't always measured in wins and losses - even for a coach with a NCAA ring.

Mike DeWitt always does a great job at OWU as well. His teams are always tough to defend and play hard.

I've been impressed with how Justus handles his team at Earlham too. That's another situation where recruiting is a bit...challenging...at times.

Rob Clune got a lot out of this Allegheny team.

And I must give a kudo to Steve Fleming at Hiram. They seem to be building a program there, which is refreshing.

So, Mr. Dorksen, I think your premise is faulty, and your conclusion is errant.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on February 18, 2007, 11:28:54 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 07, 2007, 09:33:17 PM
52-52  Okay I am looking for a new g/f... only my girlfriend would leave when the game was tied....................... awtgwrhgkajkjkahkjkgfjah


Li'l   you got anything for me?
ouch

Quote from: pennstghs on February 08, 2007, 11:45:46 AM
Also Willie apparently im not the only one noticing that Wittenberg's attendance is kind of pathatic

from today's Springfield News Sun:

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/s/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2007/02/07/snssp020807wittnotes.html
double ouch

Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2007, 10:33:09 PM
I get a little tingle when I think of how many of the obnoxious jerks around Posting Up would be unwilling to pony up $25 just to spew their venom or lame attempts at humor.  Heck, you'd have to shut down the NESCAC board altogether for lack of activity.  :)  I'd pay just for that reason alone.
Oooh... this is actually a good idea.

Quote from: David Collinge on February 14, 2007, 07:36:37 PM
Yes, I have seen The Natural, and I like it.  It's sort of a guilty pleasure; none of my cineaste friends can tolerate it.

The baseball movie that I'm somewhat surprised has escaped mention is Bang the Drum Slowly (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0069765/), which IIRC is sort of Brian's Song meets Of Mice and Men.  Good film.
I greatly dislike The Natural... a lot. Maybe cause I find him so annoying cause he thinks he so hot. :D One of my top 5 is definitely Brian's Song though, so I will have to add Bang the Drum Slowly to the list of movies I watch in the offseason when I am craving sports. I own a ton of sports movies... it's pretty silly.

My favorite baseball movie is The Rookie with Dennis Quaid, hands down. I'm surprised no one metioned it. Just cause it's Disney doesn't make it bad! :P I also love For the Love of the Game and Field of Dreams as well. Field of Dreams is good largely because it's so absurd, and yes, because of the playing catch scene. For the Love of the Game isn't really a baseball movie, just like Jerry Maguire isn't really a football movie... but I love them both a lot! As far as older ones are concerned, I'd take 8 Men Out over the horrible Natural movie anyday. A League of their Own is very fun too.

Basketball wise, I own Hoosiers and Finding Forrester. Finding Forrester also isn't really a basketball movie, but it has my fav sports scene of all time, where the guys make 50+ fts in a row...  sooo hot. Plus the guy is smart... the perfect DIII student. DON'T watch Hoosiers for the love scenes... yuck! Watch it for the look on the guys faces when they walk into that huge gym. But I've been told that the better David story was really the team of ethnic minority guys playing in that game in Indiana of all places... so that makes a great movie slightly less great. I like Glory Road and Coach Carter a whole lot too.

Football wise, you gotta love Rudy and Remember the Titans... and the aforementioned Jerry Maguire with the aforemetioned  Brian's Song topping the list.

LOL... okay, I'm officially caught up on the last two weeks now. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 18, 2007, 11:39:05 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on February 18, 2007, 11:28:54 PMI will have to add Bang the Drum Slowly to the list of movies I watch in the offseason when I am craving sports....

.......For the Love of the Game isn't really a baseball movie, just like Jerry Maguire isn't really a football movie...

I'll put Jerry Maguire in the same category as Bull Durham: a chick flick with sports thrown in to keep the guys from falling asleep.

Bang the Drum Slowly is one of my father's favorite movies, though I can't figure out why. I just didn't enjoy it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on February 18, 2007, 11:50:35 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 18, 2007, 11:39:05 PM
Bang the Drum Slowly is one of my father's favorite movies, though I can't figure out why. I just didn't enjoy it.
I didn't realize that DC had fathered a Wabash student... :D j/k
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 19, 2007, 07:16:11 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 18, 2007, 10:23:34 AM
Just one question and I'll admit that I'm too lazy to do the math myself, but would anyone know what LEC's qowi fell to after their loss this week? 

I've got Lake Erie's QOWI at 10.2 right now, but likely to jump to 10.455 if they win the AMCC tourney.  They only have a 6-team tourament.  This means that barring upsets they'll have a 12-pt game against Pitt-Bradford and a 14-pt rematch against Penn St-Behrend this weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2007, 10:11:50 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 18, 2007, 10:55:59 PMFor my money, the job that Matt Croci is doing at Kenyon is just as good, if not better, than Witt or Wooster, because he has a totally different set of obstacles and expectations.

I am ASSUMING Klingler was hurt and didn't just quit the team. If he's back, then they could be really good next year. Yelvington and Knapke are good players, and the guards are getting better, so Kenyon could be a contender to host a game next year.

Klinger did not quit the team, he's injured in some way.  He's at every game in a shirt and tie, and he limps a little bit.  I assume he'll be back next season.  If so, he'll be the only significant senior on that team (his only classmate with significant playing time, Chris Yorlano, would be his backup.)  This year, their only senior is a rah-rah guy at the end of the bench (Mike Cohen,) so they lose nothing.  So they should be better next year, and, if they can recruit a point guard, better still the following year, when Bryan Yelvington, Korey Haddox, Jim Arce, and David Jolson are all seniors and David Knapke is a junior.  I hope and assume that the new facility will help recruiting and will put Kenyon in the first division to stay.

And the Kenyon women's team will win the conference title next year--you heard it here first.

Quote from: smedindy on February 18, 2007, 10:55:59 PM
Feh on Dorksen - the ink stained wretch knows not of what he talks about. For my money, the job that Matt Croci is doing at Kenyon is just as good, if not better, than Witt or Wooster[...]
Of course, Mac Petty once again guides a young team to improvement [...]
Mike DeWitt always does a great job at OWU [...]
I've been impressed with how [Jeff] Justus handles his team at Earlham too. [...]
Rob Clune got a lot out of this Allegheny team.[...]
And I must give a kudo to Steve Fleming at Hiram. [...]
So, Mr. Dorksen, I think your premise is faulty, and your conclusion is errant.

Conspicuous by their absence are Isaiah Cavaco and Bob Ghiloni...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 19, 2007, 10:42:36 AM
Thanks DC for the schedule on the tourney games- i am going to have to hope for the holding of "home" court-just kidding Wooster fans- friday night so i can have my day off Saturday to get up there early and tailgate.

One thing to take into consideration is if in fact the POY awards are awarded after the NCAC Tourney, a good performance could vault them into the lead (ex. Greg Hill won player of the week award after a huge performance at Wooster)-just some food for thought
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2007, 11:01:50 AM
Quote from: diehardfan on February 18, 2007, 11:50:35 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 18, 2007, 11:39:05 PM
Bang the Drum Slowly is one of my father's favorite movies, though I can't figure out why. I just didn't enjoy it.
I didn't realize that DC had fathered a Wabash student... :D j/k

Not just a Wabash alum, but worse yet, a lawyer.  Oh honey, where did we go wrong?  ??? :'( ;) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 19, 2007, 11:24:40 AM
Speaking of food for thought, here's some more:

Going back the past 3 years prior to this season, the regular season conference champ has lost in the finals of the conference tournament.  Witt last won the regular season 4 seasons ago and lost in the finals to Wooster.  Wooster has won the last 2 regular season titles (not including this year) and lost both championship finals to Wittenberg?!   ::)

I thought that hosting the conference tournament was supposed to be some sort of advantage or something??? ??? ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 19, 2007, 11:25:17 AM
DC - I don't have an opinion on Oberlin's coach, since whenever they come to town I'm away for some reason.

Yorlano played 39 minutes against Wabash and was steady. He's no scorer, but he knows what he's doing out there!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 19, 2007, 11:40:45 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 19, 2007, 11:24:40 AM
Speaking of food for thought, here's some more:

Going back the past 3 years prior to this season, the regular season conference champ has lost in the finals of the conference tournament.  Witt last won the regular season 4 seasons ago and lost in the finals to Wooster.  Wooster has won the last 2 regular season titles (not including this year) and lost both championship finals to Wittenberg?!   ::)

I thought that hosting the conference tournament was supposed to be some sort of advantage or something??? ??? ::)

Dating back to the start of the '03-'04 season, the road team in the Witt/Woo series is 9-2.  I think that's quirky to this series specifically and pretty atypical.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 19, 2007, 11:46:43 AM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 17, 2007, 11:27:18 PM

Its unfortunate for the Scots the way that the tiebreakers fell.  With the Quakers regional record at exactly .333...

Okay I'm confussed unfortunately for the Scots... I think it might be the other way around. 

WoW it looked like L. Henry wanted to end his career with a BANG!  I liked the way he followed up his 12-62 performance with a 0-5 @ Oberlin... Last time I checked Oberlin College hasn't played a Lick of (D)  Evvvvvrrrr.  I'm not sure what I would do right now if I was Coach Justus...  As an Earlham Alum and Fan I'm more then disappointmented in this group.

More so I feel bad for Jewett who worked his A$$ off during the off-season and throughout the season.  I know no one has given him credit for the basketball player he is on and off the court .(1st team all NCAC)   He could of walked away from the NCAC, but decided to come back for his super-senior year (when he didn't need the credits)  I have Mucho Respect for A MAN that has dedicated his time this year as a Student, Basketball Player and a Father... MUCHO Respect from Me!  Wish the rest of the team would have the balls he has!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2007, 11:58:19 AM
FWIW, I'd put Jewett on my all-NCAC 2nd team, along with Cooper, Chojnacki, Spencer and a player to be named later.  I don't consider that to be a lack of respect; I consider to be an honor!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedAlum on February 19, 2007, 12:06:53 PM
Congratulations to the Big Red on a strong finish.

They could have rolled over and they did not.  That shows what kind of team they are.
I am just sorry they came up one game short.

As far as first team all-conference.........I agree with Go Quake.  I would not change a thing.  Do they give it to more than 5?

I know I am bias but Hodgkinson does deserve a look for POY.   Had the Big Red finished 500 or above I think he would have been a lock.  But frankly you have to win.  That is the bottom line.
Hodgkinson leaves Denison as one of the best to have ever played!!!!  That is pretty special.

For that reason my vote is either Borchers or Port.  Both have had great seasons.

I am also glad those coaches stepped on that reporter.  What a jerk.  Maybe he should think about going to a movie on his day off.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 19, 2007, 12:20:18 PM
D.C.  It is special to 1st,2nd and honorable mention.. Sorry just frusterated with a little bit of everything!  I.U./E.C.  I would say is it baseball season yet... but as a Cubs fan I only get to look forward to the season and the first month!  :'(   Maybe there are (7) 1st Team all NCAC players, but only room for (5)  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 19, 2007, 12:39:29 PM
I know earlier in the year i would have considered Jewett as a POY contender and at least a first teamer, but later on in the season he has dropped off slightly, and everyone else in the league has stepped up. Of course i have only seem him twice against Wittenberg with a high scoring game (30) and a low scoring game (under 10) so his average is right around what a second teamer would be. However, Jewett in my opinion has carried Earlham (whatever he has carried them to i dont know) so i think he merits first team considerations
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 19, 2007, 12:56:13 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 19, 2007, 11:46:43 AM
More so I feel bad for Jewett who worked his A$$ off during the off-season and throughout the season.  I know no one has given him credit for the basketball player he is on and off the court .(1st team all NCAC)   He could of walked away from the NCAC, but decided to come back for his super-senior year (when he didn't need the credits)  I have Mucho Respect for A MAN that has dedicated his time this year as a Student, Basketball Player and a Father... MUCHO Respect from Me!  Wish the rest of the team would have the balls he has!
I wouldn't go as far as to say that no one has given Jewett credit.  I totally agree that it's too bad that Jewett seems to be the only player on his team who gives a damn about seeing the EC succeed.  For the sacrifices that he has made this season, he deserved better from his teammates.

Quote from: earlhamalum on February 19, 2007, 12:20:18 PM
I would say is it baseball season yet... but as a Cubs fan I only get to look forward to the season and the first month!  :'(     
Hey now.  As a fellow Cubs fan, I think there's about $300 million reasons for some optomism.  Maybe sweet Lou can light a fire under some of these guys which is something old wrist bands couldn't seem to figure out how to do.

BTW,  I'm also an Indians fan, so I'm cursed from both leagues?!?! :P ??? 8)  I guess I'm a glutton for punishment?! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 19, 2007, 01:11:30 PM
As a Tigers' fan who still expected reality to set in as late as August last season, don't abandon hope! :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 19, 2007, 01:27:07 PM
wow earlhamalum we agree again i am TOO a cubs fan-well if we can give up less than 5 runs a game i think we are going to be ok.

jewett has gotten his credibility and i agree with ScotsFan, the rest of the team doesn't care on a nightly basis-thats when you see performances against the bad teams that they have had lately.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 19, 2007, 01:27:43 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 19, 2007, 01:11:30 PM
As a Tigers' fan who still expected reality to set in as late as August last season, don't abandon hope! :o

A Wittenberg Tiger?  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 19, 2007, 01:57:23 PM
Pennstghs- Are you reading the John Amaechi book?  I know Billy_Pilgrim picked up the book yesterday and started reading it today.  I guess he started out referring to the N.B.A.  as the N fuc%ing B.A. 

I too claim to be a fan of (1) Ohio team.  The Reds but I convince myself Cincy isn't totally part of Ohio.  So close to Indiana, and across the river from KY!  I know the cubs and the reds in the same division... but loving basketball and baseball Indianapolis doesn't have a MLB team and growing up in the late 80's they were not in the same division plus we use to have their farm team.  You think routing for 2 teams in the central I'd increase my chances of one of them winning it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on February 19, 2007, 02:18:20 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 19, 2007, 11:01:50 AM
Quote from: diehardfan on February 18, 2007, 11:50:35 PM
I didn't realize that DC had fathered a Wabash student... :D j/k
Not just a Wabash alum, but worse yet, a lawyer.  Oh honey, where did we go wrong?  ??? :'( ;) :D
LOL... Lawyers aren't allowed to use Lawyer jokes, are they?  ??? :P :D

Quote from: ScotsFan on February 19, 2007, 12:56:13 PM
Hey now.  As a fellow Cubs fan, I think there's about $300 million reasons for some optomism.  Maybe sweet Lou can light a fire under some of these guys which is something old wrist bands couldn't seem to figure out how to do.

BTW,  I'm also an Indians fan, so I'm cursed from both leagues?!?! :P ??? 8)  I guess I'm a glutton for punishment?! ;D
I think Orioles fans like me win some sorta glutton for punishment award. How many seasons hve YOUR teams gone without a winning season? I'm pretty sure the Orioles are coming up on 10 straight seasons. In fact, the last time we were good, didn't the Indians beat us in the playoffs? 1997 ring a bell? No pity from me. :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 19, 2007, 02:38:51 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on February 19, 2007, 02:18:20 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 19, 2007, 11:01:50 AM
Quote from: diehardfan on February 18, 2007, 11:50:35 PM
I didn't realize that DC had fathered a Wabash student... :D j/k
Not just a Wabash alum, but worse yet, a lawyer.  Oh honey, where did we go wrong?  ??? :'( ;) :D
LOL... Lawyers aren't allowed to use Lawyer jokes, are they?  ??? :P :D

I think they get to make those jokes because they are lawyers.  It's the rest of us that are treading on thin ice with lawyer humor.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 19, 2007, 03:59:33 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on February 19, 2007, 02:18:20 PM
I think Orioles fans like me win some sorta glutton for punishment award. How many seasons hve YOUR teams gone without a winning season? I'm pretty sure the Orioles are coming up on 10 straight seasons. In fact, the last time we were good, didn't the Indians beat us in the playoffs? 1997 ring a bell? No pity from me. :P


If I were a baseball nut, this is where I would point to the  Detroit Tigers past 15 years before last season.  ;D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2007, 04:12:43 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcontent.answers.com%2Fmain%2Fcontent%2Fwp%2Fen%2Fthumb%2Fb%2Fbc%2F150px-Indian_uprising.jpg&hash=86fc5d901151d2481030d32463902bd91e79b4e9)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2007, 05:36:42 PM
The NCAC men's Player of the Week is Wooster's Tom Port, who went for 21 and 14 in leading the conference champion Scots over Ohio Wesleyan.

http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt

Congratulations, Tom!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2007, 06:06:05 PM
By the way, Kenyon now stands at 10-15 on the season.  Their 10th win, against Oberlin a week ago, snapped a ten-year string of single-digit win campaigns.  The last Kenyon team to win 10 games was the 1995-96 team led by Jamie Harless and coached by Bill H. Brown in his final season (no, not that Bill Brown; he left Gambier in 1988.)  Matt Croci is the 4th head coach since then, and next season he has a decent chance to lead the Lords to their first winning season since going 20-9 in 1994-95.  Congratulations to Coach Croci and the Lords!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 19, 2007, 06:59:01 PM
Not that I'd ever expect to see it happen as it's almost certainly against NCAA regulations, but it would be cool to have a post-season all-star game between the NCAC and OAC.  If I had to choose 12 guys to represent our league against the best of the thugs, I'd go like this, in alphabetical order:

Dane Borchers, Wittenberg
Ben Chojnacki, Ohio Wesleyan
James Cooper, Wooster
Greg Hill, Wittenberg
Dan Hodgkinson, Denison
Markous Jewett, Earlham
Brandon Johnson, Wooster
Tom Port, Wooster
Dustin Rudegeair, Ohio Wesleyan
Quinton Spencer, Oberlin
Tim Vandervaart, Wooster
Andrew Zimmer, Wabash

Just missing out would be Jesse Jean of Ohio Wesleyan.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 19, 2007, 09:32:56 PM
It's legal for seniors to play a postseason game. A couple leagues do them -- the ODAC plays the USAC and the CUNYAC plays the Skyline (after the NJAC swept both men's and women's for about four years in a row).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 20, 2007, 04:24:06 AM
Quote from: sac on February 19, 2007, 03:59:33 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on February 19, 2007, 02:18:20 PM
I think Orioles fans like me win some sorta glutton for punishment award. How many seasons hve YOUR teams gone without a winning season? I'm pretty sure the Orioles are coming up on 10 straight seasons. In fact, the last time we were good, didn't the Indians beat us in the playoffs? 1997 ring a bell? No pity from me. :P


If I were a baseball nut, this is where I would point to the  Detroit Tigers past 15 years before last season.  ;D ;)

The last time my favorite team won a pennant, the Motion Picture Daily Fame Poll had just named Bing Crosby "Top Male Vocalist" for the ninth straight year, and the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were still radioactive.

The last time my favorite team won the World Series, Henry Ford had started production of the Model T less than a month earlier; the Titanic was still a blueprint on the shop table in the Harland & Wolff shipyard in Belfast; and the United States was abuzz over whether William H. Taft or William Jennings Bryan would win the upcoming presidential election.

Checkmate. :D

Next topic?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2007, 10:25:19 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 20, 2007, 04:24:06 AM
Quote from: sac on February 19, 2007, 03:59:33 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on February 19, 2007, 02:18:20 PM
I think Orioles fans like me win some sorta glutton for punishment award. How many seasons hve YOUR teams gone without a winning season? I'm pretty sure the Orioles are coming up on 10 straight seasons. In fact, the last time we were good, didn't the Indians beat us in the playoffs? 1997 ring a bell? No pity from me. :P


If I were a baseball nut, this is where I would point to the  Detroit Tigers past 15 years before last season.  ;D ;)

The last time my favorite team won a pennant, the Motion Picture Daily Fame Poll had just named Bing Crosby "Top Male Vocalist" for the ninth straight year, and the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were still radioactive.

The last time my favorite team won the World Series, Henry Ford had started production of the Model T less than a month earlier; the Titanic was still a blueprint on the shop table in the Harland & Wolff shipyard in Belfast; and the United States was abuzz over whether William H. Taft or William Jennings Bryan would win the upcoming presidential election.

Checkmate. :D

Next topic?
Well, seeing as how Greg has gone over the futilities of the Cubs to win championships over the years, allow me to further elaborate on the futilities of my other favorite team, the Indians.  No World Series championships since 1948!  Yes we Indians fans have had the enjoyment of winning 2 pennants in the 90's but they were the 1st such pennants since 1954!  And they were also followed up with 2 painful losses in the WS culminating with the '97 one you so generously recalled for us DHF where the Indians were a measily 2 outs away from winning it all over the sooooooooooooo undeserving Florida Marlins and the roof came crashing down. >:( :(

I would take all the winning seasons of the Cubs and Indians combined for just ONE World Series in my lifetime.  Although, 2003 gave me some inclination that I'm never going to see one at Wrigley and it was those damned Florida Marlins again. >:(  What is it with that franchise and my favorite teams anyways!!! ??? ::)

Can you tell, I can't wait for spring and baseball to get here??? 8)

Rants over, back to hoops!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 20, 2007, 11:14:45 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 20, 2007, 10:25:19 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 20, 2007, 04:24:06 AM
Quote from: sac on February 19, 2007, 03:59:33 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on February 19, 2007, 02:18:20 PM
I think Orioles fans like me win some sorta glutton for punishment award. How many seasons hve YOUR teams gone without a winning season? I'm pretty sure the Orioles are coming up on 10 straight seasons. In fact, the last time we were good, didn't the Indians beat us in the playoffs? 1997 ring a bell? No pity from me. :P


If I were a baseball nut, this is where I would point to the  Detroit Tigers past 15 years before last season.  ;D ;)

The last time my favorite team won a pennant, the Motion Picture Daily Fame Poll had just named Bing Crosby "Top Male Vocalist" for the ninth straight year, and the cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki were still radioactive.

The last time my favorite team won the World Series, Henry Ford had started production of the Model T less than a month earlier; the Titanic was still a blueprint on the shop table in the Harland & Wolff shipyard in Belfast; and the United States was abuzz over whether William H. Taft or William Jennings Bryan would win the upcoming presidential election.

Checkmate. :D

Next topic?
Well, seeing as how Greg has gone over the futilities of the Cubs to win championships over the years, allow me to further elaborate on the futilities of my other favorite team, the Indians.  No World Series championships since 1948!  Yes we Indians fans have had the enjoyment of winning 2 pennants in the 90's but they were the 1st such pennants since 1954!  And they were also followed up with 2 painful losses in the WS culminating with the '97 one you so generously recalled for us DHF where the Indians were a measily 2 outs away from winning it all over the sooooooooooooo undeserving Florida Marlins and the roof came crashing down. >:( :(

I would take all the winning seasons of the Cubs and Indians combined for just ONE World Series in my lifetime.  Although, 2003 gave me some inclination that I'm never going to see one at Wrigley and it was those damned Florida Marlins again. >:(  What is it with that franchise and my favorite teams anyways!!! ??? ::)

Can you tell, I can't wait for spring and baseball to get here??? 8)

Rants over, back to hoops!

Losing is part of what makes being a Cubs fans special.  Take a look at the Red Sox.  For what seemed like millennia, the misery of Red Sox Fan was almost endearing to the rest of us outside of New England.  They had their curses and their Bill Buckners and their Bucky Dents and their Aaron Boones and it was heart wrenching.  Then they finally won it all....and immediately turned into (drumroll) the Yankees [/shudder].  The Red Sox winning the Series gave the world Fever Pitch.  Think about that....Fever Pitch. 

If the Cubs win, especially now after they've gone and spent about $87 quadrillion, they lose their broad appeal as the loveable losers and turn into Yankees Midwest.  Do you really want that?   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2007, 11:41:06 AM
Pat has caculated the top 200 QoWIs nationwide and posted the result in a couple of the multi-region rooms.  Here's the GL teams extracted from that list, FYI.  I have added the in-region win %, which can be found here (http://www.d3hoops.com/regions.php?region=greatlakes&team=m&view=standings).

Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 20, 2007, 05:01:39 AM
OK, these passed a great deal of scrutiny tonight. Through Sunday's games:

Rank   Points   Team
11   10.600   Lake Erie (.950)
20   10.318   John Carroll (.727)
21   10.316   Wooster (.895)
31   10.100   Ohio Northern (.700)
38   9.950   Wittenberg (.800)
47   9.765   Hope (.824)
60   9.500   Capital (.667)
65   9.450   Baldwin-Wallace (.700)
72   9.316   Westminster (Pa.) (.842)
75   9.261   Otterbein (.609)
82   9.174   Penn State-Behrend
115   8.619   Ohio Wesleyan (.739)
116   8.619   Carnegie Mellon (.524)
118   8.588   Calvin (.647)
132   8.435   Heidelberg (.522)
135   8.400   Bethany (.700)
148   8.188   Tri-State (.625)
159   8.083   Wilmington (.500)
164   8.000   Muskingum (.478)
166   7.944   Albion (.556)
197   7.591   Mount Union (.364)

Based on this, I'd expect Wednesday's regional rankings to be

1. Lake Erie
2. Wooster
3. JCU
4. Hope
5. Wittenberg
6. Ohio Northern
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 20, 2007, 11:58:43 AM
My  boredom at school set in so i browsed around and found the Final Four preview show from last year's set of Hoopsville broadcasts. In it they discussed the depth of the Great Lakes Region and how competiveness in the early rounds of the tournament groom the emerging team as a viable choice for Champion come Saturday night. I would add that this year this is also the case as we have seen Great Lakes teams battle against each other, especially in the OAC.

Also, as mentioned before, there are some eery paralells in the Allegheny loss and last year's Wabash loss to conclude conference play in which Wittenberg shot horridly and may have just gotten their bad game out of the way before tournament time and start another run???? If they can win Friday and Saturday at Wooster i believe their QOWI should allow them to host yet again for the first and second round games

I don't think any team is in g reat position to garner one of the first round byes, although if Wooster wins impressively and some other regional teams fall who knows, but i think we'll see the traditional 4 team brackets this next week in our region.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2007, 01:02:56 PM
a reminder...

Tuesday game information:

At Springfield:
5:30 women's quarterfinal #7 Earlham at #2 Wittenberg
7:45 men's quarterfinal #7 Hiram at #2 Wittenberg

At Meadville:
5:30 women's quarterfinal #6 Wooster at #3 Allegheny
7:30 men's quarterfinal #5 Wabash at #4 Allegheny

At Wooster:
7:30 men's quarterfinal #8 Earlham at #1 Wooster

At Delaware:
7:30 men's quarterfinal #6 Kenyon at #3 Ohio Wesleyan

At Granville:
7:30 women's quarterfinal #8 Oberlin at #1 Denison

At Gambier:
7:30 women's quarterfinal #5 Ohio Wesleyan at #4 Kenyon

There will be live audio and/or video available for some of these games, and LiveStats for others.  Click here (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/multimedia.html) for more information. 

Meadville is definitely the place to be tonight, but it's just too far away.  I probably won't decide until it's actually time to leave, but I think I'm headed to Gambier tonight.  I expect a great game between the Bishops and the Ladies on the suddenly mournful Kenyon campus (http://www.kenyon.edu/x35901.xml).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 20, 2007, 01:47:41 PM
Besided Earlham  ::)  it looks like Wabash has the only chance to Knock off the higher seed.  I am going to be pulling for the all men's college West of us.  I hope Wabash doesn't get screwed in the 1st round at Allegheny like Earlham did in 2003.  (As you can see I'm still bitter)

Good luck to all teams and especially seniors... Seems like 4 more teams will be joining Denison and Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 20, 2007, 04:01:05 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 20, 2007, 01:02:56 PM
I expect a great game between the Bishops and the Ladies on the suddenly mournful Kenyon campus (http://www.kenyon.edu/x35901.xml).

Wow.  What a strange (and sad) coincidence.  Wittenberg is going through the same thing.

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/hp/content/oh/story/news/local/2007/02/16/sns021707fazli.html

Prayers to all involved or affected.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 20, 2007, 04:08:14 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 20, 2007, 01:47:41 PM
Besided Earlham  ::)  it looks like Wabash has the only chance to Knock off the higher seed.  I am going to be pulling for the all men's college West of us.  I hope Wabash doesn't get screwed in the 1st round at Allegheny like Earlham did in 2003.  (As you can see I'm still bitter)

Good luck to all teams and especially seniors... Seems like 4 more teams will be joining Denison and Oberlin.

Well, earlhamalum, I am happy to tell you that I will be rooting for Earlham this evening and I hope that they can pull the upset.  Another Witt-Woo game would be nice, but having the rest of the tourney in the big city would be better, I think.

I will try to check in on the game while listening to Witt.

That said, I must also say ... GO TIGERS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 20, 2007, 04:15:57 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 20, 2007, 11:41:06 AM
Based on this, I'd expect Wednesday's regional rankings to be

1. Lake Erie
2. Wooster
3. JCU
4. Hope
5. Wittenberg
6. Ohio Northern

I'm a little rusty (actually, I don't have enough memorized to be rusty) on the selection criteria.

Could go over this for me again please?

Is there some room for human analysis with all this calculated QOWI?  Obviously, Lake Erie does well in the calculations but not so well in the analysis part, since they are 30th in the latest poll.

How does the regional ranking fit in?  Does it only matter in Pool C? 

In other words, what wins out in the end, the calculated ranking, or human analysis?

Thanks.

TF_73
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 20, 2007, 04:23:51 PM
I'll say that I'm always conflicted this time of year.  My head tells me that I should root for Witt so that (hopefully) the Scots will get the QOWI benefit of playing the higher-rated team on Saturday.  But I really find it hard at game time to pull for the Tigers - especially when watching in person. ::) 

Still, I'll probably pull for the W's tonight - Wooster, Witt, Wesleyan, and Wabash.

Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2007, 04:26:19 PM
The NCAA considers five "primary criteria" in determining the regional rankings and at-large bids to the tournament.  Those criteria are
Quote from: 2007 Division III Men's Basketball Handbook, pp 16-17• Win-loss percentage against regional opponents
• Quality-of-Wins-Index (only contests versus regional competition)
• In-region head-to-head competition.
• In-region results vs. common regional opponents.
• In-region results vs. regionally ranked teams
Ranked opponents are defined as those teams ranked at the time of the ranking/selection process only.
Conference postseason contest(s) is included.
Contest versus provisional members in their third and fourth years shall count in the primary criteria. Provisional members shall remain ineligible for rankings and selection.
(For more information on what Quality-of-Wins-Index, or QoWI, is and how it is calculated, please refer to the FAQ section of D3Hoops.com (http://www.d3hoops.com/faq.php?category=NCAA%20Tournament).)

A bit later on in the Handbook you find this telltale sentence:
Quote from: 2007 Division III Men's Basketball Handbook, p17Note: Media and/or coaches polls are not factors in the selection process.
[emphasis in original]

The regional committees each produce their rankings, then after the Pool A (automatic qualifiers) and Pool B (not in Pool A conferences) bids are extended, the national committee compares the highest-ranked un-selected team in each of the 8 regions, and selects one to receive a Pool C bid.  That team is replaced by the next-highest-ranked team in their region, and this process repeats until all 19 Pool C bids have been awarded.

There is "human analysis" involved, but only to the extent of comparing and contrasting teams within the five primary (and, if necessary, seven secondary) criteria.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 20, 2007, 08:37:14 PM
WoW I love Wooster Live updated stats.... Looks like Wooster has this one in the bag.  72-52 10:22 left in the 2nd half.  Tim Vandervaart is BACK  4-7 Fg 8 Rebounds   10 points...   Nice to see him able to come back.. Tom Port is killing Wooster is shooting 31-48 from the field.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 20, 2007, 08:49:12 PM
Wabash leads Allegheny 53-46 early second half in Meadville. 

Live Stats here (http://www.allegheny.edu/athletics/menbb/live/xlive.htm)

UPDATE:  60-53 Wabash with 10 minutes left.
UPDATE: Allegheny regains the lead, 71-70 with 5:19 left.
UPDATE: Wabash 75-74, 3:19 left.  Turnover 'Gheny.  Zimmer makes them pay.  77-74 Bash.  Allegheny misses the jumper, Wabash rebound.  Zimmer again!  79-74 Wabash.  2:19 left.
UPDATE: Allegheny makes a layup (Torsney).  76-79 Bash.  Timeout Allegheny.
UPDATE: Wabash by 5, under 2 minutes to go.  Allegheny answers.  78-81 Bash.  Allegheny STEAL with a minute left!  Missed 3 pointer, Wabash rebounds.
UPDATE: 40 seconds left.  Allegheny starts fouling.

Wabash's Earl Rooks is good for both foul shots.  83-78 Bash.  Allegheny drills a 3!  83-81 Bash.  Timeout Gheny.  :22 seconds left on the clock.  Wabash wants to talk it over, too.

Allegheny has 6 guys in double figures, Wabash has 4.  Wabash leads on the boards, 35-27.

Wabash makes both foul shots again.  Then Wabash fouls Allegheny on a 3 point shot.  McCloskey makes Wabash pay, making all 3.  1 point game with 4 seconds left!  84-85 Bash.

Zimmer sinks them both.  87-84 Wabash with 3 seconds to go, and that's how it stays, as Bill Babe's last second 3 point attempt misses.  Wabash wins and will face Wooster on Friday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 20, 2007, 08:54:36 PM
Scots win 94-76.   :) 

Book your weekend tickets for Timken!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 20, 2007, 09:03:46 PM
From Springfield:  Witt 54    Hiram 37 with 7:03 left
From Meadville:  Wabash 64   Allegheny 55 with 9:19 left
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 20, 2007, 09:06:05 PM
With tonight's win the Scots' QOWI drops from 10.316 to 10.000.  If Allegheny comes back against Wabash the Scots' rating falls to 9.800!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 20, 2007, 09:06:42 PM
I think I found a final from Delaware:

OWU 60, Kenyon 54

Edit: Now confirmed by Wittenberg Webcast.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 20, 2007, 09:10:13 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 20, 2007, 09:06:05 PM
With tonight's win the Scots' QOWI drops from 10.316 to 10.000.  If Allegheny comes back against Wabash the Scots' rating falls to 9.800!

Most of that QoWI damage comes from the fact that the loss makes Earlham a sub. 333 team in-region, right?  So Wooster gains 8 points (at home, below .333 team) and loses 4 of those because of the drop in the opponent they beat.  So a nice 4 point QoWI win for the Scots tonight.   :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 20, 2007, 09:22:57 PM
Witt 72   Hiram 49   Final

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 20, 2007, 09:29:00 PM
Complete men's results:

Wooster 94             Earlham 76
Wittenberg 72         Hiram 49
Ohio Wesleyan 60    Kenyon 54
Wabash 87             Allegheny 84

Semi-Final Matchups Friday night at Timken Gym:
Ohio Wesleyan vs Wittenberg at 5:30
Wabash vs Wooster at 7:45
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 20, 2007, 09:30:19 PM
Im sure no one cares about my analysis but o well

Wittenberg 72, Hiram 49

Hiram kept it close and was only down 6 at the half until Wittenberg, led by Dane Borcher's 26 points and im sure over 10 rebounds started to pull away. One thing of note and importance is that Wittenberg played most of the game without their starting 5 in at the same time, as the bench saw significant minutes today. Perhaps resting for a tough weekend ahead. I do not feel at ease about Friday's matchup at all as OWU has given us a tough tough time this year, but i think with the motivation of a locked-up NCAA bid they should show up to play.

Also of note, Wittenberg women won by 31 points. Perhaps the NCAC needs to look into having the women's officials full time  ;D as they did a significantly better job than the men's game. Awful both ways tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 20, 2007, 09:37:10 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 20, 2007, 09:29:00 PM
Complete men's results:

Wooster 94             Earlham 76
Wittenberg 72         Hiram 49
Ohio Wesleyan 60    Kenyon 54
Wabash 87             Allegheny 84

Semi-Final Matchups Friday night at Timken Gym:
Ohio Wesleyan vs Wittenberg at 5:30
Wabash vs Wooster at 7:45

Battle of the W's :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2007, 09:37:29 PM
I thought that the OWU - Kenyon affair would be close!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 20, 2007, 09:52:39 PM
Wooster looked good tonight.  Port and Cooper lit it up going for 27 and 21 respectively.  Overall Wooster shot 59.7% from the floor and 40.9% from 3 point land

Could have done a better job defensively though as the Quake shot 49.2% on the game. 

http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/boxes/2006-07/earlham3.php

Should be 2 fun games Friday!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 20, 2007, 10:06:50 PM
Witt looked downright UGLY in the first half.  Shots weren't falling, defense was okay, but not the exceptional D we tend to expect from Witt.  I'd be worried if I were this team heading into the matchup with Wesleyan.  The absence of Chojnacki has proven not to be much of a hinderance in this matchup (he only scored 6 in the OWU win, according to Bill Brown post-game tonight), and OWU kept it close in Springfield without him.

Hopefully the Tigers can turn things around like they started to in the second half.  If not, forget the rematch with Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 20, 2007, 10:21:03 PM
I am surprised the Wabash made the early week trip all the way to Meadville and pulled out the win.  I feel bad for the lil' Giants that they will have to turn around go up Wayne County after going all the way back to Indiana.  But I should always remember that Wabash always fights!!

Saw Darth Vandervaart in the box score with 10 points and 8 rbs in 14 min with 3 blocks.  It is good to have him back.  I hope he gets his legs for the weekend.

Eight (8) fouls by Bidwell and Fulk in combined 34 minutes?? 

Rest up Scots because the NCAC is coming to town and Tigers want to defend the title!!

Go Scots!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 20, 2007, 10:26:13 PM
With 9 3-pointers tonight the Scots now have 264 for the year - just 2 short of the conference record set by Kenyon in the 1994-95 season.  They're still a bit shy of the NCAA record of 595 set by Redlands in 2005!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 20, 2007, 10:35:11 PM

Honestly overall this Earlham Team ranks as one of the worst overall in the last 8 years and I think Billy_P agrees with me on that one.  I think they have 3 of the most talented players on one team at the same time during that same stretch.  I just think they lacked Depth and I don't know what they are going to do NEXT year!!

But Hat's off to Earlham for playing hard against Wooster tonight... Shooting 49% from the Field against Wooster isn't easy to do.   Wooster just out manned Earlham today shooting an OUTSTANDING percentage from the field.   Congrats to Wabash for pulling up the upset on the road.

Now I'm not a lobbyist, but I'm going to give it my best shot!  I call it Jewett 1st Team All NCAC.  They say big time player make big time plays in big time situations and now to my point...  Markous Jewett played 8 games against the top 4 NCAC teams (Wooster *3, Wittenberg *2, OWU *2, Allegheny *1)  Jewett went 57-110 from the field 51% , (23 of those shot attempts were  3 pointers), 25-36 Fat's 75%, 4.5 RPG, with an 18.6 PPG.  I would also like to add that if I was a coach of an opposing NCAC team my Defensive game plan would be stop Jewett!!  I would think that was the objectives of the Top 4 teams in the conference since 2 of the teams out work the rest of the NCAC coaching staff.   

I'm glad that I at least explained to everyone on this board why Jewett is a 1st Team all NCAC player and when it happens don't be all that shocked   ... and if it doesn't then I'll just have to accept  the fact   
If it does I'll be willing to accept Karma from each and everyone of you!





P.S.  Don't forget you can't spell jeWETt without WET
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 20, 2007, 10:43:28 PM
Good summation of Jewett's stats, Earlhamalum.

I was unable to follow the game tonight. I'll post some thoughts at some point on Earlham's season, but I'll need to look things over first.

However, I would like to say just one thing:

THANKS MARKOUS
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 21, 2007, 05:18:02 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 20, 2007, 11:14:45 AMLosing is part of what makes being a Cubs fans special.  Take a look at the Red Sox.  For what seemed like millennia, the misery of Red Sox Fan was almost endearing to the rest of us outside of New England.  They had their curses and their Bill Buckners and their Bucky Dents and their Aaron Boones and it was heart wrenching.  Then they finally won it all....and immediately turned into (drumroll) the Yankees [/shudder].  The Red Sox winning the Series gave the world Fever Pitch.  Think about that....Fever Pitch. 

If the Cubs win, especially now after they've gone and spent about $87 quadrillion, they lose their broad appeal as the loveable losers and turn into Yankees Midwest.  Do you really want that?   :)

I'd feel dirty and ashamed, but, yes, I could live with that. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zu1414 on February 21, 2007, 09:21:35 AM
Witt 72 Hiram 49...sigh.

tough end to a decent season for a young Terriers squad. so close, yet so far from that 4-5 game. now if the program wants to take some steps forward we need to finish better than #7. Next year we must: start winning home games and non-conference games to gain that "winning mindset."

One has to go back to the '00-'01 team that went 14-11 (the Terriers first season in the NCAC) to find a double digit in the left hand column

Let's hope we work hard in the off season and perhpas next year at this time we might make it to the weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 21, 2007, 09:45:00 AM
It'll be interesting to see where Jewett falls in terms of NCAC all-conference.  His numbers are definately very deserving of 1st team as earlhamalum pointed out.  Also, as earlhamalum said, it's too bad that Jewett didn't have a few more players surrounding him.  Gregory is a nice player, but Wooster did a nice job of shutting him down in the 2nd half.  He went for 10 in the 1st half and only managed one fg in the 2nd half.  Henry had a better game than he had been having down the stretch, but his overall shooting percentage still wasn't up to par with what he did over his carreer.  Jewett just had another solid game.  You take away the 3 point attempts and he's 7-10 from the field and they weren't easy bunnies.  Most of them were difficult floaters while he was driving the lane or fadeaway jumpers.  It was nice to see that the Wooster fans that were in attendance last night showed some real class in giving Jewett an ovation as he went to the bench for the final time.

As for Wooster, Tom Port is really making it difficult not to slot his name in as NCAC POY.  In his last 5 games he is averaging 21.2 ppg and all he did after garnering his first NCAC POW of the season is go out and score a season high 27 pts. on 11-17 shooting.  And 4 of his misses were from downtown.  Coach Moore pointed out on his post game interview that he thought this is the best he has seen Port play in his carreer and I would definately have to agree.  Cooper was also right there with Port getting a quiet 21 if you can call it quiet.  He hit a couple of 3's that were of the Wittenberg game winner variety!  It was great to not only see Vandervaart back on the floor, but it was even better to see the game that he turned in!  Nearly a double double in just over 14 minutes of action after being out over a month.  Not to mention the time he missed with the calf injury before his broken wrist.  He has been out quite a while and it's good to see him back and contributing!  Lastly, I just wanted to comment on Andy Van Horn.  I had been riding him a bit lately and I just wanted to say that he is taking some steps in looking like he is getting his shooter's touch back.  He went 2-2 from beyond the arc Saturday against OWU and last night he was 1-1.  I know it's not much, but when you are in the kind of season long funk he was mired in, baby steps look like giant steps and I just wanted to say that I'm hoping the stroke is back just in time to pay dividends in the post-season! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2007, 10:40:24 AM
Not to take anything away from Jewett's game last night, but I thought that a few bunnies were among the shots that he made.  They came about through some nice work on the offensive glass where he got inside position and had the easy stick-backs.

He's a nice player, in my opinion much improved from last season when he was shut down by Tim Vandervaart at Wooster.  This year he's more than a shooter, but an intelligent player who makes the most of his ability on the court.

Still, one play from last night sticks in my mind.  Near half court, while being guarded by Tom Port, Jewett lost control of the ball behind him.  Port began a move to the floor to get it, but the super fast Marty Bidwell, coming from probably fifteen feet away, beat both Port and Jewett to the ball.  Jewett dove on top of him.  As usual, no foul was called, even though Jewett decided that a forearm pushed into Bidwell's neck was in order.  I don't think Markous quite realized how close he came to being embarrassed by the man he thought he had down.

Vandervaart was remarkable.  He hit the ground two or three times, scaring the heck out of the crowd and probably Steve Moore and his staff as well.  Tim popped right back up, apparently unharmed.  He had a terrific game, including a catch and conversion at top speed in traffic late in the game.  I suspect he'll be ready to go 20-25 minutes by the weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2007, 12:13:04 PM
QuoteStill, one play from last night sticks in my mind.  Near half court, while being guarded by Tom Port, Jewett lost control of the ball behind him.  Port began a move to the floor to get it, but the super fast Marty Bidwell, coming from probably fifteen feet away, beat both Port and Jewett to the ball.  Jewett dove on top of him.  As usual, no foul was called, even though Jewett decided that a forearm pushed into Bidwell's neck was in order.  I don't think Markous quite realized how close he came to being embarrassed by the man he thought he had down

I see no relevance in this key play whatsoever, unless maybe it is too downgrade Jewett's ability or call him a thug in some way. But, the lesson as always, don't touch a Wooster player or you become A.) a player who deserves to be suspended from North Coast Athletic Conference competition for life (as was the case with the Hiram kid last year) or B.) a lesser player in the eyes of the experts who browse this forum.

Really, again, why exactly would a player having the ball stolen from him stand out as something spectacular and in what way was Jewett about to be embarrassed?

And, from now on, I am going to refer to all abilities of Wooster players as super in a not so subtle attempt to have my opinions on basketball validated.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2007, 12:20:35 PM
FINALLY (OK, a day late, but still) I've finished my Smed Power Rating Amalgamation for the regular season.

Out of 403 teams.

2. Wooster
12. Wittenberg

85. Ohio Wesleyan


196. Allegheny
230. Wabash
270. Kenyon
278. Earlham
322. Denison
333. Hiram
344. Oberlin

Wow...quite the drop off...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2007, 12:29:17 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2007, 12:13:04 PM
I see no relevance in this key play whatsoever, unless maybe it is too downgrade Jewett's ability or call him a thug in some way. But, the lesson as always, don't touch a Wooster player or you become A.) a player who deserves to be suspended from North Coast Athletic Conference competition for life (as was the case with the Hiram kid last year) or B.) a lesser player in the eyes of the experts who browse this forum.

I see no reason for the word "expert," as it is employed in this context, to be used in the plural.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2007, 12:32:57 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 21, 2007, 12:13:04 PM
QuoteStill, one play from last night sticks in my mind.  Near half court, while being guarded by Tom Port, Jewett lost control of the ball behind him.  Port began a move to the floor to get it, but the super fast Marty Bidwell, coming from probably fifteen feet away, beat both Port and Jewett to the ball.  Jewett dove on top of him.  As usual, no foul was called, even though Jewett decided that a forearm pushed into Bidwell's neck was in order.  I don't think Markous quite realized how close he came to being embarrassed by the man he thought he had down

I see no relevance in this key play whatsoever, unless maybe it is too downgrade Jewett's ability or call him a thug in some way. But, the lesson as always, don't touch a Wooster player or you become A.) a player who deserves to be suspended from North Coast Athletic Conference competition for life (as was the case with the Hiram kid last year) or B.) a lesser player in the eyes of the experts who browse this forum.

Really, again, why exactly would a player having the ball stolen from him stand out as something spectacular and in what way was Jewett about to be embarrassed?

And, from now on, I am going to refer to all abilities of Wooster players as super in a not so subtle attempt to have my opinions on basketball validated.


Bidwell blew by both Port and Jewett as if they were standing still.  That's not meant to downgrade the playing abilities of either, just pointing out a matter of fact, that Marty Bidwell is fast as hell.

Jewett's reaction to being beaten to the ball was a bit thuggish, since you ask.  Without any call to do so, he placed his forearm across Bidwell's upper chest or neck in a threatening or at least condescending way.  How was he possibly going to be embarrassed?  I suspect if he had followed through in his gesture he would have gotten his ass kicked.

Your buddy is a good basketball player.  I said so as much in my other post.  I didn't like what I saw from him on that one play and I'll stand by it whether you like it or not.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 21, 2007, 01:31:59 PM
The Wooster basketball web site says both games will be on free video Friday night.

http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/schedule.php

Karma to Wooster on this one, if I only could, I would.

GO TIGERS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2007, 01:32:51 PM
I posted the following over on the Pool C board in the multi-region area.  QoWI is just one of the five primary selection/ranking criteria, and it will change a lot over the rest of this week, but looking at it as of this moment, Wittenberg is in a very, very precarious Pool C situation if they don't win the tournament.  :o

Quote from: David Collinge on February 21, 2007, 01:09:26 PM
Here's the top 67 teams (QoWI 9.3 and up) with conference and presumptive pool added.  I am not predicting A's, I am not attempting to identify who is leading a conference for the A, I'm merely picking the first-listed team in each conference and awarding the A on that basis (disclaimers required because of endless confused misunderstanding on this subject last year.)  The B's and C's are bolded and numbered (C1-C32 and B1-B4.)  There will be 3 B and 19 C bids awarded.

   1   11.652   1   UW-Stevens Point   0.957 (22-1)   23-2 WIAC A   
   2   11.625   1   Amherst   0.958 (23-1)   24-1 NESCAC A   
   3   10.950   2   Trinity (Conn.)   0.850 (17-3)   21-3 NESCAC C1   
   4   10.810   3   Worcester Polytech   0.905 (19-2)   21-2 NEWMAC A   
   5   10.708   4   Salem State   0.920 (23-2)   23-2 MASCAC A   
   6   10.696   1   Chicago   0.818 (18-4)   20-4 UAA A   
   7   10.667   1   Mississippi College   0.952 (20-1)   22-2 ASC A   
   8   10.640   2   St. Thomas   0.880 (22-3)   22-3 MIAC A   
   9   10.600   1   Lake Erie   0.950 (19-1)   23-2 AMCC A   
   10   10.520   5   Rhode Island College   0.880 (22-3)   22-3 LEC A   
   11   10.400   1   Brockport State   0.840 (21-4)   22-4 SUNYAC A   
   12   10.381   2   Washington U.   0.810 (17-4)   19-4 UAA C2   
   13   10.375   2   Virginia Wesleyan   0.875 (21-3)   22-3 ODAC A   
   14   10.333   3   Aurora   0.913 (21-2)   23-2 NathCon B1   
   15   10.318   3   St. John's   0.864 (19-3)   19-6 MIAC C3   
   16   10.292   2   St. Lawrence   0.792 (19-5)   20-5 LL A   
   17   10.261   1   Ramapo   0.783 (18-5)   19-7 NJAC A   
   18   10.250   4   Occidental   0.813 (13-3)   18-5 SCIAC A   
   19   10.250   4   Augustana   0.833 (20-4)   20-5 CCIW A   
   20   10.238   3   DePauw   0.900 (18-2)   21-4 SCAC A   
   21   10.217   3   Rochester   0.739 (17-6)   17-7 UAA C4   
   22   10.217   6   Keene State   0.826 (19-4)   22-4 LEC C4   
   23   10.208   4   St. John Fisher   0.792 (19-5)   20-5 E8 A   
   24   10.174   5   UW-Oshkosh   0.783 (18-5)   21-5 WIAC C6   
   25   10.174   1   Johns Hopkins   0.864 (19-3)   21-4 Centennial A   
   26   10.136   2   John Carroll   0.727 (16-6)   17-8 OAC A   
   27   10.125   7   Brandeis   0.750 (18-6)   18-6 UAA C7   
   28   10.105   2   Messiah   0.842 (16-3)   19-5 MACC A   
   29   10.038   2   Stevens   0.808 (21-5)   21-5 SKY A   
   30   10.000   4   Guilford   0.870 (20-3)   21-3 ODAC C8   
   31   10.000   5   Averett   0.800 (16-4)   18-6 USASAC A   
   32   10.000   3   Catholic   0.792 (19-5)   20-5 CAC A   
   33   10.000   4   Lincoln   0.786 (11-3)   17-7 Ind B2   
   34   10.000   3   Wooster   0.900 (18-2)   23-3 NCAC A   
   35   9.960   6   Mary Hardin-Baylor   0.840 (21-4)   21-4 ASC C9   
   36   9.909   6   Whitworth   0.864 (19-3)   22-3 NWC A   
   37   9.905   7   Loras   0.810 (17-4)   19-6 IIAC A   
   38   9.900   4   Ohio Northern   0.700 (14-6)   19-6 OAC C10   
   39   9.875   5   Hood   0.792 (19-5)   20-6 CAC C11   
   40   9.870   5   New York University   0.783 (18-5)   19-5 UAA C12   
   41   9.870   6   Scranton   0.739 (17-6)   19-6 MACF A   
   42   9.864   8   UW-La Crosse   0.727 (16-6)   18-7 WIAC C13   
   43   9.800   3   Manhattanville   0.800 (20-5)   21-5 SKY C14   
   44   9.792   8   Bates   0.708 (17-7)   18-7 NESCAC C15   
   45   9.778   7   Centre   0.778 (14-4)   20-4 SCAC C16   
   46   9.773   8   Maryville (Tenn.)   0.864 (19-3)   19-6 GSAC B3   
   47   9.765   5   Hope   0.824 (14-3)   21-3 MIAA A   
   48   9.762   6   Hamilton   0.714 (15-6)   18-6 LL C17   
   49   9.739   7   Alvernia   0.913 (21-2)   22-4 PennaAC A   
   50   9.737   6   Westminster (Pa.)   0.842 (16-3)   18-7 PresAC B4/C18   
   51   9.708   9   Husson   0.875 (21-3)   21-5 NAC A   
   52   9.652   4   New Jersey City   0.696 (16-7)   17-8 NJAC C19   
   53   9.650   5   Elmhurst   0.750 (15-5)   19-5 CCIW C20   
   54   9.636   9   McMurry   0.818 (18-4)   19-6 ASC C21   
   55   9.625   8   King's   0.708 (17-7)   17-8 MACF C22   
   56   9.529   9   Lewis and Clark   0.765 (13-4)   18-6 NWC C23   
   57   9.500   6   Carthage   0.650 (13-7)   16-8 CCIW C24   
   58   9.500   7   Capital   0.667 (16-8)   16-8 OAC C24   
   59   9.476   8   Wittenberg   0.810 (17-4)   22-4 NCAC C26   
   60   9.409   7   Grinnell   0.727 (16-6)   17-6 MWC A   
   61   9.364   9   FDU-Florham   0.636 (14-8)   17-8 MACF C27   
   62   9.360   10   Tufts   0.600 (15-10)   15-10 NESCAC C28   
   63   9.348   7   Utica   0.739 (17-6)   18-6 E8 C29   
   64   9.346   11   Western New England   0.731 (19-7)   19-7 GNAC A   
   65   9.318   10   DeSales   0.727 (16-6)   18-7 MACF C30   
   66   9.316   8   Wheaton (Ill.)   0.632 (12-7)   16-8 CCIW C31   
   67   9.300   5   Rowan   0.750 (15-5)   20-5 NJAC C32   

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 21, 2007, 01:34:06 PM
wooster players are great, they always get jobbed by the refs even when it is going the opposite-yada yada yada
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 21, 2007, 01:38:10 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 21, 2007, 12:20:35 PM
FINALLY (OK, a day late, but still) I've finished my Smed Power Rating Amalgamation for the regular season.

Out of 403 teams.

2. Wooster
12. Wittenberg

85. Ohio Wesleyan


Where does Lake Erie come in?

Please describe your system a little bit.

Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2007, 01:40:56 PM
Jumping on this a bit late but, then again, I've driven 800 miles in the last 24 hours. Congrats to Wabash on the win. I think it was mentioned above to make the weekday trip to Gheny then pull out a win is impressive.

I think that shows tremendous growth and development of this team during the course of the season. I hope this season isn't over yet.  :)

Wabash Always Fights!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2007, 01:56:37 PM
Basically, it's the Massey (using MOV) and Wolfe power ratings, with a SOS factor and my own factor to measure if you WON the game, and I weight the factors accordingly.

Lake Erie is #33 in my system, lower than both Massey and Wolfe, but they have an AWFUL SOS.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2007, 02:03:40 PM
Ah, time and again I see players, out of frustration or what, lash out because of instinct. Especially if the refs aren't doing a good job of keeping control of the game. That doesn't make the player thuggish at all. In fact, believe it or not, I've been disappointed with the reactions of Wabash players (say it isn't so!) from time to time.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 21, 2007, 02:09:38 PM
David,

I haven't checked the other three primary criteria, but if regional winning % receives at least equal weighting with QOWI, you may have at least one too many 'verys' on the precariousness of Witt's pool C chances!  Several teams not very far ahead in QOWI have significantly worse %s.  Also (and there may be other examples I didn't catch), if Capital does not win the AQ, all OAC teams (and some others) will lose QOWI points because Cap will fall below .667.

Witt IS more 'bubble' than I would have guessed, but 'very, very precarious' may be a bit too strong!

And, of course, all this assumes there is not an epidemic of high-QOWI presumed-AQs who fall in their tourneys.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 21, 2007, 02:24:48 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 21, 2007, 10:40:24 AM
Still, one play from last night sticks in my mind.  Near half court, while being guarded by Tom Port, Jewett lost control of the ball behind him.  Port began a move to the floor to get it, but the super fast Marty Bidwell, coming from probably fifteen feet away, beat both Port and Jewett to the ball.  Jewett dove on top of him.  As usual, no foul was called, even though Jewett decided that a forearm pushed into Bidwell's neck was in order.  I don't think Markous quite realized how close he came to being embarrassed by the man he thought he had down.

The more we hope things change, the more they apparantly stay the same...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 21, 2007, 02:34:15 PM
To the Tale of the Tape! 

Jewett measures out at 6-6, 210. 
Bidwell comes in at 6-4 (Bidwell didn't strike me as 6-4 when I saw him in C'ville but whatever) and 185 lbs. 

Jewett has inches and weight on Marty.  What Bidwell lacks in size he apparently makes up for with superhuman strength and speed. 

The line opens with Super Marty a 2/5 favorite (having super powers and all).  It's even money that Jewett makes out of the first round.   

;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2007, 02:46:14 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 21, 2007, 02:09:38 PM
David,

I haven't checked the other three primary criteria, but if regional winning % receives at least equal weighting with QOWI, you may have at least one too many 'verys' on the precariousness of Witt's pool C chances!  Several teams not very far ahead in QOWI have significantly worse %s.  Also (and there may be other examples I didn't catch), if Capital does not win the AQ, all OAC teams (and some others) will lose QOWI points because Cap will fall below .667.

Witt IS more 'bubble' than I would have guessed, but 'very, very precarious' may be a bit too strong!

And, of course, all this assumes there is not an epidemic of high-QOWI presumed-AQs who fall in their tourneys.

If Witt beats OWU and loses to Wooster, their QoWI will be 9.522.  The lowest QoWI to earn a Pool C last year was 9.542, and QoWIs look to be up across the board this year.  Last year, only 8 teams with QoWIs above the lowest failed to earn a Pool C.  Wittenberg would have to pass at least seven teams with higher QoWIs, and that assumes that the highest QoWI team in each conferences gets the A bid.  If, say, 5 of these high-QoWI teams fail to earn the A bid, that pushes the QoWI threshold up to about 9.8 or so. 

Yes, there are four other primary criteria, and Witt looks very good in one of them (regional win %), but I think "very, very precarious" is about where they stand vis-a-vis Pool C.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 21, 2007, 02:58:09 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 21, 2007, 02:34:15 PM
To the Tale of the Tape! 

Jewett measures out at 6-6, 210. 
Bidwell comes in at 6-4 (Bidwell didn't strike me as 6-4 when I saw him in C'ville but whatever) and 185 lbs. 

Jewett has inches and weight on Marty.  What Bidwell lacks in size he apparently makes up for with superhuman strength and speed. 

The line opens with Super Marty a 2/5 favorite (having super powers and all).  It's even money that Jewett makes out of the first round.   

I swear you must get some kind of kickback from Bodog for enabling my gambling habit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2007, 04:03:39 PM
More bad news for Witt--the new regional rankings are out:

Great Lakes Region
1. Lake Erie 23-2 19-1
2. Wooster 22-3 17-2
3. John Carroll 17-8 16-6
4. Hope 21-3 14-3
5. Ohio Northern 19-6 14-6
6. Wittenberg 21-4 16-4

http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/2007/02/21/final-2007-ncaa-regional-rankings

Just looking at those last two:
ONU had QoWI of 10.100 through Sunday (the period the rankings looked at) and a region win % of .700; Witt's QoWI was 9.950 and win % was .800.  The committee weighed these factors (and the other primary criteria, especially including head-to-head) and preferred ONU.

The good news is that the Tigers could be the second GL team to be considered for a C bid, if LEC, Wooster, Hope, and either JCU or ONU win their tournaments.  But Westminster (PA) must be very close to Witt in the would-be #7 spot, and another loss by Witt could slip them behind ScotsFan's alma mater.

I think the Tigers have a much better chance to win the NCAC tournament than to lose it and get a Pool C.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 21, 2007, 04:08:27 PM
Quote from: TigerFan_1973 on February 21, 2007, 01:31:59 PM
The Wooster basketball web site says both games will be on free video Friday night.

I'm wondering if the camera man will be able to keep up with SUPER MARTY this weekend... maybe with his speed he'll just look a blurrrrrr  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2007, 04:19:05 PM
Actually, Marty runs in slow motion with some weird sound effects playing in the background - because they made him better, stronger, faster...Wooster had the technology!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 21, 2007, 04:51:36 PM
What I find really funny about all this Bidwell talk is that he's probably not even the fastest guy on Wooster's team!  That would be Brandon Johnson, I'd think.

In other news, very happy to hear "Darth" Vandervaart back in the line-up for Wooster.  Couldn't have come at a better time.  All the news from Wooster is positive:  Port's all-around effort and contribution seems to increase game by game (NCAC POY?, All-American?), Van Horn has found the range again, and Vandervaart's injury found Will filling his shoes nicely.

If the Scots can win the NCAC tournament title, they will be 20-2 (.909%) in-region, with a QoWI above 10.  They would be able to make a strong case to be a sectional host in the NCAAs if they win their way into the Sweet 16.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2007, 05:34:54 PM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 21, 2007, 04:51:36 PM
What I find really funny about all this Bidwell talk is that he's probably not even the fastest guy on Wooster's team!  That would be Brandon Johnson, I'd think.

I'm not so sure.  My guess is that it would be pretty close, but I'd bet on Bidwell.  A two-time first team All-Ohio running back (D IV) and the 200 meter champion in his league, he's fast.  On the court, he can pretty much beat any defender to the basket, but he's one of those slashers who's usually a little out of control and still moving at full speed when he gets there.  He sees the court so well, though, that he can often find an open man for an easy shot.  When he learns to combine that quick first step with being able to harness himself for little pull-up jumpers, watch out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 21, 2007, 08:28:21 PM
This would be my line up for POY,1st-2nd Team All NCAC.
There has been a few times where the NCAC had 6 players on 1st team and 6 players on 2nd team.  This is kind of a stretch... 7 guys on 1st team and 6 guys on 2nd team, but here it goes....

Player of the Year : 
#33 Thomas Port        *Wooster

1st Team:
#23 James Cooper       *Wooster
#41 Dan Hodgkinson  *Denison
#45 Dane Borchers     *Wittenberg
#40 Markous Jewett    *Earlham
#52 Andrew Zimmer   *Wabash
#33 Ben Chojnacki      *OWU

2nd Team:

#42Ryan Hollihan         *Gheny
#10 Brandon Johnson   *Wooster
#34 Tim Vandervaart    *Wooster
#50 Dustin Rudegeair   *OWU
#11 Greg Hill                *Wittenberg
#32 Quinton Spencer    *Oberlin   


Honorable Mention:
Earlhamalum  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 21, 2007, 09:29:42 PM
After lurking for a few days I want to comments on a few things, even a few that have died down...

First Team - In general the names of the players who are nominated for first team honors are the ones who can consistently create and make their own quality shot. Defense and intangibles are often mentioned, but the focus is really on offense.

The list by earlhamalum is a good one. I really like a list with 7-8 players, adding an asterick for the starters, because that is what a coach would want in numbers to a game. Port is definitely my pick for POY, even though I think Copper has improved over his POY play last year. Vandervaart is the top pick of the second team and had he not gotten hurt deserved more consideration for the first team.


Big 2 Liitle 8 - When I saw that article in the Daily Record, even before there were any postings on it, I thought it was junk. That fact that Wooster and Witt have been at the top for years is not news and the comments that it is because of lack of coaching stability and effort by the rest of the teams in the league is completely baseless.

I do wish the NCAC was more competitive. I really enjoyed the OWU-Wooster game last Saturday and walked away thinking "wouldn't it be great if the majority of conference games were like that". Looking to next year I think OWU, Wabash, Alleghany, and to a smaller extent Kenyon and Hiram will improve. Couple that with the feeling that Wooster and Witt will come back to the pack a bit, it could become one of the most competitive races in years (in the top half).

My rant on the QOWI - Maybe this should be on another board, but what really irks me about the QOWI is that it is too nervous of a metric. It was posted that Wooster got only 4 net point from their win last night against Earlham. Meanwhile, Earlham got 7 points for the loss. That just isn't right. Another point is that if you look at the discussion going back several pages there is speculation that Wooster will host if the Scots wins out, probably into the second weekend. On the other hand, someone posted that Wooster may not even get into the tournament if they lose to Witt because their QOWI drops to about 9.5 and their record against regionally ranked teams would be 1-3. For the outcome of one game to take a team from hosting status to 'out of the the tournament' is another indication of a bad metric. It think the NCAA needs to count all games (even out of Division), but limit the number a team can play.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 21, 2007, 09:32:13 PM
Quote from: johnworms on February 21, 2007, 09:05:22 PM
Final: Otterbein 52, Ohio Northern 51. Last second shot by OTT's Ousely goes in. The Cards advance to take on Capital for round three Friday night.

Potentially good news there for Wittenberg, considering ONU was ahead of them in the GL standings.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2007, 10:23:02 PM
Other regional scores of interest:

John Carroll 102  Wilmington 88
Capital 82  Muskingum 60
Baldwin-Wallace 95  Heidelberg 82
Hope 89  Alma 49

OAC Tourney Semis are:
B-W vs. JCU
CAP vs. OTT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2007, 10:34:52 PM
The best part of Wooster's win last night vs. Earlham was Tim Vandervaart's solid play (10 points, 8 boards in limited minutes) after returning from his injury.  :)  Welcome back Tim!

If Vandervaart can play close to his usual high level of effectiveness, Wooster has a real chance to make a run in the NCAA tournament.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 22, 2007, 02:47:36 AM
Quote from: goscots on February 21, 2007, 09:29:42 PM
After lurking for a few days I want to comments on a few things, even a few that have died down...

First Team - In general the names of the players who are nominated for first team honors are the ones who can consistently create and make their own quality shot. Defense and intangibles are often mentioned, but the focus is really on offense.

The list by earlhamalum is a good one. I really like a list with 7-8 players, adding an asterick for the starters, because that is what a coach would want in numbers to a game. Port is definitely my pick for POY, even though I think Copper has improved over his POY play last year. Vandervaart is the top pick of the second team and had he not gotten hurt deserved more consideration for the first team.


Big 2 Liitle 8 - When I saw that article in the Daily Record, even before there were any postings on it, I thought it was junk. That fact that Wooster and Witt have been at the top for years is not news and the comments that it is because of lack of coaching stability and effort by the rest of the teams in the league is completely baseless.

I do wish the NCAC was more competitive. I really enjoyed the OWU-Wooster game last Saturday and walked away thinking "wouldn't it be great if the majority of conference games were like that". Looking to next year I think OWU, Wabash, Alleghany, and to a smaller extent Kenyon and Hiram will improve. Couple that with the feeling that Wooster and Witt will come back to the pack a bit, it could become one of the most competitive races in years (in the top half).

My rant on the QOWI - Maybe this should be on another board, but what really irks me about the QOWI is that it is too nervous of a metric. It was posted that Wooster got only 4 net point from their win last night against Earlham. Meanwhile, Earlham got 7 points for the loss. That just isn't right. Another point is that if you look at the discussion going back several pages there is speculation that Wooster will host if the Scots wins out, probably into the second weekend. On the other hand, someone posted that Wooster may not even get into the tournament if they lose to Witt because their QOWI drops to about 9.5 and their record against regionally ranked teams would be 1-3. For the outcome of one game to take a team from hosting status to 'out of the the tournament' is another indication of a bad metric. It think the NCAA needs to count all games (even out of Division), but limit the number a team can play.

Wooster got eight points for beating Earlham, not four. Unless you mean something else by "net points" which I'm not understanding.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on February 22, 2007, 08:46:32 AM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 20, 2007, 09:10:13 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 20, 2007, 09:06:05 PM
With tonight's win the Scots' QOWI drops from 10.316 to 10.000.  If Allegheny comes back against Wabash the Scots' rating falls to 9.800!

Most of that QoWI damage comes from the fact that the loss makes Earlham a sub. 333 team in-region, right?  So Wooster gains 8 points (at home, below .333 team) and loses 4 of those because of the drop in the opponent they beat.  So a nice 4 point QoWI win for the Scots tonight.   :-\

The "net points" comes from the fact that the loss dropped Earlham into a lower percentage category.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 22, 2007, 10:23:29 AM
Pat, we were just trying to make all the adjustments at once.  Since Wooster's defeat of Earlham made Earlham sub. 333 in-region, Wooster gained 8 pts for the win, but lost 4 pts from the two conference games against Earlham when Earlham was a .333-.500 team.  Wittenberg also lost those 4 points because Earlham slid into the lowest category.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on February 22, 2007, 01:43:22 PM
A couple of questions for the Woosterites.....I'm going to make the "roadtrip" to Wooster from Chicago to check out the Wabash upset....Will I have any problems getting a stub for the game?? Are there any traffic problems (detours) to be aware of?? This will be my first trip to the Wooster area.

Will this be a doubleheader or two single games?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2007, 01:49:21 PM
Here's a preview of the weekend, including links to ticket information and coverage (audio/video/LiveStats):

Link (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2006-07/ncac_preview.php)

roadtrip, no detours that I know of.  Get off the Turnpike at Milan and just take US 250 all the way to Wooster.  Drive safely!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2007, 01:59:53 PM
It looks like Tim Vandervaart wasn't the only all-conference performer to make his comeback in the quarterfinals:

Quote from: Hugh HowardThe Bishops have overcome a significant injury down the stretch, as their top player, Ben Chojnacki, went down with a serious knee injury Jan. 31. He didn't play the rest of the regular season and was limited to just three minutes in the Kenyon game.
[emphasis added]

Chojnacki's comeback game may not have been as impressive as Vandervaart's, but it's still got to be an unpleasant sight for Witt.

OWU/Kenyon boxscore (http://bishops.owu.edu/owum0220.htm)

Jeez, I wish we could scare up a regular OWU poster.  Where have you gone, Barry Robinson?  A nation turns its lonely eyes to you...woo woo woo...woo woo woo. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2007, 02:56:48 PM
Here's still more bad news for a possible Wittenberg Pool C bid:

Pool C Shocker: Cut Back to 18! (http://www.d3hoops.com/)

Don't get me wrong; I really, really want Witt to get a Pool C bid.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on February 22, 2007, 03:17:01 PM
DC

Thanks for the info....I'm hoping for the same effort as the last time we faced Woo but with different results
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2007, 03:29:05 PM
How in the h-e-double hockey sticks can the NCAA screw that up and only realize it NOW????

The Messiah loss looms YOUUUUUGE (tm Donald Trump)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 22, 2007, 03:58:13 PM
wow two rough pieces worth noting today, what else could we find out
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WillieBrown on February 22, 2007, 04:01:39 PM
Witt not getting an at large would be a joke. You guys are blowing this wayyyyy out of proportion. We could lose to ohio wesleyan and still get in.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ChicagoHopeNut on February 22, 2007, 04:04:45 PM
Quote from: WillieBrown on February 22, 2007, 04:01:39 PM
Witt not getting an at large would be a joke. You guys are blowing this wayyyyy out of proportion. We could lose to ohio wesleyan and still get in.

I wouldn't be so sure about that. I don't think Witt is a sure thing at all if they lose to OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2007, 04:05:07 PM
Quote from: WillieBrown on February 22, 2007, 04:01:39 PMWe could lose to ohio wesleyan and still get in.

I hope you're right...twice.   ;);D

But if Witt were to lose to OWU, it'd take a miracle to get the Tigers into the tournament...and the NCAA has outlawed miracles.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 22, 2007, 04:06:32 PM
Quote from: roadtrip on February 22, 2007, 03:17:01 PM
....I'm hoping for the same effort as the last time we faced Woo but with different results

My guess would be that if Wabash puts forth the same effort that they did a couple weeks ago at Richmond they'll be looking at a double-digit loss. Except for Port and Bidwell the Scots didn't play very well in that game. Plus now the Scots have Vandervaart back!  Not that the upset couldn't happen, but Wabash will need to be at their very best to have a chance.  And as OWU found out last Saturday, sometimes that's not enough against the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 22, 2007, 04:12:36 PM
Can someone please clarify this for me?  Who has the automatic bid into the tournament from the NCAC?  Is it the winner of the conference or the end-of-season tournament?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on February 22, 2007, 04:16:40 PM
The tournament winner gets the conference AQ. There was some discussion earlier in the season about the regular season winner being recognized as the conference champion. Someone would have to go back to the old All-Sports tabulations to see which the NCAC uses for its calculations.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2007, 04:24:56 PM
Did I miss a meeting about Vandervaart?  You'd swear he was Nelson, Ellenwood, and Gorman wrapped up in one neat little bundle.  He's a good player, but come on...it's not like Wooster did horribly without him. 

I'm inclined to believe that Witt is in if and only if they win the NCAC auto bid.  The numbers just aren't in Wittenberg's favor.  Losing that game against Allegheny did a ton of damage to Witt with respect to the selection criteria.  The reality is that the records in our conference don't lend themselves well to high QoWIs.  The margin of error for teams in our league is really pretty small. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 22, 2007, 04:37:51 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 22, 2007, 04:24:56 PM
Did I miss a meeting about Vandervaart?  You'd swear he was Nelson, Ellenwood, and Gorman wrapped up in one neat little bundle.  He's a good player, but come on...it's not like Wooster did horribly without him. 

I wasn't claiming that Vandervaart is the second coming of Bryan Nelson, but he does give the Scots a much more legitimate inside threat on the offensive end. Evan Will has done admirably in Tim's absence and is probably a better defender, but he is too inconsistent offensively. The inside game that Vandervaart brings makes it that much harder to deal with the plethora of shooters on the perimiter.  My point was just that the Scots are a better team with Vandervaart than without him.

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 22, 2007, 04:24:56 PMI'm inclined to believe that Witt is in if and only if they win the NCAC auto bid.  The numbers just aren't in Wittenberg's favor.  Losing that game against Allegheny did a ton of damage to Witt with respect to the selection criteria.  The reality is that the records in our conference don't lend themselves well to high QoWIs.  The margin of error for teams in our league is really pretty small. 

Absoultely.  Witt's done if they don't win the NCAC tourney.  I'd love for them to make it, but not at the Scots' expense!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2007, 05:11:38 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 22, 2007, 04:37:51 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 22, 2007, 04:24:56 PMI'm inclined to believe that Witt is in if and only if they win the NCAC auto bid.  The numbers just aren't in Wittenberg's favor.  Losing that game against Allegheny did a ton of damage to Witt with respect to the selection criteria.  The reality is that the records in our conference don't lend themselves well to high QoWIs.  The margin of error for teams in our league is really pretty small. 

Absoultely.  Witt's done if they don't win the NCAC tourney.  I'd love for them to make it, but not at the Scots' expense!

I don't think you have much to worry about.  The Scots look like a lock for at-large selection should it come to that.  Unless of course the NCAA forgets to carry a 1 somewhere...  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 22, 2007, 05:26:01 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 22, 2007, 05:11:38 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 22, 2007, 04:37:51 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 22, 2007, 04:24:56 PMI'm inclined to believe that Witt is in if and only if they win the NCAC auto bid.  The numbers just aren't in Wittenberg's favor.  Losing that game against Allegheny did a ton of damage to Witt with respect to the selection criteria.  The reality is that the records in our conference don't lend themselves well to high QoWIs.  The margin of error for teams in our league is really pretty small. 

Absoultely.  Witt's done if they don't win the NCAC tourney.  I'd love for them to make it, but not at the Scots' expense!

I don't think you have much to worry about.  The Scots look like a lock for at-large selection should it come to that.  Unless of course the NCAA forgets to carry a 1 somewhere...  :)

Let's face it, the only way the Scots are in danger is if they lose to Wabash. What are the odds of that?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 22, 2007, 06:50:54 PM
guys anything can happen. wittenberg has been up against the wall all season. no one thought they could compete this year after losing 4 starters, no one thought they would be as good after caraway got hurt, but time and time again they have risen to the occasion. who's to say they won't do that again. I think its ridiculous for a team to have 4 losses all year and probably at this point in time wouldn't be in the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2007, 07:22:53 PM
I don't think Witt is in unless they make the final - and then even then it may be iffy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 22, 2007, 08:21:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 21, 2007, 04:03:39 PM
The good news is that the Tigers could be the second GL team to be considered for a C bid, if LEC, Wooster, Hope, and either JCU or ONU win their tournaments.  But Westminster (PA) must be very close to Witt in the would-be #7 spot, and another loss by Witt could slip them behind ScotsFan's alma mater.

I think the Tigers have a much better chance to win the NCAC tournament than to lose it and get a Pool C.
While I would love to see my alma mater make into the dance for the first time since making the move from NAIA to DII to DIII, if it came at the expense of Wittenberg, that would be a shame.  Although, now that the NCAA has come out and admitted they made a mistake in the number of Pool C's and B's, it looks like my Titans could benefit from the extra Pool B as they were on the outside looking in before for a Pool B.  Even with that said, I would still be under the opinion that Witt is a better team than Westminster, even though I haven't seen the Titans in person this season.  Westminster couldn't even run the table in the PrAC.   They did turn things around after starting the season losing 4 of their 1st 5 games to clinch the PrAC regular season title, but I just can't get by thinking what Witt might do with Westminster's schedule. 

Still, I can't say that I would be broken hearted to see Westminster in the dance and Witt on the outside looking in!  ;)  Who woulda thunk it??? ;D  8)

BTW, I'm of the opinion that Witt need the automatic to get into the dance.  Had they not lost @ Allegheny, they might be finding themselves in a little more comfortable position, but that loss, combined with the NCAA's gaff, and I would say it's automatic bid or no bid at all for Witt.

And while we're on the subject of Witt's chances of getting in without the automatic:

Quote from: WillieBrown on February 22, 2007, 04:01:39 PM
Witt not getting an at large would be a joke. You guys are blowing this wayyyyy out of proportion. We could lose to ohio wesleyan and still get in.
Willie, aren't you giving us any Vegas odds??? I thought you were our Vegas insider on this board???  You seem pretty confident so I'm assuming you must know something about the odds... ;) 8)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 22, 2007, 10:25:02 PM
Well, the odds of Westminster making the tourney just took a big hit tonight. 

Grove City   -  86
Westminster - 67

Figures, the first time I talk them up all season long, they go and get routed at home in what may end up ultimately costing them a bid to the NCAA.  Looks like the Titans are once again ECAC bound?! ::) ???

Being a Michigan fan, this is all too familiar as the Wolverines have made a habit of recahing the NIT, which, IMO is the DI equivalent to the ECAC?!   ::)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 23, 2007, 06:30:56 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 22, 2007, 01:59:53 PM
It looks like Tim Vandervaart wasn't the only all-conference performer to make his comeback in the quarterfinals:

Quote from: Hugh HowardThe Bishops have overcome a significant injury down the stretch, as their top player, Ben Chojnacki, went down with a serious knee injury Jan. 31. He didn't play the rest of the regular season and was limited to just three minutes in the Kenyon game.
[emphasis added]

Chojnacki's comeback game may not have been as impressive as Vandervaart's, but it's still got to be an unpleasant sight for Witt.

OWU/Kenyon boxscore (http://bishops.owu.edu/owum0220.htm)

Jeez, I wish we could scare up a regular OWU poster.  Where have you gone, Barry Robinson?  A nation turns its lonely eyes to you...woo woo woo...woo woo woo. ;D

Two pop music quotes in one day? David, you are seriously beginning to scare me!

(BTW, I miss Barry Robinson, too.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 23, 2007, 07:01:04 AM
From the NCAC Tourney Preview page (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2006-07/ncac_preview.php), a reminder to Scots' fans attending the game tonight:

Gold Rush Friday: Wooster fans are encouraged to wear Gold shirts to Friday's game against Wabash
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 23, 2007, 08:50:28 AM
a touch of gold mixed with a little red invasion clashes
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 23, 2007, 08:57:34 AM
Stevens Tech lost to Old Westbury, so another "C" bit is locked up, probably.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 23, 2007, 09:19:31 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 23, 2007, 08:50:28 AM
a touch of gold mixed with a little red invasion clashes

Red and gold? Blech. Who wants to end up looking like these clowns?:

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi9.tinypic.com%2F2egcms7.jpg&hash=62660c6d4149302535d7f7f90ff8cfb6990e8102)

Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 23, 2007, 06:30:56 AMBTW, I miss Barry Robinson, too.

Seriously, what happened to him? He was the one regular OWU guy here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2007, 09:56:02 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 23, 2007, 09:19:31 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 23, 2007, 08:50:28 AM
a touch of gold mixed with a little red invasion clashes

Red and gold? Blech. Who wants to end up looking like these clowns?:

You really just couldn't resist on that one, could you?   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 23, 2007, 10:06:20 AM
true although every time needs a revival at some point.....

are they selling presale tickets for tomorrow night tonight? if that's a little too confusing after tonight's game will they be selling tickets for tomorrow night's game because i doubt they graciously would send tickets back with the Witt faithful if need be
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 23, 2007, 10:19:27 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 23, 2007, 10:06:20 AM
true although every time needs a revival at some point.....

are they selling presale tickets for tomorrow night tonight? if that's a little too confusing after tonight's game will they be selling tickets for tomorrow night's game because i doubt they graciously would send tickets back with the Witt faithful if need be

In the past they have pre-sold tickets for the Saturday game on Friday night.  I think (but I'm not sure) that they're for sale after tonight's first game, then again after the 2nd game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 23, 2007, 11:03:03 AM
thanks bud-i gues i'll have to get on my phone in between tables at work and see if they won and 2-get someone i know who's going to buy my ticket lol
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 23, 2007, 11:40:49 AM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 23, 2007, 07:01:04 AM
Gold Rush Friday: Wooster fans are encouraged to wear Gold shirts to Friday's game against Wabash
That's funny.  I must've had a premonition or something because yesterday I visited the COW Bookstore and went in and purchased a new gold C.O.W. shirt. ;D  I was thinking that it would be cool if the fans did something like that so I wanted to be prepared.  I also bought a new black tee in case there is another 'Blackout' as the 'Nuff said' t's didn't work out so well. ::)  At least the Witt fans had some fun with them. 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 23, 2007, 11:48:17 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 23, 2007, 09:56:02 AMYou really just couldn't resist on that one, could you?

Nope.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2007, 11:53:18 AM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 23, 2007, 07:01:04 AM
Gold Rush Friday: Wooster fans are encouraged to wear Gold shirts to Friday's game against Wabash

A monochromatic crowd by itself matters not...you must couple the Insert Color Here-Out promotion with the giveaway of trendy electronics, specifically iPods.  That's a combination that cannot be stopped as demonstrated in Richmond a couple of weeks ago.  My research tells me that substituting for the iPod with something like a Zune or some other off-branded mp3 player will backfire mightily against the home team.  It's gotta be an iPod.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2007, 11:55:25 AM
This is Wooster, Ohio we're talking about.  "Trendy electronics" around here include touch-tone phones and in-dash 8-track tape players.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 23, 2007, 11:57:18 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 23, 2007, 11:55:25 AM
This is Wooster, Ohio we're talking about.  "Trendy electronics" around here include touch-tone phones and in-dash 8-track tape players.  ;D

As opposed to Richmond, Indiana? Aren't they still arguing about buttons versus hook-and-eyes?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2007, 12:00:03 PM
No argument; buttons are "worldly."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 23, 2007, 12:47:55 PM
No reason to spend Ipod-like dollars.  About a week ago, from tigerdirect.com, I bought the Ultra Hyda, a pocked-sized combination mp3 player, FM radio, and digital voice recorder.  It has 1 gig of memory (there is a 2 gig version) which means that it can hold upwards of 200 songs at a time.  Music is easily loaded or removed from a USB port.  Although the menu for the voice recorder is a little tricky, it works fine once you get the hang of it.  The mp3 player and tuner work great (the tuner picks up more stations than my car radio) with terrific sound.  After rebate, this thing cost me all of $30.  It's cheaper now:

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=2430465&CatId=2475
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 23, 2007, 01:04:09 PM
It has to be an iPod, preferably a mini. Otherwise, students will look at you cross-eyed.

Of course, that would do me no good since I just passed the 13,000 song mark on my 80gb model. Rock and / or roll!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 23, 2007, 01:31:52 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 23, 2007, 01:04:09 PM
It has to be an iPod, preferably a mini. Otherwise, students will look at you cross-eyed.

I'm 59.  Students look at me cross-eyed anyway.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerFan_1973 on February 23, 2007, 01:54:10 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 23, 2007, 07:01:04 AM
From the NCAC Tourney Preview page (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2006-07/ncac_preview.php), a reminder to Scots' fans attending the game tonight:

Gold Rush Friday: Wooster fans are encouraged to wear Gold shirts to Friday's game against Wabash

I have my red and white shirt on.

Go Tigers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 23, 2007, 01:59:49 PM
I created an in-game updates page for the region, please feel free to use it for tonights games

http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=5127.75

Just to keep the boards cleaner, thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 23, 2007, 02:05:21 PM
Okay so if I were in attendance for tonight's game I'd have to bring two shirts Red for Coach Dewitt and the Bishops and sorry Fellow Indiana School I'd need a Gold shirt because I'm pulling for Coach Moore and the Scots...

Oh Billy_P it was a year ago today when we took off for Wooster, Ohio... Looks like we will not be gracing BW3's with our presence and drinking our sorrows away.  At least we will not being doing that in Wooster  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 23, 2007, 02:59:26 PM
good luck to witt tonight-i think they should prevail as they've had plenty of time to fix their problems against the Bishops. Hopefully Coach Taylor packed his "net cutting" suit (all red) with him because i think he may need it.

if witt wins tonight-i'll be the witt student holding "a sign" if anyone would like to  meet me
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2007, 07:06:51 PM
Artie can leave the suit on the rack.  OWU made sure he won't be needing it by defeating Witt 57-52 in tonight's first semifinal. 

I think this probably puts the finishing blow on Witt's Pool C hopes. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2007, 08:07:28 PM
8:13 remaining in the First Half:  Wooster 28  Wabash 17
James Cooper with 10 points and Wabash takes a timeout.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2007, 08:20:54 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 47  Wabash 31

Wooster took control of this game midway through the first half.  Scots are being led by James Cooper with 14 points and Tim Vandervaart with 10 points.

Wabash is being led by Andrew Zimmer with 12 points and Earl Rooks with 9 points.

Wooster shot 61% from the floor in the first half. :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2007, 09:01:41 PM
~5:30 remaining Wooster 88  Wabash 60
Scots have cleared the bench; still shooting over 60% from the floor
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2007, 09:10:29 PM
Final:  Wooster 92  Wabash 80

Wooster gets the win and advances to the NCAC tourney final game.  :) Scots were led tonight by James Cooper with 18 points, Tim Vandervaart with 16 points and Brandon Johnson with 13 points.

Wabash was led by Andrew Zimmer with 23 points and Chase Haltom with 18 points.

Wooster led by 32 points in the 2nd half and then Wabash hit several three pointers down the stretch to narrow the final margin.

Wooster is now 24-3. ;D   Next up is Ohio Wesleyan tomorrow night.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 23, 2007, 09:13:09 PM
For Wabash to get to the semis after the way the conference season started showed a lot of heart and guts. I'm proud of the LGs for the effort they showed over the course of the season. I hope next year is better. Too bad for Ryan Stephens to end his career with a broken nose. Way to go LGs. Wabash Always Fights!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 23, 2007, 09:21:23 PM
When I was at Wooster, I always dreaded the drives to Wabash, Earlham, and Allegheny especially for midweek games when we had to drive back after the games.  Seeing Wabash's schedule this week, I can not help but sympathize with them.  I think the amount of travel they did for the Allegheny and the Wooster games finally caught up with them during the Wooster game today.  There were moments during the beginning of the second half when Wooster went on a scoring binge that I thought the Wabash players gave up.  Only Andrew Zimmer was giving it all.  At least that's how I saw it.

To win the game, I think Wabash needed at least three players of Zimmer's caliber.  Even though he played for a losing team, I will crown him my player for the game.  His team-mates led him down.

Congratulations on the season to Wabash.  10-16 is not  such a terrible point to build on for next season.  I look forward to seeing them next season.

Now let's wait and see if OWU can hand us another upset tomorrow versus the Scots.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 23, 2007, 10:13:26 PM
When I was at WOO, NCAC did not include a team from Springfield or teams Indiana.  However, covering the Scots for the Voice, that trip from PA was a tough one. 

For some reason, I dreaded the trip to OWU, too but Kenyon was always a fun trip.  I once went with the football team to Rochester, NY and that was a blast (loss though).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2007, 10:19:04 PM
Saturday's matchups for 4 Automatic NCAA Bids in the Great Lakes Region:

NCAC:  Wooster vs. Ohio Wesleyan

OAC:  John Carroll vs. Capital

MIAA:  Calvin vs. Hope

AMCC:  Lake Erie vs. Penn St.-Behrend
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 23, 2007, 10:27:53 PM
I know some around Wittenberg are still optimistic, but I think that this concludes the season for the Tigers.  While it sucks that a 22-5 record probably won't be good enough for a tournament berth, the fact still remains that Wittenberg simply didn't get it done down the stretch.  Losing 2 of your last 3, including one to an Allegheny team that probably really hurt Witt's QoWI, is not the way to impress the selection committee.

And, as much as it pains me, I guess I have to root for Wooster tomorrow night, because if OWU wins the tournament title, we all know Wooster would then lock up a Pool C, all but officially ending Witt's slim chances for a spot.

Oh well...at least I still have my Mavericks....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 23, 2007, 10:29:18 PM
Also of note, a couple of quality GLakes region senior are going home probably.

Dane Borchers and Torri Davis are probably done.

Borches (an COW thorn in the side) for 10 pts, 20rbs and 3 blks in his likely last game and Davis goes for 15 pts and 19 rbs...two All-Region quality players that will be missed in the region!!

Unfortunately, ONU's Greg Badenhop did not go out as gracefully:

2-10  shooting and 1-6 from 3pt land for 7 pts in loss to Otterbein that I did not see coming. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 23, 2007, 10:45:33 PM
So what happened on the play where Stephens broke his nose. I see he got a T, was that the play, or did it happen after.

Ryan is an outstanding young man and I wish him the best.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 23, 2007, 11:10:26 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 23, 2007, 10:45:33 PM
So what happened on the play where Stephens broke his nose. I see he got a T, was that the play, or did it happen after.

Ryan is an outstanding young man and I wish him the best.

From what I heard on the broadcast he took an elbow to the nose and then after the play was over shoved the Wooster player to whom the elbow belonged. Obviously, someone who was there could give a better account.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2007, 11:18:26 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 23, 2007, 11:10:26 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 23, 2007, 10:45:33 PM
So what happened on the play where Stephens broke his nose. I see he got a T, was that the play, or did it happen after.

Ryan is an outstanding young man and I wish him the best.

From what I heard on the broadcast he took an elbow to the nose and then after the play was over shoved the Wooster player to whom the elbow belonged. Obviously, someone who was there could give a better account.

That's pretty much how I saw it on the video stream tonight.  The Wooster player in question was Melick I believe.  We can thank our lucky stars Stephens didn't get aggressive with Super Marty...no telling what could have happened there.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2007, 11:39:56 PM
I think it might have happened under the opposite basket on the previous play.  Stephens was obviously very agitated; he bumped into a Wooster player at the Woo end after the Wabash bucket, growled his way up the court, then got bumped hard by one of his teammates cutting through the lane at the offensive end, then had his little fracas with Melick; and it looked like he had something choice to say to the ref after he was whistled for fouling Melick.  The ref promptly teed him up, and Stephens walked angrily to the bench, stopping briefly to put a cloth to his nose, and then left the floor.  At the time, I though he was just venting his frustration, being a senior getting thumped in his last game, but having a nose broken to trigger the whole sequence makes more sense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2007, 11:51:22 PM
Congratulations to the Wittenberg seniors on their very successful college careers, which included two NCAC tournament titles and one trip to the Final Four, and likely ended tonight.  Special congratulations to Dane Borchers, who had an outstanding career and will soon be named an all-NCAC 1st teamer.  Although he played for my team's arch-rival, I think he always played hard, skillfully, and with class, and I've enjoyed watching him play.  Best of luck to Dane and all the other graduating seniors on all of the NCAC teams.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 24, 2007, 12:00:32 AM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on February 23, 2007, 10:29:18 PM
Borchers (an COW thorn in the side) for 10 pts, 20rbs and 3 blks in his likely last game ... 

The 20 boards for Borchers is an NCAC tourney record.  At least he'll have that to hang his hat on.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 24, 2007, 12:09:32 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 23, 2007, 11:51:22 PM
Congratulations to the Wittenberg seniors on their very successful college careers, which included two NCAC tournament titles and one trip to the Final Four, and likely ended tonight.  Special congratulations to Dane Borchers, who had an outstanding career and will soon be named an all-NCAC 1st teamer.  Although he played for my team's arch-rival, I think he always played hard, skillfully, and with class, and I've enjoyed watching him play.  Best of luck to Dane and all the other graduating seniors on all of the NCAC teams.  :)

I add my congratulations!  The "Great Dane" usually brought his best against Wooster, and as to that, I can't say that I'm too sad to see him go!   :) :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 24, 2007, 12:15:04 AM
For what its worth, Wooster's QOWI may (or may not) be 10.000 after tonight's games. Possibilities for the final rating are:

Wooster and Calvin win: 10.091
Wooster and Hope win: 10.000
OWU and Calvin win: 9.727
OWU and Hope win: 9.636

While I think that the Scots should probably make the tourney win or lose tomorrow, those ratings if they lose are awfully low.  Actually, the rating if they win isn't all that great either!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2007, 12:22:31 AM
Well, it just seemed out of character for Ryan, but I can see the frustration at an elbow catching you in the nose, breaking it, having the official say he didn't see it, and then thinking he was jostled again by the same player. He deserved to end his career on a better note than a T and a busted schnozz, especially when no foul was called when he got his nose broken because the refs didn't see it.

The NCAC's weakness is probably going to work against Wooster. It's already probably bitten Wittenberg in the tuchus, since most of the rest of the conference were pretty miserable in-region out-of-conference.

I bet that Witt is better than half or 2/3 of the "C" teams, but thanks to this infernal system won't get a sniff. I could be wrong...but...I doubt it.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 24, 2007, 12:29:28 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2007, 12:22:31 AM
I bet that Witt is better than half or 2/3 of the "C" teams, but thanks to this infernal system won't get a sniff. I could be wrong...but...I doubt it.

I'd bet you're right - and better than 3/4 of the "A" teams!

But, like it or not (NOT!), that is our system.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 24, 2007, 12:41:08 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2007, 12:22:31 AM
I bet that Witt is better than half or 2/3 of the "C" teams, but thanks to this infernal system won't get a sniff. I could be wrong...but...I doubt it.

I made a post to similar effect on the OAC board, where I noted that I think (at least) 3 OAC teams- B-W, John Carroll, and Capital- could give Witt/Woo very competitive basketball games.  However, in this instance, the strength of that league at the top has hurt these quality teams.  JCU and Cap are playing for the title tomorrow and probably only JCU could get a C if they lose.  If Capital loses I think they are out of luck, even though they were co-champions in the toughest league in one of the toughest regions nationally in d3 basketball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 24, 2007, 12:56:44 AM
Quote from: scotsbrod on February 24, 2007, 12:41:08 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2007, 12:22:31 AM
I bet that Witt is better than half or 2/3 of the "C" teams, but thanks to this infernal system won't get a sniff. I could be wrong...but...I doubt it.

I made a post to similar effect on the OAC board, where I noted that I think (at least) 3 OAC teams- B-W, John Carroll, and Capital- could give Witt/Woo very competitive basketball games.  However, in this instance, the strength of that league at the top has hurt these quality teams.  JCU and Cap are playing for the title tomorrow and probably only JCU could get a C if they lose.  If Capital loses I think they are out of luck, even though they were co-champions in the toughest league in one of the toughest regions nationally in d3 basketball.

I feel your pain. (What? Bill, get out of here!)  By general consensus, the CCIW is the #1 league this year, yet may get only the AQ in.  (If Elmhurst beats Augie, Augie is a lock for a C, but Elmhurst would be very iffy.)  IMO NCC, Wheaton, and Carthage would all beat many Cs, but have zero chance of getting to prove it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 24, 2007, 09:04:02 AM
Notes from Timken:

I missed the events prior to what happened with Melick and Stephens in front of the Wooster bench, but most people sitting around me thought that Melick probably got him with an elbow right there.  Melick will stick them out there.  I don't think he does it on purpose, but rather because he's a big kind of gawky guy growing into his body.  Stephens, I don't think, could have cared less if it was on purpose, once his nose was broken, and understandably shoved Melick in the back (not all that hard, but obvious) prompting the T.

OWU drove me crazy in their nearly successful attempt to blow a 16-point lead.  They first led by that margin with 7:21 remaining.  Rather than run some clock on their possessions they persisted in taking quick bad shots and missing them.  Despite this, neither team scored and OWU still led by 16 until Borchers hit a jumper with 4:35 to go.

It was only at this point that OWU began to try to milk the clock forcing Wittenberg to foul.  They did, and the choking Bishops missed 5 free throws while Wittenberg made a miraculous 6 3-pointers in a row, cutting the lead to 3 with 29 seconds remaining! 

OWU held on, but even on Witt's last three-point attempt, which came with only 2 seconds on the clock and Witt down 5, Rudegeair went for the block.  He got it, but could easily have committed a foul which would have given Witt one final attempt at a miracle win, especially if the ball had fallen through the hoop.  OWU played the last 7:21 about as unintelligently as possible, nearly negating a terrific, and smart, effort prior to that.

Wally - That smiley face makes all the difference when you call him Super Marty.  Funny. :)

Another Bidwell story, gleaned from his dad:

Marty Bidwell senior set the single-game record for points in a game at Ohio's Bishop Fenwick high school 32 years ago.  44 points.  That record stood for a clean 30 years until his son (Super Marty) scored 45 on exactly the same date that his father had set the record so long ago.

It's my guess that Wooster's freshmen will be doing a serious amount of running whenever the team next practices.  Their performance last night was somewhat less than amazing as they failed to get back on defense and looked completely confused on offense while getting outscored 20-4.

I'm getting a haircut today but will not be going anywhere near the vicinity of Devin Fulk's barber.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zu1414 on February 24, 2007, 09:11:01 AM
I have never been a big Witt fan, after watching them beat my Terriers consistently like a drum over the years, however, Witt is really getting shafted in my mind if they don't make the tourney.

The way this tourney is set up, is just, well, perplexing. If these conferences do not qualify for automatic bids, please tell me why there needs to be a separate Pool for them?

Eliminate this POOL business, select the best remaining teams from the non-conference winners and have the regular season count for the league champs.

Do the D-I big time football people run this in their off season?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedAlum on February 24, 2007, 09:53:28 AM
First off-----CONGRATS TO THE DENISON WOMEN!!  A chance for the three-peat tonight.  Good luck.
Plus....exactly how can they be 23-4 and not even a sniff in the top 25??

Exactly how good are these teams??

#12  Wash U    19-5
#13  Hardin-Simmons   20-4
#15   Brandeis   19-4
#17   UW-Stout  20-5
#21   Rochester  19-5
#22   Medaille   21-4

Are you telling me Denison is nowhere close to any of these teams??? Come on!!


Anyway!!

Let's hear it for the "Little Eight".  How in the world did OWU EVER beat a "big two" team???  That can not happen.  Congrats to OWU and Coach DeWitt on their victory.

It certainly didn't help that Witt couldn't hit the side of a barn.  Not a good game to go in the tank!!  But credit OWU with a great game plan and pulling out the win.

Good luck to both Wooster and OWU tonight.    And to the Denison gals!!!  GO BIG RED!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2007, 11:03:32 AM
As others have posted, I would also like to congratulate all the graduating seniors on the NCAC teams. :)

Here is a list of seniors by team:

Wooster - Tom Port, Tim Vandervaart, Andy Van Horn

Wittenberg - Dane Borchers, Jack Hemenway, Billy Bowen, Pat Denbow, Mark Huelsman

Ohio Wesleyan - Ben Chojnacki, Ted Uritus, Matt Shirer

Allegheny - Casey McCloskey, Jimmy Savage, Mike Sefscik

Wabash - Ryan Stephens

Kenyon - Mike Cohen

Hiram - Brandon Pool

Earlham - Markous Jewett, LaRon Henry, Joe Rihm

Denison - Dan Hodgkinson, Dan Izzo

Oberlin - Quinton Spencer

Congrats again to all these fine seniors!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedAlum on February 24, 2007, 11:07:46 AM
I totally second the motion on the SENIORS!!!

For these guys to play 4 years, some 5 at the D-3 level for basically the "love of the game" is very special.  They have terrific tallent and are terrific kids.  Hats off to all of them.  They will certainly be missed.

I know I will miss watching them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 24, 2007, 11:26:45 AM
The NCAC will be very interesting next year.  I can't help but believe that both Wooster and Wittenberg will come at least somewhat back to the pack.  The Tigers, especially, will have to hope for some serious stepping-up by their returnees or they will have their worst team in quite a while.  Wabash, Kenyon, and Hiram should clearly improve.  Earlham and Denison might have some real problems, again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2007, 12:28:59 PM
I had a nice visit in the cheap seats yesterday with Denison alumni and former Wooster assistant coaches Kyle Pottkotter and Patrick Ruefner.  Kyle just finished his fifth season as the top assistant at his alma mater, where he is also the head men's golf coach.  Patrick is completing his first year as the athletic director and women's basketball coach (and adjunct professor of psychology) at Wayne College in Orrville.  Wayne is a branch campus of the University of Akron.  The Lady Warriors finished their season with a 14-10 mark.  Both Kyle and Patrick were maintaining a careful neutrality during the Witt/OWU game, which is when I talked to them.  It was good to catch up with both of them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 24, 2007, 12:47:01 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2007, 11:03:32 AM
As others have posted, I would also like to congratulate all the graduating seniors on the NCAC teams. :)

Are any of these guys eligible for 5th years?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2007, 01:01:51 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 24, 2007, 12:47:01 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2007, 11:03:32 AM
As others have posted, I would also like to congratulate all the graduating seniors on the NCAC teams. :)

Are any of these guys eligible for 5th years?

Port and Borchers are, of course, already 5th-year seniors.  Hodgkinson was a four-year starter at Denison, and both Van Horn and Vandervaart have played four varsity years.  Dan Izzo only got into seven games as a frosh, but I think that's enough to use up his year of eligibility; in any case, I haven't heard anything about his coming back, even if he is eligible.  Cohen is a reserve who would have no incentive to come back (and about $50K worth of disincentive.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 24, 2007, 01:41:17 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2007, 11:03:32 AM
As others have posted, I would also like to congratulate all the graduating seniors on the NCAC teams. :)

Here is a list of seniors by team:

Wooster - Tom Port, Tim Vandervaart, Andy Van Horn

Wittenberg - Dane Borchers, Jack Hemenway, Billy Bowen, Pat Denbow, Mark Huelsman

Ohio Wesleyan - Ben Chojnacki, Ted Uritus, Matt Shirer

Allegheny - Casey McCloskey, Jimmy Savage, Mike Sefscik

Wabash - Ryan Stephens

Kenyon - Mike Cohen

Hiram - Brandon Pool

Earlham - Markous Jewett, LaRon Henry, Joe Rihm

Denison - Dan Hodgkinson, Dan Izzo

Oberlin - Quinton Spencer

Congrats again to all these fine seniors!

Thanks wooscotsfan for that list!  Looking at it the regular posters can all start mentally adjusting the standings for next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2007, 02:08:30 PM
Talk about your bad karma...

This is from the NCAC men's championship page:
QuoteTop-seeded Wooster (24-3) advanced to the championship game of the North Coast Tournament for the 11th straight year. The Fighting Scots, who went 6-5 over that span, defeated fifth-seeded Wabash (11-16), 92-80.
[emphasis added]

Wooster has gone 6-4 over that span, if you don't count tonight's result.  I hope the NCAC folks don't know something they're not telling us... :P

And I don't want to shock Aaron Dorksen, but only 6 of those 11 opponents were from Wittenberg.  Also making championship game appearances in the past 11 seasons are Allegheny (3x), Wabash, and Ohio Wesleyan, who tonight returns to the title game for the first time since 1990.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HopeConvert on February 24, 2007, 02:11:44 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2007, 11:03:32 AM
As others have posted, I would also like to congratulate all the graduating seniors on the NCAC teams. :)

Here is a list of seniors by team:

Wooster - Tom Port, Tim Vandervaart, Andy Van Horn

[

Congrats again to all these fine seniors!
Vandervaart? Van Horn? How did Hope and Calvin miss them?!? ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2007, 03:46:10 PM
Because they both played high school ball less than 1 hour from Wooster's campus....in Ohio!  ;D :) :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 24, 2007, 04:09:00 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 24, 2007, 03:52:25 PM
Elsewhere another C bid has been unexpectedly gobbled up - Virginia Wesleyan was upset by Hampden-Sydney.

That may be the official nail in Witt's coffin  :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2007, 04:44:41 PM
The ODAC with THREE bids? Wowser.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ChicagoHopeNut on February 24, 2007, 04:49:46 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2007, 04:44:41 PM
The ODAC with THREE bids? Wowser.

Which three? I don't know my ODAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 24, 2007, 04:51:10 PM
Quote from: DCHopeNut on February 24, 2007, 04:49:46 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2007, 04:44:41 PM
The ODAC with THREE bids? Wowser.

Which three? I don't know my ODAC.

Whoever takes the AQ, plus Va Wes and Guilford - but I think Guilford may end up odd-man-out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HopeConvert on February 24, 2007, 04:58:52 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 24, 2007, 04:51:10 PM
Quote from: DCHopeNut on February 24, 2007, 04:49:46 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2007, 04:44:41 PM
The ODAC with THREE bids? Wowser.

Which three? I don't know my ODAC.

Whoever takes the AQ, plus Va Wes and Guilford - but I think Guilford may end up odd-man-out.
Guilford's at 9.625 - I don't think that will get it done (well, depending on their in-region ranking).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ChicagoHopeNut on February 24, 2007, 08:31:19 PM
Congratulations to Wooster.

NCAC Final
Wooster 86
OWU      51

The game was as ugly as the score as Wooster just dominated from the opening tip. Wooster should be a very dangerous team in the NCAA tourney.

As a Hope fan I appreciate Woo saving another Pool C bid for someone else by winning tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 24, 2007, 09:13:12 PM
Ain't the beer cold!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2007, 09:41:02 PM
Quote from: DCHopeNut on February 24, 2007, 08:31:19 PM
Congratulations to Wooster.

NCAC Final
Wooster 86
OWU      51

The game was as ugly as the score as Wooster just dominated from the opening tip. Wooster should be a very dangerous team in the NCAA tourney.

As a Hope fan I appreciate Woo saving another Pool C bid for someone else by winning tonight.

I didn't think it was ugly; I thought it was beautiful.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2007, 10:02:16 PM
All-NCAC Tournament team:

James Cooper, Wooster (MVP)
Tom Port, Wooster
Jesse Jean, OWU
Dustin Rudegeair, OWU
Dane Borchers, Witt
Andrew Zimmer, Wabash

I don't know about anyone else, but I'd be happy to go into battle with this team, anytime!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2007, 10:06:04 PM
Just got back from Timken where I watched Wooster put on a clinic tonight! ;D

Wooster jumped out to a 27-8 lead and never looked back. :)  At one point in the first half, it was 44-16 because Wooster's defense totally clamped down on Ohio Wesleyan.  Meanwhile, James Cooper and Tom Port were unstoppable on the offensive end with Cooper racking up 22 points by halftime.

Wooster shot 55% from the floor tonight and their "D" held OWU to only 32%

Wooster also made 10 of 20 three pointers (4-Cooper, 3-Port).

Wooster also outrebounded the Bishops by a 41-28 margin.

Congratulations to Ohio Wesleyan on a fine season finishing 18-10

CONGRATS to the Scots on winning both the NCAC regular season title and the NCAC tourney title in the same year! ;D

Up Next -- the NCAA tournament where Wooster should get a good seeding.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 24, 2007, 10:19:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2007, 10:02:16 PM
All-NCAC Tournament team:

James Cooper, Wooster (MVP)
Tom Port, Wooster
Jesse Jean, OWU
Dustin Rudegair, OWU
Dane Borchers, Witt
Andrew Zimmer, Wabash

I don't know about anyone else, but I'd be happy to go into battle with this team, anytime!

Well, it's certainly a good team, but it's a bit top-heavy.  I'd add Brandon Johnson as the point guard and either Greg Hill or Devin Fulk as another shooter. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on February 24, 2007, 10:22:50 PM
the hope assient  coach said tonight that hey dose not think hope gets in he said there seasson might be done
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 24, 2007, 10:26:51 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 24, 2007, 10:19:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2007, 10:02:16 PM
All-NCAC Tournament team:

James Cooper, Wooster (MVP)
Tom Port, Wooster
Jesse Jean, OWU
Dustin Rudegair, OWU
Dane Borchers, Witt
Andrew Zimmer, Wabash

I don't know about anyone else, but I'd be happy to go into battle with this team, anytime!

Well, it's certainly a good team, but it's a bit top-heavy.  I'd add Brandon Johnson as the point guard and either Greg Hill or Devin Fulk as another shooter. :)

Gregg Hill? What game were you watching?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2007, 10:34:41 PM
I think Hope is a safe bet, but Witt looks tenuous.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ChicagoHopeNut on February 24, 2007, 10:36:02 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2007, 10:34:41 PM
I think Hope is a safe bet, but Witt looks tenuous.

From what I have read on the Pool C board and heard from others it doesn't look like Witt has any chance at all. There are just too many teams in front of Witt right now for them to get a Pool C.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 24, 2007, 10:39:06 PM
Witt does not have a chance since Capital won OAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2007, 10:47:18 PM
The Witt players congregated with their fans in the stands during the early moments of the Woo/Wabash game yesterday, and from the looks on their faces, I think they knew their season was over.  It's a shame, really, but they're not going to be the only "top 59" team to be left out of the tournament.

Many of us were pulling for Witt all the way last year.  I hope the conference can now rally behind the Wooster men and Denison women as the NCAC standard-bearers in the NCAA tournament.  Go Scots and Big Red!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 25, 2007, 12:17:32 AM
greg hill? sure he had ove r10 points but 4 for 15 shooting doesn't merit first team......

congrats on a good season witt. disappointing way to end some careers, but i guess you have to make shots when you need them. i'll be following wooster and keeping track of them as well. As much as it pains me good luck Wooster-represent us well
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2007, 12:22:47 AM
I could be wrong, but I don't think Wooster Booster was suggesting that Greg Hill should have received tourney honors.   He was just responding to my post about how good a real team the all-tournament team would be; his point was that it was a post-heavy group and needed guards besides Cooper.  I think Greg Hill would be an excellent choice in a pickup game, regardless of how well he may have played against OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 25, 2007, 12:35:01 AM
fair enough
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2007, 12:47:50 AM
Congratuations to my alma mater on a successful NCAC season, winning both the regular season and tournament championships.  I wish Wooster success on a deep run in the NCAA tournament this year; and winning the AQ puts Wooster in an excellent position to be a sectional host if they make it to weekend number two.  :)

Here's hoping to see several tournament games in Timken!   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 25, 2007, 12:56:59 AM
There's really not much to say for you Wittenberg guys.  I mention a Witt player in a complimentary way and that's not good enough for you.  Nothing ever is.  So, hear this.  Nothing, NOTHING, could have pleased me more, besides Wooster winning the tournament, than watching Wittenberg get sent home early.  Enjoy the early off-season and living in that slum of a town you call Springfield.  And have fun with your second-division team next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on February 25, 2007, 02:05:37 AM
Wooster Booster-
I don't think that pennstghs was trying to knock you, much less say that he didn't think his OWN player was good enough to make the team.  It's a good compliment you think he was deserving.  As much as I have hated playing against Witt, I felt sorry for the way they had to end their season. Borchers is the real deal, he's a great player and I wish their whole team much success.  It's unfortunate they had to end their season this way.

Good luck to all the teams in tournament.  Here's to hoping Wooster goes all the way!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2007, 02:34:08 AM
Congrats to Wooster on a fine season.  The home loss to Witt notwithstanding, Wooster was clearly the cream of this crop from the get go from my viewpoint. 

Wooster's tournament hay will be made, as it is every year, by how they play when they come up against a team with a very good post player who can control the tempo.  If you run and gun with the Scots, you will lose.  They just have better perimeter shooters and a better transition game than most teams.  If you can get Wooster into a half court game, you've got a shot.  It'll be interesting to see how the bracket sets up tomorrow.  Good luck Wooster...may the draw be kind. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2007, 07:15:28 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2007, 09:41:02 PM
Quote from: DCHopeNut on February 24, 2007, 08:31:19 PM
Congratulations to Wooster.

NCAC Final
Wooster 86
OWU      51

The game was as ugly as the score as Wooster just dominated from the opening tip. Wooster should be a very dangerous team in the NCAA tourney.

As a Hope fan I appreciate Woo saving another Pool C bid for someone else by winning tonight.

I didn't think it was ugly; I thought it was beautiful.  ;D
Yes, it depends on what  vantage point you are coming from!  From OWU's perspective, yes, the game was very ugly.  But from this Wooster fan's perspective and I'm sure everyone else associated with Wootster, as David said, it was a thing of beauty!!! 8) 

It's funny how this series with OWU went this season in their 3 games.  The first game was a bit of a surprise in that it was a defensive gem by both teams.  Wooster and OWU were 1-2 in the conference in scoring so it was a bit of a surprise to see a 61-54 result.  The 2nd game was just the opposite of the 1st game and more what I expected to see from these 2 offensive minded teams as the score at the half nearly equaled the score of the 1st game!  And then there was last night's game which, for Wooster, was a combination of the 1st two games where the Scots were dominant on both sides of the floor.  I don't think the Scots could have played much better than they did last night on both offense and defense.  If they bring that type of intensity out on the floor in the tournament, they will be a tough team to beat. 

Also, with JCU and Hope losing last night, and LEC's gym having hosting issues, does that pretty much make Wooster the favorite to host the sectional should they get through the regional?  My thought would be most definately.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 25, 2007, 07:38:26 AM
Wooster Booster - i wasn't jumping your case at all so don't just jump to conclusions. I was just questioning your interpretation of Greg Hill and making my point of view-does that automatically deem me ungrateful?  If you would open your eyes a little wider you would see that i did wish Wooster good luck as well. Yes i'm sure you're happy to see us lose too, i wouldn't want to be the ones to end your season  ;D. Must you guys get so defensive all the time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 25, 2007, 10:38:24 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 25, 2007, 12:56:59 AM
There's really not much to say for you Wittenberg guys.  I mention a Witt player in a complimentary way and that's not good enough for you.  Nothing ever is.  So, hear this.  Nothing, NOTHING, could have pleased me more, besides Wooster winning the tournament, than watching Wittenberg get sent home early.  Enjoy the early off-season and living in that slum of a town you call Springfield.  And have fun with your second-division team next year.

I would say the same for you Wooster guys, but then again, you're the only one that's an absolute prick.

Everyone else seems to know what respect is, and how to have some great conversations about basketball.  Every time you open your mouth it's to insult someone or whine about something.  It's old.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on February 25, 2007, 11:36:56 AM
This is a bit late but I had to chill a little after the 700 mile roundtrip from Woo.

The play where Ryan Stephens took the elbow was right in  front of the Wabash bench under the basket...I have no doubt it was inadvertent but the refs saying they didnt see it is pure BS....Immediately after it occurred one ref asked Ryan "Are you all right?" this from reading the refs lips...then they went down the floor and Ryan collected his T...the T would never have happened if the ref would have just called a foul when the play happened instead of just being in a hurry to get the game over with..so I give the T to the refs who otherwise did a good job.

I saw and talked with Ryan in the AM in the hotel lobby and his nose looked fine.

Lastly, IMO Witt not getting a spot in the tourney is a shame but if the CCIW only gets one team in the tourney after having 3 or 4 teams in the top 25 all year that is a pure disgrace and there is no way I would consider the winner of the tourney "National Champions". Ofcourse this is only MY opinion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2007, 11:42:41 AM
Here is the link to the Daily Record's story on Wooster's win over OWU.

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1649181
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 25, 2007, 12:06:02 PM
Quote from: roadtrip on February 25, 2007, 11:36:56 AM
Lastly, IMO Witt not getting a spot in the tourney is a shame but if the CCIW only gets one team in the tourney after having 3 or 4 teams in the top 25 all year that is a pure disgrace and there is no way I would consider the winner of the tourney "National Champions". Ofcourse this is only MY opinion.

Every year there are teams that 'deserve' to make the tourney, but not everyone can get in.  There are only so many spots available.  IMO, to belittle the tourney as a whole because you disagree with the last couple of at large bids seems a little extreme.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 25, 2007, 01:14:10 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 25, 2007, 12:06:02 PM
Quote from: roadtrip on February 25, 2007, 11:36:56 AM
Lastly, IMO Witt not getting a spot in the tourney is a shame but if the CCIW only gets one team in the tourney after having 3 or 4 teams in the top 25 all year that is a pure disgrace and there is no way I would consider the winner of the tourney "National Champions". Ofcourse this is only MY opinion.

Every year there are teams that 'deserve' to make the tourney, but not everyone can get in.  There are only so many spots available.  IMO, to belittle the tourney as a whole because you disagree with the last couple of at large bids seems a little extreme.

The reality is that those one or two last at-large teams are rarely ever legitimate title contenders, anyway. I don't think that their exclusion invalidates the final result.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2007, 02:35:18 PM
Yick. Upset city today!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2007, 03:32:53 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 25, 2007, 01:14:10 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 25, 2007, 12:06:02 PM
Quote from: roadtrip on February 25, 2007, 11:36:56 AM
Lastly, IMO Witt not getting a spot in the tourney is a shame but if the CCIW only gets one team in the tourney after having 3 or 4 teams in the top 25 all year that is a pure disgrace and there is no way I would consider the winner of the tourney "National Champions". Ofcourse this is only MY opinion.

Every year there are teams that 'deserve' to make the tourney, but not everyone can get in.  There are only so many spots available.  IMO, to belittle the tourney as a whole because you disagree with the last couple of at large bids seems a little extreme.

The reality is that those one or two last at-large teams are rarely ever legitimate title contenders, anyway. I don't think that their exclusion invalidates the final result.
Li'l Giant and cmhscots,

Great points.  To make a comment such as the one roadtrip made is a bit short sighted to say the least.  To say that you won't recognize whomever wins the National Championship because the 3rd or 4th best CCIW teams didn't get in just doesn't make sense.  Like those Pool C bubble teams are seriously in cosideration for making a run to Salem? 

Yes, everyone loves the Cinderella team, but the reality is, there are only so many spots in the current system and with the large amount of upsets going on, teams that had thought they were safe for Pool C contention are now on the bubble and teams that had been on the bubble are seeing them burst.

Besides, if you have followed the tournament closely at all, you would realize that any team that makes it to Salem coming out of certain regions are definately deserving of being there.  Look at the road Witt had to travel to get there last season.  I think every opponent they faced outside of LEC was ranked! 

The bottom line is the road to Salem is not easy even without the 3rd or 4th best CCIW or WIAC or OAC schools involved in the tournament, unless you are lucky enough to be in the Northeast. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 25, 2007, 04:11:46 PM
I wouldn't be too sure that teams barely left out of pool C are not title contenders (though with 18 teams rather than 5 just a couple years ago, it is less likely now).  Just last year Illinois Wesleyan may well have been the last pool C (they had the lowest regional win % of any C) and made the Final Four.  Same thing in 2001, when they finished 3rd in the CCIW and barely squeezed in, yet finished 3rd in the country.

This year, Elmhurst and Witt (among others) have basically a zero chance of getting in, but I wouldn't bet too strongly against either getting hot and going to Salem if they had the opportunity.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on February 25, 2007, 04:38:20 PM
I may have been a little extreme in my previous post but........if you play in a weak conference and you do well you're penalized (Witt)....if you play in a competitive conference and do well you're penalized (Elm).....I know if my team was ranked in the Top 25 all season and we couldn't get one of 59 spots I would be singing the blues big time.....What would happen in DI with this formula??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2007, 04:42:18 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 25, 2007, 04:11:46 PM
I wouldn't be too sure that teams barely left out of pool C are not title contenders (though with 18 teams rather than 5 just a couple years ago, it is less likely now).  Just last year Illinois Wesleyan may well have been the last pool C (they had the lowest regional win % of any C) and made the Final Four.  Same thing in 2001, when they finished 3rd in the CCIW and barely squeezed in, yet finished 3rd in the country.

This year, Elmhurst and Witt (among others) have basically a zero chance of getting in, but I wouldn't bet too strongly against either getting hot and going to Salem if they had the opportunity.
I wouldn't put this year's Emhurst or Wittenberg squads in the same class as last year's IWU squad.  From what I remember, IWU hit a bit of a funk during the regular season.  It was almost as if they became bored during the regular season and turned the switch back on for the post season.  Remember, they were also the consensus #1 team in DIII for much of the season as well, which can't be said for Witt and Elmhurst.  And the 2001 IWU team, as you mentioned, were in the era of only 5 Pool C bids.  In that era, there was more likely of a chance for a somewhat legitimate contender to be left out.  With the system as it is now, I just am not of the opinion that the tournament is lacking by leaving out the 19th and 20th best Pool C contenders.

Quote from: roadtrip on February 25, 2007, 04:38:20 PM
I may have been a little extreme in my previous post but........if you play in a weak conference and you do well you're penalized (Witt)....if you play in a competitive conference and do well you're penalized (Elm).....I know if my team was ranked in the Top 25 all season and we couldn't get one of 59 spots I would be singing the blues big time.....What would happen in DI with this formula??
Well, you can  blame the conference tournament upsets for some of the teams that have been in or around the  Top 25 all season long that are being left out.  We could do away with the conference post season tournaments and just give the automatic bids to the regular season conference champs and then dole out the Pool C bids down the line after that.  But, giving teams like Calvin and Williams and Coast Guard etc. a chance to elongate their seasons by winning their conference tournaments is a part of what makes this time of season so special.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 25, 2007, 05:21:15 PM
even if wittenberg would have reached the tournament final without losing to allegheny and ohio wesleyan, the last C spots would have been tough to come by with Hope, Virginia Wesleyan, and Amherst pretty much assured a spot and with other tough teams out there as well.

Wooster Booster, can we just kiss and make up?

jscwittfan-good lookin out bro
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: realist on February 25, 2007, 08:05:30 PM
Well said Scotts fan:  We all  knew what the rules were before the season started.  I support Calvin.   They struggled all season, but were good enough to win our conference tournament (which determines our AQ).  Do they deserve to be in the tournament.  Yes, because they came in according to the pre-set rules.  To try to redefine the selection criteria after the games have started doesn't work.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 25, 2007, 08:58:23 PM
Of course the tourney was never designed to have the 59 'best' teams (nor is the d1 tourney designed to have the 'best' 65).  I have no bone to pick with Pool A - they won their conference, they deserve a shot.  Many of them are little more than a first-round speed bump to vastly stronger teams (see d1 1v16 and 2v15), but the occasional David beats Goliath (no 16 has ever won, but a few have given a major scare; I think 2 15s have ever won) is a key part of what makes it 'March Madness'.  We DO suffer a bit in getting top teams in since we have 37 AQs for a 59-team tourney (d1 only has 20-something for a 65 team tourney), leaving a lot less wiggle-room for discretion.

But it is the lack of discretion used in selecting Bs and Cs that grates on me.  Using regional criteria to select a national tournament is nuts!  True, once at the table, teams are compared nationally, but using criteria where the damage has already been done.  Comparing (regional) QOWI, regional winning percentage, even record against regionally ranked teams, makes any logical sense only if you use the untenable assumption that all regions are equal.  A team in a strong region with a 9.5 QOWI and .7 winning % is in all probability a better team than a team in a weak region with a 10.5 QOWI and a .8 winning %.  But the 10.5, .8 team is a 'lock', the 9.5, ,7 will be going home.

Pool C consists of the next 18 teams best at meeting the regional criteria.  It should not be confused with being the next best 18 teams.

While Elmhurst and Witt (just as examples) are NOT last year's IWU team (not many are!), I would not bet serious money against them making it to Salem if they were given a chance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 25, 2007, 09:20:27 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 25, 2007, 08:58:23 PM
Of course the tourney was never designed to have the 59 'best' teams (nor is the d1 tourney designed to have the 'best' 65).  I have no bone to pick with Pool A - they won their conference, they deserve a shot.  Many of them are little more than a first-round speed bump to vastly stronger teams (see d1 1v16 and 2v15), but the occasional David beats Goliath (no 16 has ever won, but a few have given a major scare; I think 2 15s have ever won) is a key part of what makes it 'March Madness'.  We DO suffer a bit in getting top teams in since we have 37 AQs for a 59-team tourney (d1 only has 20-something for a 65 team tourney), leaving a lot less wiggle-room for discretion.

But it is the lack of discretion used in selecting Bs and Cs that grates on me.  Using regional criteria to select a national tournament is nuts!  True, once at the table, teams are compared nationally, but using criteria where the damage has already been done.  Comparing (regional) QOWI, regional winning percentage, even record against regionally ranked teams, makes any logical sense only if you use the untenable assumption that all regions are equal.  A team in a strong region with a 9.5 QOWI and .7 winning % is in all probability a better team than a team in a weak region with a 10.5 QOWI and a .8 winning %.  But the 10.5, .8 team is a 'lock', the 9.5, ,7 will be going home.
Pool C consists of the next 18 teams best at meeting the regional criteria.  It should not be confused with being the next best 18 teams.

While Elmhurst and Witt (just as examples) are NOT last year's IWU team (not many are!), I would not bet serious money against them making it to Salem if they were given a chance.

Well stated Mr. Ypsi. If I could award +K I would.   Have anyone actually ever calculated the avaerga QOWI per region. I would guess that it would show that by design there is very little difference in the averages, thus ignoring actual differences in strength of teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 25, 2007, 09:45:02 PM
Since QOWI is based only on in-region games, the averages, of mathematical necessity, will be essentially the same (they'd all be exactly the same were it not for the 200-mile rule, multi-region conferences like the UAA, and this year's addition of 'administrative regions' as another way for a game to be in-region - leave out these exceptions, a fairly modest proportion of all games, and every region would have to average 7.5 in QOWI).  Likewise, without those exceptions, all regions would, of necessity, have a winning % of .5.

Region-based criteria tell you nothing about relative strength of regions (except for the relatively few exceptions noted).

This year the CCIW went 66-22 against non-conference foes (obviously, some of the wins were against 'cupcakes', but many were not, including 4-0 against Hope and Calvin and several wins against WIAC teams, and the record includes OUR bottom-dwellers too!); the CCIW will have ONE team in the tourney.

If such games could be arranged, I would not only take Elmhurst, but also our 3rd, 4th, and 5th teams against some of the Cs that will get in.

In fairness, regionality is the preferred philosophy of d3, and, since our teams rarely make national TV (perhaps the increasing use of internet streaming video will ease that problem), selectors just don't have much except hard, cold stats to go by - but at least I wish they would improve the stats! :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2007, 10:33:57 PM
We all knew that this year's Mose Hole Classic had 4 top level teams in it, but who'd have guessed this result?

Champion: Ohio Northern--no bid to NCAA tournament
Runner-up: UW-La Crosse--no bid to NCAA tournament
3rd Place:  Wooster--Pool A
4th Place:  Calvin--Pool A

There's a good number of teams in the draw that I think would have real trouble with La Crosse.  But them's the breaks.

Wittenberg's season officially ends.  :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2007, 11:13:07 PM
No Witt, and no WIAC at-large?

Traveshamockery!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on February 25, 2007, 11:19:41 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 25, 2007, 10:33:57 PM
We all knew that this year's Mose Hole Classic had 4 top level teams in it, but who'd have guessed this result?

Champion: Ohio Northern--no bid to NCAA tournament
Runner-up: UW-La Crosse--no bid to NCAA tournament
3rd Place:  Wooster--Pool A
4th Place:  Calvin--Pool A

There's a good number of teams in the draw that I think would have real trouble with La Crosse.  But them's the breaks.

Wittenberg's season officially ends.  :'(
Good post... it's crazy how these things work out sometimes.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2007, 12:00:02 AM
Even though we all saw it coming, leaving Wittenberg out of the tournament draw is as big a "snub" as leaving out any number of other teams.  The Tigers finished the year with a record of 22-5, and among those 22 wins were defeats of the champions of the NCAC (Wooster), OAC (Capital), HCAC (Transylvania), and CUNYAC (York NY) conferences.  They had another in a seemingly endless series of great seasons, and I congratulate the Tigers on their success.

I think the Witt fans who frequent this forum have handled this news with considerable grace and dignity, especially when compared to fans of certain other "snubbed" teams.  Kudos to you all.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 26, 2007, 12:10:36 AM
Thanks David-i will have a memorandum of the year later on, while i am disappointed certainly......we had a chane to prove we belonged and make it a tough tough decision for the committee and balked at that opportunity
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2007, 12:50:56 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 15, 2007, 10:52:02 PM
Tonight's Wooster victory drops Kenyon to 6-5 at home this season.  The Lords' prior four losses at Tomsich Arena (to Grove City, DePauw, Wittenberg, and Wabash) were by an aggregate of 18 points, and one of those went to overtime (Witt.)  Wooster beat them by 25, and it could easily have been worse.  It's only the second time this season that the Lords have lost by more than 10 points.  The other time was when they lost by 35...at Wooster.

It's not just Kenyon.  Hiram's worst loss: 111-57 at home vs. Wooster.  Wabash's worst loss: 96-52 at Wooster.  Denison's worst loss: 96-67 at Wooster.  Cabrini? 128-71 at Wooster.  Mt. Union? 85-60 at Wooster.  There may be others, but you get the point.  Sure, these are not good teams (no offense intended), but it's not like Wooster is the only good team they've played (well, it's the only good team Cabrini played ::).)

It's just too bad they don't give out trophies to the team that causes the most "worst-losses" for other teams.   :-\

...now we can add Ohio Wesleyan to this list.  Their loss at Wooster last night, by 35 points, was their worst loss of the season, eclipsing by four touchdowns their previous worst loss, a 7 point loss to...Wooster (and Witt, each beat the Bishops by 7.)  Prior to the NCAC final, OWU had lost 9 games by a grand total of 38 points, and two of those were OT losses. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2007, 01:03:06 AM
Before posting that, I knew that Ohio Wesleyan had a good season, but I am just now beginning to realize just how good it was.  They finished with a record of 16-10, but they beat Capital (OAC champs) by 10 points; they beat Penn St.-Behrend (19-7 and the only D3 team to beat Lake Erie) by 20 points; and they beat Wittenberg by 22 points.  Of their 10 losses, three were to Wooster (the first two by 6 and 7 points), and another was to DePauw (by 6 points); both Wooster and DePauw are playing next week.  They lost to Wittenberg, a top 10 team, by 7; they lost twice in OT; and otherwise by margins of 3, 3, and 2 points. 

In other words, they were in every game except the last one, including 5 games against teams ranked in the current top 25.  The Bishops were just a few baskets here and there from a great season.  Congratulations to Mike DeWitt and the Battling Bishops on a terrific under-the-radar season.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 26, 2007, 06:37:06 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 25, 2007, 03:32:53 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 25, 2007, 01:14:10 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 25, 2007, 12:06:02 PM
Quote from: roadtrip on February 25, 2007, 11:36:56 AM
Lastly, IMO Witt not getting a spot in the tourney is a shame but if the CCIW only gets one team in the tourney after having 3 or 4 teams in the top 25 all year that is a pure disgrace and there is no way I would consider the winner of the tourney "National Champions". Ofcourse this is only MY opinion.

Every year there are teams that 'deserve' to make the tourney, but not everyone can get in.  There are only so many spots available.  IMO, to belittle the tourney as a whole because you disagree with the last couple of at large bids seems a little extreme.

The reality is that those one or two last at-large teams are rarely ever legitimate title contenders, anyway. I don't think that their exclusion invalidates the final result.
Li'l Giant and cmhscots,

Great points.  To make a comment such as the one roadtrip made is a bit short sighted to say the least.  To say that you won't recognize whomever wins the National Championship because the 3rd or 4th best CCIW teams didn't get in just doesn't make sense.  Like those Pool C bubble teams are seriously in cosideration for making a run to Salem? 

Elmhurst wasn't the "3rd or 4th best CCIW team", ScotsFan. The 'jays finished second in the CCIW, and second in the CCIW tourney. They beat Augustana once in three tries (CCIW champs, CCIW tourney champs), they beat UW-Oshkosh (2nd place WIAC), UW-Whitewater (4th place WIAC), and took two out of three from the CCIW's third-place team, Wheaton. They're currently ranked 14th in the nation. That's not marginal.

I've seen Elmhurst numerous times this season. They would've had a legitimate chance at making a Salem run.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 26, 2007, 06:39:11 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 25, 2007, 04:42:18 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 25, 2007, 04:11:46 PM
I wouldn't be too sure that teams barely left out of pool C are not title contenders (though with 18 teams rather than 5 just a couple years ago, it is less likely now).  Just last year Illinois Wesleyan may well have been the last pool C (they had the lowest regional win % of any C) and made the Final Four.  Same thing in 2001, when they finished 3rd in the CCIW and barely squeezed in, yet finished 3rd in the country.

This year, Elmhurst and Witt (among others) have basically a zero chance of getting in, but I wouldn't bet too strongly against either getting hot and going to Salem if they had the opportunity.
I wouldn't put this year's Emhurst or Wittenberg squads in the same class as last year's IWU squad.  From what I remember, IWU hit a bit of a funk during the regular season.  It was almost as if they became bored during the regular season and turned the switch back on for the post season.

That isn't what happened at all. I can assure you that Illinois Wesleyan's mid-season struggles last year were not the result of boredom. They were the result of sharing a league with three other very strong teams in 2005-06.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 26, 2007, 06:40:20 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 25, 2007, 08:58:23 PM
Of course the tourney was never designed to have the 59 'best' teams (nor is the d1 tourney designed to have the 'best' 65).  I have no bone to pick with Pool A - they won their conference, they deserve a shot.  Many of them are little more than a first-round speed bump to vastly stronger teams (see d1 1v16 and 2v15), but the occasional David beats Goliath (no 16 has ever won, but a few have given a major scare; I think 2 15s have ever won) is a key part of what makes it 'March Madness'.  We DO suffer a bit in getting top teams in since we have 37 AQs for a 59-team tourney (d1 only has 20-something for a 65 team tourney), leaving a lot less wiggle-room for discretion.

But it is the lack of discretion used in selecting Bs and Cs that grates on me.  Using regional criteria to select a national tournament is nuts!  True, once at the table, teams are compared nationally, but using criteria where the damage has already been done.  Comparing (regional) QOWI, regional winning percentage, even record against regionally ranked teams, makes any logical sense only if you use the untenable assumption that all regions are equal.  A team in a strong region with a 9.5 QOWI and .7 winning % is in all probability a better team than a team in a weak region with a 10.5 QOWI and a .8 winning %.  But the 10.5, .8 team is a 'lock', the 9.5, ,7 will be going home.

Pool C consists of the next 18 teams best at meeting the regional criteria.  It should not be confused with being the next best 18 teams.

Exactly!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 26, 2007, 09:10:59 AM
Good draw for the Scots!

Wooster gets its chance to avenge last year's loss to Transy at Timken on Friday.  Centre and Capital are the other teams travelling to Wooster this weekend.

On the other side of the bracket John Carroll hosts Westminster on Thursday with the winner playing at Lake Erie on Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2007, 09:13:33 AM
Elmhurst was my second highest team not making it, behind Oshkosh. Witt was the third best team not making it. All three of those teams could have made a deep run, IMHO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 26, 2007, 09:35:13 AM
Wooster doesn't have game times posted yet, but the Capital website claims that Friday's first game, Capital vs Centre, is at 6 PM.  That probably puts Transylvania playing at 8 PM.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 26, 2007, 10:09:26 AM
wow Wooster fans got a tremendous draw, Transy should be a relatively decent chance at a win and I don't know a lot about Centre, but Capital could give them problems, but Wooster at home should prevail. I was looking forward to a Hope/Wooster matchup...........
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 26, 2007, 10:09:48 AM
 Wooster fans better be thanking your lucky stars you were not rated #1 in the region. ;D

What a system!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2007, 10:21:06 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 26, 2007, 06:37:06 AM
Elmhurst wasn't the "3rd or 4th best CCIW team", ScotsFan. The 'jays finished second in the CCIW, and second in the CCIW tourney. They beat Augustana once in three tries (CCIW champs, CCIW tourney champs), they beat UW-Oshkosh (2nd place WIAC), UW-Whitewater (4th place WIAC), and took two out of three from the CCIW's third-place team, Wheaton. They're currently ranked 14th in the nation. That's not marginal.

I've seen Elmhurst numerous times this season. They would've had a legitimate chance at making a Salem run.
Well, maybe if Emhurst would have found a way to beat Millikin at home, we wouldn't be having this conversation.  Same goes for Witt and their loss at Allegheny.  With the margin of error being so small especially when factoring the high number of conference tournament upsets, there is really no one to blame but themselves for not getting the job done against far lesser teams.

I'm not trying to defend the current selection process by using this QoWI nonsense.  Thank goodness changes are being made for next season and I hope they work out better than the current sytem that is in place.  The point I was trying to make was that it isn't fair to say that whomever wins the national championship isn't a true national champion because the 59 best teams aren't in the field as Elmhurst's coach was quoted as saying in the front page.  I'm sorry, but I have a hard time feeling sorry for them.  As I said, they really have to look no further than that home loss to Millikin to figure out why their season is over.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 26, 2007, 11:30:24 AM
Wooster should be licking their chops.

;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2007, 11:41:49 AM
It looks as though Transy, Westminster and Centre were the lowest regionally ranked teams in their respective regions, therefore they would be the lowest seeded teams in this regional.  Transy and Westminster weren't ranked and Centre was 7th in the South Region, but I'm sure moved up after winning the SCAC tournament this past weekend.  So I guess it was a toss-up between Westminster and Transy as to who Wooster's 1st opponent would be.  As far as JCU most likely having to travel to LEC in the 2nd round, that's the only part I find confusing.  The Blue Streaks look to be the #3 seed in this regional behind LEC and Wooster despite losing to Cap which would explain their getting to host in the 1st round.  I guess the NCAA saw fit to reward JCU with a home game as the 3 seed against 6th seeded Westminster, but then had them go on to play the #1 seed in the 2nd round whereas Wooster gets to host their regional against what would appear to be the 7th seed in Transy while #4 Cap plays #5 Centre.

Quote from: Witt4ever on February 26, 2007, 10:09:48 AM
Wooster fans better be thanking your lucky stars you were not rated #1 in the region. ;D

What a system!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Personally, I think that JCU got the most favorable draw.  They host Westminster, who isn't very good, in the 1st round and then they are on the road to face LEC, which no one really knows anything about except that they lost by 36 last year to Witt in the 1st round of the NCAA Tournament and I really wouldn't be surprised to see JCU handle them pretty easily as well even with the game being played at LEC.

Wooster, on the other hand has to play Transy in the opening round.  While they don't appear to be as good as last year's team that knocked out Wooster in the 2nd round, I would still say that they are a better team than Westminster.  And then Wooster gets the winner of the Cap v. Centre matchup.  I would expect Cap to win that one, but Centre has been on quite a roll here to close out the season having not lost since January 26th.  They have won their last 9 games of the season by an average of just over 20 ppg including a 32 point drubbing of Pool C selection DePauw.  So, if Wooster can get past Transy, the winner of the Cap-Centre game will be IMHO a far tougher opponent than JCU will be facing in LEC. 

Looking past the regionals, I like the Sectional draw as a whole.  If Wooster can get through this regional, it looks like they should have a pretty solid argument at hosting the Seciontal and as sac so eloquently point out, should be 'licking their chops'! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on February 26, 2007, 11:56:21 AM
Websites and Season Stats-

Transy:
http://www.transy.edu/pages/athletics/m_basketball/teamcume.htm#TEAM.TEM

http://www.transy.edu/athletics/content/m_basketball.asp?folder=men&topic=m_basketball

Centre:
http://www.centre.edu/web/athletics/basketball_m/index.html

http://www.scac-online.org/basketball_mens/cen.htm

Cap:
http://www.capital.edu/internet/default.aspx?pid=292
http://www.capitalcrusaders.net/mbasketball/06-07mbbstats/teamcume.htm


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 26, 2007, 12:37:43 PM
I agree, not quite as hard as Wittenber'g road last year through Baldwin-Wallace and Hope--personally i think Wooster got a good draw by avoiding Hope
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 26, 2007, 01:18:21 PM
Here is some breakdown of the opponents coming to Wooster.

CENTRE, 23-4 (12-2), is the 2007 Southern Collegiate Athletic Conference (SCAC) Tournament Champions (#2 Seed) out of the South Region.  It looks like they tied for the regular season title with Depauw after splitting their season series.  Last year, they were 19-8 and 9-5 in the conference.  They are in also receiving votes in the D3 Hoops top 25 @ about #32 and #7 in the NCAA South Regional Rankings.

They look to have a pretty balance attack. Looks like a eight man rotation with four players averaging more than 8.0 ppg.  Matt Nestheide, a 6'0" Senior Guard, looks like he leads the team for the PG spot as the leading scorer at 14.6 ppg including 46% from long distance and leading the team in APG, 3.3 and 29 stls for the season and  6'9" 240lbs Senior Center Patterson is leading rebounder @ nearly 7 per game.  Also, maybe a little young, among the regulars are two sophomores and 1 freshman.

Common opponents with Wooster: None but Centre did go 1-1 for GL region competition (Loss vs Albion @ Hanover College Tourney and Win @ Thomas More)

TRANSYLVANIA, 19-8 (10-6), out of the Midwest Region is the Heartland Collegiate Athletic Conference tournament champions as (#2 seed).   They came in second in the conference to Franklin.  We know a little bit about them from last year.  They hosted and made it to the Elite 8. They beat Wooster to get to the Sweet 16 but lost the regional final @ Wittenberg.  That team had 7 seniors, returning on one player that saw significant time.  They are not ranked nationally or regionally.

Transy also puts out an eight man rotation with 4 scoring more than 8 ppg.  They are led by Seniors 6'7" F Nick Feagan who is leading scorer and rebounder (16.1, 5.1) and 6'6" F Senior Joey Searle (14.8, 4.9).  Feagan did not play last year due to injury but was first team all conference before getting hurt.  And Searle got us for 13 in the NCAA Tourney game.

Common opponents with Wooster:  We may have Centre in common after the weekend.  But besides playing last year (I would like to emphasize at this point that they are two different teams).  Transy went 2-1 vs GLAKES competition including 2-0 vs Thomas More. The loss was to Wittenberg @ Witt in November.  Feagan got 19 pts and 5 rbs and Transy only shot 42%.

CAPITAL, 19-8 (10-5) is the Ohio Athletic Conference tournament champions as #1 seed and shared the conference regular season title with JCU.   Last year they were 12-13 and 9-9 in the tough OAC.  Capital had not won the OAC tournament since the 1984 season and last made an appearance in the NCAA tournament during the 1995-96 season

Capital is led by the wing/post combo of Soph 6'6" Wing Nate Stahl (14.2, 4.5 including 51% from distance) and Junior 6'5" Post Steve Kyser (12.9, 5.1).  Capital looks deep as 10 players avg more than 10 mpg played.

History and Common opponents: Wooster last played and beat Capital in NCAC/OAC Challenge @ OWU in 2004-05 season where the SCOTS prevailed 83-73. Capital played about half the NCAC this year (Witt, Kenyon, Denison and OWU).  They went 2-2 losing  vs Witt @ home and OWU @ home.  Scots went 1-1 vs OAC (W vs MtUnion and L vs ONU) both were at Home.  Capital went 2-2 vs same teams.  2-0 over ONU and 0-2 to Mt Union). Get the Mt. Union game film!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2007, 01:27:13 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2007, 09:35:13 AM
Wooster doesn't have game times posted yet, but the Capital website claims that Friday's first game, Capital vs Centre, is at 6 PM.  That probably puts Transylvania playing at 8 PM.

The game times are posted on Wooster's websited and you are correct.  Tip time for Woo-Transy is slated for 8 pm on Friday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2007, 01:31:19 PM
At first glance (our power has been out until just now), I'd say the decision to send JCU and Westminster to LEC and Centre, Transy, and Capital to Wooster has little to do with seeding and everything to do with geography.  Seeding gives us the host teams (LEC and COW), but geography fills in the brackets.

I think this is a very good looking sectional for the Scots.  Much to Wooster Booster's delight ;), it looks like we could see Capital and JCU in consecutive games at Timken.

It all evens out for the NCAC, though, as the Denison women got an almost unbelievably tough draw.  :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2007, 02:28:24 PM
Actually, I think Centre is underrated and could beat Capital.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 26, 2007, 02:36:44 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 26, 2007, 02:28:24 PM
Actually, I think Centre is underrated and could beat Capital.

I don't know much about Centre - just what I could glean from their stats - but they look like they could be pretty tough on the defensive end.  Their opponents are only shooting 38% from the floor and only 29% from beyond the arc.  Kind of Wittenberg-like numbers!  I wouldn't be surprised at all to see them playing Wooster on Saturday night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 26, 2007, 02:40:33 PM
Well, I'll certainly be rooting for Centre, and for anybody that plays JCU.  Perhaps they've both reformed their styles, have discovered the error of their ways, but I'm not betting my last $16 on it.  I'll need that the next time Wittenberg hosts Wooster for a men's/women's doubleheader. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 26, 2007, 03:13:57 PM
The only red flag that goes up for me regarding Centre is the loss to Albion at a time when Albion was playing poorly.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2007, 03:56:49 PM
Centre wasn't playing so hot then either. They started 3-3 and then they rolled off 20 out of 21, with the only loss to Millsaps.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cufan on February 26, 2007, 04:13:44 PM
Wooster Booster,

What's up with your complaining about Caps and JCU style, did they take your lunch money?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 26, 2007, 04:25:28 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2007, 02:40:33 PM
Well, I'll certainly be rooting for Centre, and for anybody that plays JCU.  Perhaps they've both reformed their styles, have discovered the error of their ways, but I'm not betting my last $16 on it.  I'll need that the next time Wittenberg hosts Wooster for a men's/women's doubleheader. 

I'm not even addressing this.......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 26, 2007, 04:45:53 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 26, 2007, 04:25:28 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2007, 02:40:33 PM
Well, I'll certainly be rooting for Centre, and for anybody that plays JCU.  Perhaps they've both reformed their styles, have discovered the error of their ways, but I'm not betting my last $16 on it.  I'll need that the next time Wittenberg hosts Wooster for a men's/women's doubleheader. 

I'm not even addressing this.......

Good idea, pennstghs - I've come to realize that nothing will ever change with him, so just let him whine and eventually it will get buried a few pages deep.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 26, 2007, 05:23:02 PM
I saw both Capital and JCU in action just a few years ago.  To put it bluntly, they played dirty basketball.  I don't mean just hard and physical, I mean dirty.  Dirty basketball is condoned by the coaches of those teams that do so.  They both have the same coaches, so I'd expect that they still play the same way.  I'll know for sure, at least about Capital, on Friday.

Cost me $16 bucks at Witt to see women's and men's games that were just a few hours apart.  That's a fact, and no one has shown me another DIII venue where that level of pricing exists.  So, it was the Wittenberg athletic department, along with that so-called deli where they sell subs instead of sandwiches, that took my lunch money, not Capital or JCU.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 26, 2007, 06:25:21 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2007, 05:23:02 PMalong with that so-called deli where they sell subs instead of sandwiches

I thought "subs" were "sandwiches". Think of it by picturing a Venn diagram: All subs are sandwiches, but not all sandwiches are subs. I think they're all tasty. (okay, I'm ready for dinner already).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 26, 2007, 07:02:49 PM
"A few years ago" (specifically in the '03-'04 season) Wooster lost to both Cap and JCU at Timken (the latter ending Wooster's season in the second round of the dance).  I'm sure that these events are totally unrelated to the current discussion.   :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 26, 2007, 07:05:36 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 26, 2007, 07:02:49 PMI'm sure that these events are totally unrelated to the current discussion.

Yeah, what the hell does that have to do with subs vs. sandwiches? Let's keep it on topic, Wally.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on February 26, 2007, 07:56:55 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 26, 2007, 07:05:36 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 26, 2007, 07:02:49 PMI'm sure that these events are totally unrelated to the current discussion.

Yeah, what the hell does that have to do with subs vs. sandwiches? Let's keep it on topic, Wally.

:D :D :D :D :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2007, 08:49:58 PM
Now what about hoagies and grinders? Where do they fit in on the Venn diagram? Or wraps? And are burritos or gyros technically sandwiches?

Nachos anyone?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2007, 08:50:42 PM
I wouldn't worry much about any 'dirty play' - Super Marty to the rescue!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 26, 2007, 08:57:15 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 26, 2007, 08:49:58 PMAnd are burritos or gyros technically sandwiches?

There was a case fairly recently where a sub sandwich shop (Quiznos, I think) sued the management company of the strip-mall they were in because the management rented a space to a burrito shop. Quiznos said it violated their lease provision where Quiznos was guaranteed to be the only "sandwich" shop in the shopping center. The Supreme Court (of which state, I don't recall) ruled that a burrito is not a sandwich and therefore the lease wasn't breached. I wish I could remember more detail but my brain is full to bursting with crap for the bar exam.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 26, 2007, 09:26:09 PM
From Websters:

Sandwich: 1 a : two or more slices of bread or a split roll having a filling in between b : one slice of bread covered with food

Submarine: 2 : a large sandwich on a long split roll with any of a variety of fillings (as meatballs or cold cuts, cheese, lettuce, and tomato) -- called also grinder, hero, hoagie, Italian sandwich, po'boy, sub, torpedo

Gyro: a sandwich especially of lamb and beef, tomato, onion, and yogurt sauce on pita bread

Burrito: a flour tortilla rolled or folded around a filling (as of meat, beans, and cheese)

Does this help?  I do not normally participate in this kind of jocularity but I could not resist on this one!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2007, 09:35:15 PM
WoosterFAN--you know better than anyone else in here than to put stock in any dictionary that equates a po'boy with a submarine or hero sandwich!  Next thing you know they'll say that a Muffuletta is the same thing as ham sandwich!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2007, 09:40:47 PM
But we all know a Manwich is a meal, right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2007, 10:09:29 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 26, 2007, 09:40:47 PM
But we all know a Manwich is a meal, right?

Smeds- I think that the ConAgra Foods advertising department has successfully infiltrated your brain!   :D ;D :) ;) :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 26, 2007, 10:15:45 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 26, 2007, 09:35:15 PMNext thing you know they'll say that a Muffuletta is the same thing as ham sandwich!

It's more like a transvestite ham sandwich.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 26, 2007, 10:25:51 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 26, 2007, 10:15:45 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 26, 2007, 09:35:15 PMNext thing you know they'll say that a Muffuletta is the same thing as ham sandwich!

It's more like a transvestite ham sandwich.

I do NOT want an explanation of that comment! :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2007, 10:35:56 PM
At the risk of getting off (sandwich) topic :), new Top 25 Poll is out:

Wooster moves up to #2, behind #1 UW Stevens Point

Witt drops down to #17

Centre (KY) is #23 (playing at Timken this weekend)

John Carroll is #25

Lake Erie in 'Other Votes', essentially #26

Capital in 'Other Votes', essentially #31 (at Timken this weekend)

Transylvania in 'Other Votes' essentially #46 (only got 1 vote)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2007, 11:31:39 PM
cmhscots asked about Transy's style on the HCAC board; a Bluffton poster responded:

Quote from: cmhscots on Today at 09:48:45 am
So what is Transy's style?  I know last year they beat Wooster primarily riding Marc Bain's hot hand, but I'm not sure from looking at their stats what their style is this year.

Bluffton Poster response:
I've only seen them play once (and listened to them on the radio twice), but their top 4 scorers (Nick Feagan, Joey Verax, Joey Searle, Aaron Cash) all hit 40% to 50% from 3-point range; as a team, they hit right around 40%.  They are very good at moving the ball around and finding an open shot.  Feagan, Searle, and Verax are especially troublesome because at 6-7, 6-6, and 6-5, you have to guard them inside and outside.

The Bluffton poster's response prompted me to check the season stats for both Transy and Wooster.  Here is the summary:

Team A:  Made 251 three pointers this season, 40% on 3's, Average 9.3 made 3's/game

Team B:  Made 280 three pointers this season, 41.7% on 3's, Average 10.0 made 3's/game

Did you guess right? :)  Team A is Transylvania;  Team B is Wooster
Conclusion: Transy shoots the three pointers nearly as well as Wooster

Major key to Friday's game:  Which team will do a better job of defending the three point shots?

Transy has 7 players that shoot three pointers well and their two tallest players (6'7" Nick Feagan-50 and 6'6" Joey Searle-48) have made the most three pointers.  Impressively, Searle is shooting a "Fulkesque" 50% (48 of 96) from behind the arc!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 26, 2007, 11:42:11 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.slymans.com%2Fimages%2FP4020029web.jpg&hash=93d10f7680e3a86d207f7b94bdde4bf2a4b525cc)

This is a genuine DIII level sandwich.  Anything on submarine, hero, or hoagie style bread is nothing but an NAIA meal with mayonaise.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2007, 06:27:04 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 26, 2007, 10:21:06 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 26, 2007, 06:37:06 AM
Elmhurst wasn't the "3rd or 4th best CCIW team", ScotsFan. The 'jays finished second in the CCIW, and second in the CCIW tourney. They beat Augustana once in three tries (CCIW champs, CCIW tourney champs), they beat UW-Oshkosh (2nd place WIAC), UW-Whitewater (4th place WIAC), and took two out of three from the CCIW's third-place team, Wheaton. They're currently ranked 14th in the nation. That's not marginal.

I've seen Elmhurst numerous times this season. They would've had a legitimate chance at making a Salem run.
Well, maybe if Emhurst would have found a way to beat Millikin at home, we wouldn't be having this conversation.  Same goes for Witt and their loss at Allegheny.  With the margin of error being so small especially when factoring the high number of conference tournament upsets, there is really no one to blame but themselves for not getting the job done against far lesser teams.

I'm not trying to defend the current selection process by using this QoWI nonsense.  Thank goodness changes are being made for next season and I hope they work out better than the current sytem that is in place.  The point I was trying to make was that it isn't fair to say that whomever wins the national championship isn't a true national champion because the 59 best teams aren't in the field as Elmhurst's coach was quoted as saying in the front page.  I'm sorry, but I have a hard time feeling sorry for them.  As I said, they really have to look no further than that home loss to Millikin to figure out why their season is over.

I never said that Elmhurst deserved to be in according to the current criteria. In fact, I was the first one on CCIW Chat to say the opposite. I posted last week that the Bluejays were up the creek without a paddle, much to the consternation of the Bluejays loyalists.

My objection was to your line, "Like those Pool C bubble teams are seriously in consideration for a run to Salem?" Fact of the matter is, Elmhurst is good enough to make a run to Salem. The fact that the Bluejays did not meet the criteria that would've allowed them the chance to prove it -- and, again, the 'jays have no one but themselves to blame for that -- does not alter that basic fact. The Bluejays were good enough to make it to the Final Four if they had had the chance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 27, 2007, 08:55:38 AM
From what I remember of Transy last year.  They hit a bunch of shots and could not seem to miss especially when it is important and the Scots were making a run.  Their Guard Bain made 7-10 and they hit for 42% in the game after going for 5-10 in the first half.

One of the things that I did not notice is that despite size advantage that they do not seem to rebound well (outrebounded for season 32.3 rpg to 29.0 rpg).  That maybe because they shoot from distance so much. 

And if my memory serves, we got what we wanted inside against a senior laden team.  This time, it is in our gym, with our fans and after sleeping in our own beds.  I doubt that we'll go 1-8 from the 3pt line in the second half again.

We must defend this house!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 27, 2007, 09:16:30 AM
From the Atlanta Journal Constitution
http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/shared-blogs/ajc/marchmadness1/entries/2007/02/26/wooster_ohio_having_a_cow.html (http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/shared-blogs/ajc/marchmadness1/entries/2007/02/26/wooster_ohio_having_a_cow.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2007, 09:57:30 AM
Something to keep in mind...

Since the beginning of the '03-'04 season Wooster has lost 14 games.  9 of those games were at Timken.  This suggests that Wooster's home court isn't quite as advantageous as we might otherwise believe.  As long as Transylvania manages to not soil themselves when the pipers come out, I think this could be a good game.  And really, all the pressure is on Wooster here...#2 in the country, getting the grudge match at home...it's a done deal, right?  Transy is playing with house money Friday night. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on February 27, 2007, 10:17:50 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2007, 11:42:11 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.slymans.com%2Fimages%2FP4020029web.jpg&hash=93d10f7680e3a86d207f7b94bdde4bf2a4b525cc)

This is a genuine DIII level sandwich.  Anything on submarine, hero, or hoagie style bread is nothing but an NAIA meal with mayonaise.  ;D
Whew... I think just looking at that thing almost gave me a heart attack. I think I'm going to go eat some raw vegetables now.  ::) :D :P

Seriously, referring to something as an NAIA meal is hilarious. What a great DIII jab.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerLady on February 27, 2007, 11:14:29 AM
Interesting Article!

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/hp/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2007/02/26/snssp022707wittcolumn.html (http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/hp/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2007/02/26/snssp022707wittcolumn.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 27, 2007, 11:25:17 AM
Sounds like the author reads this site :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2007, 11:25:38 AM
This just in...water is wet. Film at 11...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 27, 2007, 11:26:55 AM
Quote from: TigerLady on February 27, 2007, 11:14:29 AM
Interesting Article!

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/hp/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2007/02/26/snssp022707wittcolumn.html (http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/hp/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2007/02/26/snssp022707wittcolumn.html)

While I can see the point of John Carroll getting in over Witt being a topic of discussion, the fact is that JCU was higher in the final regional rankings and made it farther in their conference tournament.

Really, it reads like nothing more than sour grapes, as I'm sure the hypothetical Bill Brown-Cheerios situation didn't happen, because even Bill knew they were done after Friday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2007, 12:09:12 PM
Sour grapes indeed...

The reality is that the bottom seven of the NCAC this year killed QoWIs for our best two teams.  The margin of error is pretty small in D-III in general and gets razor thin when 3 of the 10 teams in your conference sit between .333 and .500 and four more sit below the 0.333 threshold. 

So how could Witt have done better?  As nice as it seems to look that they beat York (who is dancing), that game couldn't have mattered less to the committee.  It didn't happen.  Same with the Cedarville game.  And with the Swarthmore/Haverford games.  We all knew the rules when these schedules were made, so every time you sacrifice a chance to play a D-III team in your own region, you sacrifice the chance to pick up some in-region wins which are part of the primary criteria.  You can't win if you don't play. 

Some other points from the article...

- It's "unfair" to qualify for the tournament?  How is that?  Everybody plays by the same rules...regardless of whether or not we agree with the rules, they are the same for everybody and are therefore fair. 

- One can't compare the D-I tournament and their ratio of bids to teams eligible to what we have in D-III.  D-I has a little thing called a $6 billion tv contract that pays for things like our D-III tournament, so they can be allowed some special dispensation here. 

- The NCAA doesn't seek out the next best 18 teams.  This is true.  But I don't think the NCAA has made the promise to find the best 18 at-large teams.  They promise to find the best 18 at-at large teams that meet their criteria. If they feel that the criteria isn't giving the best tournament field, then they need to alter the criteria (which they are doing). 

- I'm not sure I would go as far as to call the d3hoops.com Top 25 "worthless", but the top 25 is not an indicator or predictor or a tool used by the committee to select at large teams.  It's pointless to point at the poll as proof of why your team should be in.  The poll is irrelevant to tournament selection. 

The bottom line is that had Witt not inexcusably blown their game against Allegheny and then made the conference tournament final, they'd probably be in.  Witt's destiny was in their own hands and they didn't take care of business. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2007, 12:18:51 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2007, 11:31:39 PM
cmhscots asked about Transy's style on the HCAC board; a Bluffton poster responded:

Quote from: cmhscots on Today at 09:48:45 am
So what is Transy's style?  I know last year they beat Wooster primarily riding Marc Bain's hot hand, but I'm not sure from looking at their stats what their style is this year.

Looking over Transy's roster and their stats, I'd say that they remind me a lot of OWU.  Both teams have several players that can shoot the 3-ball extremely well.  Both teams have big men that can shoot the 3-ball well. 

Both Transy and OWU averaged 75 ppg,  both shot above 46% overall (OWU-46%, Transy-47%) and both were close in 3-pont % (OWU-37%, Transy 40%).  Both teams seem to do a good job of moving the ball around to find the open man for the 3. 

The similarities continued on the defensive end as well as both Transy and OWU allowed teams to shoot over 40% from the floor and both allowed teams to shoot at a 35% clip from 3-point range and both allowed similar ppg outputs with OWU allowing 64ppg and Transy allowing 67ppg. 

So when looking at what style of play they bring, I would say all we need to do is look at OWU.  Wooster could benefit from having seen OWU twice in the last 2 weeks.  And that familiarity with the Bishops really paid dividends for the Scots in that NCAC championship game as it seemed as though Wooster were the ones that made all the right adjustments. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 27, 2007, 12:48:09 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 27, 2007, 09:16:30 AM
From the Atlanta Journal Constitution
http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/shared-blogs/ajc/marchmadness1/entries/2007/02/26/wooster_ohio_having_a_cow.html (http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/shared-blogs/ajc/marchmadness1/entries/2007/02/26/wooster_ohio_having_a_cow.html)

I can't believe the arch filling turned into arrests. That's good that the charges were dropped, but I recall a year that probably did go overboard ("snow" in the archway turned into "snow and various debris") and little was said. Perhaps they're a bit more protective with the shiny new improvments to Kauke?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2007, 01:12:41 PM
Quote from: AndersDY on February 27, 2007, 12:48:09 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 27, 2007, 09:16:30 AM
From the Atlanta Journal Constitution
http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/shared-blogs/ajc/marchmadness1/entries/2007/02/26/wooster_ohio_having_a_cow.html (http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/shared-blogs/ajc/marchmadness1/entries/2007/02/26/wooster_ohio_having_a_cow.html)

I can't believe the arch filling turned into arrests. That's good that the charges were dropped, but I recall a year that probably did go overboard ("snow" in the archway turned into "snow and various debris") and little was said. Perhaps they're a bit more protective with the shiny new improvments to Kauke?
It was actually the rent-a-cops, errrrr, campus security that seemed to have caused the whole thing to escalate like it did.  They seem to be the ones that called the police to the scene instead of contacting the dean of students who ended up being called in and calming things down when it was all said and done anyways.  Needless to say, the Wooster PD didn't come out of that whole situation looking too good with the way that they handled things once they arrived on the scene. ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2007, 01:18:22 PM
That's odd -- this reporter specifically asked me about Witt's tourney changes midseason if they lost to Wooster twice and I told him they were not good.

Why would he expect them to be better if they lost to Allegheny and Ohio Wesleyan?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2007, 01:32:09 PM
Witt has no one to blame but themselves for not getting in the tourney. I think the Dorksen 8 needs to step up their game next year, and the signs are positive for many of those teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2007, 01:49:16 PM
From the Wooster website:

» NCAA Div. III Tournament Ticket Information: There will be a pre-sale at Wooster's Physical Education Center Wednesday from 11 a.m. to 1 p.m., and Thursday also from 11 a.m. to 1 p.m. as well as 4 p.m. to 6 p.m. On Friday, tickets will go on sale starting at noon, and the gates open at 4 p.m. Tickets are $6 for adults and $3 for all students. One ticket is good for both games on Friday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 27, 2007, 01:52:17 PM
The previous link was to a blog entry from the Atlanta Journal-Constitution writer. Here is the link to the printed story, which I found on Wooster's Web site:

http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/printedition/2007/02/27/sptroadtoatlanta0227a.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 27, 2007, 02:38:26 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2007, 01:18:22 PM
That's odd -- this reporter specifically asked me about Witt's tourney changes midseason if they lost to Wooster twice and I told him they were not good.

Why would he expect them to be better if they lost to Allegheny and Ohio Wesleyan?

This reporter also specifically sucks.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DLP on February 27, 2007, 03:20:09 PM
Feb. 27, 2007

ALL-NCAC BASKETBALL SQUAD ANNOUNCED;
PORT NAMED PLAYER OF THE YEAR

http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mballncac07.pdf (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mballncac07.pdf)

CLEVELAND -- Wooster senior forward Tom Port (Avon Lake, OH/Avon Lake) has been named Player of the Year to highlight the 2007 All-North Coast Athletic Conference men's basketball squad, announced today after voting by the conference's head coaches.

Port leads a trio of repeat first team selections after he led Wooster to the North Coast's regular season title and helped the Fighting Scots win their 10th NCAC Tournament crown, and first since 2004. The 6-5 senior makes the first team for the third consecutive season and makes his fourth overall appearance on the all-conference team. Port started his career by earning the NCAC's Newcomer of the Year honor following the 2003-04 campaign and earned second team recognition that year.

The other two repeat first-team honorees are Ohio Wesleyan senior Ben Chojnacki (Medina, OH/Medina) and Scot junior James Cooper (Springfield, OH/South) , last year's NCAC Player of the Year. Two players move up from the second team. They are Wittenberg senior Dane Borchers (Russia, OH/Russia) , who was also a second team choice two seasons ago, and Denison senior Dan Hodgkinson (Lake Forest, IL/LakeForest), who earned second team honors in 2004 and 2006, and first-team recognition in 2005.

Senior senior forward Markous Jewett (Richmond, IN/Richmond) makes his first team debut after earning honorable mention honors last year. Wabash junior Andrew Zimmer (Hobart, IN/Hobart) is the lone first-teamer making his overall debut on the all-conference team.

Kenyon freshman Dave Knapke (Westerville, OH/St. Francise de Sales) was voted Newcomer of the Year after he averaged 10.2 points per game and grabbed 5.4 rebounds per game for the 10-16 Lords.

Wooster head coach Steve Moore was voted Coach of the Year for the seventh time and first time since 2002-03. He guided his squad to its 10th regular-season title and third in a row. He is in his 20th season at Wooster and has posted an 463-106 (.814) mark in that span, including a 25-3 mark entering the 2007 NCAA Division III Tournament. In 26 years as a collegiate head coach, Moore has gone 550-171 (.763).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2007, 03:23:42 PM
I guess the big shock for me is Klinger on the all-conference honorable mention team since he only played half of the games.

Knapke is a decent player, but I wonder if Haltom, Brock and Root split votes for Wabash allowing Knapke to win???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2007, 03:50:10 PM
How about Mike Staley out of Hiram for NoY?  Led the league in assists (and not by a smidgen...he had 53 more assists in four fewer games than his next closest dime-dropper), played more minutes in the league than anybody except Jewett, and started all 24 games that he played in this season.  Was there any single freshman more valuable to a team this year than this effective point guard?  I really like the Wabash freshmen and I'm sure Knapke is a solid player, but I have to think the league overlooked this one. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 27, 2007, 03:55:18 PM
Thanks Seinfeld,  I saw it in the paper but couldn't find it on their website.  Good article.

Quote from: seinfeld on February 27, 2007, 01:52:17 PM
The previous link was to a blog entry from the Atlanta Journal-Constitution writer. Here is the link to the printed story, which I found on Wooster's Web site:

http://www.ajc.com/sports/content/printedition/2007/02/27/sptroadtoatlanta0227a.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 27, 2007, 04:43:27 PM
SECOND TEAM
Gregg Hill Wittenberg So. W
Ryan Hollihan Allegheny So. C
Brandon Johnson Wooster So. G
Mike McDevitt Hiram Jr. F
Dustin Rudegeair O. Wesleyan Jr. F
Quinton Spencer Oberlin Sr. G/F
Tim Vandervaart  Wooster Sr. F
Bryan Yelvington Kenyon So. F

HONORABLE MENTION
Bill Babe Allegheny Jr. G 5-11
Korey Haddox Kenyon So. G 6-3
Jesse Jean O. Wesleyan Jr. F 6-5
David Jolson Kenyon So. G 6-3
Josh Klinger Kenyon Jr. G 5-11
Michael Loll Oberlin So. G/F 6-5
Jimmy Savage Allegheny Sr. G 6-3
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2007, 05:12:54 PM
Had we'd known all along that they were going to take a seven-man first team, we could have avoided arguing about Markous Jewett.  There's really no argument over the top 7, it's the cutting back to five that would have been tricky.  Seven first-teamers and eight on the second team; last year it was 5 and 6.

I would guess that Staley's late-season suspension cost him some support in the Newcomer voting.  Nevertheless, Knapke is a very impressive player, very poised for a frosh.  I think he's very deserving.  Klinger's selection is certainly interesting, though.  In fact, Kenyon has four names on the list, more than anyone else except Wooster (also 4).  Four Kenyon Lords, two Wittenberg Tigers... ???

Congratulations to all of the honorees.  Extra congratulations to Tom Port and Dan Hodgkinson, both of whom were all-conference performers throughout their collegiate careers. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 27, 2007, 06:38:18 PM
Congrats to all the All-NCACers.  Can't really argue with the selections, and kudos to the NCAC for not limiting themselves to 5 for each team, instead honoring those who really did deserve to be honored.  We rip a lot of the things the conference does a lot of times, but I think they got this one right.

It's also pretty clear (I would think) that Staley's suspension really hurt him.  You live, and hopefully, he'll learn.

With that said, this is my only potential snag with the awards - Steve Moore as Coach of the Year.  Listen, before you all jump on me for this one, let me explain myself.  We all know that Moore is a great coach.  We all know that Wooster was a favorite to win the conference championship.  We all knew that Wooster was going to be loaded after only losing one senior last year.  In my opinion, anything less than a conference championship for the Scots could have been interpreted as (doesn't necessarily mean it was) a poor coaching job.  In my mind, it would be the equivalent of giving Florida's Billy Donovan the SEC Coach of the Year title - we all knew Florida would be great, so he only did what was expected of him.  Who stepped up and really did a great job - did something we didn't expect them to do - is, in my mind at least, the Coach of the Year.

My vote would have went to Steve Fleming at Hiram.  A team that was picked to finish 9th in the coaches' poll and 10th in the media poll comes out of nowhere to finish tied for 6th.  Sure, a lot of that may potentially have been because of the fact that none of those bottom teams could really get hot, and players obviously have a lot to do with it, but I think he did the best job of coaching this year considering he didn't have as much to work with as did Moore.

Again, not saying that Moore isn't deserving, because it's clear he's a great coach.  I just think that with the roster/experience he had, the deck was stacked in his favor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2007, 06:50:41 PM
I know where you're coming from, although by that logic Steve Moore and Bill Brown would never be candidates for this award; they either meet expectations or they underachieve--there's no 'up' button in their elevators.

I think Steve Fleming's chances were sabotaged by the Terriers' weak stretch run, losing their last five games. 

In hindsight, my choice for the Coach-of-the-Dorksen-Eight Award would be Kenyon's Matt Croci, leading the Lords to a double-digit win season for the first time in 11 years, and they were snakebit in their ability to lose nailbiters (although that tendency could be blamed on the coach, I suppose.)  Then again, with four all-conference players plus the conference Newcomer of the Year, maybe the Lords should have done even better!  :D

But I don't think any of the Dorksen Eight really distinguished themselves in a positive way, and Wooster did have an impressive season even by their own lofty standards.  The fact that his roster was stacked should be a credit to him, rather than a debit, since recruiting is one of the requirements of a D3 head coach.  I think the award to Steve Moore is well-deserved.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 27, 2007, 07:10:35 PM
I'm glad to see that there were 7 players on the first team. As I posted a couple of weeks ago, a team should represent what a coach wants to play a game with and 5 is too few. Another point, throughout the league there were 98 players who average over 10 minutes a game, so in my opinion 7 does not dilute the honor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2007, 08:06:44 PM
Do we know the basis of Staley's suspension?  Did he make it rain at a Hiram gentlemen's club?  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2007, 04:52:20 AM
Quote from: sac on February 27, 2007, 11:25:17 AM
Sounds like the author reads this site :)

He should read it more carefully. The author mischaracterized Pool B as consisting of both independents and schools from conferences that don't have tournaments. Pool B actually consists of both independents and schools from conferences that don't have full D3 membership.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 28, 2007, 05:41:34 AM
Or who don't have seven teams who meet the membership period qualifications -- the Presidents Athletic Conference is very much a full D-III member conference but its seventh team is finishing the two-year waiting period this year.

I believe the threshold for being recognized as a D-III conference is five schools. But that's not enough for an automatic bid.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 28, 2007, 09:02:19 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 27, 2007, 08:06:44 PM
Do we know the basis of Staley's suspension?  Did he make it rain at a Hiram gentlemen's club?  :D

I didn't know those existed up in Hiram-chuckle chuckle-just kidding.

Anyways, congrats to those who made the first and second team all NCAC. I don't have a problem with Steve Moore getting Coach of the Year either, as he coached the best team and there was no clear standout alternative. Port deserved POY and is a merit for the career he has had. I guess all the debating earlier in the year whether Jewett deserved his spot was mute since they included 7.

Finally, regarding the article. The author is the only one who is choking on his Cheerios, because as stated before Brown knew Wittenberg's chances were gone. Yes we did have a REALLY good resumee, but we knew the terms of the game we were playing and didn't quite play the way we needed two the last week of the year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedAlum on February 28, 2007, 09:11:40 AM
Congratulations to those players making all-conference.

I think everyone on first team should be there.  It is a very fair list.  Each player deserves to be there.  Without them their teams are a whole lot worse.  That is for sure and can be said for all the guys on all three teams.

I agree with Port as POY.  Him and Cooper are a deadly combination.  Best of luck to them in the tournament and bring it home to the NCAC!!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 28, 2007, 09:43:47 AM
I put together a spreadsheet that has the stats for the 4 teams heading to Wooster this weekend.  You should be able to access it from the link below (I find it works best to save it to your computer and open it from there), but you'll probably need the 2003 version of Excel to read it.  If I get a chance I'll put html-ize it and publish it on my website later.  If anyone wants this and can't access it drop me a note and I'll e-mail it to you.  Also let me know if you find any errors and I'll correct them this evening.

www.jtaswell.com/D3BB/2007_Woo_Reg_Team_Stats.xls
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2007, 09:46:37 AM
I just wanted to add my congratulations to all of those that made All-Conference.  Also, big props to Tom Port.  He really made it worth his while coming back garnering the Conference POY!!  I'm sure that he'd be the first to say that he would gladly hand that award off to someone else for a deep run in the tournament.  We all know that's the real reason Tom came back!

I really can't complain about the choices for 1st and 2nd team as they are all definately deserving.  It's the choices for Honorable Mention that leave me scratching my head.  First of all, how do 3 Kenyon guards make HM?  I looked up their stats and they're not all that impressive.  If those Kenyon guards make it, then where's Knapke?  He's the Newcomer of the Year and doesn't make the All-Conference team? 

I know everyone will jump on me for being a homer and all, but where was Devin Fulk's name on the All-Conference list?  I figured he was HM at the very least.  He was right there in scoring with the Kenyon guards who made it on.  The thing that stands out about Fulk is that he was the only player in the league to shoot 50% from 3-point range and he was also tied for 4th in 3-point fg's made trailing only  POY Tom Port and fellow 1st Teamer James Cooper along with Oberlin's Jordan Beard while tying with Wabash's Chase Haltom. 

I guess the NCAC powers that be felt that 4 Wooster players was more than enough, but to counter that with 4 Kenyon players???  At least put Haltom in there at HM over one of those Kenyon guards.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 28, 2007, 09:53:57 AM
add Jack Hemenway to the list of left-outs-he deserved at least honorable mention for quite a senior season-what an improvment over the 4 years from him. A perfect example of the growth a collegiate athlete can garner.

Also, Wooster fans i don't want to jinx you but i did pick you to make the Final Four along with UW-Stevens Point, Amherst, Virginia Wesleyan and i picked you over the defending champs-hopefully exacting some NCAC revenge on them in the finals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedAlum on February 28, 2007, 09:54:52 AM
I agree with the scotsfan...........not seeing the Kenyon picks.

I have NO idea how the voting works.  Do the coaches vote for everyone but their team members??  Or do they vote for their guys as well.  And how many can they pick??

For newcomer I thought Savage was a shoe in.  Oh well.  That is why I don't vote.  That kid can play.

For the record you could probably make a case for having the entire Wooster team on the list but I think that might be a bit much.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2007, 10:13:28 AM
Quote from: BigRedAlum on February 28, 2007, 09:54:52 AMFor newcomer I thought Savage was a shoe in.  Oh well.  That is why I don't vote.  That kid can play.

You didn't mean Jimmy Savage of Allegheny, did you?  He's a senior.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 28, 2007, 10:24:29 AM
Basically, the coaches nominate their players but cannot vote on them.

Savage would have been a newcomer last year, since I think he just joined the team as a junior. He was an impressive two-sport athlete.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2007, 10:41:38 AM
cmhschots -

Thanks lots for putting together the stats comparison.  <Disclaimer>Some interesting conclusions can be drawn, although they might not necessarily be correct.</Disclaimer>  :)

1. Despite playing at a pace that certainly produced more possessions in their games than those of Transy, Cap, and Centre, Wooster still had the fewest turnovers/game.

2. Wooster's opponents attempted the most threes.  Again, certainly due at least somewhat to the number of possessions/game, but also maybe an indicator of Wooster's improved interior defense.

3. Centre was able to hold their opponents to the lowest FG percentage among the four teams while still committing, by far, the fewest fouls.  I'm not sure what this means, whether their opponents were lame, Centre's defense is very good, or they're just not too physical.

4. Wooster took down .552 of the available rebounds in their games.  Centre .535, Capital .523,  and Transy, actually getting outrebounded, only .474.

Wooster is currently ranked 3rd on Massey.  Centre is 7th, Capital 17th, and Transylvania 29th.  Capital has the best SOS of the four teams at 3.01, followed by Wooster at 0.72, Transy at -0.17, and Centre at -3.86.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedAlum on February 28, 2007, 10:46:48 AM
I am sorry.
Looking at a roster would help.

I meant Mike Staley from Hiram.  I really liked watching that kid play.  He is going to be a good one.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 28, 2007, 10:48:54 AM
Is there anyplace that tracks possessions/game for D-III teams?  Tempo-corrected stats can be far more informative than than the raw numbers. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2007, 10:54:54 AM
I've played Friday's games at Wooster using the AtR Excel basketball game.  Both Centre and Wooster actually had easy games, Centre downing Capital 84-66 and Wooster handling Transy 96-77.  The boxscores are here:

http://arkski.com/~jwood/centre_(0)_vs_capital_(66).html

http://arkski.com/~jwood/transylvania_(0)_at_wooster_(96).html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2007, 12:01:45 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2007, 10:41:38 AM
2. Wooster's opponents attempted the most threes.  Again, certainly due at least somewhat to the number of possessions/game, but also maybe an indicator of Wooster's improved interior defense.
It also could be attributed to the large leads Wooster would build up.  A lot of teams just revert to chucking up 3's in an attempt to get back into the game.  This past weekend's NCAC Tournament games are a perfect example of that as Wabash fell behind at the end of the 1st half and even further to start the 2nd half and ended up taking 17 attempts from beyond the arc in the 2nd half alone!  Likewise, OWU fell behind the Scots early and they ended up taking 13 2nd half 3-point attempts.  The reason Wabash was able to make the score look respectable is that they made 9 of those 17 attempts (most against Wooster's JV's) while OWU was only able to connect on 2 of them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2007, 12:20:32 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 28, 2007, 12:01:45 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2007, 10:41:38 AM
2. Wooster's opponents attempted the most threes.  Again, certainly due at least somewhat to the number of possessions/game, but also maybe an indicator of Wooster's improved interior defense.
It also could be attributed to the large leads Wooster would build up.  A lot of teams just revert to chucking up 3's in an attempt to get back into the game.  This past weekend's NCAC Tournament games are a perfect example of that as Wabash fell behind at the end of the 1st half and even further to start the 2nd half and ended up taking 17 attempts from beyond the arc in the 2nd half alone!  Likewise, OWU fell behind the Scots early and they ended up taking 13 2nd half 3-point attempts.  The reason Wabash was able to make the score look respectable is that they made 9 of those 17 attempts (most against Wooster's JV's) while OWU was only able to connect on 2 of them.

Good point.  And I suspect that Wooster's freshmen are still in the process of running laps as a result of that game.  Or filling and unfilling the arch with snow.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 28, 2007, 04:02:46 PM
Speaking of filling the arch, the story made the Washington Post's Express newspaper in the Eye Openers section.  We, Woo folks in the area, had quite a chuckle out of the story and the accompanying picture.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2007, 04:59:32 PM
Pictures of the arch filling:

http://www.wooster.edu/photography/files/2006-07/arch_snow/index.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 28, 2007, 05:17:18 PM
The question is why?

did I miss a link somewhere?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 28, 2007, 05:35:26 PM
First sandwiches and now snowing filling arches...is this a basketball board or what.. ;)

I wonder what the original and true origin of the story...As a loud, proud, tatooed member of Sixth Section, Phi Sigma Alpha, I am hear to tell you that the Sixth Section, The Sigs were the first to successfully fill the arch with snow in a secret clandestine operation that was not discovered by authorities until sun up.

Does anyone else have similiar claims...I am betting everyone does.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2007, 07:47:57 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 27, 2007, 09:57:30 AM
Something to keep in mind...

Since the beginning of the '03-'04 season Wooster has lost 14 games.  9 of those games were at Timken.  This suggests that Wooster's home court isn't quite as advantageous as we might otherwise believe.  As long as Transylvania manages to not soil themselves when the pipers come out, I think this could be a good game.  And really, all the pressure is on Wooster here...#2 in the country, getting the grudge match at home...it's a done deal, right?  Transy is playing with house money Friday night. 
I had been meaning to comment on this, but I kept forgetting to do so.  While you are correct, Wally, in that Timken doesn't seem to be quite the home court advantage that it once was, I think you are overstating those home losses a bit too much. 

First of all, 5 of the 9 losses have come at the hands of one team and we all know who that is?! 

Second, only 2 of the 9 losses have been by double digits and they were both at the hands of you know who?!  In fact the average margin of defeat in all 9 losses is only 6 ppg. and that includes those double digit (18 & 11) losses to Witt.   

And lastly, Wooster's NCAA tournament record isn't exactly stellar when they travel away from the friendly confines of Timken Gym.  The  Scots' all-time record in the NCAA Tournament is 13-15.  They are 9-5 in games played at Timken Gym including a 3-1 mark since the '03-'04 season, and they are only 1-8 in true road games.  Wooster is also 3-2 in neutral-site games.  Last year's win over R-MC @ Transy would be considered one of those neutral site games.  They are 0-2 in true road tournament games since '03-'04.  To further illustrate Wooster's road struggles in the tournament, they have lost their last 5 tournament road games.  Their last tournament road win came way back in the '96-'97 season at ONU.

So, it's not really hard to guess that, even though visiting teams can have success at Timken, given the Scots' performance on the road in NCAA Tournament games over the years, and I'd say they would much much rather be playing at home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2007, 08:30:24 PM
Here’s how our teams and players fared in the final NCAA statistical rankings:

Team rankings:
Scoring (team): Wooster 89.4 ppg (#6 nationally) [Redlands, 117.1 ppg]
Team defense: Wittenberg 58.8 ppg (#7); Ohio Wesleyan 64.2 ppg (#46) [Miss. College, 56.4 ppg]
Scoring margin: Wooster +18.9 ppg (#2); Wittenberg +12.1 ppg (#23); Ohio Wesleyan +11.4 ppg (#26) [Amherst, 21.8 ppg]
Team FG %: Wooster 52.0% (#3) [Whitworth, 52.8%]
FG % defense: Wittenberg 38.5% (#12) [NYU, 35.5%]
Three-point FGs per game: Wooster 10.0 (#10); Ohio Wesleyan 8.2 (#43) [Redlands, 18.3]
Three-point FG %: Wooster 41.7% (#6) [Augustana, 44.1%]
Free throw %: Hiram 78.9% (#3); Wooster 76.6% (#12); Oberlin 76.5% (#14); Wittenberg 73.2% (#44); Earlham 73.2% (#47) [UW-Stevens Point, 81.8%]
Rebound margin: Wooster +7.1 (#16); Wittenberg +4.9 (#48) [NYU, +10.1]
Assists per game: Wooster 18.6 (#8) [Emory & Henry, 20.9]
Blocked shots per game: Ohio Wesleyan 3.8 (#48) [Christopher Newport, 6.7]
Turnovers per game: Ohio Wesleyan 11.2 (#5); Earlham 11.8 (#9); Wittenberg 11.8 (#10); Wooster 12.9 (#31) [UW-Stevens Point, 8.4]
Personal fouls per game: Earlham 15.2 (#12); Wittenberg 16.0 (#34) [Carleton, 13.2]

Individual rankings:
Scoring (individual): Dan Hodgkinson, Denison 20.8 ppg (#26); Andrew Zimmer, Wabash 19.6 ppg (#49) [Mike Hoyt, Mt. St. Mary 34.5 ppg]
Field goal %: Ben Chojnacki, Ohio Wesleyan 60.9% (#20); Dan Hodgkinson, Denison 60.5% (#22) [Michael Romes, Mt. St. Joseph 68.4%]
Free throw %: Jordan Beard, Oberlin 88.9% (#12); Mike Staley, Hiram 88.3% (#13) [Joseph Chatham, Lesley 94.7%]
Rebounding: Dane Borchers, Wittenberg 10.1 rpg (#24) [Nick Harrington, So. Vermont 13.4 rpg]
Assists: Mike Staley, Hiram 6.5 apg (#9) [Davd Arseneault, Grinnell 8.5 apg]
Blocked Shots per game: Dane Borchers, Wittenberg 1.9 (#41) [Kerry Gibson, UW-Oshkosh 3.8]

Congratulations to all of these players; you make us fans all proud.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on February 28, 2007, 08:58:57 PM
Quote from: sac on February 28, 2007, 05:17:18 PM
The question is why?
Are college students supposed to need a logical reason to do something very emphatically?  ??? :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 28, 2007, 09:56:05 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 21, 2007, 08:28:21 PM
This would be my line up for POY,1st-2nd Team All NCAC.
There has been a few times where the NCAC had 6 players on 1st team and 6 players on 2nd team.  This is kind of a stretch... 7 guys on 1st team and 6 guys on 2nd team, but here it goes....

Player of the Year : 
#33 Thomas Port        *Wooster

1st Team:
#23 James Cooper       *Wooster
#41 Dan Hodgkinson  *Denison
#45 Dane Borchers     *Wittenberg
#40 Markous Jewett    *Earlham
#52 Andrew Zimmer   *Wabash
#33 Ben Chojnacki      *OWU

2nd Team:

#42Ryan Hollihan         *Gheny
#10 Brandon Johnson   *Wooster
#34 Tim Vandervaart    *Wooster
#50 Dustin Rudegeair   *OWU
#11 Greg Hill                *Wittenberg
#32 Quinton Spencer    *Oberlin   


Honorable Mention:
Earlhamalum  

Yes I'm giving myself credit!!! :)

Okay so I didn't get the Kenyon player.. who would of thunk they would of put 7 guys on both 1st team and 2nd team...  I thought 7 and 6 was kind of a stretch.  I am a little curious why they would now go to a 7 and 7 format and then have the same amount of people on H.M.  as a former H.M. player I'm thinking do I move myself up to 2nd team...  I just think if you are going to do HONORs like that year in year out keep it the same.  I like 6 1st team (with one POY), 5 2nd team, and 7 H.M... then again whocares what I think  :'(

P.S.  Good Luck WOOSTER!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 28, 2007, 09:57:06 PM
Actually, there is a reason to fill the arch with snow according to the Wooster tradition. :)  As the Wooster newspaper noted in its article about this years event:

In keeping with College of Wooster tradition, hundreds of students gathered on campus Tuesday night, February 13th to fill the arch with snow.

"Legend has it that if the arch can be filled to the top with snow during the night, blocking the main doors, classes will be canceled the next day," according to the college's Web site.

While no one is certain of the true origin, John Finn, the college's director of public information, said he believes the rumor originated in an edict issued years ago by school administration, a member of which once reportedly said "classes would be canceled only after snow reached a height to fill the arch."

In past years, filling the arch has not always resulted in the cancellation of classes.  This year however, classes were cancelled because the heavy snow clogged Wooster's streets and prevented some members of the college staff from getting to campus on Wednesday morning. :)

Anyone want to bet if Wooster students will fill the arch next winter?  ;D :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2007, 10:07:32 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on February 28, 2007, 09:56:05 PMYes I'm giving myself credit!!! :)

Okay so I didn't get the Kenyon player.. who would of thunk they would of put 7 guys on both 1st team and 2nd team... 

You might want to stop patting yourself on the back long enough to note that there were eight second teamers; besides Kenyon's Bryan Yelvington, you also missed Hiram's Mike McDevitt.

Still, that's a pretty excellent ballot you filled out.  You may resume patting now. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on February 28, 2007, 10:10:18 PM
8.... ooopppsss... gzzz 4 years later I might of even had a chance at 1st team....... NOW that was funny... but 8... gzzz I wish Earlham would of had 8 guys that could of played basketball on their RosteR this year!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on February 28, 2007, 10:12:03 PM
Wooscotsfan: too funny! Thanks for the inside look. I would be way in favor of participating if I had been a student. :o

It was, of course, upper 60's and sunny out here in Cali today, blue sky (air pollution washed away by rain last night), white puffy clouds, palm trees (aka overzealous grass) swaying in the breeze... can we trade... for a day or two? :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 28, 2007, 10:42:41 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on February 28, 2007, 10:12:03 PM
Wooscotsfan: too funny! Thanks for the inside look. I would be way in favor of participating if I had been a student. :o

It was, of course, upper 60's and sunny out here in Cali today, blue sky (air pollution washed away by rain last night), white puffy clouds, palm trees (aka overzealous grass) swaying in the breeze... can we trade... for a day or two? :)

Today I scraped ice encrusted snow off a driveway........it was overcast, gray, and cold.  None of our trees have leaves on them and there are no palm trees (aka overzealous grass) in Michigan.  There was no pollution because all of our polluting jobs are in Mexico now.

I am now looking forward to an mix of snow, sleet, and freezing rain tonight and tommorrow.  I'm actually giddy with delight that it may turn to all rain in the afternoon with a high of 41.........another chance to scrape the ice encrusted compacted snow off the driveway.  :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 28, 2007, 10:54:24 PM
yes 5 of the 9 are to wittenberg but the other 4 include OAC teams such as Ohio NOrthern this year, John Carroll 2 years ago, and Baldwin-WAllace last year, so caution Wooster fans don't count Capital if the matchup arises with them as a shoo-in victory.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 28, 2007, 11:03:34 PM
How about a hand for our buddy Aaron Dorksen of the Wooster Daily Record.

He received second place in the Associated Press Sports Editors annual awards.

Dorksen took second in the Under 40,000 circulation feature story category.

Advice from a fellow journalist: Play to your strengths. Hide all the pens in the house when you get the urge to write another column.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2007, 11:14:21 PM
I don't think that either the Wooster coaching staff, the team, or any of the fans, at least those who pay some attention, are taking any of the teams that will be visiting this weekend lightly.  My advice, though, should Wooster get matched up with Capital on Saturday, would be to follow Jack Nicholson's motto in A Few Good Men.  Walk softly and have an armored marine division covering your back.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 28, 2007, 11:32:13 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 28, 2007, 11:03:34 PM
How about a hand for our buddy Aaron Dorksen of the Wooster Daily Record.

Dorksen took second in the Under 40,000 circulation feature story category.

Hmmm....was the "Dorksen Eight" article the feature story that won him this award?!  :) :P :D

On a more serious note, Congrats to Aaron Dorksen on receiving this national recognition.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2007, 12:10:51 AM
How did Lucas Sullivan do?  Given his record of accuracy, I expect he's in the "fiction" category.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 01, 2007, 12:13:29 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 01, 2007, 12:10:51 AM
How did Lucas Sullivan do?  Given his record of accuracy, I expect he's in the "fiction" category.  :D

That's beautiful.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2007, 12:17:52 AM
I must say that we are enjoying an embarrassment of riches when we get to complain about how crummy the reporters that cover our teams are.  Most D3 schools can't even their scores reported in the local paper, much less get inaccurate and inflammatory feature stories written about them.  :-X
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 01, 2007, 12:26:06 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 01, 2007, 12:17:52 AM
Most D3 schools can't even their scores reported in the local paper, much less get inaccurate and inflammatory feature stories written about them.  :-X

Don't worry - since football and men's basketball seasons are over, that's what Wittenberg will deal with.  Anything but those two sports is lucky to get a box score.

How is it at Wooster?  I'm sure there is some quality coverage of the baseball team given their high national ranking every year, but what about all the other sports?

For that matter, what is the reporting like around the rest of the conference as a whole?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 01, 2007, 08:59:50 AM
Was that a national award or a local Ohio award? Because every six months or so I see articles in newspapers trumpeting the fact that this reporter won third place in the light middle flyweight feature story division.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on March 01, 2007, 09:40:46 AM
QuoteWas that a national award or a local Ohio award? Because every six months or so I see articles in newspapers trumpeting the fact that this reporter won third place in the light middle flyweight feature story division.

That reminds me of the paper I read growing up that would announce its state winners every year. It always allowed me to add "The Award Winning" before another adjective and the name of the paper.

This was the Associated Press Sports Editors, so that's the biggest deal (though of course it was a low weight class...it wasn't like he was going head-to-head with the times).

I'm still new to the full-time business, but I believe these awards on based on just one story. All of this makes little sense to me, a reporter/writer can produce garbage for 364 days a year, but still be deemed award-winning with one good sweep of the pen. And, again, the release didn't say what the subject of this award-winning story was, just a feature of some sort.

By the way, I speak not out of professional jealousy. I think very little of these awards, though they do supposedly help your resume. I was actually told to prepare a story of mine for the state contest (that's coming up sometime). I looked at the managing editor a little crazy, knowing that that story was hardly my best work. Oh well, maybe it will finish 3rd or 4th in some category and we can all post about it here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on March 01, 2007, 09:53:26 AM
Oh, I just came across the APSE/Ohio results:

DIVISION III, Newspapers with daily circulation of 13,000 to 24,999
Best Web Site: The (Dover-New Philadelphia) Times Reporter; The (Hamilton) JournalNews; The (Findlay) Courier.

Best Sports Columnist: Aaron Dorksen, The (Wooster) Daily Record; Bruce Hefflinger, The (Defiance) Crescent-News; Dave Hanneman, The (Findlay) Courier; Joe Arnold, Lancaster Eagle-Gazette; Rick Noland, The Medina Gazette.

Best Sports Writer: Aaron Dorksen, The (Wooster) Daily Record; Dave Hanneman, The (Findlay) Courier; Joe Arnold, Lancaster Eagle-Gazette; Mark Heiman, The (Findlay) Courier.

Best Game Story: Bryan Schaaf, The (Wooster) Daily Record, "Champions!"; Dave Purpura, The (Newark) Advocate, "Pellet Powers NC"; Joe Arnold, Lancaster Eagle-Gazette, "Well Worth the Wait"; Skip Weaver, Middletown Journal, "Panther Pressure Wallops Warriors."

Best Sports Enterprise: Dave Hanneman, The (Findlay) Courier, "FHS and Substance Abuse"; Jamie Baker and Mark Heiman, The (Findlay) Courier, "New OHSAA Divisions"; Patrick Meyers, Steubenville Herald-Star, "Zamana: Central's Angel in the Outfield"; Skip Weaver and John Bombatch, Middletown Journal, "An Era Comes to a Close."

Best Special Sports Section: The (Newark) Advocate, "The Game"; Elyria Chronicle-Telegram, "High School Football Preview"; The (Wooster) Daily Record, "High School Football Preview: Throwback Edition"; Middletown Journal, "Career Dreams."

Best Daily Sports Section: Elyria Chronicle-Telegram; The (Newark) Advocate; The (Findlay) Courier; Middletown Journal.

Best Sports Photo: Bridget Commiso, The Medina Gazette, "Pinned"; Daniel Kraus, The (Ashtabula) Star-Beacon, "What Gravity?"; Eric George, The (Newark) Advocate, "State Track"; Frank Robertson, Chillicothe Gazette, "State Volleyball"; Jim Noelker, Middletown Journal, "T-Ball."


Feel lucky Wooster, you have one of the three best columnists and writers in the entire state of Ohio.....in papers that entered the contest....and with circulations 13,000-24,999.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on March 01, 2007, 11:14:24 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on March 01, 2007, 12:26:06 AM
How is it at Wooster?  I'm sure there is some quality coverage of the baseball team given their high national ranking every year, but what about all the other sports?

When I was at Wooster (more than a few years ago), I worked in the SID office, covering the college sports teams. For sports other than football, men's basketball, and baseball, everything written in the Daily Record came from student reporters in the SID office. All sports were covered in the Daily Record, sometimes just in a round-up, sometimes with a full by-lined article. Although it was the Daily Record, it was nice to see my name printed as the reporter.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2007, 11:26:53 AM
Quote from: pufin on March 01, 2007, 11:14:24 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on March 01, 2007, 12:26:06 AM
How is it at Wooster?  I'm sure there is some quality coverage of the baseball team given their high national ranking every year, but what about all the other sports?

When I was at Wooster (more than a few years ago), I worked in the SID office, covering the college sports teams. For sports other than football, men's basketball, and baseball, everything written in the Daily Record came from student reporters in the SID office. All sports were covered in the Daily Record, sometimes just in a round-up, sometimes with a full by-lined article. Although it was the Daily Record, it was nice to see my name printed as the reporter.

These days, the byline on such stories just reads "COLLEGE NEWS SERVICE." 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2007, 11:35:51 AM
Interesting that, in his preview of the men's tournament (http://www.d3hoops.com/salem/07/preview.htm), Pat seems to think that the sectional will be held on the court of one of the upper-half teams, possibly Rochester, even though he seems to think that Wooster will advance through this weekend.  I'm not sure how the New York State teams grade out in terms of the hosting criteria, but I can't see how Rochester, who's not even hosting a regional, would get a sectional nod over Wooster.  St. John Fisher, maybe, although I know nothing about their facilities.  It'll be interesting to see how it all plays out. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on March 01, 2007, 11:53:58 AM
David, I thought about that when I was filling out my bracket. It's probably more about distances. If the four teams will be Williams, Rochester, Wooster and JCU, then the only option for a flight-free location is Rochester (or possibly JCU).

Williams to Rochester ~260 miles
Williams to JCU ~495 miles
Williams to Wooster ~555 miles
Rochester to Wooster ~310 miles
Rochester to JCU ~250 miles
JCU to Wooster ~60 miles

The presence of Williams shifts the sectional up north into NY. If, for example, Brockport were to get through, Wooster is a possibility. The presence of St. Lawrence probably eliminates Wooster, but keeps JCU in the hunt for hosting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2007, 12:12:15 PM
I guess that's the case.  Considering we have teams in this section spread from Boston, MA (Wentworth) to Danville, KY (Centre)--a distance of just over 1000 miles--we'll have to see who wins Saturday before having a good idea of sectional hosting duties.  A sectional made up of Rochester or Fisher, Brockport, Wooster, and any of the LEC/JCU/Westminster pod would be within 500 miles of one another, I believe.  As you suggest, it's the rest of the Brockport pod that messes things up (the rest of the Wooster pod does, too, but I won't care where the sectional is held if Wooster's not in it), so Go Golden Eagles!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 01, 2007, 12:27:01 PM
Quote from: pufin on March 01, 2007, 11:53:58 AM
David, I thought about that when I was filling out my bracket. It's probably more about distances. If the four teams will be Williams, Rochester, Wooster and JCU, then the only option for a flight-free location is Rochester (or possibly JCU).

Williams to Rochester ~260 miles
Williams to JCU ~495 miles
Williams to Wooster ~555 miles
Rochester to Wooster ~310 miles
Rochester to JCU ~250 miles
JCU to Wooster ~60 miles

The presence of Williams shifts the sectional up north into NY. If, for example, Brockport were to get through, Wooster is a possibility. The presence of St. Lawrence probably eliminates Wooster, but keeps JCU in the hunt for hosting.

Bingo -- pufin channels my thoughts correctly here. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 01, 2007, 03:33:39 PM
i'd agree-if perhaps it was like last year with Wittenberg and Mississippi College's presence-then Wooster may be the central location......

John Carroll winning the region according to the Tournament Preview? I'm not so sure about that one
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 01, 2007, 03:59:53 PM
Why not John Carroll? 

- They were the champions of one of the tougher conferences in the nation
- They open at home against a team that is only in the tournament because an extra Pool B slot opened up at the last minute, then play what most people consider to be a pretty soft 25-2 team.  JCU is essentially cruising into the Salacious 16. 
- The third game for JCU will be against whoever survives the Woo/Transy/Cap/Centre meatgrinder and that game will almost certainly be played on a neutral floor.
- The final step on the way to Salem for JCU will be against whoever survives the Eastern portion of this region, none of which are currently ranked in the top 25. 

So really, it would appear that the biggest obstacle between JCU and Salem is Wooster who is a traditional tournament underacheiver and may not even make it to a potential game vs. JCU.  Really, I think the one team JCU doesn't want to see in this region is Capital who beat the Streaks twice this season.  JCU is anything but a longshot to make it to Salem. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 01, 2007, 04:40:35 PM
John Carroll is not the conference champion-they received a Pool C berth-but after your theory is stated i guess they could be considered. I dont have much knowledge about the East teams, so who knows
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on March 01, 2007, 05:06:44 PM
We're collecting previews for each team in the tourney on one of the multiregional boards. If I get them by friday I may even be able to stick them in one document for people to peruse. A fun little tourney resource of sorts. Could someone here do one for Wooster? Since there are a zillion Wooster fans, I'm assuming this is possible. :D ;) Thanks!

http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=5147.0
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 01, 2007, 05:07:57 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 01, 2007, 04:40:35 PM
John Carroll is not the conference champion-they received a Pool C berth-but after your theory is stated i guess they could be considered. I dont have much knowledge about the East teams, so who knows
JCU was actually Co-champs with Cap in the regular season.  The reason Cap hosted the tournament is because they won the tiebreaker.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 01, 2007, 10:38:07 PM
Transy's Coach Brian Lane obviously did not want to give Wooster any bulletin board material so he said plenty of nice things about the Scots when the Daily Record sportswriter called for his comments. :)

Read the full story and Coach Lane's comments here: http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1666632
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 01, 2007, 10:50:52 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 01, 2007, 03:59:53 PM
Why not John Carroll? 

- They were the champions of one of the tougher conferences in the nation

Augie was the regular season and tournament champion of THE toughest conference in the nation this year.  They are now gone.

There's a reaon they call it March Madness! :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 01, 2007, 11:11:24 PM
Quote from: pufin on March 01, 2007, 11:53:58 AM
David, I thought about that when I was filling out my bracket. It's probably more about distances. If the four teams will be Williams, Rochester, Wooster and JCU, then the only option for a flight-free location is Rochester (or possibly JCU).

Williams to Rochester ~260 miles
Williams to JCU ~495 miles
Williams to Wooster ~555 miles
Rochester to Wooster ~310 miles
Rochester to JCU ~250 miles
JCU to Wooster ~60 miles

The presence of Williams shifts the sectional up north into NY. If, for example, Brockport were to get through, Wooster is a possibility. The presence of St. Lawrence probably eliminates Wooster, but keeps JCU in the hunt for hosting.

Yes, if St. Lawrence gets through the first 2 rounds, the sectional will almost certainly be hosted in either the Rochester area or the Cleveland area (JCU or Lake Erie).

I ran the mapquest directions from Canton, NY (St. Lawrence) to Wooster, OH and got 512.6 miles.  >:(  Is there some road in rural NY that could be shortened by 13 miles? ;D

A few years ago, Potsdam State made the trip all the way to Wooster for a NCAA tourney game and Potsdam is a greater distance than St. Lawrence.  However, it was only a 2nd round game (not a sectional) and it occurred because Potsdam pulled a road upset in Erie, Pa two days earlier vs. Penn St. Behrend.  Potsdam never went home after their 1st round win -- they just took their bus from Erie, PA on down to Wooster. :D

So, Wooster needs Brockport State to win two games this weekend if they want any shot at hosting a sectional.  As DC noted, Go Golden Eagles!

First things first though, Wooster needs to take care of its own draw starting with Transy tomorrow night.

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on March 01, 2007, 11:23:37 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 01, 2007, 10:38:07 PM
Transy's Coach Brian Lane obviously did not want to give Wooster any bulletin board material so he said plenty of nice things about the Scots when the Daily Record sportswriter called for his comments. :)

Read the full story and Coach Lane's comments here: http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1666632
LOL! if you've listened to the Hoopsville broadcast interview archive, you'd know right away how affable Coach Lane comes off. But, since he reads the board (as per the interview) it's very possible he didn't want to give the NCAC posting board bulletin board material either! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 01, 2007, 11:40:53 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on March 01, 2007, 11:23:37 PMBut, since he reads the board (as per the interview) it's very possible he didn't want to give the NCAC posting board bulletin board material either!

So he's not going to weigh in on the subs vs. sandwich debate? Weak. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on March 01, 2007, 11:44:41 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on March 01, 2007, 11:40:53 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on March 01, 2007, 11:23:37 PMBut, since he reads the board (as per the interview) it's very possible he didn't want to give the NCAC posting board bulletin board material either!
So he's not going to weigh in on the subs vs. sandwich debate? Weak. :D
If it's not a whole grain, dark, nutty sorta bread, gotta go for the sub.  :D

Let's not have any more coaches posting... I got freaked out enough by the Cal Tech coach coming on the board to reprimand me for a dumb post, thanks.  :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 01, 2007, 11:46:03 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on March 01, 2007, 11:44:41 PMLet's not have any more coaches posting... I got freaked out enough by the Cal Tech coach coming on the board to reprimand me for a dumb post, thanks.

Seriously? What's the story with that?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on March 02, 2007, 12:02:21 AM
Well, you could just read the last page of the SCIAC board :P Or not! :D :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2007, 02:01:56 AM
Quote from: diehardfan on March 02, 2007, 12:02:21 AM
Well, you could just read the last page of the SCIAC board :P Or not! :D :-[

My vote would be "not;" there's a lot of ugliness there, and April was valiantly trying to make peace when she got snared; the real villain got away.  I'd suggest leaving it alone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: JK on March 02, 2007, 08:26:28 AM
Six Killed in Bluffton baseball bus crash... this is just awful.   Our thoughts and prayers to all in the Bluffton Family:

http://msn.foxsports.com/other/story/6522208
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedAlum on March 02, 2007, 07:01:46 PM
CONGRATULATIONS TO THE BIG RED!! 

THE GALS JUST CRUSHED HOPE 82-66!!!!1

CAN YOU PLEASE GIVE THEM A LITTLE RESPECT!!!!

SEE YA HOPE!!!!!!  RANKED 5TH AND PICKED TO RETURN TO THE FINAL FOUR!!!

BYE BYE

GOOD LUCK TO THE SCOTS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 02, 2007, 09:42:20 PM
Final score from Timken:

Wooster 92 - 66 Transylvania

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 02, 2007, 10:02:25 PM
Ok, with Williams out, if Wooster wins tomorrow have their chances of hosting increased?  It would either be two New York schools travelling to Ohio or two Ohio schools travelling to New York, or so it seems.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2007, 11:18:43 PM
Just got back from Timken where I watched Wooster dissect the Pioneers. :)

This game was essentially over at the half as Wooster played very tough defense and held Transy to only 32% shooting in the first half while the Scots were on fire with 60%.

Wooster was led tonight by James Cooper with 21 points, Tom Port with 19 points (5 of 6 behind the arc), Brandon Johnson with 17 points and Tim Vandervaart with 9 points.

As a team, Wooster made 9 of 16 three pointers tonight (56%) and also won the rebound battle by a 35-25 count.

Wooster is now 26-3. ;D  Next up is Centre tomorrow night in 2nd round

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2007, 11:29:20 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 02, 2007, 10:02:25 PM
Ok, with Williams out, if Wooster wins tomorrow have their chances of hosting increased?  It would either be two New York schools travelling to Ohio or two Ohio schools travelling to New York, or so it seems.

Wooster Booster -- Williams getting knocked out probably increases Wooster chances of hosting a sectional but St. Lawrence (Canton, NY) is still a problem because their campus is 512 miles from Wooster (over 500 miles and the NCAA is supposed to pay for airline travel which they try to avoid at all costs).

If Wooster wins tomorrow and Brockport State beats St. Lawrence (a tough task on St. Lawrence's home floor), I think that there is a very high probability that Wooster would host the sectional.  Brockport State is within 500 miles of Woo.

If Wooster and St. Lawrence both win tomorrow, the sectional may go to Rochester or Cleveland since both sites would be less than 500 miles for all 4 teams in the sectional.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2007, 11:39:45 PM
Actually, there is one other potential complication in my dream hosting scenario because I just realized that Plattsburgh State knocked off Rochester tonight.  >:( Plattsburgh, NY is also well over 500 miles from Wooster.  >:(

So, Wooster may need BOTH Brockport State (beating St. Lawerence) and St. John Fisher (beating Plattsburgh) to garner wins in order for the Scots to host a sectional.  SJF has the easier task because they are playing at home vs. Plattsburgh tomorrow.

So, Go Wooster, Go Brockport and Go St. John Fisher!  :) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 02, 2007, 11:41:20 PM
Using a quick mapquest of just the cities

St. John Fisher (Pittsford NY)   316 miles from Wooster
Plattsburgh State (Plattsburgh NY)  634 miles.

Brockport State (Brockport NY) 305 miles
St. Lawrence (Canton NY)   512  miles (under 500 for JCU)

So Wooster is rooting for St. John Fisher and Brockport State Saturday
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2007, 12:00:51 AM
Let's take it as granted that Wooster can only host the sectional if it includes both St. John Fisher and Brockport St. (since both Plattsburgh and Canton are more than 500 miles away).  The question then becomes who gets the nod?  This is from the last QoWI run, through Saturday's games:

4   10.818   1   Lake Erie   0.955 (21-1)   25-2
15   10.423   2   St. John Fisher   0.808 (21-5)   22-5
19   10.296   3   Brockport State   0.815 (22-5)   23-5
27   10.091   2   Wooster   0.909 (20-2)   25-3
31   10.040   3   John Carroll   0.720 (18-7)   19-9

Lake Erie is the clear choice, but they haven't got the appropriate gym.  The other 4 are within 500 miles of each other, so any could host without a flight.  JCU looks like the 4th choice.  Wooster had the better win %, but Fisher had the better QoWI.  Not knowing anything at all about their facilities, my guess would be Fisher would be the higher seed and would host.  Another plus would be that both Fisher and Brockport would be local, and I'm sure the NCAA would like that (travel cost savings plus attendance boost.)

If either Fisher or Brockport loses, but not both, then the one who wins will host the sectional almost for sure.  If they both lose, then there is no scenario where a flight is avoided (since Plattsburgh is so far away from Ohio), so my guess would be JCU (if they win) or St. Lawrence (if Lake Erie wins)--these are the one-flight locations (Plattsburgh flying to Cleveland, or Wooster flying to Canton.)

The more I think about it, the less likely it seems that Wooster will host the sectional with a win.  But cheer up; I'm practically always wrong about stuff like this.  ;D

In the meantime, we still have to beat Centre tomorrow night.  First things first.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2007, 10:54:48 AM
Here is the link to the Daily Record article on Wooster's win last night:
Wooster routs Transy (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1676811/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 03, 2007, 06:36:58 PM
This is a geeky/neat trick for those watching and listening to the Wooster games online.

If you have two computers connected to the internet, one connected directly through the ethernet and the other one connected wirelessly to the same network, you might be in luck.  The game video on the computer that is connected directly to the ethernet will be about 15 seconds faster than the one connected to the wireless.  The same goes for the radio feed as well. So there is your chance for instant replay!

I tested this theory at my friend's house and it worked.  Please try it and let me know if it works for you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 03, 2007, 08:09:22 PM
Quote from: WooMix on March 03, 2007, 06:36:58 PM
This is a geeky/neat trick for those watching and listening to the Wooster games online.

If you have two computers connected to the internet, one connected directly through the ethernet and the other one connected wirelessly to the same network, you might be in luck.  The game video on the computer that is connected directly to the ethernet will be about 15 seconds faster than the one connected to the wireless.  The same goes for the radio feed as well. So there is your chance for instant replay!

I tested this theory at my friend's house and it worked.  Please try it and let me know if it works for you.
Great job!

The videofeed from Woo is great tonight!

Woo by 19;  66-45 6:19 minutes left.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 03, 2007, 08:23:33 PM
Here is a link to prove my point above:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MlOOamOZSAg

It turns out that the time difference between the two video feeds was about 12 seconds today.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 03, 2007, 08:33:35 PM
Final from Timken Gymnasium:

Wooster 73 - 56 Centre

For a team highly touted as a defense stalwart, I expected better from Centre.  This game was essentially over by halftime.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 03, 2007, 08:48:29 PM
I love it when Wooster fans feel it necessary to dump on every team that they beat.  Hoops snobbery at it's finest.   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DLP on March 03, 2007, 08:48:58 PM
according to the scoreboard....both St. John Fisher and Brockport won...hmm...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 03, 2007, 09:06:46 PM
So with St John's Fisher, Brockport St, John Carroll and Wooster all winning tonight, who is likey to host the sectionals next week? From the little I have read on the board people are saying Wooster? Can anyone confirm this?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 03, 2007, 09:11:46 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 03, 2007, 08:48:29 PM
I love it when Wooster fans feel it necessary to dump on every team that they beat.  Hoops snobbery at it's finest.   ::)
What's that saying about jealousy and contempt??? ??? ::)

Why is it that you feel it necessary to make some snide derogatory remark towards anything Wooster or Wittenberg related???  It'd be nice to actually come in here and see a post from you congratulating Wooster on 2 fine performances so far in the tournament, but then again, I might have to start looking for signs of the Apocalypse if that were to happen?! ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 03, 2007, 09:12:32 PM
So 16 points under the Wooster season average isn't good enough? Yeesh...

Of course every game Centre lost this year, they gave up over 70 points. They only won once when they gave up over 70, a 72-71 squeaker at Hendrix, a team they pasted 75-38 earlier.

I think holding Capital to 55 and Wooster 16 under their season average is a good testament to their D.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 03, 2007, 09:13:56 PM
Scots Fan - The comment of "I expected better" did seem snobbish, though.

I mean, I expected better out of the NCAC officials this year, but you know, I was disappointed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 03, 2007, 09:21:49 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 03, 2007, 09:11:46 PMIt'd be nice to actually come in here and see a post from you congratulating Wooster on 2 fine performances so far in the tournament, but then again, I might have to start looking for signs of the Apocalypse if that were to happen?!

I don't think you realize how hard it is to do that as a fan of another school when you read stuff like this:

Quote from: WooMix on March 03, 2007, 08:33:35 PMFor a team highly touted as a defense stalwart, I expected better from Centre.  This game was essentially over by halftime.

or, even this nugget:

Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 25, 2007, 12:56:59 AMNothing, NOTHING, could have pleased me more, besides Wooster winning the tournament, than watching Wittenberg get sent home early.  Enjoy the early off-season and living in that slum of a town you call Springfield.  And have fun with your second-division team next year.

When we (Wabash, Witt, other NCAC fans) read stuff like that you shouldn't be surprised we aren't tripping over ourselves to congratulate you on your wins. Especially since Centre apparently wasn't worth the hype. [/sarcasm]

I'm not saying Wabash fans are all a bunch of saints. We say stupid stuff all the time, too. But none of us gets a free pass on it. This is a message board. If you don't like getting called out, don't say stuff that merits getting called out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on March 03, 2007, 09:31:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 03, 2007, 12:00:51 AM
  JCU looks like the 4th choice.  Wooster had the better win %, but Fisher had the better QoWI.  Not knowing anything at all about their facilities, my guess would be Fisher would be the higher seed and would host. 

Took some digging but Fisher's gym holds 1200.  Would they still be the best hosting site if Wooster could more than double that in one night in terms of capacity?

https://beta.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=22630794&postID=114024672057945593

http://bombers.ithaca.edu/Pdfs/wvball/2005/7/26/%209482-Volleyball%20final.pdf
(see page 22 i think about opponents)


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2007, 09:34:18 PM
Wooster did end up shooting 55.4% for the game, and Centre was eighth in D3 in FG% defense (38.1%), so you could argue that Centre didn't play very well.  But the Colonels dictated the tempo for the first half, and it was Wooster's superior athleticism that led to the high shooting %.  Centre took a 21-19 lead with 8:03 left in the half but only scored on one other play in the half (a hoop and free throw by Patterson), failing on ten straight possessions and falling into a 15-point halftime hole.  That had to change their gameplan at both ends, since they couldn't hope to outscore the Scots by nearly a point a minute using their defense-first strategy.  That may have helped skew the final stats to make it look like Centre's defense was worse than it really was.  But Wooster's offense, especially in the person of Tim Vandervaart, was pretty much able to get the shots they wanted all night; it just took more work to find that shot than it did against Transylvania.

Actually, I think Wooster's defense was the better of the two tonight, and was the main reason the Scots were able to pull away.  The ten straight stops were based on defensive intensity (as opposed to missed opportunities by Centre). 

Centre is a very good team, but Wooster is a great team, and they played a great game.  That's no knock on Centre at all.

So go ahead, you guys, lash away at me too.  After all, I'm a Wooster fan, and evidently we're all exactly alike.   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 03, 2007, 09:43:57 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 03, 2007, 09:34:18 PM
Centre is a very good team, but Wooster is a great team, and they played a great game.  That's no knock on Centre at all.

There you go...that's how you wrap up a tournament win (or any win really) without crapping all over the team you just beat. 

It was actually my intent initially to make a post congratulating Wooster on impressively moving through the first two rounds.  Then I got sidetracked.  If Wooster shoots next weekend like they did this weekend, a return trip to Salem could very well be in the offing. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 03, 2007, 09:47:07 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 03, 2007, 09:34:18 PMI'm a Wooster fan, and evidently we're all exactly alike.

Nobody said that. No school's fans are all alike. But there are trends.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on March 03, 2007, 10:08:28 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on March 03, 2007, 09:47:07 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 03, 2007, 09:34:18 PMI'm a Wooster fan, and evidently we're all exactly alike.

Nobody said that. No school's fans are all alike. But there are trends.

;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2007, 10:11:09 PM
Just back from Timken where I watched Wooster register a convincing win against a very good 24-4 Centre team. ;D

I have to agree with David that Wooster's defense was the better of the two teams tonight.  In the last ~8 minutes of the first half, Wooster outscored the Colonels by a 20-3 count.  This run was primarily due to the Scots defense as every Centre shot was being challenged.  Centre led 21-19 early and by halftime, Wooster had taken control of the game 39-24.

IMO, the difference in Wooster's play in the last three games (OWU, Transy, Centre) has been their defensive intensity where every shot by the opponent is being challenged.  Combine strong defense with Wooster's potent offense and the Scots have notched three convincing wins.

If Wooster keeps playing defense like tonight, they have a good shot at reaching the Final Four.

Next up is old nemesis John Carroll so Wooster will need to be ready for the Streaks pressing style and containing Brandon Mimes in the lane.

Nice to see St. John Fisher and Brockport State win tonight.  Perhaps, there is a chance that we will see some games at Timken next weekend!  :)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2007, 10:51:27 PM
A few other thoughts from tonight's Wooster victory:

Kudos to Coach Steve Moore for calling 3 rolling timeouts near the end of the game so Wooster seniors Tom Port, Tim Vandervaart and Andy Van Horn could each be individually recognized with a big round of applause. :)  Coach Moore realized that this was the last game in Timken for these 3 fine seniors IF Wooster does not host the sectional next weekend.

Tim Vandervaart played a great game tonight with 18 points (8 of 11 from the field) and 7 boards.  This was Tim's highest point total since returning from his broken wrist.

Nice to see Wooster back in the Sweet 16. :)  This is the 5th time in the Sweet 16 in the last 9 seasons.

Wooster is now 27-3.    GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2007, 10:54:15 PM
Quote from: NCAA Handbook, page 7Site Selection
The Championships Committee has prioritized the following site-selection criteria for all championships:
1. Quality and availability of the facility and other necessary accommodations;
2. Geographical location (which may include such factors as rotation of sites, weather, accessibility and transportation costs);
3. Seeding; and
4. Attendance history and revenue potential, which shall be considered necessary to assure fiscal responsibility.
In addition, the men's basketball committee requires each host to videotape all contests at its site, with the intent to make available to each team a copy of the contest in which it participated. The committee also prefers sites that will not host conflicting events during the championship practice and competition. Sites will also be evaluated as to the availability of appropriate practice times for all competing teams. To host first-round, second-round or sectional contests, a regulation court as defined in 2007 NCAA Men's and Women's Basketball Rules and Interpretations must be used. To host sectional competition, arena seating for at least 1,000 spectators is required.

Everyone meets the minimum:
Fisher 1200 (thanks, blindwatchmaker)
Brockport 2000
JCU 2448
Wooster 3400

Factor one, quality of facility perhaps favors Wooster on size alone, but quality of "other necessary accomodations" might score higher in the cities (Rochester, Cleveland) than in little ol' Wooster.
Factor two, geographical location, I think clearly favors Fisher and Brockport.  Transportation costs are lower there than here in Ohio, but we have better weather!  ;)  As regards rotation of sites, Wooster hosted sectionals in 2003 and 2004, Brockport had one in 2002, and nobody else has hosted since 2001 or earlier (I only went back that far for purposes of this post), so if this is a factor at all it would work against the Scots.
Factor three, seeding, is either Fisher or Wooster; hard to guess.  But this is just factor three; the decision might not get this far.
Factor four, attendance history and revenue potential, has got to favor Wooster with its big gym and big crowds.  There's no question that there'd be more tickets sold here (by 2000+) than anywhere else.  But again the decision may be made before even thinking about this.

It will be very interesting to see what shakes out, but I'm still planning on visiting the Kodak City next weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 03, 2007, 11:03:32 PM
Seeding is #3. Interesting. In women's D-1, seeding is #1, in fact it's the only priority.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 03, 2007, 11:04:46 PM
David, I just got off the ASC Women's web site.  Here is an interesting statistic.

Chapman women had just played their first round game before 460 fans.  That brought their season attendance, home away and neutral to 3994 or 143 fans per game

They played before 4356 fans in Brownwood tonight.  That raises the cumulative fan total for Chapman to 8350 or 288 fans per game, more than doubling their previous average!  :D

There is an airport in Brownwood,  (BWD) so you might get a charter out of DFW, SAT or IAH.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 03, 2007, 11:06:17 PM
I just looked at the box score for St. Johns game tonight - 650 people attended.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 03, 2007, 11:34:28 PM
That makes sense. The residence halls closed at 6PM Friday, and they're on Spring Break. So probably the out of towners are gone. And there's enough to do in Rochester (believe it...or not...) that the locals aren't just transfixed by St. John Fisher hoops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pbrooks3 on March 03, 2007, 11:53:14 PM
Centre fans appreciate the kind words about the team and its performance tonight.  We hope to be back next year competing hard again in the NCAA Tournament.  Tonight, the Colonels simply ran up against a superior team in the College of Wooster.  Congratulations to Wooster!  I was very impressed with the Wooster squad all the way through the lineup.  When Centre shut down the primary scoring options, the Scots didn't miss a beat with their secondary guys.  Very impressive on the offensive end.  What most impressed me however was the Wooster D.  The Scots earned their stripes on the defensive side of the ball as far as I am concerned.  This is also what makes them a great team that gives them a chance to get to the final four.  Good luck! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: FisherDynasty on March 04, 2007, 03:42:06 AM
It would be a tragedy if fisher with the best remaning QoWi to not host, since they got screwed when they were 28-0 and had to travel to amherst, then the year after, although not deserving to host with 3 losses having to travel to amherst again.  They definatly should host this year, and im happy not to see amherst in the bracket again so maybe they will get to host for once since its the 3rd straight sweet 16.  If Fisher hosts, they will be the favorite to go to the final 4, although bport state is very good, and wooster may be better overall, home court advantage is huge, especially if you look at prior years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 04, 2007, 08:09:19 AM
It would not be a tradgedy if Fisher did not host. Tradgedy is what happened to the Bluffton baseball team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2007, 09:29:08 AM
Quote from: FisherDynasty on March 04, 2007, 03:42:06 AM
It would be a tragedy if fisher with the best remaning QoWi to not host, since they got screwed when they were 28-0 and had to travel to amherst, then the year after, although not deserving to host with 3 losses having to travel to amherst again.
Well, seeing that they were 28-0 and weren't rewarded the sectional, what makes you think that they will with a 23-5 record this year?  Yes, they have the higher QoWI, but if that were such an important determining factor, why is it only 3rd in the listed criteria.  It's because QoWI isn't a national indicator but merely a regional indicator and I don't think you'll find anyone to give the nod to the East over the GL as far as being the tougher region.  For an example, one of Fisher's losses came at the hands of Alfred.  Alfred played and lost to Allegheny this year 73-57!  I know comparing scores isn't a true indicator, but still...

Quote from: FisherDynasty on March 04, 2007, 03:42:06 AMIf Fisher hosts, they will be the favorite to go to the final 4, although bport state is very good, and wooster may be better overall, home court advantage is huge, especially if you look at prior years.
While I applaud your confidence, I don't know how you could seriously think of Fisher as the favorites merely because they are hosting.  From what I can gather, it doesn't seem as though Fisher makes a habit of filling the gym.  Their season average is only 573 per game and they didn't draw over 800 for any of their playoff games.  Wooster would hardly be intimidated by that sort of fan support considering they have been making a habit of winning at Wittenberg in front of over 3,000 strong!  Not to mention, Wooster has a pretty good travelling fan base, so they will have support no matter where the sectional ends up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: FisherDynasty on March 04, 2007, 10:48:01 AM
ScotsFan, yeah they dont deserve to host this year over the past 2 years no way.  I would just hope the NCAA would make up for the past years, which the probably wont. Yes Alfred is an awful team, however it is pretty tough to play at their homecourt, no excuse to lose to such a bad team but that place does suck.  Also, fisher blew them out the 2nd game.  Fisher has had a weird season, they looked mediocre in the beginning/middle of the season but have come together finally. 
Wooster is a very good program and had a very good team, and would be the favorite.  Fisher just plays much different at home, its like watching a different team play.  Either way I hope they get past bport and get to play a national powerhouse like wooster.   Bport is very good and is a bad match up for fisher since they are so athletic, we'll see.  Sorry If i came off over confident, im just bitter about 2 years ago, last year amherst did deserve to host.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 04, 2007, 10:56:11 AM
Quote from: goscots on March 04, 2007, 08:09:19 AM
It would not be a tradgedy if Fisher did not host. Tradgedy is what happened to the Bluffton baseball team.

It's early yet, but I think that's a contender for Post of the Day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2007, 11:25:39 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 04, 2007, 09:29:08 AMNot to mention, Wooster has a pretty good travelling fan base, so they will have support no matter where the sectional ends up.

Unless it ends up at Fisher, and all those traveling Scots fans have to fight over the 300 available tickets.  :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 04, 2007, 11:34:18 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 04, 2007, 11:25:39 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 04, 2007, 09:29:08 AMNot to mention, Wooster has a pretty good travelling fan base, so they will have support no matter where the sectional ends up.

Unless it ends up at Fisher, and all those traveling Scots fans have to fight over the 300 available tickets.  :(

Actually for Friday there would only be 200 tickets allocated for Scots fans.  The home team gets half and the rest are split among the other 3 teams.

If both the Scots and Fisher would win on Friday, Wooster would get 400 tickets for Saturday night - 2/3 for the home team and 1/3 for the visitors.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2007, 11:52:30 AM
Of course, the best way to solve ticket availability issues is to have Wooster host the sectional!  :) :D

Here is the link to the Daily Record newspaper story on Wooster's win over Centre:
Vandervaart steps up (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1679561)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 04, 2007, 01:09:39 PM
I'm a little late to the party, but I just wanted to chime in that I enjoyed seeing Wooster put forth two excellent efforts this weekend in Timken.  Glad I got to finally see the Scots playing at home this year.

Also, it was very nice to meet DC, cmhscots, and one other poster- sorry, I forgot your board moniker!   :-[  My apologies for not staying longer to talk, but nice to put a few faces with names.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2007, 01:11:30 PM
Unfortunately, both the Wooster and St. John Fisher websites are now confirming that St. John Fisher will host the sectional. :(

Here is the link: St. John Fisher to Host (http://athletics.sjfc.edu/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2007, 01:13:18 PM
Let the ticket rush begin!  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2007, 01:36:12 PM
After checking the St. John Fisher website, it appears that they do NOT offer any live streaming video of their home games.  >:( :'(

By comparison, Wooster has offered streaming video of key games.  The NCAA should put this factor into their useless hosting critieria for future seasons! :P

So, for those of us who can't spend 2 days in Rochester, we will be stuck listening to the audio broadcast of next weekend's games.  Aargh!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 04, 2007, 01:44:25 PM
By my quick calcuation, assuming that both games would be sold out at either venue, the NCAA is losing approximately $30,000 to $35,000 by having the game in a gym that only holds 1200 vs. 3400 (3750 listed for the home witt game).  The student tickets are cheaper, but they're students are on spring break....  I guess the NCAA isn't as money hungry as we all thought. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2007, 01:51:22 PM
Well, you have to compare that lost revenue to the costs of busing two teams from Rochester to Wooster and putting them into hotels for two or three nights.  It's probably a wash financially, but savings on travel costs are certain whereas lost revenues are speculative. 

The cost calculus hurt Miss. College and their traveling fans worse than it hurt us, as Va. Wes. has an even smaller gym than Fisher.

This is a pretty fan unfriendly decision, but not an unexpected one. 

BTW, Wooster students are on spring break next weekend too.  Spring break in Rochester...where's my tanning oil?  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 04, 2007, 02:09:08 PM
There's no doubt in my mind that Wooster students would have stayed around this weekend to watch the Scots even though they make up probably less than 1/10 of normal Wooster crowds.  Luckily at Wooster, spring break is a 2 week event which makes it even more probable students would stay for this weekend.
As far as travel costs, would they not be basically the same either way?  Two New York teams coming to Ohio, or two Ohio teams going to New York.  I understand that both teams in New York are close to each other...but is that ONE TEAM going to make the $30,000 difference?  I can hardly see how. 
I was really just trying to point out that obviously the NCAA isn't all about money, which is not a bad thing, just a bad thing for us Wooster fans >:(  Regardless...I AM definitely going.  Time to call off work on Friday  :)  I really hope the ticket situation is not a problem.. 
I looked at a few box scores to see regular attendance at St. John Fisher.  Their conference tournament final only had 750 people there, and their last NCAA tournament game, only around 650.  That's not much of a fan base considering probably 1/2 of that was their opponents fans.  What a shame.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 04, 2007, 02:16:43 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 04, 2007, 01:51:22 PMSpring break in Rochester...where's my tanning oil?

I visited a buddy near Rochester on Spring Break my sophomore year after we lost to Chicago in the tourney. Unless tanning oil burns well it probably won't be much use to you.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 04, 2007, 02:24:22 PM
Quote from: division3hoops on March 04, 2007, 02:09:08 PM
There's no doubt in my mind that Wooster students would have stayed around this weekend to watch the Scots even though they make up probably less than 1/10 of normal Wooster crowds.  Luckily at Wooster, spring break is a 2 week event which makes it even more probable students would stay for this weekend.
As far as travel costs, would they not be basically the same either way?  Two New York teams coming to Ohio, or two Ohio teams going to New York.  I understand that both teams in New York are close to each other...but is that ONE TEAM going to make the $30,000 difference?  I can hardly see how. 
I was really just trying to point out that obviously the NCAA isn't all about money, which is not a bad thing, just a bad thing for us Wooster fans >:(  Regardless...I AM definitely going.  Time to call off work on Friday  :)  I really hope the ticket situation is not a problem.. 
I looked at a few box scores to see regular attendance at St. John Fisher.  Their conference tournament final only had 750 people there, and their last NCAA tournament game, only around 650.  That's not much of a fan base considering probably 1/2 of that was their opponents fans.  What a shame.

It may be difficult to get tickets from Wooster, however.  Assuming that the players' families can get tickets before the general public. that won't leave too many for the other fans that want to make the trip.  We'll have to wait until later in the week to see the ticket policy.  According to the handbook, schools are not supposed to make any announcements regarding tickets until after the Monday conference call.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on March 04, 2007, 02:42:35 PM
Quote from: division3hoops on March 04, 2007, 01:44:25 PM
By my quick calcuation, assuming that both games would be sold out at either venue, the NCAA is losing approximately $30,000 to $35,000 by having the game in a gym that only holds 1200 vs. 3400 (3750 listed for the home witt game).  The student tickets are cheaper, but they're students are on spring break....  I guess the NCAA isn't as money hungry as we all thought. 

Potential ticket revenue doesn't seem to be considered all that much in the determination of Sectional sites.  Just thinking of the last two Sectionals IWU played in...

In 2001, the Midwest/West field was Illinois Wesleyan, Elmhurst, Chicago, and Lewis & Clark.  Chicago's Henry Crown Fieldhouse (capacity of about 1500) was selected when they could have had it at IWU (3000).  In 2006 the field was Illinois Wesleyan, Lawrence, Puget Sound, Augustana.  Lawrence's Alexander Gymnasium (1500) was selected, again, over the opportunity to sell more tickets at IWU or Augustana.

Revenue potential is priority #4 in the site selection criteria (page 7 below) and I just don't think it ever gets there.

http://www.ncaa.org/library/handbooks/basketball/2007/2007_d3_m_basketball_handbook.pdf
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: FisherDynasty on March 04, 2007, 03:54:40 PM
Fisher will be sold out extremely early, I am a little worried about getting in for the 2nd game, the first game should be sold out, im not sure what they are going to do about letting fans in for the 2nd game.  Wooster fans, I definatly feel your pain for not hosting, having the best record and having the highest ranking nationally and not hosting really stinks.  However, it has happend to us the 2 years ago when we were 28-0, last year amherst did deserve to host so im not complaining there.  Good luck agains John Carrol, I hope we get to see a Fisher vs Wooster elite 8 game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2007, 04:20:17 PM
I'm pinning my rapidly diminishing hopes on the possibility that the Friday games will be treated as two sessions, with separate ticket sales and the emptying of the gym between games.  I believe that's what they did at Albion a couple of years ago.  I guess that would double the ticket availability for Friday at least.

Failing that, I may just go and hang around outside the gym in the hopes that I can buy a Saturday ticket from a fan of the losing Rochester-area team.  Although that might be a wasted trip if the Scots don't get by the Streaks Friday.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 04, 2007, 04:45:58 PM
I think it's a shame that either Wooster or even John Carroll didn't get the chance to host. Wooster had the record, championships, ranking worthy of hosting and won't get awarded for that. Plus, their gym is tournament quality as i'm sure they could do as well as a hosting job as Wittenberg last year was able to do.
I know the Top 25 merits little consideration but its hard to imagine a team ranked in the Top 5 pretty m uch all season isn't getting their dues. dont worry if you guys prevail there will be plenty of tickets available in Salem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 04, 2007, 05:44:26 PM
It's definitely travel costs. Actually, travel costs (mileage, hotel, and meals) add up really quickly, and the fact that the two NY schools are a lot closer together than JCU and Wooster probably meant a lot in the NCAA's decision.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 04, 2007, 06:31:41 PM
So what can anyone tell me about JCU.  I know they have a really good guard - Brandon Mimes.  Have looked up some of his statistics.  Looks like a solid player.  His FT percentage could be better.  But solid in terms of scoring and rebounding.  In their cum. statistics, it shows he is 0-1 on 3 pointers for the year!  Is that a typo or is that true?  Considering he is a guard, I just assumed he'd shoot the three ball more than one time all year! 
I know JCU did do a 5 man in - 5 man out rotation.  Do they still run that? 

I've also heard they are quite the 2nd half team, at least in the last 2 games they have shown they are coming back from deficits to both Westminster and Lake Erie.
Looks like it should be a good game in Rochester of all places...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 04, 2007, 07:06:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 04, 2007, 05:44:26 PM
It's definitely travel costs. Actually, travel costs (mileage, hotel, and meals) add up really quickly, and the fact that the two NY schools are a lot closer together than JCU and Wooster probably meant a lot in the NCAA's decision.

If they are more than 25 miles apart, I'm not sure that it makes much difference.  At least according to my reading of the NCAA Travel information.   (http://www1.ncaa.org/finance/travel/index.html)   I know its close - mappoint lists Brockport and Pittsford as 25.4 miles apart, so it depends on the specific addresses of the schools.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on March 04, 2007, 07:34:39 PM
I have to say after reading the 1st three sectional sites, I thought the NCAA really got it right with 3 of the most probable Final 4 contenders hosting, and then I read St. John Fisher hosting?? That has to be considered a "traveshamockery!" (For those of you who don't remember the classic quote that's a travesty, a sham, and a mockery, all rolled into one). The only explanation that the committee can give is that they are trying to amend for Fisher not hosting in past years where they actually WERE deserving. In which case, you should NEVER try to make up for past mistakes by MAKING another HUGE one!!! Not to mention the money they'll lose in attendance, they are basically saying that rankings don't mean a thing. Gym size doesn't mean a thing. Hotel prices don't mean a thing. And above all, THE FANS, don't mean a THING!! And, whoever thinks hotels are MORE expensive in Wooster, Ohio than Rochester, New York is smoking the same stuff that the Gonzaga players were this season. Come on. I mean, I'd rather see the games at an equidistant neutral site rather than this. Why not any of the large arenas in Pittsburgh??? Between a 3 and 4 hour drive for all the schools involved.) The Igloo is always looking for events and I think 15,000 seats are PLENTY for everyone to be able to attend. One of the many D3 schools in Pittsburgh could "host" just like Division 1 does and they could get some of the money. Anyway, I wish I could be there for the games, but I won't be able to get a ticket, oh well, I'll watch it on the Internet I guess...OH WAIT!! I can't do that either because there will be NO webcast of the game either. What a crock.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2007, 07:47:52 PM
No, MoneyBall, the rankings don't mean a thing, and the fans don't mean a thing, and the NCAA unfortunately doesn't pretend that they do.  But a neutral site isn't the solution; we'd be lucky to have more than 1,000 people show up in Pittsburgh, and that'd be pretty lonely in a 15,000 seat arena.  I think JCU would have been an excellent compromise, but oddly enough nobody from the NCAA thought to ask my opinion.

As for tickets, I guess I'd hope that former players would be higher up on the food chain than the ordinary run of the mill fan like me, and I haven't given up hope yet. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 04, 2007, 08:53:39 PM
Quote from: division3hoops on March 04, 2007, 06:31:41 PM
So what can anyone tell me about JCU.  I know they have a really good guard - Brandon Mimes.  Have looked up some of his statistics.  Looks like a solid player.  His FT percentage could be better.  But solid in terms of scoring and rebounding.  In their cum. statistics, it shows he is 0-1 on 3 pointers for the year!  Is that a typo or is that true?  Considering he is a guard, I just assumed he'd shoot the three ball more than one time all year! 
I know JCU did do a 5 man in - 5 man out rotation.  Do they still run that? 

I've also heard they are quite the 2nd half team, at least in the last 2 games they have shown they are coming back from deficits to both Westminster and Lake Erie.
Looks like it should be a good game in Rochester of all places...

Brandon Mimes i am pretty sure is a center but i could be wrong, trust me he has tormented us in the past
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 04, 2007, 09:01:37 PM
Hmm interesting.  I thought something was wrong there.  Interesting though that he is listed as a Guard on JCU's website roster....
Anyone have the answer to this?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 04, 2007, 09:38:48 PM
I looked up their Media Guide and Mimes is listed as F/C.  That makes more sense.  I can't believe that they have left him listed as a guard the whole year on their roster... ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on March 04, 2007, 10:21:43 PM
Sectional team breakdown:

First After road trips from Ohio, Wooster will face JCU.

John Carroll, 21-9 (13-5 OAC), is the runner-up based on tiebreak in the OAC after tying Capital for the title.  In the NCAA tourney they defeated Westminster at home and then went on the road to defeat #1 seed Lake Erie, 79-77 after coming back from 16 points down.  They are 25th in the last D3Hoops poll and were 5th in the GLakes regional rankings.

The Blue Streaks are led by 6'5" Senior Guard Brandon Mimes, All-OAC First Teamer, who goes for 20.6 ppg and 10.5 rpg while shooting almost .500 @ .499 FG%.  Second leading scorer and rebounder is another 6'3" senior Forward Terry Walsh, All-OAC Second Team member 16.4 ppg and 6.2 rpg and leads the team 66 makes from 3 point land.  The point guard is the only other double figure scorer, 6'0" Senior Pete Moran who was also recognized as All-OAC Honorable Mention. He averages 10.2 ppg and almost 5.0 apg. From recent box scores and stats it looks like they go mainly two deep on the bench with the starters are getting more than 35 minutes per game.

Common opponents with Wooster: These teams have history in the tourney that the SCOTS websites covers.  JCU went 2-0 vs. ONU.  ONU beat Wooster 91-84.  And of note JCU went 0-2 for BW and 1-2 vs CAPITAL and some bad losses to Wilmington and Heidelberg??

St. John Fisher, 23-5 (11-3) is the conference and tourney champs of the Empire 8 conference).  They defeated Wentworth Tech and Plattsburg State at home to advance to the sweet 16. Received 3 votes in the D3Hoops poll.  They were #2 in the NCAA East regional rankings, FYI their opponent, Brockport St is #1 in the East.

St. John's has four players that average double figures.  They are led by All-E8 Second Teamer, 5'11 Senior Guard Dan Mueller, 14.2 ppg, 3.3 apg, 89 makes from long distance, hitting 3's @ .473 (all lead the team) and 6'6" Senior Center Dan McSweeney, ALL-E8 First Teamer, 12.2 ppg, 7.4 rpg and 1.5 bpg (leading the team in rbs and blocks). 6'4" Junior Forward Justin Beigel (from my hometown, Cincinnati, OH) is the third leading scorer and 2nd leading rebounder, 11.9/6.5 and was also All-E8 Second Team. 6'3" Freshman Wing Chris Baltz chips in as the fourth leading scorer 10.1 ppg.
St John's has 10 players in the rotation that average more than 10 mpg!!

There are no common opponents this year. And if they should meet Wooster and St. John Fisher would be competing for the first time.

Brockport State (25-5, 14-20 is the regular season champs and tourney runners-up in the State University Of New York Athletic Conference (SUNYAC).   They advanced past Williams and St. Lawrence to reach the sweet 16.  They are not ranked in the D3Hoops poll but are #1 NCAA in the East Region.

A three headed monster leads Brockport:  5'9" Junior Guard Sherod Harris (16.3 ppg, 4.3 apg and 58 3's connecting @ .487 clip). And 6'2" Junior Forward Brandon Williams (13.6 ppg and 8.8 rpg) are both first team all conference and 6'7" Center Contrel Parish ( 12.5 ppg, 5.3 rpg is the conference rookie of the year. Another seven players see more than 10 minutes per game in a deep rotation.

Wooster and Brockport both played Oberlin this season.  Brockport won by 12 in their first game of season and of course SCOTS swept season series. And they have played only once in the histories, the 71-72 season, a win by Brockport St.  Interestingly, Brockport went 1-1 vs. St. John Fisher already this year.  This is round 3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 04, 2007, 10:30:59 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 04, 2007, 07:47:52 PM
........but oddly enough nobody from the NCAA thought to ask my opinion.

Hall of Fame status doesn't have the power it once had.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 05, 2007, 12:14:16 AM
While I know that this weekends games: St Johns Fisher vs Brockport and Wooster vs John Carroll are occuring at St John's Fisher for some ungodly reason ::)
My question is:  what if any broadcasts of these games will be available?
In particular anything similar to the streaming live video that Wooster regullarily provides for thier home games so us fans that must suffer following our teams over the web at least are able to feel somewhat involved?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 05, 2007, 12:15:04 AM
D3hoopsNet will be producing audiocasts of all three games for NCAASports.com.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 05, 2007, 12:16:24 AM
Pat: Wow you are a man that works a light speed ;D Thank you so much not only for your prompt response but also for all your efforts to put these broadcasts on.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2007, 12:45:51 AM
Wooster's WQKT (http://wqkt.com/) will also provide radio coverage, which in turn will be streamed from the Wooster website (http://www.wooster.edu/interactive/) as usual.  I don't think there will be video.  I also don't know if they intend to cover the Fisher/Brockport game, but I'm told they did broadcast the Witt/OWU NCAC semifinal, so I guess it's a possibility.  But with D3HoopsNet's coverage, we're set regardless.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: FisherDynasty on March 05, 2007, 09:22:19 AM
I like the analysis WoosterScots Fan.  Predictions for this weekend.

Fisher Vs Bport = +5

Wooster Vs. JCU = +9

Fisher Vs. Wooster = +7


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Toph on March 05, 2007, 10:05:37 AM
Mimes is a F/C, that is a typo.  If he doesn't get going, JCU struggles offensively.  Pete Moran needs to be an offensive force if JCU hopes to win as well.  He had 5 assists Friday, but only 2 points.  I think that the area that the Streaks need to improve the most is their help defense.  At times it seems they lose their focus defensively, especially in the post, leading to blown assignments and open lay ups. 

I don't know if the Streaks have the horses to take down Wooster, but I felt the same way a couple years back when they went to the final four...so you never know.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: FisherDynasty on March 05, 2007, 10:15:17 AM
Same with Fisher Toph,  this is a rebuilding year for them as they lost 3 key starters and there next 2 reserves off the bench.  However they have really come aroudn this last weekend and the freshman a playing out of their minds, we'll see if they can keep it up.  This hosting thing after having much better regular seasons the past 2 years still has not set in yet, but I cant complain.  If you would have asked me half way through the season I would have said they probably wont even make the tourny, but after the last 4 games they are a legit contender to the final 4, should be a great wkend of basketball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 05, 2007, 11:16:19 AM
Just read your post MoneyBall and I have to agree with you on just about every point:
Quote from: MoneyBallSTL on March 04, 2007, 07:34:39 PM
The only explanation that the committee can give is that they are trying to amend for Fisher not hosting in past years where they actually WERE deserving. In which case, you should NEVER try to make up for past mistakes by MAKING another HUGE one!!!
This is typical of the NCAA.  They just never seem to learn from their mistakes!  Fisher was totally deserving of hosting the last 2 years and especially last year.  Instead Amherst gets both of them and then gets a 3rd year in a row this year.  So, instead of learning from the mistake of last season, the NCAA decides to 'make it up to Fisher' and award them the host site over a much more deserving Wooster?!  The NCAA just keeps digging itself deeper and deeper.

Quote from: MoneyBallSTL on March 04, 2007, 07:34:39 PMNot to mention the money they'll lose in attendance, they are basically saying that rankings don't mean a thing. Gym size doesn't mean a thing. Hotel prices don't mean a thing. And above all, THE FANS, don't mean a THING!! And, whoever thinks hotels are MORE expensive in Wooster, Ohio than Rochester, New York is smoking the same stuff that the Gonzaga players were this season. Come on.
Once again, I totally agree!  It all goes back to the bogus QoWI system that is in place.  Yes, Fisher has a better one than Wooster, but, it can also be argued that Wooster comes out of a much much tougher region.  I guess since Fisher was #1 in the East Region and Wooster was #2 in the GL Region, that's the difference.  Besides, I thought that seeding was only 3rd on the list of criterea.  Quality and availability of facilities is supposed to be #1.  This should be Wooster in a landslide because of the 3400+ seating capacity.  Geography is the 2nd factor and it should be a wash since you're talking about choosing to bus 2 teams from Ohio to NY or vice-versa.  The nod should have still favored the Ohio schools slightly due to lodging expenses being less in Wooster, OH than in Rochester, NY or even in Cleveland.  Then the 'seeding' factor comes into play where you would have to give a slight edge to Fisher due to the fact that they were #1 in a weaker region than Wooster.  And the 4th factor is attendance which is where Wooster is clearly the better choice over  the other 3 schools, ESPECIALLY FISHER who can't even sellout a 1500 seat gym for tournament games.  Heck, they can't even get 50% capacity!!!  Yet, Wooster, who has already drawn 3,000+ five times this season isn't given any credit for this at all.  As you said MoneyBall, it's a slap in the face to the fans.  Fisher's fans who don't even bother to show up for tournament games are rewarded, while Wooster fans, who nearly sold out a 3,400 seat gym back to back nights are slapped in the face by the NCAA!  There is one group you left out as to what doesn't mean a thing to the NCAA and that is the players who worked their tails off this season and put themselves in a solid poistion to be awarded a sectional only to see the NCAA drop the ball again?! 

Quote from: MoneyBallSTL on March 04, 2007, 07:34:39 PM
I mean, I'd rather see the games at an equidistant neutral site rather than this. Why not any of the large arenas in Pittsburgh??? Between a 3 and 4 hour drive for all the schools involved.) The Igloo is always looking for events and I think 15,000 seats are PLENTY for everyone to be able to attend. One of the many D3 schools in Pittsburgh could "host" just like Division 1 does and they could get some of the money.
This is where I don't agree.  As David said, holding the games at a neutral site would not draw well.  Local fan support at the neutral site would probably be virtually non-exhitent and having the games in 15,000 seat areanas would make the places look empty with a couple of thousand at most turning out.  Besides, the atmosphere that goes along with allowing host sites at the home of one of the schools can't be beat, at least from the experience I've had in attending both years Wooster has been awarded the host site. 

At least Fisher can count on one thing when it comes to attendance this weekend.  Wooster and JCU will probably be bringing some pretty good contingents which might help them crack the 1000 attendance threshold?! ::)  Oh how I would kill to see Fisher not even sell out it's tiny 1500 seat gym when the NCAA could have most definately been assured of at least 3000+, if not sell-outs for each session if the games were to have been played at Timken. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 05, 2007, 11:20:08 AM
Now that I got my rant out of the way, I will turn my focus onto Wooster's next opponent which has been a thorn in the side of the NCAC lately and that is John Carroll.  The Streaks have made a habit of winning at Wooster and Wittenberg lately, so maybe getting them on a neutral floor will be a change of fortune.  Along with Wooster knocking of JCU, I'm also hopeful that Brockport can knock of Fisher in the nightcap because it would mean that Wooster wouldn't be competing in a 'true' road game over the weekend.  It's well documented that the Scots have fared much better in the NCAA's when they are on the road at neutral sites than they do in 'true' road games.  Of course, Brockport would essentially be playing a home game since they are less than 1/2 hour from Fisher. 

Hopefully, Wooster can continue to play at this high level that they have brought since the post-season started and take it with them on the road this weekend.  They're only 4 wins away from accomplishing their ultimate goal and if they continue to play that the level I witnessed last weekend, I think they could be well on their way!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 05, 2007, 11:49:15 AM
Obviously, the prudent thing would be to hold it at JCU, where there are plenty of hotels and amenities in Cleveland. But, I do think the tiny difference between Brockport and St. John Fisher made ALL of the difference.

But you know, you play to win the game, no matter where it is. I do think the home court may be neutralized a bit with St. John Fisher on break. But hey, saddle up and play ball!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2007, 12:44:32 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 05, 2007, 11:49:15 AM
Obviously, the prudent thing would be to hold it at JCU, where there are plenty of hotels and amenities in Cleveland. But, I do think the tiny difference between Brockport and St. John Fisher made ALL of the difference.

Me, too, although elsewhere Pat has said elsewhere with a certain amount of definiteness that the decision was based on seeding (ostensibly a less important criterion than geography.)  Whether he has actual inside information, or is just reaching a logical conclusion, I don't know. 

Steve Moore seems to agree:
Quote from: Chad Conant, The Daily Record"I don't think John Carroll was a real strong option because geography wasn't a factor," Scots coach Steve Moore said. "They don't announce seeds, but I think that might have had a bit to do with it. My personal feeling all along was that it would be at St. John Fisher."
http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1682182



Quote from: smedindy on March 05, 2007, 11:49:15 AMBut you know, you play to win the game, no matter where it is. I do think the home court may be neutralized a bit with St. John Fisher on break. But hey, saddle up and play ball!

With the way Wooster is playing of late, I don't think the team will be fazed by playing hither or thither.  What rankles about the site selection is the effect on the fans, not the team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 05, 2007, 01:00:39 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 05, 2007, 11:49:15 AMBut you know, you play to win the game


(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cbc.ca%2Fgfx%2Ftopstory%2Fsports%2Fedwards_herman0108.jpg&hash=7eae1f4dcd9f31da1ef9b838361d3db57a99587a)

--Unavailable for comment...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 05, 2007, 01:07:13 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 05, 2007, 12:44:32 PM
With the way Wooster is playing of late, I don't think the team will be fazed by playing hither or thither.  What rankles about the site selection is the effect on the fans, not the team.
I totally agree.  Wooster seems to be on a mission since the post-season started.  The fans are the ones getting burned in this whole selection process!  I thought that attendance was supposed to be one of the critera in determining a host.  Wooster by far outdraws all of the other schools in this sectional.  So it's no secret that Wooster might bring a good following no matter whrere the games are played.  So what's the NCAA do???  The award the sectional to the school with the smallest gym, thus limiting the opportunity for many Wooster fans who might have made the trip to not make the trip at all because there were no tickets available. 

As I said on the E8 board today, it would be nice to see the officials at Fisher do the right thing and make Friday a 2 session affair clearing the gym between the 2 games!  They wanted to host the sectional so badly, now let's see them put forth a little extra effort that goes along with hosting a sectional and make friday's event 2 sessions to accomodate more fans from down here Ohio way!!!  And don't tell me it can't be done, because didn't  Albion do it 2 years ago when they hosted the sectional?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 05, 2007, 01:08:24 PM
ScotsFan:

Attendance is not the be-all and end-all. How many games has Wooster hosted in the last few years? Rotation of sites is also on that list, is it not?

Just a thought.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on March 05, 2007, 01:19:57 PM
Just ask a West Michigander about the first weekend: I wouldn't hold your breath on that split session...

But I hope this talk that C.O.W. is on a mission is right. I need at least one team to give me a reason to trek to Salem next week, and the Scots don't have UWSP standing in their way.

Go Woo
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 05, 2007, 01:27:25 PM
Why was St. John Fisher picked over Brockport St. to host? Brockport St. was ranked No. 1 in the East Region rankings.

http://www.ncaasports.com/basketball/mens/polls/rankings/diviii
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2007, 01:33:28 PM
Brockport lost in their conference tournament; Fisher won theirs.  In the SuperSecretTM final rankings, Fisher was quite likely the East #1.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 05, 2007, 01:36:58 PM
Obviously, those final rankings are on a 'need to know' basis. Which means no one "needs" to know...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: FisherDynasty on March 05, 2007, 02:42:07 PM
This has been taken from the Fisher Website:

"The St. John Fisher College Cardinals will host the NCAA Division III Championship Sectional semifinals and finals this Friday, March 9 and Saturday, March 10.  On Friday night the College of Wooster Fighting Scots (27-3) will take on the John Carroll Blue Streaks (21-9) at 6 p.m. and the Cardinals (24-5) will face off against the SUNY Brockport Golden Eagles (24-5) at 8 p.m.  The winner of each game will play Saturday night at 7 p.m..

Tickets are general admission at the following prices:
$7 for adults
$4 for senior citizens/students with ID/children
Children under 2 are free

Presale tickets will be available Tuesday, March 6 from 12 p.m. – 3 p.m. and Wednesday, March 7 from 12 p.m. – 3 p.m. in the Athletic Department main office in the Student Life Center.  Presale tickets are for Friday night only, and separate tickets must be purchased for the 6 p.m. and 8 p.m. games. Tickets for Saturday's games will go on sale Saturday night at 6 p.m."

From reading that I dont think too many fisher and bport fans will be buying tickets for the game before so Wooster and JCU fans should be able to get their tickets.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2007, 02:50:18 PM
Split session...that's excellent.  I'm not quite sure from reading the tournament handbook how many tickets Wooster and JCU will get.  Ticket distribution for split session games not involving the home team are not discussed directly in the Handbook.  No matter how it shakes out, though, it can't mean fewer and probably will mean substantially more tickets available to Wooster for presale, perhaps as many as 600.  I'm anxiously waiting to hear what the Wooster ticket office is going to do.

Also, note that there is no presale at all for Saturday games.  That means that someone as crazy as me can go to Rochester, stand in line to buy a Saturday ticket on Friday at 6, then even if I can't get into the gym Friday, I can go to the hotel and listen to Mike Breckenridge or Pat Coleman and hope that my Saturday ticket is a Scots ticket.

Thanks, FisherDynasty.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 05, 2007, 02:52:45 PM
Games at 6 and 8 but separate sessions?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 05, 2007, 02:57:14 PM
must not be anticipating a big JCU or Wooster contingent.

They'd be wrong..........the JCU band takes up 50 tickets by itself. :D  They brought a lot of people to Albion 2 years ago, as did Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 05, 2007, 02:58:57 PM
Called to check, they are indeed clearing the gym between games. Once the gym is clear, 30 minutes go on the clock.

I'd guess that gives us a real start time of 8:25 or 8:30.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 05, 2007, 03:00:34 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 05, 2007, 02:50:18 PM
Also, note that there is no presale at all for Saturday games.  That means that someone as crazy as me can go to Rochester, stand in line to buy a Saturday ticket on Friday at 6, then even if I can't get into the gym Friday, I can go to the hotel and listen to Mike Breckenridge or Pat Coleman and hope that my Saturday ticket is a Scots ticket.

You are crazy. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on March 05, 2007, 03:01:40 PM
Hey guys, I just thought I'd pop in to let you know about a little project we did. A group of around 40 posters banded together and created a Unofficial Guide to the 2006-2007 NCAA Tourney, that contains a team-by-team breakdown of the teams in the tournament. This is especially cool given the fact that the official NCAA guide gives you very little insight into the teams, and nearly all of the previews in the Unofficial Guide were made by fans of the team.

The website is: http://wheatonhoops.googlepages.com/ncaatourney and on that website you can find browsable information, as well as a 19 page printable PDF document. This was updated as of this morning.

While I doubt that we'll ever get any posters to submit information for the 11 teams that did not submit previews, it does include previews from 48 of the 59 teams in the tournament, and all of the teams in the Sweet Sixteen. I hope you check it out and enjoy the content!

If there are any corrections or content additions you would like to me, please submit them to me by PM. Thanks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2007, 04:02:33 PM
Quote from: sac on March 05, 2007, 02:57:14 PM
must not be anticipating a big JCU or Wooster contingent.

They'd be wrong..........the JCU band takes up 50 tickets by itself. :D  They brought a lot of people to Albion 2 years ago, as did Wooster.

Just the opposite; because they expect Wooster and JCU to travel well, they have to have the split session so we don't have to compete with the locals for scarce seats.  This decision in effect doubles the size of the gym for Friday's games.

I'm a little worried about the JCU band, as much as I love 'em.  I would hope that their presence is deducted from the JCU seat allotment and not a general reduction spread among all teams.  For a number of reasons, I hope the Scot pep band won't be present.  They weren't at the regional, so I don't expect them at the sectional.  Anyway, Wooster will be on spring break, and in my day the Symphonic Band went on tour for spring break.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2007, 04:08:55 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 05, 2007, 04:02:33 PM
I'm a little worried about the JCU band, as much as I love 'em.  I would hope that their presence is deducted from the JCU seat allotment and not a general reduction spread among all teams.  For a number of reasons, I hope the Scot pep band won't be present.  They weren't at the regional, so I don't expect them at the sectional.  Anyway, Wooster will be on spring break, and in my day the Symphonic Band went on tour for spring break.

I don't know if JCU will be on break; but Wooster definitely will be and there will not be a pep band from Woo at the sectionals.  I learned while I was on campus this past weekend that two things worked against having a pep band for the first and second round games.  First, not enough students were available (as the week before spring break, it's a big midterms week on campus), second, the additional restrictions on when the pep band could play would have significantly limited the band's impact anyway.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Toph on March 05, 2007, 05:19:39 PM
JCU is on break, but my guess is the band will be there.  I don't know that they've missed a playoff game in the last few trips to the dance.  I think they might even go to the Final Four when JCU hasn't gone!

As for how things shake out with the tickets, I don't know anything about it. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2007, 05:25:49 PM
Yes, the JCU pep band has been at the last two JCU-less Final Fours, and are a crowd favorite in Salem.  Of course, there's plenty of room for them in the Salem Civic Center, which holds more than 1150 non-band members!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 05, 2007, 05:51:52 PM
This is from the Wooster website about tickets

QuoteNCAA Div. III Tournament Ticket Information: There will be a split session of Friday's games at St. John Fisher in Rochester, N.Y. Wooster has been allotted 450 tickets and they will be on sale at the Physical Education Center Wednesday from 11 a.m. to 1 p.m. and 4 p.m. to 6 p.m., and Thursday from 11 a.m. to 1 p.m.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2007, 05:55:17 PM
You just beat me, Mix!  :D

I'll see ya'll at 11am Wednesday.  I'm not sure where the 450 figure comes from; it might be what's left after parents and other important people are accounted for.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ricco1 on March 05, 2007, 07:42:26 PM
For all the out of town fans,make sure you have a ticket for the final because no one gets in without a ticket,not even the players parents.I know a players father who didn't get to see the game last year at Fisher.Once they hit their seating capacity thats it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 05, 2007, 09:47:55 PM
Quote from: ricco1 on March 05, 2007, 07:42:26 PMOnce they hit their seating capacity thats it.

The local fire marshal will be pleased. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 05, 2007, 11:45:44 PM
For Wooster to get the win on Friday, they need to contain John Carroll's three key Seniors:

Brandon Mimes - OAC First Team Selection
6'5" Post -- 20.6 points/gm;  10.5 boards/gm; 50% FG Shooting; 49 Blocks

Terry Walsh - OAC Second Team Selection
6'3" Wing -- 16.4 ppg; 6.2 boards/gm; 66 three pointers made (39%); 80%FT

Pete Moran - OAC Honorable Mention
6'0" Point -- 10.2 ppg; 2.8 boards/gm; 146 Assists (~5/game); 80% FT

Another key for the Scots will be taking good care of the ball when John Carroll runs their full court press.  John Carroll averages over 8 steals per game as they rotate 10-12 players to keep up the defensive pressure.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 05, 2007, 11:50:59 PM
I would add........not get frustrated by JCU's style of play. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 06, 2007, 08:54:45 AM
Last night I spoke with a relative who lives in the Atlanta area.  She told me that the bus carrying the Bluffton baseball team actually had its tragic fall at a left exit off of I75, which I hadn't known.  I checked out an article on CNN this morning which gave a little more information. 

Apparently the bus was travelling in the far left lane, the HOV (high-occupancy vehicle) lane.  A left exit ramp began running parallel to the HOV lane.  The bus driver must have thought that the highway was just widening, that this new lane was now the HOV lane, and mistakenly took it.  I can now somewhat more understand his error.

This from the CNN article:

The bus, which was being driven by a fresh driver during an overnight trip, drove up a left-side exit on Interstate 75 just north of downtown and crossed a multilane highway overpass before crashing though a guardrail and plunging onto the highway below, said National Transportation Safety Board Member Kitty Higgins.

"We know that there have been numerous accidents at Exit 252 for Northside Drive," Higgins said, referring to the accident site, where a high-occupancy vehicle (HOV) lane and an exit lane run side by side.

"We are also interested in the history of the HOV lane and exit ramp design and will be looking at the signage, highway markings and other motorist warning devices that were available before exiting at that particular spot."

I really hope that after this investigation something is done to make sure that there are no more disasters at this (or any other similar) location.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: FisherDynasty on March 06, 2007, 09:37:01 AM
Any predictions on the upcoming games? I have made mine in a previous post.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jcu_fan on March 06, 2007, 01:34:26 PM
Your wishes are granted on both counts... the JCU Band is travelling, but since we're competing with spring break too, we won't be too much bigger than 15 people, so regardless of where they put us, we won't take up that much space.

Lake Erie actually put us on the floor for the game last weekend, so we didn't take any seats away.  I liked that arrangement.

Also, yes, the band will be going to Salem for the final four regardless of this weekend's outcome.  Our third year as the Official Pep Band of the DIII championships.  We have a blast doing that gig.  It'll be doubly sweet for us if we get to cheer on the Blue Streaks, but I can understand if folks on this particular board aren't sharing that sentiment.

On that note, though, just wanted to say how much I'm looking forward to this weekend.  The two games last week almost gave me a heart attack, and I have a feeling, based on our past history that that's not going to change this weekend either.  I continue to be impressed with the consistant strength of Wooster's program, and the devoted while respectful fanbase you have.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on March 06, 2007, 02:09:29 PM
Quote from: jcu_fan on March 06, 2007, 01:34:26 PM
I continue to be impressed with the consistant strength of Wooster's program, and the devoted while respectful fanbase you have.

jcu_fan making sure to stay on Woo fans' good sides: setting the record straight that he is definitely NOT a Witt fan  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jcu_fan on March 06, 2007, 02:21:50 PM
Nah... Witt's got a Carroll grad on their coaching staff... (Artie 'A-Train' Taylor.)  I was pulling for them at the final's last year.

I just wanted to post that previous post because, well, we ran in to a few bad apples at the last Wooster game.   (Drunk fan and his sons wanted to start a fist fight with our Clarinet player... honestly.  Who takes on the clarinet section?)  But we realize that's certainly not representative of the true Wooster fan base.  Apart from that one guy and his two kids, I've got nothing but good things to say about our trips to Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on March 06, 2007, 02:43:33 PM
Quote from: jcu_fan on March 06, 2007, 02:21:50 PM
Nah... Witt's got a Carroll grad on their coaching staff... (Artie 'A-Train' Taylor.)  I was pulling for them at the final's last year.

I just wanted to post that previous post because, well, we ran in to a few bad apples at the last Wooster game.   (Drunk fan and his sons wanted to start a fist fight with our Clarinet player... honestly.  Who takes on the clarinet section?)  But we realize that's certainly not representative of the true Wooster fan base.  Apart from that one guy and his two kids, I've got nothing but good things to say about our trips to Wooster.

Uh oh, watch out for those woodwinds, they knew to stay away from us tough guys with the sticks and mallets at least. In Springfield they just take on the whole band, and they send the football team to do it...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on March 06, 2007, 03:12:53 PM
Quote from: jcu_fan on March 06, 2007, 02:21:50 PM
(Drunk fan and his sons wanted to start a fist fight with our Clarinet player... honestly.  Who takes on the clarinet section?) 
Seriously. They can't even defend themselves with their instruments. Doesn't everyone know how hard it is to find a good reed?  :D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2007, 05:15:23 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on March 06, 2007, 03:12:53 PM
Quote from: jcu_fan on March 06, 2007, 02:21:50 PM
(Drunk fan and his sons wanted to start a fist fight with our Clarinet player... honestly.  Who takes on the clarinet section?) 
Seriously. They can't even defend themselves with their instruments. Doesn't everyone know how hard it is to find a good reed?  :D ;)

This one time, at band camp ...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 06, 2007, 05:29:12 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on March 06, 2007, 03:12:53 PM
Quote from: jcu_fan on March 06, 2007, 02:21:50 PM
(Drunk fan and his sons wanted to start a fist fight with our Clarinet player... honestly.  Who takes on the clarinet section?) 
Seriously. They can't even defend themselves with their instruments. Doesn't everyone know how hard it is to find a good reed?  :D ;)

That was a good one! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 06, 2007, 05:30:41 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on March 06, 2007, 03:12:53 PM
Quote from: jcu_fan on March 06, 2007, 02:21:50 PM
(Drunk fan and his sons wanted to start a fist fight with our Clarinet player... honestly.  Who takes on the clarinet section?) 
Seriously. They can't even defend themselves with their instruments. Doesn't everyone know how hard it is to find a good reed?  :D ;)

Nobody EVER messed with us Sousaphones! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 06, 2007, 08:43:42 PM
Does anyone know if CSTV will be broadcasting the championship game this spring? I heard they had in the past.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 06, 2007, 09:21:17 PM
Quote from: woolax on March 06, 2007, 08:43:42 PM
Does anyone know if CSTV will be broadcasting the championship game this spring? I heard they had in the past.

According to the handbook, the chamiponship game WILL be broadcast on CSTV.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 06, 2007, 09:42:24 PM
and according to the monopolized company that is Time Warner Cable 20% of the country who gets CSTV will actually get to see it
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 07, 2007, 01:59:31 AM
Quote from: woolax on March 06, 2007, 08:43:42 PM
Does anyone know if CSTV will be broadcasting the championship game this spring? I heard they had in the past.

I believe you can also watch the game through www.cstv.com for a reasonable fee.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 07, 2007, 10:54:24 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 06, 2007, 09:42:24 PM
and according to the monopolized company that is Time Warner Cable 20% of the country who gets CSTV will actually get to see it

DirecTV and Comcast also have it as part of one of their digital sports packages.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 07, 2007, 11:40:02 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 05, 2007, 11:45:44 PM
For Wooster to get the win on Friday, they need to contain John Carroll's three key Seniors:

Brandon Mimes - OAC First Team Selection
6'5" Post -- 20.6 points/gm;  10.5 boards/gm; 50% FG Shooting; 49 Blocks

Terry Walsh - OAC Second Team Selection
6'3" Wing -- 16.4 ppg; 6.2 boards/gm; 66 three pointers made (39%); 80%FT

Pete Moran - OAC Honorable Mention
6'0" Point -- 10.2 ppg; 2.8 boards/gm; 146 Assists (~5/game); 80% FT

I would also add 6'4" Forward Rudy Kirbus who has seemed to have somewhat of a coming out party since the NCAA Tournament began.  He's only averaging 6.7 ppg on the season, but he has gone off for 18 points in both of JCU's NCAA Tournament wins. 

Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 05, 2007, 11:45:44 PM
Another key for the Scots will be taking good care of the ball when John Carroll runs their full court press.  John Carroll averages over 8 steals per game as they rotate 10-12 players to keep up the defensive pressure.
I asked about this on the OAC board and I don't think the 'hockey style' line changes that we Wooster fans remember from JCU back in the '03 and '04 tournament games is as prevalent with the Blue Streaks this season.  From the looks of their roster, it looks as though they aren't nearly as deep as in years past as they have 4 guys averaging at least 29 mpg.  And in their last 2 games it looks as though Moran has shortened the bench even further. 

Also in regards to their steals per game, Wooster is actually averaging more with over 9 steals per game.  So if they are running a pressing style, it doesn't seem too be overly effective.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 07, 2007, 11:48:34 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on March 07, 2007, 10:54:24 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 06, 2007, 09:42:24 PM
and according to the monopolized company that is Time Warner Cable 20% of the country who gets CSTV will actually get to see it

DirecTV and Comcast also have it as part of one of their digital sports packages.

I was going to say the same thing. CSTV is 610 if you have DirecTV
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bjgiants6 on March 07, 2007, 05:34:37 PM
This sounds silly but anyone from John Carroll or Wooster has an extra game ticket for Friday's game? Thanks. If interested, send me an e-mail.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2007, 05:37:52 PM
Attention to those local to Wooster still in need of tickets:

» NCAA Div. III Tournament Ticket Information: There will be a split session of Friday's games at St. John Fisher in Rochester, N.Y. Wooster has been allotted 450 tickets and they will be on sale at the Physical Education Center Wednesday from 11 a.m. to 1 p.m. and 4 p.m. to 6 p.m., and Thursday from 9 a.m. to noon (note this change in time)

http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/default.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2007, 07:50:45 PM
FYI...

I just opened up a new topic in the Multi-Region room concerning this sectional.
http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=5165.new#new

It might make it easier for the followers of all 4 teams to discuss the tournament there; one-stop shopping.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: superman57 on March 07, 2007, 10:03:12 PM
ok I promised it earlier here it is...I forget who did it last year but someone did for the Amherst Sectional and it was really helpful   this is a list of good places for food and for the most part I will try to include google map directions...

Ok first off your one stop places for just about everything that you need

Eastview Mall-the best of the malls in rochester...has the normal food court places

Johnny Rockets-$-relativly cheap chain resturant good burgers a nice atmosphere

Champs-$$$1/2-A more expensive sports bar-it is your place to be if you want to watch any of the games on friday or saturday...lots of tvs and decent food

PF Changs never been there before but have heard decent things about it.

Biaggi's Italion-haven't heard anything about it but here is the websiteBiaggis


and here is the eastview mall website

Pittsford plaza is a great place to go do a little shopping, there is a very nice grocery store, and if you've never been to a wegmans it is a whole new experiance and several of the buildings at fisher are named after the wegmans family... Applebee's is in this plaza along with someother resturants that I'm not familiar with...also a good cheap movie theater  Pittsford Plaza website....this is 5 minutes from the fisher campus....

I will post what I know about Fairport hots because that is where I get my plates...they range from around $6-8or9 depending on how hungry you are...they are good, not the best but definatly good and close to fisher...right next to Fairport hots is Baird Road Pub...last time I heard ex-fisher basketball player Raymie Aumen was doing a little bartending...who knows what he is up to now...this is easy to find you take a left out of the main fisher campus and go two-three miles if you get to the mobile station, a friendly's and a 7-11 you've gone to far it is on the corner of Fairport road and baird road at a light....


anyother questions please ask
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 07, 2007, 10:58:09 PM
Ok, you can only die once, right?  Even if there was no game at all this weekend, I'd be inclined to make the trip to Rochester to try one of these:

http://www.roadfood.com/Reviews/Writeup.aspx?ReviewID=218&RefID=218

Check out this site, too, where they actually review all of the seemingly hundreds of so-called restaurants in Rochester that serve Garbage Plates.

http://www.geocities.com/garbageplates/

And, of course, how to eat one:

http://ambrosiasw.com/Ambrosia_Times/November_97/4.6HowTo.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: superman57 on March 07, 2007, 11:03:08 PM
and I forgot to mention the best BBQ this side of south carolina...Dinosaur BBQ down by the Blue Cross arena is an incrdible resturant...though I suggest taking out, instead of eating in...as eating in tends to be a 45min-1 hour wait minimum
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on March 07, 2007, 11:14:47 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 07, 2007, 10:58:09 PM
http://ambrosiasw.com/Ambrosia_Times/November_97/4.6HowTo.html
Asian gourmet aficionados will find the next step similar to the preparation of the Korean dish "bibbim bap".

Only all you're doing is mixing vegetables and rice together... and Korean food is actually healthy... ::) :D ;) :-*

hmm... except for kimchee and spam! :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 07, 2007, 11:26:09 PM
Quote from: diehardfan on March 07, 2007, 11:14:47 PM
Asian gourmet aficionados will find the next step similar to the preparation of the Korean dish "bibbim bap".

Bibbim Bap.  If Tony Soprano was a Korean, I'd suspect that would be the name of his Dance Club.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 08, 2007, 08:18:03 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 07, 2007, 10:58:09 PM
Ok, you can only die once, right?  Even if there was no game at all this weekend, I'd be inclined to make the trip to Rochester to try one of these:

http://www.roadfood.com/Reviews/Writeup.aspx?ReviewID=218&RefID=218

Check out this site, too, where they actually review all of the seemingly hundreds of so-called restaurants in Rochester that serve Garbage Plates.

http://www.geocities.com/garbageplates/

And, of course, how to eat one:

http://ambrosiasw.com/Ambrosia_Times/November_97/4.6HowTo.html

That burger is what I want to cause my first heart attack.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 08, 2007, 09:50:38 AM
Oh, my arteries!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 08, 2007, 09:53:51 AM
Using the Above the Rim Excel basketball game, Wooster has held off JCU by the score of 85-72.  AtR called all three of last weekend's games at Wooster correctly, including Centre's surprisingly easy win over Capital.

AtR: Centre 84, Capital 66
Actual: Centre 69, Capital 55

AtR: Wooster 96, Transylvania 77
Actual: Wooster 92, Transylvania 66

AtR: Wooster 85, Centre 54
Actual: Wooster 73, Centre 56

In this latest simulation, although Wooster led all the way after the first few minutes, they never could shake JCU until the end.  The Blue Streaks were as close as three points with only 5 or 6 minutes to go when Tom Port (8-8, 5-5, 2-2, 23 points) put together a string of threes that helped to produce the final margin.  Brandon Johnson was limited to 23 minutes of playing time due to foul trouble.  Brandon Mimes, with 19 points and a game high 8 rebounds, led a JCU team that went to the line for 35 free throws and made 25.  Boxscore below:

http://arkski.com/~jwood/john%20carroll_(72)_vs_wooster_(85).html

I'll probably try to play the St. John Fisher-Brockport matchup tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 08, 2007, 09:56:09 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 07, 2007, 10:58:09 PM
Ok, you can only die once, right?  Even if there was no game at all this weekend, I'd be inclined to make the trip to Rochester to try one of these:

http://www.roadfood.com/Reviews/Writeup.aspx?ReviewID=218&RefID=218

Check out this site, too, where they actually review all of the seemingly hundreds of so-called restaurants in Rochester that serve Garbage Plates.

http://www.geocities.com/garbageplates/

And, of course, how to eat one:

http://ambrosiasw.com/Ambrosia_Times/November_97/4.6HowTo.html

That.  Is.  Awesome. 

I want one.  It's 10:00 a.m. and I need one of those.  You got anything like that down in the Republic, LG?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 08, 2007, 11:41:01 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 08, 2007, 09:56:09 AMYou got anything like that down in the Republic, LG?

You mean food that will kill you? Have you looked at me lately? I didn't get this bloated eating vegetables. Hells yeah there is food like that here. We'll have 4 days to get you ready for your cardiologist.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2007, 01:03:32 PM
Browns Sign Jamal Lewis (http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-browns-lewis&prov=ap&type=lgns)

:'(

That's it; my lifelong (except for a gap of a few years) love for the Cleveland Browns is now over.  I can't root for a team with this guy on the roster. 

I'd long ago lost interest in the rest of the NFL, so I guess I'm officially done with pro football. 

A sad day for me.  :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 08, 2007, 01:07:43 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 08, 2007, 01:03:32 PMI can't root for a team with this guy on the roster.

You might as well give up. There isn't a team in the NFL that doesn't have at least one felon on it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 08, 2007, 01:14:59 PM
Oh c'mon DC...he only brokered a big coke deal.  It's not like he stabbed anybody.  I'm sorry...allegedly stabbed anybody. 

The reason to be peeved about this is because it probably means Cleveland isn't drafting Peterson.  That should be upsetting.  Unless the Browns are hot to trot for Quinn they have to be trading down, right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2007, 01:19:26 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 08, 2007, 01:14:59 PM
Oh c'mon DC...he only brokered a big coke deal.  It's not like he stabbed anybody.  I'm sorry...allegedly stabbed anybody. 

...as if they wouldn't sign that guy, too, if they could.  :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 08, 2007, 01:19:57 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 08, 2007, 01:14:59 PMIt's not like he stabbed anybody.  I'm sorry...allegedly stabbed anybody.


(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi23.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb361%2Fgrose51787%2F0411192159_ray_lewis.jpg&hash=6923aec760ae10ed6c193194534c8001d8406cbf)

"I already told you once, I didn't see nuthin'!"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 08, 2007, 01:31:27 PM
David,

Given your love for New Orleans, you should be rooting for them - after all, they are guaranteed to all be Saints! :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2007, 02:02:19 PM
Given my love for New Orleans, I doubt I'll ever be able to forgive Tom Benson for using the Katrina disaster as a means to extort money from the state to upgrade (not repair, not restore, but dramatically upgrade) the Superdome under threat of moving to another city.  To blazes with Benson and the Saints; I wish they were LG's problem now. >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 08, 2007, 03:00:20 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 08, 2007, 02:02:19 PM
To blazes with Benson and the Saints; I wish they were LG's problem now. >:(

There's not much love for Tom Benson in San Antone. He used this city as leverage too many times in the past for him to be well received here. Plus, his brother was responsible for the San Antonio Canadian League team debacle.

No NFL team in SA will EVER have as good a following as the Cowboys, anyway. Plus, the Alamodome is a pit. There's no way an NFL team could survive in that building.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 08, 2007, 10:22:01 PM
Here is the link to the Daily Record preview for Friday's big game:
Scots, JCU familiar foes (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1697191)

The Daily Record writer makes the point that Wooster will need to contain JCU Seniors Brandon Mimes, Terry Walsh and Pete Moran.

The article also describes the full court press often employed by JCU and how Wooster will need to avoid key turnovers.

Less than 24 hours to tipoff! :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: FisherDynasty on March 09, 2007, 09:01:54 AM
From reading the article it looks like Wooster may struggle more against bports press then playing against Fisher in the elite 8 game.  Bport applies an immense amount of pressure, one of the quickest teams in d3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 09, 2007, 04:15:02 PM
Above the Rim predicts SUNY Brockport over St. John Fisher, 84-71.  Poor shooting combined with plentiful turnovers by both teams produced a low-scoring first half after which SJF led by the score of 30-28.  Both clubs began to find the range after intermission, but especially Brockport, as they put up a remarkable 56 points. 

With 15:39 to go in the ballgame a three-pointer by Dave Maldonado broke a 39-39 tie and Brockport never again trailed, leading by as many as 17.  Fisher cut it to 8 around the six-minute mark, but could never get closer.

Fisher had a very difficult time with the quickness of Brockport which forced them into committing 25 fouls.  Both McSweeney and Biegel fouled out.  Brockport missed 10 free throws, but made 23, and that was enough for the margin of victory.  The SUNY school also came up with 14 steals, led by Sherod Harris' five.

The boxscore:

http://arkski.com/~jwood/suny%20brockport_(84)_at_st.%20john%20fisher_(71).html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 09, 2007, 06:37:35 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 35  John Carroll 32

Sounded like a sloppy first half with neither team shooting a very high percentage.  Wooster missed a number of open three point shots in the half.  Scots actually trailed by 10 points but went on a big 21 to 8 run to close the half.  :)

Wooster is being led by Tom Port with 13 points and Devin Fulk with 8 points.  John Carroll is being led by Brandon Mimes with 10 points and Terry Walsh with 7 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 09, 2007, 06:39:50 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 09, 2007, 06:37:35 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 35  John Carroll 32

Sounded like a sloppy first half with neither team shooting a very high percentage.  Wooster missed a number of open three point shots in the half.  Scots actually trailed by 10 points but went on a big run (21 to 8) to close the half.  :)

Wooster is being led by Tom Port with 13 points and Devin Fulk with 8 points.  John Carroll is being led by Brandon Mimes with 10 points and Terry Walsh with 7 points.

GO SCOTS!

We need James Cooper to discover his shot in order for us to be more comfortable in this game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 09, 2007, 06:49:26 PM
I think Wooster has to be happy about where they are to end the half.  As wooscotsfan mentioned, they were down 10 with just over 6 minutes left in the half and rallied to go up by as much as 5 in the closing minutes.  Wooster has heated up a bit as well shooting wise as they were in the 30's for most of the half but ended up at 43% for the half!  Wooster is still getting it done defensively holding the Blue Streaks to 32%.  It's now down to who makes the better 2nd half adjustments.  If JCU's recent trends of coming from way down in the 2nd half are any indication, the Scots may be in trouble.  However, Wooster is not Westminster or LEC either!!!

Quote from: WooMix on March 09, 2007, 06:39:50 PM
We need James Cooper to discover his shot in order for us to be more comfortable in this game.

Very true!!!  Yet another reason Wooster can feel pretty good about still being up 3 at the half!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 09, 2007, 07:08:37 PM
~12:00 remaining   Wooster 57  John Carroll 43

Wooster on a 8-0 run seems to be taking control of the game. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 09, 2007, 07:11:48 PM
Wooster started the half with a 10-0 run, but JCU made a run of their own to cut the lead back to 6 only to see Wooster take back control and gain their biggest lead of the game at 14! 

Of note, Walsh for JCU and Port for Wooster each have 3 fouls.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 09, 2007, 07:14:22 PM
The fouls are beginning to mount for the Scots as Bidwell just picked up this 3rd and 4th within seconds of each other.  Will also has 3?! ???

Johnson just missed 2 ft's only to see Vandervaart get the offensive stickback! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 09, 2007, 07:16:41 PM
Terry Walsh just picked up his 4th foul and isn't leaving the game!

Wooster is struggling from the line at only 2-7 for the 2nd half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 09, 2007, 07:20:46 PM
Very questionable 4th foul called on Tom Port and John Carroll has cut the lead to 8 points.

Woo 66  JCU 58  with 7:30 remaining
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 09, 2007, 07:30:23 PM
4:41 remaining  Wooster 72  JCU 63  Scots get the turnover and have the ball

3:10 remaining Wooster 74  JCU 63  Vandervaart rebound & bucket
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 09, 2007, 07:43:48 PM
Final:  Wooster 83  John Carroll 73

Great win for Wooster as they go to the ELITE EIGHT!  :) ;D

Scots came up big in the 2nd half and their offensive production was too much for John Carroll.

Wooster was led by Tim Vandervaart with 16 points, Tom Port with 16 points, Brandon Johnson with 14 points, James Cooper with 13 points and Devin Fulk with 10 points.

John Carroll was led by Rudy Kirbus with 23 points, Brandon Mimes with 21 points (11 boards), Terry Walsh with 11 points and Pete Moran with 11 points.

Wooster is now 28-3  ;D  Next up is the St. John Fisher/Brockport winner.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on March 09, 2007, 07:48:13 PM
Wooster's defense since the end of the season has been excellent.

33% FG% for OWU in the NCAC final
32% FG% vs TRANS UNIV  NCAA First Round
32% FG% vs Centre NCAA Second Round
37% FG% for JCU tonite in the 'Sweet Sixteen'

Defense does indeed win championships.  Rest for Elite Eight tomorrow night and hopefully defensive effort will continue!!

Go SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 09, 2007, 08:29:49 PM
Congrats to the Scots in reaching the Elite 8!!!

Solid win over a team that I felt for a while was the best team in the OAC.  Sweet revenge for the Wooster to send JCU home and pick up an NCAA win over an OAC foe! 

I must admit that I was a bit nervous for the Scots with only a 3 point lead at the half, but they pretty much put my nerves to rest by coming out to start the 2nd half with a 10-0 run and they never really looked back from there!

To give JCU credit, they never gave up in the 2nd half, but Wooster proved that they were a better opponent than either WC or LEC by not relinquishing the lead. 

All I have to say is that I am stoked that Wooster was able to get over the hump against JCU!  When the Streaks went up 10 in the 1st half, I was thinking 'here we go again with this team', but they quickly calmed my nerves by making their late 2nd half run and continuing it over to the 2nd half!

Now the Scots get to rest up fo the winner of the nightcap between the local participants tomorrow.  They should be able to get some good scouting in while they're at it too!!!

Anyone at the game with some firsthand perspective to share with us??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 09, 2007, 09:08:34 PM
Just got back from the game.  It was extremely intense. 
The gym is really small.  Us Wooster fans were shocked upon entering. 
About the game:
Moran is a really good player.  JCU's defense was exceptional.  It seemed a lot of times we just couldn't find a hole anywhere.  Their defense on Coop was magnificent.  Overall I was very impressed with their team.
Luckily we were able to take the lead before half-time and we never lost it.  We'll have to wait to see who we play tomorrow.
Hopefully some of our players can find their shots again.  Seemed like we struggled a little on the offensive end tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 09, 2007, 10:22:01 PM
Final:  SUNY Brockport 105  St. John Fisher 91

So, Wooster will take on the Golden Eagles tomorrow night for a spot in the Final Four.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 09, 2007, 10:27:19 PM
So what do we know about Brockport St? who are thier best players? How well do we match up with them?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pg04 on March 09, 2007, 10:29:19 PM
Good luck Wooster and all the scots fans!!

I am hoping for a good game!! 

May the best team win. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 09, 2007, 10:39:04 PM
Quote from: woolax on March 09, 2007, 10:27:19 PM
So what do we know about Brockport St? who are thier best players? How well do we match up with them?

Here is the Team Profile that was posted on the D3Hoops Team Profile board:

SUNY Brockport
26-5, 14-2 conference

Depth, Depth, Depth.  Their second five could start for most D-III teams.  They routinely have four or 5 in doubles, and at least 8 players on the roster are capable of doubles on any given night

Starters
Sherod Harris - 5-9, JUCO from Monroe CC.  If he was 6-1, he'd be playing high D-I.  Can dominate a game on defense, offense, and especially in transition

Mychal Wilkes - 5-11 So.  Deadly shooter, draws tough defensive assignment, hard nose, in your face.

Brandon Williams - 6-2 220 - the SUNYAC's version of Charles Barkley.  Can shoot from the outside, and uses his strength and athleticism to dominate in the paint.  Runs very well for his size.

Cantrel Parish - 6-7 Freshman - long and athletic.  Wonder how s mid-major missed this guy.  he can shoot, run, and especially rebound.

Aaron Poles - 5-10 Jr. G, unselfish, role player, does what it takes to win.

This team can beat you any way you want.  If it's a track meet, they can run with anyone.  In half court, they have great athletes who are all strong, quick, and competitive.

Very deep bench.  As I said their second five could start at a lot of D-III Schools.

They beat St. Lawrence University by 30 earlier this season.  Only an upset in the SUNYAC tournament kept them from hosting the Rochester area pod in the NCAA's.

My thoughts:

SUNY Brockport is not a tall team so Wooster may have some luck scoring in the paint.  Brockport appears to be very athletic and quick so Wooster will need to take good care of the ball and defend their shooters.  Sherod Harris (4), Aaron Poles (3) and Mychal Wilkes (2) combined to make 9 three pointers tonight vs. St. John Fisher so Wooster will need to play tough defense if they are going to get the win.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 09, 2007, 10:53:08 PM
Wow!  That's quite a rave review for a team that was not ranked in the top 25 and has not beaten any team in the top 25 to reach the elite eight!

While it would obviously be foolhardy to take ANY tournament team (much less an elite eight team) lightly (as top 10 teams Augustana and St. Thomas found out the hard way against Carroll), if Wooster plays their game they should have a pretty clear path to Salem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pg04 on March 09, 2007, 11:06:43 PM
That's a pretty sweeping statement to say Wooster should just breeze through  Though it does seem, even to me, that Wooster should win the game...

The fact that Brockport hasn't even had the opportunity to play a Top 25 team yet means we have no real idea how they will play against one.  It's a definitely a big step up the ladder, it should be interesting to see.  Sherod was a force tonight for sure and will need to be so again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 09, 2007, 11:19:29 PM
#1 UW Stevens Point has been upset tonight on their homecourt by Washington University.  So, here are the ELITE EIGHT matchups for tomorrow night:

Washington University vs. Hope
Virginia Wesleyan vs. Guilford
Amherst vs. Rhode Island College
Wooster vs. SUNY Brockport
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2007, 08:23:59 AM
Here is the link to the Daily Record article on Wooster's big win over John Carroll:
Johnson puts in a good night's work (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1707101)

Let's hope that Brandon got a good night's rest because he will be facing some quick Brockport guards tonight! :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on March 10, 2007, 08:31:41 AM
Never sure how much wieght to put on it but remember that Brockport St was NCAA #1 in the East Region this year.

This game will be very interesting as it appears to be strength vs. strength is this where the tough pre-NCAC schedule plays a part??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2007, 08:33:43 AM
The Cleveland Plain Dealer ran an article this morning on Wooster's big win over JCU and noted that JCU Coach Moran tried to convince D1 Cleveland State to offer Tom Port a basketball scholarship before he went to D1 Miami University to play football. :)  Good thing for Wooster that Coach Moran wasn't convincing enough!  ;D :D

Here is the link to the Plain Dealer article:
Port carries Wooster past JCU (http://www.cleveland.com/sports/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/sports/1173519081150840.xml&coll=2)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pbrooks3 on March 10, 2007, 09:50:06 AM
Good to see the Scots got by JCU.  Defense will be the key as someone noted getting past Brockport State and into the final 4!  No pushover games from this point forward; every team has advanced thus far based on being solid on the defensive end.

Good luck Scots!  At least one Centre supporter is behind you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 10, 2007, 10:32:13 AM
The Above the Rim basketball game predicts Wooster over Brockport, the Scots holding on for a 92-86 win.

Behind the spectacular shooting of James Cooper (29 points on 12-16, 3-4, 2-2), Wooster led by as many as 14 in the first half.  A pair of Aaron Poles free throws eventually tied the ballgame with 12:54 remaining in the second stanza.  With 6:29 left on the clock, Jermaine Johnson found Sherod Harris for two, giving Brockport their largest lead of the game at 79-73.  Wooster, though, then went on a 13-point run, fueled by 7 points from James Cooper, taking a lead of 86-79 at the 3:25 mark.  Soon after, Brockport was forced to foul and never could get closer than 5.

The boxscore:

http://arkski.com/~jwood/suny%20brockport_(86)_vs_wooster_(92).html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 10, 2007, 11:55:24 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2007, 08:33:43 AM
Here is the link to the Plain Dealer article:
Port carries Wooster past JCU (http://www.cleveland.com/sports/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/sports/1173519081150840.xml&coll=2)

GO SCOTS!

For some reason, the Plain Dealer article isn't coming up.  Will it be a violation of some kind to paste the article here?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 10, 2007, 12:03:55 PM
To any Wooster fans in Rochester who saw both games last night: what are your impressions of Brockport and how do you think the Scots will do tonight?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 10, 2007, 02:19:10 PM
Quote from: WooMix on March 10, 2007, 11:55:24 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2007, 08:33:43 AM
Here is the link to the Plain Dealer article:
Port carries Wooster past JCU (http://www.cleveland.com/sports/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/sports/1173519081150840.xml&coll=2)

GO SCOTS!

For some reason, the Plain Dealer article isn't coming up.  Will it be a violation of some kind to paste the article here?

Yeah, it's a violation of their copyright.

I would say if there's a few paragraphs you can excerpt that would be reasonable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 10, 2007, 04:36:48 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 10, 2007, 10:32:13 AM
The Above the Rim basketball game predicts Wooster over Brockport, the Scots holding on for a 92-86 win.

Given how spot on (winners wise, anyway) those have been this postseason, I would think that's a good omen for the Scots...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2007, 05:42:04 PM
Quote from: WooMix on March 10, 2007, 11:55:24 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2007, 08:33:43 AM
Here is the link to the Plain Dealer article:
Port carries Wooster past JCU (http://www.cleveland.com/sports/plaindealer/index.ssf?/base/sports/1173519081150840.xml&coll=2)

GO SCOTS!

For some reason, the Plain Dealer article isn't coming up.  Will it be a violation of some kind to paste the article here?

Yea....the link was broken because they have removed the digital file on Cleveland.com. :(

I will paraphrase the most interesting points in the article:

When Tom Port was graduating from Avon Lake High School about 4 years ago, JCU Coach Mike Moran lobbied D1 Cleveland State's Coach (Rollie Massimino at that time) to give Port a basketball scholarship.  Despite Coach Moran's strong lobbying efforts, Cleveland State didn't offer Port and he went to D1 Miami University on a football scholarship before he eventually transferred to Wooster.

The article also recaps the fact that Tom Port had 16 points and 11 rebounds vs. JCU and that he was a major factor in Wooster notching the win over the Blue Streaks.  Later in the article, it describes that Wooster as a team had too much firepower for JCU and it also notes that the Scots will play Brockport State in the Elite Eight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2007, 07:36:18 PM
At the Half:  Brockport State 44  Wooster 33 :(

Wooster has their hands full tonight with an extremely quick Brockport team.  The Golden Eagles shot over 70% from the floor for most of the half but did cool off to about 53% compared to only 43% for Wooster.  Scots also had 9 turnovers in the half.

Wooster is being led by James Cooper with 15 points, Brandon Johnson with 6 points and Tim Vandervaart with 5 points.

Brockport top scorers are Sherod Harris with 15 points, Cantrel Parish with 7 points and Brandon Williams with 6 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2007, 08:15:06 PM
12:10 remaining  Wooster 61  Brockport 57

Scots were down 12 points and put together a 23-7 run to take the lead! :)

9:27 remaining  Wooster 70  Brockport 59
Brandon Johnson 3 point play followed by a Tom Port three pointer!
Wooster on a 32-9 run.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on March 10, 2007, 08:23:34 PM
BIG RUN by the Scots!!! The Live Stats have apparently been broken. Let's hope the audio doesn't cut out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2007, 08:36:04 PM
2:45 remaining  Wooster 77  Brockport 73   Scots have the ball.

1:53 remaining  Wooster 79  Brockport 76  Scots have the ball
Cooper hits 2 pointer for Woo;  Sherod Harris nails a three pointer

1:24 left:  Vandervaart shooting 2 FT's
First one good.  Second good.      Wooster 81  Brockport 76

Wilkes hits a three pointer for Brockport
Wooster 81  Brockport 79
1:16 left:  Wooster has the ball.   Brockport timeout.

Wooster fails to inbound.  Turnover. :(

Williams 2 pointer for Brockport
Tied at 81-81  Wooster timeout.  Scots have the ball.

Vandervaart missed two free throws with 37 seconds left.
Brockport has the ball

Tied 81-81  Brockport timeout with 15 seconds left.

Sherod Harris missed the last second shot.  OVERTIME!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on March 10, 2007, 08:48:53 PM
WOOOOO!!!!! Bonus Basketball Baby!!! You can hear Doug Cline sounding PUMPED on the audio broadcast.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2007, 08:52:19 PM
Wooster 84  Brockport 81
Cooper makes a 2 pointer
Port makes 1 of 2 free throws.

Brockport turnover.  Scots have the ball ~3 min. left:

Cooper fouled, at the line:
First one good.  Second one good.  29 points for Coop
Wooster 86  Brockport 81

2:29 left  Sherod Harris fouled, at the line
First one good.  Second one miss.

Wooster 88  Brockport 85  2 mins. left:  Scots ball
Coooooper hits again!!

Wooster 90  Brockport 85  1:21 left.  Brockport ball
Cooper has 33 points!

1:05 left: Sherod Harris fouled, at the line.
First one good, Second one good.

Wooster 90  Brockport 87  Scots have the ball.
Van Horn scores!

Brockport turnover.  Cooper is fouled!
Wooster 92  Brockport 87  20 secs left:
Cooper hits 1 of 2 free throws.

Wooster 93  Brockport 87

Brockport miss.  Port rebound and he is fouled! 14 secs left:
Port hits 1 of 2 free throws.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on March 10, 2007, 09:03:01 PM
Wooster SCOTS fans start to celebrate...We are headed to Final Four..9 hours from Memphis...6 point lead with :13.8 left in OT!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2007, 09:03:45 PM
Wooster to the Final Four!!!!

Final:  Wooster 94  Brockport 87 :) ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on March 10, 2007, 09:05:08 PM
Looks like Wooster will face Amherst in Salem, VA in the first game of the Final FOUR!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on March 10, 2007, 09:06:52 PM
BRING ON AMHERST!!!! FINALLY, REVENGE AGAINST THE NESCAC!!! IT'S NOT WILLIAMS, BUT AMHERST WILL DO!!! I'LL SEE Y'ALL IN SALEM.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pg04 on March 10, 2007, 09:08:07 PM
Way to go Wooster.  Nice win.  Good luck in Salem. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 10, 2007, 09:11:27 PM
I just got T'd up by my neighbor for screaming.  I humbly apologized.  Meet me in Salem people!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DLP on March 10, 2007, 09:20:58 PM
good lord..i can't take many more games like this. i'm going to die young...or get an ulcer. or both. but, it'll be worth it....


WOOHOO!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2007, 09:28:18 PM
Final:  Wooster 94  Brockport State 87  OT

Wooster was led tonight by James Cooper who had an unbelievable performance with 34 points! :D ;D  Cooper was clutch in the Overtime! 8)

Tim Vandervaart had 17 points, Brandon Johnson had 13 points, Tom Port had 12 points (12 boards) and Devin Fulk chipped in 10 points.

Brockport State was led by Sherod Harris with 26 points and Brandon Williams with 21 points.

Wooster is now 29-3 ;D   Next up is Amherst in the Final Four!!!

Wooster goes to Salem, Virginia! :)

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2007, 09:51:40 PM
Final:  Washington University 58  Hope 55

So, the Final Four is now set:

Washington University vs. Virginia Wesleyan (Defending Champs!)
Wooster :) vs. Amherst

GO SCOTS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 10, 2007, 10:02:12 PM
CONGRATS TO WOOSTER ON THE FINAL FOUR INVITE

Yes a Wittenberg fan can show congratulations. Its almost deja vu of last year with A NCAC team vs Amherst and VA. Wesleyan in the other game. I am almost one step closer to a perfectly predicted final four.

Amherst will be a good matchup for Wooster as they play very very similarly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 10, 2007, 10:12:46 PM
Congrats indeed to the Wooster folk.  The recaps sounded like another just classic game.

And, to all of the Wooster fans (probably more geared towards the newer ones), a piece of advice.  Having gone to the Final Four last year, let me tell you this: if you can go, GO!  It is a great atmosphere, and you are guaranteed some great basketball.  Hopefully for you guys, things will work out better for you than it did for us, but even though it didn't, I watched some of the best live basketball I ever had.

And nice pick-up pennstghs - the first thing I noticed was the fact that Wooster may have the same exact matchups as Witt did last year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on March 10, 2007, 10:19:53 PM
Well done Wooster....

Well done.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 10, 2007, 10:43:29 PM
I second the advice.  The Final Four is a great event, a real celebration of D3 hoops.  I was going to go anyway (for the third straight year), but now it will be that much sweeter.

And yes, Moneyball, Doug was definitely pumped.  How'd you guess?  :D

That was the best basketball game I've seen since the 3 OT classic at Witt a couple of years ago.  Brockport was one of, if not the, best team Wooster faced all year.  It took everything the Scots had to give to pull it out.  Congratulations to both teams.

See you in Salem!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 11, 2007, 08:52:58 AM
Congratulations Wooster, and good luck in Salem!!

My hat is off to James Cooper.  There are times when you want to put him over your knee, but so often in the big games when other players are struggling Coop just takes over.  He's done it against Wittenberg and he did it again last night.  What a performance, nearly flawless, when the Scots needed it the most.  Sectional MVP, and very well deserved.

Just an innocent question for Scott Van Horn.  Wooster has just won the sectional, everybody in the stands is ecstatic, and you look like you've just had a two-foot put rim out.  What's up?  :D :D

http://arkski.com/~jwood/celebration.jpg
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 11, 2007, 11:07:16 AM
I'll add some more thoughtslater this wek but the quick hits from this weekend (Also posted on the SJF Sectional board):

Brockport State: They were a very very good basketball team, as good as any team Wooster has played this year. Then I heard that they return all their starters!  The D3 pollsters need to think about putting them in the Top 10 in the preseason poll next year.

St. John Fisher as a host: Early in the week there were many comments about the fact that Wooster should have hosted, but the fans came anyway and although not technically a sellout the essentially full gym created an electric atmosphere. I also think the 'road trip' really added to the weekend as fans had a chance to gather after the game to celebrate, something that would probably not happened if it was in Wooster.

Officiating: In short, nothing short of excellent. Yes there was the 15 minute delay to sort out the technical and there are always some calls we would not agree with, but the officials were fair and consistent, all you could ask for.

The Wooster Scots: What can you say - down double digits in both games but showing the heart to come back and win both times. They are a very deserving Final Four team.

The Final Four: A very good set of teams that I'm sure will create a grat set of games this coming weekend.  Salem here we come!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 11, 2007, 11:21:11 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 11, 2007, 08:52:58 AM
My hat is off to James Cooper.  There are times when you want to put him over your knee, but so often in the big games when other players are struggling Coop just takes over.  He's done it against Wittenberg and he did it again last night.  What a performance, nearly flawless, when the Scots needed it the most.  Sectional MVP, and very well deserved.

I will second that point of view!  James Cooper played an incredible game last night and was absolutely clutch in Overtime. :)

Consider that Cooper scored 34 points total and 9 of those points were in the critical Overtime period.  As a team, Wooster had 13 points in OT and James Cooper was responsible for 9 of them!

Great to see Wooster back in the Final Four! ;D

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 11, 2007, 11:24:36 AM
Here is the link to the Daily Record story on Wooster's great win over Brockport:
Scots back in the Final Four (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1709641)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bports on March 11, 2007, 11:51:11 AM
Congrats on a good win last night wooster. As bad as i feel Bport returns there top 13 players next year. As far as the polls go , they are fun for the fans to talk about but they are a joke. Bport was receiving a few votes for one week this year. They ended up26-6 won 14 in a row many of those were in blow out fashion, and beat several teams that at some point were receiving votes. Bport has a pretty good history of sending teams to the playoffs also. With that said it was a great game last night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 11, 2007, 11:58:41 AM
For Wooster fans planning on going to Salem, is it best to wait and get tickets from The College of Wooster so as to be in their seating section?  Or, if you call the Civic Center, will they put you in the Wooster section if you ask?  I'm assuming that seats are reserved.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 11, 2007, 12:00:05 PM
Here is the link to the Rochester newspaper story on Wooster's win:
Brockport bounced (http://www.democratandchronicle.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070311/SPORTS09/703110345/1007/SPORTS)

The article notes that Wooster is the winningest team in NCAA basketball (at any level) since 2000.  Scots are 209-31.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on March 11, 2007, 12:10:30 PM
Wooster Booster... you can call the Salem Civic Center and order them directly if you want... they do have reserved sections for each team now that the field is set. I have no idea how it works... obviously Wooster gets a lot of the seats in their section directly, but I don't know if they are the best ones or how that works.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on March 11, 2007, 12:13:47 PM
The number for the Civic Center, incidentally, is 540-375-3004. One of the many nerdy D3 numbers in my phone. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 11, 2007, 12:25:18 PM
Brockport didn't prove they were a rankable team until this weekend. What do you want us to do?

Important note: Sherod Harris (you know, the guard with all the points) only has one semester of eligibility left. He won't be there when the season starts next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on March 11, 2007, 01:16:39 PM
Congrats to the NCAC... i mean WOOSTER (players and coaching staff) for representing the NCAC in THE Final Four!  Good Luck  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on March 11, 2007, 01:17:46 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 11, 2007, 12:00:05 PM


The article notes that Wooster is the winningest team in NCAA basketball (at any level) since 2000.  Scots are 209-31.  :)



Glad we could help!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 11, 2007, 01:35:18 PM
Quote from: earlhamalum on March 11, 2007, 01:17:46 PMGlad we could help!

Lol, thanks!  Contributions by Oberlin, Hiram, and Allegheny are also much appreciated.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 11, 2007, 01:41:08 PM
My cousin asked, "how many times in total along the way do they get to cut down the nets if they win it all?"  I think four (winning the league, NCAC tournament, elite 8, championship)?  Am I correct?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 11, 2007, 02:09:12 PM
Just got back in from a weekend out of town. Great job, Scots! Good luck in Salem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 11, 2007, 02:23:50 PM
Quote from: WooMix on March 11, 2007, 01:41:08 PM
My cousin asked, "how many times in total along the way do they get to cut down the nets if they win it all?"  I think four (winning the league, NCAC tournament, elite 8, championship)?  Am I correct?

I haven't seen too many (maybe any?) teams cut the nets down after clinching the regular-season top spot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 11, 2007, 02:32:13 PM
I might be wrong, but I think Wooster cut the nets down after beating Centre to make the Sweet Sixteen.

Here tell, and this is a very suspect rumor, that Oberlin cuts the nets down every time the varsity downs the J.V. in a scrimmage...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bports on March 11, 2007, 03:15:54 PM
Pat you are 100% wrong harris sat the 1st semester this year because he only had 3 semesters left. He has a full year left next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 11, 2007, 03:18:42 PM
To answer some of the burning questions from last night's game:

Elapsed time from the whistling of the technical foul to the sinking of the last associated foul shot: 7 minutes, 43 seconds.
Elapsed time between whistles on the five-second call on Tom Port at the end of regulation: 5.397 seconds
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 11, 2007, 03:19:36 PM
Quote from: bports on March 11, 2007, 03:15:54 PM
Pat you are 100% wrong harris sat the 1st semester this year because he only had 3 semesters left. He has a full year left next year.

You'd better tell Coach Whitmore. He is the one who told me otherwise. There was a foul-up with full-time/part-time status at Harris' junior college.

Don't bother to post your message on the other two boards I responded to you on. You are the one who is wrong.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Stout survivor on March 11, 2007, 04:02:34 PM
Since UWSP is out I am pulling for Wooster.  We played them last year and they are a great team (made 17 3's on us, too big inside i think  ;D)

They seemed to have both outside and inside balance it will be interesting ro read what you all have to say about their matchups this weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 11, 2007, 04:04:44 PM
I just wanted to add my congratulations to the Scots on getting back to Salem!!! ;D  I was in no shape to post last night! I think that picture of Andy's dad in the stands is about how I felt once the final horn sounded! :P

I must say, I wasn't feeling too good about the Scots' chances the way Brockport came out to start the 2nd half.  When Wooster came out to score the 1st five points of the 2nd I was thinking, here's the run we've been waiting for.  But then the Eagles responded with 6 unanswered of their own to push the lead back to 12 and I began to wonder how Wooster would get over on this team the way they were scoring.  Well, they finally did get that elusive run and looked like they were going to take control only to see Brockport come stroming back forcing what seemed like the longest 1:08 in history.  First Vandervaart misses 2 ft's.  When that happened, I thought it was over as Brockport had the ball with the shot clock off and everyone knew Harris would be taking the last shot to win the game for the Eagles.  Luckily for Wooster, he missed!!! 

And then it became the James Cooper show in OT as he outscored Brockport by himself in the extra period 9-6!  It sure is nice to have a player like that who you can pretty much count on when you absolutely need a basket!

One area of concern heading into next weekend for the Scots has to be their FT shooting!  They were absolutely atrocious from the line last night!  If they shoot their season average from the line, the game doesn't even go into overtime!  And it wasn't just last night's game.  They didn't shoot too well from the line Friday either!  They can't expect to keep winning these games with poor free throw perfomances!  Eventually it could end up costing them as it almost did last night! 

Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 11, 2007, 03:18:42 PM
To answer some of the burning questions from last night's game:

Elapsed time from the whistling of the technical foul to the sinking of the last associated foul shot: 7 minutes, 43 seconds.
I was wondering about this myself as goscots noted the break in his post as being 15 minutes and Coach Whitmore noted in the D&C article that it was a 20 minute break.  I'm sure it seemed that long to those in attendance, but I was thinking to myself as I read the accounts of the break that it didn't seem that long.  Thanks Pat for clearing the air on that one! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 11, 2007, 04:10:43 PM
A couple things:
Wooster cut down the nets after winning the conference (the OWU game), the conference tourney (again OWU), the sweet 16 (centre) , and the elite 8 (brockport)! :)

Wooster Booster -
I know Scott Van Horn very well.  Both him and Marty Bidwell (Sr.) were mentally and physically exhausted after the game!!  Scott didn't even have the energy to clap his hands  ;) We were contemplating calling the squad for the both of them!!! :D ;)  Hate to see what the final four is going to be like for them.  Are you planning on coming??  By the way, I've met you.  You could probably figure out easily who I am.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 11, 2007, 04:13:55 PM
The second round, not the sweet 16. :)

Don't know if I've seen too many second-round net cuttings. Oh well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 11, 2007, 04:27:19 PM
Sorry you are right about that!  It was the second round!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 11, 2007, 05:05:23 PM
Oh Pat - didn't know if anyone mentioned anything to you, but you did a good job with the National Anthem at the sectional.  Couldn't believe it when I heard them announce your name!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 11, 2007, 05:24:28 PM
Quote from: division3hoops on March 11, 2007, 04:10:43 PM
Wooster Booster -
I know Scott Van Horn very well.  Both him and Marty Bidwell (Sr.) were mentally and physically exhausted after the game!!  Scott didn't even have the energy to clap his hands  ;) We were contemplating calling the squad for the both of them!!! :D ;)  Hate to see what the final four is going to be like for them.  Are you planning on coming??  By the way, I've met you.  You could probably figure out easily who I am.

I don't figure out anything very easily.  :)  Scott, I hope, knows that I was only teasing him.  As it sounds like you probably know, he and Super Marty Sr. sit right behind me at the Wooster home games.  Good guys, both of them, even if they continually avoid my counsel about laying off the refs.  :D  :D  Did Scott down a garbage plate right before the game?  ;)

I'm pretty sure that I'm heading to Salem, it's just that I hate making such a long drive by myself.  The guys that I usually go to the games with won't be going, so I'll have to figure something else out.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 11, 2007, 05:47:10 PM
I called Scott and told him about it, he got a really good laugh and actually wanted me to get on and reply to you!!  Good luck with getting them to lay off the refs!    :D
Hope you can figure out a way to Salem because we need you to get there...the more Wooster fans the better!
On the road again....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 11, 2007, 06:47:50 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 11, 2007, 05:24:28 PM
I'm pretty sure that I'm heading to Salem, it's just that I hate making such a long drive by myself.  The guys that I usually go to the games with won't be going, so I'll have to figure something else out.

The last time Wooster made it to Salem, the college provided two buses (or was it just one?) for us.  The subsidized cost was $55 then for the bus (round trip), tickets to all games, and hotel (for the duration of our stay there).  I'm pretty sure they will do the same thing again.  So maybe you wanna check with the guys in the Armington Physical Education Center if you want to have some company.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 11, 2007, 07:25:24 PM
Just out of curiosity, is Brockport's Sherod Harris as good as Cooper?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 11, 2007, 07:57:18 PM
Quote from: WooMix on March 11, 2007, 07:25:24 PM
Just out of curiosity, is Brockport's Sherod Harris as good as Cooper?
Just one man's opinion:

Both Harris and Cooper have a miraculous touch shooting.  Harris' shot looks a little better than Coop's strange off-the-shoulder shot, but its no more or less effective.  Harris is better at driving to the hoop, but Coop's fadeaway shot makes up for it.  Harris is a couple of steps quicker, which means he's more likely to steal the ball.  Coop is the better defender (believe it or not) and a much, much better rebounder (Harris is only 5'9" after all.)  I'd probably give a slight edge to Coop based on these factors.

But the technical foul on Harris was just huge, and that's the kind of thing that Cooper doesn't do.  Harris was getting under the refs' skins all night, and had been talked to on several occasions about it (Pat pointed out elsewhere that one ref told the B'port coach that Harris had been warned three times.)  I don't know if that's just part of the way he always plays, or if something about the game or refs was bugging him, but in that situation you just have to play under control.  Cooper keeps his cool, and at least this one time, Harris didn't.  And was it ever costly.  Wooster went from down four to (after the seven-minute lapse) tied and with the Woo crowd absolutely on fire; Wooster never trailed again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fpc85 on March 11, 2007, 08:10:59 PM
Any thoughts on the game...dont know much about wooster but i hear they are an excellent team...what are the keys to win for wooster?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldknight on March 11, 2007, 08:12:54 PM
Congratulations to the Woo Scots for advancing to Salem. When I saw your team hand Calvin's Knights' their heads at Mose Hole in December I announced on the MIAA board that I thought Wooster was a Final Four team. After a few anxious weeks awaiting the final verdict on Vandervaart's injury, Wooster made me out to be prophetic--whether one with or without honor I'll let others judge, but at least a prophet. Good luck to the Scots this weekend. I'll be rooting for you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 11, 2007, 08:16:36 PM
Coop can either destroy a guy or he can't.  Usually, but not always, he figures that out in the first few minutes of the ballgame.  There have only been 2 or 3 guys in the last couple of years that could contain him.  I had feared that Harris, with his quickness, might be one of them.  But when Coop began scoring early, you knew he was going to have a big night.

Coop is not at all quick.  With the possible exception of Evan Will, I think all of the other players in Wooster's eight-man rotation are quicker.  He's just remarkably skillfull with both his ballhandling, fakes, and shot.  He could probably turn the corner on King Kong in a phone booth, and if he couldn't, he'd get the big ape into the air, shoot over him, and draw the foul.  :)

If he was a half-step quicker, and just a little bigger and stronger, I'd bet some NBA teams would give him a look.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 11, 2007, 08:37:58 PM
Quote from: fpc85 on March 11, 2007, 08:10:59 PM
Any thoughts on the game...dont know much about wooster but i hear they are an excellent team...what are the keys to win for wooster?

I suggest you start with diehardfan's excellent tourney preview document, which you can find here:
http://wheatonhoops.googlepages.com/ncaatourney

Now, I admit that I wrote the Wooster section, so all you're really getting is my opinion, but at least it's a starting point.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 11, 2007, 08:49:42 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 11, 2007, 08:37:58 PMNow, I admit that I wrote the Wooster section, so all you're really getting is my opinion, but at least it's a starting point.  :)

Not that a Hall of Famer's opinion should be given the soft sell. ;)

I wish I remembered more about the game Amherst played against Trinity here in SA back in December. What I remember is they can shoot the lights out, played pretty physically and were really quick.

Should be an awesome game. Good luck, again, to Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 11, 2007, 08:58:31 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 11, 2007, 08:16:36 PM
If he was a half-step quicker, and just a little bigger and stronger, I'd bet some NBA teams would give him a look.
My dad and I were discussing what a nice player Cooper is and he mentioned that if only he were about 4 inches taller, imagine how deadly he would be.  And my response was thank goodness he's not, because if he was, he wouldn't be playing for Wooster right now! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fpc85 on March 11, 2007, 08:59:54 PM
Thanks for the site.....Wooster looks tough! It shapes up to be an excellent game. Both teams are deep and talented. Edge to the Jeffs. (Amherst fans that I am:))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 11, 2007, 09:17:25 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 11, 2007, 03:18:42 PM
To answer some of the burning questions from last night's game:

Elapsed time from the whistling of the technical foul to the sinking of the last associated foul shot: 7 minutes, 43 seconds.
Elapsed time between whistles on the five-second call on Tom Port at the end of regulation: 5.397 seconds

I'm not sure where you came up with a timing to three significant digits (perhaps a video replay?), but in any case this is a precise illustration of why I tend to respect referees and try to be hesitant about complaining about them.  I would have gone to my deathbed swearing that the were no more than 4 seconds between those whistles.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fpc85 on March 11, 2007, 09:29:05 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 11, 2007, 09:17:25 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 11, 2007, 03:18:42 PM
To answer some of the burning questions from last night's game:

Elapsed time from the whistling of the technical foul to the sinking of the last associated foul shot: 7 minutes, 43 seconds.
Elapsed time between whistles on the five-second call on Tom Port at the end of regulation: 5.397 seconds

I'm not sure where you came up with a timing to three significant digits (perhaps a video replay?), but in any case this is a precise illustration of why I tend to respect referees and try to be hesitant about complaining about them.  I would have gone to my deathbed swearing that the were no more than 4 seconds between those whistles.  :)
Actually it is 4 sig. figs.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 11, 2007, 09:43:28 PM
Oh well.  It's been a long time since college; plus in law school they forcibly remove whatever scientific knowledge you ever had--that's what they mean by "thinking like a lawyer."  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 11, 2007, 09:58:20 PM
Quote from: fpc85 on March 11, 2007, 09:29:05 PM
Actually it is 4 sig. figs.  ;D

Actually, four significent figures would be those of Julie Newmar, Anita Ekberg, Marilyn Monroe, and Jayne Mansfield.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 11, 2007, 10:08:56 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 11, 2007, 09:58:20 PM
Quote from: fpc85 on March 11, 2007, 09:29:05 PM
Actually it is 4 sig. figs.  ;D

Actually, four significent figures would be those of Julie Newmar, Anita Ekberg, Marilyn Monroe, and Jayne Mansfield.

I can't think of Anita Ekberg without thinking of From Russia With Love (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0057076/), where Karim Bey shoots the Bulgarian assasin Krilencu immediately after he crawls out of Anita's mouth in the wall-sized ad for Call Me Bwana (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0056897/).  Probably the most shameless bit of self-promotion this side of Federico Fellini, Bwana was a box office disaster for the producing team of Broccoli/Saltzman.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 11, 2007, 10:16:01 PM
As a devoted fan of the D3 Men's Final Four, I think it's something we all should experience at least once.  I had a blast cheering on Wittenberg last year, and of course for me it will be even more fun pulling for the Scots this weekend.  I'd be happy if the NCAC could make this into an annual tradition.  How about Ohio Wesleyan in '08?  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 11, 2007, 10:38:18 PM
From Wooster website (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/default.php):

» NCAA Div. III Tournament Ticket Information: Wooster's allotment of tickets for the "Final Four" will be sold at the Physical Education Center from noon to 6 p.m. on Monday and 9 a.m. to 6 p.m. on Tuesday. They can also be purchased on-site in Salem, Va. The ticket package is $20 for adults and $10 for students.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 11, 2007, 10:55:04 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 11, 2007, 10:16:01 PMI'd be happy if the NCAC could make this into an annual tradition.  How about Ohio Wesleyan in '08?  ;D

Let me know when it gets to Wabash's turn so I can do my vacation letter.  :D

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 11, 2007, 11:06:42 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 11, 2007, 10:38:18 PM
From Wooster website (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/default.php):

» NCAA Div. III Tournament Ticket Information: Wooster's allotment of tickets for the "Final Four" will be sold at the Physical Education Center from noon to 6 p.m. on Monday and 9 a.m. to 6 p.m. on Tuesday. They can also be purchased on-site in Salem, Va. The ticket package is $20 for adults and $10 for students.

Is there any chance that the games might be sold out in which case I have to call my contacts in Wooster?  Or I'll be fine if I just show up at the box office in Salem on Friday?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 11, 2007, 11:19:57 PM
Quote from: WooMix on March 11, 2007, 11:06:42 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 11, 2007, 10:38:18 PM
From Wooster website (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/default.php):

» NCAA Div. III Tournament Ticket Information: Wooster's allotment of tickets for the "Final Four" will be sold at the Physical Education Center from noon to 6 p.m. on Monday and 9 a.m. to 6 p.m. on Tuesday. They can also be purchased on-site in Salem, Va. The ticket package is $20 for adults and $10 for students.

Is there any chance that the games might be sold out in which case I have to call my contacts in Wooster?  Or I'll be fine if I just show up at the box office in Salem on Friday?

I would say the chances of a sellout of the Wooster section are remote.  You should know, however, that all seats are reserved (at least that's how it's been in the past), so if you want your choice of seats, the earlier you purchase the better.  If you can't buy them at Wooster, you can buy them in advance by contacting the Salem Civic Center.  There's more information available at the Championship website here: http://odac.bridgewater.edu/hoopchamp/ 

There will surely be tickets available at the door, as I'd be flabbergasted if either Amherst or Wash U. come close to selling their allotment.  Plus, unlike the sectionals, I don't think all tickets are allocated; I think there's some reserved for walk-up sales.  (It's probably in the Handbook, but having been in the Handbook 14,296 times in the past two weeks, I just don't feel like opening it up again tonight. ;D)  I attended the last two Final Fours on non-allocated tickets.

Wooster and Amherst play in the early game Friday (6pm), so make your travel plans accordingly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2007, 12:12:14 AM
The audio editing software allows me to pinpoint the first split-second of each whistle and measure the distance in between. :)

Thanks on the anthem, folks. I enjoyed it, though a little nervous. Used to do that kind of thing like four or five times a season but it's only been twice in three years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 12, 2007, 12:22:33 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 11, 2007, 11:19:57 PM

There will surely be tickets available at the door, as I'd be flabbergasted if either Amherst or Wash U. come close to selling their allotment.  Plus, unlike the sectionals, I don't think all tickets are allocated; I think there's some reserved for walk-up sales.  (It's probably in the Handbook, but having been in the Handbook 14,296 times in the past two weeks, I just don't feel like opening it up again tonight. ;D)  I attended the last two Final Fours on non-allocated tickets.


Washington had around 100 fans in Stevens Point, 8 hour drive and with the women also in the final four I seriously doubt WashU will selll their allotment.

I was told had Hope won we'd have received 300 tickets to start with which apparently is the standard. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 12, 2007, 12:21:21 PM
I visited the 4 team websites this morning and compiled their stats into one file.

Its available here in Excel format
http://www.jtaswell.com/D3BB/2007_FinalFour_Stats.xls

And here in html
http://www.jtaswell.com/D3BB/2007_FinalFour_Stats.htm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 12, 2007, 12:42:38 PM
Well, that was disappointing.  After being no worse than the tenth person in line to get tickets at Wooster, I found that all the lower level seats that Wooster was allotted are already gone or being held for player's families.  They don't seem to have been given much of an allottment at all.  A call to Salem produced the same result, they have nothing in the lower level in the Wooster section or in the adjacent section.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DLP on March 12, 2007, 01:39:12 PM
according to a friend who went at 12:30, all the wooster allotted tickets were gone in 30 mins. i called Salem direct and we're in row 17, section B9....get 'em while you (maybe) can..   :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 12, 2007, 02:15:48 PM
well here's the deal with Salem. Last year you have a "seat" but its not like its impossible to move around in there. That is impressive of Wooster to sell out their tickets. Wish i could go down there. Well Saturday night could be double the celebration.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2007, 02:17:34 PM
Just call 540-375-3004. There are plenty of seats in Wooster's quarter of the arena. Tell them you want to sit in Wooster's sections and you will be fine.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 12, 2007, 03:43:13 PM
Pat, I did call them.  They have seats in the Wooster section, but only in the upper level.  I'm just disappointed that after getting to the ticket window early all of the good seats are either gone or being reserved.  It seems to me that Wooster (and the other teams) could have been given two lower sections each instead of just one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 12, 2007, 03:51:10 PM
Ok, I just talked to someone in the Wooster Athletic Ticket Office.  They have completely sold out the initial allotment of tickets that they received, so no more are being sold today.

They called down to the Civic Center and 400 more tickets are being sent to Wooster via overnight mail.  They expect to receive them around 10 AM tomorrow and will open the ticket windows at NOON.  The tickets will be directly at one end of the court, under the basket, presumably adjacent to the original corner location of the other Wooster tickets.

Meet me in the lobby for brunch. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2007, 06:42:35 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 12, 2007, 03:43:13 PM
Pat, I did call them.  They have seats in the Wooster section, but only in the upper level.  I'm just disappointed that after getting to the ticket window early all of the good seats are either gone or being reserved.  It seems to me that Wooster (and the other teams) could have been given two lower sections each instead of just one.

Are you talking about the five rows of chairs behind the bench? (The sections marked C on this chart ...)
http://www.odaconline.com/hoopchamp/salemseatingchart.gif

That's hardly lower level and upper level. You can still shout about the refs from the B sections and you will be so close to the floor you can spit on it.

Just don't spit, please. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 12, 2007, 07:14:29 PM
I have never spit at a ref in my life; always confine that to media types. :)

The seating chart that they had at Wooster made it look more like ten rows and the woman selling the tickets said that there was a definite distinction between the lower and upper seats.  Maybe she's misinformed, I don't know.

I found a couple of pictures from the Civic Center earlier and it looks like the end line seats are way back, behind a portable metal fence.

http://www.jcu.edu/news/salem_finals.asp
(scroll down on this link to see what I mean)

I'm going down there, ticket in hand or not.  I'm just trying to decide whether to buy a poor ticket now or hope that I can finagle a better one at the door for a few more bucks.  I just like to sit close, not just to referee bait, but because my eyes are no longer the greatest.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 12, 2007, 07:31:28 PM
I realize that I have no credibility on this issue with you (;)) but I will say that the B-section seats are definitely better than the A-section (i.e., behind the baskets) seats.  There are some, like Point Special, who prefer the end seats for the different perspective, but at Salem there is a pretty substantial buffer between the court and these seats.  That's where in the past at least part of the student sections have (wisely) been located, as well as the pep bands.  The B-section seats can get pretty high, but the higher seats tend not be sold.  IIRC, the main walkways are what divides the B-s from the C-s (courtside), but the lower 15 rows or so of the B's are plenty close enough to the court for a good view.  I don't know what it takes to get courtside seats (I hesitate to call them C-section seats...eww), but I'm satisfied that I'm not important enough for them, never have been, and never will be.

If you can get seats anywhere in B-9 or B-11 (I think that's the Wooster quadrant), I think you'd like them better than seats behind the baselines.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2007, 07:43:37 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 12, 2007, 07:14:29 PM
I have never spit at a ref in my life; always confine that to media types. :)

The seating chart that they had at Wooster made it look more like ten rows and the woman selling the tickets said that there was a definite distinction between the lower and upper seats.  Maybe she's misinformed, I don't know.

I found a couple of pictures from the Civic Center earlier and it looks like the end line seats are way back, behind a portable metal fence.

That's why I suggested the B section seats.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 12, 2007, 09:21:23 PM
 Any ideas were the Wooster team or fans will be staying in Salem/Roanoke this weekend? Maybe Wooster fans could arrange for a post-game celebration(s) Friday and Saturday night. Any Ideas?

From my experience of going to grad school in the area, Mac & Bob's
Mac & Bob's http://www.macandbobs.com/ (http://www.macandbobs.com/) is a nice spot located in Salem at 316 East Main St. Salem, Va 24153
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 12, 2007, 09:38:46 PM
woolax-
From what I have heard, the team is staying at the Wyndham hotel.  I think all the teams have to stay there and that is where teams usually stay?  Also, I have heard they are completely booked both Friday and Saturday night.
Also, there is supposed to be some kind of tailgate party for Wooster fans on Friday.  Not sure of any of the details yet but when I hear, I will let you know.  The post game celebration on Saturday night will probably be at the hotel the boys are staying at.  Hope that helps. 
I think a lot of Wooster fans are staying at the Holiday Inn Roanoke - Tanglewood. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CCRolly on March 12, 2007, 09:47:07 PM
Wow, the more I hear about the seats at the end of the court, the more I don't really want them.  Is it a definite that those are the seats that Wooster will be receiving tomorrow?  I'd like to sit by the rest of the Wooster fans so I can get rowdy with them, but am just not sure about those seats behind the baseline.  Can any Wooster fan confirm the sections that are ours?  Thanks in advance for any help you guys can give...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2007, 09:49:00 PM
Just call the ticket office and don't panic, people. Sheesh.

Thanks, Booster, for starting this.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on March 12, 2007, 10:06:09 PM
Dining (drinking) wise, I believe Awful Arthur's is the preferred hangout in the area (Roanoke).

I've heard tales of debauchery from various D-3 coaches.

I've also eaten there myself, back in 2003 during Earlham's tip-off tournament.

Good stuff...and I'm sure it tastes even better during Final Four weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 12, 2007, 10:27:00 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2007, 09:49:00 PM
Just call the ticket office and don't panic, people. Sheesh.

Thanks, Booster, for starting this.  :-\

You can count on me, Pat, I've got your back.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on March 12, 2007, 10:27:29 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on March 12, 2007, 10:06:09 PM
Dining (drinking) wise, I believe Awful Arthur's is the preferred hangout in the area (Roanoke).

I've heard tales of debauchery from various D-3 coaches.
The problem with Awful Arthur is that it's a seafood place hundreds of miles from the coast. ::) With that said, their food isn't bad for inland seafood. It's definitely prettier and more open than Mac and Bob's. But it's a tad more expensive (food, not alcohol, I've only ever bought a drink at Mac and Bob's, and I have no idea how much it cost so I can't really do much comparison :D ) and less college town homey feeling than Mac and Bob's. I guess it's just a matter of preference and location of the Wooster fans, as Mac and Bob's and Awful Arthur's are pretty far apart, with Mac and Bob's being in Salem near the Civic Center, and Awful Arthur being in downtown Roanoke. I've eaten at both an approximately equal number of times over the last four years. I, too, have heard tales of debauchery taking place at Awful Arthurs. :o :D :-X It is also the famed location of the Rochester diehardfan tennis shoe eating luncheon session thing :P to which our NCAC friend David College was actually witness. Corned Beef & Co is also a pretty popular night time location. It's huge and has tons of pool tables and was mostly packed when I went there.

My favorite thing about Salem is that we're going to be there for the St. Patty's day parade. Those kind of things are so cute in a small town... though it does make finding places to park and eat a bit annoying. :) I think this is actually the second time (at least) in the last five years that the Final Four has fallen on St. Patrick's day weekend. I wonder if it has something to do with Patrick Coleman?  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DLP on March 13, 2007, 08:28:20 AM
Quote from: CCRolly on March 12, 2007, 09:47:07 PM
Can any Wooster fan confirm the sections that are ours?  Thanks in advance for any help you guys can give...

The lady I spoke with in Salem yesterday said that sections B9, B11 and C11 were reserved for Wooster fans.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on March 13, 2007, 08:41:44 AM
Is there any sort of organized group from Wooster heading out to Virginia? I'm up in Michigan and would love to go check out the Final Four, but the normal people I might go out there with may not be available and I'm likely not going if it's just me, myself, and I road-tripping out to Salem. Is there any sort of bus trip or group being put together to leave from Wooster on Friday perhaps? I didn't see anything at the college website, though I did not do an exhaustive search.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 13, 2007, 09:10:55 AM
AndersDY,

Looks like there is info about a bus trip on the basketball site now, although it indicates students, staff & faculty. But it is worth checking to see if they are allowing others, or if there is a bus for non-school people.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 13, 2007, 09:29:44 AM
Drawing from my experiences last year, Mac and Bob's is definitely the place to go. Its more of a restaurant/sports bar and may even feature live music since St. patrick's day is among us. Especially since the hotels are relatively close to downtown
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 13, 2007, 10:10:35 AM
It's official, this result just in!  In the AtR preplay (on the money so far, 6-6 in postseason DIII play) Wooster has downed Amherst by the score of 89-77.

Close most of the way, the Scots slowly edged away from the Lord Jeffs to produce the final twelve-point gap.  The differences were a rebounding margin of 33-36 and Amherst having a poor shooting night from range, going only 7-27 from beyond the arc.

Wooster was led, surprisingly by Devin Fulk, who nailed 7-12 three-pointers to total 23 points.  James Cooper threw in 17, while Tim Vandervaart and Evan Will added 15.

Dan Wheeler topped Amherst with 17 and Brian Baskauskas and Kevin Hopkins contributed 15.  Andrew Olson had 8 assists.

I'm hoping to do Virginia Wesleyan vs Washington U. today.

The boxscore:

http://arkski.com/~jwood/amherst_(77)_vs_wooster_(89).html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 13, 2007, 10:57:22 AM
Quote from: diehardfan on March 12, 2007, 10:27:29 PMI, too, have heard tales of debauchery taking place at Awful Arthurs. :o :D :-X It is also the famed location of the Rochester diehardfan tennis shoe eating luncheon session thing :P to which our NCAC friend David College was actually witness.

Since then, he's added several graduate-level programs and he's now known as David University.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 13, 2007, 11:01:46 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 13, 2007, 10:57:22 AM
Quote from: diehardfan on March 12, 2007, 10:27:29 PMI, too, have heard tales of debauchery taking place at Awful Arthurs. :o :D :-X It is also the famed location of the Rochester diehardfan tennis shoe eating luncheon session thing :P to which our NCAC friend David College was actually witness.

Since then, he's added several graduate-level programs and he's now known as David University.  ::)

I think Juris David is more appropriate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 13, 2007, 11:11:28 AM
Just talked to the Wooster ticket office.  All that they have left are endline seats, 400 of them, and they will be going on sale at noon.  There will be no returned tickets from players' families as they have actually requested more and the school will be trying to accomodate them by obtaining additional tickets from Salem.

Alright, if any of you players or parents out there are lurking and happen to have an extra good ticket, maybe we can make a deal? :)  I'm willing to pay more than face value and perhaps throw in free beer, inland seafood, or nine holes of golf. (Parents only on the brew!) :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 13, 2007, 11:21:03 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 12, 2007, 07:14:29 PM
The seating chart that they had at Wooster made it look more like ten rows and the woman selling the tickets said that there was a definite distinction between the lower and upper seats.  Maybe she's misinformed, I don't know.

I found a couple of pictures from the Civic Center earlier and it looks like the end line seats are way back, behind a portable metal fence.

Quote from: CCRolly on March 12, 2007, 09:47:07 PM
Wow, the more I hear about the seats at the end of the court, the more I don't really want them.  Is it a definite that those are the seats that Wooster will be receiving tomorrow?  I'd like to sit by the rest of the Wooster fans so I can get rowdy with them, but am just not sure about those seats behind the baseline.  Can any Wooster fan confirm the sections that are ours?  Thanks in advance for any help you guys can give...

You guys are in the Final Freaking Four.  Are you seriously bitching this hard about what seats you're getting?  Can any seat for a D3 game really be that bad?  There are fans of literally hundreds of teams that would love to be in your spot. 

I wish Wooster luck this weekend, but even more so I'm hoping that sometime between now and tipoff some of you realize just how damn fortunate you really are. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 13, 2007, 11:28:54 AM
::heavy sigh::

Here we go again.  Somebody come find me when it's over this time.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 13, 2007, 11:41:33 AM
Wooster Booster- is it possible for Wooster to lose in your "simulation" because i dont think that they have ever lost according to you.

Also, come on guys-i agree with Wally-you guys are in Salem that's all that matters. It doesn't matter where you sit. If it makes that big of a difference just go to the Amherst side. I'm sure they won't sell out their tickets. Tehre isn't a bad seat in the house there at all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 13, 2007, 11:57:10 AM
At least all of you complaining about not getting the choice seats actually GET TO GO!  I'll be stuck here in Wooster due to family obligations hoping that the internet video broadcast is watchable?! ???  I think the thing I'll miss the most is the opportunity to tailgate and hang out with fellow Wooster fans before and after the games.  It sounds like a blast from all accounts I've been hearing. 

At least I can count on Mike Breckenridge and his quality play by play that he delivers for the Scots!  I'm hoping to try and matchup the radio play-by-play with the internet broadcast, but I'm not holding my breath on that one.

The bottom line is, for those of you going to Salem, just be thankful you get the opportunity to go, because not all of us are so fortunate!  :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 13, 2007, 11:59:04 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 13, 2007, 11:57:10 AMThe bottom line is, for those of you going to Salem, just be thankful you get the opportunity to go, because not all of us are so fortunate!

QFT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on March 13, 2007, 12:00:36 PM
LOL!  :-[ Sorry David. But obviously I know how to spell your last name. :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 13, 2007, 12:02:09 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 13, 2007, 11:41:33 AM
Wooster Booster- is it possible for Wooster to lose in your "simulation" because i dont think that they have ever lost according to you.

Um, duh, have they lost yet in the actual games either?

You guys are a bad two-act circus.  As soon as one posts something negative about Wooster or its fans, the other jumps on the bandwagon.  And then often another.  Hate to tell you guys this, but we NEVER start it.  We never say a word about either of you.  We never come out and say "Hey, let's tell Wally or pennstghs what schmucks they are."  But you guys get really old.  You really do.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 13, 2007, 12:19:50 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 13, 2007, 12:02:09 PMHate to tell you guys this, but we NEVER start it.

Using the royal "we"?

I don't think Wally is the only one who thinks the ticket deal is getting out of hand.

Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2007, 09:49:00 PM
Just call the ticket office and don't panic, people. Sheesh.

Thanks, Booster, for starting this.  :-\

Nobody said anything negative about Wooster. But there are at least two barbs sent to YOU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 13, 2007, 12:28:39 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 13, 2007, 11:28:54 AM
::heavy sigh::

Here we go again.  Somebody come find me when it's over this time.  :-\

I laughed so hard when I read this. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 13, 2007, 03:21:52 PM
well yes they have lost games, vs Wittenberg when you did it and they lost last year once or twice. Not that i can talk cuz our team is not the one's going to the Final Four so you have some credibility there.

I'm not even going to say any more because it's useless arguments.......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 13, 2007, 06:00:42 PM
Hey Wooster fans -
Got an email about this:

SCOT BASKETBALL FANS INVITED TO CHEER ON THE TEAM AT THE DIV. III FINAL FOUR
The Scot basketball team is back in the NCAA Division III Final Four following a heart-stopping 94-87 overtime victory against Brockport State (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/recaps/2006-07/brockport.php) Saturday night. Wooster, which raised its record to 29-3, will take on Amherst, which is 28-2, Friday night (March 16) at 6 p.m. at the Salem Civic Center (http://www.salemciviccenter.com/). Please join us for a pre-game reception in Parlor A  of the Civic Center, beginning at 4 p.m. There will be a variety of snack foods, bottled water, and sodas, plus hot and cold hors d'oeuvres. Wear your black and gold, and get ready to cheer the Scots on to a national championship. After the game, many Wooster fans will gather at Mac and Bob's Restaurant in downtown Salem. For more information about the reception, contact Sharon Rice at srice@wooster.edu or 330-263-2458. Tickets may be purchased at the box office or online from ticketmaster.com.


For those unable to attend the games in Salem, live video of both semifinals and the consolation game will be provided by the NCAA over the Internet. Links to the live video as well as live stats can be found on the championship home page (http://www.odaconline.com/hoopchamp/). Also, the national championship game will not be offered over the Internet, as it will be broadcast live on College Sports Television (CSTV). According to CSTV's Web site, it has agreements with cable distributors representing more than 52 million homes nationwide, including Adelphia, Charter, Comcast, Cox, Insight, and Time Warner, as well as DirectTV (channel 610) and DISH Network (channel 152).


As always, live audio from the Wooster games can be heard over the Internet (http://www.wooster.edu/interactive/), courtesy of WQKT 104.5 FM.

Also,
Apparently between 12:15 and 12:30 tomorrow afternoon (Wednesday) there is a send-off for the boys leaving.  If you plan on going, people are meeting in between Lowry and the PEC to wish the boys farewell. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: division3hoops on March 13, 2007, 06:08:19 PM
Also, this link tells a little bit about the St. Patrick's Day festivities down in Roanoke for those of you making the trip:
http://www.roanokechamber.org/community_calendar/detail.php?id=262
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 13, 2007, 07:00:18 PM
Wooster's Final Four website:

http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2006-07/final4/default.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on March 13, 2007, 10:29:34 PM
Final 4 website:
http://www.odaconline.com/hoopchamp/

Scroll horizontally to see video links.

CSTV website for video of games:
http://all-access.cstv.com/cstv/player/player.html?code=ncaa

A person must register before access is available.

The ODAC Final 4 site list both Friday and Saturday games will be available thru webstreaming. Last year the championship game was available on CSTV (channel 610 on directv), dishnet and timewarner and not on internet.

Maybe there is a mistake listing the championship game being available thru CSTV video streaming.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 13, 2007, 11:05:34 PM
I've forgotten on which board I saw it, but a poster said the championship game will NOT be on the 'net, ONLY on CSTV.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 13, 2007, 11:38:38 PM
Salem's projected weekend weather

Friday
High  55 degrees
Low   37  degrees

Saturday
High  49 degrees
Low   31  degrees

Sunday
High  52 degrees
Low   40 degrees

Please pack and dress accordingly ...  :)

Source:  http://www.weather.com/weather/local/24153?lswe=24153 (http://www.weather.com/weather/local/24153?lswe=24153)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 14, 2007, 12:32:38 AM
Regardless of what CSTV decides, we will have audio of the national title game, as always. This includes the exclusive first announcement of the All-American teams, the game itself, the postgame news conferences and the popular highlight reel of the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DLP on March 14, 2007, 08:39:43 AM
Men's All-Great Lakes Region Team
Players were nominated for these awards by the Sports Information Directors at the various schools. All SIDs in the region were given the opportunity to vote.

First team

Pos.     Name                   School                 Yr.          Hometown
G         James Cooper      Wooster              Jr.           Springfield, Ohio
G         Stephen Cramer   Hope                   Sr.          Akron, Mich.
F         Tori Davis              Baldwin-Wallace Sr.           Elyria, Ohio
F         Tom Port               Wooster              Sr.          Avon Lake, Ohio
C         Tyler Ousley          Otterbein            Sr.          Butler, Ohio

Second team

Pos.        Player                  School                                   Yr.    Hometown
G            Jon Koch               Washington and Jefferson   Sr.    New Kensington, Pa.
G            Greg Rosatelli       Westminster (Pa.)                Sr.    Clinton, Pa.
F             Dane Borchers     Wittenberg                           Sr.    Russia, Ohio
F             Brandon Mimes     John Carroll                         Sr.    Euclid, Ohio
C            Dan Hodgkinson    Denison                               Sr.    Lake Forest, Ill.

Third team

Pos.             Player                      School                 Yr.        Hometown
G                 Caleb Veldhouse     Calvin                  So.       Sioux Falls, S.D.
G                 Brandon Todd          Muskingum          Jr.        Cambridge, Ohio
F                  Ben Chojnacki         Ohio Wesleyan    Sr.        Medina, Ohio
F                  Andrew Zimmer       Wabash              Jr.          Hobart, Ind.
C                 Tim Vandervaart     Wooster               Sr.         North Canton, Ohio

Player of the Year: Tom Port, Wooster
Coach of the Year: Steve Moore, Wooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 14, 2007, 08:41:53 AM
D3hoops.com Men's All-Great Lakes Region Team (http://www.d3hoops.com/all-region/07/glakemen.htm)

Crongratulations to Tom Port and Steve Moore for  being named the D3hoops.com Player and Coach of the Year for the Great Lakes Region! 8)

Congrats also to James Cooper who made 1st Team All-GL Region along with Port.  Tim Vandervaart also made 3rd Team!

Lastly, congratulations to all the NCAC players to make the team:

Dane Borchers and Dan Hodgkinson made 2nd Team.  Ben Chojnacki and Andrew Zimmer joined Vandervaart on the 3rd Team.

Congrats to all these fine players and especially the seniors (Cooper and Zimmer are the only returning NCAC players to make the All-Region Team.  There was actually only one other non-senior to make the All-Region team and that was Veldhouse from Calvin!) on fine and memorable carreers you have given us fans.  Thanks again!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on March 14, 2007, 10:42:20 AM
Is Wooster no longer putting a fan bus for the Final Four together? I don't see the notice on the website any more and my email to the contact person hasn't been answered. Has anyone heard that they cancelled that bus?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 14, 2007, 11:16:12 AM
Quote from: AndersDY on March 14, 2007, 10:42:20 AM
Is Wooster no longer putting a fan bus for the Final Four together? I don't see the notice on the website any more and my email to the contact person hasn't been answered. Has anyone heard that they cancelled that bus?

The bus info is now on the Wooster Final Four main page located at:

http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2006-07/final4/default.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 14, 2007, 11:21:43 AM
I was just told by the Wooster athletic office that the bus is full and there are no plans for another one.  All tickets that Wooster had for sale are being returned to the Salem Civic Center (they will actually travel with the team today and go on sale down there tomorrow).  The majority of these are endline seats but a few upper-level top row seats in the Scots' sections remain.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 14, 2007, 11:27:07 AM
It sounds like Wooster is going to have an excellent crowd in Salem.  That's great; I'm excited!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 14, 2007, 11:49:58 AM
The NCAC gobbled up 7 of the 15 available places on the All-Region teams, including Player of the Year, and nabbed Coach of the Year besides.  Five NCAC teams (Wooster, Witt, OWU, Denison, Wabash) had players named to the Regional teams.  By contrast, the OAC had just four representatives, one each from four teams, and the MIAA and Prexy had only two apiece.  And, it must be noted, nobody from the AMCC, including nobody from Lake Erie, made the All-Region team.  As much as I love Steve Moore and respect the job he's done this year, I think my Coach of the Year vote would have gone to LEC's Cliff Hunt (Hiram, Class of '69.)

Congratulations to all of the NCAC players and to Coach Moore for these achievements!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DLP on March 14, 2007, 12:34:13 PM
According to an article in the Daily Record today, BW3's will be showing the championship game on Saturday should Wooster be playing. With it being St. Patty's Day and with OSU's game earlier in the day, that should still be a fun time if you can't make it to Salem!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 14, 2007, 02:07:41 PM
In all seriousness...good luck to the Scots this weekend.  Amherst will be very tough.  You can count on one hand the number of things that can pry me from the first weekend of the Big Dance...watching an NCAC team in the D-III championship is one of them (don't ask about the others). 

If the Scots make it to Saturday's championship, I'll be watching live from the front row seat in my living room.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on March 14, 2007, 02:12:20 PM
I gave up on waiting to hear back on that bus group and just went for it and got my tickets direct from Salem, I'll just have to drive myself out there now. It sounds like Wooster will be bringing a sizeable group out. I was told nothing was available in the Wooster section and I will have to sit across the way, but when I was concerned I may be sitting smack in the middle of some other group, the person I spoke to said "oh, they're everywhere" in regard to the Woo ticket holders.

I did get someone on campus on the phone and found out that 100+ of the college's allotment was sent back to Salem, but there is really no way to purchase those specific seats until tomorrow or Friday.

Anyway, see everyone on Friday, hopefully it will be good and loud. You can look for me, I'll probably pull out my "Wooster is not in Massachusetts" shirt on Friday, seems appropriate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: petewitt54 on March 14, 2007, 02:49:51 PM
What a great time of year!  To all of you Scots fans going to Salem, I had the same worries as you going into the Final Four last year.  I simply ordered my tickets through TicketMaster, picked them up at will call, and then sat wherever I wanted.  It wasn't a problem at all.  I ended up with some pretty decent seats.  Just my two cents. 

I can't believe I'm saying this, but Go Scots!    Wooster has been quite the archrival through my career, and as a player, I could not stand them.  Now, as I mellow out, I really respect and admire the program.  Best of luck to COW and I'll (honestly) be cheering for you guys.

A quick story from the Elite 8 game, I was in Houston, Tx for work and my laptop had crashed.  I wanted to see what was happening in the game so I went to the hotel's computer.  There were no speakers, so the audio was out of the question, so what did I do?  The live stats.  I was sitting in front of a computer, sweating out an overtime game, through a stat feed.  The people around me had to have thought I was on drugs.  Nope, just a d3 basketball fan.  Which is worse? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 14, 2007, 03:00:43 PM
Quote from: petewitt54 on March 14, 2007, 02:49:51 PM
What a great time of year!  To all of you Scots fans going to Salem, I had the same worries as you going into the Final Four last year.  I simply ordered my tickets through TicketMaster, picked them up at will call, and then sat wherever I wanted.  It wasn't a problem at all.  I ended up with some pretty decent seats.  Just my two cents.   

That may or may not work.  A couple of years ago, my walk-up tickets were in the Rochester section, and a number of Rochester students tried the same trick, but every time they did, the ushers were right there to chase them away again.  I guess it depends on how crowded the section is you're trying to elbow into, and whether you look like a student or not.  And if you're a foot taller than the usher, that probably helps too.  ;D

But those Rochester students weren't evicted or anything, so I guess it can't hurt to try.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 14, 2007, 03:34:46 PM
Quote from: DLP on March 14, 2007, 12:34:13 PM
According to an article in the Daily Record today, BW3's will be showing the championship game on Saturday should Wooster be playing. With it being St. Patty's Day and with OSU's game earlier in the day, that should still be a fun time if you can't make it to Salem!
I read about this too.  While I could care less about the Buckeyes, and I really don't care for BW3's (white trash headquarters of Wooster ::) ) I might just have to go and at least give it a try should the Scots get past Amherst Friday evening.  After all, the owner is a COW alumnus and it is going to be St. Patty's Day.  Besides, after my family obligations are through, I will definately be in the frame of mind to throw back a pint or 10 of Guinness while watching the Scots go for their 1st National Championship!!! ;D :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 14, 2007, 03:57:16 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 14, 2007, 03:34:46 PM
Quote from: DLP on March 14, 2007, 12:34:13 PM
According to an article in the Daily Record today, BW3's will be showing the championship game on Saturday should Wooster be playing. With it being St. Patty's Day and with OSU's game earlier in the day, that should still be a fun time if you can't make it to Salem!
I read about this too.  While I could care less about the Buckeyes, and I really don't care for BW3's (white trash headquarters of Wooster ::) ) I might just have to go and at least give it a try should the Scots get past Amherst Friday evening.  After all, the owner is a COW alumnus and it is going to be St. Patty's Day.  Besides, after my family obligations are through, I will definately be in the frame of mind to throw back a pint or 10 of Guinness while watching the Scots go for their 1st National Championship!!! ;D :P

I'm confused. You're gonna celebrate an Irish holiday by rooting on the Scots whilst drinking Irish beer? And I thought my last Cinco de Mayo was messed up. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 14, 2007, 04:04:14 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on March 14, 2007, 03:57:16 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 14, 2007, 03:34:46 PM
Quote from: DLP on March 14, 2007, 12:34:13 PM
According to an article in the Daily Record today, BW3's will be showing the championship game on Saturday should Wooster be playing. With it being St. Patty's Day and with OSU's game earlier in the day, that should still be a fun time if you can't make it to Salem!
I read about this too.  While I could care less about the Buckeyes, and I really don't care for BW3's (white trash headquarters of Wooster ::) ) I might just have to go and at least give it a try should the Scots get past Amherst Friday evening.  After all, the owner is a COW alumnus and it is going to be St. Patty's Day.  Besides, after my family obligations are through, I will definately be in the frame of mind to throw back a pint or 10 of Guinness while watching the Scots go for their 1st National Championship!!! ;D :P

I'm confused. You're gonna celebrate an Irish holiday by rooting on the Scots whilst drinking Irish beer? And I thought my last Cinco de Mayo was messed up. :)
And I'm of German decent if it wasn't confusing enough already?!?! :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 14, 2007, 04:22:47 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 14, 2007, 04:04:14 PMAnd I'm of German decent if it wasn't confusing enough already?!?! :D

Nein!

All joking aside I, too, will be throwing back a few pints of Guinness on Saturday and hopefully I'll get to toast a Wooster victory. Good luck, Scots. All y'all fixin to travel be careful.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: guyman on March 14, 2007, 04:24:07 PM
Good luck Scots, from a fan in NJ. By the way, will there be any national TV coverage of the Final Four or the Final?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 14, 2007, 04:35:25 PM
In an AtR game that wasn't nearly as close as the 73-53 final, Virginia Wesleyan easily turned aside Washington University enroute to a showdown with Wooster in the final.

It was all about dominating the boards as a 40-26 rebounding margin produced 20 more shots (67-47) for VWU.  The lead was 37-16 at the half, and reached a peak of 30 at 57-27 with 10:40 remaining.  Both teams began clearing the benches at around the six-minute mark and WU's bench managed to knock ten points off the difference.

Neither team shot the ball well, and both were pitiful from long range, combining to go 6-34 on three-point attempts.  TonTon Balenga alone was 1-8 from a distance but was 7-16 overall to lead VWU with 18 points.

Boxscore:

http://arkski.com/~jwood/washington%20u._(53)_vs_virginia%20wesleyan_(73).html  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pbrooks3 on March 14, 2007, 09:52:38 PM
I'll throw in my support for the SCOTS!.  Good luck in Salem.  Regardless of what happens, you've had a great season with a complete team and outstanding coaching staff.  Pretty impressive fan support, too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 14, 2007, 10:31:14 PM
so after doing some research the only some what funny anti-Amherst cheer I fould was: "Amherst Sucks, Lord Jeff Swallows :o"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 14, 2007, 10:34:18 PM
There is reportedly a T-shirt available which reads

Amherst : Williams :: Chocolate : Poop

:D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 14, 2007, 10:43:16 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 14, 2007, 10:34:18 PM
There is reportedly a T-shirt available which reads

Amherst : Williams :: Chocolate : Poop

:D


I can vouch for that. I saw that with my own eyes when Amherst played Trinity here in SA on New Year's Eve. That is the best smack ever. Eh-VER!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 14, 2007, 11:24:05 PM
Best cheer ever, though, is from M.I.T.:

Cosine, secant, tangent, sine!
3.14159!

Especially pertinent since today, March 14th (3.14 - get it?) is national Pi day. ;)

http://www.examiner.com/a-612894~Pi_Fans_Have_Their_Day.html?cid=rss-Strange

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: mrmike88 on March 14, 2007, 11:47:53 PM
A group of Williams students printed out shirts for the annual football game a few years back that (roughly) said:

"What do Amherst and (excrement) have in common?  They're both #2."

They haven't really let us forget that they passed us in the US News rankings in 2003...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 15, 2007, 01:47:43 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 14, 2007, 03:34:46 PM
Quote from: DLP on March 14, 2007, 12:34:13 PM
According to an article in the Daily Record today, BW3's will be showing the championship game on Saturday should Wooster be playing. With it being St. Patty's Day and with OSU's game earlier in the day, that should still be a fun time if you can't make it to Salem!
I read about this too.  While I could care less about the Buckeyes, and I really don't care for BW3's (white trash headquarters of Wooster ::) ) I might just have to go and at least give it a try should the Scots get past Amherst Friday evening.  After all, the owner is a COW alumnus and it is going to be St. Patty's Day.  Besides, after my family obligations are through, I will definately be in the frame of mind to throw back a pint or 10 of Guinness while watching the Scots go for their 1st National Championship!!! ;D :P

Guinness? At least go find a bottle or two of McEwan's Scotch Ale to honor Wooster's Caledonian traditions. A Fat Tire aficionado such as yourself should appreciate the fine maltiness of a "wee heavy" such as McEwan's Scotch Ale. It's one of my top ten favorite beers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 15, 2007, 09:16:44 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 15, 2007, 01:47:43 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 14, 2007, 03:34:46 PM
Quote from: DLP on March 14, 2007, 12:34:13 PM
According to an article in the Daily Record today, BW3's will be showing the championship game on Saturday should Wooster be playing. With it being St. Patty's Day and with OSU's game earlier in the day, that should still be a fun time if you can't make it to Salem!
I read about this too.  While I could care less about the Buckeyes, and I really don't care for BW3's (white trash headquarters of Wooster ::) ) I might just have to go and at least give it a try should the Scots get past Amherst Friday evening.  After all, the owner is a COW alumnus and it is going to be St. Patty's Day.  Besides, after my family obligations are through, I will definately be in the frame of mind to throw back a pint or 10 of Guinness while watching the Scots go for their 1st National Championship!!! ;D :P

Guinness? At least go find a bottle or two of McEwan's Scotch Ale to honor Wooster's Caledonian traditions. A Fat Tire aficionado such as yourself should appreciate the fine maltiness of a "wee heavy" such as McEwan's Scotch Ale. It's one of my top ten favorite beers.
Yes, I do like the McEwan's.  That's one ale, ala Great Lakes Christmas Ale, that you have to watch out for if you aren't careful! :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 15, 2007, 10:35:20 AM
An interesting tidbit caught my eye in today's Daily Record:

Quote from: The Daily RecordWOOSTER -- Jane and Steve Moore of Wooster announce the engagement of their daughter, Beth, to Nate Gaubatz. He is the son of Joan and Chuck Gaubatz of Wooster.

Miss Moore is a 2003 graduate of the College of Wooster, with a bachelor of arts degree in history, Bowling Green State University Graduate School in 2006, with a masters degree in education and will graduate in August as an education specialist in school psychology. She is an intern school psychologist for Clyde-Green Springs Exempted Village Schools.

Her fiance is a 2001 graduate of the College of Wooster, with a bachelor of arts degree in history and will graduate this year from the University of Scranton, with a masters degree in educational administration. He is a history teacher at Cloverleaf High School and is a junior varsity men's basketball coach and varsity assistant coach at the College of Wooster.

A July 21 wedding is planned at St. Mary Catholic Church in Wooster.

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/1723331

Congratulations to Nate and Beth!  I hope Nate gets along with his new in-laws.  ;D 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 15, 2007, 11:07:13 AM
o boy Steve Moore's daughter is engaged-i can live my day peacefully now
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 15, 2007, 11:49:04 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 15, 2007, 11:07:13 AM
o boy Steve Moore's daughter is engaged-i can live my day peacefully now

Going to Salem?  Please introduce yourself so I can belt you right in the mouth.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 15, 2007, 12:02:43 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 15, 2007, 11:49:04 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 15, 2007, 11:07:13 AM
o boy Steve Moore's daughter is engaged-i can live my day peacefully now

Going to Salem?  Please introduce yourself so I can belt you right in the mouth.

Will CSTV or D3Hoops.com have any coverage of that?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Toph on March 15, 2007, 12:03:30 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 15, 2007, 11:07:13 AM
o boy Steve Moore's daughter is engaged-i can live my day peacefully now

Is this necessary?  

By the way, pennstghs, still think the NCAC is better than the OAC as a conference?

You said we should wait until tournament time...tournament time is here...and while one NCAC team is doing extremely well, I don't remember anyone else from the conference being invited.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rscl70 on March 15, 2007, 03:03:23 PM
Best of luck to the Wooster Scotts this weekend! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 15, 2007, 05:40:02 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 15, 2007, 11:49:04 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 15, 2007, 11:07:13 AM
o boy Steve Moore's daughter is engaged-i can live my day peacefully now

Going to Salem?  Please introduce yourself so I can belt you right in the mouth.

I can't stress enough how inappropriate this post is. Somewhere you must know better.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 15, 2007, 09:08:11 PM
Everyone on Hoopsville just picked Wooster to beat Amherst, including Pat Coleman who, IIRC, has seen each team four times this season.  :)

Of course, Pat had Trinity (CT) vs. John Carroll in this game on his bracket.  :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 16, 2007, 12:48:22 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 15, 2007, 09:08:11 PM
Everyone on Hoopsville just picked Wooster to beat Amherst...

Would this qualify as falling under the'Hoopsville Jinx'??  :o ;)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on March 16, 2007, 06:02:32 AM
good luck wooster tonight and this weekend
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on March 16, 2007, 08:54:59 AM
Nice article about the Scots by Terry Pluto in the Akron Beacon-Journal.

Title dream motivation for Wooster (http://www.ohio.com/mld/ohio/16915783.htm)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 16, 2007, 09:18:57 AM
Toph - We all know that the way that the NCAA gives out D-3 at-large bids are an egregous insult, so don't go there.

Good luck to Wooster!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 16, 2007, 10:46:43 AM
I apologize for my inappropriate comment. It's pretty low how anyone can make a joke, but when I do its deemed inappropriate. Anyways

Good luck tonight Wooster. Don't let Amherst get hot from outside...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 16, 2007, 11:13:12 AM
I was talking about the response to your post obviously.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on March 16, 2007, 11:16:52 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 16, 2007, 11:13:12 AM
I was talking about the response to your post obviously.  :-\

I was hoping that was so because pennstghs is not the one that should be apologizing.

In fact, I hope you are considering banning Wooster Booster permanently.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on March 16, 2007, 01:57:45 PM
Actually, Mark Simon picked Amherst to win it all later, so I think you guys are safe. :) In my original bracket, I had Wooster winning it all, and then changed it at the last second to Point. I have a feeling that's going to turn out just like the way that you're supposed to go with your first impression on a test. :D

Was definitely cool to see the player interviews live. Tom Port did a nice job representing Wooster. And everyone was asking where their favorite Top 25 guru was... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 16, 2007, 03:23:19 PM
I don't think there's anything to be gained by discussing the future status of individual posters. You're more likely to influence me to the opposite of what you would prefer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 16, 2007, 04:05:52 PM
Well, seeing as though I can't be in Salem in person, I might as well make the most of being stuck here in Wooster tonight.  I've already got some 12 oz. berverages chilling in the fridge along with a couple of half baked Coccia House Pizzas to throw in the oven after the game.  I don't see myself having much of an appetite until the final buzzer goes off! :P  Hopefully we will be celebrating a berth in the finals for the Scots!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 16, 2007, 06:38:54 PM
Amherst leads Wooster by 14 at the half, 39-25.

Amherst led big early, jumping out to an 18-4 lead on the Scots, and have kept it above double digits the majority of the way.

The early leader for Wooster was Tim Vandervaart who has 12 points on 6-6 shooting.  Tom Port has 7 points, while James Cooper has been held to 2 points on 1-5 shooting.

3 point shooting may be the difference.  Wooster as a team is only 1-9 from 3 point land (Port the only make), while Amherst is 7-15.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: The Goreman on March 16, 2007, 06:39:38 PM
Down 14 at halftime.  Amherst is playing like it's been there before, which it has.  I hope the Scots can catch their breath and pull of its third straight double-digit comeback.   :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 16, 2007, 07:36:47 PM
Despite a valiant second-half comeback which saw the Scots grab a three point lead, Wooster falls to Amherst in the national semifinal 67-60.

Wooster was led by Tim Vandervaart with 20 points on 9-10 shooting.  Tom Port finishes with 13 and James Cooper with 12.

Wooster falls to 29-4, and will finish their season tomorrow in the third-place game at 2:30 p.m.

Congratulations to Wooster for giving the NCAC another deep run into the postseason.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: The Goreman on March 16, 2007, 07:37:06 PM
Scots showed a lot of heart and character in their comeback.  The shots just didn't fall at the end, and Amherst made the plays.  Nothing to be ashamed of.  Congratulations on a great effort.  You made your fans proud.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 16, 2007, 09:44:41 PM
Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

The 3rd time was a charm for Williams when they faced Wooster in 2003 and the 3rd time was again the charm for Amherst against Wooster in 2007! :'(  Maybe, the next time Wooster makes it to Salem will finally be the charm for the Scots as well?!?! ???

I really had a good feeling about this game when the Scots wasted hardly any time erasing a 14 point halftime deficit and eventually taking 3 point lead of their own, but to Amherst's credit, they didn't fold up their tents and they made the big plays and hit their ft's down the stretch to preserve the win.

I just wanted to be the first to congratulate this team on a fine fine accomplishment!!!  You guys were only the 2nd Wooster team to advance this far in the tournament so you have nothing to hang your head over!!  As hard as it is, go out tomorrow and get it done in the consolation game tomorrow!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pbrooks3 on March 16, 2007, 10:24:37 PM
Congrats to the SCOTS for making it to the Final Four and playing a tough game against Amherst.  You had a wonderful season.  Good luck in tomorrow's 3rd place game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: senatorfrost on March 16, 2007, 10:29:02 PM
 According to what I heard on the webcast Coach Hixon when asked said that Vanderwaart was your best player. Certainly looked that way to me and the guy has a bad hand!!
  I gave McLaughlin my player of the game award and of course Vanderwaart would have gotten it if Wooster had won. Wooster is a very nice team and I appreciated the fans who came over to NESCAC and participated. I liked the Box Score which incorporated stats. ( I assumed) You have pretty good fans.
Best of luck for tomorrows game and may all arrive home safely.
   
   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 16, 2007, 11:05:16 PM
Well, phooey.  I'm much too tired to say anything intelligent tonight (I have no excuse the rest of the time ;D) except congratulations to the Scots.  Another dig-deep gutty comeback, but Amherst had the moxie to hold off a couple of Scot runs and hang on.  It was closer than 7 points; a shot rimming out here or a bad pass there was the difference.  Tough loss for our heroes, but a great tourney run, and still a chance for the record-tying (I think) 30th win tomorrow against Wash U.

The Wooster contingent here is larger than anyone else's, even Va. Wesleyan.  It's a very impressive turnout by the fans (if I do say so myself :-[).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 16, 2007, 11:14:37 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 16, 2007, 11:05:16 PM
The Wooster contingent here is larger than anyone else's, even Va. Wesleyan.  It's a very impressive turnout by the fans (if I do say so myself :-[).

It was the same way with Witt last year.  You would think VW would have more fans considering it is in their home state, but that just shows you the dedication of NCAC fans.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 16, 2007, 11:58:44 PM
Tough loss for Wooster tonight as it looked like the Scots might get the win when they led 59-56 with about 4 minutes remaining.  Amherst finished the game with a 11-1 run to garner the victory. :(

Terrific performance by Tim Vandervaart as he led the Scots with 20 points and was unstoppable in the lane tonight.  Turnovers hurt Wooster tonight and some cold shooting stretches at inopportune times (only made 5 three pointers tonight and the Scots missed a number of open shots).

David is quite correct that Wooster has the biggest fan contingent in Salem and we made plenty of noise tonight. :)

Let's hope that Wooster can get a 3rd place win tomorrow afternoon vs. Washington University.  It would be great to have Tom Port, Tim Vandervaart and Andy Van Horn finish their collegiate careers with a "W". :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Amherst95 on March 17, 2007, 04:21:33 AM
I want to offer some respect to Wooster's team and its fans.  The difference between victory and defeat in a game like that is razor thin, as we all know from previous trips to Salem.

It is a distinct privilege for us to compete against a program like yours.  Tonight we were the better team, but it would take us years to match the sustained excellence of your program.  I hope we will have the opportunity to match up again soon.

Good luck next season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on March 17, 2007, 10:28:40 AM
I know all about the heartbreak that comes with watching your team lose in the national semifinal game.  IWU lost to Rowan in 1996, William Paterson in 2001, and Virginia Wesleyan in 2006.  The Titans looked to have the games vs Rowan and VWC won, which made it even tougher when the final horn sounded.  When the dream of a national championship dies, it's tough.

Sometime early Saturday afternoon the sting starts to wear off and you realize how special it's been to watch your team play and how great it will be to see the seniors take the floor in your school's uniform one final time.  You go to the Salem Civic Center and enjoy a game that becomes sort of a celebration, but also one where the guys will be playing as hard as if it's the late game Saturday.  Whether they raise the 3rd or 4th place trophy, it hits you how special of a accomplishment it was to get to Salem, Virginia and how many great memories you have of that group of young men...

http://www.iwuhoops.com/3rd.jpg

This group of Wooster players has nothing to hang their heads over.  They've been special for a long time. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: PraiseTheLords* on March 17, 2007, 01:07:54 PM
More props here from an opposing fan for Vandervaart and his (forgive unavoidable Boston reference) Kevin McHale imitation. The drop-steps, spins, over-under moves...you don't see post work like that very often anymore. Even better than his shooting percentage was the fact that by the time he'd finished his footwork, the shots were actually easy. I didn't think Amherst was going to survive him.

Here's hoping that V. and his teammates will eventually feel the satisfaction they deserve from a strong final game and a great season. Wooster was a pleasure to watch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 17, 2007, 04:22:16 PM
Wash. U defeats Wooster 92-84 in the consolation game.

Tough weekend for Wooster, and while I'm sure it stings now, this team can always remember they finished in the top 4 in the nation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 17, 2007, 04:33:25 PM
I know it's small consolation to Scots fans but you guys had a great run and represented the NCAC well. It may hurt now but keep in mind there are literally hundreds of programs that would love to have the sustained success you've enjoyed. Getting to Salem is just a fantasy for a lot of us but was your reality this year.

Congrats on your great season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 17, 2007, 10:28:59 PM
I hope I'm not wrecking a state secret, because I don't see the All-American teams posted anywhere.  I think the tradition has been that they are announced during the championship broadcast, and I assume that happened today as well.  So congratulations to Wooster's Tom Port and James Cooper, both named to the D3Hoops.com All-America second team today, and to Wittenberg's Dane Borchers, who was named to the third team (IIRC).  It's great to have three NCAC players with national recognition, just like it's great to have the NCAC represented in the Final Four (even if the weekend was less than satisfying.)  Go Scots, Go Dane, and Go NCAC!  :)

Also I would like to congratulate Tim Vandervaart who played a tremendous couple of games and was quite deservedly named to the all-Final Four team.  I'm told that it's not automatic that one player from each team gets on the team, and even if it were, Tim clearly deserves this honor.  I doubt that anyone on Amherst or Wash U. would dispute that.

Finally, congratulations and thanks to Tom Port, Tim Vandervaart, and Andy Van Horn for allowing up to share in their successes these past four years.  It's been a real thrill ride with this group of seniors, with both highs and lows but overall a fantastic record of success, culminating in a special senior year here in Salem.  You've done the school and conference proud.  Thanks and good luck in your futures!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 17, 2007, 10:50:47 PM
While my Alma Mater fell in both games this weekend, I have never been prouder to say that I am an Wooster Alum. The heart I witnessed in person Friday Night in Salem during Wooster's furious comeback vs Amherst, and the tenacity and class they demonstrated in the 3rd place game today, playing less then 24hrs after such a emotionally deflating loss, left me possibly prouder of Wooster then I would have been had they won the National Championship.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 17, 2007, 11:32:05 PM
If I may be permitted to stray off-topic a wee bit for a moment, I'd also like to say congratulations to the swimmers and divers at Kenyon and Denison for their performances at the D3 nationals these past two weekends. 

Last weekend, the Kenyon Ladies captured the D3 national swimming and diving championship, their 21st team national title in the past 24 seasons.  Kenyon had finished second to Emory each of the past two years, but this year the Ladies swamped the competition, amassing 538 points, nearly as many as 2nd place Amherst (320) and third-place Emory (295) combined.  Denison, the 2001 champion and 4 times a runner-up to Kenyon, finished fifth this year with 267 points. 

This weekend, the Kenyon Lords captured their amazing 28th consecutive national championship, winning an astounding nine of 20 events to outdistance second-place Denison by a 570-351 margin. 

Congratulations to the Kenyon and Denison swimmers, and thanks for doing the NCAC proud!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Toph on March 18, 2007, 12:11:08 PM
Congrats to Wooster on another fantastic season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on March 18, 2007, 06:54:49 PM
Finally back in Michigan. It was good to see some of you guys out in Salem and, though I don't remember 2003 too well, I think more fans in black and gold than were brought on the last trip. I'm sorry to report that next time the Scots make the Final Four, I will probably make every effort to return, despite Wooster now having a 1-6 record in road games I've attended.

Wooster certainly belonged on the floor with all three teams, but I'm guessing that neither of those performances represented the full 40 minute effort they usually brought this year. In past trips to Salem, there often appears to be one of the four teams that snuck in and was not quite up to Final Four caliber, but all four squads looked up to the competition this year. Seeing the seniors that Washington U sent to get their trophy, (no starters, and only one reserve I recall seeing the floor) they must have an inside track to the top of next season's preseason poll.

The Wooster seniors certainly went out firing every shot they had. Always a fun weekend in Salem and hopefully there will be another one soon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: La Verdad on March 18, 2007, 08:45:38 PM
I'm a loyal Amherst fan and I just wanted to come over to Wooster's home board to give you guys some love.  Your team played their guts out, your fans screamed till their voices were gone, and then you went out Sat night with your heads held high and partied your faces off.  I got to talk to Vandervart and Port for a bit and they are both incredibly classy guys, best of luck to them in whatever they do.  Congrats on a great season and know that there is a small town in MA that has nothing but respect for your program.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 18, 2007, 09:18:58 PM
Just back from Salem a few hours ago and I wanted to post a few more thoughts on a great Final Four weekend.

Wooster should be very proud that they made it to the Final Four (second time in 5 years).  It is a real achievement that many D3 teams would love to accomplish even once.

Wooster led both games in the second half but just couldn't put together the finishing stretch in either game to get the victory.  The difference in the Amherst game was razor thin as the Lords had 3 fewer turnovers, 2 more rebounds and 2 more steals than the Scots.  That translated to 53 shot attempts for Amherst compared to only 45 attempts for Wooster which was one reason for the loss.   The other reason was Amherst outscoring Wooster by a 11-1 margin to end the game.

The Washington University game was lost primarily because Wooster did not play its best defense.  The Scots gave up 92 points obviously and they allowed the Bears to shoot 49% from the floor compared to only 42% for Wooster.

I also want to add my CONGRATULATIONS to Tom Port, Tim Vandervaart and Andy Van Horn on their terrific careers as Scots! :)

Wooster fans were all over Salem this weekend and the Scots had the most support, even more than in-state Virginia Wesleyan.  Good job Wooster nation!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 18, 2007, 10:18:03 PM
Got in last night from Salem.  It was a great weekend and I did enjoy myself.  Maybe the third time will be the charm as was the case for Amherst?

I would like to thank Woolax for the ride to and from Salem and among many other things.  You are most certainly a great guy and a true Fighting Scot.  Thank you man.   Hopefully we'll make the trip together again in the near future?

It was a great season for the Scots folks.  I surely enjoyed it to the max.  Hopefully the next one will be just as good.  On this note I also would like to thank you all posters for your informative posts.  It wouldn't have been the same without this board.  Please let's make a date for the 2007-2008 season.  This is me signing off for the season.  Its been real folks.  Peace.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on March 20, 2007, 10:27:55 AM
Withdrawal...sigh  :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on April 20, 2007, 01:30:19 PM
It looks like Tom Port got off to a fairly good start at the College Basketball Invitational (http://www.mccarthysports.com/).  His team (Structure Personnel) was seeded directly into the winner's bracket, and they defeated a team that had won earlier in the day (Soprema) 104-99.  Port was the only D3 player in this game, and he scored 14 on 5 of 8 shooting (4/6 from the arc.)  His team advances to take on the only 2-0 team in the tournament (Galaxy, another D3-less team) this afternoon.  A couple more good performances might get Tom into Saturday's All-Star game, to be televised live on ESPN U.

Stats from Tom's first game (http://www.mccarthysports.com/cbi_game3_stats.html)
D3Hoops.com coverage by Matthew Florjancic (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables.php?item=1022)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on April 22, 2007, 05:36:34 PM
Any word on whether or not Port happened to make the 'All-Star' game tonight at the CBI?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on April 22, 2007, 11:56:22 PM
He did not; B-WC's Tori Davis was the only D3 player in the All-Star Game.  D3Hoops.com coverage. (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables.php?item=1026)

I can't quite figure out how this tournament was structured; it seemed that Port's team received a bye into the winner's bracket, but then was eliminated with just one loss.  So Tom only played in two games, and his numbers in the second one (http://www.mccarthysports.com/cbi_game7_stats.html) weren't very inspiring (0/2, both from deep, with 1 rebound, 1 block, and 2 assists in 23 minutes, but 4/5 from the line.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on April 23, 2007, 08:54:06 AM
I just read the front page of GoBlueWolverine.com that Blake Mealer's younger brother, Elliot, is in the middle of a recuriting battle between Michigan and Ohio State for his services on the gridiron.  He's from Waseon which is pretty much on the dividing line between Ohio State and Michigan fans, so it'll be interesting to see where he ends up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on April 24, 2007, 08:52:54 AM
^^^^^

I guess it wasn't much of a battle after all as Blake's younger brother committed yesterday to Miiiichigan!!! ;D  GO BLUE!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on April 25, 2007, 08:31:01 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on April 24, 2007, 08:52:54 AM
^^^^^

I guess it wasn't much of a battle after all as Blake's younger brother committed yesterday to Miiiichigan!!! ;D  GO BLUE!!!

I heard he was homesick and would be transfering to Arkansas.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on April 27, 2007, 10:31:54 AM
Quote from: sac on April 25, 2007, 08:31:01 PM
I heard he was homesick and would be transfering to Arkansas.  ::)
LOL!!!   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on April 28, 2007, 02:50:12 PM
I'm glad someone got that very obscure reference. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on May 07, 2007, 08:20:53 PM
Congratulations to Wooster senior Andy Van Horn, who earned first-team all NCAC honors in men's golf this season.  Andy tallied a composite score of 702 strokes over the nine conference-sanctioned rounds, a scoring average of 78.0, good for fifth-best in the conference.  Andy was also a first-team all-conference performer in his freshman season.  The College of Wooster community is really going to miss this guy when he graduates.

Ohio Wesleyan ran away with both the season-long league crown and the post-season tournament, and will represent the conference in the NCAA tournament.  OWU also swept the postseason awards, including 3 golfers on the all-NCAC first team, a fourth named conference player of the year (which encompasses off-the-links attributes such as academics and sportsmanship), coach of the year, and tournament medalist.  Congratulations to the Bishops, and good luck in the nationals!

http://www.northcoast.org/go/goallncac07.pdf
http://athletics.wooster.edu/golf/recaps/2006-07/ncac.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on May 13, 2007, 04:57:04 PM
Wooster tends to post their schedule among the latest in D3, like in October.  But other schools have begun to post schedules, and I see that one of them, University of St. Thomas, has the Van Wie Classic on their schedule (http://www.stthomas.edu/tommies/shared/shownews.cfm?ArticleID=4953).  The Tommies finished 10th in the final poll (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/) last year with a record of 24-4, but lose the All-American duo (http://www.d3hoops.com/tow/07/menallam07.htm) of Issac Rosefelt and Bryan Schnettler.  Always a good program, however, UST should provide an early-season test should the Scots and Tommies meet up.  UST has come to one Wooster tourney or the other several times in the recent past, so I gather there is a good relationship there.  I wonder if the Scots will ever go to St. Paul to return the favor?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tyrone on May 24, 2007, 11:12:15 AM
That will be a great game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on May 28, 2007, 12:45:09 PM
I just stumbled onto this blog (http://recruitingincali.blogspot.com/2007_02_01_archive.html) by Oberlin's head coach, Isaiah Cavaco, in which he talks about his recent trip home to California and some recruiting he did in the Bay Area and the Southland.  It's a good, and sometimes funny, read.  It hasn't been updated since he completed his trip in March, so I guess it's dormant now, which is a shame, especially since his incredibly awful fast-food diet is going to kill him, and soon (Del Taco?!?  Jack in the Box?  Yuk.)   :D

I especially liked this quote:
Quote from: Isaiah CavacoI started talking to the guy next to me in line only to find out he was a Hiram graduate. I didn't hold it against him, but if there had been a rush getting into the gym, I can't promise I wouldn't have had my elbows up.

Give his blog (http://recruitingincali.blogspot.com/2007_02_01_archive.html) a look.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on May 28, 2007, 01:33:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on May 28, 2007, 12:45:09 PM
I just stumbled onto this blog (http://recruitingincali.blogspot.com/2007_02_01_archive.html) by Oberlin's head coach, Isaiah Cavaco, in which he talks about his recent trip home to California and some recruiting he did in the Bay Area and the Southland.  It's a good, and sometimes funny, read.  It hasn't been updated since he completed his trip in March, so I guess it's dormant now, which is a shame, especially since his incredibly awful fast-food diet is going to kill him, and soon (Del Taco?!?  Jack in the Box?  Yuk.)   :D

I especially liked this quote:
Quote from: Isaiah CavacoI started talking to the guy next to me in line only to find out he was a Hiram graduate. I didn't hold it against him, but if there had been a rush getting into the gym, I can't promise I wouldn't have had my elbows up.

Give his blog (http://recruitingincali.blogspot.com/2007_02_01_archive.html) a look.
Interesting blog...

He sounds like a guy who is estranged from his favorite cuisine.  :D

A stranger in a strange land??

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: diehardfan on May 28, 2007, 02:19:21 PM
QuoteI'll be in a car for about 14-15 hours, watching basketball for about six hours and spending about $170 from car rental and gas to food and admission to the games.
Haha... that ratio of driving to actual game time sounds familiar.... though I have to usually add in the cost of a hotel and plane flight now too. :-X

QuoteI hopped into the Suzuki at about noon to get to a workout in Oakland. Unfortunately, I was worried about being late, so my only food stop was at a gas station where I got a fountain soda (it's nice to say soda and not have everyone respond, 'you mean pop?') and a protein bar
Eek.... so unhealthy!! :o :D Basketball player lurkers, don't try this at home. ;)

QuoteI got to drive along the coast for a while and go over a bridge (not the Golden Gate Bridge, but still very cool) that overlooked a whole bunch of lights. I was about to point my camera out the window to take pictures, but I figured that snapping photos while doing 50 MPH on a bridge was far from safe.
Come on! I totally have pictures taken on both the Golden Gate Bridge (looking up through the sunroof), and of the St. Louis Arch (still totally my fav city monument not in DC) while on a bridge going at least that fast. You only live once! And I mean, a great picture subject, shot at a perfect and unique angle, is totally worth more than one's life anyway. Just ask any photographer. ;D 8)

Thanks David, that was fun, what a unique look at the DIII world! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on May 31, 2007, 11:46:16 AM
Great find on the blog.

Go Yeo, or go home.

Not entirely sure what that means, but I definitely like it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on June 07, 2007, 10:26:48 AM
Wittenberg's schedule has been released:

http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule07-08.html

Tigers play in the Wheaton Lee Pfund Classic on Nov. 16-17

In the Zimmerman Classic, Witt will play Olivet. With LaCrosse and Marian(In) competing in the first game.

Also Witt and COW do not meet until Jan. 19 and then again less than a month later on Feb. 16.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on June 07, 2007, 12:23:11 PM
Witt also has their OWU matchups adjacent to the COW games: Jan. 19 vs. Woo, then Jan. 23 at OWU; and Feb. 13 vs. OWU followed by Feb. 16 at Wooster.  Those two weeks could define the Tigers' season.

A couple of other interesting things about this schedule:
* As anticipated, the "who-we-play-once" part of the schedule has been adjusted.  This coming season, Witt plays Oberlin and Denison just once (at Granville Jan. 2 then home vs. Oberlin Jan. 5), and now plays Kenyon twice.  The past few seasons, Witt's one-timers were Oberlin and Kenyon.  This could be good news for the Tigers, since Denison has given them fits in the recent past.  However, Denison's season outlook isn't all that bright with Hodgkinson and Izzo gone, while Kenyon is clearly a program on the rise. 
* The other once-only matchups last year, which could change, were Wooster vs. Oberlin and Denison and OWU vs. Kenyon and Denison.  Assuming everyone gets one change, then Wooster will add a game with Oberlin, playing Denison and Kenyon once, while OWU plays Oberlin and Kenyon once and Denison twice.  That's just a guess, though.  (The alternative would be for OWU's schedule to remain the same--once each with KC and DU--and Wooster to gain a game with Denison at the expense of a second Kenyon game.)  Obviously the Hiram/Gheny vs. Wabash/Earlham single pairings won't change, being determined logistically rather than competitively.
* Witt has just one conference game (vs. Hiram) in December; the same is true for Allegheny (vs. Denison). 

Thanks for posting the schedule link, W4E.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on June 07, 2007, 01:05:23 PM
Allegheny has also posted their schedule:
http://www.allegheny.edu/athletics/menbb/results.php

Their non-conference highlights include opening against Bethany in the Mt. Aloysius tournament and later hosting Westminster.  Like Witt, they also face Wooster and OWU in back-to-back games both times (Jan. 26/30 and Feb. 20/23).  'Gheny and Hiram will make the biannual trek to Indiana in early January.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on June 08, 2007, 12:13:15 PM
Just in case there's any lingering doubt on where the North Coast Athletic Conference stands on the politics of Division 3, here's a link to a short article (PDF format) in the Chronicle of Higher Education (http://chronicle.com/) by Earlham College president Doug Bennett, who also serves as the chairman of the NCAC's President's Council.

Division III: Too Big for Its Own Good (http://www.northcoast.org/news/bennettchronicle6-8-07.pdf)

This article can be accessed through the Chronicle's website (subscription required), and also through the sites of Earlham College (http://www.earlham.edu/) and the NCAC (http://www.northcoast.org/) without cost.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wydown Blvd. on June 08, 2007, 08:04:39 PM
thats a powerful article...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on June 08, 2007, 08:54:12 PM
Quote from: Wydown Blvd. on June 08, 2007, 08:04:39 PM
thats a powerful article...
More discussion is on the Future of Division III board...

http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=3880.msg721729#new
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 09, 2007, 11:22:18 AM
Update on Wooster's 6'5" Jake Johnson:  He is transferring to Bridgewater College (VA). :(

Sorry to see Johnson go because he demonstrated a good shooting touch in the limited minutes that he logged as a freshman for the Scots.  Johnson could have helped to backfill some of Tom Port's minutes and points next season but it is understandable that he probably wanted to be closer to family and friends in Virginia.  Good luck to Jake Johnson at Bridgewater!

Here is the link to the story:
http://www.rocktownweekly.com/sports_details.php?AID=10287&CHID=3
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on June 11, 2007, 06:24:36 PM
Does anyone have info regarding any of the incoming recruiting classes from the NCAC?  It seems as though most of the classes should be pretty set by now.

WSF, thanks for the info regarding Johnson.  I too am disappointed to see him leave as he demonstrated the potential of becoming a nice shooter from the perimeter and as you said, possibly softening some of the blow felt by Port's graduation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on June 12, 2007, 03:43:17 PM
Ray Mears, the legendary coach  at Wittenberg and Tennessee, passed away yesterday in Knoxville.


http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/hp/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2007/06/11/sns061207spmearssider.html

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/hp/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2007/06/11/sns061207spmears.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on June 15, 2007, 11:17:46 PM
Sac has noted on another board (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=5245.56) that Albion's schedule is up.  They are participating in Otterbein's holiday tournament, a fete which also includes Hanover and Ohio Wesleyan.  Nice pre-conference pulse check for the Bishops, although I must say that it's not much of a snowbird trip to head south from Delaware to Westerville.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on June 18, 2007, 07:00:21 PM
More schedule bits and pieces...can you tell I'm ready for the season to begin?  :D

The NCAC/OAC Challenge again involves Kenyon and Denison from the NCAC and Muskingum and Capital of the OAC.  Last year this quartet played in Granville and New Concord; this year the venues are Columbus (Sat. Nov. 24) and Gambier (Sun. Nov. 25).  I'd guess that we'll get new teams involved next season.

Capital plays at Wittenberg immediately before the Challenge (Nov. 20), and then heads to Branch Rickey Arena to take on OWU in their first post-Challenge game (Dec. 1), giving the OAC champs a mini 4-game NCAC schedule (three of them at the NCAC venue) before embarking on league play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 18, 2007, 10:13:04 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on June 11, 2007, 06:24:36 PM
Does anyone have info regarding any of the incoming recruiting classes from the NCAC?  It seems as though most of the classes should be pretty set by now.

With the disclaimer that I found this information on other chat boards, two of Wooster's incoming frosh recruits appear to be Bryan Wickliffe and Kevin Truitt:

Bryan Wickliffe is a 6'5" forward out of Columbus St. Charles.  He averaged ~22 ppg, 8 rpg and apparently received at least one D2 recruiting offer from a West Virginia school.  Wickliffe made this year's All-Ohio Team in Division I as an Honorable Mention choice.  He also appeared on HoopScoop's Class of 2007 Top 100 players in Ohio list.

Kevin Truitt is a 6'0" point guard out of Marysville High School that was recruited by several NAIA schools.  He is Marysville's all time assist leader.  Kevin is also a superb golfer (79 average) and was selected as a Columbus Dispatch scholar athlete this year (excellent grades).  Reminds me of Van Horn. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on June 19, 2007, 09:31:43 AM
Thanks for the info wsf. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on June 19, 2007, 09:58:16 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on June 18, 2007, 10:13:04 PM
Bryan Wickliffe is a 6'5" forward out of Columbus St. Charles.  He averaged ~22 ppg, 8 rpg and apparently received at least one D2 recruiting offer from a West Virginia school.  Wickliffe made this year's All-Ohio Team in Division I as an Honorable Mention choice.  He also appeared on HoopScoop's Class of 2007 Top 100 players in Ohio list.

I hear that the coaching staff is very high on Wickliffe.  If he's all that they think he is expected to fill Port's position.

I've also heard that they have a big man that they are hoping can start in Vandervaart's spot, but I don't remember any details.  I had some other recruiting news at one point, but didn't get it posted.  I'll see if I can find it when I get home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on June 19, 2007, 10:10:47 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on June 19, 2007, 09:58:16 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on June 18, 2007, 10:13:04 PM
Bryan Wickliffe is a 6'5" forward out of Columbus St. Charles.  He averaged ~22 ppg, 8 rpg and apparently received at least one D2 recruiting offer from a West Virginia school.  Wickliffe made this year's All-Ohio Team in Division I as an Honorable Mention choice.  He also appeared on HoopScoop's Class of 2007 Top 100 players in Ohio list.

I hear that the coaching staff is very high on Wickliffe.  If he's all that they think he is expected to fill Port's position.

I've also heard that they have a big man that they are hoping can start in Vandervaart's spot, but I don't remember any details.  I had some other recruiting news at one point, but didn't get it posted.  I'll see if I can find it when I get home.

Evan Will finished the year as the starter in the 5 spot. I doubt a freshman will take his spot unless you meant first sub off the bench.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on June 20, 2007, 09:13:37 AM
I think Will is safe at the 5.  Port was a forward so there would be a spot open for Wickliffe to crack the starting rotation as a frosh. 

It'll be interesting to see who cracks the starting lineup for the Scots next year.  Obvious choices are Cooper and Johnson at the guard positions and Will as I said at either the 4 or 5.  From there, it could go many ways.  I would think Bidwell could be the one to replace Van Horn in the starting 5.  And as for the last spot, do the coaches go big with Melick or Elam or does Wickliffe impress enough to gain a starting spot as a freshman?

I read a bit on Truitt and it sounds like he will contend for PT as the backup to Johnson at the point.  He is Marysville's all-time assists leader and it sounds as if he can play defense as well.  The problem is, Wooster is already loaded at the guard spot with Fulk arguably one of the best guards not to start in the NCAC.  Dustin Geitgey also saw significant PT as a freshman last season and I would look for him to be an improved player his sophomore season.  Depending on how many other solid recruits that Coach Moore and co. have reeled in, Wooster could have a very good JV squad this season. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on June 21, 2007, 10:53:49 AM
It will be very interesting this fall to see which of this past season's freshmen return and whether or not their games have improved.  Watching them play last season was like riding a roller coaster.  I still don't really know what I saw, whether it was a very good class or a poor one, at least by Wooster standards.  The first couple of weeks of the upcoming season will shed lots more light on this.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on June 22, 2007, 09:43:31 AM
There is an article in the local Wooster paper touching on changes in the NCAA Selection criteria, Wooster's schedule this year, and recruiting class (which is missing a couple of names, I believe). Either way, I don't see Vandervaart's replacement on this list:

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/2165131
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on June 22, 2007, 01:03:55 PM
RE:  the recruiting class at Wooster, it looks like Wooster loaded up on forwards this season with 2 of the 5 recruits listed as 6'5" forwards.  Reed played forward at Northwestern, and I believe he is 6'3"-6'4" or something around there.  Interesting that Reed is going to try to play both football and basketball for the Scots.  From the DR article, it noted that he was going to try out at QB for Wooster, a position that seems to be stacked for the Scots as there's supposedly going to be 6 qb's in camp for the Scots competing to fill the departed Schafer's shoes. 

Overall, the Scot's recuiting class doesn't appear to be very big, heighth  wise or depth wise.  Kind of surprising given the tournament success that Wooster had last season.  Also, judging by the smaller recruits, it looks as if the up-tempo, smaller lineup is here to stay and that Wooster is recruiting more players to fit their system.  It appears that the days of the quality big-men being the focal point of the offense at Wooster are over at least for the immediate future.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 22, 2007, 01:43:13 PM
Seinfeld - thanks for the link to the Daily Record article.  :)

As ScotsFan noted, Kaleb Reed out of Northwestern was listed at 6'4" this year on football and basketball lists.  Kaleb Reed was selected All Ohio Division III Special Mention in basketball this season and he was honored at Northwestern HS as a scholar athlete with a GPA above 3.5.  Reed and Dustin Geitgey played together for Northwestern 2 seasons ago.

Judging from the article, the Scots will play another tough non-conference schedule this coming season and it is good to see opponents like Otterbein, St. Thomas, Walsh and Cedarville listed on the schedule.  It will be interesting to see which teams fill out the Mose Hole classic when the full schedule is released.

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Nonbiased Observer on June 22, 2007, 05:35:59 PM
Remember, Wooster has a 6-8 sophomore on campus and a 6-6 sophomore who looks quite stout in the post. If Steve Moore really wants to dump it in constantly, which I wouldn't think with James Cooper in the backcourt, he'd have a shot with those two and Evan Will.

Kaleb Reed, from what I've seen, looks farther along as a basketball prospect than football. But, with six quarterbacks on the roster, but none of them past their sophomore years, he might have a better chance of an immediate impact in football. When all's said, he's proobably a small forward/power forward hybrid. Like Tom Port without the consistent jumper and the bulk.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on June 26, 2007, 10:11:18 AM
I believe the two other Wooster recruits that didn't show up in the article are:

Ian Franks - Greenwich South Central
Eric McCloskey - Cardinal Stritch

Five to seven recruits a year is probably just the right number. If you get one or two impact players per recruiting class, then you are in great shape. Wooster had a huge class last year, so they didn't need a lot of players. Plus, when you have a lot of players and only one ball, some guys can feel left out. I don't know the details of why certain guys from last year's freshman class aren't coming back, but a few of them aren't, and I bet at least part of it had to do with playing time.

In football, I think freshmen expect to maybe only see some time on special teams their first year. In basketball, I think there is a little more of an expectation of seeing time earlier, or at least by their sophomore season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 26, 2007, 02:32:35 PM
Seinfeld - thanks for the names of the two additional Wooster recruits.  :)  k+

Both of these guys were guards for Division IV teams in northwest Ohio this past season.

Eric McCloskey scored over 1,000 points in his high school career for Oregon Cardinal Stritch.  The 6'1" guard averaged 16.4 ppg this season and was selected All Northwest Ohio Division IV - Second Team.

Ian Franks was the leading scorer for Greenwich South Central this season averaging ~20 ppg.  Franks actually had a triple double in one game this season.  He was selected All Northwest Ohio Division IV - Honorable Mention.  He was a First Team selection in District 6.

With Cooper, Johnson, Fulk and others returning for Wooster, my guess is that these two recruits will not see much varsity playing time this coming season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Nonbiased Observer on June 27, 2007, 05:35:17 PM
I saw Franks as a junior. He was a stand-still shooter. Terrific shooter if you let him line up and let it fly, but his accuracy decreased immensly off the bounce.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 02, 2007, 12:02:22 AM
Kenyon's 2007-08 schedule (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x23821.xml) is posted.  They open the season in a classic-format tournament at Brandeis, facing the host Judges (20-7 last season) as well as the Tufts Jumbos (15-10).  They return home to participate in the NCAC/OAC challenge, and also have non-conference games with Case Western Reserve (5-20), DePauw (22-6), and Washington & Jefferson (14-14) as well as neighbor Mt. Vernon Nazarene (NAIA, 25-7) and Ohio Christian U. (NCCAA, 12-20). 

After an early December date with Wabash, the Lords open 2008 NCAC play at Wooster (Jan. 5) and hosting OWU (Jan. 9), their only matchups with these conference powers.  I think Kenyon has the nucleus of a good team, and after what appears to be a challenging first half, they could get on a roll in the second half of the season, with their only major obstacles being two games with Witt and one with Wabash in the final 13 games.  I wouldn't be surprised to see Kenyon in the conference semifinals this season, and possibly with a top 4 seeding. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 02, 2007, 12:15:24 AM
Looking at Kenyon's and Witt's published schedules, it appears to me that the non-Hiram Ohio portion of the "who-we-play-just-once" NCAC schedule looks like this:

Denison: vs. Wittenberg, at OWU (and 2x against Wooster)
Kenyon: vs. OWU, at Wooster (and 2x against Witt)
Oberlin: vs. Wooster, at Wittenberg (and 2x against OWU)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
OWU: vs. Denison, at Kenyon (and 2x against Oberlin)
Wittenberg: vs. Oberlin, at Denison (and 2x against Kenyon)
Wooster: vs. Kenyon, at Oberlin (and 2x against Denison)

That represents no change for OWU or Oberlin from years past, while Wooster and Witt trade second games with Kenyon and Denison. 

Perhaps Nonbiased Observer, who seems to have a grip on Wooster's as yet unpublished schedule, can confirm or refute this.  Any lurkers with connections to any of these programs (i.e. Wooster, OWU, Denison, Oberlin) and might be able to pass along schedules to me offline (dacollinge [at] yahoo [dot] com) would also be welcome.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on July 03, 2007, 12:29:21 PM
Kenyon is definitely heading the right direction, and only one game vs. Wooster can and will help them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Nonbiased Observer on July 07, 2007, 07:46:59 PM
Wooster plays Denison twice and Oberlin and Kenyon once. That is correct.

They also play Ohio Wesleyan instead of Witt in December
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: yumbo on July 16, 2007, 01:39:26 PM
Hi All -

I'm a 1985 Oberlin grad, lurking mainly to pick up info on my alma mater's struggles on the gridiron.  We're actually not doing all that badly, considering our lack of any real winning tradition. 

Anyway, a 6'10" Filipino kid has committed to play hoops for Oberlin next year:

http://www.abs-cbnnews.com/storypage.aspx?StoryId=84520 (http://www.abs-cbnnews.com/storypage.aspx?StoryId=84520)

His name is Gian Chiu and he has some workout vids on Youtube.

Perhaps this is the year.  Maybe not.

Sincerely,

Yumbo
Milwaukee, WI
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on July 19, 2007, 02:03:52 PM
Just wondering why schools sit on their new scheds when they are already completed??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 19, 2007, 03:17:46 PM
If there's one you think should be published, let the school know. Some don't understand that there is demand for this information.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on July 20, 2007, 12:24:07 PM
Thanks Pat, I followed your advice.

It looks like Asst Coach Mully at Wabash is now Head Coach Mulligan at the University of New England per UNE website. Good Luck to Coach Mulligan!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on July 20, 2007, 04:48:09 PM
Go get 'em Jason!

Wabash fans - Ben Burkett from Southmont is playing at Wabash. He's a bit undersized, but he's HARD working and tough and strong. Last year Southmont was horrid (mainly because the new coach was...well...over his head and they were young) but Burkett is a good kid.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on July 20, 2007, 05:53:15 PM
The NCAC has recently lost its best dressed Asst. Coach...

Artie Taylor has taken the Head Coaching position at Ohio Dominican. Sad to lose the best dressed coach in the history of the NCAC!!!

Good luck to Coach Taylor, we'll sure miss him at Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on July 20, 2007, 07:59:49 PM
Congrats to Artie indeed.  Working the JV games for 4 years, I was able to see that he would make a great head coach somewhere, and now he gets his chance.  We'll miss him at Witt, but a great opportunity for Artie!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 20, 2007, 08:55:02 PM
The key question is, what are Ohio Dominican's team colors?  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 20, 2007, 09:21:54 PM
Here's an update from Ohio (or rather, an update of Ohio from North Dakota).  Schedules are not complete as regards tournament pairings unless otherwise noted:

OAC:
Baldwin-Wallace:  men (http://www.bw.edu/athletics/mbb/sched/); women  (http://www.bw.edu/athletics/wbb/sched/)
Capital:  men (http://www.capital.edu/internet/default.aspx?pid=13225); women (http://www.capital.edu/internet/default.aspx?pid=13230)
Heidelberg (not posted)
John Carroll (not posted)
Marietta:  men (http://pioneers.marietta.edu/mbasketball/schedule.html); women (http://pioneers.marietta.edu/wbasketball/schedule.html)
Mount Union:  men (http://www.muc.edu/athletics/men_s_teams/basketball/2007_08_schedule); women (http://www.muc.edu/athletics/women_s_teams/basketball/2007_08_women_s_basketball_schedule)
Muskingum (not posted)
Ohio Northern (not posted)
Otterbein (not posted)
Wilmington:  men (http://www2.wilmington.edu/mens-basketball/calendar.cfm?month=07&curr_year=2007); women (http://www2.wilmington.edu/womens-basketball/calendar.cfm?month=07&curr_year=2007)

NCAC:
Allegheny:  men  (http://www.allegheny.edu/athletics/menbb/results.php)(complete); women (http://www.allegheny.edu/athletics/womenbb/results.php)
Denison (not posted)
Earlham (not posted)
Hiram (not posted)
Kenyon:  men  (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x23821.xml)(complete); women (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x23822.xml)
Oberlin (not posted)
Ohio Wesleyan (not posted)
Wabash (not posted)
Wittenberg:  men  (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule07-08.html)(complete); women (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/wbasketball/schedule07-08.html)
Wooster:  men (not posted); women  (http://athletics.wooster.edu/wb/schedule.php)(complete)

HCAC:
Anderson: (I couldn't get to their %#*@^ website) :-[
Bluffton:  men (http://www.bluffton.edu/sports/mensbasketball/2008/schedule.html); women (http://www.bluffton.edu/sports/womensbasketball/2008/schedule.html)
Defiance:  men (not posted); women (http://www.defiance.edu/athletics/womens_basketball_schedule_0708.html)
Franklin:  men (http://www.franklincollege.edu/athweb/ath_calendar.cfm?sid=2); women (http://www.franklincollege.edu/athweb/ath_calendar.cfm?sid=9)
Hanover:  men (http://sports.hanover.edu/hcmbbresults.htm); women (http://sports.hanover.edu/hcwbbresults.htm)
Manchester (not posted)
Mt. St. Joseph:  men (http://www.msj.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/sched0708/index.asp); women (http://www.msj.edu/athletics/womens/basketball/sched0708/index.asp)
Rose-Hulman:  men  (http://www.rose-hulman.edu/sports/mbasket/0708mbb.htm)(complete); women  (http://www.rose-hulman.edu/sports/wbasket/0708wbb.htm)(complete)
Transylvania:  men  (http://www.transy.edu/sec_page.asp-content-athletics/m_basketball/07schedule.htm-folder-men-sub-m_basketball-topic-m_basketball)(complete); women  (http://www.transy.edu/sec_page.asp-content-athletics/w_basketball/07schedule.htm-folder-women-sub-w_basketball-topic-w_basketball)(complete)

Other Ohio schools:
Case Western Reserve:  men (http://www.case.edu/athletics/varsity/winter/mbasketball/schedule.htm); women (http://www.case.edu/athletics/varsity/winter/wbasketball/schedule.htm)
Lake Erie (not posted)

Yes, I know these are not all Ohio schools, but they are the three conferences with at least 3 Ohio schools.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on July 20, 2007, 11:08:16 PM
The NCAC is the cradle of coaches this year???

Looks like ODU is black and gold. Drat. I was hoping for some teal, or chartruse, or purple!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 21, 2007, 01:52:10 AM
Cradle of coaches, indeed; it occurs to me that nobody has yet mentioned in here that Marietta's new (Apr. 18) head coach is Jon VanderWal, an assistant to Mike DeWitt at Ohio Wesleyan the past four seasons.  Story in the Notables section of this site (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables.php?page=5) (scroll down a bit).  VanderWal played at Albion, graduating in 2001, and coached for two seasons at Defiance before departing for Delaware and, now, Marietta.  I guess he's just a snowbird, albeit a very slow-moving one.  Maybe he'll turn up at Emory in about a dozen years, with stops at Bethany, Maryville (TN), and Sewanee.  ;D

Also, Schreiner's new head coach, Drew Miller, is a Kenyon grad.  Notables (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables.php?page=4), scroll to bottom.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 21, 2007, 09:58:19 AM
Here's permalinks for those two:

Schreiner http://www.d3hoops.com/notables.php?item=1028
Marietta http://www.d3hoops.com/notables.php?item=1018
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on July 21, 2007, 11:31:22 AM
VanderWal was also a fine pinch hitter back in the day with the Expos, Rockies and Padres. Oh, wrong one!  ;D

/still in baseball mode
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on July 21, 2007, 01:51:15 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on July 21, 2007, 01:52:10 AM
Cradle of coaches, indeed; it occurs to me that nobody has yet mentioned in here that Marietta's new (Apr. 18) head coach is Jon VanderWal, an assistant to Mike DeWitt at Ohio Wesleyan the past four seasons.  Story in the Notables section of this site (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables.php?page=5) (scroll down a bit).  VanderWal played at Albion, graduating in 2001, and coached for two seasons at Defiance before departing for Delaware and, now, Marietta.  I guess he's just a snowbird, albeit a very slow-moving one.  Maybe he'll turn up at Emory in about a dozen years, with stops at Bethany, Maryville (TN), and Sewanee.  ;D

Funny observation DC, you can add to that.......Jon is from Cadillac, MI which is a little more than halfway up the lower peninsula, then to Albion which could be considered Southern Michigan........and so on.  :)

Quote from: smedindy on July 21, 2007, 11:31:22 AM
VanderWal was also a fine pinch hitter back in the day with the Expos, Rockies and Padres. Oh, wrong one!  ;D

At the time Marietta's Vander Wal played, Hope had its own VanderWall (Kyle), spelled with a second 'L'.  They'd occasionally end up defending each other. 

The baseball Vander Wal was born in Grand Rapids, MI and attended Western Michigan.  He'd be a regular feature on the late night sportscast if he got a hit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 21, 2007, 07:22:53 PM
I have a lot of respect for assistant coaches, and I'm glad to see these three doing well in their careers.  Some of the best guys in our conference are assistant coaches.

I can't help but notice that the three top contenders to Wooster's title are the teams that just lost their top assistants.  I know that if Wooster lost Doug Cline, it would definitely have an effect on their success, and he'd be very hard to replace (even considering that Wooster has about a half-dozen assistants.)  That makes me wonder how much losing VanderWal, Mulligan, and Taylor will hurt OWU, Wabash, and Wittenberg (respectively) this season.  Since we have no OWU regulars, what do you folks think about Wabash and Witt?  Also, who will become the top assistants at these schools this year?

As for OWU, this loss may hurt significantly, as I believe VanderWal was DeWitt's only assistant (at least, only full-time assistant.)  I just took a quick look at their website, and there are no other men's basketball coaches listed besides Mike.  Plus, losing VW in April must have had an effect on their recruiting.  I wish someone close to the Bishops program would log in and give us an update on this.

Quote from: smedindy on July 20, 2007, 11:08:16 PM
Looks like ODU is black and gold. Drat. I was hoping for some teal, or chartruse, or purple!

Black and gold?  Something tells me that Artie's wardrobe is not long on those colors!  Some Big and Tall Men's store in Columbus is about to have a great sales day.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 25, 2007, 08:22:59 PM
*crickets chirping*

I guess I should know better than to ask a basketball question to Witt and Wabash fans in July.  Methinks their minds are elsewhere... :)

Wabash schedule is posted, maybe thanks to the gentle nudge provided by roadtrip.  Here's a link: LINK (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball/schedule)

LGs get to spend New Years' Eve in San Antonio, taking on Trinity and Southwestern (the schedule doesn't reveal the matchups, but this is probably a classic format tournament; no reason for SCAC rivals Trinity and SW to meet in a holiday tournament.  Which means that the LGs avoid Ohio Northern on that trip.)  Wabash faces Wooster and Ohio Wesleyan back-to-back twice, including two road tilts on Feb. 6 and 9.  In fact, they have a very tough stretch at the beginning of February, starting with Wittenberg at Chadwick on Jan. 30, followed by Kenyon's visit to C-ville and the trips to OWU and Wooster.  That looks to me like the two week "make or break" stretch for the Giants' season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on July 25, 2007, 11:34:07 PM
No Pete Thorn??? Hmmm....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 26, 2007, 12:59:04 AM
Seeing who they've invited to the tipoff tournament, perhaps it's a good thing they have only one tournament. Two NAIA's and a Canadian school?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on July 26, 2007, 01:17:17 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on July 25, 2007, 08:22:59 PMLGs get to spend New Years' Eve in San Antonio, taking on Trinity and Southwestern (the schedule doesn't reveal the matchups, but this is probably a classic format tournament; no reason for SCAC rivals Trinity and SW to meet in a holiday tournament.  Which means that the LGs avoid Ohio Northern on that trip.)

There's no "probably" about it, DC. Trinity (TX) and Southwestern annually participate in this holiday tournament that the Tigers host down in San Antone, and it's always set up in the classic format. Last season the two visitors were Pitt-Greensburg and Swarthmore; in 2005-06 it was Manchester and Dominican; in 2004-05 it was Ohio Wesleyan and Illinois Wesleyan; and in 2003-04 it was Augustana and Wheaton. In 2002-03 the tourney was held over Thanksgiving weekend, and the visitors were Chicago and Washington (MO).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on July 26, 2007, 01:12:22 PM
DC
I think you'll be able to tell if Wabash will be a contender this year by the end of the Trinity tourney. If they can come thru the "pre-season" with good guard ball handling I believe it would bode well for the NCAC season. IMO the front line will be big and deep as alot of guys got their feet wet last year and will be expected to improve. A lot of 6'5/6"6 225/
230 guys if the freshmen hit the weight room over the summer. If Wabash guards can show they can handle the rock, run the offense with limited turnovers and be leaders I think they could make the W's pay them some mind. Wabash has some serious streak shooters at the guard spots so I would think they would be OK on the scoring side but you still need the driver to break down the D for the easy buckets against the good teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on July 26, 2007, 06:08:12 PM
Quote from: roadtrip on July 26, 2007, 01:12:22 PM
DC
I think you'll be able to tell if Wabash will be a contender this year by the end of the Trinity tourney. If they can come thru the "pre-season" with good guard ball handling I believe it would bode well for the NCAC season.

"Non-conference", not "pre-season". Non-conference games count towards a team's record.

First time I've trotted out my hobby horse in 2007-08! :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on July 27, 2007, 09:40:16 AM
Wittenberg's Recruits:

http://zeke.phpnet.us/wittbb.html

Also, it looks like Mark Caraway is not returning.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on July 27, 2007, 02:06:40 PM
The "pre-season" was an attempt at humor...winning the NCAC, beating the W's and getting the auto bid is the goal....and being from the Chgo area I wouldn't mind seeing Wabash come up north for a few games/tourneys
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on July 27, 2007, 07:07:18 PM
Any recruiting class with a player from Bellefontaine gets an A in my book. 

Mostly because of the pronunciation. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 30, 2007, 09:28:01 PM
With thanks to the UAA/SLIAC poster "Wydown Blvd.", here's a link to a New York Times slideshow (http://www.nytimes.com/slideshow/2007/07/26/education/edlife/20070729_SCHOOLSPIRIT_slideshow_1.html) of clever college T-shirts.  All but one of them are D3 schools, and two of them are from our own witty conference.

So I take it that nobody wants to talk about assistant coaches? :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on July 30, 2007, 09:30:59 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on July 25, 2007, 08:22:59 PMLGs get to spend New Years' Eve in San Antonio, taking on Trinity and Southwestern

Wow. I came in here to wish DC condolences on the passing of his favorite filmmaker and figured out that come New Year's week I will get to see my first Wabash basketball game in person since the spring of 1999. I'm stoked about this. Of course, as DC pointed out, my mind was on the gridiron.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 31, 2007, 09:46:22 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on July 30, 2007, 09:30:59 PMI came in here to wish DC condolences on the passing of his favorite filmmaker [...]

Second favorite, behind Ozu, but thanks.  Bergman was 89, and while he was still very active, it's fair to say that he was at or near the end of his creative years at death.  Would that the same could be said for all great artists (for example, Jerry Hadley, who I've commemorated since his tragic and untimely passing two weeks ago). 

Still it is a great loss in a summer of great losses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on July 31, 2007, 09:53:18 AM
Oooh...ONU is headed down for that tournament also.  Wabash might even get a regional game out of the deal!

That's pretty sweet that the LGs are headed down to your backyard.  Make sure they hit Chris Madrid's before they leave.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on July 31, 2007, 12:53:26 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on July 31, 2007, 09:53:18 AM
Oooh...ONU is headed down for that tournament also.  Wabash might even get a regional game out of the deal!

Wally - for your info, that tournament has prescheduled matchups so Wabash and ONU will not meet.

December 29th:  Trinity vs. Wabash...and...Southwestern vs. Ohio Northern

December 30th:  Trinity vs Ohio Northern...and...Southwestern vs. Wabash

In fact, they use this format every year so perhaps it should be renamed the "North vs South Classic" ;D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 01, 2007, 01:55:42 AM
Next year, the LGs need to schedule a Minnesota swing for me - how about playing Augsburg and Hamline???

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 01, 2007, 03:51:59 PM
Wooster has posted their 2007-2008 schedule on their website. :)  Highlights are:

Opening Al Van Wie Tourney includes Farmingdale State (NY), Otterbein & St. Thomas (MN)

Next 4 games are on the Road versus Lake Erie, Cedarville, Oberlin and Ohio Wesleyan

In 7th game of the season, Walsh University visits Timken on December 15th

Next, Wooster plays in the Bahamas Sunshine Shootout on December 18-19 competing
against St. Mary's College (MD) and Benedictine University (IL)

For the Mose Hole Tournament, Scots will host Mt. Union, Notre Dame College (OH) and Wesley College (DE)

Remainder of the schedule is the NCAC matchups in January/February

For the full schedule, here is the link: http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/schedule.php

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on August 01, 2007, 06:20:15 PM
WSF, thanks for the schedule update!

Quote from: wooscotsfan on August 01, 2007, 03:51:59 PM

For the Mose Hole Tournament, Scots will host Mt. Union, Notre Dame College (OH) and Wesley College (DE)

The Mose Hole doesn't appear like it's going to be such the marquee event that it was last season with all 4 teams in the tournament ranked in the d3hoops preseason poll and 3 of the 4 teams ranked at the time of the tournament.

It looks as though the Al Van Wie will be the better tournament this year at least in terms of recognizable teams in Ott and St. Thomas.  Although both lost some pretty good players to graduation so it will be interesting to see how well they did in re-building or re-loading.

I'm also surprised that Wooster isn't making a trip to Georgetown (KY).  I figured that was going to be a home and home series.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on August 01, 2007, 06:21:52 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on July 30, 2007, 09:28:01 PM

So I take it that nobody wants to talk about assistant coaches? :(

While I'm here, I'll bite David.  I was going to post something when you originally brought this up, but I never got around to it.  Anyways, just how valuable is Doug Cline to the Wooster program?  I really can't think of too many assistants who stick around as long as Doug has at Wooster and especially not at the DIII level.  Ususally being an assistant is just a stepping stone to taking a HC gig somewhere as we're seeing with Artie at Witt and VanderWal at OWU. 

I can't imagine that Doug hasn't had offers to leave his staple position as Coach Moore's right hand man.  Do you suppose that he doesn't want to be a HC?  Or is it more of a matter that he can't see himself anywhere but at Wooster and, in all likelihood, he will be the one to be handed the reigns once Moore decides to retire?  Personally, I think it has more to do with the latter than anything.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 02, 2007, 05:24:38 PM
Quote from: smedindy on August 01, 2007, 01:55:42 AM
Next year, the LGs need to schedule a Minnesota swing for me - how about playing Augsburg and Hamline???

Minnesota? ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 02, 2007, 08:37:00 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on August 01, 2007, 06:20:15 PM
I'm also surprised that Wooster isn't making a trip to Georgetown (KY).  I figured that was going to be a home and home series.

No, this was a single-game contract to the best of my knowledge.  I recall being told that Georgetown's coach tried to persuade several of the Wooster players in the postgame handshake line to tell Coach Moore to schedule a return match in Kentucky. 

Wooster's non-conference schedule doesn't look especially tough to me.  The marquee name teams, Otterbein and UST, lose key players, as ScotsFan notes; the same is true for Lake Erie.  Notre Dame of Ohio is a disappointing choice for the Mose Hole, making me wonder if someone pulled out.  NDC was 19-14 last season, finishing 7th in the sixteen-team American Mideast Conference (NAIA-2; Cedarville and Walsh were 4th and 5th, respectively, and Artie Taylor's new team Ohio Dominican was 10th).  The Scots have a maximum of three in-region games in the pre-conference: Lake Erie, as well as Otterbein and Mt. Union, should they meet in the tournaments.  That leads me to expect that Ott and MUC will be the Scots' first-round opponents in the Van Wie and Mose Hole, respectively. 

I must say, the Bahamas trip is a nice perq.

The conference schedule starts out with five road trips in the first six games, including the trips to OWU (Dec. 8,) Wabash (Jan. 12,) and Wittenberg (Jan. 19).  The payback comes at the end of the schedule, with five of the last seven games (including OWU, Wabash and Witt on successive February Saturdays) at home, and the only road games being at likely non-contenders Denison and Earlham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 02, 2007, 08:59:22 PM
Ohio Wesleyan's schedule (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1) is also out, and it looks like they're going for the title of America's Favorite Party Guest.  They start the season at successive UAA-based invitationals:  at the University of Chicago, along with Lake Forest and Trinity (presumably the San Antonio Trinity, as opposed to Hartford or, for that matter, Dublin), and at the University of Rochester, alongside Baldwin-Wallace and Cortland State.  There's some pretty good programs at each of these tournaments, and it should be an excellent way for Mike DeWitt to get an early read on his team.  The Bishops return to Ohio to face Defiance, Capital, Wooster, and Lake Erie (the middle two at home), and then cross town to participate in another tournament with four excellent programs: Otterbein's "O" Club Tournament, also featuring Albion and Hanover.

That's got to be one of the toughest Nov/Dec schedules in D3 hoops.

In the conference, OWU has one tough-looking stretch, facing Wooster, Wabash, and Wittenberg in an 11-day stretch starting Feb. 2, with the Woo and Witt games being road tests.  (They host Hiram between the Wabash and Witt tilts.)  OWU only meets Kenyon once (Jan. 9 in Gambier), which may be beneficial if Kenyon improves as I anticipate they will.

I'm quite sure that Coach DeWitt expects his team to be serious contenders for the NCAC title this year.  I think this is a schedule that should prepare them well for the conference season.  Furthermore, if they survive the rugged pre-conference schedule, they could be in excellent shape for a Pool C bid.

By the way, the OWU website (http://bishops.owu.edu/coaches.html) still does not list an assistant men's basketball coach.  I would guess that the post would be mighty attractive to Travis Schwab, and vice versa as he now has three years as an assistant on his resume (two at Heidelberg, one at Kenyon).  However, the Kenyon website (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x3098.xml) still lists him, and even includes a biographical blurb which begins "Travis Schwab enters his second season as an assistant at Kenyon".  I'd guess that, if he hasn't moved by now (recalling that the OWU position has been open since April), it's too late for this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 02, 2007, 11:54:35 PM
Yep, I'm moving there soon. You need to keep up, DC, and follow the football board too!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 03, 2007, 01:17:05 AM
Quote from: smedindy on August 02, 2007, 11:54:35 PM
Yep, I'm moving there soon. You need to keep up, DC, and follow the football board too!  :D

If visiting the football board is the price of keeping up, I choose to remain blissfully ignorant.   ;D

Nevertheless, good luck with the move, smedminny!  :D

Quote from: ScotsFan on August 01, 2007, 06:21:52 PM
I can't imagine that Doug hasn't had offers to leave his staple position as Coach Moore's right hand man.  Do you suppose that he doesn't want to be a HC?  Or is it more of a matter that he can't see himself anywhere but at Wooster and, in all likelihood, he will be the one to be handed the reigns once Moore decides to retire?  Personally, I think it has more to do with the latter than anything.

I have no inside information, and have never asked Doug either directly or indirectly about this in our few conversations.  So it would be pure speculation on my part.  But yes, I imagine he'd be a strong candidate for a head coaching position, and I'd be shocked, shocked to learn that he hasn't been asked to apply for some over the years.  My guess would be that he's happy with his current situation, and hopes/plans to be the next head coach at Wooster--but that's purely a guess.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Nonbiased Observer on August 03, 2007, 08:06:34 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on August 01, 2007, 06:20:15 PM

I'm also surprised that Wooster isn't making a trip to Georgetown (KY).  I figured that was going to be a home and home series.



Steve Moore said immediately after that game that there'd be no return trip.

Surprised no one's talking about Wooster's Bahamas trip.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on August 04, 2007, 03:11:09 PM
He could become smedapolis....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 04, 2007, 10:31:34 PM
In the words of Samwise Gamgee, "well, I'm back."  I left home on March 16 to attend the Final Four in Salem, and, after 20 weeks and 20,455 driving miles, I got back home yesterday.  It's good to be home.

Shortly after I arrived, I was presented with a copy of the July 31 Daily Record which my family had saved, knowing I would want to see it.  In that edition, our friend Nonbiased Observer has an excellent article reporting on the future of D3, and an accompanying editorial, and both are well worth the time of everyone in here to read.

NCAA examines future of Div. III sports (reportage) (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/2333661)
Trying to reclaim original ideals (column) (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/2333651)

Very nice work, NBO!  :)

Regarding the Bahamas trip, I guess all I'd have to say is I wish I could go.   Great venue, assuredly good weather, and good but not overwhelming competition.  I'm impressed with the schedule-maker.  California in 2006, Bahamas in 2007. let's see...there are D3 holiday tournaments in Hawai'i, so that could be 2008, but after that I'm stumped.  I'm not sure if a Smedminny Swing through Minnesota would be appropriate after these trips. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 05, 2007, 04:07:55 PM
Chicken!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Nonbiased Observer on August 06, 2007, 05:02:01 PM
Thanks David. I put a lot of work into that. You wouldn't believe the file of research I have.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on August 06, 2007, 05:16:59 PM
I can't imagine. Back in June I made another attempt to start this type of story and while I have barely gotten started, I have more material than I know what to do with.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Nonbiased Observer on August 06, 2007, 06:36:20 PM
That was the thing that got me, too. I kept running into more information. I'd sit down to write it and end up spending four hours reading over more stuff. I, personally, killed two trees the city of Wooster will never get back with all the research I did.

That was part of the reason I stuck to the NCAC. If all the information was burying me, what was it going to do to my readers when I presented it all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on August 08, 2007, 09:19:39 AM
Word has it that Witt has named Travis Schwab as new asst. coach replacing recently departed Artie Taylor. The former OWU standout had previously been asst. at Kenyon under Matt Croci, a former Witt standout in his own right!

Congrats to Travis and welcome to the Witt family!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 08, 2007, 10:21:39 AM
Well, color me surprised!  I just get through speculating that Travis Schwab might be interested in the OWU assistant job (which, according to their website, is still open), but deciding that it's too late to move, and he's off to Wittenberg!  Shows what I know, I guess.  ::)  There's no confirmation on the Witt site, but Kenyon's staff directory (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x6044.xml) no longer lists Schwab as a men's basketball coach. 

It appears that Croci has moved swiftly to replace Travis; the new assistant coach appears to be 2006 Kenyon grad and four-year letterman Arlen Galloway, who had been an assistant at Washington College in Maryland.  Galloway is among Kenyon's all-time leaders in the three-point shooting categories, so in that regard he brings a very different perspective to the Lords' bench than big-man Schwab did.

Congratulations to Travis; and to Arlen, congratulations and welcome home!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 08, 2007, 08:07:04 PM
Arlen Galloway could hoist them from way downtown, but he's no Travis Brett.

Oh, you know it's true!!!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on August 09, 2007, 10:43:20 AM
http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/news/2007releases/08_08.html



http://zeke.phpnet.us/wittbb.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 16, 2007, 12:26:40 PM
Hiram's schedule is up. (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/schedule.html)  Their non-conference schedule is not very interesting, featuring CWRU, Heidelberg, Bluffton, Franciscan, Grove City, and Geneva, as well as a trip to Ashland University for their holiday tournament.

Still waiting on Denison, Earlham, and Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 19, 2007, 12:36:12 PM
Kenyon's men's team is presently touring Italy, and at this moment is playing its first of three exhibition games, against a Tuscan team in Montecatini.  They're going to see a good portion of Italy, from Rome to Tuscany to Lake Como.  Some of the players are blogging about their experiences, and these well-written blogs can be accessed from the Kenyon website here (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x25646.xml).  The Lords play their other exhibitions on Tuesday and Wednesday, and return home on Thursday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 19, 2007, 05:54:36 PM
I saw a little tidbit in the "Open Dates" section (here (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4536.msg705771#msg705771)) that suggested that Wittenberg was contemplating the discontinuance of the Zimmerman tournament after this season.  As that was a fairly old item, I wonder if any of you Wittenbergers have an update on this.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 20, 2007, 05:12:31 PM
Kenyon lost their first game in Italy, 95-93 (OT) to the Tuscan Regional team.  Bryan Yelvington led the Lords with 37 points, perhaps an early signal of what may become a huge year for the junior-to-be.  Double-figure contributions were also made by senior (and blogger (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x25652.xml)) Chris Yorlano (16), junior Korey Haddox (15), and sophomore David Knapke (16).  Coach Matt Croci describes the Tuscan team in his blog (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x25653.xml):
Quote from: Matt Croci[T]he Tuscany Regional Team...is comprised of the top players through the smaller towns of the Tuscan region. They all come to Florence to train and compete throughout the year.

Today the team has an off day as they continue their journey to the north and west, visiting Pisa.  Tomorrow they take on the Olimpia Cadorago team in Como.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 20, 2007, 05:45:05 PM
I'd be filling up on food and wine, so I'd probably not be able to function on the court!

Not that it would be any difference!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on August 21, 2007, 09:21:34 AM
A nice job that Jeff Clapacs, Wooster student assistant coach that just graduated in may, landed:


http://www.lsusports.net/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=27826&SPID=2166&ATCLID=1157356&DB_OEM_ID=5200 (http://www.lsusports.net/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=27826&SPID=2166&ATCLID=1157356&DB_OEM_ID=5200)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 22, 2007, 10:25:25 AM
Congratulations to Jeff Clapacs, and Geaux Tigers!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 22, 2007, 10:30:34 AM
Kenyon moves to 1-1 on their Italian swing, defeating Olimpia Cadorago 56-37 behind David Knapke's 22 points and Bryan Yelvington's 10 points and 10 boards.  Their last game is this evening (Italian time) against the "San Massagno Basket Team." 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on August 22, 2007, 12:25:15 PM
For someone who's only just graduated from college, that's a very impressive resume that Jeff Clapacs has put together.  All the best to him down at LSU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 27, 2007, 10:28:25 AM
This just in: Kenyon won their third and final game in Italy, 73-54 over Amici del Campetto outside Milano.  Sporadic internet access has delayed the update to the trip blog site (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x25648.xml).  Bryan Yelvington had his third game in double figures, leading a balanced Lord attack with 21 points.  He was complimented by 14 from Dave Knapke, 13 from Korey Haddox, and 10 from 6'8" junior Jon Lawrence.  Coach Croci describes the ADC team as consisting of players from Milano and Verese and "the best team we played."  The team is safely back in Gambier now, preparing for their next trip: Boston in November, to open the season in a tournament at Brandeis.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on August 28, 2007, 02:07:41 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on August 27, 2007, 10:28:25 AM
This just in: Kenyon won their third and final game in Italy, 73-54 over Amici del Campetto outside Milano.

This line score made me hungry.

[Homer]

Mmmm ... Amici del Campetto.

Mmmm ... milanos.

[drool]

[/Homer]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 28, 2007, 09:11:25 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on August 19, 2007, 05:54:36 PM
I saw a little tidbit in the "Open Dates" section (here (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4536.msg705771#msg705771)) that suggested that Wittenberg was contemplating the discontinuance of the Zimmerman tournament after this season.  As that was a fairly old item, I wonder if any of you Wittenbergers have an update on this.

Well, here's the answer, courtesy of a post by Travis Schwab, if anyone besides me cares:

Quote from: WittTiger1 on August 28, 2007, 04:17:20 PM
Wittenberg University is looking for ONE Division III team to fill our 2008 Charles B. Zimmerman Memorial Classic.  The tournament will take place on December 29 and 30, 2008 on our campus in Springfield, Ohio.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 30, 2007, 12:50:58 PM
Wabash has hired 2000 graduate Antoine Carpenter as their newest assistant basketball coach.  Since graduating from Wabash, Carpenter has gained coaching experience as a grad assistant at Franklin for two years and as an assistant at Brownsburg (IN) High School for the past two seasons.  It's not immediately clear (to me) if he will replace Jason Mulligan as top assistant, or whether that position will go to someone else.

Press Release at D3Hoops.com (http://www.d3hoops.com/pressreleases.php?release=1411) and at Wabash.edu (http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=4903)

Still no word from Ohio Wesleyan about their open assistant coaching position.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 30, 2007, 01:59:19 PM
DC -

He'll be the top assistant. The other assistants are volunteers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 01, 2007, 08:27:56 PM
Lacking anything better to do on a beautiful Saturday afternoon, I drove down to Gambier to watch Kenyon take on Grinnell in football.  Shortly after I arrived, Kenyon sophomore tight end (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x4165.xml)-cum-forward (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x4155.xml) A.J. Clair caught a touchdown pass, and that got me wondering how many other varsity hoopsters around the conference are playing football this fall.  Any help?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on September 01, 2007, 10:52:31 PM
I don't know if any Wabash freshmen are playing two sports this year. Gary Simkus is back from overseas and is starting for the soccer team. No doubt as soon as soccer is over he'll migrate over to hoops again.

BTW - Grinnell's football team gave up 70. I wonder if their football team also plays 'system ball'?  :D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on September 01, 2007, 11:44:11 PM
Quote from: smedindy on September 01, 2007, 10:52:31 PM
BTW - Grinnell's football team gave up 70. I wonder if their football team also plays 'system ball'?  :D ;)

;D ;D +k to you, sir!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on September 03, 2007, 01:12:01 PM
Even though his eligibility for basketball is over, Tim Vandervaart is playing soccer for Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on September 03, 2007, 09:04:27 PM
While he has yet to play on  the hardwood for the Scots, freshman Kaleb Reed is currently a backup QB for the Scots and plans to play hoops this winter as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on September 04, 2007, 09:19:12 AM
Congratulations to Tom Port who will be playing pro basketball for the Thor Basketball Club in Iceland this season.  The Thor Club plays in Iceland's Express League so perhaps Tom Port can throw a few dunks down on the Icelanders. ;D :D :)  Of course, he is pretty good at draining three pointers and cleaning the glass as well!  Good luck to Port!

Here is a link to the full story: http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2006-07/port_iceland.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on September 04, 2007, 09:51:10 AM
I hope he doesn't have to dress up like Pippi Longstockings and sell Icelandic Honey during Icelandic Honey Week.

/obscure...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 04, 2007, 10:35:05 AM
Here's a link to the Daily Record's take (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/2494132) on Port's announcement, including this startling revelation:

Quote from: Elliott Schreiner, The Daily RecordHe'd looked into playing overseas for more than a year now and got the attention of teams by making tapes and exposing himself at camps after the season.

:o

Seriously, though, congratulations to Tom and good luck in Iceland!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on September 04, 2007, 09:14:23 PM
I'm showing my, young, age here and my, bad, taste in movies.

However, I recall this tidbit from that cinematic classic Mighty Ducks 2.

"It's green in Iceland, but icy in Greenland."

The blonde Icelander female asst. coach was attractive, too.

All of this must add up to Tom Port having fun in his endeavors...especially since he's already exposed himself during camp.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on September 04, 2007, 09:47:22 PM
Billy -

Ooof...I thought Quakers had more taste than that - since they're all arty and peaceful and such.

:D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on September 04, 2007, 09:59:15 PM
I'll blame it on the two bookend years of my higher education, which were spent at Big Ten institutions...plus those places had cable television where I'd see such movies.

Meanwhile, Earlham didn't allow cable in the dorms, so I read my Latin books and Norton Anthology of Poetry into the wee hours of the morning.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on September 04, 2007, 10:05:49 PM
smed,

I confess to being very familiar with 'Mighty Ducks 2' (not to mention 1 and 3 - can't recall if there was a 4)!  Of course, I have the classic excuse - kids! ;D

(Though with some shame I also confess that I liked the movie. :-[)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on September 05, 2007, 10:36:29 PM
I nominate Wooster's Bryan Nelson as the DIII Hoops All-Decade First Team center.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 18, 2007, 11:06:02 AM
Denison's schedule (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/2007_08_men_s_basketball_schedul.html) has been posted on their new website.  As the Big Red enter the Post-Dan era (with both Dan Hodgkinson and Dan Izzo gone to graduation), they've taken on a fairly ambitious schedule, one which may delay their return to respectability.  Denison has the full compliment of nine non-conference games on their slate, but an astonishing 8 of them are on the road (4 away, 4 neutral.) 

The Big Red start the season in St. Louis at Webster University, where they will play HCAC powers Hanover and Transylvania in the Sodexho Classic.  Returning to Ohio, they'll travel to Painesville to play Lake Erie (it seems like LEC is playing a lot of NCAC schools in this, their final year of D3 ball) and then join Kenyon, Capital, and Muskingum in the annual NCAC/OAC Challenge.  Their first and only non-conference home game will be against Washington & Jefferson in late November.  The Big Red end the year in New York at NYU's Holiday Tournament, where they'll meet the host Violets and then either John Jay or Drew.  Denison starts their NCAC schedule (apart from an early December trip to Meadville) with Wittenberg and Ohio Wesleyan, teams they will face only once this year.

All in all, it looks like a 10-win campaign would be a triumph for the young Granvillians.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on September 18, 2007, 01:08:42 PM
Denison is the Coppin State of D-3?  ;)

It should be interesting to see the Big Red. Will they embrace defense? Who will provide scoring? Will their fan(s) post on this board??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 18, 2007, 01:13:49 PM
Oberlin announces 4 recruits for the class of '11. (http://www.oberlin.edu/athletic/varsity/m_basketball/archive/2007-2008/mbb_recruits_082007.html) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on September 18, 2007, 03:16:06 PM
Looks like quite the class, hopefully they pan out and can help balance the competiveness of the league a little
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on September 18, 2007, 07:00:35 PM
I've been impressed with Cavaco's work at Oberlin thus far - considering what he had to start with there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 21, 2007, 12:15:13 PM
Here's the schedule  (http://www.oberlin.edu/athletic/varsity/m_basketball/schedule.html)lined up for those new Oberlin recruits.  Compared to some of the other NCAC schedules, this one is kind of blah (season-opening trip to Philadelphia; six non-conference games against teams generally in the bottom half of the Great Lakes Region; Wooster and Wittenberg out of the way by Jan. 5), until you get to Jan. 12:

January 12     at Yale University     2:00 p.m.

How cool is that?  I hope it's a home-and-home contract, as I'd love to see a Yale-Oberlin game without having to go to New Haven in January.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on September 23, 2007, 03:20:58 PM
Yale - Oberlin should be a College Bowl matchup, no?   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on September 24, 2007, 11:47:16 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on September 21, 2007, 12:15:13 PM
Here's the schedule  (http://www.oberlin.edu/athletic/varsity/m_basketball/schedule.html)lined up for those new Oberlin recruits.  Compared to some of the other NCAC schedules, this one is kind of blah (season-opening trip to Philadelphia; six non-conference games against teams generally in the bottom half of the Great Lakes Region; Wooster and Wittenberg out of the way by Jan. 5), until you get to Jan. 12:

January 12     at Yale University     2:00 p.m.

How cool is that?  I hope it's a home-and-home contract, as I'd love to see a Yale-Oberlin game without having to go to New Haven in January.

Other than the Villanova "we must cleanse ourselves" game at Redlands a few years ago, I can't say when the last time was a D-I team played in a D-III gym, which is unfortunate -- that would be cool.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tyrone on September 24, 2007, 01:39:03 PM
Do any other NCAC teams have a D-1 exhibition this year?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 24, 2007, 05:01:02 PM
Quote from: tyrone on September 24, 2007, 01:39:03 PM
Do any other NCAC teams have a D-1 exhibition this year?

I believe I've seen all of the schedules except Earlham, and I don't recall seeing any other D1 games.  I could be wrong.

And the Oberlin-Yale game is not an "exhibition," it's a full-fledged counts-in-the-record regular season game (at least the Oberlin schedule makes no mention otherwise).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on September 25, 2007, 10:56:31 AM
Yale has it listed as a regular season game, between a trip to Longwood and the last game before their Ivy League lid-lifter against Brown.

Yale is 1-0 against Oberlin. Last year they beat Allegheny 98-55 in the season opener, breaking Allegheny's three game winning streak against the Elis. Of course, the last game was in 1906.

Are they just working through the NCAC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on September 25, 2007, 02:13:22 PM
Wooster has finalized the opening round matchups for the Al Van Wie & Mose Hole Tournaments:

Al Van Wie Tournament  11/16
Otterbein vs. St. Thomas (MN)
Wooster vs. Farmingdale State

Mose Hole Tournament  12/28
Mt. Union vs. Notre Dame (OH)
Wooster vs. Wesley

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on September 25, 2007, 06:42:42 PM
Earlham schedule wise, I was able to unearth this today:

The Quakers will play at Washington on Nov. 30 in the 24th annual Lopata Classic...the other teams involved are Babson and Claremont-Mudd-Scripps. Consolation and championship on Dec. 1.

Typically Earlham opens the season with a tourney on the road, which looking at the calendar should fall on Nov. 16 and 17...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pabegg on September 25, 2007, 08:32:52 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on September 25, 2007, 06:42:42 PM
Earlham schedule wise, I was able to unearth this today:

The Quakers will play at Washington on Nov. 30 in the 24th annual Lopata Classic...the other teams involved are Babson and Claremont-Mudd-Scripps. Consolation and championship on Dec. 1.

Typically Earlham opens the season with a tourney on the road, which looking at the calendar should fall on Nov. 16 and 17...


Yeah, they'll be at Case's season opener this year, starting with Lake Erie on the 16th. Their other tournament is at Franklin on 12/28-29
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 27, 2007, 01:26:55 PM
Here's Earlham's complete schedule (http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/2007-08/schedule/index.html) (well, not "complete," as that term has come to be known in PU, as the matchups in the Franklin holiday tournament are not shown.) 

As noted by Billy and Patrick, the Quakers are competing with Ohio Wesleyan for the title of America's Guest, as they too will play in three fairly interesting tournaments:  the lidlifter at Case Western Reserve with Lake Erie and Alma, the Lopata Classic at WUSTL with CMS and Babson, and the Franklin tournament with Aurora and Baldwin-Wallace.  Their other three non-conference games constitute a Tour d'HCAC (at Manchester and RHIT, and home vs. Anderson). 

After opening the NCAC season with Oberlin in December and Hiram as day one of the annual East Meets West trip (this year in Indiana), the Quakers hit a rugged six-game stretch: Allegheny, at Kenyon, Wittenberg, at OWU, Wabash, and at Wooster.  The second half of the conference slate is a little better balanced, which may enable the Quakers to make a late-season run at a decent conference tournament berth.

It's interesting to note that NCAC teams will be guests at holiday tournaments on six of the eight UAA campuses:  Wash U. and CWRU (Earlham), Chicago and Rochester (OWU), NYU (Denison), and Brandeis (Kenyon.)  It's time for CMU and Emory to figure out the prestige that comes with bringing an NCAC team to campus in the fall.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on September 27, 2007, 01:51:39 PM
Actually, I think Presbyterian is America's Guest. They're moving to D-1 and have just 6 home games this year. Radford, Army, and four D-2 teams. And Radford and Army are home-and-home's this year.

http://www.gobluehose.com/SportSelect.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=18100&KEY=&SPID=10747&SPSID=89799

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 27, 2007, 02:15:37 PM
Recap:  here's the schedules for all 10 teams.

Allegheny (http://www.allegheny.edu/athletics/menbb/results.php)
Denison (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/2007_08_men_s_basketball_schedul.html)
Earlham (http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/2007-08/schedule/index.html)
Hiram (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/schedule.html)
Kenyon (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x23821.xml)
Oberlin (http://www.oberlin.edu/athletic/varsity/m_basketball/schedule.html)
Ohio Wesleyan (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1)
Wabash (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball/schedule)
Wittenberg (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule07-08.html)
Wooster (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/schedule.php)

Let's lace 'em up!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on September 27, 2007, 02:21:43 PM
Does anybody have a schedule for Wooster's scrimmages yet?  And, although off-topic I'll ask it here since the baseball board is hibernating, does anyone know when the Scots will be playing the fall baseball Black and Gold world series?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: tyrone on September 28, 2007, 12:09:14 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on September 27, 2007, 02:21:43 PM
Does anybody have a schedule for Wooster's scrimmages yet?  And, although off-topic I'll ask it here since the baseball board is hibernating, does anyone know when the Scots will be playing the fall baseball Black and Gold world series?

And I'm curious as to Wooster's prognosis/starters...tough to replace last year's talent. Is there any hope for the Dex Battista, who was fervently talked about one year ago at this time in here and the MIAA boards?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on September 28, 2007, 08:29:02 AM
Quote from: tyrone on September 28, 2007, 12:09:14 AM
And I'm curious as to Wooster's prognosis/starters...tough to replace last year's talent. Is there any hope for the Dex Battista, who was fervently talked about one year ago at this time in here and the MIAA boards?
I think it is going to be tough for Wooster to replace the talent they lost last season.  You don't just replace players like Tom Port and Tim Vandervaart.  With that said, there is still a lot of talent on this team.  Starting at the guard position, you have James Cooper coming back for his senior year.  He was then NCAC POY as a sophomore.   And at the point, Brandon Johnson is pretty good as well.  They were NCAC 1st and 2nd team respectively last season.  Wooster also has arguably one of the best guards not to start in Devin Fulk.  This is a position Wooster is loaded at.  Evan Will was also a starter last year after Vandervaart went down with an injury.  He will probably start at the 4 or the 5.  Marty Bidwell seems like he would start in Andy VanHorns spot.  That leaves  one starting position up in the air.  Does Wooster go bigger with one of their big freshman from a season ago in 6'8" Robert Melick or 6'6" Craig Elam?  Or do any of their freshman have the talent to crack into the starting lineup right away?

As far as Dex Battista, he has not lived up to the hype.  He was often one of the last players to get in during mop up duty for the Scots.  I'm interested if he spent any time working to improve his game at all this offseason. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on September 28, 2007, 10:57:42 AM
Thanks to the scheduling of Indiana Wesleyan in the tip-off classic, I wonder if Wabash's football team makes the playoffs if they would move that game to Sunday, since it's not really a tournament, just four teams playing two games each at the same site.

Just curious - now that I'm out of the loop I can wildly speculate...heh...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on September 28, 2007, 01:41:46 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on September 28, 2007, 08:29:02 AM
Does Wooster go bigger with one of their big freshman from a season ago in 6'8" Robert Melick or 6'6" Craig Elam?  Or do any of their freshman have the talent to crack into the starting lineup right away?

As far as Dex Battista, he has not lived up to the hype.  He was often one of the last players to get in during mop up duty for the Scots.  I'm interested if he spent any time working to improve his game at all this offseason. 

I agree with ScotsFan that Robert Melick and Craig Elam have a shot at the starting lineup.  Melick and Elam both got more playing time last year than Battista who underachieved.  The most likely freshman to get playing time is 6'5" Bryan Wickliffe who averaged ~20 points/game in his senior year at Columbus St. Charles.

If my sources are accurate, Dex Battista is not even enrolled at Wooster this year.  My guess is that he has transferred to one of the MIAA colleges (Hope? ...they were his #2 choice when he was a HS senior) but no team rosters are posted yet for this season.  Perhaps another Wooster poster knows where Battista has landed?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 29, 2007, 05:18:33 PM
I went to the Ohio Wesleyan/Kenyon football game this afternoon, where I ran into OWU head coach Mike DeWitt.  He told me that OWU has a new assistant coach for this season, Chad Bostelman.  Chad is a graduate of Ohio Northern and was a key contributor to their 2000-01 Final Four team; in fact, he was ONU's representative on the D3Hoops.com All-Tournament team (http://www.d3hoops.com/salem/01/index.html) that season.  Most recently, Chad was an assistant coach at Heidelberg College, helping the Student Princes return to respectability with their 13-13 finish (9-9 OAC) last season.  He should be an outstanding addition to the OWU program, and I welcome him to the NCAC!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 01, 2007, 09:11:41 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on September 28, 2007, 01:41:46 PM
[  Perhaps another Wooster poster knows where Battista has landed?

Cuba??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 01, 2007, 11:54:36 PM
I've got my tentative schedule finished for the season now.  My preliminary plans are to see 58 games in 8 gyms (Wooster, Kenyon, Denison, OWU, Muskingum, Capital, Otterbein, and Mt. Vernon Naz.)  during the regular season (men's and women's, but not counting JV games.)  And that's after I abandoned my plans to go to the Cactus Jam in Phoenix in December (which would have been 12 games in 3 days...still pretty tempting.)  I wonder how close I'll come to fulfilling this ambitious schedule?  Ah, but it's nice to dream... :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on October 02, 2007, 09:52:14 AM
Quote from: smedindy on October 01, 2007, 09:11:41 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on September 28, 2007, 01:41:46 PM
[  Perhaps another Wooster poster knows where Battista has landed?

Cuba??

:D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hopefan on October 02, 2007, 10:03:26 AM
Dave Collinge  -  what, no trips to St Louis????? :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 03, 2007, 10:42:58 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on October 01, 2007, 11:54:36 PM
And that's after I abandoned my plans to go to the Cactus Jam in Phoenix in December (which would have been 12 games in 3 days...still pretty tempting.) 
Just the words 'Phoenix in December' would be tempting enough for me! 8)  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 04, 2007, 01:41:25 PM
The first two NCAC 2007-08 rosters are now posted.

Kenyon (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x4155.xml) lists 19 players, including 8 frosh, on their 2007-08 roster.  It may be hard for this large first-year class to find playing time, as the entire 9-man rotation from last year's 10-16 (6-10 NCAC) squad returns, bringing with them 97.6% of the scoring and 97.9% of the rebounding.  The Lords will be led by senior co-captains Josh Klinger (5'10" G, HM All-NCAC, returning from an injury that kept him out of 8 games last season) and Chris Yorlano (5'9" G, 45% 3-point shooter, also an all-conference honoree as a 2nd baseman), All-Conference returnees Bryan Yelvington (6'6" junior F, led team in both scoring [13.5] and rebounding [7.5]), Korey Haddox (6'2" junior G, 11.3 ppg) and Dave Jolson (6'3" junior G, 10.4 ppg), and last year's NCAC Newcomer of the Year Dave Knapke (6'5" sophomore F, 10.2ppg, 5.4 rpg, .510 FG%).

The freshman class is made up of 6 guards all 6'4" or shorter, including Korey Haddox' little brother Kodey, and two big men: 6'8" Evan McCulley (Winter Park, FL) and 6'7" Uros Vasiljevik (Ellicott City, MD).

I am very high on this squad, and I think they will be disappointed with anything less than a first-division finish this season.  Furthermore, if they can find a reasonable replacement for Klinger at the point, this team could (gasp) challenge for the league title in 2008-09--and maybe this year too.  You heard it here first.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 04, 2007, 01:57:58 PM
Oberlin (http://www.oberlin.edu/athletic/varsity/m_basketball/roster.html)'s 2007-08 roster is also posted.  The Yeomen will be without the services of 2007 graduate and two-time All-NCAC performer Quinton Spencer, but return the rest of their top 8 scorers from 2006-07.  The returning core will be led by All-NCAC honoree Michael Loll (6'5" junior G/F), who led the team in both scoring and rebounding (15.8 and 7.1, respectively).  Overall, 76.2% of the scoring and 74.6% of the rebounding return, along with 80.6% of the minutes played.  However, there should be room for the four freshmen (profiled earlier on this page) to make inroads, considering that Oberlin finished 5-20, 4-12 last season and missed the NCAC tournament.  Although Spencer is a big loss, Oberlin appears to be a program on the rise, and I think it's more than reasonable to expect to see the Yeomen playing a 26th game this March.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 04, 2007, 04:25:28 PM
I think the Lords could challenge for a home game this year. I'm glad that Oberlin and Kenyon are improving. Let's hope their non-conference records are reasonable!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 06, 2007, 09:23:23 PM
Why Sports Matter (http://www.allegheny.edu/athletics/FromTheADDesk.php), by Betsy Mitchell (http://www.allegheny.edu/athletics/FromTheADDesk-BetsyBio.php), Allegheny College (http://www.alleg.edu/athletics/) Director of Athletics and Recreation.

Required reading.  My single biggest regret is that I never participated in varsity athletics in my school days; Ms. Mitchell explains very cogently why it is so important.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 07, 2007, 11:10:44 AM
Former Wooster standout Rodney Mitchell has been named the new head coach at Wayne College (http://www.wayne.uakron.edu/ss_athletics.htm) in Orrville, according to the Daily Record's Aaron Dorksen (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/2665021).  Wayne is an adjunct of the University of Akron and competes in the Ohio Regional Campus Conference (ORCC) with the likes of OSU-Newark, Ohio Eastern, and Cincinnati Clermont.  The Warriors will play the Wooster JV squad twice this season, on Dec. 3 (at Wooster) and Feb. 4 (at Orrville).  Wayne's AD, Rodney's new boss, is former Wooster assistant coach Patrick Ruefner, who also coaches the Lady Warriors.  In addition to serving as the Warriors' head coach, Rodney also serves as the assistant director of the Wooster Community Youth Center, and is a student in Ashland U.'s MBA program.  Congratulations and good luck to Rodney in his new assignment!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 07, 2007, 07:42:23 PM
Isn't Clermont transitioning to D-3?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 07, 2007, 08:32:17 PM
Another roster is posted; this time it belongs to Wabash (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball/roster) (it's labeled as "2007" but it clearly refers to this year's squad). 

Like Kenyon and Oberlin before them, Wabash returns the great majority of their team, losing just 2007 graduate Ryan Stephens' inside presence and a handful of end-of-the-bench players (senior Ryan Nuppnau, juniors Collin Smith and Mark Turpin, and sophomore Kyle Brasher.)  The Little Giants bring back 92.3% of the offense and 83.1% of the rebounding from an 11-16 (7-9) squad.  Leading the returnees is first-team all-NCAC F/C Andrew Zimmer (6'5" senior), the team's leader in scoring (19.7), rebounding (7.8 ), blocked shots (40), steals (26), and minutes played (30.7), all by substantial margins.  Four other players who started at least 13 games last year are returning: senior guard Earl Rooks (1.46 A/TO), and sophomores Robert Haltom (10.6 ppg last year as Chase Haltom), Aaron Brock (9.4 ppg, 4.1 rpg), and Andy Root (9.3 ppg.) 

There are seven freshman among this 21-man roster (I do not include senior Torm Hustvet, who although listed on the roster is clearly the team manager.)  There's not a lot of size among the plebes, with only 6'5"/200 Benjamin Burkett of C'ville contributing interior size to the team.  The other frosh include paper-thin 6'4"/175 SF Alan Forman, 6'3"/185 G/SF Wesley Smith, 6'3"/180 SF Chad Barkdull, and guards Andrew Gilman (6'1"), Kenneth Taylor (6'0"), and Dominique Thomas (6'0").  However, with over 86% of the minutes from last season going to players returning this year, these frosh may have to get their collegiate feet wet on the JV squad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 07, 2007, 08:38:35 PM
Quote from: smedindy on October 07, 2007, 07:42:23 PM
Isn't Clermont transitioning to D-3?

Not according to Patrick Abegg's list of provisional members (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=5245.msg736670#msg736670).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 07, 2007, 09:46:40 PM
Hmmm...I thought I remembered hearing that they were applying or something when they came to the Pete Thorn last year.

Ben Burkett is a great kid and a hard worker. He is one of those guys that will be a successful 6'5 center because of his effort, strength, and positioning.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 07, 2007, 09:47:42 PM
A-HA:

http://www1.ncaa.org/membership/governance/division_III/membership/2006/April_minutes.htm

I looked on the NCAA site and they are an Exploratory member:

http://www1.ncaa.org/membership/governance/division_III/membership_information/Current_EPR.pdf
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on October 09, 2007, 03:58:24 PM
Dex Battista is at Grand Valley State in Michigan, and I believe his playing days are over.

If anyone runs into the Wooster coaches, tell them to bring back Late Night Madness this year. This is always an enjoyable event that helps get fans, and especially students, into the spirit of basketball. They didn't have it last year, and I haven't seen anything about it for this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 10, 2007, 05:39:57 PM
Titan Q posted this summary of Street & Smith's preseason D3 review in CCIW chat:

Sporting News/Street & Smith's 2007-08 Division III preseason top 10:

1. Wash U.
2. UW-Stevens Point
3. Brockport St
4. Amherst
5. Augustana
6. Brandeis
7. Virginia Wesleyan
8. Guilford
9. Rochester
10. Williams

"Possible Breakthroughs":

Alvernia, Aurora, Averett, Calvin, Capital, Defiance, Elmhurst, Hampden-Sydney, Heidelberg, Hope, Keene St, Lewis & Clark, Loras, Mississippi College, Plattsburgh St,  Puget Sound, Rhode Island Coll, Rowan, Stevens Institute, Ursinus, Wheaton, Whitworth, William Paterson, UW-Platteville, UW-Whitewater, Wittenberg, Wooster, Worcester Poly, York

Preseason All-American Team...

1st Team

James Cooper, Wooster
Andrew Olson, Amherst
Troy Ruths, Wash U
Ben Strong, Guilford
Larry Welton, Aurora

2nd Team

Sherod Harris, Brockport St
Chad McGowan, York (Pa)
Kent Raymond, Wheaton
Nick Shattuck, Ursinus
Anthony Williams, Plattsburgh St


Obviously, Witt and Woo were listed in the "Possible Breakthroughs" group.  It is interesting that Capital and Heidelberg were picked for this group from the OAC.

Congratulations to James Cooper on being picked by S&S as preseason All-American 1st Team!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 10, 2007, 06:53:02 PM
Wabash's Andrew Zimmer was also tabbed by that publication in their "Honorable Mention" section, along with Nate Stahl (Capital) and Brandon Todd (Muskingum) from the OAC.  Congratulations to these student-athletes as well.

http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4440.msg773668#msg773668
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 11, 2007, 10:43:48 AM
Glad to see someone noticed Zimmer. And congrats to Cooper. Now hurry up and graduate, will ya?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on October 11, 2007, 04:23:57 PM
Quote from: smedindy on August 08, 2007, 08:07:04 PM
Arlen Galloway could hoist them from way downtown, but he's no Travis Brett.

Oh, you know it's true!!!  ;)

Can I tell you the guy that use to post on here and end everything in Oh, You know it's True drove me Crazy!!!    Anyways good to see travis brett sightings!   Gzzz I bet those Depauw players are still having nightmares... He was 10 for 15 from downtown, in the O.T. Upset over #2 raked Depauw... 

Oh the good old days, I'm not sure if that was better then the triple O.T. Win Against #14 Wittenberg my Freshman year at home, and then a week later beating them at the HYPER...

I can not take the Former, beating Witt. Twice in one season takes the cake.  Think i'm going to go watch that tape, because there is nothing like watching  Chris FILLMORES Up and under Post move... over and over again.    Under-Rated play of the game, in the 3rd O.T Undersize Freshman Sean O'Reilley Pulled the Chair causing Fillmore to travel.  Score was 88-90 at that point.  EC won 95-88.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 13, 2007, 09:28:33 PM
Historian -

If you have a beef with Pat, I would suggest you keep it off of the boards. It's a great story, but your posts about it in every board makes it hard for someone to see your side of it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on October 14, 2007, 03:02:47 AM

The SID could have put an actual byline on the story when he sent it as a press release. There's way more to the story, not surprisingly, that Historian hasn't mentioned. It'll get taken care of.

I think we were supposed to just guess what name to put on it. There was no byline on the release.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 16, 2007, 11:11:01 PM
You know what separates Wooster and Wittenberg from the rest of the pack?

In a NORMAL season, Wooster and Witt don't have hiccups against the bottom tier of the league.

(Sure, Witt lost to Denison a couple of years ago...)

But it always seems that Wabash, or Earlham, will play Witt and Wooster tough, even beat them once in a while, but then lose a maddening game or two against Oberlin or Kenyon or Hiram. It never fails.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 17, 2007, 05:13:31 PM
Quote from: smedindy on October 16, 2007, 11:11:01 PM
You know what separates Wooster and Wittenberg from the rest of the pack?

In a NORMAL season, Wooster and Witt don't have hiccups against the bottom tier of the league.

Smed - that point is especially true for Wooster.  :)

In the last 10 seasons (going back to 1997-1998), Wooster has only lost a total of 3 games to NCAC teams other than Wittenberg:

February 2006 - Lost at Ohio Wesleyan
February 2002 - Lost to Wabash (at Timken)
February 1998 - Lost to Allegheny (NCAC Tournament Finals)

Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 19, 2007, 11:45:54 AM
Jason Ronyak has popped up on Case Western Reserve's 2007-08 roster (http://www.case.edu/athletics/varsity/winter/mbasketball/roster.htm).  Jason played at Wooster last season as a frosh, primarily as a jayvee.  Best wishes to Jason with the Spartans.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 21, 2007, 08:40:22 PM
Last season, Denison (6-18, 5-11 NCAC) had 11 players average at least ten minutes per game, and ten of them started at least one game.  Of those eleven, only two were seniors: four-time all-NCAC honoree Dan Hodgkinson, the NCAC's leading scorer, and three-year starter Dan Izzo.  While the two Dans will be difficult to replace, having nine players from your rotation is a good start for a rebuilding year.

Unfortunately, things aren't that rosy for the Big Red, as according to their published roster (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/mens_basketball_roster.html), only five of those players will return for another season of Denison basketball.  I wouldn't begin to speculate on the reasons why, but Shea McMahon, Steve Koecheler, John Ward, and Karlin Tichenor are not on the 2007-08 roster.  Collectively, these four players contributed 28% of the scoring, 31% of the rebounding, and 33% of the minutes last season.  When you add in the contributions of the Dans (45%, 35%, and 28%, respectively), you quickly come to the conclusion that Denison has a tall rebuilding task on its hands this season.

The top returning players will be junior PG Pat Sullivan (2.33 apg, 1.33 A/TO, 1.04 steals/game, 22 starts, 23.0 mpg), soph. guard Chris Luther (3.7 ppg, 2.3 rpb, 17 starts, 19.0 mpg), senior post Brian Elder (4.5 ppg, 2.3 rpg, 12.0 mpg), and senior guards Chris Eberst (10.9 mpg) and Brian Gognat (13.8 mpg).  This group will be complimented by soph. Caleb McFerren, a 6'0" guard and transfer from Wayne State (where he played football but not hoops, as far as I can tell), three reserves from last year's team, and a seven-player first-year class (four guards, two wings, and a 6'6" post).  This group will have to gel quickly, as they open the season with consecutive games against Hanover, Transylvania, Lake Erie, and Capital, all away from the friendly confines of Livingston Gymnasium.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 22, 2007, 12:00:26 AM
Wow! That's a roster prunin', or something...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 23, 2007, 09:30:48 PM
Wooster has posted their 2007-2008 Season Outlook on their website:  :)

In the Backcourt, the top 4 players listed are James Cooper, Brandon Johnson, Devin Fulk and Dustin Geitgey.

In the Frontcourt, the top 4 players listed are Evan Will, Marty Bidwell, Craig Elam and Robert Melnick.  Rob Tenenini is the 5th player mentioned.

There are 7 freshmen on the 19 man roster.  From this group, the best candidate for early playing time is probably 6'5" Bryan Wickliffe from Columbus St. Charles.

The link to the season outlook is: http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/outlook.php

The link to the 2007-2008 roster is: http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/roster.php

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on October 24, 2007, 12:54:05 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on September 27, 2007, 02:21:43 PM
Does anybody have a schedule for Wooster's scrimmages yet?

The schedule that I have is:
Sunday, October 28      Intrasquad Scrimmage @ 12:00 p.m.
Friday, November 2      Scrimmage vs. Defiance College at Wooster  7:00 p.m.
Saturday, Nov. 10        Scrimmage @ Ashland University  6:00 p.m.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 25, 2007, 12:55:02 AM
Thanks, CMH, I appreciate the news about the intrasquad scrimmage.  Going to be there?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on October 25, 2007, 02:51:13 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on October 25, 2007, 12:55:02 AM
Thanks, CMH, I appreciate the news about the intrasquad scrimmage.  Going to be there?

I'm planning to come up on Sunday for the scrimmage.  Hope to see you there!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 25, 2007, 03:52:44 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on October 25, 2007, 02:51:13 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on October 25, 2007, 12:55:02 AM
Thanks, CMH, I appreciate the news about the intrasquad scrimmage.  Going to be there?

I'm planning to come up on Sunday for the scrimmage.  Hope to see you there!

Sunday, or Saturday?  I have a note from your dad that says the scrimmage is Saturday at noon.  I'd hate to show up on the wrong date!  Can you verify the date and let us know?  Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on October 25, 2007, 04:07:46 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on October 25, 2007, 03:52:44 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on October 25, 2007, 02:51:13 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on October 25, 2007, 12:55:02 AM
Thanks, CMH, I appreciate the news about the intrasquad scrimmage.  Going to be there?

I'm planning to come up on Sunday for the scrimmage.  Hope to see you there!

Sunday, or Saturday?  I have a note from your dad that says the scrimmage is Saturday at noon.  I'd hate to show up on the wrong date!  Can you verify the date and let us know?  Thanks.

The mailing that I just received today from the Rebounders lists the scrimmage as Sunday, October 28 at noon at Timken.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 26, 2007, 08:27:08 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on October 09, 2007, 03:58:24 PM
If anyone runs into the Wooster coaches, tell them to bring back Late Night Madness this year. This is always an enjoyable event that helps get fans, and especially students, into the spirit of basketball. They didn't have it last year, and I haven't seen anything about it for this year.
Has anyone heard if they are doing the Late Night Madness?  I'm assuming they aren't doing it seeing as how they have released their scrimmage schedule with no mention of any Madness.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on October 26, 2007, 12:51:09 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on October 24, 2007, 12:54:05 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on September 27, 2007, 02:21:43 PM
Does anybody have a schedule for Wooster's scrimmages yet?

The schedule that I have is:
Sunday, October 28      Intrasquad Scrimmage @ 12:00 p.m.
Friday, November 2      Scrimmage vs. Defiance College at Wooster  7:00 p.m.
Saturday, Nov. 10        Scrimmage @ Ashland University  6:00 p.m.


Note the corrected time for the scrimmage at Ashland on Nov 10.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 26, 2007, 01:55:09 PM
I was in the middle of a long, and insightful post about 2-9 in the NCAC (since Wooster will be #1 and Denison #10 - I assume) and the tab closed.

The magic...lost...

Anyway, I saw on the Wabash website that Gary Simkus is indeed playing basketball this year, so, with that info, I'm picking them this way, for now.

1. Wooster
2. Wabash
3. Wittenberg
4. Kenyon
5. Ohio Wesleyan
6. Allegheny
7. Earlham
8. Hiram
9. Oberlin
10. Denison

However, Hiram and Oberlin will have 5 to 7 conference wins and the distance between #4 and #7 is very small, IMHO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 26, 2007, 05:08:41 PM
Wesleyan fifth?!?  I'm sorry to not have benefited from the insight that was your original post. 

Your top five agrees with my current thinking (albeit not in that order), but I'm not ready to crown Wooster just yet (or to dethrone them either.)  After all, this is a team that lost half of it's "starting six" (counting both Will and Vandervaart) to graduation.  I'm interested to see them in the scrimmage on Sunday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 26, 2007, 06:00:48 PM
OWU lost three of their top five scorers, including Chojnacki. Do they have enough left over? I don't think Rudegeair can be THE man, and Jean doesn't have the offensive moves. A lot of people can shoot the 3 but is that enough?

But a 5th place OWU could still be 10-6 or 9-7 in the conference because of how close it will be.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 26, 2007, 07:20:48 PM
Nearly cross-posting, here's what I've been working on regarding OWU this evening:

------
2007 NCAC Tournament runner-up Ohio Wesleyan (http://bishops.owu.edu/2007-08/mbb08ros.html) has posted its roster.  The Battling Bishops return nine letterman from last season's 18-10 (10-6) squad, eight of them having averaged at least 11 minutes per game, and two of them garnering all-conference honors.  This senior-dominated squad figures to be led by 6'5" posts Dustin Rudegeair (12.8 ppg, 5.9 rpg, 2nd team all-NCAC) and Jesse Jean (10.0 ppg, 6.5 rpg, HM all-NCAC) and point guard Casey Teeters (2.6 apg, 1.7 A/TO, 5.0 ppg).  Overall, the Bishops bring back 65.1% of their scoring, 73.8% of their rebounding, and 68.6% of their minutes, despite losing (to graduation) Ben Chojnacki, a three-time first team all-NCAC honoree, and two other starters. 

Competing for playing time on this experienced squad are two upperclassmen returning from injury-plagued 2007 campaigns and five first-year players, including yet another recruit from Medina High School.  Despite being located roughly halfway between Wooster and Oberlin, Medina H.S. has instead sent several players 100 miles southwest to Delaware, including 2007 grads Ben Chojnacki and Matt Shirer, as well as four-time first team all-NCAC honoree (and new Wittenberg assistant coach) Travis Schwab.  The latest Battling Bee to become a Battling Bishop is 6'5" wing Dillon McBride, who was an all-district performer in high school and now has some mighty big shoes to fill.
-----

It's true that OWU has graduation losses, but so do Wooster (3 starters including Port and Vandervaart) and Wittenberg (4 starters including Borchers), and OWU does return a lot of its rotation from a pretty good team last year.  Wabash and Kenyon lost almost nothing, and Simkus' return should be a benefit to Wabash, but is that alone enough to close what in my opinion was a considerable gap to the top three?    They finished fifth and sixth last year, respectively, and I haven't even begun to consider fourth-place Allegheny yet.  I have a lot of respect for Mike DeWitt and the program he's building down there, and I doubt if I'll pick them lower than 3rd when I get around to making a preseason prognostication.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 26, 2007, 07:27:14 PM
NCAC media day for both men's and women's hoops is set from next Thursday, Nov. 1.  The conference website has also posted its capsule outlooks (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mb.html) for each team.  One roster I'm dying to get a look at is Hiram's:

Quote from: NCAC websiteSecond team All-NCAC forward Mike McDevitt is the top returnee as he heads into his senior campaign for Hiram. He will have a lot of new players around him as 16 newcomers, including 13 freshman, are on the roster.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 26, 2007, 08:26:02 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on October 26, 2007, 07:20:48 PM

It's true that OWU has graduation losses, but so do Wooster (3 starters including Port and Vandervaart) and Wittenberg (4 starters including Borchers), and OWU does return a lot of its rotation from a pretty good team last year.  Wabash and Kenyon lost almost nothing, and Simkus' return should be a benefit to Wabash, but is that alone enough to close what in my opinion was a considerable gap to the top three?    They finished fifth and sixth last year, respectively, and I haven't even begun to consider fourth-place Allegheny yet.  I have a lot of respect for Mike DeWitt and the program he's building down there, and I doubt if I'll pick them lower than 3rd when I get around to making a preseason prognostication.

I don't know - 'Bash did beat OWU on the road last year. This is just a hunch. I respect OWU, but the rest of the league is getting better. I think it's going to be a case of 2-9 beating up on each other (like the Big 10), and many close games against Wooster.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 29, 2007, 11:23:51 AM
Ahhh.  It's nice to see some meaningful basketball discussion in here once again!

I thought that I would add my two cents on how I look for the NCAC to shake out this year for what it's worth... ;)

I see Wooster as the team to beat once again.  I know that is a big surprise to many of you!!! ;D  Even with the losses they sufferred (most notably Port) I still think this team has far more talent than any other team in the conference.  Wooster's backcourt is the best in the conference.  Bidwell should step in and fill Van Horn's shoes at the 3 and Will was already starting the 2nd half of the season due to Vandervaart's injuries.  I see Cooper really stepping up his scoring this season with the loss of Port.  I think a major key for Wooster will be the play of Will, Elam and Melick posting up.  Vandervaart's presence in the middle might be sorely missed if those 3 can't pick up thier game.  Especially Elam and Melick.

As for the rest of the league, I really don't know who I would consider to pencil in as my #2 team.  You can make arguments for several teams right now.  Witt lost even more than Wooster did IMO.  They really lack any proven inside presence for the first time in a looooong time.  And they are the thinnest I can remember on the inside as well.  I would be really hesitant to pick them to finish above either OWU or Wabash at this point.  IMO, it's pretty much a pick 'em between either Wabash and OWU in the battle for 2nd and 3rd.  You can make pretty strong arguments both ways.

Outside of the top 4, I see teams trying to get better in Hiram and Oberlin which is encouraging.  Kenyon should be better this year with all that they have returning.  I really don't know what to expect from Allegheny.  And will Tristan Gregory be able to carry Earlham with the losses of Jewett and Henry?  And Denison would be my choice to bring up the rear.  I don't see how they overcome all of the losses they've sustained.

I just think overall, however, while the gap is closing, it was still pretty big between Wooster and the rest of the league last year and I don't see that gap closing all the way just yet.  It wouldn't surprise me to see Wabash or OWU knock the Scots off though.  On the other hand, I also wouldn't be surprised to see the Scots run the table in the conference as well.  One thing I do expect is a for Wooster to be in a lot more competitive games this year than in years past.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 29, 2007, 11:27:04 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on October 26, 2007, 05:08:41 PM
I'm interested to see them in the scrimmage on Sunday.
How did they look in the scrimmage?  Any of the freshman look like they might be able to contribute?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on October 29, 2007, 01:40:37 PM
One player to keep an eye on is Brent Pleiman from Ohio Wesleyan. He is from the same high school (Russia) as Dane Borchers. He missed all of last season with an injury. At 6-8, 250, he is a load, and was an All-Ohio player in high school. If he is healthy, he could give OWU the best frontline in the conference. I really think the Bishops are the most likely team to challenge Wooster this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 29, 2007, 04:29:27 PM
The intrasquad scrimmage at Wooster was fun.  James Cooper picked up right where he left off last year, throwing shots into the hole from anywhere he pleased.  Even the excellent-defending Brandon Johnson, who attempted to guard him, had his hands full.  Will, Elam, and Melick were all loads under the basket, playing as physical as ever.  I'd like to see Will look to the basket more, though, rather than giving the ball up as often as he does.

Bidwell's offensive game looks to be dramatically improved.  For one short stretch, he was Super Marty, putting in four or five shots in a row including two or three three-pointers and a nice pull-up jumper.  Devin Fulk was kind of quiet, but we know what he can do.  Last year's two best freshmen guards, Geitgey and Molz, both had their moments shooting the ball, but I don't see either of them getting too much crunch-time on the court.  Rob Tenenini performed solidly at forward.

I'll have to admit I was not impressed with the incoming freshmen class.  Nobody at all, of those that took the court, seemed ready to play at this level.  Bryan Wickliffe, touted as the best prospect, remained on the bench, and I was told he was injured.  Hopefully he'll be able to participate soon.  Local product Kaleb Reed (Northwestern High School) didn't seem to be there at all.

It'll be interesting to see which way coach Moore goes with his starting lineup.  Johnson, Cooper, and Will are locks.  Will he add Bidwell and Fulk, going small and very fast but sacrificing size?  Or, will it be either Bidwell or Fulk plus either Melick or Elam, a more traditional lineup? 

My guess is that Devin Fulk will once again be the third guard with Bidwell and Melick getting the nod along with Johnson, Cooper, and Will.  Devin will certainly get plenty of minutes, as will Elam.  Look for Rob Tenenini to possibly be in an eight-man rotation, although Wickliffe is the wild card in this prediction, since I haven't yet seen him play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 29, 2007, 04:40:43 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on October 29, 2007, 01:40:37 PM
One player to keep an eye on is Brent Pleiman from Ohio Wesleyan. He is from the same high school (Russia) as Dane Borchers. He missed all of last season with an injury. At 6-8, 250, he is a load, and was an All-Ohio player in high school. If he is healthy, he could give OWU the best frontline in the conference. I really think the Bishops are the most likely team to challenge Wooster this year.

Hard to tell with freshmen, though that IS a load. You wonder, though, with that size why he didn't go mid-major D-1 unless it was the injury.

The thing about OWU that is that if they're not shooting well, they won't win. They need some help in the middle, otherwise teams will just play a 3-2 or 2-2-1 zone and pressure the wings when they shoot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 29, 2007, 07:36:08 PM
Quote from: smedindy on October 29, 2007, 04:40:43 PM
Hard to tell with freshmen, though that IS a load. You wonder, though, with that size why he didn't go mid-major D-1 unless it was the injury.
Pleiman is a sophomore.  He injured his back forcing him to miss his entire freshman season.  Still, he does lack experience and he is still unproven at the next level.  Size and success at the high school level doesn't always translate into success at the college level.  I just have to wonder how much Pleiman will actually contribute with no experience. 

Also, thanks for the update Wooster Booster.  IMHO, Will, Cooper, Johnson and Bidwell are locks to start.  My gut tells me that Fulk will be coming off the bench to spell Cooper with Geitgey and Molz spelling Johnson.  BTW, there was a lot of talk about Kevin Truitt possibly making an immediate impact at PG.  Did he see much action?  As for the other starter, I'm also leaning towards Melick getting the nod there with Elam coming off the bench.  I would guess that Tenenini might get some minutes as well and it will be interesting to see if Wickliffe is the real deal and whether or not his injury could cost him a shot at cracking the rotation for the Scots. 

One final thought I've been having is the fact that Wooster had been having quite a stretch of getting immediate impacts from freshmen or 1st year players .  There was Bryan Nelson,  Kyle Witucky, Tom Port,  James Cooper, Brandon Johnson etc.  But, last year's class didn't really have one freshman that made an immediate impact.  There are still some in that class that could develop into fine players for Wooster, but no standouts after their 1st year.  Will this be two seasons in a row where Wooster has no stand-outs from their freshman class?  Of course, a contributing factor to freshman not making an impact is that Wooster has so many talented upperclassmen that it is hard to crack the rotation as a freshman. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 29, 2007, 09:16:44 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on October 29, 2007, 07:36:08 PM
Quote from: smedindy on October 29, 2007, 04:40:43 PM
Hard to tell with freshmen, though that IS a load. You wonder, though, with that size why he didn't go mid-major D-1 unless it was the injury.
Pleiman is a sophomore.  He injured his back forcing him to miss his entire freshman season.  Still, he does lack experience and he is still unproven at the next level.  Size and success at the high school level doesn't always translate into success at the college level.  I just have to wonder how much Pleiman will actually contribute with no experience. 

Thanks for the clarification.

Still, to be that big and not get a D-1 offer? (Just a conjecture - it wouldn't surprise me if a lower echelon D-1 offered him and he said no, but with that size the MAC or MVC could have used him.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 29, 2007, 10:37:17 PM
Scotsfan -

I agree, this is probably a second year in a row without an impact freshman, unless Wickliffe turns out to be one.  I'm really hoping that whatever is ailing him isn't too serious and that he'll be on the court next Friday night against Defiance.

I don't see either Geitgey or Molz as regulars in the guard rotation.  I think it'll be a three-way, as last year, with Cooper manning the point when Johnson is on the bench.  That's why I see Fulk not starting, so they can easier manipulate this.  That leaves a three-man big dude rotation with Will, Melick, and Elam, and Bidwell being spelled by by Tenenini.  Again Wickliffe my find some room in there somewhere.  And, there is certainly much flexibility available.  A lineup of one big guy, Bidwell, and three guards could do lots of damage going up and down the court if they could rebound.

Truitt, along with the other freshmen that played, didn't impress.  While I might be wrong, none of them seemed to be at the level that Elam, Melick, Molz, or Geitgey were at during this same scrimmage last season.  They're going to need to watch and learn and hit the weights to get time on this team.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on October 30, 2007, 09:12:38 AM
Nobody knows what a new player is going to do, especially one that was hurt as a freshmen, but what else are you supposed to go off of if they haven't played in college other than what they did in high school? That's what Wooster is doing with Wickliffe. Maybe he will be no good. I'm just a Wooster fan throwing out some names of players that might be going under the radar this year.

Here is a couple of things I found on Plieman:

Ranked No. 87 in the Ohio Class of 2006: http://www.hoopscooponline.com/members/area12/OhioLocalRankings_1Page4.html

Plus another article on him:
http://www.fanfilemagazine.com/stories_php/05boyspreview.php

Believe he is also the cousin of Jordan Plieman of Wright St.
http://wsuraiders.cstv.com/sports/m-baskbl/mtt/pleiman_jordan00.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 30, 2007, 12:58:02 PM
As I am not the first to notice, Wooster's 2007-08 team (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/roster.php) is starting to take shape.  The Scots, three-time defending NCAC Champions (regular season), have to find a way to replace three starters, including an All-American and 2007 NCAC Player of the Year (Tom Port), a second 1,000 point career scorer (Tim Vandervaart), and one of the best three-point shooters in program history (Andy Van Horn.)  The Scots also lost four bench/JV players from a season ago.*  However, the cupboard is far from bare.  Among the returnees are a second-team D3Hoops.com All American and 2006 NCAC Player of the Year (James Cooper), as well as a second-team all-NCAC player (Brandon Johnson).  Collectively, the returning veterans bring with them 62.5% of the offense, 58.9% of the rebounding, and 64.1% of the minutes of a season ago.  These players averaged 55.0 points and 22.2 rebounds per game, a decent base upon which to build.

The Scots list seven first-year players on their pre-season roster, although two of them (Kaleb Reed and Marcus Mitchell) were not in uniform for the intrasquad scrimmage Sunday.  Most of the attention seems to be on 6'5"/195 forward Bryan Wickliffe, an honorable mention All-Ohio player in Div. 1 as a senior at Columbus St. Charles.  As noted, Wickliffe sat out the scrimmage, ostensibly with an injury.  The two frosh who appeared to log the most playing time in the scrimmage were forwards Matt Cameron (6'5"/175) and Ian Franks (6'3"/175), both of whom played aggressively and looked good at times, but clearly would benefit from substantial time in the weight room.  (This advice applies doubly to 6'6"/160 forward Eric Fertig.)  Guard Kevin Truitt (5'11/165) also saw considerable PT, but the depth chart for guards is much more formidable than for frontcourt players, so I expect Truitt will spend the season on the JV squad.

*The non-returning underclassmen are Jake Johnson (transfer to Bridgewater, Va.), Jason Ronyak (transfer to CWRU), Dex Battista (transfer to Grand Valley St.), and Nick Hershberger, whose whereabouts I do not know (seinfeld?).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on October 30, 2007, 01:13:07 PM
Hershberger is at Muskingum I'm pretty sure. And DC, your observation about Kaleb Reed not playing would make sense, considering he is still on the football team as far as I know, so I'm not sure who Wooster Booster thought was Reed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 30, 2007, 02:20:24 PM
Graduation losses have ravaged Wittenberg (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/roster07-08.html), who returns just 41.5% of its scoring (29.4 ppg), 35.3% of its rebounding (13.0 rpg), and 41.2% of its minutes from a 22-5 squad of a season ago.  Gone are four starters, including All-American and three-time All-NCAC honoree Dane Borchers, the 2007 conference leader in rebounding and blocked shots and fourth-leading scorer.  The lone returning starter is junior guard Gregg Hill (11.6 ppg), the top three-point shooter in conference play last year (.534 in NCAC games, .429 overall).  Hill is joined by four veterans who averaged at least 11 minutes per game last season:  senior wings Brandan Barabino (6'4", 5.8 ppg, 2.7 rpg, the team's top returning rebounder) and Brandon White (6'0", 2.9 ppg, 2.0 rpg), 6'2" junior wing Kevin Murray (3.4 ppg), and 5'8" sophomore G/W David Nowicki (3.2 ppg, 1.5 apg, 1.8 A/TO) who is, aside from Hill, the only returnee to have started any games last season (5 starts).

Consistent with Bill Brown's usual practice, the balance of the varsity roster is not expected to be released until the last possible moment before the season starts.  Witt4ever (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4200.msg732579#msg732579) has posted a couple of articles from the Springfield News-Sun (http://zeke.phpnet.us/wittbb.html) that list the program recruits and suggest two to watch are 6'7"/205 forward Lewis Buzzard (Columbus/Franklin Heights) and 5'10"/160 guard Derrick Hannon (Shawnee). 

While it seems on paper that Wittenberg has considerable rebuilding to do, it should be noted that this is the most successful program in D3 history, one that has won at least 18 games every year under Bill Brown and has not suffered a losing season in over a half-century (8-12 in 1955-56).  I wouldn't be too hasty in writing them off just yet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 30, 2007, 02:26:52 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on October 30, 2007, 01:13:07 PM
Hershberger is at Muskingum I'm pretty sure. And DC, your observation about Kaleb Reed not playing would make sense, considering he is still on the football team as far as I know, so I'm not sure who Wooster Booster thought was Reed.

Thanks.  Muskingum hasn't posted a roster as yet, but as they are relatively nearby I manage to catch them two or three times a year;  I look forward to seeing him dominate the OAC.  :) 

Wooster Booster didn't claim to see Reed at the scrimmage; quite the opposite:
Quote from: Wooster Booster on October 29, 2007, 04:29:27 PMLocal product Kaleb Reed (Northwestern High School) didn't seem to be there at all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on October 30, 2007, 02:43:35 PM
DC,

My bad about Wooster Booster's comment on Reed. At a quick glance I thought he meant he didn't do anything worthwhile at the scrimmage, but instead he noted that Reed just wasn't there.

I don't think you can draw any conclusions whatsoever from early season scrimmages. For proof that what you do as a freshman doesn't dictate what kind of player you become is Tim Vandervaart and Rodney Mitchell, who were both JV players as freshmen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 30, 2007, 08:32:30 PM
I think you can tell an awful lot from a scrimmage; it's certainly one of the major reasons that schools partake in them.  I hope that I'm wrong, but I'll stand by my observation that none of the freshmen that saw action this past Saturday will make much of a varsity contribution this season.  Now, that's not saying that some of them won't develop into fine players in a year or two, a la Mitchell and Darth.  It's just that they didn't look, at the moment, ready to play well at this level.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 30, 2007, 08:55:49 PM
Allegheny (http://www.allegheny.edu/athletics/menbb/roster.php), fourth place finishers last season at 8-8 (12-13 overall), lost just two senior starters and three role players in the offseason, and returns approximately three quarters of its 2007 productivity for a run at the 2008 NCAC title.  Gone to graduation are all-conference honoree Jimmy Savage (7.7 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 2.3 apg, 1.8 A/TO) and part-time starter Casey McCloskey (8.2 ppg, 13 starts), but the Gators bring back their top two scorers (Bill Babe [10.7] and Ryan Hollihan [10.6]) and top three rebounders (Hollihan [5.6], George Raftis [4.4], and Ben Torsney [4.2]).  Both Babe, a senior guard, and Hollihan, a 6'8" junior forward, earned all-conference honors last year.  Overall, the Gators return four players with significant starting experience, and eight players who averaged at least 12 minutes per game; collectively, the returnees accounted for 74.1% (52.4 ppg) of last year's offense, 79.8% (26.4) of the rebounding, and 72.4% of the minutes. 

There are no first-years listed on the roster, which may indicate either that there are none in the program (which seems unlikely) or that the roster is still under development (the posted roster is headed "2006-07", but the classes are all updated and last year's seniors are gone).  There are, however, five upperclassmen on the roster who have not been issued uniform numbers and did not log varsity minutes last season.  That brings the total list of upperclassmen to an astonishing 17 players, giving head coach Rob Clune lots of choices even if the recruiting cupboard is bare.  Clune will be joined this season by new assistant coach Matt Drahos, who some may remember was an all-American standout at Bethany College, where he (and his twin brother Mike) were also honored as Academic All-Americans. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 30, 2007, 09:12:13 PM
Eight of the rosters, or parts thereof, are now posted; only Hiram and Earlham are still displaying 2006-07 rosters on their websites.  Here's the blurbs for these teams as currently posted on the conference website:

QuoteEarlham's top returning scorer is Tristain Gregory, who finished last season with a 12.8 scoring average. Eight letterwinners and three starters return for 10th year head coach Jeff Justus. The Quakers look to replace the loss of first-team All-NCAC player Markous Jewett to graduation.

Second team All-NCAC forward Mike McDevitt is the top returnee as he heads into his senior campaign for Hiram. He will have a lot of new players around him as 16 newcomers, including 13 freshman, are on the roster.

I've posted my quick thoughts on each of the eight posted rosters.  Based on those, here's my preliminary guess at the conference race:
1.  Wooster
2.  Ohio Wesleyan
3.  Wabash
4.  Wittenberg
5.  Kenyon
6.  Allegheny
7.  Oberlin
8.  Earlham
9.  Hiram
10. Denison
I find it difficult to pick against Wooster (perhaps showing a bias, perhaps not), especially when they have one confirmed all-American and another (Brandon Johnson) who may get there, but I think the top six teams could each beat the others on any given night.  I am very reluctant to drop Wittenberg all the way to fourth, but it's hard to pick them higher when they appear to be so dependent on first-years I know nothing about.  Hiram and Denison look on paper like programs in disarray; hopefully they'll prove me wrong on the court.  The X-factor in the entire race may be how well Gary Simkus performs in his return to the hardwood.  Overall this may shape up as the best conference race in many years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on October 31, 2007, 09:14:46 AM
If it was the case that Wickliffe, Mitchell and Reed didn't play in that first scrimmage, then that is probably three of the top four incoming players, so there is a long way to go before judging the depth of this freshmen group. Hopefully we will see Wickliffe and Mitchell Friday, with Reed shortly after football is over.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 31, 2007, 07:50:07 PM
DC -

Instead of 13-3 or 14-2, though, you would think second would have a record of 10-6, perhaps. 11-5 tops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 01, 2007, 10:08:01 AM
Quote from: smedindy on October 31, 2007, 07:50:07 PM
DC -

Instead of 13-3 or 14-2, though, you would think second would have a record of 10-6, perhaps. 11-5 tops.

No, I don't think so.  I think the bottom four, and especially the bottom two, are going to lose a lot of games.  If you think, as I do, that the top 6 teams will be heavily favored to win all of their games with the bottom 4 teams, then your starting point for record construction is 6 wins for Witt, 7 each for Wooster, OWU, Wabash, and Allegheny, and 8 for Kenyon.  To get from there to 10-6 requires a losing record against the other top teams.  Since they can't all have losing records against each other (i.e., gotta be .500 as a group), it follows that I don't think 10-6 will be nearly good enough for 2nd. 

There may, of course, be instances where a bottom-4 team beats a top-6 team, but I think this will only happen a handful of times this year, probably with fingers to spare.  But say this group wins a healthy 20% of its 42 games against the top group.  That's 8 or 9 wins, and it means that the top group wins an aggregate of 61-62 games, an average of more than 10 per team.  That makes it very hard for 10 to be good enough for 2nd place--more likely 3rd or 4th in this scenario.

Rather than 8 or 9 wins by the bottom vs. the top, however, I think it'll be more like 3 or 4.  Accordingly, the way I see it, 8-8 is only going to be good enough for 6th place, and the top three teams will each win at least 12 games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 01, 2007, 10:19:28 AM
I'm going to work this out...

And I did.

I came up with (purely speculation, with history on how some teams get other teams' goats):

Wooster 14-2 (L at Witt and Wabash)
Wabash 11-5 (L at Kenyon, Wooster, Oberlin, Earlham, and OWU)
Witt 10-6 (L Wabash X 2 at Gheny, OWU, Wooster, and Kenyon)
Kenyon 10-6 (L OWU X2, at Wooster, Witt, Oberlin and Hiram)
OWU 10-6 (L Wooster X2, at Wabash, Witt, Earlham, and Gheny)

Allegheny 7-9
Earlham 6-10
Oberlin 5-11
Hiram 4-12
Denison 3-13
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 01, 2007, 11:22:20 AM
I hope you're right about Wooster losing at Wabash, but this seems like a good time to mention that Wabash has never beaten Wooster at Chadwick as a member of the NCAC (Wabash did beat Al Van Wie's Scots at Chadwick in 1975).  History is definitely not on the LG's side.  :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 01, 2007, 12:55:58 PM
No time like the present, Wally. This may be the year. Of course, Cooper could go insane against us as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 01, 2007, 12:58:31 PM
Here's what the coaches think (http://www.northcoast.org/bkbmediaday/coach0708.pdf):

1.  Wooster [8]...98
2.  OWU [1]...90
3.  Wittenberg [1]...78
4.  Wabash...73
5.  Kenyon...55
6.  Allegheny...54
7.  Hiram...33
8.  Earlham...30
9.  Oberlin...20
10. Denison...19

No love for Oberlin from the coaches!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 01, 2007, 01:03:19 PM
Wabash almost pulled it off last year despite having no business of being anywhere near that loaded Wooster team.   Wabash looks to be improved this year, Wooster is definitely not as stacked as they were last year...could be Wabash's chance to finally get one at home against those guys.  There's a lot of hoops to be played between now and then...and a lot of football left to be played before the hoops.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 01, 2007, 01:15:38 PM
Too bad you can't see how the 1st place votes broke down.  Is it correct that coaches can't vote for themselves?  So, did Moore send his vote OWU's direction?  And who voted for Witt?

David, your prediction turned out to almost mirror the coaches predictions with the exception of Wabash and Witt being reversed and the coaches apparantly being higher on Hiram than you were and not so much with regards to Oberlin.

And smed, as far as your predictions of Wooster losses, I would say recent history would suggest Witt would beat Wooster at Timken and not at the HPER.  And as Wally pointed out, the same could be said for Wabash as they haven't beaten Wooster at home since joining the NCAC.  Although, it's not as though the games at Chadwick have all been easy.  And I would expect the LG's to give the Scots all they can handle this year as well!

Quote from: wally_wabash on November 01, 2007, 01:03:19 PM
Wabash almost pulled it off last year despite having no business of being anywhere near that loaded Wooster team.   Wabash looks to be improved this year, Wooster is definitely not as stacked as they were last year...could be Wabash's chance to finally get one at home against those guys.  There's a lot of hoops to be played between now and then...and a lot of football left to be played before the hoops.   :)
The only football I'm still following still is following Michigan's improbable run to a Big 10 Championship and Rose Bowl birth and an even more improbable run to a playoff spot by the Cleveland Browns! 8) :P

Still, good luck to the Lil Giants on their march to the playoffs and do the NCAC proud once you get there!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 01, 2007, 01:41:21 PM
Thanks, ScotsFan. I only wish I was close by this year to see the action at Chadwick. It's always fun when there's a football / basketball DH thanks to a playoff home game. I see one again this year.

And I'm sure Marian wouldn't mind moving the Nov. 8 game after we roll past Mt. Union and into the Final 4 in football...

...oh, wait...sorry, irrational exuberance!  :D ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 01, 2007, 02:17:40 PM
Hey, this has been a crazy year in college football across the board.  Appy State beats #5 Michigan.  Stanford beats #1 USC.  Trinity uses 300+ laterals on the last play of the game to beat Millsaps!  Maybe Wabash over MUC can add another improbable chapter in what has become a year of improbables.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 01, 2007, 03:28:58 PM
d3 preseason poll is out:

8.  Woo

(37) Witt [31 votes]
(40) OWU [24 votes]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 01, 2007, 03:44:15 PM
Wow, no offense to Witt this year, but I can't see how they can get votes except for the people who automatically rank Witt just because they are Witt.

Of course, this young Witt team may surprise, but still...who knows with them!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on November 01, 2007, 04:11:16 PM
That's 37th. They could still be the 37th-best team yet not be great.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 01, 2007, 04:26:54 PM
The NCAC media poll (http://www.northcoast.org/bkbmediaday/bkbpolls0708.pdf) is out, and appears thusly:
1.  Wooster (20)...218
2.  Ohio Wesleyan (2)...192
3.  Wittenberg...174
4.  Wabash...142
5.  Allegheny...130
6.  Kenyon...128
7.  Hiram...75
8.  Earlham...59
9.  Oberlin...50
10. Denison...42
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 01, 2007, 07:28:03 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on November 01, 2007, 04:11:16 PM
That's 37th. They could still be the 37th-best team yet not be great.

I can see them being the 37th best team or so, but obviously some voters put them in the top 20 or 25.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 05, 2007, 10:33:31 AM
Well, dang it, I missed Friday's scrimmage between Wooster and Defiance and was hoping to get some insight on here as to how it went.  Didn't any posters attend?  If so, spurt it out! :)  Who won?  Who played and how much?  Who looked good?  Did Wickliffe play?  C'mon, spill it! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 05, 2007, 05:17:33 PM
Wooster won by 13 or something. Easily won the first half. Then they reset the score for the second half, and Defiance won by about 6 points. Cooper worked his magic, and had several assists. Everyone else had their moments, but still have some improvement.

Defiance was very athletic and could very well win the HCAC this year. Wooster's interior players had some trouble getting offensive position against their quick defenders. Will have to work on that. Wickliffe was back with a wrap on his left elbow. Showed that he is athletic, but didn't do much.

Overall, I would grade the Scots at a B or B+ for the scrimmage. If the big men can improve their footwork and defensive position, then Wooster is good to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 05, 2007, 10:40:36 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on November 05, 2007, 05:17:33 PM
Defiance was very athletic and could very well win the HCAC this year.

Defiance is more or less a co-favorite (with Franklin), according to their coaches' poll (http://www.heartlandconf.org/conference_releases/2007/10_30_mbball_preseason.htm).  Interestingly, Bluffton, picked to finish 5th in that nine-team league, reportedly (according to poster RO_24) (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=3706.msg798485#msg798485) beat Wittenberg in a scrimmage in Springfield on Saturday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 06, 2007, 10:39:01 AM
However, I don't know how much weight I put in scrimmages. It's a good way to get a lot of people game action, and I think some coaches will let everyone get time and work on some floor combinations.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 06, 2007, 03:04:13 PM
Tell it to Tom Izzo, smeds.  Izzo has his team dressing down in a weight room after they lost their exhibition/scrimmage to GVSU.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 06, 2007, 03:55:06 PM
Well, that was an 'exhibition', not a scrimmage. And yeah, the way MSU played, they deserved it.

(Is there a difference between an exhibition and a scrimmage in the eyes of the NCAA? )
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 06, 2007, 05:36:23 PM
Congratulations to James Cooper of Wooster on being named to the D3Hoops preseason All America First Team.  Some well deserved recognition for Cooper!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 07, 2007, 10:05:52 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 06, 2007, 03:04:13 PM
Tell it to Tom Izzo, smeds.  Izzo has his team dressing down in a weight room after they lost their exhibition/scrimmage to GVSU.   :)
You can add Thad Matta to the list as fellow D-II and GLIAC member Findlay knocked off Ohio State 70-68 in an exhibition last night! ;D

Wooster will take on GLIAC member Ashland on Saturday in a scrimmage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 07, 2007, 10:21:59 AM
The gulf between the majors and mid-majors in D-1 has diminished greatly, but now I guess the D-2 teams are getting closer as well, thanks to scholarship reductions.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 07, 2007, 10:26:46 AM
Yikes...exhibitions or not, there's no way that top half Big Ten teams can be losing to D-II schools.  This bodes ill for the Big Ten...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 07, 2007, 12:33:39 PM
I just thank goodness for D-3. I know our athletes aren't all boy scouts, but they seem to be relatively few problems in the NCAC in regards to athlete tomfoolery and coaches 'phoning it in' as it were.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 11, 2007, 05:08:35 PM
Wooster came out on the short end of the score over at DII Ashland on Saturday night - something in the neighborhood of 12-15 points.  After falling behind by about a dozen early they fought back to a halftime tie.  However, Ashland opened up a lead to open the second half and pretty much maintained it throughout.  Ashland shot the ball very well all night, especially from the guard positions.

Craig Elam didn't play, although he was on the bench in warmups and did shoot around before the game.  Hopefully whatever ails him is minor, because his muscle inside was definitely missed.  Will, Melick, and freshman Bryan Wickliffe worked hard in the paint, but this is where the Scots are going to live or die this season against the tougher teams.

Ashland's guards were small, but quick, and Wooster had trouble beating them off the dribble.  Still, the drive-and-kick was working, especially when Devin Fulk was on the receiving end, and he must have made 6 or 7 threes.  Although he's not polished, Wickliffe showed some ability to score inside.  All in all, though, too many turnovers and an inability to get second shots probably hurt the Scots the most.  Next up, the real thing on Friday night.

Lineup Predictions:

Starting Lineup
Point Guard - Brandon Johnson
Shooting Guard - James Cooper
Small Forward - Marty Bidwell
Post - Evan Will
Post - Rob Melick

Others in an Eight-Man Rotation
Devin Fulk, Craig Elam, and Bryan Wickliffe

Minutes played in competitive games barring foul trouble
Brandon Johnson - 33
James Cooper - 33
Evan Will - 26
Rob Melick - 24
Marty Bidwell - 29
Devin Fulk - 25
Craig Elam - 15
Bryan Wickliffe - 15


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 12, 2007, 01:04:37 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 11, 2007, 05:08:35 PM
Craig Elam didn't play, although he was on the bench in warmups and did shoot around before the game.  Hopefully whatever ails him is minor, because his muscle inside was definitely missed. 

...

Lineup Predictions:

Starting Lineup
Point Guard - Brandon Johnson
Shooting Guard - James Cooper
Small Forward - Marty Bidwell
Post - Evan Will
Post - Rob Melick

Others in an Eight-Man Rotation
Devin Fulk, Craig Elam, and Bryan Wickliffe


I heard that Elam tweaked his knee in an inter-squad scrimmage last week.  Not sure about the prognosis, but it doesn't sound like its too bad.

I would think that we'll see Dustin Geitgey again making a contribution off the bench. He played about 6 min per game last year and I would expect at least the same this year.

Has anyone heard anything about Kaleb Reed?  Now that the football season is over, is he still planning to play basketball?

Go Scots!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 12, 2007, 03:23:57 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on October 30, 2007, 02:20:24 PM
Graduation losses have ravaged Wittenberg (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/roster07-08.html), who returns just 41.5% of its scoring (29.4 ppg), 35.3% of its rebounding (13.0 rpg), and 41.2% of its minutes from a 22-5 squad of a season ago.  Gone are four starters, including All-American and three-time All-NCAC honoree Dane Borchers, the 2007 conference leader in rebounding and blocked shots and fourth-leading scorer.  The lone returning starter is junior guard Gregg Hill (11.6 ppg), the top three-point shooter in conference play last year (.534 in NCAC games, .429 overall).  Hill is joined by four veterans who averaged at least 11 minutes per game last season:  senior wings Brandan Barabino (6’4”, 5.8 ppg, 2.7 rpg, the team’s top returning rebounder) and Brandon White (6’0”, 2.9 ppg, 2.0 rpg), 6’2” junior wing Kevin Murray (3.4 ppg), and 5’8” sophomore G/W David Nowicki (3.2 ppg, 1.5 apg, 1.8 A/TO) who is, aside from Hill, the only returnee to have started any games last season (5 starts).

Consistent with Bill Brown’s usual practice, the balance of the varsity roster is not expected to be released until the last possible moment before the season starts.  Witt4ever (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4200.msg732579#msg732579) has posted a couple of articles from the Springfield News-Sun (http://zeke.phpnet.us/wittbb.html) that list the program recruits and suggest two to watch are 6’7”/205 forward Lewis Buzzard (Columbus/Franklin Heights) and 5’10”/160 guard Derrick Hannon (Shawnee). 

While it seems on paper that Wittenberg has considerable rebuilding to do, it should be noted that this is the most successful program in D3 history, one that has won at least 18 games every year under Bill Brown and has not suffered a losing season in over a half-century (8-12 in 1955-56).  I wouldn’t be too hasty in writing them off just yet.


The varsity roster (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/roster07-08.html) is now up.  Four first-years made the varsity:  Buzzard and Hannon, as anticipated above, as well as Jeff Lee, a 6'7"/195 forward out of Groveport Madison, and Kyle Peterson, a 6'1"/170 wing from Caledonia River Valley.

The Tigers open the season Friday at Wheaton (IL) College's Pfund Classic, facing Benedictine (12-14 last year).  On Saturday they'll face either Kalamazoo (5-19) or the host Thunder (17-9).  Facing Wheaton on their home court would be a good early-season test for the rebuilding/reloading Tiger squad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 12, 2007, 03:26:16 PM
I think that the better part of Geitgey's minutes last year were obtained in bench-clearing sessions and I suspect that that will again be the case.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 12, 2007, 04:11:50 PM
BTW - Wabash now lists Andy Root as a sophomore. I guess his first year, when he left Wabash to go to IU (for a GIRL, if I heard right...yeesh...) didn't count.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 13, 2007, 10:15:21 AM
Zach Bollinger of the Wooster Daily Record previews the Scots:
   Team of the 2000s, Scots Look to Continue Success (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/2846042)
and the conference race:
   NCAC Preview: Even Without Port, Scots will be Tough to Beat (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/2845801)
in today's paper.

In the conference preview article, which features a capsule look at each team, he mentions the following regarding Wittenberg:
Quote from: Zach BollingerTrent Schwaub (sic) is the most intriguing newcomer. Schaub (sic), the twin brother of four-time first-team NCAC selection Travis Schwaub (sic) (Ohio Wesleyan, 2001-04), decided against college right out of high school but will suit up for the Tigers this season.
Schwab does not appear on Witt's varsity roster (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/roster07-08.html) and is not listed or mentioned in the season outlook (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/preview07-08.html), so I'm not sure what to think.  Too bad if it turns out to be inaccurate; it'd be a great story!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 13, 2007, 11:34:58 AM
DC,

I see a name on the Wittenberg roster that is familiar. Tim Beck, a junior forward. If my memory serves me correctly, he was a fairly strong recruit of Wittenberg's two years ago. I guess he left school, and now he is back. Here is a little note about him from the Daily Dose two years ago:

http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/2005/06/25/the-latest-on-the-recruiting-trail/

Interesting how a bogus twin brother of Schwab appears in the season outlook, but not a real big man named Beck (who I also believe may be related to a Beck that played at Earlham in the past).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 13, 2007, 12:25:57 PM
Schwab's twin brother is indeed bogus, as I have confirmed with my source in Springfield.  It was intended as a joke, but Zach Bollinger evidently fell for it and somehow was unable to find out the truth of the matter.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 13, 2007, 02:59:34 PM
When I first read that article, my first thought was why hadn't we heard of Schwab's twin brother before now?  And my second thought was if he was even half the player that Travis was, how could DeWitt not have landed both of them.  They really would have made for a formidable front-court.  :o

But, now I know why we had never heard of this twin brother before now.  Because he never exhisted! :P

So, was Travis the one to leak this info about his 'mythical' twin brother?  And was it done as merely a joke, or was it more of a psychological ploy to psyche out the rest of the league to think that coach Brown and the Tigers were holding an ace or two up their sleeves??? ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on November 13, 2007, 05:28:41 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on November 13, 2007, 11:34:58 AM
DC,

I see a name on the Wittenberg roster that is familiar. Tim Beck, a junior forward. If my memory serves me correctly, he was a fairly strong recruit of Wittenberg's two years ago. I guess he left school, and now he is back. Here is a little note about him from the Daily Dose two years ago:

http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/2005/06/25/the-latest-on-the-recruiting-trail/

Interesting how a bogus twin brother of Schwab appears in the season outlook, but not a real big man named Beck (who I also believe may be related to a Beck that played at Earlham in the past).

Beck missed last year with an ACL. Romero returns after sitting out last year with an achilles injury. Caraway quits again and this time does not return, reportedly enrolled at Wright State due to money issues.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 13, 2007, 05:36:22 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 13, 2007, 02:59:34 PM
So, was Travis the one to leak this info about his 'mythical' twin brother?  And was it done as merely a joke, or was it more of a psychological ploy to psyche out the rest of the league to think that coach Brown and the Tigers were holding an ace or two up their sleeves??? ;)

I know you're kidding, but just for the record I'll say that there certainly was no hidden agenda or subterfuge involved.  I wasn't there when the joke was delivered (evidently during the media day conference call two weeks ago), but I have no reason to suspect that it was anything other than an attempt at humor, probably of the self-depricating variety.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 13, 2007, 07:14:42 PM
Wooster opens the season Friday, hosting the Al Van Wie/Rotary Classic with Farmingdale St., Otterbein, and St. Thomas. 

Farmingdale  (http://www.farmingdalesports.com/sports/mbkb/index)was 18-10 last season, finishing tied for fourth in the Skyline Conference.  As far as I can tell, there has not been a preseason poll done for the conference, but the Rams seem to be among the conference favorites.  As far as I can tell, the Rams have never played in Wooster before, nor have ever faced the Scots.

Otterbein  (http://www.otterbein.edu/athletics/Mbasketball/mbasketball.htm)had a strong team last season, finishing 16-11 and losing to Capital in the OAC semifinals.  They must find a way to replace all-America (http://www.d3hoops.com/tow/07/menallam07.htm) center Tyler Ousley, however, and are projected by the OAC coaches (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4292.msg800692#msg800692) to finish a distant 8th this season.  The Cardinals last appeared in Wooster as part of the 2003 Van Wie Classic, where they defeated Brockport St. and lost to Wooster.

St. Thomas (http://www.tommiesports.com/mbb/) spent the entire 2006-07 season in the D3Hoops.com top 10, and claimed both the regular season and tournament titles in the MIAC.  They received a bye in the first round of the NCAA tournament, but were ousted by surprising Carroll College.  UST finished the season 24-4 and ranked 10th.  The Tommies featured two all-Americans (http://www.d3hoops.com/tow/07/menallam07.htm) in Isaac Rosefelt and Bryan Schnettler, both of whom are playing professionally this season.  Without these stars, the Tommies have been projected to finish 3rd (http://www.miac-online.org/News/mbball/2007/11/2/mbbpoll07.asp?path=mbball) in the MIAC this season.  They did, however, receive 18 points in the preseason D3Hoops.com top 25 poll (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/), the equivalent of a ranking of #42.  St. Thomas last visited Wooster for the 2005 Van Wie Classic, falling in overtime to UW-Stout and handily defeating Kalamazoo to take third place. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 14, 2007, 12:00:22 PM
Is anyone planning on setting up an NCAC weekly "Pick-em" this year?  Getting close to start-up time. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 14, 2007, 02:06:13 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 14, 2007, 12:00:22 PM
Is anyone planning on setting up an NCAC weekly "Pick-em" this year?  Getting close to start-up time. :)

I was going to ask too, but I figured the person that mentioned it first would get the job!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 14, 2007, 03:28:39 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on November 14, 2007, 02:06:13 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 14, 2007, 12:00:22 PM
Is anyone planning on setting up an NCAC weekly "Pick-em" this year?  Getting close to start-up time. :)

I was going to ask too, but I figured the person that mentioned it first would get the job!!

You must have missed the memo - this year the second to bring it up is elected! ;D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 14, 2007, 03:43:18 PM
Funny.  I got a different memo entirely.  Said something about having the initials "D.C." as being the main requirement... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 14, 2007, 04:42:53 PM
Yeah, okay, I guess it's my turn in the barrel again.  I'll sod something up over in the pickem room.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 15, 2007, 10:41:20 AM
The preview for this weekend's Al Van Wie/Wooster Rotary Classic has been posted on Wooster's website: http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2007-08/van_wie.php

In lieu of admission, canned/boxed food items will be collected at the door by the Wooster Rotary for the People to People Food Pantry.  http://pages.sssnet.com/rotaryclub/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 15, 2007, 12:00:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 14, 2007, 04:42:53 PM
Yeah, okay, I guess it's my turn in the barrel again.  I'll sod something up over in the pickem room.
I was hoping someone would step up to the plate!!!  ;)  I will gladly relinquish my duties at running the Pick'em! ;D

And, just for the record, yes I was just kidding about the hidden agenda thing. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 15, 2007, 05:54:25 PM
About 24 hours to the opening tip!  ;D ;D ;D

I hope ScotsFan, Witt4Ever, TigerUp07, Wally, LG, Seinfeld, Mr. Ypsi, Billy, EarlhamAlum, and everyone else out there (especially newcomers and/or folks from the "Forgotten Four"--Allegheny, Hiram, Oberlin, OWU) are planning to join us in the Pick 'Em competition (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4044.msg809981#msg809981) this year.  There's 23 points at stake in Week 1, so if you miss out it'll be tough to catch up later in the year.  Come log your picks, and I hope to see all of you at an NCAC gym soon!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2007, 10:32:53 AM
Here's Zach Bollinger's preview of tonight's game (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/2862172) vs. Farmingdale, published in today's Daily Record, and complete with the following addendum:

Quote from: Wooster Daily RecordEDITOR'S NOTE: Due to erroneous information provided by Wittenberg head coach Bill Brown during conference media day, it was reported in Tuesday's NCAC men's basketball preview that the Tiger roster would include newcomer Trent Schwab. It was, apparently, Brown's attempt at humor and was not intended for publication.

Trent Schwab does not exist. However, Travis, a four-time first-team NCAC selection, will be an assistant to Brown at Wittenberg this season.

::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 16, 2007, 10:42:19 AM
I think that someone could pull the Plainfield Teacher's College gag on the Daily Record
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 16, 2007, 10:55:08 AM
Alright, I'm about to OD on football...so I'll take a quick hoops respite.  I'm looking forward to catching the LGs opener tonight.  There seems to be quite a bit of buzz around this squad.  Lots of returning players, Zimmer is getting some national recognition, Simkus is back, and there is quite a bit of noise being drummed up about a freshmen who played in high school with Oden and Conley over in Indianapolis.  I'm anxious to see how it all comes together. 

What I'm not anxious to see are NCCAA and NAIA schools.  These games essentially do not count for Wabash for any sort of tournament resumé they may want to build.  Bordered on the immediate east by the HCAC, CCIW on the west, and MIAA to the north, there are plenty of D3 schools around that I think Wabash should be filling its invitationals with D3 teams (preferably in-region).  I realize that the problem here is that 2 out of every 3 D3 schools are hosting a tipoff tournament/classic of some sort and there just aren't enough teams to go around, but I'd really like to see Wabash schedule at least two other D3s for these events.  Perhaps scheduling multiple years in advance would help?  How far in advance does Wooster schedule its Mose Hole and Van Wie invitationals?  Wooster always seems to have good D3 fields for those events. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2007, 12:59:16 PM
REMINDER

For those interested in the NCAC Pick 'ems competition (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4044.msg809981#msg809981), Week 1 picks must be posted (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4044.msg809981#msg809981) by 3:30 PM this afternoon (time of the Denison[w]/Salisbury tipoff). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash83 on November 16, 2007, 02:18:37 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 16, 2007, 10:55:08 AM
What I'm not anxious to see are NCCAA and NAIA schools.  These games essentially do not count for Wabash for any sort of tournament resumé they may want to build.  Bordered on the immediate east by the HCAC, CCIW on the west, and MIAA to the north, there are plenty of D3 schools around that I think Wabash should be filling its invitationals with D3 teams (preferably in-region).  I realize that the problem here is that 2 out of every 3 D3 schools are hosting a tipoff tournament/classic of some sort and there just aren't enough teams to go around, but I'd really like to see Wabash schedule at least two other D3s for these events.  Perhaps scheduling multiple years in advance would help?  How far in advance does Wooster schedule its Mose Hole and Van Wie invitationals?  Wooster always seems to have good D3 fields for those events. 

Wally, I agree.  I did look and it appears that Wabash had posted on the open dates message board back in early October, 2006 trying to find teams for this year's Tip-Off Classic.  While I think that such boards serve a purpose, I would also think that you resort to them after you have tried other, more direct approaches to teams.  I wonder if this has more to do with an attempt to find good "early season" competition to allow the team to get some minutes under its belt versus trying to find good competition in general.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 16, 2007, 02:40:06 PM
One one hand, though,  Wabash and Marian have had played each other quite a bit in hoops, and I think the Knights help out the LG's prepare for the NCAC. But this year's tip-off is a bit...um...odd.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 16, 2007, 02:49:13 PM
Marian busted up our massive home win streak in the late 90s [/grumble]. 

I don't mind the occasional NAIA game...Wooster and Witt typically play one or two every season.  Most teams do.  But to be out of place at your own home tournament isn't right. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 16, 2007, 09:10:09 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 49  Farmingdale 32

Wooster comes out firing on all cylinders offensively led by their 3 returning starters.  :)  Leading the Scots are All-American James Cooper with 14 points, Brandon Johnson with 14 points and Evan Will with 8 points.

Wooster made 8 of 14 three pointers in the first half and overall shot 56% from the floor.  ;D

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on November 16, 2007, 09:37:40 PM
Wittenberg loses their opener to Benedictine 79-74.  Witt gets a game high 24 from Gregg Hill on 10-22 shooting (as if there was any doubt as to who the main offensive catalyst for this team was going to be), and a nice 12 from Jeromy Romero off the bench, but it was not enough for the Tigers, as Benedictine had 5 players in double figures.  Witt actually trailed by 13 at halftime, and got it as close as 3 with 3 seconds left.  Witt never led in the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 16, 2007, 09:40:35 PM
Wooster has had 22 turnovers so far with over 8 minutes left.  Ouch, but I guess that stat is not surprising for a first game of the season.

Wooster still has a comfortable 73-54 lead.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 16, 2007, 10:03:40 PM
Final:  Wooster 106  Farmingdale State 81

Wooster was led by James Cooper with 19 points, Marty Bidwell with 19 points, Brandon Johnson with 18 points, freshman Bryan Wicklliffe with 11 points, Devin Fulk with 10 points and Evan Will also with 10 points.

Farmingdale State Rams were led by Damien Santana with 23 points and Erastus Shannon with 10 points.

Wooster shot 50% from the floor tonight, made 14 three pointers and outrebounded Farmingdale 49 to 29.

Nice opening win for the Scots. :)  Wooster will face St. Thomas (MN) tomorrow night in the Championship game of the Al Van Wie Tourney
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 16, 2007, 10:13:27 PM
Earlham 87,
Lake Erie 84
:o


per Earlham Web site...no final stats yet


color me shocked, surprised and every other adjective you can come up with...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 16, 2007, 10:40:44 PM
Other Final Scores:

Allegheny 69  Bethany 68    nice win for the gators
Mount Union 95  Hiram 84    Mike Staley had 25 points for the Pups
Swarthmore 81  Oberlin 62    road loss for Yeomen
Hanover 63  Denison 51    neutral site loss for the Big Red
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 16, 2007, 10:42:07 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on November 16, 2007, 10:13:27 PM
Earlham 87,
Lake Erie 84
:o


per Earlham Web site...no final stats yet


color me shocked, surprised and every other adjective you can come up with...

Great win for the Quakers. Way to go!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2007, 11:02:01 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on November 16, 2007, 10:13:27 PM
Earlham 87,
Lake Erie 84
:o


per Earlham Web site...no final stats yet


color me shocked, surprised and every other adjective you can come up with...

Definitely the upset of the night.  NCAC pride!  Go Quake!  ;D :) 8)

Elsewhere:
* James Cooper reached 1,500 career points with a couple of 1st half free throws this evening.  Congratulations to Coop!
* Denison and Kenyon women both open with nice road (neutral site) victories, DU 54-40 over Salisbury and Kenyon 64-54 over Wesleyan.  (I mention here only because these are games in the pick 'em.)
* Very tough night for Witt.  Not only do the hoopsters lose, but the undefeated and top-ranked volleyballers fell in the national semifinals to Wash. U.   :'(
* Anyone have a score from C'ville yet?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2007, 11:10:55 PM
ATTENTION Pick 'em pickers:  Week 2 games are posted in the pick 'em room.  There's a Monday game (Wabash at Hanover), so we have an early deadline (7:30pm Monday). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 16, 2007, 11:12:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 16, 2007, 11:02:01 PM* Anyone have a score from C'ville yet?

Via text message from Wally_Wabash, the LGs beat Kentucky Christian 96-88.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 16, 2007, 11:39:54 PM
I'm waiting for stats to be posted, but my impressions from Chadwick tonight...

- Wabash really pushed the tempo tonight.  This is a pretty stout departure from the more methodical Wabash teams I've seen in recent years.  I think this style will suit this Wabash team pretty well...the LGs have some solid outside shooters and with Simkus back they've got plenty of size to work the offensive glass.  I don't have the numbers yet, but it seemed like Wabash got a lot of offensive boards tonight. 

- Color me impressed with the new kid on the block.  Wes Smith was a bit tentative at first, but really started to assert himself a bit at the end of the first half and throughout the second half.  He seems like the type of player who has a knack for getting himself open under the basket in loose ball/chaos kinds of situations.  Some players do this and some players don't...it's nice to have one who does.  Smith's Wabash debut ended with a team-high 21 points and 9 rebounds.  Well done. 

- Wabash's play was a little sloppy at times...sometimes because they were pushing too hard and sometimes because they were a little tired. 

- The Chadwick Crazies are in midseason form. 

- Wabash got solid contributions from a lot of players tonight...Aaron Brock looked particularly sharp, Root and Haltom can hurt you if you let them spot up on the perimeter. 

- Fouls were a problem for the LGs tonight...maybe a little too pumped up for the first game.  I was impressed with the depth demonstrated tonight and that depth was necessary because of the pace of the game and the fouls.  Nice to see Wabash has a second unit that can come in without a lot of dropoff. 

All in all, it was a good win for Wabash tonight.  The LGs opened up on fire, KCC battled their way back to grab a lead toward the end of the first half which is about when Smith got going and led Wabash on a run to end the half.  The second half started with Wabash jumping out to a double digit lead and while KCC made a couple of runs, they never really threatened in the second half.  I think Indiana Wesleyan will be a stiffer test tomorrow for Wabash, but I'm expecting Wabash's size to dominate that game. 

All of that and I didn't even mention Zimmer (15 and 8 tonight).   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 16, 2007, 11:46:22 PM
Of course as soon as I post, stats get planted on the web page. 

- Wabash shoots 50% for the game (36-78)
- of Smith's 9 rebounds, eight (eight!) were offensive
- very balanced scoring for Wabash tonight...al 9 players who saw the floor scored and all had between 8 and 21 points except for Li'l Earl who had just the three pointer early in the game
- Wabash won the rebound game 42-32, with an 18-9 edge in offensive rebounds (which translated to a 23-12 edge in 2nd chance points)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 17, 2007, 12:05:48 AM
Pictures (http://www.wabash.edu/photo_album/home.cfm?photo_id=4609&photo_album_id=1388) from the game are posted on the game recap (http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=5239) on the Wabash site. I'll take this time to mention I dig the new unis. Old school. No fancy schmancy stripes or piping. Just a big "Wabash" on the jersey and a big "W" on the shorts. Fantastic looking.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 17, 2007, 12:32:10 AM
I knew you'd dig the new unis, LG.  I'm definitely a fan of the big block "Wabash" on the front and the simple double-stripe trim.  It's a good look for the LGs this year. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on November 17, 2007, 09:17:07 AM
Quaker pride...please QUAKER pride.

Let us never reference that strange name that has creeped over into a few other athletic programs at Earlham.

Anyway, a career high 34 points for Tristian Gregory and 22, including the game-winner for Neil Collins.

According to now assistant coach Markous Jewett, "(Lake Erie) just kept running and jumping (defense) and we just kept making 3's".

Earlham also wins the rebounding batte, surprising, and kept turnovers in check after a shaky start.

Now, the bad news. Earlham only uses 7 players. It's not even a matter of not having depth, they just barely have players.

It will likely still be a long season, but this was a fun way to kick it off and I'll continue to enjoy it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 17, 2007, 09:52:50 AM
First of all, nice wins for Wabash and especially Earlham!

I wasn't able to attend the Wooster game last night, but I did catch the replay on the tele.  IMO, Marty Bidwell looks like he is ready to be a player this season.  Over his 1st two seasons at Wooster, his primary job was defense as he wasn't really needed on the offensive end of the floor.  But, with the departure of Port and Vandervaart, I had a feeling that Bidwell would look to score more this year and look to score he did last night!  And not only did Bidwell finish tied for the team lead in points, but he also led the team in rebounds and assists!  Sound familiar?  If Wooster can get that kind of production from Bidwell, it could result in some good things for this season.

Other positives were to see the Scots hit the century mark in their first game without Port and Vandervaart and Van Horn.  And they did it with yet another balanced attack as 6 players reached double figures.  And how about local freshman product Kaleb Reed who just joined the Scots basketball team on Monday after football and made an immediate impact scoring 8 points on 3-3 shooting from the floor!

On the negative side, 26 turnovers!!! :o  That's not good!  Hopefully, a lot of that can be attributed to it being the first game and all. 

Also, I'll add the officiating to the negative side of the game!  59 fouls?!  Maybe a lot of that can be attributed to it being the first game as well?! ::)

Well, I'm off now to prepare myself for The Game!  Here's hoping the Maize and Blue can pull one out for Lloyd, Henne, Hart and Long!!! 

GO BLUE!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 17, 2007, 10:42:21 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 16, 2007, 10:55:08 AM
What I'm not anxious to see are NCCAA and NAIA schools.  These games essentially do not count for Wabash for any sort of tournament resumé they may want to build.  Bordered on the immediate east by the HCAC, CCIW on the west, and MIAA to the north, there are plenty of D3 schools around that I think Wabash should be filling its invitationals with D3 teams (preferably in-region).  I realize that the problem here is that 2 out of every 3 D3 schools are hosting a tipoff tournament/classic of some sort and there just aren't enough teams to go around, but I'd really like to see Wabash schedule at least two other D3s for these events.  Perhaps scheduling multiple years in advance would help?  How far in advance does Wooster schedule its Mose Hole and Van Wie invitationals?  Wooster always seems to have good D3 fields for those events. 

I asked Steve Moore about this last night during the Otterbein/St. Thomas game.  He told me that they start working on filling their two tournaments about 18-24 months in advance.  He also told me that it is getting harder and harder to find D3 opponents, due to the plethora of new tip-off and holiday tournaments.  It's tough for everyone; I know that Wittenberg at least briefly considered dropping the Zimmerman Classic (their end-of-year tournament) last year, and didn't Wabash recently drop a year-end confab?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 17, 2007, 04:51:13 PM
Final from Crawfordsville

Indiana Wesleyan 66
Wabash 62

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 17, 2007, 05:35:22 PM
The Pete Thorn isn't happening this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 17, 2007, 08:04:25 PM
Sadly, I'm unable to give any feedback from the Wabash game today....post playoff victory celebration kept me away from the hardcourt this afternoon.  I'm wondering if there wasn't any lingering fatigue effect from last night's sprintfest.  Time will tell...I've still got a really good vibe about this year's Little Giants.  Wabash travels to Hanover on Monday which will be a nice test. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 17, 2007, 08:07:21 PM
Earlham 77 Case Western 72
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 17, 2007, 08:47:02 PM
At the Half:  St. Thomas 38  Wooster 37

St. Thomas actually led this game by 10 points in the half (34-24) before Wooster went on a 13-4 run to close out the half.

Wooster is being led by James Cooper with 12 points, Marty Bidwell with 7 points and Devin Fulk with 7 points.

Leading the scoring for St. Thomas are Joe Scott with 10 points and BJ Viau with 7 points.

St. Thomas made 6 three pointers in the half vs. 4 three pointers for Woo.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 17, 2007, 09:09:53 PM
Last year, Indiana Wesleyan was 30-5 (gotta love (not) those NAIA schedules. Class time, anyone??)

This year they're 7-1 after beating Wabash. I don't think the LGs should hang their heads.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on November 17, 2007, 09:32:40 PM
Wittenberg defeats Kalamazoo 80-72 behind Gregg Hill's second straight 24-point performance.  The difference today is that Hill gets the help he needed, as three other starters score in double digits (Sam Gregory with 16, Brandan Barabino with 13, and Brandon White with 10).  The other main difference came at the free throw line, where the Tigers went 22-30 compared to only 13-20 for Kalamazoo.

The Tigers now stand at 1-1 and play their home opener Tuesday night against Capital.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 17, 2007, 09:38:27 PM
Final:  Wooster 85  St. Thomas 79 :)

Wooster was led by All-American James Cooper with 20 points, Marty Bidwell with 19 points, Devin Fulk with 19 points and Brandon Johnson with 12 points.  Scots win the championship game of the Al Van Wie Tourney.

Leading St. Thomas in scoring was Joe Scott with 15 points, Lonnie Robinson with 15 points, David Baker with 14 pts and BJ Viau with 11 pts.

Wooster shot 55% from the floor and outrebounded the Tommies 30 to 25 to get the victory.

Marty Bidwell wins the Tourney MVP Award; Brandon Johnson gets the Defensive Player Award and James Cooper is on the All Tournament Team

Wooster is now 2-0.  ;D   Scots next play at Lake Erie on 11/25.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 17, 2007, 10:17:14 PM
Other NCAC Final Scores:

Allegheny 68  Salisbury 58    Bill Babe with 16 pts. for the 2-0 Gators

Transylvania 60  Denison 52   Big Red are 0-2

#12 Brandeis 70  Kenyon 61   Bryan Yelvington with 21 pts. for the Lords

Earlham 77  Case Western 72   Tourney MVP Tristian Gregory has 28 points
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 17, 2007, 11:09:49 PM
Also:
Haverford 58, Oberlin 35...rats
Trinity (TX) 64, Ohio Wesleyan 53...yuk
Pick 'em games:
UW-Stevens Point 105, Carroll 72
Penn St.-Behrend 6, Bridgewater (Va.) 46

If there's such a thing as a "good loss," both Kenyon (losing by 9 at #12 Brandeis) and Wabash (losing by 4 to the #5 team in NAIA-2) had them tonight.  Very encouraging results for both squads, IMHO. 

And congratulations to the Kenyon Ladies, who beat #14 Brandeis 67-62 on their home court this afternoon!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 17, 2007, 11:14:31 PM
Trinity (Texas) 64, Ohio Wesleyan 53
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 18, 2007, 12:19:31 PM
If there's one thing I've learned in the last few years of watching Wooster and DIII basketball more closely than before it's the difference in how players improve.  Some barely do.  Some might peak or top out during their sophomore or junior years.  Some show a steady, continual improvement, their whole game, or most of it, rising and making them a better all-around player.  Wooster's Brandon Johnson would fit this last mold.

And then there's the case of the Scot's Marty Bidwell.

As a freshmen, Bidwell's minutes were mostly limited to clean-up time, and as a fan it really wasn't clear what he would eventually be able to do.  He showed some athletic ability, some speed, and that he was hard-nosed.  But he also appeared to be a bit nuts, playing defense in a frenzy, arms swinging wildly about, often-times swinging into the bodies of opposing players.

Last year, Bidwell still came off the bench, but moved into the regular rotation.  He showed that he could shoot the ball some, although surrounded by scorers he certainly wasn't a go-to guy.  You began to see how fast he really was, and he revealed the ability to penetrate and dish although he probably should have been looking to finish more himself.  He toned down his defensive wildman act, somewhat anyway, and down the stretch he was often the team's stopper, given the challenge of either guarding a quick small man or a bigger power forward.  He could handle either, with quickness and a fierce determination.

Now it's the fall of 2007.  With Wooster losing three key players and needing offensive help, Bidwell is now a starter at small forward.  And holy cow, where do I start?  He appears to have spent the whole summer shooting baskets as he now looks deadly from three-point range.  He's improved his penetration, making good decisions as to whether to finish or dump off, and he can finish by either going all the way to the hoop or making little pull-up jumpers.  When Farmingdale pressed full court at the end of Friday's game, he showed the ability to break it, with speed and strength, being the needed big-man ballhandler that Tom Port previously was.

I don't expect Bidwell to average his current nineteen points per game.  But I'll bet he'll be around 14-16, and very possibly, even probably, the team leader in assists (12 in two games so far).  Bidwell has dramatically added skills and improved his game each season.  He's almost certainly going to be All-NCAC something this year.  Next season, with the graduation of Cooper and Fulk, with the skills that he's already shown, he could even play the shooting guard spot on a bigger if slower Scots team.  It's not hard to imagine this former crazy man being able to continue his basketball career in Europe, as a guard, after he's done helping the COW win ball games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 18, 2007, 07:21:26 PM
Ohio Wesleyan puts one in the win column, defeating Lake Forest 56-42 in the consolation game of the Midway Classic.  Box score (http://bishops.owu.edu/2007-08/owum1118.htm).  Bishops had three in double figures, led by Brian Cafarella's 14.  They shot a miserable 31.6% and were outrebounded 37-30, but forced 22 turnovers and held Lake Forest to 36.4% shooting, including a horrendous 3/18 from the arc.

There's no consolation for the 0-2 Kenyon Lords, however, as they drop their second game at the Brandeis Tip-Off Classic, this time to Tufts by a count of 69-63.  Recap and box score (http://my.brandeis.edu/athletics/one-game?group_id=1385&item_id=500609).  Bryan Yelvington scored 13 and grabbed 7 rebounds to lead Kenyon, which also got 12 points, 6 boards, and two blocks from the enigmatic Allen Bediako.  Kenyon got as close as two with just under 5:00 left, but the Jumbos, who never trailed in the game, pulled away to post the six-point victory.

Kenyon, which returned 10 lettermen including all five starters from last season, had a first-year in the starting five this afternoon.  Rookie J.T. Knight contributed 23 points and 6 boards in 48 minutes this weekend, shooting 9/18 (.500) overall and 5/11 (.455) from the arc.  This may be a plebe we have to keep an eye on.  He replaced David Jolson in the starting lineup; Jolson started Saturday's game, but played just 10 minutes, and did not play at all today.  That sounds like an injury to me; I hope it is not serious. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Hoops MacPherson on November 18, 2007, 10:58:21 PM
Its about time someone on here talked about someone other than Wooster. The ironic thing, until this league gets more balanced from top to bottom, the eventual winner will continue to come up short in March.

Early reviews on the rest of the NCAC:
Wittenberg-- Seem to have slipped somewhat, but their tradition keeps them hanging in there.
Ohio Wesleyan-- Disappointing last year, should have been closer to top two.
Wabash-- Is there a girls' school near Wabash, and if not, does this hurt them in recruiting?
Earlham-- Not very deep, but started off well this season.
Kenyon-- Experienced, have to learn how to win. If the big fella wasn't an enigma, he wouldn't be in D-III.
Allegheny-- Potential sleeper team; start out 2-0, got some balance in their scoring this weekend.
Denison-- Seemed like an unhappy group last year; hopefully, this season finds them a little more cohesive.
Oberlin-- Read review of colleges once that said the liberal attitude at Oberlin went against everything that team sports stands for. Whoops.
Hiram-- We'll see if Year 2 of rebuilding program yields progress.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 19, 2007, 02:37:52 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 18, 2007, 07:21:26 PM
Ohio Wesleyan puts one in the win column, defeating Lake Forest 56-42 in the consolation game of the Midway Classic.  Box score (http://bishops.owu.edu/2007-08/owum1118.htm).  Bishops had three in double figures, led by Brian Cafarella's 14.  They shot a miserable 31.6% and were outrebounded 37-30, but forced 22 turnovers and held Lake Forest to 36.4% shooting, including a horrendous 3/18 from the arc.

I saw Wittenberg play on Saturday night and Ohio Wesleyan play on Sunday afternoon, so I got a unique window into the upper reaches of the NCAC this weekend.

OWU couldn't have thrown a ball into Lake Michigan this weekend, even if the Bishops had been perched on the edge of Navy Pier. They went .33-107 (308) from the field and 18-60 (.300) from downtown. Ouch. But they absolutely put the clampdown on Lake Forest at the defensive end, and I suspect that LFC is a better team than the Foresters demonstrated this weekend. The Foresters only scored ten points in the entire second half, and even though OWU's shooting woes kept it from blowing the game wide open it never really seemed that LFC would ever mount a response once the Bishops caught up (it was 32-25, LFC, at the half).

Wittenberg didn't wow me. Kalamazoo plays hard, but it's a team that has a serious talent shortage. I doubt that the Hornets would pose much of a threat to most good D3 teams; after all, Wheaton tossed aside the Hornets like a discarded wad of gum the night before (98-59). The Tigers roared out to a 27-9 lead two-thirds of the way through the first half, and I figured that that would be the end of it. Yet the Hornets hung around, getting as close as four down with five minutes to go in the game -- partly because they didn't appear to have an ounce of quit in them, but mostly because Wittenberg proved unable to put together any sort of a run that would've caused the Hornets to mentally pack it in. That might be a youth thing, of course, as I understand that the Tigers are a little on the inexperienced side. Veteran teams seem to understand that when you open up a bit of a lead it's the time to put the pedal to the metal, rather than let up a little. But it's that lack of a killer instinct that makes me wonder if they'll finish ahead of OWU this season, even though I think that Wittenberg does have more overall talent in its rotation than do the Bishops. Good defense never takes a night off, and if the Bishops can sustain what they did in the second half of that game against LFC throughout the season they'll be tough for the Tigers (and most likely everyone but Wooster) to hold at bay in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 19, 2007, 10:43:27 AM
Quote from: Hoops MacPherson on November 18, 2007, 10:58:21 PM
Its about time someone on here talked about someone other than Wooster. The ironic thing, until this league gets more balanced from top to bottom, the eventual winner will continue to come up short in March.

I don't know about all of that, Hoops.  In the last five years, the NCAC has been represented in the Final Four three times and in the final eight one more time.  That's pretty good.  You can't blame the rest of the league if the NCAC champion isn't hanging banners.  Blame Ton Ton Balenga. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2007, 10:46:00 AM
Quote from: Hoops MacPherson on November 18, 2007, 10:58:21 PM
Its about time someone on here talked about someone other than Wooster. The ironic thing, until this league gets more balanced from top to bottom, the eventual winner will continue to come up short in March.

If "coming up short" means reaching Salem but not winning the title, like the league champion has done the past two seasons, I'll take it.

Quote from: Hoops MacPherson on November 18, 2007, 10:58:21 PMEarly reviews on the rest of the NCAC:
Ohio Wesleyan-- Disappointing last year, should have been closer to top two.
Ohio Wesleyan did reach the tournament final last season, beating Wittenberg 57-52.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 19, 2007, 10:59:13 AM
Quote from: Hoops MacPherson on November 18, 2007, 10:58:21 PM

Wabash-- Is there a girls' school near Wabash, ..........


Don't they call it DePauw?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 19, 2007, 11:20:27 AM
Quote from: sac on November 19, 2007, 10:59:13 AM
Quote from: Hoops MacPherson on November 18, 2007, 10:58:21 PM

Wabash-- Is there a girls' school near Wabash, ..........


Don't they call it DePauw?

This is the fastest way to earn karma.  Ever.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 19, 2007, 11:32:06 AM
Funny, I thought the board has been a bit less Wooster-centric in the past few pages, as we cussed and discussed the season.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 19, 2007, 12:36:11 PM
Sac,

I like the new avatar and sig! :)

I'm sure you've also heard the one about Michigan needing a new Carr with Les Miles... ;)

Quote from: Hoops MacPherson on November 18, 2007, 10:58:21 PM
Its about time someone on here talked about someone other than Wooster. The ironic thing, until this league gets more balanced from top to bottom, the eventual winner will continue to come up short in March.
I'll echo the sentiments of those already expressed by Wally and David.  If coming up short means at least reaching Salem, I'll take it! 

And if you're referring to coming up short when Wooster and Witt get to Salem?  Wooster was a mis-timed buzzer away from beating the eventual National Champions when they lost to Williams in the semi's 5 years ago.  And Wooster also had overcame a 14 point haltime deficit and actually led with under a minute to go before Amherst finished them off at the ft line last year!

And as far as Witt goes, as Wally touched on, they were a Ton Ton Balenga miss away from hanging a banner!

So, if that's your definition of falling short, again, I think I can live with it!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 19, 2007, 01:11:28 PM
GS-

Thanks for the early read/impressions of Witt and OWU.

I'm really interested to see what happens when Capital goes to Witt tomorrow night.  Should give us some idea of how the top of the OAC stacks up against the top of the NCAC this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 19, 2007, 07:31:26 PM
Getting ready to tip from Hanover...I'll keep you all updated right here.   :)

Sloooooow start to this one...just about 3 minutes in and Wabash has a 3-0 lead following a Wes Smith triple on Wabash's first possession. 

10:43 to go in the first half, 13-11 Wabash.  The teams traded mini-runs and a whole bunch of turnovers.  Make it 13-13 now....and Wabash turns it over again.  LGs up to 7 turnovers already in this game.  Yikes. 

4 minutes to go in the first half...27-21 in favor of Wabash.  Simkus just converted a three point play to give Wabash their biggest lead of the game.  Wabash has only trailed for a brief moment in this game when the score was 8-7. 

And Hanover has gone on a quick run to tie the game at 27-27..I'm guessing that we're close to one minute to go here. 

Hanover closes the half pretty strong.  Hanover got the last shot of that half, but it rimmed out and Wabash goes to half with a 30-29 lead over Hanover. 


Brent just told me that Wabash hasn't beaten Hanover since the HCAC tournament game (a first round game I think) in 1999.  Yikes. 

Wabash started the second half ice cold and gave up the lead to the Panthers.  Hanover opened up a 34-30 lead on Wabash, but Wabash flipped the switch here and has come back with 8 straight points.  38-34 Wabash....and I have no idea how much time is left here.  15:24 to go. 

Oh my...Wabash is exploding.  Zimmer nails a three pointer and Wabash extends the lead to 43-34.  Timeout Hanover.

Midway through the half and Hanover is making a run.  Clint Parker hits a three for Hanover to cut the lead to one point at 46-45.  Wabash responds quickly with Gary Simkus scoring a basket and getting fouled.  The free throw is no good.  48-45 Wabash.

Sounds like the game is getting pretty physical and the officials are letting it go.  5 minutes to go, Wabash clinging to a 54-52 lead. 

Hanover nails a triple and the score is tied at 57-57 with 3 minutes to go.  Wabash has 22 turnovers tonight.  Not good. 

Make it two 3s in a row for Hanover.  Panthers retake the lead 60-57.  2:38 to play.   :-\

Hanover gets a pair of free throws to extend the lead to 62-57 for Hanover.  Andy Root draws a foul for Wabash on the other end.  Andy gets one of his two shots.  62-58, Hanover with the ball....Chase Haltom gets a steal and a layup off the full court pressure.  62-60 now, just over one minute to go.

Wabash forces another turnover!  Haltom gets an open three pointer but misses...Hanover has the ball with about 40 seconds to play.  Hanover draws a foul underneath on Zimmer and Zimmer will be done for the evening with 5 fouls.

Hanover's free throws are...no good and....good.  63-60 in favor of Hanover.  23 seconds to play, Wabash will have the ball.   

After a couple of timeouts, Wabash goes one pass to Andy Root who misses the three pointer.  Rebound to Hanover and an immediate foul.  Wabash takes a timeout which seems like their 17th timeout in the last two minutes. 

Hanover's first free throw is good.  The second one is missed, rebounded by the shooter and put back in.  Ugh.   Hanover is going to win this game. 

Final score from Hanover: Hanover 68, Wabash 63.  The LGs let this one get away...far too sloppy tonight with the basketball.  Fouls are an issue as well...Wabash has been outshot at the line by a pretty significant margin in each of their first three games.  The LGs are either going to have it tone it down on D (not likely) or start forcing the issue a little more on the offensive end and getting some more free throw opportunities. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2007, 09:33:25 PM
Outstanding post, WW!  +1!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Darryl Nester on November 20, 2007, 08:50:53 AM
Wally -- I agree with DC; thanks for the report, though the ending must have been painful for you.

And DC, thanks for pointing out the report to those of us who hang around the HCAC room.  (Any additional chatter in that usually-empty room is always welcome.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 20, 2007, 11:48:56 AM
It's been a pretty familiar script for the last couple of seasons, Darryl.  Wabash will play well for stretches and then play just wretched for stretches.  You won't win many games when you turn the ball over 23 times which is what Wabash did last night.  It was understandable last year with so many first year players on the floor, but 20+ turnover games have to be a thing of the past if Wabash is going to think about competing in the NCAC this year. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2007, 12:05:17 PM
The inaugural winner of the NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) award is Earlham's Tristan Gregory, who poured in 62 points en route to being named the MVP of the Tip-Off Tournament at Case Western Reserve.  Congratulations, Tristan!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 20, 2007, 12:54:41 PM
The free throw line continues to be a struggle as well. They need to get to the line and then shoot 70% or more.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 20, 2007, 03:32:07 PM
Congrats to former Wabash assistant Jason Mulligan for winning his first two games at the University of New England.

They beat Unity 102-35 and Fisher 87-41.

Denizens of the annual 'winless teams of D-3' feature here on the boards recognize Unity as the designated punching bag for all of the weaklings in the Maine / NH area. It's pretty much a hippy dippy place, dude. But they'd kill if the USCAA had hacky sack as a varsity sport.

Still, 2-0 is 2-0!

Mulligan's squad faces Bowdoin tonight as part of the "NESCAC plays only a single round robin so we gotta fill our schedule with someone" tour. Actually, it makes sense since Bowdoin is also in Maine, and well, they lost to Elms, so they're beatable.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 20, 2007, 11:35:12 PM
11/20 Final Scores:

Allegheny 58  PSU-New Kensington 57   Gators are 3-0

Capital 79  Wittenberg 75    Kevin Murray scores 22 points for the Tigers

Lake Erie 74  Denison 56    Big Red are 0-3
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: roadtrip on November 21, 2007, 10:01:19 AM
Ref Wabash....IMO too many guys are willing to fire it up from anywhere...nobody wants to board and everybody is a step slow on D...Coach has to get on the boys to step up on the D...Zim is getting doubled/tripled.....cant have the guards leading the team in rebounds..still the talent is there and the league hasn't started yet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 21, 2007, 01:56:00 PM
Well, after the 1st weekend of the season, the NCAC's overall record is just 10-13.  I really don't know how that compares to season's past, but I would imagine it would be par for the course. 

I do see improvements as this record is with Witt only sitting on a 1-2 record where most years they would more than likely still be without a loss at this point of the season.  Kenyon is 0-2, but they had to start with a very difficult road trip with games at Brandeis and vs. Tufts and they were more than respectable in their 2 losses.  Earlham is also a pleasant surprise at 2-0 with road wins at Lake Erie and vs. Case.  Allegheny is 3-0, but that is more of a result of a very weak schedule to date than anything else.  I still don't know what to make of the Gators and it may be a while before we find out as they host 3 relatively weak teams in their National City Tournament.  The Gators open with yet another Penn State (insert name here) in the first round.  That name would be Dubois fwiw.  And then they will more than likely take on the winner of Marietta and Medaille.  If they aren't 5-0 after this weekend, add them to the disappointing list.

On the disappointing side, I already mentioned Witt's start.  I say that in regards to their loss to Benedictine, but in all likelihood they would've lost to Wheaton had they beaten Benedictine and would more than likely still be looking at a 1-2 record.  Wabash was also disappointing in their loss at home to Hanover.  I thought this was the year they would get over on Hanover but 22 turnovers helped Hanover keep their run over Wabash going.

And then there's the usual suspects of Hiram, Oberlin and Denison who have yet to win a game.  Hiram and Oberlin have a shot at putting one in the win column tonight.  Dension on the other hand... ::)  Let's just say it might take a while.

Overall, I think we are seeing some glimpses of improvement.  Maybe after this weekend's action, we can be looking at a record over .500 for the conference after this weekend...?  Then again, probably not...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 21, 2007, 02:38:58 PM
Be fair, ScotsFan...Wabash's game vs. Hanover was at Hanover.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 21, 2007, 03:00:09 PM
All in all, I'm pleased with the way the LGs season has started. A close loss to a really good NAIA team and a loss at Hanover isn't bad. And they definitely have a rotation. I am surprised by Brock's lack of production off the bench, though. Hopefully that will be rectified soon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 21, 2007, 06:29:33 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 21, 2007, 02:38:58 PM
Be fair, ScotsFan...Wabash's game vs. Hanover was at Hanover.   :)
My bad wally.  For some reason I had Chadwick on the brain for that game. 

Besides, I'm only basing my assessments on the 1st few games of the season.  It's not too late for Wabash to get out of my disappointment column. ;)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 22, 2007, 09:36:46 AM
Hey guys. Welcome back to yet another season. I'm sure everyone has been awaiting my return to provide some Wittenberg perspective. I was at the Capital game on Tuesday night and came away with a few opinions.

1- This is a very very very young and unpolished Wittenberg team. Especially in the low post i think Witt will have some troubles early on until they can mesh well with each other. This attributes to the foul trouble that they get in as well as that at times was their only resort to stopping easy baskets. Are we sure Borchers doesnt have another year of eligibility?

2-Brandon Barabino is going to have a breakout year for Witt. He can take a game over at any time with his explosiveness. Gregg Hill is going to produce obviously as well and i think Kevin Murray as shown the other night is going to provide solid minutes on both ends of the floor, as he was a nice defensive presence as well.

3-This game in particular Wittenberg had a great chance to win, which if you looked at the stats (rebounds) in particular, you would have thought no way. Murray actually missed the tying 3 with 1:16 to go. Capital is a tenacious team that returned their top 9 players from last year, and i didnt realize that they are ranked 10th in the nation. I think this loss can be used as a positive for Witt. Although disappointing to lose a game, showing that they can come back in the second half and remain competitive against a top team will help them down the road. Although it is kind of funny thinking what Witt can learn from losses however........

Good luck to everyone this year. I will remain active and hopefully not cause any fights this year. Happy Thanksgiving all!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 22, 2007, 11:17:41 AM
If Borchers has another year, then I think Wabash should allow Josh Estelle to suit up again!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2007, 02:34:54 PM
A couple of Wednesday scores that understandably escaped mention in here, until now that is:

CWRU 98, Hiram 81 (at Hiram)
Thomas More 83, Oberlin 45 (at Oberlin)

Egad.  Perhaps ignorance was bliss, after all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 22, 2007, 02:40:43 PM
Um...so much for the 'improvement' card...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 23, 2007, 01:12:54 AM
Quote from: smedindy on November 22, 2007, 11:17:41 AM
If Borchers has another year, then I think Wabash should allow Josh Estelle to suit up again!

Why stop there? Why not bring back Pete Metzelaars as well? I don't think that the big Dutchman's duties with the Colts are so pressing that he couldn't lace 'em up for his old alma mater a few more times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 23, 2007, 10:42:45 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 23, 2007, 01:12:54 AM
Quote from: smedindy on November 22, 2007, 11:17:41 AM
If Borchers has another year, then I think Wabash should allow Josh Estelle to suit up again!

Why stop there? Why not bring back Pete Metzelaars as well? I don't think that the big Dutchman's duties with the Colts are so pressing that he couldn't lace 'em up for his old alma mater a few more times.

If not Pete Metzelaars himself, then surely his heretofore unknown identical twin brother has eligibility remaining...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 23, 2007, 10:46:34 AM
And I do think there's some DNA of Maurice "Shang" Chadwick, Homer Stonebraker, and Pete Thorn rolling around somewhere. The biochem lab should get on that cloning project, toot sweet!  ;)

I hope all of the NCAC hoop squads enjoyed their turkeys and are ready to kick some non-conference tail!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 23, 2007, 09:33:28 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 23, 2007, 10:42:45 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 23, 2007, 01:12:54 AM
Quote from: smedindy on November 22, 2007, 11:17:41 AM
If Borchers has another year, then I think Wabash should allow Josh Estelle to suit up again!

Why stop there? Why not bring back Pete Metzelaars as well? I don't think that the big Dutchman's duties with the Colts are so pressing that he couldn't lace 'em up for his old alma mater a few more times.

If not Pete Metzelaars himself, then surely his heretofore unknown identical twin brother has eligibility remaining...

Yep. And I've heard that Drew W. Metzelaars has better handles than his twin brother used to have. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCAC4Life on November 24, 2007, 07:46:18 PM
Big win for the NCAC over the OAC today as Ohio Wesleyan downs Baldwin-Wallace 98-68 at Rochester.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 24, 2007, 07:49:32 PM
Quote from: NCAC4Life on November 24, 2007, 07:46:18 PM
Big win for the NCAC over the OAC today as Ohio Wesleyan downs Baldwin-Wallace 98-68 at Rochester.
Looks like the Bishops found their shooting touch!  Nice win for OWU and the NCAC! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 24, 2007, 09:36:31 PM
Both games in today's NCAC/OAC Challenge went to the OAC.  In the opener, Kenyon lost to Muskingum, 71-66, and Capital finished off the sweep by dumping Denison 71-53.

Kenyon was (IMHO) clearly the better team in the first game.  Josh Klinger basically negated Muskingum's all-conference guard Brandon Todd, and without him, the Musky offense was dysfunctional, repeatedly forced into chucking up buzzer-beating attempts.  On the offensive end, the gameplan was to get the ball inside to Bryan Yelvington, who would either back his man down or kick out for the open jumper.  It wall worked splendidly as Kenyon raced out to an 11-point halftime lead.  But shortly before the half, Klinger re-injured the knee that kept him out of half of last season (more on this below), and shortly after the half, Yelvington picked up his third and fourth fouls, and as a result, the second half was a completely different game.  With Klinger in the locker room, Tood was freed up to work his magic (he finished with 12 points and 7 assists), and with Yelvington watching in frustration from the bench, Dave Knapke and Allen Bediako weren't able to control the paint--Kenyon shot 54.5% in the 1st half but just 36.4% in the second, while Musky's shooting percentage went from a woeful 30% in the 1st to a hot 57.7% in the second.  Still, Kenyon had two chances to tie the game in the final 10 seconds, both three-point attempts by first-year Kodey Haddox (Korey's little brother), but both looked a little panicky and were off-target.

So Kenyon drops to 0-3 with three closes losses to good teams (Brandeis, Tufts, Muskingum.)  And things don't look terribly bright for tomorrow, if they have to take on Capital without Josh Klinger.  Klinger plowed into a Musky defender on a breakaway late in the half (drawing the foul), but crumbled to the floor grabbing his braced knee and writhing in pain.  He was down for a few minutes, but got up (with help) and was able to put some weight on it, which I take to be a good sign.  He emerged from the locker room about midway through the second half with a substantial icepack on his knee.  My completely uneducated guess would be that he'll be back in the lineup soon, based on his being able to walk before game's end today.  I certainly hope so, since Kenyon is a different team with him at the point.

The second game was a mismatch in a couple of different ways.  Capital is ranked #10 in the nation, and while that's IMO tremendously inaccurate (they may not even be the 10th best team in the region), it still points up the gulf between their players and those in the Denison red jerseys.  So how do you account for the fact that Denison stayed within striking distance until the last 7 minutes or so?  Well, perhaps Capital didn't take their opponent as seriously as they might have, or maybe they just rest on their superior athletic ability, I don't know.  But Bob Ghiloni and Kyle Pottkotter certainly get every last bit of game out of their players, and I think that the coaching advantage is the main reason the OAC favorite had trouble putting away the NCAC least-favorite.  Despite being considerably taller, faster, and stronger than their opponents, Capital actually lost the rebounding battle, 34-33.  It seemed to me that Denison's positioning and effort were both better than Capital's, allowing them to overcome the physical disadvantages and stay in the game.  On offense, Denison took a page from the Princeton small-and-slow playbook and ran a number of back door cuts, usually with success.  When the ball went into the post, usually to Jeremy Stuhlfauth (6 FG, 13 points) or Brian Elder (2 FG, 9 points), the result was as often a block (8 blocks for Capital, 4 by Ben Gunn in just 13 minutes) as a bucket.  That meant that DU had to rely on the jumper, and they just haven't got the shooters to make that gameplan work; the Big Red shot just 38.2% excluding Stuhlfauth and Elder, and only attempted 7 threes (making two). 

So what do we know after day 1?  Well, the OAC representatives were picked to finish 1st and 6th by their coaches, while the NCAC representatives were picked to finish fifth and 10th by their coaches.  The OAC #1 beat the NCAC #10, as expected (but not by the sort of margin I'd expect Wooster to ring up on Marietta).  The OAC #6 and NCAC #5 played a game that could have gone either way, even though Kenyon was without the services of their two most important players for about half of the game.  The OAC teams will probably win both games tomorrow as well, but I'm encouraged by today's results that interconference parity may not be too far off.  (Plus OWU's smackdown of BWC helps, even though OWU is our #2 and BWC is only their #5.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Hoops MacPherson on November 24, 2007, 09:47:56 PM
Results from Meadville:

Medaille (3-0) beats Marietta, setting up final of tournament against host  Allegheny (4-0) which beat PS-DuBois, 103-58.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 25, 2007, 10:57:22 AM
Not that I want to play the "comparative scores" game ;), but it must be noted that St. Thomas, who lost at Wooster by 6 last weekend, defeated Division 2's top-ranked team, Winona St., on their home court last night.  See this site's front page for more details.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 25, 2007, 11:58:23 AM
After seeing that score, I'm seriously beginning to doubt my ability to judge the merits of anything hoops.  Last week, at the Van Wie tournament at Wooster, after seeing St. Thomas in action (and I use that word loosely) against Otterbein, I'd have bet my bottom dollar that Wooster would take them by 20-30 points.  I was way off, of course, as the Scots had to come from behind to eek out the win.  Now St. Thomas knocks off the top team in DII.  Either the DII voters have no clue, or I have no clue.  I think it's me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 25, 2007, 12:16:12 PM
UST didn't look very good in that game against Ott.  I remember remarking to Steve Moore at halftime of that game that it didn't look like Steve Fritz had a lot of talent on this year's squad.  I realize that makes me look like an idiot, but I stand nervously by that statement.  They're very good because they are extremely well-coached and fundamentally sound, but not terrifically talented or athletic.  I think they just had an off night against Otterbein.  Off nights happen: look at the Kenyon women, who sandwiched an 11-point loss to a pedestrian ONU squad between a win at #14 Brandeis and a double OT loss at #6 Wash U.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 25, 2007, 02:46:11 PM
Wow, Gheny really pushed themselves with that tourney schedule!  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 25, 2007, 04:13:02 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 25, 2007, 12:16:12 PM
UST didn't look very good in that game against Ott.  I remember remarking to Steve Moore at halftime of that game that it didn't look like Steve Fritz had a lot of talent on this year's squad.  I realize that makes me look like an idiot, but I stand nervously by that statement.  They're very good because they are extremely well-coached and fundamentally sound, but not terrifically talented or athletic. I think they just had an off night against Otterbein. 
I didn't see the STU/Ott game, but one thing that stood out to me from their game vs. Wooster was how fundamentally sound and well coached they were.  I was very impressed with how they ran their inside outside game by getting the ball inside and then kicking it out for an open three.  They reminded me a lot of Wooster prior to the up-tempo days.  And they certainly seem to be a very good shooting team.  Especially from beyond the arc.  That's what kept them in the game against Wooster. 

I must say though, that going by 1st impressions based on team personnel, I didn't expect the Tommies to offer much of a challenge to Wooster.  But they shot the ball much better than I expected them to and had the Scots on the ropes for much of the game.  Now they go and pull off a huge upset beating the D-II number 1.  And on the road to boot.  One question I have is where were GVSU and Findlay ranked.  They had wins over D-1 powers MSU and OSU respectively under their belts already!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 25, 2007, 04:34:10 PM
Findlay was #6 and is 3-0, Grand Valley #24 and is 6-0

They meet December 8th in Allendale, MI, their only meeting of the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 25, 2007, 08:19:02 PM
The NCAC/OAC Challenge is now in the books for 2007, and you can chalk up a 4-0 record for the OAC.

In the opener, Muskingum held off a pesky Denison squad, 72-66.  It was more of the same for Denison, who played well but lacks the scoring threat that can carry them to a victory.  Statistically, the game was decided at the free throw line, where Muskingum was a perfect 12-12 while Denison was just 10 of 17.  Otherwise, the stats were similar: shooting (MU 26/53 [49.1%], DU 25/52 [48.1%]), three-point shooting (MU 42.1%, DU 42.9%), rebounds (MU 30, DU 31), and turnovers (MU 8, DU 7) were nearly dead even.  Denison was led by first-year Larry Farmer with 15 points on 7/8 shooting.  (Aside: former Wooster plebe Nick Hershberger started both games in the post for Muskingum, scoring 14 points in each game.)

The nightcap was a thriller with a crummy ending, which has become an all-too-familiar story for Kenyon.  The Lords, playing without co-captain and floor general Josh Klinger (knee) held a 4-point halftime lead over the tenth-ranked Capital Crusaders, and still led by 7 with about 3:00 left.  Capital, however, drilled three straight treys while Kenyon's offense fell silent, and the Cru forced overtime.  The OT was dominated by Capital as Kenyon's Bryan Yelvington misfired on several threes, and Capital ended up with a 95-85 victory.  Statistically, the game was won by free throws (Cap sank 26, while Kenyon missed nine of 26 attempts) and turnovers (21 by Kenyon vs. just 10 by Capital--Klinger's absence was keenly felt.)  Kenyon's missed free throws were critical, but somehow I just felt like they wouldn't have been decisive--that Capital would find some way to pull it out, which they did.  Yelvington was undoubtedly the hero for the Lords, scoring 22 points and grabbing 11 boards.  Dave Knapke quietly added a double-double of his own (11 + 12).  Plebe Kodey Haddox contributed 17, while junior David Jolson added 13 points and 7 assists helping to replace Klinger.  Capital was led by the slimmed-down Steve Kyser, whose 23 points included two huge threes, and by first-year D.J. Frazier with 21, 8 of which came from the from the charity stripe (many of those in the OT.)  (Aside: former Wooster reserve Jamie Yoder is now in the Capital rotation, scoring 20 points on 7/12 shooting in 37 minutes of action this weekend.)

Denison is now 0-5, while Kenyon is 0-4, but both teams are better than that.

Elsewhere:
Medaille 70, Allegheny 68
Manchester 84, Earlham 67
Wilmington 78, Oberlin 50
#9 Rochester 76, Ohio Wesleyan 69
and
Lake Erie leads Wooster by 4 with 13:40 left in the 2nd.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 25, 2007, 08:33:47 PM
Wooster and Lake Erie tied at 57, 10:47 left.  LEC led by something like 14 at the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 25, 2007, 08:38:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 25, 2007, 08:33:47 PM
Wooster and Lake Erie tied at 57, 10:47 left.  LEC led by something like 14 at the half.

It was 43-31 at half.  Scots scored the first 8 I think of the second half.

Johnson-Bidwell-Fulk for a layup on a steal, Wooster by 4, sounded like a pretty pretty play.

Bidwell to the line to shoot two, 9:41 left.  Fulk leads Wooster with 22(!).

Wooster has clamped down on D, outscoring LEC 30-14 in the second half so far.

63-57 Wooster, 9:15 or so left.  Now Thorton (sp?) scores on an old-fashioned 3 pt. play, 63-60.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 25, 2007, 08:42:28 PM
Keeping the updates coming:

Will hits two from the line for Wooster. 65-60.
Bidwell picks up his third foul. LEC misses.
Wooster turnover, 2-1 drill for LEC, Thorton lays it in, he has 24.  65-62 Woo
Cooper does as he usually does, makes a 15 footer.
Quick lay in for LEC, Woo left someone wide open.
Johnson picks up a blocking foul, makes them both. Woo by 5, 7:40 left.

Coop gets a transition lay in, Woo by 7. Not sure on time.  71-64, 6:04 left.
Largest lead for Wooster. Thorton drives and scores again, he has 26.  He sounds like a force who will not be stopped sometimes.

A jump ball call gives it back to LEC with 6:41 to play. Fulk picks up his 11-12 board for a double-double, great game for him...Breckenridge says it's a career-high in RBs and only a few points from his career high, too. Fulk has 22, Will 13, Cooper 14.


I can't find any live stats...so I apologize about not knowing the stat line on LEC players as much...

Wooster turnover, 16 in the game, only 4 in second half. LEC makes them pay, 71-68.

Another turnover...LEC misses a three, Fulk with another board. Bidwell misses. Hutt gets a lay in, 71-70, Woo by one. Coop gets a basket, 16 for him, 14 in the second half.  LEC trades the basket back, 73-72, now 4 minutes left.

Huge 3 by LEC's Moore...75-73 LEC.  Wooster misses; fouls on the rebound. LEC to the line for a 1-1.
LEC's Campbell makes the first....and the second. He has 16. Woo trails by four.

3:00 left.  Johnson drives and scores, Campbell scores for LEC, Johnson drives straight to the hole, in and the foul! 
Had to run away from my computer...missed some things.

Now 2:12 left, 80-79 LEC.  Wooster has possession.

Wooster turns the ball over, again...they really need to get better at this.  But they steal it away!  Fulk takes in toward the hole, gets fouled. Almost drew a technical.

Fulk, nearly automatic from the line...makes the first, tied game at 80....second one is good. 81-80 Wooster. Fulk has career highs in points and rebounds.

Dickinson goes to the line for LEC for a 1-1. Fulk rebounds, but Bidwell fouls.

Sorry, missed stuff again (my dryer is acting strangely...) anyway, Johnson misses the first free throw, makes the second...45 seconds left, 85-84 LEC leads, and has the ball.

Timeout. LEC has 14 to shoot, 24 sec. left in game.

Campbell misses in the lane, Evan Will fouled on the rebound. He'll shoot two for the chance to lead.

Will....misses the first...now to tie...misses...Fulk rebounds! but ball comes loose...and jump ball again!  Ball to LEC.

Now Scots have to foul, and hit a shot to have a chance.  5.2 on the clock. LEC uses their last timeout on the inbounds.

Boy, those missed FTs hurt, but the Scots had other chances.

Ryan Benchwick (sp?) sent to the line for two. Will fouls out. Scots still have three timeouts. Only 3.2 on the clock.

First FT is...good.  Second is...no good. Quick timeout Wooster.  They have to go the length of the floor in 2.7 seconds. Bidwell inbounding from a spot.  Fulk takes the inbound and calls another time out. 1.9 on the clock.

Bidwell to inbound, from about half-court...can't find anyone, so burns the last timeout.

Inbound to Johnson, ball tipped/passed to Fulk, who puts it up, but off the back of the rim.

Lake Erie wins, 86-84.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 25, 2007, 09:16:52 PM
That Earlham win over LEC is looking better all the time...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 25, 2007, 09:24:52 PM
Yeah, definitely some interesting non-conference results so far this season.

DC- I would imagine that one consequence of this loss will be Wooster's first non-top-ten national ranking this week.  How long was that streak again?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 25, 2007, 09:31:32 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on November 25, 2007, 09:24:52 PM
Yeah, definitely some interesting non-conference results so far this season.

DC- I would imagine that one consequence of this loss will be Wooster's first non-top-ten national ranking this week.  How long was that streak again?


To quote Monty Python and the Holy Grail, "I'm not dead yet!"  There's been a lot of carnage in the 9 days of action since the preseason poll was released; the teams ranked #7 thru #13 (including Wooster) sit at a composite 18-6, and some of the 18 wins were less than stellar (like Capital's OT win at Kenyon today.)  But you're probably right, and if so, Wooster's string of top 10 rankings will end at 54 weeks.  The last non-top-10 week for the Scots was week 8 of the 2003-04 season (when they were #11).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 25, 2007, 11:28:05 PM
For the 2nd time in 3 games this season the Scots turned the ball over 20 or more times.  I don't care how good of a team you are, if you are turning the ball over 20+ times per game you are going to get beat sooner or later.  Wooster was able to overcome 26 turnovers in a comfortable win in the opener against Farmingdale, but they couldn't overcome 20 tonight including 12 in the first half that contributed to LEC being able to go into the half with a 12 point cushion. 

Wooster actually did a much better job of taking care of the basketball in the 2nd half and look at the result.  They turned a 12 point deficit into a 7 point lead.  And then the turnover bug hit again over the last 5 minutes of the game as Wooster committed at least four more costly turnovers down the stretch!

Wooster has got to do a better job taking care of the basketball.  Plain and simple.  And they don't have a lot of time to get this turnover thing figured out as they travel to NAIA ranked Cedarville next Saturday and also to Delaware for an early conference tilt with OWU.  Oh yeah, and there's a tilt at Oberlin sandwiched in between.  We'll find out in a hurry where this Wooster team is!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 26, 2007, 12:47:39 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 25, 2007, 11:28:05 PM
For the 2nd time in 3 games this season the Scots turned the ball over 20 or more times. 
Wooster has got to do a better job taking care of the basketball.  Plain and simple. 

ScotsFan, what I find really frustrating about the turnover problem is who is turning the ball over.  Johnson (3), Cooper (6) and Fulk (7) accounted for 16 of the 20 turnovers tonight. That's supposed to be Wooster's established, experienced backcourt guards. Cooper and Johnson each had 5 turnovers in the season-opening Farmingdale State game.

The radio broadcast noted that many of tonight's turnovers happened well out in the backcourt. It sounded like Lake Erie again had athletic, quick guards, which is what Farmingdale also presented.  With Cooper in particular, it seemed like when he went into his shimmy-shake moves he was getting his pocket picked off the dribble much more than in previous seasons, both tonight and in the opener against Farmingdale.

Again, could be a mis-guided notion and I didn't personally see the game tonight, but Wooster places so much emphasis on letting its guards create offense off the dribble, that this would be a crucial weakness if the high turnover count continues.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 26, 2007, 09:47:48 PM
Alas, the upset was not in cards tonight at Hiram.  Heidelberg's 1000-point scorer Shawn Shriver nailed a 3-pointer 11 seconds into the game, and the Terriers never got any closer as the Student Princes sailed to a 105-76 victory at the Terrierdome.  The 'Berg put six players in double figures, shot 56.3% (53.8% from the arc), and held Hiram to 43.1% shooting (and just 23.8% on threes).  Hiram was only down by 11 at the half, but Heidelberg blistered the nets for 65 second-half points on 65% shooting to remove any doubt.  Chris Roberts and Mike Staley led the Terriers with 18 and 17 points, respectively.  Box. (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/hirm1126.htm)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2007, 03:24:38 PM
This Saturday:

2:00 #9 Wash. U. at Denison (women)
3:00 #18 Capital at Ohio Wesleyan (men)
3:00 Wabash at Kenyon (men)

what to do... ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2007, 03:29:21 PM
Congratulations go out to this week's NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt), Ohio Wesleyan's senior post Dustin Rudegeair, who's tougher to defend than his name is to spell.  Dustin dropped 25 and 12 on then-#20 Baldwin-Wallace at Rochester, then added 14 more points in the Bishops' narrow loss to the now-sixth-ranked Yellow Jackets.   Congratulations, Dustin!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 27, 2007, 03:32:14 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 27, 2007, 03:24:38 PM
This Saturday:

2:00 #9 Wash. U. at Denison (women)
3:00 #18 Capital at Ohio Wesleyan (men)
3:00 Wabash at Kenyon (men)

what to do... ???


1:00 Wabash at UW-Whitewater  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zu1414 on November 27, 2007, 06:08:29 PM
David
Thanks for the Hiram update. A double digit season in the win column is looking less likely than ever....by the way we used to have some 'battles' with the Big Red, I remember a couple of overtimes...great games often decided who got to face Witt or Wooster in the first round
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 27, 2007, 06:22:22 PM
Wittenberg vs Ohio Northern tomorrow night should be a good game!

If we want to play the "comparative game" as well. Wooster travels to Cedarville Saturday night and Wittenberg to Cedarville Tuesday night, so possibly we can get a sense of how things might work out between these two teams. Probably not.

I think tomorrow night's game vs Ohio Northern is key for Wittenberg. If they can keep competitive and steal a game vs a "top" opponent then that could be big momentum wise. I'd also like to see improvements in the low post game.

karma points for me anyone?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2007, 06:35:00 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 27, 2007, 06:22:22 PM
Wittenberg vs Ohio Northern tomorrow night should be a good game!
[...]
I think tomorrow night's game vs Ohio Northern is key for Wittenberg. If they can keep competitive and steal a game vs a "top" opponent then that could be big momentum wise. I'd also like to see improvements in the low post game.

karma points for me anyone?

I'll gladly give you a karma point, while at the same time questioning ONU's designation as a '"top" opponent.'  ONU was picked to finish 4th in the OAC by the coaches, and is off to a 2-2 start which includes an 11-point loss at Carnegie Mellon.  Hmmm.  I hope Witt wins this game, and if so you can spin it any way you please.  For me, I'd prefer to rest on the closer-than-expected 4 point loss to the OAC's preseason #1, Capital (with the caveat that I think Capital is wildly overrated and will not win the OAC.)

So here's your karma point.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2007, 09:40:04 PM
By most measures, the team Oberlin faced tonight was not a "top" opponent (well, academically, but in that regard Oberlin could give them a game and then some), but still Case Western Reserve was able to squeeze out the victory by a score of 88-51.  Here's all you need to know, courtesy of the recap on the Case website (http://www.case.edu/athletics/varsity/winter/mbasketball/stats/2007-08/story_06.htm):

QuoteThe Spartans used a 24-0 run to take a 30-point lead, 49-19, into the intermission.

Oberlin falls to 0-5 while Case improves to 5-1.  Like Lake Erie, CWRU's lone loss this season came at the hands of Earlham. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 28, 2007, 11:07:12 AM
Yick. The Yeomen are struggling more than I thought they were.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 28, 2007, 03:06:00 PM
DC- I completely agree with you on Capital. As Witt lost to them by 4 I was thinking wow I don't know how we didn't beat that team, they are not that good. But when i went home and looked at the boxscore and realized they were 10th in the nation, I didn't know whether to think that they are vividly overrated or Wittenberg is just not that far off.

I'm leaning towards Capital is not as good. They were able to exploit Wittenberg's subpar post defense and capitalize when the double teams came to hit open perimeter 3-pointers, so I think Capital may not be as strong as everyone thinks. Bring on the OAC haters with this post I'm guessing......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2007, 03:34:06 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 28, 2007, 03:06:00 PMBut when i went home and looked at the boxscore and realized they [Capital] were 10th in the nation, I didn't know whether to think that they are vividly overrated or Wittenberg is just not that far off.

How about...both?  I've seen Capital twice (at home vs. Denison, at Kenyon) and while I don't think they're anything close to the 10th (or 18th, now) best team in D3, they have shooters and some big guys who can play.  They're a good team, just not a great one.

I haven't yet seen Wittenberg, and I'm sure they're still trying to figure themselves out.  I have confidence in Bill Brown and Travis Schwab (to say nothing of his brother) and expect they'll improve as the season goes along.  I think a close loss to a good Capital team is a sign that the cupboard is not entirely bare.

As far as the OAC goes, I took my shots at them in my Daily Dose (http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/2007/11/27/top-25-news-and-notes-week-1) column this week.  I'm dying to see Heidelberg (not sure when; they don't come to Muskingum until the last day of the season, and its the same day that Witt visits Kenyon) who, on paper, looks to me like the team to beat.  And one can never count out JCU.  But B-WC is off to a horrible start, ONU has a bad loss, Muskingum is mediocre (certainly no better than Capital), Otterbein sucks, etc. etc.  I think this is a down year for the OAC, except perhaps for the Princes. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCAC4Life on November 28, 2007, 09:18:03 PM
Final from  Defiance. Ohio Wesleyan 68 Defiance 67.   Bishops come from nine down late in 2nd half to win! Big win for OWU!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 28, 2007, 09:27:45 PM
Those of you in central Ohio may want to circle the Otterbein tournament near the end of the month.

You could get a matchup with Albion who should be 7-1 facing Ohio Wesleyan.  That should be a good D3 matchup.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 28, 2007, 09:40:00 PM
Wittenberg 57 Ohio Northern 59-ONU ends game on 8-0 run. DC i have a few comments concerning what we were discussing earlier. I will wait till tomorrow morning to post my analysis because right now i'm not thinking rationally-what a disappointing game......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2007, 10:12:58 PM
Quote from: sac on November 28, 2007, 09:27:45 PM
Those of you in central Ohio may want to circle the Otterbein tournament near the end of the month.

You could get a matchup with Albion who should be 7-1 facing Ohio Wesleyan.  That should be a good D3 matchup.

I'll be there.  It overlaps a women's tournament, four games each day, so it's hoops heaven for someone like me.  Fri/Sat Dec. 28-29 at Otterbein.  Participants--Men:  Albion, OWU, Hanover; Women:  Kenyon, Franklin, St. Mary's of IN.

Scores from tonight:
As noted, OWU won and Witt lost close games against good opposition
Wabash 63, Rose-Hulman 60...I thought Rose was sucky at hoops.  Am I wrong?
Wash/Jeff 66, Denison 58...another close loss for the luckless Big Red
Edinboro 61, Allegheny 55...Edinboro is D2, so that's not too bad a result for the Gators
Bluffton 87, Hiram 70...23 more points from Mike Staley, but he's not getting a lot of help, it appears
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 28, 2007, 10:13:24 PM
Final from Chadwick Court:

Rose-Hulman 60
Wabash 63

I have no further insight. I worked late tonight and only have the score.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 28, 2007, 11:25:39 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 28, 2007, 10:12:58 PM
Quote from: sac on November 28, 2007, 09:27:45 PM
Those of you in central Ohio may want to circle the Otterbein tournament near the end of the month.

You could get a matchup with Albion who should be 7-1 facing Ohio Wesleyan.  That should be a good D3 matchup.

I'll be there.  It overlaps a women's tournament, four games each day, so it's hoops heaven for someone like me.  Fri/Sat Dec. 28-29 at Otterbein.  Participants--Men:  Albion, OWU, Hanover; Women:  Kenyon, Franklin, St. Mary's of IN.

Scores from tonight:
As noted, OWU won and Witt lost close games against good opposition
Wabash 63, Rose-Hulman 60...I thought Rose was sucky at hoops.  Am I wrong?
Wash/Jeff 66, Denison 58...another close loss for the luckless Big Red
Edinboro 61, Allegheny 55...Edinboro is D2, so that's not too bad a result for the Gators
Bluffton 87, Hiram 70...23 more points from Mike Staley, but he's not getting a lot of help, it appears

No, you're right - RHIT is now 1-4, including losses to Manhattanville, Fontbonne of the SLIAC, and Millikin, picked (a distant) last in the CCIW.  This was NOT an impressive win for the LGs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 29, 2007, 01:04:12 AM
Rose used to be pretty good at hoops, especially in the 90s. They've been on a slide recently when they moved to the SCAC and now back in the Heartland...

Plus Rose and Wabash have had a pretty good rivalry in the past when Rose was also all male, and then when they became a 'turncoat'.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 29, 2007, 01:30:42 AM
The article on the website mentioned that this was the first time since 1998 that Wabash has beaten Rose in hoops.  That makes me feel old...that game would have been the game at RHIT's brand new arena where Estelle nailed a triple with just about no time left to win.  Bryan Egli (who was an absolute baller) had a shot for RHIT to win but just missed.  Unbelievable game.  I can't belive Wabash hasn't beaten Rose since then...wow. 

Good win for the LGs tonight..I must confess that I wasn't able to get down for the game tonight, but it's good to see Wabash winning games against decent teams that they've struggled against in recent history. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 29, 2007, 07:59:32 AM
To be honest, since they went to the SCAC and we went to the NCAC, we hadn't played Rose that much.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2007, 12:40:15 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 29, 2007, 01:30:42 AM
Good win for the LGs tonight..I must confess that I wasn't able to get down for the game tonight, but it's good to see Wabash winning games against decent teams that they've struggled against in recent history. 

Since I jumped on pennstghs for calling Ohio Northern a "top opponent," I feel obligated to object to the above characterization.  Rose is 1-4 against the unimpressive schedule that Chuck makes reference to, and they were picked to finish dead last (http://heartlandconf.org/conference_releases/2007/10_30_mbball_preseason.htm) in the HCAC by that league's coaches.  Still, a win is a win, and if it's against a rival against whom you have struggled, so much the better.  Game story by Wabash's Brent Harris. (http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=5269)

While eagerly waiting ghs's promised analysis of the the Witt/ONU game, here's the game story (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/07-08gamestories/ohionorthern.html) from Ryan Maurer's point of view.  It sounds like it was absolutely gut-wrenching.

Denison did their best Polar Bear impersonation (imursanation?), converting a 10-point deficit at 12:37 to a one-point lead at 4:01, but unlike their Ada counterparts they were unable to hang on to the lead, eventually falling by 8 to the visiting Presidents.  Rookie Larry Farmer (15 points) is starting to look like a player, and may even provide the scoring ability, the lack of which is the bane of this team.  Craig Hicks' game recap. (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/men_s_basketball_presidents_hol.html)

Here also are the SID recaps from Allegheny/Edinboro (http://www.allegheny.edu/cgi-bin/mt/mt-view.cgi/5/entry/7753/menbb_entry) and Hiram/Bluffton (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/news/article.php?id=1524).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 29, 2007, 12:43:52 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 29, 2007, 07:59:32 AM
To be honest, since they went to the SCAC and we went to the NCAC, we hadn't played Rose that much.

According to the Wabsh site, they'd played twice 2004 and 2006.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 29, 2007, 01:10:48 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 29, 2007, 12:40:15 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 29, 2007, 01:30:42 AM
Good win for the LGs tonight..I must confess that I wasn't able to get down for the game tonight, but it's good to see Wabash winning games against decent teams that they've struggled against in recent history. 

Since I jumped on pennstghs for calling Ohio Northern a "top opponent," I feel obligated to object to the above characterization.  Rose is 1-4 against the unimpressive schedule that Chuck makes reference to, and they were picked to finish dead last (http://heartlandconf.org/conference_releases/2007/10_30_mbball_preseason.htm) in the HCAC by that league's coaches.  Still, a win is a win, and if it's against a rival against whom you have struggled, so much the better.  Game story by Wabash's Brent Harris. (http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=5269)

Mea culpa...I should have looked up RHIT's numbers before dubbing them a "decent" team.   ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 29, 2007, 01:21:54 PM
Quote from: sac on November 29, 2007, 12:43:52 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 29, 2007, 07:59:32 AM
To be honest, since they went to the SCAC and we went to the NCAC, we hadn't played Rose that much.

According to the Wabsh site, they'd played twice 2004 and 2006.

I'd say that's not that much...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 29, 2007, 01:57:30 PM
Sorry to keep you guys waiting. Ryan Maurer did a good job, but unless you were in the stands watching the gamer, you can't get a sense of how demoralizing a loss this is. Witt was up 51-41 with 8 minutes to play. And of course ended up losing 59-57.

A couple of observations from the game:

1 – This was really an ugly game to watch all around. As alluded to earlier, both teams shot very poorly from the field, ONU shooting more efficiently from the free throw line. The refs were generally terrible, which means that don't worry NCAC fans we have something to complain about all year. A couple terrible offensive foul calls on Romero
took him out of the game and attributed to his only playing 13 minutes. Very undisciplined and uncharacteristically poor offensive play from Wittenberg as well. It seemed like they didn't have a good flow or sense of what they were trying to do on offense and couldn't finish short shots as well.

2- This was one of those games that might come back to haunt you later on in the year.

3 – Our post play struggled as well. Our 3 true post players (Gregory, Snyder, and Beck) combined for only 13 points. I don't include Barabino in this as he is not your traditional low post presence. It just seems that the inexperience has caused mental lapses and we cannot adjust.

4- DC I completely agree with you now. ONU is NOT that good of a team and along with Capital a very down Wittenberg team lost by a combined 6 points. I think Wittenberg is going to be a formidable team as the season goes on, but they are def. going through some growing pains.

I don't think I've seen a more stunned crowd and myself being demoralized quite like that in some time. Honestly, I don't even know how to explain how we lost that game.

Also, where are all the Wooster supporters-attendance on the boards seems lacking so far.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2007, 02:07:06 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 29, 2007, 01:57:30 PM
Also, where are all the Wooster supporters-attendance on the boards seems lacking so far.....

:o

Now that's a complaint I never thought I'd see...especially from a Wittenberg paritsan!

You've got to admire Witt's devotion to the tough in-region scheduling, even if it is giving them fits early on this season.  Next up for the Tigers is Transylvania in Lexington, and the Pioneers are off to a very slow start.  This could be a good in-region road win for Witt, if they're not caught looking ahead at Cedarville.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 29, 2007, 04:22:00 PM
that is the one strength this witt team does have, i don't think they will look past ANYONE this year. the target is on their backs
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2007, 10:33:05 PM
Observation:  There's 2:23 left in the game, and Wash U. leads Earlham by 30.  Earlham has played just 7 players to this point.  What's going on in Richmond, roster-wise?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2007, 11:45:13 AM
It sounds like we might have some dodgy weather this evening throughout NCAC-land.  Anyone who is out driving in it please take caution and leave some extra time.  I'm thinking particularly of Wooster fans headed to Cedarville, Witt fans on their way to Lexington, and Denison fans headed to Cleveland, all night games.  (I figure the Earlham fans planning to attend the game in St. Louis tonight are already there.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCAC4Life on December 01, 2007, 05:55:03 PM
Capital defested OWU today in front of a full house 70-68. Exciting game with a great crowd and CSN broadcasting the game. Both teams are very good. DC, not sure what you saw in Capital but I saw an aggressive scrappy defensive team with size and the ablity to shoot the three ball today. OWU shot poorly from the line and was outrebounded but overall was pretty good. Both teams will be factors in their respective league races.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2007, 06:18:21 PM
Quote from: NCAC4Life on December 01, 2007, 05:55:03 PMDC, not sure what you saw in Capital but I saw an aggressive scrappy defensive team with size and the ablity to shoot the three ball today.

I'd agree with that.  I wouldn't use this language to describe the 18th-best team in the country, not the overwhelming favorite in a tough league like the OAC, though.  Factor in the race, sure.

Kenyon bested Wabash in the NCAC opener this afternoon, 67-66.  This was a thriller from start to finish.  A bit sloppy, and very physical (especially the battles between Andrew Zimmer and Dave Knapke), but a great game to watch.  I may post more on this game later; right now I'm trying to do too many other things!

Elsewhere, Adrian topped Oberlin, 85-54.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2007, 06:28:14 PM
Now that the NCAC season is underway, I can reveal the results of the Posters' Poll on the conference race.  Perhaps not suprisingly, Wooster is the unanimous choice of all 14 voters to win the regular season title.  However, the posters think the #2 slot is up for grabs.  Here's the tally:

1. Wooster (14)...140
2. Ohio Wesleyan...114
3. Wittenberg...109
4. Wabash...104
5. Allegheny...78
6. Kenyon...77
7. Hiram...46
8. Oberlin...44
9. Earlham...39
10. Denison...19

Here's where the voters slotted these teams:
Wooster...#1 by everyone
Ohio Wesleyan...high #2 (9 votes), low #6 (1 vote)
Wittenberg...high #2 (3), low #5 (1)
Wabash...high #2 (2), low #6 (1)
Allegheny...high #4 (1), low #7 (1)
Kenyon...high #3 (1), low #8 (1)
Hiram...high #6 (3), low #9 (4)
Oberlin...high #7 (6), low #10 (2)
Earlham...high #3 (1), low #10 (2)
Denison...high #8 (1), low #10 (10)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2007, 06:33:19 PM
Earlham has played only 7 players all season. #8 and #9 got their first minute against Wash U.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 01, 2007, 07:20:30 PM
I suspect, had the Pollsters had the benefit of waiting until your December 1st deadline, that they'd have placed Oberlin two spots south, in their usual spot. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2007, 07:39:09 PM
Nah, I still think Denison is worse than Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2007, 07:42:42 PM
DC -

I see where Wabash had the lead by 4 with 3:30 left. What happened? Did Kenyon turn up the defense?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2007, 08:08:51 PM
Final score in from Lexington:  Transylvania 50, Wittenberg 45.  No details yet.

Quote from: smedindy on December 01, 2007, 07:42:42 PM
DC -

I see where Wabash had the lead by 4 with 3:30 left. What happened? Did Kenyon turn up the defense?

There were no "turning points" in this game, at least none that stand out in my mind.  It was just a series of punches, some of which landed, others which missed.  My recollection was that down the stretch Kenyon, particularly the Brothers Haddox, was able to penetrate and get their shots to drop, whereas Wabash's shots from inside and out would not fall when it counted.  The end-game sequence, as I recall it, was that Wabash was forced into some low-percentage shots.  Kenyon's Korey Haddox grabbed a rebound and was fouled with :25 left and a one-point lead, but he missed both free throws (overall KC was 9/19 from the stripe).  However, Wabash was unable to get a good look, and Chase Haltom threw up a prayer with about :02 left, which was rebounded by Dave Jolson to seal the win.  Andrew Zimmer led all scorers with 17 to go along with 10 boards, but he got away with a lot all day long.  Gary Simkus added 16, and rookie Wes Smith, far and away the best athlete at the KAC not wearing a swimsuit, had 13 and 9.  Kenyon got 30 from the Haddoxes (Kodey 16, Korey 14) and a double-double (12/10) from Dave Knapke.   Box score. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26062.xml)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 01, 2007, 08:12:30 PM
The Scots started the freshman Wickliffe tonight over Melick.  Melick did come in first off the bench in the big man rotation.  I don't know if I missed it, but what exactly is the deal with Elam?  I had read in the DR last week that he is close to returning from an injury.  What exactly is the injury?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2007, 08:30:06 PM
Elam has a lingering knee injury.  He's been cleared to play, but evidently hasn't felt like he can go all-out just yet, and the coaches don't want him to play at half-speed.

Here's the box score (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/07-08statistics/witm1201.htm) from Witt/Transy.  Looks ugly: Witt shot 38.3%; Transy just 30.9%, but that was just one fewer bucket, since Witt turned the ball over 21 times, giving Transy 8 more FGA.  Transy technically won the game at the foul line, as the teams each scored 42 from the floor.  Witt had just 6 FT attempts on the game, hitting just 3; Transy was 8/14 (and each team had 14 fouls called against them.)  Just looks ugly all around.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2007, 08:48:55 PM
It took the combined efforts of Claremont-McKenna College, Harvey Mudd College, and Scripps College to do it, but Earlham College was defeated tonight 60-47 in the consolation of the Lopata Classic in St. Louis.  Once again, just 7 Quakers quaked, a strategy I find highly questionable.  I mean, how bad must that 8th man be?   Anyway, Nick Welsh led the way with 21, aided by Tristan Gregory's 14 points and Tarrell Barry's 10 rebounds.  The Earlham 7 shot a collective 32.7% (and just 18.2% from the arc), and that won't get it done against many opponents.  Box (http://bearsports.wustl.edu/mensbball/CMS-EC.HTM).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 01, 2007, 09:09:14 PM
Wooster's in another dogfight on the road as they trail 51-47 with just under 8 to play at Cedarville.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2007, 09:46:17 PM
Cedarville prevails, 65-61.  Seems like a lot of NCAC teams were icy-cold on this icy-cold night, and Wooster was no exception, hitting 33% and putting exactly nobody in double figures.  Oh well, Cedarville's a good team (highly ranked in NAIA 2), and at least from a March perspective, it doesn't count.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 01, 2007, 10:02:29 PM
Wooster drops their 2nd in a row falling at NAIA #2 Cedarville 65-61.  Quite surprising to have such a low scoring affair considering both teams came into the game averaging over 87 ppg.  Also factor in the last meeting between these two teams was a high octane affair with the Scots winning 104-95 last season.

I really don't think the Scots have anything to hang their heads about tonight.  Wooster only shot 33% from the field, but I think a lot of that can be attributed to the tremendous size advatage that Cedarville enjoyed over the Scots.  Coach Moore mentioned that this was probably the most talented team that the Scots would face all season and I would probably agree. 

Some positives from tonight.  Wooster did only turn the ball over 11 times.  Wickliffe had a good game and finally stayed out of foul trouble, but on the other hand, Robert Melick had a good game offensively as he was 4-5 from the floor.  But he just couldn't stay on the floor as he was in constant foul trouble.

One surprisng stat was that Wooster was able to out-rebound Cedarville tonight.  Unfortunately, they couldn't coralle the most important rebound of the night which was an offensive rebound by the Yellow Jacket's big man, Christopher Walker, after a missed 3 pointer with the Scots only trailing by 1.  He not only grabbed the rebound, but made the put-back and was fouled converting a crucial 3-point play. 

One last surprising stat is that no Scot finished in double figures?! :o  They entered the game with five players averaging at least double figures! 

Overall, I think this is definately a loss that the Scots can take and build off of.  They played a very talented team on the road in a pretty hostile environment and still almost pulled off the upset. 

Well, now the road trip continues for yet another week as Wooster travels to Oberlin midweek for what should be a glorified scrimmage and a tuneup for a crucial early NCAC match-up with the up and coming OWU Bishops.  And the way that they played Cap today, I don't know if I'll be able to keep myself from attending that game in person!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2007, 10:23:45 PM
The exclamation point on a fairly dismal day for the NCAC was administered by Case Western Reserve, a 102-56 whuppin' of Denison.  Case had nearly all they'd need by halftime, cruising out to a 52-28 lead at the break.  On paper, this game looks exactly this bad:  Case missed more shots than Denison made (50% more, in fact), and still shot 59.1% for the game.   :o  The Spartans drilled exactly half of their 32 three-point attempts, out rebounded the not-very-Big Red by 10, and forced 19 turnovers (vs. 11 of their own), and recorded 7 blocks and 13 steals.  Denison was led (if that's the correct word) by Pat Sullivan's 15 and Larry Farmer's 12; these two (collectively 12'2" tall) were also the leading rebounders, with 6 and 7, respectively.  Sounds like a thorough domination.  I hope this is as low as it gets for the Big Red.  Recap and box (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/men_s_basketball_case_western_.html).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 01, 2007, 11:41:52 PM
http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/index.html

David please go to this page and you will see how bad number 8 through 12 look... anymore questions about only playing 7????
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 02, 2007, 01:50:13 AM
Quote from: earlhamalum on December 01, 2007, 11:41:52 PM
http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/index.html

David please go to this page and you will see how bad number 8 through 12 look... anymore questions about only playing 7????

One can't always go by appearance... (http://espn.go.com/i/magazine/new/larry_bird_245x325.jpg)  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 02, 2007, 01:14:23 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 02, 2007, 01:50:13 AM
Quote from: earlhamalum on December 01, 2007, 11:41:52 PM
http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/index.html

David please go to this page and you will see how bad number 8 through 12 look... anymore questions about only playing 7????

One can't always go by appearance... (http://espn.go.com/i/magazine/new/larry_bird_245x325.jpg)  ;D

It does work sometimes (http://cache.viewimages.com/xc/1397134.jpg?v=1&c=ViewImages&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF1939057D9939C83F10688F4BEB274F471A55A5397277B4DC33E).   :D 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on December 02, 2007, 07:57:51 PM
Hey My name is sean and I was number 44... thank god i did not look that bad!!! and i spell my name differently too!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 03, 2007, 08:57:52 AM
Just for the record although its been mentioned already. The Wooster loss at Cedarville was not a bad loss at all. Cedarville is a really good team, with exceptional depth and size, so losing on the road is not a bad loss. And from what my sources told me(I was not in attendance), Wooster killed themselves with many shots rimming out and turnovers. However, this shows that this team is vulnerable.

How many times this early in the season have Wooster and Wittenberg both had at least 2 losses?????
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 03, 2007, 09:44:51 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 03, 2007, 08:57:52 AM
Wooster killed themselves with many shots rimming out and turnovers. However, this shows that this team is vulnerable.
pennstghs,

Wooster did have a hard time getting the ball to drop through the net on Saturday.  Wooster managed to shoot just over 33%.  However, turnovers were not a problem in this loss for Wooster.  They had a season low in turning the ball over just 11 times.

I think what you pointed to about Cedarville's exceptional size, depth and atleticism is what contrubuted most towards the Scot's woeful shooting efforts.  I was very surprised when I heard the stat that the Scots had only committed 11 turnovers and they actually outrebounded Cedarville 49-45.

Does anyone want to put a wager on what  the margin of victory will be for the Scots vs. Oberlin on Wednesday?  My guess is that it won't be a pretty site if you're a Yeomen!

Quote from: pennstghs on December 03, 2007, 08:57:52 AM
How many times this early in the season have Wooster and Wittenberg both had at least 2 losses?????
I can't answer the question for Witt, but Wooster last started the season 2-2 back in the 97-98 campaign where they ended up with a 22-6 record including going 15-1 in the NCAC.  Incidentally, both of those early losses were to non-DIII opponents in Tiffin (DII) and Harvard (DI).

To find Wooster's worst start in recent memory, you would have to go back to the 92-93 season where the Scots were only 4-4 after eight games!  Included in those L's were losses to Hiram and Denison!  Wooster went on to finish 21-7 that season.  They also won the conference tournament gaining an automatic bid into the NCAA's.

So, Wooster stumbling a bit out of the gate doesn't exactly spell doom and gloom.  There is still a lot of basketball left to be played.  And one encouraging aspect is that Saturday's loss won't come into play in the eyes of the NCAA. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 03, 2007, 12:50:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 01, 2007, 09:46:17 PM
Cedarville prevails, 65-61. 

Quote from: ScotsFan on December 03, 2007, 09:44:51 AM
and they actually outrebounded Cedarville 49-45.

94 rebounds in a 65-61 game?  Holy brick house.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2007, 01:01:54 PM
They meant to shoot like that. Just padding the rebounding totals, ya know!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 03, 2007, 06:32:51 PM
The NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) this week is Kenyon's Dave Knapke.  His double-double and (what would turn out to be the) game-winning stickback against Wabash--giving the Lords sole possession of first place in the NCAC--were cited in the announcement of his award.  Congratulations, Dave!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 03, 2007, 09:27:54 PM
Last Second Shot Propels Gators to Victory (http://www.allegheny.edu/cgi-bin/mt/mt-view.cgi/5/entry/7774/menbb_entry)
Allegheny 68, Westminster 66.  Sorry, ScotsFan!  'Gheny outrebounded Westminster 46-27...Gators had 18 offensive rebounds (vs. 23 defensive for Titans).  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2007, 04:06:10 PM
Slow news day in Wooster; the Daily Record's Mike Plant uses a Scots JV game as an excuse to write about JVs in general.  Link to article (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/2939752) (subscription may be required).  In the game, the Scots defeated Wayne College  77-41.

Wooster's varsity team extended their Top 25 streak to 79 weeks, second only to Amherst (81), but just barely: in the new poll released this morning, the Scots are #25.  Both Wittenberg and OWU lost what little support they were getting; in the case of the Tigers, it's the first time in 57 weeks that they've not gotten at least one vote.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 04, 2007, 07:55:13 PM
That drop in the ranking seems a bit dramatic to me- maybe I don't understand enough about how people view NAIA-II programs, but Cedarville is a highly ranked team (4th).  The game was also at Cedarville.

Anyway, I'm not really interested in dwelling on the rankings, I just was expecting to see Wooster more around 19-21 than at 25th.

Far more crucial is the start of conference play for the Scots (and most of the rest of the NCAC).  Hopefully Oberlin will serve as a game where the Scots can find a nice rhythm and can put in a good all-around performance.  I know they'll need everything they've got for the absolutely crucial early season conference tilt at OWU Saturday.  It might be as close to a must-win game as you can have this early in a season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2007, 09:10:32 PM
Cedarville completes the sweep, defeating visiting Wittenberg 73-58.  Cedarville drains 17 of 32 treys (53%), thwarting numerous Tiger runs.  Witt was led by Gregg Hill's 19 and Kevin Murray's 17.  Witt shot 33%, just like Wooster did at Cedarville; Cedarville shot 46%.

Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 04, 2007, 07:55:13 PM
That drop in the ranking seems a bit dramatic to me- maybe I don't understand enough about how people view NAIA-II programs, but Cedarville is a highly ranked team (4th).  The game was also at Cedarville.

I'd venture to guess that part of Wooster's drop is trepidation over the upcoming OWU game.  The voters don't like to over-rank teams when they can avoid it.  If Wooster wins that game (and the Oberlin game), then their ranking should go back up into the high teens or low twenties.

Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 04, 2007, 07:55:13 PMFar more crucial is the start of conference play for the Scots (and most of the rest of the NCAC).  Hopefully Oberlin will serve as a game where the Scots can find a nice rhythm and can put in a good all-around performance.  I know they'll need everything they've got for the absolutely crucial early season conference tilt at OWU Saturday.  It might be as close to a must-win game as you can have this early in a season.

It is certainly a must-win game, especially psychologically, for the Scots.  But it may be even bigger for the Bishops, since they must protect their home court if they want to win the conference title.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 04, 2007, 09:57:39 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 04, 2007, 07:55:13 PM
That drop in the ranking seems a bit dramatic to me- maybe I don't understand enough about how people view NAIA-II programs, but Cedarville is a highly ranked team (4th).  The game was also at Cedarville


Those familiar with NAIA II know that good basketball players and teams can be found at this level.  Some very comparable to top 25 D3 teams.

Outside the 4 state region of Illinois, Indiana, Ohio and Michigan not much respect is given to the NAIA II's from the D3 crowd.

With regards to the poll, Wooster has 2 losses, hard to justify a team with 2 losses being much higher than 20 in a poll this early in the season.  There are many, many teams that will make it January with fewer losses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2007, 10:06:57 PM
Quote from: sac on December 04, 2007, 09:57:39 PM
With regards to the poll, Wooster has 2 losses, hard to justify a team with 2 losses being much higher than 20 in a poll this early in the season.

About #20 is what we (Bryan and I, and perhaps others) were expecting:

Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 04, 2007, 07:55:13 PM
Anyway, I'm not really interested in dwelling on the rankings, I just was expecting to see Wooster more around 19-21 than at 25th.

There are, however, two teams ranked above #20 that have two losses: #12 Wash U. and #18 Calvin...and Calvin now has three losses, as they were beaten by Aquinas by 16 tonight (they lost to AQ in 2OT earlier this season).

Personally, I have concerns about Wooster's depth and post play, and would be very hesitant to rank them any higher than where they are now.  Furthermore, I have predicted that they'll lose at OWU on Saturday, and thus drop out of the poll altogether.  But I also expect them to improve as the season progresses and end up back in or near the top 10.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 04, 2007, 11:12:45 PM
I see the Woo - Ohwoo game as basically a pick'em.  It could all come down to the final seconds as it did two years ago when Tom Port's last second game-winning three attempt rimmed out from the corner.  That was my first Wooster road game, and I got hooked.

Yeah, post play and depth, in no particular order.  With just a little improvement in those areas Wooster will probably win the conference.  But it will take some serious bolstering (Elam, maybe, eventually?) for Wooster to make any sort of run in the tournament.  I hope it happens, but I haven't seen the beginnings of it yet.

By the way, I saw Kyle Molz's name in the Wooster JV boxscore.  I'd heard that he had a bad ankle injury and it's nice to see that he's back on the court.  I'm still thinking that someday, if not later this year, he can help the varsity program.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 04, 2007, 11:23:27 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 04, 2007, 10:06:57 PM
There are, however, two teams ranked above #20 that have two losses: #12 Wash U. and #18 Calvin...and Calvin now has three losses, as they were beaten by Aquinas by 16 tonight (they lost to AQ in 2OT earlier this season).
I'm also surprised that Wooster took such a drop losing to such a good team.  As far as the other teams still ranked ahead of Wooster with two losses, WashU was the preseason #1 and their losses were to ranked opponents so I can see why they are still as high as they are.  As for Calvin, I guess they are still riding the coat tails of beating WashU when they were still #1.

Quote from: David Collinge on December 04, 2007, 10:06:57 PM

Personally, I have concerns about Wooster's depth and post play, and would be very hesitant to rank them any higher than where they are now.  Furthermore, I have predicted that they'll lose at OWU on Saturday, and thus drop out of the poll altogether.  But I also expect them to improve as the season progresses and end up back in or near the top 10.
I agree with your concerns with regards to Wooster's depth and post play.  I think Melick made some strides in that Cedarville game but foul trouble thwarted what could have been a career game for him.  I also think that getting Elam back will help kill two birds with one stone as it should help in post play as well as lengthen Wooster's bench. 

Quote from: David Collinge on December 04, 2007, 09:10:32 PM

Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 04, 2007, 07:55:13 PMFar more crucial is the start of conference play for the Scots (and most of the rest of the NCAC).  Hopefully Oberlin will serve as a game where the Scots can find a nice rhythm and can put in a good all-around performance.  I know they'll need everything they've got for the absolutely crucial early season conference tilt at OWU Saturday.  It might be as close to a must-win game as you can have this early in a season.

It is certainly a must-win game, especially psychologically, for the Scots.  But it may be even bigger for the Bishops, since they must protect their home court if they want to win the conference title.
I commented on this game being a must win when I made my prediction on the Pick 'Em board.  I agree with David in that it is a must win for both teams and it is hard to tell which team needs the win more.  For Wooster, as David pointed out, a loss could be devastating to Wooster from a psychological standpoint.  I really think they need this win to get them back on track to having a successful season.  For OWU, this is a game that could put them in control of the conference early on.  In seasons past, they have always found ways to lose games they shouldn't, thus pretty much eliminating them from contention.  An early win over Wooster could go a long way in helping them carry that momentum throughout the season.

Should make for one heck of a game down in Delaware on Saturday night.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 05, 2007, 12:09:50 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 04, 2007, 11:23:27 PM
Should make for one heck of a game down in Delaware on Saturday night.

I totally agree. I'll definitely be in attendance, but for those Woo/OWU fans who might be more geographically challenged, OWU will be streaming the game live over the internet. (http://stream.owu.edu/)

Quote from: sac on December 04, 2007, 09:57:39 PM
With regards to the poll, Wooster has 2 losses, hard to justify a team with 2 losses being much higher than 20 in a poll this early in the season.  There are many, many teams that will make it January with fewer losses.

I am aware of this. 2-2 is not an impressive body of work; nor would 3-3 be (if Wooster were to split their games this week).  There hasn't been enough time to feel out just how good this Wooster team is, unlike last year when it was known from the start as a legitimate national contender.

Wooster does already have a "signature win" on their resume, though, as they represent the "1" in St. Thomas's 6-1 record, a win that looks better almost every day.  (Wooster scored 85 pts. in that game, and UST has yet to give up more than 70 to any other D3 opponent.)

I remember thinking last year that Wooster was significantly better than Capital, a matchup that almost came about in the tournament. I'll see the 2008 version of Capital tomorrow and consider how they might matchup this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 05, 2007, 09:20:02 PM
Wooster downs Oberlin, 94-54.  Box Score. (http://www.oberlin.edu/athletic/varsity/m_basketball/statistics/2007-2008/obem1205.htm)

Wooster puts six in double figures, highlighted by Fulk and Geitgey each going 4-4 from behind the arc.  I didn't listen to it, any comments?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2007, 11:33:34 PM
Also...
Hiram drills Franciscan 97-71 to get off the schneid.  Four Terriers score 15 or more points.  Recap  (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/news/article.php?id=1530)- Box Score. (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/hirm1205.htm)

Kenyon drops another heartbreaker, this time to Case, 84-81, at Gambier.  Frustrated in my plans to see the JCU/Muskingum game (which was postponed), I ended up at this game instead.  It was a thriller to the wire, but Kenyon actually lost the game in the final 8 seconds of the first half.  Trailing 42-40, Case held the ball for a last shot.  The Case guard initiated the offense with 8 seconds left, and 2 seconds or so later he had an open 8-foot jumper, caused by two effective screens and a sleepy Kenyon defense.  Then Kenyon lazily inbounded the ball, which was promptly stolen and laid in for two more at the buzzer.  Those 4 points account for the final margin, plus one for lagniappe.

Case continued its torrid shooting, hitting 46.6% for the game, including 45.8% (11/24) from the arc.  Case's hot shooting was the result of three interrelated factors: 1) they're just good shooters, especially 6'7" junior Brad Sutton  (22 points, 5/8 from the arc); 2) they pass the ball extremely well, leading to many uncontested shots anywhere from 1 to 21 feet from the hoop; and 3) they are excellent on the offensive glass, grabbing 10 offensive rebounds tonight.  Kenyon, on the other hand, is a streaky-shooting team (40.5% overall, but just 24.1% from deep, including only 3/16 in the second half) who has a certain amount of difficulty passing the ball.  Kenyon's ball movement around the perimeter tends to be just so slightly off the mark, which gives the defense an extra moment to react and/or interferes with the shooter's catch-and-release.  Their passes into the paint are also frequently just a wee bit awry, which tends to lead to turnovers (13 tonight, not too bad), blocked shots (Case had 4), and fouls (Case committed 20, mostly in the second half.)  Sending Kenyon to the line has so far been an effective strategy, as they're hitting at just a 61.1% clip this season and bricked 10 more attempts tonight (58.3%).

All this is not to suggest that Kenyon never functions on offense; quite the reverse.  Bryan Yelvington and Dave Knapke, both of whom have been effective both inside and out, each recorded double-doubles tonight.  Yelvington, the team's leading scorer (15.3) and rebounder (9.2) had 18 and 11, while Knapke, second in both categories, had his fourth straight double-double, recording 15 points and 11 boards.  Between them they snatched 9 offensive boards, with the remainder of the squad contributing another 9; the 8 rebound edge on the offensive glass led to an overall rebounding advantage of +2 for the Lords (43-41).  Knapke's stats included a sequence within the last 2:00 of the game that gave the Lords a 4-point lead: he followed his shot (something so few shooters seem to do these days), grabbing the rebound while driving through the lane, and recorded the stickback and foul, which he converted.  At this point Kenyon had all the momentum as well as the enthusiasm of the student section.  However, the Lords failed to score on their next three possessions (a charge and two missed threes), while Case hit an open three and three free throws to regain a lead they would not relinquish.  Kenyon falls to 1-5; Case moves to 7-2, including a 4-1 record against NCAC opposition (lost to Earlham, beat Kenyon, Denison, Oberlin, and Hiram.)  Box score. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26077.xml)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 06, 2007, 12:05:28 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 01, 2007, 08:12:30 PM
I don't know if I missed it, but what exactly is the deal with [Craig] Elam?  I had read in the [Daily Record] last week that he is close to returning from an injury.  What exactly is the injury?

Quote from: David Collinge on December 01, 2007, 08:30:06 PM
Elam has a lingering knee injury.  He's been cleared to play, but evidently hasn't felt like he can go all-out just yet, and the coaches don't want him to play at half-speed.

I see that Elam played 8 minutes tonight at Oberlin.  (Box score. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/boxes/2007-08/oberlin.php))  I further see that Evan Will did not play.  Anyone care to comment on that?  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 06, 2007, 12:14:00 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 06, 2007, 12:05:28 AM
I see that Elam played 8 minutes tonight at Oberlin.  (Box score. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/boxes/2007-08/oberlin.php))  I further see that Evan Will did not play.  Anyone care to comment on that?  ???

From the play-by-play box score, it looks like Elam was in for the very end of the first half and then about the last 6-7 minutes of the second half.

Devin Fulk's first career start tonight, according to the Wooster write-up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 06, 2007, 01:49:06 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 05, 2007, 11:33:34 PMThose 4 points account for the final margin, plus one for lagniappe.

Good to see that you're still carrying around a bit of Nawlins with you, DC. ;) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 06, 2007, 10:42:54 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 06, 2007, 12:05:28 AM
I see that Elam played 8 minutes tonight at Oberlin.  (Box score. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/boxes/2007-08/oberlin.php))  I further see that Evan Will did not play.  Anyone care to comment on that?  ???

According to Zach Bollinger of the Daily Record ('Fulk Helps Wooster Hand it to Oberlin' (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/2952651), subscription may be required), Evan Will has a mild hamstring pull suffered in practice this week.  His absence is the reason for Devin Fulk's first career start.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 06, 2007, 11:36:34 AM
There was some noise over the summer about a potentially great college player of Asian decent that Oberlin was getting.  Oberlin recruited him from some Prep school in California.  If my memory saves me right, he was expected to turn things around for the Yeomen.  I however don't remember his name though.  My apologies for that.  So based on what you've seen of him so far, assuming you know who I'm talking about (if he is even playing), what do you make of him?   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 06, 2007, 12:05:26 PM
Quote from: WooMix on December 06, 2007, 11:36:34 AM
There was some noise over the summer about a potentially great college player of Asian decent that Oberlin was getting.  Oberlin recruited him from some Prep school in California.  If my memory saves me right, he was expected to turn things around for the Yeomen.  I however don't remember his name though.  My apologies for that.  So based on what you've seen of him so far, assuming you know who I'm talking about (if he is even playing), what do you make of him?   :)

Oberlin.edu article on their four recruits. (http://www.oberlin.edu/athletic/varsity/m_basketball/archive/2007-2008/mbb_recruits_082007.html)  Two of the four (Gian Chiu and Ryan Magiera) are starters, and the other two (Bernhard and Tompsett) see playing time. 
* Chiu started every game until last night, when he did not play for reasons unknown to me.  He's averaging 4.3 pts. and 2.5 rebs. in 20.8 minutes/game so far, and has 6 blocks in 6 games.  He's the only Asian of the four, so perhaps he's who you are thinking of.
* Magiera is averaging 6.7 and 2.4 in 25 mpg.  He has 24 turnovers in 7 games (5 starts.)  He had 5 points (2/9 shooting), 4 turnovers, and 3 rebounds in 26 minutes last night.
* Bernhard and Tompsett each have started one game--Tompsett's start was last night--and appeared in all seven.  Tompsett has the better stats: 4.6 ppg (.519 shooting), 3.6 reb., 10 blocks, and just 6 turnovers (and 6 assists) in 18.6 mpg.  Berhnard (9.6 mpg) plays sparingly and is averaging 1.7 and 1.0.  Neither was effective last night (combined for 7 pts. and 5 reb. in 24 minutes.)
I haven't yet seen Oberlin, but it's safe to say that none of these first-years has managed to turn things around for the 0-7 Yeomen yet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 06, 2007, 01:20:46 PM
Chiu is the man.  He was a highly touted 6'9" post player from the Phillipines via California.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 06, 2007, 01:22:36 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 06, 2007, 12:05:28 AM
I see that Elam played 8 minutes tonight at Oberlin.  (Box score. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/boxes/2007-08/oberlin.php))  I further see that Evan Will did not play.  Anyone care to comment on that?  ???
Nice to see Elam back in action last night just in time for the big showdown in Delaware.  Not so nice to see that Will was out of the game with an injury?!  I hope Will's injury is indeed a mild hamstring problem and that they were just holding him out of Wednesday's game for precautionary reasons.  If he's out Saturday, that could really decrease Wooster's chances in coming away with a win.

Some other thoughts as I was perusing the NCAC statistics web-page...

First, how about Devin Fulk and the season he is putting together this year.  He is leading the league in overall shooting percentage.  And after last night's 6-6 performance he now is sitting at 64%! :o   Also, with his 4-4 performance from beyond the arc, he is now up to 57 % from 3-point range!  He is also now leading the team in scoring at 15.2 ppg surpassing James Cooper last night.  Although, I would expect Coop to retake the lead in scoring if and when he finds his range again.

As for Cooper and his shooting woes, he is only shooting 39% overall and just 32% from beyond the arc?! :o  This is from a guy that shot 54% overall the past 2 season's combined and a combined 45% from 3-point range over that span as well!  For as much talk about the lack of production from inside with this team, the Scots really need to hope that Coop can get things going as well.  And soon!

Some other interesting stats that caught my eye concerning Wooster involved rebounding and turnovers.  Not surpirsingly, Wooster is leading the league in rebounding margin at almost +10 per game.  What I thought was surprising was that they were almost +7 ahead of the next closest team which is Witt at +3.4.

And as far as the turnover statistics go, Wooster is negative in this category for the first time in a long time at -1.75.  They are also below 1 in assist/turnover ratio for the first time I can remember.  The Scots seem to have been improving in turning the ball over less as they followed up a season low 11 turnovers against Cedarville with a new season low of 10 last night.  Wooster will need to keep their turnovers down closer to their last 2 games or they will have a tough time winning Saturday if they are up around the 20+ range instead.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 06, 2007, 02:27:57 PM
Six games into the season and Wittenberg (1-5) has already matched or exceeded their loss totals from each of the last four years.  Looking ahead, the Tigers have three more non-conference games, all at home, against Otterbein (1-5), Olivet (2-4), and either Wisconsin-La Crosse (4-2) or NAIA's Marian (4-4).  The best-case scenario appears to be a 2-1 run--they're unlikely to beat LaX, and probably would have to lose to Olivet to avoid playing the Eagles. 

The Tigers have what surely is the longest intact season winning streak in all of college basketball: their last non-winning season was 1967-68 (13-13), and their last losing season was in 1955-56 (8-12), 52 seasons ago.  Should Witt post a non-conference record of 3-6, they'd have to post a conference record of 10-6 have a winning regular season.  While that is, of course, not out of the question, it would probably require the Tigers to win at least 4 games against a group including Wooster, OWU, Wabash, Allegheny, and Kenyon. 

Without significant mid-year improvement, I'd have to say that Wittenberg's 52-year winning streak is in serious jeopardy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 06, 2007, 02:34:12 PM
DC you may be right but i wouldn't be too quick to count this team out. They have been competitive in every game, with their inexperience and youth hampering their ability to finish games. I think they will be fine, it just takes time to go through the learning process. I have been wrong often though.

Time to get win number 2 Saturday!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 06, 2007, 09:16:11 PM
Final from Chadwick Court:

DePauw 60
Wabash 71

Wabash led the entire game and the LGs were up double digits at the half. DePauw made a run in the 2nd half getting as close as 6 but Wabash held the Tigers off and go home with a crowd pleasing win.

That's a great ending to a crappy day for this LG fan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 06, 2007, 10:31:55 PM
Whats Wabash doing playing a girls school.  ;) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 06, 2007, 10:48:21 PM
Back from Chadwick and almost fully transitioned into hoops mode....the eyeball report from tonight's action...

As LG mentioned, Wabash opened with 5 Earl Rooks points and never looked back.  Wabash led by as many as 9 early in the game, but DePauw came back on the back on Mike Moore (who is a really good little point guard) and tied the score with about 8 minutes to go in the first half.  Wabash responded with a little run of their own and went to half up by 10 points.  Chase Haltom led the LGs with 10 first half points and Zimmer (as you would expect from a senior playing his last game vs. DPU) added 9 in the first half. 

The second half was more of the same for Wabash....timely shooting with stout defense and excellent rebounding kept the Tigers at bay for the remainder of the game.  DPU briefly got within 5 or 6 once or twice, but never really threatened throughout the second  half.  Wes Smith chipped in with 8 second half rebounds. 

For the game, Zimmer, Haltom, Rooks, and Smith all reached double figures.  Wes  Smith notched a double-double with 14 points and 11 rebounds. 

I was impressed with Wabash's tenacity on the glass tonight...very few DePauw rebounds came easy.  Overall a really good effort from the LGs tonight and a good win for Wabash. 

Quote from: sac on December 06, 2007, 10:31:55 PM
Whats Wabash doing playing a girls school.  ;) :D

This is Hall of Fame quality posting.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 07, 2007, 01:01:09 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 06, 2007, 02:27:57 PM
Six games into the season and Wittenberg (1-5) has already matched or exceeded their loss totals from each of the last four years.  Looking ahead, the Tigers have three more non-conference games, all at home, against Otterbein (1-5)

I'll bet that the last time that both Wittenberg and Otterbein had losing records when they met on the basketball court was back when you still had to climb a ladder and fish the ball out of the peach basket after a made shot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2007, 09:43:30 AM
WOOT! Glad to hear 'Bash took care of business and somewhat made up for the Monon Bell loss...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2007, 10:49:44 AM
The Daily Record's Zach Bollinger reports today that Evan Will should be available for tomorrow's game at OWU.  Will comments about this injury and the decision to sit him down at Oberlin:
Quote from: Zach Bollinger, the Daily Record"It's nothing serious," Will said.  "We just decided to take it easy, make sure I would be ready for Saturday. [...] I will be ready to go."
The article does not appear in the online edition (http://www.the-daily-record.com/).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DanTHEman67 on December 07, 2007, 10:50:15 AM
Witt. is just going through some growing pains with young players, but it must be agreed they have been competitive against some teams that are rated quite highly.  Don't count them out. I truly believe they will make some noise before the season ends.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 07, 2007, 04:38:13 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 06, 2007, 10:48:21 PM
This is Hall of Fame quality posting.  :)

Shamless, wasn't it.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2007, 09:36:39 PM
Kenyon drops Ohio Christian tonight, 78-65, at Mt. Vernon Nazarene U.  Kenyon, to my eyes the vastly superior team, played 20 minutes of uninspired and ineffective basketball at both ends, limping to halftime trailing 37-36.  They must have gotten a wake-up call in the locker room, as they started the second half on an 18-2 run to put the game away.  I confess I stopped paying close attention at that point, spending most of the second half pestering the patient father of one of the KC players with my inane chatter.  It seemed like every time I looked up, either Dave Knapke or Bryan Yelvington was ripping down another rebound, and the box score bears this out.  Knapke had a monster game with 20 points and 16 rebounds, while Yelvington added 14 and 12, including a welcome 6/8 performance from the free throw line.  (Overall, the Lords were 14/18 from the stripe, including 12/12 in the second half.)  Defensively, the first half Lords allowed the smaller Trailblazers to penetrate and get open looks, and as a result they hit 44.8% of their shots.  The second half Lords were having none of that, though, as they clamped down on OCU, holding them to 30.6% shooting, and just 8 buckets from inside the arc (in 31 attempts).  Since OCU was one-and-done all night (Kenyon dominated the glass 54-26), the much tougher second half interior defense spelled the Trailblazers' doom.

After building up the big lead, it seemed that Kenyon coasted a little and OCU hung around, getting to within a few possessions, but I never felt that the outcome was in doubt--not even during the miserable first half; Kenyon is just that much bigger, stronger, and more talented than the Trailblazers.  Tomorrow will be a horse of a different color, though, as the Lords take on MVNU, the #8 ranked team in NAIA 2.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on December 08, 2007, 03:48:10 PM
Fwiw, OW-COW game is being video streamed from the OW website (link from the Wooster basketball website).

Wooster 39 OW 34 at half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 08, 2007, 03:59:07 PM
We've got a back and forth game happening at Chadwick this afternoon.  Marian leads Wabash 22-21 at the break.  Neither team is shooting particularly well.  Wabash is using offensive rebounds to stay right with the Knights. 

Zimmer was held scoreless for Wabash in the first half...needless to say trailing by a single point with the team's offensive leader not on the board is a good thing for Wabash.  Let's hop Zim can get going here as the second half starts. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on December 08, 2007, 04:48:05 PM
Wooster pulls out win 80-77 at OWU
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 08, 2007, 04:53:38 PM
This has not been the prettiest game to listen to....Wabash fell behind by 7 pretty early in the second half and has clawed their way back to a tie at 48-48 on Zimmer's first field goal of the night with 45 seconds to play.  Right now we've got 25 seconds to play, Marian has the ball.  

Marian holds...holds...holds....Marian misses a layup and the rebound goes to Zimmer.  Wabash gets a timeout with 4 seconds to play.  

And my feed cut out...now it's back and it sounds like we're going to OT.  Wabash shot 9-19 from the free throw line in regulation.  That stat stands out in a tie game.  

Back and forth in the overtime here as well....Haltom just nailed a HUGE three pointer to give Wabash a 59-57 lead with 28 seconds to play.  Marian's attempt to answer is no good and Wabash has the rebound.  Brian Maloney has free throw shots here for Wabash with 4 seconds to play.  The first shot is no good.  Marian calls timeout.  The second shot is good.  Marian is unable to get a shot off.  Wabash wins 60-57. 

Whaddya know...that's a winning streak for the LGs.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 08, 2007, 08:25:15 PM
NCAC scores that I can dredge up...

Wabash 60, Marian 57 (OT)
Allegheny 72, Denison 50
Oberlin 68, Earlham 59  :o
Witt 77, Hiram 57
Mt. Vernon Nazarene 80, Kenyon 68
Wooster 80, OWU 77
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2007, 11:33:10 PM
It's been a long day, and it's not yet over.  I'm too tired to post much on the games I saw today, so I'll let the SIDs speak for me:

Scots Hold Off OWU's Rally, Retaking Lead Twice During Final 1:03 for 80-77 Win (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/recaps/2007-08/owu.php), by Hugh Howard (Wooster)
My comments:  Both teams played poorly for most or all of the first half, perhaps feeling the pressure of the big game.  Wooster took control late in the first half and stayed in control until, presumably to deal with their foul troubles, they went into a slow-down offense, nearly a four-corners.  That's not Wooster's game, and it gave OWU a chance to get back into the game.  The last two minutes, which were back and forth, were reminiscent of many Woo/Witt games.  OWU was a miserable 7/28 (25%) from the arc; if they had been any hotter, or conversely any less eager to pull the trigger on the trey, the result might have been different.  Any worries about James Cooper's early season funk can be laid to rest with a big "32" stamped on them.

Cougars Sprint Past Kenyon (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26093.xml), by Marty Fuller (Kenyon)
My comments: Like last night, Kenyon was woeful in the first half, and very sharp in the second.  The difference was the opponent: Ohio Christian was easy pickins, but MVNU (9-0 and #8 in NAIA-2) is the real deal.  The fact that Kenyon "won" the second half by 12 is very encouraging, since, despite building a 24-point halftime lead, it did not appear that MVNU let up much if at all.  MVNU took over the gym, making it a virtual home court (with much, much better lighting), but the two schools disagree on how many Cougar Crazies were there.  Kenyon reports the attendance as 725, while MVNU says it was 1325.  Hmmm.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2007, 11:37:39 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 08, 2007, 08:25:15 PM
Oberlin 68, Earlham 59  :o

Okay, let's work this out:
Oberlin beat Earlham by 9
Earlham beat Lake Erie by 3
Lake Erie beat Wooster by 2
Wooster beat St. Thomas by 6
St. Thomas beat Winona St. by 1
...somebody more knowledgeable with D2/D1 hoops can take it up from here, but already we "know" that Oberlin is three touchdowns better than the best D2 team in the country, right? :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 09, 2007, 04:27:12 PM
Regardless of level, 34 assists in a game of basketball is pretty incredible!

Division III Grinnell's Arseneault shatters NCAA assists record (ESPN) (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3147898)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 09, 2007, 05:24:51 PM
Quote from: WooMix on December 09, 2007, 04:27:12 PM
Regardless of level, 34 assists in a game of basketball is pretty incredible!

Division III Grinnell's Arseneault shatters NCAA assists record (ESPN) (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3147898)

I disagree.  Grinnell doesn't play to win, they play to break records.  This is meaningless as far as I'm concerned. 

You'll note the quote in there about wanting to play the best two offensive players for longer stretches...not because it helps the team win but because the coach wanted to see how many points those two kids could score.  That doesn't sit quite right with me. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 09, 2007, 05:45:43 PM
Quote from: WooMix on December 09, 2007, 04:27:12 PM
Regardless of level, 34 assists in a game of basketball is pretty incredible!

Division III Grinnell's Arseneault shatters NCAA assists record (ESPN) (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3147898)

It doesn't sound like a record broken within the spirit of the game.  But then what is these days.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 09, 2007, 06:00:43 PM
Quote from: sac on December 09, 2007, 05:45:43 PM
Quote from: WooMix on December 09, 2007, 04:27:12 PM
Regardless of level, 34 assists in a game of basketball is pretty incredible!

Division III Grinnell's Arseneault shatters NCAA assists record (ESPN) (http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=3147898)

It doesn't sound like a record broken within the spirit of the game.  But then what is these days.

It could be worse. It could be a record Mercury Morris wants to rap about.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 09, 2007, 06:04:39 PM
sac, I mostly agree, as long as Ben Strong's playoff scoring record is exempted (Guilford needed every point he got)!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 10, 2007, 12:28:41 AM
Posted this over on the Top 25 board, but thought it should get mention here. I wish we had a regular OWU poster.

Quote from: sac on December 09, 2007, 09:45:01 PM
Calvin's the best 4-3 team in the country, I wouldn't poo poo them so quickly.

Speaking of that, after watching Ohio Wesleyan suffer another tough loss to a ranked opponent this weekend, I think OWU might be the best 3-4 team in the country. OWU's last two games have seen them lose to #15 Capital and #25 Wooster by a combined 5 pts. in games that could easily have gone the other way.

OWU also led (soon-to-be?) #1 Rochester for the wrong 3/4 of the game in a seven point loss on the road at Rochester.

Its other loss? To 6-0 Trinity (TX) in the season-opening lid-lifter on a neutral floor.

Combined record of the teams that defeated them: 24-3.

I mentioned on the Top 25 posting that I didn't think that OWU will get much national poll voting support. But this team is Wooster's primary competition for the NCAC crown, and, like Wooster, should be able to amass numerous victories against a very lackluster conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 10, 2007, 11:03:46 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 09, 2007, 05:24:51 PM

I disagree.  Grinnell doesn't play to win, they play to break records.  This is meaningless as far as I'm concerned. 

I agree.  After reading how this seemed to be premeditated and also finding out that Grinnell seems to circle a couple of the easier games per year on their schedule as games to go after certain records, I'm beginning to feel that most of the records Grinnell has are of the meaningless varitety.  Or maybe disingenous is a better way to describe my feelings towards their record breaking performances.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 10, 2007, 01:35:34 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 10, 2007, 11:03:46 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 09, 2007, 05:24:51 PM

I disagree.  Grinnell doesn't play to win, they play to break records.  This is meaningless as far as I'm concerned. 

I agree.  After reading how this seemed to be premeditated and also finding out that Grinnell seems to circle a couple of the easier games per year on their schedule as games to go after certain records, I'm beginning to feel that most of the records Grinnell has are of the meaningless varitety.  Or maybe disingenous is a better way to describe my feelings towards their record breaking performances.

"Coming into the game we had a game plan looking to get John Grotberg '09 a lot of points, and maybe me getting the assists record in the process while also getting Keith Chamberlain '08 some points," Arseneault explained. "Everything went well. At halftime we looked at the situation and said we'll give it a further shot, and everything turned out."

When you combine the facts that they purposefully went after the record, and that the record-setter is the coach's son, well, that really sticks in my craw.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2007, 03:45:04 PM
To me, it's the same as when Troy rang up over 200 points on a hapless and outclassed opponent back in the day. Worthless and useless.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 10, 2007, 04:00:31 PM
I thought Troy lost; at least they did in the movie.  Held their own in the first half but then got overwhelmed.  The Greeks had the horses, er, horse.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2007, 04:02:18 PM
There is an ongoing discussion about this (edit: Grinnell, not 300) going on in the Daily Dose (http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/), and Grinnell's coach David Arsenault (Sr.) has participated.  You might be interested.  (If you're not a regular reader of the Daily Dose (http://www.d3hoops.com/dailydose/), you should be; there's some very interesting stuff discussed there, including two ongoing blogs by current players.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 10, 2007, 04:07:39 PM
This is worse...if the end of your bench is scoring points in a blowout and the score gets way out of hand, so be it.  It happens...you can't very well tell the kid(s) who probably won't ever see the floor at any other time in the year to go out there and not compete.  But here you've got a kid playing 38 minutes against a team that has no chance and he's out there for the sole purpose of breaking some record?  That's just awful.  What is Coach Arsenault teaching these kids about sportsmanship? 

What's worse is that this story is getting mentioned in major outlets (SI.com, ESPN, etc.).  This is one of those "news of the weird" stories that aren't necessarily good for small college athletics, particulary if anybody reads the not-so-subtle clues about what Grinnell's on-court goals really are which are very much contrary to the competitive spirit we see at the vast majority of our games.  If this ah-noose wants to get his (and/or his kid's) name in the paper, go win a championship.  Do it the right way...this doesn't serve the game well at all. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 10, 2007, 04:45:48 PM
When I browse through the NCAA records book every now and then, I pretty much ignore the Grinnell and Redlands records.  I've never thought much of the system in the first place, I saw it once or twice or some variation of it (Tri-State) and once was quite enough thanks.

Its fine for Grinnell, its a neat mathmatical formula way to play basketball, it got them a lot of publicity and probably a new gym, but for me its no better than watching a pick up game betwen Delta Chi and Moo Kappa Moo.

The best thing to ever happen to the MIAA might have been Tri-State dropping the system.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 10, 2007, 07:35:40 PM
This kind of reminds me of when that guy in the NBA threw a shot up at his own hoop at the end of a game because he needed one more rebound to get a triple double.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2007, 09:08:30 PM
The NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) this week is Oberlin's Mike Loll.  Loll recorded 37 points and 16 rebounds this week, including a double-double in leading the Yeomen to their first victory of the season, against Earlham.  And as far as I know, he neither broke any NCAA records nor deliberately humiliated any of his opponents.   :)  Congratulations, Mike!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2007, 12:25:17 AM
New poll is out (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/)...Wooster moves up 2 spots to #23 but actually lost 29 votes (=approx. one spot on the average ballot.)  I would never complain about such a thing, but I think that for perhaps the first time in the history of the D3hoops.com poll, Wooster is underranked.

No votes for any other NCAC team, of course.  Capital stays at #15, gaining 44 points.  Hope moves to #8 and picks up one of the wildly dispersed #1 votes.  Calvin falls to #24, and St. Thomas drops out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2007, 10:02:56 PM
Thiel 59, Allegheny 55.  Box (http://www.thiel.edu/athletics/mens_basketball/MBB07-08/HTML/allthim.htm).

Thiel led by 7 at the half and 9 shortly thereafter, but Allegheny went on a 12-2 run to take the lead with 12:49 left.  It was nip and tuck from then on, with Thiel tying the game on a pair of free throws with 0:59 left.  'Gheny then missed three shots and committed three fouls, one of them a technical, leading to seven straight for the Tomcats, providing the final margin but for a Gator buzzer-beating trey.

'Gheny had three in double figures led by Charlie Jaicks' 13, but shot just 37.3% and were outrebounded 34-29.  The Gators also committed 22 turnovers, but forced 25 in what reads like a sloppy and perhaps chippy game.

Elsewhere, in a game of interest to the pick'em crew, #25 Rhode Island topped Trinity (Conn.) in a thriller, 70-68.  The Bantams missed a shot and two stickbacks in the closing seconds, any of which would have forced overtime.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2007, 09:06:35 PM
Hiram leads Grove City 38-30 at the half at the Terrierdome.  GCC radio broadcast. (http://www2.gcc.edu/sports/)

Hiram 55-47, 12:26.  It's raining threes at both ends of the Doghouse.  Grove City has a very nice radio broadcast, one of the best I've heard.
Pups' lead down to 60-57, 7:50.
Hiram 62-60, 4:08 left.  Broadcaster says this was a double OT game each of the last two years.
Grove briefly got a one-point lead, but Hiram regained it.  Now Hiram leads by 2 with 0:43 left, GCC ball.  Layup good, and Hiram plays for the last shot, tied at 67.  Terriers see a fire hydrant and call timeout, 0:28.4 remaining.
McDevitt misses in the paint, rebound knocked out and GCC gets the call, 0:04.4 left.
Shot rims out, and it's overtime once again.
End to end action in the OT, Hiram by 1 with 3:00 left, 74-73.
Tied at 76, and Hiram has the ball with 0:22 left, timeout.
Pfouts with the layup with 0:03 remaining gives the Pups the lead...and the 78-76 win!

He's ripping through the stats like he has to go to the restroom...
Hiram with 4 in double figures, led by McDevitt's 16 on 4 3's; Pfouts had 7 in the overtime.  Hiram won the rebound battle by 6 and shot 42% or thereabouts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 13, 2007, 11:20:42 PM
For interested parties...

Anderson 69, Earlham 62 (http://www.anderson.edu/athletics/mbasket/earlham.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 14, 2007, 10:05:50 PM
Yeomen fever....catch it!

Oberlin wins back to back road games, dumping the hapless Alma Scots 62-57.  The game recap on the Alma website (entitled "Scots battle hard; fall 62-57 (http://www.alma.edu/athletics/mbb/archives/2007/12/14/acvsoberlin)") is a magnificient work of spindoctory.*  Two favorite parts:
QuoteDespite shooting only 7-30 from the field and 2 of 17 from the three point line in the second half, the Scots stayed in the game with pure effort[.]
and
QuoteThe Scots played an uptempo, exciting style and used a 14 man rotation to stay fresh. The strategy had the desired effects as the Scots looked energized and scrappy and played with outstanding effort.

Exciting, fresh, scrappy, filled with pure effort...but still winless.  :D

Three Yeomen reached double figures, led by the exciting Jordan Beard with 16 and the energized Mike Loll with 15, whose outstanding effort also had the desired effect of a team-leading 6 rebounds. ;)

*EDIT:  Not to be outdone, the Oberlin.edu recap is entitled "Yeomen Extend Road Win Streak (http://www.oberlin.edu/athletic/varsity/m_basketball/archive/2007-2008/alma.html)."  Not so much "extend" as "establish," but why split hairs? :D 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 14, 2007, 10:15:34 PM
I was on the Oberlin bandwagon for this game.  I'm somewhat disturbed that picking Oberlin to win is the first pick I've gotten right in this week's Pick'em.

Go Yeomen, indeed!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 15, 2007, 12:19:23 AM
I posted this on the MIAA board, thought you might like to see it, I'm calling this my "morbid curiosity" game of the season.

Oberlin 62 Alma 57

At tip off there were 64 souls in Cappaert Gymnasium, not counting the 2 teams and the unnecessary "Event Staff" of about a dozen or so.  More trickled in as the game went along, including one Kevin VandeStreak (Calvin coach) who wandered in around halftime, spent the 2nd half jotting a few notes on legal pad (not many) and left with about 2 minutes to go.

Sure I'd like to say it was a pretty game, but it wasn't, I'm shocked the turnover totals were so low in the boxscore, perhaps that button wasn't working on the stats program.  The shooting was dreadfull at times (see Alma 2nd half), and I would say an awful lot of shots were uncontested.

What often happens when you put two teams of equal talent and ability on the floor is you end up with a very close competitive ballgame.  Both teams played with a great deal of enthusiasm and desire to win, I give them the credit there.   The benches were really into the game on both sides. Oberlin was just as excited to win as Alma was down after the loss.

I really think the game turned at the end of the first half when Alma was leading by 9 and had just gone on a long 23-8 run to lead 35-26, then Oberlin hits a 3 at the buzzer to cut it to 6.  At the start of the 2nd, Alma missed their first seven shots, while Oberlin made a couple and just 3 minutes into the half it was tied.  All the momentum had swung to Oberlin, from that point on the Yeoman seemed to have a little more energy, a little more desire.

With about 8 minutes to go it was a 1 point game, in crunch time the Yeoman had the more fluid offense, and I see at least 5 different players scored down the stretch while Alma seemed to be really trying to get the ball in only 1 or 2 guys hands.

Fittingly Oberlin missed a bunch of FT's while Alma missed a bunch of 3's in the late stages.  It lacked drama but the Yeoman did enough to get the W.

Interesting game, I think Alma really missed Sam Machuta their 6-8 (ish) center who was in street clothes for no visible reason.  It would have been fun to see him bang in the paint with Gian Chiu, the 6-9(ish) center for Oberlin.  Neither team seemed to be to interested in banging the ball down low, although everything was either a 3 or a layup as far as I can recall.

Competitive game, interesting Friday evening I guess.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 15, 2007, 10:32:22 AM
As a stats purist, I think Alma needs to change a rebound and a steal from #40 to #4, since it's hard to get a rebound and a steal when you don't play. Unless the time / space continuum melted during this classic matchup.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2007, 03:43:41 PM
Halftime in Terre Haute, and a late surge by Earlham gives them a 23-20 lead.  EC actually had just two made baskets in the first 17:38, but a constant parade to the free throw line (courtesy of 12 RHIT fouls) kept them in touch.  Then EC hit 4-for-4 in the final 2:22, closing the half on a 9-2 run.

I wouldn't be surprised to hear of cancellations in my area, as it has been snowing hard and steadily since about 1pm here.  But so far I've not heard of any.  (Well, I take that back.  One of the boys' high school games prior to the Wooster/Walsh game has been canceled, but the other two are still on as is the college game.  All of tomorrow's games in the Steve Smith Classic--more boys' HS games--have also been nixed.  So has Doylestown bingo, sorry!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2007, 04:22:41 PM
Earlham extended to a 12-point lead by 11:30, then Rose went on a 17-2 run over 4:00 to recapture the lead.  Rose now leads by 5 with 3:06 remaining.

UPDATE:  Final score Rose 58, Earlham 48.  Sound like the Quakers had 10 really good minutes sandwiched inside 30 really crummy ones.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 15, 2007, 04:50:41 PM
Looks like the Quaker 7 ran out of gas...

I would suspect this to be a common trend as the year wears on for Earlham.  They can hang with a team for 1/2 to 3/4 of a game and then just hit a wall and lose it down the stretch.  Hopefully they don't succomb to any injuries or they could be in some serious touble.

As for the snowstorm, I can't believe that they haven't called the Wooster game for tonight yet.  If the 6 inches of snow that have already fallen with continuous steady snow still coming down weren't enough, how about the possiblity of the white stuff turning to a freezing rain mix which makes things even worse IMO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2007, 04:59:36 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 15, 2007, 04:50:41 PM
Looks like the Quaker 7 ran out of gas...

They played 8 today.  It's a little hard to tell from "livestats" how much anyone plays, but all 8 were in the game while it still mattered.  Looked like an 8-man rotation to me.

I guess Walsh is already in town, and the thinking is it's better to play it now rather than reschedule.  If so, it may be a "friends and relatives" game; I'm sure not driving the 18 miles for it!  This game and the Earlham game were the only NCAC men's games on today's schedule.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 15, 2007, 05:28:30 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 15, 2007, 04:59:36 PM
I'm sure not driving the 18 miles for it! 
And a treacherous 18 miles at that in this kind of weather! :)

I won't be in attendance tonight not because of the weather as I could almost walk to the college if I had to.  Instead, I'll be hosting a family birthday dinner tonight.  So I guess I'll just catch the replay on Clear Picture. 

BTW, I have yet to make it to a Wooster game this year?! ???  Not that there have been a plethora of opportunities as this is only Wooster's 3rd home game of the season.   Hopefully my schedule will allow me to catch the Mose Hole games! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2007, 10:09:41 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 15, 2007, 09:10:13 PM
Wooster 45, Walsh 43, half.

Wooster 89, Walsh 88.  Cavs complete a 3-pt. play with 0:04.x left, and Scots eschew the timeout; Brandon Johnson hits a 15-footer at the buzzer for the win.  Cooper with 32 for the second straight game.  A real thriller.  Scots 31/56 (55%) from the floor, 13/24 (54%) from the arc.  Walsh 34/65 (52%), 11/19 (58%) from the arc.  Wooster +3 in rebounds, despite the Cavs being much taller.  Scots 11 turnovers, and Walsh 8, even with the uptempo game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 15, 2007, 10:11:11 PM
Wooster wins on a last-second jumper by Brandon Johnson, 89-88 over NAIA-II #3 Walsh.

Walsh's only lead in the second half was with 4.8 seconds left, after a made free throw in an old-fashioned 3 point play.

Johnson took the inbound and drove to the free throw line, then sunk the winning jumper as time expired. Huge win for Wooster, as they just escape after almost giving the game away (they were up 6 with under two minutes to go).

Cooper scores 32 again, 7-9 three-point shooting.  He's hitting his All-American form.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 15, 2007, 10:39:12 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 15, 2007, 10:11:11 PM
...as they just escape after almost giving the game away (they were up 6 with under two minutes to go).
Wooster tried to give this game away on more than one occasion.  The Scots broke the game open midway through the 2nd half leading by as many as nine on several occasions.  But Walsh put together a run erasing Wooster's lead to eventually tie the game.  Then Cooper took over burying a couple of treys and just like that, Wooster is back up by 6 with under 2 minutes left and things look promising for the Scots. 

Wooster was still pretty well in control with a 3 point lead with under a minute to play and the ball when Walsh stole the inbounds pass and converted an easy lay-up to cut the lead to one.  Then James Cooper (84% from the line) is fouled and only makes 1 of 2?!  And then, not only does Walsh get the tying basket on their next possession.  They also get fouled in the process converting the old fashioned 3 point play and taking a 1 point lead with just over 4 seconds left. ???

And Brandon Johnson did the rest!!!  Earlier in the week, Brandon Johnson had this quote in the Wooster Daily Record:

Quote from: Brandon Johnson said"I'm not going to force anything. Keep firing away and things will start going for me," Johnson said. "(Defenses) are looking for me a little more. I feel like it's the same shot. It will start falling."

Kind of fitting that Brandon was the one to nail the game winner at the buzzer if you ask me!

Way to keep firing away Brandon!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2007, 10:55:33 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 15, 2007, 05:28:30 PM
I won't be in attendance tonight not because of the weather as I could almost walk to the college if I had to.  Instead, I'll be hosting a family birthday dinner tonight. 

but....

Quote from: ScotsFan on December 15, 2007, 10:39:12 PMWooster tried to give this game away on more than one occasion.  The Scots broke the game open midway through the 2nd half leading by as many as nine on several occasions.  But Walsh put together a run erasing Wooster's lead to eventually tie the game.  Then Cooper took over... (etc.)

The Host with the Most!  ;D

Guests (singing):  Hap-py birth-day to youuuu, hap-py...
ScotsFan (wearing headphones):  Would you people please shut up?!?  I can't hear Breckenridge!
:D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 16, 2007, 01:26:05 AM
All five or Earlham's starters played over 30 minutes. The iron five! In fact, of the five only Terrell Brown averages under 30 minutes a game, and he's at 29.4

Justin Carter played his first game for the Quake today. Perhaps he had first semester eligibility issues.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 16, 2007, 01:48:40 PM
Looking at this picture of Brandon Johnson making the game-winner last night, from the Wooster web site (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/recaps/2007-08/walsh.php), it looks like it was a one-handed shot--over a 7-footer, no less. 

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fathletics.wooster.edu%2Fimages%2F0708%2Fmb%2Fjohnson_winner_walsh.jpg&hash=bfa9ee4afe0926f7079335f0baf096c73d9eec28) (http://athletics.wooster.edu/images/0708/mb/johnson_winner_walsh.jpg)(Click to enlarge)

Holy cow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 16, 2007, 04:38:20 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 15, 2007, 10:55:33 PM
The Host with the Most!  ;D

Guests (singing):  Hap-py birth-day to youuuu, hap-py...
ScotsFan (wearing headphones):  Would you people please shut up?!?  I can't hear Breckenridge!
:D
LOL!!! ;D  Actually, it was a big YES!!! when Johnson sunk the game winner as we were singing happy birthday causing everyone to stop singing and figure out what the interruption was all about!!! ;) ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 16, 2007, 05:00:35 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 08, 2007, 11:33:10 PM
Any worries about James Cooper's early season funk can be laid to rest with a big "32" stamped on them.

I think Cooper's effort last night even further cements the thoughts that his early season struggles have come to an end.  All he did is follow up a 32 point effort at OWU with yet another 32 point effort last night vs. Walsh.  And Cooper's shooting numbers are quite staggering in these last 2 games as well.  After starting the season shooting just over 30% from the field he's gone  22-31 overall from the field in the last 2 games and an unconsios 9-12 from beyond the 3-point line! :o

With his torrid shooting over the last 2 games, Cooper has jumped from the mid 30's in fg percentage to right around his career average at 50% on the season!  Also, he has gone from barely 30% from beyond the arc to 47% over the last 2 games!  Also, since Devin Fulk's brief stint as the team's leading scorer, Cooper has upped his scoring average to just under 20 ppg!  Those numbers are a little more James Cooper-esque! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 16, 2007, 10:49:51 PM
Brandon Johnson's basket got me thinking about other dramatic baskets by Wooster players in the recent years and I can remember 3 others:

- James Coopers 28 foot shot to beat Wittenberg 86-83 during the 2005-06 season
- Kyle Witucky's running jumper down the lane to beat Earlham 83-81 in OT
- Kyle Witucky's 3 pointer at Wittenberg to send the game into a 2nd OT

Brandon's bucket is in that it is the only one to change a loss into a win instantly.

A couple other dramatic baskets I remember:

- Bryan Wickliffe's offensive rebound and put back against OWU
- Tom Port's dramatic 3-pointer against Wittenberg last season to give Wooster a 66-65 lead, then stealing the inbound to seal the win (68-65)
- Marty Bidwell's 4-point play at Wabash last year to give Wooster a 64-61 lead (68-63)
- Andy Van Horn's driving layup against Ohio Northern his sophomore year to give Wooster a 3 point lead (and cement his starting position the rest of his career).

Can anybody add others?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 17, 2007, 09:48:54 AM
Rodney Mitchell's last-second runner in the lane to beat John Carroll 77-75 in the 2003 NCAA tournament.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 17, 2007, 10:39:47 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 17, 2007, 09:48:54 AM
Rodney Mitchell's last-second runner in the lane to beat John Carroll 77-75 in the 2003 NCAA tournament.


That's one I'll never forget!  That basket propelled the Scots all the way to Salem that year as well!

I can think of a couple of other dramatic baskets that didn't necessarily lead directly to Wooster wins.  These were actually memorable sequences. 

The first one is the most recent occurring last season at home vs. Wittenberg.  Wooster had come all the way back to erase a 15 point halftime deficit with just under 2 minutes to go in the game.  Wooster had possession to tie or take the lead, but turned it over and Witt had almost an uncontested lay-up that would have gone a long way to putting the Scots away.  However, Witt missed the lay-up.  There was a mad scramble which somehow came to Devin Fulk at mid-court.  He then flipped the ball over his head to an open Brandon Johnson who then emphatically slammed it home for the tying basket almost blowing the roof off of Timken Gymnasium.  Unfortunately, Witt went on to win that game, but that was about the loudest I have ever heard Timken after that dunk.

Another memorable sequence occurred back in 2000 in the first round of the NCAA Tournament.  ONU was the opponent and the Scots were in control of that contest almost the entire game.  However, Northern made a run at Wooster late in the first half and appeared to have the Scots on the ropes.  With ONU down 3, they forced a Wooster turnover that led to an ONU breakaway and what appeared to be a slam dunk that would have cut the Wooster lead to one.  But the ONU player missed the dunk, Wooster controlled the rebound and broke the other way.  Wooster then kicked the ball out to an open Steve Thompson who calmly sunk a 3 point dagger pushing the Wooster lead back to 5 and ONU never really threatened the rest of the way.  That basket also sent Timken into a frenzy as well!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 17, 2007, 10:52:21 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 17, 2007, 10:39:47 AM
The first one is the most recent occurring last season at home vs. Wittenberg.  Wooster had come all the way back to erase a 15 point halftime deficit with just under 2 minutes to go in the game.  Wooster had possession to tie or take the lead, but turned it over and Witt had almost an uncontested lay-up that would have gone a long way to putting the Scots away.  However, Witt missed the lay-up.  There was a mad scramble which somehow came to Devin Fulk at mid-court.  He then flipped the ball over his head to an open Brandon Johnson who then emphatically slammed it home for the tying basket almost blowing the roof off of Timken Gymnasium.  Unfortunately, Witt went on to win that game, but that was about the loudest I have ever heard Timken after that dunk.

SF- That sequence started with Fulk driving the lane for Wooster's only lead, by 1, then Witt drained a three to go back ahead, then the sequence as you describe above. Crazy 30 seconds of basketball.

Best thing is, Wooster still has the video clip of this whole sequence on its website- view it here. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/recaps/2006-07/woo-witt.mov)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 17, 2007, 10:55:07 AM
I learned something this morning, courtesy of Zach Bolinger in his Daily Record article "Sixth Man with a Hot Hand" (link (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/3010822); subscription may be required):

Quote from: Zach Bolinger[Devin] Fulk, a first-team All-Ohioan at Licking Valley, who also quarterbacked the football team to the Div. III state semifinals in 2003, was a late addition to the Scots' family.

"It was all but finalized that I was going to Wittenberg," Fulk said. "I had been talking to them for months during my senior year and hadn't actually said a word to Wooster, but I made a visit here late in the spring. I decided a couple days later (Wooster) was where I wanted to play."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 17, 2007, 11:42:17 AM
I will never look at Devin Fulk the same way again. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 17, 2007, 01:41:14 PM
Wooster now has a short video clip of Brandon Johnson's last-second shot on the Web.

http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/recaps/2007-08/walsh.php

Maybe Wittenberg will also claim that Fulk didn't have the grades to get in there, just like they claim with Cooper. Saw a similar post on the football board. I, along with probably just about everyone else, have no idea about specific cases, but it is really funny/ridiculous to hear Wittenberg people complain about academics. Not that the U.S. New Rankings are the be-all, end-all, but Wittenberg is ranked 118, and Wooster is 71. But then again, I didn't go to Wittenberg, so I must not be smart to enough to know the difference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 17, 2007, 04:06:22 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 17, 2007, 10:39:47 AM
The first one is the most recent occurring last season at home vs. Wittenberg.  Wooster had come all the way back to erase a 15 point halftime deficit with just under 2 minutes to go in the game.  Wooster had possession to tie or take the lead, but turned it over and Witt had almost an uncontested lay-up that would have gone a long way to putting the Scots away.  However, Witt missed the lay-up.  There was a mad scramble which somehow came to Devin Fulk at mid-court.  He then flipped the ball over his head to an open Brandon Johnson who then emphatically slammed it home for the tying basket almost blowing the roof off of Timken Gymnasium.  Unfortunately, Witt went on to win that game, but that was about the loudest I have ever heard Timken after that dunk.

I knew someone would describe that one eventually.  I would agree that was a cool sequence of events(my only Woo/Witt game).  It made the last 1:11 very interesting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 17, 2007, 05:42:45 PM
yes i will admit that was a good play-the outcome made it even better ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 17, 2007, 09:59:19 PM
Heard this second-hand from the Wooster coaching staff, and now the Woo website (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/default.php) confirms.

"» Due to a conflict in travel plans, Wooster's game in The Bahamas against St. Mary's (Md.) has been moved to Thursday."

My understanding is that the team's flight was delayed in Cleveland, to the extent that they would have missed their connecting flight, so rather than be stranded in a different city and scrambling for a hotel, they came back home to practice and will try to fly to the Bahamas tomorrow.

I believe that Wooster will play Benedictine as scheduled Wednesday, then the St. Mary's game on Thursday, barring any further travel difficulties.  Apparently St. Mary's and Benedictine both arrived in the Bahamas today, and will play tomorrow night in place of the original Woo-St. Mary's game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 18, 2007, 04:15:14 PM
NCAC fans...I'll be trying something new this evening and posting live from Chadwick Court with instant, first-hand observations and thoughts from tonight's tussle with Franklin in C'ville.  We'll see how well this little experiment works out.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 18, 2007, 07:32:40 PM
And we're live from Chadwick...starting lineups are being introduced.  With the students on break, this is a friends and family affair tonight.  I'll try to keep a semi-running log of the action....I hope you guys enjoy it. 

1st Half.....

20:00 - Zimmer controls the tip and we're underway!

18:05 - Franklin is running a pretty deliberate offense, but has drawn two fouls already and are 4-4 from the line.  Wabash has scored on its first two possessions as well (Simkus and Brock scoring under the hoop).  We're knotted at 4-4.  Brock scores again as I type.  6-4 Bash.


5:41 - Timeout Franklin.  Livestats tells me that Franklin is 5-6 on 3ptFGs.  Wabash has a pretty clear advantage in the paint tonight...the LGs are going to have to defend that perimeter a little better because Franklin can clearly shoot the ball.
15:50 - Franklin is doing a good job on the offensive boards.  They've gotten multiple attempts on three of their first four possessions and lead 10-6. 

14:04 - Typing and watching basketball simultaneously is hard.  :)   Simkus is flying all over the floor.  He earned himself another bucket as well.  10-8 Grizz.

12:56 - Wabash isn't defending the perimeter well.  Jace Redman just nailed his second triple of the game to give Franklin a 13-8 advantage.

This is a good time to mention that Wabash/Franklin has a long series and in the last decade or so these games have been very competitive.  Wabash and Franklin had some real wars in the late 90s with Estelle and Franklin's Jason Sibley taking center stage.  Those were the days.   :)

10:11 - Wabash has just one scorer on the floor right now (Brock)...it'll be interesting to see how long Petty goes with this lineup.  And as I hit the period, Zimmer goes to the scorer's table.  Wabash will get shots here with 9:31 to go.  First one is no good.  Andy Root is the shooter.  Second shot is good.  16-16 is the score.

8:00 - Aaron Brock scores underneath to give Wabash the lead again at 20-19.

3:56 - Livestats tells me that Franklin is 5-6 on 3s.  5-7 now as one hits the back iron.  Wabash has a decided advantage in the paint but will need to clamp down that perimeter D because Franklin can clearly shoot well. 

1:43 - Brock scores on a great drive to the hoop.  Brock's got a quick first step...I've been impressed with his play all year.  26-21 Wabash. 

1:15 - Maloney is struggling for Wabash.  He's turned the ball over a few times and just went over the back on a rebound.  Franklin will get foul shots as Wabash reaches the penalty.  Good and good.  26-23 Wabash.

Franklin's last possession is well defended and they fail to get off a good shot at the buzzer.  We go to halftime with Wabash leading 26-23. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 18, 2007, 07:55:30 PM
I turned on the Wabash live stream and heard some opera crap. It will make it significantly harder to keep up with the game whilst cooking. Well, thanks Wally for the updates.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2007, 07:58:58 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 18, 2007, 07:32:40 PM
14:04 - Typing and watching basketball simultaneously is hard.  :)   

You should see Diehardfan do it on her little cellphone gadget.  I can't describe it, except to say that there's a lot of poking of things with a little stick that is attached to it. 

Quote from: Li'l Giant on December 18, 2007, 07:55:30 PM
I turned on the Wabash live stream and heard some opera crap.

Opera crap?  OPERA CRAP?!?  In the words of Floria Tosca,
O Scarpia, avanti a Dio!
:)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 18, 2007, 08:17:24 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 18, 2007, 07:58:58 PM
Opera crap?  OPERA CRAP?!?  In the words of Floria Tosca,
O Scarpia, avanti a Dio!
:)

I'm not opposed to opera per se. Just not when I expect to hear some hoops action.  ;)

Quote from: David Collinge on December 18, 2007, 07:58:58 PMYou should see Diehardfan do it on her little cellphone gadget.  I can't describe it, except to say that there's a lot of poking of things with a little stick that is attached to it. 

I'm glad I don't have one that requires a stylus anymore. It's a lot easier with an actual, though tiny, keyboard.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 18, 2007, 08:21:01 PM
A couple of haltime observations...while Franklin holds a pretty substantial edge in the rebound column, Wabash has been the stronger team inside.  A few of Franklin's offensive rebounds have been the result of wild shots (mostly by Marty Young) that just get too far away from the collapsing Wabash defense.  Speaking of Young, he is Franklin's leading scorer coming in to the game and has been held to zilch thus far.  The Wabash post defenders are really crashing down on him hard and he hasn't had a clean look at the hoop yet.  

For Wabash, Wes Smith only played four minutes before he picked up two fouls and found himself on the bench for the duration of the half.  Brock had a great half with 12 points.  We're about set for the second half...I'll start a new post for the 2nd half chronicle.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 18, 2007, 08:23:04 PM
2nd half.....

19:45 - Silly foul by Earl Rooks to start the half.  Franklin nets 1 of 2 free throws.  It seems like every Wabash foul sends Franklin to the line...that's another thing I'd like to see less of in the second half.  26-24 Wabash.

18:14 - More Wabash inside strength as Zimmer makes a strong move on the baseline and gets himself a three point play.  29-24...largest lead of the game for Wabash. 

17:10 - Timeout Franklin.  Wabash is too much for Franklin in the paint.  Wabash has scored pretty easily on their last three possessions as Franklin can't deny the entry pass.  33-26 Wabash. 

15:15 - Young finally gets loose for Franklin and scores a layup.  35-31 Wabash.

14:46 - The response...Brock yanked down a strong offensive rebound and got the stickback along with a foul.  38-31 after the made free throw. 

A quick check of the stats shows me that Wabash is winning the rebound battle here in the second half by a count of 10-1.  That's more like it. 

13:20 - And Wes Smith is on the board wth a layup coming off of, you guessed it, an offensive rebound.  And before I can get that out, Smith steals and gets fouled on his way for another layup.  He makes his charity shots and Wabash stretches it out to a 42-32 lead. 

12:51- Another steal, this time by Haltom.  He gets fouled driving for a layup and will get shots.  44-32 Wabash. 

11:26 - Timeout Franklin.  Wabash has really stepped up their on-ball D in this second half.  Franklin is turning the ball over like if they keep doing it they'll win something.  Franklin's timeout was forced by a Haltom layup which pushes the lead to 46-32.  Wabash is on a pretty big run right here. 

10:00 - Wabash is in control here up 48-33.  Franklin isn't getting many open looks, but they have had a few and they aren't falling like they were in the first half.  Until I said something...Franklin hits a three.  48-36 now. 

7:37 - Timeout Franklin.  Not much to add here...Zimmer is starting to get going now and is up to 9 points.  Franklin is starting to maybe look a little frustrated and Wabash is being pretty physical with the Grizzlies and they don't seem to like it much.  Franklin gets a triple out of the timeout.  50-39 Bash.

3:45 - Franklin is stepping up the pressure here and has closed to within 10 at 53-43.  It's a game of possessions now...so far Wabash has held tight on their perimeter D in the second half. It'll have to continue for the next few minutes here.  Free throws will help.  Zimmer will shoot two here.  Good and....timeout Grizzlies.  54-43 as we sit in a timeout.

Franklin has made just three field goals inside the arc.  Yikes.  Zimmer's second shot is good.  55-43.

As Wabash is icing this game down, I want to thank Brent Harris for helping me connected at Chadwick tonight.  Technology rules. 

0:53 - Franklin has made a couple of buckets here and is within 9 at 57-48.  Brock just fouled a three point shooter (aggressive D, but not really warranted at this point in the game).  Brick.  Good. Good.  57-50.  Wabash will need to make a few free throws here down the stretch. 

0:40 - For some reason Franklin is shooting free throws again.  This is not good end of game strategy for Wabash.  I just noticed the livestats put tonight's attendance at 483.  In a related story, the game program lists Earl Rooks at 5'9".  Free throws galore here.  61-52 Wabash.  30 seconds to play.

And we're all wrapped up here at Chadwick.  Final score Wabash 64, Franklin 58 (Grizzlies got a buzzer beater). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash83 on December 18, 2007, 09:20:57 PM
Wally,

Thanks for the online coverage.  I was going to try and make it over for the game, but end of the year demands got in the way.

Was there any talk about this piece

http://www.journalreview.com/articles/2007/12/17/sports/01petty.txt

in the Journal Review?  It seems as if the transition to a new basketball coach will be handled a bit differently than the change in football coach.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash83 on December 18, 2007, 09:24:37 PM
Here is a companion piece that has interviews with three former Wabash players (and, in my mind, three pretty good ones at that):

http://www.journalreview.com/articles/2007/12/17/sports/personality.txt
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 18, 2007, 09:41:24 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 18, 2007, 08:23:04 PMI just noticed the livestats put tonight's attendance at 483.  In a related story, the game program lists Earl Rooks at 5'9".

And that's your post of the night, folks.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 19, 2007, 01:09:02 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on December 18, 2007, 09:41:24 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 18, 2007, 08:23:04 PMI just noticed the livestats put tonight's attendance at 483.  In a related story, the game program lists Earl Rooks at 5'9".

And that's your post of the night, folks.  :D

I thought you'd like that, LG.  You'll see just how funny that is in a couple of weeks when Wabash treks to your backyard for a little holiday hoops action. 

Quote from: gobash83 on December 18, 2007, 09:20:57 PM
Wally,

Thanks for the online coverage.  I was going to try and make it over for the game, but end of the year demands got in the way.

Was there any talk about this piece

http://www.journalreview.com/articles/2007/12/17/sports/01petty.txt

in the Journal Review?  It seems as if the transition to a new basketball coach will be handled a bit differently than the change in football coach.

I didn't talk to anybody specifically about this, but I'm sure it will become a pretty big topic of conversation as this season ends.  Whether it's this season or next, you can bet your mortgage that I'll be at Coach Petty's last game at Chadwick and I won't stop clapping for a long time after that final buzzer sounds.  The man has been an instiution at Wabash for three decades and was easily my favorite interview when I was writing sports at The Bachelor.  Certainly, nothing lasts forever and we'll all carry forward, but it's going to be sad to see Coach Petty go. 

But enough with that until that day comes...Wabash has a pretty good team this year and I hope the focus can remain on the quality of ball that this team is playing.  Based on what results I've seen out of the NCAC this season, I don't think a #2 seed in the conference tourney is out of the question.  These kids get after it big time and I'm anxious to see how they amp it up when the conference season gets into full gear in January.  I think we're in for one of the better hoops seasons we've seen out of Wabash in some time. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 19, 2007, 09:51:39 AM
The Quakers have found an eighth.

Justin Carter, who initally came to Earlham last year as a freshman before quitting and heading to a different school to be with a girlfriend (or something like that), has returned to the team and became eligible at the end of the first semester.

This isn't quite James Brady Keaton returning to the Quakers from a similar sabbatical back in the early part of the decade, but it should at least give Earlham one more player who can dribble.

Progress, progress.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash83 on December 19, 2007, 10:58:48 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 19, 2007, 01:09:02 AM

I didn't talk to anybody specifically about this, but I'm sure it will become a pretty big topic of conversation as this season ends.  Whether it's this season or next, you can bet your mortgage that I'll be at Coach Petty's last game at Chadwick and I won't stop clapping for a long time after that final buzzer sounds.  The man has been an instiution at Wabash for three decades and was easily my favorite interview when I was writing sports at The Bachelor.  Certainly, nothing lasts forever and we'll all carry forward, but it's going to be sad to see Coach Petty go. 

But enough with that until that day comes...Wabash has a pretty good team this year and I hope the focus can remain on the quality of ball that this team is playing.  Based on what results I've seen out of the NCAC this season, I don't think a #2 seed in the conference tourney is out of the question.  These kids get after it big time and I'm anxious to see how they amp it up when the conference season gets into full gear in January.  I think we're in for one of the better hoops seasons we've seen out of Wabash in some time. 

Wally, I agree with your sentiments about Coach Petty completely.  I covered the basketball team for WNDY back in the day and Coach was always fun to talk with, let alone intereview.  He has represented Wabash well.

I also agree that this year's team looks pretty good.  I saw the Marian game and my sense was that they play with an intensity that is rare.  I look forward to seeing how the conference schedule plays out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2007, 12:16:09 PM
Jason Mulligan took the job in Maine in part because he didn't want to wait for Mac. I'm sure he could be enticed back.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2007, 12:21:25 PM
Good to see Brock step up. He's going to be key, along with Smith and Haltom, if the NCAC concentrates on shutting down Zimmer. Whither Andy Root?

Good to see Earlham with an eighth.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 19, 2007, 01:42:46 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 19, 2007, 12:21:25 PM
Good to see Brock step up. He's going to be key, along with Smith and Haltom, if the NCAC concentrates on shutting down Zimmer. Whither Andy Root?

Brock has been very good so far this year.  I've seen three games and he's stood out in each one...strong, aggressive, and has a decent mid-range game to keep defenders honest. 

Smith...I'm not sure Wabash can count on Wes for big points on a regular basis.  He's good with the ball and slashing to the hoop, but he isn't finishing off plays well.  He's getting a good number of free throw attempts, but I'd like to see him finish his drives a little more.  He kind of reminds of Tabor (Chad), except Tabor finished.  I'm guessing this will come as Wes gets an offseason on the strength program. 

Haltom is very improved over last year.  He's added penetration to his game whereas last year he was content to stand behind the line and chuck 3s.  His dribble-drive is quicker than I would have guessed also...this improved play will be a must during NCAC play. 

As for Root, I'm not sure exactly why his minutes are down.  I'm guessing that it's a combination of Brock and Haltom good playing so well and that Petty seems to be giving Evan Arnold a look (Evan was the first man off the bench last night I believe).  There just aren't enough minutes to go around right now. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2007, 04:46:22 PM
DePauw upends Kenyon 77-66.  Kodey (25) and Korey (18) Haddox combine for two-thirds of the Kenyon offense.  Bryan Yelvington contributed 6 points and a team-best 7 boards, but fouled out with over 5 minutes to play.  Frosh Brendan Coyne played a good number of minutes in the second half, marking his first varsity appearance.  Kenyon allowed DPU to shoot 52% (something like 57% in the first half, building an 11-point lead) and was outrebounded by the Tigers 36-23. 

Do the math:  (offense mostly from two players) + (double-digit rebound deficiency) + (leading scorer fouls out early) + (opponent shoots >50%) = LOSS.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2007, 05:18:42 PM
I think that many on this board (yours truly included) overhyped the Lords. Won't be the first time, won't be the last.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2007, 05:44:01 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 19, 2007, 05:18:42 PM
I think that many on this board (yours truly included) overhyped the Lords. Won't be the first time, won't be the last.

Guilty as charged.  But this is not a Pool C contender, so the only games that matter are the NCAC games...and they're 1-0 in those. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 19, 2007, 06:11:29 PM
Also guilty as charged.  I ranked Kenyon highest out of anyone (3rd) in the Pick-em conference standings tie-breaker.  I did that half because I just wanted to see someone different compete for the top of the NCAC, and half because I thought Kenyon really was better this year. However, I'm not jumping off the bus just yet, especially because they still should be better than Denison, Oberlin, Hiram, and maybe Wittenberg. Plus they do already have a win against Wabash.

The question may be: can the Lords win any on the road in the NCAC. They have yet to win a true road game this year (1-1 on neutral floors).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 19, 2007, 08:57:21 PM
Wooster is up at the half on Benedictine to the tune of 43-28.


Wooster opened up the game scoring the 1st 15 points before Benedictine finally lit up the scoreboard.  Wooster led by as many as 19 I believe, but Benedictine was able to make a run and cut the Scots' lead down to 11 (the closest they've come).  Wooster then righted the ship and closed out the half to lead by 15.

The 2nd half is just now getting under way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2007, 09:10:42 PM
Wittenberg handles Otterbein with ease, disposing of them 87-73.  Witt held a double-figure lead for the final 27 minutes of the game.  Kevin Murray led the Tigers with 27 points on 9/12 shooting, including 3/5 from the arc.  Four other Tigers scored in double figures--Barabino 17, Hill 11, Romero 11, and Gregory 10--as Witt hit 51.8% of their field goal attempts, including 8/17 from the arc.  Witt improves to 3-5 and drops Ott to an un-Ott-like 1-8.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 19, 2007, 09:47:34 PM
Wooster finishes off Benedictine to the tune of 91-62 to improve to 6-2 on the season.

Benedictine made a run at the Scots early in the 2nd half and closed to within 7 points forcing a Steve Moore timeout.  After that, the Scots were back up 13 a minute and a half later and they slowly pulled away from there.

Wooster continues their hot shooting going 55% from the floor.  Even more impressive for Wooster was their shooting from beyond the arc going 11-17 for 65%!

Wooster was led in scoring by James Cooper who finished with 24.  Brandon Johnson, Brian Wickliffe and Devin Fulk joined Cooper in double figures for Wooster.

Wooster will take on St. Marys (MD) tomorrow at 8 pm.  St. Marys defeated Benedictine by 12 last night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 19, 2007, 10:35:42 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 19, 2007, 09:47:34 PM
Wooster was led in scoring by James Cooper who finished with 24.

Off-night for Cooper.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2007, 11:13:23 PM
Witt 3-5 beating Ott 1-8??

I swear that would be Earlham beating Marietta if you just gave me the teams records and not the names.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 20, 2007, 12:42:50 PM
DC and Smediny-

Although i was not in attendance last night for personal reasons (girl issues don't ask) I do find it ironic that the game preview in the Springfield News Sun spoke of Wittenberg's focus on finding their offense over the past week off in practice. The results??? We've already shown that we can defend adequately.

87 points, 51% shooting from the field, and their newfound offensive weapon in the starting lineup-Kevin Murray with 27 points.

As i said last week do not count this team out, as they find their offensive touch they will be a tough out and as with Kenyon they are 1-0 in conference as well.......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 20, 2007, 01:10:58 PM
I never count Witt out - it's just that a 3-5 record is pretty surprising for them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 20, 2007, 01:43:22 PM
A quick glance of the schedule suggests Wittenberg may hit the Wooster game in January on a good run.

Dec. 8  4:00 PM  Hiram * •  W, 77-57     
Dec. 19  7:30 PM  Otterbein •  W, 87-73     
Dec. 28  7:45 PM  Olivet •     
Dec. 29  TBA  TBA      Marian or UW-LaCrosse
Jan. 2  7:30 PM  at Denison * •     
Jan. 5  3:00 PM  Oberlin * •     
Jan. 12  3:00 PM  at Allegheny * •     
Jan. 16  7:30 PM  at Earlham * • 
Jan. 19  7:30 PM  Wooster * • 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2007, 02:21:19 PM
I'm far from counting Wittenberg 'out' of anything, but at the same time I'm not putting too much weight on a smackdown of a pretty poor Otterbein squad.  If you disregard the season-opening loss to Benedictine (which is fair, given how much rebuilding Witt had to do), what the Tigers have done is lose to good teams (Cap, ONU, Cedarville, and to a lesser extent Transy) and beat bad ones (Kzoo, Hiram, Ott).  Of course, that formula can lead to an NCAC record of 10-6 or better!  I'll be interested to see how Witt does in Game 2 of the Zimmerman (vs. Marian or La Crosse) and then Jan. 12 at Allegheny; those games should give us a good sense of where the Tigers are prior to the Wooster game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 20, 2007, 04:23:56 PM
I would agree DC on losing to good teams, but with all of their losses minus the Cedarville game you find a trend of losing close games. Hypothetically speaking most of those losses come from lack of experience and discipline in those games.

loss to Benedictine by 5
loss to Capital by 4
loss to Ohio Northern by 3
loss to Transylvania by 5

But yes early conference play should allow Wittenberg to see an indication of how they stand competitively in the conference
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2007, 09:47:40 PM
Wooster downs St. Mary's of Maryland, 85-70.  Tournament MVP James Cooper had 28 points, giving him 116 points in his last 4 games and 1,681 in his career, 4th in Wooster history and just 103 behind Tom Port.  Wooster shot about 50%, and held St. Mary's to something like 1-17 from the arc.  Tyson Lesesne, the Seahawks' leading scorer at 20.5 ppg, had just 2 points before fouling out in the final minute of play.  Wooster is now 7-2, while SMC falls to 6-4.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 20, 2007, 09:59:52 PM
Wooster (7-2) beats St. Mary's (7-4) 85-70.

Nice win for the Scots. For the second night in a row, the Scots came out fast, scoring the first 10 points of the game. St. Mary's played a good first half after that, and with the help of 11 first-half turnovers by the Scots, cut the advantage down to 2 at half.

The Scots went on a decisive run around the 13 min. mark of the second half, taking a 5 point lead to a 16 point lead in a hurry, and was never seriously in danger after that. Largest lead was 21.

Cooper led all scorers with 28; he's averaging 29 over his last four games. He also contributed with 6 boards and 3 assists. Wickliffe is improving by the game, falling one rebound short of a double-double, with 18 points and 9 boards. Fulk, as usual, contributes 12 on 2-3 from 3 pt. land.

It feels to me that this is a winning streak that could continue for awhile. The Scots are definitely showing signs of playing better basketball. Wickliffe continues to be a revelation, Cooper has found the All-American form and the supporting cast is gelling.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 20, 2007, 10:31:42 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 20, 2007, 09:59:52 PM

It feels to me that this is a winning streak that could continue for awhile.

I'd look out for Wabash on the 12th. Of course, then there's Witt on the 19th.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 22, 2007, 05:40:42 PM
Kenyon 69, Wash-Jeff 58 (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26122.xml)

Kenyon (3-7) out-shot (43.1% to 35.7%), out-rebounded (39-34), and under-turnovered (15-17) the Presidents.  Bryan Yelvington had another double-double--his 5th of the season--with 23 points and 10 boards.  Frosh Kodey Haddox continued his hot scoring, adding 21 points and raising his scoring average to 12.8 ppg.  In a worrisome note, four Lords logged 33+ minutes, while starting guard David Jolson played just 3 minutes.  I hope that doesn't indicate an early-game injury; I hope one of my lurking Kenyon friends will email me (dacollinge -at- yahoo.com) and let me know what's up.   :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 24, 2007, 09:55:38 AM
I just wanted to wish everyone a Merry Christmas!

Hope everyone has a safe and joyous holiday season!


(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cardsdirect.com%2Fimages%2Fchristmascards%2FC0570_L.jpg&hash=c3c4f5a9644e6c803bcfe352e64039bd2f6da87d)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 28, 2007, 11:07:03 PM
Ohio Wesleyan picks up a nice win over stubborn Hanover tonight, 70-66. (http://www.otterbein.edu/athletics/Mbasketball/games/2008/smoke04.htm)  Wesleyan was almost undone by their ineptitude at the free throw line (just 16/28, 57.1%) but managed to hit enough of them to hold off the Panthers down the stretch.  Dustin Rudegeair had a huge game that is underestimated by the scorebook  (http://www.otterbein.edu/athletics/Mbasketball/games/2008/smoke04.htm)(15 points, 9 rebounds).  Three other Bishops contributed 13-15 points apiece, as OWU shot 48% from the field and committed just 10 turnovers on the evening.  OWU will play for the Smokey Ballenger Classic title tomorrow evening against Albion, who knocked off a very pesky homestanding Otterbein squad, 76-70.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 28, 2007, 11:47:15 PM
Final:  Wooster 94  Wesley (DE) 61

Back from Timken where I watched Wooster dismantle a 6-2 Wesley team as the Scots played a great game tonight.

Wooster was led by All-American James Cooper with 29 points (4 three pointers), Brandon Johnson with 14 points and freshman Bryan Wickliffe also with 14 points.

Wooster won this game easily by shooting 56% from the floor (vs. 35% for Wesley), by outrebounding Wesley 48-26 and by shooting 46% from the three point arc (12 of 26 for the Scots).

Marty Bidwell played very stout defense on Wesley's #1 scorer (Devin Fulk also helped).  Rashawn Johnson who was averaging ~25 points/game for Wesley was held to only 14 points on 4 of 19 shooting from the floor. :)

Wooster's future looks bright given the potential of freshmen Bryan Wickliffe and Kaleb Reed who both showed good athleticism and hustle tonight.  Wickliffe played the best of all Wooster big men tonight with 5 of 6 FG, 4 of 4 FTs for 14 points and 5 rebounds in just 23 minutes of action.  Reed didn't score much but he played good defense and grabbed a few rebounds.

Wooster plays Notre Dame (OH) for the Mose Hole championship tomorrow night. ;D

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 28, 2007, 11:55:53 PM
Elsewhere:
Franklin 70, Earlham 58 (http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/2007-08/press_releases/pr122807.html) (at Franklin)...Earlham faces Baldwin-Wallace in the consolation of the Bankers Classic
Aquinas 92, Hiram 64 (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/news/article.php?id=1541) (at Ashland)...Hiram faces Rio Grande in the AU Holiday Inn Express Classic consolation game tomorrow
Wittenberg 71, Olivet 58 (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/kiwanis07/gamestory4.html) (at Witt)...Witt will play UW-La Crosse for the championship of the Zimmerman Classic
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2007, 09:14:55 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 28, 2007, 11:47:15 PM
Final:  Wooster 94  Wesley (DE) 61

Back from Timken where I watched Wooster dismantle a 6-2 Wesley team as the Scots played a great game tonight.

I must say, I'm quite surprised at the margin of victory in the Scots' win last night.  I really thought this game was going to be close with even the chance of a Wesley upset.  With Wesley's Johnson coming into the game averaging 25 ppg, I thought if he went off, the Wolverines might've had a chance.  But Marty Bidwell with some help from Devin Fulk and Brandon Johnson held him to 10 points under his average.  I really don't know which was more fun to watch.  Coop going off for 29 points in another stellar offensive performance or Bidwell doing his thing on the defensive end of the floor.

Wooster seems to be really hitting their stride after a bit of a shaky start.  I think a lot of this had to do with settling on a starting line-up and rotation.  Of course, Cooper's slow start didn't help matters either.  But now, Wooster seems to have found a starting 5 and a solid rotation that works.  Wickliffe is really starting to settle into his starting role.  I was worried about his pension for getting into foul trouble, but he seems to have gotten that under control a bit better over the last few games.  I agree with wsf in that I really see a bright future with this kid.  He's going to be a good one.

Wooster now faces another NAIA foe in Notre Dame of Ohio where the Scots will actually have a chance to reclaim the Mose Hole title after 1st round losses the last 2 years in this tournament!  I think NDC might be a little better than their record indicates.  They have a good pg averaging 20 ppg.  Should be another opportunity for Bidwell to showcase his defensive prowess.  They have also lost several close games including losing by only 6 to Cedarville, whom you might recall also beat Wooster earlier in the year.  On the flip side, they also got handled pretty good by an average MSJ team.  All in all, I really expect Wooster to handle NDC rather easily.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 29, 2007, 06:03:30 PM
Just got back home from Wabash's disappointing 72-66 loss to Trinity. I don't have much time before I head down for the Alamo Bowl but I will say that Wabash made a great run late in the 2nd half, played with great heart and just came up short.

Let's hope the LGs can put it all together tomorrow and go home with a win.

Wabash Always Fights!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2007, 11:42:14 PM
Wooster wins the Mose Hole for the first time in 3 seasons closing out Notre Dame College 87-71.

Wooster trailed 20-15 about 3/4 of the way through the 1st half but James Cooper took over the show scoring 11 consecutive points (including 3 treys) to jump start a 25-5 run to close the 1st half for the Scots.  NDC was able to make a run at Wooster cutting the Scots' lead to just 7 with around 3 minutes to play, however Brandon Johnson canned one of his 6 3-pointers and Wooster never trailed by less than 10 from there on out!

Johnson finished with 26 points which was enough to garner him tournament MVP honors.  Marty Bidwell was a well deserving defensive MVP and James Cooper who added a quiet 22 points joined his teammates on the all-tournament team.

In the consolation game, Wesley might not ever venture back to the Buckeye state after an 0-fer for the weekend as they couldn't shake off the drubbing they took at the hands of Wooster last night losing to lowly MUC 77-66.

Other scores of significance from the NCAC:

Wittenberg - 54

UW-LAX - 50

Nice win for the Tigers as they claim their holday tournament.

OWU - 67

Albion - 59

The Bishops get a nice win over an Albion team that could be a sleeper to contend for the MIAA.  The Bishops get 2 nice wins to claim the Otterbein holiday tourney to get some much needed momentum to propel them into the NCAC season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2007, 12:57:06 AM
OWU was very impressive tonight in dispatching a good Albion squad.  Recap and box score. (http://bishops.owu.edu/2007-08/mbb1229.html)  I'm not sure if OWU ever trailed, but if they did, it was not by much and not for long.  Like last night, they were horrendous at the stripe in the first half, hitting just one of seven, but still led by six after holding the Britons to just 31% shooting.  Then in the second half, while Albion caught fire (58.6%, hitting six more FGs than the Bishops), they calmly drained sixteen of nineteen free throws to secure the win.  As important as the sudden accuracy, though, was their impressive ability to handle the ball, committing just 7 turnovers on the night (at least three of which were charging calls, always subject to conjecture).  These two factors allowed OWU to claim the Smokey Ballenger Classic title, despite being outshot in both quality (45.5% to 42.9%) and quantity (55 FGA to 49) and outrebounded (35-32).  Tournament MVP Dustin Rudegeair had another good evening, with a team-high 16 points, 5 boards, and 3 steals.  Jesse Jean was a bucket (or, ahem, 2 free throws, he was 0-3) away from a double-double, scoring 8 and grabbing a game-high 12 rebounds;  he too was named to the all-tournament team.  But perhaps the key player in the Bishops' win was reserve Mitch Noggle, plucked off the cobwebby end of the OWU bench when Brian Cafarella picked up 3 early fouls.  Noggle, who had played all of 7 minutes prior to this evening, contributed 5 points, 4 boards, and lots of defense and hustle in 13 solid minutes, a surprise and quite welcome contribution, especially as the Bishops were without the services of the limping and non-uniformed Brent Pleiman all weekend.

The consolation game was won, somewhat to my surprise, by a very hot-shooting (55.8%) Otterbein over an even hotter (62.1%) Hanover.  The difference in this game is easy for all to see:  Hanover was 6 of 13 from the stripe, while Otterbein was 27 of 34.  Draw your own conclusions.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 30, 2007, 01:20:17 AM
SF and DC, (and Lil Giant for chipping in!)

Thanks for the nice recaps of the games, perfect for someone who would have wanted to take all four of these games in but had commitments that kept me from hearing any of them.

Great to see Johnson continue to step up on the offensive end. Cooper still seems locked into one of the best stretches of his collegiate career, but Wooster is strongest when its flashes its other weapons, too.

That's two straight good wins for OWU. Circle Feb. 2 in Wooster on your calendars now.

Nice result for the Tigers, too. Always nice to win your home tournaments, and Witt's on a four game winning streak. (And should push that to 6: they get Denison and Oberlin next, then a potentially crucial matchup with Allegheny...)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2007, 01:21:11 AM
So, a recap:
Wooster 87, Notre Dame (O.) 71 (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/recaps/2007-08/ndc.php)...Wooster win the Mose Hole Classic
Wittenberg 54, UW-La Crosse 50 (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/kiwanis07/gamestory8.html)...Wittenberg wins the Zimmerman Classic
OWU 67, Albion 59 (http://bishops.owu.edu/2007-08/mbb1229.html)...OWU wins the Ballenger Classic (at Otterbein)
Trinity (TX) 72, Wabash 66 (http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=5364)...Wabash faces co-host Southwestern tomorrow in the classic format Trinity/Southwestern Holiday Classic
Baldwin-Wallace 82, Earlham 65 (http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/index.html)...Earlham finishes last in the Goaltenders-Bankers Classic (at Franklin)
Rio Grande* 108, Hiram 101 (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/news/article.php?id=1543)...Hiram finishes last at the Holiday Inn Express Classic (at Ashland)
NYU 72, Denison 51 (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/men_s_basketball_second_half_ru.html)...Denison moves on to the consolation of the NYU Holiday Classic vs. John Jay tomorrow.

Three tournament titles, plus one more for the women (OWU at the South Padre Island Shootout)...not a bad weekend for the NCAC!

*For those who may be unaccustomed to our quaint Ohio ways, this name is pronounced RYE-oh Grand.  ::) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2007, 03:31:06 PM
John Jay slips past Denison, 73-69, in the consolation game of the NYU Holiday tournament.  *sigh* :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2007, 03:45:14 PM
Wow, if the Big Red can't beat a sub .500 team from one of the worst conferences in D-3, then they may go donut for the season. Ick!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 30, 2007, 03:50:37 PM
Wabash is up on Southwestern 37-33 at halftime in the finale of their Texas two-step.  Wes Smith is having a good game with 11 points and 11 rebounds at the break.  Aaron Brock leads the Little Giants with 15 first half points. 

And we're all done in San Antonio...Wabash hangs on to beat Southwestern 69-64.  After first half foul trouble, Andrew Zimmer came back to lead Wabash in scoring with 19 points.  Wes Smith finished with 13 points and 16 rebounds. 

This concludes Wabash's non-conference schedule...next up for the LGs is the Allegheny/Hiram double on 1/4 and 1/5.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 01, 2008, 09:46:54 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on December 29, 2007, 06:03:30 PM
Just got back home from Wabash's disappointing 72-66 loss to Trinity.

Wabash Always Fights!
Wabash put up a more respectable result against Trinity than ONU.  The PB's fell to Trinity the other day to the tune of 75-58.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on January 01, 2008, 11:13:13 PM
Ahhh, Rio Grande College, now University, of Bevo Francis (http://athletics.rio.edu/index.php?module=Static_Docs&func=view&f=bballmen/bevo.htm) fame!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 02, 2008, 08:09:33 PM
Wittenberg up 40-23 at halftime, sounds like a relatively pedestrian game so far for Witt. Denison shot 9-31 in the first half. Gregg Hill has 12 points so far. Hopefully things hold serve!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2008, 11:18:44 PM
It was a pretty crummy game all around, pennstghs.  Wittenberg appeared to be supremely undermotivated, especially after the non-competitive first half, and strolled to a lackluster 73-59 win.  Gregg Hill led all scorers with 21, but he took 17 shots (vs. 2 assists).  That's indicative of how the game went: Wittenberg didn't move the ball very well because they really didn't have to.  Every time Hill had an open look he fired, and that was pretty much every time he touched the ball.  Denison played with heart, and to their credit they never gave up, getting as close as 13 in the latter stages (Witt's largest lead was 25 at 12:51, but immediately thereafter DU went on a 14-2 run), but they just don't have the talent to mount much of a threat to a top-half team like Witt. 

Denison's leading scorer, as he has been all season, was Pat Sullivan, whose 19 represented a career high.  As I mentioned to a friend I was sitting with, and meaning no disrespect, when Pat Sullivan is your top scoring threat, you're in trouble.  He should be piling up assists (he had just one tonight), feeding the ball to the post, but they have no replacement for Dan Hodgkinson, so the scoring load has fallen on Sullivan (now averaging 12.2 ppg and still getting 2.8 apg).

Denison, who has played just two home games now, falls to 0-11, and travels to Ohio Wesleyan Saturday.  The good news is that two of their next four games are against Oberlin and Hiram.

Wittenberg improves to 6-5, the first time they have been over .500 this season.  Although tonight's game might not provide much of a measuring stick for how much they may have improved since their 1-5 start, I'd say their chances of extending their streak of non-losing seasons to an unreal 53 are pretty good right now.

Box score (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/denm0102.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 03, 2008, 08:06:37 PM
A couple of weeks ago at the Wabash/Franklin game I kept a running post live from Chadwick Court.  With Wabash returning to Chadwick tomorrow night, I'm looking for some feedback.  Is this something anybody would like to see again or even regularly from Wabash home games?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2008, 08:40:24 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 03, 2008, 08:06:37 PM
A couple of weeks ago at the Wabash/Franklin game I kept a running post live from Chadwick Court.  With Wabash returning to Chadwick tomorrow night, I'm looking for some feedback.  Is this something anybody would like to see again or even regularly from Wabash home games?

Personally, I enjoyed it, but with the conference season getting underway in earnest, I'm likely to be at a gym somewhere at the same time as you, so simple recaps are likely to serve me as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 03, 2008, 11:30:04 PM
I liked it, Wally.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 04, 2008, 09:59:11 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 03, 2008, 08:06:37 PM
A couple of weeks ago at the Wabash/Franklin game I kept a running post live from Chadwick Court.  With Wabash returning to Chadwick tomorrow night, I'm looking for some feedback.  Is this something anybody would like to see again or even regularly from Wabash home games?

I thought the commentary was great.  I loved it.  If it's not too much to ask and not too big of an inconvenience, I'd say please keep doing them.   Thank you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 04, 2008, 11:28:08 AM
The response seems pretty favorable...I'll go ahead and post live updates from Chadwick for tonight's critical Wabash/Allegheny game. 

This is an important game because the winner here holds the tiebreak and the loser doesn't get a chance to split the series later in the season.  Wabash and Allegheny seem to be teams that are likely to finish with similar records, so that tiebreak could be the difference between having to travel from one geographic extreme of the conference to the other in the first round of the tournament (as Wabash had to do last year...a regular season win at Allegheny would have reversed that situation).  The Gators have been off since 12/11.  It will be interesting to see how that layoff will affect Allegheny in tonight's game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash83 on January 04, 2008, 04:51:48 PM
I know that you have already made up your mind, but I wanted to chime in and say that I enjoyed the in game updates for the Franklin game and if you are inclined to continue to do similar updates for other LG games, I would follow them the best I can.  Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 04, 2008, 07:31:52 PM
Alright....90 seconds to the anthem and the starting lineups.  I'll quickly set the stage here.  NCAC season kicks off in earnest tonight for both of these squads.  Allegheny has had a 145 day layoff or some such thing (they last played on 12/11) and to make matters worse I've been informed that Bill Babe and Ryan Hollihan (scorers #2 and 3 on the team) suffered injuries in practice this week and are out for tonight's game. 

This is the first of a four game home stand for the Little Giants and it will be critical for Wabash to take advantage of the extra home game they get in this east-comes-west year.  Lineups are being announced....tipoff coming shortly. 

Quickly before we get underway, I'll say that is a friends and family affair at Chadwick tonight....very sparse crowd, but those who came seem fired up.   :)

19:38 - Wabash wins the tip and Zimmer scores quickly to give Wabash the early advantage.  Nice to Zimmer off to a quick start.  He's taken some time to get into the flow of the game lately.  Simkus just scored for Wabash as well.  4-0 early. 

16:30 - Earl Rooks just got called for palming.  I'm not sure Earl could palm a grapefruit.  We've traded 3s since the last update.  7-3 Wabash.   

12:12 - Wabash opens up an 18-5 lead following a Chase Haltom 3 pointer.  8 minutes into this game, Allegheny looks like a team that hasn't played in 4 weeks.  They're just a step slower than Wabash right now and looking pretty sloppy.  We just traded 3s again.  21-8 now in favor of Wabash. 

8:52 - I should have kept my mouth shut.  Gheny is on a mini-run since the last update and has closed the gap to 23-19.  Wabash could probably use a timeout here, but Mac doesn't seem to agree with me.  We play on. 

6:28 - With the starters back on the floor, Wabash picked up the tempo and answered the Gheny run.  Wabash's little run here was just punctuated by a Wes Smith fast break dunk which promptly brought a Gator timeout.  31-22 here coming out of the timeout.

3:10 - Another steal and breakaway flush for Wes Smith.  He's putting on a show tonight as he's made a couple of very nice steals, had an impressive blocked shot and some nice rebounds.  If I can channel Hubie Brown, Wes has been very active in the painted area tonight.  37-26 in favor of the LGs. 

2:08 - We've got a timeout.  No score change, but I want to give some props to the kid doing radio tonight.  He's flying solo which can never be easy. 

0:00 - 39-30 is the halftime score.  Allegheny got some foul shots with 10 seconds to go, missed the second of two and put back an offensive rebound to close within 9 at the break.  All in all, not a bad close to the half for the Gators considering their first 8 minutes. 

Some halftime observations....Wabash is really forcing the pace of this game, particularly wiht the starting unit on the floor.  I don't know if this is to take advantage of Allegheny perhaps being a step slow due to their layoff or if they are taking advantage of Allegheny being down two players that typically give them big minutes...either way, it is working pretty well and if Wabash can maintain the high tempo, we may see Allegheny fold down the stretch. 

Not much that Allegheny has done really stands out to me so far.  Indvidually, George Raftis has been been pretty solid.  Livestats tells me that he's got 8 first half rebounds and 6 points which is a good 20 minutes work. The Gators are being led by Craig Devinney at the half with 7 points. 

Wabash is being led by Gary Simkus who had 12 early points.  Zimmer is 3-3 for 6 points and Wes Smith has chipped in with 7 for the LGs.  Just over 6 minutes to go before the second half. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 04, 2008, 08:20:29 PM
Early second half note....Wes has switched from the white headband to the red headband.  We'll see how Allegheny reacts and adjusts to the wardrobe change. 

20:00 - The red headband was a ruse.  Wes has shed the headband altogether. 

17:40 - And Aaron Brock finally opens the second half scoring with a leaner in the paint.  41-30 Wabash. 

13:53 - Brock scores again in the post to give Wabash a 48-36 advantage.  Offensively, the Gators are having a hard time getting into any sort of set play.  Another steal for Wabash here...Simkus lays it in.  50-36 now.  As I was saying, the Little Giant defense has been pretty smothering this evening.  It's clear that Wabash knows how important this game is. 

8:01 - Simkus nails a pair of free throws to give him 20 points on the night.  I'm guessing that this is a career high for Gary...if not he has to be close.  60-43 Wabash.

11:09 - there hasn't been a whole lot of scoring this half, but Earl Rooks just made a highlight reel no-look pass to Rich Kavalauskas for an easy layup.  Wow.  All 75 people in attendance tonight were wowed by that one.  54-37 for Wabash here coming out of a timeout.  Allegheny is still struggling to get anything going offensively...the Gators are scrambling big time on offense. 

9:33 - Gheny connects on a pair of free throws to trim the lead to 55-42 then comes with the all out full court press forcing a Wabash timeout.  I think the Gators are going to need to force a bunch of turnovers here down the stretch to get back in this thing...seems they think so too.  Wabash has just been too strong inside to expect Allegheny to get enough stops in the half court to make this a game. 

8:01 - Simkus connects on a pair of free throws to give him 20 points on the night.  This has to be somewhere around a career high for Gary.  60-43 Wabash.

6:00 - Zimmer drives and lays it in without much resistance.  67-47 and this one is starting to get away from the Gators.  Allegheny is starting to look fatigued. 

4:03 - It's 71-47 and benches are clearing.  I think Coach Clune is waiving the white flag.

2:29 - Timeout Wabash.  Mac is going to make sure that a couple of guys are going to get their first varsity minutes tonight. 

0:00 - Final score Wabash 75, Allegheny 56.  The Gators picked up some garbage time points to make this one a little closer than it really was.  Impressive win for Wabash tonight.  Hiram comes to town tomorrow as Wabash goes for the sweep against the eastern schools. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 04, 2008, 11:07:00 PM
Nice live updating, Wally!  +K

Sounds like a very good win for the LGs.  Part of that four-game homestand is against Wooster...sounds like Woo better be ready to play for that one. Will the Chadwick Crazies be back on Jan. 12?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2008, 11:10:47 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 04, 2008, 07:31:52 PM...and to make matters worse I've been informed that Bill Babe and Ryan Hollihan (scorers #2 and 3 on the team) suffered injuries in practice this week and are out for tonight's game. 

Good grief.  Is it too late for me to change my pick for this game?  :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 04, 2008, 11:41:03 PM
From the Wooster website:

NCAC Player of the Week: In addition to his tournament MVP honor, Brandon Johnson (Columbus, Ohio / Groveport Madison) was the North Coast Athletic Conference Player of the Week.

In the Mose Hole tourney, Johnson had a combined 40 points with 10-of-10 free throw shooting and 11 assists against only two turnovers plus six steals in the two Wooster victories.

Congratulations to Brandon!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2008, 11:41:55 PM
Hiram scores final five points to defeat Earlham 79-75 (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/news/article.php?id=1545) (at Richmond)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 04, 2008, 11:45:57 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 04, 2008, 11:41:55 PM
Hiram scores final five points to defeat Earlham 79-75 (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/news/article.php?id=1545) (at Richmond)

I was just going to ask if anyone had seen a score from this one.  I picked the right end of this pick'em.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2008, 11:49:30 PM
Other game of pick'em interest:
John Carroll 55, Grove City 51
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 05, 2008, 12:25:32 AM
Nick Welsh got tossed, so it says, and he did so after Ian Pfouts was called for a foul.

Now, I'm just guessing that Pfouts fouled Welsh pretty hard (perhaps) and Welsh took umbrage. Or there was some hard play and Welsh took umbrage. At any rate, there is no doubt umbrage was taken by Welsh and he was asked to leave.

Pfouts was the Hiram player that made a hard foul on one of the Wooster studs a couple of years ago and there was mayhem on the boards here. He was virtually drawn & quartered, boiled in oil, keelhauled, and forced to watch Barney videos. So there is some precedent that Pfouts isn't exactly a gentleman on the basketball floor. (Though he's probably a scholar since the NCAC don't cotton to no dummies...)

So, any Quaker or Terrier want to chime in on the lowdown?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 05, 2008, 12:35:14 AM
I saw Pfouts and, I think, Bryan Yelvington nearly come to blows at Kenyon last season.  I've seen him play perhaps four or five games in his career; the kid plays like a hockey enforcer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: earlhamalum on January 05, 2008, 02:02:27 AM
So I have been quiet this year about my Earlham Quakers... I could lie and say I have been busy with work and getting my Freshman Squad ready for Indianapolis North Central (Eric Gordon's alma mater) game tomorrow morning; honestly been busy with that and the holiday and family gatherings.  Speaking of Gordon he is GOOD okay a little better then good, but I was able to watch him up close and personal @ the Iowa game and that kids is good.  THANK YOU BRONSON Lickliter! 

Going to pass on talking about my big ten and Horizon league games I have attended this year and take my direction towards the NCAC.  So I've seen Earlham twice this year once at home against Anderson with Billypilgram.  Since he decided not to comment on this board I opted not to also.  I'm not a big fan of boards and well he usually surfs every Penn State Board known to mankind.  I also went down to Franklin College last Saturday for there game against Baldwin-Wallace. 

Anderson game- Lost 62-69.  I really think they have some individual talent and it is a shame that they do not have those missing players to fill in some of the voids they have.  I look at the 11 guys Anderson played and the 7 guys Earlham played and thought no way these guys will be able to play with Anderson.  Well needless to say they Gregory with a quiet 17 and .500 from the field, Terrel Berry grabbed an impressive 17 carmoms and God love him I'm not sure if he could throw the ball in the ocean.  Nick Welsh played soft as always, but put up solid (love me an oxymoron) numbers 5-8,   12 pts, 5 rebounds and 2 blocks. They were in the game the entire time trailing 61-63 with 52 seconds remaining.  They just do not have the numbers right now and they get worn down throughout the game.  They pretty much play 4 players over 30 minutes a game, and by no means do I judge that decision.  I think I would have them train with the cross country team and try to have 6 guys ready to play since they seem to have a bunch of obstacles in the way and to be truthfully honest with you they only have a handful college basketball players on that roster.

Baldwin-Wallace- Lost 65-82.  Walked in the gym and saw Gregory with a taped ankle and a coaching staff w/ trainer watching him workout like it was the NFL Combine.  Well needless to say his Ankle injury prevented him from playing and man did that hurt.  It was nice to see Justin Carter who was playing in his second game for the Quakers.  He ended up 6-10 with 14 points in 35 minutes and they also received a pleasant 14 from freshman Mark Host.

As for tonight or should I say Friday night game I'll hopefully have something for you later.  It is hard for me to believe that this was one-sided and not provoked because Nick is a Soft 6'8.  I am thinking about going to become an official instead of coaching.  Some of these guys are steps below a bad joke.  I actually saw Mike Fox, one of the official's that covered the Game tonight and also worked the Earlham/Baldwin-Wallace game I attended.  I also saw him on National T.V. thinking he was a chairman or doing something or another... I wish I would of told BillyPilgram, because it has eluded my mind at the current moment in time and buggin me... Anyone that can help? anyone?  BUELLER? BUELLER? BUELLER?   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 05, 2008, 02:37:44 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 04, 2008, 11:07:00 PM
Nice live updating, Wally!  +K

Sounds like a very good win for the LGs.  Part of that four-game homestand is against Wooster...sounds like Woo better be ready to play for that one. Will the Chadwick Crazies be back on Jan. 12?

Thanks for the +K....and this was a good win for Wabash.  I'm going to reserve really heavy praise for this one for a couple of reasons.  On the surface, Wabash laying waste to a 6-3 team seems awesome, but Allegheny's schedule is littered with every Penn State hyphen school known to man and I'm not sure how tough that 6-3 record is.  Also, the Gators were without two key players tonight and they were playing for the first time in four weeks.  Allegheny was running up a steep hill before this game even tipped off and after digging a hole in the first 8 minutes, they didn't have much of a chance. 

That having been said, I'm really impressed with what I'm seeing from Wabash this season.  Wabash's defense has been pretty good lately, even through the last few "lean" seasons, but this year the defense has stepped up a little bit.  As I posted during the game, Allegheny had trouble getting anything at all going in the half court thanks to constant harassment from Little Giant defenders.  While the defense is still good, the thing that has me really optimistic is that Wabash seems to be playing with a LOT more consistency offensively this season.  We know Zimmer can score, but Simkus, Brock and Haltom have each added a great deal to Wabash's offense both inside and outside.  Teams that are gearing up to stop Zimmer at all costs are getting burned big time by these other guys who are knocking down shots with enough consistency to be dangerous. 

At risk of looking past Hiram tomorrow afternoon, the CoW/Wabash game is looking very good to me.  The students will be back for that one and I'm expecting a good and rowdy student crowd.  I'm also anxious to see what kind of kicks Coach Petty is going to sport for Coaches vs. Cancer Day.  Wabash hasn't beaten Wooster at Chadwick since joining the NCAC....I think 1/12 is the best chance Wabash has had since Wabash's first year in the conference (with Estelle and Latham).  Wabash will be underdogs for sure, but the Scots will get everything they can handle from Wabash.  I'm anticipating that Wes Smith will draw the Cooper assignment...tough draw for a freshman, but Wes is the best defender Wabash has and while I'm sure Cooper will get his points (he's too good not to), I think Wes will make it a difficult time.  It's going to be a fun matchup for sure. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 05, 2008, 09:01:10 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 05, 2008, 02:37:44 AM
Wabash hasn't beaten Wooster at Chadwick since joining the NCAC....I think 1/12 is the best chance Wabash has had since Wabash's first year in the conference (with Estelle and Latham).  Wabash will be underdogs for sure, but the Scots will get everything they can handle from Wabash.  I'm anticipating that Wes Smith will draw the Cooper assignment...tough draw for a freshman, but Wes is the best defender Wabash has and while I'm sure Cooper will get his points (he's too good not to), I think Wes will make it a difficult time.  It's going to be a fun matchup for sure. 
I don't know.  Those teams with Joe DesJean and Brady Claxton seemed to always give the Scots all they could handle when Wooster would visit the 'ville.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 05, 2008, 09:03:51 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 04, 2008, 11:41:55 PM
Hiram scores final five points to defeat Earlham 79-75 (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/news/article.php?id=1545) (at Richmond)
Wow, for once my upset special turned out correct!!! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 05, 2008, 12:26:24 PM
Mike Fox runs the Hoosier Dome...er...RCA Dome as the stadium director.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 05, 2008, 02:58:48 PM
We're about 5 minutes from tipoff at Chadwick.  This is my first chance to see Hiram's Mike Staley so I'm excited about that.  In a bizarre twist, Hiram will be wearing the home whites today and Wabash will be sporting the road reds.  As I never get to see Wabash in the red unis, I'm ok with this.  Wes appears to be going with the red headband to start today...we'll see if the headband makes it through the layup drills and onto the court for tipoff.  Back with more once we get underway. 

19:00 - The scoring starts with a Wes Smith steal and breakaway dunk.  Nice.  2-0 Wabash.  Smith is shadowing Staley here early and Staley is having a tough time getting free. 

17:12 - Wabash is having a tough time getting shots to fall early here.  Earl Rooks just picked up his second foul which will send Staley to the line.  The shots are good and Hiram has an early 7-4 lead.   

16:25 - Rough start for Wabash.  Staley just scored again to give Hiram a 9-4 lead and forcing a Wabash timeout.  With Rooks on the bench, Wabash is going to need strong minutes from Chase Haltom here in the first half.  Simkus scores in the paint out of the timeout.  9-6 Terriers.  And then Haltom hits a 3 before I can post.  9-9.

15:16 - And Wes Smith converts a 3 point play after finishing a great drive.  Just like that Wabash is on an 8-0 run and leads 12-9.

13:00 - Another steal and dunk for Smith.  Wabash is on a 14-0 run here.  Make it 16-0 as Zimmer lays the ball in.  20-9 Wabash leads.  Hiram coach Steve Fleming is about to come out of his sweater vest...he's not happy with much of anything right now. 

11:02 - Evan Arnold drills a triple for Wabash and extends the lead to 27-13.  Timeout Hiram.  In the last 4 minutes, Hiram has gotten completely out of any half court offense at all...pretty much we've got Staley pushing the ball up the floor and jacking up 3s.  this strategy will not serve the Terriers well.  The current Wabash run is 23-4 over the last 5 minutes or so. 

7:22 - We're in a timeout.  The game has gotten a little sloppy over the last couple of minutes...lots of turnovers by both teams here.  The score sits at 29-19 in favor of Wabash.  Hiram's offense is pretty stale...lots of one-on-one stuff, not much passing.  The Terriers are getting killed with Wabash's help defense.  Staley drives the baseline and scores out of the timeout and draws the foul.  The freebie is good.  29-22 now.  This Staley cat can play. 

1:30 - There hasn't been much to talk about here...this game has been pretty sloppy for most of the last 10 minutes.  Hiram has chipped away...until Zimmer nails a triple.  We're under a minute go now and Wabash leads 42-29.

0:00 - Hiram gets a free throw to close to the first half scoring and we go to the break with Wabash leading 42-30. 

First half observations....I really like Mike Staley.  He plays in a different gear than his teammates.  He's just a little quicker, passes are crisper....he could probably play at any school in the NCAC.  Unfortunately for Staley, his teammates aren't quite at the same level and Hiram's offense suffers because of it.  You can see Staley get selfish at times which doesn't help.  Not surprisngly, Staley leads Hiram in scoring with 11 first half points. 

For Wabash, Zimmer had a big first half with 14 points and Smith added 10 more.  Aaron Brock, who has his knee wrapped today (I hope he'll be 100% for Wooster next weekend) had 9 first half rebounds.  Wabash is winning the rebounding battle 29-15.  Clearly Hiram will have to reverse this if they are going to make a run in the second half. 

Brent just sent over first half stats...it's like I'm on press row!   ;D
Anyway, what stands out is Wabash's 20-8 edge in points in the painted area and the 13-4 advantage Wabash has on second chance points.  Hiram really doesn't have an answer for Wabash's strong rebounding.  Hiram shoots just 30% for the first half and they'll have to do much better than that if they aren't going to rebound. 

Second half will be underway in a couple of minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on January 05, 2008, 03:37:13 PM
I am following your commentary wally.  Thank you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 05, 2008, 03:54:23 PM
Denison leads Ohio Wesleyan at halftime, 39-38.

You read that right.  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 05, 2008, 03:57:26 PM
Wow on that Denison score.  Beating OWU would be a good way to break the win column. 

Here we go for the second half...Hiram will get the ball to start off. 

18:25 - No scoring here yet, but Wabash just earned free throws after getting three offensive rebounds on this possession.  Not exactly the adjustment Hiram needed at halftime.  Brock gets one of the two shots.  43-30 for the Little Giants. 

17:33 - Zimmer beats the shot clock with a three pointer and Wabash matches their largest lead of the game.  46-30.  Hiram turns the ball over.  Back comes Wabash.

17:01 - He might be good, but he's still a freshman...Wes Smith draws towel duty after some bodies hit the floor. 

15:29 - Wabash is playing with some more patience on offense here in the second half whicih is good considering the 11 first half turnovers.  Zimmer lays the ball in after a Hiram turnover.  The lead has ballooned to 20 as Wabash leads 50-30. 

Zimmer has a double double....19 and 10 so far. 

13:00 - Hiram has gone back to a full court press.  It was at about that point in the first half when the game got sloppy.  We'll see how it plays out here in the second half.  We've got Staley at the line for two.  He misses the first.  Makes the second.  52-35 Wabash. 

10:01 - We're going through the motions here now.  Wabash has the second unit in...we'll see if the starters get back on the floor.  Chase Haltom gets a pair of free throws and Wabash has a 58-39 lead.

8:36 - 60-41 Wabash here....the first unit checks back in so they'll get one more run in before taking a seat tonight.  Zimmer scores immediately.  62-41 in favor of the LGs. 

6:54 - Zimmer hits another 3.  He's having a huge afternoon.  28 points for Zimmer to this point.  Rooks hits a driving layup for Wabash as well here.  67-43.  I think Mac is waiting for Coach Fleming to send in the end of the bench here.  Two more for Zimmer.  That's 30!  69-45 with 5:30 to go.

5:07 - Here comes the Hiram bench.  I'm sure Mac will substitute here at the next dead ball.

3:36 - Here come the Wabash subs.  Zimmer comes out to a well deserved ovation.  30 and 13 for Zim today.  Wabash leads comfortably, 73-48.

2:08 - Timeout Wabash...Mac finally gets a chance to substitute for Earl Rooks.  We've got 2 minutes to see how many of these kids can get their first varsity points. 

0:00 - 80-60 is the final.  After a slow start, this was a pretty easy win for the Little Giants.  Wabash has 7 days to get ready for Wooster.  This was a nice set of games for Wabash...I'm very encouraged by what I've seen here in the last 24 hours.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 05, 2008, 03:58:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 05, 2008, 03:54:23 PMYou read that right.  :o

Good. I thought I needed to go get my glasses.

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.funshop.com%2Fimages%2Ffs_r1495_l.jpg&hash=ea12d1b67363743cab150f9939d360bbb701ca4c)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 05, 2008, 04:39:35 PM
Great job, again, Wally. I'll repeat what a lot of us have said. You need to get into the SID business.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 05, 2008, 05:01:56 PM
EDIT:  d3hoops' scoreboard and the OWU website do not agree on this score at the moment.  OWU says they won 83-70 but the D3 site lists Denison as the winner by that score.

I suspect someone flipped the score when they submitted it to the d3 scoreboard.  Haven't seen a score at Denison's website or a recap for the game yet.

Denison 83, OWU 70, Final.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 05, 2008, 05:06:49 PM
OWU's site has the score the other way around. I'm assuming they have it correct, since it was a home game for OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 05, 2008, 05:55:36 PM
This score is now confirmed.

Denison 70, Ohio Wesleyan 83 (http://bishops.owu.edu/2007-08/mbb0105.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 05, 2008, 05:57:28 PM
OWU won but the Big Red gave them all they could handle.
Good showing by the Big Red.  They may be o-fer but there is no quit in this team and that is a credit to all the guys and the coaches.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 05, 2008, 06:43:49 PM
More scores...

Witt 82, Oberlin 66 (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/07-08statistics/witm0105.htm)
Allegheny 73, Earlham 57 (http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/2007-08/stats/erlm0105.html)
Wooster 81, Kenyon 63 (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/boxes/2007-08/kenyon.php)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 06, 2008, 08:20:24 AM
Wooster's win over Kenyon was in rather ho-hum fashion.  Kenyon hung around for much of the 1st half before Wooster put together a run to end the half up 15.  Wooster then extended the lead to 26 mid-way through the 2nd half and looked as if they were going to run away with the contest.  But, give the Lords credit.  They never quit and kept chipping away at the lead, but they could never get closer than 15.

Kenyon made a concerted effort to deny Wooster from the perimeter and it showed statistically as Wooster had one of their poorest 3 point shooting efforts of the season at just under 37%.   So the Scots made Kenyon pay by pounding it inside.  Wooster tallied 42 points from inside the paint compared to just 22 for the Lords.  As a result, Wooster's big men garnered the team lead in scoring with Bryan Wickliffe scoring 16 and Evan Will adding 13. 

Wooster now has a week off before making the trek to Indiana to take on Wabash next Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 06, 2008, 08:18:28 PM
How are Wooster fans feeling about Saturday's trip to C'ville? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 06, 2008, 09:04:36 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 06, 2008, 08:18:28 PM
How are Wooster fans feeling about Saturday's trip to C'ville? 

Not for me; too far away when I have an Earlham/Kenyon doubledip right in my backyard.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 07, 2008, 11:49:50 AM
Brent has posted a good preview article for this weekend's game at Chadwick. 

http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=5376

This is a huge game for the LGs.  Allegheny and Hiram didn't get front page preview articles...I'm just saying.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 07, 2008, 12:11:55 PM
Congratulations to Wabash's Andrew Zimmer, the NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) for the holiday period.  Zimmer scored a total of 62 points in 'Bash victories over Southwestern, Allegheny, and Hiram.  Congrats, Andrew!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 08, 2008, 05:35:12 PM
Going into tonight's home game vs. Bates, Jason Mulligan's College of New England Nor'easters are currently 6-5. A good showing, considering the team was 39-89 in the past five seasons.

After tonight, they finish the year with 13 (count 'em) conference games - there are 14 teams in the CCC and in the fine NESCAC tradition, everyone just plays each conference team once.

Gordon is probably the favorite going into conference play, but Mulligan's crew is one of the few with winning records, so they're a contender.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 09, 2008, 08:35:26 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 06, 2008, 08:18:28 PM
How are Wooster fans feeling about Saturday's trip to C'ville? 
Wally, are you talking in terms of actually making the trip?

I won't be making the trek, but I thought I would share some thoughts regarding this game.  I'm expecting this game to be a tough physical game as it usually is when the Scots make the trip to the 'ville.  Last year, Wabash held Woo's high scoring team to just 68 points.  Only one of 4 times last season Wooster was held below 70 points (the other 3 were also road games Earlham, at OWU and at Witt).  I'm expecting that type of defensive effort out of Wabash on Saturday as well.

Wabash is also playing some pretty good basketball of late as well as they've won 6 of 7 with their only loss to Trinity (TX) in Texas who was ranked at the time they beat Wabash. 

I think this game will be decided on who controls the tempo the best.  It seems that Wabash has always fared much better and the games have been much closer when they dictate the pace.  Another key for Wabash is to prevent one of Wooster's patented runs.  Last weekend, Kenyon was still hanging around in the 1st half when the Scots ended the half outscoring the Lords 16-6 to turn a 5 point lead into a 15 point halftime cushion.  Wabash can't afford to let the Scots get on one of those extended runs.

All in all, I'm expecting a game similar to what we saw last season.  The uglier this game is, the better the chances for Wabash to come out with a win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 09, 2008, 10:13:16 AM
Was just looking to stir some discussion about the first "big" NCAC game of 2008.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 09, 2008, 10:29:55 AM
This will be a tough game for Wooster.  The Scots have been playing better of late and will have to continue to do so against a difficult opponent on the road.  Although Brian Wickliffe has settled in nicely, adding another solid basketball player to the Scots rotation, it's still their depth, or lack of it actually, that scares me.  One recent positive has been the return to the floor of Craig Elam.  If he can continue to play himself back into shape and contribute 15 minutes or so a game that will help Wooster immensely.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 09, 2008, 10:51:59 AM
I feel good about Wabash's front court - I am concerned about who on the LG's will handle Cooper.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 09, 2008, 11:23:29 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 09, 2008, 10:51:59 AM
I feel good about Wabash's front court - I am concerned about who on the LG's will handle Cooper.

I don't think you really handle Cooper.  He's too good.  As Wes Smith has become the "defensive specialist" for Wabash, I'm sure we'll see Wes chasing Cooper around for most of the game.  Cooper will still get his points, but Smith should be able to force some turnovers or at least force the ball away from Cooper at times. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 09, 2008, 03:25:57 PM
I don't really care who Wabash puts on Cooper, as long as it's not that henchman of Al Swearingen's, the guy that pushed the rube off the cliff in order to steal his gold claim.  That's my opinion, unsolicited. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 09, 2008, 04:03:43 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 09, 2008, 03:25:57 PM
I don't really care who Wabash puts on Cooper, as long as it's not that henchman of Al Swearingen's, the guy that pushed the rube off the cliff in order to steal his gold claim.  That's my opinion, unsolicited. :)

That would be Dan, and I think you're safe.  He's out of eligibility.   :)

Deadwood references are a good way to boost karma.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 09, 2008, 09:51:54 PM
Scores from tonight's early games:

Oberlin 75  Denison 70
Hiram 113  Geneva 95
Penn-St Behrend 64   Allegheny 48

I haven't found scores for the OWU at Kenyon game.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 09, 2008, 10:35:55 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on January 09, 2008, 09:51:54 PM
Scores from tonight's early games:

Oberlin 75  Denison 70


The goose egg gets larger....sigh.  :-\

Also, OWU over Kenyon, 76-63.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2008, 12:22:13 AM
The conventional wisdom about tonight's OWU/Kenyon game would have been that Kenyon needed to pound the ball inside on offense and exploit their significant rebounding advantage on defense if they wanted to come away with a victory.  Well, they couldn't, and they didn't, and they lost. 

To my complete surprise, Wesleyan, not known for their rebounding prowess, dominated the boards 34-24, and were nearly even under their own basket, grabbing 12 offensive boards vs. 16 defensive for the Lords.  At the other end, Dave Knapke had a very strong game, scoring 16 on 8/13 shooting and grabbing 3 offensive boards.  Bryan Yelvington, on the other hand, was shut down almost completely, with just 6 points (2/8 shooting), 2 rebounds, and 15 minutes of relaxation on the bench.  No rebounds + no Yelvington = no happy locker room in Gambier.

OWU got a big game from Kyle Holliday (12 pts., 9 rebounds including 4 offensive boards, and 4 steals), a bigger one from Jesse Jean (16 points on 8/11 shooting and 8 boards), and a huge one from Dustin Rudegeair (21 points on 9/12 shooting, and 9 rebounds including 3 on the offensive glass.)   Overall, the Bishops shot 52.9% and committed just 12 turnovers, helping to offset a fairly woeful 5/18 (27.8%) from the arc.  Kenyon had just 11 turnovers, but only managed 7 assists on 23 baskets and hit just 4 of 15 long-range shots, indicative of their injury-thinned guard rotation. 

The good news for Kenyon is that senior co-captain Josh Klinger was back in uniform, although he spent the whole game icing his balky knee.  Frosh JT Knight was also over his recent indisposition, and tossed in 10 points including a couple of treys.  It looked like OWU frosh Brent Pleiman was also back in uniform, but he like Klinger did not get into the fray.

OWU recap (http://bishops.owu.edu/2007-08/mbb0109.html)
Kenyon recap (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26148.xml)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 10, 2008, 10:02:50 AM
It would appear that in the battle for the #1 draft pick the Big Red has a commanding lead.  :-[

And I would say the road is not going to get much easier the rest of January.  The Big Red has Kenyon at home....Hiram at home and then three stright road games starting with the Scots.  Ouch.

Not pretty. 

This team hangs with pretty much anyone, they just can't close the deal.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 10, 2008, 10:12:16 AM
Hiram's definitely winnable for Denison.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 10, 2008, 10:21:26 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 10, 2008, 10:12:16 AM
Hiram's definitely winnable for Denison.
That's what a lot of us thought about Oberlin as well...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 10, 2008, 10:24:11 AM
I agree that Hiram is our best shot at stopping the O-fer.  But I certainly wouldn't bet the ranch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 10, 2008, 11:29:36 AM
Oh, it's not a game I'd gamble on! Besides, not much action on D-3 games, you know.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 10, 2008, 01:19:16 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 10, 2008, 11:29:36 AM
Oh, it's not a game I'd gamble on! Besides, not much action on D-3 games, you know.

The look you get from the sportsbooks in vegas when you ask for a D3 score is priceless.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2008, 01:36:50 PM
I expect that I'll pick Denison to beat Oberlin, Earlham, and Hiram when each comes to visit Granville.  I'll be shocked, shocked :o if the Big Red go 0-3 through that lineup.

...then again, I'm essentially in last place in the pick'ems... :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2008, 03:13:40 PM
Under intense interrogation by Zach Bolinger of The [Wooster] Daily Record (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/3118222), Mac Petty broke down and let slip his entire gameplan for Saturday:
Quote from: Mac Petty as quoted by Zach Bolinger"To me, games always come down to making baskets. We have to take care of the ball, give ourselves a chance, and just try to play solid defense and solid offense."
:o
Loose lips sink ships, Coach. 

I overheard Steve Moore tell Bolinger that he plans to encourage his team to "outscore" Wabash, but he quickly insisted that this comment be off the record, lest Petty find out about his secret coaching strategy.
:D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 10, 2008, 03:25:00 PM
That kind of media savvy only comes with 3+ decades in the coaching business.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 10, 2008, 05:39:05 PM
Petty knows that you play to win the game... ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 10, 2008, 05:43:22 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 10, 2008, 03:13:40 PM
Under intense interrogation by Zach Bolinger of The [Wooster] Daily Record (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/3118222), Mac Petty broke down and let slip his entire gameplan for Saturday:
Quote from: Mac Petty as quoted by Zach Bolinger"To me, games always come down to making baskets. We have to take care of the ball, give ourselves a chance, and just try to play solid defense and solid offense."
:o
Loose lips sink ships, Coach. 

I overheard Steve Moore tell Bolinger that he plans to encourage his team to "outscore" Wabash, but he quickly insisted that this comment be off the record, lest Petty find out about his secret coaching strategy.:D

He already let the cat out of the bag - he plans no defense!  Otherwise he would have said he plans to encourage his team to have Wabash score less than his team. ;) ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 10, 2008, 05:44:58 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 10, 2008, 05:39:05 PM
Petty knows that you play to win the game... ;D

Hello!

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cbc.ca%2Fgfx%2Ftopstory%2Fsports%2Fedwards_herman0108.jpg&hash=7eae1f4dcd9f31da1ef9b838361d3db57a99587a)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 10, 2008, 06:50:30 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.theage.com.au%2Fffximage%2F2005%2F07%2F06%2Fdwood_wideweb__430x279.jpg&hash=72ffe7f09b681d476f711eed0fa8446eff9e3211)

Al Swearengen and the Deadwood coaching staff.  Their boys play in the NAIA Division - National Association of Inconsiderate Assassins.  Coach Swearengen, despite leading his team to a 13-0 record this season, has cast his eyes upon the top slot at Wabash College in Indiana, where he believes he can reverse that school's unfortunate trend against The College of Wooster.

"You just never know, when given such an opportunity, exactly what might happen.  But I like the odds.  I mean, pay heed, in all of Wabash's previous contests against Wooster, or anyone else for that matter, not a single Scot has been felled by gunshot while driving to the hole.  Uncanny!  Surely, just by pure chance, one has to figure that might change, and I'd like to be the man in the driver's seat when it does."

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 10, 2008, 07:17:44 PM
I'll assume that that was edited for board appropriateness...I'm not sure Al has ever spoken three consecutive sentences that in no way violated any number of the items in the Terms of Service.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 10, 2008, 09:03:18 PM
A tragedy has struck the Wooster basketball family.

Former Scot Blake Mealer lost his father and has a younger brother in critical condition with serious back injuries following a car accident on Christmas Eve. The girlfriend of another of Blake's brothers was also killed in the accident.

I recommend reading Zach Bolinger's article in the Jan. 9th The Daily Record here. (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/3111862) I think for now, at least, the article is available to anyone.

My thoughts are definitely with Blake and his family.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 11, 2008, 10:16:27 AM
Thoughts and prayers for sure to the Mealer family.

Just to add a little to that article, I don't believe that Blake's brother, Brock, is still in critilcal condition.  He was transported to UofM Hospital in Ann Arbor to begin rehab to help in the possibility of him walking again.  From what I've heard, the Doctors had put the odds of him not walking again at 70%.  And his response to that was that he was focused on the other number.  The 30% chance that he will walk again.

Here is another article that shows some of the great character that this young man has:

Brock Mealer article (http://www.wnwo.com/news/news_story.aspx?id=81693)

He seems to be to be quite a young man and my prayers will for sure be with him as he makes the long hard road to regain the use of his legs.  But, if there is someone that can defy the odds and walk again, it sounds as if Brock would be one of those individuals!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2008, 12:09:38 PM
Here's a quick mid-season update on four sophomores who were JV frosh at Wooster last season:

Nick Hershberger (http://www.muskingum.edu/home/athletics/basketball_m/stats.html) is playing well down at Muskingum, helping the Muskies to a 7-3 start (3-2 OAC).  Nick has played in all 10 games, starting 7 (including the last 6 straight), and is averaging 7.2 points and 3.6 rebounds in 22.4 minutes per game. 

Jake Johnson (http://www.bridgewater.edu/index.php?id=1396) is in the rotation at 6-2 Bridgewater (Va.), but has yet to start a game.  He's averaging 13.1 minutes per game, 7th best on the team, and is chipping in 3.1 points, 2.0 rebounds, and 1.1 assists.  He's made nearly half (.481) of his field goal attempts, and has even drained 4 three-pointers.

Jason Ronyak (http://www.case.edu/athletics/varsity/winter/mbasketball/stats/2007-08/TEAMCUME.HTM#TEAM.ROS) was on the roster at Case Western Reserve as of the end of December, but had yet to see any action.  He's no longer listed on the Spartans' roster (http://www.case.edu/athletics/varsity/winter/mbasketball/roster.htm).

Word has it that Dex Battista is at Grand Valley State (http://gvsulakers.cstv.com/sports/m-baskbl/mtt/grva-m-baskbl-mtt.html), but is not playing hoops there (this season, at least.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2008, 12:13:43 PM
Oh, and belated wishes for a happy birthday to our good friend Li'l Giant!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 11, 2008, 04:59:09 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 11, 2008, 12:13:43 PM
Oh, and belated wishes for a happy birthday to our good friend Li'l Giant!  :)

Muchas gracias. Any nice tidings are great right now as for my birthday I got The Flu.  >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 11, 2008, 05:10:44 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 11, 2008, 04:59:09 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 11, 2008, 12:13:43 PM
Oh, and belated wishes for a happy birthday to our good friend Li'l Giant!  :)

Muchas gracias. Any nice tidings are great right now as for my birthday I got The Flu.  >:(

I got the same thing for Christmas........and no one will take it back.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2008, 06:02:40 PM
In addition to being named the NCAC Player of the Week (mentioned earlier (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4200.msg844077#msg844077)), Andrew Zimmer has been named to the D3hoops.com Team of the Week (http://www.d3hoops.com/tow/) for the week ending Jan. 6.  Congratulations, Andrew!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on January 11, 2008, 07:34:50 PM
Is Wooster the only NCAC team that broadcasts video of thier home basketball games?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 11, 2008, 07:38:20 PM
I think that OWU has broadcast games.  They had a video setup at the OWU-Wooster game from earlier this year.  Other schools may, too.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 12, 2008, 12:50:20 AM
Witt did a few random games on video last year, but I don't see any games on the schedule for this year.  Either they haven't posted them yet, or they've been lost as part of the same cost-cutting tactics that refused to send a willing broadcast team to cover the then-undefeated volleyball team in the national quarterfinals.  I'm guessing the latter.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 12, 2008, 01:46:41 PM
I'm on the scene here in C'ville...teams are going through warmups....we've got about 13 minutes before lineup intros.  I'm ready to get this one underway.  I think we're in for a really good one this afternoon at Chadwick. 

And here we go....

18:46 - Cooper opens the scoring with a three pointer [/shocked].  On that possession Wes got called for a nickel-dimer....let 'em play guys. 

17:00 - The LGs are tight.  We're at 6-0 here early, but Wabash is all out of sorts.   Wooster is forced to call a timeout trying to inbound.  Maybe Mac can use this to get the kids to loosen up a bit. 

16:13 - Wabash finally gets on the board with an Aaron Brock free throw.  8-1 Scots. 

13:20 - Wooster is denying the post extremely well right now.  The LGs are having a tough time getting the ball to the painted area.  But, Gary Simkus found himself open for a triple adn Wabash is within two at 8-6.  Wes Smith drew a foul here driving to the basket and has free throws.  Missed 'em.  Offensive rebound for Zimmer kicked out to Simkus for another triple.  9-8 Wabash. 

11:03 - 14-10 Scots here.  This is a good time to mention that I'm pretty impressed with Wickliffe.  He's gonna be a beast. Evan Arnold hits a three for Wabash.  14-13 Scots. 

9:43 - Cooper is back on the floor for Wooster after an extended break.  Wabash did a good job with him early in the game as he's 1-4 so far.  Not surprisingly, Mac quickly brings Wes Smith back in the game.  Ah...the chess match. 

8:19 - It took some time, but the students are packing it in here.  Good to see.  Wabash leads here 17-16.  Sorry, Brock just hit a 3.  20-16 Little Giants.  Wabash has really responded well after the slow start. 

6:19 - It's been physical here so far.  Both teams are now in the bonus as Aaron Brock makes one of his two charity shots.  We're knotted at 21-21. 

5:49 - Zimmer worked his tail off to get a couple of offensive rebounds and finally stick it back.  And he got fouled.  The shot is good and Wabash goes back ahead 24-21. 

3:36 - This game is as good as hoped.  Total slugfest here.  The Scots are starting to accumulate some fouls defending the post.  Brian Maloney just forced Evan Will into his second foul and will be going to the line for two shots.  Good and not good.  29-26 Wabash.

2:32 - Simkus blocks a three point shot on the defensive end, then drains one at the other end of the floor.  Gary is playing very well this afternoon.  32-26 Wabash. 

0:32 - Zimmer picks up his second foul here late in the first half.  Both teams have 10+ fouls here in the first 20 minutes.  Foul trouble could be a big story here in the second half.  Wabash turns the ball over with 5 seconds to go.  The Scots will have a chance to score here to close the half.  And Johnson drives the length of the floor to score.  Wabash employed the "traffic cone" defense there.  Le sigh.  34-33 in favor of Wabash at the half. 

Following up my note regarding fouls...for Wooster Wickliffe, Will, Mealick, Fulk, and Elam all have two fouls.  For Wabash, Brock, Zimmer, Rooks, and Maloney all have two.  Keeping the sheet clean early in the first half is going to be pretty key or else one of these teams is going to get a pretty serious advantage on the inside. 

One other telling stat here....Wooster turned 13 Wabash turnovers into 18 points.  Wabash converted six Wooster turnovers into just four points.  Gotta take better care of the ball in the second half.  Not to say tha Wabash has been particularly sloppy...Wooster is a just an outstanding on-ball defending team. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 12, 2008, 02:46:14 PM
Dang, Wally, you're about 20 seconds ahead of the Wooster online radio feed!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 12, 2008, 03:01:13 PM
Fresh post for the second half.   :)  Let's hope the second half is as good as the first. 

And before we get into the second half I just want to note that last year when Wabash took Wooster to the wire here at Chadwick, I don't think Wooster played very hard.  They kinda went through the motions, IMO.  Not the case here today.  Both teams are working really hard here. 

19:15 - The second half starts the way the first half did...with a Cooper triple.  Zimmer answers with one of his own.  And Wabash scores off of steal.  39-35 Wabash here early in the second half. 

18:12 - Another Wabash steal leads to a Gary Simkus layup.  41-35 Wabash.  Steve Moore couldn't call that timeout fast enough. 

17:09 - Wes alters a Cooper three point attempt and it draws atmosphere.  Coop is hearing about it.  Zimmer scores on a nice little hook for Wabash.  45-37...largest lead of the game for the LGs. 

13:19 - Zimmer scores following a Wooster turnover.  Wabash is doing a better job of converting those extra possessions here.  49-45 Wabash.  The fouls have been scarce here in the second half, so that may not be as big of an issue as I thought.  Zimmer just picked up his third.  Johnson has 3 for Wooster. 

Wickliffe just missed his fourth free throw in the last two trips for Wooster.  Ouch. 

12:00 - Simkus with another triple.  He's in the zone.  52-45 Wabash.  On the other end, Smith picks up his 3rd for Wabash.  Fouls may be an issue after all. 

11:00 Three for Wes Smith and Wabash opens up a ten point lead!   55-45. 

10:10 - Brock beats the buzzer for three more!  58-47 Wabash.  It's getting noisy in here. 

9:42 It's 58-49 for Wabash coming out of a timeout.  Mac is stretching his minutes with Wes and Brock...both are on the floor with three fouls and will need to be careful over the next handful of minutes. 

7:11 - Brock and the crowd don't like it, but Aaron picked up a silly foul and will take his 10 points and 8 rebounds to the bench with four fouls.  The foul shots are good and Wooster is closing...60-53. 

We're in a timeout....the foul situation is Wabash 7, Wooster 3.  Not ideal for Wabash here. 

5:37 - Maloney picks up his fourth foul on Wickliffe.  Cooper takes what I'm guessing will be his final breather of the day.  The foul shots are good for Wickliffe and Wabash leads 62-58.  Wooster quickly converts after a steal.  62-60 now with 4:53 to go.  Timeout Wabash.  In a word....nailbiter. 

3:23 - Rooks just took a pair of bad shots for Wabash.  Cooper is checking back in.  Wooster ball...we're still at 62-60.

2:59 - Bidwell scores in the lane to tie the game.  Timeout Wabash.  Wooster still has a foul to give here. 

2:35 - Fulk gets a pair of free throws and Wooster has their first lead in a long time.  64-62 Scots.  Time for the seniors to step up.  Zimmer and Simkus have had great games...they'll need to finish it here. 

1:28 - Wabash ends up with the ball after a mad scramble at midcourt.  Zimmer draws a foul and will shoot one and one.  They're good. 66-65 Scots.

0:58 - Fulk buries a triple from the corner.  69-65.  Wasn't it Fulk that buried the killer three-pointer here last year?  69-65 Scots.

:45 - Zimmer answers with a driving basket.  69-67 Scots.

0:11 - Alright, Johnson drove the lane, missed his layup but the collapsing D left nobody on Wickliffe who had an easy rebound and putback.  71-67 Scots.  Haltom went up the floor in a hurry, fed the ball to Simkus who nailed a triple.  71-70.  Immediate timeout for Wabash.  Obviously Wabash will be fouling here out of the timeout.

0:09 - Quick foul on Fulk.  The first shot is no good.  Chadwick is going crazy.  Second shot is good.  72-70. Wabash calls timeout after getting the ball to half court.  They'll have 6.9 seconds to tie this beast up.  What a game. 

0:00 - That was anticlimactic....Wabash inbounds to Haltom who pump fakes a three and dishes to Zimmer.  Zimmer has the ball knocked away, recovers and drives about two steps before being stripped again and Wabash doesn't get a shot off.  What a disappointing way to end such a great game.  72-70 Scots win.   :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 12, 2008, 03:55:34 PM
That was a great game.  Wow.  72-70 Wooster wins.

+K for you with the running updates, Wally.  That was an incredible effort by both teams- what a shooting performance by Wabash.  Too many turnovers, though.

The Scots survive, somehow.  Fulk's missed FT right at the end was his first miss since his sophomore season at Wooster, broke a streak of 41 straight, I believe.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerLady on January 12, 2008, 03:57:13 PM
Does anyone happen to know the score of the Witt/Allegheny game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 12, 2008, 03:58:31 PM
Quote from: TigerLady on January 12, 2008, 03:57:13 PM
Does anyone happen to know the score of the Witt/Allegheny game?

Live stats available here: Live Stats (http://www.allegheny.edu/athletics/menbb/live/xlive.htm)

And Live Video here. (http://ustream.tv/channel/allegheny-college-athletics)  Unfortunately, no broadcast on the video stream.

41-25 Wittenberg leads, about 14 minutes to go, second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 12, 2008, 04:10:29 PM
Having a long stretch late in the 2nd half without hitting an FG will kill just about any team. I think it was almost 5 minutes the LGs went between hoops. Only points at the stripe.

sigh........ :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 12, 2008, 04:36:48 PM
Wittenberg 72, Allegheny 55, Final.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 12, 2008, 05:01:54 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 12, 2008, 04:10:29 PM
Having a long stretch late in the 2nd half without hitting an FG will kill just about any team. I think it was almost 5 minutes the LGs went between hoops. Only points at the stripe.

sigh........ :-[
You're absolutely right.  I mentioned earlier, a key for Wabash to win this game was they had to prevent any significant Wooster runs.  And they had done that up to the 10 minute mark of the 2nd half where the LG's enjoyed their biggest lead at 58-47.  Over the next 7+ minutes of the game, however, Wooster outscored Wabash 17-2 to turn an 11 point deficit into a 2 point lead and that was basically ballgame.

Quote from: wally_wabash on January 12, 2008, 03:01:13 PM

0:58 - Fulk buries a triple from the corner.  69-65.  Wasn't it Fulk that buried the killer three-pointer here last year?  69-65 Scots.

It was actually Bidwell.  Wooster's radio guy, Mike Breckenridge mentioned this play on his pregame show.  Bidwell hit a trey and was fouled to complete a 4 point lead and turned a 63-61 deficit into a 65-63 lead and an eventual 68-65 Wooster win.

With Wooster's win at Chadwick today, the Scots improve to 20-1 overall vs. the LG's since they joined the NCAC and also to 11-0 at Chadwick.

Lastly, things should be status quo next weekend in Springfield.  Witt won easily today in Meadville to remain unbeaten in the NCAC.  Both Witt and Wooster have what should be mid-week scrimmages at The EC and at Hiram respectively and should set up yet another showdown for sole possession of 1st place between these rivals.  With that said, Wooster's record in the NCAC is faaaaar more impressive than that of Wittenberg's to date.  Of Wooster's 4 conference wins, 2 are impressive road wins over OWU and Wabash.  Compare that to Wittenberg with 3 of their 4 wins over the bottom 3 of the conference vs. Hiram, Oberlin and Denison.  I'm still expecting this game to be another classic.  After all, as is the case in most rivalries, you throw the records out the window.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2008, 05:04:00 PM
Final from Gambier:
Kenyon 71
Earlham 51
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 12, 2008, 05:23:18 PM
Just too many turnovers today.  Other than take better care of the ball, I don't know what else Wabash could have done to win today.  Wabash took away Wooster's three point shot completely.  Cooper was frustrated.  Wabash shot a very high percentage on 3 point FGs.  But those 21 turnovers.....just can't do that against teams of Wooster's caliber. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 12, 2008, 05:31:58 PM
I agree, Wally. Turnovers was basically the only statistical category where there was a decided advantage for Wooster today.  The LGs really played well enough to deserve to win; second straight year with a really tough outcome for Wabash at home.

Looking ahead, Wooster has to feel happy about escaping both Crawfordsville and Delaware with a 2-0 record.  I suspect that no one else in the NCAC will do that.  If Wooster follows with a win next Saturday at Wittenberg, that 3-0 record on the road at the other top conference opponents will put Woo firmly in the drivers seat of this conference chase for another year.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2008, 05:56:11 PM
Ohio Wesleyan nips Hiram, 91-53, and the DoggieDome.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 12, 2008, 06:26:36 PM
It seems as if the game plans of both coaches, though textbook, failed somewhat.  Wabash, although successful at shutting down Wooster from the perimeter, had to give up something, and that was Wickliffe's inside game and penetration by Johnson and Bidwell.  On the other end, the Scots knew they had to help inside against the Little Giants size, and probably figured they wouldn't get hurt too much by threes.  Wrong, especially in the first half, as long shots were being dropped by all takers.  Still, I'll bet there are no major philosophical changes when these teams meet again in Wooster.

The Scots are still pretty limited to six guys.  After Fulk off the bench, Melick played only 5 minutes, Elam 6, and Geitgey 11.  At this point, I don't know where any help is going to come from, I think this is the way it's going to be.

Obviously, this is one that Wabash nearly had, a very tough game as we probably all thought it would be.  Wooster's record against Wabash is very one-sided, but there's been some luck involved in coming out on top so often in Indiana.  Honestly, I don't expect that to continue in the future, as the Scots will once again be losing three key players to graduation: Cooper, Will, and Fulk.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 13, 2008, 08:09:37 AM
good win for Wooster yesterday-anytime you come out of Wabash unscathed is impressive. Wittenberg held serve as well with their win at Allegheny. Barring some miraculous upset we will see yet another showdown next Saturday-it will be the first matchup between the two in the  Pam Evans Smith Arena btw. I will have some more notes later on, but I hadn't posted in a while so thought that I would just keep in touch.

A side note everyone may find interesting--my brother's high school basketball coach is James Cooper's old high school coach from his freshman and sophomore years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 14, 2008, 02:58:32 PM
For the second time this season, NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) accolades go to Ohio Wesleyan's Dustin Rudegeair.  Dustin had a monster game at Kenyon with 21 points and 9 boards, and then topped it at the Puppy Palace with a 23-and-11 effort, as OWU stayed one game back (loss column) of co-leaders Witt and Woo.  Congratulations, Dustin!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 14, 2008, 03:10:59 PM
Must-See TV:

Wednesday's Kenyon/Denison clash will be  (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/men_s_basketball_wednesday_s_d.html)televised (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26154.xml) to Columbus-area viewers, on a tape-delay basis, on the Columbus Sports Network (http://www.columbussports.net/), first on Wednesday at 10:30 pm, replayed Thursday at 9:30 am and 8:00 pm.   CSN can be found over the air on ch. 32, on Time Warner Cable on channels 78 and 524, and on WOW!, which I gather is another cable provider, on ch. 97.  The same network will televise the Kenyon/Denison women's game next Weds. (1/23) as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 14, 2008, 04:08:25 PM
so us who actually have the channel can see first hand how terrible Denison is  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 14, 2008, 07:04:50 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 12, 2008, 06:26:36 PM

The Scots are still pretty limited to six guys.  After Fulk off the bench, Melick played only 5 minutes, Elam 6, and Geitgey 11.  At this point, I don't know where any help is going to come from, I think this is the way it's going to be.


I think an interesting comparison of this years team could be made to the 03-04 squad in terms of support off the bench. In the 03-04 season Coach Moore basically used a 9-man rotation, Ryan (Jimmy) Snyder, PJ McCloud, Ryan Ridder, and Jeff Stevens.  This year the primary players off the bench are Fulk, Geitgey, Melick, and either (Elam or Reed). If I were to do a man to man comparison:

Snyder vs. Fulk - both were the first off the bench and were/are used for instant offense. Give the nod to to Fulk.

Geitgey vs. Ridder - Ridder got a lot of minutes early in the season but scored less than 1 point a game. Geitgey can handle the ball and is very effective from 3-point land. Give the nod to Geitgey.

PJ McCloud vs. Melick - PJ was a senior in '03-'04 and was a good defensive player. Nod to McCloud.

Stevens to (Elam or Reed) - This is the toughest comparison because of the limited minutes. Stevens and Elam are the most alike.  I think Elam has much more upside than Stevens had but at the moment this is a draw.

The point of all this is that I think the bench situation is very similar if not more favorable for the 07-08 squad and yet the 03-04 got to the elite eight. In '04 Coach Moore shortened his bench rotation as the season wrapped up and pretty much used the upperclassmen in the tournament.

What I like from the Wabash game came from the post game interview with coach Moore. Mike B asked what he said to the team with 10 minutes to go. Coach Moore said he challenged the team to win with defense. That is obviously what happened and I like to believe that this team has found their identity which separate then from last season's team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 14, 2008, 07:11:31 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 14, 2008, 03:10:59 PM
Must-See TV:

Wednesday's Kenyon/Denison clash will be  (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/men_s_basketball_wednesday_s_d.html)televised (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26154.xml) to Columbus-area viewers, on a tape-delay basis, on the Columbus Sports Network (http://www.columbussports.net/), first on Wednesday at 10:30 pm, replayed Thursday at 9:30 am and 8:00 pm.   CSN can be found over the air on ch. 32, on Time Warner Cable on channels 78 and 524, and on WOW!, which I gather is another cable provider, on ch. 97.  The same network will televise the Kenyon/Denison women's game next Weds. (1/23) as well.

Hey, aren't we in favor of showing D-3 in a POSITIVE light?  :D

Well, Kenyon's a nifty team. And at least they didn't show Alma vs. Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 14, 2008, 07:19:53 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 14, 2008, 07:11:31 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 14, 2008, 03:10:59 PM
Must-See TV:

Wednesday's Kenyon/Denison clash will be  (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/men_s_basketball_wednesday_s_d.html)televised (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26154.xml) to Columbus-area viewers, on a tape-delay basis, on the Columbus Sports Network (http://www.columbussports.net/), first on Wednesday at 10:30 pm, replayed Thursday at 9:30 am and 8:00 pm.   CSN can be found over the air on ch. 32, on Time Warner Cable on channels 78 and 524, and on WOW!, which I gather is another cable provider, on ch. 97.  The same network will televise the Kenyon/Denison women's game next Weds. (1/23) as well.

Hey, aren't we in favor of showing D-3 in a POSITIVE light?  :D

Well, Kenyon's a nifty team. And at least they didn't show Alma vs. Oberlin.

I could of course give the argument that Denison and Kenyon represent much of the best that D3 can be, regardless of wins or losses, but I won't.  ;)

What I will point out is that the Denison/Kenyon women's game, to be televised Jan. 23, should be a helluva game.

And in any case it should be better TV than that awful Grinnell game on ESPN a few years back... ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 14, 2008, 07:28:31 PM
That game was truly awful..........
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 14, 2008, 07:32:52 PM
And to add another thought - am I correct in remembering that the Wooster-Witt 3OT classic followed that televised Grinnell game a week later, only to point out what ESPN should have televised...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 14, 2008, 09:22:17 PM
The reason the Grinnell game was bad was that the TV timeouts ruined the Grinnell mojo, IMHO. It's hard to showcase chaos and anarchy when you have structured stoppages.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 14, 2008, 09:30:54 PM
Anyone have any knowledge of the ticket situation at Wittenberg on Saturday?

If I arrive in Springfield in the afternoon, will I be able to purchase tickets then, and in the "Wooster allotment?" Or is that whole section of seating sent to Wooster and sold there in advance of the game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 14, 2008, 10:16:44 PM
you should be able to purchase tickets. i received an email on the "student" ticket purchasing information. once again all tickets are going to be reserved, so even if students want to attend they have set times throughout the week for us to pick up our tickets. an interesting subplot is that it is "bid night" for the fraternities and sororities on campus, so i am not sure what this will impact concerning the student attendance at the games. anyways....this helps in no way i'm sure as i have no idea what the "public" ticket situation is
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 14, 2008, 10:34:05 PM
Quote from: Bonnie Hughes--College of WoosterLIMITED NUMBER OF TICKETS AVAILABLE FOR WOOSTER-WITT MEN'S BASKETBALL GAME
THIS SATURDAY
We will have a limited number of tickets for the January 19 men's
basketball game at Wittenberg available for advance sale. We hope to
receive the tickets by Monday, and will sell Tues/Wed/Thurs. Sale hours
will be determined sometime today. We hope to sell for an hour or so around
the lunch hour, and again later in the day.
Check at Armington PEC if you're in the Wooster area.

Pam Evans Smith Arena is huge.  I'll be flabbergasted if it sells out for this game.  With all tickets reserved, I couldn't guess where walk-up seats will be located, though.

There's (sure to be) a JV game before the varsity, but no women's game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 15, 2008, 03:56:15 PM
For the second straight NCAC gameday, it would appear that the conference's featured game will be at Chadwick Court.  Tomorrow's game is big for both teams...OWU needs to keep pace, Wabash needs to avoid falling under .500. 

We'll see how well Wabash responds after Saturday's tough loss.  I think the LGs will be playing some urgency. OWU comes in having had a bit of an easy run...the Bishops haven't played particularly challenging basketball in over a month.  It should be another good game in C'ville tomorrow night. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 16, 2008, 07:14:25 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 14, 2008, 07:19:53 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 14, 2008, 07:11:31 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 14, 2008, 03:10:59 PM
Must-See TV:

Wednesday's Kenyon/Denison clash will be  (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/men_s_basketball_wednesday_s_d.html)televised (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26154.xml) to Columbus-area viewers, on a tape-delay basis, on the Columbus Sports Network (http://www.columbussports.net/), first on Wednesday at 10:30 pm, replayed Thursday at 9:30 am and 8:00 pm.   CSN can be found over the air on ch. 32, on Time Warner Cable on channels 78 and 524, and on WOW!, which I gather is another cable provider, on ch. 97.  The same network will televise the Kenyon/Denison women's game next Weds. (1/23) as well.

Hey, aren't we in favor of showing D-3 in a POSITIVE light?  :D

Well, Kenyon's a nifty team. And at least they didn't show Alma vs. Oberlin.

I could of course give the argument that Denison and Kenyon represent much of the best that D3 can be, regardless of wins or losses, but I won't.  ;)

Perhaps they can televise the Denison women's tennis team playing the Kenyon men's swimming team. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 16, 2008, 11:29:09 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 16, 2008, 10:03:18 AM
Kenyon at Allegheny - Yet another tough one IMO.  A healthy 'Gheny should beat Kenyon at home.  Kenyon seems to be getting healthier as well, however...  I wish we had some injury updates on these 2 MASH units.
(from the pick'ems page)

I can give you an update on Kenyon. 

All I know about 'Gheny is that Bill Babe did play against Wittenberg, albeit only for 3 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 16, 2008, 11:39:10 AM
Thanks DC.  I think I'll stick with my pick. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 16, 2008, 12:13:15 PM
I think the Lords may have their hands full given the national TV audience. When those lights come on the Big Red will bring it!!   
Truthfully, I think the O-fer ends against Hiram on Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 16, 2008, 04:51:48 PM
I posted this on the Great Lakes board-maybe some discussion will ensue.....

A point from the Wittenberg perspective-although Wittenberg's only chance of making the tournament is to successfully win the NCAC Tournament, they are a huge factor in the races. If they can successfully win a few games (i.e. win against Wooster) and improve their record-the wins by Capital, ONU, Transy, will only look even better in the long run and help improve their regional ratings.

If Witt can successfully beat Wooster 1-2 times this year i belive with their continual improvement over the course of the year they will be major players in the season-some tough games to come in the next few weeks!

Anyways-Witt by 21 tonight at Earlham
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 16, 2008, 07:29:33 PM
We're approaching tipoff here at Chadwick...that means running commentary from yours truly.   :)

Wabash is the traditional home whites with red lettering and red trim.  OWU is sporting the road black unis tonight with white numbers and red trim. 

Jesse Jean is a big cat...and we're underway. 

19:20 - Gary Simkus opens the scoring with some nice post work.  2-0 Wabash.

Ummm....somebody forgot to alert the student body that there was a hoops game tonight.  Unfortunate.

15:32 - Solid work for Wabash's first unit here early.  Wes Smith just earned some free throws.  Wabash is really controlling the glass in teh first five minutes here.  Smith's shots are good adn Wabash leads 10-4...good buddy. 

14:14 - Casey Teeters managed to squeeze off a three pointer over Earl Rooks.  OWU follows that up with a traditional three point play.  Just like that we're tied at 10-10.

10:20 - Nice little dump off for Jean here earns Rozak an easy two pointts for the Bishops.  A steal and fast break gets Jean an easy layup.  Bishops take their first lead of the game, 16-14. 

7:50 - Rudegair finally gets on the board for OWU.  Bishops lead 20-17 here as we go to a timeout.  I think Wes may have hurt his hip a little when he was fouled earlier in the game...he's favoring his right side a little bit.  Wabash has gotten a little sluggish here in the last handful of minutes.  Hopefully the timeout wakes them up. 

4:19 - Halftime can't come soon enough here.  Wabash is really playing a half step slower than OWU tonight.  Fortunately, OWU isn't shooting very well adn holds a slim 23-21 lead. 

2:04 - Ah, there's a three for Chase Haltom.  Wabash regains the lead 26-25.  Jean travels...Wabash will have a chance to extend the lead. 

0:29 - the officials are determined to get somebody into the bonus here in the first half.  Brock just picked up his first, team sixth on what looked pretty innocent to me. 

0:00 - Desperation heave from Chase Haltom finds the atmosphere and we go to the break with the score 28-26 to OWU's advantage.  Wabash will need to find another gear if they're going to win here tonight....the LGs are playing at about 80% of what they did on Saturday vs. Wooster. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 16, 2008, 08:23:14 PM
Alright, we're almost ready for half two.  Wabash was led by Aaron Brock's 6 points in the first half.  Zimmer was 0-5 and didn't score although he did chip in with a team high 4 rebounds. 

OWU was lead by Jesse Jean's 9 points (on 4-10 shooting...wow, 10 shots in the first half!).  Rudegair didn't get much...2 points, just two FG attempts and he picked up two fouls.  I believe Wabash will start with the ball at midcourt.  Here we go...

20:00 - Early second half development...Wes has shed the headband. 

19:00 - The second half starts as the first did...with a Simkus bucket in the post.  28-28.  Argh...OWU quickly scores in transition.  30-28 Biships. 

17:59 - Brock scores to even things up at 30-30. 

16:15 - Lot of bodies on the floor here in the last minute.  Simkus nailed a three to give Wabash a 33-32 lead.  Zimmer is really struggling for Wabash tonight.  I will say that Wabash has picked it up here early in the second half.  Cafarella hits a triple for the Bishops.  We're tied at 35-35 now.  Timeout Wabash. 

13:46 - Zimmer is finally on the board with a hookshot.  This followed a Jesse Jean three point play.  38-37 Bishops. 

12:14 - Wabash goes up 40-38 on an Evan Arnold triple.  Kyle Miller has the answer.  41-40 OWU.  It's fast and furious here.  Zimmer scores in the lane.  42-41.  My point here was that the team foul situation is Wabash 5, OWU 1.  Wabash is going to have to win this game with field goals because there won't be many foul shots coming their way. 

9:45 - Zimmer is awake now.  Andrew scored again on a blow by Rudegair.  44-41 Wabash.  Zimmer is going to get a breather here. 

6:57 - Zimmer checks back in.  Jean is shooting free throws and he gets one out of two.  48-47 Wabash.  This is going to be a great finish.  Wes Smith just drained a big three pointer.  51-47 the Bash.

3:55 - Rudegair goes over Zimmer's back adn picks up his fourth foul.  It's been a frustrating night for Dustin.  We're at 53-50 right now with Aaron Brock headed to line for some free throws for Wabash.  Brock makes his shots.  55-50 Wabash with 3:22 to go. 

2:35 - This was sweet.  On the fast break, Brock floats a pass over the rim for Zimmer who jumped and put it back off the glass.  And he was fouled.  Free throw is good and Wabash goes up 60-50.  Of course, before I can save the post, OWU nails a three pointer and the shooter was fouled.  We'll have a Wabash timeout here.  60-53 Wabash with a free throw pending. 

Holliday missed his free throw.  The score remains 60-53.  Simkus gets called for charging.  Wabash is not doing well to protect the lead here. 

1:06 - Casey Teeters gives the foul on Chase Haltom who will shoot one and the bonus.  His shots are good.  62-53 Wabash. 

0:42 - I'm not sure why Wabash insists on doing this.  Two straight turnovers have turned into 5 quick OWU points and the score is 62-58.  This one should be on ice by now.  OWU's full court press forces a Wabash timeout now. 

0:31 - 10 second violation.  Le sigh.  OWU has the ball. 

0:20 - Brock just made the play of the game by swatting away a Rudegair shot near the rim.  The loose ball is controlled by Wabash, OWU can't set up the press and has to give the foul.  Haltom makes his free throws and Wabash goes up 64-58.  Wabash allows OWU pretty easy access to the rim.  64-60.  Wes Smith is fouled immediately on the inbound. 

Wes makes one out of two.  65-60.  Traveling is apparantly not a point of emphasis for officials tonight...OWU's player (didn't catch the number) walked his way all the way to the basket and scored the layup.  65-62 with 4.4 seconds left.  Timeout OWU.

Zimmer is fouled upon receiving the inbound...and that'll be five fouls for Rudegair.  Zimmer makes his first free throw and this one is doneski.   The second shot is also good.  67-62 Wabash.

And that's the final.  Wabash 67, OWU 62.  Gritty game for Wabash tonight in a really important game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 16, 2008, 09:43:11 PM
NCAC Scores from tonight:

Wabash 67, OWU 62
Wooster 117, Hiram 87
Allgheny 76, Oberlin 61
Kenyon 60, Denison 47
Wittenberg 59, Earlham 49
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 16, 2008, 10:11:40 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on January 16, 2008, 09:43:11 PM
NCAC Scores from tonight:

Wabash 67, OWU 62
Wooster 117, Hiram 87
Allgheny 76, Oberlin 61
Kenyon 60, Denison 47
Wittenberg 59, Earlham 49

Pretty much right to form there, huh.  Big win for the LGs- they have to be happy about that one.  Other than that, only the somewhat smaller than expected margin of victory by Wittenberg stands out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 17, 2008, 01:12:20 AM
JT Knight is back in the lineup; his problem was illness, not injury. 


Is this the same JT Knight from Ann Arbor Pioneer HS, if so I saw him last spring in the Michigan Class A championship game.  I thought he was a good looking D3 prospect.  I believe he and a teamate looked at Hope.  His teamate went to Carnegie-Mellon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 17, 2008, 02:12:08 AM
Quote from: sac on January 17, 2008, 01:12:20 AM
JT Knight is back in the lineup; his problem was illness, not injury. 


Is this the same JT Knight from Ann Arbor Pioneer HS, if so I saw him last spring in the Michigan Class A championship game.  I thought he was a good looking D3 prospect.  I believe he and a teamate looked at Hope.  His teamate went to Carnegie-Mellon.


Yes, it is.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2008, 11:24:08 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 17, 2008, 02:12:08 AM
Quote from: sac on January 17, 2008, 01:12:20 AM
JT Knight is back in the lineup; his problem was illness, not injury. 


Is this the same JT Knight from Ann Arbor Pioneer HS, if so I saw him last spring in the Michigan Class A championship game.  I thought he was a good looking D3 prospect.  I believe he and a teamate looked at Hope.  His teamate went to Carnegie-Mellon.


Yes, it is.

...and he is indeed a good-looking D3 prospect.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 17, 2008, 11:35:08 AM
For those (like me) who are generally unfamiliar with Springfield and it's eating options- can anyone recommend a few dinner spots for 5 college/grad school/recent graduates, all of whom are interested in good food without having to break the wallet?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2008, 11:38:10 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 17, 2008, 11:35:08 AM
For those (like me) who are generally unfamiliar with Springfield and it's eating options- can anyone recommend a few dinner spots for 5 college/grad school/recent graduates, all of whom are interested in good food without having to break the wallet?

Dayton.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 17, 2008, 11:39:50 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 17, 2008, 11:38:10 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 17, 2008, 11:35:08 AM
For those (like me) who are generally unfamiliar with Springfield and it's eating options- can anyone recommend a few dinner spots for 5 college/grad school/recent graduates, all of whom are interested in good food without having to break the wallet?

Dayton.  ;D

I was going to say Columbus.  We're on the same page.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 17, 2008, 11:46:37 AM
Apparemtly the bright lights of Hollywood were too much for the Big Red.

I am just curious if anyone was at this game?  60-47 isn't exactly lighting it up on both sides.

Another question I have for anyone having witnessed the Big Red in action......where is everyone?

What happened to McMahon, Koecheler, Ward, Glover, Tichenor?  Did they all give it up?  The only one on the roster with significant playing time last year is Gognat and he hasn't played a single minute.  I thought I read where he is hurt.  

Every team on the D-III level loses people.  When you are not paid to play you really WANT to play the game at this level.  But it seems that from last year to this that is a whole lot of guys did not return.  On top of losing seniors Izzo and Hodgkinson.  You put that group as a whole and you basically have last years entire team outside of Luther and Sullivan.  

That to me is a recipe for disaster and I guess 0 for 14 proves my point.

I now have my doubts about Saturday but I still think they will get the W against Hiram.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2008, 12:37:15 PM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on January 17, 2008, 11:46:37 AM
I am just curious if anyone was at this game? 

I'm sure someone was... ;D  But among those likely to post in here, I'm probably the only one that ever sees either of these teams in Granville or Gambier (plenty of lurkers, though).  And I was not there; I was down the road in New Concord.

Quote from: BigRedGrad on January 17, 2008, 11:46:37 AMAnother question I have for anyone having witnessed the Big Red in action......where is everyone?

What happened to McMahon, Koecheler, Ward, Glover, Tichenor?  Did they all give it up?  The only one on the roster with significant playing time last year is Gognat and he hasn't played a single minute. 

Yes, well, that's the $64 question, isn't it?  The attrition isn't quite that bad, as you seem to realize by your later comments.  Pat Sullivan, Chris Luther, Chris Eberst, and Brian Elder were key contributors last year and are the team's leaders this year.  Why the others are not playing (and, quite frankly, how much they are missed, at least in the case of some) is a question for which I don't have an answer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2008, 12:53:07 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 17, 2008, 11:35:08 AM
For those (like me) who are generally unfamiliar with Springfield and it's eating options- can anyone recommend a few dinner spots for 5 college/grad school/recent graduates, all of whom are interested in good food without having to break the wallet?

Courtesy of my good friends (well, friend) in Springfield, I can direct you to a listing of area restaurants:
http://www4.wittenberg.edu/springfield/restaurants/index.html
I think the place I ate last year, with three other posters, was Mike & Rosy's Deli, although I could be mistaken.  Wherever it was, it was very close to Pam Evans Smith Arena, and quite pleasant. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 17, 2008, 01:13:05 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 17, 2008, 10:05:06 AM

SF,

Yeah, the fact that they have the three wins on the road is very impressive.  The same type of impressive that Wooster will be going for if it can pull off a win at Wittenberg this weekend (though that would only give Woo a 1 game NCAC lead.)


KB,

I thought I'd respond to this over here on the NCAC board since it is NCAC related and not OAC related.

I feel that, should Wooster win in Springfield, they would be in a pretty comfortable position in the NCAC even though, in essence, it would only be a one game lead.  Wittenberg, while they are tied at the top of the standings with Wooster, has done it by feasting on the bottom half of the NCAC.  And Witt is doing it less than impressively including last night's closer than expected tilt with The EC.  And Witt's schedule only gets tougher after their date with Wooster as they travel to OWU the following Wednesday and then they travel to Wabash a week from that.  So, I guess we'll find out just how far Wittenberg has come in the next week and a half.

If Witt can find a way to beat Wooster on Saturday, I might buy into their turnaround a little more.  Not only would it give the Tigers a signature win, but amazingly, it would put them alone in 1st place in the NCAC! :o  As for now, I'm having trouble overlooking the fact that the average wins of the teams they have beaten over their 8 game win streak is a tad under 4.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 17, 2008, 02:22:27 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 17, 2008, 01:13:05 PM
So, I guess we'll find out just how far Wittenberg has come in the next week and a half.

If Witt can find a way to beat Wooster on Saturday, I might buy into their turnaround a little more.  Not only would it give the Tigers a signature win, but amazingly, it would put them alone in 1st place in the NCAC! :o  As for now, I'm having trouble overlooking the fact that the average wins of the teams they have beaten over their 8 game win streak is a tad under 4.

Added the emphasis, because I hadn't realized the size of the difference.

Overall record of Wooster's last 10 opponents:   72-76 (.486)
Overall record of Wittenberg's last 8 opponents: 31-82 (.274)

Wittenberg's win over Allegheny is its only win over an above .500 team this season.  Wooster counters that with wins over above .500 teams Farmingdale St., St. Thomas, Ohio Wesleyan, Walsh, Wesley and Wabash, and St. Mary's is at .500 currently.

Again, on paper, this looks like a game where Wooster should win...but I know better than to bet on the "on paper" analysis in this rivalry.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 17, 2008, 02:26:46 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 17, 2008, 11:39:50 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 17, 2008, 11:38:10 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 17, 2008, 11:35:08 AM
For those (like me) who are generally unfamiliar with Springfield and it's eating options- can anyone recommend a few dinner spots for 5 college/grad school/recent graduates, all of whom are interested in good food without having to break the wallet?

Dayton.  ;D

I was going to say Columbus.  We're on the same page.   :)

See?  Now if I'd come out with a remark like that I'd have been buried so deep in negative karma I'd have to climb for weeks just to reach Spence.

Personally, had I commented, I would have said San Francisco or New York City, but that's just me. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 17, 2008, 02:44:41 PM
Thanks DC...........
I must admit you do get around.

I have to think that when you are 0-14 everyone is pointing fingers at everyone.

As I said earlier, I think the coaches and players have done a terrific job keeping their heads up.  It certainly can not be easy for any of them.

There is still that #1 pick waitng for them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2008, 03:35:16 PM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on January 17, 2008, 02:44:41 PM
Thanks DC...........
I must admit you do get around.

I have to think that when you are 0-14 everyone is pointing fingers at everyone.

As I said earlier, I think the coaches and players have done a terrific job keeping their heads up.  It certainly can not be easy for any of them.

There is still that #1 pick waitng for them.

Yes, there's definitely no quit in the Big Red.  And there's signs of hope.  This was never going to be a high-scoring team, even if everyone came back.  Their only hope for success was always going to be defense and rebounding.  Last night, they outrebounded Kenyon (one of the top rebounding teams in the NCAC) 35-25, and was nearly even with them on their own glass (16 def. reb. for KC, vs. 14 off. reb. for DU).  They also shut down KC's Bryan Yelvington for most of the game; Bryan ended up with 10 points (but 6 in the last 5 minutes) and just 3 rebounds, both well under his season averages.  Judging by the box score, the Big Red lost the game because a) they shot poorly (37.5%), b) they had trouble handling the ball (21 turnovers, 13 of which were KC steals), and c) they had no answer for Dave Knapke (18 pts., 12 boards).

I get around a little, but Gambier is just 45 minutes from my home, and Granville less than 1:15, so these are easy drives.  I'm heading back to Granville Saturday, when I expect to see two DU victories. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 17, 2008, 03:42:14 PM
DC,
Take good notes I will wait your report!!  It will be a double win for both Big Red Teams.
Thanks
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on January 17, 2008, 04:45:46 PM
Springfield fine dining = Mike and Rosy's.

That is all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 17, 2008, 09:51:13 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 17, 2008, 02:22:27 PM

Overall record of Wooster's last 10 opponents:   72-76 (.486)
Overall record of Wittenberg's last 8 opponents: 31-82 (.274)

Wittenberg's win over Allegheny is its only win over an above .500 team this season.  Wooster counters that with wins over above .500 teams Farmingdale St., St. Thomas, Ohio Wesleyan, Walsh, Wesley and Wabash, and St. Mary's is at .500 currently.

KB - nice analysis (k+) on the statistical comparison of opponents vs. Witt.  :)

IMO, Wooster's two best "W's" this year are Walsh and St. Thomas.  ;D

Walsh is now 14-2 and ranked #2 nationally in NAIA-2

St. Thomas is now 11-3, first place in the MIAC and they were ranked #23 in the D3Hoops poll last week before falling to #32 this week due to their 3rd loss.

Farmingdale is now 9-4 and tied for first in the Skyline which is a weaker conference.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2008, 09:56:20 PM
Welcome back, wsf!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 17, 2008, 09:57:12 PM
Through yesterday's games, Wooster is the best overall rebounding team in the NCAC, thanks to their ability to clear their own defensive board.  They have an overall rebounding percentage of .550, followed by Witt's .533.  The best offensive rebounding team in the league is Kenyon, who grab .372 of their available offensive rebounds.  Wabash is second in that category at .361.  See the following chart that I put together:

http://arkski.com/~jwood/ncacrebounding.htm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 17, 2008, 10:38:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 17, 2008, 09:56:20 PM
Welcome back, wsf!

Thanks DC.  My posting time is sometimes limited by chasing a 2 year old and a 5 year old! :)  I will catch the radio broadcast on Saturday night! ;D  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 17, 2008, 11:26:19 PM
well there's a fine cracker barrel-where i may have to reside saturday night unless i "cough cough" am sick----

one thing i found interesting-earlham was able to beat lake erie college earlier this year but wooster could not???? hmmmmm i know don't play the well they beat so and so card

should be another chapter to the never ending excitement of a book
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2008, 09:50:57 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 17, 2008, 11:26:19 PM

one thing i found interesting-earlham was able to beat lake erie college earlier this year but wooster could not???? hmmmmm i know don't play the well they beat so and so card


Since you wanted to play that game, do you want to talk about Benedictine??? ;) ;D

Sorry, but I couldn't resist... 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 18, 2008, 10:52:48 PM
Well, kinda a boring Friday night for me, and I simply keep thinking of the game, so I thought I'd do some more pre-game analysis:

Wittenberg counts on the offensive production of three players: Gregg Hill (18.1 ppg), Brendan Barabino (11.1 ppg) and Kevin Murray (10.6 ppg). Combined, that trio typically provides about 57% of Wittenberg's average of 68 ppg- and below them, points are spread out thinly among several players, with no one else averaging even 6 points per contest.

Barabino and Murray have both increased production nicely for Witt this season. Barabino has doubled his scoring average right along with doubling his minutes, and also leads Witt with 7.4 rebounds per contest. Murray has nearly tripled his scoring while only doubling his minutes, so he is making a much larger scoring impact for Witt this season.

Wooster counters with an offensive barrage consisting of five players averaging 10 ppg or better: James Cooper (20.5 ppg), Devin Fulk (12.3), Bryan Wickliffe (11.9), Brandon Johnson (11.9) and Marty Bidwell (10.4). Evan Will contributes 8.4 points per contest.  Wooster averages 87 points per game.

For Wooster, the clear "most improved player" this season is Bryan Wickliffe, who seems to turn into a newer, better version of himself every game, and has become a legitimate inside scoring threat. He has averaged 15.8 ppg over his past 6 contests.

Defensively, each team tends to outrebound its opponents: Witt by a +4.9 margin; Wooster by +7.3, and hold their opponents to virtually equal shooting percentages: 40% to 43%, respectively.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2008, 11:01:43 PM
I think we should all get together on this now, before it gets out of hand:
The fellow's name is Bryan Wickliffe.
Just like Bryan Nelson...I hope!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2008, 11:04:22 PM
Springfield News-Sun profile on James Cooper:

Wooster's Cooper Having a Career Year (http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/s/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2008/01/17/sns011808spcooper.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 18, 2008, 11:11:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2008, 11:01:43 PM
I think we should all get together on this now, before it gets out of hand:
The fellow's name is Bryan Wickliffe.
Just like Bryan Nelson...I hope!  ;D

.......or kiltedbryan ;) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 18, 2008, 11:22:12 PM
Now a follow-up post:

Keys to the game:

1) As usual: Who controls the tempo? With last year's 68-65 Wooster's victory in Springfield as the only exception, the past 16 Wooster-Wittenberg winners can be determined by asking one very simple question: "Did either side score 80 points?" If "No" is the answer, Wittenberg wins (10-0 in such games). If yes, then award Wooster the victory (5-0 in games where they score 80 or more). Other than last year, Wooster hasn't beaten Wittenberg without scoring 80 or more points since the '00-'01 season.

2) Who out-rebounds whom? Rebounding margin is a strength for each team...who wins this battle has a leg up on winning the game.

3) Turnovers.  A weakness in Wooster that Wittenberg should try to exploit. Wooster averages almost 15 a game compared to 11 for Wittenberg, though Wooster tends to cause slightly more steals (7.5 a game vs. 6.2 for Witt).  But Wooster has been careless, including 20 turnovers during the Lake Erie loss.

4) Outside shooting.  Can Wooster turn this into the advantage it looks like on paper?
Wooster has Fulk and Cooper at better than 50%, Geitgey at 50%, and Johnson and Bidwell above 40% from behind the arc and they average 9 makes per game at a team 46%.
Wittenberg has no one above 40% and only Hill and Murray seem to be threats. Witt makes 6 per game, and shoots fewer threes, but only averages 32% as a team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 18, 2008, 11:24:20 PM
Quote from: sac on January 18, 2008, 11:11:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2008, 11:01:43 PM
I think we should all get together on this now, before it gets out of hand:
The fellow's name is Bryan Wickliffe.
Just like Bryan Nelson...I hope!  ;D

.......or kiltedbryan ;) :D

I really can't believe I missed that!  I went back and modified the post to fix it, because it drives me up a wall personally when people assume that my name is spelled with an 'i" in the middle.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2008, 12:14:54 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 18, 2008, 10:52:48 PM
Well, kinda a boring Friday night for me, and I simply keep thinking of the game, so I thought I'd do some more pre-game analysis:

Well, I'm just sitting hear watching one hell of a tennis match at the Aussie Open between one of my favorite players James Blake forcing a 5th set with a little Frenchy so I thought I'd take some time to add to the discussion as well:

Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 18, 2008, 11:22:12 PM
Now a follow-up post:

Keys to the game:



4) Outside shooting.  Can Wooster turn this into the advantage it looks like on paper?
Wooster has Fulk and Cooper at better than 50%, Geitgey at 50%, and Johnson and Bidwell above 40% from behind the arc and they average 9 makes per game at a team 46%.
Wittenberg has no one above 40% and only Hill and Murray seem to be threats. Witt makes 6 per game, and shoots fewer threes, but only averages 32% as a team.


Great job of analysis KB, even if you got Wick's name wrong. ;)  I thought that your last point was a definate key.  If we look back at the Wabash game, I'm sure that we could have said pretty much the same thing.  But, all it takes is for Witt to catch a hot hand shooting like Wabash did against Wooster.  Let's not forget that Wabash was 10-15 from behind the arc at one point in that game while Wooster had only one make and ended the game with just TWO total from beyond the arc! :o  I think this was a result of Wabash defending hard against the outside shot.  But, I also think that the LG's were a bit surprised and at how BrYan Wickliffe was able to take advantage on the inside.

While I wouldn't be surprised in the least to see Witt force Wooster into a similar type of shooting performance, I just don't see anyone on Witt's roster that can try to slow down James Cooper like Wes Smith seemed to be able to do for Wabash.

I could see Witt coming out with a Wabash type performance from beyond the arc, but I don't see Wooster shooting so poorly yet again as they did a week ago in C'ville. 

All of this should add up to a Wooster win, but in this rivalry, it has become the norm to expect the unexpected which is what I am bracing for tomorrow evening...

And as I type, James Blake completed coming back from 2 sets to love to beat that Frenchy in five sets!!! 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2008, 01:44:04 PM
Upset Alert!!!

At the half in Oberlin, the LG's are clinging to a slim 5 point lead:

Wabash - 48
Oberlin  - 43

According to the Live Stats, Wabash led by as many as 16 but Oberlin is shooting over 70% to keep them in this one.


And Wabash has taken over this one in the 2nd half.  They have pushed their lead to 21 with just over 5 minutes to play. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2008, 03:08:17 PM
Whew. Wabash always loses to a bottom feeder at some point during the season, and many times it has been at Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 19, 2008, 03:58:15 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 19, 2008, 03:08:17 PM
Whew. Wabash always loses to a bottom feeder at some point during the season, and many times it has been at Oberlin.

I think the 1-point loss to Kenyon in December qualifies here.  Wabash has already paid their tax this season.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2008, 05:54:44 PM
Not this Kenyon team. They just waxed Gheny by 21 AT Gheny and are 4-2 in the NCAC. They took Capital to OT as well.

Earlham still is to follow. That's the one I'm nervous about.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2008, 06:28:40 PM
In other NCAC action, Denison keeps the 0-fer going losing at home to Hiram. :-[

Hiram    - 78
Denison - 55

Many thought that game would be Denison's best chance of not going winless on the season.  The Big Red still have home tilts vs. Oberlin and what I would consider now their best chance at a 'W' vs. The EC in their 2nd to last game of the season.

In the only other final this afternoon, OWU took care of The EC in Delaware to extend the Quakers losing streak to 13 games as they remain winless in conference play:

OWU    - 79
The EC - 53
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 19, 2008, 07:05:09 PM
0-fer continues............ouch.
I really thought we could get a win. 
Having Sullivan out just adds insult to injury. (no pun intended)

If this doesn't suck the air out of the balloon I don't know what would.

Regardless of playing good "D" you still have to score and the Big Red seems
to have an very hard time doing it.

Wooster next.........maybe they will play the JV team and give the varsity a rest.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 19, 2008, 07:19:05 PM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on January 19, 2008, 07:05:09 PM
0-fer continues............ouch.
I really thought we could get a win. 
Having Sullivan out just adds insult to injury. (no pun intended)

If this doesn't suck the air out of the balloon I don't know what would.

Regardless of playing good "D" you still have to score and the Big Red seems
to have an very hard time doing it.

Wooster next.........maybe they will play the JV team and give the varsity a rest.

In this case, I believe the correct phrasing would be "adding injury to insult". ;)

More seriously, good luck the rest of the way. :)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 19, 2008, 07:32:15 PM
Denison needs a Sven.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 19, 2008, 07:33:14 PM
You are correct sir!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2008, 08:11:28 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 44   Wittenberg 39

Wooster is being led by James Cooper with 16 points, Marty Bidwell with 9 points and Evan Will with 7 points.  Cooper hit a big three pointer just before the halftime buzzer.  Witt is being led by Brandan Barabino with 17 points and Mark Snyder with 10 points.

Wooster shot 56% from the floor in the half with 6 three pointers compared to 48% for Witt with 1 three pointer.  Rebounds were even at 14-14.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2008, 08:18:46 PM
Well, it was just a disaster at Denison today.  Denison has been suffering all season from the lack of offense due to all the losses to graduation and attrition.  Now they've also lost point guard and leading scorer Pat Sullivan, who watched the game from the bench with a boot on his ankle and a dejected look on his face.  Without Pat, the Big Red had nobody to handle the ball, nobody to defend Mike Staley, and nobody to score.  Add to it that DU doesn't have the athletes to keep up with a fast-paced team like Hiram, and it spells, well, disaster.  Hiram took control of the game at about the 10:00 mark, and led comfortably throughout the second half, cruising to the win.

I don't know how badly Sullivan is hurt, but I can say with great confidence that DU will not win while he is wearing a dress shirt.  Then again, maybe this is a good time for him to be out, considering that their next two games are at Wooster and at Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 19, 2008, 09:09:20 PM
Wow.  Up by three points, Wooster's Brandon Johnson fouls Vinny Barbarino with one second left.  The Sweathog makes all three shots and ties the game.  Now Wooster is going to have to survive an overtime.  The Scots are playing with fire here. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2008, 09:10:52 PM
Wow - going to overtime in Springfield. :o  Tied at 76-76

Brandan Barabino of Witt was fouled on a three pointer by Brandon Johnson with less than 2 seconds left.  Barabino made all three free throws to force the OT.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DanTHEman67 on January 19, 2008, 09:15:08 PM
So the under or over 80 points analysis from earlier is where in case of OT?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 19, 2008, 09:20:26 PM
Oh my!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2008, 09:24:23 PM
Final:  Wittenberg 87  Wooster 86  OT

Wittenberg gets the big upset tonight in OT.  Marty Bidwell missed two free throws for Wooster with ~12 seconds left and then Greg Hill hit the game winner for Witt with 4.4 seconds left.  Congratulations to the Tigers.

Wittenberg was led by Brandan Barabino with a career high 26 points, Greg Hill with 16 points, Kevin Murray with 15 points and Mark Snyder with 14 points.

Wooster was led by James Cooper with 21 points, Brandon Johnson with 14 points, Evan Will with 14 points, Devin Fulk with 14 points and Marty Bidwell with 12 points.

Witt is now 6-0 NCAC in First Place, Wooster drops to 5-1 NCAC.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2008, 09:25:51 PM
Congratulations to Witt!  :)

I wonder when the last time this game was not a classic was?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DanTHEman67 on January 19, 2008, 09:35:13 PM
The season still has a long way to go, but this win represents a ton of team progress since the beginning of this campaign. Great coaching, Bill Brown, to get so much out of a team which had so little expectations from so many (I am proud I was one of the few that reminded folks not to count the Tigers out). Good, exciting, classic game between 2 rivals (let's keep it a friendly one)!  ;D

GO TIGERS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 19, 2008, 09:49:01 PM
GREAT GAME!!!!! will have more extensive thoughts tomorrow on the game as i have some celebrating to do, but if a team can show more grit, will, and determination more than Witt did tonight i'd like to see that team......

great win guys-i told you don't count witt out yet
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2008, 10:22:40 PM
If there was ever a case of 'that's why we play the game', tonight's game was it!  I really can't remember a time in this rivalry when a team went into the game as favored as Wooster went into tonight's game.  Yes, Witt had the impressive win streak going, but as was pointed out, it was against some pretty sub-par competition to say the least. 

You have to tip your hats to the Tigers tonight.  They played one hell of a game.  They shot the ball as good as they have all season and they just never folded when things looked bleak to earn a hard fought come from behing thriller at home.  Wooster had several opportunities to put this game away, especially when they got up 11 almost midway through the 2nd half, but Witt always seemed to hit a big shot when they needed it to keep them within striking distance.  Meanwhile, it seemed that whenever Wooster had a chance to hit a dagger shot, they failed to do so including from the ft line in OT. ::)

If you would have told me before this game that Wooster would shoot 51% from the floor, 47% from the arc on 10 made 3's and they would lose to Witt, I would have said you were crazy.  Add to that that Wooster was 14-17 from  the ft line.  The catch...  Wooster's only 3 misses from the charity stripe occurred in the final minutes of ot when Brandon Johonson missed his 2nd attempt that would have put the Scots up 5.  And then after a desperation 3 by Greg Hill to make it only a one point game, Marty Bidwell missed on both his attempts and that set up the heroics by Hill. 

If there's one thing I would question about the closing moments of the game is why wasn't the ball in the hands of either Fulk, Cooper or Johnson after that made 3 by Hill?  Fulk has only one miss at the charity stripe all season and Cooper and Johnson are both over 80% ft shooters.  Yet, Bidwell and his 66% ft shooting end up on the line...

One other thing.  Any eyewitness accounts of that foul on Barabino's desperation 3 at the end of regulation?  From the radio call, Breck didn't give a definitive account one way or the other.  He just said that Barabino was falling away from the basket as he shot.  That just seems like a pretty tough call to make at that point in the game unless it was a legitimate mugging... ::)

With that said, hats off to Witt for the win.  They are now amazingly in sole possession of 1st place in the NCAC after their forgettable 1-5 start.  But their road doesn't get any easier as they have to now go on the road and put their win streak on the line againt the Battling Bishops of OWU on Wednesday.  They then host Kenyon before another road test in C'ville against Wabash.  I'm already looking forward to Wooster getting their shot at evening the score a month from now at Timken!!!  Hopefully, it will be for a chance to clinch their 4th straight NCAC regular season title!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 19, 2008, 11:15:07 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 19, 2008, 10:22:40 PM
One other thing.  Any eyewitness accounts of that foul on Barabino's desperation 3 at the end of regulation?  From the radio call, Breck didn't give a definitive account one way or the other.  He just said that Barabino was falling away from the basket as he shot.  That just seems like a pretty tough call to make at that point in the game unless it was a legitimate mugging... ::)

I was there...but honestly I didn't have the right angle to determine if a foul should have been called.  There wasn't a foul on the arm...I think it was called for a bump on the body by Johnson.  What was exceedingly hard to tell from my angle was whether Barabino was off-balance because of contact or because of desperation. He was definitely off-balance when taking it and the shot never had a chance.

I can say it wasn't a mugging, but there may have been contact. What I thought was strange about the call was that Barabino was falling away to his left, while Johnson was coming out toward him and jumping in front of him moving away to Barabino's right.  It didn't seem like a position where a lot of body-to-body contact would have happened.  When Barabino landed, he feel backward, but Johnson was a good 4 or 5 feet away from him on the court at that point, because they had been moving in opposite directions.  The foul call was immediate, though, the whistle almost seemed to blow before the ball was even out of Barabino's hand, so the call wasn't about contact after the shot.

Johnson didn't protest at all, but he looked directly at Moore immediately after the play and gave a flabbergasted expression and shook his head "no" to Moore's non-verbal question.

I can't and I won't blame the loss on that call- Wooster certainly forgot to execute at other key moments in the game.

Incidentally, I actually felt that there was a non-call that was worse: Wooster probably has a decent argument for an intentional foul on the foul of Bidwell in overtime.  He saw the defense coming and tucked the ball in a la a football running back, and he ended up shoved or tripped onto the floor-- for a moment I thought he was hurt, too.  Three Witt players came to that play and in total they gave much more contact than was necessary for the foul.  I was about 15 feet from that play.

Again, I just want to provide an eye-witness account of the plays.  I don't think that either one of them "cost" Wooster the game.  The Tigers played an incredible game, and really rose to the occasion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2008, 11:26:48 PM
Judging from where I sat, which was on my futon holding my transistor radio, Witt deserved the win by virtue of coming up with the clutch plays down the stretch.  Don't forget they erased an 11-point second half deficit just to make Barabino's and Hill's heroics possible.  A great win for a great program.

On the other side, I'll bet the Wooster players feel like they let a winnable game slip away, and they're probably pretty frustrated.  I sure wouldn't want to be the team that plays them next.  Now let's see, who would that be...? 

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fen%2Fb%2Fbe%2FDulogo.jpg&hash=3ae35c39688fcdeec42ed996f5081e8b4d271cc7)

Uh oh.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 19, 2008, 11:29:11 PM
Going back to my pre-game post:

Keys to the game:

1) Who controls the tempo? This game was pretty up-tempo all night, and it becomes another game to go against form, because I'd say Wooster controlled the tempo, but Wittenberg came out with the victory.

2) Who out-rebounds whom? This is the stat of the night.  This is why Wittenberg won this game:  Rebounding.  Witt- 39, Woo- 28.  +11 rebound margin for Witt.  Also, exceedingly impressive, Witt held Wooster to only 2 offensive boards for the entire game.  I wonder when the last time was that Wooster posted that low of a number??  Witt took down 9 offensive boards by comparison.

3) Turnovers.  An impressively clean game by both sides- very few breakaway points.  Only 15 turnovers total, and virtually even: Wooster had 8, Wittenberg 7.

4) Outside shooting.  Can Wooster turn this into the advantage it looks like on paper?  Answer: No, not really. Wooster made 10 and basically hit its statistical percentage, and Witt made 8 while shooting only slightly better (36% vs. 32%) than its season average.  More or less a statistical wash.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 19, 2008, 11:32:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2008, 11:26:48 PM
Judging from where I sat, which was on my futon holding my transistor radio, Witt deserved the win by virtue of coming up with the clutch plays down the stretch.  Don't forget they erased an 11-point second half deficit just to make Barabino's and Hill's heroics possible.  A great win for a great program.

Absolutely agreed.

Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2008, 11:26:48 PM
On the other side, I'll bet the Wooster players feel like they let a winnable game slip away, and they're probably pretty frustrated.  I sure wouldn't want to be the team that plays them next.  Now let's see, who would that be...? 

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fupload.wikimedia.org%2Fwikipedia%2Fen%2Fb%2Fbe%2FDulogo.jpg&hash=3ae35c39688fcdeec42ed996f5081e8b4d271cc7)

Uh oh.  ::)

Things are not looking good for the Big Red.   :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TigerLady on January 20, 2008, 12:18:05 AM
The officials are going to make both some bad and questionable calls...it happens in any sport.   

I did not have a good view of the Bino foul either....but Witt also got called for two fouls on Cooper that were also questionable.  And, there is also the whole timeout issue that occurred once Hill scored in the last seconds of the overtime. 

It was by far the best basketball game I have seen in my life.  I waited 4 years to see Witt beat Woo on our home court.  Usually, we lose at home, and win at Wooster during regular season.   The last time we beat Wooster at home was January 17th, 2004. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2008, 09:02:01 AM
Quote from: TigerLady on January 20, 2008, 12:18:05 AM
And, there is also the whole timeout issue that occurred once Hill scored in the last seconds of the overtime. 


If anything, that favored Witt in that situation.  Wooster has been in these situations before and this has been a trademark of Moore to not call timeout.  Wooster did it to Walsh and it seemed to catch them off guard as Johnson drove the length of the court to hit the game winner at the buzzer.  It seemed as though that was the case again, however, the clock operator must have just assumed that Wooster was going to call a timeout as they never restarted the game clock after Wooster inbounded and pushed the ball up the court.  So instead of Wooster having the opportunity to catch Witt on their heels in the closing seconds, Witt not only got to have an opportunity to regroup, they also got to call an additional timeout after Wooster took the floor to gameplan what they were going to do. 

Johnson still got a good look, but that element of surprise was lost for Wooster when that clock operator made the mistake of assuming that Wooster was going to call a timeout in that situation.

Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2008, 11:26:48 PM
Witt deserved the win by virtue of coming up with the clutch plays down the stretch.  Don't forget they erased an 11-point second half deficit just to make Barabino's and Hill's heroics possible.

In the end I agree with David.  As TigerLady pointed out, bad calls happen.  And I'm sure that had Wooster pulled out the win, there would have been some calls that Witt could have pointed to that were questionable in Wooster's favor.  The bottom line is that this was yet another classic in this rivalry.  As David noted, Witt made all of the plays down the stretch to get in the position to force OT.  If Wooster makes ft's to close it out in OT, they likely win this game.  Furthermore, if Wooster could have taken advantage of the few opportunities they had to blow the game open in the 2nd half, they may have been able to prevent the Witt comeback.

One thing I do find disconcerting concerning Wooster is their pension for losing leads late in games.  I touched on this earlier, but it has reared it's ugly head again.  Wooster squandered a 7 point lead late in their loss to LEC.  They also led by as many as 13 in the 2nd half vs. OWU.  Wooster also held a 10 point lead with just 5 minutes to go and allowed the Bishops to come all the way back to retake the lead.  Wooster was fortunate to escape with the win on that day.  And last night, Wooster had Witt on the ropes leading by 11, but they couldn't deliver the knockout punch once again.  Wooster has also had their share of comeback wins including their win over Wabash last Saturday, but, if the Scots are going to have aspirations of playing basketball deep into the NCAA Tournament, they are going to have to figure out why they can't close teams out when they get the chance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Valley on January 20, 2008, 10:54:19 AM
A note about Coach Moore - As the game ended the Wooster players began running off the floor to the locker rooms.  Coach Moore chased them down and told them to get back on the floor to congratulate the Witt team.  It was a tremendous touch of class by a great coach.  By the way, I'm a Witt fan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 20, 2008, 10:56:25 AM
Good overall analysis, ScotsFan.  Sadly, I think we've come to the point where we can't be "outraged" at any bad calls that happen in this series.  It seems (at least with every Witt/Wooster game that I've been to in person, as well as accounts that I have read from everybody else from games I have not attended) that there are two guaranteed things we can all expect heading into these games: #1, they'll be extremely competitive and show everybody in attendance why this is such a great rivalry, and #2, there will be a myriad of bad calls from the officials.  Everyone here I believe is right when they've said the game was decided in other areas of the game besides a few bad calls (and I'm just going off what you all have to say, as I couldn't even listen to the game last night), but it's gotten to the point where bad calls are about as common as someone making a 3-point shot.  Much like you have to expect the other team to shoot a few threes, you have to also expect that the other team will shoot a couple questionable free throws.  Again, it's sad that we've come to expect bad calls by officials in these games, but it is what it is.

Congrats to Witt on a huge victory, and for finally beating Wooster at home!  I'm sure round 2 (and possibly round 3) will be just as exciting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 20, 2008, 11:39:01 AM
I have heard all the reasons why you don't foul a guy with time running out.  But when you are up by 3 and have only six fouls.  I sure as heck would foul the kid and put him on the line for the 1&1. 

Now that they have moved the players off the lower block,  the chances of the shooter hitting the first and banging the second and getting the ball back has been reduced that much more.

I understand all the reasons why you don't foul the kid but in this case I think Wooster should have.

It was a terrific game and congrats to Witt on a big win.

I am just a little nervous about how upset Wooster is going to be and maybe take it out on the Big Red machine Wednesday night....at Wooster.  Big OUCH!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 22, 2008, 02:31:49 PM
If Wooster beats Wittenberg in the rematch, and both teams win the rest of their ballgames, putting the conference race into a tie, how is it then determined where the tournament is held?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2008, 02:38:45 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 22, 2008, 02:31:49 PM
If Wooster beats Wittenberg in the rematch, and both teams win the rest of their ballgames, putting the conference race into a tie, how is it then determined where the tournament is held?

IIRC, there is a coin toss, and the winner gets to select between the #1 seed and the right to host the tournament (presuming, of course, that they win their first-round game.)  I don't think it's ever actually happened.

But...my menory has been deteriorating since...since...since I can't remember when, so I'd appreciate either a confirmation or correction on this. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 22, 2008, 03:07:04 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 22, 2008, 02:38:45 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 22, 2008, 02:31:49 PM
If Wooster beats Wittenberg in the rematch, and both teams win the rest of their ballgames, putting the conference race into a tie, how is it then determined where the tournament is held?

IIRC, there is a coin toss, and the winner gets to select between the #1 seed and the right to host the tournament (presuming, of course, that they win their first-round game.)  I don't think it's ever actually happened.

But...my menory has been deteriorating since...since...since I can't remember when, so I'd appreciate either a confirmation or correction on this. 

I'm pretty sure that the tiebreaking procedure is
1) Head-to-Head
2) Worst Lost (or best win - I'm never sure which)
3) Coin flip with the winner getting pick of #1 seed or hosting.

So with the scenario presented by Wooster Booster, it would come down to the coinflip.  With 3 & 4 being pretty equal this year, I would think the winner would choose to host.  The past few years #3 has been much stronger than #4 so it would have been a more interesting choice.  Play at home or make the other team have to beat a stronger opponent to get to the finals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 22, 2008, 03:27:28 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 22, 2008, 02:31:49 PM
If Wooster beats Wittenberg in the rematch, and both teams win the rest of their ballgames, putting the conference race into a tie, how is it then determined where the tournament is held?

Does anybody think this will happen?  Witt plays 10 more games.  2 with Wabash, 2 with OWU, 2 with Kenyon (on the right night, I think Kenyon could get them)...Witt isn't running the table, fellas. 

Let's save the tiebreak stuff for when we're actually on the brink...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2008, 04:08:18 PM
Jan. 19:
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 19, 2008, 03:58:15 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 19, 2008, 03:08:17 PM
Whew. Wabash always loses to a bottom feeder at some point during the season, and many times it has been at Oberlin.

I think the 1-point loss to Kenyon in December qualifies here.  Wabash has already paid their tax this season.   :)

Jan. 22:
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 22, 2008, 03:27:28 PMWitt plays 10 more games.  2 with Wabash, 2 with OWU, 2 with Kenyon (on the right night, I think Kenyon could get them)...Witt isn't running the table, fellas. 

From bottom feeder to rough equivalent of Wittenberg in three days...it's already been a good week for Kenyon!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 22, 2008, 04:13:31 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 22, 2008, 03:27:28 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 22, 2008, 02:31:49 PM
If Wooster beats Wittenberg in the rematch, and both teams win the rest of their ballgames, putting the conference race into a tie, how is it then determined where the tournament is held?

Does anybody think this will happen?  Witt plays 10 more games.  2 with Wabash, 2 with OWU, 2 with Kenyon (on the right night, I think Kenyon could get them)...Witt isn't running the table, fellas. 

Let's save the tiebreak stuff for when we're actually on the brink...
I agree with Wally here.  Let's see what Witt does on the road vs. OWU and Wabash over the next 2 Wednesdays and then maybe we can start talking about tiebreakers.  I wouldn't be surprised in the least to see Witt drop both and at the very least one of those two road contests.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 22, 2008, 04:36:02 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 22, 2008, 04:08:18 PM
Jan. 19:
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 19, 2008, 03:58:15 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 19, 2008, 03:08:17 PM
Whew. Wabash always loses to a bottom feeder at some point during the season, and many times it has been at Oberlin.

I think the 1-point loss to Kenyon in December qualifies here.  Wabash has already paid their tax this season.   :)

Jan. 22:
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 22, 2008, 03:27:28 PMWitt plays 10 more games.  2 with Wabash, 2 with OWU, 2 with Kenyon (on the right night, I think Kenyon could get them)...Witt isn't running the table, fellas. 

From bottom feeder to rough equivalent of Wittenberg in three days...it's already been a good week for Kenyon!  ;D

I was chastised for dumping on the Lords...  :)

...that and I'm still not sold that Wittenberg is a really good team.  Heaps and heaps of praise for the Tigers for winning Wednesday's game notwithstanding, I lean toward the Tigers having been given a gift thanks to some very uncharacteristic play from Wooster in the waning moments of that game (Johnson's foul on a desperation three-point shooter is the main culprit here).  The bulk of Wittenberg's schedule is in front of them.  I'll be surprised if they make it to the end with 2 or fewer NCAC losses.  I would not be surprised if Wooster did. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 22, 2008, 06:16:59 PM
I completely agree that it's unlikely Wittenberg will run the table; was just asking what would happen if they did.  Actually, I'd expect them to pick up three, maybe four, more losses before tournament time is here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 22, 2008, 07:48:38 PM
Looked into this conference race a little:

Presuming that Wittenberg, Wooster, Ohio Wesleyan and Wabash are the best four teams in the NCAC, I looked at the remaining schedule to see what challenges each team has left.  Then, presuming that Earlham, Oberlin, Denison and Hiram are the four worst teams in the NCAC, I also looked at how many "easy" games the top teams had left.

Currently each team has 10 games left to play.

Team                        Games against top 4 teams                   Games against bottom 4 teams
                         Home, Away (Current rec. vs. top 4)        Home, Away (Current rec. vs. bottom 4)

Wittenberg                  Home 2, Away 3 (1-0)                            Home 1, Away 1 (4-0)

Wooster                      Home 3, Away 0 (2-1)                            Home 3, Away 2 (2-0)

Ohio Wesleyan            Home 2, Away 2 (0-2)                            Home 2, Away 2 (3-0)

Wabash                      Home 1, Away 3 (1-1)                            Home 3, Away 2 (2-0)


Wittenberg, with 5, has the greatest number of games remaining against the better teams, while also having only 2 games left that should be "easy wins." On the plus side, they are the only team that could still go 6-0 against the top, even if that seems unlikely.

Wooster is in the best position, having the least number of "tough" matchups, and all of those will occur at home. They also have 5 "easy wins," tied for most with Wabash.

Ohio Wesleyan is the most balanced in terms of remaining schedule, but they are digging a hole by being 0-2 currently against the top of the NCAC.  They'll have to prove they can beat Wittenberg/Wooster/Wabash if they want to be in the hunt.

Incidentally, 4-2 Kenyon is 1-2 against the "top four," and may not like me talking about the top of the NCAC without mentioning them (especially after a trouncing of Allegheny this weekend.) They have the added scheduling benefit of not seeing Wooster or OWU again this year, and have to go to Wabash and have the home-home with Witt.

Wabash probably has the second toughest run, facing all three teams on the road, but on the flip side, they get five games against teams they should beat. The Bash's other potential problem is that they are currently the only team of these four to lose to someone who isn't in these four (as noted above, that's Kenyon).

Not sure if this is actually helpful to anyone else.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 23, 2008, 09:28:19 AM
Ok. Witt did benefit from some uncanny free throw shooting by Wooster, BUT Wooster did benefit from Barabino uncharacteristically missing 2 free throws that would have given Witt the lead so it may never have even came down to overtime. Anyways, that game is in the past and Witt is moving forward to tonight at  Ohio Wesleyan. In typical fashion everyone is picking Witt to get stomped just because there is a slight possibility of a letdown, however i don't see that happening. This team is striving on everyone discounting them so keep it flowing guys.......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 23, 2008, 11:45:42 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 23, 2008, 09:28:19 AMIn typical fashion everyone is picking Witt to get stomped just because there is a slight possibility of a letdown,

In the pick'ems, so far Witt is the 6-4 choice.  So I'm not sure who "everyone" is.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 23, 2008, 11:55:45 AM
Wittenberg 6 to 4?  Good, good.  Me and everyone else will begin to make our moves in the "Pick'em" when OWU victoriously holds court.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 23, 2008, 12:54:08 PM
The Witt/OWU game will be videocast live over the web tonight at 7:30.  Click here (http://stream.owu.edu/) for more information.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 23, 2008, 01:01:57 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 23, 2008, 11:45:42 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 23, 2008, 09:28:19 AMIn typical fashion everyone is picking Witt to get stomped just because there is a slight possibility of a letdown,

In the pick'ems, so far Witt is the 6-4 choice.  So I'm not sure who "everyone" is.

Oops, 6-5, I miscounted.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 23, 2008, 01:20:48 PM
I see that it is Wooster by 90!!!  With the over under being 100!!!! Interesting 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 23, 2008, 02:20:24 PM
well i guess i'm the only vocal wittenberg poster on here on a consistent basis besides jscwittfan so that may have something to do with it right?

I think if anyone picks Denison to win tonight they should be banished from the boards-Wooster is the team i would want to face the least of anyone tonight

ALSO-FYI all NCAC supporters remember to vote on the d3hoops.com main page for Wittenberg/Wooster being the "2nd" best rivalry behind Hope and Calvin-personally i know there is a lot of history there but i would argue Witt/Wooster is top notch stuff!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 23, 2008, 03:50:24 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 23, 2008, 02:20:24 PM
ALSO-FYI all NCAC supporters remember to vote on the d3hoops.com main page for Wittenberg/Wooster being the "2nd" best rivalry behind Hope and Calvin-personally i know there is a lot of history there but i would argue Witt/Wooster is top notch stuff!!!!
Yeah I voted.  It looks as though Witt/Woo is going to have to settle for 3rd as Amherst/Williams is starting to pull away.  They are now 20 percentage points clear. 

It's obviously no argument as to the top spot.  But I thought it would be a bit closer between the Witt/Woo rivalry and the Amherst/Williams rivalry.  I guess all of that history is just too hard to overcome.  Seeing as how Wittenberg and Wooster have only played each other 91 times vs the 195 times Williams and Amherst have squared off vs. one another.  So, I guess that puts them at a bit of an advantage over Wooster and Wittenberg from a historical perspective.  But Wittenberg and Wooster have the top 2 winningest programs of all-time to counter with.  Oh well, I guess we'll just have to settle for 3rd best which isn't so bad either...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 23, 2008, 05:00:51 PM
they can just follow ohio state in settling for runners up......ba dum cha (drumroll) sorry couldn't resist

good luck to witt tonight-it is on webcast tonight as mentioned before
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2008, 08:00:20 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 54  Denison 24  :)

Wooster is cruising in this game as Brandon Johnson has 21 points to lead the Scots.  James Cooper has 10 points and Marty Bidwell has 8 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2008, 08:07:08 PM
At the Half:  Wittenberg 37  Ohio Wesleyan 32

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2008, 08:45:46 PM
Final:  Wooster 97  Denison 57  :)

Wooster was led by Brandon Johnson with 25 points, James Cooper with 14 points, Dustin Geitgey with 12 points and Marty Bidwell with 12 points.

Chris Luther had 11 points and Caleb McFerren added 10 points for Denison.

Scots shot 52% from the floor overall and 13 of 23 on three pointers (56.5%).  Brandon Johnson was 5 of 7 on three pointers and Geitgey was 4 of 7.

Wooster is now 13-3, 6-1 NCAC.  Next up is Earlham on Saturday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2008, 08:49:57 PM
4:05 left in Delaware:   Witt  63  OWU 60  Nice video stream of this game.

OWU three pointer by Teeters.  63-63

Intentional foul on OWU on Witt breakaway....questionable.

Witt 65  OWU 63  made both FTs, ~2 minutes left.

Timeout Witt, OWU ball with 2 minutes left

OWU miss, Witt gets a bucket with 1:15 left.  Witt 67  OWU 63

Another three pointer by Casey Teeters,  Witt 67  OWU 66
Timeout OWU with 56 secs left.  Witt has the ball.

Witt's Murray misses a three pointer,  OWU ball with ~20 secs left.  Timeout

Rudegair scores.  OWU 68  Witt 67.  Greg Hill gets a charging foul.  OWU ball.

Foul on Witt, One & One for OWU's Cafarella.  2.2 secs left.  Timeout.

Brian Cafarella hits both FTs.  OWU 70  Witt 67.  Timeout Tigers.

Witt misses desparation shot from about half court.

Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 70  Wittenberg 67
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 23, 2008, 09:09:43 PM
Great finish to the game, even if it didn't turn out right in the end for Witt.

Also, kudos to OWU - the video stream looked really clean.  Hopefully more schools will be able to do things like this on a more consistent basis (I'm looking at you, Witt).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2008, 09:20:00 PM
~9 minutes left in Richmond:   Wabash 43  Earlham 43

8-0 run by Little Giants.  Wabash 51  Earlham 43 with ~6 minutes left.

~2:40 left.  Wabash 59  Earlham 51

0:53 left.  Wabash 62  Earlham 55  LG's have the ball.

Final:  Wabash 65  Earlham 55  LG's get the road win, 5-2 NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 23, 2008, 09:31:51 PM
This game sounds like it's being broadcast from Mexico in 1952.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2008, 09:53:34 PM
All the NCAC 1/23 Final Scores:

Hiram 84  Allegheny 79
Kenyon 70  Oberlin 60
Wooster 97  Denison 57
Ohio Wesleyan 70  Wittenberg 67
Wabash 65  Earlham 55

So, the NCAC standings at the top:
Witt 6-1
Woo 6-1
OWU 5-2
Wabash 5-2
Kenyon 5-2,  don't overlook those Lords  :) ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 23, 2008, 11:00:36 PM
Wittenberg 67, Ohio Wesleyan 70

This game played out somewhat along the lines of Wooster-Wittenberg from this weekend, except that there was a role-reversal for Wittenberg.

Wittenberg led for most of the game, usually in the 4-8 point range, with Ohio Wesleyan making enough shots down the stretch (credit to Teeters) to stay close and then edge ahead.

Barabino with 16 and Hill with 14 for Wittenberg, who was out-rebounded by OWU (surprisingly) 28-34.

Jesse Jean put in a double-double effort, with 19 points (including OWU's first 8 pts.) and 14 rebounds, and Rudegeair chipped in 13 points.

Sat next to David for this game- he may have additional thoughts, though I don't really have that many comments.  Pretty good basketball game overall, and OWU comes away with a much-needed win at home against one of the better teams in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 23, 2008, 11:49:10 PM
All I have to add is this. 
1) OWU has a nice team and an excellent program with Mike DeWitt, and they deserve MUCH better fan support than they get.  The gym was maybe 2/3 full, similar to what it was when Wooster was in town.  And it's not a large gym.  They should pack the place, and it's a shame they don't.
2) Nevertheless, it was loud.  As anyone who knows Rickey Arean knows, the acoustics are designed to amplify the sound.  The student section was pretty large and very active from the tap, and they kept the decibel level high all night, and that had to help the Bishops.  I know that Teeters appreciated it, at least, because at the final horn he did what I guess has come to be known as a "Lambeau Leap" into the arms of the students.
3) Speaking of Teeters: just when I finished lecturing the uber-patient Bryan on my thesis that what separates Witt from the pretenders is that they always make the plays in the clutch, up steps Casey Teeters.  After an 0-3 shooting start, and looking pretty tentative on the last one, he hit 3 of 3 treys in the final 5 minutes of the game, each one killing off a mini-rally by the Tigers.  Absolutely huge, and fearless. 
4) I did tell Bryan during the pre-game introductions that I thought Jesse Jean would be the key to the game, especially whether he was able to rebound against Witt's big men.  Well, all he did was pull down 14 boards, including 6 on the offensive end, to complement his 19 points on 8/14 shooting.  It's nice to be right once in a while!  ;D
5) Did anybody see us on TV?  We were more or less at midcourt, in the top row opposite the cameras, and standing the whole time (so we could see over the OWU students.)
6) I'm not sorry I chose to attend this game rather than Denison's nailbiter at Wooster.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 24, 2008, 12:43:19 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2008, 08:49:57 PM

Witt misses desparation shot from about half court.

What, no foul? ;)

To Witt's credit, they made that game a lot closer than I thought it would be.  I'm really surprised they let that one slip away.  As David mentioned, Witt seems to always be clutch when they need to make plays and tonight, OWU looks to have given them a dose of their own medicine. 

BTW, I knew I should have stuck with my gut and gone with my Pups over on the Pick 'Em board?! Ugh...??? ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2008, 01:10:51 AM
Interesting night in the NCAC.  Solid win for OWU...really a must win for OWU.  This puts the pressure on Wabash to get one from Witt to keep pace...or get the remaining game at OWU.  Neither will be easy.  Hiram over Allegheny?  Can we officially declare the Gators in the tank?  I know they're hurting a bit, but the Gators had a pretty experienced squad coming back.  Their current standing has to be a disappointment. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 24, 2008, 10:17:47 AM
It looks like the Big Red just ran out of time.  Ouch!!

Credit to Coach Moore for playing his guys 1/2 the game.  Johnson could have scored 50 had they left him in.  But all their starters only played half the game.  Very classy move to pull his team off the floor.

I think frustration has certainly set in for the Big Red.  They now have NO scoring and the fact that they are about to post the worst record in 24 years in the NCAC is taking its toll on everyone.  Players and Coaches.

The real sad thing is how will they recruit anyone to the program???  Certainly no talented Ohio kid is going to go because he wants to "turn the program around".  There are too many good D3 schools in Ohio before anyone would even consider  playing at Denison.

On the flip side Ghiloni can certainly promise the kid plenty of playing time. 

This program has hit rock bottom and may stay there for a number of years.

Good win for OWU.............I still think Wooster will win out.  They are just too tough.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2008, 10:33:22 AM
Congratulations to Witt's Brandon Barabino, the NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) for the week ending Jan. 20.  I need not remind everyone what Barabino did to earn this trophy; all you need to know is that it involved the intersection of the phrases "career game"  and "huge in the clutch" with the word "Wooster."   :)  Congratulations, and my apologies for getting around to this so tardily!  :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2008, 11:18:52 AM
From wsf's end-game play-by-play account:
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2008, 08:49:57 PM
Intentional foul on OWU on Witt breakaway....questionable.

Since I know how much we love to second-guess officiating in here ;D I thought I'd weigh in on this. 

It was not a questionable call at all, but it is a questionable rule.  Here's what happened.  Game tied, 2:43 left, OWU has the ball but Witt frosh Derrick Hannon steals it from Dustin Rudegeair on the left wing.  Hannon streaks down the right side, and Casey Teeters catches up with him from the left (i.e., at a right angle) just as Hannon starts to go up for the layup.  Now, Teeters has basically three choices: he can take a vicious hack at Hannon's arms (the "Karate Kid" option), he can undercut the helpless frosh (the "Ian Pfouts" option), or he can grab Hannon with both arms in bear hug, ensuring he doesn't get a shot off and guiding him gently into the embrace of the Witt cheerleaders (the "Good Sportsmanship" option.)  Either of the first two would have resulted in a standard shooting foul, while the third, which Teeters selected, is a no-doubt-about-it intentional foul. 

It ended up being a non-event when Kyle Holliday picked Brandon Barabino's pocket on a drive during the ensuing possession.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 24, 2008, 12:21:01 PM
tough loss for witt, but isn't it interesting that every game between witt, wooster, owu, and wabash so far this year has been decided by less than 6 points????? this could set up for an interesting conference tournament
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 24, 2008, 12:59:12 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 24, 2008, 12:21:01 PM
isn't it interesting that every game between witt, wooster, owu, and wabash so far this year has been decided by less than 6 points

True, but none of the games involving OWU or Wabash has been in Springfield or Wooster!  I can't speak for the Tigers, but Wooster's games in Delaware and C'ville have historically been fairly tight, whereas the games in Wooster were not nearly as close. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2008, 01:35:02 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on January 24, 2008, 12:59:12 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 24, 2008, 12:21:01 PM
isn't it interesting that every game between witt, wooster, owu, and wabash so far this year has been decided by less than 6 points

True, but none of the games involving OWU or Wabash has been in Springfield or Wooster!  I can't speak for the Tigers, but Wooster's games in Delaware and C'ville have historically been fairly tight, whereas the games in Wooster were not nearly as close. 

This is a good time to mention that the one time Wabash has defeated Wooster since joining the NCAC happened at Timken. 

I'm going to expect close games between these four teams each and every time they square off against one another.  The Scots are clear favorites, but I wouldn't be surprised if they took another loss (at home) before this season is done.  OWU and Wabash both have the experience to play well (and win) on the road.  And for whatever reason, Witt has had plenty of success in Timken.  Things are far from settled here. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 24, 2008, 01:41:19 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 24, 2008, 11:18:52 AM
From wsf's end-game play-by-play account:
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2008, 08:49:57 PM
Intentional foul on OWU on Witt breakaway....questionable.


It was not a questionable call at all, but it is a questionable rule.  Here's what happened.  Game tied, 2:43 left, OWU has the ball but Witt frosh Derrick Hannon steals it from Dustin Rudegeair on the left wing.  Hannon streaks down the right side, and Casey Teeters catches up with him from the left (i.e., at a right angle) just as Hannon starts to go up for the layup.  Now, Teeters has basically three choices: he can take a vicious hack at Hannon's arms (the "Karate Kid" option), he can undercut the helpless frosh (the "Ian Pfouts" option), or he can grab Hannon with both arms in bear hug, ensuring he doesn't get a shot off and guiding him gently into the embrace of the Witt cheerleaders (the "Good Sportsmanship" option.)  Either of the first two would have resulted in a standard shooting foul, while the third, which Teeters selected, is a no-doubt-about-it intentional foul. 

It ended up being a non-event when Kyle Holliday picked Brandon Barabino's pocket on a drive during the ensuing possession.
You bring up an interesting point David.  I too agree that this rule is questionable at best.  I think the interpretation of the rule needs to be changed if nothing else.  Of the 3 options you described, the 3rd option is by far the least confrontational yet it is the one that will ALWAYS draw the intentional foul.  Meanwhile, the first two options are not only far more violent, they are also more likely to cause injury.  Yet, these harder fouls don't warrant an intentional foul? ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 24, 2008, 01:43:52 PM
I totally agree with you Wally. However, I get the impression you are looking past Saturday to next Wednesday.

Have you checked the schedule and see who is coming to town?? :-)

That's right.......THE BIG RED MACHINE!!!

Thank you very much!! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2008, 01:49:41 PM
I'm not looking past anything, BRG.  I can't wait to give a first-hand chronicle of Denison on Saturday.  That, and I really need my Wabash hoops fix...consecutive road games leave me hanging for far too long.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 24, 2008, 02:15:09 PM
At some level of hoops, a while back, there was a difference between an Intentional Foul (where the defender wanted to put the guy with the ball on the line, so he just grabbed him) and a Flagrant Foul (which was a harsh and dangerous foul).  My memory is beyond pathetic, so I can't remember if I'm even thinking NCAA or NBA.  But it seems to me that maybe that was a better system.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2008, 02:38:22 PM
It's a long drive from my home to Delaware, and there a whole lot of nothing along the way.  Gives a man time to think.  One of the things I thought about last night was my game attendance patterns.  So far this season, I've seen six teams at least as often than I've seen the Wooster men.  Six! :o

Kenyon men: 8
Kenyon women: 6
OWU men: 5
Wooster women: 5
Denison men: 4
Otterbein men: 4
Wooster men: 4

If I keep this up throughout the season (and I might, as I plan to forego Wooster's game with Earlham Sat. in favor of Allegheny at OWU), Frank Knorr will revoke my membership in the Downtown Rebounders!  (As well he should, since I still haven't paid...::))

My tally is at 41 games now (23 men's) and have seen 37 different teams (19 women's).  It's been a good year so far, even if there's been a paucity of Scots in it. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2008, 02:45:06 PM
I think the confusion arises from the fact that the terms "flagrant foul" and "intentional foul" get used interchangeably.  The referee's hand signals are the same for each, the penalty is the same for each (two free throws and possession of the basketball)...on the bottom line, they're the same thing.  

I have no dog in this hunt, but I think a fourth option is available to Mr. Teeters: concede that you just gave up a layup because you didn't take care of the the ball.  If you're late enough to the party that you can't actually guard the shooter and your only options are to whack the airborne shooter hard (and possibly cause injury to the shooter or yourself as well as possibly being whistled for flagrancy) or man-hug the guy thus surely giving up two shots and the ball, it might be best to concede the layup here.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2008, 03:14:10 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2008, 02:45:06 PM
I have no dog in this hunt, but I think a fourth option is available to Mr. Teeters: concede that you just gave up a layup because you didn't take care of the the ball.  If you're late enough to the party that you can't actually guard the shooter and your only options are to whack the airborne shooter hard (and possibly cause injury to the shooter or yourself as well as possibly being whistled for flagrancy) or man-hug the guy thus surely giving up two shots and the ball, it might be best to concede the layup here. 

Agreed, but I'm not sure the trajectories and speeds of the two players would have easily permitted that option.  Anyway, it's a spur of the moment decision, in a key conference game, last 2 minutes or so and your opponent is about to go ahead;  I think Teeters was thinking "I have to stop this shot."  Afterward, he spent a good amount of time discussing it with the ref, so I'm not sure he expected the call he got.  (He should have.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 24, 2008, 04:08:47 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2008, 02:45:06 PM
I think the confusion arises from the fact that the terms "flagrant foul" and "intentional foul" get used interchangeably.  The referee's hand signals are the same for each, the penalty is the same for each (two free throws and possession of the basketball)...on the bottom line, they're the same thing. 
I have no dog in this hunt, but I think a fourth option is available to Mr. Teeters: concede that you just gave up a layup because you didn't take care of the the ball.  If you're late enough to the party that you can't actually guard the shooter and your only options are to whack the airborne shooter hard (and possibly cause injury to the shooter or yourself as well as possibly being whistled for flagrancy) or man-hug the guy thus surely giving up two shots and the ball, it might be best to concede the layup here.  

I thought a flagrant foul also meant ejection from the game.  Am I mistaken (or perhaps that is NBA)?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 24, 2008, 04:13:05 PM
Now, if I were an enterprising young man with a name like that, I might just get myself a medical degree, move to southern California, buy a bunch of bulk silicon, hang a simple "Teeters" shingle, and see what walked through the door.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 24, 2008, 04:41:26 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 24, 2008, 04:08:47 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2008, 02:45:06 PM
I think the confusion arises from the fact that the terms "flagrant foul" and "intentional foul" get used interchangeably.  The referee's hand signals are the same for each, the penalty is the same for each (two free throws and possession of the basketball)...on the bottom line, they're the same thing. 
I have no dog in this hunt, but I think a fourth option is available to Mr. Teeters: concede that you just gave up a layup because you didn't take care of the the ball.  If you're late enough to the party that you can't actually guard the shooter and your only options are to whack the airborne shooter hard (and possibly cause injury to the shooter or yourself as well as possibly being whistled for flagrancy) or man-hug the guy thus surely giving up two shots and the ball, it might be best to concede the layup here. 

I thought a flagrant foul also meant ejection from the game.  Am I mistaken (or perhaps that is NBA)?

The Association has a regular Flagrant, and an ejection level Flagrant 2, which also gets you suspended. Right, Robert Horry?

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.azcentral.com%2Fsports%2Fsuns%2Fpics%2F0515dirtybig-autosized258.jpg&hash=097301c986bb050e3ded3e9e5a3d2343c842098f)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 24, 2008, 10:22:35 PM
post of the year so far that was such a terrible screwing of the suns
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 24, 2008, 11:09:00 PM
Well, as a lifelong San Antonian you can probably guess I wasn't shedding any tears for the guys who left the bench. But it was a jackhole play by Horry.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2008, 11:32:44 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2008, 01:35:02 PM

The Scots are clear favorites, but I wouldn't be surprised if they took another loss (at home) before this season is done. 

Actually, someone will very likely need to get a win at Wooster if they want to win the NCAC title this season.  Wooster's remaining schedule is far easier than the other three contenders.  Here are the remaining road games for the 4 teams that Wally mentioned in his post.

Wooster - Only 3 Road Games left (@Gheny, @Denison, @Earlham)

Witt - 4 Road Games (@Wabash, @Hiram, @Wooster, @Kenyon)

Ohio Wesleyan - 5 Road Games (@Oberlin, @Wooster, @Witt, @Earlham, @Gheny)

Wabash - 4 Road Games (@Ohio Wesleyan, @Wooster, @Witt, @Denison)

The key point here is that Wooster has already played all their tough road games.

One other point to note.  Wooster is currently 2-1 in games already played among the top 4 teams while Witt is 1-1, Wabash is 1-1 and Ohio Wesleyan is 1-2.

As we all know, the conference title will be decided on the hardwood so it will be fun to see how the rest of the NCAC season turns out.  :)



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2008, 11:39:00 PM
I think the point I was making is that in recent years, I'd be content to just assume Wooster wins at home against everybody but Witt.  I'm not willing to concede that this year.  Wooster has played the toughest road games on their schedule, but that doesn't put them in the clear.  To reiterate an earlier point, Wabash and OWU are experienced enough and have the chops to win at Wooster.  Witt usually can't wait to play to at Wooster.  So while the schedule appears to be downhill from here on out for Wooster on first glance, Wooster's talent edge over the other top teams in the league isn't as great as it has been and they'll be tested a few times on their own floor before this season is over. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 24, 2008, 11:46:21 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2008, 11:32:44 PM

One other point to note.  Wooster is currently 2-1 in games already played among the top 4 teams while Witt is 1-1, Wabash is 1-1 and Ohio Wesleyan is 1-2.


Another point to note.  Wabash is also the only team among the top 4 with a loss to a team out of the top 4 (@ Kenyon).  And seeing as the LG's  have 3 of their 4 remaining road games against the top 4, it looks as though they have a real up-hill road to climb.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2008, 11:48:08 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 24, 2008, 11:46:21 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2008, 11:32:44 PM

One other point to note.  Wooster is currently 2-1 in games already played among the top 4 teams while Witt is 1-1, Wabash is 1-1 and Ohio Wesleyan is 1-2.


Another point to note.  Wabash is also the only team among the top 4 with a loss to a team out of the top 4 (@ Kenyon).  And seeing as the LG's  have 3 of their 4 remaining road games against the top 4, it looks as though they have a real up-hill road to climb.


As it stands currently, Kenyon is tied with OWU and Wabash for third, so it might be unfair to leave them out of the top 4 discussion.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 25, 2008, 08:37:46 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2008, 11:48:08 PM
As it stands currently, Kenyon is tied with OWU and Wabash for third, so it might be unfair to leave them out of the top 4 discussion.   :)

Well, someone among Wooster, Wittenberg, Wabash, OWU, and Kenyon needs to be left out of the top four discussion since, with my Bradley U. education, I'm able to ciper that we have five teams there.  I'm up for making it a top five discussion. :)

Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2008, 11:39:00 PM
I think the point I was making is that in recent years, I'd be content to just assume Wooster wins at home against everybody but Witt.  I'm not willing to concede that this year.  Wooster has played the toughest road games on their schedule, but that doesn't put them in the clear.  To reiterate an earlier point, Wabash and OWU are experienced enough and have the chops to win at Wooster.  Witt usually can't wait to play to at Wooster.  So while the schedule appears to be downhill from here on out for Wooster on first glance, Wooster's talent edge over the other top teams in the league isn't as great as it has been and they'll be tested a few times on their own floor before this season is over. 

I completely agree with this.  Although I'd make Wooster a solid favorite in the three games, I'd give both OWU and Wabash about a one in four shot of pulling off the win.  Wittenberg maybe a little better, even though I don't think they're quite as good, my reasoning being that the Scots always seem to play a little tight against the Springfielders at home.

PS - A karma point to the first person that can correctly identify my new avatar.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2008, 10:54:44 AM
The NCAC is turning out how I thought it would, with Wooster the favorite but not totally head and shoulders above the rest, and four teams scratching and clawing.

I think Wooster will lose again, but won't lose the title. Second place will be a bloody affair, though, and the race for 4/5 will be nasty, too. That 4/5 game in the NCAC tourney (along with the 3/6 if Gheny can right the ship) will be classics.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 25, 2008, 10:56:11 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2008, 11:48:08 PM
As it stands currently, Kenyon is tied with OWU and Wabash for third, so it might be unfair to leave them out of the top 4 discussion.   :)

I knew that was going to get brought up. ;)

I should have noted that I wasn't including Kenyon in the 'top 4' discussion because I was going by overall record of which Kenyon is 6-9 overall compared to 10-5 for Wabash and 9-5 for OWU.

Although, now that I've thought about it more, technically, wouldn't Kenyon be alone in 3rd place?  After all, the tie-breaker would be head-to-head which Kenyon holds over Wabash at the moment correct?  That would put Wabash in 4th and OWU in 5th since Wabash beat OWU.  However, OWU has also beaten Kenyon so how does that factor in?  Confusing enough??? :P ;D

I think it would be easier to just take WB's advice and make it a 'top 5' discussion. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 25, 2008, 11:16:15 AM
Kenyon, currently at 5-2 in the league, seems to have a real chance to end at least 11-5.

They still get Hiram twice, and Denison, Earlham and Oberlin one more time.  Those should all be wins. Plus the Lords already beat Allegheny on the road, so it stands to reason they have a good chance to beat them at home, too. That would be 11-5, assuming losses to Wittenberg twice and away at Wabash.

Even with a loss to Bash, they'll have split the season series there, and a win against Witt would split that season series.

Kenyon doesn't have to face either Wooster or Ohio Wesleyan again in the regular season- a huge scheduling advantage over Wabash and Wittenberg.

Wouldn't it be fun if the most crucial final-weekend game were Kenyon hosting Wittenberg?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 25, 2008, 11:27:54 AM
So you're saying we can't have five teams in a "top four" discussion?  We're all liberally educated...let's think outside the box gentlemen.    :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 11:30:30 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 25, 2008, 10:56:11 AM
Although, now that I've thought about it more, technically, wouldn't Kenyon be alone in 3rd place?  After all, the tie-breaker would be head-to-head which Kenyon holds over Wabash at the moment correct?  That would put Wabash in 4th and OWU in 5th since Wabash beat OWU.  However, OWU has also beaten Kenyon so how does that factor in?  Confusing enough??? :P ;D

Kenyon, OWU, and Wabash have each lost twice: once to Wooster, and once to one of the others.  Kenyon beat Wabash, Wabash beat OWU, OWU beat Kenyon.  Unless there's a 'home record' line in the tie-breaker, these three are presently in a flat-footed tie for third.  Furthermore, each has lost one home game and one road game.  The only difference is that Kenyon's home loss was to OWU while the other two lost at home to Wooster, but I can't see how that would make any difference if the season were to end today (which, thankfully, it does not.) 

Kenyon being done with OWU and Wooster is an advantage going forward, but a disadvantage in that they now lose tiebreakers to both teams and have no way to reverse that.

Quote from: wally_wabash on January 25, 2008, 11:27:54 AM
So you're saying we can't have five teams in a "top four" discussion?  We're all liberally educated...let's think outside the box gentlemen.    :D

After all, we all live amidst an eleven-team Big Ten! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 25, 2008, 11:34:51 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 11:30:30 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 25, 2008, 11:27:54 AM
So you're saying we can't have five teams in a "top four" discussion?  We're all liberally educated...let's think outside the box gentlemen.    :D

After all, we all live amidst an eleven-team Big Ten! :)

It's possible that the Big Ten is unable to count that high.   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2008, 11:39:59 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 25, 2008, 11:34:51 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 11:30:30 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 25, 2008, 11:27:54 AM
So you're saying we can't have five teams in a "top four" discussion?  We're all liberally educated...let's think outside the box gentlemen.    :D

After all, we all live amidst an eleven-team Big Ten! :)

It's possible that the Big Ten is unable to count that high.   :D

I doubt it. Someone has to count all that BCS television money.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 25, 2008, 11:42:29 AM
Now, now, come on. They still have Northwestern. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 11:51:21 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 25, 2008, 11:42:29 AM
Now, now, come on. They still have Northwestern. :)

A favorite story:
Back in 199x, when Northwestern made the Rose Bowl, ABC produced and televised an hour-long schmalzfest about how wonderful and heartwarming and life-affirming it was that a great school like Northwestern could still play championship football without compromising their high academic ideals.  This point was hammered home by interview after interview.  After about 45 minutes of this, my mother, University of Michigan '51, who had been listening to this from the kitchen unbeknownst to us, came storming into the room, mixing bowl in hand, wooden spoon dripping batter on the floor, and declared "the University of Michigan is higher ranked than Northwestern in every single academic program; why don't they do this when they make the Rose Bowl?!?" and stormed back out. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 25, 2008, 12:06:44 PM
It's possible Northwestern applies the standards a little more stringently to its football players than Michigan does ...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2008, 12:09:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 11:51:21 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 25, 2008, 11:42:29 AM
Now, now, come on. They still have Northwestern. :)

A favorite story:
Back in 199x, when Northwestern made the Rose Bowl, ABC produced and televised an hour-long schmalzfest about how wonderful and heartwarming and life-affirming it was that a great school like Northwestern could still play championship football without compromising their high academic ideals.  This point was hammered home by interview after interview.  After about 45 minutes of this, my mother, University of Michigan '51, who had been listening to this from the kitchen unbeknownst to us, came storming into the room, mixing bowl in hand, wooden spoon dripping batter on the floor, and declared "the University of Michigan is higher ranked than Northwestern in every single academic program; why don't they do this when they make the Rose Bowl?!?" and stormed back out. :D

See?! Even the Big Ten plays the "academic card".  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 25, 2008, 12:17:01 PM
The Big Ten is back down to 10 teams.  Ohio State was voted out after their loss to LSU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 12:17:31 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 25, 2008, 12:06:44 PM
It's possible Northwestern applies the standards a little more stringently to its football players than Michigan does ...
It's also possible that they don't.

It's always bugged me that Michigan appears to have a double standard regarding athletics, one possibly more egregious than any this side of Palo Alto.  Maybe that's why I went to a D3 school, and it's certainly why I cheer for D3 schools and pay no attention to D1 athletics, Michigan included.  But it's not like Michigan is the only top-rank academic school in the Big 10 that overemphasizes sports (hello, Indiana!), so why not Northwestern too?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2008, 01:25:09 PM
But at least the athletes at Duke, Northwestern, Rice, Stanford, Vanderbilt, etc. all seem to be getting an education. I said seem to be!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2008, 02:23:55 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 25, 2008, 01:25:09 PM
But at least the athletes at Duke, Northwestern, Rice, Stanford, Vanderbilt, etc. all seem to be getting an education. I said seem to be!

It's more likely we just assume they are because of a subjective view that those schools are better. Maybe it's a bias we have that private schools are better.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 02:59:27 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2008, 02:23:55 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 25, 2008, 01:25:09 PM
But at least the athletes at Duke, Northwestern, Rice, Stanford, Vanderbilt, etc. all seem to be getting an education. I said seem to be!

It's more likely we just assume they are because of a subjective view that those schools are better. Maybe it's a bias we have that private schools are better.

I try not to assume anything or generalize in this regard.  I know that athletes at Duke, Vanderbilt, Michigan, etc. have access to a superior education.  Whether they take advantage of that access, or are encouraged to, is not something I know.  Some obviously do, and more power to them.  Others appear to be unconcerned with the educational aspects of the school; leaving early for the pros is one indication of this. 

I guess my presumption is that an athlete in a big-time program at a great school who is taking full advantage of the educational opportunities is a rare and highly motivated student.  Just the opposite of D3, I might add.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2008, 03:06:16 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 02:59:27 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2008, 02:23:55 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 25, 2008, 01:25:09 PM
But at least the athletes at Duke, Northwestern, Rice, Stanford, Vanderbilt, etc. all seem to be getting an education. I said seem to be!

It's more likely we just assume they are because of a subjective view that those schools are better. Maybe it's a bias we have that private schools are better.

I try not to assume anything or generalize in this regard.  I know that athletes at Duke, Vanderbilt, Michigan, etc. have access to a superior education.  Whether they take advantage of that access, or are encouraged to, is not something I know.  Some obviously do, and more power to them.  Others appear to be unconcerned with the educational aspects of the school; leaving early for the pros is one indication of this. 

I guess my presumption is that an athlete in a big-time program at a great school who is taking full advantage of the educational opportunities is a rare and highly motivated student.  Just the opposite of D3, I might add.

Well, this is second hand info, but one of our occasional posters (Loyal Son of Wabash) teaches at the University of Texas and he has a section of a class that is specifically for athletes. What he has told me is that the kids in the non-revenue sports are more like the D3 athletes and the kids in the major revenue sports are the ones that fit the "generalization".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 03:14:59 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2008, 03:06:16 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 02:59:27 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2008, 02:23:55 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 25, 2008, 01:25:09 PM
But at least the athletes at Duke, Northwestern, Rice, Stanford, Vanderbilt, etc. all seem to be getting an education. I said seem to be!

It's more likely we just assume they are because of a subjective view that those schools are better. Maybe it's a bias we have that private schools are better.

I try not to assume anything or generalize in this regard.  I know that athletes at Duke, Vanderbilt, Michigan, etc. have access to a superior education.  Whether they take advantage of that access, or are encouraged to, is not something I know.  Some obviously do, and more power to them.  Others appear to be unconcerned with the educational aspects of the school; leaving early for the pros is one indication of this. 

I guess my presumption is that an athlete in a big-time program at a great school who is taking full advantage of the educational opportunities is a rare and highly motivated student.  Just the opposite of D3, I might add.

Well, this is second hand info, but one of our occasional posters (Loyal Son of Wabash) teaches at the University of Texas and he has a section of a class that is specifically for athletes. What he has told me is that the kids in the non-revenue sports are more like the D3 athletes and the kids in the major revenue sports are the ones that fit the "generalization".

I could relate a similar story about Duke basketball players from ~25 years ago, also second hand, but I won't.  Suffice to say that their connection with Duke University was tenuous at best.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2008, 05:15:47 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 03:14:59 PM
I could relate a similar story about Duke basketball players from ~25 years ago, also second hand, but I won't.  Suffice to say that their connection with Duke University was tenuous at best.

Yet doesn't Duke under Coach K graduate pert near everyone that stays four years?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 05:38:06 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 25, 2008, 05:15:47 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 03:14:59 PM
I could relate a similar story about Duke basketball players from ~25 years ago, also second hand, but I won't.  Suffice to say that their connection with Duke University was tenuous at best.

Yet doesn't Duke under Coach K graduate pert near everyone that stays four years?

Even if that's true, it doesn't mean they had the same educational experience as the run of the mill Duke student.  I don't really want to go into specifics; suffice to say that the ancient Duke situation I have second-hand knowledge of with makes Loyal Son of Wabash's athletes-only sections of regular classes look strict by comparison.  And how many athletes do you think LSW flunked in that section?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2008, 05:59:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 05:38:06 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 25, 2008, 05:15:47 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 03:14:59 PM
I could relate a similar story about Duke basketball players from ~25 years ago, also second hand, but I won't.  Suffice to say that their connection with Duke University was tenuous at best.

Yet doesn't Duke under Coach K graduate pert near everyone that stays four years?

Even if that's true, it doesn't mean they had the same educational experience as the run of the mill Duke student.  I don't really want to go into specifics; suffice to say that the ancient Duke situation I have second-hand knowledge of with makes Loyal Son of Wabash's athletes-only sections of regular classes look strict by comparison.  And how many athletes do you think LSW flunked in that section?

As far as his passing rate of his students I have no earthly idea.
Knowing him the way I do, I'd say if none of them flunked, none of them needed to.

It's a good time to mention LSW was a 2 sport athlete at Wabash. He understands what they're going through and maybe that's why he was selected to teach that section.

And as far as the athlete's experience vs. the run of the mill student's experience I will say he passed on a story about a day when more of his students were on crutches than were not. That doesn't typically happen in a "regular" class.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 06:46:02 PM
Offline communications make it clear that my Duke anecdote and LG's UT one are almost entirely dissimilar.  UT appears to be helping their athletes to get a good education, while Duke was helping theirs avoid one.  I apologize for leaping to the wrong conclusion about the Loyal Son of Wabash athletes-only section.

I think it's time to let this drop and get back to the real student-athletes of the NCAC.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2008, 08:50:22 PM
Still, I think there are some 'real' student - athletes afoot in D-1.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 08:56:52 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 25, 2008, 08:50:22 PM
Still, I think there are some 'real' student - athletes afoot in D-1.

I agree gustily, and never intended to suggest otherwise:

Quote from: David Collinge on January 25, 2008, 02:59:27 PMI know that athletes at Duke, Vanderbilt, Michigan, etc. have access to a superior education.  Whether they take advantage of that access, or are encouraged to, is not something I know.  Some obviously do, and more power to them. 

All this from whether we could legitimately claim to have 5 "top 4" teams in the NCAC...and most of it my own d*mn fault... ::) :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2008, 09:05:25 PM
Oh well. We've spent more pages on less worthy topics before.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 26, 2008, 01:31:51 PM
At the Half:   Wooster 40  Earlham 25  :)

In the first game on the NCAC slate today, Wooster is comfortably leading the Quakers at halftime.  Scots are being led by Devin Fulk with 10 points, Robert Melick with 6 points and James Cooper also with 6 points.

Earlham is being led by Nick Welsh with 11 points and Mark Yost with 6 points.

Scots outrebounded the Quakers by 20 to 10 in the first half.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2008, 01:37:35 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 25, 2008, 09:05:25 PM
Oh well. We've spent more pages on less worthy topics before.

In a related note, I'll be keeping a running post from tonight's Wabash/Denison game.  In a rare weekend start time, the ball will go in the air at 7:30 p.m. tonight at Chadwick. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 26, 2008, 02:18:19 PM
Final:  Wooster 89  Earlham 68   :)

Wooster played all of their bench players in the second half as they cruised to an easy victory over the Quakers (biggest lead was 24 points).

Wooster was led by Devin Fulk with 15 points, Robert Melick with 13 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 12 pts, James Cooper with 12 pts, Brandon Johnson with 11 pts and Evan Will also with 11.

Earlham was led by Nick Welsh with 23 points, freshman Mark Yost with 19 points and Tristian Gregory with 16 points.  Yost had a breakout game shooting 5 of 5 from 3 point land so he should get more playing time for the Quakers.

Wooster shot 56% from the floor, 42% on three pointers (11 of 26) and won the battle of the boards by a 37-19 count.

Wooster is now 14-3, 7-1 NCAC  ;D  Next game at Allegheny on 1/30.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2008, 03:07:20 PM
The Big Red in prime time. Can C'ville handle the excitement?  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2008, 03:34:58 PM
Halftime in Springfield:

Kenyon 33
Wittenberg 32

Kenyon led for most of the first half.  Witt hit a run and pushed their lead to seven points.  Kenyon closed the half on an 8-0 run to take the 1-point advantage into the break. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 26, 2008, 03:41:48 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 26, 2008, 03:34:58 PM
Halftime in Springfield:

Kenyon 33
Wittenberg 32

Kenyon led for most of the first half.  Witt hit a run and pushed their lead to seven points.  Kenyon closed the half on an 8-0 run to take the 1-point advantage into the break. 

Yelvington with 10 for Kenyon, Hill and Murray with 9 each for Witt in the first half.  Interestingly, Barabino took only one shot in the first half and was held scoreless.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2008, 04:29:25 PM
Wittenberg is going to get a win here.  The lesson...you really can't go without a field goal for the first 8 minutes of the second half and expect to win at Witt. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 26, 2008, 04:35:58 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 26, 2008, 04:29:25 PM
Wittenberg is going to get a win here.  The lesson...you really can't go without a field goal for the first 8 minutes of the second half and expect to win at Witt. 

Yeah, and it's final:

Kenyon 61
Wittenberg 74

Hill and Murray with 18 and 19 respectively for Witt. Murray also posts 10 rebounds for the double-double.
Knapke with 15, Yelvington with 12 for Kenyon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2008, 05:00:05 PM
D3hoops.com is reporting a score of OWU 75, Allegheny 57. 

What has happened to the Gators??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 26, 2008, 05:17:37 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 26, 2008, 05:00:05 PM
D3hoops.com is reporting a score of OWU 75, Allegheny 57. 
OWU is also reporting that score on its website.

Quote from: wally_wabash on January 26, 2008, 05:00:05 PM
What has happened to the Gators??

No idea, but I think David was going to go to this game, so I would expect that he'll offer his thoughts on Allegheny later.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2008, 05:21:27 PM
One other afternoon final:

Oberlin 66
Hiram 93

Ouch. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2008, 05:58:13 PM
Don't the Gators have some injury issues?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 26, 2008, 06:36:07 PM
Serious issues.  So much so, that D.C., who has all of his eligibility left, had to step in and go a few minutes for them at shooting guard.  He hoisted a few, from nearly as far out as he normally sits from the court while in the stands, and the results were predictable.  Hence the final score.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 26, 2008, 06:53:06 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 26, 2008, 06:36:07 PM
Serious issues.  So much so, that D.C., who has all of his eligibility left, had to step in and go a few minutes for them at shooting guard.  He hoisted a few, from nearly as far out as he normally sits from the court while in the stands, and the results were predictable.  Hence the final score.

As Don Francisco says on Sabado Gigante "Un applauso!"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2008, 06:54:27 PM
You can stick a fork in the Gators as far as I am concerned.  OWU had no trouble whatsoever disposing of them this afternoon.  Yes, they have had injury troubles, chiefly with senior Bill Babe and junior Ryan Hollihan.  Babe has some sort of partial tear in his knee, but has been playing lately (today, 29 minutes, 11 points).  Hollihan is done for the season.  I don't know him on sight, but I think I accounted for everyone else, so I don't believe he even made the trip today.  That's a tough loss for 'Gheny, but I can't believe it would have made that much difference. 

Everything OWU wanted to do today, they were able to do.  'Gheny had no answer on either end.  Quick stats:  shooting: OWU 55.6%, AC 38.5%.  Rebounds: OWU 34, AC 28.  Assists: OWU 17, AC 11.  I think you get the general idea.  Mid-season discovery Mitch Noggle led a very balanced OWU attack with 15.  Ten Bishops scored, including soph. post Brett Pleiman, making his first appearance since aggravating an old back injury before the holidays. 

OWU is looking awfully good lately, and Pleiman's return is a big plus for them.  I think the rest of the league, Wooster included, needs to watch out for these guys.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2008, 07:15:27 PM
I'm on the scene here at Chadwick and with 17 minutes before tipoff, I've already got something noteworty (savor it...noteworthy updates may be few and far between tonight).  Wabash head coach Mac Petty will be a guest on tomorrow night's edition of Hoopsville.  Go ahead and check that out.   Back with more when we tip off. 

Well one more note before tipoff...Denison's leading scorer, Pat Sullivan, continues to be sidelined and will not play tonight. 

As we get ready to tip off some important notes.  Wes is going with the white headband tonight.  We've also got a group of students going with an 80's motif....I can pick out a "Thriller" era Michael Jackson, a Det. Sonny Crockett, and Andy Clark from the Breakfast Club.  Well done students. 

And with that, we're about two minutes in here and Wabash has a 4-0 lead. 

17:59 - Simkus gets an easy basket in the paint.  6-0 Wabash.  Ghiloni is off the bench and calls a timeout.  This timeout might be about two months too late. 

15:51 - Earl Rooks made a steal here and the referee played some of the best fast break defense I've seen preventing the runout layup.  On the possession Simkus got to the foul line and made one of two.  7-3 Wabash.  Denison gets their first field goal with about 15:15 to go.  7-5 now. 

14:44 - Simkus picks up his second foul and goes to the bench.  Since that Denison timeout that I poked fun at, Wabash has gone completely flat.  Serves me right. 

12:58 - Wes Smith makes a couple of free throws.  I couldn't help but  notice there that there are a few vocal Denison fans in the house.  Great to see the fans not giving up on these guys.  We're at 11-9 Wabash here. 

10:45 - Chase Haltom drills a long range triple which prompts another Denison timeout.  This timeout is well placed.   :)  Wabash on a 7-0 run and the score is 16-9 as the huddles break.

7:45 - Wabash brought the starters back on the floor at the last dead ball.  Wes drew a foul on a jumper.  He gets one of his two shots.  19-13 Wabash.  The full court press is really bothering Denison here as Larry Farmer is forced into a turnover.  Wabash methodically works the half court offense and gets an easy bucket for Wesley.  21-13. 

5:15 - Steal and a dunk for Wes.  Denison isn't that bad when they can set up their half court offense.  Getting that far seems to be the biggest problem for the Big Red tonight.  23-15 for Wabash...matches the biggest lead of the night.

4:23 - Aaron Brock just got a great seal on his defender and went went with the two-footed slam dunk.  Nice to see the rims getting loosened up here tonight.  25-17 Wabash leads.

1:13 - Denison completes a three point play and are within three poitns now at 27-24.  More 80's students....I've got a kid sporting a Larry Bird (#7) jersey from the original Dream Team.  That was '92, but I'll give him "close enough" credit here.  Good stuff. 

Halftime....Wabash 30, Denison 26.  I whiffed on that extra point I gave Denison earlier...not sure where that came from. 

This wasn't the most inspired half of hoops I've seen from Wabash this year.  The LGs are actually getting outrebounded here 19-18.  Honestly, I'm impressed with how Denison is competing.  I expected a team that was going through the motions and red x-ing the calendar for spring break.  Not the case.  Ghiloni has these kids playing hard and they are right in the game.  I really can't understand how this team hasn't won a game yet.  I'm not saying that they are a good basketball team...they're young and inexperienced and pretty raw offensively, but a team that competes like this should have accidentally won a game along the line somewhere. 

I guess I didn't give Denison an extra point.  I lost my mind momentarily.  It must be the killer 80s garb that the students are sporting tonight that is throwing me off.   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 26, 2008, 07:19:49 PM
Don't forget to give the status of Wes Smith's headband.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2008, 08:24:36 PM
New half, new post....

No change in Wesley's headband status as we get started here. 

19:38 - Wes Smith opens the scoring with a nice jumpshot.  Denison's Caleb McFerren answers with a driving layup and a foul.  He missed the free throw.  32-28 early in the 2nd half.

18:13 - Denison hits their first three pointer of the game and has trimmed the lead to a single point.  32-31.  Wabash is going to have to tighten down here because the Big Red aren't going away.  Before I can post, Simkus nails a three pointer.  And before I can post that Eberst for Denison hits another one.  It's raining threes here.  35-34. 

14:30 - Eberst just hit a three pointer and Denison has their first lead of the game 39-37.  The Denison fans are excited like this is their first lead of the season.  That isn't a knock...I'm really impressed with their enthusiasm here.  Mac Petty gets a timeout and Wabash really needs to get some things straight here. 

12;37 -Ghiloni is calling a timeout here to settle things down.  Wabash leads 40-39 but it's pretty clear to this observer that Denison is outplaying the Little Giants by a significant margin right now.  The energy level for Wabash is going to have to take a step up here or Denison may very well be celebrating on this floor tonight.  Out of the timeout Wabash gets a steal which turns into a a Brian Maloney layup.  42-39 Wabash now. 

8:41 - Aaron Brock gets himself a nice little layup off a pretty Chase Haltom pass.  Denison answers with Brian Elder in the paint.  The score is 46-42 and Ghiloni calls for a timeout.  There must be something he saw on the defensive end that he wants to discuss.  8:33 to play as the ball comes back in for Wabash. 

7:04 - Zimmer scores off the glass and Wabash has matched their largest lead of the game at 50-42.  This second half has been full of whistles.  Neither team can establish any flow here. 

5:03 - Zimmer gets away with a travel, then gets fouled on a drive to the rim.  He'll have foul shots.  Wabash got away with one there.  The shots are good.  54-44 Wabash. 

3:27 - Aaron Brock will be shooting free throws for Wabash.  He's struggling tonight.  Missed the first one.  Makes the second.  57-45.  Without any real three point shooters, this one may be getting away from Denison. 

2:35 - Fast break...sweet dish from Rooks to Zimmer who slams it home.  61-45 now.  It's starting to look like the score of this game is going to be pretty deceiving.  In no way has this been an easy game for Wabash.

0:52 - Zimmer is going to the line for some more foul shots.  Wabash is wearing out a path to the stripe in the second half.  64-45 Wabash.  This one is on ice. 

Final from Chadwick: Wabash 66, Denison 47.  My hat is off to the Big Red tonight.  They'll win a game before this season is over. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2008, 08:30:27 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 26, 2008, 07:15:27 PMHonestly, I'm impressed with how Denison is competing.  I expected a team that was going through the motions and red x-ing the calendar for spring break.

Actually, I'd argue the opposite.  If there's any team in the NCAC that should be expected to give their all every night, it's Denison.  If not now, when?  Every game is their "Super Bowl."  If they're going to just go through the motions, they might just as well quit the team (as of course several have.)  The DU roster is full of kids who are short on talent and athletic ability, but long on heart and tenacity.  I've yet to see them quit, not even late in the game when they're already out of it.  I am filled with admiration for the players and coaches there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 26, 2008, 10:59:38 PM
Wally has already mentioned it, but yes, Mac Petty will be our guest on Hoopsville tomorrow night.

http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 26, 2008, 11:06:19 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 26, 2008, 08:24:36 PM
My hat is off to the Big Red tonight.  They'll win a game before this season is over. 

Might even happen this coming Wednesday... ;)
0-8 Denison plays at 0-8 Earlham.  Best chance could be on 2/20 when they host Earlham?

Biggest game on Wednesday 1/30 is Wittenberg at Wabash.  Go Little Giants!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 27, 2008, 04:20:36 PM
Sounds like the Big Red gave them all they wanted.  But it certainly didn't help scoring 8 points in the final 14:30.  That isn't going to get it done.  If they can put it together for 40 minutes and not 25 they will get the W.

With Earlham and Oberlin at home gives them the best shot.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2008, 11:06:00 AM
Congratulations to Hiram sophomore Mike Staley for being named the NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) for the week ending Sunday.  Staley helped the Terriers to two wins, including one over Allegheny that pushed the Pups past the Gators an into 6th place in the conference standings.  Congratulations, Mike!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 28, 2008, 11:50:14 AM
I have a general question. 

I was looking at the NCAC stats.
Denison is the worst shooting team in the conference at .401.
They have also shot it the least.  875 shots  (Outside of Oberlin who has shot it 3 less at 872 times)

Am I off base for asking if they shoot so poorly you may want to try and speed up the game and get more shots to make up for the fact that you miss so many?

If you shoot it the least and are the worst shooting team........how the heck are you going to win????   I guess 0-17 tells the story.

I think Denison should pick up the pace and start shooting the darn the ball. 

It might be worth it to give it a try because what they are doing now doesn't seem to work.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2008, 11:57:03 AM
There may be other factors besides the number of shots. Actually, I had a coach in HS who contended that if they shot less FGs than the other team, they'd win. And he was right, because of the pace they played and the fact that when they won, they shot a lot more FTs than the other team and they'd maximize points per possession.

Denison is near the bottom or the bottom in rebounding and turnovers, so that means fewer shots as well.

I don't think offense is the crux of the issue for the Big Red. Making a few stops would be key as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2008, 12:16:33 PM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on January 28, 2008, 11:50:14 AM
Am I off base for asking if they shoot so poorly you may want to try and speed up the game and get more shots to make up for the fact that you miss so many?

That's a bit like the retailer that sells each item at a loss "but we'll make it up in volume."

The faster the pace of the game, the further Denison gets behind.    Say that the combination of factors mentioned above works out that they are 10% less effective at scoring than their opposition.  If the opposition has 40, DU has 36; two buckets with a stop in between and it's tied.  If the opposition has 80, they're 8 points down and they probably can't score quickly enough to catch up.

Add to this that Denison is not very athletic, and not very deep.  They can't maintain a fast pace, so a running team can actually exacerbate the problems the Big Red have.  They especially have difficulty getting back on defense; that's precisely why they got smoked by Hiram. 

Look at it this way.  If these were the good old days before the shot clock, what gameplan would you draw up for DU vs. Wooster?  My plan would be to go into a 20-minute four corners right from the start, so that you're never more than one possession down (depending on who controlled the tip.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 28, 2008, 12:43:00 PM
Excellent points.

It is a catch 22 for Denison.  They are screwed no matter what they do.  It does all come down to the talent you have.  And I am afraid Denison is lacking in the talent department.

Good players make  good coaches.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 28, 2008, 12:46:58 PM
Reading about taking fewer shots in a game reminded me of reading over the box-score for a local HS boys basketball game from Saturday night.  One of the Wooster area's best teams played keep away for an entire quarter in what turned out to be a scoreless 3rd quater. :o ???  Talk about an exiting brand of basketball?  ::)  After reading the article, it reminded me why I really would rather have my teeth pulled than watch HS basketball...

That is, until they implement a shot clock anyways...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 28, 2008, 12:50:53 PM
Maybe it's just that nearly everyone seems to get pumped up when playing Wooster, but I was pretty impressed with Earlham on Saturday.  I was expecting to see a horrible team, a team that had deservedly lost the fifteen straight games that they have.  Hence, in our little live courtside "pick the score" contest, I chose the Scots in a rout, 106-56.  My guess was that the Quakers would try to run, increasing the game's possessions, but be very unsuccessful at it and get killed.

After just five or six possessions, it was clear that I was way off base.  Earlham's defense was solid, even against Wooster's generally good ball movement.  Wooster, in their offensive sequences, would try four or five different attempts at isolating someone and it just wasn't working.  This was far different than when the Scots played Denison and open looks were readily available.

Although the outcome was never in doubt, Wooster could not score at will and the Quakers, who probably had a better than average shooting night, kept it an interesting game.  Big post Nick Welsh played well inside and a redheaded freshman, Mark Yost, did his best Devin Fulk impression, going 5-5 from behind the line.  Earlham certainly isn't a good basketball team, but they played hard and with some skill all game long.  It's very surprising to me that they've now lost 15 straight.

And, in my mind, they are the current record holders for having the longest shorts.  Individual honors, thanks to what appears to be a "one-size-fits-all" plan, go to 5'10" guard Leo Bautista, who had little or no gap between shorts and shoes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2008, 12:51:33 PM
No shot clocks! I lamented when college went to shot clocks.

Nothing wrong with Keep Away if you can get away with it. At Western Boone High School, Howard Leedy's team went to the Semi-State by playing keep away effectively.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2008, 12:54:11 PM
Earlham's main issue is that they have no depth. They have just eight players that see any time, and if one is hurt or sick, they just trim the rotation to seven.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 28, 2008, 12:55:56 PM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on January 27, 2008, 04:20:36 PM
Sounds like the Big Red gave them all they wanted.  But it certainly didn't help scoring 8 points in the final 14:30.  That isn't going to get it done.  If they can put it together for 40 minutes and not 25 they will get the W.

With Earlham and Oberlin at home gives them the best shot.

As poorly as Allegheny has looked lately, might we add them to the list when they make the trek to Granville?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 28, 2008, 01:01:35 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 28, 2008, 12:50:53 PM
After just five or six possessions, it was clear that I was way off base.  Earlham's defense was solid, even against Wooster's generally good ball movement.  Wooster, in their offensive sequences, would try four or five different attempts at isolating someone and it just wasn't working.  This was far different than when the Scots played Denison and open looks were readily available.
I agree and I think Denison will have a tough time beating The EC judging from what I saw from both of these teams vs. Wooster last week.  If The EC plays with the same intensity they brought to Timken, there's no reason they should lose to Dension.

And, as far as those shorts go...  Who is feeding these kids the notion that it looks good??? ::)  I thought the Quakers looked like a bunch of clowns.  They were closer to capris than they were shorts... ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2008, 01:02:59 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 28, 2008, 12:50:53 PM
And, in my mind, they are the current record holders for having the longest shorts.  Individual honors, thanks to what appears to be a "one-size-fits-all" plan, go to 5'10" guard Leo Bautista, who had little or no gap between shorts and shoes.

I saw the opposite of this on Saturday from Allegheny's Andrew Barker.  Now, he wasn't exactly dressed like Jerry West, but his shorts were a good 6" above his knees, which is so out of place in today's game that it looked odd.  AC's road jerseys are dark blue (or whatever; color-blind so don't sue me) but have wide yellow panels on the sides which has a very slimming effect.  Put that together with the short-ish shorts, and the big mop of curls atop Barker's 6'9" frame, and you end up with someone who looks like a little boy that grew two feet since the time he got dressed. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2008, 01:13:39 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 28, 2008, 12:55:56 PM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on January 27, 2008, 04:20:36 PM
Sounds like the Big Red gave them all they wanted.  But it certainly didn't help scoring 8 points in the final 14:30.  That isn't going to get it done.  If they can put it together for 40 minutes and not 25 they will get the W.

With Earlham and Oberlin at home gives them the best shot.

As poorly as Allegheny has looked lately, might we add them to the list when they make the trek to Granville?

Quote from: smedindy on January 28, 2008, 12:54:11 PM
Earlham's main issue is that they have no depth. They have just eight players that see any time, and if one is hurt or sick, they just trim the rotation to seven.

(Based on one viewing only) Allegheny is also thin.  They play nine guys, but really depend almost entirely on Bill Babe and George Raftis, after whom there's a big drop-off.  That's not enough to win with any frequency, but it might be enough to do in Denison.  Babe is a deadly shooter when he's open, and I don't think either Jeremy Stuhlfauth or Brian Elder will be able to keep up with Raftis. 

DU's games this week (at Earlham and home vs. Allegheny) are winnable, but if Pat Sullivan is still out, I wouldn't make them the favorite in either.  Furthermore, by most accounts, the Big Red's best performances this season were at OWU and at Wabash, and perhaps the second half of their home game vs. Witt.  That suggests to me that they get up for the "big" games better than the ones against the other second-division teams. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 28, 2008, 01:35:20 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 28, 2008, 12:51:33 PM
No shot clocks! I lamented when college went to shot clocks.

Nothing wrong with Keep Away if you can get away with it. At Western Boone High School, Howard Leedy's team went to the Semi-State by playing keep away effectively.

That sounds downright unwatchable.  I can't imagine it being fun to play in a system where the goal is to win by not playing.  Yuck.  It can't be fun for fans either...if I'm going to watch somebody dribble around for minutes at a time without shooting, the Washington Generals better be on the floor and somebody better get hit with a bucket of water. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2008, 02:09:41 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 28, 2008, 01:35:20 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 28, 2008, 12:51:33 PM
No shot clocks! I lamented when college went to shot clocks.

Nothing wrong with Keep Away if you can get away with it. At Western Boone High School, Howard Leedy's team went to the Semi-State by playing keep away effectively.

That sounds downright unwatchable.  I can't imagine it being fun to play in a system where the goal is to win by not playing.  Yuck.  It can't be fun for fans either...if I'm going to watch somebody dribble around for minutes at a time without shooting, the Washington Generals better be on the floor and somebody better get hit with a bucket of water. 

The kids had fun because they won. And the fans were into it because they knew they could beat the big boys that way. To each their own...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 28, 2008, 02:56:50 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 28, 2008, 12:46:58 PMThat is, until they implement a shot clock anyways...

There are no shot clocks in HS hoops in Ohio? Whoa.

Quote from: wally_wabash on January 28, 2008, 01:35:20 PMThat sounds downright unwatchable.  I can't imagine it being fun to play in a system where the goal is to win by not playing.  Yuck.  It can't be fun for fans either...if I'm going to watch somebody dribble around for minutes at a time without shooting, the Washington Generals better be on the floor and somebody better get hit with a bucket of water.

This. It's the opposite extreme of the Grinnell-style "system" and in that vein is just as close to "real" basketball in my humble opinion. I mean, to just sit there and watch the clock run isn't a sport or a strategy. It's a cop-out. Seriously, there's a reason a shot clock was created. Hoops without it is boring.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 28, 2008, 03:08:22 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 28, 2008, 01:02:59 PM
AC's road jerseys are dark blue...but have wide yellow panels on the sides which has a very slimming effect.

Quote from: David Collinge on January 28, 2008, 01:02:59 PM
Allegheny is also thin.  They play nine guys...

Ok, so, what you're saying is, if the Gators eliminated the yellow panels, they would have more depth?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2008, 03:15:41 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 28, 2008, 02:56:50 PM
Seriously, there's a reason a shot clock was created. Hoops without it is boring.

Oh, I love it when the youngin's come over and talk the newfangled talk... :D

Actually, the conspiracy theorist in me says that the Villanova / Georgetown final game was a reason the shot clock was approved. You know, there was a big time upset AND WE JUST CAN'T HAVE THAT! Georgetown was supposed to win and be the best team of the 80's.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 28, 2008, 03:15:56 PM
I watched some terrific high school basketball last weekend; 13 games worth.  Girls, with no shot clock.  The only game that was absolutely horrible, the first game on Monday morning, was when the opponent of one slow-down team decided that they could play even slower.  In a game with eight-minute quarters, whichever team had the ball with two minutes to go in a period was playing for the last shot.  I began wondering why I got out of bed, and moreso, why these two teams did.

I grew up playing and watching basketball without a clock, and loved it.  But I'm over it.  I feel the 35-second clock provides ample opportunity for a team to run an offense and try to get a decent look.  If they can't, then the defense has done their job and gets rewarded with either a tough shot or infraction.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2008, 03:18:02 PM
If refs would actually enforce the 5-second rule properly, there would be no need for a shot clock. A team could still be rewarded by playing defense even if one team decided to hold the ball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 28, 2008, 03:48:03 PM
One of the funniest scenes I've ever seen in a game was a one-man stall.  Not by holding the ball (the refs would eventually call 5-seconds, after all), but because he was the best dribbler I've ever seen (I believe it was Bobby Jo Mason of Bradley - who did play later for the Globetrotters - but I can't recall for sure).  Eventually he had 4 defenders chasing him, but they never could trap him.  Of course, by that time he had teammates open all over the place, but the crowd was going so wild who's gonna pass?!  After nearly 5 minutes (why the other team never fouled, I have no clue) he did finally pass to a wide-open teammate under the basket - clinching points (going from 3 to 5 with now under a minute, if my memory is anywhere near accurate).

The four-corners (or other stalls) can be effective in neutralizing a superior opponent [though absolutely indefensible when down significantly and just trying to avoid a total butt-whipping], but it led directly to the shot clock.  There is a reason why 'keep away' remains a playground favorite, but has never become a major spectator sport!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 28, 2008, 03:49:25 PM
I love it when I get an opportunity to post this boy's high school score from Michigan


1-16-1996
Jackson Northwest 7 Haslett 6-----  5 Overtimes
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 28, 2008, 04:00:16 PM
Quote from: sac on January 28, 2008, 03:49:25 PM
I love it when I get an opportunity to post this boy's high school score from Michigan


1-16-1996
Jackson Northwest 7 Haslett 6-----  5 Overtimes

That can't possibly have been a fun game to watch. It's like soccer on hardwood. Barf.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2008, 04:14:41 PM
Well, it's better that than 101-6, right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2008, 05:48:18 PM
I love it when the Wabash guys go after one another...

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cre8asiteforums.com%2Fforums%2Fuploads%2Fpost-3012-1185415263.gif&hash=23cfdf0df5bfd9a4c83f5f6b8d9f6e7806be534d)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 28, 2008, 06:35:05 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 28, 2008, 04:14:41 PM
Well, it's better that than 101-6, right?

No, I'd say they both suck and are both crappy games. It's like saying "getting stabbed is better than getting shot".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 28, 2008, 07:10:16 PM
thats why a team almost comes into stall mode in high school hoops when they have a 6 point lead because they know the other team has to foul and they can just stall. I rarely see comebacks in high school games because of no shot clock existing. my brother's team coming back from 6 down with a minute to go and winning last week was an exception as they relied on some timely steals the old fashioned way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 28, 2008, 07:17:24 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 28, 2008, 02:56:50 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 28, 2008, 12:46:58 PMThat is, until they implement a shot clock anyways...

There are no shot clocks in HS hoops in Ohio? Whoa.


I didn't know it was just an Ohio thing.  I thought that HS hoops didn't have a shot clock period.  There are states that actually implement a shot clock for HS hoops?  Maybe there is hope! :P



Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 28, 2008, 03:48:03 PM
There is a reason why 'keep away' remains a playground favorite, but has never become a major spectator sport!

That's pretty much how I feel.  I just don't feel like watching a team pass and dribble for the majority of a basketball game with no intentions of scoring as my idea of entertainment.  And as pennstghs said, it really eliminates comebacks for the most part.  I highly doubt WashU rallies from 7 down to win vs. Brandeis in the game's final minute if there was no shot clock...  That is unless the team that is leading sucks at ft's. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2008, 07:20:57 PM
After starting 1-5, Wittenberg now stands at 11-6.  To my mind, there is no conceivable scenario in which they win fewer than three of their last 8 games.  Three more victories give them 14 wins, which is enough to guarantee that they extend their phenomenal streak of non-losing seasons to 52, regardless of post-season results.  Although their remaining schedule (http://www.d3hoops.com/school/WITT/mens/2008) is tough, there is a three-game stretch beginning Saturday where they face Hiram, Earlham, and Allegheny (two of them at home).  That 14th win will be in the books not later than next Saturday evening, Feb. 9.  So let me offer my congratulations to Bill Brown and the Tigers, if a tiny bit premature, for this great turnaround and extending this amazing streak.  :) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 28, 2008, 07:21:16 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 28, 2008, 07:17:24 PMI didn't know it was just an Ohio thing.  I thought that HS hoops didn't have a shot clock period.  There are states that actually implement a shot clock for HS hoops?  Maybe there is hope!

I've been corrected by a friend that down here in The Republic apparently high school hoops has no shot clock either. I'll be honest, I didn't go to a single hoops game when I was in high school.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 28, 2008, 07:30:10 PM
One alternative to the 'stall' or the 'foul fest'  - I saw Bradley U. (and this time I'm sure it was them!) come back from 7 down with <15 seconds to go (c. 1964, not sure of exactly the season).  Four consecutive inbounds steals will do that! ;D

Admittedly, probably not something you want to count on!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 28, 2008, 07:54:21 PM
On my way to Atlanta a few years ago I stopped over in Lexington, took in a boys' high school game, and was amazed to find that they played with a shot clock.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2008, 08:29:28 PM
Wooster's James Cooper started this season with 1,491 career points in 94 games (15.9 ppg.)  So far this season he has recorded 334 points (19.6), bringing his career total to 1,825 (16.4).  With eight games remaining, he'd have to average 21.9 ppg. the rest of the way to reach 2,000 in the regular season.  He's 133 points (16.6+) from passing Bryan Nelson and moving into second all-time on Wooster's scoring list; 1st place Tom Dinger is well out of reach at 2,370.

Further down the list, Devin Fulk now sits at 966 points and is poised to become the 32nd member of Wooster's 1,000-point club in the near future.  He's averaging 12.3 ppg this season (one of five Scots averaging in double figures), at which rate he'll reach the plateau against Hiram at home next week.

Not far behind him is junior Brandon Johnson, whose 217 points this season put him at 876 for his career.  Maintaining his 12.8 ppg average will put him over 1,000 10 games for now, which works out as the NCAC semifinals, should the Scots be fortunate enough to get that far. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2008, 08:57:44 PM
With the conference season half done, here's a quick glance at the statistical leaders.

Scoring:
Overall, James Cooper's 19.8 edges out Tristian Gregory (EC) 19.6.  Actually, this is a bit odd, as the NCAC credits Cooper with 336 points vs. the 334 (19.6) that Wooster says he has.  In conference games only, the leader is Andrew Zimmer of Wabash at 19.0, by a hair over Witt's Gregg Hill (18.9). 

Rebounding:
Allegheny's George Raftis is the clear leader at 9.6 (overall) and 11.8 (conference.)

Assists:
The overall leader is Wooster's Marty Bidwell (3.82) by one assist over Hiram's Mike Staley (3.76).  For conference games, it's the same teams but different dishers:  Woo's Brandon Johnson (3.75) leads Hiram's Nick Russo (3.63).

A/TO ratio:
Overall, the best in this category is OWU's Casey Teeters (2.21), just ahead of Marty Bidwell (2.17) and Nick Russo (2.15).  In conference action, the leader is Russo at 2.64, ahead of Kenyon's Josh Klinger (2.50 in limited action.)

FG%:
Three Wooster players are in the top 4 for all games, led by frosh Bryan Wickliffe (.579).  OWU's Jesse Jean is second at .571, just ahead of Devin Fulk (.569) and James Cooper (.537), both of whom are primarily jumpshot artists.  The leaders in conference play are Bishop teammates Jean (.625) and Kyle Holliday (.623), another jumpshooter.

3pt. FG%:
Three players are over 50% for the season: James Cooper (.524), Devin Fulk (.514), and Mike Staley (.508).  In conference play there are 8 players (from 6 teams) at .500 or better, led by Gary Simkus (Wabash) at .619 (13/21).

FT%:
The conference's best free throw shooter is OWU's Brian Cafarella, 33 of 34 for the season (.971).  Devin Fulk (31/32, .969) would be right behind, but doesn't meet the minimum for inclusion (2 makes per game.)  In conference play, with the same threshold, the leader is Oberlin's Jordan Beard at .909 (20/22).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2008, 09:20:00 PM
Team leaders:

Scoring offense: 
It should come as no surprise to find Wooster at the top of these lists, looking as much like a public radio station as a basketball team (88.1 overall, 89.5 conference).

Scoring defense:
We're all used to finding Wittenberg atop this list, but they're just tied for second in both lists.  Overall, the scoring defense leader is Ohio Wesleyan at 63.9, a half-point better than both Witt and Wabash.  In conference play, the stingiest team is Kenyon at 62.4, again a half-point better than Tigers and Giants.

Scoring margin:
Wooster's well out ahead of the pack here, +16.0 overall and +19.1 conference.

FG% offense:
Again, it's the Scots, the only team above .500.  They're hitting at a .509 clip overall and .527 in conference play.

FG% defense:
Wittenberg, usually among the national leaders in this category, leads in all games at .411, just ahead of Wabash's .413.  In conference games the order is reversed, with the LGs at .403 to Witt's .414.

FT%:
Wooster has been the best at this for the season as a whole, at .751 slightly better than Hiram's .743.  In conference play, Oberlin's .780 is well out in the lead.

3pt FG%:
Wooster is far ahead in this category, hitting at .468 for the season and .478 in conference action.  I'd be surprised if this wasn't near the top of the national list.

Rebounding:
The Scots average 38.9 boards per game, a half-rebound better that Witt.  In conference play, the leader is Wabash at 38.9, more than a full board better than Witt.

Rebounding margin:
Wooster is far and away the overall leader in this category as well, at +7.6, but in conference play the leader is Wittenberg at +7.7, followed by Wabash (+7.1), Wooster (+6.9), and OWU (+6.1).  Everyone else is negative in this category.

Turnover margin:
The league's best at this has been Ohio Wesleyan at +2.38.  Wooster, however, leads in conference-only play by nearly one full turnover at +3.62.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 28, 2008, 10:35:06 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 28, 2008, 09:20:00 PM
Team leaders:
3pt FG%:
Wooster is far ahead in this category, hitting at .468 for the season and .478 in conference action.  I'd be surprised if this wasn't near the top of the national list.

It is #1 nationally, a full percentage point above Emerson.  Wooster actually raised the average slighting during this past week, from .465 to .468, so I suspect they'll stay on top for this week.

Also, Wooster is currently well clear of its team record for a season of 43.7%.  The Scots have flirted with setting a new record a few times over the past few years and usually have ended up content with only setting a new mark for number of 3pt baskets made.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 28, 2008, 10:43:50 PM
The NCAC rebounding numbers through today, January 28th:

http://arkski.com/~jwood/ncacrebounding.htm

Wooster still leads overall by virtue of their .743 defensive rebounding percentage.  However, the Scots are only the fifth best offensive rebounding team in the league, trailing Wabash, Kenyon, OWU, and Wittenberg in that order.  OWU has moved up a couple of notches in the overall category since I last did this.  OWU's games contain the fewest available rebounds, Hiram's the most.  

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on January 29, 2008, 01:26:31 AM
Word on the streetz at the local Mini Mart is Woo will be abuzz with many notable alumni this weekend as they take on the JV team.  Look for this squad to be filled with multiple inside/outside threats, high-risers, and ball-aholics. There has been no preliminary word on pre-sale for tickets to the contest, nor when the various player's charter planes arrive in Cleveland or Akron.  More updates to come...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 29, 2008, 07:20:19 AM
Moneyball -

By any chance would this contest be taking place on Saturday before the varsity's 7:30 game against OWU?  Any idea what time?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 29, 2008, 09:40:32 AM
Quote from: MoneyBallSTL on January 29, 2008, 01:26:31 AM
...nor when the various player's charter planes arrive in Cleveland or Akron.  More updates to come...
You mean the Wayne Co. Airport isn't equipped to handle private charters??? 8) ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on January 29, 2008, 09:48:45 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 28, 2008, 08:29:28 PM
Wooster's James Cooper started this season with 1,491 career points in 94 games (15.9 ppg.)  So far this season he has recorded 334 points (19.6), bringing his career total to 1,825 (16.4).  With eight games remaining, he'd have to average 21.9 ppg. the rest of the way to reach 2,000 in the regular season.  He's 133 points (16.6+) from passing Bryan Nelson and moving into second all-time on Wooster's scoring list; 1st place Tom Dinger is well out of reach at 2,370.

Just for those who don't know, Dinger did that without the 3-pointer, having played 1967-1971. I would have loved to see him play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 29, 2008, 10:11:57 AM
Talking Stats...........
If Denison wasn't feeling bad enough.  They should see how they rank of the 389 teams in D3.  Let's just say they don't have much room between them and the bottom. :-(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bigkrapper on January 29, 2008, 01:54:45 PM
The Alumni classic is slated for 3:30 because a high school game will break up the excitement from the JV vs. Alumni and the Wooster vs OWU game.  With the amount of notable alumni reported to come back you gotta wonder what Coach Gaubatz might try to do to slow down this threat.  This has got to be his toughest challenge in his young Collegiate Coaching career!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 29, 2008, 04:06:24 PM
good luck witt at wabash tomorrow night-i have a feeling this is going to be another tester. i am very interested in the wooster/owu rematch results saturday as well
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 30, 2008, 07:26:12 PM
We're on the scene at Chadwick....tipoff coming very shortly. 

LG....Wes is in the white headband to start.   :)

Alright, before we get started here, I want to point out that this game is huge.  Obviously.  This game will have major implications in the standings.  Statistically, these teams are about identical.  I'm expecting a great, great game here tonight.  The students are filing in and are vocal....this is the biggest game of the conference student for the student body here.  They don't much care for Witt around these parts.  Lineups have been introduced and we're about to tip.  Go Wabash!

19:00 - Kevin Murray opens the scoring with a triple.  3-0 Witt. 

17:29 - This Barabino kid is pretty good.  He just picked up his first foul.  I'll not be sad to see him get into foul trouble. We're at 3-2 Witt.  Li'l Earl with a 3.  5-3 Bash. 

15:30 - A couple of quick buckets for Witt and the Tigers are back in front 7-5.  Barabino had the last layup off of a steal. 

14:07 - Our first subs of the game are checking in.  We'll see how the second units matchup.  Simkus stayed on the floor and got a dunk off of a steal.  The Scary Gary chant is out.  9-7 Bash. 

13:03 - Gary came to play tonight.  Simkus chased down his own missed three pointer and earned himself a basket and a foul off of the rebound.  Gary converts the free throw and Wabash leads 12-7.  And now we have another Witt turnover.  Wabash is playing well to start here. 

10:11 - Kyle Bigler knotted the score at 12-12 with a three pointer for Witt.  Chase Haltom had the quick answer and got his own three pointer.  15-12 Wabash.  And another Witt turnover. 

8:52 - Li'l Earl with another three pointer!  Nice start for Earl.  18-14 Wabash. 

7:13 - Bigler hits another three.  Witt is having great success with the penetrate and kick game.  That's been their best offense tonight.  20-17 Wabash.  And we're getting a Witt timeout.  Wabash's starters have been waiting to check in for about 3 minutes now. 

4:12 - Brandon White gets loose for a three pointer and Witt has the lead 22-20.  Anytime Witt can ge the ball into the paint and successfully get it back out without turning it over, they are gettine wide open looks on the perimeter. 

1:16 - Sam Gregory gets one of two from the foul line.  Witt leads 26-21.  For 17 minutes, physical play in the paint was cool.  The refs have since decided otherwise.  It's too bad.  And here Gregg Hill beats the shot clock with a three pointer.  29-21 Witt. 

0:00 - And that's how we go to the half.  29-21 Witt.  The livestats seem to be missing a Wabash basket...which is strange because there weren't many of them.  The LGs will need to shoot much, much better in the second half.  Witt is 6-8 on 3's so far.  That has to stop. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 30, 2008, 08:05:02 PM
sounds like wabash's offensive rebounding is keeping them close-refs are trying to take hold of the reigns-witt is shooting very well from the field with taking about half as many shots it seems.

29-21 Witt at half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 30, 2008, 08:08:59 PM
At the half:

Wooster 43
Allegheny 28

Fulk leads Woo with 11 (on uncharacteristic 1-4 3pt shooting).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 30, 2008, 08:15:16 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 26, 2008, 04:29:25 PM
Wittenberg is going to get a win here.  The lesson...you really can't go without a field goal for the first 8 minutes of the second half and expect to win at Witt. 

I don't know why I do things like this to myself.  Wabash covered the last 7:46 of the first half without a field goal (unofficially 0-49 durin that stretch).  Let's see if Wabash can do what Kenyon couldn't and overcome the drought.  Second half tip coming in about 5 minutes. 

Halftime leaders....Kevin Murray is pacing Witt with 10 points.  Bigler has 6.  For Wabash, Simkus is the leading scorer with 9 points.  Earl Rooks has 6.  Zimmer has no points (not scoring in the first half is becoming a bad habit for Zim) but he does have six rebounds for the LGs.  Neither team has foul issues at this point. 

19:13 - Witt opens the second half with a three.  32-21.  Wabash can't find the bucket tonight. 

17:11 - Zimmer has broken the drought with a couple of baskets.  Wabash trails 34-25.  Gregg Hill misses the first of two free throws and Bill Brown gets a timeout. 

16:41 - It's all Zimmer so far here for Wabash.  He's got all six second half points for the LGs.  34-27 now. 

14:20 - Consecutive threes by Hill and Barabino have pushed the lead to 42-27.  Timeout for Mac Petty.  Somebody needs to flip the switch or this will get out of hand. 

12:40 - Chase Haltom drills a triple and Wabash has rattled off seven quick points.  Bill Brown gets a timeout immediately.  42-34 is the score.  The crowd has their second wind. 

10:53 - Shaky foul called here on Simkus.  That'll be his third but Mac will keep in the game.  The Wabash run is 9-0.  42-36 is the score.  Witt has possession.

9:51 - Great feed from Simkus to Maloney for a layup.  42-38 Witt.  And here's a runout for Simkus.  42-40 now.  13-0 run!  What a response.  Timeout Bill Brown. 

7:50 - There's the inside out for Witt.  Hill gets a three pointer and ends the Wabash run.  45-40 Witt.

6:30 - Aaron Brock for three.  45-43.  We've got a slugfest. 

4:56 - We've traded baskets here.  Zimmer will now go to the line here for two shots.  The first is good.  The second is also good.  We're tied up.  47-47. 

3:04 - Witt scored five quick points.   Barabino got the last bucket for Witt.  52-47 Witt. 

2:00 - Wes Smith misses a long three and the rebound goes to Witt.  Wabash needs something good to happen here.  And it did.  Wes Smith gets a foul, a layup and will go to the line for the bonus shot.  Timeout Wabash before the foul shot.  52-49 is the score.
3:04 - Witt answers back with 5 quick points.  Barabino got the last basket for Witt.  52-47 Witt.

The foul shot is good.  52-50 Witt. 

Long three for Barabino is no good.  Wabash back up the floor.  And Simkus draws a shooting foul in the paint.  Chance to pull even again here.  49.7 seconds to go. 

The shots are good and we're tied up again.  52-52.  It looks like Wabash is giving fouls here.  Wabash had just three team fouls. 

0:29 - Zimmer gets whistled for a foul.  Gregory calmly hits the first.  And the second.  54-52 in favor of Witt.  Wabash calls a timeout and will have no shot clock. 

0:13 - In a horrid flashback to the Wooster game, Wabash turned the ball over on what looked like their last possession.  Witt turned the ball over on the subsequent inbound pass.  Haltom gets a decent look for Wabash but it hits the back iron and Witt rebounds with 1 second left.  Bollocks. 

This is interesting.....Witt had free throws with 1 second left.  The shooter (didn't catch the player, sorry) missed the front of the 1+1.  Wabash rebounds and a timeout is whistled immediately.  The clock shows 0.1 seconds left.  It does not look as if any time will be added.  Wabash has 90 feet and the blink of an eye to get one in here. 

Outstanding.  They put a half second back on the clock.  Wabash now has 0.6 seconds.  Great officiating here.   ;D

No miracles here.  Witt wins 54-52.  The answer is no.  You can't not go without a field goal for 8 minutes and beat good teams. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 30, 2008, 08:30:00 PM
Good grief. It seems like anything shot from in the ZIP Code is gonna fall for Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 30, 2008, 08:30:39 PM
well.....i guess wally's hypothesis about the second half is coming true right now
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 30, 2008, 08:30:51 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 30, 2008, 08:30:00 PM
Good grief. It seems like anything shot from in the ZIP Code is gonna fall for Witt.

QFT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 30, 2008, 08:32:04 PM
When was the last time we saw a Witt team go 9-12 from 3 land??  This is unbelievable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 30, 2008, 08:44:41 PM
If anyone has any interest:
#6 Capital is having some trouble in Wilmington tonight.

12:00 in the second half:

Capital         36
Wilmington  50

Key stats are rebounding, where Wilmington has 14 offensive rebounds so far.  Also, Wilmington is 11-12 from the line while Capital is only 5-14.

Broadcast feed here: http://www.capital.edu/166/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on January 30, 2008, 09:06:45 PM
Great game.  Excellent road victory for Wittenberg, but a nice showing from Wabash as well, as they easily could have folded after Witt jumped out to the big lead in the second half.  Witt finishes 11-17 from 3, a great 64.7%.  3 Tigers in double figures - Hill (16), Murray (13), and Barabino (11).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 30, 2008, 09:09:53 PM
great tough win-i said it would be  agrind it out game and it held true to form-so that makes owu/wooster on the clock to be decided by 5 points or less now?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on January 30, 2008, 09:13:30 PM
BIG RED WINS!!!!

Let me repeat that...........

THE BIG RED WINS!!!!!  55-49

O-fer   O-VER
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 30, 2008, 09:20:12 PM
Final:  Wooster 78  Allegheny 61

Wooster gets the road win in Meadville. :)  Scots were led by Marty Bidwell with 16 points, Evan Will with 14 pts/8 rebounds, Devin Fulk with 11 pts, Bryan Wickliffe with 11 pts/7 rebounds and James Cooper also with 11 points.

Gators were led by Charlie Jaicks with 17 points, George Raftis with 14 points and Craig Devinney who added 11 points.

Wooster is now 15-3, 8-1 NCAC.  Next up is Ohio Wesleyan at home on Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 30, 2008, 09:29:34 PM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on January 30, 2008, 09:13:30 PM
BIG RED WINS!!!!

Let me repeat that...........

THE BIG RED WINS!!!!!  55-49

O-fer   O-VER

Congratulations to the Big Red on their first win! Should make for an enjoyable ride home from Richmond this evening.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 30, 2008, 09:41:42 PM
All the 1/30 NCAC Final Scores:

Ohio Wesleyan 84  Oberlin 69
Kenyon 90  Hiram 73
Wooster 78  Allegheny 61
Wittenberg 54  Wabash 52
Denison 55  Earlham 49

So, the top 5 in the NCAC standings are:
Witt 8-1
Woo 8-1
OWU 7-2
Wabash 6-3
Kenyon 6-3

Note: corrected typo on the Kenyon/Hiram score
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 30, 2008, 10:56:00 PM
Kenyon won fairly easily, but not that easily.  It was 90-73. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26285.xml)  The teams battled through the first half, with KC going out to a 7-ish point lead, but Hiram nearly caught up and trailed at the half by just 2, 36-34.  They tied it up after a steal on the opening possession of the 2nd, and it was pretty much all Kenyon the rest of the way.  Kenyon got their offense going on all cylinders in the 2nd, getting runouts, open jumpers, and good interior looks.  It showed, as they outscored the Terriers 54-39 in the 2nd and shot 71.4% in the process. 

Kenyon neutralized Mike Staley, who scored on the final possession of the 1st half for his first bucket and had 3 points in the first 34:00 or so.  He ended up with 11, but most of that was of the too little, (much) too late variety.  Hiram's most impressive player tonight was frosh Hassan Muhammed, who led the Pups with 14 on 7/9 shooting; he continually managed to get open under the hoop, and snared four offensive rebounds to go along with his seven bunnies.  Kenyon had four scorers in double figures, led by frosh Kodey Haddox with 21.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 31, 2008, 10:46:35 AM
After hearing conflicting reports about the gametime for the Wooster Alumni vs JV this Saturday, I asked their SID, Hugh Howard, who said that it will be a 3 PM tipoff.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 31, 2008, 01:48:53 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 31, 2008, 10:46:35 AM
After hearing conflicting reports about the gametime for the Wooster Alumni vs JV this Saturday, I asked their SID, Hugh Howard, who said that it will be a 3 PM tipoff.
Too bad they can't make that HS game the first game.  I wouldn't mind seeing the alumi take on the JV, but I don't really care to see the HS game in between. 

Of course, there is yet another threat of inclement weather putting the conclusion of the Steve Smith/WQKT Classic up in the air once again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 31, 2008, 02:18:18 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 31, 2008, 01:48:53 PMbut I don't really care to see the HS game in between.

And risk missing a 13-11 overtime nailbiting classic?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 31, 2008, 02:23:41 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 31, 2008, 02:18:18 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 31, 2008, 01:48:53 PMbut I don't really care to see the HS game in between.

And risk missing a 13-11 overtime nailbiting classic?  ;)
:D  Exactly!  What was it that I said?  Something about pulling teeth! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on January 31, 2008, 02:34:07 PM
An easy fix would be to check out the alumni game at 3, visit the Coccia House for a pie after and still make it back for what should be a great game between the Bishops and the Scots...will be interesting to see if the inclement weather poses any threats to the charter flights that some of the alumni have arranged
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bigkrapper on January 31, 2008, 02:55:31 PM
With the JV vs Alumni game tip officially confirmed for 3:00pm.  What an excellent opportunity to visit some of Wooster's finest restaurants.  Coccia House is always a fan favorite (as previously mentioned) but one can always be tempted by the classy french restaurant in town, Che LeRoys, or the Olde Jaol is always an option.  The most exciting rumor floating around is that after the game New President Grant Cornwell has graciously provided the Wooster Inn Guest House (The old rubbermaid house) for all those returning for this thrilling event! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 31, 2008, 03:36:45 PM
Well, while I'm always interested in seeing the old (heh heh) Scots take the floor, I'm not so sure I'd define this game as a thrilling event.  I don't know if it'll happen, but if the Alums show up in force, the Wooster JV, no offense, is in serious trouble.  It could be a mismatch of mammoth proportions.

Last preseason, the Alumni had Nelson, Gorman, Schlingman, Mitchell, Witucky and (I think) Thompson, among others.  Antwyan Reynolds was a no-show, but had been listed on the roster.  When they had their starters on the court, they played a very good Wooster varsity to a standstill.  If those guys are in town, and last year's graduates Port, Vandervaart, and Van Horn are added to the team, that's a ballclub that (if in shape) would walk away with the current NCAC title and might win the DIII championship.  Heck, DII!

I haven't seen the Wooster JV this year, but with Melick and Elam now bonafide varsity players, the mini-Scots have to be that, guard heavy. Outside of Rob Tenanini and Eric Fertig, I don't think they have any size.  And the Alumni have that and then some.  Good luck to the Jayvees, they're going to need it. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 31, 2008, 09:15:30 PM
Wooster has decided to make Saturday's game a "Blackout" the gym night.

Can't wait to be in Timken watching the Scots again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 31, 2008, 10:55:46 PM
i'll be up in timken in 2 weeks......keep the gym warm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 01, 2008, 02:48:15 PM
Quote from: bigkrapper on January 31, 2008, 02:55:31 PM
With the JV vs Alumni game tip officially confirmed for 3:00pm.  What an excellent opportunity to visit some of Wooster's finest restaurants.  Coccia House is always a fan favorite (as previously mentioned) but one can always be tempted by the classy french restaurant in town, Che LeRoys, or the Olde Jaol is always an option.  The most exciting rumor floating around is that after the game New President Grant Cornwell has graciously provided the Wooster Inn Guest House (The old rubbermaid house) for all those returning for this thrilling event! 
So how much is a "shell" and / or a "frosty" at Che Leroys these days?  Haven't been there since 1980.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on February 01, 2008, 11:45:43 PM
Word on the streetz at Dino's tonight is that the charter flights made it in without a hitch. Alumni players are rumored to be resting up before a early morning shootaround at "The Q". After getting word about the blackout  at the varsity game, there was some confusion as to why there couldnt be a blackout before, during, AND after the varsity contest...Anyway, I hope Coach Gaubatz can catch a few Z's tonight before tomorrow's title bout. One last inquiry, I hope Hugh Howard is printing up programs for tomorrow, I bet Jenine is free to distribute them and I'm sure the youngsters in the Wooster community would love to get some autographs tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 02, 2008, 03:02:07 PM
On the scene at Chadwick....

Can't say that I care for Kenyon's black road unis.  Gratuitous use of black.  Wesley has the white headband on, which seems to be the standard play for home games.  We're about two minutes from lineups. 

From the game program....Andrew Zimmer is creeping up on some lofty places in the Wabash record books.  Zim is 22 points from moving into 10th place in all time scoring and is 12 rebounds away from passing Chad Tabor '99 for 9th place in all time rebounds.  When  you start passing Tabor, you've had a helluva career. 

Back with the tip in a minute.

19:40 - One possession, one bucket for Simkus.  2-0 Wabash.  Wabash is going to miss Simkus big time next year. 

Uniform update for Earl Rooks...Earl is goign with the white T under the jersey today.  New look for Earl.  In the meantime, Yelvington scores a reverse layup for Kenyon and the Lords trail 6-5 with 17:03 to play in the first half. 

14:50 - Yelvington is doing some nice work in the paint for Kenyon.  He just converted a three point play and put Kenyon in front 10-8.

13:24 - Yelvington for three more.  Wabash is going to have to adjust to him.  Zimmer scores quickly for Wabash.  The score is 13-12 for Kenyon. 

10"36 - Bediako turns the ball over by traveling...Bediako and Zimmer are really banging down in the paint.  This is pretty fun to watch.  The score is 15-14 in favor of the Lords. 

Wabash has gone small here.  Freshman Dominique Thomas is getting some rare minutes here.  I wonder if there isn't something wrong with Evan Arnold who would normally be coming in in this spot.  9:14 to go...score is still 15-14.

8:04 - And now Andrew Gilman is checking for Wabash.  This is a bizarre substiution pattern for Coach Petty.  There must have been some regulars that are getting sent a message after the wretched offensive game vs. Witt on Wednesday.  Brian Maloney gets a steal and a layup and Wabash goes ahead 16-15.  Yelvington has the quick answer with his own layup.  17-16 Lords.  6:38 to play.

5:42 - We're in a timeout here.  The score is still 17-16 for Kenyon.  Wabash is not playing that well.  I'm not sure the Lords are either.  What I am sure of is that the Lords lead the league in knee braces.  There are NFL offensive lines that don't have as much knee gear as this team does. 

4:11 - We've been scoreless here for about three full minutes.  Zimmer breaks the drought with a steal and a layup.  He was fouled but missed the free throw.  Wabash leads 18-17. 

3:03 - Korey Haddox gets a triple for the Lords and a 20-18 lead.  Brian Maloney answer for Wabash with a jumper in the lane.  20-20. 

0:47 - Yelvington for three more.  23-20 Lords. 

0:00 - Knapke gets a putback bucket at the buzzer and the Lords go to the half up 25-20.  Mercifully, this half ends. 

Yelvington has 16 points for Wabash.  The LGs are going to want to put a body on him in the second half.  Zimmer leads Wabash with 8 points and 3 rebounds.  Frankly, that half of basketball stunk like a foot.  Kenyon closed pretty strong, hence the lead.  Wabash is going to have to play with a lot more intensity because what happened in the first half won't cut it. 

Evidence of the quality of play we saw here in the first half....Turnovers: Kenyon 16, Wabash 12.  Uh-gly. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 02, 2008, 03:55:09 PM
Second half....here we go...

19:30 - Zimmer opens the scoring in the second half.  Knapke answers quickly.  27-22 Kenyon early in the second period.

18:45 - As Aaron Brock makes one of two free throws it dawns on me that Brock sat a heavy, heavy portion of the first half with two fouls.  His being able to stay on the floor and help on Yelvington will be huge here in the second half.  Simkus is now shooting free throws Wabash and he gets one out of two.  Yikes...Wabash is leaving some points at the line today.  27-23 is the score.

16:15 - Chase Haltom gets a big three pointer for the LGs.  29-26 for the Lords.  Knapke gets fouled on a drive to the basket and will go to the line.  He misses both shots.  Rebound to Wabash.

15:29 - Wesley Smith snakes his way to the tin for two points and Wabash has crawled back to within one at 29-28.  Coach Croci will get a timeout here. 

14:07 - Steal and a big dunk from Wes Smith.  Wabash leads 30-29 and the crowd is juiced. 

13:15 - Huge putback dunk by Smith!!  Wow that was impressive.  Wabash leads 32-30. 

11:50 - More good stuff from the Zimmer-Bediako battles.  Zimmer uses some great post work to get up and under Bediako for a bucket and a foul.  The bonus shot is good and Wabash leads 35-32.

10:33 - Bediako picks up hish second foul and with over 10 minutes to go, both teams will be in the bonus from here on out.  This could make for a long second half. 

9:33 - Oh my...things are getting chippy.  Mad scramble for a loose ball, bodies everywhere, Kenyon gets called for a travel.  The energy is ramping up a notch or two here.  Aaron Brock nails a three for Wabash after the turnover, then Haddox comes back and gets a three point play of his own.  My oh my.  40-39 in favor of Wabash as it stands now. 

8:16 - This game is getting very physical. Knapke just cleared Brock out with a forearm, Brock was of course called for the foul.  That makes four for Brock and he sits down.  Knapke gets one of two foul shots and the score is tied 40-40. 

5:56 - AJ Clair gets a triple for Kenyon and the Lords regain the lead 43-42.  On the other end, Zimmer gets fouled in the post and will shoota one and one I think.  the shots are good and Wabash goes back on top 44-43.

5:03 - Excellent transition offfense for Wabash right here.  Earl leading break, dishes right to Simkus who gets a layup and a foul.  The shot is no good but Zimmer battles for the rebound and draws a foul for himself.  Zim will shoot a pair of free throws (both teams are in the double bonus now).  Wiat...Zimmer has been taken out of the game.  Blood somewhere I'm guessing.  Haltom will take his place at the line.  Chase converts the free throws.  48-43 Wabash.

They've also sent Simkus off for having blood on his jersey.  I don't know where all of this blood is coming from.  It's been a physical game, but I don't see anybody busted open.  Kenyon just converted a pair of free throws.  48-45 Wabash.  4:37 to play.

3:03 - chase Haltom nails a three in right in the grill of a Kenyon defender.  That was a huge shot.  Wabash takes their largest lead of the game at 53-45.  Timeout Lords. 

1:58 - It's going to be a parade to the line for the rest of this game.  Wes Smith is taking his crack right now.  The first shot is no good.  The second shot is no good as well.  This is a good time to mention that Yelvington has been limited to  just 4 points in the second half.  Knapke gets a tough bucket underneath for Kenyon and draws a foul.  It's 53-48  with the foul shot pending.  Timeout Lords.  1:34 to play now. 

1:18 - Knapke's shot was good.  Haltom makes a lazy pass across the court and turns it over.  He makes up for it by preventing a layup.  Kenyon inbounds and squanders the chance by taking a long three pointer.  Rebound to Smith who is immediately fouled.  He misses the first shot.  Each of his last three shots have been off to the left.  He gets the next one to fall.  54-49 and Wabash takes a timeout.  1:07 to play.

0:50 - Yelvington drives with a lot of contact from Brock.  Nothing is called until Yelvington travels.  It's strange to say with both teams well past the double bonus, but you can't expect the refs to bail you out here.  It's a physical game today.  Earl Rooks is going to the line for Wabash and he makes two shots.  56-49 LGs. 

0:20 - Kenyon's three pointer is off the rim.  Rebound to Simkus.  Runout for Brock...his dunk gets stopped by a foul from behind.  He gets two shots down.  58-49 and this one is over.

58-49 is the final.  What a phsyical game.  Both teams will be sore after this one.  Good win for the LGs.  This Kenyon team is pretty good.  And most of them are coming back next year.  2008-2009...year of the Lord(s)?   ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash83 on February 02, 2008, 04:57:40 PM
Wally,

Thanks for the updates.  As always, they were well written and welcomed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 02, 2008, 05:51:00 PM
In what turned out to be a much closer game than I'm sure many of us expected, Wittenberg defeats Hiram 91-85.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 02, 2008, 06:01:21 PM
Nice updates once again Wally.  Thanks.

In other news there was an upset in the GL Region up in the MIAA:

Albion 56
Hope 52

jsc,  was that a little too close for comfort?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 02, 2008, 06:17:43 PM
After leading  48-30 at the half, Witt once again goes soft.

They must remember to keep the "chip on their shoulder", nobody is going to rollover, witness the Wabash game.

After leading in the first half by as much as 21, the score was down by 2 pts with 1 minute to go in the game. If the Tigers did not make their FTs, this game  would have gone down in the loss column.

The Tigers were 20-20 from the FT line, with 6 made in the final seconds.
The technical foul by Barabino did not help as McDevitt made all 4 FTs.
Bino slammed the ball after a foul was called.

By the way, Hiram's McDevitt scores 43 pts, with 30 coming in the 2nd half.
;) with 10 rebounds.

Another observation about this game, Kevin Murray scores 18pts, with 16pts coming in the 1st half.

Key factor in this game was the play of Mark Snyder. The MVP of the game for Witt, with 16pts.


As Bill Brown said after the game, "McDevitt scored 43 pts!!! Wow!! We were 20/20 from the line?". 

If he really knew what was going on during the game Witt could be a dangerous team. If you have ever heard the Maryville(TN) coach in a post game interview, you would understand that statement completely.



http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/hirm0202.htm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 02, 2008, 06:22:50 PM
For you Scot fans that didn't make the Alumni game - it was a bit sloppy but had a great finish. Kyle Witucky hits a 3 with 1.3 seconds remaining to lift the old guys to a 79-78 win. Alumni who were present:

Steve Thompson ('01)
Bryan Nelson ('02)
Matt Smith ('02)
PJ McCloud ('04)
Issac Ward  ('05)
Matt Schlingman ('05)
Kyle Witucky ('06)
Joe Agler ('06)
Tim Vandervaart ('07)
Andy Van Horn ('07)
Jeff Stevens ('07)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 02, 2008, 08:06:55 PM
At the Half:   Wooster 36  Ohio Wesleyan 32

Wooster is being led by Evan Will with 15 points (3 three pointers), Brandon Johnson with 11 points and James Cooper with 5 points.

Ohio Wesleyan's top scorers are Jesse Jean with 6 points, Kyle Holliday with 6 points and Brian Cafarella with 5 points.

OWU is not shooting well but the Bishops are winning the rebound battle so far by a 19-15 count.  Wooster needs to hit the boards in the 2nd half.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 02, 2008, 08:28:27 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 02, 2008, 06:01:21 PM
jsc,  was that a little too close for comfort?

Yeah, just a little bit, ha ha.  Even moreso when I saw the stats posted by W4E.  Witt doesn't have a good enough team this year to be letting people drop 40+ on them.  Games like the Wooster and Wabash games show me this is a tough, resilient team that has the chance to do something postseason-wise (nowhere near a national title, but maybe an NCAC tourney title and 1 or 2 wins in the NCAAs), but then showings like today make me feel prepared for another NCAC semifinal bounce.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 02, 2008, 09:04:36 PM
Final:  Wooster 73  Ohio Wesleyan 65

Wooster gets the big win over the Bishops. :) Scots were led by Evan Will who had a career high 27 points, Brandon Johnson with 17 points and James Cooper with 13 points.  Cooper and Johnson both hit huge three pointers with less than 2 minutes to go in the game. :D

Ohio Wesleyan was led by Jesse Jean with 15 points, Kyle Holliday with 13 points and Dustin Rudegair with 9 points.

Wooster won this game despite being outrebounded 44-32 and despite their poor free throw shooting (only 12 of 22).  Good shooting by the Scots was the difference as they made 53% from the floor and they were 9 of 15 on three pointers (60%).

Wooster is now 16-3, 9-1 NCAC ;D  Next up is Hiram on 2/6
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DanTHEman67 on February 02, 2008, 09:27:21 PM
Quote from: Witt4ever on February 02, 2008, 06:17:43 PM


As Bill Brown said after the game, "McDevitt scored 43 pts!!! Wow!! We were 20/20 from the line?". 

If he really knew what was going on during the game Witt could be a dangerous team. If you have ever heard the Maryville(TN) coach in a post game interview, you would understand that statement completely.





Since I am sure I am not alone in failing to follow Maryville, TN's team, would you please elaborate so we can understand the context of your remarks? Thanks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 02, 2008, 09:40:47 PM
All the NCAC 2/2 Final Scores:

Oberlin 65  Earlham 64
Wittenberg 91  Hiram 85
Wabash 58  Kenyon 49
Allegheny 83  Denison 54
Wooster 73  Ohio Wesleyan 65

So, the top 5 in the standings are:

Wooster 9-1
Wittenberg 9-1
Ohio Wesleyan 7-3
Wabash 7-3
Kenyon 6-4
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 03, 2008, 09:01:26 AM
So, the top 5 in the standings are:


Wittenberg 9-1 ;)
Wooster 9-1
Wabash 7-3
Ohio Wesleyan 7-3
Kenyon 6-4
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 03, 2008, 09:10:42 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 02, 2008, 09:04:36 PM
Final:  Wooster 73  Ohio Wesleyan 65

Cooper and Johnson both hit huge three pointers with less than 2 minutes to go in the game. :D

This game seemed to be a hard one for the home crowd to get into.  Wooster seemed to be on the verge of taking control of the game for most of the contest, but to OWU's credit, they wouldn't go away.  They always made the defensive stop when they needed to or they got a key offensive board when they needed it.

The key point of the game came late in the 2nd half.  OWU got a turnover.  But the only problem is that they had the wrong player running the floor.  Their big man, Jesse Jean lumbered down the court for what looked like an uncontested layup that would have made it a one point game.  Then, out of nowhere, Brandon Johnson streaked down the floor and made a spectacular block on the OWU big man.  That really seemed to awaken the crowd for the 1st time all night.  Wooster controlled the rebound and on their ensuing possession, James Cooper hit the shot of the game.  One of his trademark NBA 3's!  And that really got the fans going!  I don't believe the Bishops ever got within 5 the rest of the way.

Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 02, 2008, 09:04:36 PM
Final:  Wooster 73  Ohio Wesleyan 65

Wooster won this game despite being outrebounded 44-32 and despite their poor free throw shooting (only 12 of 22).  Good shooting by the Scots was the difference as they made 53% from the floor and they were 9 of 15 on three pointers (60%).

The stat that jumped out at me was offensive rebounds.  OWU had 17 offensive boards compared to just 3 for Wooster! :o  If you would have told me before the game that OWU would have dominated the boards and had that many 2nd chance points and still lost, I would have probably thought you were crazy.  I will say, some of their rebounding tactics are questionable at best...

As far as ft shooting for Wooster, the main culprit in that statistic was Marty Bidwell who accounted for 5 of Wooster's 10 missed ft's.  At one point, he missed 4 in a row.  I'm really surprised by his struggles at the line this season.  After last night's dreadful performance from the line, Bidwell is just a percentage point ahead of Robert Melick for the team low!  I'm guessing he'll be logging some time at the line in practice this week...

Overall, a good win for the Scots.  OWU was coming into this game playing some pretty good basketball.  As tight as this race has been, it is crucial to defend the home floor.  Especially since Wooster already took care of 2 of their 3 chief rivals on the road.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 03, 2008, 10:43:56 AM
I think the problem with the crowd is that many of them are just not that informed.  They don't seem to understand that these aren't the OWUs, Kenyons, and Wabashes of yesteryear, that they are now pretty darned good basketball teams, and that when the Scots play them they're going to be serious tussles.

Brandon Johnson's block was probably the best play that I've seen by a Scot in the dozen or so years that I've been watching them.  Totally surprising in how he got up so high to get it - well above the rim - but also that one of those absolutely incompetent referees didn't blow the whistle.

I think you've got it backwards about Cooper's long threes.  They're not NBA threes.  In the NBA, when somebody makes an especially long three, word up is that he made a "James Cooper three". ;)

OWU was allowed to crash the boards, literally, the whole game.  Not once were they called for shoving, holding, or any of the other blatantly illegal tactics that they employed.  NCAC referees really, really eat it.

Unfortunately, Marty Bidwell now seems to have lost confidence in his free throw shooting.  He's not a great shooter, but he's a good one, and should be at LEAST at 70%, and probably 75% or above.  But now he's not following through, obviously worried about missing, etc.  He'll work through it, but it might take a little bit.  As for the rest of his game last night, it looked a little like early last year when every time he touched anyone, or even didn't, he got a whistle blown on him.  That hasn't happened in a long time, and hopefully it was just a one-game blip.

Honestly, though, the only reason the game was close in the first half was that OWU got every call.  Every one.  Otherwise Wooster has a 10-15 point lead.  What's the point of boxing someone out when they're allowed to run over you?  How is anyone supposed to defend Jesse Jean when he can get away with just bumping and elbowing his way to the basket?  OWU is guilty of nothing.  They did what they did because they were allowed to do it, but that's to the detriment of the NCAC and DIII hoops in general. 

PS - I hope you boys enjoyed those cookies, and maybe showed just a LITTLE class and saved ONE for Elaine. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 03, 2008, 10:34:26 PM
17-0 lives on!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 03, 2008, 10:43:08 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 03, 2008, 10:34:26 PM
17-0 lives on!!

Not really - the Pats were, afterall, 18-0.

To the '72 Fish - shut up, already!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 04, 2008, 09:23:01 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 03, 2008, 10:43:08 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 03, 2008, 10:34:26 PM
17-0 lives on!!

Not really - the Pats were, afterall, 18-0.

To the '72 Fish - shut up, already!
While I agree with the fact that the '72 Fish need to just go away and shut up, the bottom line is that the Pats didn't finish.  They could have been 20-0 and that still doesn't change the fact that they didn't end the season with a '0' in the loss column...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 04, 2008, 09:44:36 AM
regardless of the patriots losing, that was probably one of the most well-played super bowls of all time. like the giants said after the game everyone saying the patriots were going to win based on their previous meeting gave them some confidence but it also gave the giants more confidence
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 04, 2008, 09:57:17 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 04, 2008, 09:44:36 AM
regardless of the patriots losing, that was probably one of the most well-played super bowls of all time. like the giants said after the game everyone saying the patriots were going to win based on their previous meeting gave them some confidence but it also gave the giants more confidence
Yeah.  That was a great game to watch!

I also agree about what everyone was saying with regards to the Giants gaining a 'false' sense of confidence based on their competitive game with the Pats in their final game of the regular season.  It was like the Pats were the only team holding back in that game.  I think it was pretty clear by how the Giants defense dominated the Pats (especially up front) that the Giants may have been holding some things back as well... ::)

You have to admit, that was one hell of a run by the Giants this post-season.  They win 3 road playoff wins where they were pretty overwhelming underdogs in each of those games only to get to the Super Bowl and find themselves as even more overwhelming underdogs agaisnt the undefeated and history chasing Patriots and they overcame those odds yet again!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 04, 2008, 10:32:00 AM
The play where Manning miraculously escaped the burning fort, threw up a hope and a prayer, and then had Tyree make that amazing catch was unbelievable.  The Giants were dead in the water, ballgame, and then that!  Tyree got two hands on it, then one hand plus a defender's hand pinning it against the top of his helmet, and then, finally, before hitting the ground, he got his second hand back on it!  A good game, and a spectacular fourth quarter, especially if you were rooting for the Giants.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2008, 02:28:35 PM
Congratulations to Oberlin's Mike Loll, the NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) and probably the best player nobody talks about.  Loll was recognized for his 48-point week which led directly to a win over Earlham that kept the Yeomen squarely in playoff contention.  Congratulations, Mike!

Honorable mention surely must go to Hiram's Mike McDevitt, whose 43-point effort Saturday failed to garner him this award most likely because a) it was in a losing effort and b) his teammate Mike Staley was last week's PotW.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 04, 2008, 03:18:47 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 04, 2008, 02:28:35 PM
Honorable mention surely must go to Hiram's Mike McDevitt, whose 43-point effort Saturday failed to garner him this award most likely because a) it was in a losing effort and b) his teammate Mike Staley was last week's PotW.

Additional honorable mention must go to Wooster's Evan Will, who set career highs in blocks (5 in Wednesday's tilt against the Gators), points (27 in the victory over OWU), and 3 pointers (4 against OWU) during the last week.

His stat line for the week was  41 points, 12 rebounds, two assists, five blocks and three steals, and he shot very well: 17-24 (.708) overall and 6-11 (.545) from three-point range.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 04, 2008, 03:43:33 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 04, 2008, 03:18:47 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 04, 2008, 02:28:35 PM
Honorable mention surely must go to Hiram's Mike McDevitt, whose 43-point effort Saturday failed to garner him this award most likely because a) it was in a losing effort and b) his teammate Mike Staley was last week's PotW.

Additional honorable mention must go to Wooster's Evan Will, who set career highs in blocks (5 in Wednesday's tilt against the Gators), points (27 in the victory over OWU), and 3 pointers (4 against OWU) during the last week.

His stat line for the week was  41 points, 12 rebounds, two assists, five blocks and three steals, and he shot very well: 17-24 (.708) overall and 6-11 (.545) from three-point range.
I was thinking that Will might have gotten the nod considering that his career night came in a crucial NCAC game against a contending OWU squad whereas Loll's efforts came in a win over bottom feeding Earlham and a loss to OWU.

FYI, a video clip of Johnson's block and Coop's subsequent trey is now viewable on the write-up page of Wooster's win.  Here's the link if anyone is interested:

Momentum Changer (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/recaps/2007-08/owu2.php)

One final note:

Wooster has been led in scoring by their 6th different player in their last 7 games.  With the exception of the Hiram and Wittenberg games where James Cooper took home scoring honors in those back to back games, 5 other players have led the team in scoring.  Starting with Wabash, it was Bryan Wickliffe.  Then Brandon Johnson led the way vs. Densison.  Devin Fulk had team honors against Earlham.  And Marty Bidwell and Will topped the list vs. Allegheny and OWU respectively.  Wooster is also a tenth of a percentage point from having 6 players averaging in double figures (Evan Will is at 9.9 ppg following his 27 point outburst)!  That's some serious balance and further proof that stopping Cooper isn't the solution to beating Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 04, 2008, 04:05:52 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 04, 2008, 03:43:33 PM
...and further proof that stopping Cooper isn't the solution to beating Wooster.

And kudos to Cooper for working so hard against OWU.  The James Cooper of two or three years ago, if the opposition was working so hard to deny him the ball, might have stood in the corner and become a spectator.  This year's version of Coop now does nothing of the sort; he spent the entire night working to get free and really earned the thirteen points that he scored.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 04, 2008, 04:56:35 PM
another big week of games for wooster-step 2 of the 3 game stretch on saturdays against the top 3 teams besides them in the NCAC---witt should be able to hold homecourt setting up a HUGE week next week that will determine the conference tournament picture
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Put_It_On_My_Tab on February 05, 2008, 04:17:20 PM
Can anyone believe the unbelievable amount of talent that Wabash has on its squad?  I mean they are just absolutely ridiculous....poised like a cat with claws of talent ready to pounce down the stretch.

I tabble in water paints.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 05, 2008, 04:40:11 PM
except for not being able to score for long periods of streches......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 06, 2008, 08:01:34 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 46  Hiram 27

Wooster is in control of this game already. :)  Leading scorers for the Scots are James Cooper with 12 points, Craig Elam with 7 points and Marty Bidwell with 7 points.

Hiram is being led by Mike Staley with 8 points and Chuck Williams with 6 points.

Wooster made 7 three pointers in the half and outrebounded the Terriers 21 to 14.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 06, 2008, 08:54:19 PM
Final:  Wooster 104  Hiram 61

Wooster cruised in the 2nd half to a lopsided win.  Scots were led by James Cooper with 21 points, Devin Fulk with 16 points, Marty Bidwell with 13 points and Craig Elam with 10 points.  Congrats to Devin Fulk on hitting his 1,000 point in his Wooster career (49% career three point shooter!). :)

Hiram was led tonight by Mike Staley with 12 points and Mike McDevitt with only 12 points (Bidwell applied the "D").

Wooster is now 17-3, 10-1 NCAC ;D   Next up is Wabash on Saturday
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 06, 2008, 09:10:38 PM
All the NCAC 2/6 Final Scores:

Ohio Wesleyan 86  Wabash 57
Wittenberg 70  Earlham 54
Allegheny 74  Oberlin 55
Wooster 104  Hiram 61
Kenyon 73  Denison 53

So, the top 5 in the standings are:

Wooster 10-1
Wittenberg 10-1
Ohio Wesleyan 8-3
Wabash 7-4
Kenyon 7-4
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 06, 2008, 09:12:34 PM
Ugh. That is all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 06, 2008, 09:23:34 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 06, 2008, 09:10:38 PM
NCAC 2/6 Final Scores:

Ohio Wesleyan 86  Wabash 57

Well that was unexpected.  Anyone in attendance care to lend an explanation?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 06, 2008, 09:24:57 PM
The OWU/Wabash score is really surprising. I just got back from the newly named Pam Evans Smith Arena-Wittenberg started the game on an 18-2 run, but struggled thereafter to find their shot. Earlham to their credit kept fighting, but Wittenberg seemed to struggle hitting shots all night long
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 06, 2008, 09:34:30 PM
Congratulations to Devin Fulk in becoming the 32nd Wooster Scots to hit the Grand threshold (pun intended). Checking the media guide, this is the 7th straight season the Scots have had a player hit that threshold. Under Coach Moore....

'87-'88  ---
'88-'89  Mike Trimmer
'89-'90  Matt Heistand
'90-'91  Stan Aukamp, Erich Reibe
'91-'92  ----
'92-'93  Brian Buchanan
'93-'94  Doug Cline, Scott Meech, Doug Meinen
'94-'95  ----
'95-'96  ----
'96-'97  ----
'97-'98  Ryan Gorman (I'm guessing on this one - it was either the very end of '98 or very beginning of next)
'98-'99  -----
'99-'00  John Ellenwood
'00-'01  -----
'01-'02  Antwyan Reynolds, Bryan Nelson
'02-'03  Matt Smith
'03-'04  Rodney Mitchell
'04-'05  Matt Shlingman
'05-'06  Tom Port, Kyle Witucky
'06-'07  Tim Vandervaart
'07-'08  Devin Fulk + probably Brandon Johnson (94 points away)

There have also been four 1500 point scorers (Erich Reibe '91-'92, Bryan Nelson '02-'03, Tom Port '06-'07, James Cooper '07-'08)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 06, 2008, 10:19:20 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 06, 2008, 09:23:34 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 06, 2008, 09:10:38 PM
NCAC 2/6 Final Scores:

Ohio Wesleyan 86  Wabash 57

Well that was unexpected.  Anyone in attendance care to lend an explanation?

My first-hand account would say that the score you see is a pretty good indication of how well these teams played tonight.  It was probably about 9-8 or 10-9 or so early, then OWU put together a run to push it out to double digits, took a 17-point lead into halftime, and the final was never in doubt throughout the second half.  It might have gotten down under 15, but when it was back out to around 20 and under 10 minutes, it seemed like Wabash just faded and lost the effort to try to get back in it.

My first time seeing Wabash this season.  Not impressed. Bash seemed pretty lackluster offensively all night long- not a lot of motion, some poor shot selection, etc. OWU had a tendency to turn the ball over a bit, but otherwise worked harder to find open looks, made more shots, and corralled a pretty good handful of offensive rebounds.

I would say that OWU played tonight approximately as well as they did against Wooster.  Wabash beating Wooster Saturday would be a huge upset in my book, based off of the Wabash team I saw tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2008, 11:23:30 PM
Yeah, this game was pretty much over at the tip.  The box score (http://bishops.owu.edu/2007-08/owum0206.htm) tells the whole story:

Shooting: OWU 48.4%, Wabash 36.5%
Three-point shooting: OWU 47.6% (10/21), Wabash 13.3% (2/15)
Rebounding: OWU 45, Wabash 27
Offensive rebounds: OWU 21 :o, Wabash 12

I don't want to be unkind (well...), but if the red jerseys had said "Denison" rather than "Wabash," the Bishops would not have been in firmer control of this game.

Wabash has to find a way to regroup before Saturday, or they'll be looking at a long bus ride to Gambier for the first round of the conference tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 06, 2008, 11:39:51 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 06, 2008, 11:23:30 PMI don't want to be unkind (well...), but if the red jerseys had said "Denison" rather than "Wabash," the Bishops would not have been in firmer control of this game,

This pretty much sums up what OWU did tonight:

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi30.tinypic.com%2F35mil38.jpg&hash=91873fb8e73bf19d498200d92fd0c8ffe443e6a5)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 06, 2008, 11:45:43 PM
Aside from not playing defense, not rebounding, and shooting poorly, Wabash did OK!

Yikes, boys, time to regroup!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2008, 12:02:10 AM
Quote from: goscots on February 06, 2008, 09:34:30 PM
Congratulations to Devin Fulk in becoming the 32nd Wooster Scots to hit the Grand threshold (pun intended).

Interesting to note that Fulk has just one career start.  That's gotta be pretty rare among 1,000 point scorers.

On the other hand, if Fulk and James Cooper stay healthy and continue to play, they'd set the Wooster record for games played after 5 post season games (e.g., 3 NCAC tourney and 2 NCAA tourney games), should Wooster get that far.  That would put them at 124 games for their careers, topping Kyle Witucky's 123.  And that was the NCAA D3 record when Kyle did it (whether it still is or not I'm not sure; Andrew Olson must be close.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 07, 2008, 10:29:17 AM
It was also fitting that Fulk hit the milestone by hitting a triple!  He will more than likely go down as Wooster's all-time leader in 3-point acuracy unless he goes into a monumental slump.  He's sitting at 48% for his career.  He's also on pace to shatter the career ft acuracy mark as well as he is sitting at cool 92% for his career.

Also of note, James Cooper is closing in on a record.  He is currently sitting in 3rd place in 3-point fg's made.  He is at 220 for his career which puts him only 2 back of Matt Smith for 2nd and he only needs 12 to surpass Tom Port at #1.  Devin is a ways back in this category sitting at 191 which is good enough for 5th all-time at Wooster.  If he can make 15 more he would pass Kyle Witucky and move into 4th. 

As far as Coop's quest for 2,000, that will take some effort, but it is still not out of reach.  If he were to average 26 ppg over the final 5 regular season games, he would reach 2,000.  Hypothetically, saying the Scots reach the NCAC finals and adding 3 games to that total, he would need to average just over 16 ppg to reach the milestone.  Should be fun to watch him chase down 2,000!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 07, 2008, 12:14:38 PM
No disrespect taken DC but the last time I checked Denison had OWU on the ropes and ended up losing by 13........NOT 30!!  You may wnat to check those uniforms again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2008, 08:30:58 PM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on February 07, 2008, 12:14:38 PM
No disrespect taken DC but the last time I checked Denison had OWU on the ropes and ended up losing by 13........NOT 30!!  You may wnat to check those uniforms again.

You're right; Denison did give OWU much more trouble in Delaware than the LGs did.  I certainly didn't mean to insult the Big Red by comparing them to Wabash!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2008, 10:01:20 AM
The LGs better step up tomorrow. If they reached their nadir on Wednesday, can they reach their zenith on Saturday?

/felt all SAT-like
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 08, 2008, 10:28:06 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2008, 10:01:20 AM
The LGs better step up tomorrow. If they reached their nadir on Wednesday, can they reach their zenith on Saturday?

/felt all SAT-like

Complete the analogy with the best response.

Wooster:Wabash::80:______

A) 79
B) 85
C) 68
D) 57
E) 92
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2008, 12:01:39 PM
Ohio Wesleyan's Dustin Rudegeair has been selected to the ESPN the Magazine Academic All-District first team for District IV. (http://bishops.owu.edu/2007-08/bb08acad.html)  As a first team selection, Rudegeair automatically becomes a nominee for the Academic All-American team.  Dustin carries a 3.71 GPA in phys. ed.  His teammate Kyle Holliday was named to the All-District second team, as was his OWU classmate Steffi Graf on the women's side.  Congratulations to these OWU standouts!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 08, 2008, 12:20:29 PM
At this point I think Denison would LOVE to be compared to Wabash or anyone else with a few more W's!!!!!!

With Oberlin at home on Saturday we may just get that elusive second victory.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 09, 2008, 12:14:23 PM
good luck witt today- a win sets up a huge week
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 09, 2008, 12:16:31 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2008, 12:01:39 PM
Ohio Wesleyan's Dustin Rudegeair has been selected to the ESPN the Magazine Academic All-District first team for District IV. (http://bishops.owu.edu/2007-08/bb08acad.html)  As a first team selection, Rudegeair automatically becomes a nominee for the Academic All-American team.  Dustin carries a 3.71 GPA in phys. ed.  His teammate Kyle Holliday was named to the All-District second team, as was his OWU classmate Steffi Graf on the women's side.

How's her backhand?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 09, 2008, 02:33:31 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 43  Wabash 37

Wooster is being led by Brandon Johnson with 9 points, James Cooper with 8 points, Devin Fulk with 6 pts., Craig Elam with 6 points and Evan Will also with 6.

Wabash leading scorers are Andrew Gilman with 8 points, Brian Maloney with 7 points, Gary Simkus with 6 points, and Aaron Brock with 6 points.

Now 6:21 Left to Play:  Wooster 70  Wabash 56 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 09, 2008, 03:30:04 PM
Final:  Wooster 83  Wabash 71 :)

Wooster was led by their All American James Cooper who had 20 points.  Next in scoring were Evan Will with 16 points, Brandon Johnson with 14 points, Marty Bidwell with 9 points and Bryan Wickliffe with 8 points (8 boards).

Wabash was led by Gary Simkus with 20 points, Andrew Zimmer with 12 points, Andrew Gilman with 8 points and Wesley Smith also with 8.

Wooster shot 50% from the floor vs. 43% for Wabash.  Scots outrebounded the Little Giants 36 to 32.

Wooster is now 18-3, 11-1 NCAC ;D  Next game is at Denison on 2/13

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 09, 2008, 03:49:41 PM
Wittenberg trails Alleghany at the half 37-33.  Even if Witt loses either this game or Wednesdays game against OWU, the matchup next Saturday will determine who hosts the tournament. If they lose both it is a different scenario.

Congratulations the the senior class of Devin Fulk, Evan Will and James Cooper for winning thier 100th contest (100-15), the sixth straight class to accomplish this.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 09, 2008, 04:51:09 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 09, 2008, 03:49:41 PM
Wittenberg trails Alleghany at the half 37-33.

Wittenberg won, 78-66.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 09, 2008, 04:56:17 PM
Also,

Hiram 71
Ohio Wesleyan 85


Can't find any scores for Kenyon-Earlham or Oberlin-Denison yet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 09, 2008, 05:22:00 PM
Big Red VICTORY!!!!!  78-74
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 09, 2008, 05:31:30 PM
Have to give props to Denison for not giving up on the season....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 09, 2008, 06:50:18 PM
Wabash, take heart...

Kenyon 63
Earlham 64

Earlham's Tristan Gregory has 32, 11-17 from the floor, 6-9 from 3 including the game-winner with 6 seconds left.  Sounds like he really carried Earlham to victory today.

Kenyon has a write-up (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26338.xml) on the game on its website.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 09, 2008, 07:20:02 PM
Whoa....

The Quake shock the Lords...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2008, 11:43:35 PM
Maybe today's unbelievable result from Richmond will bring Billy and/or EA out of their self-imposed exile.  :)

So the standings look like this:
1a. Wittenberg 11-1 (Witt has tie-breaker on head-to-head results)
1b. Wooster 11-1
3. OWU 9-3
4a. Wabash 7-5*
4b. Kenyon 7-5
6. Allegheny 5-7
7. Hiram 4-8
8. Oberlin 3-9
9. Denison 2-10
10. Earlham 1-11

* I can never remember whether the tie-breaker (after head-to-head) is best win or worst loss, but Wabash had both: the best win is their victory over #3 OWU, and the worst loss is Kenyon's loss to #10 Earlham.

Wabash has Earlham and Oberlin at C'ville, then trips to Wittenberg and Denison remaining.  Kenyon travels to Oberlin, hosts Allegheny, goes to Hiram, then closes the season at Gambier against Wittenberg, and they'd better plan on winning all four if they want to host the 4/5 game two weeks from Tuesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 10, 2008, 12:03:43 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 09, 2008, 11:43:35 PM
* I can never remember whether the tie-breaker (after head-to-head) is best win or worst loss, but Wabash had both: the best win is their victory over #3 OWU, and the worst loss is Kenyon's loss to #10 Earlham.


I believe the NCAC does worst loss.  The OAC does best win, and I remember from last year thinking that the two leagues used different ones.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 10, 2008, 01:48:05 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 09, 2008, 11:43:35 PM* I can never remember whether the tie-breaker (after head-to-head) is best win or worst loss

Can we add worst win and best loss?  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2008, 08:15:01 PM
This week's NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) is Denison's Brian Elder, who recorded 29 points in two games.  Congratulations, Brian!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 10, 2008, 08:38:45 PM
running out of players to give the award to? just kidding
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2008, 09:45:52 PM
It's just that my usual enthusiasm for this award is dampened by a touch of the flu, that's all.  I'll admit that there seems to be a "Denison's turn" aspect to this, especially when one considers Tristian Gregory's week (http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/2007-08/press_releases/pr020908.html), but it happens all the time and I've never let that bother me. 

Brian Elder is the senior leader of a team that could very easily have thrown in the towel weeks (even months) ago.  That they didn't, and still play hard right to the finish of every game, is largely because of his hard work and inspirational leadership.  He's constantly giving pep talks and back slaps to his teammates, all of whom clearly look up to him.  Is he the best post in the league, even the best post this week?  No.  But he exemplifies a lot of what's right about our league, and I think he's very deserving of league recognition for his efforts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 11, 2008, 08:05:16 AM
Well said David.  I think a lot of credit has to go to Coach Ghiloni as well.  It had to be rough to not only have the losses to graduation that Denison sufferred, but also the losses of kids just quitting on the program.  I'm sure that he felt like he was running a sinking ship at some points this season and to his credit, he has been able to keep the ship from sinking completely.  Let's hope that the young kids Ghiloni has now are buying in to what he's trying to accomplish and they can continue to build Denison instead of leaving Ghiloni with another major rebuilding project.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 11, 2008, 09:27:08 AM
To clarify, i wasn't trying to take a hit on Mr. NCAC for the week, i was just trying to make a light-hearted attempt at some humor. Please forgive me....geez

Anyways, as noted before Wittenberg's game against Ohio Wesleyan essentially has little impact on Saturday's game at Wooster conference standings-wise because whether Witt wins or loses they control their own destiny as the cliche goes. However, i think form a mental standpoint playing OWU will allow Witt the chance to avenge a tough loss from earlier in the year. Should be a great week of basketball for Witt fans-that is the ones that actually show up to the games.......that's a whole other issue.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2008, 11:38:38 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 11, 2008, 09:27:08 AM
To clarify, i wasn't trying to take a hit on Mr. NCAC for the week, i was just trying to make a light-hearted attempt at some humor. Please forgive me....geez

I know that.  I just felt like I needed to expand on my less-than-normally-enthusiastic first post on this subject.  :)

Current odds on next week's NCAC Player of the Week:
George Raftis 3:2
Bill Babe 4:1
Charlie Jaicks 6:1
Ben Torsney 6:1
Field 40:1
;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 11, 2008, 11:39:20 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 11, 2008, 09:27:08 AM
However, i think form a mental standpoint playing OWU will allow Witt the chance to avenge a tough loss from earlier in the year.

However, I think from a mental standpoint playing Witt will allow Wooster the chance to avenge a tough loss from earlier in the year... :P  ;)  ;D

Sorry penn but I couldn't resist! 8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 11, 2008, 04:12:22 PM
It's ok-I'm sure i'll have a counterpunch later on this week ;)

FYI-the NCAC was "well represented" in the all-decade teams released today........take a look and you'll see what i mean. I can't really argue against any of the picks. The name Brandon Adair of VWU brings back chills thinking about the 2006 Final Four......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2008, 04:31:29 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 11, 2008, 04:12:22 PM
FYI-the NCAC was "well represented" in the all-decade teams released today........take a look and you'll see what i mean.

Yeah, well, y'know, there's never been a postseason 1st team D3hoops.com All-American from an NCAC school, which I think means we were ineligible from the start.  I guess we just suck.

Now if Brian Elder had gone to a CCIW school.... ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 11, 2008, 05:06:40 PM
Oh, not completely ineligible, but it made the odds long, to be sure. We didn't have a stated rule against it but it would make it difficult.

I mentioned this in the Daily Dose but will repeat -- I think you'll see James Cooper on the 2000s All-Decade Team when we name that in a few years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2008, 05:25:28 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 11, 2008, 04:31:29 PM


Yeah, well, y'know, there's never been a postseason 1st team D3hoops.com All-American from an NCAC school, which I think means we were ineligible from the start.  I guess we just suck.


Ah, it's a team sport anyway, right??

RIGHT???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 11, 2008, 05:26:57 PM
how about some love for Daniel Russ then maybe????-can't think of any other players other than him and James Cooper who could have that big-no pun intended- of an impact on a team's gameplan
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on February 11, 2008, 07:59:42 PM
Bryan Nelson ring a bell
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 11, 2008, 10:00:02 PM
on to another pressing issue.....what is there to do before a Witt/Wooster game in Wooster in terms of pregaming or bars?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2008, 10:22:06 PM
Quote from: Vanilla24COW on February 11, 2008, 07:59:42 PM
Bryan Nelson ring a bell

K+ to Vanilla24COW for mentioning the Wooster player, Bryan Nelson, who should have been on the All Decade Team! :)

Bryan Nelson's Amazing Career Stats:
1,957 Total Points Scored
961 Total Rebounds
60.1% Shooting on Field Goals
82.5% Shooting on Free Throws

Those career numbers and shooting %'s are better than some of the players (Forwards/Centers) who were selected to the All Decade Team by D3Hoops (I did some research ;)).

Bryan Nelson was selected as a First Team All-American and the National Player of the Year in 2002-2003 by the National Assoc. of Basketball Coaches (not by D3Hoops).  In his senior season, Nelson scored 645 points, shot 64.4% from the floor and 88.5% from the charity stripe (amazing %'s).

Nelson led Wooster in scoring during his sophomore, junior and senior seasons.  During his career, Wooster made the NCAA tournament 3 times highlighted by their national 3rd place finish in the 2002-2003 Final Four when Nelson played on a badly sprained ankle and Wooster lost the semi-final to eventual champ Williams by only 2 points.

One quick anecdote from a game that I attended.  In 2000-2001, Wooster played Carthage in the 2nd round of the NCAA tourney.  Carthage big man Jason Wiertel who is on the All Decade Team was a junior that season and at 6'8", he was 4 inches taller than Nelson.  Wooster lost the game but sophomore Nelson dropped 28 points (10 of 15 FGs) and 14 boards on Wiertel who could not stop him.  Wiertel, another All-American, had a below average game with only 15 points and 5 boards.

Bryan Nelson is currently Wooster's all time #2 scorer (after Tom Dinger) though James Cooper does have a chance to surpass him.  Congrats again to Bryan Nelson on a stellar career at Wooster!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2008, 10:37:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 11, 2008, 04:31:29 PM
Yeah, well, y'know, there's never been a postseason 1st team D3hoops.com All-American from an NCAC school, which I think means we were ineligible from the start.  I guess we just suck.

Now if Brian Elder had gone to a CCIW school.... ::)

Good one DC! :)   Now if Bryan Nelson had gone to a CCIW school...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on February 11, 2008, 11:29:05 PM
Bryan Nelson was a special player.  I'll never forget his performance in Salem in 2003.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 11, 2008, 11:31:31 PM
Agreed. It's rare we move someone up on the All-American team based solely on a semifinal game but we did with Nelson, as I recall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 12, 2008, 07:27:51 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 11, 2008, 10:00:02 PM
on to another pressing issue.....what is there to do before a Witt/Wooster game in Wooster in terms of pregaming or bars?

I would say Coccia House.  Great pizza!!!  Ok bar. 

The Old Jaol & CW Burgersteins would be good too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 12, 2008, 07:42:58 AM
Bryan Nelson not making the All-Decade team is comical.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2008, 09:42:03 AM
Well, you can't please everyone, you know.

I think Josh Estelle at Wabash was a special player but I am realistic that he wasn't among the 8 best guards in the D3 world the past 10 years.

And it's not all about the stats. Shooting 60%, while great, isn't as impressive as shooting 50% with a repertoire of outside shots and inside moves, including threes.

There were many fine, special players that didn't make it. There were fine, special players that did.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 12, 2008, 11:16:59 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 12, 2008, 09:42:03 AM
There were fine, special players that did.
Yeah, and they were all from the CCIW or the WIAC... ::)

I was going to make the Nelson argument as well.  After all, he was the NABC DIII POY for the 2002-03 season.  But, then I looked to see where he finished on the D3hoops.com AA team and they had him as only a 4th teamer.  ???  And he would have been lower than that had it not been for his performance in Salem? ???  Now I  realize why he wasn't included on the All-Decade team...

One other note about Nelson that I found impressive.  Wasn't he the first player under Moore's tenure at Wooster to average over 20 ppg?  And that was back in the days before Wooster made the switch to their current guard oriented, up-tempo offense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2008, 12:44:22 PM
Well, ya know, the CCIW and WIAC are always amongst the top conferences in D-3. Except for Witt and Woo (and occasional decent OWU and Wabash teams), the NCAC, not so much.

I guess you can blame the company that Nelson kept. Beating up Hiram, Oberlin and Denison in the regular season isn't that impressive to the D-3 cognesceti even if Wooster held its own during the NCAA tourney and finished third his senior year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2008, 01:47:47 PM
Amongst, sure.  But 44% of the all-decade team is from these two conferences, 28% from the CCIW alone (heck, 12% from Illinois Wesleyan alone!).  That's not amongst, that's overwhelming.  And it smells funny. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2008, 02:50:24 PM
Well, I know Titan Q has a lot of pull around here.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on February 12, 2008, 03:25:38 PM
Forgot about his matchup with Wiertel, he also outplayed the vastly overrated IMO Derek Reich whose Chicago Maroons played in the 00-01 Mose Hole (well showed up)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2008, 04:28:53 PM
Of course, that was ONE game you saw, and it was a home game for Nelson and Wooster. And frankly, putting up excellent numbers in the UAA is much more impressive than the same numbers in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 12, 2008, 04:54:27 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 12, 2008, 01:47:47 PM
Amongst, sure.  But 44% of the all-decade team is from these two conferences, 28% from the CCIW alone (heck, 12% from Illinois Wesleyan alone!).  That's not amongst, that's overwhelming.  And it smells funny. 

Before you get too far into conspiracy territory, who among Korey Coon, Adam Dauksas, and Keelan Amelianovich do you think is unworthy of their selection?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 12, 2008, 05:00:13 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 12, 2008, 01:47:47 PM
Amongst, sure.  But 44% of the all-decade team is from these two conferences, 28% from the CCIW alone (heck, 12% from Illinois Wesleyan alone!).  That's not amongst, that's overwhelming.  And it smells funny. 

No Illinois Wesleyan representative had any say in the players selected to the All-Decade team. Only Gordon Mann, Mark Simon and I were on the "selection committee."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 12, 2008, 05:15:26 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 12, 2008, 04:54:27 PM
Before you get too far into conspiracy territory, who among Korey Coon, Adam Dauksas, and Keelan Amelianovich do you think is unworthy of their selection?

Nice try at loading the question, but it's full of blanks.  The answer?  Compared to Nelson, all of them.  I saw Nelson play almost all of his home games and a handful of road games.  From his junior year forward, every time he stepped onto the court he was the best player out there, and that includes those playoff games his senior year when he was playing on one leg.

You guys chose to ignore him, one of ten DIII players of the year during this decade, leaving him completely off a list of 25 players?  Alright, it's your ball and your choice.  But Pat, at some point during that 2001 Final Four, I'm almost sure that you said Bryan Nelson was the most impressive player that you'd seen at the Final Four.  So, basically, I don't get it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 12, 2008, 05:26:13 PM
Who are you talking to, Ypsi or me?

Nelson, as mentioned, wasn't one of OUR players of the decade. Ask the NABC for their All-Decade Team if that's a measurement you want to use.

Like most people complaining about a team, you have only seen a few players on this list and one of them you've seen many times. Just because Nelson was the best player in the games you saw doesn't mean he was one of the 25 best players out of 19,000 starting slots over those 10 years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 12, 2008, 05:31:14 PM
Here's what I said (in 2003, of course, not 2001):

http://www.d3hoops.com/salem/03/wrapup.htm

Most Unbelievable Player: Bryan Nelson, Wooster. We don't know how he did it, but he did. And then he came out in the third-place game and did it again. As meaningless as the third-place game can be if one or both teams aren't motivated to play, perhaps we should have let it also influence our All-American picks.

That's the most unbelievable player of two games, yes. That doesn't mean I can throw out the other nine years of the decade, however. There are a LOT of players.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 12, 2008, 05:51:28 PM
Geeze, wasn't his picture even on the old home page of d3hoops as the poster boy of "posting up"?

I know there are a lot of players.  I know that I saw none of them except for Tori Davis.  I know Nelson wasn't a d3hoops player of the year.  I just find it extremely hard to believe that division three basketball has had so many guys better than him in the last ten years.  That Wooster team that he took to the final four did not have anywhere near the talent that these more recent teams do.  He carried them through the playoffs on his shoulders, with a bad ankle to boot, and nearly pulled off a championship.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2008, 05:59:47 PM
Who I would or wouldn't have on such a team is no more interesting or relevant than any other fan.  But I wouldn't approach the question from a position that the CCIW, its teams, players, and coaches, are the best unless and until proven otherwise.  And I often get the sense that this is the way the D3 world is viewed around here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 12, 2008, 06:16:47 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 12, 2008, 05:59:47 PM
Who I would or wouldn't have on such a team is no more interesting or relevant than any other fan.  But I wouldn't approach the question from a position that the CCIW, its teams, players, and coaches, are the best unless and until proven otherwise.  And I often get the sense that this is the way the D3 world is viewed around here.

Substitute "OAC" for "CCIW" and you've got the football board.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 12, 2008, 06:36:39 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 12, 2008, 05:59:47 PM
Who I would or wouldn't have on such a team is no more interesting or relevant than any other fan.  But I wouldn't approach the question from a position that the CCIW, its teams, players, and coaches, are the best unless and until proven otherwise.  And I often get the sense that this is the way the D3 world is viewed around here.

David, that wasn't my point (and, of course, I had nothing to do with the selection of the all-decade team), but you singled out my team as receiving 12% of the selections shortly before saying "it smells funny".  In that context, I don't think it was at all inappropriate (or confrontational) to ask who would you say was not worthy.

WooBoo, I never saw Bryan Nelson, but you've acknowleged that you never saw Coon, Dauksas, or Amelianovich, so I doubt this debate would go anywhere! ;)  Titan Q (whose judgment I greatly respect) already said Nelson was fantastic (for those games, at least), so I don't doubt he may have been worthy.  But please don't cast aspersions on the Titans you haven't seen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 12, 2008, 07:10:36 PM
Mr. Ypsi -

I'm not sure what you mean by casting aspersions.  I'm not in any way saying that those three players are not very good basketball players.  (And, actually, I did see Dauksas and Amelianovich on a webcast or two, for whatever that's worth)  When I say that I believe Bryan Nelson is better than all of them, it only indicates my regard for his level of play.

This whole thing is just amazing to me.  When I first saw mention that an All-Decade team was going to be chosen I was absolutely sure that Bryan Nelson would not only be on it, but if there was going to be a player of the decade, that he would merit some very serious consideration for that honor.  I'm just in complete disbelief that he could be left off the whole top 25.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 12, 2008, 07:56:52 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 12, 2008, 05:59:47 PM
Who I would or wouldn't have on such a team is no more interesting or relevant than any other fan.  But I wouldn't approach the question from a position that the CCIW, its teams, players, and coaches, are the best unless and until proven otherwise.  And I often get the sense that this is the way the D3 world is viewed around here.

They've had a lot of individually talented players over the past decade. That's all this is measuring.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 12, 2008, 08:23:12 PM
Come on, guys, you know better.  What is the one thing that Pat Coleman has always taught us over the years?  That he is always right, and those who disagree with him with have the smiting gods to answer to.

Now, onto this week's games.  Does anyone think OWU will win in Springfield tomorrow night?  I was originally worried that Witt would look past OWU heading into the first-place clash at Wooster and be prone to defeat, but I think the worst thing OWU did in regards to this game was beating Witt in the first game.  I can't see the Tigers losing this one at home when (presumably) revenge is on their minds.  Thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on February 12, 2008, 08:29:56 PM
Just a reminder that the way the D3hoops.com All-American teams are setup up (and always have been), guys like Adam Dauksas and Keelan Amelianovich are not in competition with a Bryan Nelson for spots.  Dauksas is compared with other point-guards, Amelianovich with other wings (G/F's), and Nelson with other low post players (F/C).

The debate should be whether or not Nelson should have made it over guys like Tori Davis/Adam Doll (HM), Rich Melzer/Jason Wiertel (4th team), and Brandon Adair/Joel Kolmodin (3rd team).  Dauksas and Amelianovich did not keep the former Wooster star off the team.  (I know there was some Wiertel vs Nelson discussion above, and that is more on-point.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2008, 08:52:15 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 12, 2008, 08:23:12 PM
Come on, guys, you know better.  What is the one thing that Pat Coleman has always taught us over the years?  That he is always right, and those who disagree with him with have the smiting gods to answer to.
As unhappy as I am over this issue, I don't think it's reasonable to believe that Pat sits there smiting those who dare disagree with him, and I am quite certain that he doesn't run a "smiting ring."  After all, my karma actually has gone up since I vented my frustrations.

QuoteNow, onto this week's games.  Does anyone think OWU will win in Springfield tomorrow night?  I was originally worried that Witt would look past OWU heading into the first-place clash at Wooster and be prone to defeat, but I think the worst thing OWU did in regards to this game was beating Witt in the first game.  I can't see the Tigers losing this one at home when (presumably) revenge is on their minds.  Thoughts?
I think these two teams are too good for either to "look past" the other.  They are very evenly matched, and it should be a battle to the end.  I certainly think that OWU could win the game, and I wish I could be there to see it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 12, 2008, 10:34:12 PM
OWU-Witt should be a great game.  Certainly there is a revenge factor in play, but at the same time, I imagine that OWU would love to pull off a regular season sweep of Witt (who wouldn't?)  ;D  Wooster pulled off a regular season sweep of Witt in '05-06-- no one else has done that to Witt since both Wooster and Earlham turned the feat during the '99-00 season.

(Though, maybe the Tigers should root for the regular season sweep...since we know how that 05-06 team panned out...)   ;)  :D ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 12, 2008, 11:18:37 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 12, 2008, 08:52:15 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 12, 2008, 08:23:12 PM
Come on, guys, you know better.  What is the one thing that Pat Coleman has always taught us over the years?  That he is always right, and those who disagree with him with have the smiting gods to answer to.
As unhappy as I am over this issue, I don't think it's reasonable to believe that Pat sits there smiting those who dare disagree with him, and I am quite certain that he doesn't run a "smiting ring."  After all, my karma actually has gone up since I vented my frustrations.

Indeed -- I think people with well-reasoned arguments tend to get rewarded better than people who primarily use backbiting sarcasm. Posters who follow other people around the board just to engage them in arguments tend to have negative karma. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 13, 2008, 12:06:09 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 12, 2008, 11:18:37 PM
Indeed -- I think people with well-reasoned arguments tend to get rewarded better than people who primarily use backbiting sarcasm.

You know, when you put it that way, you kind of make a point.  I mean, who ever would have thought that sarcasm could be criticized by using . . . sarcasm!   ::)

Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 12, 2008, 11:18:37 PM
Posters who follow other people around the board just to engage them in arguments tend to have negative karma. :)

Not sure what you mean there, considering the only times I've ever gotten into arguments with you (or anyone else, for that matter) were on NCAC boards, with the exception of that time you posted that Amherst article without giving proper credit and I commented on their board.

And quite honestly, I gave up on caring about my own karma a long time ago.  Sure, some people get it because they have great points and insight, but most of the time, it's just a reflection of how many posters from your school there are.

Sorry everybody for the sidetrack.  Back to our regularly scheduled NCAC discusson...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 13, 2008, 12:23:12 AM
Dunno, man -- you specifically interjected into conversations you weren't participating in twice in the past couple of weeks just to give me a hard time. They may be on NCAC boards but it's fairly clear that my involvement is the only reason you chose to speak up.

Sorry that I inspire such behavior from you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 13, 2008, 03:44:43 AM
Quote from: Titan Q on February 12, 2008, 08:29:56 PM
Just a reminder that the way the D3hoops.com All-American teams are setup up (and always have been), guys like Adam Dauksas and Keelan Amelianovich are not in competition with a Bryan Nelson for spots.  Dauksas is compared with other point-guards, Amelianovich with other wings (G/F's), and Nelson with other low post players (F/C).

The debate should be whether or not Nelson should have made it over guys like Tori Davis/Adam Doll (HM), Rich Melzer/Jason Wiertel (4th team), and Brandon Adair/Joel Kolmodin (3rd team).  Dauksas and Amelianovich did not keep the former Wooster star off the team.  (I know there was some Wiertel vs Nelson discussion above, and that is more on-point.)

What Bob says is true, although the details are actually a bit different. The positions d3hoops.com uses aren't "point guard", "wing", and "low-post", they're "guard", "forward", and "center". The idea is to get two guards, two forwards, and a center onto each team, even though the actual players named don't always strictly correspond to a point guard, an off guard, a small forward, a power forward, and a center. This is in order to give Pat some flexibility in creating the teams. F'rinstance, the capsule that I wrote for Jason Wiertel as a part of his being named to the All-Decade team mentions that he was a power forward, even though he's listed on the All-Decade team as a center. Wiertel played alongside a pair of true centers at Carthage: Bill Garner during Wiertel's freshman and sophomore seasons, and Jim Oboikowich during Wiertel's junior and senior seasons. Garner and Oboikowich were (and are!) seriously burly individuals whose job for the Redmen was to rebound, set baseline screens, defend opposing centers, and to never under any circumstances move further than eight feet from the basket at either end of the floor. Wiertel was technically the center whenever Bosko Djurickovic went small and took Garner or Oboikowich out of the game and put in an extra guard such as Brett Nishibayashi or Bart Fabian, but the typical Carthage lineup during the Redmen's glory years featured Garner or Oboikowich at the 5 (center) and Wiertel at the 4 (power forward).

I don't have a problem with Wiertel being named as a center rather than at his true position, because the principle Pat employs is this: Could these five individuals play together as a team? The answer is yes -- if you put Michael Crotty, Kyle Myrick, Keelan Amelianovich, Rich Melzer, and Jason Wiertel on the floor together in uniforms of the same color, they would slide easily into their listed 1-2-3-4-5 roles and be quite effective in doing so.

(As an aside, wooscotsfan said that Wiertel could not stop Bryan Nelson when Carthage and Wooster met in the 2001 tourney. Are you sure that Wiertel was guarding Nelson? It could've easily been Oboikowich who drew that duty, inasmuch as Nelson was Wooster's primary interior threat. I wasn't at that game, so I'm just asking.)

The only time I ever saw Bryan Nelson play he was not impressive. Then again, I'm not going to judge him based upon that one game. I know that he was a great player, because the numbers don't lie and because lots of people in whose opinions I put stock have told me that he was a great player. If anything, I respect him more because he played hurt; I have a tendency to personally favor players who play through debilitating injuries (e.g., Joel Kolmodin of Wheaton). I would simply caution those of you who are doing their utmost to defend Bryan Nelson to avoid casting aspersions upon any other player based upon having seen him play one game, in the face of all other evidence to the contrary (i.e., Derek Reich was "vastly overrated", in spite of the fact that he was a three-time All-American first-teamer, four-time UAA MVP, and scored 2,254 career points). After all, a player doesn't even get to be a part of this discussion unless he was truly great.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on February 13, 2008, 09:31:29 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 13, 2008, 03:44:43 AM

I don't have a problem with Wiertel being named as a center rather than at his true position, because the principle Pat employs is this: Could these five individuals play together as a team? The answer is yes -- if you put Michael Crotty, Kyle Myrick, Keelan Amelianovich, Rich Melzer, and Jason Wiertel on the floor together in uniforms of the same color, they would slide easily into their listed 1-2-3-4-5 roles and be quite effective in doing so.

No matter what we call the positions, yes, this is really the important point about the D3hoops.com All-American teams - Pat & Co. construct teams that could actually play together.  I like this approach a lot because, a) it values the importance of each position, and  b) it allows for like players to be compared. 

Many (most?) All-American/All-conference teams just take the 5 players with the best offensive stats.  The D3hoops.com approach considers the importance of a point-guard, for example, who may only score 12 ppg, but dishes out 5-6 assists per game, takes care of the basketball, and is the floor general.  Most AA squads would take a 2-guard who scores 18 ppg over most PG's.  Preseason 1st Team All-American Andrew Olson (Amherst) is a great example - just 11.2 ppg this year, but 7.2 apg, and a 2.1 A:TO ratio.  Olson probably doesn't make a lot of your typically structured AA teams.  (Now, every now and then, D3hoops will have two SG's on one team when the case is compelling, but I think you will find most 5-man teams have a PG.)

In the frontcourt, even though D3hoops picks two forwards and a center, it's still clear from history, they try to pick one Small Forward type (either a pure wing like Amelianovich, or a 3/4 type, like Dworak or Kalsow), and then two "low post" players, who I refer to as "F/C's."  Obviously with these guys, the big stats are points, rebounds, and probably FG%.  Again, the way D3hoops.com does it, they can evaluate similar players, as opposed to comparing John Grotberg, who shoots a million 3's per game for Grinnell, to Dan Russ, who used to bang down low for Wittenberg.

I think all of this is very important in the Bryan Nelson discussion, because obviously Bryan Nelson fits into the two F/C spots.  He wasn't a 3/4...he was a 4/5.  The All-Decade team doesn't mean that Nelson wasn't considered one of the top 25 players of the past 10 years -- it means he wasn't considered one of the top 10 4/5's.  I think as you really dig into the merits of Adam Doll, Tori Davis, Rich Melzer, Jason Wiertel, etc., you find that they all have tremendous resumes (as does Nelson) and that there was no way to avoid leaving off great players.  I don't think IWU's Zach Freeman should have made the team over the players chosen, for example, but Freeman was an absolute stud...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F2EANANcrj8

There are a bunch a tremendous D3 players not on the All-Decade team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 13, 2008, 09:31:58 AM
(Though, maybe the Tigers should root for the regular season sweep...since we know how that 05-06 team panned out...)      

ok, you win but i'd take that season back to watch again any day of the week....

As for these "All-Decade" teams, maybe it is an attribute that no Wooster and Wittenberg players were selected as they are "team" basketball teams, so look at the overall success of the two programs and that is our satisfaction.

On to game of importance #1 for Wittenberg for the week. As noted before i think this will be a very competitive game and a good warmup for Saturday-i don't think this game will fatigue Witt as we've seen the players usually step up to a whole other level for Witt/Wooster games...

And leave jscwittfan alone-we can't help it we're completely outnumbered
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 13, 2008, 09:56:02 AM
If I were the Scots coach I would play the starters for 5 minutes tonight against the Big Red.  Denison only has 4 games left for the year.  Getting a back screen from Elder and Cooper ends up in the 3 row of the bleachers would not be a good thing.  Coming off his POW performance you never know.

Wooster was up by 30 at half the last time these teams played.  The reserves added another 10 points in the second half.  If it were up to me I would not take the chance to getting ANYONE hurt.  Not that they would, but there is always a chance.  Sit your guns down and go for home field advantage Saturday night.

Denison has NOTHING to lose.  The Scots have everything to lose if they lost a key player.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 13, 2008, 09:57:53 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 13, 2008, 12:06:09 AM
And quite honestly, I gave up on caring about my own karma a long time ago.  Sure, some people get it because they have great points and insight, but most of the time, it's just a reflection of how many posters from your school there are.
Or if you are one of the 'popular' kids...

I'm with you on the karma thing jsc.  I think it's more of a popularity contest than anything.  There's only one person who I will admit to 'smiting' on a regular basis and that is 'Spence' from over on the Baseball boards.  And I'm far from alone as his -179 karma rating will attest... ::)  But beyond that, I really don't pay much attention to it.  What does it really prove anyways.  I mean, jscwittfan doesn't come off to me as someone fitting Pat's description of posters who have negative karma:

Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 12, 2008, 11:18:37 PM
I think people with well-reasoned arguments tend to get rewarded better than people who primarily use backbiting sarcasm. Posters who follow other people around the board just to engage them in arguments tend to have negative karma.

Yet, with his -18 rating one might jump to that assumption and be quicker to smite him...  I just personally think the whole karma thing is silly and really don't pay all that much attention to it.

What it all boils down to is that you shouldn't upset the 'Karma Police' (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Ay699qcSb4)   8)

Sorry about the rant.  Now back to more important NCAC discussions... :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 13, 2008, 10:22:38 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 12, 2008, 08:23:12 PM
Now, onto this week's games.  Does anyone think OWU will win in Springfield tomorrow night?  I was originally worried that Witt would look past OWU heading into the first-place clash at Wooster and be prone to defeat, but I think the worst thing OWU did in regards to this game was beating Witt in the first game.  I can't see the Tigers losing this one at home when (presumably) revenge is on their minds.  Thoughts?
Indeed!

As far as your question about who will win tonight, I haven't made up my mind.  Witt has shown they seem to play in spurts this season (except against Wooster  :)).  Look at the Hiram game for example.  Witt jumps out to an 18 point lead at halftime only to let the Terriers rally to within two before icing the game at the ft line to win by six.  I just think if Witt can play a complete game, they should win. 

One other question I have is what the heck got into OWU last Wednesday vs. Wabash?  Was it a matter of Wabash just not showing up, or did OWU pretty much play a flawless game of basketball?  If OWU plays like they they did vs. Wabash, I would think they would be tough for anybody to beat them.  The problem is, that's about the only time they've played like that all season...

All in all, I think it boils down to defense.  Witt can't afford any defensive lapses like the one that occurred in the Hiram game.  Should be a real good game tonight down in Springfield.

As for this game fatiguing Witt for Saturday's game...  As penn put it, don't count on it because Bill Brown always finds a way to have his players ready to play on a whole other level when it comes to the Witt/Woo game.  As I've always said, something is triggered when Witt players see the Black and Old Gold.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 13, 2008, 01:39:35 PM
What's up guys.  I am begining to post on the forum.  I am a former player for the Quakers, who was refered to as a dirty player a few years ago.  I had read all of your posts though out my years at Earlham, enjoyed some and disagreed with some.  Buts that not here nor there.

But something that I wanted to bring up that was in the article on the front page of d3hoops.  I was regarding the strength of schedules of teams in D3.  Here are the strength of schedules for the teams in the conference.  I wanted to hear form you guys about the schedules of the teams, where they rank, and how our teams would far in the tourament.  Do you guys think that the scheduling these teams do hurt them when it comes to tournament time and how they far if they make the tournament?


WOOSTER  133
WITTENBERG 352
OHIO WESLYAN 74
WABASH 81
KENYON 267
ALLEGHENY 271
HIRAM 101
OBERLIN 378
DENISON 253
EARLHAM 292
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on February 13, 2008, 02:55:50 PM
Interesting note from last night's Kentucky - Vanderbilt game.  The 41 point margin of defeat is the sixth worst in Kentucky basketball history.

The third worst defeat for Kentucky remains its 47 point loss to Wabash on January 6, 1925, by the score of 57-10.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 13, 2008, 04:20:49 PM
Quote from: ECHOOPER on February 13, 2008, 01:39:35 PM
I wanted to hear form you guys about the schedules of the teams, where they rank, and how our teams would far in the tourament.  Do you guys think that the scheduling these teams do hurt them when it comes to tournament time and how they far if they make the tournament?
Welcome to the board Hooper.  I hope I wasn't one of the ones calling you a dirty player. ;)

With regards to your question, there really isn't a lot that NCAC teams can do outside of making their non-conference schedule as difficult as possible.  Until we seed some consistent improvement from the mid to lower tier teams in the league, this will not change.  Wooster has tried hard to beef up their non-conference schedule in recent years and I think it has paid off as evidenced by their 2 trips to Salem in the last 4 years.  Wittenberg has also scheduled some tougher competition for their non-conference schedule and you can't argue with their post-season success either.  Really, Wooster and Wittenberg are the only two teams worth discussing since no other conference team has qualified for the NCAA Tournament in recent memory.  All in all, it's mostly the NCAC itself that brings the strengths of schedules of all of it's members down.  And overall, I wouldn't say that it plays too big of a factor in how much post season success is or isn't achieved.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 13, 2008, 07:32:32 PM
We're getting ready for tip at Chadwick.  Right off the bat I have to say that if things go south for the LGs tonight, I've got nobody to blame but myself.  I forgot to swap my trusty SF Giants hat with the traditional game night Wabash hat.  Hopefully the LGs will be able to pick me up here. 

Starting lineups are on the floor and we're about to put the ball in the air.  Go Wabash!

19:22 - Simkus scores the first basket after rebounding a Wes Smith miss.  Worth noting that Wes has his left wrist and thumb pretty heavily taped.  Already I can tell that he'd rather  not use that hand for anything tonight.  Back to the action and Zimmer scores after another Wabash offensive rebound.  4-0 Wabash. 

17:32 - Simkus scores again in the paint.  Already Wabash is dominating the paint harder than Congress dominated McNamee today.  Zimmer hits a three pointer and Wabash is up 9-0.  Timeout for Coach Justus. 

15:00 - Tristan Gregory gets Earlham on the board with a driving basket.  He also drew a foul on Brock on made the free throw.  11-3 Wabash. 

11:29 - Zimmer scores on a putback from another Wes Smith miss.  We're at 18-6 here.  I love Wesley's game, but looking ahead to his bright future here, he'll have to really improve his finishing skills.  And before we save the post Haltom buries a three pointer.  21-6 Wabash. 

10:18 - Haltom gets another three.  I'm not sure why Earlham thinks they can lay off of  him...the three pointer si about 80% of his game.  Timeout Quakers.  24-6 is the score. 

Wabash has a 16-4 rebounding advantage halfway through the first period.  Wow. 

7:40 - After a pretty good rest, Mac brings the starters back in.  The score is 24-10.  Earlham has looked really unorganized to this point in the game. 

5:03 - Zimmer scores after another offensive rebound.  Wabash is out their largest lead of the game at 31-13.

1:43 - Haltom squashes an Earlham mini-run with his third three pointer of the game.  Wabash leads 38-22. 

0:30 - Steal, runout, and a nice dunk for Terrell Berry.   Simkus answers with a basket just before the buzzer sounds.  Wabash goes to the break with a 40-24 lead. 

Halftime stats you say?  You got it.  Wabash is being led by Zimmer's 14 points.  Simkus has 10 in the first half as well and Haltom has 9.  Zimmer and Simkus have 6 and 7 boards, respectively, so double double-doubles is a possibility here tonight.   :)

Earlham is being led in scoring by Tristan Gregory's 9 points.  Terrell Brown has added 7.  Gregory is just 2-10 shooting tonight...he's having a tough time getting any clean looks with Wes Smith guarding him. 

Wabash is shooting 50% from the floor (17-34) while Earlham is struggling along here at 30.8% (8-26).  Wabash is dominating the glass with a 23-13 rebound advantage (this was something like 17-3 at one point). 

In my astute opinion, Earlham has some adjustments to make at halftime.  We're back to action in about 4 minutes. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 13, 2008, 07:54:45 PM
Under 10 minutes to go in the 1st half in Granville:

Wooster - 14
Denison -  13

And no that isn't a typo?! :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 13, 2008, 08:18:49 PM
At the half in Granville:

Wooster - 39
Denison - 28

Wooster actually trailed at the 7:30 mark of the 1st half 16-14!  But then James Cooper took over with a three point barrage hitting on 4 treys for the half and I believe he has 16 points.  At one point Wooster outscored Denison 22-7 and built their largest lead of 13 points.  Give Denison credit for not going away... yet. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 13, 2008, 08:21:59 PM
Handy link to the livestats gets you +karma...sarcasm or not.   :)

I think they just gave the Wooster score here but it was totally unintelligible.  Chadwick has the acoustics of a steam tunnel.  

Alright, let's play ball.  Second half is underway....now.

18:06 - Kind of a sluggish start here.  Earlham opened with a three pointer, Wesley answered with a runner in the lane.  Zimmer is shooting free throws now which he split.  Wabash leads 43-27. 

16:03 - Gregory finally got himself free and drilled an open three pointer.  Maybe it's just me but some of the energy has been sapped out of this game.  Score is at 47-32. 

14:41 - Simkus nabs his 10th rebound and has his double-double.  Zimmer hits a three pointer on the offensive end for Wabash.  53-32 and Justus gets a timeout.  Zimmer is up to 20 points for the game tonight. 

9:10 - This game is getting a little sloppy as lopsided games tend to do.  Wabash is leading 63-42 after a pair of Zimmer free throws.  Zimmer comes out after his foul shots and Wabash is starter-free on the floor right now. 

6:18 - Mac is bringing Smithj, Simkus, and Brock back in the game here just to make sure this thing doesn't get uncomfortable.  Wabash leads 67-48. 

5:29 - Rooks and Zimmer are back so Wabash has the starting five on the floor.  And Smith gets a driviing layup to break a bit of a drought for the LGs.  69-48 is the score. 

4:25 - Mac takes the starters out during an Earlham timeout.  Good call there...nothing good can come of leaving the starting five out there at this point.  71-48 is the tally.  Make it 73-48 after an Evan Arnold layup. 

2:48 - And now Mac has gone all the way to the end of the bench.  These guys are going to get almost three good minutes here. 

1:27 - This is unfortunate...Terrell Brown hits a three pointer in front of Earlham's bench and stepped back right onto the foot of a teammate on the bench.  The ankle rolled and Brown has to come out of the game.  I hope he'll be alright. 

And we're all done.  Wabash wins comfortably 83-61.  This was a nice bounce back win after a tough week last week.  Wabash will host Oberlin for Senior Day on Saturday afternoon. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 13, 2008, 09:01:48 PM
3 and change to go in Springfield:

OWU 61
Witt 63

Live stats here (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/livestats/xlive.htm)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 13, 2008, 09:08:44 PM
Nicely done wally, like how you do that.  Scots fan it wasn't you, it was a bishop fan(i.e. a father of a player).  The thing that is hurting Earlham this year is their youth, and their lack of scoring besides Tristan and Welsh on some, they do not have much scoring.  But hopefully next year these guys will be a year older and a year of experience in the conference.  Hopefully they can play the three W's like the teams I played on beating Wabash a few times, taking Wooster to the final buzzer, and playing Witt strong, besides the 47 point defeat.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 13, 2008, 09:13:59 PM
OWU by 4 w/ 20 seconds left - and at the line.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 13, 2008, 09:17:07 PM
OWU by 2 w/5 secs left . . . gotta restart...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 13, 2008, 09:21:35 PM
OWU by 3, time-out, 5 seconds, Witt ball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 13, 2008, 09:22:34 PM
OWU wins 72-69.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 13, 2008, 09:36:45 PM
Final:  Wooster 82  Denison 64

Wooster was paced by James Cooper with 16 points, Evan Will with 13 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 12 points and Devin Fulk with 10 points.

Larry Farmer and Chris Eberst led the Big Red each with 13 points.

Wooster didn't shoot particularly well tonight but they outrebounded Denison 45 to 29 and had 5 less turnovers so they had far more offensive looks.

Wooster is now 19-3, 12-1 NCAC. :)  Next up is Witt on Saturday at Timken!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 13, 2008, 09:48:34 PM
All the NCAC 2/13 Final Scores:

Kenyon 78  Oberlin 56
Allegheny 80  Hiram 76
Wooster 82  Denison 64
Ohio Wesleyan 72  Wittenberg 69
Wabash 83  Earlham 61

So, the top 5 in the standings are:
Wooster 12-1
Wittenberg 11-2
Ohio Wesleyan 10-3
Wabash 8-5
Kenyon 8-5
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 13, 2008, 10:25:51 PM
Wittenberg 69 Ohio Wesleyan 72 - overall it was a very competitive game and you could tell that both teams wanted a win badly, it just came down to OWU making the plays throughout the game when the "opportunity" was there and Witt making some bad judgements throughout. However, shoot me down with negative karma and berating for saying this. I don't think the outcome would have been significantly different but the officiating was TERRIBLE in this game. Several plays that were called or not called had a huge impact on the outcome of this game. Rudegair is a great flopper, a loose ball that was being fumbled turning into a OWU timeout even though they never had the ball, a terrible blocking foul at the end of the game that resulted in OWU going ahead-those plays are examples of plays that changed the game.

Regardless, Witt had their chances to win or take control and didn't, but this game only puts fuel and fire into the minds of Witt so expect them to be out for blood Saturday night regardless.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 13, 2008, 10:31:59 PM
Nice win for OWU tonight, and a tough loss for Witt.  Gregg Hill had a chance to tie at the end thanks to some timely OWU free throw misses, but it was not to be (adding one more miss to Witt's 4-for-17 3-point shooting night).  Don't look now, but OWU has beaten Witt 3 straight and 4 of the last 5, perhaps even further solidifying their place in the top 3 in the conference.

Quote from: pennstghs on February 13, 2008, 10:25:51 PM
I don't think the outcome would have been significantly different but the officiating was TERRIBLE in this game.

Alas, such is a game in the NCAC.  Then again, looking at the endings of both the Villanova-Georgetown and Rutgers-Tennessee games on Monday, such is also any game in the entire NCAA.

I just wish we could have watched this game like we were able to watch the first game between these two.  I mean, if OWU can pull off an internet video broadcast from (and no offense to any OWU fans) their old, aging, technologically-challenged (from what I remember from my broadcasts there) arena, I would think that Witt would like to consistently showcase this feature as well (considering they KNOW they can do it after basketball games last year and the NCAA volleyball tournament this year).

This is not a good sign for Witt heading into Saturday's showdown with Wooster. Wooster may have struggled a little bit tonight (as much as an 18-point win can be considered a "struggle"), but the Scots a) will be looking for revenge, b) can essentially (if not officially) wrap up the regular season conference title, and c) also deliver a blow to Witt's at-large hopes.  I must say, I don't have a good feeling about Saturday.  But, as Mr. Berman says so often, that's why they play the game.  Should be a fun one nonetheless.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 13, 2008, 11:00:07 PM
i think this loss makes them all the more hungry saturday night
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 13, 2008, 11:23:06 PM
Well, one thing that it definitely does, even if Wittenberg beats Wooster, is to put the Tigers' final two games back into play.  A win now over Wooster ties them for the lead, and they'll have the head-to-head tiebreaker.  But should they drop either their mid-week home game against Wabash or their season-finale matinee at Kenyon next Saturday they'll still finish second, at best.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 14, 2008, 12:01:08 AM
One random note from the Scots game tonight:

Devin Fulk recorded career start #2 for the Scots...a sort of early Senior Night for Fulk, who attended Licking Valley High School and must have plenty of family in the Newark/Granville/Licking County area.

One of the biggest cheers of the night was when he was announced in the starting lineup.  I thought this was a nice, classy move by Steve Moore to allow Fulk the start in front of the "home" fans.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 14, 2008, 12:46:46 AM
From the OWU website (http://bishops.owu.edu/2007-08/mbb0213.html) about tonight's game:

"The win snaps Ohio Wesleyan's 43-game losing streak to the Tigers in Springfield dating back to Feb. 28, 1953, when the Bishops took a 67-58 decision in Wittenberg Field House. The win also gives Ohio Wesleyan its first regular-season sweep of Wittenberg since the 1949-50 campaign."

:o :o :o

That's a pretty impressive streak.

Quote from: jscwittfan on February 13, 2008, 10:31:59 PM
Nice win for OWU tonight, and a tough loss for Witt.  Gregg Hill had a chance to tie at the end thanks to some timely OWU free throw misses,

Yeah, and not just by any 'ol OWU player.  Brian Caferella went 1-2 at the line twice in the final ten seconds of play- quite unusual for a player in "Devin Fulk" territory on FT percentage.  Caferella came into the game 39-42 on the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 14, 2008, 01:36:34 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 14, 2008, 12:46:46 AM
From the OWU website (http://bishops.owu.edu/2007-08/mbb0213.html) about tonight's game:

"The win snaps Ohio Wesleyan's 43-game losing streak to the Tigers in Springfield dating back to Feb. 28, 1953, when the Bishops took a 67-58 decision in Wittenberg Field House. The win also gives Ohio Wesleyan its first regular-season sweep of Wittenberg since the 1949-50 campaign."

:o :o :o

That's a pretty impressive streak.

Those are two mighty impressive streaks. Congrats to the Bishops for getting both of those monkeys off of OWU's back.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 14, 2008, 07:16:47 AM
Reading the post on the main page of d3hoops, before last night they had OWU ranked high in the regional rankings than Witt.  How is this possible?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2008, 09:59:34 AM
The regional rankings are set by many criteria. It's not just a popularity contest. They use regional record, OWP (opponents winning percentage), and OOWP (opponents opponents winning percentage).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 14, 2008, 10:18:27 AM
Looks like the forecast is calling for a 'Whiteout' on Saturday:

Quote from: The front page of the C.O.W. Basketball web site:
» Whiteout!: The Wooster athletic department is encouraging all fans to wear white in support of the Fighting Scots at Saturday night's game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 14, 2008, 10:27:21 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 14, 2008, 10:18:27 AM
Looks like the forecast is calling for a 'Whiteout' on Saturday:

Quote from: The front page of the C.O.W. Basketball web site:
» Whiteout!: The Wooster athletic department is encouraging all fans to wear white in support of the Fighting Scots at Saturday night's game.

Hopefully it will go as well for Witt as last year's "blackout" did...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 14, 2008, 10:33:10 AM
Quote from: ECHOOPER on February 14, 2008, 07:16:47 AM
Reading the post on the main page of d3hoops, before last night they had OWU ranked high in the regional rankings than Witt.  How is this possible?

I think you may have answered your own question Hooper...*Both teams have essentially identical regional records (13-4 or OWU, 14-4 for Witt), Witt has an advantage against regionally ranked opponents (1-2 vs. 0-3 for OWU), but the difference in the SOS numbers is huge as you posted earlier.  That, combined with OWU's head-to-head win over the Tigers makes it pretty easy to have them ranked higher than Wittenberg. 

*These numbers do not include last night's results...which really only enhance the argument for OWU. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2008, 10:53:06 AM
They don't use SOS though, they use OWP and OOWP now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 14, 2008, 10:55:38 AM
Has anyone noticed that Ian Franks has appeard to have passed Dusitn Geitgey on Wooster's depth chart?  Geitgey logged 11 minutes in the OWU game compared to just 2 for Franks and since then, Franks has been averaging nearly 13 minutes per game compared to just 4 minutes per game for Geitgey.  In fact Geitgey didn't even see the floor in the Wabash game.  I'm just wondering if Geitgey didn't do something to get him in Coach Moore's doghouse...

As for last night's game, Wooster had a subpar shooting performance (by their standards) and still won by 18.  Wooster only shot 45% from the floor and just 33% from deep despite Cooper and Fulk combining on 5-9 treys.  The rest of the team only managed 2-14.  Interesting note that the last time the Scots had an off night shooting the basketball was at Allegheny (44% from the floor and 24% from deep).  They followed that game up with a sizzling shooting performance vs. OWU as they shot 53% from the floor and a scorching 60% from deep!  Will history repeat itself this Saturday?  Lets hope so! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 14, 2008, 11:05:06 AM
amen jsc---note to all in attendance i should "standout" to the crowd-maybe meet some of you fellow Wooster fans??? I will be at the JV game and trust me you won't be able to miss me.....

The only school that can truly have a successful whiteout is Penn State football-case in point the Notre Dame game last year-that was amazing
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 14, 2008, 11:17:57 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 14, 2008, 11:05:06 AM
The only school that can truly have a successful whiteout is Penn State football-case in point the Notre Dame game last year-that was amazing
The White Out for the Michigan game 2 years ago went pretty well for Penn State... ;D  At least there were no reports of urine filled water bottles being tossed out of the student sections?! ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 14, 2008, 11:27:30 AM
Congratulations to OWU on a HUGE win.  That is awesome!!  Mike DeWitt is clearly the COY.  Nobody else should get a vote.  Seriously, not only does his guys get it done on the court, they get it done in the class room as well.  With Rudegeair and Holliday being clear examples.

I would not count them out in any game. 

Again, hats off to DeWitt and his guys.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 14, 2008, 11:39:12 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 14, 2008, 10:55:38 AM
Has anyone noticed that Ian Franks has appeard to have passed Dusitn Geitgey on Wooster's depth chart?  Geitgey logged 11 minutes in the OWU game compared to just 2 for Franks and since then, Franks has been averaging nearly 13 minutes per game compared to just 4 minutes per game for Geitgey.  In fact Geitgey didn't even see the floor in the Wabash game.  I'm just wondering if Geitgey didn't do something to get him in Coach Moore's doghouse...

I have definitely noticed this, and think it's a good move.  He seems to have better court sense out there then Geitgey, however still has a long way to go before he's really a contributor on the floor.  Right now, he seems mostly to be trying to stay out of the way on offense, but that will probably gradually change.  He needs some work in the weight room, looking much like a high school kid, which he still almost is.  I can see him down the road, if he works hard, being a Matt Smith type of player.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 14, 2008, 11:56:15 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 14, 2008, 10:53:06 AM
They don't use SOS though, they use OWP and OOWP now.

I should have been more clear...what I meant by SOS was the SOS metrics of OWP and OOWP of which OWU's are significantly better than Wittenberg's. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 14, 2008, 12:10:39 PM
honestly, i think Witt and Wooster need to win the tournament to get in the NCAA's, but we will surely see. Whoever wins the regular season title between Witt and Wooster is going to get a great opportunity to host a very competitive weekend of basketball in 2 weeks, ceteris parabis(assuming all seeds hold accordingly).
Also, i do not think that we should look too far into the loss last night to OWU or Wooster not "winning" by as much as they'd have liked when looking at Saturday's game. Witt knows they need a win regardless and as i've said before just throw everything out of the window. After all, no one though Witt had a great chance the first time around and being able to come back and win just booms with a confidence increase.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 14, 2008, 01:20:44 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 14, 2008, 12:10:39 PM
honestly, i think Witt and Wooster need to win the tournament to get in the NCAA's, but we will surely see.
I think if Wooster loses on Saturday and then loses in the NCAC tournament, they will be facing a big question when it comes to a Pool C bid.  But, if Wooster wins on Saturday and goes on to win the NCAC regular season title and loses in the NCAC tournament, I think they still get into the NCAA's at large. 

IMO, the only way Witt gets into the NCAA's is to win the NCAC tournament IMO.  And I think the same can be said for OWU.  That being said, I also feel that, at this point, OWU has a stronger case for a Pool C than Witt.

As far as motivators for this game, I think that Wooster will have plenty to motivate them.  For the seniors, this will be a chance at 4 straight NCAC championships.  That has only been done once before at Wooster back from the '88-'89 through '91-'92 seasons.  And 2 of those ('89-'90 and '90-'91) were when the conference was divided North and South and the other 2 were Co-Champions.  I don't believe that anyone has ever won 4 straight outright NCAC titles.  Not to mention, I'm sure that none of the seniors want to end their careers losing at least 2 straight to Witt.  Especially James Cooper.  And then there's the hosting issue.  I'm sure that these seniors don't want to have to make any more trips down to Springield.  And I'm sure that losing that lead late and not finishing has left a lingering bad taste for the entire team.  I'm sure that they want nothing more than to finish the job Saturday in front of the home fans.  And that would bring me to my last point.  The lone win at home over Witt for these seniors occurred on that memorable shot by James Cooper 2 years ago.  Witt has won 5 of the last 7 regular season match-ups at Timken.  Witt reversed the trend of Wooster winning down in Springfield.  Now it's Wooster's turn to return the favor.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 14, 2008, 01:23:44 PM
pardon me i meant to say OWU instead of Wooster i think Wooster has a good at large chance-sorry about my slip up guys its been a long day
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 14, 2008, 01:26:59 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 14, 2008, 12:10:39 PM
honestly, i think Witt and Wooster need to win the tournament to get in the NCAA's, but we will surely see. Whoever wins the regular season title between Witt and Wooster is going to get a great opportunity to host a very competitive weekend of basketball in 2 weeks, ceteris parabis(assuming all seeds hold accordingly).
Also, i do not think that we should look too far into the loss last night to OWU or Wooster not "winning" by as much as they'd have liked when looking at Saturday's game. Witt knows they need a win regardless and as i've said before just throw everything out of the window. After all, no one though Witt had a great chance the first time around and being able to come back and win just booms with a confidence increase.

Wittenberg's only NCAA chance is to win the NCAC tournament.  If Wooster wins out and then loses in the NCAC championship, I think the Scots would be a likely Pool C contender.  A loss to Witt Saturday hurts those chances.

OWU has Pool C chances also, by winning out and losing the NCAC final to Wooster (preferable, because if Wooster takes the Pool A bid, it takes Woo out of Pool C contention.)

Wittenberg would be at least a 6-loss (in-region) Pool C team...and its OWP and OOWP numbers are well below Wooster, Capital and Ohio Wesleyan, among others.

EDIT:  I see that ScotsFan has already addressed this point, but I felt that I didn't trample on what he said too much, so I'll post, too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 14, 2008, 01:27:06 PM
Witt is certainly not out of the woods even if they do get a win against Wooster on Saturday.  Witt's remaining two opponents both played the Tigers tough the first time around (Wabash and Kenyon both suffered 8-minute FG droughts that doomed them).  Both teams will have plenty to play for (Wabash and Kenyon are fighting for the last home game in the first round...and neither wants to travel to the other for that first round game).  Wabash could all but cinch up that 4th place spot with a win next Wednesday.  Should the LGs slip, Kenyon could all but cinch that spot up by beting Witt at home in the season finale (and on Senior Day at that...Kenyon may have a TON to play for on that final Saturday).  Witt has two stern tests coming in the season's final week for sure.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 14, 2008, 01:31:58 PM
With the rankings should OWU and Wooster meet in the championship game, do you guys think that both make the tournament regardless of who wins?  The loser going to Pool C and the winner possibility of hosting the first 2 round.  I think it doesn't matter much where you are seeded in the first 5 seeds becasue any one can beat anyone on a single night.  Take the teams I played on seeded 5th we went into wabash where we had lost earlier in the season and won the first round.  Also, take OWU a couple of years ago beating Witt in the semi's to play wooster, but the eventually lost that one.  But like I said it doesn't matter where you are ranked within the top 5 of the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 14, 2008, 02:01:25 PM
Quote from: ECHOOPER on February 14, 2008, 01:31:58 PM
With the rankings should OWU and Wooster meet in the championship game, do you guys think that both make the tournament regardless of who wins?  The loser going to Pool C and the winner possibility of hosting the first 2 round.

If both OWU and Wooster win out until meeting in the NCAC championship, it seems likely that they could both make the tournament...however, the loser of that game will definitely be hoping that most other Pool A bids around the country go according to form.  Upsets in championship games can kill a bubble Pool C team's chances.

Hosting will again depend on what still happens between now and then.  If Capital wins out, Capital almost assuredly would have hosting rights (whether or not any NCAC teams would be slotted into that bracket is less clear- Capital came to Wooster for the first weekend last year.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 14, 2008, 02:34:03 PM
Do you think that it Wooster and Capital win out it would be a toss up or is it clear that Capital would host if it wins out?  Any OWU fans goin to make the trip to Earlham this weekend for the game? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 14, 2008, 02:56:29 PM
Quote from: ECHOOPER on February 14, 2008, 02:34:03 PM
Do you think that it Wooster and Capital win out it would be a toss up or is it clear that Capital would host if it wins out?  Any OWU fans goin to make the trip to Earlham this weekend for the game? 
I think it's pretty clear that if Cap wins out, they will be the top seed coming out of the GL Region.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 14, 2008, 07:47:53 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 14, 2008, 02:56:29 PM
Quote from: ECHOOPER on February 14, 2008, 02:34:03 PM
Do you think that it Wooster and Capital win out it would be a toss up or is it clear that Capital would host if it wins out?  Any OWU fans goin to make the trip to Earlham this weekend for the game? 
I think it's pretty clear that if Cap wins out, they will be the top seed coming out of the GL Region.

I kind of think thats unclear give the uncertainty of what Hope's in-region record is supposed to be.  If Hope wins out they'd be 18-2 in-region.  Thats certainly comparable to 22-3, which is what I think Capital would finish.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 14, 2008, 09:03:07 PM
Looking at the regional rankings and if they stayed this close, do you guys think that all these teams make the tournament?

1. Capital 18-3 17-3 .536 .530
2. Wooster 18-3 11-2 .525 .495
3. Hope 17-3 10-2 .501 .519
4. Ohio Wesleyan 14-6 13-4 .545 .498
5. Heidelberg 16-5 14-4 .507 .528
6. Penn State-Behrend 17-4 15-3 .425 .501

With the tournament time coming up who do you guys think might be a sleeper in the NCAC tourney, and who could be a sleeper in the national tourney?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 14, 2008, 09:51:29 PM
the thing is, the number one seed in the region isn't exactly "guaranteed" to host the sectionals because that's based on lowest cost of travel
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 14, 2008, 10:59:02 PM
Quote from: sac on February 14, 2008, 07:47:53 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 14, 2008, 02:56:29 PM
Quote from: ECHOOPER on February 14, 2008, 02:34:03 PM
Do you think that it Wooster and Capital win out it would be a toss up or is it clear that Capital would host if it wins out?  Any OWU fans goin to make the trip to Earlham this weekend for the game? 
I think it's pretty clear that if Cap wins out, they will be the top seed coming out of the GL Region.

I kind of think thats unclear give the uncertainty of what Hope's in-region record is supposed to be.  If Hope wins out they'd be 18-2 in-region.  Thats certainly comparable to 22-3, which is what I think Capital would finish.
I said what I said because I felt that Cap would gain the edge in OWP over both Hope and Wooster.  That's probably why Cap is currently holding the initial #1 ranking.

Anyways, there's still a lot of basketball to be played. A lot can happen between now and the end of the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 15, 2008, 10:03:21 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 14, 2008, 09:51:29 PM
the thing is, the number one seed in the region isn't exactly "guaranteed" to host the sectionals because that's based on lowest cost of travel

This is true...though there shouldn't be any travel problems with finding 3 teams to send to Wooster, Holland or Bexley.  Teams just have to be within 500 miles of the venue to avoid a flight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 15, 2008, 01:01:01 PM
Quote from: ECHOOPER on February 14, 2008, 09:03:07 PM
With the tournament time coming up who do you guys think might be a sleeper in the NCAC tourney, and who could be a sleeper in the national tourney?

Who knows about sleepers in the NCAAs...way way too far away still.

Sleepers in the NCAC tourney?  Like who? Kenyon? The Lords are better and the LGs are decent, too, but it's going to be Wooster, Wittenberg or Ohio Wesleyan cutting down the nets in a few weeks, IMHO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2008, 01:59:21 PM
I think Kenyon or Wabash can make the finals, perhaps.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 15, 2008, 05:25:39 PM
NCAC on the front page.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2008, 05:28:34 PM
Thanks, Pat!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 16, 2008, 05:34:50 AM
I suspect that there's a JV game at Wooster prior to the main event.  Does anyone know for sure, and if so, what time it is scheduled to begin?

Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on February 16, 2008, 09:16:42 AM
THere is indeed a jv game I believe with a 5 tip but I am not 100% positive on the time
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 16, 2008, 10:55:48 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 15, 2008, 05:25:39 PM
NCAC on the front page.

Thanks Pat for highlighting the Wittenberg - Wooster rivalry!  The D3 Hoops article features two freshmen - Bryan Wickliffe (Woo) and Derrick Hannon (Witt) who are getting introduced to the intense rivalry.  At the other end of their college careers, 6 Seniors will play in tonight's big Woo-Witt game knowing that this is their last chance to win another NCAC regular season title.

Wittenberg's three seniors are Brandan Barabino, Sam Gregory and Brandon White.

Wooster's three seniors are James Cooper, Devin Fulk and Evan Will.

Should be a great game tonight! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 16, 2008, 11:13:13 AM
JV game tips off at 5:30 i do believe-I'm on my way up to the COW shortly-hope to see you all there-i will be the person not wearing white
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 16, 2008, 11:36:10 AM
...and don't forget the 2pm women's game. Witt vs. Woo @ Timken
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 16, 2008, 11:50:24 AM
great preview article in the springfield-newssun today:

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/hp/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2008/02/16/sns021608spwitthoops.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 16, 2008, 12:56:05 PM
I'm courtside at Chadwick for the Wabash/Oberlin game.  How's that for a little appetizer in the NCAC?  Hopefully I'll get one more chance to keep a running post of a Wabash game...Wabash will need to hold serve over these last three games to make sure that happens.  More on the possible tiebreak later....Senior Day activiites are underway.  Back with the tip in a bit. 

More on the race for fourth place...if I'm reading the game program correctly, Wabash holds the tiebreak over Kenyon by virtue of their wins over Earlham.  So Kenyon needs to gain a game on Wabash over this last week to avoid a trip west.  I think this means that Kenyon should plan on having to go 3-0 to close the season. 

Alright, starting lineups are being announced.  Tipoff comes in just a minute.

19:20 - Hot start for Wabash.  Simkus scores in the post on the opening possession.  Wes Smith followed with a quick steal and layup.  Oberlin has answered with a three from Pat Bernhard.  Then Zimmer scores putting back his own miss.  And Bernhard drills a three for the Yeoman.  This is tough to keep up with.  It's 6-6 with 18:06 to play. 

My mistake on that last Berhard basket.  It was just a two point field goal.  The score sits at 8-5.  With this pace, it's easy to see how these teams put up nearly 190 points the last time they played. 

15:57 - Mike Loll gets trapped in the corner by Wes Smith and calls a timeout.  This is a good time to note that Wesley once again has drawn the assignment of checking the other team's leading scorer.  We're racing up and down the court here.  Zimmer and Omari Hall have traded baskets.  The score is 13-9 in favor of Wabash. 

14:03 - Oberlin is substituting liberally...Wabash has yet to go to the bench.  Interesting given the pace of the game.  Oberlin is hanging tough.  Loll just scored for the Yeomen and the Wabash lead is just 15-13. 

12:04 - Here's the rare double foul call.  I think they got Simkus and Colin Sallee.  I'll be honest, I didn't really see the play.  Oberlin turns the ball over.  Wabash guard Dominique Thomas responds by throwing a pass into the scoring table.  Wabash leads 19-13. 

11:32 - The officials don't like the pace of the game and have slowed things down considerably.  Ah, the power of the whistle. 

9:30 - Chase Haltom gets loose and knocks down a trey.  Wabash opens up a 23-15 lead...biggest of the game I believe. 

8:06 - Three more for Haltom.  26-15 is the score. 

7:31 - Haltom scores again on a runner in the paint and Oberlin gets a timeout.  The score is up to 28-15 and Oberlin is in trouble here.  The Yeoman are in the double bonus.  This lead could get huge before we hit halftime. 

5:45 - Omari Hall must have heard me because he's gone on a personal 8-0 run.  The score is 30-23.  And now Ryan Magiera drills a three pointer and the lead is down to four.  30-26 is the score.  Mac Petty gets a timeout with 5:01 to go.

4:09 - Wabash responds out of the time out with a pair of Zimmer free throws, a steal, and a three point play by Wes Smith.  The lead is back up to 35-26 and Wabash has the ball after another Yeoman turnover. 

0:56 - Oberlin gets a layup on a fast break...largely because Zimmer was back arguing a non-call.  I've actually seen a bit more of this today from both sides than I normally do.  Oberlin has done well to stay in this game.  The score is 42-37 after an Omari Hall basket.  Hall also has a foul shot coming.  It's good.  42-38 is the score. 

0:00 - Zimmer hits a three at the end of the half and Wabash will carry a 45-38 lead into the break.  Again, Oberlin made some big shots in the last seven minutes to keep this game from getting out of hand.

Alright, you need look no farther than the FG% stat to see what's going on here.  Wabash is shooting respectably at 41.5% (17-41) but the Yeoman are shooting extremely well at 53% (16-31).  Wabash has the edge in most other statistical categories as you might imagine. 

The LGs are being led by Zimmer's 13 and 7.  A double-double seems very likely here.  Oberlin is led by Omari Hall's 13 points, most of which came during a critical stretch where the Yeoman needed a big run.  Mike Loll is on his way to double-doublesville with 9 and 7 in the first half.

4 minutes until we're back to action. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 16, 2008, 02:03:29 PM
And before we get started, I want to mention that we're on steal watch here.  Wes Smith is 8 steals away from breaking the Wabash single season record of 63 currently held by Mike Lustina '95. 

19:00 - We've traded three point plays to start the opening half here.  48-41 is the score. 

17:22 - Wide open three for Zimmer goes down.  51-42 Wabash.   

16:57 - Steal and breakaway dunk for Wesley.  Timeout Oberlin with the score 55-42. 

16:19 - Oberlin fires up an airball out of the timeout.  On the other end, Zimmer scores in the post adn gets fouled.  His shot is good.  58-42. 

14:44 - Another steal and runout layup for Smith.  He's picking off these perimeter swing passes like if he keeps doing it he's going to win something.  The score is 62-45.

10:56 - Bit of a dry spell here.  Wabash leads 65-49.  Matthew Godwin gets a three for Oberlin.  65-52. 

8:00 - Three more for Zimmer.  Wabash leads 73-54.  Oberlin looks gassed here...they may have run themselves out of the game.  Wesley has just picked up his 4th foul.  A couple of these fouls on Wesley have been iffy...he's upset about this last one.  He'll go the bench. 

7:17 -  There's some ticky tack called on Omari Hall.  That's his fourth and everything about that call smells like a make up.  The score is 74-56. 

5:14 - Zimmer is having a whale of a game.  This last three pointer gives him 31 for the game which matches his career high...set earlier this year against Oberlin.  83-62 is the score as we come out of a timeout.

4:27 - Wes fouls out with 21 points, 7 rebounds, and 5 steals.  I'm pretty sure the 21 is a career best for Smith.  86-64 as the parade to the foul line continues. 

3:35 - Three more for Zim.  34 points!  Wow.  90-66 is the score. 

2:00 - Big ovations for Zimmer and Rooks as they come out of the game.  Well deserved.  Simkus drains a three right before his exit.  The score is 96-71 with 1:10 to go here.

And the regular season has come to a close at Chadwick Court.  Wabash defeats Oberlin by a score of 97-73.  Huge, huge days for Zimmer and Smith.  Congratulations to Wabash seniors Andrew Zimmer, Gary Simkus, and Earl Rooks for great careers. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 16, 2008, 06:14:14 PM
More scores...

Kenyon 88, Allegheny 77
Hiram 89, Denison 81

and get ready...

Earlham 79, OWU 73

Wowza. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 16, 2008, 07:03:55 PM

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 16, 2008, 06:14:14 PM

Earlham 79, OWU 73

"Just throwing it all away.........throwing it all away"
"Is there nothing that I can say, to make you change your mind?"
"I watch the world go round and round.........and seen mine turning upside down."
"Throwing it all way"..................................
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2008, 08:03:52 PM
Witt goes to the half with a 36-35 lead.  Witt has hit an unreal 8 of 12 from the arc, and two of the misses were blocked.  Two of the makes were NBA-length, beat-the-shot-clock desperation shots.  You've just got to tip your cap and be thankful that you're only down one after a shooting performance like that.  Barabino and Cooper with 13 apiece.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 16, 2008, 08:04:18 PM
Anyone think Witt can continue shooting 67% from three?

Witt 36 Woo 35.......Witt 8-12 from 3, video quality is excellent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 16, 2008, 08:16:40 PM
They did it at Wabash earlier this year.  The answer is yes.  Yes they can keep shooting 3s like that. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2008, 08:24:18 PM
Cooper has two early threes in the second half.  He's got 22 now on 8/10 shooting (5/7 from the arc.)  You know, he's a pretty good player.  He might even be good enough to play varsity on a CCIW team!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 16, 2008, 08:42:31 PM
Wooster's live stats feed seems to have stopped updating, but the video tells me it's 57-56 Wooster in the 2nd half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2008, 08:49:22 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 16, 2008, 08:42:31 PM
Wooster's live stats feed seems to have stopped updating, but the video tells me it's 57-56 Wooster in the 2nd half.

Generic Wooster/Wittenberg Score Update FormTM
Approved for use at any time within the first 38:30 of any Woo/Witt game

{One team} leads {the other team} by {a few points}.

Ho-hum.  It never really gets interesting until there's 90 seconds left.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2008, 08:53:02 PM
Wooster 64-59, 1:07 left, Scots ball after a tieup.  (From the video, which I think is significantly delayed.)

Johnson misses, Hill (I think) hits a layup, timeout Witt.  :47.1 if I heard correctly.

My web connection, which has acid reflux, burped, so I've switched to radio.  Wooster leads by 5, 66-61, with 13.8 seconds left, and I think they have the ball.

Cooper fouled, goes to the line, misses the first but Will gets the rebound.  Fulk is fouled and will shoot.

He also misses, but Nowicki misses the three and Wooster holds on for the win, 66-61.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on February 16, 2008, 09:45:28 PM
Interesting numbers for bean counters:  If the linked Feb 16 Springfield NewSun article has accurate numbers, then for the last ten games, including tonight, Witt and Woo have split 5 and 5, but Wooster is up in total points scored 744 to 743. 

Unfortunately for either squad, the "annual" third game looms in the NCAC tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2008, 09:55:37 PM
So once again, the greatest rivalry in college sports is reenacted, with the two dominant superpowers squaring off in a battle that went right to the wall before it was decided.  And once again the underdogs came up just that short.  Ah, there's nothing like life in the NCAC.

Of course, I'm talking about swimming and diving, where the Kenyon Lords and Ladies again emerged from the pool as NCAC champs: Men 1633 to Denison's 1598, and Women 1630 to Denison's 1558.  Each Kenyon team has now won 23 of the 24 championships in NCAC history.  Championship page. (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mswimming/08ncac/)  Now on to dominate the nationals!

And back to your regularly scheduled programming... ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 16, 2008, 10:00:36 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on February 16, 2008, 09:45:28 PM
Unfortunately for either squad, the "annual" third game looms in the NCAC tourney.

That's anything but a mortal lock this year...there are 2-3 pretty good teams that are very capable of beating Wooter or Witt in the semis.  

Quote from: David Collinge on February 16, 2008, 09:55:37 PM
So once again, the greatest rivalry in college sports is reenacted, with the two dominant superpowers squaring off in a battle that went right to the wall before it was decided.  And once again the underdogs came up just that short.  Ah, there's nothing like life in the NCAC.

Of course, I'm talking about swimming and diving, where the Kenyon Lords and Ladies again emerged from the pool as NCAC champs: Men 1633 to Denison's 1598, and Women 1630 to Denison's 1558.  Each Kenyon team has now won 23 of the 24 championships in NCAC history.  Championship page. (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mswimming/08ncac/)  Now on to dominate the nationals!

Also noteworthy from Canton, the Little Giant swimmers crossed the 1,000 point mark for the first time since joining the NCAC.  This has been a goal for the Wabash swimming and diving team for some time and it's great that they were able to acheive that goal.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2008, 10:02:01 PM
Quote from: sac on February 16, 2008, 08:04:18 PM
Anyone think Witt can continue shooting 67% from three?

Witt was 0 for 6 from the arc in the second.  They ended up 8/18, while Wooster was 7/17, so the advantage was negated.  Shooting was about even, both inside and out, and rebounds were about even.  Statistically, the game was won from at the line, where Wooster scored 11 (of 16) to Witt's 7 (of eight).  Stat of the game, however: Wooster had just 4 turnovers on the evening.

Box score. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/boxes/2007-08/witt2.php)

Wooster clinches at least a tie for the conference title.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 16, 2008, 10:33:10 PM
Just back from a sold out Timken gymn (3,300) where I watched Wooster essentially win the NCAC regular season crown with a sweet win over Wittenberg.:)

Difference in this game was Wooster's second half defense as they gave Witt no open looks in the 2nd half.  Tigers were 0 of 6 on three pointers in the 2nd half as David noted and Witt only scored 25 points in the 2nd half.  Several times the shot clock ran down and Witt was forced to take off balance shots.

Wooster was led by James Cooper who was 9 of 14 from the floor including 5 three pointers (5 of 7!).  Evan Will played the game of his career with 8 points, 12 boards, 5 assists and 5 blocks.  He was all over the floor with his hustle.  Brandon Johnson had 12 points including a great drive through Witt's defense to score a layup with ~3 minutes left and give the Scots a 6 point lead that the Tigers could not overcome.

Wooster actually outrebounded Witt by a 31-30 count and took better care of the ball (only 4 turnovers vs 9 for Witt).  As a result, Wooster got 55 shots in the game to only 51 for Witt and that was a big factor.

Wooster is now 20-3, 13-1 NCAC ;D  Next up is Allegheny on 2/20.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2008, 10:35:26 PM
Earlham's victims this year:

Lake Erie (16-6)
Case (7-14, but 7-4 non conference)
Kenyon (8-5 NCAC, 10-12 overall with a stout non conference schedule)
OWU (15-7 overall, and just whizzed their "C" bid chance down their leg).

Kenyon's Earlham's losses include:

Manchester (4-19) (seemingly back to the Manchester I remember back in the 80's)
Hiram (7-15) (lost to Case by 17)
Oberlin (TWICE) (4-19)
Denison (2-20)

What the....

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 16, 2008, 10:41:26 PM
All the 2/16 NCAC Final Scores:

Earlham 79  Ohio Wesleyan 73 :o
Kenyon 88  Allegheny 77
Hiram 89  Denison 81
Wooster 66  Wittenberg 61
Wabash 97  Oberlin 73


So, here are the updated NCAC standings:

Wooster 13-1
Wittenberg 11-3
Ohio Wesleyan 10-4
Wabash 9-5
Kenyon 9-5
Allegheny 6-8
Hiram 5-9
Oberlin 3-11
Denison 2-12
Earlham 2-12
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 16, 2008, 11:48:16 PM
With Wooster's win tonight, they have achieved another 20 win season. :)

Congratulations to Coach Steve Moore, Coach Doug Cline and the rest of the staff on their 12th Consecutive 20 Win Season!

During those 12 seasons, Wooster has 299 wins vs. 52 losses (a winning percentage just over 85%!)  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 17, 2008, 01:09:16 AM
Well, let's hope OWU loses another, Kenyon or Wabash catches them for the #3 seed, and Witt doesn't have to see them until potentially the NCAC tournament finals!  Seriously, I feel more confident about Witt going into a game against Wooster than I do going into a game against OWU at Wooster (which is what an NCAC tourney match-up would be).

And, on a completely non-NCAC related side-note, am I the only one who was absolutely amazed by Dwight Howard in the dunk contest tonight?  The slap the ball off the backboard with the left hand dunk it with the right may have been one of the most impressive dunk contest slams I've seen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 17, 2008, 01:18:29 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 17, 2008, 01:09:16 AM
And, on a completely non-NCAC related side-note, am I the only one who was absolutely amazed by Dwight Howard in the dunk contest tonight?  The slap the ball off the backboard with the left hand dunk it with the right may have been one of the most impressive dunk contest slams I've seen.

I watched and yes, Howard's dunks were awesome tonight.  Probably the best set of dunks in a dunk contest since Vince Carter in 2000. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 17, 2008, 08:42:56 AM
dwight howard is the man-ill have some actual intellectual thoughts on the game later-it seems as if we all are prognosticators in a way...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 17, 2008, 01:15:05 PM
Here's the beginning of the game recap on the Witt site (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/07-08gamestories/wooster2.html), written by John Strawn, assistant SID (formerly known around here as 'TigerUp07'):

Quote from: John StrawnThe Wittenberg-Wooster rivalry never fails to disappoint. Not permanently, at least. When the buzzer sounded Saturday night in Timken Gymnasium, the Scots had secured a 66-61 victory over the Tigers, and for about 30 seconds an air of disappointment fell over the Tiger crowd. But it was quickly replaced with the glow of pride and the satisfaction of being a part of one of the best Division III rivalries.

Very classy; a great write-up.  Way to go, John.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 17, 2008, 01:27:33 PM
Congratulations to Coach Moore, his staff, and the Wooster players for their 4th straight NCAC regular season title. They earned it with three straight home Saturdays wins against the top tier of the NCAC.

The frontline of Evan Will, Robert Melick, Bryan Wickliffe and Craig Elam have continued to improve throughout the season. It may have been Will's and Melick' s best all round game of the year. If the front line continues to play like this the rest of the season, coupled with what I believe has been the best defensive team Wooster has had in years, making a deep run into the NCAA is a seasonable expectation.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 17, 2008, 02:34:10 PM
Notes from Timken:

The Wooster JV starters piled up a big first-half lead on Wittenberg only to have the bench give most of it back.  Same thing happened in the second half, as Coach Gaubatz gave everyone lots of playing time.  Nate, don't you understand, we want to beat Witt by 50? :)

Watching the game last night, even from up close, it wasn't clear how Marty Bidwell acquired the cut on the side of his head that, for a while,  forced him from the game.  Was he the victim of a Greg Hill elbow?  Did he hit his head on the floor?  After the game, it was explained to me that he had actually banged his head on the top of an exit when saving a ball at the Wittenberg corner of the gym.  The Clear Picture replay verified this, showing Marty running into the exit, then while within the doorframe, leaping high in the air only to bang his noggin hard enough to give himself a pretty good gash.  Super Marty has met his kryptonite, and it's not any opponent, but hard inert objects. :)

Cooper, you're amazing, especially in big games, and especially in big games against Wittenberg.  The young big men all continue to improve, giving help to the redheaded warrior Will.  Ian Franks begins to look more and more like he belongs on the floor.  He moves his feet very well defensively, always in position, and is deceptively quick to loose balls. 

In attendance last night, the big man trio of Tom Port, Ryan Gorman, and Matt Schlingman.  In absentia: Tim Vandervaart, out sick with the flu.  Better soon, Tim!

Last night's game was one of the better officiated matches that I've seen at Wooster.  Kudos where kudos is due.

Marty Bidwell Sr. continues to hold his lead in the season-long pick-the-score contest, but the gap is narrowing!  Unfortunately I'm not a part of the closers, wallowing in last place. :(

The great cookie mystery deepens.  Someone ain't leveling with me, and I suspect it ain't the blonde. ;)  No matter how you look at it, the two perps are guilty.  Either they pilfered the cookies, or they lied about doing so.  Punishment will be swift and severe. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 17, 2008, 03:39:41 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 17, 2008, 02:34:10 PM
Notes from Timken:

In attendance last night, the big man trio of Tom Port, Ryan Gorman, and Matt Schlingman.  In absentia: Tim Vandervaart, out sick with the flu.  Better soon, Tim!


Also in attendance was Matt Smith.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 17, 2008, 03:46:50 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 17, 2008, 03:39:41 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 17, 2008, 02:34:10 PM
Notes from Timken:

In attendance last night, the big man trio of Tom Port, Ryan Gorman, and Matt Schlingman.  In absentia: Tim Vandervaart, out sick with the flu.  Better soon, Tim!


Also in attendance was Matt Smith.....

goscots - k+ since we shouldn't overlook anyone who posts on this board. :) ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 17, 2008, 06:52:01 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 17, 2008, 02:34:10 PM
Last night's game was one of the better officiated matches that I've seen at Wooster.  Kudos where kudos is due.

There were just 29 fouls called--17 on Witt, 12 on Woo.  In that sense, it was perhaps the least officiated game in a while.  But I don't doubt that "less officiating" is the equivalent of "good officiating" in your book!  ;) ;D

Seriously, though, from my position on the futon, I was not aware of the officiating, or lack thereof, being a factor one way or another during the game, and that certainly is best.

Looking ahead at the tournament, and not overlooking the two huge recent wins by a suddenly resurgent Earlham squad, I think the only 6-10 team that might cause a problem is Hiram.  They play aggressively and up-tempo, and if they are hitting they can play with anyone in the league.  As it stands right now, they'd draw Witt in the first round, and they gave the Tigers fits (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/07-08gamestories/hiram2.html) up at Hiram just a couple of weeks ago (remember Mike McDevitt's 43 points?)  Witt beat 'em by 20 in Springfield, though, and that was back in December (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/07-08gamestories/hiram.html) before things really gelled for the Tigers.

Other prospective first-round matchups are Oberlin at Wooster, Allegheny at OWU, and (of course) Wabash vs. Kenyon, location TBD.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 17, 2008, 08:06:14 PM
Beating Witt is nice, sure, and clinching your fourth conference championship in four years is okay I guess, but James Cooper got what he really wanted this evening: the coveted NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt) trophy!  Fair's fair in the NCAC Office, since Brandan Barabino was similarly honored after Witt/Woo I.  Congratulations, Coop!

Quote from: David Collinge on February 11, 2008, 11:38:38 AM
Current odds on next week's NCAC Player of the Week:
George Raftis 3:2
Bill Babe 4:1
Charlie Jaicks 6:1
Ben Torsney 6:1
Field 40:1
;)
George Raftis is just going to have to wait until next Sunday.  The odds on him have moved to 2:5.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 17, 2008, 08:48:33 PM
Wabash's Andrew Zimmer had a good week with 60 points and 21 rebounds in two games...it's worth noting.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2008, 09:56:01 AM
After spending most of the weekend demolishing my kitchen, and in the process discovering some other fun projects,  ::)  I finally have a minute to spare to share some brief thoughts on Saturday's game.

Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 17, 2008, 02:34:10 PM
Last night's game was one of the better officiated matches that I've seen at Wooster.  Kudos where kudos is due.

Quote from: David Collinge on February 17, 2008, 06:52:01 PM
But I don't doubt that "less officiating" is the equivalent of "good officiating" in your book!  ;) ;D

Seriously, though, from my position on the futon, I was not aware of the officiating, or lack thereof, being a factor one way or another during the game, and that certainly is best.

I have to agree with all of these points.  As the game went on, I really hadn't noticed how non-existent the  officials were.  It basically dawned on me in the final 2 minutes when Witt was getting to the point where they needed to start fouling and they still had 2 fouls to give with less than a minute to go in the game!  I definitely think a game where you don't notice the officials qualifies as a well officiated game.  Especially in games of this magnitude.   Can we track down that officiating crew and get them back for the NCAC tournament? ;)

As far as the game, I just sat there through Witt's unconscious 8-12 performance from deep (and many were Cooper deep) in the 1st half and thought, here we go again?! ::)  The silver lining was Wooster was only down 1 at the half and Witt surely couldn't keep that shooting pace going.  Little did I know that Witt would do one better going 0-6 from deep in the 2nd half with many not even drawing iron.  Wooster didn't help themselves any in the 2nd half either. I thought it was deja vu all over again as Wooster went on a 10-0 run building an 8 point lead and continuing to get key defensive stops only to not capitalize on the offensive end.  And sure enough, Witt quietly crept back in eventually taking the lead.  But Wooster responded on this night and did just enough to not allow a repeat of what happened in Springfield.

And what else can be said about James Cooper!  Yet another sparkling performance and yet another vivid reminder to Coach Brown about the one that got away! ;D  In case they forgot, the students helped remind them with the, "He's from Springfield" chant. ;)

I'll echo the sentiments of those praising the efforts of Wooster's bigs as well.  They have really improved as a unit.  Especially the young ones.   And speaking of young ones, I agree with WB's thoughts on Ian Franks as well.  I'm pretty sure that it's what he has done on the court that has allowed him to surpass Dustin Geitgy on the depth chart. 

All in all, great win by Wooster in clinching at least a share of their unprecedented 4th straight NCAC Championship.  Congrats especially to the seniors on such a great accomplishment!  Wooster now is one win away from clinching home court for the NCAC tournament and more importantly, shouldn't lose any ground in the GL Regional rankings.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 18, 2008, 10:09:28 AM
I would like to extend a thanks to the Wabash seniors for a great career.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 18, 2008, 11:47:50 AM
Now back from my weekend in Wooster, I have a chance to put a couple comments out there about watching two Wooster wins last week.

A few posters have beat me to it, but Wooster has definitely improved on the inside- both defensively and offensively. Will notched 5 blocks (matching his career high set about two weeks ago) and the team contributed 2 more- I'm tempted to go back through box scores to see when the last time was that Wooster had 7 blocks against Witt.  Offensively, Woo was very effective inside early when it was beating Witt's zone defense.

4 turnovers.  Wow.  I think Woo had 8 turnovers @Witt.  12 total in the two Woo-Witt games is a good sign for Wooster if they can continue to protect the basketball in the big games coming up. 

Kudos to Witt on handling the "Cooper holds for the last shot" defense well at the end of the first half.  Coop makes that shot so often when it's 1-1, but Witt brought extra defense out beyond the 3 point line and forced a poor shot from way, way outside.  It turned out to be a play that only seemed significant--ie. Witt protected its lead into halftime..Wooster misses out on the chance for a huge momentum swing, etc.--but didn't seem like it mattered at all once the second half started.

I don't know what it is, but Wooster again seemed to tighten up offensively once it opened a lead in the second half.  Ugh.  Does it just seem like every time Wooster gets up 8-10 points on a good opponent we're unable to keep the pressure up and push it out to 12-15?  I felt like Woo started making bad offensive choices (awkward Cooper fade-away, Wickliffe shoots a 3?) moreso than Witt shutting Woo down on offense...but the opportunity was there around the 14 minute mark to push the advantage out into double digits, and Wooster suddenly lost its offense.

Overall, though, another quality game in a great rivalry.  Wooster guts out the 66-61 win.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2008, 12:01:32 PM
I have to wonder about the interplay between the subdued officiating and the seven Wooster blocks (Will five, Melick and Johnson one apiece).  Could it be that the major difference between blocks Saturday and fouls in games past was the officiating?  That Will's technique wasn't actually that much better than in the past?  I wasn't there, so I can't know for sure, but on TV the interior defense didn't seem all that different to me, just un-whistled.  (This is not a knock on Will's great game Saturday, but rather a mild criticism of the sometimes overzealous officiating at other Timken games.)

The rebounding and the interior offense did seem to me to be much improved, however.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 18, 2008, 02:00:50 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 18, 2008, 11:47:50 AM
I don't know what it is, but Wooster again seemed to tighten up offensively once it opened a lead in the second half.  Ugh.  Does it just seem like every time Wooster gets up 8-10 points on a good opponent we're unable to keep the pressure up and push it out to 12-15?  I felt like Woo started making bad offensive choices (awkward Cooper fade-away, Wickliffe shoots a 3?) moreso than Witt shutting Woo down on offense...but the opportunity was there around the 14 minute mark to push the advantage out into double digits, and Wooster suddenly lost its offense.

This does happen all too often.  Too often for me to believe that it's just due to the inevitable ebb and flow of the game.  Most of the time, and this was true to some extent in the Witt game, it's because Wooster gets conservative, too careful, and passes up too many open looks, especially on threes.  But sometimes it's something else, like Wickliffe taking two consecutive early outside shots.  I don't care if they both would have gone in, the Scots have better options than that (one of which would be to get the ball inside to Wickliffe himself).

Bidwell, Will, and even Johnson (who usually will take them when available) passed on some very good three-ball opportunities, choosing instead to fake the shot and try to drive.  I'd like to see the wide-open three go up there more often, as these guys can all shoot the ball very well.

Quote from: David Collinge on February 18, 2008, 12:01:32 PM
I have to wonder about the interplay between the subdued officiating and the seven Wooster blocks (Will five, Melick and Johnson one apiece).  Could it be that the major difference between blocks Saturday and fouls in games past was the officiating?  That Will's technique wasn't actually that much better than in the past?  I wasn't there, so I can't know for sure, but on TV the interior defense didn't seem all that different to me, just un-whistled.  (This is not a knock on Will's great game Saturday, but rather a mild criticism of the sometimes overzealous officiating at other Timken games.)

Very likely true.  And, by the way, these refs all looked familiar to me, veterans of prior games at Timken, guys that I've very likely harpooned in the past.  I think they did a better job on Saturday, and my voicebox feels the better for it.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 19, 2008, 08:03:42 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 18, 2008, 02:00:50 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 18, 2008, 11:47:50 AM
I don't know what it is, but Wooster again seemed to tighten up offensively once it opened a lead in the second half.  Ugh.  Does it just seem like every time Wooster gets up 8-10 points on a good opponent we're unable to keep the pressure up and push it out to 12-15?  I felt like Woo started making bad offensive choices (awkward Cooper fade-away, Wickliffe shoots a 3?) moreso than Witt shutting Woo down on offense...but the opportunity was there around the 14 minute mark to push the advantage out into double digits, and Wooster suddenly lost its offense.

This does happen all too often.  Too often for me to believe that it's just due to the inevitable ebb and flow of the game.  Most of the time, and this was true to some extent in the Witt game, it's because Wooster gets conservative, too careful, and passes up too many open looks, especially on threes.  But sometimes it's something else, like Wickliffe taking two consecutive early outside shots.  I don't care if they both would have gone in, the Scots have better options than that (one of which would be to get the ball inside to Wickliffe himself).

Bidwell, Will, and even Johnson (who usually will take them when available) passed on some very good three-ball opportunities, choosing instead to fake the shot and try to drive.  I'd like to see the wide-open three go up there more often, as these guys can all shoot the ball very well.

Quote from: David Collinge on February 18, 2008, 12:01:32 PM
I have to wonder about the interplay between the subdued officiating and the seven Wooster blocks (Will five, Melick and Johnson one apiece).  Could it be that the major difference between blocks Saturday and fouls in games past was the officiating?  That Will's technique wasn't actually that much better than in the past?  I wasn't there, so I can't know for sure, but on TV the interior defense didn't seem all that different to me, just un-whistled.  (This is not a knock on Will's great game Saturday, but rather a mild criticism of the sometimes overzealous officiating at other Timken games.)

Very likely true.  And, by the way, these refs all looked familiar to me, veterans of prior games at Timken, guys that I've very likely harpooned in the past.  I think they did a better job on Saturday, and my voicebox feels the better for it.





I seemed that everytime Earlham played at Wooster they had the same officals.  So we had a joke that Wooster was employing their own officals to officate their games at Timken.  But with the NCAC scheduling them.  But it was something that we would always say.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 19, 2008, 11:42:34 AM
Ok guys-I'm sure it's well past relativeness but anyways here are my thoughts on the game(s) Saturday --

The JV game was a well fought contest with Wooster jumping out big and Witt fighting back but it was too little too late.

GREAT atmosphere for the game throughout. The whiteout for Wooster seemed to work well and Wittenberg had an enthusiastic following. Although i must admit that I hate playing against Cooper because of his presence and challenge that he brings, I myself had to stand up and applaud when he was recognized for senior night, and it was a well-deserved standing ovation. Now as for the game.

The intensity both teams brought was once again as i said earlier in the week on another level. Witt and Wooster seemd to match each-other for what seemed like the entire game. One team would go on a little spurt and the other team would answer with a spurt. Essentially the game ended with Wooster going on their little spurt and with no time left that resulted in the 66-61 Wooster win. The officiating was very sparse and allowed the teams to play, which seemed to hurt Witt several times down low as some fouls may have  been called otherwise, i'm not complaining as this had little impact on the outcome. One call that may have been argued was a timeout late in the game called by Fulk? as he was falling out of bounds, which "is not allowed" based on the new rule changes by the NCAA this year.....but anyways.

I have some theorizing based on Witt shooting 8-12 from 3point range and missing 3's in the second half. Any observer of the game obviously could read into Witt's strategy to run the shot clock down and look for one shot. This was to keep the game at a slower pace and not allow Wooster to get into their run and gun preference. I thought this was interesting based on our discussions earlier about how boring this can be. But this attributed to some of the long 3's Witt took as Wooster played great defense thorughout the game forcing these shots and often times Witt was found frustrated that they couldn't get a higher-percentage shot off.

So it looks like Witt is going to once again have to settle some demons and fight the OWU/Wooster gauntlet up at Wooster for seemingly the 3rd year in a row i think. Witt has not played well either time against OWU as one play could have changed either outcome, and i fully believe that Witt can beat Wooster and vice versa anytime they play. Let's hope for a Witt/Wooster 3 to let the rubber match play out itself. Also OWU i think killed any at large hopes with their great showing against Earlham Saturday.......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 19, 2008, 02:04:22 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 19, 2008, 11:42:34 AM
One call that may have been argued was a timeout late in the game called by Fulk? as he was falling out of bounds, which "is not allowed" based on the new rule changes by the NCAA this year.....but anyways.
Doesn't the rule state that a player cannot be airborne and falling out of bounds while calling a timeout?  Devin had at least one, if not both feet inbounds and on the ground while he was falling out of bounds.  He wasn't airborne and falling out of bounds.  In fact, here's a quote of the approved proposal from the rules committee from the NCAA:

Quote from: NCAA Playing Rules Oversight Panel Approves  Basketball ProposalsAlso approved was the rules committees' proposal that does not allow an airborne player falling out of bounds or into the backcourt to be granted a timeout.
So, I don't think that the refs missed the call by granting Fulk the timeout as he was not airborne while falling out of bounds.  Besides, I thought Fulk saved the ball anyways.  The ref had just granted him the timeout before Fulk made the pass.  I'll have to look at the replay to see for sure.  In any event, I think the correct call was made.

Quote from: pennstghs on February 19, 2008, 11:42:34 AM
So it looks like Witt is going to once again have to settle some demons and fight the OWU/Wooster gauntlet up at Wooster for seemingly the 3rd year in a row i think.
This is actually the 4th year in a row that Wooster is hosting the NCAC Tournament.  In fact, Witt actually won the tournament 2 out of the last 3 years.  The Tigers beat Wooster 2 years in a row in the finals in '05 and '06.  They lost to OWU in the semis last year thank goodness or they may very well be working on a 3 year streak. ::)  At least Wooster got the monkey off their back somewhat by finally beating Witt after losing 4 of their last 5 to the Tigers at Timken.  And it was nice to not have to hear the Witt fans chanting, 'Our House' after the game.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 20, 2008, 12:56:23 AM
i think we get the point by now that "he's from springfield" too......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 20, 2008, 10:16:51 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 20, 2008, 12:56:23 AM
i think we get the point by now that "he's from springfield" too......

Amen to this.  Reason #139 why I'm glad James Cooper is graduating is that this stuff:

Quote
another vivid reminder to Coach Brown about the one that got away! ;D  In case they forgot, the students helped remind them with the, "He's from Springfield" chant. ;)

goes away.  This is easily the most overblown non-issue in the league over the last four years. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 20, 2008, 10:32:27 AM
Can anyone answer me a question??
Should the Big Red find a way to win tonight against Earlham. 
Both Denison and Oberlin have 3 conference wins............
Who gets the pleasure of getting crushed by the Scots in the first round??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 20, 2008, 10:50:17 AM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on February 20, 2008, 10:32:27 AM
Who gets the pleasure of getting crushed by the Scots in the first round??

Oh c'mon BRG...that's not the right attitude.  Remember, whether you think you can or think you can't, you're right.    ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2008, 11:20:16 AM
I think it then depends on their worst losses - the records against Earlham, then Hiram, etc....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 20, 2008, 11:57:52 AM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on February 20, 2008, 10:32:27 AM
Can anyone answer me a question??
Should the Big Red find a way to win tonight against Earlham. 
Both Denison and Oberlin have 3 conference wins............
Who gets the pleasure of getting crushed by the Scots in the first round??

My guess is that it comes down to a coin toss.  They have split their season matchups and would have both beaten Earlham twice and lost to everyone else...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2008, 12:10:28 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 20, 2008, 10:16:51 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 20, 2008, 12:56:23 AM
i think we get the point by now that "he's from springfield" too......

Amen to this.  Reason #139 why I'm glad James Cooper is graduating is that this stuff:

Quote
another vivid reminder to Coach Brown about the one that got away! ;D  In case they forgot, the students helped remind them with the, "He's from Springfield" chant. ;)

goes away.  This is easily the most overblown non-issue in the league over the last four years. 
The Witt students aren't exactly saints in this whole thing either with their 'ACT' chants down in Springfield... ::)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 20, 2008, 12:12:22 PM
If it is a coin toss I guess you want to win it just to play one more game.  Especially for the seniors.

If it based on the worst loss..........40 points to Wooster stands out.  

I am not saying "on any given Sunday" any team can win.  But in this case I would be willing to bet the ranch on the Scots.

Speaking of guys getting away how did Devin Fulk get away from Denison.  Maybe it is as simple as wanting to a little further from home.  Or in Devin's case there was NO WAY he wanted anything to do with the Big Red.  He is obviously a very good player and had to be on Ghiloni's radar.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2008, 12:17:43 PM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on February 20, 2008, 12:12:22 PM
If it based on the worst loss..........40 points to Wooster stands out. 

"Worst loss" (in this context) doesn't mean "suckiest loss," it means loss to the worst-placed team.  In a "worst-loss" tie-breaker, you take the tied teams and compare their records vs. the rest of the league, starting at the bottom.  In this case, as cmhscots points out, all that gets you is nausea.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 20, 2008, 12:31:07 PM
Thanks DC.......obviously I need all the help I can get. :-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 20, 2008, 01:09:23 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 20, 2008, 12:10:28 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 20, 2008, 10:16:51 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 20, 2008, 12:56:23 AM
i think we get the point by now that "he's from springfield" too......

Amen to this.  Reason #139 why I'm glad James Cooper is graduating is that this stuff:

Quote
another vivid reminder to Coach Brown about the one that got away! ;D  In case they forgot, the students helped remind them with the, "He's from Springfield" chant. ;)

goes away.  This is easily the most overblown non-issue in the league over the last four years. 
The Witt students aren't exactly saints in this whole thing either with their 'ACT' chants down in Springfield... ::)

Nope...I should have been "fair and balanced" in my earlier criticism.  The whole thing is lame from both sides.  If I didn't know any better, I'd swear James Cooper was the first kid ever to go to college somewhere other than his own hometown.  Wait...I do know better.  It happens all the time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 20, 2008, 03:48:58 PM
Word has it that on Saturday following the Wabash game will be the Big Red alumni game.
That has always been a well attended event and hopefully it will be another wonderful turnout again this year.

Congratulations to the four seniors on the Big Red for their hard work and dedication during what turned out to be a very long year.  Best of luck to all of you.

You never gave up!!!!  GO BIG RED!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 20, 2008, 05:05:40 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 20, 2008, 01:09:23 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 20, 2008, 12:10:28 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 20, 2008, 10:16:51 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 20, 2008, 12:56:23 AM
i think we get the point by now that "he's from springfield" too......

Amen to this.  Reason #139 why I'm glad James Cooper is graduating is that this stuff:

Quote
another vivid reminder to Coach Brown about the one that got away! ;D  In case they forgot, the students helped remind them with the, "He's from Springfield" chant. ;)

goes away.  This is easily the most overblown non-issue in the league over the last four years. 
The Witt students aren't exactly saints in this whole thing either with their 'ACT' chants down in Springfield... ::)

Nope...I should have been "fair and balanced" in my earlier criticism.  The whole thing is lame from both sides.  If I didn't know any better, I'd swear James Cooper was the first kid ever to go to college somewhere other than his own hometown.  Wait...I do know better.  It happens all the time.

yes it is not the first time this has happened. i just think it is not as big of an issue generally either and people use it against Wittenberg all the time when in fact it is not even a concern.

Good luck to Witt tonight vs Wabash on Senior Night! Witt is losing 3 tremendous assets to their program
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 20, 2008, 06:29:42 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 20, 2008, 05:05:40 PM
Good luck to Witt tonight vs Wabash on Senior Night! Witt is losing 3 tremendous assets to their program

I move that Wittenberg postpone Senior Night activities until Tuesday.  All in favor?   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 20, 2008, 08:03:11 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 42  Allegheny 36

Wooster is being led by freshman Bryan Wickliffe with 20 points, James Cooper with 7 points and Devin Fulk with 7 points.

Allegheny is being led by George Raftis, Bill Babe and Craig Devinney with 9 points each.

Both teams shot well in the half (~55% each) but Wooster outrebounded the Gators by 18 to 9 which gave the Scots several extra possessions that led to 18 shots made vs only 14 made by Allegheny.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 20, 2008, 09:01:33 PM
Final:  Wooster 84  Allegheny 74 :)

Wooster was led by freshman Bryan Wickliffe with a season high 25 points (7 boards), Devin Fulk with 19 points, James Cooper with 13 points and Brandon Johnson with 10.

Allegheny was paced by Craig Devinney with 21 points, Bill Babe with 17 points and George Raftis with 15 points.

This was post Witt letdown night and the Scots still managed to get the win.  Kudos to the Gators who shot very well tonight (54%).

Congratulations to the Scots on their 4th straight NCAC regular season title!

Wooster is now 21-3, 14-1 NCAC ;D   Next game at Earlham on Saturday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 20, 2008, 09:07:36 PM
Here's a score of interest:

Heidelberg 80
Capital      74


This won't be reflected in the regional rankings tomorrow, but will be in the following week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 20, 2008, 09:14:46 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 20, 2008, 09:07:36 PM
Here's a score of interest:

Heidelberg 80
Capital      74


This won't be reflected in the regional rankings tomorrow, but will be in the following week.

Good news for Wooster as that score may push them to the top of the regional rankings next week if they can win at Earlham on Saturday.

2nd Regional Rankings are actually out tonight.

Great Lakes rankings (regional records noted)
1.  Capital 19-3
2.  Wooster 13-2
3.  Hope 13-2
4.  Albion 12-3
5.  Penn State Behrend 17-3
6.  Heidelberg 16-4

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 20, 2008, 09:17:11 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 20, 2008, 09:14:46 PM

2nd Regional Rankings are actually out tonight.


I forgot it was Wednesday.   :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 20, 2008, 09:52:14 PM
In a game that was tied at the half, Witt defeats Wabash tonight 69-63.  Witt's led by 16 points and 7 boards from Kevin Murray, as well as 13 points each from Hill and 'Bino.  Wabash gets a big 23 from Wesley Smith and 12 from Zimmer.

Wabash actually led by 5 with nine-and-a-half to go in the game, but the Tigers were able to pull it out down the stretch.

Witt finishes the regular season at Kenyon on Saturday.

Elsewhere....

OWU rebounds from their Saturday loss and defeats Oberlin 82-58.
Kenyon defeats Hiram 93-82.
Denison picks up a win over Earlham 69-61.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 20, 2008, 09:59:16 PM
NCAC 2/20 Final Scores:
Wittenberg 69  Wabash 63
Ohio Wesleyan 82  Oberlin 58
Denison 69  Earlham 61
Kenyon 93  Hiram 82
Wooster 84  Allegheny 74

Updated NCAC Standings:
Wooster 14-1
Wittenberg 12-3
Ohio Wesleyan 11-4
Kenyon 10-5
Wabash 9-6
Allegheny 6-9
Hiram 5-10
Oberlin 3-12
Denison 3-12
Earlham 2-13
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 20, 2008, 10:00:28 PM
Big Red 3 wins........Oberlin 3 wins..........oil up the coin!!!!
Get ready Scots here we come!!!
Don't they always say it is REAL hard to beat a team 3 times!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 20, 2008, 10:31:19 PM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on February 20, 2008, 10:00:28 PM
oil up the coin!!!!

What exactly is going to be done with this coin?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2008, 02:37:42 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 20, 2008, 09:59:16 PM
Updated NCAC Standings:
Wooster 14-1
Wittenberg 12-3
Ohio Wesleyan 11-4
Kenyon 10-5
Wabash 9-6
Allegheny 6-9
Hiram 5-10
Oberlin 3-12
Denison 3-12
Earlham 2-13

Tournament seeding:
#1: Wooster
#2-#3: OWU holds the tie-breaker on Witt, by virtue of their head-to-head sweep.  Thus, if on Saturday OWU wins (at 'Gheny) and Witt loses (at Kenyon), OWU is the #2 seed.  Otherwise, it's Witt #2 and OWU #3
#4-#5: Wabash and Kenyon split, and both will have been 6-2 at home and 4-4 on the road (not sure if that's in the tie-breakers).  Nevertheless, Wabash has the tie-breaker whether it is best-win (OWU) or worst-loss (Kenyon's loss at Earlham).  Thus, if Kenyon loses (to Witt) and Wabash wins (at Denison), Wabash is the #4 and Kenyon the #5.  Otherwise, vice-versa.  Either way, these teams will meet on Tuesday in the quarterfinals.
#6-#7: Allegheny and Hiram split.  If Hiram wins (at Oberlin) and Gheny loses (to OWU), both teams would be 6-10, with wins over each other, at Earlham, Denison (x2) and Oberlin (x2).  With nothing to differentiate them, I assume that this would result in a coin toss.  So Allegheny is the #6 seed, and Hiram the #7, if any of the following occur: 1) Gheny beats OWU; 2) Oberlin beats Hiram; or 3) Gheny wins the coin toss.
#8: 
Scenario 1a: Oberlin wins (over Hiram) and Denison loses (to Wabash)--Oberlin is #8 at 4-12.
Scenario 1b: Denison wins and Oberlin loses--Denison is #8 at 4-12.
Scenario 2: Oberlin and Denison each win Saturday to go 4-12.  The teams split, and each swept Earlham; each would be 3-5 at home and 1-7 on the road.  The fourth win would be Saturday's, and as Wabash will finish ahead of Hiram, Denison would earn the #8 bid.
Scenario 3a: Oberlin and Denison each lose Saturday, and Earlham loses to Wooster.  As in scenario 2, the teams split and each swept Earlham.  Although their schedules were not identical*, I think this becomes a coin toss scenario.  Whether the coin should be oiled is a separate question.
Scenario 3b: Oberlin and Denison each lose Saturday, and Earlham defeats Wooster, resulting in a 3-way tie at 3-13.  I think the way this works is that Earlham is eliminated by virtue of an 0-4 record among the tied teams, after which Oberlin and Denison (each 3-1 in the group) revert to the coin toss from Scenario 3a.  Thus, it is my belief that Earlham has been eliminated from playoff contention.  But I admit that I'm just guessing, as I find this scenario the least likely to come to pass.

*Because of the not-quite-double-round-robin scheduling, Denison played Wooster twice and OWU once, while Oberlin played Wooster once and OWU twice, all of the foregoing being losses.  Strictly speaking, Denison would win a 'worst-loss' tiebreaker by virtue of being 0-1 against second-or-third-place OWU while Oberlin was 0-2, but I don't think it would play out that way.  (Besides, I think the tie-breaker is 'best-win', not 'worst-loss'.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DadofBashWarrior.. on February 21, 2008, 12:11:29 PM
Congrats to Yelvington at Kenyon on his game last night.....Career high and terriffic stats.....been following him since his HS days....Great young Man
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 21, 2008, 12:53:36 PM
If my calculations are correct, James Cooper has now amassed 1943 career points.  If he scores 14 points at Earlham on Saturday he'll tie Bryan Nelson for 2nd in career scoring at Wooster.  He should have a legitimate shot at passing the 2000 point mark during the conference semi-final game, assuming that Wooster advances on Tuesday.

And an unrelated question - how long is the Scots' winning streak over Earlham?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 21, 2008, 01:03:04 PM
I finally found the official tiebreakers:

1. Head-to-Head competition (NCAC contests only – no restrictions regarding number of games and sites).
2. Combined win-loss record with all teams above tied teams (restricted to "like" games – any team played twice; and single games played at the same location, either home or away).
3. Record versus individual opponents examined in descending order of standings (restricted to "like" games – any team played twice; and single games played at the same location, either home or away).
4. Coin toss.

IF THREE OR MORE TEAMS ARE TIED, the combined records of the teams
involved versus each other are totaled and rankings are listed according to
the winning percentage. The best percentage will be given the highest
seed. If two or more teams tie for the highest percentage, the lowest team
will be seeded. Once the lowest team is clearly seeded the remaining
teams repeat the process until the tie is broken. If three or more
percentages are arrived in initial process, and no ties remain, then teams
shall be seeded according to their percentages.

LIKE GAMES: Defined as: games that are played under the same
traveling condition (either home or away). E.G.: OWU and ALL are tied.
ALL plays DEN once—at DEN. OWU plays DEN twice—once home and
once at DEN. In comparing the two schedules, only compare the games
at DEN, throw out the DEN at OWU game. All teams played home &
home are also "like" games (teams that play each other twice).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 21, 2008, 01:09:11 PM
In case anyone is interested, the NCAC Baseketball Policies and Procedures are here: http://www.northcoast.org/policies/basketball.pdf
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2008, 01:54:55 PM
Great work, cmhscots--thanks!

Okay, let's apply tie-breaker #2 to a potential Wabash/Kenyon tie.  The teams above them are Woo, Witt, and OWU.  Wabash played each one twice.  Kenyon played Witt twice, and played at Woo and played OWU at home.  Kenyon's record in those games would be 0-4 (presuming a loss Sat. to Witt, necessary for there to be a tie.)  Wabash's record against Witt, at Woo, and vs. OWU is 1-3--they beat OWU at home.  Thus, Wabash has the tie-breaker over Kenyon.

A potential Hiram/Allegheny tie for 6th is still a coin toss, as their records/schedules would be identical.

Oberlin and Denison tied at 4-12 (Scenario 2 in my post above) still goes to Denison, using tie-breaker #3 ("best-win.")  Head-to-head they split, and collective like record against the teams #1-#7 would be 1-9 each (like games are home vs. Woo, at OWU, and 2x vs. Wabash, Kenyon, Allegheny, and Hiram, and the only wins would be home wins by Denison over Wabash and Oberlin over Allegheny, both this coming Saturday.)  Tie-breaker #3 falls to Denison by virtue of their win over Wabash (necessary to make this scenario possible.)

Oberlin and Denison tied at 3-13 (Scenario 3a above) is still an oily coin toss.  It's the same as above, without the fantasy wins over Wabash and Allegheny.  If those two wins are losses, tie-breaker #3 is indecisive, and we move to #4--coin toss.

Oberlin, Denison, and Earlham tied at 3-13 (Scenario 3b), it is the same result as scenario 3a (Oberlin/Denison coin toss.)  The first tie-breaker is
Quotethe combined records of the teams
involved versus each other are totaled and rankings are listed according to
the winning percentage. The best percentage will be given the highest
seed. If two or more teams tie for the highest percentage, the lowest team
will be seeded.
Those percentages are Oberlin .750, Denison .750, Earlham .000 (both OC and DU swept EC, and split with each other.)  Thus Earlham is seeded (#10) and the process continues with OC and DU.
QuoteOnce the lowest team is clearly seeded the remaining
teams repeat the process until the tie is broken.
Were left with Oberlin and Denison tied at 3-13, which is the same as Scenario 3a.

So farewell and adieu to Earlham, who have been eliminated even if they can manage to beat Wooster Saturday.  Which seems strange: they could finish with wins over the #1, #2, and #4 teams in the conference and finish behind two teams that beat nobody better-placed than #8.  But that would be a fitting end to Earlham's bizarre Jekyll/Hyde season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 21, 2008, 02:12:07 PM
Hmm...color me very concerned about Wabash's chances of hosting a first round game.  Wittenberg, for all intents and purposes, has virtually nothing to gain (what's the difference between a #2 seed and a #3 seed..zilch as far as I can tell) and everything to lose (specifically, the risk of injury to key players).  It's a different story if Wittenberg were a pool C candidate, but that seems pretty unrealistic at this point.  Kenyon on the other hand has everything to play for...home court advantage next week, senior day, the warm feeling you get anytime you beat Wittenberg at anything, etc.  I was really hoping that the #4 seed wouldn't come down to the last Saturday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2008, 03:22:33 PM
Of course, Witt could win and Wabash could lose. It's been that kinda year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 21, 2008, 03:40:06 PM
I have to think Wabash prevails against the Big Red on Saturday.
It is the OILY coin. :-)  Very slippery oily coin.   I wonder who is there when they flip or are they just told by the NCAC you lost or won. 
It is one more game but I don't know which is worse...losing the flip or having to get stomped by the Scots.  Come tournament time NO coach is going to be Mr. Nice guy.

It is one and done for either Oberlin or the Big Red and that is a fact.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2008, 04:02:22 PM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on February 21, 2008, 03:40:06 PM
It is one more game but I don't know which is worse...losing the flip or having to get stomped by the Scots.

Ask Brian Elder, Chris Eberst, Tom Perkins, or Brian Gognat (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/mens_basketball_roster.html) which is worse.  Ask Jordan Beard, Matthew Godwin, Chase Palmer, or Elvis Francois (http://www.oberlin.edu/athletic/varsity/m_basketball/roster.html).  I'll guarantee you get the same answer 8 times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 21, 2008, 04:08:37 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 21, 2008, 04:02:22 PM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on February 21, 2008, 03:40:06 PM
It is one more game but I don't know which is worse...losing the flip or having to get stomped by the Scots.

Ask Brian Elder, Chris Eberst, Tom Perkins, or Brian Gognat (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/mens_basketball_roster.html) which is worse.  Ask Jordan Beard, Matthew Godwin, Chase Palmer, or Elvis Francois (http://www.oberlin.edu/athletic/varsity/m_basketball/roster.html).  I'll guarantee you get the same answer 8 times.

Definitely.  Oberlin and Denison are longshots to advance in the tournament for sure.  But longshot has better odds than no shot.  I can't imagine either team would want to throw away the opportunity to play next week. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2008, 04:47:22 PM
Quote from: DadofBashWarrior.. on February 21, 2008, 12:11:29 PM
Congrats to Yelvington at Kenyon on his game last night.....Career high and terriffic stats.....been following him since his HS days....Great young Man

A little more on this...at Hiram last night, in another must-win game for Kenyon (as they all are at this point), Bryan poured in a career-best 34 points on 12-of-14 shooting (7/7 after the half) and a perfect 10/10 from the line.  He also had nine rebounds and three assists on the evening.  Bryan is averaging 15.0 ppg and 7.6 rpg, and is shooting .518 from the floor and .825 from the line.  I think he's a shoo-in for one of the seven first-team all-conference slots, and should be a dark horse candidate for POY next season.  I don't know him (I tend to avoid contact with the players) but I've heard nothing but good things about him from coaches and parents around the league. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2008, 11:43:13 PM
...which reminds me, with the regular season coming to a close this weekend, it's time to start thinking of all-conference teams.  For reasons that escape me, the coaches select a seven-man first team and a seven-man second team on separate (and sequential) ballots.  The honorable mentions are then selected (by third ballot) in a somewhat more complex way that ensures that every school is represented on the overall list.  How the coaches have the time and energy for all this is a mystery, but hey! when it comes to NCAC hoops, we've got time and energy in abundance! ;D

So I'd like to suggest that we provide our own all-conference teams.  The guidelines (found in the document cmhscots linked to earlier today) tell us that nominations begin tomorrow and voting begins Monday, but it doesn't say when the teams will be announced.  I think we should plan to have our teams ready by the first semifinal tipoff next Friday. 

We'll dispense with the sequential balloting and all that razzmatazz.  If you're interested in participating, post your seven-man first team and your seven-man second team, together with your selections for Player of the Year, Newcomer of the Year, and Coach of the Year, over in the Pick'ems room, with a deadline of, say, 3pm next Friday 2/29.  I'll compile the results, and figure out an honorable mention, and post the teams that afternoon.  Everyone who feels sufficiently well-informed to participate is welcome to do so.

Personally, I think your decisions should be made on the basis of conference-only stats, as opposed to overall stats, in addition to whatever intangibles you think are important (such as leadership or sportsmanship,) but it's entirely up to you.  Here's two links to help you out:
Individual stats, conference-only (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/07-08stats/CONFONLY.HTM#conf.wki)
Individual stats, overall (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/07-08stats/CONFLDRS.HTM#conf.wki)

If for whatever reason you'd prefer your picks to be anonymous and/or kept confidential, you can PM them to me through this site (preferred) or email them to me at dacollinge <at> yahoo <dot> com.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 22, 2008, 04:05:27 AM
How do they deal with player positions?  How should we?  A balanced team, or just whom we consider the seven best guys even if they're all posts or guards?

Note the time of this post.  I can't sleep worrying about the fortunes of the Scots. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 22, 2008, 10:15:54 AM
I will give you seven out of eight........Gognat has been hurt all season and I am sure another bus ride to Wooster isn't in his top ten things he wants to do.  I am probably wrong again, it is just a guess.

Rah Rah!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2008, 12:04:52 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 22, 2008, 04:05:27 AM
How do they deal with player positions?  How should we?  A balanced team, or just whom we consider the seven best guys even if they're all posts or guards?

They don't.  Coaches can vote for anyone on the ballot, except their own players.  Since it's a seven-man team, I'm not sure that forcing a positional balance is important.

However, positional balance may be a by-product of your selections, even if unintentional.  Personally I find it difficult to compare a player like Mike Staley to a player like Dave Knapke straight up; if the final slot on my team were to come down to two players such as these (purely hypothetical), I'd probably opt for Staley solely by virtue of his being (IMO) the second-best point guard in the league as opposed to Knapke being just one of the 7-10 best forwards. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2008, 01:43:37 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 44  Earlham 31

Wooster is being led by James Cooper with 23 points (4 three pointers) and Marty Bidwell with 5 points.

Earlham is being led by Nick Welsh with 14 points and Tristian Gregory with 12 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2008, 01:51:46 PM
Congratulations to All American James Cooper who has now passed Bryan Nelson and become Wooster's all time #2 scorer.  :)

Cooper is at 1,966 points for his career and closing in on 2,000.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2008, 02:46:52 PM
Final:  Wooster 92  Earlham 65

Wooster was led by James Cooper with 29 points, Evan Will with 14 points and Marty Bidwell with 10 points.

Quakers were led by Nick Welsh with 23 points, Tristian Gregory with 16 and Justin Carter with 12.

Wooster shot 53% and outrebounded Earlham 46 to 23.

Wooster is now 22-3, 15-1 NCAC  ;D  Next game is NCAC tourney at home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 23, 2008, 04:56:32 PM
Kenyon beats Wittenberg 64-51.  The Lords led by 10 at halftime and by as many as 21.

Stats Here (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/07-08statistics/witm0223.htm)

Things not looking good for the Tigers heading into the NCAC tourney.  I think Hiram has a legitimate chance to beat them in the first round (if that's who Witt draws - I think the long trip to Springfield would derail Allegheny), and OWU will beat them in the semis, if they get there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jpope2 on February 23, 2008, 05:44:05 PM
I didnt catch the scots game. Was wandering why Wickliffe did not play?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 23, 2008, 06:11:01 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 23, 2008, 04:56:32 PM
Kenyon beats Wittenberg 64-51.  The Lords led by 10 at halftime and by as many as 21.

Stats Here (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/07-08statistics/witm0223.htm)

Things not looking good for the Tigers heading into the NCAC tourney.  I think Hiram has a legitimate chance to beat them in the first round (if that's who Witt draws - I think the long trip to Springfield would derail Allegheny), and OWU will beat them in the semis, if they get there.


At least, Witt has Paco Labrador!!!!

Watch the Allegheny/OWU game:
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/allegheny-college-athletics




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 23, 2008, 06:24:18 PM
Quote from: jpope2 on February 23, 2008, 05:44:05 PM
I didnt catch the scots game. Was wandering why Wickliffe did not play?

Wickliffe was sick.  He was dressed, but didn't play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2008, 08:01:11 PM
I don't know what to say about the Kenyon/Witt game.  It was not close.  Kenyon played wonderfully, especially on defense.  The first ten minutes, the game was a terrific defensive struggle at both ends, with both teams having trouble even getting a decent look before the shot clock expired.  Eventually, though, Kenyon was able to open up a running game, and quickly got out to a double digit lead.  Things never got easier for the Tigers, who rarely had an open shot from inside 24 feet, and had to survive on putbacks.  Kenyon really got their inside game going, finding Knapke (16) and Yelvington (18) open time and again in the paint.  Plus the Lords got the half of the ages from Allen Bediako, who ripped down eight first-half rebounds like a man possessed.  At the half, the Lords held a 10-point edge, but everyone knew that Witt was more than capable of erasing that in a hurry.  Instead, the opposite happened.  Almost before I looked up, Kenyon had scored the first 11 points of the second half to open up a 21-point cushion.  Witt had two turnovers and five misses in their first six possessions, while Kenyon ripped off three three-pointers.  Although you can never count a Bill Brown-coached team out, even down 21 with 16:00 left, Kenyon had been so dominant that there was little doubt remaining as to the outcome. 

I then raced down to Granville to catch the second half of the Denison/Wabash game, and saw a Denison team that clearly wanted their season to continue.  Trailing by just six at the half, they hung close to a taller, faster, and just better Wabash squad for most of the half, eventually falling by just 11, 86-75.  Wabash looked like they didn't really want to be there, but they often look that way to me. 

If Kenyon and Wabash repeat their respective performances on Tuesday, it's the Lords who will be moving on.

In the meantime, the season comes to a close for Denison, without the use of the well-oiled coin, as Oberlin clinched the #8 seed and trip to Wooster by beating Hiram 76-73.  Hiram will be the #7 seed and Allegheny the #6; who they will play depends on the outcome of the OWU/Allegheny game in progress (OWU leads by 13 in the 2nd).  If OWU wins, they will be the #2 seed and draw the Pups, but if they lose, Witt gets the #2 and OWU have to face 'Gheny in a rematch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2008, 08:38:51 PM
OWU has finished off the Gators, 72-62.  Here's the final NCAC standings and seeds:

1. Wooster 15-1
2. (tie) Ohio Wesleyan 12-4 (#2 seed)
2. (tie) Wittenberg 12-4 (#3 seed)
4. Kenyon 11-5
5. Wabash 10-6
6. Allegheny 6-10
7. Hiram 5-11
8. Oberlin 4-12
9. Denison 3-13 (misses tournament)
10. Earlham 2-14 (misses tournament)

Tuesday's quarterfinals will be thus:
#8 Oberlin at #1 Wooster, 7:30 pm
#5 Wabash at #4 Kenyon, 6:00 pm
#6 Allegheny at #3 Wittenberg, 6:00 pm
#7 Hiram at #2 Ohio Wesleyan, 6:00 pm

Those games are 6:00 starts because they are all the first game of doubleheaders, as Kenyon (women's top seed), Witt (women's #3) and OWU (women's #2) are hosting quarterfinal games at 8:00 (vs. Earlham, Oberlin, and Hiram, respectively).  Three chances for fans to get out and support NCAC hoops in a rare Tuesday double-dip!  (The fourth women's quarterfinal pairs #5 Allegheny at #4 Denison at 7:30). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 23, 2008, 09:26:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 23, 2008, 08:38:51 PM
Three chances for fans to get out and support NCAC hoops in a rare Tuesday double-dip!

I'll be surprised if the total attendance for both Witt games combined is over 1,000... :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 23, 2008, 10:51:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 21, 2008, 11:43:13 PM

We'll dispense with the sequential balloting and all that razzmatazz.  If you're interested in participating, post your seven-man first team and your seven-man second team, together with your selections for Player of the Year, Newcomer of the Year, and Coach of the Year, over in the Pick'ems room, with a deadline of, say, 3pm next Friday 2/29.  I'll compile the results, and figure out an honorable mention, and post the teams that afternoon.  Everyone who feels sufficiently well-informed to participate is welcome to do so.


Just to help everyone out - here are the freshman with big minutes this year. Sorry if the list doesn't post well. These numbers are for the entire season, not just conference play. It looks to be a 3 horse race. Haddox has the highest average, good FT and 3PT shooter. Wickliffe has the best % from the floor and is 2nd in rebounds. Smith is the worst shooter of the three but he has an unbelievable number of steals and leads in blocks and rebounds as well.

Overall, Oberlin and Hiram had the largest group of freshman who put in substantial quality minutes (4 each). Most eveyone else had 1 (Kenyon had 2 and Alleghany & OWU had none).

SCH  # Name                GP/GS     M/G   FG/FGT    FG% 3P/3PT  3FG%  FT/FTT    FT%   RB  RG/B  A  BLK STL  PTS  AVE.
KEN   Kodey Haddox....... 25-15  24.9    110-255   .431  50-128    .391   63-83   .759    51  2.0   29     0  10   333  13.3
WAB  Wesley Smith         25-25  30.6                  .423               .244              .619         5.6   27    19  60         11.2 
WOO Bryan Wickliffe....    24-21  21.1    102-178   .573      2-4    .500   59-85   .694   128  5.3   18     9  19   265  11.0
OBL   Ryan Magiera.......  25-19  27.3                  .416               .339              .650          3.3   12   12  17           8.7
KEN   J.T. Knight........     22-1   21.7     66-142    .465   24-72    .333   31-41   .756    58   2.6   25     5  34  187    8.5
DEN   Larry Farmer.......   25-12  25.2     76-157    .484   12-38    .316   29-45   .644  115  4.6   28    12  20   193    7.7
OBL   Gian Chiu..........     24-21  20.0                  .466               .000              .619         2.3   10   12   6             5.6
EAR   Mark Yost..........     25-9   19.6    42-102    .412    31-77   .403     4- 7   .571    14  0.6   12     1    8   119    4.8
HIR   Nick Russo.........     24-20  26.4                  .380               .322              .826         1.0   86    0   25           4.8
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2008, 11:09:38 PM
Thanks, goscots.  I would not be too quick to toss Nick Russo out of your three-horse race.  He led the conference in assists this season, with 62 (3.88 per game), and he'll end up among the league leaders in A/TO as well.  It's often hard to evaluate point guards using stats; Russo's stellar play at the point shows up primarily in Mike Staley's stats, as Russo's play has freed up Staley to become a much better scoring threat.  I will probably have Russo #2 on my list of frosh.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2008, 02:52:33 PM
For those interested, I've posted my all-conference ballot on the pick'ems page.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 24, 2008, 05:02:53 PM
rough loss for witt yesterday, but all in all it was irrelevant-i think it works out well though because i'd rather play allegheny than hiram personally
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2008, 05:20:30 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 21, 2008, 04:47:22 PM
Quote from: DadofBashWarrior.. on February 21, 2008, 12:11:29 PM
Congrats to Yelvington at Kenyon on his game last night.....Career high and terriffic stats.....been following him since his HS days....Great young Man
A little more on this...at Hiram last night, in another must-win game for Kenyon (as they all are at this point), Bryan poured in a career-best 34 points on 12-of-14 shooting (7/7 after the half) and a perfect 10/10 from the line.  He also had nine rebounds and three assists on the evening. 

Bryan went on to record 18 points and 6 boards yesterday against Wittenberg, helping the Lords secure fourth place and the home floor for their playoff game vs. Wabash Tuesday.  DadofBashWarrior will be pleased to learn that Bryan's huge week has resulted in his being named the NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.txt).  Congratulations, Bryan!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2008, 10:37:26 PM
Wooster needs to win the North Coast tourney this week if they want to increase their chances of hosting some games and making a run in the NCAA tournament.

Updated by D3Hoops through 2/24, the national stats for regional winning %, OWP and OOWP can be found here: http://www.d3hoops.com/salem/08/owp.htm

Wooster is currently sitting 12th on this list (sorted by regional win %) with a regional record of 15-2.  These are the stats the NCAA will utilize (in some weighted formula that they don't disclose) to pick Pool C teams, determine seeds and host sites in the national tournament.  There are other factors as well (e.g. travel costs) that determine host sites.

If Wooster picks up another loss this week, they will still make the NCAA tournament as a Pool C (at large) selection but they will fall further down the NCAA's national rankings.  This scenario will increase their likelihood of having to play road games in the NCAA tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2008, 12:02:26 AM
By the way, belated congratuations to Wabash's Andrew Zimmer, named to the D3hoops.com Team of the Week (http://www.d3hoops.com/tow/) for the week ending Feb. 17.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 25, 2008, 09:15:47 AM
Apparently summer has come early once again at WABASH...........NO CLASS!!

With NO time left and the game OVER some kid named Mark Turpin decides he should shoot and add to his stats.  Just HOLD THE BALL.  WHAT WAS THAT?????  OH I see, YOUR ONLY BASKET OF THE YEAR!!!! NICE SHOT.

I am surprised yourfans didn't start their chant of "OHIO SUCKS" after you made your basket.

Does Pennsylvania suck when the Gators come to visit??? Or what do you do with Earlham..is that "Almost Ohio Sucks"? 

That was soooooooooooooooooo poor I couldn't believe it.  Nice job coach!!! 

Now Wabash can go back home and prepare for some OHIO school to end their year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2008, 09:20:19 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2008, 10:37:26 PM
Wooster needs to win the North Coast tourney this week if they want to increase their chances of hosting some games and making a run in the NCAA tournament.

This should be a telling week as far as the regional rankings are concerned.  We'll find out how much in-region win percentage is weighed as compared to OWP and OOWP.  Either way, I don't have a good feeling about Wooster being #1 at least for this week.  Wooster played 2 weaker teams and as a result, Hope now has a better OWP and OOWP.  But, Cap still has both Hope and Wooster beat in OWP and OOWP. 

I agree with you WSF, in that if Wooster wants any shot at hosting they need to win out.  However, even if Wooster were to win out, I'm not sure it would be enough.  I just don't have a good feeling about things unless the Scots get some help in the form of Hope and Cap getting upset in their respective conference tournaments.  We'll see though.  You can never predict how the NCAA is going to sort things out... ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 10:40:20 AM
So, you think that no kid should be allowed to play hard and score in garbage time when the game was decided? It looks like Denison was playing hard in the last part of the game.

Turpin has busted his butt on the JV most of the year, played in five varsity games and that was his first FG attempt.

Basically, at the end of a game, if the scrubs are in, play. If the starters are in, then you can just tell 'em to cool it. But no way I'm going after a kid that's played about 10 minutes in the entire year for wanting to try to get in the scorebook.

I recall some scrub at IU making a buzzer shot at the end of a game, for his only points of the year, way back in the day. (I think it was Doug Allen back in the '72 NCAA tourney, but I could be wrong.)

Oh, and the Ohio thing...you can thank Witt for adding that to our repertoire.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 25, 2008, 10:59:36 AM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on February 25, 2008, 09:15:47 AM
Apparently summer has come early once again at WABASH...........NO CLASS!!

With NO time left and the game OVER some kid named Mark Turpin decides he should shoot and add to his stats.  Just HOLD THE BALL.  WHAT WAS THAT?????  OH I see, YOUR ONLY BASKET OF THE YEAR!!!! NICE SHOT.

I have no problem with a bench player trying to score at the end of the game.  These guys bust their butts in practice every day and rarely get into a game.  When they finally get a chance to play, there's no way that I would tell them that they need to sit on the ball.  If it was a player from the normal 8 or 9 man rotation I'd have a little more issue with it.  But, for a guy that saw all of 10 minutes of playing time all season, I say "shoot it".  Especially since it was the last game of the season and they guy hadn't put up a shot all year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 25, 2008, 11:07:31 AM
Last I heard it was the defense's responsibility of stop the scorer.  Good on him!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2008, 11:09:24 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 25, 2008, 09:20:19 AM

I agree with you WSF, in that if Wooster wants any shot at hosting they need to win out.  However, even if Wooster were to win out, I'm not sure it would be enough.  I just don't have a good feeling about things unless the Scots get some help in the form of Hope and Cap getting upset in their respective conference tournaments.  We'll see though.  You can never predict how the NCAA is going to sort things out... ::)

Wouldn't it be possible that Wooster could be sent to somewhere "out of region?" For example, Centre came to Wooster last year; it could be that Wooster would go there this year. There are probably other examples of places Wooster could be sent within 500 miles but not within the GL region.  It may not just be Hope/Capital that Woo would be competing against.

Though I should also note that I wouldn't be surprised to see a Hope/Capital/Wooster pair playing each other as soon as the second round, even though you'd rather have teams like that meet in the second weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 25, 2008, 11:21:28 AM
The precedent when Hope is in the tournament is for Hope to play teams from the Chicago area and Wisconsin.  I see no reason why this year would be different.  Since they started using the Pools process for selection

2002--St. Norbert, WI, Carthage, WI
2003--UW Oshkosh
2006--WI Lutheran, Calvin
2007--Chicago, Calvin

In fact the only Great Lakes team thats even been in the same 4 team 1st and 2nd round bracket has been Calvin.  Heck last year, Hope wasn't even paired with the Great Lakes for the Sectionals, instead we got WashingtonU, UW Stevens Point and Carroll.

When I look for 1st and 2nd round opponents for Hope this year, I'm looking at Aurora, Wheaton/Elmhurst, Chicago, Albion/Calvin or other MIAA winner, maybe the HCAC winner (Defiance).

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 25, 2008, 11:34:59 AM
Woo hoo... a scrub scoring, finally a NCAC topic I can contribute to this year.

Since I was a little more than a scrub in my EC days, I'll always say let the kids actually play out the final minutes of a blowout. I'd have only two points to my collegiate name if we hadn't been allowed to shoot in garbage time.

HOWEVER, there is one important caveat of garbage time (or even closer 6 to 8 point games for that matter).

DON'T SHOOT THE BALL AT THE BUZZER WHEN EVERYONE ELSE ON THE FLOOR HAS STOPPED PLAYING!!!!

In other words, once players and coaches have made it clear that they aren't trying anymore, i.e. the ball handler is doing the little handshake thing with the guy guarding him, no one should make an attempt at scoring.

The prime example of this came back during Billy's olden high school playing days in a Class 2A Sectional semifinal. Billy was guarding a player 29 feet from the basket in the closing when that player began backing up and said nice game. All around, the other players in the 9 or so-point game were giving half handshakes and hugs. Then, as Billy turned to walk to the bench with the final second about to tick off, the player Billy was guarding, who will forever be remembered as that fat #$(#$(% redhead decided to let fly from NBA range. The ball swished through the net and the fat #$(#$(% redhead decided to celebrate like he had just won the state title with his 3-pointer. To this day, Billy hopes that classless fat #$(#$(% redhead dies a horrific death.

So, in summary, if Little Giant scrub hit a 3-pointer at the buzzer in the confines of an offense and when both teams were still playing hard...good for him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2008, 11:40:56 AM
I'd like to echo the sentiments of those who say let the bench players play!  As cmh noted, those kids at the end of the bench work every bit as hard in practice as the starters and subs off the bench.  If they have the chance to come in and score a couple of baskets in garbage time I say more power to them!  If I were a coach, there's no way I would tell one of those kids at the end of my bench to go in and sit on the ball.  It's one of the few chances they get to see the floor at the varsity level and if they want to show what they've got, go for it!

It's not like that was Brock or Zimmer taking the shot at the end of the game.  Like smeds said, if you empty your bench at the end of the game, let those kids play.  If your starters are still in there and the game is all but over, then that is when you sit on the ball.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2008, 11:47:58 AM
Quote from: sac on February 25, 2008, 11:21:28 AM
The precedent when Hope is in the tournament is for Hope to play teams from the Chicago area and Wisconsin.  I see no reason why this year would be different.  Since they started using the Pools process for selection
Good point sac.  Hope does seem to draw more teams from the midwest and west regions in the early rounds of the tournament.

As far as Wooster travelling to another region, it's definitely a possiblity.  Wooster was shipped to Transy a couple of years ago, but they were also a Pool C participant that year as well.  I would think it would be hard to ship Wooster all the way to Centre if Wooster were to win out an get the Pool A bid.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2008, 11:52:49 AM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 25, 2008, 11:34:59 AM
HOWEVER, there is one important caveat of garbage time (or even closer 6 to 8 point games for that matter).

DON'T SHOOT THE BALL AT THE BUZZER WHEN EVERYONE ELSE ON THE FLOOR HAS STOPPED PLAYING!!!!

In other words, once players and coaches have made it clear that they aren't trying anymore, i.e. the ball handler is doing the little handshake thing with the guy guarding him, no one should make an attempt at scoring.

Welcome back, Billy. 

What you describe is exactly what happened.  Denison's scrubs and Wabash's scrubs had both been in the game for a minute or two, with everyone playing hard.  Then Wabash inbounded the ball with a nine-point lead and just a few seconds on the clock.  The Denison players clearly were expecting a handshake drill, and were acknowledging the end of their season...and of four careers.  The fans were (mostly) on their feet, saluting the seniors, who were gathered at the end of the bench.  And the Wabash kid shot the ball.  "Classless" is perhaps too strong a word, but it was definitely not something he should have done. 

BigRedGrad, were you at the game?  If so, sorry I missed the chance to meet you.

Oddly enough, it was the second such event I got to see that afternoon.  About 90 minutes earlier up at Kenyon, Brandan Barabino attempted a buzzer-beating three with his team down 13 and the Kenyon team already celebrating.  The difference being a) Witt was behind, not ahead; b) Barabino is a starter, not a scrub; and c) he missed badly.  It doesn't show up in the play-by-play, so it might have been after the buzzer, or maybe the scorebook keeper just took pity on him by pretending it didn't happen.  If it had been me, I'd have held onto the ball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 25, 2008, 12:03:52 PM
I would never call anything classless unless I actually saw it, but I will add this: if a player, no matter how hard he's busted his butt, can only get in the scoring column by hitting a shot with no one else on the floor playing, he better get to busting his butt even harder in the future. And again, this is from an NCAC scrub.

Anyway, first time in a long time that the Quakers won't be involved in the tourney. But I was happy to see them get a couple wins down the stretch, and against some top half teams at that. They didn't quit, which is something that couldn't be said about at least one more talented team that I recall in my time following Earlham.

Enjoy the tourney, I'll be reading about it here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 25, 2008, 12:09:50 PM
Yes I was there and that is why I did not appreciate that behavior. 
The game was clearly OVER!!!!!  Trust me...Zimmer does not take the shot.  Or ANY Denison player if the shoe was on the other foot.

Everyone knows you just turn and hold the ball and shake their hands.  Apparently that is not what they are taught in Indiana....but that is how we play in OHIO!!!!  Even though we suck!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 25, 2008, 12:18:43 PM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on February 25, 2008, 11:38:33 AM
THERE WAS NO TIME LEFT, THERE WAS NO ONE DEFENDING HIM.  THE GAME WAS OVER!!!!!  YOU HOLD THE BALL................PERIOD!!!  I don't care how the hell hard he works in practice.  IT WAS A TOTAL "NO CLASS MOVE"

LET"S HERE THE CHANT AGAIN PLEASE!!!!!!  WHAT'S THAT OHIO SUCKS??????

All caps is considered shouting and contrary to the Terms of Service.

Take a deep breath -- if you get that worked up over one basket in a game that is clearly over, then you're likely headed for health problems if anything truly important ever comes up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 25, 2008, 12:29:12 PM
No need to shout!!
I agree........let me count to ten!!



All better now!!
Thank you for your concern regarding my health. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on February 25, 2008, 12:40:26 PM
Congratulations to the Fighting Scots cagers for a great season and a NCAC regular season championship.
This brings me to the second part of my post. Why is a 4-12 team even in the playoffs? Is the NCAC that desperate for cash they dilute their championship to that extent? I know records vary from year to year but, this is a joke. No disrespect to Oberlin but 4 conference wins and 5 overall is no playoff team. I know anything can happen on game day. Oberlin has everything to gain. Wooster can only accrue injuries that could limit their post season run.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 01:04:47 PM
Why is Oberlin in the playoffs? Because it's the right and honorable thing to do. If you are going to have conference tourneys, then you actually should invite everyone.

I would rather see the autobid go to the regular season champ, but that's not how it is.

If you want to protect the #1 and #2 seeds then you bye them into the semis like some D-1 conferences have done in an effort to 'protect' the #1 seed from getting upset.

Personally, I'd like to see what conferences like the Big 10/11 do. Invite 'em all at one site and just let 'em play! Yes the 7-10 and 8-9 games may not be excitement plus, but it's another chance to play ball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 01:06:46 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 25, 2008, 11:52:49 AM


What you describe is exactly what happened.  Denison's scrubs and Wabash's scrubs had both been in the game for a minute or two, with everyone playing hard.  Then Wabash inbounded the ball with a nine-point lead and just a few seconds on the clock.  The Denison players clearly were expecting a handshake drill, and were acknowledging the end of their season...and of four careers.  The fans were (mostly) on their feet, saluting the seniors, who were gathered at the end of the bench.  And the Wabash kid shot the ball.  "Classless" is perhaps too strong a word, but it was definitely not something he should have done. 



Did the Wabash player realize this? That's the question. He may have been excited about varsity time that he didn't notice.

Anyway, it's a relatively minor event. Denison even covered the spread WITH the basket, so says my source "Greasy Palms".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on February 25, 2008, 02:06:38 PM
What is so honorable about inviting a 5 win team to the post season? Lets forget about the regular season and invite everyone to the tournament. In this day and age of political correctness , that would be the honorable thing to do.
What ever happened to only the fittest survive? In a 10 team conference the top 4 should be the maximum number of playoff representatives.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 25, 2008, 02:12:49 PM
Wooster has been lucky enough to be on the top side of many games that have been decided well before the final gun.  No matter who's on the court during the last few minutes, for either team, the play is still hard and competitive as it should be.  But when the Scots have the ball and the shot clock has been turned off, they don't shoot, period, no matter who the player is.  That's class, and the way class teams do it.  To defend a player who breaks that unwritten rule, just because he's from your school, is as cheap as the player's shot.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 02:18:17 PM
Quote from: old scot on February 25, 2008, 02:06:38 PM
What is so honorable about inviting a 5 win team to the post season? Lets forget about the regular season and invite everyone to the tournament. In this day and age of political correctness , that would be the honorable thing to do.
What ever happened to only the fittest survive? In a 10 team conference the top 4 should be the maximum number of playoff representatives.

Well, as I said, the BEST thing is to not have a conference tourney.

Watching many conference tournaments in D-1, though, leads me to think that you need to invite everyone because that one last chance for a team provides a lot of drama.

It's only because the NCAC is quite top heavy that it seems like a weird thing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 02:20:50 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 25, 2008, 02:12:49 PM
Wooster has been lucky enough to be on the top side of many games that have been decided well before the final gun.  No matter who's on the court during the last few minutes, for either team, the play is still hard and competitive as it should be.  But when the Scots have the ball and the shot clock has been turned off, they don't shoot, period, no matter who the player is.  That's class, and the way class teams do it.  To defend a player who breaks that unwritten rule, just because he's from your school, is as cheap as the player's shot. 

DC has told me privately his side of it, and I see it now. Based on the initial post, it seemed a way over the top reaction to a trifle.

But if the other team is playing with the shot clock off, you play the game. I cannot deny a scrub a chance to play and score even with 1 second to go if the other team is also giving effort to stop him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2008, 02:30:50 PM
Privately, only because it seems time to move on.

It seems that we're all in basic agreement that scrubs should play hard, but that the offense should dribble the clock out when the defense concedes the last few seconds.

BigRedGrad and I were the only posters in attendance (I suppose), and we are both adamant that the shot by Mark Turpin was inappropriate.  I think that all of you, regardless of school affiliation, would agree if you had been there. 

I'd rather we moved on to the tournament and all-conference discussions. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2008, 02:46:55 PM
Regarding Oberlin being in the tournament:
Quote from: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 01:04:47 PM
If you want to protect the #1 and #2 seeds then you bye them into the semis like some D-1 conferences have done in an effort to 'protect' the #1 seed from getting upset.
Not just D-1.  I've made a spreadsheet of conference tournament brackets to help me try to keep the Top 25 "How They Fared" straight this week, and there's all varieties of D3 tournaments.  Some examples:
* MIAA women, a 9-team league: all 9 get in, with a "play-in" game between #8 and #9
* WIAC men and women, a 9-team league: an 8-team tournament, missing only the 9th-place team (same as NCAC women, which Wooster got left out of on a tiebreaker)
* Lots of 8-team leagues with 8-team tournaments, e.g. MIAA men, SCAC men & women
* MIAC, which has 11 men's and 12 women's teams: 6-team tourney, with byes for the 1 and 2 seeds
* Centennial men, a 10-team league: 5 teams get in; #4 plays #5 with the winner playing #1
* Lots of 4-team tournaments, like the SCIAC, CCIW, and both halves of the MAC (Freedom/Commonwealth)
* NWC, a 9-team league: just the top three get in, with #2 playing #3 and the winner playing #1
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 25, 2008, 03:29:08 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 02:18:17 PM
Well, as I said, the BEST thing is to not have a conference tourney.

Watching many conference tournaments in D-1, though, leads me to think that you need to invite everyone because that one last chance for a team provides a lot of drama.

It's only because the NCAC is quite top heavy that it seems like a weird thing.

I'd rather seem them do away with the tourney as well, but that's not likely to happen any time soon.  If they insist on the tournament I would like to see all the teams get to participate.  I guess you'd give the top 6 byes, and have the bottom 4 play the first round? 

Just FYI, I took a look at the tournaments back to 1999 that are posted on the NCAC site.  The only times that a #5-8 seed won a first round game were the last 3 years.  Each of those were #5 beating #4, then getting beaten by Wooster in the semi's.  I wouldn't be too surprised to see a couple more upsets this year...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 03:35:21 PM
I think a lot of the D-3 tourneys are smaller to save costs and travel. And for conferences over 8 teams, it makes sense to limit it a bit. 12 team tourneys get a bit obtuse (but that doesn't stop the Sun Belt or Southern Conference).

But why not have an NCAC blowout in Dayton or Columbus?

Day 1: #5 vs #10, #6 vs. #9, #7 vs. #8
Day 2: #4 vs. winner of 5/10, #3 vs. winner of 6/9, #2 vs. winner of 7/8
Day 3: #1 vs. winner of 4/5/10, 3/6/9 winner vs. 2/7/8
Day 4: World Championship of the NCAC.

That protects #1, gives teams incentives to finish in the top 4, yet allows for a quixotic tourney run by an underdog which would make great copy for us junkies.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on February 25, 2008, 03:38:35 PM
Dave, thanks for your insite on other confernce tournaments. The real question is why should the regular season be only to establish your seeding in the conference tourney when 80%-90% are invited? The level of competion is so askewed from the top 5 teams in the NCAC that a #1 vs #8 is a meaningless game.
D1 conference tourneys are at one site on one long weekend and generate large sums of cash for their conference. DIII tourneys are at the site of the higher ranked school and are nothing more than a extra regular season game until the final 4 are established,
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2008, 03:44:17 PM
Quote from: BigRedGrad on February 25, 2008, 09:15:47 AM
Apparently summer has come early once again at WABASH...........NO CLASS!!

With NO time left and the game OVER some kid named Mark Turpin decides he should shoot and add to his stats.  Just HOLD THE BALL.  WHAT WAS THAT?????  OH I see, YOUR ONLY BASKET OF THE YEAR!!!! NICE SHOT.

That was soooooooooooooooooo poor I couldn't believe it.  Nice job coach!!! 

Somebody needs a nap. 

Matt Turpin, who has played all of 10 minutes this season and has scored all of three points this season has hardly committed a crime against humanity here.  It's one thing to say "I wouldn't have done that", it's another to put the curse of classlessness on an entire program because of it.  This is a non-issue. 

Quote from: BigRedGrad on February 25, 2008, 09:15:47 AM
I am surprised yourfans didn't start their chant of "OHIO SUCKS" after you made your basket.

We're on the same page here.  I'll go on the record as saying that this is something that could probably stop.  Or at the very least it should be saved until Wabash is actually better than all of the Buckeye staters that they play against...but probably it just needs to be shelved.  They can come up with something better than this to chant. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 03:54:29 PM
Quote from: old scot on February 25, 2008, 03:38:35 PM
D1 conference tourneys are at one site on one long weekend and generate large sums of cash for their conference.

Not for a lot of them. The big ones, yes, but the mid-majors and below struggle at times. Many are at the site of the #1 team. Some, like the MEAC championship, are at a neutral site and barely draw enough to pay the rent, or so it seems. Just how many people are going to show up at a Southern Utah - Missouri KC game on a neutral floor?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 04:00:04 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 25, 2008, 03:44:17 PMThey can come up with something better than this to chant. 

But...but...it's a TRADITION!  ;)

(The joke in the offices at Wabash is that if something happens two years in a row, it's a tradition, and three years in a row it's 'we've always done it this way' and stopping it would be an affront of the gentleman's rule, etc. etc.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCAC_alum55 on February 25, 2008, 04:05:14 PM
Gentlemen of the NCAC,

I've watched and followed your conversations for years... and figured what better time to begin my posting career than NCAC tourney time  ;D

As a side note... I did graduate from OWU- feel free to hold that against me 8)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 25, 2008, 04:05:37 PM
If I remember correctly back in the 9-team NCAC days they used to have a play-in game.  The 8-9 teams - usually Oberlin and someone else - would play to see who would get to play Woo or Witt in a couple days.  At some point that was abandoned and they went to the 8 team tournament.

Also, the site of the semi and final round games used to rotate between Wooster, Ohio Wesleyan, and Wittenberg.  I remember the finals being at OWU during a couple of the Jamie Harless years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 25, 2008, 04:14:33 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 04:00:04 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 25, 2008, 03:44:17 PMThey can come up with something better than this to chant. 

But...but...it's a TRADITION!  ;)

(The joke in the offices at Wabash is that if something happens two years in a row, it's a tradition, and three years in a row it's 'we've always done it this way' and stopping it would be an affront of the gentleman's rule, etc. etc.)

That joke wasn't just limited to the administrative or staff offices. There's another school I know of that treats tradition that way: Texas A&M. And anyone who knows me knows I don't want that comparison being made.

Count me as one who thinks the "Ohio Sucks" chant needs to go away forever. It's just dumb. The point of chants is to be clever, at least it is IMHO. There's nothing clever about that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2008, 04:15:33 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 25, 2008, 04:05:37 PM
If I remember correctly back in the 9-team NCAC days they used to have a play-in game.  The 8-9 teams - usually Oberlin and someone else - would play to see who would get to play Woo or Witt in a couple days.  At some point that was abandoned and they went to the 8 team tournament.

Also, the site of the semi and final round games used to rotate between Wooster, Ohio Wesleyan, and Wittenberg.  I remember the finals being at OWU during a couple of the Jamie Harless years.

I could be wrong, but I think the OAC had a 10-team tourney until recently.  Now it's 8.

Quote from: NCAC_alum55 on February 25, 2008, 04:05:14 PM
Gentlemen of the NCAC,

I've watched and followed your conversations for years... and figured what better time to begin my posting career than NCAC tourney time  ;D

As a side note... I did graduate from OWU- feel free to hold that against me 8)

Woo-hoo!  An OWU guy, and (unless I'm mistaken) a former player as well!  Great news!  Welcome aboard!

Okay, Allegheny lurkers, it's your turn.  Time to step up!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 25, 2008, 04:43:09 PM
Some comments on conference tourneys:

When the CCIW began having a tourney (only 3(?) years ago), I was against it, and agreed with those who think the whole season should determine the AQ.  I've changed my mind, but ONLY so long as it stays a 4-team tourney.

The tourney gives a second chance to those very good teams who lost a couple of early games to injury, youth, or whatever (whereas, if you can't make the top 4, you weren't good ENOUGH to overcome the inevitable misfortunes of the season).

It still leaves the regular season meaningful and exciting - generally no more than one or two teams have been eliminated from contention before the final week.

With a full (or 8 ) team tourney, the first round games are likely to actually HURT the OWP of the top teams. 

And, of course, there is aways the risk that the conference will send a truly bad team as their AQ (they 'earned' it, but should a 3-game hot streak outweigh an entire season of 'badness'?).  Whereas even if #4 gets hot, they are still a very respectable team.  (And if any of the teams above them are truly superior, there is always pool C.)

Just my $.02 - it's your conference! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 04:56:27 PM
Ah, but then there's the entire insanity of picking the at-large teams anyway, and that's a different kettle o'fish.

And of course, there are years where there's a whole knot of teams from 3-6 in a given conference, where they all would be good teams representing a certain league.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 25, 2008, 05:04:04 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 03:35:21 PM
I think a lot of the D-3 tourneys are smaller to save costs and travel. And for conferences over 8 teams, it makes sense to limit it a bit. 12 team tourneys get a bit obtuse (but that doesn't stop the Sun Belt or Southern Conference).

But why not have an NCAC blowout in Dayton or Columbus?

Day 1: #5 vs #10, #6 vs. #9, #7 vs. #8
Day 2: #4 vs. winner of 5/10, #3 vs. winner of 6/9, #2 vs. winner of 7/8
Day 3: #1 vs. winner of 4/5/10, 3/6/9 winner vs. 2/7/8
Day 4: World Championship of the NCAC.

That protects #1, gives teams incentives to finish in the top 4, yet allows for a quixotic tourney run by an underdog which would make great copy for us junkies.



Doing it this way we could almost rotate the tournament allowing 2 teams to host the tournament( i.e. Wabash and Earlham holding it in Indianapolis).  It allows fans to make the trip to the tournament.  Having the tournament last from Thursday to Sunday.  This is something that some other players and I have been talking about for a couple of years.  Something that we should draft up and maybe send it to the commish and have him take a look at it. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 25, 2008, 05:20:21 PM
I think that, if there is going to be a tournament, that the regular season winner has earned the right to host it, gaining home court advantage.  Whatever edge that the top seed had earned would be seriously reduced if they had to travel to a neutral site, especially one that might be more favorable to a competitive lower seed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 25, 2008, 05:36:36 PM
I guess it depends on what the purpose (stated or otherwise) of a postseason tournament is. If the purpose is to determine the champion and recipient of the automatic qualifier for the Dance, then having it at the regular season champ's house is the way to go.

If the purpose is to create an event that sells tickets and generates revenue, then the way the Big 12, Big 10, Pac-10 do it is the way to go.

I also like what I read about the CCIW's way of doing it. It seems like a great middle ground.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2008, 05:44:24 PM
I guess there's no way to prove it, but I think an NCAC tournament, regardless of the number of teams or duration, played at a neutral site would be a financial disaster.  The only neutral-site D3 tournaments I can think of off the top of my head are the ODAC (Salem, VA) and the SCAC, which is not strictly "neutral;" until recently it had been played at Rhodes College in Memphis, but this year has moved to Hendrix College in Conway, AR.  Maybe I can get pbrooks from Centre to weigh in on how well attended that will be.

The CCIW tournament is played on the court of the top-seeded team.

Also, according to the NCAC basketball handbook, the purpose of the tournament is to determine the autobid.  The NCAC Champion is determined in the regular season:
Quote1.1 Determination of Conference Champion
The NCAC champion shall be the team with the best record (winning percentage)
in regular-season conference play.
[...]
2.1 Conference Champion for NCAA Championship
In 1999, the NCAA implemented a system of automatic entry into Division III
team sport championships for all conferences. If a conference accepts an
automatic entry for its champion, it must deliver one champion for the national
NCAA Championship. Obvious problems occur if a conference has more than
one champion, under its existing rules. Therefore, the North Coast Athletic
Conference basketball coaches have determined the winner of the NCAC
Tournament shall earn the conference's automatic bid into the NCAA
Tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on February 25, 2008, 06:28:10 PM
Thanks for the info Dave. After reviewing the NCAC Basketball Handbook the problem lies within the conference itself. Nine years ago the coaches voted for the tourney winner to receive the auto bid. No problem there. I would like to know how many coaches think 8 of 10 teams deserve the right to compete for that bid? If you can't finish in the top 40% of the conference, should you have the right to compete for an NCAA berth?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 06:37:45 PM
Well, yes you have the right. If a #1 seed loses to the #8, then it is what it is.

DC - My idea was mostly in jest, mainly because I realize that there's no way the NCAC could pull it off financially.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2008, 08:58:00 PM
Any Wabash or Oberlin fans that may be planning to head towards my little corner of the world should keep an eye on tomorrow's weather.  We're supposed to get more of the delightful "wintry mix" tonight, then convert that to snow tomorrow, perhaps up to 3".  I'd also keep an eye on the NCAC website as well as the Kenyon and Wooster sites in case there's a postponement. 

I'm not sure what the Wabash team travel plans would be; would they have left this evening or would they travel tomorrow?  If they came tonight to stay in Mt. Vernon, they'd have no weather trouble, and the game would go on tomorrow regardless of weather.  So stay tuned.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on February 25, 2008, 09:42:13 PM
Smeds, you enjoy playing the devils advovate. The point is a 15-1 team should not be playing a 4-12 team in a playoff game. The NCAC does not go that deep in competitive balance and the conference needs to make a change. If you can't finish in the top 4, pack your bags and go home. This isn't Little League where everyone has to play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 25, 2008, 10:10:23 PM
I can see where a lot of your are coming from, but why change a system because some teams are down now?  What if you eliminate the 5-8 teams, and all of a sudden the conference becomes extremely deep?  Why eliminate a 4-5 game that almost never fails to disappoint (4 of the last 5 4-5 games have been decided by single digits)?  It's like all the people saying that the Eastern Conference in the NBA should have fewer playoff teams than the West because they are so much inferior THIS season.  A #16 has never beaten a #1 in the NCAAs - why not just get rid of all the 16 seeds and give the top seeds a bye?  Yes, the bottom of the NCAC isn't that great, but why take away the possibility for excitement?  Hiram as a 7 kept it close with Witt last year (down 6 at the half) until the Tigers pulled away in the second half.  What's so wrong with giving 4 teams one more game on their schedule?  I mean, there was intrigue and interest based on who was going to get the 8 seed this past weekend - sure, it 99.99999999999% surely means a loss to Wooster, but fans were excited about what would happen, people were interested in figuring out the tiebreakers - an otherwise meaningless game had some importance added to it.  Why take that away?  This isn't the pros - nobody's getting paid to play, so I see no harm in one extra game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2008, 10:19:39 PM
I would guess that Wabash left tonight for Gambier.  On my one trip with the team to places that far east, the team left the day before the 2000 NCAC semis at Wooster and stayed in lovely Wooster, OH for the duration of the tournament.  It's tournament time...I wouldn't want my team to be on a bus for 5 hours or so and then jump off and play a do or die game.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2008, 10:22:27 PM
On conference tournaments...I think they serve very little purpose in division-III.  The margin for error for inclusion in the national tournament is too small to risk sending anybody other than your best team.  I'd rather see the NCAA let these teams play 3 more games during the regular season and lose the conference tournaments all together. 

In D-I, the tournaments can be a money maker, and if your regular season champion loses, it really doesn't affect the national tournament bracket as that team was going to go anyway.  There are no such guarantees in D-III.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 25, 2008, 10:51:00 PM
Quote from: old scot on February 25, 2008, 09:42:13 PM
Smeds, you enjoy playing the devils advovate. The point is a 15-1 team should not be playing a 4-12 team in a playoff game. The NCAC does not go that deep in competitive balance and the conference needs to make a change. If you can't finish in the top 4, pack your bags and go home. This isn't Little League where everyone has to play.

I think Smeds roots in playing devil's advocate in this case come from his roots of having grown up in Indiana...where everybody in the high school tournament, regardless of record, gets a shot to win a championship.

I agree with him and, not just as a result of Earlham being outside the top eight this year, I've always thought that every NCAC team should be able to participate in the postseason tournament.

The NCAC decided to let the tourney winner get the auto bid to the national tournament. Oberlin, Kenyon, et al. as part of the NCAC have the right to play in that tournament then. Let them play it out.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 11:23:18 PM
Quote from: old scot on February 25, 2008, 09:42:13 PM
Smeds, you enjoy playing the devils advovate. The point is a 15-1 team should not be playing a 4-12 team in a playoff game. The NCAC does not go that deep in competitive balance and the conference needs to make a change. If you can't finish in the top 4, pack your bags and go home. This isn't Little League where everyone has to play.

No, the point is if you're going to have a tourney, invite 'em all. I don't like tourneys but if you have them then they should be true conference tourneys. Rig the seeding to protect high seeds and have home court or something for #1.

You know, over the years I've seen kids on the 6th through 9th place teams fight at the end of the year just to be sure to make the tourney. That one game is one extra game they'll never have again.

The difference between 4 and 5 is razor thin in this league this year.

You know, that blasted uncompetitive 7 beat a 2 in the WIAC just tonight. Nah, they shouldn't let 7th seeded teams with 5-11 records in the tourney, should they?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 11:23:54 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 25, 2008, 10:22:27 PM
In D-I, the tournaments can be a money maker, and if your regular season champion loses, it really doesn't affect the national tournament bracket as that team was going to go anyway.  There are no such guarantees in D-III.   

Tell that to Davidson if they don't win the Southern Conference...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2008, 11:55:13 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 25, 2008, 11:23:54 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 25, 2008, 10:22:27 PM
In D-I, the tournaments can be a money maker, and if your regular season champion loses, it really doesn't affect the national tournament bracket as that team was going to go anyway.  There are no such guarantees in D-III.   

Tell that to Davidson if they don't win the Southern Conference...

Davidson would be an interesting case...I'm not worried though as they are blasting everybody in the SoCon.  They're definitely bubblicious if they blow it in their tournament.  Unfortunately for the smaller single bid leagues, they have to play the all-or-nothing game with these conference tournaments.  Too bad they couldn't have won one of those tight games with UNC, Duke, or UCLA.  They wouldn't have anything to worry about. 

Back to D-III tournaments...I'm in agreement with the idea that since we do have them and they're not going anywhere, then everybody should be allowed to play.  Inclusion is part of the D-III philosophy, right? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 26, 2008, 12:07:53 AM
I like it as it is, but I'm not adament about it.  Including the bottom two teams diminishes regular season play a bit more; right now I suspect there's some excitement within those programs when the season winds down as they fight to make the tournament.  Fighting to move up or down a spot seed-wise might not be as important.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 26, 2008, 12:42:10 AM
I kinda like giving Division III players as many chances to compete as possible. The NCAA, and in some cases, conferences, restrict them from taking the floor more often.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2008, 08:23:28 AM
And yes, Billy, my Hoosier roots also say that everyone gets a chance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 26, 2008, 08:46:15 AM
Invite all teams to the tournament giving having 8/9 and 7/10 match up play on monday or tuesday and then continue the tournament tuesday or wednesday with what would now be the first round and having the semi's where ever.  Doing it almost like the Big Ten, not having the 6/11 matchup, but with 6 playing 3, or a tournament that has 10 teams.  Everyone has to remember George Mason from a couple years ago, and every one loves the underdog, giving all teams the opportunity to participate in the tournament allows for the underdog to make a run possible.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2008, 10:09:01 AM
Terrific article in today's Cleveland Plain Dealer on Coach Steve Moore and the Wooster basketball program. :)

The article, "Great Scots Again", actually appeared on the front page of the sports section with a picture of Coach Moore.

Here is the link: http://blog.cleveland.com/sports/2008/02/great_scots_again_at_wooster.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2008, 10:33:31 AM
In the last few days, the Star - Tribune has given ink to St. Thomas' women's team and the Hamline hockey team on the front page. So it seems that at least in some areas, D-3 sports are getting the attention of big city ink-stained wretches!

/was a small town ink-stained wretch for a while...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on February 26, 2008, 10:54:25 AM
Good luck to all teams tonight!!!!!!!!!!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 26, 2008, 12:16:59 PM
good luck to Witt tonight-hopefully Allegheny doesn't prove the third time is the charm-i think Witt should be able to win handidly-people are looking way too far into their loss to Kenyon Saturday as it was a nothing to gain or lose situation essentially and everything to gain or lose for Kenyon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2008, 02:39:04 PM
Here it comes...
The Hiram at OWU games (men's/women's doubleheader) scheduled for tonight have been postponed (http://www.northcoast.org/) until tomorrow.  Also the entire slate of OAC women's quarterfinals have been put off a day.  As I said yesterday, stay tuned...

Also...
The doubleheader at Kenyon, which is still on (I'd guess that both Wabash and Earlham got into town yesterday), will have free live streaming video.  Click here for details and access. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26419.xml)  The men's game is scheduled to tip at 6, with the women's game to follow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 26, 2008, 03:29:16 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 26, 2008, 02:39:04 PM
Also...
The doubleheader at Kenyon, which is still on (I'd guess that both Wabash and Earlham got into town yesterday), will have free live streaming video.  Click here for details and access. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26419.xml)  The men's game is scheduled to tip at 6, with the women's game to follow.

Jackpot.  While we're in the calm before the storm, this is a good time to mention that every NCAC school should be streaming games.  We have the technology...

Looking forward to watching the LGs in action tonight! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCAC_alum55 on February 26, 2008, 04:14:35 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 26, 2008, 02:39:04 PM

Also...
The doubleheader at Kenyon, which is still on (I'd guess that both Wabash and Earlham got into town yesterday), will have free live streaming video.  Click here for details and access. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26419.xml)  The men's game is scheduled to tip at 6, with the women's game to follow.

Good to know... In my opinion ::), this is the most interesting quaterfinal matchup. If their first two meetings this season are any indication, should be a close (and physical) game either way. Will be interesting to see how Kenyon comes out tonight- would think they would still be riding high from Saturday's win. I think tonight's game will come down to guard play.

When Kenyon's guards play well- they are tough... and unfortunately for Wabash, they have been shooting the ball very well the last four or five games. Wabash, as a program, has much more experience in these tourney situations- will be interesting to see how the Lords react.

Let the fun begin...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 26, 2008, 06:05:17 PM
Wow...plenty of good seats still available at Kenyon.  Yikes.  This looks like a winter break game. 

BTW...is anybody getting audio with the video stream or is it video only?

A pair of three's for Wabash induces a Kenyon timeout.  Wabash is up 15-8 early on here.

A quick reload of the page and the audio is on...great news because I was tired of keeping score by myself.  5:30 to go and Wabash leads by 9.  The score eludes me at the moment.  Bediako just picked up his third foul...bad news for Kenyon.

Haltom hits one from Cleveland and Wabash goes up 44-32.  Wabash is shooting extremely well here.  I think the last game between these two was played in the 50s. 

Halftime...Wabash leads 46-36. 

Sweet scoreboard at Tomsich.  This has been an entertaining game to watch so far. 

BTW, the last Wabash/Kenyon game was 58-49.  This game is much less of a meat grinder than that last game was. 

Hot start for the Lords in the second half.  Wabash leads just 50-47 with under 16:00 to go. 

Good answer after a Wabash timeout.  Wabash has built the lead back to nine points at 56-47.  Make it 58-47 after Brock scores in the paint.  He's got a foul shot coming as well after a Kenyon timeout.  The free throw would push the Wabash lead back to 12 to match the largest lead of the game.  And it is good.  59-47 for Wabash. 

Wabash is on a 13-0 run since Kenyon cut it to three points.  Timeout Kenyon with 10:11 to go.  The score is 63-47. 

2:25 to go and Wabash leads by 10, 79-69.  Free throws will be critical for the Little Giants down the stretch here as Kenyon has started to heat up again.

1:28 to play...Wabash will have the inbound after this timeout.  Free throws, gentlemen...free throws. 

A pair of Wesley Smith free throws puts Wabash up by 13 with about a minute to go and this one is just about over.

And it's all over.  Wabash wins...forgive me if I missed the final score.  Brock had 21 to lead Wabash.  Wes Smith had a double-double with something in the area of 13 and 12.  All around good game for Wabash against a team that came into the tournament on a hot streak. 

86-73 was the final score. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 07:41:48 PM
12:41 left in the first half:

Oberlin 7
Wooster 19

Wooster comes out hot (7-10 FGs), and so far are cruising in Timken.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 07:50:14 PM
Finals in the NCAC tonight:

#6 Allegheny 65
#3 Wittenberg 63

(Notably, Witt's website is saying that this is the first time Wittenberg has ever lost in the NCAC quarterfinals.)


#5 Wabash 86
#4 Kenyon 73

OWU/Hiram postponed until tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 07:54:27 PM
7:00 first half

Oberlin 16
Wooster 32

Wooster already has 9 players with points in the book on very balanced scoring. Woo is shooting about 75%, while Oberlin is shooting about 30%.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 08:09:05 PM
Live Stats for Wooster has frozen and didn't update at the end of the half.

At the half:

Oberlin 32
Wooster 51

Very smooth overall half on offense for Wooster, who was shooting around 70% for most of the half (though ended lower, I think.)  Oberlin shot very well to end the half (8-10).

Wooster has gotten a number of points at the line and also holds about a 2-1 rebounding edge.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 26, 2008, 08:29:50 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 07:50:14 PM
Finals in the NCAC tonight:

#6 Allegheny 65
#3 Wittenberg 63

Oh my.  Our Witt fans expressed concern, but I wasn't really buying it.  I guess that concern was well founded.  How fired up are OWU and Hiram right now?  The road to the finals just got a little easier. 

Some official stats from the Wabash game...Wabash shot 53% for the game compared to 44% for Kenyon.  Wabash outrebounds Kenyon 37-26.  Wabash also wins the turnover battle 9-11 (I'd not be surprised if that 9 turnovers is a season low for the LGs).  Really it was a pretty clean game in this regard. 

Individually, Wabash got 21 points from Aaron Brock in just 24 minutes.  Zimmer had 18, Simkus 17, and Smith 13 to round out Wabash's double figure scorers.  Kenyon got 27 from Kodey Haddox and 21 more from Yelvington.  Smith led Wabash rebounders with 13 and Zimmer just missed a double double with 9 rebounds.  Yelvington led Kenyon with 8 rebounds. 

It's going to take this kind of game this weekend to get by Wooster.  But we know that Wabash has the potential.  Should be a great game at Timken this weekend! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 08:44:43 PM
James Cooper has 26 points tonight and is 2 points shy of hitting 2,000 points in his career.

Wooster has a 30 or so point cushion, and it seems clear at this point that Coop will stay in until he finishes off the honor.

Wooster is working toward Cooper getting a shot...he passes off, then an offensive rebound...Cooper works to get a 3- and it's in and out.  Rebound Evan Will with the putback.

All the other Wooster starters are now out of this one.

Isolation with Cooper at the top of the key.  He drives, and misses.  Offensive rebound. Cooper drives and misses, again!  Another offensive rebound, and now he draws a foul and will go to the line.

1999 is good...and 2,000 is good.  Standing Ovation for James Cooper!!   ;D ;D

James Cooper has joined Scots legend Tom Dinger as the only Scots to reach the 2,000 point plateau.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 08:51:33 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 26, 2008, 08:29:50 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 07:50:14 PM
Finals in the NCAC tonight:

#6 Allegheny 65
#3 Wittenberg 63

Oh my.  Our Witt fans expressed concern, but I wasn't really buying it.  I guess that concern was well founded.  How fired up are OWU and Hiram right now?  The road to the finals just got a little easier. 

Some official stats from the Wabash game...Wabash shot 53% for the game compared to 44% for Kenyon.  Wabash outrebounds Kenyon 37-26.  Wabash also wins the turnover battle 9-11 (I'd not be surprised if that 9 turnovers is a season low for the LGs).  Really it was a pretty clean game in this regard. 

Individually, Wabash got 21 points from Aaron Brock in just 24 minutes.  Zimmer had 18, Simkus 17, and Smith 13 to round out Wabash's double figure scorers.  Kenyon got 27 from Kodey Haddox and 21 more from Yelvington.  Smith led Wabash rebounders with 13 and Zimmer just missed a double double with 9 rebounds.  Yelvington led Kenyon with 8 rebounds. 

It's going to take this kind of game this weekend to get by Wooster.  But we know that Wabash has the potential.  Should be a great game at Timken this weekend! 

Witt game story: http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/07-08gamestories/ncac1.html

Allegheny game story: http://www.allegheny.edu/cgi-bin/mt/mt-view.cgi/5/entry/8063/menbb_entry
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 26, 2008, 08:53:44 PM
One more statistical note from Wabash/Kenyon...Wes Smith had three steals in the game to give him 63 for the season.  That ties the Wabash single season record held by Mike Lustina '95.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 08:55:16 PM
The parts of the Kenyon/Wabash game I saw with the live video made it clear that Wabash was the better team tonight. Nice, complete win for the LGs tonight.

What's with Wabash showing up for some games and disappearing for others?  (re. 'Bash/OWU a few weeks ago compared to tonight, etc...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 09:01:04 PM
Final from Wooster:

Oberlin 71
Wooster 104

With the win, Wooster will host the NCAC semifinals and finals this weekend.

James Cooper scores 28 points exactly, reaching the 2,000 point plateau for his career.  Other Scots in double figures were Marty Bidwell with 14 and Robert Melick with 12. Very balanced scoring below that; 12 Scots scored on the evening. Wickliffe contributes 8 pts and 9 boards.

Omari Hall had 22 on 10-13 shooting for the Yeomen.

Wooster advances to face Wabash in Friday's semifinal.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 26, 2008, 09:19:05 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 07:50:14 PM
Finals in the NCAC tonight:

#6 Allegheny 65
#3 Wittenberg 63

(Notably, Witt's website is saying that this is the first time Wittenberg has ever lost in the NCAC quarterfinals.)

Wow.  I thought the long trip for Allegheny would be too much for them to overcome.  I guess the Witt players thought that too, and that, plus a good performance from the Gators, bit them.   :-[

Let's hear all those people who wanted the tourney cut to 4 teams share their opinion now...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 26, 2008, 09:33:41 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 08:55:16 PM
The parts of the Kenyon/Wabash game I saw with the live video made it clear that Wabash was the better team tonight. Nice, complete win for the LGs tonight.

What's with Wabash showing up for some games and disappearing for others?  (re. 'Bash/OWU a few weeks ago compared to tonight, etc...)

I think you've got to just throw out that game at OWU.  That's the only game Wabash hasn't been competitive in this season.  Over the course of 25 or so games, everybody is bound to have one lousy night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 26, 2008, 09:44:51 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 07:50:14 PM
Finals in the NCAC tonight:

#6 Allegheny 65
#3 Wittenberg 63

(Notably, Witt's website is saying that this is the first time Wittenberg has ever lost in the NCAC quarterfinals.)

I wonder when the last time was that Witt lost 4 out of 5 games in any stretch...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 26, 2008, 09:50:55 PM
Quote from: cmhscots on February 26, 2008, 09:44:51 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 07:50:14 PM
Finals in the NCAC tonight:

#6 Allegheny 65
#3 Wittenberg 63

(Notably, Witt's website is saying that this is the first time Wittenberg has ever lost in the NCAC quarterfinals.)

I wonder when the last time was that Witt lost 4 out of 5 games in any stretch...

You'd have to go all the way back to the start of this season...Witt started 1-5.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 26, 2008, 10:42:49 PM
thanks for the refresher-just kidding-disappointing way to end the season-i wasn't in attendance so i can't say much but from what i could gain from text messages witt looked terrible
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 26, 2008, 10:48:45 PM
If there's anything good about Witt's loss, it's that it was only seen by another less-than-stellar Springfield crowd of 376 people (a number that includes both teams, coaching staffs, and workers).  For comparison, Wooster tonight had 717 as the listed attendance, Kenyon-Wabash drew 400, while the Kenyon-Earlham women's game drew 300.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2008, 11:12:08 PM
A couple of quick notes before I embark on a night of scoreboard-chasing:
*The crowd at Kenyon may have looked small, but it was actually pretty large compared to normal.  I wonder which side you were looking at, as there were cameras on both sides.  The weather was HORRIBLE and I was surprised how many folks turned out.
*Wabash played the best game I've ever seen them play, and this is the 5th time I've seen them this year.  Yes, their performance at OWU was an outlier, but so was this.  The couldn't miss from outside in the first half, and that really opened up the inside for the bigs and the lane-drivers.  Everything worked.  Kenyon didn't play poorly, but they had no answer.  If Wabash can repeat this performance Friday, Wooster will be in trouble.
*I don't think that the road for OWU or Hiram got significantly easier tonight; Allegheny is a decent team who has been improving down the stretch.  George Raftis is a stud, and their outside shooting (Sharp, Jaicks, Babe, Price, Devinney) can be deadly.  Plus remember tomorrow's winner gets the Gators on short rest on a neutral court.  Warning--Warning--Danger--Danger!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2008, 01:00:20 AM
Tonight's rescheduled Hiram/OWU doubleheader will be available in free live streaming video.  Click here for details and access. (http://stream.owu.edu/)  The men's game is scheduled to tip off at 6pm, with the women's game to follow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCAC_alum55 on February 27, 2008, 06:52:41 AM
Great win by Allegheny- as we all know, regardless of Witt's talent- it takes a lot to go into the HPER Center and come away with a victory. 

Also... Congrats to James Cooper- wow! Truly a special player. Should be a fun game to watch Friday against Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2008, 10:14:08 AM
So much for only inviting the top 4 to the tourney! Also, Salisbury won a game in their league as a #8 seed with a 6-19 record!

Can OWU be the surprise team to win it all? Can Wabash hang with Wooster? Will this give Gheny confidence?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2008, 10:18:02 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 26, 2008, 08:29:50 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2008, 07:50:14 PM
Finals in the NCAC tonight:

#6 Allegheny 65
#3 Wittenberg 63

Oh my.  Our Witt fans expressed concern, but I wasn't really buying it.  I guess that concern was well founded.  How fired up are OWU and Hiram right now?   The road to the finals just got a little easier. 

I was thinking the same thing, especially concerning OWU.  If the Bishops can avoid the upset bug and get past Hiram, the prospect of having to beat Witt for a 3rd time this season seemed like a tall order.  After all, it had been 50+ years since OWU had even swept Witt in the regular season.  Now the Bishops were facing the prospect of beating Witt 3 times in a season!  But, Allegheny took care of that problem for the Bishops by pulling off the upset last night in Springfield! 

With that said, I have to echo the following sentiments expressed by David:

Quote from: David Collinge on February 26, 2008, 11:12:08 PM
*I don't think that the road for OWU or Hiram got significantly easier tonight; Allegheny is a decent team who has been improving down the stretch.  George Raftis is a stud, and their outside shooting (Sharp, Jaicks, Babe, Price, Devinney) can be deadly.  Plus remember tomorrow's winner gets the Gators on short rest on a neutral court.  Warning--Warning--Danger--Danger!
Allegheny seems to have been playing their best basketball of late.  Their record might not reflect that as they had lost 4 of 5 and their last 3 games of the season before last night's upset. 

Despite the Gators ending up on the short end of their last few games, they have been in postition to win almost every one of them.  Their first game at Witt the Gators led by as many as 10 and they led by 4 at the half before falling by 12.  And at Wooster last week, Allegheny was very much in that game as the game was tied at 69 with seven minutes to go, but the Scots closed out the game on a 15-5 run.  And in their season finale with OWU, the Gators were only down 2 with just over 9 minutes to play, but the Bishops used a 12-4 run to build a comfortable lead and iced it at the ft line down the stretch.

I think one thing that is overlooked about Alleghey is that they are a good shooting team.  They are one of the best shooting teams in the conference (4th overall and 2nd in 3-pointers) and they have been shooting the ball well over 50% (52.6%) over their last 6 games.  And they've been equally impressive from deep as they've shot 50.1% over that same span from 3 point range.  If Allegheny can keep shooting, they have the potential to knock off anyone.

One thing is for sure.  If OWU wins tonight, they had better not come into Friday's game taking the Gators lightly or they will be sent packing just like Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2008, 10:23:17 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 27, 2008, 10:14:08 AM
So much for only inviting the top 4 to the tourney! Also, Salisbury won a game in their league as a #8 seed with a 6-19 record!
It didn't take too long for that arguemt to be thrown back at him did it?  :P

Quote from: smedindy on February 27, 2008, 10:14:08 AM
Can OWU be the surprise team to win it all? Can Wabash hang with Wooster? Will this give Gheny confidence?
Would you really call it that much of a surprise if OWU were to win it all?  After all, they are the #2 seed and they did beat Witt twice and they were in postition to beat Wooster in both games.  I just wouldn't call it that much of a surprise if OWU came up here and won it all.  Wabash and Allegheny winning it all, on the other hand...  Now that would be a surprise.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DanTHEman67 on February 27, 2008, 10:30:52 AM
It's only truly a home game if the home team's crowd shows up  :-[ and cheers.

I grew up in Springfield and the crowded games I attended with my grandfather in the old field house were borderline rowdy at times, especially during important matches. Even when I went to Witt. after the move to the HPERC there was spirit at least, even if the arena was and is not conductive to intimacy. Now, it sounds like few are interested so I guess we got the result we deserved. I'd like to know WHY? Maybe a few losing seasons like others often experience would cure the complacency.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on February 27, 2008, 10:52:55 AM
Smeds, I never said upsets would not happen. Low seeds go into the game with the "nothing to lose" attitude and makes them dangerous.
My point is other than tournament seeding and home court advantage, it makes the season conference play meaningless.
If less teams were invited to the tourney we would see play elevated during the regular season.
Anyways, the way Witt finished their season they were ripe for the taking.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2008, 11:03:58 AM
I don't think we'd see that much difference in play, at all. I have rarely seen teams just go through the motions, no matter if they are Oberlin or Wooster.

In fact, I think we'd see more teams 'throwing in the towel' if there was no 7 or 8 seed to play for.

You only have so many college games to play in, but I think the instinct of some players, beaten down over time by losing so many games, would slack off if their game against Hiram was for nothing but a place in the schedule.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2008, 11:18:34 AM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 26, 2008, 10:48:45 PM
If there's anything good about Witt's loss, it's that it was only seen by another less-than-stellar Springfield crowd of 376 people (a number that includes both teams, coaching staffs, and workers).  For comparison, Wooster tonight had 717 as the listed attendance, Kenyon-Wabash drew 400, while the Kenyon-Earlham women's game drew 300.

Quote from: DanTHEman67 on February 27, 2008, 10:30:52 AM
It's only truly a home game if the home team's crowd shows up  :-[ and cheers.

I grew up in Springfield and the crowded games I attended with my grandfather in the old field house were borderline rowdy at times, especially during important matches. Even when I went to Witt. after the move to the HPERC there was spirit at least, even if the arena was and is not conductive to intimacy. Now, it sounds like few are interested so I guess we got the result we deserved. I'd like to know WHY? Maybe a few losing seasons like others often experience would cure the complacency.
Wooster never seems to draw very well either for their 1st round tournament games.  Last night might have been the first time all season the Scots didn't crack the 1,000 mark.  Too bad that more people couldn't have been there to honor James Cooper on such a historic night for him and the program.  I'm sure that the weather had a factor as well as the opponent.  I was contemplating on whether I would go or not and then I thought to myself, how many more times am I going to be able to see James Cooper do his thing?  I wasn't even counting on him breaking the milestone last night as I figured it would happen Friday.  Turned out to be an added bonus for the few of us that braved the elements last night!  8)


It was really fun to see Cooper's last sequence of shots when he was trying to get 2,000.  After his first miss, Wooter garnered the offensive rebound and immediately got the ball back to Cooper.  As he put up his 2nd attempt at the milestone, everyone thought he had to make that shot and clang...  Miss #2!  But again Wooster corralled yet another offensive rebound and again found Cooper with a big grin on his face.  And almost mercifully, Oberlin fouled Cooper where he made both ft's to finally reach 2,000!  Congrats on such a great accomplishment in becoming only the 2nd Wooster player to break the 2,000 point plateau!

And Cooper's accomplishment really puts into perspective just how good Tom Dinger was!  And Dinger's 2,370 points came without the 3-point line!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2008, 11:20:38 AM
With the preface that, as a card-carrying member of the 'ribbons-and-cookies' wing of intercollegiate athletics, I like the tournament, and think the more teams in it, the better...

Last night's results I think actually support those who would like a shorter field.  The argument would be that all season long Allegheny (or more to the point, Salisbury) has done little to deserve the chance to represent the conference in the NCAA tournament, so why give them the chance?  It's great for the fans and exciting and all that, but for every Salisbury that makes its way into the 59-team field on the basis of one good week, some other team that has proved more worthy over four months is left out. 

Norman Maclean expressed it best when talking about his father's views on fly fishing:
Quote from: Norman Maclean, A River Runs Through ItMy brother and I would have preferred to start learning how to fish by going out and catching a few, omitting entirely anything difficult or technical in the way of preparation that would take away from the fun. But it wasn't by way of fun that we were introduced to our father's art. If our father had had his say, nobody who did not know how to fish would be allowed to disgrace a fish by catching him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on February 27, 2008, 12:12:23 PM
Amen Dave.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2008, 12:23:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 27, 2008, 11:20:38 AM

Last night's results I think actually support those who would like a shorter field.  The argument would be that all season long Allegheny (or more to the point, Salisbury) has done little to deserve the chance to represent the conference in the NCAA tournament, so why give them the chance?  It's great for the fans and exciting and all that, but for every Salisbury that makes its way into the 59-team field on the basis of one good week, some other team that has proved more worthy over four months is left out. 


Though you are ultimately proven worthy by winning the auto bid. If you do not, and are not a "B", then you have left it up to others to decide your fate.

York and Wittenberg have little hope for a "C" anyway.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2008, 03:28:00 PM
The two visiting league teams that impressed me the most this season were OWU and Allegheny.  The latter is, also, definitely on the rise, those players that were thrust onto the court during the early season having become veterans.  Raftis is as good (or better) than any big man in the NCAC, and I'm anxious to see him take on Rudegeair and Jean on Friday.  I see that first game as being a tossup, with the winner certainly being a contender for the title.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 27, 2008, 03:48:14 PM
so Wittenberg didn't impress you at all when they visited Witt? I know they're eliminated and probably don't deserve it but come on that's a little harsh haha. I am interested to see what chinks OWU can find in the Wooster armor to find the keys to victory. If Wooster has to travel to Capital in the NCAA i think that would be a moderate test as compared to having to travel to say Hope? Although i'd be interested to hear what some opinions of DeVos Fieldhouse up there is as it looks like a gem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2008, 04:03:56 PM
Feb. 27 regional rankings:

Great Lakes Region 
1.  Hope  21-3  15-2 
2.  Capital  21-4  20-4 
3.  Wooster  22-3  15-2 
4.  Heidelberg  20-5  18-4 
5.  Penn State-Behrend  21-4  19-3 
6.  Albion  18-5  14-3

The only news here for NCAC fans (I think), is that the stronger OWP and OOWP numbers in the OAC are keeping Capital ahead of Wooster, even with Capital's loss last week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2008, 05:02:54 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 27, 2008, 12:23:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 27, 2008, 11:20:38 AM

Last night's results I think actually support those who would like a shorter field.  The argument would be that all season long Allegheny (or more to the point, Salisbury) has done little to deserve the chance to represent the conference in the NCAA tournament, so why give them the chance?  It's great for the fans and exciting and all that, but for every Salisbury that makes its way into the 59-team field on the basis of one good week, some other team that has proved more worthy over four months is left out. 


Though you are ultimately proven worthy by winning the auto bid. If you do not, and are not a "B", then you have left it up to others to decide your fate.

York and Wittenberg have little hope for a "C" anyway.

I suppose this depends on one's definition of "worthy".  I think a team that has performed far better over the course of a 25-game season is more "worthy" than one who plays better over the course of three games.  As a man of science, sample size is pretty important and, quite simply, conclusions drawn from a set of 25 games far outweigh conclusions drawn from three games.  We (and by we I mean every conference in Division III) should be sending their regular season champions to the tournament.  The choice, to me, seems to be between having a relatively meaningless regular season or a completely meaningless conference tournament.  Overwhelmingly, the Division has chosen the former which is too bad. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2008, 05:50:17 PM
Maybe worthy is not the proper word. However, if you don't take care of business, you have no one to blame but yourself.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2008, 06:02:34 PM
Your intrepid correspondent is here on the scene in Delaware, but it seems I have to choose between connectivity and power.  So no play-by-play, but maybe sporadic in-game commentary.

OWU is off to a rough start.  As we all know, Hiram is an aggressive team, bumping, slapping, and forcing the action all the time.  This is not a style of play that plays to OWU's strengths; for example, Dustin Rudegeair is a great player in a lot of ways, but he's as soft as a kitten.  He's off to a very tough start, being manhandled at both ends.

Mike Staley is a special player.  He can do it all for a man his size, not unlike James Cooper. 

Hiram's fans (30 or so) were infuriated at the officiating early on, but that worm has turned, especially after back-to-back charging calls went their way.

I have to stand up to maintain my connection, which sucks, especially since I can't follow the action while I do this.  So I'll sit down now, as Muhammed ties the game at 30, 2:32 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2008, 06:48:37 PM
OWU on top, 35-30 at the half.  Hiram's fans, one in particular, are back to being unhappy with the refs.  This one guy, who I remember vividly from their visit to Denison, is very large (body-builder style), very loud, and very obnoxious.  At the end of the half he was screaming at the refs and actually started down out of the stands in their direction.  The cops here clearly have their eye on him. 

Those watching at home can see that the stands are about half-full, which is normal here in my experience.  You're looking at the student section on the right, the two women's teams in the center, and general admission on the left.  The more crowded G.A. section is to the left of the camera, and the Hiram section is to the right. 

It felt like Hiram must have dominated the stat sheet in the 1st, since they provided nearly all of the energy and forced the pace of play.  But actually OWU has an 18-17 rebounding edge and made one more basket (13/28 vs. 12/31 for Hiram).  Staley and Muhammed have 8, as do Jean and Holliday.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 27, 2008, 09:15:54 PM
OWU wins 84-66.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2008, 12:09:31 AM
Yeah, so as I was saying... :D

I guess the server from which I was stealing my connection got turned off or something.  And then there was the women's game, and the long drive through the snowstorm (took me a full extra hour to get home.)  All so I could tell you that the second half belonged to Jesse Jean.  He put up a solid double-double with 15 points and 10 boards...in the second half alone.  His final tally was a Jeff Gibbs-like (http://www.d3hoops.com/salem/02/round5/ottetown.htm) 23 & 19.  If Rudegeair is a kitten (and of course that's an exaggeration), then Jean is a water buffalo.  A rebounding water buffalo, with a nice soft touch around the hoop.  They may have had their way with Rudegeair in the first half (held to 2 points and 1 board in 16 first-half minutes), but nothing Ian Pfouts or Jason Hebeisen (to say nothing of Hassan Muhammed, who's a rag doll next to Jesse) did was going to budge Jesse in the second.  And that opened things up nicely for Dustin, who contributed 15 second-half points.

Hiram played a very good game, and it took a very good game from a very good team to eliminate them.  The 18-point final margin is misleading.  OWU had to work hard for the win, and they were spent by the end.  It will be interesting to see how well they can pull themselves back together for the early game Friday against Allegheny.  Then, if they should win that, they'd have a third game in four days on Saturday, and it would be against either an up-tempo team (Wooster) or a physical team (Wabash).  If OWU can pull this title out of their hat, I'll change my vote for Coach of the Year to my friend Mike DeWitt, because he'll have earned it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 28, 2008, 12:36:36 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 28, 2008, 12:09:31 AM
Hiram played a very good game, and it took a very good game from a very good team to eliminate them.  The 18-point final margin is misleading.  OWU had to work hard for the win, and they were spent by the end.  It will be interesting to see how well they can pull themselves back together for the early game Friday against Allegheny. 

Seems very similar to the situation Witt was in last year.  Hiram played them tough, kept it close in the first half, and Witt pulled away late for the win, then had to try and bounce back (which they obviously failed to do) against OWU in the early Friday game.  Hmmmm.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 28, 2008, 02:00:23 AM
We're not really comparing Jesse Jean vs. Hiram to anything Jeff Gibbs ever did?  Come on now. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2008, 02:02:57 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 28, 2008, 02:00:23 AM
We're not really comparing Jesse Jean vs. Hiram to anything Jeff Gibbs ever did?  Come on now. 

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 25, 2008, 03:44:17 PM
Somebody needs a nap.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 28, 2008, 02:06:03 AM
I didn't use all caps.   :)

But seriously...Jeff Gibbs was a one man national championship.  Jesse Jean had a monster game against Hiram.  You can't fill the Grand Canyon with the gap between the two. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2008, 11:23:32 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 28, 2008, 12:09:31 AM
OWU had to work hard for the win, and they were spent by the end.  It will be interesting to see how well they can pull themselves back together for the early game Friday against Allegheny.  Then, if they should win that, they'd have a third game in four days on Saturday, and it would be against either an up-tempo team (Wooster) or a physical team (Wabash).  If OWU can pull this title out of their hat, I'll change my vote for Coach of the Year to my friend Mike DeWitt, because he'll have earned it.
I was just wondering, isn't this what they have to do to win the OAC and the MIAA, etc.?  :P ;)     The NCAC seems to be one of the few smart conferences that start their conference tournaments at least a day early to give teams an extra day of recovery.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2008, 11:43:24 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 28, 2008, 11:23:32 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 28, 2008, 12:09:31 AM
OWU had to work hard for the win, and they were spent by the end.  It will be interesting to see how well they can pull themselves back together for the early game Friday against Allegheny.  Then, if they should win that, they'd have a third game in four days on Saturday, and it would be against either an up-tempo team (Wooster) or a physical team (Wabash).  If OWU can pull this title out of their hat, I'll change my vote for Coach of the Year to my friend Mike DeWitt, because he'll have earned it.
I was just wondering, isn't this what they have to do to win the OAC and the MIAA, etc.?  :P ;)     The NCAC seems to be one of the few smart conferences that start their conference tournaments at least a day early to give teams an extra day of recovery.

There's a wide variety in the scheduling of tournaments, ranging from the SCAC, ASC, and ODAC playing three games in three days, to the WIAC's Mon-Wed-Sat schedule this year.

What makes it different and difficult for OWU is that they have one fewer day of rest than the other three semifinalists, thanks to the postponement.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 29, 2008, 07:37:56 AM
These guys are 19, 20 years old!  How much rest do they need?  It just means one fewer day to party in between games. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 29, 2008, 12:32:40 PM
Free live video, audio, and stats will be available for the NCAC tournament at Wooster.  Click here (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2007-08/ncac_preview.php) for information and access, as well as a preview of the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 29, 2008, 09:35:18 PM
Wow. Just wow. Wabash Always Fights. I'm going to go get a drink now. Way to go, Little Giants!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ChicagoHopeNut on February 29, 2008, 09:36:42 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 29, 2008, 09:35:18 PM
Wow. Just wow. Wabash Always Fights. I'm going to go get a drink now. Way to go, Little Giants!

That was a really impressive game from Wabash. A pleasure to watch. Also, the NCAC video feed was exquisite. Maybe the best I have ever seen at the D3 level.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 29, 2008, 09:39:42 PM
NCAC Tourney Semi-Final Scores:

Ohio Wesleyan 79  Allegheny 63

Wabash 87  Wooster 63

Congratulations to the Little Giants on a very well played game!  Wabash shot 54% from the floor and held to Wooster to only 39%.

Aaron Brock led Wabash with 29 points (8 of 11 FGs, 4 of 5 three pointers, 9 of 9 FTs) and was unstoppable tonight.

Brandon Johnson rolled his ankle midway through the first half and never returned for Wooster.  Let's hope that Brandon's injury is not serioius so he can play in the NCAA tourney if Wooster gets an at-large bid.

So, the NCAC should get 2 teams into the NCAA tourney.:)  Good luck to the Bishops and Little Giants in tomorrow's battle for the automatic bid.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on February 29, 2008, 09:40:07 PM
What a shocker from Wabash - congrats to the LGs!  When was the last time we've had an NCAC Tournament Championship game without either Witt or Wooster? 

I would assume Wooster is still good for an at-large bid, but does anyone think otherwise?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ChicagoHopeNut on February 29, 2008, 09:42:33 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 29, 2008, 09:40:07 PM
What a shocker from Wabash - congrats to the LGs!  When was the last time we've had an NCAC Tournament Championship game without either Witt or Wooster? 

I would assume Wooster is still good for an at-large bid, but does anyone think otherwise?

I think Wooster is safely in as a Pool C bid. A terrible host of things would have to happen across the country for Wooster to fall outside the top 17 C's.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 29, 2008, 09:47:24 PM
Quote from: jscwittfan on February 29, 2008, 09:40:07 PMWhen was the last time we've had an NCAC Tournament Championship game without either Witt or Wooster? 

It would have to be before 1999 because that's as far back as the archive on the NCAC site goes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pbrooks3 on February 29, 2008, 11:01:32 PM
Reporting from the SCAC tournament in Conway AR where the quarterfinal round games were played today. Most games followed the projected script - Centre and Millsaps won along with Trinity (TX) in a thrilling 2 overtime game over DePauw. In a mild upset the host school Hendrix defeated Oglethorpe in the late game. Attendance was generally 200-300 per early games this afternoon. The Hendrix-Oglethorpe men's game drew close to 600 tonight. Can't begin to compare with atmosphere at Timken in Wooster, but a better turnout than I expected. Hendrix should get another good draw tomorrow against Millsaps.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 29, 2008, 11:40:42 PM
Quote from: pbrooks3 on February 29, 2008, 11:01:32 PM
Reporting from the SCAC tournament in Conway AR where the quarterfinal round games were played today. Most games followed the projected script - Centre and Millsaps won along with Trinity (TX) in a thrilling 2 overtime game over DePauw. In a mild upset the host school Hendrix defeated Oglethorpe in the late game. Attendance was generally 200-300 per early games this afternoon. The Hendrix-Oglethorpe men's game drew close to 600 tonight. Can't begin to compare with atmosphere at Timken in Wooster, but a better turnout than I expected. Hendrix should get another good draw tomorrow against Millsaps.

Thanks.  I was interested in your report because the SCAC is playing at a quasi-neutral site (at Hendrix, pre-selected and not based on seeding.)  200-300, eh?  There were more than that at Kenyon tonight for the women's NCAC tournament.  I think this is evidence that a neutral site tournament would not work for us.  Thanks again for the report, pbrooks3!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 29, 2008, 11:57:31 PM
Congrats to this Little Giants team on a tremendous win tonight in Wooster. 

WAF
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BashDad on February 29, 2008, 11:59:59 PM
Go Bash! Terrific!

Let's get OWU!

WAF
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 01, 2008, 12:10:27 AM
Oh my. BashBro and #3 appear on the hoops board. This is a banner night, indeed.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on March 01, 2008, 01:31:47 AM
Fun game to finally get the feed for, and a great, season ending run for the LGs and Coach Mac.  Time to Bash the Bishops and even the score from last time...

"Who'd a thunk it" last week at this time?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 01, 2008, 01:56:22 AM
They're coming out of the woodwork tonight!  This is great.  I'm going to reserve comments like "amazing" and "tremendous" to describe tonight's win.  From what I've seen of Wabash this season, I've felt that this kind of game was entirely possible.  I wouldn't have guessed this kind of margin, but beating Wooster in Wooster wasn't out of the question. 

I didn't see the game, but I'm guessing based on what I saw in the Wabash/Wooster game in C'ville, Wes Smith was checking 2,000 point scorer James Cooper.  14 points and 0-6 on 3 pt field goals...he must have done a great job.  Wesley won't win the NoY award in front of Wickliffe, but I really think that he's had more impact on a team this year than any freshman in the league.  What Smith has done for Wabash on defense this year doesn't show up directly in the stat box...but he's been a big key for the LGs. 

OWU has been playing well....but really, who wants to play the team that just beat Wooster on their own floor by 24?  This is cool...one game to make the dance for the first time in 10 years.  Go Wabash....these kids deserve it.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 01, 2008, 01:59:49 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 29, 2008, 11:40:42 PM
Quote from: pbrooks3 on February 29, 2008, 11:01:32 PM
Reporting from the SCAC tournament in Conway AR where the quarterfinal round games were played today. Most games followed the projected script - Centre and Millsaps won along with Trinity (TX) in a thrilling 2 overtime game over DePauw. In a mild upset the host school Hendrix defeated Oglethorpe in the late game. Attendance was generally 200-300 per early games this afternoon. The Hendrix-Oglethorpe men's game drew close to 600 tonight. Can't begin to compare with atmosphere at Timken in Wooster, but a better turnout than I expected. Hendrix should get another good draw tomorrow against Millsaps.

Thanks.  I was interested in your report because the SCAC is playing at a quasi-neutral site (at Hendrix, pre-selected and not based on seeding.)  200-300, eh?  There were more than that at Kenyon tonight for the women's NCAC tournament.  I think this is evidence that a neutral site tournament would not work for us.  Thanks again for the report, pbrooks3!

I think your conference is a tad more geographically compact than the SCAC. Probably safe to say that Wabash, almost always your furthest team, would bring more fans to a neutral site in the  NCAC footprint than Colorado College or Austin College would have brought to Conway, Ark.

Also remember that the SCAC was playing in two sites in the same city on the same day, so that split things up a little.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 01, 2008, 02:18:57 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 26, 2008, 08:29:50 PM
It's going to take this kind of game this weekend to get by Wooster.  But we know that Wabash has the potential.  Should be a great game at Timken this weekend! 
Well Wabash played that kind of game and then some last night!  Congrats to Wabash on the sound arse kicking they delivered tonight at Timken!  I have not seen a Wooster team look that bad since I started following the Scots closely back in '97.  You could argue that tournament loss at Calvin several years back, but that was on the road and not in the friendly confines of Timken Gym.  And to think that the Scots had not lost at home until tonight's debacle.

Some thoughts from the game:

Who lit the fire under Aaron Brock?  He follows up a 21 point performance at Kenyon with a 29 point all-american 'esque performance last night?!  This dude is in one unbelievable groove right now.

You have to give credit to Wabash for weathering the Wooster comeback.  Wooster came out on fire in the 2nd half and you could tell they were responding to whatever Coach Moore and his staff had to say during the intermission.  Before you knew it, Wabash's 13 point lead was down to 4 and the crowd was jacked.  I couldn't believe Petty wasn't calling a t.o.  I guess that's why he's the coach as Wabash not only thwarted Wooster's comeback.  But they responded with a huge run of their own to put the game very much on ice...

And lastly, I think we got to see just how much Brandon Johnson brings to the table both offensively and defensively.  Losing him early in the game was a tremendous blow.  If Wooster is worthy of a C bid, they won't go far without Johnson on the floor.  And from the looks of it, I would be very surprised if Johnson is back for the early round games.

One more thing.  I overheard some OWU fans as I was leaving commenting on how empty the gym will be tomorrow.  Then one of them said that OWU fans would be there at least and the 8 or so Wabash fans that were there tonight.  I had to speak out at that point.  I said, I would expect there to be a few more than 8 or so Wabash fans in attendance tomorrow night.  So, you Lil' Giant followers.  Don't let me down! ;)

Quote from: wally_wabash on March 01, 2008, 01:56:22 AM

OWU has been playing well....but really, who wants to play the team that just beat Wooster on their own floor by 24?  This is cool...one game to make the dance for the first time in 10 years.  Go Wabash....these kids deserve it.   :)
I'm sure that OWU was thinking the same thing after they won at Witt marking the first Witt sweep in 50+ years... ::)

And as far as Wes Smith is concerned.  He certainly bothered Cooper a bit, but I wouldn't say he is the reason Cooper was 0-6 from deep.  Many of Coopers looks were pretty good.  The shot just wasn't falling tonight.  It happens to the best of them...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pbrooks3 on March 01, 2008, 02:25:56 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 01, 2008, 01:59:49 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 29, 2008, 11:40:42 PM
Quote from: pbrooks3 on February 29, 2008, 11:01:32 PM
Reporting from the SCAC tournament in Conway AR where the quarterfinal round games were played today. Most games followed the projected script - Centre and Millsaps won along with Trinity (TX) in a thrilling 2 overtime game over DePauw. In a mild upset the host school Hendrix defeated Oglethorpe in the late game. Attendance was generally 200-300 per early games this afternoon. The Hendrix-Oglethorpe men's game drew close to 600 tonight. Can't begin to compare with atmosphere at Timken in Wooster, but a better turnout than I expected. Hendrix should get another good draw tomorrow against Millsaps.

Thanks.  I was interested in your report because the SCAC is playing at a quasi-neutral site (at Hendrix, pre-selected and not based on seeding.)  200-300, eh?  There were more than that at Kenyon tonight for the women's NCAC tournament.  I think this is evidence that a neutral site tournament would not work for us.  Thanks again for the report, pbrooks3!

I think your conference is a tad more geographically compact than the SCAC. Probably safe to say that Wabash, almost always your furthest team, would bring more fans to a neutral site in the  NCAC footprint than Colorado College or Austin College would have brought to Conway, Ark.

Also remember that the SCAC was playing in two sites in the same city on the same day, so that split things up a little.

Good points, Pat - the SCAC is not the NCAC.  I don't consider Hendrix College's gym a quasi-neutral site.  Granted the quarter final games for the women were played today at a local high school, so we might classify those games as having been played at a quasi-neutral site.  Interestingly enough, the host school in the women's game almost upset a top seed (Oglethorpe) in the quarters this evening.  I got some additional opinions from Hendrix folks tonight on attendance at the men's 8 pm game between Hendrix and Oglethorpe - they suggested the house was closer to 700 rather than the 600 I previously noted.  The remainder of the tournament Saturday & Sunday will be played at Hendrix's new gym.  For a first hosting, my hat's off to the Hendrix folks for a fine job done on day one.  Hendrix is a school of 1,300 students located in Conway Arkansas (30 miles west of Little Rock).  Conway is a community of 50,000 with three colleges so it's a little more than a shade tree in the outback.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2008, 11:24:20 AM
Quote from: pbrooks3 on March 01, 2008, 02:25:56 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 01, 2008, 01:59:49 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 29, 2008, 11:40:42 PM
Quote from: pbrooks3 on February 29, 2008, 11:01:32 PM
Reporting from the SCAC tournament in Conway AR where the quarterfinal round games were played today. Most games followed the projected script - Centre and Millsaps won along with Trinity (TX) in a thrilling 2 overtime game over DePauw. In a mild upset the host school Hendrix defeated Oglethorpe in the late game. Attendance was generally 200-300 per early games this afternoon. The Hendrix-Oglethorpe men's game drew close to 600 tonight. Can't begin to compare with atmosphere at Timken in Wooster, but a better turnout than I expected. Hendrix should get another good draw tomorrow against Millsaps.

Thanks.  I was interested in your report because the SCAC is playing at a quasi-neutral site (at Hendrix, pre-selected and not based on seeding.)  200-300, eh?  There were more than that at Kenyon tonight for the women's NCAC tournament.  I think this is evidence that a neutral site tournament would not work for us.  Thanks again for the report, pbrooks3!

I think your conference is a tad more geographically compact than the SCAC. Probably safe to say that Wabash, almost always your furthest team, would bring more fans to a neutral site in the  NCAC footprint than Colorado College or Austin College would have brought to Conway, Ark.

Also remember that the SCAC was playing in two sites in the same city on the same day, so that split things up a little.

Good points, Pat - the SCAC is not the NCAC.  I don't consider Hendrix College's gym a quasi-neutral site.  Granted the quarter final games for the women were played today at a local high school, so we might classify those games as having been played at a quasi-neutral site.  Interestingly enough, the host school in the women's game almost upset a top seed (Oglethorpe) in the quarters this evening.  I got some additional opinions from Hendrix folks tonight on attendance at the men's 8 pm game between Hendrix and Oglethorpe - they suggested the house was closer to 700 rather than the 600 I previously noted.  The remainder of the tournament Saturday & Sunday will be played at Hendrix's new gym.  For a first hosting, my hat's off to the Hendrix folks for a fine job done on day one.  Hendrix is a school of 1,300 students located in Conway Arkansas (30 miles west of Little Rock).  Conway is a community of 50,000 with three colleges so it's a little more than a shade tree in the outback.

I explained what I meant by "quasi-neutral": pre-selected and not based on seeding.  Perhaps my made-up term didn't capture that sentiment precisely. 

I've been to lots of NCAC games, both men's and women's, and I think I have a pretty good sense of how well fans show up to support their teams on the road.  Wooster's fanbase travels pretty well, and to a lesser degree so do Witt's.  Others, not so much.  I read upthread that someone suggested that "8" Wabash fans were in attendance last night at Wooster.  An exaggeration, I'm sure, but I've seen nearly empty visitor's sections in a lot of NCAC gyms.  And this is despite the fact (of which I already was aware) that we have a relatively geographically compact conference. 

The reported attendance for the second games of our doubleheaders was 1000 (Kenyon) and 1759 (Wooster).  I can attest to the Kenyon figure as that was my estimate, too.  (The two openers are listed at 350 and 1010, respectively.)  At a neutral, or "central", site, I think you can safely cut those figures in half, down towards a level like the SCAC, leaving you with a tournament that lacks both fan energy and financial viability.  I'll be interested to see tonight's figures, since we have truly neutral and relatively central sites in play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pbrooks3 on March 01, 2008, 12:08:52 PM
I got away from your definition of "quasi-neutral" site last night while watching the Oglethorpe-Hendrix game. Thanks for the reminder.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 01, 2008, 01:23:26 PM
How sweet is it that the win over Wooster last night may help to keep DePauw out of the dance?  Outstandiing.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 01, 2008, 03:05:53 PM
Wow! I had no time to visit yesterday, and was at work all day today! Congrats LG's!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on March 01, 2008, 06:58:48 PM
Is there video of the game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 01, 2008, 07:11:24 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 29, 2008, 11:40:42 PM

Thanks.  I was interested in your report because the SCAC is playing at a quasi-neutral site (at Hendrix, pre-selected and not based on seeding.)  200-300, eh?  There were more than that at Kenyon tonight for the women's NCAC tournament.  I think this is evidence that a neutral site tournament would not work for us.  Thanks again for the report, pbrooks3!

Now, I like the idea of that just for hoop junkies. The issue with afternoon games on a Friday would probably keep that attendance down.

How about an NCAC final four in Dayton or Columbus? Play the first round at campus sites and then move there for the finals?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 01, 2008, 07:11:51 PM
Right here Schwami:

http://www.teamline.cc/free_view?teamcode=1061&eventcode=6&status=PFF
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on March 01, 2008, 07:16:03 PM
Thanks Wally!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 01, 2008, 07:35:17 PM
Blech...pretty poor finish to the half for Wabash there.  Wabash will have to a much better job rebounding the basketball in the second half. 

Halftime score is 42-30 with OWU in the lead.  Zimmer's foul trouble has thrown things off for the LGs big time.  He'll have to play smarter in the second half. 

Wabash Always Fights!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 01, 2008, 07:51:43 PM
Rudegair is unconcious. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 01, 2008, 08:31:16 PM
89-72 is the final.  Hats off to OWU.  The Bishops really played lights out tonight.  Congrats on the tournament championship and the bid to the NCAA tournament! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 01, 2008, 08:48:49 PM
Congrats to OWU! No offense to Wooster or Witt, but it is nice for one of the 'little eight' to win the championship!

Now, it's up to Wooster and OWU to represent well in the tourney!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2008, 09:31:32 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 01, 2008, 08:48:49 PM
Congrats to OWU! No offense to Wooster or Witt, but it is nice for one of the 'little eight' to win the championship!

Don't you mean the Dorksen Eight (http://www.d3sports.com/post/index.php?topic=4200.msg675859#msg675859)?  :D

Congratulations to Mike DeWitt and the OWU Battling Bishops on their tournament championship.
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.allemoticons.com%2FAvatars%2Fclap2.gif&hash=e8b540eb031a1423c66d132ea6c5a9988739397e)
Twenty years after winning the 1988 NCAA Division 3 championship, the Bishops return to the national tournament to put their perfect record on the line.  I'd guess they'll begin their defense of that unblemished slate just down the road in Bexley, which should be good for the "OWU Zoo."  (Then again, Capital lost tonight to Heidelberg, so who knows?)  Good luck to the Bishops, and the Scots if they get a bid, in the tournament!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on March 02, 2008, 08:44:38 AM
To watch the men's selection show @ noon Monday:

http://all-access.cstv.com/cstv/player/player.html?code=ncaa&sport=m-baskbl&category=Features%20%26%20Interviews%20%28MediaType%29&media=62248
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 02, 2008, 12:33:47 PM
Congrats to OWU for winning the tourney championship. Despite the disappointing end to the season, it was a good one. Brock and Smith are young and the experience of beating Wooster and being a game away from the Madness will go a long way for them. Next year should be good, indeed.

Good luck to OWU and Wooster. Represent the NCAC well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2008, 04:09:31 PM
The announced attendance at Wooster on Saturday was 750.  I thought I saw an attendance of 300 for the women's final, but now the boxscores on the various sites (Denison, Witt, Kenyon) have omitted the attendance. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 02, 2008, 05:30:04 PM
It's a day late but my congratulations to Coach DeWitt and his OWU Bishops. Coach DeWitt is a class act and he has been building his team to this accomplishment for several years.

Congratulations to Wabash also. Even though it was at Wooster's expense they played a tremendous game. When Wooster made that run at the start of the second half I thought they would wilt but they responded with confidence. At the end of the game on Friday night and after the teams exchanged handshakes, coach Petty acknowledged the fans and his wife came down to give him a big hug. It was a special moment that I was glad to witness.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2008, 08:53:05 PM
I would like to add my congratulations to Ohio Wesleyan and Coach DeWitt for winning the NCAC tourney and automatic bid to the big dance!  Nice to see the Bishops with their large group of Seniors getting a chance to play in the NCAA tourney. :)

One other stat that may help Wooster in getting an at-large bid into the NCAA tourney.  Wooster is 5-0 vs. other teams that have aready clinched automatic bids into the tourney.

The 4 NCAA bound teams that Wooster beat are:
St. Thomas (MIAC)
Farmingdale State (Skyline)
St. Mary's, MD (CAC)
Ohio Wesleyan (twice)


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 02, 2008, 09:05:28 PM
I am also a bit late to the party, but I wanted to extend my congratulations to the Bishops as well, and may they represent the NCAC well in the NCAA tournament!

I would be remiss if I didn't also pass along some kudos to Wabash, who utterly beat Wooster on Friday night.  Impressive performance for the LGs, and especially from Brock.

Hoping Wooster gets a bid and Brandon Johnson's injury isn't serious.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 03, 2008, 12:25:21 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 01, 2008, 07:51:43 PM
Rudegair is unconcious. 
To say the same thing about Brock vs. Wooster would be a bit of an understatement... ;)

Belated congrats to OWU on the A bid to the tournament.  As has been mentioned, Coach DeWitt is definitely a class act and he has been building towards this accomplishment and it is more than well deserved for not only him, but also to his team.

As far as the tournament is concernced, I woud be very surprised if Wooster didn't get an at large bid seeing as how they beat OWU twice this season.  And as wsf pointed out, they also have wins over 3 other teams who are dancing.  The first weekend of games could very well be an NCAC vs. OAC matchup  with OWU and Wooster vs. Heide and Cap.  But the NCAA never fails to impress me with their incopetence, so I wouldn't be surprised in the least to see Wooster left out of the dance... ::)

And even if Wooster happens to get in, without Brandon Johnson, I'm not too confident in how far this team can go in the tournament.  Has there been any word on the severity of Johnson's injury or are the Scots going Lloyd Carr and keeping the injury on the down low... ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 03, 2008, 12:29:36 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 03, 2008, 12:25:21 AM
The first weekend of games could very well be an NCAC vs. OAC matchup  with OWU and Wooster vs. Heide and Cap.

I tend to doubt that the selection committee would pair the two NCAC teams and the two OAC teams in a four-team pod. I think that the committee will make it a point to split them up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on March 03, 2008, 09:52:24 AM
From the Daily Record

JOHNSON X-RAYS NEGATIVE -- One of the downfalls for Wooster against Wabash was an ankle injury suffered by standout guard Brandon Johnson (11.4 ppg.) in the first half.

Moore said X-rays did not reveal a fracture and the team is hopeful Johnson will be able to get off his crutches today.

"Brandon is making progress, but it's too early to tell how soon he'll even be able to start running again," Moore said.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on March 03, 2008, 10:33:03 AM
Congrats to OWU!!! That is awesome and even though I am not a REAL BIG Wabash fan I think that was great and the conference needs this.  They did a great job.  The whole Witt vs Wooster thing was getting real old.

Wooster certainly deserves a bid and I am sure they will get one.  Nobody at 23-4 does not go.  They did not pick a good night to shoot it like crap.  But Wabash does have a nice club and it was great.

I am going to shout again so cover your ears.............GO BIG RED GALS!!!!  That was terrific.  Good luck in the tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2008, 12:38:29 PM
Well, Wooster got in, but wow what a tough draw (vs. Wash U. at Augustana, if I heard correctly.)  A rematch of last season's third-place game, FWIW.  I certainly hope that Brandon Johnson's ankle allows him to play Friday as he will surely be needed. 

OWU goes to Centre to take on Heidelberg, while Centre faces Franklin. 

Good luck to the Scots and Bishops!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2008, 12:44:12 PM
Nice to see Wooster make the NCAA tourney!

As David noted, this is an extremely tough draw having to play Washington University at Augustana.  The winner of that first round game probably gets to play Augustana on their home floor in the 2nd round.  Augustana hosts Aurora (IL) in the first round.

Once again, this proves why winning the automatic bid and finishing with a better record is so important.

Good Luck to both the Scots and the Bishops in the Big Dance!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2008, 01:01:06 PM
Mapquest (city to city) shows Wooster to Rock Island, IL as 501 miles.

Any bets that the NCAA mapping software shows it at 499 miles? :o ;) :D

I can't imagine that the NCAA will pay Wooster's airfare to Augustana!

Mapquest also shows that St. Louis is about 268 miles from Rock Island
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on March 03, 2008, 01:15:33 PM
I used Google Maps, and it was 501 miles from Wooster to Rock Island, but when the addresses of the schools are used it is under 500 miles. Either way, it is a long trip for the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2008, 01:22:19 PM
NCAA uses mappoint.msn.com.  City to city is 496.7 mi.; I didn't input the street addresses. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on March 03, 2008, 02:54:31 PM
If any Wooster faithful are making the trip to Rock Island from SAINT LOUIE, let me know, possible carpool!!! GO SCOTS!!! I've also heard a lot about Wash U this year in the city and I'm not drinking the Red&Green Kool-Aid this time...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2008, 02:56:21 PM
Augustana's Carver Center holds 3300 fans.  I don't know how well they draw, or how well Wash U. and Aurora travel, but with a gym that size I'd guess that tickets will be available at the door.  No word yet from Wooster about a pre-sale of tickets. 

Also no word yet from either OWU or Centre about tickets.  According to D3hoops.com, Centre's Alumni Gym seats 1300. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 03, 2008, 04:05:58 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 03, 2008, 02:56:21 PM
Augustana's Carver Center holds 3300 fans.  I don't know how well they draw, or how well Wash U. and Aurora travel, but with a gym that size I'd guess that tickets will be available at the door.  No word yet from Wooster about a pre-sale of tickets. 

Also no word yet from either OWU or Centre about tickets.  According to D3hoops.com, Centre's Alumni Gym seats 1300. 

Augie posters themselves complain about attendance and almost total lack of community support.  When IWU plays there, the crowd is generally at least 40-50% Green (and never anywhere near capacity).  And WashU can't draw even at home (don't know about Aurora).  I seriously doubt tickets would be a problem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 03, 2008, 04:16:06 PM
Wash U didn't sell their alotment for the Sectional at UWSP, Augustana is about 3-4 hours closer but even then I wouldn't expect many fans to make the journey.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on March 03, 2008, 04:18:30 PM
Wash U is led by their post man Ruths. IMO the key in this game will be whether or not Will and Co can contain and limit Ruths and make things difficult on him. If Johnson plays will certainly be the other key and how effective he can be. Wash U lost their PG early in the season and I think Johnson's ability to pressure the ball when healthy could be a big factor. A very interesting first round matchup between two teams that battled it out in the civic center almost a year ago. Best of luck to the Old Gold and black and a late congrats and good luck wishes to the Bishops...I will also echo the sentiments of others with respect to Coach DeWitt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 03, 2008, 05:13:33 PM

Its too bad Sean Wallis is out for WashU, seeing he and Cooper matchup would be worth the drive, they would definately 2 of the best guards in D3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 03, 2008, 05:17:23 PM
Looks like Aurora averages 520 a game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2008, 05:52:18 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 03, 2008, 05:17:23 PM
Looks like Aurora averages 520 a game.

Points?  Good Lord!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2008, 06:48:28 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 03, 2008, 05:52:18 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 03, 2008, 05:17:23 PM
Looks like Aurora averages 520 a game.

Points?  Good Lord!

It's a little misleading.  They averaged 80.8 points per game for 24 games, but when they beat Grinnell 11,061-11,047, it messed up the averages.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 03, 2008, 07:13:18 PM
David, I knew there was a Grinnell joke in there, I just didn't come up with it first! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2008, 08:10:24 PM
Yeah, Grinnell had 'em, too, but choked in the last 0.003 seconds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: LGHistorian on March 03, 2008, 10:15:11 PM
Just wanted to pass along a good luck wish to Wooster and OWU in the tourney. Being a Wabash grad I would have liked for the LGs to be there since Coach Petty is contemplating retirement. But it was a competitive year for conference play and I hope this year was an indication that the NCAC be more balanced in the future.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Marty Peretz on March 04, 2008, 04:02:41 AM
Wash.U. has had terrific student support this year, and improved but still not significant support from the community. Though the players' families travel extremely well, the students begin spring break Friday and almost definitely not make the trip to Rock Island (at least that's the case for me and I suspect I speak for a lot of the WU student faithful) en masse. I would not worry about getting tickets considering the size of the venue. There won't be more than 200 Bears fans there, unfortunately. Then again, if they beat Wooster, some of the Chicago-area fans may make the trek for the Saturday night showdown.

And a question: If WU were to get out of the weekend, what are their chances of hosting  the sweet 16 games?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 04, 2008, 04:08:23 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 03, 2008, 04:05:58 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 03, 2008, 02:56:21 PM
Augustana's Carver Center holds 3300 fans.  I don't know how well they draw, or how well Wash U. and Aurora travel, but with a gym that size I'd guess that tickets will be available at the door.  No word yet from Wooster about a pre-sale of tickets. 

Also no word yet from either OWU or Centre about tickets.  According to D3hoops.com, Centre's Alumni Gym seats 1300. 

Augie posters themselves complain about attendance and almost total lack of community support.  When IWU plays there, the crowd is generally at least 40-50% Green (and never anywhere near capacity).  And WashU can't draw even at home (don't know about Aurora).  I seriously doubt tickets would be a problem.

Augie doesn't draw well, and I'm pretty sure that the students will be on spring break there as well.

About half the crowd at the de facto UAA championship game at the U of C's Ratner Center on Saturday afternoon consisted of Wash U fans, so there were a good thousand or so people on hand who were wearing Wash U's Christmas colors. Rock Island is a closer trip from St. Louis than is Chicago. Then again, Wash U has a big Chicagoland fanbase (and several Chicagoland players on the roster), which helps explain the big turnout on Saturday. I'm not certain if that will translate to an equally big road turnout on Friday night in the QC for the Bears.

Aurora draws about 400-500 people to most home games. Last year the Spartans had about 400 or so of their fans in Thornton Gym watch them host the two opening rounds. They were dwarfed by the combined Hope and Calvin contingents, but they held their own. No telling how well they'll travel, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 04, 2008, 04:18:25 AM
Quote from: Vanilla24COW on March 03, 2008, 04:18:30 PM
Wash U is led by their post man Ruths. IMO the key in this game will be whether or not Will and Co can contain and limit Ruths and make things difficult on him. If Johnson plays will certainly be the other key and how effective he can be. Wash U lost their PG early in the season and I think Johnson's ability to pressure the ball when healthy could be a big factor.

An even bigger problem for Wooster might be Wash U's Tyler Nading (15.0 ppg, 5.9 rpg). He's a do-everything 6'7 wing who creates a lot of matchup problems for opponents, because most D3 teams don't have someone that size who is mobile enough to play out on the perimeter.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pbrooks3 on March 04, 2008, 11:06:54 AM
Alumni Gym at Centre can handle 1,500, and probably 200 more standing-room.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 04, 2008, 12:24:53 PM
I just did my pick 'em, and sad to say I can't be more of an NCAC homer. Wooster has a tough draw, and OWU going to Centre will be tough as well.

Best of luck! Prove me wrong!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2008, 02:14:27 PM
Ohio Wesleyan sneaks into the bottom of the 'others receiving votes' category of this week's Top 25 poll (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/), earning 2 votes (i.e., two voters had them at #25, or one had them at #24).  Woo-hoo!   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2008, 05:50:56 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 04, 2008, 04:18:25 AM
Quote from: Vanilla24COW on March 03, 2008, 04:18:30 PM
Wash U is led by their post man Ruths. IMO the key in this game will be whether or not Will and Co can contain and limit Ruths and make things difficult on him. If Johnson plays will certainly be the other key and how effective he can be. Wash U lost their PG early in the season and I think Johnson's ability to pressure the ball when healthy could be a big factor.

An even bigger problem for Wooster might be Wash U's Tyler Nading (15.0 ppg, 5.9 rpg). He's a do-everything 6'7 wing who creates a lot of matchup problems for opponents, because most D3 teams don't have someone that size who is mobile enough to play out on the perimeter.

Tyler Nading did the most damage in last year's third place game vs. Wooster as he led the Bears with 22 points.  Sean Wallis was right behind with 21 points and Troy Ruths had ~16-17 points.  Aaron Thompson is a good shooter as well and can hit the three pointer for the Bears.

Wooster will probably utilize Marty Bidwell (6'4", very quick, rebounds well) to defend Tyler Nading and this matchup will be one of the keys to the game.  If Wooster can prevent Troy Ruths and Tyler Nading from having a big scoring night (easier said than done), they will have a chance to win the game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2008, 08:55:01 PM
In today's newspaper, Wooster Coach Steve Moore gives an update on the high ankle sprain and status of Brandon Johnson.  He is now starting to walk :)...but it is still day to day and he has not done any running yet.

Best wishes to Brandon for a speedy recovery!

Here is the link to the Wooster Daily Record article on the Scots' NCAA bid:
http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/3408712
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jpope2 on March 04, 2008, 10:19:54 PM
Just a few stats to compare Wooster, Washington U. and the starting five of each, for fun.

            Wooster (23-4)           Washington U. (19-6)
ppg:           86.2                             72.3
rpg:            38.5                             33.7
fg%:           50.6%                          47.6%
3fg%:         44.3%                          41.3%

Probable starters:
Wooster
F Mary Bidwell (6'4" JR): 9.4 ppg 5.2 rpg 3.4 apg 1.8 steals
F Bryan Wickliffe (6'5" FR): 11 ppg 5.5 rpg
F/C Evan Will (6'6" SR): 9.7 ppg 6.6 rpg
G James cooper (6' SR): 19.4 ppg 2.5 rpg
G Brandon Johnson (6'2" JR): 11.4 ppg 3.8 rpg 3.4 apg 1.8 steals

Washington U.
F Troy Ruths (6'6" SR): 19.2 ppg 6.8 rpg
F Tyler Nading (6'7" JR): 15 ppg 5.9 rpg
F Cameron Smith (6'5" SO): 5.9 ppg 4.8 rpg
G Aaron Thompson (6'3" SO): 10.6 ppg 3.1 rpg 3.8 apg
G Ross Kelley (6'1" SO): 3.7 ppg 2 rpg
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2008, 12:19:32 PM
The NCAC All-Conference team (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mballncac.html) has been announced.  Congratulations to the following award-winners:
Player of the Year: James Cooper, Wooster (his second POY)
Coach of the Year: Matt Croci, Kenyon
Newcomer of the Year: Kodey Haddox, Kenyon

First team:
James Cooper, Wooster
Gregg Hill, Wittenberg
Jesse Jean, Ohio Wesleyan
Brandon Johnson, Wooster
Dustin Rudegeair, Ohio Wesleyan
Bryan Yelvington, Kenyon
Andrew Zimmer, Wabash

Second team:
Brandan Babarino, senior, Wittenberg
Devin Fulk, senior, Wooster
Tristian Gregory, junior, Earlham
Kyle Holliday, junior, Ohio Wesleyan
Michael Loll, junior, Oberlin
Mike McDevitt, senior, Hiram
George Raftis, sophomore, Allegheny
Gary Simkus, senior, Wabash
Evan Will, senior, Wooster

Honorable Mention:
Bill Babe, senior, Allegheny
Marty Bidwell, junior, Wooster
Aaron Brock, sophomore, Wabash
Dave Knapke, sophomore, Kenyon
Mike Staley, sophomore, Hiram
Pat Sullivan, junior, Denison

Congratulations to these outstanding gentlemen!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 05, 2008, 12:24:37 PM
I'm a bit surprised on how DeWitt wasn't coach of the year instead of Croci. Croci did a fine job, but OWU won the tourney.

Yes, I know their path was helped by upsets, but still, who wanted to play the Bishops this year anyway?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 05, 2008, 12:26:52 PM
Did voting take place after the tournament?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2008, 12:35:40 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 05, 2008, 12:24:37 PM
I'm a bit surprised on how DeWitt wasn't coach of the year instead of Croci. Croci did a fine job, but OWU won the tourney.

Yes, I know their path was helped by upsets, but still, who wanted to play the Bishops this year anyway?

I think the difference was that DeWitt's team met expectations (2nd place), while Croci's exceeded theirs (4th).  I of course would have been happy with either choice.  FWIW, two of the three ballots in our poster's all-NCAC team were also for Croci.

Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 05, 2008, 12:26:52 PM
Did voting take place after the tournament?

Voting began the Monday before the tournament began; I don't know what the deadline was.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 05, 2008, 01:51:39 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 05, 2008, 12:24:37 PM
...who wanted to play the Bishops this year anyway?

I imagine Wooster wanted to play them one more time!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCAC_alum55 on March 05, 2008, 05:08:24 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 05, 2008, 12:24:37 PM
I'm a bit surprised on how DeWitt wasn't coach of the year instead of Croci. Croci did a fine job, but OWU won the tourney.


Congrats to Coach Croci at Kenyon. He has done a remarkable job and has the Lords' future looking bright- just ask Wittenberg 8)

Coach DeWitt has done a great job building the program at OWU, but I agree with David- in this case, it's more about exceeding expectations. The Bishops did have higher expectations- what a double-edged sword. But one that I'm sure Coach DeWitt is ok with!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2008, 05:40:33 PM
Quote from: NCAC_alum55 on March 05, 2008, 05:08:24 PM
Coach DeWitt has done a great job building the program at OWU, but I agree with David- in this case, it's more about exceeding expectations. The Bishops did have higher expectations- what a double-edged sword. But one that I'm sure Coach DeWitt is ok with!

Plus, it's not like Mike's been overlooked by his peers--he was the 2006 NCAC Coach of the Year (PDF link (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mballncac06.pdf)).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 05, 2008, 05:56:44 PM
Just brought it up. From what I heard, the balloting was open until Monday, I think.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pbrooks3 on March 05, 2008, 10:27:21 PM
How do the pundits of the NCAC see the match-up shaping up at Centre Friday between your Battling Bishops and the Student Princes of Heidelberg?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Marty Peretz on March 06, 2008, 12:56:44 AM
Interesting story line: Thompson grew up around the Wooster program, attended camps there for years, etc. Apparenty very nearly played there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2008, 02:26:47 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 05, 2008, 12:19:32 PM
The NCAC All-Conference team (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mballncac.html) has been announced.  Congratulations to the following award-winners:
Player of the Year: James Cooper, Wooster (his second POY)
Coach of the Year: Matt Croci, Kenyon
Newcomer of the Year: Kodey Haddox, Kenyon

First team:
James Cooper, Wooster
Gregg Hill, Wittenberg
Jesse Jean, Ohio Wesleyan
Brandon Johnson, Wooster
Dustin Rudegeair, Ohio Wesleyan
Bryan Yelvington, Kenyon
Andrew Zimmer, Wabash

Second team:
Brandan Babarino, senior, Wittenberg
Devin Fulk, senior, Wooster
Tristian Gregory, junior, Earlham
Kyle Holliday, junior, Ohio Wesleyan
Michael Loll, junior, Oberlin
Mike McDevitt, senior, Hiram
George Raftis, sophomore, Allegheny
Gary Simkus, senior, Wabash
Evan Will, senior, Wooster

Honorable Mention:
Bill Babe, senior, Allegheny
Marty Bidwell, junior, Wooster
Aaron Brock, sophomore, Wabash
Dave Knapke, sophomore, Kenyon
Mike Staley, sophomore, Hiram
Pat Sullivan, junior, Denison

Congratulations to these outstanding gentlemen!  :)

There's twenty-two players on the All-NCAC team? Add in the Newcomer of the Year, and that makes twenty-three. That's almost half of the league's fifty starters! Did the other twenty-seven each get one of those everyone's-a-winner participation ribbons? ::)

Your league is certainly entitled to dole out awards as it sees fit, of course, but IMHO that's much too big of an all-conference team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 06, 2008, 09:05:33 AM
Quote from: Marty Peretz on March 06, 2008, 12:56:44 AM
Interesting story line: Thompson grew up around the Wooster program, attended camps there for years, etc. Apparenty very nearly played there.

Yes, this point got discussed some at the Final Four last year.

Aaron Thompson played his high school ball in Elida, Ohio.  Over the years, Wooster has had several good players come out of Elida and play for the Scots.

Two of the best were Matt Smith who graduated from Wooster in 2002-2003 and Rodney Mitchell who graduated from Wooster in 2003-2004.  Mitchell also served as one of the assistant coaches for Wooster after his graduation.  Both Matt Smith and Rodney Mitchell were terrific players (and great three point shooters) who made the NCAC all conference teams during their careers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 06, 2008, 09:32:29 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2008, 02:26:47 AM

There's twenty-two players on the All-NCAC team? Add in the Newcomer of the Year, and that makes twenty-three. That's almost half of the league's fifty starters! Did the other twenty-seven each get one of those everyone's-a-winner participation ribbons? ::)

Your league is certainly entitled to dole out awards as it sees fit, of course, but IMHO that's much too big of an all-conference team.

Well, the all conference team is just the first team. The second team is first runners up and then the HM are Mr. Congeniality!

Gregory, the way the NCAC picks the players of the week would make your head asplode, though!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 06, 2008, 10:10:22 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 05, 2008, 12:19:32 PM
The NCAC All-Conference team (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mballncac.html) has been announced.  Congratulations to the following award-winners:
Player of the Year: James Cooper, Wooster (his second POY)
Coach of the Year: Matt Croci, Kenyon
Newcomer of the Year: Kodey Haddox, Kenyon

First team:
James Cooper, Wooster
Gregg Hill, Wittenberg
Jesse Jean, Ohio Wesleyan
Brandon Johnson, Wooster
Dustin Rudegeair, Ohio Wesleyan
Bryan Yelvington, Kenyon
Andrew Zimmer, Wabash

Second team:
Brandan Babarino, senior, Wittenberg
Devin Fulk, senior, Wooster
Tristian Gregory, junior, Earlham
Kyle Holliday, junior, Ohio Wesleyan
Michael Loll, junior, Oberlin
Mike McDevitt, senior, Hiram
George Raftis, sophomore, Allegheny
Gary Simkus, senior, Wabash
Evan Will, senior, Wooster

Honorable Mention:
Bill Babe, senior, Allegheny
Marty Bidwell, junior, Wooster
Aaron Brock, sophomore, Wabash
Dave Knapke, sophomore, Kenyon
Mike Staley, sophomore, Hiram
Pat Sullivan, junior, Denison

Congratulations to these outstanding gentlemen!  :)
Congrats to all those recognized.

I did pretty darn good on my prognostications.  I had 6 of the 7 on the 1st team.  My only discrepency was I had Jean on the 2nd team and Mike Loll on the 1st team. 

I missed on NOY as well.  Kodey Haddox is definately derserving of the award.  I just thought that Bryan Wickliffe had a better claim to the award.  He started 23 of 26 games for the conference champs.  He also led the entire league in fg percentage.  I guess if this vote is anything like the player of the week awards, this really comes as no surprise... ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 06, 2008, 10:22:35 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2008, 02:26:47 AM

There's twenty-two players on the All-NCAC team? Add in the Newcomer of the Year, and that makes twenty-three. That's almost half of the league's fifty starters! Did the other twenty-seven each get one of those everyone's-a-winner participation ribbons? ::)

Your league is certainly entitled to dole out awards as it sees fit, of course, but IMHO that's much too big of an all-conference team.
We had a whopping one more than the OAC... :o

Maybe it's just an Ohio thing... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 06, 2008, 10:58:55 AM
Weather update:
There's a big snowstorm headed for Ohio tomorrow.  Cincinnati, Columbus, and Dayton are all predicted to pick up 3-6" of snow tomorrow during the day.  The forecast for central Kentucky (Lexington/Danville) is "accumulations possible," so it might be tough to get to Centre but not too bad once you get there.  For travelers to Rock Island, it looks like the snow will be limited to an area east of a diagonal from, say, Indianapolis to Toledo, with the weather being dry but very very cold west to Rock Is.  So if you're planning to drive tomorrow, it might be messy for the first half of the drive.

As for myself, I had planned to go to tonight's game at Capital and head west tomorrow, but I'm scrapping that and heading west today to get ahead of the weather. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 06, 2008, 11:00:01 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2008, 02:26:47 AM
Your league is certainly entitled to dole out awards as it sees fit, of course, [...]

Okay, thanks.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedGrad on March 06, 2008, 12:55:55 PM
Good luck to the NCAC!! 
Tough road ahead but Wooster is due to light it up.  Wash U has the advantage of playing on that floor before the Scots.  Should be a good game.

OWU is going to have it just as tough.  They are certainly capable of pulling it off.

My COY vote still goes to DeWitt.  Beating Witt twice got my vote.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 07, 2008, 01:15:29 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 06, 2008, 11:00:01 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 06, 2008, 02:26:47 AM
Your league is certainly entitled to dole out awards as it sees fit, of course, [...]

Okay, thanks.  ::)

Pardon for my offense, honorable sir!

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi.ehow.com%2Fimages%2FGlobalPhoto%2FArticles%2F2128081%2Fhomebow1-main_Thumb.jpg&hash=feb619ee44f6584030449652da82eedbf86dfc9c)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lammersk on March 07, 2008, 07:25:04 AM
Anyone planning to travel to Danville (Centre College) for the games: I just watched a couple of Lexington channels' weather predictions and it's not good.

The last weatherman pointed to an area which included Danville and said 6-10", "the worst snowfall in a decade."  By noon today they are predicting heavy snow and 32 degrees, with temperatures dropping.  They also reported that roads are not being pre-treated because it's going to rain first and this would just wash it away.

Personally, I'd like to see as many people as possible in Danville (school pride and all) but I thought it fair to warn everybody that Kentucky's not used to this type of weather and the people aren't used to driving in it.  Expect chaos and closed roads.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2008, 06:28:25 PM
OWU 35
Heidelberg 24

3:00 left first half.

OWU is shooting well from outside.  Rudegair has several 3 pointers already.  Heidelberg sounds like they are taking a number of poor shots.

Dave McHugh on the call for d3hoops- see the links on the homepage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2008, 06:36:54 PM
At the half:

OWU  44
Heidelberg  30

Largest lead of the game for OWU is the 14-point lead at the half.

OWU put together a great half.  The Bishops are shooting well, though I don't have stats.  Heidelberg sounds like they aren't taking great shots, but mostly sounds like Ohio Wesleyan is outplaying the OAC champs at this point.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2008, 06:50:27 PM
Pre-game report from the radio broadcast:

Steve Moore says that Brandon Johnson will start, and that he practiced yesterday with the team.  He thinks Johnson will be effective, but he's not 100%.

Sounds like they are expecting to have to score more from the half-court set, as he doesn't expect Brandon to have the explosive speed to outrun people tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2008, 06:52:14 PM
OWU scores the first 5 points and extends the lead to 49-30 early in the second half.

Dustin Rudegair is 5-7 from 3 point land.  Impressive.

May not have many updates from the this game going forward, as the Scots are about to start.

64-51 OWU leads with 5:30 to go second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2008, 07:13:12 PM
Moderately disastrous start for Wooster:

Wash U. 18
Wooster  8

13:18 left in the first half.  Wash. U. is shooting well while Wooster spent most of the first 4 minutes turning the ball over.  Check that: Wooster continues to turn the ball over.  7 turnovers in the first 9 minutes.

23-15 Wash U with 8 minutes left after Johnson runs the floor and puts in a layup.  Wooster's looking a bit better here in the last five minutes.  Now they get a stop and Will drains the 3.  23-18 and Wash U calls a timeout.

Another stop for Wooster...Bidwell drives and makes it and gets fouled.  He makes the FT.  23-21, 6:30 left.

25-21 now.  Bidwell to shoot a 1-1.  He misses.  Cooper hasn't scored for Wooster yet, Ruths has 12 for Wash U.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 07, 2008, 07:31:01 PM
At the Half:  Wash Univ.  34  Wooster 27

Wooster is being led by Marty Bidwell with 6 points and Evan Will with 6 points.

Wash U. is being led by Troy Ruths with 17 points and Danny O'Boyle with 6 points.  Wooster has had no answer defensively for Ruths.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2008, 07:33:21 PM
OWU   83
Heidelberg  62
Final

Impressive win for Ohio Wesleyan tonight, and a good win for the NCAC!  OWU remains unbeaten in NCAA play.   ;D

OWU simply outplays Heidelberg tonight, in a game most probably expected to go the other way, or at least be much closer.  OWU kept the margin in double-digits throughout the second half.

I also assume that OWU becomes the first NCAC team not named Wooster or Wittenberg to win an NCAA game in awhile--anyone know the last non-Woo/Witt NCAC team to win one?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 07, 2008, 08:09:24 PM
6:18 Left:  Wash U. 59  Wooster 56
James Cooper with 17 points in the 2nd Half, Troy Ruths now with 26 points

5:20 Left:  Wash U. 60  Wooster 58  Fulk basket

4:00 Left:  Wash U. 64  Wooster 58  2 Baskets by the Bears

3:12 Left:  Wash U. 64  Wooster 60  Fulk again, Wooster timeout

2:45 Left:  Wash U. 66  Wooster 60  Ruths again, now has 30 points

1:53 Left:  Wash U. 69  Wooster 60  Thompson 3 pointer for Bears

1:42 Left:  Wash U. 69  Wooster 62  Cooper hits, now has 19 points.  Woo Timeout

1:35 Left:  Wash U. 69  Wooster 64  Turnover, Cooper hits again

1:18 Left:  Wash U. 71  Wooster 64  Nading hits 2 FT's, Wooster misses shot

0:45 Left:  Wash U. 73  Wooster 64  Nading hits 2 FT's

0:26 Left:  Wash U. 73  Wooster 69  Woo bucket, Turnover, Fulk hits 3 pointer, TO

0:24 Left  Wash U. 74  Wooster 69,  critical Wooster turnover, foul by Woo

0:22 Left  Wash U. 76  Wooster 69,  Nading hits 2 FT's

0:13 Left  Wash U. 76  Wooster 71,  Cooper hits, now with 23 points

0:07 Left  Wash U. 77  Wooster 74,  Will hits 3 pointer

Final:  Washington Univ. 79  Wooster 74

Wooster was led by James Cooper with 23 points, Devin Fulk with 18 points and Brandon Johnson with 10 points.

Wash University was led by Troy Ruths with 30 points, Aaron Thompson with 16 points and Tyler Nading with 15 points.

Congratulations to the Washington Bears and good luck in the rest of the Tourney!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2008, 08:34:42 PM
Congratulations to the Scots for another great season.  Valiant effort tonight against a very tough, very good team.

Great second half performance for Cooper and Fulk- the seniors really stepped up when necessary.  Will had a good all-around game in his final career game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 07, 2008, 08:38:26 PM
Congratulations to Wooster seniors James Cooper, Evan Will and Devin Fulk on terrific careers as Scots!

James Cooper finishes his Wooster career with 2,037 points (#2 all time) and 241 three pointers made (#1 all time).

Devin Fulk finishes with well over 1,000 points, 91% Free Throw shooter and 49% Shooting on 3 pointers.

Congrats to Coach Moore and the entire Wooster team (23-5) on another great season including another NCAC regular season title. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on March 07, 2008, 08:42:26 PM
Congrats and best of luck to the seniors Coop, Fulk and Will and hopefully the underclassmen will realize how tough it is to get to Salem and work that much harder to make a return trip next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Hoops MacPherson on March 07, 2008, 09:48:09 PM
Wooster certainly had a good season, winning a lot of games, finishing first in a league that hasn't been very competitive or deep the last few years, but losing at home in NCAC semis, then dropping a first-round NCAA game can't be considered a great season-- I'm guessing the Scots themselves would agree with that.

My question is this: Wooster wasn't deep this year, and they lose a lot of their contributors. Who do you people think is going to step up next year and have a real shot at prying the regular season title away from the Scots?

Seems to me, the more competitive this league gets, the better chance the eventual winner will have of getting to Salem, and then winning there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2008, 10:59:48 PM
Quote from: Hoops MacPherson on March 07, 2008, 09:48:09 PM
Seems to me, the more competitive this league gets, the better chance the eventual winner will have of getting to Salem, and then winning there.

Hmm.  I'm not sure about this.  If "being more competitive" means "Wooster is less talented," yes, it will make for a more interesting and competitive league.  But if that occurs at an overall lower level of talent than Wooster/Wittenberg have had during their previous Salem runs, then I doubt it will help future NCAC reps in the tourney.

A talented team plus 1-2 great players is what makes a Salem run possible.  Wooster in 2003: Bryan Nelson.  Wittenberg in 2006: Dan Russ and Dane Borchers (sp?). Wooster in 2007: Tom Port and James Cooper.  Those were great players on top of talented teams that dramatically out-classed the NCAC, but they needed every ounce of that talent and All-American ability to reach Salem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2008, 11:48:05 PM
Congratulations to Mike DeWitt and OWU on their making-a-statement big victory tonight in snowy Danville.  Back during the first half of the Hiram game a week ago Weds., I called Dustin Rudegeair "soft as a kitten."  Since then, in seven halves of basketball, he's gone off for 84 points and 28 boards, including 32 and 11 tonight in OWU's first NCAA game in 20 years.  I swear I'll never understand why anyone gives any weight to anything I say in here.   ::) ;D

Next up: Centre, and I think the Bishops can get it done.

Wooster played pretty well for about 3/4 of the game, James Cooper especially, but Wash U. is just too good a basketball team to surrender an early lead.  It's a shame that this had to be a first-round game, but whaddayagonnado?  Congrats to Wash U. and good luck the rest of the way.  And congratulations to the Scots on another great season, and especially to James Cooper, Devin Fulk, and Evan Will, for three great careers in the Black and Old Gold.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pbrooks3 on March 08, 2008, 12:50:31 AM
David, didn't know if you'd seen Old Student/Athlete's post on the SCAC board - this game tomorrow night is sort of a homecoming for Coach Dewitt.  Prior to Greg Mason taking the reins at Centre, Dewitt coached the Colonels for 3 years.  This is a big rematch of the SCAC - NCAC from the Wooster-Centre game in the 2nd round last season.  Agreed OWU played a tremendous game tonight and they will present some major challenges for the Colonels, particularly with Jean and Rudegeair scoring and rebounding well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2008, 11:11:59 AM
Quote from: pbrooks3 on March 08, 2008, 12:50:31 AM
David, didn't know if you'd seen Old Student/Athlete's post on the SCAC board - this game tomorrow night is sort of a homecoming for Coach Dewitt.  Prior to Greg Mason taking the reins at Centre, Dewitt coached the Colonels for 3 years.  This is a big rematch of the SCAC - NCAC from the Wooster-Centre game in the 2nd round last season.  Agreed OWU played a tremendous game tonight and they will present some major challenges for the Colonels, particularly with Jean and Rudegeair scoring and rebounding well.

I hadn't, but I was aware of Mike DeWitt's Centre connection (http://bishops.owu.edu/dewitt.html).  The fact that Greg Mason was his assistant during his time in Danville I think adds to the intrigue of the matchup, in the sense that each coach is a little bit inside the other's head (although nine years is a long time.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on March 08, 2008, 11:59:13 AM
QuoteSeems to me, the more competitive this league gets, the better chance the eventual winner will have of getting to Salem, and then winning there
Altho I agree with this, it also takes a good deal of good fortunes and avoidance, if Johnson doesn't sprain his ankle we might be talking about Woo moving on...that being said injuries are part of the game and the teams that win championships find ways to rise above the adversity...my point being a competitive leage/schedule definitely prepares you for a championship run but so do the basketball gods!!! Good luck to the Bishops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 08, 2008, 08:17:30 PM
OWU leads 38-35 at the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pbrooks3 on March 08, 2008, 08:40:29 PM
Great win for OWU.  Congratulations to Centre on finishing another wonderful season at 26-3.  They were defeated tonight by an outstanding Ohio Wesleyan squad with tremendous senior leadership.  Not the easiest way for seniors from Centre, Britt and Nestheide, to go out.  In a way it was fitting to finish on the home court though.  My hat's off to the Mike Dewitt, Ohio Wesleyan and NCAC on a very solid performance.  Best of luck to the Battling Bishops as they move on in the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on March 08, 2008, 08:59:42 PM
Final score is OWU 82-65, eerily similar to their opening round win (83-62).

Congrats to the Bishops, and continue to do the NCAC proud!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pbrooks3 on March 08, 2008, 10:14:50 PM
I put this on the SCAC board earlier.  Congratulations Ohio Wesleyan on advancing after a good win tonight at Centre.

Centre went up against a top-notch team from the NCAC in Ohio Wesleyan tonight.  This is a reminder of the physical and mental strength of the Wooster team Centre faced last year in the 2nd round of the NCAA III tournament.  The Colonels got off to a nice start with a 10-0 run.  The Battling Bishops didn't quit
and were able to break into the lead late in the 1st half.  Centre held tough and played hard to keep the game close until about the 10 minute mark of the 2nd half. OWU then made a nice run to build the lead to double digits.  Centre had one last run, but couldn't sustain it with 5 minutes to go.  Ohio Wesleyan
then played like a champ building the lead to the final margin of 82-65. 

Centre had a wonderful season, and played successfully using their superior strength - smart, solid guard play.  Good balanced teams like Ohio Wesleyan are able to offset Centre's strength by exposing the team's weakness - inferior post play.  There are many teams throughout the NCAC and other conferences that are comprised of teams similar to Ohio Wesleyan that play a physical inside/outside style of basketball.  The Bishops scored their share of points in the paint tonight with Jessee Jean and Dustin Rudegeair backing down their opponents but they were also hitting big threes all night - Kyle Holliday hit 2 big ones late in the game, and Brian Cafarella simply hit anything he put up.  What I am saying is the Bishops' style of basketball is indicative of the best of D3 basketball throughout the land.  Coach Greg Mason has done a fabulous job working a different system to get amazing results.  The SCAC is a conference that has few teams like those of the NCAC or OAC. Centre did not play many teams of Ohio Wesleyan's caliber this season.  This probably also explains the fact OWU has 7 losses while marching on, and Centre has 3 in bowing out of the D3 tourney.  I now have an appreciation for strength of schedule that was easy to ignore when watching the Colonels go on a 25-game winning streak.  I am not saying Centre had a weak schedule, but rather a weaker schedule than teams in the NCAC or some of the other power conferences across D3.  I also have not given credit where credit is due to good defense - OWU played it tonight.  Wooster played it last year against Centre as well.  The defensive side frequently is overlooked when you're generating 80+ points on the offensive end and I'm guilty of not recognizing this.

With all of this said, I am very proud of the Centre team's accomplishments in a record-setting season that produced a 26-3 record.  Seniors Thomas Britt and Matt Nestheide, you provided a lot of exciting moments for an old-timer.  Through the course of the past 4 seasons, I have grown to become a D3 fanatic thanks to the Centre Colonels and their coach, Greg Mason. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2008, 10:54:47 PM
Thanks for the kind words, pbrooks3.   :)

So now the Bishops move into a sectional with Hope, Wheaton, and a west coast team (Oxy or Whitworth).  Normally you might expect such a confab to be at Hope, but there's a complication.  In even-numbered years, when both teams at a school are in a position to host a sectional, priority is given to the women.  The Hope women's team (also ranked #1, but evidently not #1 in the GL at the time the tourney began) will be in a sectional with DeSales, Howard Payne, and a west coast team (UPS or George Fox).  None of these teams is within 500 miles of any of the others, so the presumptive host will be whichever the women's committee thinks is best-qualified.  That may well be Howard Payne, in which case the OWU group will likely be at Hope.  But if Hope is tabbed to host the women's sectional, and keeping in mind that the west coast team is out of the running as a host (3 flights--forget it), would the tourney end up in Delaware or in Wheaton?

It's great to even be able to contemplate the possibilities of a sectional at OWU.  Go Bishops!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 08, 2008, 11:18:03 PM
IF Hope can't host, the decision may be interesting in terms of how finely the NCAA watches the dollars.  I'd guess that air fare West Coast to Ohare, then a 10-15 mile bus trip to Wheaton would be cheaper than air fare to Columbus, then a somewhat longer bus trip to OWU (and bussing OWU and Hope to Wheaton would be less than bussing Wheaton and Hope to OWU); on the other hand, lodging might be cheaper at OWU.  And then there is seeding: while Wheaton was probably the #17 (i.e., last) pool C, OWU would not even have been in the running for a C.

While I think the Hope women deserve to host, maybe they won't and all this speculation will be moot as the men play in Holland.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 09, 2008, 12:28:54 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 08, 2008, 11:18:03 PM
IF Hope can't host, the decision may be interesting in terms of how finely the NCAA watches the dollars.  I'd guess that air fare West Coast to Ohare, then a 10-15 mile bus trip to Wheaton would be cheaper than air fare to Columbus, then a somewhat longer bus trip to OWU (and bussing OWU and Hope to Wheaton would be less than bussing Wheaton and Hope to OWU); on the other hand, lodging might be cheaper at OWU.  And then there is seeding: while Wheaton was probably the #17 (i.e., last) pool C, OWU would not even have been in the running for a C.

While I think the Hope women deserve to host, maybe they won't and all this speculation will be moot as the men play in Holland.

O'Hare to Wheaton:  36 minutes, 25 miles
Port Columbus to Delaware: 34 minutes, 29 miles
Ford Int'l to Holland: 36 minutes, 33 miles
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 09, 2008, 01:46:57 AM
Those airport to campus distances are closer than I would have thought.  And checking airline quotes, Spokane to Chicago is only about $25 cheaper (per person!) than to Columbus - who knows on charters?  For the men, Holland is obvious; for the women, it is less clear but I suspect 'Horrid Pain' (thanks, Ralph!) will win out and this will all be moot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2008, 03:11:04 AM
For the record... I have been told that OWU will NOT be able to host this weekend... Hope or Wheaton... suspect Hope, because the women's teams was about a #2 of #3 in the NCAA's mind in the region.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on March 09, 2008, 12:43:13 PM
for the people coming up to holland this weekend the double tree motel in holland is pretty nice right on 31  and waverly street with swimming pool inside
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HopeConvert on March 09, 2008, 12:47:31 PM
Or, on campus, the Haworth Inn:

http://www.haworthinn.com/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: aueagle on March 09, 2008, 04:21:09 PM
Listened to the game last night and had a buddy call me and say, "Could this be 1988 all over again?" It is way to early for that comparison...but, way to go Bishops! Keep it rolling...Keep Battling!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: monsoon on March 09, 2008, 08:31:10 PM
I just started a "Hope Sectional" page in the Great Lakes Region.  Let's try to move most of the OWU - Hope - Wheaton - Whitworth talk to that common location.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 10, 2008, 05:28:47 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2008, 07:33:21 PMI also assume that OWU becomes the first NCAC team not named Wooster or Wittenberg to win an NCAA game in awhile--anyone know the last non-Woo/Witt NCAC team to win one?

Allegheny beat Bald Wally, 97-88, in the opening round of the 1998 tourney. That was the last time before this weekend that an NCAC team not named Wittenberg or Wooster won a game in the big dance.

Wabash won a first-round game over Aurora in that same tournament, but that was the year before Wabash joined the NCAC.

Quote from: aueagle on March 09, 2008, 04:21:09 PM
Listened to the game last night and had a buddy call me and say, "Could this be 1988 all over again?" It is way to early for that comparison...but, way to go Bishops! Keep it rolling...Keep Battling!!

I didn't see anyone in an OWU uni who looked even remotely like Scott Tedder or Lee Rowlinson when I saw the Bishops play this season, although I acknowledge that I saw them in November ... and November was a very long time ago in basketball terms. Nevertheless, all you can ask for at this point is to still have a shot at the Big Doorstop. OWU may not have any All-Americans this time around, a la Tedder and Rowlinson, but there are a lot of teams that have All-Americans that won't be suiting up in the Sweet Sixteen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on March 11, 2008, 07:04:43 PM
Congrats to this fine Bishops basketball team.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2008, 01:48:56 PM
You may have already done this, but in case you haven't, I encourage you all to register to win the Salem prize package.

http://www.d3hoops.com/salemgiveaway/

• Hotel accommodations for Thursday, Friday and Saturday in one of the Roanoke Valley's fine hotels, convenient to Roanoke Regional Airport and Valley View Mall, the largest shopping destination in Southwest Virginia.

• Two tickets to the Friday and Saturday sessions at the Salem Civic Center.

• Two tickets to the Thursday evening team banquet, including talks by all four coaches, a player from each team, the introduction of the starting lineup and the ever-popular highlight video.

• Two VIP hospitality passes, giving you sideline access before the game and access to the hospitality room.

• $400 toward your travel cost to get you to and around the Roanoke Valley.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 14, 2008, 09:52:26 AM
From warm and sunny Texas, I want to send my best wishes for continued tournament success to Mike DeWitt and the OWU Battling Bishops.  Winning at Hope in a sold-out arena will be a tough challenge, but there's no reason to think that they aren't up to it.  Play well and hopefully I'll see you in Salem!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: aueagle on March 14, 2008, 05:17:18 PM
If you haven't.......go to the the Hope College Athletic page....great shot of the DeVos Arena...A D1 setting...awesome... I did some reading on Hope basketball and their history....great history & fans....Good Luck to the Bishops....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 14, 2008, 08:44:01 PM
At the half:

OWU 31
Hope 36

Ohio Wesleyan was down as much as twelve in this first half and hasn't had the lead since it was 2-0, but the Bishops made a late run to cut the lead down to 5.  OWU is definitely still in striking range here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: aueagle on March 14, 2008, 09:26:47 PM
57-54....5 min left...Hope up...Bishops in foul trouble....yikes...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: aueagle on March 14, 2008, 09:49:58 PM
71-63...Hope wins. Congrats to the Flying Dutchman...a class act from the MIAA.
Bishops had a great run but the first half, poor shooting from the foul line, not scoring for 2 min late in the game and fouls were too much to overcome. The OWU Sr's were great all year. Was that 3,000 plus at DeVos Fieldhouse? GO BISHOPS
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pbrooks3 on March 14, 2008, 10:43:03 PM
Congrats to Coach DeWitt and his Battling Bishops on an excellent post-season run.  Sounds like the good shooting touch they enjoyed in Danville last weekend didn't fully carry over to Holland tonight. OWU is a class representative of the NCAC. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scottiedawg on March 14, 2008, 10:48:21 PM
Quote from: aueagle on March 14, 2008, 09:49:58 PM
Was that 3,000 plus at DeVos Fieldhouse?

It was 3500+.  It's a special atmosphere, and I'm thankful to be a part of it.  By the way, how surprising is it to Bishops fans that Dustin Redegeair only scored two points. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 15, 2008, 12:05:54 AM
Well, it was a great run, but all good things must perish.  I guess this is one of those rare years when we'll have to endure a Final Four with no NCAC representation.  Congratulations to Ohio Wesleyan on a stirring end-of-season run, and especially to the six seniors--Brian Cafarella, Jesse Jean, Elliot Kaple, Ryan Rozak, Dustin Rudegeair, and Casey Teeters--who can be very proud of what they have accomplished as Bishops. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 15, 2008, 02:35:40 AM
Have to give a nice hand to Ohio Wesleyan tonight, they played tough and represented the NCAC very well.  Ultimately Hope was just a touch better on the defensive end, in a physical battle on both ends of the floor.

Congrats to the 6 Sr's David mentioned, they went down fighting in a pretty tough environment.  The NCAC has much to be proud about.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hope1 on March 15, 2008, 08:56:31 AM
you have a nice team to bad we could have played during the regular seasson 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 15, 2008, 04:32:46 PM
I'll take this point to jump out of hibernation (storing up posts for football season :) ) and congratulate OWU for their fantastic run.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopdreams on March 15, 2008, 04:40:26 PM
I was very impressed with OWU  last night. Classy, played hard, played clean. Curious how their conference matches up top to bottom with the MIAA?  As nice as it is to have some "breather" games now an then, I would much rather watch Hope play the OWU's, Albions, Elmhurst, etc.... all the time.  It's simply better basketball all the way around, and ultimately what makes everyone better.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 16, 2008, 12:41:27 AM
Personally, I would probably put the NCAC above the MIAA if measuring the conference from top to bottom - just my humble opinion!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 16, 2008, 02:40:58 AM
Quote from: Dave "d-mac" McHugh on March 16, 2008, 12:41:27 AM
Personally, I would probably put the NCAC above the MIAA if measuring the conference from top to bottom - just my humble opinion!

Massey ratings

MIAA #25
NCAC #31
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NW Hope Fan on March 16, 2008, 11:19:22 PM
Quote from: sac on March 16, 2008, 02:40:58 AM
Quote from: Dave "d-mac" McHugh on March 16, 2008, 12:41:27 AM
Personally, I would probably put the NCAC above the MIAA if measuring the conference from top to bottom - just my humble opinion!

Massey ratings

MIAA #25
NCAC #31

Oooo, SAC and real numbers! Don't ya just hate that? Although we all know Massey has some flaws.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 16, 2008, 11:26:07 PM
Quote from: NW Hope Fan on March 16, 2008, 11:19:22 PM
Quote from: sac on March 16, 2008, 02:40:58 AM
Quote from: Dave "d-mac" McHugh on March 16, 2008, 12:41:27 AM
Personally, I would probably put the NCAC above the MIAA if measuring the conference from top to bottom - just my humble opinion!

Massey ratings

MIAA #25
NCAC #31

Oooo, SAC and real numbers! Don't ya just hate that? Although we all know Massey has some flaws.

But, alas, even #25 is well down in the bottom half of d3.  Both conferences are obviously excellent at the very top, but with sub-par middles and horrid bottoms.

Woo and Hope can't do much more for the conferences; it's gonna take the Oberlins and Almas to boost them up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NW Hope Fan on March 16, 2008, 11:32:00 PM
Tri-State is coming along, and I think the new coach at Olivet will improve that program as well... And if K would just get Smokin' Joe to re-up, we might have some good competition south of Holland. Alma??? if they could keep the recruits they get, they may have a good team someday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 17, 2008, 12:07:54 AM
There isn't much difference between the MIAA and NCAC, in fact the difference in the Massey ratings is probably the 3 extra teams the NCAC has to carry at or near the bottom of the conference.

The top teams are all very comparable and typically play pretty close games.

If you play the comparative scores game between Hope, Albion, Wooster and Ohio Wesleyan you won't see a whole lot of separation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 19, 2008, 04:41:07 PM
The NCAC showed up nicely in the All-Great Lakes Region team (http://www.d3hoops.com/all-region/08/glakemen.htm), as selected by regional SIDs.  The NCAC produced three-fifths of the first team, including the regional Player of the Year, as well as the region's Rookie of the Year. 

Player of the Year: James Cooper, Wooster
Coach of the Year: Glenn Van Wieren, Hope
Rookie of the Year: Kodey Haddox, Kenyon

First team
Pos.    Player    School    Yr.    Hometown
G    James Cooper    Wooster    Sr.    Springfield, Ohio
G    Brody Jackson    Bethany    Sr.    Akron, Ohio
F    Dustin Rudegeair    Ohio Wesleyan    Sr.    Yellow Springs, Ohio
F    Marcus Vanderheide    Hope    Sr.    Grandville, Mich.
C    Andrew Zimmer    Wabash    Sr.    Hobart, Ind.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: aueagle on March 21, 2008, 01:56:28 PM
DELAWARE, OHIO -- Ohio Wesleyan University senior Dustin Rudegeair (Yellow Springs) and head coach Mike DeWitt were named to the All-Great Lakes District men's basketball team by the National Association of Basketball Coaches, it was announced by the NABC.

DeWitt was named Great Lakes Region Coach of the Year, while Rudegeair was a first-team all-region selection.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: aueagle on March 21, 2008, 02:28:51 PM
D. Collinge is right about the Bishops seniors...A Big Thanks for an outstanding season & 4 yrs on the hardcourt. Dustin Rudegeair will be missed....almost 16 pts/game and 7 boards....DeWitt was "The Man"...it starts at the top. Not bad for a 2nd place NCAC ballclub........GO BISHOPS
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 21, 2008, 09:55:16 PM
Quote from: aueagle on March 21, 2008, 01:56:28 PM
DELAWARE, OHIO -- Ohio Wesleyan University senior Dustin Rudegeair (Yellow Springs) and head coach Mike DeWitt were named to the All-Great Lakes District men's basketball team by the National Association of Basketball Coaches, it was announced by the NABC.

DeWitt was named Great Lakes Region Coach of the Year, while Rudegeair was a first-team all-region selection.

I'll add my congratulations to Coach DeWitt and Dustin, and also to Wooster's James Cooper, also named to the all-region first team (PDF) (http://nabc.cstv.com/auto_pdf/p_hotos/s_chools/nabc/genrel/auto_pdf/All-DistrictD32008).  Further congratulations to Cooper, who was selected to the NABC's All-America team (2nd team)(PDF) (http://nabc.cstv.com/auto_pdf/p_hotos/s_chools/nabc/genrel/auto_pdf/D3StateFarm08).  To my naked eye, it looks like the 1st team was merely the 8 regional Players of the Year, and the GL POY was Hope's Marcus Vanderheide.  The second and third teams also appear to be one per region, so I guess you could say that Cooper was the GL POY runner-up. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 21, 2008, 11:50:24 PM
At least the Scots can take solace in the fact that they lost to a team that advanced to play for the national championship.  WashU beat Hope tonight in the Final Four 89-74.  The Bears will face Amherst in a battle of, impressively enough, the D3hoops.com preseason #1 vs #2.  So after all of these games throughout the entire season, I guess the guys voting for these polls really do know what they're doing. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 22, 2008, 05:36:50 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 21, 2008, 09:55:16 PMTo my naked eye, it looks like the 1st team was merely the 8 regional Players of the Year, and the GL POY was Hope's Marcus Vanderheide.  The second and third teams also appear to be one per region, so I guess you could say that Cooper was the GL POY runner-up. 

That's how the NABC does it every year -- the eight regional POYs constitute the eight-man All-American first team, and the eight regions are each apportioned one player each on the second and third teams as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 24, 2008, 05:41:12 PM
Just wanted to take this time to point out that former Wabash hoops player Josh Kendrick coached Brownsburg High School to the Indiana 4A boy's hoops title this weekend. Way to go, Josh. Some Little Giant!

Hayward's last-second shot wins it for the Bulldogs (http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080323/SPORTS0203/803230375/1057/SPORTS02)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on April 03, 2008, 10:17:19 PM
Congratulations to Wooster Coach Steve Moore who has been selected to receive a national "Guardian of the Game" award for education by the National Association of Basketball Coaches (NABC). :)  Coach Moore will receive the award at the NABC national convention this weekend in San Antonio.

Here is a link to a full story on Wooster's website:
http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2007-08/moore_nabc.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on May 03, 2008, 11:05:56 PM
Its been one month with no new posts on the NCAC board. Got to get it going with something. How about this question - In a best of 7 series, which Wooster final four team would win? Put some matchup thoughts in to make it interesting. I'll post mine soon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on May 09, 2008, 10:43:57 AM
Quote from: goscots on May 03, 2008, 11:05:56 PM
How about this question - In a best of 7 series, which Wooster final four team would win? Put some matchup thoughts in to make it interesting. I'll post mine soon.
Are we talking with a healthy Bryan Nelson?  Either way, I think I'd take the '02-'03 team in five or six.  Nelson was a difference maker and if he would have been healthy, I really believe Wooster would have won it all that year.  Nelson wasn't close to 100% and yet it took an inadvertant shot clock buzzer going off for Williams to get over on the Scots and go on to win the National title. 

It would definately be a contrast in styles.  The '02-'03 team was much bigger and stronger and looked at scoring a lot in the paint with a deliberate half court set.  Meanwhile, the '06-'07 team was much more up-tempo and chucked a lot of treys.  The thing that puts the '02-'03 over the top is that they had some pretty good guards that could shoot the three as well in Matt Smith, Rodney Mitchell, Kyle Witucky and Ryan Snyder.  And Blake Mealer could drain them as well.  I just like the combination of having a good inside and outside game which the '02-'03 team had.

So, as I said, '02-'03 in five.  Six at the most.  8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on May 14, 2008, 09:03:46 PM
My approach would be to compare  by position.

Witucky vs. Johnson -  the floor general and superior ball handler versus athleticism and speed. Even
Mitchell vs. Cooper - defense versus offense. Rodney would have made Cooper really work for an open shot but i think Coop still get most of his point. Advantage '07
Smith vs. Van Horn - Both were three point specialist. Smith looked to score more often, Van Horn usually drew the best player. Advantage '03
Mealer vs. Port - Mealer played better low post defense but overall this is Advantage '07
Nelson vs. (Vandervaart or Will), I'll use Vandervaart because he was he season starter until his injur. Clearly Nelson's style of play would give Vandervaart trouble and he would have needed double team help. On the other side of the court Vandervaarts quickness would have given Nelson trouble. Vandervaart was a better rebounder but Nelson a better FT shooter. Advantage '03

Bench (Will, Fulk, Bidwell) vs. (Schlingman, Snyder, Lilienthal) - Fulk tips the balance to '07

So by this accounting I think the '07 team was a deeper team. The key point is which team could consistently force their style of play. You know that the '03 would go to Nelson virtually every time down the court and the double team would come. Could the resulting '03 open man make the '07 team pay? '03 could shoot but I think the '07 team had more offensive weapons.

'07 in 7
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on May 15, 2008, 09:28:35 AM
You make valid points goscots, but I think the tipping point in favor of the '03 team was how well they defended.  They held opponents to just 40% from the floor and only 30% from beyond the arc.   There weren't many times that the '07 team struggled against to find their points, but when they did, it was usually against a team that was very good at defending the perimeter. 

Wooster struggled to score in both Wittenberg games that year.  Even though they split the series, Witt was able to dictate the pace of both games.  And in the loss in the national semi-finals, against a good defensive team in Amherst, Wooster was again not able to dictate their pace in only scoring 60 points.

I feel you would see much of the same vs. the '03 team as the '07 team would have a hard time getting the tempo they liked.

I know it's cliche, but as the saying goes, 'Defense wins championships' and the '03 Scots were a pretty good defensive team which adds to why I picked them. 

Too bad no one else has an opinion to share... 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on June 05, 2008, 02:55:20 AM
Tommy Cawood  F  East Lansing HS, East Lansing Michigan will attend Denison University.

Sorry can't find his height anywhere, but I think he's in the 6-4/6-5 range.  He's listed as a F/C on the teams website.  Tommy was a Class A honorable mention, and was part of East Lansing cinderalla run to the Class A semi-finals in Michigan before losing to eventual champ Saginaw.


Tommy turned down D1 offers to Valparaiso and University of Detroit.............for Tennis.

"He also earned a Class A all-area honorable mention this past basketball season, and picked Denison, a Division III school, because it offered him the opportunity to continue playing that sport as well."~ Lansing State Journal
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 06, 2008, 10:58:42 PM
Wittenberg has posted next season's schedule: http://www5.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule08-09.html

The Tigers have nonconference home games vs. Transylvania, Ohio Northern, Taylor (IN) and either Mount St. Joseph or Wheaton (IL) in the 2nd game of Witt's Charles B. Zimmerman Holiday Classic.

Wittenberg's nonconference road games include Capital, Cedarville and Otterbein.  The Tigers are also playing in a tournament on 11/28 and 11/29 in Tacoma, Washington where they will face Concordia (OR) and the host team Pacific Lutheran.

Witt visits Wooster on Saturday, January 17th and Wooster plays in Springfield on Saturday, February 14th.

Wooster has not posted their schedule for next season yet but several games are now apparent from opponents' 2008-2009 schedules that have been posted.

Wooster has invited Washington & Jefferson to their season opening tourney though the actual matchups and 2 other invited teams are not apparent on the W&J schedule.  Wooster will play at Carnegie Mellon University on 11/25.

Wooster will also make a trip to Indiana on 11/29 and 11/30 to play in a tourney at Hanover College.  Wooster will face a strong WIAC team in UW Platteville in the first game and either the host team Hanover or IU-Southeast in the second game.

It will be interesting to see if Wooster plays both Walsh and Cedarville again this year as well as the other teams that get invited to the Al Van Wie and Mose Hole tournaments.  Can anyone else fill in the rest of Wooster's nonconference schedule for next season?  :)


 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on June 08, 2008, 09:42:34 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on June 06, 2008, 10:58:42 PMCan anyone else fill in the rest of Wooster's nonconference schedule for next season?  :)

The only game that I know of is at Univ of Hawaii - Hilo sometime around the week before Christmas.  Nice litte roadtrip!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 10, 2008, 09:25:25 PM
imderekpoe - thanks for the insight on the Hawaii trip...and I see that you have switched usernames again.  :)

So by my count, that would make 8 non-conference games (2 - Al Van Wie, 2 - Hanover tourney, 2 - Mose Hole, at Carnegie Mellon and at Hawaii-Hilo.)  That would leave only 1 more non-conference game because Wooster normally plays 16 NCAC games and 9 non-conference matchups for a total of 25 regular season games.

I suppose Wooster could play a second game in Hawaii if that is set up as a tourney or they could play either Walsh or Cedarville (not both) for the 9th non-conference game.  Well, this off season mystery should be solved in the next few weeks (months?) when some more schedules get posted.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on June 10, 2008, 10:08:08 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on June 10, 2008, 09:25:25 PM
imderekpoe - thanks for the insight on the Hawaii trip...and I see that you have switched usernames again.  :)

So by my count, that would make 8 non-conference games (2 - Al Van Wie, 2 - Hanover tourney, 2 - Mose Hole, at Carnegie Mellon and at Hawaii-Hilo.)  That would leave only 1 more non-conference game because Wooster normally plays 16 NCAC games and 9 non-conference matchups for a total of 25 regular season games.

I suppose Wooster could play a second game in Hawaii if that is set up as a tourney or they could play either Walsh or Cedarville (not both) for the 9th non-conference game.  Well, this off season mystery should be solved in the next few weeks (months?) when some more schedules get posted.  ;D

I'm told that the Hilo game is a single game, not a tournament.  So I wouldn't be surprised if they play either Walsh or Cedarville as the 9th non-conference game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on June 11, 2008, 01:15:49 AM
I'd be surprised if that ninth Wooster game was something other than another Hawaii-based contest. I've never heard of a D3 team going all the way to the Aloha State to only play one game.

There are three other D2 schools besides Hawaii-Hilo in our fiftieth state (BYU-Hawaii, Hawaii Pacific, and Chaminade). Back in 1991-92 North Park played UHH, BYUH, and HPU on a Hawaii road trip, plus Hawaii Loa (which merged with Hawaii Pacific following that school year), and it's commonplace for D3 teams to schedule at least two of the Hawaii-based D2 schools when they visit the islands. And it's also not unheard-of for D3 schools that are located in various parts of the country to play each other in Hawaii; in fact, Whitworth (which is located in Spokane, WA) used to host a tournament in Hawaii until it was discontinued a couple of years ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on June 14, 2008, 08:05:37 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on June 06, 2008, 10:58:42 PM
Wooster plays in Springfield on Saturday, February 14th.

I'm sure the spirits of love, harmony, and brotherhood will be present on this Valentine's Day matchup...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on June 24, 2008, 02:04:22 PM
Heard through the rumor mill that Steve Moore landed a 7 footer from somewhere in Africa.  Anyone heard such?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Vanilla24COW on July 02, 2008, 10:05:14 PM
I can't confirm that he is a true 7 footer but I have heard he is very close
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on July 03, 2008, 09:16:56 PM
Good to hear that Wooster may have landed a big man - will be interesting to learn some more details about him when they are available. :)

Another team's 2008-2009 schedule has revealed the participants in this year's Mose Hole Classic.  Kean University from New Jersey (NJAC) will join Mt. Union and Thiel as the 3 visiting teams in the Mose Hole.  No first round matchups are posted yet on the Kean website.  This seems like an average field to me so Wooster's toughest tourney this year will probably be the Hanover tournament where they face UW-Platteville in the first round.

UW-Platteville returns virtually their entire team which finished 2nd in the strong WIAC last year with a 19-7 overall record.  UW-P's best player is 6'10" center Jeff Skemp who was First Team WIAC and Third Team All American last season.  So, let's hope that Wooster's new big man can step right in and at least help 6'8" Robert Melick with some defensive minutes versus Skemp in late November.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 06, 2008, 11:53:06 PM
Wooster Scots are heading to Italy this month! :)

Coach Moore and the Scots are making a trip to Italy this month to play 3-4 games(?) against Italian club teams.  I don't know all the details so perhaps another poster can provide specifics.  The 2008 graduating seniors are invited and I heard through the grapevine that Evan Will plans to make the trip but Devin Fulk and James Cooper will not participate.  Cooper has another basketball commitment that starts August 15th.

James Cooper has recently received a professional contract to play for Dortmund, a team in Germany in the Third Division league.  ;D Here is the link to the full story on the Wooster website:  http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2007-08/cooper_germany.php    Congratulations to Cooper on receiving this offer and good luck in Germany!  Same release also notes that Tom Port plans to play another year in Europe as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 07, 2008, 12:28:49 AM
With some significant internet sleuthing, here is my best info on Wooster's incoming freshman class:

Gideon Mabeny ~7'0" Fork Union Military Academy in VA
He is Sudanese and only started playing basketball about 4 years ago.  Honors student at Fork Union.
Some Fork Union game recaps describe his rebounds (7 in one game) so he is probably a defender/rebounder type.

Justin Hallowell 6'7" Thomas Worthington HS in Columbus
Ohio Capital Conference First Team, All Central District Division I Honorable Mention, was listed on a Top 100 Ohio players list and received some interest from D2 schools

Greg Ross 6'5" Archbishop McNicholas HS in Cincinnati
14.5 ppg, 8.2 rpg last season.  Greater Catholic League First Team, Greater Cincy Division II Player of Year

Michael Evans 6'4" Pickerington North HS in Columbus area
16 ppg, 6.4 rpg last season.  Ohio Capital Conference Second Team, GPA of 3.6 and National Honor Society

Scott Voiers 6'3" Lutheran West HS in Cleveland area.
23.0 ppg, Leading scorer on team, All-Ohio Division III Third Team

Ibrahim Ibrahim 6'1" Licking Heights HS in Newark, OH area
17.8 ppg last season, All Central District Division II Third Team

Matthew Fegan 6'1" Strongsville HS in Cleveland area
~14 ppg, #2 scorer on team.  All Northeast Lake District Division I Honorable Mention

Blake Sword 6'1" Wellington HS near Oberlin (Yeomen didn't get him :))
13.4 ppg last year, All Northeast Lake District Division III Third Team

This looks like a very nice incoming class for the Scots!  Justin Hallowell and Scott Voiers are probably the two best recruits but it is great to have a big man in Gideon Mabeny and several other players look like they could compete for playing time as well.

Did I miss any other Woo recruits?  Comments and corrections will be appreciated. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on August 07, 2008, 11:34:13 AM
Thanks for that info wsf.  It does indeed look like Wooster has another good class coming in.  I wonder if any of these incoming frosh will have a chance to make an immediate impact. 

Even at 7', it looks as though Mabeney could be a serious work in progress with only 4 years of playing competitive basketball.  I'm wondering how much development this kid will need before he is ready to contribute at the college level.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on August 08, 2008, 11:34:01 AM
An Earlham note...

The Quakers will play at D-1 Evansville in an exhibition game on Nov. 8.

That's guard Tristian Gregory's hometown...and his brother, Trevor, is a walk-on for the Purple Aces.

I acknowledge that at one point in my life Evansville was my favorite college basketball team. The best player in the history of our small, rural high school was a four-year letterwinner there about starting about eight years ago. I also loved the purple t-shirts that they used to wear.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 09, 2008, 09:40:25 PM
I recently received a hard copy of Wooster's schedule :) ...so here it is:

2008-2009 Wooster Men's Basketball Schedule
DATE      OPPONENT
Nov 21   Al Van Wie Tourney at Wooster with
Nov 22   Randolph-Macon, Messiah and Washington & Jefferson

Nov 25   at Carnegie Mellon University

Nov 29   at Hanover Tournament (IN) with
Nov 30   Wisconsin-Platteville, IU-Southeast and Hanover

Dec 3     Oberlin
Dec 6     Ohio Wesleyan
Dec 13   Albion
Dec 19   at Univ. of Hawaii-Hilo

Dec 29   Mose Hole Classic at Wooster with
Dec 30   Mount Union, Thiel and Kean University

Jan 7     at Kenyon
Jan 10   at Wabash
Jan 14   Hiram
Jan 17   Wittenberg
Jan 21   at Denison
Jan 24   at Earlham
Jan 28   Allegheny
Jan 31   at Ohio Wesleyan

Feb 4     at Hiram
Feb 7     Wabash
Feb 11   Denison
Feb 14   at Wittenberg
Feb 18   at Allegheny
Feb 21   Earlham

Feb 24   North Coast Athletic Conference Tournament Quarterfinals

 
Well, the mystery is solved on the non-conference games with Hawaii-Hilo and Albion College (no Walsh or Cedarville this year) filling out the schedule.  Al Van Wie Tourney has 3 out of state teams with Randolph-Macon looking like the most challenging opponent.  They only graduated one senior starter from a team that went 20-6 last season and lost in their conference final.

Hanover Tournament still looks the toughest with 3 quality teams that weekend.  Mose Hole Classic field looks average at best with Mount Union, Thiel and Kean University.

On the NCAC games, Wooster will face Oberlin and Kenyon only once each just like last year.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on August 10, 2008, 12:29:43 AM
I can still hardly believe that Wooster would travel all the way to Hawaii to play one game.  Is it definite that there isn't a second opponent?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on August 10, 2008, 12:33:05 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on August 10, 2008, 12:29:43 AM
I can still hardly believe that Wooster would travel all the way to Hawaii to play one game.  Is it definite that there isn't a second opponent?

Seems odd to me as well, but the schedule posted has (the maximum) 25 games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 11, 2008, 12:30:57 PM
Hanover College has a very excellent facility.  It's quite beautiful and a great place to watch a basketball game, rivalling Kenyon's Tomsich Arena.  I encourage Wooster fans to consider the trip for what looks to be a good tournament.

Two more schedules:
Ohio Wesleyan (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html):
Nov. 21-22: at Pfund Classic (UW-Eau Claire, Staten Island, host Wheaton IL)
Nov. 29: hosting Marietta as part of new "OWU/Kenyon Classic" (Kenyon plays Albion)
Nov. 30: Day 2 of "OWU/Kenyon Classic" at Kenyon (OWU plays Albion)
Dec. 3: at Capital
Dec. 6: at Wooster
Dec. 10: Kenyon
Dec. 18: Defiance
Dec. 29-30: at Bill Sudeck Tournament (Manchester, MCLA, host CWRU)
Jan. 7: at Denison
Jan. 10: Hiram
Jan. 14: Wabash
Jan. 17: at Earlham
Jan. 21: at Wittenberg
Jan. 24: at Allegheny
Jan. 28: Oberlin
Jan. 31: Wooster
Feb. 4: at Wabash
Feb. 7: at Hiram
Feb. 11: Wittenberg
Feb. 14: Earlham
Feb. 18: at Oberlin
Feb. 21: Allegheny

Kenyon (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26038.xml):
Nov. 15-16: at Midway Classic (Illinois Tech, Edgewood, host Chicago; KC opens with IIT)
Nov. 19: at Capital
Nov. 25: at Washington & Jefferson
Nov. 29: vs. Albion (at OWU, OWU/Kenyon Classic)
Nov. 30: Marietta (OWU/Kenyon Classic)
Dec. 6: at Wabash
Dec. 10: at OWU
Dec. 13: at Mt. Vernon Nazarene (evidently this men/women doubleheader is all that is left of the old "Food for the Hungry Holiday Tournament")
Dec. 20: Kalamazoo
Jan. 3: CWRU
Jan. 7: Wooster
Jan. 10: at Earlham
Jan. 14: Denison
Jan. 17: Allegheny
Jan. 21: at Oberlin
Jan. 24: Wittenberg
Jan. 28: at Hiram
Jan. 31: Wabash
Feb. 4: at Denison
Feb. 7: Earlham
Feb. 11: Oberlin
Feb. 14: at Allegheny
Feb. 18: Hiram
Feb. 21: at Wittenberg
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hoopscoach on August 11, 2008, 05:17:29 PM
Allegheny Schedule:

Rutgers-Newark Tip-Off Tournament   
Sat.   Nov. 15   vs Fredonia St.   5:30 p.m.
Sun.   Nov. 16   Consolation / Championship Games   2:00 / 4:00 p.m.
           
Sat.   Nov. 22   at Youngstown St.   TBA
           
       NATIONAL CITY TOURNAMENT   
Sat.   Nov. 29   Ithaca vs Baldwin-Wallace   6:00 p.m.
Sat.   Nov. 29   HILBERT   8:00 p.m.
Sun.   Nov. 30   Consolation Game   1:00 p.m.
Sun.   Nov. 30   Championship Game   3:00 p.m.
           
Wed.   Dec. 3   at Gannon   7:30 p.m.
Sat.   Dec. 6   at Denison *   3:00 p.m.
Tues.Dec. 9   THIEL   7:30 p.m.
Thurs.Dec. 11   at Penn St. New Kensington   7:00 p.m.
Fri   Jan. 2   EARLHAM *   8:00 p.m.
Sat.   Jan. 3   WABASH *   1:00 p.m.
Wed.   Jan.7   PENN ST. BEHREND   6:00 p.m.
Sat.   Jan. 10   at Wittenberg *   3:00 p.m.
Wed.   Jan. 14   OBERLIN *   8:00 p.m.
Sat.   Jan.17   at Kenyon *   3:00 p.m.
Wed.   Jan. 21   HIRAM *   7:30 p.m.
Sat.   Jan. 24   OHIO WESLEYAN *   3:00 p.m.
Wed.   Jan. 28   at Wooster *   7:30 p.m.
Sat.   Jan. 31   DENISON *   2:00 p.m.
Tues.Feb. 3   at Oberlin *   7:30 p.m.
Sat.   Feb. 7   WITTENBERG * (Alumni Game)   3:00 p.m.
Wed.   Feb. 11   at Hiram*   7:30 p.m.
Sat.   Feb. 14   KENYON *   1:00 p.m.
Wed.   Feb. 18   WOOSTER *   7:30 p.m.
Sat.    Feb. 21   at Ohio Wesleyan *   3:00 p.m.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jscwittfan on August 11, 2008, 11:17:30 PM
Witt's schedule can be found here:

http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule08-09.html (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule08-09.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on August 12, 2008, 12:28:26 AM
wooscotsfan,

Good list, but I think there are a couple more to add:

Drew Sawyor - Kettering Fairmont
Justin Warnes - Toledo Bowsher
Terrence Williams - Alliance
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on August 12, 2008, 02:50:12 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on August 12, 2008, 12:28:26 AM
wooscotsfan,

Good list, but I think there are a couple more to add:

Drew Sawyor - Kettering Fairmont
Justin Warnes - Toledo Bowsher
Terrence Williams - Alliance
With the addition of these 3, this has the makings of being a really good class for the Scots.  Williams really looks like a stud that could contribute right away!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 12, 2008, 10:08:19 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on August 12, 2008, 12:28:26 AM
wooscotsfan,

Good list, but I think there are a couple more to add:

Drew Sawyor - Kettering Fairmont
Justin Warnes - Toledo Bowsher
Terrence Williams - Alliance

Seinfeld - k+ for you as I suspected that I had missed a couple! :)

Terrence Williams 6'3" wing  Alliance HS, near Canton
22.6 ppg, ~9 rpg, ~3 apg, ~3 steals/g    All-Ohio Division II Second Team

Drew Sawyer 6'5"  Kettering Fairmont HS, Dayton area
13.9 ppg, 6.9 rpg,  Greater Western OH Conference 2nd Team, SW District Division I Honorable Mention

Justin Warnes 6'2" guard  Toledo Bowsher (Toledo City League)
Leading scorer for a weak team, was also a starter as a junior

Scotsfan is right - Terrence Williams as another All-Ohio selection looks like a great recruit.  Newspaper articles also describe Drew Sawyer as very athletic and he did register 28 points and 17 boards in one game this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 12, 2008, 10:21:30 PM
Dear Ol' Wabash:

Nov 21 Little Giant Tipoff Tournament
(DePauw, Franklin, Wilmington)
Nov 22    Little Giant Tipoff Tournament
(DePauw, Franklin, Wilmington)
Nov 25    Hanover College    07:30 PM    
Dec 02    at DePauw    07:30 PM    
Dec 06    Kenyon *    03:00 PM    
Dec 12    Pete Thorn Tournament
(Marian, St. Joseph's - Calumet, IU-SE)
Dec 13    Pete Thorn Tournament
(Marian, St. Joseph's - Calumet, IU-SE)
Dec 20    at Rose-Hulman    07:30 PM    
Dec 30    at Franklin    07:30 PM    
Jan 02    at Hiram *    08:00 PM    
Jan 03    at Allegheny *    01:00 PM    
Jan 10    Wooster *    02:00 PM    
Jan 14    at Ohio Wesleyan *    07:30 PM    
Jan 17    Oberlin *    01:00 PM    
Jan 21    Earlham *    07:30 PM    
Jan 24    Denison *    07:30 PM    
Jan 28    at Wittenberg *    07:30 PM    
Jan 31    at Kenyon *    03:00 PM    
Feb 04    Ohio Wesleyan *    07:30 PM    
Feb 07    at Wooster *    02:00 PM    
Feb 11    at Earlham *    07:30 PM    
Feb 14    at Oberlin *    01:00 PM    
Feb 18    Wittenberg *    07:30 PM    
Feb 21    at Denison *    03:00 PM    
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on August 13, 2008, 01:24:49 AM
Quote from: smedindy on August 12, 2008, 10:21:30 PMDec 12    Pete Thorn Tournament
(Marian, St. Joseph's - Calumet, IU-SE)
Dec 13    Pete Thorn Tournament
(Marian, St. Joseph's - Calumet, IU-SE)

Wow. Wabash couldn't find any D3 teams to come to Crawfordsville for that tournament?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 13, 2008, 12:44:02 PM
Hiram (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html)

Nov. 22 UNIVERSITY OF PITTSBURGH-GREENSBURG
Nov. 26 MOUNT UNION
Nov. 29 @ Geneva (Pa.)
Dec. 1 @ Case
Dec. 5 @ Franciscan University
Dec. 10 @ Grove City (Pa.) College
Dec. 13 WITTENBERG
Dec. 18 BLUFFTON
Dec. 28 @ Greensboro (N.C.)
Dec. 29 @ Guilford (N.C.)
Jan. 2 WABASH (Ind.)
Jan. 3 EARLHAM
Jan. 10 @ Ohio Wesleyan University
Jan. 14 @ Wooster
Jan. 17 DENISON 
Jan. 21 @ Allegheny
Jan. 24 @ Oberlin
Jan. 28 KENYON
Jan. 31 @ Wittenberg
Feb. 4 WOOSTER
Feb. 7 OHIO WESLEYAN
Feb. 11 ALLEGHENY
Feb. 14 @ Denison
Feb. 18 @ Kenyon
Feb. 21 OBERLIN
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 13, 2008, 12:49:53 PM
Oberlin (http://www.goyeo.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&schedule=11&tab=basketball) ... Please note: D3 men's game of the year to take place Nov. 26 in Pasadena.  Mark your calendars.

11/15/2008        @Kalamazoo   2 p.m.    
11/18/2008        @Thomas More    7:30 p.m.    
11/21/2008        @Mt. Aloysius   7 p.m.
11/24/2008        Westminster   7:30 p.m.    
11/26/2008        @Cal Tech   6 p.m. PST (9 p.m. EST)    
11/28/2008        @Pomona   8 p.m. PST (11 p.m. EST)    
11/29/2008        @Claremont-McKenna   4 p.m. PST (7 p.m. EST)    
12/3/2008    *   @Wooster    7:30 p.m.    
12/6/2008    *   Earlham   3 p.m.    
12/12/2008        Alma   7:30 p.m.    
1/3/2009    *   Wittenberg   3 p.m.    
1/7/2009        Case Western Reserve   7:30    
1/10/2009    *   @Denison   3 p.m.    
1/14/2009    *   @Allegheny   8 p.m.    
1/17/2009    *   @Wabash   1 p.m.    
1/21/2009    *   Kenyon   7:30 p.m.    
1/24/2009    *   Hiram   3 p.m.    
1/28/2009    *   @Ohio Wesleyan   7:30 p.m.    
1/31/2009    *   @Earlham   3 p.m.    
2/3/2009    *   Allegheny   7:30 p.m.    
2/7/2009    *   Denison   3 p.m.    
2/11/2009    *   @Kenyon   7:30 p.m.    
2/14/2009    *   Wabash   1 p.m.    
2/18/2009    *   Ohio Wesleyan   7:30 p.m.    
2/21/2009    *   @Hiram 3 p.m.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on August 15, 2008, 02:13:40 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on August 13, 2008, 01:24:49 AM
Quote from: smedindy on August 12, 2008, 10:21:30 PMDec 12    Pete Thorn Tournament
(Marian, St. Joseph's - Calumet, IU-SE)
Dec 13    Pete Thorn Tournament
(Marian, St. Joseph's - Calumet, IU-SE)

Wow. Wabash couldn't find any D3 teams to come to Crawfordsville for that tournament?

At least no Canadian schools in this tournament this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shooting Star on August 19, 2008, 05:46:34 PM
I'm new to Ohio.  I'm interested in knowing more about Denison Basketball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 19, 2008, 08:56:20 PM
Quote from: Shooting Star on August 19, 2008, 05:46:34 PM
I'm new to Ohio.  I'm interested in knowing more about Denison Basketball.
The Denison men's program has fallen on hard times in recent years.  They have struggled to get more than one or two all-conference caliber players onto the roster, and then struggled to keep them healthy.  The results can be seen by their recent records (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/index.html).  However, the Big Red are consistently a hard-working, defense-oriented bunch who play the game "the right way," and usually can be counted upon to pull off a shocker somewhere along the line.  They're definitely worth the price of admission.

The real story in Granville is the women's team (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/womens/basketball/index.html), four-time defending NCAC tournament champions and the prohibitive pre-season favorite in the NCAC this season.  This is a team that actually could make some national noise this season, a rarity for NCAC women's hoops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 21, 2008, 11:28:57 AM
Speaking of Denison, the Big Red welcome a new assistant coach this season.  David Muchnick (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/golf/go_muchnick.html), a 2005 SUNY-Geneseo graduate, comes to Granville from Cortland St. where he was an assistant for the past three seasons.  Muchnick will also helm the golf program for DU.  He replaces DU alum and former Wooster assistant Kyle Pottkotter in both capacities; Kyle has moved on to Otterbein College where he will serve as an assistant to the legendary Cardinal coach Dick Reynolds.  I offer my congratulations and best wishes to both of these coaches on their new positions.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 21, 2008, 02:57:13 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on August 13, 2008, 01:24:49 AM
Quote from: smedindy on August 12, 2008, 10:21:30 PMDec 12    Pete Thorn Tournament
(Marian, St. Joseph's - Calumet, IU-SE)
Dec 13    Pete Thorn Tournament
(Marian, St. Joseph's - Calumet, IU-SE)

Wow. Wabash couldn't find any D3 teams to come to Crawfordsville for that tournament?

Sometimes it's not about D3, it's about getting ready for the conference season. And since the tourney is right near finals, it may be tougher to get some schools to come a long way for it.

Marian's always been excellent competition, though last year they went 3-20 after a 4-0 start. (OUCH!) But usually, they're a tough team with a good pedigree.

Calumet College of St. Joseph's was 18-13 last year and 22-8 in 06-07.

IU - SE was 24-9 last year and made the NAIA National tournament. They had no seniors and one junior last season.  Besides, they're the Grenadiers, and that's a cool nickname.

Also cool is that they are coached by Wiley Brown, who some of us remember from his days being a starter with those great Louisville teams with Darrell Griffith and the McCray brothers. (Scooter is an assistant coach) Oh, and the fact he had an artificial thumb. (And he played two years in the NFL, which is also cool.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on August 21, 2008, 10:06:21 PM
Quote from: smedindy on August 21, 2008, 02:57:13 PM
Marian's always been excellent competition, though last year they went 3-20 after a 4-0 start. (OUCH!)

OK, don't be bringin' that weak Indiana math in here.  You may be able to sneak that stuff past your fellow Hoosiers, but here in Ohio we know better.  Well, some of us do. :)  Unless of course Marian had a win reversed after the fact?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on August 22, 2008, 04:30:27 AM
Quote from: smedindy on August 21, 2008, 02:57:13 PMSometimes it's not about D3, it's about getting ready for the conference season. And since the tourney is right near finals, it may be tougher to get some schools to come a long way for it.

Marian's always been excellent competition, though last year they went 3-20 after a 4-0 start. (OUCH!) But usually, they're a tough team with a good pedigree.

Calumet College of St. Joseph's was 18-13 last year and 22-8 in 06-07.

IU - SE was 24-9 last year and made the NAIA National tournament. They had no seniors and one junior last season.

I wasn't casting any aspersions regarding the talent level of those teams. Indeed, it's very possible that this NAIA trio represents a better field for Wabash in strict basketball terms than would any three midwestern D3 teams picked at random from within hailing distance of Crawfordsville. And the "close to finals" rationale is certainly plausible, although it begs the question as to whether or not those NAIA schools would have similar academic concerns.

I was simply remarking about this field because it flies in the face of the ongoing push by D3 to de-NAIAify, to coin a term, the schedules of D3 member schools as much as possible.

Quote from: smedindy on August 21, 2008, 02:57:13 PMBesides, they're the Grenadiers, and that's a cool nickname.

I wonder if IUS players wear big bearskin hats on the court to make themselves look taller.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 22, 2008, 12:02:37 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on August 21, 2008, 10:06:21 PM
Quote from: smedindy on August 21, 2008, 02:57:13 PM
Marian's always been excellent competition, though last year they went 3-20 after a 4-0 start. (OUCH!)

OK, don't be bringin' that weak Indiana math in here.  You may be able to sneak that stuff past your fellow Hoosiers, but here in Ohio we know better.  Well, some of us do. :)  Unless of course Marian had a win reversed after the fact?

I meant they finished 7-20 last year. Started 4-0. Won their last game, too. So they had a 2-20 stretch actually. Ick.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 22, 2008, 12:09:33 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on August 22, 2008, 04:30:27 AM

I wasn't casting any aspersions regarding the talent level of those teams. Indeed, it's very possible that this NAIA trio represents a better field for Wabash in strict basketball terms than would any three midwestern D3 teams picked at random from within hailing distance of Crawfordsville. And the "close to finals" rationale is certainly plausible, although it begs the question as to whether or not those NAIA schools would have similar academic concerns.

I was simply remarking about this field because it flies in the face of the ongoing push by D3 to de-NAIAify, to coin a term, the schedules of D3 member schools as much as possible.


For these three schools, it's a Friday bus ride, one night in a hotel, then home Saturday night. Not that bad.

Yeah, I know they want to de-NAIAfy D-3, but looking at the Indiana landscape - 'Bash already plays Hanover, Franklin, DePauw, Earlham, and Rose-Hulman, leaving Anderson, Trine and Manchester. It's not always easy to entice a MIAA, OAC or CCIW school to C'ville in mid-December.

But it's better than IU-Kokomo!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on August 22, 2008, 01:20:09 PM
I always loved those "K" names.  Kokomo, Kankakee, Keokuk, Kewanee.  Small midwestern towns with rich minor league baseball heritage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on August 22, 2008, 06:18:15 PM
While driving home from work this evening, I was captivated by a story on NPR about a recent college graduate, whose family and socio-economic background was such that becoming a college graduate seemed to be a long shot at best.  As the story continued, I learned that the subject of the feature, named Jesse, had recently graduated from Ohio Wesleyan.  "That's cool!" I thought, and I now continued to listen with increased interest.  Then I learned that he was a basketball player.  I had missed the beginning of the story, but it then dawned on me that it was a feature about Jesse Jean.

Ohio Wesleyan can be very proud of this recent graduate, and fellow NCACers can be proud of Ohio Wesleyan.

I'll try to find a link to the NPR story and post it here.

Here's the link.  This may be old news in part, since NPR previously aired stories about Jesse Jean in 2002 and 2004.

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=93850513
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 26, 2008, 12:14:56 AM
Wooster has posted two items on their website - the first is the report on their trip to Italy where they won 2 of the 4 games played and visited some great sites.  Here is the link:  http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2007-08/italy.php

The second item is the 2008-2009 schedule confirming that there is only one game that will played in Hawaii: http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/schedule.php

Wooster will play Washington & Jefferson in their first round game of the Al Van Wie Tipoff tournament and Thiel is the first round opponent for the Scots in the Mose Hole tournament.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 26, 2008, 05:33:58 PM
One of the teams Wooster faced on this trip also took on Kenyon during the Lords' preseason trip last year.  Kenyon beat Amici del Campetto 73-54, while Wooster dispatched them 85-47.  It's interesting to note that Matt Croci complimented ADC as "the best team we played (in Italy) (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4200.msg741964#msg741964)" whereas Steve Moore described them as "weaker competition than we expected."  I wonder who's on the NCAC portion of ADC's schedule for next season?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on August 27, 2008, 12:15:43 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on August 26, 2008, 05:33:58 PM
One of the teams Wooster faced on this trip also took on Kenyon during the Lords' preseason trip last year.  Kenyon beat Amici del Campetto 73-54, while Wooster dispatched them 85-47.  It's interesting to note that Matt Croci complimented ADC as "the best team we played (in Italy) (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4200.msg741964#msg741964)" whereas Steve Moore described them as "weaker competition than we expected."   I wonder who's on the NCAC portion of ADC's schedule for next season?
I wonder who Kenyon's other opponents were???  Judging by the fact that Wooster lost twice during this trip, it's hard to argue that Coach Moore's description of ADC is more applicable.  Also when considering that one of the teams to defeat the Scots also defeated a DI school just before they defeated Wooster. 

I guess what it ultimately boils down to is different strokes for different folks...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 30, 2008, 11:56:15 PM
Wooster head coach Steve Moore (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/coach.php) will enter the 2008-09 season with 577 victories as a head coach, 490 of them at Wooster. 
> He will very likely reach the 500 victory plateau at Wooster during the season--it could conceivably be as early as at the Mose Hole (with a 10-0 or 10-1 start), which would be nice, or else during conference action in January. 
> With another outstanding season, the overall 600 victory mark is also within reach; if it happens, it would be around tournament time.  If I've counted correctly, there are just four active D3 coaches with 600+ career wins (Glenn Robinson of F&M, Jim Smith of St. John's, Dick Reynolds of Otterbein, and Glenn Van Wieren of Hope) with three more on the verge (Dick Whitmore of Colby [590], David Hixon of Amherst [577], and Moore).  To say the least, this is an elite group, and with a very good but achievable 23+ win season, Steve can join them. 
>> As an aside, everyone on that list has at least 4 more years of head coaching experience than Steve does.  This will be Steve's 28th season as a head coach, as compared to Hixon (32), Van Wieren (32), Reynolds (37), Robinson (38), Whitmore (38), and Smith (45).

Just a couple of things to watch for as the season unfolds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on August 31, 2008, 12:11:37 AM
Advance congratulations to Steve Moore!  It took Dennie Bridges (still the AD at IWU, but retired as hoops coach in 2001) 36 years to reach 667.  Barring retirement or dismal fortune, Coach Moore should blast right through that mark.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 31, 2008, 11:20:00 AM
Aaron Dorksen reports in today's Daily Record (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4322702) that Brandon Johnson will be sidelined when the season begins:
Quote from: Aaron DorksenJohnson, who averaged 11.3 ppg and a team-best 3.8 assists, suffered an ACL tear in his knee and had surgery in early July. The Scots hope they can have him back for the second half of the season.
I need not point out what a huge loss this is; Johnson is a two-time all NCAC performer and would have been a legitimate All-American candidate this season.  Best wishes for Brandon's full and speedy recovery.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 31, 2008, 05:19:19 PM
One more Wooster note:  the Scots have added an exhibition game with Ohio University to their schedule, to be played Nov. 1 in Athens.  This will be the first game of any variety for either squad.  It is listed on both  (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/schedule.php)schedules  (http://ohiobobcats.cstv.com/sports/m-baskbl/sched/ohio-m-baskbl-sched.html)as an "exhibition game" and not as a "scrimmage."  I had thought that exhibition games counted against a team's maximum 25-game schedule, but Wooster still has a full compliment of 25 games scheduled, starting with the Van Wie Classic in late November--the Ohio game would make 26.  So I guess I must be wrong. ??? Nevertheless, anything that brings the season on three weeks earlier is a good thing in my book. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on August 31, 2008, 05:51:28 PM
In 2005-06, when IWU played an exhibition at U of Illinois, we still had a full schedule, so apparently they don't count against the limit.

Perhaps Pat (or someone) could clarify the rule?  Perhaps scrimmage and exhibition are counted the same by the NCAA?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on September 02, 2008, 09:06:19 AM
I wonder; if Brandon Johnson's recovery happens to proceed more slowly than is desired, were he to be held out this season could he possibly be granted another year of eligibility?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on September 02, 2008, 10:51:33 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on August 31, 2008, 05:51:28 PM
In 2005-06, when IWU played an exhibition at U of Illinois, we still had a full schedule, so apparently they don't count against the limit.

Perhaps Pat (or someone) could clarify the rule?  Perhaps scrimmage and exhibition are counted the same by the NCAA?

As of this year, actually, an exhibition game no longer counts against your limit of 25.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on September 02, 2008, 11:53:09 AM
Today's Wooster Daily Record has a nice article on the Scots' incoming 7-footer's journey from tribal live in the Sudan to the Wooster campus.

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4326461 (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4326461)


I wouldn't be too terribly surprised to see Mabeny get some decent minutes as the season progresses.  He doesn't have much basketball experience, but appears to be athletic, smart and eager to learn (plus he's got that 7-foot thing going for him.)  There aren't many better to learn from than Steve Moore and Doug Cline.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on September 02, 2008, 05:46:31 PM
If Mabeny becomes a fan of D3Hoops, maybe he can tell me if my sign-off is an actual African proverb or not. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on September 02, 2008, 08:56:17 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on September 02, 2008, 11:53:09 AM

I wouldn't be too terribly surprised to see Mabeny get some decent minutes as the season progresses.  He doesn't have much basketball experience, but appears to be athletic, smart and eager to learn (plus he's got that 7-foot thing going for him.)  There aren't many better to learn from than Steve Moore and Doug Cline.

They always say, you can't teach height!  ;D 

Hard to believe he is 3 inches taller than the tallest big man Moore has ever recruited.  Stan Aukamp at 6'9" was Moore's tallest player prior to Mabeny's arrival.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 20, 2008, 07:54:20 PM
Coaching carousel:
Congratulations and best wishes to Anthony, Chad, and Scott on their new assignments.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 20, 2008, 08:03:08 PM
I happened to be on Wooster's campus on Wednesday, where I happened to cross paths with someone who couldn't have been anyone other than Gideon Mabeny, the "Dunking Dinka."  And...he was on crutches.  I've since heard through the grapevine that he has suffered an ACL injury and may be out for the season.   :(

Elsewhere:
Denison  (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0809/mb_schedule08a.html)has posted their schedule, the highlight of which is a New Year's Eve visit to the Boston area.  The Big Red open with what appears to be a three-day, three-team tournament with Goshen College and Hanover (in Granville.)  The two teams that Denison will face just once are Wittenberg (12/10 at Springfield) and OWU (1/7 at Granville).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on September 22, 2008, 05:56:17 PM
Oh yes, you know you've been anxiously awaiting it. I present to you, the fine folks at D3Hoops.com, the 2008-09 Earlham men's basketball schedule.

http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports/men/basketball/2008-09/schedule/index.html

Highlights again include the exhibition at beautiful Roberts Stadium against the Evansville Purple Aces.

Also, there's the return of the Quaker Bowl....the always popular showdown between Earlham and Wilmington.

Fight, Fight, Inner Light!
Kill, Quakers, Kill!
Knock 'em Down, Beat 'em Senseless!
Do It 'til We Reach Consensus!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on September 22, 2008, 06:22:19 PM
Second Verse? ;)

Consensus Reached
We Beat 'Em Dead!
Punched Them, Mauled Them
Kicked 'Em In the Head!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on September 22, 2008, 07:08:27 PM
George Fox is spinning in his grave like a rotisserie chicken. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 23, 2008, 10:43:05 PM
One more piece of assistant coaching news: Wooster has a new (part-time) assistant coach in the person of Evan Will.  Will replaces Nate Gaubatz, who has moved to northwest Ohio and is coaching at Anthony Wayne High School.  Congratulations, Evan!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on September 24, 2008, 06:25:39 PM
Well, why not have an 8-team Quaker Classic for D-3?



Earlham College, Richmond, Indiana

George Fox University, Newberg, Oregon

Guilford College, Greensboro, North Carolina

Haverford College, Haverford, Pennsylvania

Swarthmore College, Swarthmore, Pennsylvania

Whittier College, Whittier, California

William Penn University, Oskaloosa, Iowa

Wilmington College, Wilmington, Ohio



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on September 24, 2008, 07:52:42 PM
Quote from: smedindy on September 24, 2008, 06:25:39 PM
Well, why not have an 8-team Quaker Classic for D-3?



Earlham College, Richmond, Indiana

George Fox University, Newberg, Oregon

Guilford College, Greensboro, North Carolina

Haverford College, Haverford, Pennsylvania

Swarthmore College, Swarthmore, Pennsylvania

Whittier College, Whittier, California

William Penn University, Oskaloosa, Iowa

Wilmington College, Wilmington, Ohio





Only if its played in Oskaloosa, Iowa because thats just a damn cool name.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 05, 2008, 09:36:44 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on September 20, 2008, 08:03:08 PM
I happened to be on Wooster's campus on Wednesday, where I happened to cross paths with someone who couldn't have been anyone other than Gideon Mabeny, the "Dunking Dinka."  And...he was on crutches.  I've since heard through the grapevine that he has suffered an ACL injury and may be out for the season.   :(

I can now confirm this story.  It was mentioned in the Daily Record earlier in the week; sorry but I can't find the article for a hyperlink.  Best wishes to Gideon on his recovery.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 17, 2008, 09:53:05 PM
From Eurobasket.com (http://www.eurobasket.com/reports/2008/9/10.asp):
Quote from: Moritz KorffJames Cooper leaves Dortmund
SVD 49 Dortmund (Regionalliga West) have parted with James Cooper (183-G-86, college: Wooster) after only game played in this season. While the former NCAA Division 3-All American is more of a shooter, 49ers' Coach Peter Radegast needed a playmaker who can score as well. Dortmund fell 66:101 to Grevenbroich on the opening day of the 2008-09 season this past weekend. Cooper scored 11 points in this game.
This dates back about a month.  Without a paid membership to Eurobasket.com, searching is difficult, but I don't turn up any evidence that he's caught on with another team who just admires good shooting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shooting Star on October 20, 2008, 07:29:18 PM
What's the recruit situation at Denison and how does Denison look to compete this year?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on October 27, 2008, 08:52:00 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on September 23, 2008, 10:43:05 PM
One more piece of assistant coaching news: Wooster has a new (part-time) assistant coach in the person of Evan Will.  Will replaces Nate Gaubatz, who has moved to northwest Ohio and is coaching at Anthony Wayne High School.  Congratulations, Evan!

The latest news on this is that due to a job-related conflict Evan wasn't able to take the assistant coaching job.  Instead the new man on the bench will be Tom Port.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jpope2 on November 01, 2008, 02:41:30 PM
Anyone know what the status of Brandon Johnson is and why Marty Bidwell was not on the rooster of the OU game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 01, 2008, 03:13:04 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on August 31, 2008, 11:20:00 AM
Aaron Dorksen reports in today's Daily Record (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4322702) that Brandon Johnson will be sidelined when the season begins:
Quote from: Aaron DorksenJohnson, who averaged 11.3 ppg and a team-best 3.8 assists, suffered an ACL tear in his knee and had surgery in early July. The Scots hope they can have him back for the second half of the season.
I need not point out what a huge loss this is; Johnson is a two-time all NCAC performer and would have been a legitimate All-American candidate this season.  Best wishes for Brandon's full and speedy recovery.

As David Collinge posted back in August, Brandon Johnson had ACL surgery in July and the Scots hope that he might play in the second half of the season.  I don't know why Marty Bidwell is not on the roster for the Ohio U. game.

At the Half:   Ohio University 44  Wooster 33

Scots are hanging around despite having 16 turnovers in the first half.

Wooster's starting five was Robert Melick, Bryan Wickliffe, Justin Hallowell, Ian Franks and Dustin Geitgey.

14 guys played for the Scots in the first half and the leading scorers were all freshmen including Drew Sawyer with 6 points (4 boards), Matt Fegan with 5 points and Scott Voiers also with 5 points.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 01, 2008, 04:22:02 PM
Exhibition Final:  Ohio University 79  Wooster 65

Wooster actually cut the lead to just 6 points (51-45) in the 2nd half before the Bobcats went on a 10-0 run to take control of the game.  Scots were led by Ian Franks with 10 points, Matt Fegan with 8 points and Scott Voiers with 7 points.  A total of 16 guys played for Wooster.  Not a bad showing against a Division I team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAS A PLAYER on November 01, 2008, 07:43:04 PM
Not surprised The Scots put 65 on the board against a DI team. Ian Franks is much improved and the newcomers can flat out shoot. Best wishes to Brandon and would like to know some info on Marty. Even with the new faces, I'm sure coach Moore and his staff will have the Scots ready to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 01, 2008, 08:42:29 PM
Just back from Athens.  First game out without Cooper, Will, and Fulk, with Johnson and Bidwell watching from the bench, several other Scots nursing a variety of injuries, and a roster with 11 players who were not at Wooster last season, and playing a D1 team on their home court, and they stay in the game the whole time...I am impressed.  I don't think Ohio ever got to a 20-point lead, and as wsf points out, they were within 6 with the ball midway through the second half.  It was a very satisfactory way to start the season from my point of view.  Both teams were ragged, not surprising when you consider that they're just 8 days or so into practice.  Wooster's offense was pretty rusty; they had very little success trying to go inside against the much bigger and more athletic Bobcats, and their three point attempts (from everyone, from all over the arc), shall we say, could use some work.  They did manage to get a number of open looks from the arc, which is good, but not having stats available, I'd be surprised if they hit one in five of them.  The defense, however, was generally very good, especially from a team still learning each other's names and trying all sorts of rotations.  When they gave up an open jumper or were beaten to the hoop, more often than not it was as a result of the superior strength and quickness of their opponents rather than a breakdown of the defense. 

Fourteen players saw action in the first 38 minutes, and among these were eight frosh and one sophomore transfer.  The only veterans were Melick and Geitgey, both of whom sat for long periods (might have been foul trouble--I wasn't keeping track); Reed, who didn't play much and may be deep in the rotation;  Franks, who took the point in Johnson's absence and handled it pretty well; and Wickliffe, who started slowly but was a force in the second half, the only Scot player who could have switched into an Ohio uniform and not looked out of place.  Of the newcomers, several were solid but all looked like, well, first-week frosh playing a D1 team.  Nathan Balch, a transfer from D1 UM-Kansas City (where he was a walk-on playing in 30 games as a frosh, starting 11 of them (http://www.umkckangaroos.com/fls/18300/stats/200708stats/m-basketball/teamcume.htm)), looked pretty good but was perhaps a little too eager to force the action and/or take the shot.  I was impressed by baby-faced Terrence Williams and Matt Fegan, generally playing the off guard spots, and by Mike Evans playing as a small 4.  Greg Ross had some good moments, mostly on defense, and Scott Voiers found himself with a number of open looks from the arc.  The other frosh who contributed were Justin Hallowell (who started at the 4) and Drew Sawyer.  It's not easy to evaluate a group of frosh playing their first game so early in the season against a D1 team, but I think everyone played pretty well, and there's a lot to build on.

I spoke with Doug Cline before the game, and he rattled off an injury report so lengthy and depressing that I can't remember who has what.  But here's what I do recall:
* Gideon Mabeny, as we know, is out for the season.  He didn't make the trip.
* Brandon Johnson is also still out.  I didn't ask about his condition today, but when I last spoke with the coaches, they were hoping he'd be ready for the Mose Hole Classic.
* Marty Bidwell should be available by the end of next week.  Both Brandon and Marty were on the bench in their warmups.
* Several of the frosh were also dinged up; the only one I recall Doug mentioning was Nathan Balch, and he played substantial minutes today so he must be doing reasonably well.
* No new injuries were sustained today...hooray!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 02, 2008, 07:58:32 AM
Here is Wooster's upcoming scrimmage schedule:

Intra-squad scrimmage on Friday, Nov. 7th, at 7:00 p.m.
Ashland at home on Tuesday, Nov. 11, at 7:00 p.m.
Varsity - Alumni game on Saturday, Nov. 15, at 7:00 p.m.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 02, 2008, 08:07:08 PM
A few more scrimmages:
Kenyon plays at Defiance on Friday 11/7 (I think; it might be 11/14--whichever is "next Friday")
OWU plays at Ohio Northern on Sunday 11/9
OWU hosts Otterbein on Friday 11/14

Kenyon scrimmaged at Baldwin-Wallace last Thursday; I don't have a result or any details, but it has been described to me as "close throughout."  I have heard through the grapevine that neither senior Korey Haddox nor his younger brother Kodey will don the threads for Kenyon this season.  It's strictly a rumor (i.e., I have no first-hand knowledge), but I've now heard this from two independent and reliable sources, so I thought I'd pass it on.  If true, it's a big loss on a number of fronts: scoring (Kodey, the NCAC and GL Region Newcomer of the Year, was the Lords' second-leading scorer at 13.8 ppg last season), leadership (Korey played in every game the past three years, starting 68 of them), and depth.  I wish the Haddox brothers nothing but success in whatever they decide.

Good news, bad news, and no news coming out of Springfield.  The good news is that frosh posts Alex Brandt and Clayton Black, each 6'7", are looking good in camp, and comparisons have been made to an earlier pair of impact frosh posts you might recall, Dane Borchers and Dan Russ.  In all, as many as four freshmen (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Four_Freshmen) may be significant contributors for Witt, which sounds a little like the situation at Wooster.  With Woo and Witt so young, and OWU having graduated six seniors, the rest of the league must be champing at the bit.  The bad news is that guard Kyle Bigler has a torn ACL and will miss his senior season.  That's a shame, and I wish him well.  The "no news" is just that: a rumor I haven't been able to confirm about a possible second injured player.  So I'll just let you ruminate. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 04, 2008, 09:52:35 AM
Wooster has posted their 2008-2009 Season Outlook on their website.

Returning players (6) that are discussed include Brandon Johnson, Marty Bidwell, Bryan Wickliffe, Ian Franks, Dustin Geitgey and Robert Melick.

In the backcourt, the 4 newcomers discussed are Nathan Balch, Matt Fegan, Scott Voiers and Terrence Williams.

In the frontcourt, the 5 freshmen mentioned are Justin Hallowell, Drew Sawyer, Mike Evans, Brian Frank and Greg Ross.

Here is the link to the article: http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/outlook.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 06, 2008, 01:42:59 PM
FYI.  Al Van Wie participant and possible 2nd round opponent Randolph-Macon just upset DI George Mason last night in an exhibition game at GMU.  That is the same George Mason that made that improbable run to the Final 4 in the NCAA Tournament 3 seasons ago and they are also the defending Colonial Atheltic Association champions.  Pretty impressive win for R-MC!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 06, 2008, 05:45:17 PM
ScotsFan - thanks for the info on R-MC's impressive win vs. George Mason.

The NCAC preseason polls were released today and Wooster was selected as the favorite by both the coaches and media.  In the coaches poll, Wooster collected 7 of the 10 first place votes with Wittenberg receiving one first place vote and Wabash collecting two votes.  In the media poll, Wooster collected 20 of 23 first place votes with Witt, Ohio Wesleyan and Wabash each receiving one first place vote.

The top five places were the same in both polls:
1.  Wooster
2.  Wittenberg
3.  Ohio Wesleyan
4.  Wabash
5.  Kenyon

Here is a link to a full story on the two preseason polls:  http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/news/2008-09/mediaday.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 07, 2008, 05:59:25 PM
The Wooster Daily Record (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4461923) previews the season.
So does the Springfield News-Sun (http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/hp/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2008/11/06/sns110708spncacseg.html), which also makes mention of Gregg Hill's continuing problems with his balky shoulder.  Here's hoping that he's able to play, or if not, that he's able to redshirt and come back next season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 09, 2008, 11:39:30 PM
Geeze.  First Randolph-Macon knocks off George Mason, then Wisconsin-Platteville downs Bradley.  Wooster might have to play both of these teams!  R-M is in Wooster's Al Van Wie tournament and will probably meet Wooster in the championship game if the Scots can get by Washington & Jefferson (no lock this year).  Platteville is Wooster's first-round opponent in a tournament at Hanover.  All of these games will be without Brandon Johnson. :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on November 11, 2008, 01:26:31 AM
Folks, this is me from Washington DC logging in for yet another season of the always exciting D3 basketball.  Here's hoping my Fighting Scots delivers yet again.  And good luck to the rest of the folks in our beloved NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 12, 2008, 01:20:49 PM
After leading for most of the game, Wooster finished second to Ashland last evening, by about five points, in a scrimmage.  The Brandon-Johnson-less Scots did some things well, and revealed that there is some hope for this season.  They have some shooters, and for the most part played pretty good D.  Offensively, though, they did very little on the interior, and if that doesn't somehow improve it will be a rough go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 13, 2008, 08:59:07 PM
A few nuggets of interest, gleaned from a quick skim-through of the NCAC basketball media guide:

Allegheny: Don't forget about Ryan Hollihan, who was 2nd team all-NCAC two seasons ago but missed most of last season with a knee injury.  The Gators were a pretty good team by season's end without him, so they should be improved if and when he is ready to go.  (“Ryan is working hard to come back from a devastating knee injury,” Clune said. “We’re going to wait and see with him. We’re hopeful he can come back.”)
Denison:  They have 15 freshmen.  Fifteen.  (Although the online roster (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0809/mb_roster09.html) lists 'only' eleven.)  And ten returning lettermen (although it looks like Jack Twyman and one other are not playing.)  Maybe a JV team in Granville this year?  Also: Denison will have a food drive this fall; admission fees will be waived with a donation of non-perishable food.  Details here. (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0809/mb_fooddrive08.html)  Good on ya, Big Red.
Earlham:  My new favorite NCAC player?  Frosh Kyle Calder, 5-11 guard from (heh, heh) Crawfordsville. ;D
Hiram:  All-NCAC guard Mike Staley has transferred to Adrian.  I'm very sorry to see this; I really enjoyed watching him play, and thought he had a good shot at NCAC Player of the Year this season or next.  With him, Hiram was going to be my sleeper pick; without him, they're in a heap of trouble.
Kenyon:  As rumored, the Haddox brothers are not on the roster (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x4155.xml).   Best wishes to them.
Oberlin:  The only NCAC team with five returning starters; no other team has more than 3 (unless you count Ryan Hollihan at Allegheny.)
Ohio Wesleyan:  The starting five is easy to predict, but who will contribute from the bench is not.  They're scrimmaging Otterbein tomorrow, so I'll get a preliminary answer to that question.
Wabash:  Described in the media guide as "experienced and talented," they have just six lettermen returning; the only team with fewer returning vets is...
Wittenberg:  Five returning lettermen, and one of them (Gregg Hill) may not be able to play.  Also: the names to remember are Clayton Black and Alex Brandt.
Wooster:  Frosh Justin Hallowell looks like he may be a starter from day one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 14, 2008, 08:21:19 PM
Just back from OWU, where the Bishops easily dispatched Otterbein by a total score of 77-57.  The Bishops won both halves, 44-30 in the first and 33-27 in the second.  Otterbein came back to claim the JV period (10 minutes) 14-13.  OWU played a ten-man rotation, which included the seven returning lettermen and two frosh.  The starting five were PG Rob "Don't Call Me Robbie" Gardiner, W Kyle Holliday, W Kyle Miller, P Brent Plieman, and P Pat Pellerite, a 6'6" frosh from Olmstead Falls.  When these five were playing, they were clicking.  They were much quicker than the Cards and seemed to work together very well on both ends.  Gardiner ran an up-tempo attack and, seeing the floor well, always seemed to know where the mismatch would be.  Miller and Holliday, the team's senior leaders, didn't have anything to prove tonight and played capably.  Plieman, who has struggled with injuries throughout his career, seemed healthy if not completely in shape.  He's not going to make anyone forget Jesse Jean anytime soon, but he is an immovable object in the paint for rebounds and stickbacks.  Pellerite played very well in the first half, and looks like he'll turn out to be a more than capable replacement for Dustin Rudegeair and the main scoring threat down low.  The whole team (in fact, both teams) were more ragged in the second half, probably due in part to the three-minute halftime after a high-intensity first half, and in part to the coaches trying different plays, attacks, and combinations. 

OWU played both man and zone on defense, both effectively as the score would indicate.  Otterbein was unable to get the ball inside against the zone, and often had shot clock problems against the man.  (Now, just how good Otterbein will be this year is an open question that should be considered when evaluating OWU's performance.)

The problem for OWU, such as it was, was the steep drop off in performance when the second 5 were in the game.  Whereas the offense was clicking for the starters, the second team was just a hair off--errant passes, driving holes that weren't really there, shots just off the mark, etc.  Each of these players (PG Mike Schwartz, frosh G Tim Brady, W Mitch Noggle, W Dillon McBride, and P Andrew Martin) had their moments, but the overall quality of play was inversely proportional to how many of them were playing at a given moment.  Of course, this is a pretty green group--only Noggle got any significant PT last year--so it's no wonder they're not as efficient as the veterans in the starting five.  Only one other player got in the game before the JV period (Ryan Willis), and then only for the last three minutes of the second half.

OWU opens up next Friday vs. UW-Eau Claire at Wheaton College.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 14, 2008, 10:57:17 PM
Jack Twyman?  Son?  Grandson?  Is he any good?  How come he's not playing? (There.  Broke the record for question marks in consecutive quasi-sentences.  Will D3hoops submit it to Guinness or do I need to do it myself?)  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 15, 2008, 08:30:39 PM
I had to Google "Jack Twyman" to learn that there was an NBA player by that name.  No idea if the Denison student is a relation, nor why he's not on the varsity this year.

The first team out of the gate this season is Allegheny, who dropped a 64-55 decision to Fredonia St. in the opening round of the John K. Adams Tip Off Classic at Rutgers-Newark.  The Gators had a good first half, shooting better than 46% to force a 33-all tie.  They left their shooting touch in the locker room, however, hitting just 8 baskets in the second period.  Better free-throw shooting would have made the game more competitive, as 'Gheny hit just six of 13 attempts (3 for 8 in the 2nd.)  Craig Devinney led all scorers with 19, including 5 of 7 from the new three-point line, and was also the game's top rebounder with 9 (tied with teammate George Raftis).  Ryan Hollihan saw seven minutes of action.  Gheny will face the loser of Medgar Evers and host Rutgers-Newark tomorrow.  Box (http://www.fredonia.edu/athletics/mbasketball/0809stats/jka08g1.htm); recap (such as it is) (http://www.fredonia.edu/athletics/PR_mbsk/11-15-08.asp).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 15, 2008, 11:29:07 PM
Kenyon holds off Illinois Tech in Chicago, 71-59, to record the first NCAC win of the season.  It was all Bryan Yelvington, all the time in his hometown--well, home metro-area.  The senior POTY candidate put up 30 points--24 in the second half--while taking better than 40% of his team's shots and logging 38 minutes.  Bryan hit 11 of 22 from the floor and grabbed a game-high 9 rebounds to boot.  Sophomore J.T. Knight chipped in 16 mostly second-half points.  Overall the Lords shot 42%, hitting 39% of their 18 treys, and shot 20/27 from the line (4 of the missed free throws were in the final 5:05), while holding IIT to 39% from the field, 29% from the arc.  The Scarlet Hawks missed ten free throws, many of them in key second half situations which helped the Lords take control of the game.  Tied at the half 25-25, the Lords built a 17-point lead with 6:18 left, then held on as both Allen Bediako and Dave Knapke fouled out.  Kenyon played basically a seven-man rotation, with a significant contribution from rookie guard Anthony Chun (8 points, 6 assists.)  Kenyon moves on to the championship round of the Midway Classic, where they will face Edgewood, upset winners over host Chicago, 101-93.  Box; (http://athletics.uchicago.edu/mensbasketball/iit-ken.htm) recap. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28206.xml)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2008, 06:39:33 PM
Allegheny 88, Medgar Evers 61 (http://www.allegheny.edu/cgi-bin/mt/mt-view.cgi/5/entry/9078/menbb_entry) behind a double-double (19/12) from George Raftis.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2008, 08:47:20 PM
Kenyon takes home the championship trophy from the University of Chicago's Midway Classic, dropping Edgewood 87-79.  Tournament MVP Bryan Yelvington followed up his 30 point outburst with 32 more, including 17 of 20 from the free throw line.  Dave Knapke pitched in a double-double, with 12 rebounds and 10 points (8 of 8 from the line), and J.T. Knight added 15 points and 6 assists; his 31 combined points landed him a spot on the all-tournament team.  When given a chance to shoot, the Lords hit 42% of their field goal attempts, and recorded 15 assists on 23 field goals.  The game, however, was decided at the free throw line, where Kenyon was 34 for 39 (87%), outscoring the Eagles by 21.  The Lords led for most of the game, although Edgewood parlayed an 11-0 run into a one-point halftime lead.  Kenyon quickly reassumed command in the second, and led the final 17:30 of the game.  Kenyon held their opponents to 39% shooting, one night after the Eagles shot 60% and dropped 101 points on nationally-ranked Chicago.  Kenyon is now off until a week from Tuesday when they travel to Washington & Jefferson.  Box; (http://athletics.uchicago.edu/mensbasketball/ec-kenm.htm) recap. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28210.xml)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on November 17, 2008, 12:53:43 AM
Any word yet on how the scrimmage between the 2009 Fighting Scots and the 2003/2007 Final Four Scots went? I know the alumni had a decent contingent present and I wanted to hear how the new batch looked. Sounds like Kenyon might break up the party of the "W" schools in the top 4 this year...gotta run, Nelly is calling. Late.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 17, 2008, 04:18:29 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 15, 2008, 11:29:07 PM
Kenyon holds off Illinois Tech in Chicago, 71-59, to record the first NCAC win of the season.  It was all Bryan Yelvington, all the time in his hometown--well, home metro-area.  The senior POTY candidate put up 30 points--24 in the second half--while taking better than 40% of his team's shots and logging 38 minutes.  Bryan hit 11 of 22 from the floor and grabbed a game-high 9 rebounds to boot.  Sophomore J.T. Knight chipped in 16 mostly second-half points.  Overall the Lords shot 42%, hitting 39% of their 18 treys, and shot 20/27 from the line (4 of the missed free throws were in the final 5:05), while holding IIT to 39% from the field, 29% from the arc.  The Scarlet Hawks missed ten free throws, many of them in key second half situations which helped the Lords take control of the game.  Tied at the half 25-25, the Lords built a 17-point lead with 6:18 left, then held on as both Allen Bediako and Dave Knapke fouled out.  Kenyon played basically a seven-man rotation, with a significant contribution from rookie guard Anthony Chun (8 points, 6 assists.)  Kenyon moves on to the championship round of the Midway Classic, where they will face Edgewood, upset winners over host Chicago, 101-93.  Box; (http://athletics.uchicago.edu/mensbasketball/iit-ken.htm) recap. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28206.xml)

... and what an ugly game it was to watch. Although it picked up a little in the second half, mostly thanks to Yelvington, the first half was a missed-shot festival. Layups, treys, midrange jumpers, hook shots, free throws, you name it -- IIT and Kenyon missed 'em in all flavors, and leavened the mess with a lot of turnovers as well. And it isn't as though either team was even close to playing the sort of defense that was good enough to explain it all. One has to expect a lot of rust on opening weekend, but that was egregiously bad basketball even by opening-weekend standards.

On the plus side, Kenyon had a great turnout in the Ratner Center, with a lot of enthusiastic students present.

Quote from: David Collinge on November 16, 2008, 08:47:20 PM
Kenyon takes home the championship trophy from the University of Chicago's Midway Classic, dropping Edgewood 87-79.  Tournament MVP Bryan Yelvington followed up his 30 point outburst with 32 more, including 17 of 20 from the free throw line.  Dave Knapke pitched in a double-double, with 12 rebounds and 10 points (8 of 8 from the line), and J.T. Knight added 15 points and 6 assists; his 31 combined points landed him a spot on the all-tournament team.  When given a chance to shoot, the Lords hit 42% of their field goal attempts, and recorded 15 assists on 23 field goals.  The game, however, was decided at the free throw line, where Kenyon was 34 for 39 (87%), outscoring the Eagles by 21.  The Lords led for most of the game, although Edgewood parlayed an 11-0 run into a one-point halftime lead.  Kenyon quickly reassumed command in the second, and led the final 17:30 of the game.  Kenyon held their opponents to 39% shooting, one night after the Eagles shot 60% and dropped 101 points on nationally-ranked Chicago.  Kenyon is now off until a week from Tuesday when they travel to Washington & Jefferson.  Box; (http://athletics.uchicago.edu/mensbasketball/ec-kenm.htm) recap. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28210.xml)

I didn't see the Sunday games, which is why I was initially shocked to discover that Kenyon beat Edgewood. The Lords looked pretty wobbly on Saturday, as I indicated above, while Edgewood looked like world-beaters in upsetting preseason #22 Chicago. However, the Eagles are very, very young -- they feature only one upperclassman in the rotation -- and a young team can very easily look like world-beaters one night, and self-beaters the next.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 17, 2008, 12:04:43 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 14, 2008, 08:21:19 PM
(Now, just how good Otterbein will be this year is an open question that should be considered when evaluating OWU's performance.)
Judging by where Ott landed in the OAC preseason coaches poll (9th out of 10), I'd say the Cards aren't expected to be very good...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 17, 2008, 11:23:15 PM
Happy hoops season, gents.   :)

I'm looking forward to another exciting year of NCAC hoops!  My preliminary feeling on the Little Giants is...well, I don't know.  I'm looking for big things from Aaron Brock this year.  He had stretches where he was just outstanding last year.  Of course he doesn't have Zimmer drawing attention away from him, so it will be a bigger challenge.  I also hope to see that Wes Smith has an improved offensive game to go along with his already stellar defensive skills.

My immediate concern is size size size.  After Brock and Brian Maloney (who i expect will be starting at center this year), there isn't a ton of size.  There are a couple of freshman on the roster who have good size, but they are freshman and time will tell how ready they are to contribute. 

I had been looking forward to bringing some first hand reports from Wabash's opening tournament this weekend, however certain misfortunes on Saturday have led to Wabash's first round football playoff game being played in Cleveland and as such, I'll be reading about those games ex post facto.  I'll get my first look at the LGs next Tuesday when they play host to Hanover. 

Here's to a good season for the NCAC! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: all day quads on November 18, 2008, 03:33:23 PM
Allegheny will surprise everyone this year, as they will finish in the top 3 of the conference.  The Gators have one of the best, if not the best, big man in the league with junior George Raftis.  He's a beast on the boards and also is a very effective scorer in the post.  They also have do it all junior wing player Craig Devinney, who shoulda been all-conference last year (it is a joke he wasn't), who can shoot the three, has a nice mid range game and can also get to the basket very well.  Junior PG Charlie Jaicks, who had a much improved sophmore season, should also be all conference this year.  Jaicks is very quick which allows him to get in the lane very easily and find the open guy, and is also deadly from beyond the 3 point line. 

To go along with those three, they also have depth in their frontline to compliment Raftis in 6'7 Ryan Hollihan and 6'9 Andrew Barker.   Wing players Pete Jones, Doug Price and high flying freshman Donte Briscoe should give the Gators some versatility, as all three players can play multiple positions.  Soph sniper Seth Eisner is a player to also keep an eye on, as he will be one of the best shooters in league.

This is the year Wittenberg will start to decline and Allegheny will be on the rise in NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 19, 2008, 09:53:21 AM
Allegheny, especially Raftis, impressed me last year, and I expect them to be very much in the hunt for this season's league title.  Both Wooster and Wittenberg don't appear to be as strong this year.  Wooster might struggle early due to Brandon Johnson's absence and a tough schedule.  If he can return and approach top form by the the new year Wooster will contend.  Otherwise, I'm afraid not.  Besides him, they'll need two or three freshmen to contribute.  That, also, might or might not happen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2008, 11:09:59 AM
Kenyon basketball joins the 21st century (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28219.xml) with LiveStats and audio and video webcasts...and coaches' shows!  Tune in Monday to listen to Coach Croci discuss how his team's "egregiously bad basketball" and good fortune to play a team of "self-beaters" led to their 2-0 start.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 20, 2008, 10:29:33 PM
Heh! :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2008, 01:46:50 PM
Six teams get underway tonight:

Allegheny (1-1) travels to beautiful downtown Youngstown to face the Div. 1 Penguins tomorrow, while Hiram hosts Pitt-Greensburg in the Terriers' season opener.  Kenyon (2-0) is off until Tuesday, when they will travel to Washington & Jefferson.  Wittenberg opens their campaign at Capital the same evening.

Good luck to all!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 21, 2008, 08:46:49 PM
At the Half:   Wash & Jeff 44  Wooster 41

Scots didn't play very good defense in the first half :( and W&J made 5 three pointers.  Wash & Jeff outrebounded Wooster 15 to 10 and the Scots also missed 6 free throws in the half.

Wooster is being led by freshman Justin Hallowell with 11 points (3 of 4 on three pointers) and Dustin Geitgey with 5 points.

Wash & Jeff is being led by Brian Felker with 17 points and Wahab Owolabi with 8 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 21, 2008, 09:57:07 PM
Final:  Washington & Jefferson 72  Wooster 70

Wash & Jeff outscored Wooster by 6 points at the charity stripe and that was the difference in this game. :(

Scots only made 13 of 24 free throws which is just plain ugly (54%).  W&J made 19 free throws and shot 83% from the charity stripe.

Wooster was led by Ian Franks with 21 points (17 in 2nd half), Justin Hallowell with 11 points and both Marty Bidwell and Drew Sawyer each had 7 points.  Bryan Wickliffe had a subpar game with only 6 points.

W&J was led by Brian Felker with 23 points, Wahab Owolabi with 12 points and Albert Varacallo with 11 points.

Pretty disappointing game for Wooster but not surprising given that 5 new players played significant minutes and Brandon Johnson's point guard presence is missing.

Wooster plays Messiah tomorrow in the consolation game tomorrow and misses a great opportunity to play a ranked Randolph Macon squad.  RMC knocked off Messiah by a 75-49 score in the opener and will play W&J in the championship game.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2008, 11:08:39 PM
Elsewhere:
Ohio Wesleyan 87, UW-Eau Claire 78...Congratulations to the Bishops, the only NCAC team to win tonight.  They get to make a statement tomorrow against Wheaton.
Goshen 75, Denison 62
Illinois College 69, Earlham 54...Quakers take on Eureka tomorrow
Wilmington 69, Wabash 50...LGs face DePauw tomorrow
Mt. Aloysius 83, Oberlin 71
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 22, 2008, 06:36:40 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 40  Messiah 35

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 15 points and Justin Hallowell with 6 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 22, 2008, 07:38:57 PM
Final:  Wooster 86  Messiah 77

Wooster notches its first win of the season. :)  Scots were led in scoring by Ian Franks with 24 points, Justin Hallowell with 17 points (5 three pointers) and Marty Bidwell with 12 points.

Messiah was led by Drew Sneeringer with 18 points, Jason Miller with 17 points and Andy Hawk with 17 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2008, 10:50:48 PM
Elsewhere:
Youngstown St. 96, Allegheny 59
Eureka 64, Earlham 63
Hiram 98, Pitt-Greensburg 86
Wabash 57, DePauw 52
Wheaton 81, Ohio Wesleyan 59

Tomorrow's only game:
Hanover at Denison
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 23, 2008, 08:39:45 AM
I know the season is early, but there are a couple of concerns I have regarding this young Wooster team.  First is their lackluster shooting from the charity stripe.  After an abysmal 14-23 performance in the tournament lidlifter, the Scots followed that up with seven more misses going just 14-21 last night.  I'm sure that this number will improve, especially considering that both Ian Franks and Marty Bidwell are both shooting at a better clip from beyond the arc than they are at the free throw line...  I really hope it does improve, because missed ft's have already indirectly cost them a win and allowed Messiah to get within striking distance at the end of last night's game.

Defense is my other concern.  A night after W&J shot nearly 45%, Wooster allowed Messiah to shoot nearly 50%.  I'm sure the Scots' youth plays a major role in this.  And Brandon Johnson's absence isn't helping things defensively either. 

Offensively, Ian Franks has looked really impressive with his back to back 20+ performances.  And Justin Hallowell appears to be living up to the hype he was receiving coming out of high school.  He's already made 8 treys in 2 games.  And Wooster is shooting the ball at a nice clip (save from the ft line as noted above...). 

One thing to take solace in for Wooster is that loss to W&J does not appear to be as bad as I originally thought after the Presidents followed up their win over Wooster with a win over R-MC.  Things aren't going to get any easier as next up for the Scots is U-W Platteville at Hanover this Saturday.  The Pios have yet to be tested winning their 1st three games by an average of 35 ppg while scoring 93 ppg in the process.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 23, 2008, 10:38:50 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 23, 2008, 08:39:45 AM
I know the season is early, but there are a couple of concerns I have regarding this young Wooster team.  First is their lackluster shooting from the charity stripe.  After an abysmal 14-23 performance in the tournament lidlifter, the Scots followed that up with seven more misses going just 14-21 last night.  I'm sure that this number will improve, especially considering that both Ian Franks and Marty Bidwell are both shooting at a better clip from beyond the arc than they are at the free throw line...  I really hope it does improve, because missed ft's have already indirectly cost them a win and allowed Messiah to get within striking distance at the end of last night's game.

Defense is my other concern.  A night after W&J shot nearly 45%, Wooster allowed Messiah to shoot nearly 50%.  I'm sure the Scots' youth plays a major role in this.  And Brandon Johnson's absence isn't helping things defensively either. 

Offensively, Ian Franks has looked really impressive with his back to back 20+ performances.  And Justin Hallowell appears to be living up to the hype he was receiving coming out of high school.  He's already made 8 treys in 2 games.  And Wooster is shooting the ball at a nice clip (save from the ft line as noted above...). 

One thing to take solace in for Wooster is that loss to W&J does not appear to be as bad as I originally thought after the Presidents followed up their win over Wooster with a win over R-MC.  Things aren't going to get any easier as next up for the Scots is U-W Platteville at Hanover this Saturday.  The Pios have yet to be tested winning their 1st three games by an average of 35 ppg while scoring 93 ppg in the process.



The free throw shooting has certainly been abyssmal.  While I think it will improve, I'm not sure how much.  I'd be surprised if the team goes over 70% for the season, and would not be surprised if that number was more around 65%.  Many of the good free-throw shooters are gone: Cooper, Port, Fulk.  Bidwell started struggling from the stripe last year and I don't know if he'll come around.  Franks will probably shoot well, but I'm just not sure about the others that have been missing.

The Scots defense has not been good.  Too many guys are allowing penetration, something that I haven't seen from a Wooster team in many years.  Help usually arrives before the perp gets to the basket, but that has brought about dish-offs for open jumpers.

Before Platteville, whom I'm afraid will be too much for the Scots to handle, is Carnegie-Mellon, a tough opponent on the road.  Wooster will probably have to play better than they have to win that one.

So far, I like two of the kids, Hallowell and Sawyer.  I see them as bookend forwards next season, after Bidwell's graduation.  Hallowell is an excellent shooter with lots of range.  He hasn't done too much else, but he keeps his composure on the court and I see his game growing over this season and beyond.  Sawyer has a different set of skills.  He's shown the ability to score inside with a nice touch.  His defensive footwork has already improved, plus he can block a shot.  I think we'll begin to see him run the floor more as time goes on.  I'd like to see his minutes increase to the 20-25 range, but for that to happen, he'll have to stay out of foul trouble.

The return of Brandon Johnson will mean much to this team.  Ian Franks can move to the more natual position of two-guard, where he can continue to score which he's done so well.  But Johnson's speed in pushing the ball upcourt will get the Scots some easier points, plus his savvy and ability to penetrate will get the rest of the offense more involved.  Wooster should be a much better team in the second half; however, I think that they're going to pick up 4-6 2008 losses in the process.  An at-large bid is probably out of the question this year, but the Scots will definitely be among the favorites to win the NCAC and gain the automatic bid. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 23, 2008, 06:39:36 PM
Hanover edges Denison in Granville, 77-74.  The Panthers ran out to a double-digit lead in the first 7:21, but Denison ended the half on an 8-2 run to trail by 6 at the break.  The Big Red continued to chip away at the Hanover advantage in the second half, catching and finally overtaking the visitors in the final minute.  But a three-pointer by Taylor Dial with 0:19 remaining gave Hanover the lead, and after Denison frosh Jim Leffew missed a three with 0:04 on the clock, two Panther free throws provided the final margin.  Denison was led by junior Chris Luther's 20 points.  DU essentially played an 8-man rotation, with four of the eight being first-years; in fact, of the twelve players who saw game action, eight were frosh.  Hanover may be in rebuilding mode, but for an eight-frosh Denison team to play a tradition-rich program like Hanover to a basic standstill suggests that the future may be bright in Granville (although it must be noted that the four veterans contributed 50 of DU's 74 points and 17 of the 28 rebounds not assigned to "TEAM".)  Box. (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0809/mb_roster09.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 24, 2008, 10:50:39 PM
Oberlin bounces Westminster at Philips Gym tonight, 67-52.  Despite the low score, this appears to have been a run-and-gun affair, not uncommon for the Titans.  In the first half alone, 67 field goals were attempted, approximately one every nineteen seconds.  However, just 21 of those shots went in the hoop, and nearly three quarters of those were shot by Yeomen.  It was only an 11/12 performance from the free throw line that kept Westminster as close as 16 at the break.  Things got a little better for the visitors in the second, but they were still outshot by their hosts, who ended up shooting 47% for the game to Westminster's 26%.  Despite a +14 rebound margin that led to 13 more field goal attempts, the Titans actually surrendered 8 more field goals than they made, and that was the difference in the game.  Oberlin was led by senior Jordan Beard's 21 points, giving him 51 combined in the season's first two games.  Beard's output was augmented by 15 from his classmate Mike Loll who, oddly enough, was not in the starting lineup and did not play against Mt. Aloysius on Friday.  (Loll was the leading receiver for the Oberlin football squad, earning all-conference honors, and may have needed a bit of a break between seasons.)  5'8" frosh Josh Merritt led the Yeomen with 8 rebounds and 5 assists.  Oberlin played 11 men, each for a minimum of 9 minutes and none for more than 25.  Six of these players are first-years, and they collectively produced 16 points, 18 boards, and nine assists.  Oberlin is now 1-1 while Westminster drops to 0-5.  Box (http://www.goyeo.com/custompages/stats/MBB/Men%27s%20Basketball%20Stats/2008-09/OBEM1124.HTM); recap (http://www.goyeo.com/news/2008/11/24/MBB_1124080421.aspx?tab=).

Classic coachspeak moment of the night, from Oberlin head coach Isaiah Cavaco:
This was a big win for us.  It really builds momentum for our team as we head out to the California for a tough three-game stretch. 
Oberlin's next opponent?  Caltech.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 24, 2008, 10:56:28 PM
Oh, well ... two-game stretch? :D  (I didn't check who their other opponents were.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 25, 2008, 11:14:18 AM
I was looking at the Oberlin website earlier today and noticed that Gian Chiu, their big man from the Phillipines who is now a sophomore, has not yet played this season.  He's still listed on the roster, so I'm wondering if he's injured, but I could find no information to that effect.  Dave, I think you should take a ride up to Oberlin and investigate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 25, 2008, 11:40:52 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 25, 2008, 11:14:18 AM
I was looking at the Oberlin website earlier today and noticed that Gian Chiu, their big man from the Phillipines who is now a sophomore, has not yet played this season.  He's still listed on the roster, so I'm wondering if he's injured, but I could find no information to that effect.  Dave, I think you should take a ride up to Oberlin and investigate.
You know, I don't think I've ever been to Philips Gym.  I almost went last night, but just couldn't pull the trigger.  Maybe later this season.

Tonight's schedule:
Case Western Reserve at Denison (0-2)
Manchester at Earlham (0-2)
Kenyon (2-0) at Washington & Jefferson
Wittenberg (0-0) at Capital
Wooster (1-1) at Carnegie Mellon
Hanover at Wabash (1-1)

Tomorrow's schedule:
Mt. Union at Hiram (1-0)
Oberlin (1-1) at Caltech

Allegheny (1-2) and Ohio Wesleyan (1-1) are both off until Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 25, 2008, 01:07:08 PM
All I can say is that I'm glad I didn't have to do the computer for the Wabash - Wilmington game. Wilimington played 20 players! Is that a D-3 record, or close to it?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 25, 2008, 03:01:54 PM
I've just noticed that on the D3Hoops Live games list (on the main page) the WOO at CMU game claims that it will have video!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 25, 2008, 07:50:59 PM
Is anyone listening to the Wooster feed of their game?  I'm wondering if they've said why Justin Hallowell isn't playing tonight against CMU?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 25, 2008, 08:53:35 PM
They've mentioned that he had some sort of hip/or/groin injury this week in practice.  They're hoping he'll be back for the weekend.  I turned off the video; couldn't watch.  Listening now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 25, 2008, 10:09:03 PM
Results:
Denison (1-2) 92, CWRU 82 (OT)...Big Red get five in double figures;  box (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0809/denm1125.html)
Washington & Jefferson 61, Kenyon (2-1) 58...Lords led by 7 at the half but shot just 31% in the 2nd while W&J hit 52%; box (http://www.washjeff.edu/Athletics/MBasketball/0809stats/game5.htm)
Capital 73, Wittenberg (0-1) 62...Young Tigers led by 12 at the half; recap (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/gamestories/08-09gamestories/capital.html); box (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/08-09statistics/witm1125.htm)
Carnegie Mellon 74, Wooster (1-2) 66...Scots led 11-2 but were outscored by 17 the rest of the way; recap (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/recaps/2008-09/cmu.php)
Manchester 72, Earlham (0-3) 61
Wabash (2-1) 89, Hanover 63
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 26, 2008, 10:31:09 AM
I was unable to get down to Chadwick for last night's game vs. Hanover...but wow, what a score!  Wes Smith dropped in a career high 41 points last night.  Aaron Brock added 17 more.  Next up for Wabash a rematch of last Saturday's game vs. DePauw...this time down in Greencastle. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on November 26, 2008, 12:30:13 PM
Congrats to Denison on their first win of the young season.

I am really happy for Jeremy Stuhfauth (22&12).  He is not got a whole lot of flash but he plays hard and brings it every night.  Good for him!!

GO BIG RED!!!!  I'm thinking they may surprise some teams this year. 

They may not want to celebrate too hard with Capital up next!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 26, 2008, 07:03:35 PM
All Day Quads and BigRedFan, I hope you will stick around and keep us up to date on the Gators and Big Red this season.  I make an effort to keep current on the six teams that don't have their own correspondents (plus the nine women's teams in the NCAC Women's Echo Chamber (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=726.msg972672#msg972672)), and I would love to have some relief.  I do get to Denison games from time to time, so I'm not totally at sea there, but since I have no connections to 'Gheny and it's a million miles away, it'd be especially helpful to hear from a former player who has connections to the program and may even still be able to get to games.  Plus since it looks like the Gators will be a factor in a wide-open NCAC title chase, we're all in need of reliable and insightful information about the team.  It also would be welcome to get a first-hand account of what might be a turnaround year in Granville (provided of course that it's not given by a player's father who has a personal bone to pick with the coach! ;))  Please consider yourselves most welcome, and speaking for the regulars, we hope you will stick around and contribute.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 26, 2008, 07:47:11 PM
Mt. Union 74, Hiram 69...after trailing by 12 during the first period and by 7 at the half, most of the second half was played basically even, but Hiram was unable to pull it out in the Terrierdome.  Hiram is now 1-1 and plays at Geneva on Saturday.  Recap (http://news.hiram.edu/?p=1794); box. (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/hirm1126_000.htm)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 26, 2008, 09:45:15 PM
Seems to me you're in here as much as you used to be.  Already reneging on campaign promises, I see. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 26, 2008, 11:43:28 PM
Out West...
Oberlin 76, Caltech 58...Beard and Loll combine for 43 points in just jetlagged 27 minutes, and nine other Yeo get into the scorebook.  The Beavers' Haussler and Dellatorre matched the Oberlin duo, but the remainder of the Beavers managed just four buckets.  Oberlin outshot (48%-37%) and outrebounded (39-27) their hosts and held a double-digit lead for the last 25 minutes of action.  Then everyone shook hands and went off to hit the books.  Box. (http://www.gocaltech.com/sports/mbkb/2008-09/stats/obl-cit.htm)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2008, 01:10:10 PM
I just noticed that Gregg Hill is listed on Wittenberg's roster (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/roster08-09.html) with a jersey number of "inj;" this is the same designation as Kyle Bigler, who is confirmed to be out for the season with an ACL injury.  I'm going to take this as confirmation that Hill is taking a medical redshirt and will miss the season.  However, if any of our AWOL Wittenberg friends know better, it'd be nice to hear.

Happy Thanksgiving to all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2008, 03:39:53 PM
Congratulations to Hiram sophomore guard Chris Roberts, the inaugural NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html) for the 2008-09 season.  Roberts was honored for his 31-point outburst vs. Pitt-Greensburg.  Roberts also led the Terriers in scoring in last night's game, canning 18 points, and through two games is hitting better than 55% of his shots (16/29). 

Not meaning any offense to Roberts, I think my vote would have gone to Bryan Yelvington...

------------------

Both Earlham (http://www.earlham.edu/athletics/content/sports_news/2008/pr111908.html) and Ohio Wesleyan (http://connect2.owu.edu/issues/20081112/athletics/basketball.html) have announced that they will be waiving admission fees to all men's and women's basketball games this season, citing the current economic crisis.  They join Kenyon, which to my knowledge has never charged admission, and Wooster (women's games only) in offering a cost-free source of entertainment.  Denison has also waived admission fees for home games in Nov. and Dec. as part of their support for a local food drive (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0809/mb_fooddrive08.html).  If there are other schools are not charging admission, please post it here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on November 28, 2008, 11:14:04 AM
Hey DC,
I am afraid I am not going to be of much help because I am also a long distance fan.
I have relied heavily on you in the past.  Howver, we do attend a few games a year and will be happy to give you my "less than expert anylsis" when we are there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2008, 09:44:24 PM
Wittenberg holds off Concordia of Portland (OR) this afternoon, 70-67, to grab their first win of the season.  This was a nip and tuck game all the way, with neither team able to build a lead of greater than 7 points.  With 6:37 to go and Witt down 1, Seth Hill grabbed a missed CU free throw and fed Kevin Murray on the break for the old-fashioned three-point play, and the Tigers never trailed again.  Murray led all scorers with 21, while David Nowicki added 14 points and 5 assists.  Wittenberg took an un-Tiger-like 18 three-point shots, and hit 7 for a reasonable 39%, part of their overall 41% shooting.  The Tigers will face host Pacific Lutheran tomorrow in the conclusion of this classic-style tournament.  Box. (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/08-09statistics/witm1128.htm)

Elsewhere,
It took the combined forces of two colleges to do it, but Pomona-Pitzer drops Oberlin 69-56 tonight in Claremont, CA.  Oberlin trailed by a humbling 32-14 score at the half and could get no closer than 9 points down the stretch.  The Yeomen were once again led by seniors Mike Loll and Jordan Beard, with Loll scoring 20 of the duo's combined 36 points.  The Yeomen play their fourth game in six days (with a cross-country trip in that span) tomorrow when they take on three colleges at once (Claremont-Mudd-Scripps, a/k/a CMS) on Pomona's home court.  Box (http://www.goyeo.com/custompages/stats/MBB/Men%27s%20Basketball%20Stats/2008-09/OBEM1128.HTM); recap (http://www.goyeo.com/news/2008/11/28/MBB_1128081620.aspx?tab=basketball).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 29, 2008, 08:01:48 PM
Wooster falls in a hard fought effort to Platteville, 76-67 to drop to a very uncharacteristic 1-3 on the young season.  Wooster trailed early by as many as 14 before trimming the lead to just 5 at the half.  The Scots then proceeded to score the first 9 points of the second half to actually lead by 4.  But it was all Platteville after that.

Wooster shot 47% from the field but only 9-27 from downtown.  And for the second game in a row, Wooster was the victim of a rather large discrepancy at the charity stripe as the Scots only attempted 7 ft's compared to 24 for Platteville...  Wooster was outscored at the line 17-4?!  :o  It's tough to win when there's that kind of disparity...

Wooster was led in scoring by Justin Hallowell who scored 17 including 5 treys. Balch chipped in 16 off the bench and Franks added 11.

Wooster will now await the winner of the Hanover v. IU-Southeast loser tomorrow afternoon.

It sounds like, even though Wooster fell tonight, there were a lot of positives the Scots can take from this loss and build off of heading into conference action.  We just have to remember how young this team is and one of the leaders of this team will be back very soon.  And from how this season has started, Johnson's return can't come soon enough!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2008, 08:22:58 PM
Other results:
Kenyon 61, Albion 55...more below
Ohio Wesleyan 80, Marietta 58...more below
Hiram 88, Geneva 84...Geneva recap (http://www.geneva.edu/object/io_1227997184860.html); Chris Roberts with 22, Ian Pfouts adds 18, Hiram is now 2-1
DePauw 92, Earlham 57
Hilbert at Allegheny and Oberlin vs. CMS at Pomona should be underway
Wittenberg plays at Pacific Lutheran later tonight.
Denison and Wabash are idle.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2008, 08:55:45 PM
In the first game of the "OWU/Kenyon Classic" (catchy title!), Kenyon came up with a very impressive six-point win over Albion, 61-55.  As the score would indicate, the defenses on both ends predominated.  Kenyon's defense got the better of the matchup, forcing 17 turnovers, including 10 steals, and holding the previously unbeaten Britons to 37% shooting.  The Lords' front line of seniors Bryan Yelvington and Allen Bediako and junior Dave Knapke dominated in the paint, grabbing 23 rebounds (Knapke 9) and blocking 4 shots (Yelvington 2), while combining for 38 points (Yelvington 17) and five assists (Knapke 3) at the other end.  This trio also kept Albion in foul trouble all afternoon, drawing enough fouls to require 20 free throws (Albion's whole team only had 15 free throw attempts).  Dave Jolson and Jim Arce each contributed 10 points, with seven of Arce's tally also coming from the stripe.  Recap (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28325.xml); box (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28324.xml).

The second game was considerably less entertaining, although it was much closer than the score (OWU 80, Marietta 58) would indicate.  OWU got out to a 10 point lead in sloppy first five minutes, and although the lead stayed in double digits for almost the entire game, the Bishops just couldn't seem to shake their guests until the final minutes.  Senior Kyle Holliday led OWU with 25 points on 9/18 shooting, but it took him most of the game to find his stroke; it was when he did that the Bishops were able to put away the Pioneers.  (He never did find it at the stripe, making just two of 10 attempts.)  Junior center Brent Pleiman added a double-double with 10 points and 10 boards; overall, OWU owned the glass with a +13 rebounding margin that included 20 offensive rebounds (Holliday 5).  The Bishops also took good care of the ball, recording 17 assists (Rob Gardiner 5) on 31 buckets while committing just 9 turnovers (and forcing 18 Pioneer TOs).  Recap (http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/mbb1129.html); box (http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/owum1129.htm).

The same four teams match up again tomorrow at Kenyon, with OWU leading off against Albion, followed by Marietta taking on Kenyon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 29, 2008, 09:46:20 PM
Just from the feel of the radio broadcast, it seemed that Wooster played much better this afternoon than Tuesday night in Pittsburgh.  Platteville's early lead was gained from some very hot shooting.  Wooster, even though in considerable foul trouble inside, weathered the storm and fought back.  For a good while in the second half they seemed to be playing well, but then went cold from the outside and that was the ballgame.

The bad news?  Ian Franks is no longer a secret weapon, and teams will be watching him.  Melick and Wickliffe continue to hack and hold, or at least get called for doing so.  Marty Bidwell is still not much of a part of the offense.

On the other side, Hallowell, about a month after Halloween, was back in the lineup and had another very good game.  And, sophomore transfer Nathan Balch made very good use of his minutes and will likely see even more time.  I'd almost given up on him.

To be honest, I was expecting a much tougher loss.  This was a ballgame until near the end, against a good team, and that should bode well for a young team getting its sea legs on the road.

It was mentioned that freshman Drew Sawyer did not make the trip; no reason was given.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2008, 10:09:12 PM
More scores:
CMS 67, Oberlin 60...Yeo go 1-2 out west
Allegheny 58, Hilbert 54...Gators will face Ithaca tomorrow; Ithaca bombed B-WC 97-75
Witt vs. Pac Lute scheduled to begin at 11pm EST.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 29, 2008, 11:32:10 PM
Well, I just got a look at the Wooster boxscore (from the Platteville website) and it says that Drew Sawyer played 2 minutes and had an offensive rebound.  I'm sure, though, that in the WQKT pregame it was mentioned that Sawyer didn't make the trip.  My bet is that the boxscore is incorrect.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2008, 12:48:55 AM
One last score:
Pacific Lutheran 80, Wittenberg 60...Tigers chilly overall (34%) and icy cold (16%) from the arc, and turn the ball over 23 times.  Witt puts three in double figures, led by Mark Snyder's 14.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 30, 2008, 01:38:47 PM
Quote from: nuscottsfan on November 27, 2008, 11:44:10 AM
The stats through 3 games belie the 1-2 record Wooster has posted. They have outscored (1 pt) and out-rebounded (suprise) their opponents. The losses stem from poor performance at the FT line and allowing the other teams to get to the charity stripe way too often. This comes from defensive breakdowns...not moving your feet, leaving the passing lanes open and not calling the help.

nuscottsfan - good first post.  I watched the second half of the Carnegie Mellon game on the webcast and Wooster just played poor defense too often reaching and committing fouls instead of moving their feet on defense.

I wasn't able to listen to the Platteville game but it was good to see Wooster make it a competitive game.  Hopefully, Wooster will continue to improve as their key freshmen continue to improve and the return of Brandon Johnson will be a big plus.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 30, 2008, 01:42:51 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 45  Hanover 28

Wooster has made 9 three pointers in the half :) ....with Hanover playing mostly zone defense.  Wooster shot 50% in the half.

Scots are being led by their newcomers with Justin Hallowell notching 12 points (4 three pointers) and Nathan Balch with 11 points (3 three pointers).  Ian Franks has chipped in 7 points.

It is worth noting that Hanover is only 1-3 on the season.  Their only win is a 3 point victory over Denison and they also lost by 26 points to the Little Giants in a game played at Wabash.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 30, 2008, 02:38:12 PM
Final:  Wooster 93  Hanover 61

Wooster was led by Nathan Balch with 17 points, Justin Hallowell with 12 points, Ian Franks with 12 points and Matt Fegan also with 12 points.  Bryan Wickliffe chipped in 10 points.  Scots shot 52% from the floor this afternoon.

Wooster made 19 three pointers today :) as Hanover stayed in a 2-3 zone defense and gave the Scots lots of open shots from the three point arc.

Coach Moore on the post game show was pleased with the team's improvement today but still noted that Wooster's defense needs work as too many guys are still driving around us with the ball.

Scots improve to 2-3.  Next up is the first NCAC game vs. Oberlin on Wednesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 30, 2008, 03:47:35 PM
Ohio Wesleyan 69 Albion 66
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2008, 07:33:03 PM
Elsewhere:
Kenyon 75, Marietta 48
Ithaca 85, Allegheny 63
Capital 87, Denison 63
Defiance 83, Earlham 68
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 30, 2008, 09:23:22 PM
Just back from a loooong ride back from Hanover...

I thought that the Scots made some big strides this weekend.  They seemed a bit overwhelmed early against Platteville, but picked up the defensive intensity midway through the first half and it seemed to carry through the rest of the weekend.  The offense went flat for a long period in the second half of that game or it would have been much more interesting down the stretch.  Today's game was impressive, albeit against a much weaker opponent.  As Wooscotsfan mentioned, Hanover played a zone almost exclusively, and the Scots were able to shoot over the zone pretty much at will.  However, I will say that I don't ever recall a Scots team moving the ball so well against a zone.  They did a nice job of passing quickly, reversing the ball, and driving the lane and kicking it out for wide-open jumpers.  Pretty much a textbook performance on the offensive side. 

A lot of the newcomers really stepped up their game this weekend.  In particular I've been wondering what Steve Moore had been seeing in Nathan Balch that was warranting so many minutes.  This weekend he played a very confident game, was quick and decisive with the ball, and was deadly from outside.  Congrats to Balch and Justin Hallowell for making the all-tournament team.  The inside game was still a little weak, but frosh Greg Ross played very well and I wouldn't be surprised to see him move up the depth chart if his improved play continues.

There is still room for improvement - they did foul a LOT all weekend, usually from not being in position, but there was definite improvement in the defense.

Overall, I think that we got a peek at what could be a very good team by the end of the season, but we should know a lot more by this time next week.

Go Scots!!



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2008, 11:40:13 PM
Ohio Wesleyan played excellent basketball for about 30 minutes today.  After building an 18-point lead with 11:52 remaining, the Bishops went flat at both ends, and Albion went on a tear to make a game of it.  Trailing by 15 at the 7:58 mark, Albion went on a 14-2 run over the next 5:13 which was ended by a brilliant drive through the lane by OWU's Kyle Holliday.  From that point forward, the Bishops made just enough free throws to keep the Britons at bay.  OWU, which connected on just two of their last nine field goal attempts, shot 42% for the afternoon (57% in the first half, 30% in the second) and hit a sterling 24 of 27 free throws (although two of the three misses were in the final 0:24 of the game).  Holliday led the way with 18 points, including a 9-for-11 performance from the line.  Frosh Pat Pellerite added 15 points and a game-high 8 rebounds.  Albion managed to make just one of eleven three-point attempts and misfired on nine of 32 free throws; statistically at least, that was their undoing.  Albion goes home to Michigan with their first two losses of the season.  Recap; (http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/mbb1130.html) box (http://www.albion.edu/sports/mbasketball/89mbkstats/1130abow.htm).

The second game was won easily by the homestanding Lords; too easily, in fact, as they appeared to have some difficulty maintaining their intensity whenever the lead reached 17 points.  The lead would shrink to about 10 points, then Kenyon would regain focus and renew their lead.  On one occasion, the momentum change was spectacular, as senior Allen Bediako blocked a shot, crossed to the other side of the lane and rejected a second shot (this one reaching the Marietta bench), and moments later made a nifty baseline move around his defender and thunder-dunked over a second Pioneer, sending what crowd was still there into a frenzy.  That sequence adequately fired up his teammates, who ended the game on a 24-8 run (the last 2+ minutes being played by the last five guys on the bench) to post the lopsided final score.  The leading scorer, for the fourth time in five games, was Bryan Yelvington, who posted 23 points on 7/13 shooting and 9/10 from the line.  Bryan is now averaging 23.2 PPG, and prior to today's game was honored by his coach for scoring his 1,000th career point, accomplished back on 11/16 in Chicago against Edgewood.  Yelvington also grabbed 11 rebounds and now leads the team in this category as well (7.8 RPG).  Bediako added 11 points, his second consecutive double-digit performance.  Recap (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28328.xml); box (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28332.xml).

For those who have faith in the "comparative scores" game, Kenyon should have a slight edge over their co-hosts.  The Lords beat Albion by 6 and Marietta by 27, while Ohio Wesleyan was "only" able to win by margins of 3 and 22, respectively.  OWU next takes the short drive to face Capital on Wednesday, then both Kenyon and OWU open NCAC play on Saturday in what could be pivotal games in the conference race.  Kenyon hosts Wabash, and OWU travels to Wooster. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2008, 03:17:06 PM
Wabash sophomore Wes Smith's 41-point outburst vs. Hanover has earned him the coveted NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html) award for the second week of the 2008-09 season.  Congratulations, Wes!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 02, 2008, 12:22:47 AM
Hiram adds to Case Western Reserve's misery tonight, handing the Spartans an 84-80 defeat tonight in Cleveland.  Chris Roberts and Ian Pfouts combined for 54 points on 22 for 30 shooting; Pfouts' career high 25 points was augmented by 10 rebounds.  The Terriers shot 48% overall and owned a +15 advantage on the boards.  Hiram moves to 3-1 on the young season while Case drops to 0-5.  Recap (http://news.hiram.edu/?p=1806); box (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/stats/m-basketball/hirm1201.htm).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 02, 2008, 08:25:14 PM
Halftime in Greencastle.....Wabash just put together a 3-20 shooting half.  Not surprisingly, the Little Giants are not winning.   >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 02, 2008, 11:13:38 PM
Final score:
DePauw 67, Wabash 57
Tigers and Little Giants split the season series.

The conference season kicks off tomorrow at Wooster when road-weary Oberlin comes to town.  In non-conference action, Wittenberg hosts Ohio Northern, Allegheny visits Gannon, Denison travels to Marietta, Earlham and Wilmington try to reach a consensus at Wilmington, and Ohio Wesleyan faces Capital in Bexley.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 03, 2008, 09:15:11 PM
Finals tonight:

Wooster 104 - Oberlin 54
Ohio Northern 78 - Witt 62
Capital 82 - Ohio Wesleyan 70
Marietta 84 - Denison 71

After hitting 45% (19 of 42) of their 3-pointers against Hanover, the Scots were 16 of 27 from behind the arc tonight for 59%!  Overall the Scots hit 67% from the floor, held Oberlin to 36% and outrebounded the Yeomen 41 - 16.  The Scots continued to struggle from the line hitting only 8 of 14.

Individually the Scots were led by Marty Bidwell with 19 pts (in 16 minutes) and Mike Evans, who poured in 18 points in his 13 minutes.  Justin Hallowell was also in double-figures with 12 on 4-5 shooting from behind the arc.  Oberlin was led by Jordan Beard with 13, Mike Loll with 12 and Omari Hall with 10.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 03, 2008, 10:46:52 PM
Also...
Gannon (D2) 82, Allegheny 55
Wilmington 75, Earlham 48

It seems to me that OWU has three basic weaknesses, and a very, very good Capital team exposed two of them tonight in Bexley.
1) OWU really misses Dustin Rudegeair and Jesse Jean.  There's nobody on this year's team that can replace the production of these two players.  There's not enough going on in the paint to force the defense to pack it in and allow open looks to OWU's several excellent jumpshooters.  Brent Pleiman has the size of Jean, but not nearly the athleticism to be a credible scoring threat.  Kyle Holliday, like Rudegeair, has an excellent jump shot and is a fearless driver of the lane, but he hasn't got the size to play with his back to the basket.  Pat Pellerite looks like he'll become a special player, but he's still a freshman and a bit wild.  (And both Holliday and Pellerite are woeful free throw shooters.)  Between them, these three scored 24 tonight on 9 of 22 shooting.
2) On defense, OWU tends to overplay the man, leaving them susceptible to the back door cut.  Make no mistake, Capital as a team is very skilled at shooting the basketball.  But tonight they scored 38 points in the paint and only missed 14 shots taken inside the arc (64%), and you can't do that without help from the defense.  Pellerite is the key offender here; as a post defender, he tends to play his man off to the side just a bit, leaving the baseline undefended against either a backdoor cutter or a spin move.  I should say that this is a weakness that seems especially glaring when you play against a team with a half-dozen or more bulky but athletic guys listed at 6'6" but playing like they're 6'9"; nobody in the NCAC meets that description.
3) OWU has a short bench.  That's true, but the play of the key reserves has gotten a lot better, and tonight there was hardly any dropoff when they were in the game.  Tim Brady and Dillon McBride both had creditable games tonight, combining for 17 points.

Both halves of the game ended up 41-35, and Capital shot a blistering 56+% in each half.  OWU shot a respectable 43% in the first half, dropping to 38% in the second due in part to some fairly desperate attempts in the final couple of minutes.  Capital won the battle of the boards 40-31, with each team getting about 1/4 of the available offensive rebounds.  OWU continued to keep good care of the ball, with just 9 turnovers, counterbalanced by seven steals, but had just 8 assists on 26 baskets.  Kyle Miller led the Bishops with 17 points, and Pellerite ripped down 14 rebounds, including four on the offensive end.  OWU recap (http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/mbb1203.html); box (http://www.capital.edu/22365.htm).

The matchup this Saturday between the Scots and Bishops gets more intriguing with each passing day.  It could be a classic.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 04, 2008, 01:11:39 PM
Solid win for Wooster last night.  Nice to see Bidwell have a nice night offensively.  I'm wondering if he's finally getting close to being 100% for the first time this season.

And how about these freshmen?  Three frosh shot a combined 11-14 from downtown led by Hallowell and Evans each knocking down 4-5 and Fegan adding 3-4!

On a side note, Hanover just beat newly ranked and previously unbeaten Transy last night to open HCAC play 55-53!  Go figure...  Hanover had been allowing nearly 88 ppg in their previous three contests which included lopsided losses to both Wabash and Wooster and they hold Transy to 53!  Either Hanover ditched that 2-3 zone that was so ineffective against Wooster or Transy couldn't shoot over it...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAS A PLAYER on December 05, 2008, 02:00:27 PM
Just a matter of time till Coach Moore, Coach Cline, and the health of their players, put this team on the right track.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2008, 10:11:43 PM
Franciscan University of Steubenville, a D3 provisional and new member of the AMCC, upends Hiram tonight, 88-80.  The Barons, coming off a 43-point loss Wednesday to Penn St.-Altoona, even their record at 3-3, but as far as I can tell this was their first win over a D3 opponent (the others being Penn St.-New Kensington and Christendom College).  I doubt there's any way to spin this as anything but a very bad loss for the Terriers, who fall to 3-2.  Box (http://www.franciscan.edu/Home2/apps/printer/main.aspx?id=3107).  Hiram had four in double figures, led by Chris Roberts' 25 points on 10 for 16 shooting, but it appears that hot shooting by their hosts (50% overall, 10-for-21 from the arc) did them in.  Hiram forced 15 turnovers and grabbed 16 offensive rebounds, leading to a +17 margin in field goals attempted, but more than a third of those attempts were from the arc, where the Terriers shot just 24% (7 for 29).  Every starter for the Barons finished in double figures, and collectively they provided 84 of the team's 88 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 05, 2008, 10:18:24 PM
From the tone of your post, I take it that Franciscan University wasn't moving DOWN from D1. :)  That does lead me to ask, though, what level of the basement are they coming up from, to be a provisional DIII? ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2008, 10:36:43 PM
Poking around their website (http://www.franciscan.edu/home2/Content/CampusLife/Athletics/main.aspx?id=1659&cat=209), it looks like this is just the third year of varsity basketball at Franciscan; I guess it was a club or even intramural sport prior to that.  (In fact, the 2006-07 team might not have had varsity status; it's hard to tell for sure.)  They were 6-19 last year, although just one of those wins was against a D3 program (Waynesburg,) and 5-20 in their first season (including a win over D3 Penn St.-Altoona.)  But these guys own Christendom--they're 3-0 all time vs. the Crusaders with an average margin of victory of nearly 17.  Maybe Hiram should schedule Christendom?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 06, 2008, 03:46:13 AM
So, what does a Scot fan do in the middle of the night and he can't sleep??  Pour through the record book and see when the last time that a Scot team started off the season 1-3!  Turns out that the last time that happened was the final year under Lu Wims - 1986-87 - when the Scots opened with losses to Capital, Millikin and Mt Union before defeating Marietta.

Here's some tidbits regarding the 3rd loss in coach Moore's first 21 seasons at Wooster:
8 have come vs Wittenberg - no surprise there.  Next is Denison and Kenyon wth 2 each.
7 times the 3rd loss has occurred in December, 5 in Feb and March.  This year marks the only time the 3rd loss was in November.
9 years the 3rd loss came with less than 10 games in the win column, 5 times with 10-19 wins, and 8 times with more than 20 wins (and 7 of those they had at least 25!).
This is the 3rd season in which the 3rd loss occurred with less than 3 wins.  The other two seasons the Scots finished 18-9 (1989-90) and 21-7 (1991-92).

OK - maybe that number crunching has tired me out enough to get some sleep...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 06, 2008, 09:34:30 AM
Derek, maybe you should try a hot rum toddy.  Or 11 of them.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 06, 2008, 04:37:16 PM
Kenyon takes care of business this afternoon in Gambier, defeating Wabash 70-55.  J.T. Knight led the Lords with a huge 20 point, 10 board, 5 assist afternoon.  Bryan Yelvington also recorded a double-double, with 16 points and 11 boards.  Wabash's Chase Haltom led all scorers with 23 points, but the Little Giants collectively only shot 27% and were out-rebounded by a whopping 22 boards (48-26).  Box. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28364.xml)

Behind Tristian Gregory's 24 points, Earlham knocks off Oberlin 68-64.  Oberlin got 19 from Jordan Beard, but Mike Loll was held to 8 points on 3/11 shooting.  The Quakers had just 6 turnovers on the day and outscored their hosts by a dozen at the free throw line, helping to counteract Oberlin's 47% shooting and +7 rebound margin. Box. (http://www.goyeo.com/custompages/stats/MBB/Men%27s%20Basketball%20Stats/2008-09/OBEM1206.HTM)

Allegheny steals a victory at Denison on a free throw with one second on the clock, winning 64-63.  The game was a back-and-forth affair, with 17 lead changes and neither team able to build a lead larger than 8 points.  Chris Luther hit a short jumper with 2:06 left to give the Big Red a 63-60 lead, but the hosts were only able to get one more shot off, committing two turnovers and three fouls down the stretch, while the Gators converted four of six free throws, including one by Donte Brisco to provide the margin of victory.  Allegheny got 25 points from George Raftis on 9 of 12 shooting (but just 7 of 12 from the free throw line), part of an overall 46.5% shooting effort.  Denison won the battle of the boards 38-25 and had eleven more field goal attempts, but sent their guests to the free throw line 30 times, where despite connecting on just 57%, the Gators outscored Denison by 5--more than enough for the victory.  Box (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0809/denm1206.html).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 06, 2008, 09:20:47 PM
The evening ends with a couple of blowouts:

Wooster wipes out Ohio Wesleyan by the deceptive score of 82-65.  The Scots led by 21 at the half and by 26 as late as the 3:07 mark before OWU closed the game on a 14-5 run.  OWU, which has had low turnover totals all season, coughed it up 11 times in the first half, and shot the ball miserably when they managed to hold on to it.  For the game, OWU shot just 37.5% and were outrebounded by 13.  Wooster got out to an early 10-point lead despite missing their first 5 shots, but then righted the ship and ended up shooting 47% for the game (although just 26% from the arc.)  The fans who braved the cold and icy roads (myself not among them) were treated to 19 missed free throws between the two teams.  Wooster was led by Ian Franks with 18 points, all but one of them in the 2nd half, with four others contributing 9 or more points, including Bryan Wickliffe who grabbed a game-high 10 rebounds to go with his 9 points.  The Kyles led OWU, as Kyle Holliday netted 15 points before fouling out, and Kyle Miller added 13. Box. (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/boxes/2008-09/owu.php)

Cedarville, ranked #4 in NAIA D2, waxed Wittenberg by the embarrassing score of 80-53, Witt's largest loss in over 4 years (since the NCAC title game in 2004.)  Wittenberg had just 4 assists on the night, and managed to force just 5 Cedarville turnovers.  The Tigers couldn't find the bottom of the net from anywhere on the floor, shooting 32% overall, 21% from the arc, and 55% from the free throw line.  The leading scorers for the Tigers were David Nowicki, who had 9 at the half and still had 9 when the game ended, and frosh Michael Cooper, who saw his first action of his career in garbage time and scored eight on two treys and two free throws.  Fortunately for the Tigers, as a non-conference, non-regional, non-D3 game, this one only hurts the pride.  Box. (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/08-09statistics/witm1206.htm)  In his postgame comments, Bill Brown suggested that the series between these neighborhood rivals (the two campuses are less than 15 miles apart) may not be continued.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 06, 2008, 11:45:43 PM
Just got back from Timken after some snowy driving and Wooster made the trip worthwhile with a convincing win over the Bishops.  As David noted, this game was not really as close as the final score with Wooster in complete control before halftime.

I was impressed by both Wooster's defense and their rebounding. ;D  OWU shot 37.5% because Wooster challenged most of their shots and the Scots won the battle of the boards by 46-33.

The newcomers are starting to play more cohesively and the defense is improving so Wooster seems to be rounding into form just in time for the conference schedule.  Nathan Balch and Justin Hallowell appear to be the best additions this season from a talent standpoint but Greg Ross, Mike Evans and Matt Fegan also played some quality minutes tonight.  Ian Franks took control of this game in the second half and Bryan Wickliffe really hustled tonight on the boards.

Gideon Mabeny was manning the video camera tonight and he is walking normally without a limp so his recovery seems to be going well but it will be next season before he hits the court.

It is always nice to get a NCAC win vs. a contender and this was a convincing victory by the Scots. :) It will be interesting to see how Wooster does against the rest of the NCAC in the next couple of months.  If the Scots can continue to play defense like they did tonight, they should be a strong contender for another conference title.

Wooster is now 4-3, 2-0 NCAC.  Next up is Albion at home next Saturday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 07, 2008, 11:03:11 AM
Wooscotsfan, you said it all.  This is a very different team than the one that lost at CMU just 11 days ago.  Albion next, and OWU knocked them off.  Things are looking good, and I'm very happy to be so surprised.

For your consideration: if it takes 6 months for a six-footer to recover from an ACL injury, does it take 7 months for a seven-footer, given the proportional length of his ACL?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2008, 01:04:42 PM
Nuscottsfan, thanks for the insights into Hallowell.  You do realize that we can see your email address, right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Reserved Seat on December 07, 2008, 04:34:06 PM
Looks like Wittenberg's Sullivan is having the same problems he had at F&M. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2008, 04:42:12 PM
Quote from: Reserved Seat on December 07, 2008, 04:34:06 PM
Looks like Wittenberg's Sullivan is having the same problems he had at F&M. 
which are...?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 07, 2008, 06:03:38 PM
Team Records thru 12/6 (Overall, NCAC)

Kenyon 5-1, 1-0
Wooster 4-3, 2-0
Hiram 3-2, 0-0
Ohio Wesleyan 3-3, 0-1
Allegheny 3-4, 1-0
Wabash 2-3, 0-1
Oberlin 2-5, 0-2
Wittenberg 1-4, 0-0
Denison 1-5, 0-1
Earlham 1-6, 1-0
(Note: this list sorted by most overall wins)

Only 3 NCAC teams with overall winning records at this point.  Kenyon has looked the most impressive on paper so far with their tournament win at Chicago and beating Wabash at home yesterday.  Their only loss was on the road at W&J by 3 points, a team that also beat Wooster in Timken on opening weekend.

With graduation losses and injuries, Wittenberg only has 3 returning players (Nowicki, Murray, Snyder) who played significant roles last season and with 6 newcomers logging minutes they still appear to be finding their team chemistry.  As a team, they are shooting 36% from the floor through 5 games.

Wooster has 5-6 newcomers (Hallowell, Balch, Fegan, Ross, Evans, Sawyer) logging minutes and they appear to be headed in a positive direction as they have now won 3 games in a row after a 1-3 start.

Ohio Wesleyan, Wabash and Allegheny should also factor in the NCAC race this year but none of them have a winning record at this point.

Can anyone else add some observations to this discussion?





 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 07, 2008, 06:21:07 PM
Question regarding the Wooster-OWU game this weekend.  Did anyone else notice coach Dewitt and his seeming lack of interest in the game?  It seemed that once the Scots started to pull away in the first 10 minutes he just sat in his seat with his legs crossed and his chin resting in his hand.  I believe that he only called one timeout in the first half (after which they cut into the lead) and I'm not sure they ever called one in the second.  I dunno - maybe that's just his style.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 07, 2008, 06:35:26 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 07, 2008, 06:03:38 PM

Can anyone else add some observations to this discussion?


We might know a little more after Kenyon's visit to Delaware on Wed night.  If the Lords win that one it sets up a pretty big game after the holidays when the Scots will travel to Gambier for the only game between Wooster and Kenyon this season.

Having only seen 2 NCAC teams so far this year (Wooster and OWU), its hard to make much of an early season judgement.  However, I think its safe to say that if the Scots continue to play they way have the last 3 times out - especially defensively - that they're gonna be pretty tough to beat.  But as mentioned by a couple of others, the Scots are playing mostly 1st year players and they're bound to have a few games where they don't play at that level.  And teams with a good inside game are likely to give Wooster some problems. 

I think it looks like its shaping up to be an interesting season with maybe 7 teams having a legit shot at playing a home tourney game this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2008, 06:40:04 PM
I think it is worth noting that the four team that have beaten Wittenberg have a combined record of 26-3, and two of them are ranked in the top 12 nationally in their divisions.  When you have a practically all-new team, that's a rough way to start the season.  (You could say something similar about Wooster, but the Scots have more veterans and have had games vs. Oberlin and Hanover.)  I made the mistake of underestimating Witt when they struggled early last year, and while I think they're not the favorites, they'll still be a factor in the conference race.  Their next three games are against Denison, Hiram, and Otterbein, and the results of those games should tell us a lot.

Quote from: imderekpoe on December 07, 2008, 06:21:07 PM
Question regarding the Wooster-OWU game this weekend.  Did anyone else notice coach Dewitt and his seeming lack of interest in the game?  It seemed that once the Scots started to pull away in the first 10 minutes he just sat in his seat with his legs crossed and his chin resting in his hand.  I believe that he only called one timeout in the first half (after which they cut into the lead) and I'm not sure they ever called one in the second.  I dunno - maybe that's just his style.
That absolutely is his style.  He's the most laid-back coach (literally and figuratively) that I think I've ever seen.  It's not that he's not completely into the game, it's just that his body language doesn't belie his feelings.  I do wonder sometimes about his reticence in calling timeouts, though.  He called one with maybe 10:00 gone in the first period last night, and I immediately thought "wow, that's odd, he must think they're in deep trouble."  Which of course they were.

We've got a number of teams out there that have played or will play three or more NCAC teams, giving us a benchmark of somewhat dubious merit.
*Hanover--won at Denison 77-74; lost at Wabash 89-63; lost to Wooster 93-61
*Washington & Jefferson--won at Wooster 72-70; def. Kenyon 61-58; hosts Denison Sat.
*Albion--lost to Kenyon 61-55; lost to OWU 69-66; plays at Wooster Sat.
*Case Western Reserve--lost at Denison 92-82 (OT); lost to Hiram 84-80; hosts Kenyon Jan.3; plays at Oberlin Jan. 7; could host OWU Dec. 30
*Marietta--lost at OWU 80-58; lost at Kenyon 75-48; beat Denison 84-71
*Capital--def. Wittenberg 73-62; won at Denison 87-63; def. OWU 82-70; hosts Kenyon Dec. 22
I apologize and welcome additions if I have missed any.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Reserved Seat on December 07, 2008, 07:02:59 PM
Sullivan's problems at F&M were his inability to make plays from the point guard position(few assists) and his inability to knockdown his shot(current shotting percentage similar to last year).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2008, 11:01:24 PM
Quotewhile the Gators converted four of six free throws, including one by Donte Brisco to provide the margin of victory

Donte Brisco? Wasn't there a movie made about him with Depp and Pacino?

Oh, wait...that was Donnie Brasco.

Nevermind.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 08, 2008, 08:11:34 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2008, 11:01:24 PM
Quotewhile the Gators converted four of six free throws, including one by Donte Brisco to provide the margin of victory

Donte Brisco? Wasn't there a movie made about him with Depp and Pacino?

Oh, wait...that was Donnie Brasco.

Nevermind.



The Count of Donte Brisco?  Shot six free throws, made four.  Film at eleven.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 08, 2008, 09:50:15 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 07, 2008, 11:03:11 AM
Wooscotsfan, you said it all.  This is a very different team than the one that lost at CMU just 11 days ago.  Albion next, and OWU knocked them off.  Things are looking good, and I'm very happy to be so surprised.

I totally agree.  I still wasn't sure on how I felt about this team even with their large margins of victory over a down Hanover team and, well, Oberlin.  But my reservations were subdued a bit with the pounding that Wooster delivered to the Bishops Saturday night. 

I was thinking after the OWU game that if Wooster were able to go back and play W&J and CMU now, I would guess we would see different results than what we originally saw.  The difference has been defense.  If the Scots continue to come out and play defense like they have the last 3 games, they will be tough to beat in the conference.  And then there's that little added bonus of Brandon Johnson's return for the Mose Hole!   8)

As for the rest of the NCAC, IMO, Kenyon looks to be asserting themselves as the team to challenge Wooster this year.  As derek mentioned, we should be able to get a better gauge on the Lords after their trip to OWU on Wednesday. 

And I would agree with DC about Witt as well.  Many of us, myself included, were writing Witt off last year after their slow start against a very tough non-conference schedule.  I remember questioning whether their streak of consecutive winning seasons might be in jeopardy.  And I have to admit, those thoughts have been creeping back into my head again this year.  But, this is Witt and I get the feeling Bill Brown will have his young team playing well come conference action.  And as DC noted, Witt's next 3 games are definitely winnable and should tell us a lot about where Witt's season is headed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: all day quads on December 09, 2008, 11:59:30 AM
a little late with the post....but Allegheny with a good start in conference with a road win @ Denison.  POY canidate George Raftis led the way wit 25 pts and 8 boards on 9-12 shooting.  The kids a beast and is the reason Allegheny will compete for the conference title this year.

As far as people saying that they dont have a winning record at 3-4, 2 of their loses came to D-II powerhouse Gannon and D-1 Youngstown St.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 09, 2008, 03:43:38 PM
I'm a little late arriving to the hoops party, but here I am...armed with a backlog of opinions...let's do it rapid fire style! 

- Re: Witt/Cedarville...I'm pretty staunchly opposed to playing games outside of the division because they don't count and it's a wasted opportunity for two teams to put a D-III (and preferably regional) game on the resumé.  The harm done is certainly less when we have 20 games to play around with as opposed to just 10 in football, I still think we should be looking to eliminate the non-divisionals from our schedules as much as possible. 

- My early feel for the NCAC tells me that Wooster, despite obviously not being what they were last year or in years prior, are the favorites.  This would have been a great year for somebody new to step up and take the crown, but unfortunately the only team that looks like a real challenger to the Scots is Kenyon and I'm not convinced that Kenyon is ready to break from their middle of the pack mold.  You know Bill Brown will have his guys primed for February as well. 

- My early feel for Wabash (who I ashamedly have not seen play yet...to be remedied this weekend at the Pete Thorn NAIA Invitational) is telling me that the LGs are a perimeter oriented team which makes me nervous.  In their last two games, both losses to decent teams on the road, Wabash shot themselves in the foot...maybe not an appropriate turn of phrase as Wabash couldn't shoot at all, particularly in the first half.  I'm not sure the LGs have the jump shooters to win games on a consistent basis from outside the paint.  Aaron Brock is going to draw everybody's attention in the paint...Brian Maloney and freshman Nick Curosh are going to have have some offensive presence in the post.   

- Bad for the LGs...turnovers.  Egads Wabash is not taking care of the ball at all this year.  Good for the LGs...free throws.  In particular the free throw shooting of Wes Smith which is way way way up over his numbers from a year ago.  Wesley converting his freebies is critical for a guy that will spend a lot of time at the line. 

- Allegheny is also on the watch list...they've got some beef parked in the painted area. 

I'm very much looking forward to January and getting the conference season going.  I think we'll have an interesting race even if we do end up with similar results...I believe the NCAC games will be a bit more competitive across the board than they have been recently. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 09, 2008, 05:22:39 PM
Congratulations to this week's NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html), Kenyon sophomore guard J.T. Knight.  J.T.'s 20-10-5 performance against Wabash helped his team to a key early victory in the NCAC race.  Congratulations, J.T.!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 09, 2008, 10:03:00 PM
Tonight's score:
Allegheny 89, Thiel 78
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 10, 2008, 11:01:10 AM
As I was perusing this week's top 25, something caught my attention.  There are only 2 teams ranked in the top 25 from the GL Region!  :o  There's Capital at #10 and CMU at #13 and that's it!  Not even any in the ORV section of the poll.  I must say, I can't recall when the GL Region was ever this poorly represented in the d3hoops poll.

We've just grown accustomed to seeing the traditional GL powers like Wooster, Witt, Hope and Calvin as well as the likes of JCU, B-WC and Ohio Northern and they are all missing from the poll so far this year.  It just seems strange for the GL Region to be so down this year.  After all, this region has had a representative in Salem every year dating back to 2000.  Could that streak be in jeopardy this year?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 10, 2008, 11:01:07 PM
Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 95  Kenyon 59

Wow, I didn't expect a complete blowout in this game and it was clearly over at halftime (52-25).  Kyle Holliday led the Bishops with 22 points and Brent Pleiman added 11 points.  The Lords only shot 38% from the floor and had 24 turnovers.

Here is the link to the game story: http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/mbb1210.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 10, 2008, 11:08:29 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 10, 2008, 11:01:10 AM
As I was perusing this week's top 25, something caught my attention.  There are only 2 teams ranked in the top 25 from the GL Region!  :o  There's Capital at #10 and CMU at #13 and that's it!  Not even any in the ORV section of the poll.  I must say, I can't recall when the GL Region was ever this poorly represented in the d3hoops poll.

We've just grown accustomed to seeing the traditional GL powers like Wooster, Witt, Hope and Calvin as well as the likes of JCU, B-WC and Ohio Northern and they are all missing from the poll so far this year.  It just seems strange for the GL Region to be so down this year.  After all, this region has had a representative in Salem every year dating back to 2000.  Could that streak be in jeopardy this year?

Capital will give it a go.........No doubts about the GL having to go through at least a couple Midwest Region teams to get to Salem.

Forget what year, but it wasn't that long ago the GL Region only had 4 teams in the whole tournamant.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2008, 11:31:04 PM
Tonight in the NCAC, a couple of real nailbiters ::):
Wittenberg 74, Denison 45
OWU 95, Kenyon 59
In non-conference action:
Hiram 66, Grove City 56
Kalamazoo 73, Oberlin 46
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
At the Pam Smith Center, Bill Brown tinkered with his lineup and produced a 50% shooting night which included 8 three-pointers, and Witt smoked the Big Red.  The Tigers led by 21 at the half on the strength of a +10 rebound advantage and 52% shooting (46% from the arc), while holding Denison to just 26% and 10 turnovers (33% and 20, by game's end).  Kevin Murray led three Tigers in double figures with 14, while DU's leading scorer, Chris Luther, could manage just 9 points.  Recap (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/gamestories/08-09gamestories/denison.html); box (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/08-09statistics/witm1210.htm).

At Branch Rickey Arena, to coin a phrase, "it was the best of times, it was the worst of times."  The Bishops played brilliantly right from the start, which neatly meshed with the "egregiously bad basketball" turned in by the Lords, resulting in a game that was pretty well decided in about 15 minutes of play.  This game was so one-sided that OWU's second half 26-0 run was not meaningful to the outcome.  Like the Witt/DU game, the relevant box score would be from the first half (won by OWU 52-25), but alackaday! neither school published a 1st half box.  For the evening, which ended for most varsity-level players at about the 10:00 point of the 2nd half, OWU shot 49% (56% in the 1st half) and drained 14 three-pointers (42%), many of them wide open as a result of superior ball movement (with some crappy defense thrown in).  Kenyon managed to shoot 41% in the first half, but due to a gaggle of turnovers (many forced, some unforced) they had 11 fewer chances at the hoop than their better-shooting rivals.  The Lords coughed the ball up 24 times on the evening, 15 of those being steals by the aggressive Bishops defense.  Kyle Holliday torched the nets for 22 points, draining five of seven attempts from the arc, in his 24 minutes, and was not whistled for a single personal foul (he had been averaging 4 per game and fouled out of his last two games.)  Bryan Yelvington had 13 for Kenyon, but the only Lords who played well were the end-of-the-bench guys who produced a game-ending 30-17 run over the final 11 minutes (that's right, math majors; the score had been 78-29.)  Recap (http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/mbb1210.html); box (http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/owum1210.htm).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 11, 2008, 06:39:00 AM
I absolutely don't know what to make of the OWU-Kenyon score.  Up here, Wooster made OWU look bad.  Is Kenyon really that much worse?  The Lords downed Wabash by 15; where does that put them in this mix? 

I've watched Kyle Holliday play for about eight years (seems that long).  He's a very physical player, to say the least.  For him to not once be whistled makes me wonder a bit, or a lot.

 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2008, 10:18:51 AM
I wouldn't spend too much time on the "comparative scores" game.  I watched the Wooster/OWU game on the web, and saw the Kenyon/OWU game in person, and these were two completely different OWU teams.  I've seen five or six OWU games this year, and these were easily their worst and then best performances, respectively.  I don't think it says much about Kenyon beyond "they're not quite there yet," although it will be interesting to see how well and quickly their bruised egos will recover.  There may be psychological barriers at play, too: Wooster is the one team that OWU can't seem to beat, while Kenyon hasn't beaten the Bishops in a dog's age.

It's not so much that Holliday was getting away with non-calls as that everyone was getting away with non-calls.  One of the keys to the game was that Kenyon did not take advantage of the free-for-all officiating by backing down their defenders in the post, while OWU did take advantage by playing right in the faces of the Kenyon guards (again, 15 steals!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 11, 2008, 02:20:03 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 11, 2008, 10:18:51 AM
I wouldn't spend too much time on the "comparative scores" game.  I watched the Wooster/OWU game on the web, and saw the Kenyon/OWU game in person, and these were two completely different OWU teams.  I've seen five or six OWU games this year, and these were easily their worst and then best performances, respectively. 
This score totally caught me by surprise.  Kenyon seemed poised to take the next step after their big win over Wabash last weekend, but instead they ended up tripping over themselves and falling flat on their faces.  And OWU did what they had to do to put that forgettable performance at Wooster behind them.

As far as making the argument that this was two completely different OWU teams, I think Wooster's defense had a lot to do with making OWU look like a completely different team.  I don't think it's being fair to Wooster's defensive effort they put forth to just chalk it up as OWU having an off night or playing their worst game of the season.

Statistically speaking, one could argue that the Bishop's game against Wheaton was their worst game of the season.  OWU shot only 35% in that game compared to just 37% vs. Wooster and they had only one fewer turnover against Wheaton than they did against Wooster.  What these stats tell me is that both Wheaton and Wooster shut OWU down with defense as opposed to OWU just having off nights...

Now, I'm not saying that OWU isn't capable of playing better.  I just feel that Wooster had a lot to do with OWU having an off night.  I am still expecting the Bishops to give Wooster all they can handle when they meet again in Delaware at the end of January as Coach Moore alluded to in his comments in the DR following Saturday's game:

Quote from: Wooster Daily Record and Coach Steve MooreDespite the good feeling in the Wooster locker room, Moore cautioned that Ohio Wesleyan will still be a team to reckon with.

"Things went well for us and it was not their night, but that's a good team," Moore said. "They'll give us a game the next time."

But I will also say this.  If Wooster can bring the same defensive performance they brought last Saturday, should we expect another 'off' night from the Bishops?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 11, 2008, 04:19:10 PM
I've been to two Wooster-at-OWU games and both times (a loss and a win) came away feeling Wooster got the short end of the officiating.  OWU (now, this is when they had RuddyGear, Jean, and that other big guy) was able to be very physical while Wooster was unable to lay a hand on anyone.  If that happens again this year, and I have no reason to expect things to change in that "inside-of-a-cello" that they call a gym, it will be a game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2008, 04:25:30 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 11, 2008, 02:20:03 PMAs far as making the argument that this was two completely different OWU teams, I think Wooster's defense had a lot to do with making OWU look like a completely different team.  I don't think it's being fair to Wooster's defensive effort they put forth to just chalk it up as OWU having an off night or playing their worst game of the season.
I don't believe that's what I said.  I said that OWU's performance at Wooster was their worst of the games I've seen (I wasn't at Wheaton), and I stand by that.  It is possible for one team to play well and the other to play poorly in the same game, and for these to be independent.  (Last night's game was a perfect example of this.)  At Wooster, OWU missed open shots, made bad passes and foolish decisions, committed silly fouls, etc.  They also were stymied by an excellent defense.  Wooster won that game as much or more than OWU lost it.  But in my opinion OWU played a poor game.  From your quote, it sounds like Steve Moore might agree with me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2008, 10:17:46 PM
Last night:  Allegheny 84, Penn St.-New Kensington 42...PSUNK lost their first five games by an average of 38 ppg, then they stopped keeping track (http://www.nk.psu.edu/StudentLife/Athletics/28376.htm?cn25).  Still, a win is a win.
Tonight: Alma 76, Oberlin 51...Alma's first victory of the season.  Oberlin head coach Isaiah Cavaco: “We are in a bad funk right now.” (http://www.goyeo.com/news/2008/12/12/MBB_1212084355.aspx?tab=)
Also tonight, Wabash plays St. Joseph Calumet in the Pete Thorn Invitational.  I am hopeful that we'll get a report from a LG fan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 13, 2008, 11:04:09 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 12, 2008, 10:17:46 PM
Last night:  Allegheny 84, Penn St.-New Kensington 42...PSUNK lost their first five games by an average of 38 ppg...
Maybe New Kensington should insert a 't' between the S and the U...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 13, 2008, 04:55:01 PM
Final from Chadwick Court:

Marian 74
Wabash 62


The LGs came out seriously cold leading to as much as a 15 point lead for Marian. Chase Haltom caught fire toward the end of the first half and Wabash made it a more workable 7 point deficit at halftime. Unfortunately Wabash never got closer than that in the 2nd half.

Wes Smith led the LGs in scoring with 18 points, Haltom had 12, Brock and Maloney each grabbed 7 boards.

Next game for Wabash is a week from today at Rose-Hulman.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 13, 2008, 06:09:36 PM
I'm finally getting back around to the boards and catching up- should see Wooster for the first time tonight via the live video feed.  Anyway, while I was waiting for that I was checking in on some other NCAC action, and there's a bit of a surprise out there:

Hiram 80, Wittenberg 77 Final, according to the Witt website. 

It just ended, so no link to a game story or box score yet.  Hiram moves to 5-2 (1-0) and Wittenberg falls to 2-5 (1-1).

EDIT: Game story here. (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/gamestories/08-09gamestories/hiram.html)  Hiram's first win against Wittenberg since the Terriers joined the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 13, 2008, 09:45:27 PM
Final in Overtime:  Wooster 74  Albion 66

Wooster had too many turnovers (21) >:(  ...and a long scoring drought near the end of regulation that resulted in this game going to overtime.  Scots led 53-38 and then Albion outscored them 20-5 to force the OT.  Wooster only shot 40% from the floor tonight but they had a massive 57-42 rebounding and they made 11 three pointers as key factors in the victory.

Wooster was led tonight by Justin Hallowell with 17 points, Nathan Balch with 15 points, Ian Franks with 11 points and Bryan Wickliffe with 9 points, 15 rebounds.

Albion was led by Drew Yancey with 14 points, J.C. Cruse with 11 points and Dave Elliott with 10 points.

Wooster is now 5-3. :)  Next up is Hawaii-Hilo in the land of palm trees. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 13, 2008, 10:18:22 PM
All the 12/13 Final Scores:
Denison 62  Wash & Jeff 59  nice road win for the Big Red
Mt. Vernon Nazarene 88  Kenyon 53
Marian 74  Wabash 62
Hiram 80  Wittenberg 77
Wooster 74  Albion 66 OT

Current Records (overall, NCAC):
Hiram 5-2, 1-0
Wooster 5-3, 2-0
Kenyon 5-3, 1-1
Allegheny 5-4, 1-0
Ohio Wesleyan 4-3, 1-1
Wabash 3-4, 0-1
Wittenberg 2-5, 1-1
Denison 2-6, 0-2
Oberlin 2-7, 0-2
Earlham 1-6, 1-0

Note: sorted by overall wins
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2008, 11:13:50 PM
Denison beats W&J, who beat both Wooster and Kenyon...
Albion forces OT at Wooster after losing to both OWU and Kenyon...
Hiram beats Witt and has the best overall record in the league...
:o
What a crazy year we have on our hands!

I'm judging on just one game, but it looks like Wittenberg will sorely miss Gregg Hill.  This afternoon at Price Gym, Kevin Murray was the only Tiger who could be relied upon to make a good attempt from outside 10 feet.  He was pretty effective, scoring 20 on 8-of-13 shooting (3/6 from the arc), but they really need a second shooter to take the pressure off of the posts.  The post players, Snyder, Brandt, Black, and sometimes Lee, generally got a fairly easy bucket when the guards could get them the ball (collectively 10 for 14), but since Hiram's cadre of athletic 6'4"-ish guards and wings (Roberts, Muhammad, Eniola, and Wiegand) didn't have to worry about those guards shooting, they could concentrate on denying the entry pass.  On the other end, Hiram plays a little like OWU in that they don't really have a back-to-the-basket post (Hebeisen and Pfouts try, but they're no match for Witt's big men inside), but they have good outside shooters (Russo, Roberts, and Wiegand combined for 9-of-16 shooting from the arc) and good slashers to the hoop (Roberts, Eniola, Muhammad).  Hiram led virtually the entire game, benefitting from slow starts to each half (11-2 and 8-2) by the Tigers.  The only time Witt got the lead, 33-32 with about 5:30 left in the 1st, it was almost immediately erased by a three-pointer from Russo followed by another by Roberts. 

Still, Witt never gave up and fought their way back from a 12-point deficit midway through the second, and got within 2 a couple of times down the stretch, the latest being on a Murray trey with :17 left.  Hiram broke the Witt press, causing Mark Snyder to foul out by grabbing Chris Roberts with :07 left.  Roberts, who finished with 19 points, missed the front end, but David Nowicki's three with :03 left was errant.  Another foul, and Deon Milton made one of two, giving Witt one last chance with :01.2 left, down three.  Hiram may as well have put all five guys on Murray, since he was the only threat, but instead they went man-to-man, and not only was Witt able to get Murray the ball at the halfcourt line, but his defender promptly fell down, giving Murray an open shot from about 27'...but it came up short, and Hiram had a big win.  Box (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/hirm1213.htm).

This was my first-ever trip to Price Gym a/k/a the Terrier Dome.  You can add Hiram to the list on schools that doesn't charge admission--good for them.  It's a nice enough gym, well lit and with nice old amenities (such as the hardwood ceiling).  They've got banners up for each school in the conference, which is a conference-pride element that I appreciate; I wish every school did this, but at least Wooster, Kenyon, and OWU don't.  Denison does, and I noticed on a videocast from Witt this week that they have them too, although I think that's new.  I've still never been to Allegheny, Oberlin, Earlham, or Wabash, but I may yet get to one or two of these this season.

I made it back to Wooster in time for the Woo/Albion game, about which the less said (by me), the better.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on December 14, 2008, 12:53:20 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 13, 2008, 11:13:50 PM

This was my first-ever trip to Price Gym a/k/a the Terrier Dome.  You can add Hiram to the list on schools that doesn't charge admission--good for them.  It's a nice enough gym, well lit and with nice old amenities (such as the hardwood ceiling).  They've got banners up for each school in the conference, which is a conference-pride element that I appreciate; I wish every school did this, but at least Wooster, Kenyon, and OWU don't.  Denison does, and I noticed on a videocast from Witt this week that they have them too, although I think that's new.  I've still never been to Allegheny, Oberlin, Earlham, or Wabash, but I may yet get to one or two of these this season.


Get to Earlham then...banners for all of the NCAC schools and free admission. Of course, the four hour drive might make the chance to save $5 and see a Wooster banner above a basket seem so appealing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 15, 2008, 11:53:02 AM
After a weekend chock full of Christmas decorating and childrens programs, I finally have some time to discuss the happenings of the weekend.

First off, the Wooster game which I was able to catch on tape delay.  Nice win for Wooster although I wasn't happy with the way they had to win.  Twenty one turnovers is just inexcusable.  Give Albion credit.  They played some tough man to man defense and seemed to really bother the Scots.  I think finals week had something to do with Wooster's lethargic look at times as well and maybe thoughts of the warm beaches in Hawaii...   

Wooster was very fortunate to come out on top of this one.  With two in-region losses already, a loss Saturday would have been a big blow.  Especially in the manner in which it would have occurred.  But give the Scots credit for flipping the switch in OT and finishing off the Britons once and for all...

And then there was the Witt shocker!  :o  Can the Wittenberg consecutive winning season streak watch begin yet?  I know I said earlier that it was too soon to count Witt out yet, but that was before the Tigers lost to Hiram for the first time in 40 years!

Lastly, there was Denison's rather shocking win at W&J!  W&J is a team that is hard to figure out.  They have quality wins over Wooster, R-MC and Kenyon and then they lose at home to a Denison team that was coming off a 29 point loss to Witt just 3 days earlier?!  Go figure...  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 15, 2008, 12:29:47 PM
Has anyone heard any updates on Brandon Johnson's scheduled return?  I remember reading a couple of weeks ago that he was still planning on returning for the Mose Hole.  Is that target date still on?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 16, 2008, 06:10:11 PM
Congratulations to Allegheny center and all day quads' favorite player, George Raftis, for being named the NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html).  Raftis recorded back-to-back double-doubles against Penn State's Erie and New Kensington campuses, leading the Gators to two wins and a record of 5-4.  Congratualtions, George!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 16, 2008, 10:28:23 PM
Tonight:
Rose-Hulman 76, Earlham 72 (OT)...Rose-Hulman retains the John Mutchner Cup; the Rose radio announcer seems to think this is a very big deal, so I'm agin it.  Tristian Gregory scored 23 and frosh Shane Heidt added 20, but their valiant efforts to wrest the Cup from the clutches of the Terre Hauters were ultimately insufficient.  Recap (http://www.rose-hulman.edu/sports/mbasket/09msum09.htm), posted literally within minutes after the game ended byt the RHIT SID staff...and it was a road game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: all day quads on December 17, 2008, 04:00:04 PM
Thanks for the post David, Raftis is a beast.


The North Coast Athletic Conference selected Allegheny junior George Raftis (Pittsburgh, Pa./Sewickley Academy) as its men's basketball Player of the Week on Monday. During the previous week, Raftis recorded double-doubles in wins over Thiel and Penn State New Kensington.

Against Thiel, he scored 21 points and made 10 rebounds as the Gators won, 89-78. Then, Allegheny defeated New Kensington, 84-42, as Raftis led the way with 20 points and 11 rebounds.

Raftis, a 6-5 forward/center, now has three double-doubles during the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 17, 2008, 11:40:22 PM
FWIW, Hanover nearly knocked off #15 IWU tonight.  Hanover took IWU to OT before falling 76-75.  It took an IWU 3-pointer with 3 seconds remaining for the Titans to escape with the win.  I know the whole comparative score thing doesn't really matter, but it does give us something to talk about considering Wooster waxed Hanover to the tune of 93-61...

For any night owls planning on staying up to follow Wooster's game in Hawaii, it will not be broadcast by WQKT.  Tip-off is scheduled for 2am local time...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on December 18, 2008, 12:20:35 AM
DC,
Any word on why Gregg Hill is out for Witt? It sounds like they miss him badly...

If this has already been addressed, I apologize!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2008, 11:15:42 AM
Quote from: jimmychitwood15 on December 18, 2008, 12:20:35 AM
DC,
Any word on why Gregg Hill is out for Witt? It sounds like they miss him badly...

If this has already been addressed, I apologize!
Gregg has had a bad shoulder for quite some time, and I understand that he aggravated that injury this summer or fall.  I don't really know any more than that, although it is presumed that he is out for the season and may take a medical redshirt and come back next year as a fifth-year senior.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 18, 2008, 11:49:09 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 18, 2008, 11:15:42 AM
Quote from: jimmychitwood15 on December 18, 2008, 12:20:35 AM
DC,
Any word on why Gregg Hill is out for Witt? It sounds like they miss him badly...

If this has already been addressed, I apologize!
Gregg has had a bad shoulder for quite some time, and I understand that he aggravated that injury this summer or fall.  I don't really know any more than that, although it is presumed that he is out for the season and may take a medical redshirt and come back next year as a fifth-year senior.
Didn't he finally have surgery on the shoulder?  I thought he had a choice to not have surgery and try and fight through the pain this season, or go under the knife and miss the season with the possibility of coming back next year with a medical red-shirt...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2008, 03:32:47 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 18, 2008, 11:49:09 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 18, 2008, 11:15:42 AM
Quote from: jimmychitwood15 on December 18, 2008, 12:20:35 AM
DC,
Any word on why Gregg Hill is out for Witt? It sounds like they miss him badly...

If this has already been addressed, I apologize!
Gregg has had a bad shoulder for quite some time, and I understand that he aggravated that injury this summer or fall.  I don't really know any more than that, although it is presumed that he is out for the season and may take a medical redshirt and come back next year as a fifth-year senior.
Didn't he finally have surgery on the shoulder?  I thought he had a choice to not have surgery and try and fight through the pain this season, or go under the knife and miss the season with the possibility of coming back next year with a medical red-shirt...
That may well be the story; I really don't know one way or the other. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2008, 11:46:49 PM
Tonight:
Hiram 74, Bluffton 61...Chris "the Savior" Roberts with 28 points, 7 rebounds, and 3 steals, all game highs.
Franklin at Earhlam, ppd. due to "expected inclement weather" (Hoosiers! ::))...rescheduled for 12/29.
Defiance 80, Ohio Wesleyan 65...For 37 minutes, this was a very good basketball game.  OWU got just enough post defense to keep the taller, more athletic Yellow Jackets from running away, and just enough perimeter offense to keep the game practically tied throughout.  The game was tied on 13 occasions, there were ten lead changes, and the second half was played entirely within a four-point margin...up to the 3:00 mark.  At that time (3:10, to be precise), OWU's Kyle Miller missed a layup in traffic, and during the resulting scrum for the rebound, the ball squirted out to Brent Pleiman, who leaned in and put the ball in the hoop, which would have cut the Defiance lead to one.  However, the bucket was waved off and Pleiman was whistled for a charge, his fourth foul.  It was one of those D3 "player who initiates the contact" type of charges, since there was no earthly way that the defender, who was probably not even aware that Pleiman had the ball, had established a defensive position.  Nevertheless, the momentum went entirely over to Defiance, who scored on their next five possessions en route to scoring the game's last 15 points, establishing the misleading final margin of what actually was a very close game.  Defiance's Anthony Pettaway, every micrometer of 6'8", completely dominated in the 30 minutes he was playing, scoring 16 points, dishing out 6 assists, and ripping down 18 rebounds.  Kyle Holliday led the Bishops with 17, mostly from the arc where he was 4 of 12.  With Defiance in a zone most of the night, with Pettaway neutralizing the paint, OWU was forced to bomb away all night; slightly more than half of their field goal attempts were of the three-point variety, and they were about as effective from outside (29%, 30 points) as from inside (35%, 28 points).  However, they missed their last three treys inside those fateful final three minutes, whereas the visitors made four of their last five (over the last 4:02), and got a stickback on the one they missed.  Box. (http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/owum1218.htm)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 20, 2008, 09:35:01 AM
Final from the Aloha State:

Hawaii-Hilo - 90
Wooster     - 77

Looking at the box score, the game was decided in the first half.  Hilo shot a blistering 57% from the floor compared to Wooster's paltry 34%.  As a result, Wooster trailed 48-35 at the half.  Wooster looks like they played better in the second half as they played the Vulcans even at 42 apiece in the 2nd half.  Wooster's play looks like it improved on both ends of the floor in the second as the scoreboard indicates.  The Scots shot 47% from the floor while holding the Vulcans to 39%. 

It looks like Wooster had foul trouble to contend with as well as they had 3 players foul out.  Bryan Wickliffe fouled out in just 10 minutes of action! :o   Nathan Balch and Ian Franks fouled out as well.  Overall, Wooster was whistled for 11 more fouls (31-20) than Hilo.

Justin Hallowell led Wooster in scoring with another good shooting night.  He finished with 20 points connecting on 4 of 8 from beyond the arc.  Freshman Drew Sawyer had a nice night as well as he was the only other Scot in double figures with 11.  Franks chipped in 9 points while Marty Bidwell and Matt Fegan added 8 apiece.

All in all, this really isn't that unexpected of a result considering Hilo is a D-II scholarship program.  Unfortunately for Wooster, Hilo jumped out early and Wooster looks like they showed up one half too late.

Wooster is now off until after Christmas.  Hopefully, they can get back on their winning ways when they host Thiel in the first round of the Mose Hole Tournament on the 29th. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 20, 2008, 10:07:53 AM
ScotsFan - good summary of the box score.

Just to add a couple of factors in Wooster's loss last night...It is hard to notch a win when you only shoot 41% from the floor, have 20 turnovers and get outrebounded by a 42-36 margin.  I didn't expect Wooster to get a win either but they played a sloppy game and I am not sure how much of this was due to the strength of their opponent.  After all, the Scots did play the Vulcans!  :o ::) ;D

I believe that IMDerekPoe was at the game so perhaps, he can provide a first hand report later.

Mose Hole Classic is next and Mount Union (7-1) may give Wooster a competitive test if they both advance to the championship game.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on December 20, 2008, 10:37:45 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 20, 2008, 09:35:01 AM
Final from the Aloha State:

Hawaii-Hilo - 90
Wooster     - 77

Looking at the box score, the game was decided in the first half.  Hilo shot a blistering 57% from the floor compared to Wooster's paltry 34%.  As a result, Wooster trailed 48-35 at the half.  Wooster looks like they played better in the second half as they played the Vulcans even at 42 apiece in the 2nd half.  Wooster's play looks like it improved on both ends of the floor in the second as the scoreboard indicates.  The Scots shot 47% from the floor while holding the Vulcans to 39%. 

It looks like Wooster had foul trouble to contend with as well as they had 3 players foul out.  Bryan Wickliffe fouled out in just 10 minutes of action! :o   Nathan Balch and Ian Franks fouled out as well.  Overall, Wooster was whistled for 11 more fouls (31-20) than Hilo.

Justin Hallowell led Wooster in scoring with another good shooting night.  He finished with 20 points connecting on 4 of 8 from beyond the arc.  Freshman Drew Sawyer had a nice night as well as he was the only other Scot in double figures with 11.  Franks chipped in 9 points while Marty Bidwell and Matt Fegan added 8 apiece.

All in all, this really isn't that unexpected of a result considering Hilo is a D-II scholarship program.  Unfortunately for Wooster, Hilo jumped out early and Wooster looks like they showed up one half too late.

Wooster is now off until after Christmas.  Hopefully, they can get back on their winning ways when they host Thiel in the first round of the Mose Hole Tournament on the 29th. 

It's very hard to beat those Hawaii D2's (Hilo, Chaminade, Hawaii Pacific are the ones that comes to mind).  I think Wooster's 13-point loss to Hilo was a pretty solid showing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 20, 2008, 10:44:34 AM
Good points wsf.  Those 20 turnovers were definitely a factor in Wooster's loss as well.  That's now 2 straight games where Wooster has committed 20+ turnovers.  They were fortunate to overcome those 21 turnovers vs. Albion, but they couldn't overcome those turnovers against Hilo...

Only being outrebounded by 6 doesn't seem that bad to me.  Especially when Wooster's leading rebounder was riddled with foul trouble and only saw the floor for 10 minutes.

One things for sure, Wooster needs to start taking better care of the basketball.  Maybe Brandon Johnson's return will help in that regard....

Oh, and thanks for the kind words concerning Wooster's performance Bob.  8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2008, 11:27:55 AM
Here's a link to the box score (http://vulcans.uhh.hawaii.edu/uploads/mbk/2008/121908m.htm) on Hilo's website.  I'll point out that Nathan Balch started, with Dustin Geitgey coming off the bench.  Steve Moore doesn't change his starting lineups lightly.  I'll also point out that Robert Melick, whose minutes had been dwindling, has now not played in two straight games.

It's also worth noticing, for those not already aware of this, that of the eleven players that saw action for Wooster, six were frosh and a seventh (Balch) is new to the program this year.  It's not a bad result to stay within 13 points of a D2 team on the road on a vacation-y trip with just one senior and one junior on the floor. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 20, 2008, 12:06:32 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 20, 2008, 11:27:55 AM
It's not a bad result to stay within 13 points of a D2 team on the road on a vacation-y trip with just one senior and one junior on the floor. 
(http://vulcans.uhh.hawaii.edu/uploads/mbk/2008/121908m.htm)
To add to this not being a bad result for Wooster, it appears as though all 5 of Hilo's starters are seniors...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 20, 2008, 12:41:32 PM
Aloha everyone! 

The Scots really didn't play very well last night, as might be expected after a 5 time zone trip and several days at the beach!  As noted, all of the UHH starters were seniors, and they played like it.  The Scots continued to have problems with turnovers, making too many fouls, and having a rough time from the stripe.  As noted, Balch started, but committed 2 quick fouls as did Wickliffe.  Wick's departure really hurt as he started strong on the boards as he has been the past few games.  Both eventually drew their 3rd fouls in the 1st half and also quickly fouled out in the 2nd.  The Scots didn't shoot well and didn't compete well physically with the bigger Vulcan squad.

The highlight of the night was Emily Moore winning a halftime contest to sink a layup, foul shot and 3-pointer in 30 seconds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 20, 2008, 12:49:52 PM
Quote from: Titan Q on December 20, 2008, 10:37:45 AM
It's very hard to beat those Hawaii D2's (Hilo, Chaminade, Hawaii Pacific are the ones that comes to mind).

BYU-Hawaii is the other D2 school in the Aloha State.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 20, 2008, 03:29:27 PM
Balch 5 fouls in 13 minutes.  Wickliffe 5 fouls in 10 minutes.  Sawyer 4 fouls in 11 minutes.  Fegan 4 fouls in 22 minutes.  Pardon me, but I smell a rat.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2008, 07:26:29 PM
Kenyon 72, Kalamazoo 58...recap (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28449.xml); box (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28450.xml).  Lords shoot 53% and hold Hornets to 38%, which was fortunate, since 23 Kenyon turnovers and 12 Kzoo offensive boards led to the Hornets getting off nine more shots than their hosts.

Also...Wabash 68, Rose-Hulman 66...three LGs in double figures, led by a double-double (12/10) by Aaron Brock.  Recap (http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=6551); box (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/docs/basketballstats/200809/wabm1220.htm).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 22, 2008, 07:31:20 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 20, 2008, 03:29:27 PM
Balch 5 fouls in 13 minutes.  Wickliffe 5 fouls in 10 minutes.  Sawyer 4 fouls in 11 minutes.  Fegan 4 fouls in 22 minutes.  Pardon me, but I smell a rat.

Why? Smaller team that doesn't match up physically, gets frustrated, and fouls. Seen it millions of times. The tin foil needs to vanish...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 22, 2008, 07:33:20 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 20, 2008, 07:26:29 PM
Kenyon 72, Kalamazoo 58...recap (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28449.xml); box (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28450.xml).  Lords shoot 53% and hold Hornets to 38%, which was fortunate, since 23 Kenyon turnovers and 12 Kzoo offensive boards led to the Hornets getting off nine more shots than their hosts.



My old HS coach always wanted FEWER FG attempts than the opponent, as long as they had more FT attempts because in his system (patience, patience...) that meant they were successful in waiting for a 'good' shot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 23, 2008, 03:04:34 AM
Capital 89, Kenyon 84...Lords miss 10 free throws, and were -8 at the line (21-13)..Recap (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28452.xml) with box included.
Also...Wittenberg 87, Otterbein 66...Recap (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/gamestories/08-09gamestories/otterbein.html) with box included.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 23, 2008, 11:12:32 AM
Brandon Johnson to red-shirt this year:

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4492183

The main push for Wooster's recruiting will be keeping the players they have now. The Scots only graduate one player (Bidwell), and will add to the team an all-conference and potentially all-region point guard in Johnson and a potential starting center in Gideon Mabeny next season. Add to this that only one junior (Geitgey) is even in the rotation now, and Wooster has to worry about having too many quality players, not too few. While this is a good dilemma to have, this can create problems when trying to establish a set rotation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 23, 2008, 01:46:50 PM
I'm gonna guess that this sets them up rather well for next season.  I'd see Johnson and Franks starting at the guard spots, with Balch getting quite a few minutes spelling both of them.  Playing time for both Fegan and Geitgey would drop.  Hollowell would remain the starting power forward, with Wickliffe the starting center backed up by the learning Mabeny.  The question is who will be the new Bidwell, and for that spot there are a number of choices in Ross, Sawyer, and Evans.  Possible minutes:

Johnson 28
Franks 28
Balch 24
Wickliffe 25
Mabeny 15
Hollowell 26
Sawyer 18
Evans 18
Ross 18

Those are the guys that I see as the major contributors for next season, and a very vague idea of their playing time.  Of course, this doesn't take into account any incoming freshmen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 23, 2008, 05:41:42 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 23, 2008, 01:46:50 PM
I'm gonna guess that this sets them up rather well for next season.  I'd see Johnson and Franks starting at the guard spots, with Balch getting quite a few minutes spelling both of them.  Playing time for both Fegan and Geitgey would drop.  Hollowell would remain the starting power forward, with Wickliffe the starting center backed up by the learning Mabeny.  The question is who will be the new Bidwell, and for that spot there are a number of choices in Ross, Sawyer, and Evans.  Possible minutes:

Johnson 28
Franks 28
Balch 24
Wickliffe 25
Mabeny 15
Hollowell 26
Sawyer 18
Evans 18
Ross 18

Those are the guys that I see as the major contributors for next season, and a very vague idea of their playing time.  Of course, this doesn't take into account any incoming freshmen.

Wooster has the potential to be a very very deep team next season.  WB, you listed 9 players as major contributors.  And you left Geitgey and Fegan out of the mix.  And then there's Terrance Williams.  He hasn't seen much playing time but he's too good to not see the floor some more next year.  With Bidwell now being the only starter graduating this season, there won't be any reloading or rebuilding next year in Wooster to say the least!  8)

While I think Wooster will miss not having Johnson return this year, I am happy to see that he will more than likely be able to return for a full year at 100% next year.  I had been wondering just how effective he would be in returning to play this year and the way the article sounds, he wouldn't have been 100% and I'm sure that weighed heavily into Brandon's decision to scrap this season and return next year. 

Now the Scots will just have to regroup and prepare for the remainder of the season without Johnson.  I still think they have enough to win their 5th NCAC championship in a row without Johnson.  But, not having Johnson certainly brought Wooster a lot closer to the rest of the pack of teams trying to knock off the Scots from their throne!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 23, 2008, 07:15:41 PM
Given the Scots 5-4 start I was wondering if they still could boost this title. I did some checking and with their last loss in Hawaii they have indeed falling behind Amherst (.8495 to .8498). With the loss of Brandon for the season they may still win the conference, but I would expect them to drop at least two additional games that they might not have otherwise, so its a tagline that is probably gone unless Amhest struggles next year and Wooster becomes something special.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 23, 2008, 11:40:51 PM
Quote from: goscots on December 23, 2008, 07:15:41 PM
Given the Scots 5-4 start I was wondering if they still could boost this title. I did some checking and with their last loss in Hawaii they have indeed falling behind Amherst (.8495 to .8498). With the loss of Brandon for the season they may still win the conference, but I would expect them to drop at least two additional games that they might not have otherwise, so its a tagline that is probably gone unless Amhest struggles next year and Wooster becomes something special.

???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 24, 2008, 01:20:58 AM
I think the reference is to this:
QuoteWooster owns the best winning percentage of any NCAA team (all divisions) of the 2000s with a success rate of .859 (232-38).
(Note that the title of goscots' post is "Team of the Decade.")
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 24, 2008, 12:24:24 PM
Ah, OK. Thanks, David.

(I confess that I never look at post headers, because 99.9% of the posts that appear on d3boards.com simply use that particular room's generic post header. F'rinstance, the last post in this room to use a header other than "Re: NCAC" was goscots' post #7741, which he posted last May 14.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 24, 2008, 09:23:16 PM
Happy Holidays to all in the NCAC! This isn't a problem here in Texas, but stay warm!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 28, 2008, 04:04:16 PM
Greensboro 71, Hiram 68 (OT)...Hiram scored just two points over an eight-plus minute span,  from 6:08 in the second (when they led by one) through 2:37 in OT (when they trailed by seven).  They found late life, and had a couple of chances to tie the game late in the OT, but came up short.  Chris Roberts led the Pups with 23 points and 7 rebounds.  Box. (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/hirm1228.htm)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2008, 08:15:31 PM
At the Half:   Wooster 41  Thiel 28

Wooster took control of the game in the last 5 minutes of the half.  Scots led 28-24 and then went on a 7-0 run to stretch out the lead.

Wooster is being led by Greg Ross with 8 points, Justin Hallowell with 7 points, Nathan Balch with 7 points while Drew Sawyer and Ian Franks each have chipped in 6 points.  Greg Ross got the start tonight replacing Bryan Wickliffe who is out with the flu.

Tomcats are being led by Nick Sefscik with 10 points.  Scots should be able to secure this victory over a Thiel squad that is only 1-7 on the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2008, 09:16:45 PM
Final:  Wooster 82  Thiel 63

Wooster was led in scoring by Drew Sawyer who had a big night with 18 points (8 of 10 FGs), Nathan Balch with 16 points, Greg Ross with 10 points and Justin Hallowell with 9 points.  Sawyer should get some extra playing time after tonight's performance and Nathan Balch now appears to be a starter (2nd consecutive start tonight).  Scots shot 51% from the floor tonight and had only 12 turnovers compared to 23 turnovers for Thiel.

Thiel Tomcats (now 1-8) were led by Nick Sefscik with 21 points (5 three pointers) and Keebo Dowe with 15 points.

Wooster will next play a good Mt. Union team that knocked off Kean University (NJ) 78-70 in tonight's opening game.  Purple Raiders are led by their top scoring guard Chris Switzer who had 29 points tonight (7 three pointers!).  I wonder if Marty Bidwell might be guarding Switzer tomorrow night? :P ::)  Mt. Union is now 9-1 on the season including 3-1 in the OAC but they have not yet played Capital or Ohio Northern which may be the top two teams in that conference this year.

Wooster is now 6-4 on the season. :)  Should be a good Mose Hole championship game tomorrow night.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2008, 09:42:26 PM
Other 12/29 NCAC Final Scores:

Ohio Wesleyan 67  Manchester (IN) 60  at CWRU tourney
Guilford (NC) 73  Hiram 70  good road effort by Terriers who lose narrowly to a 7-2 team
Taylor Univ. (IN) 58  Wittenberg 56   at Witt tourney
Salem State (MA) 95  Denison 85
Franklin 84  Earlham 70  from the road team's website (ummm...Franklin of course)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 30, 2008, 01:01:25 PM
Wow.  Witt loses again?  That loss to Taylor breaks a string of 25 consecutive years since Witt lost in the semi's of their Zimmerman Tournament!  :o  I love how Witt's game recap tries to spin the loss by saying how it was Taylor's 7th win of the season.  What they failed to mention is that Taylor also has 9 losses...  :-\

Looking ahead to tonight's matchup between Wooster and MUC, I am really looking forward to seeing whether or not MUC is actually for real.  One thing is for sure and that is Chris Switzer looks to be for real.  His 7-11 performance from downtown last night really has me worried as Wooster seems to struggle at defending the perimeter this year and it continued last night as they allowed Nick Sefscik of Thiel to go off with a 5-7 performance from beyond the arc.

IMHO, Wooster will need a better overall performance than what they put forth last night to beat MUC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2008, 01:55:45 PM
Fans going to the Wooster/MUC game may be interested to know that MUC's starting guard Dave Pellerite is the elder brother of OWU winger Pat Pellerite.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 30, 2008, 05:40:41 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 30, 2008, 01:55:45 PM
Fans going to the Wooster/MUC game may be interested to know that MUC's starting guard Dave Pellerite is the elder brother of OWU winger Pat Pellerite.
I knew I had heard that name before...  :P

Also, MUC's starting forward, Jay Mathis, is the elder brother of COW tight end Jon Mathis...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 30, 2008, 10:35:25 PM
Final from Timken tonight:

Wooster - 80
MUC - 61

Wooster was led in scoring by the tournament Defensive MVP, Ian Franks with 21 points including a perfect 13-13 from the charity stripe.  Tournament MVP, Justin Hallowell chipped in 19 including 5-8 from beyond the arc.  All in all, five Scots hit double figures including Matt Fegan with 11, Nathan Balch with 10 and Drew Sawyer had another solid outing filling in for Wickliffe with 10.

MUC actually outshot Wooster tonight to the tune of 45% to 43% but Wooster really clamped down on their perimeter defense limiting MUC to just 17% (3-18) from deep while the Scots made 11-23 for 48%.  Franks' defensive effort on MUC's leading scorer and 3 point shooter, Chris Switzer was a thing of beauty to watch.  Switzer came into the night averaging just shy of 20 ppg. while shooting almost 44% from deep and Franks clamped down defensively to hold him to just 6 points on 2-11 shooting and 1-5 from downtown.

Wooster also dominated on the glass to the tune of 43-28 including 15-6 on the offensive glass!

And lastly and most surprisingly, Wooster actually had an outstanding night at the ft line going 15-16.  Their only miss on the night was Greg Ross' miss on the front end of a one & one in the 2nd half.  MUC on the other hand was a horrid 10-20.  Switzer came into the game 17-17 from the line on the season and he missed his first 3 ft's of the night.

All in all, this was a much, much better performance on both ends of the floor tonight for the Scots, save from about midway through the first half where Wooster went ice cold and  allowed MUC to come all the way back from a 12 point defecit to pull within 4 at the half.  But, Wooster always seemed to hit the big shot when they needed to, and I think Wooster's depth and the pace of the game really started to take it's toll on the Purple Raiders and then MUC compounded things when they began to unravel and lose their composure to add to their demise in the 2nd half as Wooster pulled away down the stretch.

Wooster is now off until a week from tomorrow when they travel to Gambier for a key NCAC matchup with up and coming Kenyon for their only meeting of the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 30, 2008, 10:46:41 PM
Other scores:

CWRU - 78
OWU - 68

Ugly loss for the Bishops...  ???

Witt - 82
MSJ - 75

Witt avoids going winless in their Holiday tournament

Wabash - 73
Franklin - 68

Denison - 74
Nichols - 59
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2008, 11:11:32 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 30, 2008, 10:46:41 PM
Other scores:

CWRU - 78
OWU - 68

Ugly loss for the Bishops...  ???

Sheesh.  I hereby recuse myself from making any more comments on OWU's place in the conference race this season.  They are just too tough to figure out--great one day and crummy the next.  Unless some Case chemistry professor (http://www2.powercom.net/~fredmac/images/abs.jpg) has invented a substance that allows the Spartans to sail unimpeded around the gym, this is one terrible loss for the Bishops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2008, 11:33:02 PM
Just back from Timken and I think that ScotsFan gave a very nice summary of the Wooster victory.  A few other observations that I would add...

Coach Moore made a key substitution midway through the second half when Wooster's offense had stagnated and Mt. Union had closed the Scots lead to 1 point (50-49).  Moore recognized the need for an offensive spark and he reinserted both Nathan Balch and Justin Hallowell.  They promptly each hit a three point shot...suddenly the Wooster lead was 7 points (56-49)  ;) and the Purple Raiders never got the lead to less than 4 points after that juncture.

How do you stop a 6'7" guy from draining three pointers in D3 basketball? ;D  It is a very difficult task as Mount discovered tonight when Hallowell hit 5 of them and rightly earned the MVP award for the tournament.

Drew Sawyer could have made the all tournament team as well with a near double double tonight (10 points, 9 boards) following his 18 point effort last night.  He is probably the most athletic player on the Wooster squad and he is clearly earning more playing time with his hustle.

Matt Fegan had another strong performance with 3 three pointers (11 points) and a beautiful assist to Greg Ross for an easy layup.  He looks more comfortable with his shot and ball handling with every game played.

As ScotsFan noted, major kudos to Ian Franks for his defensive work on Switzer and Marty Bidwell picked up the challenge whenever Franks was out of the game.

Wooster's perimeter defense was superb tonight as Mt. Union entered this game shooting 43% as a team from the three point arc (key reason for their 9-1 record) and the Scots held them to only 3 of 18.

Scots got 10 more shots than Mt. Union tonight mostly because of their rebounding advantage already noted by Scotsfan.

Wooster is now 7-4, 2-0 NCAC.  :)  Let's knock off the Lords in Gambier on 1/7.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 31, 2008, 12:07:22 AM
One other thought - 7 first year players (6 frosh plus Balch as a transfer) saw playing time for the Scots tonight and these first year players accounted for 70% of Wooster's total points.  Note that Bryan Wickliffe missed another game with the flu tonight.

It is a real credit to the Wooster coaching staff that this mostly new team is already playing well as an unit and much improved from the start of the season.  The future looks very bright for Wooster if these first year players continue to improve as the season progresses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 31, 2008, 08:45:43 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 31, 2008, 12:07:22 AM
One other thought - 7 first year players (6 frosh plus Balch as a transfer) saw playing time for the Scots tonight and these first year players accounted for 70% of Wooster's total points.  Note that Bryan Wickliffe missed another game with the flu tonight.

It is a real credit to the Wooster coaching staff that this mostly new team is already playing well as an unit and much improved from the start of the season.  The future looks very bright for Wooster if these first year players continue to improve as the season progresses.
It is amazing to me that Wooster has this many freshmen or first year players making such significant contributions to this team.  And I am even more amazed at the level of play these first year players are showing.  I think when you look at this recruiting class, this has to be arguably one of Wooster's best in both talent and depth.

Also, as I was reading Witt's game recap from their win over MSJ, I noticed they had a Springfield South product with the last name of Cooper.  Any chance he's related to James?  His name is Michael Cooper and he's a freshman and he's Witt's 2nd leading scorer so far this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 31, 2008, 09:27:48 AM
Leave it to Witt to sneak a former Los Angeles Laker into DIII basketball.  Kudos to Cooper himself, though, who at 53 apparently still has some game left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 31, 2008, 12:12:49 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 31, 2008, 08:45:43 AM
Also, as I was reading Witt's game recap from their win over MSJ, I noticed they had a Springfield South product with the last name of Cooper.  Any chance he's related to James?  His name is Michael Cooper and he's a freshman and he's Witt's 2nd leading scorer so far this season.
Michael and James are not related.  Michael was a wide receiver on the football team, and now that he's fully in "basketball shape," the Witt folks are very high on him.  From what I've seen, he's a good player with plenty of potential, part of Witt's large and talented freshman class.  With the numerous frosh at Witt and Wooster, it looks like the "Big 2" may reassert their NCAC dominance in the coming years after a couple of years of relative parity.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2009, 12:44:17 AM
Allegheny 89, Earlham 78...
Quote from: Allegheny press release with emphasis addedMEADVILLE, Pa. - Craig Devinney (Allison Park, Pa./Shaler) led five different Gator scorers in doubt figures, finishing with 22 points -- including 17 in the second half -- and six steals, as the Allegheny women's basketball team defeated Earlham, 89-78, in North Coast Athletic Conference action.
Devinney seems to be recovering well from his her operation.  :D Recap. (http://www.allegheny.edu/cgi-bin/mt/mt-view.cgi/5/entry/9217/menbb_entry)
Hiram 80, Wabash 72...Chris Roberts (8 points, 4 assists) was off his game, and Ian Pfouts (14 points, 5 boards) was clearly under the weather, which accounts for the closer-than-expected final margin.  ;)  As they did against Wittenberg, Hiram took control of the game's pace from the outset, scoring 10 of the game's first 12 points and leaving the Little Giants wondering what hit them.  A Nick Russo three-pointer gave the Terriers a 12-point lead with 10:44 left in the first, and Wabash couldn't get the margin back to single digits until there were less than 9 minutes left in the contest.  Hiram hit 55% of their first-half shots, including 8 threes, to open up an 18-point halftime lead.  Wabash couldn't get anything going in the opening half, hitting just 30% of their shots (Chase Haltom missed his first five treys, all of which were from 24' or beyond), being outrebounded by 7, and generally getting outhustled on both ends.  Wes Smith came alive early in the second half, single-handedly bringing the LGs back into the game.  He scored 16 points and grabbed 7 boards in just over 10 minutes, cutting the Hiram lead to 8 with 8:53 left, but Hiram doubled him up the rest of the way, limiting him to just a late free throw.  (Smith ended up with 19 points and 11 boards, game highs in both categories.)  Wabash kept whittling away at the lead, cutting it to 5 with 1:24 left, but then they seemed to panic and chucked up a couple of off-balance threes, fouling quickly on the rebound.  Hiram, thus fortified with a seven-point lead and only 0:47 to kill off, held off the visitors with seven free throws down the stretch.  Wabash falls to 0-2 with what amounts to a must-win game tomorrow afternoon at Allegheny.  Hiram moves into the conference lead (with Wooster and 'Gheny) at 2-0 and hosts Earlham tomorrow.  Box. (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/hirm0102.htm)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 03, 2009, 10:49:32 AM
Hiram looks to be making a serious challenge at a top 4 finish in the league, having already beaten the #2 and #4 teams as voted by the pre-season media and coaches polls.  It will be interesting to see how they build off of these wins as the conference schedule progresses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2009, 12:50:58 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 03, 2009, 10:49:32 AM
Hiram looks to be making a serious challenge at a top 4 finish in the league, having already beaten the #2 and #4 teams as voted by the pre-season media and coaches polls.  It will be interesting to see how they build off of these wins as the conference schedule progresses.
I was discussing that with a coach who was scouting the game, and we agreed that this is likely Hiram's best chance to make a run at a league title.  The stars are arranged about as well as they could be: Hiram has its best team in years, while Wabash and OWU are struggling and Witt and Wooster are rebuilding.  (Kenyon is in a similar position.)  Hiram winning the conference may still be a longshot, but if it's ever going to happen, this is the season.

Just think where they'd be if Mike Staley hadn't transferred.  He's averaging 15.6 points and 6.6 assists per game for Adrian.  His A/TO is 2.1, and he's scored 84 points in his last four games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 03, 2009, 07:50:10 PM
First, the Buzzsaw that is the Arizona Cardinals wins an NFL playoff game, and now there's talk on the board that Hiram could be a legit contender in the NCAC.

Next, you'll tell me cats and dogs will be living together...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 03, 2009, 08:07:17 PM
Wabash gets a split of their biannual eastern swing with a 58-56 win at Allegheny this afternoon.  Chase Haltom hit two three pointers in the last 20 seconds to tie the score and then give Wabash the lead.  Following the go ahead basket, Allegheny induced a foul on the inbound pass.  Both free throws were made even though the second one was to be missed intentionally.  Not weird enough, yet?  It turns out that Allegheny decided to use a sixth man during the foul shots.  The points stayed on the board, but a technical foul was assessed and that was how the game ended.  Strange stuff for sure. 

Based on what I've seen and heard of Wabash hoops this season, Wabash would be a heck of a team if they bothered to play the first half of their games.  Time and again Wabash struggles to score points in the first half, digs themselves a massive hole, and then spends the second half crawling back.  Sometimes it works out (see the win vs. Franklin on 12/30) and sometimes it doesn't (see losses to Hiram, Kenyon, DePauw). 

It would seem that the league title is up for grabs...there are no dominant teams in our league this season.  Hopefully the LGs will find some consistency in the first half of their games and make a serious run.  If it's going to happen, it'll have to start at Chadwick Court vs. Wooster on 1/10. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 03, 2009, 10:54:06 PM
Final:  Hiram 85  Earlham 70

No surprise in this final score as Hiram improves to 8-4 overall and 3-0 in the NCAC.

Quakers fall to 1-10 and 1-2 in the NCAC.  Hiram was led in scoring by Andrew Weigand, a freshman guard who had 16 points and here is the link to the game story: http://news.hiram.edu/?p=2080
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 03, 2009, 11:09:21 PM
Two more NCAC Scores:

Kenyon 94  Case Western Reserve 85  OT
Bryan Yelvington led the Lords (7-4, 1-1 NCAC) with 29 points and here is the game story link: http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28463.xml

Wittenberg 68  Oberlin 49
Kevin Murray led the Tigers with 25 points.  Witt is now 5-6, 2-1 NCAC and here is the link to the game story: http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/gamestories/08-09gamestories/oberlin.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2009, 11:22:49 PM
Despite the fact that Case Western couldn't miss from outside the arc (or so it seemed; 56.5% on the evening), the overtime at Kenyon was only made necessary by KC's horrendous free throw shooting...nine for twenty-one during regulation.  They had to go 10 of 12 in the OT just to bring their total for the game to a disreputable 57.6%.  Those planning to attend Wednesday's Wooster/Kenyon showdown may want to bring air sickness bags with them.  :) Other than that, Kenyon played a pretty good game, with 51% shooting, 22 assists on 31 hoops, just nine turnovers, and stalwart defense inside the arc, where Case was just 16 of 36 (44%) and had four shots blocked. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 05, 2009, 11:11:58 PM
On the strength of his MVP performance at the Mose Hole Classic, Wooster frosh Justin Hallowell today was named the NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html).  Hallowell scored 28 points in the two games, shooting 9 for 16 overall and 7 of 13 from behind (often well behind) the arc.  Congratulations, Justin!

Quote from: NCAC Weekly Update with emphasis addedHiram (3-0, 8-4) and Wooster (2-0, 7-4) share the lead in the North Coast Athletic Conference after the Terriers won twice in conference play last weekend. The Terriers meet fifth-place (tie) Ohio Wesleyan (1-1, 5-5) Saturday for their only action in the coming week. Last week, Wooster won twice in non-conferencee play to claim the title at the Mose Hole Kiwanis Classic and has won five of its past six games. The Fighting Scots' only game this week is a Saturday road contest at seventh-place (tie) Wabash (1-2, 6-5).

Other games on Saturday in a light week of conference competition are Allegheny (2-1, 6-5) at Wittenberg (2-1, 5-6), Kenyon (1-1, 7-4) at Earlham (1-2, 1-10) and Oberlin (0-3, 2-8) at Denison (0-2, 3-7). Link. (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mb.html)
It's only light if you think the week begins on, say, Thursday, like the conference office evidently does.  Denison lost at Bethany tonight 71-64 (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0809/denm0105.html#GAME.BOX), and Earlham heads to Anderson tomorrow.  On Wednesday, Wooster plays at Kenyon, OWU travels to Denison, Allegheny hosts Penn St.-Behrend, and Oberlin welcomes Case Western Reserve on Wednesday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 06, 2009, 10:31:53 PM
Anderson 71, Earlham 64 (http://www.anderson.edu/athletics/mbasket/earlham.html#GAME.BOX)...Anderson is now 10-3, and two of those three losses were by two points to Wash. U. and UW-Platteville, both former #1s this season.  They also beat Elmhurst by six on Saturday.  A seven-point loss to the Ravens is not a bad loss by any means.  Earlham shot 44% and won the battle of the boards 37-29.  Tristian Gregory (who else?) had 18 to lead the Quakers, who got scoring production from all 10 players who saw action.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 07, 2009, 01:46:50 PM
Looks like Wooster will be catching somewhat of a break for this week's challenging road trip.  With roadies at Kenyon on Wednesday and at Wabash on Saturday, it looks as though classes won't be back in session at either school meaning no student sections...  8) 

This will especially come in handy with the game at Wabash as Chadwick has become a tough venue for the Scots to escape with wins of late.  And a lot of that has to do with the Wabash students making things tough on the visiting Scots.

I also noticed that Wooster hasn't done especially well away from the friendly confines of Timken this season as they are only 1-2 in 'true' road games.  Granted, one of those losses was 5,000 miles away in tropical Hawaii to a non-DIII opponent, but it would be nice to see Wooster start to improve on their away record starting this week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 07, 2009, 04:37:39 PM
It's hard to say how many students will make it back for Saturday's game.  Classes don't resume until 1/14, but many seniors should probably be on campus preparing for written comprehensives.  I can't think of a better study break than strolling down to Chadwick for some potential history.  Not only might Saturday be the first win over Wooster at Chadwick, but a Little Giant win would push Mac Petty to the career victory #500 milestone.  I couldn't think of a better way to hit a milestone than beating the league favorites in front of your own home crowd. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 07, 2009, 04:45:24 PM
Kenyon is also on break until 1/12, which should reduce the crowd by at least a couple dozen.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2009, 08:07:34 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 35  Kenyon 35

Wooster is being led by Justin Hallowell with 9 points and Nathan Balch with 7 points.  Kenyon's leading scorers are JT Knight with 9 points and Bryan Yelvington with 8 points.

Wooster had a 9 point lead during the half but the Lords rallied and finished the half on a 11-2 run to even the score up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2009, 09:04:17 PM
Final:  Wooster 74  Kenyon 64

Nice road win for Wooster as they beat the Lords in their only scheduled game of the season. :)

Wooster was led in scoring by Nathan Balch with 16 points (9 boards), Ian Franks with 14 points, Justin Hallowell with 13 points (7 boards), Bryan Wickliffe with 9 points and Greg Ross chipped in 8 points.

Kenyon's leading scorer Bryan Yelvington was in foul trouble much of the 2nd half and only scored 11 points.  Marty Bidwell's defense on Yelvington was noted by Coach Moore in his post game remarks.  Leading the Lords in scoring was Dave Knapke with 15 points.  JT Knight added 12 points and Allen Bediako chipped in 10 points.

Wooster won this game by shooting 49% from the floor compared to only 43% for the Lords.  The key juncture in this game was the beginning of the 2nd half when the Scots opened with a 15-5 run that resulted in a 10 point lead (50-40) that the Lords could not overcome.  Kenyon on the season drops to 7-5, 1-2 in the NCAC.

Wooster is now 8-4, NCAC 3-0  ;D   Next game is at Wabash on Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2009, 09:29:49 PM
Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 85  Denison 60
Good road win for the Bishops as they improve to 6-5, 2-1 NCAC.  Kyle Miller led OWU with 17 points (5 three pointers) and here is a link to the boxscore: http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0809/denm0107.html

Final:  Oberlin 75  Case Western Reserve 62
What OWU could not accomplish, the Yeomen did with a win over the Spartans!  Mike Loll led Oberlin with 22 points and 11 boards.  Oberlin is now 3-8, 0-3 NCAC.

Final:  Penn St. Behrend 69  Allegheny 52
This game was over at halftime as the Lions had a 21 point lead (37-16).  Top scorer George Raftis apparently did not dress for the Gators as he is not listed in the boxscore.  Ryan Hollihan led Allegheny with 27 points.  Gators are now 6-6, 2-1 NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 08, 2009, 11:27:24 AM
Nice way to start the week for the Scots with a solid road win in Gambier last night!  That was Kenyon's first loss at Tomsich of the season as they were 4-0 at home prior to last night.

I wasn't all that surprised that the Scots struggled shooting from beyond the arc.  That gym doesn't seem like it would be an easy place to shoot with the glass behind the one basket especially when you only get to play there once every other year.  And Bidwell would have been the only Scot with previous experience in Tomsich.  I really think this was a factor in the Scots' struggles from deep, especially in the first half.  Wooster was only 3-12 in the first half.  And they pretty much abandoned the deep ball in the second half putting up only three attempts.  But they made 2 of those 3 attempts.  8)

Also, when you factor in that Yelvington and Bediako were battling foul trouble, it would only make sense for Wooster to take advantage and work the ball inside.

One stat that surprised me was rebounding.  Listening to the game, I thought for sure that Kenyon was going to have an advantage in that category.  Especially on the offensive end.  The Lords were hitting the offensive boards HARD, especially in the 2nd half!  But they only ended up with a 13-11 advantage on the offensive glass and overall, the rebounds were even at 32 apiece.

Lastly, Wooster had another nice game in keeping the turnovers down.  This is Wooster's 3rd straight game with 12 or fewer turnovers after going back to back games with 20+ turnovers.  That's more like it!

If Wooster can get a win in C'ville on Saturday, that would be a big hurdle passed on their way to claiming a 5th straight NCAC title!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 08, 2009, 02:18:54 PM
It was one of those games in which both teams had a lot of good close-in shots just trickle out.  Had more of Wooster's dropped, the Scots win easier.  Had more of Kenyon's dropped - but not Wooster's - this game might still be going on.

I thought Wooster, for the most part, did a very good job on their defensive board.  Most of Kenyon's offensive rebounds came on two or three plays wherein they grabbed three or four in a bunch.

Hey! Bidwell! :)  Shoot the ball!  You hit a three early, but then passed up some other open looks from the perimeter.  You've got a good shot, don't be THAT unselfish.  Your old man woulda taken those shots! :)

The drive down to Kenyon was a trip and a half.  Not bad until Loudonville, but then it went steadily downhill.  For about a ten-mile stretch, it was really difficult to see the center median on the road, which is not a good thing.  Luckily, coming home, the plows had been out, and I had a tank driven by Cliff Johnson to blaze the way.  Thanks, Cliff!



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 08, 2009, 06:53:04 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2009, 09:29:49 PM
Final:  Oberlin 75  Case Western Reserve 62
What OWU could not accomplish, the Yeomen did with a win over the Spartans!  Mike Loll led Oberlin with 22 points and 11 boards.  Oberlin is now 3-8, 0-3 NCAC.

So, Case found a way to beat OWU, but they can't beat lowly Oberlin?  Go figure...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TheDoggies on January 08, 2009, 10:51:29 PM
Don't count your titles yet, there are a lot of big hurdles left for all teams in the conference. Its a marathon race, not the 100m hurdles.

Hopefully both Wooster and Hiram can get it done on Saturday, which would set up a nice meeting of similar conference and overall records with similar teams. Young (people seems to forget/not notice that Hiram is made up of one senior, one junior and the rest freshmen and sophomores), Run and Gun, lots of athletes on the floor, and a lot of scoring (Top 2 scoring teams in the conference).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 08, 2009, 11:43:55 PM
Quote from: TheDoggies on January 08, 2009, 10:51:29 PM
Don't count your titles yet, there are a lot of big hurdles left for all teams in the conference. Its a marathon race, not the 100m hurdles.
Hardly counting titles yet doggie... 

The reason I said what I said was because, with a win at Wabash on Saturday, Wooster will have cleared two BIG hurdles on their way to their goal of a conference championship. 

Holding serve at home is only half the battle to winning conference championships.  Winning on the ROAD is where championships are won.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2009, 10:58:52 AM
Today's games and non-games:
Oberlin at Denison has been postponed until tomorrow, as has the DU women's game vs. Hiram.  Tomorrow there will be a doubleheader beginning with the women's game at 1pm.
Hiram at OWU has been postponed until 3pm tomorrow.  OWU had planned to stream this game live (http://bishops.owu.edu/) on the web; I don't know it that still goes for tomorrow.  Today's women's game at OWU (vs. Allegheny) still appears to be on as scheduled.
The other games (Wooster at Wabash, Allegheny at Wittenberg, Kenyon at Earlham) all seem to be proceeding as scheduled.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 10, 2009, 02:17:23 PM
Could not have written a better start for wabash here. Five minutes gone, lgs lead 15-1.

9 minutes left in the first half. Wabash's second unit hasn't looked very sharp. Wabash leads 19-11.

Halftime at Chadwick...Wabash leads Wooster 38-30. The Scots made a nice run to get within 6 but Wabash closed the scoring as Wes Smith made a nice tip in off his own miss. Frankly I'm pretty stunned here. I didn't expect Wabash to hold a double digit lead for most of the half.  Hopefully it'll hold up for 20 more minutes!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 10, 2009, 02:26:06 PM
Scots cut it to a TD and it's now 17-10.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 10, 2009, 02:44:57 PM
At the Half:   Wabash 38  Wooster 30

Wooster got off to a terrible start taking over 4 minutes to score a single free throw and over 5 minutes to get their first field goal of the game.  At that point, Wabash already had a 15-1 lead as Wally noted.

Wooster has no answer for Wes Smith who is leading Wabash with 17 points.  Chase Haltom has hit 2 three pointers and he has added 7 points for the Little Giants and Aaron Brock also has 7 points.

Wooster is being led by Marty Bidwell with 10 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 6 points and Matt Fegan with 5 points.

The difference in this half was shooting as Wabash hit 48% from the floor and the Scots only managed 39%.  Wooster is still in this game but the Scots are going to need play much better in the second half to have any shot at a victory.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 10, 2009, 03:00:57 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 10, 2009, 02:44:57 PM
Wooster is still in this game but the Scots are going to need play much better in the second half to have any shot at a victory.


I think it was huge for Wooster to get the lead down to single digits before the half.  Wooster started about as bad as they could have and Wabash started about as good as they could have and yet they only have an 8 point lead to show for it...

Especially when you consider the Scots' 2 leading scorers have yet to get it going with Franks sitting on the bench saddled with 3 fouls for much of the 1st half and Hallowell yet to score as he seems to be forcing his shots a bit from the way it sounds. 

Conversely, Wes Smith seems to be unstoppable.  I really think that Wabash needs some other contributors in the 2nd half if they want to hang on and pull off the upset.  Right now, 31 of Wabash's 38 points are from Smith, Haltom and Brock.  Not much balance there...  If Wooster can find a way to slow down Smith in the 2nd half, there could be trouble for Wabash.  That sounds easier said than done, however...  ???

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 10, 2009, 03:08:37 PM
Another hot start for wabash in the second half. Wabash has extended their lead 48-34 with 16 min to go.

9 minutes to play. Everything is falling for the little giants here while Wooster continues to struggle. LGs lead 58-42.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2009, 03:08:56 PM
I don't understand why Wes Smith doesn't dominate every game he plays.  He's probably the most talented player in the conference right now, and when he turns it on, he's unstoppable in all phases (driving, dishing, rebounding, etc.).  Sounds like that's what he's doing today, as he already has a double-double early in the second half.  He did it for an unbelievable ten minute span at Hiram, but was a non-factor the rest of the time during that game.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2009, 03:20:23 PM
When this game ends, Hiram is going to be in sole posession of first place in the NCAC... :o

Wabash winning today gives Mac Petty his 500th career win against his hometown team (congratulations, Coach Petty!), and it also denies Steve Moore his 499th win as Wooster's head coach.  That means that, if Wooster can beat Hiram on Wednesday, the Scots will have an opportunity to give Coach Moore his 500th COW win against Wittenberg, his alma mater, on Saturday.  Those two 500th wins, should they come to pass, would have to be especially satisfying for the coaches.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 10, 2009, 03:33:52 PM
I've seen Wooster pull off some crazy things here at Chadwick. I'm not calling this one over til the students hit the floor.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 10, 2009, 03:44:59 PM
 :o

Honestly, I'm shocked at this game. Congratulations to Coach Petty on the 500th win!

Hopefully Wabash can repeat this performance again and use this as momentum for a push to the postseason.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 10, 2009, 03:45:15 PM
Final:  Wabash 75  Wooster 58

Congrats to the Little Giants on a well played game and a key win in the NCAC race!

Wabash was led by the unstoppable Wes Smith with 24 points, Chase Halton with 17 points and Aaron Brock with 13 points.

Wooster was led by Nathan Balch with 13 points, Marty Bidwell with 10 points and Bryan Wickliffe with 10 points.  This was a ugly game for Wooster as they shot only 39% from the floor and had 20 turnovers.

Congrats also to Wooster native and Wabash Coach Mac Petty on his 500th career win!

Wabash improves to 7-5, 2-2 NCAC and Wooster falls to 8-5, 3-1 NCAC.  Next up for Wooster is Hiram on 1/14.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 10, 2009, 04:03:45 PM
Congrats to Wabash on the win today.  They came ready to play and jumped on Wooster early and never let up.  Wooster had some chances when they were able to cut the lead to 6 on a few separate occasions, but Wabash never let Wooster get any closer and always seemed to extend leads every time.

As Mike Breckenridge was going over his pre-game show, he noted how Wabash had been struggling to shoot the ball this year as they were only 39% from the field on the season to date and a lowly 30% from 3-point range.  When he said that, I thought to myself, just watch.  Wabash will come out and shoot lights out and that's exactly what they did while Wooster had an uncharacteristically poor shooting afternoon.

Who would have ever imagined at the start of the season that Wooster-Wittenberg isn't going to be the key game of the week for the Scots and that Hiram-Wooster is a bigger match-up and almost a must win for the Scots???   :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 10, 2009, 04:14:17 PM
Wittenberg is having no problems with Allegheny today, perhaps with a thought of revenge on their minds, as they are up 23-8 early on
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2009, 05:19:01 PM
Kenyon holds off Earlham, 72-69.

Wittenberg's lead on Allegheny keeps bobbing back and forth between 9 and 18.  Right now, it's "just" nine, with about 5 minutes left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 10, 2009, 05:34:10 PM
Big congrats to my former neighbor and my friend Mac Petty. I was a little older than his children (Susan and Matt) but I certainly remember them around my old neighborhood in C'ville. Mac is one of the legends of college basketball. I think D-3 is exactly where he needs to be. He's not a self-promoter. He's not about himself. He's about the student athletes.

I think a great testament to Petty is what he did after winning the national title. He STAYED! He was still a relatively young coach then.

I'd rather have Petty coach my team every day and twice on Sunday than some of the D-1 dorks like Bob Huggins.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 10, 2009, 05:39:49 PM
Back from Chadwick....and I'm just as stunned as LG about the way this one played out. Not so much stunned that Wabash won the game as we all realize that this isn't the same kind of dominant Wooster team that we're used to, but stunned at the way in which this one went down.  I've seen Wabash hold double digit leads on Wooster at Chadwick in the past, only to have Wooster flip a switch and make a run in the second half.  It was a little uncomfortable waiting for that inevitable Scots run, but it just never came along today.  

Of course congratulations are in order to Coach Petty for winning his 500th game this afternoon.  Milestones are always awesome, but they are even better when they happen in big moments in front of the home crowd.  

Wes Smith's effort today was outstanding.  Wooster really did not have an answer for Wes's dribble penetration game and Smith's great first half really helped to get Wabash off on the right foot.  I knew Chase Haltom could shoot, but egads his range was ridiculous today.  He hit a three pointer early in the game right out of Steve Moore's lap.  I've not seen that kind of range from a Wabash shooter since Josh Estelle....high praise indeed.  Wabash also got very valuable minutes from freshmen Nick Curosh and Derek Bailey.  These kids look like they could develop into solid players in the next couple of years.  

Perhaps some Wooster fans can shed some light on this for me....last year when I saw Bryan Wickliffe, he looked like the next big thing for the Scots.  I wasn't looking forward to seeing him for three more years.  However, his numbers this season don't seem to indicate much improvement from a year ago and he only played 20 minutes today (fouls were not an issue).  Is Wickliffe hurt or has he not progressed that much from his solid first year?  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2009, 05:41:15 PM
Allegheny could get no closer than 6 down the stretch.  Witt holds on for a 72-64 victory.

At Earlham, Kenyon shot a mind-boggling 71% from the field in the first half, including 5/8 from the arc, and yet only led by 5 at halftime, as the EC got off seven more shots, hitting 42%, and made 8 treys.  That must have been a great half for the fans.  Things settled down in the second, with both teams shooting in the low 40s and just 4 treys made (of 19).  Bryan Yelvington had 22 points and 8 boards, game-highs in both categories. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 10, 2009, 06:49:44 PM
Wickliffe's play this year is a mystery, quite frankly. He seems to have regressed, or at least he is not being used even as much as last year.

Another puzzling development has been the play of Ian Franks in recent games. In the first seven games of the year, Franks averaged 15.6 points per game and shot 54.8% (40-of-73) from the field and 39.1% from three-point range (9-of-23). In the last six games, he is averaging just 10.5 points per game (if you take away the last two minutes of the Mt. Union game, when he got eight points at the foul line when the Purple Raiders were fouling to stay in the game), his average would be 9.2 points per game. He is shooting just 37.7% from the field (20-of-53) and 18.2% from three-point range (2-of-11). Throw in three foul outs for good measure.

I don't think it is coincidence that his recent poor streak coincides with his movement to the two-guard position. It seems that his natural position would be shooting guard, but he put up better numbers when he was running the point. Maybe they need to use him more in that role.

Whatever the reason, Wooster is going nowhere if he is not playing like he was earlier in the year, when he looked like one of the best players in the league.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 10, 2009, 07:10:40 PM
Jerry (if I may use your first name), that's a very good point.  I think everybody expected Franks to be moved to the two spot upon the return of Brandon Johnson.  Now, under different circumstances, with Balch at the top, he's there anyway and it's not working that well, which surprises me.

There is one thing that I noticed at the Kenyon game, and that's that Wooster has gotten away from the high picks at the top of the circle that were a staple of their offense earlier in the season.  Against the Lords, they only went to that near the end of the game.  Listening on the radio today, it's not possible to tell why they were struggling offensively, only that they were.

With a good scouting report, most of the Wooster players can be somewhat exploited.  Put a man on Hollowell and give him no room.  Do NOT drop off him much to double team or he'll get that open three that is pretty much his only offense.  When Bidwell drives, do NOT have your other players leave their men, as he's looking to pass.  Work to deny Franks the ball in the half-court set.  Pressure Fegan, as his ballhandling, although improved, is still a bit suspect and he's a shooter not a penetrator.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 10, 2009, 07:13:16 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 10, 2009, 06:49:44 PM
Wickliffe's play this year is a mystery, quite frankly. He seems to have regressed, or at least he is not being used even as much as last year.

Another puzzling development has been the play of Ian Franks in recent games.... Whatever the reason, Wooster is going nowhere if he is not playing like he was earlier in the year, when he looked like one of the best players in the league.

Both of these points about Wickliffe and Franks are well noted by Seinfeld and they both beg the larger question:  Who is Wooster's "go to" player this year when the Scots need a bucket?

It was very clear in today's game that no Wooster player took charge on the offensive end and got the Scots some key baskets when Wabash was extending their lead.  In fact, no one on the Scots was even close to matching what Wes Smith was scoring for the Little Giants.

In the past 12+ years, Wooster has had James Cooper, Tom Port, Bryan Nelson, John Ellenwood, etc. and each season the offensive leader(s) for the Scots would get the key baskets when they were needed.

It seems like Ian Franks, Bryan Wickliffe, Nathan Balch and Justin Hallowell have the potential to be the key scoring leaders of this Wooster team but none of them have demonstrated enough offensive consistency to get the job done.  Wooster needs one or more of these guys to demonstrate leadership on the offensive end or it could be a challenging season for the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 11, 2009, 06:31:17 PM
Final:  Hiram 77  Ohio Wesleyan 73

Hiram registers an impressive road win at OWU this afternoon and they are clearly the team to beat in the NCAC at this point. :o The Terriers were led by Ian Pfouts with 16 points and Chris Roberts with 14 points.

Ohio Wesleyan was led by Kyle Holliday with 22 points and Brent Pleiman with 18 points.  The difference in this game appears to be slightly better shooting by Hiram and the Terrriers also made 8 three pointers compared to only 5 for the Bishops.

Here is a link to the boxscore:  http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/owum0111.htm

Hiram improves to 9-4, 4-0 NCAC while OWU drops to 6-6, 2-2 NCAC.

It should be an interesting game on Wednesday when first place Hiram plays at Wooster! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 11, 2009, 06:41:32 PM
Final:  Oberlin 64  Denison 63

Oberlin gets the road win this afternoon.  Yeomen improve to 4-8, 1-3 NCAC.  Denison is 3-10, 0-4 NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 11, 2009, 06:49:55 PM
NCAC Standings thru 1/11 games
(NCAC record, Overall record)

Hiram 4-0, 9-4
Wooster 3-1, 8-5
Wittenberg 3-1, 6-6
Kenyon 2-2, 8-5
Wabash 2-2, 7-5
Ohio Wesleyan 2-2, 6-6
Allegheny 2-2, 6-7
Oberlin 1-3, 4-8
Earlham 1-3, 1-12
Denison 0-4, 3-10
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2009, 07:04:00 PM
The difference in the game is hard to pick up from the boxscore, and it amounts to one thing: Hiram played more aggressively the Bishops.  It's not that OWU didn't play hard, it's just that Hiram is just a touch more athletic at most positions, and they had that tiny edge on loose balls, on ball movement, on defense, and on rebounds.  Their defense was fierce all evening, staying right in the faces of the ballhandlers and forcing some awkward shots.  OWU was able to get the ball inside quite a bit, but they'd have to force or hurry the shot; I lost count of how many OWU layups or putbacks stayed on the rim before dropping off.  Still, if OWU could have hit their threes with any regularity, it'd've been a different game.

And even with all of the above, the game was still in OWU's hands: they had the ball on their own baseline with 0:40 left, trailing by two.  They called a timeout to set up the offense, but Hiram wouldn't allow them to breathe and OWU never got a decent shot.  It was practically a case of the Terriers running out the clock on defense.

Fear the Pooch--this team is for real (in NCAC terms, at least.)  They've got bangers, drivers, and shooters, they play good defense, they move the ball well, and they dictate the tempo.  It's easy to get caught up in the Cinderella story (although, given the way they swagger and woof, it's more like an Evil Stepsister story), but they're earning these wins.  Three of their four conference wins are over legitimate contenders, and they played well in all three games.  They're playing with a chip on their shoulders and they're not backing down to anyone.  This may be a team only a (wicked step-)mother could love, but they're a real threat.  Wooster will have their hands full on Wednesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2009, 07:25:59 PM
I realize it's very early yet, with just a quarter of the conference season gone, but here's something to ponder:  when was the last time the All-Conference first team had no Wooster or Wittenberg players on it? 

It's a distinct possibility this year, as neither team has what I consider to be an obvious choice.  As of right now, the first team is looking like Chris Roberts, Bryan Yelvington, Wes Smith, George Raftis, Tristian Gregory, and Kyle Holliday, with (probably) one slot open (there were seven first-teamers each of the last two years.)  Earlier, I thought it might be Ian Franks, but he's tailed off of late.  Both Witt and Woo are getting balanced contributions up and down the lineup with no real standout.  And there's other candidates as well, such as Mike Loll, Jordan Beard, and Chris Luther who are having good years for non-championship caliber teams. 

Just something to keep in the back of your mind.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 11, 2009, 08:07:27 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 11, 2009, 06:31:17 PM
Hiram registers an impressive road win at OWU this afternoon and they are clearly the team to beat in the NCAC at this point.

It hurts my brain to even begin trying to comprehend this. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 11, 2009, 08:25:49 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 11, 2009, 08:07:27 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 11, 2009, 06:31:17 PM
Hiram registers an impressive road win at OWU this afternoon and they are clearly the team to beat in the NCAC at this point.

It hurts my brain to even begin trying to comprehend this. 
Could this be signs of the Apocalypse???  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 11, 2009, 08:38:59 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 11, 2009, 08:25:49 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 11, 2009, 08:07:27 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 11, 2009, 06:31:17 PM
Hiram registers an impressive road win at OWU this afternoon and they are clearly the team to beat in the NCAC at this point.

It hurts my brain to even begin trying to comprehend this. 
Could this be signs of the Apocalypse???  :P

One word...  'Oberlin'...........then I'm moving to Idaho. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 11, 2009, 10:49:02 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 11, 2009, 07:04:00 PM
Still, if OWU could have hit their threes with any regularity, it'd've been a different game.

A rare written double-contraction sighting.  Generally confined to verbal usage in hairstyling salons and farm equipment stores. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 12, 2009, 12:34:40 PM
If memory serves, wasn't Mr. Pfouts the recipient of a lot of flack for a particularly hard foul on a Wooster player a couple of years ago that caused said player to miss time? Does that still linger at Wooster?

Inquiring minds.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 12, 2009, 12:36:36 PM
I know it's way early, but it will be intriguing to see the race for the title and:

The race for 3rd and 4th seed.

The race for 6th seed.

The race for the final spots in the tourney.

To me, I think it's a wide open tourney, and even the 8th seed will have a chance at an upset. In the past, that wasn't plausible. But this year, there is hope.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2009, 01:24:30 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 12, 2009, 12:34:40 PM
If memory serves, wasn't Mr. Pfouts the recipient of a lot of flack for a particularly hard foul on a Wooster player a couple of years ago that caused said player to miss time? Does that still linger at Wooster?

Inquiring minds.

Pfouts, now a senior, fouled Tom Port on a breakaway dunk, with the result that Port broke his wrist and missed significant playing time.  There was a great deal of outrage by Wooster fans at the time, which was Jan. 2006 when Pfouts was a frosh.  Pfouts has gone on to make himself quite unpopular with fans and (at least some) players on numerous NCAC teams since then.  I've seen Hiram play three times this year, and my observation is that, now that he's being counted on as a team leader (he's second in scoring, rebounding, and minutes on the team) and can't afford to be in foul trouble, he's toned down his play quite a bit.  In the games I've seen (vs. Wittenberg, Wabash, and OWU), he's played hard and aggressively, but not over the line like he has at times in the past.  Nevertheless, Wooster fans have long memories, and it will be quite interesting to see what their reaction to Pfouts will be.  (It adds some intrigue that Port, now a COW assistant coach, will be back on the bench.)

The way Hiram has been playing this season, which is as if they have something to prove, I expect that a hostile reaction by Wooster fans might even feed their fire.  It should be a very interesting evening.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2009, 11:39:24 PM
This week's NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html) is Oberlin's two-sport star, Mike Loll.  Loll, a second team all-NCAC wide receiver, recorded 36 points and 19 rebounds in Oberlin's wins over Case and Denison this week.  Congratulations, Mike!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 14, 2009, 06:53:21 PM
It appears that, despite some dodgy weather in northeast Ohio, all scheduled games are on for tonight.  The Denison at Kenyon backyard rivalry game can be viewed online at Kenyon.edu (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28487.xml).  Hiram at Wooster will also be videocast from Wooster.edu (http://www.teamline.cc/sportpage?teamcode=1100&eventcode=6).  Other games have their usual assortment of audiocasts and live stats. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 14, 2009, 08:12:08 PM
It also appears that Charlie Brown's teacher has kidnapped Brent Harris and is calling the game for Wabash. Or maybe he sounds like the Swedish Chef. I can't be sure. And there appears to be some sort of Mexican radio station bleeding in. How odd.

Does OWU have live stats?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2009, 08:30:16 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 37  Hiram 23

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 10 points, Marty Bidwell with 7 points, Bryan Wickliffe also with 7 points and Nathan Balch with 5 points.

Hiram is being led by Glenn Campbell with 5 points, Jason Hebeisen with 4 points and several players have 3 each.

The score was 29-23 and the Scots finished the half on a 8-0 run to widen the lead to 14 points.  Wooster shot 49% in the half compared to only 26% for Hiram.  The Terriers attempted 15 three pointers and only made 3 of them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 14, 2009, 08:33:35 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2009, 08:30:16 PMHiram is being led by Glenn Campbell with 5 points

  ;)


(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi41.tinypic.com%2Fogz4wh.jpg&hash=0b5e22ff5bed4c5c4a0e2517909e7d66550badaa)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 14, 2009, 08:36:43 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 14, 2009, 08:12:08 PM
Does OWU have live stats?
I'm not aware that they do.  From time to time they'll do videocasts, but I'm not sure if tonight is one of their nights or not. 

The announcers on Wooster's CPI videocast (not affiliated with the College, I hasten to add) are laughably bad.  Someone should explain to them that it's a simple matter to corral an assistant coach for the visiting team to ask how to pronounce player names.  I think the only Hiram name they're getting right is "Roberts."  And they even made a "Glenn Campbell" joke.  ::)  EDIT: Great minds think alike, I see.  :D

The difference (to my eyes) between this game and Hiram's games vs. Witt, Wabash, and OWU is that Wooster is doing a much, much better job on defense and rebounding than those other W's did, and it's giving Hiram fits.  Ian Franks is doing to them precisely what Wes Smith did for ten minutes (i.e., being unguardable on offense and unstoppable on the boards), which makes me think that Steve Moore has a tape from that game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 14, 2009, 08:45:53 PM
Kenyon leads Denison 36-33 at the half.  Denison made their first six field goal attempts, three of them threes, in building up an early 7 point lead, but made only 7 of their last 22 attempts.  Kenyon also made 14 field goals, but at a much more steady pace.  JT Knight (KC) and Pat Sullivan (DU) lead the scoring with 9 apiece.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 14, 2009, 08:51:15 PM
The CPI announcer has now begun yelling at the refs for perceived bad non-calls.  I think Wooster Booster has seized the microphone and is doing the play-by-play.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 14, 2009, 09:21:02 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 14, 2009, 08:12:08 PM
It also appears that Charlie Brown's teacher has kidnapped Brent Harris and is calling the game for Wabash. Or maybe he sounds like the Swedish Chef. I can't be sure. And there appears to be some sort of Mexican radio station bleeding in.

I feel a hot wind on my shoulder ...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2009, 09:32:10 PM
Final:  Wooster 79  Hiram  63 ;D

Wooster got an important NCAC win tonight and they were led by Ian Franks' terrific double double (21 pts, 11 boards), Marty Bidwell with 14 points, Nathan Balch with 10 points and Bryan Wickliffe with 9 points.

Hiram was led tonight by Chris Roberts with 14 points and Ian Pfouts with 12 points.  Wooster won this game shooting 45% from the floor and using their good defense to hold the Terriers to only 34%.  Hiram won the boards 45-43 and had 19 offensive boards.

Coach Moore on the post game show noted that Ian Franks was not feeling 100% tonight so that make his performance even more amazing.  Moore also commended Marty Bidwell for his defense on Hiram's Chris Roberts who only made 3 of 14 shots.

This was Wooster's 22nd straight win over Hiram. :)  Wooster improves to 9-5, 4-1 NCAC.  Hiram falls to 9-5, 4-1 NCAC.

Big game on Saturday as Wooster hosts Wittenberg (also 4-1) and Coach Moore goes for his 500th win.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 14, 2009, 09:47:29 PM
Kenyon got a challenge but holds off Denison, 76-67.  Bryan Yelvington had 20, while JT Knight had 19 points, 8 rebounds, and 3 assists. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2009, 09:48:26 PM
January 14th NCAC Final Scores:

Wittenberg 91  Earlham 58
Kenyon 76  Denison 67
Wooster 79  Hiram 63
Ohio Wesleyan 80  Wabash 64
Allegheny 81 Oberlin 59
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2009, 10:04:23 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 1/14 games:

1.  Wooster 4-1, 9-5
1.  Hiram 4-1, 9-5
1.  Wittenberg 4-1, 7-6
4.  Kenyon 3-2, 9-5
4.  Ohio Wesleyan 3-2, 7-6
4.  Allegheny 3-2, 7-7
7.  Wabash 2-3, 7-6
8.  Oberlin 1-4, 4-9
8.  Earlham 1-4, 1-13
10. Denison 0-5, 3-11
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 14, 2009, 10:07:20 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 14, 2009, 09:21:02 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 14, 2009, 08:12:08 PM
It also appears that Charlie Brown's teacher has kidnapped Brent Harris and is calling the game for Wabash. Or maybe he sounds like the Swedish Chef. I can't be sure. And there appears to be some sort of Mexican radio station bleeding in.

I feel a hot wind on my shoulder ...

+k
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 14, 2009, 11:22:26 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 14, 2009, 08:51:15 PM
The CPI announcer has now begun yelling at the refs for perceived bad non-calls.  I think Wooster Booster has seized the microphone and is doing the play-by-play.  ;D

Well, if you're referring to the refs standing idly by as Roberts slid fifteen feet on his back while looking for an open man to pass to, it wasn't just the announcers yelling, it was the whole crowd.  Except, of course, for two clowns sitting in my vicinity, civilian refs, who claimed that he'd never established a pivot foot.  Gimme a break.  If a building was in a flaming blaze, basketball officials would claim it was underwater.

And, of course, there was the obligatory thug foul of Marty Bidwell as he went in for a layup.  Two guys knocked him from behind, into the wall, ala Tom Port.  But that's what you get when you have a dirty team trailing big and lazy refs that want to go home.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 15, 2009, 12:04:47 AM
Some observations:

-- The final margin of the Wooster-Hiram game is not indicative of the talent level between the two teams. Hiram missed some wide open three pointers and shot terribly from the foul line. Correct these two things, which I assume were below the norm, and the game is much closer. I think Wooster is a little bit better than Hiram, but just marginally. It is rare to see a team match Wooster's athleticism, but Hiram certainly can.

-- Ian Franks looked like the player I saw at the start of the year. Looking confident with the ball and with his decisions, and owning the glass. It is strange to see a shooting guard who scored all of his points without making a shot from more than five or six feet. There is no question he is more comfortable as a quasi point guard.

-- The mystery of Bryan Wickliffe continues. But frankly, the mystery, at least from tonight's game, lies with the fact that there seems to be no effort to get him the ball, or anyone else in the paint. The only role Wickliffe seems to have in the offense is setting picks. Unless Wooster gets some sort of consistent post play from someone, they are not going to win the conference. I just don't see it. If you average the scoring of the Scots' three frontline players (Wickliffe, Ross & Sawyer), they average less than 20 points per game of Wooster's nearly 80 ppg. I also think part of the problem for Wickliffe is that he is playing center when he is a forward. I wonder if putting Wickliffe on the floor with Ross from time to time would help this problem.

-- There has been a lot of talk about Wooster's newcomers, but I think Wittenberg's are just as good, maybe even better. Two of their starters are freshmen (Cooper and McKee), who both played a lot as freshmen football players, come to Wittenberg with very distinguished high school resumes. McKee averaged nearly 20 points per game as a senior and was named Clark County Player of the Year. Also one of the top players from that county was Cooper, who went to Springfield South. Wooster knows a little bit about how talented South players can be. Add in two freshmen big men in Clayton Black and Alex Brandt, and the Tigers managed to bring in quite a group of players despite having a mediocre season last year. Wooster may have more depth in its incoming class, but I think the star power lies with Wittenberg right now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 15, 2009, 09:08:21 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 15, 2009, 12:04:47 AM
Some observations:

-- Ian Franks looked like the player I saw at the start of the year. Looking confident with the ball and with his decisions, and owning the glass. It is strange to see a shooting guard who scored all of his points without making a shot from more than five or six feet. There is no question he is more comfortable as a quasi point guard.

What a difference a productive Franks makes to this team!  Saturday, he couldn't stay out of foul trouble long enough to make any sort of significant contribution to the game.  And Wooster loses big.

Last night, he drops in an impressive double double and Wooster wins big.

I definitely feel that the more he has the ball in his hands, the better he plays.

As for Wickliffe, I didn't think he had that bad of a game last night.  He did score 9 points in just 19 minutes on 4-7 shooting.  Personally, I'm wondering if he's still 100%.  He seemed to get gassed pretty quick last night so that leads me to think that he hasn't built his stamina back up all the way just yet since before his illness over the break. 

I do agree with you that Wooster needs to make more of a concerted effort to get the ball inside.  It's not a good stat when your shooting guard is leading the team with points in the paint and I think Franks did that last night.

Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 14, 2009, 11:22:26 PM

And, of course, there was the obligatory thug foul of Marty Bidwell as he went in for a layup.  Two guys knocked him from behind, into the wall, ala Tom Port. 

I'm claiming that is the reason behind Terrance Williams missing his break-away dunk towards the end of the game.  He heard footsteps behind him and he was bracing himself for having his legs cut out from under him from behind...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 15, 2009, 09:55:16 AM
Last night, Franks spent much more time with the ball in his hands at the top of the key.  Seemed to me that he was more of the point guard, Balch the off-guard.  That seemed to help the Wooster offense a lot. 

Bidwell looked for his shot much more on his penetrations, and that helped a lot, too.  Him having the wraps off his hand might be helping him out.  His defense was so good that Roberts, in the half court, rarely even tried to do anything with the ball.  He knew what he was up against; a guy that is every bit as athletic as he is, plus bigger. 

I thought Wickliffe had a fine game last night, finishing strong inside a few times and bringing down some very tough rebounds. 

Matt Fegan is a fine shooter, but really lacks the quickness and ballhandling skills that are necessary to be a point guard.  He needs to be relieved of his duty of bringing the ball up the court.

The nineteen offensive rebounds that Hiram had are deceiving.  About five of them came in one possession, which resulted in only one basket.  If you're the defensive team, that's actually much better than giving up five OR's on five different possessions, and having them result in five baskets.

On the other hand, Wooster did give up two, maybe three, OR's on free throws.  These were not long rebounds, either; the Hiram guys somehow got the inside position.  Not pretty.

You guys can ding my karma all you want, but this is a fact: there is serious risk of injury, or an incident, when the referees decide to swallow their whistles in lopsided games, and they do it all the time.  Hiram is a very physical team.  If they can get away with something, they will do it.  Nothing will stop them except the consequence of losing the game.  Once that is no longer an issue, only the referees can keep that aggression in check.  When they fail to do that, as they did last night, danger is in the air.  Marty Bidwell could have been hurt badly, and the guilt would have extended beyond the Hiram player that creamed him to the refereeing crew that permitted that overly physical atmosphere to exist.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 15, 2009, 11:55:59 AM
I think it's going to come down to who amongst the top 5-7 teams can scratch out road wins against the other top teams, while holding serve on the home court.

Wabash getting blasted at OWU after beating Wooster at home is a case in point.

BTW, I think it would be neat to have the NCAC tourney in little ol' Hiram, Ohio for a change.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 15, 2009, 12:44:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 15, 2009, 11:55:59 AM
I think it's going to come down to who amongst the top 5-7 teams can scratch out road wins against the other top teams, while holding serve on the home court.

Wabash getting blasted at OWU after beating Wooster at home is a case in point.
Hiram has a win at OWU.  Wooster has a win at Kenyon.  Wabash has a win at Allegheny.  I can't think of any other key road wins to date.

Quote from: smedindy on January 15, 2009, 11:55:59 AMBTW, I think it would be neat to have the NCAC tourney in little ol' Hiram, Ohio for a change.
I was thinking the same thing yesterday.  It's awfully small*, though, and I don't think they have facilities for videocasting or live stats there (I could be wrong about that).  One nice byproduct of the Wooster/Wittenberg dominance over the years is that the conference tournament is usually played in a 3000+ seat arena.  The other gyms would be stressed to handle the combined weight of Wooster's and Wittenberg's traveling fans.  Although a men's conference tournament would be a nice way to showcase Kenyon's Tomsich Arena.

*I just checked the Hiram website; it says
Quote from: Hiram CollegeWith seating capacity for 2,000 spectators - all within close proximity to the playing floor [...]
I'll say.  If there were 2000 people in there, they'd ring the playing floor standing about 5 deep.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 15, 2009, 01:10:08 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 15, 2009, 12:44:41 PM

Quote from: Hiram CollegeWith seating capacity for 2,000 spectators - all within close proximity to the playing floor [...]
I'll say.  If there were 2000 people in there, they'd ring the playing floor standing about 5 deep.

I don't think the whole town of Hiram could handle an additional 2,000 people.  And if 2,000 people DID go there to attend, 20% would get lost and 70% of the remainder would starve to death.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 16, 2009, 07:19:35 PM
I can't believe how quiet it is in here for Wooster-Wittenberg week!

Does anyone have any thoughts?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: JohnDaly on January 17, 2009, 09:47:29 AM
I was at the Hiram/Wooster game on wednesday and I do not know what some of you guys are talking about. Now, I am not a fan of either team, and if you are calling the foul where the Hiram player jumped in the air and tried to deflect a lob pass being thrown to the wooster player and he fouled him and the wooster player ended up into the wall. I do not see the "thugness" out of that. If the hiram player had just ran underneath him then yes that would be a thug like foul, but the kid was making a hustle play and ended up giving a hard fould.

One thug thing I DID see was during the post game handshake. I do not know what was said for sure, but I saw a Wooster player start to jaw at the Hiram players, which made the Hiram players start to jaw back. You'd think a team that boasts the highest winning percentage this decade would know how to take a win. That stuff will just fire up a team for the next time they meet, and the way I saw it was if Hiram would have shot better, then the game would have been interesting. Hopefully this doesn't affect the next meeting to the point where there are intentional fights or people getting in each other's faces.

By the way, the kid that missed the dunk probably missed it because he traveled  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 17, 2009, 10:19:05 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 15, 2009, 12:44:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 15, 2009, 11:55:59 AM
I think it's going to come down to who amongst the top 5-7 teams can scratch out road wins against the other top teams, while holding serve on the home court.

Wabash getting blasted at OWU after beating Wooster at home is a case in point.
Hiram has a win at OWU.  Wooster has a win at Kenyon.  Wabash has a win at Allegheny.  I can't think of any other key road wins to date.

I agree on the importance of road wins if a team is going to win the NCAC title.  Thus, it is important to note that Hiram has a built in scheduling advantage because the Terriers only play 7 NCAC road games this year and they have 9 NCAC home games.  This imbalance is due to the NCAC minimizing travel costs by having the Hiram/Allegheny pair only play the Wabash/Earlham pair once each season.  This just happens to be the alternating year when Hiram and Allegheny play host and do not travel to the Indiana schools.

The current effect of this policy is that Hiram only has 3 tough road games left on their schedule (at Witt, at Allegheny, at Kenyon).  Wooster of course has the balanced 8 road, 8 home schedule so the Scots currently have 4 tough road games remaining (at Witt, at Allegheny, at Hiram, at Ohio Wesleyan).  Wittenberg also has the balanced 8/8 schedule and counting tonight they have 5 tough road games left (at Woo, at OWU, at Allegheny, at Kenyon, at Wabash).

The scheduling advantage for Hiram just increases the importance of Wooster winning tonight vs. Witt if they want to keep pace with the Terriers.  This is especially true because Hiram already has a home win vs. Wittenberg and Wooster needs to match that victory.

Should be a great rivalry game tonight. :)  I hope to see the gym full of black attire when I walk into Timken tonight!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 17, 2009, 10:52:09 AM
I'm interested to see what kind of crowd is in attendance tonight.  Unfortunately, I won't be a part of the crowd because I have to work...  :-[

This is the first year I can recall in quite sometime where one or both teams aren't even ranked.  The game just doesn't seem to have that normal  buzz about it.  Kind of like the Ohio State-Michigan game this past football season.

I'm sure that the players don't feel the same way and once the ball is tipped, the intensity of the rivalry will be in full effect.  But it just seems strange to see a Wooster/Wittenberg game with only one senior apiece on each team's roster and such heavy contributions from freshmen or first year players for both teams.

As for the game, Wittenberg does seem to be playing better of late, but, could that be contributed by who they have played?  Three of their 4 conference wins are against the bottom 3 in the conference.  And while their lone conference loss looked like a shocker at the time, Hiram has proven that they seem to be a serious challenger to the conference championship so far. 

I do know one thing we can count on and that is Wittenberg coming into Timken and playing out of their minds.  Someone from Witt that we least expect will go off and this game will probably come down to the wire yet again.  After all, it is still Wooster and Wittenberg!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 17, 2009, 01:52:12 PM
36-25 in favor of Wabash at halftime in C'ville. Oberlin led early but the LGs got hot in the middle of the half and asserted some control. Wabash is being led by Wes Smith and his 11points and 5 rebounds. Oberlin is paced by Jordan Beard with 11 points.

It's pretty critical that Wabash hold serve ok this home stand versus oberlin, earlham, and Denison. These just aren't loseable games if Wabash is going to get back into the top four.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 17, 2009, 02:34:44 PM
Wabash is on control here 64-49 with 90 seconds to play. Wes just went down pretty hard after being fouled driving to the basket. Looks like it might be a back or tailbone situation. He is definitely in some serious pain here. You hate to see that but it does happen. I certainly didn't see anything malicious on the play. Wes has been helped off the floor. We hope he'll be alright. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 17, 2009, 04:00:54 PM
Back from Chadwick where Wabash beat Oberlin this afternoon 69-51.  Oberlin played well early in the game and had a small lead in the first half before Wabash went on a nice run to get ahead by double digits and were never really threatened beyond that.  Oberlin did cut the lead to seven points in the second half, but were never able to get closer than that. 

Aaron Brock went to work in the second half and finished with a game  high 18 points.  Wes Smith was right behind him with 17 points and also added a game high nine rebounds.  Oberlin's Jordan Beard was held to just two second half points and finished with 13 for the game.  Mike Loll led the Yeoman with 15 points.  Wabash outrebounded the Yeomen 39-25 and held a decisive 15-5 edge in offensive rebounding. 

The bigger story here is going to be the status of Wes Smith going forward.  As mentioned, Wes took a pretty nasty fall late in the game and seemed to be hurting pretty bad.  While there's never a good time to lose your best player, Wabash may catch a break here with their next two games against Earlham and Denison both of which are at Chadwick.  If Wes does need miss any time, now would be about the only time that I can see Wabash being able to go without him. 

In other news, Kenyon is all over Allegheny 47-25 with 17 minutes to go in that game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 17, 2009, 05:09:25 PM
Some more finals:

Hiram gets all over Denison 74-46.  This was a close game at half, and then the Big Red forgot how to score.  Hiram outscores Denison 45-22 in the second half. 

Kenyon cruises to a win over Allegheny 74-51. The Lords got a huge game from JT Knight who dropped 30.  Yelvington added 18 points and 15 rebounds and Knapke also had a double double with 12 and 10. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 17, 2009, 07:22:54 PM
One more afternoon final:

OWU 84
Earlham 70
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 17, 2009, 09:55:15 PM
Another Wooster game, another cheap, dirty shot.  With the game over, Wittenberg punk David Nowicki charges full steam into Marty Bidwell from behind as he's dunking.  In sixteen years of watching Wooster play, I can't recall a single incident of a Wooster player taking a cheap, dangerous shot at an opponent.  I see Wooster's opponents do this a couple of times a year.  To me, it says a lot about the coaching, and the types of players that these schools recruit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on January 17, 2009, 10:01:48 PM
Wooster 68, Wittenberg 59

Led by some timely 3's from Ian Franks (22 pts) and Justin Hallowell (14), the Scots win at home.  Up 11 at the half despite some sloppy play on offense, the Scots led by 14 with 6 minutes left, but Witt fought back.  The Tigers got as close as 5, but Wooster made some free throws in the last minute to secure the win.

There were some tense moments at the end of the game.  Up seven in the closing seconds, Wooster had a three-on-zero break, and one of the Scots set up to go for a dunk.  A hustling Tiger player ran back down the court, and committed a hard foul (which was not called flagrant by the officials) to prevent the dunk.  A few words were exchanged, but there was no pushing and shoving as a result.

The two head coaches had an intense discussion during the post-game handshakes, apparently over the incident, as Bill Brown immediately pointed to that basket.  Presumably, Brown found the dunk attempt to be lacking class, and Steve Moore didn't appreciate the hard foul.  Another fan told me that Brown also said something to the player in the handshake line, but I missed that, if it happened.

This was my first Woo-Witt game, and I was a bit underwhelmed by the atmosphere.  Timken was not full, and (aside from the student section), the Scot fans mostly sat on their hands.  Maybe it was the weather, combined with both teams being out of the top tier of D-III this year, but I was expecting more.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 17, 2009, 10:04:26 PM
Wooster Booster,

John Daly is the same guy as TheDoggies, who I guess decided he wanted to change his name. Of course this is also the same guy who as a player for Hiram in 2006 was running his mouth on the post up board after the game where Tom Port was fouled hard an injured up there. He then talked about how they were going to show their toughness at Wooster, when they proceeded to lose 129-67. Of course we never heard from said player again until this year (he is graduated), when suddenly he is talking tough now that Hiram is good. It is silly to try and go after a team that you have never beaten in conference play. Reminds me a little bit of the Scot football team, who runs their mouth at basketball games when Wittenberg is there even though the Tigers have more or less owned Wooster over the years -- minus this year. Of course, there were no Wittenberg students at the game tonight, yet our students (mostly football players, I'm guessing) make fools of themselves with the stupid chant with the four-letter "S" word that is directed at mostly parents.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2009, 10:12:03 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on January 17, 2009, 10:01:48 PM
Wooster 68, Wittenberg 59

Led by some timely 3's from Ian Franks (22 pts) and Justin Hallowell (14), the Scots win at home.  Up 11 at the half despite some sloppy play on offense, the Scots led by 14 with 6 minutes left, but Witt fought back.  The Tigers got as close as 5, but Wooster made some free throws in the last minute to secure the win.

There were some tense moments at the end of the game.  Up seven in the closing seconds, Wooster had a three-on-zero break, and one of the Scots set up to go for a dunk.  A hustling Tiger player ran back down the court, and committed a hard foul (which was not called flagrant by the officials) to prevent the dunk.  A few words were exchanged, but there was no pushing and shoving as a result.

The two head coaches had an intense discussion during the post-game handshakes, apparently over the incident, as Bill Brown immediately pointed to that basket.  Presumably, Brown found the dunk attempt to be lacking class, and Steve Moore didn't appreciate the hard foul.  Another fan told me that Brown also said something to the player in the handshake line, but I missed that, if it happened.

This was my first Woo-Witt game, and I was a bit underwhelmed by the atmosphere.  Timken was not full, and (aside from the student section), the Scot fans mostly sat on their hands.  Maybe it was the weather, combined with both teams being out of the top tier of D-III this year, but I was expecting more.
I must say, I agree with every word of this post.  +k.

Quote from: seinfeld on January 17, 2009, 10:04:26 PMOf course, there were no Wittenberg students at the game tonight, yet our students (mostly football players, I'm guessing) make fools of themselves with the stupid chant with the four-letter "S" word that is directed at mostly parents.
I wish just one time some Wooster official, preferably the AD, Keith Beckett, would go over to the student section and tell them to knock it off.  It's embarrassing to me as an alum that this is permitted to go on year after year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 17, 2009, 10:20:59 PM
Fantastic 50,

You are right that the atmosphere wasn't what it usually is. The two main reasons, I think, are that the teams aren't as good this year, and Wittenberg had no students there. Where a lot of the energy comes from is the banter back and forth between the two student sections. Also, while Wooster never pulled away, the outcome didn't really ever feel in doubt in the second half. That may have led to the energy level being down somewhat.

Here is my reaction to the foul and the end of the game and the post game handshake. You can probably go either way as to whether Bidwell should have pulled up or gone in for the slam at the end of the game. My guess is that a majority of players would have gone in for the score in that situation. Given the intensity of the rivalry, and considering the game was still in doubt one possession before this, I don't think it was over the top for Bidwell to try to score. I also think Nowicki's foul wasn't out of line either. He actually got a lot of the ball, but certainly got a lot of body as well. I think that given Bidwell was trying to dunk when the game was over, it was fair for Nowicki to commit the hard foul. The key to this sequence is that Nowicki didn't come from behind or throw him down or anything that would have caused an injury (which was different about the foul on Port three years ago). And while there was a little bit of talking after the play, it wasn't anything that if it happened at the Div. I level, you would even think twice about.

What I'm puzzled about is the reaction of Bill Brown. While I was on the opposite side of the floor (so obviously I couldn't hear anything), I watched the entire thing unfold. Moments after Steve Moore gets his 500th career win at Wooster, he has Bill Brown lecturing him at midcourt, holding up the line. I didn't see Steve say anything, it was all Brown. I don't think it was necessary for Brown to lecture Steve about that play, but that may be up for argument. But where Brown crossed the line in my opinion is that he stopped and was apparently trying to lecture Bidwell. There is no reason for Brown to talk to a Wooster player like that. The only circumstance I could see this being appropriate is if Bidwell had somehow committed a cheap foul that injured one of his players. That obviously didn't happen. On top of that, Brown continued to follow Bidwell through the line after Bidwell either said something or just continued to move on.

Brown is not the Dean Smith of Div. III basketball. His players have been known for their questionable antics over the years (BJ Harris comes to mind). His teams have jumped around Wooster's seal at midcourt after wins at Timken many times. They act like they win the national championship when they win a regular season game at Timken. While he may not have any control over the student section, Wittenberg students have left beer bottles on the floor after games, stolen chairs and rugs, so I mean, c'mon. There is nothing more hypocritical, to me, than someone thinking they are in a position to lecture someone else, especially someone that is not a part of your team/organization, when either your conduct or your team's conduct isn't perfect.

If Bill Brown doesn't like what happened, then use it to motivate his team. Don't patronize Steve Moore or Bidwell, a team captain, on their own floor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 17, 2009, 10:44:17 PM
Back to the game itself real quick, it is amazing that Ian Franks went from seemingly being lost on the floor to looking like one of the best players in the conference in just a couple of games. When he creates his own offense, he is a completely different player. His body control when he drives the lane is the best I've seen of any recent Wooster player. He is quick enough that the defense can't slide over to take a charge or someone doesn't come in and swipe the ball, but he is under control enough to adjust himself at the last second if necessary.

I'm impressed with Wittenberg's two young big men. They are both going to be good (I wish one of them was wearing a Scot uniform). I just wish Wooster would make it a little more difficult for them to get the ball. If Wooster isn't going to double, they have to make it harder for them to get the ball. The guards have to deny better, and the post players need to try and front the post player more often.

Mike Cooper looked a little frustrated on offense. My guess is he hasn't had anyone as tall as Hallowell cover him all year.

Wooster was again able to win despite not much of a post game. This was only evident as a problem late in the second half when their half court offense stalled. It would have been nice to just dump the ball inside in those situations. We'll see if this is a problem at any point this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on January 17, 2009, 10:51:43 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 17, 2009, 10:12:03 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 17, 2009, 10:04:26 PMOf course, there were no Wittenberg students at the game tonight, yet our students (mostly football players, I'm guessing) make fools of themselves with the stupid chant with the four-letter "S" word that is directed at mostly parents.
I wish just one time some Wooster official, preferably the AD, Keith Beckett, would go over to the student section and tell them to knock it off.  It's embarrassing to me as an alum that this is permitted to go on year after year.

Not being as familiar with the history (and being across from the students), I thought that the chant was, "SIT on Witt."  However, given the smirks on the faces of some of the front-row students leading it, I can believe that it was vulgar instead.  As a member of the CoW community, I am disappointed and embarrassed.  That sort of thing has no place in athletics, and particularly not in scholastic/collegiate athletics.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 17, 2009, 11:14:41 PM
Back from Timken where it was great to see Wooster get an important NCAC win even if the crowd wasn't at a fever pitch.  I thought the attendance was pretty good given the snowy, cold weather though the Witt turnout was lower than normal.

Congratulations to Coach Moore on his 500th win! ;D  I am sure that this win is even sweeter for Coach Moore because it came against Wooster's biggest rival in a key conference game.

Kudos to both Ian Franks (22 points) and Justin Hallowell (14 pts, 4 three pointers) who both played very well tonight.  The defensive job that Marty Bidwell did on Witt's #1 scorer, Kevin Murray, was outstanding as he only scored 6 points (2 of 15 from the floor) and those 6 points came near the end of the game when Wooster was in control.

Wooster is now 10-5, 5-1 NCAC :)   Next week they play at Denison and Earlham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2009, 11:16:58 PM
Down at the KAC this afternoon, the Lords wiped out an uninspired Allegheny team, 74-51.  After five Kenyon possessions to start the game, the Lords had a 15-5 lead, with JT Knight contributing four of the five triples.  That seemed to take the wind out of the Gator sails, and they were never really in the game.  Coach Rob Clune did everything he could to fire up his team, calling his final timeout with still more than 10 minutes remaining, but it was to no avail.  Pretty much everyone on the Kenyon squad was on his game, with Knight pouring in 6 of 10 treys for a career-high 30 points, and big men Bryan Yelvington (18/15) and Dave Knapke (12/10) each notching double-doubles.  The Lords recorded 20 assists on their 25 baskets; Dave Jolson had more assists (7) than shots (5).  Yelvington, who had 5 assists as well as 3 steals, shut down and (evidently) demoralized Ryan Hollihan, who was just 1 for 8 from the floor before leaving the game in a chair-kicking huff with about 4 minutes left.  George Raftis was a bigger handful for Knapke, tossing in 17 points, but nobody else was able to get anything going for the visitors.  The Kenyon student section was out in force, and their heckling, considerably less vulgar than their Wooster counterparts, seemed to get under the Gators' skins, making their bad day that much worse.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 17, 2009, 11:17:59 PM
All the 1/17 NCAC Final Scores in one place: :)

Ohio Wesleyan 84  Earlham 70
Wabash 69  Oberlin 51
Kenyon 74  Allegheny 51
Wooster 68  Wittenberg 59
Hiram 74  Denison 46
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2009, 11:19:09 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 17, 2009, 11:14:41 PMCongratulations to Coach Moore on his 500th win!
Just to clarify, this was Coach Moore's 500th win as Wooster's head coach.  It's his 587th overall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 17, 2009, 11:22:07 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 1/17 games:

1. Wooster 5-1, 10-5
1. Hiram 5-1, 10-5
3. Kenyon 4-2, 10-5
3. Ohio Wesleyan 4-2, 8-6
3. Wittenberg 4-2, 7-7
6. Wabash 3-3, 8-6
6. Allegheny 3-3, 7-8
8. Oberlin 1-5, 4-10
9. Earlham 1-5, 1-14
10. Denison 0-6, 3-12
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 17, 2009, 11:26:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 17, 2009, 11:19:09 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 17, 2009, 11:14:41 PMCongratulations to Coach Moore on his 500th win!
Just to clarify, this was Coach Moore's 500th win as Wooster's head coach.  It's his 587th overall.

Yes, and the other 87 wins were at Muhlenberg College in Pennsylvania. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 18, 2009, 12:38:48 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 17, 2009, 10:20:59 PM
Fantastic 50,

You are right that the atmosphere wasn't what it usually is. The two main reasons, I think, are that the teams aren't as good this year, and Wittenberg had no students there. Where a lot of the energy comes from is the banter back and forth between the two student sections. Also, while Wooster never pulled away, the outcome didn't really ever feel in doubt in the second half. That may have led to the energy level being down somewhat.

I kinda want to disagree with this.  I actually think that the student "banter" is, at best, marginally helpful to the atmosphere of these games (it's loud, at least), and at worst, vulgar and consistently disrespectful, which takes away from an otherwise excellent atmosphere.  I didn't see tonight's game, but I have plenty of recent experience watching this rivalry both in Wooster and in Springfield, and in both places I consistently feel that the students' "contributions" help ruin/distract people from what is generally an otherwise excellent basketball game.

I prefer to think that the great crowd atmosphere has been a product of the national-calibre of recent Wooster and Wittenberg teams, which has drawn huge crowds.  Witt had a mini-tradition of beating Wooster immediately after Wooster reached a #1 ranking for a few years, for example.

Plus, rare are the games in this rivalry that are decided before more than 39 minutes of play has elapsed.  Even tonight, Wittenberg found a way back into the game late.  What is better at driving fan intensity than the feeling that no lead is truly safe until the final buzzer sounds?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: JohnDaly on January 18, 2009, 02:45:27 AM
seinfeld,

I have no idea who you think I am, but you are sadly mistaken. Yes I did change my name, but only because I had it TheDoggies because I am a browns fans, not because I support Hiram,Thus the reason why I changed it, I did not want that mistake to be made by other members, but hey I suppose you are entitled to your own opinion (say hi to george and kramer for me). To go back to the incident in 2006, I have only heard about this. I have never seen it so I have no basis to ever comment on that incident.

However, I did see the incident tonight, and I agree with the Wittenberg player. Obviously there is no need for a bucket at that time for Wooster to win. Up 9 with what about 5 seconds and the a STARTER is trying to run up the score? Come on now, thats high school JV stuff. I would expect a senior to have some class and not do that. But its just another thing to intensify the rivalry I guess.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2009, 09:23:51 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 17, 2009, 10:20:59 PM

Here is my reaction to the foul and the end of the game and the post game handshake. You can probably go either way as to whether Bidwell should have pulled up or gone in for the slam at the end of the game. My guess is that a majority of players would have gone in for the score in that situation. Given the intensity of the rivalry, and considering the game was still in doubt one possession before this, I don't think it was over the top for Bidwell to try to score. I also think Nowicki's foul wasn't out of line either. He actually got a lot of the ball, but certainly got a lot of body as well. I think that given Bidwell was trying to dunk when the game was over, it was fair for Nowicki to commit the hard foul. The key to this sequence is that Nowicki didn't come from behind or throw him down or anything that would have caused an injury (which was different about the foul on Port three years ago). And while there was a little bit of talking after the play, it wasn't anything that if it happened at the Div. I level, you would even think twice about.

I wasn't in attendance at the game, but I did catch the replay and I can understand the foul by Nowicki.  I didn't see it as over the top as he didn't even take Bidwell down.  What I didn't like was how Nowicki got in Bidwell's face after the foul as if he was trying to goad Bidwell into a reaction.  And Nowicki wasn't the only Witt player to run his mouth as there was another Witt player jawing at Bidwell as he was walking away from Nowicki. 

I can see where Bidwell should not have gone up for that dunk as the game was essentially over and the PC thing to do would have been to just hold the ball and let the time expire.  But, this is a heated rivalry and with emotions running high, I can see where Bidwell allowed his emotions to take over when he saw a breakaway dunk opportunity. 

And as a result, Nowicki decided to stop Bidwell's dunk attempt with a hard foul.  And like I said, I had no problem with the foul.  It was what Nowicki did after the foul that I had a problem with.  And I was real proud of Bidwell for just walking away in that situation!

Quote from: seinfeld on January 17, 2009, 10:20:59 PM

What I'm puzzled about is the reaction of Bill Brown. While I was on the opposite side of the floor (so obviously I couldn't hear anything), I watched the entire thing unfold. Moments after Steve Moore gets his 500th career win at Wooster, he has Bill Brown lecturing him at midcourt, holding up the line. I didn't see Steve say anything, it was all Brown. I don't think it was necessary for Brown to lecture Steve about that play, but that may be up for argument. But where Brown crossed the line in my opinion is that he stopped and was apparently trying to lecture Bidwell. There is no reason for Brown to talk to a Wooster player like that. The only circumstance I could see this being appropriate is if Bidwell had somehow committed a cheap foul that injured one of his players. That obviously didn't happen. On top of that, Brown continued to follow Bidwell through the line after Bidwell either said something or just continued to move on.

Brown is not the Dean Smith of Div. III basketball. His players have been known for their questionable antics over the years (BJ Harris comes to mind). His teams have jumped around Wooster's seal at midcourt after wins at Timken many times. They act like they win the national championship when they win a regular season game at Timken. While he may not have any control over the student section, Wittenberg students have left beer bottles on the floor after games, stolen chairs and rugs, so I mean, c'mon. There is nothing more hypocritical, to me, than someone thinking they are in a position to lecture someone else, especially someone that is not a part of your team/organization, when either your conduct or your team's conduct isn't perfect.

If Bill Brown doesn't like what happened, then use it to motivate his team. Don't patronize Steve Moore or Bidwell, a team captain, on their own floor.
I totally agree with you on this Seinfeld.  Who does Bill Brown think he is trying to come off all high and mighty about this whole incident???  Is it a guarantee that if the situation were reversed that one of his players wouldn't have done the same thing???  And as Seinfeld mentioned, it's not as if Brown hasn't had some players with questionable character issues over the years either.  I just don't get where he gets off with his lecturing antics at the end of the game.  To me, all this demonstrates about Bill Brown is that he is not very gracious in defeat...  Maybe Brown is the one that needs the lecture on how to take loss without acting like such a sore loser...  ::)   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2009, 09:43:36 AM
Turns out after reading the article in the  Wooster Daily Record (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4508061) Bidwell did have a few choice words for Nowicki.  It also appears that the two teams were jawing with each other all the way to their respective locker rooms.  Who said the rivalry would lose steam just because both programs are a bit down by their standards?  8)

I wonder what's in store for the rematch in Springfield next month?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 18, 2009, 10:20:02 AM
Here is the link to the Woo-Witt game article in the Springfield News-Sun: http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/s/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2009/01/18/sns011809spwitthoops.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2009, 11:29:37 AM
The whole thing is a tempest in a teapot. 

Some players would have backed the ball out rather than go for the dunk, but Marty Bidwell is not that type of player.  It was a tough game against a tough opponent who is your biggest rival and has been your biggest source of frustration many times in the past.  After beating them fairly decisively most of the night, suddenly Josh McKee drains a three with a hand in his face, then Kevin Murray, the guy you've shut down all night, hits another, and just like that your big lead is down to 5 and they've got the ball.  You and your team withstand the storm and get back out to a safe 7-point lead and the game is won.  Then with a couple of seconds left you find yourself with the opportunity you've waited your whole college career for, to dunk on your bitterest rival to punctuate a big home victory and give your coach his 500th win at Wooster.  Offhand I can't think of any Woo or Witt player over the years that wouldn't have taken that shot in that situation (remember Isaac Ward?), and it wasn't "cheap" or "dirty" to do so.

Now you're David Nowicki, and you see all of this unfold in front of you.  You're upset and frustrated about how this game got away from you, and even though your team didn't play terribly well, you still had a good chance to win, but a couple of threes went awry and that chance evaporated.  And the game's all but over, and here's the toughest, brashest player on their team going up for an in-your-face dunk.  You're not going to let that happen.  You're not trying to injure him, of course, but if he thinks he's going to dunk on you in this situation, you're going to make sure he pays a price for doing it.  I'd have fouled him, probably pretty hard, and I think most of the rest of you would have, too.  I don't think it was a "dirty" play at all.

This was followed with the amount of woofing and chest thumping you'd expect from such a situation in a rivalry this intense.  The fact that some of it came from Bill Brown was perhaps disappointing, except that it's not out of character for him; he's an emotional guy.  One must understand that this rivalry lives and burns in the hearts of the coaches at least as fiercely as it does with any player or fan.  Bill Brown hates to lose to Wooster, just as Steve Moore hates to lose to Wittenberg.  There's a whole lot of history with these two, and for them, it's not a friendly rivalry.  They're human, too, despite what we'd like to believe. 

In the final analysis it was just an understandable sequence of events in which nobody was hurt and only frayed nerves were irritated a bit.  And we move on to Wednesday's games, and keep the Valentine's Day rematch in the back of our minds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 18, 2009, 02:50:32 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 17, 2009, 09:55:15 PM
In sixteen years of watching Wooster play, I can't recall a single incident of a Wooster player taking a cheap, dangerous shot at an opponent. 

I can.  At the end of Wooster's game at Wabash, Marty Bidwell clocked Wabash freshman Derek Bailey with an elbow up around the head area that was, shall I say, less than sporting.  I didn't mention it at the time because it really isn't that important and I'm not in the business of thinking that every hard foul committed on a Little Giant is done with the intent to maim.  The kid took a shot at the end of a very frustrating game and I'm sure in hindsight he'd probably take it back if he could.  When you put super competitive 18-22 year olds on a field or court of competition, sometimes things get a little aggressive, particularly in instances when your team gets embarrassed.  It happens, Booster, and yes even some of your favorite Scots are susceptible to the occasional poor decision. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 18, 2009, 03:06:10 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2009, 11:29:37 AM
In the final analysis it was just an understandable sequence of events in which nobody was hurt and only frayed nerves were irritated a bit.  And we move on to Wednesday's games, and keep the Valentine's Day rematch in the back of our minds.

Nice post David! k+   You are quite right that both players, Bidwell and Nowicki, did what you would expect in an emotionally charged rivalry game.

Speaking of Wednesday's games ;), here is the schedule:

OWU at Witt
Hiram at Allegheny
Kenyon at Oberlin
Earlham at Wabash
Wooster at Denison

The best game on the slate is the Bishops playing at the Tigers.  Should be a great game and it will be interesting to see who picks up the win in that matchup.  I would like to see Allegheny give Hiram a game in Meadville but it doesn't look likely after the Gators poor showing against the Lords yesterday.  Kenyon, Wabash and Wooster look like heavy favorites in the other 3 games, IMO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 18, 2009, 05:49:01 PM
The big difference is this: Nobody gets hurt, except maybe for their feelings, when a player goes in for an unnecessary dunk at the end of a ballgame.  When somebody rams into that player from behind, there is a serious chance of injury.  And, no, Nowicki had no chance in hell of getting near that basketball.  Bidwell has at least half a foot on him and was well up in the air when Nowicki collided into him.  Bidwell has now taken two hits of this type in successive ballgames, hits that should not be a part of this game.  He was lucky to get away unhurt.  I call it dirty play, and I'll stand by it.  Players that do it, coaches that condone it, and fans that dismiss it are dirty players, unscrupulous coaches, and fans that are way off base in their thinking, in that order.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2009, 08:16:01 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fthesituationist.files.wordpress.com%2F2007%2F06%2F12-angry-men.jpg&hash=26770139dc6f2823e9b912319bccc42098d86fdd) (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0050083/)
;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 18, 2009, 10:12:48 PM
You might consider remembering the beginning of Twelve Angry Men, when Henry Fonda, also, stood alone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2009, 10:49:27 AM
Of course, it's a conspiracy! Everyone's out to get Wooster (Wabash, Wittenberg, Hiram, Oberlin, Kenyon, Denison, Allegheny, Ohio Wesleyan, Earlham) because they win all of the time (they're not competitive, they're from Ohio, they're not from Ohio) and the other teams are a bunch of thugs (hooligans, rapscallions, ne'er do wells, liberals, conservatives,unrepentant sinners) and get all of the calls.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on January 19, 2009, 11:08:29 AM
The game at Witt should be an interesting one.  Don't think I could talk the little lady into heading out for that game considering it will be on Valentines day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2009, 11:46:17 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 19, 2009, 10:49:27 AM
Of course, it's a conspiracy! Everyone's out to get Wooster (Wabash, Wittenberg, Hiram, Oberlin, Kenyon, Denison, Allegheny, Ohio Wesleyan, Earlham) because they win all of the time (they're not competitive, they're from Ohio, they're not from Ohio) and the other teams are a bunch of thugs (hooligans, rapscallions, ne'er do wells, liberals, conservatives,unrepentant sinners) and get all of the calls.


Over the top much???  ::)   

Give me a break...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2009, 11:55:27 AM
Um, that was called satire...kind of an NCAC mad lib. I meant to make it that you can mix and match the elements in the parenthesis.

I probably should have said:

Everyone's out to get ______________(A) because they ________________ (B) and the other teams in the NCAC are a bunch of _______________ (C) that get all of the calls.

A) Wooster, Wabash, Wittenberg, Hiram, Oberlin, Kenyon, Denison, Allegheny, Ohio Wesleyan, Earlham

B) they win all of the time; they're not competitive; they're from Ohio; they're not from Ohio

C) thugs, hooligans, rapscallions, ne'er do wells, liberals, conservatives, smarty pants, unrepentant sinners
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2009, 07:55:15 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 19, 2009, 11:55:27 AM
Um, that was called satire...kind of an NCAC mad lib. I meant to make it that you can mix and match the elements in the parenthesis.

C) thugs, hooligans, rapscallions, ne'er do wells, liberals, conservatives, smarty pants, unrepentant sinners


Smed - I especially like the addition of "smarty pants"!  After all, the NCAC is an academic conference! :) ;D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2009, 08:54:58 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 19, 2009, 11:55:27 AM
Everyone's out to get ______________(A) because they ________________ (B) and the other teams in the NCAC are a bunch of _______________ (C) that get all of the calls.

A) Wooster, Wabash, Wittenberg, Hiram, Oberlin, Kenyon, Denison, Allegheny, Ohio Wesleyan, Earlham

B) they win all of the time; they're not competitive; they're from Ohio; they're not from Ohio

C) thugs, hooligans, rapscallions, ne'er do wells, liberals, conservatives, smarty pants, unrepentant sinners

They they? ::)

(Would you expect less from a ne'er do well liberal smarty pants like me? ;))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2009, 09:37:19 PM
Congratulations to ____(A)______'s _________(B)_____________, this week's ________________(C)______________.  ________(B)______________ was honored for his ___________(D)_____________ against ____________(E)__________, which put ________(E)_____________ in a hole they couldn't climb out of.  The ___________(F)____________ from ______________(G)_____________ now leads the NCAC in ______________(H)___________ at .583.  Congratulations, ___________(B)_________!

(A) OWU, IWU, Moose Jaw
(B) Brent Pleiman, smedindy, Herve Villechaize
(C) NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html), nominee for Commerce Secretary, Publisher's Clearinghouse $20 million Sweepstakes Winner
(D) 20-point first half, astonishing good looks, ability to play "Among My Souvenirs" on the kazoo
(E) Wabash, the law, the University of Southern North Dakota at Hoople
(F) 6'8" junior post, Last of the Mohicans, three-time Academy Award nominee
(G) Russia (OH), Ohio (Russia), Moscow (ID)
(H) FG%, felony convictions, most offensive categories including nose hair

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 19, 2009, 11:48:05 PM
Wow, a University of Southern North Dakota at Hoople reference. Haven't heard that in years.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 20, 2009, 11:18:42 AM
Somebody please tell me that there isn't a University of Northern South Dakota.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on January 20, 2009, 11:33:55 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 20, 2009, 11:18:42 AM
Somebody please tell me that there isn't a University of Northern South Dakota.

It was founded by the same people that decided North Bend, OH should be south of South Bend, IN.  How can North Bend be South of South Bend?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 20, 2009, 12:21:27 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 20, 2009, 11:18:42 AM
Somebody please tell me that there isn't a University of Northern South Dakota.

*facepalm*

I'm just surprised that Mott's Applesauce isn't produced in Hoople.

/obscure, all the way to Memphis...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 20, 2009, 12:23:24 PM
Quote from: ziggy on January 20, 2009, 11:33:55 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 20, 2009, 11:18:42 AM
Somebody please tell me that there isn't a University of Northern South Dakota.

It was founded by the same people that decided North Bend, OH should be south of South Bend, IN.  How can North Bend be South of South Bend?

Why is there a Kansas City in Missouri as well as one in Kansas? Why is Texarkana named after three states, but is only located in two of them? Why is it called "Ohio" when it really isn't round on the ends and high in the middle, despite what Devo told us?

Questions for the ages.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 20, 2009, 12:24:52 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 20, 2009, 12:21:27 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 20, 2009, 11:18:42 AM
Somebody please tell me that there isn't a University of Northern South Dakota.

*facepalm*

I'm just surprised that Mott's Applesauce isn't produced in Hoople.

/obscure, all the way to Memphis...

For years I wondered why Ian was singing about Oreos.

Then I learned the real words.

I felt so ashamed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 20, 2009, 01:41:20 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 20, 2009, 12:24:52 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 20, 2009, 12:21:27 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 20, 2009, 11:18:42 AM
Somebody please tell me that there isn't a University of Northern South Dakota.

*facepalm*

I'm just surprised that Mott's Applesauce isn't produced in Hoople.

/obscure, all the way to Memphis...

For years I wondered why Ian was singing about Oreos.

Then I learned the real words.

I felt so ashamed.

Only flying monkeys sing about Oreos.  It's their passion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 20, 2009, 09:51:35 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 20, 2009, 01:41:20 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 20, 2009, 12:24:52 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 20, 2009, 12:21:27 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 20, 2009, 11:18:42 AM
Somebody please tell me that there isn't a University of Northern South Dakota.

*facepalm*

I'm just surprised that Mott's Applesauce isn't produced in Hoople.

/obscure, all the way to Memphis...

For years I wondered why Ian was singing about Oreos.

Then I learned the real words.

I felt so ashamed.

Only flying monkeys sing about Oreos.  It's their passion.

It was the Winkie Guards that sang about Oreos, not the flying monkeys.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 20, 2009, 11:19:17 PM
Ok, I concede, you know more useless things than I do. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 20, 2009, 11:53:17 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 20, 2009, 11:19:17 PM
Ok, I concede, you know more useless things than I do. :)

It's a strange gift, like being able to bend your thumb backwards or whistle "The Star-Spangled Banner" through your teeth. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 21, 2009, 08:41:46 AM
And what's so useless about THAT stuff?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on January 21, 2009, 03:06:07 PM
Wow...good thing we have a game tonight.
It seems that the crew is a bit off course. :-)

Nothing game night won't solve!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2009, 03:53:58 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on January 21, 2009, 03:06:07 PM
Wow...good thing we have a game tonight.
It seems that the crew is a bit off course. :-)

Nothing game night won't solve!!
True, although three of the games figure to be fairly non-competitive (no offense intended, BRF!), while the two that may be interesting (OWU at Witt, Hiram at 'Gheny) are unlikely to have any posters in attendance who can report on them--unless the Witt contingent suddenly re-emerges, that is.  As for me, I'm going to make my long-delayed first-ever visit to the friendly confines of Philips Gymnasium for the battle between the Lords and the Yeomen, something that sounds less like a game than a revolution.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 21, 2009, 06:40:32 PM
David.........Have no fear I am going to be in attendance at the game and will provide some insight as to both teams. I haven't seen Wittenberg much this year so my opinion will be somewhat based on this game but I know how OWU's offense usually runs so don't worry. I will come through! Sorry guys, a full time job keeps you busy
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2009, 08:09:51 PM
At the Half:   Wooster 32  Denison 28

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 8 points, Nathan Balch with 7 points and Justin Hallowell with 6 points.  Scots led by 10 points and then hit a cold spell which allowed the Big Red to narrow the margin.  Wooster had 9 turnovers in the half. :(

Denison's leading scorers are Chris Luther with 10 points and freshman Mike Garabedian with 9 points.

UPDATES:  12:20 left  Wooster 51 Denison 37  Scots are stretching their lead.
~9 mins left:  Wooster 62  Denison 44  Scots have now made 8 three pointers.
6:35 left:  Wooster 73-46  Scots getting fast break buckets now and the subs are coming in.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2009, 08:11:56 PM
At the Half:  Ohio Wesleyan 37  Wittenberg 23

OWU is being led by Rob Gardiner with 10 points.  Bishops shot 61% from the floor and made 3 three pointers.

Witt's leading scorer is Michael Cooper with 8 points.  Tigers only shot 37% from the floor

UPDATES:  ~11:00 min. left  OWU 43  Witt 35  Tigers are narrowing the Bishops lead.
~7 mins left:  OWU 50  Witt 39  Bishops still shooting well at 52% from the floor.
~3:00 left:  OWU 56 Witt 41  Tigers only shooting 35% from the floor
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 21, 2009, 08:27:16 PM
Wabash leads earlham 31-30 at the half. Wabash tried to get away with leaving Wes out tonight but it took about two minutes to see that Gregory was going to be trouble for any other Little Giant to guard. So Wes plays which is good to see after his hard fall on Saturday. No stars handy at the moment but I'll try to work those in.

Wes Smith leads wabash with 7 points. Tristian Gregory leads all scorers with 10 points.

Smith just picked up his fourth foul with 16 minutes to play. Not good for LGs. 35-34 wabash is the score here.

Earlham is in the bonus with 14 minutes to go. This is not a good second half so far for the home team. The EC is playing with a ton of confidence. The score is 46-39. Timeout for Mac Petty. 12:19 to play.

7 minutes to go and wabash is all out of sorts with Wes on the bench. Nobody to guard Gregory and nobody to trigger the offense. 54-44 quake at the moment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 21, 2009, 09:00:47 PM
Maloney threw a long pass to Brock who threw up a shot. The crowd seemed to think a foul should have been called. Radio guys disagree and think a non-call was appropriate. Either way, Wabash came back from a big deficit but it ultimately wasn't enough. Tough loss at home.

Earlham 68
Wabash 67 Final.

Wabash is so up and down. They get a big win against Wooster. Get blasted on the road by OWU. Then come home and beat Oberlin. Then lose a tough game at home to Earlham.

Which team shows up is like a coin flip.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 21, 2009, 09:03:57 PM
Huge run for wabash here. 2 minutes to play and we are knotted at 60-60. Wabash Always Fights is on full display this evening. Aaron Brock has been huge to this run for Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2009, 09:05:05 PM
Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 63  Wittenberg 48

Nice road win for the Bishops as they shot very well tonight.  OWU was led by Rob Gardiner with 13, Tim Brady with 13 and Pat Pellerite with 10 points.

Witt was led tonight by Kevin Murray with 11 points, Michael Cooper with 10 points and Mark Snyder with 8.  Big free throw disparity in this game with OWU taking 25 charity tosses to only 4 for the Tigers.

OWU is now 5-2 NCAC and Witt falls to 4-3 NCAC.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2009, 09:09:32 PM
Final:  Wooster 86  Denison 66

Wooster gets the road win and they were led by Ian Franks with 16 points, Nathan Balch with 12 points (6 assists), Matt Fegan with 12 (4 three pointers) and Marty Bidwell with 11 points.  Justin Hallowell had 8 points and 9 boards.  Scots shot 52% from the floor and made 10 of 21 three pointers (47%).

Denison was led by freshman Mike Garabedian with 20 points and Chris Luther with 10 points.  The Big Red shot 39% from the floor.  Garabedian got his first start of the season and my guess is that he just became a permanent starter for Denison. :P ::)

Wooster is now 11-5, 6-1 NCAC. :)  Next game is at Earlham on Saturday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2009, 09:24:38 PM
All the 1/21 NCAC Final Scores in one list:

Kenyon 77  Oberlin 53
Earlham 68  Wabash 67
Wooster 86  Denison 66
Ohio Wesleyan 63  Wittenberg 48
Hiram 65 Allegheny 61
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2009, 09:49:27 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 1/21 Games:

1.  Wooster 6-1, 11-5
1.  Hiram 6-1, 11-5
3.  Kenyon 5-2, 11-5
3.  Ohio Wesleyan 5-2, 9-6
5.  Wittenberg 4-3, 7-8
6.  Wabash 3-4, 8-7
6.  Allegheny 3-4, 7-9
8.  Earlham 2-5, 2-14
9.  Oberlin 1-6, 4-11
10. Denison 0-7, 3-13
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2009, 11:02:54 PM
The Kenyon/Oberlin game was a real snoozer.  With Mike Loll not playing (unsure as to why), Oberlin had no defensive answer for Bryan Yelvington and Dave Knapke, and on the other end had no scoring punch.  Jordan Beard was held to 8 points, and the Yeo turned the ball over 22 times, about half of them plain giveaways, directly resulting in 32 KC points.  JT Knight knocked down 9 of 17 for 24 points, while the aforementioned post duo combined for 36 points on 13 of 15 shooting from the field (generally from within 2 feet) and 9 of 9 at the line.  The Lords only put forth such intensity as was required to put the game away in frosty Philips Gym; an indication of this was that they were whistled for just 10 fouls, 3 of them by bench jockeys in the final 1:15 of the game. 

Philips Gym is a reasonably nice facility.  It's one of the better-lit gyms in the NCAC, although I am told that the lighting is new.  It was awfully cold inside, perhaps due in part to the lack of body warmth in the arena.  When the national anthem was played, there were 15 spectators in attendance.  Perhaps 30 or 40 students eventually drifted in, but by the time they began to arrive OC was down by double figures, and the Yeo Crew never seemed to be paying any attention to the game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 22, 2009, 10:08:38 AM
I guess last night was the traditional inexplicable home NCAC loss to a bottom feeder for Wabash. Unlike past years, this one really smarts since the conference is really up in the for all tourney seedings.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 22, 2009, 05:11:56 PM
It was a curious game for sure, smeds.  After digesting it for a night there were a few things that struck me as odd.

- Wes Smith doesn't start but comes into the game after just a few minutes.  I imagine Wes was still feeling some effects from the fall last Saturday, but if your best player is good enough to dress, he's probably good enough to start. 

- My guess is that Wes came in when it became really obvious that aside from Smith, Wabash didn't have anybody who was going to be able to guard Tristian Gregory.  Dominique Thomas (first game back from an ankle sprain, btw) did about as well you could have expected him to do given that the matchup is a huge physical mismatch that favors Gregory.  Rosters list the two as being about the same size (Gregory 6-2, Thomas 6-1), but my eyes tell me that somebody's roster isn't telling the whole truth and nothing but the truth.  But even if the physical mismatch isn't as much as it appeared to me, Gregory is one of the best players in the league and Thomas is a role player and Gregory had little trouble driving to the goal or just taking jumpshots when he was being checked by Thomas. 

- So how are the two above points related?  With 15 seconds left and Earlham playing for the last shot of regulation, everybody in central Indiana knows that Gregory is taking that shot.  I fully expected to see Wes Smith check in out of the time out and guard Gregory, for better or worse.  But no Wes.  Predictably, Earlham works the ball to Gregory at about the center of the court.  Gregory holds, holds, holds, then walks his dribble up to the top of the arc and takes his jumpshot as if nobody was there (Thomas was guarding him, but not even close to a threat to be able to disrupt his jumper), and drains it.  Smith is by far the best defender Wabash has...he'd already been used in the game so holding him out didn't seem necessary, wasn't disqualified due to fouls...so why was he on the bench for the last 15 seconds?  I'm sure there's something I don't know, but it seemed weird to me that Wabash's best defender was left on the bench in that end-of-game situation. 

But oh well...disappointing for sure but there is more basketball to play.  Everybody in the league right now is playing for those three games in the conference tournament.  I think any team in this league from 1-7 can be the best team over a three game stretch.  We'll find out in February who that team is. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: LGHistorian on January 23, 2009, 01:57:05 AM
Smed & Wally-
     This is only a theory as I do not have inside info but I do have experience of following Mac's entire coaching career at Wabash and general knowledge of his rules.
     First off, Wes suffered a deep bone bruise in his back and was examined for a concussion after his fall Saturday.  If he indeed suffered even a mild concussion he more than likely missed practice time the past few days.  Under Mac's rules for playing, if you miss any practice time, regardless of the circumstances you do not start. (For example, years ago, one of Wabash's all-time greats Chris Whitfield missed practice during his senior year either because of a job interview or some other type of post graduate exploration.  Mac did not start him due to the missed practice in spite of the fact he was Wabash's best player.)  I remember I was pretty upset at the time because I felt the pursuit of a job or further schooling should have been an legitimate excuse for missing practice.
     It was also obvious on a couple of occasions that Wes was suffering residual pain from Saturday.  He got up wincing in pain after a scramble on the floor for the ball that was ruled a held ball.  Also Wes bailed out at midcourt on what would have been a 3 on none breakaway.  It was also noticeable to me that Wes was not playing inside a great deal nor was he driving as much to the basket against Earlham as he did against Oberlin.  Whether this was by design or there was just a lack of trust that he would be safe to play under the basket - I can't say - it just was what I saw going on IMO.
     As a final note the article in the Paper of Montgomery Co. had Mac saying that the team knew they had to defend the 3 at the end of the game and they knew who would have the ball in that situation.  Wabash was supposed to force him to drive and instead allowed the Earlham player enough space to shoot the winning basket.  Mac said the team didn't play smart basketball down the final few minutes of the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 23, 2009, 10:41:01 AM
All good points, LGH.  There's no question that Wes was not at 100% Wednesday night (I was surprised he was able to play at all frankly...his spill last Saturday was about as hard a fall as I've seen in 13 years of watching games at Chadwick), but even if he's not 100%, I would have thought that he'd be the one on Gregory at the end of the game there.  At the very least Wes has enough length to bother Gregory's shot.  Oh well...c'est la vie. 

One big positive from Wedensday and going back to Saturday has been the re-emergence of Aaron Brock in the post for Wabash.  Brock is starting to look more like the guy that went off during the Little Giant NCAC tournament run last season and Wabash will need the assertive Aaron Brock (and a healthy Wes Smith) if they are going to have a shot to win those last three games in the tournament and punch a dance ticket. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 24, 2009, 03:18:57 PM
Five minutes into the game in Richmond and Wooster has yet to miss a shot from the field and as a result lead 20-4!!!  8) 

Wooster is 7-7 overall and 4-4 from deep early in this one!

Perfect start for the Scots who seem to always struggle in their games at the EC and also considering that the EC was coming into this game with some confidence as a result of their upset of Wabash earlier in the week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2009, 03:37:07 PM
At the Half:  Hiram 42  Oberlin 26

Ian Pfouts is leading the Terriers with 9 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2009, 03:43:53 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 55  Earlham 32 :)

Wooster hit 12 of their first 14 shots and 7 of those were three pointers!  Scots are being led by Matt Fegan with 9 points (3 three pointers), Justin Hallowell with 8 points, Nathan Balch with 8 points, Bryan Wickliffe also with 8 points and Ian Franks with 7 points.  Wooster made 9 three pointers in the half.  Scots shot 75% from the floor in the half.

Earlham's leading scorers are Tristian Gregory with 13 points and AJ Sutherlin with 8 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 24, 2009, 04:01:20 PM
Looks like Witt is responding in their must win game at Kenyon.

They lead 52-32 early in the 2nd half!  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2009, 04:26:45 PM
Final:  Hiram 74  Oberlin 59

Hiram gets the road win and moves their record to 12-5, 7-1 NCAC.  Terriers were led by Ian Pfouts with 16 points.

Jordan Beard was the leading scorer for Oberlin with 20 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2009, 04:33:45 PM
Final:  Wooster 109  Earlham 86 :)

Wooster ran away with this game by making 15 three pointers and they got the easy road win.  Scots were led by Nathan Balch with 17 points (5 three pointers), Marty Bidwell with 15 points, Bryan Wickliffe also with 15, Ian Franks with 13 points, Justin Hallowell with 12 points and Matt Fegan with 11 points.  Wooster shot 68% from the floor today and won the boards 37 to 26.

Earlham was led by Tristian Gregory with 29 points and A.J. Sutherlin with 20 points.  Quakers are now 2-15, 2-6 NCAC.

Wooster is now 12-5, 7-1 NCAC. ;D

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2009, 04:44:38 PM
Final:  Wittenberg 74  Kenyon 61

Tigers get a nice road win in Gambier.  Both Witt and Kenyon are now 5-3 in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2009, 05:25:28 PM
One more final...OWU beats Allegheny in Meadville 64-60.  No stats or game stories are available as of yet. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 24, 2009, 05:31:50 PM
Nice balance shown by the Scots today with 6 of the 11 players that made the trip to Richmond scoring in double figures!  And Drew Sawyer was only a bucket away from joining the double figures party!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2009, 08:28:46 PM
Halftime at Wabash where Denison leads the Little Giants 37-28. Denison shot 50% in the first half while Wabash shot considerably less than that. This was a pretty poor effort from the LGs all the way around.

Good group of Denison fans made the trip but they sure are an angry bunch. They need a hug I think.

Wabash is led by Smith, Brock, and Maloney who have 8 points each. Denison is paced by Garabedian and his 9 points but Larry Farmer is Denison's best player. I don't understand why he isn't used more.

Here's to a better second half for Wabash!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2009, 08:50:53 PM
With just over five minutes gone at Kenyon, J.T. Knight had personally outscored Wittenberg; his 7 points contributed to a 14-6 KC lead with the hosts seemingly in control.  Then Knight stepped into a backcourt passing lane trying for a steal, but instead committed his second foul.  Sent to the bench for the remainder of the half, Wittenberg chose to pack in the defense and dare the other Kenyon guards to shoot over the defense.  They did, and failed (0-5), and Witt converted that 8-point deficit into a 10-point halftime lead (which would have been 12 if not for a phantom technical foul called on Witt's Chris Sullivan).  After Knight's departure, Kenyon's offense consisted of a 5-of-7 performance by Bryan Yelvington, a putback by Allen Bediako, and nine turnovers, while at the other end Witt was unconscious, hitting 11 of 18 shots including 14 points from Kevin Murray, while turning the ball over just four times.  Knight returned to the floor to begin the second half, but missed his first four jumpshots as Witt used a 17-4 run to put the game out of reach.  KC did mount a 13-4 run to close the gap to 12, but the visitors remained on fire, hitting 56% of their second half shots (they were better than 62% for the game), and the Lords could get no closer.  

With the win, Wittenberg (8-8, 5-3 NCAC) passes the ceremonial Must-Win Game Albatross over to Kenyon (11-6, 5-3) who will take it with them to Hiram (12-5, 7-1) on Wednesday in an attempt to stay in the conference race.  Wittenberg gets to return home for their next three games, but all of them are minefields: Wabash (8-8, 3-5), then Transylvania (13-4), then Hiram.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2009, 08:57:57 PM
Wally, or anyone else who's seen him, I'm interested in your opinion of Denison's wonderfrosh Mike Garabedian.  He had 20 points against Wooster and already has 20 this evening.  EDIT:  finished the game with 26 on 9/17 from the floor and 7/9 from the line.

EDIT:  Denison hangs on and wins 78-72.  First NCAC win of the season for Denison, and it happens in one of the toughest places in the NCAC to win. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2009, 10:00:35 PM
All the NCAC 1/24 Final Scores in one list:

Hiram 74  Oberlin 59
Wooster 109  Earlham 86
Wittenberg 74  Kenyon 61
Ohio Wesleyan 64  Allegheny 60
Denison 78  Wabash 72
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2009, 10:05:19 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 1/24 Games:

1.  Wooster 7-1, 12-5
1.  Hiram 7-1, 12-5
3.  Ohio Wesleyan 6-2, 10-6
4.  Wittenberg 5-3, 8-8
4.  Kenyon 5-3, 11-6
6.  Wabash 3-5, 8-8
6.  Allegheny 3-5, 7-10
8.  Earlham 2-6, 2-15
9.  Oberlin 1-7, 4-13
9.  Denison 1-7, 4-13
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2009, 11:19:29 PM
Time to heap a ton of credit onto the Big Red for taking it to the Little Giants tonight.  Denison was faster and sharper than Wabash all night long and when you do that, you win.  Denison, winless at the time, also gave Wabash a very difficult time last season at Chadwick.  I said it then and it bears repeating now, I really don't understand why that team isn't winning more games.  Maybe they don't bring it like they do against Wabash.  Who knows. 

And now it's time to talk about what the heck just happened here.  Seven days ago, Wabash was 2-3 in the league staring at home games vs. Oberlin, Earlham, and Denison in the next week.  Top half of the standings here we come, right?  Wrong.  Wabash dropped two games and got their best player injured with 90 seconds left in a double digit win.  Frankly, this week couldn't have been any worse for the Little Giants.  Against Earlham and again tonight against Denison, Wabash was sloppy on offense, a step slow on defense, and just out of sorts in pretty much every way.  Aaron Brock has been about the lone bright spot (23 more points for Aaron tonight).  It's gut check time for Wabash.  The LGs have 8 more games to get right before the NCAC tournament starts up.  Hopefully something will relight the fuse for these guys soon. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2009, 11:26:04 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 24, 2009, 08:57:57 PM
Wally, or anyone else who's seen him, I'm interested in your opinion of Denison's wonderfrosh Mike Garabedian.  He had 20 points against Wooster and already has 20 this evening.  EDIT:  finished the game with 26 on 9/17 from the floor and 7/9 from the line.

I was pretty impressed with Garabedian.  He's certainly not built like a freshman...very good size for a kid in his first year of college basketball.  As mentioned, he torched Wabash for 26 and just hit big shot after big shot in the second half.  Based on what I saw tonight, he's going to be a really good player in this league. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 25, 2009, 12:00:24 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2009, 11:19:29 PM
Maybe they don't bring it like they do against Wabash.  Who knows. 

I could say the same thing about Wabash when they play Wooster...

I mean, Wabash played out of their minds when the Scots came to C'ville and then proceeded to lose back to back games at home to teams that the Scots have since handled easily on the road as well??? 

Talk about a team that is hard to gauge at the moment...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2009, 06:51:03 PM
The last two times Wabash and Wooster have met, Wabash is 2-0 with an average margin of victory of 20.5 ppg.  The only other NCAC team to beat Wooster the last two seasons was Wittenberg, and that was by one point in overtime.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on January 26, 2009, 10:25:36 AM
CONGRATS to the BIG RED!!!!

Huge win for the Big Red....first time in history of Wabash coming into the NCAC for the Big Red to win at Wabash.

Sounds like Coach Giloni may have a bunch of potentially very good freshman.  Garabedian sounds like the real deal.

With Earlham up next, maybe, just maybe, the Big Red can get on a roll here to finish the season strong and sneak in the back door!!!


Looking at the stats free throws were the difference.   25 of 29 for the Big Red.  That is stepping up when you have to.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2009, 11:01:38 AM
Quote from: BigRedFan on January 26, 2009, 10:25:36 AM
CONGRATS to the BIG RED!!!!

Huge win for the Big Red....first time in history of Wabash coming into the NCAC for the Big Red to win at Wabash.

Sounds like Coach Giloni may have a bunch of potentially very good freshman.  Garabedian sounds like the real deal.

With Earlham up next, maybe, just maybe, the Big Red can get on a roll here to finish the season strong and sneak in the back door!!!


Looking at the stats free throws were the difference.   25 of 29 for the Big Red.  That is stepping up when you have to.

Free throws do stand out in the box score, but what the box score doesn't show is how much faster and sharper Denison was than Wabash.  They simply looked like the better basketball team on Saturday night. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on January 26, 2009, 03:04:15 PM
Thanks Wally that is some very welcome news!!

I know the Big Red has had some tough losses. 

Again, maybe they can keep it up and close strong. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2009, 05:11:46 PM
Tristian Gregory's game-winning three-pointer at Wabash not only sent the Little Giants into a tailspin, it also earned the EC senior the coveted NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html) award.  Gregory had 52 points combined against Wabash and Wooster, keeping him just ahead of Kenyon's Bryan Yelvington on the NCAC's scoring charts (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/08-09stats/CONFLDRS.HTM).  Congratulations, Tristian!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2009, 07:11:20 PM
We've got more bad weather headed our way.  This is from the Columbus Dispatch:
QuoteGrab some extra bread and milk and locate your snow shovel.

The National Weather Service posted a winter storm warning for a large chunk of Ohio, including Franklin and surrounding counties, early this evening.

Up to 6 to 9 inches of snow are possible by the time the winter storm ends Wednesday afternoon, according to forecasters.

Light snow is expected to begin tonight and continue into Tuesday, with some freezing drizzle possible Tuesday afternoon, according to the warning. One to 2 inches of snow are possible through Tuesday afternoon.

Then, the heavy stuff is forecast to overspread the region Tuesday night into Wednesday, with another 5 to 8 inches of snow expected.

The winter storm warning is in effect from 10 p.m. tonight to noon Wednesday.

Travel could be "very hazardous or impossible," according to the National Weather Service, in the area along a line north of I-70 to the Ohio River.
That line seems to extend into central Indiana, at least.  That puts Earlham at Denison (I-70 all the way) squarely at risk, as well as Wabash at Wittenberg.  Further north, we have this winter storm watch from the NWS:
QuoteAN AREA OF LOW PRESSURE WILL MOVE UP THE TENNESSEE VALLEY LATE
TUESDAY INTO WEDNESDAY. WINTRY PRECIPITATION ASSOCIATED WITH THIS
LOW IS EXPECTED TO OVERSPREAD THE AREA FROM SOUTHWEST TO NORTHEAST
BEGINNING LATE TUESDAY. BY TUESDAY EVENING MOST OF THE AREA SHOULD
BE SEEING LIGHT TO MODERATE SNOW. SIGNIFICANT ACCUMULATIONS OF
SNOW WILL BE POSSIBLE ALONG AND EAST OF LINE FROM MANSFIELD TO
JUST SOUTHEAST OF CLEVELAND TO ASHTABULA. ACCUMULATIONS OF 4 TO 6
INCHES ARE POSSIBLE TUESDAY NIGHT IN THIS AREA WITH ANOTHER COUPLE
INCHES LIKELY ON WEDNESDAY. THE SNOW IS EXPECTED TO QUICKLY END
FROM WEST TO EAST WEDNESDAY AFTERNOON.
Hiram, due to host Kenyon, is squarely in the path of this one (Hiram's been squarely in the path of every snowstorm since 1830), while Allegheny would have to drive right through it to get to Wooster.  And Oberlin would have to deal with both parts of this storm (the northern and southern portions) in trying to get to OWU.  (The women's slate, at Allegheny, Oberlin, Kenyon, and Denison, are all also at risk.)

In short, I wouldn't make any plans I couldn't cancel.  With the forecast improving from Wednesday into Thursday, some teams may take a cautious approach and push their games back a day.  If you hear of any postponements, please post them in here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2009, 09:49:41 PM
Us Minnesotans scoff at 4 to 6 inches as mere ground cover. Heh.

;) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 26, 2009, 10:36:13 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 26, 2009, 09:49:41 PM
Us Minnesotans scoff at 4 to 6 inches as mere ground cover. Heh.

;) :D

This year, us Michiganders, too. :P

The problem is getting to be that there is no place to put the damn stuff - my driveway is nearly 3 feet deep on both sides, and some roads are beginning to resemble tunnels.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 27, 2009, 12:08:23 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 26, 2009, 07:11:20 PM
(Hiram's been squarely in the path of every snowstorm since 1830)

Correct.  'Twas Andy 'By God" Jackson himself that declared Hiram a national disaster area and it has remained so to this day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 27, 2009, 04:20:25 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 26, 2009, 09:49:41 PM
Us Minnesotans scoff at 4 to 6 inches as mere ground cover. Heh.

;) :D
The National Weather Service has heard your scoffing and has upped the ante:

Forecast for the northeastern section of the NCAC (affecting Allegheny, Hiram, Oberlin, Wooster, and Kenyon):
Quote from: National Weather Service with emphasis addedA Winter Storm Warning remains in effect until 4 PM EST
Wednesday for northeast and north central Ohio.

Heavy snow will spread across the region this evening and last
through the first half of Wednesday as low pressure moves through
the Ohio Valley. Snow will increase in intensity this evening and
continue through the overnight hours. Snow will be heavy at
times... especially around daybreak Wednesday. By the time the
snow tapers off Wednesday afternoon most of the region should see
7 to 10 inches of new snow accumulation. Some blowing and drifting
of snow will be possible Wednesday afternoon as winds increase out
of the northwest.

Forecast for the I-70 section of the NCAC, where it has already begun to snow (affecting Denison, Ohio Wesleyan, Wittenberg, Earlham, and perhaps Wabash):
Quote from: National Weather Service with emphasis addedA Winter Storm Warning remains in effect until 12 PM EST
Wednesday.

Snow will mix with sleet and freezing rain overnight. The wintry
precipitation will change back to all snow early tomorrow morning.
Then the snow will taper off from west to east tomorrow afternoon.

An additional 3 to 5 inches of snow and sleet will occur tonight
along with up to one tenth of an inch of ice accumulation. Another
2 to 3 inches of snow can be expected tomorrow.

Total snow accumulation for the entire event will be 7 to 11
inches.

Especially considering that conditions look to improve rapidly on Wednesday evening and Thursday, I'm expecting that most or all of tomorrow's games will be pushed back to Thursday.  This especially sucks for Wittenberg (forecast for Springfield is 8-12"), who has a game scheduled for Friday night vs. Transylvania and another Saturday vs. Hiram.  If their game with Wabash is pushed to Thursday, they'd have three games in three nights.  At least they'd all be home games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 27, 2009, 04:35:35 PM
Seems a silly thing to schedule out of conference smack dab in the middle of conference play.  That's why we have November and December!  How realistic do you suppose it would be for Wittenberg to postpone or maybe even more likely cancel that game vs. Transy?  Three games in three nights is hard...particularly when that third game is against the conference co-leader who is working off of a more normal rest. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 27, 2009, 05:27:52 PM
I don't know why that Transy game is there, but it was there in the original schedule.  I think Witt and Transy had a home-and-home contract (Witt played in Lexington in Dec. 2007) and maybe this was the only date they could agree on.  Witt's original schedule, therefore, had three games in four days, and three games in three days is only slightly worse.  It's also not unheard of; I think some of the 8-team holiday tournaments like those in Phoenix, San Diego, and Daytona, are set up that way.  Last season's NAIA-1 national champs, Oklahoma City, played five games in six days to win that tournament.

I also don't know the ins and outs of athletics management, so I can't begin to guess how difficult it would be for Witt to get out of their game with Transy, assuming they even would want to.  No doubt the Pioneers will want to play it if possible; it's a regional game (same administrative region, and within 200 miles) and Transy looks like a valid Pool C aspirant. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 27, 2009, 08:47:43 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 27, 2009, 05:27:52 PM
Witt's original schedule, therefore, had three games in four days, and three games in three days is only slightly worse.  It's also not unheard of; I think some of the 8-team holiday tournaments like those in Phoenix, San Diego, and Daytona, are set up that way.  Last season's NAIA-1 national champs, Oklahoma City, played five games in six days to win that tournament.

Exactly!  The original schedule had 3 games in 4 days which isn't exactly a cake walk in the middle of the conference schedule.  So now they will more than likely have to play 3 games in 3 nights.  As David noted, while it may be more difficult, it is only slightly more than what Witt's original schedule entailed.  And besides, that's what you get when you schedule a non-conference tilt smack dab in the middle of the conference schedule...  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 27, 2009, 11:06:31 PM
I have now found out that the Witt/Transy game was originally scheduled for Nov. 19 but had to be rescheduled, and it landed on Jan. 30 because no other suitable date could be found.  It's a tough break that the resulting three game stretch ended up being right after the year's biggest snowstorm.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 28, 2009, 09:14:13 AM
No word yet of a cancellation at Wooster despite there being eleven feet of snow on the ground here.  I'm going to try to get some of the visiting Alegheny players to shovel my walk...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 28, 2009, 09:47:31 AM
Let the postponements begin....as predicted by DC, tonight's Wabash/Witt game has been pushed back to tomorrow evening (http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=6631). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2009, 10:07:09 AM
The Denison doubleheader (Wittenberg women, Earlham men) is off (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/); the women's game will be held tomorrow, while the men's game is still up in the air.
Kenyon's games with Hiram (men at Hiram, women at Gambier) are off (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28638.xml) until tomorrow; the women will tip at 7:30 while the men's tip is TBA.
Wabash's game at Wittenberg has been postponed (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/) until (tentatively) tomorrow, as Wally noted.  It's so bad in Springfield today that the University is closed (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/2009/snowstorm0128.html).
The Oberlin/OWU games (men at Delaware, women at Oberlin) and the Wooster/Allegheny games (men at Wooster, women at Meadville) are still on at the moment, or at least none of the websites have announced a postponement.  If the Allegheny players are indeed shoveling Wooster Booster's snow, then the game will surely be played, but I doubt it.  Allegheny makes a fair number of overnight trips competing in this mostly distant conference, but I don't think Wooster is one of them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 28, 2009, 11:02:43 AM
I shovelled a bit of my driveway about half an hour ago, then came in to get warm and have some breakfast.  Magically, when I looked out the window, the whole front sidewalk and driveway was clear.  Honest.  I don't know who did it, and doubt that it was anyone from Alegheny, but it happened.  Probably just some wayward Wittenberg students with nothing to do.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2009, 11:42:50 AM
All men's and women's games are now off for tonight and rescheduled for tomorrow night.  (http://www.northcoast.org/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2009, 01:52:19 PM
Wittenberg's scheduled game vs. Transylvania, originally set for Nov. 19 then moved to Jan. 30, has now been canceled (http://www.transy.edu/athletics/go/m_basketball/0128post.htm).  It will not be rescheduled again; Witt will play a 24-game schedule.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 28, 2009, 03:37:22 PM
As per DC already stating, the Witt game vs Transylvania has been cancelled. As alos pointed out it was supposed to be scheduled in the preseason and Wittenberg actually had NCAA permission to schedule the game 2 days prior to the "official" season starting because of scheduling difficulties, however the NCAC wouldn't give Wittenberg permission.......don't know the politics there either guys.

Coach Brown gave his players the option to cancel it or play it as originally scheduled and the players chose to go on and play it as they are competitors. It's all moot now though.

This is all from the Springfield News Sun blog page, but also personal references inside the Wittenberg community.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 29, 2009, 11:29:05 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 28, 2009, 03:37:22 PM
... Wittenberg actually had NCAA permission to schedule the game 2 days prior to the "official" season starting because of scheduling difficulties, however the NCAC wouldn't give Wittenberg permission.......don't know the politics there either guys.

I didn't realize the NCAC didn't adopt the Division III start date of Nov. 15. Is that the case? Nov. 19 is a playing date every year now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2009, 12:22:26 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 29, 2009, 11:29:05 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 28, 2009, 03:37:22 PM
... Wittenberg actually had NCAA permission to schedule the game 2 days prior to the "official" season starting because of scheduling difficulties, however the NCAC wouldn't give Wittenberg permission.......don't know the politics there either guys.

I didn't realize the NCAC didn't adopt the Division III start date of Nov. 15. Is that the case? Nov. 19 is a playing date every year now.
Two teams started earlier, Allegheny and Kenyon's men's teams.  Both were locked into tournaments (at Rutgers-Newark and Chicago, respectively).  My understanding is that the NCAC Presidents were reluctant (or even unwilling) to agree to the new, earlier start date (a predictable position for the NCAC Presidents), but they made exceptions so that Rutgers-Newark's and Chicago's tournaments weren't sabotaged.  They did not make an exception for Wittenberg's one-off game with Transylvania, with the result that it had to be rescheduled.  Witt and Transy had no usable off dates in common until January, and Witt's attempts to shift their conference slate around to make room for a Transy game were fruitless.

Factoring into that, I think, is the fact that Wittenberg had no significant downtime in their schedule, with games scheduled every week in November (starting on the 19th) and December.  Their longest stretch with no scheduled games was Dec. 14-21 inclusive (hosted Hiram 12/13, played at Otterbein 12/22).  I recall, but can't find the documentation to prove, that the earlier start date included an NCAA-mandated provision that the overall season length not be extended.  Teams that chose to play in that first week (Nov. 15-21) had to have a week with no games or practices later in the schedule to compensate.  Both Allegheny (idle in Dec. after 12/11) and Kenyon (no games between 12/23 and 1/2 inclusive) met that criterion, but Wittenberg couldn't.  This is just my educated guess, and would appreciate any corrections or amplifications.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 29, 2009, 03:26:14 PM
So the NCAC will continue with the previous date of "Friday before Thanksgiving?"

Little conference-level differences like these are vastly superior to splitting up the entire division. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 29, 2009, 07:56:24 PM
31-20 Witt with about 4 minutes to go in the first half

Murray has 9 and Witt in general can't miss from outside.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 29, 2009, 08:06:19 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 56  Allegheny 30

This game is over at the half as Wooster has a commanding lead.  Scots are being led by Justin Hallowell with 14 points and Marty Bidwell with 13 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 29, 2009, 08:58:26 PM
Final:  Wooster 93  Allegheny 76 :)

Wooster was led tonight by Justin Hallowell with 21 points, Nathan Balch with 18 points and Marty Bidwell with 18 points.  Mike Evan chipped in 12 points.  Wooster shot 50% from the floor and made 11 three pointers.  Let's hope that Ian Franks recovers quickly from his sprained ankle.

Wooster is now 13-5, 8-1 NCAC :)  Big game on Saturday at Ohio Wesleyan

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 29, 2009, 09:55:19 PM
All the NCAC 1/29 Final Scores:

Hiram 66  Kenyon 55
Wooster 93  Allegheny 76
Wittenberg 75  Wabash 64
Denison 85  Earlham 57
Ohio Wesleyan 75  Oberlin 53
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 29, 2009, 09:57:46 PM
 :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 29, 2009, 10:02:52 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 1/29 Games:

1.  Wooster 8-1, 13-5
1.  Hiram 8-1, 13-5
3.  Ohio Wesleyan 7-2, 11-6
4.  Wittenberg 6-3, 9-8
5.  Kenyon 5-4, 11-7
6.  Wabash 3-6, 8-9
7.  Allegheny 3-6, 7-11
8.  Denison 2-7, 5-13
9.  Earlham 2-7, 2-16
10. Oberlin 1-8, 4-14

Two big games in the title race this Saturday:
Wooster at Ohio Wesleyan
Hiram at Wittenberg
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 29, 2009, 10:16:09 PM
If a loss could potentially be a disaster, it was Thursday night for Wooster. In addition to Ian Franks leaving in the first half with an ankle injury, both Bryan Wickliffe and Greg Ross left in the second half with ankle/foot injuries. All three had ice on their feet. And with the snow cancellations Wednesday, this is one less day for recovery. And now they have to face a hot Ohio Wesleyan team on the road.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 29, 2009, 11:29:58 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 29, 2009, 10:16:09 PM
If a loss could potentially be a disaster, it was Thursday night for Wooster. In addition to Ian Franks leaving in the first half with an ankle injury, both Bryan Wickliffe and Greg Ross left in the second half with ankle/foot injuries. All three had ice on their feet. And with the snow cancellations Wednesday, this is one less day for recovery. And now they have to face a hot Ohio Wesleyan team on the road.
Looks as though Wooster paid a high price for their win over the Gators tonight...  :-\  Hopefully the injuries aren't too serious and that all 3 will be able to go for the important game in Delaware on Saturday!

One positive from the win was Wooster's continued success at the charity stripe.  Wooster is shooting an impressive 84% from the line over their last five games.  And even Marty Bidwell is getting into the act.  He was a perfect 9 of 9 from the charity stripe in tonight's game!  8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on January 30, 2009, 08:17:02 AM
I rarely get to see the Scots play as I no longer live in Wooster, but rather Columbus.  I've never seen them play on the road either.
Would I have difficulty getting tickets for this game tomorrow if I walked up?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 30, 2009, 10:32:45 AM
Quote from: countyroad on January 30, 2009, 08:17:02 AM
I rarely get to see the Scots play as I no longer live in Wooster, but rather Columbus.  I've never seen them play on the road either.
Would I have difficulty getting tickets for this game tomorrow if I walked up?
No, you won't; and furthermore, tickets are unnecessary as OWU has waived admission fees for all men's and women's games this season. 

The men's OWU/Wooster game is the second part of a doubleheader which kicks off at 1pm with the 2nd place (tie) OWU women in a key game vs. 4th place Kenyon, just a half game back of the Bishops.  Come early!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2009, 11:03:13 AM
Remember when the NCAC was the Big 2 and the rest?

Not anymore - at least not this season.

Looks like any given Saturday and Wednesday...etc....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 30, 2009, 11:13:07 AM
From the game article in the DR, it sounds as if Franks should be a go for Saturday.  Coach Moore said that Franks could have gone back in in the 2nd half if needed.  Moore noted that Wickliffe's injury is, "of the most concern for Saturday..." and he said that they would have to wait and see on Ross' injury.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 30, 2009, 11:32:06 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 30, 2009, 11:03:13 AM
Remember when the NCAC was the Big 2 and the rest?
The immortal "Dorksen 8." (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4200.msg675859#msg675859)  :D

It's worth noting, however, that the Big 2 appear (to me, at least) to be rounding into shape as the tournament approaches.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2009, 12:19:50 AM
All you Wooster fans planning to travel to Delaware for tomorrow's game:  bring your daughters, and come early.  OWU is hosting a number of clinics for girls (softball, lacrosse, tennis, and soccer), starting at 11am, to be followed by a picnic lunch and the basketball doubleheader.  All of this is in celebration of National Girls & Women in Sports Day, which is Weds. Feb. 4 (a date the Bishops are on the road, at Wooster.)

More details are available here (http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/ngwsd09.html).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 31, 2009, 04:50:48 PM
Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 83  Wooster 65

Congrats to OWU as the Bishops get the big home win over Wooster.  OWU was led by Kyle Holliday with 27 points, Kyle Miller with 18 points and Brent Pleiman with 11 pts.

Wooster was led by Nathan Balch with 14 points, Ian Franks with 13, Marty Bidwell with 12 points and Justin Hallowell with 11 points.

Wooster lost this game due to poor defense (Breckinridge on the broadcast - "Bishops player ___ burys a wide open three pointer",  "makes a wide open layup" etc.) and far too many turnovers for the Scots - 19).

Kudos to OWU for shooting 55% from the floor and making 8 three pointers.

OWU improves to 12-6, 8-2 NCAC.  Wooster falls to 13-6, 8-2 NCAC.  Next game for Wooster is next Wednesday at Hiram.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 31, 2009, 05:01:07 PM
At the Half:  Hiram 39  Wittenberg 37

Here is a case where a Wooster fan yells loudly "GO TIGERS!" ;) :o :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 31, 2009, 06:33:17 PM
Hiram wins, 79-75.  The Terriers take sole possession of first place in the NCAC.  Big game looming when Wooster goes there on Wednesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2009, 07:06:00 PM
Congratulations to OWU's Kyle Holliday, whose 27 points today included his 1,000th career point.  It's always good to combine your personal milestone with a huge team achievement, so congratulations, Kyle!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2009, 08:11:34 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 31, 2009, 06:33:17 PM
Hiram wins, 79-75.  The Terriers take sole possession of first place in the NCAC.  Big game looming when Wooster goes there on Wednesday.

Words I thought would never be uttered! Holy cow!  :o  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2009, 09:06:06 PM
I don't mean to tread on wooscotsfan's turf, but... :-\

All the NCAC 1/31 Final Scores
OWU 83, Wooster 65
Hiram 79, Wittenberg 75
Kenyon 71, Wabash 59
Denison 67, Allegheny 64
Earlham 78, Oberlin 70

Current NCAC Standings thru 1/29 Games:

1.  Hiram 9-1, 14-5
2.  Wooster 8-2, 13-6
2.  Ohio Wesleyan 8-2, 12-6
4.  Wittenberg 6-4, 9-9
4.  Kenyon 6-4, 12-7
6.  Wabash 3-7, 8-10
6.  Allegheny 3-7, 7-12
6.  Denison 3-7, 6-13
6.  Earlham 3-7, 3-16
10. Oberlin 1-9, 4-15
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2009, 09:32:48 PM
It looks like we've established a Big 5/Dorksen 5 arrangement this season.  Taking a quick look at the Big 5:

Hiram (9-1):
Key road wins: at OWU, at Wittenberg
Key games remaining:  Wooster (h), OWU (h), Kenyon (a)

Wooster (8-2):
Key road wins: at Kenyon
Key games remaining: Hiram (a), Wittenberg (a)

OWU (8-2):
Key road wins: at Wittenberg
Key games remaining: Hiram (a), Wittenberg (h)

Wittenberg (6-4):
Key road wins: at Kenyon
Key games remaining: OWU (a), Wooster (h), Kenyon (h)

Kenyon (6-4):
Key road wins: none
Key games remaining: Hiram (h), Wittenberg (a)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 31, 2009, 09:39:11 PM
David - thanks for updating the scores and standings.  I am down at Hilton Head with the family for vacation.  Just finished dinner out and getting the kids to bed so your pinch hitting is much appreciated! :)

Wooster's remaining shot for a NCAC regular season title is this coming Wednesday at Hiram.  If the Scots don't get the win, the Terriers will win the conference given their remaining schedule which is fairly easy.  Wooster has the tougher remaining schedule with a game also at Witt.

This rather young Wooster team still needs to learn that defense wins games especially when you are on the road.  Coach Moore took several timeouts today after easy OWU baskets (open shots) no doubt trying to stress that point with the team.  It will be very interesting to see if the Scots can get the job done on Wednesday.  Having Bryan Wickliffe back on the floor would help so let's hope that he has a quick recovery.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 01, 2009, 08:52:53 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 31, 2009, 09:39:11 PM
David - thanks for updating the scores and standings.  I am down at Hilton Head with the family for vacation.  Just finished dinner out and getting the kids to bed so your pinch hitting is much appreciated! :)
You poor soul...  ;)  Well, at least we're supposed to crack the freezing point up here in the arctic circle today.  :P

Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 31, 2009, 09:39:11 PM
Wooster's remaining shot for a NCAC regular season title is this coming Wednesday at Hiram.  If the Scots don't get the win, the Terriers will win the conference given their remaining schedule which is fairly easy.  Wooster has the tougher remaining schedule with a game also at Witt.

Hiram definitely has the upper hand to the conference championship at the moment with their second away win over one of the 'Big 5'.  Wooster hasn't proven they can win on the road with the exception of their win at Kenyon.  I agree with you wsf, in that Wooster's regular season title hopes hinge on their game at Hiram on Wednesday.  A win and the Scots are back in 1st.  A loss and their regular season title hopes are all but over.

One thing for certain.  It's looking more and more like the possibility of the NCAC tournament being held in Hiram is becoming a reality.  Who would have guessed that 2 months ago at the start of the season?!

Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 31, 2009, 09:39:11 PM
This rather young Wooster team still needs to learn that defense wins games especially when you are on the road.  Coach Moore took several timeouts today after easy OWU baskets (open shots) no doubt trying to stress that point with the team.  It will be very interesting to see if the Scots can get the job done on Wednesday.  Having Bryan Wickliffe back on the floor would help so let's hope that he has a quick recovery.
I'm really confused as to why this team can't seem to find any consistency on the defensive end of the floor and especially on the road.  It seems that Wooster forgets how to play defense when they are away from Timken.  Wabash and OWU are perfect examples of this.  If the Scots can't figure this problem out, we will be adding Hiram to the list as well...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 01, 2009, 10:49:32 AM
How about the BIG RED??  Three straight.....now that has not happened in a REAL LONG TIME!!!  That is great.

Looking at the standings are we going to see a whole bunch of tie breaker options?  I have no idea what the rules say but it sure looks like we are going to have some real intesting situations for the tourney spots.  Home field may be HUGE.

Again, way to go BIG RED!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2009, 06:53:43 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 31, 2009, 09:39:11 PM
This rather young Wooster team still needs to learn that defense wins games especially when you are on the road.  Coach Moore took several timeouts today after easy OWU baskets (open shots) no doubt trying to stress that point with the team.  It will be very interesting to see if the Scots can get the job done on Wednesday.  Having Bryan Wickliffe back on the floor would help so let's hope that he has a quick recovery.
Wickliffe's absence was huge.  Mike DeWitt took advantage of the situation right from the start, forcing the ball inside to Brent Pleiman, who had no difficulty backing down first Ross and then Sawyer.  In the first 4:35 of the game, Pleiman had three baskets and two free throws, while Ross and Sawyer had three fouls between them.  Although Pleiman was held to three points for the rest of the game (playing only 24 minutes total), the pattern had been established, as OWU ended up with 44 points in the paint.  Wooster's non-post defenders always had to keep aware of what was going on behind them, so they could help out the overmatched post player if needed, and that (combined with OWU's excellent ball movement) helped create a lot of those open jumpers.  OWU ended up shooting 55% for the game, 64% in the second half, and was 5-of-9 from the arc.  They're good shooters, and they were shooting with confidence, but I think Wooster's vulnerability in the post also contributed to the hot shooting.  How different things would have been with Wickliffe healthy is a guessing game, but I think it would have been at least a little different, because I doubt that OWU would have emphasized getting the ball in to Pleiman so much so early if he'd been going up against Wickliffe.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 01, 2009, 09:28:23 PM
Pleiman is a cross between a slug and a lug - outweighing the Wooster defenders by at least 50 pounds.  At home, in the friendly officiating environment of the Branch Rickey Center, he was able to throw his considerable bulk around with impunity.  Not a pretty sight, but effective as the refs were also intent in throwing their weight around, smirking at the Wooster players as they did so.  But that's what you get at OWU, every time.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 02, 2009, 07:21:13 PM
How about equal time for the Dorksen 5?   :)

Five teams, three available spots for the tournament...here's how it breaks down:

Wabash (3-7)
Remaining games: OWU, @Wooster, @Earlham, @Oberlin, Witt, @Denison

This is bad, bad news for Wabash.  The LGs have been pretty awful on the road in conference play and have been pretty awful really since the Wooster game on 1/10.  The two home games come against teams that Wabash doesn't seem to match up well with.  There's nothing easy  here and Wabash is going to have to find 2-3 wins here to get into the tournament. 

Allegheny (3-7)
Remaining games: @Oberlin, Witt, @Hiram, Kenyon, Wooster, @OWU

The Gators are on a five game slide here, but they've been losing closer games than Wabash has.  This is a pretty brutal stretch here for Allegheny.  The Oberlin game on Wednesday is a must win. 

Denison (3-7)
Remaining games: Kenyon, @Oberlin, @Wooster, Hiram, @Earlham, Wabash

The Big Red are red hot and two of their remaining games are against teams that they've beaten. 

Earlham (3-7)
Remaining games: Witt, @Kenyon, Wabash, @OWU, Denison, @Wooster

Earlham only has a win against Wabash of their remaining opponents.  The head to heads at home against Wabash and Denison probably will make or break Earlham's chance to play in the postseason tournament. 

Oberlin (1-9)
Remaining games: Allegheny, Denison, @Kenyon, Wabash, OWU, @Hiram

Oberlin isn't likely to make up two full games on the four teams ahead of them, but if they can get home wins against the Gators and the Little Giants, the Yeoman have a real shot to sneak in. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 02, 2009, 08:38:08 PM
I really value the online relationship with Woo posters, so I hope no one will take offense: after so many years of dominance by the W's, I'm rooting for the Puppies on Wednesday.

Sorry, but Go Terriers! :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2009, 08:43:53 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 02, 2009, 07:21:13 PMOberlin (1-9)
Remaining games: Allegheny, Denison, @Kenyon, Wabash, OWU, @Hiram

Oberlin isn't likely to make up two full games on the four teams ahead of them, but if they can get home wins against the Gators and the Little Giants, the Yeoman have a real shot to sneak in. 

Mike Loll, Oberlin's leading rebounder and second-best scorer, has missed the last four games and is reportedly out for the season with a non-basketball-related condition.  That certainly dampens whatever chance the Yeomen had to make the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2009, 08:47:27 PM
Congratulations to Denison's Chris Luther for becoming the latest recipient of the NCAC Player of the Week Award (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html).  Luther scored 37 points in victories over Earlham and Allegheny, hitting better than half of his field goal attempts in the process.  Congratulations, Chris!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2009, 08:57:04 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 01, 2009, 09:28:23 PM
Pleiman is a cross between a slug and a lug - outweighing the Wooster defenders by at least 50 pounds.  At home, in the friendly officiating environment of the Branch Rickey Center, he was able to throw his considerable bulk around with impunity.  Not a pretty sight, but effective as the refs were also intent in throwing their weight around, smirking at the Wooster players as they did so.  But that's what you get at OWU, every time.   

Wow, that reminds me of what I saw when Wooster came to Wabash, and the Ohio-based NCAC refs allowed Wooster to push and maul and go over the back of Wabash players, every time, for years.

Of course  that may just what I THOUGHT I saw, and not what really happened.

And you know, I bet that even though there are different refs each year assigned to those games, they still conspire the same way...


(i.e. - this is getting old, WB - you win or lose on the court...and players should adjust to what is or is not being called)

PS - BTW - is it OWU's fault that Wooster's heaviest player is listed at 215? Time to hit the weights...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 03, 2009, 11:21:33 AM
Fat jokes?  Really???  Is there any kid in the league with a funny haircut you want to rip on while your at it?  Maybe a guy with a tatoo that you don't care for?  Why stop with the just the big fellas??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 03, 2009, 12:22:25 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 02, 2009, 08:38:08 PM
I really value the online relationship with Woo posters, so I hope no one will take offense: after so many years of dominance by the W's, I'm rooting for the Puppies on Wednesday.

Sorry, but Go Terriers! :o
No offense taken from me Mr. Y!  This was bound to happen sooner or later.  I just would have never guessed that Hiram would be the ones knocking over the apple cart...  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 03, 2009, 02:45:41 PM
Congrats to Chris Luther on his POTW selection....the Big Red are playing some REAL good ball late in the season when it matters the most.

I can only assume that the person writing the article for the NCAC attended somewhere other than Denison. 

10-22 is NOT 54%  :-)   Truth be told, Chris shot 12 of 22 which IS 54%  Really 55%!!

Go Big Red....make it 4 in a row!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 03, 2009, 03:59:23 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 03, 2009, 11:21:33 AM
Fat jokes?  Really???  Is there any kid in the league with a funny haircut you want to rip on while your at it?  Maybe a guy with a tatoo that you don't care for?  Why stop with the just the big fellas??

Shoot, I thought I had deleted that post, which was clearly in poor taste and completely unneeded on this board. Apparently I decided not to.

I'll rectify that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2009, 05:31:40 PM
Wittenberg is back up to a 25-game schedule, with a last minute addition.  The Tigers will now face Indiana Univ.-East on Feb. 16 at 5:30 at Witt.  This will be the first game of a most unusual late February men's/women's non-conference doubleheader, as the Witt women have a scheduled game vs. Capital at 7:30 that evening.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 03, 2009, 09:54:30 PM
IU - East? Well, when you need play a game, that certainly will be a game. A good game? Now that's another story. But it is a game...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2009, 11:08:49 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 03, 2009, 09:54:30 PM
IU - East? Well, when you need play a game, that certainly will be a game. A good game? Now that's another story. But it is a game...
Well, for whatever it is worth, the Red Wolves are 18-7 on the year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2009, 09:35:54 AM
I haven't been able to get a read on what that 18-7 record really means. They're a cipher...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 04, 2009, 10:47:48 AM
Allegheny picked up their 4th conference win and ended their 5 game losing streak defeating Oberlin last night 76-67 at Oberlin.  Allegheny is now 4-7 in conference and 8-12 overall.  Oberlin falls to 1-10 and 4-16 overall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 04, 2009, 02:53:29 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 03, 2009, 09:54:30 PM
IU - East? Well, when you need play a game, that certainly will be a game. A good game? Now that's another story. But it is a game...

Yea, I guess Wittenberg could have scheduled Calumet College of St. Joseph  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 04, 2009, 03:12:33 PM
Or some school from Canada.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 04, 2009, 03:24:59 PM
curious........Wabash 80 Calumet St. Joeseph 77.........this year even.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 04, 2009, 08:38:32 PM
14:05 Left:   Wooster 61  Hiram 57

11:43 left:  Wooster 65  Hiram 62

10:57 left:  Hiram 67  Wooster 65  Terrriers on a 5-0 run, just hit a three pointer

9:31 left:  Wooster 70  Hiram 67  Scots on a 5-0 run, Hallowell is 7 of 7 on three pointers

7:15 left:  Hiram 75  Wooster 72  Hiram just made two 3 pointers

6:24 left:  Wooster 75  Hiram 75  Franks just made a three pointer for Wooster

6:10 left:  Wooster 78  Hiram 75  Justin Hallowell hits his 8th three pointer for Wooster

4:30 left:  Hiram 82  Wooster 81  Traditional three point play by Milton for Hiram

3:29 left:  Wooster 86  Hiram 83  Franks with a quick 5 points for Wooster

2:25 left:  Wooster 88  Hiram 85

1:50 left:  Wooster 88  Hiram 87  Eniola scores for Hiram, Wooster ball, Hiram timeout

1:10 left:  Wooster 88, Hiram 87  Wooster turnover, Hiram ball, Hiram timeout

1:01 left:  Offensive foul on Hiram's Chris Roberts, Wooster ball

0:25 left:  Wooster 88 Hiram 87  Franks shot spun in & out, Hiram rebound - with ball

0:01 left:  Hiram only got an off balance shot, Wooster rebound, Hiram fouls Wickliffe

Wooster 89  Hiram 87   Wickliffe hit the first free throw, Timeout Hiram

Final:  Wooster 89  Hiram 87  Great win for the SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 04, 2009, 08:52:00 PM
Sounds like a helluva game!

No offense, but after so many years of the Ws - go Puppies! ;)

[My beloved dog is end-stage cancer; Terriers, win it for Sandy Girl.  While she's more other things, she has SOME terrier in her!]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 04, 2009, 09:17:54 PM
Final:  Wooster 89  Hiram 87 :)

Huge road win for Wooster as they tie up Hiram for first place in the NCAC.  Both teams shot incredibly well tonight (Wooster 54%, Hiram 52%).  Justin Hallowell led Wooster with 24 points (all on 8 three pointers), Ian Franks had 21 points (19 in the second half and many near the end of the game), Bryan Wickliffe with 15 points and Nathan Balch chipped in 12 points.

Both teams also shot well on three pointers -- Wooster made 16 of 28 from behind the arc and Hiram hit 11 of 24 three point shots.

Hiram was led by Glen Campbell with 18 points and Chris Roberts with 11 points.  Andrew Weigand also chipped in 11 points for the Terriers.

Wooster and Hiram are both now 14-6, 9-2 NCAC. ;D  Scots host Wabash on Saturday
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2009, 09:36:10 PM
Hey now! I'm not defending Wabash's scheduling. Heck, they used to make a habit out of pasting IU-Kokomo. I had no idea IU-East was in an actual conference (sometimes these branch schools don't really have much of an organization - at least in the past) and trying to figure out how strong it was in NAIA-II. So my flippancy was unfounded.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 04, 2009, 09:41:40 PM
All the 2/3 & 2/4 NCAC Final Scores:

Allegheny 76  Oberlin 67
Wittenberg 84  Earlham 70
Ohio Wesleyan 51  Wabash 45
Wooster 89  Hiram 87
Kenyon 78  Denison 68
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 04, 2009, 09:43:18 PM
I told Sandy Girl that the Terriers had let her down, but she replied WOO(f), WOO(f), so I guess all is forgiven. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 04, 2009, 09:48:21 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 2/4 Games:

1.  Wooster 9-2, 14-6
1.  Hiram 9-2, 14-6
1.  Ohio Wesleyan 9-2, 13-6
4.  Wittenberg 7-4, 10-9
4.  Kenyon 7-4, 13-7
6.  Allegheny 4-7, 8-12
7.  Wabash 3-8, 8-11
7.  Denison 3-8, 6-14
7.  Earlham 3-8, 3-17
10. Oberlin 1-10, 4-16

Biggest game this Saturday:  Ohio Wesleyan at Hiram
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2009, 10:52:22 PM
All of that lake effect snow diverted me south to Denison rather than northeast to Hiram tonight.  Sounds like I missed a great game, but it was a pretty good game in Livingston Gym.  On one end, Denison got outstanding ball movement, hustle, and shooting from their cadre of guards, but on the other end the Big Red could do nothing to stop or even slow down an utterly dominant performance from Bryan Yelvington.  Bryan missed a three-pointer early on, and had a floater rim out near the end of the game, but otherwise was 13 of 13, including two treys, and added six (of six) free throws for a total of 34 points.  You could tell from the start that he was playing with fire in his eyes, and was going to back down anyone assigned to him.  Kenyon's guards, who couldn't hit anything from outside tonight (collectively 1 for 13 from deep), got the ball into Bryan early and often, and he responded with a 9-for-10, 22 point first half.  Denison led by 1 at the break, having hit four of eight treys and paraded to the free throw line for 15 more points.  But whereas the Big Red couldn't keep up the hot shooting after the break, Yelvington was just as effective.  When DU finally decided to go for broke and double- or triple-team Bryan, that opened things up for Dave Knapke (20 points, 6/10 from the floor, 8/10 from the line) and JT Knight (16 points on 6/9 from inside the arc).  Denison hung tough, staying within a bucket or two for most of the second half, but Kenyon hit 14 of 16 free throws in the second half to secure the victory.  One telling stat from the game was that Kenyon's guards, when not heaving bricks in the general direction of the backboard, recorded 13 assists (chiefly feeding the posts) while committing just seven turnovers.  Denison's Mike Garabedian was shut down completely, recording just three free throws, but the Big Red got very good games from Pat Sullivan (12 points, five assists, and superb hustle all night, which is normal for him) and 5'7" frosh Jim Leffew, whose three three-pointers were all daggers.  But when your opponent gets the kind of game in the post that Yelvington and Knapke had, good games from a couple of sub-6' guards aren't going to get the job done.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 04, 2009, 11:45:51 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 04, 2009, 09:17:54 PM
Justin Hallowell led Wooster with 24 points (all on 8 three pointers),

Hallowell went 8-9 (.889) from three tonight.  I'm pretty sure (haven't seen a Wooster recap yet) that this ties him for second-most made three pointers in a game by a Scots player, with Tom Port (who made 8 against Wis. Stout a few years ago).  Port, however, was "only" 8-15 (.533) in that game from distance.  Hallowell almost assuredly set a new all-time individual mark for 3 point accuracy tonight.

Also, he now has 66 made three pointers on the season.  James Cooper and Tom Port share Wooster's single-season mark with 78 apiece, both during the 06-07 campaign.  Hallowell needs a couple threes per game from here on out to potentially set a new mark.

Any other NCAC players approaching milestones/records that anyone knows of out there?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 05, 2009, 12:14:10 AM
I'm too tired to post too much, but I was at the Wooster-Hiram game, and it was one of the better regular season games. I've never been to Hiram, but I'm guessing the crowd was four or five times larger than normal. I would be half the student body was there, no exaggeration.

For the first time in memory, there is another team in the NCAC more athletic than Wooster -- Hiram. They were quicker, and as a result got a ton of offensive rebounds. If it wasn't for offensive rebounds, they would have been way behind in the first half.

For Wooster, if it wasn't for Hallowell just going off, they would have been in deep trouble. Franks was quiet for much of the game, then had a real strong spurt midway through the second half. Both teams were a little tight and rushed a couple of shots over the last couple of minutes. Hiram had the ball with about 25 seconds and down one point. Roberts had the ball on the wing, but Hallowell, who didn't have a very good defensive night, made a good play and left his man to help on Roberts. I think this threw Roberts off, as all of a sudden he had a much taller player covering him (than Bidwell). So Roberts quickly tried to pass it to Pfouts, who may have been fouled by Bidwell as Bidwell reached around to steal the ball. Pfouts fell to the floor, and may have traveled with the ball, but the refs, and probably rightly so, let both plays go as they were not blatant. Pfouts was then forced to drive the baseline and put up an off balance jumper that missed, and Wickliffe rebounded with 1.2 seconds left. He made one free throw, and that was that.

Wickliffe had the best game that I've seen him have this season. Maybe this will give him, and the coaching staff, the confidence to use him more. I'm sticking with my assessment from a couple of weeks ago, that unless Wooster's gets some sort of interior offensive presence, they aren't going to win the conference. You can't count on Hallowell draining threes from all over the place (although it would be nice if he kept doing it.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 05, 2009, 12:44:20 PM
If Wooster were to win out, would they have the tiebreaker over either OWU or Hiram, providing one of those two also won out?  Wooster certainly should have it over Hiram, whom they've beaten twice.  In matching up with OWU, Wooster has split with them, but has beaten Hiram twice while OWU has only a split.  Is that what they would go by?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 05, 2009, 12:58:06 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 05, 2009, 12:44:20 PM
If Wooster were to win out, would they have the tiebreaker over either OWU or Hiram, providing one of those two also won out?  Wooster certainly should have it over Hiram, whom they've beaten twice.  In matching up with OWU, Wooster has split with them, but has beaten Hiram twice while OWU has only a split.  Is that what they would go by?

I believe that OWU would win the tiebreaker over Wooster on the basis of worst loss (Wooster's loss to Wabash).  At one point I had the NCAC tiebreakers, but I couldn't find them last time that I looked.

So... Go Terriers!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 05, 2009, 01:30:55 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 05, 2009, 12:44:20 PM
If Wooster were to win out, would they have the tiebreaker over either OWU or Hiram, providing one of those two also won out?  Wooster certainly should have it over Hiram, whom they've beaten twice.  In matching up with OWU, Wooster has split with them, but has beaten Hiram twice while OWU has only a split.  Is that what they would go by?
The Bishops need to win at Hiram on Saturday to gain a split with Hiram. 

And I think that derek is correct about the tie-breaker going by worst loss.  Hard for me to get my fingers around the fact that Wabash is a worse loss than Hiram...  :P

Looking at the 3 teams tied for first, OWU seems to me like the team to beat at the moment.  They are riding a 7 game win streak that includes wins at Witt and over Wooster at home.  They haven't lost since Hiram knocked them off at home almost a month ago.

I have to say, it was nice to see Wooster finally get over on a quality opponent away from the friendly confines.  Although Hiram didn't make it easy for them to do so having the ball with a chance for a last second basket to win it!  That's what you want when you have a guy like Roberts but Wooster stepped up big time defensively on Hiram's last possession and forced them into a shot they really didn't want and from a player other than Roberts!  Now it's time to take out some revenge on the Little Giants and try to put that little 2 game losing streak against Wabash to bed this Saturday!!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 05, 2009, 01:41:21 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 04, 2009, 11:45:51 PM
Hallowell went 8-9 (.889) from three tonight.  I'm pretty sure (haven't seen a Wooster recap yet) that this ties him for second-most made three pointers in a game by a Scots player, with Tom Port (who made 8 against Wis. Stout a few years ago).  Port, however, was "only" 8-15 (.533) in that game from distance.  Hallowell almost assuredly set a new all-time individual mark for 3 point accuracy tonight.

Also, he now has 66 made three pointers on the season.  James Cooper and Tom Port share Wooster's single-season mark with 78 apiece, both during the 06-07 campaign.  Hallowell needs a couple threes per game from here on out to potentially set a new mark.

Any other NCAC players approaching milestones/records that anyone knows of out there?

Justin Hallowell continues to amaze me with his daft touch from 3-point range!  I tried looking up the record for 3 point % for a game and they don't have that category in the record books that I could find.  But, not only is Hallowell closing in on the record for 3-pointers made for a season, he is doing that by flirting with the all-time best 3-point shooting percentage in Wooster history while he's at it!  He is currently TIED with Craig Bradley who shot 53.7% back in the 92-93 season!  But Bradley only made 44 treys that season.  Justin could come close to doubling that number by season's end!  Justin was also 4th in the nation in 3-point accuracy.  But using updated percentages, he would currently sit 3rd and less than 1% out of 2nd.  And this kid is only a freshman!!!  8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 05, 2009, 02:34:11 PM
One question I have about last night's game is why Kaleb Reed was in the rotation over Drew Sawyer?  I have been wondering what happened to Reed all season, as I see last night was only his 4th game he's seen action in this year and it was a season high 9 minutes off the bench.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2009, 02:44:50 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 05, 2009, 01:30:55 PM
And I think that derek is correct about the tie-breaker going by worst loss.  Hard for me to get my fingers around the fact that Wabash is a worse loss than Hiram...  :P

There are a lot of things about this season that I'm having a hard time figuring out.  It's tailspin city for the Little Giants...frustrating to watch because there's more talent on the team than the record would have one believe.  Hopefully Wabash can find a spark in the next couple of games, and get some confidence going into the tournament.  Hopefully. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2009, 03:12:22 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 05, 2009, 02:34:11 PM
One question I have about last night's game is why Kaleb Reed was in the rotation over Drew Sawyer?  I have been wondering what happened to Reed all season, as I see last night was only his 4th game he's seen action in this year and it was a season high 9 minutes off the bench.
I assume Reed has shown the coaches something in practice the last week or two.  He played in the only JV game I saw (Witt), and I think the reason he's only played in 4 games is because he's not been high enough on the depth chart to see more action.  He played fairly well at OWU, and last night he was singled out for his efforts by Steve Moore in his postgame comments. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 05, 2009, 04:00:18 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 04, 2009, 11:45:51 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 04, 2009, 09:17:54 PM
Justin Hallowell led Wooster with 24 points (all on 8 three pointers),


Any other NCAC players approaching milestones/records that anyone knows of out there?

It's not an individual honor - but at 14 wins with 5 regular season games remaining, extending The Scot's string of twelve consecutive 20 win seasons is still well in doubt, (but in my opinion still highly probable)

More remote is extending the string of 6 consecutive senior classes that have won 100 games. Marty Bidwell has been a part of 92 wins.

An to extend that just a bit further, the Scots need to win 23 games in order for Coac h Moore to hit 600 career wins this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: username........ on February 05, 2009, 06:56:42 PM
hey everyone, Im a beginner on this so bare with me.....


What do you guys think of this newcomer out of nowhere, Chris Roberts.....and do you think he has a shot at winning player of the year in this conference?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 05, 2009, 07:23:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 05, 2009, 03:12:22 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 05, 2009, 02:34:11 PM
One question I have about last night's game is why Kaleb Reed was in the rotation over Drew Sawyer?  I have been wondering what happened to Reed all season, as I see last night was only his 4th game he's seen action in this year and it was a season high 9 minutes off the bench.
I assume Reed has shown the coaches something in practice the last week or two.  He played in the only JV game I saw (Witt), and I think the reason he's only played in 4 games is because he's not been high enough on the depth chart to see more action.  He played fairly well at OWU, and last night he was singled out for his efforts by Steve Moore in his postgame comments. 

Reed gives the Scots some much-needed muscle inside.  Little offense, but he fights on the boards and holds his ground underneath.  Greg Ross is just a bit undersized, although he offers more offense than Reed.  I keep waiting for Sawyer to get some more minutes, and to get some more touches when he's in there.  Hopefully it will happen, if not this season than next.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2009, 07:27:46 PM
Quote from: username........ on February 05, 2009, 06:56:42 PMWhat do you guys think of this newcomer out of nowhere, Chris Roberts.....and do you think he has a shot at winning player of the year in this conference?
I'm not sure he's a "newcomer out of nowhere" (I doubt he's a "newcomer" at all, as the NCAC defines that term); he did average 11.2 ppg last season, third on the team (behind Staley and McDevitt), although he only played 11 games.  It looks to me that those were most or all of the first 11 games, so I guess he got injured.  Funny, we weren't paying as close attention to Hiram last season as we are now!

I think Roberts is a lead-pipe cinch for first team All-NCAC.  If Hiram wins the conference, he has a chance for conference POY, especially if he has a big game Saturday.  But I don't think it's a strong chance.  Overall he ranks fourth in the conference in scoring at 17.5 ppg, but a lot of that was his ultra-hot start to the season--he was Hiram's leading scorer in each of the first 10 games, a span during which he averaged 22.9 ppg.  Since then, he's averaged just 12.0 ppg and was the leading scorer in just two games.  In terms of conference games only, he's averaging 12.6 ppg, tied for 13th with Wooster's largely unheralded Nathan Balch.  Roberts is also a top-10 rebounder (overall 5.5 rpg, 10th; conference only 5.2 rpg, 9th), and he's among the league leaders in steals, but unless he really elevates and delivers a conference title, I think he'll probably have to settle for a first-team all-NCAC slot.

Which raises the question of who will the POY be?  From where I sit, Bryan Yelvington is far ahead in this race, leading the conference in both scoring and rebounding, overall and conference-only.  He's also top 10 in FG%, FT%, and steals.  The only thing his resume lacks is that his team will not win the conference and may not finish in the top 4.  His saving grace, however, may be that the teams that finish ahead of Kenyon don't have any players that can come close to his stats.  Both Wooster and Wittenberg have different players up and down the lineup pitching in every night.  Hiram has Roberts, as discussed above.  OWU has Kyle Holliday, top 10 in scoring, rebounding, FG% (conf. only), 3pt. FG% and 3pt. FGs, but his stat line really pales in comparison to Bryan's.  It may come down to Holliday, Roberts, and Yelvington, but I think it's Bryan's plaque to lose at this point.

EDIT:  I'd be remiss if I didn't mention the fabulous season that Tristian Gregory is having at Earlham.  Despite being the focus of everyone else's defensive effort, he's averaging over 20 points per game (18.3 in conference games) and will reach 1400 career points the next time he puts the ball through the hoop.  But you can't win the POY trophy on a last place team, no matter how good you are.  Just ask Dan Hodgkinson.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2009, 07:50:32 PM
If playing in just 11 games as a frosh somehow means that Chris Roberts hasn't lost his "newcomer" status, then he'd easily win NCAC Newcomer of the Year.  But I'd be surprised if that were the case, making the leading candidates probably OWU's Pat Pellerite and Wooster's Justin Hallowell.  There's other rookies making big contributions, like Denison's Mike Garabedian, Hiram's Andrew Wiegand, Wooster's Nathan Balch, and Josh McKee, Michael Cooper, and Alex Brandt at Wittenberg, but none of them have been contributing at as high a level from the start of the season as Pellerite and Hallowell have. 

Hallowell is the better scorer (12.0 to 10.0 in conference, 13.4 to 9.9 overall) and we all know about his three point shooting (leading the conference and 25th in D3 in makes, 1st in the NCAC and 4th nationally in 3PFG% overall, and 4th in 3PFG% in conference games), but he's also a top-20 rebounder (18th overall, t-12th conference only) and is actually 15th overall in FG%, amazing considering that nearly 3/4 of his shots are from beyond the arc. 

Pellerite is the better rebounder, ranking 5th both overall and in conference, is leading the conference in FG% (conf. only; he's 2nd overall) and is 6th in blocked shots (overall and conf. only), and is among the league leaders in free throw shooting (14th overall, 10th conference only).  I think he's the better all-around player, but he's perhaps less critical to his team's success; both Kyle Holliday and Kyle Miller have higher scoring averages (as does Brent Pleiman in conference games), while Hallowell is Wooster's second-leading scorer, just behind Ian Franks (also behind Nathan Balch in conference games, but just barely). 

On balance, I think Pellerite has a slight lead, but the race will be decided over the next five games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2009, 07:56:30 PM
Just to round things out, I'm sure we can all agree on who the NCAC Coach of the Year will be, almost regardless of what happens between now and the 21st.  Sometimes I wonder if the coaches get too much (or too little) credit, but if you're not a Steve Fleming believer, try this simple test.  You take last year's 8-18 Hiram team, subtract your two leading scorers, leading rebounder, (conference-)leading assister, and three leading three-point shooters, replace them all with Andrew Wiegand, then coach them and see what happens.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: JohnDaly on February 05, 2009, 10:08:05 PM
I was just looking through some box scores from the games last night and saw that Aaron Brock didn't play last night against OWU. Anyone from Wabash know the reason why?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2009, 11:11:33 PM
Word on the street (the street being the Wabash press release) is that Brock sat out last night nursing an elbow that has been bugging him all year.  I've noticed Brock wearing a sleeve over the last few weeks but I wouldn't have been able to tell you if it was for aesthetic purposes or if it was therapeutic.  Seems to have been the latter.  Not having Brock, who has been by a pretty wide margin Wabash's best player since Jan. 10, certainly didn't help Wabash on a night when his points easily could have put the LGs over the top. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 05, 2009, 11:19:57 PM
I can't see how Roberts can be a Newcomer. He is a sophomore, and he is a sophomore because he played 11 games with Hiram last year (I think he then left school, but maybe JohnDaly can add more to this). 11 games is enough to lose your eligibility for that year. I actually think Hallowell probably has the edge over Pellerite. Assuming OWU and Wooster are seen as about equals at the end of the year, Hallowell will likely be seen as playing a larger role for the Scots. He has solidified himself as Wooster's second-best player. While he needs to improve his rebounding, especially for someone his size, he has single-handily won a few games this year, and his performance against Hiram on the road, in the biggest regular season game in the NCAC this year, should be the tie-breaker right now. In a game were everyone was dragging, Hallowell nearly played the entire second half, and would have if not for two quick fouls late in the second half.

Reed is playing because Wooster has no one else more than anything else. Yes, he plays with energy, but when his is on the floor, Wooster has four offensive players. Sawyer didn't make the trip last night, and Ross and Wickliffe each picked up two fouls in the first half. Absent these two factors, and Reed doesn't play. While Melick never developed like they hoped, Wooster could use his body in the post right now for about 10 minutes a game.

Random thought. Glenn Campbell, in my opinion, has looked like Hiram's best player in the two games Wooster has played them this year. If you knew nothing of season averages or the like, Campbell would look like Hiram's best player.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 05, 2009, 11:57:35 PM
Jerry, do you know why Sawyer didn't make the trip?  He's becoming quite a mystery this season.  A talented freshman that gets only sporadic playing time.  The Wooster bench definitely seems thinner than it did a month ago, and I'd really love to see Sawyer have more opportunity.  I don't think it would hurt Wooster to go back to a more traditional offense with the team makeup that it has: two guards on the court rather than the three that they've used the last few years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 06, 2009, 09:20:46 AM
After seeing the NCAA regional rankings this week, with no NCAC team included, this is looking like a one-bid league.  Given the national prominence of Wooster and Wittenberg, when is the last time that only one team got into the NCAA tournament from the NCAC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 06, 2009, 09:54:29 AM
I was also wondering the last time that Wooster and Wittenberg missed out on the tournament in the same year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 06, 2009, 10:29:57 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 06, 2009, 09:20:46 AM
After seeing the NCAA regional rankings this week, with no NCAC team included, this is looking like a one-bid league.  Given the national prominence of Wooster and Wittenberg, when is the last time that only one team got into the NCAA tournament from the NCAC?

In 2007 Wooster was the only NCAC representative. 

Quote from: countyroad on February 06, 2009, 09:54:29 AM
I was also wondering the last time that Wooster and Wittenberg missed out on the tournament in the same year.

I would guess that you have to go back to the 1998 tournament to find a championship bracket void of both Wooster and Wittenberg.  Allegheny won the conference tournament that year and based on the records of Wooster and Witt, I doubt that they would have been selected.  1998 was also the last time Wabash was in the tournament...which seems like forever ago now!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2009, 10:31:08 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 06, 2009, 09:20:46 AM
After seeing the NCAA regional rankings this week, with no NCAC team included, this is looking like a one-bid league.  Given the national prominence of Wooster and Wittenberg, when is the last time that only one team got into the NCAA tournament from the NCAC?
Two seasons ago, in 2007.  Wooster got the only bid.

Quote from: countyroad on February 06, 2009, 09:54:29 AM
I was also wondering the last time that Wooster and Wittenberg missed out on the tournament in the same year.
The last NCAA tournament that failed to include either Wooster or Wittenberg was in 1988.  Wooster was 14-11 in Steve Moore's first year at the helm.  Wittenberg was the regular season OAC champions at 20-7, but lost in the OAC tournament to Muskingum.  Larry Hunter was the coach (Bill Brown took over in 1993).  Witt joined the NCAC two seasons later, for the 1989-90 season.

[cross-posted with Wally]

In 1998, Wooster was an at-large selection with a 22-5 record; they lost in the first round to John Carroll.  Witt was 19-7.  Allegheny beat Witt in the NCAC semifinal 61-50, then beat NCAC champion Wooster 66-64 for the title.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 06, 2009, 10:56:20 AM
Wittenberg actually hasn't made the NCAA tournament since their run all the way to the finals where they ended up as national runners up in '05-'06.  And unless they can somehow put things together in the conference tournament, that streak will grow to 3 seasons without an NCAA tournament appearance this year.

This has to be one of their longest NCAA tournament droughts in some time for Witt.  David?  Wally?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 06, 2009, 11:08:46 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 05, 2009, 07:27:46 PM
Which raises the question of who will the POY be?  From where I sit, Bryan Yelvington is far ahead in this race, leading the conference in both scoring and rebounding, overall and conference-only.  He's also top 10 in FG%, FT%, and steals.  The only thing his resume lacks is that his team will not win the conference and may not finish in the top 4.  His saving grace, however, may be that the teams that finish ahead of Kenyon don't have any players that can come close to his stats.  Both Wooster and Wittenberg have different players up and down the lineup pitching in every night.  Hiram has Roberts, as discussed above.  OWU has Kyle Holliday, top 10 in scoring, rebounding, FG% (conf. only), 3pt. FG% and 3pt. FGs, but his stat line really pales in comparison to Bryan's.  It may come down to Holliday, Roberts, and Yelvington, but I think it's Bryan's plaque to lose at this point.

EDIT:  I'd be remiss if I didn't mention the fabulous season that Tristian Gregory is having at Earlham.  Despite being the focus of everyone else's defensive effort, he's averaging over 20 points per game (18.3 in conference games) and will reach 1400 career points the next time he puts the ball through the hoop.  But you can't win the POY trophy on a last place team, no matter how good you are.  Just ask Dan Hodgkinson.
I can't argue with Yelvington right now.  You have to think, where would Kenyon be without Yelvington?  I'm sure the Lords aren't where they would like to be at this point in the season, but without Yelvington, I think the Lords would be battling just to make the NCAC tournament instead of battling for hosting a first round game.  If Roberts can somehow find his game, he should definitely be in the conversation.  But his average in conference games just isn't going to get it done IMO.  Of course, a huge game tomorrow against OWU could go a long way in the argument in Robert's favor. 

As for the other contenders, OWU has Holiday and Miller and I think they kind of cancel each other out.  And as far as Wooster goes, Franks would be their leading contender, but as David noted, the Scots seem to have a different leading scorer each game.  One night it's Franks, one night it's Hallowell, and the next night it's Balch, etc, etc.

If I had to vote now, Yelvington would be my choice, but Roberts still has some time to get his name back into consideration.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 06, 2009, 11:14:30 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 05, 2009, 07:50:32 PM
If playing in just 11 games as a frosh somehow means that Chris Roberts hasn't lost his "newcomer" status, then he'd easily win NCAC Newcomer of the Year.  But I'd be surprised if that were the case, making the leading candidates probably OWU's Pat Pellerite and Wooster's Justin Hallowell.  There's other rookies making big contributions, like Denison's Mike Garabedian, Hiram's Andrew Wiegand, Wooster's Nathan Balch, and Josh McKee, Michael Cooper, and Alex Brandt at Wittenberg, but none of them have been contributing at as high a level from the start of the season as Pellerite and Hallowell have. 

Hallowell is the better scorer (12.0 to 10.0 in conference, 13.4 to 9.9 overall) and we all know about his three point shooting (leading the conference and 25th in D3 in makes, 1st in the NCAC and 4th nationally in 3PFG% overall, and 4th in 3PFG% in conference games), but he's also a top-20 rebounder (18th overall, t-12th conference only) and is actually 15th overall in FG%, amazing considering that nearly 3/4 of his shots are from beyond the arc. 

Pellerite is the better rebounder, ranking 5th both overall and in conference, is leading the conference in FG% (conf. only; he's 2nd overall) and is 6th in blocked shots (overall and conf. only), and is among the league leaders in free throw shooting (14th overall, 10th conference only).  I think he's the better all-around player, but he's perhaps less critical to his team's success; both Kyle Holliday and Kyle Miller have higher scoring averages (as does Brent Pleiman in conference games), while Hallowell is Wooster's second-leading scorer, just behind Ian Franks (also behind Nathan Balch in conference games, but just barely). 

On balance, I think Pellerite has a slight lead, but the race will be decided over the next five games.
I think I would lean towards Hallowell for NOY at this point of the season.  I think he is more valuable to Wooster's overall success than Pellerite is for OWU. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 06, 2009, 11:46:00 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 06, 2009, 10:56:20 AM
This has to be one of their longest NCAA tournament droughts in some time for Witt.  David?  Wally?  ;)

The last time Witt went three seasons without making the dance are the '97-'98 through '99-'00 seasons. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 06, 2009, 03:36:27 PM
Even acknowledging that the NCAC was never a powerful league, it's still not what it used to be, and that fact can not only be delved from the teams' records, but from the conversation about the player of the year.

Yelvinton?  Roberts?  Holiday?  These aren't bad players, but they don't match up with the stars of a few years ago: Daniel Russ, Dane Borchers, Tom Port, Dustin Rudegeair, Ben Chojnacki, James Cooper, Tim Vandervaart, Brandon Miller, even the injured Brandon Johnson.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2009, 05:01:14 PM
Holliday, Yelvington, and Gregory may not be All-Americans like Russ, Port, or Cooper, but I think they could hang with some of those names.  But rather than argue that point, I'll instead mention another exalted group that they definitely can hang with, proudly.

All three seniors were named to the Academic All-District team today.  OWU's Kyle Holliday, an Accounting major sporting a 3.87 GPA, was named to the first team, college division, for District 4, making him eligible for Academic All-America consideration.  Kenyon's Bryan Yelvington, who has a 3.34 GPA and a double major in Economics and Political Science, was named to the second team in the same district.  Earlham's Tristian Gregory was named to the second team in District 5, college division, and has a 3.70 GPA in Business and Non-Profit Management. 

To be named Academic All-District, one must excel both on the court and in the classroom.  It is a great honor, and these outstanding young men deserve our congratulations.  Here's the announcement (http://www.cosida.com/documents/2009/2/5/09mensbasketball.pdf) (pdf).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2009, 02:41:46 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.getgreatcodes.com%2Fgraphics%2Ffunny%2F16%2Ffunnypic171.gif&hash=0093b20c7f1060d57b54009d30c6cd306a170b17)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 07, 2009, 05:13:07 PM
Wittenberg 68
Allegheny 58

Wooster 78
Wabash 58

OWU 70
Hiram 62  OT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2009, 05:17:27 PM
Quote from: Witt4ever on February 07, 2009, 05:13:07 PM
Wittenberg 68
Allegheny 58

Wooster 78
Wabash 58

OWU 70
Hiram 62  OT

Additionally...

Denison 73
Oberlin 64

Earlham 62
Kenyon 91
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2009, 10:24:15 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 2/7 Games:

1.  Wooster 10-2, 15-6
1.  Ohio Wesleyan 10-2, 14-6
3.  Hiram 9-3, 14-7
4.  Wittenberg 8-4, 11-9
4.  Kenyon 8-4, 14-7
6.  Allegheny 4-8, 8-13
6.  Denison 4-8, 7-14
8.  Wabash 3-9, 8-12
8.  Earlham 3-9, 3-18
10. Oberlin 1-11, 4-17

Huge road win for the Bishops today as they have an easier remaining schedule than Wooster.  OWU plays Witt at home on Wednesday while Wooster has to play at Witt next Saturday.

It's another case of a Wooster fan cheering "Go Tigers!" on Wednesday. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2009, 11:54:50 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2009, 10:24:15 PM
Huge road win for the Bishops today as they have an easier remaining schedule than Wooster.  OWU plays Witt at home on Wednesday while Wooster has to play at Witt next Saturday.

Wooster, however, has a tie-breaker advantage with OWU, by virtue of their sweep of Hiram.  (Here's a link to the tiebreakers (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4200.msg873234#msg873234), courtesy of imderekpoe from about this time last season; it's a modified "best-win" tiebreaker.)  Wooster and OWU split their games, but Wooster swept Hiram while OWU split with the Terriers.  If Hiram were to fall below either Kenyon or Wittenberg, the situatuation would not likely change.  The results vs. Kenyon would not count, as they are not "like" games (OWU played the Lords at home, while Wooster played them at Gambier; and anyway, both Woo and OWU won those games.)  Both Wooster and OWU are currently 1-0 vs. Wittenberg with one game remaining.  If Wooster and OWU end up tied, it probably means that they both either beat or lost to Witt, so that wouldn't affect the tie-breaker.

OWU has a tie-breaker advantage over Hiram, by virtue of their split with the Scots, something Hiram couldn't accomplish in two tries.

When all is said and done, OWU has to play as if they are currently in second place, a game behind Wooster.  Wooster has home games with Denison and Earlham, and road games at Wittenberg and Allegheny remaining.  Anything is possible, especially this season, but Wooster looks like a good bet to finish 3-1 or 4-0 in those games.  If they finish 4-0, they earn the top seed.  If they finish 3-1, OWU needs to win all four of their remaining games (home vs. Witt, Earlham, and Allegheny, and at Oberlin) to earn the top seed.

Hiram's last four games are home vs. Allegheny and Oberlin, and road at Kenyon and Denison.  They pretty much have to win all four and get some help, probably from Wittenberg, to get the top seed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2009, 12:17:37 AM
Wanna know how OWU managed to pull out today's thriller?  Here two stats to consider:
Total rebounds:  OWU 47, Hiram 32.  Offensive rebounds: OWU 9, Hiram 8.  In fact, two of Hiram's 8 were recorded by Ian Pfouts on the last play of regulation; he scored on the second putback to send the game to OT.  It was a great, great sequence for the much-maligned senior, who really left it on the floor today.  But prior to that sequence, Hiram had been held to an almost unthinkable six offensive rebounds, and it really threw their offense out of synch.  It suddenly became clear, to my eyes at least, that a big part of their offense was to take the first reasonably good shot they had, knowing that if it missed, they'd have about a 50-50 chance at a rebound and putback.  When it became clear that that wasn't going to happen today (thanks largely to Pat Pellerite and Kyle Holliday, who combined for 17 defensive rebounds), their offense stagnated as they looked in vain for a better-than-reasonably good shot.  Which brings me to my second key stat:
Field goal shooting:  Hiram 25-65 (38.5%); 2-19 (10.5%) from the arc.  When the Terriers did get the better-than-reasonably good shot, they usually missed it, often badly.  Frosh Andrew Wiegand, usually fairly accurate from the arc (.345 prior to today), was a painful 0-7 and may not have even drawn iron on any of them.  Roberts was pretty much a non-factor, hitting just five of his 12 shots (10 points.)  They struggled with OWU's defense all afternoon, but they also struggled with their own shots, and it cost them. 

Chris Roberts certainly did nothing to enhance his POY credentials (although he did get lots of points toward the Lady Byng Trophy; he's a real class act and does Hiram much credit by his play), as we had discussed.  But Pat Pellerite certainly enhanced his NOY credentials.  He dominated most of the first half at both ends, ending up with 18 points (9 of 14 shooting), 11 rebounds, and three assists.  Of course, his main NOY competition also had a big game at Hiram this week, although for whatever it's worth Hallowell's big game was much more one-dimensional than Pellerite's.

It was a great game, marred only by rocky, nearly random, officiating, which had both cheering sections calling for blood by the time the overtime rolled around.  The players on both teams coped with the bizarre officiating with a level of composure I found inspiring.  Both of these teams are more than capable of winning the NCAC tournament, regardless of where it is held.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2009, 10:26:15 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 07, 2009, 11:54:50 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2009, 10:24:15 PM
Huge road win for the Bishops today as they have an easier remaining schedule than Wooster.  OWU plays Witt at home on Wednesday while Wooster has to play at Witt next Saturday.
If they finish 3-1, OWU needs to win all four of their remaining games (home vs. Witt, Earlham, and Allegheny, and at Oberlin) to earn the top seed.

Hiram's last four games are home vs. Allegheny and Oberlin, and road at Kenyon and Denison.  They pretty much have to win all four and get some help, probably from Wittenberg, to get the top seed.

The first scenario where OWU wins their 4 remaining games and Wooster loses at Wittenberg is my primary concern as a Scots fan.  Wittenberg always get psyched up to play Wooster and Springfield is a tough place to get a win.  As David noted with an assist from Imderekpoe, it is great to know that Wooster owns the tiebreaker if they finish tied with OWU. :)

Hiram needs lots of help to host the NCAC tourney because they lose the tiebreaker scenarios with both Wooster (2 wins over the Terriers) and OWU (who split with the Scots).  So, Hiram needs to win all 4 remaining games and have both Wooster and OWU pick up two additional losses.  While that is possible, it seems highly unlikely.  I welcome corrections if that reasoning is faulty but it seems right to me.

One final point - the NCAC tourney championship looks like the only way into the big dance (NCAA tournament) this year as none of the conference teams will be selected as a Pool C bid.  So, hosting the NCAC tourney is an important advantage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2009, 10:39:09 AM
By the way, has anyone noticed that Hiram's roster has just one senior (Pfouts) and one junior (Jason Hebeisen) on it?  If all of the underclassmen come back next season, there's no reason to suppose they won't be tough again.  This may be the beginning of a Doggie Dynasty!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2009, 11:08:02 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2009, 10:39:09 AM
has anyone noticed that Hiram's roster has just one senior (Pfouts) and one junior (Jason Hebeisen) on it?

David, good point about the Doggie Dynasty! k+

Of course with Melick now off the team and Johnson injured, Wooster's roster has just one senior (Bidwell) and one junior (Geitgey) also on it.

I checked the numbers -- so far this season, 83% of Wooster's points have been scored by freshmen and sophomores.  So, the Scots Dynasty looks promising as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2009, 12:56:20 PM
Witt is another team dominated by underclassmen; Kevin Murray is the only senior, with Gregg Hill set to come back next season.  OWU loses a lot (Holliday, Miller, Noggle), but they lost a lot last year (6 seniors, including Rudegeair, Jean, and Teeters) and look what happened.  Wabash loses only Brian Maloney and a bench player.  Allegheny will probably return their top 9 scorers.  And Kenyon will still have Dave Knapke and JT Knight, among others.   So next year should be another competitive one in our league.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 08, 2009, 01:52:03 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2009, 10:39:09 AM
By the way, has anyone noticed that Hiram's roster has just one senior (Pfouts) and one junior (Jason Hebeisen) on it?  If all of the underclassmen come back next season, there's no reason to suppose they won't be tough again.  This may be the beginning of a Doggie Dynasty!

Could be.  But yesterday up at Hiram was not a Dog Day Afternoon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 08, 2009, 03:30:32 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2009, 10:39:09 AM
By the way, has anyone noticed that Hiram's roster has just one senior (Pfouts) and one junior (Jason Hebeisen) on it?  If all of the underclassmen come back next season, there's no reason to suppose they won't be tough again.  This may be the beginning of a Doggie Dynasty!

I've noticed quite a few rosters around D3 are generally Fr. and So dominated...........my only theory is that the current 20 and 21 year olds (born in 1988 and 1989 (egads)) were the last generation exposed to hair metal bands. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on February 09, 2009, 07:22:57 AM
Interesting point.
I have been reading, and watching this board for a while; the water looked great, so I decided to jump in. 
Let's keep Smiling.

Lord Supporter.

Mark

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 09, 2009, 10:02:18 AM
Hey, welcome to the board, spread the word!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2009, 10:42:26 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2009, 10:39:09 AM
By the way, has anyone noticed that Hiram's roster has just one senior (Pfouts) and one junior (Jason Hebeisen) on it?  If all of the underclassmen come back next season, there's no reason to suppose they won't be tough again.  This may be the beginning of a Doggie Dynasty!
By way of an update, I just found out that Hebeisen will also be graduating (early) this year, so next year's Doghouse will be senior-free.

Quote from: M.Knapke on February 09, 2009, 07:22:57 AM
I have been reading, and watching this board for a while; the water looked great, so I decided to jump in. 
Welcome to our little world, Mark!  I know that there's a lot of parents who follow this board, but very few of them decide to post (at least, to post openly), so I'm looking forward to your observations.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2009, 05:25:24 PM
Congratulations to Wittenberg senior Kevin Murray for being named the NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html).  Murray, who is Witt's leading scorer and is tied for third in the conference in scoring in NCAC games, averaged 20.5 ppg in the two Tiger wins this week.  Murray is also the conference's leading free throw shooter, and was a perfect eight for eight this week from the stripe.  Congratualtions, Kevin!

The NCAC Player of the Week award has now gone to one player from each squad over the first ten weeks of the season:
Week 1:  Chris Roberts, so., Hiram
Week 2:  Wes Smith, so., Wabash
Week 3:  JT Knight, so., Kenyon
Week 4:  George Raftis, jr., Allegheny
Week 5:  Justin Hallowell, fr., Wooster
Week 6:  Mike Loll, sr., Oberlin
Week 7:  Brent Pleiman, jr., OWU
Week 8:  Tristian Gregory, sr., Earlham
Week 9:  Chris Luther, jr., Denison
Week 10: Kevin Murray, sr., Wittenberg
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on February 10, 2009, 05:43:15 AM
Thanks for the welcome.
Player of the Year considerations: Skills, Talent, Leadership & Heart.
Tristian and Bryan clearing exhibit all of the above. Both play as "marked men" by their opposing squads game in and out.
You can check Stats if your a numbers person. The numbers are there.
I respect both of these Young Men. My Nod goes to Yelvington.

New Comer of the Year: As of this writing undecided. I am watching Pellerite and Garabedian. Both were impressive the last game I watched.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on February 10, 2009, 05:54:18 AM
and the word should have been  "clearly" not "clearing"
my bad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2009, 09:35:31 AM
Quote from: M.Knapke on February 10, 2009, 05:43:15 AM
Tristian and Bryan clearing exhibit all of the above. Both play as "marked men" by their opposing squads game in and out.
You can check Stats if your a numbers person. The numbers are there.
I respect both of these Young Men. My Nod goes to Yelvington.
First of all, allow me welcome you to the board as well Mr. Knapke.  It will be nice to get some reports from down in Gambier on a regular basis.  Although, David has done a nice job of spreading himself out around the league this year as well.

I think that it will be difficult for Gregory to get the nod based on how poor the EC is overall.  Yes, he is a marked man, but he is also basically the EC's only legit scoring threat which helps to inflate his numbers IMO.

Yelvington, on the other hand, is clearly the leader for Kenyon, but he also has some help around him which is why Kenyon is tied for 4th with Witt. 

I agree with you about the heart and leadership displayed by both players, and I also agree with you that my nod would have to go to Yelvington as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 10, 2009, 09:19:34 PM
Ticket information for those interested. Don't think it will be a sellout but regardless everything is reserved seating again this year, all the way down to the student section areas. Apparently everyone will be held to their strict "ticketed" seat. Also for those parents interested, For every $8 ticket purchased, you can get a free ticket for a child under 18.

Regardless should be a great rivalry game. Now on to tomorrow night vs OWU. To beat them this time around, Wittenberg needs to keep the tempo up and not let OWU get into their half court sets, in which they destroyed us last game in. Also, turnovers are going to be a key as well as rebounding. If we can finish some easy shots this time around and win the offensive rebounding contest I think Witt has a good chance to win. Will be tough either way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2009, 10:14:12 PM
Tickets for the Wooster/Wittenberg game will also be on sale at the Armington PEC ticket office (at Wooster) on Wednesday from 12:00pm until 2:00pm and on Thursday from 5:00pm until 7:00pm.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2009, 08:09:20 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 39  Denison 32

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 13 points and Marty Bidwell with 9 points.

For the Big Red, Mike Garebedian has 8 points and Chris Luther has chipped in 6 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 11, 2009, 09:13:56 PM
Justin Hallowell hits a 28-footer at the buzzer to send the Wooster-Denison game into overtime!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2009, 09:15:07 PM
Overtime:  Denison 77  Wooster 77

Wow! :o Wooster salvages an overtime period when Justin Hallowell hits a 30 foot three pointer just before the buzzer to tie up the game.  Denison shot over 65% in the second half and led most of the last 7 minutes of regulation.

Wooster trailed by 4 points with ~12 seconds left but the Scots scored to cut the lead to 2 points and then Chris Luther missed a free throw that allowed Justin Hallowell to send the game into overtime with his big shot.

Overtime updates:

~2:00 left  Wooster 85  Denison 85
1:41 left   Still tied at 85-85.  Denison timeout and Big Red ball.
1:05 left   Justin Hallowell shooting 1&1 FTs, Missed...but Wooster got the rebound, Scots miss 2 shots.
0:48 left  Denison ball and Big Red timeout
0:25 left  Denison miss and Wooster gets the rebound
0:03 left  Wooster loses the ball, Big Red ball and timeout
Denison missed shot and we go to a 2nd overtime!

Ian Franks blocks Chris Luther's shot, rebound foul on Denison
Bryan Wickliffe makes 2 big free throws,  Wooster 87  Denison 85
Wooster foul, Pat Sullivan makes 1 free throw,  Wooster 87  Denison 86   Wooster ball.
3:30 left  Ian Franks scores,  Wooster 89  Denison 86
Denison misses a three pointer, Wooster rebound and Denison fouls.
Geitgey makes 1 free throw,   Wooster 90  Denision 86
Denison missed shot, Wooster rebound with 2:30 left
Wooster misses, Denison rebound
Garebedian hits a big three pointer for Denison, Wooster 90 Denison 89   timeout Big Red with 1:47 left
Wooster gets caught on a three second call.  Denison ball.
Wooster steal and breakout, Denison fouls Justin Hallowell
Justin Hallowell makes 1st free throw, timeout Scots.  Wooster 91  Denison 89
47.9 left:  Hallowell FT good, Wooster 92  Denison 89
Denison miss, Wooster rebound and Denison foul
0:35 left.  Bryan Wickliffe hits 2 more big free throws.  Wooster 94  Denison 89
Another Denison miss, Wooster rebound and another Denison foul on Larry Farmer who fouls out with 22 pts.
0:21 left:  Hallowell makes 2 FTs, Wooster 96 Denison 89
Denison loses ball and gets a technical foul.
Hallowell makes 2 more FTs,  Wooster 98 Denison 89
Geitgey makes 2 Fts, Wooster 100 Denison 89
Big Red 3 pointer with 2 secs left.  Woo 100  Denison 92

Final: Wooster 102  Denison 92  2OT

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2009, 09:51:30 PM
Final:  Wooster 102  Denison 92  2OT's

Wooster was led tonight by Justin Hallowell with 30 points! :)  Hallowell prevented the huge upset with his big three pointer at the end of regulation.  Ian Franks had 29 points, Nathan Balch with 14 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 12 points and Marty Bidwell also with 12 points.

Denison's top scorers were Larry Farmer with 22 points, Chris Luther with 20 points, Mike Garebedian with 14 points and Pat Sullivan chipped in 13 points.
 
Coach Moore complimented Denison on the post game show and described Larry Farmer as unstoppable on the offensive end for the Big Red.

Wooster is now 16-6, 11-2 NCAC. :)  Next game at Wittenberg on Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2009, 10:03:19 PM
All the 2/11 NCAC Final Scores:

Ohio Wesleyan 83  Wittenberg 59
Oberlin 62  Kenyon 50  big upset and road win for the Yeomen
Wooster 102  Denison 92  2 OT's, Scots narrowly avoid the upset
Wabash 80  Earlham 48  this game called as a Wabash win with a power outage (3:37 left)
Allegheny 77  Hiram 72  Craig Devinney leads Gators with 18 pts. in an upset
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2009, 10:19:01 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 2/11 Games:

1.  Wooster 11-2, 16-6
1.  Ohio Wesleyan 11-2, 15-6
3.  Hiram 9-4, 14-8
4.  Kenyon 8-5, 14-8
4.  Wittenberg 8-5, 11-10
6.  Allegheny 5-8, 9-13
7.  Wabash 4-9, 9-12
7.  Denison 4-9, 7-15
9.  Earlham 3-10, 3-19
10. Oberlin 2-11, 5-17
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 11, 2009, 10:33:29 PM
I'm glad Wooster won, but they had no business winning this game. While Wooster didn't have their A game, they didn't play bad. It was just that Denison played extremely well, and out of their mind in the second half. I would bet that there were only a handful of possessions when they didn't score in the second half. Even when they missed they got a bunch of offensive rebounds. And they were on fire from the line. Fortunately for Wooster, they may have gotten tight with victory in sight, missing three free throws in the last minute. This allowed Hallowell to hit what had to be close to a 30-foot three pointer at the buzzer. Sometimes in the heat of the moment, shots seem farther than they actually are, but he was definitely farther than any of Cooper's long-range threes.

I thought this was the game where finally Wooster's lack of post play was going to get them. They didn't look inside, and barely scored inside. And when Wooster's offense starting stagnating in the middle of the second half, particularly from the outside, you could see this problem even more. Wooster's bench also has to start playing better, as they only had five points in a 50-minute game, and only one field goal.

Despite all this, Wooster seems to be pretty mentally tough, particularly for a team this young. When a sophomore (Franks) who didn't play much last year and a freshman (Hallowell) are ice in the clutch, that is a good sign.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2009, 12:10:25 AM
Miscellany:
At Delaware, OWU scored the game's first 22 points; Witt didn't get on the board until David Nowicki hit a 3 more than eight minutes in.  At about that time, Witt switched to a zone defense, and OWU struggled offensively for most of the rest of the night, with Witt generally having the run of play until the last 10 minutes or so.  But by then the damage was done; Witt never got closer than 11--although they reached that point several times.  The loss drops Witt to 11-10, the second straight year with 10+ losses for the Tigers.  The last time that happened was 1955-56, which also happens to be the last season Witt had a losing record (8-12).  The last time Witt lost 10 games in the regular season (last year they lost 9, with the 10th loss being in the NCAC tournament) was in 1967-68, which also happens to be the last season Witt had a non-winning record (13-13).

At Gambier, neither Bryan Yelvington (illness) nor Dave Jolson (injury) suited up.  When you play without your leading scorer, rebounder, and assist man, you're in trouble, even against Oberlin.  Kenyon stays in a tie with Witt for the #4 slot, and the tiebreaker is up in the air.  The two teams face each other in the last game of the season, 2/21.

Hiram's loss means the only way they can earn the tournament's #1 seed is if they win out and both Wooster and OWU lose all of their remaining games.  I'll take the under on that.

We (at OWU) got score updates during the COW/DU overtimes from the PA announcer, but nobody seemed to care much.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on February 12, 2009, 06:34:56 AM
Gambier-Tomsich Arena
Congratulations go out to the Oberlin Squad. With many of thier players doubling,tripeling, thier average outputs.
Storyline simply this: Kenyon squad shoots low percentage with matching output . 50 points.
Particularly impressed with Gary, Tompsett, Dilworth.
Kenyon needed more production from the Total Team.

Tough Loss for the Lords. However, it seems the Lightning Bolts were striking elsewhere in the Conference as well.
Still a ways to go into the tournament. Certainly there will be a few more twists in the plot.

Mark   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 12, 2009, 10:09:21 AM
Wow is right!! 
Great game and congrats to the Scots for pulling it out.  But the Big Red certainly deserves a whole lot of credit for putting the fear of God into them on their home floor. 

I just have two points and I know hindsight is 20/20 but with time running out and your are up 3 why not foul Hallowell?
I know there are people that say you don't want them on the line.  But really, ONLY A THREE kills you.  It was a great shot and Hallowell deserves a lot of credit.  But if I were the coach I foul him.  Put him on the line and take my chances.

Missing 3 free throws with 20 seconds left also killed the Red.  What I am curious about is why take out Garabedian, .750 from the line, and Leffew, .895.  And put in McFerren at .532 and Stuhlfauth at .667.  I am aware of the offensive/defensive switch idea but Wooster had to foul.  And McFarren, according to the season stats, is the worst free throw shooter on the team.  At crunch time don't you have your best free throw shooters on the floor.

Again, hindsight is 20/20 and I was sitting watching a computer feed so I was not there.  But it would have been such a huge win.  The guys never gave up and have been playing terrific ball down the stretch.

If there is any such thing as a moral victory this had to be it but I also think moral victories are like kissing your sister.

But my hat is off to the Big Red they played a GREAT game.

The season is not over and I really think Denison is a team that needs to be taken REAL seriously or they will bite you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 12, 2009, 10:31:42 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 11, 2009, 10:33:29 PM
I thought this was the game where finally Wooster's lack of post play was going to get them. They didn't look inside, and barely scored inside. And when Wooster's offense starting stagnating in the middle of the second half, particularly from the outside, you could see this problem even more.
Bryan Wickliffe's play really has me puzzled of late.  He really didn't seem to have his head in the game AT ALL last night.  Well, at least until the 2nd ot when he was pretty clutch at the line to put the game away.  I will give him that...

But, as for the rest of his game, he picks up 2 early fouls in the first 3 minutes of the 1st half causing him to become a spectator for the remainder of the half.  Then in the 2nd half, he was called for a 3 second violation not once, not twice, but three times!  And one of the violations erased a Nathan Balch 3-pointer.  I'm sorry, but it's bad enough getting a 3-second call once in a game.  But to let yourself get caught 3 times in the span of 8 minutes is a sign that you don't have your head in the game.

At least he did vindicate himself, as I said, with his ft shooting performance in the 2nd ot.  And he also earns props for snagging 10 boards and earning his 1st career double double!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2009, 12:06:15 PM
I do believe the conference tournament will be wide open with no 'gimme' games, even in the 1-8 game. No one will be satisfied just making the tourney.

But Witt as a #5 seed and on the road in the first round. It could happen! Wowser.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 12, 2009, 12:15:10 PM
BigRedFan -

Fouling Hollowell would have meant fouling him in the act; it was literally a catch-and-shoot situation with him after he got the dump-off from Franks.  And, he was at the very least 26 feet from the basket; very likely 27 or 28.  Even for him, that's a long, long shot.  I'd say the odds are better that he'd have made the three free throws than that jumper.  Now, why they didn't foul Franks when he was bringing the ball up the court is another story.

ScotsFan -

There's something to what you say about Wickliffe's play, but a little bit of it at least was bad luck.  On one of the three-second calls, he was the victim of great Scots' ball-movement.  Someone faked a three from the left wing.  Wick is in there for the offensive board.  A quick pass went to the corner, where it appeared another Scot was going to shoot, so Wick remained in rebounding position.  But, it was yet another fake, with another pass back to the wing.  By now Wickliffe was screwed and got called.

He was also unlucky twice in one Denison possession at the other end.  He had good rebounding position at the far end of the hoop on an attempted three-pointer from the corner.  Had his man boxed out and everything, but the ball took a long carom well over his head to the Denison guy.  This same situation then happened again, in the same possession.

On the other hand, he did miss a couple of important chippies, and those need to be put into the hoop.

It was one of those games where three or four players went from hero to goat to hero to goat to hero.  Hollowell is probably the best example, as he missed some relatively easy close-in shots and a big free throw, but also made many big threes including the monster game-saver.

It was an exciting game, marred only by the usual lousy officiating, especially during regulation when Wooster couldn't buy a call.  The fouls on Wickliffe that put him on the bench for virtually the whole first half were very suspect.  The same goes for the fouls on Bidwell, who along with Wick seem targeted by three or four of the refs that continually mar the contests at Timken Gym.




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 12, 2009, 01:45:33 PM
It's amazing how Wooster can find ways to win despite getting screwed by the zebras in every single game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2009, 03:13:12 PM
Yeah, you'd think the NCAC would notice such blatant homerism, except when it's anti-homerism in Timken.

Well, it could be worse - the old ICAC refs with Eric Harmon in charge. You think Ted Valentine has issues?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 12, 2009, 05:13:30 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 12, 2009, 12:06:15 PM
I do believe the conference tournament will be wide open with no 'gimme' games, even in the 1-8 game. No one will be satisfied just making the tourney.

But Witt as a #5 seed and on the road in the first round. It could happen! Wowser.

better than a #7 seed  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 12, 2009, 06:02:15 PM
Quote from: Witt4ever on February 12, 2009, 05:13:30 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 12, 2009, 12:06:15 PM
I do believe the conference tournament will be wide open with no 'gimme' games, even in the 1-8 game. No one will be satisfied just making the tourney.

But Witt as a #5 seed and on the road in the first round. It could happen! Wowser.

better than a #7 seed  ;D

Yeah yeah.  That's what happens when you go in the tank for three weeks and drop home games to Earlham and Denison.  Even so, I think there's a good chance Wabash can make up the one game difference on Allegheny and get the #6 seed.  Allegheny is closing with Kenyon, Wooster, and @OWU while Wabash is closing @Oberlin, Witt, @ Denison.  If the 80-points-in-36-minutes Wabash team gets back on the bus for those road games, the LGs should catch or pass Allegheny in the standings.  But we'll see what happens...I can't figure out the '08='09 LGs at all. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2009, 07:06:39 PM
Moving up from #7 to #6 is beginning to look like swapping out a trip to Wooster or OWU for a trip to Hiram.  As they say, be careful what you wish for... ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 12, 2009, 08:44:42 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 12, 2009, 07:06:39 PM
Moving up from #7 to #6 is beginning to look like swapping out a trip to Wooster or OWU for a trip to Hiram.  As they say, be careful what you wish for... ;D

The only downside I see to getting Hiram in round 1 vs. OWU or Wooster is the length of the trip.  OWU and Wooster are teams that have recent success and routinely go deep in the tournament.  Not so much with Hiram.  I'd prefer the draw against the less experienced team. 

Even less important than that is how Wabash is playing when tournament time starts.  As we've seen, when Wabash plays well, they can beat anybody in our league.  And when they don't, they're fully capable of losing to anybody.  Just depends on which Wabash team shows up in a couple of weeks. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2009, 09:41:25 PM
I was alluding to both the length of the trip and its destination.  I don't think Wabash's chances are significantly better against Hiram than against the other two, so you may as well go to the closer and more comfortable venue.   :)

The LGs did recently lose to OWU by just 6, and they seem to have some kind of mojo working with Wooster, whereas they had to put on a furious comeback just to lose to Hiram by 8, and IIRC that was back when Wabash was healthy and playing pretty well.  I wouldn't count too heavily on Hiram's youth and inexperience helping; after all this is a team that had not beaten Wittenberg since 1968 until this year, when they swept the Tigers.  They also won on OWU's home court. 

If I were Wabash, the opponent (of these three) I'd want to face in the first round is Wooster.  OWU and Hiram rarely beat themselves (I still can't explain that Hiram/Franciscan game), but if Wooster is not hitting their threes, they're vulnerable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 12, 2009, 11:51:26 PM
The inexperience factor is really about all I have to go on as I wasn't afforded the chance to see the new and improved Terriers play.  Hiram has dropped three in a row...perhaps the pressure of being in contention in February is getting to them?  It's hard to say. 

There are definitely pros and cons for any potential first round opponent.  The most important thing for Wabash is to be playing consistently well going into the tournament because if not it really won't matter who the opponent is.  Wednesday's result at Earlham (sans Aaron Brock even) is definitely a positive step for the LGs. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on February 13, 2009, 06:57:52 AM
The excitement level around the League certainly is building.....
Great fun to contemplate and theorize over.
Another offered, "A team isn't measured by thier work/performance on a great day! but rather; the absolute guaranteed
minimum on thier worst day."

Let's enjoy this weekends games, good luck to all.

It's all part of the journey.

Happy Valentines Day.  Keep Smiling & Go Lords
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 13, 2009, 10:14:18 AM
A few random (and belated) notes on Wooster's play of late:

First, I'm a big fan of watching the Wooster webcasts, except that the Clear Picture commentary usually isn't very good.  But for me the feed has been pretty reliable and about as close as I can be to "being there" when I'm 600 miles away.

Second, anyone else notice Wooster's steady improvement in foul shooting this year?  I remember thinking they were shooting very poorly at the line early in the year, but now as a team Wooster's at a very respectable 75%, and turned in a 32-36 performance against Denison.  In fact, I have the Scots as 100-118 from the line over the last 6 games, for 85% performance.  The Scots' opponents are 106-151 in those same six games, for 70%.  So while I love that the Scots are doing so well from the line, they actually have fewer points from the line because they haven't been there as often as their opponents.  Still, major improvement for the Scots.

Third, on Hallowell watch:  4-9 vs. Denison gives him 73 made 3pt hoops with at least four games to go, counting the NCAC first round.  He needs five to tie the Wooster single-season record.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 13, 2009, 01:18:30 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 13, 2009, 10:14:18 AM


Second, anyone else notice Wooster's steady improvement in foul shooting this year?  I remember thinking they were shooting very poorly at the line early in the year, but now as a team Wooster's at a very respectable 75%, and turned in a 32-36 performance against Denison.  In fact, I have the Scots as 100-118 from the line over the last 6 games, for 85% performance. 
And if you take away Wooster's first 2 games of the season, Wooster would be over 80% from the line for the year!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 13, 2009, 05:04:30 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 13, 2009, 01:18:30 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 13, 2009, 10:14:18 AM


Second, anyone else notice Wooster's steady improvement in foul shooting this year?  I remember thinking they were shooting very poorly at the line early in the year, but now as a team Wooster's at a very respectable 75%, and turned in a 32-36 performance against Denison.  In fact, I have the Scots as 100-118 from the line over the last 6 games, for 85% performance. 
And if you take away Wooster's first 2 games of the season, Wooster would be over 80% from the line for the year!

I knew it was bad right at the start- didn't realize it was that bad at the beginning.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 14, 2009, 01:04:36 PM
From my perspective, there are 3 very interesting games today based on recent performances:

Hiram at Denison - the Terriers have actually lost 3 straight.  Denison demonstrated their recent improvement by taking Wooster to double overtime on Wednesday in a near upset.  Can the Big Red raise their performance again and knock off Hiram at home?

Kenyon at Allegheny - Allegheny scored a nice road win on Wednesday at Hiram.  Can they continue their improved play and beat the Lords in Meadville?  A big contribution from Yelvington is probably needed if the Lords are going to get this road win.

Wooster at Wittenberg - Huge rivalry game :) ...so the Tigers will be pysched.  A strong defensive effort will be needed by Wooster both inside the lane and also against Kevin Murray if the Scots hope to get out of Springfield with a victory.  Wooster must win this game if they wish to host the NCAC tourney, IMO.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2009, 01:09:33 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 14, 2009, 01:04:36 PM
Kenyon at Allegheny - Allegheny scored a nice road win on Wednesday at Hiram.  Can they continue their improved play and beat the Lords in Meadville?  A big contribution from Yelvington is probably needed if the Lords are going to get this road win.
Yelvington is still under the weather and I am told did not make the trip to Meadville.

Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 14, 2009, 01:04:36 PM
Wooster at Wittenberg   Wooster must win this game if they wish to host the NCAC tourney, IMO.
If ever there was a year when the 8 seed posed a legitimate threat to the 1 seed, this is the year.  The 8 seed is likely to be Allegheny, Wabash, or Denison, and any one of these teams could take out OWU, Wooster, or Hiram.  The semifinals and finals conceivably could end up on the home court of any of the top 5 seeds this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 14, 2009, 01:51:35 PM
Halftime in Oberlin:

Wabash 36
Oberlin 29

Oberlin is staying close here thanks to blistering 63% FG shooting which includes 5-5 on 3 point FGs.  The Yeomen are being led, not surprisingly, by Jordan Beard's 12 points.  Wabash is being led by Wes Smith's 9 points, but those 9 points came on 4-13 shooting for Wes which isn't terribly efficient.  Standing out a little more to me in the first half is Brian Shelbourne's 8 points and 4 assists in 19 first half minutes.  I've noticed that during the wretched losing streak Wabash went through, Coach Petty started shaking up the lineup quite a bit and one change was getting Shelbourne much more time.  Seems that Shelbourne is making the most of his opportunity and really helping to get the Wabash offense working more efficiently. 

Also worth reporting is that Aaron Brock is back on the court today for Wabash which is good news for the Little Giants. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 14, 2009, 02:41:22 PM
All done in Oberlin and Wabash escapes with a 63-61 win over the Yeomen. 

Wabash's shooting got a little frosty in the second half while Oberlin remained red hot.  Oberlin made up their halftime deficit and grabbed the lead from Wabash about halfway through the second half and then the teams traded mini-runs for the rest of the half.  Fortunately, Wabash got the last run and squeaked out the close win. 

Oberlin was led by Jordan Beard and his 17 points, but just five of those points came in the second half.  Josh Merritt had a big second half for the home team with 15 points on 7-9 shooting.  Wabash was led by Wes Smith's game highs of 20 points, 7 rebounds, and 4 steals.  Wes was the only Little Giant to reach double figures today, however Chase Haltom and Brian Shelbourne chipped in with 9 and 8 points, respectively. 

Next up for Wabash will the final game at Chadwick for the 2008-2009 season on Wednesday night vs. Wittenberg. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2009, 06:30:14 PM
The Oberlin folks don't seem to be real happy about the way this game was decided:
Yeomen Get Shortchanged at Home (http://www.goyeo.com/news/2009/2/14/MBB_0214094336.aspx?tab=)
Pretty strong stuff coming from an SID.

Meanwhile:
Allegheny holds off the Yelvington-less Kenyon, 62-61.

OWU has no problem with Earlham, 64-46

Hiram barely outlasts Denison, 70-68.  This was not the same Hiram team I saw several times earlier this season.  For starters, there's the starters.  Roberts and Wiegand were joined today by Russo (rather than Milton), Muhammad (rather than Eniola), and Hebeisen (rather than Pfouts).  I don't know what was up with that, since all of them played significant minutes.  Maybe it was disciplinary, maybe it was Coach Fleming trying to shake up his team, search me.  It's not as if Russo, Muhammad, and Hebeisen are not worthy starters.  Hiram's zone defense absolutely controlled the first half, when Denison could get nothing accomplished and stayed in contact (33-20) only because of frosh Brett Tiberi's three threes.  The rest of the team went a combined 0-for-16 from the arc, most of them within the last 5 seconds of the shot clock; they only managed nine field goal attempts inside the arc.  Unfortunately for the Terriers, they weren't able to take command of the game on the strength of this suffocating defense, because their offense was never in synch.  Hiram has an athletic advantage over most every team they play, and certainly over Denison, but possession after possession they walked the ball upcourt to set up a halfcourt motion offense with not enough motion in it.  Sloppy passes, missed shots, and poor rebounding (DU grabbed 8 offensive rebounds in the half) conspired to keep the game relatively close, although Deon Milton's 30-footer at the buzzer was a help (in fact, it turns out to be the margin of victory.)  The main difference in the second half was that Denison, still playing with much more energy than Hiram, started to hit their shots.  While the zone was still pretty effective, DU hit 10 of 15 treys launched over top of it.  The Big Red also hit all eight of their second-half free throws, while Hiram missed five of their eight.  Denison had the ball down two with :25 left and called timeout to set up the play to tie or win, but the execution failed when Chris Roberts blocked a short Chris Luther jumper and came away with the ball.  Roberts was credited with 21 points (although I think he had 23, as his first basket was erroneously credited to Hassan Muhammad), while Nick Russo had six assists and hit all three of his shots for 8 points. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2009, 06:51:40 PM
Wow, was Oberlin's SID channelling some of the posters on this board??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 14, 2009, 08:09:44 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 35  Wittenberg 20

Wooster is being led by Nathan Balch with 14 points (4 three pointers) and Ian Franks with 11 points.

For Wittenberg, the top scorers are Kevin Murray with 6 points and Alex Brandt with 5 points.

Neither team shot a high percentage in the half with Wooster at 41% and Witt at 25%.  Wooster outrebounded Witt 22 to 13 in the half mostly because the Scots were getting the defensive rebounds on missed shots by the Tigers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 14, 2009, 08:14:37 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 14, 2009, 08:09:44 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 35  Wittenberg 20

Wooster is being led by Nathan Balch with 14 points (4 three pointers) and Ian Franks with 11 points.

For Wittenberg, the top scorers are Kevin Murray with 6 points and Alex Brandt with 5 points.


Balch also leads all rebounders with 7, part of the reason that Woo was +9 on rebounds for the half (22-13).

Wooster's not actually shooting all that well- 40 percent, but has held Wittenberg to only 6-24 from the field, only 25 percent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 14, 2009, 08:43:47 PM
I have been following the stats for the Woo Witt game.  I apologize if this has been discussed before, but is Michael Cooper related to James Cooper of Wooster?  I see they are both from Springfield South.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 14, 2009, 08:49:36 PM
No, they are not related.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 14, 2009, 08:58:45 PM
Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 14, 2009, 09:05:12 PM
Final:  Wooster 67  Wittenberg 53

Big road win for Wooster as they stay tied with Ohio Wesleyan for first place in the NCAC. :)  Scots were led by Nathan Balch with a season high 22 points (made 6 three pointers! :o), Ian Franks with 19 points and Marty Bidwell with 9 points.  Balch hit 2 big three pointers in the last 4 minutes of the game to secure the victory.

Wittenberg was led by Michael Cooper with 13 points (all in the 2nd half), Alex Brandt with 9 points, Chris Sullivan with 9 points and Kevin Murray chipped in 8 points.

Scots shot 42% from the floor compared to 36% for the Tigers.  Wooster won the boards 37-26 and the Scots made 11 three pointers compared to only 3 for Wittenberg

Wooster is now 17-6, 12-2 NCAC ;D  Next game is at Allegheny on Wednesday
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 14, 2009, 09:15:08 PM
All the 2/14 NCAC Final Scores in one list:

Ohio Wesleyan 64  Earlham 46
Allegheny 62  Kenyon 61
Wabash 63  Oberlin 61
Hiram 70  Denison 68
Wooster 67  Wittenberg 53

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 14, 2009, 09:18:59 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 2/14 Games:

1.  Wooster 12-2, 17-6
1.  Ohio Wesleyan 12-2, 16-6
3.  Hiram 10-4, 15-8
4.  Kenyon 8-6, 14-9
4.  Wittenberg 8-6, 11-11
6.  Allegheny 6-8, 10-13
7.  Wabash 5-9, 10-12
8.  Denison 4-10, 7-16
9.  Earlham 3-11, 3-20
10. Oberlin 2-12, 5-18
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2009, 09:24:36 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 14, 2009, 09:18:59 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 2/14 Games:

4.  Kenyon 8-6, 14-9
4.  Wittenberg 8-6, 11-11
6.  Allegheny 6-8, 10-13
7.  Wabash 5-9, 10-12
8.  Denison 4-10, 7-16
9.  Earlham 3-11, 3-20
10. Oberlin 2-12, 5-18

If anyone is concerned that the rampaging Gators may break into the Dorksen 5, please be advised that their last two games are vs. Wooster and at Ohio Wesleyan.

Everyone is still alive for a tournament berth.  Oberlin could catch Denison, and they hold the tiebreaker with the Big Red if the tie is for 8th place.  (If it's for 9th place, the tiebreaker would be a coin toss, but it wouldn't matter since both would miss the tournament.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 14, 2009, 09:46:46 PM
Just a little fun facts for everyone.  This is only the fourth time Woo has swept Witt in the regular season since the 1990-91 season.  Given the rivalry between Woo-Witt, I think this makes Witt extremely dangerous if Woo meets them again in the NCAC tournament.  This led me to take a look back at the history.

Witt swept Woo in regular season 6 times during that span (93-93, 95-96,, 96-97, 00-01, 01-02, 03-04).  Woo beat Witt three of those years in the NCAC tournament (96-97, 00-01, 03-04).  One of those years, Witt won the tournament (01-02).  The other two years, Woo and Witt did not play in the NCAC.  

Woo, as I said, swept Witt four times during this span (94-95, 99-00, 05-06, 08-09).  During those years, Woo only played Witt once in the NCAC (05-06) and lost.

Only once during this period did a team make a clean sweep by beating the other team three times in a single season (Witt, 01-02).  By the way, the scores that year were 75-70, 68-66, and 58-57 (NCAC).

Of course, this does not mean Woo and Witt will play again in the NCAC, but they did meet in the NCAC in 9 seasons since 90-91.  If this year becomes the tenth, I don't like the odds for Woo.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DarkSide-D on February 14, 2009, 09:50:02 PM
And, if we wanted to make the numbers more interesting, Woo and Witt only played once during the regular season in 90-91.  But when they met in the NCAC, Witt won the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2009, 12:09:23 AM
Video of the Smith drive is here:

http://www.wabash.edu/sports/docs/basketballstats/video/200809/OberlinHighlights.mov

Seemed there was some contact. The fans and the scorers table seemed to be screened from the action a bit by their angle but this view does show contact during the drive.

Also, it clearly shows that after the free throws, Oberlin had a good chance to break the press but threw the ball away.

Somehow if the NCAC refs were conspiring against someone I don't think they'd choose a game between two teams cemented below the Dorksen five.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 15, 2009, 12:21:30 AM
I've got to believe that the OC SID may want to make some editorial changes to the posted web story.  It's pretty clear that a foul was committed there. 

One mystery solved, one to go.  What's with Wabash busting out the home whites at Oberlin? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on February 15, 2009, 09:17:56 AM
Can Visitors wear white on the road?
Ahead things are really looking balanced.

12/3 12/3 10/5 9/6 8/7 7/8 6/9 5/10 3/12 3/12
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: LGHistorian on February 15, 2009, 12:42:05 PM
The Oberlin women's basketball team unveiled new pink jerseys for their game and it was in conjunction with a fundraising event for a local cancer organization.  The Earlham seniors on the men's team requested that they wear their traditional road uniform for their final regular season home game and in support of what the Oberlin women were doing.  And Wabash went along with it and therefore had to wear the traditional home whites.  Brent Harris mentioned this at the start of the radio broadcast.

By the way, "bad officiating" is truly in the eye of the beholder during the last few seconds of this game. I remember Brent saying that Coach Petty yelled for a timeout as soon as Smith made his second free throw and the referees did not grant (or hear) Petty.  Obviously Wabash wanted to set up the defense against Oberlin's final shot but Oberlin obliged by throwing away the basketball before they could get a shot off.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on February 15, 2009, 02:29:29 PM
re: officiating

Can anyone provide a short tutorial on NCAC referees? 

For instance:  Any experience or extra quals required to call NCAC games?
Who controls and assigns them?  Does anyone grade them? 

Thanks, nd
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 15, 2009, 02:52:18 PM
Quote from: LGHistorian on February 15, 2009, 12:42:05 PM
The Oberlin women's basketball team unveiled new pink jerseys for their game and it was in conjunction with a fundraising event for a local cancer organization.  The Earlham seniors on the men's team requested that they wear their traditional road uniform for their final regular season home game and in support of what the Oberlin women were doing.  And Wabash went along with it and therefore had to wear the traditional home whites.  Brent Harris mentioned this at the start of the radio broadcast.

Mystery #2 solved.  Cool stuff and I hope Oberlin's fundraising efforts were successful. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2009, 11:14:03 AM
Seeding updates:
#1 seed: Wooster owns the tie-breaker with OWU, by virtue of their sweep of Hiram.

#3 seed: Hiram will be the #3 seed.  They lose tie-breakers to Wooster (head-to-head), OWU (record vs. would-be first place Wooster), and three-way (head-to-head).  They win tie-breakers with Wittenberg (head-to-head), Kenyon (boils down to Hiram's win at OWU, where KC lost), and a three-way tie is not possible.

#4: Kenyon and Wittenberg are the only teams that can earn the #4 seed.  Wittenberg owns all possible tie-breakers with the Lords, so the only way Kenyon grabs the #4 seed is by beating the Tigers in Springfield on Saturday AND either a) beating Hiram on Weds. or b) Wabash beating Witt on Wed. (or both).

#5: Allegheny could finish in a tie with either Wittenberg or Kenyon at 8-8 (but not both, since either Witt or KC must finish with at least 9 wins.)  Wittenberg swept the Gators and would the tie-breaker, but 'Gheny would win a tie-breaker with Kenyon based on composite record vs. teams ahead of them (like games only.)  So if 'Gheny wins out and Kenyon loses out, Kenyon drops to #6 with AC at #5 traveling to meet #4 Wittenberg.

#6 seed: Wabash owns the tie-breaker with Allegheny (head-to-head).  Allegheny owns the tie-breaker with Denison (composite record vs. teams ahead of them in the standings; boils down to AC's wins over Hiram and Kenyon, each of whom swept DU.)  The winner of next Saturday's Wabash/Denison game would also win a tie-breaker between them (Denison sweep, or Wabash better record vs. teams ahead of them, namely Wooster).  A three-way tie would fall out as Denison, then Wabash, then Allegheny.

#7 seed: (Wabash vs. Denison as above.)  Denison holds the tie-breaker with Earlham, either by head-to-head (if the Big Red beat the Quakers Wed.) or by better record vs. the teams above them.  Wabash wins a tie with EC based on records vs. teams above them.  A three-way tie would favor Denison, then EC, then Wabash...which means that Wabash could still miss the tournament by losing their last two games.

#8 seed:  (Denison vs. Earlham as above.)  Earlham owns the tie-breaker with Oberlin (sweep.)  Oberlin would have the tie-breaker vs. Denison, based on record vs. teams ahead of them, provided Earlham finishes last.  A three-way tie would put Earlham into the #8 seed, with Denison 9th and Oberlin last, based on head-to-head.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2009, 11:23:54 AM
Congratulations to Wabash's Wes Smith, the first player to win the NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html) for a second time this season.  Smith, who was also named POTY back on Dec. 1, shot the lights out this week, first with 31 in the power-failure-shortened game vs. Earlham, then 20 more at Oberlin.  Congratulations, Wes!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2009, 11:36:58 AM
David, you're a better man than I.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2009, 03:30:20 PM
If the 11-11 Tigers lose to three of four, it will be the first time since the 1955-56 season that they will have had a losing record. Heck, they've only had five seasons of 10 losses (and one .500 season) since that time!

It could happen. Wabash on the road, IU-East (no longer making fun...), Kenyon and perhaps Kenyon again in an NCAC playoff match.



Next thing you know, Linfield will be 4-5 in football!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2009, 07:05:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 16, 2009, 03:30:20 PM
If the 11-11 Tigers lose to three of four, it will be the first time since the 1955-56 season that they will have had a losing record. Heck, they've only had five seasons of 10 losses (and one .500 season) since that time!

It could happen. Wabash on the road, IU-East (no longer making fun...), Kenyon and perhaps Kenyon again in an NCAC playoff match.



Next thing you know, Linfield will be 4-5 in football!

First hurdle cleared:  Wittenberg 80, IU-East 69.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 16, 2009, 07:31:28 PM
Crazy to think that Wabash could miss the tournament.  I'm confident that they'll get in though given that Earlham has only ever beaten Wooster twice, not once in the last 23 years, and never ever at Wooster.  History suggests that Earlham won't get the two wins they need to force the tiebreak. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2009, 07:39:51 PM
Witt may not have cleared the hurdle cleanly, however; it appears that both of the frosh wide receiver-cum-hoopsters turned their ankles in tonight's game.  Michael Cooper would seem to be fine, but you never know what will happen overnight.  Josh McKee's ankle injury is more of a concern, and would have to be considered questionable for Wednesday.  The short turnaround time and long bus ride to C'ville don't help matters, either.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 16, 2009, 07:49:25 PM
Last week, Wooster was #5 in the Great Lakes regional rankings (http://d3blogs.com/d3hoops/category/ncaa-stuff/regional-rankings/ (http://d3blogs.com/d3hoops/category/ncaa-stuff/regional-rankings/)), indicating at least a shot at a Pool C berth for the Scots.  However, Patrick Abegg's projections (http://d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2009/02/16/the-abegg-projections/ (http://d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2009/02/16/the-abegg-projections/)), which fared pretty well last year, don't have the Scots anywhere on the board.  That's interesting...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2009, 08:46:44 PM
The regional rankings are a snapshot at a moment in time.  I believe Patrick's projections also look into the future.  Wooster's next three games (Allegheny, Earlham, and the NCAC first round game) are all games that will hurt the Scots' OWP (I have no idea what they'll do to the OOWP), something that I think is taken account of in the projections.  I think a Pool C bid for either Wooster or OWU is at best a longshot at this point.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 16, 2009, 08:57:41 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 16, 2009, 07:39:51 PM
Witt may not have cleared the hurdle cleanly, however; it appears that both of the frosh wide receiver-cum-hoopsters turned their ankles in tonight's game.  Michael Cooper would seem to be fine, but you never know what will happen overnight.  Josh McKee's ankle injury is more of a concern, and would have to be considered questionable for Wednesday.  The short turnaround time and long bus ride to C'ville don't help matters, either.

This was a mortal lock to happen, right?  Witt scrambles the jets for a non-conference, non-divisional game they don't need at a time in the season when the day off is probably worth more than the game experience (non-divisional game experience at that).  I hope those kids come back alright, but this one gets filed directly into the "be careful what you wish for" file. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 16, 2009, 11:12:39 PM
Abegg must have completely missed Wooster. Not sure how Ohio Wesleyan can be #16 on the Pool C list, and Wooster is not even in the top 28. Wooster is one game better in winning percentage. OWU has an edge in OWP, and they are basically tied in OOWP. I would think these two teams would be virtually tied in any at-large rankings, with Wooster possibly holding a tiny advantage because of a slightly better record.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 17, 2009, 12:33:16 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 16, 2009, 11:12:39 PM
Abegg must have completely missed Wooster. Not sure how Ohio Wesleyan can be #16 on the Pool C list, and Wooster is not even in the top 28. Wooster is one game better in winning percentage. OWU has an edge in OWP, and they are basically tied in OOWP. I would think these two teams would be virtually tied in any at-large rankings, with Wooster possibly holding a tiny advantage because of a slightly better record.

Quote from: ziggy on February 16, 2009, 04:25:13 PM
Quote from: pabegg on February 16, 2009, 09:41:33 AM
OK, here we go for this week:

Reg Conf Rank Prior RPI    OWP    OOWP   School                    Natl Status      Reg Overall
GL  64   01   01    0.6193 0.5522 0.5154 Capital                   013  A w C       18-3 20-3
GL  64   02   02    0.6115 0.5416 0.5208 John Carroll              018  C 4         16-3 18-4
GL  62   03   04    0.5876 0.4686 0.4965 Calvin                    020  A w C       11-1 16-6
GL  63   04   05    0.5828 0.5133 0.5047 Wooster                   037  A w C       16-4 17-6
GL  90   05   03    0.5921 0.5335 0.5366 Carnegie Mellon           038  C 13        13-4 17-5
GL  63   06   06    0.5798 0.5315 0.5063 Ohio Wesleyan             044  C 16        15-5 16-6
GL  64   07   08    0.5716 0.5334 0.5194 Ohio Northern             057  C 26        14-6 16-7
GL  62   08   07    0.5692 0.5446 0.4951 Hope                      068  C 35        9-4 16-7
GL  61   09   09    0.5412 0.4724 0.4831 Penn State-Behrend        082              14-5 16-7


Reg        Region
Conf       Conference number
Rank      Regional ranking
Prior       Prior regional ranking
School
Natl     National ranking based on regional results
Status
    B + number: Pool B ranking (top 4 in tournament)
    C + number: Pool C ranking of 18 teams in tournament
    C second: second tier Pool C (spots 19-28)
    C third: third tier Pool C (spots 29-38)
    A in: clinched Pool A bid
    A w C: Pool A, in Pool C range (1 to 18)
    A second: Pool A, in second tier Pool C
    A third: Pool A, in third tier Pool C
    A: lower level Pool A
    blank: lower level Pool C

The bottom  chart is the Great lakes region chart, Pabegg has Wooster penciled in as the Pool A from the NCAC.  If they don't get the A, they would be in ok shape for a C, depending on when the tournament loss occured.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 17, 2009, 12:52:05 AM
Quote from: sac on February 17, 2009, 12:33:16 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 16, 2009, 11:12:39 PM
Abegg must have completely missed Wooster. Not sure how Ohio Wesleyan can be #16 on the Pool C list, and Wooster is not even in the top 28. Wooster is one game better in winning percentage. OWU has an edge in OWP, and they are basically tied in OOWP. I would think these two teams would be virtually tied in any at-large rankings, with Wooster possibly holding a tiny advantage because of a slightly better record.

Quote from: ziggy on February 16, 2009, 04:25:13 PM
Quote from: pabegg on February 16, 2009, 09:41:33 AM
OK, here we go for this week:

Reg Conf Rank Prior RPI    OWP    OOWP   School                    Natl Status      Reg Overall
GL  64   01   01    0.6193 0.5522 0.5154 Capital                   013  A w C       18-3 20-3
GL  64   02   02    0.6115 0.5416 0.5208 John Carroll              018  C 4         16-3 18-4
GL  62   03   04    0.5876 0.4686 0.4965 Calvin                    020  A w C       11-1 16-6
GL  63   04   05    0.5828 0.5133 0.5047 Wooster                   037  A w C       16-4 17-6
GL  90   05   03    0.5921 0.5335 0.5366 Carnegie Mellon           038  C 13        13-4 17-5
GL  63   06   06    0.5798 0.5315 0.5063 Ohio Wesleyan             044  C 16        15-5 16-6
GL  64   07   08    0.5716 0.5334 0.5194 Ohio Northern             057  C 26        14-6 16-7
GL  62   08   07    0.5692 0.5446 0.4951 Hope                      068  C 35        9-4 16-7
GL  61   09   09    0.5412 0.4724 0.4831 Penn State-Behrend        082              14-5 16-7


Reg        Region
Conf       Conference number
Rank      Regional ranking
Prior       Prior regional ranking
School
Natl     National ranking based on regional results
Status
    B + number: Pool B ranking (top 4 in tournament)
    C + number: Pool C ranking of 18 teams in tournament
    C second: second tier Pool C (spots 19-28)
    C third: third tier Pool C (spots 29-38)
    A in: clinched Pool A bid
    A w C: Pool A, in Pool C range (1 to 18)
    A second: Pool A, in second tier Pool C
    A third: Pool A, in third tier Pool C
    A: lower level Pool A
    blank: lower level Pool C

The bottom  chart is the Great lakes region chart, Pabegg has Wooster penciled in as the Pool A from the NCAC.  If they don't get the A, they would be in ok shape for a C, depending on when the tournament loss occured.
My guess is that it was just an oversight on Abegg's part.  Looking at his projections from the GL above, it looks as though he feels that Wooster is still fairly safe if they don't get the A.  I still think the Scots need to at least win out and make the conference finals for them to be even considered for a C.  And I'm still not convinced that will be good enough for the Scots to get a C.  I really have a hard time believing the NCAC would be a 2 bid conference this year...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 17, 2009, 01:19:48 AM
It's not an oversight -- read the chart and the key.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 17, 2009, 08:32:07 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 16, 2009, 07:05:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 16, 2009, 03:30:20 PM
If the 11-11 Tigers lose to three of four, it will be the first time since the 1955-56 season that they will have had a losing record. Heck, they've only had five seasons of 10 losses (and one .500 season) since that time!

It could happen. Wabash on the road, IU-East (no longer making fun...), Kenyon and perhaps Kenyon again in an NCAC playoff match.



Next thing you know, Linfield will be 4-5 in football!

First hurdle cleared:  Wittenberg 80, IU-East 69.

You know it would happen - and it was all because I mentioned Linfield. I should know you don't mess with Linfield's streak...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 17, 2009, 01:06:28 PM
Just wanted to say that I checked out how former Wabash assistant's Jason Mulligan's team is doing up at the University of New England.

20-3, 11-0 in the CCC after a 1-3 start.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 17, 2009, 03:34:06 PM
Good stories about UNE have been in the What We're Reading list on the D3hoops.com front page, if people here are interested.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 17, 2009, 10:58:51 PM
With his performance against Wittenberg last Saturday, I think Nathan Balch has now entered the discussion for Newcomer of the Year. Even though he played Div. I basketball last year, he still qualifies (why the Newcomer award is not limited to new college players, not new players to the NCAC, I don't know).

For the year, he is averaging 12 points, three rebounds and is third on the team in assists (53) and steals (18). He is also shooting 48% from the field, 46% from three-point range and 89% from the foul line. In NCAC play, he is averaging 13.5 points. Throw in that he can play both the point guard and two guard positions, he is giving Hallowell a good run or the best newcomer on the Scots and should at least get some consideration.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 18, 2009, 07:58:45 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 25  Allegheny 20

Wooster is being led by Marty Bidwell with 8 points, Ian Franks with 5 points and Matt Fegan also with 5 points.

Allegheny's hottest player is Henry Heeter with 9 points.  :P ::)  Donte Briscoe has chipped in 4 points.

Both teams did not shoot well in the half with Allegheny at 30% and Wooster at only 27%.  Scots made 4 three pointers and outscored the Gators at the charity stripe to get the 5 point lead.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 18, 2009, 08:30:48 PM
9:00 left:  Wooster 46  Allegheny 29

Scots on a 14-1 run.  Justin Hallowell has 13 points so far in the 2nd half. :)  Nathan Balch with 8 pts. in the half

5:20 left  Wooster 50  Allegheny 35

OWU Update:  OWU 50  Oberlin 47 with ~8:00 left in Oberlin
OWU Update:  Oberlin 54  OWU 50 :o with ~6:00 left!

~1:50 left:  Wooster 52  Allegheny 38  Scots winning with defense and they will get the win in Meadville! :)

OWU Update:  Oberlin 58  OWU 53  with 3:52 left
OWU Update:  OWU 60  Oberlin 59  with 1:04 left, Yeomen have the ball
Oberlin missed shot, Bishops rebound with 0:50 left
Kyle Holliday scores again,  OWU 62  Oberlin 59  0:18 left  Yeomen ball and timeout
OWU fouls with only 4 secs left: 2 FT's by Oberlin  OWU 62 Oberlin 61, OWU ball and Oberlin timeout
OWU misses free throw (1&1) but OWU rebounds, Oberlin foul with 2 secs left:
OWU makes 2 FTs, Oberlin misses desparation shot
Final:  OWU 64  Oberlin 61  Bishops escape with a nailbiting road win.  Yeomen led this game with 1:20 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 18, 2009, 08:52:12 PM
Final:  Wooster 52  Allegheny 39

Wooster was led tonight by Justin Hallowell with 17 points (15 points in the 2nd half), Nathan Balch with 10 points and Marty Bidwell also with 10 points.

Allegheny was led by George Raftis with 13 points and Henry Heeter with 10 points.

Ugly win for Wooster as they shot 33% from the floor but they held the Gators to less than 30% shooting.

Wooster is now 18-6, 13-2 NCAC :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 18, 2009, 09:22:12 PM
Final:  Wabash 68  Wittenberg 43

Wabash gets the home win.  Little Giants led by Chase Halton with 22 points and Wes Smith with 16 points.  Kevin Murray led Wittenberg with 8 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 18, 2009, 09:29:25 PM
Kenyon 75
Hiram 74 OT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 18, 2009, 09:42:48 PM
All the 2/18 NCAC Final Scores in One List:

Denison 72  Earlham 70  Big Red clinch their NCAC tourney berth
Kenyon 75  Hiram 74 OT  Arce hits 3 pointer with 9 secs left for win with no Yelvington
Wabash 68  Wittenberg 43  Little Giants made 12 three pointers to get the win
Wooster 52  Allegheny 39
Ohio Wesleyan 64  Oberlin 61
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 18, 2009, 09:47:34 PM
Current NCAC Standings thru 2/18 Games:

1.  Wooster 13-2, 18-6
1.  Ohio Wesleyan 13-2, 17-6
3.  Hiram 10-5, 15-9
4.  Kenyon 9-6, 15-9
5.  Wittenberg 8-7, 12-12
6.  Wabash 6-9, 11-12
6.  Allegheny 6-9, 10-14
8.  Denison 5-10, 8-16
9.  Earlham 3-12, 3-21
10. Oberlin 2-13, 5-19
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 18, 2009, 11:19:02 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 18, 2009, 09:22:12 PM
Final:  Wabash 68  Wittenberg 43

Wabash gets the home win.  Little Giants led by Chase Halton with 22 points and Wes Smith with 16 points.  Kevin Murray led Wittenberg with 8 points.

With that offensive output, is Wittenberg gunning for membership in the Big 10?

Mark Turpin got a start - great for Mac and Mark. Turpin played 16 minutes, boosting his season total to 30. Going into this season, he had played 10 total minutes for the varsity. Wow. Sweet

And it was sweeter because 'Bash clocked Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2009, 12:14:02 AM
Seeding update:

#1/#2: Wooster will be the #1 seed if they beat Earlham on Saturday or if OWU loses to Allegheny.  Otherwise the top seed goes to OWU.
#3: Hiram, which owns the tie-breaker with Kenyon, should they need it.
#4/#5:  Kenyon has clinched at least a share of fourth place for the second consecutive year.  They will face Wittenberg on Saturday in Springfield, and the winner of that game will host the rematch on Tuesday in the NCAC quarterfinals.
#6/#7/#8:  There are four possibilities based on the outcomes of two Saturday games:
  a) OWU beats Allegheny; Wabash beats Denison:  Wabash #6, Allegheny #7, Denison #8
  b) OWU beats Allegheny; Denison beats Wabash:  all three tied for 6th, and the seeding would be Denison #6, Wabash #7, Allegheny #8
  c) Allegheny beats OWU; Wabash beats Denison:  WC and AC tie for 6th, with the seeds Wabash #6, Allegheny #7, Denison #8
  d) Allegheny beats OWU; Denison beats Wabash:  WC and DU tie for 7th; seeds Allegheny #6, Denison #7, Wabash #8

Oberlin and Earlham have failed to make the tournament field.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 19, 2009, 11:10:53 AM
CONGRATS to the Big Red for making it back to the BIG DANCE!!!!   

Hindsight again being 20/20 the Big Red could easily be 9-6 had they beat Allegheny on 12/6 (64-5-63) and Oberlin on 1/11 by the same score, both games at Denison.

And this past week they had Wooster and Hiram beat. 

But again, would da, should da, could da doesn't win the games but they sure have played well down the stretch. 

I am real happy for the coach and the kids for not folding and getting themselves back into the tournament!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 19, 2009, 11:26:46 AM
The Little Giants continue to mystify...great stuff in thrashing Wittenberg (always a good time when that happens). 

And now it's on to Denison to earn that #6 seed.  Should Wabash do that, they'll enter the tournament riding a 4-gamer and draw a Hiram team that will have lost four or five of their last six.  Revisiting last week's conversation, I think it's becoming clearer that drawing a scuffling Hiram team is preferable to drawing either OWU or Wooster at this point.  But that, of course, all hinges on Wabash getting that win in Granville on Saturday.  I'd have to believe that Wabash learned their lesson a couple of weeks ago and will come out ready to match Denison's energy.  The LGs certainly did not do that when they hosted the Big Red at Chadwick. 

Quote from: smedindy on February 18, 2009, 11:19:02 PM
With that offensive output, is Wittenberg gunning for membership in the Big 10?

I watched the Penn State/Illinois "game" last night.  39-33...with a shot clock and a three point line?  Embarassing.  Those two set basketball back 40 years.  The "competing" institutions and the league should issue an apology to the general public for that abomination.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2009, 12:46:04 PM
Wittenberg is now 12-12.  They basically need to sweep Kenyon on Saturday and Tuesday to guarantee their 41st straight winning season.  They could lose Saturday, but then they'd have to win the NCAC tournament to have a winning season.  The other version of this streak, non-losing seasons, sits at 52 years, and would be extended to 53 with a win Saturday.  If they lose Saturday, they need to reach the NCAC finals to finish 14-14 or better.

Take a moment to let that soak in, if you never have before.

The last time Wittenberg's men's team had a losing record in a complete season was 53 years ago, in 1955-56.  Since then, they've only had one .500 season, in 1967-68.  Those are Joe DiMaggio-like streaks, absolutely mind-boggling.  I know the Tigers aren't everyone's favorite team in here, but partisanship aside, these are achievements I think we all can and should applaud.

Wittenberg record book (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/records/recordbook.pdf) (pdf)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 19, 2009, 03:40:24 PM
Agreed, DC. It's also interesting to look back upon the 2006 Final Four and check out where those teams are this season:

1. Virginia Wesleyan  13-11  7-8 ODAC
2. Wittenberg  12-12  8-7 NCAC
3. Illinois Wesleyan  13-11  5-8 CCIW
4. Amherst  19-5  7-2 NESCAC

Only Amherst has thrived this season, although of course one can't help but wonder what the record of the Lord Jeffs would look like if the NESCAC played a double round-robin rather than a single.

There may be a perception out there that it's the same teams that dominate D3 over and over every year, and that's not really true.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 19, 2009, 04:09:22 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 19, 2009, 12:46:04 PM
I know the Tigers aren't everyone's favorite team in here, but partisanship aside, these are achievements I think we all can and should applaud.

Ok, I've applauded them, silently.  Now, if you'll pardon me, I'm going to root like hell for Kenyon. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on February 19, 2009, 08:30:47 PM
Woo Boo,
Your karma reflects how truely classless you and your opinions are.  Class equals respect for your traditional rivals.  Woo-Witt is one of the great rivalries in D3. 
Wallow in your enjoyment of Witt's down year.  I doubt Steve Moore is.....
I don't see your team ranked highly in any polls, and I see it as an unfortunate trend for the NCAC, not as an opportunity to gloat.
Not that you would understand the nuance of this post, but I thought I would throw it out there for everyone else.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 19, 2009, 09:05:55 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 19, 2009, 12:46:04 PM
The last time Wittenberg's men's team had a losing record in a complete season was 53 years ago, in 1955-56.  Since then, they've only had one .500 season, in 1967-68.  Those are Joe DiMaggio-like streaks, absolutely mind-boggling.  I know the Tigers aren't everyone's favorite team in here, but partisanship aside, these are achievements I think we all can and should applaud.

Congratulations to Wittenberg on an amazing streak.  Not having a losing season since 1955-56 is an impressive accomplishment.

Many posters on this board probably know that the North Coast (NCAC) includes the two winningest teams in all of Division III basketball.  Entering this season, Wittenberg was #1 in all time wins with 1,575 and Wooster was #2 with 1,472. :) :)  Each team deserves a smiley face on those numbers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on February 19, 2009, 09:17:25 PM
Thank you WSF, for the kudos.  Back at you for Woo's success.
Woo Boo, Witt's .500 record this season has put a huge bite on the W-L discrepancy.  Congratulations.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2009, 09:42:20 PM
This was really not the effect I had in mind... :(

...and I didn't think WB's post was all that terrible.  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 19, 2009, 10:29:51 PM
Quote from: drt on February 19, 2009, 08:30:47 PM
Woo Boo,
Your karma reflects how truely classless you and your opinions are.  Class equals respect for your traditional rivals.  Woo-Witt is one of the great rivalries in D3. 
Wallow in your enjoyment of Witt's down year.  I doubt Steve Moore is.....
I don't see your team ranked highly in any polls, and I see it as an unfortunate trend for the NCAC, not as an opportunity to gloat.
Not that you would understand the nuance of this post, but I thought I would throw it out there for everyone else.
Judging from your karma, you don't have much room to talk...   ::)

Witt's streak is impressive and they should definitely be applauded on it.  But all things must come to an end at some time...

BTW, I was thinking the same thing as WB.  Does that make me classless too?  I don't want to be construed as gloating or anything...  :-\

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 19, 2009, 11:02:36 PM
Quote from: drt on February 19, 2009, 08:30:47 PM
Woo Boo,
Your karma reflects how truely classless you and your opinions are.  Class equals respect for your traditional rivals.  Woo-Witt is one of the great rivalries in D3. 
Wallow in your enjoyment of Witt's down year.  I doubt Steve Moore is.....
I don't see your team ranked highly in any polls, and I see it as an unfortunate trend for the NCAC, not as an opportunity to gloat.
Not that you would understand the nuance of this post, but I thought I would throw it out there for everyone else.

Excuse me?  I'll root for who I want, against who I want, and I'll gloat at whichever team I please.  And, by the way, it doesn't look to me as if you want to compare karma percentages with anyone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on February 20, 2009, 05:31:13 AM
Just read last nights comments,tough room; sort-a sorry I was out and about and missed it live.

History & Traditions should not only be "Noted, Observed and Celebrated", but also Congratulated.
Traditions+Experience+Execution+a dash of luck=Success

Now everyone knows things change, here comes the weekend. Tighten up the chin straps. Heads and Eyes Up.

Smile and Enjoy.

Good Luck
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on February 20, 2009, 08:30:06 AM
I was a little  over the top on that one.  I guess I just don't believe in kicking anyone when they're down, no matter who it is.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 20, 2009, 09:24:27 AM
Wittenberg's consistent success over 50+ years is simply amazing.  No doubt, regardless of exactly what its record ends up being this year, Witt will continue to be a successful and winning organization for years to come.  And, as a Wooster fan, I must admit that- in a certain way- I like it like that.  I want my arch-rival to be good; I want those games to matter.  I want every game between them to be a battle for the conference title, an NCAA bid, etc.  It's part and parcel of what makes it such a great rivalry.

Speaking of "success streaks" though, I was trying to remember how many seasons of 20+ wins Wooster has had in a row?  This will be the first season in several where Wooster has not completed a 20 win year by the end of the regular season, yes?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2009, 09:29:20 AM
It's incredible. That kind of run doesn't come by accident.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2009, 10:36:55 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 20, 2009, 09:24:27 AM
Speaking of "success streaks" though, I was trying to remember how many seasons of 20+ wins Wooster has had in a row?  This will be the first season in several where Wooster has not completed a 20 win year by the end of the regular season, yes?
The last time Wooster won fewer than 20 regular season games was 2001-02, when they finished 19-6.  The next season, they won 30 games (23-2 reg. season) and went to the Final Four.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 20, 2009, 10:56:37 AM
A repeat of that scenario isn't out of the possibility.  Wooster loses Marty Bidwell after this season, and he'll be an important loss in many ways.  But he's the only departure.  With Brandon Johnson returning, the Scots will no doubt have the best set of three guards in the league, and one of the best in all of D3, with he, Ian Franks, and Nathan Balch.  Justin Hollowell and Brian Wickliffe also return.  Add to that the belated debut of the seven foot Gideon Mabeny (sp), plus any additions from the next freshmen class, and what has turned out to be a pretty good Wooster team this year could be much improved next season.

As for Wittenberg.  Of course I recognize their achievements over the years.  But given my druthers, and ESPECIALLY since they're a hated rival to the Scots, I'd love to see them lose every game for the next century, or at least until coach Brown retires.  Witt as an Oberlin-like doormat instead of a nemesis?  Hoorah!  Bring on Kenyon, OWU, or both, to take their place.  Shorter trips, classier programs, free admission instead of eight bucks, and, at least in Kenyon's case, a better facility. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2009, 11:02:28 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 20, 2009, 10:36:55 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 20, 2009, 09:24:27 AM
Speaking of "success streaks" though, I was trying to remember how many seasons of 20+ wins Wooster has had in a row?  This will be the first season in several where Wooster has not completed a 20 win year by the end of the regular season, yes?
The last time Wooster won fewer than 20 regular season games was 2001-02, when they finished 19-6.  The next season, they won 30 games (23-2 reg. season) and went to the Final Four.
As you noted, Wooster didn't get to 20 wins in the regular season on '01-'02 but they ended up with 20 by winning 2 NCAC tournament games before bowing out to Witt for the 3rd time that season.  They also failed to reach 20 wins in the '96-'97 season but ended up with 23 after post-season wins.  And they even received an at large bid to the NCAA tournament that season!  And that was the year their current streak of 20+ wins overall started.

The last season Wooster didn't reach the magic number of 20 wins in a season was back in the 1995-96 season.  They ended up 19-7 that season...

So that would make the streak 12 straight years of 20+ win seasons and on the verge of extending it to 13!  :)

Even more impressive is what Moore has accomplished over his 21 years at Wooster.  He has only failed to reach 20 wins in 4 of those seasons!  Once was his first season which was also Wooster's lone sub-.500 season under his reign.  The other 3 times, Wooster still won 18 games twice and 19 games once!

And over the past 6 seasons Wooster is averaging an incredible 27 wins per season!  8)

And as WB notes, with what Wooster has returning and the fact that they are only losing Marty, this streak should be continuing at least into next year, if not further depending on how recruiting goes.  8)

Pretty impressive...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2009, 11:38:41 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 20, 2009, 10:56:37 AMWooster loses Marty Bidwell after this season, and he'll be an important loss in many ways.
More on Marty (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4530439), from Dan Brown of the Daily Record.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 20, 2009, 12:33:16 PM
I just got this list from WPI's sports information director a few minutes ago, actually. Streaks of consecutive 20-win seasons, entering 2008-09:

Wooster 12
Maryville (Tenn.) 10
Amherst 8
Virginia Wesleyan 5
WPI 5
Elms 4
Hope 3
St. Thomas 3
Augustana 3
Farmingdale State 3
Salem State 3
Whitworth 3
Northwestern (Minn.) 3

Some of these streaks are going to end this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 20, 2009, 10:48:53 PM
Regarding Wittenberg's downfall this season, much can be gained by looking at the present day roster and coaching of Bill Brown. As some may know, I am not a fan of Bill Brown's coaching style. Just ask Arte Taylor.

Brown plays too many players during the game. During Witt's heyday (70's), Coach Hunter only played 7 or 8 men a game, these players accrued around 30-35 minutes a game whereas Brown's starters are lucky if they play 25 minutes a game.

Sometimes Brown's player combination just boggles the mind. Inconsistent rotation.
As a Freshman recruit, Lewis Buzzard was the talk of Springfield, as he was picked in the top 125 post players in the Midwest regardless of college division. Sometimes Buzzard starts a game, then he does not play any minutes for 2 or 3 games. So the team can not get into any flow.
And for a team that does not scrimmage during practice and does not have any set plays, they are lucky the streak has continued as long as it has.

The roster situation should be noted as the following:
6 players that were freshmen that played significant minutes on the 2006 final 4 team are no longer on the team due to injuries or just quitting the team.

The players are : Dan McNeely(quit team), Tyler Howard (never returned to team from serious concussion in 2006 NCAC tourney game against Wooster, DJ Corbett (quit), Mark Caraway (transferred to Wright State to be with his girlfriend).

And the other 2 players are Gregg Hill (Witt's best  player, injured for over 3 years with a bad shoulder) and Kyle Bigler (point guard with ACL).

Now for  the rest of the story:

27 players are no longer with the team since the 2005-06 season
that could be playing at Witt now.

First the names of the players that played significant Varsity minutes:

Dan McNeely, Tyler Howard, DJ Corbett, Mark Caraway,  Gregg Hill, Kyle Bigler, Robby Peters, Derrick Hannon (transferred to Cedarville, local fans knew about this before Brown knew), Casey McCoart, Trent Bailey, Tim Beck ( saw him at the local Meijer store before season, said looking forward to the new season, then just quit),Jeromy Romero (on and off player from Delaware, Oh)

Now for the other players that played JV:
Dan Bruce, Sean Hyland, Jace McGonigle(was a star at West Jeff but never saw much varsity action),Sonny Snell, Nick Vukasovich,  Ben Dobberstein, Nick Felter, Joe Klamforth, Kevin Lange. Brian Morrow, Tyler Siemon, Adam York, Darrel Cook and Patrick Guido.

And for the record, I went back at looked at Daniel Russ's statistics during his freshman season He never started one game. Period. Maybe this speaks volumes about Alex Brandt or lack of talent that Witt has. I hope the former and not the latter.

As Bill Brown said during a recent post game interview, "Winning just is not important as used to be". If he feels like this, the players probably sense it.

Wittenberg athletics sure has changed in the last 5 years. Witt fans expect that the football and basketball program will lose and the soccer and volleyball teams will win.

Just like former Wittenberg President Wm. Kinnison wanted over 30 years ago and one of the reasons that Witt got out of the OAC. He wanted team parity among all varsity sports. A Springfield native which makes it worse..

Who would have thunk it. :P



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 20, 2009, 10:57:10 PM
Witt4Ever,

Thanks for one of the most candid posts I've seen on this board. I've always had the sense that Wittenberg has had more physical talent than Wooster, but seeming underperformance (with the exception fo 2006) and the attrition rate does seem high there. Brown has what I think is a pretty strong recruiting advantage over Wooster due to the school's location. Springfield, and Clark County as a whole, is much bigger and has a lot more talent to choose from. In other words, the 30-40 mile radius around Wittenberg is much more fruitful (including Dayton) than it is around Wooster. So Wooster is forced to go farther away to get its recruits. That is not a small thing in Div. III. Being able to pluck a good local player every few years makes for easier recruiting. And while Wooster has had some nice players from nearby, the last all-conference level players were Nate Gaubatz and Steve Thompson in 2001.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 20, 2009, 11:02:21 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 20, 2009, 10:57:10 PM
Witt4Ever,

Thanks for one of the most candid posts I've seen on this board. I've always had the sense that Wittenberg has had more physical talent than Wooster, but seeming underperformance (with the exception fo 2006) and the attrition rate does seem high there. Brown has what I think is a pretty strong recruiting advantage over Wooster due to the school's location. Springfield, and Clark County as a whole, is much bigger and has a lot more talent to choose from. In other words, the 30-40 mile radius around Wittenberg is much more fruitful (including Dayton) than it is around Wooster. So Wooster is forced to go farther away to get its recruits. That is not a small thing in Div. III. Being able to pluck a good local player every few years makes for easier recruiting. And while Wooster has had some nice players from nearby, the last all-conference level players were Nate Gaubatz and Steve Thompson in 2001.

Do not get me started on the recruiting topic. Brown hates to recruit locally because he does not want to deal with the players parents.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2009, 11:19:15 PM
It's a down cycle for Witt - it just happens. I can imagine that some parents would be an issue. Ask any Dean of Students about "helicopter parents". But some parents are like that even if they have to drive 200 miles to get to their precious snowflake's game.

Many coaches play 10, 11, 12 guys. Some play 6 or 7 only. Whatever the system is for the coach and what works for the coach and team. Up here, Tubby Smith plays 11 guys, whatever the situation calls for. Everyone is ready to go at any moment. I've always believed in getting at least 9 to 10 some minutes because if someone gets hurt the subs need to be able to handle long stretches.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 21, 2009, 09:53:28 AM
I feel necessary to follow up on Witt4Ever's post as I agree with points and disagree a little bit.

It is pretty obvious to astute Witt followers that ever since that 2005 Runner Up finish Witt hasn't had the same type of attitude or mentality. Much of the players leaving the system from what I have heard, Witt4ever having much more information than myself, have been because of unhappiness with playing time, style, and lack of purpose. I tend to like playing many guys on a team, especially this season where he is forced to see what he has and how guys respond to pressure and playing time. The thing about playing 10 guys a night is how your players respond/buy into the system. University of Dayton regularly plays 10 guys to keep everyone fresh and their defensive tenacity is hard to handle with the Coach constantly bringing in fresh bodies. Wittenberg players/fans seems to think what is he doing?

I think the thing about local players being recruited because of him not wanting to deal with parents is a little bogus, as you're going to have to deal with parents anyway whereever they are from. In some cases being further away will make it worse because parents won't want to come multiple hours just to see their son get minimal playing time.

Also, some Witt recruits have vastly been overrated (ex. Lewis Buzzard-very uncoordinated)

I think the critical point in the Witt program will be displayed both the next two games to see how the young players respond to adversity and pressure and next season especially with getting Gregg Hill back. If Witt can't muster up a good season, good being winning the NCAC or having a 2 seed at worst.

Thoughts/opinions????

Witt4Ever i have you mad karma for posting that as most people just like to look outside in and not inside out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 21, 2009, 03:17:36 PM
Quote from: Witt4ever on February 20, 2009, 10:48:53 PM

And for the record, I went back at looked at Daniel Russ's statistics during his freshman season He never started one game. Period. Maybe this speaks volumes about Alex Brandt or lack of talent that Witt has. I hope the former and not the latter.

I don't want to come across as bashing Witt,  but I would tend to say it has more to do with the latter.  Looking back at Witt's lineup when Russ was a frosh and I don't know too many players that would have been able to crack that starting line-up as a freshman!  I mean they had seniors BJ Harris and Kevin Longley and Peter Walker was a junior.  There was a lot of experienced talent that was ahead of Russ when he arrived in Springfield as a freshman!  There isn't near that level of talent in Springfield on this season's team from an experience and talent standpoint...

But, hey.  Wooster is basically in the same boat.  I can't remember when a Wooster team has had to rely so heavily on freshmen or first year players!  I mean, Cooper didn't even get significant PT as a freshmen and he certainly was not a starter.  But that doesn't mean that Wooster's frosh are that much better talent wise to be starting as freshmen.  It just means that there isn't anyone else to choose from in the sr. and jr. classes that are better...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2009, 03:37:11 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 55  Earlham 24

This game is essentially over at halftime. :)

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 16 points, senior Marty Bidwell with 12 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 6 points (8 rebounds) and Matt Fegan with 6 points.

Earlham's top scorers are AJ Sutherlin with 6 points and Ryan Taylor with 6 points.

Wooster shot 74% in the first half compared to only 32% for the Quakers.  Scots made 7 of 11 three point shots.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2009, 04:07:07 PM
Congrats to Justin Hallowell who just hit his 78th three pointer of the season! :)  Hallowell has now tied James Cooper and Tom Port for the Wooster record of most three pointers made in a season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2009, 04:23:00 PM
Final:  Wooster 95  Earlham 54 :)

Congrats to the Scots who clinch their 5th straight NCAC regular season title!

Wooster was led today by Ian Franks with 23 points, Marty Bidwell with 16 points, Nathan Balch with 12 points and Bryan Wickliffe with 9 points, 11 boards.  Congrats to Marty Bidwell on Senior Day as he finishes his regular season career.

Tristian Gregory, also a Senior, led Earlham with 16 points in his final game.  Congrats to Gregory on a fine NCAC career.

Wooster is now 19-6, 14-2 NCAC ;D  Next is a NCAC tourney quarterfinal game at home on Tuesday.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2009, 04:43:03 PM
All the NCAC 2/21 Final Scores:

Wittenberg 68  Kenyon 44
Wabash 75  Denison 63
Wooster 95  Earlham 54
Allegheny 59 Ohio Wesleyan 57
Hiram 70  Oberlin 52
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 21, 2009, 04:47:28 PM
Alleg 59
OWU 57 final

congrats to Wooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2009, 04:49:17 PM
Witt4ever - thanks for the update!  Wooster gets the undisputed NCAC regular season title! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 21, 2009, 04:50:33 PM
5 years in a row.  >:(

http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mballtime.pdf
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2009, 04:51:36 PM
NCAC Tournament Games on Tuesday

#1 Wooster hosts #8 Denison
#2 Ohio Wesleyan hosts #7 Allegheny (again)
#3 Hiram hosts #6 Wabash
#4 Wittenberg hosts #5 Kenyon (again)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 21, 2009, 05:01:27 PM
Great win by Witt today, Witt went on a little run to go up by 7 at half and then put the game out of reach within minutes of the second half starting.

1- Kenyon better tighten up their turnovers before Tuesday, as I haven't looked yet but I'd say almost 1/3 of Witt's points were off of turnovers. Kenyon committed 19 turnovers. Even though Wittenberg committed 15 TO's, they were able to play solid D to counteract those.

2-Also, as I alluded to earlier, the depth thing can play into Witt's favor by throwing fresh bodies out there. 12 guys scored for Wittenberg today!!!!!

3-Kenyon can't compete over the course of an entire game with the athleticism on the boards for Wittenberg. They were outrebounded by 17.

Great crowd on hand as well. Should be a great NCAC tournament again this year. When's the last time potentially Wittenberg and Wooster would face each other on a Friday night instead of Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2009, 05:09:13 PM
NCAC Final Regular Season Standings (All Games)

1.  Wooster 14-2, 19-6
2.  Ohio Wesleyan 13-3, 17-7
3.  Hiram 11-5, 16-9
4.  Wittenberg 9-7, 13-12 (#4 seed in tourney)
4.  Kenyon 9-7, 15-10 (#5 seed)
6.  Wabash 7-9, 12-12 (#6 seed)
6.  Allegheny 7-9, 11-14 (#7 seed)
8.  Denison 5-11, 8-17
9.  Earlham 3-13, 3-22
10. Oberlin 2-14, 5-20
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 21, 2009, 05:11:26 PM
Could we see some wackiness in this year's tournament?  Check it out:

#1 Wooster hosts #8 Denison - The Big Red were a 28 foot buzzer beater from beating Wooster at Timken not that long ago.  
#2 Ohio Wesleyan hosts #7 Allegheny (again) - Allegheny just beat OWU at the Branch today.
#3 Hiram hosts #6 Wabash - Wabash is on a four gamer and have seemingly figured some thigns out.  Hiram has scuffled down the stretch big time.  
#4 Wittenberg hosts #5 Kenyon (again) - Total toss up.  Sometimes these teams look really good, sometimes they look really bad.  Anything goes in this one.  

It is plausible that any or all of the lower seeds could win on Tuesday.  Should be interesting to follow the action on Tuesday night.  Let's go Little Giants!  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 21, 2009, 05:16:38 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 21, 2009, 05:01:27 PM
When's the last time potentially Wittenberg and Wooster would face each other on a Friday night instead of Saturday.

Not in a very long time ...

Wittenberg and Wooster have been on opposite sides of the bracket in every NCAC tournament since Witt joined the league in 1989, with the possible exception of the 1992-93 season.  That year, Wooster was the #3 seed while Allegheny and Wittenberg shared the regular-season title; I'm not sure which was in the half of the bracket with Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2009, 05:20:26 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 21, 2009, 05:01:27 PM
Great win by Witt today, Witt went on a little run to go up by 7 at half and then put the game out of reach within minutes of the second half starting.

1- Kenyon better tighten up their turnovers before Tuesday, as I haven't looked yet but I'd say almost 1/3 of Witt's points were off of turnovers. Kenyon committed 19 turnovers. Even though Wittenberg committed 15 TO's, they were able to play solid D to counteract those.

2-Also, as I alluded to earlier, the depth thing can play into Witt's favor by throwing fresh bodies out there. 12 guys scored for Wittenberg today!!!!!

3-Kenyon can't compete over the course of an entire game with the athleticism on the boards for Wittenberg. They were outrebounded by 17.

Great crowd on hand as well. Should be a great NCAC tournament again this year. When's the last time potentially Wittenberg and Wooster would face each other on a Friday night instead of Saturday.

Oh, and
4-Kenyon played without their two leading scorers, both probable all-conference honorees, which means that over 45% of the offense was on the bench in warmups today.  I didn't see the game, but I'm quite sure that Witt felt able to key on Dave Knapke (0 pts., only took 1 shot) in the absence of Yelvington and Knight, and let the other guys beat them (they couldn't).  

It's possible that Yelvington will be back for Tuesday's game; I don't know the status on Knight, who injured his ankle during the OT vs. Hiram on Wednesday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2009, 05:25:57 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2009, 05:09:13 PM
NCAC Final Regular Season Standings (All Games)

1.  Wooster 14-2, 19-6
2.  Ohio Wesleyan 13-3, 17-7
3.  Hiram 11-5, 16-9
4.  Wittenberg 9-7, 13-12 (#4 seed in tourney)
4.  Kenyon 9-7, 15-10 (#5 seed)
6.  Wabash 7-9, 12-12 (#6 seed)
6.  Allegheny 7-9, 11-14 (#7 seed)
8.  Denison 5-11, 8-17
9.  Earlham 3-13, 3-22
10. Oberlin 2-14, 5-20


Tie-breakers, for the anal among us:
#4: Wittenberg swept Kenyon (73-61, 1/24 at KC; 68-44 2/21 at WU)
#6: Wabash defeated Allegheny in their only game (58-56, 1/3 at AC)
That was pretty easy... :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2009, 05:33:56 PM
Cribbing from wooscotsfan's post to add tip times:
NCAC Tournament Games on Tuesday

#1 Wooster hosts #8 Denison 7:30pm
#2 Ohio Wesleyan hosts #7 Allegheny 8:00pm (following women's quarterfinal, Witt vs. OWU, at 6:00pm)
#3 Hiram hosts #6 Wabash 7:30pm
#4 Wittenberg hosts #5 Kenyon 7:30pm

This is the first time since joining the NCAC in 1989-90 that Wittenberg will not host a quarterfinal doubleheader (the Witt women finished 5th).  Another amazing Witt streak gone by the wayside but worthy of commemoration. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 21, 2009, 05:40:54 PM
DC, I believe Knight will not be playing Tuesday, as he was in a walking boot today, not too promising. I did notice that Yelvington did not play. Witt had numerous guys on Knapke today and was taken out of the game. Kenyon was turnover prone on the perimeter and never got anything going really.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2009, 06:34:17 PM
OWU, which hasn't won the NCAC championship since their magical 1987-88 national championship season, really had the title in their grasp a week ago, but look what happened:
    Wed: OWU 64, Oberlin 61
    Sat: Allegheny 59, OWU 57
I've said all season that I thought OWU had the best team in the conference, but this is a terrible way to go into the tournament.  I don't know what to think now.  They could repeat as tournament champions, or they could go out in the quarterfinals.  I can't figure this team out.  One thing is for sure: there's no Pool C bid available to the Bishops now, so they need three wins to extend their season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2009, 06:48:34 PM
DC - I can't figure ANY NCAC team out this year. Is Wooster safe as a "C"? I think they'd better take care of Denison for sure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 21, 2009, 08:21:45 PM
Here are two sets of numbers:

13.5 ppg; 42% from the field; 39% from three-point range; 72% from the foul line; 6.4 rpg; 3.5 apg; 30 blocks & 28 steals

15.3 ppg; 51% from the field; 38% from three-point range; 77% from the foul line; 4.3 rpg; 3.1 apg; 12 blocks and 29 steals

The first belongs to Tom Port as a sophomore in 2004-05, the second belongs to Ian Franks this year, his sophomore year. While Port, due to his size and athleticism, was probably a little more of a factor defensively, clearly Franks is a better offensive player right now. Pretty remarkable considering Franks was mostly a JV player last year.

Franks' numbers this year are just about as good as Port's as a junior. These are Port's numbers as a junior, when he was an All-American:

15.4 ppg; 46% from the field; 38% from three-point range; 84% from the foul line; 5.9 rpg; 2.8 apg; 26 blocks and 21 steals.

I'm not saying Franks is as good as Port, because he isn't, but he is a lot closer than I think anyone could have imagined. And he is doing this while basically playing the point guard position. And as a result, he should get strong consideration for NCAC Player of the Year. Franks currently ranks in the top-10 in the league in scoring, field-goal percentage, assists, free-throw percentage and assist-to-turnover ratio. I still give the advantage to Yelvington, but Franks has probably joined Wes Smith and Chris Roberts as the three best returning players for next season (I apologize if I'm forgetting anyone).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2009, 08:32:06 PM
If Wooster manages to win their next 2 games and then if they lose in the NCAC tourney final game, their record would be 21-7.  The last time that Wooster lost in the NCAC tourney final and finished at 21-7 was in the 2001-2002 season.  Wooster did not receive a Pool C bid at 21-7 that year and missed the NCAA tournament.

Acknowledging that the NCAA tourney field has expanded some since 2001-2002, there may be a small chance for a Pool C bid with that same 21-7 record this year.  However, as we all know Pool C bids become very scarce if a number of highly ranked teams are upset in their conference tourneys and then are selected as Pool C bids.  If there are too many upsets around the country, a 21-7 Wooster team will not get invited as a Pool C.  I can remember one season several years ago when a Capital team with only 5 losses failed to receive a Pool C bid due to a large number of upsets.

So, the best approach for Wooster is to play every game now as "One and Done"...as in you lose one game, you are done for the season.

First things first, Wooster better play a much better game on Tuesday than they did on February 11th when the Big Red took them to double overtime.  ::)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2009, 08:58:40 PM
Port and Franks -

I'm still amazed at Franks; both his ability to penetrate and, with his guard's frame, his ability to avoid, or even use, contact around the basket while finishing.  I think he's the best I've seen at Wooster in that regard.  And that's saying a lot, considering James Cooper just left town a year ago.  Don't underestimate Franks' defense, either.  After Bidwell, he'd be my next choice on the Scots to guard the other team's top guy at guard or wing.  I said this a few days ago but will say it again: next season, with Franks, Balch, and the return of Brandon Johnson, the Scots will have the best three-guard combination in the league, and one of the best in DIII.

Marty Bidwell Sr., now 1-0 as a guest coach, will no doubt be bending ears about how he masterminded today's rout of Earlham. :)  Seriously, he's gonna be missed in the stands next year, so let's extend this season as far as possible.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: username........ on February 21, 2009, 09:01:51 PM
I really think that Chris Roberts should be in the top 2 when it comes to NCAC Player Of The Year....Averaging 17.2 points, 5.6 rebs...shot 50% from the field, 38% from 3 and 74% from the line....and is in the top ten in steals, assists and minutes played.....I really do believe that without Roberts...Hiram wouldn't even be in the equation this year. Maybe its just me.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2009, 09:04:40 PM
The final conference-only stats are up at the NCAC website (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/08-09stats/CONFONLY.HTM).

Scoring: Despite missing the last four games with mono, Kenyon's Bryan Yelvington easily wins the scoring title with an average of 19.2 ppg.  Four other players averaged at least 17.0 ppg in conference action: Oberlin's Jordan Beard (17.9), OWU's Kyle Holliday (17.1), and Kenyon's J.T. Knight (17.0).

Rebounding: Jide Eniola of Hiram was the league's top rebounder at 8.1 rpg, and was even more dominant on the offensive glass, averaging 3.9 rpg to win that category by more than a carom and a half over Allegheny's George Raftis.  Kenyon's Dave Knapke finished second overall with 7.7 rpg, followed by his teammate Bryan Yelvington and OWU's Pat Pellerite, each at 7.5.  Knapke and Yelvington were the top defenisve rebounders at 5.6 and 5.5 rpg respectively.

Assists: Ian Franks of Wooster, at 3.81 apg, won this category, leading Hiram's Nick Russo (3.44), OWU's Kyle Miller (3.07), and Kenyon's Dave Jolson (3.07).

Steals:  OWU's Kyle Miller edged out Earlham's Shane Heidt, 2.33 to 2.27, to become the league's top thief.  Wes Smith of Wabash and Kenyon's J.T. Knight tied for third with an average of 2.0 steals/game.

FG%: OWU's Pat Pellerite and Kenyon's Bryan Yelvington finished in a virtual dead heat in this category, with Pellerite hitting 58.779% of his shots to Yelvington's 58.772%.  Pellerite's teammate Brent Pleiman was third at 57.6%.

FT%:  Wittenberg's Kevin Murray missed just two of his 38 free throws to finish with a league-leading FT% of .947.  Wooster's Justin Hallowell (.900) and Oberlin's Joardan Beard (.875) were the runners-up.

3PFG%:  Oberlin's Ryan Magiera was the only shooter in the conference to make more than half of his three-pointers while connecting at a rate of at least one per game.  He hit 19 of his 31 attempts, a rate of .613.  Kyle Holliday (OWU) and Jordan Beard (Oberlin), who attemped 87 and 104 treys, respectively, were next best at .494 and .490.  Beard connected on the most three-pointers, making 51 to finish ahead of Wooster's Justin Hallowell (45) and Holliday (43).

A/TO:  Nick Russo of Hiram, who committed just 20 turnovers in 16 games, had a ratio of 2.75 to win this category by a wide margin over Wooster's Ian Franks (1.56) and Marty Bidwell (1.45).

Blocked shots:  Kenyon's Dave Knapke swatted away 1.19 shots per game to lead the league in this category.  Wabash's Wes Smith (1.06) was the only other defender to record better than a block per game.

Minutes played:  Chris Roberts of Hiram was the league's Ironman, averaging 34.19 minutes per game to finish ahead of Allegheny teammates Craig Devinney (33.62) and George Raftis (32.69).

Congratulations all around!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2009, 09:08:47 PM
Just looked at the regional rankings. Wooster is 5th in the GL, behind Capital, JCU, C-M and Calvin. OWU was sixth but that will fall now, for sure.

It looks like Wooster will be the third or fourth GL team on the "C" board if they lose in the NCAC tourney, perhaps. If they lose to Denison, then all bets are off.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 21, 2009, 09:15:19 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2009, 08:32:06 PM
If
First things first, Wooster better play a much better game on Tuesday than they did on February 11th when the Big Red took them to double overtime.  ::)

I kind of think that game with Denison may have been a case of overlooking an opponent with a road game against your biggest rival looming on the horizon.  With that game so fresh in the minds of Wooster's players, I really doubt Denison comes close to pulling off the upset on Tuesday.  I'm not saying this game is going to be a blow out, but I just don't see Wooster overlooking the Big Red twice in less than a month...

And speaking of playing a better game Tuesday, OWU has not played poorly in one game, but now two games to end the regular season.  I would have thought that Oberlin's near upset bid on Wednesday would have been enough to be a wake up call for the Bishops, but I guess I was wrong as they blew a 10 point halftime lead at home to lose their chance to at least share the regular season conference title with Wooster.

Wooster now joins Wittenberg in winning 5 straight titles since the NCAC's inception!  Witt accomplished the feat from 1990-94.  The difference is, Wooster's 5 straight titles are outright!  Witt had to share titles with Wooster and Allegheny in 1992 and 1993!

Congrats to Marty Bidwell in joining last year's Wooster seniors as having never not won an outright NCAC title over their 4 year careers as  Fighting Scots!!!   8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 21, 2009, 09:26:21 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 21, 2009, 09:08:47 PM
Just looked at the regional rankings. Wooster is 5th in the GL, behind Capital, JCU, C-M and Calvin. OWU was sixth but that will fall now, for sure.

It looks like Wooster will be the third or fourth GL team on the "C" board if they lose in the NCAC tourney, perhaps. If they lose to Denison, then all bets are off.
CMU lost again last night to WashU.  I would guess they would fall below Wooster in the rankings.  And Calvin lost today as well and to lowly Kzoo to boot!  So, Wooster's position in the GL region may not be as bad as previously thought...  8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 22, 2009, 12:19:23 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 21, 2009, 09:26:21 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 21, 2009, 09:08:47 PM
Just looked at the regional rankings. Wooster is 5th in the GL, behind Capital, JCU, C-M and Calvin. OWU was sixth but that will fall now, for sure.

It looks like Wooster will be the third or fourth GL team on the "C" board if they lose in the NCAC tourney, perhaps. If they lose to Denison, then all bets are off.
CMU lost again last night to WashU.  I would guess they would fall below Wooster in the rankings.  And Calvin lost today as well and to lowly Kzoo to boot!  So, Wooster's position in the GL region may not be as bad as previously thought...  8)

Pool C slots are going to depend on when teams lose in their respetive conference tournaments.  From this region this year, I wouldn't bank on an invite with any loss prior to the conference championship game.

Cap and JCU might be ok if they lose in the Semi's........but I wouldn't want to be in that position.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 22, 2009, 01:10:42 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2009, 08:32:06 PM
If Wooster manages to win their next 2 games and then if they lose in the NCAC tourney final game, their record would be 21-7.  The last time that Wooster lost in the NCAC tourney final and finished at 21-7 was in the 2001-2002 season.  Wooster did not receive a Pool C bid at 21-7 that year and missed the NCAA tournament.

Acknowledging that the NCAA tourney field has expanded some since 2001-2002, there may be a small chance for a Pool C bid with that same 21-7 record this year.  However, as we all know Pool C bids become very scarce if a number of highly ranked teams are upset in their conference tourneys and then are selected as Pool C bids.  If there are too many upsets around the country, a 21-7 Wooster team will not get invited as a Pool C.  I can remember one season several years ago when a Capital team with only 5 losses failed to receive a Pool C bid due to a large number of upsets.

That 21-7 record would be irrelevant, WSF, because it's the regional record that counts in the eyes of the selection committee -- or, to be more precise, the regional winning percentage. In other words, throw out the win over Messiah and the losses to UW-Platteville and Hawaii-Hilo when you're discussing Wooster's record. If Wooster loses in the NCAC tourney final, the Scots will be 20-5 (.800) in regional play. And that would be more than good enough for a Pool C berth.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 22, 2009, 01:15:19 AM
Quote from: sac on February 22, 2009, 12:19:23 AM
Pool C slots are going to depend on when teams lose in their respetive conference tournaments.  From this region this year, I wouldn't bank on an invite with any loss prior to the conference championship game.

This has actually been less and less of a concern in the new system. The smoke-filled room/old-boys network system cared a lot, lot more about when you lost in your tournament. In this system, top seed Randolph-Macon lost in the ODAC quarterfinals a few years ago and still made the tournament.

The entire body of work is taken into account, not just your last game and what round it was in.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2009, 10:32:49 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 21, 2009, 08:21:45 PM
I'm not saying [Ian] Franks is as good as Port, because he isn't, but he is a lot closer than I think anyone could have imagined. And he is doing this while basically playing the point guard position. And as a result, he should get strong consideration for NCAC Player of the Year.

Aaron Dorksen agrees with you (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4531761).



Sincere congratulations to Bill Brown and the Wittenberg Tigers on the occasion of extending their streak of non-losing seasons to 40.  The Tigers overcame a lot of adverse circumstances to achieve this goal, and should be proud of what they've accomplished. (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fhappy-smiley-8769.gif&hash=aeb289e67220f3813c231bcf5c375101dc1b9252)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2009, 12:55:55 PM
After careful deliberation, here's my choices for the end-of-season awards.

All-Conference, First Team (listed alphabetically):
Ian Franks, sophomore, Wooster
Kyle Holliday, senior, Ohio Wesleyan
Kevin Murray, senior, Wittenberg
George Raftis, junior, Allegheny
Chris Roberts, sophomore, Hiram
Wes Smith, sophomore, Wabash
Bryan Yelvington, senior, Kenyon
no real surprises here

All-Conference, Second Team (listed alphabetically):
Jordan Beard, senior, Oberlin
Marty Bidwell, senior, Wooster
Babajide Eniola, sophomore, Hiram
Tristian Gregory, senior, Earlham
Justin Hallowell, freshman, Wooster
J.T. Knight, sophomore, Kenyon
Kyle Miller, senior, Ohio Wesleyan
Pat Pellerite, freshman, Ohio Wesleyan
eight players for seven spots; see Newcomer of the Year discussion

All-Conference, Honorable Mention (listed alphabetically):
Nathan Balch, freshman, Wooster
David Knapke, junior, Kenyon
Nick Russo, sophomore, Hiram
Pat Sullivan, senior, Denison
19 spots overall, nine of then freshmen or sophomores

Player of the Year:  Bryan Yelvington, Kenyon, the conference's scoring champion, who was also third in rebounding, ninth in steals, first in FG%, and 8th in free throw percentage.  Ian Franks and Kyle Holliday had tremendous years, but neither was as dominant as Bryan...when he was healthy, that is.  His four missed games could cut both ways; on the one hand, it's hard to be outstanding from the bench, and while Yelvington sat, Franks was powering his team to a conference title; but on the other hand, his absence clearly demonstrated just how valuable he was to his team. 

Newcomer of the Year:  Maybe it's a cop-out on my part, but I just can't decide between Wooster's Justin Hallowell and OWU's Pat Pellerite.  Pellerite was the slightly better rebounder (7.5 rpg, 3rd in NCAC vs. 5.0 rpg, 11th), while Hallowell was the slightly better scorer (12.9 ppg, 15th vs. 10.9 ppg, 21st).  Pellerite led the league in FG% at .588, while Hallowell was 6th in 3PFG% (.469).  Pellerite hit better than 80% of his free throws (10th in NCAC), but Hallowell hit 90% of his (2nd).  Both were starters from day one, and both were crucial elements in their team's success, with Pellerite averaging 23.6 and Hallowell 27.9 minutes per game.  Neither has any significant weakensses: Pellerite is perhaps a little too prone to foul, while Hallowell could maybe use his size to better effect.  In trying to decide which had the better season, I can't find anything to hang my hat on.  This extended to my being unable to decide between them for the last spot on my all-conference second team, which is why there's 8 players rather than the seven required by the conference regulations.  (As an aside, as far as I can tell, Hiram's Babajide Eniola is ineligible for this award, which is restricted to "freshmen and transfers."  Although Eniola saw no action last season, he is a sophomore and evidently not a transfer.  Otherwise, his dominant performance on the offensive glass would make him a strong candidate for this award.)

Coach of the Year:  Steve Fleming, Hiram.  This choice need not be defended.  Special mention, however, should be made of the jobs done by Wooster's Steve Moore and OWU's Mike DeWitt, contending for the conference title after losing such stars as James Cooper, Dustin Rudegeair, Brandon Johnson, and Jesse Jean.  In any other year, perhaps, but not this year.

So these are my choices, FWIW.  I hope posting this will stimulate some positive discussion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 22, 2009, 02:11:31 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 22, 2009, 01:10:42 AM
If Wooster loses in the NCAC tourney final, the Scots will be 20-5 (.800) in regional play. And that would be more than good enough for a Pool C berth.

The problem with Pool C bids is that there are no guarantees.

Pool C slots can fill up very quickly if there are a large number of upsets in conference tourneys of highly ranked teams.  In the scenario where Wooster loses in the NCAC tourney final and they are 20-5 in regional play, they still could miss a Pool C slot if there are 18 teams nationally that have better Pool C records based on the selection criteria.

My advice for Wooster remains the same - they need to win the NCAC tourney and the automatic bid.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on February 22, 2009, 03:19:20 PM
Now that we are nearly on the eve of the NCAC tournament....let's hear some predictions....my first round predictions are as follows...
1.) Wooster over 8.) Denison...the Scots will be focused after nearly losing to the Big Red a week and a half ago.
4.) Wittenberg over 5.) Kenyon...although it's hard to beat teams 3 times in a row, I feel that the Tigers have the Lords number and will advance to the semi-finals. 
3.) Hiram over 6.) Wabash...despite the Little Giants recent hot streak and the Terriers recent struggles...I feel Hiram's scoring and rebounding prowess will offset Wabash's height advantage.
2.) OWU over 7.) Allegheny...the rematch of the final regular season game for both teams won't be close as I feel the Bishops will regain form and put it to the Gators.
-No upsets seedwise, setting up some great semi-final matchups b/w Woo-Witt, and Hiram and OWU on Friday at Timken Gymnasium in Wooster....thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2009, 04:36:30 PM
I'm no Nate Silver (but geez, I wish...I mean, he's taken his geekdom to fame and fortune, while I...well...) but here are my predictions.

Wooster over Denison (98%) - While Denison has played hard all season and has improved greatly, AND they gave the Scots a huge scare at Timken - it will be a tall, tall order to do that again.

Ohio Wesleyan over Allegheny (67%) - Anything can happen once, but I don't think the Gators can do it twice.

Wabash over Hiram (52%) - Hiram is still one of the best stories in D-3 hoops this year, and seems to have laid the foundation for a good future. Wabash has been playing better than Hiram of late, but I for one would not wager any hard earned dollars on this matchup. Too close to call, just like Franken vs. Coleman.

Witt over Kenyon (70%) - If Kenyon were 100% healthy, then I'd pick the Lords. But if Kenyon were 100% healthy they'd be hosting this.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2009, 06:46:05 PM
I'll bite...

Wooster over Denison - Like most of the rest of us here, it's hard to see Denison getting another run at Wooster like they had a couple of weeks ago. 

OWU over Allegheny - OWU isn't coming into this thing playing their best ball, but I think they'll put together enough to get the Gators here. 

Wabash over Hiram - Of course I'm taking the LGs.  But not without good reason.  Hiram is scuffling, Wabash is hot and not just hot but they've been playing well on the road which is key. 

Kenyon over Wittenberg - There's no way Yelvington sits out again and if he's in, Kenyon wins. 

I do think that at least three of these four games will be very close.  It's going to be fun to follow along on Tuesday night. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 22, 2009, 07:09:33 PM
I'll take a shot, too.

Wooster over Denison:  I doubt this game will be close, although Denison's style gave the Scots fits for the 1st half in Granville too.

OWU over Allegheny: Not sure what was up with the Bishops last week, but I think that OWU will have a strong tourney.

Wabash over Hiram: Seems like the pressure of being in the race so long took its toll on the Terriers and after they lost close games to Wooster and Wesleyan they couldn't get the momentum back.  I think this one will be tight, though, and could go either way.

Witt over Kenyon: Might be close, but unless Kenyon's got everyone back and at full strength I don't see them pulling this one off.

In any event, it should be a much more interesting tournament from beginning to end than in past years!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 22, 2009, 09:03:32 PM
Very sad news involving the Wooster basketball team. The 3-year old son of assistant basketball coach Doug Cline was killed in a car accident this morning, when a car driven by Scot junior Dustin Geitgey (and cousin of Doug) slid off the road. Corey was then apparently hit by another car that also slid on ice.

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4532098
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on February 22, 2009, 09:46:56 PM
That is terrible terrible news...what a tragedy...Dustin is a great kid and I feel horrible for him because he is a hardworking, very kind young man.  Coach Cline is also a great coach and even better man, and no words can explain what he must be going through right now.  RIP Corey Cline, you will be missed by everyone in the Wooster community! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on February 23, 2009, 06:07:18 AM
I'm going against the grain, with all lower seeds on tuesday.
Denny
Al
Bash
Ken

I'm thinking they will all be deliberate, grindem out games.

Lord Supporter
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 23, 2009, 07:23:50 AM
I live out of town now but check the DR online every morning.  When I saw the headline for this story, and before I could read the story, I was fearful of what family may be affected.  It's definitely a very sad story.  Prayers are sent to everyone involved.   What a tragedy..
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 23, 2009, 08:16:43 AM
When was the last time that Woo and Witt met on friday night and not saturday for the conference championship?

Wooster over Denison- Wooster is unstoppable at home when they don't miss.
Wittenberg over Kenyon- Witt inspired to play Wooster in the second round
Hiram over Wabash- Hiram's youth over the long bus ride from C'ville.
OWU over Allegheny- Bishops win in the rematch
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2009, 10:29:43 AM
Here's an updated story (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4532179) on the tragedy, which provides a few more details.  Such a sad, sad day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 23, 2009, 11:04:08 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 22, 2009, 02:11:31 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 22, 2009, 01:10:42 AM
If Wooster loses in the NCAC tourney final, the Scots will be 20-5 (.800) in regional play. And that would be more than good enough for a Pool C berth.

The problem with Pool C bids is that there are no guarantees.

Pool C slots can fill up very quickly if there are a large number of upsets in conference tourneys of highly ranked teams.  In the scenario where Wooster loses in the NCAC tourney final and they are 20-5 in regional play, they still could miss a Pool C slot if there are 18 teams nationally that have better Pool C records based on the selection criteria.

My advice for Wooster remains the same - they need to win the NCAC tourney and the automatic bid.

I'm going by Patrick Abegg's numbers and by past history regarding the regional winning percentages of Pool C teams. I don't ever remember a team from an AQ conference that had an .800 regional winning percentage being denied a Pool C bid since the Pool C field was expanded (i.e., post Capital '03).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 23, 2009, 11:49:03 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 23, 2009, 10:29:43 AM
Here's an updated story (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4532179) on the tragedy, which provides a few more details.  Such a sad, sad day.
My goodness.  A sad, sad day indeed!  As a father of 3 young ones myself, I cannot even begin to fathom what the Clines are going through right now.  After hearing about this tragedy last night, I just wanted to hug my girls and not let them go!

My deepest sympathies, thoughts and, most of all, prayers go out to the Cline family in this moment of grief.  Also keep Dustin and his family in your thoughts and prayers as well as the driver of the vehicle that hit Corey.  I can imagine this whole tragic and freakish accident is going to be difficult on all the parties involved...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2009, 12:30:37 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 21, 2009, 05:33:56 PM
Cribbing from wooscotsfan's post to add tip times:
NCAC Tournament Games on Tuesday

#1 Wooster hosts #8 Denison 7:30pm
#2 Ohio Wesleyan hosts #7 Allegheny 8:00pm (following women's quarterfinal, Witt vs. OWU, at 6:00pm)
#3 Hiram hosts #6 Wabash 7:00pm
#4 Wittenberg hosts #5 Kenyon 7:30pm 
Please note the adjusted tip time for the Wabash/Hiram game.  Still the LGs won't be back on their own campus until sometime after 3am at the earliest.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2009, 12:40:46 PM
Congratulations to Wooster's lone senior Marty Bidwell, the final NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html) for the 2008-09 season.  Marty led his team to their fifth consecutive outright NCAC championship by scoring 26 points on 61% shooting in wins over Allegheny and Earlham.  He also chipped in eight rebounds, seven assists, and five steals in those two games.  Congratulations, Marty!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 23, 2009, 03:18:17 PM
Very, very sad story.  Thoughts and prayers to the Cline family as they deal with this loss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2009, 03:37:57 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 23, 2009, 12:30:37 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 21, 2009, 05:33:56 PM
Cribbing from wooscotsfan's post to add tip times:
NCAC Tournament Games on Tuesday

#1 Wooster hosts #8 Denison 7:30pm
#2 Ohio Wesleyan hosts #7 Allegheny 8:00pm (following women's quarterfinal, Witt vs. OWU, at 6:00pm)
#3 Hiram hosts #6 Wabash 7:00pm
#4 Wittenberg hosts #5 Kenyon 7:30pm 
Please note the adjusted tip time for the Wabash/Hiram game.  Still the LGs won't be back on their own campus until sometime after 3am at the earliest.

Two weeks ago today, Wabash was 3-9 in the league and in very real danger of missing the tournament all together.  A long bus ride is definitely preferable to not having a chance to play at all!    :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 23, 2009, 04:04:45 PM
There is no word yet on whether the Wooster-Denison game will go on as scheduled.  Given that both a coach and a player on the Scots team are grieving in this tragic situation, I won't be shocked if the game is pushed back to Wednesday or Thursday evening.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 23, 2009, 04:17:20 PM
For those that may know the Cline family personally or otherwise wish to express their sympathies, the funeral will be at 11:00 on Thursday morning, in the McGaw Chapel, on the College of Wooster campus.  The visitation, also in McGaw, will be on Wednesday evening from 6:00 to 9:00.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 23, 2009, 05:52:36 PM
EC-technically speaking any team is tough to beat at home when they're making their shots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 23, 2009, 08:54:45 PM
The Wooster-Denison game will be played tomorrow night, as scheduled, despite the Scots' heavy hearts.  Corey Cline was a regular at practices and games, from what I understand, so this week will be very tough on the entire Wooster team.  My thoughts and prayers are with Coach Cline, Dustin Geitgey, and all of the families grieving.

http://athletics.wooster.edu/ (http://athletics.wooster.edu/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on February 23, 2009, 09:44:58 PM
Picks so far
Wooster (5) over Denison (1)
Witt (4) over Kenyon (2)
Wabash (4) over Hiram (2)
OWU (5) over Allegheny (1)
...that would set up some interesting semi-final matchups!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Hugenerd on February 23, 2009, 10:04:54 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 23, 2009, 08:54:45 PM
The Wooster-Denison game will be played tomorrow night, as scheduled, despite the Scots' heavy hearts.  Corey Cline was a regular at practices and games, from what I understand, so this week will be very tough on the entire Wooster team.  My thoughts and prayers are with Coach Cline, Dustin Geitgey, and all of the families grieving.

http://athletics.wooster.edu/ (http://athletics.wooster.edu/)

I read some of the news articles on that story, and it sounds like a tragic and very unfortunate death.  My thoughts and prayers go out to the Cline family.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2009, 10:55:27 PM
Thank you, hugenerd.  Coming from outside the Wooster "family," your comments are greatly appreciated.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Hugenerd on February 23, 2009, 11:07:48 PM
I am originally an Ohioan as well (one of my high school temmates even played a season for Wooster), and although I may not be part of the Wooster family, you really cant help but feel for what the Cline family must be going through.  I have a young child and I cant imagine the emotions they must be feeling right now.  I hope that it brings the Cline family, and the Wooster family, closer so that they can get through this very difficult time in their lives.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2009, 11:12:11 PM
A real tragedy.  As a father of a 3 year old myself, it is hard to imagine losing such a young child in a terrible accident.  Sympathies and prayers go to Doug Cline and his family.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 24, 2009, 06:03:57 AM
I went to the Wooster basketball website as I so ritually do everyday and saw the story about the accident.  Extremely sad and unfortunate.  My deepest sympathies to the Cline family and the whole Wooster community at large for this unfathomable loss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BUBeaverFan on February 24, 2009, 06:49:27 AM
My family and I send our thoughts and prayers to the Cline family and the entire Wooster Fighting Scots community.  I had the opportunity to meet Coach Cline through mutual friends at the OHSAA State Basketball Tournament over the years.  He is great man and a loving father and husband.  May they all feel God's healing presence in their lives as they cope with this tragedy.  God Bless!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 24, 2009, 07:25:29 AM
As a player that played against the Scots.  Thoughts and prayers go to Coach Cline and the Wooster family.  Right its not about what team your with but about a member of the conference losing a loved one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2009, 12:10:26 PM
Quote from: ECHOOPER on February 24, 2009, 07:25:29 AM
As a player that played against the Scots.  Thoughts and prayers go to Coach Cline and the Wooster family.  Right its not about what team your with but about a member of the conference losing a loved one.
Amen!  +1 for that!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on February 24, 2009, 02:24:03 PM
Good luck tonight Scots!...i'm sure they'll be playing the rest of this season for Corey!                                                                                                                     
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on February 24, 2009, 05:53:57 PM
"play it for corey" is the message given by coach Cline to the team after Monday's practice, I would say the odds of Wooster winning this match up and the entire conference tournament just went up a little bit as they will all be playing their hearts out for the little guy they all loved like a brother!


keeping the cline family in our prayers
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2009, 07:39:00 PM
Halftime in Hiram:

Wabash 38
Hiram 34

It's been a back and forth half with both teams trading the lead most of the half.  Chase Haltom hit a long three pointer ahead of the buzzer.  I believe he's leading Wabash with 12 points.  Should be a good second half....go Little Giants!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2009, 07:53:46 PM
Congratulations to Justin Hallowell who has made his 79th three pointer and thus set a new Wooster record for most three pointers in a season! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2009, 08:00:56 PM
Here comes the running second half post...

16:40 - Wabash leads 42-34 and Hiram is struggling to get into any kind of offense.  We're in a timeout for the Terriers here.  Brent Harris tells me that Hiram is up to 13 TOs for the game which is a lot.  And before I post, Wes Smith gets a layup and ups the lead to 10. 

12:47 - Hiram has gone to a pretty aggressive full court press here which is bothering the Little Giants a bit. It's 48-41 in favor of the LGs here as Hiram has a little bit of momentum back on their side.   

10:25 - Mac Petty gets a timeout as Hiram's press has become a serious nuisance.  As bad as the last couple of minutes have gone, Wabash maintains a seven point advantage, 53-46. 

6:25 - Wabash has settled down a bit and stretched the lead back out to 60-50.  Hiram's full court press is working, but if Hiram isn't making a shot and can't set up the press or Wabash breaks it, the LGs are having their way with the Terriers in the half court.  Wes Smith is having a great second half here and is Wabash's leading scorer with 17 points.  The Terriers are just 5-21 on FGs in the second half. 

Worth noting that Wes Smith is owning Chris Roberts.  Smith has 21 points in the game while Roberts, who just hit a three pointer, has just 9 (Wes is guarding Roberts pretty much exclusively this evening).  And I just missed the score as Hiram is in a timeout, but the lead sits around 9 or 10 points here with 4:30 to go. 

4:01 - Chase Haltom hits two free throws, and Wabash has a 12 point advantage (sorry I don't have the exact score).  Haltom has 17 in the game.  Pfouts I believe answers with a three pointer so we're back to a nine point game. 

70-61 is the score with Pfouts at the line.  He gets one of the two and the score is at 70-62. 

Oh my...after a Wabash turnover, Hiram gets a triple and the lead is down to 5. 

Andrew Gilman just quiets the Terrier fans with a humongous three pointer.  That's a clutch bucket!  I'm hoping to get a time remain...there it is.  2:20 to go.  Eight point Wabash lead.

Hiram turns the ball over...Wabash back with the ball.  Shot clock violation.  Ugh. 

1:31 - Wabash maintains their eight point advantage.  Chase Haltom is going to the line and he misses.  A rare miss from Haltom.  Rebound to Hiram.  On the other end, Pfouts gets physical with Wabash's Ben Burkett who picks up the foul (ending his evening).  Pfouts gets the basket to fall and the freebie.  73-68 is the score in favor of Wabash. 

Haltom drains a trey!!!  Fanfreakintastic!!!  35.7 seconds to go and Wabash creeps back out to an eight point lead.  Hiram misses their attempt to answer and Haltom will go to the line for Wabash.  Haltom gets them both and Wabash is back up to a ten point lead at 78-68. 

We are running this one out here.  Wabash is going to advance to the semifinals at Wooster this weekend! 

Well, we're trying to run this one out.  Hiram won't let it go just yet.  Nope...Fleming is clearing the bench.  This should be the last foul shot of the game here as Haltom hits another pair of free throws. 

Ball game.  83-75 win for the LGs.  They'll be back in action Friday at 6:00 p.m. at Timken.   Excellent job tonight Little Giants!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2009, 08:04:44 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 49  Denison 25

Wooster is being led by Nathan Balch with 9 points (3 three pointers), Justin Hallowell with 8 points (2 three pointers), Marty Bidwell with 7 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 6 points (5 boards) and Greg Ross also with 6 points.

Denison's top scorers are Larry Farmer with 6 points, Casey Stockton with 6 points and Jeremy Stuhlfauth also with 6 points.

Wooster made 8 three pointers in the half compared to only 2 for the Big Red.

UPDATE:  11:00 left  Wooster 71  Denison 43  Looks like the NCAC tourney semi-finals will be at Wooster.
Now 4:00 left  Wooster 94  Denison 58
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2009, 08:10:30 PM
At the Half:   Wittenberg 35  Kenyon 32

Kevin Murray (8 points) and Mark Snyder (6 points) are leading the Tigers.

Yelvington (2 pts, 2 boards) is playing and J.T. Knight is leading the Lords with 13 points.

UPDATE:  7:33 left  Kenyon 51  Wittenberg 49
Now 6:26 left  Witt 54  Kenyon 51  Tigers on a 5-0 run
Now 2:49 left  Witt 54  Kenyon 53  Scoring drought for both teams
Now 2:13 left  Witt 55  Kenyon 55  Kenyon ball and timeout
0:40 left  Kenyon 61  Wittenberg 55  Jim Arce hit back to back three pointers for the Lords
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 24, 2009, 08:45:43 PM
Any update on the OWU/GHENY game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2009, 08:54:56 PM
Negative EC.  No audio, no video, no live stats.  We'll all be in the dark until a score gets posted somewhere. 

OWU streams some of their games.  Why wouldn't they stream the tournament game?   ???

Looks like we're going down to the wire in Springfield.  Kenyon leads 61-57 with 33 seconds to go.

Ballgame.  Kenyon goes back to Springfield and picks off Wittenberg 65-60. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 24, 2009, 08:56:44 PM
First, the Wooster family has my deepest condolences in what is undoubtedly  a tough time. I have no children myself but you'd have to be a monster not to be saddened by the tragic death of a child. Thoughts to the Cline family and Dustin Geitgey in this terrible time.

Second, I'm glad Wabash's offense showed up. Let's hope they keep it going. Wabash Always Fights!

LG
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 24, 2009, 08:57:31 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2009, 08:54:56 PM
Negative EC.  No audio, no video, no live stats.  We'll all be in the dark until a score gets posted somewhere. 

OWU streams some of their games.  Why wouldn't they stream the tournament game?   ???


With the opportunity of hosting it would seem smart to stream the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2009, 09:01:00 PM
Final:  Wooster 101  Denison 68

Wooster was led tonight by Nathan Balch with 20 points (5 three pointers), Justin Hallowell with 14 points (4 three pointers), Ian Franks with 11 points, Marty Bidwell with 11 points and Mike Evans also with 11 points.  Justin Hallowell now has made 82 three pointers this season.

Denison's top scorers were Larry Farmer with 12 points and Chris Luther also with 12 points.  Congrats to Denison seniors Pat Sullivan and Jeremy Stuhlfauth on finishing their basketball careers with the Big Red.

Only negative for Wooster was Balch spraining his ankle and leaving the game in the 2nd half to ice it.

On the post game show, Coach Moore talked about the team wanting to win this game for Corey Cline.

Wooster will host the NCAC tourney semi-finals on Friday. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2009, 09:02:00 PM
Final:  Kenyon 65  Wittenberg 60

Lords register the big road win and will play Wooster on Friday night.

Kenyon was led by J.T. Knight with 18 points, Bryan Yelvington with 15 points (13 in the 2nd half) and Allen Bediako with 10 points.  Jim Arce hit the back to back three pointers in the last 2 minutes of the game to clinch it for the Lords.

Kevin Murray with 11 points and Mark Snyder with 10 points led the Tigers.  Witt finishes the season at 13-13.  Congrats to senior Kevin Murray on a fine career at Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 24, 2009, 09:04:49 PM
Who would have thought that Witt would have gotten beat at home in the tournament?  But is like Coach Moore said after the game saturday everyone has 0-0 record and anything can happen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2009, 09:09:43 PM
Quote from: ECHOOPER on February 24, 2009, 09:04:49 PM
Who would have thought that Witt would have gotten beat at home in the tournament? 

I'm sure somebody did...

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 22, 2009, 06:46:05 PM
I'll bite...
Kenyon over Wittenberg - There's no way Yelvington sits out again and if he's in, Kenyon wins. 

;D

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2009, 09:28:43 PM
With the win tonight, Wooster is now 20-6.  Congrats to Coaches Steve Moore, Doug Cline and the rest of the staff.

Wooster has now registered 20 or more wins in 13 straight seasons - the longest streak in Division III. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2009, 09:36:34 PM
At the Half:   Ohio Wesleyan 34  Allegheny 24

Score is from the D3Hoops scoreboard.  No minute by minute updates available.  Thanks to D3Hoops which surpasses the OWU website!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on February 24, 2009, 09:43:33 PM
looks like it is probably going to be.....
5.) Kenyon @ 1.) Wooster..............in the second semi-final game.
and
6.) Wabash @ 2.) Ohio Wesleyan.........in the first semi-final game. 

assuming OWU finishes off Allegheny...who should match up in the finals.....

I think Wooster will finish off Kenyon...they won by 10 at Kenyon earlier this year....I'd say they would be around a 8-10 point favorite even despite Kenyon's impressive victory......WOO 80-70

I also think OWU will win although it will be a very close game....I'd say OWU by b/w 6-8 points although Wabash's recent streak could make it closer....thoughts and other predictions??? OWU 70-64
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 24, 2009, 10:01:20 PM
I wouldn't be so quick to pick Wooster over Kenyon. With Yelvington back, the Lords have probably the best player in the league, and he plays a position where Wooster doesn't have a lot of depth. Plus, if Balch is out or slowed (I got to believe one of the two the way he looked at the end of the game), this game becomes a pure toss-up in my opinion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2009, 10:16:36 PM
Final:  Allegheny 78  Ohio Wesleyan 75 OT :o    ....per the OWU website

Gators take a 2nd bite out of the Bishops and will play Wabash on Friday.

George Raftis had a double double (21 points, 10 boards), Henry Heeter had 15 points (5 three pointers) and Doug Price chipped in 10 points to lead Allegheny.

For OWU, top scorers were Tim Brady with 19 points, Mitch Noggle with 17 points and Kyle Miller with 14 points.

Gators outscored the Bishops 47-37 in the 2nd half to force the Overtime, and then 7 to 4 in the OT.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 24, 2009, 10:18:44 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2009, 10:16:36 PM
Final:  Allegheny 78  Ohio Wesleyan 75 OT :o    ....per the OWU website

Gators take a 2nd bite out the Bishops and will play Wabash on Friday.

wow
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2009, 10:18:59 PM
Three of the four lower seeds win tonight.  This may be unprecedented in NCAC tournament history.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 24, 2009, 11:31:55 PM
A few observations from tonight's Wooster-Denison game:

1. Coach Cline was at the game. He received a standing ovation when he walked out and acknowledged the Scot faithful. He sat next to Coach Moore the entire game and showed emotion but really didn't "coach".  As a father myself I still cannot fathom the thought of losing a child and my heart has ached for the Cline family since I learned of their loss.

2. The Scots were definitely focused. They looked sharp early. While they do not have the athleticism of some of the most recent Scot teams, they handle the ball better and communicate to each other well.

3. WOW! - OWU, Witt, and Hiram all lose at home today. Why do I not feel any better?  Anyone I talked to (and I agree) believes the Scots must get to Saturday's game to even be in consideration of a Pool C bid.

4. Regardless of how the week plays out - Congratulations to the coaching staff for molding a young, inexperienced set of players into a team so quickly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on February 24, 2009, 11:45:30 PM
WOW! crazy night in the NCAC tourney....I can't believe that Allegheny came back to shock the Bishops....that sets up Wooster as the only top 4 seed left in the tournament and the obvious favorite......Wooster beat Kenyon earlier in the year and I feel despite Yelvington and Knight returning...the Scots still have to be favored to beat the Lords...I still say the Scots will be victorious by 8-10 although it could be closer and advance to the championship game...The team is really coming together with the tragedy involving Coach Cline and his son....don't underestimate what this has done to this team...they played as hard as i've seen them play all year tonight and with the huge crowds expected this weekend...the home court advantage could play quite a role....and as far as Wabash defeating Hiram, it wasn't completely unexpected but kind of disappointing the way the Terriers finished off the season....it'll be a good semi-final matchup b/w the LG's and the Gators although it is setting up for a Wooster-Wabash championship game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2009, 12:37:39 AM
I guess you have to say that OWU and Allegheny are pretty evenly-matched teams.  OWU won by 4 in Meadville, 'Gheny by 2 in Delaware, and then again tonight by 3 in OT.  With 11.4 seconds left in regulation, Charlie Jaicks managed to get Pat Pellerite to foul out, and then hit one of two free throws to tie the game.  Kyle Miller brought the ball up for OWU, worked into a good look at a three pointer from the left wing, but airballed it.  In the OT, the difference was the absence of Pellerite; George Raftis was too quick for Brent Pleiman to handle, scoring twice and grabbing a couple of key rebounds.  OWU, which has some pretty good outside shooters in Holliday and Noggle (Miller also fouled out), seemed more intent on driving the lane in the OT, but on their last two possessions Holliday drove into traffic, put up unlikely scoop shots, failed to get the whistle he surely expected, and Raftis came down with the ball both times.  It was a great game, pretty much start to finish.  Allegheny played excellently, keeping all of their players moving on offense and hitting some big open threes earned by this movement.  With both the Gators and the LGs playing well as of late, Friday's first game could be a classic. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 25, 2009, 05:52:21 AM
The OWU loss caught me off guard.  I totally did not see that one coming.  Wow!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 25, 2009, 07:21:49 AM
Quote from: lebron23 on February 24, 2009, 11:45:30 PM
it'll be a good semi-final matchup b/w the LG's and the Gators although it is setting up for a Wooster-Wabash championship game!


Wouldn't be so quick to give Bash the game over Gheny.  Anything can happen as it did tonight.  Plus the Ohio refs may not want an Indiana team in the championship game.

It will be tough for Wooster to lose at home when you look at the remaining teams.  Riding the emotions and the way the can shot at Timken.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on February 25, 2009, 07:36:22 AM
As much as I like the odds of the scots winning the tournament now with the 2-4 teams out, how will this effect their strength of schedule and seeding in the NCAA tournament assuming they win ? how will it effect thier pool C odds if they lose ?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on February 25, 2009, 07:52:11 AM
Congratulations to all teams that advanced last night.

It is still a wide open tournament.

Any one of these teams can Win It! There is "NO CLEAR FAVORITE" in my humble opinion. 

Lord Supporter
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on February 25, 2009, 09:27:14 AM
I'm not saying by any means that Wooster WILL win the tournament...but having home court advantage and only the 5, 6, and 7 teams remaining....you have to call Wooster the clear favorite...if you were to go to vegas and this tournament was hypothetically up for bet....what do u think the odds would be?...although any of the 3 other remaining teams could easily upset the scots....wooster is the clear favorite being the 1 seed with home court advantage....trust me though, the team will not practice and prepare as if they are, however....this is just my opinion and i'm 1-3 picking so far after one round so you can tell how well i do at betting against the underdogs! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2009, 10:15:32 AM
Quote from: Ryder16 on February 25, 2009, 07:36:22 AM
As much as I like the odds of the scots winning the tournament now with the 2-4 teams out, how will this effect their strength of schedule and seeding in the NCAA tournament assuming they win ? how will it effect thier pool C odds if they lose ?
Kenyon's regional winning percentage (.619) is better than Wittenberg's (.526), so Wooster's OWP is actually better than it would have been. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2009, 10:16:25 AM
As I was telling LG last night, I really don't think there is a best team in our league this year.  Wooster has been the most consistent since January, but nobody in the league is so good that they can win on a night when their opponent is on.  We've had seasons in the past where even if one team was on, they probably weren't going to beat Wooster or Wittenberg.  I can remember a game 2 years ago where Wabash hosted Wooster.  The LGs could not have played a better game, Wooster probably couldn't have played much worse and Scots still won by five points.  Sometimes you're just flat out better.  But that isn't the case this year...any of these teams can beat anybody else.  It'll come down to which team can stay "on" over the weekend.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ECHOOPER on February 25, 2009, 10:27:00 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 25, 2009, 10:16:25 AM
 It'll come down to which team can stay "on" over the weekend.  

It will also come down to fatigue.  All the games friday night will be tough and hard fought.  So the team that wins the tournament will have to fight through everything to win.  It may not be the best team that wins but it the team that has the drive to fight through the fatigue and beat a team that may be on. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2009, 10:45:34 AM
Quote from: ECHOOPER on February 25, 2009, 10:27:00 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 25, 2009, 10:16:25 AM
 It'll come down to which team can stay "on" over the weekend.  

It will also come down to fatigue.  All the games friday night will be tough and hard fought.  So the team that wins the tournament will have to fight through everything to win.  It may not be the best team that wins but it the team that has the drive to fight through the fatigue and beat a team that may be on. 

This is a good point.  I know that last season Wabash ended the regular season with games @Witt and @Denison then traveled to Allegheny for the quarters and then back to Wooster for the semifinals and championshp games.  I think it added up to something like 5 games in 10 days all on the road.  By the time Wabash got to the finals against OWU there was nothing left.  Now this year, Wabash ended with the game @ Denison and then turned around quickly for the game at Hiram.  One less road trip involved and the long one wasn't quite as long.  Hopefully that means there will be a little more left for Wabash this time around and they can close the deal. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2009, 11:19:24 AM
Quote from: WooMix on February 25, 2009, 05:52:21 AM
The OWU loss caught me off guard.  I totally did not see that one coming.  Wow!
What in the world happened to OWU over the last week and a half of the season???  They had won 10 straight games heading into the last week of the season including 2 easy wins over Witt and an 18 point win over Wooster in that streak.  And they certainly looked like they were the team to beat heading into the postseason at least from my perspective. 

And then comes Oberlin's near upset bid which was definitely some foreshadowing of things to come.  Or should I say a thing to come.  And that thing was Allegheny!  First last Saturday when the Bishops enjoyed a comfortable 10 point lead at home at the half.  But Allegheny had other ideas outscoring OWU by 12 in the 2nd half to pull off the upset and in the process killed OWU's bid at sharing the regular season NCAC title with Wooster!

And then came last night.  Nearly identical circumstances with OWU up 8 this time at home at the half.  Surely lightning can't strike twice can it?  I guess it does in Delaware as OWU blew a comfortable lead to the Gators for the 2nd game in a row!  And just like that, what I had considered the most dangerous team heading down the stretch is now cleaning out their lockers!  Hard to believe things went so bad so fast for the Bishops to end the season...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2009, 11:56:19 AM
First Hiram and then OWU hit the skids. Kenyon's skids were injury related, at least. What an unexpected final four in the NCAC! No OWU, no Wittenberg.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2009, 12:06:01 PM
Quote from: lebron23 on February 24, 2009, 11:45:30 PM
and as far as Wabash defeating Hiram, it wasn't completely unexpected but kind of disappointing the way the Terriers finished off the season....
I agree with the aspect of Wabash beating Hiram not being completely unexpected.  If OWU hit a wall the last week of the season, Hiram hit that wall about a month ago when they lost to Wooster.  It really looks like that loss really took the wind out of Hiram's sails!  Had they won that game, who knows how differently things would have been.  But that loss started Hiram on a tailspin losing 4 of their last 6 games to finish out the season.

I really think this had a lot to do with the youth of this team.  They were not only young, they weren't accustomed to having to deal with the pressures of contending for the conference championship.  I think that finally started to weigh on them down the stretch. 

But they are young, and they should be able to build off of this cinderella season...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 25, 2009, 12:11:48 PM
Quote from: ECHOOPER on February 25, 2009, 07:21:49 AM
Quote from: lebron23 on February 24, 2009, 11:45:30 PM
it'll be a good semi-final matchup b/w the LG's and the Gators although it is setting up for a Wooster-Wabash championship game!


Wouldn't be so quick to give Bash the game over Gheny.  Anything can happen as it did tonight.  Plus the Ohio refs may not want an Indiana team in the championship game.


...because one from Pennsylvania is better?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2009, 12:29:48 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 25, 2009, 11:19:24 AMWhat in the world happened to OWU over the last week and a half of the season??? 
Without going into any unnecessary detail, a quick check at the Oberlin  (http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/owum0218.htm)and first Allegheny  (http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/owum0221.htm)boxscores might shed some light on one of OWU's key problems down the stretch.  As for last night (http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/owum0224.htm), Allegheny played very, very well in the second half, including making seven treys (54%), while shutting down Kyle Holliday (1 for 10) and keeping Pat Pellerite in foul trouble.  Tim Brady had an excellent game, but so did George Raftis and Henry Heeter, and that was just enough.  I think last night's story was more about how Allegheny won than how OWU lost.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2009, 02:10:24 PM
I don't really want to make any predictions about this weekend, but I will say that I felt Wooster put together one of its best overall games last night- in nearly all phases of the game.  I felt it was truly an inspired performance at Timken, especially in the first half.  Quality rebounding, passing, shooting that involved the entire team.  At one point early in the game, I believe that 7 of the 8 players who had entered the game had scored.   Similar all-around efforts this weekend would make the Scots a hard team to beat. 

The effort of this young Wooster squad seems to be peaking at the right time.  Clearly the tragedy with Coach Cline's son put extra emotion into last night's game, but I think this team's true late season wake-up call was the double overtime win against Denison a few weeks ago.  Since then, Wooster accomplished a nearly wire-to-wire win at Wittenberg (a challenge regardless of season and records), then utterly shut down Allegheny and ran away with the games against Earlham and Denison.  Last night in the first half was the first time in watching the Scots this year where I sensed a confidence level that said "we know we're better than <insert opponent here>" and they played like it.  It was a very Scots circa 06-07 experience to watch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2009, 12:05:16 AM
It may be small consolation after his team's early end to the 2008-09 season, but many congratulations to Ohio Wesleyan's Kyle Holliday for being named to the ESPNtM/CoSIDA Academic All-America second team (http://www.cosida.com/documents/2009/2/25/2008-09MBBAAATeams.pdf).  This award recognizes Kyle's outstanding abilities both on the court and in the classroom, and although today he'd probably trade it for an extra shot at the NCAC tournament crown, his pursuit of both academic and athletic excellence will serve him better in his life than any championship banner.  So be proud, Kyle, and congratulations!  (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fhappy-smiley-8769.gif&hash=aeb289e67220f3813c231bcf5c375101dc1b9252)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 26, 2009, 12:10:26 AM
This may be the result of my overly worrisome nature, but I think Wooster fans would be remiss to underestimate the Lords, and maybe just as importantly, the potential loss of Nate Balch would be. I don't know what his status is going to be, but he is not going to be 100%, and may not play. Here is what Balch has done over the last 11 games:

15 ppg (all in double figures); 52.4 fg % (55-of-105); 57.9 3pt fg% (33-of-57) and two assists per game.

These are first-team all-conference type numbers he has been putting up down the stretch. Add in his solid ball handling skills, defense and ability to create his own offense when needed, and you could argue he is Wooster's second-best player right now.

Throw in that Kenyon has the leagues best player (Yelvington) and two very good seniors (Yelvington & Knapke) that will not want to see their careers end, and Friday's game is very much in doubt in my opinion.

Injuries have been a factor in two earlier Wooster losses. Hallowell did not play in the loss to Carnegie Mellon, and Wickliffe didn't play in the loss to OWU, and Franks was hobbled somewhat by an ankle injury.

Now it is off to bed feeling much better ...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on February 26, 2009, 12:20:53 AM
I agree seinfeld...if balch does not play it could create quite a problem for the scots because as you said he has been quite a key component of not only running the offensive show but also with tough defense on opposing guards....he is a very intense competitor and i'm sure he'll do his best to suit it up although it doesn't look good right now from the looks of it...but it could be more precautionary and simply to keep the weight off of the injured ankle....i guess he'll just be a gametime decision  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on February 26, 2009, 05:37:16 AM
Last night in the first half was the first time in watching the Lords this year where I sensed a confidence level that said "we know we're better than <insert opponent here>" and they played like it. 

Brian: I liked it, it's applicable, so I used it.

Quote from: seinfeld on February 26, 2009, 12:10:26 AM
Throw in that Kenyon has the leagues best player (Yelvington) and two very good seniors (Yelvington & Knapke) that will not want to see their careers end, and Friday's game is very much in doubt in my opinion.

Minor correction: Four Seniors: Yelvington, Jolson, Arce, Bediako; Knapke and Clair are Juniors

Brian's time away from the court did offer valuable playing time and the opportunity for the other Post players to hone thier game. They now can play a Four Man rotation in the Paint. Further, 3 additional guards sharpened thier skills thru the final games. Every man of Kenyon's Thirteen is waiting for Coach Croce to say "GO"

Can't wait for the weekend!


edited by DC to add quote formatting for clarity's sake
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on February 26, 2009, 05:45:25 AM
Also of Note, Word on the Grapevine is,  Kenyon plans to send multiple buses for Students to attend the Game.

if they do, I think it is a brillant idea on someone's part; probably thier AD. No reason all teams, and all students shouldn't

be there to witness and support thier squad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on February 26, 2009, 09:16:58 AM
My apologies gentleman.

Y not I  Bryan   I not E Coach

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: acgator98 on February 26, 2009, 10:49:53 AM
Allegheny alum here and new to the board.  Great job by the boys at OWU and good luck this weekend.  They're playing well at the right time of year, epecially this season where the league is probably its most balanced.  Does anyone know who was the lowest seed to win the NCAC AQ and when?

I'd also like to echo the sentiments of so many others prior, as my heart goes out to the Cline family during this tragic time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 26, 2009, 01:16:51 PM
Three times, the #3 seed has won the NCAC tournament (including Allegheny, eleven years ago).  No team seeded lower than #3 has ever gone on to claim the AQ berth.  As a Scot fan, I'm hoping that trend continues for another year!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2009, 02:36:05 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 26, 2009, 01:16:51 PM
Three times, the #3 seed has won the NCAC tournament (including Allegheny, eleven years ago).  No team seeded lower than #3 has ever gone on to claim the AQ berth.  As a Scot fan, I'm hoping that trend continues for another year!
I hear ya!  But if ever there was a year for a team lower than a 3 seed to win the automatic bid, this would be the year seeing as how 3 of the 4 teams remaining are all lower than a 3 seed!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 26, 2009, 06:04:30 PM
Wooster coach Steve Moore is on Hoopsville tonight. Show runs from 6-8 ET and he's in the first hour, so tune in soon!

http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/tunein.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 27, 2009, 09:29:20 AM
No Balch tonight:

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4535496
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 27, 2009, 09:35:11 AM
For anyone listening to the podcast, Steve Moore's interview is from roughly 47:30 to 58:00 at http://d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2009/02/26/hoopsville-podcast-february-26th/ (http://d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2009/02/26/hoopsville-podcast-february-26th/).

Coach Moore did say that the Scots will likely be without Nathan Balch this weekend, because of the ankle injury he suffered on Tuesday night.

Tickets go on sale at 4:30 this afternoon at Timken for tonight's games ($8 adults, $5 faculty/staff, $3 students/kids).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MoneyBallSTL on February 27, 2009, 10:58:25 AM
Greetings all from the Gateway City! I've been a stranger on here lately but I had a question...I see that the Scots were not ranked in the last D-3 hoops Top 25 poll. Is there a chance that should they slip up tonight or tomorrow that they not make it in the tourney as an at-large? I sure hope not but I'm not as familiar with the selection process as I used to be. Based on record and being regular season conference champs I would think they'd get in regardless. Good luck Scots tonight! Keep playing for Corey! My thoughts and prayers continue to be with the Cline family. I wish I could've made the trip in to be there all this week.

--Moneyball
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 27, 2009, 11:28:23 AM
The national top 25 and the NCAA regional rankings don't necessarily mesh very well.  However, the Scots will be squarely on the bubble if they fail to win the NCAC tournament, especially if they lose tonight to Kenyon.

See the Pool C forum for more details.
http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4232.2205 (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4232.2205)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2009, 12:54:04 PM
I feel horrible about the accidental death of Corey Cline.  By sheer chance, I was a patient in the emergency room when he was brought in.  At the time, though, I knew nothing.  I was only informed that there had been a traffic accident and not to be alarmed by the number of police in the hallways as I was being wheeled into another room to get a catscan.  My questions to the staff went for nought as they weren't allowed to reveal anything else, although they did say that it was terrible.  While being rolled past the crowd, though, I recognized two or three persons, including Mike Breckenridge, with affiliations to the college.  I had a sense of doom, but never suspected the severity of what had actually happened. 

On Sunday night, after being transported to the VA hospital in Cleveland to have an apendectomy, I was visited by a couple of friends.  They then made a couple of calls and soon found out the terribly sad story.

I don't know Doug Cline or his family but have watched his boys cavort on the floor after games for a couple of years.  Just recently I remember laughing as one of the cheerleaders chased and poked at Corey with her pompom.  What a sad, sad thing to happen.  Not even four years old.  I can hardly imagine how his family members feel, but they have all of my sympathy.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 27, 2009, 07:21:38 PM
Unfortunately I can not make the semi's tonight.  Good luck to the Scots and keep Corey in your hearts....


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 27, 2009, 07:28:23 PM
Final: Wabash 73  Alleghany 56.  Wabash was hot from downtown (10-19) while the Gators were not (5-23)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 27, 2009, 07:40:16 PM
Capital holds form (a saves a Pool C bid) by defeating ONU 63-58.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2009, 07:41:10 PM
The Live Video of Kenyon/Wooster is $15 tonight?  Is that right?  Is that normally the case for their live video?  If so, that really sucks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on February 27, 2009, 08:17:02 PM
This season Wooster's streaming video has been free (I think Wooster boosters may have picked up the cost).  My guess is that since the tournament is a conference event, NCAC probably controls the live telecast rights (and gets a monetary cut).

As an aside, my grade from CPI live game video is a "D" (one camera almost entirely fixed focus and game announcers who seem to have done little game prep), but from a thousand miles away, I happily watch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 27, 2009, 08:34:30 PM
At the Half:   Wooster 52  Kenyon 27  :)

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 15 points, Justin Hallowell with 9 points (3 three pointers), Dustin Geitgey with 9 points, Marty Bidwell with 6 points and Matt Fegan also with 6 points.  Nathan Balch is on crutches and will not play tonight.  If Wooster makes the final tomorrow, Balch will also miss that game.  So far, the rest of the Scots are picking up the slack in Balch's absence.  ;)

Top scorers for Kenyon are Dave Jolson with 6 points, Jay Findlay with 6 points and Anthony Chun with 5 points.

Wooster shot 55% in the half compared to only 38% for the Lords.  Scots also made 7 of 15 three point shots.

The Scots are wearing a black band on their uniforms in honor of Corey Cline.

UPDATE:  ~7:30 left:  Wooster 80  Kenyon 55   Scots clearing the bench.    Wooster vs. Wabash tomorrow night!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 27, 2009, 08:37:29 PM
Just got home from work and all I have to say is Wabash Always Fights! This team was dead in the water just a few weeks ago and will play in the title game tomorrow night. I'm glad the offense finally came around. Let's hope we can put it together one more time tomorrow night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 27, 2009, 08:43:03 PM
Unbelievable finish to the half for the Scots - 1 turnover for the half. As I said on Tuesday, they take care of the ball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 27, 2009, 09:25:52 PM
Final:  Wooster 89  Kenyon 71  :)

Wooster advances to the tourney finals with a nice win.  Top scorers for the Scots were Ian Franks with 17 points, Marty Bidwell with 15 points, Mike Evans with 15 points, Justin Hallowell with 14 points and Matt Fegan with 12 points.

Kenyon was led by Bryan Yelvington with 14 points but most of those points were in garbage time.  Dave Jolson had 12 points and Anthony Chun also added 12 points.

Congratulations to the four Kenyon seniors (Bryan Yelvington, Allen Bediako, Jim Arce, Dave Jolson) who wrapped up their Kenyon careers tonight.  The Lords finished their season at 16-11.

Wooster made 14 of 28 three point shots and won the rebound battle 40 to 33.

Wooster is now 21-6 ;D  Next up are the Little Giants with a NCAA bid on the line.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2009, 10:04:20 PM
Congrats to Wabash! Go Little Giants!

Wooster should be extremely motivated due to last year's semi-final, so the LGs better bring their A++ game.

With all of the carnage going on everywhere (DPU, Guilford, Randolph-Macon, Buena Vista, St. Mary's (MD) all losing) and the WIAC should, by all rights, have 2 C's, then Wooster's margin for error is shrinking.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2009, 10:24:06 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on February 27, 2009, 08:17:02 PM
This season Wooster's streaming video has been free (I think Wooster boosters may have picked up the cost).  My guess is that since the tournament is a conference event, NCAC probably controls the live telecast rights (and gets a monetary cut).
The NCAC controls not just the video (and, for the women, the audio, which is $10), but also the ticket prices ($8).  I believe the conference gets a slice of the ticket revenue, and not just a slice but the whole pie from the women's audio and men's video revenue, with the proceeds used to help pay for these and the other 19 championship events.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 27, 2009, 10:39:32 PM
A handful of tournament losses thins the Pool C bubble....

While Wooster has been winning impressively I think it is becoming apparent that they need to get the automatic bid.

I know that the Scot faithful remember last years crushing defeat by Wabash, but the only Scot regulars from that team are Marty and Dustin. I think the loss of Corey will continue to be a bigger motivation...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2009, 11:06:38 PM
Fifteen bucks is by far the highest I've seen for a D-III live video.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2009, 01:19:31 AM
Quote from: goscots on February 27, 2009, 10:39:32 PM
I know that the Scot faithful remember last years crushing defeat by Wabash, but the only Scot regulars from that team are Marty and Dustin. I think the loss of Corey will continue to be a bigger motivation...

I totally agree!  IMHO, these last two games have to be arguably the best that the Scots have played all season.  I would never have imagined that Wooster, minus Nate Balch, would be up 25 over Kenyon at halftime.  But they did a number defensively on Yelvington in that 1st half.  Really, they did a number on the entire Kenyon team in that 1st half! 

I think a strong case for POTY was made tonight by Ian Franks even though voting has already been cast, I think...  Franks outscored POTY favorite Bryan Yelvington 15-2 in the first half and Yelvington's 2 points came at the charity stripe!  Sure, Yelvington outscored Franks 12-2 in the 2nd half, but the game was, for all intents and purposes, over at halftime with the Scots up 25 points!

Yelvington certainly deserves POTY, but I think Ian Franks made a statement tonight to put him in the front running for next year at the very least!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2009, 05:26:24 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2009, 11:06:38 PM
Fifteen bucks is by far the highest I've seen for a D-III live video.

I think it's outrageous.  Wittenbergish.  Sitting home recovering from an apendectomy, it was an easy choice to listen to the game, free, rather than fork over that much cash for a dubious video flow.  I'm sending half of my negative kudos to the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on February 28, 2009, 06:43:31 AM
Congratulations to the Wooster team.

Congratulations to the Kenyon team. I've enjoyed watching you guy's, and you had a great season.
Take away the important elements and build upon them.

Mark
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DanTHEman67 on February 28, 2009, 10:17:26 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2009, 05:26:24 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2009, 11:06:38 PM
Fifteen bucks is by far the highest I've seen for a D-III live video.

I think it's outrageous.  Wittenbergish.  Sitting home recovering from an apendectomy, it was an easy choice to listen to the game, free, rather than fork over that much cash for a dubious video flow.  I'm sending half of my negative kudos to the NCAC.
Yours was not a Scotty comment, but a snotty comment. Why must you start stuff like that? Can't you just be happy your team has the chance to advance without denigrating others and making your association with Wooster one your fellow alums might regret?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 28, 2009, 10:34:14 AM
Wabash has now won 6 games in a row so I checked the stats to see what was contributing to their turnaround.

The Little Giants have played some good defense in several of those wins.  The other major factors for Wabash are the improved play of both their athletic wing Wes Smith and their point guard Chase Haltom.  These two players have raised their scoring significantly in the last 6 games...well above their season averages.

In the last 6 wins, Wes Smith is averaging 20.8 points/game so he will be the #1 defensive priority for Wooster tonight.  I would expect Marty Bidwell and/or Ian Franks to get the task of trying to slow down Smith.  Smith had 27 pts, 14 boards vs. Allegheny.

In the last 6 wins, Chase Haltom is averaging 16.3 points/game with many of those points on three pointers.  Haltom is Wabash's best three point shooter and has made 65 on the season.  He will be the #2 defensive priority for Wooster.  Haltom made 3 three pointers vs. Allegheny.

I am looking forward to watching a great game at Timken tonight.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2009, 10:44:32 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2009, 05:26:24 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2009, 11:06:38 PM
Fifteen bucks is by far the highest I've seen for a D-III live video.

I think it's outrageous.  Wittenbergish.  Sitting home recovering from an apendectomy, it was an easy choice to listen to the game, free, rather than fork over that much cash for a dubious video flow.  I'm sending half of my negative kudos to the NCAC.
Wittenberg has been providing free video (with audio) for both men's and women's home games this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 28, 2009, 11:17:06 AM
Congratulations to Kenyon and Allegheny on making the run to the NCAC semifinals.  Also congratulations are in order for Wittenberg on the 40-year above .500 season streak.  Hiram gets a shout out,  too, as clearly the most improved conference team and biggest surprise.

Tonight should be a great game between the two NCAC teams who are both playing good basketball right now.  Both of these teams have everything on the line tonight- neither can expect to get a bid to the NCAA tourney without winning the automatic bid.

For Wooster, the goal has to be to shut down Wes Smith and Chase Haltom as much as possible.  Especially Smith.  If Wooster wins it's because they win with defense, I think.

For Wabash, you can't let Wooster start to run away with it.  Four straight Wooster opponents have been down by 20+ by the end of the first half.  Bash needs to find a way to stop Franks and contain the three-point damage.  Bash needs to neutralize the crowd because Timken will be electric if Wooster starts to build a lead.

Should be a great game.  Won't be watching because of the online streaming cost (but I prefer Breckenridge's radio call, anyway).  The Denison-Wooster game on Tuesday was free...and was an NCAC tournament game.  So they're only charging for the semifinals/finals, apparently.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2009, 11:17:31 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 28, 2009, 10:44:32 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2009, 05:26:24 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2009, 11:06:38 PM
Fifteen bucks is by far the highest I've seen for a D-III live video.

I think it's outrageous.  Wittenbergish.  Sitting home recovering from an apendectomy, it was an easy choice to listen to the game, free, rather than fork over that much cash for a dubious video flow.  I'm sending half of my negative kudos to the NCAC.
Wittenberg has been providing free video (with audio) for both men's and women's home games this season.

True.  But Wittenberg also charges what is probably a DIII high $8 per game for both men's and women's hoops.  Hence my comment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2009, 11:21:44 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 28, 2009, 10:44:32 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2009, 05:26:24 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2009, 11:06:38 PM
Fifteen bucks is by far the highest I've seen for a D-III live video.

I think it's outrageous.  Wittenbergish.  Sitting home recovering from an apendectomy, it was an easy choice to listen to the game, free, rather than fork over that much cash for a dubious video flow.  I'm sending half of my negative kudos to the NCAC.
Wittenberg has been providing free video (with audio) for both men's and women's home games this season.
So has Wooster up until last night.  This isn't a Wittenberg vs. Wooster issue.  It's an NCAC issue! 

And, for those of us in the local Wooster area, CPI airs a replay for free at 10 after every home game!  Usually, if I can't make it to a game, I just wait to watch the replay...  Like I will be doing tonight as, unfortunately, I have to work...  :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 28, 2009, 12:18:22 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 28, 2009, 11:21:44 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 28, 2009, 10:44:32 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2009, 05:26:24 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2009, 11:06:38 PM
Fifteen bucks is by far the highest I've seen for a D-III live video.

I think it's outrageous.  Wittenbergish.  Sitting home recovering from an apendectomy, it was an easy choice to listen to the game, free, rather than fork over that much cash for a dubious video flow.  I'm sending half of my negative kudos to the NCAC.
Wittenberg has been providing free video (with audio) for both men's and women's home games this season.
So has Wooster up until last night.  This isn't a Wittenberg vs. Wooster issue.  It's an NCAC issue! 

And, for those of us in the local Wooster area, CPI airs a replay for free at 10 after every home game!  Usually, if I can't make it to a game, I just wait to watch the replay...  Like I will be doing tonight as, unfortunately, I have to work...  :-[

FWIW, the OAC has a free video feed of its championship game tonight.  Tip is 7:30.
http://www.teamline.cc/sportpage?teamcode=1037&eventcode=6
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 28, 2009, 01:14:01 PM
Witt charges 8 only for the Wooster game, every other game it is 5
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on February 28, 2009, 03:00:48 PM
can't wait for tonights game....wooster has been building a lot of momentum lately and especially with the recent tragedy the team is playing with extra motivation....bash has been on a roll lately too so this should be a great matchup!...i'm sure it'll be much closer than both teams semifinal games...if wooster's best defensive player marty bidwell can hold wes smith to closer to the 11 points he had in their second matchup at timken, the scots have a great chance at cutting down the nets...smith has 11 turnovers in the 2 games against wooster so although he's averaging 17.5 ppg in the two matchups, he hasn't played a per say "complete" game for his standards...hopefully the scots can continue their hot shooting and WIN!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 28, 2009, 03:31:29 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2009, 11:17:31 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 28, 2009, 10:44:32 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2009, 05:26:24 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2009, 11:06:38 PM
Fifteen bucks is by far the highest I've seen for a D-III live video.

I think it's outrageous.  Wittenbergish.  Sitting home recovering from an apendectomy, it was an easy choice to listen to the game, free, rather than fork over that much cash for a dubious video flow.  I'm sending half of my negative kudos to the NCAC.
Wittenberg has been providing free video (with audio) for both men's and women's home games this season.

True.  But Wittenberg also charges what is probably a DIII high $8 per game for both men's and women's hoops.  Hence my comment.

Not quite, the cushiony chairs (the cadillac of D3 seats) cost $10 for the men's games at Hope. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 28, 2009, 06:56:12 PM
We're ready for the tip in Timken.

Wooster is without Balch, while Wabash is without the services of Brock.

Dustin Geitgey will start his second game for Wooster in Balch's place.  Bidwell will start the game on Wes Smith.

It's game time!!  Let's Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 28, 2009, 07:14:19 PM
12 minutes in, Wooster and Wabash both just launching threes- Wooster has 5 makes, Wabash now has 6.

Wooster is 11-15 from the floor, Wabash is 10-19.

7:52 left   29-26 Wooster

5:45-   34-31 Wooster - both teams still shooting well.  Halthom has 14, Hallowell has 10.

5:12- 36-31 Wooster.  No turnovers for Bash so far; Wooster only has 2.  Turnover Bash on a shot clock violation.

3:20- teams are cooling off now, missing some tip-in attempts.  38-33 Wooster with 3 mins to go first half.  Wabash hasn't led though there have been 2-3 ties.  Wooster's largest lead is 5.

2:14- offensive foul on Fegan; Bash had made 1-2 FTs last possession so it's 38-34 and Wabash ball.

Halthom hits another one. 38-37 Wooster, Bash ball with a chance for the last shot....Smith misses, Wooster rebounds and pushes but a long Geitgey 3 attempt is off the mark.

38-37 Wooster leads at the half.  Wooster led throughout the half but it's been close the whole way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on February 28, 2009, 07:36:55 PM
At the game now and both teams are on fire from deep...Chase Haltom is carrying the LG's...Scots receiving a more complete effort...2nd half will be interesting to watch...should go down to the wire if Haltom continues his hot shooting or Wes Smith heats up...Scots need to defend the 3 better
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 28, 2009, 07:50:43 PM
16:00- trading buckets, 46-45 Wooster leads; Wickliffe has a few early buckets for Woo and Smith and Burkett for Bash.  Turnover Wabash.

Franks draws a foul from Smith...makes the first, makes the second- he has 16. Layup by Dominique Thomas, he has 8.  Franks turns it over, then draws the charge to get the ball back.

14:43-  48-47 Wooster leads with the ball.  Hallowell drives and makes the bucket with the foul.  He has 12, make that 13 with the FT.  51-47 Woo

13:00-  Thomas hits another 3...he has 11.  Ross gets a put back off the offensive boards.  Smith misses...rebound Wooster and they push it...Hallowell drains the 3!  Wooster by 6, 56-50.  Timeout Wabash.

Smith comes right out and makes a 3... 56-53 Woo.  Ross turns it over down low, Woo's 8th turnover...Bash misses, but Wooster turns over the outlet pass.

10:30 left-  Smith enters double-figures with a layup.  He has 11.

10:14- Franks draws the foul.  Makes the first, makes the second.  Wooster is 11-11 from the line tonight.  58-55 Wooster

9:50- Smith misses, Franks rebounds.  Wooster throws it away.  10 turnovers for them. 

9:12- Hallowell hits a LONG 3, it's 61-55 and Hallowell has four 3s and 19 pts. Smith answers with a bucket by misses the FT on the chance for a 3-pt play.

8:04- Thomas makes another 3.  Where did this guy come from!!  He has 14 and is 4-4 from 3 pt. land.  Wooster quickly answers with a layup from Hallowell.  He has 21.

Timeout Scots.  63-60 Wooster

Ross commits a foul on Burkett--he makes them both.
Geitgey answers with a layup, making it a 3 point game again.

7:00- Smith hits a three, but Hallowell answers with another 3.  He has five of those and 24 points.  68-67 Wooster

6:00- Wooster misses, Bash rebound.  Hallowell blocks the shot and recovers.  Wooster has it with the one-point lead.  Smith blocks a Franks drive, still Wooster ball.

5:30- Bidwell hits a 3 as the shot clock expires!!  71-67 Wooster. Wabash nearly turns over then Haltom misses a long three.

4:40- Wooster ball and 4 point lead....Hallowell drains another NBA three...how good is this kid!  Wooster has its largest lead of the game.  74-67 Wooster.  Wooster timeout.  Wooster crowd is in this game now...Hallowell is 10-13 from the field.

4:00- Wickliffe blocks, but Bash recovers....Thomas misses the three, rebound Wooster.

3:31- Bidwell drives and scores.  Wooster by 9.  Bash misses....rebound Wooster.  Smith forced one up, good defense Wooster.

2:40- Franks misses, long three by Haltom is no good...he's lost the touch...rebound Wooster with the 9pt lead.  Two misses by Wooster.

2 mins- Franks blocks Haltom's jumper.  Wabash timeout.  It's still 76-67 Wooster leads.

Here we go- last two minutes:

Starting lineups in with Thomas for Wabash, everyone else is the starting five.
Wabash ball...miss by Burkett, rebound goes out of bounds still to Wabash.  New 35 for them.

1:35- Smith misses, Thomas recovers but steps out of bounds.  Turnover Wabash. Only their 5th of the game.

1:25- Wooster with the ball and the lead...STEAL wabash and Thomas goes and lays it in.  76-69 and now Wabash fouls.  Geitgey misses- Wooster's first miss in the game.

1 minute left: Smith makes a wild drive, misses.  Hallowell rebounds and is fouled.  He'll shoot....makes the first....makes the second.  78-69 Wooster.

Haltom runs straight down the court and makes a 3. First bucket of the second half for him.  78-72 Wooster leads.  55.1 to go.  Timeout Bash.

This is all about can Wooster make foul shots now.

:51- Haltom fouls Geitgey...last 1-1 for Wooster...he makes the first (he has 10), and...makes the second.  Woo leads by 8.

:38- Haltom misses, geitgey saves it to Hallowell.  He's fouled...makes them both.  Hallowell has 31; new high for him.

The College of Wooster Scots will earn the NCAC Pool A bid to the 2009 NCAA National Championship!

Smith misses, Hallowell rebounds, is fouled and makes them both again.  He's going to be your NCAC Tournament MVP.  He ends up with 33.

Final Score: 84-72 Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2009, 08:29:24 PM
Chuckin' Justin Hollowell!  After the preliminary acts finally cleared the floor, the real shooter was left, still throwing them in!  Holy Smokes!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 28, 2009, 09:34:45 PM
"Wabash fights" is right ... the Little Giants put up a very impressive battle tonight.  The first half was the best end-to-end action I've seen all year at Timken.  Chase Halton's shooting (including a very long 3 at a key point) kept the LGs in the game.  In the second half, Dominique Thomas and Wes Smith continued to put up the points.  Wabash has a great deal to be proud of in the way they played this week, and my black-and-gold hat is off to their team.

Every time the Scots needed a big bucket tonight, freshman Justin Hallowell knocked down another 3.  With about four minutes left, and Wooster up by just four, Hallowell swished a long jumper, and as time out was called, pounded the black ribbon on his chest and pointed to Mrs. Cline, sitting behind the Wooster bench.  It was one of many emotional moments for Wooster, wrapping up a week full of them.

If I'm at Wooster for the next several decades, I suspect that I'll see the Scots basketball team cut down the nets more than a few times.  However, this first championship I've seen will always be memorable for the circumstances under which it came, and the lift that this run provided to the campus community.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2009, 09:37:13 PM
Those of you who didn't feel like ponying up the $15 to watch the video can just tune in to those commercials where kids are throwing the ball over roofs and off of trees and swishing them.  That's like a highlight reel of tonight's game.  

H.O.R.S.E. is not really the kind of basketball I like, but when it's played at this high a level, it can make for a great game.  And it was a great game.  And it was very, very emotional at the end, especially when the team sent 7-year-old J.J. Cline out to receive the tournament championship trophy.  What a night.

Congratulations to both teams, and also to the All-Tournament Team:
Henry Heeter (Allegheny)
Dave Jolson (Kenyon)
Chase Haltom (Wabash)
Wes Smith (Wabash)
Ian Franks (Wooster)
Justin Hallowell (Wooster)...Al Van Wie Trophy winner as Tournament MVP
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 28, 2009, 10:11:26 PM
What a game. How did Wabash lose 13 games this season?  This was one of the more intense games I have seen at Timken gymnasium. Wabash deserves much respect for their play. They definitely belonged in the title game.

Congratulations to the Scots for earning the NCAC automatic bid.

Congratulations to Marty Bidwell for winning his 100th game as a Scot - the 7th straight senior class to achieve this milestone.

Coach Steve Moore now has 599 career wins...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 28, 2009, 10:55:26 PM
Back from Timken and I will echo the other comments about watching a great game tonight!

Congrats to the Little Giants on a great effort tonight and yes, Wabash always fights!

This game was very close (68-67) until about the 5:30 mark when Bidwell hit a three pointer, Hallowell hit a three pointer and a Bidwell layup made it 76-67 with only 3:30 left.

Is there any doubt left in anyone's mind that Justin Hallowell (33 pts, 6 of 9 three pointers) should be the NCAC Newcomer of the Year! :)  An incredible shooting performance by a freshman who could not be stopped tonight.

After Wooster began this season with a 5-4 record, who would have guessed that they were going to win the NCAC regular season title, win the NCAC tourney and go to the NCAA's with a 22-6 record?  Major kudos to Coach Steve Moore and Coach Doug Cline on molding this young team into a conference champion!

I think that this tough game tonight may have helped to prepare Wooster for the NCAA tourney.  It would be nice to see the Scots make some noise in the Big Dance but it will be a great experience for this young team no matter the outcome.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on February 28, 2009, 11:46:18 PM
Congratulations to Wooster on a 5th straight NCAC championship.  Slainte and best of luck in the upcoming tournament! 

It was one heck of an enjoyable game to watch, even for this LG fan.  Hallowell was lights out, and when a team shoots over 50% from the field (and over 55% from three) and is a shot short of perfection from the line...

Wouldn't be surprised to see a three-peat matchup next year, with Wooster graduating Johnson and Bidwell and for Wabash, Maloney and Turpin.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on March 01, 2009, 12:08:16 AM
Congrats to Wooster. Good luck in the tourney. What a great shooting performance.

Quote from: goscots on February 28, 2009, 10:11:26 PM
How did Wabash lose 13 games this season?

I wish I had an answer for that. Whatever switch the LGs flipped at the end of the season needs to be left in the "ON" position next year.

I would have loved to have been in Timken for this one. I hope next year we can do this again. Without the 13 losses that is.

Again, congrats to Wooster. Represent the NCAC well in the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 01, 2009, 12:11:41 AM
Quote from: cave2bens on February 28, 2009, 11:46:18 PM
Wouldn't be surprised to see a three-peat matchup next year, with Wooster graduating Johnson and Bidwell and for Wabash, Maloney and Turpin.   

Wooster's Brandon Johnson took a medical redshirt for this season.  He plans to return as a fifth-year senior next year and play for the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 01, 2009, 12:22:36 AM
Since we've now seen all the match ups we'll see between two NCAC teams this year, I think it's probably time to say- what a fun, great year in the NCAC.  This conference shows all indications of continuing to be deeper top-to-bottom than it has been in years (perhaps ever).  Three lower seeds win in the NCAC quarterfinals, Hiram breaks into the top four and looks like it plans to stay there for awhile, Wabash gives Wooster all it can handle in a great tournament final, and with the exception of Oberlin and Earlham anyone in this conference could've beaten anyone else all season (see: Denison vs. Wooster in 2OTs, or Ohio Wesleyan vs. Oberlin).  With a ton of young talent in the league, it looks like this competitive trend will continue next season in the NCAC.

So here's to Wooster being a worthy representative for this year's NCAAs from a conference that looks to be on the rise in overall quality and depth.  Major kudos to Wabash in the game tonight-- I suspect we'll see a few more Haltom/Hallowell 3-pt raining contests in the next few years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on March 01, 2009, 06:09:20 AM
Sounds like it was a great game last night. I was not able to attend. It was a great season and tournament for the Teams and the Conference. I agree with Brian's comments, Wooster has shown that they truely are not just the Conference Champs; but the best squad to represent us ( NCAC & Great Lakes) all in the Tournament.

Best of Luck.... Your re playing for us all.

Bring Home some Hardware.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 01, 2009, 08:58:01 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 28, 2009, 09:34:45 PM

Every time the Scots needed a big bucket tonight, freshman Justin Hallowell knocked down another 3.  With about four minutes left, and Wooster up by just four, Hallowell swished a long jumper, and as time out was called, pounded the black ribbon on his chest and pointed to Mrs. Cline, sitting behind the Wooster bench.  It was one of many emotional moments for Wooster, wrapping up a week full of them.


This was indeed the capper on what was a very emotional week for the College of Wooster Basketball team!  And what a capper it was!  Hats off to Wabash who played one hell of a game and ended the season on a rather impressive run and should have plenty of confidence to build off of going forward to next season!  But I just don't think that anyone could have stopped this Scots' team from reaching their destination and that was bringing the NCAC Tournament trophy home for Corey!!!  I cannot convey enough how much I applaud the players and coaches for how they persevered through this very difficult week to reach their goal of an NCAC Championship!

It is so nice to be able to discuss where the Scots might end up as opposed to having to fret over whether or not Wooster's resume was good enough to garner them a Pool C!  For selfish reasons, I'm hoping that the Scots stay close to home at JCU (whom I'm assuming should be a lock to host out of the GL Region) so I could attend the games.  And in all reality, is there ever a year more wide open in the GL Region where any number of teams could prevail out of this region?!  Any other year, I would say I wouldn't mind seeing Wooster shipped to another region due to the toughness of staying in the GL Region.  But this year, I don't know...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 01, 2009, 12:52:27 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 01, 2009, 08:58:01 AM
For selfish reasons, I'm hoping that the Scots stay close to home at JCU (whom I'm assuming should be a lock to host out of the GL Region) so I could attend the games.

The D3Hoops projection envisions this exact scenario with John Carroll hosting Wooster, Hope and Medaille (from Buffalo, NY) in a 4 team pod for the first 2 rounds.  If the projected seeds play out, Wooster would play Hope in the first round and the winner would likely face JCU in the 2nd round.

If the Scots don't play in Wooster, this is probably the next best travel scenario as ScotsFan noted.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 01, 2009, 01:50:58 PM
If the D3Hoops projected bracket is accurate, here are the geographically closest NCAA tourney teams for Wooster:

~65 miles  John Carroll
~95 miles  Capital
~125 miles Carnegie Mellon
~215 miles Thomas More (across river from Cincy)
~250 miles Medaille (in Buffalo)
~285 miles Transylvania (Lexington, KY)
~325 miles Centre (Danville, KY)
~330 miles Hope (Holland, MI)

The D3Hoops projected bracket is mingling some Great Lakes teams with some Middle Atlantic teams.  If the NCAA chooses instead to create a full bracket with mostly Great Lakes teams, it would likely be most of the above teams plus Wooster.  For example, if Centre stayed in a South Bracket, then Wooster plus the other 7 teams above could create a 8 team bracket with JCU as the likely #1 seed.  Wooster has been in pods/brackets with several of these teams in past tourneys (Transy, Centre, Cap, JCU, Hope)

Technically, the NCAA can ask a team to bus up to 500 miles (they avoid airline expenses if possible) which resulted in Wooster playing in Rock Island, Illinois last year in the first round. ::) >:(  Let's hope that Wooster as a Pool A automatic bid isn't asked to drive ~495 miles for a first round game this year.

National balancing of the brackets and the NCAA attempting to minimize travel costs for all teams could obviously result in some other combination of teams in a bracket as well.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 01, 2009, 04:01:52 PM
I really think that trying to prognosticate what the NCAA selection committee is going to do is kind of a waste of time.  I mean, what they try and predict here on this site is things that actually make sense!  And we all know all too well that the NCAA's thought process through the selections and seeding of the brackets often leaves us with nothing left to do  but scratch our heads...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 02, 2009, 01:24:54 AM
Thanks, ScotsFan, appreciate the vote of confidence.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 02, 2009, 11:27:32 AM
Wooster (22-6) goes to Capital to play Gettysburg (18-8) in the first round.  The winner will face the victor between Capital (24-4) and Thomas More (19-8).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2009, 11:42:41 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 02, 2009, 11:27:32 AM
Wooster (22-6) goes to Capital to play Gettysburg (18-8) in the first round.  The winner will face the victor between Capital (24-4) and Thomas More (19-8).
Thomas More, it should be noted, is coached by former Wooster great John Ellenwood, who was an assistant at Capital for three years before heading to TMC.  In Ellenwood's three seasons in Crestview Hills, the Saints have gone from 3-23 to a 19-8 PAC championship season. 

I'm not sure if Gettysburg has anything to contribute to the All-In-The-Family nature of this regional.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2009, 11:49:22 AM
Pretty good draw for Wooster in the tourney.  Gettysburg on a neutral floor should be a game that Wooster will have a decent chance of winning.  A 2nd round potential game vs. a host school was expected.  I actually prefer Capital as the host school instead of John Carroll which still plays that full court press style with a 10-12 man rotation.

Let's hope that Wooster can make some noise in the tourney! :)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 02, 2009, 12:12:52 PM
I sure lucked out.  Capital is right down the street from me.  Depending on what time the game is played I might be able to catch the Scots play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2009, 12:20:20 PM
For those who haven't been there, the Capital Center is a very nice, 2100-seat facility, and should be a fine host site for this regional.  It could get a little crowded, however, given how well Wooster travels and how well Capital draws (I doubt that either Gettysburg or TMC will contribute too much to the throng.)  To make matters worse, Capital's spring break has already come and gone (first day of classes was today), so the students should be out in force.  Wooster, on the other hand, begins its spring break on Friday.  Listen up, COW students: to get from Wooster to Florida, you have to drive through Columbus anyway, so why not take an extra day or two en route? ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2009, 12:25:05 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2009, 11:49:22 AM
Pretty good draw for Wooster in the tourney.  Gettysburg on a neutral floor should be a game that Wooster will have a decent chance of winning.  A 2nd round potential game vs. a host school was expected.  I actually prefer Capital as the host school instead of John Carroll which still plays that full court press style with a 10-12 man rotation.

Let's hope that Wooster can make some noise in the tourney! :)


I agree.  I can't really complain about who Wooster drew.  It could be a lot worse...  As you said, we all knew that Wooster would be travelling.  It was just a matter of where.  I think I would rather be playing at Cap as well.  And, even though their 1st round game is at Cap, Wooster should still enjoy a large advantage in crowd support in their game vs. Gettysburg. 

No question, the toughest section is the Midwest/West.  They have the top 7 teams in the d3hoops Top 25!!!  :o  And 9 of the 15 teams in that sectional are ranked!!!   There are two possible 2nd round matchups featuring top 10 teams!  St. Thomas has managed to remain unbeaten throughout this entire season and they have the very real possibility of being knocked out of the tournament in the 2nd round by UWSP!  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2009, 12:48:49 PM
While poking around on the Massey site (http://www.mratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&sub=III&mid=1), something I don't do often, I did notice that Hiram's December loss to Franciscan ended up as the second-least likely result involving D3 teams this season.  What better testament to Hiram's rise than to be on the "right" side of a statistic like that?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: LGHistorian on March 02, 2009, 01:07:09 PM
Good luck to Wooster in the NCAA.

It was nice to hear some good feedback on Wabash's effort in the NCAC championship game from Wooster.

It was an exciting year in the conference and I hope this will continue next year.

And I also want to express my deepest sympathy to the Wooster community for the loss of a child.  One thing that gets overlooked by people who are anti-sports is how much it means to have an extended family (team, coaches, etc.) for support during life's most tragic or troubling times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on March 02, 2009, 03:11:29 PM
Looking at the Scots first round matchup, I can say statistically it was a good draw at least...first for the Gettysburg College Bullets of the Centennial Conference who finished the regular season and conference tournament play with an 18-8 record...
Starters
PG- 5-10 160 Sr. Chris Nevolo- 4 PPG, 91% FTA
SG- 6-2   160 Sr. Dan Capkin- 14 PPG, 64% FTA, 41% 3PA
SF-  6-5  195 Sr. Corey Dorsey- 12 PPG, 77% FTA, 31% 3PA
PF- 6-8   190 Sr. Joe Spierenburg- 5.5 PPG, 6 RPG, 2.5 BPG
C-  6-6   190 So. Andrew Powers- 18 PPG, 7 RPG, 73% FTA
Totalling- 53.5 PPG from starters or 82.3% of team's total points PPG
Top Reserve(s)
F- 6-5   195 So. Kevin Kennedy- 6 PPG, 78% FTA
-Kennedy was the only real reserve that had significant playing time as others played but not much.
Some key notes- The Bullets have won their past 4 games after losing the previous 3.  The average score for their past 4 wins is 69-58 so they have been playing some good ball
-For the year, averaging 65 PPG, Opp. 61 PPG
-Average 34% 3PA, Opp. 30% 3PA
-73% team FTA
-Rebounding dead even with Opp. at about 33-33 RPG
-Averaging 16 TO's per game with Opp. 14 TO's per game
-Average 4 block shots per game
-Finished 10-2 at Home, 6-6 Away, and 2-0 at Neutral Sites. 

Now for the College of Wooster Fighting Scots of the North Coast Athletic Conference who finished the regular season and conference play with a record of 22-6....
Starters
PG- 6-1 175 So. Nathan Balch- 12 PPG, 90% FTA, 47% 3PA
SG- 6-3 175 So. Ian Franks-     15 PPG, 79% FTA, 39% 3PA
SF- 6-4 205 Sr. Marty Bidwell-  10 PPG, 71 % FTA, 42% 3PA
PF- 6-7 200 Fr. Justin Hallowell- 14.5 PPG, 89% FTA, 4.5 RPG, 52% 3PA
C- 6-6  205 So. Bryan Wickliffe- 7.5 PPG, 6 RPG, 71% FTA
Totalling- 59 PPG from starters or 70% of team's total PPG
Key Reserve(s)
G- 6-1 175 Jr. Dustin Geitgey- 5 PPG, 82%FTA, 3 RPG
G- 6-1 180 Fr. Matt Fegan- 5 PPG, 48% 3PA
F- 6-4 200 Fr. Mike Evans- 4.5 PPG, 37% 3PA
F- 6-5 205 Fr. Greg Ross- 4.5 PPG, 3.5 RPG
Some Key Notes- The Scots have won their past 9 contests with an average win of 84 PPG to their Opp. 66 PPG
-For the year Wooster averages 81 PPG and their Opp. 69 PPG
-Wooster averages 43.5% 3PA, with Opp. at 33% 3PA
-Wooster shoots at a 77% FTA
-Wooster averages 37.5 RPG to Opp. 32 RPG
-Wooster averages 14 TO's per game to their Opp. 13 TO's per game
-Average 2.5 BPG as a team
-Finished the year 15-1 at home, 7-4 Away, 0-1 at neutral sites....
Some Final Comments
-Gettysburg plays around a 6-7 man rotation as Wooster typically plays more of a 9-10 man rotation
-Wooster is coming in with slightly more momentum riding their 9 game winning streak
-Andrew Powers and Justin Hallowell potential matchup could be a great one...with Powers having a great inside game and Hallowell shooting Threes Lights out
-Wooster will need to use their depth to an advantage to try to tire out and possibly get Powers and/or Spierenburg in foul trouble to alleviate their lack of height.
-Gettysburg will need to play a more slow grind it out game against Wooster while relying on their big 3 of Powers, Capkin, and Dorsey to outlast Wooster's great shooting team..
-If Wooster can negate the slightly height disadvantage and use their depth, I feel Wooster will win the game and advance to play the Capital/Thomas More winner....should be a great one!!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 02, 2009, 04:21:06 PM
Nice job Lebron23!

I agree that this seems like a good draw for the Scots.  At least its a heck of a lot better than traveling to Augustana to play Wash U!!  I was only half-listening to the Hoopsville analysis, but it seemed like all of the guys on there were picking the Scots to advance out of this pod.

The stat that really jumps out at me for Gettysburg is that they hold their opposition to .297 from behind the arc.  Since Wooster scores a large percentage (38.5%) of their points on 3's, that could be a huge factor in this game. 

Any word on Balch's availability this weekend? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2009, 04:32:01 PM
Thanks for the overview lebron.

Quote from: lebron23 on March 02, 2009, 03:11:29 PM
-Andrew Powers and Justin Hallowell potential matchup could be a great one...with Powers having a great inside game and Hallowell shooting Threes Lights out
My gut feeling would be that Wooster will start with Wickliffe on Powers with help from Greg Ross, Mike Evans and Kaleb Reed.  I would hate to see Hallowell get into foul trouble trying to gaurd the Gettysburg big man!

I'm really amazed by the apparent lack of depth from Gettysburg.  Only 2 players off their bench averaging double figures in minutes played?  Wooster on the other hand has 4 players off the bench averaging double figures in minutes.  I would guess that Wooster will definitely want to try and dictate the tempo of this game and get out running every chance they get to wear down the Bullets.  If Wooster can find a way to get Gettysburg in foul trouble, the Bullets could be in real trouble!

An interesting stat I noticed while comparing Wooter and Gettysburg and that has to do with 3 point shooting.  Gettysburg has only 2 players with more than 30 made 3-pointers on the season.  Meanwhile, Wooster has 5 players with 30 or more made 3-pointers on the season!  And 4 of those 5 shooters for the Scots have a better percentage from beyond the arc than Gettysburg's best 3 point shooter!  Only Ian Franks has a slightly worse percentage than the Bullets' Dan Capkin!  Hallowell finished the year ranked 4th in the nation in 3-point fg % at 51.7%. And if Nate Balch wouldn't have gotten injured, he may have had a chance to make enough more treys to qualify him for the national rankings where he would have also finished in the top 10!  You need 2.5 made 3's pg and he was at 2.2 when he was injured.  It just continues to amaze me how Coach Moore and his staff can keep bringing in such talented shooters year in and year out!

Something that Gettysburg does have going for them is senior leadership and experience.  Several of Wooster's losses this season have been to teams heavy on senior leadership so, Wooster will have to be well aware of the fact that 4 of the 5 starters for Gettysburg are all seniors and I believe they also all have tournament experience.

Lastly, one other thing I think will be key for Wooster is the status of Nate Balch.  With Nate, I think this team is very capable of making a deep run into this tournament.  Wooster proved that they can get the job done without him, but I just think they will miss his ball handling ability and his shooting the deeper they get into the tournament.  He will have been off for almost a week and a half by the time tip happens on Friday, so hopefully Tom Love and the rest of the Wooster training staff will have him ready to go!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: larry_u on March 02, 2009, 04:37:28 PM
Can someone post your NCAA team's profiles in here:

http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=6299.0
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on March 02, 2009, 04:41:40 PM
ScotsFan...very good point about keeping Hallowell out of trouble by not guarding Powers....that would put Hallowell and Spierenburg matching up....Spierenburg averages 2.5 Block per game, but I would have to imagine he doesn't guard players that have quite the range that Hallowell has....he seems pretty lanky though at 6-8 190, so that might be something to look at if Hallowell can spread him out of the paint, it might open the lanes up a bit for Franks, Balch, Bidwell and company to get some closer baskets without Spierenburg in their face....i'll try to get an accurate word on Balch as soon as I can.... 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2009, 04:52:28 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 02, 2009, 04:21:06 PM
The stat that really jumps out at me for Gettysburg is that they hold their opposition to .297 from behind the arc.  Since Wooster scores a large percentage (38.5%) of their points on 3's, that could be a huge factor in this game. 

Yes, it does look like Gettysburg does well at defending the three, but how often do they face a team like Wooster with all of the shooters they throw at you?  I was over on the CC board and there was mention that the CC is not that good of a conference when it comes to 3-point shooting.  Gettysburg was the highest ranked team nationally of the top 4 in their conference and they checked in at 211th...  BTW, Wooster was 4th nationally in a virtual tie with Wis. Lutheran and Wesley.  Wooster is ranked even higher in 3-point percentage.  They are 2nd behind Brandeis in that category.  But what stands out to me is the number of made treys.  Wooster is more than 100 made treys than almost everyone else in the top 10!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2009, 05:00:41 PM
Quote from: larry_u on March 02, 2009, 04:37:28 PM
Can someone post your NCAA team's profiles in here:

http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=6299.0
I think lebron did a fairly nice job for Wooster's team profile.  I would just cut and paste that to the link provided by larry u...

Any word on when tickets will be made available and how many Wooster will likely be allotted?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on March 02, 2009, 07:10:51 PM
College of Wooster Fighting Scots, Wooster, OH
Rank Last in d3 hoops.com poll: Unranked
North Coast Athletic Conference (NCAC) Outright Regular Season and Tournament Champions
22-6 Overall Record, 14-2 NCAC
Head Coach Steve Moore- 22nd Season

Key Wins: Dec. 6th, 82-65 vs. Ohio Wesleyan; Jan. 7th, 74-64 @ Kenyon; Feb. 4th, 89-87 @ Hiram; Feb.14th, 67-53 @ Wittenberg. 

Record Against NCAA Tournament Teams- (0-2) L 66-74 @ Carnegie Mellon; L 67-76 Neutral Site vs. Wisc.-Platteville

Starters
22 PG- 6-1 175 So. Nathan Balch- 12 PPG, 90% FTA, 47% 3PA
33 SG- 6-3 175 So. Ian Franks-     15 PPG, 79% FTA, 39% 3PA
14 SF- 6-4 205 Sr. Marty Bidwell-  10 PPG, 71 % FTA, 42% 3PA
40 PF- 6-7 200 Fr. Justin Hallowell- 14.5 PPG, 89% FTA, 4.5 RPG, 52% 3PA
32 C- 6-6  205 So. Bryan Wickliffe- 7.5 PPG, 6 RPG, 71% FTA

Key Reserve(s)
12 G- 6-1 175 Jr. Dustin Geitgey- 5 PPG, 82%FTA, 3 RPG
20 G- 6-1 180 Fr. Matt Fegan- 5 PPG, 48% 3PA
42 F- 6-4 200 Fr. Mike Evans- 4.5 PPG, 37% 3PA
54 F- 6-5 205 Fr. Greg Ross- 4.5 PPG, 3.5 RPG

Other Notes
5th Straight Outright NCAC Championship
254-44 Record Since 2000 (85.2%) Winning Percentage...Best in ALL divisions
Final 4 Appearances in 2007 (4th Place) and 2003 (3rd Place)
Overall NCAA Record since 1990- (16-17)
7th Consecutive NCAA Tournament Appearance

Our Tournament Profile is posted!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 02, 2009, 07:24:07 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 02, 2009, 12:20:20 PM
For those who haven't been there, the Capital Center is a very nice, 2100-seat facility, and should be a fine host site for this regional.  It could get a little crowded, however, given how well Wooster travels and how well Capital draws (I doubt that either Gettysburg or TMC will contribute too much to the throng.)  To make matters worse, Capital's spring break has already come and gone (first day of classes was today), so the students should be out in force.  Wooster, on the other hand, begins its spring break on Friday.  Listen up, COW students: to get from Wooster to Florida, you have to drive through Columbus anyway, so why not take an extra day or two en route? ;D

The Capital Center is a very nice, high quality D3 gym.  However I will quibble with the attendence.  Last year Capital hosted Bethany in round 1.  Granted it was round one and it was Bethany on a Thursday but the total attendance was only 896.
http://www.capital.edu/17992/

OAC.org says Cap averaged 673 a home game this year.

Bethany brought at least one bus load of students from West Virginia and a number of other fans.  Capital had a good sized student section maybe 6 or 7 rows but there were plenty of good seats available to stretch out.  I also recall that parking wasn't the greatest, so get there early.

I'll be interested to hear what its like this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2009, 07:50:33 PM
Quote from: sac on March 02, 2009, 07:24:07 PM
The Capital Center is a very nice, high quality D3 gym.  However I will quibble with the attendence.  Last year Capital hosted Bethany in round 1.  Granted it was round one and it was Bethany on a Thursday but the total attendance was only 896.
http://www.capital.edu/17992/

OAC.org says Cap averaged 673 a home game this year.

Bethany brought at least one bus load of students from West Virginia and a number of other fans.  Capital had a good sized student section maybe 6 or 7 rows but there were plenty of good seats available to stretch out.  I also recall that parking wasn't the greatest, so get there early.

I'll be interested to hear what its like this year.
My guess would be that if Wooster gets past Gettysburg, the Wooster contingent alone would come close to doubling that attendance figure from that Bethany game last year...  And that's not including students.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on March 02, 2009, 08:11:09 PM
word is that balch will be ready to go this weekend...so that's good news...but you know how ankle injuries are...hopefully all goes as planned though because he's a key member of the team!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2009, 08:24:17 PM
NCAC athletes among the final NCAA statistical leaders (http://web1.ncaa.org/stats/StatsSrv/rankings?sportCode=MBB&rpt=wkly):

Scoring:  Bryan Yelvington, Kenyon, 19.9 (47th)
Three-point FG per game:  Justin Hallowell, Wooster, 3.41 (12th); Jordan Beard, Oberlin, 3.00 (37th)
Three-point FG%:  Justin Hallowell, Wooster, .517 (4th); Jordan Beard, Oberlin, .475 (8th); Chase Haltom, Wabash, .423 (33rd)
Free throw %:  Jordan Beard, Oberlin, .882 (19th); Tristian Gregory, Earlham, .849 (54th)
Steals:  Kyle Miller, OWU, 2.42 (39th)
Assist/turnover ratio:  Nick Russo, Hiram, 2.48 (15th)

(The NCAA uses higher cutoffs for rate stats than does the NCAC, which knocks out folks like Kevin Murray's league-leading .922 FT%.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on March 02, 2009, 08:25:26 PM
Per Capital Basketball Page....The action begins with a doubleheader on Friday as Wooster faces Gettysburg at 6 p.m. followed by Capital playing host to Thomas More at 8 p.m.  The winners will square off in an NCAA Second Round matchup on Saturday at 7 p.m.

Tickets are only $6 for General Admission and $3 for all students/children/senior citizens.  A separate ticket will be sold for each day....still not sure how many tickets will be allotted for COW yet, but if I find out I'll post it...also from our basketball page....Capital is encouraging fans to arrive early on Friday due to a variety of other events going on in the area, including the OAC Indoor Track & Field Championships inside the Capital Center.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2009, 08:36:13 PM
Quote from: lebron23 on March 02, 2009, 08:25:26 PMCapital is encouraging fans to arrive early on Friday due to a variety of other events going on in the area, including the OAC Indoor Track & Field Championships inside the Capital Center.
Egad...parking, which sac correctly notes is a problem in the best of circumstances, is really going to be a nightmare.  I hope the Rebounders and/or the college sends a bus or two.  Looks like I'll be spending a lazy afternoon in downtown Bexley! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 02, 2009, 09:25:38 PM
I'm looking for the Scots to dodge some Bullets, then launch a Crusade to the Sweet Sixteen!   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on March 03, 2009, 01:48:27 AM
It's good to see the NCAC board is lively as always. Just thought I'd shed some light on the Bullets for you gentlemen. While Wooster has an obvious advantage outside the arc, Gettysburg's inside game could wreck havoc on the Scots. While Spierenburg has primarily been a force on the defensive side, Powers is a legit offensive presence in just his second year on the squad. He has good moves in the post and makes his shots (.542). He also draws contact and has made more free throws than anyone on Wooster's team has attempted. While the combo isn't quite Witt's talented duo of Dane Borchers and Dan Russ, it's potent and could be a pivotal point to the game, especially if the Scots are off the mark from deep. While the Centennial may not be on the same par from distance as the NCAC, I assure you there is not a lack of big men, and Powers has had his way with most of them.

On the perimeter, the Bullets stack up with Nevolo, Capkin, and Dorsey. Nevolo doesn't score much, but he's a solid passer and pesky on the defensive end. Capkin is the team's top shooter, but he is also the best driver and slasher. He'll take a hit and keep on ticking. Dorsey is the most athletic player outside of Powers and can be a match up problem for most teams when he's on his game. Should be a good match with Bidwell, given the latter's physicalilty on defense and quickness.

Yes, Gettysburg uses a pretty shallow lineup, while Wooster's is pretty deep. But remember a few years ago when the Scots only went three deep on the bench? Didn't seem to hurt them too much (Final Four anyone?) Most teams try to throw in all their players to wear the Bullets down (McDaniel used 16 in the CC semis), but it doesn't matter very much given the team's conditioning. 

One last note...Gettysburg runs an offense that is unlike anything Wooster has seen. With the scores the Bullets have put up, some of you might compare it to Witt or Wabash's style. But it's not even close and I can't even begin to explain it. Just a blur of movement and cuts from everywhere.

So let's have it out: Youth versus Experience; Depth versus lack of Depth; Three-point offense versus Three-point defense; Perimeter play versus Inside Play; and on and on...The possibilities are endless, but I can't wait to see what the coaches draw up to try and throw the other off.

Hope this helps with your NCAA perusing about the first round. As much I enjoyed my time at Wooster watching the Scots battle it out with Witt, score 100 points every night, and advance in the NCAAs, I have to give the nod to the  Orange & Blue based on experience and plain, old adversity. This is a team that lost to the worst team in the conference and still managed to bounce back at the end of the season and knock off the top two conference teams twice each in the final two weeks.

Good luck to all this weekend!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 03, 2009, 05:53:41 AM
Thanks waterboy.  That's some interesting information.  Looks like I will make this game with the wife.  The 6:00 start time is a little tricky.  I'm not going to like driving on 70 east that time of the day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2009, 08:26:41 AM
I agree, Gettysburg will be tough.  Massey shows them with a considerably tougher SOS than Wooster.  In the following computer simulation, in which I had the Scots play without Nathan Balch, the team from Pennsylvania opened up an eleven-point first half lead.  Wooster could never get closer than seven after that, and a late Gettysburg burst produced the final margin of sixteen points.  This was just one game, and I think most would be closer, but I believe it shows the Scots will have their hands full.

Sorry about the columns, I don't know how to line them up.

Official Basketball Box Score 
Gettysburg vs Wooster  
Gettysburg 69, Wooster 53  
----------------------------------------------------------------------------  
VISITORS: Gettysburg  
  TOT-FG  3-PT   REB  
Player Name  Pos  FG-FGA  FG-FGA  FT-FTA  TOT  PF  TP  A  TO  BLK  S  MIN  
Andrew Powers....... C 7-16  2-3  6-6  7  3  22  3  1  0  0  36  
Dan Capkin.......... G 9-18  3-9  0-0  2  2  21  2  2  0  6  36  
Corey Dorsey........ G/F 4-8  3-5  2-2  3  4  13  0  0  0  0  27  
Chris Nevolo........ G 0-2  0-0  1-2  1  2  1  2  0  0  2  31  
Joe Spierenburg..... F 1-2  0-0  1-1  4  2  3  3  2  3  2  28  
Kevin Kennedy....... F 4-5  1-1  0-0  4  0  9  0  0  1  0  25  
Brendan Hager....... G 0-2  0-1  0-0  3  1  0  4  2  0  0  12  
Team................     4  
Totals..............  25-53  9-19  10-11  28  14  69  14  7  4  10  196  
----------------------------------------------------------------------------  
HOME TEAM: Wooster  
  TOT-FG  3-PT   REB  
Player Name  Pos  FG-FGA  FG-FGA  FT-FTA  TOT  PF  TP  A  TO  BLK  S  MIN  
Justin Hallowell.... PF 7-13  5-9  2-2  6  3  21  0  2  0  0  31  
Ian Franks.......... G 4-8  0-1  3-3  4  2  11  4  3  1  0  33  
Marty Bidwell....... SF 4-6  1-1  0-0  2  1  9  1  3  0  2  32  
Bryan Wickliffe..... C 2-7  0-0  0-0  9  2  4  1  3  0  1  25  
Dustin Geitgey...... G 0-6  0-3  2-2  3  1  2  3  2  2  1  32  
Matt Fegan.......... G 0-1  0-1  0-0  0  1  0  1  0  0  0  15  
Greg Ross........... C 1-3  0-0  1-2  3  3  3  2  2  0  0  15  
Mike Evans.......... F 1-6  1-2  0-0  4  1  3  0  1  0  0  16  
Team................     0  
Totals..............  19-50  7-17  8-9  31  14  53  12  16  3  4  200 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lebron23 on March 03, 2009, 09:16:51 AM
BASKETBALL TICKETS FOR NCAA 1ST ROUND AT CAPITAL

Wooster vs Gettysburg Friday night game time 6pm.  Sales will be Tuesday 5-7pm and Wed 10-12 at Armington PEC Ticket Windows (Normal Spot to get Tickets to the right when you walk in to home games), $6 Adults, $3 Students/Seniors/Children, CASH ONLY!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 03, 2009, 09:35:18 AM
Is there plenty of parking?  Is parking free?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2009, 10:25:01 AM
Quote from: countyroad on March 03, 2009, 09:35:18 AM
Is there plenty of parking?  Is parking free?

From further up the page:
Quote from: sac on March 02, 2009, 07:24:07 PMI also recall that parking wasn't the greatest, so get there early.
...and a little after that:
Quote from: David Collinge on March 02, 2009, 08:36:13 PM
Quote from: lebron23 on March 02, 2009, 08:25:26 PMCapital is encouraging fans to arrive early on Friday due to a variety of other events going on in the area, including the OAC Indoor Track & Field Championships inside the Capital Center.
Egad...parking, which sac correctly notes is a problem in the best of circumstances, is really going to be a nightmare.

The Cap Center lot is free, but that won't help much if it's full when you get there.  After that, it's street parking, unless Capital opens up another lot for event parking.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 03, 2009, 11:00:22 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 03, 2009, 10:25:01 AM
The Cap Center lot is free, but that won't help much if it's full when you get there.  After that, it's street parking, unless Capital opens up another lot for event parking.
There are no parking garages within walking distance?  I'm not looking too forward to these parking horror stories I'm hearing about.  I probably won't be able to get down there much before 5 on Friday night.  Guess I'd better wear my walking shoes...  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2009, 11:17:08 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 03, 2009, 11:00:22 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 03, 2009, 10:25:01 AM
The Cap Center lot is free, but that won't help much if it's full when you get there.  After that, it's street parking, unless Capital opens up another lot for event parking.
There are no parking garages within walking distance?  I'm not looking too forward to these parking horror stories I'm hearing about.  I probably won't be able to get down there much before 5 on Friday night.  Guess I'd better wear my walking shoes...  :-\
The only time I've been shut out of the main lot, the school was on a break (Christmas, probably), and they were letting us park anywhere we chose.  So I've never had to investigate parking in Bexley proper.  But there's a shopping/dining district on E. Main Street just two blocks from the Cap Center, so I expect there'll be some place for everyone to park.  It might not be too bad for early-game partisans; most of the locals will probably not arrive until after the Wooster/Gettysburg game has started, and I'm not terribly concerned about overflow crowds at the OAC Indoor Track & Field Championships.  (Although that requires a lot of team buses and vans that must be parked somewhere.)

Most of us have experience parking at Wooster, and the situation seems not too different: once the Lowry Center lot is full, you're pretty much left with street parking.  What I don't know about Bexley is if street parking is metered or otherwise limited, or if there's any municipal lots within easy walking distance of the Cap Center.  It's too bad the OAC board is bereft of Capital supporters!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2009, 11:33:49 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 03, 2009, 11:17:08 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 03, 2009, 11:00:22 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 03, 2009, 10:25:01 AM
The Cap Center lot is free, but that won't help much if it's full when you get there.  After that, it's street parking, unless Capital opens up another lot for event parking.
There are no parking garages within walking distance?  I'm not looking too forward to these parking horror stories I'm hearing about.  I probably won't be able to get down there much before 5 on Friday night.  Guess I'd better wear my walking shoes...  :-\
The only time I've been shut out of the main lot, the school was on a break (Christmas, probably), and they were letting us park anywhere we chose.  So I've never had to investigate parking in Bexley proper.  But there's a shopping/dining district on E. Main Street just two blocks from the Cap Center, so I expect there'll be some place for everyone to park.  It might not be too bad for early-game partisans; most of the locals will probably not arrive until after the Wooster/Gettysburg game has started, and I'm not terribly concerned about overflow crowds at the OAC Indoor Track & Field Championships.  (Although that requires a lot of team buses and vans that must be parked somewhere.)

Most of us have experience parking at Wooster, and the situation seems not too different: once the Lowry Center lot is full, you're pretty much left with street parking.  What I don't know about Bexley is if street parking is metered or otherwise limited, or if there's any municipal lots within easy walking distance of the Cap Center.  It's too bad the OAC board is bereft of Capital supporters!

I watched several games at the Capital Center back when I lived in Columbus.  Capital is situated mostly in a residential neighborhood, and street parking will be available on these streets as long as you're willing to walk a few blocks.  On the residential streets, there aren't any meters.  There may be meters on Main Street- I can't remember for sure, but you can't park on Main during the afternoon rush hour period, so avoid parking on the street there (you will get ticketed/towed- they require the lane to be free to run the #2 bus on Main).  Instead, you could see if there are spaces in the commercial lots along Main, or just drive through Bexley's charming and leafy residential neighborhoods to find a place to park.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2009, 01:00:05 PM
Capital.edu's NCAA Tournament Central page (http://www.capital.edu/24228/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 03, 2009, 01:01:51 PM
Schools are not allowed to charge for video during the NCAA Tournament, to the best of my knowledge.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 03, 2009, 01:08:07 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 03, 2009, 11:17:08 AM
Most of us have experience parking at Wooster, and the situation seems not too different: once the Lowry Center lot is full, you're pretty much left with street parking. 
This is definitely true!  :)  We Wooster fans can't really complain about lack of parking...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: r.w. mcnickels on March 03, 2009, 01:16:34 PM
Quote from: waterboy on March 03, 2009, 01:48:27 AM
Dorsey is the most athletic player outside of Powers and can be a match up problem for most teams when he's on his game.

waterboy -

Just stopped in here to see what people were saying about the Wooster-Gettysburg game and was impressed with your breakdown of the Bullets.  I saw them beat F&M three times, and I still don't know how they lost eight games.  They have everyone back from last year's Sweet 16 squad and are currently playing their best ball of the season. 

I don't know much about Wooster, but if the Scots can keep Dorsey from getting hot (he can be streaky) I think it improves their chances tremendously.  When Dorsey and Capkin are BOTH hitting, the Bullets are tough to stop.  Powers is one of the more well-rounded big men I've ever seen play in the Centennial.  Best of luck to all and enjoy the games!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 03, 2009, 07:20:12 PM
I have gathered together the rosters and stats for the teams that will be playing at Capital this weekend.  They can be found here:  http://www.jtaswell.com/2009MBB/2009_MBB_Capital_Pod_Stats.htm

If anyone cares to have that information in an excel file, drop me a note and I'll be happy to send it to you!

Go Scots!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2009, 02:04:35 PM
The All-NCAC team (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mballncac.html) has been announced, and Kenyon senior Bryan Yelvington has been named Player of the Year.  Wooster's Justin Hallowell nabbed the Newcomer of the Year award, and Hiram's Steve Fleming was honored with the Coach of the Year trophy.  Here's the All-NCAC teams:

First team (listed alphabetically):
Jordan Beard, Oberlin
Marty Bidwell, Wooster
Ian Franks, Wooster
Kyle Holliday, OWU
George Raftis, Allegheny
Chris Roberts, Hiram
Wes Smith, Wabash
Bryan Yelvington, Kenyon

Second team (listed alphabetically):
Tristian Gregory, Earlham
Justin Hallowell, Wooster
Dave Knapke, Kenyon
JT Knight, Kenyon
Chris Luther, Denison
Kyle Miller, OWU
Kevin Murray, Wittenberg
Ian Pfouts, Hiram

Honorable Mention (listed alphabetically):
Nathan Balch, Wooster
Aaron Brock, Wabash
Chase Haltom, Wabash
Mike Loll, Oberlin
Pat Pellerite, OWU

Congratulations to these scholar-athletes on their achievement!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 05, 2009, 04:25:38 PM
Congrats to all the selections to make the All-conference teams this past season!  You should all be applauded!  I can't say that I'm overly surprised by the POY, NOY and COY selections. 

As far as the selections go, I have to admit, I didn't see Marty making 1st team, but it's nice to see him get the honor as the lone sr. on this year's Wooster team!  Nice to see Wooster well represented once again with 4 of their 5 starters garnering all-conference recognition!  8)

On another note, when's the last time that Hiram and Oberlin each had more all-conference represntation than Witt? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 05, 2009, 08:37:47 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 05, 2009, 04:25:38 PM

On another note, when's the last time that Hiram and Oberlin each had more all-conference represntation than Witt? 

When's the last time Witt didn't have a first teamer?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2009, 09:06:44 PM
Quote from: sac on March 05, 2009, 08:37:47 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 05, 2009, 04:25:38 PM

On another note, when's the last time that Hiram and Oberlin each had more all-conference represntation than Witt? 

When's the last time Witt didn't have a first teamer?

I think it's the first time Witt hasn't had a first-team selection while a member of the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on March 06, 2009, 05:34:13 AM
RE: ALL NCAC tEAM

Congratulations to all of the Honorees.

You"ll all exemplary both on and off the court. Soak it in for a little while.

As a Kenyon supporter, I am particularly proud of Bryan,Dave, and JT.

As a newbie, I can't comment regarding pre 07' selections. I decided not to go back and research.

Rather, I wonder if you can extrapolate from the names, schools, and class yr. about the future.

Wooster,Hiram,Wabash
Wooster,Kenyon,Denison
Wooster,Wabash,OWU

4       1       3       2      1       1 = Anticipated Returning Starters

Now isn't the time for this topic, but maybe following the Tournament.

I would like to see the NCAC Conference continue to improve overall, further I would love to see them rule the Great Lakes Region. There is no shortage of Talent and Coaching. For now, Go Wooster!

PS: Hi CC, Sophie, Cam.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 06, 2009, 06:02:04 PM
Anyone having trouble getting the video feed for the Wooster game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 06, 2009, 06:04:43 PM
I can't get it either.  OAC bastards.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 06, 2009, 06:06:48 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 06, 2009, 06:04:43 PM
I can't get it either.  OAC bastards.
Ha!  I was thinking more specifically Capital bastards!  Leave it to Cap to screw us over!!! ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 06, 2009, 06:08:30 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 06, 2009, 06:06:48 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 06, 2009, 06:04:43 PM
I can't get it either.  OAC bastards.
Ha!  I was thinking more specifically Capital bastards!  Leave it to Cap to screw us over!!! ???

I also can't get the video.  I think Capital just has a dead link on the page- or they never really intended to broadcast it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 06, 2009, 06:10:53 PM
Man, this sucks.  If you're gonna put out video, for God's sakes test it sometime earlier in the week to see if you know what you're doing.  ****.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 06, 2009, 06:29:44 PM
I can't get the video either....even after reinstalling the latest Quicktime program. >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 06, 2009, 06:34:59 PM
Gettysburg now 6-9 from deep, and who knows if they're open or contested.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 06, 2009, 06:37:48 PM
At the Half:  Gettysburg 37  Wooster 32

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 10 points, Nathan Balch with 7 points and Justin Hallowell with 6 points.

Gettysburg's top scorers are Andrew Powers with 13 points, Dan Capkin with 9 points and Corey Dorsey with 8 points.

The Bullets are shooting 58% from the floor and have made 6 three pointers.  Scots at 50% FG but only 1 of 6 on three point shots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 06, 2009, 06:48:00 PM
So far I feel like Wooster isn't quite clicking.  Balch seems to be 100% though.  I can't imagine the Scots will only shoot 6 threes in the second half, but they will need to start falling.

Gettysburg isn't really a 3-pt shooting team...I also wonder whether they can hit that same percentage for another half.  We'll see.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 06, 2009, 06:49:58 PM
At least from listening to the game :-\, the Bullets' perimeter defense seems to be for real.  I don't know if Hallowell has even attempted a trey in the first half...

Still, if I were Wooster, I wouldn't be too upset with where they sit at the half.  To only be 1 of 6 from deep and conversely to see Gettysburg come out and go 6 of 9 from deep, to only be down 5 isn't all that bad!

Wooster's defense has to improve if they want to have any chance at a comeback in the 2nd half.  They can't continue to allow Gettysburg to shoot over 50%, let alone near 60% like they did in the 1st half!

Come on Wooster!  Finish strong!  I want to come down to C'bus tomorrow night!!!  8)

At least then, I wouldn't have to worry about Cap screwing us over with their lack of a live feed...  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 06, 2009, 07:15:24 PM
7:38 left  Wooster 55  Gettysburg 51

Nathan Balch hits another three pointer and now has 18 points, 7 boards! :)

5:45 left  Wooster 61  Gettysburg 51  Geitgey hits back to back three pointers :) 
4:57 left  Wooster 63  Gettysburg 52  Balch and Bidwell both with 4 fouls
3:55 left  Wooster 63  Gettysburg 57  Bullets on a 5-0 run.
3:08 left  Wooster 65  Gettysburg 59  Scots with the ball.
2:55 left  Franks misses 2 free throws.
1:55 left  Wooster 68  Gettysburg 59  Balch hits another three pointer! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 06, 2009, 07:21:32 PM
Holy crap!  Geitgey back-to-back threes, and a ten-point lead!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 06, 2009, 07:42:02 PM
Final:  Wooster 79  Gettysburg 66  :)

Wooster advances to the 2nd round with a nice win over the Bullets!

Scots were led tonight by Nathan Balch with 21 points (14 in the 2nd half) and 7 boards.  Ian Franks had 18 points, Bryan Wickliffe added 14 points and Justin Hallowell also with 14 points.  It was great to see that Balch is fully recovered from his ankle sprain. :)

Gettysburg's top scorers were Andrew Powers with 23 points, Dan Capkin with 19 points and Corey Dorsey with 11 points.

Wooster is now 23-6.  Next up is the winner of Capital/Thomas More tomorrow night.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on March 06, 2009, 07:44:20 PM
Number 600 career win for Steve Moore?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 06, 2009, 07:59:21 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on March 06, 2009, 07:44:20 PM
Number 600 career win for Steve Moore?

Nicevilledave - great point!  I am sure Coach Moore likes getting 600 with a NCAA tourney win. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 06, 2009, 08:12:44 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 06, 2009, 07:59:21 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on March 06, 2009, 07:44:20 PM
Number 600 career win for Steve Moore?

Nicevilledave - great point!  I am sure Coach Moore likes getting 600 with a NCAA tourney win. ;D

A good win and a gutty performance for the Scots. Congratulations to all the players and Coach Moore on his 600th win!

Interesting to note that Marty Bidwell's first game as a Scot was against Kalamazoo. It was a 84-66 win for Wooster and the 500th coaching win for Coach Moore. So the trivia question is.. ( for which I do not have the answer) ... how many D3 players do you think get to play for a coach who hits two such milestones...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 06, 2009, 08:15:43 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 06, 2009, 06:29:44 PM
I can't get the video either....even after reinstalling the latest Quicktime program. >:(

FYI, I can't get a video feed for Capital's game, either.  Very frustrating.  Clearly something not working on their end.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 06, 2009, 08:22:05 PM
Well, I'm glad the feed for their own game isn't working either.  If, miraculously, if WAS, I'd be even more pissed at them.  Never liked Capital's program, not since they had two goons take potshots at Bryan Nelson years ago.  I hope Wooster beats them by fifty.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 06, 2009, 09:32:31 PM
If the Scots are fortunate enough to advance to the regionals, there were two teams that might be in line ahead of Wooster to host - John Carroll and (maybe) Centre.  However, Centre went down tonight at home to Averett.  If the Brockport State / Carnegie Mellon winner knocks off John Carroll tomorrow night and the Scots move on, I think that the regional would be at Timken Gym.

Of course, the game (likely) against Capital is still far from a sure thing...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 06, 2009, 10:04:51 PM
I have been told the Capital TM game is in OT and TM is up.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on March 06, 2009, 10:10:09 PM
Live Stats froze up on my computer with 3:54 left in OT, TMC up by 2.  No audio or video working.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on March 06, 2009, 10:13:33 PM
Final:  Capital 80 TMC 77
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2009, 12:20:28 AM
Very nice game by the Scots tonight, clearly led by Nathan Balch.  Impressive night for him, 8-9 from the field, 2-2 at the line, three 3-pointers and 7 boards.  All the key Scots contributed and Geitgey was the spark, draining the crucial three pointers to give Wooster the lead for good at the crucial moments of the second half.  This team is showing us its best basketball right now- unlike a few Wooster teams in recent years, the 08-09 group seems to be peaking at just the right moment.  Capital showed its weaknesses tonight, but Wooster did, too, such as the first half when Wooster's 3-pt. game was ineffective.  Gettysburg is a well put together basketball team and they had a fine season- winning the conference tourney and getting a bid is always a successful way to end the year.

I can't wait for a matchup that I have wanted to see for a few years tomorrow.  Capital vs. Wooster.  Should be a great game.

Regardless of what happens, every win from here on out is icing on the cake for a Wooster team that has, I think, already met or exceeded even our highest expectations from the beginning of the season.

Congrats to Coach Steve Moore on victory #600.  Great accomplishment.  Also, congrats to former Wooster standout John Ellenwood- Thomas More impressed everyone (including the Capital radio broadcasters) even in defeat.  Good luck on much more success leading the Saints!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 07, 2009, 08:36:24 AM
Tonight at the Capital Center - the irresistible force meets the immovable object! :) :P

Capital has not lost a home game all year and they are now 14-0 on their home floor.

Wooster has now won 10 games in a row and 15 of their last 16 contests.  Scots are peaking at the right time.

Included among Cap's home wins are 3 games vs. NCAC opponents (Kenyon lost 89-84, OWU lost 82-70, Witt lost 73-62).  While comparative scores are not always accurate, those results seem to suggest that tonight's game should be exciting and will probably go down to the wire.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 07, 2009, 09:18:01 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2009, 12:20:28 AM

Regardless of what happens, every win from here on out is icing on the cake for a Wooster team that has, I think, already met or exceeded even our highest expectations from the beginning of the season.

I was just talking to someone about this yesterday.  I was commenting on what a change it is for Wooster to go into the tournament with a nothing to lose mentality.  Usually the Scots are the ones with the targets on their backs.  It's kind of refreshing to see them kind of flying under the radar for a change! :)

What a nice 2nd half for Wooster last night.  Gettysburg pushed the lead to 7 on their 1st possession of the 2nd half and from there, it was all Wooster as the Scots outscored the Bullets by 20 the rest of the way!!!  Congrats to Coach Moore on achieving another great milestone!  Although, I'm sure that he would rather trade all those wins in for a chance to hang a national championship banner up in Timken!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 07, 2009, 10:04:02 AM
I just got off the phone with Capital's SID.  There will be no video of tonight's ballgame.  Technical difficulties.  Screw Capital.  I wonder, is providing live video a criteria for hosting?  Again, screw Capital.  Beat them by fifty blanking points. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 07, 2009, 10:27:43 AM
With a quick phone call, I just got a ticket held at will call for tonight's game at the Cap Center. :)

Wooster will need to hit their three pointers tonight and play some tough defense if they hope to advance to the Sweet Sixteen.  I am looking forward to seeing this showdown of the Scots and Crusaders!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 07, 2009, 03:31:23 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 07, 2009, 10:04:02 AM
I just got off the phone with Capital's SID.  There will be no video of tonight's ballgame.  Technical difficulties.  Screw Capital.  I wonder, is providing live video a criteria for hosting?  Again, screw Capital.  Beat them by fifty blanking points. 

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.health-in-action.org%2Flibrary%2Fpdf%2FShaken%2520Baby%2FImages%2FWaa%2520cry%2520baby2.jpg&hash=bb4f0a29846daef806cb4d02f2de5f600e9fbd52)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 07, 2009, 03:33:58 PM
Family business has kept me from getting around to posting since last weekend's conference finals so this is belated but still worth posting...

Congrats to the Scots on winning the tournament championship.  Sounds like the final game was well played by both sides.  Also congratulations to the Scots on the first round win and best of luck to them tonight against Capital! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 07, 2009, 03:36:17 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 07, 2009, 03:31:23 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 07, 2009, 10:04:02 AM
I just got off the phone with Capital's SID.  There will be no video of tonight's ballgame.  Technical difficulties.  Screw Capital.  I wonder, is providing live video a criteria for hosting?  Again, screw Capital.  Beat them by fifty blanking points. 

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.health-in-action.org%2Flibrary%2Fpdf%2FShaken%2520Baby%2FImages%2FWaa%2520cry%2520baby2.jpg&hash=bb4f0a29846daef806cb4d02f2de5f600e9fbd52)

Seriously. I mean, I get you that the video not working is upsetting, but grow the heck up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 07, 2009, 04:13:55 PM
I am grown up.  In my opinion, moreso than the staff at Capital, who stated that they would have video of the games but then failed to do so.  I find that very unprofessional.  You don't like me complaining, then ban me, it's what you do best, besides making sarcastic comments.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 07, 2009, 04:36:22 PM
Well, honestly, it's the violent language you use in being immature that is distressing. It's not a good fit with the philosophy of the board and honestly, it just isn't necessary. On a board with a bunch of other Wooster fans, you still have a significantly negative karma. I wonder why that is?

Someone who threatens to punch people in the mouth, who says "screw you" when something doesn't work technologically, who can't get through a game without complaining about officiating like it's some damn conspiracy ... that's not needed. It's not mature. It's not grown-up.

Thanks for the invitation. I think I will take you up on it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2009, 06:56:55 PM
Can anyone get the WQKT stream to work??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 06:59:56 PM
I'm here live at the game, and I may pop in from time to time with some comments.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on March 07, 2009, 07:01:44 PM
It's working for me...got it about 6:45.

http://wqkt.com/index.php?sports=true
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2009, 07:06:03 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on March 07, 2009, 07:01:44 PM
It's working for me...got it about 6:45.

http://wqkt.com/index.php?sports=true

Yeah, I can't get it to work, but it's ok, I'm listening to the Capital broadcast.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 07:09:42 PM
Capital is a notoriously slow-starting team, and tonight's no different.  But they're 9-1 when trailing at the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 07:31:46 PM
Cap is shooting 30%, while Wooster is at 55%, and yet the game is tied with 3:57 left in the half.  Why?  1) Wooster has 7 turnovers; 2) Cap is 11-14 at the line.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 07:40:18 PM
Halftime and it's 35-30 Wooster.  I again remind you that this is standard operating procedure for Capital, who have trailed by as many as 12 at the half (Wittenberg) and won (that game, by 11.)  I expect a barnburner in the second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2009, 07:45:54 PM
Elsewhere in the bracket, JCU leads CMU 37-35 at the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:00:10 PM
There's a lot of strength-vs.-strength here.  Stastically, almost everything Wooster is good at, Capital is almost as good at.  For instance, Wooster is 2nd in the nation in 3PFG%, but Capital is 17th.  Wooster is 34th nationally in rebound margin, but Capital is 20th.  Capital has come out hot and now leads 45-40; they're on a 12-0 run.



The run topped out at 15-0 and 18-2, but Wooster has found their sea legs again and have cut the deficit to 4, 48-44, 14:00 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:09:27 PM
Capital's Casey Brown just picked up his fourth foul and heads to the bench with 13:xx left;  this may open up the middle a little bit for Wooster's penetration.  Two point game now, Wooster ball, 12:50 left, timeout Capital.



Now working on Adam Johns (who had a surprise 22 points last night), Wickliffe drives across the lane for the nice 4 foot hook to tie the game.  After a Capital turnover, it's Wickliffe again, this time driving the baseline and drawing a foul on Quintin Mitchell.  Wickliffe at the line gives the Scots the lead with two makes.  50-48, 11:55.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2009, 08:10:40 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:09:27 PM
Capital's Casey Brown just picked up his fourth foul and heads to the bench with 13:xx left;  this may open up the middle a little bit for Wooster's penetration.  Two point game now, Wooster ball, 12:50 left, timeout Capital.

Live stats also shows Quintin Mitchell with 4 fouls for the Crusaders, that would be another middle of the lane guy that Cap can't use...and Wickliffe quickly puts up two baskets.  Tie game at 48.

And Mitchell fouls out with 12 minutes left.  Wick drains a couple free throws and he has 14.  Wooster on 10-0 run now, but Niekamp puts one back and we're tied at 50.  Then Bidwell gets a 3 to go.

So far this second half is an 18-2 run for Capital, then a 13-4 run for Wooster.  53-52 Wooster and we're at a "media" timeout.  9:22 to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:18:04 PM
I hate media timeouts.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2009, 08:19:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:18:04 PM
I hate media timeouts.....

So much so you made it your 5,000th post.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:20:57 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2009, 08:19:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:18:04 PM
I hate media timeouts.....

So much so you made it your 5,000th post.   ;)
No, it was my 4999th.  My 5000th is elsewhere.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2009, 08:25:19 PM
At another media timeout...

7:53 left, 57-54 Wooster with the edge.  Franks has Wooster's last 4, he has 13.  Niekamp at the line for an old-fashioned 3-pt play...and makes it.

Wooster by 2, 57-55.

Franks misses, then Capital converts a lay up to tie it.  Franks drives, lays it in and the foul. He'll be at the line.  He makes it.  60-57 Wooster, 6:55 left.

We trade 3-pointers.  Yoder for Cap and Balch for Wooster.  Niekamp somehow makes a lay up and the foul.  Makes the FT and it's 63 all.  This one's going to the wire....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:27:43 PM
Couple of gunslinger moments, followed by the town drunk:
Capital's Jamie Yoder buries a three from the point to tie the game, then Balch answers with a three from the left wing.  Then Niekamp drives the lane, and as Franks fouls him, he throws the ball more or less straight up in the air and it comes down on the rim, bounces twice, and drops.  The three-point play re-ties the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2009, 08:29:20 PM
Don't know if you're following this one, David.

Still close at John Carroll...67-65 JCU leads CMU with about 5 minutes left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:33:21 PM
Woster has gotten a couple of very charitable calls lately, resulting in three made free throws for the Scots, who now lead by 1 with 4:00 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2009, 08:33:32 PM
We're entering critical phase in the Capital Center...

4:10 to play with Hallowell going to the line, Wooster down 1.

Any team that can get a little 2 possession lead at this point might be able to force the other one to foul in a few minutes.  Possessions are critical right now...

FTs for Hallowell...good and good.  Wooster leads 66-65.  4 mins to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:35:23 PM
Despite Wooster's reputation for living and dying by the three-ball, they've only attempted 12 so far (making 6), while Capital has chucked up 20 of them (making 7).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:37:36 PM
Two minutes to go, one-point game.  Would you rather be the team with seven seniors, or the team with one?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:40:39 PM
Beautiful coast-to-coast drive by (sophomore) DJ Frazier gives Capital the lead.  Wickliffe is fed by Franks and draws the foul, but misses one of the FTs.  Cap 68-67, 1:15 left.  JCU up 4, :39 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:43:53 PM
After an offenisve rebound and reset, Wood draws the foul on Franks and goes to the line with :20 left.  Hits the first, and the second, Capital up 3, Wooster ball.  Balch answers with a straightaway three with 9.1 left, but Frazier wins it with a soft 8 foot runner at the horn, and the students mob the floor.  Capital is now 10-1 when trailing at the half.  Congratulations to the Cru.

JCU also wins their game at the buzzer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2009, 08:45:43 PM
That sounded like a wail of a game.  That was everything a second round game should be.  Wooster gave Capital everything they could handle, and vice versa.  Fantastic finish.

I'm proud of the Scots, and good luck to the Crusaders in the Sweet 16.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 07, 2009, 09:05:16 PM
What a ride for the Scots in the last few weeks.  With a very young team, Wooster has won a lot of ballgames, and has done a lot of growing up.  The lone senior Marty Bidwell will be missed, and the rest of this group has a very bright future.  I'm proud of what this team has accomplished!

As for Capital, congrats to them on a great game; I wish them well against a Texas opponent in the next round.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on March 07, 2009, 09:14:50 PM
Congrats to Wooster on a season which has exceeded all expectations, unless you leave Steve Moore out of the equation, which you obviously can't .
I fear that this brief tournament run has solidified the foundation of a fearsome dynasty. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2009, 10:55:13 PM
I never did get the Wooster/WQKT broadcast to work tonight.  Anything interesting in the post-game show from Coach Moore?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 07, 2009, 11:01:21 PM
Congratulations to senior Marty Bidwell on a great Wooster career!  Wooster won four NCAC championships during his 4 years and his leadership, strong defense and assists will be missed.

Wooster played a terrific game tonight but came up just short at the end.  The Scots exceeded all expectations this season with a team that had freshmen and sophomores scoring over 80% of the total points.

This NCAA tourney run was good experience for all of Wooster's young players and should serve the Scots well in the next couple of seasons.  Two guys in street clothes at the Cap Center tonight should make a big impact next year - Brandon Johnson and Gideon Mabeny.

Good luck to the remaining Ohio teams in the NCAA tourney - Capital and John Carroll.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 11:42:08 PM
It's always dangerous to project the end of one season onto the beginning of another, but Scots fans may be encouraged by how Bryan Wickliffe, Justin Hallowell, and Nathan Balch ended their seasons.  A night after hitting 8 for 9, including 3 of 4 from long range, Balch was again fearless tonight, nailing four of five treys including the clutch trey to tie the game with 9.1 seconds left.  He also used several baseline drives to create offense and get to the foul line, where he was 4 of 4.  Hallowell has added an inside game to go with his outside game.  He was the main focus of both Gettysburg's and Capital's defense, and they basically took away his three (he took just one tonight, and hit it), but he compensated with some very nice drives straight to the hoop.  He had 22 points on the weekend, hitting 6 of 11 shots (4 of 6 in the paint) and eight free throws.  He was also strong on the defensive glass, with 14 rebounds on the two games.  And Wickliffe, who had a very strong defensive year but was mostly MIA on offense, really stepped up his game in his hometown.  His weekend tally was 30 points on 11 for 18 shooting and 8 for 11 free throws, to which he added 12 rebounds and 3 blocks.  A lot of people have been hoping to see more inside game from Hallowell and more offense from Wickliffe, and both delivered this weekend, raising hopes that next year could be a special one.

One final comment on the Scots.  Yes, they exceeded the expectations most of us had for this team.  As Coach Moore says, they faced a great deal of adversity and even tragedy and overcame it to produce a fantastic season.  It was a heck of a run, and they should be proud--and we should be proud of them.  But take a moment to look at tonight's box score (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/boxes/2008-09/capital.php).  Wooster shot 51.1% and held Capital to 40.4%.  They were 7 of 13 (54%) from the arc, and 17 of 22 (77%) from the free throw line.  They were outrebounded by just two boards against a bigger, stronger team, and had 30 points in the paint to Cap's 24.  This is not the box score of a team that lost, except that they did, in fact, lose, somehow.  The game-changing stat was that Capital had 14 offensive rebounds leading to 17 second-chance points (vs. 5 and 7, respectively, for the Scots), but even that is misleading, as a number of those second-chance points came from long rebounds and offensive resets.  In other words, the stats suggest that Capital was dominant on the offensive glass, but the game didn't really feel that way (to me, at least.)  Wooster played a terrific game at both ends of the floor, and still came up one runner short against a very good team.  I don't know if it's tougher to lose a game that stats say you should have won, or if there's some solace in knowing that you went down with your best game and were beaten by a better team. 

So congratulations to the Scots, and best of luck to the Crusaders.  The last two teams to knock the Scots out of the NCAAs went on to win the Walnut and Bronze, so maybe Capital is just starting a magical playoff run!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 08, 2009, 12:26:25 AM
All I have to say is that was one heck of a basketball game tonight down in Bexley!  Even though the Scots came up on the short end tonight, this was one of those games where you hated to see anyone lose.  I thought both of these teams played at a really high level throughout the entire game as the closeness throughout the game attests. 


Quote from: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:37:36 PM
Two minutes to go, one-point game.  Would you rather be the team with seven seniors, or the team with one?
Well, it depends on how you are looking at things.  I choose to look at it from a future perspective and I would rather be the team with just one senior.  Cap has a major rebuilding project on their hands after this season.  Meanwhile, Wooster with just one senior nearly knocked off Cap and their 7 seniors on their home floor!  And I really can't fault Wooster's youth as the reason they lost this game.  I think it was just the fact that Cap seems to be in one of these games on about a weekly basis and they continue to pull wins out of their arses...

It would have been nice to see Wooster continue their post season run a little further, but it is comforting to know that not only will everyone be back except Bidwell.  But there is the addition of Brandon Johnson and the 7 footer Mabeny!  The future indeed looks bright up on the hill!!!  8)

Congrats to Capital in doing what seems to be routine and that is winning in the clutch this season.  Good luck the rest of the way!  Could very well be an all OAC elite 8 matchup.  More than we can say for the WIAC after tonight...   :P

Lastly, I just wanted to congratulate the Scots and thank them for giving us fans yet another successful season.  A 5th straight outright NCAC regular season title.  A conference tournament title.  Advancing to the 2nd round of the NCAA tournament.  Picking up yet another milestone for Coach Steve Moore.  And all the while doing it with an extremely young and relatively inexperienced team that didn't fold when things started off a bit shaky at the beginning of the year.  Instead, they really came together as a team and showed a lot of growth and improvement and have us all (well all of us Wooster supporters that is  ;) ) very excited about what the future holds for this group of talented players!

And I also wanted to give a shout out to the Wooster fans!  If we didn't outnumber the Cap supporters in their OWN GYM, it was pretty damn close to being an even split!  And Cap can thank their lucky stars that they had such an early spring break, because without their students, it would have been about 2-1 in Wooster's favor.  I'll bet that there were close to 1000 Wooster fans in attendance tonight.  The best part was when the Cap students would start their 'Let's go Cap' chant and the Wooster contingent would drown them out with our 'Let's go Scots' chant!  8)  That's got to make the players feel good when they walk out as the visitors and see that they have more fans in the stands than the home team does!

BTW, did that Cap mascot freak anyone else out???  My daughters were scared of it...  :P  That face reminded me of Arnold Schwarzenegger in Total Recall when his eyes were popping out of his head from being outside of the controlled atmosphere on Mars...  ;D  Freaky looking crusader dude...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 08, 2009, 12:48:54 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 08, 2009, 12:26:25 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 07, 2009, 08:37:36 PM
Two minutes to go, one-point game.  Would you rather be the team with seven seniors, or the team with one?
Well, it depends on how you are looking at things.  I choose to look at it from a future perspective and I would rather be the team with just one senior.  Cap has a major rebuilding project on their hands after this season. 

Rebuilding next year or not, Capital has a shot at the ultimate prize right now.  If the cost of winning a championship is a few years of mediocrity, I'm paying that cost in a cocaine heartbeat.  Championships never, ever go away.  If I get to see Wabash win a national championship, any amount of suffering I may have endured before and after said championship will have been 100% worth it.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 08, 2009, 01:00:48 AM
David- Great post that really captures most everything I was thinking about this Wooster team and the result tonight.  +K

Many months from now, it will be fun to watch this Scots team play again.  While I'll miss the always-on enthusiasm and energy of Marty Bidwell, I think all us Scots fans are interested to see how Brandon Johnson will add onto the nucleus established this season.  Johnson averages more points-per-game than Bidwell, so the Scots could actually "return" more than 100% of its offensive production from this year.

For now, though, we get to enjoy rooting our OAC brethren on toward the Final Four.  (Someone needs to, since the OAC mens board is essentially an echo chamber...)   :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on March 08, 2009, 06:43:31 AM
My Congratulations go to the Wooster Squad on an Outstanding Season. I look forward to seeing you all again next year.

Earlier yesterday afternoon, during a discussion of Capital's team. It was noted that they seemingly are a very lucky team.
Winning many games in the final minute or so of regulation or ot.  After hearing post game comments, and reading this mornings Columbus Dispatch; the real anwser presented itself. First- You make your own luck. Second they plan for it. Third they stick to the plan Fourth the practise the plan Fifth they don't panic and the expect the plan to work.


Seems so Simple........ but  Execution...........

Oh, and Senior leadership sure is a Blessing.

Hey Pat: What is this Karma thing , and how does it get acquired, earned, awarded?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 08, 2009, 09:18:18 AM
Anytime you lose a postseason game that you could claim as yours as much as your opponent, it hurts. This reminds me of 2006 a little bit when Wooster lost to Transylvania in the second round, a game they felt like they should have had. Wooster followed up the next season by going to the Final Four.

Can anyone who was at the game comment on why Balch didn't get more shots? Considering how hot he has been the last several games he has played (including last night), it would seem like they should have made more of an effort to get him involved. Was he being watched closely, or did he just get lost in the flow a little bit?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2009, 11:27:10 AM
Mark:  Karma. (http://www.d3hoops.com/faq.php?question=41)

Seinfeld:  Capital coach Damon Goodwin explained after the game that his goal was to hold Wooster to six threes.  His thinking was that it was likely going to be a close game, and converting four of Wooster's baskets from threes to twos (Wooster averaged 10.2 made threes per game this year) would be worth four points that could make the difference.  It was admittedly a "pick your poison" strategy, since extending the defense and running at the three-point shooters left the lane open for drives by Hallowell, Franks, and Balch, and for passes into Wickliffe in the post.  As Steve Moore pointed out after the game, Wooster's offense was very good last night, making 1.1 points per possession mostly on layups and short jumpers; in my opinion it would have been foolish to try to force contested threes when easier avenues to the bucket were available.  Still, Coach Goodwim's strategy appears to have paid off--if Wooster had made their usual 10 threes instead of the seven they did make, all other things being equal, the outcome would have been different. 

I definitely would not say that Balch (or Hallowell, who took just one shot from beyond the arc) got "lost in the flow".  (In fact, Balch's attempts were right on his season averages: 8 overall, 5 from the arc vs. 7.8 and 4.2 for the season and 9.1 and 4.8 in conference play.)  He was being defended closely at the arc, which is what allowed him to drive the baseline numerous times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 08, 2009, 11:39:32 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 08, 2009, 09:18:18 AM
Can anyone who was at the game comment on why Balch didn't get more shots? Considering how hot he has been the last several games he has played (including last night), it would seem like they should have made more of an effort to get him involved. Was he being watched closely, or did he just get lost in the flow a little bit?
He was definitely being guarded closely!  He had a shadow all night.  Both he and Hallowell had shadows.  I think it was quite obvious that Cap wanted to take away Wooster's best offensive weapon and that is the 3-point shot and they were really tightly defending the perimeter.  And as a result, it opened things up inside for Wickliffe and he made them pay by playing by far his best game of the season.  It was very nice to see Wooster take what Capital was giving them and pound the ball inside when the outside game wasn't there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 11, 2009, 01:18:58 AM
I see that Muhlenberg's head coach, Dave Madiera, has decided to retire (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2009/03/10/muhlenberg-mens-coach-retires.html).  If I've done my math right, Madiera was an assistant to Steve Moore at Muhlenberg for the five years that Moore was in Allentown, then took over when Moore came to Wooster.  Madeira amassed 311 wins in his 22 years guiding the Mules and retires as their all-time winningest coach.  I wish him a long and happy retirement.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 14, 2009, 09:57:58 AM
St. Thomas and Farmingdale State are among the eight teams to advance to tonight's sectional finals.  Wooster fans got a sneak preview of what could be two Final Four teams last year when both these teams participated in the season-opening Van Wie Classic (http://athletics.wooster.edu/mb/archives/2007-08/schedule.php) at Wooster.  Both teams beat Otterbein and both lost to Wooster, playing their first games since a Final Four of their own.  I recall being impressed with Farmingdale, which was the "who are those guys?" entrant in a confab that included three coaches at or approaching 600 wins (Otterbein's Reynolds, UST's Fritz, and Wooster's Moore).

What little dialogue we had about those games begins here (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4200.msg808970#msg808970), for anyone interested.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 15, 2009, 12:51:42 AM
Well, in another example of how unfair the brackets were this year, Franklin &  Marshall   is going to Salem.    Why should we care you might be wondering?  Because Gettysburg beat them 3 times this season and they weren't even that close of games.  Yes, the same Gettysburg that Wooster outscored by almost 20 points in the 2nd half of their NCAA 1st round tournament game, beat F&M by an average of almost 10 ppg in their three wins over the Diplomats this season.  Yet Gettysburg gets shipped to the GL and gets ousted by Wooster in the opening round of the tournament while F&M takes advantage of their weak bracket and waltzes their way to Salem...  ::)

And this leaves us with about the most anti-climactic final 4 that I can recall from recent memory.   I think the only suspense left now is just how large the margin of victory will be for WashU.  That is, assuming they have anything left after coming out of the bracket of death.  Unfortunately for the other 3 participants, WashU at 80% is still better than the other three...

And before anyone jumps on me, yes I know upsets do happen and that's why they play the games and stranger things have happened, I just don't see it happening in this Final 4.  All WashU has done on their way to Salem is beat a ranked opponent in every single round including #8, #3, and #1 respectively in the last 3 rounds!  :o  I'm sorry, but I just don't see any of the other 3 participants having what it takes to knock off the defending champs...

Of course, I'm still smarting after that Cap loss last week.  Especially seeing what went down up in the Heights this past weekend.  I really think that Wooster would have matched up pretty good with UT-D and Guilford.  I really thought if they could just get by Cap, they could have a real good shot at making a run to Salem.  Oh well.  We'll never know now.  And in all reality, it would have been ahead of schedule anyways as young as this team is!  8)        
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 17, 2009, 09:56:23 PM
Several NCAC athletes were honored today by being named part of the D3Hoops.com All Great Lakes (http://www.d3hoops.com/all-region/09/glakemen.htm) team.  NCAC Player of the Year Bryan Yelvington of Kenyon was placed on the second team, while Wooster's Ian Franks, OWU's Kyle Holliday, and Allegheny's George Raftis earned third team recognition.  Also an NCAC athlete was named the region's Rookie of the Year for the second consecutive year.  This year's honoree is Wooster's Justin Hallowell.  Congratulations to all five of these players!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 20, 2009, 08:56:22 PM
Congratulations to OWU's Kyle Holliday and Kenyon's Bryan Yelvington for their inclusion on the NABC Great Lakes All-District Team (http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/nabc/genrel/auto_pdf/D3all-district.pdf).  Holliday was named to the second team, while Yelvington was placed on the first team, which makes him eligible for All-America consideration from the NABC.  Stay tuned for that All-America announcement.  :)



And just like that, the NABC posts their D3 All-America Team (http://nabc.cstv.com/auto_pdf/p_hotos/s_chools/nabc/genrel/auto_pdf/D3All-America), and Bryan Yelvington is there on the third team.  This award caps Bryan's outstanding career at Kenyon and is a well-deserved honor.  Congratulations, Bryan!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 21, 2009, 09:03:56 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 20, 2009, 08:56:22 PM
And just like that, the NABC posts their D3 All-America Team (http://nabc.cstv.com/auto_pdf/p_hotos/s_chools/nabc/genrel/auto_pdf/D3All-America), and Bryan Yelvington is there on the third team.  This award caps Bryan's outstanding career at Kenyon and is a well-deserved honor.  Congratulations, Bryan!

Very nice award for Bryan Yelvington - Congratulations to the Lords big man! :)


On a separate note, which of these 3 players was most deserving to be on the NABC Great Lakes 2nd Team? ::)

Player #1  15.5 Points/game,  48.9% Field Goal Shooting,  4.2 Rebounds/game,  3.4 Assists/game

Player #2  14.2 Points/game,  45.8% Field Goal Shooting,  2.4 Rebounds/game,  1.0 Assists/game

Player #3  12.9 Points/game,  34.6% Field Goal Shooting,  3.6 Rebounds/game,  2.3 Assists/game


Ian Franks, Wooster's leading scorer, is Player #1 and he was not selected!  He had the best stats in all 4 categories.

Ryan Wood from Capital is Player #2 and he was selected.  Wood was #2 scorer on Cap's team but Franks had the better stats.

Caleb Veldhouse from Calvin is Player #3 with a dreadful shooting percentage of only 34.6% and yet he was also selected.


When his better performance so clearly justifies it, why was Ian Franks not selected? :o  Well..er..umm..he is only a Sophomore! :P

So, apparently it is far more important in the NABC's mind to award the average performance of Seniors (Veldhouse, Wood) than the excellent performance of a Sophomore?  IMO, the NABC should be embarassed that they put a player shooting only 34.6% from the floor on their 2nd team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 21, 2009, 10:55:56 AM
wooscotsfan,

Good observation. And I thought only the NCAC had it in their by-laws that seniors are automatically given preference. A version of political correctness has entered into these types of awards, where you have to take care of the veterans first. Of course we won't go into the joke that is the NCAC Player of the Week honors.

On a different note, this is probably a good time (or a bad time if you are a frustrated Wooster fan) to mention that Aaron Thompson of Washington U. nearly went to Wooster. He went to Elida high school in Ohio, the same school as former Scot players Matt Smith and Rodney Mitchell. Thompson's high school coach works at Wooster's summer camp every year, and even his older sister went to Wooster. Instead, he has been to the Final Four all three years of his career, and can be a part of back-to-back national champions. I'm happy for his success, but it does sting a little for a Wooster fan who has not seen his team even make the national championship game despite being the second-winningest team in Div. III history.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: JohnDaly on March 21, 2009, 11:45:30 AM
What about Player #4: 17.1 Points/game, 50.2% from the field (40% from 3), 5.4 boards/game, 2.3 assists/game and 1.7 steals/game.

In our own version of a "blind resume" this player is Hiram's Chris Roberts  :o. Better than all the players in all the categories except assists. I think this is the best arguement over any of the other players listed. I am just saying this to make a point that most colleges can probably put up a legitimate "beef" for some of their guys. This should just give the players a reason to work even harder in the off-season.

I cant wait for next season, with so much young talent in the conference, and a lot of game experience under their belts, should make things very exciting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on March 22, 2009, 09:36:49 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 21, 2009, 10:55:56 AM
wooscotsfan,

Good observation. And I thought only the NCAC had it in their by-laws that seniors are automatically given preference. A version of political correctness has entered into these types of awards, where you have to take care of the veterans first. Of course we won't go into the joke that is the NCAC Player of the Week honors.

On a different note, this is probably a good time (or a bad time if you are a frustrated Wooster fan) to mention that Aaron Thompson of Washington U. nearly went to Wooster. He went to Elida high school in Ohio, the same school as former Scot players Matt Smith and Rodney Mitchell. Thompson's high school coach works at Wooster's summer camp every year, and even his older sister went to Wooster. Instead, he has been to the Final Four all three years of his career, and can be a part of back-to-back national champions. I'm happy for his success, but it does sting a little for a Wooster fan who has not seen his team even make the national championship game despite being the second-winningest team in Div. III history.

Political correctness - the misguided belief that it is possible to pick up a turd from the clean end.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 22, 2009, 11:21:23 AM
Congratulations to Wooster's Justin Hallowell, who has been named the national Rookie of the Year (http://www.d3hoops.com/all-american/menallam09.htm) by D3Hoops.com.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 22, 2009, 11:30:54 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 22, 2009, 11:21:23 AM
Congratulations to Wooster's Justin Hallowell, who has been named the national Rookie of the Year (http://www.d3hoops.com/all-american/menallam09.htm) by D3Hoops.com.   :)

Wow!  Congrats to Justin.  Great Lakes region and national Rookie of the Year- I guess teams will know about him next season.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on April 02, 2009, 07:54:11 PM
Wooster alum and former OWU assistant John Ellenwood has been hired to coach Ashland U. (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2009/04/02/thomas-more-coach-gets-d-ii-job.html) next season.  Ellenwood turned the Thomas More program around in his three years in Crestview Hills, capping it off this season with regular season and PrAC tournament championships.  His Saints then forced Capital, unbeaten at home, to overtime in an NCAA first-round thriller.  Congratulations to John on his new job, as well as on the birth of his daughter Mollie, born to John and his wife Abbi on the first.   ;D

AU press release (http://www.ashland.edu/athletics/press-news.php?pressID=1454)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on April 03, 2009, 11:03:31 AM
The awards keep pouring in for Bryan Yelvington and Justin Hallowell, this time from DIII News. (http://bearsports.wustl.edu/mensbball/D3NApril09FINAL.pdf)  This publication has named Yelvington to their All-America team (5th team), and Hallowell to their all-Freshman team.  Congratulations to both!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on April 04, 2009, 09:05:10 PM
Another NCAC grad joins the head coaching ranks, as Shaka Smart (Kenyon '99) becomes the head coach at Virginia Commonwealth University.  Kenyon press release. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x29969.xml)  Congratulations, Coach Smart!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on April 26, 2009, 09:32:42 PM
Posted this on the football board as well. The rumor I've heard is that Earlham is leaving the NCAC for the HCAC at the end of the 09-10 academic year. Can anyone confirm this?

If this does happen, DePauw makes the most sense to join. If not them, I would go after Washington & Jefferson. If neither of those work, we can always go back to nine schools, which it was before Wabash and Hiram joined. Would make for a more balanced schedule in both football and basketball if nothing else.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on April 26, 2009, 09:47:57 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on April 26, 2009, 09:32:42 PM
Posted this on the football board as well. The rumor I've heard is that Earlham is leaving the NCAC for the HCAC at the end of the 09-10 academic year. Can anyone confirm this?

If this does happen, DePauw makes the most sense to join. If not them, I would go after Washington & Jefferson. If neither of those work, we can always go back to nine schools, which it was before Wabash and Hiram joined. Would make for a more balanced schedule in both football and basketball if nothing else.

Yup, I've heard the same thing, although I wasn't sure of the year!  I agree that DePauw easily makes the most sense.  And while those trips to Allegheny would be rough, it would still have to be better for them than some of the trips that they must make in the SCAC.  And it would be great to keep a team in the conference relatively close to 'Bash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on April 27, 2009, 11:05:56 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on April 26, 2009, 09:47:57 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on April 26, 2009, 09:32:42 PM
Posted this on the football board as well. The rumor I've heard is that Earlham is leaving the NCAC for the HCAC at the end of the 09-10 academic year. Can anyone confirm this?

If this does happen, DePauw makes the most sense to join. If not them, I would go after Washington & Jefferson. If neither of those work, we can always go back to nine schools, which it was before Wabash and Hiram joined. Would make for a more balanced schedule in both football and basketball if nothing else.

Yup, I've heard the same thing, although I wasn't sure of the year!  I agree that DePauw easily makes the most sense.  And while those trips to Allegheny would be rough, it would still have to be better for them than some of the trips that they must make in the SCAC.  And it would be great to keep a team in the conference relatively close to 'Bash.
And it would heat up that rivalry even moreso as they would again be conference rivals...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on April 27, 2009, 04:05:37 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on April 27, 2009, 11:05:56 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on April 26, 2009, 09:47:57 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on April 26, 2009, 09:32:42 PM
Posted this on the football board as well. The rumor I've heard is that Earlham is leaving the NCAC for the HCAC at the end of the 09-10 academic year. Can anyone confirm this?

If this does happen, DePauw makes the most sense to join. If not them, I would go after Washington & Jefferson. If neither of those work, we can always go back to nine schools, which it was before Wabash and Hiram joined. Would make for a more balanced schedule in both football and basketball if nothing else.

Yup, I've heard the same thing, although I wasn't sure of the year!  I agree that DePauw easily makes the most sense.  And while those trips to Allegheny would be rough, it would still have to be better for them than some of the trips that they must make in the SCAC.  And it would be great to keep a team in the conference relatively close to 'Bash.
And it would heat up that rivalry even moreso as they would again be conference rivals...

If wishing made it so....

Wabash vs. DePauw is a great rivalry even as is, but I would by lying if I said that it isn't significantly different in the 11 academic years since DePauw joined up with the SCAC.  Of couse Wabash always wants to beat DePauw and vice versa, but over the last decade, in the biggest picture, the results of those games haven't been terribly important.  I'd love to see the two institutions once again competing against each other in games that count for more than just bragging rights....and this is the first time in a decade that the possibility even seems remotely plausible.  I think such a move would benefit both DePauw and the NCAC, but we'll see.  It's all just speculation for now. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on May 07, 2009, 01:13:00 PM
Basketball season may be long over, but the awards and honors keep rolling in for OWU's Kyle Holliday.  Now comes word that Kyle has been named a recipient of a prestigious NCAA Postgraduate Scholarship (http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/mbb09pg.html).  Kyle is one of just 29 male winter sports athletes, and one of just two D3 men's basketball players, to receieve the award this year.  Once again, congratulations Kyle!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on May 07, 2009, 01:36:39 PM
The others, for those interested:
http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2009/05/06/four-d-iii-players-earn-ncaa-postgrad-scholarships.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on May 07, 2009, 08:41:15 PM
I know Wooster's official schedule hasn't been released yet, but I do know that Washington (Mo.) will be coming to Wooster for one of its tournament's, most likely the Mose Hole. I'm sure they are not scheduled to play in the first round, but if they meet in the title game, that should be one heavyweight match up. Assuming that both get off to good starts (a pretty good bet with the returning talent of both teams), there is a good chance both teams will be in the Top-10 when they meet.

I could be easily missing a team, but off the top of my head, has Wooster played a defending national champion the following year?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on May 08, 2009, 10:22:43 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on May 07, 2009, 08:41:15 PM
I could be easily missing a team, but off the top of my head, has Wooster played a defending national champion the following year?
I can't recall any times where Wooster has played the defending national champions the following year, but this won't be the first time a defending national champion has been invited to one of Wooster's annual tournaments.  Calvin played in the Mose Hole the year following their national championship run of 1999-20000 but they lost to Chicago in the 1st round.  It was supposed to be a bit of a revenge game for the drubbing the Scots recieved up at Calvin during their championship run in the 2nd round of the NCAA tournament.  Not getting that revenge game with Calvin didn't really bother the Scots though, as they went on to thump Chicago in surprisingly easy fashion in the finals of the Mose Hole that year.  8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on May 10, 2009, 08:41:08 AM
This looks like a very tough schedule to challenge the experienced Scots.  St. Thomas is coming to the Al Van Wie Classic in November, and Wash. U. is coming to the Mose Hole after Christmas. 

There's a rematch of the second-round NCAA game at John Carroll (away, again).  Other non-conference games include Ohio Northern (home) and Albion (away, the season opener).

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4584481 (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4584481) (about halfway down)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on May 10, 2009, 09:58:37 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on May 10, 2009, 08:41:08 AM
This looks like a very tough schedule to challenge the experienced Scots.  St. Thomas is coming to the Al Van Wie Classic in November, and Wash. U. is coming to the Mose Hole after Christmas. 

There's a rematch of the second-round NCAA game at John Carroll (away, again).  Other non-conference games include Ohio Northern (home) and Albion (away, the season opener).

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4584481 (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4584481) (about halfway down)

Should be some tough tests for the Scots this year!

In recruiting news, it looks like the Scots have landed 2 players that should be able to help inside.

Jake Mays from Tallmadge: 6-8, 17 points 10.8 boards and 4.6 blocks per game, 2nd team all-district http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sfHPndBppaE

Josh Claytor from Talawanda HS: 6-7, 23.3 points and 11.9 rebounds per game.  Butler County player of the year (Middletown Journal), 3rd team all-district.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on May 10, 2009, 10:23:40 AM
Fantastic 50,

I think you are confusing John Carroll with Capital. The last time Wooster played John Carroll was the Sweet 16 game of the 2007 tournament.

Potential games against St. Thomas and Washington are great, but in the grand scheme of things, they only mean something in terms of where Wooster stacks up nationally and for the D3Hoops.com poll. Because of the silly NCAA selection criteria, these games virtually mean nothing.

The games with Albion, and especially ONU and JCU are huge. Lose both, and an at-large bid is in serious jeopardy already. Win both, and you are in great position to be a first-round host, which is what I'm guessing is part of the strategy in scheduling these tougher games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on May 10, 2009, 12:25:05 PM
Wooster has a chance to exorcise a number of demons in that opener at Albion.  The last time the Scots played at Kresge Gym, things got a little intense.

So here's the complete non-conference schedule, lacking only the teams/pairings from the three tournaments:
Unspecified exhibition game (home)
at Albion
Van Wie Classic (UST + two others)
at Randolph-Macon tournament (RMC + two others)
Ohio Northern
at John Carroll
Mose Hole Classic (WUSTL + two others)

Congratulations to all of the award-winners at the Scots' banquet, including any who may be reading this.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on May 10, 2009, 01:38:47 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on May 10, 2009, 10:23:40 AM
I think you are confusing John Carroll with Capital. The last time Wooster played John Carroll was the Sweet 16 game of the 2007 tournament.

Yes, I did get those two mixed up...

Quote from: seinfeld on May 10, 2009, 10:23:40 AM
Potential games against St. Thomas and Washington are great, but in the grand scheme of things, they only mean something in terms of where Wooster stacks up nationally and for the D3Hoops.com poll. Because of the silly NCAA selection criteria, these games virtually mean nothing.

In my mind, the benefit of those games is having the Scots experienced for March by playing the best early in the season.  Win or lose, those battles will help an already experienced team grow; hopefully, Wooster will be prepared to make a deep NCAA tournament run.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on May 11, 2009, 10:47:46 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on May 08, 2009, 10:22:43 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on May 07, 2009, 08:41:15 PM
I could be easily missing a team, but off the top of my head, has Wooster played a defending national champion the following year?
I can't recall any times where Wooster has played the defending national champions the following year, but this won't be the first time a defending national champion has been invited to one of Wooster's annual tournaments.
Obviously, Wooster played OWU following their 1988 national championship. In fact, the Scots took two of three (regular season split and a win in the NCAC tournament) that year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on May 14, 2009, 12:39:42 PM
Hmmmm.
Something just occurred to me.

Wooster's season-opener at Albion is scheduled for Nov. 15, which is the first day of the season according to the NCAA, under a new rule adopted this past season (under the old rule,the first day of the season had been the Friday before Thanksgiving, which would be Nov. 20 this year.)  Last season, Wittenberg had a game scheduled vs. Transylvania for Nov. 19, and my understanding is that the NCAC Presidents told Bill Brown he had to reschedule, as they would not permit such an early game, NCAA be damned.  (See discussion here (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4200.msg1023265#msg1023265).)  Witt ended up rescheduling that game for a Friday in January, a terrible time, and it was subsequently snowed out and replaced with a last-minute game vs. IU-East.  (Kenyon and Allegheny also had "early" games which went on as scheduled, but those were tournaments, whereas Witt's game was a single game.)  I recall that Coach Brown, who had a tough enough season as it was, was somewhat less than thrilled with the league office as a result of these shenanigans. 

So does this mean that the conference is now going to allow schools to schedule up to the limit of the NCAA's approved schedule?  Or might it mean that Wooster gets preferential treatment by the league office (perish the thought?)  Of course, it could also be that the Daily Record reported the date of that Albion game wrong, but that seems unlikely if only because they also note that the Van Wie Classic will be the following weekend, Nov. 20-21, and those dates are almost surely correct.

Something to ponder during the long offseason.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on June 08, 2009, 11:01:35 AM
A thread on JJHuddle about a recruit has coming in next year -- David Hieber.

http://www.jjhuddle.com/forums/showthread.php?t=206375
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on June 08, 2009, 12:13:17 PM
Devin Fulk has joined the basketball coaching ranks.  He was hired at Heath HS to be their next head basketball coach:

Fulk hired as Heath boys hoops coach (http://www.newarkadvocate.com/article/20090604/UPDATES04/90604021)

Congrats to Devin and good luck as you begin your coaching career!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on June 12, 2009, 09:32:29 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on June 08, 2009, 11:01:35 AM
A thread on JJHuddle about a recruit has coming in next year -- David Hieber.

http://www.jjhuddle.com/forums/showthread.php?t=206375

thanks for the link

If anyone is interested, the News-Sun published Witt's recruits yesterday(June 11).

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/springfield-oh-sports/wittenberg-university-tigers/wittenberg-basketball-gets-help-on-the-perimeter-157713.html



http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/springfield-oh-sports/wittenberg-university-tigers/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on June 12, 2009, 01:17:14 PM
Quote from: David JablonskiLucas McKean, a 6-1 guard from Northwestern High in Wayne County, averaged 17 points and 4 assists last season.
Ouch.  Is this revenge for James Cooper?  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on June 12, 2009, 06:45:09 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on June 12, 2009, 01:17:14 PM
Quote from: David JablonskiLucas McKean, a 6-1 guard from Northwestern High in Wayne County, averaged 17 points and 4 assists last season.
Ouch.  Is this revenge for James Cooper?  :D
How did Coach Cline, Dustin Geitgey and Kaleb Reed let this kid go to the dark side???  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on June 14, 2009, 08:38:59 AM
This sucks:  http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4607812
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on June 14, 2009, 08:57:04 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on June 14, 2009, 08:38:59 AM
This sucks:  http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4607812

Wow!  That's definitely a tough break for the Scots.  Here's wishing Brandon a speedy recovery, but I would think its gotta be pretty tougher to come back from a repeat injury.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on June 15, 2009, 12:51:32 PM
Sad news. Dennis Collins, commissioner of the NCAC, passed away yesterday from a heart attack:

http://www.northcoast.org/news/collins.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on June 16, 2009, 03:02:06 PM
RIP, Dennis.  He was the only commissioner in the conference's 25 year history.  My condolences to his family and friends.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on June 17, 2009, 08:23:06 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on June 16, 2009, 03:02:06 PM
RIP, Dennis.  He was the only commissioner in the conference's 25 year history.  My condolences to his family and friends.

Nice article in the Columbus Dispatch (http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/sports/stories/2009/06/17/ncac_collins.ART_ART_06-17-09_C7_ALE719B.html?sid=101) this morning.  Dennis' dedication to the NCAC will clearly be missed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 17, 2009, 04:47:07 PM
Dennis Collin's service to the NCAC was also noted in the Plain Dealer/Cleveland.com.

Here is the link: http://www.cleveland.com/sports/college/index.ssf/2009/06/dennis_collins_executive_direc.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 17, 2009, 11:13:09 PM
With some internet sleuthing, here are some of the tournament teams for Wooster's upcoming season:

Van Wie Tourney - St. Thomas, Heidelberg and Carnegie Mellon.  Source is CMU's website which does not list the first round matchups.  CMU graduated 3 of their starters from last year's squad that beat the Scots.

At Randolph Macon Tourney - looks to be the Briggs Elliott Classic on 12/13 and 12/14.  In addition to host RMC and Wooster, this tourney appears on North Carolina Wesleyan's schedule with no first round matchups listed....so the 4th team is still a mystery.

Mose Hole Tourney - first round matchups are Washington University vs. Transylvania and Wooster vs. Kalamazoo.  First round matchups now appear on both the Wash U. and Transy schedules.  Possible Wash - Woo championship game could be a great contest if it occurs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on June 17, 2009, 11:19:57 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on June 17, 2009, 11:13:09 PM

At Randolph Macon Tourney - looks to be the Briggs Elliott Classic on 12/13 and 12/14.  In addition to host RMC and Wooster, this tourney appears on North Carolina Wesleyan's schedule with no first round matchups listed....so the 4th team is still a mystery.


I believe that the 4th team in the Randolph Macon tourney will be Alvernia
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on June 19, 2009, 01:53:29 PM
Wittenberg has its schedule posted...

http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html)

Nov. 20-21  at Gettysburg tournament
Nov. 24  vs. Capital
Dec. 19  at Ohio Northern
Dec. 29-30  Home tournament (vs. Olivet in first round)
Jan. 23  vs. Wooster
Feb. 13  at Wooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on June 19, 2009, 09:06:40 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on June 17, 2009, 11:13:09 PM
With some internet sleuthing, here are some of the tournament teams for Wooster's upcoming season:

Van Wie Tourney - St. Thomas, Heidelberg and Carnegie Mellon.  Source is CMU's website which does not list the first round matchups.  CMU graduated 3 of their starters from last year's squad that beat the Scots.

At Randolph Macon Tourney - looks to be the Briggs Elliott Classic on 12/13 and 12/14.  In addition to host RMC and Wooster, this tourney appears on North Carolina Wesleyan's schedule with no first round matchups listed....so the 4th team is still a mystery.

Mose Hole Tourney - first round matchups are Washington University vs. Transylvania and Wooster vs. Kalamazoo.  First round matchups now appear on both the Wash U. and Transy schedules.  Possible Wash - Woo championship game could be a great contest if it occurs.
Nice sloothing wsf!  :)

I hope that Wooster gets a shot at CMU in the opener of the VanWie tournamant.  It would be nice to exact some revenge on those Tartans!

I also like your Wash-Woo reference.  It's not WahsU, it's Wash-Woo...  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on June 20, 2009, 05:35:05 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on June 19, 2009, 01:53:29 PM
Wittenberg has its schedule posted...

Dec. 29-30  Home tournament (vs. Olivet in first round)
Artie Taylor is bringing his Ohio Dominican squad to Springfield for this tournament as well.  The fourth team is Marian College (which will be Marian University by then), which means that win or lose, Witt has a non-D3 opponent for the second game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 27, 2009, 11:36:42 PM
Wooster has not posted their schedule online yet but I did receive a hard copy.  :)

College of Wooster 2009-2010 Basketball Schedule

Nov. 15  at Albion 3:00 pm
Nov. 20  Al Van Wie Rotary Classic  (Heidelberg, St. Thomas, Carnegie Mellon)  6:00 pm, 8:00 pm
Nov. 21  Al Van Wie Rotary Classic - consolation & championship games 6:00 pm, 8:00 pm
Nov. 24  Ohio Northern 7:30 pm
Nov. 29  at John Carroll 3:00 pm
Dec. 02  at Ohio Wesleyan 7:30 pm
Dec. 05  at Kenyon (time TBA)
Dec. 13  at Randolph-Macon Tourney (Alvernia, North Carolina Wesleyan, Wooster) 6:00 pm, 8:00 pm
Dec. 14  at Randolph-Macon Tourney - consolation & championship games 6:00 pm, 8:00 pm
Dec. 20  Wabash 2:00 pm
Dec. 28  Mose Hole Kiwanis Classic  Transylvania vs. Washington Univ. 6:00 pm
                                                                    Kalamazoo vs. Wooster 8:00 pm
Dec. 29  Mose Hole Kiwanis Classic - consolation & championship games 6:00 pm, 8:00 pm
Jan. 09  Kenyon 3:00 pm
Jan. 13  at Allegheny 7:30 pm
Jan. 16  Earlham 1:00 pm
Jan. 20  at Oberlin 8:00 pm
Jan. 23  at Wittenberg 7:30 pm
Jan. 27  Hiram 7:30 pm
Jan. 30  Denison 7:30 pm
Feb. 03  Allegheny 7:30 pm
Feb. 07  at Wabash 2:00 pm
Feb. 10  at Hiram 7:30 pm
Feb. 13  Wittenberg 7:30 pm
Feb. 17  Ohio Wesleyan 7:30 pm
Feb. 20  at Earlham 1:00 pm
Feb. 23  NCAC Tournament Quarterfinals
Feb. 26  NCAC Tournament Semifinals
Feb. 27  NCAC Tournament Final

Home games are in Bold font
Note:  First round matchups for the Al Van Wie and Randolph-Macon tourneys were not listed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on June 28, 2009, 07:23:29 AM
Awesome ... thanks very much for posting it!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on June 29, 2009, 11:40:58 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on June 20, 2009, 05:35:05 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on June 19, 2009, 01:53:29 PM
Wittenberg has its schedule posted...

Dec. 29-30  Home tournament (vs. Olivet in first round)
Artie Taylor is bringing his Ohio Dominican squad to Springfield for this tournament as well.  The fourth team is Marian College (which will be Marian University by then), which means that win or lose, Witt has a non-D3 opponent for the second game.

What color of suit will he wear for his return trip to Witt? The RED ensemble? Something in ODU colors?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on June 29, 2009, 12:33:02 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on June 27, 2009, 11:36:42 PM
Wooster has not posted their schedule online yet but I did receive a hard copy.  :)
Thanks for posting this.  I suppose you got this through the Rebounders, but if you happen to see a copy of the women's schedule, please post it on the women's board and/or shoot me a copy. 

Although I am enjoying life here in the paradise that is Humboldt Co., seeing these schedules start to appear fills me with homesickness.  I won't be within 2400 miles of a Scots game this season.  It's going to be a long winter. :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 18, 2009, 07:36:48 PM
Kenyon's schedule is posted (tip o' the cap to hopefan): http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x26038.xml
Nothing too exciting here.  An early season trip to the Main Line is the only "fun" trip, with neutral-site games against Haverford and Swarthmore.  All other non-conference games are in-region, including two home games against OAC foes.  The Lords have a home-and-home with Wooster this year, but both are among Kenyon's first four NCAC tilts.  Their single-game opponents are Wittenberg (Dec. 9) and OWU (Jan. 13), and nine of their last 11 NCAC games are against teams that finished in the bottom five last season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 18, 2009, 07:49:16 PM
Sad news from Delaware (http://bishops.owu.edu/2008-09/larry_eberst.html) ~
Former OWU assistant coach Larry Eberst perished in a plane crash earlier this week.  Eberst's 12 seasons on the Bishops' bench included the 1988 national championship.  Since leaving OWU, Eberst has been the head boys' basketball coach at Rutheford B. Hayes High School in Delaware, where he coached recent OWU grad Kyle Miller and doubtless other NCAC athletes.  My condolences to Coach Eberst's family, friends, and colleagues.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 18, 2009, 07:59:19 PM
Here's this season's single-game matchups:
Allegheny and Hiram face Earlham and Wabash once each, as usual; this year's games will be in Indiana the weekend of Jan. 8-9.
As noted above, Kenyon's single-game opponents are Wittenberg and OWU.
Denison gets Wooster and Wittenberg just once each.
Oberlin faces OWU and Wooster one time only.
For Wooster, the singles are Denison and Oberlin.
Wittenberg's singles are with Denison and Kenyon.
OWU gets Kenyon and Oberlin for one game each.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on July 19, 2009, 10:18:06 PM
Wooster's official schedule has been posted on its new Web site: 

http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule.aspx

If you are looking for any other information, you are likely out of luck. For some reason, almost all the information that was on the previous site is gone. They don't even have results from last year on there, let alone box scores, recaps or pictures. No records, nothing. You can't get any sense of the history or the success of the program from this new Web site.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 20, 2009, 12:43:25 AM
Ditto my NCAC football post as response to your ditto'ed rant.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on July 20, 2009, 12:47:32 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on July 19, 2009, 10:18:06 PM
Wooster's official schedule has been posted on its new Web site: 

http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule.aspx

If you are looking for any other information, you are likely out of luck. For some reason, almost all the information that was on the previous site is gone. They don't even have results from last year on there, let alone box scores, recaps or pictures. No records, nothing. You can't get any sense of the history or the success of the program from this new Web site.

You might ask the SID for the URL to the old sites.  I doubt that he erased it.  I know that the ASC is now on its third website and the other two sites are not readily available to the casual viewer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on July 20, 2009, 08:37:14 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 20, 2009, 12:43:25 AM
Ditto my NCAC football post as response to your ditto'ed rant.

I didn't realize wondering where results are from the most recent season (08-09) qualified as a rant. I wonder what the adjective would be if I had actually ranted. :)

I'm familiar enough with Wooster to know that despite working on this for over a year, this is pretty much what was planned for the athletics site. What you see is what you get. There are no links to the old site.

Obviously not the end of the world. Hopefully going forward more information will for the upcoming seasons.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 20, 2009, 09:06:18 AM
Well, you edited you original post after I read it so now I have no idea what you actually said.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 29, 2009, 04:59:46 PM
The NCAC has announced (http://www.northcoast.org/news/NCACsearch.html?DB_OEM_ID=9300&ATCLID=204764897) today that they will conduct a national search for a new Executive Director to replace the late Dennis Collins, and that Keri Alexander Luchowski will serve in that capacity on an interim basis.  Keri has been the conference's de facto SID for the past 10 years, and was elevated to Assistant Director two years ago.  Congratulations to Keri!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woowashu on July 30, 2009, 05:00:34 PM
Perhaps we can get two Woo-Washu games in one season!? I don't know if I could handle that, but at least I have the perfect shirt.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on July 30, 2009, 11:16:33 PM
woowashu - 2 games in one season looks like a high probability, imo.

The Scots football squad visits St. Louis on October 17th.  The Wooster basketball team will be heavily favored to beat Kalamazoo at home in the Mose Hole first round and national champs Washu should take down Transy on a neutral floor.  So, game #2 should be a great contest in the Mose Hole championship game on December 30th.  I think the Scots will give the Bears a real challenge given that Wooster returns nearly their entire team this season.  Of course, the Bears lost only Tyler Nading with Sean Wallis returning for his 5th year.

BTW, what is the explanation behind your poster name?  Undergraduate at COW and graduate work at washu?  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on July 31, 2009, 01:39:14 PM
I have heard from a reliable source that Wooster is going to have a home exhibition game against a nearby D-I opponent, on the evening of November 7, the day of the last home football game.  It is my understanding that the proceeds will be going to a worthy cause close to the hearts of the Wooster faithful.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woowashu on July 31, 2009, 10:32:09 PM
wooscotsfan: I am most definitely a wooster alum.  And let's just say that I've watched Wash U. play a lot of basketball--some of the players more than others. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on July 31, 2009, 10:39:53 PM
Quote from: woowashu on July 31, 2009, 10:32:09 PM
wooscotsfan: I am most definitely a wooster alum.  And let's just say that I've watched Wash U. play a lot of basketball--some of the players more than others. 

I'll bite.  You're a Woo alum, and your son plays for WashU.

Do I win?  And what's the prize? ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woowashu on August 02, 2009, 11:22:26 PM
Sorry Mr. Ypsi, you lose this round. 

Any other contestants in the "guess the identity" game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Marty Peretz on August 03, 2009, 12:34:10 AM
I'm guessing woowashu is among the legions of Ohio hoop heads who claim some relationship to the immortal Buckeye state resident formerly known as "A.T." That would be reigning UAA POY and first team all American Aaron Thompson. The Wooster tournament serves as a sort-of homecoming game for the rising senior since his hometown of Elida is about a two hour drive to Wooster. I may be mistaken, but I believe A.T. went to camps at Wooster when he was younger. Should be a great game in Decemeber. Thinking about making the trek actually. Will the legendary Wooster fans be as good as advertised considering the lack of students on campus at that time?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woowashu on August 03, 2009, 08:26:07 AM
Ah Marty....So close.  I have indeed watched the infamous A.T. play basketball.  In fact, I cheered him on in countless Elks hoop shoot contests and watched him act as the ballboy for the Elida high school team long before he began to dominate at the college level.

Unfortunately, it is more complicated than being one of his many Northwest Ohio fans.

As far as a prize...I have a few spare Wooster Bricks lying around.... ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BUBeaverFan on August 03, 2009, 08:46:32 AM
Marty,
Hope to see you at the Wooster Tournament.  Wooster will be a very formidable opponent, especially at home.  If the final of the tourney pits Wash U against Wooster it could be one of the best non-conference match-ups of the year. 

Hi Woowashu!  Your secret is secure with me. I can introduce you to Marty in Wooster. Everyone have a great rest of the summer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on August 20, 2009, 07:22:30 PM
Looks like it can finally be announced publicly -- Wooster will play Kent St. in an exhibition game Nov. 7. This in and of itself isn't that noteworthy. But the fact that the game is at Wooster, and not Kent, is what is noteworthy. Kent St. agreed to play at Wooster, with all sales from the gate to go towards Corey Cline (not exactly sure if this is towards scholarship or what). So this is way cool. I wonder if a major Div. I school has played an exhibition at a Div. III school before?

http://www.ohioverticals.com/blogs/kent_state/2009/08/20/2009-10-kent-state-mens-basketball-schedule/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on August 21, 2009, 10:32:14 AM
This game should be a lot of fun, and good preparation for the Scots' tough non-conference schedule.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on August 26, 2009, 09:12:38 PM
A much needed upgrade in Richmond....

http://www.goearlham.com/ (http://www.goearlham.com/)

Enjoy!

It even includes Earlham's basketball schedule...far in advance of when it usually surfaces.

Highlights include preseason tournaments in both Chicago and Memphis. Good stops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on September 03, 2009, 08:47:16 AM
Just wonering, since school is back in session now, if anyone has heard anything about Wooster's incoming freshman basketball class?  I don't really remember hearing much about this year's class at all over the offseason.  I'm just curious to know.  Also, has anyone heard any news on how the big 7 footer is doing?  Is he back to 100% yet?  And last question.  Anyone heard how Brandon Johnon's recovery is progressing.  I thought I had heard he was again hoping to be back by the start of full conference action after the holiday break.  Is that still his target or could he come back sooner? 

Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: dcscots14 on September 03, 2009, 02:46:19 PM
Hey Scotsfan....this is the first d3hoops post of my career but I figured I needed to fill you in on the freshman. After playing with them last spring as prospects and talking to Brandon Johnson over the course of the summer, the freshman seem to be playing very well. I don't remember their names but one is the big boy (6'8) from Tallmadge and the other a 6'7 or 6'8 big man from Oxford Talawanda. Both seem to be able to compete at this level right away and have the opportunity to get playing time this year. I believe Gideon is back and playing and Brandon is making great progress with his rehab and should definately be ready to go by the time conference play starts up. That's all I've got for now..but I'm sure I'll hear updates as the preseason continues.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 03, 2009, 09:26:02 PM
Welcome aboard, dcscots14!  We hope to hear from you often this season.  And I'm flattered that you chose my initials for a screen name, what an honor... ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on September 04, 2009, 01:05:13 PM
Thanks for the update dcscots.  And welcome to the board!

Good to hear that Brandon's recovery is coming along nicely!  Also, I'm anxious to see what sort of role Gideon provides for this team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on September 10, 2009, 09:02:31 AM
I don't post often anymore, but if all goes as planned...I might not post here ever again past this year:

http://www.pal-item.com/article/20090907/NEWS02/909070314 (http://www.pal-item.com/article/20090907/NEWS02/909070314)

Earlham to the Heartland? It's been rumored for a couple years, but now it definitely has legs...long legs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 11, 2009, 09:59:00 PM
I'm willing to offer the Heartland Conference a Buy One, Get One Free deal... ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 14, 2009, 12:20:55 PM
Sad news from Granville relayed via Denison's Twitter feed (http://twitter.com/DenisonSports).  Former Big Red player Joe Hines ('04) (http://twitpic.com/hpn2r) has died.  I don't have any details on his passing or services; you might want to keep in touch with Denison via Twitter or their web page (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/) for more information.  What I do know is that Joe was a role player who contributed for four years and played in all 26 games as a senior, starting four.  He was by all accounts a great teammate and outstanding individual.  Joe was embarking on a dental career when this tragedy struck.  Please keep Joe and his loved ones in your thoughts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 23, 2009, 11:04:56 PM
OWU continues to be a stepping-stone for assistant coaches, as they seem to have a new one every season.  This season, it will be Marcus Gill learning from Mike DeWitt.  Gill comes to Delaware from Albion College, his alma mater (2004), where he assisted Mike Turner and Jody May in three of the last five seasons.  (The other two were spent at Siena Heights U., where he was an assistant while earning his master's degree.)  This will be his first full-time coaching opportunity.  Good luck, Coach Gill, and welcome to the NCAC!  OWU link. (http://connect2.owu.edu/issues/20090923/athletics/gill.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 25, 2009, 11:00:21 PM
Heartfelt congratulations to Wooster assistant coach Doug Cline, who will be inducted into the "W" Hall of Fame tomorrow.  Doug was a standout post player as an undergrad, a key part of the program's continuing success as a coach, and just a terrific guy, one of the nicest people you'll meet.   Here's the announcement from wooster.edu (http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Athletics-News/2009/September/Hall-Of-Fame-2009-Cline.aspx), the best part of which is perhaps this final sentence:
Quote from: Hugh HowardPersonally, Cline and his wife, Lauren, are the proud parents of Joshua, 8, and the late Corey (3), and they are expecting twins in December.
Many reasons to congratulate Doug this weekend!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on September 30, 2009, 11:39:33 PM
Wooster's tourney matchups are now evident for the Al Van Wie Rotary Tourney and Randolph-Macon Briggs Elliott Classic.

Per Carnegie Mellon's website, Wooster will play CMU in the first round of the Al Van Wie Tourney.  Heidelberg and St. Thomas (MN) is the other first round game.  Carnegie Mellon graduated several seniors, including 3 starters and their leading scorer Ryan Einwag, from their squad that beat Wooster by 6 points in Pittsburgh early last season.

On paper, this tourney championship game should feature a Wooster vs. St. Thomas matchup (Tommies were 30-1 last year losing only to national champ Washington University in the NCAA tournament).


Per NC Wesleyan's website, Wooster will play North Carolina Wesleyan in the first round of the Randolph-Macon Classic on December 13th in Virginia.  NC Wesleyan returns nearly their entire squad but they were only 14-12 last season and their conference record was only 4-8.  Their nonconference schedule was weak, including several bible schools, which accounted for 10 of their wins.  Tourney host Randolph Macon plays Alvernia (PA) in the other first round game.

On paper, this tourney championship game should feature a Wooster vs. Randolph-Macon matchup.  RMC was 20-6 last season and 12-0 at home.  Yellow Jackets return 3 starters and historically have been a strong team in the ODAC.

Just over 5 weeks until the exhibition game vs. Kent State! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on October 02, 2009, 07:18:03 AM
Speaking of the Wooster - Kent State exhibition, I heard this week that the site is up in the air.  NCAA rules do not ordinarily allow D-I teams to play such games on the road.  KSU has requested an exception from the NCAA, but if it is not granted, this game will be played at Kent State.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 04, 2009, 10:25:48 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on October 02, 2009, 07:18:03 AM
Speaking of the Wooster - Kent State exhibition, I heard this week that the site is up in the air.  NCAA rules do not ordinarily allow D-I teams to play such games on the road.  KSU has requested an exception from the NCAA, but if it is not granted, this game will be played at Kent State.


This would be a bit of BS if the NCAA didn't grant KSU's request to play at Wooster.  This game is being played as a caritable event for crying out loud!  Do the right thing NCAA!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 04, 2009, 03:25:43 PM
The reported attendance at last year's Wooster/Ohio U. exhibition was 2249.  Although I'd love for the KSU game to be at Wooster, I'm not sure that the attendance, and thus the charitable intake, would be a lot different if it's in Kent.  The spirit, of course, would be very different, however.

As a compromise, I think it should be played at Humboldt State!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on October 06, 2009, 07:49:28 PM
ESPN has done a story on Elliot Mealer and family for their show E: 60...... a short preview......

http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=null&categoryid=3060647

Unfortunately I don't see that they are running the show again, but the video should be available on the E60 page sometime this week.

Its worth a watch.

Edit.....the full video is now available.
http://espn.go.com/video/clip?id=4537842
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 06, 2009, 09:22:31 PM
With a disclaimer that this ranking is not of the same quality (IMHO) as the D3Hoops Top 25, here is the Sporting News College Basketball preseason Top 10 for D3:

1. Washington University (St. Louis)
2. Guilford (NC)
3. Richard Stockton (NJ)
4. Franklin & Marshall (PA)
5. Wooster (OH) :)
6. UMass-Dartmouth
7. John Carroll (OH)
8. DeSales (PA)
9. Wisconsin-Stevens Point
10. Brooklyn (NY)

Commentary on Wooster - "Injuries and youth dashed any hopes of a championship season last year, yet the Fighting Scots still finished at 23-7 and preserved their honor with the highest winning percentage (.850) in college basketball this decade.  The four returning starters (all underclassmen) are 6-3 Ian Franks (15.5 ppg, 4.2 rpg), 6-7 Justin Hallowell (14.2 ppg, 4.7 rpg), 6-1 Nathan Balch (12.6 ppg) and 6-6 Bryan Wickliffe (7.9 ppg, 6.2 rpg).  The most exciting boost to coach Steve Moore's lineup could be 6-2 senior Brandon Johnson, who averaged 11.3 ppg and 3.8 rpg two years ago but sat out last season with a torn ACL."

Possible Breakthrough Teams - included in this list were Amherst, Calvin, Hope, Elmhurst, Illinois Wesleyan, Ohio Northern, St. Thomas (MN) and 19 other teams (no others in Ohio or NCAC).

All-America First Team:  Darnell Braswell - DeSales, Santini Lancioni - Richard Stockton, Tyler Sanborn - Guilford, Aaron Thompson - Washington Univ., Sean Wallis - Washington Univ.

All- America Second Team:  Steve Djurickovic - Carthage, Richard Jean-Baptiste - Brooklyn, D.J. Marsh - Wisc. Oshkosh, Andrew Powers - Gettysburg, Joe Scott - St. Thomas (MN)

Honorable Mention Team:  Ian Franks - Wooster, Gregg Hill - Wittenberg, Rudy Kirbus - John Carroll, Kyle Meyer - Ohio Northern, and 25 other players (no others in NCAC or OAC)

This Division III preview was written by Chuck Mistovich, Basketball Times

Congratulations to both Ian Franks and Gregg Hill on being selected to the Honorable Mention Team. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 07, 2009, 01:02:28 PM
Wooster also clocks in at #5 in the preseason DIII News rankings (http://www.smallcollegehoops.com/Home_files/2009Top25.pdf) (PDF).  John Carroll is #9, Hope #11, Calvin #18, and Capital #24. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 07, 2009, 08:23:00 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on October 07, 2009, 01:02:28 PM
Wooster also clocks in at #5 in the preseason DIII News rankings (http://www.smallcollegehoops.com/Home_files/2009Top25.pdf) (PDF).  John Carroll is #9, Hope #11, Calvin #18, and Capital #24. 

David - thanks for the DIII News rankings.  Using that list, there is a strong possibility that Wooster will have played #1 Wash. Univ, #7 St. Thomas and #9 John Carroll by the end of December if the tourney matchups go as projected.  Wooster may have the toughest non-conference schedule in D3 this year! :o

Hopefully, the non-conference opponents will help prepare the Scots for another NCAA tourney run this season! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 15, 2009, 01:50:24 PM
Ah, Billy, we'll miss you after this season. (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2009/10/15/hcac-formally-welcomes-earlham.html)  Good luck in the HCAC; Earlham will be a credit to that league like they were to ours, and I hope the Quakers succeed over there.

Down to nine teams in most men's sports after this season.  Ask the women, especially the basketball coaches, how much fun it is trying to schedule a nine-team league, complicated by the fact that two of the teams are >450 miles apart.  I wonder if that's enough of an impetus for the league to try to find a new 10th team.  (Of course, the women benefit by going to an 8-team loop all sports, at least all of them that Hiram sponsors.)  One thing that's probably gone is the dreaded annual East-West trip:  'Gheny and Hiram playing two games in two days at Wabash and the EC was tough enough, but substitute Wittenberg for Earlham and it makes both the logistics and the competitive balance unsupportable.  (Plus, they'd probably have to go both directions each year in a full round-robin schedule; this is what the women have been doing for years.)  Full round-robin is the happy result of this move.

I wonder how well this is going to work where one school is no closer than 185 miles to any other conference school.  There are other schools with similar problems, like Colorado College in the SCAC or TheWhitworthPirates in the NWC, but I'm not being facetious when I say that long travel is just different in the west than it is in the east; things out here are so spread out that people get used to long travel at an early age.  (Plus, I expect CC flies to their away dates anyway.)

This is going to be an interesting story to follow as it develops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 15, 2009, 07:48:13 PM
Denison's hoops teams get a pre-season pep talk from Bill Bradley. (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/bill_bradley09.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 15, 2009, 09:38:37 PM
What does the NCAC do? Drop the unbalanced schedule and go home and home for all 16 games?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on October 16, 2009, 11:51:03 AM
For help with my D3hoops.com Preseason Top 25 ballot, can you guys help me sort out the 2010 NCAC race?  Wooster seems to be a heavy favorte, correct?  Who do you see in slots 2 & 3?

Thanks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 16, 2009, 12:55:56 PM
Quote from: smedindy on October 15, 2009, 09:38:37 PM
What does the NCAC do? Drop the unbalanced schedule and go home and home for all 16 games?
If the conference stays at nine members, the nine-team men's schedule would likely be the same as the current women's nine-team schedule, which is a full round-robin 16-game schedule.  They have two three-game weeks each season, with a game on Tuesday followed by back-to-back Friday/Saturday games.  It is on those weekends that the "Big Trip" is made, with Allegheny and Hiram traveling to Earlham and Wittenberg, and vice versa.  However, as I noted above, whether the men would want to adopt that, with the western half of the trip being Wittenberg and Wabash (185 miles apart), is an open question due to numerous logistical and competitive issues.  The fallback would be just a plain vanilla 16-game home and home schedule, although Wabash, 'Gheny, and Hiram might object to that as their travel costs would rise. 

I edit this to add that, of course, in a nine-team loop, every "game night" someone is either playing a non-conference foe or taking the night off. 

Volleyball has an interesting solution, which I can't see basketball adopting but is worth a mention.  This year they'll play half of their season schedule (8 games for each team) in two "Power weekends" held at the outermost points of Allegheny and Earlham.  These are essentially what we hoops fans might think of as classic-format (i.e. pre-determined pairings) tournaments, with each team playing two games per day.  The other half of the season schedule (8 games) is played in regular home-and-home fashion.  This must hold down the travel costs quite a lot, and since it's volleyball and not hoops, attendance is probably enhanced (I'd guess that attendance at volleyball matches is only an interesting subject at Wittenberg, and they may also be the only school to charge admission--if they do, I don't know.)  Of course, you can't play four basketball games in two days, and hoops coaches are loath to give up home games for neutral-site games, but there may be a germ of an idea here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 16, 2009, 01:12:15 PM
Quote from: Titan Q on October 16, 2009, 11:51:03 AM
For help with my D3hoops.com Preseason Top 25 ballot, can you guys help me sort out the 2010 NCAC race?  Wooster seems to be a heavy favorte, correct?  Who do you see in slots 2 & 3?

Thanks!
Just off the top of my head, I'd say Wabash, who brings virtually everyone back, and OWU, where Mike DeWitt has I believe established a "reload not rebuild" program that will ameliorate heavy graduation losses.  Wittenberg gets their top gun Gregg Hill back from injury along with 12 other lettermen, so they should be in the mix as well.  Also Hiram, where everyone returns (if they return, always a question at Hiram) except Ian Pfouts.  That's a big loss of leadership, but they return a lot of talent.  How last season's late-season swoon will affect them will be interesting to see.  Kenyon will go as far as Dave Knapke and JT Knight can take them; they're aiming to be a consistent top 4 team, but that might be a stretch this year.  Allegheny will have seven seniors, including George Raftis, but they need to stay healthy and have everything go right to be in the top 4.  I'll mention Oberlin, Denison, and Earlham out of courtesy.  But yes, Wooster is the solid favorite, even with lingering injury concerns for Brandon Johnson and a very tough non-conference schedule.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 16, 2009, 02:20:46 PM
I just got word from a reliable source that the 2010-11 conference schedules have been released to the schools, and that they are double-round-robin for both men and women, with no "Big Trip" weekends for either.  There will be an increased number of men/women double-headers in an effort to hold down travel costs, which is good for fans but can be uncomfortable for players having half the bus space they're used to.  (I note that Earlham has been doing this for some time.)  The men will have bye dates in their conference schedules, since only eight of the nine teams can play conference games on a given night.  The women will play a 14-game season concentrated on Wednesdays and Saturdays, and will have two extra non-conference games available.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on October 16, 2009, 03:26:19 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on October 16, 2009, 02:20:46 PM
I just got word from a reliable source that the 2010-11 conference schedules have been released to the schools, and that they are double-round-robin for both men and women, with no "Big Trip" weekends for either.  There will be an increased number of men/women double-headers in an effort to hold down travel costs, which is good for fans but can be uncomfortable for players having half the bus space they're used to.  (I note that Earlham has been doing this for some time.)  The men will have bye dates in their conference schedules, since only eight of the nine teams can play conference games on a given night.  The women will play a 14-game season concentrated on Wednesdays and Saturdays, and will have two extra non-conference games available.

Does this open up a December weekend or two for non-conference games or is the NCAC still going to start in December?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 16, 2009, 03:57:14 PM
I haven't seen the 2010-11 schedule, but I don't see why this change would do away with the December games.  After all, it's still 16 games.  Just looking at Wooster's 2009-10 schedule as a point of reference, they have conference games every Wednesday and Saturday* from January 9 through February 20 (after which the conference tourney begins), and that's only 13 games.  There's nowhere to squeeze three more games in that doesn't involve December (or three-game weeks).

And upon further reflection, I realize that the "December problem" will get worse, not better, in this new 9-team world, because of the now-necessary byes.  Each team will have to sit out one of every nine Game Days (i.e., Wednesdays and Saturdays) on average.  Looking again at Wooster's 09-10 schedule, those 13 January/February games are in 13 Game days.  Next year, the Scots will only be able to play 11 or 12 (conference) games in those 13 slots, leaving 4 or 5 for December (or, gulp, November) or forcing some three-game weeks in the New Year.  This looks more and more like it's going to be a bitch to schedule; non-conference games are hard to find after the First, which means that, in order to have a full 25 game slate, teams may have to schedule as many as fourteen games between Nov. 15 and the Christmas holidays (worst-case scenario.)  Yikes.

*Wooster plays at Wabash on Sunday 2/7 for some reason; Sat. 2/6 is open for both teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 18, 2009, 11:14:56 AM
The big to and from Wabash trips may be during break, just so class time won't be missed. That's my speculation.

That may play havoc with holiday tournaments, but that's how I can see it.

Wabash goes out to Hiram and Allegheny one Friday / Saturday.
Hiram and Gheny trek out to Wabash the next Friday / Saturday.

Heck, Gheny's bus can pick up Hiram on the way! Perhaps they can have epic battles of Go Fish, Crazy 8's, and Old Maid on the way to C'ville.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 18, 2009, 09:59:46 PM
I got a hard copy of Wooster's 2009-2010 Roster :) (18 players) which is not available yet on the COW website:

#10 Brandon Johnson Sr. Guard 6'2"  (starter in 2008, 11.3 ppg, 3.8 rpg)

#14 Matt Fegan So. Guard 6'1" (4.7 ppg, 1.5 rpg)

#22 Nathan Balch Jr. Guard 6'1" (returning starter, 12.6 ppg, 3.1 rpg)

#23 Dave Mallett Fr. Guard 6'2" (Naperville Central High School - IL)

#24 Justin Warnes So. Guard 6'2" (bench player last year)

#30 Eric Robbins So. Guard 6'1" (bench player last year)

#31 Ibrahim Ibrahim So. Guard 6'2" (bench player last year)

#32 Bryan Wickliffe Jr. Forward 6'6" (returning starter, 7.9 ppg, 6.2 rpg)

#33 Ian Franks Jr. Guard 6'4" (returning starter, 15.5 ppg, 4.2 rpg)

#34 Kaleb Reed Jr. Forward 6'4" (bench player last year)

#35 Tom Adams-Wall So. Guard 6'2" (JV team last year?)

#40 Justin Hallowell So. Forward 6'7" (returning starter, 14.2 ppg, 4.7 rpg, D3 Hoops freshman of the year)

#41 Eric Fertig Jr. Forward 6'6" (bench/JV player last year)

#42 Mike Evans So. Forward 6'4" (4.1 ppg, 1.9 rpg)

#44 Josh Claytor Fr. Forward 6'6" (Oxford Talawanda HS, 23.3 ppg, 12.3 rpg;  was recruited by Cornell University)

#50 Gideon Mabeny So. Center 7'0" (The Sudan, Fork Union, team videographer last year with ACL surgery)

#52 Jake Mays Fr. Center 6'7" (Tallmadge HS, 17.0 ppg, 10.8 rpg, 61% FG; 2nd Team Inland District)

#54 Greg Ross So. Forward 6'5" (4.2 ppg, 3.3 rpg)

Note: Parenthetical information is my comment/addition

Coaches:  Steve Moore, Doug Cline, Bruce Martin, Tim Vandervaart (Tom Port not listed)

Who did not return: Marty Bidwell-graduated, Dustin Geitgey, Drew Sawyer, Terrence Williams, Scott Voiers

Newcomers: 3 big men in Claytor, Mabeny and Mays.  Mallett and Adams-Wall at Guard

Comments - Wooster looks very strong with the 4 returning starters plus the 3 new big guys.  Brandon Johnson will hopefully be a big addition off the bench with his experience and knowledge of the game.  With his recovery from a second knee surgery still in process, Johnson may not play until January.  I like the addition of Tim Vandervaart as a coach who can teach Claytor, Mabeny and Mays some of his famous spin moves in the pivot. ;)  Dustin Geitgey will be missed but Matt Fegan played solid reserve minutes last season and if Brandon Johnson plays that still gives the Scots 4 strong guards.  Ian Franks looks like he grew an inch this summer to 6'4" ;D.  Let's recall that Nathan Balch got significant playing time 2 years ago on a Division I team and we also have a D3 Hoops freshman of the year, Justin Hallowell, who shot over 50% from the 3 point arc last year. :)  It will be interesting to see who is the 5th starter for the Scots when the season begins.

Wooster has the potential to be a top 10 team in Division III this season.  The Scots will be the favorite in the NCAC again and hopefully can make another run in the NCAA tourney.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on October 20, 2009, 09:12:30 PM
Info has been slow to get on Wooster's new athletic Web site.

wooscotsfan, do you know why Geitgey is not playing this year? If Brandon Johnson were healthy from day one, Geitgey wouldn't have played much. But with that not being the case, Wooster only has three guards it can play against strong opponents. So if one gets hurt or is in foul trouble, depth could be a problem. Depth along the frontline, however, has probably never been better.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 21, 2009, 06:53:03 PM
Thanks for the info wsf!  I can't believe the hoops season is right around the corner! 

Quote from: wooscotsfan on October 18, 2009, 09:59:46 PM
It will be interesting to see who is the 5th starter for the Scots when the season begins.

Wooster has the potential to be a top 10 team in Division III this season.  The Scots will be the favorite in the NCAC again and hopefully can make another run in the NCAA tourney.

GO SCOTS!

Would one of the bigs be a candidate for that 5th starting position?  My thoughts would be leaning towards Greg Ross and it could be the freshman Claytor depending on how good he is.

I'm interested to see what kind of a role Mabeny plays on this team as well.  One thing that can't be taught is height and he's certainly got that!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 22, 2009, 08:57:31 AM
The D3hoops.com Top 25 (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/) has been unveiled and Wooster opens up at #9. 

To say that Wooster's non-conference schedule is difficult is an understatement!

Wooster could possibly wind up facing the #1, the #2 and the #4 teams (WashU, JCU, and St. Thomas respectively) in the pre-season rankings if the tournaments they play in go according to Hoyle.  Also, in another tournament, there is the possiblitiy of facing #19 R-MC.

Wooster also will face off with 2 other non-conference foes that are in the ORV portion of the poll.  CMU whom the Scots face in their season opener and ONU are both receiving votes in the poll.

So, the possiblity is there for 6 of Wooster's 8 non-conference opponents to be ranked or receiving votes!  :o

BTW, OWU is the only other NCAC team showing up on the poll.  They managed to collect 2 votes.

One surprising note wrt the poll is that there are no U-W schools in the top 5!  When was the last time that has happened  (I'm sure that David can fill us in on that...  ;) )? UW-SP is the highest ranked WIAC team at #10 just behind Wooster.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 23, 2009, 02:32:07 PM
For the first time since, oh, I don't know when, Wabash isn't hosting any tourneys this year. They are going to Maryville and to DePauw for tourneys in November.

Other than that, the non-conference slate is Marian, Franklin, Rose-Hulman and DPU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on October 28, 2009, 01:30:52 PM
Quote from: smedindy on October 23, 2009, 02:32:07 PM
For the first time since, oh, I don't know when, Wabash isn't hosting any tourneys this year. They are going to Maryville and to DePauw for tourneys in November.

Other than that, the non-conference slate is Marian, Franklin, Rose-Hulman and DPU.


That's good. Wabash might find some D-III opponents at those tournaments.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on October 29, 2009, 07:27:25 AM
Today's Wooster Daily Record has an article that appears to say Kent State is coming to Wooster next week for the exhibition (which would mean the NCAA has granted permission to KSU to do this).  Unfortunately, I can only see the headline, as you have to be a subscriber to read it.

Can anyone access the article and confirm this?
http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4699030 (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4699030)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on October 29, 2009, 09:20:02 AM
Yes, that's what the article says, but it also says that the waiver hasn't been officially granted. It's amazing that we are only slightly over a week away, and neither school can officially promote this event on their Web sites.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on October 29, 2009, 12:58:12 PM
My source in the athletic department told me today that there's still no news, but are expecting to hear something any day.  This is crazy ... thanks, NCAA!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 29, 2009, 11:22:48 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on October 28, 2009, 01:30:52 PM
Quote from: smedindy on October 23, 2009, 02:32:07 PM
For the first time since, oh, I don't know when, Wabash isn't hosting any tourneys this year. They are going to Maryville and to DePauw for tourneys in November.

Other than that, the non-conference slate is Marian, Franklin, Rose-Hulman and DPU.


That's good. Wabash might find some D-III opponents at those tournaments.

Rimshot!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on October 29, 2009, 11:46:46 PM
Quote from: smedindy on October 29, 2009, 11:22:48 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on October 28, 2009, 01:30:52 PM
Quote from: smedindy on October 23, 2009, 02:32:07 PM
For the first time since, oh, I don't know when, Wabash isn't hosting any tourneys this year. They are going to Maryville and to DePauw for tourneys in November.

Other than that, the non-conference slate is Marian, Franklin, Rose-Hulman and DPU.


That's good. Wabash might find some D-III opponents at those tournaments.

Rimshot!  :D

Just struck me - ya know, compared with the comedy drum reference, in bball that might have a whole different meaning! ;D

I still have nightmares over losses from 'rimshots'! :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 01, 2009, 04:08:45 PM
I got a second hand report from my father who attended the Wooster Varsity vs. Alumni scrimmage yesterday.

The Wooster Alums controlled the game from the start and never looked back winning by a score of 78 to 68.  The Alums team included All-American James Cooper, All-American Tom Port, Tim Vandervaart, Devin Fulk, Andy Van Horn, Evan Will, PJ McCloud, Antwyan Reynolds, Joe Agler and Dustin Geitgey.  Geitgey played for the Alums because he has either used up all of his eligibility or is just a few courses short of finishing his degree...or both?  The Alums were all in great shape physically with Port and Cooper nailing three pointers like they did as seniors. ;D

For the Varsity, my father thought some of the best looking players were Justin Hallowell and the two freshmen "bigs" Josh Claytor and Jake Mays.  Apparently, the rest of the team didn't play particularly well and missed a number of shots.

It may be a blessing that the Varsity lost this scrimmage because the intensity at practices will probably go up this coming week. ;)

Can anyone else offer a first hand report from this Varsity/Alum scrimmage?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 01, 2009, 07:57:43 PM
All I can do is agree with most of what you put in your report, WSF.  I also heard secondhand about the scrimmage yesterday at Timken.  My source was particularly impressed by Claytor, who started, and said that Mays also offered good minutes.  Hallowell apparently didn't make many shots and the alums were on from the start.  Mabeny (sp?), the 7'0'', didn't offer too much from what I heard.

Starting five was Balch, Franks, Hallowell, Claytor and Wickliffe.  That's two juniors, two sophomores and a freshman.  With Johnson as the only senior on the roster, think the Scots might be good for the next few years?   :)

No word or announcement about the Kent State scrimmage was made at the game, so I assume that the schools are still waiting for the NCAA's ruling on where that game will be.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 02, 2009, 10:08:30 AM
Thanks for the updates on the alumni scrimmage guys!  Sounds like Moore found a couple of nice freshmen!

Quote from: kiltedbryan on November 01, 2009, 07:57:43 PM
Starting five was Balch, Franks, Hallowell, Claytor and Wickliffe.  That's two juniors, two sophomores and a freshman.  With Johnson as the only senior on the roster, think the Scots might be good for the next few years?   :)

No kidding!  But doesn't this seem to almost always be the case for Moore and the Scots?  8)

BTW, Balch is listed as a Jr. on the roster.  I know that he still has 2 years of eligibility remaining if he so chooses to use them.  The question is, will he use them? 

And not having Johnson in the lineup to start the season might hurt because the schedule is so brutal in the non-conference portion of the schedule.  But the experience these youngsters will get without Johnson will only help this team down the stretch as they move into conference play and on into a possible run in the post-season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 02, 2009, 10:27:03 AM
Exhibition is official.

http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 02, 2009, 01:13:13 PM
Glad to see the NCAA did something right for a change...   ;)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 02, 2009, 11:06:22 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 02, 2009, 01:13:13 PM
Glad to see the NCAA did something right for a change...   ;)

Yes, the NCAA did the right thing for a great cause - the Corey Cline Memorial Fund.  Kudos also to Kent State Coach Geno Ford for offering to bring his team to Wooster and then pushing the NCAA for the necessary waiver! :)

Kent State beat Ohio Northern in a home exhibition game tonight by a 75-66 score.  KSU played a lot of guys because Coach Ford is still sorting out his team.  Wooster scouted the game tonight obviously because they will play both of these squads during the next two months.  ;)

Here is a link to the Wooster exhibition game announcement on Kent State's website: http://www.kentstatesports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=47654&SPID=4464&ATCLID=204825887&DB_OEM_ID=11400
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on November 03, 2009, 07:35:16 AM
Certainly, I'm glad to see that the NCAA (finally) approved the contest, and also grateful that Kent State was willing to come to Wooster in the first place.

However, the KSU story looks like it was written by someone whose first language is not English.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 03, 2009, 12:23:52 PM
I suppose that most if not all of you already know this, but it's worth pointing out that Geno Ford (http://www.kentstatesports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=57784&SPID=4464&DB_OEM_ID=11400&ATCLID=1065336&Q_SEASON=2009) is no stranger to Ohio D3 hoops.  He was the head coach at Muskingum College for two years before moving to Kent State, and is the son of Muskie legend Gene Ford (http://www.muskingum.edu/home/athletics/basketball_m/coach.html), the current head man in New Concord.  I have no doubt that Gene and Geno are good friends with Steve Moore and Doug Cline, paving the way for this big-hearted gesture on Geno's (and KSU's) part.

Does anyone know if there will be any radio or video streaming coverage of this game, for those of us who can't be in attendance?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on November 03, 2009, 01:34:51 PM
Wooster typically offers streaming video of their home football & men's basketball games, and they're covered by a local radio station that offers streaming audio.  However, I'm not sure whether any NCAA rules would forbid that, with this being an exhibition game involving a D-I opponent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 03, 2009, 01:52:28 PM
It looked like KSU offerred live stats for their game with ONU.  That would be better than nothing eh?

WQKT and WKVX are going to be covering HS playoff action on Saturday evening.  So, unless Kent State's college radio station is going to broadcast it, I would guess your only hope would be following the live stats.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 03, 2009, 02:13:15 PM
I wasn't really expecting video, which I suppose depends on Clear Picture (or whatever the cable outfit is called) broadcasting the game.  Radio would have been nice, but I forgot about WQKT's obsession with high-school sporting events, even non-local ones.   ::) Oh well.

I'm sure it's for the best, anyway.  I wouldn't want anyone who is interested in this game to have an excuse to stay home and not make the $6 contribution to the Corey John Cline Fund.  I'd go myself, but I can't find room in my schedule for the 4,382-mile round trip. :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 04, 2009, 01:05:55 AM
Schedule musings:

Wooster's not the only squad with a big-time exhibition game coming up.  Kenyon will unofficially kick off their season a week from Friday with an exhibition game at The Citadel in Charleston, SC.  And Hiram opens their season for real with a regular-season game at Youngstown State on the 15th.

Wooster's schedule, as we all know, looks to be a real meat-grinder, but Steve Moore is not the only aggressive scheduler in the league.  Have a look at Ohio Wesleyan's first eight games.  They open the season at Illinois Wesleyan's tournament, where they will face top-ranked Washington U.  A victory in that game would likely bring a meeting with the host Titans, who fell one place short of the top 25 in the preseason poll.  The Bishops then travel to Defiance (18-9 last year) and Albion (15-11) before hosting ninth-ranked Wooster on Dec. 2.  Next up is a trip to Allegheny; you might recall that the Gators beat OWU twice in the final week of last season.  The Bishops return home for Capital (26-5), take their semester exams, then go to to Marietta's tournament where they'll run into Final Four participant and preseason #3 Guilford.  It's not out of the question that OWU could be 2-7 or 3-6 at the end of the calendar year and still be a pretty good ballclub.  If they win at least 6 of these first nine games (the ninth would be against either Marietta or Grove City), they'll be a serious force to reckon with in 2010.

Opening day in D3 is Nov. 15, and six of our ten squads will be playing:
Denison hosts Marietta, part of a men/women double-dip (the women face Trine)
Earlham travels to Manchester, the first of four meetings with future HCAC foes
Hiram, as mentioned above, tests their mettle at Youngstown St.
Kenyon plays host to Muskingum
Oberlin greets Mt. Aloysius
Wooster travels to Albion for the first time since their memorable 2005 NCAA tournament matchup
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 05, 2009, 06:52:26 PM
Media Day is no more, a victim of budget cuts, but the coaches still were polled as to their thoughts on the conference race, and that poll was released today (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mb.html).  The results:

1.  Wooster (9)...99
2.  Ohio Wesleyan...79
3.  Wabash...78
4.  Wittenberg (1)...74
5.  Hiram...65
6.  Allegheny...50
7.  Kenyon...42
8.  Denison...31
9.  Earlham...21
10. Oberlin...11
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 06, 2009, 09:48:58 AM
I bet Moore didn't vote himself #1, but the question is did Cavaco vote his team 9th instead of 10th??  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 06, 2009, 01:42:31 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 06, 2009, 09:48:58 AM
I bet Moore didn't vote himself #1, but the question is did Cavaco vote his team 9th instead of 10th??  ;)

Do NCAC coaches rank all ten teams in the preseason poll -- in other words, do they slot their own teams as well -- or do they just rank the other nine?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 06, 2009, 01:48:33 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 06, 2009, 01:42:31 PMDo NCAC coaches rank all ten teams in the preseason poll -- in other words, do they slot their own teams as well -- or do they just rank the other nine?
They vote for all ten, their own teams included.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 06, 2009, 06:20:36 PM
Breaking news:  A Wooster player is named to the D3hoops.com preseason All-America team (http://www.d3hoops.com/all-american/womenpreseason10.htm).  See if you can guess who? ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 07, 2009, 10:07:44 AM
Wooster has posted their Season Outlook on the COW website and here is the link:
http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Season-Outlook

The outlook notes that Wooster could very well play 3 teams in the Top 5 nationally in the D3Hoops Preseason Poll - #1 Washington University, #2 John Carroll and #4 St. Thomas.  Wooster could also play at #19 Randolph-Macon in a December tourney as well.   Splitting these 4 tough games would be a good result especially since the JCU and RMC matchups are very tough road games.

Good luck to Wooster in the exhibition game tonight vs. D1 Kent State! :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 07, 2009, 03:23:31 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 03, 2009, 02:13:15 PM
I wasn't really expecting video, which I suppose depends on Clear Picture (or whatever the cable outfit is called) broadcasting the game.
During today's broadcast (i.e., webcast) of the Wooster football game, the announcers have said repeatedly that tonight's Kent St. game will be aired "next weekend."  I presume that means that Wooster locals who subscribe to Clear Picture will be able to see it then--although it is to be hoped that they will go watch it live this evening--but that it won't be rebroadcast via Wooster.edu/Teamline.

Please forgive the netiquette breach of quoting myself. :-[

-----------------------
EDIT: It now seems that the game will receive an audio broadcast from the Wooster student radio station WCWS "Woo 91", which will be streamed on the internet (http://www3.wooster.edu/woo91/).  Hooray!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 07, 2009, 07:25:29 PM
Anybody know why Ian Franks is not playing tonight (at least, not so far, about 12 minutes in)?
EDIT: The Woo91 commentators say he has a twisted ankle and is sitting out.  Scots are doing pretty well considering that neither Franks nor Johnson is available.

Wooster has new home uniforms, which for a change are white rather than the old gold they've been wearing for some time now.  You can see them in this short video, courtesy of Woo 91.  Video link (http://twitvid.com/4801E).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 07, 2009, 10:59:11 PM
Game report indicates that the Scots led early, but were overtaken late in the first half and then Kent went on to a 17-point victory.  The Wooster write up (http://wooster.edu/Athletics/Athletics-News/2009/November/Mens-Basketball-Recap-2009-10-Kent-State) indicates that over $5,000 was raised for the Corey Cline Fund, including a $1,000 gift from the three officials of the game.

It looks like freshmen Jake Mays, Josh Claytor and Justin Warnes all received significant time.  Mays led all Wooster scorers with 12 and Claytor had a team-high 8 boards.  Nice early contributions from these three, who are all slotted ahead of Reed, Evans and Maybeny on the current depth chart, it would seem
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 08, 2009, 12:59:29 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on November 07, 2009, 10:59:11 PMIt looks like freshmen Jake Mays, Josh Claytor and Justin Warnes all received significant time. 
Warnes is a sophomore (http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Roster).  The Woo91 commentators were speculating (or perhaps they knew) that he was a JV last year--I can't remember, and don't have my JV roster from last season out here.  I bet wooscotsfan or imderekpoe can answer this for certain.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 08, 2009, 09:48:28 AM
I was in attendance last night for the game.

Prior to the game both Coach Cline and Coach Moore took a moment to thank Coach Ford and the KSU players and the referees for their gesture (I joked with my dad when they said that the refs had donated their pay for the night that this meant we had to be nice to the officials  :P).  It was a pretty touching moment and I'm not ashamed to admit that I had to fight back the tears.   The crowd gave them a very nice standing O and the KSU players were returning the favor.  Coach Ford and his players were a class act for sure!

As for the game, I thought Wooster fared pretty well considering Wooster's top 2 point guards were on the bench in street clothes.  Usually depth at the guard position has been a luxury for the Scots, but last night they had to go with only a 3 guard rotation.  Not to mention, Greg Ross was on the bench in street clothes as well.

My dad had gone to the alumni game and he said he wasn't too impressed with how the team looked against the alumni.  But he said they definitely looked much better in their effort vs. KSU.  I have to say, I was very impressed with both Claytor and Mays.  Mays is very quick around the basket and he doesn't waste too much time taking it strong to the hoop.  They both more than held their own against much bigger KSU bigs.  Not to mention that KSU's starting frontcourt were seniors that these 2 frosh were going up against. 

Another player that impressed me was Warnes.  He's going to be tough to keep out of the rotation.  He had a real scrappiness in his play especially on the defensive end.  He made several nice plays defensively.

All in all, KSU was just too big and too deep for Wooster.  The Flashes had a guard that went 220 and it was a solid as a rock 220!  It was a fun experience to see a team like Kent St. on the floor at Timken.  And it was also nice to see that over $5000 was raised for the Corey John Cline Fund from an exhibition game!  While it would have been nice to see a bit larger of a turnout, drawing nearly 2000 fans for an exhibition game is not too shabby. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 08, 2009, 10:49:42 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 08, 2009, 09:48:28 AM
As for the game, I thought Wooster fared pretty well considering Wooster's top 2 point guards were on the bench in street clothes.  Usually depth at the guard position has been a luxury for the Scots, but last night they had to go with only a 3 guard rotation.  Not to mention, Greg Ross was on the bench in street clothes as well.

I have to say, I was very impressed with both Claytor and Mays.  Mays is very quick around the basket and he doesn't waste too much time taking it strong to the hoop.  They both more than held their own against much bigger KSU bigs.  Not to mention that KSU's starting frontcourt were seniors that these 2 frosh were going up against. 

Another player that impressed me was Warnes.  He's going to be tough to keep out of the rotation.  He had a real scrappiness in his play especially on the defensive end.  He made several nice plays defensively.


It was great to see a Division I team play at Timken last night.  I fully agree with ScotsFan on 3 points that he made:

1.  Ballhandling was Wooster's downfall with Ian Franks and Brandon Johnson both on the bench last night.  The Scots had 21 turnovers and that was too much to overcome against Kent State.  Word in the gym was that Franks would have played if it was a regular season game and on a very positive note, Brandon Johnson has been practicing hard and may see playing time in the near future.

2.  Justin Warnes was the 3rd guard last night and played with a lot of hustle.  He had 7 points and 4 assists coming off the bench and he will probably see some court time even after Franks and Johnson return.

3.  Josh Claytor and Jake Mays are FANTASTIC RECRUITS! ;D  These guys played like Juniors last night vs. a Division I team!  Claytor got the starting nod last night and rightly so because this guy is an athletic 6'7" player who can handle the ball and create his own shot.  He led Wooster with 8 boards and chipped in 7 points.  He reminds me some of Tom Port but he is bigger physically and not quite as fast as Port.  Claytor has a very fluid shot and passes the ball well for a big guy.

Jake Mays is a big 6'8" post who is very mobile and fluid around the basket.  He held his own against KSU's stout bigger frontline.  Mays led the Scots with 12 points on 6 of 8 from the floor and he added 5 boards.

Claytor and Mays will be a very tough pair for most D3 teams to handle.  Combined with Wickliffe and Hallowell, Wooster now has an impressive 4 man rotation up front that most teams will not be able to match.  Gideon Mabeny will be the 5th big guy off the bench playing defensive minutes.

Summary:  Wooster has the talent and depth to win the NCAC again and make another strong run in the NCAA tourney, IMO.  :)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 08, 2009, 10:52:28 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 08, 2009, 12:59:29 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on November 07, 2009, 10:59:11 PMIt looks like freshmen Jake Mays, Josh Claytor and Justin Warnes all received significant time.
Warnes is a sophomore (http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Roster).  The Woo91 commentators were speculating (or perhaps they knew) that he was a JV last year--I can't remember, and don't have my JV roster from last season out here.  I bet wooscotsfan or imderekpoe can answer this for certain.

Yes, Justin Warnes played on the JV team last year.  Actually if you check last season's boxscore, you will also find that he even had 1 minute of varsity playing time. :D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 08, 2009, 01:48:45 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 08, 2009, 10:52:28 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 08, 2009, 12:59:29 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on November 07, 2009, 10:59:11 PMIt looks like freshmen Jake Mays, Josh Claytor and Justin Warnes all received significant time.
Warnes is a sophomore (http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Roster).  The Woo91 commentators were speculating (or perhaps they knew) that he was a JV last year--I can't remember, and don't have my JV roster from last season out here.  I bet wooscotsfan or imderekpoe can answer this for certain.

Yes, Justin Warnes played on the JV team last year.  Actually if you check last season's boxscore, you will also find that he even had 1 minute of varsity playing time. :D ;)

I knew I should've double-checked class years before my post.  Looks like he might be a nice addition to the varsity this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 10, 2009, 03:25:54 PM
Matt Croci promises a more up-tempo, guard-oriented, three-pointer attack at Kenyon this season.  With Bryan Yelvington and Allen Bediako gone to graduation, and the last couple of recruiting seasons being guard-heavy, he's trying to open up the offense to take advantage of their area of depth as well as take some pressure off Dave Knapke in the post.  This will put more pressure on JT Knight, but Croci assures us that he's up to the challenge.  He also talks up the improvement in Uros Vasiljevik's game, and profiles his incoming frosh and the conference race.  Listen to Croci's podcast here (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x30914.xml).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 12, 2009, 02:24:02 PM
From Woo 91's Twitter feed (http://twitter.com/WOO91):
"Jason and Andrew just had a great interview with Wooster Men's Basketball coach Steve Moore. It will air this Friday (tomorrow)."
Woo 91 is the college radio station, and they stream live to the web from their home page (http://www3.wooster.edu/woo91/).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 12, 2009, 05:54:37 PM
There's some very funny stuff going on regarding the Wooster/Wittenberg "Mascot Face-Off" in preparation for the football game this weekend.  One particularly humorous episode involves Wooster alum Bob Dyer, whose daughters Carrie (basketball) and Kimmie (volleyball) play for Wittenberg, making a pro-Witt spot, and getting a reaction from the Wooster Dean of Students.  You might want to check this site out before it goes away, which it might do after this weekend. 
http://www.mascotfaceoff.com/
I think this is an excellent way to remind us that this is in essence a friendly rivalry, something that is sometimes forgotten during basketball season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 13, 2009, 09:41:17 AM
Tip-off weekend has finally arrived for us Scots fans!   ;D

The Wooster DR had an article in yesterday's paper previewing the season.  It was a locked article on their website for subscribers only so that is why I didn't link it.

The article did have some good news wrt Brandon Johnson.  Moore said in the article that Johnson has recovered enough and should be available to contribute off the bench on Sunday at Albion!

It also stated the potential of just how versatile of lineups Coach Moore could be using throughout the season.  They could go very guard oriented by having Franks, Johnson and Balch all on the floor togeter or they could go with a very front-court oriented lineup with the potential of having no-one under 6-4 on the floor and they could do that without moving players out of their natural positions!  The example used in the preview was Mabeney (7-0), Mays (6-8), Claytor (6-7), Hallowell (6-7) and Franks (6-4).  Pretty scary proposition for a lot of opponents to have to deal with that rotation.

Moore also said that there are 13 players in the mix vying for playing time right now.  He also said he didn't expect that all 13 would see action in the regular rotation on Sunday.  Moore added that they are still trying to work out who their regular subs will be.

I really think this team has the potential to be a special team.  While the loss of Marty was significant from a leadership perspective and the energy he brought on the floor, I really think that Brandon Johnson can fill that role and then some if he can stay healthy.  And when you combine Johnson's return with the addition of the new bigs to the rotation, I think there is no question that Wooster has the potential to be a much improved team from a year ago!  And that's scary considering they won 23 games last season!   8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 13, 2009, 04:51:47 PM
Highlights of Coach Moore's interview with the Woo91 student broadcasters:
* Justin Hallowell will be playing the small forward position this year.  This is partly due to the fact that it suits his game more ("posting up is not his game so much"), partly because his ball handling and defensive skills are improved, and partly because there's now more depth in the 4/5 positions.
* Josh Claytor will start at the power forward position.  Moore took pains to avoid comparing Claytor to Bryan Nelson, but the similarities are there.
* Jake Mays is a true center, and he'll be first off the bench to spell Wickliffe at the 5.  He is a good jumper who has the ability to rebound in a crowd, something that is "rare at this level."
* For the record, that means that the starting frontcourt will go 6'5", 6'7", 6'7", with the smallest of these being the center, who will be spelled by a 6'8" guy.  That maybe isn't titanic, but it's pretty big for Wooster teams of the recent past, and they're all pretty athletic to boot.
* With the addition of Claytor and Mays, Moore hopes to return Wooster to a half-court team with fast-breaking ability, much like the Gorman/Ellenwood/Nelson teams of the early part of this decade.  He actually had to give the students a little Scot basketball history lesson when they suggested that Wooster has a long tradition of being perimiter-oriented. 
* Moore confirmed that, pending what happens in the last few practices, Johnson will play at Albion, "probably not as a starter."  He'll probably start out playing cautiously, more of a true point guard than a scoring guard like he was prior to his injuries.  The interviewers made a good point when they said that, last year, we were hoping that BJ would stabilize a team that was young and inexperienced at guard, which neither happened (re-injury) nor was ultimately necessary due to the emergence of Franks and Balch.  This year, the interviewers noted, is different, since now guard is well-covered if not terrifically deep, so where does that leave Johnson?  Moore replied that, if nothing else, Brandon will provide the leadership and defensive stopper capabilities that were handled by Bidwell last year.
It was a pretty good interview.  I've never paid any attention to Woo91 before, if they even had a sports department, but they've started this season strongly in my opinion.  I wonder if they're planning on broadcasting women's games?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 13, 2009, 10:39:40 PM
The Citadel holds Kenyon to 31% shooting and drops the Lords, 64-45 tonight in Charleston.  Kenyon, which never led, was still within 8 at the half, but 20 KC turnovers combined with Citadel's 36 points in the paint doomed the Lords.  JT Knight led the Lords with 15 points (3 for 4 from the arc), and Dave Knapke added 11 boards.  The Lords started a three-guard lineup with Knight, sophomore Anthony Chun, and frosh Marcus Healey, while Knapke was joined down low by 6'7" junior Uros Vasiljevik.  Senior A.J. Clair, just 6'4", was the only other post player to see the floor, while a total of seven guards, none taller than 6'3", saw action.  Kenyon gets the regular season underway at home on Sunday afternoon vs. Muskingum, with Kenyon providing webstreamed video, audio, and Live Stats coverage (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml).

Citadel/Kenyon box score (https://www.nmnathletics.com//pdf5/655926.pdf?ATCLID=204833211&SPSID=43218&SPID=3830&DB_OEM_ID=9700) (PDF)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 14, 2009, 11:15:08 AM
I was hoping that interview with Coach Moore would be available for podcast, but unfortunately I could not find anything.

As far as Woo91 goes, it does appear that they are making more of an effort to develop their sports dept.  I used to be a huge fan of their radio play when their focus was more on devoting a large part of their airplay to indy bands.  But the last few years, it seems more hit and miss for indy music being played.

The radio station did appear to have a feed set up at the KSU game and they were doing promos and such during the game.  It will be interesting to see if they will continue that throughout the season or if it is just more of a special events type of promotion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 14, 2009, 12:36:16 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 14, 2009, 11:15:08 AM
I was hoping that interview with Coach Moore would be available for podcast, but unfortunately I could not find anything.
Yeah, I figured as much.  That's why I tried to take good notes so I could relate as much of the substance as possible.

Quote from: ScotsFan on November 14, 2009, 11:15:08 AMThe radio station did appear to have a feed set up at the KSU game and they were doing promos and such during the game.  It will be interesting to see if they will continue that throughout the season or if it is just more of a special events type of promotion.
They did broadcast/webcast the KSU game, and did a pretty good job of it.  But I'd rather they concentrate on other sports, especially women's hoops, that aren't already covered by WQKT and ClearPicture.  A third broadcast option (fourth, if you count the visiting team) for Wooster home games is not something we really need.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 15, 2009, 02:56:05 PM
First "uh-oh" moment of the season: JT Knight is not in Kenyon's starting lineup.  I'm not sure if he's in the layup line or not; if he is, he has a Mohawk, as do several other Lords.
UPDATE: No, he's there, and he came in after a couple of minutes.  Kenyon looks awfully shrimpy next to Muskingum, who is out to an early big lead.  Maybe it's the new home grey unis that make them look so small.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 15, 2009, 03:33:07 PM
At the Half:  Albion 26  Wooster 24

Wooster played a sloppy first half and Albion leads at the break.  Bryan Wickliffe is leading the Scots with 12 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 15, 2009, 03:37:04 PM
Sloppy half is right wsf!

Bryan Wickliffe is 5-8 shooting while the rest of the Scots have only made 4 baskets as a TEAM! :o

So, when looking at it from that perspective, Wooster is fortunate that the deficit is only 2.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 15, 2009, 03:46:36 PM
At the half, it's Muskingum 39, Kenyon 29.  Kenyon does not look good offensively, defensively, sartorially, or (especially) tonsorially.  A thoroughly mediocre-looking Muskingum team is having their way so far.  Frosh Marcus Healey (9), Knight and Knapke (8 apiece) have provided almost all of the scoring for the Lords.

S(n)ide note: I'll sure be glad when the stupid football season ends, for server reasons among many others.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 15, 2009, 04:14:49 PM
Feels like Wooster is playing 5 on 8 in this game.  Albion is in the double bonus and has been in the bonus since the 11 minute mark of the 2nd half.  Wooster still not in the bonus yet.

And Wooster still leads by 3 with seven to go.

Wooster is now down 3 with just 3 seconds to go.

Albion does the smart thing and fouls Franks in the backcourt.  And yet more homerism as apparently it takes 2 1/2 seconds to foul someone immediately...   ::)

This gym continues to be a house of horrors for Wooster.  ???

And the game ends as Albion wins 57-55.

In the end, it was just a sloppy sloppy game for the Scots.  Wooster now needs to regroup in a big way for their next game vs CMU in their home opener on Friday!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 15, 2009, 04:35:46 PM
Final:   Albion 57  Wooster 55  ???

Not a good opening game for the Scots.  Wooster lost this game due to 33% shooting and 18 turnovers.  Scots were led by Bryan Wicklliffe with 18 points and Justin Hallowell with 11 points. 

Albion was led by Chris Hutton with 16 points and Andre Bridges with 13 points.

Wooster is 0-1 with the Al Van Wie tourney next weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 15, 2009, 04:55:51 PM
Kenyon uses defense and hustle to stay in the game, but their comeback falls short as Muskingum prevails 77-73.  The final margin was a close as the Lords got in the wire-to-wire win by the Muskies.  JT Knight led all scorers (off the bench) with 26, while Dave Knapke contributed 19 points and 17 boards. 

Classic postgame interview with Matt Croci; he's a real breath of fresh air who doesn't seem to know coachspeak, even when the interviewer is begging for some positives:
(paraphrased)
Interviewer: You guys finished strong.
Croci: We started terribly.
Interviewer: Muskingum started strong, but you clawed back into it.
Croci: We can't do that. 
Interviewer: Knapke had a great game.
Croci: Nobody except Knight stepped up to help him.  We can't win as a two-man team.

-----------------------------

At halftime, Denison and Marietta are tied at 25.  Neither team is shooting well (MC 33%, DU 30%) and they''ve combined for 19 turnovers so far.  DU's Larry Farmer and MC's Kevin Knab lead the scoring (9 apiece) and rebounding (5 and 6, respectively) columns.

-----------------------------

Oberlin drops visiting Mt. Aloysius 85-77 to open the season 1-0.  Frosh Andrew Fox led the Yeo wit 20 points and 8 boards; fellow frosh Jonathan Nelson chipped in 17 and 6, while soph. Marcus Johnson added 18.  Oberlin shot 53% and forced 24 Mt. Aloysius turnovers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 15, 2009, 05:36:40 PM
A couple positives from an otherwise frustrating day in what has to be the Scots' least favorite gym ever:

Brian Wickliffe put up a solid double-double, 18-10 I believe.  Breckenridge (Woo broadcast) noted that he seemed very active and was getting himself involved in the game.  It's too bad he missed the layup at the end, but otherwise a good first outing for the Wooster junior.

Brandon Johnson had an shooting day to forget, but he seemed to make an immediate impact on the defensive side with several steals.  He also was pushing the fastbreak at several points, and even though today a lot of those seemed to end up in turnovers, I expect more fastbreaks will connect in the future.  Plus, it's just great to see him back out on the basketball court for Wooster.  Welcome back, Brandon!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 15, 2009, 05:55:36 PM
Marietta edges Denison, 57-50.  It seems (from Live Stats) that the Big Red kind of fell apart down the stretch in a game that was close throughout.  In the last 5:16, they could only manage five free throws as the game edged out of reach.  Larry Farmer and Chris Luther led the home team with 16 points each; Farmer also added 9 boards to share the team high with frosh Dimonde Hale.

------------------------------------

Youngstown State is laying the wood to Hiram, presently 79-38 with a bit more than a minute left.  The YSU play-by-play guy is hilarious, calling each Penguin basket as if it were an Argentinian goal.  I wonder what he's like in a close game.  Hiram is shooting the ball miserably, even taking into account the mismatch.  Now gone final, 81-41 for YSU.  I see that Andrew Wiegand is not on Hiram's roster for this season, but everyone else seems to be back (except the graduated Ian Pfouts, of course.)

------------------------------------

Earlham is also in a mismatch, trailing at Manchester 50-29 at the half.  Sophomore Shane Heidt has 13 points, but the Spartans are cooly canning two-thirds of their field goals and have a ridiculous 28-7 rebounding advantage.
UPDATE: Manchester eases out to a 79-63 final. 

-------------------------------------

So the NCAC starts out 1-5 (1-7 if you include the women), with the only victory being recorded by....Oberlin?!?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on November 15, 2009, 08:09:26 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 15, 2009, 04:35:46 PM
Final:   Albion 57  Wooster 55 

Ouch ... I didn't see that coming.  I'm sure it's a VERY long bus ride back to Wooster after that outcome.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BogeyMan on November 15, 2009, 10:31:07 PM
ScotsFan:

I find it interesting that the foul shots were:
Wooster 12 for 17
Albion 8 for 16
Looks to me like Wooster should of fouled more with Albion shooting 50% from the line.

The 2.5 seconds off the clock was after the player caught the ball and took two short dribbles up the sideline and started to go around the defender.  The defender grab him from behing.  Nothing shady about the 2.5 seconds at all.

From what I heard about last year's game when Wooster won in OT at Wooster the same 5 on 8 comment should of been made by the Albion fans.  Count the foul shots last year then complain about homerism!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2009, 12:58:05 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 15, 2009, 04:14:49 PM
Feels like Wooster is playing 5 on 8 in this game...

Quote from: BogeyMan on November 15, 2009, 10:31:07 PM
From what I heard about last year's game...

I wonder if it is possible for us to have a rule that bars complaining about refereeing in games we didn't actually see.  Or would that be just too idyllic?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BogeyMan on November 16, 2009, 06:47:48 AM
I think official bashing should be barred altogether especially when the team you are rooting for loses.  I did go to both games and I do know the answer to the question on how many foul shots were taken last year.  I am from Ohio and could care less about who won either game.  I just don't like reading posts from people who whine about the officiating if their team loses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 16, 2009, 08:46:22 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 16, 2009, 12:58:05 AM
I wonder if it is possible for us to have a rule that bars complaining about refereeing in games we didn't actually see.  Or would that be just too idyllic?

Sorry I didn't measure up to your 'idyllic' expectations...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 16, 2009, 09:41:04 PM
Hey guys! Long time no post, sorry for my absence but I'll apparently be the voice of Wittenberg on the boards again this year.

I"ll be in attendance at Wittenberg's opener vs UC Clermont tomorrow night and will give my thoughts.

Just a note, Wittenberg will be without two returning contributors from last year, Josh Mckee and Micheal Cooper as they're still in football season
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 17, 2009, 03:57:41 PM
And on the same note, Wabash gets their season underway tonight with a roadie at NAIA Marian College University (whoops) in Indianapolis.  I won't be there, but I will be listening and following live stats (http://scoreboard.marian.edu/scoreboard/mbball/xlive.htm).  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 17, 2009, 06:41:13 PM
Not sure if anybody has previewed Wabash in here yet, so I'll give a quick IMO style preview before the LGs get tipped off tonight...

Wabash is bringing back 4 of their 5 starters, with only Brian Maloney (5.5ppg/4.6rpg) having been lost to graduation.  The only other senior Wabash lost was Mark Turpin who played just 38 minutes last season. 

Returning is the bulk of Wabash's production.  Leading the way, obviously, is Wes Smith who made 1st team all NCAC one year ago as a sophomore.  Wes is clearly the key player for Wabash as the teams best offensive and defensive player. 

Also returning is Aaron Brock who struggled through injury last year before finally having to shut it down prior to the end of the regular season.  Brock can be very good when healthy (recall the nasty run he went on just before and through the NCAC tournament two seasons ago).  Brock will be Wabash's primary offensive threat in the painted area. 

Chase Haltom, Wabash's long distance specialist, is also back.  Haltom has big range and commands a close guard well outside of the 3 point line.  Haltom is reportedly in fantastic condition and hopefully has added a tad more consistency to his jumpshot (he's been a very streaky shooter in the past). 

In place of Maloney it looks like Wabash will turn to Ben Burkett and Nick Curosh.  Burkett has shown some flashes of promise and I'm really excited to see Curosh in his sophomore season.  Curosh missed some time last year with illness, and I'm not sure he ever quite got back to being right.  Healthy and with a year of college level conditioning, I think he could be a big factor in the paint for Wabash (I'm looking for him to be a big rebound guy for the LGs). 

Point guard was split last year between Andrew Gilman and Brian Shelbourne...Wabash's season really turned around when Shelbourne was inserted into the starting lineup.  I'll be interested to see this evening if Shelbourne will be the guy starting at point guard for Wabash. 

I see these guys being the main players for Wabash this season.  Also expect significant bench contributions from Derek Bailey and senior Rich Kavalauskas...every year every team needs to win a game where the 7th or 8th guy in the rotation steps up big and these two are the surprise guys that I expect to see pop up in a headline or two this year. 

I'll confess to not knowing too much about Wabash's freshmen, so I can't comment too much there. 

Season outlook....I really think that Wabash can be quite good this year.  The last two years we've seen Wabash tread water until mid January, then go in the tank for about three weeks, then flip a switch and make a run to the tournament final.  With so much of the group returning (many of them for their 3rd full year of varsity level play), the expectation has to be that the midseason swoon isn't happening...or at least shouldn't happen.  This group is too veteran to drop six straight conference games again.  I expect that Wabash will be near the top of the standings (I don't know if Wabash can outduel Wooster for the regular season championship) and be ready to challenge the Scots again in the tournament...at which point anything can happen. 

Less than an hour until the season gets going...here's hoping Wabash can turn around this early season tail kicking that the NCAC seems to be taking! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 17, 2009, 07:04:34 PM
And it is Shelbourne that starts for Wabash tonight.  

Wabash trails 14-8 about halfway through the first half.  So far for Wabash, Wes Smith is 3-5 with 7 points.  The rest of the team is 0-5.  That will need to change.  Marian's announcers sound like they expect Marian to have a much improved team over the last couple of years.  This game should be a strong test for Wabash.  

Wabash is pretty sloppy with the ball.  9 turnovers so far.

Wabash played about 3 minutes there with a full second 5 on the floor.  That was not a good stretch for Wabash.  The starters are back on the floor.  Marian can't miss on 3 point shots.  26-14, Marian with 6 minutes to go in the first half.  

Halftime at Marian: Marian 38, Wabash 25.  Wes Smith leads all scorers with 11 points.  Aaron Brock leads the game with 6 rebounds.  But Wabash is having trouble scoring the basketball and turning it over.  Haltom and Brock are combined 1-6 which won't cut it.  Wes can't do all the scoring.  Let's go Wabash!  

Good start for Wabash in the second half...LGs get the first 4 points to get the lead under 10 for the first time in a while.  

Wes Smith gets a triple and has 20 points.  LGs are chipping away...down 42-36 now.  

13 minutes to go and Wabash won't let Marian get away.  Gilman hits a three for Wabash and the score is 47-42 for the Knights.  Marian answers with a three...50-42.  Dang.  

Wabash turnover turns into a layup and Marian goes up 52-42 with 11 minutes to go.  Timeout Wabash.  Wabash keeps making mini-runs but then gives it right back with turnovers.  Haltom is still without a field goal.  If he can find the range in the last 10 minutes, Wabash will have a chance here.  

And here come the LGs again...Wabash turns Marian over and Wes Smith gets a layup.  6 minutes to go, Marian leads 57-49.  Haltom is 0-5, all 3 point attempts.  Wabash really needs him to get one of those to go down the stretch here.  

Make it 0-7 for Haltom...most of them have been described as "too strong".  Sounds like Chase is a little too amped up for game 1 tonight.  61-50 with under 4 minutes to play.

Wabash always fights!  2 minutes to go and Wabash has chipped it down to 63-59.  

Marian's Alex Sylvester gets a shooters roll and puts the Knights up 65-59 with 59 seconds to play.  Timeout...let's see what Coach Petty can draw up here.  

Brock scores a layup for Wabash with 40 seconds to play.  65-61.  

Curious move as Wabash does not press and allows the clock to hit 30 seconds before fouling.  Marian's free throws are split.  66-61.  And Wes Smith is whistled for an offensive foul on the other end.  That one hurts.  Wabash gives the foul with 20 seconds to go.

Marian splits the foul shots again, Wes gets an easy layup.  67-63...12 seconds to go.  Wabash needs a turnover in the worst way.  

And it's all over in Indy.  Marian defeats Wabash 68-65.  Wabash made a strong run in the second half, but when you spend the second half working your FG% up to 35.5%, you're going to have a hard time.  Wes Smith had 28 and 9, Brock had 15 and 12...the third prong of the attack, Chase Haltom, struggled to 1-8 (0-7 3PT FGs) for just 4 points.  Wabash travels to Maryville, TN this weekend for a little 4 team powow.  I believe Wabash is scheduled to play the host Maryville who made the tournament last season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 17, 2009, 08:30:57 PM
Wittenberg is having no trouble with UC-Clermont so far, leading by 21 early in the 2nd.  The only noteworthy thing to report so far is that the Tigers were 7/14 from the arc in the first half.  The Witt announcers were suggesting that there'd never be another game where they shoot that many treys, and it's not like Clermont is a good litmus test for a "normal" game, but it's still impressive.

Update:  Witt wins, 91-65.  I'll let pennstghs handle any recap he feels is necessary.

Quote from: wally_wabash on November 17, 2009, 07:04:34 PMWabash travels to Maryville, TN this weekend for a little 4 team powow.  I believe Wabash is scheduled to play the host Maryville who made the tournament last season.
I don't know why the Wabash site doesn't specify the matchups (or didn't, last time I checked), but my understanding is that Wabash will face LaGrange on Saturday (http://lagrange.edu/athletics/basketball/schedule.htm) and the host Scots on Sunday (http://www.maryvillecollege.edu/athletics/schedule-mn-basketball.asp?sportNameID=5&sy=8).  See also: D3hoops.com schedule (http://www.d3hoops.com/school/BASH/mens/2010).

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 17, 2009, 09:37:01 PM
Thanks David for the privilege haha.

Pretty ho hum win for Wittenberg tonight, although to be honest it probably shouldn't have been as close as it was. Wittenberg seemed to play down to their opponent a little but overall it was an easy win and a good way to start the season.

To note, Wittenberg's road gets extremely tougher starting Friday at Gettysburg classic vs Catholic and then either Gettysburg or Messiah and then an intra-state battle vs Capital next week.

Wittenberg has returned to the days where their size can overwhelm opponents. Off the top of my head, I don't think any team will be able to match Witt's post size and depth. Similarly to last year, this is a deep team that can go 10-12 deep easily.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 18, 2009, 10:21:35 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 17, 2009, 09:37:01 PM
Off the top of my head, I don't think any team will be able to match Witt's post size and depth.

Have you looked at Wooster's roster lately?  The Scots appear to be able to match...   8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 18, 2009, 10:35:42 AM
Yes that's true, however to clarify I should have put no one will be able to match the experience of post players....maybe Wooster can, but from past experience Wooster plays a more up tempo, guard oriented offense that isn't focused on post players as heavily.

Wittenberg is also playing a more up tempo game this year, as last year scoring 91 points vs anyone wasn't even a thought. Just somethign to keep in mind.

A few other discussion points:

-- since everyone I'm sure is concerned, the officiating last night was flawless and fair

-- Wittenberg had a nice crowd last night as well. They actually have a student section this year (meaning students dressing up and participating rather than just sitting there). We'll see how this transpires throughout the year

--I"ll try to stay as active as possible so this can be an NCAC board, not just Wooster and Wabash discussion all day every day.

+ karma
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 18, 2009, 10:57:05 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 18, 2009, 10:35:42 AM
--I"ll try to stay as active as possible so this can be an NCAC board, not just Wooster and Wabash discussion all day every day.

+ karma

Awesome.  +k for you as well!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 18, 2009, 01:31:53 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 18, 2009, 10:35:42 AM
-- since everyone I'm sure is concerned, the officiating last night was flawless and fair
;D

Quote from: pennstghs on November 18, 2009, 10:35:42 AM
--I"ll try to stay as active as possible so this can be an NCAC board, not just Wooster and Wabash discussion all day every day.
Great!  If you're interested in discussing Wittenberg women's hoops (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=726.360) as well, we'd love to have you!  (And by "we," I mean "I"!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 18, 2009, 03:07:11 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 18, 2009, 10:35:42 AM
Yes that's true, however to clarify I should have put no one will be able to match the experience of post players....maybe Wooster can, but from past experience Wooster plays a more up tempo, guard oriented offense that isn't focused on post players as heavily.


I figured you were coming from an experience standpoint.  Yes, Wooster has been running a more up-tempo, guard oriented offense and I would expect that to continue this yearto a certain extent.  But, at the same time, it wasn't all that long ago when Wooster ran a more deliberate, half court offense that was centered around the post.  I wouldn't be surprised to see this Wooster team, with the addition of what appears to be 2 pretty decent freshmen bigs, go back to their roots a bit more this season...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on November 18, 2009, 09:34:07 PM
I was at the Albion game.  If you call that "up tempo" then we have a long way to go with our basketball philosophy.   :-\

It was a disappointing effort all around for the most part.  Scots will be ok I think after a while, but they may go through more downs than ups early on.  I'm sure the fellas shoot the ball much better than they did, just were out of sink.  Got beat by a much worse team, though Albion...or anywhere in Michigan is a tough place to play. 

This weekend will be a big weekend for the Scots as hopefully they matured quickly over this past week.  Let's get it goin fellas!!  GO SCOTSS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2009, 01:48:39 AM
Earlham joins Oberlin and Wittenberg in the NCAC Parade of Winners, downing Franklin this evening 83-78 on the Grizzlies' home floor.  The EC took a two-point lead to the half, and the teams traded the lead back and forth over the first 14 minutes of the second half, until AJ Sutherlin buried a three to give the Quakers a one-point lead with 5:59 remaining.  Franklin managed to forge a tie with 4:09 left, and had a chance to regain the lead when Kyle Calder robbed FC's Scott Trueblood and fed Shane Heidt for a fastbreak layup, giving Earlham a lead they'd not relinquish.  Franklin got within a single point on several occasions, but Earlham converted six-of-six free throws down the stretch to seal the win.  Heidt and Sutherlin did most of the damage, scoring 26 and 25 respectively.  The Quakers allowed their hosts to hit 59% of their shots, but hit 52% themselves, were much better from the free throw line (14/16 vs. a woeful 8/17 for FC), and took care of the ball (just 9 turnovers), all adding up to their first win of their last NCAC season.  Box score. (http://goearlham.com/custompages/men%27s%20basketball/2009-10/erlm1118.htm)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2009, 02:51:52 PM
Full slate this weekend around the league.  All times Eastern.

Tonight:
Kenyon vs. Haverford 6pm (at Swarthmore - Live Stats available from Swarthmore via Kenyon.edu (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml))
Baldwin-Wallace at Hiram 7:30pm (Live Stats available at Hiram.edu (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html); Live Audio available from B-WC's WBWC radio (http://www.wbwc.com/))
Allegheny at Westminster 8pm (Gators' season opener - Live Stats and Live Audio available at 'Gheny men's hoops page (http://www.alleghenysports.com/index.aspx?path=mbball))
Wittenberg vs. Catholic 8pm (at Gettysburg - Live Stats and Live Audio available at Wittenberg.edu (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html))
Carnegie Mellon at Wooster 8pm (Live Stats, Live Audio, and Live Video available at Wooster.edu (http://www.wooster.edu/en/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule))
Oberlin at North Central 8:30pm (Live Stats available from Oberlin.edu (http://www.goyeo.com/index.aspx?path=mbball&tab=basketball))

Tomorrow:
Kenyon vs. Swarthmore 1pm (at Haverford - Live Stats available from Haverford via Kenyon.edu (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml))
Allegheny vs. Emory & Henry 2pm (at Westminster - Live Stats available at 'Gheny men's hoops page (http://www.alleghenysports.com/index.aspx?path=mbball))
Denison vs. Goshen 3pm (at Hanover - Live Stats available at Hanover.edu (http://www.hanover.edu/athletics/men/mbasketball/mbkschedule))
Oberlin vs. Lakeland 3:30pm (at North Central - Live Stats available from Oberlin.edu (http://www.goyeo.com/index.aspx?path=mbball&tab=basketball))
Wittenberg vs. Messiah 4pm (Live Audio available at Wittenberg.edu (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html) - Live Stats and PPV Video from Gettysburg (http://www.gettysburgsports.com/sports/2009/11/16/MBB_1116090919.aspx?path=mbball))
Wabash vs. LaGrange 5pm (at Maryville TN - not sure about coverage)
Earlham at Chicago 7pm (Live Stats and Live Video available at UChicago.edu (http://athletics.uchicago.edu/mensbasketball/mbk-midwayclassic-2009.htm))
Ohio Wesleyan vs. Washington U. in St. Louis 7pm (at Illinois Wesleyan - Bishops' season opener - Live Stats available at WUSTL's site (http://bearsports.wustl.edu/mensbball/mensbball.html))
St. Thomas at Wooster 8pm (Live Stats, Live Audio, and Live Video [presumably] available at Wooster.edu (http://www.wooster.edu/en/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule))

Sunday:
Wabash at Maryville TN 4pm (not sure about coverage)
Denison at Hanover 5pm (Live Stats and Live Video available at Hanover.edu (http://www.hanover.edu/athletics/men/mbasketball/mbkschedule))
Earlham vs. TBA (at Chicago - either vs. Southwestern at 2pm or vs. Rose-Hulman at 6pm, depending on Saturday outcomes, Live Stats available at UChicago.edu (http://athletics.uchicago.edu/mensbasketball/mbk-midwayclassic-2009.htm))
OWU vs. TBA (at Illinois Wesleyan - either IWU or Johnson & Wales - consolation at 3pm, championship at 5pm - Live Stats and Live Audio via IWU.edu (http://www.iwusports.com/index.aspx?tab=basketball&path=mbball) if they are the opponent)

Corrections welcome -- also check the D3hoops.com scoreboard page (http://www.d3hoops.com/scores/) for updated coverage information.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2009, 07:40:47 PM
In a game with the momentum swinging back and forth, the last swing favored Haverford, and Kenyon goes down to a 70-60 defeat.  It was close throughout; the final score indicates the shoot-and-foul style Kenyon had to resort to in the last couple of minutes.  As usual, JT Knight (21 pts., 10 reb.) and Dave Knapke (14 pts., 7 reb.) led the way, and as usual they got little support from the rest of the roster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2009, 07:49:14 PM
Looks like Wooster is charging $15 for the video webcast (http://www.teamline.cc/sportpage?teamcode=1100&eventcode=6).  Harumph! >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 20, 2009, 07:51:34 PM
Gettysburg is charging 5.95 for the "paperview" broadcast to watch on video. I'll take the WUSO 89.1 radio cast for free and watch UNC/Syracuse instead!

Good luck Witt---time for a huge weekend

Tiger Up!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 20, 2009, 08:08:19 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 20, 2009, 07:49:14 PM
Looks like Wooster is charging $15 for the video webcast (http://www.teamline.cc/sportpage?teamcode=1100&eventcode=6).  Harumph! >:(

It'd be nice if they did that at least as a $15 for both (Wooster) games of the tournament.  Limiting me to listening to WQKT and the live stats.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 20, 2009, 08:46:45 PM
At the Half:   Wooster 37  Carnegie Mellon 31

Wooster played a reasonable first half with 9 players scoring points.  Bryan Wickliffe is leading the Scots with 8 points, Brandon Johnson has added 6 points and Justin Hallowell has chipped in with 6 points.

For CMU, Jack Anderson has 11 points, Jon Wolleben has 6 points and John Duhring has 6 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2009, 09:07:07 PM
Elsewhere...

Witt is on a 16-0 run, 25-4 since halftime, and is annihilating Catholic 60-27, 9:28 left...FINAL: Witt 70, Catholic 45...Witt got 15 guys onto the floor, and 13 of them scored or rebounded (or both).  Nowicki with 17, Hill had 11, and Black had 11 rebounds.

Hiram has led since the 14:xx mark and looks to close out Baldwin-Wallace, 76-68 with 1:44 left....FINAL: Hiram 82, B-WC 72...Roberts with 23 on 8 for 12 shooting; Terriers clean the boards 49-31 and shoot 53% overall.

Allegheny leads at Westminster 62-50 with 14:42 left.  UPDATE: Gators on a run, now up 20 (73-53) with 9:42 left...FINAL: Allegheny 100, Westminster 77...I guess Westminster is still using that silly System, resulting in 'Gheny shooting 58%.  4 Gators in double figures (Raftis 24, Briscoe 20).

Oberlin's one-game winning streak is in serious jeopardy, as they trail at North Central 37-16 at the half...FINAL: NCC 70, Oberlin 38

Wooster now on top of CMU 57-45, 9:18 left.  UPDATE: Wooster is about to win, details below courtesy of wooscotsfan.

As noted above, Haverford upended Kenyon 70-60.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 20, 2009, 09:47:21 PM
Final:   Wooster 74  Carnegie Mellon 61  :)

Wooster played a solid 2nd half to notch the win.  Wooster was led by Justin Hallowell with 17 points (5 three pointers), Bryan Wickliffe with 13 points, freshman Josh Claytor with 12 points and Nathan Balch with 11 points.

Carnegie Mellon's top scorers were Jack Anderson with 21 points, John Duhring with 10 points and Jon Wolleben with 10 points.

Wooster is now 1-1.  Next up is #4 St. Thomas in the tourney championship game tomorrow night.  Wooster will have to play much better tomorrow if they are going to knock off the Tommies.

St. Thomas thumped Heidelberg 92-55 in the opening tourney game this evening.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2009, 10:11:21 PM
(Updated with pairings)

Saturday:
Kenyon vs. Swarthmore 1pm (at Haverford - Live Stats available from Haverford via Kenyon.edu (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml))
Allegheny vs. Emory & Henry 2pm (at Westminster - Live Stats available at 'Gheny men's hoops page (http://www.alleghenysports.com/index.aspx?path=mbball))
Denison vs. Goshen 3pm (at Hanover - Live Stats available at Hanover.edu (http://www.hanover.edu/athletics/men/mbasketball/mbkschedule))
Oberlin vs. Lakeland 3:30pm (at North Central - Live Stats available from Oberlin.edu (http://www.goyeo.com/index.aspx?path=mbball&tab=basketball))
Wittenberg vs. Messiah 4pm (Live Audio available at Wittenberg.edu (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html) - Live Stats and PPV Video from Gettysburg (http://www.gettysburgsports.com/sports/2009/11/16/MBB_1116090919.aspx?path=mbball))
Wabash vs. LaGrange 5pm (at Maryville TN - Live stats available from Maryville (http://www.maryvillecollege.edu/athletics/livestats/mens-basketball/index.asp))
Earlham at Chicago 7pm (Live Stats and Live Video available at UChicago.edu (http://athletics.uchicago.edu/mensbasketball/mbk-midwayclassic-2009.htm))
Ohio Wesleyan vs. Washington U. in St. Louis 7pm (at Illinois Wesleyan - Bishops' season opener - Live Stats available at OWU.edu (http://bishops.owu.edu/))
St. Thomas at Wooster 8pm (Live Stats, Live Audio, and "Free Video" available at Wooster.edu (http://www.wooster.edu/en/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule))

Sunday:
Wabash at Maryville TN 4pm (Live stats available from Maryville (http://www.maryvillecollege.edu/athletics/livestats/mens-basketball/index.asp))
Denison at Hanover 5pm (Live Stats and Live Video available at Hanover.edu (http://www.hanover.edu/athletics/men/mbasketball/mbkschedule))
Earlham vs. TBA (at Chicago - either vs. Southwestern at 2pm or vs. Rose-Hulman at 6pm, depending on Saturday outcomes, Live Stats available at UChicago.edu (http://athletics.uchicago.edu/mensbasketball/mbk-midwayclassic-2009.htm))
OWU vs. TBA (at Illinois Wesleyan - either IWU or Johnson & Wales - consolation at 3pm, championship at 5pm - Live Stats and Live Audio via IWU.edu (http://www.iwusports.com/index.aspx?tab=basketball&path=mbball) if they are the opponent)

Corrections welcome -- also check the D3hoops.com scoreboard page (http://www.d3hoops.com/scores/) for updated coverage information.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: waterboy on November 20, 2009, 11:44:40 PM
It was nice seeing a familiar NCAC face tonight in Witt. After a slow start, the Tigers pulled away from Catholic late in the first half thanks to hot shooting from Nowicki and a consistent effort on the boards. Catholic went ice cold in the second half, leading to Wittenberg's big run. The bigs did a nice job down low getting the team second chances and Hill really adds another element to the game that was definitely missing last season from what I gather.

The Tigers should not have too much trouble beating Messiah tomorrow. It was a bit of a yawner between the Falcons and Bullets, with a few threes here and there keeping the hosts in it. Messiah was unimpressive in the win, so I look for Witt to win by double figures especially if they can shoot a little better from the field.

Just some thoughts from an NCAC alum. Good luck to everyone in the NCAC this season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2009, 12:26:40 AM
Wooster's site (http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule) proclaims that tomorrow's Van Wie championship game will have "Free Video." (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.criterionforum.org%2Fforum%2Fimages%2Fsmilies%2Feusa_clap.gif&hash=58c9d09f87bbd0001327fe2361d77a4bc2c28f6c) (Tuesday's game vs. Ohio Northern, who is now 0-2 by the way, is still listed as "Live Video.") 

Nice to "see" you again, waterboy.  Very surprised at Gettysburg's loss tonight; I hope you rebound vs. Catholic and have a good season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 21, 2009, 11:46:10 AM
Some thoughts on Wooster's tough opponent tonight -- #4 St. Thomas

The Scots will need to slow down the Tommies three best players who are all starters:

Joe Scott 6'4" Senior, Shooting Guard,  Preseason All-American 2nd Team by D3Hoops
13.4 ppg last year, 49% FG, 41% on three pointers with 71 made

Tyler Nicolai 5'11", Junior, Guard, scored 14 last night vs. Heidelberg
9.5 ppg last year, 48% FG, 43% on three pointers with 57 made

Anders Halvorsen 6'9" Junior Center, had 8 points, 5 boards vs. Heidelberg in limited minutes
7 ppg last year, 57% FG, big guy who hits the boards

St. Thomas plays aggressive team defense so it will be important for Wooster to take care of the ball and not commit a lot of turnovers.

St. Thomas usually outrebounds its opponents so Wooster will also need to neutralize them on the boards.

I am looking forward to seeing a great game at Timken tonight! :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2009, 01:54:46 PM
Kenyon takes a nine-point lead (39-30) to the locker room; they had led Swarthmore by 15 with 1:45 left, but allowed the Garnet to score the last 6 points of the half--three of them on free throws after Anthony Chun fouled Will Gates beyond the arc as the half ended.  That should make for a very unpleasant locker room.  Trying to find a combination that will help out the Knight and Knapke show, Matt Croci tried a new starting lineup today, replacing Uki Vaseljevik, Jay Findlay, and frosh Marcus Healey with AJ Clair, Tim Shadyac, and frosh John Beaulieu.  So far, so good.
UPDATE: Lords cruise in the second half, winning their first game of the season by a score of 71-56 (or thereabouts--Haverford's LiveStats has been a little squirrelly, and is stuck with 0:11 remaining).  Guess Who Sr. and Guess Who Jr. lead the way with a combined 37 pt., 20 rebound afternoon.  KC outshoots (47% to 27%) and outrebounds (45-36) the Garnet, overcoming another miserable day from the arc (4 for 25 today, 12 for 59 for the weekend.)

------------------------

Allegheny is manhandling Emory and Henry, leading 41-25 at the break.  'Gheny has made 52% of their field goals, down from 58% yesterday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on November 21, 2009, 02:50:44 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 21, 2009, 12:26:40 AM
Wooster's site (http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule) proclaims that tomorrow's Van Wie championship game will have "Free Video." (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.criterionforum.org%2Fforum%2Fimages%2Fsmilies%2Feusa_clap.gif&hash=58c9d09f87bbd0001327fe2361d77a4bc2c28f6c) (Tuesday's game vs. Ohio Northern, who is now 0-2 by the way, is still listed as "Live Video.") 

In my two years at Wooster, I don't think that the Scots have ever charged a fee for a regular-season broadcast.  In the NCAC tournament (at Wooster for the last several years), the conference sets the fee.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2009, 03:34:29 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on November 21, 2009, 02:50:44 PMIn my two years at Wooster, I don't think that the Scots have ever charged a fee for a regular-season broadcast.  In the NCAC tournament (at Wooster for the last several years), the conference sets the fee.
That's why yesterday's $15 tariff was so surprising.

---------------------------------

Allegheny holds off E&H, winning 78-63.  The Gators had gotten the lead out to 24 with about 7:00 remaining, but a 9-0 Wasp run over the ensuing two minutes led to Rob Clune's reinsertion of his starting five.  The starters, all of whom scored in double figures today, quelled the run and 'Gheny coasted home.  George Raftis led the way with 18 points and 9 boards, as 'Gheny cops the Buzz Ridl Classic title.

---------------------------------

Denison is hanging tough with Goshen down in Hanover, tied at 31 with about 5:00 to go before halftime.  Chris Luther has hit five of his first six shots for 12 early points.
UPDATE: DU uses a 14-2 run to take a 7-point lead inside 7:00 to go.
UPDATE: Going to OT, tied at 77; DU frosh Dimonde Hale fouls outside the arc with 0:02 left, and the Goshen guy makes all three FTs to tie the game.
UPDATE: Goshen pulls out the victory, 87-84; DU, setting up a potential game-winning play, has the ball stolen and Goshen's Jeremy Pope hits the buzzer-beating triple for the win (this must have been at least a half-court heave, as the steal was made with 0:01 on the clock after a :20 DU possession.)  A real heartbreaker for the Big Red, especially since Goshen, now 5-2 and with a win over NAIA-II's seventh-ranked team in the books, was a heavy favorite.

---------------------------------

Lakeland is having little trouble with Oberlin, leading 50-25 early in the 2nd. 
UPDATE: 65-42 Lakeland, 8:16 left.
UPDATE: Oberlin made a run at them, closing to within 13, but it looks like Lakeland will survive, leading 71-58, 2:05 left.
UPDATE: Final, Lakeland 77, Oberlin 63

---------------------------------

Wittenberg starts the game ice-cold and trails Messiah 37-24 at the half.  Witt shooting just 9 of 32 (28%).
UPDATE:  Witt is also making a run, getting with 6 before a technical foul on Clayton Black puts Messiah back up by 8, 44-36, 14:07 left.
UPDATE: Getting exciting; Witt is within 3, 57-54, with 2:28 to go.  Witt just 5 of 12 from the free throw line, and right now that's the difference in this game.  How's this for balance: Witt has 10 players with points, none of them with more than 8 (and four players have that many.) 
UPDATE:  Hill and Sullivan drain quick threes in back-to-back possessions and Witt has the lead, 62-61, 0:40 left and Nowicki at the line shooting 2.
UPDATE:  Witt pulls it out!  Final score, Witt 66, Messiah 61.  Gregg Hill was just 4 for 19 today, but hit a big three to give Witt the lead and then two free throws to ice the victory.

---------------------------------

Maryville College's Live Stats program gave up the ghost just 34 seconds into the Wabash/LaGrange game.  Oh well.
UPDATE: Still down.
UPDATE:  Wabash wins, 81-63.

---------------------------------

IWU's Live Stats are down, too, so no live updates of what is sure to be OWU's earth-shaking upset of #1 Wash U.  Actually, I think the blame lies with sidearmsports.com, the vendor of the (awful) Live Stats program; I've had problems with this product all across America today.
UPDATE: The program is up now, but it says that the game has yet to begin.
UPDATE:  OWU leads by 8, 27-19, with 8:00 left in the 1st period.
UPDATE: Bishops go cold, Wash U. goes on a 17-4 run to take the lead.  Now 38-34 WUSTL, 2:25 left.
UPDATE:  OWU recovers and goes into halftime with a 45-41 lead.  Pat Pellerite with 14 on 5 of 7 shooting; OWU shooting 58% overall.
UPDATE:  Wash U. opens the half on a 10-2 run to lead by 4.
UPDATE:  WUSTL has opened a 12 point lead, 64-52, behind some hot three-point shooting.  13:00 left.
UPDATE: It's all Bears now, as they've outscored the Bishops 33-9 since halftime.  74-54, 9:23 left.
UPDATE:  Final score, Wash U. 85, Ohio Wesleyan 68.  A respectable effort from the Bishops, considering what we all know WUSTL is capable of.

---------------------------------

In the meantime, Chicago leads Earlham 19-11, 10:xx left in the first.
UPDATE: Chicago 47, Earlham 28, halftime.
UPDATE:  Chicago 55, EC 44, 11:14 2nd.
UPDATE:  UC 82, Earlham 69, 1:37.
UPDATE: Chicago 84, Earlham 71, Final.

---------------------------------

Wooster is being dominated early by UST, who leads 23-8 with 9+ minutes left.  Wooster looks completely clueless on both ends.
UPDATE: Halftime, UST leads 48-23.  Ouch.
UPDATE: At least it's not an in-region game. :)
UPDATE:  John Finn: "Tommies lead 79-52, 3:51 left in regulation."  In regulation!  That's it, John, stay positive!
UPDATE: Final, UST 84, COW 53.  Wooster looked terrible, but some of that is because St. Thomas looked so good.  They'd get my #1 vote if I had one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2009, 10:40:22 PM
(Updated with pairings, assumes that J&W will not come back from a 22-point halftime deficit tonight)

Sunday:
Earlham vs. Southwestern 2pm (at Chicago - Live Stats available at UChicago.edu (http://athletics.uchicago.edu/mensbasketball/mbk-midwayclassic-2009.htm))
OWU vs. Johnson & Wales 3pm (at Illinois Wesleyan - Live Stats via IWU.edu (http://www.iwusports.com/index.aspx?tab=basketball&path=mbball))
Wabash at Maryville TN 4pm (Live stats available from Maryville (http://www.maryvillecollege.edu/athletics/livestats/mens-basketball/index.asp))
Denison at Hanover 5pm (Live Stats and Live Video available at Hanover.edu (http://www.hanover.edu/athletics/men/mbasketball/mbkschedule))

Corrections welcome -- also check the D3hoops.com scoreboard page (http://www.d3hoops.com/scores/) for updated coverage information.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 21, 2009, 11:13:46 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 21, 2009, 11:46:10 AM
Some thoughts on Wooster's tough opponent tonight -- #4 St. Thomas

The Scots will need to slow down the Tommies three best players who are all starters:

Joe Scott 6'4" Senior, Shooting Guard,  Preseason All-American 2nd Team by D3Hoops
13.4 ppg last year, 49% FG, 41% on three pointers with 71 made

Tyler Nicolai 5'11", Junior, Guard, scored 14 last night vs. Heidelberg
9.5 ppg last year, 48% FG, 43% on three pointers with 57 made

Anders Halvorsen 6'9" Junior Center, had 8 points, 5 boards vs. Heidelberg in limited minutes
7 ppg last year, 57% FG, big guy who hits the boards

St. Thomas plays aggressive team defense so it will be important for Wooster to take care of the ball and not commit a lot of turnovers.

St. Thomas usually outrebounds its opponents so Wooster will also need to neutralize them on the boards.

Back from Timken where I watched #4 St. Thomas absolutely dismantle Wooster. :-[  I don't usually quote myself but in this case my worst fears were realized.

1.  Tyler Nicolai had 20 points, Anders Halvorsen had 14 points and Joe Scott added 9 points as the Tommies top 3 scorers

2.  St. Thomas played very aggressive defense and Wooster buckled with 18 turnovers vs. only 8 turnovers for the Tommies.

3.  St. Thomas won the rebounding battle 28 to 21.

Two other key stats also tell the story of this lopsided game:

4.  Wooster went over 5 minutes in the first half with NO points while St. Thomas ran off 12 points.  The score was 11-8 St. Thomas and went to 23-8 before the Scots scored again.  Key question:  Who is Wooster's "go to" scorer when they need a bucket?  So far this season, I don't see such a player.

5.  Points off Turnovers:  St. Thomas 26  Wooster 0

I agree with David Collinge -- St. Thomas would also get my vote for #1 in the nation.

Wooster is 1-2.  Next up is Ohio Northern at home on Tuesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 21, 2009, 11:27:16 PM
One other observation -- Wooster really needs to work on their offensive sets.  The Scots did not pass the ball crisply tonight and there is not enough movement and picks off the ball.  In the first half tonight, Wooster only made 7 field goals due to poor offensive execution and excessive turnovers.

Wooster is relying too much on one on one drives to the basket that often result in turnovers.  Ian Franks was a casebook example of this tonight as he turned the ball over 4 times when he was pressured in the lane by St. Thomas.

The Scots must take better care of the basketball or they will lose to the tougher teams on their schedule.

Here are Wooster's cumulative team stats after 3 games:  30 Assists and 50 Turnovers ::)

The good news is that the season is still early and Wooster has the talent and coaching staff to get these issues corrected.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 21, 2009, 11:39:36 PM
Well, I'm not sure of the last time I saw Wooster get so thoroughly beaten by a simply superior team, and on their own floor to boot.  I only watched the second half of this one, but one half was enough to make it clear that UST already looks like its in mid-season, even post-season form, while Wooster doesn't yet look to be in any form at all.  UST had their way inside, had their way outside, shooting nearly 60 percent for the game while taking 22 more shots thanks in large part to collecting 7 more rebounds and forcing 10 more turnovers.  Tonight, at least, the Tommies looked better than even the best Wooster teams of recent years that I can remember.  Impressive performances up and down their bench--the UST bench logged 39 to the starters' 45 pts. tonight.


As for Wooster, for a team that essentially returned all of its scoring from the previous year the Scots seem in near total disarray on the offensive end.  Turnovers coupled with poor shooting are simply crushing their ability to be effective.  From my viewpoint tonight, (and again, I was only watching once this one was already decided) the Scots looked listless on the offensive end--no energy, not enough movement, no one seeming to take the leading role and spearheading the attack.  While I must give UST immense credit for their defense, which was stellar, even Wooster's "good" passes just didn't seem crisp, the attack didn't seem purposeful, and they just seem to lack direction.  Calling the Carnegie Mellon game, Mike Breckenridge said that Wooster seemed to be missing a cylinder, even last night on a game they won—tonight they looked like they were missing two or three cylinders.


What's not clear to me yet is whether this is still something of an early season "we're-still-adjusting-to-playing-together" funk, caused perhaps by re-inserting Brandon Johnson in a new lineup and rhythm unlike the earlier Wooster teams he played on plus getting Claytor, Mays, Mabeny and others fitting into new roles; or if this is a "we're-really-just-not-as-good-as-initally-advertised" funk that will hang around for Wooster's year.  Among individual players, Ian Franks and Brandon Johnson just don't seem to have gotten going yet.  Franks, the team leader in scoring a year ago at 15.5 ppg, is struggling to find the basket this year, shooting only 30 percent from the floor.  Johnson, who will probably never be 100 percent on his knee this year, hasn't yet found the range either, also shooting around 30 percent.  Right now, though, the Scots are definitely underperforming their talent offensively, and I'm no longer exactly sure when that ship will be righted, especially with the quality of opponents still facing Wooster down on their schedule.


Defensively, it's obviously never a "good" defensive effort when your opponent registers 58% shooting on you, but even while I'm sure Wooster could've done much better—especially on their interior defense—St. Thomas was just that good.  Even on their best defensive night, I'm not sure Wooster could've held UST much below 50 percent tonight.  The Tommies offensive execution looked extremely well-coached and purposeful: fluid ball movement, effective driving, excellent shot selection, and great ball protection.  The only other times I recall seeing a team in Timken gym that showed that level of poise, drive and execution were from the "we're-hell-bent-for-Salem" Wooster teams during their final four runs—and UST is clearly a team of that caliber.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2009, 03:43:57 PM
Earlham captures the 4th Place Trophy at the University of Chicago's Midway Classic, dropping the consolation game to Southwestern 80-70.  EC hung with the Pirates for the first 30 minutes of the game, but the Texans finally pulled out to an 8-12 point margin which they more or less sustained down the stretch.  Four Quakers scored in double figures, led by Shane Heidt's 21.

--------------------------

OWU outlasts Johnson & Wales, 73-65, in the consolation game at Illinois Wesleyan.  This is a game I expected the Bishops to win fairly easily; maybe they weren't motivated, or maybe J&W is better than I thought.  OWU got behind early and played a sloppy first half with something like 19 turnovers, but scored the half's last five points to tie the game.  The Bishops then held their opponents scoreless for the first 4:52 of the second, and while they only accumulated six points in that stretch, it was enough to give them a lead they wouldn't relinquish.  Pat Pellerite had 18 points and 8 rebounds before fouling out with 2:54 left.  Tim Brady, Dillon McBride, and Marshall Morris also scored in double figures for the Bishops, who ended up shooting 52% for the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 22, 2009, 04:50:20 PM
Halftime in Maryville:
Wabash 40
Maryville 32

Wabash is being led by (surprise) Wes Smith and his 12 points.  Chase Haltom has chipped in with 11 first half points.  Maryville is led by their preseason All-American Eryk Watson's 10 points.  This would be a pretty solid road win for the Little Giants if they can hold on.  WAF!

Ten minutes to play:
Wabash 61
Maryville 57

Wes and Chase continue to pace Wabash.  Maryville has come back with some hot three point shooting.  Watson is on the bench with 4 fouls.  

5 minutes to play:
Wabash 66
Maryville 71

Maryville has stormed back behind seven three point field goals in the second half.  

Under 2 to play:
Wabash 76
Maryville 76

Wabash has turned Maryville over a couple of times and picked up some layups to tie the game.  This one is going down to the wire!  Smith has 22, Haltom 19 for Wabash.

They've stopped updating the livestats, so I have to assume that the game is over.  The final score (I think):
Wabash 79
Maryville 86

Maryville exploded in the second half with three point plays (7 three point field goals and at least three basket plus a foul plays).  Wabash just wasn't able to keep pace with Maryville's 54 point outburst.  Wabash slips to 1-2 on the season.  Next up for Wabash will be Franklin College on the Monon Bell-less campus of DePauw University next Saturday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2009, 05:21:47 PM
Watching the Denison/Hanover game from beautiful Collier Arena (in beautiful Hanover, IN).  They have a three-camera setup for this (free) videocast--what splendor!  See link on previous page.  Hanover has the early lead as Denison is trying nothing but threes.  Interesting note: Hanover has a frosh guard from Carmel named Nowicki--surely the little brother of the Wittenberg player.

Hanover leads at the half, 30-23.  Denison is playing good defense, but their offense is fairly lifeless, they're turning it over too often trying to force the tempo, and they're being badly outrebounded, giving the Panthers second, third, and even fourth looks.  Still they made a nice run towards the end of the half to cut a 14-point deficit in half.  Frosh Dimonde Hale may not make the best decisions (see yesterday's recap), but on video he's a nice-looking player, lanky and yet athletic.

DU's offense looks much sharper early in the second half, but already in the first 4 minutes they've allowed two second-chance hoops to Hanover.  Poor rebounding is killing this team.  DU got to within 3 early, but it's back out to 15, 50-35, about midway through the half.  Hanover is getting the ball inside with few problems, while the Big Red has gone back to the three-only offense at the same time that they've gone cold.  Inside the last two minutes, Hanover started missing free throws and Chris Luther started hitting threes, but the only result was to make the final score a little more respectable: 69-57.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 22, 2009, 07:24:01 PM
Well I'm a little tardy on my comments from last night, but I'm with Bryan in that I can't remember seeing a Wooster team so thoroughly dismantled as they were last night by UST.  I knew the Tommies has a good team, but I didn't expect them to be 30 points better than Wooster.

And I don't like the look of that stat that WSF posted.  Only 30 assists so far through three games to go along with 50 turnovers???   ???  That's not Wooster basketball!

I had one question.  Where has Jake Mays been?  Is he injured or something?  I wasn't able to attend either game but I watched them on Clear Picture and he made zero appearances over the weekend.  I couldn't tell if he was on the bench or not.  Anyone have any idea of why he was missing in action this weekend?

The Scots don't have long to regroup as they have yet another tough contest with an OAC contender in ONU on Tuesday.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2009, 07:57:51 PM
Mays has the flu or some such malady.  He wasn't at the Van Wie, from what I understand; I think he was at home, recuperating.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 23, 2009, 09:14:29 AM
Thanks for the info David.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 23, 2009, 03:45:03 PM
Pre-holiday schedule around the conference

Tuesday:
Oberlin (1-2) at Waynesburg 7pm (Audio? (http://www.waynesburgsports.com/index.aspx?tab=basketball&path=mbball))
Denison (0-3) at Case Western Reserve 7:30pm
Washington & Jefferson at Kenyon (1-2) 7:30pm (Live Stats, Audio, Video (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml); follows conclusion of women's game vs. ONU, also with LS/A/V coverage)
Ohio Wesleyan (1-1) at Defiance 7:30pm (Live Stats (http://www.defianceathletics.com/))
Capital at Wittenberg (3-0) 7:30pm (Live Stats, Audio, Video (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html))
Ohio Northern at Wooster (1-2) 7:30pm (Live Stats, Audio, Video (http://www.wooster.edu/en/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule))

Wednesday:
Hiram (1-1) at Mt. Union 7pm (Live Stats (http://www2.muc.edu/athletics/men_s_teams/basketball/))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 24, 2009, 04:51:59 PM
Allegheny's George Raftis, twice an all-conference honoree, has gotten his senior season off to a roaring start, with a 42 point, 16 rebound effort en route to being named the MVP of the Buzz Ridl Classic at Westminster.  For his strong weekend, George has also been named the season's first NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html).  Congratulations, George!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 24, 2009, 08:06:27 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 35  Ohio Northern 29

Ohio Northern built a 11 point lead (23-12) off Wooster turnovers and then the Scots went on a 14-0 run to retake the lead at the half.  ONU is being led by Tony Meyer with 11 points and Ezra Bradshaw with 5 points.

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 12 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 9 points, Josh Claytor with 5 points and Justin Hallowell with 5 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 24, 2009, 08:12:53 PM
Some other scores:
OWU 35, Defiance 32...half
Wittenberg 43, Capital 28...half
Kenyon 41, Washington & Jefferson 31...half
No updates on the Oberlin or Denison games
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 24, 2009, 09:08:38 PM
Final:  Wooster 70  Ohio Northern 64   :)

Wooster played a better game tonight with only 13 turnovers to get the win.  Scots were led by Ian Franks with 22 points, Justin Hallowell with 16 points (4 three pointers), Bryan Wickliffe with 9 pts and 8 boards, and freshman Josh Claytor with 8 points, 4 steals.  Brandon Johnson hit a big three pointer with only 1:24 remaining after ONU had cut the lead to just 3 points.

Ohio Northern's top scorers were Ezra Bradshaw with 22 points, Kyle Meyer with 12 points, Tony Meyer with 11 points and Matt Phillips chipped in 10 points.

Wooster is now 2-2.  Next up is a road game at John Carroll on Sunday afternoon.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 24, 2009, 09:14:20 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on November 21, 2009, 11:39:36 PM
Among individual players, Ian Franks and Brandon Johnson just don't seem to have gotten going yet.  Franks, the team leader in scoring a year ago at 15.5 ppg, is struggling to find the basket this year, shooting only 30 percent from the floor.

Ian submits the following rebuttal to my comments above:
Franks vs. ONU:  22 pts on 9-14 shooting, 3-5 FTs, 6 boards and 4 assists.

:)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 24, 2009, 09:16:39 PM
More finals:
Wittenberg 79, Capital 69
Oberlin 63, Waynesburg 51
Kenyon 83, Washington & Jefferson 72
Defiance 74, Ohio Wesleyan 71
Case Western Reserve 67, Denison 57

Overall, 4-2...and 2-0 vs. the OAC :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 24, 2009, 09:57:24 PM
Wittenberg had a nice victory tonight over a average Capital team. They were outmatched by Witt, but Coach Goodwin's team like usual had a tenacious defense and actually cut a 15 point Wittenberg lead into 6 with under 4 minutes to play. Sloppy play by Witt I thought with a lot of missed assignments out of the zone.

Gregg Hill had 35 points to lead Witt! Good start to the season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 24, 2009, 10:26:10 PM
A good comeback win for the Scots from the crushing defeat on Saturday,  I can't add anything new to the other reports on the St. Thomas game other than I thought the Scot's actually did a good job defending in the paint and denying the post pass in the first half. It's the offense that clearly looked lost. You just didn't know where the open shot was going to come from. I wasn't at tonight's game so I can't comment if it looked any better but 13 turnovers is definitely an improvement.

Another note - Brandon Johnson is only 4 points from 1000 for his career.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 25, 2009, 12:19:58 AM
I meant to post this observation before tonight's game, but wanted to wait until I saw them play in person before I did. And thankfully, coach Moore and Ian Franks illustrated my point perfectly.

The biggest change to the offense this season, up until tonight, was that Franks was not running the point, or at least being allowed to run the offense in the half court. I know it was probably logical thinking that Brandon Johnson would return to point guard, and Franks would slide over to the wing, but I felt that this would be a mistake, and I think it has already proven out.

Franks was Wooster's best player last year. In fact, when he was running the point, he was one of the best guards in the region. His struggles at the off-guard spot is not a surprise. Here are some numbers I wrote about last year that showed the difference in his play when he was the point guard vs. the off-guard.

Quote from: seinfeld on January 10, 2009, 06:49:44 PM
Another puzzling development has been the play of Ian Franks in recent games. In the first seven games of the year, Franks averaged 15.6 points per game and shot 54.8% (40-of-73) from the field and 39.1% from three-point range (9-of-23). In the last six games, he is averaging just 10.5 points per game (if you take away the last two minutes of the Mt. Union game, when he got eight points at the foul line when the Purple Raiders were fouling to stay in the game), his average would be 9.2 points per game. He is shooting just 37.7% from the field (20-of-53) and 18.2% from three-point range (2-of-11). Throw in three foul outs for good measure.

I don't think it is coincidence that his recent poor streak coincides with his movement to the two-guard position. It seems that his natural position would be shooting guard, but he put up better numbers when he was running the point. Maybe they need to use him more in that role.

As good as Johnson was in his first three years, he never put up a season like Franks did last year. To me, since Franks is your best player, he shouldn't be tinkered with. The rotation and distribution of the ball should be adjusted around him.

I think this became very clear tonight. For the first 10 minutes, Johnson did all the ball handling and Franks seemed lost in the offense. Then Franks returned to his role as the trigger for the offense, and he and the rest of the team exploded from there.

Johnson is obviously a very good player who will only get stronger and better as the year goes on, but it would be a big mistake, in my opinion, to change Franks' role in the offense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on November 25, 2009, 09:59:39 AM
Seinfeld.....

you posted "As good as Johnson was in his first three years, he never put up a season like Franks did last year. To me, since Franks is your best player, he shouldn't be tinkered with. The rotation and distribution of the ball should be adjusted around him."

Interesting.  They are two totally different players for one.  But the biggest difference i would totally have to say in terms of the number point wise and overall between BJ and IF are their supporting cast.  Or at that time, really back then BJ was more of a supporter not the main show. 
Here are some stats that I had a chance to look at.  And no offense at all against these Scots of 2009, but truth is, they are really a totally different team than the names you'll see below:

Brandon's 1st year he was 6,7,8 man playing 20 min/g 9.5ppg, 75assist, 49 steals.  Who he supported are names like: Cooper, Port, Witucky,VanHonrn, Vandervaart, Fulk, Bidwell, Will

BJ's 2yr and first year starting he played still about 20-25 min/g with 11ppg, 125ass, 63 steals.  He played with: Cooper, Port, Vandervaart, Fulk, Will, Bidwell, Geitgy,

BJ's 3rd year, same deal....11.3ppg, 105ass, 34 stls  with: Coop, Fulk, Will, Bids, Geitgy, Melick, and on the scence comes the big man who is playing so well now. 

So, the players they have been playing with are totally different.  I think Brandon was/is owed that chance being a leader on this team to help.  Now, IF is totally capable, but defensively they are going to need BJ's quickness if they are goin to make a run in the postseason.

THESE NEXT 4 GAMES could really either lift up the guys spirits or make for a long season.  LETS GO SCOTS WE'RE PULLIN FOR YA!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 25, 2009, 10:05:32 AM
Quote from: D3BASKETBALLFAN on November 25, 2009, 12:53:48 AM
Tough crowd...   but that is their entertainment, I guess.

And we all know how entertaining Ada can be...  :P

What's the main source of entertainment up there?  Watching the snow drift in the winter time?   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 25, 2009, 10:20:17 AM
Nice win for the Scots last night.  I wasn't in attendance, but caught the replay once again.

The first 10 minutes of the game looked as if it was UST deja vu.  ::)  Wooster was not executing offensively and being sloppy with the ball and at the same time they were being lazy once again on the defensive end not fighting through screens and allowing ONU a LOT of open looks.  Consequently, the Scots dug themselves a hole of as many as 11 points.  This forced Moore to call a timeout in which he was as animated as I've seen him in a while.  They didn't show the whole timeout on TV, but what I saw was Moore trying to implore his kids into making a better effort. 

Well, whatever he said in that huddle seemed to work as after Wooster trailed 27-17, they proceeded to end the half on a n 18-2 run to go into the locker room up 6.  And they continued to push the lead out from there leading by as many as 13 on a couple of occasions.  But give ONU credit.  They didn't go away and kept chipping away at the Wooster lead.  I have to say I was real impressed with that Bradshaw kid.  In the first half, not so much.  But in the 2nd half, he almost single handedly kept ONU in this game.

Things aren't getting any easier for the Scots as they will be taking on #2 JCU on Sunday after a short holiday break.  It would be nice to see them come back from Cleveland with a W!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 25, 2009, 04:23:54 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on November 25, 2009, 12:19:58 AM

Franks was Wooster's best player last year. In fact, when he was running the point, he was one of the best guards in the region. His struggles at the off-guard spot is not a surprise. Here are some numbers I wrote about last year that showed the difference in his play when he was the point guard vs. the off-guard.



I realize you are trying to make a larger point but in my opinion the best player on the Scots last year was Marty Bidwell. For certain he did not have the shooting skill than Ian has but what Marty did have was heart and leadership. Even though he is the only starter who was lost to graduation it is a big hole to fill. Brandon Johnson, being the only player left from the Final Four team, needs to fill that role.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 25, 2009, 08:08:08 PM
Quote from: goscots on November 25, 2009, 04:23:54 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on November 25, 2009, 12:19:58 AM

Franks was Wooster's best player last year. In fact, when he was running the point, he was one of the best guards in the region. His struggles at the off-guard spot is not a surprise. Here are some numbers I wrote about last year that showed the difference in his play when he was the point guard vs. the off-guard.



I realize you are trying to make a larger point but in my opinion the best player on the Scots last year was Marty Bidwell. For certain he did not have the shooting skill than Ian has but what Marty did have was heart and leadership. Even though he is the only starter who was lost to graduation it is a big hole to fill. Brandon Johnson, being the only player left from the Final Four team, needs to fill that role.
From a talent-wise perspective, Franks was the best player.  But, as you pointed out goscots, Marty's leadership is what set him apart from the rest of the team.  And that leadership is  proving harder to replace than I originally thought it would be.  I was hoping that Brandon would be able to fill that leadership role and he very well might do that as the season progresses but so far, I think that lack of a true leader is one of the things that is hurting this team.









Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 25, 2009, 08:19:52 PM
Not to shed more bad light on Woo's season opening loss to Albion, but the Britons just lost last night to Heide who went 0-2 and the Al Van Wie Tournament last weekend...  :-\

I know that whole schpeel about comparitve scores and all.  Just sayin' that loss is one that is looking worse by the day...  :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 25, 2009, 08:45:22 PM
Looks like Hiram didn't get the memo about the new-found dominance of the NCAC over the OAC.  Tonight they're really laying an egg at Mt. Union.  It's been a real trial to listen to it on the MUC radio feed, made bearable only by the laughable way the announcer has decided to pronounce "Eniola."  Anyway, MUC was already ahead by 19 by halftime, and Hiram hasn't shown much life in the second.  Hiram got badly outshot (47% to 35%) and outrebounded (44-32), although Babajide Whatsizname did contribute 17 boards and 10 points.  Final score: Mt. Union 75, Hiram 60.

Happy Thanksgiving, everyone!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on November 25, 2009, 10:29:04 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 25, 2009, 10:20:17 AM
Consequently, the Scots dug themselves a hole of as many as 11 points.  This forced Moore to call a timeout in which he was as animated as I've seen him in a while.  They didn't show the whole timeout on TV, but what I saw was Moore trying to implore his kids into making a better effort. 

I was sitting right behind the scorer's table, not far from the Wooster bench.  The time-out was called three minutes into the game, and I think that Wooster was down seven points at the time.  This is only my second season following the Scots, but I've never seen Coach Moore that upset with his team.  With a relatively small crowd in attendance, you could hear what was said, no matter where in Timken you were sitting.  At the end of that "speech," a big roar went up from the crowd.  The team definitely responded, and immediately turned up the defensive intensity.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 26, 2009, 09:29:57 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on November 25, 2009, 10:29:04 PM

I was sitting right behind the scorer's table, not far from the Wooster bench.  The time-out was called three minutes into the game, and I think that Wooster was down seven points at the time.  This is only my second season following the Scots, but I've never seen Coach Moore that upset with his team.  With a relatively small crowd in attendance, you could hear what was said, no matter where in Timken you were sitting.  At the end of that "speech," a big roar went up from the crowd.  The team definitely responded, and immediately turned up the defensive intensity.
For as mild mannered as Coach Moore is, he has been known to get quite animated in the huddle during timeouts.  It doesn't happen all that often but usually the whole crowd notices when it happens! 

One thing I know is that the players definitely needed a swift kick in the pants at that point in the game and they definitely responded.

Happy Thanksgiving everyone.  Be safe and don't eat too much!   ;D 
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fts4.mm.bing.net%2Fimages%2Fthumbnail.aspx%3Fq%3D1421687327059%26amp%3Bid%3D26f7c353fbb5277fb7902260a45ad78c%26amp%3Burl%3Dhttp%253a%252f%252fct.iscute.com%252fgraphics%252fwset1%252fturkey4.gif&hash=3ffd18a9fe9cfb6895f01e20bae0b8adfe747357)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2009, 07:53:38 PM
Earlham kicks off a busy holiday weekend by dropping a nailbiter to The University of the South, 87-81 (OT), at Rhodes College in Memphis.  It's always a little difficult to recreate action from the terrible Sidearm Stats version of Live Stats, but it appears that Sewanee's Lewis Affronti hit a three-pointer (excuse me, he "dialed up a three from long distance" ::)) in the waning seconds of regulation to force OT.  (It's also possible that the OT was forced by two free throws by EC's Shane Heidt with 0:01 left; that the sequence is not clear is one of my many complaints about this awful program.)  Sewanee jumped out to a quick six-point lead in the OT.  Earlham closed to within one on a trey (er, "a rainmaker from downtown") from Justin Barger midway through the period, but those were the last Quaker points as Barger and teammate Dustin Rusk misfired on three treys and two free throws while the Tigers were connecting on five of six free throws.  Earlham drops to 1-4 and will face the host Lynx tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on November 27, 2009, 08:08:57 PM
It's always sketchy using dial-up. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2009, 10:13:04 PM
...especially from long distance!

Now, about that busy holiday weekend:
> Allegheny is hosting their National City Tournament; they play Montclair St. tomorrow and either Case Western Reserve or Wilmington on Sunday
> Denison plays at Mt. St. Joseph on Sunday
> Earlham, as noted above, plays at Rhodes tomorrow
> Hiram is idle
> Kenyon travels to Kalamazoo tomorrow
> Oberlin plays at Westminster Sunday
> Ohio Wesleyan is at Albion tomorrow
> Wabash is playing at DePauw's Mike Rokicki Community Versus Cancer Challenge, where they'll face Franklin tomorrow and either Washington & Jefferson or their genial hosts Sunday
> Wittenberg is idle
> Wooster takes on #2 John Carroll at JCU's DeCarlo Varsity Center on Sunday

I'm too lazy to post links.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2009, 04:20:20 PM
Some scores:
Kenyon 80, Kalamazoo 74...Matt Croci says Kenyon can't win as a two-man team. Well, maybe not always, but it can happen, like today.  JT Knight goes for 33, including eight treys (of 11 chances), Dave Knapke contributes 23 points, and the two combine for 17 rebounds (8 and 9, respectively).  Jay Findley (13) and Anthony Chun (11) break into double figures as well.

Albion 62, Ohio Welseyan 52...OWU's disappointing start to the season continues at Kresge Gym, graveyard of NCAC teams.  Tim Brady had 14 to lead OWU's balanced (11 scorers) but ultimately feeble (35%, just 2 of 20 from the arc) attack. 

Earlham 87, Rhodes 79...AJ Sutherlin with 32 points & 15 rebounds. 

Allegheny 95, Montclair St. 68...Gators led 52-15 at one point of the first half, and coasted from there.  Double-double (21 & 12) from Big George in just 25 minutes; three others in double figures.

Wabash 95, Franklin 84...see below.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 28, 2009, 09:39:14 PM
I'm following livestats from Virginia tonight...Wabash has gone bonkers since your last update, David.  Currently the LGs are leading Franklin 77-60 with 8 minutes left in the game.  Seems balance is the name of the game for Wabash tonight.  Scoring so far for Wabash:
Ben Burkett - 12 points
Wes Smith - 11
Chase Haltom - 10
Nick Curosh - 10
Aaron Zinnerman - 8
Brian Shelbourne - 8 (make it 10 for Brian)

In my dreams, Wabash gets this kind of balance more than three times this year.  

And it's final from Greencastle:

Franklin 84
Wabash 95

Wabash was up by as many as 21 in the second half and never really threatened by Franklin in the final 20 minutes.  Final tallies on the aforementioned balanced scoring:
Wes Smith - 15 points (Wes also added 6 steals)
Ben Burkett - 14 points
Chase Haltom - 13 points
Aaron Brock, Nick Curosh, and Brian Shelbourne - 10 points

Wabash shot 69.1% from the field and unless you're playing Grinnell, there's pretty much no way to shoot 70% and lose.  I'm guessing this sets up a Sunday game agaisnt DePauw tomorrow afternoon.  WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2009, 11:15:55 PM
DePauw beat W&J, 76-68, setting up the first game of what will be a home-and-home with Wabash for tomorrow (the other at C'ville on 12/11).  In Meadville, Wilmington dumped CWRU 75-64 and will face the host Gators tomorrow.

So here's the Sunday slate:
Wilmington at Allegheny 3pm (Live?  (http://www.alleghenysports.com/index.aspx?tab=basketball&path=mbball)Stats? (http://www.alleghenysports.com/sports/2009/7/14/Live%20Stats.aspx?tab=livestats))
Denison at Mt. St. Joseph 3pm (Live Stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html))
Oberlin at Westminster 3pm (Live Stats and Live Audio (http://www.goyeo.com/index.aspx?path=mbball&tab=basketball))
Wooster at John Carroll 3pm (Live Stats (http://www2.sidearmstats.com/jcu/mbball/index.htm) and Live Audio (http://wqkt.com/))
Wabash at DePauw 4pm (Live Stats and Live Audio (http://depauw.edu/ath/mbasket/2010/rokicki.asp))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 29, 2009, 09:48:56 AM
Wooster faces #2 John Carroll in Cleveland this afternoon.  Here is some background info on JCU:

John Carroll is 3-0 on the season having won the Scranton tourney in Pennsylvania last weekend.  JCU is still running the 10+ player rotation with the full court press ("hack attack" :P) for much of the game.  Oh that's right, Mike Moran is still their coach. ;)

Blue Streaks with their press have forced 70 turnovers from 3 opponents (23 turnovers/game) while committing 55 turnovers themselves.  Wooster will need to take good care of the ball or this game could get ugly.

JCU is hitting lots of three pointers (43 of 81 for 53%) through 3 games.  The average is 14 three pointers made per game! ::)  With all these three pointers,  John Carroll is also averaging 102 points per game. :o

JCU has 5 players that have made 6 or more three pointers each through 3 games.  So, Wooster will need to cover all 5 of these shooters (Michael Hartnett, Chris Zajac, Joey Meyer, Corey Shontz, Rudy Kirbus).

JCU's top 4 scorers are:

Corey Shontz, 6'1" sophomore
17.0 pts/game,  56% FG,  57% on three pointers,  5.0 assist/game

Rudy Kirbus, 6'4" senior
15.0 pts/game,  40% FG,  35% on three pointers,  

Matt Crozier, 6'7" sophomore
15.0 pts/game,  46% FG,  10.3 rebounds/game

Joey Meyer, 5'11" sophomore
9.7 pts/game,  59% FG,  70% on three pointers (7 of 10)

JCU is also outrebounding their opponents (+4.6 per game) so Wooster will need to hit the boards.

I am not expecting to Wooster to win this tough road game but it should be an interesting matchup.

Let's hope that we have plenty of Wooster fans in attendance.  It's only about 25 minutes from my house so I will be there!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 29, 2009, 10:38:01 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 29, 2009, 09:48:56 AM

Let's hope that we have plenty of Wooster fans in attendance.  It's only about 25 minutes from my house so I will be there!

GO SCOTS!

Having 3 girls under the age of 6 has made it difficult for me to get to games at Timken this year which is walking distance from my house!   :P  So, I'm afraid trying to get out of the house to drive up to Cleveland this afternoon isn't likely on my agenda.  :P

I did notice that it appears there will be video available via the JCU website:

COW/JCU Game Coverage (http://www.jcusports.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&)

Just click the 'Details' link and that opens the page with the link to watch the game hopefully.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 29, 2009, 03:07:38 PM
Well, so much for the live video.  I can do without the $5.95 that it costs to view the video feed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2009, 03:12:13 PM
Evidently there's no Live Stats for the Allegheny game.
Oops, I take that back (http://www3.allegheny.edu/athletics/mbbstats/xlive.htm).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 29, 2009, 03:34:21 PM
Just over 3 minutes remaining in the opening half at the DeCarlo Center and Wooster is trailing by one, 30-29.

Wooster's shooting is keeping them in this game as they are currently shooting 57%.

However, Wooster's turnovers are starting to mount keeping the Blue Streaks in this one as Wooster already has committed 10 turnovers.

Wooster is doing a great job of perimeter defense as JCU has only ONE made 3-pointer in the half.  They're averaging 14 made treys/game.

And at the half:

JCU - 33
Wooster - 31

Wooster is being led in scoring by Wickliffe as he chipped in 10 on 5-6 shooting!  Ian Franks has 6.  JCU is being led by Matt Crozier with 11, athough he only scored 2 points after scoring JCU's first 9 of the game.

Wooster finishes the half shooting an even 50% as Hallowell seemed to get greedy and fired up 2 long range 3-pointers that missed badly on Wooster's final 2 possessions.

Wooster finished with 12 turnovers.  And as wsf noted above, the Blue Streaks are forcing 23 turnovers/game so Wooster is on pace to match JCU's average.

Wooster is also surprisingly outrebounding JCU by a 17-14 count.

Lastly, Wooster is  winning the battle of pace of the game.  How often has Wooster been the team making the concerted effort to slow the game down over the past few years?  This is like good old fashioned Steve Moore basketball!

Hallowell starts the 2nd half like he ended the first missing 2 more from downtown.  He's only 1-7 shooting and Wooster is only 2-10 from deep as a team.

And the turnovers continue to mount for the Scots as they are now up to 18 with just under 13 minutes remaining.  And most of these sound like they are of the careless variety...

Timeout Wooster:

JCU - 42
Wooster - 37

47-43 JCU.  Just over 8 minutes remain

Wooster's having some big time shooting woes in the 2nd half as they are 0-8 (2-17 overall) in the 2nd half from deep but still just trail by one!

48-47 Wooster.  Under 7 minutes to play!

54-53 JCU.  4 minutes to go.  Wooster is now 0-10 from downtown in the 2nd half!

Justin Warnes ties the game at 56 by making Woo's first trey of the 2nd half!

Wooster with maybe their most costly turnover and JCU bumps the lead to 5.

Now 7 with 1 minute to go.

Just like that, 9-0 run by JCU and this one is all but over.

Franks ends the run with an old-fashioned 3 point play and the JCU lead is 6 with 42 seconds left.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2009, 03:44:13 PM
Halftime scores:
Wilmington 31, Allegheny 29
Mt. St. Joseph 26, Denison 20
Westminster 30, Oberlin 23
John Carroll 33, Wooster 31 (oh, wooscotsfan is at the game, so no halftime update)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 29, 2009, 04:27:33 PM
Yesterday's hot shooting seems like about a decade ago now.  Wabash has started 3-15 and trails DePauw 16-7 halfway through the first half.  

Halftime from Greencastle:
Wabash 18
DePauw 34

No Little Giant has made more than one single field goal in this game.  The team is 6-30 and an even more miserable 1-14 on 3pt FGs.  The best anlaysis I have for this game so far is: pfft.   >:(

13:01 left to play and Wabash has whittled the lead to 10 points at 43-33.  DePauw has called a timeout, surely to try and halt Wabash's momentum.  Still a long way to go to get back in it, but Wabash is moving in the right direction.

5 minutes to play and Wabash has clawed back.  DePauw leads 52-47...but this is now anybody's game.  

Chase Haltom hits a triple with 4 minutes to play and the score is 52-50!  Great turnaround in the second half for Wabash here.  

Final from Greencastle:
Wabash 57
DePauw 65

Valiant effort in the comeback for Wabash, but once again Wabash learns that you can't lay bricks for an entire half of basketball against a decent team and win.  This first half doldrums thing has been a plague on the Little Giants for the last couple of seasons.  What was youth and inexperience in the previous years are now veterans and strength...these guys are too good to be this inconsistent. 

Burkett and Haltom led Wabash today with 14 points each.  Wes Smith had 12, Aaron Brock had 10 points and 8 rebounds (but his 1-9 on FGs isn't good enough).  Wabash got just six points from the bench today. 

The Wabash road show rolls in to Granville, OH on Dec. 5 for an NCAC contest against Denison. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2009, 04:41:44 PM
Finals:
Westminster 67, Oberlin 60...Trailing by 12 with 8:18 left, OC went on a 16-4 run over the next six minutes to tie the game, but the Yeo couldn't get over the hump.
Wilmington 71, Allegheny 57..A 12-0 Wilma run early in the second half decided this one.
MSJ 57, Denison 51...MSJ extended their lead to double-figures a couple of times but never could shake the pesky, but still winless, Big Red.
John Carroll 71, Wooster 63...closer than probably most of us anticipated, especially with foreknowledge that the Scots couldn't buy a three.

and at the half:
DePauw 34, Wabash 18
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 29, 2009, 05:05:55 PM
Wooster falls short and as David noted, it was closer than many of us anticipated.

This game was tied late despite the fact that Wooster shot only 14% from downtown and committed 26 to's!  :o

Wick continues to shine early this season with another outstanding game!  He led all scorers with 22 points and led Wooster in rebounds as well with 7.  He was Wooster's only double digit scorer as both Franks and Hallowell just missed out on double figures with 9 apiece.

Matt Crozier led the Blue streaks in scoring and rebounding as he finished with a double double (18-10).

Despite Wooster's frigid shooting from deep, the Scots still managed to shoot 45% overall.  In the end, it was the mounting turnovers that did in the Scots.  Wooster had better figure out a way to take better care of the basketball in a hurry.  In their 3 losses this season, Wooster has committed and uncharacteristic 18, 18 and 26 to's.  That is not going to win you too many games when you are that sloppy with the basketball! ???

Next up for the Scots is 2 key early season NCAC matchups as they open up on the road this week starting Wednesday in Deleware vs. OWU and then on to Gambier on Saturday to take on Kenyon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 29, 2009, 05:28:17 PM
Not a good day for the NCAC i must admit by the scores...is that an 0-fer?

One thing to keep in mind for Wooster fans. Although these early season losses are not all in-region, Wooster should be careful as to losing so many games so far....if for some reason they don't win the conference (such as a team from Springfield winning instead) takes the title--losses don't look favorable to the committee.

But then again....who knows what the committee considers
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2009, 05:37:40 PM
Wooster's in no position right now to be worrying about Pool C (!), but if they were, it'd only be the in-region losses that would count against them.  Unfortunately, that only removes the loss to St. Thomas from the evaluation. 

It's not an 0-fer quite yet, as Wabash is making a valiant run at DePauw, trailing 56-53 with 1:14 left.

Aside: wow, I just noticed that this thread has gotten way out-of-sequence today, thanks to the liberal application of the "modify" button.  I confess that I'm probably the worst offender/most frequent modifier around here; in fact...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2009, 05:42:00 PM
...I was doing it right then!  :-[  Maybe we all need to consider how confusing this thread can get with out-of-sequence updates, starting with myself.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2009, 05:51:07 PM
It's an 0-fer now, as DePauw outlasts Wabash 65-57, ending the game with a dunk as the horn sounded (or so Live Stats suggests), which probably doesn't sit too well with the Wallies.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 29, 2009, 06:03:57 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 29, 2009, 05:51:07 PM
It's an 0-fer now, as DePauw outlasts Wabash 65-57, ending the game with a dunk as the horn sounded (or so Live Stats suggests), which probably doesn't sit too well with the Wallies.

Losing in any fashion to DePauw doesn't sit well with Wallies.  As has been noted, Wabash will get a chance for a little redemption on 12/11 at a non-holiday weekend Chadwick Court.  Here's hoping for an especially raucous group of students out for that one. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 29, 2009, 06:16:52 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 29, 2009, 05:37:40 PM
Wooster's in no position right now to be worrying about Pool C (!), but if they were, it'd only be the in-region losses that would count against them.  Unfortunately, that only removes the loss to St. Homas from the evaluation.  

It's not an 0-fer quite yet, as Wabash is making a valiant run at DePauw, trailing 56-53 with 1:14 left.

Aside: wow, I just noticed that this thread has gotten way out-of-sequence today, thanks to the liberal application of the "modify" button.  I confess that I'm probably the worst offender/most frequent modifier around here; in fact...
While I agree that now is not the time to be worrying about Pool C possibilities, Wooster's losses aren't exactly bad losses.  Of their 3 losses, only 2 count against Wooster as in-region losses.  And of those 2 losses, only the Albion loss could be considered a 'bad' loss.  Wooster's 2 wins are also both in-region and both could turn out to be pretty nice wins as both ONU and CMU could both win 15+ games this season.

All in all, this slow start by Wooster isn't all that surprising.  We all knew how difficult this gauntlet of a non-conference schedule was going to be for the Scots and I can't say that I'm all that disappointed in where the Scots sit record wise at this point in the seasaon.  Yes, the loss to Albion stands out most and that was disappointing and the loss to UST was was disappointing from a margin of defeat perspective.  But, the Scots have nothing to hang their heads over in the effort they put forth against the #2 team in the country this afternoon.  These games are all learning experiences and this experience against all of this tough competition is only going to help the Scots down the strech IMO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2009, 06:22:43 PM
The loss to Albion looks a little better in light of how the Britons handled OWU yesterday.  Albion may end up with a pretty good in-region record when all is said and done. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 29, 2009, 09:01:05 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 29, 2009, 05:05:55 PM
This game was tied late despite the fact that Wooster shot only 14% from downtown and committed 26 to's!  :o

Matt Crozier led the Blue streaks in scoring and rebounding as he finished with a double double (18-10).

Back from dinner with the family, so here are my first hand observations from the game.  ScotsFan nailed the 3 biggest reasons Wooster lost this game with the two sentences (above) in his post. k+

Wooster did not take care of the ball with 26 turnovers.  Amazing, they might have won the game with over 20 turnovers if they had just taken care of the ball in the last 2 minutes of the game but they lost their composure when it mattered most.

2:10 remaining, score tied 60-60 and Wooster goes their next 3 possessions with 2 turnovers and a missed shot.  Game over!

As noted by DC and ScotsFan, Wooster missed most of their 3 pointers today (3 of 21 = 14.3%) and that was the second reason they didn't get the "W".  By the way, Josh Claytor made a 3 pointer today (saw it with my own eyes  :)) and the stats credited it to Ian Franks.  Both teams defended the 3 point line well but Wooster also missed some open 3 pointers.

The third reason for the loss was Matt Crozier who led JCU in the paint.  Wooster gave up a layup and a 3 point play to Crozier with 2:06 left that started the decisive JCU run.  Good defensive teams don't give up layups at the end of games - you have to foul hard and put the opponent on the line.

One other observation:  John Carroll is a scrappy team, as usual, but IMO they would get their clock cleaned by St. Thomas.  JCU didn't shoot very well today due to Wooster's defense, the Scots outrebounded them 38-32 and JCU missed 11 free throws which was only slightly worse than their season average. :P  I would still pick JCU to win the OAC again but they are not a top 3 team nationally IMO.

ScotsFan also summed up my major concern for the Scots.  If Wooster doesn't start taking better care of the ball, it will be a long season.  Let's hope that the Scots have fewer turnovers on Wednesday at Ohio Wesleyan.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Toph on November 29, 2009, 09:22:41 PM
This was my first chance to see JCU in action this season.  I wasn't overly impressed.  As usual, they found a way to win at home and forced a TON of turnovers from Wooster.  Their lack of size is a problem we were all aware of, but when Crozier started off with the first 9 points, there wasn't a concerted effort to get him the ball in the post when his group came back on the floor.

They didn't shoot as well as they had in the first three games, but that was expected.  The missed free throws will come back to kill them if that keeps up (and free throws are not often a strong point for the Streaks).  They were in the bonus early in the 1st half but couldn't do much to capitalize on it.

The other thing that stood out from a JCU fan's standpoint was the lack of finishing around the rim by the Streaks.  How many wide open bunnies did they miss?  4?  5?  Add contested shots from inside four feet, it seemed like they missed more shots in the paint than they did from three!

Wooster controlled tempo for the most part, but the full court pressure from JCU gave the Scots fits.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woobball on November 29, 2009, 10:26:39 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 25, 2009, 08:08:08 PM
Quote from: goscots on November 25, 2009, 04:23:54 PM
I realize you are trying to make a larger point but in my opinion the best player on the Scots last year was Marty Bidwell. For certain he did not have the shooting skill than Ian has but what Marty did have was heart and leadership. Even though he is the only starter who was lost to graduation it is a big hole to fill. Brandon Johnson, being the only player left from the Final Four team, needs to fill that role.
From a talent-wise perspective, Franks was the best player.  But, as you pointed out goscots, Marty's leadership is what set him apart from the rest of the team.  And that leadership is  proving harder to replace than I originally thought it would be.  I was hoping that Brandon would be able to fill that leadership role and he very well might do that as the season progresses but so far, I think that lack of a true leader is one of the things that is hurting this team.
I believe this team is really struggling without Marty this year. Three things that the scots are struggling with this year 1. Leadership 2. Taking care of the ball 3. Getting key defensive stops.

1. I heard Coach Moore last year refer to Marty as one of the best captains and leaders he has ever coached. So far without him the team doesn't seem to be playing as hard nor with as much passion and heart as they did last year.

2. Wooster doesn't have a player with a positive assist to turnover ratio this year, nor do they have a player averaging more than 3 assists a game. Bidwell led the NCAC in assists last year and was in the top five in assist to turnover ratio.

3. In all 3 Wooster losses, key defensive stops have been a factor. Besides the thumping against UST, in both the Albion and JCU games, Wooster has not been able to get a stop in the closing minutes of the game (allowing JCU to score almost everytime they got the ball in the last three minutes, and the same with Albion in the final minutes). These are the kind of moments Marty was able to help come up with a big stop.

To be honest, I thought that losing Marty would not be a factor at all with the addition of Brandon Johnson and the other returning players having another year under their belt but it appears to have been a larger loss than everyone expected.

On the bright side, last year's team started out 2-3 as well, so their is plenty of time for the guys to turn it around and play like they are capable of. But in order to do so, I trully believe that roles need to be established and a player (or multiple players) need to start addressing the issues mentioned above.


EDITED to fix the quote formatting; I think/hope I got it right!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 30, 2009, 09:52:59 AM
Quote from: woobball on November 29, 2009, 10:26:39 PM

On the bright side, last year's team started out 2-3 as well, so their is plenty of time for the guys to turn it around and play like they are capable of. But in order to do so, I trully believe that roles need to be established and a player (or multiple players) need to start addressing the issues mentioned above.

Yes, and last year's 2-3 start was going up against a much lesser schedule than this 2-3 start!  Just trying to brighten things up a bit more...  8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 30, 2009, 04:53:30 PM
Quote from: Toph on November 29, 2009, 09:22:41 PM

The other thing that stood out from a JCU fan's standpoint was the lack of finishing around the rim by the Streaks.  How many wide open bunnies did they miss?  4?  5?  Add contested shots from inside four feet, it seemed like they missed more shots in the paint than they did from three!

Coach Moore commented on this in his post game comments.  He basically said that Woo's poor shooting from deep was basically cancelled out by JCU's inabality to finish around the rim as he noted how many easy bunnies the Blue Streaks missed as well.


Quote from: Toph on November 29, 2009, 09:22:41 PM

Wooster controlled tempo for the most part, but the full court pressure from JCU gave the Scots fits.

This is one question I had that maybe either you or wsf could answer since you were at the game.  I know that JCU is known for their constant full court pressure and that they force a ton of turnovers.  But, it seemed in listening to the game that Wooster's radio guy kept saying how Wooster just kept committing foolish turnovers.  It seemesd like at least half of Wooster's turnovers were as a result of lazy passees or carelessness with the dribble and not so much from JCU's pressure.  Any thoughts from those in attendance?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2009, 05:17:44 PM
Congratulations to Earlham sophomore (and Crawfordsville refugee) AJ Sutherlin, this week's NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html).  The Sewanee/Rhodes Classic MVP, Sutherlin had a 54-point, 19-rebound trip to the Bluff City as the Quakers split their OT games with the co-hosts.  Congratulations, AJ!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Toph on November 30, 2009, 05:30:35 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 30, 2009, 04:53:30 PM

This is one question I had that maybe either you or wsf could answer since you were at the game.  I know that JCU is known for their constant full court pressure and that they force a ton of turnovers.  But, it seemed in listening to the game that Wooster's radio guy kept saying how Wooster just kept committing foolish turnovers.  It seemesd like at least half of Wooster's turnovers were as a result of lazy passees or carelessness with the dribble and not so much from JCU's pressure.  Any thoughts from those in attendance?

Well, even if half of Wooster's turnovers were due to carelessness, that leaves another 13 forced from JCU's pressure!

I may be looking at it through blue and gold glasses, but Wooster looked pretty rattled by JCU's press.  Having watched this team for the last 7 years, I can say this full court pressure was the best I've seen.  As aggressive as the Streaks are in the full court, you're going to give up a fair amount of 2 on 1 and 3 on 1 breaks throughout the game (hence, they give up an average of like 88 points coming into the Wooster game).  The Blue Streaks ability to get in position after a made basket and rotate correctly, forcing Wooster into a position to be trapped, or where they have a forward bringing the ball up the floor was one of the things I was pleased with yesterday.  As usual, the Blue Streaks made as much contact as the officials let them get away with (to be completely fair, the Scots weren't exactly shying away from good, physical defense on their end either).

Some of the passes probably lacked the appropriate mustard, but JCU also gambles quite a bit and tries to jump in front of almost every pass until the opponent gets into their half court set.  Either by design or by force, Wooster found themselves scrambling to get across the half court line fairly often and that led to some forced passes that were easy pickings for defenders.

I think Wooster's poor outside shooting was in part because they just hit a cold streak, and they were playing on the road, but with a few exceptions JCU did a nice job closing on three point attempts.  Wooster didn't get a lot of good looks.  So I'd attribute some of those misses to good defense, but I seriously doubt Woo shoots 3-21 if the two teams play again.

My two cents...anyway.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 30, 2009, 07:12:58 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 30, 2009, 05:17:44 PM
Congratulations to Earlham sophomore (and Crawfordsville refugee) AJ Sutherlin, this week's NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html).  The Sewanee/Rhodes Classic MVP, Sutherlin had a 54-point, 19-rebound trip to the Bluff City as the Quakers split their OT games with the co-hosts.  Congratulations, AJ!

Actually, I think Earlham is the NCAC refugee (now). And they don't have to live like one. (Heh...)

Sutherlin played along side Purdue super-frosh DJ Byrd at North Montgomery.

BTW - Matt Painter has 4 walk-ons this season. All of them are from the area near Lafayette. Add that to Byrd and Purdue has some serious local flavor on his team (even if most are towel wavers). One of them, in fact, has the great name of Bubba Day. I bring this up wondering how much Painter's influence has affected recruiting at the Indiana D-3 level, since many of those walk-ons probably could have been contributors at Wabash, DPU, Franklin, Rose, etc.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2009, 09:06:39 PM
Belated congratulations are extended to Allegheny senior center George Raftis, who recorded his 1,000th career point with a layup early in the first half against Wilmington College on Sunday.  Well done, George! :)

---------------------------------------------------------

[in my best John Facenda voice]
This Week in the NCAC:
It's a light slate, with just four Wednesday games, but two of them officially inaugurate the conference season:
Wooster at Ohio Wesleyan 7:30 pm -- video and live stats from OWU (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html), audio from Wooster (http://wqkt.com/)
Hiram at Oberlin 7:30pm -- Live stats, live audio, live video all from Oberlin (http://www.goyeo.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&tab=basketball)
Allegheny at Penn St. Erie, The Behrend College 8 pm -- no coverage that I can find
Kenyon at Case Western Reserve ~8pm (second game of a women/men doubleheader) -- no coverage that I can find

All ten teams suit up for conference action on Saturday; more details forthcoming.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash83 on November 30, 2009, 10:33:29 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 30, 2009, 07:12:58 PM
BTW - Matt Painter has 4 walk-ons this season. All of them are from the area near Lafayette. Add that to Byrd and Purdue has some serious local flavor on his team (even if most are towel wavers). One of them, in fact, has the great name of Bubba Day. I bring this up wondering how much Painter's influence has affected recruiting at the Indiana D-3 level, since many of those walk-ons probably could have been contributors at Wabash, DPU, Franklin, Rose, etc.

I think the fact that Bobby Riddell (initially a walk-on from Lafayette Harrison who went on to be a key contributor as a senior last year) also was an influence.  Not only can you walk-on at Purdue, but you can play if you put in the effort.

While I think that Purdue's receptiveness to walk-ons may have an impact on recruiting at the D-III level, I suspect it is minimal as there are only so many walk-on spots at Purdue.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 30, 2009, 10:54:40 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 30, 2009, 04:53:30 PM
This is one question I had that maybe either you or wsf could answer since you were at the game.  I know that JCU is known for their constant full court pressure and that they force a ton of turnovers.  But, it seemed in listening to the game that Wooster's radio guy kept saying how Wooster just kept committing foolish turnovers.  It seemesd like at least half of Wooster's turnovers were as a result of lazy passees or carelessness with the dribble and not so much from JCU's pressure.  Any thoughts from those in attendance?

From my observations at the game, I would say that the majority of the turnovers were caused by Wooster carelessness and poor decision making on where to pass the ball.  Court spacing was also another issue.  The JCU press was effective at times and in one instance forced a 10 second call when Wooster didn't get over halfcourt.

Carelessness -- several times Wooster players got their pocket picked while dribbling up the court because they didn't focus on ball security with a JCU defender closing in.  Wooster also made one or two bad passes that were just off the mark resulting in turnovers.

Poor decision making -- several times, Wooster tried high risk passes that were picked off by JCU.  A couple of these happened on fast breaks where Wooster foolishly tried to pass through several JCU defenders.  In another instance, a Wooster player tried to pass the ball during the JCU press from near the end line after inbounding all the way to the halfcourt line to another Scot.  Given the length of the pass, it was easily picked off by JCU.

Court spacing -- Near the end of the game, Wooster got trapped near the corner after inbounding which resulted in a turnover.  Wooster also committed a couple of turnovers by letting themselves get trapped against the sidelines.  When you receive a pass near the sideline, the basic rule is to dribble towards the center of the court so the sideline doesn't act like another defender.  To be fair, the Wooster coaches did remind the players to space the court properly in the frontcourt when the Scots were on offense and they did it well.

Wooster did miss a couple of open three pointers but the majority of them were contested and both teams played very tough defense as Toph noted.  Overall, Wooster did a nice job on the boards and they did control the tempo of the game except for the critical last 2 minutes.

The season to date stats tell the story.  Through 5 games, Wooster as a team has only 55 total assists and a very high 89 turnovers. ???  The Scots are averaging nearly 18 turnovers a game which often results in losses.  It is especially concerning that Wooster's top six players (Hallowell, Franks, Johnson, Balch, Wickliffe, Claytor) each have more turnovers than assists.

Let's hope that Wooster keeps their turnovers under 15 in the game on Wednesday at OWU.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 01, 2009, 10:10:11 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 30, 2009, 10:54:40 PM

The season to date stats tell the story.  Through 5 games, Wooster as a team has only 55 total assists and a very high 89 turnovers. ???  The Scots are averaging nearly 18 turnovers a game which often results in losses.  It is especially concerning that Wooster's top six players (Hallowell, Franks, Johnson, Balch, Wickliffe, Claytor) each have more turnovers than assists.

Let's hope that Wooster keeps their turnovers under 15 in the game on Wednesday at OWU.

GO SCOTS!
It's unfortunate that we have to keep bringing up these stats.  These numbers have got to be very frustrating for Coach Moore. I know one of the first stats he looks at after a game is how many asssists there were compared to baskets made.  Saturday's game was a season high for Wooster with just 14 assists.  Before Saturday, Wooster was averaging just over 10 assists/game.  Not Wooster-like basketball.  And when you combine that with the fact that Wooster is averaging nearly 18 turnovers/game, you really have uncharacteristic Wooster basketball.

One more telling stat so far this season:

In Wooster's 3 losses they have had 18+ turnovers.  In Wooster's 2 wins they have had fewer than 14!  That stat pretty much says it all!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2009, 12:30:24 PM
Quote from: gobash83 on November 30, 2009, 10:33:29 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 30, 2009, 07:12:58 PM
BTW - Matt Painter has 4 walk-ons this season. All of them are from the area near Lafayette. Add that to Byrd and Purdue has some serious local flavor on his team (even if most are towel wavers). One of them, in fact, has the great name of Bubba Day. I bring this up wondering how much Painter's influence has affected recruiting at the Indiana D-3 level, since many of those walk-ons probably could have been contributors at Wabash, DPU, Franklin, Rose, etc.

I think the fact that Bobby Riddell (initially a walk-on from Lafayette Harrison who went on to be a key contributor as a senior last year) also was an influence.  Not only can you walk-on at Purdue, but you can play if you put in the effort.

While I think that Purdue's receptiveness to walk-ons may have an impact on recruiting at the D-III level, I suspect it is minimal as there are only so many walk-on spots at Purdue.   

That's why I was surprised Painter has four of them. I know that last year IU had to ask anyone who played any high school ball to join the team. But Purdue has a team that could be a Final Four team. But again, teams like Kansas and North Carolina also have many walk-ons. Perhaps that's why Painter is filling the practice team with them.

Not knowing the academics, I think Bubba Day or Stevie Loveless (from Frankfort) would have fit in well at Wabash. But again, that's not knowing their academic story. I do know Riddell was accepted at Wabash and had he not been invited to walk on would have probably come to C'ville.

Dru Anthrop was probably destined to walk on at Purdue, since his dad did the same thing.

At any rate, it's an interesting case of 'what-ifs' that can only distract us from the poor shooting of the LGs against DPU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 01, 2009, 07:03:42 PM
Congrats to Wittenberg for entering the Top 25 for the first time this season debuting at #22.

Wooster is at #25 in the new poll, just saying.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 02, 2009, 08:40:08 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 01, 2009, 07:03:42 PM
Congrats to Wittenberg for entering the Top 25 for the first time this season debuting at #22.

Wooster is at #25 in the new poll, just saying.

Yeah, yeah.  How many ranked opponents has Witt faced again?  Hope Witt can finally get back on the winning side with Hiram this weekend.  What's that losing streak up to again vs. the Pups?  Just saying.   8)  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 02, 2009, 09:28:36 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 01, 2009, 07:03:42 PM
Congrats to Wittenberg for entering the Top 25 for the first time this season debuting at #22.

Wooster is at #25 in the new poll, just saying.

Yeah we dogdged a bullet there though being even #25.  SCOTS will put it together, we can pretty much count on that.  BUT, it may do some good to drop out of the Top 25.  I'm sure the fellas peak every now and then; maybe it would spark them a lil' more.  I also wonder if they just feel lot of pressure right now given the circumstances of the season, etc.  Big game tonight!  GO SCOTS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 02, 2009, 08:07:21 PM
At the Half:  Ohio Wesleyan 35  Wooster 33

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 14 points, Josh Claytor with 5 points & 6 boards and Brandon Johnson with 5 points.  Scots have made 5 three pointers and kept their turnovers to 7 in the half but the Bishops had only 3.

Ohio Wesleyan is being led by Andy Winters with 9 points, Marshall Morris with 7 points and Pat Pellerite with 5 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 02, 2009, 08:20:44 PM
Halftime at Oberlin finds the Yeo leading Hiram 15-14.  The Wooster/OWU game passed that mark with about 12 minutes remaining in the half.  Hiram has made five baskets while turning the ball over 11 times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 02, 2009, 08:43:26 PM
Wow 15-14......

A few thoughts after watching part of the second half on OWU's video feed.

Ohio Wesleyan lacks a few outside shooters. It appears that Wooster is matching straight up and giving OWU room to shoot outside and that's allowing them to help underneath against the size advantage and low post presence of OWU

I think there's a few things that can be taken advantage of against Wooster. Wooster has taken advantage of OWU by driving to the basket and either passing off underneath or kicking it out for open 3's. Against teams (ex. Wittenberg) that have a big low post presence, Wooster will not get as many open looks underneath.

I think its a matter of the team and matchup, but I also think that a team that has a strong outside presence can keep Wooster from doubling down low. Witt may have an advantage with all guards and even their 3 man (Hieber and Weide) as outside threats. This should open things up underneath.

Thoughts? Of course this is biased, but isn't everyone on this board?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 02, 2009, 08:54:32 PM
6:04 left in Delaware:  Wooster 64  Ohio Wesleyan 52  :)

Wooster is shooting ~70% so far in the 2nd half to seize control.  5 more three pointers in the 2nd half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 02, 2009, 09:16:42 PM
Final:  Wooster 80  Ohio Wesleyan 72 :)

Wooster played a strong second half to win their NCAC opener.  Scots were led by Ian Franks with 26 points, Justin Hallowell with 13 points (3 three pointers), Nathan Balch with 14 points (3 three pointers) and Brandon Johnson with 9 points.

Ohio Wesleyan was led by Marshall Morris with 20 points, Andy Winters with 20 points and Pat Pellerite with 15 points.

Wooster won this game by limiting their turnovers to 11 ;), winning the battle of the boards 37 to 32 and by making 12 three pointers on 43% shooting.  Scots outscored the Bishops 47 to 37 in the 2nd half.

On post game show, Coach Moore complimented Ian Franks' defensive job on OWU's Tim Brady (1 of 7) in addition to his 26 points.  Excellent game by Ian Franks tonight.

Wooster is now 3-3.  1-0 NCAC ;D  Next game at Kenyon on Saturday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 02, 2009, 09:18:44 PM
The Hiram/Oberlin game may not have been elegant, but it looks like it was exciting.  Hiram prevailed, 49-47, after committing just two second half turnovers (versus 11 baskets).  Chris "the Truth" Roberts had 14, while Babajide Eniola contributed a dozen points and a dozen rebounds.  Oberlin's Josh Merritt led all scorers with 15.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 02, 2009, 11:57:24 PM
12/2 Final Scores:

Penn St. Behrend 77  Allegheny 70

Case Western Reserve 75  Kenyon 54
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 03, 2009, 02:01:18 AM
Belated congratulations to Wooster super-senior Brandon Johnson, who scored his 1,000th point on Sunday at John Carrroll.  Johnson's jumper at 4:25 of the 2nd, off a pass from Justin Warnes, drew the Scots to within one in that closely-fought contest.  Johnson added nine more points tonight in helping lead his team to a critical road NCAC victory, giving him 1,009 points in his career.  Congratulations, Brandon!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 03, 2009, 08:56:06 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 02, 2009, 09:16:42 PM
Final:  Wooster 80  Ohio Wesleyan 72 :)

Wooster played a strong second half to win their NCAC opener.  Scots were led by Ian Franks with 26 points, Justin Hallowell with 13 points (3 three pointers), Nathan Balch with 14 points (3 three pointers) and Brandon Johnson with 9 points.

Ohio Wesleyan was led by Marshall Morris with 20 points, Andy Winters with 20 points and Pat Pellerite with 15 points.

Wooster won this game by limiting their turnovers to 11 ;), winning the battle of the boards 37 to 32 and by making 12 three pointers on 43% shooting.  Scots outscored the Bishops 47 to 37 in the 2nd half.

On post game show, Coach Moore complimented Ian Franks' defensive job on OWU's Tim Brady (1 of 7) in addition to his 26 points.  Excellent game by Ian Franks tonight.

Wooster is now 3-3.  1-0 NCAC ;D  Next game at Kenyon on Saturday.

GO SCOTS!
Nice win for the Scots last night!  OWU may be 1-4 record wise, but I definitely think they'll be a team to reckon with by the end of the season.  They have some good YOUNG talent that Mike DeWitt has assembled.  Both of the Bishop's leading scorers last night were freshmen and Pellerite who was their 3rd leading scorer last night is a soph!  From watching and listening the OWU video feed it sounds as if DeWitt is still doing some tinkering to his lineups as they said last night marked the first career starts for both Morris and Winters.  Once DeWitt settles in on a rotation (and I would say last night's was a good start) this team should roll off some wins.

OWU just had no answer for Franks all night.  It looked as though DeWitt started to double down on Franks late which was somewhat effective, but by that time the damage had already been done by the Wooster guard.  Also, it was nice to see Wooster finally figured out how to remove that lid that was on the basket whenever they were chucking up 3's!   :P  Twelve made 3's on 43% shooting is more Wooster-like!  And as wsf noted, only 11 turnovers!  The trend continues as Wooster is undefeated when they turn the ball over fewer than 14 times!  Also, Wooster had 18 assists on 26 made baskets.  I'm sure that Moore was pleased to see that stat!  This is the first time all season where Wooster has had more assists than turnovers in a game!

Anyways, it's no secret how important it is to win conference games on the road and especially against other conference contenders.  OWU's record may not indicate it, but they were picked as the NCAC preseason #2.  So, even though that was the tip-off to conference play last night, that is the type of win that could go a long way in determining the conference champion come February.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 03, 2009, 09:14:33 AM
Some more belated congratulations.  Congratulations to Doug and Lauren Cline on the birth of their twins early Monday morning!  :)

They had a boy (Jordan Corey) and a girl (Courtney Marie)!

Glad to hear that Lauren and the twins are all healthy and doing well!

As a father of twins myself, they are truly a joy!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash83 on December 03, 2009, 11:38:47 AM
Wabash has announced that six of this season's home basketball games will be broadcast live over the Internet thanks to a partnership between the College, Teamline Broadcasting, and the Shelbourne Knee Center.  The games are:

Tuesday, December 8 vs. Rose-Hulman (7:30 p.m.)

Friday, December 11 vs. DePauw (7:30 p.m.)

Saturday, January 2 vs. Franklin College (7:30 p.m.)

Wednesday, January 20 vs. Wittenberg (7:30 p.m.)

Wednesday, February 3 vs. Earlham (7:30 p.m.)

Sunday, February 7 vs. Wooster (2 p.m.)

The broadcast on Teamline will begin a few minutes prior to the opening tip.  The games will include two- to three-camera productions with a updated scoreboard through the Wabash livestats page. Audio play-by-play will be provided by WNDY, the Wabash student radio station.

I think this is a great step and am glad the College has been able to put it together.  Thanks to Don Shelbourne '72 for helping to make this happen.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 03, 2009, 01:30:16 PM
Congrats Junior!!!!!  Congrats Lauren!!!!!  GO SCOTS!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 03, 2009, 05:58:39 PM
Kenyon's JT Knight has been named to the D3hoops.com Team of the Week (http://www.d3hoops.com/tow/) for Nov. 23-29.  Congratulations, JT!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2009, 10:45:47 PM
Five conference games tomorrow--let's roll!

OWU (1-4, 0-1) at Allegheny (3-2, 0-0), 3pm* (Live Stats (http://www3.allegheny.edu/athletics/mbbstats/xlive.htm))
Wabash (2-3, 0-0) at Denison (0-5, 0-0), 3pm (Live Stats and Audio (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html) + Wabash audio (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball/schedule))
Oberlin (2-4, 0-1) at Earlham (2-4, 0-0), 3pm* (Live Stats (http://sidearmstats.com/earlham/mbball/index.htm))
Wooster (3-3, 1-0) at Kenyon (3-3, 0-0), 3pm* (Live Stats, Audio, and Video (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml) + Wooster audio (http://wqkt.com/))
Wittenberg (4-0, 0-0) at Hiram (2-2, 1-0), 5:30pm* (Live Stats, Audio, and Video (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html) + Wittenberg audio (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/sportsnetwork/))

*Each of these games (all but the Wabash/DU game) are second games of men/women doubleheaders, with the women's game starting two hours earlier than the time shown (except at Hiram, where the women's game vs. Denison is at 2pm).  Thus, starting times are approximate.  Please refer to the NCAC Women's Discussion Board (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=726.msg1144664#msg1144664) for links for the women's games, two of which also will feature live video.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 05, 2009, 09:35:22 AM
Thanks for the links David!  :) 

Nice to see that the live video feed for the Kenyon game is featuring Wooster audio!  Watching that OWU live feed, it was about all I could take hearing those OWU broadcasters keep saying Wooooooster...  :P

I don't know who will be doing the Wooster broadcast as Mike Breckenridge is going to be back and forth between Massillon and Canton covering Ohio State Football Championships.  But whoever it is, at least we won't have to endure someone saying Wooooooster!  ;D

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 05, 2009, 10:05:10 AM
Looking at those games, there's some intriguing matchups today.

Starting with OWU travelling to 'Gheny.  I'm sure that the Bishops have been waiting for this game for a while now after the Gators did in the Bishops to end the season last year.  First 'Gheny denied OWU home court advantge in the NCAC tournament, and then they followed that up by ousting the Bishops out of the NCAC tournament in Delaware no less!  And this is almost a must win for OWU if they want to keep their conference title hopes alive. 

Witt at Hiram is another interesting matchup.  Hiram has had Witt's number of late sweeping Witt in conference play last year.  However, Hiram doesn't appear to be playing up to the level they did at the start of last season.  It appears that last season's end of the season skid has carried over to this year for the Pups.  After picking up a nice win over B-W, Hiram followed that up with  a dud vs. MUC and barely escaped Oberlin on Wednesday night.  Hiram is going to have to play much better to even come close to extending their winning streak to 3 vs. Witt.

Wabash at Denison is next.  The Big Red are winless on the season, but they've been in every game.  They're only losing by an average of just over 7 ppg and their worst loss was at Hanover by 12.  It seems as though Wabash has had trouble in Granville in the past.  Depending on which Wabash team shows up, or if Wabash decides to show up for the full 40 minutes, don't be surprised by an upset in this one. 

Does anyone really care about Oberlin and Earlham?  I'm pulling for the NCAC in this one!   :P  Go Yeomen!

And last is Kenyon vs. Wooster.  I'm having a tough time seeing how the Lords can keep this one close.  Yes, their Special K duo has been playing well as Knight is averaging over 22 ppg and Knapke is averaging over 15 ppg, but after that, the scoring drops off significantly.  Kenyon is going to need more than K&K to beat Wooster.  And then there's the height discrepency.  Kenyon has two players on their entire roster at 6'6" or taller.  Wooster equals that just in their starting lineup and surpasses that when you factor in that Wick plays bigger than the 6'5" he's listed at.  I would look for Wick to rebound from his quiet game in Delaware on Wednesday and have another big game today!  Also, does the lid stay lifted for the Scots on their 3-balls?  If they are shooting cold from the field, that could help keep Kenyon in the game.  In the end, I just think Wooster has too much depth, especially inside, and the Scots will gradually pull away in the end!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 05, 2009, 10:06:09 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 03, 2009, 05:58:39 PM
Kenyon's JT Knight has been named to the D3hoops.com Team of the Week (http://www.d3hoops.com/tow/) for Nov. 23-29.  Congratulations, JT!

Wooster's defense in today's game will need to focus on J.T. Knight who is currently averaging 22.3 points/game on 49% shooting.  Knight is also the Lords' top threat from the 3 point arc where he has made 22 of 47 (47%).  Knight also has 8.2 rebounds/game.

Kenyon's #2 scorer is 6'6" Dave Knapke who is averaging 15.3 points/game on 53% shooting and 8.7 rebounds/game.

If the Scots slow down these two guys, they should get an easy victory this afternoon because the rest of the Kenyon team all shoots 41% or less from the floor.  In fact, 6 Kenyon players with regular minutes are shooting 38% or worse on the season.

Kenyon is 3-3 on the season but their 3 victories have come against 0-5 Swarthmore, 0-4 Kalamazoo and 2-5 Wash & Jeff so they haven't beaten any solid opponents yet.  The Lords have dropped games to Muskingum, Haverford and Case Western.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 05, 2009, 10:33:23 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 05, 2009, 10:05:10 AM

Witt at Hiram is another interesting matchup.  Hiram has had Witt's number of late sweeping Witt in conference play last year.  However, Hiram doesn't appear to be playing up to the level they did at the start of last season.  It appears that last season's end of the season skid has carried over to this year for the Pups.  After picking up a nice win over B-W, Hiram followed that up with  a dud vs. MUC and barely escaped Oberlin on Wednesday night.  Hiram is going to have to play much better to even come close to extending their winning streak to 3 vs. Witt.


ScotsFan - looks like we agree on the Kenyon - Wooster matchup and the need to contain the Lords dynamic duo! :)

I also agree that the Wittenberg at Hiram game should reveal a lot about where these two teams are positioned.  Hiram actually has lost 3 players who played strong roles on last year's team.  Ian Pfouts was a starter and averaged 10.6 pts, Andrew Wiegand was also a starter and averaged 8.4 pts, while Jason Hebeisen was a solid bench player at 5.7 pts.

It looks like the Terriers have tried several different starters so far in their 4 games this season.  It will be interesting to see if the Pups can give the Tigers a competitive game today.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 05, 2009, 11:47:58 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 05, 2009, 10:33:23 AM

ScotsFan - looks like we agree on the Kenyon - Wooster matchup and the need to contain the Lords dynamic duo! :)

Great minds...  ;D   :P   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2009, 12:54:45 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 05, 2009, 09:35:22 AM
Nice to see that the live video feed for the Kenyon game is featuring Wooster audio! 
I'm not sure where you're getting that; Kenyon usually has their own audio for home games--in fact, two: one for the audio stream and another to accompany the video.  If you're reading my post to say that the Wooster audio accompanies the Kenyon video, that's a misreading; I just added the Wooster audio link since I figured so many in here would prefer it.  If, however, you figured out somewhere else that Kenyon's video will feature Wooster's audio, that's an interesting state of affairs.

Quote from: ScotsFan on December 05, 2009, 09:35:22 AMWatching that OWU live feed, it was about all I could take hearing those OWU broadcasters keep saying Wooooooster...  :P
I was listening to the Wooster audiocast of that game, and I recall saying to a friend who was with me at the time: "You can tell who's broadcasting by how they pronounce the names.  If they're saying 'WOOOster,' it's an OWU broadcast; and if they're saying "WeZZZleyan," it's a Wooster broadcast."  :)

Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 05, 2009, 10:33:23 AMHiram actually has lost 3 players who played strong roles on last year's team.  Ian Pfouts was a starter and averaged 10.6 pts, Andrew Wiegand was also a starter and averaged 8.4 pts, while Jason Hebeisen was a solid bench player at 5.7 pts.
Pfouts graduated, and Hebeisen graduated early, making him a de facto senior on last year's team.  I still haven't located Wiegand, who was just a frosh last year.  

This game, by the way, has been postponed until 5:30; I'll make the correction in my post above.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 05, 2009, 03:33:26 PM
At the Half:  Kenyon 32  Wooster 25

Wooster got off to a slow start as Kenyon jumped out to a 15-4 lead.  Scots fought back and took a 25-21 lead.  Then the Lords went on a 11-0 run to lead 32-25 at halftime.

Wooster shot only 28% in the half and got outrebounded by Kenyon 20-12.  Both shooting and rebounding will need to improve if the Scots are going to rally in the 2nd half.

Kenyon shot 50% from the floor in the half and also made 6 three pointers to build this lead.

Ian Franks had a monster half with 14 points to lead Wooster.  Brandon Johnson has added 3 points.

For Kenyon, JT Knight has 8 points and Dave Knapke has added 7 points.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2009, 03:47:14 PM
Other halftime scores:
Allegheny 45, OWU 36 (corrected Live Stats link in my above post)
Denison 39, Wabash 25 (not a typo)
Oberlin 34, Earlham 34
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 05, 2009, 03:57:14 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 05, 2009, 03:47:14 PM
Other halftime scores:
Denison 39, Wabash 25 (not a typo)

>:(

That is all. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 05, 2009, 04:03:02 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 05, 2009, 12:54:45 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 05, 2009, 09:35:22 AM
Nice to see that the live video feed for the Kenyon game is featuring Wooster audio! 
I'm not sure where you're getting that; Kenyon usually has their own audio for home games--in fact, two: one for the audio stream and another to accompany the video.  If you're reading my post to say that the Wooster audio accompanies the Kenyon video, that's a misreading; I just added the Wooster audio link since I figured so many in here would prefer it.  If, however, you figured out somewhere else that Kenyon's video will feature Wooster's audio, that's an interesting state of affairs.

Yes, that was a mis-reading.  My bad...  :P

Wooster continues to trail by 5 but a key moment in the game may have just occurred as Knight picks up his 4th foul with over 12 minutes remaining! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 05, 2009, 04:19:15 PM
Just as I was afraid of, that lid has found it's way back over the Wooster basket in this game!  Wooster's made 8 treys in the game, but that is on 26 attempts!  :o

Kenyon is shooting 50% and as a result lead by 7 with 4 to go!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 05, 2009, 04:26:52 PM
seriously....Wooster down 3 with a minute to go and the video feed goes down
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 05, 2009, 04:28:10 PM
seriously.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 05, 2009, 04:29:06 PM
63-62 :35 seconds to go.  Kenyon ball.......with a TO right now.  SCOTS IN A DOG FIGHT!  MISSED SHOT, SCOTS CAN WIN WITH NEXT BUCKET!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 05, 2009, 04:30:35 PM
wOW WHAT AN AWESOME LAST :35 SECONDS.  SCOTS AND LORDS TRADE LAY UPS WITH NATHAN BALCH HITTING THE GAME WINNER!!  SCOTS WIN  66-65!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 05, 2009, 04:33:05 PM
Final:  Wooster 66  Kenyon 65 :)

Whew!  Wooster was down 6 with only 1:28 left and rallied to get the win! ;D  Nathan Balch got the winning layup with 2 seconds left on a great pass from Ian Franks.

Wooster was led by Ian Franks with 29 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 9 points (8 boards) and Nathan Balch with 9 points.

Kenyon was led by JT Knight with 16 points and Dave Knapke with 12 points.

This was a big NCAC road win and Ian Franks made some huge shots down the stretch to pull out this victory.

Wooster shot only 37% from the floor but they did make 15 of 15 free throws and they needed every one of them!

Wooster is now 4-3.  NCAC 2-0. ;D  Next up is the Randolph Macon tourney in Virginia on 12/13.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 05, 2009, 04:35:43 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 05, 2009, 04:26:52 PM
seriously....Wooster down 3 with a minute to go and the video feed goes down
Quote from: pennstghs on December 05, 2009, 04:28:10 PM
seriously.....
No kidding!  8)  Seriously???  Thanks Kenyon for allowing us to miss that fantastic finish!

Wooster escapes today in a game that they were far from deserving of winning!

Hats off to Kenyon for putting together a hardfaught effort!  I still can't believe the Scots pulled that one off!  But I'll definitely take it!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2009, 04:39:24 PM
Another thriller is taking place in Meadville, where OWU has fought back to lead 67-66 with 0:53 left.

Earlham defeats Oberlin 82-77.

Denison is trying to close out Wabash, leading 71-59 with 2:00 left.

Quote from: ScotsFan on December 05, 2009, 04:35:43 PMThanks Kenyon for allowing us to miss that fantastic finish!
Yeah, it's frustrating; streaming video still has a lot of bugs in it.  I tried to watch some of the Hiram/Denison women's game, and never got an image at all.  But I'm glad they're trying to give us this service.  39 minutes of video is not as good as 40, but a lot better than 0. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2009, 04:41:10 PM
George Raftis blocks a potential game-winning layup by Tim Brady, and OWU and Gheny go to overtime, tied at 67!

Denison survives Wabash's comeback attempt and wins 78-71.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 05, 2009, 04:48:15 PM
Final:  Denison 78  Wabash 71

Big Red pull the upset at home to get their first win of the season.  Chris Luther led with 32 points.  Wes Smith led the Little Giants with 20 points.  Wabash is now 2-4, 0-1 NCAC.  Denison is now 1-5, 1-0 NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 05, 2009, 04:58:23 PM
Congratulations to Denison on getting to 1-0 in league play. 

I don't have much to say about this one.  Obviously, this is not an acceptable result for a veteran Wabash team.  It took Wabash 7 minutes and 37 seconds of game time before they scored a point.  You just can't spot any team 8 minutes and 15 points to start a game and win.  Maybe finally getting to play at home next week will snap Wabash out of the funk. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2009, 05:05:06 PM
Allegheny comes out on top in the nip-and-tuck battle in Meadville, 79-76 in OT.  Charlie Jaicks led the Gators with 16, and seven other Gators had at least 7 points.  By contrast, OWU was led by 28 from Tim Brady, while Pat Pellerite (15), Andy Winters (14), and Rob Gardiner (eight) added 37, but the rest of the roster combined for a total of 11 points.  OWU drops to 0-2 in conference play and has a very hard road ahead of them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 05, 2009, 05:49:25 PM
Did not see the Wooster-Kenyon result coming at all. I never remember a Steve Moore team struggling like this seven games into a season.

I think Franks has not only answered the question about being Wooster's best player (and one of the top players in the NCAC), but I think the leadership mantle is now his. He single-handily won this game, and was responsible for keeping Wooster in the OWU game the other night before they pulled away.

The two players that have to get going are Balch and Hallowell. Balch is really struggling from the field, which is really a surprise, considering the couldn't miss practically down the stretch last year. I think he might be struggling trying to find his role in the offense now that he is playing with two guards (Johnson and Franks) instead of one like last year.

As for Hallowell, he is going to shoot better, obviously, but thinking he was going to shoot threes like last year is unrealistic. What surprises me is that he hasn't developed his offensive game more. I had heard he had worked on scoring more in the paint and off the dribble during the summer, but if he did, he hasn't shown it. And with him playing the power forward position most of the time, it would be nice to get him to do something in the paint once in a while. He certainly has the size to shoot over people. If nothing else, he needs to show more diversity in his offensive game to make the defenses back off him a little bit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 05, 2009, 06:26:12 PM
At the Half:  Hiram 47  Wittenberg 36

Glenn Campbell is hitting the high notes for the Terriers with 11 points. :P  Gregg Hill is leading the Tigers with 8 points.

15:08 left in 2nd Half:  Hiram 61  Wittenberg 42  Terriers looking good in this game.

5:52 left:  Hiram 80  Wittenberg 65  Terriers have balanced scoring with 5 players in double figures.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2009, 06:46:08 PM
Holy cow, where has this Hiram team been all year?   :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 05, 2009, 07:06:58 PM
Final:  Hiram 92  Wittenberg 74

Terriers were led by Babajide Eniola with 20 points and Chris Roberts with 16 points.

Tigers were led by Chris Sullivan with 17 points and Gregg Hill with 13 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 05, 2009, 07:11:29 PM
Parity in the North Coast this year?

Strange first Saturday in the NCAC!  ???

Who would have guessed that Ohio Wesleyan, Wittenberg and Wabash would all pick up losses and Wooster would need a buzzer beater basket to pull out a win?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2009, 07:34:51 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 05, 2009, 07:11:29 PMWho would have guessed that Ohio Wesleyan, Wittenberg and Wabash would all pick up losses and Wooster would need a buzzer beater basket to pull out a win?
ScotsFan was all over that Denison/Wabash result (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4200.msg1144802#msg1144802), and warned us that it was going to be an interesting afternoon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2009, 07:50:08 PM
Another day, another 1,000 point scorer!  Today, congratulations go out to Wittenberg senior Gregg Hill, who reached the milestone in the first half of today's game at Hiram.  I'm sure he'd have traded it for a victory, or even for a shorter bus ride, but congratulations all the same! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 05, 2009, 07:53:52 PM
Did anyone watch video of the Hiram/Witt game today? I wasn't able to see it as I was officiating a game somewhere. Sounds like Witt just couldn't stop Hiram defensively and pocket points together and make a run at first glance at the stats.

Interesting game indeed next Wednesday at Witt between Witt and Kenyon. I doubt either team would like to start conference play 0-2
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2009, 08:32:06 PM
I watched it, but I'm very hesitant to draw any sweeping conclusions from a medium resolution, fixed-position camera that may not be watching the part of the action I would have watched.  That said, it looked like Hiram had a lot more energy than Witt from the get-go, which may have been a combination of Hiram's enthusiasm for this particular matchup and Wittenberg's endless bus ride (long enough normally, but the hours-long traffic jam didn't help.)  Hiram basically could do no wrong early on.  They have a lot of raw athletic ability, and when it works (which is not too often), they're hard to stop on either end.  Wittenberg seemed to me to be too willing to settle for the long three, and as they weren't falling early, they fell far behind and had to play catch-up all afternoon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 05, 2009, 09:08:07 PM
WOW!   ???  All of this is huge for the Scots as they came out of a nail biter 1-0 in the NCAC.  And with Wabash, Witt, and OWU going down, this could also have been the week of separation.  Gonna be interesting.

As for the comments about Hallowell, I'm not so sure if he is gonna get it going.  At the Albion game, and I hate to say this, I was like "THATS HIM?" Was very unimpressed as he did not shoot the ball well and his D had me dumbfounded.  The Scots are going to have to rely on grit and gutsy performances if the are going to pull this thing out.  I think we (SCOTS FANS) are hoping this is just the bitter waters period before the sweetness comes!  Regardless, we're in for a great year in the NCAC!! 

Big road trip for the Scots now.  If they can take 2, wow,....could be turn around they need!  Get'em ready coach!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 05, 2009, 09:22:12 PM
Quote from: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 05, 2009, 09:08:07 PM
WOW!   ???  All of this is huge for the Scots as they came out of a nail biter 1-0 in the NCAC.  And with Wabash, Witt, and OWU going down, this could also have been the week of separation.  Gonna be interesting.

As for the comments about Hallowell, I'm not so sure if he is gonna get it going.  At the Albion game, and I hate to say this, I was like "THATS HIM?" Was very unimpressed as he did not shoot the ball well and his D had me dumbfounded.  The Scots are going to have to rely on grit and gutsy performances if the are going to pull this thing out.  I think we (SCOTS FANS) are hoping this is just the bitter waters period before the sweetness comes!  Regardless, we're in for a great year in the NCAC!!  

Big road trip for the Scots now.  If they can take 2, wow,....could be turn around they need!  Get'em ready coach!!!

Wooster is 2-0, not 1-0. And if you think Hallowell can't shoot, you must not have gone to a single Wooster game last year -- like these two:

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4525256

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4536937

Not to mention that he was the Freshman of the Year in Div. III. What does that have to do with this year? Nothing, other than he isn't sneaking up on people, which is another reason he needs to diversify his game. As for defense, the few times I've seen him, I think he is better this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 06, 2009, 03:14:23 PM
Quote from: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 05, 2009, 09:08:07 PM
WOW!   ???  All of this is huge for the Scots as they came out of a nail biter 1-0 in the NCAC.  And with Wabash, Witt, and OWU going down, this could also have been the week of separation.  Gonna be interesting.

As for the comments about Hallowell, I'm not so sure if he is gonna get it going.  At the Albion game, and I hate to say this, I was like "THATS HIM?" Was very unimpressed as he did not shoot the ball well and his D had me dumbfounded.  The Scots are going to have to rely on grit and gutsy performances if the are going to pull this thing out.  I think we (SCOTS FANS) are hoping this is just the bitter waters period before the sweetness comes!  Regardless, we're in for a great year in the NCAC!! 

Big road trip for the Scots now.  If they can take 2, wow,....could be turn around they need!  Get'em ready coach!!!
You should know better than to draw conclusions after just seeing him in person once.  As for why Hallowell has seemed to have lost his shooter's touch, I'm sure he's wondering that himself.  But, it's not as though Justin is the only Wooster player struggling to find their shot either.  Nate Balch shot nearly 50% from deep last season and he was having trouble drawing iron in yesterday's game.  Personally, I think some of the struggles that Wooster had yesterday shooting the ball could be attributed to Kenyon's gym.  It's not a particularly common gym as there is a lot of glass behind the baskets.  IIRC, Wooster seems to always struggle shooting at Kenyon since they opened up their new gym.

Heck, if you look at the stats from yesterday's game, Franks was far and away Wooster's best shooter on the day as he canned 5-7 treys.  The rest of the team was a miserable 4-22 from beyond the arch!  So, Hallowell isn't the only one struggling to find his range.

Personally, I can't remember a Wooster team that has struggled this much from 3-point range.  The Scots are shooting well below 40% so far this season and they only have one player shooting over 40% and that is Matt Fegan checking in at 43%.  And for as hot as Franks was yesterday beyond the arc, he was only 4-16 prior to yesterday's 5-7 performance.

I just think the part that is the most puzzling is that we are talking about proven shooters here.  Both Hallowell and Balch were at or over 50% from deep last year and they are both struggling to crack 30% this season.  All we as fans can do is hope that shooters touch returns and soon!  These guys are too good of shooters to not find their range sooner or later.  I just hope they find that range sooner than later...  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on December 07, 2009, 10:58:32 AM
Big win by the Big Red!!!  Congrats to Luther on his 32 points......10 for 10 from the line....VERY NICE!!

Looks like the big 3 may have their hands full this season.  Not to say they won't end up on top, it would be nice to have a little compitition.

It will certainly make for some exciting games!!!

GO BIG RED!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2009, 01:09:38 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on December 07, 2009, 10:58:32 AMLooks like the big 3 may have their hands full this season.  Not to say they won't end up on top, it would be nice to have a little comp[e]tition.
I'm very curious to know who you see as the "Big 3."  Last year, the top three in the standings were Wooster, OWU, and Hiram, and Hiram's lead over 4th place was two full games.  On the other hand, the tournament final four was Wooster, Wabash, Allegheny, and Kenyon.  And a traditional rendering of the "Big [Any Number]" in the NCAC must include Wittenberg.  So which three of these were you thinking of?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 07, 2009, 01:24:53 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 07, 2009, 01:09:38 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on December 07, 2009, 10:58:32 AMLooks like the big 3 may have their hands full this season.  Not to say they won't end up on top, it would be nice to have a little comp[e]tition.
I'm very curious to know who you see as the "Big 3."  Last year, the top three in the standings were Wooster, OWU, and Hiram, and Hiram's lead over 4th place was two full games.  On the other hand, the tournament final four was Wooster, Wabash, Allegheny, and Kenyon.  And a traditional rendering of the "Big [Any Number]" in the NCAC must include Wittenberg.  So which three of these were you thinking of?
I was kind of wondering this myself.  Traditionally speaking, the NCAC has been the "Big 2" with Witt and Woo battling it out and everyone else fighting for scraps.  Occasionally, OWU or Wabash will have a decent showing and put in a scare to either of the Big 2, but the staying power of either of those 2 hasn't been there.  I really wouldn't say there's been anything but the big 2 up until last year and possibly this year.

I will say, it is nice to see some of the traditional lower tier teams rising up to challenge the likes of Woo and Witt.  A few years ago, the only question wrt a Witt/Hiram game or a Woo/Kenyon game was how big the margin of victory was going to be.  Now, low and behold, Hiram has actually beaten Witt 3 times in a row!  And Kenyon really deserved to win that game vs. Wooster which really would have shaken up the standings!  And Denison made everyone take note that they're not going to be an easy out either with the way they handled Wabash. 

If things continue the way they went down last weekend in conference play, this season has the makings of being one of the most balanced and competitive conference races we've had in the NCAC.  To me, it looks like any team from 1-8 in the conference has the potential to pull off a win over anyone in this conference.  I can't recall a year when I looked at the top 8 teams in the conference and thought that.

As BigRedFan noted, this will indeed make for some exciting games and an even more exciting conference championship race!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on December 07, 2009, 02:25:48 PM
Witt and Woo for sure but I always consider OWU part of that mix.  Year in and year out OWU can beat anyone.  Coach DeWitt has done a great job since coming there and I have the utmost respect for him and his program.

Sorry for the mass confusion.  My bad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2009, 03:36:54 PM
No worries.  Anyway, I'm right there with you: I also have a great deal of respect for Coach DeWitt and his program, something I hope shows through in my posting.  And yet I'm also right there with ScotsFan in that I'm thrilled by the appearance of parity in the conference, something we've seen precious little of.  After all, OWU is currently tied for ninth place!

If the conference race is going to be a war, it can only help the team that emerges and goes on to the NCAAs.  I'm not sure that two months of blowouts interrupted by the occasional nailbiter has done Wooster a lot of good in recent years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2009, 03:58:43 PM
Just one game on tap for tonight, and a non-conference one at that, as NCAC founding member Case Western Reserve travels to conference co-leader Hiram for a 7pm tip.  Building on their successful first videocast(s--they did Saturday's women's game as well), Hiram will offer Live Stats, Audio, and Video (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2009, 05:51:24 PM
Ian Franks' heroics Saturday at Tomsich Arena led Wooster to a key road victory, and that's all well and good, I suppose.  But what Franks was really playing for was a shot at the coveted NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html) trophy, and all his hard work paid off today when he was named the third recipient of the award for this season.  Congratulations, Ian!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2009, 08:53:05 PM
Hiram drops a 77-75 heartbreaker to Case tonight.  Case led by 9 at the half, but Hiram came out like they were playing Wittenberg and took control of the game in the second half, opening with a 14-4 run.  Along about the 7 minute mark, things fell apart for the Pups, and they found themselves trailing by 8 with about 3 minutes to go.  Then some tenacious defense combined with some sloppy errors by Case led to an 8-0 Hiram run, tying the game with 0:35 left.  Alas, Case's Bryan Erce, after dribbling out most of the clock, made a brilliant one-on-one drive to the hoop to score the winning bucket with 0:03 left.  After a timeout, Hiram tried a 3/4-court inbound pass to Chris Roberts, who turned and shot but missed badly.  The whole sequence was poorly thought out, as they had ample time to get a better shot and/or inbound to half court and call time to set up a higher percentage play.  (I'm assuming that there were in fact three seconds left; the clock was not visible on the video, so I'm going with what the announcer said.)  Hiram drops to 3-3, and suits up again Wednesday against Grove City.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 08, 2009, 10:25:59 AM
As I did during football season, I plan to tweet (http://twitter.com/wallywabash) live updates from Wabash hoops games this season.  Feel free to follow along this season! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 08, 2009, 11:50:08 AM
2-0 yes in NCAC now are the Scots thanks for that correction.

On the other hand, I think Hallowell is a good player.  Moreever, I did not say that "He cannot shoot"; I simply said "He did not shoot the ball well" against Albion.  So it shocked me ya know.  And yes, I was unable to attend any games last season so when I saw him i was still expecting much more, so was disappointed a bit.  While he is a target, I really didn't see Albion "all over him"; he got off plenty of shots with ease, etc.  He very well maybe pressing ya know, which would be understandable because I'm sure he expects more from himself.  As people are saying, it just looks like he needs to diversify his game if the Scots are gonna go deep in the NCAA tournament, none of us can deny that.

Nevertheless, its a big weekend for the Scots as they head to the East Coast.  It will be very good for them to "get away" and relax.  I think they'll be some opportunities for bonding and a leader shall soon develop!  Go SCOTS!!



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2009, 01:39:26 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 07, 2009, 08:53:05 PMAfter a timeout, Hiram tried a 3/4-court inbound pass to Chris Roberts, who turned and shot but missed badly.  The whole sequence was poorly thought out, as they had ample time to get a better shot and/or inbound to half court and call time to set up a higher percentage play.
(Not that anyone cares, but...) I've been thinking about this play, and I've had a change of heart.  It still wouldn't have been my choice, but I can see where it might not be a bad gamble, especially for a strong rebounding team like Hiram.

Trailing by two with three seconds left, most teams would want to use that time to get off the best shot they could, but Hiram has a special strength in offensive rebounds (12 more last night) and may have wanted to play to that strength.  Three seconds is plenty of time to get off a shot, grab the rebound, and put it back up.  So here's my entirely made-up mathematical analysis of the play.

>3/4 court inbounds pass: let's say that has an 80% chance of being successful (20% steal, overthrow, etc.)
>Roberts turns and shoots: I give that 25% max.  Roberts doesn't shoot much from the arc, where he's .333 this year and was .406 last year, and this was a tough shot.
>Hiram gets the rebound: I make this, somewhat generously, 35%, because they're playing for it, i.e. it's part of the play's design.  Last year they got 40.2% of the available rebounds at the offensive end.  This year it's down to 32%, as it was last night.  Plus Eniola, their best offensive rebounder, is out of the play, having thrown the inbounds pass.  But Case would have been concentrating on the shot, not the rebound, giving the Hiram rebounders an advantage.
>Rebounder puts it back in: 80%.  He's probably alone and more or less right next to the hoop.  He only misses if he rushes or gets nervous.
So the chance that Roberts makes the shot to win the game is 80% x 25%=20%, and the chance that they force OT on a stickback is 80% x 75% x 35% x 80%=16.8%.  They get a positive result 36.8% of the time, which is probably about as good as they could have hoped for had they played for one "good" shot.  Plus this play generates two good opportunities for Case to foul, giving Hiram a chance to tie or win at the line.

As it happened, Eniola did connect on the inbounds pass, Roberts missed the shot, but Hiram did not get the rebound.  Roberts' shot missed badly enough that it caromed long, spoiling the plan.  The missed rebound also might be due in part to who was on the floor: besides the unavailable-to-rebound Eniola and Roberts, it was Russo, Sheppard, and Campbell (IIRC), who collectively had 6 boards on the night.  I'd have had Muhammad and Milton in for sure (Meyer and his 10 boards had fouled out by then.) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2009, 05:48:13 PM
Two non-conference games on tonight's agenda:
Kalamazoo at Oberlin 7pm -- Live Stats, Audio, Video (http://www.goyeo.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&tab=basketball)
Rose Hulman Institute of Technology at Wabash 7:30pm -- Live Stats, Audio, Video (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball) + Wally's Twitter Feed (http://twitter.com/wallywabash)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2009, 08:45:25 PM
Oberlin put on a clinic tonight, and no I don't mean a cello masterclass or a poetry slam.   Check out some of these numbers:
> The Yeomen shot 71% from the field
> They recorded 18 assists on 24 buckets
> They outrebounded Kzoo 28 to 22
> They held the Hornets to 15 second-half points
> They won the game 71-51
The good defense is nothing new; they held Hiram to 14 points in the first half just the other day.  On offense, Oberlin missed a total of 19 shots on the evening, but nine of them were free throws (65%).  They did turn the ball over 20 times, sloppiness which helped get them into an early 14-2 hole, but they filled that hole with a 12-0 run and went into the half tied at 36.  After the half, Oberlin did their best Wash U. impersonation and utterly dominated the visiting Michiganders to raise their record to 3-5.  Go Yeo!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash83 on December 08, 2009, 10:50:44 PM
Congrats to the Little Giants on their 64-46 victory over Rose-Hulman.  While the reports from those present and the stats suggest it wasn't pretty, a win is a win.

Time to get ready for another shot at DPU!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 08, 2009, 11:28:14 PM
It was definitely an uneven effort offensively for Wabash tonight, but the defense was there for the full game which helped to keep RHIT at a comfortable distance even while Wabash struggled to score in the second half.  Certainly, I don't think that an 8-29 half of basketball is going to be good enough on Friday, but I think this is a positive step after the last two starts Wabash has had (vs. DPU and Denison).  Hopefully the good start will be duplicated on Friday night.  It's just too hard to dig a deep hole against a good team like DePauw and come back to win.  I'm looking forward to a rowdy crowd and a full 40 minutes from Wabash later this week. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 09, 2009, 01:05:00 PM
Today in the NCAC:
One conference game, a rematch of last year's 4/5 quarterfinal, highlights the slate:
Kenyon (3-4, 0-1) at Wittenberg (4-1, 0-1), 7:30 -- Live Stats, Audio, and Video (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/index.html)

Non-conference:
Allegheny (4-2) at Thiel (2-4), 7pm (no coverage)
Washington & Jefferson (3-5) at Denison (1-5), 7:30pm -- Live Stats and Audio
(http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html)Grove City (3-3) at Hiram (3-3), 7:30pm -- Live Stats, Audio, and Video (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html) (Hiram's 4th game in 8 days)
Capital (1-3) at Ohio Wesleyan (1-5), ~8pm -- Live Stats and Video (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html) (second game of a doubleheader, women face Wash/Jeff at 6pm, men's tip time 30 mins. after women's game ends)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 09, 2009, 06:24:56 PM
Lets go Witt, don't want an 0-2 conference start.

I can tell you that Witt will have great energy tonight
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 09, 2009, 07:55:52 PM
Looks like its about to get ugly for Kenyon.........39-26, witt up with 7 to go in the first half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 09, 2009, 09:15:17 PM
Hiram has revised their end-of-the-game playbook; this time they fed Nick Russo on the left baseline, and he drained the game-winning three, as Hiram wins 68-65.

Elsewhere,
Washington & Jefferson 79, Denison 69
Wittenberg 76, Kenyon 66
Thiel 84, Allegheny 82
Capital 34, OWU 33 (half)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 09, 2009, 09:32:40 PM
A few notes from the Wittenberg Kenyon game tonight

Wittenberg 76 Kenyon 66

If anyone wants me to go into detail on anything let me know.......

Witt shot pretty well from 3 point range in the first half, but needs to get the ball down low a little more when the shots aren't falling

Coach Brown received his first technical of the year (deservedly) but probably should have been given a second......needless to say one of the officials wasn't having a good night. Not sure on the ethics of shouting at a coach and a player but any way.

Coach Brown on his post game show stated that we won't be seeing Mckee or Cooper until the holiday tournament and probably not into the regular rotation until the first of the year.


Kenyon is a gritty team most definitely. Croci's teams, as always, are well-coached, but for some reason I can see Kenyon possibly sneaking into that Top 4 tier at the end of the season and being a pain in the conferenec tournament. It doesn't help to start off 0-2, but most teams struggle with Wooster and Wittenberg as the first two games. Can Oberlin and Denison come soon enough? No offense
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 09, 2009, 10:03:20 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 09, 2009, 09:32:40 PM
If anyone wants me to go into detail on anything let me know.......
No man, I hate it when anyone goes into detail in here.  ;) :D

Trying to make a "The Bishops lead the Crusaders" joke but coming up empty...
anyway, it's over.  In a very sloppy and, frankly, poorly played game, OWU outlasts Capital 64-63.  DJ Frazier, still going coast to coast in many Wooster fans' nightmares, couldn't convert the second of two free throws with 0:00.8 showing, and the Bishops escaped the Holy Land Branch Rickey arena with their second win.  OWU recorded a rare victory in a game where their turnovers (24) outpaced their buckets (21).  Frosh Marshall Morris had a double-double (13/10), but committed the stupid foul that put Frazier on the line with a chance to tie.  Prior to that, Pat Pellerite threw the ball away on back-to-back possessions, but he did contribute 10 points and 9 boards.  OWU still has a lot of room for improvement as they move to 2-5 on the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 10, 2009, 10:19:38 AM
As much as a win over Kenyon can be big, last night's win for Witt was big.  I don't know if Witt could have rebounded from and 0-2 start to conference play vs. Kenyon and Hiram.  Although, as penn pointed out, Kenyon could very well be a team challenging for a top 4 finish in the league when it's all said and done.

OWU on the other hand...

I'm quite stunned at how poorly the Bishops have started this season.  I know they lost some big contributors from last year's team, but they still had a lot of talent waiting in the wings.  And I know that their schedule has been difficult, but I didn't think it was 2-5 difficult.   And they're very fortunate they didn't start off 1-6 after surviving against a sub-par Capital squad in Deleware no less. 

IMO, as I've said before, this has the makings of being one of the most wide open conference races ever.  As it stands now, Wooster still seems to be the team to beat, but they are far from looking invincible.  Witt has shown signs that they are back, but that loss to Hiram kind of opened up some questions wrt them.  Hiram shows flashes of the team they were to start last season, and they also show flashes of the team that finished last season.  Kenyon is off to an 0-2 start in conference, but they have more than held their own against Woo and Witt in those 2 losses.  And for me, Wabash and OWU are the enigmas of the conference thus far.  With all of the talent they both returned, there should be no reason why these 2 teams should be struggling the way they have to start the season. 

If I had to rank the NCAC today, I would have a hard time including Wabash and OWU in the top 4 or even in the top 5.  Woo, Witt, Hiram and Kenyon would be my top 4 for now with Gheny checking in at #5 followed by Wabash and OWU with Denison not far behind them.  Anyone else have any thoughts on how they would rank the NCAC today?  Just trying to drum up some more lively conversation...  8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on December 10, 2009, 11:18:57 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 10, 2009, 10:19:38 AM
Anyone else have any thoughts on how they would rank the NCAC today?  Just trying to drum up some more lively conversation...  8)

This probably isn't quite what you're looking for, but here's how the NCAC currently* stacks up from a regional RPI basis.

   REG   RANK     WP    OWP   OOWP     RPI   NAT   REG   OVR   CONF   TEAM
1   GL    010   .600   .625   .549   .5998   070   3-2   3-3   NCAC   Hiram
2   GL    011   .667   .571   .536   .5865   091   4-2   4-3   NCAC   Wooster
3   GL    012   .500   .632   .558   .5804   098   2-2   4-2   NCAC   Allegheny
4   GL    023   .667   .385   .483   .4798   224   2-1   5-1   NCAC   Wittenberg
5   GL    029   .600   .360   .470   .4474   276   3-2   3-4   NCAC   Earlham
6   GL    030   .333   .448   .556   .4465   279   2-4   3-5   NCAC   Kenyon
7   GL    033   .167   .567   .456   .4390   292   1-5   1-6   NCAC   Denison
8   GL    034   .200   .524   .496   .4360   300   1-4   2-5   NCAC   Ohio Wesleyan
9   GL    035   .500   .379   .485   .4359   301   3-3   3-4   NCAC   Wabash

*Up to date with scores reported on d3hoops.com thru 7:15 am (EST)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2009, 10:11:05 PM
Um, ick for Wabash.

Good to see others besides OWU and Wabash in the top 3 or 4 in some people's minds. It makes the conference more balanced and intriguing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2009, 02:16:11 PM
If pressed, I think I might argue that Allegheny belongs at least as high as Hiram and Kenyon right now, but I don't feel like doing the analysis that would either support or refute that position.  I have no doubt that Wooster and OWU will right their respective ships and be at the top come season's end.  I still haven't decided whether I'm a believer in the Wittenberg renaissance just yet.

-----------------------------------

Fairly light weekend in the NCAC, so let's do the schedule in one fell swoop.

Friday:
Alma (2-4) at Oberlin (3-5), 6pm -- Live Stats, Audio, and Video (http://www.goyeo.com/) -- stay tuned as Oberlin's women have their home opener (believe it or not) afterward, vs. Ursuline, also on video
DePauw (6-1) at Wabash (3-4), 7:30pm -- Live Stats, Audio, and Video (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball/schedule)

Saturday:
Earlham (3-4, 1-0) at Denison (1-6, 1-0), 3pm -- Live Stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html) -- The weekend's lone conference game, and lo and behold, it's a battle for a share of first place!
Wittenberg (5-1) at Anderson (6-1), 3pm -- Live Audio (Witt) (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/sportsnetwork/) -- Anderson seems to have live audio as well, but I can't figure out how to access it--"The game will be carried live on the internet broadcast and WQME 98.7 FM from O.C. Lewis Gymnasium at 3 p.m."

Sunday:
Wooster (4-3) vs. North Carolina Wesleyan (2-6) at Randolph-Macon, 4pm -- Live Audio (Wooster) (http://wqkt.com/) -- RMC will have Live Stats, Audio, and Video for at least their own games in this tourney, perhaps for this game as well, check here (http://athletics.rmc.edu/sports/mbkb/index)

Monday:
Wooster (5-3) at Randolph-Macon (7-0), 7pm -- Live Stats (http://liveathletics.rmc.edu/xlive.htm) -- Live Audio (Wooster) (http://wqkt.com/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 11, 2009, 02:32:15 PM
In case anyone missed it, R-MC has nearly moved into the top 5 in the latest D3hoops Top 25.  They currenly sit at #6.  If the Jackets and Scots happen to meet up on Sunday Monday (sorry, didn't notice the R-MC tournament didn't start until Sunday...) this would be the 3rd opponent for the Scots ranked in the top 6 out of the 9 games they've played thus far.  And as if that wasn't enough, they still have top ranked WashU on the horizon as a possible 4th top 6 opponent this season!  I don't think too many teams could match that kind of resume as far as facing so many highly ranked opponents this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 11, 2009, 03:56:25 PM
Did anybody get a chance to check out the live video from Wabash's game Tuesday night vs. RHIT?  I'm just curious as to how the production quality is.  Obviously, I'll be in attendance this evening (and the tweetstream  (http://htt://twitter.com/wallywabash) is coming with me), but I was just curious as to how Wabash's maiden voyage into hoops broadcasting looks to the casual observer. 

Big game tonight...let's go Wabash! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 11, 2009, 04:52:26 PM
QuoteEarlham (3-4, 1-0) at Denison (1-6, 1-0), 3pm -- Live Stats -- The weekend's lone conference game, and lo and behold, it's a battle for a share of first place!

Words I never thought would be uttered in that order....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2009, 07:47:45 PM
Oberlin continues to be the scourge of the dregs of the MIAA, dropping Alma 75-66 tonight.  All kidding aside, Oberlin has looked pretty sharp the last two games, and even though it's not come against the strongest opposition, hey--this is Oberlin, if you can discount a win of theirs by discrediting the opponent, that's a step forward from where they've been for many years.  Unfortunately, whatever momentum the Yeo has gained is sure to dissipate between now and their next game...which is not until Dec. 30 at Anderson.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2009, 09:58:09 PM
Wabash smoked DePauw tonight, 72-50.  I presume that Wally is already too drunk to post about the game.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 11, 2009, 11:50:56 PM
I'm actually preoccupied at a holiday soirée with friends and colleagues this evening...I promise a game report in due time though.  I will say that it is a fine night to be a Wabash man. Very proud of the team for taking care of business tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 12, 2009, 01:00:41 AM
Well, alrighty then! Forward momentum for the LGs!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2009, 02:13:48 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 09, 2009, 09:32:40 PM
If anyone wants me to go into detail on anything let me know.......
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 11, 2009, 11:50:56 PMI promise a game report in due time though.
Promises, promises... :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 12, 2009, 09:30:31 AM
David, you requested me not to go into detail haha.

Wittenberg has a tough game today as well at Anderson. Anderson has looked impressive in traveling to Wisconsin and winning easily and smoked Bluffton at Bluffton this week, which is not an easy place to play. Witt will have their hands full.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2009, 01:44:45 PM
Well, if you guys aren't going to give detailed accounts of the teams you follow, then I'll just stop giving eight-paragraph assessments of 3-second sequences in non-conference Hiram games...

...wait, that didn't come out the way I wanted...(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.smileyvault.com%2Falbums%2Fbasic%2Fsmileyvault-slaphead.gif&hash=31cf77d89401b1cf69f62218c8d8b629e8b62454)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 12, 2009, 01:49:38 PM
David, from now on you'll get a full biased Wittenberg wrap up!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 12, 2009, 02:24:40 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 12, 2009, 09:30:31 AM
David, you requested me not to go into detail haha.

Wittenberg has a tough game today as well at Anderson. Anderson has looked impressive in traveling to Wisconsin and winning easily and smoked Bluffton at Bluffton this week, which is not an easy place to play. Witt will have their hands full.

I'll give you that winning at Platteville is a good example of Anderson's prowess, but winning by 3 is not 'winning easily'........also Bluffton is 0-8 this year and has lost every game but 1 by double-digits.

I simply couldn't let this go unchallenged. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 12, 2009, 04:43:37 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 12, 2009, 02:13:48 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 09, 2009, 09:32:40 PM
If anyone wants me to go into detail on anything let me know.......
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 11, 2009, 11:50:56 PMI promise a game report in due time though.
Promises, promises... :)

As promised...  ;)

Wabash finally put together two full halves of good basketball, and the result is about what I would have expected from this veteran team.  The key going forward, obviously, is to put together games like this on a consistent basis...this group can't afford any more games like the one in Granville last weekend.  They are just too good for that. 

Wabash started the game strong last night.  Wes Smith opened the scoring with a three point play and then Chase Haltom hit a three pointer to put Wabash up by six and there was no looking back.  Wabash ran an efficient offense and really made it hard for DePauw to get many good shots of their own.  Most everything DePauw had to settle for were very difficult and well defended shots.  Credit to the Wabash D for making life miserable for the Tigers last night.  It's hard to find too much wrong with a 22 point win over your arch rival, but Wabash did miss an alarming number of shots right around the rim.  Finishing plays like that are going to be critical in the conference season (and especially next weekend at Wooster). 

Wabash was led in scoring by Wes Smith and Chase Haltom, each with 16 points.  Haltom's 13 first half points were critical in helping Wabash build their lead.  Wabash really is a completely different animal on offense when Chase is making a decent percentage of his shots.  Hopefully this DePauw game will get him going for the rest of the season.  Wabash's top rebounder yesterday was point guard Brian Shelbourne with 9.  I would also be remiss if I didn't mention Aaron Zinnerman who played some great basketball off the bench for Wabash.  The sophomore scored 12 points in 17 very active and effective minutes.  I've been quite impressed with AZ's improvement from a year ago in the two games that I've seen this season. 

As mentioned, Wabash next travels to Wooster for a Sunday afternoon tilt next weekend.  This is a monster game for Wabash, IMO.  As if all games against Wooster aren't huge, if you lose to Denison as Wabash did, you've pretty much lost a full game on the other contenders...which makes those h2h's doubly important if you expect to get those games back.  Good luck on finals this week, gentlemen...and good luck on Sunday! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2009, 04:49:30 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 12, 2009, 04:43:37 PM...if you lose to Denison as Wabash did...  
...you're probably from Indiana. ;)
Denison 78, Earlham 69...DU put five players in double figures, led by Dimonde Hale's 18 and Larry Farmer's double-double (10 & 12).  AJ Sutherlin had 31 points, including six treys, but as he's no Kym Wenz (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=726.msg1149417#msg1149417), it wasn't enough to pull the Q's to a W.

Elsewhere, Anderson has beaten Wittenberg "easily," 86-69.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2009, 05:00:35 PM
I thought the Wooster fans here might like to see this post in the Top 25 thread:
Quote from: Marty Peretz on December 12, 2009, 03:48:53 PM
What's up with Wooster? I haven't been following them but was told this was their year to make a real run. I was really looking forward to the Wooster-Wash.U game but with 3 L's in the early going,  a WUSTL victory would seem to virtually be a foregone conclusion. Anyone have a scoop?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 12, 2009, 06:03:41 PM
It must rankle DPU to have Haltom play well against them, since Cloverdale is in their back yard, so to speak. Much like DPU stealing, er, recruiting the good C'ville baseball players.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2009, 01:54:49 PM
There will be Live Stats for the Wooster/NCWC game here (http://liveathletics.rmc.edu/xlive.htm) (in addition, of course, to WQKT's audio coverage (http://wqkt.com/).)  Tip time is at 4pm.  It doesn't look to me like there will be video for this game, and furthermore it appears that there is a charge for the video when they do use it.  See here. (https://www.collegetvticket.com/schedule.php?=0&type=school&school=Randolph-Macon+College&activity=0&fromDate=12%2F01%2F2009&toDate=12%2F15%2F2009&action=filter)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 13, 2009, 04:39:32 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 43  North Carolina Wesleyan 38  :)

Wooster leads this game because they have outrebounded NC Wesleyan 23-15 in the half.  Scots are being led by Ian Franks with 15 points, Justin Hallowell with 12 points (4 three pointers) and freshman Josh Claytor with 7 points.  Wooster canned 8 three pointers in the first half.

NC Wesleyan is being led by Trey Drake with 12 points (3 three pointers) and Jarmel Arrington with 11 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2009, 04:53:12 PM
Unless my ears are deceiving me in a particularly horrible way, I believe that Wooster has brought the bagpipes on this trip!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2009, 05:36:00 PM
Wooster's shooting today -- over 50% from the floor, and under 40% from the line -- calls to mind the scene at the tin mine in Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, where the Kid, who can't hit anything while standing still, says "can I move?"  He then spins, draws, and hits the coin multiple times.  "I'm better when I move." 

Unfortunately, I haven't the YoouTube skills to dredge up this video clip...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 13, 2009, 05:37:51 PM
Final:  Wooster 87  North Carolina Wesleyan 69   ;D

Wooster won the rebounding battle 47 to 28 and made 14 three pointers to notch this victory.

Scots were led by Justin Hallowell with 24 points (7 three pointers), Ian Franks with 15 points and 10 boards, freshman Josh Claytor with 15 points and Nathan Balch with 12 points.  50% three point shooting by Hallowell and a nice double, double from Franks. :)

Wooster had 21 assists and 16 turnovers for a positive A/TO ratio.  Brandon Johnson led the Scots with 7 assists.

NC Wesleyan was led by Trey Drake with 26 points and Jarmel Arrington with 14 points.

Wooster is now 5-3, 2-0 NCAC  :)  Next up is the Randolph Macon/Alvernia winner tomorrow night.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 13, 2009, 05:55:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 13, 2009, 05:36:00 PM
Wooster's shooting today -- over 50% from the floor, and under 40% from the line -- calls to mind the scene at the tin mine in Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid, where the Kid, who can't hit anything while standing still, says "can I move?"  He then spins, draws, and hits the coin multiple times.  "I'm better when I move." 

Unfortunately, I haven't the YoouTube skills to dredge up this video clip...

Well, DC, better than this one for the same movie:

QuoteMorons. I've got morons on my team. Nobody is going to rob us going down the mountain. We have got no money going down the mountain. When we have got the money, on the way back, then you can sweat.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2009, 08:53:30 PM
Macon prevails over Alvernia, 92-64, and will face Wooster tomorrow at 7pm.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 14, 2009, 10:49:11 AM
I have a feeling that Wooster's going to have to play by far, their best game of the season to beat R-MC tonight.

The Jackets look to be a very balanced team.  They have 4 different players averaging 12 ppg and a fifth just under double figures at 9.3 ppg.  And Macon's top 2 scorers aren't even starters!

Macon could have a size advantage on the inside if they choose to exploit it.  Other than that, Wooster appears to matchup fairly well with Macon size-wise at least in the starting rotation.   In the Jacket's starting rotation they have a 6-9 C/F.  Then they go with a pair of G/F combo players at 6-5 and 6-4 and finish off the starting lineup with a pair of 6-0 guards.  Off the bench is where Wooster might struggle to match up with R-MC.   As I stated, Macon's 2 leading scorers come off the bench and are a pair of forwards checking in at 6-4 and 6-6.  The Jackets look to round out their 9 man rotation with a 6-3 guard and a 6-8 center.

Shooting will be a huge key for Wooster as it always is.  If Wooster can knock down 14 treys like they did yesterday, I like their chances.  If they struggle to find their range like they did in that 3-21 effort at JCU, it could be a long night. 

Also, turnovers will be another huge key as usual.  Wooster still committed 16 turnovers yesterday which is too many for my liking.  Even though they overcame those 16 to's with 21 assists, you can get away with 16 to's against a 2 win team like NCW, but not against a top 10 opponent like Macon.

Another key will be which big man can stay out of foul trouble.  It would be nice to see Wick be able to keep himself on the floor and get the R-MC big man into foul trouble early.  If it goes the other way and Wick finds himself in foul trouble yet again, it could make it tough sledding for the Scots.

R-MC has been pretty much on cruise control so far this season winning by an average MOV of nearly 19 ppg and no one has come within 12 points of beating the Jackets through their first 7 games!  But, I also think it could be said that Wooster will be arguably one of R-MC's toughest opponents to date.  Meanwhile, Wooster has already played a pretty tough schedule so far this season.  So, they should be used to the type of talent that the Jackets will put out on the floor.  Hopefully, the Scots can put a complete game together and not only knock R-MC from the ranks of the unbeaten, but also notch their first win over a highly ranked opponent for the first time this season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 14, 2009, 04:24:58 PM
Oberlin's recent no-kidding-they're-playing-great stretch has produced a little hardware, as sophomore guard Marcus Johnson picks up the NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html) award.  Johnson chipped in 90% of the Yeomen's 20-point margin of victory over Kalamazoo, their largest margin of victory in the past 18 seasons (I didn't know that! :o), and added 16 in their subsequent win over Alma.  It remains to be seen whether Johnson will also cop the weekly honor from the MIAA.  ;)  Congratulations, Marcus!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 14, 2009, 07:49:35 PM
At the Half:  Randolph Macon 38  Wooster 30

Both teams shot poorly in the first half at less than 40%.  Wooster only made 1 of their first 8 shots and trailed 13-4 early in the half.  Scots rallied and cut the RMC lead to 2 points a couple of times.  Wooster outrebounded RMC in the half by a 23 to 19 margin which has helped the Scots stay in the game.

Wooster had 11 turnovers in the half vs. only 4 for RMC which explains most of the RMC lead.

Wooster is being led by Justin Hallowell with 8 points and Ian Franks with 4 points.

RMC is being led by David Carlson with 10 points and Jordan Brown with 9 points
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 14, 2009, 08:06:27 PM
If Wooster is going to turn the ball over like this, they'll have troubles with Denison and Oberlin, never mind Randolph-Macon and WashU.  >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 14, 2009, 08:48:40 PM
Final:  #6 Randolph Macon 72  Wooster 65  :-\

Wooster lost this game by committing 19 turnovers.  The Scots fought hard in the 2nd half and cut the lead to 2 on several occasions including 67-65 with only 1:39 remaining.  Wooster had a chance to tie the game with ~1 minute left and instead committed their 18th and 19th turnovers on their next two possessions!! >:(

The Scots are not going to beat tough opponents by committing critical turnovers in the last 2 minutes.  This ending was eerily similar to the end of the John Carroll game.

Wooster was led by Nathan Balch with 15 points, Justin Hallowell with 11 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 10 points and Ian Franks with 9 points.

RMC was led by Jordan Brown with 20 points, Eric Pugh with 14 points and David Carlson with 10 points.

Wooster is now 5-4. 2-0 NCAC.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 14, 2009, 08:50:51 PM
Sickening.
I guess I should be happy that they played toe to toe with a top 10 team on their own court.
But I'm not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 14, 2009, 10:44:02 PM
Anyway.... :)

A couple of Tuesday non-cons for your enjoyment:
Kenyon (3-5) at Grove City (4-4), 8pm -- Live Stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
Bethany (5-3) at Denison (2-6), ~8pm -- Live Stats and Audio (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html) -- Game 2 of a Bethany/Denison double-dip at Livingston Gym, with the women's game tipping at 6pm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 15, 2009, 10:35:38 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 14, 2009, 08:48:40 PM
Final:  #6 Randolph Macon 72  Wooster 65  :-\

Wooster lost this game by committing 19 turnovers.  The Scots fought hard in the 2nd half and cut the lead to 2 on several occasions including 67-65 with only 1:39 remaining.  Wooster had a chance to tie the game with ~1 minute left and instead committed their 18th and 19th turnovers on their next two possessions!! >:(



The Scots are not going to beat tough opponents by committing critical turnovers in the last 2 minutes. This ending was eerily similar to the end of the John Carroll game.

wsf,

I had the same thoughts wrt the ending of the game being almost dejavu to the JCU ending...  :-\

Wooster's had four possessions after cutting the lead to 67-65 and that included 3 turnovers and a missed shot.  Not what you'd call qualilty execution with the game on the line?!   ???

This turnover epidemic is starting to become like a broken record.  To Wooster's credit, they did seem to do a better job of taking care of the basketball in the 2nd half.  I believe they had only committed 5 turnovers up until that forgettable final minute when Wooster went back to being Wooster...  :-[

While the turnovers were once again Wooster's ultimate undoing, I think the foul trouble of Ian Franks in the 2nd half can't be ignored either.  Franks picked up his 4th foul less than 5 minutes into the 2nd half and sat for over 8 minutes before returning.  And he picked up his 5th foul with over 2 minutes left in the game.  I don't know if Franks' presence on the floor would have helped at all down the stretch, but it surely wouldn't have hurt to have your leading scorer out on the floor in crunch time...


Quote from: David Collinge on December 14, 2009, 08:50:51 PM
Sickening.
I guess I should be happy that they played toe to toe with a top 10 team on their own court.
But I'm not.

I hate to say I agree with you David, but it's hard not to.  If Wooster takes care of the ball vs. both JCU and R-MC, they more than likely win both of those games.  Macon had 22 freaking points off of Wooster turnovers last night!  And Wooster was still only down 2 with a little more than a minute to go!  This is starting to remind me of the frustrations I have with the Wooster baseball team and their high propensity of making fielding errors...  ???

The thing I have to keep reminding myself is that Brandon Johnson is not even close to being at 100% and he probably won't be the entire season.  But he has been away from the game of basketball for basically 2 full off-seasons and one entire regular season and it is showing in his play.  He's been thrown right into the fire here in the opening month with this very difficult schedule and I think this will help him in the long run.  Come February, the rust should be all but gone and he should be getting close to being the Brandon Johnson that we all remembered before his injuries. 

And Wooster doesn't have any time to feel sorry for themselves as Wabash is coming to town this weekend for what will be a pivotal conference matchup.  And as David mentioned, if Wooster can't figure out this turnover problem, they're going to have trouble beating anyone!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 15, 2009, 11:01:20 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 14, 2009, 08:50:51 PM
Sickening.
I guess I should be happy that they played toe to toe with a top 10 team on their own court.
But I'm not.

It's one of those "well, gettem next time".  And this could be a team we see very soon if we make the NCAA Tournament.  You just never know.  We really need Hallowell to get going; 3-7 is not going to cut it, period.  And with no real size advantage, the SCOTS really could use one of the young big kids to develop FAST.  Defensively we look good, offensively its like we are not quite there.

Question....can Mabeny play or no? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 15, 2009, 11:34:03 AM
Quote from: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 15, 2009, 11:01:20 AM
We really need Hallowell to get going; 3-7 is not going to cut it, period.  And with no real size advantage, the SCOTS really could use one of the young big kids to develop FAST.  Defensively we look good, offensively its like we are not quite there.


You can't expect Hallowell to knock down 6 or 7 treys every night.  He only averaged a little more than 3 made triples per game last season anyways.  And you can't expect him to shoot 50% every night from beyond the arc.  Heck, take away one miss and he would have shot 50% last night and even 3-7 is still 43% which is above what he's been averaging.  And 43% is a good percentage from deep.  He just spoiled us last year when he seemed to be unconsious shooting the ball.

And, you mention no size advantage.  So, how do you expain Wooster outrebounding Macon 37-30?  This is a R-MC team that was outrebounding their opponents to the tune of almost 15 rebounds per game!  Wooster also had a 14-12 advantage on points in the paint as well as a 9-0 advantage on 2nd chance points.  Those numbers aren't very indicative of Wooster having no size advantage.

Those reasons you mentioned are not what cost Wooster the game last night.  It was the 19 turnovers including the 2 on back to back possessions when the Scots had chances to tie or take the lead in the final minute of the game.  And it was Franks playing a whopping 5-6 minutes at best of the 2nd half due to foul trouble.



Quote from: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 15, 2009, 11:01:20 AM
Question....can Mabeny play or no? 

I'm assuming you are wondering if Mabeny would help to give Wooster an advantage inside?  I would have to say my honest answer would be no.  Not at this point in time.  That's not to say he couldn't develop his game some.  But right now, for the most part, he looks lost when he's on the floor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2009, 12:36:40 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 15, 2009, 10:35:38 AMWhile the turnovers were once again Wooster's ultimate undoing, I think the foul trouble of Ian Franks in the 2nd half can't be ignored either. 
Franks' 4th and 5th fouls were both offensive fouls ==> turnovers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 15, 2009, 01:35:30 PM

[/quote]
And 43% is a good percentage from deep.  He just spoiled us last year when he seemed to be unconsious shooting the ball.

And, you mention no size advantage.  So, how do you expain Wooster outrebounding Macon 37-30?  This is a R-MC team that was outrebounding their opponents to the tune of almost 15 rebounds per game!  Wooster also had a 14-12 advantage on points in the paint as well as a 9-0 advantage on 2nd chance points.  Those numbers aren't very indicative of Wooster having no size advantage.


I think you are right on JH spoiling us last year.  Maybe because of that I'm putting a little too much pressure on him.  Yes, 3/7 is a good shooting percentage, I think we just need him to score more given we don't really have that "nasty" big man we're used to having in order to make the outside shot even more effective.  At the end of the day do you feel that's what we're lacking?  If so, can one of those younger fellas develop in time enough to help alleviate some of the pressure off our our guards? 

Thanks for the info on Mabeny.  It sure would be nice to have him out there, so hopefully he'll at least be able to do the things big Joe Baron (yes blast from the past from Gheny) could do...run up and down the court, change a few shots, and make the easy ones.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 15, 2009, 01:41:26 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 15, 2009, 12:36:40 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 15, 2009, 10:35:38 AMWhile the turnovers were once again Wooster's ultimate undoing, I think the foul trouble of Ian Franks in the 2nd half can't be ignored either. 
Franks' 4th and 5th fouls were both offensive fouls ==> turnovers.
Ahhh.  Too true!   :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 15, 2009, 02:18:10 PM
Quote from: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 15, 2009, 01:35:30 PM

I think you are right on JH spoiling us last year.  Maybe because of that I'm putting a little too much pressure on him.  Yes, 3/7 is a good shooting percentage, I think we just need him to score more given we don't really have that "nasty" big man we're used to having in order to make the outside shot even more effective.  At the end of the day do you feel that's what we're lacking?  If so, can one of those younger fellas develop in time enough to help alleviate some of the pressure off our our guards? 

First of all, I agree with you that it would be nice to see Hallowell score more.  But, I think part of his problem is he relies on his outside shot too much in terms of scoring.  I was under the impression that he had worked more on his inside game during the offseason and I haven't seen very much evidence of that so far.  He could very much use his outside shot to set up defenders faking them with the shot and beating them with the dribble to get inside but I haven't seen much of that.  He could really keep defenders off balance if he could develop any sort of dribble penetration.

As far as lacking an inside presence, I'm not sold on that being the problem of this team to answer your question.  Wickliffe has proven he can dominate on the inside when the emphasis is there to get him the ball and when he can stay out of foul trouble.  What bugs me about Wick is that he never seems to build off of solid performances.  Like when he dropped 22 on JCU in a losing effort, he followed that up with a 4 point effort vs. Kenyon.  And like last night, he scored just 2 points in the 1st half and scored 8 fairly easily in the 2nd half.  Part of that problem is, as I said, Wooster's effort or emphasis to get him involved or lackthereof.

I also think the potential is there for our 2 young freshmen bigs to develop into a nice inside presence, but the experience just isn't all there yet.  They show flashes, but not consistency.

And as far as where I see this team truly lacking, as I've touched on many many many times as have David and wsf and others, it's taking care of the basketball!  Wooster is just turning the ball over  far too often, whether it be from sloppy ball handling to lazy passes to reckless drives into the lane.  I'm sure that the defenses of some of these teams Wooster has been playing could be attributed to some of the turnovers, but from listening to the game last night as well as others where the Scots have had a high number of turnovers, it seemed that a high percentage of Wooster's turnovers were of the unforced variety.  And until they shore up those unforced turnovers, this team will continue to struggle I'm afraid...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2009, 05:19:59 PM
Looks like Earlham may have jumped the gun (http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/news?slug=ap-bigten-expansion&prov=ap&type=lgns)...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 15, 2009, 06:45:29 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 15, 2009, 05:19:59 PM
Looks like Earlham may have jumped the gun (http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/news?slug=ap-bigten-expansion&prov=ap&type=lgns)...

They could always re-admit the University of Chicago...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 15, 2009, 09:13:12 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 15, 2009, 05:19:59 PM
Looks like Earlham may have jumped the gun (http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/news?slug=ap-bigten-expansion&prov=ap&type=lgns)...

Pitt may make sense, geographically. I can't see Syracuse or Rutgers. Iowa State and Missouri also make sense. I heard they may consider a MAC school too, which I can't see.

Earlham should hold out for the Summit League!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2009, 09:40:57 PM
Denison and Bethany going to OT; neither team has had a double-digit lead tonight.  Audio link is at the top of this page.
UPDATE: Bethany's Jay Lyonett hits a fallaway three at the buzzer to force a second OT.  78-78.
UPDATE: Glad to have the audio, as the "live" stats has died, time of death 3:29 of the second OT.
UPDATE: Ah, now we have the "Lazarus Stats" app up and running.  90-88 Bison, 0:44.9 left, Bison ball.
FINAL: Bethany hits clutch free throws and issues more heartbreak to the Big Red, 94-90, 2OT.
If nothing else, playing for the Big Red surely builds character.  :(  Frosh Dimonde Hale leads DU with a career-high 23; Larry Farmer had a 14-point/14-rebound/9-assist game, his third straight double-double.

Grove City 79, Kenyon 68...Lords had a 40-point first half, then scored two-count-em-two points in the first 8:57 of the second, by which time they were down by 19.  Scoring: Knight 27, Knapke 26, Keverybodyelse 15.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 15, 2009, 10:49:34 PM
An absolutely sickening game.  New to the board and I am definitely feeling G-o-r-e-d after this one.  The second game this year where the Red have had a 3 pt. lead with less than 10 seconds left and it got away from them - not to mention the heartbreaker last year where they came within a few seconds of upsetting the Scots on their home floor before losing in double OT.

This team seems to have talent and athleticism, and keeps games close, but can't seem to close out.  I wish I knew the answer because they seem better than their record shows (though early in the season beating a strong Wabash team). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 16, 2009, 01:19:26 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 15, 2009, 05:19:59 PM
Looks like Earlham may have jumped the gun (http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/news?slug=ap-bigten-expansion&prov=ap&type=lgns)...

That's hilarious.   :D

Who's the 12th team?  My guess...nobody.  I don't think there's an institution where the interest would be mutual.  I don't think the Big Ten is particularly interested into expanding into Nebraska or Missouri.  I think they are interested in expanding into the Northeast media markets, but Pitt and Syracuse aren't leaving the Big East because Pitt will have better BCS access there and I'm pretty sure that there are laws that forbid Syracuse from being anything other than a Big East basketball school (can you imagine a Big East tournament sans Syracuse? I can't.).  That leaves Rutgers, and does Rutgers have enough media pull to make them a worthwhile addition?  Aside from the Cinderella season they had a few years ago (which I think landed them in the Texas Bowl...yee haw), Rutgers football isn't exactly must see TV.  When the dust settles...the Big Ten stays the Big Eleven, they add in another bye week, and move the end of their football season back a couple of weeks. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 16, 2009, 09:42:06 AM
This is all about that 12th team for a divisional football set-up. So I don't think media markets matter. So why not get the Richmond, IN market locked down!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 16, 2009, 01:57:17 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 16, 2009, 01:19:26 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 15, 2009, 05:19:59 PM
Looks like Earlham may have jumped the gun (http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/football/news?slug=ap-bigten-expansion&prov=ap&type=lgns)...

That's hilarious.   :D

Who's the 12th team?  My guess...nobody.  I don't think there's an institution where the interest would be mutual.  I don't think the Big Ten is particularly interested into expanding into Nebraska or Missouri.  I think they are interested in expanding into the Northeast media markets, but Pitt and Syracuse aren't leaving the Big East because Pitt will have better BCS access there and I'm pretty sure that there are laws that forbid Syracuse from being anything other than a Big East basketball school (can you imagine a Big East tournament sans Syracuse? I can't.).  That leaves Rutgers, and does Rutgers have enough media pull to make them a worthwhile addition?  Aside from the Cinderella season they had a few years ago (which I think landed them in the Texas Bowl...yee haw), Rutgers football isn't exactly must see TV.  When the dust settles...the Big Ten stays the Big Eleven, they add in another bye week, and move the end of their football season back a couple of weeks. 

Next year the final week of the Big Ten season will take place after Thanksgiving.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 16, 2009, 02:09:43 PM
Of course it's about media markets.  The Big Ten isn't adding any team that doesn't add to the bottom line.  Simply adding a championship game between division winners doesn't necessarily help.  The ACC's championship game is a monetary grease fire.  Adding a championship game actually hinders BCS access (read: more $$$) for the loser of that hypothetical game and for the league in general.  If the Big Ten can't turn an extra team into a far more lucrative tv deal with Disney and expand viewership of their own network into a new market, they aren't going for it.  The only team that readily achieves both of those goals is ND, and we all know that ND isn't about to share their money with anybody else. 

Ok, big game on Sunday.  I don't know exactly what matchup we'll get...who wants to break down the potential matchups:
Good Wabash vs. Good Wooster
Good Wabash vs. Bad Wooster
Bad Wabash vs. Bad Wooster
Bad Wabash vs. Good Wooster

One of these four games will happen on Sunday.  I haven't decided which one yet. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 16, 2009, 02:11:28 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 15, 2009, 02:18:10 PM

First of all, I agree with you that it would be nice to see Hallowell score more.  But, I think part of his problem is he relies on his outside shot too much in terms of scoring.  I was under the impression that he had worked more on his inside game during the offseason and I haven't seen very much evidence of that so far.  He could very much use his outside shot to set up defenders faking them with the shot and beating them with the dribble to get inside but I haven't seen much of that.  He could really keep defenders off balance if he could develop any sort of dribble penetration.

As far as lacking an inside presence, I'm not sold on that being the problem of this team to answer your question.  Wickliffe has proven he can dominate on the inside when the emphasis is there to get him the ball and when he can stay out of foul trouble.  What bugs me about Wick is that he never seems to build off of solid performances.  Like when he dropped 22 on JCU in a losing effort, he followed that up with a 4 point effort vs. Kenyon.  And like last night, he scored just 2 points in the 1st half and scored 8 fairly easily in the 2nd half.  Part of that problem is, as I said, Wooster's effort or emphasis to get him involved or lackthereof.

I also think the potential is there for our 2 young freshmen bigs to develop into a nice inside presence, but the experience just isn't all there yet.  They show flashes, but not consistency.

And as far as where I see this team truly lacking, as I've touched on many many many times as have David and wsf and others, it's taking care of the basketball!  Wooster is just turning the ball over  far too often, whether it be from sloppy ball handling to lazy passes to reckless drives into the lane.  I'm sure that the defenses of some of these teams Wooster has been playing could be attributed to some of the turnovers, but from listening to the game last night as well as others where the Scots have had a high number of turnovers, it seemed that a high percentage of Wooster's turnovers were of the unforced variety.  And until they shore up those unforced turnovers, this team will continue to struggle I'm afraid...

I agree with you on the lack of emphasis as we have seen in the past on the inside play; its uncharacteristic and nervwrecking too when we need easy baskets.  It seems like we really haven't had go to BIG man in a few years.  We've been mostly guard oriented, which has worked in particular in league play.  I also agree JH's game is too focused on shooting outside.  I don't remember him shot faking at all in the Albion game, and not too many times in the other games.  If he would dump it in with some sort of two man game with Wick, then maybe he could cut off or relocate for an easier shot.

TO's have been bad.  It's like for a few minutes some of the guys put on capes and turn into Captain Turnover.  I think what could change that though is an consistent inside presence which i think we both feel is necessary to win the league which is more important than anything.  At this point, if we don't win the NCAC we can forget about the NCAA's.  

Lets Go Scots!!!  We believe!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 16, 2009, 10:41:20 PM
From what I'm reading (here in MN and out of town) - it's all about the 12 team for a football playoff. Not saying it's right or wrong, but that's what I'm reading.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 17, 2009, 10:34:22 AM
Quote from: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 16, 2009, 02:11:28 PM
At this point, if we don't win the NCAC we can forget about the NCAA's. 


This statement got me thinking about Wooster's regional record so far and when I went to look up their schedule here on D3hoops, I came across a question and I was wondering if someone knew the answer.

On Woo's schedule, they have R-MC as a regional opponent.  I get this because Ohio and Virginia are in the same 'administrative region'.  But, NC Wesleyan is not noted as a regional opponent for the Scots despite  North Carolina being in that same 'administrative region' as Ohio and Virginia.  Is this just an oversight or is there a reason why NCW doesn't count as an in-region win for Wooster?

As for the comment above by WooHoops, it's starting to look like that could be the case.  Wooster already has 3 in-region losses and any conferences losses from here on out would count against Wooster as even more in-region losses.  At least if Wooster has to meet up with WashU in the Mose Hole and lose to the Bears, that would not count against them as a regional loss.

IMO, Wooster would almost have to run the table at this point in regular season conference play to have any shot at Pool C consideration if they don't happen to take home the automatic by winning the conference tournament...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 17, 2009, 11:24:55 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 16, 2009, 02:09:43 PM

Ok, big game on Sunday.  I don't know exactly what matchup we'll get...who wants to break down the potential matchups:
Good Wabash vs. Good Wooster
Good Wabash vs. Bad Wooster
Bad Wabash vs. Bad Wooster
Bad Wabash vs. Good Wooster

One of these four games will happen on Sunday.  I haven't decided which one yet. 
Well, if we get good vs. good or bad vs. bad, it's anybody's guess as to who will win.  I would think that both of these teams would play each other pretty evenly if they both play at their best and conversly, if they both play at their worst.

As for the other 2 potential matchups, in scenario #2, Wabash wins and in scenario #3 Wooster wins.  ;D

In all seriousness, this is another HUGE game for the Scots and for Wabash, but moreso for Wooster as they have the added pressure of holding serve on their home court.

Looking at Wabash's schedule to date, it looks as if 'bad Wabash' has only really shown up in road games which could bode well for the Scots.  Although, Wabash has also looked pretty darn good in their last 2 games, but both of those were in the friendly confines of Chadwick.  Wooster did win both games vs. Wabash last year in Timken by an average MOV of 16 points.

As for some key matchups of players in the game, I think you have to look to at least slowing down Wes Smith if you're Wooster.  I'm wondering who, between Franks and Johnson, will draw the assingnment of trying to slow him down.   He's averaging over 18 ppg but Wabash also has 3 others averaging in double figures so Smith is far from a one man show.  I know Chase Haltom can shoot from deep and even though he's a streaky shooter he always seems to find his range when he's playing Wooster.  I'm also surprised that Brock is only 2-17 from 3-point range on the season.  I seem to recall he was a pretty decent threat from beyond the arc before his injury.  Although, Wabash as a team isn't shooting particularly well from deep either as they are only 28% on the season.  Of course, they'll probably torch the nets on Saturday...  ::)

Wooster also brings 4 players to the table averaging double figures so they too have some pretty nice balance.  Franks leads the way with over 14 ppg while shooting 50% from the floor and nearly 40% from deep.  Justin Hallowell seems to be warming up a bit as well as his percentage is almost up to 38% from deep.  He was barely at 30% a few games ago!

Once again, as WooHoops and I both have harped on, I think the key will be which team can get it going inside.  I had stated that I thought Wick would be a key in the R-MC game and as it turns out, he was, but it was too late once Wooster started making a concerted effort to get him the ball.  I would like to see Wooster try and get him involved early and often in this game.

And, once again, I think the main key to this game is going to be turnovers.  Both teams are having troubles in this category as Wabash is averaging over 15 tpg and Wooster is over 16 tpg.  Wooster HAS to be less careless with the basketball and find a way to create turnovers instead of committing them!

All in all, it should be a dandy of a game between two teams that don't really care too much for each other.  Can't wait for Sunday!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on December 17, 2009, 11:44:08 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 17, 2009, 10:34:22 AM
Quote from: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 16, 2009, 02:11:28 PM
At this point, if we don't win the NCAC we can forget about the NCAA's. 

On Woo's schedule, they have R-MC as a regional opponent.  I get this because Ohio and Virginia are in the same 'administrative region'.  But, NC Wesleyan is not noted as a regional opponent for the Scots despite  North Carolina being in that same 'administrative region' as Ohio and Virginia.  Is this just an oversight or is there a reason why NCW doesn't count as an in-region win for Wooster?

It appears as though NC Wesleyan is listed as a regional game. The 'dot' noting the regional contest is located after the @ Randolph-Macon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 17, 2009, 12:22:18 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on December 17, 2009, 11:44:08 AM
It appears as though NC Wesleyan is listed as a regional game. The 'dot' noting the regional contest is located after the @ Randolph-Macon.

Oops!  I misread that on the schedule.  :-[  Thanks for pointing that out...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 17, 2009, 01:15:36 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 16, 2009, 02:09:43 PM
Ok, big game on Sunday.  I don't know exactly what matchup we'll get...who wants to break down the potential matchups:
Good Wabash vs. Good Wooster
Good Wabash vs. Bad Wooster
Bad Wabash vs. Bad Wooster
Bad Wabash vs. Good Wooster  
Before we get to the Main Event, we have to work our way through the undercard, which begins tonight (Thursday! THURSDAY! THURSDAY!!!) in Terre Haute:

Earlham at Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology, 7:30pm -- Live Stats and Audio (http://goearlham.com/index.aspx)

At stake is the coveted John Mutchner Cup, which has been retained on the western border for the past two seasons.  The EC is 3-5, Rose is 4-6.  I think we can safely dispense with the analysis of three of Wally's scenarios for this one. ;)  However, the Quakers did win at Franklin, a feat that RHIT couldn't...engineer.  Sorry.  

UPDATE:  RHIT 83, EC 66...Despite another fine (26 point) effort from AJ Sutherlin, the Mutchner Cup stays put.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 17, 2009, 10:13:41 PM
Isn't the point about Wooster being careful about these early losses for NCAA play a point I brought up two weeks ago and got chastized for??? Just saying.......

I think the NCAC  will be a one bid league this year, with that one single bid going to the conference tournament champion, which at this point is a crapshoot
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 17, 2009, 10:37:10 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 17, 2009, 11:24:55 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 16, 2009, 02:09:43 PM

Ok, big game on Sunday.  I don't know exactly what matchup we'll get...who wants to break down the potential matchups:
Good Wabash vs. Good Wooster
Good Wabash vs. Bad Wooster
Bad Wabash vs. Bad Wooster
Bad Wabash vs. Good Wooster

One of these four games will happen on Sunday.  I haven't decided which one yet. 
Well, if we get good vs. good or bad vs. bad, it's anybody's guess as to who will win.  I would think that both of these teams would play each other pretty evenly if they both play at their best and conversly, if they both play at their worst.

As for the other 2 potential matchups, in scenario #2, Wabash wins and in scenario #3 Wooster wins.  ;D

In all seriousness, this is another HUGE game for the Scots and for Wabash, but moreso for Wooster as they have the added pressure of holding serve on their home court.

Looking at Wabash's schedule to date, it looks as if 'bad Wabash' has only really shown up in road games which could bode well for the Scots.  Although, Wabash has also looked pretty darn good in their last 2 games, but both of those were in the friendly confines of Chadwick.  Wooster did win both games vs. Wabash last year in Timken by an average MOV of 16 points.

As for some key matchups of players in the game, I think you have to look to at least slowing down Wes Smith if you're Wooster.  I'm wondering who, between Franks and Johnson, will draw the assingnment of trying to slow him down.   He's averaging over 18 ppg but Wabash also has 3 others averaging in double figures so Smith is far from a one man show.  I know Chase Haltom can shoot from deep and even though he's a streaky shooter he always seems to find his range when he's playing Wooster.  I'm also surprised that Brock is only 2-17 from 3-point range on the season.  I seem to recall he was a pretty decent threat from beyond the arc before his injury.  Although, Wabash as a team isn't shooting particularly well from deep either as they are only 28% on the season.  Of course, they'll probably torch the nets on Saturday...  ::)

Wooster also brings 4 players to the table averaging double figures so they too have some pretty nice balance.  Franks leads the way with over 14 ppg while shooting 50% from the floor and nearly 40% from deep.  Justin Hallowell seems to be warming up a bit as well as his percentage is almost up to 38% from deep.  He was barely at 30% a few games ago!

Once again, as WooHoops and I both have harped on, I think the key will be which team can get it going inside.  I had stated that I thought Wick would be a key in the R-MC game and as it turns out, he was, but it was too late once Wooster started making a concerted effort to get him the ball.  I would like to see Wooster try and get him involved early and often in this game.

And, once again, I think the main key to this game is going to be turnovers.  Both teams are having troubles in this category as Wabash is averaging over 15 tpg and Wooster is over 16 tpg.  Wooster HAS to be less careless with the basketball and find a way to create turnovers instead of committing them!

All in all, it should be a dandy of a game between two teams that don't really care too much for each other.  Can't wait for Sunday!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 17, 2009, 10:44:23 PM
OK, I blew the attachment.  Here's my prediction.  Wooster by 15.  You outsize Wabash by a mile and have the shooting, talent and pedigree.   

You Scots fans have to stop worrying so much.  The real Scots will show up.  And lay off JH.  He is only a soph and a very solid player.  He will be there when he needs to be.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 17, 2009, 11:16:58 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 17, 2009, 10:13:41 PM
Isn't the point about Wooster being careful about these early losses for NCAA play a point I brought up two weeks ago and got chastized for??? Just saying.......

I think the NCAC  will be a one bid league this year, with that one single bid going to the conference tournament champion, which at this point is a crapshoot
I think you're referring to me, right?  Some post I'm too lazy to look up about Wooster's Pool C chances, which I scoffed at?  I'm sorry if you thought that was chastisement; I rarely chastise on a subject that doesn't involve referee-criticism.  ;)  Anyway, I agree with your second sentiment, which is what I've thought since the time of that post: Pool C for Wooster or anyone else in the NCAC is a faint hope at best, and no way is Wooster playing well enough to concern themselves with their Pool C chances.  Furthermore, if the Scot players are even thinking about the NCAA tournament in the midst of a 5-4 December, they seriously need to re-focus.  And focus is not usually a problem when Steve Moore is in town.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 18, 2009, 09:24:37 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 17, 2009, 10:13:41 PM
Isn't the point about Wooster being careful about these early losses for NCAA play a point I brought up two weeks ago and got chastized for??? Just saying.......

I think the NCAC  will be a one bid league this year, with that one single bid going to the conference tournament champion, which at this point is a crapshoot

You called that being chastized???    ::)

Um, OK.  If you say so...  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 18, 2009, 09:33:43 AM
Quote from: GoRed on December 17, 2009, 10:44:23 PM
OK, I blew the attachment.  Here's my prediction.  Wooster by 15.  You outsize Wabash by a mile and have the shooting, talent and pedigree.   

You Scots fans have to stop worrying so much.  The real Scots will show up.  And lay off JH.  He is only a soph and a very solid player.  He will be there when he needs to be.   

I'm sorry I don't have quite the confidence in an easy Wooster victory as you do.  Wooster also outsized Kenyon by a mile, etc, etc, and we all saw how that game turned out.  And I think if Wabash shows up to play, I would consider them to be a bit more talented overall than Kenyon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 18, 2009, 04:35:24 PM
I know, chastizement makes this board fun. Any thoughts on the Wittenberg/Ohio Northern game tomorrow. Any Scots fans have any assessments of Ohio Northern. From playing the comparison game with scores it appears taht ONU hasn't been blowing out opponents and their narrow victory over Capital, where Wittenberg was far and above better than Capital, makes me wonder. Wittenberg needs a big in-region win!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 18, 2009, 04:45:05 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 18, 2009, 04:35:24 PM
I know, chastizement makes this board fun. Any thoughts on the Wittenberg/Ohio Northern game tomorrow. Any Scots fans have any assessments of Ohio Northern. From playing the comparison game with scores it appears taht ONU hasn't been blowing out opponents and their narrow victory over Capital, where Wittenberg was far and above better than Capital, makes me wonder. Wittenberg needs a big in-region win!

Witt beat Cap by 10 in Capital's 1st game of the year, Witt's 4th

ONU beat Cap by 4........ONU had a 10 point lead with 3 minutes to play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2009, 06:05:35 PM
Wittenberg was on a roll when they played Capital, and probably brimming with self-confidence.  Not so much lately.  Should be interesting to see if the Tigers can get their mojo back.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 18, 2009, 06:20:15 PM
I find it interesting (if I read ONU's stats right) that their leading rebounder is their 5-11 guard!   :o

Witt has been particularly strong on the O boards.  If ONU's big guys play soft, Witt should take the game without too much trouble - especially if they can hit the long ball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2009, 10:09:59 PM
Complete Saturday schedule:
DePauw (6-2) at Earlham (3-6), 2pm -- no live coverage that I can find
Hiram (4-3) at Bluffton (0-9), 3pm -- Live Stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html)
Wittenberg (5-2) at Ohio Northern (5-4), 7:30pm -- Live Audio (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2009, 01:59:36 AM
Saw this interesting ranking posted in another thread, and thought I'd import it here.  It purports to rank all colleges based on an average of academics (US News ranking, FWIW), athletics (Director's Cup ranking), and graduation rate.  Three NCAC schools make the top 100 regardless of division (http://www.ncsasports.org/about-ncsa/power-rankings/%28year%29/2009/%28tab%29/0) (the top 58, actually: #38 Kenyon, #45 Wooster, and #58 Denison), while eight make the top 100 in D3 (http://www.ncsasports.org/about-ncsa/power-rankings/%28year%29/2009/%28tab%29/3) (all but Earlham and Hiram).  Now, we could argue all day and all night about those US News rankings (but, please, let's not), so I'm not sure how much actual merit there is in this rating scheme.  But I am quite proud to have called to my attention that Wooster ranks #1 regardless of classification in student-athlete graduation rate.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2009, 02:59:54 PM
Live Stats and Live Audio  (http://goearlham.com/index.aspx) for the Earlham/DePauw game, except that it seems that nobody turned the Live Stats on.  DPU leads 35-33 14:55 2nd.

UPDATE/FINAL SCORE:  DePauw 66, Earlham 55

-----------------------

UPDATE:  Hiram 31, Bluffton 31, half.   ::)
UPDATE:  Hiram 51, Bluffton 45, 11:42 2nd.  Eleven total fouls called in the game so far.  Hiram outrebounding Bluffton 29-11, but Bluffton has hit 9 of 16 treys.
UPDATE:  Hiram 59, Bluffton 59, 2:08 2nd.  Reminder that Bluffton is 0-9.  Shades of Franciscan last year.
UPDATE:  Going to OT, tied at 62.  Campbell and Roberts each miss huge free throws in the final 0:17.
UPDATE/FINAL SCORE: Hiram 71, Bluffton 64, OT.  (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.mommiesunited.org%2Fforums%2Fimages%2Fsmilies%2FDebsSmilies%2Fwhew.gif&hash=0a4b11b834bdc2192e742fb0633e12ba546a00a1)

-----------------------

Cooper and McKee are back with the hoopin' Tigers, and McKee is immediately into the starting lineup.
UPDATE:  ONU 36, Witt 31, half.  ONU led by 2-4 pts for much of the half, and by 8 until a buzzer-beating three went in for Bigler (or maybe it was Hieber?)  McKee already has 10.
UPDATE:  I'm listening to the Witt game, but I'm watching the D1 volleyball championship, and I just want to inform you that Texas actually has a player named Destinee Hooker.  Okay, back to hoops now.
UPDATE:  Hill three gives Witt a 46-44 lead with about 10:00 to go, and as I type this, ONU retakes the lead on an old-fashioned three-point play.  ONU has led virtually the whole game, but has never gotten any separation; largest lead was 8 as noted above.
UPDATE:  Witt goes up by 4, 59-55, with 4:00-ish left; it's their largest lead tonight.
UPDATE:  Witt leads 61-57, 1:35 left, Witt ball.
UPDATE/FINAL SCORE:  Witt wins, 61-59.  ONU got a rebound with maybe 0:08 left, but didn't take a timeout.  They came down and launched a three, which missed and went out of bounds to the Tigers with 0:00.6 on the clock.  Tony Meyer intercepted the inbounds pass at halfcourt, but his shot "just barely missed."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 19, 2009, 09:06:34 PM
Wittenberg 61 Ohio Northern 59

Good first game of the season for Josh Mckee as he finishes with 12 points, Gregg Hill led the way for Witt with 13 points.

Good in-region victory as well. Hopefully they can keep it going Tuesday vs Otterbein
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2009, 09:25:14 PM
Just the one game for Sunday:

Wabash (4-4, 0-1) at Wooster (5-4, 2-0), 2pm -- Live Stats & Audio (Woo) (http://www.wooster.edu/en/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule) -- Live Audio (Wab) (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on December 20, 2009, 12:55:09 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 19, 2009, 01:59:36 AM
But I am quite proud to have called to my attention that Wooster ranks #1 regardless of classification in student-athlete graduation rate.   ;D

The same rankings showed Wooster at #205 in graduation rate last year, and #499 the year before that, so the methodology appears suspect.  I think that student-athlete graduation rate data at the D-III level is still being collected only on an experimental basis by the NCAA.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2009, 02:32:40 PM
I guess it's good Wabash vs. good Wooster, as they've combined for just five turnovers in the first half.  Wooster leads 40-36.  (I guess wooscotsfan is at the game?)

UPDATE: ...but bad Wabash seems to have come out for the second half.  Just 3 pts and 7 turnovers in the first 7 minutes, and Woo suddenly leads by 18, 57-39.
UPDATE:  It was definitely good Wooster all day, though, as the Scots limit the turnovers to 7 for the afternoon while shooting around 50%.  Wabash only threatened in the last few minutes of the first half; otherwise Wooster coasts to a 78-60 victory. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2009, 03:36:00 PM
That wraps up conference play for the calendar year.  Here's the current standings:

1.  Wooster 3-0 (6-4)
2.  Hiram 2-0 (5-3)
2.  Denison 2-0 (2-7)
4.  Allegheny 1-0 (4-2)
5.  Wittenberg 1-1 (6-2)
5.  Earlham 1-1 (3-7)
7.  Wabash 0-2 (4-5)
7.  Oberlin 0-2 (4-5)
7.  Kenyon 0-2 (3-6)
7.  Ohio Wesleyan 0-2 (2-5)

We've got two non-conference games left before the holiday break:
Monday: Anderson (8-1) at Earlham (3-7), 9pm (!) -- Live Stats and Audio  (http://goearlham.com/index.aspx)
Tuesday: Otterbein (1-8) at Wittenberg (6-2), 7:30pm -- Live Stats and Audio (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 20, 2009, 05:50:22 PM
Final:  Wooster 78  Wabash 60 ;D

Back from Wooster where I watched the Scots dismantle Wabash in the 2nd half.  Wooster went on a 21-3 run to start the 2nd half and the outcome was never in doubt after that point  (61-39).

Wooster took great care of the ball as David noted and they notched 15 assists with only 7 turnovers. :)  The Scots also outrebounded the Little Giants 34-28 so they ended up with 12 more shot attempts than Wabash.

Wooster pounded the ball down low today and Bryan Wickliffe (15 points) and frosh Josh Claytor (13 points) were very successful inside.  Even Ian Franks (21 points) probably got about half of his points on drives in the lane where Wabash was vulnerable.

Scots looked good today and shot the ball well at ~49% compared to 45% for Wabash.

Nice NCAC win for Wooster as they now have 8 days off before the Mose Hole Tourney on December 29th.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 21, 2009, 06:44:35 PM
Unfortunately I wasn't able to follow along with the Wabash/Wooster tilt on Sunday, but it looks like we wound up with Bad Wabash vs. Good Wooster which is never ever going to end well for Wabash. 

I think the reality that we've all accepted for the NCAC this season is that the only team going to the NCAA tournament is going to be our tournament champion.  With that in mind, it's going to be pretty hard for me to get too upset about this loss.  There's only one game vs. Wooster that is going to really matter for any team in the NCAC this year, and that's the one that comes at Timken in late February.  The story of Wabash basketball for the last couple of years has been wild inconsistency early with a steady build up through mid-January into the conference tournament.  I had hopes that this group would have been able to start this season playing as well as they ended the last one and set themselves up to challenge Wooster for home court advantage and/or a Pool C.  That hasn't happened, so there's just two things left to do now this season.  1) Beat Witt in Springfield (Wabash has never done that since joining the league and I'd love nothing more than to see these guys achieve that) and 2) win the conference tournament.  Can they do it??  Stay tuned...

The write up on the game mentioned that Wes Smith left the game late with a concussion...I hope this isn't serious.  Wes got hurt late in a game that was over against Oberlin last year and it really disrupted the middle of Wabash's season.  I hope this isn't a repeat scenario. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 21, 2009, 07:52:18 PM
I've added Live Stats and Audio link for tonight's Earlham game, above.

---------------

The Live Stats people got bored and went home at halftime.  (Although, I think it must have been interesting, since there's still one second left in the Live Stats version of the women's game, so that first half must have been very crazy, what with 20 players on the court.)  :rimshot:
So anyway, Earlham couldn't do what Wittenberg couldn't do, losing to Anderson 80-58.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 22, 2009, 06:43:07 PM
David, I think having Mckee and Cooper back will help Wittenberg tremendously, as shown by their performance Saturday. Mckee is the type of player that will put up around 10 points a game but his energy and tenacity will give Witt some extra energy.

Kind of disappointed with the Regional Rankings......Obviously Wittenberg's loss to Hiram is hurting more than they thought.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 22, 2009, 08:20:51 PM
Dan Russ and Dane Borchers both dropped by for a brief halftime interview during the Witt/Ott game.  Dan, it turns out, is now an assistant coach at the University of the Cumberlands (http://www.ucumberlands.edu/athletics/basketball/mens/staff/), an NAIA school in Williamsburg, KY, where they evidently can't spell "Wittenberg."  The Patriots are 10-3 so far this season.  Congratulations & good luck to Dan, who is a guy that I believe has universal respect.

Witt led 31-24 at the half, by the way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 22, 2009, 08:31:01 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 22, 2009, 06:43:07 PM
David, I think having Mckee and Cooper back will help Wittenberg tremendously[...]
Cooper didn't play against ONU, and he hasn't gotten into tonight's game yet either.  I don't know if it's a "football shape" issue or a depth chart issue.  McKee has 6 pts. and 5 boards so far tonight, with Witt leading 39-31 midway through the 2nd.

UPDATE:  Witt uses a rare 6-point possession to take pretty firm control of the game.  (Layup, intentional foul, two free throws, foul, two free throws.)  Judging from the Witt audiocast, this game's pre-eminent features have been bizarre officiating and Otterbein's inability to take advantage of a dominant performance on the offensive glass (i.e. missing bunnies.)  Witt leads 56-43, 8:03 left.  The Tigers are hitting just over 50% from the floor and just under 50% from the arc, and that's helping.
UPDATE:  Since the 6-point play, Witt has run away and hidden, and now only the final margin is in doubt.  72-51, 2:01.
UPDATE:  Cooper into the game in garbage time.
UPDATE/FINAL SCORE:  Wittenberg (7-2) 72, Otterbein (1-9) 56.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 22, 2009, 08:58:43 PM
That's it for pre-holiday hoops.  Here's the tale of the tape:
1.  Wooster 3-0 (6-4)
2.  Hiram 2-0 (5-3)
2.  Denison 2-0 (2-7)
4.  Allegheny 1-0 (4-2)
5.  Wittenberg 1-1 (7-2)
5.  Earlham 1-1 (3-8)
7.  Wabash 0-2 (4-5)
7.  Oberlin 0-2 (4-5)
7.  Kenyon 0-2 (3-6)
7.  Ohio Wesleyan 0-2 (2-5)

If I don't see you, have a happy and safe holiday week.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 22, 2009, 09:29:44 PM
David, the audio pretty  much summed up the game.

Witt won fairly easily but it honestly shouldn't have been that close. Otterbein shot 31% from the floor, and considering they had 22 offensive rebounds (should NEVER happen against Witt's size), they were missing a lot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 24, 2009, 01:13:28 PM
I hope all of my fellow NCAC hoopheads enjoy a safe and happy holiday this weekend! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 24, 2009, 02:04:53 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 24, 2009, 01:13:28 PM
I hope all of my fellow NCAC hoopheads enjoy a safe and happy holiday this weekend! 
Hoopheads eh?  I like that description!  Makes me want to break out in some "Uncle John's Band" or something...  ;D   ;)

Anywho, I'll echo Wally's and David's holiday well wishes to all!  Hope everyone has a safe and joyous holiday!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 24, 2009, 03:00:31 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 24, 2009, 02:04:53 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 24, 2009, 01:13:28 PM
I hope all of my fellow NCAC hoopheads enjoy a safe and happy holiday this weekend! 
Hoopheads eh?  I like that description!  Makes me want to break out in some "Uncle John's Band" or something...  ;D   ;)

Anywho, I'll echo Wally's and David's holiday well wishes to all!  Hope everyone has a safe and joyous holiday!

Not to be confused with hoopleheads which would be something quite a bit less friendly.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 24, 2009, 04:23:56 PM
I consider myself to be more of a hoopheart than a hoophead.  Otherwise, I'd probably not spend quite so much time watching webcasts of Hiram women's games.   ;D

Hoopy Ballidays!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 26, 2009, 05:26:59 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 24, 2009, 03:00:31 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 24, 2009, 02:04:53 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 24, 2009, 01:13:28 PM
I hope all of my fellow NCAC hoopheads enjoy a safe and happy holiday this weekend! 
Hoopheads eh?  I like that description!  Makes me want to break out in some "Uncle John's Band" or something...  ;D   ;)

Anywho, I'll echo Wally's and David's holiday well wishes to all!  Hope everyone has a safe and joyous holiday!

Not to be confused with hoopleheads which would be something quite a bit less friendly.   :)

I dunno, "All The Way To Memphis", "Death May Be Your Santa Claus" and "All The Young Dudes" were fine songs. However, they'd probably be MOTTheads, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 27, 2009, 01:23:57 PM
Wow...a Mott the Hoople reference.  Well played, sir.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 28, 2009, 01:44:56 PM
Let's get started again, shall we?

Denison kicks off the Smokey Ballenger Classic this afternoon, facing Capital at 3pm.  Live Stats, Live Audio (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html), courtesy of host Otterbein, which still employs DU grad, former Wooster and Denison assistant, and our old friend Kyle Pottkotter as the assistant to legendary head coach Dick Reynolds.  Go Big Red, and good luck Kyle!

Six games tomorrow, so stay tuned!

Capital 81, Denison 48...ugh.  30% shooting, -29 rebound margin, only 5 offensive rebounds.  DU led 16-5 after a Larry Farmer dunk, then were outscored 76-32 over the last 27 minutes.  Wheels = off. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on December 28, 2009, 05:21:03 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 28, 2009, 01:44:56 PM
Let's get started again, shall we?

Denison kicks off the Smokey Ballenger Classic this afternoon, facing Capital at 3pm.  Live Stats, Live Audio (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html), courtesy of host Otterbein, which still employs DU grad, former Wooster and Denison assistant, and our old friend Kyle Pottkotter as the assistant to legendary head coach Dick Reynolds.  Go Big Red, and good luck Kyle!

Six games tomorrow, so stay tuned!

Capital 81, Denison 48...ugh.  30% shooting, -29 rebound margin, only 5 offensive rebounds.  DU led 16-5 after a Larry Farmer dunk, then were outscored 76-32 over the last 27 minutes.  Wheels = off. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 28, 2009, 05:47:08 PM
I've got to concentrate!...concentrate!...concentrate!
Hello?...hello?...hello?
Echo!...echo!...echo!
Pinch hitting for Pedro Borbon...Borbon...Manny Mota!...Mota!...Mota!

Seriously, though, I hope zander (http://www.benjaminzander.com/) will come back and finish his thought, and/or write in depth about the Mahler Third.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 28, 2009, 08:50:57 PM
Tuesday's slate:

Allegheny (4-2) vs. Wartburg (5-3, pending their game tonight) at Daytona Beach, 2pm -- Live Stats and Video (http://www.alleghenysports.com/) -- caveat: I had some trouble with Embry-Riddle's Live Stats program today
OWU (2-5) vs. #6 Guilford (8-1) at Marietta, 5:30pm -- Live Stats and Video (http://pioneers.marietta.edu/index.aspx?path=)
Hiram (5-3) at Muskingum (4-7), 7pm -- doesn't look like any live coverage, although possibly audio here (http://www.muskingum.edu/home/athletics/broadcast.html)
Olivet (4-5) at Wittenberg (7-2), 7pm -- Live Audio (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/kiwanis09/) -- Charles B. Zimmerman Memorial Classic
Kalamazoo (0-8) at Wooster (6-4), 7:30pm -- Live Stats, Audio, and Video (http://www.wooster.edu/en/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule) -- Mose Hole/Kiwanis Classic
Denison (2-8) at Otterbein (1-9, pending their game tonight), 8pm -- Live Stats and Audio (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html) -- caveat: I had some trouble with Otterbein's audio feed today
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 28, 2009, 11:15:41 PM
Denison needs to visualize everybody that they play are wearing Wabash uniforms.  They can't be beat under that scenario. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2009, 01:40:03 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 28, 2009, 11:15:41 PM
Denison needs to visualize everybody that they play are wearing Wabash uniforms.  They can't be beat under that scenario. 
There are few things in this world I hate more than seeing an NCAC team with a record like Denison's: 2-0 conference, 2-8 overall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 29, 2009, 11:09:08 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 29, 2009, 01:40:03 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 28, 2009, 11:15:41 PM
Denison needs to visualize everybody that they play are wearing Wabash uniforms.  They can't be beat under that scenario. 
There are few things in this world I hate more than seeing an NCAC team with a record like Denison's: 2-0 conference, 2-8 overall.

You could be one of those in the "2" side of that ledger.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2009, 11:26:07 AM
Brandon Johnson continues to be bitten by the dreaded injury bug.  It appears as though he sprained his ankle in Sunday's practice and is doubtful for the Mose Hole...  :-\

Here's a link to the preview of the Mose Hole from the DR.  It touches on WashU standout, Elida native and former COW basketball camper Aaron Thompson's return to Timken.

No. 1's in town tonight...  (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4737759)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 29, 2009, 11:26:23 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 29, 2009, 01:40:03 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 28, 2009, 11:15:41 PM
Denison needs to visualize everybody that they play are wearing Wabash uniforms.  They can't be beat under that scenario. 
There are few things in this world I hate more than seeing an NCAC team with a record like Denison's: 2-0 conference, 2-8 overall.

That's a SWAC record!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2009, 03:41:07 PM
Today's scores:
Wartburg 83, Allegheny 79
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2009, 06:28:40 PM
Halftime in game one of the Mose Hole and we have a bit of a shocker in the making:

Transy - 39
WashU - 30

The difference in this game has been from beyond the arc where Transy has been unconscious hitting 8-13 and WashU is 0-3.  

Also, WashU's pair of All-American guards who came into the game averaging better than 32 ppg combined have a whopping 2 points to their credit in the first half and that was a pair of ft's from Aaron Thompson!  :o  Transy must be doing a hell of a job defensively holding this duo without a fg for an entire half!

Update:

Apparently no one decided to update the live stats after halftime, but my dad called me from the game to tell me that Transy was up 14 with around 8 minutes to go!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Marty Peretz on December 29, 2009, 07:00:05 PM
Looks like our undefeated dream season is falling by the wayside... >:(     too bad no radio or functioning live stats. We always struggle after the break...no excuses though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on December 29, 2009, 07:09:07 PM
Wow ... down goes Wash. U., 73-69.  Barring another upset tonight, I guess that the home team won't get to face the Bears.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2009, 07:11:15 PM
OWU gives #6 Guilford all they can handle, closing to 72-70 with 1:06 remaining, but they couldn't close the deal and fall 79-72.  Nice effort from the Bishops, who maybe are starting to put it all together after early-season struggles against a difficult schedule.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2009, 07:16:57 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on December 29, 2009, 07:09:07 PM
Wow ... down goes Wash. U., 73-69.  Barring another upset tonight, I guess that the home team won't get to face the Bears.
As much as I was looking forward to seeing the Scots take on WashU, I'm pulling for a meeting with Transy now!   ;)

That would be pretty crazy though to see a consolation game of Wooster and WashU in this tournament.  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2009, 07:25:34 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 29, 2009, 07:11:15 PM
OWU gives #6 Guilford all they can handle, closing to 72-70 with 1:06 remaining, but they couldn't close the deal and fall 79-72.  Nice effort from the Bishops, who maybe are starting to put it all together after early-season struggles against a difficult schedule.
This should be a confidence builder for the Bishops moving forward even though they came up short in their upset bid.  The key will be how they follow up this performance tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2009, 08:09:21 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 37  Kalamazoo 21

Wooster being led by Ian Franks with 10 points, Nathan Balch with 9 points and Justin Hallowell with 8 points.  Matt Fegan hit a three pointer one second before the halftime buzzer and has chipped in 6 points (2 three pointers).

Scots shot 62% in the half and made 6 out of 10 from the three point arc. :)  Brandon Johnson is taking the night off with a mild ankle sprain and may play in the game tomorrow.

Ryan Clark is leading K-zoo with 7 points.

Wow - hard to believe that #1 Washington Univ. went down in the first game.  Transylvania should be a tough opponent if Wooster gets to the championship game tomorrow.

UPDATE:  Wooster opens up the 2nd half with a 17-2 run and this game is essentially over.  54-25 Scots with ~14 min. left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2009, 08:43:49 PM
Wittenberg guts out a 55-49 victory over Olivet.  The Comets held a slender 49-48 lead with 2:59 left, but the Tigers held them scoreless while scoring the game's final seven points.  Witt only connected on 32% of their field goals but had a wicked +20 rebounding margin leading to 15 second-chance points.  Gregg Hill was the only Tiger in double figures with 12, but that's not so bad when you have ten players contributing to the scoring, as Witt did.  Olivet's Michael McClary had a noteworthy game with 13 points and 14 boards.  Witt will face Marian (IN) in the Zimmerman Classic final tomorrow; Marian defeated Ohio Dominican 64-52, thus preventing a matchup of Artie Taylor's squad against his mentor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2009, 08:58:50 PM
Final:  Wooster 70  Kalamazoo 41 :)

Wooster got balanced scoring tonight with everyone gettting playing time.  Scots were led by Ian Franks with 15 points, Justin Hallowell with 11 points, frosh Josh Claytor with 9 points, Nathan Balch with 9 points and Matt Fegan also with 9 points.

Wooster still had too many turnovers with 17.

K-zoo was led by Ryan Clark with 10 points and Joe Prepolec with 9 points.

Wooster is now 7-4, 3-0 NCAC. ;D  Next up is Transylvania in the tourney championship game tomorrow. 

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2009, 09:28:12 PM
Hiram had a 75-70 lead with 0:27 left and blew it, losing at Muskingum 89-86 in OT.  With 0:08 remaining in regulation and Hiram up 3, MU's Nick Hershberger (a transfer from Wooster, who had a career-best 34 tonight) fouled Hiram's Chris Meyer, sending him to the line with a chance to ice the game.  Instead, the sophomore missed the front end, and then compounded his error by fouling Musky's Colin Bass with 0:01 left...in the act of shooting...a trey.  Bass hit all three free throws to force the OT, five minutes in which the Fish never trailed.  Ugh.  Chris Roberts had 30 to lead the Pups.

Otterbein drops Denison to 2-0/2-9 with an 87-71 victory at the Rike Center.  The homestanding Cardinals enjoyed a slight edge from the free throw line, where they were 24 of 30 to Denison's seven of 14.  And that's the whole story, as the rest of the stats (aside from a +13 rebounding edge for OC) were fairly even.  Denison did shoot a robust 50% from the field and committed just 13 turnovers.  Larry Farmer's 17 led four Big Reds in double figures.

Here's tomorrow's schedule:
Allegheny vs. Carroll at Daytona Beach, 4pm -- Live Stats and Video (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)
OWU vs. Grove City at Marietta, 5:30pm -- Live Stats(?) and Live Video (http://pioneers.marietta.edu/)
Marian (IN) at Wittenberg, 7pm -- Live Stats and Audio (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/kiwanis09/) -- Zimmerman Classic championship game
Oberlin at Anderson, 7:30pm -- Live Audio (http://www.goyeo.com/)
Transylvania at Wooster, 7:30pm -- Live Stats, Audio, and Video (http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule) -- Mose Hole Classic championship game
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 30, 2009, 08:25:15 AM
So much for the foregone conclusion that Wash U beats the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on December 30, 2009, 09:40:58 AM
After getting over the shock of hearing that Washington Univ fell, I am now turning to determining how Wooster matches up with Transy. Any thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on December 30, 2009, 10:37:14 AM
Quote from: woolax on December 30, 2009, 09:40:58 AM
After getting over the shock of hearing that Washington Univ fell, I am now turning to determining how Wooster matches up with Transy. Any thoughts?

I have no idea what to make of Transylvania.  They got absolutely blown out of the gym by #23 Carthage (down 25 at half)...

http://www.transy.edu/athletics/go/m_basketball/111509mb.htm


Got blown out by #10 Wilmington...

http://www.transy.edu/athletics/go/m_basketball/112409mb.htm


Lost by 15 to Thomas Moore...

http://www.transy.edu/athletics/go/m_basketball/112809mb.htm


Lost in 2OT to 5-6 Rose-Hulman...

http://www.transy.edu/athletics/go/m_basketball/121209mb.htm


And of course last night, they took down the machine that is the #1 Wash U Bears.  

On the surface, the result yesterday seems to be a big anomaly, but who knows really.  (I do think Wash U was hurt to some degree by the absence of starting center Zack Kelley.  Kelley isn't very productive, but he is a big body and plays an important role for the Bears.  Without him, I don't think Wash U's starting lineup is hurt that much, but the depth takes a big hit.)

Thanks for me allowing me NCAC board space to ramble about Transy and Wash U!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2009, 12:29:27 PM
Of course, there's still a good measure of "I don't know what to make of them" floating around Wooster, too, so it's an intriguing game.  Maybe we should apply the Wally Analysis: Good Wooster vs. Good Transy, Good Wooster vs. Bad Transy, etc.

I did watch Transy play Mt. Union (via videocast) the other day, and they looked capable.  Beating MUC isn't as easy as it once was (just 5-7, but beat JCU, ONU, and Hiram and lost to Wilma in OT), but winning that game at home by 9 should probably be considered something of a minimum threshold for a decent team.  I admit, however, that I was very distracted by the play-by-play broadcaster, who was munching on a bag of potato chips throughout the game, so I don't remember much of the actual action.

The new poll is out, by the way, and Wooster slips off the back end and into the would-be #26 slot.  It is interesting (to me) to note that five of the top nine teams have played either Wooster or OWU, and although the NCAC team lost all five game, three-and-a-half of them were real battles.  (OWU led WashU at halftime of the season opener.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 30, 2009, 01:35:51 PM
Wittenberg gets a matchup with Marian (IND) today in the championship game of their tournament.

Wabash fans, I saw that they did beat you guys by 3 earlier in the year....any thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 30, 2009, 01:45:12 PM
Quote from: woolax on December 30, 2009, 09:40:58 AM
After getting over the shock of hearing that Washington Univ fell, I am now turning to determining how Wooster matches up with Transy. Any thoughts?

I was thinking this very same thing.  I hadn't really even been paying too much attention to Transy as I thought it was highly unlikely that they pulled the upset.  Well, as it turned out, the highly unlikely came true.

Looking over Transy's results, I too would say they remind me a lot of Wabash.  David, you beat me to it in borrowing Wally's analysis for this game wrt good or bad Transy vs. good or bad Wooster.  ;)  It seems as though there is good Transy (the one that beat WashU last night) and bad Transy (the one that lost to RHIT and got smoked by Carthage and Wilmington).  Personally, from the looks of things, I would say that bad Wooster should beat bad Transy if that is who decides to show up tonight.  I mean, bad Wooster almost beat then #2 JCU and current #4 R-MC.  Personally, I'm wondering how much Transy has left both physically and mentally one night after beating the 2-time defending national champs and the #1 team in all the land.  I think the Pios are going to have a tough time duplicating the performance and effort they put forth last night.

Looking at the box score from last night's game and I would be hard pressed to know that Transy won the game.  WashU shot 50% from the floor to Transy's 44% and WashU outrebounded Transy by eight (35-27).  Transy won this game from beyond the arc where they made 6 more treys than WashU.  Transy actually shot the ball at a higher percentage from outside the 3-point circle than from inside of it.

All in all, Transy looks very similar to Wooster.  Tim Tierny looks like he runs the point and he is their leading scorer at over 15 ppg.  He must like to penetrate as he's been to the line 66 times this season.  He's made more ft's than Ian Franks (Wooster's leader in trips to the line) has in attempts!  :o  This is where a healthy Brandon Johnson would be nice to try and slow him down.

Transy also likes to shoot the three ball as they have 86 made treys on the season compared to Wooster with 96.  Both teams dialed it up 11 times from long distance (that's for you David  :P) last night.

Transy doesn't look very big and I think that Wooster could take advantage of this.  It looks as though WashU did as their big went off for a double/double with 19 points and 11 rebounds.  And I would look for Wooster to win the rebounding battle as well seeing as the Scots come into this game out rebounding their opponents by almost 6 rpg  and Transy is being outrebounded by over 2 rpg so far this season.

And then there's the dreaded T word.  Wooster was again very sloppy with the basketball last night.  Of course, there's always the excuse that you let your guard down a bit playing with such a big lead, but I'm just getting tired of seeing so much carelessness with the basketball from the Scots.  Wooster has got to keep the turnovers under 15 tonight and if they can do that, I think they will be sitting pretty at the end of the night.

All in all, it's not the match-up we Wooster fans were anticipating, but it is now a crucial in-region game.  A win over Transy would bolster Wooster's diminished Pool C hopes a tad.  So, at least this game has that going for it.  Transy and Wooster have also become quite familiar with each other as this is their 4th meeting in the last 6 years which include squaring off in back to back NCAA tournaments so a bit of a rivalry is developing between these 2 programs.  Should be an entertaining affair up on the hill and Wooster will definitely have to be on top of it's game if they want to bring home another Mose Hole trophy!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2009, 01:57:55 PM
How does Transylvania win ball games? ???

Washington University lost last night's game despite:
1.  Outshooting Transy 50% to 42%
2.  Outrebounding Transy 35 to 27
3.  Having 12 Assists vs. only 9 Assists for Transy

Transy wins games by playing well in three phases of their games:
1.  Transy averages nearly 8 three pointers made/game.  Last night they made 11 vs. 5 for Wash Univ.
On the season, Transy has made 86 three pointers while only giving up 63 to opponents

2.  Transy minimizes turnovers with only 149 on the season vs. forcing 171 by opponents

3.  Transy makes a high percentage of Free Throws at 74%  Last night, 18 FT points vs. only 12 for Wash Univ.

So, Wooster needs to defend the three point line tonight and minimize their turnovers to get a victory....something the Scots have had trouble with this season. ::)

I plan on watching a great game tonight at Timken.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 30, 2009, 02:41:20 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 30, 2009, 01:35:51 PM
Wittenberg gets a matchup with Marian (IND) today in the championship game of their tournament.

Wabash fans, I saw that they did beat you guys by 3 earlier in the year....any thoughts?

That was Wabash's season opener...Wabash let Marian get out to a huge lead in the first half, then spent the second half chipping away but ran out of time before they could get all the way back (stop me if you've seen this one before).  Sylvester is a very good distance shooter for Marian....their leading scorer (Tucker) only had four points against Wabash so they've got a little more than what Wabash got from them.  I think Marian will be a pretty good test for Witt. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 30, 2009, 05:14:29 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 29, 2009, 09:28:12 PM
Hiram had a 75-70 lead with 0:27 left and blew it, losing at Muskingum 89-86 in OT.  With 0:08 remaining in regulation and Hiram up 3, MU's Nick Hershberger (a transfer from Wooster, who had a career-best 34 tonight) fouled Hiram's Chris Meyer, sending him to the line with a chance to ice the game.  Instead, the sophomore missed the front end, and then compounded his error by fouling Musky's Colin Bass with 0:01 left...in the act of shooting...a trey.  Bass hit all three free throws to force the OT, five minutes in which the Fish never trailed.  Ugh.  Chris Roberts had 30 to lead the Pups.

Is this a broken record for Hiram?  I feel like I'm in the movie Groundhog Day when it comes to the endings of Hiram basketball games.  Only difference is the opponents and the results.  Some go Hiram's way, some don't...    :P

One things for sure, Hiram knows how to keep the crowd into a game until the very end!  Furthermore, you wouldn't want to go to a Hiram game if you have a heart condition!  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2009, 05:36:31 PM
Allegheny's basketball teams went to Florida, and all they got was this lousy t-shirt...

Carroll upends the Gator men in Daytona Beach, 80-67.  Big George had a double-double, 17 & 11, but Carroll's 10 three-pointers and +7 rebound advantage were too much for the Pennsylvanians.  The Gator men and women went a combined 0-4 in the Land of Magic Classic, but at least they got a break from the sub-Arctic conditions of Meadville for a few days.  And a t-shirt.

--------------------

So much for OWU figuring it out.  They lose tonight to Grove City, 61-53, to finish out of the medals at Marietta's tournament.  OWU led 41-29 with 12:45 left, then watched the Wolverines go on a 22-5 run.  OWU never got closer than 3 the rest of the way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2009, 08:39:57 PM
Trailing 66-60 with 5:23 left, Wittenberg held Marian scoreless the rest of the way and throughout the OT period, scoring the game's last 15 points en route, and recorded a 75-66 (OT) win.  Gregg Hill had 23 points to lead the Tiger attack.

Similarly, Wooster ends their game on a 17-5 run over the last 4:21, with the five Transy points all coming after the outcome was decided (by a 14-0 run).  Wooster prevails, 75-65.  Ian Franks had 24 points, 8 rebounds, and 5 assists, and was named the tournament MVP.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 30, 2009, 09:25:55 PM
David and others:

Wittenberg had a very good win tonight vs Marian. As wally noted, Marian has a player and really all their guards that if you give them an inch they're firing from 3 point range. Between the two teams, 15 three's were made in the first half.

Great to see Witt bear down and play some great defense in the last 5 minutes to close an 8 point gap down to a tie and then some great offensive possessions in overtime.

Micheal Cooper saw some extended minutes for the first time this season. His athleticism gives this team something that will give NCAC teams fits.

On to Ohio Wesleyan a week from today. They've given Witt problems the last two seasons really, so a win would be big.

Not sure if anyone cares but i'll throw it out there. Witt's women's team lost a heartbreaker tonight by 3 in the championship of their tournament. Great game all around and actually it shouldntn't ahve been a loss for Witt. Earlier on in the game, the official scorebook on accident granted a  2 point shot to CWR when in fact Wittenberg made the shot. By the time the officials realized what happened, too much time had gone by in the allowable period to change an error, so thus it counted and had an impact on the game.......unfortunate but really when we think of officiating sometimes not too surprising
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2009, 09:33:51 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 30, 2009, 09:25:55 PMNot sure if anyone cares but i'll throw it out there. Witt's women's team lost a heartbreaker tonight [...]
Someone cares. (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=726.msg1155343#msg1155343)  See also: my footer.

NCAC men's hoops are done for 2009.  Have a good time this weekend...
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fparty-smiley-551.gif&hash=7cd930b91cd7ba5ad083e02c6720bcddc256dc3f) (http://planetsmilies.net)
...but we have five games on Saturday, so don't have too good a time.
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fparty-smiley-7500.gif&hash=ccd02c09ccd3c14c04583429bed9ffb27d77539e) (http://planetsmilies.net)
Happy New Year, everybody! (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fparty-smiley-7486.gif&hash=e45b1276686cfe3bb25b18ad1cf65b7f5c3f70b3) (http://planetsmilies.net)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on December 30, 2009, 09:46:39 PM
GREAT WAY FOR THE SCOTS TO CLOSE OUT 2009!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2009, 11:01:19 PM
I imagine there's a fair number of readers of this page (members and lurkers alike) that rarely, if ever, venture out to other threads.  You good folks may be unaware of the fact that Washington U. came into the Mose Hole Classic with the D3 Championship BeltTM in their possession.  (Think of a prizefighter entering the ring with his championship belt being carried behind him (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fparty-smiley-7498.gif&hash=f3c3254950f1bd906af9fbcb1c1a475bd6638548) (http://planetsmilies.net); for more information, please see this thread (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=5070.msg1155015#msg1155015).)  The BeltTM changed hands twice in the tournament, and is now displayed proudly in Wooster's trophy case.  Since Wooster is done with non-conference play altogether, and since they're off now until Jan. 9, that means that the BeltTM will stay in NCAC hands up to and into the NCAA tournament.*  The BeltTM has never before belonged to an NCAC team (not since the first rhinestone bangles were sewn on its alpaca-suede surface approximately three years ago), so the tour of the BeltTM through our conference over the next two months should be a thing to behold.  Come out and see the BeltTM when it comes to an arena near you!  ;D

*There is one chance for it to slip away; that's if it somehow comes into Allegheny's possession on or before Feb. 6, and then the Gators somehow lose it to Penn St.-New Kensington on Feb. 8.**   But that's not going to happen, even if we have to mandate Olympic-style blood tests as a way of postponing that PSUNK match.

**Actually, that can't happen, as PSUNK is a non-D3 institution (they're USCAA), and as such are ineligible to rumble for the BeltTM.***  That 'Gheny/PSUNK battle will be a non-sanctioned bout.  So, barring a very unfortunate set of circumstances, the NCAC tournament champion will enter the NCAA tournament with the BeltTM tightly cinched to their waistline.

***So you can just ignore all this stuff in italics.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2009, 11:25:15 PM
Back from Timken where I watched Wooster play a great 2nd half to win the Mose Hole Tourney over Transylvania. ;D

The Scots played great defense tonight as they "held" Transy to 8 three pointers while hitting 10 three pointers of their own.  Wooster also kept their turnovers to 15 (vs. 13 for Transylvania) and they won the battle of the boards.  Wooster's defense challenged shots all night and held Transy to only 41% shooting for the game.

The key juncture of the game occurred with just over 4 minutes left and Transy leading 60-58.  Wooster made a three pointer on each of their next 3 possessions (Johnson, Franks, Hallowell) and suddenly it was 67-60 with just over 2 minutes remaining and the game was over.

Wooster's top 3 players delivered tonight as Ian Franks with 24 points, Nathan Balch with 17 points (3 three pointers) and Justin Hallowell with 13 points (3 three pointers) had most of the scoring for the Scots.

Nice win for the Scots as they move to 8-4, 3-0 NCAC. :)  Next up is Kenyon at home on January 9th.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 31, 2009, 10:38:02 AM
Good win for the Scots last night over a quality in-region opponent.  I believe this is Wooster's first win over a team with a winning record!  8)   For now anyways.  I say that because ONU is surely to get over .500 sooner or later and I would expect OWU to get over .500 by the end of NCAC play as well as Wabash.

Is that tough non-conference schedule starting to pay dividends already for the Scots?  It was nice to see the other team fold down the stretch for once this year as Transy did vs. the Scots and their decisive 14-0 run to put the game away in the final 2 minutes!  This is the kind of win that could propel Wooster on into good things once NCAC playe resumes!

Wooster's top 3 scorers once again led the way for the Scots as wooscotsfan noted, but one player that really stood out to me last night was Brandon Johonson.  For someone who was questionable coming into the game with a sprained ankle, I thought he did an admirable job on both ends of the floor when he was in the game.  In his 19 minutes he dished out a game high 6 assists including 2 of the biggest assists of the game on 3-balls from Franks and Hallowell to key Wooster's 14-0 run at the end of the game!  He also only scored 6 points but they were both HUGE baskets at critical junctures of the game.  The first came with Wooster teetering on the edge of losing the game as Transy was on a bit of a run and up 55-51.  Brandon nailed his 1st trey to cut the lead back down to one and end Transy's momentum.  And his 2nd trey was the first of 3 straight Wooster 3-pointers and sparked Wooster's decisive run.  I saw a glimpse of the leader that we were all expecting Brandon to be at the start of the season last night!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 31, 2009, 11:12:01 AM
David, I meant everyone else in this board. Considering you're the only one that posts on the women's board, your interest is a foregone conclusion.

Good luck to all of you and your teams in the year 2010!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 31, 2009, 12:05:22 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 31, 2009, 11:12:01 AM
David, I meant everyone else in this board. Considering you're the only one that posts on the women's board, your interest is a foregone conclusion.

Good luck to all of you and your teams in the year 2010!!


The story's made the front page (http://www.d3hoops.com/) now, too (in two places, actually).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 31, 2009, 12:21:06 PM
Looking forward to a great season of conference play in 2010.  Maybe it's delusional on my part, but there seems to be more parody this year and the conference winner could be a surprise.  I can see the Gators chewing up a few of the early season favorites, the Little Giants should come back to step on a few of you who aren't looking and who knows, maybe my Big Red will take down a few more, too! ;D

Good luck to all, have a great New Year and see you at the finish line!     
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 31, 2009, 12:27:38 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 30, 2009, 11:01:19 PM
I imagine there's a fair number of readers of this page (members and lurkers alike) that rarely, if ever, venture out to other threads.  You good folks may be unaware of the fact that Washington U. came into the Mose Hole Classic with the D3 Championship BeltTM in their possession.  (Think of a prizefighter entering the ring with his championship belt being carried behind him (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fparty-smiley-7498.gif&hash=f3c3254950f1bd906af9fbcb1c1a475bd6638548) (http://planetsmilies.net); for more information, please see this thread (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=5070.msg1155015#msg1155015).)  The BeltTM changed hands twice in the tournament, and is now displayed proudly in Wooster's trophy case.  Since Wooster is done with non-conference play altogether, and since they're off now until Jan. 9, that means that the BeltTM will stay in NCAC hands up to and into the NCAA tournament.*  The BeltTM has never before belonged to an NCAC team (not since the first rhinestone bangles were sewn on its alpaca-suede surface approximately three years ago), so the tour of the BeltTM through our conference over the next two months should be a thing to behold.  Come out and see the BeltTM when it comes to an arena near you!  ;D

*There is one chance for it to slip away; that's if it somehow comes into Allegheny's possession on or before Feb. 6, and then the Gators somehow lose it to Penn St.-New Kensington on Feb. 8.**   But that's not going to happen, even if we have to mandate Olympic-style blood tests as a way of postponing that PSUNK match.

**Actually, that can't happen, as PSUNK is a non-D3 institution (they're USCAA), and as such are ineligible to rumble for the BeltTM.***  That 'Gheny/PSUNK battle will be a non-sanctioned bout.  So, barring a very unfortunate set of circumstances, the NCAC tournament champion will enter the NCAA tournament with the BeltTM tightly cinched to their waistline.

***So you can just ignore all this stuff in italics.

If I ignore the italics stuff, how will I know to ignore the italics stuff? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 31, 2009, 12:40:05 PM
Quote from: sac on December 31, 2009, 12:27:38 PM
If I ignore the italics stuff, how will I know to ignore the italics stuff? 
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fnot-tagged-smiley-10475.gif&hash=ecb9cb64b776b51dd1714f0f50ea51172d3ffd36) (http://planetsmilies.net)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 31, 2009, 05:29:09 PM
My last lingering memory of 2009 will probably be my wonderment at the fact that DC somehow managed to find a smiley that's holding up a championship belt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 31, 2009, 05:52:49 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ilkeryoldas.com%2Fhappy-new-year-wallpaper.jpg&hash=53dcd970afee7ca89f8957eeaf7f6755aabd79bc)

Here's to a safe and Happy New Year everyone!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 01, 2010, 05:58:50 PM
It's about time the D-3 Championship Belt TM got out of the UAA!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 01, 2010, 08:48:46 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 30, 2009, 11:01:19 PM
I imagine there's a fair number of readers of this page (members and lurkers alike) that rarely, if ever, venture out to other threads.  You good folks may be unaware of the fact that Washington U. came into the Mose Hole Classic with the D3 Championship BeltTM in their possession.  (Think of a prizefighter entering the ring with his championship belt being carried behind him (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fparty-smiley-7498.gif&hash=f3c3254950f1bd906af9fbcb1c1a475bd6638548) (http://planetsmilies.net); for more information, please see this thread (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=5070.msg1155015#msg1155015).)  The BeltTM changed hands twice in the tournament, and is now displayed proudly in Wooster's trophy case.  Since Wooster is done with non-conference play altogether, and since they're off now until Jan. 9, that means that the BeltTM will stay in NCAC hands up to and into the NCAA tournament.*  The BeltTM has never before belonged to an NCAC team (not since the first rhinestone bangles were sewn on its alpaca-suede surface approximately three years ago), so the tour of the BeltTM through our conference over the next two months should be a thing to behold.  Come out and see the BeltTM when it comes to an arena near you!  ;D

*There is one chance for it to slip away; that's if it somehow comes into Allegheny's possession on or before Feb. 6, and then the Gators somehow lose it to Penn St.-New Kensington on Feb. 8.**   But that's not going to happen, even if we have to mandate Olympic-style blood tests as a way of postponing that PSUNK match.

**Actually, that can't happen, as PSUNK is a non-D3 institution (they're USCAA), and as such are ineligible to rumble for the BeltTM.***  That 'Gheny/PSUNK battle will be a non-sanctioned bout.  So, barring a very unfortunate set of circumstances, the NCAC tournament champion will enter the NCAA tournament with the BeltTM tightly cinched to their waistline.

***So you can just ignore all this stuff in italics.

This is pretty neat and it will be fun to watch it potential bounce around the league. 

There are scenarios where the trophy will stay in the league even if the NCAC tournament champion doesn't win the National Championship. One scenario is if Wittenberg has the trophy for the last regular season game and then loses at Oberlin on Feb 20th and Oberlin doesn't make the NCAC tournament.

Of course I'm hoping it stays with the Scots all through the season.........
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2010, 12:12:30 AM
Five games Saturday, none of them involving the BeltTM:

Capital at Kenyon, noon 1pm 12:45pm sometime soon (sheesh!  make up your minds!) -- Live Stats, Audio, and Video (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
Hiram vs. Rutgers-Newark at Marymount U., 2pm -- Live Stats and Video (http://marymount.edu/athletics/), maybe -- Marymount has these resources for their home games; whether they'll extend it to the non-Saints games in this tourney I can't say
Oberlin at Case Western Reserve, 3pm -- no live coverage to my knowledge
Franklin at Wabash, 3pm -- Live Stats and Audio (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball)
OWU at Roanoke, 7pm -- Live Stats and Audio (http://maroons.roanoke.edu/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 02, 2010, 10:26:03 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 30, 2009, 11:01:19 PM
I imagine there's a fair number of readers of this page (members and lurkers alike) that rarely, if ever, venture out to other threads.  You good folks may be unaware of the fact that Washington U. came into the Mose Hole Classic with the D3 Championship BeltTM in their possession.  (Think of a prizefighter entering the ring with his championship belt being carried behind him (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fparty-smiley-7498.gif&hash=f3c3254950f1bd906af9fbcb1c1a475bd6638548) (http://planetsmilies.net); for more information, please see this thread (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=5070.msg1155015#msg1155015).)  The BeltTM changed hands twice in the tournament, and is now displayed proudly in Wooster's trophy case.  Since Wooster is done with non-conference play altogether, and since they're off now until Jan. 9, that means that the BeltTM will stay in NCAC hands up to and into the NCAA tournament.*  The BeltTM has never before belonged to an NCAC team (not since the first rhinestone bangles were sewn on its alpaca-suede surface approximately three years ago), so the tour of the BeltTM through our conference over the next two months should be a thing to behold.  Come out and see the BeltTM when it comes to an arena near you!  ;D


Hopefully, Wooster can retain The BeltTM a bit longer than Transy was in possession of it!

Kenyon will be Wooster's first title defense and seeing that the Lords already gave the Scots all they could handle in Gambier earlier this season, I'm sure that the added motivation of The BeltTM could push Kenyon to a victory!  :P

Of course, Wooster will now be playing with the added pressure of trying to defend The BeltTM everytime out.  How will they handle the pressure?  We'll have to wait until the 9th to find out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2010, 12:08:27 PM
Today's doubleheader at Kenyon has been delayed by an hour "due to a problem with [the] officials"; new time noted in post above.  I'm going back to bed now.  ;)

UPDATE:  They should have delayed it permanently.  Ben McGrath is 7 for 7 from the arc with 26 points at the half.  Capital leads a rust-inhibited Kenyon 50-24.  Yuck.
UPDATE:  Kenyon's comeback attempt falls just short, losing to Capital 86-55.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 02, 2010, 02:36:03 PM
Final from Gambier - Capital 86  Lords 55.  McGrath's treys did the trick in the first half and the Crusaders never looked back.  He ended up with 34.  Knapke had 17 pts. and 13 boards.  J.T. had 11.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2010, 03:27:51 PM
Hiram is getting similarly murdered, trailing Rutgers-Newark 80-48 with 6:22 left.  They're being doubled up (40-20) in the second half.
UPDATE:  Final score: Rutgers-Newark 85, Hiram 59.  You know there's something amiss when your leading scorer is Jide Eniola, who had 14.  Chris Roberts contributed, uhm, four points.  And a rebound.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 02, 2010, 03:49:38 PM
Yuck.  Not a good day for the NCAC...  :-\

I'm sure that Oberlin will contribute to the conference woes today.

I guess it's up to Wabash and OWU to save some face for the conference...

So far so good for Wabash as they are up big on Franklin at the half:

Wabash - 41
Franklin - 22
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2010, 03:51:06 PM
Wabash leads Franklin at the half, 41-22.  Wabash ends the half on a 13-0 run, the last 11 of which was from the free throw line; they were 18-23 at the stripe in the first half as Franklin was whistled for an astonishing sixteen team fouls (to Wabash's 8.)

Quote from: ScotsFan on January 02, 2010, 03:49:38 PM
I'm sure that Oberlin will contribute to the conference woes today.
Not so fast my friend.  Oberlin leads CWRU 31-20 at the half.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 02, 2010, 04:02:23 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2010, 03:51:06 PM
Not so fast my friend.  Oberlin leads CWRU 31-20 at the half.  :)
I can picture you holding up your pencil in the air as you type that!   :D

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fts2.mm.bing.net%2Fimages%2Fthumbnail.aspx%3Fq%3D1599577001573%26amp%3Bid%3D2a02d239794d7a55478aaa63236bc736%26amp%3Burl%3Dhttp%253a%252f%252fhttp.cdnlayer.com%252fitke%252fblogs.dir%252f96%252ffiles%252f2009%252f06%252flee-corso.jpg&hash=57c18c1f27adf1239dd3c53ea178ff38c9864847)

That would certainly be a pleasant surprise to see the Yeomen knock off Case!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2010, 04:52:55 PM
Wabash records the easy victory, 90-61, behind 31 points from Wes Smith.  Does it count as a triple double if you have 10 field goals, 11 free throws, and 10 rebounds?  Aaron Brock added 19, and everybody got to play a lot in this laugher--9 players with double-figure minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2010, 05:17:27 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 02, 2010, 04:02:23 PM
That would certainly be a pleasant surprise to see the Yeomen knock off Case!  :)
Yeah, sure, whatever.  Case 55, Oberlin 52, on a buzzer-beating trey by Bryan Erce.  Josh Merritt led all scorers with 21, while Andrew Fox had 13 & 13 for the unlucky Yeo.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 02, 2010, 05:28:33 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 02, 2010, 04:02:23 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2010, 03:51:06 PM
Not so fast my friend.  Oberlin leads CWRU 31-20 at the half.  :)
I can picture you holding up your pencil in the air as you type that!   :D

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fts2.mm.bing.net%2Fimages%2Fthumbnail.aspx%3Fq%3D1599577001573%26amp%3Bid%3D2a02d239794d7a55478aaa63236bc736%26amp%3Burl%3Dhttp%253a%252f%252fhttp.cdnlayer.com%252fitke%252fblogs.dir%252f96%252ffiles%252f2009%252f06%252flee-corso.jpg&hash=57c18c1f27adf1239dd3c53ea178ff38c9864847)

That would certainly be a pleasant surprise to see the Yeomen knock off Case!  :)

I just want to see David put on the mascots Yeomen head.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 02, 2010, 06:34:51 PM
As noted, Wabash notched a pretty easy win over the visiting Franklin Grizzlies this afternoon.  Franklin opened the scoring with a free throw and after that it was all Wabash.  Also previously noted, fouls were the story in the first half.  It was apparent after about two minutes that Wes Smith was going to be able to get to the basket whenever he wanted...Franklin's answer was to foul him before he could get there.  16 first half fouls later, Wabash had built a 19 point lead despite the fact that the Grizzlies had attempted 14 more field goals in the first half. 

Smith and Brock both had impressive games today.  Both were aggressive going to the basket and when those two are attacking and drawing fouls, Wabash is at their best. 

It's conference play from here on out for Wabash starting with the Alleghey/Hiram series next weekend.  I think it's pretty important for Wabash to get back to .500 in conference play next weekend if they want to host a first round game in the tournament.  Good start to 2010 for the LGs...hopefully they can sustain the positive momentum.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2010, 06:58:32 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2010, 12:12:30 AM
OWU at Roanoke, 7pm -- Live Stats and Audio (http://maroons.roanoke.edu/)
...and live video, via the same link.  (Roanoke had announced that there would not be video, but has since changed their stance on this.  Thank you, Maroons!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2010, 08:39:08 PM
I realize that I'm a bit of an eternal optimist on behalf of my friends associated with OWU, but I must say that the Bishops looked good in disposing of Roanoke tonight, 74-55.  Now, Roanoke may not be the Globetrotters, but OWU made them look like the Generals, as the Bishops hit about half of their shots from both sides of the arc while the Maroons were heaving up bricks from deep.  Tim Brady had 25 on 11/15 shooting in 23 minutes.  One low point was a weak 45% effort from the foul line, but it didn't hurt them tonight.  Maybe, finally, we'll start seeing the good OWU team we all suspect is there. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2010, 08:53:52 PM
So, two games tomorrow:

Morris Cregger Invitational championship game:  Defiance vs. Ohio Wesleyan (at Roanoke), 1pm -- Live Stats, Audio, Video (http://maroons.roanoke.edu/index.aspx?path=mbball) -- (time confirmed, coverage, or lack thereof, confirmed)  Defiance (10-2) nipped OWU at home, 74-71, in late November.  Revenge time!

Marymount Holiday Classic consolation game: Hiram at Marymount, 2pm -- Live Stats and Video (http://www.marymount.edu/athletics/mbball/2010schedule.html) -- Marymount upset by 1-7 Goucher, falls to 5-6.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2010, 02:37:06 PM
Defiance and OWU had another battle today, and once again it was the Bishops that came up short, 64-56.  Pat Pellerite tied the game at 54 with 2:40 remaining, but OWU turned the ball over on each of its next three possessions, leading to an 8-point, game-deciding run for the Yellow Jackets.  Wesleyan had just 17 turnovers in the ballgame, but four of them were in the last 2:01, and that's going to be fatal against a good team like Defiance just about every time.  OWU shot 38% overall and again had their problems at the free throw line (9/14, 64%).  Pellerite's 14 points and 9 rebounds were both team highs, but so were his four turnovers.

Jekyll-and-Hiram has led throughout the first half at Marymount, but let the Saints finish the half on a 7-2 run to close within one at 31-30.  Chris Roberts, who only saw six minutes in the second half yesterday, has not played today.  I hope he's not injured.
UPDATE: I just noticed that this game is also being videocast; use the above link.  Sorry for the delay.  It's 48-48 inside 10 mins.
UPDATE:  Final score: Marymount 71, Hiram 67; this may be revised downward to 69-67, as the last bucket was clearly after the horn.  Anyway...it was exciting if not exactly well-played.  Hiram did well to hang in there without Roberts, without Meyer, who fouled out with 8+ minutes left, and without Muhammad, who left with 2+ left.  But a couple of off-balance shots by Marymount's Simoneau went in in the last 0:36, and the Terriers went out.  Muhammad tallied 14 before fouling out, leading four Pups in double figures.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2010, 08:04:58 PM
I've gotten behind in my taking notice of the NCAC Players of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html), so I'd like to both congratulate and apologize to Hiram's Glenn Campbell, who won the award on Dec. 21 for his 17-point performance against Bluffton.  Today he is joined by Wabash's Wes Smith, recognized for his 31-point outburst vs. Franklin yesterday.  Congratulations, Glenn and Wes!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BogeyMan on January 03, 2010, 10:35:48 PM
A team flying under the radar in the Great Lakes Region is Defiance.  They are 11-2 with three tournament championships.  Does anyone know anything about them?  I'm not so sure with that record they shouldn't be recognized nationally.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 03, 2010, 11:00:39 PM
Quote from: BogeyMan on January 03, 2010, 10:35:48 PM
A team flying under the radar in the Great Lakes Region is Defiance.  They are 11-2 with three tournament championships.  Does anyone know anything about them?  I'm not so sure with that record they shouldn't be recognized nationally.

Defiance is in the Midwest Region with the rest of the HCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on January 04, 2010, 11:14:04 AM
Quote from: sac on January 03, 2010, 11:00:39 PM
Quote from: BogeyMan on January 03, 2010, 10:35:48 PM
A team flying under the radar in the Great Lakes Region is Defiance.  They are 11-2 with three tournament championships.  Does anyone know anything about them?  I'm not so sure with that record they shouldn't be recognized nationally.

Defiance is in the Midwest Region with the rest of the HCAC.

;D

Defiance has a pretty, strong contingent this year, though there were a couple of early season hiccoughs and questions in the post after losing Anthony Pettiway to graduation.  They're athletic (I know-really profound comment, eh?), and have ten different guys who possess the ability to "go off" in double figures on any given night, so there is quite a bit of platooning.  Jackets Backer made an appropriate observation that the sub patterns were similar to watching a hockey team changing lines... more will be known about DC after this weeks' appointment with Transy in Lexington  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2010, 11:47:54 AM
Folks, as sac politely suggested, you're going to be hard-pressed to find anyone in this room who cares a whit about Defiance.  However, there's lots of Defiance talk going on in the appropriate thread, which is here:  MBB: Heartland Collegiate Athletic Conference (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3706.720)
Thanks for stopping by.

(Although I am duly impressed by someone who can correctly spell 'hiccough!' ;))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 04, 2010, 12:35:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 03, 2010, 08:04:58 PM
I've gotten behind in my taking notice of the NCAC Players of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html), so I'd like to both congratulate and apologize to Hiram's Glenn Campbell, who won the award on Dec. 21 for his 17-point performance against Bluffton.

Not to worry, as in spite of your momentary lapse in recognizing his achievement he's still been gettin' cards and letters from people he don't even know, and offers comin' over the phone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2010, 03:54:42 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 04, 2010, 12:35:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 03, 2010, 08:04:58 PM
I've gotten behind in my taking notice of the NCAC Players of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html), so I'd like to both congratulate and apologize to Hiram's Glenn Campbell, who won the award on Dec. 21 for his 17-point performance against Bluffton.

Not to worry, as in spite of your momentary lapse in recognizing his achievement he's still been gettin' cards and letters from people he don't even know, and offers comin' over the phone.
Yes, and because of Glenn's achievement, if and when his teammate Alan Sheppard wins the award, he won't be the first man in (this) space.   ::)

No shortage of great fun to be had with Hiram's roster, thanks to some parents who were either clueless or very mean-spirited.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 04, 2010, 05:08:23 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 04, 2010, 03:54:42 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 04, 2010, 12:35:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 03, 2010, 08:04:58 PM
I've gotten behind in my taking notice of the NCAC Players of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html), so I'd like to both congratulate and apologize to Hiram's Glenn Campbell, who won the award on Dec. 21 for his 17-point performance against Bluffton.

Not to worry, as in spite of your momentary lapse in recognizing his achievement he's still been gettin' cards and letters from people he don't even know, and offers comin' over the phone.
Yes, and because of Glenn's achievement, if and when his teammate Alan Sheppard wins the award, he won't be the first man in (this) space.   ::)

No shortage of great fun to be had with Hiram's roster, thanks to some parents who were either clueless or very mean-spirited.

Kind of appropriate, since Ohio's most famous son was born Hiram Ulysses Grant but changed it when he enrolled at the U.S. Military Academy, because his congressman got Grant's name wrong when submitting his sponsoring paperwork. He acceded to having his name changed to Ulysses S. Grant and made it permanent, since he didn't want to be teased by his West Point classmates about bearing the initials HUG with which his parents had burdened him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2010, 05:32:46 PM
Three conference games coming up this week:

Tuesday:
Allegheny (1-0) at Kenyon (0-2), 7pm -- Live Everything (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)

Wednesday:
Oberlin (0-2) at Denison (2-0), 7:30pm -- Live Stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html)
Ohio Wesleyan (0-2) at Wittenberg (1-1), 7:30pm -- Live Everything (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html)

If ever there was a must-win game for the Bishops, this is the one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 04, 2010, 06:42:20 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 04, 2010, 12:35:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 03, 2010, 08:04:58 PM
I've gotten behind in my taking notice of the NCAC Players of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html), so I'd like to both congratulate and apologize to Hiram's Glenn Campbell, who won the award on Dec. 21 for his 17-point performance against Bluffton.

Not to worry, as in spite of your momentary lapse in recognizing his achievement he's still been gettin' cards and letters from people he don't even know, and offers comin' over the phone.

After the season I bet Campbell will need a small vacation...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 04, 2010, 06:44:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 04, 2010, 05:32:46 PM
Three conference games coming up this week:

Tuesday:
Allegheny (1-0) at Kenyon (0-2), 7pm -- Live Everything (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)

Wednesday:
Oberlin (0-2) at Denison (2-0), 7:30pm -- Live Stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html)
Ohio Wesleyan (0-2) at Wittenberg (1-1), 7:30pm -- Live Everything (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html)

If ever there was a must-win game for the Bishops, this is the one.

Is the Hiram / Allegheny trip to Indiana this weekend?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2010, 06:45:54 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 04, 2010, 06:44:01 PM
Is the Hiram / Allegheny trip to Indiana this weekend?
Yes, for both the men and the women.  With Earlham leaving the conference, this may be the last Big TripTM we'll see; there's none on the schedule next season if I remember correctly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 04, 2010, 07:28:49 PM
Just peeked at next season's schedule...looks like a full double round robin.  Symmetry does my heart good.  Easy move for the league to make...it's a shame the football schedule isn't as easy to consolidate. 

And speaking of must-wins...Add Kenyon and Wabash to OWU to the list of teams that need to break through in conference play this week(end).  How much pressure gets put on these teams if they slip to 0-3?  I hope to not have to find out.  Hiram is up first for Wabash on Friday night...Allegheny on Saturday afternoon. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2010, 07:29:59 PM
Belated congratulations to Kenyon's Dave Knapke, who passed the career 1,000 point level back in December against Grove City.  Dave becomes just the 14th Lord (and the second in two years) to reach 1,000 career points and 600 career rebounds (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x31063.xml).  Congratulations, Dave!(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fhappy-smiley-8769.gif&hash=aeb289e67220f3813c231bcf5c375101dc1b9252)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 04, 2010, 09:43:00 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 04, 2010, 06:42:20 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 04, 2010, 12:35:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 03, 2010, 08:04:58 PM
I've gotten behind in my taking notice of the NCAC Players of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html), so I'd like to both congratulate and apologize to Hiram's Glenn Campbell, who won the award on Dec. 21 for his 17-point performance against Bluffton.

Not to worry, as in spite of your momentary lapse in recognizing his achievement he's still been gettin' cards and letters from people he don't even know, and offers comin' over the phone.

After the season I bet Campbell will need a small vacation...

... unfortunately, it may not come to pass at that time that it will look like rain.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 05, 2010, 01:00:45 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 04, 2010, 07:28:49 PM
Just peeked at next season's schedule...looks like a full double round robin.  Symmetry does my heart good.  Easy move for the league to make...it's a shame the football schedule isn't as easy to consolidate. 

And speaking of must-wins...Add Kenyon and Wabash to OWU to the list of teams that need to break through in conference play this week(end).  How much pressure gets put on these teams if they slip to 0-3?  I hope to not have to find out.  Hiram is up first for Wabash on Friday night...Allegheny on Saturday afternoon. 

If the LGs fall to Hiram then the Gheny matchup will be double dog huge.

An 0-4 start may consign the LGs to a scramble for the best available road matchup in the NCAC tourney. Ick.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jweingardt12 on January 05, 2010, 06:27:53 PM
Hey guys, I run the WOO 91 Sports Blog for the College of Wooster. Up now is the broadcast schedule for January: http://woo91sports.wordpress.com/

Thanks,

Jason

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on January 05, 2010, 07:06:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 04, 2010, 11:47:54 AM
Folks, as sac politely suggested, you're going to be hard-pressed to find anyone in this room who cares a whit about Defiance.  However, there's lots of Defiance talk going on in the appropriate thread, which is here:  MBB: Heartland Collegiate Athletic Conference (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=3706.720)
Thanks for stopping by.

(Although I am duly impressed by someone who can correctly spell 'hiccough!' ;))

Summarily smitten but unbowed, some do give a whit due to geographic proximity and potential, post season matches.  Regret the violation of gatekeeper sensibilities and holy sanctity of the NCAC board due to a reasoned and timely response to an inquiry rather than offering a perfunctory dismissal to a relative newcomer.  "Sac's" point has validity if reliant on a "geographically (and geologically) challenged" NCAA on which this site depends.  ;)

I do appreciate the compliment - Webster's and rote were tools of the trade in both Crawfordsville and subsequently at an undisclosed locale on the Maumee Lacustrine Plain in the late 1960s-early 1970s - and well before the onset of cyber-laziness and Wikipedia plagiarism. 

From a literal (and littoral) aspect, the "undisclosed locale" was more a part of the Great Lakes Region than any NCAC site.  Oberlin qualified as undeveloped, riparian potential, but I'll spare y'all a limnological dissertation.   8-)

In defense of "Bogeyman," perhaps he was unaware of NCAA regional designations?  Their logic hasn't been impeccable.  ::)

Stopped back, reclaimed a misplaced VISA, and happily retreat back to a lurker's lair to await 'Bash football, Denison's spring rugby season, OWU lacrosse, and abusing DePauw.  Enjoy the remainder of the season, and profound apologies for parking in an unmarked, red zone.  Slainte.  ;D

 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 05, 2010, 07:33:19 PM
I'm not the gatekeeper, I'm the keymaster. 
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmovies.infinitecoolness.com%2F15%2Fghostbusters14.jpg&hash=4224aec3b382b85704f1ae392cee338a0382f48b)
Are you the gatekeeper?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 05, 2010, 08:47:46 PM
Allegheny edges Kenyon, 89-57.  When one team makes more than twice as many field goals and almost three times as many treys, they're likely going to win, and that's what happened in Gambier tonight. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 06, 2010, 10:12:30 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 05, 2010, 08:47:46 PM
Allegheny edges Kenyon, 89-57.  When one team makes more than twice as many field goals and almost three times as many treys, they're likely going to win, and that's what happened in Gambier tonight. 

Looks like Kenyon still hasn't recovered from their New Year's Eve hangovers!  The Lords have dropped their first 2 games of the new year by a combined total of 63 points.  And these games were AT HOME no less!!!  :o

And things won't get any easier for Kenyon as their next game is on the road at Wooster.  Although, with their last 2 results being 31 and 32 point drubbings in the friendly confines of Tomsich, I'm wondering if a road trip might do the Lords some good...  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 06, 2010, 05:29:23 PM
DC and all others:

I will have the post-game wrap-up following the Ohio Wesleyan-Wittenberg game tonight in Springfield, Ohio. Full in-depth coverage!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 06, 2010, 08:58:08 PM
Wittenberg 74, OWU 67...Is Wittenberg the new Wooster?  The Scots learned early in the 2000s that having two or three dead-eye three-point shooters really makes good things happen for your offense.  It seems like Witt has gotten on this bandwagon this year.  Tonight it wasn't that the threes opened up the inside; OWU kept that packed down (at least in the first half, when the video was still working).  Instead it was the three-ball that carried them, scoring 36 longball points on 66.7% shooting--and it was only that low because they cooled off down the stretch.  But if you come out and try to shut down Hill, Sullivan, Nowicki, and/or McKee, then that gives the bigs room to operate.  It's a good system that has worked well for Wooster and is now working well for the Tigers.  Looking forward to hearing pennstghs' take on the game tonight and the Tiger offense in general.

Denison 76, Oberlin 69...A back-and-forth game with Oberlin having the advantage much of the night.  The Yeo pushed the lead out to 10 early in the second half, but a 12-2 DU run put them right back into the game.  The Red took the lead for good just inside the 5:00 mark, stretched it to as much as 7 points, then made six-of-six free throws in the final 0:28 to retain their share of first place in the conference.  DU now has a three-game lead on Ohio Wesleyan in the conference standings.   :o  It was a good night to be a three-point shooter named Chris in the NCAC; here it was Chris Luther who was 6/9 from international waters for 25 points.  DU's Mike Garabedian (17&10) and OC's Andrew Fox (16&11) each had double-doubles.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 06, 2010, 10:06:30 PM
Wittenberg won an actually typical Witt/OWU battle as it was tight throughout the first half before Wittenberg went on a 9-0 run to open up a 9 point halftime lead. As David alluded to, this lead was created on 3-pointers. Chris Sullivan, Witt's backup point guard I think shot 7-8 from 3 point range but as a team made 12 3 pointers. This of course was because OWU's strength is their inside play and OWU seemed stubborn in ensuring that Wittenberg was going to win by their outside shooting only.

A big difference in Wittenberg this year is that they are a more ball-movement offense. What I mean by this is that they move the ball side to side a lot more and have a lot more weak side movement that opens up a lot of outside shots, also thus creating more inside room for the bigs to score. Wittenberg can go 4 deep in the post, however, no one player is a "dominant" inside scorer (i.e. Borchers, Russ). If that piece were in place with this team, they'd be considered national contenders I believe. One striking stat is that again Wittenberg was outrebounded. How many Wittenberg teams would be outnumbered this many teams so far in the season and still be 10-2????

One thing that is hurting OWU so far is that they are too reliant on their post play. Wittenberg typically doesn't play 2-3 zone too well, but against OWU they were mostly in this defense because OWU has absolutely no consistent outside threats. When playing teams with quick guards, such as Witt or even Wooster, they really struggle on offense and have to rely on defense to pull out wins. Of course if they get down like they did tonight, its difficult to come back by solely shooting inside shots. However, they are a well-coached team and despite being 0-3 in conference play, they will give some teams fits this season.

Wittenberg should gain another easy win Saturday vs. Oberlin and I don't think they have a chance at being ranked with only two losses unless a win vs Wooster on the 23rd occurs. At that point if this team still only has two losses will they be considered a force to be reckoned with nationally. Thoughts, questions?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 07, 2010, 01:03:48 PM
Pretty decent winter storm is passing through the heartland today...not sure if it will affect travel for the eastern teams coming to Indiana this weekend, but it certainly could.  Something to keep an eye on tonight and tomorrow. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 07, 2010, 01:17:30 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 07, 2010, 01:03:48 PM
Pretty decent winter storm is passing through the heartland today...not sure if it will affect travel for the eastern teams coming to Indiana this weekend, but it certainly could.  Something to keep an eye on tonight and tomorrow. 
They've been calling for 2-6", but looking at the radar, it sure looks like we could see more along the lines of 8-10" easily. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 07, 2010, 01:45:58 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 07, 2010, 01:17:30 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 07, 2010, 01:03:48 PM
Pretty decent winter storm is passing through the heartland today...not sure if it will affect travel for the eastern teams coming to Indiana this weekend, but it certainly could.  Something to keep an eye on tonight and tomorrow. 
They've been calling for 2-6", but looking at the radar, it sure looks like we could see more along the lines of 8-10" easily. 

4.2" are down here in Lafayette (another inch or so is supposed to be coming tomorrow)...schools are letting out early, and I think the interstate near town is closed for the time being.  There have definitely been worse storms blow through here, but it seems to be just bad enough to be affecting travel.  Again, I've got no word on whether or not the Indiana games will be affected, but they certainly could.  I'd not be surprised to see these games get bumped back to Saturday/Sunday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 07, 2010, 04:08:16 PM
So, weather permitting, here's your abbreviated Friday schedule--it's just the Big TripTM games:

Hiram (2-0) at Wabash (0-2), 7:30pm -- Live stats and audio (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball)
Allegheny (2-0) at Earlham (1-1), ~8pm -- Live stats and audio (http://goearlham.com/index.aspx) -- Game 2 of a women/men doubleheader

Everybody is scheduled for Saturday, but let's see what Friday brings first.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 07, 2010, 10:05:38 PM
Crash in Snowy [Springfield] Ohio [on I-70] Kills 4 (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20100108/ap_on_bi_ge/us_winter_weather)

I don't know if Hiram and Allegheny typically travel the day of the game or the night before when they make the trek to Wabash, Earlham, and Wittenberg, but tonight, I hope they're all safe and snug in their beds.  Basketball can wait.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 08, 2010, 10:05:40 AM
I'm guessing that the games should be going on as planned in Indiana tonight.  Hiram and Gheny may need to get a bit of an earlier start to their travels, but I'm guessing the interstates should be fine by now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2010, 01:41:03 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 08, 2010, 10:05:40 AM
I'm guessing that the games should be going on as planned in Indiana tonight.  Hiram and Gheny may need to get a bit of an earlier start to their travels, but I'm guessing the interstates should be fine by now.
I'm sure you're right, as we certainly would have heard by now if these games had been put off. 

What do I know from winter weather?  It's about 55 here today, and snow is about as rare as a Caltech victory! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2010, 09:18:49 PM
Wabash seems to have beaten Hiram, 71-60.  It'd be nice if someone at Wabash would indicate to Live Stats that the last 0:13 have gone by, though... ::)

Allegheny seems to have beaten Earlham, 79-58.  It'd be nice if someone at Earlham would indicate to Sidearm Stats that the last 0:08 have gone by, though...::)

What is it with Indiana and clocks, anyway?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 08, 2010, 10:28:09 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 08, 2010, 09:18:49 PM
Wabash seems to have beaten Hiram, 71-60.  It'd be nice if someone at Wabash would indicate to Live Stats that the last 0:13 have gone by, though... ::)

What livestats won't tell you, the wally wabash tweetstream will.  :) 

Wabash did get their first NCAC win of the season tonight at Chadwick Court.  Hiram jumped out to the early lead and maintained a 4-7 point lead for much of the first half.  At 21-14, Hiram held their largest lead of the game and Aaron Brock was the only Little Giant to have scored a point (nearly 12 minutes into the game, mind you).  It was at this point when Wes Smith started going to the basket and the tide turned for Wabash.  Wabash closed the half on a 21-8 run and never looked back.  Hiram did close to within 3 points with about 8 minutes to play, but a 9 point run for Wabash put the game out of reach for the Terriers. 

Wabash was led by Aaron Brock's 22 points.  Wes Smith added 21 for Wabash.  Smith also had two steals tonight which makes him Wabash's career steals leader.  Congrats Wes!  I would also be remiss if I didn't mention the outstanding job done by Derek Bailey and Nick Curosh in the second half.  Starting post men Brock and Ben Burkett both picked up their fourth personal fouls at about the 14 minute mark of the second half.  Bailey and Curosh came in off the bench and played 8-9 tremendous minutes with Wabash's top two big men on the bench. 

Allegheny comes to Chadwick tomorrow afternoon for a 2:00 p.m. tipoff.  Go Wabash!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2010, 12:29:35 AM
Oh nuts, I guess I have forgotten to post the Saturday schedule.  I don't suppose life on earth will end if I don't do it, but my own exaggerated sense of self-importance compels.

Allegheny at Wabash, 2pm -- Live stats and audio (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball)
Kenyon at Wooster, 3pm -- Live stats and audio (http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule) -- First defense of the D3 Championship BeltTM -- Game 1 of a day/night doubleheader (women's game is at 7:30)
Oberlin at Wittenberg, ~4pm -- Live Everything (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html) -- Game 2 of a women/men doubleheader (women's game is vs. Allegheny)
Hiram at Earlham, ~4pm -- Live stats and audio (http://goearlham.com/index.aspx) -- Game 2 of a women/men doubleheader
Denison at OWU, 5:30 -- Live Everything (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html), courtesy of my buddies at @StreamOWUSports (http://twitter.com/StreamOWUSports) (Twitter) -- Game 1 of a men/women doubleheader
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 09, 2010, 10:37:22 AM
With yesterday's results, there are only 3 undefeated teams left in the NCAC - Wooster, Allegheny and Denison which are all currently at 3-0 records.

Both Allegheny and Denison have tough road games today.  As a Wooster fan, let's hope that the Scots have the right focus today vs. Kenyon since they narrowly escaped Gambier with a win a few weeks ago.  I hope to see a Wooster victory this afternoon when I make the snowy trek to Timken! ;)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 09, 2010, 01:32:21 PM
I know you all will get a chuckle out of what I'm going to say given the Big Red's record and history, but I think Denison matches up pretty well against OWU this year and there might be a surprise result in this one. 

If we extend the defense out and keep an eye on back door cuts, we can contain the OWU offense.  Maybe even zone up since OWU's shooting percentage from long range isn't particularly stellar so far.  If they start hitting from the outside, though, we would have to man-up quickly.  Also have to continue doing a good job of preventing the inside passes.

The biggest issue for the Big Red, is whether we can put points on the board with the offense it runs.  We have athletes, and if this team is allowed to run more, as it has in the early phases of many of the games, we can get leads.  Unfortunately, after the opening game adrenaline wears off, the offense is usually forced into long, patient searches for openings that don't come, shots are forced as the clock expires and opponents are allowed to close the gap.  If the current team can keep running, wins will come against the tougher conference opponents. 

Can't wait to get to Delaware - hope there will still be 3 unblemished at the end of the day!! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2010, 03:49:14 PM
Wabash drops Allegheny out of first place, 86-65, behind double-sawbucks from Chase Haltom and Aaron Brock.  Wabash was 51% from the field and 61% (11/18) from the arc--that's tough to beat.

Wooster leads Kenyon by 5 at the half, 40-35.  WQKT's Mike Breckenridge, usually a pro at such things, is butchering some of the more uncommon Kenyon names, giving me a good chuckle now and then.
UPDATE:  Wooster 71, Kenyon 59.   I don't know if Kenyon just matches up well with Wooster, or if they get up for this game better than others, but once again they gave the Scots fits all afternoon.  Two big threes by Fegan inside the last 4 minutes gave Wooster the margin, but it was a battle against a team that has looked downright awful since the break.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 09, 2010, 05:05:19 PM
You said it, DC.  Wabash was hot today and it's tough to beat anybody when they are shooting that well. 

Wabash started slow this afternoon and fell behind by 7 early, but then the shots started falling in bunches.  Aaron Brock again lit the fuse for Wabash offensively.  Brock had a monster weekend for the LGs...and if this is the Aaron Brock that we can expect to see for the duration of the season, Wabash should be a strong team throughout conference play.  Also noted was Chase Haltom's fine game.  Chase was 4-5 on 3 point FGs...a couple of which were very deep shots in the second half.  When he's taking those shots, he's usually having a fine game.  Wes Smith had just 15 for Wabash today, but did a lot of disruptive work on defense for Wabash today. 

These were two enormous wins for Wabash this weekend.  Wabash is back to 2-2 in league play and playing with a lot of confidence.  The re-emergence of Aaron Brock as an offensive threat has been critical.  Brock and Smith will be a handful for most teams the rest of the way.  Wabash is probably one more consistent scoring threat away from being really, really good.  We'll see if the LGs can find that third consistent option in the coming weeks. 

Wabash next heads over to Earlham on Wednesday before coming back home to see if they can finally shake the Denison curse.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2010, 05:32:01 PM
Speaking of hot, Wittenberg drains another 16 threes (in 26 att., 62%) and cruises past Oberlin, 82-56.  Seven different Tigers connected from the arc; McKee was 5/5.  Jeebus.

Hiram and Earlham are in a back-and-forth dandy; Pups up 51-43 with 8:11 left.
UPDATE: Not so dandy in the end, as Hiram pulls away for the 69-52 victory.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2010, 07:22:24 PM
OWU "upsets" first-place Denison, 70-67; Larry Farmer nails a half-court shot but it was a nanosecond after the buzzer and is waved off.  A great game, if not expertly played--lots of missed free throws, poor shot selection, etc.  Denison's pressure defense brought them back into the game.

Wooster is now alone in first place. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 09, 2010, 07:25:02 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 09, 2010, 07:22:24 PM
Wooster is now alone in first place. 

You're welcome.  :) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 09, 2010, 07:52:25 PM
NCAC Standings with 1/9 Results:

1.  Wooster 4-0, 9-4
2.  Wittenberg 3-1, 11-2
2.  Allegheny 3-1, 6-6
2.  Hiram 3-1, 6-7
2.  Denison 3-1, 3-10
6.  Wabash 2-2, 7-5
7.  Ohio Wesleyan 1-3, 4-9
7.  Earlham 1-3, 3-10
9.  Oberlin 0-4, 4-9
9.  Kenyon 0-4, 3-9
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 09, 2010, 08:07:47 PM
Back from Wooster where I saw the Scots play ugly basketball for 35 minutes today:

With only 5 minutes left in the game, it was Wooster clinging to a 57-56 lead due to some poor shooting and sloppy basketball up to that point.

Wooster then went on a 11-0 run and the game was effectively over.  Scots did not shoot the ball well today hitting only 43% from the floor.  Combined, Nathan Balch and Josh Claytor were 0 of 14 from the field which explains the low overall team shooting percentage.  On the bright side, Justin Hallowell and Matt Fegan each made 5 three pointers and Fegan hit 3 of those at key points in the 2nd half. ;D  Nice career scoring high for Matt Fegan with 19 points.  The Scots also outrebounded the Lords by a 39-31 margin.

It seems to me that Wooster quite often plays to the level of their competition this season.  ???  They never demonstrated any killer instinct today until the very end of the game.

Wooster is now 9-4, 4-0 NCAC. :)  Next up is a key road game at Allegheny, 3-1 NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 09, 2010, 09:58:11 PM
A whole bunch of observations about Wooster, most of which are not positive.

-- Today's game was one of the worst games I've seen Wooster play in a long time. Uninspired; poorly executed on offense -- just ugly. Even more so considering they should have been better prepared after nearly losing to Kenyon a month ago. It seems that almost every game Steve Moore has to be the one that fires up the team. Where is the emotional leadership? This is definitely one area where they miss Marty Bidwell, but this shouldn't be that hard. I think Brandon Johnson might fill this role, but I think his knee injury lessening his skills may make him feel less confident to do that. Plus, he hasn't played with most of the guys on the team before this year. To top it off, the bench not only can't play (with the exception of Matt Fegan), but they are lifeless on the bench. They miss Dustin Geitgey both coming off the bench and his energy while on the bench.

-- Wooster's bench is not very good. Claytor looks good some games, then others he looks lost. Mays has regressed since I saw him in the preseason and can't stay out of foul trouble.

-- One of the biggest mysteries to me has been the minutes Justin Warnes has been getting, many at the expense of Fegan. Warnes is useless on offense. You don't even have to guard him. A little birdie told me that at halftime Kenyon's coach told his players that #24 isn't very good. That is bad when the opposing coach is telling his players to ignore one of Wooster's players. And while he is a good defender, he isn't great, maybe marginally better than Fegan. Fegan even has more steals (7-2). Wooster's defense isn't their problem. In fact, their defense is better this year than it has been in a while. Get Fegan's offense on the floor, please?

-- But the biggest surprise has been the play of Nathan Balch. I don't like to single out players, especially at the Div. III, but man, he is shadow of the player he was last year. Obviously going 0-9 today makes this more obvious, but this has been the story all season long. He is shooting only 38 percent from the field and 36 percent from three-point range. A number of his shots today weren't even close. Last year he shot 51 percent from the field and 49 percent from three. He led Wooster in scoring in both NCAA Tournament games last year. I figured he would be better this year, considering last season was his first at Wooster. It hasn't worked out that way.

I'm not sure what the deal is with Wooster this year. They just aren't clicking like they should with the players they have back. Balch has to find his game and the bench needs to start producing. Wooster can't keep any kind of offensive momentum because when they have more than a couple of starters out of the game, their offense struggles.

On a good note, Brandon Johnson is looking better. Today was the first game where Wooster tried to push the ball up the floor. The problem is some guys didn't look very comfortable running the floor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 10, 2010, 09:22:28 AM
I look at a win as being a win.  Wooster put another win in the win column, regardless of how they may have played.  So did OWU. 

Thank heavens that at the Div III level, student athletes are just that - student athletes.  Maybe if they were being forced to be in the gym 10 hours a day, being paid/bribed by alumni, etc. you could expect them to post the numbers every day.  They are entitled to go cold or totally disappear sometimes, because athletics are not necessarily their main focus.  If they are ballplayers and you viewed them as being talented before, you'll see them come back. 

Case in point - Chris Luther.  Went stone cold for a couple games then came back for 25 points.  Balch is a solid player, and I'd take him any day.  The Big Red just don't need another player that size - we need a big man (oh, Danny boy!).

On the OWU - DU game yesterday, it was as I thought.  We generally contained the OWU offense except for a few back door cuts in the first half and the inside passes.  Thankfully, when the game started to slip away, the coaches put on a press that got us back into it.  Shooting was not pretty on either side of the court. 
We were totally outsized by Morris, Pellerite & Co., but athleticism kept us close.  We should have run more, but in the end, it was size that mattered.  Foul trouble trying to contain the bulk inside kept two of our main guys out of play for too long.
Great job stepping up by the freshmen and Farmer with another double.  Overtime was just a nanosecond away. 

Don't turn your backs, NCAC, the Big Red are moving up! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 10, 2010, 11:27:03 AM
Wittenberg's recent success from long distance makes me wonder....how do you think they'll play against Wooster this season. In year's past, Wittenberg did everything they could to minimize the number of possessions Wooster got and pound the ball inside every single time. It could be a couple of very entertaining games this season.

Of course, Wittenberg has to survive a mildly tough 3 game road stretch in conference play starting Wednesday at Denison, Saturday at Allegheny and then next Wednesday at Wabash (probably their second toughest road test of the season)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2010, 12:24:07 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 10, 2010, 11:27:03 AM
Wittenberg's recent success from long distance makes me wonder....how do you think they'll play against Wooster this season. In year's past, Wittenberg did everything they could to minimize the number of possessions Wooster got and pound the ball inside every single time. It could be a couple of very entertaining games this season.
What little I've seen of Witt lately suggests to me that some portion of their success is because they see a lot of zone defense, teams trying to minimize a height/bulk disadvantage.  A lot of those three-pointers are wide open, even uncontested to a degree.  Wooster never plays zone, so the question to me is how far out will they cover the Witt shooters?  It seems that the shooters are all willing to let fly from anywhere within 24 feet, kind of like Hallowell last season, and if Wooster defends out that far, it's going to be hard for Wickliffe et al. to control the paint.  This is exactly what Capital did to Wooster in the tournament last year, staying on Hallowell and Balch where ever they went.  Wooster got a lot accomplished in the paint, but not enough to win the game.  I expect the Scots would try something similar on Witt, and hope that Witt's guards can't compensate and that Wickliffe doesn't foul out. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2010, 10:48:28 PM
Wittenberg's Chris Sullivan is this week's NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html).  Sullivan was deadly from the arc, nailing a sprightly 10 of 15 three-pointers, accounting for 36 points in two Tiger victories this week.  Congratulations, Chris!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 12, 2010, 03:39:34 PM
Something very rare could go down in Richmond tomorrow night.  Wabash's Wes Smith (991) and Aaron Brock (992) are very much within range of 1,000 career points (http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=7668) and both could reach that milestone in the same game tomorrow evening.  Good luck to Wes and Aaron tomorrow night! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 12, 2010, 03:41:31 PM
Does Pat still track new additions to the Thousand Points Club? He was doing it for awhile via a front-page link.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 12, 2010, 04:04:06 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 12, 2010, 03:39:34 PM
Something very rare could go down in Richmond tomorrow night.  Wabash's Wes Smith (991) and Aaron Brock (992) are very much within range of 1,000 career points (http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=7668) and both could reach that milestone in the same game tomorrow evening.  Good luck to Wes and Aaron tomorrow night! 
That's pretty cool to have 2 players from the same team possibly join the club on the same night.  I wonder how rare of an occurance this is?  Good luck to Wes and Aaron in reaching such an accomplishment tomorrow!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2010, 04:58:59 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 12, 2010, 03:41:31 PM
Does Pat still track new additions to the Thousand Points Club? He was doing it for awhile via a front-page link.
http://www.d3hoops.com/milestones/2010
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 12, 2010, 05:02:38 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 12, 2010, 04:04:06 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 12, 2010, 03:39:34 PM
Something very rare could go down in Richmond tomorrow night.  Wabash's Wes Smith (991) and Aaron Brock (992) are very much within range of 1,000 career points (http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=7668) and both could reach that milestone in the same game tomorrow evening.  Good luck to Wes and Aaron tomorrow night! 
That's pretty cool to have 2 players from the same team possibly join the club on the same night.  I wonder how rare of an occurance this is?  Good luck to Wes and Aaron in reaching such an accomplishment tomorrow!

Per Brent's article on the Wabash website, Wabash has only had two players reach 1,000 points in the same season twice.  It has never happened in the same game in the 114 years that Wabash has been playing basketball. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 12, 2010, 05:05:22 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 12, 2010, 04:58:59 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 12, 2010, 03:41:31 PM
Does Pat still track new additions to the Thousand Points Club? He was doing it for awhile via a front-page link.
http://www.d3hoops.com/milestones/2010

Thanks, DC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2010, 05:18:31 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 12, 2010, 05:05:22 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 12, 2010, 04:58:59 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 12, 2010, 03:41:31 PM
Does Pat still track new additions to the Thousand Points Club? He was doing it for awhile via a front-page link.
http://www.d3hoops.com/milestones/2010

Thanks, DC.
Oh, and Pat, if you're reading this, please add George Raftis, Allegheny, 11/29 (http://www.alleghenysports.com/news/2009/11/29/MBB_1129095543.aspx).  I feel like there's one or two others from the NCAC who are missing; I'll give it some further thought.  Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 12, 2010, 06:17:31 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 12, 2010, 05:18:31 PM
Oh, and Pat, if you're reading this, please add George Raftis, Allegheny, 11/29 (http://www.alleghenysports.com/news/2009/11/29/MBB_1129095543.aspx). I feel like there's one or two others from the NCAC who are missing; I'll give it some further thought.  Thanks.

Dave Knapke form Kenyon is one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 12, 2010, 06:58:08 PM
Congrats to Chris Sullivan and also Katherine Hueter on the women's side for representing Wittenberg as NCAC players of the week. Keep up the good work Witt!

I'm wondering what it's going to take for Witt to get at least  a vote for the Top 25......they have 2 losses....yes one bad one at Hiram and one to 18th ranked Anderson!

A victory next Saturday???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2010, 07:04:58 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 12, 2010, 06:17:31 PM
Dave Knapke form Kenyon is one.
Thanks.  Dave reached 1000 was on 12/15. (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x31063.xml)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 13, 2010, 08:06:23 AM
Wow. That's about all I can say at this point.........

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/springfield-oh-sports/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on January 13, 2010, 08:31:54 AM
Ouch ... that's not something you expect from a fifth-year senior.  Regardless of which team you support, you can't be happy about seeing NCAC kids fail to take care of business in the classroom.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 13, 2010, 11:10:05 AM
Brown tried to allude in that article to the fact that Witt's depth should help overcome Hill's absense, but you don't have players with Hill's abilities sitting around  on the bench. 

Sullivan is certainly talented, but I'll be interested to see how teams defend him now that his fellow deep threat and scoring leader on the team is no longer on the floor.  Sullivan is by far leading the team from deep with 37 treys, but Hill had 27 and Nowicki is the next in line with 17.  That's a pretty significant drop off now with Hill's absense.  And not only will Witt miss Hill's 15 ppg, they will also miss his team leading 29 minutes/game he contributed. 

All in all, it's just sad to see a career come to an end under such unfortunate circumstances.  Hill gave up a lot to come back for one more year.  Too bad he couldn't stay on top of things to make it through to the end.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 13, 2010, 01:50:42 PM
Tonight, the alphabetical second five travel to play at the first five.  I'm sure I'm not the only one who noticed that... ::)

OWU (1-3) at Kenyon (0-4), 6pm -- Live Everything (KC) (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml) -- Game 1 of a men/women doubleheader
Oberlin (0-4) at Hiram (3-1), 7:30 -- Live Everything (HC) (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html)
Wabash (2-2) at Earlham (1-3), 7:30 -- Live stats, (EC) audio (http://goearlham.com/index.aspx?path=mbball&), (Wab) audio (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball)
Wittenberg (3-1) at Denison (3-1), 7:30pm -- Live stats and (Witt) audio (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html)
Wooster (4-0) at Allegheny (3-1), 7:30pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/) and (Woo) audio (http://wqkt.com/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 13, 2010, 04:35:21 PM
How do you decide to come back and play for a fifth year and then let that happen?  That's just unbelievable. 

Quote from: fantastic50 on January 13, 2010, 08:31:54 AM
Ouch ... that's not something you expect from a fifth-year senior.  Regardless of which team you support, you can't be happy about seeing NCAC kids fail to take care of business in the classroom.

Obviously, nobody wants to see a kid fail academically...but I think the judgement here could be deservedly more harsh than simply shaking one's head and saying "boy, that's unfortunate".  Hill was a senior...a fifth year senior at that.  He's hardly a kid.  He's not new to college life, and he's not new to juggling hoops and books.  You just can't let this happen.  Not in your last year and not in a year when the league is wide open. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 13, 2010, 07:33:34 PM
OWU 70, Kenyon 63...OWU continues the long climb back into the NCAC race, while Kenyon loses their 8th straight game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 13, 2010, 07:43:30 PM
Quick start for Wes Smith in Richmond tonight.  He's already got six points...three shy of 1,000.  Aaron Brock is scoreless so far.  Wabash leads 11-7 early at Earlham.  

8-0 run for Earlham ties the game at 15-15 and forces Wabash to get a timeout.  8:59 to play in the first half.  

8:35 left in the 1st half...Wes Smith gets a layup and scores his 1,000th and 1,001st career points.  Congrats Wes!  Wabash leads 19-17.  

Smith also has three steals and two blocks tonight...very active evening thus far for Wes.  Earlham just made their fourth 3 point FG of the evening (4-6 on the game so far) to pull back to 21-20.  The longball is keeping Earlham in it.  

4:24 left in the 1st hafl....Brock picks up his second foul and goes to the bench, likely for the duration of the half.  Two free throws puts the Quakers ahead 24-23.  Brock is scoreless so far tonight.  

Halftime in Richmond....Wabash finishes the half on a 11-0 run and goes to the break with a 36-28 lead over the homestanding Quakers.  Monster half for Wes Smith (19 pts, 7-10 FGs, 5-6 FTs, 3 STL, 2 BL).  Haltom chipped in with 9 points for Wabash, however Chase is 0-3 on his 3 pt FGs.  Dustin Rusk had a nice half for Earlham with 9 points and 4 rebounds.  

Wabash has remained hot to start the second half.  Aaron Brock scores his second basket of the half and Wabash leads 46-30.  Aaron is now four points shy of 1,000.  15:30 left to go.  

Earlham's announcing crew have taken to calling Wabash "Wes Smith College".  Wes is leaving an impression tonight.  

12:37 to play...Brock scores again.  Now just two points shy of 1,000.  

12:18....Two FTs for Brock and he joins the 1,000 point club as well!  Congrats Aaron!  56-38, Wabash leads.  Earlham's broadcast crew is getting incredulous about the refs and not calling fouls....despite the fact that the team foul count here in the second half is Wabash 6, Earlham 1.  Come on, fellas...just call the game.  

10:13 to play and Wabash has streaked ahead 61-40.  Timeout Earlham.  Wabash is shooting a balmy 57% for the game so far despite being just 1-9 on 3pt FGs.  

All done at Richmond...Wabash wins 73-48.  Smith and Brock both break the 1,000 point barrier.  LGs shoot 55% for the game while Earlham could only must a 28% shooting night.  Any road win is a good win.  Next up is Denison at Chadwick on Saturday afternoon...Wabash will look to get the Big Red monkey off their back. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 13, 2010, 08:00:00 PM
Wooster is having one of those cold shooting nights.  When the livestats were still up, Wooster was only 1-11 shooting from 3-point range and barely 30% overall from the field. 

Allegheny on the other hand is shooting close to 60% from the field.

As a result Wooster finds themselves down by 8.

And make it 6 with a chance to cut it to 5 with Balch at the line.  FT is good and it's down to 5!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 13, 2010, 08:03:33 PM
How will Wittenberg fare without Gregg Hill?  Well, they have three-pointers from five different players, they've shot 55% overall, they have just one turnover, and they're pounding Denison at the half 49-28.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 13, 2010, 08:05:23 PM
Well, the Gators score the last 4 points of the half and are up 9 at the half 37-28.

Wooster is in jeopardy of having their 25 game win streak over Gheny come to an end if they can't find their shooter's touch in the 2nd half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 13, 2010, 08:14:12 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 13, 2010, 08:03:33 PM
How will Wittenberg fare without Gregg Hill?  Well, they have three-pointers from five different players, they've shot 55% overall, they have just one turnover, and they're pounding Denison at the half 49-28.

The Big Red are saving it up for Saturday at Chadwick.    ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 13, 2010, 08:21:36 PM
The Big Red are saving it up for the new coaching staff next year.  Eight is enough.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 13, 2010, 08:26:06 PM
The as-yet unmentioned game has Hiram in the halftime lead, 34-27, over Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 13, 2010, 08:54:05 PM
Wittenberg ekes out the victory, 95-55.  Four in double figures, 12 threes made (28 att., 43%).  Five Tiger turnovers. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on January 13, 2010, 09:07:05 PM
Down by 8 with 6 minutes to play, the Scots hit enough shots down the stretch to get the "W" at Allegheny, 69-68, led by Ian Franks' 33 points.  Most nights, 4-for-25 shooting from behind the arc will doom a team, but not tonight, with Allegheny 3-of-16.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 13, 2010, 09:09:14 PM
Wittenberg shows some grit and wins ;D

Wooster survives >:(

Wittenberg gets Allegheny at Allegheny this weekend
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 13, 2010, 09:13:56 PM
Hiram runs away from Oberlin in the second half, leading by 22 with 4:00 left before emptying the bench and settling for the 74-58 victory.  Chris "Where Have I Been Lately?" Roberts had 19.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 13, 2010, 09:57:38 PM
Standings update:

Wooster 5-0
Hiram 4-1
Wittenberg 4-1
Allegheny 3-2
Denison 3-2
Wabash 3-2
OWU 2-3
Earlham 1-4
Oberlin 0-5
Kenyon 0-5
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 13, 2010, 11:03:57 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on January 13, 2010, 09:07:05 PM
Down by 8 with 6 minutes to play, the Scots hit enough shots down the stretch to get the "W" at Allegheny, 69-68, led by Ian Franks' 33 points.  Most nights, 4-for-25 shooting from behind the arc will doom a team, but not tonight, with Allegheny 3-of-16.

Led by Ian Franks might be an understatement in this game!  Ian pretty much single-handedly won this game for Wooster tonight including scoring 16 straight points at one point in the 2nd half to help the Scots eek out this win!

 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 14, 2010, 05:31:24 PM
With Franks' effort last night, I think it is safe to say that there has never been a more valuable player to Wooster's success than Franks is to this year's team. As great as Bryan Nelson, James Cooper, Tom Port, John Ellenwood, Ryan Gorman, etc., none of them, in my opinion, were asked to single-handily win games, with little help, like Franks has had to do several times this year. The closest is Nelson in 2003 when he won player of the year honors. But even that team had Matt Smith, Rodney Mitchell, Kyle Witucky, Blake Mealer and Matt Schlingman. This year's team has the talent, based on prior performances, to help share the load, but it just isn't happening.

This got me to thinking that I can't remember the last time that a Wooster team seemed so short-handed coming off the bench. Right now, the Scots' bench is probably one of the weakest in the league. How did this happen? Well, one reason is that an entire team of players that all had the ability to be in the rotation have left the team in the last three seasons.

From last year's team, Dustin Geitgey decided not to play this year. He would be taking all of Warnes minutes, and would provide an outside shooting threat. Greg Ross started the season with the team, but has now transferred. He shot over 60% last year and played in all but two games. Would likely be backing up Wickliffe or Hallowell at this point. Drew Sawyer, who was 6th on the team in scoring last year, is now at Urbana. Scott Voiers, a guard, is playing for B-W. Brian Frank is now at Kent St., sitting out a year. And Terrence Williams, who was one of the top scorers at the Div. II level of high school in Ohio, left school.

This year's senior class would not have a single player if Brandon Johnson didn't take a redshirt, and this was supposed to be one of the largest and deepest classes in Wooster history. In addition to Geitgey, the three big men of that class -- Dex Battista, Craig Elam and Robert Melick -- all never materialized. One player that did materialize, but with another team, is Nick Hershberger. He transferred to Muskingum after his freshman year. He is fourth in the OAC in scoring (15.9 ppg) and also averages 5.7 rebounds and leads the team in assists from the forward position.

Any one of these players would help right now. I think most of these players left thinking they were never going to be able to contribute, but that has proven not to be the case.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 14, 2010, 05:36:11 PM
I wish my team's "down year" meant being 5-0 and being and all alone atop the conference standings. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 14, 2010, 09:21:30 PM
Well said, Wally.  My heart is bleeding for Seinfeld and all the Whooster Whiners out there.  Enjoy the success you have had and quit complaining.  Try being a Big Red fan some day - or any other team that hasn't even been close to knowing what it's like to have a winning tradition.  You have a strong program and a coaching staff that knows what it is doing. 

DU's staff, on the other hand, has once again missed the boat on how to bring its talents together to win games.  As has become Big Red tradition, we have hit the mid-season point and our W-L record indicates it will be a struggle to try to get that 8th seed.  Early season hope has led to desperate, frenetic measures being taken by the brain trust on the bench and fans (and likely players) wondering why they continue to endure the pain. 

AD Larry Scheiderer needs to make a change here like he did with the football program.  It is clear after 7+ years that Ghiloni and Co. can't move this program forward.  He may have plenty of other positive qualities, but he can't win games and he can't keep players.  There have been plenty of solid recruits come through the program in the last 8 years that could have helped the program become more competitive and get closer to the top of the conference  I'm afraid the record here speaks for itself.  This dog don't hunt. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 15, 2010, 12:23:18 AM
So, in other words, it's only OK to complain about your team when your team is struggling just to make the top 8 in the conference?   :-\  ::)

And I'd hardly call Seinfeld's post 'whining'.

It's called having high expectations.  You know.  That's what accompanies a successful program? 

Furthermore, nothing that Seinfeld said in this post or previous posts is untrue.  Wooster has been hit hard in recent years by transfers and others that have either quit the team or dropped out of school altogether.  And you can really see the result by looking at what Wooster has on it's bench.  Heck, just look at the minutes the starters logged in their last game vs. Allegheny if you think Seinfeld is just blowing smoke!

And another one of Seinfeld's concerns surrounding this Wooster team is focused on the lack of a true leader.  There is no one on Wooster's roster that has stepped up to take that role.  It's been hashed and rehashed about the fact that Marty Bidwell's true value to this team was his leadership and I think a lot of us Scot fans undervalued the loss of that leadership.  Unfortunately, that is no longer the case...

Yes, Wooster is 5-0 and alone atop the NCAC which is familiar territory for the Scots.  But let's not kid ourselves here.  Wooster could very easily have 2, 3 or maybe even 4 losses in conference if they hadn't found a way to finish down the stretch.  Both games vs. Kenyon could have very easily gone the way of the Lords and Allegheny had the ball, down one with the shot clock turned off and a chance to win that game.  And the OWU game was very much in doubt until the last few minutes in that game as well.  So, please don't pretend that Wooster is coasting along to another NCAC crown, because that is far from the case.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 15, 2010, 08:19:23 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 14, 2010, 05:36:11 PM
I wish my team's "down year" meant being 5-0 and being and all alone atop the conference standings. 

Those of us who saw Tom Dinger play might disagree.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 15, 2010, 09:45:46 AM
ScotsFan - perhaps I was a bit harsh.  However, everything you said about Wooster can be said about Denison.  Three or four horses that have been run into the ground from overwork, no bench strength and high turnover. 

The difference is that Wooster is still winning, and likely will recover from what its fans might consider to be a down year.  There is a tradition of winning, and I commend the school, athletic department and coaches for establishing and carrying on that tradition.  In short, they know what they're doing!  I don't think you'll have any trouble continuing to get players to come to the school next year and I don't think you'll have difficulty getting 200 spectators to watch a home game on a Wednesday night. 

Big Red fans would love nothing more than to see the hard work being put in by its players result in a few more victories.  Our tradition, unfortunately, has been the opposite of yours, and my opinion is that with the quality of the University and the reputation it has, that tradition can change.  The school and athletic department have to want it to change, though.

   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 15, 2010, 01:29:37 PM
Quote from: GoRed on January 15, 2010, 09:45:46 AM
ScotsFan - perhaps I was a bit harsh.  However, everything you said about Wooster can be said about Denison.  Three or four horses that have been run into the ground from overwork, no bench strength and high turnover. 

The difference is that Wooster is still winning, and likely will recover from what its fans might consider to be a down year.  There is a tradition of winning, and I commend the school, athletic department and coaches for establishing and carrying on that tradition.  In short, they know what they're doing!  I don't think you'll have any trouble continuing to get players to come to the school next year and I don't think you'll have difficulty getting 200 spectators to watch a home game on a Wednesday night. 

Big Red fans would love nothing more than to see the hard work being put in by its players result in a few more victories.  Our tradition, unfortunately, has been the opposite of yours, and my opinion is that with the quality of the University and the reputation it has, that tradition can change.  The school and athletic department have to want it to change, though.

   

Fair enough.  I wasn't trying to dismiss your complaints.  I was just making the point that whether you support a successful program or not does not allow or disallow complaining about said program.  Depth is one of the key components that have kept Wooster and Wittenberg perched atop the NCAC for all these years.  No one else in the conference could consistently match the depth of those 2 programs.  But recently, both Witt and Woo have been experiencing a depletion of talented depth and the rest of the conference seems to be catching up.

As I said earlier in the season just before DU knocked off Wabash, their record might not indicate it, but they have shown that they can play with just about anyone.  Now, I don't know if Wednesday's lopsided result was a result of the starters starting to show signs of wearing down or what, but that was by far Denison's most lopsided defeat this season.  The question from here on out for the Big Red is how do they respond?  Kenyon lost 2 straight by a combined 63 points.  How did they respond?  By nearly knocking off Wooster at Wooster!  And they followed that up by nearly knocking off OWU.  Kenyon may not be getting the results, but they are far from throwing in the towel.  I hope that the Big Red aren't ready to throw in the towel just yet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HCfan on January 15, 2010, 03:11:09 PM
Hey guys...first time posting but I have been looking at the boards a long time.

GoRed-I am just wondering why having a 3-2 conference record and being tied for third right now is a reason to call for a struggle to get the 8th seed? Who cares what happened during the non-conference schedule, what matters now is what you have been doing in conference. And with the exception of the last game, Denison has looked good in the conference. I'm just saying that it seems a little early to start to panic this year, given the position you are in now. As far as Coach Ghiloni goes he seems like a good coach to me. He always has his teams ready to play no matter who they are playing. And I am assuming that you are saying he doesnt recruit by saying "This dog dont hunt." But you also say there have been plenty of people come through the program who could have helped the team...so who is getting them there if the DU staff isn't recruiting? If you have this much of a problem with the men's team then maybe you should go cheer for the women...they are pretty good from what I hear.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 15, 2010, 04:34:58 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 15, 2010, 01:29:37 PM
I hope that the Big Red aren't ready to throw in the towel just yet.

Maybe not just yet...but sometime before tipoff tomorrow would be nice.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 15, 2010, 07:12:04 PM
HC,

I love the womens' team at DU and would take Sara Lee as the coach of the men.  Maybe they can do a swap for the rest of the season to see what happens.

Anyone who thinks non-conference doesn't matter is deluding themselves.  It matters to the players' psyche and it , it matters to the fans and certainly matters for every team in the conference when it comes to tournament time.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HCfan on January 15, 2010, 09:05:08 PM
GoRed-

I respectfully disagree, it is important if used right to get you ready to play teams you play in your conference (same style of play). It only matters to the one or two teams that MAY get a Pool C bid...but the thing that gets most teams in the tourney is conference play. Apparently being 0-9 outside of the conference doesn't hurt Denison's psyche because again they are 3-2 in the conference and tied for 3rd place.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 15, 2010, 09:10:21 PM
Saturday games to grumble about:

Earlham (1-4) at Wooster (5-0), 1pm -- Live stats and audio (http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule); live alternate audio (http://www3.wooster.edu/woo91/) (COW student)
Denison (3-2) at Wabash (3-2), 3pm -- Live stats (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball) but no audio for some reason
Kenyon (0-5) at Oberlin (0-5), 3pm -- Live stats and video (http://www.goyeo.com/)
Hiram (4-1) at OWU (2-3), ~3pm -- Live Everything (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html) including live chatting via Twitter (http://twitter.com/StreamOWUSports) with OWU broadcast team -- Game 2 of a doubleheader; game 1 is can't miss women's game between Wittenberg (5-0) and OWU (6-0), same links apply
Wittenberg (4-1) at Allegheny (3-2), ~3pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/) and audio (Witt) (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html) -- Game 2 of a doubleheader; game 1 is another great women's game, between Kenyon (3-2) and 'Gheny (2-3)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2010, 09:32:56 PM
At the risk of more grumbling...I was on an airplane Wednesday night and missed the radio broadcast of Wooster's narrow win at Gheny. :(

A few observations from reviewing the boxscore:

Congrats to Ian Franks on a career night with 33 points! :)  He is clearly Wooster's leader at this point, as noted by Seinfeld and others, but much of this seems to occur by default as other Scots are not stepping up.  Most puzzling to me is the regression by Nathan Balch and Justin Hallowell this season after their strong performances last year.  Combined, Balch and Hallowell shot 5 of 19 from the floor at Gheny which explains Wooster's horrid 39% shooting as a team. ???

So, how did Wooster win a road game shooting only 39% when Gheny outshot them?

Wooster took great care of the ball with only 8 turnovers compared to 13 for the Gators.  Scots also made 19 of 22 free throws which resulted in a positive 4 point differential vs. Gheny.  Wooster only shot 16% on three pointers but they made 4 of them compared to only 3 hit by the Gators.  Bryan Wickliffe had a solid 10 points on strong 5 of 7 shooting.  Finally, Ian Franks either scored a bucket or drew a foul and made his charity tosses (10 of 11) when Wooster needed points to stay in the game.

One other troubling note about the Gheny boxscore.  As Seinfeld noted, the Wooster bench just keeps getting thinner and thinner.  While the coaches are correctly now playing Matt Fegan more minutes than Justin Warnes, Fegan was the only bench player to play significant minutes (25) against Gheny.  Josh Claytor only logged 8 minutes, Warnes had only 5 minutes and Jake Mays barely broke a sweat with just 3 minutes.  If you discount the last 3 players, Wooster essentially played a 6 man rotation vs. the Gators. ::)

As ScotsFan noted, Wooster has scratched out 5 wins while not playing particularly well this season.  If the Scots continue to shoot poorly and have turnover problems in future games, the NCAC title is very much up for grabs this season.  Ian Franks can't bail Wooster out every night - - some other players need to elevate their games.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 16, 2010, 06:04:15 AM
We'll need to plug into the big screens to get four Windows open for all the 3:00 action today.   

Witt at 'Gheny looks like the contest of the day to me.  A difficult three game stretch for the Gators, but if they can play a tight man and prevent the Tigers from getting the open looks from long range, this will be a tight one.  Hiram will have a tough time staying 4-1 at OWU, but consistency seems to be an issue with OWU so far this season.  Another close contest. 

I'm hoping for the best from Crawfordsville, but the LG's seem to be picking up steam and are going to be mad as hornets at the Big Red. 

Not sure what to make of Kenyon vs. Oberlin.  Would think the Lords will prevail handily, but Oberlin has a little more talent and strength underneath this year and may cause them some trouble.  The Scots will be 6-0 at 4:30 unless the power goes off in the gym. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 16, 2010, 11:49:39 AM
Good observatsion GoRed.  I'd have to say that I would agree with you for the most part.

I too think Witt @ 'Gheny is the game of the day.  Allegheny seems to play well in the friendly confines of Meadville already beating OWU and taking Wooster to the brink.  I think Witt will have their first true test to see how they will be faring without the services of Greg Hill.  Witt got a dress rehearsal at Denison on Wed., but 'Gheny should pose a bit more of a challenge to the Tigers than the Big Red.  No offense GoRed.  ;)

Hiram at OWU is also an intriguing matchup.  This is a must win really for both teams.  A loss for OWU would all but end their hopes of a conference championship.  And Hiram doesn't want to fall 2 games behind league leading Wooster.  IMO, OWU isn't neccessarily inconsistent.  They haven't won a whole lot, but they have been pretty competitive in most of their losses.  I think the Bishops are poised to make a bit of a run now that the conference schedule is in full bloom and a win today would be a great start for them.  Hiram, on the other hand, has been the epitomy of inconsistency this season.  They've looked great at times including their win over Witt and then they've looked flat out awful albeit in ugly wins over the likes of lowly Oberlin and Bluffton.  If the Pups play up to their potential, it could make for a long afternoon in Deleware for OWU.  But the question is, will the real Pups show up?

As for the game in C'ville, I'm not holding out much hope for your Big Red.  Wabash seems to be a different team at home as opposed to the road.  And add in the revenge factor and I think that you have the makings of a blowout for Wabash.  Sorry Red, but that's just how I see it.  ;)

And the Kenyon-Oberlin game will get one of these 2 off of the schneid in conference play.  Personally, I think it will be Kenyon, but who knows?

Just over an hour to tip at Timken.  Still trying to decide if I want to drag myself out of the house to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 16, 2010, 01:10:42 PM
Decided to stay home.  Missed the pre-game on the radio, but Brandon Johnson didn't start and has yet to play.  Anyone know if there was there any mention of an inury?

Game wise, Wooster's shooting woes have carried over early as they are only 4-14 to start the game and find themselves down 16-10 with 12 minutes to go.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

EDIT:

Nevermind on my question about Johnson.  Mike Breckenridge just answered my question.  Brandon apparently re-aggrevated his knee injury in the Allegheny game and isn't dressed.  He is going to be monitered on a daily basis for the remainder of the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 16, 2010, 01:21:47 PM
Radio announcer mentioned that Brandon Johnson has aggravated his knee injury and wil be reassessed game by game.

Wooster has rallied and now leads 25-20 with 5:45 left in the first half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 16, 2010, 01:33:52 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 31  Earlham 27

Wooster is being led by Bryan Wickliffe with 11 points, Ian Franks with 7 points and Nathan Balch with 5 points.

Earlham's top scorers are Ryan Taylor with 6 points and Marty Broderick with 6 points.

This was a ugly first half for Wooster as they shot only ~38% from the floor and they were a miserable 1 of 10 from the three point arc.  Scots did outrebound the Quakers by a 23-11 count in the half.

UPDATE:  Wooster now leads 55-38 with ~6 minutes left in the game.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 16, 2010, 01:37:37 PM
As noted, there is no audio or video from Chadwick today, but I'll be tweeting  (http://twitter.com/wallywabash)throughout the game.  Hey, if you're looking for almost-instant commentary, it's better than nothing.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 16, 2010, 02:29:35 PM
Final:  Wooster 63  Earlham 54 :)

Wooster plays better in the 2nd half and secures the win by controlling the paint and the boards (45 to 24).  Wooster actually had a 19 point lead before the Quakers narrowed the margin during garbage time.

Scots were led by Ian Franks with 19 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 17 points, 8 boards, Jake Mays with 8 points, Nathan Balch with 7 points and Josh Claytor with 6 points, 8 boards.

Coach Moore's record vs. Earlham over 23 years is now 45-0. :o

Earlham's top scorers were Ryan Taylor with 11 points and AJ Sutherlin with 10 points.

Wooster is now 11-4, 6-0 NCAC. ;D   Next up is a road game at Oberlin.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 16, 2010, 02:46:06 PM
Well, that is one of those games where you just walk away saying a win is a win.  Ugly as it was, it was still a win...  :-\

Wooster just can't seem to find a way to take the lid off of the basket from 3-point range.  As Breckenridge said in his broadcast, the Scots would struggle to shoot the ball in the ocean the way they've been going.  For the 2nd straight game, the Scots struggled from deep going a miserable 1-15 from beyond the arc.  Combined with the last game and Wooster is just 5-40 from deep!  :o  That's just unreal!

Wooster did finally recognize they had a decided advantage inside and began to exploit that advantage in the 2nd half which helped push their overall fg% to over 40% and helped them stretch a 4 point halftime lead out to 17.  The EC then chipped away at the lead in garbage time to make the score a bit more respectable looking.

I'm just dumbfounded by how poorly this team is shooting from beyond the arc.  I mean, this team shot nearly 44% from deep as a team a year ago and they have all of the same shooters back.  After todays miserable shooting performance, the Scots are a full 10 percentage points lower than their 3-point percentage from last season!  You keep waiting for guys like Balch and Hallowell to break out of their slumps, but it just hasn't happened and I'm beginning to wonder if it ever will???  ???

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 16, 2010, 04:49:07 PM
The other final scores:
Kenyon 78, Oberlin 64
Wabash 70, Denison 51
OWU 63, Hiram 51
Witt 85, Allegheny 73

Standings:
Wooster 6-0
Wittenberg 5-1
Hiram 4-2
Wabash 4-2
Denison 3-3
Allegheny 3-3
OWU 3-3
Kenyon 1-5
Earlham 1-5
Oberlin 0-6
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 16, 2010, 05:05:44 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 16, 2010, 02:46:06 PM
I'm just dumbfounded by how poorly this team is shooting from beyond the arc.  I mean, this team shot nearly 44% from deep as a team a year ago and they have all of the same shooters back.  After todays miserable shooting performance, the Scots are a full 10 percentage points lower than their 3-point percentage from last season!  You keep waiting for guys like Balch and Hallowell to break out of their slumps, but it just hasn't happened and I'm beginning to wonder if it ever will???  ???

I thought I'd look into this a bit, because you're right that it doesn't seem to make sense.  As you note, SF, last year the team shot approximately 44% from 3pt land, but that's not a direct apples-to-apples comparison of the leading shooters.  For example, Marty Bidwell (32-77, .416) and Dustin Geitgey (21-69, .304) both brought down the average of last year's team.

To try more of an apples-to-apples comparison, here's info on six shooters common to both teams (with Johnson's data from his full season in 2007-08):

Player         09-10 3pts (%)             08-09 3pts (%)            +/- % year-over-year

Franks               17-42 (40.5)                    31-82 (37.8)                           +2.7
Hallowell          37-103 (35.9)                  94-183 (51.4)                          -15.4
Balch                 25-69 (36.2)                  63-128 (49.2)                          -13.0
Fegan                20-48 (41.7)                    38-80 (47.5)                            -5.8
Johnson             11-36 (30.6)                    40-98 (40.8)                          -10.3
Evans                  3-14 (21.4)                    19-51 (37.3)                          -15.8

Summary:  113-312 (36.2)             285-622 (45.8)                         -9.6

Wow.  Five of these six are having a significantly worse shooting season than they have in previous years.  Four of them are shooting 10 or more percent below their pervious average, including both of the leading 3-pt shooters from the previous year.

Last year the Scots played 30 games, and the current year data above reflects the 15 games they have played so far this year.  Notice that this group of Scots is collectively shooting almost exactly the same number of 3 pointers as they did before (312 x 2=624 vs. 622), but they aren't making anywhere near as many of them.  If this group of current Scots were collectively shooting their (very good) historical average of nearly 46%, they would've made approximately 142 three-pointers this year at this point.  Those "missing" 29 three point buckets is basically the equivalent of 2 more made 3 point baskets per game.  Those extra six points could've come in handy at Albion, RMC, JCU, Kenyon and Allegheny.

Seeing 5 of 6 shooters posting significant shooting percentage declines seems to imply a non-random cause—like something team-wide.  Perhaps, even while taking the same number of three pointers, this group is taking more ill-advised three pointers, or are consistently being defended better at the perimeter, or perhaps they are simply practicing shooting less in practice.  I don't feel that I can really comment since I've barely been able to see the Scots in person this year, but you just wouldn't expect to see this many shooters having this much worse of a year without some sort of common cause.

Thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 16, 2010, 06:00:22 PM
Kind of a ho-hummer at Chadwick this afternoon.  Wabash jumped out to a 12-2 lead and was never challenged after that.  In the games that Wabash has lost to Denison recently, I don't believe Wabash matched DU's energy and it cost them.  Wabash came ready to play this afternoon and the result is what we'd probably expect from this matchup.  Kudos to Wabash for getting after it today and not letting Denison hang around and be confident in the second half. 

Aaron Brock (21 and 8) and Wes Smith (20 and 9) had strong games yet again for Wabash.  Chase Haltom was the only other Little Giant in double figures with 10 points today.  Dimonde Hale led Denison with 12 points. 

Wabash cooled off from the field today, shooting just 39.7%, well below their average percentage during this streak.  Denison actually outshot the Little Giants (42.3%), but that advantage was negated by Wabash's 43-28 rebounding edge. 

Next up for Wabash is a home contest against Wittenberg which will be a huge game for both teams.  Keep it going, LGs!   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 17, 2010, 11:47:06 AM
Wally,

Since you were at Chadwick yesterday, a couple of comments and questions for you:

According to the stats, most of the margin in the game came from the free throw line but the differential in 3-pointers made was 2:1.  Did the Big Red go zone or man-to-man on defense?   

The rebounding margin was huge, too, at 43-28.  I assume DU ran the same offense working the perimeter but being mainly out of position for rebounds?  (except for Larry Farmer, who does a nice job consistently)

Why didn't they play Mike Garabedian?  His stats were way down the last two outings but it would be out of character for Ghiloni to bench a guy completely.

And congrats on the win. I hope a season split of the matchup is the result we can expect next year too unless we take both. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 17, 2010, 12:25:36 PM
If memory serves, I think Denison was using a zone defense with an emphasis on doubling Wes Smith.  The last handful of games, Wes has been able to get the ball at about 20 feet from the basket and take his man on the dribble and get to the rim.  Yesterday, Denison was crashing on Wes whenever he put the ball on the floor and forcing him to pass out to other players.  Most of Smith's shots in the paint came in transition before Denison could get a defense set up. 

I don't know why Garabedian didn't play.  I'm assuming he was hurt and couldn't go, but I can't verify that.  I was surprised that he wasn't playing either as he flat out lit Wabash up in last year's game at Chadwick. 

Denison's offense, especially in the first half, was almost all on the perimeter.  Wabash did a good job of keeping the ball out of the painted area and forcing Denison take low percentage shots, hence the 17 first half points.  Denison did manage to get the ball down low in the second half and doubled their first half output.  Wabash certainly controlled the rebounds yesterday, but I think Wabash is a pretty good rebounding team.  Most of the time Wabash will have Brock, Burkett or Curosh, and Smith on the floor and those guys all do a good job on the glass. 

I think free throws have been a big key for Wabash's improvement this year.  I believe Wabash leads the league in FT%, and for as much as Wabash has concentrated on pounding the paint during their recent streak, converting those FT attempts is important and Wabash has been making the most of those chances. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 17, 2010, 04:08:00 PM
Thanks for the view, Wally.  And you couldn't be more right on the free throws. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2010, 11:10:51 PM
Grabbing your team by the scruff of its neck and dragging it nearly single-handedly to a victory not only helps maintain the conference lead, more importantly it can nab you the coveted NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html) trophy, as Wooster junior Ian Franks found out this week.  Franks, the first two-time honoree this season, poured in 33 points as the Scots nipped Allegheny, then added another 19 in a victory over Earlham.  Congratulations, Ian!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2010, 09:31:33 AM
I have to say, I'm kind of surprised at how Witt has done without their conference POY candidate, Greg Hill.  I really thought that Allegheny would give Witt a better game in Meadville, especially considering how well the Gators played against the Scots.  Now, the Tigers will get an even tougher test when they travel to C'ville on Wednesday.

If Witt can find a way to beat Wabash (who is always tough to beat at home), I think it might be time to start giving Witt some serious consideration as favorites to win the NCAC.  Hill or no Hill, the Tigers have been playing some really good basketball.  What is it?  Four straight games where they've shot over 50% from the field?  Wooster, on the other hand is setting records they don't want to be setting.  Their sparkling 6.7% effort from beyond the arc on Saturday was their lowest 3-point percentage in the last 10 years and their 1 made trey was their lowest since they made only 1-5 vs Emory & Henry in 2005.  The catch there is that E&H runs the 'system' and Wooster still put up 150 points in that game despite only one made trey!  I think it's pretty easy to say that Witt is playing the best basketball right now in the conference.  And uless Wooster finds their shooting touch in a big way, I'm having a hard time trying to convince myself that they can actually find a way to win their 6th straight NCAC championship.

That said, I think the Wabash/Witt game on Wed. could have a pretty big impact on Saturday's Witt/Woo showdown.  If Witt were to lose on Wed.  at Wabash, that would mean that the Scots could potentially open up a 3 game lead over Witt in the conference standings with a win in Springfield on Saturday!  The prospect of facing a 3 game deficit with a loss to Wooster could add a bit more pressure on the Tigers than going into that game knowing a win would put you in a tie for first! 

Somehow, I have a feeling that Witt will get it done on Wed. and Saturday's game will once again be another classic Witt/Woo clash with first place in the conference on the line.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 18, 2010, 10:24:54 AM
Quote from: GoRed on January 17, 2010, 04:08:00 PM
Thanks for the view, Wally.  And you couldn't be more right on the free throws. 

I actually just now realized that Denison was only 3-12 on FTs Saturday.  Ouch!  That's leaving a lot of points on the table. 

Quote from: ScotsFan on January 18, 2010, 09:31:33 AM
I think it's pretty easy to say that Witt is playing the best basketball right now in the conference. 

I don't think it's that easy.  There's some pretty good hoops being played out West right now. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 18, 2010, 01:55:06 PM
good and hoops can't be put together in the same sentence when that said team lost to Denison.....sorry wally!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 18, 2010, 02:16:12 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 18, 2010, 01:55:06 PM
good and hoops can't be put together in the same sentence when that said team lost to Denison.....sorry wally!

Sorry...I'll add emphasis where appropriate:

Quote from: wally_wabash on January 18, 2010, 10:24:54 AM
I don't think it's that easy.  There's some pretty good hoops being played out West right now. 

Hope that clears up the confusion.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2010, 03:01:46 PM
Trash talk in advance of a game that doesn't involve Wooster...I love it!

I dream of the day I can read some Hiram vs. Allegheny smack in here...but this'll do for now. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 18, 2010, 04:47:41 PM
true....right now Butler is in a pretty good stretch of basketball in the Horizon, but short of that.....nothing is too promising in Indiana ;D

Have to show a little trash talking every once in a while to keep things interesting.

In all seriousness, it should be a great game Wednesday night. Rebounding will tell the story of the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2010, 05:09:03 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 18, 2010, 10:24:54 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 18, 2010, 09:31:33 AM
I think it's pretty easy to say that Witt is playing the best basketball right now in the conference. 

I don't think it's that easy.  There's some pretty good hoops being played out West right now. 

Too bad that good hoops being played out west doesn't follow them when they travel east!  :P   ;)   8-)

Couldn't let a little trash talking go without my own contribution!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 18, 2010, 06:40:39 PM
We shall see if the LGs can take their stong play out on the road.  They didn't have much trouble with Earlham last week...less trouble than the Scots had (at home) with the Quakers.   :)

Right now (controversial statement alert!!) Wabash has the best player in the league (Smith), one senior who is playing inspired hoops (Brock), another who is coming on after a slow start (Haltom), and a boatload of young role players that are more than doing their job.  Things are meshing quite well right now in C'ville...it took longer to click this season than I thought it would, but they have it rolling right now.  Wednesday is the biggest test for Wabash since the Wooster game...I think they're ready. 

pennstghs is looking at rebounding on Wednesday...I'm looking at how well Wabash can disrupt Witt's distance game.  The Tigers are winning with the long ball this year.  We'll see if Wabash can take away some of those open looks.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2010, 07:01:07 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 18, 2010, 06:40:39 PM
pennstghs is looking at rebounding on Wednesday...I'm looking at how well Wabash can disrupt Witt's distance game.  The Tigers are winning with the long ball this year.  We'll see if Wabash can take away some of those open looks.  
The three-ball-center-pocket didn't seem to be a factor in Witt's win in Meadville.  They were pretty cold from outside while building up a pretty good lead; for example, they were just 3/15 in the first half but still led at the break by 13.  Rebounding margin of +15, and second-chance points of +12, seem to have been the decisive factors there.

One could attempt to write off Witt's win at Denison because it was Denison, but prior to doing so I'd encourage you to go take a look at that box score (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/statistics/09-10statistics/witm0113.htm).  It's pretty impressive.  Five turnovers, and two of them were made by some guy named Steven Heatherly (a JV, perhaps?) in his five-minute appearance.  Three of the five turnovers were in the last 6:27, by which time Witt led by 35.  55% shooting, +13 on the boards, 12 made threes from seven shooters, 26 assists on 38 buckets, it goes on and on.  All of this in the immediate wake of the sacking of Mr. Hill.  Tough to look at that and conclude that there's a better team in the conference right now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 18, 2010, 07:31:20 PM
While I grant that their schedule has not exactly been 'killers row', and getting blown out by Hiram is embarrassing, it mystifies me how the winningest program in d3, at 13-2 with an 8 game winning streak, can have ZERO points in the d3hoops.com poll! :o

I only had them 24th on my Posters' Poll ballot (Woo 25th), but still. ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2010, 08:08:49 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 18, 2010, 07:31:20 PMit mystifies me how the winningest program in d3, at 13-2 with an 8 game winning streak, can have ZERO points in the d3hoops.com poll!
Witt was in the polls for week 1 (#22) and week 2 (ORV).  I expect they'll get a few votes this week (week 7), and then if they win their next two games, they'll get plenty more votes next week.  That's a big 'if,' though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2010, 11:13:21 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 18, 2010, 06:40:39 PM
We shall see if the LGs can take their stong play out on the road.  They didn't have much trouble with Earlham last week...less trouble than the Scots had (at home) with the Quakers.   :)

Now we're comparing results against common opponents?  I'll just defer to that 18 point win Wooster had over your Lil Giants last month...  8-)

Furthermore, since we're playing the common opponent game, I don't think I need to remind you of the comparisons between Wabash's trip to Granville vs. Witt's trip to Granville...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 18, 2010, 11:27:38 PM
The thing about those games in December...is that they were in December.  

Easily riled is the Scots fan (or ScotsFan) that has to read about good things happening somewhere else in the league.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2010, 12:15:19 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 18, 2010, 11:27:38 PM
The thing about those games in December...is that they were in December. 
I could point out that there's just three days separating the most recent Witt and Wabash games vs. Denison, making for substantive comparison, even taking into account the fact that it was a road game for Witt and a home game for Wabash.

But I don't have to, since it'll all be irrelevant in less than two days.

In the meantime, does anyone besides me think that Wednesday's Wooster-at-Oberlin game looks like a trap game for the Scots?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2010, 01:30:46 AM
The new top 25 is out, with Wooster slipping quietly back in at #25 and Witterberg even more quietly re-entering the list with 3 votes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2010, 09:41:49 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 18, 2010, 11:27:38 PM
The thing about those games in December...is that they were in December.  

Easily riled is the Scots fan (or ScotsFan) that has to read about good things happening somewhere else in the league.   :)
Easily riled?  I know that reputation precedes me (guilty as charged  8-) ), but I would hardly include my little banter last night into that category.

Besides, I kind of started this whole thing by talking about good things happening down in Springfield.  Would that not be good things happening somewhere else in the league?  ;)

My overall thoughts wrt Wabash are that I would just like to see them get a solid win on the road.  Sure, they're playing some good basketball right now, but they have been doing it all at home.  Four of their five games on their current win streak were in the friendly confines of Chadwick and their only road game was at the EC.  A win tomorrow night over the hottest team in the league would go a long way in convincing me that they are for real.  But a nice win on the road would go a lot further IMO...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2010, 09:55:17 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2010, 12:15:19 AM
In the meantime, does anyone besides me think that Wednesday's Wooster-at-Oberlin game looks like a trap game for the Scots?

Oooooh!  The dreaded T word!  Given the way the Scots have been playing to the level of their opponents far too often this season, the T word is certainly not outside the realm of possiblility.

I will say, it would be nice to see the Scots show some signs of life here before their showdown at Witt on Saturday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 19, 2010, 12:32:13 PM
I agree with the statements that Wittenberg is playing the best basketball in the league "right now" but we'll see if they can withstand their 3rd straight road game tomorrow in Indiana.

I think Wittenberg still should be ranked in the Top 25, even over Wooster. Yes ScotsFan I said it. Wittenberg did have two bad losses, one over a ranked Anderson team and another bad one at Hiram. However, Wooster has had 4 losses total and even though they were highly ranked, they haven't done anything to merit the 24th overall ranking in the country. Now, if they win at Witt on Saturday, I will consider that a top win and that will end my argument. the John Carroll loss is diminishing as the weeks go on with every disappointing loss they suffer. I don't have a read on Wilmington yet......

I would tend to disagree with the Regional Rankings as well. Witt nowhere in the Top Ten is a joke and Penn State Behrend ranked number one, although I know nothing about them at all. History proves that teams from that conference haven't done so well in the NCAA tournament (i.e. Lake Erie College vs Witt)(PSU-Behrend vs Witt) in years past.

Also, I agree with DC's assessment. Wittenberg's great 3 point shooting is a direct result of their inside post play, which has given them so many open looks. I've said it all along this year, Witt struggled earlier in the year but once they pounded it down low and gained some respect from the defense and forced it to collapse, the 3 point shooting would open up. 2-3 zone doesn't work against Witt very well.......

Lastly, what happened to the NCAC Pick Em contest thisyear? No one to run it is my guess, but lets' get it going next year. I'll even pony up and volunteer if needed to run it!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2010, 01:00:22 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 19, 2010, 12:32:13 PM
I agree with the statements that Wittenberg is playing the best basketball in the league "right now" but we'll see if they can withstand their 3rd straight road game tomorrow in Indiana.

I think Wittenberg still should be ranked in the Top 25, even over Wooster. Yes ScotsFan I said it. Wittenberg did have two bad losses, one over a ranked Anderson team and another bad one at Hiram. However, Wooster has had 4 losses total and even though they were highly ranked, they haven't done anything to merit the 24th overall ranking in the country. Now, if they win at Witt on Saturday, I will consider that a top win and that will end my argument. the John Carroll loss is diminishing as the weeks go on with every disappointing loss they suffer. I don't have a read on Wilmington yet......

Surprisingly, I would agree with you penn.  Witt really only has one loss that doesn't look all that good and that was their blowout loss at Hiram.  Anderson looks for real and I wouldn't look at that as a bad loss.

I think Wooster is getting the benefit of the doubt because they played one of the toughest non-conference schedules in the nation.  Also, it didn't hurt that they were a pre-season top 10.

I think what has hurt Witt is that they hadn't played anyone of any significance.  The voters reluctantly ranked them #22 when they were 4-0, but then the Tigers proceeded to lose 2 of their next 3 and the losses weren't even close.  And now Witt has rattled off 8 in a row, but has there been a signature win among those?  I just think in the eyes of the voters, the jury is still out.

I also think the same could be said about Wooster.  The voters are still reluctant to move them up too far as well.  Wooster has won 6 in a row and like Witt, there is no win among those 6 that stands out.  The result is that Wooster has been sitting stagnent between #26 and #27 for about the last 3 weeks in the poll.  There have been teams ranked ahead of them drop below them and likewise, teams ranked below them move ahead of them.  Finally, this week, as a result of so much attrition, Wooster kind of backed into the poll at #25.  Hardly a vote of confidence IMO.

I think both Witt and Woo could help themselves a lot with a win on Saturday.  Of course, Witt will have their hands full on Wed. at Wabash.  If they can get by the Lil Giants and beat Wooster on Saturday, I think they would definitely warrant top 25 consideration.  However, a split won't be enough.  And if the Scots can finish the week off 2-0, that could really help them to solidify their position in the top 25 in the eyes of the voters.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2010, 01:20:18 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 19, 2010, 12:32:13 PM
I would tend to disagree with the Regional Rankings as well. Witt nowhere in the Top Ten is a joke and Penn State Behrend ranked number one, although I know nothing about them at all. History proves that teams from that conference haven't done so well in the NCAA tournament (i.e. Lake Erie College vs Witt)(PSU-Behrend vs Witt) in years past.


The poll that is put together by knightslappy on the GL Region board is just the regional RPI rankings that are based on SOS numbers.  This is only one of the criteria that the regional rankings committees use when they release their NCAA regional rankings. 

As for the one sac posted, that is strictly based on win percentage.  PSU-B had the highest win percentage in the GL Region at 10-2.  But the Lions sufferred their 3rd in-region loss last night at home to a bad Fransiscan team.  So as it stands, Witt is #2 behind Calvin in GL regional win-percentage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on January 19, 2010, 01:43:56 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 19, 2010, 01:20:18 PM
PSU-B had the highest win percentage in the GL Region at 10-2.  But the Lions sufferred their 3rd in-region loss last night at home to a bad Fransiscan team.  So as it stands, Witt is #2 behind Calvin in GL regional win-percentage.

I believe Franciscan is still an out-of-region-provisional so PSU-B is not hurt by that loss (and a very bad loss is was).

Quote from: pennstghs on January 19, 2010, 12:32:13 PM
I would tend to disagree with the Regional Rankings as well. Witt nowhere in the Top Ten is a joke and Penn State Behrend ranked number one, although I know nothing about them at all. History proves that teams from that conference haven't done so well in the NCAA tournament (i.e. Lake Erie College vs Witt)(PSU-Behrend vs Witt) in years past.

The big problem for Wittenberg (who IS ranked 10th) in the regional rankings is their strength of schedule, which ranks as the 33rd toughest (or 11th easiest) in the region. They still have to play Wooster and Wabash twice, which should help their schedule difficulty.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 19, 2010, 01:51:55 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 18, 2010, 07:31:20 PM
While I grant that their schedule has not exactly been 'killers row', and getting blown out by Hiram is embarrassing, it mystifies me how the winningest program in d3, at 13-2 with an 8 game winning streak, can have ZERO points in the d3hoops.com poll! :o

I only had them 24th on my Posters' Poll ballot (Woo 25th), but still. ???

If the winningest program in D3 isn't getting votes, then it means that the voters are doing their jobs -- which is to vote on this year's Top 25, not 1990's Top 25 or 1970's Top 25 or 1930's Top 25.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 19, 2010, 02:08:36 PM
Slappy-

A while ago you posted a table with OWPs, OOWPs, RPIs and the like for the NCAC.  Is there a site where I can look that info up, or is this something that you're tracking on your own? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2010, 02:11:57 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on January 19, 2010, 01:43:56 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 19, 2010, 01:20:18 PM
PSU-B had the highest win percentage in the GL Region at 10-2.  But the Lions sufferred their 3rd in-region loss last night at home to a bad Fransiscan team.  So as it stands, Witt is #2 behind Calvin in GL regional win-percentage.

I believe Franciscan is still an out-of-region-provisional so PSU-B is not hurt by that loss (and a very bad loss is was).


Oops.  Missed that Fransiscan is still a provisional DIII affiliate.  Personally, I think it's just a matter of time before PSU-B is exposed by some of the better teams in the AMCC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on January 19, 2010, 02:28:45 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 19, 2010, 02:08:36 PM
Slappy-

A while ago you posted a table with OWPs, OOWPs, RPIs and the like for the NCAC.  Is there a site where I can look that info up, or is this something that you're tracking on your own? 

I'm tracking it on my own, but I'll get another NCAC update posted on here this afternoon/evening if you'd like.

Quote from: ScotsFan on January 19, 2010, 02:11:57 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on January 19, 2010, 01:43:56 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 19, 2010, 01:20:18 PM
PSU-B had the highest win percentage in the GL Region at 10-2.  But the Lions sufferred their 3rd in-region loss last night at home to a bad Fransiscan team.  So as it stands, Witt is #2 behind Calvin in GL regional win-percentage.

I believe Franciscan is still an out-of-region-provisional so PSU-B is not hurt by that loss (and a very bad loss is was).


Oops.  Missed that Fransiscan is still a provisional DIII affiliate.  Personally, I think it's just a matter of time before PSU-B is exposed by some of the better teams in the AMCC.

I hold the same opinion, although they played a very tough game with Medaille early in the year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 19, 2010, 02:44:21 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on January 19, 2010, 02:28:45 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 19, 2010, 02:08:36 PM
Slappy-

A while ago you posted a table with OWPs, OOWPs, RPIs and the like for the NCAC.  Is there a site where I can look that info up, or is this something that you're tracking on your own? 

I'm tracking it on my own, but I'll get another NCAC update posted on here this afternoon/evening if you'd like.

That would be great if you get a chance.  Much love for fellow stat geeks.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on January 19, 2010, 02:45:27 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on January 19, 2010, 02:28:45 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 19, 2010, 02:08:36 PM
Slappy-

A while ago you posted a table with OWPs, OOWPs, RPIs and the like for the NCAC.  Is there a site where I can look that info up, or is this something that you're tracking on your own? 

I'm tracking it on my own, but I'll get another NCAC update posted on here this afternoon/evening if you'd like.

Well, I had a quick minute so I just went ahead and did it.

WP, OWP, and OOWP are for in-region contests only.

REG  Rank   Team         WP       OWP    OOWP     RPI   NAT   CON Status    REG   OVR
GL   4    Wooster       .7857   .4808   .5357   .5707   072   1   A         11-3  11-4
GL   10   Wittenberg    .8182   .4462   .4994   .5525   110   2   C   070   9-2   13-2
GL   17   Wabash        .6923   .4539   .4915   .5229   164   3   C   121   9-4   9-5
GL   18   Ohio Wesleyan .3846   .5974   .4758   .5138   183   4   C   138   5-8   6-9
GL   22   Allegheny     .4000   .5565   .4828   .4990   215   5   C   167   4-6   6-8
GL   25   Hiram         .5385   .4356   .4887   .4746   261   6   C   208   7-6   7-8
GL   34   Kenyon        .2500   .4895   .4771   .4265   330   7   C   274   3-9   4-10
GL   37   Denison       .2143   .4790   .4747   .4118   350   8   C   292   3-11  3-12
GL   39   Earlham       .2308   .4610   .4705   .4058   359   9   C   298   3-10  3-12
GL   40   Oberlin       .2857   .3974   .4663   .3867   374   10  C   309   4-10  4-11

Rank = Rank in region
NAT  = Rank in country
Status: C # = Rank in Pool C.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2010, 03:07:24 PM
Thanks, Dean.  ;)

We hear a lot about how tough Wooster's schedule is (and it has been, no doubt), but look at what OWU and to a lesser extent Allegheny have gone up against.  Of course, one of Wooster's tougher games (UST) was extraregional and thus not reflected above, but then again so was OWU's game vs. WashU.  The Bishops are battle-tested, and I think they may be on the verge of pulling it all together and going on a run. 

Quote from: KnightSlappy on January 19, 2010, 02:45:27 PM
GL   40   Oberlin       .2857   .3974   .4663   .3867   374   10  C   309   4-10  4-11
"C" is not a letter I associate with Oberlin, in any context. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 19, 2010, 03:10:14 PM
David, if I didn't know better I'd think that you are the Bishop.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2010, 05:40:21 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on January 19, 2010, 02:28:45 PM
I hold the same opinion, although they played a very tough game with Medaille early in the year.

Yes, but FWIW, I'm not convinced Medaille is all that either.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2010, 05:42:12 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2010, 03:07:24 PM
The Bishops are battle-tested, and I think they may be on the verge of pulling it all together and going on a run. 


How much longer are you going to hold out hope for the Bishops putting it all together.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on January 19, 2010, 06:25:35 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 19, 2010, 05:40:21 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on January 19, 2010, 02:28:45 PM
I hold the same opinion, although they played a very tough game with Medaille early in the year.

Yes, but FWIW, I'm not convinced Medaille is all that either.

Fair enough, but then who are the 'better teams in the AMCC' that will expose PSU-Behrend?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2010, 06:30:47 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 19, 2010, 05:42:12 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2010, 03:07:24 PM
The Bishops are battle-tested, and I think they may be on the verge of pulling it all together and going on a run. 


How much longer are you going to hold out hope for the Bishops putting it all together.  ;)
:)  I keep expecting Hiram to live up to their potential, too.  What can I say; ever the optimist, I suppose.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 19, 2010, 09:29:29 PM
Mr. Sager - the point you made about a team with a high historical winning percentage not getting votes should be exactly why a team such as WOOSTER should not be ranked. You shouldn't get benefit of the doubt votes for losses versus tough teams. My point was that Wittenberg should at least be getting votes based on their performance THIS year.

OWU is a gritty team, but like I said before they have a lot of matchups that teams can exploit, such as guard oriented offeenses having their way
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pufin on January 20, 2010, 09:26:37 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2010, 03:07:24 PM

We hear a lot about how tough Wooster's schedule is (and it has been, no doubt), but look at what OWU and to a lesser extent Allegheny have gone up against.  Of course, one of Wooster's tougher games (UST) was extraregional and thus not reflected above, but then again so was OWU's game vs. WashU.  The Bishops are battle-tested, and I think they may be on the verge of pulling it all together and going on a run. 


I saw that right away, too. But make sure you look at the OOWP as well. OWU's OOWP is among the bottom four of the conference. So, OWU is winning against teams with good records, but those good records are coming aginst bad teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2010, 09:40:12 AM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on January 19, 2010, 06:25:35 PM
Fair enough, but then who are the 'better teams in the AMCC' that will expose PSU-Behrend?

I should have phrased that a bit differently seeing as how I don't really think too highly of the AMCC as a whole.  ;)  Heck, PSU-B was exposed by one of the weaker teams in the conference.  Because of that, I see them struggling not to rack up 2-3 more losses by the time it's all said and done.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 20, 2010, 09:58:18 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 20, 2010, 09:40:12 AM
I should have phrased that a bit differently seeing as how I don't really think too highly of the AMCC as a whole.  ;) 

Something about rocks and glass houses....I don't know if you've looked around at our league over the last handful of years but the NCAC, as a whole, doesn't lift too many eyebrows either. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2010, 10:05:35 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 19, 2010, 09:29:29 PM
Mr. Sager - the point you made about a team with a high historical winning percentage not getting votes should be exactly why a team such as WOOSTER should not be ranked. You shouldn't get benefit of the doubt votes for losses versus tough teams. My point was that Wittenberg should at least be getting votes based on their performance THIS year.


Personally, I think it has to do with pre-season polls.  IMHO, I do not like pre-season polls in any sport at any level.  Sure, they're fun for the fans to talk about, but they also give cause to a lot of teams being over-rated and a lot of other teams being under-rated.  Look at traditionally strong teams like JCU and Wooster from our neck of the woods or Wheaton from the midwest.  All 3 were in the top 15 in the pre-season poll.  Had the first poll come out after the new year, none of them would have likely been ranked.  But because of how highly they were ranked in the pre-season poll, it has taken them longer to drop out.

On the other hand, you have a team like Eastern Mennonite who wasn't even on the radar of the pre-season poll.  Yet, here we are halfway through January and they are still undefeated vs. D3 opponents including the #12 team in the country and the previous #1 team in the country.  And they are still ranked 4 spots below R-MC whom they beat soundly BTW and 3 spots below WashU with 2 losses to D3 opponents.  Again.  This is because EMU wasn't even a blip on the radar in the pre-season poll and has had to slowly climb their way up the ladder.

This is why I have never been a big fan of pre-season rankings.  You never can tell when a team might come from nowhere that nobody was expecting.  And likewise, you can never tell whether certain newcomers could make immediate impacts for certain teams just as you can never be certain how losses to graduation could affect certain teams.  Using Wooster as an example, the Scots lost just one starter and had Brandon Johnson coming back.  Certainly, looking at last season, it's not that inconcievable to think that Wooster could be a top 10 team with the talent they had returning.  But the impact of the loss of Bidwell has been far greater than anyone really anticipated.  Thus, their record and their inconsistent play has reflected that.

Anyways, it's the regional rankings you should be focused on penn.  Those are the rankings that have a direct impact on the NCAA tournament.  Not the D3hoops top 25 poll.  And your Tigers did receive 3 votes in the latest poll FWIW...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2010, 10:25:34 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 20, 2010, 09:58:18 AM
Something about rocks and glass houses....I don't know if you've looked around at our league over the last handful of years but the NCAC, as a whole, doesn't lift too many eyebrows either. 

Well, maybe you're right wrt the lower tier teams in our respective conferences being on par with each other.  However, IMO, it is the upper tier teams that set the NCAC above the AMCC.  To prove my point, you don't have to look any further than the NCAA tournament.  How many teams from the AMCC have advanced to the final four in the last decade?  Heck, how many teams from the AMCC have made it even just out of the first round? 

The NCAC may not be the deepest conference or raise a lot of eyebrows as you say, but I would still say we stack up better than the AMCC top to bottom.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 20, 2010, 12:19:01 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 20, 2010, 10:05:35 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 19, 2010, 09:29:29 PM
Mr. Sager - the point you made about a team with a high historical winning percentage not getting votes should be exactly why a team such as WOOSTER should not be ranked. You shouldn't get benefit of the doubt votes for losses versus tough teams. My point was that Wittenberg should at least be getting votes based on their performance THIS year.


Personally, I think it has to do with pre-season polls.  IMHO, I do not like pre-season polls in any sport at any level.  Sure, they're fun for the fans to talk about, but they also give cause to a lot of teams being over-rated and a lot of other teams being under-rated.  Look at traditionally strong teams like JCU and Wooster from our neck of the woods or Wheaton from the midwest.  All 3 were in the top 15 in the pre-season poll.  Had the first poll come out after the new year, none of them would have likely been ranked.  But because of how highly they were ranked in the pre-season poll, it has taken them longer to drop out.

On the other hand, you have a team like Eastern Mennonite who wasn't even on the radar of the pre-season poll.  Yet, here we are halfway through January and they are still undefeated vs. D3 opponents including the #12 team in the country and the previous #1 team in the country.  And they are still ranked 4 spots below R-MC whom they beat soundly BTW and 3 spots below WashU with 2 losses to D3 opponents.  Again.  This is because EMU wasn't even a blip on the radar in the pre-season poll and has had to slowly climb their way up the ladder.

This is why I have never been a big fan of pre-season rankings.  You never can tell when a team might come from nowhere that nobody was expecting.  And likewise, you can never tell whether certain newcomers could make immediate impacts for certain teams just as you can never be certain how losses to graduation could affect certain teams.  Using Wooster as an example, the Scots lost just one starter and had Brandon Johnson coming back.  Certainly, looking at last season, it's not that inconcievable to think that Wooster could be a top 10 team with the talent they had returning.  But the impact of the loss of Bidwell has been far greater than anyone really anticipated.  Thus, their record and their inconsistent play has reflected that.

Anyways, it's the regional rankings you should be focused on penn.  Those are the rankings that have a direct impact on the NCAA tournament.  Not the D3hoops top 25 poll.  And your Tigers did receive 3 votes in the latest poll FWIW...  ;)

Great post, ScotsFan. I'm in complete agreement with you; I think that the preseason poll ends up skewing in-season polls, often for months after play begins in the cases of certain teams (e.g., Eastern Mennonite). However, I do understand why Pat does a preseason poll and commences the week-to-week continuity of the Top 25 poll with it: It's a great attention-getting device for the site at the outset of the season and it follows the calendar used by polls on other levels of college basketball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2010, 01:18:21 PM
Quote from: pufin on January 20, 2010, 09:26:37 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2010, 03:07:24 PM

We hear a lot about how tough Wooster's schedule is (and it has been, no doubt), but look at what OWU and to a lesser extent Allegheny have gone up against.  Of course, one of Wooster's tougher games (UST) was extraregional and thus not reflected above, but then again so was OWU's game vs. WashU.  The Bishops are battle-tested, and I think they may be on the verge of pulling it all together and going on a run. 


I saw that right away, too. But make sure you look at the OOWP as well. OWU's OOWP is among the bottom four of the conference. So, OWU is winning against teams with good records, but those good records are coming aginst bad teams.
I think what you're seeing there is the effect of the conference schedule.  So far Wooster has played OWU, 'Gheny, Earlham, Wabash, and Kenyon 2x.  OWU has played Wooster, Witt, Gheny, Denison, Kenyon and Hiram.  Throw out the common opponents and you have Woo vs. Wabash, OWU, EC and a second dose of Kenyon, and OWU vs. Woo, Witt, DU and Hiram.  OWU's NCAC opponents, excluding DU, have high OWPs and low OOWPs, whereas Wooster's opponents, excluding Wabash, have low OWPs and middling to high OOWPs.   

The non-conference schedules of these two were comparable in difficulty.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2010, 02:01:54 PM
Tonight's menu:

Appetizer: Kenyon (1-5) at Earlham (1-5), 7:30pm -- Live stats and audio (http://goearlham.com/index.aspx)
Meat: Wittenberg (5-1) at Wabash (4-2), 7:30pm -- Live everything (Wab) (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball/schedule) (note that Wally's Twitter feed gets a Wabash.edu link!) plus live audio (Witt) (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/sportsnetwork/)
Vegetables: Wooster (6-0) at Oberlin (0-6), ~8pm -- Live everything (OC) (http://www.goyeo.com/) plus live audio (COW) (http://wqkt.com/) -- game 2 of an OC/COW doubleheader (women's game at 6)
Dessert: OWU (3-3) at Denison (3-3), ~8pm -- Live stats and audio (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html) -- game 2 of a doubleheader (DU women vs. Earlham at 6)
Cigars & Brandy: Allegheny (3-3) at Hiram (4-2), ~8pm -- Live everything (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html) -- game 2 of a doubleheader (HC women vs. OWU at 6)

Bon appétit!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 20, 2010, 02:33:21 PM
All told, that's a pretty solid slate of games tonight. 

In the interest of full disclosure, while my Tweetstream did get linked on the Wabash page (talk about your pleasant surprises!), I will not be in attendance tonight.  I'm on a plane during gametime tonight.  The temptation to use my phone to follow livestats during the flight is enormous.   :)

My in-game tweets will return for the 1/27 game vs. OWU. 

Go Bash, beat Witt! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 20, 2010, 02:51:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2010, 12:15:19 AM
In the meantime, does anyone besides me think that Wednesday's Wooster-at-Oberlin game looks like a trap game for the Scots?

You know, I kind of chuckled this one away but....the New Orleans Saints are one game away from the Super Bowl, Tiger Woods is a sex addict of all things, and Republican Senators are being elected in the bluest of blue states.  The world is a crazy place right now.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 20, 2010, 06:31:50 PM
To redeem my karma  point......wally I will take your role and keep periodic updates on the forum tonight from the Witt/Wabash game. This of course is pending the "live" video feed that DC implies will be working.....

Having not seen Wabash yet this year, it will be interesting to see how they match up with Witt. Probably one of the more deep teams I'm guessing Witt has faced so far, short of possibly Capital of even Anderson
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 20, 2010, 07:42:34 PM
Wittenberg has started it out forcing things inside to Cooper and is ahead 7-5 early.

Couple of comments.....where is the crowd, it doesn' tlook like this "hyped" game is drawing a huge crowd.

Also, can the video producers quit going to a under the basket camera as the viewpoint they have is awful

Update: 11:31 min to go in the first half:
-- Witt is up 13-9 with Chris Sullivan continuing his hot shooting as he is 2-2 from 3 point range tonight with 9 points already

8 minutes to go--
wabash is on a run led by offensive rebounds to take a 18-16 lead

3:50 to go in the half, Wabash up 26-20 after Wes Smith gets on the scoreboard finally. Sullivan has cooled off a little, missing his last 3 shots. Wittenberg needs to keep pounding the post
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 20, 2010, 08:10:24 PM
I so hate that I'm not at this game right now. Go Bash!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2010, 08:24:48 PM
At the Half: Wabash 31  Wittenberg 24

~12 mins left:  Wabash 43  Witt 43

Witt led 45-43 before Wabash regained the lead
8:24 left   Bash 49  Witt 47

was tied at 49-49, Bash on a 4-0 run
6:58 left  Bash 53  Witt 49
5:14 left  Bash 57  Witt 49, now an 8-0 run
3:45 left  Bash 57  Witt 52, David Hieber three pointer
3:10 left  Bash 59  Witt 52, Ben Burkett layup for Bash
2:16 left  Bash 61  Witt 54
0:57 left  Bash 62  Witt 54
0:41 left  Bash 64  Witt 54  Brock 2 free throws for Bash
0:24 left  Bash 64  Witt 57  Tigers hit three pointer

FINAL:  Wabash 64  Wittenberg 57  Nice win for the Little Giants as they knock off the Tigers
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2010, 08:26:49 PM
The women's games at both Oberlin and Hiram went to OT, so those men's games are late starters.  That means that those of you watching the Witt/Wabash game (or following Kenyon/Earlham) should be able to watch the second half of either Woo/Oberlin or Gheny/Hiram afterwards. 

Kenyon leads Earlham 41-28, 16:57 left in the 2nd, while OWU is out to a 21-14 lead at Denison, 9:55 left in the 1st.

UPDATES: Kenyon is up 21 inside the final minute, putting the finishing touches on a victory at Earlham.  FINAL SCORE: Kenyon 77, Earlham 56
OWU leads Denison 42-29 at the half.
Gheny is up 9 on Hiram with about 7 to go before the half.
Wooster leads Oberlin by 10 with about 5 left in the 1st half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 20, 2010, 08:58:53 PM
My video feed went blank all of a sudden, so I have been sparse with my comments. Wittenberg cut down the lead and actually took the lead but Wabash took a big run to take a 8 point lead.

As I stated earlier the main component in the Wabash victory tonight was rebounding, specifically offensive rebounds. This could be due to more energy by Wabash but I think a lot of it had to do with Wittenberg playing mainly a 2-3 Zone defense, which for basketball gurus out there is tougher to rebound in because of the difficulty of matching up in order to block out properly.

Wittenberg not shooting their normal 50% from the field certainly didn't help things as well.

This makes the game Saturday vs Wooster even more crucial to Wittenberg as a 3 game deficit to Wooster would be probably insurmountable to come back from. Hopefully a return to Springfield after a 3 game road trip will be just what the doctor ordered. Also, I will not speak of Top 25 for Wittenberg for a long time!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2010, 09:02:29 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 32  Oberlin 29 ::)

Wooster is being led in scoring by Ian Franks with 12 points, Matt Fegan with 9 points and Justin Hallowell with 7 points.

For the Yeomen, Andrew Fox with 13 points and Josh Merritt with 10 points are the top scorers.

Scots did not shoot well in the half, only 42%, and gave up too many inside shots to the Yeomen.

Wooster also had 10 turnovers in the half which is way too high. ???

UPDATE:  Wooster starts 2nd half with a 12-1 run.  ~14 mins left:  Wooster 44  Oberlin 32
9:07 left  Wooster 50  Oberlin 41
6:20 left  Wooster 55  Oberlin 44,  Scots not playing well but likely to get the win
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCAC4Life on January 20, 2010, 09:04:01 PM
Perhaps we can say that Wittenberg has issues with a post oriented offense?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2010, 09:09:32 PM
Halftime in Hiram: Gheny leads 38-29.

Final in Granville:  OWU 80, Denison 63.

Final in the Doggie Dome:  Allegheny 75, Hiram 61.  Gheny had seven players score between 8 and 13 points.

Wooster is about to go 7-0 in the conference and establish a full 2-game lead, and I would describe them as "reeling." 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2010, 10:06:07 PM
Final:  Wooster 66  Oberlin 58 ::)

Wooster gets the "W" despite a horrible performance.  Scots shot only 37% from the floor and had 18 turnovers. ???  Despite lots of open looks against Oberlin's zone, Wooster only made 9 of 32 three pointers (28%).

Wooster was led by Ian Franks with 21 points, Matt Fegan with 9 points and Justin Hallowell with 9 points.

Oberlin's top scorers were Andrew Fox with 19 points and Josh Merritt with 16 points.

Wooster is now 12-4, 7-0 NCAC :)  Next game at Wittenberg on Saturday.  If Wooster doesn't shoot better and reduce their turnovers, they may get drilled in Springfield. :-[

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 20, 2010, 10:10:19 PM
Updated NCAC Standings with 1/20 results:

1.  Wooster 7-0
2.  Wabash 5-2
2.  Wittenberg 5-2
4.  Allegheny 4-3
4.  Hiram 4-3
4.  Ohio Wesleyan 4-3
7.  Denison 3-4
8.  Kenyon 2-5
9.  Earlham 1-6
10. Oberlin 0-7
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2010, 11:24:28 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 20, 2010, 09:09:32 PM
Wooster is about to go 7-0 in the conference and establish a full 2-game lead, and I would describe them as "reeling." 

I never would have guessed I would feel this uneasy over a Wooster basketball team that is 7-0 with a 2 game lead in the conference standings as I do about this Wooster team.

Maybe they'll surprise me down in Springfield on Saturday....  ???   :-\

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 21, 2010, 09:31:53 AM
When watching or listening to a Scots game this season I get the feeling I'm in an episode of "Groundhog Day".  This is what I mean:

Quote from: College of Wooster Coach Steve MooreWe had a nice lead in the first half, but we lost some concentration, had some turnovers, didn't contest some shots and they were right back in it...

Haven't I heard this before?

It's getting quite old to see Wooster continue to build up leads only to lose their focus or let up on the gas and then the next thing you know, their opponent is right back in the game.  Where is the killer instinct to put your opponent away?

And as wsf touched on, another game, another poor shooting performance from the Scots.  Not to pile on Justin Hallowell, but to say he is in a shooting slump would be an understatement.  He has only made one 3-pointer in his last 3 games.  After a solid start to the new year vs. Kenyon where he was 5-10 from deep, he has proceeded to go 0-5 vs. Allegheny, 0-6 vs. the EC and 1-9 last night vs. Oberlin.  That would be 1-20 over his last three games if you're keeping score at home...  Yikes!  :o  Moore mentioned that they still have confidence in their guys as good shooters and eventually they're going to start making their shots.  I hope he's right, because Ian Franks back is going to start to get tired without some serious help from the rest of the starters.  Especially when Wooster's bench doesn't offer all that much help in the scoring department...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 21, 2010, 10:54:07 AM
Any day that includes beating Wittenberg at something is a good day.  Such was the case for the Little Giants last night.  It looks like strong bench play carried the day for Wabash last night.  I've been impressed with Wabash's second unit for much of this season and I'm glad to see that they stepped up big in a crucial game like this.  It's an affirmation that not only does Wabash have depth, but they have quality depth...key to long term success over the course of a season.  I can't wait to see this one once it gets posted to youtube. 

Wabash was led last night by Wes Smith's 15 points and Aaron Brock's 13 points.  The usual suspects, but not their usual outbursts (again, credit to the bench for stepping up).  Wittenberg's Chris Sullivan led all scorers with 16 points (on 15 shot attempts) and was the only Tiger in double figures. 

Wabash's win streak is up to 6.  Next up is a Saturday tilt at Oberlin.  Keep on rolling LGs. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 21, 2010, 03:06:42 PM
Wally -

I wanted to thank you for your comments and insight on the Little Giants games this season.  I haven't had nearly the time to follow their season this year other then the occasional glance.

Question:   It seems as though they have found their groove a little bit.   Taking everything into consideration, are there a couple of things that stand out to you in their current win streak.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 22, 2010, 08:34:00 AM
Wooster/Wittenberg Updates:

Not sure who said it, I think it was ScotsFan, that Wooster was reeling..........but nonetheless our message board got mentioned in the Springfield News Sun article about Wooster today!

www.springfieldnewssun.com

Also, at last check yesterday, all tickets are $8 and reserved once again for the game. It is not going to be sold out, bet my life on it. Also, reserved is loosely used as you just have to have a ticket to get in but you have an assigned "section" to sit in. I doubt there will be ushers checking tickets......its mainly to keep the students separate from everyone else.


What's everyone's thoughts on the game? Personally Wittenberg and Wooster shot the ball terribly Wednesday night, so hopefully its a little more entertaining to watch. LIke I've stated all season, I think Wittenberg will continue to extend their defense to keep away the three point shooters.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 22, 2010, 10:18:35 AM
Oh, please, oh please, let this not be a year that Oberlin has the LG's number.

(Don't laugh, it's happened too often in the past...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 22, 2010, 10:20:34 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 22, 2010, 08:34:00 AM
Wooster/Wittenberg Updates:

Not sure who said it, I think it was ScotsFan, that Wooster was reeling..........but nonetheless our message board got mentioned in the Springfield News Sun article about Wooster today!

www.springfieldnewssun.com


David gets the credit for the quote in the SNS.  ;D  I wonder how often d3hoops.com posters get quoted in newspapers?  Too funny!  :D

Also, wrt the SNS article, they listed Wooster's margins of victory vs. conference opponents.  I can't believe that Wabash is Wooster's largest margin of victory in conference so far this season?!  And furthermore, I can't believe that is only one of two conference games that Wooster has won by double digits (The Scots beat Kenyon by 12 in a game that was much closer than the final score indicated)?!  :o   That is especially surprising considering some of Wooster's opponents include conference bottom dwellers Oberlin, the EC and Kenyon...  :-\

As for the game itself, I'm not really sure what to expect?  As you noted penn, both teams struggled from the field on Wednesday and for the Scots, those shooting struggles go back 3 games now.  I keep thinking that sooner or later the Scots are going to break out of this funk because they are good shooters!  But, as to when that is going to happen???  :-\  That's a question I don't have the answer to.

So, some of my keys to this game include, as always for Wooster, limiting their turnovers.  They had been doing a pretty decent job until Wednesday when the turnover monster reared it's ugly head once again at Oberlin.  I think shooting percentage will be a big key for both teams as will rebounding.  And I think a key for Witt will be trying to slow down Ian Franks.  He's averaging 22 ppg in his last 3 games and he's basically carried Wooster through this shooting funk that the rest of the team is in.  Personally, I don't know if Franks will be enough to carry Wooster to a win at Witt.  If he can't get some help, it could be a long ride home from Springfield on Saturday night...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 22, 2010, 12:40:01 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on January 21, 2010, 03:06:42 PM
Question:   It seems as though they have found their groove a little bit.   Taking everything into consideration, are there a couple of things that stand out to you in their current win streak.

There are a few things...from the boxscore what stands out to me is rebounding, free throws, and assists.  During the win streak, Wabash is doing these things better than their opponents are.  Free throws are hardly glamorous, but they are a valuable weapon if you've got players that can force their way to the line and convert those opportunities.  Wabash didn't shoot very well on Wednesday, but they were +6 from the line in a 7-point game, so it was a big deal. 

The thing that isn't going to stand out in the boxscore is how well the bench play is for Wabash this year.  Wabash has developed some high quality depth and it is paying dividends now.  There have been plenty of seasons over the last decade where Wabash going to the second unit meant going into survival mode for 4-5 minutes and hoping the other team doesn't run away and hide, but this year that second unit is a strength.  Zinnerman, Curosh, Bailey, Thomas, and Gilman have all been significant contributors throughout the season and during this streak in particular.  That's ten players deep...I don't know if there's another team that has that kind of quality that deep on the bench in the league. 

The key for Wabash going forward is to just maintain the edge...the shooting has been down in the last two games, but the effort that has manifested itself into rebounds and free throw attempts has kept Wabash in the win column.  The shooting will come and go...if Wabash keeps out-efforting their opponent, they'll continue to be tough to beat. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 22, 2010, 01:55:58 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 22, 2010, 10:20:34 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 22, 2010, 08:34:00 AM
Wooster/Wittenberg Updates:

Not sure who said it, I think it was ScotsFan, that Wooster was reeling..........but nonetheless our message board got mentioned in the Springfield News Sun article about Wooster today!

www.springfieldnewssun.com


David gets the credit for the quote in the SNS.  ;D  I wonder how often d3hoops.com posters get quoted in newspapers?  Too funny!  :D

Over the years I've seen a handful of references to (directly and nondirectly) conversations that happen in Posting Up or Post Patterns.  Much of the conversation that happens in our forums certainly helps to provide info for local writers/broadcasters with info on other teams around the league and provide some tips for storylines, etc.  I think it's a compliment to the quality of conversation that typically takes place here. 

In other news...I just got done watching the Wabash/Witt game from Wednesday (the game is posted, in entirety, on Youtube if you are interested).  It was definitely not the prettiest game Wabash has played (Wittenberg either for that matter), but Wabash was able to scrap and hustle just enough to outlast Witt.  Sign #16 of a good team...being able to beat another good team when you're not playing your best ball.  Wabash did that Wednesday and hopefully gained a few more believers as a result. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2010, 07:45:24 PM
While I wait for my royalty check from the News-Sun, I guess I'll post the agenda for tomorrow:

Wabash (5-2) at Oberlin (0-7), 1pm -- Live everything (http://www.goyeo.com/)
Denison (3-4) at Allegheny (4-3), 3pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)
Earlham (1-6) at Ohio Wesleyan (4-3), 3pm -- Live stats (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html)
Hiram (4-3) at Kenyon (2-5), ~3pm -- Live everything (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml) -- Game 2 of a women/men DH
Wooster (7-0) at Wittenberg (5-2), 7:30pm -- Live everything (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html) (Witt) -- live Wooster audio (http://wqkt.com/) -- Live Wooster student audio (http://www3.wooster.edu/woo91/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 23, 2010, 01:12:24 PM
12:14 to go in the first half...Wabash leads Oberlin 17-12.  Based on what I've seen so far, there's not a good reason why Wabash should take a single shot outside of 15 feet.  Oberlin simply doesn't have the bodies to defend Wabash around the hoop.  

9:48 in the first half, Wabash leads 23-16.  The LGs are 2-8 on 3PT FGs, 8-9 on FGs inside the arc.  Go to the rack fellas.  

4:44 1st....35-22 Wabash leads Oberlin.  Wabash is stretching this one out a little.  LGs are shooting a balmy 57% and currently hold a 16-7 edge on rebounds.  

Halftime: Wabash leads Oberlin 43-32.  I guess we could say that Oberlin is hanging around, but I don't get the sense from watching this game that it is as close as it is.  Wes Smith leads all scorers with 16 points so far.  Oberlin is being led by Josh Merritt's 11 points.  James Tompsett has also reached double figures with 10 points for the Yeomen.   I haven't seen Derek Bailey in the game today for Wabash...Bailey took a hard spill in Wednesday's game and looked like he had hit his head.  He may be sitting out today for precautionary reasons.  

This is also a good time to mention that Wabash senior Chase Haltom entered today's game 15 points shy of the 1,000 point mark.  He has seven points halfway through this one...good luck to Chase as he goes for 1,000 in the second half!

About 4:30 left to play...Wabash leads 68-54.  This hasn't been a particularly impressive half for Wabash, but they're doing just enough to keep Oberlin at a safe distance.  Haltom has 13 in the game....just two points shy of 1,000.  Hopefully he can get that last bucket before this one closes out.  

All done in Oberlin...I'll have a complete wrap up a little later.  Wabash wins 77-55.  Smith goes for 28 and 10, Haltom has 13 and sits at 998 career points.  7 in a row for Wabash!  OWU comes to Chadwick on Wednesday night.  WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 23, 2010, 04:41:50 PM
Elsewhere:
OWU 70, Earlham 62...Pellerite 19 & 12, frosh Marshall Morris with 17 boards
Allegheny 75, Denison 68...more balance from Gators; five with 9 or more points
Hiram 68, Kenyon 64...Jide Eniola with 17 & 11; Knight got his points (26) but Knapke (5) got shut down.  Bricklaying: teams combined to shoot 22 of 49 from the free throw line (KC 52%, HC 36%)

I think there's still one game left...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 23, 2010, 06:50:46 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 23, 2010, 04:41:50 PM
I think there's still one game left...

Hmmmm...  What game might that be?   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 23, 2010, 07:13:24 PM
Wooster student radio Woo91 is also going to live (audio) stream the game; I've added a link to my above post.  This may be the most live coverage for any D3 game ever played outside southwestern Michigan or southwestern Virginia.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2010, 08:06:06 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 30  Wittenberg 25 :)

Wooster only made 1 of their first 11 shots and somehow still stayed in this game. :o  Scots rallied and eventually took the lead at 23-22 after hitting some three pointers.  

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 9 points, Justin Hallowell with 6 points and Matt Fegan with 5 points.

Witt's top scorers are David Nowicki with 6 points and Kyle Bigler with 6 points.

Ugly shooting in the half with Wooster only hitting 38% from the floor and Witt only at 32%
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 23, 2010, 08:10:29 PM
A really great game so far.  Wooster down 16-5 early climbed back quickly with both 3 pointers and dribble penetration.  I liked the look of Witt's offense early, but they started pulling the trigger a little early later on and started missing 3's.  Should be a great second half. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2010, 09:06:16 PM
Final:  Wooster 66  Wittenberg 56  :)

Terrific road win for the Scots as they take a firm grip on the conference lead!

As usual, Wooster was led by Ian Franks with 20 points, Justin Hallowell with 13 points (12 boards) and Matt Fegan with 10 points.  Witt stats had Franks with 22 but they gave him a basket that Claytor made.

Wittenberg was led in scoring by Chris Sullivan with 15 points, David Nowicki with 9 points and Josh McKee with 7 points.

Scots outshot the Tigers from the floor 42% to 34%.  Wooster also outrebounded Witt 39 to 37.  Scots kept the TO's to 11. ;)

Wooster is now 13-4, 8-0 NCAC.  ;D

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2010, 09:10:55 PM
Current NCAC Standings with 1/23 Results:

1.  Wooster 8-0
2.  Wabash 6-2
3.  Wittenberg 5-3
3.  Ohio Wesleyan 5-3
3.  Allegheny 5-3
3.  Hiram 5-3
7.  Denison 3-5
8.  Kenyon 2-6
9.  Earlham 1-7
10. Oberlin 0-8
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 23, 2010, 09:12:20 PM
Well, color me surprised.  Congratulations to the Scots.  Attention News-Sun staff:  I'll have prepared remarks available later this evening.  ;)

One thing that disappoints me is the reported crowd size of something like 1800.  Wittenberg's got a good team having a good season, and Wooster looked very beatable coming into this game.  I'm saddened that these factors, on top of the Rivalry, couldn't produce a sold-out arena.  I guess times change.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 23, 2010, 09:17:02 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2010, 09:06:16 PM
Final:  Wooster 66  Wittenberg 56  :)

Terrific road win for the Scots as they take a firm grip on the conference lead!


You said it wsf!  By far Wooster's best game since their win over Transy and it couldn't have come at a better time!  I have to admit, I was a little queasy listening to the Scots come out 0-8 from deep and falling behind by 11. 

But after the rough start, the Scots looked like a different team from there on out as they didn't commit too many turnovers and they outrebounded the top rebounding team in the conference which were two of the keys I mentioned pregame.  And if you take away their frigid start from deep, I think they ended up shooting close to 50% from 3-point range the rest of the way.

There's still a lot of basketball left to be played so the conference race isn't locked away just yet (as I'm sure that Wabash will have a say in this thing before it's all said and done and maybe OWU as well).  But the Scots took a HUGE step towards 6 in a row tonight!!!  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 23, 2010, 09:21:36 PM
BTW, can you say 4 straight?  For the first time in the previous 95 meetings between Witt and Woo, the Scots can now claim a four game win streak over their arch rivals!  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2010, 11:47:47 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 23, 2010, 09:17:02 PM

And if you take away their frigid start from deep, I think they ended up shooting close to 50% from 3-point range the rest of the way.


Three point shooting was the difference in the 2nd half tonight for Wooster.  In their last 3 games, the Scots shot horribly from the 3 point arc (less than 30%) but they got hot tonight at a critical juncture in the game.

Witt had fought back from a 9 point deficit to tie the game at 44-44 with ~10 minutes left.  After a Wooster timeout, their next three baskets were all three pointers (Fegan then Franks then Hallowell).  Suddenly, it was a 53 to 46 lead for the Scots and the Tigers never got closer than 4 points the rest of the game.

It was great to see Justin Hallowell hit 3 three pointers tonight because Wooster is a much stronger team when someone helps Franks with the scoring load.

Let's hope the Scots can keep it rolling when they host Hiram next Wednesday!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 24, 2010, 10:58:17 AM
Figured I might as well throw my two "sense" in from my synopsis of the game last night.

First, DC the game was not a sellout, but differently from the trend this season, more than 1/3 of the Wittenberg fans in attendance were actually students. If many of you know, one of my biggest gripes with Wittenberg's fan base is the lack of involvement for the students. So that was great to see.

I had a funny feeling that Wooster's bad shooting lately would average out in this game, and unfortunately I was right. For those in attendance, when the game was tied 44-44 late in the second half, Wooster made two 3 pointers in a row, in where Wittenberg defenders didn't switch out on ball screens, which they had been doing all game long. This led to a three in the corner and an open three up top by Hallowell. Coach Brown was livid in the huddle and rightfully so, but in a game that close two lapses like that made the difference. Witt actually had countless opportunities to close the gap, but didn't capitalize and had a lot of shots go in and out in the closing part of the game. Rebounding was controlled by Wooster, but that wasn't the main factor, more of a result of missed 3 pointers from Wittenberg and no one in position to get an offensive rebound.

Don't even get me started on missed free throws.........

Also, for those in attendance from Wooster....I was one of the participants for the halftime Around the World contest and did come out victorious. I guess something good came of the evening.

I think Wooster clinced the conference for the most part last night, so the trip to the NCAA bid will go through Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 11:31:03 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 23, 2010, 09:12:20 PM

One thing that disappoints me is the reported crowd size of something like 1800.  Wittenberg's got a good team having a good season, and Wooster looked very beatable coming into this game.  I'm saddened that these factors, on top of the Rivalry, couldn't produce a sold-out arena.  I guess times change.

The boxscore listed the attendance at over 2200 last night.  But watching the video link, it looked as though about 1/4 of the crowd were Scots fans!   8-)


Quote from: pennstghs on January 24, 2010, 10:58:17 AM
I think Wooster clinced the conference for the most part last night, so the trip to the NCAA bid will go through Wooster.

I'm not willing to say the conference race is over just yet.  What Wooster has going for them is that they have already won AT Witt and AT OWU!  Wabash still has to travel to both!  This is going to make it real difficult on Wabash to overcome their 2 game deficit.  Yes, the Lil Giants have a chance to get one back on Wooster when the Scots travel to C'ville, but Wabash is going to have a hard time winning one in Deleware or Springfield, let alone both of them. 

Wooster just has to now take care of business.  There can't be any letdowns!  As big as that win last night was for the Scots, they still have some tricky games ahead starting Wednesday when they host Hiram.  I would really like to see them build on this momentum they gained last night moving forward in the last half of the conference schedule.  It would be nice to see the Scots come out and lay a few beatdowns over their next few games instead of making the games closer than they need to be! 

GO SCOTS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 11:46:24 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 24, 2010, 10:58:17 AM

Don't even get me started on missed free throws.........


Witt absolutely killed themselves at the line tonight!  I will say that as poorly as the Scots have been shooting from the field lately, their ft shooting has been fantastic!  I think Mike Breckenridge mentioned that they've been shooting over 80% from the line over their shooting slump.

And speaking of not making ft's.  What is up with Michael Cooper for Witt.  He didn't even draw rim on his first ft attempt of the night and then solidly bricked his 2nd attempt off the back iron.  And he never recovered finishing the night with a bagel going 0-4 from the stripe.  I can't figure out how a team that shoots as well as Witt shoots 36% from the charity stripe in any game...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2010, 12:25:37 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 24, 2010, 10:58:17 AM
Also, for those in attendance from Wooster....I was one of the participants for the halftime Around the World contest and did come out victorious. I guess something good came of the evening. 
I'm not sure what an "Around the World" contest is, but there are several possible interpretations that really make me wish I had been in attendance last night! (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fshocked-smiley-9453.gif&hash=4e63db73cbe4c3d2dc3d94d8e2c613201642d9ca) (http://planetsmilies.net) Evidently, this is not your grandfather's Wittenberg!  Nevertheless, congratulations for the, uh, triumph, ghs! ;D

I more or less expected the game to start the way it did, with Wittenberg fired up and playing well and Wooster ice cold.  I thought what this would lead to is a major shift in the balance of confidence, with Wooster playing tentatively and Witt taking chances and pouring it on, leading to a big win.  I couldn't have been more wrong, or more impressed, at the way Wooster responded to those opening ten minutes.  It seemed to me that, free throw shooting aside, Wooster won the game (as opposed to Witt losing it.)

It will be very interesting to see what transpires on Wednesday against Hiram, which by the way will have free video (http://www.wooster.edu/en/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule).  Will the Scots come out and dominate like they probably should, or will it be back to the just-good-enough-to-win team that played in the four games prior to last night?  Unfortunately for me, I'm going to be traveling that day and will miss the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2010, 12:38:32 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 11:31:03 AM
I'm not willing to say the conference race is over just yet. 

Me either. 

Quote from: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 11:31:03 AM
Yes, the Lil Giants have a chance to get one back on Wooster when the Scots travel to C'ville, but Wabash is going to have a hard time winning one in Deleware or Springfield, let alone both of them. 

Why can't Wabash win at OWU or Witt? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on January 24, 2010, 12:49:14 PM
i agree... free throw shooting killed Witt. Also, in the first half they went cold for about 5 possessions.  I watched some of the around the world competition and it appeared to me one of the lady students from Witt had the best form but was hurrying her shot. I would take her in a rematch against you any day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2010, 01:26:34 PM
Maybe it's time to resurrect the link to the tiebreaker formula that was provided by our good friend imderekpoe a couple of years ago.  (I see "derek" lurking in here a lot, but he's stayed silent so far this season.  We miss your contributions, and hope things are going well for you. :))

Official tiebreakers (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4200.msg873234#msg873234)

For Wabash to catch Wooster, in essence, the LGs would have to win out, beating Wooster in the process, and have Wooster lose a second time to someone who finishes ahead of Denison in the final standings.  Any losses by Wabash would have to be countered by another Wooster loss.  Wooster already has two one-point conference victories, and Wabash is hot right now, so this scenario is certainly possible.  Eight games is a long stretch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 24, 2010, 03:00:57 PM
Over the years, I have read the NCAC B-Ball board, but rarely posted.   I have enjoyed the knowledge and level of overall content.

Thus, here is my first B-ball contribution.

In just looking at the NCAC standings this morning,  I found them being very similar to those that we typically see in Football. (except maybe the order)

Also,  In looking at conference stats, I was surprised to find that FT Shooting percentage was, at least for the Top 4 teams in the conference, what I believed to be low.

1. Wooster - 75.6%
2. Wabash - 74.9%
3. Witt -  66.7%
4. Allegheny - 68.9%

Later, in articles I found this morning, I read that on average, a NCAA college basketball player hits only 69% of his free throws.   In the NBA, this number increases to 75% (Shaq probably has skewed this average over time.).  

I also read that there is very little correlation nationally between free throw percentage and winning percentage.

Here is a nice article on the topic:

http://dberri.wordpress.com/2009/03/08/the-cost-of-throwing-away-free-throws/


WAF!




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCAC4Life on January 24, 2010, 04:38:49 PM
What leads you to believe these are the top four teams? You know something we don't?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 06:37:28 PM
Quote from: NCAC4Life on January 24, 2010, 04:38:49 PM
What leads you to believe these are the top four teams? You know something we don't?

Well, in terms of the current conference standings, they are the top 4 teams in the conference:

NCAC Standings (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/09-10stats/CONFSKED.HTM)

Allegheny has a 1/2 game lead over both OWU and Hiram.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 06:50:31 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2010, 12:38:32 PM

Quote from: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 11:31:03 AM
Yes, the Lil Giants have a chance to get one back on Wooster when the Scots travel to C'ville, but Wabash is going to have a hard time winning one in Deleware or Springfield, let alone both of them. 

Why can't Wabash win at OWU or Witt? 

Did you see the word can't in my post?  Never said that it coudn't happen.  Geez.  Touchy much?   ::)

In my OPINION, judging by the fact that all 5 of Wabash's losses have been on the ROAD, I'm just not as positive as some wearing red and white glasses that Wabash will win one or both games when they make the trek to OWU and Witt.  Especially when one of those losses was to lowly Denison on the road.

Just because I hold that OPINION, does not make it fact as you seem to be alluding to Wally.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2010, 06:54:57 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 06:37:28 PM
Quote from: NCAC4Life on January 24, 2010, 04:38:49 PM
What leads you to believe these are the top four teams? You know something we don't?

Well, in terms of the current conference standings, they are the top 4 teams in the conference:

NCAC Standings (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/09-10stats/CONFSKED.HTM)

Allegheny has a 1/2 game lead over both OWU and Hiram.
Those standings are not up-to-date; Witt, 'Gheny, Hiram, and OWU are all tied for 3rd at 5-3.  Wooscotsfan has it right (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4200.msg1164895#msg1164895), as always.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 24, 2010, 07:34:03 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 24, 2010, 01:26:34 PM
Maybe it's time to resurrect the link to the tiebreaker formula that was provided by our good friend imderekpoe a couple of years ago.  (I see "derek" lurking in here a lot, but he's stayed silent so far this season.  We miss your contributions, and hope things are going well for you. :))

Still here, and everything's good down here in Columbus!

I made the trek over to Springfield with my father on Saturday.  I wasn't sure what to think after the cold start.  On one hand the Scots have a history of really bad starts and big comebacks, especially in big games.  On the other, I had some of the same feelings that David mentioned earlier - that the Scots would get down on themselves and would continue the cold shooting that we've seen the last few games.  Even after missing all their early 3's and after a timeout, they continued to shoot from outside.  I would have thought that Coach Moore would have had them try to power it inside, but apparently he knows a bit more about coaching the Scots than I do and they stuck to the game plan, which eventually worked out.

A couple of notes - Ian Franks seems to be just about unstoppable.  At the halfway mark of the season he has to be the odds-on favorite for POY.

I thought that the 3's that Hallowell made were big, but that his biggest contributions came on the defensive end where he held Cooper in check and was huge on the boards.  He really kept the Tigers from getting many 2nd chances which I think was a huge factor in this game.

In the JV game, Kaleb Reed suffered an injury and wasn't available for the main contest, and as a result Warnes saw a little more action.  I'm not sure there's a big impact here if Reed is out for a while, but I think he is a little better than Warnes on the defensive end and is a decent rebounder.

Wednesday's game should be huge for the Scots.  Coming off of the big win, they need to keep their heads in the game and play with the same intensity that we saw on Saturday. 

Final note:  Oberlin has been eliminated from the regular season NCAC championship race.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 07:52:36 PM
First of all, welcome back to the fray derekpoe.  Glad to here all is well.  Don't make yourself such a stranger...  ;)

Quote from: David Collinge on January 24, 2010, 06:54:57 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 06:37:28 PM
Quote from: NCAC4Life on January 24, 2010, 04:38:49 PM
What leads you to believe these are the top four teams? You know something we don't?

Well, in terms of the current conference standings, they are the top 4 teams in the conference:

NCAC Standings (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/09-10stats/CONFSKED.HTM)

Allegheny has a 1/2 game lead over both OWU and Hiram.
Those standings are not up-to-date; Witt, 'Gheny, Hiram, and OWU are all tied for 3rd at 5-3.  Wooscotsfan has it right (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4200.msg1164895#msg1164895), as always.
Doh!  I forgot that wsf posted the 'current' standings last night! :P  That's what I get for thinking the NCAC would have actual updated conference standings. 

Sorry NCAC4life.  Now I get what you were questioning bashbrother about!  :)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 24, 2010, 07:57:52 PM
my apologies.....

FT percentages for the Top 6 teams in the NCAC

1. Wooster - 75.6%
2. Wabash - 74.9%
3. Witt -  66.7%
3. Allegheny - 68.9%
3. OWU - 67.7%
3. Hiram - 63.1%
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 08:01:42 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on January 24, 2010, 07:57:52 PM
my apologies.....

FT percentages for the Top 6 teams in the NCAC

1. Wooster - 75.6%
2. Wabash - 74.9%
3. Witt -  66.7%
3. Allegheny - 68.9%
3. OWU - 67.7%
3. Hiram - 63.1%

Much better!  ;) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2010, 08:22:20 PM
The standings may not be up to date, but the all-important Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html) page is kept current using an atomic clock.  This week, the reigning POTW, Ian Franks, will tearfully pass the tiara and sceptre to OWU's Pat Pellerite.  Pellerite, who (mark my words) will be the NCAC Player of the Year before his career is over, snagged this week's award with double double-doubles in the Bishops' wins over Denison and Earlham.  OWU has now won five straight and are right back in the thick of the conference race.  Congratulations, Pat!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2010, 09:56:09 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 24, 2010, 07:34:03 PM
A couple of notes - Ian Franks seems to be just about unstoppable.  At the halfway mark of the season he has to be the odds-on favorite for POY.

Objection! 

Quote from: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 06:50:31 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2010, 12:38:32 PM

Quote from: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 11:31:03 AM
Yes, the Lil Giants have a chance to get one back on Wooster when the Scots travel to C'ville, but Wabash is going to have a hard time winning one in Deleware or Springfield, let alone both of them. 

Why can't Wabash win at OWU or Witt? 

Did you see the word can't in my post?  Never said that it coudn't happen.  Geez.  Touchy much?   ::)

In my OPINION, judging by the fact that all 5 of Wabash's losses have been on the ROAD, I'm just not as positive as some wearing red and white glasses that Wabash will win one or both games when they make the trek to OWU and Witt.  Especially when one of those losses was to lowly Denison on the road.

Just because I hold that OPINION, does not make it fact as you seem to be alluding to Wally.

All five of Wabash's losses were on the road, true.  All five of those losses happened an eternity ago.  You are submitting that Wabash is a bad road team...I'm submitting that Wabash wasn't playing well during the front half of the schedule (when seven of the first nine games were away from C'ville) and lost because of their play, not because of which gyms they happen to be playing in.  If you don't play well, you'll probably lose...at home, on the road, under water, on Mars...doesn't matter. 

I'm not going to say that the games in Delaware and Springfield will not be hard games.  They will be (Wabash has NEVER won at HPER).  But I don't know that there is a case to be made that Wabash isn't playing the best ball in the league right now (not December!) and these Little Giants are capable of beating any team in the league...in any gym. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 25, 2010, 09:55:41 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 24, 2010, 08:22:20 PM
The standings may not be up to date, but the all-important Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html) page is kept current using an atomic clock.  This week, the reigning POTW, Ian Franks, will tearfully pass the tiara and sceptre to OWU's Pat Pellerite.  Pellerite, who (mark my words) will be the NCAC Player of the Year before his career is over, snagged this week's award with double double-doubles in the Bishops' wins over Denison and Earlham.  OWU has now won five straight and are right back in the thick of the conference race.  Congratulations, Pat!

Glad to see your well documented man-crush on all things OWU continues David.   :P   ;D   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 25, 2010, 10:14:20 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2010, 09:56:09 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 24, 2010, 07:34:03 PM
A couple of notes - Ian Franks seems to be just about unstoppable.  At the halfway mark of the season he has to be the odds-on favorite for POY.

Objection! 


While Franks is one of the odds on favorites, I think Wes Smith will have something to say in the POY race as well.  I will say, I think the POY is now a 2 horse race over the rest of the 2nd half of the conference schedule between Franks and Smith.

Looking at the numbers and I really don't envy those having to vote on this because at this point in time, I think both players are more than deserving of the award.  Smith leads in overall scoring average at almost 20 ppg while Franks checks in at just under 18 ppg.  However, in league play, Franks is leading the way at almost 23 ppg compared to Smith's 20 ppg.  Both players are in the top 5 in the league in fg % and both are over 50% on the season.  Franks is among the league leaders in 3-point percentage and assists while Smith is among the league leaders in steals and rebounding.

I will say that it seems that Wooster has relied more heavily on Franks than Wabash has on Smith.  I can count at least 3 conference games that Wooster would not have won if Franks doesn't put the Scots on his back and will them to victory.  I can't say that Smith was solely responsible for any of Wabash's conference wins as he has had far more help from the likes of Brock and Haltom on a consistent basis than Franks has had from his supporting cast.

Personally, I think whoever wins the conference championship will have a large impact on who wins POY this season.  If Smith can lead Wabash to overtake Wooster and their 2 game conference lead, he's your POY without question.  But, if Franks continues to play at the level he's been playing at and helps Wooster maintain their lead in the conference, I would say he should be your POY.

Any other thoughts on the matter?  David, any Bishops you feel worthy of being in this discussion?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 25, 2010, 10:35:17 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2010, 09:56:09 PM

All five of Wabash's losses were on the road, true.  All five of those losses happened an eternity ago.  You are submitting that Wabash is a bad road team...I'm submitting that Wabash wasn't playing well during the front half of the schedule (when seven of the first nine games were away from C'ville) and lost because of their play, not because of which gyms they happen to be playing in.  If you don't play well, you'll probably lose...at home, on the road, under water, on Mars...doesn't matter. 

I'm not going to say that the games in Delaware and Springfield will not be hard games.  They will be (Wabash has NEVER won at HPER).  But I don't know that there is a case to be made that Wabash isn't playing the best ball in the league right now (not December!) and these Little Giants are capable of beating any team in the league...in any gym. 

Maybe Wabash wasn't playing all that well to start the season.  My question is, could their bad play be contributed to the fact that they played 7 of 9 to start the season on the road?  (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.scout.com%2Fmedia%2Fforums%2Femoticons%2Fnoidea.gif&hash=d0853e7250ffe0f662a746329d301aa06dd4ee9f)  And could their run of good play lately have something to do with the fact that they've played 5 of 7 in the friendly confines of Chadwick?  (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.scout.com%2Fmedia%2Fforums%2Femoticons%2Fnoidea.gif&hash=d0853e7250ffe0f662a746329d301aa06dd4ee9f)

I guess I would just like to see Wabash prove they can win a real road game before it's all said and done and we won't be able to see that for a while as the Lil Giants home cooking continues with 3 of their next 4 games in C'ville including a crucial tilt with the Scots on Super Bowl Sunday.  We won't be able to see how Wabash performes in a real road game until the last week and a half of the season when they travel to OWU and Witt on consecutive Saturdays... (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.scout.com%2Fmedia%2Fforums%2Femoticons%2Fnoidea.gif&hash=d0853e7250ffe0f662a746329d301aa06dd4ee9f)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on January 25, 2010, 10:49:17 AM
It sure looks like the wheels are off the wagon again!! :'(

Looking at the schedule I think they really do have a realistic shot at finishing strong by winning 6 of 8.  That would make for a respectable conference finish.

Can anyone tell me where Mike Garabedian is??? 

He is a strong player and is certainly missed from the lineup.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 25, 2010, 11:17:02 AM
Now that I've gotten my piling on of Wabash out of the way...  ;)

Looking at the top 25, might it be time that Wabash starts to get some consideration at least in the ORV category?  There seemed to be a lot of ORV teams that lost last week, so maybe it's time that Wabash gets a look?  I mean, they have won 7 in a row including a win over previously ORV member Wittenberg.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 25, 2010, 11:34:08 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 25, 2010, 11:17:02 AM
Now that I've gotten my piling on of Wabash out of the way...  ;)

Looking at the top 25, might it be time that Wabash starts to get some consideration at least in the ORV category?  There seemed to be a lot of ORV teams that lost last week, so maybe it's time that Wabash gets a look?  I mean, they have won 7 in a row including a win over previously ORV member Wittenberg.

Good grief no!  Last week penn wondered why Witt wasn't getting votes, Witt finally got a few votes and promptly lost twice.  The cloak of anonymity fits just fine, thank you. :)

in seriousness, the top 25 is a very exclusive club.  Wabash might be a top 25 team, but I don't think the body of work warrants a vote right now. Too many teams still out there that have similar or better records against a better schedule. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 25, 2010, 12:12:30 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 25, 2010, 11:34:08 AM
Good grief no!  Last week penn wondered why Witt wasn't getting votes, Witt finally got a few votes and promptly lost twice.  The cloak of anonymity fits just fine, thank you. :)


LOL!  Good point Wally.  ;)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 25, 2010, 12:38:19 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 24, 2010, 01:26:34 PM
Maybe it's time to resurrect the link to the tiebreaker formula that was provided by our good friend imderekpoe a couple of years ago.  (I see "derek" lurking in here a lot, but he's stayed silent so far this season.  We miss your contributions, and hope things are going well for you. :))

Official tiebreakers (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4200.msg873234#msg873234)

For Wabash to catch Wooster, in essence, the LGs would have to win out, beating Wooster in the process, and have Wooster lose a second time to someone who finishes ahead of Denison in the final standings.  Any losses by Wabash would have to be countered by another Wooster loss.  Wooster already has two one-point conference victories, and Wabash is hot right now, so this scenario is certainly possible.  Eight games is a long stretch.

If I read the tiebreakers correctly, the Wabash loss at Denison will have no bearing on the tiebreaker scenarios since Wooster doesn't play at Denison, and thus there is no "like game".  So if Wooster loses to Wabash and anyone else, and Wabash wins out, I believe that 'Bash wins the regular season crown.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2010, 01:05:31 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 25, 2010, 12:38:19 PMIf I read the tiebreakers correctly, the Wabash loss at Denison will have no bearing on the tiebreaker scenarios since Wooster doesn't play at Denison, and thus there is no "like game".  So if Wooster loses to Wabash and anyone else, and Wabash wins out, I believe that 'Bash wins the regular season crown.
Ah, yes.  You da man when it comes to tiebreakers.  But then, if Wooster's "anyone else" loss is at Hiram, that would also be negated by Wabash's not having played there.  Otherwise, I think you're correct. 

I think it is far too early in the season to begin the POY discussions; and when the time comes, JT Knight should at least be in the conversation (maybe third in a three-man race.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 25, 2010, 01:44:54 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 25, 2010, 01:05:31 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 25, 2010, 12:38:19 PMIf I read the tiebreakers correctly, the Wabash loss at Denison will have no bearing on the tiebreaker scenarios since Wooster doesn't play at Denison, and thus there is no "like game".  So if Wooster loses to Wabash and anyone else, and Wabash wins out, I believe that 'Bash wins the regular season crown.
Ah, yes.  You da man when it comes to tiebreakers.  But then, if Wooster's "anyone else" loss is at Hiram, that would also be negated by Wabash's not having played there.  Otherwise, I think you're correct. 


You beat me to it David wrt Wooster losing at Hiram. 

What happens then if Wabash wins out and Wooster were to lose at Wabash and at Hiram?  Both Wabash and Wooster would have losses vs. each other and each would have losses on the road vs. different opponents and only Wabash faced Denison on the road while only Wooster faced Hiram on the road.  Would Wooster trump Wabash because Hiram is  currently ahead of Denison in the NCAC standings?  Technically, the better loss would still be Hiram thus giving the Scots home court for the NCAC tournament would it not?

Quote from: David Collinge on January 25, 2010, 01:05:31 PM
I think it is far too early in the season to begin the POY discussions; and when the time comes, JT Knight should at least be in the conversation (maybe third in a three-man race.)

There's only 5 games left in the season so to say it's far too early may be a bit much isn't it?

I thought about Knight, but his numbers just don't jump out at me enough to think he can overcome the fact that he's playing on an 8th place team.  Personally, I would think POY is more than just scoring points and putting up numbers.  It also should have something to do with your value to your team.  So, I ask, where would Kenyon be without Knight?  Ninth or tenth?  They're eighth with him, so I don't see too much added value there. 

Now, look at where the Scots would be without Franks.  Hardly 8-0 and with a cushy 2 game lead in the conference standings IMO.  Wooster might be 5-3 at best without Franks, so IMO Franks adds far more value to Wooster with his presence in the lineup than Knight adds to Kenyon.  And I would say the same thing about Smith.  Just not quite to the extent of Franks' value.  I would need to see Knight's numbers being eye popping for me to consider him along with Franks and Smith, and quite frankly, they're not that much better, if at all than either Franks' or Smith's numbers.  If you want to call it a 3-man race, I would say Knight is a distant 3rd at the moment behind the other two...  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2010, 01:58:07 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 25, 2010, 01:44:54 PM
There's only 5 games left in the season so to say it's far too early may be a bit much isn't it?
There's 8 games left (9 for 'Gheny), not five.  That's why I think Knight still could be a factor in this conversation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 25, 2010, 02:11:19 PM
Note to Justin Hallowell - release the ball with your wrist, not your elbow
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 25, 2010, 02:13:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 25, 2010, 01:58:07 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 25, 2010, 01:44:54 PM
There's only 5 games left in the season so to say it's far too early may be a bit much isn't it?
There's 8 games left (9 for 'Gheny), not five.  That's why I think Knight still could be a factor in this conversation.

IMO, for Knight to warrant consideration over Franks and Smith would mean that JT averages about 30 ppg the rest of the way out while Franks and Smith sputter home at around 10-15 ppg. 

All things being equal, the way all 3 of them are statistically speaking, I'll side with the 2 that are actually carrying their teams to a conference championship as opposed to one who is carrying his team just to qualify for the 8 seed in the conference tournament...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2010, 02:20:35 PM
Jeez Louise, all I said was JT should be in the conversation, "third in a three-man race."  He is at least as valuable to his team as Franks and Smith are to theirs; he just doesn't have the supporting cast they do and so the wins aren't coming.  If I were voting, right now I'd go with Franks, hands down, but I'm willing to keep an open mind for the next few weeks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 25, 2010, 05:05:34 PM
It may be that we're headed for the classic POY debate of whether the award should go be going to the best player in the league or the most valuable player to his team in the league.  I have thoughts on that conundrum, but I'll save it for if/when the time comes.  8 games is still a long way to go. 

I will say, however, that while Ian Franks has more obviously and more notably won a couple of games single-handedly, I think it would be unfair to say that Smith isn't just as valuable.  Wabash is getting more contribution from their secondary offensive options than Wooster is getting from theirs, but I really believe that so much of that is because Smith demands attention from more than one defender (unless you want him to slash to the cup and shoot 16 foul shots in a game) which leads to a lot of easy opportunities for other Little Giants.  Smith's stat lines might not make one jump into Post Patterns and say "Wes Smith single handedly won this game for Wabash...wow!", but his being on the floor opens things up for the others. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 25, 2010, 10:23:45 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on January 25, 2010, 10:49:17 AMIt sure looks like the wheels are off the wagon again!!

Looking at the schedule I think they really do have a realistic shot at finishing strong by winning 6 of 8.  That would make for a respectable conference finish.

Can anyone tell me where Mike Garabedian is???


BigRedFan,

If the wheels are off the wagon, how can the Big Red go 6 of 8 for the remainder of the season?  They have revised the offense some and finally moved away from a pure "Princeton" type offense so they can utilize their speed and athleticism, but they still need major work on the defense.

I hear Garabedian is out indefinitely with an injury.  Without him they will probably give even more points to the big men inside like Knapke, Raftis and Eniola.  I think the rest of the "big men" may be hurt too - except the freshman, who they don't seem to want to play.  I'm hoping for .500 the rest of the way, but it's only possible if the wings start defending better and the shots, including LAYUPS, start dropping.   


EDITED to fix the formatting
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 25, 2010, 11:22:53 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 24, 2010, 07:34:03 PM

Ian Franks seems to be just about unstoppable.  At the halfway mark of the season he has to be the odds-on favorite for POY.


imderekpoe - Thanks for the first hand report from Springfield!  Great point about Ian Franks being the leader for POY. :)

When reviewing the Conference Only Stats through 8 games, Ian Franks is in the Top 10 in 8 categories!

#1  Points scored per game at 22.6
#2  Field Goal Shooting % at 58.7%
#2  Three Point Shooting % at 51.7%
#3  Minutes played per game at 33.0
#5  Free Throw Shooting % at 82.6%
#7  Assists per game at 2.88 avg.
#7  Three point shots made at 1.88 per game
#8  Assists/Turnover ratio at 1.77

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2010, 12:21:08 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 25, 2010, 11:22:53 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 24, 2010, 07:34:03 PM

Ian Franks seems to be just about unstoppable.  At the halfway mark of the season he has to be the odds-on favorite for POY.


imderekpoe - Thanks for the first hand report from Springfield!  Great point about Ian Franks being the leader for POY. :)

When reviewing the Conference Only Stats through 8 games, Ian Franks is in the Top 10 in 8 categories!

In the interest of equal time I should note that Wes Smith is also in the top 10 of 8 statistical categories in conference only stats.  But why are we only counting conference stats?  Do the other 8 games not count?  That's 1/3 of the season that we'd be dismissing which doesn't feel right. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 26, 2010, 12:27:49 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 26, 2010, 12:21:08 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 25, 2010, 11:22:53 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 24, 2010, 07:34:03 PM

Ian Franks seems to be just about unstoppable.  At the halfway mark of the season he has to be the odds-on favorite for POY.


imderekpoe - Thanks for the first hand report from Springfield!  Great point about Ian Franks being the leader for POY. :)

When reviewing the Conference Only Stats through 8 games, Ian Franks is in the Top 10 in 8 categories!

In the interest of equal time I should note that Wes Smith is also in the top 10 of 8 statistical categories in conference only stats.  But why are we only counting conference stats?  Do the other 8 games not count?  That's 1/3 of the season that we'd be dismissing which doesn't feel right. 

I don't know of any conference that doesn't base conference honors on conference-only performance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2010, 12:44:09 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 26, 2010, 12:21:08 AMBut why are we only counting conference stats?  Do the other 8 games not count?  That's 1/3 of the season that we'd be dismissing which doesn't feel right. 
The POY is selected by a vote of the coaches, and the only guidance that the Conference policies and procedures gives is that the POY must be a first-team All-conference honoree.  However, if I were a coach, I would base my decision on conference-only play.  It is a conference honor, after all, and there are too many variables with non-conference play.  Conference-only is a much more level playing field for comparing the performance of the candidates.  Personally, I would rely on conference-only stats for all conference honors, not just POY.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2010, 01:00:11 AM
I agree. It should be conference play only for conference awards. You don't name someone to the all NCAC tourney team if they weren't in the NCAC tourney, would you. So no love for AJ Sutherlin in the NCAC tourney (if Earlham is shut out).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2010, 01:03:05 AM
BTW, stuck up here in the frozen tundra, I have not seen Earlham play. Are those gray monstrosities their away jerseys? Home jerseys? Only jerseys?

Whatever they are, they look putrid!

/Oh, you know it's true!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 26, 2010, 09:42:29 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 26, 2010, 01:03:05 AM
BTW, stuck up here in the frozen tundra, I have not seen Earlham play. Are those gray monstrosities their away jerseys? Home jerseys? Only jerseys?

Whatever they are, they look putrid!

/Oh, you know it's true!!!

They wore them at Wooster and yes they do look putrid.  That is a good question wrt whether or not those are home or away or both!  :D  I did see they have a black uni from some photos on their website so at least the putrid greys aren't the EC's only unis...  :P

Speaking of The EC, where's Billy Pilgrim been and other Quakers supporters.  We are coming towards the end of the EC as a part of the NCAC.  Hopefully they all come back for some parting shots before it's all said and done...  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2010, 12:15:09 PM
So are we saying that a player could miss the first 8 games of the season (which would include only one, possibly two league games) and play lights out for the last 16 games and be POY....but if a player was the best player in the league for the first 16 games of the year and missed the last 8 games he shouldn't be considered for POY?  I don't know if I can agree with that. 

Quote from: smedindy on January 26, 2010, 01:03:05 AM
BTW, stuck up here in the frozen tundra, I have not seen Earlham play. Are those gray monstrosities their away jerseys? Home jerseys? Only jerseys?

Whatever they are, they look putrid!

Those jerseys are reason #173 why I'm not at all sorry to see Earlham ride off into the sunset.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on January 26, 2010, 01:11:42 PM
Believe me GoRed if I had the answers I would throw in my 2 cents but I am going with the glass being 1/2 full.

6 of 8 may be pushing it a bit but one can only hope. :-)

I think maybe we should start on practicing from the line...............what is with that???  It is called a free throw for a reason!!

Here's to the Big Red making some noise from here on out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 26, 2010, 06:23:45 PM
And here's to Chris Luther, who will probably be the next NCAC player to get to the 1,000 milestone! 

Kenyon is a game we can win.  We have to contain J.T. and find someone that can box Knapke.  Time to play dome D and break the streak.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2010, 07:08:27 PM
Your guide to Wednesday's NCAC action, including the much-discussed Denison/Kenyon Backyard Brawl:

Kenyon (2-6) at Denison (3-5), 6pm -- Live stats and audio (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html) -- Game 1 of a men/women doubleheader
Hiram (5-3) at Wooster (8-0), 7:30pm -- Live everything (http://www.wooster.edu/en/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule)
Ohio Wesleyan (5-3) at Wabash (6-2), 7:30pm -- Live stats and audio (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball)
Oberlin (0-8) at Allegheny (5-3), ~8pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/) -- Game 2 of a women/men doubleheader
Wittenberg (5-3) at Earlham (1-7), ~8pm -- Live audio (Witt) (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html) -- Game 2 of a women/men doubleheader
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2010, 07:10:25 PM
Quote from: GoRed on January 26, 2010, 06:23:45 PM
And here's to Chris Luther, who will probably be the next NCAC player to get to the 1,000 milestone! 

Chase Haltom should also get to 1,000 career points tomorrow  night.  Chase currently sits with 998 points in his Wabash career. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 27, 2010, 08:36:21 AM
Glad I qualified it with "probably".  Another excellent career.  Congrats to Chase, too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 27, 2010, 10:16:47 AM
Speaking of 1,000 point scorers, Ian Franks is on pace to break the milestone probably sometime in the NCAC tournament.  This is pretty impressive for him to go over 1,000 points as a junior considering he only scored 54 points as a frosh!  :o  One can only imagine where he would land on the Scots' all-time scoring list had he not waited until his sophomore season to explode onto the scene.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 27, 2010, 02:31:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 26, 2010, 07:08:27 PM
Your guide to Wednesday's NCAC action, including the much-discussed Denison/Kenyon Backyard Brawl:

Kenyon (2-6) at Denison (3-5), 6pm -- Live stats and audio (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html) -- Game 1 of a men/women doubleheader
Hiram (5-3) at Wooster (8-0), 7:30pm -- Live everything (http://www.wooster.edu/en/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule)
Ohio Wesleyan (5-3) at Wabash (6-2), 7:30pm -- Live stats and audio (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball)
Oberlin (0-8) at Allegheny (5-3), ~8pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/) -- Game 2 of a women/men doubleheader
Wittenberg (5-3) at Earlham (1-7), ~8pm -- Live audio (Witt) (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html) -- Game 2 of a women/men doubleheader

And, in as much as my contribution counts as "coverage", I'll be tweeting from Chadwick tonight (http://twitter.com/wallywabash) as the action happens. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 27, 2010, 08:15:02 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 26  Hiram 24

Scots are being led by Ian Franks by 12 points and Bryan Wickliffe with 4 points.

Hiram's top scorers are Chris Meyer with 6 points, Deon Milton with 5 points and Chris Roberts with 4 points.

8:50 Left:  Wooster 51  Hiram 36
5:31 Left:  Wooster 57  Hiram 39


At the Half:  Ohio Wesleyan 44  Wabash 34

13:52 Left:  OWU 57  Wabash 43
10:17 Left:  OWU 60  Wabash 47
4:07 Left:    OWU 68  Wabash 55
2:49 Left:    OWU 68  Wabash 61   Lil Giants on a run
1:17 Left:    OWU 68  Wabash 63
0:28 Left:    OWU 69  Wabash 65  Bishops missing FTs
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 27, 2010, 08:50:34 PM
Final:  Wooster 67  Hiram 43 :)

Wooster got hot in the 2nd half with both Nathan Balch and Justin Hallowell hitting multiple 3 pointers.  Scots were led by Ian Franks with 18 points, Nathan Balch with 16 points (4 three pointers in 2nd half) and Justin Hallowell with 12 points (4 three pointers in the game).  Bryan Wickliffe added 6 points and 10 boards.

Terriers were led in scoring by Chris Meyer with 10 points and Chris Roberts with 9 points.

Wooster is now 14-4, 9-0 NCAC ;D   Next up is Denison at home on Saturday

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 27, 2010, 08:56:45 PM
Wittenberg 39
Earlham 27
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 27, 2010, 08:57:30 PM
Final:  Denison 81  Kenyon 66

Dimonde Hale with 25 points and Chris Luther with 17 points for the Big Red.  Dave Knapke had 18 for the Lords.


Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 73  Wabash 67

Bishops led by Tim Brady with 22 points, Marshall Morris with 15 points and Pat Pellerite with 11 points.  Little Giants led by Aaron Brock with 23 points, Chase Haltom with 12 points and Ben Burkett also with 12 points.

Final:  Wittenberg 88  Earlham 64

Tigers were led by Chris Sullivan with 20 points (6 three pointers!) and Mark Snyder with 12 points.  Quake was led by AJ Sutherlin with 16 points and Shane Heidt with 12 points.


Final:  Allegheny 81  Oberlin 66
Gators were led by George Raftis with 19 points and Charlie Jaicks with 16 points.  For the Yeomen, top scorers were Andrew Fox with 17 points and Marcus Johnson with 13 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 27, 2010, 09:31:19 PM
.....the belt is getting bored.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 27, 2010, 09:53:14 PM
Current NCAC Standings with 1/27 Results:

1.  Wooster 9-0
2.  Wittenberg 6-3
2.  Wabash 6-3
2.  Ohio Wesleyan 6-3
2.  Allegheny 6-3
6.  Hiram 5-4
7.  Denison 4-5
8.  Kenyon 2-7
9.  Earlham 1-8
10. Oberlin 0-9
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 27, 2010, 09:57:17 PM
Quote from: sac on January 27, 2010, 09:31:19 PM
.....the belt is getting bored.

for 20 minutes this evening, several Terriers tried to bite the belt, then some Bagpiper threw them a bone and ran off with the belt! :D :) ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 27, 2010, 10:29:18 PM
good win by Wittenberg after a rough last week. After a disappointing week a big win versus anyone cools the moods.

Speaking of "disappointing," is there any team more disappointing this year than Kenyon? They started out the season with high hopes, and have struggled mightly. Yes a rivalry game and road loss to Denison isn't unexpected but as a whole I don't think anyone saw this coming.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 27, 2010, 11:00:52 PM
Well, lookie who's tied for second place all of a sudden... ;D

Yeah, Kenyon's been a big disappointment, but we knew all along that they were going to struggle unless and until someone stepped up to help the Brothers K (Knight and Knapke), and that has not happened.  Both of the Ks are having excellent seasons, but it just ain't enough.  They've very young, and maybe the experience the frosh and sophs are getting this year will help them give JT a hand next year.  Maybe.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 27, 2010, 11:13:57 PM
That was a tough way to end the streak.  OWU started very strong in the first half.  The Bishop guards were able to drive into the paint, often along the baseline, which was forcing Wabash post defenders to choose between picking up the dribbler or letting him go.  The downside to that choice is that it leads to a layup either way.  So the Wabash defense couldn't force OWU to try something different...on offense, Wabash took a LOT of poor shots in the first 10 minutes or so.  A lot of hurried, long distance shots...they weren't even bothering to challenge OWU inside early.  End result, Wabash is down 29-13, OWU has all the confidence in the world, and the road back into the game was uphill.  At a significant grade.  

Credit to the LGs for coming back in the second half...of the second half.  Two more minutes and Wabash may have been able to get over the hump.  But these games don't last two more minutes.  

So it was bound to happen...hoops seasons are long and it's hard to be at your best every night.  Usual strengths for this year's Wabash team (good shot selection, high FG%, high FT%) were weaknesses tonight.  Couple that with OWU having played a fantastic game and it was just too much for Wabash tonight.  

Wabash had four players in double figures: Brock (23 and 15....another monster game for the senior), Burkett and Haltom (12 points), and Smith (11 points...OWU did a good job of forcing the ball out of Smith's hand tonight).  Haltom did go over 1,000 career points tonight.  Congrats to Chase.  

And with that loss it's pretty safe to say game, set, match to Wooster.  I think we could have believed scenarios where Wooster may lose two of their last eight, but not three.  And certainly not three of their last seven.  It will be interesting now to see which of the four teams jammed at 6-3 will wind up on the road in the quarterfinals.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 27, 2010, 11:40:00 PM
Wooster may be struggling to find their shot of late, but one area they are NOT struggling is on the defensive end of the floor!  For the 4th straight game and the 5th in their last 6 games, the Scots defense holds their opponent under 60!

Tonight, it was Wooster's defense by far that won this game.  When the Scots couldn't get anything to fall early in the game, it was their defense that kept Hiram from getting into any rhythm of their own.  And once the offense did finally get going to the tune of 41 points in the 2nd half, the Scots clamped down even more defensively holding Hiram to just 19!  8-)

With Wooster's win coupled with Wabash's loss, I think I might be able to hear the fat lady starting to warm up.  As Wally said, it is highly inconceivable to think that Wooster would drop 3 of their last 8 and now 3 of their last 7.  Wooster hasn't won 5 straight conference championships without knowing how to finish down the stretch.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 28, 2010, 06:42:35 AM
As ScotsFan mentions, the Wooster defense was excellent last night for the entire game.  Hiram could never get anything going and had almost no open shots all night.  Chris Roberts in particular could not shake his defenders, usually Brandon Johnson or Matt Fegan.

I think that special mention should be given to Jake Mays.  He ended up with extended minutes last night, due to a minor injury to Josh Claytor, and he really stepped up his game. He was able to avoid the foul trouble that he's had in many games, played great defense and contributed a couple of nice buckets as well.

And for the first time in - well, I can't remember when - the Scots played zone for 3 or 4 posessions at the end of the game!  This coincided with Gideon Mabeny entering the game, so I'm guessing that the purpose is to keep him under the basket.

The last couple of games, we've seen glimpses of the Scots' team that we were expecting this year.  They still need to be more consistent and it would be nice to see a strong start, but hopefully they'll continue to improve and be ready for an extended post-season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 28, 2010, 09:46:14 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 28, 2010, 06:42:35 AM

The last couple of games, we've seen glimpses of the Scots' team that we were expecting this year.  They still need to be more consistent and it would be nice to see a strong start, but hopefully they'll continue to improve and be ready for an extended post-season.


I was thinking the same think derek.  We are at least getting glimpses of what we were expecting from this Scots team this season.  That is a start right?  :)  Like you said though.  It would be nice to see them come out firing instead of continuing to struggle to get going for the first 10 minutes or so of every game.  But, it looks as though things are headed in the right direction!

Also, wrt Claytor.  He had a mild groin pull and Moore said he was available if the need arose where Wick or Mays got into early foul trouble.  But, Tom Love was pretty insistent that the best thing for Josh was to sit out.  And fortunately for the Scots it worked out just great as Wick and Mays were both able to stay out of foul trouble and Wooster was able to win comfortably without Claytor's services.  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 28, 2010, 09:59:33 AM
Looking ahead to Denison, I see we have a new 1,000 point scorer in the house.

Congrats to Chris Luther for eclipsing the mark last night in a win over Kenyon!

As for the Big Red, I'm not really sure what to make of them.  They have a win over Wabash.  They nearly knocked off OWU in Deleware.  They gave Allegheny a game in Meadeville.  But, they had lost 5 straight heading into their showdown with Kenyon where they proceeded to thump their rivals quite convincingly.  I can honestly say, that is not the result I was expecting.

I'm hoping that Wooster's good form will carry over to this game with DU on Saturday.  I really don't want to see another performance like they put up in both their games vs. Kenyon or in their games with the EC or Oberlin.  If they can clamp down defensively and win as convincingly as they did last night vs. Hiram, there's no reason to think that Wooster shouldn't be able to put away the Big Red rather convincingly as well.  But, given the Scots' propensity to play at the level of their opponents so often this season, I'm preparing myself for a game that will be closer than what it should be.  Hopefully the Scots will take note of that 81-66 beatdown that the Big Red gave the Lords last night and prepare themselves for a tougher game than they may have originally thought.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2010, 12:18:10 PM
I didn't think the Scots even practiced the zone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2010, 07:21:35 PM
On tap for Saturday:

Porter: Wabash (6-3) at Kenyon (2-7), 1pm -- Live everything (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml) -- Game 1 of a DH, women vs. Allegheny at 3
Stout: OWU (6-3) at Hiram (5-4), 3pm -- Live everything (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html)
Non-Alcoholic: Earlham (1-8) at Oberlin (0-9), ~3pm -- Live everything (http://www.goyeo.com/) -- Game 2 of a women/men DH
Pale Ale: Allegheny (6-3) at Wittenberg (6-3), ~4pm -- Live everything (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html) -- Game 2 of a DH, women vs. OWU (for the conference lead!) at 2pm
Light Lager: Denison (4-5) at Wooster (9-0), 7:30pm -- Live everything (http://www.wooster.edu/en/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule) (I think there's a charge for video) + live alternate Woo audio (http://www3.wooster.edu/woo91/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 30, 2010, 10:19:22 AM
Upset watch: Kenyon vs Wabash.......only cause I called them out on the carpet this week
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 30, 2010, 10:41:07 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 29, 2010, 07:21:35 PM
On tap for Saturday:

Porter: Wabash (6-3) at Kenyon (2-7), 1pm -- Live everything (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml) -- Game 1 of a DH, women vs. Allegheny at 3
Stout: OWU (6-3) at Hiram (5-4), 3pm -- Live everything (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html)
Non-Alcoholic: Earlham (1-8) at Oberlin (0-9), ~3pm -- Live everything (http://www.goyeo.com/) -- Game 2 of a women/men DH
Pale Ale: Allegheny (6-3) at Wittenberg (6-3), ~4pm -- Live everything (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html) -- Game 2 of a DH, women vs. OWU (for the conference lead!) at 2pm
Light Lager: Denison (4-5) at Wooster (9-0), 7:30pm -- Live everything (http://www.wooster.edu/en/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule) (I think there's a charge for video) + live alternate Woo audio (http://www3.wooster.edu/woo91/)

Are we talking something along the lines of Great Lakes Dortmuder or Miller Lite.  Usually, I'm not much into Lite beers, but in this case, I'd be willing to make an exception.  Although, if you were talking a beer like Dortmunder, keep the tap flowing!   :P   ;D   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 30, 2010, 11:45:34 AM
It may be a "light lager" matchup ;) but I hope that Wooster doesn't take Denision too "lightly" tonight.

Which Big Red squad shows up tonight?
- The team that beat Wabash earlier this season?
- The team that just waxed Kenyon by 15 points, a bigger margin than Wooster's wins over the Lords?
- The team that nearly beat Wooster in Timken last year before an incredible 3 pointer by Hallowell forced OT?

When I make the trek to Timken this evening, I hope to see some "Stout" :P defense by Wooster so they can register another NCAC win!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 30, 2010, 12:37:48 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 30, 2010, 11:45:34 AM
It may be a "light lager" matchup ;) but I hope that Wooster doesn't take Denision too "lightly" tonight.

Which Big Red squad shows up tonight?
- The team that beat Wabash earlier this season?
- The team that just waxed Kenyon by 15 points, a bigger margin than Wooster's wins over the Lords?
- The team that nearly beat Wooster in Timken last year before an incredible 3 pointer by Hallowell forced OT?

When I make the trek to Timken this evening, I hope to see some "Stout" :P defense by Wooster so they can register another NCAC win!
GO SCOTS!

Niiiice!  :D

Your mentioning of Denison beating Kenyon by a wider margin than Wooster beat the Lords got me thinking.  Wooster's average margin of victory over the top teams in the league (Witt, Wabash, OWU, Hiram) is larger than their average margin of vicrtory over the bottom dwellars of the conference (Oberlin, the EC, Kenyon).  Go figure?!  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 30, 2010, 01:23:45 PM
Kenyon has the early lead on Wabash, 16-13 with just over 8 minutes to go in the first half.  Wabash is shooting cold to start here as they are just 5-17 so far.  JT Knight is not dressed today for Kenyon.  With Kenyon missing one of their top two players, Wabash can not miss on this opportunity.  LGs need to pick it up here.  

Halftime in Gambier...Kenyon leads 30-27.  Wabash is 10-29 shooting, 5-15 on 3's.  Over half of Wabash's shots are three pointers.  Wabash shot just two free throws in the first half.  That is not Wabash's game.  Not even remotely.  Knapke leads Kenyon with 12 points.  Haltom leads Wabash with 9 points.  Aaron Brock scored 8 points before having to leave with three personal fouls.  Get it to the paint, gentlemen.  

Six and a half minutes into the second half...Wabash has taken 10 shots, 8 of them three pointers.  That is exactly the opposite of what needs to be happening.  Wabash does have a four point lead, but this is brutal.  Brock and Burkett both have four fouls now, so it looks like Wabash is going to win or lose strictly from the perimeter today...an uneasy proposition to say the least.  Smith splits free throws and Wabash leads 39-34 with 13:08 to play.

Kenyon is throwing a 2-3 zone at Wabash and the LGs are completely clueless as to how to get the ball inside against it.  OWU did the same thing on Wednesday night.  This will need to be addressed.  

6:41 to play, Wabash leads 41-39.  The three point attempt tally is up to 28 for Wabash.  Twenty freaking eight.  I'm at a loss to explain what the LGs are doing here today.  Kenyon has used 6 players.  Just six.  Wabash's lack of aggressive play is letting the Lords get away with not using their bench.  

Kenyon has tied the game at 41-41.  5:41 to play.  LGs are shooting 28.6% in the game.  Ugh.  

Tied at 45-45, 2:20 to go.  My computer is going to need a virus scan when this game is over.  

1:05 to play....Wabash leads 49-47.  Kenyon is in a timeout and will have the ball.

0:21 to go...Wabash calls a timeout with the ball and 12 seconds left to shoot.  LGs maintain their 49-47 lead.  

Wabash misses a, wait for it, 3 pointer but Kenyon can't control the rebound and Wabash comes away with it.  Brock gets fouled, splits his foul shots and Kenyon has the ball, down 50-47 with 5 seconds to play.  Wabash has missed TWENTY FIVE 3 point shots in this game.  

Just when you thought this game couldn't get uglier, Kenyon's inbounder runs the baseline after a timeout...turnover.  Wabash inbounds, Brock is fouled and he makes two shots.  Five point lead, and that will do it. 

Wabash "wins" 52-47.  And I need a shower after that game.  LGs shot 28.1% for the game [/shudder]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 30, 2010, 01:53:09 PM
JT Knight is not playing for reasons of "coach's decision."  Pretty gutsy move on Matt Croci's part, and one I admire him for.  Kenyon's looking pretty good in JT's absence, especially on defense.

I leave this game in your tender mercies, Wally; it's time to switch over to today's Main Event--the OWU (8-1) at Witt (9-0) women's battle for the conference lead.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 30, 2010, 04:04:34 PM
OWU has some work to do up in Hiram or else all that Mo they had going for them will be caputski.

Hiram is up 8 (53-45) with just over 10 minutes remaining.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 30, 2010, 04:15:08 PM
And I thought the Scots game at Kenyon was ugly!  I decided to stop at the Palace in Gambier for the afternoon tilt before heading up to Wooster.  Much like the game against the Scots, Kenyon led most of the 1st half, but 'Bash kept it close and hit a big 3 to make it a 3-pt game at the break.  Haltom hit some big 3's to start the 2nd period, but the Lords hung around, helped by Wabash's poor shooting.  Kenyon gave it all they had, but with Knight not dressing they only played 6 players and just didn't have anything left at the end.  Wabash won the game by cleaning up on the boards with 17 offensive rebounds, including huge 2nd chances in the last couple of posessions.  

In tonight's game, lets hope that the Scots can maintain the defensive intensity that they've been showing lately and take care of the ball.  On paper this looks like a big win for the Scots, but it probably did last year, too.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 30, 2010, 05:17:57 PM
Well, OWU's conference title hopes pretty much ended today.  They fall at Hiram 79-71.  That leaves Witt and Wabash 3 games behind front running Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 30, 2010, 05:23:21 PM
And in the last afternoon game for the day, Witt and Allegheny are in a tight one:

Witt leads 41-40.  Under 15 to play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 30, 2010, 06:03:23 PM
Great results for Wabash today....OWU and Witt lose.  Gheny wins, but Wabash owns h2h with the Gators.  As poor as Wabash looked today, I don't think the standings could have finished better for the LGs at the end of play today. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 30, 2010, 10:01:22 PM
Well, Wednesday I came away very impressed by the defensive performance from the Scots. And today, while they still played pretty good defense, it was the offense that stole the show for Wooster!  Haven't been able to say that for a while!   ;D  It's amazing how many points you score when you don't take 10 minutes to get into the game.  For the first time in a long time, the Scots came out firing from the opening tip and really never had a let-down offensively.

About the only Scot that struggled offensively tonight was Justin Hallowell.  But Justin did snag a game high 12 rebounds to make up for his offensive woes.  Other than that, Wooster just put on a clinic placing 4 in double figures led once again by Mr. Franks who dropped in a cool 30 and had a 3-4 performance from deep to go with it!  Joining Franks in double figures were Bryan Wickliffe and Nate Balch with 18 apiece.  Both had nice games inside and outside respectively.  And Matt Fegan rounded out the double digit scorers with 13. 

Wooster shot 54% from the floor and though they only shot 40% from deep, Franks, Fegan and Balch combined to go 10-15.  The rest of the team went 2-15.

Wooster moves to 10-0 in the NCAC and maintains their 3 game lead over Wabash and Allegheny.  Wooster has also quietly won 10 in a row now.  Up next is a rematch with 2nd place Allegheny who should be coming into this game riding some confidence after their win at Witt today and the fact that they had Wooster all but beat 3 weeks ago in Meadville.  I will say this.  The Scots are playing better on both ends than they were on that Wednesday in Meadville 3 weeks ago.  Wooster might just be putting it all together for the first time really all season and at just the right time too!  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 30, 2010, 11:14:27 PM
Back from Timken where I watched Ian Franks put on a POY performance with 30 points on 11 of 16 from the floor including 4 of 5 from the three point arc!  He also had 4 boards and 5 assists on the night. ;D

ScotsFan is absolutely right that Wooster's offense dominated the game as Denison had no answer for Wooster's passing and shooting tonight.  Wooster also dominated the glass as well with a 44 to 28 advantage on rebounds.

Nathan Balch, Bryan Wickliffe and Matt Fegan all played well this evening and the two freshmen bigs, Claytor and Mays, are looking more comfortable with each game played.

Allegheny should give the Scots a tougher test next Wednesday as they had a nice win today vs. Witt.  Gators have won 4 in a row.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 30, 2010, 11:25:58 PM
1/30 NCAC Final Scores:

Wooster 97  Denison 73
Wabash 52  Kenyon 47
Allegheny 60  Wittenberg 56
Hiram 79  Ohio Wesleyan 71
Oberlin 71  Earlham 68


Current NCAC Standings with 1/30 Results:

1.  Wooster 10-0
2.  Wabash 7-3
2.  Allegheny 7-3
4.  Hiram 6-4
4.  Wittenberg 6-4
4.  Ohio Wesleyan 6-4
7.  Denison 4-6
8.  Kenyon 2-8
9.  Oberlin 1-9
9.  Earlham 1-9
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on January 31, 2010, 06:33:09 PM
Witt has to play like inspired basketball like they did to start the season.  They have the offensive threats to beat any team in the NCAC-- Let's go Witt!!!  End the season strong!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 31, 2010, 10:05:04 PM
How important is that #2 seed?  There are five teams within a game of each other (and second place).  One of those teams will get to play Denison in the tournament.  The other four get to play each other.  This race for #2 should be fun to watch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 01, 2010, 07:36:18 AM
Yeah and if you can't get the 2 seed, the 3 seed may not be so bad. It's better than the 4/5/6 which gets you possibly a road game first round and a date with Wooster Friday night.

Big time week for Wittenberg ahead. A TOUGH venue for Wittenberg Wednesday at Ohio Wesleyan, a place they've struggled mightly as of late. A win would do wonders for their confidence. And then another tough one Saturday vs Hiram in Springfield, another team they've had issues with lately.

Go TIGERS!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2010, 09:06:04 AM
Actually, the 6 may not be so bad since it's a roadie with the 3, but with the conference so close that may not be insurmountable.

If you can't get 2 or 3, you probably want to avoid 4 or 5 for the Wooster factor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 01, 2010, 10:30:44 AM
I think there's a huge difference between #2 and #3.  Mostly because I think there's a huge difference between Denison and whoever winds up as #6.  Would you want to host Denison or OWU right now?  It's not even close. 

The secondary benefit is that you don't have to play Wooster on Friday night, but if you're going to win the tournament you probably have to beat Wooster anyway (unless you're OWU in 2008....you're welcome). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 01, 2010, 12:31:41 PM
I'm actually hoping Denison ends up as the 8 seed with the way Wooster has struggled against Kenyon this season...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2010, 07:59:21 PM
Denison frosh Dimonde Hale, one of if not the leading contender for Newcomer of the Year, has been awarded the NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html) for the last week of January.  Hale's 25 points were instrumental in DU's thrashing of backyard rival Kenyon on Wednesday.  Congratulations, Dimonde!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 01, 2010, 09:25:54 PM
Go Dimonde.

Hey, Wally.  We hope Wabash ends up Number 2!!  I'd love to have a real shot at the semi's instead of having to play Wooster again. ;D  Not saying we have a 7 locked up yet, though, so if we end up number 8, I hope there's a miracle and the LG's win the conference!   

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 01, 2010, 11:29:00 PM
I understand that on paper that Wooster is in a prime position right now, but I think it is a little premature to be crowning them regular season champs. I think you can realistically build a case that they could lose any of the next five games they play. Three of the teams (Allegheny, Witt and OWU) gave Wooster all they could handle the first time through, and Wabash and Hiram are games on the road, where they lost and nearly lost, respectively, last year. Now, if I had to predict, I would say that Wooster loses Sunday at Wabash, and possibly drops a game to either Witt or OWU. But lets not forget that just two weeks ago Wooster struggled to beat Oberlin, and just one week ago scored just 26 points in the first half against Hiram. I want to see a couple of more complete games from Wooster before I think they have this wrapped up.

As for the NCAC Tournament, obviously having the home court advantage is ideal, but it hasn't necessarily translated into titles for Wooster. In fact, Wooster has hosted the last five conference tournaments, yet has only won two of them, and both of those wins (2007 & 2009) came against teams that were not the No. 2 seed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 02, 2010, 12:03:35 AM
If Wooster blows a three game lead with six to play, not only should they not host the conference tournament, they should probably go ahead and just withdraw entirely.  The race here is for #2. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 02, 2010, 12:19:45 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 26, 2010, 12:27:49 AM
I don't know of any conference that doesn't base conference honors on conference-only performance.

I don't know of any conference that states exactly how a coach should consider players when voting for All-Conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 02, 2010, 12:44:27 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 02, 2010, 12:19:45 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 26, 2010, 12:27:49 AM
I don't know of any conference that doesn't base conference honors on conference-only performance.

I don't know of any conference that states exactly how a coach should consider players when voting for All-Conference.

Nor do I, for stating it.  But c'mon - it is a conference honor.

Common sense says it is what you do in conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 02, 2010, 12:49:13 AM
Which is fine -- but you don't know of any conference doing it that way because no conference actually talks about how it does it. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 02, 2010, 10:02:23 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 01, 2010, 11:29:00 PM
I understand that on paper that Wooster is in a prime position right now, but I think it is a little premature to be crowning them regular season champs. I think you can realistically build a case that they could lose any of the next five games they play. Three of the teams (Allegheny, Witt and OWU) gave Wooster all they could handle the first time through, and Wabash and Hiram are games on the road, where they lost and nearly lost, respectively, last year. Now, if I had to predict, I would say that Wooster loses Sunday at Wabash, and possibly drops a game to either Witt or OWU. But lets not forget that just two weeks ago Wooster struggled to beat Oberlin, and just one week ago scored just 26 points in the first half against Hiram. I want to see a couple of more complete games from Wooster before I think they have this wrapped up.


The reason I feel a little more comfortable today than I did a week ago is two-fold.  Not only does Wooster have to lose 3 of it's last 6, but the teams chasing Wooster also have to run the table.  If Wooster beats Allegheny tomorrow night, the Gators are done.  And even if Wooster were to lose at Wabash, Wabash still has to turn around and win road games at Witt (which they have never done at the HPER) and at OWU (who already beat the Lil Giants in C'ville).

So, I guess while it is possible that Wooster could lose 3 or more of their last 6 games, I find it very improbable.  Furthermore, I also find it very improbable that the teams chasing Wooster are going to suddenly win out.  I mean, Witt lost at home to Allegheny and OWU lost at Hiram just last Saturday.  Hardly ringing endorsements for teams that need to win out to have any chance at catching Wooster.

As far as Wooster having yet to convince you with their recent improved play, yes, Wooster did struggle to put away games against Oberlin and the EC, but I would say their play over the last 3 games, including Wittenberg, is about the best stretch of play this team has performed all season.  Seinfeld, you mentioned that Witt gave Wooster all they could handle which is true to an extent.  But you also have to remember that Wooster basically spotted Witt an 11 point lead early in that game.  From that point on, Wooster outscored Witt by 21 points the remainder of the game and that was in Springfield.

I do see what you mean as far as not being completely sold on Wooster just yet.  But at least they have played by far their best basketball of the season over their last 2 1/2 to even 3 games.  I too would like to still see more from the Scots, but at least they have given us a glimpse that they just might have turned the corner and are ready to finish off this season on a strong note.  Of course, Wooster will have another chance to prove themselves tomorrow night up on the hill when Allegheny comes to town.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 02, 2010, 10:10:55 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 01, 2010, 11:29:00 PM
As for the NCAC Tournament, obviously having the home court advantage is ideal, but it hasn't necessarily translated into titles for Wooster. In fact, Wooster has hosted the last five conference tournaments, yet has only won two of them, and both of those wins (2007 & 2009) came against teams that were not the No. 2 seed.

Yes, Wooster has only won 2 of the last 5 conference tournaments they have hosted.  But, going back to the 2004 and 2005 tournaments, those were both 2 point losses to very good Wittenberg teams.  In fact, that 2005 Wittenberg team nearly won it all!  And Wooster has won 2 of the last 3 conference tournaments they have hosted and could make it 3 of 4 this season.

It sounds a little better when put in those perspectives...  ;) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 02, 2010, 01:02:31 PM
While I still believe Wooster has the regular season a little less locked up than other people do, I wanted to throw a little caution out there since no one seemed to want to do it, and as Go Red has pointed, I do nothing but complain. :) Lets just say I'm channeling Coach Moore, who would still think the conference was up in the air if he had Oberlin and Earlham at home for the last two games with a two-game lead.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 02, 2010, 01:35:21 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 02, 2010, 01:02:31 PM
While I still believe Wooster has the regular season a little less locked up than other people do, I wanted to throw a little caution out there since no one seemed to want to do it, and as Go Red has pointed, I do nothing but complain. :) Lets just say I'm channeling Coach Moore, who would still think the conference was up in the air if he had Oberlin and Earlham at home for the last two games with a two-game lead.

LOL!  :D  That is so true...

But, you could also say that Coach Moore's reluctance to take anything for granted is exactly why the Scots are so good at finishing off NCAC championships at this time of year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 02, 2010, 07:19:36 PM
Wally,

I keep forgetting to ask, but wrt Wooster's game at Wabash this Sunday, will the Super Bowl have any impact on attendance for the game?  Seeing that Wabash is in the heart of Colts territory, I would think there would be quite a few Super Bowl parties going on that afternoon?

Maybe tipoff is early enough that it won't have much of a bearing at all.  Just something I was wondering about...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 02, 2010, 07:55:36 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 02, 2010, 07:19:36 PM
Wally,

I keep forgetting to ask, but wrt Wooster's game at Wabash this Sunday, will the Super Bowl have any impact on attendance for the game?  Seeing that Wabash is in the heart of Colts territory, I would think there would be quite a few Super Bowl parties going on that afternoon?

Maybe tipoff is early enough that it won't have much of a bearing at all.  Just something I was wondering about...

The Super Bowl won't keep me away! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 02, 2010, 08:08:49 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 02, 2010, 07:19:36 PM
Wally,

I keep forgetting to ask, but wrt Wooster's game at Wabash this Sunday, will the Super Bowl have any impact on attendance for the game?  Seeing that Wabash is in the heart of Colts territory, I would think there would be quite a few Super Bowl parties going on that afternoon?

Maybe tipoff is early enough that it won't have much of a bearing at all.  Just something I was wondering about...

My guess is that it will.  Wabash played Denison (I think) on the same day as the Colts/Ravens game a few weeks ago.  The crowd was relatively light and about half of those that were there were wearing blue.  The level of hype around this weekend's football game is insane around here.  It's insane enough because the Colts are playing, but Drew Brees is also playing and I have vastly underestimated how much people here apparently care about his pro career.  There's a lot of "I want Indy to win, but I want Drew to have a good game too" stuff going on here (yes...people here are apparently on a first name basis with Drew Brees).  I'm actually very concerned about whether or not the general population of Lafayette can handle this game.  Colts!  Drew!!  Peyton!!!  AHHHH!!!  Heads might actually explode.  

I'll be missing the front end of my Super Bowl party to be at the game on Sunday, but then again I'm not a Colts honk.  I hope I'm wrong, but my guess is that most of the native Hoosiers (which is most of Wabash's student body) are going to be well into their own gatherings by Sunday afternoon.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2010, 11:21:52 PM
What is this "Super Bowl" of which you speak? ???

Super Wednesday's Super Slate:
Allegheny (7-3) at Wooster (10-0), 7:30pm -- Live everything (http://www.wooster.edu/en/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule) (and the video is free this time) plus live alt.audio (http://www3.wooster.edu/woo91/)
Earlham (1-9) at Wabash (7-3), 7:30pm -- Live everything including Wally World (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball)
Hiram (6-4) at Denison (4-6), 7:30pm -- Live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html)
Oberlin (1-9) at Kenyon (2-8), 7:30pm -- Live everything (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
Wittenberg (6-4) at OWU (6-4), 7:30pm -- Live everything (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html) including tweeting (http://twitter.com/StreamOWUSports)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 02, 2010, 11:53:07 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 02, 2010, 08:08:49 PMIt's insane enough because the Colts are playing, but Drew Brees is also playing and I have vastly underestimated how much people here apparently care about his pro career.  There's a lot of "I want Indy to win, but I want Drew to have a good game too" stuff going on here

I'm sure that the exact same phenomenon in reverse is occurring right now in the Big Easy, whose most beloved native son is going to be playing QB against the Saints next Sunday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 03, 2010, 09:43:15 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 02, 2010, 08:08:49 PM

I'm actually very concerned about whether or not the general population of Lafayette can handle this game.  Colts!  Drew!!  Peyton!!!  AHHHH!!!  Heads might actually explode.  


Too funny!  :)


Quote from: wally_wabash on February 02, 2010, 08:08:49 PM

I'll be missing the front end of my Super Bowl party to be at the game on Sunday, but then again I'm not a Colts honk.  I hope I'm wrong, but my guess is that most of the native Hoosiers (which is most of Wabash's student body) are going to be well into their own gatherings by Sunday afternoon. 

I figured you wouldn't miss out on the Wabash game as you're an Oregonian and probably aren't as invested in the Colts or the Brees mania that most native Hoosiers are...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 03, 2010, 09:56:54 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 03, 2010, 09:43:15 AM
I figured you wouldn't miss out on the Wabash game as you're an Oregonian and probably aren't as invested in the Colts or the Brees mania that most native Hoosiers are...  ;)

That and it's the Wooster game.  I almost didn't make the trip down for the Wooster game last year (for reasons passing understanding...and I can't exactly remember).  I was definitely glad that I talked myself into going and seeing Wabash finally win one against the Scots at Chadwick.  It's a big time game.  If Wabash can get a win against Wooster, that'll be a game they gain on most of the rest of the league and in the chase for second place, that one game is crucial. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 03, 2010, 06:30:46 PM
First NCAA Regional Rankings released today.  Pleasant surprise at the top IMO  :):

Great Lakes Region

1. Wooster 15-3  8-)
2. Wilmington (Ohio) 13-4 
3. Hope 8-2
4. Calvin 8-2
5. Penn State-Behrend 13-3
6. Thomas More 14-5
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 03, 2010, 08:05:34 PM
Wooster is off to another GREAT start on both ends of the floor!

At the half:

Wooster - 46
Allegheny - 33

Wooster has led by as many as 16 so far in this one but Allegheny did manage to trim the lead to 10 before Josh Claytor got the kind bounce on a trey for the final margin at halftime.

Wooster is being led by Nate Balch with 12 points.  Ian Franks has 9 and Bryan Wickliffe has 8 to go along with 8 rebounds to lead Wooster.  Justin Hallowell is also 2-2 from deep for six points.  Allegheny is being led by, surprise surprise George Raftis with 9 points.

In another key matchup tonight, 23 seconds to halftime in Deleware:

Witt - 41
OWU - 36

Witt started this game 6-6 from downtown and currently have since gone 0-3.  Witt has led by as much as 16 so the Bishops have to be feeling good about where they are sitting!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 03, 2010, 08:11:16 PM
Halftime score at Livingston:  Hiram 31  Denison 15.  With the score tied Hiram 10 Dimonde 10 at the 13:57 mark, Steve Fleming decides it's time to go to the "rope-a-dope" to stop Hale and it works.  Hale goes 0-for-8 from the line and only makes one more bucket. 

I'm sure the braintrust will have the answer in the second half.  Eight is enough. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 03, 2010, 08:14:08 PM
As ScotsFan noted, it was good first half for Wooster as they shot 53% from the floor and held the Gators to only 41%.  :) Scots also outrebounded Allegheny 20 to 13 in the half.

Nathan Balch on 5 of 7 shooting is leading Wooster with 12 points while Ian Franks has 9 points and Bryan Wickliffe has chipped in 8 points, 8 boards.

George Raftis is leading the Gators with 9 points and Charlie Jaicks has added 6 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 03, 2010, 08:34:28 PM
With 13:18 left in the second half, Hiram hits a 3 to go up 42-20.  Ghiloni, sensing something is wrong, calls a timeout.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2010, 08:35:59 PM
Kenyon, still playing without JT Knight, is trailing Oberlin by a dime midway through the second half, and their playoff lives are on the line.
UPDATE: Oberlin wins 66-55 (at Kenyon!), moving into a tie for 8th place with the Lords.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 03, 2010, 09:04:04 PM
Final:  Wooster 85  Allegheny 72   :)

Wooster had too many turnovers (11) in the 2nd half but they still notched the win.  Scots were led in scoring by Ian Franks with 19 points (8 assists), Bryan Wickliffe with 19 points (14 boards), Nathan Balch with 17 points (7 boards) and Matt Fegan with 11 points.

Top scorers for the Gators were George Raftis with 20 points, Charlie Jaicks with 18 points and Craig Devinney with 10 points.

Scots shot 51% from the floor and won the rebounding battle by a 39 to 30 count.

Wooster is now 16-4, 11-0 NCAC ;D   Next up is a tough road game at Wabash on Sunday afternoon.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2010, 09:06:58 PM
Other finals:

Hiram 71, Denison 62
Wabash 70, Earlham 42
Wittenberg 82, OWU 75
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 03, 2010, 09:15:58 PM
Wittenberg holds on to win 82   - 75   at Ohio Wesleyan.

This was a game of runs, as I tried to follow the video feed. The two "commentators" from OWU I don't think had their audio working, so I followed with a 3 second delay on Wittenberg's radio network.

Like I said after the first meeting, if OWU had any 3 point shooters, they'd be lethal. Generally speaking, missing 20+ 3 point shots in any game won't mean great results.

Big win for Wittenberg and overall team effort. Foul trouble on Josh McKee and Mark Snyder fouling out 9 minutes left in the game caused an already short handed Tiger squad to really buckle down.

Another big time game Saturday vs Hiram, who now with Wittenberg, Allegheny and Hiram are tied for 3rd in the conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 03, 2010, 09:17:15 PM
All the 2/3 NCAC Final Results:

Wittenberg 82  Ohio Wesleyan 75
Wooster 85  Allegheny 72
Wabash 70  Earlham 42
Oberlin 66  Kenyon 55
Hiram 71  Denison 62

Current NCAC Standings with 2/3 Results:

1.  Wooster 11-0
2.  Wabash 8-3
3.  Allegheny 7-4
3.  Hiram 7-4
3.  Wittenberg 7-4
6.  Ohio Wesleyan 6-5
7.  Denison 4-7
8.  Oberlin 2-9
8.  Kenyon 2-9
10. Earlham 1-10
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 03, 2010, 09:34:28 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 03, 2010, 06:30:46 PM
First NCAA Regional Rankings released today.  Pleasant surprise at the top IMO  :):

Great Lakes Region

1. Wooster 15-3  8-)
2. Wilmington (Ohio) 13-4 
3. Hope 8-2
4. Calvin 8-2
5. Penn State-Behrend 13-3
6. Thomas More 14-5

Wow...that IS a pleasant surprise.  I suppose that the Scots would still be in the running for a Pool C berth if they were to fall in the NCAC Tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 04, 2010, 08:56:57 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 03, 2010, 09:34:28 PM
Wow...that IS a pleasant surprise.  I suppose that the Scots would still be in the running for a Pool C berth if they were to fall in the NCAC Tournament.

I think if the Scots win out in the regular season and lose in the conference tournament, they should be a pretty safe bet for a Pool C.  I wouldn't feel too comfortable if Wooster were to lose another regular season game, however, and then lose again in the conference tournament.  That would make for a loooooong wait for the selection show for the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 04, 2010, 10:24:40 AM
You guys kill me.  You really think that if Wooster winds up with something like a 20-5 regional record, a 15-1 league record, in the year of an expanded field, and knowing that Wooster is tops in the regional rankings and probably won't fall out unless they go in the tank (which is a different scenario than the one being presented), that they won't be in?  Come on. 

I meant to post a little something on the Wabash/Earlham game but was immediately distracted by new Lost once I got home last night.  That and there really isn't a whole lot to say about the game.  After seeing Wabash struggle two games in a row against a zone defense, Earlham defied all expectation and played strictly man to man.  Bold move (bolder yet that Earlham doesn't have the personnel to win any of those m2m matchups) and one that I don't think Wabash saw coming.  The LGs adjusted in about three possessions and the game was pretty much a boat race from there.  Wes Smith led Wabash with 22 points.  Ben Burkett scored 17 points (career high), and Brock scored 13 points for the LGs.  Earlham's AJ Sutherlin was the only Quaker in double figures with 23 points.  In one of the stranger things I've seen on a hoops floor, Sutherlin scored Earlham's first 19 points and had Ryan Taylor's midrange J not fallen at the buzzer, Sutherlin would have scored all of EC's first half points.  Good game from AJ, but he had exactly zero help from his teammates last night.  Wabash shot 54% to Earlham's 33%.  The major advantage came in the painted area where Wabash outscored Earlham...wait for it...46-12. 

Next up is a Super Sunday (can I say that withour fear of penalty from the NFL?) matchup at Chadwick vs. the GL Region #1 Wooster Scots.  This is a big game for Wabash as a win over Wooster essentially amounts to a win against all of the teams Wabash is battling for the #2 spot.  WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on February 04, 2010, 01:02:39 PM
Congrats to Witt for posting their first road win against OWU for this senior class. These guys have been paying their dues and hopefully this is their year to get into the post season tourney--
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 05, 2010, 06:11:05 PM
Well, the weather isn't looking too promissing for tomorrow's games at the moment in NCAC land.   :-\

Looks like scheduling the Wooster/Wabash game on Super Bowl Sunday may have been a blessing in disguise!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2010, 10:01:13 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 05, 2010, 06:11:05 PM
Well, the weather isn't looking too promissing for tomorrow's games at the moment in NCAC land.   :-\
The Denison at Earlham game has already been pushed back to Sunday at 2pm.  Maybe I shouldn't bother with this, but here's the links as they stand now.  Each link can also be used to check on the status of the game:

Saturday:
Kenyon (2-9) at Allegheny (7-4), 1:15pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/) -- Game 1 of a DH, women vs. Wittenberg to follow
Oberlin (2-9) at OWU (6-5), 3pm -- Live stats (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html)
Hiram (7-4) at Wittenberg (7-4), 4pm7:30pm -- Live everything (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html)

Sunday:
Denison (4-7) at Earlham (1-10), 2pm -- Coverage? Link to EC's schedule page (http://goearlham.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball)
Wooster (11-0) at Wabash (8-3), 2pm -- Live everything (Wabash) (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball) + live audio (Wooster) (http://wqkt.com/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 06, 2010, 10:46:59 AM
Witt has pushed their game back with Hiram to 7:30.

Allegheny has graciously given Kenyon and extra 2 hours to make the trek from Gambier to Meadville.   ::)  And knowing the roads down around Gambier as well as those leading in to Meadville, I'm sure they'll need every bit of those extra 2 hours. 

That game is slotted to start at 3 pm now.

Oberlin and OWU appear to be still on for their 3 pm start time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2010, 11:41:34 AM
I changed the Witt/Hiram gametime in the link above.  As for the Allegheny game, Kenyon's website says 3pm, but that's not mentioned on the NCAC site or the Allegheny site, which still says 1pm.  Furthermore, 'Gheny already has a 3pm game: the women play Wittenberg then.  Witt is already there (this is their Big Trip weekend, and Witt travels in the absence of Wabash), so I'm sure their game is a go no matter the conditions (they could, of course, swap the tip times of the two games).  I was notified by Wittenberg about the change in the men's game, and they didn't mention a change in their women's game time, and their website still says 3pm.  So I guess I'm looking for confirmation.  ScotsFan, did you see that 3pm men's tip time anywhere besides the Kenyon website?  Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on February 06, 2010, 12:04:34 PM
No let downs today Witt!  Hiram is tough on them. Come out ready to play!!!

upset special-  WAF-  Wabash over Wooster- and the Colts win the Super Bowl. Good day for Wabash fans


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2010, 12:13:34 PM
I just got a confirmation (indirectly) from the relevant folks on-site at Allegheny, and the games are still as originally scheduled (with a 15 minute delay).  So the Kenyon/Allegheny men's game is presently set to tip at 1:15pm.

UPDATE: It's now underway, and 'Gheny is out to an early 16-7 lead.  The Lords are once again without JT Knight, who, I am told, may be back in time for the conference tournament, which Kenyon may or may not qualify for.  I should also point out that two contributors from the early going, junior Tim Shadyac and sophomore Jay Findley, no longer appear on the roster.  No wonder the Lords have been struggling of late.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 06, 2010, 01:28:18 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 06, 2010, 11:41:34 AM
ScotsFan, did you see that 3pm men's tip time anywhere besides the Kenyon website?  Thanks.

Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner.  I was digging out from the storm and playing with my girls and my 2 labs in this winter wonderland.   :) 

Anywho, I see it's all moot now as the game has already started.  :P

Now I'm off to make some hot cocoa.  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 06, 2010, 01:30:33 PM
Quote from: zander on February 06, 2010, 12:04:34 PM

upset special-  WAF-  Wabash over Wooster- and the Colts win the Super Bowl. Good day for Wabash fans


Oh yeah?  Well my upset special this week just happens to be Hiram over Witt...  :P   ;)   ;D 

Although, seeing how the pups already beat Witt would that be all that much of an upset?   :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2010, 01:40:33 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 06, 2010, 01:28:18 PM
Sorry I didn't get back to you sooner.  I was digging out from the storm and playing with my girls and my 2 labs in this winter wonderland.   :) 
Ah, snow.  I remember snow.  I still see some from time to time on top of the mountains.  Nasty stuff; I don't miss it.  ;D

Halftime in Meadville: Allegheny 30, Kenyon 15.  AC's Henry Heeter trails the entire Kenyon team by just one point.  KC's made just five baskets (three by Knapke) and committed 10 turnovers.  Ugh.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 06, 2010, 02:10:39 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 06, 2010, 12:13:34 PM
I just got a confirmation (indirectly) from the relevant folks on-site at Allegheny, and the games are still as originally scheduled (with a 15 minute delay).  So the Kenyon/Allegheny men's game is presently set to tip at 1:15pm.

UPDATE: It's now underway, and 'Gheny is out to an early 16-7 lead.  The Lords are once again without JT Knight, who, I am told, may be back in time for the conference tournament, which Kenyon may or may not qualify for.  I should also point out that two contributors from the early going, junior Tim Shadyac and sophomore Jay Findley, no longer appear on the roster.  No wonder the Lords have been struggling of late.

What in tarnation is going on in Gambier?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 06, 2010, 02:30:04 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 06, 2010, 02:10:39 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 06, 2010, 12:13:34 PM
I just got a confirmation (indirectly) from the relevant folks on-site at Allegheny, and the games are still as originally scheduled (with a 15 minute delay).  So the Kenyon/Allegheny men's game is presently set to tip at 1:15pm.

UPDATE: It's now underway, and 'Gheny is out to an early 16-7 lead.  The Lords are once again without JT Knight, who, I am told, may be back in time for the conference tournament, which Kenyon may or may not qualify for.  I should also point out that two contributors from the early going, junior Tim Shadyac and sophomore Jay Findley, no longer appear on the roster.  No wonder the Lords have been struggling of late.

What in tarnation is going on in Gambier?

Good question?!  Such promise heading into this season has turned about as ugly as it can get.  So, Knight has been benched by Croci basically for the remainder of the regular season and now 2 others have jumped ship?  Sounds like Croci's got a bit of a mess on his hands to say the least down there in Gambier???  ???   :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2010, 02:36:53 PM
It's a final: Allegheny 68, Kenyon 53.  Kenyon played most of the second half down 8-10, it was only in the final minute that the lead got back out to 15.  The two teams' stars had star-like performances: Big George had 15 rebounds to go along with 12 points, while Big Dave had 19 points and 11 boards.

I don't know what the story is at Kenyon -- and really, it's none of my business -- but I don't believe that Shadyac and Findley left subsequent to Knight's benching.  I think whatever happened involved all three players.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 06, 2010, 03:36:47 PM
ScotsFan, if Hiram were to beat Wittenberg today, I don't think it'd be much of an upset considering they're both tied for 3rd in the conference.

Go WITT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2010, 03:50:35 PM
In the battle for 8th place, Oberlin is giving a Kenyon-like performance today.  They trail OWU at the half 33-16.  It's looking more and more like Wooster is going to get what amounts to a "bye" in the quarterfinals.

UPDATE: OWU led by as many as 31 points before bringing in the dance team to finish off the 69-54 victory.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 06, 2010, 07:00:51 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 06, 2010, 03:36:47 PM
ScotsFan, if Hiram were to beat Wittenberg today, I don't think it'd be much of an upset considering they're both tied for 3rd in the conference.

Go WITT

Hence my questioning whether it would be all that much of an upset? (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.scout.com%2Fmedia%2Fforums%2Femoticons%2Fnoidea.gif&hash=d0853e7250ffe0f662a746329d301aa06dd4ee9f)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 06, 2010, 09:45:08 PM
Big win for Wittenberg tonight over Hiram despite some cold outside shooting by Wittenberg as they shot 5-23 from 3 point land. As they stated on the post game show, Wittenberg controls their own destiny to some extent on gaining the two seed.

As much as it pains me to say this.........for Wittenberg's sake, Wooster needs to win tomorrow vs Wabash and against Hiram next week to help out Witt!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 06, 2010, 10:33:03 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 06, 2010, 09:45:08 PM
As much as it pains me to say this.........for Wittenberg's sake, Wooster needs to win tomorrow vs Wabash and against Hiram next week to help out Witt!

Come on now penn, you know you're a closet Wooster fan.   ;D  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on February 06, 2010, 10:42:59 PM
OK- twist my arm... Go Scots!!   

And Colts by 7
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 07, 2010, 10:24:09 AM
Quote from: zander on February 06, 2010, 10:42:59 PM
OK- twist my arm... Go Scots!!   


That's the spirit!  ;)   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 07, 2010, 11:06:40 AM
To make myself feel better, I'm not rooting for a Wooster win today. Moreover, I'm rooting for a Wabash loss and then a Hiram loss later this week. It's irrelevant how that happens!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on February 07, 2010, 11:15:49 AM
I'm with you Penn. Thanks for straightening me out on what needs to happen. On another note... Is Al Vanwie still around??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2010, 11:56:02 AM
Quote from: zander on February 07, 2010, 11:15:49 AM
On another note... Is Al Van Wie still around??
Sure thing.  I'd see him at every game when I still lived in the area.  He looks great.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2010, 02:03:26 PM
Coverage update:  Live stats and audio (http://goearlham.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball) for the Earlham/Denison game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2010, 02:40:09 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 32  Wabash 27

Ugly shooting in the first half for both teams.  Wooster was only 3 of 16 (19%) from the floor early in the game and trailed 17 to 11.  Wooster rallied to retake the lead just before halftime.

Scots are being led by Nathan Balch with 12 points, Brandon Johnson with 6 points, Ian Franks with 5 points and Justin Hallowell with 5 points.

Top scorers for the Little Giants are Aaron Brock with 11 points and Wes Smith with 6 points.

At the Half:   Earlham 26  Denison 26
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2010, 02:46:07 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2010, 02:40:09 PM
At the Half:   Earlham 26  Denison 26
An EC win in this game could really throw a monkey wrench into the playoff scenarios.  Oberlin and Kenyon are both 2-10, and with a win the Quakers would join them in a three-way tie for the eighth and final playoff slot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 07, 2010, 03:07:53 PM
Wooster is running into some foul trouble.  Wooster has 15 fouls to Wabash's 10 with 13 minutes left.  Balch and Wickliffe have 3 a piece for Wooster.  Tied @ 42.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2010, 03:24:18 PM
Disregard my above post (assuming you don't already disregard all of my posts.)  Denison is laying the wood to Earlham in the 2nd half, now out to a 68-45 lead with about 4 minutes left.

UPDATE/FINAL:  Denison 74, Earlham 61
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 07, 2010, 03:41:18 PM
WOW!  Wes Smith fouls out on a charging call with 15 seconds left.  Now Wooster needs to make ft's up two and with the ball!

Wooster now up one with the ball and 5 seconds left.  Feagin calmly drills 2 followed by a Brandon Johnson steal of Chase Haltom and WOOSTER WINS!!! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2010, 03:44:31 PM
Final:  Wooster 64  Wabash 61 :)

With a big road win, Wooster clinches at least a tie for the regular season NCAC title! ;D

Scots were led today by Nathan Balch with 17 points, Ian Franks with 13 points, Brandon Johnson with 11 points and Bryan Wickliffe with 10 points.

Top scorers for the Little Giants were Aaron Brock with 20 points and Wes Smith with 18 points.

Wooster was outrebounded by Wabash 31 to 27 but the Scots shot 46% vs. only 38% for the Little Giants.

Coach Moore complimented Brandon Johnson for a great game today.  Big baskets and a steal at the end of the game.

Wooster is now 17-4, 12-0 NCAC.  Next up is a road game at Hiram on Wednesday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 07, 2010, 03:46:18 PM
It sure was a tight 2nd half between Wabash and Wooster.  I'm sure it was an entertaining game for those in attendance.

Way to go Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2010, 03:48:42 PM
2/6 and 2/7 Final Results:

Ohio Wesleyan 69  Oberlin 54
Allegheny 68  Kenyon 53
Wittenberg 66  Hiram 58
Denison 74  Earlham 61
Wooster 64  Wabash 61

Current NCAC Standings with 2/7 Results:

1.  Wooster 12-0
2.  Wabash 8-4
2.  Wittenberg 8-4
2.  Allegheny 8-4
5.  Hiram 7-5
5.  Ohio Wesleyan 7-5
7.  Denison 5-7
8.  Kenyon 2-10
8.  Oberlin 2-10
10. Earlham 1-11
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 07, 2010, 04:00:47 PM
HUGE win on the road today for the Scots!  Not only from the perspective of all but clinching their 6th straight NCAC crown, but also from a GL Region perspective.

Brandon Johnson gets my gameball today!  He showed signs of being the old Brandon Johnson today especially on defense as he came through with 6 steals to go along with 11 points.  

As wsf noted, 4 Scots ended in double figures.  Justin Hallowell also had a nice game finiishing with 8 points, but he also had another strong game on the glass with 9 boards.

Wooster actually got outrebounded by Wabash 31-27 which is kind of surprising.  But the turnover battle was won by Wooster with just 9 compared to 17 for Wabash.  

Wooster also had a decent day shooting the ball at 46% to just 38% for Wabash.

It's hard to say that Wooster struggled at the line when they shot 68%, but they've been shooting over 80% over their last 11 games and their 7 misses at the line almost cost them today.  Wabash had an outstanding day at the line going 20-23 for 87%.

Wooster has now won 12 in a row and now have a GL Region best 16-3 record.  And they are now dormy with a 4 game lead in the confence with 4 to play!   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2010, 11:02:24 PM
Tough loss for Wabash today.  Wabash turned the ball over just a few too many times in this one, especially with a couple of tough turnovers late in the game.  Credit to Wooster for taking advantage of those Wabash miscues...Scots outscored Wabash on points off of turnovers 22-9. 

While it's tough to lose a three-point game when you've turned the ball over 17 times, looking forward I think that's correctable.  A couple of extra passes that didn't need to happen and a couple of silly traveling violations can be cleaned up.  The bigger issue that I see right now with this Wabash team is the perimeter shooting.  3 pt shooting over the last handful of games:

vs. Oberlin - 9-27 (33%)
vs. OWU - 7-21 (31%)
vs. Kenyon - 8-33 (24%)
vs. Earlham - 4-14 (29%)
vs. Wooster - 5-19 (26%)

That's 114 three point FGs attempted out of 277 total FGs attempted during this stretch.  41% of Wabash's shots are coming from shots that they only make 29% of the time.  If the LGs are going to shoot this many long distance shots, somebody other than Brock is going to have to start making some. 

The loss sticks Wabash into a three way jam for that #2 spot and makes it seem pretty apparent that Wabash will need to get at least one of their road games against OWU or Witt.  I don't see the #2 team having more than five league losses.  The first opportunity comes on Wednesday in Delaware.  Go Wabash! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2010, 12:10:13 AM
For the second time in three weeks, the NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html) sash and tiara will be worn by an Ohio Wesleyan sophomore.  This time the honoree is guard Tim Brady, who lit up Wittenberg and Oberlin to the tune of 26 points per game this week.  In the loss to the Tigers, Brady recorded a double-double with 23 points and 11 boards, while his 29 points in the Bishops' win over the Yeomen was a career high.  Brady is now tied with Wabash junior Wes Smith for second in the (conference only) scoring race at 18.6 ppg.  (Both trail Wooster junior Ian Franks, who is averaging 21.6 ppg in conference play.)  Congratulations, Tim! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2010, 12:23:11 AM
One key game not to be overlooked in the maelstrom of activity on tomorrow's sports schedule is

Penn St.-New Kensington at Allegheny, 7:30 pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)

...okay, so maybe it's not key.  Or a maelstrom.  Or even tomorrow, where most of you live.  But what else are you going to do to promote a why-the-heck-are-they-playing-this-in-mid-February game like this? ;D

PSUNK, for the morbidly curious, is a member of the USCAA.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 08, 2010, 02:05:50 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2010, 12:23:11 AM
One key game not to be overlooked in the maelstrom of activity on tomorrow's sports schedule is

Penn St.-New Kensington at Allegheny, 7:30 pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)

...okay, so maybe it's not key.  Or a maelstrom.  Or even tomorrow, where most of you live.  But what else are you going to do to promote a why-the-heck-are-they-playing-this-in-mid-February game like this? ;D

PSUNK, for the morbidly curious, is a member of the USCAA.

... and has what may be the most amusing acronym in higher education.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 08, 2010, 02:10:44 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 08, 2010, 02:05:50 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2010, 12:23:11 AM
One key game not to be overlooked in the maelstrom of activity on tomorrow's sports schedule is

Penn St.-New Kensington at Allegheny, 7:30 pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)

...okay, so maybe it's not key.  Or a maelstrom.  Or even tomorrow, where most of you live.  But what else are you going to do to promote a why-the-heck-are-they-playing-this-in-mid-February game like this? ;D

PSUNK, for the morbidly curious, is a member of the USCAA.

... and has what may be the most amusing acronym in higher education.

At least since W[e]SUC[k] became the WIAC! :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2010, 09:03:38 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2010, 12:23:11 AM
One key game not to be overlooked in the maelstrom of activity on tomorrow's sports schedule is

Penn St.-New Kensington at Allegheny, 7:30 pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)

...okay, so maybe it's not key.  Or a maelstrom.  Or even tomorrow, where most of you live.  But what else are you going to do to promote a why-the-heck-are-they-playing-this-in-mid-February game like this? ;D

PSUNK, for the morbidly curious, is a member of the USCAA.


....and the Top "PSUNKER" in the USCAA scoring race this season is Justin Reed! :D ::) ;)


United States Collegiate Athletic Association: Basketball Individual Statistics (USCAA-2 Men)
Leaders for 2009-10.
==================================================================
SCORING (Min. 10 per game)
Player                         Team   Yr.  Pos      G   No.  Avg/G
==================================================================
1.  Joel Stryker               NCTA   So   G       10   353    35.30
2.  Moses Brathwaite     MEAUG  So   C       17   418  24.59
3.  L.T. Williams              MEAUG  Jr   F       12   268    22.33
4.  Kevin Carr                 VTC    So   G       21   463     22.05
5.  Marcus Genevro        PSUDB  Sr   G       20   426   21.30
6.  Chris Dickison           PSUDB  So   F/C     20   405  20.25
7.  Justin Reed                PSUNK  So   G/F     11   213  19.36
8.  Darius Prince             PSUGA  So   G       17   329  19.35
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2010, 09:24:35 PM
Allegheny.edu: (http://www.alleghenysports.com/news/2010/2/8/MBB_0208104531.aspx)
"Monday night's men's basketball game between Allegheny and Penn State New Kensington has been postponed. The teams hope to reschedule."
Everybody, keep your fingers crossed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 09, 2010, 09:00:32 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2010, 09:24:35 PM
Allegheny.edu: (http://www.alleghenysports.com/news/2010/2/8/MBB_0208104531.aspx)
"Monday night's men's basketball game between Allegheny and Penn State New Kensington has been postponed. The teams hope to reschedule."
Everybody, keep your fingers crossed.

LOL!  Why don't they just put us out of our misery and just cancel the game altogether?  ::)  I'm sure that neither team wants to play an extra game between conference games at this point of the season.  The least they could do is be truthful.  I mean, they hope to reschedule?  Seriously???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 09, 2010, 09:43:47 AM
As a player, I would have hated to lose a game of the season. But yeah, this should have been a November / early December tune up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2010, 08:54:04 PM
This may be a throw-away game for Allegheny, but it looks like the biggest game on PSUNK's schedule (http://www.nk.psu.edu/StudentLife/Athletics/28376.htm?cn25) since their clash with Williamson Trade in mid-January.  I mean, just look at how fired up these guys are!
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.nk.psu.edu%2FImages%2FNK%2Fpg_team%25281%2529_rdax_300x196.jpg&hash=f7761da0de2928a1135f68eb99c5a90419676fe5)
Okay, Lions, on three, Beat the Gators!  One...two...three!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2010, 09:26:54 PM
Wednesday games not involving any branch campuses of Penn State (and all, I guess, weather permitting):

Allegheny (8-4) at Oberlin (2-10), 7:30pm -- Live everything (http://www.goyeo.com/)
Earlham (1-11) at Wittenberg (8-4), 7:30pm -- Live audio and stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html)
Wooster (12-0) at Hiram (7-5), 7:30pm -- Live everything (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html) + live Woo audio (http://wqkt.com/)
Denison (5-7) at Kenyon (2-10), ~8pm -- Live everything (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml) -- Game 2 of a DH, women vs. Wittenberg at 6pm
Wabash (8-4) at OWU (7-5), ~8pm -- Live everything (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1) -- Game 2 of a DH, women vs. Hiram at 6pm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 10, 2010, 12:09:42 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 09, 2010, 08:54:04 PM
This may be a throw-away game for Allegheny, but it looks like the biggest game on PSUNK's schedule (http://www.nk.psu.edu/StudentLife/Athletics/28376.htm?cn25) since their clash with Williamson Trade in mid-January.  I mean, just look at how fired up these guys are!
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.nk.psu.edu%2FImages%2FNK%2Fpg_team%25281%2529_rdax_300x196.jpg&hash=f7761da0de2928a1135f68eb99c5a90419676fe5)
Okay, Lions, on three, Beat the Gators!  One...two...three!

Well, they ARE playing college basketball. Which is more than a great number of slack jawed posters on this here board and site can say.

/Myself included
//Mac Petty didn't need a deathly slow 5'11 forward
///Could shoot the three - but I'm a Hoosier of course
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2010, 09:45:46 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 10, 2010, 12:09:42 AM
Well, they ARE playing college basketball. Which is more than a great number of slack jawed posters on this here board and site can say.

/Myself included
//Mac Petty didn't need a deathly slow 5'11 forward
///Could shoot the three - but I'm a Hoosier of course


Well, I may not have played college basketball, but that was because I knew my limitations when it came to land sports.  That's why I stuck to the pool through college...  :P

I did try my hand at IM basketball though and even won a couple of titles with my fraternity bros.   8-)  Does that count?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Happy Calvin Guy on February 10, 2010, 10:14:15 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 08, 2010, 02:05:50 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 08, 2010, 12:23:11 AM
One key game not to be overlooked in the maelstrom of activity on tomorrow's sports schedule is

Penn St.-New Kensington at Allegheny, 7:30 pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)

...okay, so maybe it's not key.  Or a maelstrom.  Or even tomorrow, where most of you live.  But what else are you going to do to promote a why-the-heck-are-they-playing-this-in-mid-February game like this? ;D

PSUNK, for the morbidly curious, is a member of the USCAA.

... and has what may be the most amusing acronym in higher education.

At least in terms of boxscore acronyms, I'm of fan of Grand Rapids MI-based Davenport University Men's Basketball, or DUMB.

http://www.calvin.edu/sports/mens/basketball/results/2009-10/tip4.htm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 10, 2010, 07:55:15 PM
Big game about to get underway in Delaware.  Wabash needs to win on the road tonight to keep pace with Witt for the #2 spot (yep...I'm dismissing Earlham's chance to win tonight outright).  Running commentary in this space as I watch OWU's stream from my couch tonight!  

And we're underway.  LGs lead 3-2 early.  OWU came out in man to man [/Raftery voice].  I don't see OWU staying m2m all that long.  

I've lost the live stats and hence the score.  I can tell you that OWU is winning and Wabash is playing ugly basketball through the first five minutes.  Settling for 3s, turning the ball over...not a good start for the LGs.

It's 9-5 OWU with just under 15:00 to play in the 1st half, btw.

12:14 in the 1st - Tim Brady picks up his second foul and hits the bench.  That's a big deal.  Wabash has chipped their way back here and trail 12-11.  

10:48 in the 1st - Wabash gets their first lead of the game on a Derek Baily jumper.  15-14 Wabash.

8:12 in the 1st - LGs lead 17-16 despite OWU not having made a FG in about 8 minutes.  Bishops are living at the line right now.  

7:12 - Wes Smith gets called for a charge...50/50 call there.  That one usually goes for the offense.  In any case, that's Smith's 3rd which is doubly huge.  Score is tied up here 22-22.

Interesting move by Dewitt here...he's brought Brady back in the game with 2 fouls.  Looking to get some offense out of him with Smith on the bench.  Under 4 minutes to play in the half and we're still tied at 22-22.

1:48 - Brady goes out without having scored for OWU.  Bishops lead 28-26.  Close game throughout here...the largest margin has been OWU by 4.  

Halftime at the Branch....Bishops lead 31-28.  Wabash did well in the middle of the period when they attacked the basket...they did quite poorly at the beginning and end of the period when they were cranking up 3s.  Wes Smith did not score in the opening half and sat for the last 7 minutes with 3 fouls.  He's going to be handcuffed with those fouls for awhile in the second half...likely taking away his slash-to-the-rim game.  

Wabash is 2-10 on 3s, 11-28 on the game.  That's 9-18 on shots inside the arc.  I really just don't get it.  

New post for the second half?  I'm thinking so...this post is about to get buried with Wooster/Hiram talk.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2010, 08:23:13 PM
Halftime in Hiram:

Wooster - 44

Hiram - 22

Hiram has yet to break 24 points in a half against the Scots.  The only difference tonight from a couple of weeks ago is that Wooster broke out for 44 instead of the 26 they scored in the first half in Wooster.

Ian Franks is leading the way for Wooster with 14.  Nate Balch has 11(3-3 from downtown) and Bryan Wickliffe has 8.

Wooster is just dominating offensively shooting 56% from the floor and 6-12 from deep.  Hiram is just 29% from the field.

Also, Wooster is killing it on the glass, outrebounding the pups 22-9!   :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2010, 08:26:54 PM
I missed the opening few minutes of the game and apparently something has happened to Hallowell?  Was he injured?  Apparently, we'll find out more after the game...  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 10, 2010, 08:28:25 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 10, 2010, 08:26:54 PM
I missed the opening few minutes of the game and apparently something has happened to Hallowell?  Was he injured?  Apparently, we'll find out more after the game...  :-\

Hallowell hurt his ankle early in the game.  My dad said that he went off on crutches at halftime, but was putting a little weight on it. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2010, 08:38:11 PM
Thanks derek.

Hopefully it's not too serious.  Wooster will need Justin in their next two games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2010, 08:45:12 PM
11:35 left  Wooster 55 Hiram 35

Wooster is in control but Coach Moore takes another timeout because Wooster is not taking care of the ball.  Just had their 13th turnover.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 10, 2010, 08:54:52 PM
Sweet geebus...Witt has just two players in double figures....and is beating Earlham 90-52.  At least it's a short drive for Earlham. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2010, 08:58:37 PM
So much for a cake walk for Wooster.  As good as the Scots played in the first half, they are playing equally poor in the 2nd half as their 22 point lead has been trimmed to 14.  :-\

Balch just nailed a trey and now Wooster is at the line to try and bump the lead back to 19.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 10, 2010, 09:00:51 PM
We're underway in the second half.  Pleiman has a putback bucket for OWU, Brock made three FTs after being fouled shooting a three pointer.  Winters answered with Bishop triple and it's 36-31 Bishops.  18:26 to play.

Brock's three point attempt misses everything.  wally wabash sighs heavily.  Bishops lead 40-31.  

16:24 to go.  Wes Smith scores his first two points of the game.  Wabash trails 40-35.  And as I'm typing, Smith gets whistled for his fourth foul.  The OWU guys aren't sure where that foul actually occurred.  Smith stays in the game.  Oh my.  

This is incredible...Smith with four fouls is attacking.  I'm seeing it.  I'm not believing it.  14:35 to go, Bishops lead  44-39.  Before I can post Smith takes the ball coast to coast for a layup.  44-41 Bishops.

11:17 to play...Smith makes a jumper to cut OWU's lead to 49-43.  Smith is taking over Wabash's offense as he continues to play aggressively with four fouls.  And  he's checking Brady on defense.  This is edge of your seat stuff.  Bailey hits two free throws.  49-45 now.  

10:24 to go and Wabash is now in the bonus.  Shelbourne has two FTs.  They are good.  49-47...we've got a ballgame.  

9:47 to go...Brock gets a technical foul.  This one has probably been coming for a while.  Brock can be chatty with the officials and he's having a rough game here.  That's his third personal foul...and a lot of time to play.  51-47 Bishops lead.  

Wabash took a brief lead on a Derek Bailey three point play.  Tim Brady answered with his own three point play and the Bishops lead 56-54.  Dominique Thomas nails a triple for Wabash!  57-56 LGs back on top!  Wow!!

5:30 to play...Shelbourne hits a jumper for Wabash and the LGs have their largest lead of the game at 59-56.   The second unit for Wabash has been out-stand-ing.  They are saving Wabash's bacon tonight.  The starters, frankly, have looked tight and maybe pressing a bit.  Great to see everybody contributing here.  

It's clutch time and Mac Petty has over 3,000 career points sitting next to him on the bench.  He's riding the second unit.  As I say that, Smith checks back in.  It's 59-57 for Wabash with 4:30 to go.

3:21 to play...Pellerite scored an easy layup driving by Smith's matador D...Curosh answered with a layup for Wabash, OWU answered back with a jumper.  It's 61-61.  

1:33 to go...Pellerite gets fouled after getting an offensive rebound.  He makes one of two.  62-61.  Wabash has been just brutalized on the boards in this game.  

1:10 - Shelbourne drives to the hoop and scores!  Wabash retakes the lead 63-62.  Mac Petty gets a timeout.  This is every bit as intense as the game vs. Wooster on Saturday.  

Pellerite gets behind the Wabash post players and Brady lobs the ball up to him for an easy layup.  Yeesh.  64-63 Bishops with 47 seconds to go.  

Haltom makes his first bucket of the night!  It's a three!  33.5 seconds to go and Wabash now leads 66-64.  I hope to all things holy that that shot holds up.  Nobody on planet Earth has needed to make a big bucket more than Chase.  

Bishops turn the ball over by missing a cutting Brady!  Wabash inbounds and Brock takes the foul.  Brock makes just one of two.  Ouch.  67-64 LGs lead.  26.9 seconds to go.  Petty calls timeout again.  Poise, gentlemen.  Stick to your man.  

Bishops rush up the floor...Winters drives to the hoop for what looked like an easy layup but Derek Bailey came out of absolutely nowhere to block the shot!!  Wabash corrals the loose ball.  Haltom is shooting free throws.  Haltom misses the first shot.  Ouch.  Come on Chase....he rattles the second one in.  

Brady hits a three for OWU with 8 seconds to play!  Holy cow.  I think it's 68-67 Wabash.  Timeout OWU.  

Inbounds goes to Brock, Brock gets fouled.  It's worth noting that he is shooting into the dark end of the gym.  You know the one.  Here come the shots....first one is short.  Wabash has left the door open.  Second shot rolls off the iron.  Brady drives the length of the floor....throws up a wild shot near the rim, it misses, Wabash rebounds and the LGs win!  Oh.  My.  Goodness.  What a freaking game.  And what a HUGE win for Wabash.  

And I'm spent. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2010, 09:03:26 PM
Allegheny defeats Oberlin, 70-54.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2010, 09:08:47 PM
Final:  Wooster 69  Hiram 50 :)

Wooster clinches their 6th straight NCAC conference title! ;D

Scots were led tonight by Ian Franks with 17 points, Nathan Balch with 14 points and Bryan Wickliffe with 10 points and 10 boards.

Hiram top scorers were Chris Roberts with 13 points and Glenn Campbell with 10 points.

Wooster had 21 turnovers ???  but they shot 47% from the floor to only 34% for the Pups.  Scots won the boards 44 to 21!

Wooster is now 18-4, 13-0 NCAC ;D    Next up is Wittenberg at home on Saturday

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2010, 09:14:11 PM
Well, the 2nd half wasn't pretty but the Scots get it done and that's all that really counts.  Despite 14 second half turnovers, Wooster still cruises to the 19 point victory. 

Wooster now extends their win streak to lucky 13. 

Congrats to the Scots for winning their 6th straight NCAC regular season title!  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2010, 09:40:00 PM
Denison extends Kenyon's misery, 67-54.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2010, 09:43:14 PM
All the 2/10 NCAC Final Results:

Wabash 68  Ohio Wesleyan 67
Denison 67  Kenyon 54
Wittenberg 90  Earlham 52
Wooster 69  Hiram 50
Allegheny 70  Oberlin 54


Current NCAC Standings with 2/10 Results:

1.  Wooster 13-0
2.  Wittenberg 9-4
2.  Allegheny 9-4
2.  Wabash 9-4
5.  Ohio Wesleyan 7-6  
5.  Hiram 7-6
7.  Denison 6-7
8.  Kenyon 2-11
8.  Oberlin 2-11
10. Earlham 1-12
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 10, 2010, 10:21:03 PM
I think I"m right by saying this but Wittenberg essentially controls its own destiny for the 2 seed right now. As Coach Brown said in his post game talks tonight, if anyone can figure out all the specific scenarios for tiebreakers for 2-6 then you deserve something in recognition cause its virtually impossible.

Ho hum win for Wittenberg tonight as all 16 players played at least 2 minutes tonight for Wittenberg. Wittenberg actually came out very lethargic as I thought they would just by watching their warmup. From halfway through the first half to about 10:00 minutes left in the second half, Wittenberg was unstoppable or Earlham is just not good....as blunt as it sounds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 10, 2010, 10:22:31 PM
Also, congrats to the Wittenberg Lady Tigers for clinching the regular season NCAC title tonight and Stephanie Boardman for becoming the sixth Wittenberg women's player to eclipse the 1,000 point totals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 10, 2010, 11:17:06 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 10, 2010, 10:21:03 PM
I think I"m right by saying this but Wittenberg essentially controls its own destiny for the 2 seed right now. As Coach Brown said in his post game talks tonight, if anyone can figure out all the specific scenarios for tiebreakers for 2-6 then you deserve something in recognition cause its virtually impossible.

As does Wabash.  The game at HPER is going to be huge...likely will decide that #2 seed that I believe is so important (again, would you rather play Denison or OWU/Hiram...it's an easy choice).  And as I look at the standings, I can't help but think back to that game at Denison that Wabash dropped and how huge that result looms now.  Consider Wabash having not lost that game....they'd be sitting at 10-3 with one game up on Witt and virtually two games up on Allegheny.  Unless Witt beats Wooster on Saturday, the Wabash/Witt game in Springfield would be a throwaway as far as it relates to Wabash getting that #2 seed.  Beat Oberlin and Kenyon at home, and it's a done deal.  But Wabash didn't get that win at Denison and now we have drama in the last week of the season. 

As for the 2-6 situation...I think we know who 2-4 are in no particular order and we know who 5-6 are in no particular order.

Wabash/OWU final thoughts are forthcoming....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 10, 2010, 11:49:36 PM
Alright...absolute barnburner at Branch Rickey tonight between a couple of teams that really had to have this game.  Wabash needed the game to keep pace with Witt and Allegheny, OWU needed the game to have any shot at getting a home game in round 1 of the tournament. 

Wabash battled through foul trouble and off nights by their top line tonight.  Wes Smith missed the last 7 minutes of the first half with three fouls.  Smith only scored 8 points tonight, all in a five minute window in the second half.  Right after he scored his first basket, he picked up a chincy foul for his fourth personal.  Petty left him on the floor, Wes played with The Rage™ for about three minutes, scored six more points pretty quickly, before finally coming out of the game.  but after the 11:00 mark of the second half, Smith didn't score another point. 

The day was carried by the second unit.  Brian Shelbourne and Derek Bailey helped supply the offense that wasn't coming from Smith/Brock/Haltom tonight and their effort really helped Wabash not only get back into the game but get back over the hump.  Once back on top, Wabash and OWU went back and forth over the last five minutes.  Pellerite put OWU up by a point with under a minute to go.  Chase Haltom answered with his only field goal of the evening...a deep three pointer to give Wabash the two point lead that managed to hold up despite some shaky free throw shooting by the LGs.  Tim Brady had a shot (way too close to the hoop for my comfort) at the end that could have won for OWU, but the shot was a little wild and didn't find the basket. 

Huge, huge, huge win for Wabash.  Road wins are always nice, road wins against good teams that you don't really match up that well against are even better.  And doing it three days after the gut-punch loss on Saturday is even better still. 

Game ball tonight to Derek Bailey who played superb off the bench.  11 points on 4-4 shooting, 2 steals, and one absolutely enormous block in the final minute.  This kid is so completely unassuming on a basketball court, yet every time he's on the floor he does something good.  I would be remiss if I didn't mention Haltom and his enormous three pointer in the final minute to put Wabash up 66-64.  That's a shot that I really Chase  needed to see go down and I hope that's the shot that lights the fuse.  We've been waiting all season for Chase to heat up....Wabash is so so so much better offensively when Chase commands a defender.  Wooster had all but stopped guarding him on Saturday.  Hopefully this kind of big time basket lights the fuse for Haltom and he can start pouring it in down the stretch here. 

Next up for Wabash is Oberlin on Saturday.  No live tweets from me this weekend as I won't be able to make it to Chadwick this weekend.   :'(

WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2010, 12:16:13 AM
The Earlham farewell tour is turning the Quakers into Tomato Cans.

(Picked that up from Charlie Steiner when he was talking about the George Foreman comeback. Steiner said Foreman's seen more Tomato Cans in his comeback than the night manager at Safeway.)
(Also, Steiner called it the "Bang The Bums Slowly" comeback tour.
(Miss him on Sportscenter...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2010, 12:19:29 AM
Also...

You know the "Club Trillion" but tonight Andrew Gilman hit the "Club Seven Trillion". 7 minutes, NO stats. NONE.

Also, Vaughn Spaulding got nothing and liked it... :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 11, 2010, 07:08:47 AM
Wally, I feel the same way about our loss to you guys at Chadwick and our home loss vs Allegheny, both games I feel Witt should have won!

Big showdown next Wednesday, you Wabash fans making the trip?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 11, 2010, 07:26:15 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 10, 2010, 10:21:03 PM
From halfway through the first half to about 10:00 minutes left in the second half, Wittenberg was unstoppable or Earlham is just not good....as blunt as it sounds.

I'll bite...and this will probably be my final commentary on Earlham basketball ever unless for some reason Wabash plays them in non-league games down the road...

The Quakers are just that bad.  I can't recall seeing an Earlham team as bad as this one in the ten seasons I've been following NCAC hoops.  Most of the Quaker teams I've seen have had a few pretty decent players, but little depth behind the starting unit.  The Quaker squad I saw at Chadwick looked just lost (AJ Sutherlin excepted...he's a pretty solid player).  It sounds like it wasn't much different in Springfield last night. 

Quote from: pennstghs on February 11, 2010, 07:08:47 AM
Wally, I feel the same way about our loss to you guys at Chadwick and our home loss vs Allegheny, both games I feel Witt should have won!

I see where you're coming from, but I think the two are a little different.  Games vs. Wabash or Allegheny or Witt are games against decent teams that you know going in you might lose.  Games against Denison, if you're serious about being at the top of the league, are games you can't lose.  Wabash did, and it just may cost them the #2 seed unless the LGs can make a little history next Wednesday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 11, 2010, 08:08:03 AM
Come to us, Wally.  Will it be 4 vs 5, 3 vs 6 or 2 vs 7? 

Chris is hitting 3's, Larry's tearing down the boards, new offensive sets are finally in and Dimonde is slashing to the hoop.  The bench has seen valuable playing time, the guards are protecting the ball better and Mike is back in the lineup.  That Denison team that anyone who aspires to be at the top of the conference is supposed to beat is getting ready for the playoffs.  A strong showing against the Gators this weekend will tell you if they're still going to be your doormat. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on February 11, 2010, 08:14:29 AM
CONGRATS TO THE FIGHTING SCOTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  WHAT A WAY....LETS RUN THE TABLE FELLAS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 11, 2010, 08:38:51 AM
Quote from: GoRed on February 11, 2010, 08:08:03 AM
Come to us, Wally.  Will it be 4 vs 5, 3 vs 6 or 2 vs 7? 

Chris is hitting 3's, Larry's tearing down the boards, new offensive sets are finally in and Dimonde is slashing to the hoop.  The bench has seen valuable playing time, the guards are protecting the ball better and Mike is back in the lineup.  That Denison team that anyone who aspires to be at the top of the conference is supposed to beat is getting ready for the playoffs.  A strong showing against the Gators this weekend will tell you if they're still going to be your doormat. 

Denison isn't my doormat.  That distinction belongs to Earlham. 

I like where the Big Red are going, but let's not lose sight of the facts.  Denison is 6-16.  Four of those wins are on Earlham and Kenyon, who don't have four league wins between them.  One more is Oberlin.  Denison has won exactly one big game this year and that was over 2 months ago. 

Looking ahead to possible seeding, I think Wabash getting up to that #2 is important not so much because Denison is a particularly easy game for Wabash (it hasn't been over the last two seasons), but because the alternative is probably OWU and I'm not sure there's a worse matchup for Wabash than the Bishops (Wooster included). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on February 11, 2010, 11:57:46 AM
Congrats to the Woo Hoopsters on another NCAC Championship.

I don't really follow round ball that closely, except for reading the posts on this board. It seems to me the Scots won every close game this year despite their inability to put together a "complete game." Problems with turnovers, shooting, defense, and aggressiveness have seemed to be a problem throughout the season.

Hopefully they can put it all together and make a run during NCAA tournament. ( I think a pool C bid is an automatic if they don't win the NCAC tourney.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 11, 2010, 12:33:45 PM
Quote from: old scot on February 11, 2010, 11:57:46 AM
Congrats to the Woo Hoopsters on another NCAC Championship.

I don't really follow round ball that closely, except for reading the posts on this board. It seems to me the Scots won every close game this year despite their inability to put together a "complete game." Problems with turnovers, shooting, defense, and aggressiveness have seemed to be a problem throughout the season.

Hopefully they can put it all together and make a run during NCAA tournament. ( I think a pool C bid is an automatic if they don't win the NCAC tourney.)

They did lose some close games early in the year like vs. Albion, JCU and R-MC.  In all of those games, Wooster really struggled to execute down the stretch and it cost them with losses.  But I think they have definitely used those losses as growing experiences and really seem to have turned the corner on how to finish tight games down the stretch.

Also, you mention some of the problems that have been plaguing this Wooster team throughout the season.  Lately, some of these problems have been less noticeable, IMO.  Their shooting seems to be coming around, they have the top defense as far as points allowed per game in the conference and turnovers have been down overall lately as well (save for last night's 14 turnovers in the 2nd half in a game the Scots were up 22 at the half  ::) ).

I just think, all in all, this team seems to have been righting itself really since that first Wittenberg game.  I definitely think this team is playing it's best basketball right now and the scary part is, I think they can even play better.  Will they remains to be seen.  And now with Hallowell's injury he sufferred last night, that could throw a wrench in things as well.  Hopefully, the injury isn't too serious and the Scots can continue this good run they've been on to finish the regular season on a strong note heading into the post-season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 11, 2010, 06:10:40 PM
Breaking down the race for #2...

Allegheny (9-4):
Games remaining - @ Denison, Hiram, @ OWU
Outlook: For all the talk about whether this thing comes down to Witt or Wabash (guilty as charged), Allegheny actually has a better than average chance to get to 12 wins.  None of these games are gimmes, but all are quite winnable for Allegheny.  The Gators are 3-0 against their remaining opponents and if the Gators are to get that #2 seed they will need to get to 12 wins because....

Wabash (9-4):
Games remaining - Oberlin, @ Witt, Kenyon
Outlook: Wabash has two very probable wins, although they struggled mightily against Kenyon a couple of weeks ago.  It seems likely that Wabash gets to 11 wins and if that happens Wabash would win any tiebreak with an 11-win Allegheny team due to their h2h result.  The game in question is at Wittenberg where Wabash is 0-for-forever.  A win there gives Wabash 12 wins and h2h tiebreaks over the other two teams and a lock on the #2 seed. 

Witt (9-4):
Games remaining - @ Wooster, Wabash, @ Oberlin
Outlook: The Tigers easily have the toughest remaining schedule, however they may be catching a break with Wooster have already wrapped up the top seed and Hallowell being out and I would guess unlikely to play on Saturday (why push it....this game is relatively meaningless to Wooster if you choose to ignore the rivalry factor).  Should Witt beat Wooster and Wabash, they'll get to 12 wins and I think would be the #2 seed via tiebreak over Allegheny (if the Gators get to 12 wins).  If Witt beats Wooster and loses to Wabash, the point is moot because Wabash will get that #2 seed.  If the Tigers lose at Wooster and beat Wabash, the door swings wide open for Allegheny and also brings in the possibility of a three way tie at 11-5 that I'm not even going to try to decipher. 

And there you have it.  Saturday's Wooster/Witt game carries a lot of implication for these three teams.  It'll be interesting to see how this plays out. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 11, 2010, 06:51:37 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 11, 2010, 06:10:40 PM
...however they may be catching a break with Wooster have already wrapped up the top seed and Hallowell being out and I would guess unlikely to play on Saturday (why push it....this game is relatively meaningless to Wooster if you choose to ignore the rivalry factor). 

First of all, I don't think you can ignore the rivalry factor for Saturday's game between Witt and Woo.  This game might be meaningless from any other sort of perspective for the Scots, but this is still Witt and Wooster isn't going to just mail this game in because they've already wrapped up the top seed in the conference. 

Here are a couple of reasons why I feel this game still has plenty of significance:

There's a matter of trying to get to 5 in a row.  Neither team has ever won 5 in a row in over the other in the history of this rivalry and Wooster can do that with a win on Saturday.

And then there's the matter of Wooster trying to maintain their #1 ranking in the GL Region.  Wooster may have locked up the #1 seed for the conference tournament, but they still have plenty to play for when it comes to NCAA tournament implications.  Another loss could likely cost the Scots a chance at hosting a sectional, which they are very much alive for and will continue to be if they can win out. 

With that said, I'm with you wrt Hallowell.  Unless there's some exceptionally good news regarding his injury, I see no need to risk further injury by trying to make a go of it on Saturday no matter how much it may hurt not having him in the lineup. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on February 11, 2010, 09:48:01 PM
My first post of the season! The way we (Woo) started the season had me worried but I am a believer now. Congrats to the Scots on winning the conference.

My senior year I passed on a date with a very beautiful girl who I had been chasing for weeks to go to Witt.  That game turned out to be the 3OT thriller that we won 102-95. History has a habit of repeating itself. I know I'm going to get into trouble but I'm once again passing on another date to catch us battle Witt this weekend. Meaningless game for Woo conference-wise somebody has said but I always love the Woo/Witt games. Should be exciting.

Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 11, 2010, 10:33:15 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 11, 2010, 06:10:40 PM
The Tigers easily have the toughest remaining schedule, however they may be catching a break with Wooster have already wrapped up the top seed and Hallowell being out and I would guess unlikely to play on Saturday (why push it....this game is relatively meaningless to Wooster if you choose to ignore the rivalry factor).

Considering Wooster has not won a "true" road game in the NCAA Tournament since beating Ohio Northern in 1997, maintaining the top spot in the regional rankings is very important for their chances of going anywhere in the postseason. I think Wooster can afford one more loss (assuming that loss isn't in the first two rounds of the NCAC Tournament) and maintain either the No. 1 or 2 seed in the region, but anymore would mean travel, and that hasn't been very good to the Scots (although they have done OK in neutral court games).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2010, 09:41:18 AM
Hey, Woo fans, don't forget that the Belt TM is in play anytime you take the court. That should had a huge degree of significance to any game!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 12, 2010, 09:43:43 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 12, 2010, 09:41:18 AM
Hey, Woo fans, don't forget that the Belt TM is in play anytime you take the court. That should had a huge degree of significance to any game!  ;)

Totally!!!   ;D 

Smeds just ended the argument right there!  The Scots are playing to defend The Belt TM.  End of discussion.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on February 12, 2010, 10:42:19 AM
Are there any reports on how serious the injury to hallowell is?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 12, 2010, 11:01:56 AM
Quote from: zander on February 12, 2010, 10:42:19 AM
Are there any reports on how serious the injury to hallowell is?

All I've heard is that the injury was possibly to the top of his foot and that he was going to be x-rayed. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 12, 2010, 11:02:57 AM
Quote from: zander on February 12, 2010, 10:42:19 AM
Are there any reports on how serious the injury to hallowell is?

There was a preview article on the game in the Daily Fish Wrap but it's locked...  :-\

Haven't had a chance to buy a paper yet.

It didn't sound too promissing after the Hiram game though.  Coach Moore said even if it isn't broken, if it's a foot sprain, those often require more time to heal than ankle sprains...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on February 13, 2010, 08:19:28 AM
Can Witt win on the Scots home floor? Seems like they won one there a few years back... They need this one for hopes of second place seed in tourny.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 13, 2010, 10:47:57 AM
Quote from: zander on February 13, 2010, 08:19:28 AM
Can Witt win on the Scots home floor?

Why not?  They have indeed won quite a few games in Wooster over the past several years.  In fact, there was a stretch where it seemed like niether team could win at home vs. the other.  In '04-'05, Wooster won at Witt and Witt won at Wooster during the regular season and then again won at Wooster in the NCAC tournament finals.  Wooster swept Witt in '05-'06 only to lose once again at home to the Tigers in the NCAC finals.  And in '06-'07, both teams won in thier rival's gym once again.

Of course, Witt hasn't beaten Wooster period since their first meeting of the '07-'08 season.  And hopefully that trend continues tonight!   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 13, 2010, 11:41:53 AM
So let's see now--are there any interesting games on today's schedule?  Hmmmm.

Oberlin (2-11) at Wabash (9-4), 1pm -- Live stats (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball) -- [yawn]
Allegheny (9-4) at Denison (6-7), 3pm -- Live stats and audio (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0910/mb_schedule09.html) -- The whole DU campus is distracted by the swim meet (http://www.alleghenysports.com/sports/2010/2/4/SWIM_0204102151.aspx?id=164)
Kenyon (2-11) at Hiram (7-6), 3pm -- Live everything (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html) -- I'm sure by now there's 8 feet of snow at Hiram
OWU (7-6) at Earlham (1-12), 3pm -- Live stats and audio (http://goearlham.com/index.aspx) -- Wait, is Earlham still in this conference?
Wittenberg (9-4) at Wooster (13-0), 7:30pm -- Live everything (Woo) (http://www.wooster.edu/en/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule); live alt.audio (Woo) (http://www3.wooster.edu/woo91/sports/index.html); live audio (Witt) (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/sportsnetwork/) -- Now, this one looks interesting.  Have these teams ever met before?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 13, 2010, 11:45:23 AM
Let's go Witt, no offense but it'd be nice to see Hallowell on the bench tonight!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 13, 2010, 02:42:09 PM
First final: Wabash 59, Oberlin 47
[stifles a yawn]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 13, 2010, 02:47:24 PM
Wabash had a closer than expected game vs. the Yeomen in C'ville today.

The final 12 point margin of victory is a bit misleading IMO.

Anyone care to fill in what exactly happened at 1:13 remaining in the game?  Josh Merritt of the OC makes a layup and then gets called for a double technical?  What did he do?  His layup cut the lead to 5, but his double technical gave Wabash 4 ft's and the ball.  Brock made 3 of 4 and then Wes Smith was promptly fouled and made both of his ft's and just like that, the lead is 10 and ballgame.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 13, 2010, 03:45:25 PM
Wooster's women start the day off right, winning 74-61 at Witt.  Tigers had been unbeaten in conference and already have clinched the title. 

Halftime scores:
Allegheny 46, Denison 42
Hiram 27, Kenyon 16...ugh
OWU 35, Earlham 35...ugh again

-----------------

Finals:
Allegheny 85, Denison 79
OWU 81, Earlham 71
Hiram 64, Kenyon 54
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 13, 2010, 07:23:59 PM
I like the banners and the large Fighting Scot that have been added to Timken Gym since I last visited.  Nice touches.
Banners (http://twitpic.com/13302g)
Fighting Scot (http://twitpic.com/13325m)
Photos courtesy of Woo91 (http://twitter.com/WOO91)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 13, 2010, 08:02:01 PM
At the Half:  Witt 37  Wooster 23

Ugly first half for Wooster as they committed 10 turnovers and many of those led to easy Witt baskets.  Scots only shot 2 of 10 from the three point arc while the Tigers made 6 three pointers in the half.

Witt is being led by Josh McKee with 7 points, Michael Cooper with 6 points and Mark Snyder also with 6.

Wooster is being led by Bryan Wickliffe with 9 points and Justin Warnes with 4 points.

Scots will have to play much better in the 2nd half to make this a competitive game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 13, 2010, 08:46:34 PM
Apple turnover...Wooster turnover...Blueberry turnover....Scot turnover....Cherry turnover....Woo turnover ??? :P

2:40 left  Witt 63  Wooster 51   Scots have 18 TURNOVERS compared to 5 for Witt

Congratulations to Wittenberg on a well played game tonight!

Final:  Wittenberg 67  Wooster 56

Witt had balanced scoring with Josh McKee, Chris Sullivan, Michael Cooper and Mark Snyder each scoring 10 points.

Wooster was led by Bryan Wickliffe 15 points (13 boards) and Justin Warnes with 9 points.  Witt double teamed Ian Franks in the paint and Wooster did not make them pay for this defensive scheme.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 13, 2010, 08:50:11 PM
Current NCAC Standings with 2/13 Results:

1.  Wooster 13-1
2.  Wittenberg 10-4
2.  Wabash 10-4
2.  Allegheny 10-4
5.  Ohio Wesleyan 8-6
5.  Hiram 8-6
7.  Denison 6-8
8.  Kenyon 2-12
8.  Oberlin 2-12
10. Earlham 1-13
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on February 13, 2010, 09:05:46 PM
Way to Go WITT!!!   Witt has had the believed in themselves since pre-season. It would be nice to see them put it all together during the conference tourney
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 13, 2010, 09:13:03 PM
In other news, the much-ballyhooed Allegheny/New Kensington showdown is sunk (or PSUNK).  It quietly had been rescheduled for this past Thursday, but when that time rolled around, it was discovered that nobody actually could find New Kensington, PA; it is feared that the entire city has been buried by the recent snowstorms, an event that went unnoticed for a week but is nevertheless tragic.  So rather than postpone the game a second time, with the associated costs of publicity, crowd control, and re-rental of the MetLife Airship Snoopy One, the game has been canceled (http://www.alleghenysports.com/news/2010/2/8/MBB_0208104531.aspx).   :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 13, 2010, 09:42:52 PM
Although I didn't see or listen to the game, congrats Witt on a big win!!!! Its always nice to get a win on your rival's home court!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 13, 2010, 10:02:11 PM
This won't show up in the box score per say, but one stat that kind of sums up the Wooster-Witt game is the fact that Wooster had only committed four team fouls for the entire game with less than 8 minutes to play in the game. Wittenberg was in Wooster's face the entire game, challenging the ball as soon as Wooster crossed mid-court. There was nothing easy for Wooster, and Wittenberg had no problem bumping and pushing Wooster around. It also helped that the refs were fairly hands off, which is a good thing IMHO.

On the other hand, Wooster was letting the Tigers have all the room necessary to do whatever they wanted. Guards had room to drive or take three-pointers. Big men were catching the ball five feet from the basket and were able to turn and not run into a defender for almost two steps. Frankly, it is remarkable that Wittenberg didn't shoot a better percentage considering Wooster's mediocre defense.

The point of all this? There is no shame in losing to Witt at home. Frankly, I expected it with Hallowell out and Witt having more to play for. But to be down 23 in the second half on your own floor and Wittenberg is running around with barely a scratch should not happen. While I'm not advocating flagrant fouls, but how about letting Wittenberg know that they actually have to work for some points? I guarantee Wittenberg would not let Wooster walk around with a 23-point lead in the second half on their floor the way Wooster did.

Of course this doesn't apply to Bryan Wickliffe, who was the best player on the floor and really, along with Brandon Johnson, seemed to be the only ones up for this challenge for Wooster.

We'll see if Wooster plays with a little more toughness on Wednesday against OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 13, 2010, 10:08:36 PM
A large crowd at Timken, mostly wearing black for this rivalry game, didn't have much to cheer about tonight, as Wooster never led.  The Scots had a -11 turnover differential, Witt held Ian Franks to just 4 points.  There was a late attempt by the Scots to get back into the game, cutting the deficit from 23 to 12, but it was too little too late.

Hopefully, the Scots will re-focus after this game, and get ready for the remaining regular-season games and the NCAC Tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2010, 10:33:55 PM
Now Witt has the BeltTM.  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 14, 2010, 09:23:08 AM
Congrats to Witt on the win last night.

I was shocked at how un-into the game that Wooster appeared to be from the start.  I know this was basically a meaningless game in the big picture, but as I said earlier in the week, it's still Witt/Woo.  Do you really need anything more?  Witt didn't treat this as a meaningless game that's for sure!  I just kept waiting for a spark to go off in some of the Wooster players, and really, besides Wick, I didn't see it.  What I saw was careless ballhandling, lazy passes and uninspired play.  Sure, the Scots finally put together a little run, but it was too little too late by that point.

I know that Hallowell's absence was felt by Wooster and helped Witt give a lot more attention at defending Franks which they did.  But, IMO, the key to this game was the 18 turnovers by Wooster.  And once again, many of those turnovers were a result of poor decision making being made by the Scots.  I just don't get how Wooster can go through stretches this season where they look like they've finally turned the corner, and then, they suddenly regress back to playing like they were at the beginning of the season? 

I sure hope that Wooster comes out with more energy and gives more of an effort than the one they showed last night on Wednesday when OWU pays a visit to Timken.  If not, the Scots will be looking at a 2 game slide...  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 14, 2010, 11:33:55 AM
Not exactly the results I was looking for yesterday. 

First, I really don't know what was up with Wabash yesterday.  I wasn't at the game and followed livestats for about the middle 20 minutes of the game...looked like Wabash fell back into the "jack it up from 23 feet" trap that that leads to things like scoring 8 points in the first 12 minutes against Oberlin and shooting such a poor percentage that Oberlin stays in the game until late.  I have no idea what happened with the double tech, but I'll effort to find out what that was all about. 

I'm hoping that Wabash's effort yesterday is the result of having a pretty low profile opponent sandwiched between two giant road games.  I have to hope so because sub-33% shooting is not going to get it done on Wednesday. 

Second, I really wanted to see Wooster beat Witt last night.  In the big picture it doesn't really matter because Wabash was going to need to win on Wednesday either way, but things are just always a little bit better when Witt loses a big game.  Witt's win likely takes Allegheny out of the running for the #2 seed as the winner of Witt/Wabash on Wednesday is likely to get to 12 wins and hold the tiebreak over Allegheny. 

Alright, kids.  Big game on Wednesday at the HPER Center.  WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 14, 2010, 11:41:32 AM
You're right, big game Wednesday night.....however Wally its no longer the HPER Center, instead Pam Evans Smith Arena.

Hopefully a big and vocal Witt crowd shows up Wednesday, with it being senior night and a women's game before hand as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 14, 2010, 12:51:50 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 14, 2010, 11:41:32 AM
You're right, big game Wednesday night.....however Wally its no longer the HPER Center, instead Pam Evans Smith Arena.

I look at it as one of those things where it will always be the HPER center no matter what they change the name to.  Kind of like Jacobs Field.  I still call it the Jake even though it's been Progressive Field for two years now. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2010, 12:59:52 PM
Today is the Chinese New Year, the first day of the Year of the Tiger.  I'm just sayin'... :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2010, 02:33:09 PM
Log jams everywhere!

The race for 2/3/4 - Wabash @ Witt gives one team a big advantage. Witt follows with Oberlin and Wabash with Kenyon. so Wednesday's game is basically an elimination game for 2nd.

Allegheny has a tougher road, and they also can influence 5/6 by playing host to Hiram and on the road to OWU. While they handled Hiram by 14 on the road, the Bishops took them to OT way back when.

The race for 5/6 - Hiram at Gheny and home against Denison - OWU at Wooster and home to Gheny. Hiram has the advantage, especially if they can upset the Gators.

The race for 8/9/10 - So who is Wooster's punching bag? Oberlin is at home against Denison (who has secured 7th) and plays Witt. The Lords and Quakers match up and then Earlham finishes its NCAC career against Wooster, while as noted above Kenyon faces Wabash.

Here are my thoughts:

Gheny bests Hiram
Kenyon handles Earlham
Denison tops Oberlin
Wooster over OWU
Witt over Wabash (I'd have to say Wabash's road record does concern me...)

Wooster over Earlham
Witt over Oberlin
Hiram over Denison
Bash over Kenyon
OWU topples Gheny

Final records:

Wooster 15-1
Witt 12-4
Wabash 11-5
Gheny 11-5 (Wabash 3rd based on head to head)
Hiram 9-7 (I think in this case Hiram gets the tiebreak by their win over Witt)
OWU 9-7
Denison 6-10
Kenyon 3-13
Oberlin 2-14
Earlham 2-14

Witt could have a big letdown after beating Wooster, but playing at Witt is never any fun.

This will set up:

Kenyon @ Wooster
Denison @ Witt
OWU @ Wabash (revenge?)
Hiram @ Allegheny

Of course, I could be totally, completely wrong...


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 15, 2010, 08:25:50 PM
Lets hope the LG's can find away to win at Witt and find the #2. 

Here we are again, another Wabash vs Witt game that means a lot.

Wabash Always Fights!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2010, 09:03:42 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on February 15, 2010, 08:25:50 PM
Lets hope the LG's can find away to win at Witt and find the #2.
Do I really have to hope for that? ??? ;D

To the victor belongs the spoils:  congratulations to Wittenberg's David Nowicki, this week's NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html).  This award is usually reserved for the scorers, but Nowicki is being honored for making modest contributions in all phases of the game as Witt recorded two victories.  He scored 14 points, and recorded 7 assists, 6 steals, and 5 boards in the two victories.  Congratulations, David!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on February 16, 2010, 01:59:42 PM
I DITTO THE CONGRATS TO DAVID NOWICKI FOR NCAC PLAYER OF THE WEEK. HE'S DONE A GREAT JOB OF RUNNING THE POINT AND LETTING THE WITT OFFENSE KEEP EVERYONE INVOLVED. THEY HAVE A LOT OF OFFENSIVE WEAPONS AND THAT MAKES THEM A VERY GOOD TEAM.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 16, 2010, 06:33:55 PM
Congrats to David Nowicki and also to Wittenberg  for entering the receiving votes portion of the D3hoops.com Top 25 this week!

wishful thinking, but assuming some of the teams ahead of Witt, such as Calvin or Hope, John Carroll lose once again and Witt win's out and makes it to the conference tournament finals and loses but rises to second or third in the regional rankings.....what are their chances of receiving an at large bid (Pool C for technical terms)

Like I said, wishful thinking because I believe Witt will win the automatic bid  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 16, 2010, 07:19:28 PM
Witt is currently 14-5 in-region. If the Tigers beat Wabash and Oberlin and then get to the final round of the NCAC tourney before losing, they'd wind up 18-6, and a .750 in-region winning percentage should be good enough to garner a Pool C berth. Anything less than that (e.g., a semifinal loss), and they're pushing it. There are no guarantees for anyone below the .750 mark.

If you're a Witt fan, root like crazy for Capital or Ohio Northern to win the OAC tourney, because that would get the Crusaders or the Polar Bears regionally ranked in that final Selection Sunday ranking, and Witt beat both of those teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2010, 09:39:22 PM
I guess I picked the right year to escape from Ohio.  Enjoy the snow, folks!  ;D

Wednesday's games:

Denison (6-8) at Oberlin (2-12), 7:30pm -- Live everything (http://www.goyeo.com/news/2010/2/16/MBB_0216105131.aspx?tab=) -- It's Hawaiian Night at Oberlin!
Earlham (1-13) at Kenyon (2-12), 7:30pm -- Live everything (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
Hiram (8-6) at Allegheny (10-4), 7:30pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)
OWU (8-6) at Wooster (13-1), 7:30pm -- Live everything (http://www.wooster.edu/en/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2009-10-Schedule) plus live alt.audio (http://www3.wooster.edu/woo91/)
Wabash (10-4) at Wittenberg (10-4), ~8pm -- Live everything (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html) -- Game 2 of a doubleheader; women vs. Earlham at 6pm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 17, 2010, 05:56:58 PM
live after the Witt game, the complete game wrap up from a biased Wittenberg fan.

Hopefully a large and boisterous crowd shows up for this utterly important battle tonight. The women will clinch the conference before the men's game with senior night activities in between
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 17, 2010, 07:44:15 PM
Well, if it wasn't for Tim Brady, this game would be over.  Brady has 15 of the Bishops 20 points as they trail by 7.

Now Mike Evans is doing his best Justin Hallowell impression with a 5-5 effort from deep!  :o  Wooster has made 10 as a team so far in the first half and lead by 15!

And now Wick is starting to have his way inside and the Bishops are in trouble.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 17, 2010, 07:53:12 PM
Mike Evans on fire for the Scots with 5 three pointers and 15 points in the half! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 17, 2010, 08:00:54 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 57  Ohio Wesleyan 41  :)

Scots were very hot offensively in the half shooting over 60% and hitting 11 three pointers! ;D

Wooster is being led by Mike Evans with 15 points (5 three pointers), Ian Franks with 12 points and Bryan Wickliffe with 10 points.

Ohio Wesleyan's top scorers are Tim Brady with 20 points (including a dunk) and Pat Pellerite with 7 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 17, 2010, 08:03:56 PM
Go figure.  Mike Evans doesn't miss from deep in the first half and at the end of the half, gets the ball under the basket and misses an eaaaaaaasy bunny for what I believe was his first miss of the night.  :P

As wsf notes, the Scots are firmly in control of this one in what was a very quick first half!   8-)

Wooster could not have asked for a better start to a game following Saturday's lousy performance!  8-)

Witt and Wabash to set to tip in a few minutes BTW...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 17, 2010, 08:54:55 PM
Final:  Wooster 94  Ohio Wesleyan 78  :)

Wooster shot well tonight and made 15 three pointers to notch the easy win.

Scots were led by Ian Franks with 19 points, Mike Evans with 15 points, Brandon Johnson with a season high 14 points and Nathan Balch also with 14 points.  Mike Evans got a cut on his face early in the 2nd half and did not return.

Ohio Wesleyan was led by Tim Brady with 26 points, Brent Pleiman with 13 points and Pat Pellerite with 11 points.

Wooster is now 19-5, 14-1 NCAC. ;D  Next up is a road game at Earlham.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 17, 2010, 09:05:02 PM
2/17 NCAC Final Results:

Wabash 72  Wittenberg 69  big road win for the Little Giants
Allegheny 80  Hiram 75
Kenyon 60  Earlham 41
Wooster 94  Ohio Wesleyan 78
Denison 73  Oberlin 62
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 17, 2010, 09:06:32 PM
Nice bounce back win for the Scots tonight.

Evans is the latest to join the MASH unit for Wooster.  I guess he really did want to be like Hallowell.  :-\ Only, his injury is eye related.  I lost WQKT's radio feed just as Coach Moore was doing his post-game interview.  Hopefully it's nothing serious with Mike.

In other news, Witt is up 9 at the break over Wabash, 43-39.

And in a game of GL Region significance, Hope's stay atop the regional rankings appears to be a short-lived one.  The Flying Dutchmen fall at Adrian 73-68!

Also, Heide is giving JCU all they can handle as the Student Princes just hit a trey with 16 seconds remaining to cut the JCU lead to 2 with 16 seconds left.

Corey Shontz makes two big ft's and the lead is back to 4.  And Heide comes right back with a layup to make it a two point game once again with 9 tics remaining.

And Shontz comes up clutch again for JCU making 2 more.  JCU foul with one second remaining and the Blue Streaks are going to escape yet again...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 17, 2010, 09:51:53 PM
Wabash comes back from a 13-point deficit and defeats Wittenberg 72-69!  Tremendous second half by the Little Giants.  Following the Wooster loss, Wabash HAD to have at least this game and probably the game at OWU as well.  They got it done.  Great, great job by these guys.  WAF!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 17, 2010, 09:52:03 PM
Great college basketball game.... the 3's were falling tonight.

Little Giants need to finish off the reg. season with a victory and the 2nd seed is theirs.

Congrats to Witt on a great game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 17, 2010, 09:54:30 PM
Current NCAC Standings with 2/17 Results:

1.  Wooster 14-1
2.  Wabash 11-4
2.  Allegheny 11-4
4.  Wittenberg 10-5
5.  Ohio Wesleyan 8-7
5.  Hiram 8-7
7.  Denison 7-8
8.  Kenyon 3-12
9.  Oberlin 2-13
10. Earlham 1-14
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 17, 2010, 09:58:39 PM
Wow, congrats to the LGs! In the driver's seat for #2 seed. Well done.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 17, 2010, 10:01:45 PM
Oh, and guess what??

WE GOT THE BELTTM! Witt won it from Wooster and we have it now.

The Bell and the BeltTM in one academic year!

Nothing can top that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 17, 2010, 10:09:13 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 17, 2010, 10:01:45 PM
Oh, and guess what??

WE GOT THE BELTTM! Witt won it from Wooster and we have it now.

The Bell and the BeltTM in one academic year!

Nothing can top that.

An automatic bid to the NCAA tournament would top that.   :)

Well, the belt part anyway.  It's very hard to top owning The Bell.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 17, 2010, 10:21:37 PM
disappointing loss for Witt and sorry to say Wally, Witt had this game won but let it slip away in the first half of all things. Wabash came out way lethargic and Witt had careless turnovers and quick shots that if they could have extended the lead further, Wabash may not have been able to come back.

Rebounding was the big difference once again in this matchup b/w the two as Wabash outrebounded Witt 34-25. Also, Witt had no answer for Wes Smith's driving to the lane and drawing fouls.

It also helps that everything and anything Witt threw up was missing and Wabash could not miss with countless lucky shots. I mean Zimmerman was shooting 15% from 3 point range for the season and made 3 three's.

Mckee had a shot to tie it for Witt with under 10 seconds and was 75% of the way in the basket but somehow rimmed out.

Witt still has a chance at the 3 seed and would prefer that big time. When's the last time if Witt ends up as the 4 that Witt and Wooster met on a Friday night?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 17, 2010, 10:28:01 PM
At what point did Witt ever "have this game won"?  Wabash erased the halftime deficit pretty quickly in the second half, and with 10 minutes to go it was 55-55...anybody's game at that point.  From what I saw on the vid stream, Wabash let Witt hang around in the last two minutes more than anything. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 17, 2010, 10:42:33 PM
Wally, if you read further into that statement, what I meant to say was Witt had the game won (in other words could have put this game dangerously out of reach) if they could have extended the lead before the half instead of playing sloppy and throwing up quick shots.

I give Wabash credit for coming out after half and showing up as a completely different team. The two teams from the 1st half to 2nd half were completely different
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 17, 2010, 10:46:13 PM
Wally -

I'm sure you have season stats that go back much further then I do,  If Wabash beats Oberlin (please no let down)....  This will be the most successful regular season for the Little Giants in how many years?  Don't know if the NCAC tourney is considered reg. season?  Even if it is, figure in 1 loss.... it has still been a while.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 17, 2010, 11:01:56 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on February 17, 2010, 10:46:13 PM
Wally -

You I'm sure have season stats that go back much further then I do,  If Wabash beats Oberlin (please no let down)....  This will be the most successful regular season for the Little Giants in how many years?

The final regular season game is vs. Kenyon, but your point is the same.  Although I will say that Wabash was dangerously close to dropping their game at Kenyon a few weeks ago.  Wabash will have to figure out a way to get inside on Kenyon's 2-3 zone to be successful...otherwise it'll be a matter of shooting a decent percentage on 3's which, while it worked out tonight for the LGs, isn't a game I like to see Wabash playing. 

As for where this season stacks up against recent Wabash history....I mentioned earlier this year that I think this team is the best team Wabash has had since their first year in the NCAC...that team went 20-7 overall, 13-3 in NCAC play, and was led by Wabash's all-time leading scorer.  This team is currently 16-7.   To get to 20-7, these guys would need to win the NCAC tournament.  The 11 (or possibly 12) league wins is the most since that inaugural NCAC season.  And with all of that in mind, were it not for that dadgum Denison game in December, this team's record (overall and conference) would be dead even with that 99-00 team. 

So that's a long way of saying...10 years.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 17, 2010, 11:05:24 PM
Thanks..... Kenyon (not Oberlin) my bad.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 17, 2010, 11:16:45 PM
The unbalanced schedule of the NCAC looks to have an impact this year. Wabash didn't have to make the trip to Hiram or Allegheny this year, while all the other contenders, including Witt, had to play both teams twice. Of course the same can be said of Allegheny, but they had to go to Wabash. Who knows how things might have played out differently, but obviously if Allegheny and Wabash played another time, someone had to lose, meaning at least one of them would have five losses in conference.

This will be one added bonus of having Earlham out of the league next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 17, 2010, 11:58:32 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 17, 2010, 11:16:45 PM

This will be one added bonus of having Earlham out of the league next year.


Amen to that!  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2010, 12:46:04 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 17, 2010, 11:16:45 PM
This will be one added bonus of having Earlham out of the league next year.
...but next year only.  At this point, and without any hard information to back it up, I have no reason to doubt that the NCAC will be a 10-(men's-)team league again for the 2011-12 season.  Regardless (or perhaps especially because) of who that 10th team is, we'd surely be right back to the 16-game unbalanced schedule we enjoy now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 18, 2010, 09:36:09 AM
Can anyone confirm that Wittenberg would get the tie-breaker advantage over Allegheny (if Allegheny loses to OWU) based on "best win." I can't think of how else they'd break it short of coin flip.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2010, 10:03:03 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 18, 2010, 09:36:09 AM
Can anyone confirm that Wittenberg would get the tie-breaker advantage of Allegheny (if Allegheny loses to OWU) based on "best win." I can't think of how else they'd break it short of coin flip.

derek is the expert in this field.  :)

I would think Witt would get the nod due to their win over Wooster.  Allegheny's best win is their win over Witt is it not?

Of course, they have to lose to OWU for that to happen and the based on recent history in this series, I wouldn't bet on the Bishops to get it done...  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 18, 2010, 11:13:55 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 11:31:03 AM
Wabash is going to have a hard time winning one in Deleware or Springfield, let alone both of them. 

Whoopsie.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 18, 2010, 11:25:52 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 21, 2008, 01:03:04 PM
I finally found the official tiebreakers:

1. Head-to-Head competition (NCAC contests only – no restrictions regarding number of games and sites).
2. Combined win-loss record with all teams above tied teams (restricted to "like" games – any team played twice; and single games played at the same location, either home or away).
3. Record versus individual opponents examined in descending order of standings (restricted to "like" games – any team played twice; and single games played at the same location, either home or away).
4. Coin toss.

IF THREE OR MORE TEAMS ARE TIED, the combined records of the teams
involved versus each other are totaled and rankings are listed according to
the winning percentage. The best percentage will be given the highest
seed. If two or more teams tie for the highest percentage, the lowest team
will be seeded. Once the lowest team is clearly seeded the remaining
teams repeat the process until the tie is broken. If three or more
percentages are arrived in initial process, and no ties remain, then teams
shall be seeded according to their percentages.

LIKE GAMES: Defined as: games that are played under the same
traveling condition (either home or away). E.G.: OWU and ALL are tied.
ALL plays DEN once—at DEN. OWU plays DEN twice—once home and
once at DEN. In comparing the two schedules, only compare the games
at DEN, throw out the DEN at OWU game. All teams played home &
home are also "like" games (teams that play each other twice).

So if I'm reading this correctly, and we assume that Wittenberg and Allegheny end up tied at 11-5, then the tiebreak falls as such:

H2H - Split the season series.  Next up....

Combined record vs. all teams above tied teams (like games only) - The teams ahead of Witt and Allegheny are Wooster and Wabash.  We are only allowed to count Wittenberg's game at Wabash so that we satisfy the "like game" condition.  Wittenberg is 1-2 in these games, Allegheny is 0-3.  Wittenberg owns the tiebreak. 

Of course this is all moot if Allegheny wins on Saturday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2010, 12:01:43 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 18, 2010, 11:13:55 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 24, 2010, 11:31:03 AM
Wabash is going to have a hard time winning one in Deleware or Springfield, let alone both of them. 

Whoopsie.   :)

Yeah yeah.  You got me there...  :P 

Can I have some ketchup to go with my crow?   ;D

Congrats on Wabash on their first ever win at Witt's PESC.  I guess a name change was all that was needed for Wabash to get a win in Springfield.  Must be easier winning at a PESC than at a HPER...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 18, 2010, 02:45:32 PM
Looking ahead to Saturday....nothing is written in stone of course, but let's say that Wooster, Witt, and Wabash all win on Saturday.  We've got two games left that have some impact...Hiram/Denison and OWU/Gheny.  Scenarios please! 

Hiram and Allegheny win:
1.  Wooster 15-1
2.  Wabash 12-4 (Wabash wins #2 seed on tiebreak)
2.  Allegheny 12-4
4.  Wittenberg 11-5
5.  Hiram 9-7
6.  Ohio Wesleyan 8-8
7.  Denison 7-9
8.  Kenyon 3-13
9.  Oberlin 2-14
10. Earlham 1-15

Tournament pairings are:

1 Woo vs. 8 Kenyon
2 Wabash vs. 7 Denison
3 Allegheny vs. 6 OWU
4 Witt vs. 5 Hiram

Hiram and OWU win:
1.  Wooster 15-1
2.  Wabash 12-4
3.  Wittenberg 11-5 (Witt is #3 seed on tiebreak)
3.  Allegheny 11-5
5*.  Ohio Wesleyan 9-7
5*.  Hiram 9-7
7.  Denison 7-9
8.  Kenyon 3-13
9.  Oberlin 2-14
10. Earlham 1-15

*OWU is #5 based on having a better record (2-5) against teams above them than Hiram (1-6)

Tournament pairings are:
1 Woo vs. 8 Kenyon
2 Wabash vs. 7 Denison
3 Witt vs. 6 Hiram
4 Allegheny vs. 5 OWU

Denison and Allegheny win:
1.  Wooster 15-1
2.  Wabash 12-4 (Wabash has the h2h tiebreak for the 2 seed)
2.  Allegheny 12-4
4.  Wittenberg 11-5
5*.  Ohio Wesleyan 8-8
5*.  Hiram 8-8
5*.  Denison 8-8
8.  Kenyon 3-13
9.  Oberlin 2-14
10. Earlham 1-15

* I believe in this scenario OWU is 5, Hiram 6, and Denison is 7 by comparing results amongst the three tied teams.  In this case, OWU would be 3-1 vs. the other two, Hiram 2-2, and Denison 1-3.

Tournament pairings are:
1 Woo vs. 8 Kenyon
2 Wabash vs. 7 Denison
3 Allegheny vs. 6 Hiram
4 Witt vs. 5 OWU

Denison and OWU win: 
1.  Wooster 15-1
2.  Wabash 12-4
3.  Wittenberg 11-5 (Witt has the 3 seed via tiebreak)
3.  Allegheny 11-5
5.  Ohio Wesleyan 9-7
6*.  Hiram 8-8
6*.  Denison 8-8
8.  Kenyon 3-13
9.  Oberlin 2-14
10. Earlham 1-15

*Hiram earns the 6 seed by having a better record against the teams above this tie...2-5 vs. 0-7 in like game...unfortunately Denison's win over Wabash is of no use here as only the games at Wabash are eligible to be counted here

Tournament pairings are:
1 Woo vs. 8 Kenyon
2 Wabash vs. 7 Denison
3 Witt vs. 6 Hiram
4 Allegheny vs. 5 OWU

And there you have it.  What we know is that Wooster will play Kenyon and Wabash will play Denison.  Three of our four scenarios will create Witt/Hiram and Allegheny/OWU matchups in round one.  If both Denison and Allegheny win on Saturday, the matchups change slightly to Allegheny/Hiram and Witt/OWU. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2010, 08:12:27 PM
Nice work Wally. 

Right now, Allegheny looks favorable in either scenario, IMO.  They've already swept Hiram and won rather easily in both games so, it would seem to me, that would be the more favorable of the 2 options for the Gators.

Also, even though the Gators have won 3 straight over the Bishops, OWU is in a position to return the favor to Gheny a bit for what happened to OWU to end the season last year.  Remember, Gheny beat OWU in the season finale and then again in the conference tournament opener.  Even though Gheny has had OWU's number of late, it wouldn't surprise me in the least to see the Bishops return the favor to the Gators if given the opportunity.

As for Hiram and Witt, I'm not really sure who Witt would rather play.  They did sweep OWU, but both games were tight.  On the other hand, they split with Hiram getting blown out at Hiram and almost blowing a big lead at home.  If Witt plays like they did last Saturday, it won't matter who the opponent is.  The problem is, can Witt duplicate that performance.  They sure didn't last night...

Also, I'm not too thrilled about seeing Kenyon in that 8 seed.  They've played Wooster very tough and seem to be one of those teams that just matches up well against the Scots for some reason.  And throw in the fact that they should have a lot of confidence coming into that game that they can play with Wooster and maybe even upset the Scots.  I'm hoping the 3rd time isn't a charm for the Lords and that the Scots finally figure this team out and put them away early.

And the last game is DU and Wabash.  Yes, the Big Red caught the Lil Giants napping back in December.  But that loss seemed to awaken the sleeping Lil Giant.  :P  I just don't see Denison going into C'ville and upsetting the #2 seed.

All in all, we could be treated to some very entertaining first round games.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 18, 2010, 08:22:44 PM

QuoteI just don't see Denison going into C'ville and upsetting the #2 seed.

1/24/2009   

http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0809/wabm0124.html#GAME.BOX


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 19, 2010, 08:14:09 AM
Nice job.  I wish I had this much time.

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 18, 2010, 02:45:32 PM
Looking ahead to Saturday....nothing is written in stone of course, but let's say that Wooster, Witt, and Wabash all win on Saturday.  We've got two games left that have some impact...Hiram/Denison and OWU/Gheny.  Scenarios please! 

Hiram and Allegheny win:
1.  Wooster 15-1
2.  Wabash 12-4 (Wabash wins #2 seed on tiebreak)
2.  Allegheny 12-4
4.  Wittenberg 11-5
5.  Hiram 9-7
6.  Ohio Wesleyan 8-8
7.  Denison 7-9
8.  Kenyon 3-13
9.  Oberlin 2-14
10. Earlham 1-15

Tournament pairings are:

1 Woo vs. 8 Kenyon
2 Wabash vs. 7 Denison
3 Allegheny vs. 6 OWU
4 Witt vs. 5 Hiram

Hiram and OWU win:
1.  Wooster 15-1
2.  Wabash 12-4
3.  Wittenberg 11-5 (Witt is #3 seed on tiebreak)
3.  Allegheny 11-5
5*.  Ohio Wesleyan 9-7
5*.  Hiram 9-7
7.  Denison 7-9
8.  Kenyon 3-13
9.  Oberlin 2-14
10. Earlham 1-15

*OWU is #5 based on having a better record (2-5) against teams above them than Hiram (1-6)

Tournament pairings are:
1 Woo vs. 8 Kenyon
2 Wabash vs. 7 Denison
3 Witt vs. 6 Hiram
4 Allegheny vs. 5 OWU

Denison and Allegheny win:
1.  Wooster 15-1
2.  Wabash 12-4 (Wabash has the h2h tiebreak for the 2 seed)
2.  Allegheny 12-4
4.  Wittenberg 11-5
5*.  Ohio Wesleyan 8-8
5*.  Hiram 8-8
5*.  Denison 8-8
8.  Kenyon 3-13
9.  Oberlin 2-14
10. Earlham 1-15

* I believe in this scenario OWU is 5, Hiram 6, and Denison is 7 by comparing results amongst the three tied teams.  In this case, OWU would be 3-1 vs. the other two, Hiram 2-2, and Denison 1-3.

Tournament pairings are:
1 Woo vs. 8 Kenyon
2 Wabash vs. 7 Denison
3 Allegheny vs. 6 Hiram
4 Witt vs. 5 OWU

Denison and OWU win: 
1.  Wooster 15-1
2.  Wabash 12-4
3.  Wittenberg 11-5 (Witt has the 3 seed via tiebreak)
3.  Allegheny 11-5
5.  Ohio Wesleyan 9-7
6*.  Hiram 8-8
6*.  Denison 8-8
8.  Kenyon 3-13
9.  Oberlin 2-14
10. Earlham 1-15

*Hiram earns the 6 seed by having a better record against the teams above this tie...2-5 vs. 0-7 in like game...unfortunately Denison's win over Wabash is of no use here as only the games at Wabash are eligible to be counted here

Tournament pairings are:
1 Woo vs. 8 Kenyon
2 Wabash vs. 7 Denison
3 Witt vs. 6 Hiram
4 Allegheny vs. 5 OWU

And there you have it.  What we know is that Wooster will play Kenyon and Wabash will play Denison.  Three of our four scenarios will create Witt/Hiram and Allegheny/OWU matchups in round one.  If both Denison and Allegheny win on Saturday, the matchups change slightly to Allegheny/Hiram and Witt/OWU. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 19, 2010, 09:22:42 AM
Quote from: GoRed on February 18, 2010, 08:22:44 PM

QuoteI just don't see Denison going into C'ville and upsetting the #2 seed.

1/24/2009   

http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0809/wabm0124.html#GAME.BOX




That was over a year ago?  I think it's safe to say that this Wabash team is a tad better than the one that lost at home to Denison a season ago... (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.scout.com%2Fmedia%2Fforums%2Femoticons%2Fnoidea.gif&hash=d0853e7250ffe0f662a746329d301aa06dd4ee9f)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 19, 2010, 02:41:18 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 19, 2010, 09:22:42 AM
Quote from: GoRed on February 18, 2010, 08:22:44 PM

QuoteI just don't see Denison going into C'ville and upsetting the #2 seed.

1/24/2009   

http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/0809/wabm0124.html#GAME.BOX




That was over a year ago?  I think it's safe to say that this Wabash team is a tad better than the one that lost at home to Denison a season ago... (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.scout.com%2Fmedia%2Fforums%2Femoticons%2Fnoidea.gif&hash=d0853e7250ffe0f662a746329d301aa06dd4ee9f)

It's not a gimme for Wabash on Tuesday.  The thing with Denison is that they play hard and they always hustle.  If you lollygag your way through a game against that team, they stand a good chance to beat you (i.e. the linked 1/24/2009 boxscore in GoRed's post).  That being said, the context around Tuesday's potential game is much different than the context around that game at Chadwick last year, or either of the two games this year.  Tuesday's game is an elimination game...effort will not be conserved, opponents will not be overlooked. 

But first...Wabash has to beat Kenyon (coughgetheballinthepaintcough).  I'll be courtside at Chadwick doing my very best to convey the excitement around this regular season finale via tweet.  :)

Tip time is 3:00 p.m.  Not sure if Wabash is doing Senior Day activities tomorrow or if they are going to wait and do it on Tuesday night. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2010, 09:00:38 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 19, 2010, 02:41:18 PMNot sure if Wabash is doing Senior Day activities tomorrow or if they are going to wait and do it on Tuesday night. 
I sincerely doubt that the NCAC would allow Wabash (or anyone else) to have Senior Day festivities on Tuesday.  The conference runs the tournament, not the school, and they have everything on a strict schedule.  Expect it on Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2010, 09:26:27 PM
Haven't I done this yet this weekend?

Wooster (14-1) at Earlham (1-14), 1pm -- Live stats and audio (http://goearlham.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball) plus Wooster audio (http://wqkt.com/) -- Game 1 of a men/women doubleheader vs. Wooster as Earlham's teams bid adieu to the NCAC
Allegheny (11-4) at OWU (8-7), 3pm -- Live everything (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1) -- Game 1 of a men/women doubleheader vs. Allegheny
Denison (7-8) at Hiram (8-7), 3pm -- Live everything (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html)
Kenyon (3-12) at Wabash (11-4), 3pm -- Live audio, stats, and tweets (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball)
Oberlin (2-13) at Wittenberg (10-4), 3pm -- Live everything (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule09-10.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 19, 2010, 10:15:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 19, 2010, 09:00:38 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 19, 2010, 02:41:18 PMNot sure if Wabash is doing Senior Day activities tomorrow or if they are going to wait and do it on Tuesday night. 
I sincerely doubt that the NCAC would allow Wabash (or anyone else) to have Senior Day festivities on Tuesday.  The conference runs the tournament, not the school, and they have everything on a strict schedule.  Expect it on Saturday.

Hope did its Sr day on the first round of the MIAA tournament a couple years ago.........mostly because the final two regular season games were on the road.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 10:11:24 AM
Quote from: sac on February 19, 2010, 10:15:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 19, 2010, 09:00:38 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 19, 2010, 02:41:18 PMNot sure if Wabash is doing Senior Day activities tomorrow or if they are going to wait and do it on Tuesday night. 
I sincerely doubt that the NCAC would allow Wabash (or anyone else) to have Senior Day festivities on Tuesday.  The conference runs the tournament, not the school, and they have everything on a strict schedule.  Expect it on Saturday.

Hope did its Sr day on the first round of the MIAA tournament a couple years ago.........mostly because the final two regular season games were on the road.

Wooster used the Witt game as their sr. night this year as opposed to having sr. night on the final home game which would have been Wednesday vs. OWU.  As a result, almost 2,000 more people were in attendance for Woo's sr. night.  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2010, 12:49:39 PM
I just noticed (in Wally's post and elsewhere) that Denison could actually finish tied for 5th place if they win today and Allegheny beats OWU.  (Okay, maybe I'm slow on the uptake.)  All the tie-breakers are against them, so they're going to end up with the 7th seed no matter what happens today, but a 5th place finish is a pretty good under-the-radar performance from a team that really only gets mentioned in the context of their win over Wabash 11 long weeks ago.  Could the much-maligned Bob Ghiloni be looking at a second Coach of the Year trophy?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 12:53:46 PM
My vote would go to Rob Clune and Allegheny.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 20, 2010, 01:02:06 PM
Maybe, but I'm not sure getting six wins over teams that will finish league play 6-41 is impressive enough to get that award over the frontrunners in the league.  Denison and Coach Ghiloni certainly deserve credit for getting it together in league play and winning those games they should be winning, but I think Coach of the Year probably goes to Steve Moore.  His team is going to win the league by three full games.  Now, if either Wabash or Allegheny can win today and win the tournament, then you might see that award go to either Coach Petty or Coach Clune. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 01:04:06 PM
The MASH unit continues to grow for Wooster.  :(

Listening to Coach Moore on the pregame show, it sounds like quite a few Scots are under the weather.  Brandon Johnson has a stomach bug and might have his minutes limited.  Jake Mays may not play at all due to an illness.  Ian Franks has a sore ankle and came out of practice early yesterday from it.  Mike Evans has been cleared to play but needs goggles so we'll see how that affects him.  And Kaleb Reed has also been cleared to play today as well.  Lastly, Justin Hallowell is progressing, but still not cleared to play.  So, it looks as though the bench might have to step up a bit more than usual today.

Hopefully, this list of injuries subsides a bit by Tuesday.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2010, 01:23:40 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 20, 2010, 01:02:06 PMDenison and Coach Ghiloni certainly deserve credit for getting it together in league play and winning those games they should be winning[...]
I guess that's the thing, though: it's been several years since Denison had games on their schedule that "they should be winning."  They've progressed from being one of the three doormats, teams on the other end of the "they should be winning" statement, to one of the middle-pack teams that are expected to beat the bottom three, lose to the top three, and compete with the (other) middle three.  That's progress, and with good young players like Dimonde Hale (my choice for NOY) they might just hold on to that middle-pack slot next year and beyond.  I think Denison has shown more progress this year than any other team, and that's usually attributed to the coach.

Allegheny also doesn't get mentioned much; they've had a fine year (in conference, at least, but that's what counts), and Rob Clune would be a good choice for COY.  I don't think he's ever won it, either, so that might make him the front-runner.  But really, they've not done any more than meet expectations.  They went 1-5 vs. the W's.  They swept Hiram, and might sweep OWU, but with George Raftis and all those seniors (and OWU's implosion), that's probably what they should have done.   

I'm not so sure about Steve Moore, since the Scots were expected by most to completely dominate the league, and while they have the record, they haven't really been dominant. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 01:52:26 PM
Halftime in Richmond:

Wooster - 45
The EC - 29

Wooster has jumped out to a comfortable lead thanks in large part to shooting 65% from the field and outrebounding the Quakers to the tune of 24-5!  :o

Bryan Wickliffe is on his way to another double-double leading the way for Wooster with 14 points and 6 rebounds. Ian Franks joins Wick in double figures with 11.  And Josh Claytor could be on his way to a double-double with 6 points to go along with a game high 7 rebounds.

I wonder when the last time Wooster has had 2 players finish with a double-double in the same game? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 20, 2010, 02:22:37 PM
QuoteMy vote would go to Rob Clune and Allegheny.

I'm a loyal Big Red fan, but I'm on the opposite side of the fence on their coach and I have to say I agree with Clune vote for COY.  I don't think that Denison's going from 5-11 in conference last year to potentially 8-8 this year warrants a second thought as COY material.  Having seen some of the coaching techniques and decisions over the past several years, I would say that Denison's wins have come as a result of the talent rather than the coaching. 

I'd like to see a change in the staff and the system for these Big Red players.  I think you would see a much more competitive Denison if that were to happen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 20, 2010, 02:37:08 PM
Quote from: GoRed on February 20, 2010, 02:22:37 PM
QuoteMy vote would go to Rob Clune and Allegheny.

I'm a loyal Big Red fan, but I'm on the opposite side of the fence on their coach and I have to say I agree with Clune vote for COY.  I don't think that Denison's going from 5-11 in conference last year to potentially 8-8 this year warrants a second thought as COY material.  Having seen some of the coaching techniques and decisions over the past several years, I would say that Denison's wins have come as a result of the talent rather than the coaching.  

I'd like to see a change in the staff and the system for these Big Red players.  I think you would see a much more competitive Denison if that were to happen.

Will you take Witt's Bill Brown in a trade for Ghiloni?

Call Dr. Erickson at 1-937-327-7916 to make the deal.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2010, 02:39:45 PM
Quote from: GoRed on February 20, 2010, 02:22:37 PM
I'd like to see a change in the staff and the system for these Big Red players.  I think you would see a much more competitive Denison if that were to happen.
This is what I meant by "much-maligned," and I too have lots of doubts about Ghiloni; he's gotten some pretty poor results out of some pretty talented guys over the years.  But the award is for this year, not multiple years, and it should be remembered that recruiting is one of the duties of a head coach.  Ghiloni may not be an Xs-and-Os wizard, and may make some head-scratching decisions regarding how he uses his squad, but he seems to be a fairly good recruiter, and this year his team is playing hard and generally playing well.  

Of course, the coaches made Ghiloni the COY four or five years ago, and the program immediately nosedived right back to doormat status, so they might think twice about giving it to him a second time.  Clune, on the other hand, seems to get pretty consistent results and handle all aspects of his program pretty well.  So maybe he's the choice.  

Quote from: Witt4ever on February 20, 2010, 02:37:08 PM
Will you take Witt's Bill Brown in a trade for Ghiloni?

Call Dr. Erickson at 1-937-327-7916 to make the deal.
:D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 02:46:15 PM
Final from The EC:

Wooster - 90
The EC - 72

The EC finishes their NCAC membership with a bagel vs. the Scots over their stay in the NCAC.   8-)  I believe it's 0-45 overall?  I'm sure that The EC won't miss having to play Wooster at least 2 times a year any more...  ;D

Wick finished the day with a season high 24 points and for the 3rd time in his last 4 games he finishes with a double-double!  He's really picked his game up at the right time of the season!  Others in double figures include Nate Balch with 16, Ian Franks had 13 and Mike Evans had 10 with the goggles  8-).  Brandon Johnson had 9 while Matt Feagan and Josh Claytor finished with 8 to round out a balanced scoring effort for the Scots.

Wooster finished the game 61% from the field for the game and 38% from deep compared to 38% from the field for The EC and 32% from deep.  Wooster also ended up winning the battle of the boards 39-24.

All in all, a solid win for the Scots as they did what they needed to do. 

Also, congrats to the Scots and Coach Moore and his staff on yet another 20 win season!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2010, 03:25:41 PM
Anybody know the username and password to access Hiram's live stats utility?   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 20, 2010, 03:44:39 PM
Missed the radio broadcast of Wooster's game today but the boxscore and recap by ScotsFan certainly tell the story.  Great to see some balanced scoring today and the big game by Bryan Wickliffe.  Also nice to see Mike Evans play well with 10 points (2 three pointers) because Wooster may really need his contribution until Hallowell can get back on the floor.

One lousy statistic for the Scots today is the 15 turnovers against a last place team. ???  Wooster still needs to take better care of the ball and when they don't against a good team, it will result in a loss (recent Wittenberg loss is an example).

Nice to see Wooster finish 15-1 in the regular season. ;D   Next up is Kenyon in the NCAC tourney.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on February 20, 2010, 04:21:18 PM
Check my numbers, by my unoffical count this 20 win season for Wooster is Steve Moore's 14th straight. 

He's had 20 or more wins in 19 of the last 22 seasons (the 3 less-than-20-win seasons were 19, 18, 18). 

Now finishing his 23rd season at College of Wooster he's only won less than 18 games once--14-11 in his first year.

Going into the tournament he's 533-125 at Wooster and 620-189 lifetime.

Think Wooster made a good hire in 1987?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 20, 2010, 04:31:13 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on February 20, 2010, 04:21:18 PM
Check my numbers, by my unoffical count this 20 win season for Wooster is Steve Moore's 14th straight. 

He's had 20 or more wins in 19 of the last 22 seasons (the 3 less-than-20-win seasons were 19, 18, 18). 

Now finishing his 23rd season at College of Wooster he's only won less than 18 games once--14-11 in his first year.

Going into the tournament he's 533-125 at Wooster and 620-189 lifetime.

Think Wooster made a good hire in 1987?



nicevilledave - great post on Coach Moore's impressive results! k+

Wooster's 20 win season is their 14th straight - the longest streak in Divison III ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2010, 04:36:37 PM
I wonder how many job offers Steve Moore has declined in his years at Wooster?

Elsewhere:
Wabash wallops Kenyon 75-51
Wittenberg wastes Oberlin 107-74
Hiram harms Denison by a score I couldn't catch (but not close)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 20, 2010, 04:45:43 PM
OWU with an insurmountable lead and only ~1 minute left in their game so.....

Insurmountable???  Whew....OWU still notches the win 76-73 after missing some free throws.

Final NCAC Regular Season Standings:

1.  Wooster 15-1
2.  Wabash 12-4
3.  Wittenberg 11-5
3.  Allegheny 11-5
5.  Ohio Wesleyan 9-7
5.  Hiram 9-7
7.  Denison 7-9
8.  Kenyon 3-13
9.  Oberlin 2-14
10. Earlham 1-15


NCAC Tourney pairings are:

1 Wooster vs. 8 Kenyon
2 Wabash vs. 7 Denison
3 Wittenberg vs. 6 Hiram
4 Allegheny vs. 5 Ohio Wesleyan
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2010, 04:51:51 PM
OWU outlasts Allegheny 76-73...OWU scored the game's first 11 points, then held on for 35 minutes.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 05:23:38 PM
Glad to see that OWU result!  :)   If the Scots can get past Kenyon on Tuesday, I'd much rather have the possibility on not having to face Witt until the finals than possibly in the semis on Friday night as would have been the case if Gheny would have beaten OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 20, 2010, 05:53:13 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 05:23:38 PM
Glad to see that OWU result!  :)   If the Scots can get past Kenyon on Tuesday, I'd much rather have the possibility on not having to face Witt until the finals than possibly in the semis on Friday night as would have been the case if Gheny would have beaten OWU.

How about not playing Witt at all? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 06:01:07 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 20, 2010, 05:53:13 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 05:23:38 PM
Glad to see that OWU result!  :)   If the Scots can get past Kenyon on Tuesday, I'd much rather have the possibility on not having to face Witt until the finals than possibly in the semis on Friday night as would have been the case if Gheny would have beaten OWU.

How about not playing Witt at all? 

That'd be alright as well!  ;)

I was just sayin' that if given the choice of facing Witt in the semis or in the finals, I would rather face them in the finals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 20, 2010, 06:15:25 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 06:01:07 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 20, 2010, 05:53:13 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 05:23:38 PM
Glad to see that OWU result!  :)   If the Scots can get past Kenyon on Tuesday, I'd much rather have the possibility on not having to face Witt until the finals than possibly in the semis on Friday night as would have been the case if Gheny would have beaten OWU.

How about not playing Witt at all? 

That'd be alright as well!  ;)

Careful what you wish for, friend.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 20, 2010, 06:24:52 PM
Interesting note:

I'm not sure if this is Oberlin's attempt at a cruel joke, but it shows on the boxscore for the game a Gregg Hill played 7 minutes for Wittenberg today......

I'm happy with Wittenberg's matchups. I'm much more comfortable with a matchup vs Hiram than Ohio Wesleyan as a rivalry matchup sometimes produces crazy results.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy_pilgrim on February 20, 2010, 06:28:20 PM
Good knowing you guys.... have an enjoyable postseason and beyond.

By the way, I'll be back at Earlham next year as I enter one of the college's graduate programs...guess I'll be watching Heartland ball though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2010, 06:31:06 PM
Farewell, Billy.  Drop by anytime; you'll always be welcome.  Good luck in your studies.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2010, 07:25:16 PM
Wittenberg, which hosted a quarterfinal doubleheader every year of their conference membership until last year, will be the only school to host one this year, and in both games the opponent will be Hiram.   The third-seeded men kick off the tournament Tuesday at 6pm against the Terriers, followed by the top-seeded women vs. #8 Hiram at 8.  All other quarterfinals, men and women, will be at 7:30: the men spread out far and wide (at Wooster, Wabash, and Allegheny), and the women tightly grouped (at OWU, Denison, and Kenyon.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 08:22:38 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 20, 2010, 06:28:20 PM
Good knowing you guys.... have an enjoyable postseason and beyond.

By the way, I'll be back at Earlham next year as I enter one of the college's graduate programs...guess I'll be watching Heartland ball though.

Good knowing you too Billy.  Good luck to your Quakers in the HCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 08:28:40 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 20, 2010, 06:15:25 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 06:01:07 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 20, 2010, 05:53:13 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 20, 2010, 05:23:38 PM
Glad to see that OWU result!  :)   If the Scots can get past Kenyon on Tuesday, I'd much rather have the possibility on not having to face Witt until the finals than possibly in the semis on Friday night as would have been the case if Gheny would have beaten OWU.

How about not playing Witt at all? 

That'd be alright as well!  ;)

Careful what you wish for, friend.   :)

OK, OK.  I'm not suggesting that playing Wabash is going to be any easier than playing Witt.  I'm just looking at if from a rivalry perspective and Witt seems to thrive on playing and beating Wooster in Timken.  Wabash on the other hand...  Not so much.

That said.  Playing either Witt or Wabash in the finals, should Wooster make it that far, will be more than a challenge for the Scots to bring home a win and both are more than capable of beating the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 20, 2010, 08:38:29 PM
I just think you're putting far too much stock in Witt's win last weekend.  Rivalry game or not, you simply can't ignore that 1) Wooster was without one of their top players, 2) Wooster had already clinched the #1 seed in the tournament, and 3) Wittenberg had to win that game to keep pace with Wabash and Allegheny in the race for #2.  Everything about that game's context favored Wittenberg. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2010, 08:53:42 PM
For me, the benefit to Wooster of OWU's win today was not so much that Witt could no longer be Wooster's semifinal opponent as that it means that Wooster will not have to beat both Witt and Wabash, on back-to-back nights no less, to win the title.  I don't want to disrespect either Allegheny or OWU, but Wooster matches up much more favorably against either than they do against the W's.  Plus whichever team emerges from the 2-3-6-7 half of the bracket will have been through the wars and might not have much left for Saturday night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 21, 2010, 02:01:13 AM
 Billy - hope everything goes better for Earlham in the Heartland! At least you have Penn State basketball to fall back on.....wait nevermind

A fellow Penn State fan is rare to find these days around Ohio, keep in touch!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2010, 04:00:47 PM
Quote from: billy_pilgrim on February 20, 2010, 06:28:20 PM
Good knowing you guys.... have an enjoyable postseason and beyond.

By the way, I'll be back at Earlham next year as I enter one of the college's graduate programs...guess I'll be watching Heartland ball though.

One more time for good measure...

"Oh, you know it's true!!!!!"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2010, 08:49:58 PM
The final NCAC Player of the Week (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mbpow.html) trophy will be delivered to one of the genuine good guys of the league, forward Dave Knapke of Kenyon.  Knapke, who quietly and amid much adversity has built an outstanding senior season, capped off his year by averaging a double-double against the Indiana members of the conference.  Dave finishes up ranking 10th in the league in scoring, second in rebounding, eighth in field goal percentage, and fourth in blocked shots, a resume that surely will result in his third All-Conference certificate.  Congratulations, Dave!

-----------

Here's the tale of the tape for the POTW:
Wooster, Wittenberg, and OWU each copped the award twice, while the other seven squads had one winner apiece.  Wooster's Ian Franks was the lone two-time winner this season, and Denison's Dimonde Hale was the only Newcomer to cop the hardware.  The award was won just three times in 13 weeks by seniors, two of them coming in the last two weeks.  (Those seniors were George Raftis in week 1, and David Nowicki and Knapke in weeks 12-13.) 
Read these tea leaves however you will.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2010, 10:19:35 PM
Conference-only statistical leaders (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/09-10stats/CONFONLY.HTM#conf.wki):

Scoring Champion: Wooster's Ian Franks, at 19.5 ppg and nearly two points per game clear of OWU's Tim Brady.  (Wes Smith finished third at 17.5.)
Leading Rebounder: Larry Farmer of Denison (who knew!) at 10.9 rpg, a full 1.6 rpg ahead of Kenyon's Dave Knapke.  (George Raftis finished fourth at 8.1.)  Farmer was the best on the defensive glass (7.56) and on the offensive glass (3.31).
Assists: OWU frosh Andy Winters at just under 5.4 per game, nearly two per game ahead of Oberlin's Josh Merritt.
Assist to Turnover Ratio: Wittenberg's David Nowicki at 2.84, a healthy margin over Wabash's Brian Shelbourne.
Steals: Donte Briscoe of Allegheny, at three steals per game, well clear of Andy Winters and Wabash's Wes Smith.
Shooting percentages: The best overall field goal percentage belongs to Donte Briscoe, who connected on 63.2% of his shots, slipping past Wooster's Bryan Wickliffe (62.8%).  Oberlin's Marcus Johnson led the loop in free throw shooting, hitting 88.6% to finish just ahead of the more-frequently-fouled Aaron Brock of Wabash.  The top long-range shooter, technically, was Wittenberg's Seth Hill, whose outrageous 75% shooting equated to making nine shots in twelve attempts in nine games.  The runner-up, Wooster's Mike Evans, also just cleared the 1.0 threes-per-game threshold.  Of the more frequent long-range shooters, the best percentage belonged to Ian Franks, whose 47.9% rate on 48 attempts was good for third place in this category. 
Three point baskets:  Hill's nine makes weren't enough to get it done in this category; his teammate Chris Sullivan, who buried 58 long-range jumpers, is the champ here. 
Blocked shots: Larry Farmer was a whole lot more dominant in the post than I realized.  His 1.81 blocks per game were half-again better than OWU's Pat Pellerite, the runner-up here.
Minutes per game: Farmer's teammate Chris Luther saw the most action, at 33.7 minutes per game, about 26 seconds per game better than Oberlin's Andrew Fox.
Scoring and rebounding: Just three players were in the league's top ten in both scoring and rebounding:
> Wabash's Wes Smith--3rd in scoring (17.5), T9th in rebounding (6.5)
> Kenyon's Dave Knapke--T10th in scoring (14.6), 2nd in rebounding (9.3)
> Wabash's Aaron Brock--7th in scoring (15.6), 7th in rebounding (6.9)

Congratulations to all of these outstanding performers!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2010, 12:23:49 AM
Is the part of Donte Brisco played by Johnny Depp?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on February 22, 2010, 10:30:08 AM
Wittenberg is ready to play and win---A conference tourney is just what they need to cap off a good season and get the program back on track!
Go Witt!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 22, 2010, 10:40:09 AM
So, now that the regular season is over, who is going to walk away with the conference awards?

COY has already been touched on briefly.  When is the voting done?  Before or after the conference tournament?

Based on regular season only, I was inclined to say Clune from Allegheny but then they went and lost to OWU in the season finale.  Now, my focus has shifted towards either Mac Petty or Steve Moore.  I know that many say that what Steve Moore did wasn't anything anyone didn't expect, but guiding your team to 6 straight conference championships is pretty freaking amazing if you ask me.  I just don't see anyone else that jumps out at me that would make me say, yes, that warrants coach of the year honors more than a coach who has now guided his team to an NCAC record 6 straight conference titles and counting!  8-)

As far as POY, is there really any debate over this?  Ian Franks is among the top 10 in the league in scoring, fg percentage, assists, ft percentage, 3 pt. fg. percentage, assist/turnover ratio and minutes played.  I really think that Ian should win this award going away.

And I think David touched on NOY going to Dimonde Hale.  He'd get my vote as well.  Wooster's Josh Claytor has gotten a lot of minutes and played well for Wooster as a frosh, but Hale gets the nod from a statistical point of view.  Andy Winters from OWU and Allegheny's Devone McLeod could also warrant considerations.

Let the debates begin...  :)



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2010, 11:05:18 AM
It's coach of the year, not coach of the six years.  I've already stated that I think Moore will win that award, but not because of anything he's done prior to the 2009-2010 season.  If Moore does win the award because of an accumulation of league championships over the last handful of years, then the voters are missing the boat.  And if we're going to award coach of the year based on prior accomplishments, then nobody in the league should be winning the award other than Coach Petty because the last time I checked, he's the only one who has hung The Banner in his school's gym. 

There is debate over POY.  It seems a little easier when you elect to ignore 1/3 of the season which many seem to think is ok.  I think it's irresponsible.  The award will go to either Franks or Smith and both are deserving players.  Let's let the tournament decide! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 22, 2010, 12:47:09 PM
Geez.  You're the one that said you thought he would win the freaking award to begin with?!  I'm not talking about Moore winning the award based on past accomplishments wally.  I'm talking about maintaining.  It's not as though the Scots just coasted to another league championship.  It's not as though Moore clearly has the most talent in the league. Yet, there he is, once again, guiding his team to their 6th straight conference championship.  And not only did they win the conference, they did it by a whopping 3 games!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2010, 01:32:10 PM
I don't know you reconcile this:
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 22, 2010, 12:47:09 PM
I'm not talking about Moore winning the award based on past accomplishments

with this:
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 22, 2010, 10:40:09 AM
I just don't see anyone else that jumps out at me that would make me say, yes, that warrants coach of the year honors more than a coach who has now guided his team to an NCAC record 6 straight conference titles and counting!

Coach of the Year is hermetically sealed...last year or the year before or the year before can't matter.  If the voters are going to factor in past league championships, then this award is a bigger farce than the PotW awards are. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 22, 2010, 02:03:58 PM
And I'm not saying that the voters are taking all of those past championships into consideration.  I am saying that they may be taking into consideration how difficult it is MAINTAINING as I said above.  It's hard enough to repeat or three-peat when we're talking about winning conference championships.  But to place his team atop the league for 6 straight years takes good coaching.  And not only did he win the conference, he basically ran away from the conference this season.

Furthermore, wrt the award being a farce ala the PotW?   IMO, awarding the COY to a coach for supposedly over achieving with a 7-9 league mark would be PotW-like...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on February 22, 2010, 02:09:29 PM
I almost never post on any of the boards, but I felt this was worth pointing out. Mac Petty has never won a Coach of the Year Award in any conference Wabash has belonged to in his 34 years as a head coach. The argument has either been "he's done what he's expected to do because he's a good coach" or "well his team didn't win the conference tournament or didn't win the regular season title, so he's not really eligible for the award."

Now fortunately wiser decisions have been made in some of those seasons and he's received Regional Coach of the Year honors from the NABC, but not one Conference Coach of the Year in the ICAC, HCAC, or NCAC. In fact, he won NABC DIII Midwest Region Coach of the Year honors in 1996-97 after guiding Wabash to a 24-5 record after a 12-12 season the previous year. His reward --- watching Rose-Hulman Coach Jim Shaw receive ICAC Coach of the Year honors. I've known Mac for almost 30 years now. No one is more deserving for Coach of the Year honors in the NCAC. Campaign over, now it's back to the shadows for me. Brent Harris
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2010, 02:24:21 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 22, 2010, 02:03:58 PM
And I'm not saying that the voters are taking all of those past championships into consideration.  I am saying that they may be taking into consideration how difficult it is MAINTAINING as I said above.  It's hard enough to repeat or three-peat when we're talking about winning conference championships.  But to place his team atop the league for 6 straight years takes good coaching.  And not only did he win the conference, he basically ran away from the conference this season.

Furthermore, wrt the award being a farce ala the PotW?   IMO, awarding the COY to a coach for supposedly over achieving with a 7-9 league mark would be PotW-like...

Your logic still hinges on past seasons affecting the way voters should view what happened in 2009-2010, which I think is erroneous.  I don't care if they want to name the award after Steve Moore.  I don't care if they want to mold the award as miniature (or gigantic) statue of Steve Moore.  Just award the thing to the guy who did the best job this year.  If the vote happens this instant, I'd expect a vote for Coach Moore because he won the league by three games.  I don't think that can be ignored.  If they vote after the tournament (which is responsible...again, why ignore a part of the season?) and Petty or Clune are the last coach standing, then I think it would be more than appropriate to award either of them. 

And Coach Petty was totally hosed in '96-'97!  That team won the ICAC tournament in RHIT's gym/airplane hangar.  And the ICAC was wicked hard in the late 90s...there were no gimmes in that league at that time.  I hadn't realized that he has never won a CotY award...that's amazing, frankly. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2010, 07:10:33 PM
To me, coach of the year should be the coach that got the most out of his team - the coach that helped his team rise above expectations - and the coach that guided his team to improvement from the past season and during the season.

To me, the coaches that deserve this are:

Mac Petty - When the LG's started out 2-4, and then were 4-5 with an 0-2 NCAC record, many thought they'd be fighting for a home tourney game. Well, they're #2 seed. 13-2 in 2010!

Rob Clune - They were 6-8, 3-3 in the NCAC and looking at another sub .500 season. But they finished with 8 out of their last 10 and this LG fan was happy that we played the Gators just once this year!

Bill Brown - An under .500 Witt team the previous year somewhat shattered the notion of Witt's perennial excellence in the NCAC. Brown did one of the hardest jobs in sports - correcting a downward spiral of a program.

That's how I'd vote 'em...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2010, 08:57:30 PM
Nominations for the all-conference teams were submitted last week, and voting begins (and, I'd guess, ends) today.  As noted before, the coaches get no specific voting instructions beyond "don't vote for your own players," but the timing suggests that the awards are for regular-season performance (AJ Sutherlin breathes a sigh of relief).  As for whether basing a conference award on conference action is "irresponsible," well, I guess I have the exact opposite feeling.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2010, 09:37:53 PM
It's a shame that all of this voting takes place before the three biggest games of the year.  Why the rush to vote on this stuff?  And really, why should coaches be spending any time the day before the tournament voting on this?  Why not play out the tournament and see who gets it done with the bid on the line?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 22, 2010, 09:39:22 PM
For those planning to attend the Kenyon-Wooster game tomorrow night, tickets are $7 (or $5 for those holding NCAC passes).  Tickets will go on sale when the gates open at 6:00; there will be no pre-sale.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2010, 09:57:06 PM
The handbook does not state when the voting on all this stuff closes, and I don't know how exactly it all works.  (I feel like I used to have an email on this subject, but I can't find it.)  There are rounds of voting: the first team is selected, then the second team, then the HMs; the POY is selected from the first team; the NOY is supposed to be the newcomer that fares best in the all-conference voting, but that's not hard and fast (and none may achieve that honor); nevertheless that must take place after the all-conf. teams are finalized. 

Despite the sequential nature of this process, I can envision a coach taking care of all this business in one fax/email, and letting the conference staff sort it all out.  They already have a list of nominees from which to vote.  Because of the timing, I expect that the coaches take care of this stuff today, and then turn their attention to tomorrow's game.  But that's purely speculation on my part.  All I know for sure* is that the voting "begins" today (the Monday before the NCAC tournament.)

By the way, the coaches do get guidance for how to cast their ballots for Coach of the Year:
QuoteEach coach shall vote for a Coach of the Year based upon team record, improvement, sportsmanship and professionalism.
Take that for whatever it may be worth.

*That is, unless the handbook has been updated in the last two or three years, since I last saw a copy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 23, 2010, 07:03:14 AM
Tiger Up Witt!!!!

Hopefully Witt will replicate their gameplan and performance the last time around against Hiram.

Quick thought: If we can get enough interest (i.e. more than me, wally, ScotsFan and DC), can we start up the Pick Em next year?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 23, 2010, 09:28:49 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 23, 2010, 07:03:14 AM
Quick thought: If we can get enough interest (i.e. more than me, wally, ScotsFan and DC), can we start up the Pick Em next year?

I think the problem with the pick em is getting someone to run it.  I'd bet you'd have more than just the usual suspects join in if someone just took over the reigns to start it up.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 23, 2010, 09:33:46 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 22, 2010, 07:10:33 PM
To me, coach of the year should be the coach that got the most out of his team - the coach that helped his team rise above expectations - and the coach that guided his team to improvement from the past season and during the season.


Wooster didn't exactly get off to a hot start.  They were 2-3 at one point in the season before winning 18 of their last 20 to finish the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on February 23, 2010, 10:09:39 AM
Let's Go SCOTS!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2010, 11:07:40 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 23, 2010, 09:33:46 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 22, 2010, 07:10:33 PM
To me, coach of the year should be the coach that got the most out of his team - the coach that helped his team rise above expectations - and the coach that guided his team to improvement from the past season and during the season.


Wooster didn't exactly get off to a hot start.  They were 2-3 at one point in the season before winning 18 of their last 20 to finish the season.

2-3?!?!?!  Nothing short of an otherworldly coaching job can salvage a season that starts 2-3!  NCAC Coach of the Year doesn't do this work justice.  Parades, key to the city, presidential appointment to the Cabinet as the nation's first Secretary of Basketball....can we possibly do enough to recognize the job done by a coach who started 2-3 and then ran over a league that they were completely expected to run over (http://www.northcoast.org/pdffiles/09-10/0910bkbpolls.pdf)?  I submit that we can not.  I just hope that Coach Moore can be satisfied with the humble offering of NCAC Coach of the Year award.  Again.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 23, 2010, 12:06:32 PM
Because a 2-4 start is sooooooooooooooooooooo much more difficult to overcome...  ::)

I could really care less about who wins COY as I'm sure Coach Moore probably feels the same way.  I'm sure COY wasn't exactly at the top of the list of goals to achieve at the start of the season.  My only premise from the start is, who really stands out in the NCAC that is hands down deserving of the award?  You jump all over me because I make the same arguments that are basically being made for other coaches?  I don't recall ever making the argument that Moore should win the award hands down.  I'm just basically waiting for someone to give me a compelling argument for another coach.  

Smeds made some good points, but I would hardly say any of those just jumps off the page.  I mean, when you look at Petty, Clune and Brown, look at what all 3 coaches had coming back.  Did Wabash really overachieve that much?  With 3 returning starters and one of them being POY candidate Wes Smith, I'd have to say not really. And if you say you didn't expect how the season turned out for Wabash, I'm sorry your expectations are so low.

How about Allegheny?  They started 4 seniors.  With all of that experience, is it really that much of a surprise that they finished 4th instead of their predicted 5th place finish?  

And wasnt' Witt picked to finish 2nd in the pre-season poll?  So basically they underachieved even though they improved on their record from a season ago.

You continue to humor yourself with your sarcasm, but I've still not seen any compelling arguments from your end as to who you think deserves the award.  The only thing I've seen from you is whining about why the NCAC tournament isn't factored into the voting...  ::)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old wabash on February 23, 2010, 12:19:03 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 23, 2010, 11:07:40 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 23, 2010, 09:33:46 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 22, 2010, 07:10:33 PM
To me, coach of the year should be the coach that got the most out of his team - the coach that helped his team rise above expectations - and the coach that guided his team to improvement from the past season and during the season.


Wooster didn't exactly get off to a hot start.  They were 2-3 at one point in the season before winning 18 of their last 20 to finish the season.

2-3?!?!?!  Nothing short of an otherworldly coaching job can salvage a season that starts 2-3!  NCAC Coach of the Year doesn't do this work justice.  Parades, key to the city, presidential appointment to the Cabinet as the nation's first Secretary of Basketball....can we possibly do enough to recognize the job done by a coach who started 2-3 and then ran over a league that they were completely expected to run over (http://www.northcoast.org/pdffiles/09-10/0910bkbpolls.pdf)?  I submit that we can not.  I just hope that Coach Moore can be satisfied with the humble offering of NCAC Coach of the Year award.  Again.  

wally,
loved the humor!
this board is about info... with entertainment as a bonus!!
thanks for bringing laughter into my day!

from the preseason predictions, it seems like only one team out performed coaches preseason standings!
if i was a coach in the league i might have to think about giving some credit to my colleague, that team's coach!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 23, 2010, 12:41:24 PM
IMO, the measure of a coach's performance should be more than outperforming the pre-season polls, or if they moved up in the standings from the prior year. 

To me, when you measure a coach's performance you need to take things into account like how well they recruited to fill their team's needs, how well they scheduled their opponents to help their team grow, how they managed to turn those 10-14 guys from different areas and backgrounds into a TEAM.  (In addition to the actual 'coaching' aspect of the job).  I think its difficult to say that a coach was better than another coach 'this year' because the building of this year's team is usually a cumulative effort over the past 2 or 3 season. 

My vote for COY would probably be for Coach Moore, but I have a lot more familiarity with him and how he runs the program than I do for any of the other coaches.  My prediction is that Coach Petty wins, for the exact reason that Old Wabash gives.  What I'm fairly sure of, is that pretty much none of the 10 coaches really cares a whole lot.  For sure 8 of them have (or better have) winning 3 more games on their minds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 23, 2010, 12:50:01 PM
See, it's not a recruiting award or a scheduling award - it's a coaching award. I've seen enough "Top 10" classes to go kablooey to know that recruiting isn't an exact science. To me, it's how the teams have improved.

Wooster lost to Albion, but their other losses were a bit more expected.

Wabash lost to freakin' Denison and rebounded.
(I think any loss to Denison in hoops and football should allow one to use "freakin'" in front of Denison

Gheny was on the ropes, about ready to fall to 6-9 when they beat Hiram on the road and started a run. The Gators lost some tough non-conference games - that may have helped them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2010, 01:56:12 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 23, 2010, 12:06:32 PM
Because a 2-4 start is sooooooooooooooooooooo much more difficult to overcome...  ::)

I could really care less about who wins COY as I'm sure Coach Moore probably feels the same way.  I'm sure COY wasn't exactly at the top of the list of goals to achieve at the start of the season.  My only premise from the start is, who really stands out in the NCAC that is hands down deserving of the award?  You jump all over me because I make the same arguments that are basically being made for other coaches?  I don't recall ever making the argument that Moore should win the award hands down.  I'm just basically waiting for someone to give me a compelling argument for another coach.  

Smeds made some good points, but I would hardly say any of those just jumps off the page.  I mean, when you look at Petty, Clune and Brown, look at what all 3 coaches had coming back.  Did Wabash really overachieve that much?  With 3 returning starters and one of them being POY candidate Wes Smith, I'd have to say not really. And if you say you didn't expect how the season turned out for Wabash, I'm sorry your expectations are so low.

How about Allegheny?  They started 4 seniors.  With all of that experience, is it really that much of a surprise that they finished 4th instead of their predicted 5th place finish?  

And wasnt' Witt picked to finish 2nd in the pre-season poll?  So basically they underachieved even though they improved on their record from a season ago.

You continue to humor yourself with your sarcasm, but I've still not seen any compelling arguments from your end as to who you think deserves the award.  The only thing I've seen from you is whining about why the NCAC tournament isn't factored into the voting...  ::)

What preseason poll are you looking at that had Witt picked 2nd and Allegheny picked fifth?  It wasn't this season's poll. 

And I'm not whining about anything.  I'm just a bit confused and puzzled as to why parts of the season are actively ignored when it comes to determining who was the best player/coach/freshman of the YEAR.  Not of the half year or the 2/3 year.  Of the year.  In my eye, the NCAC coach/player/freshman of the Year award is awarded by the NCAC to the person from an NCAC team (hence the "NCAC" part of NCAC whatever of the Year)that had the best season, inclusive of the entire season.  That season includes 8-9 non-conference games (are we not still all part of the NCAC in November?) and as many as three conference tournament games and to me it seems like ignoring as many as a dozen games is a bit too head-in-the-sand-y for a league full of smart people.   

I've stated pretty plainly who I think will win Coach of the Year and why.  I've also stated pretty plainly that there are two other coaches that ought to be considered more than strongly should either of them win the league's tournament.  My problem with the CotY discussion is that people seem to want to base the award either on only a fraction of this year's season or they want to base it on an aggregation of results over seasons beyond the current one...neither approach seems appropriate.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 23, 2010, 02:03:09 PM
...........or people want to base it on whatever premise will make their choice/preference of coach win.

Personally, from a Wittenberg fan perspective, I would award the award to either Coach Moore of Wooster or Allegheny's coach, for a pretty good coaching job.

Wooster shouldn't be penalized for their loss to Albion in the non-conference as every team has a bad loss in a season (i.e. Wabash vs Denison).

Ultimately, I don't think NCAC COY is thought of anything more than a line in the preseason media guide for the veteran coaches who have won this award before.

I don't think any upsets occur tonight in the tournament; Allegheny vs OWU game wouldn't be an upset in my mind if Allegheny won.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 23, 2010, 02:41:20 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 23, 2010, 01:56:12 PM
What preseason poll are you looking at that had Witt picked 2nd and Allegheny picked fifth?  It wasn't this season's poll. 


Sue me! Sheesh...  I was going on memory.   ::)  Looking at THIS season's poll, I see that only 5 points seperated 2nd from 4th.  Not exactly what I would call a huge discrepancy.  And furthermore, Allegheny was also a whopping 5 points behind 5th place Hiram.  So sorry.  :-\  I guess that changes my perspective on everthing...  ::)


Quote from: wally_wabash on February 23, 2010, 01:56:12 PM
And I'm not whining about anything.   

Really?  Sure could have fooled me.


Quote from: pennstghs on February 23, 2010, 02:03:09 PM
I don't think any upsets occur tonight in the tournament; Allegheny vs OWU game wouldn't be an upset in my mind if Allegheny won.

Thank you for reminding us that there are actual games being played tonight.  :) 

I agree with you that I don't see any upsets from the top 3 seeds.  Although, isn't it interesting that all 3 match-ups involve lower seeded teams that have either beaten their higher seeded opponent or given them all sorts of problems.  This isn't lilke the good 'ol days when first round games could be considered glorified scrimmages for the top seeds in the tournament.  If any of the top 3 don't show up ready to play, it could be exit city.

The only game that I can't nail down is the Allegheny/OWU game in Meadville.  I really don't see either team as a favorite so I wouldn't really view it as an upset regardless of who wins.  I'm leaning towards the Gators at this point only because of their experience.  Given the choice between OWU's youngsters and Allegheny's 4 senior starters, I'm going to side with experience.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2010, 02:58:42 PM
We're closing in on a one day record for eye roll smileys...and the day is young!  The record will be smashed if the Scots only win by 15 tonight.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 23, 2010, 03:19:14 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 23, 2010, 02:58:42 PM
We're closing in on a one day record for eye roll smileys...and the day is young!  The record will be smashed if the Scots only win by 15 tonight.   :)
You're just getting me warmed up.   :P   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2010, 08:00:34 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 41  Kenyon 32 :)

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 14 points (3 three pointers), Matt Fegan with 9 points (3 three pointers) and Nathan Balch with 7 points.

Kenyon's top scorers are Dave Knapke with 8 points and A.J. Clair with 7 points.

Scots shot over 50% in the half and they made 8 three pointers.

11:29 Left:  Wooster 55  Kenyon 44  Ian Franks now with 20 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2010, 08:09:42 PM
Wittenberg won their game by about 20.

-------------------------

I've received some more info on how the player awards process works.
1) The coaches nominate players from their own team for 1st team and for 2nd team.  That was due/submitted last Friday.
2) The conference sent out the First-Team All-Conference ballot on Monday; the coaches vote on that ballot, it was due back in at noon today.
3) The conference compiles the first team, then prepares the ballot for 2nd team and HM, using nominations for 2nd team and any nominations for 1st team who didn't make it.  That ballot also has the POY vote (basically, between the seven first-teamers) and the NOY vote (not sure how that's nominated).  The coaches will vote this second ballot this week; not sure of the due date but it might be Friday noon.
4) Any team that doesn't get anyone voted onto the 1st, 2nd, or HM team can have a player named to the HM team by the team's coach.

My source didn't say anything about the COY voting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2010, 08:15:49 PM
Wittenberg 85, Hiram 63

Halftime:
OWU 40, Allegheny 28
Wabash 30, Denison 17
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2010, 08:34:58 PM
I'm intrigued by Wally's increasingly strident assertions that the conference awards should be for the full season, including non-conference play and post-season tournament play.  I'm wondering how the rest of you feel about this, so I've added a poll.  Thanks for voting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2010, 08:52:33 PM
Final:  Wooster 73  Kenyon 59  ;D

Wooster notches the win and they will host the NCAC tourney (semis and final) this weekend! :)

Top scorers for the Scots were Ian Franks with 25 points (8 boards), Nathan Balch with 13 points and Matt Fegan with 12 points.

The Lords were led by Dave Knapke with 15 points (11 boards), A.J. Clair with 12 points and Marcus Healey with 13 points.

Jake Mays and Justin Hallowell did not play tonight but Wickliffe and Claytor played well.  Mike Evans and Kaleb Reed came off the bench and made contributions.

Scots shot 51% from the floor and made 12 three pointers tonight.

Wooster is now 21-5.  Next up is a NCAC semi-final game on Friday night.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2010, 09:00:24 PM
Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 73  Allegheny 59

Bishops shot 61% from the floor to get the nice road win.  Tim Brady led OWU with 27 points, Pat Pellerite added 12 points and 12 boards.  Mike Schwartz added 10 points.

OWU also won the board battle by a 30 to 25 count.

George Raftis led the Gators with 16 points and 11 boards.

Wooster vs. Ohio Wesleyan is one semi-final matchup.

Wabash vs. Wittenberg is the other semi-final matchup.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 23, 2010, 09:31:46 PM
Looks like we're heading for a powerful Final Four for the NCAC. I don't think OWU can hold up against Wooster, but we'll see. Wittenberg/Wabash is the game to see however as Witt easily could have won both matchups but ended up losing to Wabash in both matchups. If Witt can hold Wabash's 3 point shooting to a more reasonable percentage, they stand a good chance at advancing.

Pretty ho hum win for Hiram tonight. Witt came out and forced 7 first half turnovers and turned that into 12 points to go ahead 23-6 to start the game. Short of a run by Hiram to cut the lead to 7 points, this game was never in doubt!

Also, in the grand scheme of things, is it really that big of a deal who wins COY???

POY goes to Franks whether the regular season, non-conference or tournament is counted, hands down! Sorry wally, Wes Smith is hurt by his team's balance here!

Keep it up Wittenberg, good luck Friday  night!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 23, 2010, 09:34:53 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 23, 2010, 02:58:42 PM
We're closing in on a one day record for eye roll smileys...and the day is young!  The record will be smashed if the Scots only win by 15 tonight.   :)

Wooster only wins by 14 tonight.

::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::) ::)

Did I break the record yet?   :P   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 23, 2010, 10:09:47 PM
I don't think Witt could have 'easily' won both matchups against Wabash. Yes, they could have won both matchups, but they didn't. That says to me that "Witt could have blown Wabash out twice, but didn't and lost to them twice..."

That being said - it's tough to beat a team three times in a season. Look for a great game Friday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 23, 2010, 10:17:35 PM
More importantly the last two holders of the belt will duke it out on Woosters court.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 23, 2010, 10:44:49 PM
Oh, I forgot about The Belt! TM

Witt to helt!

Keep the BeltTM!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 12:24:41 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 23, 2010, 09:31:46 PM
POY goes to Franks whether the regular season, non-conference or tournament is counted, hands down! Sorry wally, Wes Smith is hurt by his team's balance here!

This is not a hands down situation.  The two players score about evenly, Franks shoots a little better and assists a little more, Smith does a little more in the defensive statistical areas.  Either player could justifiably win that award.  Or already has even though the season isn't over yet. 

And speaking of Wabash's POY candidate, Smith led the Little Giant effort this evening with 21 and 10.  Chase Haltom pitched in 17 for Wabash and he had a nice game tonight.  Chase is at his best when he dribbles inside that arc and gets some mid range jumpers.  He's good in that 14-18' area.  Shelbourne added 12 points as he was back in the starting lineup tonight.

Denison was scrappy as always but couldn't withstand two major Wabash runs...one at the end of the first half and another about midway through the second half.  Those two outbursts proved too much for the Big Red to overcome, particularly with their top offensive player ice cold (Luther was just 1-14 tonight).  Denison was led tonight by Dimonde Hale with his game high 23 points and 10 rebounds.  This kid has some pretty serious game. 

On to the semis and the Witt Tigers.  WAF! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2010, 09:47:48 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 12:24:41 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 23, 2010, 09:31:46 PM
POY goes to Franks whether the regular season, non-conference or tournament is counted, hands down! Sorry wally, Wes Smith is hurt by his team's balance here!

This is not a hands down situation.  The two players score about evenly, Franks shoots a little better and assists a little more, Smith does a little more in the defensive statistical areas.  Either player could justifiably win that award.  Or already has even though the season isn't over yet. 


Answer me this.  How many games has Wes Smith basically put his team on his back and carried them to a win this season?  POY isn't about leading your team/conference in the most statistical categories.  That's just part of the equation.  It is also about the value that player brings to the table.  Would Wooster be even close to finishing 15-1 in the conference without Ian Franks?  I can think of 4 or 5 games that the Scots would have lost if not for Franks stepping up and carrying them to victory.  THAT is why I, and obviously many others, feel that Franks is indeed, hands down, the POY in the NCAC this season. 

And one other thing.  Is it just me, or is there some sort of us against the world complex going on among Wabash fans?   I mean, Wally jumps all over me for stating my opinions on why I feel Coach Moore is deserving of COY.  He jumps all over David for his opinion on the criteria on voting for All-conference selections.  He jumps on penn about the POY debate.  Smeds jumps on penn for his opinion that Witt could have won both games vs. Wabash just as easily as they ended up losing them.  Why so sensitive all the time??? (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.scout.com%2Fmedia%2Fforums%2Femoticons%2Fnoidea.gif&hash=d0853e7250ffe0f662a746329d301aa06dd4ee9f) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 24, 2010, 09:55:14 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 23, 2010, 08:34:58 PM
I'm intrigued by Wally's increasingly strident assertions that the conference awards should be for the full season, including non-conference play and post-season tournament play.  I'm wondering how the rest of you feel about this, so I've added a poll.  Thanks for voting.

Colten Craigin, averaging 1 point per game in two appearances for Wabash, comes off the bench and scores 22 leading Wabash past Witt, scores 28 to help put Wooster away, and averages 25 in the NCAA tourney leading Wabash to an improbable title.  Be interesting to know who Wally's POY would be. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 24, 2010, 10:18:58 AM
Lets mark this down in the history books, ScotsFan and myself agreeing on something!!

Who's going to be making the trip up to Wooster this weekend? I won't be in attendance Friday night, but if Wittenberg can pull off the "improbable" upset, I should be in attendance Saturday. I'll be up for meeting up with anyone before hand and afterwards.

Wally: Yes, Wes Smith is a great player and he will get votes, however, in my opinion Ian Franks is the POY because of his value to his team. This is a compliment now, when Wes Smith was in foul trouble in the first half against Wittenberg, Wabash is still a formidable team and would be successful without him. If Franks is out for a period of time for Wooster, they would fall apart. Point being, everyone is entitled to opinions and as i've found, everyone makes the arguments that most benefit the player or coach or point they're defending.

Smeds, I didn't mean to discredit Wabash, what I was trying to say was that how close both of those games were, Wittenberg could and in my mind should have won at least the home game vs Wabash. I mean come on, Zinnerman was shooting 2-14 from 3 point range for the season and hit 3-3, with two of them very crucial. Brock hit a couple lucky end of shot clock 3's as well.

If Wabash is this big underdog story that gets no credit from anyone, I guess they have their chance to prove it by beating both Wittenberg and potentially Wooster. If they pull that double off, I will rest my case!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 11:01:31 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 24, 2010, 09:55:14 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 23, 2010, 08:34:58 PM
I'm intrigued by Wally's increasingly strident assertions that the conference awards should be for the full season, including non-conference play and post-season tournament play.  I'm wondering how the rest of you feel about this, so I've added a poll.  Thanks for voting.

Colten Craigin, averaging 1 point per game in two appearances for Wabash, comes off the bench and scores 22 leading Wabash past Witt, scores 28 to help put Wooster away, and averages 25 in the NCAA tourney leading Wabash to an improbable title.  Be interesting to know who Wally's POY would be. 

Did Colten play his two games in the non-conference portion of the schedule or during the NCAC portion of the schedule?  ;)

Quote from: ScotsFan on February 24, 2010, 09:47:48 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 12:24:41 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 23, 2010, 09:31:46 PM
POY goes to Franks whether the regular season, non-conference or tournament is counted, hands down! Sorry wally, Wes Smith is hurt by his team's balance here!

This is not a hands down situation.  The two players score about evenly, Franks shoots a little better and assists a little more, Smith does a little more in the defensive statistical areas.  Either player could justifiably win that award.  Or already has even though the season isn't over yet. 


Answer me this.  How many games has Wes Smith basically put his team on his back and carried them to a win this season?  POY isn't about leading your team/conference in the most statistical categories.  That's just part of the equation.  It is also about the value that player brings to the table.  Would Wooster be even close to finishing 15-1 in the conference without Ian Franks?  I can think of 4 or 5 games that the Scots would have lost if not for Franks stepping up and carrying them to victory.  THAT is why I, and obviously many others, feel that Franks is indeed, hands down, the POY in the NCAC this season. 

Finally...you guys get to the meat of what is really going on here.  All of this traces back to the game where two things happened: 1) Ian Franks was the only player on his team who could make a shot and 2) Allegheny gagged away a 12-point second half lead to the Scots.  That, and that alone, is where The Legend of Ian Franks™ began.  Would Wooster be 15-1 without Franks?  Probably not.  Would Wabash be 12-4 and in 2nd place without Smith?  Absolutely not.  Advantage: push. 

Quote from: ScotsFan on February 24, 2010, 09:47:48 AM
And one other thing.  Is it just me, or is there some sort of us against the world complex going on among Wabash fans?   I mean, Wally jumps all over me for stating my opinions on why I feel Coach Moore is deserving of COY.  He jumps all over David for his opinion on the criteria on voting for All-conference selections.  He jumps on penn about the POY debate.  Smeds jumps on penn for his opinion that Witt could have won both games vs. Wabash just as easily as they ended up losing them.  Why so sensitive all the time???

It's just you.  You said that Coach Moore should be COY because he's won six straight league championships (this is on the record...I can pull the quote again if you'd like).  I said previous results can not (or at least should not) play any role in a single year award.  That's not jumping on you, that's debate.  As is the discussion about whether or not the entire season should count for an "of the Year" award.  If you're reading animosity, you probably need to relax and not take everything so personally.  This is sport...fans debate things like this all of the time.  It's ok to do so and not get all tweaked out of shape about it. 

Now, the one thing that does grind my gears is that it very much seems like in the world of Wooster, the NCAC is composed of Wooster and Wittenberg and that's pretty much it.  You've already mentioned aloud here how nice it will be for the Scots to not have to play Witt until the final...completely dismissing every other team in the tournament including the one that finished ahead of Wittenberg in the league standings and beat them twice.  It was also noted erroneously that Witt was picked to finish second in the preseason poll...without having actually looked at the poll because really, how in the world would the poll say anything other than Wooster and Witt are the top two (only two?) teams in the league?  Impossible!!  There are other teams in the league...some of them are actually worth paying attention to. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2010, 11:27:07 AM
I'm the one getting 'tweaked out of shape' in all of this?  Please excuse me.  I need to take a few minutes to clean up the coffee I just spewed all over my keyboard in laughter.    :D

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 24, 2010, 11:54:12 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 11:01:31 AM
Now, the one thing that does grind my gears is that it very much seems like in the world of Wooster, the NCAC is composed of Wooster and Wittenberg and that's pretty much it.  You've already mentioned aloud here how nice it will be for the Scots to not have to play Witt until the final...completely dismissing every other team in the tournament including the one that finished ahead of Wittenberg in the league standings and beat them twice.  It was also noted erroneously that Witt was picked to finish second in the preseason poll...without having actually looked at the poll because really, how in the world would the poll say anything other than Wooster and Witt are the top two (only two?) teams in the league?  Impossible!!  There are other teams in the league...some of them are actually worth paying attention to. 

I would have to agree completely with the original point that Wooster didn't want to play Witt on Friday.  I don't believe that anything was ever said negative about Wabash in that original statement, but somehow it seems to have been taken that way...

While not overlooking OWU, Allegheny or anyone else, I would think that going in to the tourney we would agree that the teams most likely to beat Wooster would be Wabash or Witt.  By Witt moving into 3rd place, that eliminates the possibility that Wooster has to beat both of them to win the tourney.  Wabash wasn't mentioned in that original statement as there was no possibility that they would move from the #2 seed.

Beyond that, Witt is our rival.  Nothing is better than beating your rival with everything on the line.  In past years when Wooster has played other teams in the final, its still satisfying to win, but its not the same as beating Witt for all the marbles.

Wooster also seems to start every game against Witt very tight, and falls behind early almost every time.  That's what really scares me about playing Witt.  We fall behind by 10 pts early, and its tough to make a big comeback against a good team.

Finally, there's a whole lot of conference history that says that the NCAC is Wooster, Witt then everyone else.  Obviously that's not always true, and certainly hasn't been as much for the last couple of seasons.  But its not like we're talking the last 4 or 5 years.  Without looking it up (shame on me!) Wooster and Witt have been the dominant programs for the last 15+ years.  Until other teams more consistently break into that upper echelon year after year, it will be hard to think of Wabash, OWU, Allegheny, et al in the same way that we think about Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2010, 12:08:13 PM
I wasn't criticizing the idea that Witt could have beaten Wabash each time. Certainly they could have. I was questioning the use of the word 'easily'. That's all.

Sometimes I think Woo fans think other fans are "us against the Woo" and read into things that aren't there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 12:23:00 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2010, 12:08:13 PM
Sometimes I think Woo fans think other fans are "us against the Woo" and read into things that aren't there.

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.podhoster.com%2Fthatradio%2Fimages%2Fbigstockphoto_hammer_striking_nail_w_sparks_333329.jpg&hash=b98c622902f633552300250ebbcb0d1f64a15adc)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2010, 12:53:16 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2010, 12:08:13 PM
I wasn't criticizing the idea that Witt could have beaten Wabash each time. Certainly they could have. I was questioning the use of the word 'easily'. That's all.

Sometimes I think Woo fans think other fans are "us against the Woo" and read into things that aren't there.

Really?  Pot, there's someone I'd like you to meet.

Talk about reading into things that aren't really there.  What would you call your criticizing of the word 'easily'?  If that's not reading into things that aren't really there, than I don't know what you would call it?

Same goes for wally and his hurt feelings because I didn't include Wabash as teams that I wouldn't want to face in the semis!  I think derek did a fine job of pointing out exactly why I was relieved to see Witt get the 3 seed. 

Furthermore wally, I'm sorry you fail to recognize that there's a bit of a rivalry between Wooster and Wittenberg on the hard court.  Many would place it in the top 3-5 rivalries in D3 hoops.  I'm sorry it 'grinds' you when your wittle giants aren't always the focal point of my every thought and, gasp, I might hold Wittenberg in higher regard than I do Wabash.  And that rivalry thing is just part of it.  As derek mentioned, to say Witt and Woo have dominated this conference overall is an undertatement.  I mean, lets compare Wooster's record vs. Wabash since joining the NCAC and their record vs. Witt during that same time frame.  It's pretty clear which team worries me more wouldn't you think?  And then there's a thing called history?  Witt and Woo's rivalry goes well beyond any conference affiliation.  I mean, they've only played each other 96 times and they're only #1 and #2 in all-time wins in D3 baskeball.  Of all people, you should understand this I would think?

Speaking of you being understaning, if/when Depauw joins the NCAC, am I going to be allowed to throw tantrums about all of the Wabash-Depauw talk that will be going on???   Hell, one would think Depauw is already in the NCAC by looking at the football forum sometimes.  Does that bother me?  Not in the least.  And that is why I don't get your complex about feeling slighted or left out when the topic of conversation doesn't include Wabash?!  Is it because you were late to the party and just don't feel like your wittle giants have never truly been accepted?  I don't know what it is, but to sit there and act like Wooster fans are the ones with the complex?  Please...  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2010, 12:57:28 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 12:23:00 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2010, 12:08:13 PM
Sometimes I think Woo fans think other fans are "us against the Woo" and read into things that aren't there.

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.podhoster.com%2Fthatradio%2Fimages%2Fbigstockphoto_hammer_striking_nail_w_sparks_333329.jpg&hash=b98c622902f633552300250ebbcb0d1f64a15adc)

Funny, because this is the image that first came to my mind:

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.goenglish.com%2FGoEnglish_com_ThePotCallingTheKettleBlack.gif&hash=2bd461ecc95adb87f267e8803d0b94e9ee3fde09)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 24, 2010, 01:12:34 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 24, 2010, 12:57:28 PM
Funny, because this is the image that first came to my mind:

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.goenglish.com%2FGoEnglish_com_ThePotCallingTheKettleBlack.gif&hash=2bd461ecc95adb87f267e8803d0b94e9ee3fde09)

Let's keep the cookware-on-cookware crime to a minimum
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2010, 01:25:52 PM
Quote from: ziggy on February 24, 2010, 01:12:34 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 24, 2010, 12:57:28 PM
Funny, because this is the image that first came to my mind:

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.goenglish.com%2FGoEnglish_com_ThePotCallingTheKettleBlack.gif&hash=2bd461ecc95adb87f267e8803d0b94e9ee3fde09)

Let's keep the cookware-on-cookware crime to a minimum

When spouts are outlawed, only outlaws will have spouts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 02:54:30 PM
Might want to overnight that memo to C'ville that they aren't to get in the way of The Rivalry™ this weekend.  I'm not sure they get it either. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2010, 04:12:14 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 02:54:30 PM
Might want to overnight that memo to C'ville that they aren't to get in the way of The Rivalry™ this weekend.  I'm not sure they get it either. 
Seriosly?  Is this really that difficult to comprehend for you?  If Wooster is fortunate enough to get by OWU on Friday, regardless of the opponent, it is going to be a battle for Wooster!  Wabash is the #2 seed in the conference and showed in C'ville that they are more than capable of beating Wooster.  If Wabash beats Wooster, I'm not going to start making travel plans for the NCAA tournament because I feel like a win over Wabash is a given.  Wabash is a darn good basketball team and it will take a great effort for Wooster to beat them should they meet up in the finals.  But, there's not the added tension in a Wabash/Wooster matchup that there is when Wooster and Wittenberg meet up.  And again, as to not allow you to read into what I'm saying, I'm not trying to imply that I would rather see a Witt/Woo matchup on Saturday.  I just hope Wooster makes it to Saturday and whomever the opponent might be, should Wooster win Friday, will make for a very entertaining final.  Is that cosher enough for you Wally?  I'm sure I left something out there for you to read into...  :-\

Maybe I should just adopt this policy.  Basically, so as not to upset or offend the fine folk of Indiana, from here on out we can no longer refer to Witt and Woo as being legitimate rivals.  They are just conference opponents no different than any other conference opponent in the NCAC.  Can we expect the same from you fine folks from Indiana with regards to your little rivalry that includes a bell?  What's the freaking difference with how you Wabash fans carry on wrt your rivals from Depauw?  Really, the way you all carry on about the Bell makes how we carry on about Witt pale in comparison so, like I said.  I really don't understand where you're coming from?

What's funny in all of this is that I don't ever seem to remember slighting Wabash in any way shape or form.  Yet, by stating my opinion of being hopeful that Witt captured the #3 seed so Wooster would not have to see them in the semis, suddenly that is interpreted as me not having respect for Wabash as a quality opponent?  Again, what was that about reading into things?  Sheesh.  Any of these 4 remaining teams are capable of beating the other!  OWU has failed to beat Witt or Woo but they did beat Wabash.  Witt has failed to beat Wabash but they did beat Woo and swept OWU.  And Wabash has failed to beat Woo but they have beaten both Witt and OWU.  That said, given the choice of who I would rather face in a semi-final matchup between the winner of Allegheny/OWU and Witt, I'm going to take the Allegheny/OWU winner!  If you want to take that and make it into a knock on OWU, that's your choice and that would probably be what you would do given your propensity for reading into things.  Are you going to tell me that you would rather face the prospect of Wabash playing Witt and Woo on back to back nights as opposed to the winner of Allegheny/OWU and Woo on back to back nights?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 24, 2010, 04:48:17 PM
C'mon ScotsFan, Wittenberg and Wooster are only 1st and 2nd among Div. III schools in all-time victories. The two head coaches were only each other's best men at their weddings, only to have their relationship cool over time. They only fight over the same recruits and have been covered by large media outlets for their rivalry. Besides that, they have nothing in common.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 05:42:28 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 24, 2010, 04:48:17 PM
The two head coaches were only each other's best men at their weddings, only to have their relationship cool over time.

Ho. Lee. Expletive.  I had not realized that these men were in one another's wedding.  This game has to happen.  Because decades-old wedding parties and college basketball games are linked together by a bond stronger than any force in our Heavens and Earth.  We can all hope that this thing comes off the way it's supposed to.  (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.runemasterstudios.com%2Fgraemlins%2Fimages%2Fcrossfingers.gif&hash=481a45eb6687cd4e416fd5f3622f4081eef605b2)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2010, 05:53:53 PM
Good greif.  Your freaking rediculous...

And I'm done trying to explain myself to you since everything seems to go right over your freaking head and back to somehow spinning this into us Wooster fans wanting a matchup with Witt in the finals because of our rivalry with them or something.  Clearly there's no reaching you in Wally World.   (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.scout.com%2Fmedia%2Fforums%2Femoticons%2Feek1.gif&hash=2bc70766978f404698c6750697ffcf0ca1f0ecc5)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 24, 2010, 06:04:16 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fthm-a01.yimg.com%2Fnimage%2F2a79e5fbd5b48518&hash=63adf36bfc2847f2669da9cbf9490f18b9d03c1c)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 24, 2010, 06:26:07 PM
Wally,

How many Wooster-Witt games have you been to? How many collegiate athletic events did you play in as a college student?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 07:08:25 PM
12?
8?
0?
73?

It's been a while...I can't remember.  Relevance?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2010, 08:11:51 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on February 24, 2010, 06:04:16 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fthm-a01.yimg.com%2Fnimage%2F2a79e5fbd5b48518&hash=63adf36bfc2847f2669da9cbf9490f18b9d03c1c)

Wally, is that you???  You're much hairier than I imagined.    :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 24, 2010, 08:35:36 PM
Here's to a novel suggestion.....lets discuss the games!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2010, 08:40:06 PM
I just got home from work...did I miss anything interesting in here?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 24, 2010, 08:46:54 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2010, 08:40:06 PM
I just got home from work...did I miss anything interesting in here?

Just a little back and fourth, followed by the irrelevant "Did you ever even play a collegiate sport?" line.    

How about to the games this weekend fellas?

How about:  Is it a lock that the NCAC gets two teams into the NCAA Tourney this year?  What are the scenarios that would have us only sending 1.  

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 24, 2010, 09:00:46 PM
Only one scenario needed: if Woo wins, you are probably a one-team conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 24, 2010, 09:03:46 PM
Both questions are extremely relevant. I'll take it from Wally's answer that he has never been to a Wooster-Witt game, yet he is commenting on it like an expert. Pretty silly if you ask me. The second question is also legitimate in that Wally has taken a position that he is the expert on the subject, telling others how they should view this topic. But I know he has never played a sport at any sort of high level. So he is failing to understand the game at a players level, and no, doing student radio doesn't count. Ask Wooster or Wittenberg players who their rival is? It wouldn't take them two seconds to tell you each other. If Wally wants to get on his high horse all the time, I think it is completely fair to point out he is passing judgment on how someone should view a rivalry even though he has never experienced one as a player. Note, I'm not saying that you have to play a sport to comment on that sport. In fact, it really irks me when you get that line from football coaches and players. But when you talking about something like this, I think having a perspective as someone who played in a rivalry game matters.

Of course, this is the same Wally who also felt the need to tell Wooster fans how to react to the controversial call at the end of the Albion-Wooster NCAA Tournament game in 2005 when a foul was called on a loose ball after a missed shot with under a second left to play and the score tied. Even though he wasn't even in the state, he felt he could better judge the call and how Wooster should feel than those of us at the game.

Oh, and I suppose these articles are full of crap too? He hasn't come in a while, but Terry Pluto, who is one of the most recognized sports columnists in Ohio, used to cover this game at Wooster on a yearly basis when he was the Akron Beacon Journal. The only Div. III game he would do. I wonder why he did that?

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/s/content/oh/story/sports/college/wittenberg/2008/02/16/sns021608spwitthoops.html

http://www.d3hoops.com/nation/06/dec08.htm

http://www.athleticmanagement.com/2009/08/14/qa_with_garnett_purnell/index.php

http://d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2006/12/05/tour-de-tejas-one-night-in-abilene/

http://www.mittensportsreport.com/2010/02/d-iii-basketball-great-lakes-regional_17.html

http://www.mascotfaceoff.com/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2010, 09:21:46 PM
I could regale you all with my insights gleaned from being in the pep band for numerous Wooster/Wittenberg games, but I don't really remember any of them, since Wittenberg wasn't our big rival in those days*; Mt. Union was (Squash The Grapes!). 

FWIW, I was kind of hoping that Wooster would face Denison in the finals. ;D

So, yeah, who else thinks Ohio Wesleyan is looking pretty solid right about now?  (You knew that was coming, surely.)


(*There's other reasons I don't remember many games from my college days, but we won't get into that right now.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 09:29:35 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on February 24, 2010, 08:46:54 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2010, 08:40:06 PM
I just got home from work...did I miss anything interesting in here?

Just a little back and fourth, followed by the irrelevant "Did you ever even play a collegiate sport?" line.    

How about to the games this weekend fellas?

How about:  Is it a lock that the NCAC gets two teams into the NCAA Tourney this year?  What are the scenarios that would have us only sending 1.  

I think the NCAC can only get two teams if Witt beats Wooster on Saturday Wooster loses sometime this weekend.  Witt and even less likely Wabash might be in Pool C, but neither can really afford to lose another game...ergo they'll need to win the tournament. 

Quote from: seinfeld on February 24, 2010, 09:03:46 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.runemasterstudios.com%2Fgraemlins%2Fimages%2Fblahblah.gif&hash=cea613269a4572400e2f76327d616e4b741a89d1)

Ok, really?  2005?  Turn the page already. 

So people write about Wooster/Witt...that means what exactly to the other teams chasing the bid?

Wooster/Witt is a great rivalry.  I didn't say otherwise and I certainly don't think otherwise.  But Wooster/Witt gets two scheduled games every year.  Beyond that, and especially in the conference tournament, the rest of the league actually gets to matter.  Everybody else gets to play for the same bid that Wooster and Witt do. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2010, 09:37:52 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 11:01:31 AMYou said that Coach Moore should be COY because he's won six straight league championships (this is on the record...I can pull the quote again if you'd like).  I said previous results can not (or at least should not) play any role in a single year award.  That's not jumping on you, that's debate.  As is the discussion about whether or not the entire season should count for an "of the Year" award.  If you're reading animosity, you probably need to relax and not take everything so personally.  This is sport...fans debate things like this all of the time.  It's ok to do so and not get all tweaked out of shape about it. 

Debating technique in action:
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 09:29:35 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 24, 2010, 09:03:46 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.runemasterstudios.com%2Fgraemlins%2Fimages%2Fblahblah.gif&hash=cea613269a4572400e2f76327d616e4b741a89d1)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 09:39:07 PM
Oh come on.  That was funny. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 24, 2010, 09:50:30 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 09:29:35 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on February 24, 2010, 08:46:54 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2010, 08:40:06 PM
I just got home from work...did I miss anything interesting in here?

Just a little back and fourth, followed by the irrelevant "Did you ever even play a collegiate sport?" line.    

How about to the games this weekend fellas?

How about:  Is it a lock that the NCAC gets two teams into the NCAA Tourney this year?  What are the scenarios that would have us only sending 1.  

I think the NCAC can only get two teams if Witt beats Wooster on Saturday Wooster loses sometime this weekend.  Witt and even less likely Wabash might be in Pool C, but neither can really afford to lose another game...ergo they'll need to win the tournament. 



The latest Great Lakes Region rankings suggest thats the only way the NCAC gets two, and the only way Wabash gets in is by the AQ

1. JCU
2. Wooster
3. Hope
4. Calvin
5. Thomas More
6. Wilmington

.........best advice for Wooster is to get to the Championship game, teams that lose in the semi's very rarely gain Pool C bids.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2010, 10:14:56 PM

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2010, 09:29:35 PM
Wooster/Witt is a great rivalry.  I didn't say otherwise and I certainly don't think otherwise. 

Wally - I finally found two sentences in one of your posts that I could agree with! ;) :P :o


Here is one key fact that explains why people talk so much about the Wooster and Wittenberg basketball teams:

Either Wooster or Wittenberg has won the NCAC regular season basketball title for 17 seasons in a row!

With respect to the NCAC tournament, IMO it is a great thing that 8 teams (including Wabash ;) :)) all get an equal shot at winning the automatic bid into the NCAA tournament.  Other NCAC teams have taken advantage of this opportunity with the latest being Ohio Wesleyan who won the bid during the 2007-2008 season.

I agree with Sac that only Wooster could get a Pool C bid based on the latest NCAA rankings.  I also think that Wooster needs to win the NCAC tourney if they want a shot at hosting any games in the NCAA tourney.

Should be a great NCAC tourney this weekend with 2 excellent matchups on Friday night!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 24, 2010, 10:47:04 PM
Speaking of Friday night, tickets are $10, and will go on sale at 4:30 (no pre-sale).  Tip-off for the first game will be at 6:00.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 25, 2010, 01:07:51 AM
When I came to the Board earlier, I actually had intended to agree with Wally on a couple of things, but felt the need to set the record straight on the rivalry thing. I do think the awards should take into account the tournament. I know they don't do it that way in the pros either, and I think it is wrong there. The most important games of the season aren't taking into account when selecting awards? Makes no sense.

Anyway, for things that actually matter. While Wooster is the favorite to win the tournament, I think the margin of difference between the four teams still left is about as small as I can remember. I can't speak for anyone else, but Wabash crushing Wooster in the semis two years ago is fresh in my mind, as I'm sure it is for Brandon Johnson (who got hurt early in the game), Wickliffe and Franks.

While Franks and Wes Smith are the two best players in the conference (by the way, I think Smith on his best day is better than Franks on his, it's just that Franks is more consistent; is probably the best player in the conference at two positions (point and wing); and means more to his team), Tim Brady may be the most explosive offensive player. He has scored 27 points in two of the last three games, and had the best half of offensive basketball I've seen in a while against Wooster last week. Without oversimplifying, the Scots defensively need to be in Brady's hip pocket the entire game. Start with Johnson and then bring Warnes off the bench. If they can suffocate him, Wooster will be fine. If not, who knows. Will be interesting to see how Hallowell fits back in. Maybe watching the Scots shoot the lights from three-point range while he was gone will help him regain his stroke.

As for Wabash-Wittenberg, I don't really know what is going to happen. I'm going to pick Wittenberg, just because they've been close twice and maybe they get it done this time. But Smith and Aaron Brock are the best players in this matchup, and if they play well, Wabash will probably win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2010, 09:49:59 AM
I agree that any of these 4 semi-final teams is more than capable of punching their ticket to the NCAA's.  I can remember many times when I felt that 3 of the 4 teams had legitimate shots, but rarely have I felt that way about all 4 teams.

As for the Woo/OWU matchup, I too feel that slowing down Tim Brady is going to be a key for Wooster defensively.  However, I think just as important for Wooster is going to be making sure that Brady doesn't have much help.  Looking at last weeks game, yes Brady went off for 21 points in the first half vs. Wooster, but the Scots still led at halftime by 16!  That tells me that Brady didn't have much help from the rest of his team.  And when you look at the 2nd half, Brady only scores 6 points, yet the Bishops played the Scots even.  So, to me, the more balanced OWU is, the more dangerous they are.

I still expect Wooster to win this game, but as seinfeld pointed out, if that beat-down that Wabash delivered to the Scots in the semis two years ago is still fresh in our minds, it should very well be fresh in the minds of the leaders of this team.  If Wooster doesn't come out ready to play from the opening tip, OWU could very easily pull the upset.

As for the Wabash/Witt game, I'm going to choose to obstain from making any comments on this game as to not unintentionally offend any of our friends from Indiana.  Heaven forbid I say something that gets misconstrued as me lacking respect or something towards Wabash so it's best to just say nothing at all...  :-X
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 25, 2010, 10:05:48 AM
On to the discussion of the games tomorrow night....who will all be in attendance. I think its best that I stay home tomorrow night because Wabash will "easily" win both matchups like the first two......jk

First of all, David, I don't think OWU will matchup well once again with Wooster. They are a matchup heaven for Wooster. OWU relies on their post game as their perimeter game isn't up to the level of say Wooster or Wittenberg. Because of that Wooster can compact their defense into the paint and counteract that battle. In the two matchups vs Witt this year and the matchup home vs Wooster, OWU's inability to hit outside shots is their kryptonite.
Also, this is the exact reason that Wittenberg matches up well w/ Wooster at times because by them pounding the ball inside possession after possession, Wooster has to collapse their defense, which opens up outside shots.

For the Wooster fans, what's the status on Hallowell. Him being in the game is a big changer in the strategy for teams in their defense gameplans/sets.

Can I expect a rowdy crowd this weekend?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2010, 10:07:29 AM
"I'm not gonna sit here and debate..."

Lest I be put through the woodchipper!  ;)

Look, all I was doing was bringing up a semantic, and it became the US Senate all of a sudden.  :D

Yeesh. Play ball!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on February 25, 2010, 11:00:12 AM
Exactly--"play ball"......let's enjoy the games---all 4 teams have had great seasons and as fans we're lucky for the chance our teams (and especially our seniors) have to extend their seasons for another night!!!

Go WITT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 25, 2010, 08:34:01 PM
For anyone making the trek to Wooster tomorrow, you may want to give yourself a little extra travel tme.  Looks like 4 - 8" expected by tomorrow night with high winds and blowing and drifting. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2010, 08:37:29 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 25, 2010, 08:34:01 PM
For anyone making the trek to Wooster tomorrow, you may want to give yourself a little extra travel tme.  Looks like 4 - 8" expected by tomorrow night with high winds and blowing and drifting. 
Really?  But my forecast says it'll be in the 50s or low 60s again, just like it is pretty much every day.
Oh wait--that's right--I nearly forgot--I don't live in Ohio anymore!   ;D

I do wish I could be there and raise a glass with pennstghs and anyone else willing to bury rivalry hatchets and take him up on his offer.  Presupposing that Wittenberg pulls the mammoth upset Friday, that is.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 25, 2010, 09:07:53 PM
David, I agree.....is BW3 the only good spot in town still? If Witt somehow wins tomorrow night, which is not looking good according to the British Oddsmakers..I'll be arriving in town early Saturday afternoon after the Michigan/Ohio State bball game, which i'll be attending as well.

ScotsFan must be busy, but Hallowell status?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2010, 09:23:48 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 25, 2010, 09:07:53 PM
David, I agree.....is BW3 the only good spot in town still? If Witt somehow wins tomorrow night, which is not looking good according to the British Oddsmakers..I'll be arriving in town early Saturday afternoon after the Michigan/Ohio State bball game, which i'll be attending as well.

ScotsFan must be busy, but Hallowell status?
I'm not the right person to ask about inns of libation, and I've never been to BW3 in Wooster or anywhere else.  However, some number of years ago Pat Coleman was in town to broadcast a game (dare I suggest that it was probably a Witt/Woo game?) and several of us got together at the Olde Jaol for a pregame drink and appetizer; I believe a good time was had by all.  Anyway, as I won't be there, it's not really for me to make suggestions.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2010, 09:28:12 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 25, 2010, 09:07:53 PM
David, I agree.....is BW3 the only good spot in town still? If Witt somehow wins tomorrow night, which is not looking good according to the British Oddsmakers..I'll be arriving in town early Saturday afternoon after the Michigan/Ohio State bball game, which i'll be attending as well.

ScotsFan must be busy, but Hallowell status?

Yikes, is BW3 really considered the "best spot in town?"  Sure you don't mean CW's?  I'd recommend the latter over the former anytime.  There's also supposedly a new place downtown adjacent to Matsos that might be worth checking out.  (Ciao Bella or something like that)

As David indicates, the Olde Jaol is a solid option, as is Broken Rocks Cafe downtown (also somewhat new).  That said, I won't be there either as I too no longer live in Wooster or Ohio.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 25, 2010, 10:10:29 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 25, 2010, 09:07:53 PM
David, I agree.....is BW3 the only good spot in town still? If Witt somehow wins tomorrow night, which is not looking good according to the British Oddsmakers..I'll be arriving in town early Saturday afternoon after the Michigan/Ohio State bball game, which i'll be attending as well.

ScotsFan must be busy, but Hallowell status?

I'm pretty sure that Hallowell is available.  He participated in the pre-game shoot-around over at Earlham and looked fine, but didn't dress.  He dressed and warmed up with the team on Tuesday, but didn't play.  As you point out, his presence on the court would be huge for the Scots.  Not only does he give the opponent something to think when the Scots have the ball, but he's been one of Wooster's best defenders and rebounders the last 2/3 of the season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2010, 11:48:26 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2010, 09:28:12 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 25, 2010, 09:07:53 PM
David, I agree.....is BW3 the only good spot in town still? If Witt somehow wins tomorrow night, which is not looking good according to the British Oddsmakers..I'll be arriving in town early Saturday afternoon after the Michigan/Ohio State bball game, which i'll be attending as well.

ScotsFan must be busy, but Hallowell status?

Yikes, is BW3 really considered the "best spot in town?"  Sure you don't mean CW's?  I'd recommend the latter over the former anytime.  There's also supposedly a new place downtown adjacent to Matsos that might be worth checking out.  (Ciao Bella or something like that)

As David indicates, the Olde Jaol is a solid option, as is Broken Rocks Cafe downtown (also somewhat new).  That said, I won't be there either as I too no longer live in Wooster or Ohio.

Wouldn't recommend BW3's personally.  I can think of about 10 places I would rather go ahead of BW3's.  As for my personal preferences, the Old Jaol is always a good stand-by.  I too was at that gathering David spoke of, but somehow I thought it was for the Mose Hole.  I remember some Calvin fans (oldknight and darknight I believe?) were there as well as the dearly departed Wooster Booster.  CW's is always an option as well.  I too like Broken Rocks as they always have a few good beers on tap.  City Square Steakhouse is the new kid on the block downtown just south of the square and also has a nice bar area and good beers on tap as well.  That's become my personal favorite.

Quote from: pennstghs on February 25, 2010, 09:07:53 PM
ScotsFan must be busy, but Hallowell status?

Not busy, just tied up watching the USA/Canada women's hockey final as well as watching the US pad their lead in the medal count a bit more this evening before the figure skating put me to sleep.   ;D  As far as Hallowell, I haven't heard anything difinitive on whether or not he would go.  Last I heard was pre-game of the EC game and Coach Moore said that he probably could have gone but they were just going to hold off on his return until hopefully this weekend depending on how he progressed during the week.  Seeing as how he was dressed and participated in warm-ups on Tuesday as derek mentioned, I'd say he'll be a go this weekend.  I'm sure there will be some mention of his status in tomorrow's Daily Record.

Oh, and David.  Enough already weth the rubbing it in about your beautiful weather you're enjoying out there in Cali!  :P  We had above freezing temps here last weekend as well as rain all day on Monday and it STILL didn't even dent the snow on the ground?!  :-\  And now they're calling for 4-8 inches more tomorrow???  Ugh.   >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2010, 12:28:59 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 25, 2010, 11:48:26 PMI too was at that gathering David spoke of, but somehow I thought it was for the Mose Hole. 
Ah, yes, that's right.  Not a Woo/Witt game.  Thanks.  There was also a get-together in Springfield before a Woo/Witt game with two Witt posters whose posting names I've since forgotten but both of whom have become real-life friends, as well as, incredible as it may seem, Wooster Booster (also a real-life friend.)   No animals were harmed in this mid-day meeting, aside from the ones we ate.

Quote from: ScotsFan on February 25, 2010, 11:48:26 PMOh, and David.  Enough already weth the rubbing it in about your beautiful weather you're enjoying out there in Cali!  :P  We had above freezing temps here last weekend as well as rain all day on Monday and it STILL didn't even dent the snow on the ground?!  :-\  And now they're calling for 4-8 inches more tomorrow???  Ugh.   >:(
The weather here is far from beautiful (remember, this is NorCal, not SoCal); it rains almost every day (in the winter) with the occasional earthquake to stir things up.  But yes, I can see how that would sound beautiful to someone stuck slogging through another Farch* in Wayne County.  ;D

*"Farch" was my father's name for what always seemed like the longest month of the year, dark, drab, slushy, generally awful in every way, and 59 days long, from the end of January's sunny, snowy days until the bulbs tentatively come up to test the air in April.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2010, 12:48:49 AM
I've been doing a small amount of thinking about the All-Conference team, and I think I have six of the seven fairly well locked in place.

Alphabetically:
Tim Brady, OWU
Aaron Brock, Wabash
Larry Farmer, Denison
Ian Franks, Wooster
Dave Knapke, Kenyon
Wes Smith, Wabash

If you think any of these shouldn't make first team, I'd like to hear your (well thought-out, cogently expressed) argument.  I'd also like to open the floor to discuss who the seventh player should be on this seven-man first team.  Some nominees might include, but not be limited to, George Raftis of Allegheny (the player I frankly expected to walk away with the POY this year, but has had a sub-par-for-him year with stats that don't match up well with Knapke or Farmer), David Nowicki and Chris Sullivan of Wittenberg (important players whose numbers suffer from being on a deep, balanced team), AJ Sutherlin of Earlham (16ppg despite being his team's only threat), and Bryan Wickliffe of Wooster (tough at both ends, good complement to Franks).

I want a good, clean fight.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 26, 2010, 01:51:27 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 25, 2010, 09:23:48 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 25, 2010, 09:07:53 PM
David, I agree.....is BW3 the only good spot in town still? If Witt somehow wins tomorrow night, which is not looking good according to the British Oddsmakers..I'll be arriving in town early Saturday afternoon after the Michigan/Ohio State bball game, which i'll be attending as well.

ScotsFan must be busy, but Hallowell status?
I'm not the right person to ask about inns of libation, and I've never been to BW3 in Wooster or anywhere else.  However, some number of years ago Pat Coleman was in town to broadcast a game (dare I suggest that it was probably a Witt/Woo game?) and several of us got together at the Olde Jaol for a pregame drink and appetizer; I believe a good time was had by all.  Anyway, as I won't be there, it's not really for me to make suggestions.

It was the Mose Hole tournament, but yes, good place and I would vouch for it.

I have only seen Woo-Witt at Witt. Saw a Capital game in the afternoon, flew in and out of Columbus back in the days when I could afford to do so. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on February 26, 2010, 06:56:35 AM
ScotsFan,
In yesterdays post, you mention the"dearly departed Wooster Booster."
His initials would not happen to be E.E.?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 26, 2010, 07:18:57 AM
David or any Wooster fans, next time you're in town, we'll show you the finer delicaces of Springfield.

I know the Wooster game is well covered, but is there any video feed for the first semifinal tonight? I know Wittenberg will have the radio call, but just wondering.

Good luck tonight to all 4 teams but LETS GO WITT!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on February 26, 2010, 10:33:18 AM
I would have to go with David Nowicki for the all -conference team--He runs a consistently solid point for Witt and brings leadership to the floor. His assist-turnover ratio is note-worthy,  he scores when he is needed but does not force ill advised shots. He plays a very big part in the success of this team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 26, 2010, 11:30:31 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 26, 2010, 07:18:57 AM
I know the Wooster game is well covered, but is there any video feed for the first semifinal tonight? I know Wittenberg will have the radio call, but just wondering.

Video feed is available for both games, but it's $10 (determined by the NCAC, I think, not by Wooster).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 26, 2010, 12:44:44 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 26, 2010, 11:30:31 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 26, 2010, 07:18:57 AM
I know the Wooster game is well covered, but is there any video feed for the first semifinal tonight? I know Wittenberg will have the radio call, but just wondering.

Video feed is available for both games, but it's $10 (determined by the NCAC, I think, not by Wooster).

$10 to see the game happen 50 ft in front of your face...or $10 to watch the game via grainy and sometimes sluggish webcam.  Makes perfect sense.  What's that, Fonz? 

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F1.bp.blogspot.com%2F_P8n0J5nF3I0%2FStCw86WLuUI%2FAAAAAAAABSY%2Ftd7WcTHmftY%2Fs400%2Ffonzie_thumbs_down.jpg&hash=a2a8a375b158c12d164d9f2ca43382dc2d734c6e)

Agreed.  Thank goodness for WNDY and livestats...aaaaayyyyy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 26, 2010, 02:52:39 PM
I agree, but the fee is determined by the NCAC.
http://www.northcoast.org/mb/Mbchampionships.html (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/Mbchampionships.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 26, 2010, 03:08:38 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 26, 2010, 02:52:39 PM
I agree, but the fee is determined by the NCAC.
http://www.northcoast.org/mb/Mbchampionships.html (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/Mbchampionships.html)

Oh, I know.  I'm glad the league has time to find creative ways to jam the fans but apparently not enough time to rework a football schedule into something sensible in 2011.  Priorities! 

Why can't the host institutions run these games in their own standard and customary ways?  If your school typically charges admission, let them.  If not, then so be it.  If they typically offer a video stream why not let them do it? 

If it's a matter of cost to the league and the league can't afford to put on this tournament without sticking it to the loyal fans for something that most schools are now offering gratis, then maybe the league should reconsider whether or not having a tournament is really something they should be doing.  There are pros and cons to having a conference tournament (mostly cons, IMO), but in front of any debate about that comes the cost issue.  If you can't afford it, don't do it. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on February 26, 2010, 03:30:09 PM
Just listen to the radio broadcast and watch the live stats....or go to the game---the video streams are usually not clear anyway---

GO WITT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 26, 2010, 04:51:31 PM
Good luck to all four NCAC teams in action tonight.

I hope both games are competitive and played well.





Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 26, 2010, 07:58:29 PM
WOW!!!!! What a game!

Wittenberg 61 Wabash 60 ---- looks like we may have a rivalry final if Wooster can take car eof business.

This game was a game of halfs and hot shooting. Wittenberg led by as many as 17 points but Wabash came back to tie the game late and had the lead at 60-59 with under a minute to go. Mike Cooper for Witt missed a jumper and Chase Holtam stepped on the baseline to give the ball back to Witt with about 10 seconds to go. Wabash used their foul to give and then on the ensuing inbounds play Aaron Brock committed a foul on David Hieber, who made both free throws to give Witt the lead.

Wabash then got the ball after a timeout with 5 seconds to go and missed a contested jumper, I"m sure we'll hear some Wabash complaining about a foul not being called but there were plenty of other calls that went in their favor as well.

Overall a good game, once again Witt had a chance to put the game away and didn't do it but this time got lucky and advanced. Sometimes its better to be lucky than good indeed!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 26, 2010, 08:13:40 PM
Congratulations to Witt. 

Wabash fans now can go back to Indiana and chant "Ohio sucks" until next November!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 26, 2010, 08:47:51 PM
From pennstghs tonight:

(last time) Witt had a chance to put the game away and didn't do it but this time got lucky and advanced. Sometimes its better to be lucky than good indeed!!!!

Quote from: pennstghs on February 17, 2010, 10:21:37 PM
It also helps that everything and anything Witt threw up was missing and Wabash could not miss with countless lucky shots.

Just sayin!  Now a fan of luck?  Fact is, luck is always involved in sports.


Great win for Witt tonight.  Tough loss for Wabash, but it was a tremendous season for this Little Giant team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 26, 2010, 08:51:37 PM
bashbrother, I agree great game all around. If only my internet was working so I could actually watch the $10 quality video stream......damn Ohio weather!!!!

I'm ready for Witt/Wooster III tomorrow night, see you all there!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 26, 2010, 08:52:36 PM
Good luck to Witt......  Win the thing so we can get two teams for sure from the NCAC in the show.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 26, 2010, 08:57:08 PM
Dang.  I wish I could get the live stats working.  It must of crapped out at half time of the Witt-Bash game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 26, 2010, 08:57:30 PM
Quote from: GoRed on February 26, 2010, 08:13:40 PM
Wabash fans now can go back to Indiana and chant "Ohio sucks" until next November!!!!

Actually that chant is a twelve month commitment.  We don't take any days off.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2010, 09:00:18 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2010, 09:21:46 PM
So, yeah, who else thinks Ohio Wesleyan is looking pretty solid right about now? 
I'm starting to think that I'm a jinx to the Battling Bishops.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 26, 2010, 09:04:36 PM
Anyone have the score of the Woo/OWU game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2010, 09:07:21 PM
Quote from: countyroad on February 26, 2010, 09:04:36 PM
Anyone have the score of the Woo/OWU game?
Wooster is far, far ahead. 
UPDATE: 11min left, Woo up by 26.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 26, 2010, 09:10:15 PM
Cool.

Thanks David.  Preciate it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2010, 09:12:45 PM
Currently 79-52, 8:20.

In other news, Heidelberg upset JCU tonight at University Hgts.  That bodes well for Wooster's hosting chances should they win tomorrow.

Final score: Wooster 87, OWU 70.  Wooster and Wittenberg will meet in the finals for the first time in four years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2010, 10:28:54 PM
Quote from: GoRed on February 26, 2010, 08:13:40 PM
Congratulations to Witt.  

Wabash fans now can go back to Indiana and chant "Ohio sucks" until next November!!!!

Refute the allegation. :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 26, 2010, 11:09:39 PM
So, I think my summarization of OWU the other day stating they had very little shot to beat Wooster held up to form tonight, completely outmatched.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 26, 2010, 11:20:17 PM
Saw most of the Witt-Wabash, and after falling way behind, Wabash came out hungry in the second half, while Wittenberg seemingly didn't. I swear, Witt never comes out of the half like that against Wooster, but anyway. Wabash should of won the game, in my opinion. It started with just over a minute left when Shelbourne missed an absolute bunny layup with Wabash down one point. Then leading by one point, Wes Smith steals the ball with about 30 seconds left and has a half step on the defense going the other way. Then I don't know what happened. He either wanted to dunk the ball and took off too early, forcing himself to throw up a wild shot. Or he just got too anxious. Either way, his underhand layup went way over the rim.

But despite these two mistakes, Wabash seemed to be in good shape when a Cooper shot somehow didn't go in, and Haltom ended up with the rebound with about 13 seconds left. Problem was, Haltom thought he was going to be fouled immediately, but he wasn't. Instead, he kind of dribbled around underneath his own basket while the Wittenberg defense collapsed on him. Then he went up into the air along the baseline to make a pass, but there wasn't anyone to throw it to, so he basically just threw the ball down out of bounds.

With a foul to give, Wabash commits a quick foul. But then off of the out of bounds play, before the clock even starts, Smith is called for a holding foul. I wasn't looking in that direction, so I don't know if it was a good call or not. Hieber hits both free throws to give Witt a one-point lead. Then after getting the ball past half court and taking a time out, Wabash has Smith inbounds the ball along the sideline. While they were looking to get the ball to Haltom first, I think they knew he wasn't going to be open. So they dumped it inside to Brock, who got double teamed as he moved to the center of the lane for a four-foot shot. There definitely was some contact, and I don't think Witt would of had a beef if they called a foul, but they didn't, and Brock's shot didn't reach the rim.

If I was Wabash, I'd feel a little bitter about the last few seconds. While I don't think it was a hose job, I think you could reasonably feel that either two fouls should have been called, or none at all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 26, 2010, 11:38:08 PM
As for the Wooster game, they just ran them off the floor. It was kind of a mirror of the first game, although this time Wooster did a better job of defense, especially on Brady. If Wooster would play like this against Witt, they would win, but they never seem to be able to control the tempo against Witt (I'm basically ignoring last season, since Witt was not itself a year ago).

While I have great respect for the Wooster coaching staff, they messed up tonight in my opinion. It started with two of their varsity big men -- Jake Mays & Kaleb Reed -- being out. Then Brandon Johnson hurt his thumb in the first half, and Hallowell was still not 100%. But knowing that two of his players were out and another was going to be somewhat limited, you'd think Wooster would have had enough players on the bench to bring in if the game got out of hand (like the previous meeting a week ago and last year's semifinal game). Instead, they only dressed 11 players, meaning they had four empty spots on the roster that they didn't fill, even though they were at home. I know that the JV players probably aren't even practicing right now, but they are still part of the team (I'm guessing) and should probably be given those spots.

Anyway, late in the second half, Wooster sends one of their student assistant coaches (Tenenini) into the locker room to take off his street clothes and put on a uniform. The reason being that with Johnson out, Fegan had played most of the second half, and he wanted to get him out. But since Tenenini wasn't in the book, Wooster was called for a technical. So instead of just either bringing back Franks or Balch for 2 1/2 minutes, or just keeping Fegan out there, the Scots bring in a student assistant knowing they would get a technical. The intent wasn't to show up OWU, but I can see where they would be upset that they would do something like this in an NCAC Semifinal game. And Mike DeWitt showed his displeasure by calling three full timeouts in the final 1:12 of the game, so as to extend the game as long as possible. They were even checking the table to see how many they had left after calling a timeout with 17 seconds left.

As for tomorrow, on paper Wooster is the better team, but the Scots have not fared well in these types of games against Wittenberg at home. The last two NCAC title games between the two at Timken Wittenberg won them both (2005 and 2006). The Scots have a tendency to play tight and commit too many turnovers. Wooster is quicker and more athletic than Witt. They don't need to force anything. Just run their offense and they'll get open looks. Of course, the status of Johnson is huge. If he can't go, this is going to be a problem. They are already short along the frontline without Mays & Reed and Hallowell less than 100%. If Johnson is out, they literally will be playing no more than 8 guys.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2010, 01:40:32 AM
Quote from: GoRed on February 26, 2010, 08:13:40 PM
Congratulations to Witt. 

Wabash fans now can go back to Indiana and chant "Ohio sucks" until next November!!!!

For the record, I really really don't care for that particular chant. 

As for tonight's game...that's a tough, tough game to drop.  The first half was brutal to listen to.  The second half was amazing to listen to and just when it seemed Wabash had seized control, three critical errors (the Shelbourne miss, the Smith miss, and the Haltom turnover) left the door open for Witt and Witt was able to capitalize. 

Quote from: pennstghs on February 26, 2010, 07:58:29 PM
Wabash then got the ball after a timeout with 5 seconds to go and missed a contested jumper, I"m sure we'll hear some Wabash complaining about a foul not being called but there were plenty of other calls that went in their favor as well.

I'd hope not.  Wabash had chances to put this thing away without having to rely on referees to make or not make a call.  The radio broadcast called the Smith foul that led to Witt's go ahead free throws a good call.  Wooster's radio station posted a video on twitter of the final play and I can't tell if Brock gets whacked or if he's off balance trying to get his shot off before time expires.  Probably a little of both, but it's weaksauce to put it on the officials.  Wabash scored 17 points and shot about 5.6% in the first half.  Wabash missed two layups in the last minute and turned the ball over under Witt's basket with a one point lead and 12 seconds to kill.  Those things aren't on the ref.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: LGHistorian on February 27, 2010, 01:44:49 AM
seinfeld-

 Just read your assessment of the Wabash-Wittenberg game and just wanted to let you know from my point of view that you are pretty much right on the money as how I heard it on Wabash radio.  I would give you karma if I could.  I was very disappointed at how many times Wabash could have nearly sealed the victory but didn't.  Our announcer (after a commercial...with time to assess what he saw) said pretty much the same thing about the final shot.  He said it appeared to be some contact but wasn't sure if it was enough to blow the whistle.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: LGHistorian on February 27, 2010, 01:54:37 AM
And by the way, I wish the Wabash students would also drop the Ohio chant as well.  They can surely come up with something a little more creative and less offensive.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2010, 07:22:52 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 26, 2010, 11:38:08 PM
So instead of just either bringing back Franks or Balch for 2 1/2 minutes, or just keeping Fegan out there, the Scots bring in a student assistant knowing they would get a technical. The intent wasn't to show up OWU, but I can see where they would be upset that they would do something like this in an NCAC Semifinal game. And Mike DeWitt showed his displeasure by calling three full timeouts in the final 1:12 of the game, so as to extend the game as long as possible. They were even checking the table to see how many they had left after calling a timeout with 17 seconds left.


Personally, DeWitt had more to be displeased about wrt his own team than thinking Coach Moore was trying to show up the Bishops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 27, 2010, 09:14:18 AM

Quote from: David Collinge on February 26, 2010, 09:12:45 PM
In other news, Heidelberg upset JCU tonight at University Hgts.  That bodes well for Wooster's hosting chances should they win tomorrow.

Final score: Wooster 87, OWU 70.  Wooster and Wittenberg will meet in the finals for the first time in four years.

Lost my internet access for several hours last night ??? ...but I did hear the Wooster game on the radio broadcast.  Great to see the Scots get the victory and karma to Seinfeld for his first hand report.

David is correct that the JCU loss helps Wooster IF they win tonight.  On the other hand IF the Scots lose tonight, they may have JCU in front of them at the Pool C table which could hurt their chances of an at large bid.  Best advice for Wooster - just win and take care of business.

I will be at Timken tonight to see Round #3 of the Wooster-Wittenberg rivalry. :)  Should be a great game!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HopeConvert on February 27, 2010, 10:21:22 AM
Well, since I have a kid at Wooster, and since it is in Hope's interest for Wooster to win tonight, I'll be pulling vigorously for the Scots. My daughter said something about some kind of big dance on campus tonight. Am I right in assuming that is going to conflict with the game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 27, 2010, 10:35:47 AM
Quote from: HopeConvert on February 27, 2010, 10:21:22 AM
Well, since I have a kid at Wooster, and since it is in Hope's interest for Wooster to win tonight, I'll be pulling vigorously for the Scots. My daughter said something about some kind of big dance on campus tonight. Am I right in assuming that is going to conflict with the game?

I believe that there's a Roaring 20's dance tonight, but I think its not until after the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 27, 2010, 10:58:12 AM
Does anyone know if a team that won 22 region games and finished with an OWP and an OOWP above .500 (which I think they'll clear when they play Wittenberg tonight) ever not received a bid to the tournament? I know they've only used this format for a few years, but that would be a tough mathematical resume to overlook. But of course you don't want to take any chances.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on February 27, 2010, 11:22:22 AM
Dressing a student coach during the game is a bush league move. Poor planning by Wooster's coaching staff for not preparing their roster properly.

OWU's coach definately has a right to be jacked.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2010, 11:38:07 AM
Quote from: old scot on February 27, 2010, 11:22:22 AM
OWU's coach [definitely] has a right to be jacked.

Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2010, 07:22:52 AM
Personally, DeWitt had more to be displeased about wrt his own team than thinking Coach Moore was trying to show up the Bishops.

Not being there (or having paid the extortionist video fee), all I can add is that both of these statements can be, and probably were, true at the same time.  I've no doubt that Coach DeWitt's displeasure at the performance of his team only made him more easily upset by factors external to his team.  To the best of my knowledge, Mike DeWitt and Steve Moore are on very friendly terms, and that each accords the other the highest respect.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2010, 02:31:07 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 27, 2010, 10:35:47 AM
Quote from: HopeConvert on February 27, 2010, 10:21:22 AM
Well, since I have a kid at Wooster, and since it is in Hope's interest for Wooster to win tonight, I'll be pulling vigorously for the Scots. My daughter said something about some kind of big dance on campus tonight. Am I right in assuming that is going to conflict with the game?

I believe that there's a Roaring 20's dance tonight, but I think its not until after the game.

My sources tell me it's winter gala at Woo, but having gametime at 7 p.m. should help.  Plus, it's Woo-Witt, for the championship.  I suspect students will still make it out, plus I would anticipate a pretty large community audience.  Should be a great game atmosphere.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 27, 2010, 02:39:07 PM
I'm hoping Brandon Johnson's thumb injury isn't severe enough to keep him from playing. He has really been playing well lately. Because of his discontinuous time on the team (ala-Ryan (Jimmy) Snyder), no one noticed that last nights game was Brandon's 100th win as a Scot (26-4, 29-5, 23-5, 22-5). I am counting the two games he did not play in this year (not sure when the second was but I remember he missed the first game of the Moses Hole).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2010, 04:41:39 PM
Quote from: old scot on February 26, 2010, 06:56:35 AM
ScotsFan,
In yesterdays post, you mention the"dearly departed Wooster Booster."
His initials would not happen to be E.E.?
(On behalf of ScotsFan): no, they wouldn't.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2010, 04:44:41 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 27, 2010, 11:38:07 AM
Quote from: old scot on February 27, 2010, 11:22:22 AM
OWU's coach [definitely] has a right to be jacked.

Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2010, 07:22:52 AM
Personally, DeWitt had more to be displeased about wrt his own team than thinking Coach Moore was trying to show up the Bishops.

Not being there (or having paid the extortionist video fee), all I can add is that both of these statements can be, and probably were, true at the same time.  I've no doubt that Coach DeWitt's displeasure at the performance of his team only made him more easily upset by factors external to his team.  To the best of my knowledge, Mike DeWitt and Steve Moore are on very friendly terms, and that each accords the other the highest respect.

I just look at it from the standpoint that Coach Moore isn't in the business of showing other coaches up.  Was it a mistake not having his roster better prepared pre-game?  Yes.  Was it an honest mistake?  Again, I believe the answer to be yes.  I also agree with David wrt the relationship between Moore and DeWitt and I'm sure Moore has probably explained himself and apologized and at the same time, DeWitt doesn't strike me as the type that is going to hold a grudge.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 27, 2010, 05:46:06 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2010, 02:31:07 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 27, 2010, 10:35:47 AM
Quote from: HopeConvert on February 27, 2010, 10:21:22 AM
Well, since I have a kid at Wooster, and since it is in Hope's interest for Wooster to win tonight, I'll be pulling vigorously for the Scots. My daughter said something about some kind of big dance on campus tonight. Am I right in assuming that is going to conflict with the game?

I believe that there's a Roaring 20's dance tonight, but I think its not until after the game.

My sources tell me it's winter gala at Woo, but having gametime at 7 p.m. should help.  Plus, it's Woo-Witt, for the championship.  I suspect students will still make it out, plus I would anticipate a pretty large community audience.  Should be a great game atmosphere.

Yes, the Winter Gala is tonight, with a Roaring 20's theme and swing band, but it starts at 10:00 p.m., giving students well over an hour in between the two.  A couple of my students wanted to know if my wife and I were coming to the dance, and I thought it was a great idea until I heard how late it starts.  We'll get our minute-and-a-half in the spotlight shortly before tip-off, and then let the students have the rest of the evening.

Let's go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2010, 05:51:12 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 27, 2010, 05:46:06 PMWe'll get our minute-and-a-half in the spotlight shortly before tip-off, and then let the students have the rest of the evening.

Let's go Scots!
Are you a piper as well as a professor? ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2010, 06:02:34 PM
If you're even thinking about playing them, dress them and put 'em in the book at any rate. Scorebook mistakes happen (see Matt Painter this year), but I think it's bad form to send someone into the locker room during the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2010, 07:12:31 PM
Unlike most Wooster-Wittenberg games, Wooster has come out strong tonight while Witt hasn't shot well at all (2-11 from the field).

16-6 Scots, Witt timeout at 11:54 in the first.

21-13 Scots, 9:20 left.  Balch has 12 for Wooster in the early going (2 threes).  

23-18 Scots, 6:30.  Witt has had the better of the play for a few minutes; Wooster missed five straight shots at one sequence.  

30-20 Scots, 4 mins left.  Balch has 14, but also two fouls and is sitting now.  Fegan hits his first hoop of the night, a 3, to push it to 33-20, the Scots' biggest lead so far.

Both teams protecting the ball well; only 3 turnovers apiece.  At the line, Wickliffe makes both and moves it to 35-20.  Wick has 10 pts in the half.

Cooper has 8 for Witt.  He's been the best offensive force so far for the Tigers.  Now commits a foul and he'll sit probably for the rest of the half.

Scots catch another run...pushing the lead out to 45-27 at the half.  The Scots have turned in another dominating first half, doing well in all phases of the game in the first half.  Wooster is shooting about 45% while holding Wittenberg under 30%, and that's the story of the game so far.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2010, 08:16:21 PM
Wittenberg is making a strong comeback by shooting very well in the second half.  Cooper leads with 17 for Witt, but Hieber and Sullivan are doing the damage as well from 3.

64-57 Scots lead, 9:30 left.  Witt has outscored Wooster 30-19 in the second half so far.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2010, 08:50:51 PM
Congratulations to the Fighting Scots for another NCAC Tournament Championship!!

Wooster wins 88-77 over Wittenberg and will now wait to see if they have earned hosting rights for the first rounds of the NCAAs.
Wittenberg likely saw their fine season end tonight, but they will wait and see if an (unlikely) Pool C bid materializes.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 27, 2010, 09:46:53 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 27, 2010, 05:51:12 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 27, 2010, 05:46:06 PMWe'll get our minute-and-a-half in the spotlight shortly before tip-off, and then let the students have the rest of the evening.

Are you a piper as well as a professor? ???

No, although that would have been cool.  We just sang the national anthem.  I was a little bit disappointed that there were no pipers there tonight, but perhaps the rules pertaining to hosting post-season play don't allow for that.

Congrats to the Scots on getting the win over rival Witt and (more importantly) another NCAC title!  Hopefully, there will be more basketball in Timken next weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ArmingtonCave on February 27, 2010, 09:49:45 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 27, 2010, 09:46:53 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 27, 2010, 05:51:12 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 27, 2010, 05:46:06 PMWe'll get our minute-and-a-half in the spotlight shortly before tip-off, and then let the students have the rest of the evening.

Are you a piper as well as a professor? ???

No, although that would have been cool.  We just sang the national anthem.  I was a little bit disappointed that there were no pipers there tonight, but perhaps the rules pertaining to hosting post-season play don't allow for that.

Congrats to the Scots on getting the win over rival Witt and (more importantly) another NCAC title!  Hopefully, there will be more basketball in Timken next weekend.

I was at the game, you two did an excellent job.  I ran into Dr. Hodges tonight too (who I had for First Year seminar 20 years ago) he looks good. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2010, 10:21:11 PM
Nathan Balch was named the MVP of the tournament.  He was joined on the all-tournament team by teammate Ian Franks (who was 14 of 16 at the free throw line, all in the second half--talk about clutch!), Tigers Michael Cooper and David Hieber (a rookie), OWU's Tim Brady, and Chase Haltom of Wabash (the only senior in the bunch.)  Congratulations to all six, and to the victorious Fighting Scots! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 27, 2010, 10:23:25 PM
Good day for Wooster athletics, both short term and long term. Will start with short term.

Nathan Balch is becoming Mr. February/March. In six career postseason games for Wooster, Balch is averaging 17.8 ppg, shooting 67% (37-of-55) from the field and 66% (21-of-32) from three-point range. Another remarkable aspect of the win is how well Wooster played despite having two starters (Johnson & Hallowell) well below 100%. If it weren't for a couple of real shaky calls on Wickliffe at the end of the first half and Balch having to sit early in the second half, Witt never would have made their run, as the Scots came out in the second half playing like they did in the first.

As for hosting, Wooster will definitely host. They will be the No. 1 team in the Great Lakes Region. It's just a matter of who they will play.

As for long term, the College announced today that they will begin construction on a rec center, after all these years. Here is a snippet from the email that was sent out:

The board has voted to authorize construction of a 123,000 square foot Student Recreation Center, the first phase of our long-term master plan for the Campus Center. The timeline for the project is aggressive, but it means that those entering Wooster as first-year students this fall will be able to use the new facility by the second semester of their sophomore year.

This will be, in dollar terms, the largest capital project the College has ever undertaken: $30 million.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ArmingtonCave on February 27, 2010, 10:47:52 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 27, 2010, 10:23:25 PM
Good day for Wooster athletics, both short term and long term. Will start with short term.

Nathan Balch is becoming Mr. February/March. In six career postseason games for Wooster, Balch is averaging 17.8 ppg, shooting 67% (37-of-55) from the field and 66% (21-of-32) from three-point range. Another remarkable aspect of the win is how well Wooster played despite having two starters (Johnson & Hallowell) well below 100%. If it weren't for a couple of real shaky calls on Wickliffe at the end of the first half and Balch having to sit early in the second half, Witt never would have made their run, as the Scots came out in the second half playing like they did in the first.

As for hosting, Wooster will definitely host. They will be the No. 1 team in the Great Lakes Region. It's just a matter of who they will play.

As for long term, the College announced today that they will begin construction on a rec center, after all these years. Here is a snippet from the email that was sent out:

The board has voted to authorize construction of a 123,000 square foot Student Recreation Center, the first phase of our long-term master plan for the Campus Center. The timeline for the project is aggressive, but it means that those entering Wooster as first-year students this fall will be able to use the new facility by the second semester of their sophomore year.

This will be, in dollar terms, the largest capital project the College has ever undertaken: $30 million.

Interesting.  I assume it will be located where the Field Hockey field is now and attach to Armington PEC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 27, 2010, 11:01:32 PM
Quote from: ArmingtonCave on February 27, 2010, 10:47:52 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 27, 2010, 10:23:25 PM
Good day for Wooster athletics, both short term and long term. Will start with short term.

Nathan Balch is becoming Mr. February/March. In six career postseason games for Wooster, Balch is averaging 17.8 ppg, shooting 67% (37-of-55) from the field and 66% (21-of-32) from three-point range. Another remarkable aspect of the win is how well Wooster played despite having two starters (Johnson & Hallowell) well below 100%. If it weren't for a couple of real shaky calls on Wickliffe at the end of the first half and Balch having to sit early in the second half, Witt never would have made their run, as the Scots came out in the second half playing like they did in the first.

As for hosting, Wooster will definitely host. They will be the No. 1 team in the Great Lakes Region. It's just a matter of who they will play.

As for long term, the College announced today that they will begin construction on a rec center, after all these years. Here is a snippet from the email that was sent out:

The board has voted to authorize construction of a 123,000 square foot Student Recreation Center, the first phase of our long-term master plan for the Campus Center. The timeline for the project is aggressive, but it means that those entering Wooster as first-year students this fall will be able to use the new facility by the second semester of their sophomore year.

This will be, in dollar terms, the largest capital project the College has ever undertaken: $30 million.

Interesting.  I assume it will be located where the Field Hockey field is now and attach to Armington PEC?

They're actually going to be ripping out the office section of the PEC, and the new part will extend to the south and east.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 27, 2010, 11:03:49 PM
Back from Timken where I watched Wooster play a great game to claim the NCAC tourney title and the automatic bid into the big dance! :)

Scots played a complete game tonight and took care of the ball (only 10 turnovers ;D).  As Seinfeld noted, Nathan Balch played a terrific game and hit the big shots tonight.  Witt cut the Wooster lead to only 6 points (61-55) with about 10 minutes left in the game.  Coach Moore reinserted Balch and he immediately hit a three pointer to widen the lead back to 9 points.  A few minutes later, Balch hit another key three pointer to extend Wooster's lead from 12 points to 15 points with about 6 minutes remaining (76-61).  Balch had 22 points on 8 of 11 shooting with 4 three pointers!

Wooster had 3 players really clicking well tonight with Balch, Ian Franks (21 points) and Bryan Wickliffe (18 points and 7 boards).  Hallowell also looked good with 8 points and 9 boards.

Congrats to Wittenberg on a nice season with 21 wins.  Michael Cooper played an excellent game leading the Tigers with 23 points.

Kudos to Coach Moore and the Scots on winning both the NCAC regular season and tourney titles.

Let's hope that Wooster, now 23-5, can make a nice run in the NCAA tourney this year!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ArmingtonCave on February 27, 2010, 11:07:40 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 27, 2010, 11:01:32 PM
Quote from: ArmingtonCave on February 27, 2010, 10:47:52 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 27, 2010, 10:23:25 PM
Good day for Wooster athletics, both short term and long term. Will start with short term.

Nathan Balch is becoming Mr. February/March. In six career postseason games for Wooster, Balch is averaging 17.8 ppg, shooting 67% (37-of-55) from the field and 66% (21-of-32) from three-point range. Another remarkable aspect of the win is how well Wooster played despite having two starters (Johnson & Hallowell) well below 100%. If it weren't for a couple of real shaky calls on Wickliffe at the end of the first half and Balch having to sit early in the second half, Witt never would have made their run, as the Scots came out in the second half playing like they did in the first.

As for hosting, Wooster will definitely host. They will be the No. 1 team in the Great Lakes Region. It's just a matter of who they will play.

As for long term, the College announced today that they will begin construction on a rec center, after all these years. Here is a snippet from the email that was sent out:

The board has voted to authorize construction of a 123,000 square foot Student Recreation Center, the first phase of our long-term master plan for the Campus Center. The timeline for the project is aggressive, but it means that those entering Wooster as first-year students this fall will be able to use the new facility by the second semester of their sophomore year.

This will be, in dollar terms, the largest capital project the College has ever undertaken: $30 million.

Interesting.  I assume it will be located where the Field Hockey field is now and attach to Armington PEC?

They're actually going to be ripping out the office section of the PEC, and the new part will extend to the south and east.

Wow.  I hope they don't mess with the hill.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 27, 2010, 11:13:50 PM
Great game for the Scots tonight.  IMO the game was won by the tremendous defensive effort in the first half.  Witt couldn't take a step without a Wooster player in their shadow and just about every shot for the Tigers was strongly contested.  Witt made a run in the 2nd half when Balch was forced to the bench with foul trouble, and the Tigers got hot from behind the arc.  But the Scots didn't wilt under the pressure, made a couple of key shots and put the game away.  Balch was clearly the Scots MVP for the tourney, but Franks was huge in the last 10 minutes driving to the hoop and drawing several fouls.

I agree that the Scots should host next weekend.  At least I hope so as I'm flying back from Philly on Friday and that's about the only way I can make it to the game!

And great job with the Anthem Fantastic50!  I wish that Wooster would have live singers for the Anthem more often...

I believe that the rec center will extend down the hill somewhat, although it was tough to tell from the drawings I've seen.  They're supposed to have a model inside Lowry Center, but I haven't seen it yet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 27, 2010, 11:22:00 PM
And and off-topic congrats to wooscotsfan's alma mater, Carleton College, for winning the MIAC tourney!  They beat Gustavus-Adolphus in OT tonight, after beating St Thomas (who beat Wooster by 31 early this season) on Thursday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 27, 2010, 11:32:26 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 27, 2010, 11:22:00 PM
And and off-topic congrats to wooscotsfan's alma mater, Carleton College, for winning the MIAC tourney!  They beat Gustavus-Adolphus in OT tonight, after beating St Thomas (who beat Wooster by 31 early this season) on Thursday.

imderekpoe - thanks for the note on Carleton.k+  It has been a while since the Knights made the NCAA tourney!

Here are some possible opponents for Wooster in the NCAA tourney:

OAC bid   Wilmington 21-7
HCAC bid  Defiance 23-5
PrAC bid   Grove City 19-8
MIAA bid   Hope 21-7 (may get matched with Midwest region)
AMCC bid  Medaille 23-4 (Buffalo - may get matched with Northeast)

OAC pool C?  John Carroll 20-6
HCAC pool C?  Anderson 22-5 (Indiana)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2010, 11:42:26 PM
Don't forget DePauw and Centre, who are playing in the SCAC title game down in Mississippi tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 27, 2010, 11:48:14 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2010, 11:42:26 PM
Don't forget DePauw and Centre, who are playing in the SCAC title game down in Mississippi tomorrow.

Greg - quite possible depending on how the brackets are balanced.  Centre has played at Wooster before in the NCAAs.

Two more possible opponents:

Pool B bid  Maryville 23-4  (these Scots have played at Wooster before in the tourney)
E8 Pool C?   St. John Fisher 22-5 (Wooster was sent to Rochester one year, why not the reverse)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 27, 2010, 11:50:10 PM
They also sent Wooster to Augustana one year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2010, 11:50:58 PM
It's just as likely that Wooster could play Nazareth rather than St. John Fisher. The two E8 rivals are practically right next door to each other in metro Rochester.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2010, 11:52:05 PM
Lost amid the hoopla of the conference championship game is the fact that junior guard and POY hopeful Ian Franks scored his 1000th point tonight.  It was probably on a free throw!  He ended the game with 21 points, and it was the 17th that turned over his odometer.  Congratulations, Ian!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 27, 2010, 11:54:25 PM
Quote from: sac on February 27, 2010, 11:50:10 PM
They also sent Wooster to Augustana one year.

Yes, that one squeaked just under the 500 mile limit by less than 20 miles? and they got to face the national champ Wash University in the first round!  Not a good combination! :( :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2010, 11:57:43 PM
Yes, Wooster has been sent to Rochester and to Rock Island in recent years, and I made both trips.  Fair's fair; if they can't get a home bracket this year, why not send them to Arcata (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humboldt_state) to cut down on my travel?  ;D

P.S. To ScotsFan:  I mowed my lawn this afternoon.  Just thought you'd like to know.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 28, 2010, 12:09:57 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 27, 2010, 11:57:43 PM
Yes, Wooster has been sent to Rochester and to Rock Island in recent years, and I made both trips.  Fair's fair; if they can't get a home bracket this year, why not send them to Arcata (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humboldt_state) to cut down on my travel?  ;D

P.S. To ScotsFan:  I mowed my lawn this afternoon.  Just thought you'd like to know.  ;)

I shoveled my driveway - are those just about equal?! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2010, 12:11:53 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 27, 2010, 11:57:43 PM
Yes, Wooster has been sent to Rochester and to Rock Island in recent years, and I made both trips.  Fair's fair; if they can't get a home bracket this year, why not send them to Arcata (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Humboldt_state) to cut down on my travel?  ;D

North Park went to Arcata back in '78 and beat Humboldt State in the Elite Eight game, back when HSU was still a D3 school.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 28, 2010, 12:45:29 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 27, 2010, 11:54:25 PM
Quote from: sac on February 27, 2010, 11:50:10 PM
They also sent Wooster to Augustana one year.

Yes, that one squeaked just under the 500 mile limit by less than 20 miles? and they got to face the national champ Wash University in the first round!  Not a good combination! :( :o

Augustana-Wooster was within 5 miles of the limit I think...that was a ridiculous pairing.  A first-round game that should've been bracketed as a sweet sixteen game.  Sending Wooster that far away sent them into the bracket of death that year I think, and IIRC there were certainly other, shorter distance travel options available for Wooster especially.  Both of those teams were final four participants the year before and both had the potential for another run (Wash U, obviously, went on to win its first title).

But that's the difference between winning and losing your conference tournament.  Wooster will most likely not be sent on the road this year—that year might have been the one where Wabash blew out Wooster in the NCAC semifinal, meaning Wooster drew a much lower "seed" in the tournament and drew a rough road assignment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 28, 2010, 08:15:47 AM
Wow ... the D3hoops projected brackets still have the Scots going to John Carroll, despite JCU's loss in the OAC semifinals.
http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/proj-mbbbracket2010.pdf (http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/proj-mbbbracket2010.pdf)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 28, 2010, 09:12:35 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 28, 2010, 08:15:47 AM
Wow ... the D3hoops projected brackets still have the Scots going to John Carroll, despite JCU's loss in the OAC semifinals.
http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/proj-mbbbracket2010.pdf (http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/proj-mbbbracket2010.pdf)

That projection with John Carroll hosting makes no sense to me.  JCU has 6 in region losses and Wooster only has 4 which is a big difference.  Also, JCU lost in the semi-final game of the OAC tourney while Wooster won the NCAC tourney and the automatic bid.

IF those 4 teams do play in a first/second round pod, then the Scots should be the host and JCU, Calvin and Wheaton can travel to Wooster. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 28, 2010, 09:14:05 AM
One the one hand they have JCU worrying about getting in, but on the other hand they have them hosting? It seems they must be thinking head-to-head is going to be a major trump card. Maybe their right. While head-to-head should mean something, so should the fact the game took place in November at JCU, and both teams (as all other teams) are completely different now. I don't know if this is a factor in early round games, but in 2007, St. Johns Fisher got to host the sectional over Wooster, despite Wooster having a small edge on paper, in part because Wooster had recently hosted a sectional, while St. Johns Fisher hadn't. JCU hosted both early round and sectional games last year.

We shall see, but my guess is that JCU and Grove City will be at Wooster, with a fourth team unknown.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 28, 2010, 09:36:27 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 28, 2010, 09:14:05 AM
One the one hand they have JCU worrying about getting in, but on the other hand they have them hosting? It seems they must be thinking head-to-head is going to be a major trump card. Maybe their right. While head-to-head should mean something, so should the fact the game took place in November at JCU, and both teams (as all other teams) are completely different now. I don't know if this is a factor in early round games, but in 2007, St. Johns Fisher got to host the sectional over Wooster, despite Wooster having a small edge on paper, in part because Wooster had recently hosted a sectional, while St. Johns Fisher hadn't. JCU hosted both early round and sectional games last year.

We shall see, but my guess is that JCU and Grove City will be at Wooster, with a fourth team unknown.

Seinfeld - excellent point about a more logical pairing of geographically close teams.  Wooster hosting JCU, Grove City and Defiance (northwest Ohio team) would make a lot of sense to me.

Of course, the big unknown is how the NCAA will balance the brackets to avoid paying airline expenses for teams in the tourney.  In recent years, the Michigan teams have been paired with Illinois and Wisconsin teams, not Ohio, in the first/second rounds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on February 28, 2010, 10:03:35 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 28, 2010, 09:12:35 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 28, 2010, 08:15:47 AM
Wow ... the D3hoops projected brackets still have the Scots going to John Carroll, despite JCU's loss in the OAC semifinals.
http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/proj-mbbbracket2010.pdf (http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/proj-mbbbracket2010.pdf)

That projection with John Carroll hosting makes no sense to me.  JCU has 6 in region losses and Wooster only has 4 which is a big difference.  Also, JCU lost in the semi-final game of the OAC tourney while Wooster won the NCAC tourney and the automatic bid.

IF those 4 teams do play in a first/second round pod, then the Scots should be the host and JCU, Calvin and Wheaton can travel to Wooster. ;)


I also do not agree with the projection of John Carroll hosting over Wooster.  Seems like Wooster has to be a higher overall seed, and seems like geographically, there is no barrier to the same 4 teams playing in Wooster.

Maybe Pat will explaine their rationale...after he finishes his 2-3 hours of sleep.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 28, 2010, 01:35:54 PM
Quote from: Titan Q on February 28, 2010, 10:03:35 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 28, 2010, 09:12:35 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 28, 2010, 08:15:47 AM
Wow ... the D3hoops projected brackets still have the Scots going to John Carroll, despite JCU's loss in the OAC semifinals.
http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/proj-mbbbracket2010.pdf (http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/proj-mbbbracket2010.pdf)

That projection with John Carroll hosting makes no sense to me.  JCU has 6 in region losses and Wooster only has 4 which is a big difference.  Also, JCU lost in the semi-final game of the OAC tourney while Wooster won the NCAC tourney and the automatic bid.

IF those 4 teams do play in a first/second round pod, then the Scots should be the host and JCU, Calvin and Wheaton can travel to Wooster. ;)


I also do not agree with the projection of John Carroll hosting over Wooster.  Seems like Wooster has to be a higher overall seed, and seems like geographically, there is no barrier to the same 4 teams playing in Wooster.

Maybe Pat will explaine their rationale...after he finishes his 2-3 hours of sleep.

Wooster definitely deserves the host over John Carroll. We have Wooster/Wilmington and John Carroll/Defiance at Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 28, 2010, 01:38:24 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 28, 2010, 08:15:47 AM
Wow ... the D3hoops projected brackets still have the Scots going to John Carroll, despite JCU's loss in the OAC semifinals.
http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/proj-mbbbracket2010.pdf (http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/proj-mbbbracket2010.pdf)

The d3hoops guys have always at been good at projecting the teams that make the tournament..........they are not so good at projecting brackets.  Take it with less than a grain of salt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 28, 2010, 01:41:57 PM
Quote from: sac on February 28, 2010, 01:38:24 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 28, 2010, 08:15:47 AM
Wow ... the D3hoops projected brackets still have the Scots going to John Carroll, despite JCU's loss in the OAC semifinals.
http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/proj-mbbbracket2010.pdf (http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/proj-mbbbracket2010.pdf)

The d3hoops guys have always at been good at projecting the teams that make the tournament..........they are not so good at projecting brackets.  Take it with less than a grain of salt.

Aside from the JCU/Wooster hosting they seem to have more potential early flights than are necessary. I don't like the link between the Guilford and Stevens Point pods and the Wash U. and Albright pods. We shall see.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2010, 03:16:47 PM
Quote from: ziggy on February 28, 2010, 01:41:57 PM
Quote from: sac on February 28, 2010, 01:38:24 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 28, 2010, 08:15:47 AM
Wow ... the D3hoops projected brackets still have the Scots going to John Carroll, despite JCU's loss in the OAC semifinals.
http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/proj-mbbbracket2010.pdf (http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/proj-mbbbracket2010.pdf)

The d3hoops guys have always at been good at projecting the teams that make the tournament..........they are not so good at projecting brackets.  Take it with less than a grain of salt.

Aside from the JCU/Wooster hosting they seem to have more potential early flights than are necessary. I don't like the link between the Guilford and Stevens Point pods and the Wash U. and Albright pods. We shall see.

I too am having trouble grasping how JCU deserves to host over Wooster for 1st and 2nd round games.  What exactly is the reasoning here?  If they're basing the head to head match-up won by the Blue Streaks, then why would Wooster have been ranked ahead of JCU in the regional rankings prior to the Scots' loss to Witt 2 weeks ago?  And I also don't get why you would reward a team that LOST at home in their conference semis by allowing them to host over a team that WON their conference tournament and very well should be the top ranked team in the GL Region?

Also, looking at the projected brackets, I don't like how they are projecting all of those ODAC teams.  Four teams projected to get in and 3 hosting sectionals?  If you're conference gets 4 teams in, I don't agree with the fact that 3 of those 4 teams, 3 would be hosting first round games.  And what makes even less sense is that R-MC is the only ODAC team not projected as hosting even though they just beat EMU yesterday in the ODAC semis.  Yet, they've projected EMU as a possible host? 

I realize that these are just best guess projections, but some of them just don't make a whole lot of sense IMO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: OWho? on February 28, 2010, 09:22:19 PM
OWU will be a major player in the conference next year. Tim Brady for Player of the Year= lock, as he has the powers of Pikachu behind him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2010, 09:41:37 PM
I'm also baffled as to why the Guru and his elves have JCU hosting rather than Wooster next weekend, but ...

Quote from: seinfeld on February 28, 2010, 09:14:05 AMWhile head-to-head should mean something, so should the fact the game took place in November at JCU, and both teams (as all other teams) are completely different now.

The date of head-to-head contests is not part of the criteria.

Quote from: ScotsFan on February 28, 2010, 03:16:47 PMI too am having trouble grasping how JCU deserves to host over Wooster for 1st and 2nd round games.  What exactly is the reasoning here?  If they're basing the head to head match-up won by the Blue Streaks, then why would Wooster have been ranked ahead of JCU in the regional rankings prior to the Scots' loss to Witt 2 weeks ago?

Good point.

Quote from: ScotsFan on February 28, 2010, 03:16:47 PMAnd I also don't get why you would reward a team that LOST at home in their conference semis by allowing them to host over a team that WON their conference tournament and very well should be the top ranked team in the GL Region?

That's not part of the criteria, either. Losing in the finals versus losing in the semifinals versus winning the conference tourney doesn't matter when it comes to seeding. Only the five primary criteria count ... and after that, the secondary criteria, none of which make any distinction between conference tournament games and regular season in-region games.




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 28, 2010, 09:46:33 PM
Before all the non-Wooster posters depart until the '10-'11 season, how about each of you listing your schools team of the decade. Technically the decade doesn't finished until the end of this year but this is the the last complete season. Let's go 8 deep and anyone who played '00-'01 onward should count. Having followed NCAC for about 8 years now it should be fun to see some early decade names pop up. Should be easy to pick the first three or four but then the debate starts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 28, 2010, 10:03:11 PM
Has anyone ever asked the question if the selection is done only by the book, following the criteria to the letter with no subjectivity, why there is even a selection committee at all? Might as well just have one guy take an hour, make some matchups, and call it a day. Yet having almost no leeway on who to take, we wait until the following morning, almost two days after the vast majority of teams are done playing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on February 28, 2010, 10:10:39 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 28, 2010, 10:03:11 PM
Has anyone ever asked the question if the selection is done only by the book, following the criteria to the letter with no subjectivity, why there is even a selection committee at all? Might as well just have one guy take an hour, make some matchups, and call it a day. Yet having almost no leeway on who to take, we wait until the following morning, almost two days after the vast majority of teams are done playing.

The criteria is used to guide the process, but there is still a lot of subjectivity to both selection and bracketing.  There are some really good "basketball guys" on the regional/national committees...

http://web1.ncaa.org/web_files/champ_handbooks/basketball/2010/10_3_mbasketball.pdf
(Appendix D)

They do the best they can with the rules and budget constraints they are handed by the NCAA.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2010, 10:12:09 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 28, 2010, 10:03:11 PM
Has anyone ever asked the question if the selection is done only by the book, following the criteria to the letter with no subjectivity, why there is even a selection committee at all? Might as well just have one guy take an hour, make some matchups, and call it a day. Yet having almost no leeway on who to take, we wait until the following morning, almost two days after the vast majority of teams are done playing.

It's done by the book, yes, but the book does give some leeway. Remember, there isn't just one selection criterion -- there's five of them:

QuoteThe primary criteria emphasize regional competition (all contests leading up to NCAA
championships); all criteria listed will be evaluated (not listed in priority order).
•  Win-loss percentage against regional opponents.
•  Strength-of-schedule (only contests versus regional competition).
- Opponents' Average Winning Percentage (OWP).
- Opponents' Opponents' Average Winning Percentage (OOWP).
[See Appendix B for explanation of OWP and OOWP calculations.]
•  In-region head-to-head competition.
•  In-region results versus common regional opponents.
•  In-region results versus regionally ranked teams.
Note:
• Ranked opponents are defined as those teams ranked at any time of the rankings/
selection process.
• Conference postseason contests are included.
• Contests versus provisional and reclassifying members in their third and fourth
years shall count in the primary criteria.  Provisional and reclassifying members
shall remain ineligible for rankings and selections.
Weighted Scale.  For a minimum of two championship seasons (2009-10 and 2010-
11), a weighted scale will apply.  Once the OWP and OOWP are calculated, they are
to be combined on a weighted scalre (e.g., 2/3 weight for OWP and 1/3 weight for
OOWP) and this combined number becomes the strength of schedule.

Note the parenthetical statement that I bolded and underlined. The book says that the committee has to use those five primary criteria, but it doesn't say how they should be used. Do you give the most weight to win-loss percentage? Do you take Team A, which has a better record versus regionally-ranked teams, or Team B, which has a better strength of schedule? And, once you have selected your nineteen Pool C teams, how do you then use the criteria to do your seeding and establish hosting rights (geography included, of course)?

In other words, it's not an automatic process. There's still plenty of room for some human subjectivity to enter into it. Not a lot, mind you, but some.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 28, 2010, 10:16:04 PM
From the handbook:

"Should a committee find that evaluation of a team's win-loss percentage during 25
percent of the season is applicable, (i.e., end-of-seasn performance), it may adopt such
criteria with approval from the championships committee.
Additionally, input is provided by regional advisory committees for consideration by
the basketball committee."

They're allowed to see who's playing better recently and to receive "input" from advisory committees. They're not just robots bound by three or four rules.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 28, 2010, 10:29:41 PM
I'm glad to hear that. Then maybe the regional rankings aren't an automatic guide as to where teams will end up?

I'm obviously coming at this from a Wooster standpoint, but why wouldn't they take into account the head-to-head with JCU was in November on the road, and that Wooster is obviously a different team now, having won 18-of-19. In Div. I, that game almost wouldn't even matter.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 28, 2010, 10:32:32 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 28, 2010, 10:29:41 PM
I'm glad to hear that. Then maybe the regional rankings aren't an automatic guide as to where teams will end up?

I'm obviously coming at this from a Wooster standpoint, but why wouldn't they take into account the head-to-head with JCU was in November on the road, and that Wooster is obviously a different team now, having won 18-of-19. In Div. I, that game almost wouldn't even matter.

I would think that being in the same region, once they do the regional rankings the "seeding" will follow a similar pattern. If they deem Wooster as higher than JCU (and I would think they will), I see no reason why they'd turn around and award JCU with the host over Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on February 28, 2010, 10:39:59 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 28, 2010, 10:29:41 PM
I'm glad to hear that. Then maybe the regional rankings aren't an automatic guide as to where teams will end up?

I'm obviously coming at this from a Wooster standpoint, but why wouldn't they take into account the head-to-head with JCU was in November on the road, and that Wooster is obviously a different team now, having won 18-of-19. In Div. I, that game almost wouldn't even matter.

If Wooster won the John Carroll game, and then stumbled upon hard times later in the season and found itself on the Pool C bubble, would you make the case here that the game shouldn't matter (since Wooster was a "different team" back then)?  Or would you be pointing to the John Carroll game as a reason Wooster should get in?  Just curious.

The game is considered (not as the end-all, be-all of Wooster vs John Carroll...but rather one factor), because the game actually took place.  Every game counts.

(And this is not Division I, where every committee member has seen every team play multiple times on TV.  The D3 criteria is necessary to establish some type of credibility and consistency in the process.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2010, 10:47:42 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on February 28, 2010, 10:16:04 PM
From the handbook:

"Should a committee find that evaluation of a team's win-loss percentage during 25
percent of the season is applicable, (i.e., end-of-seasn performance), it may adopt such
criteria with approval from the championships committee.
Additionally, input is provided by regional advisory committees for consideration by
the basketball committee."

They're allowed to see who's playing better recently and to receive "input" from advisory committees. They're not just robots bound by three or four rules.

Yes, but that's a secondary criterion -- and, as the clause indicates, not even an automatically-used one. I'm sticking with the primary criteria in this discussion, so as to avoid confusion.

Quote from: seinfeld on February 28, 2010, 10:29:41 PM
I'm glad to hear that. Then maybe the regional rankings aren't an automatic guide as to where teams will end up?

I'm obviously coming at this from a Wooster standpoint, but why wouldn't they take into account the head-to-head with JCU was in November on the road, and that Wooster is obviously a different team now, having won 18-of-19. In Div. I, that game almost wouldn't even matter.

Q's explanation, which I think hits the nail on the head, is probably the reasoning adopted by the NCAA as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 28, 2010, 11:01:26 PM
Pretty simply, I think JCU still should be ranked ahead of Wooster based on the head-to-head result. As noted by others, the date of the game matters not to the NCAA. It's definitely a judgment call, but I feel it is silly to throw out the head-to-head simply because it happened a long time ago. The other vital stats tend to balance each other out -- Wooster has a significant edge in winning percentage, but JCU has an edge in SOS. Pool A vs. Pool C is not a criteria. Heck, in one year of the 48-team field, every team that got a first-round bye was a Pool C team. (Believe that was 2002.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 01, 2010, 09:22:20 AM
Calling any critique of the Div. III selection criteria silly is the only thing that is silly. Where did anyone say the head-to-head should be thrown out? All I said is that since the game was so long ago and on the road, it's significance should be lessened, not taken away all together. It would be seen that way in Div. I, but I suppose their silly to judge it that way as well.

Here is the news release on the new Wooster Rec Center. I wish they didn't make the picture so big. Takes up so much of my screen:

http://www.wooster.edu/News-and-Events/News-Releases/2010/March/Trustees-Authorize-Student-Recreation-Center
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 01, 2010, 09:49:57 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 01, 2010, 09:22:20 AM
It would be seen that way in Div. I, but I suppose their silly to judge it that way as well.

Many things in Division I are different.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 01, 2010, 10:07:29 AM
Oops, I guess I was wrong about Wooster/JCU  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 01, 2010, 10:19:25 AM
So does the NCAA eventually post a printable bracket on thier website latter in the day?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 01, 2010, 10:19:34 AM
I said throughout that that was a judgment call that could go either way.

Bracket: http://www.d3boards.com/playoffs/mbb-bracket2010.pdf
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on March 01, 2010, 02:38:10 PM
How bout hosting again down in WOO!!!  Awesome.

Now as for the JCU talk, they won't make it past Maryville I don't think.  The Scots will whip Grove City without a doubt and end up facing Guilford probably on the road in NC.  That will be a very tough place to play as their gym is like a barn and can be kind of dark unless they've changed some things.  This worries me cause I dont think we match up too well against Guilford.  BUT, where there is a will there is a way. 

Now the team to watch outta this bracket is Eastern Mennonite.  They are solid, and probablu the most athletic team in this entire side of the bracket.  THEY CAN RUN.  They gave Guilford the business whooping them 90-63 so even Palumbo knows thats gonna be scary.  So watch it.

My final four for right now.....WILLIAMS, EASTERN MENNONITE, CARTHAGE, AND WILLIAM PATTERON.

MENNONITE AND CARTHAGE IN THE FINALS....

GAME GOES TO CARTHAGE. 

May change some things around, but i think that will be it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 01, 2010, 03:04:33 PM
Quote from: WooHoopsntrack01 on March 01, 2010, 02:38:10 PM
How bout hosting again down in WOO!!!  Awesome.

Now as for the JCU talk, they won't make it past Maryville I don't think.  The Scots will whip Grove City without a doubt and end up facing Guilford probably on the road in NC.  That will be a very tough place to play as their gym is like a barn and can be kind of dark unless they've changed some things.  This worries me cause I dont think we match up too well against Guilford.  BUT, where there is a will there is a way. 

Wow...that's not putting the cart in front of the horse or anything. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HopeConvert on March 01, 2010, 03:10:05 PM
Quote from: WooHoopsntrack01 on March 01, 2010, 02:38:10 PM
How bout hosting again down in WOO!!!  Awesome.

Now as for the JCU talk, they won't make it past Maryville I don't think.  The Scots will whip Grove City without a doubt and end up facing Guilford probably on the road in NC.  That will be a very tough place to play as their gym is like a barn and can be kind of dark unless they've changed some things.  This worries me cause I dont think we match up too well against Guilford.  BUT, where there is a will there is a way. 

Now the team to watch outta this bracket is Eastern Mennonite.  They are solid, and probablu the most athletic team in this entire side of the bracket.  THEY CAN RUN.  They gave Guilford the business whooping them 90-63 so even Palumbo knows thats gonna be scary.  So watch it.

My final four for right now.....WILLIAMS, EASTERN MENNONITE, CARTHAGE, AND WILLIAM PATTERON.

MENNONITE AND CARTHAGE IN THE FINALS....

GAME GOES TO CARTHAGE. 

May change some things around, but i think that will be it.

:D :D :D :D :D :D :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 01, 2010, 10:05:11 PM
I guess someone has to start the conversation about the Wooster pod. The Scots should get plenty of tape of Grove City, since they played Hiram, Kenyon and OWU. Lost to Hiram but beat Kenyon and OWU. Wooster also found a team that actually turns the ball over more than they do, which is hard to do. They also block a ton of shots. Looks like they are a solid defensive team.

The key for Wooster in this game, and really every game, is the two T's -- tempo and turnovers. When they are controlling the tempo and taking care of the ball, like they did in the NCAC Tournament, they are going to be hard to beat. With Johnson getting his speed back and Balch seemingly everywhere, the Scots are likely to be more athletic than most opponents they play. And if they can get as many shots at the basket as their opponents, they have enough hot shooters right now that their likely to shoot a higher percentage. When they have failed in these two areas (Witt a couple of weeks ago and early in the season), the results can be ugly.

On paper, Whitewater should be better than Defiance, and probably better than Wooster. The question is how sharp will they be after flying in (I assume) and playing an early game on Friday in front of a small crowd? Then if they happen to get past Defiance and Wooster can get by Grove City, can Wooster's home court advantage make up the difference for what might be a slightly more talented team?

While spring break starts Friday, hopefully some students will stick around. The crowd this weekend wasn't great, but then again the NCAC was charging NBA prices. They need to seriously rethink those prices. There was probably 1,000 more people for the Wittenberg regular season game that took place just two weeks earlier than there was for the title game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 01, 2010, 10:41:33 PM
Final NCAA Rankings for the Great Lakes Region - released today:

   Team, In-Region Record, Overall Record
1. Wooster 23-4 23-5  :)
2. Hope 16-3 21-7
3. Wilmington (Ohio) 20-6 21-7
4. John Carroll 18-6 20-6
5. Calvin 15-4 19-9
6. Wittenberg 17-7 21-7


Other teams in Wooster's Pod:

Grove City was not ranked
Defiance was ranked 5th in the Midwest Region
Wisconsin Whitewater was ranked 3rd in the West Region
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 01, 2010, 10:50:07 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 01, 2010, 10:05:11 PMOn paper, Whitewater should be better than Defiance, and probably better than Wooster. The question is how sharp will they be after flying in (I assume) and playing an early game on Friday in front of a small crowd?

UWW is not going to fly in for this weekend's games, I can guarantee that. The NCAA won't pay for it, since the distance from Whitewater, WI to Wooster, OH is just under 500 miles. In fact, that's the whole reason why the Warhawks will be in Wooster in the first place; according to the NCAA's rules, any distance over 500 miles has to be by plane, and the NCAA pays for it. And the UWW administration certainly isn't going to pay for the team to fly to eastern Ohio when they don't have to.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 01, 2010, 10:51:36 PM
John Carroll wasn't even close to Wooster, which is interesting. Wittenberg sneaking into the top 6 probably helped Wooster stay ahead of Hope, as it gave the Scots two wins against a regionally ranked team, if I'm understanding this right. Seems like winning percentage trumped everything else, so that is something to keep in mind next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 01, 2010, 10:54:57 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 01, 2010, 10:50:07 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 01, 2010, 10:05:11 PMOn paper, Whitewater should be better than Defiance, and probably better than Wooster. The question is how sharp will they be after flying in (I assume) and playing an early game on Friday in front of a small crowd?

UWW is not going to fly in for this weekend's games, I can guarantee that. The NCAA won't pay for it, since the distance from Whitewater, WI to Wooster, OH is just under 500 miles. In fact, that's the whole reason why the Warhawks will be in Wooster in the first place; according to the NCAA's rules, any distance over 500 miles has to be by plane, and the NCAA pays for it. And the UWW administration certainly isn't going to pay for the team to fly to eastern Ohio when they don't have to.

My advice for Whitewater is to go down I-39 to I-74 to Indy, then swing around I-465 to hit I-70 to get to Wooster. You'll miss Chicago that way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 01, 2010, 11:18:46 PM
Wooster should have the advantage vs. Grove City based on common opponents as Seinfeld noted.  Grove City's top scorer is their 6'7" post Andy O'Keefe and they have two other guys who are 6'6" but Wooster clearly has more size available in this matchup.  Scots are probably the quicker team as well.

IF Wooster wins on Friday, they will likely face UW Whitewater and the Warhawks will be a major challenge in the 2nd round.  They were ranked #8 nationally in the latest D3Hoops poll and they won the tough Wisconsin conference (WIAC) regular season title with a 13-3 record.  They lost to a very tough UW Stevens Point team in their tourney final so they got an at-large bid and a trip to Ohio from the NCAA.

The Warhawks shoot over 50% from the floor as a team and their leading scorer is their 6'9" senior center Dustin Mitchell who is a big man literally and figuratively at 18.2 ppg.  Their #2 scorer is their senior guard Dupree Fletcher who averages 13.4 ppg coming off the bench as the 6th man.  They run a 9 man rotation and have two other players averaging 11.0 ppg (Dantzler) and 10.3 ppg (Bendall).  If Wooster can get the 6'9" Mitchell in foul trouble, they will have a size advantage because the Warhawks next two tallest players are 6'6" and 6'5".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2010, 10:06:47 AM
Thanks for the break-downs of the Wooster pod wsf and seinfeld. Definitely glad to see Wooster hosting, but it's kind of mixed feelings seeing Whitewater being shipped in as a possible 2nd round matchup.

Quote from: seinfeld on March 01, 2010, 10:05:11 PM
I guess someone has to start the conversation about the Wooster pod. The Scots should get plenty of tape of Grove City, since they played Hiram, Kenyon and OWU. Lost to Hiram but beat Kenyon and OWU. Wooster also found a team that actually turns the ball over more than they do, which is hard to do. They also block a ton of shots. Looks like they are a solid defensive team.

The key for Wooster in this game, and really every game, is the two T's -- tempo and turnovers. When they are controlling the tempo and taking care of the ball, like they did in the NCAC Tournament, they are going to be hard to beat. With Johnson getting his speed back and Balch seemingly everywhere, the Scots are likely to be more athletic than most opponents they play. And if they can get as many shots at the basket as their opponents, they have enough hot shooters right now that their likely to shoot a higher percentage. When they have failed in these two areas (Witt a couple of weeks ago and early in the season), the results can be ugly.


To take it a step further, GCC doesn't appear to be a great 3-point shooting team.  Wooster has made over 100 more treys this season than the Wolverines.  GCC does shoot the ball well overall at over 48%, but I would guess that is because they like to attack the basket and pound the ball inside to their big man whose averaging almost 18 ppg while shooting at 68%.  Is it just me, or does this O'Keefe remind anyone of a George Raftis type player.  He's a little bigger than Raftis though.

As for the other first round game between Defiance and Whitewater, I'm expecting Whitewater to win this one.  But, I don't think it's a given.  Remember the last time an HCAC school came to Wooster, Transy knocked off then #1 WashU.  Defiance has beaten OWU twice and they've beaten Anderson 2 of 3 times including the HCAC championship game.  They split with Transy and they lost 2 of 3 to Hanover, but their one win over Hanover came in the HCAC semis so the Yellow Jackets picked a good time to notch their first win of the season over Hanover.

Another thing about Defiance is they have a veteran team with 6 seniors on the roster.  So, while I'm not expecting a Defiance win, I will certainly be cheering for one.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 02, 2010, 10:55:03 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 01, 2010, 10:05:11 PM
While spring break starts Friday, hopefully some students will stick around. The crowd this weekend wasn't great, but then again the NCAC was charging NBA prices. They need to seriously rethink those prices. There was probably 1,000 more people for the Wittenberg regular season game that took place just two weeks earlier than there was for the title game.

I agree that the NCAC overcharged for the tournament games, especially when the NCAA charges only $6 for 1st/2nd-round games and $7 for regional contests.  However, I think that the crowds would have been smaller either way, because regular-season games, with dates known far in advance, tend to bring out more of the community here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ArmingtonCave on March 02, 2010, 04:45:21 PM
I was actually pretty disappointed with the lack of student attendance at the NCAC games.  In fact I have been disappointed all year at the lack of students attendance at both football and basketball games and mentioned this to a few people the other night.  In fact I ran into Dr. Cornwell in the restroom and was going to say something put passed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2010, 07:05:29 PM
Quote from: ArmingtonCave on March 02, 2010, 04:45:21 PM
I was actually pretty disappointed with the lack of student attendance at the NCAC games.  In fact I have been disappointed all year at the lack of students attendance at both football and basketball games and mentioned this to a few people the other night.  In fact I ran into Dr. Cornwell in the restroom and was going to say something put passed.

I didn't really notice anything out of the ordinary wrt student attendance at basketball games.  Really, the only games I ever notice the students show up at all are the Witt games and the students did turn out in force for the first home game vs. Witt.  I'm sure charging students $5 definitely had something to do with the low turnout from the students in the NCAC championship game vs. Witt.  There was also a dance that night as well so when you combine the two, I think it's pretty understandable why student attendance might have been a bit low on Saturday night.  I know I sure as hell wouldn't have been too happy to find out that games that are normally free for students are now going to cost $5.  That was a case of Natty Light back in my college days!   :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 02, 2010, 08:28:14 PM
Quote from: ArmingtonCave on March 02, 2010, 04:45:21 PM
I was actually pretty disappointed with the lack of student attendance at the NCAC games.  In fact I have been disappointed all year at the lack of students attendance at both football and basketball games and mentioned this to a few people the other night.  In fact I ran into Dr. Cornwell in the restroom and was going to say something put passed.

I think that the combination of the only formal dance of the year, the admission charge, and I.S. full drafts being due on Monday for most seniors kept student attendance down.  However, most Wooster students don't attend athletic events, unless they're either athletes themselves, or sports fans.  The two big exceptions are the black-out game with Witt, and football games in nice weather (the latter having more to do with the marching band than the team).  Athletics are one of many good things happening on campus; even as a sports fan, I like it that way, although I wish there were more students at the games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ArmingtonCave on March 02, 2010, 09:03:55 PM
This has been an ongoing complaint of mine though.  I have been attending Wooster sporting events for 21 years now and the lack of student attendance has always irked me.  The two most attended football games I have seen were the first night game and the Wittenberg game in 2004.  One of the only basketball sellouts I can remember was the Witt game in 2006.    Hopefully there will be a decent crowd this Friday and Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ArmingtonCave on March 02, 2010, 09:05:54 PM
Make that  the 2007 Witt game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 03, 2010, 11:20:41 AM
Quote from: ArmingtonCave on March 02, 2010, 09:03:55 PM
Hopefully there will be a decent crowd this Friday and Saturday.

Good luck with that.  Spring break trumps a basketball game ten times out of ten for non-participating college students. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 03, 2010, 11:56:03 AM
NCAC awards have been released (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mballncac.html).  The .pdf link goes to the women's teams so I have no idea who is on the second and HM teams.  Congrats to those awarded!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 03, 2010, 04:12:41 PM
The link must have been fixed.  Here's a direct link to 1st and 2nd teams as well as HM:

All NCAC Team (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mballncac10.pdf)

And since Wally chose not to get into specifics on who won POY, allow me to do so.  Congrats to Ian Franks on winning NCAC POY as well as Bryan Wickliffe joining him on the 1st Team.  Nate Balch checks in as a 2nd teamer and Brandon Johnson deservedly gets recognized as an HM after coming back following his season lost to injury!  :)

Also, congrats to Wooster native ( :P) Mac Petty on receiving his first recognition as conference Coach of the Year in his 37 years of coaching.  I'm sure he'd trade in the award for a chance at the NCAA tournament, but it is an award long overdue nonetheless.

And congrats to all others that were honored on the all-conference team as well!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 03, 2010, 04:27:31 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 03, 2010, 04:12:41 PM
And since Wally chose not to get into specifics on who won POY, allow me to do so. 

I'm pretty sure I chose to not get into specifics about any of the awards...not just POY. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2010, 09:47:51 PM
At first glance, a pretty good effort by the coaches, in my opinion.  I don't see how you can leave Larry Farmer off the first team, but there's no shame in 2nd team.  David Nowicki got firmly screwed IMO, and I'd probably have Sutherlin a team higher as well, but overall it's not too bad.  No arguments with any of the "of the Year" awards.  Congratulations to all of the honorees!

By the way, and in relation to the (now closed) poll above, I should note that the statistics used in the press release are full-season stats, including the conference tournament.  Take that for whatever it may be worth.  Of course, the voting on the first team was complete before the tournament semifinals, so the data shown is not exactly what the coaches were using in their selection. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 04, 2010, 10:30:05 AM
Quickly on the attendance at the NCAC Tournament. I don't think the Winter Gala had anything to do with Saturday's attendance. It didn't start to 9 p.m., most people don't show up at a dance that goes all night right when it starts, and most of the students who would attend the basketball game weren't heading to a dance afterwards. The NCAC title game in 2009 at Wooster drew 2,800 against Wabash, and this year's game was against Witt. The 2007 title game against OWU drew 3,300, 2006 game against Witt drew 3,300, etc. This all has to do with ticket prices. For comparison, the OAC allowed OAC students in for free and a single ticket for the championship game was only $5 (http://www.oac.org/MENbasketballOTournament.shtml). While we all like Div. III basketball, most people are not willing to spend $10 (or $5 for a student) to go.

Looking back on Wooster's season, there was an obvious turning point, which was the halftime of the Jan. 27 game against Hiram. While they just came off of a win at Wittenberg, it was the defense, not the offense, that carried that win. And the Scots had already nearly lost to Allegheny and Kenyon and struggled with Earlham and Oberlin. Then, leading just 26-24 at halftime, Wooster proceeded to outscore Hiram 41-19 in the second half, and have never looked back. Starting at that point, the Scots have averaged 80.4 points per game and shooting 51% from the field after posting numbers of 68.4 ppg and 44.1% prior to this. Defensively, the Scots went from allowing opponents to shoot 41.8% from the field to 38%.

So what happened? Well, I'm assuming the coaches finally got through to the players about effort and intensity. Offensively, the biggest difference is Balch. He went from not being able to make wide open shots to being what I thought he was going to be this year -- a player that reminded us of James Cooper. Couple in that Johnson has progressively gotten healthier as the season went along, are the two main reasons. But if Wooster is to make any type of run in the tournament, it needs everyone to play to their ability. That means we need to see the Justin Hallowell of last year. He has played great post defense, but he is going to have to knock down three-pointers at a much better clip if the Scots are going to advance. Defenses are going to be better, and Hallowell's height will allow him to get his shot off against anyone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 04, 2010, 10:56:03 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 04, 2010, 10:30:05 AM
Quickly on the attendance at the NCAC Tournament. I don't think the Winter Gala had anything to do with Saturday's attendance. It didn't start to 9 p.m., most people don't show up at a dance that goes all night right when it starts, and most of the students who would attend the basketball game weren't heading to a dance afterwards. The NCAC title game in 2009 at Wooster drew 2,800 against Wabash, and this year's game was against Witt. The 2007 title game against OWU drew 3,300, 2006 game against Witt drew 3,300, etc. This all has to do with ticket prices. For comparison, the OAC allowed OAC students in for free and a single ticket for the championship game was only $5 (http://www.oac.org/MENbasketballOTournament.shtml). While we all like Div. III basketball, most people are not willing to spend $10 (or $5 for a student) to go.



Maybe attendance is just down because of the economy.  The MIAA tournament attendance was a bit down this year, maybe that is universally the case across the board.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ChicagoHopeNut on March 04, 2010, 10:58:19 AM
$10 does seem a bit steep to me but as I student I always got in for free and I have never been in a position to attend the MIAA tourney since graduating.

What is the cost for other conference tournaments?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 04, 2010, 11:06:15 AM
Quote from: ChicagoHopeNut on March 04, 2010, 10:58:19 AM
$10 does seem a bit steep to me but as I student I always got in for free and I have never been in a position to attend the MIAA tourney since graduating.

What is the cost for other conference tournaments?

I paid $7 for the MIAA Championship game, that was a bleacher seat in Calvin's lower bowl.

I can't remember if Hope does the tiered pricing at DeVos when they host or not, I think that would make the highest ticket price $10 for the cushy seats.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2010, 12:10:02 PM
I don't think it was the economy.  When Woo hosted Witt in the regular season, they drew almost 2900.  While that is lower than previous matchups between these rivals, that is still almost 800 more than what showed up to the NCAC champoinship game.  IMO, wouldn't one naturally conclude that a tournament championship game with an NCAA tournament birth on the line against your arch rival would out draw a regular season matchup against your arch rival?  Well, my guess is had the NCAC not tried to get greedy and jack prices up to $10 for adults and even more greedy by charging students $5 (which IMO was completely bogus), you would have seen a much larger crowd in Timken last Saturday. 

I'm inclined to email the NCAC to see what their reasoning was for jacking up the ticket prices for the championship round this year and if they might want to reconsider this next season due to the lack of numbers attendance wise.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ChicagoHopeNut on March 04, 2010, 12:27:26 PM
I am really surprised they charged students. That definitely seems strange to me and probably had an impact on attendance.

But I think the regular season game vs. championship game side of the equation may not hold. People have months to plan for the regular season games whereas for a championship you only are assured of a match-up of rivals the night before.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on March 04, 2010, 01:18:31 PM
Re: NCAC Tournament

You could always do what Wabash did. The Wabash Student Senate very graciously decided to pay for the Wabash students' tickets to the first round of the NCAC Tournament at Chadwick Court from the activity fees. Students were checked off a list and the Student Senate wrote a check the next day so that any student that wanted to attend the game didn't have to fork over $5 in addition to the money they had already been charged for student activities on campus for the whole year.

Public thanks to Wabash Student Body President Cody Stipes for putting all of this in place.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 04, 2010, 02:31:20 PM
That's a great idea at Wabash to get their students to the game.

I hate to say this, but I think that Wooster's fans may be a bit spoiled by the team's success.  Perhaps when you're hosting the conference tournament finals for the sixth year in a row, it doesn't seem like such a big deal.  I suspect that the crowds might have been better in Springfield or Crawfordsville, if their teams were the #1 seed and host.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 04, 2010, 02:45:06 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 04, 2010, 02:31:20 PM
That's a great idea at Wabash to get their students to the game.

I hate to say this, but I think that Wooster's fans may be a bit spoiled by the team's success.  Perhaps when you're hosting the conference tournament finals for the sixth year in a row, it doesn't seem like such a big deal. 

And we have a winner. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 04, 2010, 03:29:48 PM
Don't forget, final three-plus hours to enter the D3hoops.com bracket challenge.

You have extra time for the women's bracket, since the first game isn't until 4 p.m. ET on Friday.

http://www.d3hoops.com/pickem/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2010, 08:51:26 PM
Wasn't weather also a factor in the attendance last weekend?

I wonder how much of the "problem" was unsold tickets allotted to Wittenberg.

Good luck to the Scots tomorrow!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 04, 2010, 09:08:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 04, 2010, 08:51:26 PM
Wasn't weather also a factor in the attendance last weekend?

I wonder how much of the "problem" was unsold tickets allotted to Wittenberg.

Good luck to the Scots tomorrow!

Seems to me that Wooster generally has large support in the community and maybe less from the student body.  With all the high school tournament action last weekend, I would think that also would have had an impact.  Should be interesting to see how attendance is this weekend.  I don't know how well Grove City and Defiance travel, and its a long way for UWW fans.

I'm just hoping that I can make it Friday night!  I'm in Philadelphia this week and my flight is scheduled to get in to Columbus at 5:30.  Of course, "scheduled" is the key word.  I don't think that I've ever had a flight leave Philly on time!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 04, 2010, 10:34:50 PM
Tickets ($6 for adults, $3 for students/kids) go on sale at 4:30 tomorrow afternoon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2010, 10:46:21 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 04, 2010, 09:08:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 04, 2010, 08:51:26 PM
Wasn't weather also a factor in the attendance last weekend?

I wonder how much of the "problem" was unsold tickets allotted to Wittenberg.

Good luck to the Scots tomorrow!

Seems to me that Wooster generally has large support in the community and maybe less from the student body.  With all the high school tournament action last weekend, I would think that also would have had an impact.  Should be interesting to see how attendance is this weekend.  I don't know how well Grove City and Defiance travel, and its a long way for UWW fans.

I'm just hoping that I can make it Friday night!  I'm in Philadelphia this week and my flight is scheduled to get in to Columbus at 5:30.  Of course, "scheduled" is the key word.  I don't think that I've ever had a flight leave Philly on time!

Grove City only managed to draw 650 fans to their conference tournament championship game that they hosted.  So, they will do well to get 100 to 150 fans over to Wooster.

Defiance only drew ~850 fans to their last home game so they will be doing well to get 200 to 250 fans to Wooster.

Wisconsin Whitewater drew 950 fans to their conference tournament championship game vs. Stevens Point.  Given their travel distance, they might have 100 to 150 fans tops?

So, Timken should have plenty of available seats tomorrow night.  Someone can have my seat too since I will unfortunately be at home tucking my 4 year old daughter into bed and tuning into Mike Breckenridge on WQKT. :( :'(   My family responsibilities translate to only one basketball game per weekend so I am saving my "pass" hopefully for the 2nd round Saturday game. ::)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rabriggs on March 04, 2010, 11:31:08 PM
QuoteGrove City only managed to draw 650 fans to their conference tournament championship game that they hosted.  So, they will do well to get 100 to 150 fans over to Wooster.

Grove City has a short winter break (Thursday-Sunday) that coincided with the tournament semifinals and finals. Thus, about 85 percent of the students were gone from campus. Plus, Thomas More did not bring a big throng of people due to geography. The weather was not great either as quite a bit of snow fell the day before and in the morning.

I think you'll see quite a few Wolverine fans in Wooster Friday night. It is my understanding that SGA has lined up a bus for students and there are also a lot of Grove City alums in the Akron-Canton-Massillon area. Weather is supposed to be good for traveling and it's only a 2-hour ride, all on main roads.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 05, 2010, 06:19:50 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 04, 2010, 09:08:11 PM



I'm just hoping that I can make it Friday night!  I'm in Philadelphia this week and my flight is scheduled to get in to Columbus at 5:30.  Of course, "scheduled" is the key word.  I don't think that I've ever had a flight leave Philly on time!

Good luck with that.  How about the price increase on the CMH-PHL flights?  U.S. Airways has the only direct flight to PHL now that Southwest did away with that route so naturally they raised their prices.  I flew out there twice in the last month and got lucky on delays. (cross fingers).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 05, 2010, 09:54:05 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 04, 2010, 09:08:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 04, 2010, 08:51:26 PM
Wasn't weather also a factor in the attendance last weekend?

I wonder how much of the "problem" was unsold tickets allotted to Wittenberg.


Seems to me that Wooster generally has large support in the community and maybe less from the student body.  With all the high school tournament action last weekend, I would think that also would have had an impact.  Should be interesting to see how attendance is this weekend.  I don't know how well Grove City and Defiance travel, and its a long way for UWW fans.


Weather may have been a factor Friday but even then, most of the snow had ended by 1 or 2 and travelling back forth to Medina I can say the roads were 10X worse at 9am Friday morning than they were when I was coming home Friday evening.  And as for Saturday, I would say the weather wasn't much of a factor at all.  As far as the Witt crowd is concerned, they seemed equal to or bigger than the game that was played 2 weeks prior in Timken that drew almost 2900.

And wrt the high school tournament action, they always seem to be competing with the high school tournament this time of year and it hasn't hurt the numbers in years past.  And speaking of tournament action, Wooster (no big surprise) is already done.  However, two local high schools (Triway and Waynedale) will be squaring off at Wooster HS at 6 tomorrow evening for a sectional final.

It will be interesting to see what the attendance figures are this weekend.  On the one hand, ticket prices are $4 less than they were last weekend, but on the other hand, more than likely there won't be too many students as today marks the start of spring break for the COW.  Hopefully, seeing as how it's been a while since Wooster has actually hosted an NCAA tournament game, the community will make a better showing than they did last weekend!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 05, 2010, 10:05:12 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 04, 2010, 09:08:11 PM
I'm just hoping that I can make it Friday night!  I'm in Philadelphia this week and my flight is scheduled to get in to Columbus at 5:30.  Of course, "scheduled" is the key word.  I don't think that I've ever had a flight leave Philly on time!

Good luck getting to Wooster tonight derek!  I'll be thinking of you with an image of you in "Planes, Trains and Automobiles" as you try and make your way from Philly to Wooster this evening.   :)  Be safe!


Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2010, 10:46:21 PM
Someone can have my seat too since I will unfortunately be at home tucking my 4 year old daughter into bed and tuning into Mike Breckenridge on WQKT. :( :'(   My family responsibilities translate to only one basketball game per weekend so I am saving my "pass" hopefully for the 2nd round Saturday game. ::)


I know the feeling.   :)  Only I've got 3 girls (twin 6 year olds and a 4 year old).  Fridays are usually game night in our house, but I've also started to take my girls with me to a couple of games this season as well.  I asked them yesterday if they would mind pushing game night back to Sunday and go watch the Scots instead and I got a resounding YES!   ;D  So we'll be there!   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: John Gleich on March 05, 2010, 10:42:59 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2010, 10:46:21 PM
Wisconsin Whitewater drew 950 fans to their conference tournament championship game vs. Stevens Point.  Given their travel distance, they might have 100 to 150 fans tops?

And from what I understand, there was a large contingent of Pointer fans there as well (1/3 maybe?).  UWSP draws the best at home in the WIAC and and travels the best as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 05, 2010, 11:40:07 AM
It was a long time ago, but Whitewater was at the 1996 sectional at Wittenberg and they had a very small handful of fans there.

I remember it because Gustavus Adolphus had a nice group of about 150-200 and Hope brought well over 500.  It seemed weird they were so underrepresented
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ArmingtonCave on March 05, 2010, 02:54:09 PM
I am kind of annoyed to not be going to the game tonight, my son has some Chorus competition in Copley at 7:30.  Oh well.  If we win I will definitely be there tomorrow.

Go Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on March 05, 2010, 06:19:44 PM
Good luck tonight Wooster fans.  Go NCAC!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 05, 2010, 08:01:56 PM
Dupree Mitchell, who made the game-winning shot for UWW, is a 2004 high school graduate who was the AP Wisconsin state player of the year in high school, and went to Valpo. Now he is at his fourth school, UWW. The shot he hit at the end no one else in Div. III would make, IMHO.

http://74.125.113.132/search?q=cache:4xAp9jBAknYJ:www.royalpurplenews.com/news/2010/02/17/Sports/Fletchers.Long.Road.Traveled-3872852.shtml+dupree+fletcher+rufus+king&cd=4&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-a
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: John Gleich on March 05, 2010, 08:14:51 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 05, 2010, 08:01:56 PM
Dupree Mitchell, who made the game-winning shot for UWW, is a 2004 high school graduate who was the AP Wisconsin state player of the year in high school, and went to Valpo. Now he is at his fourth school, UWW. The shot he hit at the end no one else in Div. III would make, IMHO.

http://74.125.113.132/search?q=cache:4xAp9jBAknYJ:www.royalpurplenews.com/news/2010/02/17/Sports/Fletchers.Long.Road.Traveled-3872852.shtml+dupree+fletcher+rufus+king&cd=4&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=firefox-a

That's Dupree Fletcher...  Dustin Mitchell was the WIAC POY this season and is UWW's 6'9" stud.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 05, 2010, 08:57:03 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 29  Grove City 20

Wooster shot a low percentage in the half but they did hit 6 three pointers and they outrebounded the Wolverines by a 21 to 16 count.  Wooster's defense also forced 10 turnovers by Grove City.  

Scots are being led by Brandon Johnson with 6 points, Matt Fegan with 6 points and Justin Hallowell with 5 points.

Grove City is being led by Brett Matson with 8 points.  Wooster's frontcourt held Grove City's top scorer Andy O'Keefe to only 3 points in the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on March 05, 2010, 09:09:21 PM
Decent half.  Didn't shoot the ball particularly well, but we'll be ok.  Barring anything crazy, game will go to the SCOTS.  GCC looks nervous and just doesn't have the athletes to compete at the level where the SCOTS- who seem to be in a diff gear tonight!!- are playing.

GO SCOTS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2010, 09:34:59 PM
Of interest to Wooster fans: St. Thomas is one-and-done as they are ousted by Anderson.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 05, 2010, 10:00:01 PM
Final:  Wooster 63  Grove City 52  ;D

Wooster shot miserably tonight at 34% but offset that weakness by totally dominating the boards 48 to 29.

Scots were led tonight by Ian Franks with 12 points (11 boards), Bryan Wickliffe with 12 points and 15 boards, Nathan Balch with 11 points and Brandon Johnson with 9 points and 7 assists.

Grove City's top scorers were Brett Matson with 18 points and Andy O'Keefe with 10 points.

Wooster is now 24-5. :)  Next up is a very tough Wisconsin Whitewater team in the 2nd round!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 05, 2010, 10:09:52 PM
Wooster will have to play much better tomorrow night if they want to have a shot at beating UW Whitewater.

Three things that Wooster did tonight that will probably spell defeat if repeated tomorrow.

1.  Slow start - Scots only scored 7 points in the first 8 minutes of the game tonight
2.  Commit 14 turnovers
3.  Only shoot 34% from the floor

Wooster will also need to slow down UW Whitewater's top two players:  6'9" post Dustin Mitchell and their senior guard Dupree Fletcher who hit the winning shot tonight.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 05, 2010, 11:04:47 PM
Not very pretty tonight. When you shoot as bad as Wooster did, it obviously clouds how you judge them going forward, but man, I'm having a hard time figuring out how they are going to win tomorrow. Defiance played great, and Whitewater was mediocre for about 30 minutes, yet they still found a way to win. And as we saw with Anderson's win over St. Thomas, the HCAC put two pretty good teams in the tournament.

It mostly depends on if Whitewater is at full throttle from the start. They weren't against Defiance, and it allowed Defiance to get settled into the game. I think Wooster can get some good looks on offense, but not sure what they are going to do on defense. Mitchell is going to be almost impossible for any one Wooster player to guard because of his size. And Fletcher is going to have to be covered by Johnson. If Wooster was ever to show some zone or box-and-1, this would be the time to do it.

This is beating a dead horse, but Hallowell has to start making some shots. He can get open looks because of his height, but he simply isn't making them. At this point, you just have to assume this is what you are going to get from him. I think they have to consider playing Claytor more. He at least provides an offensive presence in the paint, which will make the defense have to respect Wooster's inside game more, leaving some more room for the guards. In the second half tonight, all Wooster was doing was shooting threes.

Fletcher is quite the character. At the end of the game, he was sticking his tongue out and flexing his muscles to the Defiance fans, which were the loudest visiting crowd I've heard in a while.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 06, 2010, 12:21:40 AM
Well.  Tonight's win was far from pretty, but at this time of the year, it's not how you win, just whether you win and all I care about right now is that the Scots survived to live another day!

This was one of the ugliest games I can remember being witness to.  I guess you have to credit both teams' defenses?  Although, much of the credit has to go to the Scots for leaving their shooter's touch at the gate.  Open 3's that have been automatic the last couple of weeks were rattling out.  I thought I was back in the first month of the season for a bit.  :-\  And as seinfeld touched on, I think we need to just accept that Hallowell isn't going to snap out of his sophomore slump and accept that it is what it is.  I just can't help hoping that he's suddenly going to break out to the Hallowell that won the national freshman of the year last season. 

All I can say for this game is thank god GCC actually played worse offensively than the Scots did tonight.  I couldn't believe when I heard the first half stats say that the Scots were shooting 31% from the floor?!  :o  How does a team shoot 31% and still go into the locker rooms up 9 at the break??? 

And if there is a silver lining from this game it is the defense.  Wooster's defense is what won this game.  Sure, that Matson kid got 18 points.  But he only shot 5-18 from the floor to get those 18 points.  And O'Keefe, who came into the game averaging almost 18 ppg while shooting at nearly 68% (3rd in all of d3 BTW) was held to just 10 points on a miserable 3-9 shooting from the field!  Hats off to the Wooster defense for earning this win tonight!

Tomorrow is going to be a challenge vs. Whitewater.  But I will say, Defiance gave me hope that the mighty Warhawks can be beaten.   Wooster will have to play better on the offensive end of the floor to have a chance.  If Wooster can match what they did defensively tonight on the offensive end, I think they could have a fighting chance.  They're going to have to shoot a hell of a lot better than what they did tonight for that to happen though!

Quote from: seinfeld on March 05, 2010, 11:04:47 PM

Fletcher is quite the character. At the end of the game, he was sticking his tongue out and flexing his muscles to the Defiance fans, which were the loudest visiting crowd I've heard in a while.
Yeah, I hope karma comes and bites Mr. Fletcher in the arse for his cocky antics he was pulling after that game tonight!  He can thank his lucky stars that Defiance choked that game away or he'd have been sulking on a long bus ride back to Wisconsin.  He had no business taunting the Defiance crowd like he did at the end of that game!

And speaking of loudest visiting crowds, is it safe to say that, based on the 7-10 Whitewater fans I noticed in attendance in that first game, WW's visiting crowd could be the quietest we've heard in a while?   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 06, 2010, 09:08:03 AM

Wooster Scots (24-5, 15-1 NCAC-1st) #17 in D3 Hoops Poll
Nathan Balch, 6'1" Jr. (11.7 ppg, 3.2 rpg)
Brandon Johnson, 6'2" Sr. (5.7 ppg, 2.4 rpg, 3.6 apg)
Ian Franks, 6'4" Jr. (17.2 ppg, 5.0 rpg, 3.3 apg)
Bryan Wickliffe, 6'5" Jr. (11.4 ppg, 7.4 rpg)
Justin Hallowell, 6'7" So. (9.4 ppg, 5.9 rpg)

Matt Fegan, 6'1" So. (6.3 ppg, 2.0 rpg)
Josh Claytor, 6'7" Fr. (5.6 ppg, 3.9 rpg)
Mike Evans, 6'5" So. (3.4 ppg, 1.3 rpg)
Jake Mays, 6'8" Fr. (2.9 ppg, 2.7 rpg)

UW-Whitewater Warhawks (23-5, 13-3 WIAC-1st) #8 in D3Hoops Poll
Nolan Free, 6'1" Fr. (6.6 ppg, 4.2 rpg, 2.0 apg)
Phil Negri, 6'3" Jr. (8.5 ppg, 3.3 rpg, 4.9 apg)
Alex Edmunds, 6'4" So. (7.5 ppg, 4.8 rpg)
Mike Bendall, 6'6" Sr. (10.1 ppg, 5.1 rpg)
Dustin Mitchell, 6'9" Sr. (18.2 ppg, 8.7 rpg)

Dupree Fletcher, 6'0" Sr. (13.7 ppg, 2.6 rpg)
DJ Dantzler, 6'0" Jr. (11.0 ppg, 1.9 rpg)
Chris Vines, 6'3" Jr. (4.8 ppg, 2.2 rpg)
Lucas Burns, 6'5" Fr. (3.0 ppg, 1.3 rpg)

Should be a great game tonight at Timken between two Top 20 teams! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 06, 2010, 01:38:38 PM
So, does the attendance crack 3 g's tonight at Timken?  Nearly 2700 turned out last night but that included a group of GCC students that outnumbered Woo's student section. 

I wonder if any more Whitewater fans will make the trek south today?  As I said earlier, I think I could count the total number of Whitewater fans on 2 hands.  I think Whitewaters cheerleaders outnumbered their fans in the stands.

Whatever the attendance ends up being, it should be a VERY partisan Wooster crowd tonight as I doubt we will see that many more WW fans show up tonight!  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Jackets Backer on March 06, 2010, 03:50:35 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 05, 2010, 11:04:47 PM

Fletcher is quite the character. At the end of the game, he was sticking his tongue out and flexing his muscles to the Defiance fans, which were the loudest visiting crowd I've heard in a while.

Fletcher is a ... well I'm not going to say. He's a great player but his antics ruin anything he does on the court. Do you know he was booted out of Evansville for stealing laptops, transferred to a couple junior colleges and I believe had run-ins with the law at those places as well. He had a semester or so of eligibility left and is using it at Whitewater. I'd hope a D-I talent could ball in the D-3 ranks. He graduated high school in like 2004. Defiance had them on the ropes, just didn't finish the job. Whitewater has the talent to make a long run with two D-I transfers and the huge 6-9, 240 pound Mitchell. Will be interesting to see tonight if Woo can beat them since the Scots' bigs can lift Mitchell and Bendall out with the way they can shoot it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 06, 2010, 06:55:52 PM
If Wooster, John Carroll, and Wilmington (all playing top 10 opponents) all win tonight, the sectional would likely be at Wooster.

Who's with me?  O-H!!!  I-O!!!  O-H!!!  I-O!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 06, 2010, 08:02:41 PM
Is it my computer, or is this video stream really terrible?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 06, 2010, 08:32:48 PM
I think Justin Hallowell must lead all of D3 in deadball rebounds.  Hardly any made front-end free throws escape his clutches.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on March 06, 2010, 08:34:29 PM
This could really really be interesting!  SCOTS up 68-57 with 4:30 to go.  AND, Guilford/JCU in a two point dog fight!!!! 

LETS GO OHIO!  LETS GO SCOTS!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 06, 2010, 08:39:23 PM
Is there any more telling stat in this game right now than this:

FTs:  WW 10-22, Wooster 22-25

That's impressive for the Scots.  Exactly what you need to do in the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 06, 2010, 08:43:11 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 06, 2010, 08:39:23 PM
Is there any more telling stat in this game right now than this:

FTs:  WW 10-22, Wooster 22-25

That's impressive for the Scots.  Exactly what you need to do in the tournament.

I was more NOT impressed with the 10-22. .....  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 06, 2010, 08:43:21 PM
I don't recognize these officials, but I'd guess they're Ohioans, and I think they're probably not used to a more physical Wisconsin-style game.  In the second half, they've been calling everything, and between that and the media timeouts, this game has very little flow.  Still, the overactive refs have been generally to Wooster's benefit, and as Bryan points out, they've used that benefit to good advantage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 06, 2010, 08:57:22 PM
Here we go again...
Whitewater gets seven points in the blink of an eye on a bucket-steal-bucket-steal-trey sequence.  Now they have the ball, down 4 with :47 left.

UPDATE:  But Whitewater can't seal the deal this time, as Wooster completes the 87-78 victory.  Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 06, 2010, 09:01:42 PM
No flexing by Dupree tonight, right?  Hope he keeps that tongue in his mouth too. ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HopeConvert on March 06, 2010, 09:03:04 PM
Is there a final score yet?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 06, 2010, 09:04:45 PM
Wooster 87
Whitewater 78
Final

Congratulations to the Scots on the trip to the Sweet Sixteen!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 06, 2010, 09:38:11 PM
This was a crazy game, with the Whitewater coach being ejected, then Wooster having an 11-point lead dwindle to just four in a fifteen-second span.  Ian Franks' 30 points once again carried the Scots offensively.  Congrats to the Scots on advancing to the Sweet Sixteen.

I'm guessing that Guilford will host the Scots, EMU, and the Chapman/Whitworth winner.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on March 06, 2010, 09:44:07 PM
In the bracket, Guilford 3, Eastern Mennonite 10  and Wooster 17 have won.  The west coast game, Chapman 12 at Whitworth 4 starts later. 

Guesses on who will host the next round?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on March 06, 2010, 09:46:25 PM
(Sorry, Didn't mean to step on fantastic50)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 06, 2010, 09:47:31 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on March 06, 2010, 09:44:07 PM
In the bracket, Guilford 3, Eastern Mennonite 10  and Wooster 17 have won.  The west coast game, Chapman 12 at Whitworth 4 starts later. 

Guesses on who will host the next round?

I think Guilford would be in line to host that Sectional......its one flight for the west coast team no matter who hosts.  I think Guilford is the highest seed remaining.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ArmingtonCave on March 06, 2010, 09:50:13 PM
Quote from: countyroad on March 06, 2010, 09:01:42 PM
No flexing by Dupree tonight, right?  Hope he keeps that tongue in his mouth too. ::)

Oh he was woofing it up to us and then shot an airball and made some dumb mistakes.   That three he made was clutch though.  Franks was insane the first half, he was the difference but the turning point IMO was the jumper from the top of the key Wick made when the shot clock ran out midway in the second half.  

Also Coach Moore was pumped at the beginning of the half, I haven't seen him like that in some time.  Doug seemed to be pumped too.    Crowd was into it and was a decent turnout.  

As an aside, they had the model of the new student activity center in the foyer.  It extends out parallel to the wooded hill and doesn't take out a large portion of the hill the band and football team march down, which is good.

All in all a good night to be a Fighting Scot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on March 06, 2010, 09:50:50 PM
Finally Ohio beats Wisconsin.  Thanks Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 06, 2010, 10:06:47 PM
SWEET SIXTEEN!!! Wooohooo!  ;D
Quote from: countyroad on March 06, 2010, 09:01:42 PM
No flexing by Dupree tonight, right?  Hope he keeps that tongue in his mouth too. ::)

The crowd was ALL over this dude tonight.  At one point he threw up an air ball and I've never heard the crowd outside of the students get into the 'airball' chant, but they did tonight!  ;D  And at one point he made a near steal in front of the media table which is the side I was sitting on and he made some incoherent yell while flexing his muscles.  I don't know exactly what transpired but the official called a T on the crowd and the next thing you know, Wooster's assistant SID I believe was being escorted out of the building by one of Wooster's finest?!  It was quite bizarre to say the least.


Quote from: David Collinge on March 06, 2010, 08:43:21 PM
I don't recognize these officials, but I'd guess they're Ohioans, and I think they're probably not used to a more physical Wisconsin-style game.  In the second half, they've been calling everything, and between that and the media timeouts, this game has very little flow.  Still, the overactive refs have been generally to Wooster's benefit, and as Bryan points out, they've used that benefit to good advantage.

I thought this might happen.  My dad was worried that the WW big man was going to get a lot of calls and get the Wooster bigs in foul trouble.  I mentioned to him that perhaps the WIAC's physical style may be unfamiliar to these officials and Wooster would actually benefit from that.  As it turns out, I would say the later turned out to be true.  Although, the ft discrepancy wasn't all that far off when Bryan made his post.  Wooster had only 3 more attempts at the ft line.  The discrepancy was in makes where Wooster had 12 more.  I haven't had a chance to go back and look at the final stats, so I'm just going by the numbers that Bryan posted.

And speaking of officiating, we had a bit of everything in this game.  I believe we had 4 WW players foul out.  Their coach was ejected after 2 T's and we had Hugh Howard's assistant tossed as mentioned earlier.  And then to make things interesting, the officiating completely blew two calls where Wooster's Brandon Johnson was grabbed by the attitude and was called for traveling.  And if that wasn't bad enough, a couple of possessions later, WW mugged another Wooster player only to see traveling as the call again?!  Fortunately, those horrible calls didn't come back to bite Wooster, although they almost did...  :-\

All in all, Wooster played every bit as good defensively tonight as they did last night. The difference tonight is that the offense showed up for the Scots!  While freaking Ian Franks will steal the spotlight and rightfully so with his 30 points, I'm going to have to say that Brandon Johnson hands down gets the game ball tonight!!!  I know that Dupree (aka the attitude) had twenty points, but Johnson frustrated him all night long when matched up with the attitude.  Not to mention it took the attitude 18 shots to get his 20 points.  And how about Johnson scoring 15 points.  Brandon picked a pretty good time to score your season high! 8-)

Well, now it looks like the Scots are off to ODAC land as both Guilford and EMU knocked the OAC from the tournament tonight.  Wooster should go into the round of 16 with no pressure!  No one expected them to get past WW and they proved all the doubters wrong tonight!  Well, now I'm sure that no one is going to expect them to topple mighty Guilford down in tobacco country.  Keep proving them wrong Wooster! 8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 06, 2010, 10:57:31 PM
I'm almost certain that wasn't the assistant Wooster SID that was ejected, as I saw him helping the photographer with some video during the game.

Quick question and then a few comments. Does anyone know what are the guidelines officials are supposed to follow in terms of handing out technical fouls for trash talking and taunting fans? Fletcher did both last night, and did it again tonight. The instance that ScotsFan pointed out took place right in front of the Wooster radio guy, and right in front of an official, and nothing was called. In fact, Fletcher played 36 minutes, was physical the entire game, and didn't pick up his first foul until the last two minutes of the game when they were fouling on purpose. Hard to believe there wasn't some reluctance to call a foul on him for whatever reason.

As for the officiating, not going to spend much time on this, because no one wants to hear it, but when you can predict how the officials are going to call a game over a series of minutes based on two factors -- what the scoreboard says in terms of number of fouls on each team, or a coach giving a ref an earful or picking up a technical -- you know the officials are not up to the challenge. The Whitewater coach picked up a technical with 2:40 to play in the first half. Interesting in that at Whitewater had not been called for a foul in nearly six minutes and had only two more fouls than Wooster at that point. But as soon as the technical was called, you could see how the refs changed the way they called the game. They overcompensated, and Whitewater was getting away with almost anything. Six of the next seven fouls called were against Wooster, and the only one they called against Whitewater was so blatant that they had not choice but to call it.

I completely misjudged Whitewater's defense when considering who was going to win this game. Despite their height and athleticism, their interior players are lousy defenders. They let Defiance score in the paint a lot last night, and they did with Wooster tonight, especially in the first half. Mitchell especially should be much more active defensively inside to block or alter shots. Of course you also couldn't have predicted how bad Whitewater would be at the line. If they shoot even a little bit better, they probably stay within a couple of possessions the whole second half, and with the way they finished these two games, who knows what could have happened.

Brandon Johnson's recovery from his knee surgeries really is remarkable. You would never know by the way he played tonight that nine months ago he tore his ACL for a second time. Remarkable.

But now the question is, can Wooster win a tournament game on the road? They have lost their last six in a row and haven't won on the road since 1997.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 06, 2010, 11:04:49 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 06, 2010, 06:55:52 PM
If Wooster, John Carroll, and Wilmington (all playing top 10 opponents) all win tonight, the sectional would likely be at Wooster.

Who's with me?  O-H!!!  I-O!!!  O-H!!!  I-O!!!
Well, the OAC guys didn't hold up their end of the bargain, so the Scots get to take a little Tabacky Road vacation.  I'm not complaining! 

Defiance showed that Whitewater could be beaten, and Wooster came along and finished the job.  Tonight, JCU had Guilford on the ropes, so maybe on Friday the Scots can once again finish what another Ohio squad started.  It's certainly shaping up as a terrific sectional; I only wish I could be there!  (If the NCAA would award the sectional to the Whitworth/Chapman winner, I'd be there!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 06, 2010, 11:05:35 PM
Not sure what you mean by "on the road". I'm guessing that does not include neutral site games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 06, 2010, 11:07:44 PM
What I should have said is "true" road game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 06, 2010, 11:23:06 PM
Understood. I hadn't thought of Wooster's recent tournament play in that fashion as they have ended their seasons in both neutral and "true road" game fashion.

I couldn't attend tonight's game as my twin daughters had a birthday party tonight but I had it up on internet radio and live stats. My take away from this game was the same as David's- Ian Franks carried the team in the first half but Brandon Johnson is showing his leadership here at the end of the season. His defense against Wittenberg, Grove City, and WW have been unbelievable. It all started with in the away game at Wabash. I think Brandon should be recognized as one of the best Wooster guards (certainly this decade).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 06, 2010, 11:26:44 PM
Back from Timken where I watched Wooster play probably their best game of the season against a very talented UW Whitewater team.

Kudos to Wooster for beating the first place team from the WIAC :)...usually considered one of the top 2 conferences in D3 basketball!  Always nice to knock off a higher ranked team (#8) in the D3Hoops poll.

Congratulations to the Wooster coaching staff on making the Sweet Sixteen again!

Wooster's defense tonight was terrific as they gave the Warhawks very few open looks until the final 2 minutes when the Scots were trying to avoid fouls.  Brandon Johnson played great defense on Dupree Fletcher and Bryan Wickliffe effectively neutralized 6'9" Dustin Mitchell (held him below his average) even though he was giving up 4 inches in height.

Ian Franks was unstoppable tonight with 30 points and Whitewater had no answer for him.  Wooster won this game because they executed on offense (shot 48%) while holding the Warhawks to only 43% from the floor.  The Scots also made their free throws at 81% while Whitewater missed a lot.

Great win for Wooster as they are now 25-5. ;D  Next up is Guilford on Friday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 06, 2010, 11:36:15 PM
Quote from: goscots on March 06, 2010, 11:23:06 PMMy take away from this game was the same as David's- Ian Franks carried the team in the first half but Brandon Johnson is showing his leadership here at the end of the season.
I think you mean ScotsFan.  People get us confused all of the time, despite his being a full generation younger than me.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 06, 2010, 11:50:18 PM
Sorry - I should be duly down graded for bad references

I do want to point out another achievement with tonight's win. Here is the list of 14 consecutive 20 win seasons...

1996-1997   23-6   Four year running record   86-24
1997-1998   22-6                                             90-22
1998-1999   25-4                                             89-23
1999-2000   26-3                                             96-19
2000-2001   24-4                                             97-17
2001-2002   21-7                                             96-18
2002-2003   30-3                                           101-17
2003-2004   26-4                                           101-18
2004-2005   27-3                                           104-17
2005-2006   26-4                                           109-14- d3 has this has 26-5 but I'm pretty sure I'm right
2006-2007   29-5                                           108-16
2007-2008   23-5                                           105-17
2008-2009   23-7                                           101-21
2009-2010   25-5                                           100-22

So since the first final four season they have achieved a four year running total of 100 wins - 8 seasons running. An amazing high level of consistent achievement.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 06, 2010, 11:56:41 PM
I should have put a smiley on my first comment  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on March 07, 2010, 10:00:40 AM
Congratulations Wooster on the big win.  You even defended The BeltTM.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 07, 2010, 10:26:36 AM
I read on the ODAC board that the ACC Tournament is in Greensboro next weekend, so all the hotels in the city are likely booked up.  Guilford might not get to host, after all.

Harrisonburg has the CAA women's tournaments (at James Madison), and given the relatively small size of the town, they might not be a good choice logistically, either.

Is it possible that the Scots will luck into being at home for one more weekend?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ArmingtonCave on March 07, 2010, 11:02:40 AM
The sectional at Wooster would be awesome.  Make it happen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 07, 2010, 11:04:04 AM
Wooster has the largest gym and the highest attendance average of the three teams that have a shot at hosting, for whatever that is worth. I still think it is a real long shot that Wooster would get to host, but it's not impossible.

One thing that is playing a role in how teams, especially Wooster, are approaching these tournament games are the media timeouts. It is silly that they have media timeouts at Div. III, especially games that are not televised live, but it is helpful to Wooster. Steve Moore always tightens up his rotation come tournament time, but with these extra stoppages, he is able to do it even more this year. The Scots are basically playing just seven guys, with a few token minutes thrown to Evans and Warnes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 07, 2010, 11:29:42 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 07, 2010, 10:26:36 AM
I read on the ODAC board that the ACC Tournament is in Greensboro next weekend, so all the hotels in the city are likely booked up.  Guilford might not get to host, after all.

Harrisonburg has the CAA women's tournaments (at James Madison), and given the relatively small size of the town, they might not be a good choice logistically, either.

Is it possible that the Scots will luck into being at home for one more weekend?

This is an interesting development.  Good catch fantastic!

Part of hosting also has to do with having adequate accommodations for visiting fans is it not?  Well, I'm guessing hotels will be hard to come by within 60 miles of Greensboro with the ACC tournament in town.  And it looks as though Harrisonburg might not exactly be such a strong choice as well with the CAA Women's tournament going on at JMU!  When will we find out how this will play out? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 07, 2010, 11:40:39 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 07, 2010, 11:29:42 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 07, 2010, 10:26:36 AM
I read on the ODAC board that the ACC Tournament is in Greensboro next weekend, so all the hotels in the city are likely booked up.  Guilford might not get to host, after all.

Harrisonburg has the CAA women's tournaments (at James Madison), and given the relatively small size of the town, they might not be a good choice logistically, either.

Is it possible that the Scots will luck into being at home for one more weekend?

This is an interesting development.  Good catch fantastic!

Part of hosting also has to do with having adequate accommodations for visiting fans is it not?  Well, I'm guessing hotels will be hard to come by within 60 miles of Greensboro with the ACC tournament in town.  And it looks as though Harrisonburg might not exactly be such a strong choice as well with the CAA Women's tournament going on at JMU!  When will we find out how this will play out? 

I did a quick check when I got home last night and there were hotels available in Greensboro, but they were either 2-stars or very expensive.  I guess the fact that the ACC tourney is in town would explain that.

There's also the chance that Wooster might not have even submitted a bid for the tournament.  From the looks of things they were ready to begin construction (or rather de-construction) of the PEC immediately...  But it would be great to have the possibility of 2 more games this year in the friendly confines of Timken Gym!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 07, 2010, 11:44:29 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 07, 2010, 11:29:42 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 07, 2010, 10:26:36 AM
I read on the ODAC board that the ACC Tournament is in Greensboro next weekend, so all the hotels in the city are likely booked up.  Guilford might not get to host, after all.

Harrisonburg has the CAA women's tournaments (at James Madison), and given the relatively small size of the town, they might not be a good choice logistically, either.

Is it possible that the Scots will luck into being at home for one more weekend?

This is an interesting development.  Good catch fantastic!

Part of hosting also has to do with having adequate accommodations for visiting fans is it not?  Well, I'm guessing hotels will be hard to come by within 60 miles of Greensboro with the ACC tournament in town.  And it looks as though Harrisonburg might not exactly be such a strong choice as well with the CAA Women's tournament going on at JMU!  When will we find out how this will play out? 

Accommodations, size of gym and seedings all affect the hosting.  The other factor is which schools have filed the paperwork to host a sectional.  Wooster usually files the paperwork (but did they with the new construction ready to start?) and you would think that both Guilford and EMU have filed?

If memory serves, the sectional sites are usually announced either Sunday night or Monday morning.  The NCAA can't wait too long because obviously there are 3 teams that have to make travel arrangements!


One other kudo on last night's win by Wooster goes to Nathan Balch! :)  Balch was the Scots leading rebounder and he recorded a double double with 15 points and 11 boards.  Wickliffe and Hallowell correctly focused on boxing out the Whitewater big guys which allowed Balch to sneak the lane and grab some boards.

Great to see Balch playing well at the end of the season as he was the NCAC tourney MVP also!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 07, 2010, 12:31:45 PM
According to the D3 Basketball Handbook the sectional sites are announced today online.

Teams interested in hosting need to have submitted applications by Feb 19, noting which rounds they are interested in hosting.

Also from the handbook:

Site Selection
The Championships Committee has prioritized the following site-selection criteria for all championships:
1. Quality and availability of the facility and other necessary accommodations;
2. Geographical location (which may include such factors as rotation of sites, weather, accessibility and transportation costs);
3. Seeding; and
4. Attendance history and revenue potential, which shall be considered necessary to assure fiscal responsibility.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2010, 01:06:36 PM
It's Guilford.  Pack a tent and hope for good weather.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 07, 2010, 01:38:09 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 07, 2010, 01:06:36 PM
It's Guilford.  Pack a tent and hope for good weather.  :)

My slim hopes of Wooster getting the sectional have been dashed.  :(  Nothing unexpected though. 

I see that Wooster has a link up for Live Video and that Guilford does appear to offer Video for free so I guess I'll be resigned to watching it on my computer.  Maybe I'll hook up the laptop to my flatscreen and watch the game on the bigscreen.   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 07, 2010, 04:54:15 PM
No surprise on Guilford hosting the sectional.  After all, they are 28-2 and the #3 ranked team in the country according to D3Hoops.  Most important, the NCAA committee clearly had them as the #1 seed in this quarter of the bracket.

For Wooster, I now think that they are playing with "house money" to use a poker expression. ;)  The Scots have nothing to lose this coming weekend and everything to gain if they can pull a big upset by beating Guilford on their home floor. :)

Wooster at 25-5 has already had a great season: ;D
1.  NCAC regular season title
2.  NCAC tourney title and NCAA bid
3.  Win over the #8 team nationally to reach the Sweet Sixteen!

So with very few folks expecting a Wooster win next weekend, let see if the Scots can adopt a "nothing to lose" attitude next Friday and pull the big upset at Guilford!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ArmingtonCave on March 07, 2010, 05:55:46 PM
Concur.  This season has actually gone way better than I expected.  And just think, only one senior on the team. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2010, 06:09:53 PM
Quote from: ArmingtonCave on March 07, 2010, 05:55:46 PM
Concur.  This season has actually gone way better than I expected.  And just think, only one senior on the team. 
Seconded.  And I think this is one of the keys to the continued success of the program.  It seems like every season there's a great deal of balance among the classes, so that every year has senior leadership and experience as well as freshmen getting playing time and building good careers.  No year is a rebuilding year, because there's always 6-8 experienced guys coming back, spread across the three years.  When you only have to replace one or two key components each year, you can have eight straight 100-win classes, as goscots pointed out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 07, 2010, 06:13:39 PM
I feel the same way wsf.  I really feel that Wooster may have already been playing with house money starting last night.  Friday night, they looked a little tight.  Like they were feeling the pressure of winning that first game because they were a pretty heavy favorite.  But last night, they looked like a completely different team.  They were loose and they just seemed to have more confidence and that confidence just continued to grow as they continued to build their lead.  That is until that 15 second near collapse in the final minute and a half of the game!

Now the question is, can Wooster use this 'nothing to lose' mentality and translate that into a road playoff win?  As seinfeld pointed out, it's been quite a while since Wooster last won a true road game in the NCAA tournament.  Another way to look at it is that Wooster is due to break that streak.  They have been close to doing it in their last 3 attempts which include a 2 point loss on a last second basket at Capital last season, a 3 point loss at Transy at the end of the 2005-06 season and that heart-breaking one point loss at Albion to end the 2004-05 season.  It would be nice to see Wooster on the other end of one of those close finishes and Friday would be a good start!   8-)

BTW, speaking of streaks, the last 2 times Wooster has made the round of 16, they have gone on to advance to the Final 4.  So, it would be great to see the Scots break their 6 game tournament road game losing streak while maintaining another streak of getting to Salem once they make the sweet 16!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 07, 2010, 09:48:33 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 07, 2010, 01:38:09 PM
I see that Wooster has a link up for Live Video and that Guilford does appear to offer Video for free so I guess I'll be resigned to watching it on my computer.  Maybe I'll hook up the laptop to my flatscreen and watch the game on the bigscreen.   8-)

If the video is as small as it was this weekend from Guilford, you are going to need a magnifying glass to go with the big screen tv. The video window was tiny, about half the size you normally get from Teamline.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 07, 2010, 10:52:19 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 07, 2010, 06:13:39 PM

BTW, speaking of streaks, the last 2 times Wooster has made the round of 16, they have gone on to advance to the Final 4.  So, it would be great to see the Scots break their 6 game tournament road game losing streak while maintaining another streak of getting to Salem once they make the sweet 16!  ;D

Wooster lost to JCU in the elite 8 game in 2004
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hasanova on March 07, 2010, 10:54:33 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 07, 2010, 09:48:33 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 07, 2010, 01:38:09 PM
I see that Wooster has a link up for Live Video and that Guilford does appear to offer Video for free so I guess I'll be resigned to watching it on my computer.  Maybe I'll hook up the laptop to my flatscreen and watch the game on the bigscreen.   8-)

If the video is as small as it was this weekend from Guilford, you are going to need a magnifying glass to go with the big screen tv. The video window was tiny, about half the size you normally get from Teamline.
I've watched Guilford's feed several times this season - you can expand it to full screen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on March 08, 2010, 12:22:05 PM
Let's quit lowering expectations with the "house money" and "better than expected" comments  :(

GO SCOTS!! :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 08, 2010, 12:37:34 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on March 08, 2010, 12:22:05 PM
Let's quit lowering expectations with the "house money" and "better than expected" comments  :(

GO SCOTS!! :o

Just because we feel that way doesn't mean we are lowering our expectations which is what I'm assuming you are insinuating?

I just think it's kind of refreshing for Wooster going into tournament games as the hunter rather than the hunted.  Even though I said that Wooster seemed to be playing with less pressure on Saturday night vs. Friday night, I also feel that Wooster came into that game on Saturday night with a bit of a chip on their shoulder as well.  I know the players read this site and see how no one was predicting that they would advance past Whitewater.  Wouldn't Wooster advancing to the Sweet 16 even though no one was predicting them to get past WW in the 2nd round constitute doing better than expected? 

And now the same things are being said about Guilford.  IMO, there's nothing wrong with being the underdog (i.e. playing with nothing to lose) with a chip on your shoulder and continuing to prove all the doubters wrong.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 08, 2010, 01:53:57 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on March 08, 2010, 12:22:05 PM
Let's quit lowering expectations with the "house money" and "better than expected" comments  :(

GO SCOTS!! :o

Why? Are the players looking at the board and now suddenly think they aren't good enough to be here?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 08, 2010, 02:05:09 PM
I've got my plans made for the weekend!  Anyone else making the trip south??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 08, 2010, 02:42:26 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 08, 2010, 02:05:09 PM
I've got my plans made for the weekend!  Anyone else making the trip south??

My family's headed south to Baton Rouge to visit friends over my kids' spring break, so I won't be making the trip to tobacco road.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2010, 08:07:26 PM
I think it's safe to say that no team in D3 would not be an underdog playing Guilford on Guilford's court.  That's no disrespect to Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sludge on March 08, 2010, 10:06:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 08, 2010, 08:07:26 PM
I think it's safe to say that no team in D3 would not be an underdog playing Guilford on Guilford's court.  That's no disrespect to Wooster.

Lone, possible, shocking, curious exception on a bad day might be Eastern Mennonite.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 08, 2010, 10:10:05 PM
Quote from: sludge on March 08, 2010, 10:06:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 08, 2010, 08:07:26 PM
I think it's safe to say that no team in D3 would not be an underdog playing Guilford on Guilford's court.  That's no disrespect to Wooster.

Lone, possible, shocking, curious exception on a bad day might be Eastern Mennonite.

Just because they won by 27 doesn't mean they weren't the underdog going in! :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2010, 10:14:54 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 08, 2010, 10:10:05 PM
Quote from: sludge on March 08, 2010, 10:06:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 08, 2010, 08:07:26 PM
I think it's safe to say that no team in D3 would not be an underdog playing Guilford on Guilford's court.  That's no disrespect to Wooster.

Lone, possible, shocking, curious exception on a bad day might be Eastern Mennonite.

Just because they won by 27 doesn't mean they weren't the underdog going in! :D
...or that they wouldn't be the underdog in a rematch. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: acgator98 on March 08, 2010, 10:15:58 PM
Sad news from Meadville.  Shockingly, Rob Clune has not been renewed for the upcoming season.  An extremely disappointing and unpopular decision by the AD as all current and former Gators strongly support Rob. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2010, 10:16:57 PM
Quote from: acgator98 on March 08, 2010, 10:15:58 PM
Sad news from Meadville.  Shockingly, Rob Clune has not been renewed for the upcoming season.  An extremely disappointing and unpopular decision by the AD as all current and former Gators strongly support Rob. 
:o :o :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 08, 2010, 10:22:34 PM
Quote from: acgator98 on March 08, 2010, 10:15:58 PM
Sad news from Meadville.  Shockingly, Rob Clune has not been renewed for the upcoming season.  An extremely disappointing and unpopular decision by the AD as all current and former Gators strongly support Rob. 

Now waiiiit a minute...

This is the same guy that I touted for the silver medal in Coach Of The Year, right?

The Gators won 8 of 9 near the end of the season. Last year the finished strong and upset a 2 seed in the NCAC tourney. Gheny's always been competitive, if not successful.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: acgator98 on March 08, 2010, 10:28:56 PM
Same guy.  Obviously, her decision wasn't based on wins & losses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2010, 10:34:40 PM
Quote from: acgator98 on March 08, 2010, 10:28:56 PM
Same guy.  Obviously, her decision wasn't based on wins & losses.
Makes you wonder what it was based on.  I'd like to think that she's hoping to find a coach that can push Allegheny over the final hump and challenge Wooster for supremacy, although I'm not convinced that Rob Clune wasn't that guy.  I certainly hope--and expect--that there's no untold story here.

In the meantime, good luck to him.  The mind reels with lists of schools who'd be better off with Rob Clune than with the guy they've got now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hasanova on March 08, 2010, 10:40:02 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 08, 2010, 10:10:05 PM
Quote from: sludge on March 08, 2010, 10:06:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 08, 2010, 08:07:26 PM
I think it's safe to say that no team in D3 would not be an underdog playing Guilford on Guilford's court.  That's no disrespect to Wooster.

Lone, possible, shocking, curious exception on a bad day might be Eastern Mennonite.

Just because they won by 27 doesn't mean they weren't the underdog going in! :D
All this is true.  I was at the GC/EMU game and that was simply a different effort from Guilford than I've seen the other 16 times I've been to a GC game.  I have reason to believe the Quakers just weren't 100% healthy that night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: acgator98 on March 08, 2010, 10:48:26 PM
Rob is a stand-up guy, his integrity was never in question here.  Unfortunately, by all accounts, it was simply an AD with a axe to grind.  With her decision, the she has effectively now alienated over 20+ years of Gator basketball alums, dating back to the late 80s, whose common bond to the program was either Coach Ness or Coach Clune.  As I said befire, no one can comprehend why this decision was made.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2010, 11:01:04 PM
Thanks for the news and background, gator.  I suppose this is the wrong moment to ask if you'd consider sticking around and being the advocate for the Gators in here, something (I think) we sorely need.  Despite your current level of discontent, I hope you'll be here next year and help keep us up to date on what's probably the hardest NCAC team to follow from a distance.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 09, 2010, 08:35:50 AM
Quote from: acgator98 on March 08, 2010, 10:15:58 PM
Sad news from Meadville.  Shockingly, Rob Clune has not been renewed for the upcoming season.  An extremely disappointing and unpopular decision by the AD as all current and former Gators strongly support Rob. 

Shockingly seems like a pretty good description!    :o

Firing a guy that was a serious candidate for NCAC Coach of the year?   ???

At least he got to send off all of his seniors on the team this year.

Question.  If Clune is named COY, does Mitchell still have the stones to not renew Clune's contract?

Best of luck to Coach Clune and his family.  As acgator mentioned, he was a stand-up coach.  I'm sure it won't take long for him to land another coaching postition.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: acgator98 on March 09, 2010, 09:54:05 AM
As a former player and coach,  I was always reluctant to get involved with this forum, believing that it was not in the best interest of the team to share any of my knowledge with the public.  It's not the case these days, so I feel more comfortable returning to this board in the future.

http://www.meadvilletribune.com/sports/local_story_068002235.htm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 09, 2010, 09:54:49 AM
Well, for the 3rd game in a row, Bryan Wickliffe gets to go head to head with a conference POY!  He took on O'Keefe who was the PAC player of the year in the first round of the tournament.   Then he had to follow that up with going up against the 6'9" WIAC player of the year on Saturday in the 2nd round of the tournament.  And now, Wick's reward is to go up against the ODAC POY.  Sanborn will be yet another challenge for Wick, but I'm betting that Wick is relishing the opportunity to go up against another big that should have their way against the smaller Wooster big.  I just can't get over how improved Wick has become this year compared to where he was even last year!  Especially on the defensive end of the floor.  Night and day improvement IMO!  Keep it up Wick!

As for the other matchups in Friday's game, Guilford doesn't appear to be that big outside of Sanborn.  I'm just going by the stats, but it looks as though Guilford goes with a 3 guard starting lineup with Sanborn at center and then they have their 2nd tallest guy in the starting lineup listed as a 6'4" F.  And then, looking at the bench, it appears that their biggest guys coming off the bench are forwards listed at 6'4" and 6'2" with their other 2 predominant subs being guards?  Is it just me, or does Wooster appear to match up rather favorably with this team outside of Sanborn?

It also appears to me that Guilford seems to be a 3 headed monster with Sanborn leading the way in scoring (19 ppg) followed closely by their 2 guards in Henson and Bonner (18 and 15 respectively).  Those 3 players account for 52 of Guilfords 81 ppg average!  And from there, the scoring drops off significantly as reserve guard Pittman is the team's 4th leading scorer at just under 7 ppg.

One stat that stood out to me was how many 3's their two star guards make.  Henson has 88 treys while Bonner has 68.  While that is a lot of made 3-pointers, what's more telling is how many attempts they put up.  Henson has a whopping 237 attempts meaning he's shooting just 37% from deep.  I guess that would fall under the category of a streaky shooter?  Bonner is a bit more accurate as he's shooting at 44% from deep.  But to me, it seems that this team loves the inside out game.  Get the ball down low to Sanborn and when the defense collapses he kicks it out to an open guard waiting to launch it from deep.  Kind of reminds me of Witt this season.

One thing Wooster does have going for it is that going up against a talented big man will be nothing new for them.  If anything, Wooster couldn't have asked for 2 better games to prepare them for what they will be facing with Sanborn and Guilford on Friday.  

I don't know what it is, but I just like the way Wooster matches up with this team.  If Wooster continues to play the high level of defense they have been playing, the Scots will be tough to beat.  I also don't think Wooster can afford an off night shooting.  With Sanborn's presense in the middle, it's going to make it tough for Franks to get anything inside, so when he drives and dishes it out, those guys on the outside are going to HAVE to knock down their shots.  If Wooster's shooters are on, I like our chances.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 09, 2010, 10:03:04 AM
Quote from: acgator98 on March 09, 2010, 09:54:05 AM
As a former player and coach,  I was always reluctant to get involved with this forum, believing that it was not in the best interest of the team to share any of my knowledge with the public.  It's not the case these days, so I feel more comfortable returning to this board in the future.

http://www.meadvilletribune.com/sports/local_story_068002235.htm


FYI, your link for that article doesn't seem to work.  This link should work:

Meadville Tribune Story (http://www.meadvilletribune.com/sports/local_story_068002235.html?keyword=topstory)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sludge on March 09, 2010, 01:52:24 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 09, 2010, 09:54:49 AM
Well, for the 3rd game in a row, Bryan Wickliffe gets to go head to head with a conference POY!  
...
One thing Wooster does have going for it is that going up against a talented big man will be nothing new for them.  If anything, Wooster couldn't have asked for 2 better games to prepare them for what they will be facing with Sanborn and Guilford on Friday.  
...
If Wooster's shooters are on, I like our chances.

Bryan Wickliffe is about to face a serious national POY candidate.  This will be something different than what he has seen.

The advantage that I forsee for Guilford in the paint goes beyond "just" Sanborn.  When you are done pushing him around (good luck), you've got fine tough forwards and swingmen to deal with, and after them, you've got the guards.  For Guilford, everyone scores in the paint.  And absolutely everyone rebounds.

I am still concerned about your talent and your shooters, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 09, 2010, 03:03:30 PM
Quote from: sludge on March 09, 2010, 01:52:24 PM

Bryan Wickliffe is about to face a serious national POY candidate.  This will be something different than what he has seen.

He went toe to toe against the WIAC Player of the Year last Saturday.  I know the ODAC is a very good league, but we're talking about the POY from arguably the toughest conference in the country.  I'd hardly consider Mitchell from Whitewater chopped liver?!  Unless Sanborn is Shaquile O'niel, I wouldn't go as far as to say that Sanborn will be something drastically different than the two talented bigs he faced over the weekend?!

Quote from: sludge on March 09, 2010, 01:52:24 PM
The advantage that I forsee for Guilford in the paint goes beyond "just" Sanborn.  When you are done pushing him around (good luck), you've got fine tough forwards and swingmen to deal with, and after them, you've got the guards.  For Guilford, everyone scores in the paint.  And absolutely everyone rebounds.

I am still concerned about your talent and your shooters, though.


Everyone scores in the paint?  Because it looks like most of your scoring is done by 3 guys as I touched on above.  And of those 3, two of them seem to like to do most of their scoring beyond the arc. 

And Guilford may be a good rebounding team.  I never said anything to the contrary.  I was just basing my observation by the fact that Guilford's tallest players based on minutes played after Sanborn are 6'4", 6'4" and 6'2" and all of your guards or 'swingmen' as you want to call them are all between 6'-6'2".  By comparison, Wooster's starting lineup goes 6'5", 6'7" on the inside. And our 3 guard lineup goes 6'4", 6'2" and 6'1".  And our two smaller guards have the ability to jump out of the gym.  Not to mention, Wooster has even more height coming off the bench with available subs coming in at 6'7", 6'5" and 6'8".  Obviously Guilford can rebound as they are a +12 in that category while averaging 43 rpg.  Of course, having a guy on your team that snags 15 rpg by himself doesn't hurt that statistic.  ::)  On the other hand, Wooster's leading rebounder is averaging just over 7rpg of the more than 37 rpg Wooster has been averaging.  So, I think it could be argued that 'absolutely everyone' rebounds for Wooster as well...

Look, I'm not saying I don't think Guilford is very good.  It's going to take one of Wooster's best efforts to win this game.  I was just stating my opinion that I feel, on paper, that Wooster appears to match up very well with Guilford.  And as evidenced by Wooster's win over a very good Whitewater team, the Scots are capable of beating anyone on any given night!  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ArmingtonCave on March 09, 2010, 03:12:17 PM
The key to the Scots winning, as always is limiting turnovers and shooting the three.  If we start out cold shooting we are in trouble.  Franks, Balch and Fagan have to be on top of their shots, Johnson has got to dribble the ball closer to his body (that drives me nuts sometimes) and Hallowell and Wick need to block out on rebounds.   I like our chances as we aren't scared of anyone and beat Witt and Wabash in very hostile gyms.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 09, 2010, 03:13:15 PM
Wonder if Mike DeWitt has any tips on playing Guilford? OWU played them very close at the Marietta Tournament, although that was over two months ago. Of course, the refs can just do the visiting team a favor and call a couple of quick fouls on Sanborn.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sludge on March 09, 2010, 03:27:25 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 09, 2010, 03:03:30 PM
Quote from: sludge on March 09, 2010, 01:52:24 PM

Bryan Wickliffe is about to face a serious national POY candidate.  This will be something different than what he has seen.

He went toe to toe against the WIAC Player of the Year last Saturday.  I know the ODAC is a very good league, but we're talking about the POY from arguably the toughest conference in the country.  I'd hardly consider Mitchell from Whitewater chopped liver?!  Unless Sanborn is Shaquile O'niel, I wouldn't go as far as to say that Sanborn will be something drastically different than the two talented bigs he faced over the weekend?!

Quote from: sludge on March 09, 2010, 01:52:24 PM
The advantage that I forsee for Guilford in the paint goes beyond "just" Sanborn.  When you are done pushing him around (good luck), you've got fine tough forwards and swingmen to deal with, and after them, you've got the guards.  For Guilford, everyone scores in the paint.  And absolutely everyone rebounds.

I am still concerned about your talent and your shooters, though.


Everyone scores in the paint?  Because it looks like most of your scoring is done by 3 guys as I touched on above.  And of those 3, two of them seem to like to do most of their scoring beyond the arc. 

And Guilford may be a good rebounding team.  I never said anything to the contrary.  I was just basing my observation by the fact that Guilford's tallest players based on minutes played after Sanborn are 6'4", 6'4" and 6'2" and all of your guards or 'swingmen' as you want to call them are all between 6'-6'2".  By comparison, Wooster's starting lineup goes 6'5", 6'7" on the inside. And our 3 guard lineup goes 6'4", 6'2" and 6'1".  And our two smaller guards have the ability to jump out of the gym.  Not to mention, Wooster has even more height coming off the bench with available subs coming in at 6'7", 6'5" and 6'8".  Obviously Guilford can rebound as they are a +12 in that category while averaging 43 rpg.  Of course, having a guy on your team that snags 15 rpg by himself doesn't hurt that statistic.  ::)  On the other hand, Wooster's leading rebounder is averaging just over 7rpg of the more than 37 rpg Wooster has been averaging.  So, I think it could be argued that 'absolutely everyone' rebounds for Wooster as well...

Look, I'm not saying I don't think Guilford is very good.  It's going to take one of Wooster's best efforts to win this game.  I was just stating my opinion that I feel, on paper, that Wooster appears to match up very well with Guilford.  And as evidenced by Wooster's win over a very good Whitewater team, the Scots are capable of beating anyone on any given night!  8-)

That's what I'm afraid of.  Should be a great game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sludge on March 09, 2010, 09:28:06 PM
OK, I watched those clips from the Wooster - Whitewater game.  I understand you are deadly from three point range, no doubt about it,  but... what was up with all those drives into the lane?  Where the heck was Whitewater's D on those?

Guilford will have to play better defense than Whitewater did, or it will be Guilford toast by the end of the third.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 09, 2010, 09:30:58 PM
Guilford has an interesting basketball history. They were NAIA for a long time, and had a number of good teams. They also had a couple of famous players, including M.L. Carr and World B. Free. Former Wake Forest coach Dave Odom is also an alum.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guilford_College#Notable_alumni
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hasanova on March 09, 2010, 10:33:28 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 09, 2010, 09:30:58 PM
Guilford has an interesting basketball history. They were NAIA for a long time, and had a number of good teams. They also had a couple of famous players, including M.L. Carr and World B. Free. Former Wake Forest coach Dave Odom is also an alum.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guilford_College#Notable_alumni
Two other NBA players would be Bob Kauffman and Greg Jackson.  Carr and Free were a Senior and a Freshman, respectively, on the 1973 national champions.  I was a Junior that season, so I saw a lot of great basketball!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 10, 2010, 12:02:16 PM
Great article on Ian Franks in today's Wooster Daily Record:

Unintimidating, but awfully good (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4785698)

Hard to believe he wasn't even recruited by Moore and his staff!  David, I know you joked about kids walking on in division III, but I would consider this about as close as you could get to a D3 walk-on.  Franks just showed up for practice to try and make the team his freshman year and the rest is history!

I also found this quote somewhat amusing from the article:

Quote from: Ian Franks"We always joke as a team that we might be the most unintimidating team in America."

This is so true.  :D  With Franks especially, but I've never seen a team act so ho-hum after making a great play or after getting a hoop and harm.  :)  Brandon did show some emotion last Saturday after getting a basket to go and a foul.  But, Franks got a hoop and harm earlier and he just walked back to the line and gave some teammates fives like it was just no big deal.   :)  That's just the way Franks is.  He's not a rah-rah, fire the team up kind of player and really, there aren't any with this type of personality on this team.  I've seen Brandon get fired up every once in a while and Nathan shows some emotion as does Wick every now and again, but for the most part, this team just goes about their business and lets their play do the talking.  And really, that is kind of refreshing in a way when you compare it to the jackass from Whitewater last week.  I'd much rater see players that let their play do the talking as opposed to players that don't know when to shut up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 10, 2010, 01:03:18 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 10, 2010, 12:02:16 PM
Great article on Ian Franks in today's Wooster Daily Record:

Unintimidating, but awfully good (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4785698)

Wow! A Michael Harper reference! And it's spot-on and fits the context! And a Tedder and Rowlinson reference, too. Coach Moore really knows his D3 history.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 10, 2010, 01:24:45 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 10, 2010, 01:03:18 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 10, 2010, 12:02:16 PM
Great article on Ian Franks in today's Wooster Daily Record:

Unintimidating, but awfully good (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4785698)

Wow! A Michael Harper reference! And it's spot-on and fits the context! And a Tedder and Rowlinson reference, too. Coach Moore really knows his D3 history.

The year Tedder and Rowlinson were leading OWU to their National Championship was Moore's first year at Wooster so I'm sure he became real familiar with how talented those 2 were for the Bishops.

Also, seeing that he played for Witt and then went on to be an assistant for the Tigers back in the 70's, I'm sure he was also quite familiar with how good of a program North Park had going at that time as well.

Not to mention, when you've been involved in D3 basketball for as long as Moore has including the last 26 years as a head coach at the D3 level, you're bound to pick up a thing or two wrt D3 basketball history.  :)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 10, 2010, 03:47:01 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 10, 2010, 01:24:45 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 10, 2010, 01:03:18 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 10, 2010, 12:02:16 PM
Great article on Ian Franks in today's Wooster Daily Record:

Unintimidating, but awfully good (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4785698)

Wow! A Michael Harper reference! And it's spot-on and fits the context! And a Tedder and Rowlinson reference, too. Coach Moore really knows his D3 history.

Also, seeing that he played for Witt and then went on to be an assistant for the Tigers back in the 70's, I'm sure he was also quite familiar with how good of a program North Park had going at that time as well.

After looking at his profile page on the Wooster site, I've figured it out: Moore was an assistant coach under Larry Hunter at Wittenberg from 1976-81. In 1980 Wittenberg was in the Final Four with North Park, although they didn't play each other (North Park beat Longwood and Upsala beat Wittenberg in the semifinals; Wittenberg beat Longwood in the consolation game and North Park beat Upsala in the championship game). This is undoubtedly how he became familiar with Harper's story, since, of course, Harper was the primus inter pares of the three All-Americans who played for North Park in that Final Four.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on March 11, 2010, 09:17:33 AM
Yeah, absolutely fantastic article on Franks today.  Congrats!!

Now, in terms of the Scots chances this weekend.  They can get Guilford.  Not sure if anyone has ever been to the barn down there, but its a decent gym.  Backdrop makes it interesting for shooters.  With that being said, the Scots are going to have to do 3 things (no brainers)

1) Control the glass
2) Control the tempo
3) Hallowell is going to need to show up and have a game.  Franks and the other guys have really been carrying the Scots.  If JH can step it up and give more offensively- because Guilford will do all it can to clamp down on Franks, then the Scots will come away with a big game. I don't think GC is expecting Hallowell to have a good game, and boy oh boy is he due!!!

LETS GO SCOTS!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sludge on March 11, 2010, 04:02:27 PM
Quote from: WooHoopsntrack01 on March 11, 2010, 09:17:33 AM
Yeah, absolutely fantastic article on Franks today.  Congrats!!

Now, in terms of the Scots chances this weekend.  They can get Guilford.  Not sure if anyone has ever been to the barn down there, but its a decent gym.  Backdrop makes it interesting for shooters.  With that being said, the Scots are going to have to do 3 things (no brainers)

1) Control the glass
2) Control the tempo
3) Hallowell is going to need to show up and have a game.  Franks and the other guys have really been carrying the Scots.  If JH can step it up and give more offensively- because Guilford will do all it can to clamp down on Franks, then the Scots will come away with a big game. I don't think GC is expecting Hallowell to have a good game, and boy oh boy is he due!!!

LETS GO SCOTS!!!!

Just curious, what tempo would be your preference?

I think Guilford is pretty tempo agnostic, with maybe a preference to run.  We can certainly grind out half court when we need to.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 11, 2010, 05:51:19 PM
Quote from: sludge on March 11, 2010, 04:02:27 PM

Just curious, what tempo would be your preference?

I think Guilford is pretty tempo agnostic, with maybe a preference to run.  We can certainly grind out half court when we need to.

I'd say Wooster would prefer an up-tempo game.  That said, they to can play a more deliberate half-court set if needed.  Just look at last weekend's games for a perfect example.  Grove City dictated the tempo and Wooster struggled to put the Wolverines away with the slower tempo Grove City was playing.  Conversely, the next night vs. a much better team in Whitewater, the Warhawks allowed the pace to be a bit more wide open and Wooster was thriving building up as much as a 16 point lead in the 2nd half before Whitewater tried to pull off another miracle comeback?!  ::)

Wooster has had success playing both up-tempo and more of a grind it out style, but I think it's safe to say the Scots would prefer to get out and run when they have the chance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 11, 2010, 07:12:42 PM
Coach Moore will be on Hoopsville tonight...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 11, 2010, 10:00:58 PM
I put together the stats and rosters for the teams in the Guilford Sectional. 

They can be accessed here:  http://www.jtaswell.com/D3BB/2010_Guilford_Sectional.htm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sludge on March 12, 2010, 07:24:54 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 11, 2010, 10:00:58 PM
I put together the stats and rosters for the teams in the Guilford Sectional. 

They can be accessed here:  http://www.jtaswell.com/D3BB/2010_Guilford_Sectional.htm

Thanks for that excellent presentation of thoses stats, imderekpoe.   Really nice layout.

For a running team, Wooster doesn't score all that much.  It looks like the running-est team in the Guilford sectional is... Eastern Mennonite.  That's believable to me.

It looks like Wooster is actually getting it done more with defense.  Interesting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 12, 2010, 07:31:29 AM
I'm hitting the road in a few minutes!  With any luck we'll find our way to Greensboro in time for the first game tonight!

Go Scots!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 12, 2010, 09:45:48 AM
Have a safe trip imderekpoe.  You're gonna have a good time down there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 10:10:22 AM
Quote from: sludge on March 12, 2010, 07:24:54 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 11, 2010, 10:00:58 PM
I put together the stats and rosters for the teams in the Guilford Sectional. 

They can be accessed here:  http://www.jtaswell.com/D3BB/2010_Guilford_Sectional.htm

For a running team, Wooster doesn't score all that much.  It looks like the running-est team in the Guilford sectional is... Eastern Mennonite.  That's believable to me.

It looks like Wooster is actually getting it done more with defense.   Interesting.


Wooster's offensive numbers didn't really start to click until about the last month of the season.  One of our Wooster regulars in here (seinfeld) made a point earlier that he felt as though there seemed to be a turning point in the season wrt the offense finally clicking and it was at the half of Wooster's first game with Hiram and I happen to agree.  Wooster was only averaging just under 69 ppg in their 17 games leading up to that game.  Wooster only held a 26-24 lead at the half, but the Scots came out and blitzed Hiram in the 2nd half to the tune of 41-19!  And since that game the Scots have been averaging almost 79 ppg!

And this team has excelled defesnively more than any Wooster team in recent memory.  Wooster has never had trouble scoring points and they've always been good defensively, but I just don't ever remember a Wooster team getting after it on the defensive end of the floor like this year's team!

So, when you combine how good they've been playing defensively with an offense that has finally seemed to gel over the last month of the season, I think you have the makings of a very dangerous team come tournament time as Whitewater already found out.   8-)

BTW, 8 o'clock can't get here soon enough!!!  Good luck to all four teams tonight and safe travels to all that are making the trek down to GREENSBORO!  (hasanova, that was for you  :D   ;) )
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 12, 2010, 10:26:16 AM
Guilford students are on spring break, but according to this article (http://www.news-record.com/content/2010/03/12/article/no_students_no_problem_for_quakers), the women's lacrosse team will be there, so that should be a wash. :)

Looking over imderekpoe stats quickly, I noticed something interesting. What it means, if anything, I don't know. Guilford has been called for 74 less fouls than Wooster in the same number of games, and 113 less fouls than their opponents. Only one Guilford player has fouled out, and that was a guard off the bench. Sanborn, despite his size, is not a magnet for fouls. He averages less than two fouls per game.

Wooster, on the other hand, has actually committed five more fouls than their opponents, and have had nine players foul out. What Wooster's foul totals show, in part, is that the Scots do not get favorable treatment from the refs despite their winning tradition. Considering they are leading at the end of most games, forcing other teams to foul, Wooster still has more fouls called against them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hasanova on March 12, 2010, 10:41:44 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 10:10:22 AM
BTW, 8 o'clock can't get here soon enough!!!  Good luck to all four teams tonight and safe travels to all that are making the trek down to GREENSBORO!  (hasanova, that was for you  :D   ;) )
Thanks.   There's probably a game somewhere in Charlotte, but it won't be the Scots and the Quakers!  lol
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hasanova on March 12, 2010, 10:48:20 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 12, 2010, 10:26:16 AM
Guilford students are on spring break, but according to this article (http://www.news-record.com/content/2010/03/12/article/no_students_no_problem_for_quakers), the women's lacrosse team will be there, so that should be a wash. :)

Looking over imderekpoe stats quickly, I noticed something interesting. What it means, if anything, I don't know. Guilford has been called for 74 less fouls than Wooster in the same number of games, and 113 less fouls than their opponents. Only one Guilford player has fouled out, and that was a guard off the bench. Sanborn, despite his size, is not a magnet for fouls. He averages less than two fouls per game.

Wooster, on the other hand, has actually committed five more fouls than their opponents, and have had nine players foul out. What Wooster's foul totals show, in part, is that the Scots do not get favorable treatment from the refs despite their winning tradition. Considering they are leading at the end of most games, forcing other teams to foul, Wooster still has more fouls called against them.
The baseball and softball teams are in town also, so I think they'll be there.  Hopefully, students who live within reasonable driving distance will also make the trip back to campus.

Regarding the fouls, perhaps the Scots "don't get favorable treatment from the refs," but it can also mean some flaws in their defensive technique.  I haven't seen CoW play this season, so it'll be interesting to see how the game's called tonight. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 12, 2010, 12:04:56 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 12, 2010, 10:26:16 AM
Wooster, on the other hand, has actually committed five more fouls than their opponents, and have had nine players foul out. What Wooster's foul totals show, in part, is that the Scots do not get favorable treatment from the refs despite their winning tradition.

Seriously with this?  Wooster has been called for more fouls than their opponents, ergo, Wooster is getting jammed by the officials.  It couldn't be that Wooster is just fouling more than the other team....nope.  They must be getting snowed.

A huge peeve of mine when it comes to basketball is this notion that game officials are somehow obligated to make sure that the team fouls are even.  Wrong.  Game officials are obligated to call fouls when fouls happen.  If one team fouls more, then one team fouls more. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 12, 2010, 12:23:51 PM
Wally, thanks for showing up. That post was for you and other Wabash guys, including the SID and coaches, who imply that Wooster gets calls, and that the Ohio teams get calls at the NCAC Tournament. You have even put it in your past posts. Sorry your highness doesn't think that pointing out that Wooster gets called for a lot of fouls is not appropriate comment. Maybe I should review some of the game film of Wooster that you apparently have and I don't.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 12:25:19 PM
Thanks for the well wishes wally...  ::)  Nice to see the NCAC support out there for Wooster.   :-\

BTW, why are you still lurking in the basketball forum anyways?  I figured your attention would be 100% on football once Wabash was ousted from the tournament...

And what part of seinfeld's post did he complain about getting jammed by the officials?  You and your fellow Wabash supporters are the ones constantly whining about how unfair it is that all of the big bad Ohio schools in the NCAC seem to have an unfair advantage when it comes to officials having it out for Indiana schools.  I think seinfeld just pointed out, that based on the numbers, it doesn't appear that there is any favoritism being shown to Wooster.  So, maybe you should try and start coming up with some new conspiracy theories this offseason?!?!   :-*
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 12, 2010, 01:07:06 PM
I'll attempt to offer some sort of comment that I think is relevant, but I do so with trepidation out of fear that I'm secretly blaming the refs or some other entity that feels this information has no meaning. Others have already pointed this out, but turnovers, without oversimplifying, has been the death of Wooster in all its tournament games in the 2000s. Check out these numbers:

2009:  Capital - 14
2008:  Washington U. - 13
2007:  Amherst - 15
2007:  Washington U. (consolation game) - 15
2006:  Transy - 16
2005:  Albion - 16
2004:  JCU - 20
2003:  Williams - 22
2001:  Carthage - 12
2000:  Calvin - 20

Their lowest total is 12 turnovers, and five times they had 16 or more. Average is 16.3 turnovers per game. Wooster is going to have to keep it around 10 turnovers if they are going to win, IMHO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 01:13:24 PM
seinfeld,

Do you have the numbers for tournament wins?  Personally, I don't think anything under 15 turnovers in a ballgame is all that bad.  Especially when you consider that most teams you will run across come tournament time more than likely play pretty solid defense.

I'm just asking because I know that Wooster averaged 16.5 turnovers in their two wins over the weekend including 19 vs Whitewater.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 12, 2010, 03:18:52 PM
Sorry for not jumping on the Wooster bandwagon, fellas.  It would be insincere of me to jump on here and start banging the drum for the Scots because frankly, I'm completely indifferent about what Wooster does in the tournament.  Whether the Scots lose in the first round or win the whole thing, it really doesn't do much for me or for Wabash.  Don't worry...I'm not rooting against Wooster.  I'm just not really rooting in general. 

Let's review the statement, emphasis added to the key part:

Quote from: seinfeld on March 12, 2010, 10:26:16 AM
What Wooster's foul totals show, in part, is that the Scots do not get favorable treatment from the refs despite their winning tradition.

When I read that, with the qualifier "despite their winning tradition", what I'm understanding is that because Wooster has a winning tradition, they are entitled to some kind of favorable treatment.  That kind of spoiled, elitist dialogue just can't go unchecked. 

I've quit analyzing/critiquing/judging the officiating in our league.  It is what it is.  Sometimes they're good, sometimes they're bad, sometimes they're absolutely terrible.  Game officials don't win or lose games for anybody and to say otherwise is the weakest of weaksauce. 

Quote from: seinfeld on March 12, 2010, 12:23:51 PM
Sorry your highness doesn't think that pointing out that Wooster gets called for a lot of fouls is not appropriate comment. Maybe I should review some of the game film of Wooster that you apparently have and I don't.

Maybe, and I know this is radical so I want you to really take your time and think about it before you respond, but maybe Wooster gets called for a lot of fouls because...wait for it....they commit a lot of fouls.  Why does it have to be that they're getting picked on by the officials?  Why can't it just simply be that they get called for fouls because they commit fouls?  Does that make way too much sense? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 12, 2010, 04:24:36 PM
ScotsFan,

You actually made a good point that I didn't think too much about. You're right, in their last 12 tournament wins, they have averaged 15.4 turnovers per game, so there isn't much difference. Although this average is inflated by one game -- Ramapo in 2003, when they committed 28 turnovers and still won. There was also an overtime game against Brockport St. where they committed 14.

So I'm probably overstating the impact of the raw number of turnovers, although just because they are in the tournament shouldn't necessarily mean they turn the ball over that much more. What is more important is the number of turnovers committed vs. the number of turnovers created. Don't have the time to go into that now. The bottom line, I still believe, especially on the road against a really good team, is to maximize attempts. Wooster has shown they can get open looks against anyone, they just need to make sure not to waste possessions.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 12, 2010, 05:41:10 PM
A "winning tradition" shouldn't mean squat. A team with a more aggressive defense will get called for more fouls. A team that plays a passive zone will get called for less fouls. There is no evidence that Wooster gets less favorable treatment based on the raw foul call totals.

For example, Denison was called for 10 less fouls in the game at Wooster. In the last 10 minutes, Wooster outfouled Denison 9-2. The 20+ point lead was not in jeopardy despite the numerical disparity.

Against Carnegie Mellon, Wooster outfouled their guests 25-19. Most of those fouls occurred in the second half - 7 in the last 10 minutes while the Scots held a double digit lead.

When the Scots whapped Wabash in December, Wooster outfouled the LG's 19-16.

In the losses for Wooster, they committed more fouls only 3 times out of 5. So even the supposition that a losing team fouls more is shaky at best and an invalid hypothesis at worst.

Save the hyperbole, please, about Wooster not getting the benefit of the doubt, especially when using a line like 'despite their winning tradition'.




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 06:21:52 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 12, 2010, 04:24:36 PM
The bottom line, I still believe, especially on the road against a really good team, is to maximize attempts. Wooster has shown they can get open looks against anyone, they just need to make sure not to waste possessions.

Oh, I agree completely.  I wasn't trying to imply that the Scots can be completely careless with the basketball and get away with it.  Especially on the road against a good team.  As I said.  I think if the Scots can limit their turnovers to under 15, I'll be happy with that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 06:37:26 PM
And seinfeld's point went completely over your heads.  Surprise surprise?! 

Once again, he wasn't trying to imply that Wooster's winning tradition should grant them preferential treatment!  I don't know how to spell it out any better for you?!  His point was to show that despite the conspiracy theorists crawling out of their caves in Crawfordsville crying that they are at an unfair advantage because they are the outsiders from Indiana and all the big bad Ohio schools have some sort of arrangement with the NCAC officials, Wooster seems to still be called for more fouls than their opponents!  Thanks for once again reading into something that wasn't there and blowing it completely out of proportion though...

BTW wally.  Have you ever heard of the term conference loyalty???  Apparently they don't teach you that in Indiana either???  But, I guess since you and your other Wallies were late joining the NCAC party and never have felt like you have been fully embraced by the conference, I can understand your lack of conference loyalty.  :-\ 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 12, 2010, 07:20:06 PM
Basketball hasn't been kind to Indianans lately.  Maybe Wally just needs someone to take his frustrations out on.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on March 12, 2010, 07:20:51 PM
In the spirit of conference loyalty - GO SCOTS!!!  I don't know a thing about Guilford, but in looking at the stats and results, they have had a lot of blow out wins and not a lot of close games.  They either are unbelievably good or they don't really play anybody.  

Seems to me you have a big guy to contend with that scores and rebounds a lot, but can't shoot free throws.  Gee, what do you do with somebody like that?  

Good luck Wooster fans.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 12, 2010, 07:38:43 PM
What I want to see during basketball season is Wabash winning and getting into the national tournament.  It's been far, far too long since that has happened.  If Wooster winning tournament games helps Wabash do that, then I'm all for it.  But that's ludicrous and as such I'm entirely indifferent to what Wooster does in the tournament.  Again, I don't want to see Wooster lose...I just don't care either way.  I'm just being honest and I don't see how that's a crime. 

It might be time for you guys to let go of all of this conspiracy theory stuff.  There are no arrangements, the league isn't out to get Wabash, Wabash isn't an outsider...there are no conspiracies.  It's just basketball fellas.  Nothing more, nothing less. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 12, 2010, 08:18:49 PM
Guilford's Ragan-Brown Field House looks an awful lot like OWU's Branch Rickey Arena, except with a higher ceiling.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ArmingtonCave on March 12, 2010, 08:39:06 PM
5 minutes in.  We are in for a long night.  Guilford is big and I don't think we match up very well.  Oh well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 08:42:30 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 12, 2010, 08:18:49 PM
Guilford's Ragan-Brown Field House looks an awful lot like OWU's Branch Rickey Arena, except with a higher ceiling.

Heard on the Wooster pre-game it's the same architecht.  Small world eh?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 08:46:23 PM
Quote from: ArmingtonCave on March 12, 2010, 08:39:06 PM
5 minutes in.  We are in for a long night.  Guilford is big and I don't think we match up very well.  Oh well.

Hang in there.  Still a LOT of basketball left to play.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ArmingtonCave on March 12, 2010, 08:47:15 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 08:46:23 PM
Quote from: ArmingtonCave on March 12, 2010, 08:39:06 PM
5 minutes in.  We are in for a long night.  Guilford is big and I don't think we match up very well.  Oh well.

Hang in there.  Still a LOT of basketball left to play.   :)


Oh I know. 

In a related note I played 18 holes at LC Boles this afternoon for good luck.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 09:09:26 PM
Well.  I can't quite understand Wooster's gameplan so far.  I know that Sanborn creates problems inside, but Wooster is not even trying to get the ball inside with any sort of penatration?!  As a result, they trail at the half by 18.  Ugh...  :-[

If there is a silver lining, JCU trailed last week in the 2nd half by 17 and came all the way back to take the lead.  Wooster had better make some serious halftime adjustments or this one is all but over I'm afraid.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 09:12:29 PM
Quote from: ArmingtonCave on March 12, 2010, 08:47:15 PM
In a related note I played 18 holes at LC Boles this afternoon for good luck.

How was the course?  I'd imagine it would be pretty soggy out there.  I had some thoughts of dusting the clubs off this week, but just didn't have the time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 12, 2010, 09:17:25 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 06:37:26 PM
And seinfeld's point went completely over your heads.  Surprise surprise?! 

Once again, he wasn't trying to imply that Wooster's winning tradition should grant them preferential treatment!  I don't know how to spell it out any better for you?! 

Actually, he was implying that by typing the words "despite their winning tradition" and then making another assumption regarding fouls called on losing teams are greater than fouls called on winning teams. I was trying to be neutral in my analysis.

I did not have time to look at the historical data over a period of years, nor see about score and time remaining of fouls. This year may be aberrational. Or, they could pile-up fouls when it's not close or not late, and then not foul when it's close and late. I could be all Nate Silver on it.

If you want me to do that - I can. But you gotta pay me my daily rate to do that instead of my client work.

Sorry you chose not to look deep into what I was actually saying and instead knee-jerk to partisanship.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ArmingtonCave on March 12, 2010, 09:19:25 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 09:12:29 PM
Quote from: ArmingtonCave on March 12, 2010, 08:47:15 PM
In a related note I played 18 holes at LC Boles this afternoon for good luck.

How was the course?  I'd imagine it would be pretty soggy out there.  I had some thoughts of dusting the clubs off this week, but just didn't have the time.

Actually it was in decent shape for so early in the year.  the 7th green was a mess but overall pretty good.  It was pretty busy too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 12, 2010, 09:23:30 PM
Smed,

How many Wooster games have you seen this year?

And by the way, did you guys just miss the point about losing teams usually have to foul winning teams at the end of games, therefore driving up their foul totals outside the course of normal play? Or do you just choose to ignore stuff just to make some point that has nothing to do with what the actual point was?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 12, 2010, 09:28:52 PM
It's hard to see Wooster games in Minnesota.

Did you NOT see the part in my post where in Wooster's five losses, only three times did they have more fouls than opponents. A (losing) does not seem to correlate strongly to B (fouling more). It depends on many factors. Sometimes bad defensive teams don't foul at all because they can't get close enough to their opponents. Sometimes, when you're down by double digits you don't foul, because there's no point to it.

I did check it a little. Over the past 10 seasons, Wooster has committed 34 more fouls total than their opponents. 3.4 fouls PER YEAR more, on average. Not per game, per season. I haven't gotten into W/L or anything like that, but to me there's no there there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 12, 2010, 09:36:55 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 12, 2010, 09:28:52 PMbut to me there's no there there.
From where I sit, there's not a whole lot of there anywhere in this argument.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 12, 2010, 09:40:04 PM
2010 season:

Committed more fouls than opponents: Allegheny, Earlham, Oberlin, Wooster, Wittenberg

Committed less fouls than opponents: Denison, Hiram, Kenyon, OWU, Wabash

But you know what, the margins are awfully small for the most part, at most a foul a game. Oberlin committed a whole 12 fouls more than their opponents. The moribund Quakers committed 23 more fouls this season.

If the correlation between more fouls and losses held, you'd expect Earlham to really rack up the fouls. They had a lot of losses that they didn't shoot a lot of free throws. But I think that's offensive offense for the most part.

For the most part, teams that press or play hard man-to-man get called for fouls. Teams that drive to the lane and are aggressive on offense draw more fouls. The style of play usually dictates how many fouls are called, not the score of the game.

Fouls are like penalties in football. They can be an irritant, and can lose a game, but all in all are not a season-long indicator of success when compared in a vacuum.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 12, 2010, 09:41:52 PM
Apparently tonight's game officials in Greensboro were not briefed on Wooster's winning tradition.  The Scots have been called for 6 fouls while Guilford has only been called for 4 fouls.  There's still 11 minutes left to see if they can get that evened out.  If you need me, I'll be on the edge of my seat.  

In related news, Guilford is hip deep in a what could be an absolutely epic gak job.  Can the Quakers blow a 20-point second half lead on their own floor?  It's looking very possible.  

2:29 left...Guilford leads 8-7.  In personal fouls.  I still have no idea why this is important. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 12, 2010, 09:43:36 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 12, 2010, 09:36:55 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 12, 2010, 09:28:52 PMbut to me there's no there there.
From where I sit, there's not a whole lot of there anywhere in this argument.

I haven't thrown some stats around in a while. And I haven't pounced on offhand throwaway comments. I'm getting ready for baseball season, I think!  ;)

(There's a knuckleheaded columnist or two up here who thinks that RBIs and Wins are the be all and end all and OPS and advanced pitching metrics are worthless. I can't wait to roast that argument.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 12, 2010, 09:45:54 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 12, 2010, 09:43:36 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 12, 2010, 09:36:55 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 12, 2010, 09:28:52 PMbut to me there's no there there.
From where I sit, there's not a whole lot of there anywhere in this argument.

I haven't thrown some stats around in a while. And I haven't pounced on offhand throwaway comments. I'm getting ready for baseball season, I think!  ;)

(There's a knuckleheaded columnist or two up here who thinks that RBIs and Wins are the be all and end all and OPS and advanced pitching metrics are worthless. I can't wait to roast that argument.)

VORP 'em, smed! :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 12, 2010, 10:13:06 PM
Final:  #3 Guilford  75  #17 Wooster 68  :'(

Wooster didn't have enough offense tonight.  It is hard to recover when you are down 12-0 to start the game against a quality team.  It is amazing to me that Ian Franks was scoreless in the first half and the Scots only managed 22 points total in the half.  Wooster never had the lead in this game and only got the margin as close as 5 points in the 2nd half.

Scots were led tonight by Ian Franks with 27 points and Nathan Balch with 15 points.

Rebounding also killed Wooster tonight as Guilford had 11 more boards than the Scots.  Guilford's 6'9" Center Tyler Sanborn with a 21 pts, 23 rebounds performance was too much inside for the Scots to handle.

CONGRATULATIONS to Wooster on a great season as the Scots finish 25-6!  :)

CONGRATULATIONS also to senior Brandon Johnson on finishing a great career at Wooster!  Brandon played a tremendous season after coming back from two knee surgeries!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 12, 2010, 10:17:11 PM
Guilford has defeated the Scots 75-68...despite Wooster's winning tradition. 

Very fine season for Wooster...making the final 16 is a great accomplishment. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 10:19:37 PM
All I can say is freaking Ian Franks!  Wooster gave a valiant effort coming back from 20 down at half-time and Ian Franks nearly brings the Fighting Scots back singlehandedly scoring ALL of his 27 points in the 2nd half but it just wasn't enough as Wooster comes up short.

As wsf mentioned, congrats to the Scots on yet another great season finishing 25-6 and just missing out on an appearance in the Elite 8.  I think it's safe to say with everyone coming back except Brandon Johnson, this team has the potential go even further next year!  Thanks for a great season Wooster!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 12, 2010, 10:21:38 PM
All good things must come to an end.  Congratulations to the Fighting Scots on (dare I say it?  dare! dare!) another outstanding season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 10:23:10 PM
NT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 12, 2010, 10:25:08 PM
Great job representing the NCAC at the top team in the ODAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 12, 2010, 10:27:31 PM
21 points, 23 boards is a Russell, Chamberlain, Bellamy type number. Old school. Hard to win when someone is putting that on you in the modern game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 12, 2010, 10:36:40 PM
Name calling?  Really?  Compelling stuff. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2010, 11:12:09 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 12, 2010, 10:36:40 PM
Name calling?  Really?  Compelling stuff. 

As cooler heads prevail, I've chosen to remove my post.  Still doesn't change my opinion of you from the post I removed!   Take that FWIW wally world...   :-*
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 12, 2010, 11:44:01 PM
Congratulations to Guilford on advancing to the Elite Eight. I hope they make it to the Final Four as they are a deserving team. Sanborn was as good as advertised, putting up monster numbers (is it proper to say a double score?).

Congratulations to the Wooster Scots on another fine season and a good NCAA run. I would say all Scot fans were proud of how they fought to get back in the game. The Winston Churchill quote ""Never, never, never, never give up." came to mind to me as the last minutes (and seconds) played out. To be sure it is an important lesson for the returning players.

Congratulations to Brandon Johnson.  In the early part of the season when the Scots were struggling he showed the heart of a leader. In the final stretch he showed his trademark defense. His Wooster career is complete and his legacy as one of the Scots best is secure.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sludge on March 13, 2010, 12:08:31 AM
I was impressed by Wooster tonight, the way there was no folding whatsoever.  The endgame had more suspense than I expected, and the Wooster strategy at end was tight.  It took really excellent free throw shooting and rebounding to bring that game home for Guilford.  Really fine team, Wooster.  Wow, what a comeback.

The first half, Wooster was just snake bit, and Guilford defense was part of the reason;  cold shooting was the other part of the reason. 

I thought that in general Wickliffe did a good job all game of putting his body on Sanborn, but it didn't sufffice.  He is a bit different from what you've seen.

Guilford didn't have a great shooting game, and I think alot of that was Wooster's defense.

Nice fans too, I enjoyed meeting people.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: armadillosports on March 13, 2010, 12:40:07 AM
The Allegheny situation is a mess; the female AD (former Olympic swimmer) gave no valid reasons for the firing. People on campus/in community aren't happy, and even after a week, the move hasn't been posted on the school's website. When asked why, the AD gave some garbage about ".....protecting the coach's privacy." Complete BS. Politics at its worst. Like she gives a rat's ass about a guy she just fired for no good reason.

Did the coach work at his job? Yes.
Is he honest? Yes.
Is he competent? Yes.
Are there skeletons in closet that would make this legit? Hell no.
Is the AD out to get certain people? Could be.

If the AD knew anything about team sports, she would know that just about every team has a player or two that doesn't like the coach, even big-time teams. Duke has had kids transfer out, so has just about every school.

Its a sad day when this happens anywhere, but especially in D-III, where sports are supposed to be more fun.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hasanova on March 13, 2010, 12:51:26 AM
Quote from: goscots on March 12, 2010, 11:44:01 PM
Congratulations to Guilford on advancing to the Elite Eight. I hope they make it to the Final Four as they are a deserving team. Sanborn was as good as advertised, putting up monster numbers (is it proper to say a double score?).
Good question, by the way, but a double-double is the customary way to say it ... and it's been said a lot this year at Guilford, as Tyler Sanborn's had 28 of them in 31 games!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 13, 2010, 01:01:10 AM
Quote from: hasanova on March 13, 2010, 12:51:26 AM
Quote from: goscots on March 12, 2010, 11:44:01 PM
Congratulations to Guilford on advancing to the Elite Eight. I hope they make it to the Final Four as they are a deserving team. Sanborn was as good as advertised, putting up monster numbers (is it proper to say a double score?).
Good question, by the way, but a double-double is the customary way to say it ... and it's been said a lot this year at Guilford, as Tyler Sanborn's had 28 of them in 31 games!

"Double score" was referring, of course, to both totals being over twenty.  While confusing, I thought it a clever invention.  Has Sanborn had any other 'double scores' this year (or ever)?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 13, 2010, 01:06:02 AM
How about an infamous 'treble score' - 20 pts, 20 rebounds, 20 assists? That ever been done?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 13, 2010, 01:09:01 AM
Quote from: armadillosports on March 13, 2010, 12:40:07 AM
The Allegheny situation is a mess; the female AD (former Olympic swimmer) gave no valid reasons for the firing. People on campus/in community aren't happy, and even after a week, the move hasn't been posted on the school's website. When asked why, the AD gave some garbage about ".....protecting the coach's privacy." Complete BS. Politics at its worst. Like she gives a rat's ass about a guy she just fired for no good reason.

Did the coach work at his job? Yes.
Is he honest? Yes.
Is he competent? Yes.
Are there skeletons in closet that would make this legit? Hell no.
Is the AD out to get certain people? Could be.

If the AD knew anything about team sports, she would know that just about every team has a player or two that doesn't like the coach, even big-time teams. Duke has had kids transfer out, so has just about every school.

Its a sad day when this happens anywhere, but especially in D-III, where sports are supposed to be more fun.

Something is fishy somewhere in Meadville.

Denison having an 'extensive national search' for a football coach which led them to their D-coordinator for a defense that gave up 30 or more points in 5 of their 10 games.

What is going on in NCAC land, anyway?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sludge on March 13, 2010, 01:53:45 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 13, 2010, 01:01:10 AM
"Double score" was referring, of course, to both totals being over twenty.  While confusing, I thought it a clever invention.  Has Sanborn had any other 'double scores' this year (or ever)?

Yes he has.  I call it a double double double.  10 and 10 would be a double double, and this is twice that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on March 13, 2010, 10:55:15 AM
GREAT season for the Scots particularly after the way they started.  Happy for the guys, and boy did Franks solidify himself as one of the finest players in Woo history.  In all truth, he reminds me of another young man who finished his career very well with the Scots by the name of Steve Thompson.  Steve grew and came out of no where to really step up and play well!  What do you guys think?

Great job fellas and this should be an interesting summer for the Scots. 

The EMU- Guilford game will be a dandy
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hasanova on March 13, 2010, 12:52:44 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 13, 2010, 01:01:10 AM
Quote from: hasanova on March 13, 2010, 12:51:26 AM
Quote from: goscots on March 12, 2010, 11:44:01 PM
Congratulations to Guilford on advancing to the Elite Eight. I hope they make it to the Final Four as they are a deserving team. Sanborn was as good as advertised, putting up monster numbers (is it proper to say a double score?).
Good question, by the way, but a double-double is the customary way to say it ... and it's been said a lot this year at Guilford, as Tyler Sanborn's had 28 of them in 31 games!

"Double score" was referring, of course, to both totals being over twenty.  While confusing, I thought it a clever invention.  Has Sanborn had any other 'double scores' this year (or ever)?
Ah, now I get it.  Didn't Lincoln do that four score and seven years ago?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 13, 2010, 04:28:03 PM
I think Lincoln put up 10 score and it was more like five years ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 13, 2010, 06:15:32 PM
Very well-played, Patrick!

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fjeffpicard.com%2Fblog%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2008%2F06%2Frim-shot-johnny-utah.jpg&hash=51241847dc0f06727408d615d5212fc9aecff0fb)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 15, 2010, 06:46:59 PM
I was out of the country last week, so I'm a bit late to the party, but I want to congratulate the Scots on another fine season.  It was a good year in NCAC play, and looks like it'll be another good year next year, too.

Good luck to Brandon Johnson with his post-Wooster endeavors, and good luck also to Guilford in the final four, as teams that beat Wooster in the tourney have a good track record of going on to win the thing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 16, 2010, 12:17:56 PM
Ian Franks continues to pile up the awards this season.

Congratulations to Franks on making 1st Team All-GL Region as well as being named the D3hoops.com Great Lakes Region Player of the Year.  :)  Congrats also goes out to Bryan Wickliffe who joins Franks on the GL All-Region as he made 3rd Team All-GL Region.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 16, 2010, 03:38:37 PM
Franks joins Tom Port and James Cooper as the third Wooster player to gain Player of the Year honors from the Great Lakes.

Not bad, since d3hoops.com has only been naming a regional POY for 5 years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 17, 2010, 08:56:33 PM
Congratulations to Franks and Wickliffe on their achievement; and to Wabash's Wes Smith as well, also named to the D3hoops.com all-GL 3rd team alongside Wickliffe. (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fhappy-smiley-8769.gif&hash=aeb289e67220f3813c231bcf5c375101dc1b9252)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 17, 2010, 10:32:31 PM
A bit more for Mr. Franks' trophy case:
The NABC has named Ian Franks the Great Lakes Region Player of the Year (http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/nabc/genrel/auto_pdf/2010D3All-District.pdf), which means, in the way the NABC goes about this, that he's a first-team All-American (http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/nabc/genrel/auto_pdf/2010D3All-America.pdf).  They've also named Steve Moore the co-Coach of the Year in the region. 

Other NCAC stars who have achieved all-Region (http://grfx.cstv.com/photos/schools/nabc/genrel/auto_pdf/2010D3All-District.pdf) status include Aaron Brock (Wabash), George Raftis (Allegheny), and Bryan Wickliffe (Wooster), all named to the second team.

Congratulations to all!

(Note: all hyperlinks lead to .pdf files)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 21, 2010, 01:19:18 PM
One final honor for Ian Franks: fourth-team All-American at D3hoops.com (http://www.d3hoops.com/all-american/menallam10.htm).  Congratulations (again), Ian!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 23, 2010, 07:03:31 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 21, 2010, 01:19:18 PM
One final honor for Ian Franks: fourth-team All-American at D3hoops.com (http://www.d3hoops.com/all-american/menallam10.htm).  Congratulations (again), Ian!

Not so fast my friend.   ;)

Franks was named 2nd Team All-American by DIII News.

DIII News All-America Team (http://www.smallcollegehoops.com/Home_files/D3NAATeam10.pdf)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 23, 2010, 11:57:27 PM
Wooster zooms up to #8 in the final Top 25 Poll (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/).  Four of the six teams to defeat the Scots also appear in this poll, with the other two losses being the first game of the season and in the arch-rivalry.  A season that didn't look all that special as it unfolded (to some of us, at least; some jerk even mentioned the term "reeling" ::)) looks pretty darn special in hindsight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 25, 2010, 08:02:15 PM
Although I'm not usually one to condone rumormongering, I have it on good authority that there's going to be at least one more coaching change in the NCAC this offseason.  Stay tuned.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 29, 2010, 10:06:17 PM
http://www.d3jobs.com/show/vYebyblr (http://www.d3jobs.com/show/vYebyblr)
No official announcement yet, at least none that I've seen, but my sources tell me that Matt Croci has decided to step away from basketball for a bit and, accordingly, has resigned his position at Kenyon.  This is a guy who's been an NCAC hoops guy for much of his adult life, including four years as a player at Wittenberg which earned him a spot on the NCAC 20th Anniversary team (http://www.northcoast.org/20/20bkb.html#Men%27s%2020th%20Anniversary%20Team).  Under his leadership, the Lords have moved up to become a competitive program year in and year out, bringing in the kind of talented student-athletes that Kenyon's men's hoops hasn't enjoyed since the days of Jamie Harless.  The NCAC and Kenyon College will miss his contributions, and I hope you'll all join me in wishing him the best of success and happiness.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 30, 2010, 10:39:33 PM
I know the Lords were a disappointment this year, but he did a great job there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: M.Knapke on March 31, 2010, 08:09:51 AM
While everyone in the Kenyon Lords program envisoned a different outcome regarding the final record. It would be inaccurate to declare the Lords team as disappointing. Rather, the actions of a few, largely impacted their squad. I am extremely proud of the effort, and character of those coaches, and  players who fought thru the adversity. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on April 01, 2010, 09:37:53 AM
http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=7923 (http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=7923)

Congratulations to Coach Petty.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on April 07, 2010, 08:32:40 PM
Allegheny has moved rather swiftly to fill their vacancy, today naming Jim Driggs as the new head coach (http://www.alleghenysports.com/news/2010/4/7/MBB_0407101714.aspx).  Driggs comes to Meadville from three years at Rochester; one hopes for his sake that he was fully informed of Mike Neer's plans (http://rochester.edu/athletics/index.php?article=3388) (see also front page (http://www.d3hoops.com/)) before signing on Betsy Mitchell's dotted line!  Welcome to the NCAC, Coach Driggs, and good luck in what might be a somewhat difficult situation at Gheny. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on April 14, 2010, 02:33:20 PM
Don't know much about Wooster's recruiting, other than they have a guard named Jimmy Orie coming from a tiny school in Pittsburgh. He scored a lot, but it is hard to tell much when you are playing at the Class A level. Funny that his name is Jimmy, since that was the nickname of former Scot Ryan Snyder, who also scored a ton of points in high school for a small high school. The nickname came from the player in the movie Hoosiers. If Orie is as good as Snyder, I imagine Wooster will be very happy.

http://remote.olsh.org/users/olshsports/weblog/2da5a/Congratulations_Jimmy.html

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10043/1035240-116.stm

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vrYCZI2rvsA
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on April 14, 2010, 02:51:51 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on April 14, 2010, 02:33:20 PM
Don't know much about Wooster's recruiting, other than they have a guard named Jimmy Orie coming from a tiny school in Pittsburgh. He scored a lot, but it is hard to tell much when you are playing at the Class A level.

Thanks for the recruiting update seinfeld.

He's a good size guard at 6'3".  The following quote from that Post Gazette q&a makes me think he could be more in the mold of Ian Franks:

Quote
Q:  Are you more of a scorer or shooter? A:  A scorer. When my shot is not falling, I tend to try and get to the hoop and get to the foul line. I tend to get a lot of points from the foul line.

I like the sound of that answer!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lptennisjohn on April 18, 2010, 01:15:31 PM
I never played basketball in high school. I did play intramurals all four years and I am an all-state tennis and lacrosse player. I am 6'8, 200 lbs. Would I make the team at Wabash College. I'm pretty athletic and pick up things pretty quickly. I didn't play tennis unitl my freshman year and I was all-state my junior and senior years.

Should I try out? What should I work on this summer before I go off to college?

Thanks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on April 18, 2010, 01:34:11 PM
Quote from: lptennisjohn on April 18, 2010, 01:15:31 PM
I never played basketball in high school. I did play intramurals all four years and I am an all-state tennis and lacrosse player. I am 6'8, 200 lbs. Would I make the team at Wabash College. I'm pretty athletic and pick up things pretty quickly. I didn't play tennis unitl my freshman year and I was all-state my junior and senior years.

Should I try out? What should I work on this summer before I go off to college?

Thanks!

"You cannot coach height so you had better recruit it."

I wonder how many sports that you want to play while you are college, and which sport is your passion?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lptennisjohn on April 25, 2010, 10:36:55 PM
I really enjoy both lacrosse and tennis at the varsity level, each had their own things I liked.

Tennis has finesse, and lacrosse is purely physical.

I strongly believe if I became a basketball player, it'd be my favorite sport, ever.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on May 14, 2010, 04:50:47 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on April 14, 2010, 02:51:51 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on April 14, 2010, 02:33:20 PM
Don't know much about Wooster's recruiting, other than they have a guard named Jimmy Orie coming from a tiny school in Pittsburgh. He scored a lot, but it is hard to tell much when you are playing at the Class A level.

Thanks for the recruiting update seinfeld.

He's a good size guard at 6'3".  The following quote from that Post Gazette q&a makes me think he could be more in the mold of Ian Franks:

Quote
Q:  Are you more of a scorer or shooter? A:  A scorer. When my shot is not falling, I tend to try and get to the hoop and get to the foul line. I tend to get a lot of points from the foul line.

I like the sound of that answer!
His shooting form is very similar to Tom Dinger.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on May 17, 2010, 11:01:31 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on May 14, 2010, 04:50:47 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on April 14, 2010, 02:51:51 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on April 14, 2010, 02:33:20 PM
Don't know much about Wooster's recruiting, other than they have a guard named Jimmy Orie coming from a tiny school in Pittsburgh. He scored a lot, but it is hard to tell much when you are playing at the Class A level.

Thanks for the recruiting update seinfeld.

He's a good size guard at 6'3".  The following quote from that Post Gazette q&a makes me think he could be more in the mold of Ian Franks:

Quote
Q:  Are you more of a scorer or shooter? A:  A scorer. When my shot is not falling, I tend to try and get to the hoop and get to the foul line. I tend to get a lot of points from the foul line.

I like the sound of that answer!
His shooting form is very similar to Tom Dinger.

Now, if he can only score like Tom Dinger...  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on May 18, 2010, 11:12:08 PM
Seinfeld - thanks for the recruiting news on Jimmy Orie

Here is another Wooster recruit that I found with some sleuthing:

Sam Runner 6'7" Post
Morgantown High, West Virginia

Runner averaged 15.4 ppg his senior season and he was West Virginia Class AAA All State Second Team

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on May 20, 2010, 11:09:04 PM
Here is one more Wooster recruit - Kyle Koski, a Guard from Mayfield High (large school in Cleveland area)

Kyle Koski 6'0"  17.1 ppg  Northeast Lakes All District Division I Third Team
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on May 21, 2010, 10:55:36 AM
Runner needs to put some meat on those bones. 6'7" but only 185 pounds. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gxghvqJco3s)

Another couple of recruits:

Scott Purcell - http://www.journal-news.com/hamilton-sports/sports-headlines-687248.html
http://www.gclsports.com/bkPlayerStats.aspx?player=94826

Bryce Agler - Dad is the head coach of the Seattle Storm of the WNBA
http://sports.espn.go.com/ncaa/recruiting/basketball/womens/news/story?id=5140053
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on May 22, 2010, 06:07:40 PM
Kenyon has a new head coach, and he looks like he may be a good one.  His name is Dan Priest, and he's been the head coach at Hendrix College for the past six seasons, turning an 0-23 program into a competitive one in the SCAC.  He's a graduate of Ohio Northern and has previous coaching experience at Hanover, Ohio Dominican, and briefly at Indiana State and Miami (OH).  Welcome to the NCAC, Dan, and best of success with the Lords!

Kenyon press release (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x35141.xml)
D3Hoops.com press release (http://www.d3hoops.com/pressreleases.php?release=3827)
Hendrix press release (http://www.hendrix.edu/Athletics/news.aspx?id=46861)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on June 04, 2010, 10:10:40 PM
Well, the NCAC has its 10th member again. A hint, it begins with the letter "D" and ends with the letter "W".

Now, you may be a little skeptical of this claim since I don't have a link or anything to point people to, but that's because it won't be officially announced until next week. But as sure as I was the funniest guy on tv during the 1990s, this is a done deal. The improvement over what Earlham was bringing to the conference in terms of overall strength is welcome news to teams like Wooster, Witt, Wabash, OWU, etc. The NCAC representative in the tournament has been hurt several times by the lack of schedule strength the conference has had in recent years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on June 04, 2010, 10:46:57 PM
They would make the NCAC top 4 a nice race in basketball every year at the very least.


Wooster, Witt, Wabash, D----W and Ohio Wesleyan is a pretty nice collection of programs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 05, 2010, 11:06:52 AM
Seinfeld - thanks for the heads up on the new 10th member of the NCAC! :) k+

This new member makes a lot of sense for several reasons:

1. Strong Academic Reputation and Excellent Fit with the NCAC.  D____W also has a Phi Beta Kappa chapter which seems important to some NCAC Presidents. ;)

2. Huge Rivalry with Wabash - don't they play games for some Bell?!  ;D :D ;)  Actually, this will mean that the NCAC will now include two of the strongest D3 rivalries (Scots-Tigers, Little Giants-Tigers)

3. D____W must have grown tired of paying travel costs to 8 other states for athletic teams.  Indiana to Texas is a long hike for an athletic contest. ::)

4. D____W is also in the old GLCA along with 7 other NCAC schools

5. NCAC loses an Indiana college, replaces with a stronger Indiana college :) ...which helps scheduling weekend road trips in sports like basketball.  Allegheny now has a 2nd opponent when they make the weekend trip to Hoosierland.  Seinfeld made a great point about improving the schedule strength of the NCAC as well.

Looking forward to the formal announcement next week!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on June 05, 2010, 12:04:47 PM
D----W will be joining the NCAC for the 2011-12 season. Football is still up in the air about clearing the schedules in time for the 2011 season. I'm guessing it's going to be 2012 for football.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on June 09, 2010, 10:01:43 AM
10 a.m. EST, on cue, is the announcement from the NCAC:

http://northcoast.org/news/DePauwtoNCAC.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on June 09, 2010, 10:50:15 AM
I'm sure we'll be ditching the full round-robin now and going back to the Big Trip Weekends: DPU/Wab to Hiram/Gheny and vice versa.  Might be a nice advantage for Gheny (or Hiram) to have single games with both Indiana powers every year, while the traditional top dawgs (Woo, Witt, OWU, Wabash, and now DPU) all have to face each other twice every season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on June 09, 2010, 12:53:20 PM
I'm actually pretty excited about DePauw joining the NCAC, there's little doubt this brings a pretty solid athletics program in to the conference/region.

The number of marquee matchups on the schedule in basketball alone just went up by about 8 annualy.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on June 09, 2010, 06:51:07 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on June 09, 2010, 10:50:15 AM
I'm sure we'll be ditching the full round-robin now and going back to the Big Trip Weekends: DPU/Wab to Hiram/Gheny and vice versa.  Might be a nice advantage for Gheny (or Hiram) to have single games with both Indiana powers every year, while the traditional top dawgs (Woo, Witt, OWU, Wabash, and now DPU) all have to face each other twice every season.

... meaning, I take it, a single round-robin that's two games short of a double round-robin. In other words, sixteen-game slates consisting of two games apiece against seven of the other nine NCAC teams, and single games against the other two, right? A simple substitution of DePauw for Earlham and a return to the status quo?

Anybody want to make the argument for a full double round-robin regardless of the inclusion of DePauw into the NCAC schedule (i.e., an eighteen-game NCAC slate)? Just curious.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on June 09, 2010, 09:12:48 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on June 09, 2010, 06:51:07 PM
... meaning, I take it, a single round-robin that's two games short of a double round-robin. In other words, sixteen-game slates consisting of two games apiece against seven of the other nine NCAC teams, and single games against the other two, right? A simple substitution of DePauw for Earlham and a return to the status quo?
Yes, that is what I mean, although I'd describe it as "status quo ante," since there is a different schedule in place for the 2010-11 season.  For the women, thanks to Wabash, it will be a full (double-)round-robin, with two of the long weekend trips each year: Hiram and 'Gheny to Witt and DePauw (tough weekend!) and vice-versa.  Still this would be a 16-game conference schedule as DPU's inclusion returns the NCAC to a 9-team league for the distaff hoopsters.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on June 10, 2010, 10:18:52 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on June 09, 2010, 06:51:07 PM
Anybody want to make the argument for a full double round-robin regardless of the inclusion of DePauw into the NCAC schedule (i.e., an eighteen-game NCAC slate)? Just curious.

That would be my preference.  I'd be ok with Wabash losing one of their early season tournaments (that are usually at least partially filled with NAIAs) for two more league games.  That's an easier sell for me than it would be for Wooster who hosts two of these tournaments every year and puts together a quality D-III field almost every time.  The Van Wie and Mose Hole weekends aren't going anywhere anytime soon, I'm sure.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on June 10, 2010, 10:27:00 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on June 10, 2010, 10:18:52 AM
That's an easier sell for me than it would be for Wooster who hosts two of these tournaments every year and puts together a quality D-III field almost every time.  The Van Wie and Mose Hole weekends aren't going anywhere anytime soon, I'm sure. 

Actually, I've heard that those tournaments are getting harder to fill every year.  I would not be surprised to see changes coming to one (or both) of them in the future.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on June 10, 2010, 11:44:07 AM
This will definitely help the NCAC. I can see that the runner up will be competitive for a "C" every year, if every one doesn't start beating each other up.

Two 'Bash - DPU hoop games each year is pretty sweet as well!

And there's always a chance of a meeting in the NCAC tourney - that could spread the special madness to Ohio! (Not to say 'Bash or DPU won't ever host, but...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on June 10, 2010, 04:47:50 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on June 09, 2010, 09:12:48 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on June 09, 2010, 06:51:07 PM
... meaning, I take it, a single round-robin that's two games short of a double round-robin. In other words, sixteen-game slates consisting of two games apiece against seven of the other nine NCAC teams, and single games against the other two, right? A simple substitution of DePauw for Earlham and a return to the status quo?
Yes, that is what I mean, although I'd describe it as "status quo ante," since there is a different schedule in place for the 2010-11 season.  For the women, thanks to Wabash, it will be a full (double-)round-robin, with two of the long weekend trips each year: Hiram and 'Gheny to Witt and DePauw (tough weekend!) and vice-versa.  Still this would be a 16-game conference schedule as DPU's inclusion returns the NCAC to a 9-team league for the distaff hoopsters.

It's no skin off of my nose what the NCAC does, of course, but I'm a big advocate of double round-robins. If you're a fan of Team A, and Team A loses out on the title by one game to Team B because Team A had to play third-place Team C twice and Team B only had to play Team C once, you have a built-in excuse to complain about the unfairness of an unbalanced league sked. A double round-robin -- or a single round-robin, if you're a NESCAC fan -- removes the fairness issue from the fray.

Of course, you could argue that a single round-robin has an element of unfairness, too, because there's no home-and-home, which means that one team has to play a tough competitor in that tough competitor's gym without getting a return visit, while another team only has to face the tough competitor at home. I've raised that complaint myself on the NESCAC board, but that's another story. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on June 11, 2010, 11:33:06 AM
Was just looking at all of Depauw's sports and WOW!  This is a major upgrade from Earlham who was just pretty much awful in everything in all honesty.  The Tigers will undoubtedly force a shakeup in EVERY sport on both the Men's and the Women's side, in particular basketball, track, xc, football, and baseball.  Very exciting. 

Any thoughts on how this will affect recruiting?  DePauw recruits on a more national base given their old Conference having at least 5 players last season from outside IN.  Most NCAC schools don't have this as the core of their rosters are from the neighboring cities give or take 200 miles.   

As for hoops (since this is a hoops board), this could really have an effect on Gheny, OWU, and Kenyon competing again for a while for an NCAC title.  Woo, DePauw, and Witt (IN THAT ORDER) are now the favorites ten fold.  I could see OWU possibly sneaking back up there, but for the most part this looks to be the top 3 with a big gap between 3-4-10 once again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on June 12, 2010, 12:17:05 PM
Quote from: WooHoopsntrack01 on June 11, 2010, 11:33:06 AM
Was just looking at all of Depauw's sports and WOW!  This is a major upgrade from Earlham who was just pretty much awful in everything in all honesty.  The Tigers will undoubtedly force a shakeup in EVERY sport on both the Men's and the Women's side, in particular basketball, track, xc, football, and baseball.  Very exciting. 

Any thoughts on how this will affect recruiting?  DePauw recruits on a more national base given their old Conference having at least 5 players last season from outside IN.  Most NCAC schools don't have this as the core of their rosters are from the neighboring cities give or take 200 miles.   

As for hoops (since this is a hoops board), this could really have an effect on Gheny, OWU, and Kenyon competing again for a while for an NCAC title.  Woo, DePauw, and Witt (IN THAT ORDER) are now the favorites ten fold.  I could see OWU possibly sneaking back up there, but for the most part this looks to be the top 3 with a big gap between 3-4-10 once again.

Forgetting about Wabash, who split with DPU last year and went 18-8 after starting 5-5?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 22, 2010, 12:38:07 AM
Wooster has posted their 2010-2011 schedule on their website and as IMDEREKPOE predicted (k+), changes have been made to both of Wooster's home tournaments for the coming season.

The Al Van Wie Rotary Classic is listed as a one day tournament with Wooster only playing Bethany College (PAC team) in the second game on November 20th.  The opening game is scheduled with two nonD3 schools, Miami-Middletown and Northwestern, OH (NAIA), as the matchup.

The Mose Hole Kiwanis Classic is a two day tournament but there is no scheduled championship game.  Both days are prescheduled so Wooster will host John Carroll on December 28th and then host another OAC team, Wilmington College on December 29th.  Spalding University out of Kentucky is the 4th team so John Carroll and Wilmington will not play each other at the Mose Hole.

Wooster will play two tournaments on the road with the first at Carnegie Mellon where Wooster will face another OAC team, Ohio Northern, in the opening game on November 27th.  Susquehanna plays CMU in the second game and there will be consolation/championship games on November 28th.

In early January, Wooster will play in the Bahama House Florida Classic against William Carey (NAIA team) on the first day and against Baruch College (D3 team) on the second day.

The two other nonconference opponents are Cincinnati Christian (NAIA team) in a home opener on November  17th and a December 20th road game at Anderson University (HCAC - D3) in Indiana.

Here is a link to the full schedule on Wooster's website:
http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Winter-Sports/Mens-Basketball/2010-11-Schedule



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on June 25, 2010, 11:22:21 AM
Scrounging around the web I came across another guard recruit for Wooster -- Jack Counahan from North Allegheny (Pa.). This makes two players from western Pa., which is a much different recruiting pattern for Wooster, which gets just about every player from Ohio.

Participated in this recruiting showcase along with Jimmy Orie, who is also coming to Wooster:

http://www.hoopmountainpa.com/National_Recruiting_Showcases_Evaluations.php

http://www.northallegheny.org/athletics/NA%20Sports%20Network/10collegelist.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Just Bill on July 19, 2010, 01:12:06 PM
So why did you never try basketball before now?

I'd never tell you not to try basktball at Wabash, but I'd say if you were all-state in tennis and lacrosse why not stick with those? (Wabash has tennis, but not lacrosse.) I'd go that route rather than try to pick up something brand new.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Hugenerd on August 02, 2010, 10:25:58 PM
Allegheny just hired former MIT SID James Kramer. (http://www.alleghenysports.com/news/2010/7/26/JamesKramerRelease.aspx)  Kramer was in the private sector for a year but it appears he couldnt stay away from the college game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 12, 2010, 04:15:04 PM
OWU sophomore wing Greg White has been featured in Sports Illustrated's "Faces in the Crowd (http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/scorecard/faces/2010/08/16/)" section for leading the USA to the championship of the U21 World Deaf Basketball Championship.  White appeared in 11 games last season as a Bishops' rookie, recording 11 points and 15 rebounds in 59 minutes of action.  In the WDBC, White appears to have been unstoppable, averaging 15.1 points and 7.5 boards per game.  Congratulations, Greg!

(Tip o' the cap to OWU's Facebook page (http://www.facebook.com/#!/OhioWesleyanUniversity) for bringing this to the attention of a longtime SI-boycotter).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on September 02, 2010, 10:15:02 AM


http://www.annarbor.com/sports/um-football/from-never-to-walking-brock-mealer-will-lead-michigan-football-team-onto-field-saturday/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on September 02, 2010, 11:16:51 AM
Sac,

Thanks for the heads up on this. Under the "I thought he graduated" category, Tim Vandervaart -- yes, the Tim Vandervaart that was an all-region basketball player as a senior in 2006-07 -- helped lead the Wooster soccer team to a win yesterday.

http://www.wooster.edu/Athletics/Athletics-News/2010/September/Mens-Soccer-Recap-Otterbein
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 02, 2010, 11:59:17 AM
Thanks, sac, that's a great story.  Although it makes me want to go set fire to an insurance company somewhere.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 03, 2010, 04:15:14 PM
Dustin Rudegeair is the new Director of Facilities and Summer Camps (http://bishops.owu.edu/2010-11/1011staf.html) at OWU.  Welcome back, Dustin!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on September 05, 2010, 05:42:29 PM

Brock Mealer, a man given a 1% chance of walking again.....


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RUZr-9NdOwY&feature=player_embedded

I've been to somewhere around 125+ games at Michigan Stadium, and this might be the best couple minutes of all of them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 14, 2010, 01:56:44 PM
The most beautiful college campus in the world?  Right here in the NCAC (http://realestate.yahoo.com/promo/the-worlds-most-beautiful-college-campuses). 
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fl.yimg.com%2Fa%2Fi%2Fus%2Fre%2Fgr%2Fkenyon300.jpg&hash=ac73a8d2d025fa490b8b45b2c244e542fac1b3ed)
I can't vouch for the whole world, but it's certainly the most beautiful campus I've ever visited.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on September 17, 2010, 10:28:39 PM
Well, Kenyon is certainly better than Indiana State or Purdue!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on September 20, 2010, 08:29:19 PM
Here is some preseason information to generate a little discussion:

Sporting News 2010-2011 Division III Preview
National Top 10
1. Wisconsin Stevens Point
2. Franklin & Marshall (PA)
3. Randolph-Macon (VA)
4. Wooster (OH)
5. St. Norbert (WI)
6. Eastern Mennonite (VA)
7. Williams (MA)
8. Wisconsin Whitewater
9. St. Mary's (MD)
10. Virginia Wesleyan

Also Listed 33 Possible Breakthrough Teams which included Anderson, Baruch, Hope, John Carroll, Wittenberg

Wooster's nonconference schedule includes a road game at Anderson, hosting John Carroll in the Mose Hole Classic and playing Baruch in a neutral site game (Florida tourney).  Wittenberg and Hope were the only other teams from the Great Lakes region mentioned as possible breakthroughs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on September 20, 2010, 08:42:00 PM
Sporting News Division III Preview (continued)

All-America First Team
Steve Djurickovic - Carthage
Marcel Esonwune - York
Ian Franks - Wooster :)
James McNally - Franklin & Marshall
Todd Phillips - Eastern Mennonite

Congratulations to Ian Franks on some well deserved recognition!

No other Great Lakes region players listed on the Second Team.  One player from Hope and one player from Olivet were on the honorable mention list.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on October 12, 2010, 10:13:51 PM
Denison Assistant Muchnick heard to be leaving for USMMA as Assistant Coach.  Rumor of his return to Long Island popped up last month:

Merchant Marine rumors....
Posted by The DirtKing on Friday, September 17, 2010 at 9:11am.
The U.S. Merchant Marine Academy is still without a coach since John Krikorian departed for Christopher Newport University in June. From what I've heard from great sources, current Towson assistant Danny Nee is the leading candidate here. Nee has a 410-381 record in 26 seasons as a DI head coach at Ohio University (1981-86), Nebraska (1986-2000), Robert Morris (2000-01) and Duquesne (2001-06). The 67-year old is a Brooklyn native and a Vietnam War veteran (good credentials to coach at a military academy). All indications are that USMMA wants to get this done before October 1st - still not a lot of time for a new guy to get adjusted before the season starts. If Nee turns this job down, others involved are believed to be Denison assistant coach David Muchnick (a Long Island native), St. Joseph's (LI) head coach John Mateyko, and a current DI assistant at another military academy (not getting too deep into this one). I'll keep you updated as this one progresses.

On a side note, Nee was a high school teammate of Kareem Abdul Jabbar at Power Memorial High School – pretty cool!


Stay with HoopDirt for the latest college basketball coaching news and rumors.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 18, 2010, 10:30:57 PM
Wooster has added a challenging exhibition game to this year's schedule as they will play at Division I Ohio University on October 31st.

The Bobcats are picked by some preseason publications as the MAC East Division favorite this year.  Here is the link to the Ohio University schedule with the Scots logo showing as the next opponent!  ;D :D  http://www.ohiobobcats.com/sports/m-baskbl/sched/ohio-m-baskbl-sched.html

It is interesting to see Wooster listed on a schedule that also includes Kansas, Temple and some other college basketball heavyweights! :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 19, 2010, 02:26:35 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on October 18, 2010, 10:30:57 PM
It is interesting to see Wooster listed on a schedule that also includes Kansas, Temple and some other college basketball heavyweights! :o

Hey now.  Wooster is every bit the basketball heavyweight in D3 land as those big boys.   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on October 20, 2010, 12:06:25 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on October 19, 2010, 02:26:35 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on October 18, 2010, 10:30:57 PM
It is interesting to see Wooster listed on a schedule that also includes Kansas, Temple and some other college basketball heavyweights! :o

Hey now.  Wooster is every bit the basketball heavyweight in D3 land as those big boys.   8-)

Temple? Yep.
Kansas? Not so much.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 20, 2010, 12:21:32 PM
There's only three NCAA-member schools who have had three coaches each win at least 300 games at the school.  Those three are Utah, Kansas, and Wooster.  The "big boys."

Utah:
V. Peterson 385
J. Gardner 339
R. Majerus 323

Kansas:
P. Allen 590
R. Williams 385
T. Owens 348

Wooster:
S. Moore 538 and counting
M. Hole 412
A. Van Wie 302
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on October 20, 2010, 01:03:45 PM
I'm thinking in terms of the NCAA tournament, David:

school  W-L (pct)champs  FFs
Kansas  85-38 (.691)  3  13
Temple  31-28 (.525)  0    2
Wooster  20-24 (.455)  0    2

This includes the records of Kansas and Temple in both NCAA University Division and NCAA D1 tournaments, and Wooster's record in both NCAA College Division and NCAA D3 tournaments. (Wooster went 0-4 in College Division tourneys in the early 1970s.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 20, 2010, 03:15:13 PM
You have your metrics, and I have mine...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 20, 2010, 09:36:25 PM
Received a hard copy of Wooster's 2010-2011 Pre-Season Roster which is not on the website yet.

Good news is that the top 10 returning players are all listed: :) ;D
Ian Franks 6'4"
Nathan Balch 6'1"
Bryan Wickliffe 6"6"
Justin Hallowell 6'7"
Josh Claytor 6'7"
Matt Fegan 6'1"
Justin Warnes 6'3"
Mike Evans 6'4"
Jake Mays 6'8"
Kaleb Reed 6'4"

There is also a large freshmen class of 14 and some are impressive recruits.  Details in the next post.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 20, 2010, 09:56:54 PM
On paper, here are Wooster's top 6 incoming freshmen recruits:

Jimmy Orie 6'2" Guard  Sacred Heart HS in PA
27 ppg, Pennsylvania Class A All-State Team

Sam Runner 6'8" Post/Forward  Morgantown HS in WV
15.4 ppg, West Virginia All State 2nd Team

Ryan Snyder 6'0" Guard  St. Thomas Aquinas HS in Louisville, OH
23 ppg, Division III All Ohio 2nd Team (gotta love that name ;D, wonder if his nickname is Jimmy?)

Kyle Koski 6'0" Guard  Mayfield HS in Cleveland area
18 ppg, Division I All Northeast Lakes District 3rd Team

Scott Purcell 6'3" Wing  Hamilton Badin HS in Oxford, OH
16.8 ppg, Division III All-Ohio Honorable Mention, All Southwest District 2nd Team

Doug Thorpe 5'9" Guard  Columbus Eastmoor Academy
17.2 ppg, Division II All Central District 3rd Team

The rest of the freshmen class is Bryce Agler 5'10", Jack Counahan 6'0", Justin Erfurth 6'0", Collin Pfaff 5'8", Charlie Richardson 6'5" All Ohio Honorable Mention, Aaron Saunders 6'1", Sam Schopler 6'3", and John Thompson 6'4" from Clear Fork HS
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on October 21, 2010, 01:43:53 PM
I have two of those incoming Scot basketball players in class this fall, and they're both great kids, sharp yet humble.  With what Wooster has coming back, it's going to be tough for any of the new guys to contribute this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on October 21, 2010, 08:30:07 PM
I know a lot of teams would like this problem, but Wooster seems to be going back and forth between really small classes (two players last year) to frankly too big of a class this year. The tricky part will be keeping some of the freshmen happy who are good enough to be playing right away somewhere else this year until they can get on the court next year.

I know nothing about any of these guys other than what's on paper, but this video clip of Doug Thorpe certainly makes him look like a real player. He is small, but looked pretty darn polished in this game:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwAlMaoMQSw
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 22, 2010, 10:59:54 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on October 21, 2010, 08:30:07 PM
I know nothing about any of these guys other than what's on paper, but this video clip of Doug Thorpe certainly makes him look like a real player. He is small, but looked pretty darn polished in this game:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mwAlMaoMQSw

Is he #24?

EDIT:  NM, saw the notes on the video that gave Thorpe's number.

Reminds me a bit of Antwyan Reynolds.  Kid can stroke it!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on October 22, 2010, 11:37:21 AM
Wabash has also posted a roster for 2010-2011.  While I can't make any informed comments about the freshmen, there is one new name on the roster that stood out: AJ Sutherlin.  Sutherlin is a transfer from Earlham where he was an HM NCAC performer last season...it seems that AJ has found a new circle of friends over in C'ville and will be a welcome addition to the squad this year.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on October 23, 2010, 08:07:29 PM
AJ will make Wabash a lot tougher, but I see the Scots walking away with things this year.  It will be interesting to see how Wooster works some of the new recruits into the system to keep them happy over the long term.  That will be there biggest challenge.

As far as my previous post about Denison's assistant coaching position, it looks like it's confirmed - David Muchnik has joined the Merchant Marine Academy: 

http//www.kpmariners.com/ssp/mbskt-coaches?id=137

With three solid assistants, I wouldn't think the Big Red willl worry about filling the spot.





Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 28, 2010, 12:50:25 PM
Preseason love: (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/)  Wooster 6th place, Wittenberg 6 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on October 28, 2010, 01:49:35 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on October 21, 2010, 08:30:07 PM
I know a lot of teams would like this problem, but Wooster seems to be going back and forth between really small classes (two players last year) to frankly too big of a class this year.

You could have been describing the situation of the college as a whole.  Wooster brought in two disappointingly-small freshman classes of around 480, then had almost 630 this fall, leading to a different set of challenges.  This led to a staffing change at a very senior level; the new VP dealing with admissions (among other things) had been very successful in a similar position at another NCAC school, before coming southwest to Wooster.

Given that there are no athletic scholarships, I suspect that the same financial & institutional issues that caused Wooster's overall entering enrollments to fluctuate had effects on Coach Moore's recruiting classes.  It is my understanding that there are about two dozen young men in the program this fall, so there may not be as much bouncing back and forth between the varsity and JV teams as in previous seasons.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on October 29, 2010, 09:22:28 PM
Following up on what fantastic50 said, it makes the really small recruiting class that the football team had this year even more puzzling. Wooster has one of the biggest classes in history, basketball and baseball have enough freshmen to field entire teams and then some, and football struggles to get 30 kids (less now). And it wasn't like they didn't need players. With a big senior class that graduated last year, Wooster had just over 50 players returning for this year. And for the first time ever, football had a turf field (along with a rec center in two years) to use in recruiting.

Back to basketball, Wooster plays Ohio U. in an exhibition Sunday. With so many guys returning, I'm not sure we'll learn too much, other than who comes off the bench, particularly in the backcourt.

http://www.ohiobobcats.com/sports/m-baskbl/sched/ohio-m-baskbl-sched.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 30, 2010, 05:44:09 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on October 29, 2010, 09:22:28 PM

Back to basketball, Wooster plays Ohio U. in an exhibition Sunday. With so many guys returning, I'm not sure we'll learn too much, other than who comes off the bench, particularly in the backcourt.

http://www.ohiobobcats.com/sports/m-baskbl/sched/ohio-m-baskbl-sched.html

Looks like, at the very least, we will be able to follow this game on Gametracker.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 31, 2010, 03:00:11 PM
Exhibition Game at the Half:  Ohio University 38  Wooster 16

Scots were in the game early as the Division I Bobcats only led 16-12 before they went on a 19-0 run to take complete control on their home floor.

Wooster starting 5 was Franks, Balch, Hallowell, Wickliffe and Fegan.  Three freshmen who played in the first half were Scott Purcell, Doug Thorpe and Jimmy Orie.  Jake Mays and Josh Claytor logged some minutes along with Justin Warnes. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 31, 2010, 03:59:22 PM
Exhibition Final:  D1 Ohio University 86  Wooster 50

Scots played better offensively in the 2nd half of this road game.  Nathan Balch led Wooster with 13 points.  Mike Evans and frosh Jack Counahan each added 5 points in the 2nd half off the bench as the next highest scorers.  18 guys played in this game for the Scots.

Scott Purcell, Ryan Snyder, Jimmy Orie, Jack Counahan and Doug Thorpe were the freshmen who logged the most minutes in the game.

First regular season game is November 17th vs. Cincinnati Christian.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on October 31, 2010, 06:54:03 PM
The Scots were certainly no match for OU's size, quickness and strength.  However, I was disappointed when they all but gave up on defense when OU started to pull away.  I never expected that they would be close - OU's got a pretty good team - but the effort that they put forth in the last 2/3 of the 1st half was not acceptable.

I've now seen the Scots play an inter-squad scrimmage and this week's exhibition.  So far, seems like Balch is the most consistent shooter along with Fegan.  And Franks hasn't lost anything from last year.  Wyckliffe has played pretty well both times as well.  Hollowell doesn't seem to have regained his touch from 3-pt land, but he also seems to know that and is driving and posting up a bit more.  Mays looked a little better today that he did last week and last year.  I'm still not real excited about Justin Warnes being the first non-big off the bench.  Purcell could be take over that role if he develops.  FWIW, Purcell and Thorpe were the first newcomers off the bench.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 02, 2010, 02:08:09 PM
Thanks for the scrimmage updates derek.

I agree with you about Warnes.  While he does an adequate job on the defensive end of the floor, he just seems like an offensive liablity to me.  Opposing teams don't really need to focus on him as a threat to score at all when he is in the game.  It would be nice to see one of the freshmen step up and surpass Warnes on the depth chart.

Too bad about Hallowell and not finding his range.  But at least it is good to hear and he is adapting his game as a result. 

You mentioned Mays has looked improved.  If you don't mind me asking, how has Josh Claytor been looking so far?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 02, 2010, 07:22:47 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 02, 2010, 02:08:09 PM
Thanks for the scrimmage updates derek.

I agree with you about Warnes.  While he does an adequate job on the defensive end of the floor, he just seems like an offensive liablity to me.  Opposing teams don't really need to focus on him as a threat to score at all when he is in the game.  It would be nice to see one of the freshmen step up and surpass Warnes on the depth chart.

Too bad about Hallowell and not finding his range.  But at least it is good to hear and he is adapting his game as a result. 

You mentioned Mays has looked improved.  If you don't mind me asking, how has Josh Claytor been looking so far?

I thought that Claytor has looked strong on the boards, but still isn't quite as comfortable on offense under the basket yet.  It seems to me that both Claytor and Mays sometimes think too much when they get the ball down low.  When they just take it to the hoop they have better results.  I also think that Claytor is too willing to shoot from downtown.  He's a decent shot from out there, but not so great that I wouldn't rather have him under the basket and let Balch, Fegan, Franks, or Hallowell take the 3.

On Hallowell, it seems to me like his rhythm is off most of the time.  The couple 3's that he's made in the scrimmages have looked great and you almost knew they were going to go down before he even released the ball.  The other times he's rushing or not set right or something - in any case it doesn't look the same.  I still think that in order for this team to make a long run in March they need him to get back his form from 2 years ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 04, 2010, 07:08:51 PM
Wittenberg scrimmage vs Mount St. Josephs' tonight. I won't be in attendance but anyone that has any insight?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 04, 2010, 08:37:45 PM
Size and experience should win out over speed in this game.  Witt can shoot from the outside too.  MSJ may keep it close for a while, but I can see at least a 10 point Witt win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 04, 2010, 09:08:43 PM
Wooster was picked 1st in the NCAC preseason coaches poll released today.  The Scots garnered 8 of the 9 first place votes and Wittenberg picked up the remaining first place vote.

Here is the full list:

1. Wooster (8)      80 points
2. Wittenberg (1)  70 pts
3. Ohio Wesleyan  56 pts
4. Wabash           55 pts
5. Hiram              48 pts
6. Denison           37 pts
7. Allegheny        27 pts
8. Kenyon           18 pts
9. Oberlin            14 pts

Here is the link to the release: http://www2.northcoast.org/basketball/poll2010

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 05, 2010, 06:37:59 PM
Great new look to d3hoops.com today:

http://www.d3hoops.com/landing/index (http://www.d3hoops.com/landing/index)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on November 06, 2010, 01:53:51 AM
Thanks -- Denison just signed up with PrestoSports as well, so when that site gets done you guys are going to look pretty sweet too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 06, 2010, 02:42:26 PM
Observations from this morning's intra-squad scrimmage at Wooster:

1. It was physical out there!  The veterans, especially, seemed in a mood to mix it up underneath.  With Brian Wickliffe setting the tone, the bigs held nothing back; bumping, pushing, holding, hacking, all were the order of the day.  They all seemed to enjoy it, likely imagining their opponents to be wearing Wittenberg red.

2. For a while, as in the exhibition game down at Ohio U., nothing was dropping from the outside.  Then, slowly, led by Mike Evans and Nathan Balch, the shooters began to find the range.  Josh Claytor's shot looked softer and smoother than last year's version.  Several of the freshmen made a three, although they missed quite a few, too.

3. This is the largest first-year class in a few seasons.  Seven played today and are listed on the roster that was handed out but there might be that many more.  Of the seven, all but two are guards.  Only one really stood out, that being Doug Thorpe, a 5'9" (generous measurement?) point guard out of Columbus Eastmoor Academy.  He has some quickness, can handle the ball, sees the court, and seems to be able to shoot it.  He looked comfortable out there.  Now, if he was only 6'2"; but then he'd probably be playing DII or better.

4. The big guy, Gideon Mabeny, was not in attendance.  I've no information, but I suspect that he chose not to play this year due to limited minutes in 2009-10.  I hope he's still in school.

5. The Alumni Scrimmage has been moved to next Saturday evening at 5 P.M.

6. It feels good to be back!

 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 06, 2010, 03:31:36 PM
Wooster Booster is back!

Welcome back WB. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 06, 2010, 09:02:33 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 06, 2010, 02:42:26 PM
6. It feels good to be back!
7. Glad to have you back!   :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 07, 2010, 07:17:00 PM
Wabash loses it's exhibition game.

But it was to D-1 Indiana State. The Sycamores prevailed 71-60.

http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=8468
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on November 07, 2010, 10:50:06 PM
"4. The big guy, Gideon Mabeny, was not in attendance.  I've no information, but I suspect that he chose not to play this year due to limited minutes in 2009-10.  I hope he's still in school."

I have been told he is no longer on the team (his decision) but is still enrolled at the College of Wooster


"But it was to D-1 Indiana State. The Sycamores prevailed 71-60."

It has been a long long time since I have seen Indiana State play ('79-'80) but I would have to consider an 11 point loss to a mid major D1 program as encouraging.


I wish I could see the Wooster alumni game this coming weekend but alas I will be in the great state of Indiana visiting family. I hope someone will provide their observations.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on November 08, 2010, 09:41:59 AM
I haven't spoken with Gideon lately, but my guess is that he decided to quit basketball to focus on his academics, in preparation for medical school or a PhD program.  From all accounts, he is a sharp, committed student, and had (by competitive selection) a position in one of Wooster's full-time science research programs (in chemistry or biochemistry, as I recall) last summer.

The starting point guard on the Wooster women's basketball team, a junior biochemistry and math double major, decided not to return this year for similar reasons, which had nothing to do with basketball, and everything to do with focusing on her future career.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jpope2 on November 10, 2010, 09:28:38 AM
Wooster is scrimmaging Ashland tonight, anyone know which school its at and what time?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 10, 2010, 12:23:00 PM
Quote from: jpope2 on November 10, 2010, 09:28:38 AM
Wooster is scrimmaging Ashland tonight, anyone know which school its at and what time?

I'm not 100% sure, but I believe its at Ashland at 7:00.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 11, 2010, 02:54:17 PM
Our long national nightmare is nearing its end--hoops for real starting on Monday! (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fnot-tagged-smiley-10283.gif&hash=ed0a566daa49630af69e9f82b9fd520dffaddfa8)

Monday games:
Allegheny at Bethany
Denison at Marietta
Hiram hosts Mt. Union (no longer MUC, I am informed, but now UMU--"sit, UMU, sit...good dog!")
Westminster at Oberlin

Tuesday:
Grove City at Kenyon
Albion at Ohio Wesleyan
Wittenberg at IU-East
Marian (IN) at Wabash

Wednesday:
Cincinnati Christian (who?) at Wooster
Earlham (who?) at Denison
Hiram vs. Otterbein at Geneva

Thursday:
Hiram vs. either Geneva or Penn State Greater Allegheny at Geneva

Then over the weekend (Lesser?) Allegheny and Wabash host tournaments, Wooster hosts the scaled-back Van Wie Classic (vs. Bethany), and Denison, Kenyon, and OWU travel to tournaments at Chicago, Albion, and Calvin, respectively.

Bring it on! (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fhappy-smiley-8769.gif&hash=aeb289e67220f3813c231bcf5c375101dc1b9252)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 11, 2010, 04:13:02 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 11, 2010, 02:54:17 PM
Our long national nightmare is nearing its end--hoops for real starting on Monday! (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fnot-tagged-smiley-10283.gif&hash=ed0a566daa49630af69e9f82b9fd520dffaddfa8)

Bring it on! (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fhappy-smiley-8769.gif&hash=aeb289e67220f3813c231bcf5c375101dc1b9252)

Like sweet music to my ears!   8-)


Quote from: David Collinge on November 11, 2010, 02:54:17 PM
Hiram hosts Mt. Union (no longer MUC, I am informed, but now UMU--"sit, UMU, sit...good dog!")

It is kind of humorous that MUC is now a 'University'.   :D 

This reminded me of a billboard I saw last weekend driving through Canton with my wife.  It was a Mount Union billboard and their new slogan is:

"Mount Union - More than just a college..." 

I told my wife, their slogan should truly be:

"Mount Union - More than just football..."   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 11, 2010, 05:01:34 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 11, 2010, 04:13:02 PM
I told my wife, their slogan should truly be:

"Mount Union - More than just football..."   ;D
But, that would not be truthful...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 11, 2010, 06:50:57 PM
Wooster's Ian Franks starts the season as a D3hoops.com Preseason First-Team All-American (http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-americans/men/preseason-2011)!  Congratulations to Ian!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 11, 2010, 09:40:47 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 11, 2010, 02:54:17 PM
"sit, UMU, sit...good dog!"
That's one bad hat, Harry.

Quote from: David Collinge on November 11, 2010, 02:54:17 PM
Cincinnati Christian (who?) at Wooster
And you're making fun of Mt. Union being a university?  :o  This one ain't gonna be pretty.  Three years as an NAIA II school, prior to that they played in the NCCAA.  They lost their opener to Taylor, 95-54, after which they immediately downgraded their schedule.  I believe Sarah Palin is an assistant coach.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 11, 2010, 10:00:02 PM
Notes from the Wednesday night scrimmage at Ashland:

Coach Moore brought fifteen players with him, and in the three twenty-minute periods the Scots were called numerous times for icing while Ashland had several minor high sticking penalties.  Heh.  Seriously, Wooster's staff really mixed up the lineups; only very rarely were the starters together on the floor.  Most of the time it was more likely to be something like three veterans and two frosh.  So, it was difficult to get a good read on where the top guys would be were they to play together.  I'm seeing nine guys that might get quality minutes this season.  Steve Moore might have another one or two in mind but I'm not on board yet. 

Nathan Balch had some really nice minutes as his shot continues to fall.  I love his old school game with the pull up jumpers and runners.

The Scots didn't score inside much on post-up play despite getting some nice position down low.  I'd like to see them more often make a strong move to the hoop rather than immediately sending the ball back out.

Doug Thorpe continued to impress.  Nice penetration and dishing, working a nice two-man game especially with Josh Claytor.

Ashland might be a bit improved from last year; they definitely shot the ball better from out.  But they're still not big enough to compete with the Grand Valley States and Findlays.

Flash!  Wooster has a new look to it's athletic web page.  Kind of noisy and loud.  I still like the one that they had for many years until a couple of seasons ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 15, 2010, 05:53:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 11, 2010, 02:54:17 PM
Monday games:
Allegheny at Bethany
Denison at Marietta
Hiram hosts Mt. Union (no longer MUC, I am informed, but now UMU--"sit, UMU, sit...good dog!")
Westminster at Oberlin

Allegheny/Bethany: 8pm, Bethany live stats and silent videocast (http://client.stretchinternet.com/client/bethanywv.portal#)
Denison/Marietta: 7:30pm, live everything from Marietta (http://pioneers.marietta.edu/index.aspx?path=mbball&tab=basketball) (there's a JV games scheduled for 5:30, which I guess means that DU has a roster large enough to field a JV team.  Go Big Red!)
UMU/Hiram: 7:30pm, Hiram live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html)
Westminster/Oberlin: 7:30pm, Oberlin live stats and video (http://www.goyeo.com/)

--------------------

Hiram, which has not trailed, clings to a 3-point halftime lead, 34-31.
Oberlin is up 10 on their guests at the half, 39-29, and looks pretty good. 
Denison was getting hammered at Marietta (26-7) when the live stats had a merciful demise.
Allegheny ("AGH" in the videocast) is trading baskets with Bethany, 16-16 in the first period.

-----------------------

I'm going to need a supply of Bufferin for all the video bufferin' I'm being subjected to.

------------------------

Hiram, in control throughout, vanquishes UMU 71-53.  Typical Hiram gameplan, they grab 17 offensive rebounds.  Chris Roberts and Chris Meyer lead with 15 points, while Jide Eniola adds 14 with nine boards.
Oberlin also controlled their game, albeit a little less firmly than Hiram, and nail-bited out a season-opening 78-72 victory over Westminster.  Andrew Fox had a huge game with 24 points and 14 boards.  The Yeo shot 47% and won the glass war 43-40.
Marietta reports a 78-70 victory over Denison, which if true represents a big rally by the Big Red.
AGH! Allegheny falls to Bethany, 81-69.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 15, 2010, 09:48:37 PM
Denison did rally big.  Hale inside and good 3-pt shooting brought them to within 7 as the Pioneers got a little sloppy.  Marietta extended it again to 15 or 17 again, then the Big Red closed in once more.  They played a good 2nd half, but it wasn't enough to overcome an horrendous 1st half.  If they can avoid slow starts and play each game like they did the second half of this one, I see good things coming for Denison this year.

Add Dimonde Hale to the POY poll.  He gets my pre-season vote.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 15, 2010, 09:55:55 PM
Quote from: GoRed on November 15, 2010, 09:48:37 PM
Add Dimonde Hale to the POY poll.  He gets my pre-season vote.
Actually, I did consider putting him in there, but I wasn't sure anyone else was as high on him as I was, and anyway, as Dan Hodgkinson proved quite capably, it's tough to win a POY award from a second-division program.
(My vote was not on my own list, either--I'm backing Bryan Wickliffe.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 15, 2010, 10:22:30 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 15, 2010, 05:53:21 PM
I'm going to need a supply of Bufferin for all the video bufferin' I'm being subjected to.

Glad to see your humor is already in mid-season form, DC.   :)

More seriously, good to get some D-III basketball back.  I hope to be able to follow the teams/boards more closely this year than I had been able for the past couple years (grad school will do that to ya).  Unfortunately, I'll still be quite far away geographically from most of the NCAC action for the third year running.

Good to see the NCAC put up a couple non-conference wins with the openers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 15, 2010, 11:26:43 PM
Denison box score (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/denm1115.html) and recap (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_marietta1011.html).  The Big Red outscored the Pioneers 51-35 over the game's last 22:47, but that wasn't enough to overcome a 43-19 deficit at the beginning of that stretch.  Hale had 24 on 9-13 shooting, but he contributed 5 of DU's 16 turnovers, and missed 5 free throws, so there's still room for improvement in the sophomore.  Still, dead and buried before halftime on the road, it's good to see this team suck it up and fight to the end.  Let's see if that pays off against their next opponent on Wednesday, some little Quaker school in Indiana you've probably never heard of. (http://www.goearlham.com/index.aspx?path=mbball&)  (It's true!  You know it's true!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 16, 2010, 12:18:05 AM
Lets go Witt, beat up on IU-East.

As last two years, Witt will be short handed for the first month at least as Josh Mckee and Micheal Cooper are still in football mode right now. We'll see what freshamn step up this year!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2010, 11:57:26 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 11, 2010, 02:54:17 PM
Tuesday:
Grove City at Kenyon
Albion at Ohio Wesleyan
Wittenberg at IU-East
Marian (IN) at Wabash

GCC/Kenyon, 6:00pm: video, audio, and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
Albion/OWU, 7:30pm: audio/video and live stats (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1) (tune in for the women vs. ND(O) at 5:30!)
Witt/IUE, 7:00pm: video, audio, and live stats (http://www.iueredwolves.com/sport/8/1.php)
Marian/Wabash, 7:30pm: Audio (http://www.wabash.edu/kane/realaudio/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 16, 2010, 01:37:35 PM
That Albion at OWU game might just be worth tuing in for!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2010, 02:30:45 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 16, 2010, 01:37:35 PM
That Albion at OWU game might just be worth tuing in for!
OWU games are almost always worth tuning it, thanks to the Yoder brothers (aka @StreamOWUSports (http://twitter.com/#!/StreamOWUSports) on Twitter).  They do a great job and make even the dullest games fun.  And they do most men's and women's home games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 16, 2010, 04:10:06 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 16, 2010, 02:30:45 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 16, 2010, 01:37:35 PM
That Albion at OWU game might just be worth tuing in for!
OWU games are almost always worth tuning it, thanks to the Yoder brothers (aka @StreamOWUSports (http://twitter.com/#!/StreamOWUSports) on Twitter).  They do a great job and make even the dullest games fun.  And they do most men's and women's home games.

IIRC, the Yoder bros. were butchering the pronunciation of something during their webcast with Wooster last year.  I'm thinking they weren't pronouncing Wooster correctly?  Or was it a player's name?  Pretty sure they were saying Wooooooster.  But now that you mention they make the games fun, maybe they were doing it intentionally?   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 16, 2010, 05:21:59 PM
One of the many pluses of the former two Wooster websites was the ability to click through on any of the opponents on the schedule to get to their own basketball web page.  Presto, that nice function no longer exists.  And, they've completely eliminated mention of the non-Wooster tournament games (and, hence, the times)  Again, style over substance, and I don't even care for the style. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2010, 06:40:11 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 16, 2010, 04:10:06 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 16, 2010, 02:30:45 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 16, 2010, 01:37:35 PM
That Albion at OWU game might just be worth tuing in for!
OWU games are almost always worth tuning it, thanks to the Yoder brothers (aka @StreamOWUSports (http://twitter.com/#!/StreamOWUSports) on Twitter).  They do a great job and make even the dullest games fun.  And they do most men's and women's home games.

IIRC, the Yoder bros. were butchering the pronunciation of something during their webcast with Wooster last year.  I'm thinking they weren't pronouncing Wooster correctly?  Or was it a player's name?  Pretty sure they were saying Wooooooster.  But now that you mention they make the games fun, maybe they were doing it intentionally?   :)
They both know how to pronounce "Wooster," but one of them (I forget which) intentionally says it the wrong way.  All in good fun.  They're actually very respectful fans who pull for their Bishops and like to have fun, but give proper respect to the opponent.  That's one reason why I like them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 16, 2010, 06:54:32 PM
QuoteLet's see if that pays off against their next opponent on Wednesday, some little Quaker school in Indiana you've probably never heard of.  (It's true!  You know it's true!)

From your mouth to the ears of the Jug Rox' deadliest gunner.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2010, 07:34:21 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 16, 2010, 05:21:59 PM
One of the many pluses of the former two Wooster websites was the ability to click through on any of the opponents on the schedule to get to their own basketball web page.  Presto, that nice function no longer exists.
Yeah, I liked that feature, and am sorry it is gone.

I see that Kodey Haddox, the NCAC Newcomer of the Year in 2007-08 (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/mballncac08.pdf), has returned to Kenyon for his senior season.  He had 20 points tonight to lead the Lords to a season-opening win over Grove City, 83-76 (OT).  Uros Vasiljevik also hd 20, and Marcus Healey added 19, including 5 of 7 from the arc.  Congratulations to Coach Dan Priest for his first win in his Kenyon career!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 16, 2010, 08:08:36 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 16, 2010, 05:21:59 PM
One of the many pluses of the former two Wooster websites was the ability to click through on any of the opponents on the schedule to get to their own basketball web page.  Presto, that nice function no longer exists.  And, they've completely eliminated mention of the non-Wooster tournament games (and, hence, the times)  Again, style over substance, and I don't even care for the style. 
Totally agree!  Guess we have to do it the old fashioned way and copy & paste the school in google...  :-\

They don't even have a season outlook this year on the website announcing all the promissing newcomers and such?!   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 16, 2010, 08:18:55 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 16, 2010, 08:08:36 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 16, 2010, 05:21:59 PM
One of the many pluses of the former two Wooster websites was the ability to click through on any of the opponents on the schedule to get to their own basketball web page.  Presto, that nice function no longer exists.  And, they've completely eliminated mention of the non-Wooster tournament games (and, hence, the times)  Again, style over substance, and I don't even care for the style. 
Totally agree!  Guess we have to do it the old fashioned way and copy & paste the school in google...  :-\

They don't even have a season outlook this year on the website announcing all the promissing newcomers and such?!   

But it's all shiny and stuff, with gold glitter and the smell of licorice air freshener!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2010, 08:41:56 PM
Wittenberg falls at IU-East, 90-84, despite a huge 26 pt., nine rebound game from Clayton Black.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 16, 2010, 09:03:01 PM
Question: where did Matt Croce from kenyon go to? did he resign and take a job elsewhere or was he forced out?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2010, 09:10:41 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 16, 2010, 09:03:01 PM
Question: where did Matt Croce from kenyon go to? did he resign and take a job elsewhere or was he forced out?
Matt Croci resigned to devote more time to his family.  He is not coaching anywhere this season, to my knowledge, but neither was he forced to resign.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2010, 09:30:21 PM
OWU fought back from a large early deficit to tie the game with about 13 minutes to go, but faded down the stretch and fell to Albion, 66-57, at Branch Rickey.  The Bishops could only hit 34% of their shots, buried just one of 12 from the arc, committed 19 turnovers, and missed 8 free throws.  On the bright side, they forced 19 turnovers, and grabbed 18 offensive rebounds.  Marshall Morris had 16 points and 9 boards, while Tim Brady could only muster 10 points on an icy 4/15 shooting night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 16, 2010, 10:03:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 16, 2010, 08:41:56 PM
Wittenberg falls at IU-East, 90-84, despite a huge 26 pt., nine rebound game from Clayton Black.

Interesting score.......noted, IU-East is now 7-0, 6 nobodies but hold a win over D2 NAIA II Union College in Kentucky (which may be another nobody).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 16, 2010, 10:05:36 PM
Quote from: sac on November 16, 2010, 10:03:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 16, 2010, 08:41:56 PM
Wittenberg falls at IU-East, 90-84, despite a huge 26 pt., nine rebound game from Clayton Black.

Interesting score.......noted, IU-East is now 7-0, 6 nobodies but hold a win over D2 Union College in Kentucky.

Union (KY) is NAIA D2, sac.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 16, 2010, 10:10:25 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 16, 2010, 10:05:36 PM
Quote from: sac on November 16, 2010, 10:03:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 16, 2010, 08:41:56 PM
Wittenberg falls at IU-East, 90-84, despite a huge 26 pt., nine rebound game from Clayton Black.

Interesting score.......noted, IU-East is now 7-0, 6 nobodies but hold a win over D2 Union College in Kentucky.

Union (KY) is NAIA D2, sac.

right you are.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2010, 10:21:47 PM
FYI ghs, here's a post from March--
Quote from: David Collinge on March 29, 2010, 10:06:17 PM
http://www.d3jobs.com/show/vYebyblr (http://www.d3jobs.com/show/vYebyblr)
No official announcement yet, at least none that I've seen, but my sources tell me that Matt Croci has decided to step away from basketball for a bit and, accordingly, has resigned his position at Kenyon.  This is a guy who's been an NCAC hoops guy for much of his adult life, including four years as a player at Wittenberg which earned him a spot on the NCAC 20th Anniversary team (http://www.northcoast.org/20/20bkb.html#Men%27s%2020th%20Anniversary%20Team).  Under his leadership, the Lords have moved up to become a competitive program year in and year out, bringing in the kind of talented student-athletes that Kenyon's men's hoops hasn't enjoyed since the days of Jamie Harless.  The NCAC and Kenyon College will miss his contributions, and I hope you'll all join me in wishing him the best of success and happiness.
--and a follow-up from May--
Quote from: David Collinge on May 22, 2010, 06:07:40 PM
Kenyon has a new head coach, and he looks like he may be a good one.  His name is Dan Priest, and he's been the head coach at Hendrix College for the past six seasons, turning an 0-23 program into a competitive one in the SCAC.  He's a graduate of Ohio Northern and has previous coaching experience at Hanover, Ohio Dominican, and briefly at Indiana State and Miami (OH).  Welcome to the NCAC, Dan, and best of success with the Lords!

Kenyon press release (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x35141.xml)
D3Hoops.com press release (http://www.d3hoops.com/pressreleases.php?release=3827)
Hendrix press release (http://www.hendrix.edu/Athletics/news.aspx?id=46861)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2010, 10:28:07 PM
Those of you looking at the OWU/Albion box score (or, in fact, the OWU roster; or, for that matter, the POY poll above) may notice the absence of Pat Pellerite.  Pellerite, who earned all-conference honors for each of his two seasons in Delaware, has transferred to a non-D3 school for personal, non-basketball-related reasons, and I wish him the best.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 17, 2010, 11:52:34 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 16, 2010, 08:08:36 PM
They don't even have a season outlook this year on the website announcing all the promissing newcomers and such?!   

Ask and ye shall receive...  :P   ;D

2010-11 Season Outlook (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/releases/20101117tao2kc)

Better late than never I guess...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 17, 2010, 12:39:48 PM
This weekend's schedule at Wooster:

Saturday

Women's Nan Nichols Tournament Semifinals

1 PM - SUNY Geneseo vs Trine
3 PM - Thiel vs Wooster

Men's Al Van Wie Classic

6 PM - Miami-Middletown vs The University of Northwestern Ohio
8 PM - Cincinnati Christian vs Wooster

Sunday

Women's Nan Nichols Tournament Finals

1 PM - Consolation Game
3 PM - Championship Game

The Van Wie Classic has been reduced to a one-day event.  Still, the first game might be interesting.  Northwestern is 0-2, but both were tough losses to strong opponents.  They were beaten by last year's NAIA champions, the University of St. Francis, 79-70.  And, they dropped a tough one to Mt. Vernon Nazarene, in overtime, 83-78.  They feature two local players, senior center Kyle Gillette of Loudonville and freshman guard Nate Bolyard of Orrville.  Bolyard is averaging 28 points a game in the young season while Gillette is at 13 ppg and 10.5 rpg.

Miami-Middleton is currently 1-2 with the losses coming to local schools Walsh and Malone.  Their schedule claims that they are playing at Cincinnati Christian tonight at the same time that that school is supposed to be here playing Wooster.  We'll see how that works out.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on November 17, 2010, 01:02:14 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 16, 2010, 08:08:36 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 16, 2010, 05:21:59 PM
One of the many pluses of the former two Wooster websites was the ability to click through on any of the opponents on the schedule to get to their own basketball web page.  Presto, that nice function no longer exists.  And, they've completely eliminated mention of the non-Wooster tournament games (and, hence, the times)  Again, style over substance, and I don't even care for the style. 
Totally agree!  Guess we have to do it the old fashioned way and copy & paste the school in google...  :-\

They don't even have a season outlook this year on the website announcing all the promissing newcomers and such?!   

You could use our schedules. :)

I can speak from some experience on this -- transitioning a website over to a new platform is a ton of work and when we did this the past couple of months, it didn't leave me the amount of time I would have liked to do other things on the site. So D3hoops was pretty quiet in October and early November, preseason All-Americans were late, we barely did season previews at all, etc.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 17, 2010, 02:28:39 PM
Oh by the way, Wabash defeated Marian last night, 66-51.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 17, 2010, 03:18:23 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 11, 2010, 02:54:17 PM
Wednesday:
Cincinnati Christian (who?) at Wooster
Earlham (who?) at Denison
Hiram vs. Otterbein at Geneva

CCU/COW, 7:30pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule)
EC/DU, 7:30pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html)
Hiram/Ott, 6:00pm -- no live coverage that I can locate -- this is probably due to the fact that this game is scheduled for Friday -- d'oh!

-------------------------------

Both Wooster and Denison are out to double-digit leads early in their games.
Now both lead by 20 or more as the halftimes approach.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 17, 2010, 08:11:33 PM
Wooster is cruising, up 60-36 at the half.  Nathan Balch already has 20 points in 17 minutes.  Nobody else played more than 12 minutes as Steve Moore is substituting liberally, using 11 Scots in the half.  Wooster is hitting 59% overall and 57% from the arc, and owns the boards by a 29-12 count.  The Scots have 15 assists (on 22 buckets) vs. 5 turnovers.  It seems and sounds like they're doing pretty much everything right so far.

Denison is thumping Earlham at the half by a 50-29 count.  Larry Farmer, who did not start tonight or on Monday (GoRed--?), already has a double-double, with 13 pts. (6/8 from the floor) and 10 boards.  Dimonde Hale started cold, missing four of his first five shots, but picked it up to finish the half with 13 points on 6/11 shooting.  Denison hit 60% of their first-half shots; Earlham (10/28) didn't.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 17, 2010, 09:06:20 PM
Final:  Wooster 103  Cincinnati Christian 78 :)

Wooster opens with an easy win over Cincy Christian.  Scots were led tonight by Nathan Balch with 27 points, Matt Fegan with 19 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 14 points (8 boards) and Ian Franks with 12 points.

Wooster shot 51% from the floor compared to only 39% for Cincy Christian.  Scots also shot 47% on three pointers and made 14 three pointers led by Fegan with 5 and Balch with 3.  Wooster won the battle of the boards by a 50 to 33 count while both teams had only 11 turnovers.

Next up is Bethany at home on Saturday in the Al Van Wie tourney.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 17, 2010, 09:10:13 PM
Wooster coasts to the 103-78 win.  Balch ended up with 27, and Matt Fegan added 19.  The Scots had 28 assists, but this new "live stats" program won't tell me who had them individually.  Wooster ended up hitting about half of their shots (51% overall, 47% arc, 57% line) and had a helpful +17 on the boards.  It sounds like Wooster may have lost touted frosh Scott Purcell with a potentially serious knee injury, and has already lost Mike Evans for two weeks minimum with a broken hand.  (Cross-posted with wsf.)

Denison also coasts, winning 79-58.  Hale took one-third of the Big Red's shots, making a dozen for 28 points.  Farmer ended up with 16-and-13, as Denison was +13 on the glass.  Denison shot less frequently than Wooster, but with similar accuracy: 48% overall, 40% arc, 77% line.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 17, 2010, 09:23:08 PM
David - position your cursor over a player's name and his individual stats appear in a popup box.

Of the 28 assists for Wooster:  Franks had 6, Hallowell -6, Balch -3, Fegan -3, Warnes -3, Claytor -2 and several others with 1 each.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 17, 2010, 09:31:33 PM
Wooster beats Cin---- but you already knew that. :)

So, just my normal random remarks:

1. A very light crowd for the home opener, even considering the opponent.  The contest had the feel of an exhibition rather than a regular season game.  The weather was fine, so it's not that.  I wonder if the construction, which forces a longer walk to the north end of the building to enter, was a factor.

2. A third injury that happened late was to Matt Fegan's ankle; hopefully it's not serious.

3. Wooster definitely had it's outside shooting touch back tonight, at least early.

4. Nothing else to report, and being in a benevolent mood, I'll refrain from mentioning that the officials were in mid-season form.  Oops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 17, 2010, 09:37:32 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 17, 2010, 09:31:33 PM
2. A third injury that happened late was to Matt Fegan's ankle; hopefully it's not serious.
Steve Moore indicated that it was a mild sprain, not serious.

Thanks for the tip, wsf.  Technology still baffles me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 17, 2010, 10:16:14 PM
888 (which sounds a bit...um...fishy...not that the Amidon / Fendley / Harris Wabash attendance algorithm was exact...heh...) at a non-conference game in November against a team that struggles in the NAIA that really no one has heard of? Not a bad crowd really. I think many programs would take a crowd of 900 for ANY game!

Well, if they could hold 900 in their gym...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 17, 2010, 10:50:39 PM
QuoteLarry Farmer, who did not start tonight or on Monday (GoRed--?),

I heard Larry sat out the preseason contests due to a minor injury.  It looks like Ghiloni's starting him slowly and preserving him and some of the other starters early on to make sure they last the season.  Injuries hurt them last year with Leffew out all season and Garabedian sitting out several games.  I think Bob's making sure he doesn't push the horses too hard in the early part of the season unless he has to.  They will need a full tank of gas when the conference season gets underway.  I actually like the idea of bringing a stronger player off the bench to change the tempo - forcing the defense to adjust early and keeping them off balance.   

Tonight's result was encouraging to see on top of a strong second half against Marietta Monday.  They outplayed a taller team using speed and passing and I like the mix of slashing to the basket with Hale and Farmer and a host of outside options with Stockton, Garabedian, Tiberi and Leffew all able to drain the long shot.  The shift in offensive sets away from the traditional Denison offense will be refreshing if they stay with it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 18, 2010, 10:24:09 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 17, 2010, 09:10:13 PM
It sounds like Wooster may have lost touted frosh Scott Purcell with a potentially serious knee injury, and has already lost Mike Evans for two weeks minimum with a broken hand.

It sounds as if Purcell had this same injury in high school and may have re-injured it.  Moore said they won't know much until the MRI is done.

Tough way for a young man to start his college career...  :-\


As for the game, I liked that Wooster only committed 11 turnovers.  This was clearly a point of emphasis by Coach Moore this offseason and to only commit 11 turnovers against a team that likes to press and force turnovers is a promissing sign.

One thing I didn't like was 56% at the line.  Looks like some extra work at the charity stripe is in order.

David, you had mentioned your vote for 'Wooster player other than Franks' was for Wick.  While I liked what I saw from him last night, Nate Balch may just be that 'other' player if he continues to play like he did last night!  I know it's just one game, but he usually doesn't start playing like he played last night until the post-season!  I think last night just made everyone take notice that if your objective is slowing down Franks, that will not be enough if Wooster continues to get perfomances like what we saw from both Balch and Fegan!

Lastly, is it just me or is Ryan Snyder a clone of Nate Balch?  Apparently it's not just me as I was watching the replay of the game on Clear Picture and the play-by-play guy mistakingly called out Balch as having gone cold from the outside when it was in fact Snyder!   :D  Overall, I think this freshman class has the potential to be another very good class if they can stick it out!   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 18, 2010, 01:42:46 PM
I see Wooster as a very balanced team, and as long as no one cares about individual numbers, they have the ability to go far.

I don't think you can say enough about Matt Fegan.  When I first watched him as a frosh, struggling to get the ball up court against pressure, my opinion was that if he had any future at all at Wooster it was at the shooting guard position.  But this guy came back his sophomore year having totally reinvented himself athletically.  He was faster, stronger, and an improved ballhandler.  It was clear that he always had the basketball intellect, and this season you can see that he's combined that with experience and is confidently running the offense.  He'll never be quick, but he's quicker than he was, and nobody's going to easily take the ball away from him anymore.  And the kid shoots it like the legendary Devin Fulk. :)

As for Wickliffe, I can't recall any other Scot in recent memory that has made such steady improvement in his game from year to year.  This guy is an undersized post player with decent but not great athletic ability who gives everything he has on every play.  As a freshman he got pushed around.  Now he does the pushing.  His moves are plain vanilla but he finishes strong and the ball goes in the hoop.  And nobody hits the floor more often than this guy.  He'll be very much missed when this season is finished.

Nathan Balch's game is old school at its best.  Of course he can shoot the three, with the ability to square up and get it off on a dime.  But he can shoot on the run with a mixture of mid-range jumpers and floating bank shots.  He does all of this while moving without the ball, something that he's learned well over the last couple of years.  Moreover, he's a solid defender, gets out on the break, and is the team's best free throw shooter. Balch's position, too, will be a huge hole to fill next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2010, 02:31:14 PM
No love for Chris "the Truth" Roberts in the poll... :-\

Tonight's slate:
OWU vs. Heidelberg, 5:30pm at Calvin -- looks like live video, audio, and stats (http://www.calvin.edu/sports/news/comments/one-stop-shopping-guide-for-live-stats-live-video-and-live-audio-for-busy-c/), via Calvin, even though the Knights are not playing
Hiram vs. Otterbein (for real this time), 6pm at Geneva -- no live coverage as far as I am aware
Kenyon at Albion, 8pm -- Audio (Albion) and live stats (http://www.albion.edu/sports/mens-sports/basketball/schedule/1119)
Earlham at Wabash, 8pm -- live audio (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball/schedule)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on November 19, 2010, 02:42:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 19, 2010, 02:31:14 PM
Tonight's slate:
OWU vs. Heidelberg, 5:30pm at Calvin -- looks like live video, audio, and stats (http://www.calvin.edu/sports/news/comments/one-stop-shopping-guide-for-live-stats-live-video-and-live-audio-for-busy-c/), via Calvin, even though the Knights are not playing

Some in-the-house coverage of OWU/Heidelberg via the pre-eminent Calvin basketball blog on the internet: http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/2010/11/tip-off-tournament-live-blog-day-1.html

The Calvin feed will not have an audio broadcast, just the video stream with arena noise.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2010, 09:26:51 PM
Heidelberg nips OWU, 58-57
Hiram goes overtime to down Otterbein 74-63
Albion overhauls Kenyon, 72-66
Wabash 73, Earlham 58
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2010, 10:54:17 PM
Big schedule for Saturday, only Oberlin and Wittenberg are idle:

OWU at Calvin, 1pm -- video and live stats (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1)
Kenyon vs. Finlandia, 2pm (at Albion) -- Live stats (http://www.albion.edu/sports/mens-sports/basketball/schedule/1119)
Denison vs. Hanover, 3pm (at U. of Chicago) -- Audio and live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html) -- evidently this is at 3pm Central time
Hiram at Geneva, 3pm -- no live coverage
Franklin at Wabash, 3pm -- Audio (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball/schedule)
Pitt-Greensburg at Allegheny, 8pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball)
Bethany at Wooster, 8pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2010, 02:48:16 PM
OWU continues their early-season struggles, falling at Calvin 87-60.  Bishops hit just 27% of their shots, and got outrebounded by 7--not a recipe for success.

Kenyon is a wire-to-wire winner today, dropping Finlandia 70-58.  Uros Valiljevik leads the Lords with a 15 pt., 10 reb. afternoon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on November 20, 2010, 03:34:06 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 20, 2010, 02:48:16 PM
OWU continues their early-season struggles, falling at Calvin 87-60.  Bishops hit just 27% of their shots, and got outrebounded by 7--not a recipe for success.

So now after three games, their best shooting day was 33.9% in the opener against Albion. I saw them last night against Heidelberg and today against Calvin; it's gonna be a long year for the Bishops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2010, 05:25:57 PM
Geneva downs Hiram, 90-74, to capture the championship of their own Coaches vs. Cancer tournament.

Hanover disposes of Denison at Chicago, 64-54.  Jim Leffew pours in 18 on 8/11 shooting.  Larry Farmer rejoins the starting lineup, but has a quiet four point, five board, three assist game.

Wabash makes a statement, besting Franklin 96-55.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2010, 07:36:56 PM
The Scots game will be broadcast on WKVX 960am, as there's a local H.S. football game on WQKT and it's still in the first half.  Unfortunately, the webstream is for the football game.  It appears that the college radio station, Woo91 (http://www3.wooster.edu/woo91/), will carry the Scots, as they carried the first game (NW Ohio 82, Miami-Middletown 78, which just ended by the way), but, and no offense intended, I'd rather get the WKVX/Mike Breckenridge stream.  If anyone knows if and how that might be possible, please pass it along.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2010, 08:57:01 PM
The conference is out to a favorable 10-9 non-conference record so far, this season and Allegheny and Wooster both have double-digit halftime leads.  The Gators lead Pitt-Greensburg by 11, while the Scots are up 15 on Bethany (a team that defeated 'Gheny by a dozen on Monday.)

--------------------

Greensburg got back into the game shortly after halftime, and the second half was mostly a back-and-forth affair.  In the end, however, the Gators were able to withstand the rally and escape with a 71-67 verdict.  James Ness tallied 22 points and ten boards before fouling out with a couple of minutes left; frosh guard D'Andre Corbin added 20 points.

--------------------

Wooster won quite easily, using an all-frosh lineup to finish off a 79-52 thrashing.  As easy as shooting bison from a train, I suppose.  Nathan Balch had 21, including a beautiful-to-look-at 11-for-11 from the line, and Ian Franks added 18 points and a MVP plaque.  (Yes, he was the MVP of a one-game "tournament.")  The Scots dominated the glass 43-31 and outshot the Bison 41% (50% from deep) to 32%.     

---------------------

So the conference moves out to a 12-9 record in non-conference action.  Bully!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2010, 10:08:51 PM
Two games Sunday:

Catholic at Allegheny, 3pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/index.aspx?tab=basketball&path=mbball)
Denison at Chicago, 4pm -- Video and live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 20, 2010, 11:49:43 PM
Back from Timken where I watched Wooster slice up the Bethany Bison. :)

This game was essentially over in the first 8 minutes of the opening half.  With ~12 minutes remaining in the first half, Wooster had a 24 to 4 lead and the Scots never looked back.

Bethany went on a mini run to start the 2nd half and cut the lead to 11 points briefly but they never got any closer and the Wooster freshmen got plenty of mop up playing time.  As David noted, Wooster shot 50% on three pointers and made 12 of them.  The only negative was 16 turnovers with many in the 2nd half as Bethany pressed a lot trying to get back into game.

Ian Franks and Nathan Balch both played well tonight and it was also good to see Justin Hallowell nail several three pointers.  Of the freshmen, Ryan Snyder and Jimmy Orie looked the most comfortable on the floor, IMO.

Scots are now 2-0. ;D  Next up is a neutral site game vs. Ohio Northern next Saturday at the CMU tourney.

Interesting that John Carroll knocked off #5 Carthage in Wisconsin this afternoon.  The Wooster vs. JCU matchup in the Mose Hole tourney should be another great game.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 21, 2010, 11:50:55 AM
I'm surprised that the Big Red had trouble again this year with Hanover.  If anyone out there was at the game I'd like to hear their thoughts.  From the box score it looks like Hale and Garabedian didn't get their usual minutes and it doesn't look like it was due to foul trouble.  It will be interesting to see the video of the Chicago game and how they manage against what appears to be a very tall team.

Leffew had a great game and showed just how much scoring potential there is on this team.  There is a lot of depth in shooting, but the shot clock seems to remain their enemy.  The ball needs to go up when the opening is there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2010, 04:46:16 PM
Catholic has little difficulty with Allegheny, dropping the Gators 72-53.  D'Andre Corbin's dozen led the Gator scoring; Donte Briscoe added 8 points and 9 boards. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2010, 05:40:05 PM
Quote from: GoRed on November 21, 2010, 11:50:55 AMIt will be interesting to see the video of the Chicago game ...
Yeah, it would have been, except that it turns out there was no video after all.  Not on my computer, anyway.  Which is a shame because this was a real barn-burner, as the Big Red pull out the 66-65 victory.  Mike Garabedian coolly sank five free throws (he was 7-for-7 for 12 points) on back-to-back possessions in the closing moments, providing the final margin as the Maroons misfired on three 3-pointers in the final minute.  Larry Farmer had his breakout game for the season, pouring in 29 points and grabbing 9 boards.  DU shot 48% on the evening, hitting an even 50% of their treys and a decisive 87% (13/15) of their free throws.

NCAC non-conference record: 13-10.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 21, 2010, 05:57:14 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 21, 2010, 05:40:05 PM
Mike Garabedian coolly sank five free throws

I was watching live stats too.  How do we know he wasn't nervous as heck and that he didn't clang the ball all over the rim on each FT before they fell?? :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2010, 05:59:22 PM
Quote from: Titan Q on November 21, 2010, 05:57:14 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 21, 2010, 05:40:05 PM
Mike Garabedian coolly sank five free throws

I was watching live stats too.  How do we know he wasn't nervous as heck and that he didn't clang the ball all over the rim on each FT before they fell?? :)

Because Mike Garabedian is....cool.  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 21, 2010, 06:01:05 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 21, 2010, 05:59:22 PM
Quote from: Titan Q on November 21, 2010, 05:57:14 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 21, 2010, 05:40:05 PM
Mike Garabedian coolly sank five free throws

I was watching live stats too.  How do we know he wasn't nervous as heck and that he didn't clang the ball all over the rim on each FT before they fell?? :)

Because Mike Garabedian is....cool.  8-)

Well, that name is pretty cool...so "coolly sank" it is!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 21, 2010, 07:44:33 PM
Very surprised and extremely pleased  ;D.  Chicago beat Hanover by 18 two nights ago and Hanover took down the Big Red by 10 last night. 

Talked with someone who attended after the game and it sounds like Ghiloni shifted his philosophy after the Hanover game - sorry NCAC opponents, but no clues.  Mr. Farmer apparently attended and saw Junior play a huge game.  Nice game Larry!  Garabedian had 8 pts in the last 3 1/2 minutes after spending some time on the bench in foul trouble.  A Casey Stockton three kept it close with about 6 minutes to play too.  The Big Red held Chicago to just three points in the last 5 minutes.  Nice to see that both Illinois starters had a great homecoming victory.

Go Red!!  Case is the next UAA opponent on Tuesday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 22, 2010, 10:25:00 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 21, 2010, 05:40:05 PM
NCAC non-conference record: 13-10.

I'm asking because I don't have a clue, but this non-conference record seems to be better than normal for the NCAC.  Is this truly the case?  Seems to me like the NCAC always struggles to finish above .500 in non-conference action but maybe I'm just making stuff up again in my mind...  :P

Nice win for Denison yesterday.  Proves using comparitive scores doesn't really mean too much with UC beaing Hanover by 18 and Hanover beaing DU by 10.   8-) 

With DU getting off to a nice start and OWU off to their dreadful start, Denison looks more likely to challenge for a top 4 finish in the league than the Bishops do at the moment.  If OWU can't find their shooter's touch and soon, they could be staring at a verrrrrrry long season...  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 22, 2010, 11:01:00 AM
Last year, discounting NCAC and NCAA tourney games:

Wooster 5-4
Wittenberg 8-1
Wabash 5-4
Ohio Wesleyan 3-6
Oberlin 4-5
Kenyon 3-5
Hiram 3-6
Earlham 2-7
Denison 0-9
Allegheny 3-5

Total 36-52
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2010, 05:54:54 PM
Yeah, I haven't gone back and tallied it up or anything, but I began posting the non-con record because I think it's a good 100-200 points higher than previous seasons.  The women also have a winning record so far, which is even more amazing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2010, 06:31:54 PM
Tuesday games:

Penn St.-New Kensington at Allegheny, 7:00pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)
Case Western Reserve at Denison, 7:00pm -- Live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html)
Oberlin at Hilbert, 7:00pm -- no coverage
Wittenberg at Capital, 7:00pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/)
Wabash at Hanover, 7:30pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www.hanover.edu/athletics/men/basketball)
Kenyon at Washington & Jefferson, 8:00pm -- Live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 22, 2010, 09:42:15 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 22, 2010, 05:54:54 PM
Yeah, I haven't gone back and tallied it up or anything, but I began posting the non-con record because I think it's a good 100-200 points higher than previous seasons.  The women also have a winning record so far, which is even more amazing.

I may do a couple of more years for spits and giggles after I get some client work done this week...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on November 23, 2010, 02:03:22 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 22, 2010, 06:31:54 PM
Tuesday games:

Case Western Reserve at Denison, 7:00pm -- Live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html)

My brother plays at Case. I went to Wooster. Denison wins, NCAC wins, I win. Case wins, my brother wins, the family wins. A rare win-win situation for me today. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 23, 2010, 10:45:16 AM
Quote from: WooMix on November 23, 2010, 02:03:22 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 22, 2010, 06:31:54 PM
Tuesday games:

Case Western Reserve at Denison, 7:00pm -- Live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html)

My brother plays at Case. I went to Wooster. Denison wins, NCAC wins, I win. Case wins, my brother wins, the family wins. A rare win-win situation for me today. :)

Not so rare; CWRU has upcoming games with Kenyon, Hiram, and Oberlin, as well as the We-Usedta-Be-In-Da-NCAC Classic against Earlham.  (And the Case women have five games against NCAC teams, including one at Wooster on Dec. 19.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 23, 2010, 11:23:05 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 22, 2010, 06:31:54 PM
Tuesday games:

Penn St.-New Kensington at Allegheny, 7:00pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)
Case Western Reserve at Denison, 7:00pm -- Live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html)
Oberlin at Hilbert, 7:00pm -- no coverage
Wittenberg at Capital, 7:00pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/)
Wabash at Hanover, 7:30pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www.hanover.edu/athletics/men/basketball)
Kenyon at Washington & Jefferson, 8:00pm -- Live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)

Well, the conference should conceivably be padding it's win total a bit after looking at these matchups.

I'm not really familiar with any of the NCAC opponents on the slate, but perusing over their records, it wouldn't be inconceivable for a clean sweep tonight.  Of course, I just gave everyone the kiss of death with that prognostication!   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 23, 2010, 12:09:23 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 23, 2010, 10:45:16 AM
Not so rare; CWRU has upcoming games with Kenyon, Hiram, and Oberlin, as well as the We-Usedta-Be-In-Da-NCAC Classic against Earlham.  (And the Case women have five games against NCAC teams, including one at Wooster on Dec. 19.)

Only a week after setting the record, Collinge now raises the bar with a five-hyphen classic!  With months to go in the season, will he make a run at double figures?  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on November 23, 2010, 12:23:00 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 23, 2010, 11:23:05 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 22, 2010, 06:31:54 PM
Tuesday games:

Penn St.-New Kensington at Allegheny, 7:00pm -- Live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)
Case Western Reserve at Denison, 7:00pm -- Live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html)
Oberlin at Hilbert, 7:00pm -- no coverage
Wittenberg at Capital, 7:00pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/)
Wabash at Hanover, 7:30pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www.hanover.edu/athletics/men/basketball)
Kenyon at Washington & Jefferson, 8:00pm -- Live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)

Well, the conference should conceivably be padding it's win total a bit after looking at these matchups.

I'm not really familiar with any of the NCAC opponents on the slate, but perusing over their records, it wouldn't be inconceivable for a clean sweep tonight.  Of course, I just gave everyone the kiss of death with that prognostication!   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on November 23, 2010, 12:23:56 PM
i highly doubt it>>> i predict the two "w" lose!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 23, 2010, 12:24:48 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 23, 2010, 11:23:05 AM
I'm not really familiar with any of the NCAC opponents on the slate, but perusing over their records, it wouldn't be inconceivable for a clean sweep tonight.  Of course, I just gave everyone the kiss of death with that prognostication!   ;D

Although the Spartans have struggled to open the season, a Denison win tonight would be a very good win.  Capital, as you well know, is never an easy place to win.  And I expect the Presidents will give the Lords all they can handle.  I'd be thrilled with a 6-0 night, but I'd settle for .500 or better.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 23, 2010, 12:40:30 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 23, 2010, 12:24:48 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 23, 2010, 11:23:05 AM
I'm not really familiar with any of the NCAC opponents on the slate, but perusing over their records, it wouldn't be inconceivable for a clean sweep tonight.  Of course, I just gave everyone the kiss of death with that prognostication!   ;D

Although the Spartans have struggled to open the season, a Denison win tonight would be a very good win.  Capital, as you well know, is never an easy place to win.  And I expect the Presidents will give the Lords all they can handle.  I'd be thrilled with a 6-0 night, but I'd settle for .500 or better.

Agreed.  The fact that so many of the key matcups have the NCAC on the road is what makes pulling off the clean sweep all the more difficult.  Witt is at Cap, Wabash is at Hanover and while I don't see Hilbert as that tough of an opponent for Oberlin, it is still a looooong road trip.  And I would also feel a LOT better about Kenyon's chances if they were playing at home as well. 

I guess what I'm saying is that I'm not expecting a clean sweep.  I'm just saying is isn't out of the realm of possibility which isn't something we have been able to say wrt non-conference slates involving the NCAC too often.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 23, 2010, 05:01:24 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 23, 2010, 12:24:48 PMAnd I expect the Presidents will give the Lords all they can handle.

You have to love it when a basketball game is also a contest between two systems of government.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 23, 2010, 05:35:17 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 23, 2010, 05:01:24 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 23, 2010, 12:24:48 PMAnd I expect the Presidents will give the Lords all they can handle.

You have to love it when a basketball game is also a contest between two systems of government.

Quick, get the Student Princes and the Diplomats and make it a tourney!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 23, 2010, 07:08:51 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 23, 2010, 05:35:17 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 23, 2010, 05:01:24 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 23, 2010, 12:24:48 PMAnd I expect the Presidents will give the Lords all they can handle.

You have to love it when a basketball game is also a contest between two systems of government.

Quick, get the Student Princes and the Diplomats and make it a tourney!

Searching unsuccessfully for some "Anarchists" to disrupt the basketball proceedings, I came across this list of nicknames.

http://www.smargon.net/nicknames/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 23, 2010, 07:56:42 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 23, 2010, 07:08:51 PMSearching unsuccessfully for some "Anarchists" to disrupt the basketball proceedings,


Idaho's Vandals might suffice.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 23, 2010, 08:51:43 PM
Capital 80, Wittenberg 56...ouchie
Allegheny 82, P-SUNK 44
Denison 78, CWRU 70...very nice
Wabash 68, Hanover 55

Kenyon leads W&J at the half 38-29

No report from Hilbert yet.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 23, 2010, 09:32:50 PM
Big Red only missed one shot in the last six minutes.  At one point, they hit four consecutive threes - two consecutive from Tiberi and one each from Garabedian and Leffew.  Most importantly, they hung tough the whole game again.  Hale and Farmer both had solid games again. 

It appears Coach G. has found a formula and is using all his weapons.  PLEASE DON'T CHANGE A THING!  With games like the past two under their belts, increased confidence can take this team places.  The NCAC will still be a tough road.  But right now they look good enough to take the UAA Championship!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 23, 2010, 09:40:43 PM
Did I mention they were out-reboounded 38-27? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 23, 2010, 09:44:17 PM
Kenyon goes wire-to-wire and drops W&J 75-67.  Democracy sucks, bloodlines rule!

Still no report from Hilbert.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fsant on November 23, 2010, 09:53:55 PM
Oberlin after being down 19 pts in the second half lost in 3 Overtimes

Heartbreaker


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 23, 2010, 10:09:12 PM
Thanks, fsant.  That's a bitch, though.  I see now that the score was 85-83 (3OT).

NCAC goes 4-2 which ain't bad, even if there's no joy in a couple of places.  We're now collectively 17-12 on the season.  It occurs to me that two reasons our non-conference record is improved might be that a) we don't have Earlham dragging us down to the seafloor, and b) we now have Earlham to beat up on.  :-*

Wednesday's lone game features Bluffton traveling to Hiram, 6pm -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fsant on November 23, 2010, 10:33:35 PM
Scotsfan called it ..... Long bus ride   .... Oberlin didn't get it together until the second half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 24, 2010, 09:31:32 AM
Quote from: fsant on November 23, 2010, 10:33:35 PM
Scotsfan called it ..... Long bus ride   .... Oberlin didn't get it together until the second half


Yeah.  I don't know much about Hilbert, but I figured the road trip alone would give Hilbert an advantage.  Turn the tables and have Hilbert come to Oberlin and it's a different story.  Nice to see the Yeomen fight back though!  Tough loss but at least they showed some fight!

Well, it wasn't the 6-0 sweep I was hoping for but 4-2 is still pretty damn nice! 

What the hell is up at Witt?  Penn, any insights to share?  I realize they're playing shorthanded without Cooper and he should be a welcome addition now that football is over, but still.  I didn't think Cap was 24 points better than Witt, with or without Cooper?!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 24, 2010, 11:22:01 AM
I"m not too sure what is up with Witt so far this year. I know Capital is going to be improved as they returned a lot from last year but an 0-2 start isn't how I envisioned the season starting out. Last night it looked like Capital just dominated the second half after a contested first half.

I think that Cooper being out hurts, but Josh McKee being out so far hurts even more. Mckee will be back December 4th at Allegheny for the conference opener and Cooper probably not til January I've been told cause of injuries but that's not set in stone.

They've obviously been hurt by lack of defense as coach brown alludes to in both articles from both losses as giving up 90 and 80 in two games is not WIttenberg basketball. Hoping to outscore teams will just not get the job done. Defense creates offense in fact.

I haven't been able to watch or be at either of the first two games this year as they've both been road games. In fact, Witt doesn't have a home game until December 20th. Plus my basketball officiating schedule is somewhat hectic so I'll try to see what I can uncover.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 24, 2010, 12:28:56 PM
I don't know how it falls to me, of all people, to point this out, but Wabash's Wes Smith (the favorite in our POY poll) is absolutely tearing it up so far this season.  He's averaging nearly 24 ppg in the first four Wabash games (all victories), is connecting on 57% of his shots, and has recorded 14 steals and 19 rebounds.  This hot start was noticed by the Conference office, who gave him the inaugural Player of the Week (http://www2.northcoast.org/basketball/potw/2010) award, even if his exploits have (temporarily) escaped the notice of this board.  (Where are all of your compadres, anyway, smeds?)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 24, 2010, 01:39:00 PM
Probably still hung over following the Monon Bell game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 24, 2010, 02:52:30 PM
I'm around. I haven't totally gotten into the hoops yet. I'm easing into it.

Wabash is doing as well as they are because of Wes and DC is right, he's "tearing it up".

This is the LGs best start since 1997 and that's not totally gone unnoticed by all of us. I'm also excited about this weekend's tourney at Wabash. I hope Wes and the team continue playing this well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Duster72 on November 24, 2010, 04:19:00 PM
I'm fired up about the LG's hot start...but have only ever posted on the football board and was scared to pop my cherry over here.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on November 24, 2010, 05:36:22 PM
I am lurking as always on the B-Ball board.... ;)  Excited about this Little Giants team, have been following W. Smith's develop and career at Wabash, he is something else.

Next couple of games should be interesting.  

Go Wabash!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on November 24, 2010, 07:04:39 PM
This may have been posted elsewhere. (apologies if it has)

DIII Game ends in 7 overtimes. Wow!

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/basketball/ncaa/11/24/skidmore.vermont.college.seven.overtimes.ap/

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 24, 2010, 07:47:10 PM
It's on the front page (http://www.d3hoops.com/landing/index), bashbrother.  D3hoops.com tends to cover D3hoops better than Sports Illustrated.

Hiram falls to hot-shooting Bluffton, 71-60.  Hiram got 16 more looks at the basket than the Beavers, but made one fewer field goal.  The Terriers also came up lame at the free throw line, hitting just 9 of 18. 

NCAC non-conference: 17-13.

Happy Thanksgiving to everyone!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on November 24, 2010, 10:16:15 PM
My bad, thanks David.  I haven't made it over here much in the past.   Still finding my way around.  ;) 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 25, 2010, 09:51:54 AM
Hope everyone has a safe and happy Thanksgiving!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 25, 2010, 01:55:03 PM
Happy Thanksgiving to all my Wabash and NCAC friends. We have much to be thankful for.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on November 26, 2010, 08:41:59 PM
Wabash 71
Otterbein 54

Final

Wabash went wire to wire in this one.   Wes Smith led the Little Giants with 34 points.

Wabash led 39 to 23 at half.

Wabash will now get ready for their toughest test (by far) of the season against highly ranked Randolph-Macon tomorrow at 3 pm. in the Championship game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 26, 2010, 10:06:59 PM
NCAC moves to 18-14 on the season.

Saturday games:
Wooster vs. Ohio Northern (at Carnegie Mellon), 1pm -- Audio (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule) and maybe live stats (http://www.enrollment.cmu.edu/athletics/mbasketball/xlive.htm)
Randolph-Macon at Wabash, 1pm -- Audio (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball/schedule)
Oberlin at Earlham, 3pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/)
Wittenberg vs. Washington & Jefferson (at Rochester), 6pm -- Audio (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/) and maybe live stats (http://rochester.edu/athletics/mbasketball/index.php)
Indiana U. East vs. Ohio Wesleyan (at DePauw), 8pm -- Live stats (http://www.depauw.edu/ath/mbasket/2011/rokicki.asp)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: billy the kid on November 27, 2010, 09:38:00 AM
You can bet Randolph Macon will play defense on Smith unlike Otterbein letting him run loose most of the game. Coach Reynolds believes in offense, but when you only score 54 points, you might outta think about teaching defense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 27, 2010, 10:07:38 AM
Quote from: billy the kid on November 27, 2010, 09:38:00 AM
Coach Reynolds believes in offense, but when you only score 54 points, you might outta think about teaching defense.

What?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DadofBashWarrior.. on November 27, 2010, 10:16:28 AM
This is the first time I have been on this board...have been on the football board for 6 years but never really followed basketball much...

I see that Wabash is 5-0 and is playing a top 5 ranked team Randolph Macon...

1. Do they have a chance to beat them?
2. Does Wabash have a better team this year as I have never seen them even ranked in the top 25 over the years (I have not really checked very often over that time so I may be wrong on that)
3. Is Wabash expected to win conference?

I see the numbers for Wes...not too shabby
I did follow the Hope College women team last year some as I have a daughter there...

Any responses are appreciated...

WABASH ALWAYS FIGHTS
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2010, 11:04:32 AM
DadofBashWarrior - welcome to the basketball board! :)

Responding to your questions:
1. Randolph Macon is #2 nationally and returned all their starters from a 26-7 team that went to the Final Four last year and lost to the National Champ.  Yes, Wabash has a chance but it would be a big upset today if the Little Giants knock off the Yellow Jackets.

2. Yes, I think Wabash has a better team because Wes Smith has raised his game this year and AJ Sutherlin is a nice transfer addition from Earlham.  Wabash has not played a good team yet despite the 5-0 record so today's game should be a good benchmark to check their improvement.

3. Wabash was picked 4th in the NCAC preseason poll by the Coaches...after Wooster, Witt and OWU.  I actually think that Wabash should have been picked 2nd and I see them as a serious contender in the NCAC this season.

Good luck to the Little Giants vs RandyMac! :)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2010, 11:15:09 AM
Wooster faces a big man challenge today with the Ohio Northern Polar Bears. ;)  ONU's lineup:

Ohio Northern 1-0  ONU beat Defiance 93-90 in 2 OT's in their opener
C - 6'9" Scott Schneele (26 ppg, 12 rpg, 4 apg)
F -  6'3" Joe Staley (12 ppg, 9 rpg)
G - 5'11" Tony Meyer (11 ppg, 3 apg)
G - 6'1" Taylor Kuhlman (10 ppg, 5 rpg)
G - 6'2" Branden Rushton (8 ppg, 2 rpg)

Top player off the bench in their opener was 6'3" Jared Horstman with 17 points (5 three pointers)

So, Wooster will need to slow down their 6'9" big guy Scheele and defend the three pointers by Jared Horstman and Tony Meyer.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 27, 2010, 11:55:41 AM
To add on to what wsf has said...

I'm not sure Smith has raised his game as much as he has just brought it consistently so far this season.  Wes has had the ability to go off for 20+ points every night since the day he stepped on the floor for Wabash.  He's just doing it night after night so far this season.  But it's more than just Wes.  Sutherlin is a nice addition and really fills a lot of the things that Aaron Brock has done over the last couple of years (and will get better as his knee continues to regain strength).  But there's more.  Wabash has added a pair of freshman (Wes Zimmerman and Pete Nicksic) who are both contributing quality minutes already this season.  All told, Wabash runs 9-10 deep without a lot of drop off. 

Can Wabash beat R-MC today?  Sure they can.  Anytime you have the best player on the floor, and I believe Wabash does today, you've got a chance to win.  If Wabash can keep rebounding and playing defense the way they have so far this season, they'll be right there. 

As far as league play goes, we'll have to wait and see.  If you're going to win this league you have to 1) find a way to beat Wooster at least once and 2) not lose any games you shouldn't lose.  Wabash has done a little too much of the latter to be a factor at the top of the standings lately.  This year feels a little different though.  The LGs look like they will make a run at it...maybe the best chance they've had since Wabash's first year in the league in '99-'00. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2010, 01:37:15 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 28  Ohio Northern 25

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 6 points and Bryan Wickliffe with 6 points.  ONU's top scorers are Branden Rushton with 7 points and Scott Schnelle with 6 points.

UPDATE: Wooster starts 2nd half on a 9-2 run.  Now Wooster 37 ONU 27
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2010, 02:36:10 PM
Final:  Wooster 67  Ohio Northern 53  :)

Wooster was led by Ian Franks with 20 points, Nathan Balch with 15 points and Bryan Wickliffe with 11 points.

Ohio Northern was led by Scott Schnelle with 14 points, Joe Staley with 11 points, Branden Rushton with 11 points and Taylor Kuhlman with 10 points.

Scots shot well today at 54.5% from the floor compared to only 36.5% for ONU.  Wooster also won the battle of the boards by a dominating 37 to 17 count.

Wooster is now 3-0.  ;D  Tomorrow is the tourney championship game vs. the Carnegie Mellon/Susque winner.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 27, 2010, 02:39:05 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2010, 11:15:09 AM
Wooster faces a big man challenge today with the Ohio Northern Polar Bears. ;)  ONU's lineup:

WSF, I only got to hear the very end of the game, but looking at the stats, the Scots had a 37-17  :o :o rebounding advantage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2010, 02:42:04 PM
kiltedbryan - great point, and they also held 6'9" Scott Schnelle to only 14 points compared to the 26 that he dropped on Defiance!  :) ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 27, 2010, 02:51:18 PM
Well, playing Randolph Macon is definitely a step up from IU-Kokomo! (from Pete Thorn's past...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2010, 04:00:32 PM
At the Half:  Wabash 36  #2 Randolph-Macon 26

Little Giants are on track for a big upset.  Wabash is being led by Wes Smith with 16 points and AJ Sutherlin with 8 points.

GO BASH!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 27, 2010, 04:21:10 PM
Quote from: billy the kid on November 27, 2010, 09:38:00 AM
You can bet Randolph Macon will play defense on Smith unlike Otterbein letting him run loose most of the game.

You were saying?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on November 27, 2010, 04:24:47 PM
Wabash 60
RMC 45

FINAL

Wabash 6-0 ... Bring on the Dannies!




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 27, 2010, 04:47:49 PM
There may be a Wes Smith sighting at d3hoops.com this evening.  Well deserved. This is a helluva win for Wabash.  6-0! WAF!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on November 27, 2010, 04:49:57 PM
WOW  :o

I am officially reconsidering my poll vote for Ian Franks  :-X
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2010, 04:50:37 PM
Congrats to Wabash on a Big Upset of #2 RandyMac! ;D  Excellent win by the Little Giants!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 27, 2010, 04:55:39 PM
Wow. Just Wow. Great win for The LGs. I gotta say this is a great run. Wes is bringing it every game. This is clearly Wabash's best team in a long while. Let's keep it rolling! Wabash Always Fights!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2010, 05:00:37 PM
Oberlin gets hammered in what sounded like an ugly game at Earlham, 80-68.  Not a game Oberlin should lose.  If this is another "long bus trip" loss, maybe OC should use some of their endowment on a plane.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 27, 2010, 05:09:17 PM
Does Oberlin have the bus from "Major League"? :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 27, 2010, 05:10:19 PM
Great win for the Little Giants and for the NCAC.

For the Yeomen, not so much.

Any sense on how stiff of a test DePauw is expected to be for Wabash?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on November 27, 2010, 05:15:36 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on November 27, 2010, 05:10:19 PM
Any sense on how stiff of a test DePauw is expected to be for Wabash?

Depauw beat Franklin by 6, Wabash beat Franklin by 36.... don't know if this is much of a gauge, but at least it is something.

Wabash will need to play well to beat the Dannies!...... WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on November 27, 2010, 05:41:41 PM
I certainly don't expect Wabash to win by 47 this time  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 27, 2010, 05:47:26 PM
Quote from: Schwami on November 27, 2010, 05:41:41 PM
I certainly don't expect Wabash to win by 47 this time  ;D

Did you expect it on 11/13?  :)

One thing I can point to as a key for the solid Wabash start so far is that Coach Petty has seemed to solve the slow starts to games that have really plagued Wabash in the last couple of seasons. Wabash is owning the first half this season, and the results speak for themselves. It's a lot easier to win when you're not the team chasing a big deficit.

Looking forward to seeing Wabash in the top 25 for the first time in a looong time. I've got to believe that 6-0 and a comfortable win over #2 gets them in the club.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 27, 2010, 06:34:18 PM
good win by wabash! here's hoping Witt can get number 1 tonight

**Update** Witt up 53-39 with 8 minutes to play. Chris Sullivan clearly decided he didn't want to go 0-3 as he has 22 points tonight
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2010, 07:34:20 PM
Wittenberg has bombed away tonight; with 3:00 left (and a two-touchdown lead), the Tigers have already launched 28 three point attempts--that's more than half of their shots attempted.  Sullivan has drained eight (of 16) and now has 28 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 27, 2010, 07:43:07 PM
DC - update Sullivan has 30 points---we're probably the only 2 that are actually watching that matchup
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2010, 07:48:16 PM
And it's a final, Wittenberg prevails 67-57.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 27, 2010, 08:08:03 PM
Wow! Just wow! Congrats LG's!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 27, 2010, 08:20:25 PM
And that's the first time Wabash has been 6-0 since...1922-23!

That was a pretty fair team. Wabash won the first intercollegiate championship in 1922. But after starting 6-0 in 1922-23 they struggled and finished 17-10.

The next year (1923-24) they only went 4-8, and 1924-25 went 18-1, losing only to Wisconsin by 1.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2010, 09:14:17 PM
Aside to Wooster fans:  Bethany, a team that Wooster toyed with the other day, gave John Carroll a game tonight, leading by three at the half before falling 90-85.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2010, 09:14:58 PM
Wooster will play at Carnegie Mellon tomorrow afternoon in the tourney championship game as CMU knocked off Susquehanna 84-72 this afternoon.

CMU Tartans are now 3-2 on the season.  Both of their losses have been on the road to undefeated teams while they have won their 3 home games.

Top 3 scorers for CMU this season:

6'6" Matthew Pettit (13.6 ppg, 7.6 rpg)
6'4" Christian Manoli (13.0 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 3.0 apg)
6'5" John Duhring (11.8 ppg, 4.8 rpg)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2010, 10:10:39 PM
Signs of Life?

OWU 72, IU-East 64.

You may recall that IU-East topped Wittenberg in the Tigers' season opener.  Tim Brady got tired of seeing all of those POY poll votes for Wes Smith and poured in 28 points of his own.  Marshall Morris added 19, and Greg White (http://connect2.owu.edu/issues/20100715/athletics/white.html) recorded a double-double with 11 points and 10 boards.  OWU owned the glass by a 50-35 count and hit just under half their shots (28/58), despite missing every attempt from outside the arc.  OWU advances to face host and soon-to-be conference rival DePauw in the championship of the Mike Rokicki Community vs. Cancer Challenge.

NCAC Composite record: 22-15.  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2010, 10:25:13 PM
Sunday's games:

Wittenberg at Rochester, 3pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/)
Wooster at Carnegie Mellon, 3pm -- Audio (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule) and live stats (http://www.cmu.edu/athletics/stats/index.html)
OWU at DePauw, 4pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www.depauw.edu/ath/mbasket/2011/rokicki.asp)
Kenyon at Capital, 4pm -- Audio and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
Hiram at Baldwin-Wallace, 7pm -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 27, 2010, 11:34:59 PM
Carnegie Mellon's two conquerers may be undefeated, but c'mon.  The Milwaukee School of Engineering engineered a twenty-point victory over them!  And falling by 26 at Marietta?  I don't see this team as the CMU of yesteryear.  Wooster by 15-20, going away.

Ok, see that paragraph just up above?  The one utilizing the shoddy research?  Turns out that MSOE might be a bonafide powerhouse, with wins over the Wisconsins - Eau Claire and Oskosh, by gosh!  Maybe a loss to them, in Milwaukee, by twenty, isn't a resume-breaker after all.  Even Marietta, with a win over Maryville (who trounced Thomas More) seems to be better than usual.  Revised prediction: Wooster by 14-19, going away.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 28, 2010, 12:05:24 AM
Well, to be honest, they were picked last in the UAA. Last year they were 5-20. Though they were the only UAA member to finish with a losing record.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 28, 2010, 12:44:58 AM
Quote from: smedindy on November 28, 2010, 12:05:24 AM
Well, to be honest, they were picked last in the UAA. Last year they were 5-20. Though they were the only UAA member to finish with a losing record.

Year before that, 20-7 with a win over Wooster.  That's quite a turnaround. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 28, 2010, 10:03:04 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 27, 2010, 11:34:59 PM
Ok, see that paragraph just up above?  The one utilizing the shoddy research?  Turns out that MSOE might be a bonafide powerhouse, with wins over the Wisconsins - Eau Claire and Oskosh, by gosh! 

WIAC preseason poll...

http://www.wiacsports.com/news/2010/11/4/MBB_1104104452.aspx

(Eau Claire picked 7th...Oshkosh last.)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 28, 2010, 10:35:39 AM
Quote from: Titan Q on November 28, 2010, 10:03:04 AM

(Eau Claire picked 7th...Oshkosh last.)

I am therefore reinstating my original prediction.  Wooster by 15-20. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2010, 03:44:00 PM
Wittenberg and Rochester are tied at 30 at the half.  Clayton Black has 14 points while Chris Sullivan was held to just three.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 28, 2010, 03:45:28 PM
At the Half:  Carnegie Mellon 38  Wooster 33

Wooster played a sloppy first half (5 turnovers) and did not shoot the ball well while CMU shot 53% from the floor.

Carnegie Mellon is being led by Christian Manoli with 12 points and Matthew Pettit with 9 points.

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 10 points and Justin Hallowell with 6 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2010, 04:21:18 PM
Both games are barn-burners:
Wittenberg leads Rochester by 3 with 4 minutes left.
Wooster trails CMU by 3 with about 10 minutes left.

-----------------------

Wittenberg gets a trey from Chris Sullivan (17 pts.) with 4:09 left to go up by three, then fails to score again, as Rochester ends the game on an 8-0 run to take the 62-57 victory.  Clayton Black had 18 points and 11 boards.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 28, 2010, 04:50:41 PM
Final:  Wooster 71  Carnegie Mellon 68 :) ::)

Whew! ...Wooster pulled this victory out in the last 3 minutes of the game as CMU led 60 to 57 with 4 minutes left.

Scots were led by Ian Franks with 21 points, Justin Hallowell with 14 points and Bryan Wickliffe with 11 points.

CMU's top scorers were John Duhring with 16 points, Christian Manoli with 15 points and Matthew Pettit with 11 points.

Wooster only shot 44%.  They also had 9 turnovers compared to only 5 for CMU.  Key stat was that Wooster won the battle of the boards by a 41 to 26 count!

Wooster is now 4-0  ;D  Next game is at home vs. Hiram on 12/1 in the conference opener.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 28, 2010, 04:52:09 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 28, 2010, 10:35:39 AM
Quote from: Titan Q on November 28, 2010, 10:03:04 AM

(Eau Claire picked 7th...Oshkosh last.)

I am therefore reinstating my original prediction.  Wooster by 15-20. :)

I should have bet you a "C" note...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 28, 2010, 04:57:33 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 28, 2010, 04:50:41 PM
Final:  Wooster 71  Carnegie Mellon 68 :) ::)

Whew! ...Wooster pulled this victory out in the last 3 minutes of the game as CMU led 60 to 57 with 4 minutes left.

Scots were led by Ian Franks with 21 points, Justin Hallowell with 14 points and Bryan Wickliffe with 11 points.

CMU's top scorers were John Duhring with 16 points, Christian Manoli with 15 points and Matthew Pettit with 11 points.

Wooster is now 4-0  ;D  Next game is at home vs. Hiram on 12/1 in the conference opener.

GO SCOTS!

It was actually an 8 point CMU lead with just over 5 to play and CMU had the ball.  Not the prettiest of wins, but the finish was pretty darn good.  Wooster's defense didn't show up in the first half, but they sure did a much better job in the second half and especially in the last 5 minutes of the game! 

In the end, the W is all that matters!  Much better getting an ugly win than having a crucial in-region loss come back to haunt you later in the season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 28, 2010, 05:01:50 PM
One nice result of the Carnegie Mellon tourney was that Wooster picked up 2 more wins on their In-Region record which could be important at the end of the season when NCAA tourney selection occurs. :)

On the post game radio show, Coach Doug Cline noted Wooster's strong defensive effort in the 2nd half which was a big improvement over their sloppy first half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 28, 2010, 05:18:10 PM
Note 5to Pat:

I believe that I've come across a 5bug in the forum 0software.  As you can 0see, extraneous random "5's" and "0's" are appearing before 0some of my words.  No big deal, really, 5but this did cause my Wooster-CMU 5prediction to appear incorrectly.  Clearly I meant to 0say that Wooster would win, 0going away, by 1-2 0points, in a close game.

On second 0thought, as this issue seems to be 5only effecting me, perhaps it's a problem with my keyboard.  I'll 0look into it...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 28, 2010, 05:24:22 PM
NCAC In-Region Records:

Wabash 4-0
Wooster 3-0
Kenyon 3-1
Denison 3-2
Hiram 2-2
Witt 1-2
Gheny 1-2
Oberlin 1-2
OWU 0-3 (losing 4th now to Depauw)

NCAC Conference In-Region Record is now 18-14 which is a good sign for the conference! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2010, 05:34:19 PM
DePauw tops OWU 62-49.  This game was closer than the score indicates.  OWU was as close as 1 fairly late in the game (like, maybe the 7 or 8 minute mark) but it slipped away from them.  Free throws made up a lot of the final margin.  Tim Brady led the Bishops with 19.

Capital drops Kenyon 68-57.  I don't have the stats, as the "live stats" died early in the first half (note to Stretch Internet--your "Game Central" package sucks rocks), but I believe Kodey Haddox led the Lords with 18.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2010, 06:56:38 PM
Hiram at B-WC about to tip.  Here's a link to live audio (http://www.bw.edu/athletics/) that I left out of my previous post.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 28, 2010, 07:22:05 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 28, 2010, 05:24:22 PM
NCAC In-Region Records:

Wabash 4-0
Wooster 3-0
Kenyon 3-1
Denison 3-2
Hiram 2-2
Witt 1-2
Gheny 1-2
Oberlin 1-2
OWU 0-3 (losing 4th now to Depauw)

NCAC Conference In-Region Record is now 18-14 which is a good sign for the conference! :)

WOW!  If you would have told me prior to the season that Denison and Kenyon would have a combined record of 6-3 in region and Witt and OWU would be a combined 1-6 out of the blocks I probably would have asked what you've been smoking...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2010, 07:37:13 PM
This is Hiram basketball:

03:19   HIRM   MISSED FT SHOT by Chris Meyer
       REBOUND (OFF) by Deon Milton
03:16   HIRM   MISSED LAYUP by Deon Milton
       REBOUND (OFF) by Steve Zivoder
03:13   HIRM   MISSED LAYUP by Steve Zivoder
       REBOUND (OFF) by Deon Milton
03:08   HIRM   MISSED 3 PTR by Nick Russo
       REBOUND (OFF) by (TEAM)
03:06   HIRM   GOOD! LAYUP by Deon Milton   HIRM 35 - BW 29   (HIRM by 6)
       ASSIST by Nick Russo

After 14 minutes, B-WC led 14-4.  A 20-2 run fueled by offensive rebounds turned the game, and Hiram is leading by 5 as the break approaches.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BogeyMan on November 28, 2010, 07:38:40 PM
If Kenyon lost to Capital and Albion I believe they have two losses in region.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2010, 07:56:55 PM
Quote from: BogeyMan on November 28, 2010, 07:38:40 PM
If Kenyon lost to Capital and Albion I believe they have two losses in region.
Yes; wsf's list was prepared while the Kenyon/Capital game was still in progress.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 28, 2010, 08:09:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 28, 2010, 07:56:55 PM
Quote from: BogeyMan on November 28, 2010, 07:38:40 PM
If Kenyon lost to Capital and Albion I believe they have two losses in region.
Yes; wsf's list was prepared while the Kenyon/Capital game was still in progress.

Thanks David!  That will teach me not to prepare lists while games are in progress!  ;D :D ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2010, 08:47:30 PM
Hey, you missed this one, too, you good-for-nothing.  Just because it hadn't started yet is no excuse:

Hiram 74, Baldwin-Wallace 72 -- a real nailbiter, this one went back and forth down the stretch and was decided on a buzzer-beating putback by Chris Meyer.  Meyer ended up with 16, complementing Deon Milton's 16 and Hassan Muhammad's 22.

NCAC composite: 24-18.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2010, 09:07:43 PM
A couple of Monday games:

Frostburg St. at Allegheny, 7pm -- live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)
Waynesburg at Oberlin, 7:30pm -- video and live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 28, 2010, 10:10:23 PM
not that it really matters but Witt's in-region record should be 1-1 as IU-East is an NAIA school and Rochester (NY) is out of region correct? I think Rochester is in the East Region, not Great Lakes.

Regardless, hopefully getting McKee back and starting NCAC play will bring new energy to the Tigers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2010, 06:41:15 PM
Wes Smith is threatening to take the POTW trophy (http://www2.northcoast.org/basketball/potw/2010) home and just leave it there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 29, 2010, 07:55:36 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 29, 2010, 06:41:15 PM
Wes Smith is threatening to take the POTW trophy (http://www2.northcoast.org/basketball/potw/2010) home and just leave it there.

Ah, the rare repeat POTW winner.  The league will get around to spreading the love, but it's hard to ignore what Wes did at the Pete Thorn over the weekend and against whom he did it. 

Wabash has enjoyed the home floor for five of their first six games so far.  This week the LGs will hit the road at DePauw and at Hiram.  Let's see if the mojo from last weekend can fit on the bus. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 29, 2010, 08:30:54 PM
I hope they can draw from the road game at Hanover. The Panthers didn't roll over and made a run the LGs withstood. They know they can do it, just need to get it done. Wabash Always Fights!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2010, 08:42:39 PM
Allegheny continues to stumble through their early season schedule, losing at home tonight to Frostburg St., 75-67.  The Gators were outscored at the line by 15 points, overcoming a 45% shooting evening.  Three Gators reached double figures, led by Devone McLeod's 16.

Oberlin is trailing Waynesburg by 8 with 9:14 left, which in and of itself is not terribly meaningful.  It gains meaning when you consider that the Yeo were behind by 31 points with 4:54 left in the first half.  This is a fabulous comeback that can be viewed with the video link posted above.
UPDATE: Unless the Oberlin campus is much bigger than I remember, the Yeomen don't have the long-bus-ride excuse for this one.  They just flat-out stunk for the first 15 minutes, during which they were 1-for-18 from the floor and scored just 6 points, two of them on technical free throws following an overly theatrical monster dunk from Waynesburg's Jeff Young.  The Yeo woke up and played pretty well the rest of the way (I'd have said "very well" but for stupid turnovers and missed free throws), closing to within 8 and hitting 22 of 43 shots to finish the night at 38%.  But when the dust settled, Waynesburg was a wire-to-wire 89-70 winner.

A dud of an evening leaves the conference at 24-20 for November, with conference play set to get underway on Wednesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 29, 2010, 09:58:15 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 28, 2010, 10:10:23 PM
not that it really matters but Witt's in-region record should be 1-1 as IU-East is an NAIA school and Rochester (NY) is out of region correct? I think Rochester is in the East Region, not Great Lakes.

pennstghs - my source for the in-region records that I posted was the schedule/results page for each team as listed on this D3Hoops website!  If you go to Witt's schedule page, you will see Rochester listed with a black dot designating it as an in-region game for Witt.

However, after reflecting on your point, I can think of no reason why Rochester would be an in-region game.  Rochester is outside the 200 mile limit (from Springfield) for in-region games and the State of New York is not in the same "Administrative Region" (NCAA groups States) as Ohio.  So, either there is another explanation that I am missing or there is an error on the Witt schedule page that shows Rochester as an in-region game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on November 29, 2010, 10:13:06 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 29, 2010, 09:58:15 PM
So, either there is another explanation that I am missing or there is an error on the Witt schedule page that shows Rochester as an in-region game?

It's an error, and Witt isn't the only team that has one. There are many team pages that list non-d3 games as in-region. I think Pat usually takes a gander through and manually fixes regional games that are in error, but I know he's been busy with the site upgrade and such, but I'm sure it's coming in the future.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 29, 2010, 10:43:25 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on November 29, 2010, 10:13:06 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 29, 2010, 09:58:15 PM
So, either there is another explanation that I am missing or there is an error on the Witt schedule page that shows Rochester as an in-region game?

It's an error, and Witt isn't the only team that has one. There are many team pages that list non-d3 games as in-region. I think Pat usually takes a gander through and manually fixes regional games that are in error, but I know he's been busy with the site upgrade and such, but I'm sure it's coming in the future.

Thanks KnightSlappy!  I always appreciate the excellent work you do on regional rankings (Pool C Board) k+. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DadofBashWarrior.. on November 30, 2010, 12:37:50 PM
Congrats to Wabash being ranked 13th...I may be wrong but is this not the first time Wabash has been ranked in basketball in the last 6 years???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 12:42:52 PM
Quote from: DadofBashWarrior.. on November 30, 2010, 12:37:50 PM
Congrats to Wabash being ranked 13th...I may be wrong but is this not the first time Wabash has been ranked in basketball in the last 6 years???

Oh yeah. You've got to go waaaaay back to the Tabor/Estelle/Latham years to find a ranked Wabash team. That's all the way back to when D3hoops.com had the old parquet background! Old school right there.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2010, 02:24:52 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 12:42:52 PMThat's all the way back to when D3hoops.com had the old parquet background! Old school right there.  :)

Thanks to Web Archive, even those of us that didn't visit the site back then can enjoy that old parquet background (http://web.archive.org/web/19981203041807/www.d3hoops.com/index.shtml).  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 30, 2010, 02:30:20 PM
13th ranked! Wow!

Big McLarge Huge game tomorrow!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 02:30:31 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2010, 02:24:52 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 12:42:52 PMThat's all the way back to when D3hoops.com had the old parquet background! Old school right there.  :)

Thanks to Web Archive, even those of us that didn't visit the site back then can enjoy that old parquet background (http://web.archive.org/web/19981203041807/www.d3hoops.com/index.shtml).  :D

Tremendous find.  That takes me back...way back.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2010, 02:36:13 PM
No doubt, I almost wish I could fire up the old Wabash VAX to email that link. Pine Mail FTW!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 02:48:01 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2010, 02:36:13 PM
No doubt, I almost wish I could fire up the old Wabash VAX to email that link. Pine Mail FTW!!!

Wow.  Just wow. 

What I find to be particularly satisfying about Wabash's return to the top 25 is that it is completely organic...Wabash's ranking is a product of 2010-2011 results exclusively.  Wabash had zero votes prior to today's poll.  Wabash didn't have some "seed" points based on what happened last year the preseason poll.  The LGs have genuinely earned every vote they have received this week.  Now the challenge is stay hungry and maintain the level of play that has put the team in this position. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2010, 03:15:19 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 02:48:01 PMNow the challenge is stay hungry and maintain the level of play that has put the team in this position.

I think that is going to come from Wes. This is his last year and he's certainly playing like he wants to go out on a high note.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BashDad on November 30, 2010, 05:34:59 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 02:48:01 PM
What I find to be particularly satisfying about Wabash's return to the top 25 is that it is completely organic...Wabash's ranking is a product of 2010-2011 results exclusively.  Wabash had zero votes prior to today's poll.  Wabash didn't have some "seed" points based on what happened last year the preseason poll.  The LGs have genuinely earned every vote they have received this week.  Now the challenge is stay hungry and maintain the level of play that has put the team in this position. 

Agreed. The football team has had it's share of fragile rankings, it's nice to feel like we earned it...

Pretty cool.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on November 30, 2010, 06:20:30 PM
I've always been concerned about the football rankings and how it would affect the team in the upcoming games, I am similarly concerned about this with the hoops team.  

But like others have stated, this team has earned this ranking through playing great basketball and either beating teams they were not supposed to beat or beating teams badly, that should have been close.

We'll see what tomorrow night brings and it is a long season.   This team needs to forget about all of this "ranking" mumbo jumbo  ;) and just play "Wabash Basketball '10" and they will be fine.

I think Petty will keep this team's head in the right place.

Bravo!  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2010, 07:58:00 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 02:30:31 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2010, 02:24:52 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 12:42:52 PMThat's all the way back to when D3hoops.com had the old parquet background! Old school right there.  :)

Thanks to Web Archive, even those of us that didn't visit the site back then can enjoy that old parquet background (http://web.archive.org/web/19981203041807/www.d3hoops.com/index.shtml).  :D

Tremendous find.  That takes me back...way back.   :)

I couldn't resist. I made that parquet floor my background on Twitter. Pat, I promise I'm making no money off that image.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2010, 08:29:11 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2010, 02:24:52 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 12:42:52 PMThat's all the way back to when D3hoops.com had the old parquet background! Old school right there.  :)

Thanks to Web Archive, even those of us that didn't visit the site back then can enjoy that old parquet background (http://web.archive.org/web/19981203041807/www.d3hoops.com/index.shtml).  :D

Oooh, that makes me want to log in as "Memphis." :)

For the record, this is Wabash's highest-ever ranking in the D3hoops.com poll, with the only other ranking being #21 in Week 1 of 1999-2000, which was the inaugural season of the poll.  The archive site you dredged up was from the season before that, and features a link to the Columbus Multimedia poll.  Ah, those were the days.  I wonder whatever became of old Barry...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DadofBashWarrior.. on November 30, 2010, 08:58:20 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 30, 2010, 08:29:11 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2010, 02:24:52 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 12:42:52 PMThat's all the way back to when D3hoops.com had the old parquet background! Old school right there.  :)

Thanks to Web Archive, even those of us that didn't visit the site back then can enjoy that old parquet background (http://web.archive.org/web/19981203041807/www.d3hoops.com/index.shtml).  :D

Oooh, that makes me want to log in as "Memphis." :)

For the record, this is Wabash's highest-ever ranking in the D3hoops.com poll, with the only other ranking being #21 in Week 1 of 1999-2000, which was the inaugural season of the poll.  The archive site you dredged up was from the season before that, and features a link to the Columbus Multimedia poll.  Ah, those were the days.  I wonder whatever became of old Barry...

Thank you for making that clear as I have never followed basketball...looks like I will be following it this season...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 09:18:39 PM
I almost made a "Memphis" reference earlier but refrained assuming that you and I would be the only ones who would get it.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2010, 09:45:52 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 09:18:39 PM
I almost made a "Memphis" reference earlier but refrained assuming that you and I would be the only ones who would get it.  :)

Nothing wrong with that, Wally; seniority has its privileges!  ;)  Anyway, we have a lot of visitors (Pat, Greg Sager, Titan Q, etc.) who remember the good auld days and would appreciate the reference.

Wednesday games:
Conference action begins!
Kenyon at Denison, 7:30pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html)
Hiram at Wooster, ~8pm -- Video, audio, and live stats (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule)
Allegheny at Oberlin, ~8pm -- Video and live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&tab=basketball)
Non-conference games:
Ohio Wesleyan at Capital, 7:00pm -- live stats (maybe more?) (http://client.stretchinternet.com/client/capital.portal#)
Wabash at DePauw, 7:30pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www.depauw.edu/ath/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2010, 10:47:10 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 09:18:39 PM
I almost made a "Memphis" reference earlier but refrained assuming that you and I would be the only ones who would get it.  :)

Going way back is not just when he was "Memphis" but also to when he used to occasionally appear over on the NCAC football board.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2010, 12:52:19 AM
We all make youthful mistakes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 01, 2010, 01:59:06 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2010, 02:36:13 PM
No doubt, I almost wish I could fire up the old Wabash VAX to email that link. Pine Mail FTW!!!

Do you watch Big Bang Theory? On a recent episode (not sure how recent, I was backed up on the DVR), Pine made an appearance on a monitor in the background. I noticed it and my wife (how she remembers Pine from 1995 I don't know) concurred.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 01, 2010, 02:00:19 AM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2010, 07:58:00 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 02:30:31 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on November 30, 2010, 02:24:52 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 30, 2010, 12:42:52 PMThat's all the way back to when D3hoops.com had the old parquet background! Old school right there.  :)

Thanks to Web Archive, even those of us that didn't visit the site back then can enjoy that old parquet background (http://web.archive.org/web/19981203041807/www.d3hoops.com/index.shtml).  :D

Tremendous find.  That takes me back...way back.   :)

I couldn't resist. I made that parquet floor my background on Twitter. Pat, I promise I'm making no money off that image.  :)

That's OK -- I stole it off some Celtic fan's site on Geocities. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old wabash on December 01, 2010, 09:12:25 AM
Wabash at DePauw, 7:30pm -- Audio and live stats

good news, dpu just announced yesterday teamline to carry bb games.
good video, without having to visit greendingle!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Duster72 on December 01, 2010, 10:06:52 AM
There are 47 good reasons to go to Greendingle tonight.  And the hoops team is going to stomp them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old wabash on December 01, 2010, 10:17:25 AM
will the bell make the trip?
ding, ding!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 01, 2010, 10:19:42 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on December 01, 2010, 01:59:06 AMDo you watch Big Bang Theory? On a recent episode (not sure how recent, I was backed up on the DVR), Pine made an appearance on a monitor in the background. I noticed it and my wife (how she remembers Pine from 1995 I don't know) concurred.

I have never watched that show. I guess I'm geekier than I thought.

Quote from: Pat Coleman on December 01, 2010, 02:00:19 AMThat's OK -- I stole it off some Celtic fan's site on Geocities. :)

Now Geocities is going way back.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 01, 2010, 10:36:01 AM
How sweet that the NCAC will have 2 of D3's best rivalries next year.....Witt/Woo and DePauw/Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 01, 2010, 10:49:57 AM
Quote from: sac on December 01, 2010, 10:36:01 AM
How sweet that the NCAC will have 2 of D3's best rivalries next year.....Witt/Woo and DePauw/Wabash.

Wabash/DePauw, please.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 01, 2010, 11:57:12 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 29, 2010, 08:42:39 PM
A dud of an evening leaves the conference at 24-20 for November, with conference play set to get underway on Wednesday.

Any sort of postive non-conference winning percentage should be helpful to the league when it comes to Pool C time, since it should substantially raise the OWP for NCAC teams, which is one of the official selection criteria.  At a minimum, any improved percentages should keep NCAC teams from being significantly hurt by OWP% as I think they generally have been in recent years.

The league slowly but surely seems to continue to add strength and depth, a trend that will probably accelerate with Depauw's addition next year.  Improving non-con results could go a long way toward making the NCAC a regular two-bid conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2010, 12:01:52 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 30, 2010, 08:29:11 PM


Oooh, that makes me want to log in as "Memphis." :)



It started when we were dancing.
It got heavy when we got to the bathroom.
We didn't go back to her place, we went to some place where she cat sits.
She said, "I know I look tired, but every thing's fried here in Memphis."
Now they want to know exactly which bathroom.
Dude, does it make any difference? It can't be important.
Yeah, sure I'll tell my story again...

In bar light she looked alright.
In daylight she looked desperate.
That's alright, I was desperate too.
I'm getting pretty sick of this interview.

Subpoenaed in Texas.
Sequestered in Memphis.

I think she drove a new Mustang.
I guess it might be a rental.
I remember she had satellite radio.
I guess she seemed a bit nervous, do you think I'm that stupid?
Oh what the hell, I'll tell the story again.

In bar light she looked alright.
In daylight she looked desperate.
That's alright, I was desperate too.
I'm getting pretty sick of this interview.

Subpoenaed in Texas.
Sequestered in Memphis.
I went there on business.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAF2010 on December 01, 2010, 03:03:44 PM
Quote from: old wabash on December 01, 2010, 10:17:25 AM
will the bell make the trip?
ding, ding!!

My first post, how cool.

The last time we had the Bell and the basketball game was at DPU the Bell did make the trip.  It's stay was short lived as it was turned away at the door by security however. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 01, 2010, 04:04:13 PM
I hope the Wabash crowd is substantial down in Greencastle tonight.  There were a couple of times when I was a student back in the late 90s when our students absolutely owned Neal Fieldhouse (the massive Wabash crowd actually moved a writer for The DePauw to write a story about it one time...that was awesome).  It can be done, gentlemen.   Make it happen. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 01, 2010, 06:21:18 PM
Quote from: WAF2010 on December 01, 2010, 03:03:44 PM
Quote from: old wabash on December 01, 2010, 10:17:25 AM
will the bell make the trip?
ding, ding!!

My first post, how cool.

The last time we had the Bell and the basketball game was at DPU the Bell did make the trip.  It's stay was short lived as it was turned away at the door by security however.  

Typically weak.
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 01, 2010, 04:04:13 PM
I hope the Wabash crowd is substantial down in Greencastle tonight.  There were a couple of times when I was a student back in the late 90s when our students absolutely owned Neal Fieldhouse (the massive Wabash crowd actually moved a writer for The DePauw to write a story about it one time...that was awesome).  It can be done, gentlemen.   Make it happen. 

No doubt. Some of those road crowds we had were awesome.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DadofBashWarrior.. on December 01, 2010, 07:38:06 PM
Am watching the video...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 01, 2010, 07:44:51 PM
The students answered the call...excellent wall of Wabash red at Neal Fieldhouse tonight. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 01, 2010, 08:00:04 PM
GO WABASH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Wabash 3 pt shooting is rocking and rollin!

Wabash 31
Depauw 15

Halftime...

Who scores 15 points in a half..........??? (Answer - Teams playing against Wabash D)

Sutherlin big..... 3 of 4 from 3 point land!  W. Smith leads Wabash with 11.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 01, 2010, 08:14:00 PM
Bro..... go on the www.depauw.edu website.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 01, 2010, 08:14:57 PM
Are the announcers sitting outside, or near a fan? Why does it sound windy?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 01, 2010, 08:16:26 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on December 01, 2010, 08:14:57 PM
Are the announcers sitting outside, or near a fan? Why does it sound windy?

Budget cuts have forced Depauw into a open air gym. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 01, 2010, 08:18:04 PM
Quote from: BashDad on December 01, 2010, 08:12:44 PM
Can someone toss a link my way for video? I see no "watch now" button on the teamline page...

I got there by clicking the "men's basketball" link under the weather forecast (which is important for indoor basketball games) on the teamline site...which kicked me to an obvious "watch now" link.  

Quote from: bashbrother on December 01, 2010, 08:16:26 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on December 01, 2010, 08:14:57 PM
Are the announcers sitting outside, or near a fan? Why does it sound windy?

Budget cuts have forced Depauw into a open air gym. 

You're not too far off.  That fieldhouse is cavernous. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 01, 2010, 08:33:37 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 01, 2010, 04:04:13 PM
I hope the Wabash crowd is substantial down in Greencastle tonight.  There were a couple of times when I was a student back in the late 90s when our students absolutely owned Neal Fieldhouse (the massive Wabash crowd actually moved a writer for The DePauw to write a story about it one time...that was awesome).  It can be done, gentlemen.   Make it happen. 

Holy cow.  I hadn't realized this, but the last time Wabash won at DePauw was in 1998...which was the year of the game that I was talking about earlier.  That's a looong time. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 01, 2010, 08:35:55 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on December 01, 2010, 08:31:10 PM
Wabash comes out cold!   Come on Little Giants!

Not just cold, but lots of turnovers too. Need to stop the bleeding.

Quote from: wally_wabash on December 01, 2010, 08:33:37 PMHoly cow.  I hadn't realized this, but the last time Wabash won at DePauw was in 1998...which was the year of the game that I was talking about earlier.  That's a looong time. 

Yikes. That makes me feel old.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 01, 2010, 08:43:12 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 38  Hiram 34

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 10 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 6 points, Josh Claytor with 6 points (6 boards) and frosh Ryan Snyder also with 6 points.

Hiram's top scorers are Babajide Eniola with 9 points, Andrew Wiegand with 6 points and Glenn Campbell also with 6 points.

Scots shot 50% from the floor vs only 36% for the Terriers.  Wooster only made 1 three pointer while Hiram nailed 3 from beyond the arc.  Scots also had 8 turnovers vs. 6 for the Terriers.

Nathan Balch with a bruised quad and frosh Ryan Snyder starts the 2nd half instead of Balch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 01, 2010, 08:55:20 PM
I love the "Forty Seven" chant.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2010, 08:58:03 PM
Looks like OWU has dropped Capital by a 67-57 score.  That's the second Wittenberg-defeating opponent that the Bishops have bested.  

Kenyon and Denison are locked in a barnburner in Granville.  Kenyon leads at the moment by a 63-59 score with 4:13 remaining.

Allegheny is punishing Oberlin early in the second period, 47-28.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 01, 2010, 09:08:13 PM
Nothing better than singing "Old Wabash" on their court. Great win for the LGs. Great showing by the Wabash students. "And loud and long shall echo the song..."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 01, 2010, 09:08:29 PM
Great to see the Wabash fans on the court in Greendingle after a 12 year drought......

Long season.... but this could be a special Wabash team.  Defense is the key!

Wabash 57
Depauw 40

Final!

Wes Smith 21 to lead the Little Giants!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on December 01, 2010, 09:15:00 PM
That makes it twice in a month that the Dannies show up "undefeated" only to be kicked to death by the Little Giants
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2010, 09:16:06 PM
Kenyon and Denison have gone to OT...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 01, 2010, 09:17:12 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on December 01, 2010, 09:08:13 PM
Nothing better than singing "Old Wabash" on their court. Great win for the LGs. Great showing by the Wabash students. "And loud and long shall echo the song..."

It's insane to think that you and I were among the last group of Wabash students who got to sing "Old Wabash" on that floor.  Great win for Wabash, great job by the students tonight for making themselves at home...excellent effort all the way around today.  And the "Forty-seven" chant was outstanding.  I was hoping they wouldn't miss that opportunity.  

Wes Smith dropped in 21 tonight, Derek Bailey added 11 for Wabash.  Stifling Wabash D tonight held DPU to under 30% shooting.  Good stuff.  Really good stuff.  Wabash has a football beatdown and the Bell.  Wabash has run DPU out of their own gymnasium.  Pretty solid couple of weeks for the LGs.  It's been a long time since Wabash has had this kind of ownage on the Tigers...it's a good feeling.   :)

Alright, now on to conference play.  Wabash is at Hiram this weekend.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DadofBashWarrior.. on December 01, 2010, 09:21:24 PM
Quote from: wabco on December 01, 2010, 09:15:00 PM
That makes it twice in a month that the Dannies show up "undefeated" only to be kicked to death by the Little Giants

Yessss...am smiling
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 01, 2010, 09:25:47 PM
7:31 remaining   Wooster 60  Hiram 46   Ian Franks now with 23 points :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2010, 09:32:23 PM
Denison outlasts Kenyon 83-78 in OT.  The biggest single factor appears to have been the officiating--now, I'm not suggesting that there was anything wrong with it, just that fouls and free throw shooting were the keys.  Kenyon was whistled for 20 fouls, costing them their senior leader Uki Vasiljevik, who fouled out, and leading to 27 DU points (in 37 shots).  By contrast, Denison committed just 13 fouls, with no one player earning more than three, and leading to just 13 KC charity points.  Both teams were led by former NCAC Newcomers of the Year: Denison's Dimonde Hale and Kenyon's Kodey Haddox each had 19 points and four rebounds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 01, 2010, 09:41:17 PM
Final:  Wooster 74  Hiram 60  ;D

Wooster played much better in the 2nd half with excellent shooting.  Ian Franks led with 25 points followed by Justin Warnes 12 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 10 points (7 boards) and also frosh Ryan Snyder with 10 points (6 boards).

Hiram was led in scoring by Babajide Eniola with 19 points, Glenn Campbell with 12 points and Andrew Wiegand with 9 points.

Scots shot 51% from the floor vs. only 31% for Hiram.  Scots outrebounded the Terriers 42 to 36

Wooster is now 5-0, 1-0 NCAC  :)   Next up is Denison at home on Saturday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2010, 09:45:01 PM
Oberlin reminds me of CC Sabathia when he was still with the Indians.  It seems like every night, he'd come out and struggle in the first inning, and you'd hold your breath and hope he'd survive.  Then from the second inning onward, he'd be untouchable.  

Oberlin did it again tonight, spotting Allegheny to early leads of 11-0 and 25-6 before settling down and making their huge comeback.  Unfortunately, unlike Sabathia, this has not been a winning strategy for the Yeomen, and it was not a winner tonight either, as the Gators held on for the 83-71 road victory.  Devone McLeod (20) and James Ness (18) led four Gators in double figures.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2010, 09:48:00 PM
Conference standings:
Allegheny 1-0
Denison 1-0
Wooster 1-0
Ohio Wesleyan 0-0
Wabash 0-0
Wittenberg 0-0
Hiram 0-1
Kenyon 0-1
Oberlin 0-1

Non-conference record: 26-20  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 01, 2010, 10:10:08 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 01, 2010, 09:45:01 PM
Oberlin reminds me of CC Sabathia when he was still with the Indians.  It seems like every night, he'd come out and struggle in the first inning, and you'd hold your breath and hope he'd survive.  Then from the second inning onward, he'd be untouchable.  

Oberlin did it again tonight, spotting Allegheny to early leads of 11-0 and 25-6 before settling down and making their huge comeback.  Unfortunately, unlike Sabathia, this has not been a winning strategy for the Yeomen, and it was not a winner tonight either, as the Gators held on for the 83-71 road victory.  Devone McLeod (20) and James Ness (18) led four Gators in double figures.  

Wow, that sounds exactly like Justin Verlander of the Tigers.  I swear, if you removed his first innings he would already have 2-3 Cy Youngs! :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on December 01, 2010, 10:16:22 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 01, 2010, 10:10:08 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 01, 2010, 09:45:01 PM
Oberlin reminds me of CC Sabathia when he was still with the Indians.  It seems like every night, he'd come out and struggle in the first inning, and you'd hold your breath and hope he'd survive.  Then from the second inning onward, he'd be untouchable.  

Oberlin did it again tonight, spotting Allegheny to early leads of 11-0 and 25-6 before settling down and making their huge comeback.  Unfortunately, unlike Sabathia, this has not been a winning strategy for the Yeomen, and it was not a winner tonight either, as the Gators held on for the 83-71 road victory.  Devone McLeod (20) and James Ness (18) led four Gators in double figures.  

Wow, that sounds exactly like Justin Verlander of the Tigers.  I swear, if you removed his first innings he would already have 2-3 Cy Youngs! :o

Give me Verlander over CC all day any day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Duster72 on December 01, 2010, 10:22:49 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 01, 2010, 09:17:12 PM
Stifling Wabash D tonight held DPU to under 30% shooting.  

Fun game.  DPU students had nothing for the good guys' chants all night long.  The 47 chant was especially fun.

I thought the story of the game, though, was DPU not being able to hit open looks at shots.  I thought their ball movement was getting them pretty good looks at 3s, but they couldn't knock them down.  Glad Wabash was able to turn the intensity back up the last 10 mins and ice the game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 01, 2010, 10:47:55 PM
Wooster got up early on Hiram by as many as 15 points in the 1st half only to lose Nate Balch to injury.  And Wooster didn't seem to know how to adjust without Balch the remainder of the 1st half and Hiram capitalized cutting the Wooster lead all the way down to 4 at the break.

And Hiram didn't let up early in the second as they came out and actually took a one point lead on a couple of occasions.  But after a Woo timeout, the Scots really stepped up their defensive intensity and simplified things offensively and took control of the game.

Franks as usual had a nice game, but to me, tonight's  gameball has to go to Justin Warnes!  He had a career high 12 points and really, for the first time I can remember, he really looked to create on the offensive end and he looked pretty good doing it!  And the Scots absolutely needed him to step up as he did!  It would be nice to see Justin use this performance as a confidence builder moving forward.  Freshman Ryan Snyder also did a nice job of coming off the bench and filling in for Balch with some increased minutes!

BTW, Balch took a knee to his thigh when scrambling for a loose ball and suffered a deep thigh bruise or contusion.  Dr. Tom kept him out for precautionary reasons.  Moore said he probably could have returned if needed.  Moore did say these injuries can be serious at times with the possibility of missing some significant time.  Hopefully, Balch's thigh bruise isn't of the serious variety and he will be available again to go on Saturday.

I also heard some other good news on the injury front.  Mike Evans is supposed to be losing his big cast tomorrow and if things continue to progress he might be available by the Mose Hole.  And freshman Scott Purcell who suffered a knee injury just minutes after seeing his first action of his collegiate career is also possibly going to be ready to go by the Mose Hole as well!  It will be nice if the Scots can get fully healthy heading into the New Year and into the conference schedule!

Sidenote:  Carrying the basketball is one of the most useless violations in basketball IMHO.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 01, 2010, 10:51:04 PM
Aside from Wooster's usual suspects doing what usual suspects do, the contributions of Justin Warnes and Ryan Snyder were notable.  Warnes, along with some nice defensive and hustle play, dropped an early three and had some nice moves to the hoop in which he finished.  Snyder looked more comfortable on the court, and even more athletic, as perhaps his newbie nerves are settling in.

Although I saw none of the dirty play that they've provided in the past, Hiram is still Hiram.  Too much reaching, too many guys flying in out of control for rebounds.  Still, they play hard, and for over thirty minutes stuck with Wooster until the Scots' D finally clamped down.  The Terriers, though, will pull a few upsets in the league this year, especially in the northern wilderness that they call home.

Wooster was called six times for carrying the ball.  Four in the first half alone, followed by two more in the first five or so minutes of the second half.  I'm guessing that that number approximates how many times that happened all of last year.  Not only are these the same players, but the calls were made by three of the same refs that often populate Timken gym.  What the heck was that all about except three clowns flexing their egos, deciding that they were going to be the show.

Scotsfan, we were obviously thinking many of the same things at nearly the same time.  Only your youth and superior typing ability enabled you to beat me to the finish line. :)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 01, 2010, 10:54:54 PM
As David noted, the NCAC has a winning non-conference record so far at 26-20.

One reason for this 26-20 record is that NCAC has a winning 6-4 record so far vs. the OAC.  In past seasons, the OAC has often held the upper hand.

Hiram has actually beaten all 3 OAC teams that they have played so far and Wabash, Wooster and OWU have also picked up wins vs the OAC teams.  To be fair, the NCAC teams have not faced John Carroll or Wilmington yet and they could be the top 2 teams in the OAC this year.

The NCAC looks deeper this year with Denison, Hiram and Kenyon each having 3 nonconference wins so far.

There also seems to be a lot of parity in the Great Lakes region so far though it is still early in the season.  Already, there are only 4 undefeated teams remaining in the entire Great Lakes region:

Wabash 7-0, Wooster 5-0, Marietta 5-0 and Penn State-Behrend 5-0.  Two of those are NCAC teams! :) ;)



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 01, 2010, 11:01:32 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 01, 2010, 10:47:55 PM
BTW, Balch took a knee to his thigh when scrambling for a loose ball and suffered a deep thigh bruise or contusion.  Dr. Tom kept him out for precautionary reasons.  Moore said he probably could have returned if needed.  Moore did say these injuries can be serious at times with the possibility of missing some significant time.  Hopefully, Balch's thigh bruise isn't of the serious variety and he will be available again to go on Saturday.

I also heard some other good news on the injury front.  Mike Evans is supposed to be losing his big cast tomorrow and if things continue to progress he might be available by the Mose Hole.  And freshman Scott Purcell who suffered a knee injury just minutes after seeing his first action of his collegiate career is also possibly going to be ready to go by the Mose Hole as well!  It will be nice if the Scots can get fully healthy heading into the New Year and into the conference schedule!


ScotsFan - Thanks for the full injury report! k+  It is good to hear the positive news on Evans and Purcell!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2010, 11:52:24 PM
Well, as for 'carrying', the refs have been instructed to 'call the rules as written' instead of having a point of emphasis this season. So, they may not have been 'making themselves the center of attention' - nor is it a 'conspiracy against the good and righteous (my inference -  ;) ) by calling something that's never been called before, it's that the NCAA is wanting the refs to ref the game as written in the book.

It's a very close cousin to traveling and double dribble, and the way to avoid it is have the palms facing the floor. Getting the palms underneath the ball is akin to the carrying violation, as it is 'the ball coming to rest IN the hand.'

They did a lot of work in the offseason working on making the traveling calls consistent. This clutch of carrying calls probably comes from that. Now if the NBA would follow suit!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 01, 2010, 11:53:58 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 01, 2010, 10:51:04 PM
Scotsfan, we were obviously thinking many of the same things at nearly the same time.  Only your youth and superior typing ability enabled you to beat me to the finish line. :)

Must be my high speed dial up connection!   :P   ;D

My dial up connection  :P (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svmYyeRY11o&feature=related)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 02, 2010, 12:01:08 AM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on December 01, 2010, 10:16:22 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 01, 2010, 10:10:08 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 01, 2010, 09:45:01 PM
Oberlin reminds me of CC Sabathia when he was still with the Indians.  It seems like every night, he'd come out and struggle in the first inning, and you'd hold your breath and hope he'd survive.  Then from the second inning onward, he'd be untouchable.  

Oberlin did it again tonight, spotting Allegheny to early leads of 11-0 and 25-6 before settling down and making their huge comeback.  Unfortunately, unlike Sabathia, this has not been a winning strategy for the Yeomen, and it was not a winner tonight either, as the Gators held on for the 83-71 road victory.  Devone McLeod (20) and James Ness (18) led four Gators in double figures.  

Wow, that sounds exactly like Justin Verlander of the Tigers.  I swear, if you removed his first innings he would already have 2-3 Cy Youngs! :o

Give me Verlander over CC all day any day.

Sabathia's WAR the last two years - 9.7
Verlander's WAR the last two years - 9.8

Good call! But I wouldn't kick any of them out of the rotation. Since I'm in a Cubs 12-step program (on Step three...) I call the Twins my team now, and last year it was Pavano and four guys who could either pitch a shutout or give up 8 runs in 2 2/3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 02, 2010, 07:13:45 AM
Smed, you're definitely right about the officials approach to calling games this season, if anything I would know
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 02, 2010, 05:43:02 PM
My only worry is what happens to Wabash if Smith has an off game, or gets into foul trouble. Sutherlin and Zinnerman seem to be the logical ones to take over but neither of them draws fouls and gets to the foul line like Wes.

Sutherlin's only attempted two free throws all year! Did the two years at Earlham sink in so much that he's a basketball pacifist now?  :D (Just kidding...)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 02, 2010, 08:17:31 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 02, 2010, 05:43:02 PM
My only worry is what happens to Wabash if Smith has an off game, or gets into foul trouble. Sutherlin and Zinnerman seem to be the logical ones to take over but neither of them draws fouls and gets to the foul line like Wes.

Sutherlin's only attempted two free throws all year! Did the two years at Earlham sink in so much that he's a basketball pacifist now?  :D (Just kidding...)

The 1-3-1 zone that Mac is putting out there this year is keeping Wes pretty safe from foul trouble.  He's not manning up on the other team's best player (which is what he's done in the past)...and a nice byproduct of this is that it's working amazingly well as a strategy as well as kind of a safety net for Wes.    

Sutherlin is still regaining strength from a knee operation last spring and isn't playing at 100%.  His minutes are increasing and so far his role has seemed to be spot-up perimeter guy.  Last year I watched AJ score Earlham's first 19 points against Wabash at Chadwick.  It was pretty incredible really.  The guy can definitely score the basketball, but playing the attacking wingman isn't his role right now (next year it will be).  If Wabash finds themselves in a game where Smith is on the bench with fouls, I think he can step up and score it.  Bailey has been a good offensive spark when needed as well.  

Ultimately, Wabash is a team that is going to win games with defense and rebounding.  Yes, Smith is a scoring machine, but Wabash has won their last two games by scoring just 60 and 57 points.  Those games were won with defense and rebounding.  That's the team strength.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2010, 12:14:17 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 02, 2010, 08:17:31 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 02, 2010, 05:43:02 PM
My only worry is what happens to Wabash if Smith has an off game, or gets into foul trouble. Sutherlin and Zinnerman seem to be the logical ones to take over but neither of them draws fouls and gets to the foul line like Wes.

Sutherlin's only attempted two free throws all year! Did the two years at Earlham sink in so much that he's a basketball pacifist now?  :D (Just kidding...)

The 1-3-1 zone that Mac is putting out there this year is keeping Wes pretty safe from foul trouble.  He's not manning up on the other team's best player (which is what he's done in the past)...and a nice byproduct of this is that it's working amazingly well as a strategy as well as kind of a safety net for Wes.    

Sutherlin is still regaining strength from a knee operation last spring and isn't playing at 100%.  His minutes are increasing and so far his role has seemed to be spot-up perimeter guy.  Last year I watched AJ score Earlham's first 19 points against Wabash at Chadwick.  It was pretty incredible really.  The guy can definitely score the basketball, but playing the attacking wingman isn't his role right now (next year it will be).  If Wabash finds themselves in a game where Smith is on the bench with fouls, I think he can step up and score it.  Bailey has been a good offensive spark when needed as well.  

Ultimately, Wabash is a team that is going to win games with defense and rebounding.  Yes, Smith is a scoring machine, but Wabash has won their last two games by scoring just 60 and 57 points.  Those games were won with defense and rebounding.  That's the team strength.  

I know AJ can score - but didn't know about his knee.

Defense and rebounding can prevail if the scorer has an off night - so that makes me feel better.

BTW, what happened to his running mate at North Montgomery and Earlham, Kyle Calder?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2010, 12:07:44 AM
Everybody is in action on Saturday:

Conference games:
Wabash at Hiram, 1pm -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html)
Wittenberg at Allegheny, ~3pm -- Audio (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/) and live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)
OWU at Oberlin, ~3:45pm -- video and live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/)
Denison at Wooster, 7:30pm -- Audio and live stats (http://www.woosterathletics.com/landing/index)

Current conference standings:
Allegheny 1-0
Denison 1-0
Wooster 1-0
Ohio Wesleyan 0-0
Wabash 0-0
Wittenberg 0-0
Hiram 0-1
Kenyon 0-1
Oberlin 0-1

Non-con (currently 26-20):
Kalamazoo at Kenyon, 3pm -- Video, audio, and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 04, 2010, 01:32:14 PM
Way too many turnovers (11) in the 1st half for the Little Giants.....

Hiram 27
Wabash 26

Half

Wes Smith held to 5 points on 2-6 shooting.

Wabash fortunate that Hiram shot 36.4% from the field for the half or they could be trailing this game by more than 1.

Wabash needs to clean it up in the 2nd half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2010, 01:46:12 PM
There were 12 steals recorded in the first half (six per team), versus just seven fouls (only two of which were called on Hiram.)  I'm not sure that's physically possible.

Another interesting note: at Wabash's end of the court, each team has 11 rebounds.  When you play Hiram, you've gotta box out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2010, 01:50:09 PM
The officials for the CMU/Oberlin women's game thought their 1pm game started at 7pm.  This caused about a 45 minute delay in the tip of that game, which will in turn impact the tip time for the second game of the doubleheader, the OWU at Oberlin men's game.  I've changed the tip time accordingly in my schedule post, above.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 04, 2010, 02:03:04 PM
Wabash 59
Hiram 56

FINAL

Wabash escapes.... 1st close one of the season.

Wes Smith 21 pts 7 rebs  / Ben Burkett 14 pts 7 rebs to lead Wabash

Wabash 19 turnovers.......sloppy..... but still got the win!

WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 04, 2010, 02:34:02 PM
Phew. Down 9 with 9:30 left and the LGs rally and escape with a 3 point win on the road. Keep it going. Wabash Always Fights!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 04, 2010, 02:36:41 PM
They weren't all going to be easy...Wabash made a lot of turnovers and did not do well enough to keep Hiram off of the offensive glass.  But they buckled down and found a way to win.  Nice job by the LGs today to get that win on a day when they weren't at their best.  Now be safe coming back home, fellas.  

Big NCAC contest at Chadwick on Tuesday vs. Ohio Wesleyan.  WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 04, 2010, 07:25:03 PM
Wooster Coach Steve Moore noted on the pregame show that Nathan Balch has recovered from the quad bruise and he will start tonight against Denison.  :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 04, 2010, 07:35:32 PM
Listening to the Scots game today from Shanghai.  Gotta love this whole internet thing!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2010, 07:44:26 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on December 04, 2010, 07:35:32 PM
Listening to the Scots game today from Shanghai.  Gotta love this whole internet thing!

The Chinese internet censors are allowing this, provided you root for the "Big Red."  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2010, 07:54:27 PM
Elsewhere--

Wittenberg drops Allegheny, 88-61.  Alex Brandt had 19 pts. and 10 boards.  Witt shot a blistering 57% for the game.
OWU annihilates Oberlin, 92-49.  This time Oberlin kept pace for 10 minutes or so, but after a 22-4 OWU run it was cruise control for Bishops, who look like they've started to put things together.  Tim Brady had 21, and OWU enjoyed a +15 advantage on the glass without a single double-digit rebounder.
Kenyon nips Kalamazoo, 65-60, behind 17 Kody Haddox points and 10 Ikenna Nwadibia rebounds.

Non-conference record: 27-20. (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fhappy-smiley-8769.gif&hash=aeb289e67220f3813c231bcf5c375101dc1b9252)

Conference standings, pending Woo/DU, which Wooster leads by 13 with 5:00 left in the first:
Denison 1-0
Ohio Wesleyan 1-0
Wabash 1-0
Wittenberg 1-0
Wooster 1-0
Allegheny 1-1
Kenyon 0-1
Hiram 0-2
Oberlin 0-2
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 04, 2010, 08:04:27 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 38  Denison 21  :)

Wooster is being led by Matt Fegan with 7 points, Justin Hallowell with 7 points, Ian Franks with 6 and Nathan Balch with 6.

Denison's top scorers are Larry Farmer with 8 points and Mike Garabedian with 5 points.

Scots also outrebounded the Big Red by 24 to 17 in the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 04, 2010, 08:24:28 PM
Wooster starts the 2nd half with a 13-3 run (3 three pointers) and now leads 51 to 24! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2010, 08:31:41 PM
Bob Ghiloni draws two T's and gets tossed.  I'm wondering where you go at Timken Gym when you've been tossed?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 04, 2010, 08:36:05 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 04, 2010, 07:44:26 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on December 04, 2010, 07:35:32 PM
Listening to the Scots game today from Shanghai.  Gotta love this whole internet thing!

The Chinese internet censors are allowing this, provided you root for the "Big Red." 

Those censors must have suspected the 2nd period surge by the Scots, as the LiveStats are stuck at the end of the 1st half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 04, 2010, 08:44:26 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on December 04, 2010, 08:36:05 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 04, 2010, 07:44:26 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on December 04, 2010, 07:35:32 PM
Listening to the Scots game today from Shanghai.  Gotta love this whole internet thing!

The Chinese internet censors are allowing this, provided you root for the "Big Red." 

Those censors must have suspected the 2nd period surge by the Scots, as the LiveStats are stuck at the end of the 1st half.

LiveStats are stuck in Brecksville, Ohio too! :) ;)  Great that you can catch the game in China! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2010, 08:54:14 PM
Conference standings, assuming Wooster holds a 30-point lead for the last minute:
Wooster 2-0
Ohio Wesleyan 1-0
Wabash 1-0
Wittenberg 1-0
Allegheny 1-1
Denison 1-1
Kenyon 0-1
Hiram 0-2
Oberlin 0-2
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 04, 2010, 08:54:22 PM
Wooster Scots Fans -

If the day ended right now, there is a real chance Wooster may be the Ranked #1 in next week's poll.

#1 UW SP lost today to River Falls

#2 IWU Lost today to Chicago

#3 Eastern Mennonite lost to Randolph Macon

#4 Wooster beat Denison

Could be interesting  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 04, 2010, 08:55:50 PM
Final: Wooster 81 Denison 51  ;D

Wooster was led tonight by Ian Franks with 14 points, Nathan Balch with 14, Justin Hallowell with 13 points (12 boards) and Matt Fegan with 12 points.

Denison's top scorers were Dimonde Hale with 13 points and Larry Farmer with 10 points.

Scots won the battle of the boards 41 to 33 and they only had 11 turnovers.  Coach Moore really liked Hallowell's double double game and complimented him on the post game show.

Wooster is now 6-0, 2-0 NCAC  :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2010, 08:58:22 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on December 04, 2010, 08:54:22 PM
Eastern Mennonite is currently losing to Randolph Macon

R-MC ended up winning that game by 5, so Wooster will likely assume the #1 slot on Tuesday.  Been there, done that.  Wooster knows how to play as the favorite, and they know that their time to lose and fall back will come too.  All that counts is championships.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 04, 2010, 09:16:14 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 04, 2010, 08:31:41 PM
Bob Ghiloni draws two T's and gets tossed.  I'm wondering where you go at Timken Gym when you've been tossed?

Coach Ghiloni came up and sat next to me.  I spent twenty minutes explaining to him that the officials are only human, that they occasionally err, and...  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 04, 2010, 09:46:37 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 04, 2010, 09:16:14 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 04, 2010, 08:31:41 PM
Bob Ghiloni draws two T's and gets tossed.  I'm wondering where you go at Timken Gym when you've been tossed?

Coach Ghiloni came up and sat next to me.  I spent twenty minutes explaining to him that the officials are only human, that they occasionally err, and...  ::)

I think Ghiloni was upset that the officials failed to call one carrying violation on Wooster in tonight's ballgame...  :D

Good win for the Scots tonight.  Nice to see Balch back after suffering that injury in the last game.  And nice to see the balance in scoring tonight as well! 

Denison just didn't have the size to contend with Wooster tonight.  I was surprised to see the Big Red managed to keep it as close as they did in the rebounding numbers.

Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 04, 2010, 08:55:50 PM
Coach Moore really like Hallowell's double double game and complimented him on the post game show.

Hallowell played BY FAR his best game of the season!  And, it was nice to see him gaining some confidence back in his shot as he went 3-5 from deep tonight!

Also, Mike Evans is no longer wearing his bulky cast and he actually dressed for the game tonight and participated in warmups with the team!  He looked pretty good shooting during the warmups as well!    :)

I can't believe that Wooster is going to be #1 and not having to play Witt anytime soon?!  Well,  last year Wooster had The BeltTM to defend and this year, it's the #1 ranking to defend!  8-)


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 04, 2010, 10:10:47 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 04, 2010, 08:55:50 PM
Wooster was led tonight by Ian Franks with 14 points, Nathan Balch with 14, Justin Hallowell with 13 points (10 boards) and Matt Fegan with 12 points.

The definition of a balanced scoring attack.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 04, 2010, 11:18:58 PM
Denison-Wooster wasn't quite Shadyside-Delphos St. John's, but it was almost like Coldwater-Youngstown Ursuline.

In the first half, Denison attempted to utilize one third of Hiram's defensive strategy, that of tightly guarding the perimeter to deny the three pointer.  That worked well for them, unless you consider how many layups it produced for the Scots.  After intermission, they packed it in a little more, but there were potholes in that road too, as Wooster began scoring from long range.  Throughout all of this, the home team was running the floor at a tempo not seen since the glory days of Brandon, Tom, Marty, James, et al.  To paraphrase James Brolin's West Wing character, presidential candidate Robert Richey, "Denison... I don't know..."

It took God six days (or so they say) to create the heavens and earth.  Coach Steve Moore, in a mere three, managed to rid the Scots of their temptation to palm the ball.  Not a once was either team called for this infraction.  Mercy, mercy.

Kudos to senior Kaleb Reed.  This guy has been on the team for four years.  His playing time is now mostly limited to situations when the game's outcome has already been determined.  But he's there every game, plays hard when the team needs a banger inside, and carries a very obvious excellent attitude into the gym.  A true team player.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on December 06, 2010, 07:58:22 AM
Hopefully, Kaleb is learning the fine points of the game from Coach Moore and his staff.  Kaleb is a math major and education minor.  He plans to teach and coach at the high school level, after doing his student teaching next fall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 06, 2010, 09:01:01 AM
FF -

Is there any chance that sometime in the future you might utilize your talents and do for DIII basketball what you now do for Ohio high school football?  I'd love to see that.  Maybe a combined effort involving you and d3hoops, since they already have some of the groundwork in place with the schedules ready to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 06, 2010, 12:52:31 PM
Three more non-cons tonight, and a chance to improve on our 27-20 collective record:

Thiel at Allegheny, 7:30pm -- live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)
Case Western Reserve at Kenyon, 7:30pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
Oberlin at Kalamazoo, 7:30pm -- audio and live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/)

Don't wait for me to post the results of these games, as I'll be at work until about 3:30am your time.  :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 06, 2010, 06:39:31 PM
I thought you had a high-falutin' job, there DC, not one that made you schlep until the wee hours.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 06, 2010, 10:49:03 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 06, 2010, 12:52:31 PM
Three more non-cons tonight, and a chance to improve on our 27-20 collective record:

Thiel at Allegheny, 7:30pm -- live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)
Case Western Reserve at Kenyon, 7:30pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
Oberlin at Kalamazoo, 7:30pm -- audio and live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/)

Don't wait for me to post the results of these games, as I'll be at work until about 3:30am your time.  :(

In David's absence, here are tonight's final scores:

Allegheny 77  Thiel 71
CWRU 58  Kenyon 54
Kalamazoo 83  Oberlin 62

NCAC collective record is now 28-22.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 06, 2010, 11:41:24 PM
Kenyon led their game 45-24 shortly into the second half and then got outscored 34-9 over the last 17 minutes.  You can go ahead and put that coffee down, Kenyon Lords. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 06, 2010, 11:44:20 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 06, 2010, 11:41:24 PM
Kenyon led their game 45-24 shortly into the second half and then got outscored 34-9 over the last 17 minutes.  You can go ahead and put that coffee down, Kenyon Lords. 

Sounds like maybe they should have MORE coffee at halftime. :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2010, 12:02:45 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 06, 2010, 11:41:24 PM
Kenyon led their game 45-24 shortly into the second half and then got outscored 34-9 over the last 17 minutes.  You can go ahead and put that coffee down, Kenyon Lords. 

Kenyon will say that the leads are weak....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 07, 2010, 12:31:28 AM
New D3Hoops Top 25 Poll is Up.

Wooster #1
Wabash #11

http://d3hoops.com/top25/men/2010-11/week2

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 07, 2010, 12:34:15 AM
Quote from: bashbrother on December 07, 2010, 12:31:28 AM
New D3Hoops Top 25 Poll is Up.

Wooster #1
Wabash #11

http://d3hoops.com/top25/men/2010-11/week2



Including a #1 vote for Wabash!  Someone is either prescient or highly premature. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 07, 2010, 01:47:53 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2010, 12:02:45 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 06, 2010, 11:41:24 PM
Kenyon led their game 45-24 shortly into the second half and then got outscored 34-9 over the last 17 minutes.  You can go ahead and put that coffee down, Kenyon Lords. 

Kenyon will say that the leads are weak....

For me to carry this reference on any further will require a number of violations of the ToS...so I'll just hit the bricks.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2010, 03:47:04 AM
Thanks, wsf.   Next time, though, please give me three victories, not just one.  :)

Smeds, in this economy, and after 11 years of unemployment, ANY job is high-falutin'.   :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 07, 2010, 07:59:08 AM
I watched the first half of Kenyon vs. CWRU and turned it off.  Wow!

Congratulations to Wooster.  I think they go undefeated in conference and stay at the top for the rest of the season unless Wabash upsets them in Crawfordsville. 

Wabash should definitely be Top Ten too, but the pollsters apparently don't want to give the NCAC too much credit just yet.  Really, Illinois Wesleyan loses to University of Chicago, a team the Big Red beat, and stays ahead of the Little Giants?  Wabash has beaten some very good teams by wide margins and should be 10th or higher in my book.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on December 07, 2010, 08:00:41 AM
The Wabash / OWU game is live video feed from Wabash tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on December 07, 2010, 09:13:24 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 06, 2010, 09:01:01 AM
FF -

Is there any chance that sometime in the future you might utilize your talents and do for DIII basketball what you now do for Ohio high school football?  I'd love to see that.  Maybe a combined effort involving you and d3hoops, since they already have some of the groundwork in place with the schedules ready to go.

After the passing of Patrick Abegg, I have thought about that, but would have to make some upgrades on my end in the area of data management, with the help of a senior CS student.  While I have access to powerful computational tools, making that part easy, I'm still in the 1990s with how I deal with input and output to/from the ranking algorithm.  Also, trying to predict the behavior of the NCAA selection committee is much more challenging than dealing with the OHSAA's straight-forward selection/seeding procedures.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 07, 2010, 11:06:47 AM
The last time Wooster was No. 1 was the last week of the 2005-06 regular season. Wooster lost at Ohio Wesleyan in a Saturday afternoon game (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2005-06/files/woom0218.htm). Wooster plays at Ohio Wesleyan this Saturday afternoon. Coach Moore would never let them overlook anyone or let rankings get to their head, but they would be wise to pretend they aren't ranked No. 1.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 07, 2010, 11:52:55 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 07, 2010, 11:06:47 AM
The last time Wooster was No. 1 was the last week of the 2005-06 regular season. Wooster lost at Ohio Wesleyan in a Saturday afternoon game (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2005-06/files/woom0218.htm). Wooster plays at Ohio Wesleyan this Saturday afternoon. Coach Moore would never let them overlook anyone or let rankings get to their head, but they would be wise to pretend they aren't ranked No. 1.

I think I was at that game.  Was it the game where Vandervaart sprained/fractured his wrist with just a few minutes left?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 07, 2010, 12:00:34 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 07, 2010, 11:06:47 AM
The last time Wooster was No. 1 was the last week of the 2005-06 regular season. Wooster lost at Ohio Wesleyan in a Saturday afternoon game (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2005-06/files/woom0218.htm). Wooster plays at Ohio Wesleyan this Saturday afternoon. Coach Moore would never let them overlook anyone or let rankings get to their head, but they would be wise to pretend they aren't ranked No. 1.

For any of the Top 25 historians out there, does anyone know what's the longest stretch that Wooster has held the #1 ranking?  It seems to me that Wooster has a pension of losing soon after being ranked #1 and I really can't recall the Scots ever holding the #1 spot for more than a week at a time.

And seinfeld, lets hope the Scots don't sleep on Allegheny tomorrow night up in Meadville either.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 07, 2010, 12:06:22 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 07, 2010, 11:52:55 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 07, 2010, 11:06:47 AM
The last time Wooster was No. 1 was the last week of the 2005-06 regular season. Wooster lost at Ohio Wesleyan in a Saturday afternoon game (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2005-06/files/woom0218.htm). Wooster plays at Ohio Wesleyan this Saturday afternoon. Coach Moore would never let them overlook anyone or let rankings get to their head, but they would be wise to pretend they aren't ranked No. 1.

I think I was at that game.  Was it the game where Vandervaart sprained/fractured his wrist with just a few minutes left?

I was there, too, and I think it was.  OWU shot lights out from three-point land all night.  Tom Port took a contested three from the near right-hand corner at the buzzer that would have either tied or won the game (can't remember).  It was nearly on the money but rattled in and out in front of a packed house.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HopeConvert on December 07, 2010, 12:37:56 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 07, 2010, 12:00:34 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 07, 2010, 11:06:47 AM
The last time Wooster was No. 1 was the last week of the 2005-06 regular season. Wooster lost at Ohio Wesleyan in a Saturday afternoon game (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2005-06/files/woom0218.htm). Wooster plays at Ohio Wesleyan this Saturday afternoon. Coach Moore would never let them overlook anyone or let rankings get to their head, but they would be wise to pretend they aren't ranked No. 1.

For any of the Top 25 historians out there, does anyone know what's the longest stretch that Wooster has held the #1 ranking?  It seems to me that Wooster has a pension of losing soon after being ranked #1 and I really can't recall the Scots ever holding the #1 spot for more than a week at a time.

And seinfeld, lets hope the Scots don't sleep on Allegheny tomorrow night up in Meadville either.  

All of our pensions have been losing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2010, 01:41:57 PM
The first three times Wooster was ranked #1, they were one and done.  (2000-01 Week 12, 2004-05 Weeks 7 & 13.)  Then in 2005-06, they reached #1 in Week 10 and held it for two weeks, followed by the aforementioned 2006-07 ranking, reaching #1 in Week 2 and holding it for three weeks.

Steve Moore overlooks nobody, of course, that's part of the reason he's had the success he's had.  But only a fool would overlook the Bishops, the way they've been playing of late.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2010, 02:05:34 PM
Tonight's game:

OWU at Wabash, 7:30pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 07, 2010, 02:14:19 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 07, 2010, 12:06:22 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 07, 2010, 11:52:55 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 07, 2010, 11:06:47 AM
The last time Wooster was No. 1 was the last week of the 2005-06 regular season. Wooster lost at Ohio Wesleyan in a Saturday afternoon game (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2005-06/files/woom0218.htm). Wooster plays at Ohio Wesleyan this Saturday afternoon. Coach Moore would never let them overlook anyone or let rankings get to their head, but they would be wise to pretend they aren't ranked No. 1.

I think I was at that game.  Was it the game where Vandervaart sprained/fractured his wrist with just a few minutes left?

I was there, too, and I think it was.  OWU shot lights out from three-point land all night.  Tom Port took a contested three from the near right-hand corner at the buzzer that would have either tied or won the game (can't remember).  It was nearly on the money but rattled in and out in front of a packed house.

Box score says the final was 86-83, so Port's three would've tied it.  Brandon Johnson also fouled out late, so the Scots were down two starters at the end.

Actually, OWU only shot 6-16 from three-point land (37%); I suspect that they hit all the right ones at the right moments, though, which is why you (and I) both remember them as shooting well that night.  OWU was 32-60 (53%) from the floor overall.

OWU still has the game story (http://bishops.owu.edu/2005-06/mbb0218.html) on their website.  I'd forgotten just how dramatic a comeback it almost was for Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 07, 2010, 02:22:19 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 07, 2010, 01:41:57 PM
But only a fool would overlook the Bishops, the way they've been playing of late.

Not to diminish OWU in any way or the challenge that Wooster will face down at the Branch on Saturday, but I'm not ready to proclaim that OWU is all the way back just yet after a modest two game winning streak.  Yes, their win at Cap was a nice win, but other than that win, what has OWU done to make me think they are playing up to the expectations we had for them coming into the season?  A beatdown of Oberlin?  Oberlin is a BAD basketball team.  The Yeomen just gave Kzoo their first win of the season and did so losing by 21 freaking points?!  

Let me see how the Bishops come out and play tonight in Crawfordsville before I start to buy into the notion that OWU's rough start was just a bump in the road...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2010, 02:55:19 PM
I don't mean to suggest that OWU is firing on all cylinders yet, just that they're playing better now then they were a few weeks ago.  A team that well-coached will always be a threat.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 07, 2010, 03:07:20 PM
They are well coached, I'll give you that...  :P   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 07, 2010, 03:15:02 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 07, 2010, 02:22:19 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 07, 2010, 01:41:57 PM
But only a fool would overlook the Bishops, the way they've been playing of late.

Not to diminish OWU in any way or the challenge that Wooster will face down at the Branch on Saturday, but I'm not ready to proclaim that OWU is all the way back just yet after a modest two game winning streak.  Yes, their win at Cap was a nice win, but other than that win, what has OWU done to make me think they are playing up to the expectations we had for them coming into the season?  A beatdown of Oberlin?  Oberlin is a BAD basketball team.  The Yeomen just gave Kzoo their first win of the season and did so losing by 21 freaking points?!  

Let me see how the Bishops come out and play tonight in Crawfordsville before I start to buy into the notion that OWU's rough start was just a bump in the road...

SF- I agree with your point that OWU-Wabash is a game to watch.  But there's also a big part of me that wants to wait until I see Wooster beat someone like OWU (and obviously, Allegheny) before I start to feel that their heady ranking on paper is justified by their performance on the hardwood.

I'll qualify that by saying that most of the reason I'm not sure I'm ready to buy the idea that the Scots are indisputably a Top 10 (much less #1) team right now is because I don't think the Scots have had a chance in their first six games to prove themselves against any really good competition. 

I think Wooster has artificially reached #1 because of losses in front of them rather than results-to-date.  Even a "good" (as opposed to a "national championship contending caliber") Wooster team should be 6-0 at this point, based on who it has played.  Heck, Wabash has a better claim on #1 than Wooster does based on season activity-to-date, having thoroughly beaten a very good team at home, then also beating its quality arch-rival on the road in the young season.  (And I suspect the voter that gave them the #1 vote used some similar logic.)

OWU could even be the best team that the Scots have faced so far this year.  And like I said, it's a tough economy and the Scots could use some resume-building.  In that sense, I think I'll know far more about how this Wooster squad compares after its next 5 games (Allegheny, OWU, Anderson, John Carroll & Wilmington).  Go 5-0 or maybe even 4-1 and I think the Scots will have established a credible Top 10/#1 resume.  Even better, go 8-0 or 7-1 over the next 8, which would include games against two more good opponents in Baruch and Wabash (I don't know anything about William Carey).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 07, 2010, 03:38:02 PM
Bryan, I'm in agreement with you.  It's hard for me to see this Wooster team as being comparable to the Vandervaart, Port, Cooper, Johnson teams.  They've only had one road game, against a CMU team that will probably end up being very mediocre, and the Scots struggled to pull off a tight win.  The sample size is still too small; the next few weeks will clarify things quite a bit.  Even the next three games, all on the road, will reveal much, especially Saturday at OWU.  Those games are almost always tooth and nail contests.

William Carey (6-3) is ranked 33rd in the NAIA D1 poll.  They'll be a tough opponent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 07, 2010, 06:09:41 PM
Due to D3Hoops not having last year's results posted (or at least I cannot find it), can someone tell me what the Wabash vs. OWU results were last year?

Much appreciated.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 07, 2010, 06:16:58 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on December 07, 2010, 06:09:41 PM
Due to D3Hoops not having last year's results posted (or at least I cannot find it), can someone tell me what the Wabash vs. OWU results were last year?

Much appreciated.

OWU 73 - Wabash 67    at Wabash
Wabash 68 - OWU 67   At OWU

http://www.northcoast.org/mb/09-10stats/WAB.HTM#tgbg.res
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 07, 2010, 06:30:36 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 07, 2010, 03:15:02 PM

SF- I agree with your point that OWU-Wabash is a game to watch.  But there's also a big part of me that wants to wait until I see Wooster beat someone like OWU (and obviously, Allegheny) before I start to feel that their heady ranking on paper is justified by their performance on the hardwood.

I'll qualify that by saying that most of the reason I'm not sure I'm ready to buy the idea that the Scots are indisputably a Top 10 (much less #1) team right now is because I don't think the Scots have had a chance in their first six games to prove themselves against any really good competition. 

I think Wooster has artificially reached #1 because of losses in front of them rather than results-to-date.  Even a "good" (as opposed to a "national championship contending caliber") Wooster team should be 6-0 at this point, based on who it has played.  Heck, Wabash has a better claim on #1 than Wooster does based on season activity-to-date, having thoroughly beaten a very good team at home, then also beating its quality arch-rival on the road in the young season.  (And I suspect the voter that gave them the #1 vote used some similar logic.)

OWU could even be the best team that the Scots have faced so far this year.  And like I said, it's a tough economy and the Scots could use some resume-building.  In that sense, I think I'll know far more about how this Wooster squad compares after its next 5 games (Allegheny, OWU, Anderson, John Carroll & Wilmington).  Go 5-0 or maybe even 4-1 and I think the Scots will have established a credible Top 10/#1 resume.  Even better, go 8-0 or 7-1 over the next 8, which would include games against two more good opponents in Baruch and Wabash (I don't know anything about William Carey).

Bryan, I wholeheartedly agree with you in that I don't truly believe that just because Wooster is ranked #1 in this week's poll, that they are the best team in the country.  Now, do I think they are one of the best teams in the country?  I do.  Sure, Wooster hasn't really played anyone yet this season, but at the same time, at least they've beaten every opponent they've faced so far as well.  This is something the Scots haven't been doing for the last few years (lost @ Albion last year, lost @ W&J and CMU two years ago, lost @ LEC three years ago).  At least this team has made it through November unscathed which is something that hasn't happened for a few years at Wooster.

I do feel they have reached their ranking more by default than anything else and as you said, we will find out a LOT about just how good this team is over the next 6-8 games.  But with that said, this is a team that returned 4 of 5 starters including pre-season 1st team AA Ian Franks from a team that went 25-6 and won 2 tournament games before bowing out to a very good Guilford team on their home floor in the round of 16.  So, I'm also not going to say their #1 ranking is completely unwarranted either.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 07, 2010, 06:32:01 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on December 07, 2010, 06:16:58 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on December 07, 2010, 06:09:41 PM
Due to D3Hoops not having last year's results posted (or at least I cannot find it), can someone tell me what the Wabash vs. OWU results were last year?

Much appreciated.

OWU 73 - Wabash 67    at Wabash
Wabash 68 - OWU 67   At OWU

http://www.northcoast.org/mb/09-10stats/WAB.HTM#tgbg.res

Thank you!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 07, 2010, 07:32:23 PM
PLAY BALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2010, 07:51:52 PM
I feel like this happens every year.  OWU starts the season slowly, then starts to show some signs of righting the ship, and I make a post about how they need to be watched, and they promptly go out and lay a stink bomb like they're doing tonight. :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2010, 08:10:26 PM
Well, I'm not too upset about that!

Spoke to OWU's coach at the Wabash / OWU game - he talked about how this year was going to be a challenge since he lost his shooters. So it's an atypical OWU team at least from his eyes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 07, 2010, 08:13:50 PM
Glad to see the halftime entertainment hasn't changed since I was a student.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 07, 2010, 08:44:35 PM
Officiating is questionable at best.   If a player falls down on the court...no matter the reason, there must have been a foul.... uuugh! whistle!

Wabash not playing well down the stretch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 07, 2010, 08:50:37 PM
My only real complaint with the officials was the flagrant earlier. That was just a garbage call. The rest of the calls I can live with.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2010, 09:22:55 PM
Up to date conference standings, after Wabash's 62-50 win over OWU:

Wabash 2-0
Wooster 2-0
Wittenberg 1-0
Allegheny 1-1
Denison 1-1
Ohio Wesleyan 1-1
Kenyon 0-1
Hiram 0-2
Oberlin 0-2
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 07, 2010, 09:38:19 PM
Don't forget about Wittenberg amidst all this Wooster, Wabash, OWU talk---yes they need to do something to get talked about, however, when Mckee gets back in the swing of things and Cooper returns probably around Christmas, they'll be a force to be reckoned with and have some say in the conference race.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 07, 2010, 10:07:44 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 07, 2010, 06:30:36 PM
Bryan, I wholeheartedly agree with you in that I don't truly believe that just because Wooster is ranked #1 in this week's poll, that they are the best team in the country.  Now, do I think they are one of the best teams in the country?  I do.  Sure, Wooster hasn't really played anyone yet this season, but at the same time, at least they've beaten every opponent they've faced so far as well.  This is something the Scots haven't been doing for the last few years (lost @ Albion last year, lost @ W&J and CMU two years ago, lost @ LEC three years ago).  At least this team has made it through November unscathed which is something that hasn't happened for a few years at Wooster.

ScotsFan-

We're definitely in agreement on a a number of points.  I also wouldn't say that Wooster's #1 ranking is completely unwarranted, either.  I fully understand the level of talent the Scots returned this year, and a top 10 preseason ranking is probably right for a Sweet Sixteen team that returns that much talent.

Regardless, I actually don't want to talk that much about whether anyone deserves their ranking right now; I generally don't care who's ranked #1 all that much unless the calendar is about to flip over to April.  So I'll retire that conversation in favor of talking about the games happening on the hardwood.

In that regard, I really like what you noted about the November performance.  It is true that Wooster has managed to get the wins, with several in impressive fashion.  And when I look back over the play-by-play of the CMU game, I'm a happy camper.  Coming back to win from 8 down with 7 mins to play on the road (against any type of competition) is a great sign for a team early in the year.  These are games that Wooster did seem to just continually lose in the past few years.  I actually (unlike perhaps Wooster Booster) saw a lot of optimism in the CMU win, since several players contributed down the stretch (Last 7 mins: Balch-3pts, Hallowell-4, Franks-7, Fegan-5, Wickliffe-2). 

To me, spreading your points out like that means that the team stuck to its game plan even when down late on the road, that everyone was trusted to contribute, and that the team never panicked.  In many ways I think that's far better than the old "hand the ball to Cooper, let him go 1-on-1 (or 1-on-3, or 1-on-5!) , and we'll win if he makes his shots" method of late-game Wooster offense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2010, 10:08:07 PM
Wednesday games: 3 conference, one non-con:

Wooster at Allegheny, 7:30pm -- audio (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule) and live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)
Wittenberg at Denison, 7:30pm -- audio (D) and live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html); audio (W) (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/)
Oberlin at Kenyon, ~8pm -- video, audio, live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)

Hiram at Westminster, 7:30pm -- audio and live stats (http://www.westminster.edu/athletics/sports/mens_basketball/mball_home.cfm)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 08, 2010, 03:22:38 PM
So has a Wabash Little Giants Team ever started a season 9-0?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 08, 2010, 04:00:45 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on December 08, 2010, 03:22:38 PM
So has a Wabash Little Giants Team ever started a season 9-0?

Indeed they have.  The 1907-1908 team went 24-0...that was the first "Wonder Five" team. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 08, 2010, 04:25:21 PM
They were "World Champs", which was probably true. I don't think the Russians had a team then, they were worried about...well...eating and stuff.

Now, if Wabash goes 24-0, then the first round NCAC game will be for the school record.

As good as Wabash is playing now, I think the First Wonder Five's record is safe for another year...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 08, 2010, 05:30:02 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 08, 2010, 04:00:45 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on December 08, 2010, 03:22:38 PM
So has a Wabash Little Giants Team ever started a season 9-0?

Indeed they have.  The 1907-1908 team went 24-0...that was the first "Wonder Five" team. 

Between the 04-05 and the 07-08 seasons, Wabash went 66-3, not a bad stretch.  Did anyone on the board go to any of these games?  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 08, 2010, 06:08:52 PM
No, but I think Mr. Ypsi was part of the D3telegraph network, sponsored by Western Union!

.-- .- -... .- ... .... / .- .-.. .-- .- -.-- ... / ..-. .. --. .... - ... !
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 08, 2010, 06:11:55 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 08, 2010, 06:08:52 PM
No, but I think Mr. Ypsi was part of the D3telegraph network, sponsored by Western Union!

.-- .- -... .- ... .... / .- .-.. .-- .- -.-- ... / ..-. .. --. .... - ... !

I didn't realize I would need to brush up on my Morse Code to follow Posting Up this season...  :P   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2010, 07:11:09 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 08, 2010, 04:25:21 PM
Now, if Wabash goes 24-0, then the first round NCAC game will be for the school record.

24-game schedule this season?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 08, 2010, 08:04:55 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 33  Allegheny 33

Wooster is being led by Ian Franks with 7 points and Nathan Balch with 7 points.

Allegheny's top scorers are Ryan Stanko with 9 points and Donte Briscoe with 9 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 08, 2010, 08:40:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 08, 2010, 07:11:09 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 08, 2010, 04:25:21 PM
Now, if Wabash goes 24-0, then the first round NCAC game will be for the school record.

24-game schedule this season?

I think that is the maximum allowed if a conference has a tourney (or am I misremembering?).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on December 08, 2010, 08:44:48 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 08, 2010, 08:40:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 08, 2010, 07:11:09 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 08, 2010, 04:25:21 PM
Now, if Wabash goes 24-0, then the first round NCAC game will be for the school record.

24-game schedule this season?

I think that is the maximum allowed if a conference has a tourney (or am I misremembering?).

I heard that teams "got that one back" this season. So they can schedule 25 and then have the conference tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2010, 08:47:38 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on December 08, 2010, 08:44:48 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 08, 2010, 08:40:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 08, 2010, 07:11:09 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 08, 2010, 04:25:21 PM
Now, if Wabash goes 24-0, then the first round NCAC game will be for the school record.

24-game schedule this season?

I think that is the maximum allowed if a conference has a tourney (or am I misremembering?).

I heard that teams "got that one back" this season. So they can schedule 25 and then have the conference tourney.

Wooster plays a 25-game schedule virtually every year, the only exceptions being when they have an exhibition that counts against the total.  And we've always had a conference tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 08, 2010, 08:48:06 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on December 08, 2010, 08:44:48 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 08, 2010, 08:40:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 08, 2010, 07:11:09 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 08, 2010, 04:25:21 PM
Now, if Wabash goes 24-0, then the first round NCAC game will be for the school record.

24-game schedule this season?

I think that is the maximum allowed if a conference has a tourney (or am I misremembering?).

I heard that teams "got that one back" this season. So they can schedule 25 and then have the conference tourney.

The Dean is correct. You're misremembering, Chuck; that 24-if-a-tourney rule was rescinded about three or four years ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2010, 08:54:43 PM
Well, I don't remember that rule, but Wooster has played a 25-game schedule in each of the last 7 seasons, including this one, and 9 of the past 11.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 08, 2010, 09:02:44 PM
Final:  Wooster 76  Allegheny 73 :) Big win at the buzzer on an Ian Franks three pointer!

Wooster was led by Ian Franks with 19 points, Justin Hallowell with 18 points, Matt Fegan with 15 points (5 three pointers) and Nathan Balch with 12.

Allegheny shot well tonight at 48% from the floor.  For the Gators, the top scorers were James Ness with 20 points, Devone McLeod with 17 points and Ryan Stanko with 12.

Wooster is now 7-0, 3-0 NCAC ;D   Next game is at Ohio Wesleyan on Saturday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 08, 2010, 09:06:59 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 08, 2010, 08:48:06 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on December 08, 2010, 08:44:48 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 08, 2010, 08:40:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 08, 2010, 07:11:09 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 08, 2010, 04:25:21 PM
Now, if Wabash goes 24-0, then the first round NCAC game will be for the school record.

24-game schedule this season?

I think that is the maximum allowed if a conference has a tourney (or am I misremembering?).

I heard that teams "got that one back" this season. So they can schedule 25 and then have the conference tourney.

The Dean is correct. You're misremembering, Chuck; that 24-if-a-tourney rule was rescinded about three or four years ago.

Actually, that means I DID remember correctly.  Unfortunately, my memory card failed to get updated! :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2010, 09:07:26 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 08, 2010, 09:02:44 PMFor the Gators, the top scorers were James Ness with 20 points...

Who here knew that James Ness was Phil Ness' son?  I sure didn't.

Who here remembers Phil Ness?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 08, 2010, 09:11:00 PM
Well, Wooster won this game despite Breck's best effort in jinxing Nathan Balch at the line in the broadcast!  :P

Nate was perfect for the SEASON at the line as Mike so duly noted before he attempted his one & one with Wooster up 3 and 13 ticks remaining.  Sure enough, Nate doinked the ft and Gheny then promptly took the rebound and got the ball to Devone McCloud who drained a game tying trey with under 5 seconds to play.  Wooster didn't hesitate and Franks drilled a 23 footer at the buzzer for the win!   ;D

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 08, 2010, 09:14:20 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 08, 2010, 09:11:00 PM
Well, Wooster won this game despite Breck's best effort in jinxing Nathan Balch at the line in the broadcast!  :P

Nate was perfect for the SEASON at the line as Mike so duly noted before he attempted his one & one with Wooster up 3 and 13 ticks remaining.  Sure enough, Nate doinked the ft and Gheny then promptly took the rebound and got the ball to Devone McCloud who drained a game tying trey with under 5 seconds to play.  Wooster didn't hesitate and Franks drilled a 23 footer at the buzzer for the win!   ;D



Just before that, I had gone to the Wooster website because I thought I remembered that Balch hadn't missed yet on the season...and then I figured that Breckenridge would feel compelled to mention it.  :-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2010, 09:23:52 PM
Elsewhere:

Wittenberg 84, Denison 70 -- Clayton Black with 25 on 10/13 shooting; Chris Sullivan added 17 with five treys.  Dimonde Hale had 18 for the Big Red.
No word yet from Kenyon.

Hiram 99, Westminster 81 -- Hassan Muhammad with 24 points (8/11) and 9 boards; three other Pups in double figures, including Jide Eniola's double-double (11 & 10).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 08, 2010, 09:40:34 PM
Wooster's balanced scoring and three point shooting were the major reasons they escaped with the narrow road win tonight.

Ian Franks got the game winner but he did not shoot well tonight hitting only 7 of 17 shots from the floor.  Hallowell with 6 of 10 shooting, Balch with 5 of 10 shooting and Fegan 5 of 10 shooting (all three pointers) picked up the slack so Wooster got enough points for the road victory.

Scots made 14 three pointers tonight compared to only 8 for Allegheny and that was the difference in the game.  The Gators won the boards 34 to 32 and also outshot the Scots 48% to 47%.  Turnovers were even.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2010, 09:58:15 PM
THIS JUST IN...

Kenyon 81, Oberlin 65 -- Balance: KC had seven players score between 8 and 15 points, with Kodey Haddox leading the list.  Kenyon also dominated the glass, 38-21, led by new rebounding sensation Ikenna Nwadibia's 10.  Kenyon shot a blistering 58% for the game (68% in the first half), which helps account for Oberlin's paltry 15 defensive rebounds--Kenyon only missed 19 shots in the game.

Updated standings:
Wooster 3-0
Wabash 2-0
Wittenberg 2-0
Kenyon 1-1
Ohio Wesleyan 1-1
Allegheny 1-2
Denison 1-2
Hiram 0-2
Oberlin 0-3
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 08, 2010, 10:55:53 PM
Wabash is 2-0, 9-0

They have 14 conference games left and one non conference. 14+1 = 15+9 = 24
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2010, 11:52:00 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 08, 2010, 10:55:53 PM
Wabash is 2-0, 9-0

They have 14 conference games left and one non conference. 14+1 = 15+9 = 24
Yeah, I was just wondering why the LGs haven't got a 25th game, but that wonder of mine has already generated 3x as many posts as intended.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 09, 2010, 12:06:32 AM
Ah, this crowd will talk about anything, really.

Last year Allegheny was one short and so was Wabash. Haven't looked back farther than that...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on December 09, 2010, 10:59:10 AM
Late last week, a conversation with Wooster senior Kaleb Reed reminded me that  the "Phi Beta Kappa conference."  One of the big pastimes of the Scots this year is the 1980s favorite "speed-cubing", that is, solving the Rubik's cube as fast as possible.  Ian Franks was the first to learn how to do it, and now a half-dozen of his teammates have followed.  Kaleb's senior Independent Study thesis is focused on the mathematics behind this puzzle, mostly in algebraic group theory.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 09, 2010, 11:03:29 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on December 09, 2010, 10:59:10 AM
Late last week, a conversation with Wooster senior Kaleb Reed reminded me that  the "Phi Beta Kappa conference."  One of the big pastimes of the Scots this year is the 1980s favorite "speed-cubing", that is, solving the Rubik's cube as fast as possible.  Ian Franks was the first to learn how to do it, and now a half-dozen of his teammates have followed.  Kaleb's senior Independent Study thesis is focused on the mathematics behind this puzzle, mostly in algebraic group theory.

Rotating the corners...that's the hardest part.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 09, 2010, 12:35:33 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on December 09, 2010, 10:59:10 AM
Late last week, a conversation with Wooster senior Kaleb Reed reminded me that  the "Phi Beta Kappa conference."

I love the fact that this is an incomplete sentence. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on December 09, 2010, 03:08:55 PM
This is what happens when you major in math at a big public university, where composition classes are optional...   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 09, 2010, 03:11:23 PM
It's definitely the English major nerd in me having a laugh at the expense of the math major nerds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 09, 2010, 04:06:53 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 09, 2010, 03:11:23 PM
It's definitely the English major nerd in me having a laugh at the expense of the math major nerds.

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F1.bp.blogspot.com%2F_MaQIPwgVYLA%2FS09GHUoSFDI%2FAAAAAAAAAKU%2FkyA9LtlVVME%2Fs400%2Frevenge-of-the-nerds.jpg&hash=a10c0675ef2789ddf4e98e5b8a392b90b40bde41)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 09, 2010, 04:33:58 PM
Ha! It's been a while since somebody posted ol' Ogre.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 09, 2010, 07:44:56 PM
In Witt news: Michael Cooper should return in Witt's next game in 2 weeks vs Ohio Wesleyan.... BIG GAME!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2010, 12:22:15 AM
Scott Tedder '88 (individually) and the entire 1987-88 national championship OWU men's basketball team will be inducted into the Ohio Basketball Hall of Fame (http://bishops.owu.edu/2010-11/ohiobbhof.html) next spring.  Congratulations to Scott and the entire team, and especially to former Bishops guard and current Head Coach Mike DeWitt, who made the championship possible by graduating in 1987 and getting out of the way.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2010, 01:49:59 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 10, 2010, 12:22:15 AM
Scott Tedder '88 (individually) and the entire 1987-88 national championship OWU men's basketball team will be inducted into the Ohio Basketball Hall of Fame (http://bishops.owu.edu/2010-11/ohiobbhof.html) next spring.  Congratulations to Scott and the entire team, and especially to former Bishops guard and current Head Coach Mike DeWitt, who made the championship possible by graduating in 1987 and getting out of the way.  ;)

And knowing Mike, he'd be the first to admit that!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2010, 11:13:01 AM
One game tonight:

Oberlin at Alma, 7:30pm -- Audio (http://www.goyeo.com/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 10, 2010, 06:51:21 PM
Wooster Booster's Challenge of the Day!

Go to Google Maps and put "Wooster, OH" in the address line.

http://maps.google.com/

Click on "Get Directions".
Put "Delaware, OH" in the destination line.

Note the route that it chooses, taking you off I-71 early, etc.

Now, try to alter this route so as to remain on I-71 until US-36 west which goes right into Delaware.  I'll bet you can't do it.  Even if you try to get directions from the point where GM has you leave 71 to 71/36, it will send you off into the boondocks or south into Columbus before turning back! ???

I now return you to your regularly scheduled broadcast.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 10, 2010, 07:01:03 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 10, 2010, 06:51:21 PM
Wooster Booster's Challenge of the Day!

Go to Google Maps and put "Wooster, OH" in the address line.

http://maps.google.com/

Click on "Get Directions".
Put "Delaware, OH" in the destination line.

Note the route that it chooses, taking you off I-71 early, etc.

Now, try to alter this route so as to remain on I-71 until US-36 west which goes right into Delaware.  I'll bet you can't do it.  Even if you try to get directions from the point where GM has you leave 71 to 71/36, it will send you off into the boondocks or south into Columbus before turning back! ???

I now return you to your regularly scheduled broadcast.  

Wooster Booster - give mapquest (www.mapquest.com) a try and you should get a better result.  ;) :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2010, 08:00:04 PM
All of these mapping sites have their own...quirks.

I still like the good ol' fashioned road atlases and other maps.

My lawn...please remove yourself.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 10, 2010, 08:37:52 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 10, 2010, 11:13:01 AM
One game tonight:

Oberlin at Alma, 7:30pm -- Audio (http://www.goyeo.com/)

livestats if anyone cares.........  http://othello.alma.edu/livestats/xlive.htm

Yeo, its not going well
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 10, 2010, 10:13:45 PM
Alma 77 Oberlin 63
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2010, 10:26:42 PM
Thanks, sac.

We're now 29-23 in the non-cons.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2010, 12:25:21 AM
Three conference games on Saturday:

Wabash at Kenyon, 3pm -- video, audio, live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
Hiram at Denison, ~3pm -- audio and live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html) -- W/M doubleheader, bring a non-perishable food item for free admission, benefits the Licking Co. Food Pantry and their clientele
Wooster at Ohio Wesleyan, ~3pm -- audio/video and live stats(OWU) (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1); audio (http://wkvx.com/) (COW) -- W/M doubleheader

Drive safely and have fun; I'll be at work!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 11, 2010, 03:23:14 AM
I've been down to OWU three or four times for the Wooster game.  Each time there was a women's game first, but each time, surprisingly, OWU hosted a different opponent.  This time time it's against the Scot ladies.  Kudos to whoever came up with this novel concept. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 11, 2010, 03:19:21 PM
Wabash could not hit the broad side of the barn early.  

Kenyon 30
Wabash 27

Halftime

Wabash shot 27.5% from the field for the first half.  Not going to get it done against almost anyone.  Look for the Little Giants to clean this up and hit more of their shots in the 2nd half.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 11, 2010, 03:40:13 PM
As was the case on Tuesday night, Wabash is having a hard time finishing near the basket.  The LGs are missing way too many shots from within 5 feet of the hoop. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 11, 2010, 03:43:51 PM
Gotta knock down the easy ones inside.

Credit Kenyon's defense for some of it, pretty scrappy inside.   On the defensive end, It also seems Wabash's zone is not rotating as smoothly as typical. 

We'll clean it up.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 11, 2010, 03:45:11 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 36  Ohio Wesleyan 21

Ian Franks is leading the Scots with 14 points.  Justin Hallowell has 8 points and 8 boards.  Bryan Wickliffe has 7 points.

Top scorer for the Bishops is Andy Winters with 6 points.  Tim Brady had only 2 points in the half.

Wooster shot 48% in the half and outrebounded OWU 23 to 20.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on December 11, 2010, 03:50:53 PM
Is anyone getting video at Kenyon or am I having operator error?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 11, 2010, 04:14:04 PM
Crap! Kenyon up 54-50. Time out Little Giants. 6:13 to go.

Time to sack up, LGs. Don't let this one get away.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 11, 2010, 04:20:12 PM
59-57 :07........

Why in the heck is Wes Smith not been more of the offense in the late minutes..... he has just been stationary on the wing... ????? Puzzling!  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 11, 2010, 04:28:03 PM
Thank goodness for defense! Though Kenyon's been playing good "D" as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 11, 2010, 04:29:08 PM
This is why we need multiple cameras. Scrum in the corner, ball given to Kenyon down by two. No way to see what happened.

:07 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 11, 2010, 04:34:17 PM
Crap, ball goes into the post - perfect kick out for an open three by Kenyon. 60-59 Lords :02 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 11, 2010, 04:36:00 PM
Ugh. Just ugh.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 11, 2010, 04:37:28 PM
R .............. U................ Kidding ................. MEEEEE?????????
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 11, 2010, 04:37:50 PM
HO. LEE. CRAP.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 11, 2010, 04:37:59 PM
Derek Bailey!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 11, 2010, 04:38:12 PM
Derek freaking Bailey.  Wow.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 11, 2010, 04:38:32 PM
Guess the OWU students should have thought twice about starting the over-rated chant during warm-ups.


Wooster is going to win going away today down in Deleware!   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 11, 2010, 04:39:09 PM
Final:  Wooster 68  Ohio Wesleyan 42 :)

Wooster was led by Ian Franks with 18 points, 12 boards.  Justin Hallowell added 11 points, 9 boards.  Bryan Wickliffe chipped in with 9 points.

For OWU, Dre White had 8 points and Andy Winters added 7 points.

Scots shot 50% from the floor and outrebounded the Bishops by 48 to 34 count.

Wooster is now 8-0, 4-0 NCAC ;D  Next game is at Anderson University on December 20

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BashDad on December 11, 2010, 04:39:16 PM
Wow!!! Unbelievable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on December 11, 2010, 04:39:31 PM
unbelievable end for both teams.  good teams find a way to win ... even when not playing at their best.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 11, 2010, 04:39:37 PM
While I am quite grateful to Kenyon for the free streaming video of today's game I would pay good money for a replay of that last shot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 11, 2010, 04:40:45 PM
Bailey shoots 1 three pointer all day and it was a big one!

How smart was Petty's call to move the ball up court and call another time out.

Bravo!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BashDad on December 11, 2010, 04:41:44 PM
Smith's body language has oscillated between depressed and downright indifferent the past couple games. Frustrating to watch...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 11, 2010, 04:42:25 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on December 11, 2010, 04:39:37 PM
While I am quite grateful to Kenyon for the free streaming video of today's game I would pay good money for a replay of that last shot.

I second that!!!..... I want to see it again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 11, 2010, 04:43:43 PM
There's one for the buzzer beater page!  

So...yeah.  Wabash did not play a very crisp game today, let Kenyon hang around and hang around which inevitably leads to Kenyon hitting a long 3 to get a one point lead with 2.5 seconds left.  Wabash inbounds to half court, gets a timeout.  Off the timeout, Sutherlin inbounds to Bailey who catches and shoots a turnaround 30-footer for the win.  Amazing finish to this game.  Wabash wins by 2.  

Nice to get this win, but games like this will not get Wabash where they want to go this season.  Wabash got a mulligan this afternoon.  Next up is a home date next Sunday against Allegheny.  WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 11, 2010, 04:46:51 PM
Quote from: BashDad on December 11, 2010, 04:41:44 PM
Smith's body language has oscillated between depressed and downright indifferent the past couple games. Frustrating to watch...

I'm wondering how healthy Wes is right now.  He was playing with an ice pack strapped to his hip on Tuesday against OWU.  I'm guessing today wasn't much different.  Wabash plays two games in the next 3-ish weeks.  Hopefully that'll give Wes time to rest whatever it is that is ailing him and get back to being good ol' happy-go-dunkin' Wes. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 11, 2010, 04:49:50 PM
12/11 NCAC Final Scores:

Wooster 68  Ohio Wesleyan 42
Wabash 62  Kenyon 60
Hiram 74  Denison 69

Updated Conference Standings:

Wooster 4-0
Wabash 3-0
Wittenberg 2-0
Allegheny 1-2
Ohio Wesleyan 1-2
Hiram 1-2
Denison 1-3
Kenyon 0-2
Oberlin 0-2
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 11, 2010, 04:59:14 PM
I think after Wednesday's poor performance by Wooster's bigs on both ends of the court vs. Allegheny was certainly addressed by Wooster's coaches over the last 2 days of practice.  Much better performance by Wooster's post players today as they come away with 36 points in the paint and held OWU to just 16!  Compare that to Wednesday where Allegheny outscored Wooster 32-24 in the paint!

Also, after allowing 'Gheny to shoot 48% and getting outrebounded for the first time all season in a poor defensive effort, Wooster turned up the D holding OWU to just 26% shooting from the field and the Scots outrebounded the Bishops 48-34!

One final stat to leave you with in sticking with the defensive theme!  OWU's Tim Brady came into today's game averaging 18 ppg.  He scored TWO today on 1-10 shooting!   :o

Wooster is now off until the 20th then they travel to the Hoosier State to take on Anderson.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 11, 2010, 06:46:26 PM
Notes from Delaware:

1. Christine O'Donnell, in a press release earlier today, revealed that in a past life...  Ahem.

2. Wooster's defensive play was excellent.  Taking a page from Hiram's playbook (isn't everybody doing that now?), the Scots defrocked the Bishops on the perimeter, taking away the three.  That left OWU with very little, as Wickliffe, Hallowell, Claytor, and Mays were more than capable of defending the interior.  And, until the game was out of hand (with about ten minutes to go), Wooster owned their defensive board.  All of this was enough, with a solid offensive effort, for the Scots to roll to a decisive win.

3. Bryan Wickliffe.  Offense, defense, boards, hustle, leadership.  Not only that, even after getting a bad blocking call, he steps in shortly after and takes another charge.  What else is there to say?

4. Jake Mays.  Take a gander at how Wick finishes.  Almost always layups or little flip-in finger rolls.  Toss that little jump-hook in the scrap heap unless you're guarded by Gideon's big brother.  Keep two hands on the ball longer, and you'll finish with a higher percentage inside.

5. Ian Franks and Nathan Balch.  Terrific hustle all game from these two guys.  When you add that to their skill sets, well, you win ballgames.

6. Stellar defense by Justin Warnes; totally took his man out of the game.  And, on the offensive end, he's no longer a roadblock in the patterns.  Some nice passes and a pretty cut down the lane for a layup.

7. If you're a student, and you're going to come to the games shirtless, a good prerequisite would be to have spent more time in the weight room than in the dining room.  I'm just sayin'...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on December 11, 2010, 10:26:30 PM
If ou are interested they have the last shot on tape playback on the Wabash web site.  Two great coaching calls by Mac at the end.  1) TO with 2 1/2 secs and call anand ececute an inbound to half court and quick TO.  That set up time for a planned last second (really ... a ... last ... second) called play.  2) the shot by Bailey was a planned play ... drawing his man away and providing him the opening to catch and shoot.  Bailey made the shot ... Petty gets the game ball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2010, 10:28:52 PM
So anything interesting happen while I was gone?

Thanks again for the updates, wsf.  I know I can always count on you.

The game nobody is filling pages of posts with:
Hiram 74, Denison 69...Pups end the game on a 22-11 run to erase a 6-point DU advantage, holding off the Big Red with crisp free throw shooting in the waning moments.  Denison held the Terriers to just 12 offensive rebounds, and nearly matched their guests on the overall (34-33 Hiram).  In a game with 14 lead changes where neither team led by more than a touchdown, it looks like the decisive factor was Denison's icy three-point shooting (2/13, 15%) and tepid free throw shooting (11/20, 55%), offsetting a strong 50% overall effort from the floor.  (Hiram's comparables were 39%, 73%, and 45%.)  Hiram got good balance, with frosh Andrew Stefanov contributing 16 of the Terriers' 45 bench points (vs. 13 for DU).  Dimonde Hale recorded a double-double with fries but no shake, with 24 points, 18 boards, four assists and just two turnovers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2010, 10:29:53 PM
Quote from: wabco on December 11, 2010, 10:26:30 PM
If ou are interested they have the last shot on tape playback on the Wabash web site. 
Also on the D3hoops.com (http://www.d3hoops.com/landing/index) website.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2010, 12:04:32 AM
Things seem pretty normal for this point in an NCAC season, but just think where we'd be if two last-second jumpers this week had rimmed out rather than falling through.  Of course, Wooster would still have had an OT period to pull their game out, but still, we were this close to near-chaos in the standings.  Instead, we'll just sit on a table topped by three undefeated Ws for another week at least.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 12, 2010, 01:25:26 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 11, 2010, 10:28:52 PM
So anything interesting happen while I was gone?

 Dimonde Hale recorded a double-double with fries but no shake, with 24 points, 18 boards, four assists and just two turnovers.

Someone has a jones for an In 'n' Out burger...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 12, 2010, 01:43:49 AM
My favorite part of the Derek Bailey video....check the reaction of Coach Petty on the bench.  Could Mac be any cooler?  I guess when you've been in the game as long as Coach Petty has, it takes more than a 30-foot game winner to get you to jump out of the seat.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2010, 03:12:24 PM
Steve Moore on being ranked #1:

Quote from: Aaron Dorksen of The Daily Record"Getting the No. 1 ranking is nice, [...] but when things like that happen it just serves to motivate opponents even more.

"You still have to go out and produce the next game. It's just like being undefeated the season before -- it doesn't win any games for you the next year."

Moore admitted that some other teams in Div. III have a better claim to this season's No. 1 ranking, saying, "Since we started out pretty high in the poll and the teams above us lost, that's how it works. We've kept winning so they moved us up.

"I think we've played some good basketball at times this season, but we haven't been as consistent as I'd like to see."


Ian Franks on being ranked #1:

Quote from: Kevin Lynch of The Daily Record"We know the ranking doesn't mean anything right now. It just puts a big target on our backs," Franks said. "We just try and play every game one at a time."

Links to the two stories (subscription may be required):
Moore: http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4946774
Franks (OWU game story): http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4946777
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 13, 2010, 11:16:47 AM
Forgot to mention this on Saturday, but after the OWU game in the post-game interview, Coach Moore mentioned that Wooster has a favorable finals schedule this season in that they finish up with finals on Friday giving them 4 days to fully devote to practice and preparing for their game with Anderson on the 20th.   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 13, 2010, 11:38:15 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 13, 2010, 11:16:47 AM
Forgot to mention this on Saturday, but after the OWU game in the post-game interview, Coach Moore mentioned that Wooster has a favorable finals schedule this season in that they finish up with finals on Friday giving them 4 days to fully devote to practice and preparing for their game with Anderson on the 20th.   8-)

A Monday night game is unusual, especially one outside the territoriality of the U.S.  I suspect that Wooster's following will be small, what with the distance and the issue of visas, et al.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2010, 08:29:57 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 13, 2010, 11:38:15 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 13, 2010, 11:16:47 AM
Forgot to mention this on Saturday, but after the OWU game in the post-game interview, Coach Moore mentioned that Wooster has a favorable finals schedule this season in that they finish up with finals on Friday giving them 4 days to fully devote to practice and preparing for their game with Anderson on the 20th.   8-)

A Monday night game is unusual, especially one outside the territoriality of the U.S.  I suspect that Wooster's following will be small, what with the distance and the issue of visas, et al.

Visas are no good in Indiana; they still use BankAmericard there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 14, 2010, 11:06:20 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 13, 2010, 08:29:57 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 13, 2010, 11:38:15 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 13, 2010, 11:16:47 AM
Forgot to mention this on Saturday, but after the OWU game in the post-game interview, Coach Moore mentioned that Wooster has a favorable finals schedule this season in that they finish up with finals on Friday giving them 4 days to fully devote to practice and preparing for their game with Anderson on the 20th.   8-)

A Monday night game is unusual, especially one outside the territoriality of the U.S.  I suspect that Wooster's following will be small, what with the distance and the issue of visas, et al.

Visas are no good in Indiana; they still use BankAmericard there.

Or squirrel and raccoon pelts.

/Native Hoosier, of course
//Squirrel's good eatin'
///Or so I've been told.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 14, 2010, 11:51:44 AM
Video of the end of the Wooster/Allegheny game, starting with Balch's missed free throw, is available at Wooster's Facebook page. (http://www.facebook.com/#!/CollegeofWooster)  It's a pretty incredible sequence, and of course the setup and execution of Franks' game-winner is great (as is his ice-cold "just another 24-footer" walk off the court), but check out Devone McLeod's three at :05--what a shot!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 14, 2010, 01:52:24 PM
The latest DIII Massey ratings, through yesterday's games, have Wabash 5th and Wooster 6th.  The next NCAC team is Wittenberg at 90th.

There are some new features on here that I just noticed.  Clicking on a team reveals it's schedule, running from bottom to top.  That's not new.  But there is now a column that predicts future outcomes.  Wooster, for instance, is slated to have a 37% chance of winning at Wabash.  The Scots, though, in the return game at Timken, are a 62% favorite.  These numbers will no doubt fluctuate a little almost daily as game results are added to the database.

http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&yr=2011&sub=NCAA%20III&mid=1
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 14, 2010, 06:18:58 PM
That future outcomes has been there a while. Sometimes it goes away but it's been there most years. I use it late in the year seeing about the chances of the undefeated losing or the winless winning!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 14, 2010, 08:16:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 14, 2010, 01:52:24 PM
The latest DIII Massey ratings, through yesterday's games, have Wabash 5th and Wooster 6th.  The next NCAC team is Wittenberg at 90th.

There are some new features on here that I just noticed.  Clicking on a team reveals it's schedule, running from bottom to top.  That's not new.  But there is now a column that predicts future outcomes.  Wooster, for instance, is slated to have a 37% chance of winning at Wabash.  The Scots, though, in the return game at Timken, are a 62% favorite.  These numbers will no doubt fluctuate a little almost daily as game results are added to the database.

Wooster Booster - good points about the Massey ratings. k+  After the Wabash road game with only a 37% chance of winning, Wooster's next toughest game with only a 56% probability is the upcoming game at Anderson.

In the Massey ratings, Anderson is at #27 and John Carroll is at #33 which are the next 2 opponents for the Scots!

Anderson has not lost at home this year and they only had 3 home losses last year.  Wooster will have to play their best ball on 12/20 to get the victory.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 14, 2010, 08:30:31 PM
Congratulations to Wooster's Ian Franks on being named the most recent NCAC Player of the Week! :)

Here is the link: http://www2.northcoast.org/basketball/potw/2010
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 14, 2010, 08:32:41 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 14, 2010, 11:51:44 AM
Video of the end of the Wooster/Allegheny game, starting with Balch's missed free throw, is available at Wooster's Facebook page. (http://www.facebook.com/#!/CollegeofWooster)  It's a pretty incredible sequence, and of course the setup and execution of Franks' game-winner is great (as is his ice-cold "just another 24-footer" walk off the court), but check out Devone McLeod's three at :05--what a shot!

That's an awesome sequence. Thanks for sharing that with us.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 14, 2010, 10:38:23 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 14, 2010, 08:16:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 14, 2010, 01:52:24 PM
The latest DIII Massey ratings, through yesterday's games, have Wabash 5th and Wooster 6th.  The next NCAC team is Wittenberg at 90th.

There are some new features on here that I just noticed.  Clicking on a team reveals it's schedule, running from bottom to top.  That's not new.  But there is now a column that predicts future outcomes.  Wooster, for instance, is slated to have a 37% chance of winning at Wabash.  The Scots, though, in the return game at Timken, are a 62% favorite.  These numbers will no doubt fluctuate a little almost daily as game results are added to the database.

Wooster Booster - good points about the Massey ratings. k+  After the Wabash road game with only a 37% chance of winning, Wooster's next toughest game with only a 56% probability is the upcoming game at Anderson.

In the Massey ratings, Anderson is at #27 and John Carroll is at #33 which are the next 2 opponents for the Scots!

Anderson has not lost at home this year and they only had 3 home losses last year.  Wooster will have to play their best ball on 12/20 to get the victory.

It goes somewhat beyond that, too:

Current Massey Ratings:
Anderson - 27
John Carroll - 33
Wilmington - 181 (this is actually a significant drop-off from where Wilmington was...a 4-game losing streak will do that)
William Carey - 29 (in NAIA I; Massey sees Wooster as the favorite)
Baruch - 98 (also a drop-off, after two straight losses)
Wabash - 5

That's four high-quality opponents for Wooster in its next six (and I'd hesitate to write-off Wilmington or Baruch, either).  Should be a good challenge for the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bash Brother 2000 on December 14, 2010, 11:11:38 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 11, 2010, 04:46:51 PM
Quote from: BashDad on December 11, 2010, 04:41:44 PM
Smith's body language has oscillated between depressed and downright indifferent the past couple games. Frustrating to watch...

I'm wondering how healthy Wes is right now.  He was playing with an ice pack strapped to his hip on Tuesday against OWU.  I'm guessing today wasn't much different.  Wabash plays two games in the next 3-ish weeks.  Hopefully that'll give Wes time to rest whatever it is that is ailing him and get back to being good ol' happy-go-dunkin' Wes. 

Wes' preceived body language is not indicative of his heart or love for the game.  To be honest with you, he's been beat-up quite a bit this season.  This week will allow him some much needed rest.  Then, watch him take flight and soar and earn NCAC honors once again.   

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: OWho? on December 15, 2010, 06:41:31 AM
OWU students that was absolutely shameful. Disgraceful representation of your student body. Shame on you. The way you behaved at the wooster game was a black eye for the school. Public intoxication is not funny or cool no matter what your friends say. Next time think about it. You are not funny.

     My Apologies Wooster




Forever and for always yours. WAR BEARS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 15, 2010, 10:41:56 AM
What really concerned me was that this group of 15-20 guys gathered up outside the gym after the game.  The Wooster team bus had pulled up and was parked not far from the exit and these kids were obviously planning on one last go-round at the Scot players when they walked by.  I didn't stay to see this, so I don't know what it involved, but it's sad that these situations are becoming so common. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 15, 2010, 11:57:18 AM
During warm-ups, Franks appears to be just another kid who sits on the end of the bench.  When the game started, the baby-faced kid dominated.   Disappointing for the bishops when the #1 team in the nation is playing in your gym and you come out flat and defeated.  OWHO - Agreed.  School spirit is one thing, public drunkenness and obnoxiousness is another.  Shameful day for the students and the Bishops team.  Where was the battle in this bishops team?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 15, 2010, 12:00:05 PM
I left immediately after the game. I hope there were no incidents between the OWU students and the Scots team on the way to the bus.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 15, 2010, 12:51:15 PM
It took four days to get around to posting this...must have been some pretty impactful stuff those drunk kids were yelling. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2010, 01:06:34 PM
Yeah, inquiring minds want to know.  I'm a little surprised that there was any significant number of OWU students at the game (it must have been during exams if not winter break), and very surprised that they were ugly. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2010, 01:19:01 PM
Despite it being a Wednesday, it's pretty dead on the schedule.  Just two non-conference games to interfere with Christmas shopping or snow shoveling:

Hiram at Grove City, 7:00pm -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html)
Mt. St. Joseph at Denison, 7:30pm -- audio and live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html)

NCAC stands at 29-23 in the non-conference (had to go back 4 pages to find that!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 15, 2010, 01:31:49 PM
Want to know why, Wallace?  Because I knew if it was my post that mentioned it, I'd be the target of one of your snide remarks.

There were twenty-plus students, in a group, mostly without shirts, and covered in some sort of white powder.  Mostly pretty big guys, and overweight; many looked like they could be linemen.  Security had to talk to them several times before the game and possibly during it.  They were loud and  overly obnoxious.  At least one of them, during a timeout, continually yelled over to the Wooster fans, calling someone out to meet him outside.  No official presence stepped in to stop this.  

I've seen similar stuff before, at various places, including Wooster by Wooster students.  This was among the worst.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 15, 2010, 01:40:16 PM
I heard some crude comments during the game but no four letter words. More bothersome was the individuals who appeared to be close to passing out or becoming sick.  We were wagering on which drunken student would vomit first.  Campus police did talk to the students on multiple occassions.  OWU's coach is not responsible for the students behavior.  During the game, he was sitting on the bench watching his team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 15, 2010, 01:43:30 PM
I am new to the boards so my apologies if these topics have already been discussed.
Best game in the last 5 years.
Best team in the last 5 years.
Rank the coaches.
Rank the program.  (Not just this years team)
Toughest arena to win in as an opposing team.

Any thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2010, 02:29:12 PM
Best game in the last 5 6 years. Feb. 12, 2005, Wooster 102, Wittenberg 95, 3OT (so I stretched the timeframe a wee bit...)
Best team in the last 5 years. 2005-06 Wittenberg Tigers, 30-4, lost in national championship game by 3 (although Wooster, 26-4 and NCAC champs, beat them twice that season.  Wooster was 23-1 at one point, but stumbled down the tournament stretch.)
Rank the head coaches. 1. Steve Moore, Wooster.  I'll reserve comment on the other 8.
Rank the program.  (Not just this years team) Wooster under Steve Moore is the strongest program by far.  Wabash and OWU are building winning traditions. Hiram is steadily improving and heading for a permanent position in the upper half.  Kenyon and Allegheny have been climbing in recent years, but have new coaches this season.  Wittenberg is not dominant like it used to be, but is still strong.  Oberlin and Denison have a ways to go.
Toughest arena to win in as an opposing team.  Probably Wooster, but more for the team than the atmosphere.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 15, 2010, 02:33:21 PM
Quote from: WAlum on December 15, 2010, 11:57:18 AM
When the game started, the baby-faced kid dominated.   

Should we now start referring to Franks as the Baby Faced Assassin?  ;D

Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 15, 2010, 01:31:49 PM
Want to know why, Wallace?  Because I knew if it was my post that mentioned it, I'd be the target of one of your snide remarks.

There were twenty-plus students, in a group, mostly without shirts, and covered in some sort of white powder.  Mostly pretty big guys, and overweight; many looked like they could be linemen.  Security had to talk to them several times before the game and possibly during it.  They were loud and  overly obnoxious.  At least one of them, during a timeout, continually yelled over to the Wooster fans, calling someone out to meet him outside.  No official presence stepped in to stop this.  

I've seen similar stuff before, at various places, including Wooster by Wooster students.  This was among the worst.


While I was not in attendance, I did tune into the radio broadcast and could definitely hear the students chanting things throughout the game.  As I noted in my post following the game, I heard the 'over-rated' chant during warmups which didn't work out so well for them...  :P

I do remember wondering what the OWU students were still being so vocal about when their team was getting drilled in the second half?  And if they were all drunk, I'm surprised they didn't leave once the game got out of hand and the alcohol started wearing off?   :P

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on December 15, 2010, 02:43:26 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 15, 2010, 02:29:12 PM
Toughest arena to win in as an opposing team.  Probably Wooster, but more for the team than the atmosphere.

This is an interesting question. Wooster probably wins in straight home win percentage over the last five years, but I wonder who has the biggest difference in home/road splits?

Maybe I'll look it up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2010, 03:24:36 PM
It's not like anyone in the NCAC has much "atmosphere" for their games (Woo/Witt games aside.)  Wooster has many more fannies in the seats, but that's just it--they're in the seats.  If it's a close, exciting game (and/or if it's Witt), they can get involved, but mostly they just sit there quietly like Michigan fans.  Wittenberg fans are similarly quiet, and like Wooster, are disproportionately townies rather than students.  OWU students, as noted above, sometimes are motivated to attend and cheer, but not often enough to make their gym intimidating.  I've attended games at Kenyon where I felt like I knew the name of everyone in attendance.  Denison, Hiram, and especially Oberlin play before crowds that can't really be called "crowds."  I've never been to Allegheny or Wabash, but the videos I've seen from there are underwhelming.  Wabash does at least seem to have an active student section, but I'd hesitate to call Chadwick a "tough place to win" since it seems like the other W's succeed in doing just that with reasonable regularity.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on December 15, 2010, 03:31:20 PM
Here's what my study found:

Kenyon -- 0.231
Wabash -- 0.203
Hiram -- 0.174
Oberlin -- 0.141
Ohio Wesleyan -- 0.089
Wittenberg -- 0.085
Denison -- 0.056
Wooster -- 0.045
Allegheny -- 0.012

This is home winning percentage minus away winning percentage for the past five full years plus this partial year (conference only).

The unbalanced schedule probably skews the results some. Wooster is so low because they win whether they're home or away. No real chance for much of an increase.

In all, it's probably due more to chance than atmosphere. At least I had fun.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on December 15, 2010, 04:25:37 PM
Wabash being near the top does make some sense, because of the travel involved between Crawfordsville and anywhere else in the NCAC.  When you add in a solid team and decent crowd support, they are in the conversation for toughest place to play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 15, 2010, 04:47:40 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on December 15, 2010, 04:25:37 PM
Wabash being near the top does make some sense, because of the travel involved between Crawfordsville and anywhere else in the NCAC.  When you add in a solid team and decent crowd support, they are in the conversation for toughest place to play.
...and when you subtract out the solid team and decent crowd support (but retain the travel barrier), you get Allegheny, at the bottom of the table.  Makes me think that the tough-to-get-there aspect is overrated.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 15, 2010, 06:18:12 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 15, 2010, 03:24:36 PM
It's not like anyone in the NCAC has much "atmosphere" for their games (Woo/Witt games aside.)  Wooster has many more fannies in the seats, but that's just it--they're in the seats.  If it's a close, exciting game (and/or if it's Witt), they can get involved, but mostly they just sit there quietly like Michigan fans.  Wittenberg fans are similarly quiet, and like Wooster, are disproportionately townies rather than students.  OWU students, as noted above, sometimes are motivated to attend and cheer, but not often enough to make their gym intimidating.  I've attended games at Kenyon where I felt like I knew the name of everyone in attendance.  Denison, Hiram, and especially Oberlin play before crowds that can't really be called "crowds."  I've never been to Allegheny or Wabash, but the videos I've seen from there are underwhelming.  Wabash does at least seem to have an active student section, but I'd hesitate to call Chadwick a "tough place to win" since it seems like the other W's succeed in doing just that with reasonable regularity.

I do invite you to go ahead and stream any Wabash/DePauw hoops game next year.  The atmosphere there will rival (ha!) that of a Witt/Woo game.  I was very pleased to see the large and spirited crowd on the stream from this year's game down in Greencastle.  Expect that to ramp up now that these are league games.  I can't wait for that first NCAC game at Chadwick vs. DPU next season. 

In the last three seasons at Chadwick, Wabash has boatraced Witt and Woo once apiece, beaten Witt a second time, and lost the other three games to these teams by 2, 2, and 3 points.  While the record vs. the other W's over the last three seasons is 3-3, I think it's more than fair to say that winning at Chadwick is "tough".  You can do it, sure, but it's rare that you come to C'ville and run the LGs out of the gym. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 15, 2010, 07:46:51 PM
I'm a little more optimistic than Massey's math, but I still figure Wooster to have less than a 50/50 shot at winning this season in Crawfordsville.  The road, outside of Oberlin, is a tough place.  I was surprised that the Scots won going away at OWU, but they played very well and the Bishops are really struggling.

I have a friend who, no matter what I say, believes this Wooster team to be the be-all-end-all.  When I told him of the Massey site and the prediction numbers, he believed that validated his opinion, in that Wooster is favored in every game, save in Crawfordsville.  Well, yeah, but you lose some of those games in which you're a favorite, even a heavy one.

Imagine the case of the 70% free throw shooter going to the line to shoot two.  Most people would think he's likely to make both.  In fact, his chances of doing that (for the moment dismissing other factors such as pressure, no-pressure, etc.) are only 49%.

The chances of Wooster winning at both Anderson and Wabash, based on the Massey numbers, are (.56)(.37) or 21% (rounded off).  The Scots odds of running the table during the regular season?  About 44-1 against, not much above a 2% chance.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 15, 2010, 09:38:21 PM
For anyone who cares:

     Mt. St. Joseph  73    Denison  72

In a tight game that shouldn't have been tight, Ghiloni can't find a way to get his leading scorer more than one shot in the last 6 minutes.   What should have been an easy win - even without Farmer - turns to the 4th loss in a row.

Coaching, coaching, coaching. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 15, 2010, 09:50:29 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 15, 2010, 01:31:49 PM
Want to know why, Wallace?  Because I knew if it was my post that mentioned it, I'd be the target of one of your snide remarks.

There were twenty-plus students, in a group, mostly without shirts, and covered in some sort of white powder.  Mostly pretty big guys, and overweight; many looked like they could be linemen.  Security had to talk to them several times before the game and possibly during it.  They were loud and  overly obnoxious.  At least one of them, during a timeout, continually yelled over to the Wooster fans, calling someone out to meet him outside.  No official presence stepped in to stop this.  

I've seen similar stuff before, at various places, including Wooster by Wooster students.  This was among the worst.



Yawn. At Chadwick, we call this Wednesday night against Hiram!

:D

Seriously, I think these OWU guys were trying to be a Wabash equivalent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 15, 2010, 10:22:10 PM
Red - even if the loss was due to coaching, D3 coaches dont get fired for losing or being lazy. All they have to do is stay out of trouble.  Ws and Ls dont matter.

Quote from: GoRed on December 15, 2010, 09:38:21 PM
For anyone who cares:

     Mt. St. Joseph  73    Denison  72

In a tight game that shouldn't have been tight, Ghiloni can't find a way to get his leading scorer more than one shot in the last 6 minutes.   What should have been an easy win - even without Farmer - turns to the 4th loss in a row.

Coaching, coaching, coaching. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 15, 2010, 11:45:39 PM
Final:  Hiram 65  Grove City 54

So, the NCAC is now 30-24 in nonconference games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 16, 2010, 12:21:54 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 15, 2010, 11:45:39 PM
Final:  Hiram 65  Grove City 54

So, the NCAC is now 30-24 in nonconference games.

The records of each NCAC team's non-conference opponents:

Wittenberg: 26-17
Allegheny: 27-21
Wabash: 31-27
Ohio Wesleyan: 33-29
Denison: 17-20
Wooster: 16-24
Hiram: 27-38
Kenyon: 21-36
Oberlin: 14-32

Overall: 212-244
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 16, 2010, 12:25:05 AM
Are you making a point about Hiram that I'm failing to understand? ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 16, 2010, 12:27:26 AM
No.  I'm pointing out that it's very late here, and that due to fatigue my post was incorrect the first two times (and may still be  ;D).  Check it out now. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 16, 2010, 12:42:29 AM
Wooster Booster,

I don't know where you got the Wooster numbers, but the Scots non-conference opponents overall record right now is 35-21. Throw out Cincinnati Christian and William Carey, those games are meaningless in what really matters -- determining your regional ranking and eventually bid/seeding in the NCAA tournament. Now, the 35-21 record probably isn't telling the complete story either, since this may include some non-Div. III opponents/non-region opponents. But all that matters is that Wooster's non-conference schedule is as strong as it has ever been since the NCAA went to the criteria it now uses to select tournament teams. Throw in that the NCAC as a whole is better this year than it has been in a while, and Wooster's schedule (along with that of Wabash, Witt, etc.) will actually work in their favor for a change, instead of it being a hindrance like it has been in recent years.

** I'm including the records of teams that Wooster has yet to play, but they will, and that's all that matters, since this is just a snapshot of what their strength of schedule will look like at the end of the year -- the only time it matters.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 16, 2010, 01:35:46 AM
Quote from: GoRed on December 15, 2010, 09:38:21 PM
For anyone who cares:

     Mt. St. Joseph  73    Denison  72

In a tight game that shouldn't have been tight, Ghiloni can't find a way to get his leading scorer more than one shot in the last 6 minutes.   What should have been an easy win - even without Farmer - turns to the 4th loss in a row.

Coaching, coaching, coaching. 


Was Hale asking for the ball? Was MSJ over playing him and leaving others open?

It seemed like both teams kind of slowed it down a bit the last few minutes looking at the PBP. Sometimes you need to go to your second or third scoring option down the stretch. This is college hoops - everyone on the team should be able to score if left open.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 16, 2010, 07:48:49 AM
QuoteWas Hale asking for the ball? Was MSJ over playing him and leaving others open?

It seemed like both teams kind of slowed it down a bit the last few minutes looking at the PBP. Sometimes you need to go to your second or third scoring option down the stretch. This is college hoops - everyone on the team should be able to score if left open.

Good points, Smedindy.  They did seem to slow up late in the game and the Big Red noticeably passed up open shots early in the shot clock.  Anyone should be able to score, but I have seen many a good shot passed up over the years and this game was no exception.  Denison players know the repercussions of taking the shots earlier than "the system" calls for.  They therefore pass up good open shots early on and end up forcing something late just before the clock expires. 

This was the end of a tough scheduling stretch for the Big Red, taking on Wooster, Witt and Hiram in consecutive games and now without Farmer for a while.  Hopefully they can bounce back to where they were before after the holiday break.  Enjoy the holidays everyone! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 16, 2010, 08:58:22 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 16, 2010, 12:42:29 AM
Wooster Booster,

I don't know where you got the Wooster numbers, but the Scots non-conference opponents overall record right now is 35-21. Throw out Cincinnati Christian and William Carey, those games are meaningless in what really matters -- determining your regional ranking and eventually bid/seeding in the NCAA tournament. Now, the 35-21 record probably isn't telling the complete story either, since this may include some non-Div. III opponents/non-region opponents. But all that matters is that Wooster's non-conference schedule is as strong as it has ever been since the NCAA went to the criteria it now uses to select tournament teams. Throw in that the NCAC as a whole is better this year than it has been in a while, and Wooster's schedule (along with that of Wabash, Witt, etc.) will actually work in their favor for a change, instead of it being a hindrance like it has been in recent years.

** I'm including the records of teams that Wooster has yet to play, but they will, and that's all that matters, since this is just a snapshot of what their strength of schedule will look like at the end of the year -- the only time it matters.

The numbers are from the Massey site.  They do not include the records of future opponents.  My point was to see how meaningful the NCAC's non-conference won-lost record is at this time.  Still, in looking at it this morning, I see that Wooster's numbers should be 18-24, not 16-24.  I think what I've mostly accomplished here is that I shouldn't attempt to do mental addition after midnight. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 16, 2010, 12:01:43 PM
GoRed, what's the matter with Larry Farmer?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 16, 2010, 12:12:48 PM
Quote from: GoRed on December 16, 2010, 07:48:49 AM
Denison players know the repercussions of taking the shots earlier than "the system" calls for. 

Everybody knows how many times to pass before you shoot, right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 16, 2010, 01:40:05 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 16, 2010, 12:01:43 PM
GoRed, what's the matter with Larry Farmer?

I don't know if this has anything to do with it, but Farmer looked to dislocate a finger in his shooting hand in their game at Wooster.  He came out of the locker room after halftime with his hand taped up and tried to go, but he clearly wasn't as effective as he had been before the injury.

But, I don't know if he's still having trouble with that injury or if something else has come up since then?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 16, 2010, 01:46:55 PM
David - Larry is on the sidelines with a bandaged finger on his right hand - details are sketchy.  It's presumably broken or dislocated, but there is no word on how long he is out.

Wally - time is a precious asset we should never seek to waste.  I enjoy it when a team savors the time it has with the ball.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 16, 2010, 02:19:13 PM
Dinged for a Hoosiers reference? C'mon!  

On a more serious note, Denison is an enigma to me.  A couple of years ago they were something like 0-12 and came in to Chadwick and outplayed Wabash in a big way.  The game was close and the whole time I kept thinking to myself that no matter if Denison wins or loses (they did win), I couldn't understand how on Earth they could possibly be 0-12.  There are some good players there, but getting the consistent effort every game seems to be the next step for that group to take.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 16, 2010, 02:54:38 PM
I wouldn't say Denison is much of an enigma this season.  Losing a talented player like Farmer is a big reason the Big Red have found themselves in the midst of a 4 game losing streak.

I didn't realize he hasn't even been in the lineup at all since the Wooster game.  And in those 3 games Dension has lost by 14 to Witt, 5 to Hiram and 1 to M-SJ.  Those 15 ppg Farmer had been averaging could have helped this team tremendously over the last 3 games for Denison.  Not to mention, but when you look more closely at Farmer's numbers, it seems he was starting to really be hitting his stride heading into the Wooster game.  In the 3 games leading up to Denison's game with Wooster, Farmer was averaging over 20 ppg.  And, not surprisingly, all 3 games were Denison wins.  Furthermore, he had 8 points in the first half of the Wooster game prior to getting injured.  He finished the game with 10.

Clearly, losing a player the caliber of Farmer would be tough for any team to overcome.  But for Denison, it is proving extremely difficult to overcome...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 16, 2010, 11:02:45 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 16, 2010, 12:42:29 AM

...but the Scots non-conference opponents overall record right now is 35-21.
Now, the 35-21 record probably isn't telling the complete story either, since this may include some non-Div. III opponents/non-region opponents. But all that matters is that Wooster's non-conference schedule is as strong as it has ever been since the NCAA went to the criteria it now uses to select tournament teams.

Two good inregion examples of Seinfeld's point are Bethany and Ohio Northern, teams that Wooster already beat.

Excluding their loss to Wooster, Bethany is now 7-2 and tied for 1st in the PrAC.
Excluding their loss to Wooster, Ohio Northern is now 5-2 and in 2nd place in the OAC.

If the Bison and the Polar Bears keep on winning, this will help Wooster's regional ranking at year end. ;) :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 16, 2010, 11:29:43 PM
New poll, if I did it right.  This one's designed to not end up as a Wooster-vs.-Wabash faceoff.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 17, 2010, 12:16:36 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 16, 2010, 11:29:43 PM
New poll, if I did it right.  This one's designed to not end up as a Wooster-vs.-Wabash faceoff.

Are you making some hidden point about Hiram?  ???

;) ;) ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 17, 2010, 11:15:11 PM
Someone voted for Oberlin, and there's still no votes for Denison.  Ouch.

Saturday's action, all non-conference, all on the road:

Hiram at Case Western Reserve, 3pm -- video and live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html)
Kenyon at Earlham, 3pm -- audio and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
Ohio Wesleyan at Franklin, 3pm -- live stats(?) (http://www.franklingrizzlies.com/mens-sports/mens-basketball/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 17, 2010, 11:19:01 PM
Voting for Oberlin in this poll is like casting your ballot for the Very Silly Party.

Malcolm Peter Brian Telescope Adrian Umbrella Stand Jasper Wednesday (pops mouth twice) Stoatgobbler John Raw Vegetable (whinnying) Arthur Norman Michael (blows squeaker) Featherstone Smith (whistle) Northgot Edwards Harris (fires pistol, then 'whoop') Mason (chuff-chuff-chuff-chuff) Frampton Jones Fruitbat (laughs) (squeaker) Gilbert (sings) 'We'll keep a welcome in the' (three shots) Williams If I Could Walk That Way Jenkin (squeaker) Tiger-drawers Pratt Thompson (sings) 'Raindrops Keep Falling On My Head' Darcy Carter (horn) Pussycat (sings) 'Don't Sleep In The Subway' Barton Mainwaring (hoot, 'whoop') Smith - 2
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 18, 2010, 09:36:08 AM
QuoteSomeone voted for Oberlin, and there's still no votes for Denison.  Ouch.

I had to go with my head, not my heart.  Besides, everyone would know where the lone vote came from.

I'm going to try to watch Hiram vs. Case on video this afternoon since the Big Red has been up against both already this season.  The outcomes of those games, along with Case's record, would lead one to believe Hiram should win.  But if Case can use its height properly, they could give the Terriers a lot of trouble.  Hiram will have to hit their outside shots if Case defends properly. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2010, 12:45:16 PM
I'm a little surprised at the strength of support for Hiram in the poll.  I kind of figured that OWU would take this one in a walk, based on reputation if not YTD results.  And actually, their results haven't been that bad.  They got trounced by Wooster, but that's not really much of a demerit.  They lost relatively close games at Wabash and DePauw, and beat two teams that have beaten Wittenberg, including Capital at Capital.  Hiram did show up better against both Wooster and Wabash, and they have a better record than the Bishops, but against generally weaker competition I'd say. 

Full disclosure: I voted for Hiram myself, because I'm in the "rebounding wins championships" camp.  I figure these two are the top contenders to meet in the 4/5 game, and decided to favor the Pups because I think they have a better chance to win in Delaware (Feb. 5) than the Bishops do in Hiram (Jan. 15).  (Those are two games I'd like to be at, by the way.) 

I'm curious about the reasons you voters had for selecting the teams you did in this poll.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 18, 2010, 12:54:47 PM
My reasoning? Hiram's better.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2010, 04:21:44 PM
Both Hiram and OWU have big second-half leads this afternoon.  Kenyon, however, is struggling at Earlham, tied inside the final 4:00.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2010, 04:33:43 PM
For those watching Hiram destroy Case who perhaps have never been to Horsburgh Gym, you might like to know that the camera is inside the student workout facility, and the sound you're hearing is Case coeds running, and chatting, on treadmills.  Makes for an interesting play-by-play.

Hiram finishes off the blowout, winning 103-69.  Pups were +12 on the glass and led by Aaron Stefanov's 20 points, mostly on 6/6 shooting from the arc.  Hiram shoots a robust 59%, including 13/23 (57%) from University Circle, and forces 21 Spartan turnovers.  

Earlham gains their second victory of the season, both over embarrassed NCAC teams, as the Qs beat Kenyon 76-70.  Evan McCulley had 16 while Kodey Haddox was held to just 4 points.

OWU holds off Franklin, 82-66.  Tim Brady's 24 leads four Bishops in double figures.  If OWU had done a better job on their many free throws (20/34), it wouldn't even have been this close.

NCAC non-conference record stands at 32-25. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 18, 2010, 07:57:13 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 18, 2010, 12:45:16 PM
They lost relatively close games at Wabash and DePauw, and beat two teams that have beaten Wittenberg, including Capital at Capital. 

In the interest of accuracy, OWU's game at Wabash was not a close game.  Wabash scored the first 12 points, held a 20-point advantage for most of the second half, and the Bishops never mounted any kid of meaningful comeback. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 18, 2010, 08:46:58 PM
I've seen both OWU and Hiram and the pups were easily the top dog.  Perhaps Wooster just matches up better against this OWU team, although they really didn't impress in any facet of the game.  Hiram can hit the offensive boards and pressure the ball.  If they make shots and don't give up too many layups, they're capable of beating anyone, including Wooster or Wabash.  Not so the Bishops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 18, 2010, 09:09:13 PM
Hiram got my vote in the poll because I think that they are more athletic than the other teams and capable of pulling an upset of the Top 3 if they play well as Wooster Booster also noted.

Surprising result in the OAC tonight - Otterbein upsets John Carroll 86-83.  JCU drops to 6-3 overall, 2-2 OAC.

Which JCU shows up for the Mose Hole?  The one that beat a tough CCIW team (Carthage) on the road or the one that lost to Ott this evening?  JCU will probably be motivated to upset a top ranked Wooster team so the Scots should be ready for the full court pressure. ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2010, 04:04:42 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 18, 2010, 07:57:13 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 18, 2010, 12:45:16 PM
They lost relatively close games at Wabash and DePauw, and beat two teams that have beaten Wittenberg, including Capital at Capital. 

In the interest of accuracy, OWU's game at Wabash was not a close game.  Wabash scored the first 12 points, held a 20-point advantage for most of the second half, and the Bishops never mounted any kid of meaningful comeback. 
I wasn't trying to deceive anyone, just noting that the final score was 62-50.  Thanks for the clarification.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2010, 12:27:58 PM
Today's game:

Allegheny at Wabash, 1pm -- audio and live stats (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 19, 2010, 01:44:20 PM
Halftime at Chadwick:

Allegheny 26
Wabash 46

Wabash started slow here, but clamped down on D and ran away from the Gators over the duration of the half.  Wes Smith is leading all scorers with 18 points thus far.  James Ness has 11 for Allegheny and has really been the only bright spot for the Gators.  

Update...Wabash is doubling up the Gators 68-34 with 12:30 to go.  This game is officially a beatin'.  

Final update: Wabash defeats Allegheny 89-56.  This was a nice way to bounce back after the Kenyon game last weekend.  Smith led all scorers with 20 points.  Freshman Pete Nicksic records his first collegiate double-double with 13 and 11 for the LGs.  Wabash is off until they take the short trip over to Franklin for a game on 12/29. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2010, 02:13:22 PM
Wabash is up 34 inside 13:00 to go.  If I'm the referee, I'm stopping this fight right now.

Conference standings, barring a miracle:
Wooster 4-0
Wabash 4-0
Wittenberg 2-0
Ohio Wesleyan 1-2
Hiram 1-2
Allegheny 1-3
Denison 1-3
Kenyon 0-2
Oberlin 0-2
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2010, 03:39:28 PM
The final score was 89-56, in favor of Wabash.

Two big games on tap for Monday, big in different ways:

Ohio Wesleyan at Wittenberg, 7:30pm -- audio and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/)
Wooster at Anderson, 7:00pm -- audio (A) and live stats (http://www.anderson.edu/athletics/); audio (W) (http://wkvx.com/)

Maybe a must-win for OWU to have a chance at a 4th-place finish.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 19, 2010, 09:11:29 PM
DC - you forgot to say that tomorrow night's Witt/OWU will have the long awaited debut of.................

The Wittenberg home schedule for the season! Yes, this will be Wittenberg's first home game of the year.

I'll try to make it there to give an in-person synopsis but i have to officiate my own games tomorrow night
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2010, 10:49:17 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 19, 2010, 09:11:29 PM
DC - you forgot to say that tomorrow night's Witt/OWU will have the long awaited debut of.................

The Wittenberg home schedule for the season! Yes, this will be Wittenberg's first home game of the year.

I'll try to make it there to give an in-person synopsis but i have to officiate my own games tomorrow night

How have you been keeping occupied in Springfield. Long visits to the Tokyo Health Spa?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on December 20, 2010, 06:45:30 AM
Appears you've made an excellent selection as your blog commentary justifying lacrosse elevation from club to varsity status was first-rate.  Several NCAC competitors have established, varsity programs (OWU and Denison for several decades of which I recall) and the sport qualifies for conference cup points. 

signed,  LG Fan / LAX and rugby fanatic
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bash Brother 2000 on December 20, 2010, 03:07:09 PM
Wabash looked good yesterday.  The week long rest paid dividends for the TEAM!!!!  Go Little Giants and I wish you ALL a Merry Christmas!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 20, 2010, 07:36:01 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 28  Anderson 22

Anderson plays such a short rotation that they choose to invoke all the mandatory media timeouts (3 per half) to give their players a rest.  So, choppy first half with multiple timeouts.

Wooster is being led by Justin Hallowell with 11 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 6 points and Ian Franks with 4 points.

For Anderson, top scorer is Andrew Bowman with 4 points

Scots outrebounded the Ravens 25 to 12 in the half but they also had 10 turnovers vs. only 5 for Anderson.

UPDATE:  Wooster starts the 2nd half on a 10-0 run and now leads 38 - 22!

10:02 Left  Wooster 63  Anderson 31   Scots shooting 59% and dissecting the Ravens on their home floor!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 20, 2010, 08:08:14 PM
OWU - 34
Witt 26

Halftime
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 20, 2010, 08:11:53 PM
Wooster is simply dominating the second half.   Cumulative 35-9 second half score in favor of Wooster.

63-31 Wooster with 10 minutes left.

Franks (15pts) and Hallowell (22pts) leading the charge, and Anderson can't hit 3s (5-24!) while Wooster is keeping them from being effective inside.

Scots are 12-15 from the floor in the second half; Anderson is 2-19.  There's your story.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 20, 2010, 08:13:01 PM
Wooster has now bumped the lead to 32 midway through the 2nd half! :o

I think the tale of this game is fg%.  Wooster is shooting lights out at nearly 60% for the game and the Scots are 12-15 in the 2nd half!.  Anderson on the other hand is just shooting 24% for the game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 20, 2010, 08:17:05 PM
I love how WQKT doesn't go to commercials during the 'media to's'!   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 20, 2010, 08:20:11 PM
Scots just had Scott Purcell check in, for his first minutes since game one, when he was injured about a minute after checking into his first collegiate game.  Hopefully he'll stay healthy and be able to contribute! (EDIT: He drains his first 3)

And Mike Evans just checked in.  This is an amazing half that the Scots are putting together.  Even the reserves are just clicking the Scots offense right along.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 20, 2010, 08:22:55 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 20, 2010, 08:20:11 PM
Scots just had Scott Purcell check in, for his first minutes since game one, when he was injured about a minute after checking into his first collegiate game.  Hopefully he'll stay healthy and be able to contribute!

And Purcell nails a trey for his first collegiate fg of his career!  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 20, 2010, 08:26:59 PM
SF-

Hope you're having as much fun listening to this as I am.

Do you remember when the last time was that Wooster just ran away with a game like this against a good team? 

The example that comes to mind for me was when they simply ran away from a good Ohio Wesleyan team in the NCAC tournament finals back to start the '07 run to the Final Four.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 20, 2010, 08:30:15 PM
Yeah.  This is some good stuff kb!

Everyone is on fire!  Now twelve different Scots have found the score sheet!

What is more amazing is that this rout is being done with Nate Balch being held scoreless tonight!    :o b To be fair though, he did only attempt 1 trey which he missed.

Check that.  Nate Balch is the ONLY Scot to not find the score sheet tonight as 14 different players scored at least a point tonight! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 20, 2010, 08:33:49 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 20, 2010, 08:30:15 PM
Yeah.  This is some good stuff kb!

Everyone is on fire!  Now twelve different Scots have found the score sheet!

What is more amazing is that this rout is being done with Nate Balch being held scoreless tonight!    :o

Clearly, a big part of the story here was that Anderson just didn't have it going, at all.

But that doesn't take away from the Scots putting together one their best half of the season, by far.  That was stunning.


Wooster shoots 20-26 (77%) :o in the second half!

Balch ends up being the only Scot that didn't score.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 20, 2010, 08:34:20 PM
Final:  Wooster 89  Anderson 48 ;D

Impressive road win for Wooster as they overwhelmed Anderson with their precision shooting in the 2nd half! :)

Wooster was led tonight by Justin Hallowell with 26 points (4 three pointers), Ian Franks with 15 points and Jake Mays with 10 points.

Anderson's top scorers were Jake Browne with 7 points and Gabe Miller with 6 points.

Scots scored 61 points in the 2nd half!  Wooster won the battle of the boards by a 46 to 30 count.

Wooster is now 9-0, 4-0 NCAC :)  Next up is John Carroll at home on 12/28.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 20, 2010, 08:39:43 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 20, 2010, 08:33:49 PM
Clearly, a big part of the story here was that Anderson just didn't have it going, at all.

You aren't kidding.  Coming into this game Anderson had 6 guys averaging double figures in scoring.  Tonight...  NOBODY in double figures!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 20, 2010, 08:40:42 PM
FWIW, Massey had this one at 67-66 in favor of Wooster.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 20, 2010, 08:43:14 PM
In other action:

OWU is still clinging to a 2 point lead with just under 10 to go, 45-43.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 20, 2010, 08:59:32 PM
No one could have seen this rout coming.  Anderson's prior losses were close games, on the road, to good ballclubs.  Tonight they got drubbed, at home, and only a mediocre second half of the first half by the Scots kept it from being even worse.  Why they chose to take so many threes is baffling, since that's not their normal protocol.  It wasn't as if the clock was winding down and they had to hoist them; these were early-offense shots.  Maybe they were good looks, I don't know, impossible to tell on the radio.  At any rate, lots of them were bad misses, even air balls, and that was that.

A monster win for Wooster.  Bring on the Connecticut women!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 20, 2010, 09:12:50 PM
Wittenberg up 1 with 2.5 seconds to go

Update: Wittenberg wins 64-62
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2010, 11:44:30 PM
Updated conference standings:
Wabash 4-0
Wooster 4-0
Wittenberg 3-0
Hiram 1-2
Allegheny 1-3
Denison 1-3
Ohio Wesleyan 1-3
Kenyon 0-2
Oberlin 0-2


Non conference goes to 33-25.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 21, 2010, 02:06:14 AM
I don't really know if this is unusual or not, but the Scots scored at least 2 points in every single minute of the second half.  In 17 of the 20 minutes, they had at least one field goal; in the other three they made two foul shots.

Also, kudos to Matt Fegan for his 8 point, 4 board, 9 assist (only 1 turnover), 1 block and 2 steal night in 24 minutes.  That's a pretty good set of all-around contributions.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on December 21, 2010, 09:30:22 AM

You might not make the team right now.  Wabash is awfully good this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 21, 2010, 09:44:08 AM
I put this on the OAC board on a conversation about Otterbein.  I did it for the NCAC as well to see how their teams do.

"the disagreement on reynolds reminded me of something I was thinking about this weekend.  I was watching a high school game saturday night at my daughters school.  There were two evenly matched teams.  In the last four minutes of the game one coach made all the right decisions and the other did not.  It seems that the best coaches win the majority of their games decided by five or less points with their preparation and ability to put their team in a position to win.  Anyone interested in looking back at the last three years to see the teams records in games decided by 5 or less?  It may be a slow day at the office.  If so, I will try to gather the information to see where Reynolds teams would fit be compared to others."

2009-10 season and 10-11 - 5 point games or less (and OT)
Allegheny 4-4
Denison 2-5
Hiram 7-5
Kenyon 2-7
Oberlin 1-4
OWU 2-4
Wabash 5-2
Witt 3-3
Wooster 4-1
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 21, 2010, 10:53:44 AM
I don't think there's anything significant here. It seems to me that teams perform about what they normally do if the game is close or not. There needs to be a lot more data gathered for multiple years and multiple conferences to see if any trend happens.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 21, 2010, 11:25:53 AM
I did not mean to imply there are trends or that I was presenting scientific information.  It was for discussion purposes only.


Quote from: smedindy on December 21, 2010, 10:53:44 AM
I don't think there's anything significant here. It seems to me that teams perform about what they normally do if the game is close or not. There needs to be a lot more data gathered for multiple years and multiple conferences to see if any trend happens.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 21, 2010, 12:04:28 PM
Its the holiday season with little business and co-workers on vacation.  With the slow day and the OAC board dead right now, I took my morning coffee break and reviewed schedules/results and determined the following:

Record starting in 2008 until today and records in games by less than 5 point or overtime.
Allegheny 28-32   10-6
Denision 19-43   5-10
Hiram 35-28   13-12
Kenyon 27-36   5-10
Oberlin 12-47    2-12
OWU 34-29   5-7
Wabash 43-21   11-3
Wittenberg  38-23   4-7
Wooster 57-13    5-3

Overall winning percentage rankings:
Wooster
Wabash
Wittenberg
Hiram
Ohio Wesleyan
Allegheny
Kenyon
Denison
Oberlin

Close game winning percentage rankings:
Wabash
Wooster
Allegheny
Ohio Wesleyan
Hiram
Wittenberg
Kenyon
Denison
Oberlin

Losing teams with winning records in close games: Allegheny
Winning teams with losing records in close games: Ohio Wesleyan, Wittenberg
"Best" close game teams: Wabash, Wooster, Allegheny
"Worst" close game teams: Oberlin, Denison, Kenyon


Quote from: WAlum on December 21, 2010, 11:25:53 AM
I did not mean to imply there are trends or that I was presenting scientific information.  It was for discussion purposes only.


Quote from: smedindy on December 21, 2010, 10:53:44 AM
I don't think there's anything significant here. It seems to me that teams perform about what they normally do if the game is close or not. There needs to be a lot more data gathered for multiple years and multiple conferences to see if any trend happens.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 21, 2010, 12:56:05 PM
Before attempting to derive anything from these numbers it's important to know that even twenty or thirty seasons of such data would be a small sample size.  I work in the sports simulation industry (Diamond Mind Baseball).  If there is one thing that we've learned since we've had the ability to run off multiple replays of complete baseball seasons, it's that anything can happen in one given replay.  Run off the 2010 MLB season 1,000 times and the cream will come to the top.  But nearly everyone will win sometimes, and the teams that win the most might not be the teams that you'd have expected to win, as sometimes the actual baseball season is the statistical outlier.

Here's what I think:

In the long run, both the very good teams and the very bad teams will be involved in a smaller number of these close games than the more middle-of-the-road teams.  Why?  Because the good teams are in more lopsided wins, the bad teams in more lopsided losses.  However, once these good teams are in these close end-game situations, because the games are close, they will not approach their actual won-lost percentage.  The reverse is true with the bad teams.

There is something to say for the better teams knowing how to win the close ones.  And, programs that traditionally struggle get a bit nervous when the final minutes approach, especially if it's against a better team.  Still, there is a lot of randomness to these tight-game endings.  Randomness can simply be equated with luck.  Sometimes that's all there is to it.  Is Ian Franks a very good player?  He sure as heck is.  But will he always make that long game-winning shot up at Allegheny simply because he's good and on a Steve Moore-coached Wooster team?  Nah.  I give him about a one-in-four chance.  Part skill, part luck.

Somebody with the requisite skills and software could probably put something together with large numbers.  But I'd bet it would come out something like this, using the same format:

Team A: 8,000-2,000  800-400
Team B: 5,000-5,000  2,000-2,000
Team C: 2,000-8,000  400-800

 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 21, 2010, 01:32:14 PM
WB, good point about the upper echelon teams and the lower echelon teams probably being involved in fewer 'close' end of game scenarios than the middle of the pack teams. 

Also, quality of opponents has a lot to do with how the numbers turn out as well as style of play. 

According to the numbers, Witt looks like it doesn't perform well in tight games, but I'm wondering who those 7 losses have come up against? 

Also, Witt has been in 11 close games and Wabash has been in 14.  Both of these programs place an emphasis on defense so they are bound to be in more close games than say a team like Wooster that has been implementing more of an up tempo offense where they try and run the opponent out of the gym.  My guess is that if you look at the close games Wooster has been in since 2008, their opponent more than likely succeeded in slowing the game down and dictated the tempo of the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 21, 2010, 02:00:14 PM
Thanks guys.  As I stated the sample size is small and I know the amount of factors that go into figuring it are astronomical.  However as I said, this question hatched out of a discussion in regards to the question, do better coaches win more close games? For arguments sake, give everyone the same personnel and the game is on the line.  What three coaches do you want coaching your team in a tie game with 3 minutes to go?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 21, 2010, 02:12:17 PM
Red Auerbach, John Wooden, and Clair Bee.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 21, 2010, 04:41:57 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 21, 2010, 02:12:17 PM
Red Auerbach, John Wooden, and Clair Bee.

What?  No Geno???  :D  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 21, 2010, 07:25:40 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 21, 2010, 04:41:57 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 21, 2010, 02:12:17 PM
Red Auerbach, John Wooden, and Clair Bee.

What?  No Geno???  :D  :P

He'd be my recruiter. And popcorn salesman. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 21, 2010, 10:45:03 PM
+k for Clair Bee.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 21, 2010, 10:52:06 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 21, 2010, 12:56:05 PM
I work in the sports simulation industry (Diamond Mind Baseball).  
 

I take back anything bad I said to you...I am replaying the 1971 season in Diamond Mind right now. Need to upgrade to the next version though. My version doesn't co-operate with Vista very well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 21, 2010, 10:55:25 PM
Quote from: WAlum on December 21, 2010, 02:00:14 PM
Thanks guys.  As I stated the sample size is small and I know the amount of factors that go into figuring it are astronomical.  However as I said, this question hatched out of a discussion in regards to the question, do better coaches win more close games? For arguments sake, give everyone the same personnel and the game is on the line.  What three coaches do you want coaching your team in a tie game with 3 minutes to go?

Bob Knight - as long as he behaves himself
Pete Carril - the Princeton offense is built for tight, close games
Norman Dale - MY TEAM'S ON THE FLOOR!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 21, 2010, 11:54:28 PM
One last game tomorrow before the Christmas holidays:

Wittenberg at Otterbein, 7:30 pm -- live stats, audio (W) (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/), audio (O) (http://www.otterbeincardinals.com/index.aspx?tab=mensbasketball&path=mbball)

Just a reminder (primarily to myself) that we sit at 33-25 as a conference so far.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 22, 2010, 09:45:19 PM
Well, well.  Looks like Otterbein has maybe found their legs.

Otterbein 78, Wittenberg 64 -- Cameron Walton led the Tigers with 19.  I confess that will necessitate a trip to the Wittenberg roster page before I continue this.  6'2" sophomore guard.  Chris Sullivan, whose name I do recognize, was frosty cold, hitting on just 3 of 12 shots (3/10 from the arc, 9 points).  Otterbein connected on 52% of their attempts, and two-thirds of their treys (10/15), but had a minus-17 in field goal attempts.  From the floor, this was a 57-56 Witt victory, but Otterbein made twelve more free throws than Witt even attempted, with the +15 from the line accounting for the margin of victory.  (Witt had 25 fouls, including 5 from Clayton Black, vs. just 16 for the Cards.)

NCAC falls to 33-26 as we enter the holiday break.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ste24vie on December 23, 2010, 12:27:31 AM
Otterbein had a chaser in Sullivan's jersey all night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on December 23, 2010, 12:33:52 AM
Where's Josh McKee?  Or did I miss something?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ste24vie on December 23, 2010, 09:46:46 AM
The Cards also doubledowned on Black forcing him to pass or take a bad shot and frustrated him all night. Frustration coaxed him into silly fouls and extra time on the bench.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on December 23, 2010, 03:09:26 PM
Quote from: drt on December 23, 2010, 12:33:52 AM
Where's Josh McKee?  Or did I miss something?

Looking at the number of Tiger fouls, more likely that Brad McKinley migrated from field to gym  ;D

Geseende Kersfees en 'n voorspoediga Nuwejaar from Botswana!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 24, 2010, 12:28:35 AM
McKee started against Allegheny and Denison, but did not appear in the two more recent games.  I don't know if he's hurt or what the deal is.  (pennstghs?)  Fellow gridder Michael Cooper rejoined the team for the OWU game and also started at Ott.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 24, 2010, 02:05:39 PM
DC- Mckee has had a bad virus for the past two weks, pneumonia I believe, so that's why he hasn't played much at all, missing hte past 2 games. I didn't hear Coach Brown's postgame Wednesday night on the radio, but hopefully he will be back Wednesday for their Holiday  Classic.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 24, 2010, 10:03:18 PM
Thanks, p.  Happy Holidays to you and to all! (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi23.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fb371%2Fdacollinge%2Fsanta-smiley-ho-ho-ho.gif&hash=503e5b0476880a762eb2a7da308360022d858399)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 27, 2010, 06:50:53 PM
GoRed, or anyone else, do you know if Denison was able to get down to Daytona?  Both the Big Red men and women are playing in snowbird tournaments down there, starting tomorrow.  The DU website doesn't indicate any problems, but considering how rampant flight delays are back east, I thought I'd better check.  (The Kenyon women are snowbirding to Las Vegas as well, and I presume they're on schedule delayed a day.)  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 27, 2010, 10:45:37 PM
Here's tomorrow's schedule, assuming that everything (except where noted) is still on:

OWU vs. Maryville (TN), 3pm (at Otterbein) -- video, audio?, and live stats (http://www.otterbeincardinals.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball)
Allegheny at Centre, 7pm -- video and live stats (http://www.centre.edu/web/athletics/basketball_m/schedule_basketballm.html)
John Carroll at Wooster, 7:30pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule)
Denison vs. Buena Vista, 8pm -- video and live stats, maybe (http://daytona.embryriddlesports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=11500&ATCLID=205031850)
Oberlin at Bryant, postponed -- rescheduled for Weds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 27, 2010, 11:13:04 PM
Happy Holidays to all NCAC and D3Hoops Posters! :)
For Wooster fans, here is the brief scouting report on John Carroll:

Probable JCU Starters:
5'11" G Joey Meyer 12.6 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 39.5% on three pointers
6'1"  G Corey Shontz  12.1 ppg, 3.7 rpg, 5.9 apg
6'2"  G Michael Hartnett  12.0 ppg, 3.2 rpg, 59.6% on three pointers with 3.4 made per game
6'4"  F Maurice Haynes  15.7 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 55% field goal shooting
6'7" C  Conor Tilow  12.5 ppg, 5.o rpg, 52% field goal shooting

Key Reserves:
6'5" F Kyle Hubbard  12.1 ppg, 3.7 rpg
6'0" G Conor Sweeney  3.7 ppg, 1.5 rpg
6'8" C Kenny Janz  1.3 ppg, 2.5 rpg
Two other players, DeAndre Richardson and Ryan Angers, have played all 10 games to date so Coach Moran is still running the platoon full court press at times during games.

TURNOVERS will be the key stat in tomorrow's game. ::)  If Wooster keeps the turnovers to less than 15, they will win this game, IMO.  Wooster lost last year's game at JCU solely because they had 26 turnovers compared to only 10 for JCU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 27, 2010, 11:24:27 PM
A little more info on the 7-3 John Carroll team - which JCU team will show up in Wooster tomorrow? ???

The great JCU squad that was ranked #18 in the D3Hoops preseason poll and notched 2 impressive road wins.  JCU beat #5 Carthage, a top CCIW team, that is now 7-3 on the season.  JCU also scored an impressive road win at Capital.  Cap is now 8-3 overall and #2 in the OAC standings with a 4-1 conference record.  JCU Guard Michael Hartnett made 9 of 11 three pointers at Cap to lead the road win.  OR....

The average JCU squad that lost at home to Ohio Northern, a team that Wooster beat by 14 points on a neutral floor.  JCU also lost at Otterbein in their last game.  OTT is now 4-5 overall and 1-3 in the OAC.

With Wooster's #1 ranking, JCU will be gunning for the upset so the Scots need to be ready for the full court press and take good care of the ball if they hope to get the win.  I plan on seeing a great game at Timken tomorrow.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bash Brother 2000 on December 28, 2010, 09:15:45 AM
Let's go Little Giants tonight in Franklin, IN.  We're on a roll.  Keep it simple and protect the ball.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on December 28, 2010, 09:40:12 AM
Bash Brother ... Franklin game is tomorrow night, December 29 at 7:30 PM at Franklin.  Franklin always seems to have "soccer-esk" hooligan type fans (whether football or basketball) ... suspect there is some corralation with SAT scores.  In any event ... close enough to Indy ... hope we have a bunch of supporters to help out the start of Phase II of the season ...

and then there is Woo on Saturday, Jan 8.  The students are not back yet.  Should be a great game ... Wabash will need our "A" game and our "A" fan support.  Urge all (Woo and Wabash) who want to see a (hopefully) highly contested event  between two fine teams lead/guided by two great coaches. Be there or be square!  (I do not know if there is video.  Hope so.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 28, 2010, 10:45:46 AM
Thanks for the preview of the JCU game wsf. 

I wonder who is going to get the assignment on Hartnett.  He looks like he doesn't look to do much outside of shooting 3's.  Of his 39 made fg's on the season, 34 of them are from deep.  And his 3-point fg % is actually higher than his overall shooting percentage.

As wsf said, this looks like a case as to which JCU team will show up.  Although, looking over JCU's stats, it appears that the main problem the Blue Streaks have is having slow starts out of the gate.  JCU has been down at the half in 4 of their 7 wins.  And in 3 of those 4 games, JCU was down double digits!  And in 2 of their 3 losses, JCU actually outscored their opponents in the 2nd half to nearly come back to win those games as well.  Obviously, this is a result of their agressive full court pressure style of defense that eventually wears teams down.  The question is, will they be able to wear a Wooster team down that is not only fairly deep, but also should be fairly well conditioned as well?

I think there are a couple of keys for Wooster to come away with a win tonight.  First is to get off to a fast start.  As shown above, JCU doesn't appear to be a fast starter and they have found themselves in big holes at the half in many of their games this season.  And second is for the Scots to not have an in game letup.  Wooster has had problems this season letting teams back into games at times and most notably late in the 1st half after building substantial leads.  Bethany was able to cut a 20 point deficit down to 11 early in the 2nd half of their game before Wooster went on for the easy win.  Wooster squandered a 12 point lead and allowed Hiram back to within 4 at the half of that game and the Pups actually came back to lead that game early in the 2nd before Wooster once again took control to win easily.  At Allegheny Wooster led by 8 in the first half before letting the Gators come back and tie it at halftime.  And even in the blowout win over Anderson, the Scots led in the 1st half of that game by as many as 12 before settling on just a 6 point lead at the half.  So, IMO, Wooster will not only need to get out to a fast start, but maintain that start throughout the game and try not to allow JCU back in it by having letdowns on the offensive end of the floor. 

And as wsf noted, turnovers will also be a key when discussing JCU as your opponent.  Wooster can't afford to have another 26 turnover performance like they did at JCU last season.  Wooster is averaging just over 12 to's per game and I agree with wsf in that, if they can limit that number to around 15-16 they should be ok.

Should be a good game tonight at Timken.  Hopefully Wooster can build off of their last 2 impressive wins on the road with an impressive win in the friendly confines tonight.  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 28, 2010, 11:24:18 AM
This JCU team will almost certainly to be like all JCU teams of recent vintage.  Their game plan isn't only to exert pressure on the other team's players, but to do the same to the referees.  At least the latter part will succeed.  JCU will commit so many fouls that only a small percentage will be called because the officials will not only be overwhelmed but will want to move the game along.  Moreover, the refs, in their desire to appear fair on the surface, will call more fouls on JCU's opponent than should be.  This will produce numbers, on the scoreboard and stat sheet, that imply that the game was officiated correctly but that will not have been the case.  I assure you that this will be the way it is tonight, as it is against all of John Carroll's opponents.  It'll be ugly, physical, basketball, the kind of game that removes all the art from a beautiful sport.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 28, 2010, 11:50:21 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 28, 2010, 11:24:18 AM
This JCU team will almost certainly to be like all JCU teams of recent vintage.  Their game plan isn't only to exert pressure on the other team's players, but to do the same to the referees.  At least the latter part will succeed.  JCU will commit so many fouls that only a small percentage will be called because the officials will not only be overwhelmed but will want to move the game along.  Moreover, the refs, in their desire to appear fair on the surface, will call more fouls on JCU's opponent than should be.  This will produce numbers, on the scoreboard and stat sheet, that imply that the game was officiated correctly but that will not have been the case.  I assure you that this will be the way it is tonight, as it is against all of John Carroll's opponents.  It'll be ugly, physical, basketball, the kind of game that removes all the art from a beautiful sport.

This, in its entirety, is garbage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 28, 2010, 12:25:46 PM
Such a predictable response; you really didn't need to waste your time writing it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 28, 2010, 01:13:27 PM
If the refs are letting players bang around - then they'll bang around. If refs call ticky tack fouls they won't.

I'd rather not have the ticky tack fouls called, but I'd much rather have the refs be consistent. If JCU is physical and the refs allow it - then Wooster has to adjust or go home.

JCU is physical, but they get CALLED for the fouls. They routinely get called for more fouls than their opponent (I checked their stats starting from the 2008 season) and usually are called for about 4 to 5 more fouls per game than Wooster. (The exception in 2009 when JCU was called for 21.8 fouls per game and Wooster 20.0). In 2008-09, JCU was 25-5 and outfouled their opponents 655-596.

You should know, Woo Boo, as a Diamond Mind person, that you need facts instead of anecdotes.

Nothing I hate worse in hockey than an interference call in the first period that all of a sudden is allowed in the third. Same in hoops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 28, 2010, 01:30:53 PM
You just told us that refs don't call fouls against Wooster's opponents because they want to speed the game up. Do you have any idea how absurd that is?  Say it out loud. It's ludicrous.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 28, 2010, 02:18:37 PM
Wallace, once again you've managed to twist my words.  Well done, and very conservative-like; you must be one.  Try reading my post.  The word Wooster isn't even in it.  JCU's opponent is irrelevant; this happens to whomever they happen to be playing that night.  And if you've ever watched any basketball at all, and don't have a feeling that, at least in garbage time, the officials are ignoring many things due to a desire to just let the game move on, then you're not paying much attention.  Not that you'll take my opinion for anything, but I believe that something similar eventually happens in JCU's games.  The refs sense, rightly or wrongly, that the fans are tired of hearing so many whistles.  So, they blow them less.  It's what they do.

This season, in JCU's ten games, they've commited 202 fouls to their opponents 195.  Nearly a wash.  My contention, and I stand by it, is that above and beyond the 202 fouls that JCU has been called for they commit at least two or three times that many more which are either missed (even six eyes can't be everywhere at once) or ignored (they just just tired of blowing the whistles).  Certainly their opponents have commited, but not been called for, more than that 195.  But they don't get away with nearly as much because they simply aren't doing as much.

There are no numbers to support this contention.  But basketball, and all sports, are not simply numbers.  I'd suggest seeing JCU play.  I have, several times, hence my feelings.







 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on December 28, 2010, 03:52:44 PM
There will be video for the Wabash vs. Wooster game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 28, 2010, 03:57:47 PM
I can't really vouch for JCU, but I've seen what Wooster Booster is describing, probably most often from Hiram.  I think they have a strategy to crash the boards as hard as they can and try to set the tone early for the officials--if you're going to call everything, you'll be blowing the whistle on every play.  They get them into the mindset early that only the really clear fouls will be called.  It doesn't work with all referees, of course, but I think it works more often than not.  The key is for the other team to figure out what that level of officiating is and play to it, but if you're not normally a physically aggressive team, it's hard to adjust; and if you manage to adjust, you're playing Hiram's game and not your own.

I could be totally wrong, of course, but that's been my observation over the years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: John Gleich on December 28, 2010, 04:15:43 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 28, 2010, 02:18:37 PM
Wallace, once again you've managed to twist my words.  Well done, and very conservative-like; you must be one.  Try reading my post.  The word Wooster isn't even in it.  JCU's opponent is irrelevant; this happens to whomever they happen to be playing that night.  And if you've ever watched any basketball at all, and don't have a feeling that, at least in garbage time, the officials are ignoring many things due to a desire to just let the game move on, then you're not paying much attention.  Not that you'll take my opinion for anything, but I believe that something similar eventually happens in JCU's games.  The refs sense, rightly or wrongly, that the fans are tired of hearing so many whistles.  So, they blow them less.  It's what they do.

This season, in JCU's ten games, they've commited 202 fouls to their opponents 195.  Nearly a wash.  My contention, and I stand by it, is that above and beyond the 202 fouls that JCU has been called for they commit at least two or three times that many more which are either missed (even six eyes can't be everywhere at once) or ignored (they just just tired of blowing the whistles).  Certainly their opponents have commited, but not been called for, more than that 195.  But they don't get away with nearly as much because they simply aren't doing as much.

There are no numbers to support this contention.  But basketball, and all sports, are not simply numbers.  I'd suggest seeing JCU play.  I have, several times, hence my feelings.
 

I think this is the case for most physical teams.  Because they play as physical as they do, there's a lot more contact... and, generally, the whistle would be blowing a LOT if they called it really tight. 

Most refs like to let the game have some flow, so they'll let some things go... and suddenly, fouls that would be called under other situations just aren't being called.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 28, 2010, 05:04:29 PM
Another bitterly disappointing loss today for OWU, falling to Maryville (TN) 84-77.  The Bishops got behind early, down 21-9 with just less than 7 minutes gone in the game.  Then they caught fire and finished out the half on a 34-10 blitz, extending their lead to 14 early in the second period.  And then Maryville came alive, and whittled down their deficit until it vanished with 3:59 left.  OWU responded with a layup to regain the lead, but a three-pointer on their next possession gave the Scots the lead for good.  OWU had no success playing catch-up down the stretch, as their long-range shooting remained woeful (5/22 today, 23%) and Murvul refused to miss from the free throw line (missing just twice on the afternoon--the live stats reset for the next game in Otterbein's Smokey Ballenger Classic while I was typing this, so I don't have the final figures!)  

NCAC record: 33-27.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 28, 2010, 07:41:37 PM
If our game officials are ruling based on some misplaced obligation to the fans or some misguided idea that we're on some kind of time limit rather than calling the game based on the rules, then we have far, far bigger problems than whether or not Wooster can deal with JCU's press.  Are you saying that our games aren't being officiated from an unbiased point of objectivity, but rather the games are being officiated from a point of making sure the fans get their $8 worth and they get it in under 2 hours? 

You've said that you think JCU has committed somewhere between 400-600 fouls this season.  Again, say it out loud.  It's absolutely absurd.  There's no way that JCU has made a deal with the devil and is getting 3 for 1 on their fouls.  It just doesn't work that way...and I need not see JCU play to know better. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bash Brother 2000 on December 28, 2010, 08:09:50 PM
Thank you Wabco!!!  I was a day ahead of myself.   :o

Quote from: wabco on December 28, 2010, 09:40:12 AM
Bash Brother ... Franklin game is tomorrow night, December 29 at 7:30 PM at Franklin.  Franklin always seems to have "soccer-esk" hooligan type fans (whether football or basketball) ... suspect there is some corralation with SAT scores.  In any event ... close enough to Indy ... hope we have a bunch of supporters to help out the start of Phase II of the season ...

and then there is Woo on Saturday, Jan 8.  The students are not back yet.  Should be a great game ... Wabash will need our "A" game and our "A" fan support.  Urge all (Woo and Wabash) who want to see a (hopefully) highly contested event  between two fine teams lead/guided by two great coaches. Be there or be square!  (I do not know if there is video.  Hope so.)
Quote from: Bash Brother 2000 on December 28, 2010, 09:15:45 AM
Let's go Little Giants tonight in Franklin, IN.  We're on a roll.  Keep it simple and protect the ball.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 28, 2010, 08:12:22 PM
Just watched the first half of this Wooster/JCU game.  I would rate the officiating as "fair", which is exactly what you want.  I don't see JCU mugging people and getting away with it.  I don't see the game officials being pressured by anybody to call this game one way or another.  Just a basketball game...with basketball refs.  Same as it always is.  

Flow of the game be damned, the game officials are blowing whistles nearly every trip up the floor in the second half.  Guess these guys are more concerned about, you know, the rules than they are about the pace of play.  And good for them.  I'm not seeing anything here that substantiates any of the Booster's claims about how JCU games go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 28, 2010, 10:40:42 PM
Golly gee, Wally, did you watch a whole Wooster game just in an attempt to prove me wrong?  Sorry I put you to so much trouble.  If you'd just take my word for things, you might have had a more enjoyable and even constructive evening.

You're actually not far off on your rating of the officials in the first half.  Wooster had no problem with JCU's press, breaking it with long passes.  This kept the game in the open court, JCU's half-court defense never got settled, and the Scots made both lots of threes and layups.  If it wasn't for one stretch of five or six turnovers they would have had a double-digit lead at the break.

The second half is where your vision seems to have gone awry.  Bad streaming connection?  Glasses fall off?  Apparently you couldn't see who all those fouls were being called on.  Not the aggressive OAC team, who played a very physical half court man-to-man, but the Scots, who seemed to get whistled for allowing themselves to be pushed around.  Fair, you say?  Bull****.

And I'll say this again, just for you, my lovable Hoosier.  JCU, this season, has commited between 400-600 fouls.  Probably more.

Let me do the math for you, in order to save your stamina for your inevitable sarcastic retort:

400/10 = 40     600/10 = 60  That means I'm saying that JCU commits  between 40-60 fouls a game.
202/10 = 20.2 JCU has been called for 20.2 fouls per game.

Bottom line is that I'm contending that JCU commits between 20-40 fouls per game that are not called.  Funny, I'd say that out loud anywhere, even in a crowded gymnasium.  No one would panic, few with any knowledge of the game would even dispute it.  I think, actually, that I'm being quite generous to JCU with these numbers.  I'm quite sure that even a team that doesn't hold, push, and reach as much as they do (such as Wooster or Wabash, even) commits at least 20 more fouls/game than are whistled on them.

That's the way the game is, Wally.  Always was, and always will be.  And this game went nearly exactly as I predicted it would.  JCU picked up the physical play in the second half.  They got away with a lot.  Just not enough, on this occasion, to win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 28, 2010, 11:10:09 PM
Back from Timken where I watched Wooster notch a convincing 89-76 win over a scrappy John Carroll team. :)

Wooster lost the turnover stats but they took care of the ball and only had 15 turnovers total which is solid against a pressure team like JCU. ;D

Scots outshot JCU 53% to 36%, outrebounded the Blue Streaks 43 to 29 and passed well with 18 assists compared to only 11 for JCU.

Wooster's depth and balance won this game as they had 4 players in double figures and JCU could not counter that offensive punch.  Ian Franks was nearly unstoppable with 28 points, Justin Hallowell had a great night with 19 points, Balch got back in the offense with 16 points and Josh Claytor was very effective inside with 13 points.  Claytor got his last 4 points in the last 6 minutes of the game with a bandage over his eye after taking a hit from a JCU player in the lane.  Claytor was key because Wickliffe fouled out.

Important in-region win for the Scots tonight and it may help their strength rating if JCU finishes strong in the OAC.

Wooster is now 10-0 and 4-0 NCAC ;D  Next up is Wilmington at home tomorrow.  The Quakers lost to Spalding 70-66 in the opening game of the tourney tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 28, 2010, 11:13:52 PM
On the post game show, Coach Moore mentioned how Wooster really wanted this win over JCU and he cautioned against an emotional letdown tomorrow vs. Wilmington.

BTW, I passed JCU's two minivans on I-71 a little while ago as they are obviously commuting to the Mose Hole. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 28, 2010, 11:14:24 PM
- If every team, in your estimation, is getting 20 free fouls every single game, then maybe the problem isn't the game officials, but rather your own perception of what a foul actually is.  Basketball, like it or not, is a contact sport.  Any and all contact isn't necessarily a foul.  I'm not sure you get that part.    

- If Wooster constantly finds themselves on the bad end of the stick when they play a team that bodies up on them, then maybe they shouldn't let themselves get shoved around.  Be tougher.  But this really isn't the issue because based on what I've seen of Wooster games, they give just as good as they get.  If JCU manhandles the Wooster post players, it's a crime against humanity.  If Bryan Nelson does the same thing to everybody for four years, he's an all time great.  Can't have it both ways.  

Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 28, 2010, 10:40:42 PM
That's the way the game is, Wally.  Always was, and always will be.  

This is actually exactly the point that I've been trying to make.  For a long time now.  These game officials that you bang on after each and every Wooster game (or in tonight's case, before the game...possibly a first for you), call these games exactly the same way every single time.  That's the way the game is and that's the way it will be.  You said so yourself.  So if you know that this how it's gonna be and that this is how the game is played, then why in blue hell do I have to listen to you come in here and bellyache every single year about this?  If Wooster wins, the refs were bad but not that bad.  If Wooster loses, they flat out got snowed.  It's the same ridiculous nonsense every single season.  Why?  Why when you know how these games are going to be called?  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 28, 2010, 11:24:43 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 28, 2010, 11:14:24 PM
then why in blue hell do I have to listen to you come in here and bellyache every single year about this?

Is someone holding a gun to your head forcing you to read his posts or even respond to them wallyworld???      ::) 

You don't like what WooBoo has to say, ignore it!  Trust me, I find things much more enjoyable on this board since I started ignoring most of what you post!  :D

Besides, we all have to listen to you bellyache over everyting non-Wabash related so what's the difference???  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 28, 2010, 11:31:37 PM
Wally, did you ever watch the HBO series "The Wire"?  Great show.  In the opening of the very first episode, a white cop is sitting on a stoop, talking to a black guy who lives in the neighborhood.  Across the street are several other police and a large crowd of spectators.  A dead black man is on the ground.

Turns out he was in a craps game in a nearby alley.  At some point he just up and grabbed the pot and tried to run.  It didn't work, and he was shot down.

The conversation between the two men on the steps goes on, the black guy explaining to the cop that the craps game was a weekly affair, and that the dead man had been a regular.  Every week he played, every week he grabbed the money and ran.  Every week he was caught and beat up.  This time, though, it was more than that.

The cop asks, incredulously: "So, you're telling me that every week this guy stole the money.  And that every week when he came back again you guys let him play?  How can that be?"

The black guy looks at him in amazement.  How could he possibly be asking such a question?  His posture is one of pride as he answers. "This America, man.  Everybody get to play."

If you don't like my posts, don't read 'em.  Personally, I find them much more interesting than yours.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 28, 2010, 11:41:06 PM
Love The Wire.  I'm actually watching it right now...last episode of season 3.  Good, good stuff. 

But see, unlike your endless ramblings about game officials, The Wire has a point.  And you failed to even attempt to answer the question.  Why, if you know that this is how the games are called, do you feel moved to come here and tell us about it?  What does any of that add to the conversation about NCAC basketball?  Why can't you stay focused on the games and the players...that's what this is about.   The referees couldn't be further from the point.  Here we are, about to get right into the teeth of what I think is going to be a great NCAC season...maybe one of the better league seasons we've had in a while, and we're on status interruptus because you've postulated that referees don't call fouls because they feel pressure to move the game along or keep the fans entertained or whatever other unsubstantiated horseplop you put out there.  Why can't we keep it focused on the league? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 28, 2010, 11:42:31 PM
Two other Final Scores:

Buena Vista 73 Denison 69   Big Red play York tomorrow in a neutral site game
Centre 70  Allegheny 53    Centre is now 7-1, Gators play Ohio Northern tomorrow in consolation game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 28, 2010, 11:56:42 PM
As for the actual game that took place at Timken tonight...

Knowing JCU's propensity at erasing big leads this season, it never felt as if the lead was 100% safe.  Wooster came out of the locker room and after giving up a bucket on JCU's opening possession, Wooster proceeded to go on an 11-0 run to bust the game open.  However, it just seems no lead is ever safe when you are playing JCU and sure enough, the Streaks were able to chip away and eventually climb to within 6.  But, as he's done so often, when Wooster needed a bucket, the All American came through again putting Wooster back up 8 and essentially put the dagger in JCU's comeback bid.

Franks ended the night with a game high 28 points.  And Justin Hallowell added 19 despite going just 1-7 from deep.  That's because he was 6-7 inside the arc to actually shoot 50% for the game.  Balch and Claytor rounded out the Scots in double figures with 16 and 13 respectively.

And Wooster's defense played well again tonight.  For the second game in a row, Wooster faced a team with 6 players averaging double figures in scoring.  And for JCU, only 2 players finished in double figures.  Hartnett who came into tonight's game shooting almost 60% from deep was held in check primarily by Franks and only made 2-8 from beyond the arc and finished with 8 points.

Wooster will look to improve to 11-0 on the season tomorrow vs. Wilmington who is going in the opposite direction as Wooster.  The Quakers lost their 7th in a row tonight to a not-so-good Spalding team that had just 2 wins prior to tonight's game...  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 12:07:11 AM
See, that's a good post from the ScotsFan.  We know what happened, we got a sense for the ebb and flow of the game, we know who stood out...it adds to the conversation.  Why is that so hard?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2010, 12:08:48 AM
Wally, I'm wondering what makes you say this season is shaping up to be "one of the better league seasons we've had in a while"?   Witt doesn't appear to be as strong as they have been in years past.  OWU is certainly not as strong as they have been over the past few years or so.  

For me personally, this is shaping up to be just as entertaining as the last 6 league seasons have been!   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 29, 2010, 12:33:34 AM
The NCAC has a winning record vs. non-conference this year. And when DPU joins hoops next year that will improve as well.

That's why it's better right now.

BTW - If they don't call it, it's not a foul...and so you'd better adjust to that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 12:40:39 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 29, 2010, 12:08:48 AM
Wally, I'm wondering what makes you say this season is shaping up to be "one of the better league seasons we've had in a while"?   Witt doesn't appear to be as strong as they have been in years past.  OWU is certainly not as strong as they have been over the past few years or so.  

For me personally, this is shaping up to be just as entertaining as the last 6 league seasons have been!   ;D

So the league race is only exciting if Wittenberg is playing well?  It's a nine team league....and so far, those nine teams collectively have performed better than what we've seen for quite some time.  I don't think we know enough about Wittenberg to say whether or not they'll be a player.  They had two key players missing the front part of the season (and the practice that comes along with it)...Witt won't be an easy game for anybody I think.  OWU is missing something for sure, but if they figure out why they can't start games well they'll affect the race.  Hiram will win their share and they have the players to press the top teams here.  Allegheny and Kenyon have already taken the two undefeated teams to the brink.  The quality of play in the league is up overall, even if OWU and maybe Witt are a little off.

The Scots are the favorites for sure.  That's the way it should be until somebody else wins this league.  But I don't think any team can sleep on any other team, especially on the road.  The next 6-7 weeks should be pretty good.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2010, 02:12:44 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 29, 2010, 12:33:34 AM
The NCAC has a winning record vs. non-conference this year.

Presently 34-29.

Here's the Wednesday games, featuring everyone but Kenyon playing and three OAC/NCAC matchups:
OWU vs. St. Vincent, 3pm (at Otterbein) -- video and live stats (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1)
Allegheny vs. Ohio Northern, 5pm (at Centre) -- video($) and live stats (http://www.centre.edu/web/athletics/basketball_m/schedule_basketballm.html)
Oberlin at Bryant, 7pm -- video and live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/)
Kean at Wittenberg, 7pm -- audio and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/)
Muskingum at Hiram, 7:30pm -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html)
Wilmington at Wooster, 7:30pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule)
Wabash at Franklin, 7:30pm -- audio and live stats (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball/schedule)
Denison vs. Lebanon Valley, 8pm (at Daytona Beach) -- video($) and live stats (http://daytona.embryriddlesports.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=11500&ATCLID=205031850)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 29, 2010, 06:58:41 AM
QuotePresently 34-29

We apologize.  Looks like we had a late six-point lead and couldn't hold it.  This is getting discouraging again (for the ninth time).  Doesn't look like I'll be going back to my Big Red logo any time soon unless a new President and AD are appointed and they decide to SHAKE THINGS UP ON THE MEN'S SIDE!!!!

DU women are AWESOME!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 29, 2010, 09:45:55 AM
Go Red - I agree Denison is underachieving but so are Wittenberg, O Wesleyan, and some other teams.  Farmer being out is not helping the Big Red.  When he returns the team will improve.  Is your issue with the coach a personal one or are others agreeing with you?  The Big Red will battle Kenyon, Allegheny and O Wesleyan for places 5-8 in the conference race.  Not what Red fans were hoping for this year.

Wittenberg starts their holiday tournament today, taking on an 8-3 Kean teams that has won 6 of their last 7.   Witt is 4-4 and has struggled against a below average schedule.  The Tigers 4 wins are against teams with a combined record of 15-30.  Witts 3-0 NCAC record is deceiving having beat Dension, Allegheny, and OWU.

JCU played well but Wooster proved why they are undefeated and a top team nationwide.  Wilmington gets their chance tonight to take down the Scots.  Wilmington gets a huge dose of Ian Franks and Friends.  Sorry W but the Scots win in a blow out.

It appeared like the OAC/NCAC would be also be meeting at Otterbein in the Cardinals tournament Championship game.  O Wesleyan was up 10 with 8 minutes to go but blew it and lost 84-77 to Maryville.  Bishops could end up 7th or below in the NCAC if things dont change in Delaware.   

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 29, 2010, 09:48:09 AM
I don't think we can judge Witt yet until we see a few games with an ENTIRE team healthy. Witt has 2 games this week, one non-conference game next Monday and then 2 home games with Oberlin and Hiram next week before we get into the big stretch of conference play with a home game against Ohio NOrthern in-between there.

I still think its probably Wooster, Wabash, Wittenberg in the pecking order THIS year, however, if I do remember right Witt did beat Wabash 2 out of 3 times last year so until Wabash can break the trend, Wittenberg and Wooster are the two promanent teams in the conference. Before you have a cow wally, I didn't say "best," but prominent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2010, 11:36:56 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 12:40:39 AM

So the league race is only exciting if Wittenberg is playing well?  

Yep.  That's exactly what I said isn't it???  ::)

Good grief, you and your complex about feeling slighted if Wabash is somehow excluded from the conversation?!  Sorry to break it to you, but this league has been flat out dominated by Witt and Wooster basically from the inception of the NCAC so of course when Witt struggles it's going to garner some attention.

And yes, it's great that the overall record of the league is above .500.  And sure, the bottom feeders of the league are certainly more competitive.  My point was strictly speaking about teams challenging Wooster in the top spot and I just don't see it outside of Wabash this year.  Witt, of course will be a challenge because in this rivalry you can throw the records out, but Wooster has already dispatched of OWU quite handily down in Delaware and they have also won on the road at Allegheny and they handled Hiram pretty easily at home as well.  Seems to me, when Witt is at the top of their game, OWU is playing at the level that saw them reach the NCAA Tournament a few years ago and Wabash is also competitive, that makes for a more entertaining league than the simple fact that the non-conference record of the conference is above .500.

Quote from: smedindy on December 29, 2010, 12:33:34 AM
The NCAC has a winning record vs. non-conference this year. And when DPU joins hoops next year that will improve as well.

That's why it's better right now.


Wow.  I must admit, it is quite impressive how you Wabash folk always seem to find a way to get a DPU reference into a conversation.  :D

And the fact that Wabash has gotten off to their hot start and are currently in the top 10 in the rankings has no bearing whatsoever on why you two feel the conference season is more entertaining this year???  I highly doubt there would be praises about the how entertaining the conference schedule is going to be if Wabash was not exceeding expectations right now...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 29, 2010, 12:07:43 PM
Well, as for me, it doesn't. I'm not a kool-aid drinker. I'm very pleased that the NCAC has improved itself. Actually, I think it's 'addition by subtraction', ya know what I mean?

Of course Wooster is the top dog, and Witt is naturally the wanna-be - but the conference isn't just the top two teams. It's the whole enchilada, and at least now the bottom part of that enchilada is getting tastier.

And now, I'm hungry...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2010, 12:46:18 PM
I get what you're saying smeds.  I guess my premise is, I don't see that drastic of an improvement from the bottom of the conference to compensate for the moderate decline of the likes of OWU and Witt that I perceive to not be as strong as in recent years.  It could even be argued that Hiram and Allegheny aren't even as strong this year as in the last couple of years.

With that said, there are some young teams out there (like Allegheny) who should only get better.  And as you noted, the addition of DPU to the conference next season will certainly make things more interesting overall.  And hopefully, the resurgence of the bottom teams in the conference continues it's trend as well!   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 29, 2010, 01:09:36 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 28, 2010, 11:41:06 PM
Love The Wire.  I'm actually watching it right now...last episode of season 3.  Good, good stuff. 

But see, unlike your endless ramblings about game officials, The Wire has a point.  And you failed to even attempt to answer the question.  Why, if you know that this is how the games are called, do you feel moved to come here and tell us about it?  What does any of that add to the conversation about NCAC basketball?  Why can't you stay focused on the games and the players...that's what this is about.   The referees couldn't be further from the point.  Here we are, about to get right into the teeth of what I think is going to be a great NCAC season...maybe one of the better league seasons we've had in a while, and we're on status interruptus because you've postulated that referees don't call fouls because they feel pressure to move the game along or keep the fans entertained or whatever other unsubstantiated horseplop you put out there.  Why can't we keep it focused on the league? 

Wally, I made a post regarding the relationship between overly physical teams, such as JCU, and the officials.  I believe that post to not only have been a valid opinion, but to certainly be related to DIII basketball and the NCAC.  Sorry, but you don't get to choose the subject matter here. 

Personally, I don't see the NCAC as being any stronger this year at all.  Yeah, maybe the overall non-league numbers are a bit better, but as has been mentioned, that has much to do with the elimination of one Indiana team and the rise of another.  Of all of the remaining teams, save Wooster and Wabash, I don't see real improvement in any of them.  At least two of them, Wittenberg and OWU, do not appear at the moment to be as strong as in the past.  I've no problem with that, the league is what it is.  If you're a fan of Wabash, and with them doing well you have more interest in the NCAC this season, that's totally understandable.  Why not admit it?  I'm a Giants fan.  This past baseball season was my favorite in many years, and it was due completely to how much I enjoyed watching their games and them having success.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 03:27:29 PM
I've been active in this forum for a looong time now...longer than most.  Over 10 years in fact.  Whether Wabash is having a good season or a bad season or something in between (and I've seen them all in the last decade), I'm here sharing what I see about Wabash and the league in general.  Of course a large percentage of my posts are going to pertain to Wabash...that's who I'm watching most often and it's not like there are many others here talking Wabash hoops.  It's nice to have somebody representing.  But I'm also interested in the league at large and have been from the beginning.  To quote The Wire again, I don't think you can really analyze anything without context (Gus Haynes, season 5 if you're wondering).  No doubt it's exciting that Wabash is having a good year, but I'd be interested in the league and posting here regardless of Wabash's record. 

Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 29, 2010, 01:09:36 PM
Wally, I made a post regarding the relationship between overly physical teams, such as JCU, and the officials.  I believe that post to not only have been a valid opinion, but to certainly be related to DIII basketball and the NCAC.  Sorry, but you don't get to choose the subject matter here. 

As for this...what happened is that you made a post saying that JCU fouls 60 times per game and gets away with it for reasons including the officials want to just move the game along and the officials want to make sure the fans are entertained.  Given the nature of your posting history, my sense is that this opinion is rooted in a tub of sour grapes left over from a game where JCU used the press to force a ton of Wooster turnovers and beat the Scots...and because the Scots don't lose a game or turn the ball over that much without something nefarious going on, it must be the fault of the officials for simply standing by and watching John Carroll The Terrible bully Wooster The Meek all over the court for 40 minutes because I guess they were scared of the JCU bullies or afraid that they would incite a mob riot if they called too many fouls.  That's what it's about...that's what it's always about.  All of that...from the notion that JCU fouls 60 tijmes per game to the justification as to why they get to do it is all bogus.  It's just wrong and I called you on it.  You've yet to support any of that with any kind of fact.  If you've got any kind of evidence to prove that this opinion comes from anyplace other than "Wooster gets screwed by the refs", then please do share. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 29, 2010, 03:57:49 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 03:27:29 PM
I've been active in this forum for a looong time now...longer than most.  Over 10 years in fact.  Whether Wabash is having a good season or a bad season or something in between (and I've seen them all in the last decade), I'm here sharing what I see about Wabash and the league in general.  Of course a large percentage of my posts are going to pertain to Wabash...that's who I'm watching most often and it's not like there are many others here talking Wabash hoops.  It's nice to have somebody representing.  But I'm also interested in the league at large and have been from the beginning.  To quote The Wire again, I don't think you can really analyze anything without context (Gus Haynes, season 5 if you're wondering).  No doubt it's exciting that Wabash is having a good year, but I'd be interested in the league and posting here regardless of Wabash's record. 

Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 29, 2010, 01:09:36 PM
Wally, I made a post regarding the relationship between overly physical teams, such as JCU, and the officials.  I believe that post to not only have been a valid opinion, but to certainly be related to DIII basketball and the NCAC.  Sorry, but you don't get to choose the subject matter here. 

As for this...what happened is that you made a post saying that JCU fouls 60 times per game and gets away with it for reasons including the officials want to just move the game along and the officials want to make sure the fans are entertained.  Given the nature of your posting history, my sense is that this opinion is rooted in a tub of sour grapes left over from a game where JCU used the press to force a ton of Wooster turnovers and beat the Scots...and because the Scots don't lose a game or turn the ball over that much without something nefarious going on, it must be the fault of the officials for simply standing by and watching John Carroll The Terrible bully Wooster The Meek all over the court for 40 minutes because I guess they were scared of the JCU bullies or afraid that they would incite a mob riot if they called too many fouls.  That's what it's about...that's what it's always about.  All of that...from the notion that JCU fouls 60 tijmes per game to the justification as to why they get to do it is all bogus.  It's just wrong and I called you on it.  You've yet to support any of that with any kind of fact.  If you've got any kind of evidence to prove that this opinion comes from anyplace other than "Wooster gets screwed by the refs", then please do share. 

Wally, you're lucky my first name isn't Pat.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 29, 2010, 03:59:12 PM
As of today, the NCAC ranks 9th in Massey in conference power rankings, two ahead of the OAC!!

Last year, they finished 12th ranked in Massey. The OAC was 7th.

Just throwing that out there - by neutral data - with the loss of Earlham and the improvement of the bottom end the NCAC is a deeper league. It may be a surprising result, but:

This season the overall ranking (amongst all college hoops teams):

Wooster - 316
Wabash - 326
Hiram - 798
Wittenberg - 883
OWU - 1014
Denison - 1295
Allegheny - 1334
Kenyon - 1399
Oberlin - 1828

Last season's final:

Wooster - 433 (+)
Wittenberg - 615 (-)
Wabash - 711 (+)
OWU - 921 (-)
Allegheny - 948 (-)
Hiram - 1115 (+)
Denison - 1410 (+)
Kenyon - 1538 (+)
Oberlin - 1607 (-)

Five of the nine teams are improved, some dramatically according to Massey.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 29, 2010, 04:05:13 PM
WB - You may have had a point but it was wrapped in a ridiculous conjecture (the refs let JCU get away with 3x or 4x more fouls than called) and hyperbole. That really kind of offset any validity your argument has.

When playing a team which has a style that makes your team uncomfortable, the natural reaction is for fans to think they are up to skullduggery.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 04:06:49 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 29, 2010, 09:48:09 AM
I don't think we can judge Witt yet until we see a few games with an ENTIRE team healthy. Witt has 2 games this week, one non-conference game next Monday and then 2 home games with Oberlin and Hiram next week before we get into the big stretch of conference play with a home game against Ohio NOrthern in-between there.

I still think its probably Wooster, Wabash, Wittenberg in the pecking order THIS year, however, if I do remember right Witt did beat Wabash 2 out of 3 times last year so until Wabash can break the trend, Wittenberg and Wooster are the two promanent teams in the conference. Before you have a cow wally, I didn't say "best," but prominent.

Wabash did sweep the regular season series with Witt last year...the LGs won in Springfield for the first time since joining the league.  Witt did just nip Wabash by one point in the semis of the tournament though.  

WooBoo...facts.  Where are they?  Prove that what you're saying is something other than a heaping helping of woe-is-us homerism.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on December 29, 2010, 04:27:59 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 29, 2010, 03:59:12 PM
As of today, the NCAC ranks 9th in Massey in conference power rankings, two ahead of the OAC!!

Last year, they finished 12th ranked in Massey. The OAC was 7th.

Just throwing that out there - by neutral data - with the loss of Earlham and the improvement of the bottom end the NCAC is a deeper league. It may be a surprising result, but:

This season the overall ranking (amongst all college hoops teams):

Wooster - 316
Wabash - 326
Hiram - 798
Wittenberg - 883
OWU - 1014
Denison - 1295
Allegheny - 1334
Kenyon - 1399
Oberlin - 1828

Last season's final:

Wooster - 433 (+)
Wittenberg - 615 (-)
Wabash - 711 (+)
OWU - 921 (-)
Allegheny - 948 (-)
Hiram - 1115 (+)
Denison - 1410 (+)
Kenyon - 1538 (+)
Oberlin - 1607 (-)

Five of the nine teams are improved, some dramatically according to Massey.

Piggybacking off of smed's good work...

Massey's ratings:

Wooster - 1.014
Wabash - 1.001
Hiram - 0.200
Wittenberg - 0.116
OWU - 0.002
Denison - -0.317
Allegheny - -0.362
Kenyon - -0.444
Oberlin - -1.267

Conference is 9th with a -.006 rating

Last season's final:

Wooster - 0.718 (+)
Wittenberg - 0.459 (-)
Wabash - 0.320 (+)
OWU - 0.098 (-)
Allegheny - 0.067 (-)
Hiram - -0.141 (+)
Denison - -0.501 (+)
Kenyon - -0.692 (+)
Oberlin - -0.814 (-)

Conference was 12th on Massey's list with a -0.154 rating.
Rating without Earlham: -0.054 (would have passed the MIAA for 11th).

So it does indeed look like a lot of addition by subtraction, but the remaining teams are playing better as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2010, 04:29:05 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 03:27:29 PMGiven the nature of your posting history, my sense is that this opinion is rooted in a tub of sour grapes left over from a game where JCU used the press to force a ton of Wooster turnovers and beat the Scots...and because the Scots don't lose a game or turn the ball over that much without something nefarious going on, it must be the fault of the officials for simply standing by and watching John Carroll The Terrible bully Wooster The Meek all over the court for 40 minutes because I guess they were scared of the JCU bullies or afraid that they would incite a mob riot if they called too many fouls.  That's what it's about...that's what it's always about. 
With all due respect, what it's also "always about" is you jumping on everything Wooster Booster posts, usually with a personal attack.  And here you're attacking him for something utterly absent in his post that you have invented out of "the nature of [his] posting history."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash83 on December 29, 2010, 04:45:45 PM
Whether it is due to a slow work week, being snow bound, or just general crankiness, there seems to be a great desire on the part of some to find fallacies and slights, both real and imagined, in the posts of others.  While a vigorous, well-reasoned discussion of conflicting viewpoints is always education and usually entertaining, it would perhaps be an appropriate time to suggest a New Year's Resolution to ALL of being more respectful to others in our posts.  It certainly couldn't hurt. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 04:46:27 PM
There's no personal attack.  I'm just not going to let something like JCU fouls 60 times per game and gets away with it because the officials are intimidated go unchecked.  That's a bold statement that calls into question the integrity of our game officials.  If you're going to make that claim, you better come armed with something more than anecdotes about one or two games that you've seen against the team that you're obviously in the tank for.  Without any facts to support that claim, I think we can agree that the statement is garbage and get on with our season.  

Nobody should take these conversations personally.  I certainly don't.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2010, 04:53:39 PM
In other news....

OWU defeats St. Vincent 82-77 at Otterbein.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 29, 2010, 05:40:32 PM
Gheny trails ONU at Half - 38-25.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2010, 06:00:41 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 04:46:27 PM
There's no personal attack.  I'm just not going to let something like JCU fouls 60 times per game and gets away with it because the officials are intimidated go unchecked.  That's a bold statement that calls into question the integrity of our game officials.  If you're going to make that claim, you better come armed with something more than anecdotes about one or two games that you've seen against the team that you're obviously in the tank for.  Without any facts to support that claim, I think we can agree that the statement is garbage and get on with our season.  

Nobody should take these conversations personally.  I certainly don't.  

So glad we have you on this board so people like WooBoo can't go get away with making comments that go unchecked.  ::)

The problem with you is not that you call people out.  It's the way you go about it with your snide and condescending remarks that make you come across as a bit of an arrogant a**.  And if that is how you would like to be interpreted by many here in this forum, by all means carry on...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 29, 2010, 06:10:09 PM
Why is it, Wally, that when I read your posts I'm always reminded of Sean Hannity?  I can even hear his voice in my head.  If you're going to paraphrase and/or summarize my words, you really ought to get them right.  The word "intimidated" was never used, nor even implied.

Getting in a discussion with you really is a trip into the mire, isn't it?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 06:17:35 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 29, 2010, 06:00:41 PM
So glad we have you on this board so people like WooBoo can't go get away with making comments that go unchecked.  ::)

The problem with you is not that you call people out.  It's the way you go about it with your snide and condescending remarks that make you come across as a bit of an arrogant a**.  And if that is how you would like to be interpreted by many here in this forum, by all means carry on...

Back to the name calling, SF?  Who's attacking who here?  Let's stick to the conversation and leave the name calling out of it.  

Where is the evidence that game officials rule based on the will of the crowd?  That's what has been put out here, disputed, and STILL unproven.  

Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 29, 2010, 06:10:09 PM
Why is it, Wally, that when I read your posts I'm always reminded of Sean Hannity?  I can even hear his voice in my head.  If you're going to paraphrase and/or summarize my words, you really ought to get them right.  The word "intimidated" was never used, nor even implied.

Getting in a discussion with you really is a trip into the mire, isn't it?

Still no proof here that what you've claimed is anywhere near reality.  Where are the facts, Booster?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 29, 2010, 06:27:36 PM
It's my opinion.  Seems that you voice yours on here more than occasionally, and I'm going to also.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2010, 06:39:00 PM
ONU 72, Allegheny 60.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 06:43:57 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 29, 2010, 06:27:36 PM
It's my opinion.  Seems that you voice yours on here more than occasionally, and I'm going to also.

So you have no empirical evidence to support your claims that (and I'll not paraphrase your words here...you said all of these things):
1) JCU fouls 60 times per game
2) JCU fouls 3x more than they get called for fouling
3) Game officials let JCU get away fouling because they are overwhelmed and worried about the flow of the game
4) Game officials let JCU get away with fouling because they think the fans will get tired of hearing whistles

These are all claims that you've made on this subject.  These aren't a matter of opinion...these things are either happening or they aren't.  If (as I strongly suspect) they aren't, you're falsely accusing the officials of doing something other than their job and you should acknowledge it. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2010, 06:59:24 PM
And if they are, I suppose you'll acknowledge it and apologize?

I'd be interested in hearing how you propose that these things be either proven or disproven, empirically, but I'm far more interested in seeing the immediate end of this ridiculousness.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2010, 07:10:36 PM
Wasn't calling you names wally.  Just stating how you are perceived by more than just me here in this forum with your constant badgering...

And I second David's proposal of ending this.  Furthermore, I should have never let myself get sucked in again.  As I said earlier, life was much more pleasant before when I just pretended wallyworld didn't exist...

Off to Timken to hopefully see the Scots improve to 11-0!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 07:24:46 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 29, 2010, 06:59:24 PM
And if they are, I suppose you'll acknowledge it and apologize?

I'd be interested in hearing how you propose that these things be either proven or disproven, empirically, but I'm far more interested in seeing the immediate end of this ridiculousness.

Acknowledge that my position is wrong, sure if there is proof that what WooBoo said is true.  I've nothing to apologize for, though.  I haven't insulted anybody...just trying to get to the bottom of the Booster's claims.  And that's important here...the Booster has accused the officials of giving JCU a free pass.  I think the burden of proof is on the accuser here. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 07:42:00 PM
Wabash is out to a 16-2 lead at Franklin.  Wes Smith has 12 points early on for Wabash.

Franklin did well to weather the early Wabash onslaught and chipped away at the lead for the rest of the half.  Wabash goes to the break with a 38-35 lead.

10 minutes to go...Wabash leads 60-59.  The lead has gone back and forth several times here in the second half.  It would seem that Franklin is having a lot of success in the painted area, both scoring and rebounding.  I'm noticing that Pete Nicksic is not playing for Wabash tonight.  I think these items are related.  

The livestats have been stalled out with Wabash leading 65-61 and 8:16 remaining for some time now.  I may not know what happened here until the game story shows up later tonight!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 29, 2010, 08:17:16 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 07:42:00 PM
Wabash is out to a 16-2 lead at Franklin.  Wes Smith has 12 points early on for Wabash.

Franklin did well to weather the early Wabash onslaught and chipped away at the lead for the rest of the half.  Wabash goes to the break with a 38-35 lead.

Wooster's in a similar situation, leading Wilmington 37-34 at the half, except that in this case the half was close throughout.  Wilmington generally held a small lead until Wooster took a lead with a few minutes left in the half.

For Woo, Balch with 11, Franks 8, Hallowell 8.  Wilmington is led by Bowman with 10, Vonderhaar 8 and Wellman 8.


SECOND HALF UPDATE:

Wooster comes out strong, riding 8 straight points from Bryan Wickliffe, and it's now 52-43 with about 13 mins. left.
Wilmington comes right back, trimming the lead to 56-52 at about the 10:30 mark.

Wooster 68-56 at the 8:30 mark.  Wooster already into the double bonus, and they've been making their free throws.  Wooster's biggest lead of the night, but this one still doesn't feel put away by the Scots.

Wooster remaining in control, still up 12 at 75-63 with 4 mins left.  Antonio Bowman having a great game for Wilmington, with 24.  Wickliffe with 14 & 8; Hallowell with 11 & 7 for Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2010, 08:30:46 PM
[post moved downstream]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 09:08:37 PM
The livestats are stalled out, bashbro.  I think we'll be left in suspense until we either get a @wabashsid tweet or an update to the d3hoops.com scoreboard.

And just like that it's back!  LGs are up 73-71 with 3:00 to go.  

And it's over.  Derek Bailey hit a pair of giant free throws with 12 seconds left to push Wabash ahead 77-74.  Looks like Franklin failed to get off a shot and the final score is 77-74 in favor of Wabash.  Not the prettiest result over a team that Wabash beat by 40 earlier this season, but it's a positive result nonetheless.  LGs go to 12-0 and are now finished with non-league play. 

Wabash is back in action next Wednesday with a home date against Denison and then of course the big showdown with Wooster on 1/8. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 29, 2010, 09:15:42 PM
Wooster 86, Wilmington 79, Final

Wooster pulls out the game, but loses the last five minutes.  With Wooster up 15 with just under 5 to go, Wilmington nearly comes all the way back, cutting the lead to 3 with 0:15 left...but Wooster nails 4-4 FTs in the closing possessions to secure the (somewhat shaky) 86-79 win.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2010, 09:28:35 PM
A word of caution to those who may be following the Denison/LebVal game on live stats: ignore the team logos.  LebVal's score is listed above Denison's logo.  It's been a close game throughout, but I just realized that it's LebVal, not DU, who has been playing from ahead and now leads 51-46 with 10 minutes left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on December 29, 2010, 09:33:23 PM
I think Wabash suffered from foul trouble on Curosh and absence of Nicksic from the lineup.  Needed those big men on the inside.  Otherwise the stats look pretty nominal.  Anyway, a win is a win.  Hope there was a good crowd.  From the live stats ... when they were live ... looks like a fun game to watch.  The heat of winning close ones hardens the steel.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 29, 2010, 09:39:11 PM
Quote from: wabco on December 29, 2010, 09:33:23 PM
I think Wabash suffered from foul trouble on Curosh and absence of Nicksic from the lineup.  Needed those big men on the inside.  Otherwise the stats look pretty nominal.  Anyway, a win is a win.  Hope there was a good crowd.  From the live stats ... when they were live ... looks like a fun game to watch.  The heat of winning close ones hardens the steel.

Spot on about Nicksic.  Hopefully whatever it is that had him out tonight isn't a long term thing.  Without Nicksic in the rotation, Wabash played a lot of 4-guard minutes tonight and wound up -10 on rebound margin.  The LGs are going to need that extra depth in the post for league play. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2010, 09:55:14 PM
All the scores:

OWU 82, St. Vincent 77
Ohio Northern 72, Allegheny 60
Wittenberg 74, Kean 60...nice win over an 8-3 team from a good conference
Bryant (D1) 71, Oberlin 42
Muskingum 63, Hiram 55...bad loss at home
Wooster 86, Wilmington 79
Wabash 77, Franklin 74
Lebanon Valley 73, Denison 65

Non-conference: 38-33.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2010, 09:57:53 PM
Thursday's games:

Oberlin at Salve Regina, 3pm -- live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/)
Taylor at Wittenberg, 7pm -- audio and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: LGHistorian on December 29, 2010, 10:14:48 PM
Brent Harris said on the pre-game show that Pete Nicksic came down with the flu after the last practice and did not dress for the game tonight.  That's why Colten Craigin got some playing time early in the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2010, 10:18:52 PM
I'm having a hard time figuring out how Wilmington has won only 3 games this season.  Obviously they don't bring it every night like they brought it tonight because they would have more than 3 wins if they did.  Especially on the defensive end where they held the Scots to a season low 40%.

The Quakers are certainly a scrappy bunch and Wooster didn't seem to have an answer for Bowman (although he should have fouled out with about 3 or 4 minutes to go in the game...).

I was really surprised to see Wilmington keep fighting until the end as they did.  Wilma did come out fighting in the first half which I kind of expected.  But Wooster came out on a mission to put the game away early in the 2nd half and I thought once they got up by 15, Wilma would all but fade away based on their previous games.  But to their credit, they kept fighting back again and again.  

Once again, balanced scoring gets it done for Wooster who put all 5 starters in double figures tonight.  Franks and Balch led the way with 18 points each.  Hallowell had another nice game with 16 and Wick also chipped in 16 and Fegan rounded out the double digit scorers with 10.

Nice to see Wooster come out of the Mose Hole picking up 2 more in-region wins.  Now it's off to sunny Florida for 2 more games Saturday and Sunday.  It will be interesting to see how the Scots do finishing out playing 4 games in 6 days.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 29, 2010, 10:55:06 PM
Sutherlin stepped up big for the Little Giants tonight.  The rebounding and opponent field goal percentage were a few of the areas that jumped out at me from the box score.

Go Wabash!

Edit:  Along with allowing 7-9 (77%) from beyond the arc.  Not having the big guy inside probably had the entire defense off-balance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 29, 2010, 11:02:51 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 29, 2010, 10:18:52 PM
I'm having a hard time figuring out how Wilmington has won only 3 games this season.  Obviously they don't bring it every night like they brought it tonight because they would have more than 3 wins if they did.  Especially on the defensive end where they held the Scots to a season low 40%.

SF, couldn't agree more.  The Wilmington team that I watched online just simply seemed to be better than what their results to date indicate.  They have players with talent, and especially with quickness, enough to give Wooster fits on the defensive end throughout the evening.  They had a good, generally organized offensive attack, and played some quality defense (with the exception of rebounding, which was a key to the Wooster win tonight).

Perhaps this is the sort of loss that will actually help the Quakers as they look to right the ship in OAC league play, as I'd think that taking nearly taking a top five team to the ropes, on that team's home floor, has to be a confidence boost that says "we can play with anyone" even if the Quakers didn't pick up the W tonight.

Wooster's scoring balance is an immense strength this season.  Count JCU coach Mike Moran among the believers:

"I think it's the best Wooster team I've coached against," said Moran, whose teams lost in the NCAA Tournament to The COW in both years the Scots reached the Div. III NCAA Final Four (2003, 07), and had to beat them along the way to get there themselves in 2004. "(Wooster coach) Steve (Moore) and me have probably been bumping heads for 20 years now, but this team is the best I've seen for them.

"They just have a real nice blend of experience, maturity and so many different weapons. They're a very hard team to defend against and they're so well-coached. I'm glad they're not in the OAC, put it that way."

(Quotes from today's Wooster Daily Record game recap (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4955437).)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on December 29, 2010, 11:09:31 PM
bashbro

I agree ... believe these were the result on center problems we had tonight ... permitting both rebounds and second put backs which to date are not normally there for our opponents.  

The game on Jan 8 should be a good one.  I hope both teams are healthy.  My sense is that whoever has the first "off night" period will be on the short end.  Two good coaches.  Having said that ... I do like Mac.  Over the years I would put him right up there with the best tactical coaches and this year's team appears to be one of those which can execute the TO plans he lays out.  Witness the TO after the made free throws with 12 seconds left.  Franklin ... down 3 ... never gets a shot off.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2010, 11:29:51 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 29, 2010, 10:18:52 PM
Once again, balanced scoring gets it done for Wooster who put all 5 starters in double figures tonight.  Franks and Balch led the way with 18 points each.  Hallowell had another nice game with 16 and Wick also chipped in 16 and Fegan rounded out the double digit scorers with 10.

Back from Timken and I agree with ScotsFan that Wooster's balanced scoring was the difference in this game.  Ian Franks and Justin Hallowell did not shoot well tonight from the floor but they were picked up by Nathan Balch 18 points and Bryan Wickliffe 16 points who both shot a high percentage and got key baskets.

Ian Franks is an All-American because he knows how to get points for Wooster at critical times.  He drove the ball hard in the lane tonight and the result was that he made 10 of his 18 points at the free throw line.

Hallowell played great defense and cleaned the boards well.  Wickliffe nearly had a double double with 9 boards.  A big reason that Wooster won was that they outrebounded Wilma 43 to 29.  Clutch free throw shooting by Franks, Hallowell and Fegan also helped to secure the win down the stretch.

Wooster is now 11-0. ;D  Good luck to the Scots on the Florida trip! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 30, 2010, 01:05:25 AM
good win for Witt as suprisingly I wasn't able to see the game tonight, however, I did catch the opener of the tourney in Taylor/Heidelberg. Should be a good game vs Taylor tomorrow night (or tonight I suppose). They have some good shooters on their team and play the pick and roll insistently til they rotate and get a mismatch to open up shots.

This probably would be better on the OAC board, but with the athletes that Heidelberg has and I saw in person today, are they just not that disciplined as they showed today? They were down 5 early in the second half and slowly over time their focus wilted and were down 22 with 2 intentional and unncessary fouls in the course of that run.........
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 30, 2010, 09:06:30 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 29, 2010, 11:02:51 PM


Perhaps this is the sort of loss that will actually help the Quakers as they look to right the ship in OAC league play, as I'd think that taking nearly taking a top five team to the ropes, on that team's home floor, has to be a confidence boost that says "we can play with anyone" even if the Quakers didn't pick up the W tonight.


I was kind of thinking the same thing.  If there ever was a 'good loss' I think Wilma could put this in that category.  And I also think they could actually use this loss to build off of as the season rolls on.  Or, maybe it was just a case of the Quakers stepping their game up because this was their chance to shock the world by beating the #1 team in the land.   Whatever the Quakers take away from last night's loss, I will say they were definitely better than what I expected.  BTW, Spalding, who beat Wilma 2 nights ago lost to JCU by 25 last night!  This is the sort of thing that makes you scratch your head wrt Wilmington playing Wooster closer than JCU?!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 30, 2010, 12:44:32 PM
Not knowing too much about Wooster's next 2 opponents down in Florida I have just done some minor perusing of William Carey's and Baruch's respective resumes.

William Carey is in the ORV of the NAIA I Top 25.  They are currently 8-4 on the season, but 3 of their 4 losses have come vs. teams currently ranked in the NAIA I Top 25.  And in addition, they also have 5 wins vs. teams that have been ranked in the NAIA I Top 25.  The Crusaders seem to be very athletic and should pose a considerable threat to beating the Scots.  Good thing for the Scots is that even if they do happen to lose, this game basically didn't happen in the eyes of the NCAA come time for NCAA tournament seeding.  WCU does appear to be fairly deep as it looks like they go with a 10 man rotation.  They also seem to be fairly balanced in scoring as they have 6 guys averaging between almost 8 ppg to their leading scorer who is averaging almost 14 ppg.  WCU does not appear to be very tall as their tallest player is listed at 6'5" although they do have some taller guards who are probably pretty athletic and play taller than their height.  William Carey's last game was in December 18th btw.

Here's WCU's probable starting 5:

G   Julius Blanks, Sr,  6'3" - 5.2ppg
SG Drew Meyerchick, Sr,  6'1" - 13.2ppg (leading scorer and has made 26 treys on the season)
F   Jamal Doss, So, 6'5" - 7.8ppg
PG Marcus Spann, Sr, 5'11" - 7.5ppg
F   Jonathan Woodland, Sr, 6'3" - 11.9ppg

In Wooster's second game they will be taking on Baruch from the tiny metropolis of NYC.   :P  Baruch comes into the game with a record of 6-3, but again, their record may be a bit deceiving.  Their losses have been a 3 point loss to #5 Middlebury (66-63) who is undefeated and a one point loss to #26 Manhatanville (68-67) who is 8-1.  Their their 3rd loss of the season was against Rutgers-Newark (88-75) out of the always competitive NJAC and they too have only one loss on the season (9-1).  BC appears to go 10 deep although 2 of the 10 in that rotation average just over 5 minutes/game.  The Bearcats also don't appear to be very tall as their tallest starter goes 6'5" and they have a 6'7" guy coming off the bench.  Baruch also hasn't played a game since the 12th of December.  This game also means nothing in the eyes of the NCAA come selection Sunday.

Here are the probable BC starters:

G     Tammer Farid, Sr, 6'2" - 10ppg
G     Lionel Hillaire, Sr, 5'11" - 17.8ppg (26 3-pointers made-leads the team)
G/F  Chris Beauchamp, Jr, 6'1" - 20ppg (leading team in scoring, 47-51 at the ft line  :o)
C/F  Sean Loftus, Sr, 6'5" - 10.4ppg
G/F  Arki Wisnu, Sr, 6'3" - 4.1ppg

Should make for an entertaining couple of games to start the New Year for the Scots!  8-)




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 30, 2010, 02:29:52 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 30, 2010, 12:44:32 PM
This game also means nothing in the eyes of the NCAA come selection Sunday.

If Baruch ends up as a regionally-ranked team, though, doesn't that matter?  Isn't one of the five primary criteria "results vs. regionally-ranked teams"?  It doesn't qualify to say "results against regionally-ranked teams in your region," right?  So having a result against a team that might be regionally ranked, regardless of what region that is, could be valuable to the Scots, right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 30, 2010, 05:14:45 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 30, 2010, 02:29:52 PM

If Baruch ends up as a regionally-ranked team, though, doesn't that matter?  Isn't one of the five primary criteria "results vs. regionally-ranked teams"?  It doesn't qualify to say "results against regionally-ranked teams in your region," right?  So having a result against a team that might be regionally ranked, regardless of what region that is, could be valuable to the Scots, right?


Here is what I found in the FAQ:

QuoteWhat does the NCAA use to select and seed teams into the tournament?

These are the selection (and seeding) criteria for 2009-10:

The following primary criteria (not in priority order) will be reviewed:
• Win-loss percentage against regional opponents.
• Strength-of-schedule (only contests versus regional competition).
- Opponents' Average Winning Percentage (OWP) (weighted 2/3).
- Opponents' Opponents' Average Winning Percentage (OOWP) (weighted 1/3).
- Add OWP and OOWP to give total strength of schedule
• In-region head-to-head competition.
• In-region results versus common regional opponents.
• In-region results versus regionally ranked teams.

According to that last criteria, it looks as though results vs. regionally ranked teams only include 'in-region' results which would also include administrative regions.  Baruch is not in the same administrative region as Wooster, nor is it within the 200 mile rule either so, if I had to guess, I would say this game won't help or hurt Wooster win or lose.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 30, 2010, 05:26:59 PM
There is a lot of gray area in these selection criteria.  I don't think the committees disregard out of region results entirely...they certainly don't when it comes to football selection and seeding.  Whether the committee factors it in or not, I don't think Wooster will need the result against Baruch to get into the tournament.  There are enough wins left on Wooster's schedule that they should be pretty safe no matter what happens in Florida.  What is unfortunate is that I don't think there will be any extra benefit to Wooster's opponents who might be chasing tournament spots as I don't think the SOS math includes non-regional games. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 30, 2010, 06:06:18 PM
Thanks SF.  I'd forgotten how unambiguous the "in-region" part of the primary criteria is.  The game against Baruch would only show up in the secondary criteria, and in particular perhaps in the "Results versus all DIII ranked teams" (if Baruch does end up being regionally ranked) and "Overall DIII Strength of Schedule."  The primary criteria SOS calculation does not include out-of-region results, according to the FAQ.

I agree with Wally that Wooster (or Wabash, for that matter) probably won't need the secondary criteria to make the tournament as a Pool C, but that at the same time they probably wouldn't completely disregard the result, either.  However, the FAQ seems to indicate that the committee doesn't use the secondary criteria for seeding the tournament, just for "[regional] ranking and selecting" it.  It generally seems that the secondary criteria only really come into play for the final 3-4 entrants to the dance as well as the final 3-4 that get left on the table.  (I wonder if using secondary criteria is more common in football, where teams have no more than 10 in-region games; with most teams having 20 or so in hoops, there will be more differences among the primary criteria.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 30, 2010, 06:27:19 PM
I'm sure sample size has a lot to do with it, kb.  I'd prefer to see all of this regional emphasis in the handbook go away.  Games are games...for better or worse, they should all count. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on December 30, 2010, 08:13:00 PM
Does this all mean that Wabash's win over Randolph-Macon will not affect in any way how they are viewed by the tournament committee?

I agree with the statement that a game is a game and should benefit with a win and negatively affect with a loss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 30, 2010, 08:31:07 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on December 30, 2010, 08:13:00 PM
Does this all mean that Wabash's win over Randolph-Macon will not affect in any way how they are viewed by the tournament committee?

I agree with the statement that a game is a game and should benefit with a win and negatively affect with a loss.

By the handbook, no. Wabash's result against R-MC doesn't factor unless the committee moves to the secondary criteria.  However, I'm not entirely convinced that there is a clear boundary between the primary and secondary critera...which is to say that I don't think the committee applies the criteria as analytically as most people would if they were given the handbook's set of rules and told to pick a tournament field.  I think the fairest thing that we could say about non-regional results is that while the SOS math may not show up, it never ever hurts to win regardless of who you play. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2010, 08:47:09 PM
Salve Regina 60, Oberlin 49
Wittenberg 62, Taylor 60 ... Witt led for the last 8 minutes, but barely held on for another quality win. 

Old Man 2010 hands a 39-34 non-con record to Baby 2011.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on December 30, 2010, 10:06:45 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 30, 2010, 08:31:07 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on December 30, 2010, 08:13:00 PM
Does this all mean that Wabash's win over Randolph-Macon will not affect in any way how they are viewed by the tournament committee?

I agree with the statement that a game is a game and should benefit with a win and negatively affect with a loss.

By the handbook, no. Wabash's result against R-MC doesn't factor unless the committee moves to the secondary criteria.  However, I'm not entirely convinced that there is a clear boundary between the primary and secondary critera...which is to say that I don't think the committee applies the criteria as analytically as most people would if they were given the handbook's set of rules and told to pick a tournament field.  I think the fairest thing that we could say about non-regional results is that while the SOS math may not show up, it never ever hurts to win regardless of who you play. 

The Wabash and Randolph-Macon game should be counted as in-region.

They're both in administrative region #3: Alabama, Arkansas, Florida, Georgia, Indiana, Kentucky, Louisiana, Michigan, Mississippi, North Carolina, Ohio, Puerto Rico, South Carolina, Tennessee, Virginia, West Virginia.

http://d3hoops.com/interactive/faq/ncaaTournament#regional
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 30, 2010, 10:13:22 PM
So it is.  Awesome.  Thanks, Knight!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 31, 2010, 12:51:13 AM
Few thoughts from the Witt/Taylor game tonight, my first in person game of the year!!!!

Witt is still not complete as I"m not sure what the status of Josh McKee is but David Hieber is out with an injury, should be back next week. Regardless of how deep your team is when you're without two returning starters from last year and already lost 2 to graduation, it takes time.

Witt tried to give the game away in the last minute of the game. Up 5 they threw away an inbounds pass, which Taylor made a 3 to make it a 2 point game. With 6 seconds left or so, Clayton Black missed the front end of a one and one and then with some luck/good defense Taylor had a good look to tie that missed and then barely missed a tip as time expired. Another solid non-conference win for Witt.

Witt looked really good offensively tonight, not sure if there's any singular defender in the NCAC that can match up with Black and if Sullivan is hitting, that's a tough inside/outside combo.

Also I wouldn't be surprised if Witt goes on a little run. They have 3 home games next week, then a winnable road game at Kenyon , then 2 more home games. That could set them up well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 31, 2010, 05:53:03 PM
Nice (and long) story about a former Wooster player Lamont Paris, who is now an assistant coach for Wisconsin and coaching for a former Div. III coach in Bo Ryan. Wooster is also talked about a lot, and for good measure, DePauw finds its way into the story.

http://www.uwbadgers.com/sports/m-baskbl/spec-rel/123110aab.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 01, 2011, 12:29:54 AM
For those more interested in Wooster hoops than college football bowl games (Who's with me!  Let's go!  Yeaaaaaaaaaaaaaah!  [Blutarsky runs out of the room alone]):

Wooster vs. William Carey, 5pm (at Daytona Beach) -- audio (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule); and I suspect live stats will be available here (http://daytona.embryriddlesports.com/SportSelect.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=11500&SPID=4506)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 01, 2011, 02:23:52 PM
The William Carey/Wooster game can be watched here --- although it'll cost ya.

http://daytona.embryriddlesports.com/liveEvents/liveEvents.dbml?&KEY=&DB_OEM_ID=11500&DB_LANG=&IN_SUBSCRIBER_CONTENT=
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 01, 2011, 05:41:26 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 36  William Carey 28

Wooster is being led by Nathan Balch with 10 points, Bryan Wickliffe with 9 points and Ian Franks with 7 pts.

For William Carey, top scorers are Verice Cloyd with 8 points, Drew Meyerchick with 6 and Jaron Edwards with 6.

Wooster shot only 36% in the half but they outrebounded William Carey 24 to 16.  Scots also made 10 of 12 FT's.

UPDATE:  11:27 Left  Wooster 51  William Carey 35  Scots have made 4 more three pointers in 2nd half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 01, 2011, 06:36:17 PM
Final:  Wooster 72  William Carey 55 :)

Wooster was led in scoring by Nathan Balch with 13 points, Justin Hallowell with 11, Bryan Wickliffe with 11, Jake Mays with 8 and Ryan Snyder also with 8.

William Carey was led by Verice Cloyd with 15 points and Kevin Branch with 7 points.

Scots won this game with good defense, by making 11 three pointers and outrebounding William Carey 44 to 31.

Wooster is now 12-0  ;D  Next game is tomorrow vs. Baruch

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 01, 2011, 08:04:26 PM
Happy New Year!

Three games on Sunday:
Kenyon at Muskingum, 2pm -- audio and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
Wooster vs. Baruch, 2pm (at Daytona Beach) -- audio (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule), video($) (http://daytona.embryriddlesports.com/liveEvents/liveEvents.dbml?&KEY=&DB_OEM_ID=11500&DB_LANG=&IN_SUBSCRIBER_CONTENT=) and live stats (http://daytona.embryriddlesports.com/liveStats/liveStats.dbml?&DB_OEM_ID=11500&LIST_SPORT_ID=&KEY=&DB_OEM_ID=11500&DB_LANG=&IN_SUBSCRIBER_CONTENT=)
Case Western Reserve at Oberlin, 3pm -- video and live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 01, 2011, 08:17:26 PM
Did anyone else try to get that video to work today?  I couldn't.  After registering and paying for the game, I could never get the video window begin playing the game.  It told me I needed an update to WMP and to press a button to get it.  I downloaded and installed it.  That changed nothing, I kept getting the same message.  Finally, minutes before the actual tipoff, I cancelled the event.  I don't know if I'll be able to get my $6.95 back or not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 01, 2011, 08:25:19 PM
I often can't even get free video to work--just ask the Yoder Bros., with whom I'm in constant communication about my inability to get StreamOWU to work.  So no, I didn't pay for this stream.  Sorry about your misfortune.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 01, 2011, 09:15:54 PM
Ha.  I not only lost $6.95 but also three karma points.  What a surprise.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 01, 2011, 09:31:46 PM
You can count one of them from me -- the name-calling and political references were out of bounds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 01, 2011, 10:00:24 PM
 ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 01, 2011, 10:30:44 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 01, 2011, 09:31:46 PM
You can count one of them from me -- the name-calling and political references were out of bounds.

I don't see any name-calling or political references in his post.  Was there a deleted post I missed?

While I am one of your biggest fans and frequent defenders, you DO seem a bit testy lately (e.g., Raider 68, who is fully accepted as a regular on the MIAA board).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 01, 2011, 11:12:00 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 01, 2011, 10:30:44 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 01, 2011, 09:31:46 PM
You can count one of them from me -- the name-calling and political references were out of bounds.

I don't see any name-calling or political references in his post.  Was there a deleted post I missed?

Unless he deleted posts. You'd have to go back a few days, though, I hadn't read NCAC since before leaving for Vegas.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 01, 2011, 11:37:38 PM
I did not delete any posts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on January 02, 2011, 09:03:24 AM
I hope both Wabash and Woo win their next contests.  That sets up a match of undefeateds in C-ville on Jan 8.  Certainly, Woo will be and deserves to be favored.  I am certain that Wabash will and will always fight ... it should make for a great game.  The only negative is that school has not begun again ... the game deserves a FULL HOUSE.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 02, 2011, 09:22:08 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 01, 2011, 09:15:54 PM
Ha.  I not only lost $6.95 but also three karma points.  What a surprise.

Karma Police (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NlQhgdVsuI4)

"This is what you get when you mess with us."   :D

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 02, 2011, 09:30:21 AM
Baruch (Wooster's next opponent) lost to Embry Riddle in yesterday's nightcap down in Florida 96-75.  Embry Riddle is also ranked 3rd in the NAIA II Top 25 FWIW.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 11:57:43 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 30, 2010, 12:44:32 PM
The Bearcats also don't appear to be very tall as their tallest starter goes 6'5" and they have a 6'7" guy coming off the bench. Here are the probable Baruch College starters:
G     Tammer Farid, Sr, 6'2" - 10ppg
G     Lionel Hillaire, Sr, 5'11" - 17.8ppg (26 3-pointers made-leads the team)
G/F  Chris Beauchamp, Jr, 6'1" - 20ppg (leading team in scoring, 47-51 at the ft line  :o)
C/F  Sean Loftus, Sr, 6'5" - 10.4ppg
G/F  Arki Wisnu, Sr, 6'3" - 4.1ppg

ScotsFan - thanks for the scouting reports on William Carey and Baruch.k+  In today's game vs. Baruch, Wooster should be able to score in the paint given Baruch's short lineup. They really don't have the players to match up well against Hallowell, Wickliffe, Claytor and Mays.  Baruch may play zone for this reason and then Wooster will have a good chance to hit three pointers and win the rebound battle.  I am sure though that we will see Baruch's best effort today since every team strives to pull the big upset against the #1 team.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 02:38:04 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 42  Baruch 36

Wooster is being led by Justin Hallowell with 13 points (3 three pointers), Ian Franks with 11 points and Nathan Balch with 6 points.

Baruch's top scorers are Lionel Hilaire with 8 points and Chris Beauchamp with 8 points.

Scots shot 50% in the half and made 6 three pointers.  Wooster winning the boards 23 to 18.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 02, 2011, 03:12:57 PM
Game is now tied at 59 with 9 minutes to go...  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 03:35:22 PM
Final:  Wooster 79  Baruch 77  :)

Whew!!  Wooster escapes with the win after trailing 75-71 with 2 minutes left!  Ian Franks scores 4 points in the last 2 minutes and Nathan Balch hits 2 clutch free throws for the final 2 points! ;D

Wooster was led by Justin Hallowell with 25 points (7 three pointers), Ian Franks with 25 points and Nathan Balch with 11 points.

Baruch's top scorers were Arki Wisnu with 18 points, Lionel Hilaire with 17 points (5 three pointers) and Chris Beauchamp with 13 points.

Wooster is now 13-0 ;D  Next game is the HUGE showdown at #8 Wabash on January 8th.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2011, 03:37:37 PM
Are you watching on video? Live stats say Baruch hit a three to win.

http://daytona.embryriddlesports.com/newLiveStats/Basketball/index.dbml?GAME_STAT_ID=525045&db_oem_id=11500
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 02, 2011, 03:39:44 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 03:35:22 PM
Final:  Wooster 79  Baruch 77  :)

Whew!!  Wooster escapes with the win after trailing 75-71 with 2 minutes left!

Wooster was led by Justin Hallowell with 25 points (7 three pointers), Ian Franks with 23 points and Nathan Balch with 11 points.

Baruch's top scorers were Arki Wisnu with 18 points, Lionel Hilaire with 17 points (5 three pointers) and Chris Beauchamp with 13 points.

Wooscotsfan, I'm once again amazed at your speed!  The game no sooner ends than you have a post up here.  But I've figured you out.  No doubt you stock posts, in some monstrous database, for the zillions of myriad possible endings.  As things wind down, some sort of custom software continually eliminates and eliminates until the correct one is found.  Duly impressive. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on January 02, 2011, 03:44:31 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2011, 03:37:37 PM
Are you watching on video? Live stats say Baruch hit a three to win.

http://daytona.embryriddlesports.com/newLiveStats/Basketball/index.dbml?GAME_STAT_ID=525045&db_oem_id=11500

I just noticed the same thing on the live stats?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 02, 2011, 03:46:31 PM
Very strange, indeed.  Baruch's website is calling it a 79-77 loss.  Wonder what happened with the livestats.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2011, 03:46:52 PM
More like lie stats.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 03:47:47 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2011, 03:37:37 PM
Are you watching on video? Live stats say Baruch hit a three to win.

http://daytona.embryriddlesports.com/newLiveStats/Basketball/index.dbml?GAME_STAT_ID=525045&db_oem_id=11500

Live Stats had the wrong, inflated score for Baruch for most of the second half.  Wooster won 79-77. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2011, 03:49:00 PM
Ahh. So that Farid Tammer three actually happened, it just cut the score to two.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 02, 2011, 03:49:22 PM
All I have to say is phew!  Baruch put up a real fight in this one.  While I didn't watch the live video, I did listen to the radio feed and Baruch did have a 3-pointer at the buzzer to win but, I can assure everyone, the shot did not go in!  Wooster remains unbeaten on the season and Baruch suffers another close loss to a top 5 team.

Franks took over the game at the end as I think 8 of his 25 points came in the final 3 minutes or so!

Hallowell continues to really play well as he came a point short form his season high of 26 vs. Anderson.

Wooster survives arguably the toughest stretch of basketball they will face this season as they finished off their 4th game in 6 days against 4 pretty darn good basketball teams.  

Now the Scots are off until next Saturday so they can get some much needed rest and hopefully get some bumps and bruises healed up before their big showdown with Wabash in Crawfordsville on the 8th!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 02, 2011, 03:50:55 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2011, 03:49:00 PM
Ahh. So that Farid Tammer three actually happened, it just cut the score to two.

No, Baruch was down 2 and Farid did shoot a trey at the buzzer, but he missed...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 02, 2011, 03:52:54 PM
I've been meaning to ask the last couple of days, but why do we have a poll on the NCAC board as to who will win the OAC?   :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on January 02, 2011, 03:56:01 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 02, 2011, 03:52:54 PM
I've been meaning to ask the last couple of days, but why do we have a poll on the NCAC board as to who will win the OAC?   :P

Because we already know Wooster will win the NCAC.

Just kidding Wabash fans!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2011, 03:56:46 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 03:47:47 PM
Live Stats had the wrong, inflated score for Baruch for most of the second half.  Wooster won 79-77. :)

Quote from: ScotsFan on January 02, 2011, 03:50:55 PM
No, Baruch was down 2 and Farid did shoot a trey at the buzzer, but he missed...

OK -- these don't agree but I guess I'll wait for a game story at this point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 04:20:38 PM
Wooster's scoring balance of the top 3 of Ian Franks, Justin Hallowell and Nathan Balch won this game today!

In the last 5+ minutes of the game, Wooster's top 3 scored 16 points after trailing 64-63 to Baruch:

- Justin Hallowell hit 2 critical three pointers (1 with 5+ minutes left, 1 with ~3:30 left ) for 6 total points

- Ian Franks scored 8 total points in the last ~4:15 of the game with 2 buckets and 4 of 4 FT's when fouled

- Nathan Balch nailed the 2 free throws to win the game with <30 seconds left; also made 3 three pointers today.

Combined, Wooster's top 3 players had 61 of the team's total 79 points today.  Great performance by the top 3!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 02, 2011, 04:27:52 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2011, 03:56:46 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 03:47:47 PM
Live Stats had the wrong, inflated score for Baruch for most of the second half.  Wooster won 79-77. :)

Quote from: ScotsFan on January 02, 2011, 03:50:55 PM
No, Baruch was down 2 and Farid did shoot a trey at the buzzer, but he missed...

OK -- these don't agree but I guess I'll wait for a game story at this point.

How don't they agree?  Wooster was up 79-77.  Baruch had the ball.  They missed a 3-pointer at the buzzer and the final ends 79-77.  I heard it go down on the radio feed.  That's the game story.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2011, 04:30:28 PM
That doesn't jive with Baruch having the inflated score for most of the second half. A credited made three at the buzzer means the score was 79-77 (correct) before the three was incorrectly credited.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 05:04:32 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 02, 2011, 03:52:54 PM
I've been meaning to ask the last couple of days, but why do we have a poll on the NCAC board as to who will win the OAC?   :P
Why not?  I think most posters have an interest in that race, and many have an opinion.  I think it's an interesting question.  I like having a poll in this room, and it's not so easy to craft a question that won't just end up as a litmus test for how many fans each school has.  That is, I could ask "Who will win the NCAC Regular Season: Wabash, Wittenberg, Wooster, someone else?" but I fear that would just end up with the same results as "Which is your favorite team?" (with GoRed providing the crucial swing vote ;D); personally I don't think that would be an interesting result.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 05:22:42 PM
Elsewhere, nothing but bad news:

Muskingum 57, Kenyon 56
CWRU 74, Oberlin 60

Non-conference record stands at 41-36.  I think there's just three non-conference games left on the composite schedule, so let's all congratulate each other on the >.500 record for the season!

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi717.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fww173%2Fprestonjjrtr%2FSmileys%2F1sm180congrat.gif&hash=4eb72b41b2cd74ee6053c1f3db3cf57e9a4c41cf)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 05:24:50 PM
One game tomorrow, a game potentially filled with drama (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2011/01/upb-coach-fired):

Pitt-Bradford at Wittenberg, 6pm -- audio and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2011, 06:04:34 PM
I'm interested to see how many Moores suit up for UPB after their dad was fired.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on January 02, 2011, 08:00:36 PM
they are no longer on the roster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 08:25:11 PM
Quote from: zander on January 02, 2011, 08:00:36 PM
they are no longer on the roster

Yes, with the Coach fired and the 3 Moore's (combined 35+ pts/game) now off the roster of a 5-5 team, Wittenberg should have smooth sailing in tomorrow's game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 08:29:00 PM
The play-by-play (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/files/woom0102.htm#GAME.PLY) is of no help in figuring out this game.  It shows a halftime score of 54-51 COW, which was reset to 42-36 (correct score) to start the second half.  Then it shows Baruch's Tammer Farid hitting a three with 0:03 left to tie the game at 67, and the game ends at that impossible score.  

Baruch had the good sense to lop the play-by-play off of the box score* on their site, with this note:
Quote from: Baruch CollegeStatistics Note: Play-by-Play not available in box scores this weekend, due to a statistics program issue courtside at the games.
They do have a brief game recap (http://athletics.baruch.cuny.edu/news/2011/1/2/MBB_0102115713.aspx?path=mbball) on their site, which confirms that the final shot (presumably by Farid) was missed.

*The box score, same on both sites, is also clearly flawed.  It shows, for example, Baruch hitting 18 of 45 FGs in the first half, with Wooster connecting on 21 of 42.  87 FGAs in 20 minutes has to be a record for games not involving Grinnell.  But Wooster did lead the game at the half by a score of 42-36, or in mathematical terms (21x2) - (18x2), so perhaps accurate stats can be backed into by someone willing to give more effort than I am.  Baruch's game recap relies on some of these flawed stats; for example they note that Baruch shot a blistering 69% in the second half, hitting 9 of 13 shots, but that can only produce their second-half total of 41 points if they spent a LOT of time at the free throw line.  It looks to me like the overall totals and player stats are probably correct, but those broken down by half are not, and neither are the statistical categories like "last FG" and "largest lead", and probably things like "points in the paint" as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 08:31:43 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 08:25:11 PM
Quote from: zander on January 02, 2011, 08:00:36 PM
they are no longer on the roster

Yes, with the Coach fired and the 3 Moore's (combined 35+ pts/game) now off the roster of a 5-5 team, Wittenberg should have smooth sailing in tomorrow's game.
It goes beyond that, though.  I know nothing at all about UPB, but I wonder how close the players were to the coach, and how motivated they will be in this game.  Or alternatively, how motivated they might be to make a statement to their AD about her handling of the situation. 

Pennstghs, are you going to be at the game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 08:41:19 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 08:29:00 PM
The play-by-play (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/files/woom0102.htm#GAME.PLY) is of no help in figuring out this game.  It shows a halftime score of 54-51 COW, which was reset to 42-36 (correct score) to start the second half.  Then it shows Baruch's Tammer Farid hitting a three with 0:03 left to tie the game at 67, and the game ends at that impossible score.

Baruch had the good sense to lop the play-by-play off of the box score on their site, with this note:
Quote from: Baruch CollegeStatistics Note: Play-by-Play not available in box scores this weekend, due to a statistics program issue courtside at the games.
They do have a brief game recap (http://athletics.baruch.cuny.edu/news/2011/1/2/MBB_0102115713.aspx?path=mbball) on their site, which confirms that the final shot (presumably by Farid) was missed.


Play by Play was wrong very early in the game as the actual score was tied 4-4 and Play by Play shows 2-6! ::)  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 02, 2011, 08:56:55 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 08:31:43 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 08:25:11 PM
Quote from: zander on January 02, 2011, 08:00:36 PM
they are no longer on the roster

Yes, with the Coach fired and the 3 Moore's (combined 35+ pts/game) now off the roster of a 5-5 team, Wittenberg should have smooth sailing in tomorrow's game.
It goes beyond that, though.  I know nothing at all about UPB, but I wonder how close the players were to the coach, and how motivated they will be in this game.  Or alternatively, how motivated they might be to make a statement to their AD about her handling of the situation. 

Pennstghs, are you going to be at the game?

Does anyone know why the coach was fired, and why it was handled in this manner?  Very bizarre.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 02, 2011, 09:01:06 PM
And speaking of incorrect stats, those on the COW basketball web page are messed up, at least those of the bench players.  I've not looked through all the boxscores, but I know for sure that Doug Thorpe has been in more than the two games that the cumulative stats list him as playing.  I sent an email to their webmaster a couple of days ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 09:15:27 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 02, 2011, 08:56:55 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 08:31:43 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 08:25:11 PM
Quote from: zander on January 02, 2011, 08:00:36 PM
they are no longer on the roster

Yes, with the Coach fired and the 3 Moore's (combined 35+ pts/game) now off the roster of a 5-5 team, Wittenberg should have smooth sailing in tomorrow's game.
It goes beyond that, though.  I know nothing at all about UPB, but I wonder how close the players were to the coach, and how motivated they will be in this game.  Or alternatively, how motivated they might be to make a statement to their AD about her handling of the situation.  

Pennstghs, are you going to be at the game?

Does anyone know why the coach was fired, and why it was handled in this manner?  Very bizarre.
Not beyond what is in the release (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2011/01/upb-coach-fired) on this site.  There's been several stories in the Olean Times Herald (http://www.oleantimesherald.com/sports/) on this "fiasco" (their word), but most of those stories are hidden behind a subscription wall.  Maybe Ryan Maurer and his staff will be able to shed some light on this when they write up their game recap tomorrow night.

One of these stories, from 12/16 (http://www.oleantimesherald.com/sports/article_5a83ee2c-0926-11e0-bc6a-001cc4c002e0.html), indicates that Coach Moore was suspended indefinitely due to his "conduct" in the 12/8 game vs. Medaille, and seems to suggest that the techincal foul he was assessed with 0:04 was a key component of that conduct.  Another story (12/22 (http://www.oleantimesherald.com/sports/article_ed1fa450-0dff-11e0-a199-001cc4c002e0.html)) notes that this is not the first time that UPB's AD and president have fired a coach due to "conduct" during a game; the women's coach was fired immediately after a game last season in which he received two techinicals.  Oddly, perhaps, the same man (Brian Sansom) was brought on as interim coach in both cases.

It's all quite peculiar.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2011, 09:45:14 PM
Quote from: zander on January 02, 2011, 08:00:36 PM
they are no longer on the roster

Thanks. They were as of a couple days ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2011, 09:47:12 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 09:15:27 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 02, 2011, 08:56:55 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 08:31:43 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 08:25:11 PM
Quote from: zander on January 02, 2011, 08:00:36 PM
they are no longer on the roster

Yes, with the Coach fired and the 3 Moore's (combined 35+ pts/game) now off the roster of a 5-5 team, Wittenberg should have smooth sailing in tomorrow's game.
It goes beyond that, though.  I know nothing at all about UPB, but I wonder how close the players were to the coach, and how motivated they will be in this game.  Or alternatively, how motivated they might be to make a statement to their AD about her handling of the situation.  

Pennstghs, are you going to be at the game?

Does anyone know why the coach was fired, and why it was handled in this manner?  Very bizarre.
Not beyond what is in the release (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2011/01/upb-coach-fired) on this site.  There's been several stories in the Olean Times Herald (http://www.oleantimesherald.com/sports/) on this "fiasco" (their word), but most of those stories are hidden behind a subscription wall.  Maybe Ryan Maurer and his staff will be able to shed some light on this when they write up their game recap tomorrow night.

One of these stories, from 12/16 (http://www.oleantimesherald.com/sports/article_5a83ee2c-0926-11e0-bc6a-001cc4c002e0.html), indicates that Coach Moore was suspended indefinitely due to his "conduct" in the 12/8 game vs. Medaille, and seems to suggest that the techincal foul he was assessed with 0:04 was a key component of that conduct.  Another story (12/22 (http://www.oleantimesherald.com/sports/article_ed1fa450-0dff-11e0-a199-001cc4c002e0.html)) notes that this is not the first time that UPB's AD and president have fired a coach due to "conduct" during a game; the women's coach was fired immediately after a game last season in which he received two techinicals.  Oddly, perhaps, the same man (Brian Sansom) was brought on as interim coach in both cases.

It's all quite peculiar.

One of the stories I saw in researching our brief suggested that the only reason the technical was assessed was because the coach was on the floor arguing with his own AD. I couldn't substantiate that, though it fits the timeline.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 09:50:04 PM
Wooster now has a game story posted (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/releases/20110102sedtw2), and it doesn't seem to rely on the suspect stats (although it does reference ties and lead changes, which may or may not be accurate.)  Hugh gives a pretty good blow-by-blow of the final few possessions. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on January 02, 2011, 10:13:22 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 02, 2011, 09:47:12 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 09:15:27 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 02, 2011, 08:56:55 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 08:31:43 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 08:25:11 PM
Quote from: zander on January 02, 2011, 08:00:36 PM
they are no longer on the roster

Yes, with the Coach fired and the 3 Moore's (combined 35+ pts/game) now off the roster of a 5-5 team, Wittenberg should have smooth sailing in tomorrow's game.
It goes beyond that, though.  I know nothing at all about UPB, but I wonder how close the players were to the coach, and how motivated they will be in this game.  Or alternatively, how motivated they might be to make a statement to their AD about her handling of the situation.  

Pennstghs, are you going to be at the game?

Does anyone know why the coach was fired, and why it was handled in this manner?  Very bizarre.
Not beyond what is in the release (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2011/01/upb-coach-fired) on this site.  There's been several stories in the Olean Times Herald (http://www.oleantimesherald.com/sports/) on this "fiasco" (their word), but most of those stories are hidden behind a subscription wall.  Maybe Ryan Maurer and his staff will be able to shed some light on this when they write up their game recap tomorrow night.

One of these stories, from 12/16 (http://www.oleantimesherald.com/sports/article_5a83ee2c-0926-11e0-bc6a-001cc4c002e0.html), indicates that Coach Moore was suspended indefinitely due to his "conduct" in the 12/8 game vs. Medaille, and seems to suggest that the techincal foul he was assessed with 0:04 was a key component of that conduct.  Another story (12/22 (http://www.oleantimesherald.com/sports/article_ed1fa450-0dff-11e0-a199-001cc4c002e0.html)) notes that this is not the first time that UPB's AD and president have fired a coach due to "conduct" during a game; the women's coach was fired immediately after a game last season in which he received two techinicals.  Oddly, perhaps, the same man (Brian Sansom) was brought on as interim coach in both cases.

It's all quite peculiar.

One of the stories I saw in researching our brief suggested that the only reason the technical was assessed was because the coach was on the floor arguing with his own AD. I couldn't substantiate that, though it fits the timeline.

Sounds to me like the AD is the one with the issues.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 02, 2011, 10:16:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 02, 2011, 09:50:04 PM
Wooster now has a game story posted (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/releases/20110102sedtw2), and it doesn't seem to rely on the suspect stats (although it does reference ties and lead changes, which may or may not be accurate.)  Hugh gives a pretty good blow-by-blow of the final few possessions.  

It is completely accurate. :) I kept written play by play notes of the last 5 minutes (score changes, running game time, who scored) from the radio broadcast of the game.  This story matches my notes and accurately summarizes the game's last 2 minutes score by score. ;)    Here is a little more of the play by play....

From 4 minutes left to 2 minutes left:
~4 min left:  Sean Loftus with traditional 3 point play for Baruch;  Baruch 71 Woo 68
3:39 left:  Justin Hallowell responds by nailing his 7th three pointer:  Baruch 71 Woo 71
2:31 left: Arki Wisnu makes 1 of 2 free throws:  Baruch 72 Woo 71
~2 min left: Tammer Farid hits his last three pointer:  Baruch 75  Woo 71
Ian Franks with 6 more points and Balch with 2 FT's finish the scoring to get Wooster to the 79-77 win.  ;)
Arki Wisnu made 2 FT's with 0:53 left for Baruch's final 2 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 02, 2011, 10:27:56 PM
DC, I'll be there and can provide some insight. I know even Wittenberg is aware of UPB's situation as Coach Brown acknowledged on his postgame report afte rThursday's game that he had no idea what to expect out of that team and how there is going to be some awkwardness. Luckily Witt had already scouted them somewhat as they played in the Rochester tournamen that Witt was at ,Witt just avoided playing them.

We'll see how it goes, the main storyline is the continuing saga of the Wittenberg rotation as new players come back from injuries/football and other new guys step up.

I still am adament that Witt will be a player in this year's conference race as their record cannot be a true testament of their team so far. All of their losses are attributed to turnovers and defensive breakdowns (aka they had new players so lack of repitition) is what i would surmise.


Woo Boo, don't worry about the karma, i lose it just for saying Wittenberg all the time ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 03, 2011, 12:59:59 AM
If there's a laptop issue, or something, then the stats can get all higgdly-piggdly. When I was still in Indiana, I was helping SID at a Wabash - Wooster game where the laptop fried and we had to do the first half stats by hand.

And as for the Wooster stats, it looks like there are two different #10s, so that could be the genesis for the errors. Opposing team SIDs may or may not catch who is in #10 on that particular night. Well, the good ones will...right SID?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 03, 2011, 09:50:23 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 03, 2011, 12:59:59 AM
And as for the Wooster stats, it looks like there are two different #10s, so that could be the genesis for the errors. Opposing team SIDs may or may not catch who is in #10 on that particular night. Well, the good ones will...right SID?

Nice catch!  And there are also two #50s!  That's where the problem lies.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 03, 2011, 12:29:09 PM
The W's dominate talk on this board but how about the continual struggles at Oberlin?  It appears as if the Yeo could lose 24 in a row to end the season after starting off 10-11 with a win.  Will there be a change or are they too busy to care about basketball?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 03, 2011, 01:04:11 PM
Quote from: WAlum on January 03, 2011, 12:29:09 PM
The W's dominate talk on this board but how about the continual struggles at Oberlin?  It appears as if the Yeo could lose 24 in a row to end the season after starting off 10-11 with a win.  Will there be a change or are they too busy to care about basketball?

It's not just the losing streak either, it's the margins that are disappointing.  I do think, as long as they keep competing, that Oberlin will get a win or two in league play.  As far as a long term solution...no idea.  I guess we'll see if Oberlin's approach to men's basketball changes when they pick a new AD. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 03, 2011, 02:03:22 PM
QuoteThe W's dominate talk on this board but how about the continual struggles at Oberlin?  It appears as if the Yeo could lose 24 in a row to end the season after starting off 10-11 with a win.  Will there be a change or are they too busy to care about basketball?

It would be nice to see a more competitive Oberlin program - just not before this Saturday  ;D.  I think Cavaco is a good coach and has made a lot of progress with the program that the record doesn't seem to reflect this year (the margins in the losses are puzzling, though).  He has recruited a few nice players, but depth is certainly a chronic issue.  Now that he has a roster that is his own, I would give him a little more time to see what he can do.   

Wally is right, though.  The AD sets the pace for any athletic program.  Only if they pick someone that is serious about changing the overall approach will you see real progress.           
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 03, 2011, 02:19:14 PM
Quote from: GoRed on January 03, 2011, 02:03:22 PM
Wally is right, though.  The AD sets the pace for any athletic program.  Only if they pick someone that is serious about changing the overall approach will you see real progress.       

In fairness to the outgoing AD at Oberlin, the OC's athletics program has made positive steps in recent years as evidenced by Oberlin's increasing point totals in the all-sports standings.  That progress hasn't manifested itself so much with men's basketball, but progress is there. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 03, 2011, 02:36:45 PM
Quote from: GoRed on January 03, 2011, 02:03:22 PM
QuoteThe W's dominate talk on this board but how about the continual struggles at Oberlin?  It appears as if the Yeo could lose 24 in a row to end the season after starting off 10-11 with a win.  Will there be a change or are they too busy to care about basketball?

It would be nice to see a more competitive Oberlin program - just not before this Saturday  ;D.  I think Cavaco is a good coach and has made a lot of progress with the program that the record doesn't seem to reflect this year (the margins in the losses are puzzling, though).  He has recruited a few nice players, but depth is certainly a chronic issue.  Now that he has a roster that is his own, I would give him a little more time to see what he can do.   

Wally is right, though.  The AD sets the pace for any athletic program.  Only if they pick someone that is serious about changing the overall approach will you see real progress.           


It would be nice to see some improvement from Oberlin, especially in the non-league portion of the schedule, to help the rest of the league in strength of schedule, etc.  When is the new AD coming aboard? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 03, 2011, 02:46:49 PM
Quote from: WAlum on January 03, 2011, 02:36:45 PM
It would be nice to see some improvement from Oberlin, especially in the non-league portion of the schedule, to help the rest of the league in strength of schedule, etc.  When is the new AD coming aboard? 

I think the current AD finishes up sometime in February...there will be an interim AD as Oberlin conducts their search for a replacement.  I'm not familiar enough with AD searches to know how long they generally last, so I can't say when we should expect a hire.  I would think that sometime before the start of the next academic year is a conservative enough estimate. 

I understand where you're coming from regarding Oberlin's non-league schedule, but I don't think Oberlin should worry about playing for potential bubblers in the league.  Oberlin needs to play for Oberlin.  Any bubble teams from our league that get left out of the tournament shouldn't point fingers at Oberlin for negatively influencing the SOS math.  Win more games and whatever Oberlin does won't matter. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 03, 2011, 02:50:34 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 03, 2011, 02:46:49 PM
Quote from: WAlum on January 03, 2011, 02:36:45 PM
It would be nice to see some improvement from Oberlin, especially in the non-league portion of the schedule, to help the rest of the league in strength of schedule, etc.  When is the new AD coming aboard? 

I think the current AD finishes up sometime in February...there will be an interim AD as Oberlin conducts their search for a replacement.  I'm not familiar enough with AD searches to know how long they generally last, so I can't say when we should expect a hire.  I would think that sometime before the start of the next academic year is a conservative enough estimate. 

I understand where you're coming from regarding Oberlin's non-league schedule, but I don't think Oberlin should worry about playing for potential bubblers in the league.  Oberlin needs to play for Oberlin.  Any bubble teams from our league that get left out of the tournament shouldn't point fingers at Oberlin for negatively influencing the SOS math.  Win more games and whatever Oberlin does won't matter. 

I agree about Oberlin playing for Oberlin.  On a league-wide scale though, the better the teams in the league, the better off ALL the teams are.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 03, 2011, 03:51:23 PM
While I believe that Oberlin can certainly do better, I also believe there are limits.  We're talking about what is probably the elite academic school in Ohio.  Getting in isn't easy.

Oberlin's volleyball program was horrible.  Prior to the 2005 season they hired Carey Cavanaugh as head coach.  Carey, as a player, led Stow high school to the Ohio D1 state championship.  She played a year at Ohio State, transferred due to an injury, and resurfaced at East Tennessee State where she was an all-league setter three years in a row and the league's player of the year in her senior year.

I've worked with Carey in volleyball camps and she's an amazing coach.  She brings the whole package: knowledge of the game, dedication, personality, competitiveness, you name it.

I can't find the numbers, but I believe in the season prior to her hiring Oberlin had won but a single match.  Slowly and painfully, Carey worked against the stagnant inertia of the program, bringing the team home with a 15-16 record in 2009.  This tied the school record for wins in a season. But she couldn't maintain it, the Yeochicks dropping back to 6-24 in 2010.

This isn't because of any lacking in ability on her part, nor, and I assure you of this with her coaching, is it due to a lack of effort on the part of the players.  It's just that, due to its academic standards, Oberlin's recruiting pool is that much smaller than almost all other schools, even those in the academic-oriented NCAC.  I don't know that her team can realistically hope to go much beyond where they now sit.  That's too bad, but I believe that's the reality of it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 03, 2011, 04:04:49 PM
I think it's got a lot more to do with the culture of a campus than it does admissions standards.  Smart kids play sports, too, and those kids can be actively recruited to play at a place like Oberlin.  I've never had the pleasure to visit Oberlin, but after 10+ years of following the NCAC I get the sense that athletics aren't a real big part of the Oberlin experience. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BashDad on January 03, 2011, 04:51:22 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 03, 2011, 03:51:23 PM
While I believe that Oberlin can certainly do better, I also believe there are limits.  We're talking about what is probably the elite academic school in Ohio.  Getting in isn't easy.

Oberlin's volleyball program was horrible.  Prior to the 2005 season they hired Carey Cavanaugh as head coach.  Carey, as a player, led Stow high school to the Ohio D1 state championship.  She played a year at Ohio State, transferred due to an injury, and resurfaced at East Tennessee State where she was an all-league setter three years in a row and the league's player of the year in her senior year.

I've worked with Carey in volleyball camps and she's an amazing coach.  She brings the whole package: knowledge of the game, dedication, personality, competitiveness, you name it.

I can't find the numbers, but I believe in the season prior to her hiring Oberlin had won but a single match.  Slowly and painfully, Carey worked against the stagnant inertia of the program, bringing the team home with a 15-16 record in 2009.  This tied the school record for wins in a season. But she couldn't maintain it, the Yeochicks dropping back to 6-24 in 2010.

This isn't because of any lacking in ability on her part, nor, and I assure you of this with her coaching, is it due to a lack of effort on the part of the players.  It's just that, due to its academic standards, Oberlin's recruiting pool is that much smaller than almost all other schools, even those in the academic-oriented NCAC.  I don't know that her team can realistically hope to go much beyond where they now sit.  That's too bad, but I believe that's the reality of it.

Meanwhile, Stanford plays in the Orange Bowl tonight at 8:30....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 03, 2011, 08:09:59 PM
You ever watch games where you have no idea how one team won the game,

Wittenberg 79 Pitt-Bradford 77

Wittenberg got outrebounded, outshot and outhustled and somehow came from 15 down with about 10 minutes to go for the win.

Chris Sullivan had a terrible game overall even though he finished with 22 points, as he shot 4-16 from 3 point land and as a team shot 8-27.

Great effort by Pitt-Bradford as they came in and outhustled and outworked Witt but overall good win for Witt.

Hate to say this but maybe a 1-10 Oberlin is what Witt needs to get on track
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 03, 2011, 09:29:39 PM
Ditto, pennstghs.  Unfortunately, we have to go to Crawfordsville first.  Without Larry, I don't forsee an upset this time.  Wabash is playing very well right now.  I still don't see them beating Wooster, though, on either team's court. 

Back to Oberlin.  It is a great school, in a quaint little town, with a very liberal approach to academics and the world in general.  It has a distinct tilt toward the arts.  I view Kenyon and Denison similarly, but with the exception that both have certain athletic programs with traditions and a reputation for excellence that will attract the athlete just based on that tradition (e.g. Kenyon & Denison swimming).  That is where Wooster and Witt are with basketball.  The W's seem to be the places for the best Ohio DIII players to go if they are very focused on hoops and the academic choices suit them.  Oberlin, Kenyon and Denison then have to either take then next best Ohio recruits or go out-of-state with their recruiting and hope that they can attract based on academics or other criteria.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2011, 10:20:21 PM
Non-cons are now at 42-36 (.538) with Wittenberg's narrow victory.  There's just two non-con games left:
ONU at Wittenberg (1/15)
Capital at Denison (1/19)
So far, the season series against the OAC stands at 8-8.  Wooster and Hiram have done most of the work, combining for a 6-1 record.  Wittenberg and Denison, our last hopes for a winning season against our (mostly) in-state rivals, are an inauspicious 0-3 so far. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2011, 01:02:10 PM
Speaking of Oberlin's AD:

Five Minutes with Joe Karlgaard (http://northcoastconference.blogspot.com/2011/01/five-minutes-with.html)

Five minutes with... is a new feature over at the conference website (http://www2.northcoast.org/), which I think is very interesting and valuable.

I particularly like and applaud this exchange:

Quote from: Joe Karlgaard• How has your experience been in making sure that student-athletes have a proper balance among athletics and academics at your institution?

JK: I don't like the word "balance" when describing how the pieces of an education fit together. I think athletics, when coached and taught properly, has tremendous educational value. So athletics complements what occurs in the classroom and in many cases is just as valuable. If you don't believe that athletics is educational in nature, then it's a nuisance to the mission of the institution. Our students at Oberlin participate in many educational activities on campus, and athletics is an important component for many of them.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bash Brother 2000 on January 04, 2011, 01:55:44 PM
Quote from: GoRed on January 03, 2011, 09:29:39 PM
Ditto, pennstghs.  Unfortunately, we have to go to Crawfordsville first.  Without Larry, I don't forsee an upset this time.  Wabash is playing very well right now.  I still don't see them beating Wooster, though, on either team's court. 

Back to Oberlin.  It is a great school, in a quaint little town, with a very liberal approach to academics and the world in general.  It has a distinct tilt toward the arts.  I view Kenyon and Denison similarly, but with the exception that both have certain athletic programs with traditions and a reputation for excellence that will attract the athlete just based on that tradition (e.g. Kenyon & Denison swimming).  That is where Wooster and Witt are with basketball.  The W's seem to be the places for the best Ohio DIII players to go if they are very focused on hoops and the academic choices suit them.  Oberlin, Kenyon and Denison then have to either take then next best Ohio recruits or go out-of-state with their recruiting and hope that they can attract based on academics or other criteria.   

I do see Wabash beating Wooster this Saturday.  It's our year and moment to shine across the D III Nation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on January 04, 2011, 05:28:23 PM
I like Wabash's chances.  By that I mean to take nothing away from an outstanding Wooster team. Its at home, the coaches should have the team focused, the stands should be supportive .... the team itself has individual talent and depth ...

Suspect we might just see the appearance of the Bell from its perch over the entrance to the athletic complex.  Hope so.  The colors of the Dannies and the Wooers are the same dispicable gold and black ... seems only right to shake the Bell at them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on January 04, 2011, 05:37:38 PM
I see where Wabash picked up a spot to #7 with Woo remaining #1.  Sure hope the game Saturday is at full compliment for both teams and lives up to - at least - what the 25 polsters believe it should be. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 04, 2011, 07:58:32 PM
Here's to the hype about Saturday intensifying to the point that Wabash overlooks their next opponent!  Do they even have to think about Wednesday's game?  The LG's really have to focus all their attention on Saturday.   

A Denison upset tomorrow night sure would take the fun out of Saturday's game!  Could it happen?  ::) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on January 04, 2011, 08:44:29 PM
NOPE
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 04, 2011, 09:08:05 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 07, 2010, 03:15:02 PM
But there's also a big part of me that wants to wait until I see Wooster beat someone like OWU (and obviously, Allegheny) before I start to feel that their heady ranking on paper is justified by their performance on the hardwood.

I'll qualify that by saying that most of the reason I'm not sure I'm ready to buy the idea that the Scots are indisputably a Top 10 (much less #1) team right now is because I don't think the Scots have had a chance in their first six games to prove themselves against any really good competition. 

I think Wooster has artificially reached #1 because of losses in front of them rather than results-to-date.  Even a "good" (as opposed to a "national championship contending caliber") Wooster team should be 6-0 at this point, based on who it has played.  Heck, Wabash has a better claim on #1 than Wooster does based on season activity-to-date, having thoroughly beaten a very good team at home, then also beating its quality arch-rival on the road in the young season.  (And I suspect the voter that gave them the #1 vote used some similar logic.)

OWU could even be the best team that the Scots have faced so far this year.  And like I said, it's a tough economy and the Scots could use some resume-building.  In that sense, I think I'll know far more about how this Wooster squad compares after its next 5 games (Allegheny, OWU, Anderson, John Carroll & Wilmington).  Go 5-0 or maybe even 4-1 and I think the Scots will have established a credible Top 10/#1 resume.  Even better, go 8-0 or 7-1 over the next 8, which would include games against two more good opponents in Baruch and Wabash (I don't know anything about William Carey).

Well, a few weeks ago I posted this, suggesting that Wooster's first six contests didn't really tell us much about just how good Wooster is or isn't.

Now I think we have a better idea.  With one mildly interesting game left against some team from Indiana,  ;) :D ;D the Scots will do no worse than go 7-1 against the toughest stretch of their regular season schedule.  To me, there is no longer any ceiling to what these Scots could accomplish.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 04, 2011, 09:51:06 PM
You know, it's all about the culture of a place and what they seem to emphasize. There are sports that Kenyon and Denison are pretty good in. Hiram seems to have found some success in men's basketball. Oberlin obviously feels that it's important to offer intercollegiate athletics. That, in some part, may have what doomed Antioch. Heck, even the uber-granola Unity up in Maine plays hoops (not D-3 hoops, but they do play other colleges). Unity makes Earlham seem like Hillsdale!

We have some fun at the Unbeaten & Winless board about some of the schools that are perennial bottom feeders: Cal Tech, Maine - Presque Isle, Principia, Crown, etc. But there has to be some value to the school even if they struggle each season.

Because of Oberlin's emphasis on the arts, athletics probably rightly takes second place. Theater, glee club and orchestra don't have wins and losses, nor do they have madcap fans on message boards. "OMG! The Battling Bishops choir faces Denison tonight!!!!1! Will their madrigals make the difference???"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 05, 2011, 01:38:16 AM
Quote from: GoRed on January 04, 2011, 07:58:32 PM
Here's to the hype about Saturday intensifying to the point that Wabash overlooks their next opponent!  Do they even have to think about Wednesday's game?  The LG's really have to focus all their attention on Saturday.   

A Denison upset tomorrow night sure would take the fun out of Saturday's game!  Could it happen?  ::) 

I think the background noise about the Wooster game probably isn't too loud around the Wabash basketball team.  The students haven't returned to campus yet, so the outside chatter about Saturday probably just isn't there to a degree that would be anything more than negligible. 

And Saturday's game is going to be fun regardless of tomorrow night's result.  The game is going to be #1 vs. #7 no matter what happens against Denison.  That said, I think Coach Petty has his team focused on the task at hand, which right now is preparing for Denison.  Every one of these league games is important, because the margin for error is paper thin.  If you're a team in the NCAC this year with thoughts of hosting the league tournament, I don't think you can count on Wooster losing to pretty much anybody else...which means that you're going to have to beat Wooster yourself and under no circumstances can you give a win against Wooster back by losing to a team lower in the standings.  The LGs will be ready to go tomorrow night. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 05, 2011, 02:49:05 AM
Full slate of conference action Wednesday, with only Wooster sitting it out.

Denison at Wabash, 7:30pm -- audio? and live stats? (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball/schedule) (no live links right now, but I'm guessing there will be at game time)
Kenyon at Hiram, 7:30 -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html)
Allegheny at OWU, ~8pm -- video and live stats (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Oberlin at Wittenberg, ~8pm -- audio and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 05, 2011, 04:25:55 PM
I hope the Little Giants come out firing on all cylinders tonight.   The Holiday period creates a lot of advantageous time to heal; but it also could potentially create some rust.  

Here's hoping Wabash takes care of business tonight!

WAF!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bash Brother 2000 on January 05, 2011, 08:42:24 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on January 05, 2011, 04:25:55 PM
I hope the Little Giants come out firing on all cylinders tonight.   The Holiday period creates a lot of advantageous time to heal; but it also could potentially create some rust.  

Here's hoping Wabash takes care of business tonight!

WAF!

62 - 45 Wabash with 7:18 remaining.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 05, 2011, 09:02:13 PM
I know it seems nitpicky after a 16 point win but I noticed in the box score that Sutherlin was 0-7 from the field. Hope it was just one of those nights. Glad he can have one of those nights and we can still win the game comfortably. But that is not going to be the case on Saturday. I can't wait.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bash Brother 2000 on January 05, 2011, 09:04:44 PM
Wabash bashes Denison 73 - 57.  Win #13 and bring on Wooster!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 05, 2011, 09:43:18 PM
1/5 NCAC Final Scores:

Wabash 73  Denison 57

Kenyon 89  Hiram 74

Wittenberg 81  Oberlin 45

Ohio Wesleyan 84  Allegheny 66
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 05, 2011, 09:45:30 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 05, 2011, 09:43:18 PM
1/5 NCAC Final Scores:
Kenyon 89  Hiram 74

That's a bit of a surprise.  Good win for the Lords.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 05, 2011, 09:52:53 PM
Updated NCAC Standings with 1/5 Results:

1.  Wabash 5-0, 13-0
2.  Wooster 4-0, 13-0
2.  Wittenberg 4-0, 8-4
4.  Kenyon 2-2, 6-7
5.  Ohio Wesleyan 2-3, 6-8
6.  Hiram 1-3, 7-6
7.  Allegheny 1-4, 4-9
7.  Denison 1-4, 4-9
9.  Oberlin 0-4, 1-11
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 05, 2011, 10:27:52 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 05, 2011, 09:02:13 PM
I know it seems nitpicky after a 16 point win but I noticed in the box score that Sutherlin was 0-7 from the field. Hope it was just one of those nights. Glad he can have one of those nights and we can still win the game comfortably. But that is not going to be the case on Saturday. I can't wait.

He can be and will be streaky. He was in HS as well, as I recall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 05, 2011, 11:26:03 PM
I'm not sure if we've ever had two unbeaten NCAC teams meet this late in the season.  Congratulations in advance to both of these teams for their excellent starts!

The closest parallel that comes to mind is Wooster vs. Wittenberg in 2005-06.  Both teams were undefeated coming into their first meeting, in early December.  The Scots were 7-0 and the Tigers 6-0 coming into the contest, which the Scots won at home 86-83 on one of James Cooper's patented "stand/dribble around 35 feet from the hoop for all but 7 seconds of the shot clock, then lay down a couple hesitation dribbles, shimmy-shakes, take a fake step or two as if you're about to drive to the hoop, then calmly step back and drain a game-winning 23-footer."  A fond, fond front-row (literally!) memory for this fan.

Later that year #1 Wittenberg hosted #2 Wooster, with both teams at 19-1 coming in.  37-1 against all other opponents is a pretty darn good record, but so is 26-0.

Hopefully we see game worthy of its billing this weekend in Crawfordsville.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 06, 2011, 12:59:55 AM
This is great - and what it's all about:

http://www.d3sports.com/notables/2011/01/d3-athletes-graduate
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 06, 2011, 01:17:24 AM
Quote from: GoRed on January 06, 2011, 12:59:55 AM
This is great - and what it's all about:

http://www.d3sports.com/notables/2011/01/d3-athletes-graduate


One caution: although the article calls it a "representative sample", it also says it was the 115 (of 440+) schools who "voluntarily provided data".  That is NOT a representative sample; it is a self-selected sample.  And self-selected samples tend to be those who care the most or who will look the best.  MAYBE the results are accurate, but it is also possible (probable) that schools with higher athlete graduation rates were more likely to respond.

I wouldn't put any stock in this study until they actually have a representative sample.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 06, 2011, 11:08:20 AM
Ypsi -- did you follow the link to the NCAA News story? I didn't include all of their numbers because I felt it would not be fair use, but they broke down the sample and how it compared to Division III as a whole.

All DIII schools Pilot schools
Number of schools 444115
Private/public 80%/20% 82%/18%
Average enrollment 2,3672,770
Percent admitted 63%67%
Avg. sports sponsorship 1717
Sponsors football 53%55%
Proportion of athletes to undergraduate enrollment 21%21%
Overall student body federal grad rate 65%63%
Female student body federal grad rate 68%67%
Male student body
federal grad rate 		62%59%
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 06, 2011, 12:51:04 PM
No, I didn't follow the link, because the 'representativeness' on objective criteria doesn't address my point.  Basic human nature suggests the likelihood that schools with higher athlete graduation rates are more prone to voluntarily releasing that data than schools with poorer graduation rates.

As I said, the conclusion MAY be accurate; I just wouldn't put too much stock in a study based on voluntary release of graduation rates.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 06, 2011, 02:18:25 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 06, 2011, 12:51:04 PM
Basic human nature suggests the likelihood that schools with higher athlete graduation rates are more prone to voluntarily releasing that data than schools with poorer graduation rates.

Perhaps. Although the numbers cited above showed that the pilot schools had slightly lower overall graduation rates than the D-III average.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 07, 2011, 11:55:17 AM
There is a pretty big game in conference tomorrow night.... board is awfully quiet.

Keys to the game?

I'll take a stab -

Wabash -

1. 3 point shooting percentage (Both offensively and defensively)
2. Disrupting Wooster's offensive rhythm
3. Eliminating Wooster's second chance points (offensive rebounds)
4. Less than 10 turnovers
5. Making the easy baskets (has been an issue in a couple of games)
6. Other scorers stepping up as they may focus defense on frustrating Wes.
7. Getting to the line and making them
8. Limiting Franks production
9.  Defensive spacing and intensity will be critical


Wooster -

1. Extending defense to reduce Wabash's perimeter shooting
2. Not giving Wes Smith penetration lanes
3. Pace of half court offense
4. Transition points (both offensively and defensively)
5. Taking Smith out of the game early
6. Ball movement to create open shots
7. Making the open 3's that will present themselves
8. Rebounding advantage
9. Free throws


Sure there are a bunch more

Not much room for error for the Little Giants in this one.  They will have to play their most complete game of the year to be successful.  I hope it is a battle at the Allen Center tomorrow night.

WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on January 07, 2011, 12:50:08 PM
Bashbrother

you forgot one more element:  Wabash fans.  Look for Chadwick to be full and rocking with college, alumni, and community support as well early reporting studentS.  I may be wrong but, from what I hear, expect it to be SRO
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 07, 2011, 12:53:47 PM
Fan support is a MUST!.... If I lived within 1,000 miles, I would be there  ;)

But seriously, you're right, fans are what make home court advantage.... truly an advantage.... I hope this "Special" team gets a tremendous crowd tomorrow night.....they deserve it!   The game itself is worthy of any college basketball fan's attention... #1 vs. #7..... both undefeated this late in the year........May be awhile before Wabash fans get to see a basketball game of this magnitude again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 07, 2011, 02:16:38 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on January 07, 2011, 12:53:47 PM
.... I hope this "Special" team gets a tremendous crowd tomorrow night.....

My hope is that the Wabash faithful show up tomorrow NIGHT.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DadofBashWarrior.. on January 07, 2011, 02:35:39 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 07, 2011, 02:16:38 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on January 07, 2011, 12:53:47 PM
.... I hope this "Special" team gets a tremendous crowd tomorrow night.....

My hope is that the Wabash faithful show up tomorrow NIGHT.

2 PM Eastern Time I think...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on January 07, 2011, 02:39:43 PM
BB, Wabco, and other LG fans,

Quote from: imderekpoe on January 07, 2011, 02:16:38 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on January 07, 2011, 12:53:47 PM
.... I hope this "Special" team gets a tremendous crowd tomorrow night.....

My hope is that the Wabash faithful show up tomorrow NIGHT.

The GAME is only at night, here in Suid Afrika - it's a 2:00PM tip-off!  Well played, IM - +k  ;)

Sausage fingers, and DOBW Rode on by... darned red warnings!  :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 07, 2011, 04:04:29 PM
Thanks to all for the correction on the time!

Go Wabash!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2011, 09:55:27 PM
Here is the Team Stats comparison for Wooster and Wabash:

Wooster 13-0  #1 Ranking
Offensive Field Goals 48.6%
Defensive Field Goals 36.8%
3 Point Shooting 41.8%
Free Throw Shooting 77.5%
Rebound Margin Per Game:  +11.4
Assists to Turnovers Ratio:  1.23
Scoring Margin Per Game:  +17.0 points

Wabash 13-0  #7 Ranking
Offensive Field Goals 45.8%
Defensive Field Goals 36.5%
3 Point Shooting 36.8%
Free Throw Shooting 72.7%
Rebound Margin Per Game:  +8.5
Assists to Turnovers Ratio:  0.93
Scoring Margin Per Game:  +15.5 points
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2011, 10:20:38 PM
Wooster Probable Starters
6'4"  Ian Franks SR  18.5 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 3.6 apg
6'7"  Justin Hallowell JR  13.5 ppg, 6.2 rpg, 2.0 apg
6'1"  Nathan Balch SR  12.6 ppg, 3.5 rpg
6'1"  Matt Fegan JR  8.6 ppg, 1.3 rpg, 3.2 apg
6'5"  Bryan Wickliffe SR  8.5 ppg, 6.8 rpg

Wooster Key Reserves
6'7"  Josh Claytor SO  4.6 ppg, 3.7 rpg
6'8"  Jake Mays SO  4.2 ppg, 3.6 rpg
6'0"  Ryan Snyder FR  3.2 ppg, 1.8 rpg
6'2"  Justin Warnes JR 3.1 ppg, 2.5 rpg

Wabash Probable Starters
6'3"  Wes Smith SR  23.1 ppg, 6.2 rpg
6'2"  Aaron Zinnerman JR  8.0 ppg, 3.7 rpg, 2.6 apg
6'5"  Ben Burkett SR  7.2 ppg, 4.5 rpg
6'3"  Brian Shelbourne JR  5.2 ppg, 4.1 rpg, 4.1 apg
6'7"  Nick Curosh JR  3.2 ppg, 5.8 rpg

Wabash Key Reserves
6'5"  AJ Sutherlin JR  6.7 ppg, 2.7 rpg
6'5"  Derek Bailey JR  6.2 ppg, 3.6 rpg
6'7"  Pete Nicksic FR  5.0 ppg, 3.9 rpg
6'0"  Dominique Thomas SR 2.5 ppg
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 07, 2011, 10:26:00 PM
Saturday games:

Wooster at Wabash, 2pm -- video and live stats (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball); audio (http://wkvx.com/) (Woo)
Denison at Oberlin, 3pm -- video and live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/)
Kenyon at Allegheny, ~3pm -- live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Hiram at Wittenberg, ~5pm -- audio and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
OWU is idle

Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 05, 2011, 09:52:53 PM
Updated NCAC Standings with 1/5 Results:

1.  Wabash 5-0, 13-0
2.  Wooster 4-0, 13-0
2.  Wittenberg 4-0, 8-4
4.  Kenyon 2-2, 6-7
5.  Ohio Wesleyan 2-3, 6-8
6.  Hiram 1-3, 7-6
7.  Allegheny 1-4, 4-9
7.  Denison 1-4, 4-9
9.  Oberlin 0-4, 1-11
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 07, 2011, 10:33:53 PM
Here's my two cents on game previews:

Comparing offenses:
The key strength of the Scots offense, and what could make it hard for even Wabash's excellent defense to defend, is how well the Scots can spread its scoring around.  All the Scots starters average over 8 ppg; only two of Wabash's starters hit that mark.  Further, and this is just kinda ridiculous, but true: four of the Scots starters average better than 43% from distance; only AJ Sutherlin hits at that 3pt percentage for the LGs.

Wabash's offense works the other way 'round.  Not only has Wes Smith led the LGs in scoring in every game this season, and scored 1/3 of Wabash's total points this year, but also no one else on the roster seems to really be able to step up and have a dominant offensive performance with him, or instead of him.  The LGs have had only two 15+ point performances by anyone not named Wes Smith (Zinnerman once and Sutherlin once).  Contrast that with Wooster: by my count, the Scots have had thirteen 15+ point performances by players not named Ian Franks.

Wooster also has the statistical advantage at the free throw line, averaging a very good 77%, but Wabash is no slouch at 72%.

Comparing defenses:
Both of these defenses are very, very good.  This game could easily have a final score like 52-50.  I have less to say on this side of the ball, other than the key to me seems to be "who can do a better job of using its defensive strengths best?"  For both teams this means trying to contest enough shots to keep shooting percentages below 40%.  For Wooster in particular, winning with its defensive strength means controlling the glass.  Wabash's great strength is defending the 3—there is an 16% gap between what 'Bash typically allows (26%) and what Wooster typically makes (42%).  Which number Wooster is closer to tomorrow will say a lot about the Scots' chances.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2011, 10:38:07 PM
Massey ratings have Wooster ranked #6 and Wabash #7 among Division III teams.

Here is the link: http://www.masseyratings.com

If you double click on Wooster, their schedule pops up and you can see that Massey only gives Wooster a 41% chance of winning tomorrow's game (Wabash home court).  Massey's predicted score is:  Wabash 63  Wooster 60
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 07, 2011, 10:41:04 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2011, 10:38:07 PM
Massey ratings have Wooster ranked #6 and Wabash #7 among Division III teams.

Here is the link: http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&yr=2011&sub=NCAA III&mid=1

If you double click on Wooster, their schedule pops up and you can see that Massey only gives Wooster a 41% chance of winning tomorrow's game (Wabash home court).  Massey's predicted score is:  Wabash 63  Wooster 60

Part of that is that Massey ranks Wabash as particularly good at home.  The LGs have a +3.74 point "home advantage" stat, good for 26th in all of DIII.  (Wooster, by comparison, has a +3.00 advantage, good for 117th).

We had that brief debate over the toughest place to play...Massey seems to suggest that Wabash might be on that list...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 07, 2011, 10:47:03 PM
Elsewhere...

Hiram's surprising loss to Kenyon makes tomorrow's game at Wittenberg almost as huge as that other game.  Wittenberg needs the win to keep pace with the Wab/Woo winner, while Hiram needs the win to maintain any shot at a top-3 finish.  Witt is riding a four-game win streak, while Hiram has lost their past two games, both of them winnable.

If Kenyon can pull off the road win in Meadville, the Lords suddenly become an unexpected player for that #4 seed.  I wish I'd kept the poll results; I just remember that Kenyon was down with Oberlin and Denison and not up with Hiram and OWU in that election.

Gheny and Denison (and, well, Oberlin too) need every win they can get at this point in the campaign.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2011, 10:53:15 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 07, 2011, 10:33:53 PM
Here's my two cents on game previews:

Comparing offenses:
The key strength of the Scots offense, and what could make it hard for even Wabash's excellent defense to defend, is how well the Scots can spread its scoring around.  All the Scots starters average over 8 ppg; only two of Wabash's starters hit that mark.  Further, and this is just kinda ridiculous, but true: four of the Scots starters average better than 43% from distance; only AJ Sutherlin hits at that 3pt percentage for the LGs.

Wabash's offense works the other way 'round.  Not only has Wes Smith led the LGs in scoring in every game this season, and scored 1/3 of Wabash's total points this year, but also no one else on the roster seems to really be able to step up and have a dominant offensive performance with him, or instead of him.  The LGs have had only two 15+ point performances by anyone not named Wes Smith (Zinnerman once and Sutherlin once).  Contrast that with Wooster: by my count, the Scots have had thirteen 15+ point performances by players not named Ian Franks.

kiltedbryan - great point about Wooster's scoring balance.  Let's hope that is the difference factor tomorrow! :) ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2011, 10:58:09 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 07, 2011, 10:47:03 PM
If Kenyon can pull off the road win in Meadville, the Lords suddenly become an unexpected player for that #4 seed.  I wish I'd kept the poll results; I just remember that Kenyon was down with Oberlin and Denison and not up with Hiram and OWU in that election.

David - your wish is granted!  ;) ;D

Wooster was picked 1st in the NCAC preseason coaches poll released today.  The Scots garnered 8 of the 9 first place votes and Wittenberg picked up the remaining first place vote.

Here is the full list:

1. Wooster (8)      80 points
2. Wittenberg (1)  70 pts
3. Ohio Wesleyan  56 pts
4. Wabash           55 pts
5. Hiram              48 pts
6. Denison           37 pts
7. Allegheny        27 pts
8. Kenyon           18 pts
9. Oberlin            14 pts

Here is the link to the release: http://www2.northcoast.org/basketball/poll2010

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 07, 2011, 11:00:30 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2011, 10:53:15 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 07, 2011, 10:33:53 PM
Here's my two cents on game previews:

Comparing offenses:
The key strength of the Scots offense, and what could make it hard for even Wabash's excellent defense to defend, is how well the Scots can spread its scoring around.  All the Scots starters average over 8 ppg; only two of Wabash's starters hit that mark.  Further, and this is just kinda ridiculous, but true: four of the Scots starters average better than 43% from distance; only AJ Sutherlin hits at that 3pt percentage for the LGs.

Wabash's offense works the other way 'round.  Not only has Wes Smith led the LGs in scoring in every game this season, and scored 1/3 of Wabash's total points this year, but also no one else on the roster seems to really be able to step up and have a dominant offensive performance with him, or instead of him.  The LGs have had only two 15+ point performances by anyone not named Wes Smith (Zinnerman once and Sutherlin once).  Contrast that with Wooster: by my count, the Scots have had thirteen 15+ point performances by players not named Ian Franks.

kiltedbryan - great point about Wooster's scoring balance.  Let's hope that is the difference factor tomorrow! :) ;)

A few other random data points.  Smith has scored 15+ in all 13 games (his season low is 15); Franks has done it in 10 (but his season low is 7).  Hallowell comes into tomorrow with an 8-game streak of scoring in double figures.

Wooster has yet to put at least three in double figures in every game so far this season; I could  see that streak ending tomorrow if the 50-60 point game comes to pass.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooHoopsntrack01 on January 07, 2011, 11:26:04 PM
Huuuuuuuuuuuuuuuge game for the Scots manana!  Here's to a great basketball game filled with feisty play right down to the very end.  The cool part about this game is that it is an awesome precursor to next year as well when DePauw enters into the fray. First really big NCAC test for the SCOTS. 

Getterdone Men!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 08, 2011, 12:10:39 AM
While Wooster doesn't live or die with the three, it's an important part of their offense.  This is no secret; it can easily be discerned from either the numbers or by watching them in action.  Some opponents are simply not athletically equipped to take this away from the Scots.  Others who are, or might be, are not willing to pay the price: giving up a certain number of easier inside baskets either on post-ups, penetration, give-and-go's, and back-doors.

I've not seen Wabash play this season.  But given their defensive numbers, especially the opponents' three-point percentage, it certainly seems that they are capable of, and have chosen to, tightly guard the three in most or all of their games.  There's no reason to believe that, tomorrow, they will choose to do otherwise.  Likely, given Wooster's skill set, they will make a concerted effort to do so.  As mentioned above, I believe this is in their best interest, and that it will make it hard on the Scots, doubly so on the road, where hitting from the outside is essential for any team.

One way that Wooster can counter this is to play solid defense themselves (which they likely will) and own their defensive board which will allow them to run.  They've improved their fast break since last season, and even earlier this year.  Getting early offense numbers, if they're able, will allow them the open threes that they need.  An open court game is probably in their best interests.

Because I believe Wooster will get fewer looks at threes than in most games, the match-up between Wes Smith and Ian Franks becomes crucial. Smith is the toughest, and most unique, defender that Franks will encounter all year.  It's not new, we've seen it before.  Franks, with his quick first step, will sometimes beat him off the dribble and even gain a step advantage.  The problem is that against Smith a step is often not enough.  He can recover so quickly and make blocks from behind.  So much depends on whether Franks can draw some fouls and force Smith to the bench.  This, too, has happened before, but it is, of course, a chancy proposition.

I don't think either team will turn the ball over a lot, but shooting percentages will be low.  Neither team will get as many clean open looks at the basket as they generally do.  Whichever ball club makes the most contested shots will win.  I give the Scots a little better than Massey's 41% chance, but still figure Wabash has a slight edge on their home floor.



 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 08, 2011, 01:25:26 AM
I wish so much I could get there. I expect an almost Danny game crowd in there.

But I also implore everyone to be polite and gentile...

...wait...I thought I was talking to my kids for a moment (ages 9 and 5 1/2 - both girls - and very strong and elusive).

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2011, 08:23:49 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2011, 10:58:09 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 07, 2011, 10:47:03 PM
If Kenyon can pull off the road win in Meadville, the Lords suddenly become an unexpected player for that #4 seed.  I wish I'd kept the poll results; I just remember that Kenyon was down with Oberlin and Denison and not up with Hiram and OWU in that election.

David - your wish is granted!  ;) ;D
Ha!  Thanks, but I meant the top-of-this-page poll, the one asking which non-W had the best chance to finish in the top 4.  Hiram ran away with the voting.

Quote from: smedindy on January 08, 2011, 01:25:26 AM
But I also implore everyone to be polite and gentile...
Oy vey!

Well, I wish good games and safe travels to everyone today, and gentlemanly behavior as well.  I'm off to work and will miss all but perhaps the second half of Witt/Hiram. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on January 08, 2011, 09:50:26 AM
Smed Indy

"I expect an almost Dannie game crowd ..."  and "... implore everyone to be polite and gentile ..."?   Are you drinking Dannie Zima? 

Wabash ... be Wabash ... not Dannie-esk.

Go Little Giants ... pack the gym ... be just as supportive as you want in the Wabash robust style.   Bring It On! 

Gee Wiz Batman ... but lets all be polite and gentile ...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 08, 2011, 11:16:44 AM
So...anything important happening around the league today?   :)

Unfortunately, I won't be in attendance at today's game at Chadwick as I'm spending the afternoon in the nation's capital.  Likely won't be catching any of the video feed either, but definitely will be chasing that score all afternoon. 

Good game breakdowns, fellas.  I do think it's a little too easy to write Wabash off as a one trick pony.  The statsheet might lead you to believe that Wabash's offensive scheme is "give it to Wes and watch him score", but that's far from the case.  Wes does get a high percentage of the team's shots and points, but why the heck wouldn't he?  On every game day, he's the best offensive player in the gym...usually by a wide margin.  Why not use that?  I've often wondered why Wabash hasn't been more Wes-centric over the last couple of years...but that's neither here nor there at this point.  Wabash does in fact get big offensive contributions from the rest of the team.  It may not manifest itself in the ppg column, but Wes Smith's teammates have all made huge baskets at crucial times this season.  AJ, AZ, DB, DT, BB...they've all stepped up and made important baskets when the LGs have needed them.  Yes, most of the scoring has gone through Smith, but the supporting cast is certainly capable of scoring the ball when called upon. 

In this game, the product justifies the means.  If you can be good by spreading your scoring around, awesome.  If you can be good by having your stud player score half your team's points, then that's just as awesome.  Wabash and Wooster are both 13-0 using different formulas....one 13-0 isn't any better than another  Should be a fantastic game at Chadwick between two very good teams. 

Go Wabash!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 08, 2011, 01:51:02 PM
Crazy crowd today in Crawfordsville........ One of the greatest things about Wabash..... Support!

Go WABASH!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 08, 2011, 02:01:14 PM
2-0 Wooster, one minute in...

...and then the lights went out.  We're on a (hopefully brief) lighting delay at Chadwick Court.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 08, 2011, 02:01:35 PM
"Shooting the lights out" after one shot?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old wabash on January 08, 2011, 02:27:06 PM
Anyone getting video?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 08, 2011, 02:48:17 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 27  Wabash 26

Wooster is being led by Bryan Wickliffe with 10 points and Ian Franks with 10 points.

Top scorers for Wabash are Aaron Zinnerman with 9 points and Ben Burkett with 5 points.

Wooster outrebounded Wabash 20 to 16 in the half but Scots had 8 turnovers vs. only 4 for the Little Giants.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 08, 2011, 02:49:18 PM
Quote from: old wabash on January 08, 2011, 02:27:06 PM
Anyone getting video?


It's working fine for me.

http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 08, 2011, 02:51:11 PM
Solid first half......  Both defenses playing well.

Wabash needs to make sure they knock down the open looks, the few they are getting, in the 2nd half.  

Smith needs to find his shot.   Need to get AJ on the scoreboard.

Shooting 32% and losing the rebound battle, is not going to get it done in the 2nd Half......  Wabash had a nice energy on the boards early.... me thinks, fouls probably effected the aggressiveness inside towards the end of the half.

Wes needs to get to the line in the 2nd.

WAF!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 08, 2011, 03:03:18 PM
Quote from: wabco on January 08, 2011, 09:50:26 AM
Smed Indy

"I expect an almost Dannie game crowd ..."  and "... implore everyone to be polite and gentile ..."?   Are you drinking Dannie Zima? 

Wabash ... be Wabash ... not Dannie-esk.

Go Little Giants ... pack the gym ... be just as supportive as you want in the Wabash robust style.   Bring It On! 

Gee Wiz Batman ... but lets all be polite and gentile ...

I meant in size and zealotry - not ACT like Dannies. However, some of the shenanigans can get out of hand. You know that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 08, 2011, 03:14:30 PM
Wooster starts the second half strong, 5-8 from the floor with 2 threes.  15-5 run to open the half.

Now 42-31 Wooster, 14:12 left.

49-38 Wooster, 9:30 left.  Key stat:  Ian Franks, 18.  Wes Smith, 8.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 08, 2011, 03:31:58 PM
WAF!

Fueled by Wes Smith finally taking charge,  Wabash pulls within 3 with :23 seconds left.




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 08, 2011, 03:57:02 PM
Final:  #1 Wooster 67  #7 Wabash 65 :)

Huge road win for Wooster! ;D  Scots are the first of the top 3 contenders to score a big road win!

Ian Franks was unstoppable for Wooster with 27 points.  Bryan Wickliffe added 15 points inside.

For Wabash, Wes Smith led with 21 points, Derek Bailey with 11 points and Aaron Zinnerman with 11 points.

Wooster won this game by shooting 48% compared to 33% for Wabash

Wooster is now 14-0, NCAC 5-0. ;D  Next up is Oberlin at home on 1/12

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on January 08, 2011, 03:59:45 PM
Good game Wabash ... too bad you cannot say the same for the referees.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 08, 2011, 04:03:04 PM
Phew, I'm still just exhaling.

Great game by both sides.  I wish Wooster could have held that lead, but credit them for putting themselves in a winning position by getting up by double digits.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 08, 2011, 04:11:45 PM
Denison leading Oberlin by 15 in the 2nd half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 08, 2011, 04:11:58 PM
Quote from: wabco on January 08, 2011, 03:59:45 PM
Good game Wabash ... too bad you cannot say the same for the referees.

Eh, wabco?  Whatcha say?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 08, 2011, 04:13:51 PM
That call after the ref's conference was confusing. I'm not sure what happened there. Not complaining necessarily because I simply don't know what the call actually was. There wasn't a foul there so what could it have been? It didn't make sense. Either way, one call doesn't change a game like this. Wabash waited too long to try to get back into this game.

Kudos to Wooster for taking control right out of halftime. They built and protected their lead for a good long while. Wabash couldn't eat into that lead because Wooster kept answering when they needed to. Seemed like it was never going to get inside 9 points.

Kudos to Wabash for getting back into the game and having a chance to win in the final minute. I just wish they had started that run a minute sooner.

It just goes to show you have to play a perfect game to beat Wooster no matter how good you are. It's never good enough if you don't play perfectly.

Wabash just missed too many shots. LGs outrebounded and had nearly half the turnovers as Wooster.

And I'm really not trying to pick on the kid but Sutherlin went 0-6 a game after going 0-7. You can beat Denison with your third banana throwing up a goose egg but you're not going to beat Wooster. I'm beginning to wonder if Bailey isn't taking that third banana role from AJ here. Bailey was only 2-6 but hit a bunch of FTs and ended up in double digits. Hope AJ can get his stroke back because something is not right.

Great comeback to make an exciting finish. Wabash Always Fights!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 08, 2011, 04:17:54 PM
Quote from: wabco on January 08, 2011, 03:59:45 PM
Good game Wabash ... too bad you cannot say the same for the referees.

I don't blame them, I just want to know what the call was and why the time that expired after the whistle blew was not put back on the clock.  If there was a foul... then fine.... but Wabash stole the ball and missed a shot while running the clock..... (at least 4 seconds)  If you go back to the whistle..... put the time back on the clock. This is obviously not a DI situation.  In DI, the refs would have gone to the monitor and made sure they got everything straight.

The story of this game was Wabash did not shoot well enough...and Wooster did...............Period.

Congrats to the Scots!... Some team.  Congrats to the Little Giants for battling down the stretch and having a shot to win the game as time expires....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 08, 2011, 04:25:00 PM
Steve Moore said in the post-game interview that the refs stopped the game because the Wabash scorekeeper did not start the clock.  So, possession was given back to Wooster, who had the ball at the time of this infraction, and two seconds was removed from the game clock because it should have started.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 08, 2011, 04:26:52 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 08, 2011, 04:13:51 PM
That call after the ref's conference was confusing. I'm not sure what happened there. Not complaining necessarily because I simply don't know what the call actually was. There wasn't a foul there so what could it have been? It didn't make sense. Either way, one call doesn't change a game like this. Wabash waited too long to try to get back into this game.


Quote from: bashbrother on January 08, 2011, 04:17:54 PM
Quote from: wabco on January 08, 2011, 03:59:45 PM
Good game Wabash ... too bad you cannot say the same for the referees.

I don't blame them, I just want to know what the call was and why the time that expired after the whistle blew was not put on the clock.  If there was a foul... then fine.... but Wabash stole the ball and missed a shot running the clock.....  If you go back to the whistle..... put the time back on the clock.


You mean the call right after Ian Franks was tackled and there was no call by the official???

Coach Moore said the reason for the whistle after Wabash missed the shot following the tackle of Franks was that the clock froze.  Wooster had secured the rebound so the refs awarded Wooster the ball after they took the time off the clock.

Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 08, 2011, 04:03:04 PM
Phew, I'm still just exhaling.

Great game by both sides.  I wish Wooster could have held that lead, but credit them for putting themselves in a winning position by getting up by double digits.

No kidding?!  I wish Wooster would stop making these finishes closer than they need to be!  Poor execution to finish games is going to come back to haunt the Scots one of these games.  They finished poorly vs. Wilmington almost blowing a big lead in that game and today's game was eerily similar to that one.

In the end, a win is a win though!  Wooster picks up a big conference ROAD win in a very hostile environment today!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 08, 2011, 04:30:58 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 08, 2011, 11:16:44 AM
On every game day, he's the best offensive player in the gym...usually by a wide margin. 

Ian Franks' 27 points today would suggest otherwise!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 08, 2011, 04:36:25 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 08, 2011, 04:25:00 PMSteve Moore said in the post-game interview that the refs stopped the game because the Wabash scorekeeper did not start the clock.  So, possession was given back to Wooster, who had the ball at the time of this infraction, and two seconds was removed from the game clock because it should have started.

The possession to Wooster I understand if the clock didn't start. But if the clock didn't start, then is it that the play just never happened? Kind of like a false start in football?

Quote from: ScotsFan on January 08, 2011, 04:26:52 PMYou mean the call right after Ian Franks was tackled and there was no call by the official???

There are plenty of missed calls on fouls throughout a game. I'm sure we can each point to several. The FTs and foul calls ended up almost even. Wabash had 19 fouls to Wooster's 20 and Wooster had 24 FTs to Wabash's 21. Seems like a pretty even game to me.

That play sequence was a Mongolian Clusterf@*# from the beginning. And again, I'm not necessarily complaining about it. I just didn't understand what happened.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 08, 2011, 04:42:35 PM
Let's not get into the ridiculous...... Wooster gets shafted by the refs discussion again........

This was a great college basketball game that was not decided by anything else but the players on the court..... Basketball is a physical sport...... There are fouls that don't get called all over the place in every game.......

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bearman17 on January 08, 2011, 05:17:12 PM
I will agree the whole conference thing by the refs was a little confusing, but as has already been stated here one call didn't win or lose this game. Wabash still had a good look and it appeared Smith's three at the buzzer was dead on. It was but just a little too hard as it hit the back of the rim from 30 feet out.

Bottom line was it was a GREAT Div. III game. If Woosters is the No. 1 team the polls have Wabash about right. Wabash should fall much below maybe No. 10.

Whta great atomsphere. It was just like a playoffs game. Standing room only and that was with the Wabash student body not back from break yet. Great support. Great game played by two very solid teams and two of the best coaches in the country (nearly 1,200 career wins between them).

This is what D3 athletics is all about and anyone who was there got to see a great game.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 08, 2011, 05:25:34 PM
Sounds like we had a tremendous college basketball game this afternoon at Chadwick!  Unfortunately, the LGs came up jus short, but that's the game sometimes. This result doesn't tarnish the start to this season nor should it tarnish the rest of what I believe will continue to be a very successful season. Sometimes the shots don't fall...such is basketball.  Congrats to the Scots on a good win today. I can't wait to watch this one on the YouTubes when I get back to the heartland.

WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 08, 2011, 05:29:12 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on January 08, 2011, 04:36:25 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 08, 2011, 04:25:00 PMSteve Moore said in the post-game interview that the refs stopped the game because the Wabash scorekeeper did not start the clock.  So, possession was given back to Wooster, who had the ball at the time of this infraction, and two seconds was removed from the game clock because it should have started.

The possession to Wooster I understand if the clock didn't start. But if the clock didn't start, then is it that the play just never happened? Kind of like a false start in football?


No.  The play happened.  Wabash stole the inbounds pass, missed a layup and Wooster corralled the rebound.  Then the officials realized the clock had not started so they blew the whistle and in their huddle determined the amount of time that should be removed.  And since Wooster had the ball at the time of the stoppage, they were awarded the ball.

Quote from: bashbrother on January 08, 2011, 04:42:35 PM
Let's not get into the ridiculous...... Wooster gets shafted by the refs discussion again........

This was a great college basketball game that was not decided by anything else but the players on the court..... Basketball is a physical sport...... There are fouls that don't get called all over the place in every game.......



I was simply pointing out to your buddy wabco that not all the calls went against your Little Giants as he seemed to imply...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on January 08, 2011, 05:40:02 PM
Explanation from the referee to the media representative (that was me) on the final few seconds of play: The clock stopped properly after the made basket by Wabash with less than a minute in the game. The clock did not restart when Wooster inbounded the basketball quickly. This is a correctable error situation. The play was reset to the situation that existed when Wabash made the basket. Therefor there was no turnover or steal or shot by Wabash. The officials had discussed this possibility during a timeout, and had checked with us at the table for the possibility of replay. However, the game clock does not automatically tie into our video system, so replay was not an option.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 08, 2011, 06:08:31 PM
Quote from: wabashsid on January 08, 2011, 05:40:02 PM
Explanation from the referee to the media representative (that was me) on the final few seconds of play: The clock stopped properly after the made basket by Wabash with less than a minute in the game. The clock did not restart when Wooster inbounded the basketball quickly. This is a correctable error situation. The play was reset to the situation that existed when Wabash made the basket. Therefor there was no turnover or steal or shot by Wabash. The officials had discussed this possibility during a timeout, and had checked with us at the table for the possibility of replay. However, the game clock does not automatically tie into our video system, so replay was not an option.

So, why did they still  take time off the clock if this was the case? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2011, 07:11:11 PM
Quote from: Bearman17 on January 08, 2011, 05:17:12 PM
I will agree the whole conference thing by the refs was a little confusing, but as has already been stated here one call didn't win or lose this game. Wabash still had a good look and it appeared Smith's three at the buzzer was dead on. It was but just a little too hard as it hit the back of the rim from 30 feet out.

Bottom line was it was a GREAT Div. III game. If Woosters is the No. 1 team the polls have Wabash about right. Wabash should fall much below maybe No. 10.

Whta great atomsphere. It was just like a playoffs game. Standing room only and that was with the Wabash student body not back from break yet. Great support. Great game played by two very solid teams and two of the best coaches in the country (nearly 1,200 career wins between them).

This is what D3 athletics is all about and anyone who was there got to see a great game.



Great first post, Bearman17.  Here's your first karma point.  Thanks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2011, 07:38:27 PM
Saturday games:

Wooster 67, Wabash 65
Denison 76, Oberlin 65
Allegheny 80, Kenyon 76
Wittenberg 68, Hiram 59

Updated NCAC Standings with 1/8 Results:

1.  Wittenberg 5-0, 9-4
1.  Wooster 5-0, 14-0
3.  Wabash 5-1, 13-1
4.  Kenyon 2-3, 6-8
4.  Ohio Wesleyan 2-3, 6-8
6.  Allegheny 2-4, 5-9
6.  Denison 2-4, 5-9
8.  Hiram 1-4, 7-7
9.  Oberlin 0-5, 1-12
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on January 08, 2011, 07:43:15 PM
Officials said no time came off. One official was watching the click and said clock should be set to 4.9 after the made basket by Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2011, 08:40:52 PM
New poll, actually NCAC-related.  :)  Please vote, even if you think none of these upsets will happen.  Which is the most likely?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 09, 2011, 11:13:37 AM
A few other thoughts after Wooster's big road win over Wabash:

Wooster won this game with good defense because they held Wabash to only 33% FG shooting on their home floor.  A good example of the defensive effort was the job on Wes Smith who was only 7 of 21 from the floor.

Scots fans should be thankful once again to have Ian Franks as our top player. :)  Franks was 11 of 22 from the floor for 27 points and he also had 10 rebounds, 3 assists.  He stepped up his game when it was needed most by scoring 17 points in the 2nd half.

Kudos to Wabash on their late game rally which nearly pulled off the upset.  "Wabash always Fights" was certainly true yesterday and the Little Giants are very deserving of their #7 national ranking.

IF Wooster can beat Oberlin on Wednesday, they will be 15-0 which will be the best start to a season ever in the history of Scots basketball! ;)  Pretty impressive when you think of Wooster's historical success on the hardwood.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 09, 2011, 12:56:58 PM
FOR THE WIN!!!!....... That was very close!

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.wabash.edu%2Fimages2%2Fphoto_album%2F2687%2Fmain_Just%2520missed%2520%281%291.jpg&hash=806274363fd60f7f6042f1c834c282647401887c)

Full recap - http://wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=8588

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 09, 2011, 04:50:24 PM
Looks like the refs tried to get it right as best they could. But Wabash shouldn't have been in that dire of a situation anyway.

They need to regroup and concentrate on the next game.

This is going to be a fun year, and just wait until the Dannies get in here next year!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 09, 2011, 07:00:47 PM
Looks like a HUGE game is looming a week from this Wednesday in Springfield as Wabash comes to town. That is if Wittenberg can get away with a road win at Kenyon this week. That game will be even bigger for Wabash as getting 2 conference losses will be very detrimental.

Still no idea on Josh Mckee's status, It'd be nice to get him back soon. Same for David Hieber, but I'd guess he'll be back either Wednesday or next Saturday
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 09, 2011, 09:12:08 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 09, 2011, 07:00:47 PM
Looks like a HUGE game is looming a week from this Wednesday in Springfield as Wabash comes to town.

pennstghs - that whole week is HUGE for Wittenberg.  Witt hosts Wabash on 1/19 then plays at Wooster on 1/22! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bash Brother 2000 on January 09, 2011, 11:56:21 PM
According to Mac Petty, Wes was only 75% of himself since he was battling the flu.  What a break for Wooster!  I believe he should try to get more of his teammates involved in the scoring.  Someone else besides Wes need to put up some points.  Courush and Burkett must do more inside and finish their shots.  A couple of times it appeared Courush was afraid to shoot and if he had turnaround to the basket, it would have been some very easy shots. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bash Brother 2000 on January 10, 2011, 12:05:49 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 08, 2011, 04:30:58 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 08, 2011, 11:16:44 AM
On every game day, he's the best offensive player in the gym...usually by a wide margin. 

Ian Franks' 27 points today would suggest otherwise!  ;D

Wally said it right and nothing mean about Ian Franks....great player too!  However, no excuses here, a healthy Wes would had lead to a different outcome.  Can't wait for the rematch on 2/5!!!!   :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashtownie on January 10, 2011, 11:44:46 AM
I've never seen Chadwick so packed.

Rarely does a home crowd leave a game smiling after a loss, but that was certainly my impression after the game. While no Wabash fans were happy that the team lost, I think most people were happy to be able to watch such a great contest.

Wooster absolutely shot the lights out for a while in the second half, even on contested shots.

They're good.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 10, 2011, 04:20:36 PM
Quote from: Bash Brother 2000 on January 10, 2011, 12:05:49 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 08, 2011, 04:30:58 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 08, 2011, 11:16:44 AM
On every game day, he's the best offensive player in the gym...usually by a wide margin.  

Ian Franks' 27 points today would suggest otherwise!  ;D

Wally said it right and nothing mean about Ian Franks....great player too!  However, no excuses here, a healthy Wes would had lead to a different outcome.  Can't wait for the rematch on 2/5!!!!   :o

Having been able to watch Smith and Franks compete against each other for the last three years, and really in earnest over the last two seasons, my feeling is that these two are extremely similar players.  Both can create their own shot on the drive, both have respectable range on their jumpshots (slight edge to Franks here I think), both are excellent defenders (slight edge to Smith here I think)...I think if these two were to swap places, you could probably switch their stat lines.  At Wabash, Franks would be asked to score a little more than he does at Wooster.  At Wooster, Smith would blend a little more offensively, but when they need a bucket, he'd be the guy that gets the shot.  Both are great players and it's silly to try and argue that one is better than the other, particularly based on the stat line from one game out of the 100 or so that these two will have each played in college.  

Of course, ScotsFan is smart enough to know all of this, but couldn't resist taking a shot at me.  That's fine...the Scots have scoreboard and to the victor go the spoils.  For most, being able to watch a team that wins the league every single year, wins the conference tournament most years, and not only gets to the NCAAs every year but also usually gets to host a round or two would be enough...but for some that isn't enough.  For some, the novelty of all of that winning has worn thin and they want to get all Romper Room with it and play the neener-neener card.  Wouldn't be my choice, but if that's how he wants to carry it, that's his prerogative...the Scots have scoreboard and that's the way it goes.  Me, I'm just thrilled that there was a classic game between top 10 teams played in front of the first truly packed house at Chadwick since the Allen Center renovations and I'm excited to see at least one (hopefully two!) more games between these two excellent teams and their two star players.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2011, 04:27:04 PM
With the 1988 national championship OWU team set to enter the Ohio Basketball Hall of Fame this spring, we take time to mourn the passing of one of this team's players, David Parker (http://bishops.owu.edu/david_parker.html).  RIP.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 10, 2011, 05:13:03 PM
And now, Wabash enters the slog. Not that the LG's are a fluke, but there are plenty of trouble spots ahead.

A. A long trip to Allegheny. Their routine will no doubt be disturbed with a Friday bus ride across Ohio and into PA to play a Saturday game.

B. A trip to Wittenberg. 'Nuf said. I don't care if Witt is 0-fer, they're going to defend their home court like there is no tomorrow, and all those other cliches.

C. At Oberlin, which I never take for granted. I've seen it too many times that an LG team falls on the road to a bottom NCAC team. Please, not this year guys.

D. A trip to OWU. The Bishops are disappointing, yes, which means that they'll want redemption. What better redemption than knocking off a ranked team at home?

The one thing about this Wabash team is that their strength is defense, and that can make up for any offensive issues that result from road trips.

Come out of this four game stretch 3-1 and I feel really good about Wabash the rest of the year into the NCAC tourney and (dare I say...) further action.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 10, 2011, 05:24:07 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 10, 2011, 05:13:03 PM
And now, Wabash enters the slog. Not that the LG's are a fluke, but there are plenty of trouble spots ahead.

A. A long trip to Allegheny. Their routine will no doubt be disturbed with a Friday bus ride across Ohio and into PA to play a Saturday game.

B. A trip to Wittenberg. 'Nuf said. I don't care if Witt is 0-fer, they're going to defend their home court like there is no tomorrow, and all those other cliches.

C. At Oberlin, which I never take for granted. I've seen it too many times that an LG team falls on the road to a bottom NCAC team. Please, not this year guys.

D. A trip to OWU. The Bishops are disappointing, yes, which means that they'll want redemption. What better redemption than knocking off a ranked team at home?

The one thing about this Wabash team is that their strength is defense, and that can make up for any offensive issues that result from road trips.

Come out of this four game stretch 3-1 and I feel really good about Wabash the rest of the year into the NCAC tourney and (dare I say...) further action.

Wooster plus four straight roadies is indeed the tough stretch.  This group has enough experience to know how to handle the road.  I would just ask the bus driver to make a quick stop through Franklin and pick up Sutherlin's jumper.  Seems he may have left it there after the game on 12/29 and Wabash is going to need it if they're going to make a run at this thing. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2011, 06:31:38 PM
New poll is out. (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/index)
Wooster solidifies its #1 ranking, now with 19 first place votes and 617 points (gain of 16 points; unanimous would be 625).  Wabash stays put at #7; they passed nobody, and nobody passed them, but the LGs did lose 20 poll points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 10, 2011, 07:27:04 PM
The new Massey  (http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&yr=2011&sub=NCAA%20III&mid=1) ratings are out, too.  Wooster moves up two spots to 4th, Wabash drops three places to 10th.  According to Massey, Wooster now has a 70% chance of beating Wabash at home and a 46% chance of running the regular season table.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2011, 07:55:20 PM
Back in action tomorrow, except for Wabash:

Denison at OWU, 7:30pm -- audio/video and live stats (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1)
Oberlin at Wooster, 7:30pm -- audio and live stats (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule)
Allegheny at Hiram, ~8pm -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html) -- Game 2 of W/M doubleheader
Wittenberg at Kenyon, ~8pm -- audio/video and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml) -- follows immediately after Wooster/Kenyon women's game (6pm)

Reminder of the current standings:
1.  Wittenberg 5-0, 9-4
1.  Wooster 5-0, 14-0
3.  Wabash 5-1, 13-1
4.  Kenyon 2-3, 6-8
4.  Ohio Wesleyan 2-3, 6-8
6.  Allegheny 2-4, 5-9
6.  Denison 2-4, 5-9
8.  Hiram 1-4, 7-7
9.  Oberlin 0-5, 1-12

Oberlin's men play undefeated and #1-ranked Wooster, while Oberlin's women play undefeated and #21-ranked Denison at the same time.  Could be a long night for the Yeo--or maybe the greatest night in Yeo athletics in many years?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 12, 2011, 08:02:55 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 46  Oberlin 22

Wooster is being led in scoring by Nathan Balch 11 and Ian Franks 7

Geofff Simpson is top scorer for the Yeomen with 8 points.

Wooster shot 64% in the half compared to only 32% for Oberlin
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 12, 2011, 08:13:11 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 12, 2011, 08:02:55 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 46  Oberlin 22

Wooster is being led in scoring by Nathan Balch 11 and Ian Franks 7

Geofff Simpson is top scorer for the Yeomen with 8 points.

Wooster shot 64% in the half compared to only 32% for Oberlin

Not too much to say about this one. Oberlin made their only 2-pt FG with only 44 seconds left in the half. Massey had the Scots winning by about 45 with 100% chance of victory. Looks like they might be pretty close.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2011, 08:42:32 PM
Other halftime scores:
OWU 39, Denison 32 -- but Denison has come back, and the game is tied at 51 with 10:12 left
Wittenberg 42, Kenyon 33
Hiram 50, Allegheny 31 -- Allegheny shot 50% in the half and trails by 19.  :o  Hiram is on fire in every phase of this game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2011, 08:44:16 PM
Here's a great video about the Scots' penchant for solving Rubik's Cube.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2KHqkwfFoE&feature=player_profilepage
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 12, 2011, 08:56:22 PM
Final:  Wooster 82  Oberlin 55  :)

Wooster's top scorers:  Nathan Balch 23, Ian Franks 11.   Balch was 9 of 12 from the floor with 5 three pointers. :)
Oberlin's top scorers:  Andrew Fox 13, Josh Merritt 13, Geoff Simpson 11

Scots shot 56% from the floor and easily outrebounded the Yeomen 32 to 23.

Wooster is now 15-0, 6-0 NCAC ;D  Congratulations to Coach Moore and the entire team on setting a new Wooster record for the best start ever 15-0 to a basketball season.

Next game at Denison on 1/15.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2011, 09:06:09 PM
OWU pulls away again, and holds off Denison at home, 71-62.  Tim Brady with 23 and Greg White with 19 provided about two-thirds of the Bishops' offense.  

Watching Kenyon/Witt, and it looks like Kenyon only has 10 players dressed.  Wonder what's up with that.  Witt leads by 4 with 10+ left.

Hiram continues to blast away at 'Gheny, 69-45 wih 12:29 left. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 12, 2011, 09:36:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 12, 2011, 09:06:09 PM
Hiram continues to blast away at 'Gheny, 69-45 wih 12:29 left. 

Getting rid of some frustration after the 1-4 start?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2011, 09:39:39 PM
Hiram 93, Allegheny 68 -- 'Gheny hit 50% of their shots in each half, had 6 threes, recorded 18 assists on 29 hoops, and got drilled.  "It doesn't matter whether the pitcher hits the stone, or the stone hits the pitcher; it's going to be bad for the pitcher."  Hiram's stats look like this:  58% FG, 55% 3PFG (12/22), +8 rebound margin, +9 turnover margin (17 vs. 9), largest lead was 30 with under 2 minutes left.  Five Terriers in double figures, led by Hassan Muhammad's double-double (19 & 11).  Seth Eisner had 19 for 'Gheny, and Devone McLeod had a nice 14 point, 7 assist evening.

Wittenberg 90, Kenyon 82 -- Kenyon and Witt traded the lead back and forth until there were something like 6 minutes left, and then Witt used a 9-0 run beginning at 4:18 to secure the win, holding off a late KC charge.  Sullivan was unconscious from NBA depths, hitting 7 of twelve for 21 points.  Four other Tigers reached double figures in scoring.  Kodey Haddox had 28 to lead all scorers; he's always been unconscious.

Updated standings:
1.  Wittenberg 6-0, 10-4
1.  Wooster 6-0, 15-0
3.  Wabash 5-1, 13-1
4.  Ohio Wesleyan 3-3, 7-8
5.  Kenyon 2-4, 6-9
5.  Hiram 2-4, 8-7
7.  Allegheny 2-5, 5-10
7.  Denison 2-5, 5-10
9.  Oberlin 0-6, 1-13
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2011, 09:53:09 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 11, 2011, 07:55:20 PM
Oberlin's men play undefeated and #1-ranked Wooster, while Oberlin's women play undefeated and #21-ranked Denison at the same time.  Could be a long night for the Yeo--or maybe the greatest night in Yeo athletics in many years?
The Yeopeople combined to go 0-2 by a combined score of 147-90. 
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fill-violated-dead-smiley-9436.gif&hash=6330bdec91073e72ba1b832817564069759f9252)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 12, 2011, 10:13:04 PM
I watched the video of the OWU vs DU game.  Denison put up a good fight.  Greg White had a killer game and Brady knocked down the threes when they were needed.  OWU played the game they needed to win.

For DU, offense continues to be the main problem.  The defense played well in the second half and held the points down to keep them in the game.  The Big Red just can't get their offense going, though.  Perimeter ball movement as they try to get the ball into the post is sluggish.  As a result, any shots - inside or outside - are usually under pressure.   

Three pt. pct (OWU 62% vs DU 22%) and FT pct (OWU 62% vs DU 36%) were the big difference from a stats perspective, but DU's ability to move the ball against a zone defense seemed the real killer.  For a while, when DU brought in big freshman Ted Vernon to spell a foul-plagued Hale, they moved the ball into the high post and worked against the zone the way you're supposed to.  Even though it was working, they didn't stay with it and Vernon wasn't seen at all in the second half.  They stayed for too long with a small, three guard perimeter offense that wasn't getting good open looks or hitting their shots. 

The Big Red need to use whatever size they have whenever they can, but seem to spend more time with a small, three guard attack.  I'm hoping we can get Farmer back some time soon.  If he comes back, we can get a two guard, three wing offense back, use Dimonde and Larry from perimeter positions in a motion to slash to the basket and maybe get some scoring from a stagnant offense. 
 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoostAr on January 13, 2011, 03:18:42 AM
Interesting spotlight video on 6 wooster basketball players and the rubiks cube of all things on wooster athletics website.

http://www.woosterathletics.com/landing/index
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 13, 2011, 08:31:43 AM
I had a great conversation last weekend with some former division III players.  It was fun to listen to their opinions on coaches they played for, coaches they played against, and current coaches they watch today.  They classified teams that win in three ways:
1)  teams who win because of their coach (equal or worse talent yet the coach finds a way to win the majority of those games)
2) teams who win WITH their coach (teams who play hard and the coach uses the talent he has in the best way - everyone has bought in to the system and their roles- these are the most successful teams yearly and have an established program.  they compete for a league championship almost every year)
3)  teams who win despite of their coach (coaches who usually have the best talent on the floor most nights.  these teams end up only average to good almost every year as they underachieve with the talent they have.  these coaches/teams usually beat the bad teams but cant beat the best teams even though they have the talent to compete with them.  occasionally, they get hot and place in the top 2 in the league but are normally a 3rd-5th place team). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 13, 2011, 10:16:19 AM
Quote from: WoostAr on January 13, 2011, 03:18:42 AM
Interesting spotlight video on 6 wooster basketball players and the rubiks cube of all things on wooster athletics website.

http://www.woosterathletics.com/landing/index

Even better the second time around!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on January 13, 2011, 03:55:53 PM
Wabash head basketball coach Mac Petty will be on the first hour of tonight's Hoopsville broadcast.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 13, 2011, 04:15:03 PM
Quote from: wabashsid on January 13, 2011, 03:55:53 PM
Wabash head basketball coach Mac Petty will be on the first hour of tonight's Hoopsville broadcast.

As a return guest to Hoopsville, I think they should name his segment tonight "Return of the Mac".   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 14, 2011, 03:33:24 PM
The first two games mentioned in the poll are approaching, so I've locked the voting.  I'll immortalize the results, and we'll see if any of them came true.

OWU over Wabash, 1/26 -- 8 votes
Allegheny over Wabash, 1/15 -- 7 votes
Hiram over Wooster, 2/2 -- 6 votes
Denison over Wooster, 1/15 -- 3 votes

Thanks for participating!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 14, 2011, 03:40:07 PM
Saturday's slate:

Wabash at Allegheny, 1pm -- live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)
Kenyon at Oberlin, 1pm -- video and live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/) -- Game 1 of a doubleheader; women vs. 'Gheny follows
Wooster at Denison, ~3pm -- live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html); audio (http://wkvx.com/) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
OWU at Hiram, ~3pm -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Ohio Northern at Wittenberg, 3pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/) -- NCAC non-con record stands at 42-36

I may not be around for several days, so enjoy the games!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 15, 2011, 01:44:28 PM
Wabash 80
Allegheny 58

FINAL

Wes Smith 32 Points - DUNK!  - Turnovers killed Gheny (22)

AJ Sutherlin - makes two - 3 pt Jumpers!!!!!!!

What a way for Wabash to step up after the loss to Wooster..... great road win for the Little Giants a long way from homeQ


Kenyon 62
Oberlin 49

Late 2nd - Up early, Oberlin's upset bid is done
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2011, 02:57:48 PM
Nice road win for Wabash as Meadville can be a tough place to get a victory.

Final:  Kenyon 71  Oberlin 56    Lords led by Uros Vasiljevik with 13 points;  Geoff Simpson led Oberlin with 13.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 15, 2011, 03:15:17 PM
As I was listening to the pregame show, Mike Breckenridge mentioned that if OSU won today they would likely be #1 in the nation.  So I thought, Wooster is #1 in D3, OSU is #1 in DI and if Findlay hadn't lost last week (they had been #1 in D2), the state of Ohio could have been home to the #1 basketball team in all divisions of the NCAA!   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 15, 2011, 03:33:30 PM
Someone take the lid off the Scots' basket already!   :-\

Wooster jumps out to a 14-4 lead and then have proceeded to miss 10 of their last 11 and Denison has scored 13 straight to take the lead in this one!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2011, 03:44:28 PM
At the Half:  Denison 28  Wooster 27

Justin Hallowell is leading Wooster with 15 points and Bryan Wickliffe has 4 points, 9 boards.

For Denison, Dimonde Hale has 9 points and Alex Longi has added 6 points.

Wooster shot only 27% in the half. :(  Scots did outrebound the Big Red 28 to 16.  Ian Franks has 3 fouls.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 15, 2011, 03:50:16 PM
Good thing Hallowell made the trip today.  He is 4-7 from the field (all 3-point attempts).  Meanwhile the rest of the Scots are just 4-23 from the field!   :o

Part of Wooster's woes this afternoon is the fact that Ian Franks has been saddled with foul trouble (3 fouls - 2 offensive) and has only played 11 minutes in the first half and has only 2 points!

I might be able to hear Moore in the Wooster lockerroom at halftime down in Granville all the way up here in Wooster!   :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 15, 2011, 03:57:59 PM
I think the Scots will be OK as long as they can minimize their turnovers and keep up their rebounding advantage.

Likely that the Scots won't follow up a 27% shooting half with another one.  It sounded like they had plenty of good looks, just weren't hitting them in the first half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 15, 2011, 04:18:36 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 15, 2011, 03:57:59 PM
I think the Scots will be OK as long as they can minimize their turnovers and keep up their rebounding advantage.

Looks like you were right.  Wooster is now in the midst of an 11-0 run and now lead 47-40! 8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2011, 04:43:24 PM
Final:  Wooster 72  Denison 64  :)

Scots escape Granville with a road win despite an ugly shooting performance.  Less than 40%.

Wooster's top scorers:  Justin Hallowell 20, Nathan Balch 15, Ian Franks 14  Wickliffe with 15 Boards

Denison's top scorers:  Dimonde Hale 18, Alex Longi 12, Mike Garabedian 10

Wooster won this game with good defense and by winning the rebound battle.

Wooster is now 16-0, 7-0 NCAC ;D  Next game is Allegheny at home on 1/19

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2011, 04:45:17 PM
All the NCAC 1/15 Final Scores:

Wooster 72  Denison 64
Wittenberg 73  Ohio Northern 60
Ohio Wesleyan 71  Hiram 58
Kenyon 71  Oberlin 56
Wabash 80  Allegheny 58
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2011, 04:47:53 PM
Current NCAC Standings with 1/15 Results:

1. Wooster 7-0, 16-0
2. Wittenberg 6-0, 11-4
3. Wabash 6-1, 14-1
4. Ohio Wesleyan 4-3, 8-8
5. Kenyon 3-4, 7-9
6. Hiram 2-5, 8-8
7. Allegheny 2-6, 5-11
7. Denison 2-6, 5-11
9. Oberlin 0-7, 1-15
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 15, 2011, 04:54:31 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2011, 04:43:24 PM
Scots escape Granville with a road win despite an ugly shooting performance.  Less than 40%.


Wooster did play much better offensively  as they were able to shoot around 50% in the 2nd half after only shooting 27% in the fist half.  Wooster also turned around and scored 45 second half points after being held to just 27 in the first half. 

Of course, Franks and Balch were held to 2 points apiece in that first half and both of Wooster's top 2 scoreres went off for 12 and 13 second half points respectively which contributed to Wooster's improvement on the offensive end in the second half as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 16, 2011, 02:22:19 AM
Well W Week for Witt Round 1 begins now, can't wait for Wednesday!!! Any 'Bash supporters going to be in town for the game? If so, I'd love to meet ya!

I think Witt has a chance provided we get some help with hopefully a cold shooting Wabash team. Its worked in the past to let Wes Smith go crazy and have everyone else neutralized as one player won't score you a win, but we'll see if the youth of Witt comes back to bite them. They've held serve on their home court all year so far.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 16, 2011, 10:08:28 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 16, 2011, 02:22:19 AM
Well W Week for Witt Round 1 begins now, can't wait for Wednesday!!! Any 'Bash supporters going to be in town for the game? If so, I'd love to meet ya!

I think Witt has a chance provided we get some help with hopefully a cold shooting Wabash team. Its worked in the past to let Wes Smith go crazy and have everyone else neutralized as one player won't score you a win, but we'll see if the youth of Witt comes back to bite them. They've held serve on their home court all year so far.

I'm really looking forward to this game.  This is Witt's chance to really prove that they truly in the mix for this NCAC race.  I know Witt is tied for first in the league, but the only pre-season top 4 team they have beaten in conference play so far is OWU and that was at HPER.  Wabash has played Wooster and OWU going 1-1 at home vs those two.  Wooster, on the other hand has already played and beaten 2 teams from the pre-season top 4 and both of those were road wins.

Clearly, Wooster has the early upper hand with their road wins at OWU and at Wabash.  But Witt could do some serious damage this week if they were able to find a way to knock off Wabash and win on the road in Wooster on Saturday!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 16, 2011, 10:51:31 AM
Remaining Road Games for Top 3 Contenders:

Wooster - 4
at Kenyon 1/26
at Hiram 2/2
at Oberlin 2/9
at Wittenberg 2/12

Wittenberg - 5
at Wooster 1/22
at Oberlin 1/29
at Ohio Wesleyan 2/9
at Wabash 2/16
at Hiram 2/19

Wabash - 5
at Wittenberg 1/19
at Oberlin 1/22
at Ohio Wesleyan 1/26
at Denison 2/2
at Wooster 2/5
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 16, 2011, 12:51:25 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 15, 2011, 03:15:17 PM
As I was listening to the pregame show, Mike Breckenridge mentioned that if OSU won today they would likely be #1 in the nation.  So I thought, Wooster is #1 in D3, OSU is #1 in DI and if Findlay hadn't lost last week (they had been #1 in D2), the state of Ohio could have been home to the #1 basketball team in all divisions of the NCAA!   8-)

Does Aaron Dorksen of the Wooster Daily Record get story ideas from ScotsFan? :P ;D

Dorksen posted a story about Ohio being #1 this week in college hoops noting 18-0 Ohio State will be #1 in D1, 16-0 Wooster is #1 in D3 and 18-0 Walsh is #1 in NAIA D2.  :)  He also mentions Findlay's recent loss which dropped them out of the #1 ranking in D2.

Here is the link to Dorksen's story: http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4964839
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 16, 2011, 03:05:57 PM
Maybe I should start asking for a consulting fee!   :P   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 16, 2011, 03:21:00 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 16, 2011, 03:05:57 PM
Maybe I should start asking for a consulting fee!   :P   ;D

Copyright your posts - then you can sue him! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on January 16, 2011, 06:04:25 PM
DR writers frequent message boards.  It wouldn't surprise me one bit.

:-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 18, 2011, 04:54:52 PM
So, where's the hoopla for Wabash @ Witt? While a loss to Witt at Witt won't be the end of the world for 'Bash, it would make it harder to get the #1 seed for the tourney, and maybe even a #2.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 18, 2011, 05:09:54 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 18, 2011, 04:54:52 PM
So, where's the hoopla for Wabash @ Witt? While a loss to Witt at Witt won't be the end of the world for 'Bash, it would make it harder to get the #1 seed for the tourney, and maybe even a #2.

Tomorrow night's game doesn't rate.  Wittenberg needs to be focused on Saturday.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 18, 2011, 05:21:47 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 18, 2011, 05:09:54 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 18, 2011, 04:54:52 PM
So, where's the hoopla for Wabash @ Witt? While a loss to Witt at Witt won't be the end of the world for 'Bash, it would make it harder to get the #1 seed for the tourney, and maybe even a #2.

Tomorrow night's game doesn't rate.  Wittenberg needs to be focused on Saturday.   :)

Most years that might happen.  I tend to think Witt will not allow itself to overlook the #7 ranked team in the country just because the NEXT game is arch-rival, #1 ranked, Woo! ;)

Regardless of rivalries, seeing a game against #7 in the nation as a 'trap game' just doesn't cut it with me!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 18, 2011, 05:35:20 PM
Ha!

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F29.media.tumblr.com%2FgeWPMeIaZmtnpdu5syEGI8gTo1_400.jpg&hash=feb283ee62461fcc62b3716c6d6b3211634ec12e)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 18, 2011, 05:38:04 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 18, 2011, 05:35:20 PM
Ha!

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F29.media.tumblr.com%2FgeWPMeIaZmtnpdu5syEGI8gTo1_400.jpg&hash=feb283ee62461fcc62b3716c6d6b3211634ec12e)

brilliant
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 18, 2011, 10:01:46 PM
I think besides myself the reason the boards are quiet is 1-DCollinge is out and 2-Wabash fans don't want to admit that this game is a HUGE game for them and in the long run although its a must win really for both teams, a loss by Wabash would be more detrimental to them than a loss by Wittenberg.

Let me explain: Wabash loses this game to go 2 back in the conference race and having lost to both the teams ahead of them, this means that they would have to most likely win home vs Witt (probable to happen) and at Wooster to have a chance to win the conference title. At Wooster is more often than not a sure loss for Wabash. If Witt loses, they know they could create real havoc in the conference by beating Wooster at Wooster on Saturday to create a 3 way tie.

Either way its a must win, just trying to say that Wabash needs this one just a little more. Witt needs a huge marquee home win as well and hopefully with the students back in town there may actually be more than 10 at the game??????

Hope to give you my insights tomorrow night.

GO WITT!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 18, 2011, 10:17:58 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 18, 2011, 10:01:46 PM
I think besides myself the reason the boards are quiet is 1-DCollinge is out and 2-Wabash fans don't want to admit that this game is a HUGE game for them and in the long run although its a must win really for both teams, a loss by Wabash would be more detrimental to them than a loss by Wittenberg.

And Wooster fans don't want to remind themselves of the fact that they needed a last-second Ian Franks three-pointer to defeat Allegheny...after also struggling to overcome a Larry Farmer-less Denison...and with Wittenberg looming as well on Saturday.

But, that said, I see the Scots playing well and defending home court tomorrow.  Since the game where the Gators took the Scots to the wire, the Gators have turned in generally unimpressive results: outside of beating Kenyon at home, they have lost Hiram, OWU and Wabash (x2), all by 18+ margins.

Briscoe and Ness seem to give them some points and rebounding inside, but as a team they have been out-rebounded by about 6 per contest, and I'm not sure if those two can match the athleticism of Hallowell and Wickliffe.  With the Scots routinely exploiting rebounding margins in their favor this year, I don't see any major advantage here for the Gators.  And from the outside, the Scots are clearly (as usual) the better shooting team.

I think the Scots will make extra sure tomorrow that they don't have any early lulls in concentration and I expect they'll seek to build a comfortable cushion early in this one, if possible.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2011, 11:57:31 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 18, 2011, 10:01:46 PM
At Wooster is more often than not a sure loss for Wabash.

Not necessarily.  While Wabash hasn't made a habit of beating Wooster since joining the NCAC, of their 3 total wins vs. Wooster since joining the NCAC, 2 of those 3 wins were at Timken.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 19, 2011, 12:17:32 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 18, 2011, 10:01:46 PM
I think besides myself the reason the boards are quiet is 1-DCollinge is out and 2-Wabash fans don't want to admit that this game is a HUGE game for them and in the long run although its a must win really for both teams, a loss by Wabash would be more detrimental to them than a loss by Wittenberg.

It's a league game and all league games are huge games.  There's still too many games left to worry about what happens if Wabash wins or loses.  I just want to see Wabash play a good game against a good team on the road and hope the score falls in Wabash's favor as it did last year.  Looking forward to watching tomorrow night. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 19, 2011, 08:36:59 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 19, 2011, 12:17:32 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 18, 2011, 10:01:46 PM
I think besides myself the reason the boards are quiet is 1-DCollinge is out and 2-Wabash fans don't want to admit that this game is a HUGE game for them and in the long run although its a must win really for both teams, a loss by Wabash would be more detrimental to them than a loss by Wittenberg.

It's a league game and all league games are huge games.  There's still too many games left to worry about what happens if Wabash wins or loses.  I just want to see Wabash play a good game against a good team on the road and hope the score falls in Wabash's favor as it did last year.  Looking forward to watching tomorrow night. 

Great point. tonight is one more night in league play.  Huge game but so is every game the rest of the way.  W's wlll battle each other but 1 slip up versus a lower team could be the difference.  HIram can be really good and has the ability to knock off a team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 19, 2011, 09:58:37 AM
It just doesn't feel like a gameday unless this post hits the board....

Wednesday's slate:

Allegheny at Wooster, 7:30 pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://livestats.prestosports.com/wooster/)
Capital at Denison, 7:30 pm -- audio and live stats  (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/index.html)
Hiram at Kenyon, 7:30 pm -- audio, video, live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/mensbasketball.xml)
Oberlin @ OWU, ~8:00 pm -- video (http://stream.owu.edu/); live stats (http://bishops.owu.edu/BishopLive/mbb/live.html)-- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Wabash @ Wittenberg, ~8:00 pm-- video, audio, and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/); auido (Wabash) (http://www.wabash.edu/kane/realaudio/index.cfm) -- Follows Denison/Witt women's game

NCAC non-con record stands at 43-36 (not double-checked for accuracy).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 19, 2011, 12:15:11 PM
well done wally! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 19, 2011, 03:55:29 PM
Blast!  Something has come up and I won't be able to watch tonight's game at the PES.  Will be tracking the live stats though.  How did D-III fans get by before live stats and smartphones?  It seems unfathomable...even having lived in the time of the technological abyss, I'm not sure how we managed. 

Will be looking forward to first hand impressions from penns later tonight.  WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2011, 04:45:58 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 19, 2011, 09:58:37 AM
It just doesn't feel like a gameday unless this post hits the board....

Wednesday's slate:

Allegheny at Wooster, 7:30 pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://livestats.prestosports.com/wooster/)
Capital at Denison, 7:30 pm -- audio and live stats  (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/index.html)
Hiram at Kenyon, 7:30 pm -- audio, video, live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/mensbasketball.xml)
Oberlin @ OWU, ~8:00 pm -- video (http://stream.owu.edu/); live stats (http://bishops.owu.edu/BishopLive/mbb/live.html)-- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Wabash @ Wittenberg, ~8:00 pm-- video, audio, and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/); auido (Wabash) (http://www.wabash.edu/kane/realaudio/index.cfm) -- Follows Denison/Witt women's game

NCAC non-con record stands at 43-36 (not double-checked for accuracy).

Thanks.  That Capital/Denison game is the last non-conference game on our slate for this season.  And yes, 43-36 is accurate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2011, 04:46:32 PM
Bump:

Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2011, 04:47:53 PM
Current NCAC Standings with 1/15 Results:

1. Wooster 7-0, 16-0
2. Wittenberg 6-0, 11-4
3. Wabash 6-1, 14-1
4. Ohio Wesleyan 4-3, 8-8
5. Kenyon 3-4, 7-9
6. Hiram 2-5, 8-8
7. Allegheny 2-6, 5-11
7. Denison 2-6, 5-11
9. Oberlin 0-7, 1-15
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 19, 2011, 05:01:51 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2011, 04:45:58 PM
Thanks.  That Capital/Denison game is the last non-conference game on our slate for this season.  And yes, 43-36 is accurate.

I think there is one more...Allegheny shows a 2/16 game against PSU-Behrend. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 19, 2011, 06:02:18 PM
Wally, no problem!!!

Also, I called into a local radio show tonight to make a pub for Wittenberg to get some notice for all sports, not just basketbal in the overall Dayton area. The hosts made a good point and said for people to notice, you must give them a reason to notice. Well hopefully tonight gives people that reason.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2011, 06:48:26 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 19, 2011, 05:01:51 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2011, 04:45:58 PM
Thanks.  That Capital/Denison game is the last non-conference game on our slate for this season.  And yes, 43-36 is accurate.

I think there is one more...Allegheny shows a 2/16 game against PSU-Behrend. 
Thanks again, I overlooked that one--by not expecting to find a non-con in Feb.!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2011, 08:14:22 PM
Halftime scores:
Kenyon 38, Hiram 28
Capital 29, Denison 25
Wooster 43, Allegheny 25
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2011, 08:20:23 PM
Wooster had balanced scoring in the first half with points coming from Nathan Balch 7, Ryan Snyder 7, Ian Franks 6, Matt Fegan 6 and Josh Claytor 5.  11 players logged time for the Scots in the half.

Wooster hit 6 three pointers in the half and outrebounded Allegheny 26 to 17 in the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 19, 2011, 08:32:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2011, 08:14:22 PM
Capital 29, Denison 25

The Big Red is having trouble keeping Capital in range, as the "Cru" starts the second half on a 14-3 run. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2011, 08:34:19 PM
Halftime:
Wabash 29, Wittenberg 24
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 19, 2011, 08:45:10 PM
And the lights are out in Timken with the Scots up by 30 and 9:07 left. I vote that they invoke the mercy rule, but that's just me.

Now this is different.  They're playing with no lights at the Scots offensive end and only a few lights on at the other end.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2011, 08:59:14 PM
Final:  Wooster 88  Allegheny 56 :)

Wooster's top scorers:  Ian Franks 13, Matt Fegan 12, Mike Evans 11, Josh Claytor 9
Allegheny's top scorers:  James Ness 13, D'andre Corbin 8

Scots played good defense and outrebounded the Gators 43 to 33.

Wooster is now 17-0, 8-0 NCAC ;D  Next up is Wittenberg at home on 1/22.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2011, 09:02:21 PM
Capital 81, Denison 58 -- NCAC slips to 43-37 on the season.

Score updates:
OWU 41, Oberlin 32, halftime
Kenyon 72, Hiram 55, 3:18 2nd
Wittenberg 40, Wabash 38, 10:39 2nd
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2011, 09:26:51 PM
Final: Wittenberg 55  Wabash 54
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2011, 09:27:31 PM
Scott Leo: Chris Sullivan hits two crucial free throws "like he's been doing it for years, as calm as a cucumber."  :D
Those free throws ice Wittenberg's 55-54 victory.

Elsewhere,
Kenyon 78, Hiram 69
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 19, 2011, 09:36:08 PM
The more things change..... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: D-III Insider on January 19, 2011, 09:43:23 PM
Will the Witt-Wooster game sell out on Saturday?  Scots fans what do you think?  If I wanted to make the trip could I get a ticket?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2011, 09:55:36 PM
Current NCAC Standings with 1/19 Results:

1. Wooster 8-0, 17-0
2. Wittenberg 7-0, 12-4
3. Wabash 6-2, 14-2
4. Ohio Wesleyan 5-3, 9-8
5. Kenyon 4-4, 8-9
6. Hiram 2-6, 8-9
6. Denison 2-6, 5-12
8. Allegheny 2-7, 5-12
9. Oberlin 0-8, 1-16
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2011, 10:02:27 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2011, 09:55:36 PM
Current NCAC Standings with 1/19 Results:
...one of which is
OWU 69, Oberlin 56
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2011, 10:03:24 PM
Quote from: D-III Insider on January 19, 2011, 09:43:23 PM
Will the Witt-Wooster game sell out on Saturday?  Scots fans what do you think?  If I wanted to make the trip could I get a ticket?

Witt vs Wooster has not sold out in the last several years.  Wooster's Timken Gymnasium is a fairly large D3 court with a capacity of 3,400.  To be completely safe, hit the ticket window at least 30 minutes before game time but I seriously doubt that the game will be a complete sellout. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 19, 2011, 10:05:19 PM
Wabash has got to find the consistency in it's 3-point shooting that it displayed early in the year or every opponent will drop into the 2/3 Zone and be very successful.

Credit Witt's defense as well,  but we also missed way too many wide open looks as well.  6-26 behind the arc is not going to get it done.

Onward and Upward.

WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 19, 2011, 10:09:01 PM
Final Wittenberg 55 Wabash 54.

Decent crowd, although very quiet really and subdued but probably overall the cleanest game I've seen all year. The 2 teams combined for 15 total free throws with Wabash only getting 1 shot the whole second half. Not a lot of fouls overall either and dare I say, the best officiating the whole year in a game?

The game started out rough for Witt and clearly as I have worried all year, Wabash's size was causing fits. Wabash got a few offensive rebounds to keep possessions alive and hit some shots. Wittenberg missed a lot of shots close to the basket. It was almost like those roles reversed in the second as Wabash started missing shots they should make.

The key sequence in the game came with Wittenberg up 53-51 with about 20 some seconds left. After two successive timeouts, Seth Hill from Witt made possibly the defensive play of the year as he stripped Wes Smith cleanly of the ball and got fouled to force Wabash's hand.

Overall Wes Smith had a double-double, but was for the most part contained. It seems that a zone defense is the magic way to contain him, you'll never stop him compeltely, but put the game in the shooters hands of Wabash.

Great game overall and look forward to seeing the rematch. On to Wooster!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 19, 2011, 10:11:18 PM
as you can see in my recap, the 2-3 zone idea is what i talked about
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 19, 2011, 10:54:08 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2011, 10:03:24 PM
Quote from: D-III Insider on January 19, 2011, 09:43:23 PM
Will the Witt-Wooster game sell out on Saturday?  Scots fans what do you think?  If I wanted to make the trip could I get a ticket?

Witt vs Wooster has not sold out in the last several years.  Wooster's Timken Gymnasium is a fairly large D3 court with a capacity of 3,400.  To be completely safe, hit the ticket window at least 30 minutes before game time but I seriously doubt that the game will be a complete sellout. ;)

You should be able to get a ticket if you come up. Even at the height of Woo-Witt in the middle of the decade, I think people were rarely if at all turned away at Timken's door.

However, I'd think about getting their early if you don't want to be in the rafters (unless you're DC, who always seemed to prefer watching games at Timken from the next county over.)  :D I do suspect that this iteration of the rivalry will draw very strongly.  Most factors point to Saturday's game being better attended than those of the previous few years, especially with both of these teams being undefeated in NCAC play.  I would think fan enthusiasm is pretty strong on both sides right now, with Wooster still unbeaten and carrying the #1 ranking, and Wittenberg having just defended their home court against current #7 Wabash.

As I think sac was alluding to, the winner of Woo-Witt part 1 will once again be in control of its destiny in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: D-III Insider on January 19, 2011, 11:52:59 PM
Hey Witt Fans:

What is the story with Josh McKee?  Is he out for the season?  Have not seen his name in awhile.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldtiger on January 20, 2011, 07:15:28 AM
Article re: McKee's absence:

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/springfield-oh-sports/wittenberg-university-tigers/wittenbergs-mckee-over-illness-1058118.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 20, 2011, 08:56:51 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2011, 09:55:36 PM
Current NCAC Standings with 1/19 Results:

1. Wooster 8-0, 17-0
2. Wittenberg 7-0, 12-4
3. Wabash 6-2, 14-2
4. Ohio Wesleyan 5-3, 9-8
5. Kenyon 4-4, 8-9
6. Hiram 2-6, 8-9
6. Denison 2-6, 5-12
8. Allegheny 2-7, 5-12
9. Oberlin 0-8, 1-16

The NCAC seems to be three distinct groups:
the Elite W's competing for the top 3 spots,
OWU and Kenyon in the 4-5 spots, and
Hiram, Denison, and Allegheny in the 6-8 spots. 
Oberlin will be on the outside looking in at NCAC Tournament time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 20, 2011, 05:08:53 PM
Sorry Yeomen, but next year you should have company on the outside looking in.

If I were a "W" I'd want to be sure to stay away from Hiram. They're the kind of team that could sneak up on you. Of course, there's plenty of hoop to be played.

If there was time and a central location (Dayton, perhaps?) why not have all nine teams invited? You can either do a straight seeding with an 8/9 (or next year 7/10 and 8/9) or stagger it so that #1 (or #1 and #2) get byes to the semi-finals.

Can you imagine the thrill of a Denison / Oberlin game played in Hare Arena?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 20, 2011, 05:21:42 PM
Thanks for the notes, penns.  Excellent report. 

I didn't get to see the game last night, and the boxscore doesn't always provide proper context, but from last night I see that Wabash shot 26 3FGs and 5 FTs.  This tells me that Wabash was settling and not attacking and that's a hard way to win if you're not making shots (which they weren't).  If you give up just 55 points, that's a game you should win.  Wabash seems to be in a bit of a scoring funk right now...need that to be remedied for the big games in February. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: D-III Insider on January 20, 2011, 08:21:26 PM
Thanks, Ole Tiger. 

If McKee can get some strength back in time for the second round of conference play (when the Tigers go to Wabash and host Wooster especially) and for the NCAC tournament the Tigers could peak just at the right time of year to ruin Wooster's perfect season. 

Coming back from that kind of illness will take some time though.  Any inside knowledge pennst?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 20, 2011, 08:24:10 PM
not really inside knowledge, but Coach Brown said on the postgame radio show that he is at least two weeks away from "game shape" whatever that entails. Also, there is a possibility of him qualifying for a medical redshirt since he has only appeared in two games and hasn't played in the second half of the season. It will come down to whether he will be a big factor in playing or would rather have a full year of game action. Its a tough decision to make for sure.

The question i'm wondering is what's with David Hieber's health. His size and shooting prowess will be needed the rest of the year.

Thanks wally, good to see after four years of posting i finally got my karma to the even count :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 20, 2011, 08:27:08 PM
Is the reason the Wooster fans are quiet this week is that secretly deep down they know what the recent history has been when they've been number 1 and played against a Wittenberg team with hungry mouths????

Wooster may be a little terrified, but definitely after the win against Wabash that Wittenberg had will not take them lightly any more.

I think to have the conference tournament in a central location for a year to see how it plays out might be interesting. Columbus? Campus locations definitely has a bigger atmosphere though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 20, 2011, 08:33:41 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 20, 2011, 08:27:08 PM
I think to have the conference tournament in a central location for a year to see how it plays out might be interesting. Columbus? Campus locations definitely has a bigger atmosphere though.

The conference tournament used to rotate between Wooser, OWU and Wittenberg.  I prefer the way it is now and giving the regular season champ the home court advantage.  It makes the regular season more meaningful by giving the champ a clear advantage, but still gives everyone (or almost everyone) that hope of making it to the big dance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 21, 2011, 11:49:00 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 20, 2011, 08:33:41 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 20, 2011, 08:27:08 PM
I think to have the conference tournament in a central location for a year to see how it plays out might be interesting. Columbus? Campus locations definitely has a bigger atmosphere though.

The conference tournament used to rotate between Wooser, OWU and Wittenberg.  I prefer the way it is now and giving the regular season champ the home court advantage.  It makes the regular season more meaningful by giving the champ a clear advantage, but still gives everyone (or almost everyone) that hope of making it to the big dance.


I agree with derek.  I'm already of the opinion that the regular season champ is more deserving of the automatic bid than the tournament champ is, so at the very least, the regular season champ should get the reward of hosting the tournament.


Quote from: pennstghs on January 20, 2011, 08:27:08 PM

Wooster may be a little terrified, but definitely after the win against Wabash that Wittenberg had will not take them lightly any more.


I'm guessing whether Witt beat Wabash or not, the Tigers would be getting Wooster's full attention.  A) this is a rivalry game.  B) If Witt wins, they would then be tied with Wooster for the lead in the conference standings with a rematch at Witt awaiting so Wooster will want to do their best to defend their home court.  C) This game has HUGE regional ranking ramifications as well.  Besides, all Wooster has to do is look back at last year's regular season game in Wooster between these 2 rivals to remember Witt is more than capable of pulling off the upset.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2011, 12:47:29 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 21, 2011, 11:49:00 AM
I'm guessing whether Witt beat Wabash or not, the Tigers would be getting Wooster's full attention.  A) this is a rivalry game.  B) If Witt wins, they would then be tied with Wooster for the lead in the conference standings with a rematch at Witt awaiting so Wooster will want to do their best to defend their home court.  C) This game has HUGE regional ranking ramifications as well.  Besides, all Wooster has to do is look back at last year's regular season game in Wooster between these 2 rivals to remember Witt is more than capable of pulling off the upset.
I believe ScotsFan is presupposing a Witt loss to Wabash here, which of course did not occur.  A "what-if" scenario.  Just wanted to make sure that was clear. 

As things stand, the winner Saturday is in first place all alone, with a significant leg up in the race.  If it's Wooster, they'd be up 1.5 games over Witt and (probably) 2 over Wab, with wins over each in the bank, including a key road win at Wab.  If it's Witt, they'd be up 0.5 games on Woo and (probably) 1.5 on Wab, with wins over each in the bank, including a key road win at Woo.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BashDad on January 21, 2011, 01:10:50 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 20, 2011, 05:21:42 PM
Thanks for the notes, penns.  Excellent report. 

I didn't get to see the game last night, and the boxscore doesn't always provide proper context, but from last night I see that Wabash shot 26 3FGs and 5 FTs.  This tells me that Wabash was settling and not attacking and that's a hard way to win if you're not making shots (which they weren't).  If you give up just 55 points, that's a game you should win.  Wabash seems to be in a bit of a scoring funk right now...need that to be remedied for the big games in February. 

This is soooooooo correct. It was frustrating to watch. I'm interested in other folks' assessment of Smith. I go into every game wanting to LOVE him, but I gotta say-- he pisses me off in these bigger games; taking poor shots, not getting to the basket, just being.... absent. His apparent confidence never translates into a bulldog "I'm winning this game, just get out of my way" mode of attack. He just, like, walks the ball up the court really cooly as if there's some inherent threat in his calmness.

I dunno. Am I an idiot?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 21, 2011, 01:34:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 21, 2011, 12:47:29 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 21, 2011, 11:49:00 AM
I'm guessing whether Witt beat Wabash or not, the Tigers would be getting Wooster's full attention.  A) this is a rivalry game.  B) If Witt wins, they would then be tied with Wooster for the lead in the conference standings with a rematch at Witt awaiting so Wooster will want to do their best to defend their home court.  C) This game has HUGE regional ranking ramifications as well.  Besides, all Wooster has to do is look back at last year's regular season game in Wooster between these 2 rivals to remember Witt is more than capable of pulling off the upset.
I believe ScotsFan is presupposing a Witt loss to Wabash here, which of course did not occur.  A "what-if" scenario.  Just wanted to make sure that was clear. 

As things stand, the winner Saturday is in first place all alone, with a significant leg up in the race.  If it's Wooster, they'd be up 1.5 games over Witt and (probably) 2 over Wab, with wins over each in the bank, including a key road win at Wab.  If it's Witt, they'd be up 0.5 games on Woo and (probably) 1.5 on Wab, with wins over each in the bank, including a key road win at Woo.
My bad.  I don't know why I had Witt having one loss in conference on the brain.  So, my second point would even be bigger because Witt would then have a game on Wooster and have the advantage of having the return game down in Springfield.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 21, 2011, 02:41:56 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 20, 2011, 08:27:08 PM
Is the reason the Wooster fans are quiet this week is that secretly deep down they know what the recent history has been when they've been number 1 and played against a Wittenberg team with hungry mouths????

Or Maybe it's because the Big Red scared the heck out of them last weekend at Livingston?  After seeing how the Scots handled that game, I don't think they have the heads for sweeping conference play and going deep in the tournament any more.  The big guys seemed to get intimidated by the smaller, but tougher, Denison inside guys.  Coach Moore went as ballistic as I've ever seen him, and Hallowell spent a good part of the game jawing with and whining to the officials.  Not the composure I expected from the Number 1 team, and I have to say I enjoyed watching it. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 21, 2011, 02:56:34 PM
Quote from: BashDad on January 21, 2011, 01:10:50 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 20, 2011, 05:21:42 PM
Thanks for the notes, penns.  Excellent report. 

I didn't get to see the game last night, and the boxscore doesn't always provide proper context, but from last night I see that Wabash shot 26 3FGs and 5 FTs.  This tells me that Wabash was settling and not attacking and that's a hard way to win if you're not making shots (which they weren't).  If you give up just 55 points, that's a game you should win.  Wabash seems to be in a bit of a scoring funk right now...need that to be remedied for the big games in February. 

This is soooooooo correct. It was frustrating to watch. I'm interested in other folks' assessment of Smith. I go into every game wanting to LOVE him, but I gotta say-- he pisses me off in these bigger games; taking poor shots, not getting to the basket, just being.... absent. His apparent confidence never translates into a bulldog "I'm winning this game, just get out of my way" mode of attack. He just, like, walks the ball up the court really cooly as if there's some inherent threat in his calmness.

I dunno. Am I an idiot?

I think it's easy to overthink body language.  You don't have to be a screaming, yelling, arm-flailing, chest pounding, jersey popper to be a good player.  In fact, most of the really good players that I've seen in this league over the years (Cooper, Russ, Port, Estelle...to name a few) were not this way...they just go out and play good basketball.  

As I peruse the boxscores of the games vs. Wooster and Wittenberg, a couple of things stand out to me: the 3FGAs are well above average in these games (Wabash is not taking advantage of their size in the post), and the FG%'s in these two games are pretty atrocious (33% vs. Wooster and 38.6% against Witt).  Wabash lost these games by two and one points, respectively...turn a couple of those 3FGAs into a higher percentage shot in the painted area and the results may have turned out differently.  

As it stands, Wabash has lost two games by a grand total of three points...to the #1 team in the poll and then on the road to a good team in a gym that Wabash has won in exactly once in a dozen years in the league.  This group is fine.  Keep defending they way have all season and sooner or later the shots will start falling again.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2011, 03:02:22 PM
Well, let's all gather at the campus of the winner for a four-day hoops extravaganza! I remember watching the MAAC tourney on Empire (back when that channel existed - the NHL lockout killed it) and they had the mens' AND womens' tournaments in the same location at the same time.

Day 1 - Women's 7/10 and 8/9
Day 2 - Women's Quarterfinals + Men 7/10 and 8/9
Day 3 - Women's Semis + Men's Quarters
Day 4 - Womens Final + Men's Semis
Day 5 - Men's Final

I'll volunteer to run the computer for stats!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2011, 03:39:51 PM
New poll!
I'm setting aside the question of 8 teams vs. 9 or 10 teams, only for the sake of making the poll more manageable.  

My two cents on this, in the world in which we actually live rather than an idealized one, is that a neutral location tournament would strongly favor Wooster, provided it wasn't held in Indianapolis.  If it were held in Columbus, as I suspect such a tournament would be, the crowd would likely be almost as pro-Wooster as a home game.  For evidence, look at the recent second-round NCAA game at Capital, where the Wooster crowd was both larger and louder than the Cap Cru.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 21, 2011, 04:03:55 PM
Quote from: GoRed on January 21, 2011, 02:41:56 PM

Or Maybe it's because the Big Red scared the heck out of them last weekend at Livingston?  After seeing how the Scots handled that game, I don't think they have the heads for sweeping conference play and going deep in the tournament any more.  The big guys seemed to get intimidated by the smaller, but tougher, Denison inside guys.  Coach Moore went as ballistic as I've ever seen him, and Hallowell spent a good part of the game jawing with and whining to the officials.  Not the composure I expected from the Number 1 team, and I have to say I enjoyed watching it. 

Yeah, Wooster was intimidated by the Big Red up here, too.  Funny, though.  With fourteen minutes to go, the Scots led by 37 points and cruised home.  Just imagine what the score might have been if they weren't afraid of getting beaten up.

Truth is, nobody on here can refute your ridiculous account of the game because why in hell would anyone from Wooster drive an hour and a half to see a second-rate team like Denison play?  I hope they enjoy the off-season; it'll be starting soon in Granville.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 21, 2011, 04:09:31 PM
If I thought that using the "other" option as a means to vote for "let's not have a conference tournament" wasn't a cop out, then I would have.  I think the best format is the way it is now.  Moving all of those quarterfinal games to the home of the top seed or to a neutral site takes a home game away from three or four teams, and every one of those games is going to be better attended on a Tuesday evening on a home campus than it would be on a Thursday afternoon at who-knows-where. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2011, 04:10:18 PM
Saturday slate, with live video for every game!

Wabash at Oberlin, 1pm -- video and live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/) -- Game 1 of a doubleheader, OC women vs. Hiram to follow
Allegheny at Denison, ~3pm -- video and live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader (and game 1 should be a good one)
OWU at Kenyon, ~3pm -- video and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader (and game 1 should be a good one)
Wittenberg at Wooster, 7:30pm -- Video, (separate) audio, and live stats (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule) (COW); audio (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/) (WU) -- essentially game 3 of a tripleheader (women at 2, JVs at 5:30)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 21, 2011, 04:29:33 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 21, 2011, 04:03:55 PM
Quote from: GoRed on January 21, 2011, 02:41:56 PM

Or Maybe it's because the Big Red scared the heck out of them last weekend at Livingston?  After seeing how the Scots handled that game, I don't think they have the heads for sweeping conference play and going deep in the tournament any more.  The big guys seemed to get intimidated by the smaller, but tougher, Denison inside guys.  Coach Moore went as ballistic as I've ever seen him, and Hallowell spent a good part of the game jawing with and whining to the officials.  Not the composure I expected from the Number 1 team, and I have to say I enjoyed watching it. 

Yeah, Wooster was intimidated by the Big Red up here, too.  Funny, though.  With fourteen minutes to go, the Scots led by 37 points and cruised home.  Just imagine what the score might have been if they weren't afraid of getting beaten up.

Truth is, nobody on here can refute your ridiculous account of the game because why in hell would anyone from Wooster drive an hour and a half to see a second-rate team like Denison play?  I hope they enjoy the off-season; it'll be starting soon in Granville.   

If you had joined your fellow fans in Granville last weekend, you would have seen a different side of the team and its fans.  As a matter of fact, Wooster fans outnumbered Denison by at least 3:1 because school still wasn't in session.  Ask a few of the arrogants who were there expecting a blowout but found out you don't come into Livingston expecting to get all the calls, like you do in Timken, and have a cakewalk.  They got into an unexpected fight and didn't react well until some of the long-range threes finally started dropping.  I see a lot more cool from the other two W's - maybe because they don't read as much of their own press. 

Oh, and keep in mind that Farmer got hurt during that first game.  Finally - yes, the off-season always comes too early for Denison's men.  I've given my opinion as to why.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 21, 2011, 04:45:34 PM
So Wooster fans are arrogant, the team gets all the calls in Timken, they're not cool on the road, and they read too much of their own press.  You got anything else to say here where you can safely say it, you anonymous little troll?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 21, 2011, 05:23:16 PM
I was curious as to Wabash's "cold" shooting in their losses.  Sure they shot below their average in both games, but really it was within a few percentage points of their season average.  So I looked at all their games and there are only 2 games where Wabash's FG% varies by more than 5% from their opponents season-long pct - one higher (first Franklin game) and one lower (DePauw).  I compared that to Wooster where 8 of the 16 games I could compare (Cincy Christian doesn't have stats posted) and 8 of their games had a variance of over 5 pct (5 higher, 3 lower).

Not really sure what conclusions can be drawn.  But I would say that the perceived cold shooting of Wabash is more a product of who they have been playing rather than their own offense.  Whereas Wooster seems to be more able to control their shooting pct rather than let the defense dictate their efficiency.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 21, 2011, 06:05:49 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 21, 2011, 04:45:34 PM
So Wooster fans are arrogant, the team gets all the calls in Timken, they're not cool on the road, and they read too much of their own press.  You got anything else to say here where you can safely say it, you anonymous little troll?

So you weren't at the game, and haven't spoken to anyone who was?

One minor clarification.  I did not say they were not cool on the road.  They were not cool in that game. 

So how tall are you and how do you wear your hair?  By the way, I wear dark glasses now - not just to remain anonymous (how did a Wooster fan manage to spell that word correctly?) but to hide my bug eyes.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 22, 2011, 12:39:24 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 21, 2011, 04:45:34 PM
You got anything else to say here where you can safely say it, you anonymous little troll?

Didn't you get bounced from the site FOR MORE THAN A YEAR for threatening people? What is your deal?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 22, 2011, 01:32:12 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 21, 2011, 05:23:16 PM
I was curious as to Wabash's "cold" shooting in their losses.  Sure they shot below their average in both games, but really it was within a few percentage points of their season average.  So I looked at all their games and there are only 2 games where Wabash's FG% varies by more than 5% from their opponents season-long pct - one higher (first Franklin game) and one lower (DePauw).  I compared that to Wooster where 8 of the 16 games I could compare (Cincy Christian doesn't have stats posted) and 8 of their games had a variance of over 5 pct (5 higher, 3 lower).

Not really sure what conclusions can be drawn.  But I would say that the perceived cold shooting of Wabash is more a product of who they have been playing rather than their own offense.  Whereas Wooster seems to be more able to control their shooting pct rather than let the defense dictate their efficiency.

I think it's the in-game streakiness of certain players, and the disappointing shooting of Sutherlin in losses. It was expected that AJ really be one that could hit the long jumpers with more regularity.

Wabash has a tendency, I think, to bundle together possessions where they don't finish inside and then miss a 3-pointer, and that leads to the perception.

But...if they shoot better against Witt and Wooster they're undefeated.

And if wishes were horses...rides would be free.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 22, 2011, 09:07:02 AM
Could it possibly be the defense played by Witt and Woo that contributed to Wabash's cold shooting in those two games?  I mean, Wooster is 4th in the nation if fg percentage defense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 22, 2011, 10:44:26 AM
Here is the Team Stats comparison for Wooster and Wittenberg:

Wooster 17-0  8-0 NCAC
Offensive Field Goals 48.0%
Defensive Field Goals 37.0%
3 Point Shooting 41.2%
Free Throw Shooting 76.1%
Rebound Margin Per Game:  +10.6
Assists to Turnovers Ratio:  1.24
Scoring Margin Per Game:  +17.1 points

Wittenberg 12-4  7-0 NCAC
Offensive Field Goals 45.8%
Defensive Field Goals 42.9%
3 Point Shooting 36.8%
Free Throw Shooting 68.4%
Rebound Margin Per Game:  +5.7
Assists to Turnovers Ratio:  0.90
Scoring Margin Per Game:  +4.8 points

Stats edge to Wooster but rivalry games are played on hardwood, not paper! ;) :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 22, 2011, 11:04:35 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 22, 2011, 09:07:02 AM
Could it possibly be the defense played by Witt and Woo that contributed to Wabash's cold shooting in those two games?  I mean, Wooster is 4th in the nation if fg percentage defense.

That's true as well - it all adds together in the end.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 22, 2011, 11:26:51 AM
Wooster Probable Starters
6'4"  Ian Franks SR  17.9 ppg, 6.5 rpg, 3.4 apg
6'1"  Nathan Balch SR  12.6 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 48.6% three pointers
6'7"  Justin Hallowell JR  12.5 ppg, 5.9 rpg, 2.0 apg
6'1"  Matt Fegan JR  8.7 ppg, 3.2 apg, 44.3% three pointers
6'5"  Bryan Wickliffe SR  8.4 ppg, 7.2 rpg

Wooster Key Reserves
6'7"  Josh Claytor SO  4.3 ppg, 3.7 rpg
6'8"  Jake Mays SO  4.1 ppg, 3.7 rpg
6'2"  Justin Warnes JR  3.4 ppg, 2.3 rpg
6'0"  Ryan Snyder FR  3.3 ppg, 1.7 rpg

Wittenberg Probable Starters
6'7"  Clayton Black JR  16.5 ppg, 5.6 rpg
5'9"  Chris Sullivan SR  16.1 ppg, 3.7 rpg, 40.0% three pointers
6'7"  Alex Brandt JR  7.1 ppg, 5.4 rpg
6'4"  Michael Cooper JR  5.8 ppg, 4.1 rpg, 2.5 apg
6'0"  Steven Newell FR  5.3 ppg, 1.9 rpg

Wittenberg Key Reserves
6'2"  Cameron Walton SO  8.3 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 47.4% three pointers
6'2"  Seth Hill SR  4.0 ppg, 5.0 rpg, 2.1 apg
6'6"  Jacob Weide JR  3.9 ppg, 3.1 rpg
6'4"  Scott Masin FR 2.6 ppg, 1.7 rpg

Wooster has more scoring balance; Black & Sullivan provide over 45% of Witt's offense, Walton big off the bench
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: D-III Insider on January 22, 2011, 11:33:33 AM
Well it seems to be that time of year again.  The first of what seems like almost always three Wiitt-Wooster battles.  What a rivalry.

Wooster should win today's game and maybe even comfortably.  The Tigers are still not healthy and very young.   Actually I think it bodes better for Witt that the second game is in Springfield in another six weeks.  By then they may be healthy and still have a chance to win/tie for NCAC crown if they can defend their home court.  

The pressure is on Wooster tonight.  They have to win or be faced with possibly having to win in Springfield for a tie and they are the #1 ranked team.  A game like this is why players play, coaches coach and fans watch.

Two of the most storied programs in the last 25 years at the DIII level.  This seems like UM-OSU in the 70's.  Diffrent year ... same story.
I will say Wooster 68 Wittenberg 57.  What you folks think?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 22, 2011, 11:36:25 AM
A few keys to tonight's big game between Wooster and Wittenberg:

- How does Wooster try to slow down Clayton Black and Chris Sullivan?
- How does Wittenberg try to slow down Ian Franks, Nathan Balch and Justin Hallowell?

- Does each team play man to man defense and who denies three pointers better?
- Do Ian Franks and Michael Cooper guard each other and how does that matchup play out?
- Which team wins the battle of the boards?

I plan on watching a great rivalry game at Timken tonight!  It should be a "blackout"! ;D ;)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: D-III Insider on January 22, 2011, 11:41:47 AM
Not going to be able to make the trip to Wooster tonight.  But will hopefully be able to see the Ustream feed.  I predict you see more zone defense out of the Tigers than you expect.  They zoned Wabash alot on Wednesday.

Predictions?????
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on January 22, 2011, 11:54:04 AM
Agree that a myriad of circumstances might affect an outcome, Smed, and frankly if COW had canned more than 67% from the charity stripe (16-24), it wouldn't have been that close.  What is more puzzling is how the LGs out-boarded both Witt and COW, not only in total caroms, but by 2:1 on the offensive end against both (trusting Mr. Harris for the stats).  

My locale (Botswana) doesn't enable downloads of video feeds, so this observation is purely "gut reaction" to stats, but is there either a hesitancy to take the ball back up strong, or just an inability to put it in the hole (no comment from the DPU contingent required... I know)?

COW by 4 tonight at home, unless Scots shoot the lights out over the zone - then 11 may be a good bet.  Now back to the boring cricket reruns on the tube. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2011, 12:20:04 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 22, 2011, 11:36:25 AM
A few keys to tonight's big game between Wooster and Wittenberg:

- How does Wooster try to slow down Clayton Black and Chris Sullivan?

I'm not sure you can really do both of these things.  Sullivan sometimes shuts himself down by being cold, but he takes his shots from so far out that, if he's hitting and you choose to try to take away his shot, you could be leaving yourself exposed in the interior.  Wooster could put one man in Sullivan's jock and try to play four-on-four on the Tiger end, I suppose.  That would have the advantage of having a Wooster man always ahead of the break in transition.  But the best strategy may be to hope that Sullivan is cold (since he'll shoot whether he's hot or not) and then pack it in on Black.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 22, 2011, 12:47:27 PM
Quote from: GoRed on January 21, 2011, 02:41:56 PM
Or Maybe it's because the Big Red scared the heck out of them last weekend at Livingston?

Yeah that's it...  ::)


Quote from: GoRed on January 21, 2011, 02:41:56 PM
After seeing how the Scots handled that game, I don't think they have the heads for sweeping conference play and going deep in the tournament any more.  The big guys seemed to get intimidated by the smaller, but tougher, Denison inside guys.  Coach Moore went as ballistic as I've ever seen him, and Hallowell spent a good part of the game jawing with and whining to the officials.  Not the composure I expected from the Number 1 team, and I have to say I enjoyed watching it.  

Impressive how you can draw this conclusion after seeing the Scots ONE time???  ::)  Forget the fact that the Scots waxed Denison by 30 in Wooster.  Forget the impressive wins they have on the road at Wabash, at Anderson and at OWU.  So you see them get into a dogfight with an inspired Denison team and suddenly you have the foresight to predict that this team doesn't have the heads to make a deep run in the tournament???  Personally, I'd say I saw just the opposite.  If they didn't have the heads, they wouldn't have found a way to pull that game out in the end as they did.  

Bottom line is, it's hard enough to get through the conference schedule unscathed.  Personally, I'm not expecting it to happen either.  But, the fact is, as good as Wooster is, they are going to have games like they did last Saturday in Granville or a few weeks ago in Meadeville.  Especially given the fact that they are getting the best efforts of the teams they are playing due to their current streak of conference championships and that little #1 ranking they have next to their name.  So, forgive me if I don't share in your opinion you have drawn after watching this team play one time that this isn't a team capable of making a deep run come tournament time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 22, 2011, 01:14:17 PM
Quote from: cave2bens on January 22, 2011, 11:54:04 AM
What is more puzzling is how the LGs out-boarded both Witt and COW, not only in total caroms, but by 2:1 on the offensive end against both (trusting Mr. Harris for the stats).

Rebounding numbers are a tricky business.  Team A's offensive rebounders are not directly matched up against Team B's offensive rebounders, so just looking at the OR numbers can give a skewed representation of what actually happened on the court.  Doing so is similar to comparing, in a single football game, the stats of Team A's quarterback against the numbers of Team B's quarterback, when in actuality they're not facing each other but rather the opposing team's defensive unit.  Another analogy would be comparing the stat lines of the two pitchers in a baseball game; they're facing the opposition's hitters, not each other.

You need to look at the number of available rebounds at each end of the court and see who comes up with them.  Available rebounds depend on the number of shots taken and how many go in.

Wabash at Wittenberg:

Wabash missed 36 shots and had 14 offensive boards.  So, they took down .39% of the available boards at their offensive end.  That's a pretty darned good number.  Wittenberg missed 32 shots and had only 7 offensive boards.  So, they controlled only 22% of the rebounds at their offensive end.  In this game, the Little Giants did indeed do a far better job on the offensive glass than the Tigers.  Obviously, to see a team's defensive rebounding prowess, just flip these percentages.

Wooster at Wabash:

Wooster missed 33 shots and had only 8 offensive boards, for just 24%.  Wabash missed 45 shots with 16 offensive boards; 36%.  So, you can see from looking at it this way that while Wabash did do a better job on the offensive glass than Wooster, it was not truly the 2:1 ratio that the simple OR numbers indicate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 22, 2011, 01:48:10 PM
2010-11 NCAC Team Rebounding Percentages   -   Through January 21st                                 
                                 
                Opp's   Avail           Opp     Avail           Total      Off        Def   Total
Team      Off   Def        Off   Def   Off     Def        Total   Avail      Reb     Reb   Reb
              Reb  Reb     Reb   Reb   Reb     Reb        Reb   Reb      Pct.     Pct.   Pct.
Wooster      211  335    546   491   187     678     702   1224   .386    .724   .574
Wabash     197   338    535   430   160     590     627   1125   .368    .729   .557
Wittenberg  203   321    524   382   174     556     585   1080   .387    .687   .542
Kenyon     191   414    605   442   186     628     633   1233   .316    .704   .513
Hiram     266   458    724   369   162     531     635   1255   .367    .695   .506
OWU             223   443    666   432   202     634     655   1300   .335    .681   .504
Allegheny     165   409    574   378   230     608     543   1182   .287    .622   .459
Denison     173   409    582   347   217     564     520   1146   .297    .615   .454
Oberlin     137   454    591   368   183     551     505   1142   .232    .668   .442

Totals   1766 3581  5347   3639 1701   5340   5405   10687   .330    .681   .506

I don't know how to get these columns to line up.  Anybody know if there is a way?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on January 22, 2011, 02:40:48 PM
WooBoo -  I appreciate your effort and analysis, and I will resist any cliche, Geico comments about "cavemen."  ;D

My inquiry was whether these "bonus opportunities," when secured, were capitalized on.  I haven't seen a statistic on "second chance" points, but only those generated off turnovers.  Sometimes players become borderline "bi-polar" in the paint - aggressive in crashing the boards, then for whatever reason (unless a Gene Hackman clone tells his player not to shoot), tentative or even "gun shy" about executing a put back with similar enthusiasm.  Just seeking opinions from fans, regardless of W affiliation, who watched those games for insight.

Mein Gott, cricket is as boring as soccer - thank goodness it's over for the night and Super 15 and trout season resume next week.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2011, 02:52:18 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 22, 2011, 01:48:10 PM
2010-11 NCAC Team Rebounding Percentages   -   Through January 21st                                 
                                 
                Opp's   Avail           Opp     Avail           Total      Off        Def   Total
Team      Off   Def        Off   Def   Off     Def        Total   Avail      Reb     Reb   Reb
              Reb  Reb     Reb   Reb   Reb     Reb        Reb   Reb      Pct.     Pct.   Pct.
Wooster      211  335    546   491   187     678     702   1224   .386    .724   .574
Wabash     197   338    535   430   160     590     627   1125   .368    .729   .557
Wittenberg  203   321    524   382   174     556     585   1080   .387    .687   .542
Kenyon     191   414    605   442   186     628     633   1233   .316    .704   .513
Hiram     266   458    724   369   162     531     635   1255   .367    .695   .506
OWU             223   443    666   432   202     634     655   1300   .335    .681   .504
Allegheny     165   409    574   378   230     608     543   1182   .287    .622   .459
Denison     173   409    582   347   217     564     520   1146   .297    .615   .454
Oberlin     137   454    591   368   183     551     505   1142   .232    .668   .442

Totals   1766 3581  5347   3639 1701   5340   5405   10687   .330    .681   .506

I don't know how to get these columns to line up.  Anybody know if there is a way?

The format is this, using square brackets instead of squggly ones:

{table}
{tr}{td}data point or heading{/td}{td}data point or heading{/td} (etc. to the end of the row) {/tr}
{tr}{td}data point or heading{/td}{td}data point or heading{/td} (etc. to the end of the row) {/tr}
{tr}{td}data point or heading{/td}{td}data point or heading{/td} (etc. to the end of the row) {/tr}
{/table}

Comes out like this:

headingheadingheading
dp1dp3dp5
dp2dp4dp6
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2011, 02:52:42 PM
Wabash 83, Oberlin 55
Denison 99, Allegheny 89
OWU 74, Kenyon 70

Standings prior to tonight's Witt/Woo showdown:

1. Wooster 8-0, 17-0
2. Wittenberg 7-0, 12-4
3. Wabash 7-2, 15-2
4. Ohio Wesleyan 6-3, 10-8
5. Kenyon 4-5, 8-10
6. Denison 3-7, 6-12
7. Hiram 2-6, 8-9
8. Allegheny 2-8, 5-13
9. Oberlin 0-9, 1-17
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2011, 09:13:41 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 22, 2011, 11:36:25 AM
A few keys to tonight's big game between Wooster and Wittenberg:

- How does Wooster try to slow down Clayton Black and Chris Sullivan?
- How does Wittenberg try to slow down Ian Franks, Nathan Balch and Justin Hallowell?

- Does each team play man to man defense and who denies three pointers better?
- Do Ian Franks and Michael Cooper guard each other and how does that matchup play out?
- Which team wins the battle of the boards?

I plan on watching a great rivalry game at Timken tonight!  It should be a "blackout"! ;D ;)

GO SCOTS!

This is truly an outstanding rivalry.  Sometimes in such rivalries, the standard questions do not apply.  It's more like
- Which role player will step up when the big names are ineffective due to foul trouble, cold shooting, or good defense?
- Which team will overcome uncharacteristic weaknesses in its usual gameplan?

Black and Sullivan were non-factors, and yet Wittenberg led most of the game behind a big game from Cameron Walton.  Wooster shot 4 of 22 from the arc, and still managed to pull out the 65-58 victory.  Strange things happen in rivalry games.  Thank god.

Congratulations to Wooster's Bryan Wickliffe, whose 12 points (10 in the second half, which were huge) put him over the 1,000 point mark in his career.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2011, 09:18:39 PM
Standings through the games of 1/22:

1. Wooster 9-0, 18-0
2. Wittenberg 7-1, 12-5
3. Wabash 7-2, 15-2
4. Ohio Wesleyan 6-3, 10-8
5. Kenyon 4-5, 8-10
6. Denison 3-7, 6-12
7. Hiram 2-6, 8-9
8. Allegheny 2-8, 5-13
9. Oberlin 0-9, 1-17
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 22, 2011, 10:19:20 PM
Congratulations to Wooster. The fight they showed in the late comeback impressed me. The 3-point shot was never there, but tonight they got it done. This squad keeps finding ways to win basketball games, and especially in this rivalry, that's all that tends to matter at the end of the day. Wittenberg put forth an incredible effort and it looked like they would bring it home at several points throughout the evening. The first-hand report indicates that the atmosphere in Timken was incredible.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 22, 2011, 11:10:08 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 22, 2011, 10:19:20 PM
The first-hand report indicates that the atmosphere in Timken was incredible.

Incredible may just be an understatement.  First of all, it was a packed house in full black attire.  And when Wooster finally climbed all the way back to actually take the lead, I don't think I've ever heard Timken louder. 

One of the keys to the comeback for me was Witt going into stall mode after doing such a great job of building their 11 point lead.  Witt was milking the shot clock on almost every possession and as a result, were not getting the quality looks at the basket as they had been so effective at doing for the most part of the first 10 minutes in the 2nd half.  And Wooster took advantage, slowly but surely pecking away at the Witt lead and the more the Witt lead shrunk, the tighter the Witt players became.

Bryan, I totally agree about how impressive this team is in finding ways to win.  When Witt stretched the lead out to 11, in years past, I don't think we would have seen the game finish the way we saw it finish tonight.  But this team just doesn't quit.  I have been critical of their poor finishes in a couple of games they had well in hand and almost blew (Wilmington, Wabash) but at the same time, they have proven they have what it takes to make the plays down the stretch when they are behind to pull out wins as well (CMU, Allegheny, Denison, and Witt).


And good points David about how all of our predictions about who will guard who and who will need to be stopped can go ahead and get thrown out the window.  Black turns out to be stoppable when he gets into foul trouble.  And the battle between he and Wick never truly materialized as Wick spent some time on the bench in foul trouble as well.  And Witt didn't just put Cooper on Franks.  Instead they chose to collapse down on him with double and triple teams and they got away with it because Wooster was colder than the temps outside from deep.  Thankfully for Wooster they weren't the only ones frigid as Sullivan finished with only one made trey for Witt.  And who would have ever guessed Cameron Walton almost was the hero of the night for Witt going 4-6 from deep to almost be the unlikely hero. 

But as the great ones always do, Franks made the plays when he needed down the stretch to once again led all scorers in yet another All-America type performance reminding everyone why he is the reigning NCAC POY.

And I too will send my congrats to Wick on joining the 1000 point club at Wooster!  His 10 second half points were absolutely HUGE in helping the Scots to this come from behind win!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2011, 11:23:19 PM
Wooster has now won five of the last six meetings between these two ancient rivals, and has closed to within four games in the all-time series (Witt leads 51-47).  The first meeting was 99 years and 2 days ago, when Wooster clocked Witt 59-12 at home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 22, 2011, 11:32:07 PM
Back from Timken where I watched Wooster rally from 11 points down to get the big win tonight! :)

Three Seniors and One Junior won this game for the Scots along with some great team defense down the stretch of the game.  Ian Franks 17, Nathan Balch 15 and Bryan Wickliffe 12 combined for 44 points by the Seniors and Junior Justin Hallowell added a big 14 points.

Wooster still trailed this game 54-49 with just over 3 minutes left.  In the last 3 minutes, Ian Franks scored 7 points and Justin Hallowell scored 7 points!  Granted 4 of those 14 points were on free throws when Witt had to foul at the very end of the game but the other 10 points were the game changers.  In fact, those 10 points were on a run that took a Wooster deficit at 49-54 and turned it into a Wooster lead of 59-54!

In the last 3 minutes, the Wooster team defense held Wittenberg to just 4 points as they finished with 58.  There was a critical 6 point swing in about 45 seconds when Hallowell hit the three pointer to tie it up 54-54 and after Witt failed to score, Franks had a traditional three point play.  Suddenly, Wooster led 57-54 and Witt could not recover.

Kudos to Wittenberg as they played tough defense all night and Cameron Walton with 4 three pointers led the Witt team who canned 8 three pointers total and nearly pulled the upset.

Great crowd tonight as Wooster nation numbered over 3,100 and it was a blackout as ScotsFan noted. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2011, 10:05:58 AM
Here is the Wooster Daily Record story on the Scots big win: http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4968517
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 23, 2011, 11:30:17 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 22, 2011, 11:32:07 PM

Great crowd tonight as Wooster nation numbered over 3,100 and it was a blackout as ScotsFan noted. ;D
It should also be noted that the Big Red rolled past Allegheny in front of 390 intimidating fans. ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 23, 2011, 12:18:27 PM
"We thought Wooster had more to lose than us and we had more to gain," Brown added. "But there's a long way to go and a lot of good teams everyone has to play yet."

Coach Brown is correct with this statement. If Wooster is to make it to the finals of the NCAC tournament (10 games in all) - in all likelyhood 5 of those games will be against the 3 W's. What are the odds they can run the table with that schedule?

Regardless - this is a special group of players. If they can make it to the Final Four the comparisons to 2003 & 2007 would be fun to read.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2011, 01:21:48 PM
Quote from: goscots on January 23, 2011, 12:18:27 PM
"We thought Wooster had more to lose than us and we had more to gain," Coach Brown added. "But there's a long way to go and a lot of good teams everyone has to play yet."

Very true.  There is a long way to go and Wooster needs to focus on one game at a time.

Next game is at Kenyon on Wednesday.  Wooster barely escaped Gambier last year with a narrow 66-65 win at the buzzer.

To beat the Lords, the Scots need to focus on slowing down Kodey Haddox who dropped 28 points on Witt and 23 points on OWU in recent games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 23, 2011, 03:17:11 PM
After a pretty shaky start to the season, Wittenberg has really pulled it together and is looking pretty good now.  I wonder what their record (and Pool C chances) would be if Cooper and McKee weren't football players?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 23, 2011, 11:29:36 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on January 23, 2011, 11:30:17 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 22, 2011, 11:32:07 PM

Great crowd tonight as Wooster nation numbered over 3,100 and it was a blackout as ScotsFan noted. ;D
It should also be noted that the Big Red rolled past Allegheny in front of 390 intimidating fans. ::)

I wouldn't say they rolled.  They did lead coast-to-coast, but had to hang on and make FT's at the end, which they did.  Four players in double figures, led by Hale with 28, in an unusually high scoring affair for the Big Red. 

It would be nice to see Dimonde get POW in the conference this week, as he also dropped 18 in the loss against Capital.  Ness from Allegheny had a great week too, pouring in 31 against us last night on impressive 14-16 shooting.  He should be a candidate this week as well since most of the usual high point producers were down a little in scoring.  It will be interesting to see who gets picked.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 24, 2011, 12:21:41 PM
Question for any Witt followers out there...  What has happened to Wittenberg's fan support?  I was shocked to see how few fans made the trip to Wooster this weekend.  It looked like there was just about nobody outside of parents, and I think I counted a total of 4 or 5 that looked like they might be students.  I know that their fans don't travel nearly as well as Wooster's do, but still I expected to see a lot more red in the stands.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2011, 02:22:02 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 24, 2011, 12:21:41 PM
Question for any Witt followers out there...  What has happened to Wittenberg's fan support?  I was shocked to see how few fans made the trip to Wooster this weekend.  It looked like there was just about nobody outside of parents, and I think I counted a total of 4 or 5 that looked like they might be students.  I know that their fans don't travel nearly as well as Wooster's do, but still I expected to see a lot more red in the stands.

Let's look at it from the perspective of current Witt students.  Seniors at Witt right now have seen Witt lose 6 times in 8 tries to Wooster.  The've also seen Witt seasons end, with pretty middling records, in the quarterfinals of the league tournament...twice.  So they aren't beating Wooster, they aren't making the NCAA tournament, and their records haven't been all that great (in the experience of the current student body).  The buzz around Witt hoops probably just isn't as high as it was 5-6 years ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on January 24, 2011, 02:48:50 PM
another couple observations about traveling students. remember students are poor, gas prices are up. Personally knowing some former Witt students, they commented they planned on making the trip to the conference tournament  in Wooster or Wabash and thus; seeing their team play 2 games when it mattered instead of driving 3 hours to watch them play one regular season game. Also, i think the school has something to do with the low student attendence because in the past i believe they brought busses of students up for the game ? maybe the bussing wasnt offered ? or some other events on campus effected the turnout ( frat pledging or some other non athletic event).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 24, 2011, 03:12:27 PM
I understand that students don't generally make too many road trips, and my point really wasn't intended to single out the small student turnout.  Overall, I've never seen such a small visiting crowd at Timken for a Witt game.  But perhaps many of the same factors that were mentioned apply to the non-student fans as well.

And certainly Wooster's students don't travel either.  I don't expect more than a dozen or so to make the trip to Springield in a few weeks.  But I do expect that overall we'll overflow the small area into which they try to cram all the Wooster supporters.  Esp if the Scots manage to remain undefeated until then.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2011, 09:22:33 PM
I believe that Wittenberg has not been drawing well at home, either (relatively speaking; I'm sure they still outdraw Oberlin and Allegheny and so forth).  The enthusiasm that used to surround that program seems to have abated somewhat over the past several years of relative mediocrity (bearing in mind that, for Witt, anything short of outright dominance qualifies as "relative mediocrity.")  Pennstghs has been commenting on the small crowds and poor student turnout for at least a couple of years now. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 24, 2011, 09:42:28 PM
Does it cost anything to get into a Witt game? Do students have to pay?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 24, 2011, 09:48:07 PM
I feel that I"m obligated to make a response:

Yes, Witt's students don't travel and even at home games are very quiet. Last Wednesday i.e. big game vs Wabash, decent amoutn of students in attendance, barely a peep out of them the whole time. Very frustrating.

Saturday, there was greek life pledging I believe, however, I don't think the crowd that actually goes to the games would be affected by that, just a smaller turnout. However, I do expect a SELLOUT when wooster comes to Wittenberg. I probably will jinx by saying this but by looking at Witt's schedule prior to the rematch, they have at Ohio Wesleyan as a potential loss in my eyes. The overall pizzazz of the program has gone down and overall everywhere as well. Students do get in free, but 8 bucks for adults? A little steep.

I didnt' see or listen to the game Saturday but from what I can gather from it Wittenberg (by their own doing it appears) took Black and Sullivan out of the game and Witt did what they could to take Franks out of the game, so the game was decided by which team had a a more productive bench, which turned out to be Wooster. Witt should have won it appears, but we'll be ready for the rematch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2011, 10:12:15 PM
Here is Wittenberg's Average Attendance Per Home Game by Season:

2000-2001:  1,184
2001-2002:  1,099
2002-2003:    896
2003-2004:  1,159
2004-2005:  1,118
2005-2006:  1,179  30-4 NCAA Runnerup
2006-2007:    946
2007-2008:    776   16-10 record
2008-2009:    645   13-13 record
2009-2010:    684   21-7 record
2010-2011:    687   8 home games to date   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2011, 10:18:55 PM
Here is Wooster's Average Attendance Per Home Game by Season:

2000-2001:  1,734
2001-2002:  1,232
2002-2003:  1,621  30-3 NCAA Final 4
2003-2004:  1,183
2004-2005:  1,564
2005-2006:  1,716
2006-2007:  2,036  29-5 NCAA Final 4
2007-2008:  1,638
2008-2009:  1,689
2009-2010:  1,448
2010-2011:  1,558  9 home games to date
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2011, 10:24:40 PM
In the last 10 years, Wabash Average Attendance Per Home Game was always less than 700 per game until the Little Giants became more competitive..... :)

2008-2009:  687
2009-2010:  821
2010-2011:  962  Clearly, the national ranking of Wabash has raised attendance this season! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 24, 2011, 10:28:19 PM
First semester Wabash crowds were always spotty, it seemed, and picked up during the second semester after comps.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 25, 2011, 07:52:27 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2011, 10:18:55 PM
Here is Wooster's Average Attendance Per Home Game by Season:

2000-2001:  1,734
2001-2002:  1,232
2002-2003:  1,621  30-3 NCAA Final 4
2003-2004:  1,183
2004-2005:  1,564
2005-2006:  1,716
2006-2007:  2,036  29-5 NCAA Final 4
2007-2008:  1,638
2008-2009:  1,689
2009-2010:  1,448
2010-2011:  1,558  9 home games to date
Much of Wooster's consistently good attendance can be attributed to community support.  The Downtown Rebounders, established in the early 70s by Coach Van Wie and insurance executive Gene Schorman (sp), have worked to establish a strong-positive relationship between the college basketball program and the business community.  It's not unusual to see 100 local business leaders and their families at Scot games.  Many local newspaper articles on the Scots include the Rebounders activities as evidenced in the last two paragraphs here:  http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4755608 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 25, 2011, 08:10:12 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 24, 2011, 09:48:07 PM
I didnt' see or listen to the game Saturday but from what I can gather from it Wittenberg (by their own doing it appears) took Black and Sullivan out of the game and Witt did what they could to take Franks out of the game, so the game was decided by which team had a a more productive bench, which turned out to be Wooster. Witt should have won it appears, but we'll be ready for the rematch.

Clayton Black, of course, spent much of the game on the bench with foul trouble.  During his time on the floor, though, he really wasn't that effective.  It didn't seem to me that Witt lost that much when he was out, especially when Wickliffe was out also.  They were still able to score pretty well down low, as almost always seems to be the case against Wooster.

As for Sullivan, that was really Nathan Balch's doing.  Balch has become a terrific hustle defender and was in Sullivan's face all night, even out to 22-23 feet.  He never got a good look all night and forced up some threes that he shouldn't have.

I thought Witt did a terrific job on Franks, or any of Wooster's players that tried to utilize a high pick.  They jumped out very quickly, instituting a double-team.  Then someone from down low was always there to pick up the picker if he rolled to the hoop.  This has become the standard way to defense this play (Wooster does it, too) but the Tigers did it as well or better than I've ever seen.

Wooster's bench had its ups and downs.  Justin Warnes had a very nice defensive game and shook himself loose for two layups, one on a fast break (nice long pass by Fegan, I believe) and one when Wickliffe found him with a nice dish inside.  Mike Evans managed five rebounds in eight minutes but also went 0-3 from the floor. (Tough luck, his shots were very close.) Josh Claytor was fair in 16 minutes (due to Wickliffe's first-half foul trouble) of action.  

Ryan Snyder and Jake Mays, on the other hand, only played six and two minutes respectively and weren't effective.    

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 25, 2011, 08:54:19 AM
I've been trying to find the game times for this season's DIII Final Four but have had no luck.  The dates are March 18th and 19th, a Friday and Saturday.  Does anyone know what time they play?  I've been to the NCAA site and can find no times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 25, 2011, 09:03:19 AM
The Friday games are at 6 & 8.  Saturday at 1 & 3:30.  Per the Salem Civic Center site (http://www.salemciviccenter.com/).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 25, 2011, 09:22:14 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 25, 2011, 09:03:19 AM
The Friday games are at 6 & 8.  Saturday at 1 & 3:30.  Per the Salem Civic Center site (http://www.salemciviccenter.com/).

Thanks!  And according to the site, there's an all-star game prior to the championship game.  I'd have to think that if Wooster doesn't make it to the Final Four that Ian Franks would have a very good chance of playing in that game.

Plus, night games on Friday means golf, weather permitting. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2011, 12:35:33 PM
I gather it's not golf weather back east, but basketball goes on!

Denison at Wittenberg, 7:30pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/)
Hiram at Oberlin, 7:30pm -- video and live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/)
Wooster at Kenyon, 7:30pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml); audio  (http://wkvx.com/)(W)
Wabash at OWU, 7:30pm -- audio/video and live stats (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1)
Allegheny is idle

It is, however, golf weather out here, and has been for most of the last two weeks...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2011, 01:28:06 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 14, 2011, 03:33:24 PM
The first two games mentioned in the poll are approaching, so I've locked the voting.  I'll immortalize the results, and we'll see if any of them came true.

OWU over Wabash, 1/26 -- 8 votes -- TONIGHT
Allegheny over Wabash, 1/15 -- 7 votes -- Wabash 80, Allegheny 58
Hiram over Wooster, 2/2 -- 6 votes
Denison over Wooster, 1/15 -- 3 votes -- Wooster 72, Denison 64

Thanks for participating!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2011, 01:29:03 PM
[bump]

Standings through the games of 1/22:

1. Wooster 9-0, 18-0
2. Wittenberg 7-1, 12-5
3. Wabash 7-2, 15-2
4. Ohio Wesleyan 6-3, 10-8
5. Kenyon 4-5, 8-10
6. Denison 3-7, 6-12
7. Hiram 2-6, 8-9
8. Allegheny 2-8, 5-13
9. Oberlin 0-9, 1-17

[/bump]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 26, 2011, 08:06:37 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 47  Kenyon 30

Wooster is being led by Nathan Balch with 16 points (4 three pointers), Ian Franks with 11 and Bryan Wickliffe 8.

Lords are being led by Brian Lebowitz 6, Kodey Haddox 6 and Uros Vasiljevick 6.

Scots shot over 50% in the half, made 6 three pointers and outrebounded Kenyon 19 to 13.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 26, 2011, 08:18:55 PM
It appears to be no letdown tonight for the Scots as they are taking it to a shorthanded Kenyon down in Gambier!

To say Balch is on fire may be a bit of an understatement tonight.  As wsf noted he's already chipped in 16 points and he's 6-7 from the floor and a perfect 4-4 from deep!   8-)

In other action, Wabash and OWU are locked up in a defensive struggle down in Delaware as Wabash leads that one at the half 45-40.  :P   Wabash is shooting 51% fro the half and 53% from deep while OWU is shooting 47% for the half.

And Witt is pummeling Denison as it is 52-20 with the 2nd half just underway.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 26, 2011, 09:07:41 PM
Final:  Wooster 103  Kenyon 67 :)

Wooster's Top Scorers:  Nathan Balch 22, Ian Franks 20, Bryan Wickliffe 12, Jake Mays 12, Ryan Snyder 10

Kenyon's Top Scorers:  Brian Lebowitz 17, Kodey Haddox 11, Marcus Healey 10

Scots wrapped up this game early and cleared the bench with everyone getting playing time.

Wooster is now 19-0, 10-0 NCAC  ;D   Scots play Idle on Saturday ;)  Next game is 2/2 at Hiram

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 26, 2011, 09:15:09 PM
Wabash 76, OWU 87

Tim Brady with 36, Wes Smith with 29.

This was a 1-point game at the five minute mark, and then OWU won the closing section of the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 26, 2011, 09:16:58 PM
As kb noted, OWU knocks off Wabash as the Lil Giants suffer a serious blow to their hopes of a conference championship.

Wabash cooled off significantly shooting in the second half as they finish the game at 37% after shooting over 50% in the first half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 26, 2011, 09:25:20 PM
All the NCAC 1/26 Final Scores:

Wooster 103  Kenyon 67

Wittenberg 82  Denison 54

Ohio Wesleyan 87  Wabash 76

Hiram 77  Oberlin 57
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 26, 2011, 09:29:17 PM
Current NCAC Standings with 1/26 Results:

1. Wooster 10-0, 19-0
2. Wittenberg 8-1, 13-5
3. Wabash 7-3, 15-3
3. Ohio Wesleyan 7-3, 11-8
5. Kenyon 4-6, 8-11
6. Hiram 3-6, 9-9
7. Denison 3-7, 6-13
8. Allegheny 2-8, 5-13
9. Oberlin 0-10, 1-18
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on January 26, 2011, 09:29:44 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 26, 2011, 09:15:09 PM
Wabash 76, OWU 87

Tim Brady with 36, Wes Smith with 29.

This was a 1-point game at the five minute mark, and then OWU won the closing section of the game.

This Calvin fan would like to thank the Bishops for their effort tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2011, 09:51:30 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 14, 2011, 03:33:24 PM
The first two games mentioned in the poll are approaching, so I've locked the voting.  I'll immortalize the results, and we'll see if any of them came true.

OWU over Wabash, 1/26 -- 8 votes -- OWU 87, Wabash 76
Allegheny over Wabash, 1/15 -- 7 votes -- Wabash 80, Allegheny 58
Hiram over Wooster, 2/2 -- 6 votes
Denison over Wooster, 1/15 -- 3 votes -- Wooster 72, Denison 64

Thanks for participating!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2011, 10:19:49 PM
Oof, this hurts in rankings, but also Wabash trying for the "C". Plenty of time to recover, but they need to play better!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 26, 2011, 10:31:00 PM
Quote from: ziggy on January 26, 2011, 09:29:44 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 26, 2011, 09:15:09 PM
Wabash 76, OWU 87

Tim Brady with 36, Wes Smith with 29.

This was a 1-point game at the five minute mark, and then OWU won the closing section of the game.

This Calvin fan would like to thank the Bishops for their effort tonight.

As a Wooster fan I have mixed feelings about this game.  I'm happy to see Wabash lose and minimize the chances that the NCAC tourney would be in Crawfordsville.  But I really would like to have seen 'Bash wait until next week to lose, to maximize their chances of being included in the regional rankings.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 26, 2011, 10:50:32 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 26, 2011, 10:31:00 PM
As a Wooster fan I have mixed feelings about this game.  I'm happy to see Wabash lose and minimize the chances that the NCAC tourney would be in Crawfordsville.  But I really would like to have seen 'Bash wait until next week to lose, to maximize their chances of being included in the regional rankings.

I think Wabash is still in decent shape ranking wise. The only teams that are probably ahead of them are Wooster, Hope and Marietta. Even though they lost to Witt, they have three more region wins and a couple of really good non-conference regional wins. Now, a whole host of teams are probably right on their heels (Witt, Penn St. Behrend, Thiel, Calvin, Capital, JCU), but Wabash will play Wooster and Witt probably three more times, maybe four. If they split those games, they will finished ranked. If they beat Witt at home, which I still think they will, they will likely stay ahead of Witt heading into the conference tournament. A lot of these teams still have to play each other at least one more time, and Witt still has to go to OWU. I don't remember the region being so in-flux after the top spot in a while.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 26, 2011, 11:14:23 PM
Nothing to say about tonights's Witt-Denison game other than that Witt was on fire and did everything they needed to win in about 15 minutes in the first half. 

Josh McKee saw action - answering the question about his red shirt.  Also learned Larry Farmer is red shirting and will return to the Big Red next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 26, 2011, 11:16:13 PM
Let's call it like it is..... Wabash has lost it's shot mid-season.  

Cost them tonight against the Bishops.... and definitely at Witt.

They will find it again...but will it be in time.

WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2011, 11:19:41 PM
Quote from: GoRed on January 26, 2011, 11:14:23 PMAlso learned Larry Farmer is red shirting and will return to the Big Red next year.
Now there's some news!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on January 26, 2011, 11:30:29 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 26, 2011, 10:50:32 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 26, 2011, 10:31:00 PM
As a Wooster fan I have mixed feelings about this game.  I'm happy to see Wabash lose and minimize the chances that the NCAC tourney would be in Crawfordsville.  But I really would like to have seen 'Bash wait until next week to lose, to maximize their chances of being included in the regional rankings.

I think Wabash is still in decent shape ranking wise. The only teams that are probably ahead of them are Wooster, Hope and Marietta. Even though they lost to Witt, they have three more region wins and a couple of really good non-conference regional wins. Now, a whole host of teams are probably right on their heels (Witt, Penn St. Behrend, Thiel, Calvin, Capital, JCU), but Wabash will play Wooster and Witt probably three more times, maybe four. If they split those games, they will finished ranked. If they beat Witt at home, which I still think they will, they will likely stay ahead of Witt heading into the conference tournament. A lot of these teams still have to play each other at least one more time, and Witt still has to go to OWU. I don't remember the region being so in-flux after the top spot in a while.

GL looks wide open to me right now. My opinion as it stands right now:

1. Wooster - safely
2. Hope - safely for now (@ Calvin on Saturday, if they lose then throw them in the mix below)
3. Could put Wabash or Thiel, or maybe Calvin (depending on result versus Hope). Marietta's ultra low SOS makes them look like a stretch to me, although they've done well versus regionally ranked.
4. See above
5. See above
6. Marietta / John Carroll / Adrian / PSU-Behrend

Basically, it looks like Wooster then a massive fight to the death for 2-6.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 27, 2011, 02:47:31 AM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on January 26, 2011, 11:30:29 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 26, 2011, 10:50:32 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 26, 2011, 10:31:00 PM
As a Wooster fan I have mixed feelings about this game.  I'm happy to see Wabash lose and minimize the chances that the NCAC tourney would be in Crawfordsville.  But I really would like to have seen 'Bash wait until next week to lose, to maximize their chances of being included in the regional rankings.

I think Wabash is still in decent shape ranking wise. The only teams that are probably ahead of them are Wooster, Hope and Marietta. Even though they lost to Witt, they have three more region wins and a couple of really good non-conference regional wins. Now, a whole host of teams are probably right on their heels (Witt, Penn St. Behrend, Thiel, Calvin, Capital, JCU), but Wabash will play Wooster and Witt probably three more times, maybe four. If they split those games, they will finished ranked. If they beat Witt at home, which I still think they will, they will likely stay ahead of Witt heading into the conference tournament. A lot of these teams still have to play each other at least one more time, and Witt still has to go to OWU. I don't remember the region being so in-flux after the top spot in a while.

GL looks wide open to me right now. My opinion as it stands right now:

1. Wooster - safely
2. Hope - safely for now (@ Calvin on Saturday, if they lose then throw them in the mix below)
3. Could put Wabash or Thiel, or maybe Calvin (depending on result versus Hope). Marietta's ultra low SOS makes them look like a stretch to me, although they've done well versus regionally ranked.
4. See above
5. See above
6. Marietta / John Carroll / Adrian / PSU-Behrend

Basically, it looks like Wooster then a massive fight to the death for 2-6.

Probably lather, rinse, repeat for most of the regions in this wacky year where no one wants to be ranked under the Top 10.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 27, 2011, 08:27:47 PM
In case anyone might not have seen, Coach Moore was a guest tonight on Hoopsville.  I'm sure if you missed it, you can check out the arcives tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 27, 2011, 09:43:57 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 27, 2011, 08:27:47 PM
In case anyone might not have seen, Coach Moore was a guest tonight on Hoopsville.  I'm sure if you missed it, you can check out the arcives tomorrow.
Archive (http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/12288562)
Coach Moore begins at about 1:10.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2011, 11:59:16 AM
There is an excellent in-depth interview with Coach Moore produced by the students at Woo91, available here (http://soundcloud.com/woo91/morewithmooredebut1).  It lasts 44 minutes.  The students were well-prepared and asked some great questions which succeeded in getting the usually reticent Coach to open up a little bit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seventiesraider on January 28, 2011, 02:52:01 PM
Nice article in the Akron Beacon-Journal about Wooster being Ohio's other #1  Scots in state of perfection (http://www.ohio.com/sports/114780254.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2011, 06:54:20 PM
A few things four y'all to enjoy while I'm at work tomorrow:

Kenyon at Wabash, 3pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
OWU at Allegheny, ~3pm -- live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/) -- game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Wittenberg at Oberlin, ~3pm -- video and live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/) -- game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Denison at Hiram, ~4pm -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html) -- game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Wooster is idle

Current standings:
1. Wooster 10-0, 19-0
2. Wittenberg 8-1, 13-5
3. Wabash 7-3, 15-3
3. Ohio Wesleyan 7-3, 11-8
5. Kenyon 4-6, 8-11
6. Hiram 3-6, 9-9
7. Denison 3-7, 6-13
8. Allegheny 2-8, 5-13
9. Oberlin 0-10, 1-18
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2011, 08:18:23 PM
What will happen first - Wooster loses or the Cavaliers win?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 29, 2011, 09:58:02 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 28, 2011, 08:18:23 PM
What will happen first - Wooster loses or the Cavaliers win?

That's a very good question.   :D

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on January 29, 2011, 11:36:05 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 29, 2011, 09:58:02 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 28, 2011, 08:18:23 PM
What will happen first - Wooster loses or the Cavaliers win?

That's a very good question.   :D


wooster loses is my bet
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 29, 2011, 05:07:44 PM
NCAC 1/29 Final Scores:

Wittenberg 75  Oberlin 47

Wabash 74  Kenyon 65

Ohio Wesleyan 69  Allegheny 61

Hiram 78  Denison 60
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 29, 2011, 05:17:23 PM
NCAC Current Standings with 1/29 Results:

1. Wooster 10-0, 19-0
2. Wittenberg 9-1, 14-5
3. Wabash 8-3, 16-3
3. Ohio Wesleyan 8-3, 12-8
5. Hiram 4-6, 10-9
6. Kenyon 4-7, 8-12
7. Denison 3-8, 6-14
8. Allegheny 2-9, 5-14
9. Oberlin 0-11, 1-19

 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 29, 2011, 06:30:04 PM
AJ Sutherlin didn't play against Kenyon. What's the word?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 29, 2011, 06:39:40 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 29, 2011, 06:30:04 PM
AJ Sutherlin didn't play against Kenyon. What's the word?

On the video stream I only saw AJ in a sweatshirt and he was noticeably limping. Apparently it is an ankle injury.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 31, 2011, 10:49:12 AM
Don't look now, but Witt could find their way into the top 25 this week.  They are currently #31, but several teams just ahead of them didn't make it through the week unscathed.  Teams above them that lost include #'s 24, 26, 27, 28, 29, and 30.  Meanwhile Witt won both of their games by an average of 28 points.  IWU is #20 and they also lost, but given the pollsters apparent love for the Titans/CCIW, they will probably move up in the polls after their narrow loss to #3 Augie...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2011, 10:59:01 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 31, 2011, 10:49:12 AMIWU is #20 and they also lost, but given the pollsters apparent love for the Titans/CCIW, they will probably move up in the polls after their narrow loss to #3 Augie...  :P
Kind of like how Witt moved up in the polls (from 1 point to 24) after their narrow loss to #1 Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on January 31, 2011, 10:59:59 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 31, 2011, 10:59:01 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 31, 2011, 10:49:12 AMIWU is #20 and they also lost, but given the pollsters apparent love for the Titans/CCIW, they will probably move up in the polls after their narrow loss to #3 Augie...  :P
Kind of like how Witt moved up in the polls (from 1 point to 24) after their narrow loss to #1 Wooster.

Except Witt wasn't already overrated by about 20 slots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 31, 2011, 12:14:56 PM
For what it's worth, I don't think IWU is in a position to move up in the poll. I know most of the comments are sarcastic/tongue in cheek, but I hear plenty of voter frustration. IWU dropped off a handful of ballots last week already. This week won't bring them back for those people, I'm sure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2011, 12:53:54 PM
Great article (http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/sports/stories/2011/01/29/no-giving-in.html) about OWU's hearing-impaired starter, Greg White, in the Columbus Dispatch this weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 31, 2011, 01:45:37 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on January 31, 2011, 10:59:59 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 31, 2011, 10:59:01 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 31, 2011, 10:49:12 AMIWU is #20 and they also lost, but given the pollsters apparent love for the Titans/CCIW, they will probably move up in the polls after their narrow loss to #3 Augie...  :P
Kind of like how Witt moved up in the polls (from 1 point to 24) after their narrow loss to #1 Wooster.

Except Witt wasn't already overrated by about 20 slots.

This and the fact that Witt also had a win over the then #7 team in the land that week to go along with their narrow loss at Wooster. 

And just for the record, my comment was tongue in cheek which is why I put the emoticon.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2011, 08:54:08 PM
You were right, ScotsFan, Wittenberg is the new #25 in the poll.  They still trail IWU, though.  ;) Witt's debut means that 12% of the top 25 men's teams are NCAC members.  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryder16 on February 01, 2011, 07:18:30 AM
12% .... interesting way of wording it. haha. i would say three of the W's crack the top 25. but you say tomato i say...  well, something similar
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 01, 2011, 08:01:34 AM
Congrats to Witt for cracking the Top 25, looks like they're finally coming to fruition of the team they knew they could be once they got everyone somewhat healthy and on the same page.

Dangerous game tomorrow night vs Kenyon, need to keep it rolling
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2011, 12:08:12 PM
Hiram, Denison, and Wittenberg are all closed today.  Doesn't bode too well for tomorrow's schedule:

Oberlin at Allegheny, 6pm -- live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/) -- Game 1 of a M/W doubleheader -- the drive is right through the Snowbelt
Wabash at Denison, ~8pm -- video and live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html) -- Game 2 of a doubleheader, women vs. OWU at 6 -- sounds like I-70 may be a mess, though
Wooster at Hiram, ~8pm -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html); audio (http://wkvx.com/) (W) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader -- ever seen Price Gymnasium's parking lot after a big snow?  Neither has anyone else
Kenyon at Wittenberg, ~8pm -- audio, video, and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader -- Witt is closed, and Gambier is impossible to get out of in a big snow
OWU is idle -- and maybe not alone
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2011, 12:13:44 PM
Oh by the way, it's sunny and about 50 here, with a forecast high of 58.  So please, don't worry about me! (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fnoisen.com%2FSmileys%2Fcyna%2Fwhistling2.gif&hash=643df003478c141f36962cb121cdf374b22323c8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2011, 12:27:10 PM
Good article (http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/sports/stories/2011/02/01/bkc-ohio-insider-2-1-art-gsabfreu-1.html) in today's Columbus Dispatch about Denison's undefeated and 14th ranked women's team.  It also has a tag ending about OWU's men and their winning streak, featuring this classic observation:
Quote from: Mark ZnidarToday, the Bishops are 12-8 and third in the North Coast Athletic Conference at 8-3, trailing only Wooster, a national power, and Wittenberg.
(emphasis added) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2011, 02:06:48 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 01, 2011, 12:08:12 PM
Hiram, Denison, and Wittenberg are all closed today.  Doesn't bode too well for tomorrow's schedule:

Oberlin at Allegheny, 6pm -- live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/) -- Game 1 of a M/W doubleheader -- the drive is right through the Snowbelt
Wabash at Denison, ~8pm -- video and live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html) -- Game 2 of a doubleheader, women vs. OWU at 6 -- sounds like I-70 may be a mess, though
Wooster at Hiram, ~8pm -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html); audio (http://wkvx.com/) (W) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader -- ever seen Price Gymnasium's parking lot after a big snow?  Neither has anyone else
Kenyon at Wittenberg, ~8pm -- audio, video, and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader -- Witt is closed, and Gambier is impossible to get out of in a big snow
OWU is idle -- and maybe not alone

First casualty is in:  Wabash at Denison has been postponed until Thursday at 7:30, and pessimism reigns even for that date.  A make-up date for that make-up date has already been penciled in for next Monday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 01, 2011, 05:36:22 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 01, 2011, 12:13:44 PM
Oh by the way, it's sunny and about 50 here, with a forecast high of 58.  So please, don't worry about me! (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fnoisen.com%2FSmileys%2Fcyna%2Fwhistling2.gif&hash=643df003478c141f36962cb121cdf374b22323c8)

Sunny and 80 here in Cancun!   8-)
And the mango daiquiris are great!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 01, 2011, 08:21:59 PM
Wabash at Denison game is postponed until Thursday Feb 3 at 7:30 pm.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 01, 2011, 08:23:21 PM
oops - didn't see David's post on this page.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 01, 2011, 09:08:51 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 01, 2011, 05:36:22 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 01, 2011, 12:13:44 PM
Oh by the way, it's sunny and about 50 here, with a forecast high of 58.  So please, don't worry about me! (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fnoisen.com%2FSmileys%2Fcyna%2Fwhistling2.gif&hash=643df003478c141f36962cb121cdf374b22323c8)

Sunny and 80 here in Cancun!   8-)
And the mango daiquiris are great!

Hmmmm....Shanghai, China and Cancun, Mexico all in the span of 4 months!  :o 8-)

Perhaps, your new handle should be "Derek World Traveler"! :P ;)   Is my jealousy showing? ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: D-III Insider on February 01, 2011, 09:48:08 PM
When do the first regional rankings come out?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 01, 2011, 09:49:47 PM
Quote from: D-III Insider on February 01, 2011, 09:48:08 PM
When do the first regional rankings come out?

Supposedly at least, late tomorrow afternoon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: D-III Insider on February 01, 2011, 11:08:53 PM
Thanks, Ypsi.

Here are my projections for Great Lakes Regional Rankings:

1.  Wooster - have had all the answers this year ... in fact for several years.
2.  Marietta - OAC leader.  Enough said.
3.  Hope - benefitting from a down year in MIAA.  Still a perennial power in region.
4.  Wittenberg - beat Wabash head up.  Getting healthier every day.  If McKee/Heiber ever get back close to 90% this year they
                          could become very diffuclt to beat especially in Springfield.
5.  Wabash - despite better overall record lost to Witt and at home to Wooster.  Then lost at OWU.
6.  John Carroll - may still be the team to beat in OAC tourney.  Experience in big games may get tehm over the Pioneers by end of year.

Other thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2011, 02:34:11 AM
Quote from: D-III Insider on February 01, 2011, 11:08:53 PM
Other thoughts?
Many other thoughts on this subject can be found here (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=5126.660).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 02, 2011, 06:50:26 AM
I don't know if I should be happy or sad about delay on denison game. I had planned on driving from columbus but I have to drive a snow plow tonight so it works out for me.


david
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 02, 2011, 07:46:27 AM
From the OAC board:
With so many opinions on here... I am curious to find out how would all the OAC followers rate the OAC coaches from top to bottom?

What about the ncac coaches?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on February 02, 2011, 09:05:42 AM
Mac Petty is a fine coach, a gentleman, a great friend and supporter of the essence of what Wabash IS, and is a source of leadership by example to and for both his team and all of the students. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2011, 12:42:39 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 01, 2011, 02:06:48 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 01, 2011, 12:08:12 PM
Hiram, Denison, and Wittenberg are all closed today.  Doesn't bode too well for tomorrow's schedule:

Oberlin at Allegheny, 6pm -- live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/) -- Game 1 of a M/W doubleheader -- the drive is right through the Snowbelt
Wabash at Denison, ~8pm -- video and live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html) -- Game 2 of a doubleheader, women vs. OWU at 6 -- sounds like I-70 may be a mess, though
Wooster at Hiram, ~8pm -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html); audio (http://wkvx.com/) (W) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader -- ever seen Price Gymnasium's parking lot after a big snow?  Neither has anyone else
Kenyon at Wittenberg, ~8pm -- audio, video, and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader -- Witt is closed, and Gambier is impossible to get out of in a big snow
OWU is idle -- and maybe not alone

First casualty is in:  Wabash at Denison has been postponed until Thursday at 7:30, and pessimism reigns even for that date.  A make-up date for that make-up date has already been penciled in for next Monday.

The whole slate has now been postponed until tomorrow.  Except for Denison, all the tip times remain the same.  DU has pushed theirs forward by a half hour (5:30 women, 7:30 men.)

Hiram, Wooster, Kenyon, OWU, and Wittenberg are all closed today, as is DePauw.  Denison is open but has canceled all classes (lucky employees!)  Oberlin is so snowbound that even their website is down.  Boy, do I miss living in Ohio!  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2011, 01:15:52 PM
The Daily Record on Wooster's "unsung hero," Bryan Wickliffe (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4974084).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2011, 02:01:53 PM

Quote from: David Collinge on January 14, 2011, 03:33:24 PM
The first two games mentioned in the poll are approaching, so I've locked the voting.  I'll immortalize the results, and we'll see if any of them came true.

OWU over Wabash, 1/26 -- 8 votes -- OWU 87, Wabash 76
Allegheny over Wabash, 1/15 -- 7 votes -- Wabash 80, Allegheny 58
Hiram over Wooster, tomorrow night (weather permitting) -- 6 votes
Denison over Wooster, 1/15 -- 3 votes -- Wooster 72, Denison 64

Thanks for participating!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 02, 2011, 02:04:49 PM
Quote from: D-III Insider on February 01, 2011, 11:08:53 PM

3.  Hope - benefitting from a down year in MIAA.  Still a perennial power in region.


MIAA
vs NCAC  5-1
vs OAC 5-1

Massey rankings
#9    MIAA
#11  OAC
#16  NCAC

Who's down in the what now?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 02, 2011, 02:13:08 PM
Quote from: D-III Insider on February 01, 2011, 11:08:53 PM
Thanks, Ypsi.

Here are my projections for Great Lakes Regional Rankings:

1.  Wooster - have had all the answers this year ... in fact for several years.
2.  Marietta - OAC leader.  Enough said.
3.  Hope - benefitting from a down year in MIAA.  Still a perennial power in region.
4.  Wittenberg - beat Wabash head up.  Getting healthier every day.  If McKee/Heiber ever get back close to 90% this year they
                          could become very diffuclt to beat especially in Springfield.
5.  Wabash - despite better overall record lost to Witt and at home to Wooster.  Then lost at OWU.
6.  John Carroll - may still be the team to beat in OAC tourney.  Experience in big games may get tehm over the Pioneers by end of year.

Other thoughts?

Projection based on things like numbers: http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/2011/02/predicting-first-round-of-gl-region.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 03:17:05 PM
First Regional Rankings: http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2011/02/02/ncaas-mens-regional-rankings/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 02, 2011, 03:40:38 PM
Quote from: sac on February 02, 2011, 02:04:49 PM
Quote from: D-III Insider on February 01, 2011, 11:08:53 PM

3.  Hope - benefitting from a down year in MIAA.  Still a perennial power in region.


MIAA
vs NCAC  5-1
vs OAC 5-1

Massey rankings
#9    MIAA
#11  OAC
#16  NCAC

Who's down in the what now?

Of those 5 wins vs. the NCAC, 2 were vs. OWU who is arguably playing at a much better level than when they lost early in the year to Calvin and Albion.  Kenyon lost to Albion and beat Kzoo.  And the other two wins were Oberlin losses to Kzoo and Alma.  So forgive me if I'm less than impressed over that 5-1 record. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 02, 2011, 03:57:24 PM
Ok so who were Witt, Wooster and Wabash's big wins over the top MIAA teams again?

OK thanks, and I'm sure Calvin, Albion and Kalamazoo are playing at higher level than when  those teams met.


Its all we have to go on, I thought it was an incredibly ignorant statement.

10-2 is flat out better no matter who you play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 02, 2011, 04:05:55 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 02, 2011, 03:40:38 PM
Quote from: sac on February 02, 2011, 02:04:49 PM
Quote from: D-III Insider on February 01, 2011, 11:08:53 PM

3.  Hope - benefitting from a down year in MIAA.  Still a perennial power in region.


MIAA
vs NCAC  5-1
vs OAC 5-1

Massey rankings
#9    MIAA
#11  OAC
#16  NCAC

Who's down in the what now?

Of those 5 wins vs. the NCAC, 2 were vs. OWU who is arguably playing at a much better level than when they lost early in the year to Calvin and Albion.  Kenyon lost to Albion and beat Kzoo.  And the other two wins were Oberlin losses to Kzoo and Alma.  So forgive me if I'm less than impressed over that 5-1 record. 

So instead of losing to Calvin by 27 they would have lost by 15? 7?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 02, 2011, 04:13:17 PM
Quote from: sac on February 02, 2011, 03:57:24 PM
Ok so who were Witt, Wooster and Wabash's big wins over the top MIAA teams again?

OK thanks, and I'm sure Calvin, Albion and Kalamazoo are playing at higher level than when  those teams met.


Its all we have to go on, I thought it was an incredibly ignorant statement.

10-2 is flat out better no matter who you play.

And who are Hope's or Calvin's wins vs the top NCAC teams again???  Give me a break.  Spin it however you want to...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 02, 2011, 04:17:36 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 02, 2011, 04:13:17 PM
Quote from: sac on February 02, 2011, 03:57:24 PM
Ok so who were Witt, Wooster and Wabash's big wins over the top MIAA teams again?

OK thanks, and I'm sure Calvin, Albion and Kalamazoo are playing at higher level than when  those teams met.


Its all we have to go on, I thought it was an incredibly ignorant statement.

10-2 is flat out better no matter who you play.

And who are Hope's or Calvin's wins vs the top NCAC teams again???  Give me a break.  Spin it however you want to...

Check the massey rankings, it really isn't even close.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:22:24 PM
sac - Massey ratings also I think count Hope's and Calvin's games against non-D3 and non-NCAA teams, if I am not mistaken, so those numbers a bit off.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 02, 2011, 04:24:22 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:22:24 PM
sac - Massey ratings also I think count Hope's and Calvin's games against non-D3 and non-NCAA teams, if I am not mistaken, so those numbers a big off.

Irrelevant
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:28:51 PM
Quote from: ziggy on February 02, 2011, 04:24:22 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:22:24 PM
sac - Massey ratings also I think count Hope's and Calvin's games against non-D3 and non-NCAA teams, if I am not mistaken, so those numbers a big off.

Irrelevant
How?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 02, 2011, 04:29:40 PM
The only ranking or rating I care about is the Regional Ranking.  And based on that, I see Wooster has wins over 2 teams ranked in the GL Region and one vs a team ranked in the MW Region.  How many wins vs. regionally ranked opponents does Hope have again?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 02, 2011, 04:30:15 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:28:51 PM
Quote from: ziggy on February 02, 2011, 04:24:22 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:22:24 PM
sac - Massey ratings also I think count Hope's and Calvin's games against non-D3 and non-NCAA teams, if I am not mistaken, so those numbers a big off.

Irrelevant
How?
Because it discounts their argument...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 02, 2011, 04:31:16 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 02, 2011, 04:29:40 PM
The only ranking or rating I care about is the Regional Ranking.  And based on that, I see Wooster has wins over 2 teams ranked in the GL Region and one vs a team ranked in the MW Region.  How many wins vs. regionally ranked opponents does Hope have again?

This never was an argument about Hope, it was about an ignorant comment that the MIAA was down.

we have 1 Alma, it appears the OAC and NCAC have at least 3 each.  The MIAA is flat-out a stronger conference this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 02, 2011, 04:32:25 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:28:51 PM
Quote from: ziggy on February 02, 2011, 04:24:22 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:22:24 PM
sac - Massey ratings also I think count Hope's and Calvin's games against non-D3 and non-NCAA teams, if I am not mistaken, so those numbers a big off.

Irrelevant
How?

Should Calvin not receive credit for playing and beating Massey's number 5 team in NAIA II? A game is a game and a win is a win. Limiting the schedule to just the D3 portion doesn't allow for a true view of the resume each team, and therefore each conference, has accumulated.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:34:03 PM
ziggy - when it comes to talk about Division III teams and how good they are in Division III... out of division and out of NCAA games are meaningless... and that is especially true when we are talking about regional rankings which will determine if Hope or Calvin or whomever get into the tournament as at large teams AND who they potentially will face and where they are in the bracket.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 02, 2011, 04:34:50 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 02, 2011, 04:29:40 PM
The only ranking or rating I care about is the Regional Ranking.  And based on that, I see Wooster has wins over 2 teams ranked in the GL Region and one vs a team ranked in the MW Region.  How many wins vs. regionally ranked opponents does Hope have again?

I will readily admit that the NCAC has the best team between the two conferences. That is Wooster.
Don't change the argument.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 02, 2011, 04:35:33 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:28:51 PM
Quote from: ziggy on February 02, 2011, 04:24:22 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:22:24 PM
sac - Massey ratings also I think count Hope's and Calvin's games against non-D3 and non-NCAA teams, if I am not mistaken, so those numbers a big off.

Irrelevant
How?

The d3hoops boy's need to take a week to swing through some NAIA basketball powers around here.  I recommend places like Bethel, Taylor, Grace, Huntington, Cornerstone, Davenport, Walsh, Malone etc.

You'll find great fan support and strong programs that year after year are easy equivalents of top 25 NCAA III programs.

Completely discounting their strengths because they don't play in the NCAA III is just more ignorance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 02, 2011, 04:37:25 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:34:03 PM
ziggy - when it comes to talk about Division III teams and how good they are in Division III... out of division and out of NCAA games are meaningless... and that is especially true when we are talking about regional rankings which will determine if Hope or Calvin or whomever get into the tournament as at large teams AND who they potentially will face and where they are in the bracket.

Perhaps I missed the turn where this discussion had anything to do with the NCAA tournament. I'm not arguing against the NCAA criteria, different argument for a different time, but to disregard the Massey rankings because they include games outside of D3 is faulty logic.

sac: you owe me some karma for dragging me into this!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 02, 2011, 04:42:17 PM
No one is disputing the fact that the NAIA has some very good programs in this region.  The bottom line is, games with NAIA teams don't count in the eyes of the NCAA when they are selecting teams for the tournament.  It has nothing to do with discounting their strengths because the don't play in the NCAA III.  It has everything to do with the fact that those games are basically meaningless in the eyes of the selection committee.  

And it's because of this that I would rather see Wooster schedule games against the likes of Anderson and JCU and Wilmington (I include them because they were picked 2nd in the OAC preseason poll) as opposed to going out and scheduling games with Walsh and Malone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:44:16 PM
sac - I am not saying the teams are not good - but they mean nothing when it comes to who's in and who's out of the tournaments and we get TONS of complaints about teams being out when teams like Hope men load up their schedules with NAIA teams (women don't have the same issue scheduling other D3 teams).

ziggy - when it comes to determining who is a better conference in Division III... going on a rating system that doesn't account for the fact that teams play non-d3 teams isn't a fair process or something you can just jump on when the feeling is right. It is the same argument people bring up when discussing why Top 25 voters don't take into account more the Massey ratings when ranking their teams... it is a D3 poll... not an overall poll... and when I look at a conference's strength compared to other conferences, I am first going to look at how they compare to common opponents and other D3 opponents... not how they did against non-NCAA teams that no one else is playing, for the most part.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 02, 2011, 04:47:55 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:44:16 PM
sac - I am not saying the teams are not good - but they mean nothing when it comes to who's in and who's out of the tournaments and we get TONS of complaints about teams being out when teams like Hope men load up their schedules with NAIA teams (women don't have the same issue scheduling other D3 teams).

ziggy - when it comes to determining who is a better conference in Division III... going on a rating system that doesn't account for the fact that teams play non-d3 teams isn't a fair process or something you can just jump on when the feeling is right. It is the same argument people bring up when discussing why Top 25 voters don't take into account more the Massey ratings when ranking their teams... it is a D3 poll... not an overall poll... and when I look at a conference's strength compared to other conferences, I am first going to look at how they compare to common opponents and other D3 opponents... not how they did against non-NCAA teams that no one else is playing, for the most part.

[facepalm]

fine.

Quote from: sac on February 02, 2011, 02:04:49 PM
MIAA
vs NCAC  5-1
vs OAC 5-1

Massey rankings
#9    MIAA
#11  OAC
#16  NCAC
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 02, 2011, 04:53:40 PM
Feel free to carry on -- not sure Dave really followed the conversation before he dove in and I tried to warn him off. You can use whatever you like to discuss the strength of conferences. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 02, 2011, 05:00:49 PM
Quote from: sac on February 02, 2011, 04:35:33 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:28:51 PM
Quote from: ziggy on February 02, 2011, 04:24:22 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2011, 04:22:24 PM
sac - Massey ratings also I think count Hope's and Calvin's games against non-D3 and non-NCAA teams, if I am not mistaken, so those numbers a big off.

Irrelevant
How?

The d3hoops boy's need to take a week to swing through some NAIA basketball powers around here.  I recommend places like Bethel, Taylor, Grace, Huntington, Cornerstone, Davenport, Walsh, Malone etc.

You'll find great fan support and strong programs that year after year are easy equivalents of top 25 NCAA III programs.

Completely discounting their strengths because they don't play in the NCAA III is just more ignorance.

For someone who doesn't like being painted with a broad brush, Scott, you seem to have pulled a pretty big one out with your statement.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 02, 2011, 05:02:52 PM
Yeah, this was never about what it takes to get in the NCAA.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: D-III Insider on February 02, 2011, 05:06:00 PM
How can you argue it is down year in the MIAA?  Calvin is far below par and this league in all fairness is much like the NCAC.  Two powers and occasionally another strong team.  Usually it is Albion.  But this year the Britons are not what they have been in years past.

How can you argue that?   In the NCAC it is Wooster/Witt and the others with Wabash and OWU usually tough to beat in their own gyms.  How many other NCAC teams have been to the NCAA tournament in the past decade?  How often?

In the MIAA what team besides Hopw/Calvin (and occasionally Albion) has been to the dance?

I am not trying to knock Hope, Calvin, or Albion.  But Olivet, Kzoo, Adrian, Trine, and Alma have all been down for several years.  Adrian is on a slight improvement now but is that partly because the rest of the league is down?  

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 02, 2011, 05:07:01 PM
Quote from: sac on February 02, 2011, 05:02:52 PM
Yeah, this was never about what it takes to get in the NCAA.


Again, I understand this. We are aware of the quality of NAIA-I and highly ranked NAIA-II teams so I would say your statement that "the d3hoops boys" need to spend team getting to know non-D3 teams is not necessary. That would be like saying "Hope fans" are X based on one post. And I know you do not like that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 02, 2011, 05:08:40 PM
Quote from: D-III Insider on February 02, 2011, 05:06:00 PM
How can you argue it is down year in the MIAA?  Calvin is far below par and this league in all fairness is much like the NCAC.  Two powers and occasionally another strong team.  Usually it is Albion.  But this year the Britons are not what they have been in years past.

How can you argue that?   In the NCAC it is Wooster/Witt and the others with Wabash and OWU usually tough to beat in their own gyms.  How many other NCAC teams have been to the NCAA tournament in the past decade?  How often?

In the MIAA what team besides Hopw/Calvin (and occasionally Albion) has been to the dance?

I am not trying to knock Hope, Calvin, or Albion.  But Olivet, Kzoo, Adrian, Trine, and Alma have all been down for several years.  Adrian is on a slight improvement now but is that partly because the rest of the league is down?  



Followers of the MIAA board will know that a lot of discussion there has been about the overall quality of play being much improved from the last few years. That is quantified by the difference we see in the Massey ratings (and overall non-conference record) this year compared to previous years.

Trine had a 6-2 in-region record entering league play; they are 1-7 in MIAA play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 02, 2011, 05:45:05 PM
Average RPI for D3 in-region competition (if you wanna make it about that).

MIAA: 0.536
OAC: 0.515
NCAC: 0.505

Average RPI for all D3 competition:

OAC: 0.527
MIAA: 0.511
NCAC: 0.506

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 02, 2011, 05:45:37 PM
Quote from: D-III Insider on February 02, 2011, 05:06:00 PM
How can you argue it is down year in the MIAA?  Calvin is far below par and this league in all fairness is much like the NCAC.  Two powers and occasionally another strong team.  Usually it is Albion.  But this year the Britons are not what they have been in years past.

How can you argue that?   In the NCAC it is Wooster/Witt and the others with Wabash and OWU usually tough to beat in their own gyms.  How many other NCAC teams have been to the NCAA tournament in the past decade?  How often?

In the MIAA what team besides Hopw/Calvin (and occasionally Albion) has been to the dance?

I am not trying to knock Hope, Calvin, or Albion.  But Olivet, Kzoo, Adrian, Trine, and Alma have all been down for several years.  Adrian is on a slight improvement now but is that partly because the rest of the league is down?  



It seems like your basing your opinion of this year more based on history than any on court insight.  I don't think either me or Ziggy are trying to argue the MIAA is outstanding, or better than ever......head to heads and other ratings/rankings certainly suggest the league might be the best in the Great Lakes and that's a place it hasn't been for the last 3 seasons.  I don't see how you can be down if that's the case.

You made your comment that Hope was benefiting from a down MIAA.......do you realize Hope's been behind to 6 of the 8 teams at halftime?  Has had to win FIVE games by single digits.  Some benefit wouldn't you say.


I guess I should ask down compared to what.......the last 3 years?   No, not even close.

Down compared to 2005 when 2 teams played each other for the right to go to Salem and the league had 2 other teams talented enough to be in the dance and do well?  Then yes.


I think if you poked through the MIAA's boxscore's this year you'd see a league that has been very competitive top to bottom, with only a couple blowouts.......of those very teams that don't impress scotsfan even that won their games vs the NCAC and OAC.  Outside the conference it did pretty well, and played a much tougher overall schedule than either the OAC or NCAC can boast.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 02, 2011, 05:48:24 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on February 02, 2011, 05:45:05 PM
Average RPI for D3 in-region competition (if you wanna make it about that).

MIAA: 0.536
OAC: 0.515
NCAC: 0.505

Average RPI for all D3 competition:

OAC: 0.527
MIAA: 0.511
NCAC: 0.506



I know you can't do it because you don't have the data, but I'd love to see the MIAA's RPI including all the NAIA and D2 opponents.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 02, 2011, 05:54:16 PM
Quote from: sac on February 02, 2011, 05:48:24 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on February 02, 2011, 05:45:05 PM
Average RPI for D3 in-region competition (if you wanna make it about that).

MIAA: 0.536
OAC: 0.515
NCAC: 0.505

Average RPI for all D3 competition:

OAC: 0.527
MIAA: 0.511
NCAC: 0.506



I know you can't do it because you don't have the data, but I'd love to see the MIAA's RPI including all the NAIA and D2 opponents.

Would end up looking like Massey's rankings, except his numbers would be more accurate (with margin of victory and all).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 02, 2011, 06:48:22 PM
I was just reading the posts about games with naia teams. I understand why the games are not scheduled, the arguments make sense. I do have a interest in seeing some games between d3 and naia schools  though as I went to Mt. Vernon Nazarene and would love to see them play schools like wooster , or ohio wesleyan.  The question I have though is this. If it doesn't count in basketball to schedule naia schools then does it count in other sports? Mt. Vernon regularly plays d3 or d2 schools in baseball. Also I remember in the past cap playing ohio dominican(while odu was still naia) and mt. vernon regularly playing kenyon in basketball. Has the requirements of schedules changed in the last year when it comes to games against naia schools. If anyone can help me out on this matter I would appreciate it.

david

P.S. go big red
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2011, 10:30:52 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 02, 2011, 06:48:22 PM
I was just reading the posts about games with naia teams. I understand why the games are not scheduled, the arguments make sense. I do have a interest in seeing some games between d3 and naia schools  though as I went to Mt. Vernon Nazarene and would love to see them play schools like wooster , or ohio wesleyan.  The question I have though is this. If it doesn't count in basketball to schedule naia schools then does it count in other sports? Mt. Vernon regularly plays d3 or d2 schools in baseball. Also I remember in the past cap playing ohio dominican(while odu was still naia) and mt. vernon regularly playing kenyon in basketball. Has the requirements of schedules changed in the last year when it comes to games against naia schools. If anyone can help me out on this matter I would appreciate it.

david

P.S. go big red

I think you might be confused by what posters mean by games that "count."  We're talking strictly about games that the NCAA uses when they select participants for the national tournament, in any and all team sports (where the team qualifies, not the individual, such as in swimming and track and field).  So when Kenyon plays MVNU in basketball, as they do virtually every year, that result "counts" in their overall record, but it does not "count" in the eyes of the NCAA when they are deciding whether Kenyon should be regionally ranked or invited to the NCAA tournament.  Same goes for football, baseball, volleyball, whatever. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2011, 12:19:32 PM
The Kenyon/Wittenberg doubleheader, originally scheduled for Wednesday and postponed to this evening, has again been postponed.  The women will now play tomorrow at 5:30pm, while the men's game is still TBD.  (I don't know why it wouldn't also be played on Friday, given that Kenyon has an off day on Saturday and Witt is home for Allegheny.)  The Wittenberg campus is closed for the third straight day.  Brrrr.  As of right now, everything else is still on, and I suppose at least the Wabash/Denison game will be played, as Wabash is surely already en route to Granville.

Oberlin at Allegheny, 6pm -- live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/) -- Game 1 of a M/W doubleheader
Wabash at Denison, ~7:30pm -- video and live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html) -- Game 2 of a doubleheader, women vs. OWU at 5:30
Wooster at Hiram, ~8pm -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html); audio (http://wkvx.com/) (W) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Kenyon at Wittenberg, PPD
OWU is idle
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2011, 02:03:03 PM
Congratulations to Kenyon senior Kodey Haddox, who today was named to the District IV Academic All-District First Team by CoSIDA.  Kodey now becomes eligible for the prestigious Academic All-America team.  Kodey is joined by Wittenberg junior posts Alex Brandt and Clayton Black, each named to the third team.  Congratulations to all three fine scholar-athletes! :)

Release (pdf) (http://www.case.edu/athletics/varsity/sports_men/mbasketball/stats/2010-11/Images/2010_11_AAA_MBB_All_District_Teams%5B1%5D%205.pdf)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 03, 2011, 08:38:19 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 34  Hiram 33

Wooster is being led by Nathan Balch with 10 points (3 three pointers), Josh Claytor with 6 and Bryan Wickliffe also with 6.

Hiram's top scorers are Babajide Eniola with 6 points and Chris Roberts with 5 points.

Wooster shot over 50% in the half but they had 7 turnovers and were outrebounded by Hiram.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 03, 2011, 09:20:53 PM
Denison 3 at the buzzer to beat Wabash 65-62. What is happening to the 'Bash?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 03, 2011, 09:22:46 PM
Crazy finish in Granville.  Down by 3, Denison's Jim Leffew drilled a trey and was fouled.  He made the and-1 to give Denison the one point lead with 4 seconds to go.  Then Mike Garabedian fouled Brian Shelbourne giving him a chance to win the game for Wabash at the line.  But Shelbourne only made one of two and with two ticks of the clock remaining, Jim Leffew nailed his 5th triple of the game for the winner for Denison.  

Wabash is officially done in the race for the regular season title with this loss IMO...

BTW, Wooster is now up 9 on the pups with five and a half to play...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 03, 2011, 09:45:03 PM
Final:  Wooster 70  Hiram 64 :)

Wooster's Top Scorers:  Nathan Balch 20, Ian Franks 13, Josh Claytor 10, Bryan Wickliffe 9

Hiram's Top Scorers:  Babjide Eniola 16, Chris Roberts 11, Aaron Stefanov 9

Scots had too many turnovers tonight 15 which made this a close game.

Wooster is now 20-0, 11-0 NCAC ;D

Congratulations to Coach Steve Moore and his staff on 15 consecutive 20 win seasons! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 03, 2011, 09:50:12 PM
Ugh. That is all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 03, 2011, 09:57:59 PM
1. Wooster 11-0, 20-0
2. Wittenberg 9-1, 14-5
3. Ohio Wesleyan 8-3, 12-8
4. Wabash 8-4, 16-4
5. Hiram 4-7, 10-10
6. Kenyon 4-7, 8-12
7. Denison 4-8, 7-14
8. Allegheny 2-10, 5-15
9. Oberlin 1-11, 2-19

Kenyon @ Witt?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 03, 2011, 09:59:50 PM
Kenyon vs. Wittenberg was postponed today and will be played at a later date.

Oberlin gets a road win tonight at Allegheny by 72 to 68 score.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 03, 2011, 10:10:50 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 03, 2011, 09:45:03 PM
Scots had too many turnovers tonight 15 which made this a close game.

To add to that, the Scots gave up too many offensive rebounds which also made this a close game.  I don't know what the final tally was but I think the pups had something like 17 offensive boards in this game?  I know they had around 20 more shot attempts so when you combine the turnovers with the offensive rebounds given up by the Scots, they are very fortunate to come away with this victory tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 03, 2011, 10:12:18 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 03, 2011, 09:59:50 PM
Oberlin gets a road win tonight at Allegheny by 72 to 68 score.

What???  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2011, 10:39:51 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 03, 2011, 09:22:46 PM
Crazy finish in Granville.  Down by 3, Denison's Jim Leffew drilled a trey and was fouled.  He made the and-1 to give Denison the one point lead with 4 seconds to go.  Then Mike Garabedian fouled Brian Shelbourne giving him a chance to win the game for Wabash at the line.  But Shelbourne only made one of two and with two ticks of the clock remaining, Jim Leffew nailed his 5th triple of the game for the winner for Denison.  

That's a lot of end-to-end action for four seconds (really, two seconds, from 0:04 to 0:02)!  Wish I could have seen it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2011, 10:42:04 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 14, 2011, 03:33:24 PM
The first two games mentioned in the poll are approaching, so I've locked the voting.  I'll immortalize the results, and we'll see if any of them came true.

OWU over Wabash, 1/26 -- 8 votes -- OWU 87, Wabash 76
Allegheny over Wabash, 1/15 -- 7 votes -- Wabash 80, Allegheny 58
Hiram over Wooster, 2/3 -- 6 votes -- Wooster 70, Hiram 64
Denison over Wooster, 1/15 -- 3 votes -- Wooster 72, Denison 64

Thanks for participating!

Looks like I picked a decent quartet of potential upsets, with one coming true and two others being close.  And the fourth one, the blowout, of course was the one I picked.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2011, 10:51:52 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 03, 2011, 10:39:51 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 03, 2011, 09:22:46 PM
Crazy finish in Granville.  Down by 3, Denison's Jim Leffew drilled a trey and was fouled.  He made the and-1 to give Denison the one point lead with 4 seconds to go.  Then Mike Garabedian fouled Brian Shelbourne giving him a chance to win the game for Wabash at the line.  But Shelbourne only made one of two and with two ticks of the clock remaining, Jim Leffew nailed his 5th triple of the game for the winner for Denison.  

That's a lot of end-to-end action for four seconds (really, two seconds, from 0:04 to 0:02)!  Wish I could have seen it.
Ohhhh!  It wasn't with 2 seconds after all, it was a GENUINE BUZZER BEATER.  Video from DU available here (http://www.twitvid.com/HMXYL).  It was a 35-footer, undefended.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 03, 2011, 10:54:39 PM
This is THAT game. The game each year where Wabash lets it guard down and loses to one of the bottom three of the league.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2011, 11:21:34 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 03, 2011, 12:19:32 PM
The Kenyon/Wittenberg doubleheader, originally scheduled for Wednesday and postponed to this evening, has again been postponed.  The women will now play tomorrow at 5:30pm, while the men's game is still TBD.  (I don't know why it wouldn't also be played on Friday, given that Kenyon has an off day on Saturday and Witt is home for Allegheny.)
So they finally dotted the t's and crossed the i's and settled on a Friday make-up date:

Kenyon at Wittenberg, 7:30pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/) -- Game 2 of a re-re-scheduled W/M doubleheader (women at 5pm)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 03, 2011, 11:41:10 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 03, 2011, 10:51:52 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 03, 2011, 10:39:51 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 03, 2011, 09:22:46 PM
Crazy finish in Granville.  Down by 3, Denison's Jim Leffew drilled a trey and was fouled.  He made the and-1 to give Denison the one point lead with 4 seconds to go.  Then Mike Garabedian fouled Brian Shelbourne giving him a chance to win the game for Wabash at the line.  But Shelbourne only made one of two and with two ticks of the clock remaining, Jim Leffew nailed his 5th triple of the game for the winner for Denison.  

That's a lot of end-to-end action for four seconds (really, two seconds, from 0:04 to 0:02)!  Wish I could have seen it.
Ohhhh!  It wasn't with 2 seconds after all, it was a GENUINE BUZZER BEATER.  Video from DU available here (http://www.twitvid.com/HMXYL).  It was a 35-footer, undefended.

I was just going by what the livestats were saying during the game David (while trying to keep an ear on the Wooster game at the same time I might add  ;)).  I should have been more specific in that Denison was inbounding the ball with approximately 2 seconds remaining when Leffew hit his shot at the buzzer for the win.

Thanks for the link for the buzzer beater BTW.  Wabash has now been on both ends of the buzzer beater treatment this year having won with a buzzer beater as Derek Baily nailed a triple to beat Kenyon on the road earlier in the year and of course, they were on the short end of the stick tonight.  Lest we forget, Wes Smith also had a just miss on a 3-pointer that would have give Wabash another buzzer beater win vs. Wooster as well.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2011, 11:55:43 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 03, 2011, 11:41:10 PM
I was just going by what the livestats were saying during the game David (while trying to keep an ear on the Wooster game at the same time I might add  ;)). 
No criticism intended!  Believe me, I know what that's like, being chained to my computer for NCAC action.  Sometimes I try to follow as many as six games at once.  I know that LiveStats is frequently misleading when it comes to describing the actual action. 

I immediately thought of Wabash @ Kenyon too.  All the more reason for me to wonder why nobody did anything to prevent the shot.  Sure, it was a prayer, but why not have a defender at least guard him loosely instead of everyone sagging back to the arc?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 04, 2011, 12:30:41 AM
Quote from: WAlum on February 03, 2011, 09:20:53 PM
Denison 3 at the buzzer to beat Wabash 65-62. What is happening to the 'Bash?

Watch the video. That's a one in twenty shot. As was the shot Wabash hit to beat Kenyon. It's even now. Winning on the road in college hoops is hard. Credit the Big Red for getting the job done tonight.

Big game on Saturday. WAF!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 04, 2011, 07:23:41 AM
I can't stop watching the replay.  Jim Leffew (listed at 5'6") was the biggest guy on the court last night, going 5 for 7 from three point land, tallying 18 total points, no turnovers in 37 minutes of play AND the winner at the end.

A deserving front-pager on d3hoops.  Go Big Red!  Let this be the catalyst to finish a tough season strong. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 04, 2011, 08:15:41 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 04, 2011, 12:30:41 AM
Quote from: WAlum on February 03, 2011, 09:20:53 PM
Denison 3 at the buzzer to beat Wabash 65-62. What is happening to the 'Bash?

Watch the video. That's a one in twenty shot.

I believe that any good shooter makes, at least, one out of ten from that range, if open and allowed a run-up to get momentum.  Had Leffew been picked up before crossing mid-court he'd have been forced to either pull up earlier or divert his path.  Either way, a much tougher shot attempt would have ensued, a true 1-20 or worse.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 04, 2011, 09:26:11 AM
I just watched the replay.  What were the Wabash players thinking?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 04, 2011, 10:02:48 AM
Quote from: WAlum on February 04, 2011, 09:26:11 AM
I just watched the replay.  What were the Wabash players thinking?

I think what they were thinking was a combination of being happy they had just tied it and also thinking along the same lines (or hoping) as what Wally was thinking in that it was a desperation shot and Wabash was already thinking OT.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 04, 2011, 10:21:44 AM
CONGRATS TO THE BIG RED!!!!

BOY.......I GUESS OHIO REALLY DOES "SUCK"!!!  OUCH!!

HUGE WIN!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 04, 2011, 04:29:46 PM
I almost didn't go for the denison game last night but I am glad I did. I am not a denison alum but I have become a big big red fan in all sports over the past few years. I have gone too a lot of games all over ohio and michigan and I must say the final 15 seconds was some of the most exciting I have seen. First the three pointer and foul to go ahead would have been enough. The finish though, I told my wife and daughter we are bound for overtime and then wild excitement breaks out. What a great moment. The only basketball moment I can remember being as good was d.j. frazier hitting the winner against wooster for cap a couple of years age. I am a huge Ohio Bobcat fan and I think we can celebrate with the best but nothing I have seen in Athens can beat last  night. Congratulation to the big red on a really big win. Loved watching the students get involved also. Never seen that at a denison game other then lacrosse before.

David

P.S. My wife said she almost went down too kiss the player who hit the winner as she had a bad headache and was ready to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 04, 2011, 04:35:11 PM
I don't know if it has been brought up but the reason for no  time comming off the clock between the go ahead basket and  the foul that allowed wabash to tie the game is this. The foul happened as wabash was trying to throw the ball in. Oh and as exciting as the second half and finish were, the first half honestly was some of the worst basketball by two teams I can remember.

david
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 04, 2011, 04:38:32 PM
oh by the way , big red fan I am assuming when you said ohio sucks this year you were      referring to basketball in general in the state of ohio. I must say as a loyal ohio university fan I can say without reservation that the bobcats do suck this year. I had originally planned on going to watch ohio play northern illinois tomorrow but I think I might just come back to denison instead.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2011, 04:53:04 PM
I don't know what's going on with this Kenyon/Wittenberg game, but it has now been "canceled" according to the Witt site.  Not "postponed" (again), but "canceled."  I don't see how that is possible--it'll have to be made up sometime, for the integrity of the conference standings--and I don't understand why this has happened.  The Kenyon women are on site and preparing to tip off against Witt in 10 minutes.  I suppose the Kenyon men traveled separately from the women, since the women are headed directly to Oberlin for a game tomorrow while the men have tomorrow off, and maybe the men's bus just couldn't get there?  Is the weather still bad back there?  I have lots of questions, but no answers.

UPDATE:
According to Ben Bradley on the Witt videocast of the women's game, the KC/Witt game was rescheduled for tonight by the NCAC office, and Kenyon "did not approve" of the schedule change, and "refused" to make the trip to Springfield.  He's suggesting that it might go down as a forfeit victory for the Tigers.  I'm sure there will be more details forthcoming.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 04, 2011, 05:02:32 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 04, 2011, 04:38:32 PM
oh by the way , big red fan I am assuming when you said ohio sucks this year you were      referring to basketball in general in the state of ohio. I must say as a loyal ohio university fan I can say without reservation that the bobcats do suck this year. I had originally planned on going to watch ohio play northern illinois tomorrow but I think I might just come back to denison instead.

I believe he was referring to a favorite Lil Giant student cheer. 

Nice to see a few other Big Red fans chime in - hope to see more of you here and at all the games you can make.  The rest of this year will be a challenge to get to a higher seed for the tournament, but hopefully we can move up the seeding chart by pulling down at least two more wins this season.  Next year is looking very promising with everyone on the roster and more likely returning for another year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2011, 05:33:43 PM
Here's a longer video clip of the end of the Denison/Wabash game, encompassing most of the last 7 seconds and including play-by-play audio.  It shows the play that resulted in Leffew's three-plus-one that gave DU the lead, then skips the foul of Shelburn, picking back up as he attempts his free throws. 

http://www.twitvid.com/NOWKH (http://www.twitvid.com/NOWKH)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 04, 2011, 05:45:25 PM
Thanks for the great video. I shoot pictures and film at most games I go too. This was the one night I had to leave the camera at home.####


david
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 04, 2011, 06:15:29 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 04, 2011, 04:29:46 PM
I have gone too a lot of games all over ohio and michigan and I must say the final 15 seconds was some of the most exciting I have seen. First the three pointer and foul to go ahead would have been enough. The finish though, I told my wife and daughter we are bound for overtime and then wild excitement breaks out. What a great moment. The only basketball moment I can remember being as good was d.j. frazier hitting the winner against wooster for cap a couple of years age.

Dave, nice to hear your enthusiasm for D3hoops.  But I have to say, your favorite basketball moment is arguably one of my LEAST favorite basketball moments.   ;)   :P   ;D

I had made the trek down to Columbus with my wife and kids and it was so nice to see Wooster's supporters outnumbering Cap fans in their own gym on that forgettable night.  I really wasn't too optimistic for a Wooster win considering how good Cap was that year, so when Wooster put themselves in a position to win only to see DJ Frazier stick a dagger in our hearts is not something I wish to remember.   ;)

Now, watching Woo erase an 11 point 2nd half deficit to Witt 2 weeks ago?  THAT was a great moment!   8-)

BTW, if you don't mind me asking, how did you become so interested in D3 athletics and more specifically, Denison athletics?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 04, 2011, 06:24:29 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 04, 2011, 04:53:04 PM
I don't know what's going on with this Kenyon/Wittenberg game, but it has now been "canceled" according to the Witt site.  Not "postponed" (again), but "canceled."  I don't see how that is possible--it'll have to be made up sometime, for the integrity of the conference standings--and I don't understand why this has happened.  The Kenyon women are on site and preparing to tip off against Witt in 10 minutes.  I suppose the Kenyon men traveled separately from the women, since the women are headed directly to Oberlin for a game tomorrow while the men have tomorrow off, and maybe the men's bus just couldn't get there?  Is the weather still bad back there?  I have lots of questions, but no answers.

UPDATE:
According to Ben Bradley on the Witt videocast of the women's game, the KC/Witt game was rescheduled for tonight by the NCAC office, and Kenyon "did not approve" of the schedule change, and "refused" to make the trip to Springfield.  He's suggesting that it might go down as a forfeit victory for the Tigers.   I'm sure there will be more details forthcoming.

This is truly a bizarre story going on here.  How is it that the Kenyon women could make the trek to Springfield, and yet the Kenyon men have now "refused" to make the same trip?   ???  Does the women's bus have AWD or something?   :P  And now there is talk of a forfiet?  I really can't argue with that outcome if that is how this plays out.  After all, Kenyon really had NO reason not to play this game tonight, especially considering they are off this weekend.  If anyone would be objecting to playing this game tonight, you would think it would be Witt who would be being asked to play back-to-back nights.

And the weather has not been bad since Wednesday.  It's been cold, but the sun has been shining and the roads are clear for the most part.  This seems like more of an issue between Kenyon and the league office for apparently re-scheduling this game without the blessings of Kenyon and Kenyon doing their best impersonation of a 2 year old throwing a tantrum over it.  In the end, it looks like it's going to cost the Lords a forfiet. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2011, 06:30:28 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 04, 2011, 04:53:04 PM
I don't know what's going on with this Kenyon/Wittenberg game, but it has now been "canceled" according to the Witt site.  Not "postponed" (again), but "canceled."  I don't see how that is possible--it'll have to be made up sometime, for the integrity of the conference standings--and I don't understand why this has happened.  The Kenyon women are on site and preparing to tip off against Witt in 10 minutes.  I suppose the Kenyon men traveled separately from the women, since the women are headed directly to Oberlin for a game tomorrow while the men have tomorrow off, and maybe the men's bus just couldn't get there?  Is the weather still bad back there?  I have lots of questions, but no answers.

UPDATE:
According to Ben Bradley on the Witt videocast of the women's game, the KC/Witt game was rescheduled for tonight by the NCAC office, and Kenyon "did not approve" of the schedule change, and "refused" to make the trip to Springfield.  He's suggesting that it might go down as a forfeit victory for the Tigers.  I'm sure there will be more details forthcoming.

What's even weirder is that Kenyon has tomorrow off, so it wouldn't be a burden playing back-to-back games. Yeesh...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2011, 06:38:27 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 04, 2011, 06:30:28 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 04, 2011, 04:53:04 PM
I don't know what's going on with this Kenyon/Wittenberg game, but it has now been "canceled" according to the Witt site.  Not "postponed" (again), but "canceled."  I don't see how that is possible--it'll have to be made up sometime, for the integrity of the conference standings--and I don't understand why this has happened.  The Kenyon women are on site and preparing to tip off against Witt in 10 minutes.  I suppose the Kenyon men traveled separately from the women, since the women are headed directly to Oberlin for a game tomorrow while the men have tomorrow off, and maybe the men's bus just couldn't get there?  Is the weather still bad back there?  I have lots of questions, but no answers.

UPDATE:
According to Ben Bradley on the Witt videocast of the women's game, the KC/Witt game was rescheduled for tonight by the NCAC office, and Kenyon "did not approve" of the schedule change, and "refused" to make the trip to Springfield.  He's suggesting that it might go down as a forfeit victory for the Tigers.  I'm sure there will be more details forthcoming.

What's even weirder is that Kenyon has tomorrow off, so it wouldn't be a burden playing back-to-back games. Yeesh...
This fact makes me suspect that there's something else going on here that we don't know about.  (And I hasten to point out that all we know is through Ben Bradley's comments before the women's game, and I can't attest as to how well-informed those comments were.)  I've asked the league office for more information, and I'll report back with whatever, if anything, I find out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 04, 2011, 06:49:51 PM
How did I become interested in d3 and denison? that might too long to answer. In 06 I inherited money. Had always wanted to watch college sports so I picked OU first because they were closest(I hate ohio stae)outside of columbus. I was instantly hooked on ou even though they lost to bg that day. After that I had too see something every weekend. So columbus has a lot of opportunites for football, basketball, so starting at cap I have been to just about every school you can think of in ohio(well I have missed a few). My favorite is denison because the folks their are so nice and it is the most beautifull campus I have seen(kenyon, john carroll, miami and michigan are also at the top of my list of most beautifull campuses. Usually make it over to denison 3 or 4 times a year for basketball, at least once for football and love watching lacrosse there. I have also turned into a amatuer photographer so I am almost always taking pictures.(always in football). I also love wooster, not far from mvnu where I went to school. I remember the wooster cap game well, sorry too bring up bad memories. I was hoping the scots would win also. I have always been impressed by the support the socts get from the community. I think all school would appreciate that much support. It doesn't seem too matter which sport there are alway plenty of fans. Of course my favorite tradion has always been the pipers. Too bad they can't come in off the hill with the football team anymore. Through the stadium just isn't the same. I am easy to spot at games. I usually have ohio u gear on. Just look for the guy who looks like john mccain and that is me. Oh I am also a big fan of otterbein as well.I try to go to at least 2 hoops game every saturday(once again columbus makes that pretty easy) and during football season I try to go to as many doubleheaders as possible. I actually saw wooster play 4 times this year in football. Oh one last thing I was at the wooster-denison hoops game this  year. Looked for a long time like denison might pull the big one in that game also.

david
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2011, 07:12:57 PM
The Springfield News-Sun (http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/springfield-oh-sports/wittenberg-university-tigers/witt-kenyon-mens-basketball-game-cancelled-1072845.html) has the story.  Basically, it seems that Kenyon balked at the Friday date for academic reasons, and Wittenberg balked at a possible Monday date for competitive reasons, and both sound valid.  There will not be a forfeit (i.e., Witt doesn't get a win on their record), but for purposes of seeding the conference tournament, Witt gets credited with a conference win, provided the teams and league can not agree on a re-play date in the coming weeks (seems unlikely.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 04, 2011, 07:20:04 PM
Oh, I can't believe I missed what I like about d3 the best. I appreciate when the student-athletes are actually students.

david
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2011, 07:26:41 PM
So, for all intents and purposes, the conference standings now look like this:

1. Wooster 11-0, 20-0
2. Wittenberg 10-1, 14-5
3. Ohio Wesleyan 8-3, 12-8
4. Wabash 8-4, 16-4
5. Hiram 4-7, 10-10
6. Kenyon 4-8, 8-12
6. Denison 4-8, 7-14
8. Allegheny 2-10, 5-15
9. Oberlin 1-11, 2-19

I don't even want to think about what impact the Wittenberg/Kenyon not-a-forfeit result will have on tiebreakers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2011, 07:31:55 PM
And here's Saturday's slate of action:

Wabash at Wooster, ~2pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule) -- Game 2 of a doubleheader, women vs. Denison at noon
Oberlin at Denison, 3pm -- audio and live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html)
Hiram at OWU, ~3pm -- live stats (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Allegheny at Wittenberg, ~6pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Kenyon is in the library
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 04, 2011, 07:36:14 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 04, 2011, 07:31:55 PM
Kenyon is in the library



*applause*
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 04, 2011, 08:07:53 PM
Maybe the bigger question for Wittenberg is how does the NCAA look at this game in terms of regional rankings and a Pool C bid were they to need it. There is such a fine line for a number of teams that on the bubble, that having one less regional win will make a difference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2011, 08:11:55 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 04, 2011, 08:07:53 PM
Maybe the bigger question for Wittenberg is how does the NCAA look at this game in terms of regional rankings and a Pool C bid were they to need it. There is such a fine line for a number of teams that on the bubble, that having one less regional win will make a difference.
From what I can gather, in the eyes of the NCAA there was no game and no result.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2011, 08:26:15 PM
Our little fiasco is now the lead story (http://www.d3hoops.com/landing/index) on D3hoops.com.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 04, 2011, 09:38:27 PM
Big game tomorrow with Wabash visiting Wooster! :)

Wabash really needs a win tomorrow to strengthen their case for a NCAA Pool C bid if they don't win the NCAC automatic bid.  Another loss by Wabash would make 5 on the season and almost force them to win the automatic bid to get into the NCAA tourney.  Teams with 6 losses usually are on a low probability bubble for getting a NCAA bid.

Wooster really needs a win tomorrow to stay one game ahead of Wittenberg in the conference race.  A loss by Wooster would likely put them in a must win situation when they play at Wittenberg if the Scots want to win the NCAC regular season title.

With both teams nationally ranked and needing the win, I plan on watching a great game tomorrow! ;D

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 04, 2011, 09:55:43 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 04, 2011, 08:26:15 PM
Our little fiasco is now the lead story (http://www.d3hoops.com/landing/index) on D3hoops.com.

Fiasco is right.  I am sure there is more to this story. We have the Witt side reported. I hope we get to hear this from the Kenyon perspective.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 05, 2011, 12:49:25 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 04, 2011, 08:26:15 PM
Our little fiasco is now the lead story (http://www.d3hoops.com/landing/index) on D3hoops.com.

Yeah that was an interesting afternoon. It's unusual for us to directly link out to a story on another publication's site, but this was an unusual story.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2011, 11:59:09 AM
On top of what's been reported, I understand that Kenyon had transportation issues as well, probably tied into the fact that the men's and women's teams could not travel together (because the women had to go directly to Oberlin from Springfield.)

It's an unfortunate situation all around. I may be in the minority here, but I am glad to see that, in a situation where there was (reportedly) an irresolvable conflict between academics and athletics, academics was given priority. I think that's the essence of D3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 05, 2011, 12:29:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 05, 2011, 11:59:09 AM
On top of what's been reported, I understand that Kenyon had transportation issues as well, probably tied into the fact that the men's and women's teams could not travel together (because the women had to go directly to Oberlin from Springfield.)

It's an unfortunate situation all around. I may be in the minority here, but I am glad to see that, in a situation where there was (reportedly) an irresolvable conflict between academics and athletics, academics was given priority. I think that's the essence of D3.

I agree.  It is sad to see the Lords forfeit a league win because they chose academics over athletics but kudos to the Kenyon coach, AD, and team for making the right decision.  Student-athletes and student comes first!  It is going to be interesting as more and more details of this fiasco are disclosed publicly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 01:12:29 PM
Yeah...I'm not buying it.  I don't know how, if you're Kenyon, you can play the academics card for the men's team but the women travel and make the same trip on the same day that the men are supposed to.  So they weren't traveling together?  Not an issue.  Get another bus.  Load up in a couple of college vans.  The trip isn't that long.  I posted this on twitter, but it's worth repeating here...if Kenyon and Wittenberg traded places in the league standings, Kenyon finds a way to play that game.  What happened here this week is unfair to the players and unfair to the rest of the league who don't get the same freebie that Witt does.  Big, big fail by Kenyon here. 

It's a two hour trip.  If they wanted to play the game, they could have. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 05, 2011, 01:41:02 PM
Here's the latest:

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/dayton/springfieldpreps/entries/2011/02/05/kenyon_coach_gives_his_side_of.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 01:52:47 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 05, 2011, 01:41:02 PM
Here's the latest:

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/dayton/springfieldpreps/entries/2011/02/05/kenyon_coach_gives_his_side_of.html

That clears it all up.  Or not at all.  Did Kenyon get okie-doked by Witt here?  If the handbook says to play on the next available day, and everybody else in the league played on Thursday, why did Witt not play Thursday?  Was that not the next available day?  Perhaps Wittenberg has a little more splainin' to do.  

If Thursday was the next available day and Witt declined to play on Thursday, why is Kenyon forfeiting?  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2011, 01:58:00 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 01:52:47 PMIf the handbook says to play on the next available day, and everybody else in the league played on Thursday, why did Witt not play Thursday?
Witt was closed on Thursday due to the weather.  Although the HPER Center may have been open, I think it's reasonable to cancel athletic events on days when classes are canceled.  At the high school level, at least, it's a requirement.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 05, 2011, 02:21:24 PM
It was at the two schools I've worked at as well, although I know that that isn't a hard-and-fast rule.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 05, 2011, 03:40:40 PM
Great win! Wabash Always Fights!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 03:53:56 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 05, 2011, 03:40:40 PM
Great win! Wabash Always Fights!

Massive win.  That ought to get Wabash out of the hole Jim Leffew dug for them on Thursday.  Wabash now has wins over #1 and #2 ranked teams in the nation.  Good stuff. 

Also, we learned that Wabash is more than just Wes Smith.  Smith had just 11 points and had to really scale back his offense playing with four fouls for the last 8 minutes of game time.  Wes didn't hang 25, Wabash was outshot and outrebounded...and they won.  That's a good team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 04:11:09 PM
Today's game also concludes the road portion of Wabash's regular season schedule.  We all play 8 road games in league play, and Wabash just played six of them in the last three weeks.  That's rough.  Wabash concludes their season with home games against Hiram (2/12), Witt (2/16), and Oberlin (2/19).  My hope is that today's game plus the three home dates will snap Wabash out of the mini funk they were in and get some positive inertia going into the league tournament. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 05, 2011, 04:36:36 PM
Of course as a Witt fan I love seeing Wabash come away with the victory today, now Witt just needs to hold serve and make it through a historically tough game at OHio Wesleyan Wednesday to set up a HUGE showdown next Saturday night In Springfield.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 04:42:17 PM
Hiarm's last second shot to force overtime at OWU comes up empty.  Bishops survive 54-52.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 05, 2011, 04:47:19 PM
Big crowd (almost 3000, including a bunch in red), tough loss.  Kudos to Wabash on coming up with the big plays in OT after losing a 7-point lead in the final minutes of regulation.  Hopefully, this will help the Scots to refocus on the stretch run.  If Wooster can win at Witt next Saturday, they could have as many as nine consecutive home games ahead.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 05, 2011, 04:53:58 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 03:53:56 PM
Quote from: Li'l Giant on February 05, 2011, 03:40:40 PM
Great win! Wabash Always Fights!

Massive win.  That ought to get Wabash out of the hole Jim Leffew dug for them on Thursday.  Wabash now has wins over #1 and #2 ranked teams in the nation.  Good stuff. 

Also, we learned that Wabash is more than just Wes Smith.  Smith had just 11 points and had to really scale back his offense playing with four fouls for the last 8 minutes of game time.  Wes didn't hang 25, Wabash was outshot and outrebounded...and they won.  That's a good team.

Only took them almost a full season to figure that out.  Smith was also defended very well all game long.  It wasn't just a matter of him scaling back his offense because of foul trouble.  ::)

Aaron Zinnerman was the difference in this game with his 4-8 shooting from downtown.  And Wooster was just leaving him alone to shoot it for the most part.  They finally started getting out on him after he made his fourth and he wasn't quite as effective from then on.

Another difference maker was the fact that Wabash also did a great job of perimeter defense on Wooster.  They really took Balch and Fegan out of the game completely.  Balch only managed to get off one 3-point attempt and Fegan had 2 attempts and they were 0-3 on those shots.  And Hallowell only had 4 attempts.  Holding Wooster's three best 3-point shooters to just 7 attempts is some pretty damn good defense.

Because of Wabash focusing on the perimeter defensively, it opened things up inside and Wick took advantage.  This too is a reason why Wooster's fg percentage was higher than I would have expected it to be.  Wick had a monster game which was nice to see.  Too bad it was in a losing effort though.  He really single handedly kept Wooster in this game and gave them a chance to win in the end.

The thing that really did Wooster in was turnovers.  Wooster may have outshot and outrebounded Wabash, but they also committed 20 turnovers including the most costly one of all on their last possession when Franks was stripped of the ball before even getting a shot attempt off.

Congrats to Wabash.  They played a hell of a game today.  Was this the first time Wes Smith wasn't their leading scorer this season?  If you would have told me before the game that Wooster would have held Smith to 11 points, outshot and outrebounded Wabash, I would have not been wondering if Wooster had won, but my question would have been by how much?!  But for the first time this season, not one, not two, but three Wabash players stepped up to score more points than Smith.  And that was really the difference in this game.  So, does this sudden revelation by Wabash help them down the stretch?  Will they try and be more team oriented?  Or does Smith continue to try and be a one man team?

Oh well.  I know it's cliche to say it, but this loss might just be the best thing to happen to this team.  It wasn't realistic to think that they could get through the entire season unbeaten.  Better for this loss to happen now than for their first loss of the season to occur in the postseason.  It's gut check time now for the Scots.  They have lost for the first time all year.  How do they respond moving forward is now the question.  Do they learn from this loss and get better as a result?  I'm thinking they will.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 05:04:43 PM
It's not news to the team or those of us who watch Wabash regularly, SF.  Wes is the #1 option on offense for sure, but Wabash isn't anywhere near 17-4 without the other guys. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 05, 2011, 05:17:00 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 05:04:43 PM
It's not news to the team or those of us who watch Wabash regularly, SF.  Wes is the #1 option on offense for sure, but Wabash isn't anywhere near 17-4 without the other guys. 

Then why did you say, "Also, we learned that Wabash is more than just Wes Smith?"  You said it, not me.  And furthermore, why has it taken 21 games for someone OTHER than Wes Smith to step up and lead Wabash in scoring?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 05, 2011, 05:20:18 PM
Great Win for the Little Giant's today.

WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 05:25:16 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 05, 2011, 05:17:00 PM
Then why did you say, "Also, we learned that Wabash is more than just Wes Smith?" 

For your edification...trying to include the room at large with the "we" there.  

Quote from: ScotsFan on February 05, 2011, 05:17:00 PM
You said it, not me.  And furthermore, why has it taken 21 games for someone OTHER than Wes Smith to step up and lead Wabash in scoring?

It hasn't taken until today for somebody else to lead Wabash in scoring.  It's happened before...but, that's not the point.  Why does it not make sense for the best offensive player in the entire league to lead the team in scoring most games?  That seems like it should be obvious.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 05, 2011, 05:49:33 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 05:25:16 PM

It hasn't taken until today for somebody else to lead Wabash in scoring.  It's happened before...but, that's not the point.  Why does it not make sense for the best offensive player in the entire league to lead the team in scoring most games?  That seems like it should be obvious.  

I stand corrected.  Today wasn't the first time Smith didn't lead his team in scoring, it was his second.  He also failed to lead his team in scoring in a 28 point blowout of Oberlin where he only played 26 minutes.  So, I guess if not leading the team in scoring in all but one game equates to 'most games' in your eyes, so be it.  I just think that if you look back at the losses Wabash has sufferred this season, you could also point to the fact that Wes Smith did his thing, but no one else stepped up to help because they were relying on Smith to do it all. 

Today, to their credit, Smith's teammates stepped up their games and look at the difference in the outcome.  Without Zinnerman and Kurosh stepping up and scoring almost 10 more than their season averages along with Baily scoring almost 7 above his season average, Wabash doesn't win this game.  All I'm saying is that, perhaps Wabash doesn't lose 4 of their last 7 games heading into today's game if they had consistent help for Smith like he got today...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 06:08:49 PM
The problem is that the picture you're painting is that Wabash's offensive plan is to hand it Smith and then clear out and let him play one on five.  It doesn't work like that.  Are there times and situations in games where Wabash will isolate Smith and let him create something?  Sure, but what team doesn't do that from time to time...especially with a player of Smith's caliber?  I'm not going to go as far as to say that Wabash is balanced, but it takes all five to make the offense work. 

I also think you're making a bit too much out of the losing four of seven thing.  Let's recap:
- Lost by 2 to the #1 team in the nation...buzzer beater to win just missed
- Lost by a single point at Wittenberg
- Lost at OWU on Tim Brady's career night
- Lost to Denison when Leffew turned into Reggie Miller for ten seconds

The sky was never falling for Wabash.  It's easy to react that way without perspective, but there was never a need for Wabash to panic.  They didn't panic, kept working hard, and beat a good team today. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 05, 2011, 06:18:49 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 06:08:49 PM
The sky was never falling for Wabash.  It's easy to react that way without perspective, but there was never a need for Wabash to panic.  They didn't panic, kept working hard, and beat a good team today. 

Funny how you can say this today after you have been pretty much a ghost in here during the 4 of 7 stretch Wabash was in...  ::)

But Wabash beats Wooster and here's Wally, front and center.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 06:46:49 PM
My bad.  I wasn't aware that I had to check in with the board with any kind of regularity.  I took a break from this forum because it had reached a point where no matter what I had to say, I would wind up getting insulted somehow.  If that's where this is headed again and you want to make it all about me, I'm happy to enjoy my hoops without the grief. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 05, 2011, 07:47:28 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 05, 2011, 04:47:19 PM
Big crowd (almost 3000, including a bunch in red), tough loss.  Kudos to Wabash on coming up with the big plays in OT after losing a 7-point lead in the final minutes of regulation.  Hopefully, this will help the Scots to refocus on the stretch run.  If Wooster can win at Witt next Saturday, they could have as many as nine consecutive home games ahead.

Or if they lose to Wittenberg, which I would put the odds at 50-50, or maybe worse for Wooster, then the Scots may not play another home game after Feb. 19. There is recent precedent for this. In 2005-06, Wooster was #1 in the country heading into the final regular season game against OWU. They lost there, and in the NCAC title game, giving them three regional losses. They went on the road for the first two games of the NCAA Tournament. The Scots focus, which I'm sure it is, should be on cutting down on turnovers and figuring out why their hottest shooter in recent weeks (Nathan Balch) and their hottest shooter in the first half against Wabash (Hallowell) were ignored for the entire game and second half, respectively.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 08:11:24 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 05, 2011, 07:47:28 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 05, 2011, 04:47:19 PM
Big crowd (almost 3000, including a bunch in red), tough loss.  Kudos to Wabash on coming up with the big plays in OT after losing a 7-point lead in the final minutes of regulation.  Hopefully, this will help the Scots to refocus on the stretch run.  If Wooster can win at Witt next Saturday, they could have as many as nine consecutive home games ahead.

Or if they lose to Wittenberg, which I would put the odds at 50-50, or maybe worse for Wooster, then the Scots may not play another home game after Feb. 19. There is recent precedent for this. In 2005-06, Wooster was #1 in the country heading into the final regular season game against OWU. They lost there, and in the NCAC title game, giving them three regional losses. They went on the road for the first two games of the NCAA Tournament. The Scots focus, which I'm sure it is, should be on cutting down on turnovers and figuring out why their hottest shooter in recent weeks (Nathan Balch) and their hottest shooter in the first half against Wabash (Hallowell) were ignored for the entire game and second half, respectively.

They played one of the best defenses in D-III.  Wabash had a plan to limit the 3FGAs and force Wooster inside...which led to a lot of turnovers.  The Scots didn't do anything wrong today.  No shame in losing by one to a good team. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 05, 2011, 08:21:11 PM
Back from Wooster where I watched an exciting game and overtime today.

Congratulations to Wabash on a well deserved important road win.  The Little Giants defended Wooster well today and forced some turnovers.  They also hit the boards on the offensive end and it paid dividends for them.

Great play by Wes Smith to knock the ball away from Ian Franks at the end of overtime.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 05, 2011, 08:32:21 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 05, 2011, 08:11:24 PM
They played one of the best defenses in D-III.  Wabash had a plan to limit the 3FGAs and force Wooster inside...which led to a lot of turnovers.  The Scots didn't do anything wrong today.  No shame in losing by one to a good team. 

There isn't a team that has played Wooster since the end of the 2008-09 season that hasn't tried to limit their three-pointers. Wabash played good defense, but it couldn't have been that good if Wooster shot 54% from the field, including 58% during regulation. Balch's game is just as strong inside the three-point line as it is beyond it. While Hallowell takes the majority of his shots from three, he was posting up early in the first half and making shots from inside. They just stopped going to that completely. Of course there is no shame to losing to Wabash. My point is that there is just a good a chance that Wooster loses a couple of more games than it does winning them all. This is giving credit to Wittenberg and even Wabash if they were to play in the NCAC Tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 05, 2011, 08:41:10 PM
Wooster shot 54% in this game compared to 43% for Wabash and they lost this game? ???  54% shooting should be good enough to win the game if you hit the boards, play tough defense and limit your mistakes....however,

IMO, Three Key Factors contributed to the loss by Wooster today:
1.  20 Turnovers by Wooster compared to only 14 by Wabash is a net 6 more shots for the Little Giants.  For the game, Wabash had 8 more shot attempts than the Scots.  You can't give the ball away against good teams!

2.  "Box Out" was not in Wooster's vocabulary today as they gave up 11 Offensive Boards to Wabash and the Little Giants turned several of these into second chance points.

3.  Wooster also did not defend the arc well giving up 8 three pointers (a couple were open looks by Aaron Zinnerman who made 4 three pointers for Wabash).  This was not a surprise as Zinnerman is the #2 scorer for Wabash and he is also #2 in three pointers made for their team.  This was a 5 point swing in Wabash's favor as Wooster only made 3 three pointers compared to 8 for the Little Giants.

One final point - Wooster started playing ferocious defense with ~4 minutes left in regulation when they trailed 62-55.  Where was this same defensive effort during the rest of the game when Wabash built a lead? ???

Hopefuly, the Scots learned today that they need a stronger effort for the whole game, not just the last 4-5 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 05, 2011, 10:03:33 PM
1. Wooster 11-1, 20-1
2. Wittenberg 11-1, 15-5
3. Ohio Wesleyan 9-3, 13-8
4. Wabash 9-4, 17-4
5. Hiram 4-8, 10-11
6. Kenyon 4-8, 8-12
7. Denison 5-8, 8-14
8. Allegheny 2-11, 5-16
9. Oberlin 1-12, 2-20
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2011, 02:13:49 PM
Kenyon Coach Dan Priest discusses the Wittenberg situation in a little more depth, and then makes an outstanding point about how this mare's nest is distracting from some of the great stories around our league.  This is a must-listen, at least the first half (the second half is mostly devoted to the upcoming Kenyon/Denison backyard rivalry game.)

The Dan Priest Show (http://client.stretchinternet.com/client/kenyon.portal?mode=link&eventId=17987&broadcastType=audio#)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 07, 2011, 03:45:42 PM
Good, coherent, timely communication, either from the schools involved or the conference office, could have spared us some of the drama.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 08, 2011, 11:53:25 AM
In non-Kenyon/Wittenberg news, Mac Petty today announced his retirement.

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2011/02/wabash-coach-to-retire
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bearman17 on February 08, 2011, 03:05:35 PM
Sad Day for Wabash and all of DIII with Mac's announcement. Total class and the game will miss him. Thanks for the great memories and for turning out not only great players and teams but quality individuals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 08, 2011, 03:59:34 PM
I wouldn't go with sad.  Of the many, many outstanding people that I've had the privelage to meet/know/work with/cover, Coach Petty stands out as one of the best.  There will be time later to reminisce about and celebrate this great career, but he's not done yet.  There's still plenty of work to do on this season and plenty of goals to accomplish.  WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2011, 02:49:39 AM
Four doubleheaders today!  Get thee to a gymnasium!  All links are valid for both games, except for the Wooster audio link (men only).

Hiram at Allegheny: women 6pm, men ~8pm -- live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/)
Denison at Kenyon: men 6pm, women ~8pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml)
Wooster at Oberlin: men 6pm, women ~8pm -- video and live stats (http://www.goyeo.com/); audio (http://wkvx.com/) (W; men only)
Wittenberg at Ohio Wesleyan: women 6pm, men ~8pm -- video and live stats (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1); audio (http://client.stretchinternet.com/client/wit.portal#) (W)

Oops!  Got the tip times mixed up at Gambier.  Just to clarify, the men play first at Kenyon and Oberlin, while the women play first at Allegheny and OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2011, 07:45:45 PM
Early games:
Wooster 79, Oberlin 62...Wooster trailed the whole first half, 30-28 at the break.
Kenyon 80, Denison 66
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 09, 2011, 09:19:38 PM
Wittenberg 45 Ohio Wesleyan 40 with 18:00 minutes to go
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 09, 2011, 09:26:24 PM
Dang.  The picture on the Witt-OWU video is about the best I've ever seen for DIII.  But after a minute or so, it just began stopping, even slipping backwards.  Unwatchable now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 09, 2011, 09:34:17 PM
Did Hallowell get injured? Only played 5 minutes. It was this exact same game of the year last season that he got hurt and then missed four games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2011, 09:52:16 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 09, 2011, 09:34:17 PM
Did Hallowell get injured? Only played 5 minutes. It was this exact same game of the year last season that he got hurt and then missed four games.
Breckenridge said he was icing his back and talking to the trainer in the second half.

Hiram shot 70% in the first half and ran away and hid from Allegheny.  Final was 72-57.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 09, 2011, 09:57:47 PM
Final:  Wittenberg 76  Ohio Wesleyan 70

Chris Sullivan made 8 of 12 three point shots and led Witt in scoring with 24 points.

I hope that Wooster guards Sullivan closely on Saturday!  ::) :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 09, 2011, 10:05:45 PM
Wittenberg as a team shot 14-25 from 3 point range, hopefully they save some of that for Saturday night as well.

Also, now that we can look forward to Saturday: all seats are reserved again this year for the game and a big crowd is expected.

Congrats to Chris Sullivan for breaking the school record for 3-pointers in a career with 211 in his career

Woo Boo- I agree with the video feed, I gave up midway through the game and went to the Wittenberg radio feed instead
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 09, 2011, 10:11:12 PM
Current NCAC Standings with 2/9 results:

1. Wooster 12-1, 21-1
1. Wittenberg 12-1, 16-5
3. Ohio Wesleyan 9-4, 13-9
3. Wabash 9-4, 17-4
5. Hiram 5-8, 11-11
5. Kenyon 5-8, 9-12
7. Denison 5-9, 8-15
8. Allegheny 2-12, 5-17
9. Oberlin 1-13, 2-21

 


 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2011, 10:13:12 PM
So Wittenberg played a good opponent and played an outstanding game, grabbing a key win, while Wooster played a terrible opponent and looked horrible doing so (at least for a half).  What does that say about Saturday's matchup?  Given the history of the Wooster/Wittenberg rivalry, probably nothing at all.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: D-III Insider on February 09, 2011, 10:33:10 PM
Anyone else find it a bit strange that Wittenberg dropped out of this week's regional rankings without losing a game?  And they seem to be getting stronger with the addition of McKee from a personnel standpoint.  It really will not matter in the long run but I found it a bit odd.  If they beat Wooster at home on Saturday (which I believe they will) they will almost assuredly jump back into the top four in Great Lakes.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 09, 2011, 10:34:57 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 09, 2011, 10:13:12 PM
So Wittenberg played a good opponent and played an outstanding game, grabbing a key win, while Wooster played a terrible opponent and looked horrible doing so (at least for a half).  What does that say about Saturday's matchup?  Given the history of the Wooster/Wittenberg rivalry, probably nothing at all.  :)

Yeah, it means nothing. Wabash lost to Denison less than 48 hours before winning at Wooster. Anything can happen in conference play. The important thing is that Wooster and Witt both won and the league lead is on the line this weekend. How they got there isn't critical.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 09, 2011, 10:40:53 PM
D III Insider - I brought up this exact point in the Great Lakes region board, doesn't make much sense
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 09, 2011, 10:46:52 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 09, 2011, 10:34:57 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 09, 2011, 10:13:12 PM
So Wittenberg played a good opponent and played an outstanding game, grabbing a key win, while Wooster played a terrible opponent and looked horrible doing so (at least for a half).  What does that say about Saturday's matchup?  Given the history of the Wooster/Wittenberg rivalry, probably nothing at all.  :)

Yeah, it means nothing. Wabash lost to Denison less than 48 hours before winning at Wooster. Anything can happen in conference play.

Well, not anything. Oberlin winning two halves against Wooster on the same night rather than just one would certainly cause a massive rupture in the fabric of the space/time continuum.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 09, 2011, 11:09:08 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 09, 2011, 10:46:52 PMWell, not anything. Oberlin winning two halves against Wooster on the same night rather than just one would certainly cause a massive rupture in the fabric of the space/time continuum.

I was thinking more along the lines of:

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.alaska-in-pictures.com%2Fdata%2Fmedia%2F20%2Fmushroom-cloud_4517.jpg&hash=37ffa973b6878412f024ec96c22bb90820e54843)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 10, 2011, 12:30:32 PM
Quote from: D-III Insider on February 09, 2011, 10:33:10 PM
Anyone else find it a bit strange that Wittenberg dropped out of this week's regional rankings without losing a game?  And they seem to be getting stronger with the addition of McKee from a personnel standpoint.  It really will not matter in the long run but I found it a bit odd.  If they beat Wooster at home on Saturday (which I believe they will) they will almost assuredly jump back into the top four in Great Lakes.


It happened because Wittenberg and Thiel (and PSU-Behrend) were so close in the rankings that a few small changes in the winning percentage and SOS numbers were enough to jockey their positions around some.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 11, 2011, 05:42:13 PM
Quote from: WAlum on February 02, 2011, 07:46:27 AM
From the OAC board:
With so many opinions on here... I am curious to find out how would all the OAC followers rate the OAC coaches from top to bottom?

What about the ncac coaches?

I know this was 10 days ago, but I never really noticed any responses.  And I think this is at least the 2nd time that someone asked basically the same question this season - with a similar lack of response both times!

I would find it tough to rank all 9 coaches, but I'd be willing to give a shot to the 4 that have been constants in the league for a number of years.

1.  Moore - Wooster. There really shouldn't be any argument on this one.  He has the highest All-Time career winning % of any DIII coach.  Recruiting, player development, game prep, in-game adjustments - none better.
2a.  DeWitt - OWU.  Always runs a very competitive program, perhaps without quite the same level of talent as the W's.
2b.  Petty - Wabash.  Runs a great program, recruits well.  Sorry to see him go.
4.  Brown - Witt.  Good coach, but I think he's a half-rung or so below Petty and DeWitt.

There has been a lot of turnover in the lower half of the conference. Fleming from Hiram would probably be next on my list, but I have no clue after that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2011, 06:49:55 PM
Derek,

I'd put Mac at 2 and DeWitt at 2 1/2. Fenlon from DPU will be right there as well with DeWitt. Priest at Kenyon may be pretty good based on what he did at Hendrix. Fleming has made Hiram more than just an automatic "W" which is a tall order there. I'm still shocked Allegheny cut ties with Clune.

One guy who I thought was a pretty good coach was Jeff Justus at Earlham. He's hamstrung by many factors at Earlham but the Quake always seemed to play hard.

The question is can anyone really evaluate Oberlin's coaches fairly? Cavaco may be a coaching genius but Oberlin's program and priorities are not conducive to 20+ win seasons. What would coach Moore or Petty do with the limitations at an Oberlin or Earlham?

The mind wonders...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2011, 06:52:03 PM
One thing I do have faith is this administration at Wabash getting the right coach for the team. The entire athletics program is headed in the right direction, and improving in every facet. I think Tom Bambrey's last great move will be to hire a Wabash basketball coach that will carry on Mac's legacy while being his own coach.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 11, 2011, 07:23:16 PM
Wow. It seems like all coaches have been mentioned but one.  But if people are waiting for me to weigh in, I have an event to get to. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2011, 08:24:17 PM
I recuse myself from discussion of head coaches.  I'm anxious to see what kind of teams Doug Cline and Travis Schwab have when they reach that level.

Tomorrow's games:
Hiram at Wabash, 1pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/)
Denison at Allegheny, ~3pm -- live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Kenyon at OWU, ~3pm -- live stats (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Wooster at Wittenberg, 7:30 -- video, audio, and live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/); audio (http://wkvx.com/) (COW) -- Game 3 of a tripleheader; women at 2pm and men's JV at 5:30
Oberlin is idle

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on February 11, 2011, 08:37:08 PM
Any word on Hallowell? Will he play tomorrow ?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2011, 10:03:01 PM
Quote from: GoRed on February 11, 2011, 07:23:16 PM
Wow. It seems like all coaches have been mentioned but one.  But if people are waiting for me to weigh in, I have an event to get to. 

:D

Seriously, about every Denison team of recent vintage has one or two top players, and then a bunch of role players that seem to be a notch below most NCAC teams in terms of talent, especially on defense. It's very odd, and quite the pattern. While you can definitely win with stud + role players, the role players have to be able to play their roles and play good defense, and not just be good, scrappy, nice guys.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2011, 10:11:59 PM
Here's a nice article in the Daily Record (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4979277) on the Wooster players volunteering at a local school.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 12, 2011, 11:15:37 AM
Here is the Daily Record article on tonight's big game between Wooster and Wittenberg: www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4980070

The article points out that the winner of tonight's game will have the upper hand in the race for the NCAC title.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 12, 2011, 01:49:39 PM
Here's to another good chapter in the Witt/Wooster rivalry tonight!!!

LETS GO WITT!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 12, 2011, 05:01:06 PM
OWU holds Kenyon to two points in the last 9 minutes of the game to come from 11 down and win on a three with 14 seconds left.  Looked like a thriller. 

Denison drops a critical game to Allegheny to stay in contention for a sixth seed spot. Looks like a 7th seed for the Big Red unless a few miracles happen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2011, 06:50:55 PM
Those scores were as follows:
Allegheny 66, Denison 63
OWU 58, Kenyon 56

Elsewhere,
Hiram 70, Wabash 58

Updated standings, heading into the nightcap:

1. Wooster 12-1, 21-1
1. Wittenberg 12-1, 16-5
3. Ohio Wesleyan 10-4, 14-9
4. Wabash 9-5, 17-5
5. Hiram 6-8, 12-11
6. Kenyon 5-9, 9-13
7. Denison 5-10, 8-16
8. Allegheny 3-12, 6-17
9. Oberlin 1-13, 2-21
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2011, 07:10:07 PM
The LG's had a week to get through the Wooster hangover. Hiram's no sissy-mary. To not be ready to play a home conference game at this juncture is quite concerning. Now Witt comes to town.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 12, 2011, 07:10:25 PM
Haven't seen any reports.  What the heck happened in Crawfordsville today?!  Losing to Hiram is one thing; losing by 12 at home is another. :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2011, 07:18:48 PM
From the web site - the LGs fell behind 19-9, and then stormed back to take a half-time lead. Wabash couldn't shoot and Hiram got hot, and after about the 15 minute mark they raced away.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 12, 2011, 07:26:08 PM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on February 11, 2011, 08:37:08 PM
Any word on Hallowell? Will he play tomorrow ?


Hallowell is in the starting lineup for the Scots tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 12, 2011, 08:02:36 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 42  Wittenberg 32

Wooster is being led by Nathan Balch with 13 points (3 three pointers), Josh Claytor with 6 and Ian Franks with 6.

Wittenberg's top scorers are Clayton Black with 14 points and Chris Sullivan with 5.

Scots shot over 50% in the half and Witt won the rebound battle.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2011, 08:05:14 PM
Every time I see the name "Claytor," I think there's something wrong with my display since the terminal 'n' is cut off. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 12, 2011, 08:23:02 PM
Wooster couldn't have asked for a better start to this game tonight!  Now, let's just continue this for another 20 minutes and leave Springfield with the upper hand for Woo's 7th regular season title in a row!

Also, looks like a nice Wooster crowd showed up.  Breck mentioned a good size crowd, but nowhere close to the 3000 they were expecting.  He was guessing around 2000 and I'm guessing Woo's fans make up about 1/4 of the crowd!   8-)

Black has kept Witt in this game.  Included in his 14 points are a couple of ill advised shots that Wooster will probably live with.  One was his first made trey on the season and another was a shot from around 18 feet out.  I'm guessing Wooster will take Black settling for outside jumpers as I don't see him continuing to find the success he did in the first half if he keeps chucking 18-20 foot jumpers.

I'm loving the Witt video feed and WQKT's webcast are pretty much in sync with each other as well!  8-)

As for that Wabash result, I think all of the Pool C love Wabash attained after beating Wooster was just flushed down the toilet with their loss at home to Hiram.  Also, it looks like they learned nothing by the team effort they displayed in beating Wooster as it once again looks like Wes Smith tried to do it all himself.  He had 25 and the only other player for Wabash in double figures was Derek Bailey with 10.  Not even close to the team effort and balanced scoring they showed at Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 12, 2011, 08:50:42 PM
This is deja vu only the opposite of the game in Wooster.  Wooster has blown a 12 point 2nd half lead and now trails by 4?!  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 12, 2011, 09:03:14 PM
Final:  Wittenberg 76  Wooster 72

Congratulations to Wittenberg on a big comeback to secure the victory tonight.

Wooster's top scorers:  Ian Franks 13, Nathan Balch 13, Bryan Wickliffe 12

Wittenberg's top scorers:  Clayton Black 30, Chris Sullivan 16, Jacob Weide 8
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on February 12, 2011, 09:35:47 PM
Unusual for Witt to put it all on the shoulders of one guy offensively, and he really stepped up. 
Great to see the Tiger "D" do the J O B...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 12, 2011, 09:40:08 PM
Wittenberg 76 Wooster 72, BIG time win for Witt as they take sole possession of first place in the NCAC and hold their own destiny in their corner.

I will say, for the most part it was a near sell out for Witt and probably the most "sportsman" display on both fan bases in a long time in this rivalry. No "S*it on Witt or F Wooster cheers. Very energetic crowd and I think about half of Witt's students were in attendance (not really but it seemed like it)

As for the game, really it was a tale of two segments. Wooster controlled the first 25 minutes and Witt controlled the last 15 minutes. In the first half, Wooster had about 16 points on wide open layups or shots down low. Witt didn't play zone one bit tonight so they got caught in some switches down low as they were trying to guard against the 3. Witt started playing a little more intensely in the second half.

Game balls go to: First and foremost Clayton Black, whether he was out for redemption from the first matchup or whatever, he was absolutely a force tonight on the offensive end. He had an impact on the D as well as he kept Hallowell in check for the most part.

2 - Seth Hill. He only had 6 points but for a guard to have 13 rebounds and 5 assists is a pretty good box score.

3. Micheal Cooper, he did a fairly good job on Franks in the second half and kept him well below his scoring average. Although Franks had more than enough driveing layups, I honestly don't think he had a 3 pointer all night and may not have even gotten one off.

Great overall hustle by Witt and here's to another great addition to the Wittenberg/Wooster chapter, the best rivalry in D3 Hoops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 12, 2011, 09:41:52 PM
Also, not sure what to think of Wabash's loss to Hiram today but that should effectively drop them way down the regional rankings and move Witt way up. Perhaps they could flip flop spots, but cannot have losses like that.

Should be an interesting psychological battle for both coaches. How does Witt come off a victory that huge and how does Wabash rebound after a tough loss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 12, 2011, 09:53:02 PM
1. Wittenberg 13-1, 17-5
2. Wooster 12-2, 21-2
3. Ohio Wesleyan 10-4, 14-9
4. Wabash 9-5, 17-5
5. Hiram 6-8, 12-11
6. Kenyon 5-9, 9-13
7. Denison 5-10, 8-16
8. Allegheny 3-12, 6-17
9. Oberlin 1-13, 2-21
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2011, 10:05:35 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 12, 2011, 09:41:52 PM
Also, not sure what to think of Wabash's loss to Hiram today but that should effectively drop them way down the regional rankings and move Witt way up. Perhaps they could flip flop spots, but cannot have losses like that.

Should be an interesting psychological battle for both coaches. How does Witt come off a victory that huge and how does Wabash rebound after a tough loss.

Maybe Witt will have the Wooster hangover as well... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on February 12, 2011, 10:32:21 PM
For as well as Wabash played at Wooster, we turned back into the team that played Denison.  Hiram is as athletic of a team as I have witnessed in the conference and when the three bombs started falling, Wabash could not put a run together.  Wabash had 3 attempts to make a five point game a one possession contest and could not get a shot to fall.  Wes Smith was out with the flu the last two days; not an excuse, just a factor.  In short, Wabash had a sub-par game.  When Hiram is clicking on all cylinders they are very dangerous.  Not excited about them coming back over for round one of the tourney but they were the better team tonight.  Agreed that Pool C is probably long gone.  This is still a good Wabash crew and I am not counting them out for a tourney run.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 12, 2011, 10:59:22 PM
Congrats to Witt on turning the tables on Wooster tonight.  Witt was on the short end of the stick in blowing a double digit second half lead at Wooster and tonight, the Tigers returned the favor to the Scots by overcoming as much as a 14 point deficit early in the second half to come all the way back for the win.

Clayton Black was too much for Wooster tonight.  It should have been pretty clear when he made his first 3-pointer of the season, that we were in for one of those nights...   

When Wooster looks back at what went wrong in this game, they need look no further than rebounding and more specifically offensive rebounding.  Witt outrebounded Wooster 39-30 and the more crucial number was a 15-7 advantage for Witt on the offensive glass.  That was the difference in this one. 

And for as good as Wooster looked offensively in the first half, they were equally as bad in the 2nd half.  Case in point, Nathan Balch's 2nd half dissapearance.  He scored 13 points in the first half and was shut out in the 2nd half.  And Matt Fegan's shooting and scoring woes continue.  In Fegan's last 6 games dating back to Witt round one, Fegan has averaged just over 2 ppg and is 3-19 from 3-point range over those 6 games?!  He really needs to get things figured out if Wooster has any hopes of making a deep run come tournament time.

Wooster now finds themselves in a position of needing help if they want to claim their 7th straight regular season conference title.  Not something I thought we'd be talking about just a couple of weeks ago...  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 12, 2011, 11:03:18 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 12, 2011, 09:40:08 PM
Micheal Cooper, he did a fairly good job on Franks in the second half and kept him well below his scoring average. Although Franks had more than enough driveing layups, I honestly don't think he had a 3 pointer all night and may not have even gotten one off.

The 3-point shot isn't really where Franks is most lethal from an offensive perspective.  He looks to get most of his points driving to the basket and at the ft line.

But with that said, he did manage to make one 3 pointer on four tries...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 13, 2011, 01:08:12 AM
Refresh my memory, how many years in a row has Wooster won the NCAC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2011, 01:41:54 AM
Six in a row, and seven of eight, regular season crowns for the Scots.

Though right now, any of the top four could win the tourney given matchups, etc. AND Hiram could sneak in and win a couple of games and really wreck things.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 13, 2011, 01:50:30 AM
Wooster and/or Wittenberg have won or shared every (regular season) NCAC Championship since the 1988-89 season.  Witt shared the conference title with Allegheny in 1992-93, and since then it's been only Wooster (11 times including the last 6) or Wittenberg (6 times).  OWU is the only other team to have won an outright title (twice, 1984-85 and 1986-87), while Allegheny has shared the title three times but never won it outright. 

Congratulations to Wittenberg on a great victory today.  Same goes for Hiram, OWU, and 'Gheny.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 13, 2011, 09:46:56 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 12, 2011, 10:59:22 PM
Not something I thought we'd be talking about just a couple of weeks ago...  :-\

As I recall, I spoke of this a few weeks ago but was summarily chastised.  Regardless, Witt played an outstanding game and
Clayton Black was great.  Congrats Witt on moving into the top spot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 13, 2011, 10:01:07 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 05, 2011, 07:47:28 PM
Or if they lose to Wittenberg, which I would put the odds at 50-50, or maybe worse for Wooster, then the Scots may not play another home game after Feb. 19. There is recent precedent for this. In 2005-06, Wooster was #1 in the country heading into the final regular season game against OWU. They lost there, and in the NCAC title game, giving them three regional losses. They went on the road for the first two games of the NCAA Tournament.

Prophetic post by Seinfeld. k+  Wooster now finds themselves in a tough spot because they may not play any more home games after February 19th unless they win the NCAC tourney, regardless of the hosting site.

If Wooster's key seniors (Franks, Balch, Wickliffe) want to make some noise in the NCAA tournament, the Scots need to regroup and try to win their next 5 games (2 regular season, 3 NCAC tourney) so Wooster gets a decent seed and hopefully some home games in the NCAA tournament.

Rebounding, minimizing turnovers and avoiding offensive lapses (Wooster was stuck on 68 points last night for ~6 minutes while Witt went on a 12-0 run to take a 5 point lead) should be Wooster's focus in the next few games.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 13, 2011, 10:27:02 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 12, 2011, 10:59:22 PM
When Wooster looks back at what went wrong in this game, they need look no further than rebounding and more specifically offensive rebounding.  Witt outrebounded Wooster 39-30 and the more crucial number was a 15-7 advantage for Witt on the offensive glass.  That was the difference in this one. 

ScotsFan nailed the key factor in last night's loss by Wooster. k+  Wittenberg's rebounding advantage in this game meant that Witt got 63 shots at the basket versus only 58 for the Scots.

So, while Wooster outshot Witt (46.6% to 44.4%) they still lost the game with the Tigers taking 5 more shots.

In Wooster's other loss, Wabash took 58 shots compared to only 50 for Wooster.  The Scots had 20 turnovers in that game and gave up 11 offensive rebounds which is why the Little Giants had more shots and won the game.

Wooster generally shoots a higher % than their opponents (as they did in their 2 losses!) but they waste that shooting advantage when they lose the rebounding battle or commit too many turnovers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 13, 2011, 11:51:00 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 13, 2011, 10:27:02 AM
Wittenberg's rebounding advantage in this game meant that Witt got 63 shots at the basket versus only 58 for the Scots.

So, while Wooster outshot Witt (46.6% to 44.4%) they still lost the game with the Tigers taking 5 more shots.

In Wooster's other loss, Wabash took 58 shots compared to only 50 for Wooster.  The Scots had 20 turnovers in that game and gave up 11 offensive rebounds which is why the Little Giants had more shots and won the game.

Wooster generally shoots a higher % than their opponents (as they did in their 2 losses!) but they waste that shooting advantage when they lose the rebounding battle or commit too many turnovers.

Yep.  There is a negative trend with this team that gives me great cause for concern as the post season nears.  And that is Wooster's inability to match up with teams who are big and physical on the inside.  Witt, Wabash and even Hiram have seemed to all out-muscle Wooster inside on the boards and especially when it comes to Wooster giving up too many offensive boards which lead to 2nd chance points.  Wooster has GOT to figure out a way to do a better job of boxing out, although last night they may have been so preoccupied with boxing out Witt's bigs, they forgot to account for the smaller players as 6'2" Seth Hill corralled 13 boards?!

All in all, if Wooster can't figure out a way of tightening down their pension for giving up so many offensive rebounds, their post-season will be shorter than expected...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 13, 2011, 01:26:16 PM
Quote from: GoRed on February 13, 2011, 09:46:56 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 12, 2011, 10:59:22 PM
Not something I thought we'd be talking about just a couple of weeks ago...  :-\

As I recall, I spoke of this a few weeks ago but was summarily chastised.

Good try, Big Red, but this isn't quite what you said. Here is what you actually said:

QuoteThe big guys seemed to get intimidated by the smaller, but tougher, Denison inside guys.

I'm sure there were a couple of moments in that game where Wooster's frontline wasn't as aggressive as they should have been, but considering they outrebounded Denison 47-33 in the game you are referring to, how intimidated could they have been? Add in the rebound total from the first meeting, and the Scots outrebounded the Big Red by 22 boards in two games.

QuoteNot the composure I expected from the Number 1 team, and I have to say I enjoyed watching it.

Again, not really sure where this comes from. Wooster trailed by four points about five minutes into the second half, then outscored Denison 36-24 down the stretch. Not sure where the lack of composure comes from. And this comment was made while Wooster was undefeated, having won several games in tight fashion, including late come from behind wins over Carnegie Mellon (road) and Baruch (neutral) while grinding out tough wins over Allegheny (road), Wilmington and Wabash (road). And right after your "insightful" observation, Wooster rallied from 11 points down with less than 10 minutes to play against Wittenberg to win. I guess they showed some composure there.

QuoteI see a lot more cool from the other two W's - maybe because they don't read as much of their own press.

This statement pretty much discredited any thing else you have said -- even things that may have had some merit. Are you traveling around Ohio watching these teams play? How can you make some sort of assessment like that? You obviously hadn't seen Wabash play, since they just lost to Denison last week. I just pointed out how Wooster rallied against said "W" team with better composure. In Wooster's loss to Wabash, the Scots trailed almost the entire game, but rallied from down seven points with 4:20 to play to force overtime. I would say they kept their cool pretty well in that game. Now, the Scots did blow a big lead against Witt last night, but from all reports, the comeback came as a result of great all-around play from the Tigers, not some sort of mental breakdown from the Scots.

As for the reading the press nonsense, there isn't a coach who has more antipathy to publicity and rankings than Steve Moore. He encouraged the College NOT to publicize the #1 ranking in any way. And while I'm sure there are a few Wooster fans who were already booking their Final Four tickets (this would be the case with any team in this position), all the Wooster fans I know felt Wooster never deserved to be #1 and had a couple of areas that needed fixing. That's the beauty of a long season. These things get flushed out. But after the dust settles, Wooster has lost only two games -- to two nationally-ranked teams -- by a combined five points. They are right were they were when they went to the Final Four (2003 & 2007), and they are also where they were when they bowed out quickly in the NCAA Tournament (2006). So we'll just have to see what happens.

Code Select
After seeing how the Scots handled that game, I don't think they have the heads for sweeping conference play and going deep in the tournament any more.

I'm not sure many people thought they were going to sweep the conference schedule. It has only been done three times since the conference went to just one division in the early 1990s. If a Wooster fan posted it on this message board, I'd like to see the quote. As for a deep tournament run, again, people I have talked with were and remain slightly skeptical of how this is all going to play out. But when you're team is undefeated and #1, what are you supposed to think? That you are going to lose in the first round of your conference tournament?

As for Wooster's rebounding, this obviously hurt them last night, but they have always had problems rebounding against Wittenberg. This is the Tigers' bread and butter -- big, physical inside play. But I'm not ready to declare this a significant problem. For one, Wooster leads the NCAC in rebounding margin (+9.7). Second, Wickliffe, Wooster's top rebounder, was limited to just 16 minutes with foul trouble, so this was a factor. And in the Wabash loss, Wooster did give up too many offensive rebounds, but for the game they outrebounded the Little Giants by 7, and Wabash got more offensive rebounds, in part, because they missed 10 more shots, creating more opportunities for offensive rebounds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2011, 02:27:13 PM
I edited the poll, may have screwed it up...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 13, 2011, 02:30:34 PM
Keep in mind I was speaking to their composure in that game (Wooster at Denison), which I don't think any of the writers here witnessed other than me, and what I believed it meant for their ability to run the table and go deep into the tournament.  After seeing what happened in the first game at Wooster, I thought they might be good enough to go through the conference without a loss.  I then saw a few distinct flaws in their armor that night at Livingston.  The fact you feel they demonstrated their composure by pulling that particular game out doesn't prove my point wrong.    

I understand that you and the other Wooster fans won't ever agree with me on this.  I still stand by my comment and it has so far proven out in who is now on top of the conference.  If they do happen to pull out the conference now and go deep into the tournament, good for them.  They have a lot of talent.  

Lastly, I have been to and watched many games - the miracle of video on the internet.  Saw Wabash/Hiram and Woo/Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 13, 2011, 05:25:37 PM
I think some of the rebounding woes come from the fact that Wittenberg and Wabash are two strong rebounding teams. As seinfeld alluded to, Wittenberg has a history of dominating down low in matchups against Wooster and this is certainly not an unheard of stat.

I think Wednesday's Witt/Wabash game could be the biggest game of the season for both teams because of this. With another regionally ranked win, Wittenberg gives itself a strong case for an at large bid if something happens in the conference tournament. Wabash needs a strong victory for confidence reasons, but also to help any floating chance sof a Pool C bid (not many remain at all)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 13, 2011, 11:42:16 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fts4.mm.bing.net%2Fimages%2Fthumbnail.aspx%3Fq%3D411996726135%26amp%3Bid%3Df15ae2191f834b3b3a138f26ebdff309&hash=1f6651ea1f51a33f5adc19907ee272f33fe50ecb)


Edit - Original photo was removed from web.  This one will do.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2011, 02:40:34 AM
Quote from: bashbrother on February 13, 2011, 11:42:16 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.annyas.com%2Fscreenshots%2Fimages%2F1941%2Fdr-jekyll-and-mr-hyde-trailer-title-still.jpg&hash=6bccaacbc794cec0c6ca5f3b74183da995accf33)



I agree. 10 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 14, 2011, 11:20:12 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 13, 2011, 05:25:37 PM
I think some of the rebounding woes come from the fact that Wittenberg and Wabash are two strong rebounding teams. As seinfeld alluded to, Wittenberg has a history of dominating down low in matchups against Wooster and this is certainly not an unheard of stat.

I agree.  The part that concerns me is the probablility of Wooster running into a team with a strong inside presence come tournament time.  Seinfeld mentioned Wooster's overall rebounding numbers have been good as they lead the conference in rebounding margin.  I just think those numbers might be a bit deceiving as Wooster hasn't had to face teams with big and physical inside presences like they see from Witt and Wabash on a regular basis.  I'd say Hiram is the only other team in the conference and Wooster didn't really face big teams in their non-conference portion of their schedule either.

I will take solace in the fact that Wick getting into foul trouble didn't help Wooster's cause in that game on Saturday.  He is Wooster's leading rebounder after all. 



BTW, does anyone know why Wooster and Kenyon are playing tomorrow night instead of Wednesday?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 14, 2011, 11:33:23 AM
Quote from: GoRed on February 13, 2011, 02:30:34 PM
Keep in mind I was speaking to their composure in that game (Wooster at Denison), which I don't think any of the writers here witnessed other than me, and what I believed it meant for their ability to run the table and go deep into the tournament.  After seeing what happened in the first game at Wooster, I thought they might be good enough to go through the conference without a loss.  I then saw a few distinct flaws in their armor that night at Livingston.  The fact you feel they demonstrated their composure by pulling that particular game out doesn't prove my point wrong.    

I understand that you and the other Wooster fans won't ever agree with me on this.  I still stand by my comment and it has so far proven out in who is now on top of the conference.  If they do happen to pull out the conference now and go deep into the tournament, good for them.  They have a lot of talent.  Lastly, I have been to and watched many games - the miracle of video on the internet.  Saw Wabash/Hiram and Woo/Witt.

The current standings have done nothing to prove your comment correct.  The fact is, Witt and Wabash are two very good basketball games and there is no shame in losing to either of those two nationally ranked opponents.  The fact that Witt is now alone atop the standings proves nothing of your point that Wooster doesn't have the heads to sweep the conference schedule and make a deep run come tournament time.  You also made mention of how you see a lot more cool from the other W's???  Was that coolness in evidence when Wabash lost to Denison?  Or how about in their home loss to Hiram?  How about Witt's coolness when they blew a double digit lead a couple of weeks ago in their game with Wooster?

As seinfeld made note of, I don't recall reading any Wooster fans in here predicting Wooster would run the table in the NCAC.  And in talking to other Wooster fans, I can assure you we have plenty to be concerned about when it comes to hoping for this team to make a deep run in the tournament.  At the same time, you try and not be too critical of a team that was undefeated and ranked #1 in the country until just last week. 

Bottom line is, I just don't see how 2 losses to ranked opponents by a total of 5 points suddenly proves your opinion that this team doesn't have the heads to make a deep run in the tournament.  Oh, and the regular season conference race isn't over just yet BTW.  Witt has two very loseable road games to finsih off the season and Woo's game with OWU will be no gimme either.  How about letting the season finish out before you go around thumping your chest about your opinions...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2011, 09:55:44 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 14, 2011, 11:20:12 AMBTW, does anyone know why Wooster and Kenyon are playing tomorrow night instead of Wednesday?

No idea, but thanks for pointing this out; otherwise, I'd have missed it altogether.  Maybe someone on Kenyon's team has to take the LSAT, and Wooster uncomplainingly moved the game to accommodate?  ;D

Kenyon at Wooster, 7:30pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 14, 2011, 10:58:58 PM
New Top 25 poll is released:

Wooster is at #5, Wittenberg moved up to #17 and Wabash checks in at #18.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2011, 11:44:51 AM
Three in the Top 25, but only one in the NCAA?

Could happen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 15, 2011, 01:59:48 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 15, 2011, 11:44:51 AM
Three in the Top 25, but only one in the NCAA?

Could happen.

Highly unlikely, I think.  I doubt that Wittenberg could win the regular season league title and be left out.  Even though I know league championships are not a selection criteria, it's hard to imagine Wittenberg being left out if that happens.  Witt probably needs to lose both of their games this week (which would cough up the league championship), then lose in the semis to play their way out. 

Pool C scholars seem to think Wabash has a pretty good résumé regardless of the head-scratcher from Saturday.  The record over regionally ranked teams is quite good and if Wabash could add one more win over a RR'd team (be it tomorrow night or in the league semis), they would likely be in a good position for selection. 

Right now, I think the league looks excellent for two teams, with a better than you might think chance at placing a third team in the field as well...and of course a lot of that at-large speculation hinges on what happens in league tournaments around the nation and how many teams that are outside of the bubble play well for a weekend and steal bids. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 15, 2011, 03:14:33 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 15, 2011, 01:59:48 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 15, 2011, 11:44:51 AM
Three in the Top 25, but only one in the NCAA?

Could happen.

Highly unlikely, I think.  I doubt that Wittenberg could win the regular season league title and be left out.  Even though I know league championships are not a selection criteria, it's hard to imagine Wittenberg being left out if that happens.  Witt probably needs to lose both of their games this week (which would cough up the league championship), then lose in the semis to play their way out. 

Pool C scholars seem to think Wabash has a pretty good résumé regardless of the head-scratcher from Saturday.  The record over regionally ranked teams is quite good and if Wabash could add one more win over a RR'd team (be it tomorrow night or in the league semis), they would likely be in a good position for selection. 

Right now, I think the league looks excellent for two teams, with a better than you might think chance at placing a third team in the field as well...and of course a lot of that at-large speculation hinges on what happens in league tournaments around the nation and how many teams that are outside of the bubble play well for a weekend and steal bids. 

Wittenberg looks pretty good to me to get in, even if they lose to Wabash here tomorrow.

Wabash probably wants to win this matchup if they want to maintain a strong case for Pool C. If they don't win, they'll probably need to reach the NCAC championship game to get a Pool C. Either way, it mean's they'll probably need to beat Wooster or Wittenberg at least one more time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2011, 08:54:29 PM
Final: Wooster 73  Kenyon 58

Wooster's Top Scorers:  Ian Franks 24, Justin Hallowell 19, Nathan Balch 10

Kenyon's Top Scorers:  Evan McCulley 11, Kodey Haddox 11, Brian Lebowitz 9,

Sloppy game tonight with neither team shooting very well.  Wooster won the battle of the boards 47 to 36 and played solid defense to notch the win.

Kenyon drops to 9-14 overall, 5-10 NCAC.

Wooster is now 22-2, 13-2 NCAC :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2011, 09:53:30 AM
Tonight's games:
OWU at Denison, 6pm -- video and live stats (http://www.denison.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/1011/mb_schedule10.html) -- Game 1 of a doubleheader, women vs. Witt to follow
Oberlin at Hiram, 7:30 -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html)
Wittenberg at Wabash, 7:30 -- video, audio, and live stats (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball); audio (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/sportsnetwork/) (Witt)
Penn St.-Behrend at Allegheny, 7:30pm -- live stats (http://www.alleghenysports.com/) -- NCAC's final non-conference game, record is 43-37
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 16, 2011, 03:30:35 PM
Week 3 Regional Rankings are out: http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2011/02/16/ncaa-2011-regional-rankings-week-3/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 16, 2011, 05:27:59 PM
I'm pretty worried about the Wabash/Witt game tonight. Biggest game of the season easily for both teams really. Witt can clinch a share of the conference title with a win tonight and probably lock up an NCAA birth and Wabash arguably needs a win tonight to keep any at large chances alive. Wabash and Witt of course will both have a great chance to win the conference tournament.

Game will come down to 2 things tonight: 1 - who wins the rebounding battle and 2- who is shooting the 3 pointers with a higher percentage.

I won't be watching the game online as I'm going to the Cleveland State/Wright State game but I'll try to catch the tail end of it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2011, 06:55:49 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 15, 2011, 01:59:48 PM

Pool C scholars...

Is that anything like the Rosanjin Scholar that was one of the judges of the Iron Chef?

"I found your team's resume a bit bland. It needed more of the hot bean paste..."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2011, 07:53:17 PM
OWU 75, Denison 67
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2011, 08:11:32 PM
I wonder if Roger Smith thinks it is cute or funny to consistently mispronounce 'Wooster?'  None of Wittenberg's other on-air folks have that difficulty. ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2011, 08:55:13 PM
Wabash 70, Wittenberg 59
We have a flat-footed tie atop the league standings, to be decided--or not--on Saturday, when Witt travels to Hiram and OWU plays at Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 16, 2011, 08:57:39 PM

A big Thank You! from a Wooster fan to the Wabash Little Giants! ;D  WAF was very true tonight!

The Little Giants strengthened their Pool C chances tonight if they don't win the NCAC tourney bid.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2011, 09:02:08 PM
Hiram 86, Oberlin 57
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2011, 09:18:39 PM
Allegheny hung tough with regionally-ranked Penn St.-Behrend all evening, but finally succumbed by a 83-73 count.  NCAC finishes up with a 43-38 (.531) non-conference record.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 16, 2011, 09:19:55 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 16, 2011, 08:11:32 PM
I wonder if Roger Smith thinks it is cute or funny to consistently mispronounce 'Wooster?'  None of Wittenberg's other on-air folks have that difficulty. ::)

It's been a problem for Wabash's announcers for our entire time in the NCAC. I'm not a Wooster grad and it grates on me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2011, 09:25:05 PM
Current standings with one game remaining (except for Denison, which is done):

1. Wittenberg 13-2, 17-6
1. Wooster 13-2, 22-2...Neither team holds the tie-breaker; if they both lose Saturday, Witt wins the tie-breaker
3. Ohio Wesleyan 11-4, 15-9
4. Wabash 10-5, 18-5...Wabash holds the tiebreaker with OWU
5. Hiram 7-8, 13-11...#5 seed
6. Kenyon 5-10, 9-14...#6 seed
7. Denison 5-11, 8-17...#7 seed; Denison holds the tiebreaker with Kenyon corr: Kenyon holds the tie-breaker
8. Allegheny 3-12, 6-18...#8 seed
9. Oberlin 1-14, 2-22...Oberlin is eliminated
   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 16, 2011, 10:00:57 PM
DC - time to brush out the tiebreaker procedures? what happens if both win and its a tie?

I followed the Live Stats and from the looks of it the game was decided in a 5 minute stretch in the second half where Witt couldn't buy a shot and Wabash was making everything.

LIke I said earlier, rebounds and 3's would decide the game and Wabash held the edge in both categories.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 16, 2011, 10:02:49 PM
Good night for Wooster, as both Hope and Marietta lose. The Hope loss, coming at home, is a crusher for their hopes of passing Wooster. Marietta now has almost no chance as well. Assuming Wooster only loses one more time, and that loss doesn't come in the first round of the NCAC Tournament, they probably are going to finish #1 in the GL region regardless. Two losses, and all bets are off.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2011, 10:17:01 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 16, 2011, 10:00:57 PM
DC - time to brush out the tiebreaker procedures? what happens if both win and its a tie?

Tie-breakers, as I understand them (they've probably changed slightly this year because of the double-round-robin, but should be the same as what the women's have always been, since they've always been d-r-r):
#1-#2:  Witt and Woo split with each other and with Wabash.  If they both win Saturday, they will have identical records, and it will come down to a coin toss.  If they both lose Saturday, Witt will be the #1 seed on the third tie-breaker, which is record vs. individual opponents in descending order of standings.  The Tigers will have swept OWU (either #3 or #4) while Wooster will have split with them.
#3-#4:  OWU and Wabash split their games.  Wabash would prevail on the second tie-breaker, which is combined win-loss record with all teams above tied teams.  Wabash was 2-2 with Witt and Woo, while OWU would be 0-4 (Wooster must beat them Saturday to force an OWU/Wabash tie.)
#6-#7: Denison and Kenyon split.  Kenyon wins the tiebreaker (despite what I posted above, I'll correct that) on the second tie-breaker, as they were 2-8 vs. the top 5 finishers, while Denison was 1-9.  (Kenyon's 2 wins were vs. Hiram, while Denison's was vs. Wabash.  That would give the 3rd tie-breaker to DU, but Kenyon prevails on the second.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 16, 2011, 10:31:23 PM
Wooster and OWU is the only evening game on Saturday; Witt and Hiram play at 3 p.m. Wooster will know the conference situation by the time they tip it up in Timken.

Witt almost snuck back in right at the end, but Wabash held on, making enough of their free throws to seal the win (unlike Hope tonight).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 16, 2011, 10:55:23 PM
The end of that game was two-thirds of the way to being amazing.  With 2:43 to play, Wabash led by 18 points.  It wasn't until the 2:11 mark that Wittenberg scored, making the score 63-47.  Wabash added a point on a free throw, with 1:45 to go, extending the lead to 17.  Bill Brown, around this point, pulled his regulars, or most of them.  I remember this because the Wabash student announcers were perplexed at this move.  To me, it seemed very reasonable.  The game was over, he was looking to avoid injuries, and probably not at all too happy with their play anyway.

Wabash, then, pulled their own starters, even as Witt began hitting long threes.  Three in a row went in, unanswered, cutting the lead to 8 at the 48 second mark.  Mac Petty began rushing regulars back into the game.  A Wes Smith free throw was followed by another Witt three, making the score 65-59 with 34 seconds to go.  Wittenberg had cut an 18-point lead to 6 in 1:37!

That was as far as it went, but for my money, that was as good as it gets.  A Wittenberg win, which was what Wooster needed, but in the process we got to see the Wallies squirm. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 16, 2011, 11:14:35 PM
Nice that Josh McKee was one of those bench players tonight for Witt.  He was a starter last year but had mono and is just getting back to being in game shape.  I was under the impression that it was McKee who hit those three straight triples himself for Witt.

Nevermind.  I just read over the boxscore and see that McKee made only 2 of the 3 treys in question.   But he also started the run with a lay-up and he also just happened t assist on the trey he didn't make that was made by McDowell.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on February 16, 2011, 11:28:59 PM
Wabash played the defense tonight that was what put together the win streak at the first of the year. Shelborne on Sullivan and Curosh on Black were the key match-ups.  Rebounding was an additional factor with Wahash taking the offensive glass over in the second half.  This should be a great tourney...just not sure where to make reservations?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 17, 2011, 11:12:09 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 16, 2011, 10:55:23 PM
A Wittenberg win, which was what Wooster needed, but in the process we got to see the Wallies squirm. :)

How exactly would a Wittenberg win last night have benefited Wooster?  Regional Rankings?  Tournament seeding?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 17, 2011, 11:46:12 AM
Quote from: bashbrother on February 17, 2011, 11:12:09 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 16, 2011, 10:55:23 PM
A Wittenberg win, which was what Wooster needed, but in the process we got to see the Wallies squirm. :)

How exactly would a Wittenberg win last night have benefited Wooster?  Regional Rankings?  Tournament seeding?



I'm guessing he meant to say a Wabash win was what Wooster needed.  Having to pull for either Witt or Wabash can have negative effects on your thought process which is pretty evident by WooBoo's typo...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 17, 2011, 12:08:03 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 16, 2011, 10:55:23 PM
That was as far as it went, but for my money, that was as good as it gets.  A Wittenberg win, which was what Wooster needed, but in the process we got to see the Wallies squirm. :)

No squirming here.  Wittenberg did shoot their way back to a six point game, but by that time Wabash was in the double bonus.  Wabash was going to have to miss four more free throws in a row AND Witt was going to have to hurry and make two more three point baskets to tie the game.  Both of those things were not going to happen. 

Quote from: pennstghs on February 16, 2011, 10:00:57 PM
I followed the Live Stats and from the looks of it the game was decided in a 5 minute stretch in the second half where Witt couldn't buy a shot and Wabash was making everything.

Wabash took a seven point lead late in the first half, then Witt bridged an 11-0 run over the intermission to get the lead.  Then Wabash went bananas for about 7 minutes...largely super-sub Derek Bailey and Jordan Surenkamp making shots during that stretch.  I believe Aaron Zinnerman also had a couple of big baskets during that run as well (one big bomb with the shot clock expiring...that was a killer shot).  Total team effort from the LGs last night on a night when they had to have it.  It was a lot of fun to be in the gym last night. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 17, 2011, 12:19:48 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 17, 2011, 11:46:12 AM
Quote from: bashbrother on February 17, 2011, 11:12:09 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 16, 2011, 10:55:23 PM
A Wittenberg win, which was what Wooster needed, but in the process we got to see the Wallies squirm. :)
How exactly would a Wittenberg win last night have benefited Wooster?  Regional Rankings?  Tournament seeding?
I'm guessing he meant to say a Wabash win was what Wooster needed.  Having to pull for either Witt or Wabash can have negative effects on your thought process which is pretty evident by WooBoo's typo...  :P
Exactly.  It was a typo due to the extreme mental fatigue brought about by such a dilemma.  I hope I'm never faced with such a choice again. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 17, 2011, 12:21:07 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 17, 2011, 12:08:03 PM
...largely super-sub Derek Bailey and Jordan Surenkamp making shots during that stretch.  I believe Aaron Zinnerman also had a couple of big baskets during that run as well (one big bomb with the shot clock expiring...that was a killer shot).  Total team effort from the LGs last night on a night when they had to have it.  It was a lot of fun to be in the gym last night. 

So where did this Jordan Surenkamp come from and why hasn't he been getting more minutes?  I was following the game last night and didn't recognize the name at all.  So I went and looked up his stats and he's only appeared in 14 games all year for Wabash.   Also, he's only averaging just over 6 minutes/game on the season.  Last night he played 21 minutes.  And, he had only scored 25 points all season before dropping 13 on Witt last night.

So, again, where has he been and why hasn't he been getting more minutes?  Has he been battling injuries?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 17, 2011, 01:10:03 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 17, 2011, 12:21:07 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 17, 2011, 12:08:03 PM
...largely super-sub Derek Bailey and Jordan Surenkamp making shots during that stretch.  I believe Aaron Zinnerman also had a couple of big baskets during that run as well (one big bomb with the shot clock expiring...that was a killer shot).  Total team effort from the LGs last night on a night when they had to have it.  It was a lot of fun to be in the gym last night.  

So where did this Jordan Surenkamp come from and why hasn't he been getting more minutes?  I was following the game last night and didn't recognize the name at all.  So I went and looked up his stats and he's only appeared in 14 games all year for Wabash.   Also, he's only averaging just over 6 minutes/game on the season.  Last night he played 21 minutes.  And, he had only scored 25 points all season before dropping 13 on Witt last night.

So, again, where has he been and why hasn't he been getting more minutes?  Has he been battling injuries?

Jordan has been just out of the regular rotation last year and for most of this year, with some spot minutes here and there.  It would appear that over the course of the season, he has worked his way into the second unit.  I'm speculating here, but I think the increased time for Jordan is probably a result of his improvement over the course of the season and Sutherlin's slumping/hurting.

21 minutes last night was a big spike for Jordan, but this is a pretty standard Mac Petty move.  Coach Petty will "let it ride" with a hot player, especially off the bench.  Jordan got the call to play a few minutes in the first half, he scored five points, guarded well, and earned some more minutes in the second half.  I'll not be surprised to see him get 15+ minutes off the bench on Saturday.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 17, 2011, 05:43:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 16, 2011, 10:17:01 PM
Tie-breakers, as I understand them...

I got confirmation on the tie-breakers today, and I believe what I have written in the above-referenced post is correct.  Furthermore, it should be noted that, if Witt and Woo both win Saturday and are co-champions at 14-2, and there is a coin toss, the winner of that toss gets to choose whether to be the overall #1 seed or to have the right to host the semi-finals and finals.  That winner will almost certainly choose to host, which would mean they'd be the #2 seed and face Denison and, if they win, the winner of Kenyon vs. #3 (probably Wabash), while the #1 would face Allegheny and, if they win, the winner of Hiram vs. #4 (probably OWU).  Interesting choices.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 17, 2011, 06:10:39 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 17, 2011, 05:43:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 16, 2011, 10:17:01 PM
Tie-breakers, as I understand them...

I got confirmation on the tie-breakers today, and I believe what I have written in the above-referenced post is correct.  Furthermore, it should be noted that, if Witt and Woo both win Saturday and are co-champions at 14-2, and there is a coin toss, the winner of that toss gets to choose whether to be the overall #1 seed or to have the right to host the semi-finals and finals.  That winner will almost certainly choose to host, which would mean they'd be the #2 seed and face Denison and, if they win, the winner of Kenyon vs. #3 (probably Wabash), while the #1 would face Allegheny and, if they win, the winner of Hiram vs. #4 (probably OWU).  Interesting choices.

Leave Marty Morningweg out of it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 17, 2011, 06:14:42 PM
Due to extenuating circumstances, I'd forgo the tiebreak rules and award Wooster the #1 seed and the host site for the semifinals and finals.  What extenuating circumstances?  Kenyon @ Wittenberg.  That game was never played.  Why should we assume that Witt would have won that game and why should Wittenberg be allowed to benefit from that assumption?  I hammered Kenyon when that news broke, probably a little prematurely.  A follow up story would seem to indicate that Wittenberg did not do their level best to try and play that game either...there's some stank around that "result" and it's unfair to Wooster and the rest of the league that played 16 games that Wittenberg got a free win out of that.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 17, 2011, 07:40:55 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 17, 2011, 06:14:42 PM
Due to extenuating circumstances, I'd forgo the tiebreak rules and award Wooster the #1 seed and the host site for the semifinals and finals.  What extenuating circumstances?  Kenyon @ Wittenberg.  That game was never played.  Why should we assume that Witt would have won that game and why should Wittenberg be allowed to benefit from that assumption?   I hammered Kenyon when that news broke, probably a little prematurely.  A follow up story would seem to indicate that Wittenberg did not do their level best to try and play that game either...there's some stank around that "result" and it's unfair to Wooster and the rest of the league that played 16 games that Wittenberg got a free win out of that. 

You bring up some interesting points Wally.  The question I bolded is one I'd like to hear explained a little better by the league office.  It seems to me that when the story first broke, things seemed to be pointing Kenyon's way as far as the blame game went.  If this was the end of the story, I could understand awarding Witt the W in forfeit.  However, that didn't appear to be the end of the story as things came out that pointed towards Witt being equally or even moreso to blame.  What I can't figure out is how the NCAC came to the result they did so easily.  Why was Witt awarded the W and Kenyon the L?  Why would this game just not count since both sides seemed to be equally to blame in not making a concerted effort to get the game played (IMO, Witt made the least effort of the two schools). 

I'm almost of the opinion that this game shouldn't count at all in the conference standings or should carry less weight than a TRUE win and with that, should Wooster win Saturday, the Scots should be awarded the #1 seed by virtue of actually playing every conference opponent on their schedule and not benefitting from a questionalbe at best win by forfeiture.  I mean, Wooster played and actually beat Kenyon twice.  Witt?  Not so much...  ???



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 17, 2011, 08:57:36 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 17, 2011, 07:40:55 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 17, 2011, 06:14:42 PM
Due to extenuating circumstances, I'd forgo the tiebreak rules and award Wooster the #1 seed and the host site for the semifinals and finals.  What extenuating circumstances?  Kenyon @ Wittenberg.  That game was never played.  Why should we assume that Witt would have won that game and why should Wittenberg be allowed to benefit from that assumption?   I hammered Kenyon when that news broke, probably a little prematurely.  A follow up story would seem to indicate that Wittenberg did not do their level best to try and play that game either...there's some stank around that "result" and it's unfair to Wooster and the rest of the league that played 16 games that Wittenberg got a free win out of that. 

You bring up some interesting points Wally.  The question I bolded is one I'd like to hear explained a little better by the league office.  It seems to me that when the story first broke, things seemed to be pointing Kenyon's way as far as the blame game went.  If this was the end of the story, I could understand awarding Witt the W in forfeit.  However, that didn't appear to be the end of the story as things came out that pointed towards Witt being equally or even moreso to blame.  What I can't figure out is how the NCAC came to the result they did so easily.  Why was Witt awarded the W and Kenyon the L?  Why would this game just not count since both sides seemed to be equally to blame in not making a concerted effort to get the game played (IMO, Witt made the least effort of the two schools). 

I'm almost of the opinion that this game shouldn't count at all in the conference standings or should carry less weight than a TRUE win and with that, should Wooster win Saturday, the Scots should be awarded the #1 seed by virtue of actually playing every conference opponent on their schedule and not benefitting from a questionalbe at best win by forfeiture.  I mean, Wooster played and actually beat Kenyon twice.  Witt?  Not so much...  ???





Well, I think under league rules the Friday date was accepted as a viable date for when to make up the game...therefore when Kenyon refused to travel to Wittenberg to play the game on that date, they took the loss from the league's perspective. Brown sounded like he was holding the line on following the league rule that the game should be made up on the first available date, which was Friday, as Wittenberg had been closed on both Wednesday and Thursday. I guess the scheduling prerogative goes to the home team, with the visitors generally having to accept the home team's date, which Kenyon refused in this case.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BogeyMan on February 17, 2011, 10:11:20 PM
I find it hard to believe that the league would rule basketball over academics in this case.  The priority of the student-athletes in college is what?  Brown took a tough stand and showed his true colors when refusing to work with Kenyon on this.  Kenyon had athletes that could not get out of going to class on that Friday and Brown said too bad, league rules are league rules.  Shame on the NCAC and shame on Brown!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 17, 2011, 10:13:20 PM
A pox on both their houses!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2011, 12:28:37 AM
When the story first broke, at least from my vantage point, it was broken by David Jablonski of the Springfield News-Sun, who had access to Bill Brown (and quoted his take on the situation, as I recall).  There was no indication that he'd talked with Witt AD Garnett Purnell, and it's clear he hadn't talked to anyone from Kenyon in that early report.  Thus, the first report was essentially the POV of Wittenberg, and specifically of Bill Brown.  Jablonski then got hold of Kenyon coach Dan Priest, and got his side of the story, and updated his own story in the News-Sun with Priest's comments as well as some fairly inflammatory comments from Brown.  It was that version of the story that made Witt look like the bad guy and Kenyon the white knight, especially when Brown's comments were considered.  However, it's not at all clear that Brown was responding specifically to, or was even aware of, Priest's version of the story.  Perhaps more importantly,  it's still not clear at all to me if Purnell actually offered Monday as a make-up date to Kenyon (as Priest contends), or if he did, whether he cleared it with Brown, who seems to have put the kibosh on that plan, insisting on Friday (and not without good reason, I might add.)  

In a nutshell, then, what we got was Witt's unrebutted side of the story, making Kenyon look bad, followed by Kenyon's mostly unrebutted side, making Kenyon look good and Witt at least look internally disorganized.  I think the true story lies somewhere in between (and for all I know, Jablonski has reported it; I don't subscribe to the News-Sun!)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Witt4ever on February 18, 2011, 10:29:37 AM
Yes, blame Wittenberg for following NCAC rules. :-\



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 18, 2011, 10:51:57 AM
Quote from: Witt4ever on February 18, 2011, 10:29:37 AM
Yes, blame Wittenberg for following NCAC rules. :-\

But did they?  The "rules" would say that postponed games need to be played on the next available day.  The next available day was Thursday and it had been communicated to Kenyon by Wittenberg that they would play on Thursday.  Kenyon's players shuffled their academic obligations accordingly, then Wittenberg apparently changed their mind about playing on Thursday.  So who isn't playing by the rules? 

But Wittenberg was closed on Thursday, you say.  I say who cares.  We don't go to class on Saturdays but we certainly do play basketball.  The entire league schedule was postponed on that Wednesday and the next day everybody else traveled and played their games all through Ohio.  Why not Kenyon and Wittenberg? 

To me, what's clear is that this isn't simply a case of Kenyon saying "nah, we'll go ahead and pass on this one".  There was some miscommunication from the host institution that contributed to the scheduling conflict which ultimately led to the game not being played.  Wittenberg has some responsibility in what happened and as such, IMO, do not deserve credit for winning a game they never played. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 18, 2011, 10:58:33 AM
The university may feel differently about how its facilities are used when the school is closed because of weather. It is so NOT the same as just a normal Saturday.

At many schools, this is not the athletic department's decision, it's a university and facilities decision, and it applies campus-wide with no exception for athletics.

So, you may say who cares, but Wittenberg doesn't really care whether you care or not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 18, 2011, 11:09:57 AM
Oh, I'm quite aware that Wittenberg couldn't give a flip about what I think and that's fine.  But if Wittenberg told Kenyon that they were going to play Thursday and then reneged on that, they still aren't free from being partially responsible for the chain of events that led to the cancellation of the game.  And if they share responsibility, they probably shouldn't be getting a win credit. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 18, 2011, 11:21:02 AM
If Wittenberg athletics said they were going to play the game and Wittenberg University made a decision to close that overruled that, I don't think that's anywhere near reneging.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2011, 11:26:43 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 17, 2011, 08:57:36 PM
Well, I think under league rules the Friday date was accepted as a viable date for when to make up the game...therefore when Kenyon refused to travel to Wittenberg to play the game on that date, they took the loss from the league's perspective. Brown sounded like he was holding the line on following the league rule that the game should be made up on the first available date, which was Friday, as Wittenberg had been closed on both Wednesday and Thursday. I guess the scheduling prerogative goes to the home team, with the visitors generally having to accept the home team's date, which Kenyon refused in this case.

I get this.  I was just basing my response on what Priest's version of how things went down.  However, the more I think about it, the more I'm confused as to how this all played out.  According to Priest, he was contacted by Witt's AD about playing the game Monday.  This makes no sense to me whatsoever.  Why would Purnell (Witt's AD) propose a make-up date without consulting with his head basketball coach first?  This is where Priest's version of the story gets a little shaky with me.  To me, Kenyon wanted to play Thursday.  Witt was closed and so that wasn't a vialble option.  IMO, Priest knew Friday wouldn't work because of his players' academic obligations and tried for Monday as a possible date.  Of course this is all speculation on my part, but I'm basing this on the questions I have as to why either Kenyon or Witt would have rather played this game on Monday as opposed to Friday?  Kenyon had a bye that Saturday, so it would make much more sense to play the game Friday as opposed to Monday making them have to play 3 games in 6 days.  But, they couldn't play Friday based on two players having conflicting test schedules that would have prevented them from making the trip on Friday.  And for Witt, yes they would have had to play back-to-back games on Friday and Saturday, but they were against Kenyon and Allegheny and they were both at home.  That seemed like a more viable option for Witt than playing the game Monday and having to also then play 3 games in 6 days.  Especially considering that the last 2 games were difficult away games at OWU and at Wooster.

Ultimately, we will probably never get the whole story of what went on in this fiasco or who is more to blame for what went wrong.  As I said above, I personally think both sides share in the blame in some form.  But in the end, the rules were followed and the results can't really be disputed. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 18, 2011, 12:20:46 PM
how many years has it been since Oberlin has made the NCAC tournament?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 18, 2011, 12:25:46 PM
Quote from: WAlum on February 18, 2011, 12:20:46 PM
how many years has it been since Oberlin has made the NCAC tournament?

Two years...Oberlin was the #8 seed in the 2008 NCAC Tournament. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 18, 2011, 12:47:47 PM
I think what could potentially become the most interesting aspect of this is the role this win (or lack of a win as considered by the NCAA) affects Wittenberg Pool C chances. Right now they have four in-region losses. If they need a Pool C bid, they will have at least five (lets assume they beat Hiram). With five losses you in bubble territory. If they happen to lose in the semifinals of the NCAC Tournament, they in essence will lose out on two wins (the semifinal win, plus the Kenyon win). In other words, having one less in-region win could be the difference between Witt getting a bid or not. Their OWP isn't that great, so their winning percentage is going to be real important. This lack of a win could also be the difference for the committee if they decide to only take one NCAC Pool C team (with Wabash getting the bid in this case.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 18, 2011, 12:55:00 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 18, 2011, 12:47:47 PM
I think what could potentially become the most interesting aspect of this is the role this win (or lack of a win as considered by the NCAA) affects Wittenberg Pool C chances. Right now they have four in-region losses. If they need a Pool C bid, they will have at least five (lets assume they beat Hiram). With five losses you in bubble territory. If they happen to lose in the semifinals of the NCAC Tournament, they in essence will lose out on two wins (the semifinal win, plus the Kenyon win). In other words, having one less in-region win could be the difference between Witt getting a bid or not. Their OWP isn't that great, so their winning percentage is going to be real important. This lack of a win could also be the difference for the committee if they decide to only take one NCAC Pool C team (with Wabash getting the bid in this case.

In this case, a home game against a poor opponent may have hurt their SOS just as much as it would have helped their winning percentage. I think it's probably a wash for Pool C.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 18, 2011, 01:32:14 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on February 18, 2011, 12:55:00 PM
In this case, a home game against a poor opponent may have hurt their SOS just as much as it would have helped their winning percentage. I think it's probably a wash for Pool C.

You're probably right. What do you think are Wittenberg's Pool C odds with a 16-5 region record (beating Hiram and losing in the NCAC semis) and at 17-5 (beating Hiram and reaching NCAC title game)? Do the odds go up at all with one more win (would have been Kenyon), or is it going to come down to SOS?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 18, 2011, 02:58:34 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 18, 2011, 01:32:14 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on February 18, 2011, 12:55:00 PM
In this case, a home game against a poor opponent may have hurt their SOS just as much as it would have helped their winning percentage. I think it's probably a wash for Pool C.

You're probably right. What do you think are Wittenberg's Pool C odds with a 16-5 region record (beating Hiram and losing in the NCAC semis) and at 17-5 (beating Hiram and reaching NCAC title game)? Do the odds go up at all with one more win (would have been Kenyon), or is it going to come down to SOS?

I created a formula to try to mimic the NCAA's regional rankings (see GL Region board for more details). Using that calculation, a win over Kenyon at home would have increased Witt's rating by 0.0001, which is really nothing at all.

That's before considering any potential NCAC Tournament scenarios, but I think the end result of that game (assuming a win) wouldn't have affected much of anything.

It's really hard to start predicting odds before the seeding is settled. The semi-final game being either home or neutral would have a decent sized-impace on SOS.

If we're talking Pool C, it would behoove Witt for Wooster to win the home court advantage coin flip. Much better for SOS to not play all of those games at home.

Just spitballing, but I would say Witt's a lock if they beat Hiram and reach the NCAC finals. Probably still in if they beat Hiram and lose in the semi's (especially if it's a neutral site).

Losing to Hiram would put them squarely on the bubble in either case.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 18, 2011, 03:01:53 PM
I should also mention that I have Witt as my #15 Pool C right now (out of 18).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 18, 2011, 05:31:18 PM
Looking for the boards thoughts on Wabash's realistic Pool C chances:

1.  They will win the conference tournament -  Lock?

2.  If they make the tournament final but lose - Bubble?

3.  If they lose before tourney final -  out?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2011, 05:34:15 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on February 18, 2011, 05:31:18 PM
Looking for the boards thoughts on Wabash's realistic Pool C chances:

1.  They will win the conference tournament -  Lock?

2.  If they make the tournament final but lose - Bubble?

3.  If they lose before tourney final -  out?

I'll take the easy one and leave the others for those who pay closer attention to the NCAA's doings.

1. If they win the conference tournament, they have no chance whatsoever at a Pool C bid...because they will be in the NCAA tournament with a Pool A bid.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 18, 2011, 07:53:03 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on February 18, 2011, 05:31:18 PM
Looking for the boards thoughts on Wabash's realistic Pool C chances:

1.  They will win the conference tournament -  Lock?

2.  If they make the tournament final but lose - Bubble?

3.  If they lose before tourney final -  out?

If Wabash makes the finals, they would likely have one more win over a regionally ranked team plus an SOS boost. Provided they don't get buried in the regional rankings for losing to Witt or Woo in the final, I think Wabash has an attractive profile for at large selection. Losing in a semi probably puts Wabash just barely in or just barely out depending on how many pool A bids get snatched up by cinderellas in league tourneys.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 19, 2011, 01:30:36 AM
If Wabash loses in the conference semi-finals, they have to pray that all other conferences play to form and there are no surprises.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 19, 2011, 11:09:41 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 19, 2011, 01:30:36 AM
If Wabash loses in the conference semi-finals, they have to pray that all other conferences play to form and there are no surprises.

I'd say if Wabash has to rely on this scenario, they'd better not lose in the semis...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2011, 11:23:04 AM
Final day of the regular season, and every game has at least a little bit of an impact on the final standings:

Oberlin at Wabash, 1pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball)
Allegheny at Kenyon, ~3pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x28386.xml) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Wittenberg at Hiram, ~3pm -- live stats (http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/menssports/basketball/newschedule.html); audio (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/) (W) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
OWU at Wooster, ~7:30pm -- video, audio, and live stats (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule) -- Game 2 of a W/M doubleheader
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2011, 02:40:25 PM
Wabash 72, Oberlin 42.  Wabash did their part; now it's up to OWU to win the #3 seed at Wooster tonight.  If Wooster wins, Wabash will be #3 and OWU #4.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2011, 03:46:56 PM
Halftime score: Hiram 41, Wittenberg 30.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 19, 2011, 03:56:20 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 19, 2011, 03:46:56 PM
Halftime score: Hiram 41, Wittenberg 30.
:o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2011, 04:04:35 PM
Hiram now leads 57-32 with 13:50 left.  Witt is 2 for 14 from the arc.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 19, 2011, 04:15:35 PM
I was going to post something about it not really mattering if Wabash is the #3 or the #4 because either way, they'd be facing a true road game in the semis thanks to the NCAC's quirky "seed or home court" choice for a coin flip winner.  Nevermind all of that. 

After today's game at Chadwick, Mac Petty was honored for his 35 years of service to Wabash College.  AD Tom Bambrey announced that in honor of Mac's sterling career at Wabash, the floor at Chadwick Court will have Mac Petty's name on it beginning next year.  A well deserved tribute for Coach Petty.  I can't wait to see the unveiling next season.  But first things first...there's a tournament to win this week.  WAF! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 19, 2011, 04:16:58 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 19, 2011, 04:04:35 PM
Hiram now leads 57-32 with 13:50 left.  Witt is 2 for 14 from the arc.

WOW!  If Wooster wins the AQ, Hiram may have single-handedly knocked the NCAC from three tourney teams to one in less than 2 weeks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2011, 04:22:33 PM
Hiram leads 72-42 with 7:40 left, and it sounds like Hiram is inside both Witt's minds and jerseys a little bit.  It's getting a little chippy up there, as Hiram is already in the double-bonus.  I wish I could be there, but alas! I'm not even going to be able to stick with the audiocast to the end of the game.  

Reminder that, even if Hiram pockets this win, Witt will still be the league co-champions and #1 seed if OWU beats Wooster this evening.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 19, 2011, 04:26:02 PM
Is Bill Brown dumping this game to get the road/neutral multipliers for his SOS next weekend?  Crafty.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on February 19, 2011, 04:26:13 PM
The Puppies are taking Witt to the woodshed.

This Hiram team has found themselves here in the latter part of the season.

Feb. 3  WOOSTER * - L, 70-64
Feb. 5 @ Ohio Wesleyan - L, 54-52
Feb. 9 @ Allegheny - W, 72-57
Feb. 12  @ Wabash (Ind.)  - W, 70-58
Feb. 16  OBERLIN * - W, 86-57
Feb. 19  Wittenberg -  W, 87 - 65  :o

Will be a dangerous draw in the Tourney.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 19, 2011, 04:45:06 PM
And it's done.  So we are left with tonight's game.  Wooster is playing for an outright NCAC championship.  OWU is playing to avoid Hiram on Tuesday.  We can debate which is a bigger motivator at this point. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 19, 2011, 05:31:27 PM
Those with a vested interest in how the GL Pool C shapes up would be interested to follow the end of this one.

http://www.sidearmstats.com/jcu/mbball/index.htm

at last look JCU leading Marietta by 1
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 19, 2011, 05:42:25 PM
Marietta wins on a last second jumper.  82-81, and Marietta dodges the bullet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 19, 2011, 05:57:31 PM
And that's a standard definition of blowing a golden opportunity. I turned off the radio midway through the second half. Geesh.

Wooster still has work to do tonight, but regardless should be an interesting conference tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 19, 2011, 06:00:37 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 19, 2011, 05:57:31 PM
Wooster still has work to do tonight, but regardless should be an interesting conference tournament.

Yes it should.  Any of the top 5 teams can honestly say that they have a legit shot at winning this thing!  I can't remember when such a statement could be made heading into the NCAC tournament.  Should be a fun week!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 19, 2011, 06:11:51 PM
Well as much as I'd love to see OWU win tonight, I don't think it will happen. Wooster is not going to blow this chance at home on a Senior Night. Looks like I"ll be making a trip up North next Saturday!!!!!!

The one solace is that as a Witt fan I'd much rather face OWU in the semis (pending a first round victory) than Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DPU3619 on February 19, 2011, 08:03:06 PM
Pretty good soundbyte from Mac Petty at my station (WTHR, NBC affiliate- Indy) tonight.  He was asked what his fondest memory was in his career.  Said it was beating DePauw for program win #1,000. 

Good to see Indy media pick that up and actually send a photographer to cover it.  That's something I harp on a lot around here...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 19, 2011, 08:11:59 PM
Quote from: Wes Anderson on February 19, 2011, 08:03:06 PM
Pretty good soundbyte from Mac Petty at my station (WTHR, NBC affiliate- Indy) tonight.  He was asked what his fondest memory was in his career.  Said it was beating DePauw for program win #1,000. 

I remember it well.  That was an awesome, awesome night at Chadwick.  Is that airing tonight, Wes?  I'd like to find a space on the dvr for that coverage. 

In other hoops news...OWU leads Wooster 28-27 at halftime.  OWU is the more aggressive side by far.  The Scots look like tight to me...but they are down just 1.  The Scots can definitely tidy up their game for the last 20 minutes and get this done. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 19, 2011, 09:08:43 PM
That 4/5 game is going to be intense, no matter who draws Hiram.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 19, 2011, 09:11:16 PM
Final: Wooster 81  Ohio Wesleyan 72

Congratulations to Wooster on winning its 7th Straight NCAC title! :)

Wooster's top scorers:  Ian Franks 25, Bryan Wickliffe 17, Justin Hallowell 15, Nathan Balch 12

Ohio Wesleyan's top scorers:  Andy Winters 24, Marshall Morris 13, Tim Brady 11, Greg White 11

Wooster is now 23-2, 14-2 NCAC  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 19, 2011, 09:20:04 PM
If DC's math is correct, Tuesday's quarters are set:

(8) Allegheny @ (1) Wooster 7:30 p.m.
(5) Hiram @ (4) OWU 6:00 p.m.

(7) Denison @ (2) Witt 7:30 p.m.
(6) Kenyon @ (3) Wabash 7:30 p.m.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 19, 2011, 09:37:39 PM
Very cool matchups for this Tuesday.  How about those lower seeds? 

- We know that Allegheny is capable of playing Wooster to the buzzer
- Denison is chilly right now, but they've drawn an equally frosty Wittenberg
- Hiram might be the hottest basketball team on the planet right now
- Kenyon has played Wabash well twice this season

No gimmes in round 1 for any of the host teams.  Tuesday night is going to be a blast. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2011, 01:57:59 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 19, 2011, 06:11:51 PM
The one solace is that as a Witt fan I'd much rather face OWU in the semis (pending a first round victory) than Wabash.
Uh oh, I have some bad news for you, ghs..... :P

Final standings:
1.  Wooster 14-2 (23-2)
2.  Wittenberg 13-3 (17-7)
3t. Wabash 11-5 (19-5)
3t. OWU 11-5 (15-10)
5.  Hiram 8-8 (14-11)
6t. Kenyon 5-11 (9-15)
6t. Denison 5-11 (8-17)
8.  Allegheny 4-12 (7-18)
9.  Oberlin 1-15 (2-23)

Congratulations to Wooster on their seventh consecutive outright conference championship!  ;D

OWU is the only school which earned the right to host a doubleheader on Tuesday.  Witt accomplished that feat every year of their conference membership until '08-'09, but the women have now finished 5th in two of the past three seasons (they were the regular season champions last season.)  Wooster's women's team finished 8th, and Wabash does not have a women's team.  The women's host schools will be Denison (who, in case you haven't noticed, finished the regular season with a 25-0 record), OWU, Allegheny, and Kenyon
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 20, 2011, 07:47:48 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 19, 2011, 09:37:39 PM
Very cool matchups for this Tuesday.  How about those lower seeds? 

- We know that Allegheny is capable of playing Wooster to the buzzer
- Denison is chilly right now, but they've drawn an equally frosty Wittenberg
- Hiram might be the hottest basketball team on the planet right now
- Kenyon has played Wabash well twice this season

No gimmes in round 1 for any of the host teams.  Tuesday night is going to be a blast. 

I respectfully disagree.  I see no problems for any of the home teams save OWU; I'd make that game a pick'em.  Now, once we get to the Final Four, at that point I see a crap-shoot.  Wooster, rolling the bones in their home alley, will bring the biggest bankroll, but anyone might walk off with the loot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 20, 2011, 09:19:37 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 20, 2011, 07:47:48 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 19, 2011, 09:37:39 PM
Very cool matchups for this Tuesday.  How about those lower seeds? 

- We know that Allegheny is capable of playing Wooster to the buzzer
- Denison is chilly right now, but they've drawn an equally frosty Wittenberg
- Hiram might be the hottest basketball team on the planet right now
- Kenyon has played Wabash well twice this season

No gimmes in round 1 for any of the host teams.  Tuesday night is going to be a blast. 

I respectfully disagree.  I see no problems for any of the home teams save OWU; I'd make that game a pick'em.  Now, once we get to the Final Four, at that point I see a crap-shoot.  Wooster, rolling the bones in their home alley, will bring the biggest bankroll, but anyone might walk off with the loot.

I agree 100% WoosterBooster.  3 easy wins and the OWU/Hiram game is a toss-up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 20, 2011, 09:37:36 AM
Looks like we're headed for a Wittenberg/Wabash semifinal which essentially could be a play in game for the NCAA tournament in all likelihood. Also, Wooster vs I"m going to go out on a limb and say Hiram, which could be interesting.

Still disappointed in yesterday's loss to Hiram, but I feel bad for Denison on Tuesday as I can't imagine Witt will be in any mood to feel gracious at all
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2011, 10:20:45 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 20, 2011, 09:37:36 AM
Still disappointed in yesterday's loss to Hiram, but I feel bad for Denison on Tuesday as I can't imagine Witt will be in any mood to feel gracious at all

I imagined Witt would show up with that mood yesterday after losing to Wabash.  Obviously, Witt's mood was pretty gracious towards Hiram.   :o   

IMO, Brown has some work to do to repair the psyche of his team before Tuesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 20, 2011, 02:43:55 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 20, 2011, 10:20:45 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 20, 2011, 09:37:36 AM
Still disappointed in yesterday's loss to Hiram, but I feel bad for Denison on Tuesday as I can't imagine Witt will be in any mood to feel gracious at all

I imagined Witt would show up with that mood yesterday after losing to Wabash.  Obviously, Witt's mood was pretty gracious towards Hiram.   :o   

IMO, Brown has some work to do to repair the psyche of his team before Tuesday.

A witt fan told me last night "1 game lead with 2 games to go and you lose both and dont win the conference, CHOKE."   I dont understand witt not being ready to play yesterday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 20, 2011, 03:06:46 PM
Quote from: WAlum on February 20, 2011, 09:19:37 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 20, 2011, 07:47:48 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 19, 2011, 09:37:39 PM
Very cool matchups for this Tuesday.  How about those lower seeds? 

- We know that Allegheny is capable of playing Wooster to the buzzer
- Denison is chilly right now, but they've drawn an equally frosty Wittenberg
- Hiram might be the hottest basketball team on the planet right now
- Kenyon has played Wabash well twice this season

No gimmes in round 1 for any of the host teams.  Tuesday night is going to be a blast. 

I respectfully disagree.  I see no problems for any of the home teams save OWU; I'd make that game a pick'em.  Now, once we get to the Final Four, at that point I see a crap-shoot.  Wooster, rolling the bones in their home alley, will bring the biggest bankroll, but anyone might walk off with the loot.

I agree 100% WoosterBooster.  3 easy wins and the OWU/Hiram game is a toss-up.

That's certainly a possibility.  I was just pointing out that all of the lower seeded teams have shown themselves to be capable of hanging around or even beating those teams that you'll assume have easy wins on Tuesday.  LIkely?  Maybe not...but I think we've seen enough surprising results out of the league this season to just assume anybody is going to win their game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 20, 2011, 04:07:11 PM
Link to the Wooster Daily Record article on the 7th consecutive NCAC title for the Scots: http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4984632
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2011, 05:52:13 PM
Quote from: WAlum on February 20, 2011, 09:19:37 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 20, 2011, 07:47:48 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 19, 2011, 09:37:39 PM
Very cool matchups for this Tuesday.  How about those lower seeds? 

- We know that Allegheny is capable of playing Wooster to the buzzer
- Denison is chilly right now, but they've drawn an equally frosty Wittenberg
- Hiram might be the hottest basketball team on the planet right now
- Kenyon has played Wabash well twice this season

No gimmes in round 1 for any of the host teams.  Tuesday night is going to be a blast. 

I respectfully disagree.  I see no problems for any of the home teams save OWU; I'd make that game a pick'em.  Now, once we get to the Final Four, at that point I see a crap-shoot.  Wooster, rolling the bones in their home alley, will bring the biggest bankroll, but anyone might walk off with the loot.

I agree 100% WoosterBooster.  3 easy wins and the OWU/Hiram game is a toss-up.

Chickens. Don't count 'em. This could be the year the lower seeds make a huge ol' omelet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 21, 2011, 12:27:23 PM
Wooster should probably ignore their last game against Allegheny. The Gators were without Briscoe, the conference's leading rebounder and shot blocker. When the two teams played the first time, Briscoe had 16 rebounds, 11 points, six assists, three blocks and three steals. While I don't think the game will be like the buzzer beater in December, it won't be the blowout that happened a month ago.

With the way Hiram is playing right now, they may be seen as the favorite against OWU. But Hiram has never reached the NCAC semifinals before, and have had a couple of flame outs in the first round.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2011, 01:14:23 PM
Yikes, I'd forgotten that Allegheny was without Briscoe in that game.  Guess I'm going to have to buy a ticket...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 21, 2011, 03:32:15 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 21, 2011, 12:27:23 PM
Wooster should probably ignore their last game against Allegheny. The Gators were without Briscoe, the conference's leading rebounder and shot blocker. When the two teams played the first time, Briscoe had 16 rebounds, 11 points, six assists, three blocks and three steals. While I don't think the game will be like the buzzer beater in December, it won't be the blowout that happened a month ago.

With the way Hiram is playing right now, they may be seen as the favorite against OWU. But Hiram has never reached the NCAC semifinals before, and have had a couple of flame outs in the first round.

Briscoe or no briscoe, Wooster wins by 14 +.
Hiram has never won ONE league tournament game?  Shocking!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2011, 03:53:20 PM
Quote from: WAlum on February 21, 2011, 03:32:15 PM
Hiram has never won ONE league tournament game?  Shocking!

Hiram and Oberlin were the co-doormats of the OAC and NCAC for many, many years.  Hiram's recent upsurge has been very surprising and draws great credit to Steve Fleming.  They are 0-7 in conference tournament play, losing three of those first-round games to the eventual champion.  (The Terriers failed to qualify for four tournaments.)  Only once have they hosted a first-round game, two seasons ago when Wabash defeated them.  This season's #5 seed is their second-highest since joining the conference in 1999.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2011, 05:01:05 PM
Quarterfinals:

#5 Hiram at #4 OWU, 6pm -- video, audio, live stats (http://bishops.owu.edu/winske.html#FA1) -- Bishops swept the season series, 71-58 at Hiram (1/15) and 54-52 in Delaware (2/5)
#8 Allegheny at #1 Wooster, 7:30pm -- audio, live stats (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule) -- Scots swept the season series, 76-73 at Allegheny (12/8) and 88-56 at Wooster (1/15)
#7 Denison at #2 Wittenberg, 7:30pm -- video, audio, live stats (http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/) -- Tigers swept the season series, 84-70 at Denison (12/8) and 82-54 at Wittenberg (1/26)
#6 Kenyon at #3 Wabash, 7:30pm -- video, audio, live stats (http://www.wabash.edu/sports/basketball) -- Little Giants swept the season series, 62-60 at Kenyon (12/11) and 74-65 at Wabash (1/29)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 21, 2011, 07:54:55 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 21, 2011, 05:01:05 PM
Quarterfinals:

#8 Allegheny at #1 Wooster, 7:30pm -- audio, live stats (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule) -- Scots swept the season series, 76-73 at Allegheny (12/8) and 88-56 at Wooster (1/15)

It's ridiculous that Wooster isn't doing live video for this. Wooster is really falling behind the conference in doing video for its contests. Exceptionally frustrating for those of us who aren't actually in the Wooster area.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2011, 09:32:57 PM
I'm hoping that they're working on this with Clear Picture and just haven't finalized the details yet.  I think everyone else does their video in-house, so it's easier to arrange.  If there is video, the link above will give you access to it. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 21, 2011, 09:50:58 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 21, 2011, 09:32:57 PM
I'm hoping that they're working on this with Clear Picture and just haven't finalized the details yet.  I think everyone else does their video in-house, so it's easier to arrange.  If there is video, the link above will give you access to it. 

Ah, good point. I'd forgotten that Wooster does need to insure that Clear Picture will cover the game. Still, you'd think that once Wooster had clinched a top four conference finish they could've made arrangements for the Tuesday game.

I'll hold out hope for video to watch while I listen to Breckenridge's audio call...   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 21, 2011, 10:32:49 PM
Unfortunately, for those of you not in close proximity to Wooster, I don't recall CPI ever broadcasting first round games of the NCAC tourney.  Usually these games are yawners and don't seem to be worth the time and effort it takes for CPI to broadcast the game. 

The bigger question is, why is the COW still relying on CPI for the video of their webcasts?  How hard would it be to set up their own video and audio production of a video webcast?   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2011, 10:42:20 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 21, 2011, 09:50:58 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 21, 2011, 09:32:57 PM
I'm hoping that they're working on this with Clear Picture and just haven't finalized the details yet.  I think everyone else does their video in-house, so it's easier to arrange.  If there is video, the link above will give you access to it. 

Ah, good point. I'd forgotten that Wooster does need to insure that Clear Picture will cover the game. Still, you'd think that once Wooster had clinched a top four conference finish they could've made arrangements for the Tuesday game.

I'll hold out hope for video to watch while I listen to Breckenridge's audio call...   :)

I will hold out hope as well for video since my family is catching some vacation time in sunny South Carolina this week. :)  If not, Mike Breckenridge does a great job and I actually listened to him on Saturday while watching the CPI video feed of the WOO/OWU game.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2011, 10:45:10 PM
I know nothing about the technology, but I've been wondering something recently.  For about $150, or less, anyone can now buy a mini-video camera on Amazon.com.  Or many other places.  These things will shoot and save files in 720P, which is HD, and a far better picture than you usually see streaming over the net.  Is it a quantum leap from such a product to one that can not just record the HD video but instantly stream it into a laptop which could then put it out onto the web?  Of course you'd need some heavy bandwidth to stream HD, but still.  I'm not talking about the licensing that would be involved here, just the technology.  It seems that we're really close to being able to do this.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2011, 10:47:03 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 21, 2011, 10:32:49 PM
The bigger question is, why is the COW still relying on CPI for the video of their webcasts?  How hard would it be to set up their own video and audio production of a video webcast?   

That's an excellent question.  I suppose there's a "why buy the cow when the milk is free?" response available, but that's just one aspect of what seems to me to be a larger problem.  Wooster has fallen behind most of the rest of the conference in terms of the quality and breadth of their online athletics presence in my opinion, especially if you consider that most streaming audio as well as all streaming video is produced by local companies (WQKT/WKVX and CPI, respectively) and not the College.  I'd say Kenyon and Wittenberg are doing the best job in this area now, with Oberlin not far behind.  All three have excellent websites and have a broad offering of streaming audio and video for many sports.  OWU (despite having a woeful website), Denison, and Wabash form a middle tier, with Wooster perhaps seventh, ahead of Hiram.  Allegheny is a distant 9th.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 22, 2011, 09:12:51 AM
I see the NCAC is upping the price of admission to tournament games.  Quarterfinal matchups are $7 and it's going to cost you a $10 spot to get into the semis and finals! 

Is is just me or is that kind of steep?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 22, 2011, 09:35:09 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 22, 2011, 09:12:51 AM
I see the NCAC is upping the price of admission to tournament games.  Quarterfinal matchups are $7 and it's going to cost you a $10 spot to get into the semis and finals! 

Is is just me or is that kind of steep?

I think it's kind of steep for DIII.  I also think it's the same price as last year.  And, if I remember correctly, the prices actually will drop for the NCAA tournament.  Were they $8?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2011, 10:47:06 AM
Anybody NOT going to a game tonight because of the $7?  If the answer is no, then no, it's not too steep. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 22, 2011, 11:07:01 AM
I was speaking of the $10 price.  And, yes, I understand that for the semis you get to see two games.  Furthermore, if those games are at Wooster, I'll still be going.  Still, I contend that it's a bit pricey, and that it will no doubt keep a certain percentage of possible attendees from coming.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 22, 2011, 11:07:48 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 22, 2011, 10:47:06 AM
Anybody NOT going to a game tonight because of the $7?  If the answer is no, then no, it's not too steep.  

I wasn't talking about tonight's game being too steep.  If I don't go tonight it's because I don't want to deal with the cold and snow.  Not because of the cost of the ticket which is only a dollar more than what Wooster charges for regular season games.  

I was talking about the $10 they will be charging for the semis and finals.  And while I will still pay the $10 if Wooster wins tonight, there are a lot of casual fans that might choose to stay home or go to a high school game instead because, they too feel $10 might be asking a tad much for a D3 basketball game.  And judging from last year's attendance for a Witt/Woo NCAC final of just over 2000, I'd say that is a pretty accurate assessment.  

EDIT:  WB beat me to the punch...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2011, 11:22:39 AM
$7 for one game is fine, but $10 for two games is over the line?  Come on guys...I know you're better at math than that. 

There's no way this can be a shock to long time Wooster fans.  Before the season even starts, if you're a Wooster fan, you KNOW that Wooster will be hosting a quarterfinal game and there's an awfully good chance that they will be hosting the last two rounds as well.  You also know that the league office makes you pay to watch these games.  So if you're a Wooster die-hard, you're probably gonna want to squirrel away $20 bucks for tournament time...can use the extra few bucks to get yourself a soda between the two semifinal games.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 22, 2011, 12:45:32 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 22, 2011, 11:22:39 AM
$7 for one game is fine, but $10 for two games is over the line?  Come on guys...I know you're better at math than that. 

There's no way this can be a shock to long time Wooster fans.  Before the season even starts, if you're a Wooster fan, you KNOW that Wooster will be hosting a quarterfinal game and there's an awfully good chance that they will be hosting the last two rounds as well.  You also know that the league office makes you pay to watch these games.  So if you're a Wooster die-hard, you're probably gonna want to squirrel away $20 bucks for tournament time...can use the extra few bucks to get yourself a soda between the two semifinal games.   :)

As you certainly well know, there is a large segment among any team's fan base that could care less about the first game of doubleheaders, the game not involving their home team.  That's the case in the early season tournaments at Wooster, where the crowd for those initial contests is probably only 20-25% the size of the nitecap.  This remains true for the NCAC semifinals, although perhaps the percentage of attendance at the early game increases.  So the fact that there will be two games, for the majority of fans, is irrelevant.  It's $10 to see Wooster play, and for some, that's a bit of money these days.

Luckily for me, when talking $10, that's not a factor.  But for everyone, there is a line in the sand, somewhere, that they either can't afford to cross or choose not to on principle.  For me, it's professional baseball.  (I could care less about the NFL and NBA)  They've pretty much priced me out of their market.  I'll go to a couple of games a year, but at $40-$50 and up for a decent seat, being a regular attendee, which I would love, is out of the question.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2011, 01:26:54 PM
If Wooster fans don't want to take advantage of the full $10 session on Friday, that's their choice.  I just don't think there's a legitimate gripe there.  This ticket policy has been used by the league for a number of years now...it's not a surprise and it's not egregiously priced, else they wouldn't be able to sell any tickets. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 22, 2011, 04:01:13 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 22, 2011, 01:26:54 PM
If Wooster fans don't want to take advantage of the full $10 session on Friday, that's their choice.  I just don't think there's a legitimate gripe there.  This ticket policy has been used by the league for a number of years now...it's not a surprise and it's not egregiously priced, else they wouldn't be able to sell any tickets. 
I won't be going to the first game and you're right, it's my choice.  I'm personally not going to raise a fuss over the cost of the tickets.  But I'm also more than a casual fan and I'm usually going to these games sans the family.  I'm simply pointing out that casual fans might see $10 as a bit steep.  Especially when you factor in those that would like to bring their entire families.  If I took my family, we're talking in excess of $40 once you add in food and drinks for everyone.  And that might be a bit more than what many people are willing to shell out for a D3 basketball game in these tough economic times. 

As I said, I think last year's low attendance figures for a Witt/Woo final (over 1/3 smaller than an average Witt/Woo game) pretty much validifies what I'm trying to convey.  You may not think it's that much of a difference, but you are more than an average fan of D3 basketball. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2011, 04:18:03 PM
Same thing with the D-3 playoffs. Paying for tickets means less fans.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 22, 2011, 04:25:29 PM
Looks like I was wrong about CPI not providing video for tonight's game.  A video link has been added on Wooster's website:

#8 Allegheny at #1 Wooster, 7:30pm --  Live stats  Video  Audio (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/schedule)

Looks like wsf will be able to watch the game from the warmth of the South Carolina beaches after all!   8-)

And even more reason for me to probably just stay home and watch the game in front of the fire!   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2011, 05:15:39 PM
Charging for these games probably prices out the casual fans, but I don't think the league office is particularly concerned about jamming the house for these tournament games.  I won't even pretend to know what it costs the league to put on this tournament and how much of that cost is offset by the gate revenue, but they seem to have set a price point that makes sense for them, the casual fan and arena atmosphere be damned. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2011, 05:30:20 PM
Does the NCAC foot the bill for the transportation, food and lodging for the tournament? That may be a big factor in the price point. With fuel costs increasing, if the NCAC foots the bus bill, that could be the reason for the increase.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 22, 2011, 06:37:17 PM
I'll provide my recap from the interesting Wittenberg/Denison tilt tonight, hopefully the Witt of the first 7/8ths of the season shows up instead of the past week
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2011, 06:41:26 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 22, 2011, 06:37:17 PM
I'll provide my recap from the interesting Wittenberg/Denison tilt tonight, hopefully the Witt of the first 7/8ths of the season shows up instead of the past week
Maybe the middle 5/8ths.  The first 2/8ths were pretty sucky too.

OWU is hammering Hiram so far, leading by 19 and shooting an unreal 74% as halftime approaches.  At the half: OWU 52, Hiram 34.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2011, 07:44:17 PM
OWU advances to the semifinals with a 100-85 victory over Hiram.  The Bishops cooled off in the second half and managed to hit just 67.2% for the game.   :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2011, 07:59:51 PM
Is anyone besides me unable to access the Wooster audio broadcast?  I haven't been able to get it for at least the past few games, and I wonder if it's my HP POSvilion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 22, 2011, 08:02:33 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 33  Allegheny 30

Justin Hallowell leading Wooster with 8 points and Devone McLeod is leading the Gators with 11 points.

Scots had 12 turnovers in the half which is too many...offsetting their 56% shooting in the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 22, 2011, 08:03:38 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 22, 2011, 07:59:51 PM
Is anyone besides me unable to access the Wooster audio broadcast?  I haven't been able to get it for at least the past few games, and I wonder if it's my HP POSvilion.

Tonight the broadcast has been a bit choppy, but it generally works for me. I'm on a mac, though, so may not be relevant for you on a Windows machine.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2011, 08:12:04 PM
I can't get anything to work right.  And this was supposed to be a super-duper multimedia pc.  It's live stats for me!

Elsewhere at the half:
Wittenberg 32, Denison 27
Wabash 38, Kenyon 25
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on February 22, 2011, 09:03:04 PM
Wabash and witt win ... what about Woo/gheny?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 22, 2011, 09:05:06 PM
Quote from: wabco on February 22, 2011, 09:03:04 PM
Wabash and witt win ... what about Woo/gheny?

60-57 Wooster with 15 seconds left. Allegheny has the ball.  Wooster came back from being down 9.

Gheny misses the three attempt. Wooster's Balch is fouled on his rebound.

Balch sinks them both to seal the win.

62-57 Wooster, final.

Wooster and Pool C fans across the country breathe a huge sigh of relief.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 22, 2011, 09:07:33 PM
Final:  Wooster 62  Allegheny 57 :)

Whew!  Wooster plays a terrible 2nd half (only 30% shooting) and escapes with a narrow win.  Scots will host on Friday/Saturday

Wooster's Top Scorers:  Bryan Wickliffe 15, Ian Franks 13, Nathan Balch 10, Justin Hallowell 8

Allegheny's Top Scorers:  Devone McLeod 21, D'Andre Corbin 14, James Ness 11

Wooster is now 24-2.  Scots will need to play much better vs. Ohio Wesleyan on Friday night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on February 22, 2011, 09:09:54 PM
looks like the seeds all won.  So either Wabash or witt will lose Fri.  What does that do to the loser's chances for the NCAA tourn?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 22, 2011, 09:19:53 PM
Quote from: wabco on February 22, 2011, 09:09:54 PM
looks like the seeds all won.  So either Wabash or witt will lose Fri.  What does that do to the loser's chances for the NCAA tourn?

My take is that (due to Hiram) the loser is staying home.  And the winner is only on the high side of the bubble unless they win the AQ.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 22, 2011, 09:21:28 PM
Quote from: wabco on February 22, 2011, 09:09:54 PM
looks like the seeds all won.  So either Wabash or witt will lose Fri.  What does that do to the loser's chances for the NCAA tourn?

Witt has to win, Wabash is still in decent shape but losing in the semi's is never a good thing for Pool C's.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 22, 2011, 09:22:48 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 22, 2011, 09:07:33 PM
Final:  Wooster 62  Allegheny 57 :)

Whew!  Wooster plays a terrible 2nd half (only 30% shooting) and escapes with a narrow win.  Scots will host on Friday/Saturday

Wooster's Top Scorers:  Bryan Wickliffe 15, Ian Franks 13, Nathan Balch 10, Justin Hallowell 8

Allegheny's Top Scorers:  Devone McLeod 21, D'Andre Corbin 14, James Ness 11

Wooster is now 24-2.  Scots will need to play much better vs. Ohio Wesleyan on Friday night.


Allegheny outscored Wooster by 26 for about 20 minutes of the game.......down 17 to up 9.

Then scored 1 point in the final 6 1/2 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2011, 09:40:42 PM
Wooster is really limping to the finish.   :(

All the final scores:
#1 Wooster 62, #8 Allegheny 57
#2 Wittenberg 77, #7 Denison 63
#3 Wabash 72, #6 Kenyon 61
#4 OWU 100, #5 Hiram 85
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2011, 10:19:45 PM
I should have taken Gheny and the points!

The Wabash / Witt game is elimination for Pool C. Holy implications, Batman!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 22, 2011, 10:21:39 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 22, 2011, 09:40:42 PM
Wooster is really limping to the finish.   :(

No kidding.  How many more rabbits can they have in their hat?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2011, 10:29:37 PM
Kenyon senior Kodey Haddox, whose on-again off-again collegiate career began with an NCAC Newcomer of the Year award and will end with NCAC All-Conference accolades, today was named an Academic All-American (http://www.cosida.com/media/documents/2011/2/CapitalOneMBBAAA201011.pdf) by CoSIDA.  Haddox averaged 17.5 ppg on the court and 3.65 gpa in the classroom as an economics major.  Congratulations, Kodey!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2011, 10:31:43 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 22, 2011, 10:29:37 PM
Kenyon senior Kodey Haddox, whose on-again off-again collegiate career began with an NCAC Newcomer of the Year award and will end with NCAC All-Conference accolades, today was named an Academic All-American (http://www.cosida.com/media/documents/2011/2/CapitalOneMBBAAA201011.pdf) by CoSIDA.  Haddox averaged 17.5 ppg on the court and 3.65 gpa in the classroom as an economics major.  Congratulations, Kodey!  :)

Kodey was awesome tonight. Dropped 32 on Wabash and there wasn't much the LGs could do about it. Fine way to end a solid career.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2011, 11:44:37 PM
BTW, thanks to some carnage in the NJAC, a pool C may have just been taken. Ramapo and Kean were both beaten and that may have taken a "C" that an NCAC team could have used.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 12:30:21 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 22, 2011, 11:44:37 PM
BTW, thanks to some carnage in the NJAC, a pool C may have just been taken. Ramapo and Kean were both beaten and that may have taken a "C" that an NCAC team could have used.

Do we think that an NJAC quarterfinal loser is a stronger candidate than Fridays Wabash/Witt semifinal loser?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 23, 2011, 02:33:47 AM
Tonight was the NJAC's semifinals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 23, 2011, 10:31:46 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 12:30:21 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 22, 2011, 11:44:37 PM
BTW, thanks to some carnage in the NJAC, a pool C may have just been taken. Ramapo and Kean were both beaten and that may have taken a "C" that an NCAC team could have used.

Do we think that an NJAC quarterfinal loser is a stronger candidate than Fridays Wabash/Witt semifinal loser?

Ramapo and Kean both lost in the NJAC semis. I'd say if Wabash lost, they'd be behind Ramapo, but ahead of Kean. Wittenberg would likely be behind both NJACs if they lost.

Wabash could still get in with a semifinal loss, but Witt probably couldn't.

Best chance the NCAC has at getting three teams in would be for Witt to beat Wooster in the finals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 10:45:03 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 23, 2011, 02:33:47 AM
Tonight was the NJAC's semifinals.

Whoopsie...forgot that they started earlier than the rest of us. 

Quote from: KnightSlappy on February 23, 2011, 10:31:46 AM
Best chance the NCAC has at getting three teams in would be for Witt to beat Wooster in the finals.

I'd rather see Wabash beat Wooster in the final and roll the dice on Wittenberg getting in.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 23, 2011, 11:20:30 AM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on February 23, 2011, 10:31:46 AM
Best chance the NCAC has at getting three teams in would be for Witt to beat Wooster in the finals.

What if OWU beats Witt in the finals?  Four teams in?  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 23, 2011, 11:21:21 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 23, 2011, 11:20:30 AM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on February 23, 2011, 10:31:46 AM
Best chance the NCAC has at getting three teams in would be for Witt to beat Wooster in the finals.

What if OWU beats Witt in the finals?  Four teams in?  :o

Unlikely. I really don't like Witt's chances at a Pool C at this point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 23, 2011, 12:15:12 PM
When are the all-league teams announced?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 23, 2011, 12:52:39 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on February 23, 2011, 10:31:46 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 12:30:21 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 22, 2011, 11:44:37 PM
BTW, thanks to some carnage in the NJAC, a pool C may have just been taken. Ramapo and Kean were both beaten and that may have taken a "C" that an NCAC team could have used.

Do we think that an NJAC quarterfinal loser is a stronger candidate than Fridays Wabash/Witt semifinal loser?

Ramapo and Kean both lost in the NJAC semis. I'd say if Wabash lost, they'd be behind Ramapo, but ahead of Kean. Wittenberg would likely be behind both NJACs if they lost.

Wabash could still get in with a semifinal loss, but Witt probably couldn't.

Best chance the NCAC has at getting three teams in would be for Witt to beat Wooster in the finals.

I just looked a Witt-Wabash loser scenarios. Witt looks definitely out and Wabash looks very much on the edge, more than I thought they might. I'll probably have a better look at things after tonight's games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 23, 2011, 02:44:40 PM
Does anyone know how common it is for one team to have the same referee for two straight games? Wooster had Izzy Santiago against both OWU on Saturday and Allegheny last night.

Wooster and Allegheny were honored with the presence of Jim D'Amato last night. He is so widely respected in Ohio basketball circles that he is barred from doing OAC games because the coaches got together and determined he was simply too talented to be doing their games. So instead the NCAC is lucky enough to get his unique brand of officiating -- calls made by hunches and by the type of mood he happens to be in at that moment.

** Just wanted to add that this post isn't implying the refs had anything to do with the close result. Allegheny probably deserved to win based on overall effort and execution. I'm just pointing out what seems like a quirk in the referee scheduling and just the plain bad luck in getting what is probably the worst ref in Ohio college basketball. **
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 23, 2011, 03:54:31 PM
Final Regional Rankings are out before Selection Sunday: http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/category/ncaa-stuff/regional-rankings/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on February 23, 2011, 04:52:22 PM
I thought you all might enjoy this piece about Mac Petty by an Indy TV station.  I think this is what Div III is about and I know this is what Wabash is about.

http://www.wthr.com/story/14078938/legendary-wabash-hoops-coach-retiring
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2011, 07:20:05 PM
Quote from: WAlum on February 23, 2011, 12:15:12 PM
When are the all-league teams announced?

The voting is taking place this week.  Expect the announcements sometime next week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2011, 07:42:19 PM
Here's a link to the NCAC's Men's Tournament webpage (http://www2.northcoast.org/mbasketball/NCACTournament/2011).  It includes tip times and links to the online coverage (video, audio, live stats.)  Wooster does not have a tournament website up (yet?) which would hopefully include information for visitors about parking and logistics.  If I see that a site has been put up, I will post a link.  In the meantime, travelers might want to consult Wooster's main athletics page (http://www.woosterathletics.com/landing/index).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: familyaffair on February 23, 2011, 09:34:13 PM
[Does anyone know how common it is for one team to have the same referee for two straight games? Wooster had Izzy Santiago against both OWU on Saturday and Allegheny last night.]

I don't know but the Wooster announcers liked him because every OWU foul was a "hammer" and every Wooster foul was a "ticky tack" foul. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 09:48:34 PM
Quote from: familyaffair on February 23, 2011, 09:34:13 PM
[Does anyone know how common it is for one team to have the same referee for two straight games? Wooster had Izzy Santiago against both OWU on Saturday and Allegheny last night.]

I don't know but the Wooster announcers liked him because every OWU foul was a "hammer" and every Wooster foul was a "ticky tack" foul. 

That's how those two guys for CPI announce every Wooster game.  Did you catch the part in the broadcast where one guy actually booed?  That was classic. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 23, 2011, 09:54:24 PM
Quote from: familyaffair on February 23, 2011, 09:34:13 PM
[Does anyone know how common it is for one team to have the same referee for two straight games? Wooster had Izzy Santiago against both OWU on Saturday and Allegheny last night.]

I don't know but the Wooster announcers liked him because every OWU foul was a "hammer" and every Wooster foul was a "ticky tack" foul. 

Those CPI guys have no business sitting behind the mike in any sport.  Either they're relatives of some big shot or they're blackmailing one.  Now, Mike Breckenridge, the WQKT radio guy, is excellent.  He knows the game and can call one.  I'm surprised that he hasn't moved along to some larger and better paying position.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 23, 2011, 10:18:07 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 09:48:34 PM
Quote from: familyaffair on February 23, 2011, 09:34:13 PM
[Does anyone know how common it is for one team to have the same referee for two straight games? Wooster had Izzy Santiago against both OWU on Saturday and Allegheny last night.]

I don't know but the Wooster announcers liked him because every OWU foul was a "hammer" and every Wooster foul was a "ticky tack" foul. 

That's how those two guys for CPI announce every Wooster game.  Did you catch the part in the broadcast where one guy actually booed?  That was classic. 

Almost as classic as when the Wabash radio guys were standing and cheering at the end of the Wooster/Wabash game in Timken...   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 10:25:03 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 23, 2011, 10:18:07 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 09:48:34 PM
Quote from: familyaffair on February 23, 2011, 09:34:13 PM
[Does anyone know how common it is for one team to have the same referee for two straight games? Wooster had Izzy Santiago against both OWU on Saturday and Allegheny last night.]

I don't know but the Wooster announcers liked him because every OWU foul was a "hammer" and every Wooster foul was a "ticky tack" foul. 

That's how those two guys for CPI announce every Wooster game.  Did you catch the part in the broadcast where one guy actually booed?  That was classic. 

Almost as classic as when the Wabash radio guys were standing and cheering at the end of the Wooster/Wabash game in Timken...   :D

Completely unreasonable when their team pulls their season back from the brink by beating an undefeated, #1 ranked team on the road.  Part of the cost of winning so many games is that it's a big deal when somebody beats you and they may just react as such.  You should take it as a compliment. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 23, 2011, 10:29:50 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 23, 2011, 10:18:07 PM
Almost as classic as when the Wabash radio guys were standing and cheering at the end of the Wooster/Wabash game in Timken...   :D

Sorry ScotsFan, I've got to correct you on this one. They didn't stand and cheer at the end of the game. They jumped up and down (and cheered), and along with the SID, who was sitting next to them, pointed to their bench in celebration. But more relevant is the fact that they were standing up and cheering DURING the game, from the end of the press table.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2011, 10:30:59 PM
Re: the new poll.  I figure the lead-pipe cinches for first team are Franks, Sullivan, Black, and Smith.  Brady and Winters from OWU are both candidates, as are Balch and Wickliffe of Wooster, and maybe those seven are your first team.  But I expect at least one and perhaps two players from "bottom 5" teams to get on, and I think these are the leading choices from that group.  What are your thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 10:42:51 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 23, 2011, 10:30:59 PM
Re: the new poll.  I figure the lead-pipe cinches for first team are Franks, Sullivan, Black, and Smith.  Brady and Winters from OWU are both candidates, as are Balch and Wickliffe of Wooster, and maybe those seven are your first team.  But I expect at least one and perhaps two players from "bottom 5" teams to get on, and I think these are the leading choices from that group.  What are your thoughts?

Hale and Haddox would make good first teamers, IMO.  I'd take your four locks, Brady, Hale, and Haddox for my seven first teamers. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 10:44:52 PM
I can't even imagine how riled up y'all are going to get if somebody else winds up cutting nets off your rims on Saturday night.  The whole team, the fans, and even the students there to broadcast the game might all be out there going crazy.  The horror! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 23, 2011, 11:10:59 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 23, 2011, 10:29:50 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 23, 2011, 10:18:07 PM
Almost as classic as when the Wabash radio guys were standing and cheering at the end of the Wooster/Wabash game in Timken...   :D

Sorry ScotsFan, I've got to correct you on this one. They didn't stand and cheer at the end of the game. They jumped up and down (and cheered), and along with the SID, who was sitting next to them, pointed to their bench in celebration. But more relevant is the fact that they were standing up and cheering DURING the game, from the end of the press table.

See, this is what happens when winning becomes 'old hat' - you tut-tut irrational exuberance.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 23, 2011, 11:15:14 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 10:44:52 PM
I can't even imagine how riled up y'all are going to get if somebody else winds up cutting nets off your rims on Saturday night.  The whole team, the fans, and even the students there to broadcast the game might all be out there going crazy.  The horror! 

Should that happen, I for one will remain in the gym.  There's always the distinct possibility that a Witt or Wabash player might fall off the ladder.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 23, 2011, 11:23:32 PM
Irrational indeed. That sounds excessive to me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 23, 2011, 11:23:55 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 10:44:52 PM
I can't even imagine how riled up y'all are going to get if somebody else winds up cutting nets off your rims on Saturday night.  The whole team, the fans, and even the students there to broadcast the game might all be out there going crazy.  The horror! 

I think what we are saying is that we would expect that the Men of Wabash would have higher standards for their conduct, or at least match the commonly held standards you'd expect out of media members on press row -- particularly coming from two guys who worked on press row at one time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 23, 2011, 11:29:38 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 10:44:52 PM
I can't even imagine how riled up y'all are going to get if somebody else winds up cutting nets off your rims on Saturday night.  The whole team, the fans, and even the students there to broadcast the game might all be out there going crazy.  The horror! 

Yep.  I imagine that's exactly how it will go down?!  ::)   :D

Funny thing though.  I don't seem to recall seeing this reaction when OWU won the tournament on Wooster's floor when they beat Wabash in 2008?!  Or when Witt did the deed by beating Wooster in 2006?!  I'm sure Wooster fans weren't happy about watching another team cut down the nets at Timken, but to use the term 'riled up' seems a bit excessive.  But then again, excessive is something you're good at.  Especially when it comes time for the post-season in any sport in which your Wallies are involved...

And just for the record, you were the one pointing out how rediculous Wooster's local access cable guys sounded by booing (emphasis on local access cable guys; maybe the term don't quit your day job applies here for them which is why they sound rediculous?).  Well, I simply pointed out to you how equally rediculous Wabash's radio guys looked jumping up and down at the end of a regular season game against Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2011, 11:49:04 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.44lbs.net%2Filia%2FDoNotFeedTroll.jpg&hash=020db910fee0f5320efe1aba8846914d8a8f4404)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 11:56:25 PM
Noted.  I'm sure they'll circulate a memo before the next Wabash/Wooster game at Timken...no celebrating.  Behave appropriately and apologize to those players for ruining their perfect season and apologize to those fans who paid ten bucks (TEN!!) to watch Wooster win as always...had only Wabash not screwed up and just stuck to the script.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 24, 2011, 12:07:35 AM
Your hyperbole and snark aside, I have been at schools where they actually do circulate a memo on press row reminding people what is considered professional behavior.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2011, 12:13:46 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 23, 2011, 11:23:32 PM
Irrational indeed. That sounds excessive to me.

Hence the wink...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2011, 12:28:16 AM
So the Wabash student broadcast team calling a game for their team, sans remuneration, for the student radio station watches the team beat an undefeated and top ranked team on the road, in overtime...one of the biggest and most important wins in program history mind you...got excited at the end of the press table and got out of their chairs.  We should hardly be beating them down for that.  It was a big deal.  A very big deal. 

See, for Wooster, every game is just another game.  They're the alpha dog in this league.  You can't expect folks with passion about their team to not get excited when they win a game with that kind of drama and significance. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 24, 2011, 01:17:06 AM
Somehow, at other schools, it manages to not happen either. Not just Wooster. Many, many, many places. Been to the Final Four, where it is actually an even bigger deal, and somehow plenty of student broadcast teams manage to keep their seats. (In fact, I've never seen a student broadcast team stand up in that manner at the Final Four.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 24, 2011, 08:38:35 AM
I for one don't see the foul, given: a) they are students and b) how I have seen older, non-student fans from one of those schools behave in Granville when their team was losing.  Granted, most of the other student broadcasters I have listened to generally keep themselves in check, but I certainly wouldn't complain about any of them if they did get more than a little excited about winning a game like that.  I'm sorry, but it appears to be a little bit of sour grapes on the part of the losing side here. 

BTW, ScotsFan.  "Rediculous" = r-i-d-i-c-u-l-o-u-s.  I couldn't let 3x in the same posting go. :o

Let me know how things turn out.  I'll be focusing on the women's tournament. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 24, 2011, 08:55:01 AM
Comparing the actions of normal fans as opposed to those people who are "working" a game is apples to oranges.  One of the first things anyone should be taught when working a game, in any capacity (scorekeeper, clock, broadcaster, etc.) is how to act in a professional manner.  I would think that this would especially apply to students, and that it should be fresh in their minds, considering that they are new to what they're doing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 24, 2011, 09:25:29 AM
Ironic that you to would be taking the higher ground now after suggesting you would like to see someone fall off a ladder if your team didn't win the tournament.   >:(

Apparently the nurse arrived with your medications.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2011, 09:51:58 AM
Quote from: GoRed on February 24, 2011, 08:38:35 AM
I for one don't see the foul, given: a) they are students and b) how I have seen older, non-student fans from one of those schools behave in Granville when their team was losing.  Granted, most of the other student broadcasters I have listened to generally keep themselves in check, but I certainly wouldn't complain about any of them if they did get more than a little excited about winning a game like that.  I'm sorry, but it appears to be a little bit of sour grapes on the part of the losing side here.

I gently remind you that this foofaraw started when Wally chided CPI's semiprofessional announcers for unacceptable behavior (a point with which Wooster Booster immediately agreed), and then argued that even worse behavior is acceptable when it comes from (Wabash) non-professional announcers:
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 23, 2011, 09:48:34 PM
That's how those two guys for CPI announce every Wooster game.  Did you catch the part in the broadcast where one guy actually booed?  That was classic. 

I apologize in advance for any misspelled words.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 10:09:29 AM
Quote from: GoRed on February 24, 2011, 08:38:35 AM
I for one don't see the foul, given: a) they are students and b) how I have seen older, non-student fans from one of those schools behave in Granville when their team was losing.  Granted, most of the other student broadcasters I have listened to generally keep themselves in check, but I certainly wouldn't complain about any of them if they did get more than a little excited about winning a game like that.  I'm sorry, but it appears to be a little bit of sour grapes on the part of the losing side here.  BTW, ScotsFan.  "Rediculous" = r-i-d-i-c-u-l-o-u-s.  I couldn't let 3x in the same posting go. :o

Let me know how things turn out.  I'll be focusing on the women's tournament. 


Sour grapes from the losing side? Really?  I think David pretty much summed up where our responses were coming from and it had NOTHING to do with sour grapes for losing to a good basketball team!  Maybe if you tried as hard at reading comprehension as you do at being the grammar police you would realize this?!  :-\

Oh, and  thanks for the spelling lesson.  Much appreciated?!   My life is complete now that I know the proper spelling of ridiculous.  Which is pretty much how I feel about your response BTW... ::)  Uh oh.  I hope the newly self appointed grammar police isn't going to be critical of me for not spelling out b-y  t-h-e  w-a-y???  :o  Oh, the horror???  ???  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2011, 10:45:30 AM
I didn't say it was acceptable, DC.  What I am saying is that what happened there (and let's also remember that we are getting one side's account of the incident...a side that may be biased) is hardly a crime against humanity.  Who got hurt by those kids getting excited about that moment?  Did some innocent bystander get bonked by a flying headset?  Did they spill somebody's dasani?  Were they taunting mothers behind them?  Seriously...aside from the feelings of a few nitpicky fans in this forum getting hurt, where's the harm in standing up and sharing a high five?  Should it be going on all game, every game?  Of course not...but at the conclusion of a dramatic and important game like that I think we can put it in perspective and understand what happened. 

#1 has been beaten exactly three times all season.  Only one of those times did #1 lose at home.  The moment was enormous.  You can't be as good as Wooster is and expect people not to get worked up when they beat you.  It comes with the territory. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 11:38:20 AM
You're completely missing the point as to why I brought up the actions of the Wabash radio guys in the first place?!  We get it.  Wabash Lil Giants slayed the mighty beast that is Wooster.  Wabash always fights.  And the student radio guys got a little wrapped up in the moment.  Yadda yadda yadda. 

The actual point you are missing is, you made a snide and snarky comment  (I know, there's a real shocker) regarding Wooster's cable broadcasters, so I was simply letting you know that your own wally radio guys were acting equally or even more unprofessional than Wooster's local cable access guys.  End of story, or so I thought...

Now, can we move on to talking basketball yet, or should we be expecting more grammar lessons from GoRed???  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2011, 12:02:06 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 11:38:20 AM
The actual point you are missing is, you made a snide and snarky comment  (I know, there's a real shocker) regarding Wooster's cable broadcasters, so I was simply letting you know that your own wally radio guys were acting equally or even more unprofessional than Wooster's local cable access guys. 

But that's exactly it...one of these broadcast teams is professional, the other is not.  The standards ARE different.  And I'll go a step further and say that whatever it is that the Wabash guys did by standing up and high fiving or whatever, pales in comparison to having your p-b-p guy literally boo a referee during game action.  Listeners to the Wabash broadcast probably never even knew what was happening...the product wasn't affected.  Those listening/watching the CPI team had the product compromised because this guy can't stop being a fan for an hour and a half, even though he's being paid to do so. 

And why do you or seinfeld or anybody else who isn't on the row care at all what happens on the row?  How are those guys affecting you in any way?  Did they run into the stands and facepalm you when the buzzer went off?  Did they taunt you?  Call you some names?  What did those kids do to you or anybody else there that has you on this board killing them for getting caught up in the moment?  Whether it's the other teams fans or radio guys or the game officials, nobody can find a way to sour a college basketball experience like some of you Wooster guys.  It's amazing really. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 24, 2011, 12:39:45 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2011, 12:02:06 PM
But that's exactly it...one of these broadcast teams is professional, the other is not.  The standards ARE different. 

The expected behavior in a professional environment is absolutely not different, and that should be made clear to all student broadcasters, whether they have one fan posting on this board in their defense or zero.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 12:53:16 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2011, 12:02:06 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 11:38:20 AM
The actual point you are missing is, you made a snide and snarky comment  (I know, there's a real shocker) regarding Wooster's cable broadcasters, so I was simply letting you know that your own wally radio guys were acting equally or even more unprofessional than Wooster's local cable access guys. 

But that's exactly it...one of these broadcast teams is professional, the other is not.  The standards ARE different.  And I'll go a step further and say that whatever it is that the Wabash guys did by standing up and high fiving or whatever, pales in comparison to having your p-b-p guy literally boo a referee during game action.   Listeners to the Wabash broadcast probably never even knew what was happening...the product wasn't affected.  Those listening/watching the CPI team had the product compromised because this guy can't stop being a fan for an hour and a half, even though he's being paid to do so. 


To call CPI's broadcast crew 'professional' is one of the biggest LOL statements I have ever heard!   :D  As I said in another post, most, if not all of these CPI broadcast guys do this on the side!  One of them is a Baptist minister.  One of them works as Director of Public Information at the COW.  I'd be surprised if they even got paid by CPI and if they do, it can't be all too much?!

As for why I care about the actions of the wally radio guys?  I really don't.  In fact, at the time, I actually thought it was more humorous than anything because the wally radio guys looked more foolish than anything else. 

But, ultimately, Pat summed things up pretty clearly with his last statement,  IMO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BashDad on February 24, 2011, 12:55:20 PM
While I agree technically with Pat's post, Wally's point is well taken. There's a difference between in-game homer-ism and cheering an outcome after the fact. Enthusiasm gushing out happens, even in the most professional of environments. Sportcenter's "Calls of the Week" aren't solicited from the loser's broadcast.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 24, 2011, 01:00:24 PM
Best argument ever about radio announcers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2011, 01:28:08 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 24, 2011, 12:39:45 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2011, 12:02:06 PM
But that's exactly it...one of these broadcast teams is professional, the other is not.  The standards ARE different. 

The expected behavior in a professional environment is absolutely not different, and that should be made clear to all student broadcasters, whether they have one fan posting on this board in their defense or zero.

That's fair, and what allegedly happened here isn't something I would condone on a regular basis.  But in this case the #1 team was beaten on their own floor...something that has happened exactly once this season (out of how many hundreds and hundreds of games?).  The circumstance was certainly not regular and the reaction to the result is understandable, even if their toe slipped over the line of professionalism for a minute.  All in all, I think the the incident is pretty far from an affront to the profession of broadcast journalism. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on February 24, 2011, 01:33:11 PM
very entertaining..sp?? you go Wally!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on February 24, 2011, 05:05:59 PM
I hate to side with Wally but, you Woo guys take this way too personal. Although the student broadcasters are "schooled on being professional behind the mike", I see no harm in standing up for your school.
The players are classmates, frat brother, or friends of the broadcasters and their "extended family" at the school. They are not only rooting themselves but, everyone at Bash.
There is a difference at being paid to do the job versus students volunteering for the job.
That being said, Go Scots."Win the NCAC Tourney!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2011, 05:14:10 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 10:09:29 AM
Oh, and  thanks for the spelling lesson.  Much appreciated?!   My life is complete now that I know the proper spelling of ridiculous.  Which is pretty much how I feel about your response BTW... ::)  Uh oh.  I hope the newly self appointed grammar police isn't going to be critical of me for not spelling out b-y  t-h-e  w-a-y???  :o  Oh, the horror???  ???  :D

Dear ScotsFan,

GoRed wasn't the grammar police. He was the spelling police.

Sincerely,

The definition police

;)

Quote from: sac on February 24, 2011, 01:00:24 PM
Best argument ever about radio announcers.

Absolutely. And as HOFers, I think it's our duty to stoke the fire and keep it going for as long as possible.

Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 24, 2011, 12:39:45 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2011, 12:02:06 PM
But that's exactly it...one of these broadcast teams is professional, the other is not.  The standards ARE different. 

The expected behavior in a professional environment is absolutely not different, and that should be made clear to all student broadcasters, whether they have one fan posting on this board in their defense or zero.

Yes! And I might also point out as a broadcaster that I and my broadcast partner would never jump up and down during a broadcast.

(Of course, we wear connected headsets and my broadcast partner is 6'8 to my 6'0 ... so the no-jumping-up-and-down edict is strictly for my personal safety.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 06:05:34 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2011, 05:14:10 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 10:09:29 AM
Oh, and  thanks for the spelling lesson.  Much appreciated?!   My life is complete now that I know the proper spelling of ridiculous.  Which is pretty much how I feel about your response BTW... ::)  Uh oh.  I hope the newly self appointed grammar police isn't going to be critical of me for not spelling out b-y  t-h-e  w-a-y???  :o  Oh, the horror???  ???  :D

Dear ScotsFan,

GoRed wasn't the grammar police. He was the spelling police.

Sincerely,

The definition police

;)


Duly noted.  At least I wasn't mistaking pre-season games with non-conference games eh?   ;D   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2011, 06:12:32 PM
Quote from: old scot on February 24, 2011, 05:05:59 PM
I hate to side with Wally but, you Woo guys take this way too personal. Although the student broadcasters are "schooled on being professional behind the mike", I see no harm in standing up for your school.
The players are classmates, frat brother, or friends of the broadcasters and their "extended family" at the school. They are not only rooting themselves but, everyone at Bash.
There is a difference at being paid to do the job versus students volunteering for the job.
That being said, Go Scots."Win the NCAC Tourney!!!!!

Reason...ftw. 

Safe travels to everyone tonight and tomorrow.  Let's have a great NCAC final four this weekend!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2011, 06:59:58 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2011, 05:14:10 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 10:09:29 AM
Oh, and  thanks for the spelling lesson.  Much appreciated?!   My life is complete now that I know the proper spelling of ridiculous.  Which is pretty much how I feel about your response BTW... ::)  Uh oh.  I hope the newly self appointed grammar police isn't going to be critical of me for not spelling out b-y  t-h-e  w-a-y???  :o  Oh, the horror???  ???  :D

Dear ScotsFan,

GoRed wasn't the grammar police. He was the spelling police.

Sincerely,

The definition police

;)


But who are the Dream Police?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 24, 2011, 07:47:12 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2011, 06:59:58 PM

But who are the Dream Police?

What is Cheap Trick Alex?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IiVscqYrtfM
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 24, 2011, 07:56:33 PM
My take on this (pointless) argument is that Wally was bashing Wooster's broadcast team for being unprofessional but standing up for his broadcasting team for essentially being unprofessional.........

Now onto real topics, such as basketball in Wooster tomorrow night!!!

BIG GAME forWitt/Wabash in the sense that its a "play-in" game in essence even though the team that wins isn't guaranteed anything. I'm probably in the minority but think that OWU has a legit shot to upset Wooster tomorrow night too.

Witt/Wabsh will come down to the same thing as last Wednesday, which team is shooting better from 3 point range.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 24, 2011, 08:16:53 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 24, 2011, 07:56:33 PM

Witt/Wabsh will come down to the same thing as last Wednesday, which team is shooting better from 3 point range.

And to dwell on this a little further, here's a question: would you rather have one stellar three-point shooter that is maybe relied on too much, or three decent ones who on any given night you're not sure what they might contribute?  If you have the one guy, an excellent and dedicated defender just might shut him down.  If you have three, it's likely that there will be more good looks, but will they go in?

Better to have three very good shooters, but few teams have that luxury.  Wooster did for a couple of seasons with Cooper, Port, and Fulk.  This season, the consistency isn't there for the Scots to fall into this category.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2011, 08:26:00 PM
The last thing I'm going to say on this subject is this: I don't think anyone was really too bothered by the "alleged" antics of the Wabash broadcasters at the Wooster game.  If they had been upset about it, someone would have mentioned it back then and not waited more than two weeks to bring it up.  No, what bothers people is the double standard that Wally is attempting to apply here.  He criticizes something associated from Wooster, gets shown that something from Wabash was as bad or worse, and suddenly it's double-standard time.  Again.

Moving on...

Wooster now has a Championship website (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/releases/20110224r061lg) up, with information on tip times, online coverages, ticket sales, and the four participating teams.  Unfortunately, nothing about parking; I guess you're on your own there.  I'd advise people to get there early, and not to wait for the second game.  

The first game is interesting in a lot of ways, most of them already known to most of us.  One thing that strikes me is the neutral-court aspect.  Which team will bring more/louder fans?  Will the Wooster fans tend to support Wabash (and/or Mac Petty) or will they just sit on their hands?  (I can't see them cheering for Wittenberg en masse.)  Will it be a quiet but quickly filling gym, and if so will that drain away energy from one or both teams?  Should be interesting.

You're not alone, pennstghs; I think either game could go either way.  Should be a great night of basketball, which unfortunately I will miss in its entirety, being scheduled for work during that time.  >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 08:48:00 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 24, 2011, 07:56:33 PM
My take on this (pointless) argument is that Wally was bashing Wooster's broadcast team for being unprofessional but standing up for his broadcasting team for essentially being unprofessional.........

Ding ding ding ding... Finally, someone sees the original point I was trying to make here!  8-)

Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2011, 08:26:00 PM
The last thing I'm going to say on this subject is this: I don't think anyone was really too bothered by the "alleged" antics of the Wabash broadcasters at the Wooster game.  If they had been upset about it, someone would have mentioned it back then and not waited more than two weeks to bring it up.  No, what bothers people is the double standard that Wally is attempting to apply here.  He criticizes something associated from Wooster, gets shown that something from Wabash was as bad or worse, and suddenly it's double-standard time.  Again.


And yes, David hit the nail squarely on the head on this one. 



Quote from: pennstghs on February 24, 2011, 07:56:33 PM
I'm probably in the minority but think that OWU has a legit shot to upset Wooster tomorrow night too.

I don't know why you would think you are in the minority.  After watching Wooster struggle over the past few games and especially watching the Scots turn a 17 point lead into a 9 point deficit against a team that had won a total of 4 league games all season is certainly no reason to be confident of a Wooster win tomorrow night.  Do I think Wooster is the better team?  Yes.  But has Wooster been playing like the team that was undefeated for the better part of this season and ranked #1 in the country of late?  Not so much. 

That said, OWU still has the burden of trying to figure out just how to beat the Scots.  The Bishops got drilled by the Scots down in Delaware back in December.  Then last Saturday, OWU played Wooster much tougher, but still ended up losing by nearly double digits.  Brady didn't have his best game, but Winters more than made up for it with almost a career night.  In the end, OWU just seemed to wilt down the stretch.  Whether it was from the pressure of not having too much success against Wooster or fatigue or was it the fact that Wooster is a veteran and talented team and simply has more experience in knowing how to finish in situations like that.  The bottom line is OWU didn't finish too strongly last Saturday in Wooster.  The question is, will the Bishops have what it takes to pull off what they failed to do just last Saturday in Timken?

I would also like to think that the scare Allegheny gave Wooster just may have awoken what has been a slumbering giant over the last month or so of the season.  Will the Scots use that scare as a wake up call or will we see Wooster continue to just seeminly go through the motions on the court with no real sense of urgency until they are faced with a challenge?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 09:03:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2011, 08:26:00 PM

Wooster now has a Championship website (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/releases/20110224r061lg) up, with information on tip times, online coverages, ticket sales, and the four participating teams.  Unfortunately, nothing about parking; I guess you're on your own there.  I'd advise people to get there early, and not to wait for the second game.  


Add in the distinct possiblity that we could be seeing some significant snowfall moving into the area starting early tomorrow morning and falling heavily throughout the early afternoon hours.  I read one forecast said that there is the possiblity of seeing 2 inches per hour from 5 am to 10 am.  If that is the case, we could be looking at quite a mess for tomorrow night's games.  The quesion will be, just how bad will it get and how early will it hit.  The earlier the better as it should give road crews the chance to get the roads cleared by the evening rush.  Should is the key word here.  Hopefully the road crews here in Wooster will be more ahead of this storm than they were by the one we got hammerred with on Monday.  I can't remember seeing so many cars just stranded in the middle of roads in Wooster as I did Monday evening.  I'm not talking about cars in ditches or cars that slipped off the road.  I'm talking about cars that became stuck in the middle of roads and were abandoned because there were no salt trucks to be found plowing or salting the streets?  I'm hoping Wooster's road crews learned from their mistakes of Monday and will be ready for this storm ahead of time tomorrow?!  Although, I'm not going to be holding my breath...  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2011, 09:21:35 PM
It's not a double standard, it's a different standard.  Guys who have been calling games for years and years and years and taking money to do so can't boo during games.  I don't even care about impartiality...I know better than to expect that from small college broadcasts, but you can't boo.  Want to boo the refs?  Buy a ticket and sit with the rest of the crowd.  That's a mistake that experienced, veteran broadcasters can't make.  Students doing this job as full fledged amateurs, as green as they get, getting excited about a win like that isn't a big deal.  It just isn't.  I've been in my job for 10+ years now...there are mistakes that new employees can make (and learn from) that I'd get buried for now.  The standard changes as you get older...this is no different. 

Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2011, 08:26:00 PM
Will the Wooster fans tend to support Wabash (and/or Mac Petty) or will they just sit on their hands?  (I can't see them cheering for Wittenberg en masse.)  Will it be a quiet but quickly filling gym, and if so will that drain away energy from one or both teams?  Should be interesting.

I thought it was noted that Wooster fans don't attend the first game of doubleheaders, thus getting jammed out of three extra bucks.  Did we change our minds about that? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2011, 09:24:46 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2011, 09:21:35 PM
I thought it was noted that Wooster fans don't attend the first game of doubleheaders, thus getting jammed out of three extra bucks.  Did we change our minds about that? 

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.44lbs.net%2Filia%2FDoNotFeedTroll.jpg&hash=020db910fee0f5320efe1aba8846914d8a8f4404)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 09:42:57 PM
Will you be there Wally?  Perhaps that may influence my decision as to whether or not to attend...  :-*
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2011, 09:43:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2011, 08:26:00 PM
The last thing I'm going to say on this subject is this: I don't think anyone was really too bothered by the "alleged" antics of the Wabash broadcasters at the Wooster game.  If they had been upset about it, someone would have mentioned it back then and not waited more than two weeks to bring it up.  No, what bothers people is the double standard that Wally is attempting to apply here.  He criticizes something associated from Wooster, gets shown that something from Wabash was as bad or worse, and suddenly it's double-standard time.  Again.

Kudos and karma to David, ScotsFan and pennstghs for all pointing out Wally's double standard posting behavior. :)  I have a lot of respect for Mac Petty and the Wabash program but no respect for some of Wally's posts which have been inaccurate criticisms of Wooster's program/fans.  Wally - Wooster fans don't get "riled up" when an opponent wins in Timken.

As for Friday's games, Wabash vs. Witt should be a great game as both teams likely need the victory to keep their seasons alive.  Wabash deserves a pool C bid even if they lose IMO but it is not a sure thing if other highly ranked teams miss their automatic bids.  Great point by pennstghs that Wooster could get upset by Ohio Wesleyan.  The Bishops have played well recently and Wooster sleepwalked through their Allegheny win on Tueday.  Coach Moore lamented all their turnovers on the post game show and their shooting was poor in the second half.  It is also very difficult to beat the same team 3 times in one season so Wooster better raise their game to avoid the upset by the Bishops.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2011, 09:59:07 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 09:42:57 PM
Will you be there Wally?  Perhaps that may influence my decision as to whether or not to attend...  :-*

Unfortunately not...I'll be watching from home this weekend.  I'd love to be there though as I do think that we're in for three great basketball games regardless of outcomes. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2011, 10:00:15 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2011, 09:43:33 PMWooster fans don't get "riled up" when an opponent wins in Timken.

My experience is that the preponderance of Wooster fans don't get riled up for any reason, unless Wittenberg is in the house.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2011, 10:03:29 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 06:05:34 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2011, 05:14:10 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 10:09:29 AM
Oh, and  thanks for the spelling lesson.  Much appreciated?!   My life is complete now that I know the proper spelling of ridiculous.  Which is pretty much how I feel about your response BTW... ::)  Uh oh.  I hope the newly self appointed grammar police isn't going to be critical of me for not spelling out b-y  t-h-e  w-a-y???  :o  Oh, the horror???  ???  :D

Dear ScotsFan,

GoRed wasn't the grammar police. He was the spelling police.

Sincerely,

The definition police

;)


Duly noted.  At least I wasn't mistaking pre-season games with non-conference games eh?   ;D   ;)

That would call down the pedantry division of the definition police upon your head, of which I am the chief constable. ;)

Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2011, 06:59:58 PM
But who are the Dream Police?

Dunno, but I do know that they don't get paid to take vacations, or let me alone.

Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2011, 09:24:46 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2011, 09:21:35 PM
I thought it was noted that Wooster fans don't attend the first game of doubleheaders, thus getting jammed out of three extra bucks.  Did we change our minds about that? 

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.44lbs.net%2Filia%2FDoNotFeedTroll.jpg&hash=020db910fee0f5320efe1aba8846914d8a8f4404)

Uh ... no leprechauns holding roasted turkeys on the end of a stick allowed?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2011, 10:46:16 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2011, 10:03:29 PM
Uh ... no leprechauns holding roasted turkeys on the end of a stick allowed?

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm4.static.flickr.com%2F3005%2F2605198089_894337388e.jpg&hash=95602f67ede7b81a1134b04fbc75e031d1b7695a)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 24, 2011, 10:48:47 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2011, 10:03:29 PM
Uh ... no leprechauns holding roasted turkeys on the end of a stick allowed?

That part's allowed, but you can't hold a knife behind your back in the process.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2011, 10:55:42 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on February 24, 2011, 10:48:47 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2011, 10:03:29 PM
Uh ... no leprechauns holding roasted turkeys on the end of a stick allowed?

That part's allowed, but you can't hold a knife behind your back in the process.

Ah ... yes, now that I look at it more closely I can see the knife.

So, it's, "No knife-wielding leprechauns holding roasted turkeys on the end of a stick allowed," right?

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcollider.com%2Fuploads%2FimageGallery%2FLeprechaun%2Fleprechaun_movie_image__2_.jpg&hash=9d7a7bd95232e80323ea50c96c0a24b45589f01d)

If you don't have a metal detectior, don't invite this guy over for Thanksgiving dinner!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 24, 2011, 11:00:22 PM
I want to know where the gold at! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nda_OSWeyn8
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2011, 11:20:22 PM
This here's a special leprechaun flute that's been passed down from thousands of years ago by my great-great-grandfather, who's Irish.

I just came to help out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 11:21:44 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on February 24, 2011, 11:00:22 PM
I want to know where the gold at! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nda_OSWeyn8

Only in Alabama!   :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2011, 02:14:55 AM
You said "The Knife"??

Stand up and fight, for you know we are right
We must strike at the lies
That have spread like disease through our minds.
Soon we'll have power, every soldier will rest
And we'll spread out our kindness
To all who our love now deserve.
Some of you are going to die -
Martyrs of course to the freedom that I shall provide.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 25, 2011, 08:14:01 AM
"Mus be a crackheeead."   ;D ;D ;D

Gone be some good games this weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 25, 2011, 09:36:18 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 24, 2011, 09:03:21 PM

Add in the distinct possiblity that we could be seeing some significant snowfall moving into the area starting early tomorrow morning and falling heavily throughout the early afternoon hours.  I read one forecast said that there is the possiblity of seeing 2 inches per hour from 5 am to 10 am.  If that is the case, we could be looking at quite a mess for tomorrow night's games.  The quesion will be, just how bad will it get and how early will it hit.  The earlier the better as it should give road crews the chance to get the roads cleared by the evening rush.  Should is the key word here.  Hopefully the road crews here in Wooster will be more ahead of this storm than they were by the one we got hammerred with on Monday.  I can't remember seeing so many cars just stranded in the middle of roads in Wooster as I did Monday evening.  I'm not talking about cars in ditches or cars that slipped off the road.  I'm talking about cars that became stuck in the middle of roads and were abandoned because there were no salt trucks to be found plowing or salting the streets?  I'm hoping Wooster's road crews learned from their mistakes of Monday and will be ready for this storm ahead of time tomorrow?!  Although, I'm not going to be holding my breath...  :-\

It's a mess in Wooster this morning.  My compact car was scraping snow with the undercarriage on the way to work, with 5" on the ground and even major roads largely untreated.  My guess is that it will be better by day's end, but will Wabash be able to get here?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on February 25, 2011, 09:49:25 AM
At the risk of resurrecting the resurgence of unwarrented Wooster attacks on Wally .... isn't it a policy (I think even stated somewhere ... couched of course in language of the "display of good sportsmanship" et. al.) by the NCAC correctness police to banish booing or any sort of negative references to referees or the other team?  I seem to remember their concern lest Chadwick Court become too boistrous and ... heavans forbid ... negative in any way toward referee authority or the other team.

If this is in fact the case ... isn't booing by paid or "career" announcers for one team against referee authority or the other team twice as bad?

I am having fun with this .... boo away and cheer on.  Whoever you are.  Stand on your chairs Little Giants and support us.  Woo boo-birds, do the same.  And whatever you do, do not hide out in Illinois until you get your way.

GO WABASH !!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2011, 12:29:43 PM
Rather than post my usual links for the games, here's a single link to the NCAC's men's championship page (http://www2.northcoast.org/mbasketball/NCACTournament/2011), which has everything you need.  It seems that the games are both "on," despite the weather (which I hear is improving anyway.)  Drive carefully, everyone, and enjoy the games!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bombers798891 on February 25, 2011, 12:40:11 PM
Although I'm a little late to the discussion on radio guys cheering, as a former student broadcaster, I can tell you, it's all about the expectations handed down from the faculty/staff at the institution. At Ithaca, despite the "student" moniker, we were expected to act as if we were professionals, and thus the, "It's their classmates, friends, etc" argument might not have held much water.

But I think there's a strong misconception about what a student broadcaster is supposed to be among a lot of people, especially in and around the athletic department. I can't tell you the number of times we were criticized by players and coaches for not being "supportive enough" of the teams we covered. If they had it their way, we'd be cheering constantly.

If there are competing viewpoints on the subject, sometimes people can be swayed by the pressure. A coach telling you he doesn't like your broadcasts because they're too negative is something that can be tough for an 18- or 19-year old to hear. I'm not saying that happened here, but I bring it up because I think there's likely more at work in these incidents than just the broadcasters in question.

I still remember the time, during a football game, one of our lineman was injured (not seriously) on a play and referred to as looking like "a beached whale" lying on the field. I can't help but laugh every time I think about it, but that broadcaster got a talking to not long after. Still the funniest moment (IMO) in IC sports radio history.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2011, 02:19:29 PM
Quote from: Bombers798891 on February 25, 2011, 12:40:11 PM
But I think there's a strong misconception about what a student broadcaster is supposed to be among a lot of people, especially in and around the athletic department. I can't tell you the number of times we were criticized by players and coaches for not being "supportive enough" of the teams we covered. If they had it their way, we'd be cheering constantly.

I think if players and coaches spend more than about two nanoseconds worrying about what the guys doing radio are saying, then they have their priorities in all kinds of the wrong places. 

Less than four hours until it's time to hoop.  Exciting stuff tonight...can't wait to get this thing started.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 25, 2011, 02:45:25 PM
WW, any word of whether the LG's arrived in Wooster yet, or are getting close?  I continue to hear anecdotal reports of horrible road conditions in the rural areas.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on February 25, 2011, 03:30:03 PM
Little Giants came over last night.  I just arrived in town from Bloomington Indiana, no problems on the highways.  Interstate and Hwy 30 to Wooster clear.  WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2011, 03:30:31 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 25, 2011, 02:45:25 PM
WW, any word of whether the LG's arrived in Wooster yet, or are getting close?  I continue to hear anecdotal reports of horrible road conditions in the rural areas.

Oh, they got there.  There's unfinished business to take care of over there...they weren't going to let a little bit of weather derail their plans.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 25, 2011, 05:49:14 PM
Hopefully the game is a little more competitive tonight than last week.

Lets go Witt, Tiger Up!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 25, 2011, 06:00:59 PM
and of course the Wooster video feed isn't working................
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 25, 2011, 06:26:14 PM
Halftime in Wooster

Wittenberg 29 Wabash 24 - pretty clean game it sounds like so far, whichever team wants it more will come away with the W
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2011, 06:33:41 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 25, 2011, 06:26:14 PM
Halftime in Wooster

Wittenberg 29 Wabash 24 - pretty clean game it sounds like so far, whichever team wants it more will come away with the W

Sullivan went bananas in that first half hitting 4-4 on his 3FGs.  Wabash didn't let it get away though and closed strong.  Anybody's game in the second half...this is fun. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on February 25, 2011, 06:37:13 PM
Why is it so difficult to get the steaming video up and running?!? What are the odds they figure this out by the time Wooster takes the court....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2011, 06:47:12 PM
Quote from: jimmychitwood15 on February 25, 2011, 06:37:13 PM
Why is it so difficult to get the steaming video up and running?!? What are the odds they figure this out by the time Wooster takes the court....

I'd place those at somewhere between good and excellent. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on February 25, 2011, 07:05:57 PM
Nice job Woo Boos on the video.  Real class and organization for a basketball tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 25, 2011, 07:18:00 PM
Would have rather seen it live but WHAT A FINISH!!!!!  :o

Congrats Witt and hope to see a tournament title in person tomorrow night!!

Unconscience game by Chris Sullivan as he goes 9-11 from 3 point range to finish with 29 points! Wow
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2011, 07:19:41 PM
That's a helluva basketball game.  Too much Sullivan tonight.  Congrats Witt on the win.  Going to be a long wait until Monday now. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2011, 08:29:33 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 34  Ohio Wesleyan 30

Wooster being led in scoring by Ian Franks with 13 and Bryan Wickliffe with 7.

Ohio Wesleyan's top scorers are Greg White with 9, Tim Brady with 9 and Marshall Morris with 8.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on February 25, 2011, 09:10:49 PM
Sullivan was on fire and pressured, not free ones.  I have to say as an official and a basketball fan, you have to make the call under the Wabash basket on the rebound attempted put back with about 5 sec to go.  Plenty of other situations in the game not to place the game on one call but disturbing as an official to see that one as a no call, if I were on the crew, I would be embarrassed. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2011, 09:31:06 PM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on February 25, 2011, 09:10:49 PM
Sullivan was on fire and pressured, not free ones.  I have to say as an official and a basketball fan, you have to make the call under the Wabash basket on the rebound attempted put back with about 5 sec to go.  Plenty of other situations in the game not to place the game on one call but disturbing as an official to see that one as a no call, if I were on the crew, I would be embarrassed. 

That end of game stuff is always odd. Last year Wabash was called for a foul with one second left giving Witt free throws to win. That looked like the right call last year, but then where is that call now? Wabash has been on both ends of the end of game protocol in the last two semifinals...frustrating that it can't be more consistent, but that's basketball.  Tonight Wabash had other chances...left some points at the stripe which could have made a difference. And you have to tip the cap to Sullivan. The kid came up huge after being cold for a couple of weeks. It was another great game in the series, even if the LGs came up just short.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2011, 09:36:42 PM
Final:  Wooster 70  Ohio Wesleyan 62 :)

Wooster's Top Scorers:  Ian Franks 25 (12 Boards), Bryan Wickliffe 12, Nathan Balch 11.  Nice double double by Franks.

Ohio Wesleyan's Top Scorers:  Andy Winters 16, Greg White 12, Marshall Morris 12, Tim Brady 11

Scots did not shoot very well tonight but played good defense and won the rebound battle 46 to 30.

Wooster is now 25-2.  Woo-Witt Round #3 will determine the NCAA automatic bid tomorrow night.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 26, 2011, 12:34:40 AM
Quote from: wabco on February 25, 2011, 07:05:57 PM
Nice job Woo Boos on the video.  Real class and organization for a basketball tournament.

I don't know why the NCAC and OAC insist on using Teamline. That's such crappy technology when there are so many other better options.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: D-III Insider on February 26, 2011, 09:27:57 AM
Does anyone have the video of Witt-Wabash buzzer beater last night? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on February 26, 2011, 10:30:19 AM
Just wondering if Wabash should be pulling for a Witt win tonight --- does that improve Wabash's chances in Pool C?  Considering that Wooster is a probable lock to be an early Pool C selection if they don't get the AQ, and Wabash gets to the table quicker than if they are behind Witt in Pool C.  (Although it is not obvious that Wabash would be placed behind Witt in the Pool C pecking order.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 26, 2011, 10:32:49 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 26, 2011, 12:34:40 AM
Quote from: wabco on February 25, 2011, 07:05:57 PM
Nice job Woo Boos on the video.  Real class and organization for a basketball tournament.

I don't know why the NCAC and OAC insist on using Teamline. That's such crappy technology when there are so many other better options.

Is it the conference or the hosting school that determines the service provider?  I wonder because the women's tournament at Denison was done via Game Central, not Teamline.  Except for a few moments where the streaming stopped briefly, the video was very good in both semi-finals.  

And the student broadcasters did what I would consider to be a very professional job.  Play by play was done by Big Red men's player Mike Garabedian in both games with separate color men for each game.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 26, 2011, 10:44:38 AM
Quote from: Schwami on February 26, 2011, 10:30:19 AM
Just wondering if Wabash should be pulling for a Witt win tonight --- does that improve Wabash's chances in Pool C?  Considering that Wooster is a probable lock to be an early Pool C selection if they don't get the AQ, and Wabash gets to the table quicker than if they are behind Witt in Pool C.  (Although it is not obvious that Wabash would be placed behind Witt in the Pool C pecking order.)

I don't think that Wabash would end up ahead of Witt.

At this point, it looks like Wabash is clinging to the bubble for dear life.

Since Witt will probably ranked ahead of 'Bash no matter what, LG fans may be rooting for Witt to win the AQ. Since Woo is an obvious Pool C team, they may be ushered in quickly giving the LG's maximum opportunity "on the board".

Wabash fans should be rooting for Penn State-Behrend over La Roche, Thiel over Bethany, Marietta over John Carroll, and Hope over Calvin (although I personally wouldn't mind a little Calvin support  :))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 26, 2011, 11:32:44 AM
Quote from: GoRed on February 26, 2011, 10:32:49 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 26, 2011, 12:34:40 AM
Quote from: wabco on February 25, 2011, 07:05:57 PM
Nice job Woo Boos on the video.  Real class and organization for a basketball tournament.

I don't know why the NCAC and OAC insist on using Teamline. That's such crappy technology when there are so many other better options.

Is it the conference or the hosting school that determines the service provider?  I wonder because the women's tournament at Denison was done via Game Central, not Teamline.  Except for a few moments where the streaming stopped briefly, the video was very good in both semi-finals.  

And the student broadcasters did what I would consider to be a very professional job.  Play by play was done by Big Red men's player Mike Garabedian in both games with separate color men for each game.  


Good question, I guess I don't know for sure. But the Teamline page referenced the NCAC, not Wooster, so I took my cue from that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: djabs7 on February 26, 2011, 03:04:18 PM
Quote from: D-III Insider on February 26, 2011, 09:27:57 AM
Does anyone have the video of Witt-Wabash buzzer beater last night? 

I was finally able to up footage of Wabash's last shot and Seth Hill's buzzer-beater on SpringfieldNewsSun.com.

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/springfield-oh-sports/wittenbergs-buzzer-beater-1091870.html (http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/springfield-oh-sports/wittenbergs-buzzer-beater-1091870.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 26, 2011, 03:37:11 PM
There's no doubt that Curosh got mugged under the basket.  It was even clearer watching it in person.  This is just more evidence, that especially under pressure, the NCAC officials are horrible.  "Let them play?  Let the players decide the game?"  Hogwash.  I was rooting for Wittenberg, but Wabash got screwed.

But how about that air ball put up by number 21?  Who the heck is that guy?  Such a weak shot...must have had the flu.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2011, 04:08:07 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2011, 03:37:11 PM
There's no doubt that Curosh got mugged under the basket.  It was even clearer watching it in person.  This is just more evidence, that especially under pressure, the NCAC officials are horrible.  "Let them play?  Let the players decide the game?"  Hogwash.  I was rooting for Wittenberg, but Wabash got screwed.

But how about that air ball put up by number 21?  Who the heck is that guy?  Such a weak shot...must have had the flu.   ::)

:D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2011, 06:48:01 PM
It appears that, as with last night, there will be no video feed from Timken tonight.

Some hosting job, Wooster.  >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on February 26, 2011, 07:32:23 PM
Wooster should be ambarrassed with the tournament web site. The lack of updating and live vidio feed is unacceptable. I just checked the site for tonights info and yesterdays info is still there and sending regrets for not having vidio feed for yesterdays game.

Wooster's SID has never been on top of their game. Example: In prior years the media guide for the baseball team has been loaded to the web site as the team played in the NCAA regionals.
3 years ago, when Woo baseball hosted the Mid East regionals, the same thing happened. Info was a day late and a dollar short.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2011, 07:38:11 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 39  Wittenberg 30

Wooster is being led by Justin Hallowell with 12 points, Nathan Balch with 7 and Ian Franks with 5.

Wittenberg's top scorers are Clayton Black with 12 points, Alex Brandt with 8 and Chris Sullivan with 5.

Hallowell hit a long three pointer just before the halftime buzzer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2011, 07:49:36 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2011, 06:48:01 PM
It appears that, as with last night, there will be no video feed from Timken tonight.

Some hosting job, Wooster.  >:(

I am posting from Virginia tonight where we are visiting in-laws.  I agree that it is very disappointing that Wooster can't provide a video feed of the tournament championship game. :(

Thank goodness for Mike Breckenridge's excellent radio broadcast!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2011, 07:58:54 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2011, 07:49:36 PM
Thank goodness for Mike Breckenridge's excellent radio broadcast!

...and thank goodness I can actually get it to work tonight!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2011, 08:19:08 PM
Becker's loss to Elms may have popped Wabash's bubble and if Witt can't beat Wooster they may have to sweat if some others bubbles pop.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2011, 08:24:07 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 26, 2011, 08:19:08 PM
Becker's loss to Elms may have popped Wabash's bubble and if Witt can't beat Wooster they may have to sweat if some others bubbles pop.

And right now Marietta is losing by about 15 to JCU—if the Pioneers lose, it will further push Wabash/Witt out on the bubble.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2011, 08:41:26 PM
Final:  Wooster 82  Wittenberg 68 :)

Wooster won this game tonight by outshooting Witt and hitting 13 three pointers!  Ian Franks was unstoppable - great game!

Wooster's Top Scorers:  Ian Franks 25, Justin Hallowell 19, Nathan Balch 13

Wittenberg's Top Scorers:  Clayton Black 19, Alex Brandt 14, Chris Sullivan 9, Josh McKee 9, Seth Hill 9

Congratulations to Wooster's key seniors (Franks, Wickliffe, Balch) on winning both the NCAC regular season and tournament titles!

Wooster is now 26-2 ;D  ...and should get a very nice seed in the NCAA tourney!  16 NCAA bids in 17 years!

GO SCOTS!

Post game show:  Coach Moore complimented the seniors and especially the defense that Balch & Warnes played vs. Sullivan
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 26, 2011, 09:42:56 PM
Quote from: old scot on February 26, 2011, 07:32:23 PM
Wooster should be ambarrassed with the tournament web site. The lack of updating and live vidio feed is unacceptable. I just checked the site for tonights info and yesterdays info is still there and sending regrets for not having vidio feed for yesterdays game.

Wooster's SID has never been on top of their game. Example: In prior years the media guide for the baseball team has been loaded to the web site as the team played in the NCAA regionals.
3 years ago, when Woo baseball hosted the Mid East regionals, the same thing happened. Info was a day late and a dollar short.


Nothing like Wooster fans who haven't been on this board the entire year come and run their mouth about stuff they know nothing about. If you want to find out what's wrong and do something about it, contact the President and tell him to make a financial commitment to doing this stuff right, and not have an IT department that snickers at the technology needs of the athletic area, including sports information, for a decade. Oh, and also check in with the VP of College Relations and ask why he doesn't attend any of the games. If he actually had a clue about what is going on, maybe he would help. This is his area.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2011, 09:49:47 PM
Witt may have been saved by Marietta's furious comeback win. Still doesn't look good for Wabash, but stranger "C" bids have happened!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 26, 2011, 09:50:52 PM
This tiny detail probably won't make the difference, but you never know. Both Wittenberg and Wabash completed their regular season playing one less game than they could have. Wabash only scheduled 24 games (maybe someone pulled out on them, I don't know), and Wittenberg lost the Kenyon forfeit game as one that could count towards their overall record. When you take into account that Wabash lost in the semis, when the committee compares them with a team that reached the championship game of their conference tournament, they could possibly have played two less games, and be down two potential wins.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2011, 10:08:57 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 26, 2011, 09:49:47 PM
Witt may have been saved by Marietta's furious comeback win. Still doesn't look good for Wabash, but stranger "C" bids have happened!

First, it would be great for the NCAC if either Witt or Wabash got a Pool C bid.  Even better if they both did! (low probability)

Wabash was ranked #6 in the last NCAA regional rankings and Witt was not ranked.  Both picked up one more loss in the NCAC tourney.  However, Witt does have fewer in-region wins.  If I am correct, Witt now stands with a 16-6 in-region record and Wabash has a 19-6 in-region record.  So, Wabash appears to be in a better position than Witt on that one metric.  On the other hand, Witt won the head to head games 2 to 1.  What will be the deciding factor for the NCAA?

Because only one Great Lakes team can be reviewed at a time by the NCAA Selection Committee, both Witt and Wabash will probably have to wait for Penn State Behrend and Thiel to be considered first for a Pool C bid.  Both PSB and Thiel were ranked higher than Wabash in the last regional ranking and both lost in their tourney championship games tonight.

Good luck to both Wabash and Witt on their Pool C chances!

Note:  Augustana just beat Illinois Wesleyan minutes ago so Augustana gets the CCIW automatic bid saving a Pool C bid for someone else.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2011, 10:17:30 PM
Less than two weeks ago, the NCAC boasted three teams ranked in the top 18 in the D3hoops.com poll.  Tonight, it looks (to me at least) like a one-bid conference.  It's been a tumultuous two weeks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on February 26, 2011, 10:50:07 PM
Seinfeld, as an infrequent poster and a frequent lurker, as well as someone who has watched a lot of both Witt and Woo this season via the internet, I am curious what you think we can accomplish by contacting Wooster's President regarding their non-existent video coverage of this game.
It's the 21st century, and the technology needed to put video of this game on the web is already old.
You're saying it's some political b***s*** on campus?
And we don't know what we're talking about?
Basketball defines Wooster athletics.  Act like it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2011, 10:52:13 PM
Of course, while it is important for College Relations to have the video feed going, there could be bigger fish to fry on campus. Believe me, what the 'outside' could think of as a minor issue is fraught with turmoil inside the walls of academia.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 26, 2011, 10:57:55 PM
Quote from: drt on February 26, 2011, 10:50:07 PM
Seinfeld, as an infrequent poster and a frequent lurker, as well as someone who has watched a lot of both Witt and Woo this season via the internet, I am curious what you think we can accomplish by contacting Wooster's President regarding their non-existent video coverage of this game.
It's the 21st century, and the technology needed to put video of this game on the web is already old.
You're saying it's some political b***s*** on campus?
And we don't know what we're talking about?
Basketball defines Wooster athletics.  Act like it.

Read my post again and you'll get the answer to your question. Tell me what question you just asked that I didn't answer.

And yes, the post I referred was riddled with errors. First of all, how is he expecting tonight's information a 7:30 when the game started at 7 p.m.? Second, why don't you ask the other SIDs in the conference what they think of Wooster.? When you have that answer, come back and let me know. Third, Wooster baseball didn't host the Mid East regionals three years ago. The last time they hosted it was in 2007, and that wasn't even on campus. It was an hour away.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on February 26, 2011, 11:05:01 PM
OK, basketball defines Wooster athletics.  WHY doesn't the college act like it?
I don't think that question was answered in your post, or maybe I'm just obtuse.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 26, 2011, 11:07:53 PM
drt,

I'm not looking to pick a fight, but I just told you the root problems to this issue. What more do you want me to say? Do I need to give you internal documents and budget reports? Just because basketball is good at Wooster and people care about it doesn't mean they are investing money in things like advanced multimedia. You are under the assumption that everyone thinks it is important except the SID and the media people. I'm guessing you've never worked at a college before. You, writing the president, have more influence over getting this problem fixed than they do.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2011, 11:17:09 PM
All-tournament team:

Ian Franks, Wooster (MOP)
Bryan Wickliffe, Wooster
Clayton Black, Wittenberg
Chris Sullivan, Wittenberg
Nick Curosh, Wabash
Tim Brady, OWU

One or two curious selections there, if you ask me.  Of course, I didn't see the games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on February 26, 2011, 11:19:42 PM
Well, I worked at a college a long time ago, and before that I was intimately involved in D3 athletics at a very high level.
Thanks, I don't care to review internal documents or budget reports.
If things are as bad as you say in regards to lack of institutional support for basketball, then I say kudos to coach Moore for everything he has done there, apparently against all odds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 26, 2011, 11:27:06 PM
Maybe where the confusion is coming from, in part, is that the sports information operation isn't part of the athletic department. So they operate under a completely different budget and supervisory structure. The athletic department could want video in HD, and it won't make a difference. One of the people I referenced in my first post on this actually wanted to suspend Live Stats a few years back. This is after Wooster had been one of the first schools to use it. Think about that and you'll get an idea of what I was talking about.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on February 26, 2011, 11:34:29 PM
OK, I think I get it now, but WTF.
So sad for such a fine program.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2011, 11:46:59 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2011, 08:41:26 PM
Final:  Wooster 82  Wittenberg 68 :)

Wooster won this game tonight by outshooting Witt and hitting 13 three pointers!  Ian Franks was unstoppable - great game!

Wooster's Top Scorers:  Ian Franks 25, Justin Hallowell 19, Nathan Balch 13

Wittenberg's Top Scorers:  Clayton Black 19, Alex Brandt 14, Chris Sullivan 9, Josh McKee 9, Seth Hill 9

Congratulations to Wooster's key seniors (Franks, Wickliffe, Balch) on winning both the NCAC regular season and tournament titles!

Wooster is now 26-2 ;D  ...and should get a very nice seed in the NCAA tourney!  16 NCAA bids in 17 years!

GO SCOTS!

Post game show:  Coach Moore complimented the seniors and especially the defense that Balch & Warnes played vs. Sullivan

Congratulations to the Scots on a fine performance tonight where the team came out and simply won a basketball game. So many of the recent efforts from the Scots had seemed lacking, and tonight they were more or less in command throughout.

Since I couldn't see it, I don't know what to attribute the vastly improved 3 point shooting to. Perhaps the Scots just had better looks, perhaps tonight they were just collectively more focused and thus the shots were falling. Either way, I welcome the return of the 3-point shot to Wooster's arsenal. It'd be nice if I still felt that making free throws was also part of that arsenal, of course... :(

Kudos to Justin Warnes—the first-hand report that I received indicated that he simply pestered Sullivan everywhere Sullivan went for the second half. After a 9-11 night, Sullivan was 2-11 (I believe) tonight. For the season against Wooster he was something like 7-35 according to Breckinridge in the post-game show.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2011, 12:25:05 AM
Teams either have a man that can guard Sullivan, or they don't.  Wabash didn't.  Wooster did.  Two of them.  Nathan Balch began the job and was excellent, as he was in the last outing against Wittenberg.  When Justin Warnes entered the game, he took over.  Since he, too, was doing spectacular work, it was his chore most of the rest of the way, even when both he and Balch were on the court together.  My guess is that Steve Moore chose to handle it in that manner so as to save some of Balch's energy for offense.

Sullivan worked incredibly hard to get open.  He doesn't stand around; he's in constant motion off picks and screens, both high and low.  But if you have quick athletes who are willing to put out the effort, he's guardable, because he's a one-dimensional player.  He's a three-point shooter, and that's it.  So, if you can catch him, you can stay in his face out to 24-25 feet without the threat of him trying to go by you.

One more thing about Justin Warnes.  I don't think I've ever seen a player improve so much during the course of a single season.  I bashed him and trashed him earlier in the year, and I still think his play deserved it.  I didn't think he should have been on the court getting meaningful minutes.  But Steve Moore and the coaching staff were right, they had a budding defensive stopper on their hands.  Warnes has proved his worth these last few weeks, and especially so tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2011, 02:19:42 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2011, 03:37:11 PM
But how about that air ball put up by number 21?  Who the heck is that guy?  Such a weak shot...must have had the flu.  ::)

There ya go...run a kid down because he missed a shot.  Nice.

Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 27, 2011, 12:25:05 AM
Teams either have a man that can guard Sullivan, or they don't.  Wabash didn't.  Wooster did. 

This simply isn't true.  Wabash defended the heck out of Sullivan in the two previous games.  He got his attempts, but he wasn't making anything.  The reports from last night would indicate that Sullivan made a lot of shots while being guarded well...but sometimes a good shooter just makes his shots.  It happens.  Why not give him credit for having a good game? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on February 27, 2011, 03:28:17 AM
Belated congratulations to Wooster and Coach Moore - a good, solid win and heck of a streak.

A "clever" remark regarding #21 is predictable, Wally.  Unfamiliar with medical records of any current players, but  lost most of a semester, many years ago, to "mono" and recurrent bouts of flu - glad some find jocularity in these situations between "Ralph and Buick" sound effects.

Sullivan really went off on Friday - it was reminiscent of a bygone era of spot shooters prior to Earvin Johnson's, Lynryd Skynyrd ("Gimme Three Steps") routine.  Schellhase, Mount, Komives, West, Goodrich, Bradley, Carr, Mullins...  Some nights, a player with back to the basket from mid court can loft anything up and it'll fall - short of a ball and chain or straight jacket, the defender(s) are toast.  It was a career-type, dream night for the Witt guard and came at the perfect time for the Tigers - no excuses.  The rivalry status with Wittenberg is approaching "Dannydom" in intensity.  Every game, lately, comes down to final minute.  ;)

It is ironic that a "bad loss" to Denison, in the same academic year as the St. Louis debacle, may relegate Wabash to post-season, spectator status again. **it happens.  Which life lesson is that?  ???

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 27, 2011, 07:09:56 AM
just waking up after a long day of basketball in northrtn ohio. First a opener with lake erie losing a exciting game to ashland on a three pointer, then the wittenberg-wooster game. Always love going to wooster. Noboby supports the team better then wooster fans and it was certainly rocking last night. Good game , that shot right before half was a killer for wittenberg after fighting back into it. Good to see the tigers not give up and close to 4 at one point in the second half. Every time it looked like Wittenberg had it going though Wooster would hit another big three. Only one complaint on the day. Mansfield needs to do a much better job plowing their streets.

david
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on February 27, 2011, 07:49:36 AM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 27, 2011, 07:09:56 AM
Only one complaint on the day. Mansfield needs to do a much better job plowing their streets.

david

So, Snow Trails has expanded?   ;D

Understand it's been a brutal winter with regard to snow/ice this year and wish y'all an early spring.  93 in "Bots," currently.  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on February 27, 2011, 08:25:29 AM
Seinfeld,
You must have something to do with the SID Dept. at Woo since you "went off"on my post.
It doesn't matter if I'm a Wooster fan or not, people expect to see a vidio feed. I'm sure the fans from Witt, Bash, and OWU  shared my disappointment. Maybe they should write a letter to Woo's president also. I could care less about inter-campus politics. After hosting the NCAC Championship for the last 6-7 years ???? (I hope my time frame is correct) you would think they should have the program down by now.

Congrats to the Scots on another championship and good luck in the NCAA's.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 27, 2011, 08:37:05 AM
I don't even work at Wooster, Old Scot. I went off because it is hit and run posts like yours that are immensely inaccurate (and riddled with spelling errors) that drag down this board lower than it already is. And your obsession with an insignificant media guide is also quite bizarre.

I never said people shouldn't be upset. I would be upset, and the way KiltedBryan expressed his disappointment without making you know what up as the cause of it was the mature way to approach it.

If you read any of my follow up posts, which apparently you didn't, you'd know the underlying reasons why this happened, and what you might be able to do to help. If this is as big of a deal as it must have been for you to make your post, then you'll do something. If not, then it obviously wasn't important enough to warrant your response in the first place.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2011, 08:39:58 AM
Quote from: old scot on February 27, 2011, 08:25:29 AM
Seinfeld,
You must have something to do with the SID Dept. at Woo since you "went off"on my post.
It doesn't matter if I'm a Wooster fan or not, people expect to see a vidio feed. I'm sure the fans from Witt, Bash, and OWU  shared my disappointment. Maybe they should write a letter to Woo's president also. I could care less about inter-campus politics. After hosting the NCAC Championship for the last 6-7 years ???? (I hope my time frame is correct) you would think they should have the program down by now.

Congrats to the Scots on another championship and good luck in the NCAA's.

oldscot, it doesn't matter how many years in a row Wooster has hosted this tournament.  If the athletic department doesn't have the proper support from the actual places you need support from within the operations of the college, nothing will change.

Also, at least Wooster offers video.  They may have had the misfortune of experiencing technical difficulties on the biggest weekend of basketball all season, but at least they offer it when things are running smoothly.  At least they aren't Hope who spent millions of dollars on building a fancy new basketball arena, but apparently don't have the money to invest in any sort of online video whatsoever.   Be thankful with what you've got.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 27, 2011, 08:58:04 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 26, 2011, 11:17:09 PM
All-tournament team:

Ian Franks, Wooster (MOP)
Bryan Wickliffe, Wooster
Clayton Black, Wittenberg
Chris Sullivan, Wittenberg
Nick Curosh, Wabash
Tim Brady, OWU

One or two curious selections there, if you ask me.  Of course, I didn't see the games.

I'm not sure which of the two picks puzzled you, but I'm guessing that Wickliffe may have been one. They take into account the first round games, and if it wasn't for Wickliffe's effort late in that game, we'd be talking about the biggest upset in NCAC history instead of who Wooster might host in the first round. The Gators have a bright future. I believe their entire starting lineup returns next season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 27, 2011, 09:26:39 AM
Any idea of the cost of providing a video feed using the technology used by the benchmark schools?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2011, 09:27:15 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 27, 2011, 08:58:04 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 26, 2011, 11:17:09 PM
All-tournament team:

Ian Franks, Wooster (MOP)
Bryan Wickliffe, Wooster
Clayton Black, Wittenberg
Chris Sullivan, Wittenberg
Nick Curosh, Wabash
Tim Brady, OWU

One or two curious selections there, if you ask me.  Of course, I didn't see the games.

I'm not sure which of the two picks puzzled you, but I'm guessing that Wickliffe may have been one. They take into account the first round games, and if it wasn't for Wickliffe's effort late in that game, we'd be talking about the biggest upset in NCAC history instead of who Wooster might host in the first round. The Gators have a bright future. I believe their entire starting lineup returns next season.

It would be nice to see defensive efforts rewarded for all-tournament selections.  Warnes did a heckuva job the last 2 nights in shutting down Brady on Friday after Brady was coming off a good offensive performance against Hiram and then turning around and shutting down Sullivan after he was coming off a career performance against Wabash.  

But, you can't really argue Wick's selection after he kept Wooster's tournament alive on Tuesday vs. Allegheny.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on February 27, 2011, 10:02:58 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 27, 2011, 08:37:05 AM
I don't even work at Wooster, Old Scot. I went off because it is hit and run posts like yours that are immensely inaccurate (and riddled with spelling errors) that drag down this board lower than it already is. And your obsession with an insignificant media guide is also quite bizarre.

I never said people shouldn't be upset. I would be upset, and the way KiltedBryan expressed his disappointment without making you know what up as the cause of it was the mature way to approach it.

If you read any of my follow up posts, which apparently you didn't, you'd know the underlying reasons why this happened, and what you might be able to do to help. If this is as big of a deal as it must have been for you to make your post, then you'll do something. If not, then it obviously wasn't important enough to warrant your response in the first place.
So if your not a Woo employee, how do you know so much about the colleges inter politics? If you get your info 2nd and 3rd hand, we all know how that changes.
You must be an english teacher.Your always on me about my speling or spellen or speeling ......... heck with it.







Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 27, 2011, 12:21:03 PM
Quote from: countyroad on February 27, 2011, 09:26:39 AM
Any idea of the cost of providing a video feed using the technology used by the benchmark schools?

Ustream is absolutely free to use. There would be some cost if you need to purchase a camera or if you need to upgrade the bandwidth in the gym (that part I think Wooster is fine on) or find a laptop that's good enough. Actually, for home games, a desktop computer would provide more power and would be portable enough, I'd think.

You could pay to use another service, but Ustream is acceptable, at least.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on February 27, 2011, 02:48:54 PM
So the committee has all the data in front of them.  Is it a rule they follow all the numbers or is it only there to help them make a decision?  If not a rule would the fact that Mac Petty is retiring help Wabash's chance?  Just asking, personally I am not optimistic at this point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2011, 03:22:32 PM
The committee is required to use the primary and secondary selection criteria (win %, SOS, etc.) to make their decision.  The rules do not stipulate how those criteria are used (i.e. weighted), but they are not supposed to deviate from the criteria for reasons of reputation or nostalgia.  If Wabash gets a bid, it'll be because the criteria are being weighed in their favor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on February 27, 2011, 03:55:41 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 27, 2011, 03:22:32 PM
The committee is required to use the primary and secondary selection criteria (win %, SOS, etc.) to make their decision.  The rules do not stipulate how those criteria are used (i.e. weighted), but they are not supposed to deviate from the criteria for reasons of reputation or nostalgia.  If Wabash gets a bid, it'll be because the criteria are being weighed in their favor.

Thanks David
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 27, 2011, 10:26:37 PM
Some possibilities on teams that Wooster could find in its section of the NCAA bracket:

Marietta (OAC - Pool A)
Hope (MIAA - Pool A)
Bethany (PRAC - Pool A)
Manchester (HCAC - Pool A)
LaRoche (AMCC - Pool A) - may get shipped East?
Centre (SCAC - Pool A) - may stay in the South?
Benedictine (NATHC - Pool A) - may stay in the Midwest?

Penn State Behrend (If they are Pool C)
Hanover (If they are Pool C)
Wittenberg (If they are Pool C)
Wabash (If they are Pool C)

The NCAA usually will not match teams from the same conference until the 3rd round.  The NCAA will select the highly ranked teams to host in the 1st/2nd round.  Among the first group of 7 teams above, Marietta and Hope have the best chance of hosting in addition to Wooster.

So, two possible 1st/2nd round pods could be:

Penn State Behrend at Wooster (Host team)
Manchester vs. Bethany

Witt or Wabash vs. Marietta (Host team)
Hanover vs. Hope

The disclaimer is that the matchups will depend on who gets all the Pool C bids nationally and how the NCAA can then fill out the brackets while minimizing the potential travel costs (bus rides if less than 500 miles).  Recall that the NCAA shipped a Pool C team (Wisconsin Whitewater all the way to Wooster last year).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on February 28, 2011, 12:12:12 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 27, 2011, 10:26:37 PM
The NCAA usually will not match teams from the same conference until the 3rd round.  The NCAA will select the highly ranked teams to host in the 1st/2nd round.  Among the first group of 7 teams above, Marietta and Hope have the best chance of hosting in addition to Wooster.

Ha, sorry I had to chuckle at that section. At least for those of us who observe the MIAA, that isn't the case. I'm pretty sure that of all the times Calvin and Hope made the same tournament, the only time they didn't meet within round 1 or 2 was 1995 when they each lost the first game (and would have met in the second round, I believe). In 2005, Albion and Calvin were split far enough to meet in the Elite 8, but that was the exception to the rule. I think that is part of the limitation from placing your conference on a peninsula though so this consideration may hold more true for OH teams. 

Hope's women would theoretically get preference in hosting before the men would get it. They did lose their last game, but that was also only their second loss. Based on resume alone, I wouldn't expect the men to host if the women are passed over. That is a reason it's nice to have the shiny new arena, but it isn't as if tCOW can't seat nearly as many people as Hope can. As usual, if we can't play at home, I'll be hoping for a reason to road trip down to Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 28, 2011, 10:13:40 AM
I hope that Witt gets a bid to the tournament, just for the sake for all of the turmoil and injuries they've had to overcome this year, it'd be a fitting end.

I was in attendance Saturday night up at Wooster, while it was a very competitive game, Wooster's outside shooting and driving to the hoop kept Witt at bay and Wittenberg not shooting as well as the night before was def. the key factor.

While I don't think it had a direct outcome on the game, the officiating was subpar at best, very inconsistent i'd say. Especially on the touch fouls as one time down it'd be a foul and the next time down it'd be nothing. I think that's why Coach Brown was assessed with a technical very early in the game (well deserved I will say, however his point at being pissed was valid at the same time)

Good luck to Wooster in the tourney, hopefully you can have a filled gym for the NCAA as Saturday I was suprised to not have a sellout. If Witt can join you guys, maybe we'll have a Witt/Wooster IV.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2011, 10:57:08 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 28, 2011, 10:13:40 AM
Good luck to Wooster in the tourney, hopefully you can have a filled gym for the NCAA as Saturday I was suprised to not have a sellout.

Just from eyeballing the Wooster crowds over the last few years, my impression is that attendance at Timken has been slowly dropping.  Now, this year, no doubt some rough weather and the inconvenience of having to use the back entrance are certainly factors.  Still, for whatever reasons, even against Wittenberg in a tournament final, there was not a packed house.  The bulk of Wooster fans have always been older, and it just might be that as those people get even older and begin not to come, they are not being replaced.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 28, 2011, 11:16:08 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2011, 10:57:08 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 28, 2011, 10:13:40 AM
Good luck to Wooster in the tourney, hopefully you can have a filled gym for the NCAA as Saturday I was suprised to not have a sellout.

Just from eyeballing the Wooster crowds over the last few years, my impression is that attendance at Timken has been slowly dropping.  Now, this year, no doubt some rough weather and the inconvenience of having to use the back entrance are certainly factors.  Still, for whatever reasons, even against Wittenberg in a tournament final, there was not a packed house.  The bulk of Wooster fans have always been older, and it just might be that as those people get even older and begin not to come, they are not being replaced.

Or, as Breckinridge noted in his pregame, the $10 a ticket might have had something to do with it (more expensive than the NCAAs will charge). Plus the $5 for students, though I understand that the Wooster President's Office subsidized entrance for students so that they only had to pay $1. A similar thing happened last year, where the NCAC final was not a full house.

By contrast, I watched the end of the JCU-Marietta game, which was packed absolutely to the gills and had a tremendous atmosphere. Adult tickets $7, seniors $5, OAC students free, and non-OAC school students $2.

Wooster still had more total fans in the gym, since Timken has about twice the capacity of Marietta's gym, but I still think cost was a factor for the NCAC final.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 28, 2011, 11:16:30 AM
Don't underestimate the impact the $10 ticket price is having on the NCAC Tournament attendance. For two years in a row, there was nearly 1,000 more people that showed up for the Wooster-Wittenberg regular season game at Wooster than showed up for the NCAC championship. The first meeting this year was only about 100 people short of a sellout, and this was on a night with temperatures in the single digits. To get a sense of how out of whack the ticket prices are for the NCAC Tournament, tickets for the NCAA Tournament opening two rounds at Wooster last year was $6.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2011, 11:32:26 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2011, 10:57:08 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 28, 2011, 10:13:40 AM
Good luck to Wooster in the tourney, hopefully you can have a filled gym for the NCAA as Saturday I was suprised to not have a sellout.



Just from eyeballing the Wooster crowds over the last few years, my impression is that attendance at Timken has been slowly dropping.  Now, this year, no doubt some rough weather and the inconvenience of having to use the back entrance are certainly factors.  Still, for whatever reasons, even against Wittenberg in a tournament final, there was not a packed house.  The bulk of Wooster fans have always been older, and it just might be that as those people get even older and begin not to come, they are not being replaced.

I can't help but think the $10 ticket price has something to do with the lower attendance figures as well.  It's hard not to think that way when a little over a month ago there was almost a full house for the regular season game and Saturday saw almost 1000 fewer fans.  But, this year's final did outdraw last year's Witt/Woo tournament final by almost 500.  I think part of the problem this time of year is that high school tournament action is also starting up.  Also, some fans were probably drawn away by the Wooster/Orrville basketball game that also took place on Saturday. 

Justin Hallowell didn't seem to mind a 'smaller' crowd:

Quote from: Justin Hallowell"Every play, we feed off the energy in the crowd," said Hallowell. "It's the most fun game I've ever played in -- I'm sure they (Wittenberg) feel the same way."


Quote from: kiltedbryanBy contrast, I watched the end of the JCU-Marietta game, which was packed absolutely to the gills and had a tremendous atmosphere. Adult tickets $7, seniors $5, OAC students free, and non-OAC school students $2.

I wonder if the format of their tournament helps them to keep their ticket prices down?  With the NCAC tournament, I'm assuming the conference is footing the bill for travel and lodging during the tounament?  If so, the NCAC is paying hotel stays for 3 teams starting Thursday night and one of those teams needs 2 nights of lodging expenses.  With the new format in the OAC, I don't know if they would have to pay any lodging expenses as the tournament is broken up into Tuesday-Thursday-Saturday match-ups with the higher seeds serving as hosts each round.  Maybe the NCAC could look into this and save some money in the process?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 28, 2011, 12:07:29 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 28, 2011, 11:32:26 AM
I wonder if the format of their tournament helps them to keep their ticket prices down?  With the NCAC tournament, I'm assuming the conference is footing the bill for travel and lodging during the tounament?  If so, the NCAC is paying hotel stays for 3 teams starting Thursday night and one of those teams needs 2 nights of lodging expenses.  With the new format in the OAC, I don't know if they would have to pay any lodging expenses as the tournament is broken up into Tuesday-Thursday-Saturday match-ups with the higher seeds serving as hosts each round.  Maybe the NCAC could look into this and save some money in the process?

As a fan, I like that idea, giving two teams the chance to host semifinals; it's a shame that a lot of Wittenberg fans missed seeing the great semifinal game against Wabash, because it was played at a neutral site.  On the other hand, having the two semifinals together at one site can give the event a "big time" feel, provided there is a good crowd.  More importantly, the geographic spread of the NCAC makes it tougher to adopt the Tuesday/Thursday/Saturday format.  Imagine a Wabash or Depauw team seeded #5 making three trips east (potentially Allegheny, Wooster, Witt) and back in one week (or having to miss a full week of classes to avoid busing back and forth).  For the reason of travel, I don't see the NCAC taking on that format.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2011, 12:11:50 PM
Plus, the OAC schools don't have to worry about missed class time...(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fnoisen.com%2FSmileys%2Fcyna%2Fwhistling2.gif&hash=643df003478c141f36962cb121cdf374b22323c8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2011, 01:28:27 PM
Witt gets in, with a tough draw starting with LaRoche at Marietta.  Wabash stays home.  Wooster hosts.  Brackets are set up to make a potential Woo/Witt IV a sectional final, with Salem on the line.  If that game were to occur, it would probably be at Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2011, 01:29:03 PM
Wooster and Witt are in.  Wabash is out.

Wooster is hosting this weekend.  They will take on Benedictine (IL) in the first round.  The other game at the Wooster pod features Bethany taking on Manchester.

Witt is going to make the trek to Marietta.  Marietta will also be hosting the first and second round games and will face Centre.  And we will get to see how good LaRoche really is as they will be Witt's oppenent at Marietta.

While I was hoping to see Wooster get a bye, I can't complain with their draw.

Only real surprise team to make the tournament overall was IWU.  I'm really puzzled how the Titans managed to earn a pool C bid?!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2011, 01:40:47 PM
Looking at the brackets, it looks like Whitworth is the #1 seed in Wooster's section of the bracket.  Is there a possibility that Whitworth would host the sectionals in the round of 16 and the NCAA shipping 3 teams out to Washington?  I don't see it happening, especially with the close proximity of teams from the Marietta pod to Wooster,  but it would suck for Wooster if they won their pod this weekend to be rewared with a trip to Spokane?! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 28, 2011, 01:43:37 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 28, 2011, 01:40:47 PM
Looking at the brackets, it looks like Whitworth is the #1 seed in Wooster's section of the bracket.  Is there a possibility that Whitworth would host the sectionals in the round of 16 and the NCAA shipping 3 teams out to Washington?  I don't see it happening, especially with the close proximity of teams from the Marietta pod to Wooster,  but it would suck for Wooster if they won their pod this weekend to be rewared with a trip to Spokane?! 

It looks to me like they left that possibility open, but if two Ohio schools advance the NCAA would be foolish to fly 3 teams out to Washington.

Pretty wide ranging group of 16 teams

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2011, 02:00:38 PM
Everyone in Marietta's pod is within 500 miles of Wooster, and maybe everyone in Cabrini's pod is too (not sure off the top of my head where Hartwick is.)  If Wooster advances to the third round, I'd be quite surprised if they did not host.

Sucks to be Whitworth.

(Quick check of MapQuest:
Cabrini: 427 miles to Wooster
NJCU: 468
Hartwick: 474
SUNY-Purchase: 497)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 28, 2011, 02:07:08 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 28, 2011, 02:00:38 PM
Everyone in Marietta's pod is within 500 miles of Wooster, and maybe everyone in Cabrini's pod is too (not sure off the top of my head where Hartwick is.)  If Wooster advances to the third round, I'd be quite surprised if they did not host.

Sucks to be Whitworth.

Per google maps (I know - not official)
Cabrini - 449
NJ City - 466
SUNY Purchase - 494
Hartwick (Oneonta, NY) - 470

Looks to me like the NCAA's plan is to have round 3/4 in Wooster.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WLCALUM83 on February 28, 2011, 02:09:52 PM
Wooster followers:

Here are the stats for Benedictine-IL:

http://northernac.org/web-2010/sports/basketball_men/statistics/2010-11/bu.htm

(Snelling got boatloads of rebounds in the NAthCon tournament--Green and Tribble provide quickness-Licht, Brown, and Genslinger are talls who can shoot.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on February 28, 2011, 02:11:54 PM
Well, now that the drama's over and can leave a painful itch behind  :D, it's back to fly-tying, a week on the Zambezi on 3/7, and Bulls/Stormers (real football, Afrikaaner style) at Loftus Versfeld on the 19th.  Hope the NCAC produces a decent showing for y'all.  

Thanks, Coach Mac - best wishes with your retirement.  It was an entertaining year, LGs. WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2011, 02:16:54 PM
I see Derek beat me to it.  At least we know that Google Maps and MapQuest substantially agree!  Of course, that doesn't mean the NCAA will agree.  And if Whitworth ends up hosting the sectional, I don't think we can complain, as they are pretty clearly the top seed.  It would be a nice step forward for the NCAA to fly three teams within 500 miles of each other to Spokane because of seeding. 

Of course, they'd have to fly them on Pig's Wings Airlines. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2011, 02:25:56 PM
Looks like Wabash was at the table (http://www.ncaa.com/rankings/basketball-men/d3) when the selection was complete.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 28, 2011, 06:07:06 PM
That's all you can ask for, to be considered.

Eastern Mennonite didn't make it - so I can't complain too much about Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 06:43:42 PM
I would be curious to see a résumé comparison of IWU and Wabash.  I'd like to know what IWU has that trumps Wabash's better regional win percentage and 4 wins vs. RR'd teams.  

Selection business aside, this Wabash team deserves a great deal of applause for having put together a very fine season.  They won 20 games and they defeated teams ranked #1 and #2.  This group of players has positioned Wabash well for the future...I believe this is a pretty attractive opening right now and should draw some significant national interest.  

But before I get too far ahead, I would be remiss to not spend a second to say thank you to Mac Petty for his 35 years of service to the program and to the College.  I wish Coach Petty all the best in the next phase of his life and am grateful for the chance to have covered at least a tiny part of his career.  Thanks again, Coach!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 28, 2011, 07:05:26 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 06:43:42 PM
I would be curious to see a résumé comparison of IWU and Wabash.  I'd like to know what IWU has that trumps Wabash's better regional win percentage and 4 wins vs. RR'd teams.  

Selection business aside, this Wabash team deserves a great deal of applause for having put together a very fine season.  They won 20 games and they defeated teams ranked #1 and #2.  This group of players has positioned Wabash well for the future...I believe this is a pretty attractive opening right now and should draw some significant national interest.  

But before I get too far ahead, I would be remiss to not spend a second to say thank you to Mac Petty for his 35 years of service to the program and to the College.  I wish Coach Petty all the best in the next phase of his life and am grateful for the chance to have covered at least a tiny part of his career.  Thanks again, Coach!

First, a clarification - I too think Wabash deserved a spot, and was surprised (stunned!) that IWU got in.  But just as I pointed out on the ODAC board (where I think EMU got the shaft), I'm sick of IWU always being singled out as the 'bad guy'. 

(Around the various boards, I swear there is more discussion, always negative, about IWU than any other two teams in the country! :o)

In EMU's case, the criticism was particularly unfair - EMU never even reached the table, since they were (erroneously, imo) regionally-ranked behind Ferrum, who went unselected.  In the case of Wabash, you've got a logical gripe since they appear to have been at the table at the same time.  BUT, imo ANY of these three (IWU, EMU, and 'bash) would be significant favorites over at least 5-6 of the Pool C teams selected before them.  The selections are what they are and we can't do anything about it, but the constant singling out of IWU is unfair.  (Carleton backers are also doing it - and I think they too have a gripe - so not picking on you specifically, but why always IWU?)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 07:21:09 PM
Ypsi, I've got nothing against IWU.  I'd be curious to see the comparison between Wabash and any 8-loss team that received an invitation.  It's just coincidence that in this specific instance, the identity of that team is IWU. 

Ultimately, the system's flaw is the over dependence on regionality and the regional rankings.  In this regard, I think the D-I method of at-large selection is superior, specifically their attention to quality wins which I have always believed should be one of the most, if not the most important way to separate teams in the at-large pool.  Especially for teams toward the end of that at-large pool...if a team is at the end of the at-large pool, we can be sure that they've probably lost a game or two that they shouldn't have.  It should matter that you've shown ability to beat tournament caliber teams. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 28, 2011, 07:34:59 PM
Great to see two ncac teams make it in.  I guess that Denison game might have been a deciding factor for Wabash.  Too bad would have loved too see three in. Just wondering is there a place I can post pictures from the wooster - wittenberg game saturday night? I take  pictures every where I go and I took about 30 saturday.


david
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 07:39:25 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 28, 2011, 07:34:59 PM
Great to see two ncac teams make it in.  I guess that Denison game might have been a deciding factor for Wabash.  Too bad would have loved too see three in. Just wondering is there a place I can post pictures from the wooster - wittenberg game saturday night? I take  pictures every where I go and I took about 30 saturday.


david

Denison, the 1 pointer to Wooster, the 1 pointer to Witt, or the 2 pointer to Witt...any of those games going the other way has Wabash in the tournament.  Just one too many near misses for the LGs. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2011, 07:45:33 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 07:39:25 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 28, 2011, 07:34:59 PM
Great to see two ncac teams make it in.  I guess that Denison game might have been a deciding factor for Wabash.  Too bad would have loved too see three in. Just wondering is there a place I can post pictures from the wooster - wittenberg game saturday night? I take  pictures every where I go and I took about 30 saturday.


david

Denison, the 1 pointer to Wooster, the 1 pointer to Witt, or the 2 pointer to Witt...any of those games going the other way has Wabash in the tournament.  Just one too many near misses for the LGs.  

Yes, but ultimately, Denison was a game teams on the bubble can't afford to lose.  And unfortunately for Wabash, the team they were competitng for out of the NCAC for that C bid beat them 2 out of 3 times.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 07:54:14 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 28, 2011, 07:45:33 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 07:39:25 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 28, 2011, 07:34:59 PM
Great to see two ncac teams make it in.  I guess that Denison game might have been a deciding factor for Wabash.  Too bad would have loved too see three in. Just wondering is there a place I can post pictures from the wooster - wittenberg game saturday night? I take  pictures every where I go and I took about 30 saturday.


david

Denison, the 1 pointer to Wooster, the 1 pointer to Witt, or the 2 pointer to Witt...any of those games going the other way has Wabash in the tournament.  Just one too many near misses for the LGs.  

Yes, but ultimately, Denison was a game teams on the bubble can't afford to lose.  And unfortunately for Wabash, the team they were competitng for out of the NCAC for that C bid beat them 2 out of 3 times.  

They weren't competing against just Wittenberg for a spot.  Wittenberg was rightly placed ahead of Wabash per the criteria.  What I'm curious about is IWU vs. Wabash based on the criteria.  

And losing to Denison is what gets you on the bubble in the first place.  You aren't on the bubble unless you've lost a game or two that you shouldn't have.  Every team left toward the end of the process has a bad loss or two. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 28, 2011, 08:54:29 PM
I don't quite understand it either, Wally.  The loss to Denison was on their home court and admittedly it was a lucky buzzer beater.  The other three losses were to ranked teams that made the tournament and were just by a handful of points total.

IWU lost eight total.  One was to University of Chicago by eight, a team with a record almost as bad as Denison that Denison beat.  North Park is no great team, and Augustana pounded IWU in their last outing. 

I think the tournament is worse off for not having three NCAC teams in it.  Wabash should be in it too in my opinion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2011, 09:13:08 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 06:43:42 PM
I would be curious to see a résumé comparison of IWU and Wabash.  I'd like to know what IWU has that trumps Wabash's better regional win percentage and 4 wins vs. RR'd teams.

Imported from the Pool C board, with emphasis added:
Quote from: Titan Q on February 28, 2011, 04:26:52 PM
So assuming IWU was team #18, the final data for the final group at the table was...

(In-region winning %/In-region SOS/Record vs ranked teams)

* Illinois Wesleyan (MW): .692/.543/2-2
* St. Joseph's LI (Atl): .769/.504/3-4
* Stevens (E): .731/.512/2-2
* Wabash (GL): .760/.499/4-3
* Leb Valley (Mid Atl): .720/.509/2-3
* Eastern Conn (NE): .680/.526/1-6
* Ferrum (S): .800/.471/1-3
* Carleton (W): .750/.528/5-4


It looks like the national committee used SOS in determining #18.



That difference in SOS is enormous, and seemingly decisive.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 09:48:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 28, 2011, 09:13:08 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 06:43:42 PM
I would be curious to see a résumé comparison of IWU and Wabash.  I'd like to know what IWU has that trumps Wabash's better regional win percentage and 4 wins vs. RR'd teams.

Imported from the Pool C board, with emphasis added:
Quote from: Titan Q on February 28, 2011, 04:26:52 PM
So assuming IWU was team #18, the final data for the final group at the table was...

(In-region winning %/In-region SOS/Record vs ranked teams)

* Illinois Wesleyan (MW): .692/.543/2-2
* St. Joseph's LI (Atl): .769/.504/3-4
* Stevens (E): .731/.512/2-2
* Wabash (GL): .760/.499/4-3
* Leb Valley (Mid Atl): .720/.509/2-3
* Eastern Conn (NE): .680/.526/1-6
* Ferrum (S): .800/.471/1-3
* Carleton (W): .750/.528/5-4


It looks like the national committee used SOS in determining #18.



That difference in SOS is enormous, and seemingly decisive.

Also enormous is the difference in win percentage and quality wins.  PSU-B was selected despite a weak SOS.  This is where the process is flawed.  The national committee should be ranking teams independent of the regional committees, because based on this decision, PSU-B would not have been nearly as high on the list as they were. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2011, 10:27:20 PM
The difference between WPs of .692 and .760 is not nearly as big as between SOSs of .543 and .499.  KnightSlappy does a better job of explaining this than I do (and he has the data at his fingertips, while mine is tucked away in a faulty memory), but to simplify things, WPs essentially range from .000 to 1.000, or in the real world to about .960 (24-1).  Both .760 and .692 are at the upper end of that scale, in the top quartile at least.  It's the high WP that gets you into the conversation in the first place.  SOSs range basically from above .400 to below .600.  .499 is below the median, while .543 is very near the top.  IWU played a much tougher schedule than Wabash, at least according to the way the NCAA evaluates things. 

I don't think IWU should have gotten a bid, either, but I can see why they got selected over Wabash (which was your original question, before Behrend somehow got into the mix.)  If anyone on that list got screwed, it was Carleton.  St. Joe's also has a stronger argument than Wabash based on the numbers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 10:40:35 PM
I was simply using PSU-B as an example of how the SOS trumps everything else argument doesn't hold a ton of water.  Based on the list provided here, I would select in order: Carleton, Wabash (I prefer the extra win over the slight SOS advantage over St. Josephs), St. Josephs, and then IWU. 

What's exposed here is that the regional committees are applying the criteria in a different manner than the national committee.  Which by itself isn't a problem until the national committee starts using those regional lists to prioritize the teams available for selection.  Once that happens, the order by which the national committee should be picking teams based on the way that national committee chooses to apply the criteria is compromised.  That's all. 

I also think it's a cop out by the committees (all of them) to view a result over one regionally ranked team exactly the same as another.  Wabash's wins over Wooster and Randolph Macon should carry more weight than their wins against Witt or Hanover or any of the wins that IWU has. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: djabs7 on February 28, 2011, 11:08:18 PM
I figured I'd post this here so Wooster fans can see it, because I don't know how many Witt fans will want to. Highlights from Saturday's NCAC championship:

http://bcove.me/67t09yjg (http://bcove.me/67t09yjg)

Another video: Chris Sullivan's record night, a compilation of 3-pointers.

http://bcove.me/adpyuzcs (http://bcove.me/adpyuzcs)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 28, 2011, 11:17:24 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 10:40:35 PM
I was simply using PSU-B as an example of how the SOS trumps everything else argument doesn't hold a ton of water.  Based on the list provided here, I would select in order: Carleton, Wabash (I prefer the extra win over the slight SOS advantage over St. Josephs), St. Josephs, and then IWU. 

What's exposed here is that the regional committees are applying the criteria in a different manner than the national committee.  Which by itself isn't a problem until the national committee starts using those regional lists to prioritize the teams available for selection.  Once that happens, the order by which the national committee should be picking teams based on the way that national committee chooses to apply the criteria is compromised.  That's all. 

I also think it's a cop out by the committees (all of them) to view a result over one regionally ranked team exactly the same as another.  Wabash's wins over Wooster and Randolph Macon should carry more weight than their wins against Witt or Hanover or any of the wins that IWU has. 

I can agree with this 'subjectivity' ONLY if you can agree there should be a premium (not huge, but somewhat) on WHEN a game is played.  The NCC team that IWU went 2-1 against in 2011 (when they went 11-4 and took first seed in the CCIW tourney) was NOT the 4-7 NCC team of 2010 that kept them from ever being regionally ranked! :)

And BTW, "any of the wins that IWU has" would include beating Augie. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2011, 11:21:19 PM
Wow, thanks David!  That Woo/Witt highlight video is terrific; in fact, both are.  Wooster should give you a contract to do the live video for all their games. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 11:31:56 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 28, 2011, 11:17:24 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 10:40:35 PM
I was simply using PSU-B as an example of how the SOS trumps everything else argument doesn't hold a ton of water.  Based on the list provided here, I would select in order: Carleton, Wabash (I prefer the extra win over the slight SOS advantage over St. Josephs), St. Josephs, and then IWU. 

What's exposed here is that the regional committees are applying the criteria in a different manner than the national committee.  Which by itself isn't a problem until the national committee starts using those regional lists to prioritize the teams available for selection.  Once that happens, the order by which the national committee should be picking teams based on the way that national committee chooses to apply the criteria is compromised.  That's all. 

I also think it's a cop out by the committees (all of them) to view a result over one regionally ranked team exactly the same as another.  Wabash's wins over Wooster and Randolph Macon should carry more weight than their wins against Witt or Hanover or any of the wins that IWU has. 

I can agree with this 'subjectivity' ONLY if you can agree there should be a premium (not huge, but somewhat) on WHEN a game is played.  The NCC team that IWU went 2-1 against in 2011 (when they went 11-4 and took first seed in the CCIW tourney) was NOT the 4-7 NCC team of 2010 that kept them from ever being regionally ranked! :)

And BTW, "any of the wins that IWU has" would include beating Augie. ;)

Ah, my fault there.  I missed the Augustana win during my glance at the schedule. 

As for North Central, I mean 15-11 is 15-11.  There's only so much anybody can do to polish that record up.  Maybe the best 15-11 team ever...but 15-11 still. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 28, 2011, 11:42:02 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 11:31:56 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 28, 2011, 11:17:24 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 28, 2011, 10:40:35 PM
I was simply using PSU-B as an example of how the SOS trumps everything else argument doesn't hold a ton of water.  Based on the list provided here, I would select in order: Carleton, Wabash (I prefer the extra win over the slight SOS advantage over St. Josephs), St. Josephs, and then IWU. 

What's exposed here is that the regional committees are applying the criteria in a different manner than the national committee.  Which by itself isn't a problem until the national committee starts using those regional lists to prioritize the teams available for selection.  Once that happens, the order by which the national committee should be picking teams based on the way that national committee chooses to apply the criteria is compromised.  That's all. 

I also think it's a cop out by the committees (all of them) to view a result over one regionally ranked team exactly the same as another.  Wabash's wins over Wooster and Randolph Macon should carry more weight than their wins against Witt or Hanover or any of the wins that IWU has. 

I can agree with this 'subjectivity' ONLY if you can agree there should be a premium (not huge, but somewhat) on WHEN a game is played.  The NCC team that IWU went 2-1 against in 2011 (when they went 11-4 and took first seed in the CCIW tourney) was NOT the 4-7 NCC team of 2010 that kept them from ever being regionally ranked! :)

And BTW, "any of the wins that IWU has" would include beating Augie. ;)

Ah, my fault there.  I missed the Augustana win during my glance at the schedule. 

As for North Central, I mean 15-11 is 15-11.  There's only so much anybody can do to polish that record up.  Maybe the best 15-11 team ever...but 15-11 still. 

In one sense I would agree with you.  But when a team starts 3 frosh and a soph, I assume you can understand that their 2nd half might be radically different from their first half.

My contention is that IWU might have an additional 2-1 record against regionally-ranked teams if later results counted more than earlier results.  At this point NCC is better than some of the ranked teams.  But they don't factor in time of the year, so it is what it is.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 01, 2011, 12:22:14 AM
The issue here is that while D-3 is promoting in-region games, it leaves teams like EMU, Carleton and Wabash on the table and takes a PSU - Behrend.

Not to say that any of those three would win the Walnut & Bronze, but at least they should have a chance. Two of those three were in the Top 15 most of the season.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 01, 2011, 10:24:08 AM
Great video djabs. 

I really enjoyed that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2011, 03:12:25 PM
Wooster's Ian Franks is one of the ten finalists for the Josten's Trophy (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2011/03/jostens-finalists-named), an award which recognizes D3's most outstanding player, taking into account academic success and community service as well as achievements on the basketball court.  Just to be nominated is a tremendous honor.  The overall winner will be announced in Salem on March 17, immediately prior to the Final Four.  Congratulations, Ian!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 01, 2011, 04:26:51 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 01, 2011, 03:12:25 PM
Wooster's Ian Franks is one of the ten finalists for the Josten's Trophy (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2011/03/jostens-finalists-named), an award which recognizes D3's most outstanding player, taking into account academic success and community service as well as achievements on the basketball court.  Just to be nominated is a tremendous honor.  The overall winner will be announced in Salem on March 17, immediately prior to the Final Four.  Congratulations, Ian!

I echo David's sentiments.  Congrats Ian on just the honor of being named to the 10 finalists for the Jostens Trophy! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 01, 2011, 08:37:40 PM
I need some help from the members of this fine forum. I have a choice of three locations on Friday night. Marietta, Wooster , or OXford(my OU Bocats against the hated Redhawks). Which one should I go too? Please help, this is a tough choice to make.

David
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 01, 2011, 08:45:51 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on March 01, 2011, 08:37:40 PM
I need some help from the members of this fine forum. I have a choice of three locations on Friday night. Marietta, Wooster , or OXford(my OU Bocats against the hated Redhawks). Which one should I go too? Please help, this is a tough choice to make.

David

I have to say Wooster.  Get up there early and get some good dinner from Coccia House. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 01, 2011, 11:15:18 PM
Quote from: countyroad on March 01, 2011, 08:45:51 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on March 01, 2011, 08:37:40 PM
I need some help from the members of this fine forum. I have a choice of three locations on Friday night. Marietta, Wooster , or OXford(my OU Bocats against the hated Redhawks). Which one should I go too? Please help, this is a tough choice to make.

David

I have to say Wooster.  Get up there early and get some good dinner from Coccia House. ;)

Well, this is a D3hoops forum so I doubt you're going to get too many votes for the OU/Miami game.   ;)

Of course, I'm partial to the Wooster game, but I've heard Marietta has been playing to packed houses and it sounds like a pretty good atmosphere to catch a game.  I'd say you can't go wrong at either Marietta or Wooster.   Although, I'd almost think Marietta's atmosphere will be a bit more electric because they haven't experienced post-season basketball for some time.  Wooster's games can get to be loud, but I just don't think Timken will be as electric as what you could see in Marietta. 

One thing to take note of at Wooster is that the Wooster students won't be on spring break as they have in years past when Wooster has hosted NCAA games so it will be nice to have a student section in the house.  I saw where they are going to get into the games free this weekend as well as the President is footing the bill once again to allow free admittance for Wooster students.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2011, 02:50:20 AM
I think the Marietta pod has the better matchups, so if I didn't have rooting interest in a particular team, I'd probably go there.  But why not make the longer trip up to Holland MI and cheer on the Denison Big Red women?  That pod's got everything you need: four teams all ranked in the top 12 nationally, both teams from last year's national championship game, an advance look at Denison's top challenger in the NCAC starting next year, and of course a 28-0 DU squad.  I'd definitely go there if it were within 2000 miles of my current location.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on March 02, 2011, 04:06:08 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 02, 2011, 02:50:20 AMThat pod's got everything you need: four teams all ranked in the top 12 nationally, both teams from last year's national championship game, an advance look at Denison's top challenger in the NCAC starting next year, and of course a 28-0 DU squad.  I'd definitely go there if it were within 2000 miles of my current location.

Heck, what's an additional, 248 miles (and a bit of delay around the greater Gary, IN metroplex  :D), from The Fly Shop parking lot to DeVos   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 02, 2011, 09:10:24 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 01, 2011, 11:15:18 PM
One thing to take note of at Wooster is that the Wooster students won't be on spring break as they have in years past when Wooster has hosted NCAA games so it will be nice to have a student section in the house.  I saw where they are going to get into the games free this weekend as well as the President is footing the bill once again to allow free admittance for Wooster students.

The bagpipers will be there to bring out the team, which is a cool (though not quite as much so as at the football games).  Because of some other things happening on campus this weekend, I expect a better-than-usual atmosphere for a postseason game at Wooster on Friday night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2011, 09:22:59 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 02, 2011, 09:10:24 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 01, 2011, 11:15:18 PM
One thing to take note of at Wooster is that the Wooster students won't be on spring break as they have in years past when Wooster has hosted NCAA games so it will be nice to have a student section in the house.  I saw where they are going to get into the games free this weekend as well as the President is footing the bill once again to allow free admittance for Wooster students.

The bagpipers will be there to bring out the team, which is a cool (though not quite as much so as at the football games).  Because of some other things happening on campus this weekend, I expect a better-than-usual atmosphere for a postseason game at Wooster on Friday night.

Let's hope so!   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 02, 2011, 09:41:27 AM
But the big question is if we can't make it to Wooster will we be able to "see" via a computer........

Now, anyone have any insight on Laroche, Witts opponent?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2011, 10:57:57 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 02, 2011, 09:41:27 AM
Now, anyone have any insight on Laroche, Witts opponent?

Not as much insight as an opinion, but I think if Witt plays like they are capable of, I really see no reason the Tigers should lose this game.  Now, if Witt comes out and plays like they did the last week of the regular season, all bets are off.

LaRoche is a feel good story with how they have managed to forge on despite the death of their coach during the season and how the team has rallied to turn a tragedy into a positive.  But, with that said, until a team from the AMCC proves otherwise, I just don't see either of the AMCC representatives making it out of the first round.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2011, 12:52:54 PM
NCAC All-Conference Teams Announced (http://www2.northcoast.org/mbasketball/All-NCAC/2011)

Player of the Year: Ian Franks, Wooster (second consecutive year)
Newcomer of the Year: Aaron Stefanov, Hiram
Coach of the Year: Mike DeWitt, OWU

First Team:
Nathan Balch, Wooster
Clayton Black, Wittenberg
Tim Brady, OWU
Ian Franks, Wooster
Kodey Haddox, Kenyon (our poll voters got it right!)
Wes Smith, Wabash
Chris Sullivan, Wittenberg

Second Team:
Dimonde Hale, Denison
Justin Hallowell, Wooster
Marshall Morris, OWU
James Ness, Allegheny
Chris Roberts, Hiram
Bryan Wickliffe, Wooster
Andy Winters, OWU

Honorable Mention:
Alex Brandt, Wittenberg
Devone McLeod, Allegheny
Josh Merrritt, Oberlin
Brian Shelbourne, Wabash
Uros Vasiljevik, Kenyon

Congratulations to all!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 02, 2011, 03:01:57 PM
Congrats to all the players that made the all NCAC teams. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on March 02, 2011, 06:00:58 PM
Thank you!

Congrats to all NCAC players being honored!   Good luck to Wooster and Wittenberg in doing the NCAC proud in the tourney.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2011, 06:15:56 PM
Typo; fixed. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 02, 2011, 07:51:56 PM
Well the marietta games appear to be sold out already. I better check tomorrow with wooster too make sure tickets are available for those games. Thanks for the tips, it would be great to see the pipers again just like last week. Too bad the pipers can't come down off the hill for the football games anymore. Coming in through the stadium just doesn't have the same effect.

david
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 02, 2011, 08:19:07 PM
They'll be back coming down the hill again once the construction is done and the trailers are gone (I'm pretty sure that's the plan). It will be a more narrow space, but I'd be shocked if they don't at least march down the hill (they might not be able to line the hill like they have in the past).

http://www.wooster.edu/About-Wooster/rec_center/photos/photos
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 02, 2011, 09:01:11 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 02, 2011, 08:19:07 PM
They'll be back coming down the hill again once the construction is done and the trailers are gone (I'm pretty sure that's the plan). It will be a more narrow space, but I'd be shocked if they don't at least march down the hill (they might not be able to line the hill like they have in the past).

http://www.wooster.edu/About-Wooster/rec_center/photos/photos

As someone that has personally led the Scot Band on this march down the hill, my understanding has been that they will re-instate the practice.

It really should be fine from the band's perspective—we always actually marched down the hill in a narrow line, really expanding out across the practice field only when hitting the bottom of the hill, and I think most of that space will still be there, though I'm not sure what the final site will be like.

The football team won't have as much space to "line the hill" but I'm sure they'll figure something out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2011, 10:35:45 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on March 02, 2011, 07:51:56 PM
Well the marietta games appear to be sold out already. I better check tomorrow with wooster too make sure tickets are available for those games. Thanks for the tips, it would be great to see the pipers again just like last week. Too bad the pipers can't come down off the hill for the football games anymore. Coming in through the stadium just doesn't have the same effect.

david

As far as I know, Wooster wasn't selling pre-sale tix:

QuoteTicket Information: As determined by the NCAA, ticket prices for this weekend's first- and second-round action are $6 for adults and $3 for senior citizens, students, and children (under two are free). College of Wooster students, however, can be part of the excitement for free, courtesy of an underwriting by the president's office. Students must present their College ID to receive a ticket.

There will be no advanced ticket sales and the gates first open at 4 p.m. Friday. Also of note, artificial noisemakers are prohibited, and Wooster is calling for a "Gold Rush" on Friday night, encouraging fans to wear gold in support of the Scots.

I actually heard that you can get tickets as early as 3:30 in case you wanted to beat the rush.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on March 03, 2011, 05:47:48 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 02, 2011, 09:41:27 AM
But the big question is if we can't make it to Wooster will we be able to "see" via a computer........

Now, anyone have any insight on Laroche, Witts opponent?
Good question?
Maybe the college president should be putting $$$$$ toward updating Woo's video feed versus paying for student to see the game. I have no problem with defraying the  cost of student tickets but, don't tell me the college can't afford to upgrade the video system. Step into the 21st century.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 03, 2011, 11:10:45 PM
You know, usually adding that technology is part of an overall upgrade in the network infrastructure. And yes, it would be nice, but it has to fit into the College's strategic plans and needs.

Most all colleges and universities have cut back on many things that don't directly affect students, or are 'nice to have' instead of vital needs. I don't know Wooster's priorities, but if it's like many places it's about the classroom first.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2011, 04:35:02 PM
Betsy Mitchell is out as Allegheny AD (http://www.alleghenysports.com/news/2011/3/4/GEN_0304115055.aspx).  One year too late for Rob Clune.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 04, 2011, 05:30:47 PM
Wittenberg up at the half 42-26. Looking good and rebounding well from last Saturday's loss.

Big half by Micheal Cooper with 14 points and 6 rebounds, Sullivan has 0 points and Wittenberg is holding their own down low big time with big time hustle. Lots of wild shots forced for Laroche and bad shots overall
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jimmychitwood15 on March 04, 2011, 06:49:19 PM
Witt pulls out the win 74-68.

LaRoche fought back from being down as much as 22 early in the 2nd half.

Huge night from Michael Cooper with 23 pts & 10 rebs. Clayton Black was big with 22 pts. Brandt also added 12pts & 12 rebs. Sullivan held scoreless on 0-5 from downtown. Let's hope he returns to form tomorrow night!

Great win for the Tigers!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 04, 2011, 07:50:04 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 04, 2011, 04:35:02 PM
Betsy Mitchell is out as Allegheny AD (http://www.alleghenysports.com/news/2011/3/4/GEN_0304115055.aspx).  One year too late for Rob Clune.

QuoteFollowing close to five years as the Director of Athletics, Betsy Mitchell has decided to pursue other professional opportunities and personal interests.

Translation: F-I-R-E-D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 04, 2011, 08:31:17 PM
Marietta has a nice lead over Centre at the half, halfway to an enticing Witt/Marietta 2nd round game.


http://sidearmstats.com/marietta/mbball/index.htm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2011, 01:10:10 PM
Congratulations to Wooster and Wittenberg on the wins last night.

Wooster held off an athletic, skilled and balanced Benedictine team that refused to go away. Benedictine put five players in double figures.

A tough night for some of the Scots, especially Nathan Balch, who fouled out  ??? was called for a mythical travel late in the game, and only contributed 4 points. (FWIW, Balch hadn't fouled out this year, and only had 4 fouls called on him once in 28 games before last night.)

Game ball goes to Justin Hallowell, who had 19 pts on 4-8 shooting from the outside and a critical 5-5 from the line. He would've had an even better night if he hadn't gone 1-7 from 2pt land. I was also impressed with the minutes provided by freshman guards Snyder and Thorpe in helping fill the gap while Balch was on the bench in the first half.

Good luck to both NCAC squads tonight.  Let's Go Scot!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2011, 02:04:49 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2011, 01:10:10 PM
Game ball goes to Justin Hallowell, who had 19 pts on 4-8 shooting from the outside and a critical 5-5 from the line.

...and 15 rebounds!

Good luck to both W's tonight, both have very tough games on tap. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 05, 2011, 02:18:40 PM
What's everyone's take on tonight's Wooster game?   Why so little talk about it on the board?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2011, 02:32:04 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 05, 2011, 02:04:49 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2011, 01:10:10 PM
Game ball goes to Justin Hallowell, who had 19 pts on 4-8 shooting from the outside and a critical 5-5 from the line.

...and 15 rebounds!

Good luck to both W's tonight, both have very tough games on tap. 

Oh, right, yeah, and a career-high 15 boards. Minor detail.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 05, 2011, 03:50:26 PM
the game tonight between wittenberg and marietta could be a great one. That freshman guard for the pioneers(sorry can't remember his name)is tough and will be tough to handle. That duo inside I saw last week for wittenberg could make things very hard for marietta. Could be a classic.


david
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 05, 2011, 04:05:06 PM
I agree the Witt/Marietta game should be good....  I think if Witt plays like they are capable, they should win the game
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 05, 2011, 04:47:47 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2011, 01:10:10 PM
A tough night for some of the Scots, especially Nathan Balch, who fouled out  ??? was called for a mythical travel late in the game, and only contributed 4 points. (FWIW, Balch hadn't fouled out this year, and only had 4 fouls called on him once in 28 games before last night.)

I would look for Balch to have a big bounce back game tonight.  He could never get into the flow of the game and the way the officials were calling fouls on anyone guarding Green from BenU, I really don't know how you are supposed to guard him.  Thankfully, it doesn't appear that Manchester has anyone with the speed and athleticism Green had so I would guess Balch should be able to stay out of foul trouble tonight. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 05, 2011, 08:38:42 PM
too bad for the tigers but was that a great game or what? Great finish to the scott game also. Very exciting night indeed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2011, 08:41:37 PM
Manchester 45
Wooster 47
Final

Manchester misses a 3 at the buzzer. No one will want to watch the videotape of this one, but Wooster manages the mantra of "survive and advance."

Heck of a game at Marietta, too. Good season for Wittenberg and the great season keeps rolling for the Pioneers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 05, 2011, 09:14:10 PM
Hats off to Manchester for never saying die.  Wooster had multiple chances in the 2nd half to bury this team, but each and every time, Manchester had an answer.  The ultimate was Wooster up 7 with a minute to go.  After watching the Spartans miss 6 straight at the line, Ian Franks proceeds to draw a foul.  And he then misses BOTH of his leaving the door cracked ever so slightly.  Then, Manchester runs off 5 straight over the final minute and had the ball with a chance for the win.  They actually had two damn good looks at 3's for the win(especially the final shot) but the shots went begging!  What a game!  My heart can't take this much more.  

Marietta and Cabrini have already punched their ticket and Whitworth plays later tonight.  Outside of the very low probability of Whitworth being upset, the only question remains is where the round of 16 games will be played.  My money is on Wooster but we shall see...

Lastly, congrats to Justin Hallowell for surpassing 1,000 points tonight.  He is now the 4th player on Wooster's roster with 1,000 or more in their Wooster careers joining Franks, Wickliffe and Balch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 06, 2011, 01:07:23 AM
First, congrats to Witt and Wooster for representing the NCAC in a positive way. Close games can go either way, and this year it seems the tournament is just a crapshoot.

Second, I know Earlham is no longer "one of us", the Quake let Jeff Justis go.

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2011/03/earlham-coaches-out
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 06, 2011, 03:47:46 AM
Survive and Advance baby.... Let's go Wooster!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HopeConvert on March 06, 2011, 12:25:39 PM
Wooster hosting a sectional. Students start spring break on Friday, however.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 06, 2011, 12:44:39 PM
Quote from: HopeConvert on March 06, 2011, 12:25:39 PM
Wooster hosting a sectional. Students start spring break on Friday, however.

As derek pointed out on the OAC board, last year Wooster's spring break started a week earlier and fell during the first week of the tournament.  Wooster left the campus open for that first weekend allowing students the option of staying and watching those games.  Hopefully, that option will be available again this weekend!   :)

Regardless, I'm expecting there to be some large crowds at the games this weekend.  I would think Marietta will be bringing a large contingent up from southern Ohio so Friday's games should be in front of a packed house.  And if Wooster and Marietta happen to both win on Friday, look out!  :o   Saturday's crowd could be packed to the rafters!  On the flip side, if Wooster and Marietta both lose on Friday, you'll probably be able to hear crickets in Timken on Saturday! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 06, 2011, 01:07:09 PM
One of the questions discussed after last nights game was "When was the last time Wooster won a game with less than 50 points?". A quick look at the media shows Feb 14th 1996 against Kenyon (48-43). It's also the last time Wooster was under 50 win or lose. In other words - this does not happen often.

Watching the Manchester players come out of the locker room after the game to the applause of their families and fans was heartful. I'm sure they didn't sleep much last night knowing they had a great chance to advance.

Much credit to Manchester for playing a tough, disciplined game. For Wooster it was won with defense obviously. Manchester didn't even score until almost four minutes into the game and then it was only 2-2.

To me a key to the first half offensive struggles was that Wooster didn't make the 3-point shot part of their offense. Manchester obliged and crowded the lane, challenging every shot in the paint. In the second half you could tell coach Moore had told them to shoot 3's at halftime and it was just enough to loosen up the defense to allow players like Balch to hit some clutch jumpers.

Congratulations to Justin Hallowell for attaining 1000 points. To achieve this as a junior puts him in with some elite Wooster players. He was big this weekend, cleaning up the boards to limit the opponents to single shots.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on March 06, 2011, 01:07:30 PM
Great weekend for the Scots. Hopefully they can make the up coming weekend even better. Go Woo!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 06, 2011, 02:58:48 PM
So Wooster v Cabrini, how do these two teams match up against each other?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 06, 2011, 03:34:51 PM
Quote from: woolax on March 06, 2011, 02:58:48 PM
So Wooster v Cabrini, how do these two teams match up against each other?

Wooster should be a solid favorite in my estimation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 06, 2011, 03:43:29 PM
Cabrini is 24-5, they won their conference regular season and tournament titles. They have won 18 of their last 19 games.

They seem to do well in close games with 7 of those 18 wins coming by 7 points or less. They were down 13 at halftime of their last game and outscored SUNY-Purchase by 20 in the second half. The win was Cabrini's 28th straight at home since the start of the 2009-10 regular season. The Cavaliers are 44-2 at Nerney Field House.

It looks like they played 2 teams who made the NCAA Tournament during the season, Scranton and Gwynedd-Mercy.  Scranton beat them back on December 15th 77-64 @Scranton.  Cabrini swept Gwynedd-Mercy in three games (2 regular season and in the conference tournament finals with margin of victory increasing each game (86-83, 83-74 and 92-70).  Both Scranton and Gwynedd-Mercy lost in the 1st round of the tournament.

Cabrini Quick Facts:
Coach: Marcus Kahn
Conference: CSAC
Region: Mid-Atlantic
Enrollment: 1678
Location: Radnor, PA
Colors: Blue, Black, White

I'd be curious to hear about how they play and their lineup, etc... anyone have info?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 06, 2011, 07:58:43 PM
First, I have to un-remember the infamous apartment project in Chicago (The Cabrini Green) when talking about Cabrini.

According to Massey, Cabrini is 82nd in power and their SOS is 299th. Their conference isn't the strongest. It has Philly Bible, which went winless this year. Immaculata just recently went co-ed, so their program isn't as mature as others. Centenary (NJ), Rosemont and Baptist Bible are usually tomato cans.

Wooster should be favored by 10 or so, setting up an outstanding matchup against Whitworth or Marietta.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 06, 2011, 08:07:19 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 06, 2011, 07:58:43 PMCentenary (NJ), Rosemont and Baptist Bible are usually tomato cans.

I haven't heard that phrase in fifty years except in old boxing movies.  Always was one of my favorites. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 06, 2011, 08:39:27 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 06, 2011, 07:58:43 PM
Wooster should be favored by 10 or so, setting up an outstanding matchup against Whitworth or Marietta.

I understand this sentiment, but based on the way Wooster played over the weekend, they aren't breezing past anyone. The Scots of the NCAC Tournament semifinals and finals has given way, for the most, to the team of the last couple of weeks of the regular season. The intensity is certainly there, especially defensively, but the offensive execution is lacking right now. Manchester's defense certainly had something to do with it, but after opening up Saturday's game with an 11-2 lead, Wooster's offense was literally unwatchable for about the next 25 minutes. Hopefully the long week of practice can help them work some things out, and they can stop being so careless with their passes. It's amazing how many of their turnovers are unforced right now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 06, 2011, 09:07:09 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 06, 2011, 08:07:19 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 06, 2011, 07:58:43 PMCentenary (NJ), Rosemont and Baptist Bible are usually tomato cans.

I haven't heard that phrase in fifty years except in old boxing movies.  Always was one of my favorites. :)

WooBoo, you need to get around the boards more!  We use that expression pretty regularly on what I will forever call 'CCIW Chat'. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 07, 2011, 08:48:43 PM
Spent the past week in rural Virginia due to a family issue.  Unfortunately, I had no web/radio access to this past weekend's games and no D3 board posting ability. :(

So, let me add my belated congratulations to Wooster on making the Sweet Sixteen for the second year in a row! :)  This is also the 7th time in the last 13 seasons that the Scots have made the Sweet Sixteen which is indicative of the excellent Wooster coaching staff led by Steve Moore and Doug Cline!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 07, 2011, 09:22:46 PM
Quote from: Cali-Scot on March 06, 2011, 03:43:29 PM
Cabrini is 24-5, they won their conference regular season & tourny titles. They have won 18 of their last 19 games.

I'd be curious to hear about how they play and their lineup, etc... anyone have info?

Cabrini is 24-5 overall but they are 15-0 at home and only 8-5 in road games this season.

Likely Starters:
6'3" Dom Farrello, Sr.  17.9 ppg, 8.2 rpg, 57 made three pointers (38%)
5'10" Cory Lemons, So.  17.2 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 51.3% FG shooting, 6.2 assists/game
6'3" John Boyd, Jr.  12.6 ppg, 3.9 rpg, 48 made three pointers (34%)
6'4" Fran Rafferty, Fr.  8.4 ppg, 4.1 rpg
6'7" Goran Dulac, So. 7.7 ppg, 5.2 rpg

Key Reserves:
5'10" AJ Williams, 6.0 ppg, 1.8 rpg
6'6" Jon Miller, 3.5 ppg, 3.4 rpg
6'1" Lamar Fisher, 3.2 ppg, 2.5 rpg

Dom Farrello is the senior leader, top scorer and top rebounder.  Cory Lemons is a lightning quick point guard who shoots 51% from the floor while breaking down defenses and dishing out over 6 assists per game.

On the other hand, Cabrini has only an average road record at 8-5 and they are a short team with only 2 players that are taller than 6'4" on their roster.  Wooster may be able to do some damage inside vs this team.  I did read on another board that Cabrini plays three different zone defenses...probably to offset their short lineup so good outside shooting by Wooster will also be important in this game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2011, 10:21:58 PM
Here's a link to Wooster's Sectional Tournament information page. (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/ncaa/sectional/index)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 08, 2011, 12:22:00 AM
Good info wooscotsfan, thanks for sharing.   Hopefully Cabrini will end the season 8-6 on the road after Friday's game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: mailsy on March 08, 2011, 11:05:57 AM
 
Quote from: Cali-Scot on March 08, 2011, 12:22:00 AM
Good info wooscotsfan, thanks for sharing.   Hopefully Cabrini will end the season 8-6 on the road after Friday's game!

As a Cavs fan.  I know that there could be a sixth loss.  Just hoping that it's not Friday.  Though if you look at it seems that Cabrini doesn't have a chance.  But, that's why they play the game.  :)

GO CAVS!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 09, 2011, 06:01:20 PM
One of the two coaches at the NABC Div. III All-Star game (http://www.alleghenysports.com/news/2011/3/8/MBB_0308114444.aspx), to be held in Salem prior to the National Championship game on Sat. Mar. 19, will be Allegheny legend Phil Ness.  Ness, who retired in 2002 as Allegheny's all-time winningest head coach, and who led the Gators to a share of the 1992-93 NCAC title (the last team other than Wooster or Wittenberg to win the league), will coach the East squad in the All-Star game.  Unfortunately, he won't be coaching his son, second-team All-NCAC post James Ness, as Ness fils is just a junior, and the All-Star game is restricted to seniors.

Ness is presently a Major Gifts Officer at 'Gheny, but I hear there's an opening in the department of athletics....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 09, 2011, 06:13:54 PM
Ok, where do we vote?  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 09, 2011, 08:33:59 PM
well my youngest daughter is due with my second grandchild(first grandson) on saturday. Should I make the trip to wooster on friday night? Might have to flip a coin on this one.

david
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 09, 2011, 09:02:42 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on March 09, 2011, 08:33:59 PM
well my youngest daughter is due with my second grandchild(first grandson) on saturday. Should I make the trip to wooster on friday night? Might have to flip a coin on this one.

david

Come.  Bring her with you.  We have a hospital here. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 10, 2011, 07:23:30 AM
Good morning.

Here's an article from today's DR.

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4996537
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on March 10, 2011, 09:51:52 PM
Hey guys, first post here so forgive me.

I the Assistant GM of WCWS-FM (WOO 91), Wooster's student-run radio. We've been recoding over the past few weeks a segment called "More with Moore" where we sit Coach down for about a half hour and just ask him some questions. We recorded one this morning where we spent the entire time recapping Wooster's tourney wins and a lot of the time previewing Cabrini. You can find the link here, as I hope it provides some more insight into the game tomorrow night: http://i.mixcloud.com/CSSGi

Thanks, and go Scots!

Jason
Assistant GM, WCWS
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: mailsy on March 10, 2011, 10:51:19 PM
Quote from: woo91 on March 10, 2011, 09:51:52 PM
Hey guys, first post here so forgive me.

I the Assistant GM of WCWS-FM (WOO 91), Wooster's student-run radio. We've been recoding over the past few weeks a segment called "More with Moore" where we sit Coach down for about a half hour and just ask him some questions. We recorded one this morning where we spent the entire time recapping Wooster's tourney wins and a lot of the time previewing Cabrini. You can find the link here, as I hope it provides some more insight into the game tomorrow night: http://i.mixcloud.com/CSSGi

Thanks, and go Scots!

Jason
Assistant GM, WCWS
Very good interview.  Thank you.  Got some incite on your team.   :) +1
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 10, 2011, 11:44:19 PM
Jason, I've listened to all of the "More with Moore" segments (except I haven't gotten to this one yet), and they are all excellent.  Steve Moore is often a very difficult interview, and you do a better job with him than any other interviewer I've heard.  This is a very good and valuable segment, and I hope you and WCWS will continue it next season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash Always Fight on March 11, 2011, 01:21:11 PM
Good success to Wooster this weekend!  Win it all for the conference!!!! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 11, 2011, 05:10:40 PM
Story about Cabrini guards.

http://www.delcotimes.com/articles/2011/03/10/sports/doc4d79a9cb8fec8108329540.txt
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 11, 2011, 07:26:41 PM
Looks like Whitworth had little trouble with Marietta tonight

with 9 seconds to go....

Whitworth 93
Marietta 77
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 11, 2011, 08:09:12 PM
Wooster up 10 with 8 min to go in 1st half.  Scots shooting the lights out from 3pt range!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 11, 2011, 08:33:29 PM
Scots up 48-36 at Half-Time.

I believe the Scots biggest lead was 17
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 11, 2011, 09:10:57 PM
Scots up 20 points (76-56) with 5:46 to go!

Let's go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 11, 2011, 09:46:31 PM
Wooster wins 94-77!  Congrats to the Scots on making the elite eight

Gonna be a great game tomorrow night against #1 ranked Whitworth
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 11, 2011, 09:49:02 PM
Congratualtions to coach Moore and Scots for advancing to the Elite Eight. I thought they did a good job of avoiding the trap. Their dominance on the boards was the big difference.

I watched the first game and they are going to have to play even better to defeat the Pirates.

I posted this last year and I get to do it again. I hesitated to mention at all this year because I thought it would be nearly impossible to accomplish, but here it is:

1996-1997   23-6   Four year running record   86-24
1997-1998   22-6                                             90-22
1998-1999   25-4                                             89-23
1999-2000   26-3                                             96-19
2000-2001   24-4                                             97-17
2001-2002   21-7                                             96-18
2002-2003   30-3                                           101-17
2003-2004   26-4                                           101-18
2004-2005   27-3                                           104-17
2005-2006   26-4                                           109-14
2006-2007   29-5                                           108-16
2007-2008   23-5                                           105-17
2008-2009   23-7                                           101-21
2009-2010   25-5                                           100-22
2010-2011   29-2 and counting                      100-20

For the ninth straight season we have a senior class with 100 wins. I think this is even more impressive than the 15 year 20+ win streak

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 11, 2011, 11:06:56 PM
Back from Timken where I watched the Scots notch a nice win vs. Cabrini! :)

Congratulations to Wooster on making the Elite Eight again!

Here are a few reasons why the Scots won tonight:
1.  Outrebounded smaller Cabrini team 39 to 20
2.  Scored inside with Senior Bryan Wickliffe 23 points & Sophomore Josh Claytor 15 points
3.  Shot 61% from the floor and 50% on three pointers (11 of 22).  Hallowell made 5 three pointers!
4.  Played solid defense....especially on Cabrini's Cory Lemons and made him earn every point

Game ball to Bryan Wickliffe who was 10 of 11 from the floor with 23 points, 8 boards.

Wooster will have a big challenge with #1 Whitworth as the Pirates have two former Division I players.

As goscots noted (k+), congratulations to the Wooster seniors on reaching the 100 win mark!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on March 11, 2011, 11:17:59 PM
Make that, two players who didn't make it in Division I.
Good luck Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 11, 2011, 11:40:14 PM
Quote from: drt on March 11, 2011, 11:17:59 PM
Make that, two players who didn't make it in Division I.

Wrong. Michael Taylor, one of Whitworth's D1 transfers, was a regular member of Montana's rotation last season. He appeared in 29 of the 32 games that Montana played in 2009-10 and averaged 4.2 ppg for the Grizzlies.

I have no dog in the Wooster vs. Whitworth fight, but I hate to see a player get insulted by a poster who doesn't know what he's talking about.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 11, 2011, 11:40:56 PM
Quote from: drt on March 11, 2011, 11:17:59 PM
Make that, two players who didn't make it in Division I.
Good luck Scots.

I wouldn't say this is an accurate assessment, at least for Michael Taylor. He was the Big Sky Freshman of the Year when he was at Eastern Washington, and he was in the rotation for Montana the two years he was there.

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basketball/players/61192

http://www.bigskyfans.com/2007/06/05/griz-basketball-lands-ewu-transfer

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 12, 2011, 12:02:48 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 11, 2011, 11:40:56 PM
Quote from: drt on March 11, 2011, 11:17:59 PM
Make that, two players who didn't make it in Division I.
Good luck Scots.
I wouldn't say this is an accurate assessment, at least for Michael Taylor. He was the Big Sky Freshman of the Year when he was at Eastern Washington, and he was in the rotation for Montana the two years he was there.

http://rivals.yahoo.com/ncaa/basketball/players/61192

http://www.bigskyfans.com/2007/06/05/griz-basketball-lands-ewu-transfer

After rechecking the Whitworth roster, there may be only ONE Division I transfer but as Greg and Seinfeld noted, Michael Taylor played Division I ball for 3 years and Taylor averaged 16 minutes per game for a Montana team that was 22-10 last season.

So why did Taylor end up at Whitworth?...well, he is originally from Brewster, WA and he is a cousin of the Gebbers brothers who are also starters for the Pirates.  Finally, he is married to a woman who also attends Whitworth.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nwhoops1903 on March 12, 2011, 09:17:19 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 12, 2011, 12:02:48 AM
So why did Taylor end up at Whitworth?...well, he is originally from Brewster, WA and he is a cousin of the Gebbers brothers who are also starters for the Pirates.  Finally, he is married to a woman who also attends Whitworth.
That is correct.  Whitworth is fortunate to have MT on the roster this year and he is glad to be here.  We think he should have been here the whole time.  ;)  He may also be here in order to end his basketball career with a championship.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2011, 09:27:01 AM
Quote from: nwhoops1903 on March 12, 2011, 09:17:19 AM
That is correct.  Whitworth is fortunate to have MT on the roster this year and he is glad to be here.  We think he should have been here the whole time.  ;)  He may also be here in order to end his basketball career with a championship.   :)

Too bad that won't be happening...  ;)   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on March 12, 2011, 09:40:40 AM
I stand corrected and humbled.  No insult intended.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 12, 2011, 09:51:18 AM
Here is link to the Daily Record article on the win over Cabrini:
http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4997949

At the risk of flipflopping like a politician ::), Whitworth does have two Division I transfers. ;)
The second Division I transfer is 6'7" Jack Loofburrow who played at Eastern Washington.  He is mentioned in this second Daily Record article that previews tonight's big sectional final between Wooster and Whitworth:
http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/4997948

Let's hope that Wooster can rise to the challenge and claim a Final Four berth tonight!

GO SCOTS!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 12, 2011, 11:31:17 AM
The kid still has it.  At the Wooster game last night, showing off that tremendous vertical, I snagged a flying t-shirt almost right from the hands of the land-ridden Jeff Franks in front of me.  Rumors that I committed an over-the-back foul are vastly exaggerated.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 12, 2011, 11:51:21 AM
Brief Profile of #1 Whitworth Pirates 28-1

Likely Starters:
6'4" Mike Taylor 19.9 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 3.5 apg, 53% on three pointers
6'5" David Riley 16.5 ppg, 3.8 rpg, 41% on three pointers with 77 made
6'8" Felix Friedt 12.8 ppg, 7.2 rpg
5'11" Wade Gebbers 8.8 ppg, 2.8 rpg, 3.3 apg
6'1" Clay Gebbers 6.7 ppg, 4.4 rpg

Key Reserves:
6'7" Jack Loofburrow 12.1 ppg, 6.0 rpg, 46% on three pointers with 68 made
5'11" Chase Ramey 2.3 ppg
6'8" Michael Taylor 1.6 ppg

Whitworth plays a very short rotation (basically 6 guys) with the 7th and 8th players getting very few minutes.  Ramey and Taylor #2 only played 6 and 4 minutes last night vs. Marietta.  IF Wooster can draw some fouls going to the basket and force Whitworth to use more of their bench, it could work to the Scots advantage.

Whitworth has 4 players averaging over 12 points/game and they shoot the three pointer very well.  42% as a team shooting 3 pointers and over 10 made per game.  Wooster will need to defend the three point shots closely.

GO SCOTS!


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 12, 2011, 02:47:52 PM
So what does everyone really think the Scots chances are tonight?

Whitworth seems like they are big and can shoot the ball very well from three point range. 

If the Scots can make it to the Final Four they will have earned it for sure!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 12, 2011, 05:12:54 PM
Without a doubt the Scots are the underdogs. I watched them on internet video last night and my reaction midway through the first half was "Are these guys for real!?#". The are big in paint and they shot threes like they are layups. I had someone who was at the game call me to tell me that Mr. Taylor is the best Division III player he has ever seen.

So with that all being said, the Scots have three things going for them.
1. Home court with a large contingent of supportors
2. Probably the best defense Whitworth will have seen all year.
3. The ability to shoot three's right along with them from several players.

In my opinion they need to take advantage all of these AND reduce the number of turnovers in half to have a 50-50 chance. Otherwise, the Pirates by 15.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 12, 2011, 07:36:01 PM
37-31 Wooster at the half.

This is a tremendous game. These two are both playing at a top level.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 12, 2011, 07:36:55 PM
Correction, Scots up 37-33 at the half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on March 12, 2011, 07:45:03 PM
Fantastic half by both teams. Contain, contain, contain...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 12, 2011, 07:48:17 PM
Quote from: woo91 on March 12, 2011, 07:45:03 PM
Fantastic half by both teams. Contain, contain, contain...

Yeah, incredible play by Warnes on D. These teams are like two prizefighters trading blows and just trying to contain the damage...

Amazing game, must be an incredible atmosphere in there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 12, 2011, 08:22:41 PM
Come on Scots!

DEFENSE!
DEFENSE!
DEFENSE!
DEFENSE!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 12, 2011, 08:34:10 PM
gotta make free throws!

come on scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 12, 2011, 08:40:19 PM
FINAL FOUR FOR WOOSTER!

Congrats to Coach Moore, his staff and the Scots Basketball Team!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 12, 2011, 08:57:05 PM
That was one of the best DIII games I've ever seen—congratulations to both teams on simply outstanding performances.

Wooster played its best game of the season and was better than Whitworth in the final 7 minutes to win the game. Whitworth is a tremendous basketball team with immense talent, and Michael Taylor is one of the best players I've ever seen in a DIII gym.

Congratulations to the Scots! What a win!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 12, 2011, 09:32:06 PM
Fantastic result by the Scots! Am absolutely ecstatic! Hopefully I can make it 3/3 to Salem.

Hopefully this is the year we make the final and win it!

Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2011, 10:07:52 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 12, 2011, 08:57:05 PM
That was one of the best DIII games I've ever seen—congratulations to both teams on simply outstanding performances.

Wooster played its best game of the season and was better than Whitworth in the final 7 minutes to win the game. Whitworth is a tremendous basketball team with immense talent, and Michael Taylor is one of the best players I've ever seen in a DIII gym.

Congratulations to the Scots! What a win!!

I echo everything you said bryan!  This game not only lived up to the hype, but it surpassed it.  A great game between two great teams and I think the home court and the fact that WW was playing so far from home pushed the Scots to the win!

I'm still in disbelief that this team is going to Salem!  After watching WW dismantle a good Marietta team last night, I felt it would take a herculean effort by the Scots to get past this team and more specifically to try and contain Michael Taylor.  As bryan said, he's one of the best DIII players I've ever seen and I've seen plenty of good ones just in Wooster unis alone. 

But in the end, it was Wooster's defense that made the difference.  Warnes is by far the defensive MVP and he did a hell of a job in trying to at least slow down Taylor (yes he still went off for 25 points but it took him 20 shots to get there).  Oh, and the fact that Warnes dropped in 11 points including 3-4 from beyond the arc and a monster dunk to finish off a fantastic drive to the basket was just the icing on the cake!

Congrats to the Scots on yet another Final Four berth.  The Scots hold true on their recent trend of Final Four appearances on a four year cyclical pattern.  They made their debut appearance in 2003, followed that up in 2007.  Now, it's their 3rd trip in 2011 and I'm hoping the 3rd time is the charm for Wooster and they can finish their business and bring home the Walnut and Bronze this time!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 12, 2011, 10:14:32 PM
What do we know about our opponent next week?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2011, 10:21:41 PM
Quote from: Cali-Scot on March 12, 2011, 10:14:32 PM
What do we know about our opponent next week?



One word...  REVENGE!!!   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 12, 2011, 10:30:01 PM
congrations scots, great game wish I could have been at it. Good luck at the final four. Tonight all ohio fans of basketball should be proud of the scots and their great accomplishment. Congratulations to all the loyal fans of the scots also. I have been too many colleges and universities all over ohio, michigan, and indiana and wooster fans are the best. Nobody deserves this more.

david
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 12, 2011, 10:41:41 PM
Back to the Final Four for the Wooster Scots! ;D

Great game at Timken tonight between two top teams.  As Scotsfan noted, Wooster's DEFENSE was the big difference in this game as they held Whitworth's top two scorers to only 8 of 20 for Michael Taylor and only 4 of 13 for David Riley.

Whitworth averages 84 points per game and tonight, they only scored 66 because of the Scots defense!

The other key was three pointers and Wooster made 11 while holding the Pirates to only 8 (they average 10/game).  Justin Warnes had an incredible game on defense and he drilled his 3rd three pointer with only 3:45 left in the game.  It was a huge play because Whitworth had cut the Wooster lead to only 60-56.  Warnes three pointer stretched the lead back to 7 points at 63-56 and Whitworth was forced into shooting desparation three pointers.

Wooster is now 30-2 and next faces Williams in a Final Four semi-final game!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nescac1 on March 12, 2011, 10:53:32 PM
See you guys in Salem!!!  Hoping for a repeat of 2003 ... not sure if the outcome will be the same, but I predict a similar level of drama.  Two very good teams, led by all-Americans, surrounded by plenty of shooters, from the looks of things.

Williams has three elite players in Whittington (who is at worst a first-team all-American, and deserves national player of the year in my view -- at least in the discussion with Taylor, etc. --  his game vs. Virginia Wesleyan was one for the ages, although he did suffer a bit of an injury vs. Amherst which worries me), James Wang (a bit cold this weekend but a tremendous scorer from all over the court, and tough as nails), and Nate Robertson (much better than his stats might indicate, tremendous distributor and defender, the consumate glue guy but can take over when needed as shown vs. Amherst tonight).  In addition, James Klemm has been playing at an elite level in the tourney, a great shooter / natural scorer when he gets it going, arguably the x-factor for the Ephs.  The rest of the team are mainly role players who play tough D and (when the Ephs are clicking) hit open threes set up by the other guys.   Rooke-Ley can get his own shot but as you'd expect from a frosh is up-and-down.  Will be a star eventually. 

Williams doesn't shoot it quite as well as last year's Final Four team, not as efficient offensively overall, but they are better defenders, more athletic, and tougher on the boards.  I'd say the two Eph Final Four teams are basically even. 

What is the scouting report on Wooster?  Franks in particular sounds very tough, and it looks like Wooster can really shoot the three ball?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 12, 2011, 11:04:01 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 12, 2011, 10:07:52 PM
But in the end, it was Wooster's defense that made the difference.  Warnes is by far the defensive MVP and he did a hell of a job in trying to at least slow down Taylor (yes he still went off for 25 points but it took him 20 shots to get there).  Oh, and the fact that Warnes dropped in 11 points including 3-4 from beyond the arc and a monster dunk to finish off a fantastic drive to the basket was just the icing on the cake!

That was a great play, and I felt like it was important for keeping the Scots crowd in the game early, as Wooster had fallen behind and there was some apprehension. I very rarely buy the "statement" dunk idea, but I did feel that in this case it showed that there was going to be some great fight in Wooster tonight—and there was.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 12, 2011, 11:27:12 PM
Quote from: nescac1 on March 12, 2011, 10:53:32 PM
What is the scouting report on Wooster?  Franks in particular sounds very tough, and it looks like Wooster can really shoot the three ball?

Senior Ian Franks is Wooster's leading scorer but the Scots play a 9-10 man rotation and have excellent depth compared to most D3 teams.  Franks usually starts the offense and he will find the open man if teams try to play help defense on him.

Senior Nathan Balch has scored over 1,000 points in his Wooster career (3 years) and he is Wooster's most accurate three point shooter.  Junior Justin Hallowell is a 6'7" player who rebounds well and he also shoots 41% on three pointers.  Hallowell has already scored over 1,000 points in his 3 seasons for the Scots.  Senior Bryan Wickliffe is 6'5" but he defends very well against much larger post players and he is Wooster's leading rebounder.  Wickliffe has also scored over 1,000 points in his 4 seasons at Wooster.  Guard Matt Fegan is Wooster's 5th starter and he is also a three point shooter.

Off the bench, Wooster brings 6'7" Josh Claytor and 6'8" Jake Mays to back up the post players.  Justin Warnes is Wooster's top defender vs. guards/wings and freshman guard Ryan Snyder has improved his game in the last half of this season.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 13, 2011, 12:00:20 AM
Some excellent photos of Wooster's big win over Whitworth are already posted on the Scots website including Warnes' monster dunk and a team photo with "4 fingers" for the Final Four!  Here is the link:
http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/photos/0004/index
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nescac1 on March 13, 2011, 09:14:45 AM
Thanks wooscotsfan.  Williams and Wooster sound like pretty similar (and evenly matched) teams, actually.  I think it should be a very competitive game.    I see Wooster gets strong fan support, and it is a manageable trip to Salem, so I would guess that there will be a lot of your fans there.  See you in Salem!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on March 13, 2011, 09:53:14 AM
Congrats to the Scots on a great victory and run to the Final 4.

Bring home the schools first team National Championship!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 13, 2011, 09:57:35 AM

Nice article in the Spokane Washington newspaper on Wooster's win over Whitworth.  There are some very complimentary comments about Wooster from the Whitworth coach and players.  Here is the link:
http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2011/mar/12/whitworth-men-beaten-wooster/

Wooster's win also got a brief mention in the Cleveland Plain Dealer this morning.  Here is the link:
http://www.cleveland.com/sports/college/index.ssf/2011/03/wooster_advances_to_division_i.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on March 13, 2011, 01:36:33 PM
I've compiled information for Wooster students/faculty about the Final Four. You may access it here: http://bit.ly/woofinalfour.

Is there any other information I should add? I've applied for press credentials for the game(s), as I'm only about four hours away from Salem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 13, 2011, 03:06:44 PM
Great work woo91!  I didn't make it to Wooster's first two appearances in Salem.  I'm not going to pass up this opportunity though.  Made my hotel reservations last night!   :)

As far as purchasing tickets, do they stick the Wooster fans together if you buy your tickets through the college?

We should start some sort of a roll call of posters making the trip and have a gathering before the game on Friday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nuscottsfan on March 13, 2011, 03:35:01 PM
woo91 please keep us updated on the College's efforts on tickets. I just went to the Salem Civic Center website and tried, via TicketMaster, to buy tickets-the site said none available. TicketMaster 1-800 #....same thing, no tickets and they said call the Civic Center's box office. It is closed. Anybody have any other ideas or help? Thanks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 13, 2011, 03:52:17 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 13, 2011, 03:06:44 PM
As far as purchasing tickets, do they stick the Wooster fans together if you buy your tickets through the college?

Yes.  And I believe that you can purchase tickets directly from the Civic Center, and either specify which school's section you want to sit in, or specify none.

Everybody who can figure out a way to get there needs to go.  It is a BLAST.  You won't regret it. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 13, 2011, 04:48:56 PM
Thanks David!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 13, 2011, 08:31:21 PM
Interesting post from a NESCAC poster in the Div. III Tournament board. Apparently Mike Taylor and Whitworth are now chopped liver.

Quote from: Bucket on March 13, 2011, 07:49:11 PM
Couldn't disagree more.

Williams had the most difficult draw of the weekend--Va Wes and Amherst. Both of those teams are better than any that played at Wooster.

And Middlebury had to play on Rochester's home court, in front of their home crowd, followed by a very good St. Mary's squad, which dispatched the ODAC's RMC the week prior.

If Troy Whittington is not 100 percent in Salem, then Wooster gets a HUGE break and the Final Four is robbed of the nation's most dynamic player not being at full strength.

Midd-St. Thomas should be a great match-up. Of course, I'm with the Panthers.  :)


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on March 13, 2011, 10:11:21 PM
Video on Youtube I found of Whittington. Listed at 6-6, huh? Kids got ups.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C7h-5bIP0Hg
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 13, 2011, 11:09:28 PM
Is that a highlight film of Whittington or a lowlight film of teams that don't help out on D?  Even Oberlin switches better than that in defending the pick-and-roll.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nescac1 on March 14, 2011, 08:35:05 AM
While I didn't make that comment (another NESCAC poster did), I don't think Whitworth is chopped liver.  But neither are Amherst and Virginia Wesleyan, believe me!  Whitworth is better than Amherst, but I think Virginia Wesleyan is better than Cabrini by a wider margin, than Whitworth is better than Amherst.  In all events, both Wooster and Williams had tough paths to the Final Four -- as did all four Final Four teams this year.  All deserve to be there, and I think it's fair to say that the four best teams in the country, or at least the four teams PLAYING the best right now, are in Salem.  

Troy is not 6'6, no doubt.  I'd say he is more like 6'4 (he was listed at 6'5 until this year, but suddenly gained an inch, without visibly growing :)).  But he has super long arms, a high release point, ridiculous ups, and is also super strong and extremely quick.  

I am not sure how healthy he will be, but believe me, if you take anything away from those highlights besides, a healthy Troy can not be guarded one-on-one by anyone in D-3, you aren't seeing what Eph fans have seen all year.  Or what Stevens Point fans saw in last year's Final Four.  Or what Trinity or Virginia Wesleyan fans saw in recent weeks (the only two teams who left Troy on an island in that time frame, and he ate them for breakfast, lunch, and dinner).  Or what Midd fans saw when he came back from ten staples in his head mid-game to give Middlebury its only loss of the year.  I don't think anyone in the Final Four, including Wooster, will make that mistake, unless he simply can't grip a basketball.  But believe me, I'd love it if you tried ... I'll gladly rest my hopes on a guy who shoots 72 percent despite being the primary focus of every defense he faces ... even at less than 100 percent.   And trust me, no one in the country plays better defense than Middlebury (best D-3 defensive team I've ever watched, and I've seen Williams in several Final Fours now), so it's not as if Troy hasn't played against tough competition this year.  

(And remember, btw, the other half of that pick and roll features James Wang, an all-American himself ... the Wang/Whittington duo can make a lot of good teams look very bad on D). 

Williams is younger and from the look of things not quite as deep as Wooster, but no one in the country has a better 1-2-3 punch than Whittington/Wang/Robertson.  Unfortunately, there have been very few games this season when all three have been 100 percent at the same time, including, it looks like, at Salem.  Even still, I think this game will be a toss-up.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 14, 2011, 11:35:07 AM
Quote from: nescac1 on March 14, 2011, 08:35:05 AM
And trust me, no one in the country plays better defense than Middlebury (best D-3 defensive team I've ever watched, and I've seen Williams in several Final Fours now), so it's not as if Troy hasn't played against tough competition this year.  

I'm not going to argue about Midd's defense as their numbers are quite impressive.  But Wooster can play some pretty good defense themselves.  They held a very good offensive team in Whitworth to 18 points below their season average and held the Pirates to under 70 points for the first time all season.  And they also held a good Manchester team to under 50 and 27 points below their season average.

BTW, it can't be a coincidence that the top 3 teams in defensive fg% are playing in Salem this weekend.  Midd is #1, Williams #2 and Wooster is tied for 3rd!  They don't say defense wins championships for nothing!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on March 14, 2011, 08:33:29 PM
E-mail excerpt sent to all Wooster students this morning:

"Students: The college is chartering a bus and offering a special discounted package -- to COW students only -- that includes round trip bus transportation, tickets to Wooster's first round game Friday and the national championship game on Saturday, hotel accommodations for both nights, and a commemorative t-shirt, all for just $30 per person if you stay four to a room, or $60 per person if you stay two to a room. Interested? See Krista Martin in the Dean of Students' office. You can pay for the trip with your COW card, or have it charged directly to your student account. BUT THERE ARE ONLY 45 SEATS AVAILABLE ON THE BUS, SO ACT QUICKLY!

Everyone: The college has a block of tickets reserved in the section directly across from our team's bench. All seats are reserved and must be bought in a two-game package (Wooster's semi-final game, plus the championship game on Saturday). The price is $25 for adults, $12.50 for students. These reserved seats will go on sale in the PEC lobby on Tuesday, March 15, from noon to 2 p.m., and again from 4 to 7 p.m. CASH SALES ONLY."

For those that were wondering...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 15, 2011, 10:11:26 AM
Congrats go out to Ian Franks on being named the Great Lakes Region POY!  8-)

Joining Franks on the GL Region 1st team from the NCAC are Wes Smith from Wabash and Chris Sullivan from Witt.

Also, Kodey Haddox of Kenyon and Clayton Black of Witt made 3rd team All-Region!

The NCAC had the most representation on the All-GL team with 5.  The OAC had 4 and the MIAA had 3 while the PrAC had 2 and the AMCC had 1.  Congrats to all the NCAC representatives on the All-Region team. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 15, 2011, 01:01:16 PM
Well, I went to purchase tickets at the COW today as they were supposed to be on sale from noon to 2pm today.  Got there at noon and there were probably already over 100 people in line.  By ten after, Wooster's allotment of nearly 400 tickets was sold out and there was still over 100 people in line.   :o   So, in 10 minutes Wooster sold nearly 400 tickets and that didn't even count the 100 or so people waiting in line that will now be buying their tickets directly from the Salem Civic Center as I just did. 

I think it's safe to assume that Wooster will be well represented in Salem!  :D   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on March 15, 2011, 01:37:52 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 15, 2011, 01:01:16 PM
Well, I went to purchase tickets at the COW today as they were supposed to be on sale from noon to 2pm today.  Got there at noon and there were probably already over 100 people in line.  By ten after, Wooster's allotment of nearly 400 tickets was sold out and there was still over 100 people in line.   :o   So, in 10 minutes Wooster sold nearly 400 tickets and that didn't even count the 100 or so people waiting in line that will now be buying their tickets directly from the Salem Civic Center as I just did. 

I think it's safe to assume that Wooster will be well represented in Salem!  :D   


That's incredible. Anyone know if Williams is bringing a lot of fans? Their website isn't actually too helpful...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nuscottsfan on March 15, 2011, 02:31:34 PM
Thanks woo91! Bought my 2 and it sounds like I'll be seeing a lot of the Scots faithful in Salem!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 15, 2011, 11:51:18 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 09, 2011, 06:13:54 PM
Ok, where do we vote?  :)

I asked the above question last week in reference to this, wondering how we fans would go about voting for the players chosen by D3Hoops.com:

The selection process for the rosters in the Reese's Division III All-Star Game will include two players from each region, two players from the losing teams in the national semifinal games, and two players from fan internet voting at D3Hoops.com. This year's contest will be streamed live.

Was there ever any voting on this website?  Was this how the players were chosen?  Are there rosters listed anywhere for the public to see?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 16, 2011, 12:04:05 AM
WB:

16,234 votes were collected via a poll vote on the front page of D3hoops.com, which took place between March 1 and 3.

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2011/03/massaquoi-hipp-win-nabc-vote
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on March 16, 2011, 03:05:02 PM
So what IS the deal on Whittington? Is he just freakishly athletic at 6-6? Can Wick take him? And probably most importantly, is he 100%?

Does Wooster have a shot here?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 16, 2011, 05:16:32 PM
Quote from: woo91 on March 16, 2011, 03:05:02 PM
So what IS the deal on Whittington? Is he just freakishly athletic at 6-6? Can Wick take him? And probably most importantly, is he 100%?

Does Wooster have a shot here?

Yes.  I have it from a reliable source that Wooster, only this morning, activated Gideon Mabeny.  It turns out that the big center, who has now grown to 7'3",  had been working out with the team since November, just in case he might be needed down the stretch.  An expert in video analysis, Mabeny has been studying Whittington's tendencies since early February, when it became clear that Williams would be a possible future opponent of the Scots.  Fear not, he says; the situation is in good hands.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 16, 2011, 06:14:04 PM
Quote from: woo91 on March 16, 2011, 03:05:02 PM
So what IS the deal on Whittington? Is he just freakishly athletic at 6-6? Can Wick take him? And probably most importantly, is he 100%?

Does Wooster have a shot here?

Whittington does appear to be a freakishly good athlete with long arms and great hops that make him play taller than his listed height.  I do think Wick has the ability to at least slow Whittington down as Wick is quick enough to stay with Whittington and strong enough to stand up to him as well.

As for Whittington's health?  I'm sure that Williams is going to keep that hush hush until as close to game time as possible.  I haven't even heard what his injury is.  The only evidence I've even seen of his injury is that his hand was heavily taped and iced as he was cutting down the nets last Saturday.  He played 31 minutes in that game so either the injury occurred late or he played through it.  If he played through it, that might explain why his stats weren't all that impressive as he was only 4-8 for 10 points and he was also just 2-5 from the line.  Those numbers are way down from his season averages of 70% from the field, 16.7 ppg and 75% from the line...  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 16, 2011, 06:46:30 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 16, 2011, 06:14:04 PM
Quote from: woo91 on March 16, 2011, 03:05:02 PM
So what IS the deal on Whittington? Is he just freakishly athletic at 6-6? Can Wick take him? And probably most importantly, is he 100%?

Does Wooster have a shot here?

Whittington does appear to be a freakishly good athlete with long arms and great hops that make him play taller than his listed height.

And his listed height is deceptive; apparently he's more like 6'4 than 6'6.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 16, 2011, 11:26:40 PM
Brief Profile of #4 Williams College Ephs 29-2

Likely Starters:
6'0" James Wang JR  18.5 ppg, 4.7 rpg, 3.4 apg, 44% on three pointers (80 made)
6'6" Troy Whittington SR  16.7 ppg, 9.0 rpg, 71% shooting on FG's
6'3" James Klemm SO  11.1 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 42% on three pointers (89 made)
6'3" Nate Robertson SO  7.7 ppg, 3.4 rpg, 3.5 apg
6'8" Harlan Dodson SR  4.8 ppg, 2.7 rpg

Key Reserves:
6'2" Hayden Rooke-Ley FR  6.6 ppg, 4.2 rpg
6'4" Taylor Epley FR  6.2 ppg, 1.8 rpg, 43% on three pointers (32 made)
6'8" Brian Emerson JR  6.0 ppg, 4.3 rpg
6'4" Jordan Mickens JR  2.5 ppg, 1.5 rpg

Williams gets over 46 combined points per game from their top 3 scorers (James Wang, Troy Whittington, James Klemm).  Whittington is quick and jumps well for a big guy so he dunks often which explains his 71% shooting from the floor.  Wang and Whittington combined have over 50% of Williams free throw attempts as they draw the most fouls.  Best three point shooters are Wang, Klemm and Taylor Epley off the bench.  As a team, Williams (just like Whitworth) averages over 10 made three pointers per game.

Wooster will need to defend the pick & roll with Wang/Whittington and the three point line to get the win.

GO SCOTS! :)


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 17, 2011, 09:04:35 AM
6'0" James Wang - Fegan/Balch
6'6" Troy Whittington - Wickliffe
6'3" James Klemm - Balch/Warnes
6'3" Nate Robertson - Franks
6'8" Harlan Dodson - Hallowell

I'd guess that the defensive match-ups would be like this.  Fegan on Wang when he and Balch are on the court, otherwise Balch on Wang and Warnes on Klemm.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nescac1 on March 17, 2011, 09:28:51 AM
The two teams look to me to be as even as two teams possibly can be on paper.  Ephs have the clear edge at PG with Wang and C with Troy, Wooster has the clear edge at the forward spots with Franks and Hallowell, and Robertson is probably about = Balch.  Even the benches look similar, both seem to get a lot of production from the 6-7-8 guys, two solid forwards and a gritty guard, with a ninth guy who is a role player.  

Local media reported this morning that Whittington had a chipped bone in his right hand, and is "progressing."  

http://www.thetranscript.com/ci_17632854

As for the Williams defensive match-ups, they will probably be the same as those for Wooster, except that I am not sure if Williams will put Robertson or Klemm on Franks.  Nate is our best defender so it might make sense, but Maker will sometimes surprise me on that front, and Klemm is our natural three (also a solid defender, but Nate is clearly our top guy on the perimeter) so he might keep him on Franks and then occasionally help out.  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 17, 2011, 09:51:09 AM
Whittington is left-handed, so while that slows him down it isn't completely debilitating.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 17, 2011, 10:39:11 AM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 17, 2011, 09:51:09 AM
Whittington is left-handed, so while that slows him down it isn't completely debilitating.

He'll only be able to dunk one handed...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 17, 2011, 07:15:05 PM
Five Minutes with Steve Fleming (http://northcoastconference.blogspot.com/2011/03/five-minutes-with_17.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 17, 2011, 07:48:28 PM
Just finally got around to watching the Wooster video (linked on the front page).  Amazing, Ian Franks STILL looks about 15-16 to me! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 17, 2011, 09:19:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 17, 2011, 07:15:05 PM
Five Minutes with Steve Fleming (http://northcoastconference.blogspot.com/2011/03/five-minutes-with_17.html)

Reading that was a waste of two minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 17, 2011, 09:24:37 PM
One of the best known sports writers in northeast Ohio is Terry Pluto of the Cleveland Plain Dealer.  He has also authored several sports books.

In today's paper, Terry Pluto's column featured Wooster Coach Steve Moore and the Scots! :)  Here is the link:
http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/blog/index.ssf/2011/03/as_wooster_chases_a_division_i.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 17, 2011, 11:55:53 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 17, 2011, 09:19:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 17, 2011, 07:15:05 PM
Five Minutes with Steve Fleming (http://northcoastconference.blogspot.com/2011/03/five-minutes-with_17.html)

Reading that was a waste of two minutes.
Yeah, admittedly there's not much there.  He is a coach, after all.  But Hiram gets so little publicity, I thought I'd link it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 18, 2011, 12:22:47 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 17, 2011, 11:55:53 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 17, 2011, 09:19:33 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 17, 2011, 07:15:05 PM
Five Minutes with Steve Fleming (http://northcoastconference.blogspot.com/2011/03/five-minutes-with_17.html)

Reading that was a waste of two minutes.
Yeah, admittedly there's not much there.  He is a coach, after all.  But Hiram gets so little publicity, I thought I'd link it.

It's not him, it's the interviewer.  I really wanted to know what his favorite color was, and he was never asked.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 18, 2011, 02:37:00 PM
Final Four coming up quick...

Let's go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 18, 2011, 06:39:50 PM
At the Half:  Williams 42  Wooster 28

Wooster started the game with cold shooting and trailed 11-2 after just 4 minutes. :(  Scots actually trailed by 18 points with 7 minutes left in the half (32 to 14) but have fought back to narrow the margin.

Wooster is being led by Bryan Wickliffe with 8 points, Justin Hallowell with 8 and Ian Franks with 6.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 18, 2011, 07:27:37 PM
Woo getting back in it - they now trail by only 5 with 5+ to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 18, 2011, 07:30:09 PM
5:10 Left  Williams 63  Wooster 60

Wooster has ralllied and Franks just hit another basket to cut the margin to 3 points!  GO SCOTS!

Franks just hit a three pointer    Williams 63  Wooster 63
Williams 64  Wooster 63  Whittington with 1 FT    Franks just picked up his 4th Foul
Wooster 65  William 64  Balch hits  3:25 left
Williams 67  Wooster 65 Robertson with traditional 3 point play.
Wooster 67  Willliams 67  Franks with a steal & a bucket
Wooster 70  Williams 67  Balch with a Huge 3 Pointer!  1:53 left
Wooster 70  Williams 69  Robertson scores for Ephs  1:33 left  Timeout
Williams 71  Wooster 70  Robertson 2 FT's, IAN FRANKS fouls out with 5th.  1:06 left.
Wooster 72  Williams 71  Wickliffe 2 FT's
Willliams miss, Woo rebound, Robertson FOULS OUT.  Nathan Balch to the line for Woo
Wooster 73  Williams 71  Balch 1 of 2 FT's
Wooster WINS 73-71!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 18, 2011, 07:37:54 PM
This might come down to who fouls out first, Nate Robertson or Ian Franks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 18, 2011, 07:43:43 PM
Woo LEADS by one with 25 seconds left!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 18, 2011, 07:45:08 PM
HOT DAMN!  Helluva game Wooster!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 18, 2011, 07:45:40 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 18, 2011, 07:43:43 PM
Woo LEADS by one with 25 seconds left!

WOO WINS, 73-71!!

Nice comeback!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 18, 2011, 07:47:19 PM
FINAL:  Wooster 73  Williams 71 :) ;D

WOW!  Wooster comes all the way back from an 18 point deficit to get the huge win!!  INCREDIBLE COMEBACK!

Wooster's Top Scorers:  Ian Franks 24, Justin Hallowell 18 (8 boards), Bryan Wickliffe 14, Nathan Balch 13

Scots took care of the ball with only 5 turnovers compared to 16 for Williams.  Scots had 19 more shots!

Wooster is now 31-2 ;D  Wooster plays for the national championship tomorrow! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 18, 2011, 07:51:40 PM
WOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pbrooks3 on March 18, 2011, 07:54:23 PM
Great win Wooster. Good luck in the final tomorrow!

From a SCAC poster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 18, 2011, 07:54:37 PM
Wow!  What heart and determination by the Scots!  I can't believe that Wooster is playing for the national title tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on March 18, 2011, 07:55:30 PM
What a come back!!!!!!!!! Great win!!!!! Go Scots, win it all !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 18, 2011, 07:56:56 PM
From the NE board...

Quote from: nescac1 on March 18, 2011, 07:52:45 PM
Congrats to Wooster.  Great defensive team and Franks was awesome.  Karma is a bitch as Wooster caught every break including atrociously one sided officiating I mean awful.  And two shots bouncing in and out.  Agonizing.   But I guess we are now even for 2003.  Gutty effort by Troy who was physically abused all game.  Great game for Nate also.  Great year for a young Ephs team but right now hard to take as I don't think they were worse than Wooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: mailsy on March 18, 2011, 08:05:25 PM
Congrats to Wooster!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 18, 2011, 08:23:56 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 18, 2011, 07:56:56 PM
From the NE board...

Quote from: nescac1 on March 18, 2011, 07:52:45 PM
Congrats to Wooster.  Great defensive team and Franks was awesome.  Karma is a bitch as Wooster caught every break including atrociously one sided officiating I mean awful.  And two shots bouncing in and out.  Agonizing.   But I guess we are now even for 2003.  Gutty effort by Troy who was physically abused all game.  Great game for Nate also.  Great year for a young Ephs team but right now hard to take as I don't think they were worse than Wooster

Gee, uh, thanks for those warm, heartfelt congratulations, nescac1.  ::)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9iMy0969BTw (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9iMy0969BTw)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BUBeaverFan on March 18, 2011, 09:43:25 PM
Congrats Wooster! Bring the Walnut and Bronze to the Buckeye State.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on March 18, 2011, 09:46:51 PM
Lost my voice on the broadcast tonight. I'd say it was worth it. For those who listened (I'm guessing all of you watched online), if you'd like a heavily Wooster oriented broadcast head over to http://www.ustream.tv/channel/wooster-sports at 3:15 PM EST tomorrow)

Unreal game. Go Scots!

Jason
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: frank uible on March 18, 2011, 09:52:28 PM
Apologies from Williams fans for those of us, who in the passion of disappointment come across as sore losers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 18, 2011, 10:07:37 PM
Final:  St. Thomas 59  Middlebury 57

Tommies get the close victory so Wooster will face them in the championship game.

Hopefully, the Scots recall a loss to St. Thomas last season that they need to avenge tomorrow! ;)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 18, 2011, 10:16:28 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.woosterathletics.com%2Fsports%2Fbsb%2F2008-09%2Fphotos%2F0002%2FMPD_1.jpg%3Fmax_width%3D150&hash=c3f5ddcefd9b8a9ea3244a35b6e1f824f42a7d68) (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/bsb/2008-09/photos/0002/index)

Get your revenge, Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on March 18, 2011, 10:36:07 PM
Congrats Scots.  Go the distance....
Frank, you certainly don't  need to apologize for those other people.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 18, 2011, 10:50:21 PM
Brief Profile of St. Thomas 29-3

Likely Starters:
5'11" Tyler Nicolai SR  14.6 ppg, 1.9 rpg, 3.1 apg, 41% on three pointers (76 made)
6'4" Alex Healy SR  12.9 ppg, 2.8 rpg, 3.2 apg, 31% on three pointers (33 made)
6'8" Tommy Hannon JR  12.2 ppg, 6.7 rpg, 59% shooting, Most FT's made (105)
6'9" Anders Halvorsen SR  7.8 ppg, 4.0 rpg, Most Blocks (44)
6'1" Teddy Archer SR  5.5 ppg, 3.0 apg

Key Reserves:
6'4" John Nance SO  5.4 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 47% on three pointers (17 made)
6'1" Peter Leslie JR  4.1 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 47% on three pointers (17 made)
6'2" Brady Ervin SR  4.7 ppg, 3.8 rpg
6'6" Josh Pedretti SO  2.5 ppg, 2.3 rpg

St. Thomas wins games by shooting over 49% from the floor while strong defense holds opponents to only 43%.  Tyler Nicolai is their star player who hit a last second shot earlier in the tourney to knock off UW Stevens Point - the defending national champs.  St. Thomas will make three pointers but they only average 5.6 made per game, less than Williams or Whitworth.

Tommies have a big front line and 6'8" Tommy Hannon is their inside scorer who also shoots the most free throws.  They don't have much post depth off the bench so if Hannon or Halvorsen get into foul trouble, it could be an advantage for Wooster.

Tommies also press a lot so Wooster will need to take care of the ball and break the press!

GO SCOTS! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on March 18, 2011, 11:31:52 PM
Irony:  Tonight Williams missed a layup with under 2 seconds left, Wooster grabbed the rebound and it was over--in 2003, Williams made a layup with 1 second left...at the same basket, from almost the exactly the same spot on the floor...to beat the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 18, 2011, 11:38:51 PM
Timken South was rockin' tonight!  Expecting even more fans making the trek south tomorrow!

What an atmosphere tonight in the Civic Center for the opener!  And what a game!

I'm still trying to wrap my head around the fact that the Scots actually pulled this game out!  Good thing I've had a few beers and a 300+ mile drive to help me get some sleep tonight and get ready for tomorrow's game! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 18, 2011, 11:42:32 PM
Congrats Scots! Way to rep the NCAC!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndersDY on March 18, 2011, 11:58:14 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on March 18, 2011, 11:31:52 PM
Irony:  Tonight Williams missed a layup with under 2 seconds left, Wooster grabbed the rebound and it was over--in 2003, Williams made a layup with 1 second left...at the same basket, from almost the exactly the same spot on the floor...to beat the Scots.

I was going to come on and comment how sweet it is to get some revenge on Williams after how it went down in 2003. I don't suppose there were any clock-keeping shenanigans that came into play this time?

They do usually televise the final game on some obscure channel, don't they? Does anyone know what station will have the game tomorrow?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 19, 2011, 12:50:59 AM
Quote from: AndersDY on March 18, 2011, 11:58:14 PM
They do usually televise the final game on some obscure channel, don't they? Does anyone know what station will have the game tomorrow?

This year, the game will be streamed live by the NCAA.  You can access the video from the Wooster tournament website (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/ncaa/final_four/index).  I don't believe that CBS College Sports (or anyone else) will be televising (but as I don't have a TV and therefore don't give a hoot, I could be mistaken.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 19, 2011, 03:26:58 AM
No television.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 19, 2011, 09:21:54 AM
No game stories can be linked from the Wooster Daily Record because they for subscribers only? ???

So, here are two other alternatives.

Great story in the Roanoke Times about Wooster's comeback win over Williams.  :)
http://www.roanoke.com/sports/college/wb/280549

Game story from Williams perspective in the western Mass Berkshire Eagle newspaper:
http://www.berkshireeagle.com/sports/ci_17649499

GO SCOTS! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 19, 2011, 09:37:05 AM
Here are a few more Wooster-Williams game stories from other sources.  Boston Globe newspaper online:
http://www.boston.com/sports/colleges/mens_basketball/articles/2011/03/18/late_fts_lift_wooster_past_williams_73_71/?rss_id=Boston.com+--+Latest+sports+news

Washington Post recap story including several game photos:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/down-17-in-second-half-wooster-closes-on-27-8-run-to-beat-williams-73-71-in-d-iii-semifinals/2011/03/18/ABXVzBs_story.html

GO SCOTS! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 19, 2011, 01:07:41 PM
40 minutes away from bringing home the walnut-and-bronze, and hanging the big banner in Timken.  C'mon, Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 19, 2011, 04:11:57 PM
At the Half:  St. Thomas 43  Wooster 26

Wooster may have literally thrown away their chances with 11 turnovers in the half. :(

St. Thomas also made 7 of 10 three point shots in the first half.

Let's hope that the Scots can put together another big 2nd half rally!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 19, 2011, 04:34:31 PM
2nd Half Updates:
St. Thomas 46  Wooster 36  Scots on a mini-run as Franks get a traditional 3 point play.
St. Thomas 53  Wooster 36  Tommies on a 7-0 run, Scots shooting poorly
St. Thomas 57  Wooster 40  9:43 Left
St. Thomas 63  Wooster 43  7:39 Left  Wooster now with 14 turnovers
St. Thomas 67  Wooster 50  5:07 Left  Ian Franks with 22 points, Balch with 9.
St. Thomas 71  Wooster 50  3:40 Left
St. Thomas 74  Wooster 50  3:06 Left  Game is Over except for the Final Score.  Woo with 16 turnovers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 19, 2011, 05:09:24 PM
Final:  St. Thomas 78  Wooster 54

Congratulations to the Scots and Coach Moore on a Great Season at 31-3!  National 2nd Place!

Congrats to Wooster Seniors Ian Franks, Nathan Balch and Bryan Wickliffe on stellar careers!  This Wooster class had 102 wins in their 4 years - a tremendous achievement!

Ian Franks finishes with 1,696 points which is 5th on Wooster's all time list.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 19, 2011, 05:14:45 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 19, 2011, 05:09:24 PM
Congratulations to the Scots and Coach Moore on a Great Season at 31-3!  National 2nd Place!

Congrats to Wooster Seniors Ian Franks, Nathan Balch and Bryan Wickliffe on stellar careers!  This Wooster class had 102 wins in their 4 years - a tremendous achievement!

Agreed!  Hopefully some of the freshmen on this team will be able to lead another deep run in two or three years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Drake Palmer on March 19, 2011, 05:58:22 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 19, 2011, 05:09:24 PM
Final:  St. Thomas 78  Wooster 54

Congratulations to the Scots and Coach Moore on a Great Season at 31-3!  National 2nd Place!

Congrats to Wooster Seniors Ian Franks, Nathan Balch and Bryan Wickliffe on stellar careers!  This Wooster class had 102 wins in their 4 years - a tremendous achievement!

Ian Franks finishes with 1,696 points which is 5th on Wooster's all time list.



Tough ball club & game Wooster fans.  I watched yesterday when you all wiped out that 17-18 point lead against Williams, and thought another one of those comebacks was in the works when you closed the gap to 10 points a couple of times in the 2nd half.  Ian Franks is a stud & well deserving of his All American honors.  Great leadership & basketball abilities. Best of luck next season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: SUMMIT!!!!! on March 19, 2011, 06:45:17 PM
Going into the game, I had high hopes for my alma mater and a ton of respect for Wooster.  Both teams played well, and while I am thrilled to tears that we won, my respecty for the Wooster program- players, coaches and fans-- has gone up. The Scots played their hearts out right to the end, and everyone associated with Wooster exhibited tons of class. Its a shame someone had to lose, and I look forward to our next rematch with the Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 19, 2011, 11:33:56 PM
As alluded to by Drake Palmer (thanks, by the way, for the comments by our visiting UST friends, +1 each), Ian Franks was indeed selected to the D3hoops.com All-America team (http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-americans/men/2011) today.  He was joined by two other NCAC senior standouts:

1st team: Ian Franks, Wooster
3rd team: Wes Smith, Wabash
Honorable Mention: Chris Sullivan, Wittenberg

Congratulations to all three of these outstanding players, and thanks for your contributions to NCAC hoops these past four years!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 20, 2011, 09:52:07 AM
Well, yesterday's game made for a loooong drive home last night.   :(  Thanks for the kind words Drake and miac.  UST was certainly a fine team and deserving of hoisting that trophy yesterday.  I read the game story in the Roanoke paper yesterday morning and Midd's coach had made a comment about how UST's defense was the best they'd played against all season.  I really thought Wooster would have the ability to break the Tommies' press, but man.  They are just relentless!!! 

That press was a lethal combination for Wooster.  When you factor in the energy Wooster's starters exherted in that epic comeback against Williams and add in the toll that press puts on you both physically and mentally, that's a recipe for the outcome we saw in yesterday's game.  And then when you add in that Balch was dealing with an ankle injury that pretty much made him ineffective on both ends of the floor and Wick did something to either his groin or his hamstring that limited him defensively as well, and you get the result we saw in the final outcome.

I think Wooster's biggest problem due to the quick turnaround after Friday's game was that you could just see they were very flatfooted on defesne and a step slower than they normally have been. 

But credit to UST.  They put the hammer down on defense and they never let up!  Tenacious is a word that comes to mind when thinking about how they play defense.  And offensively, you could just tell how well coached they were.  They executed very well and were able to really exploit Wooster for being a step slow defensively.

All in all, 2nd place is nothing for this team to hang their heads over.  This team advanced further in the tournament than any other Wooster team.  They finally cleared the hurdle of getting past the semis and actually getting to play for the title.  This team gave us fans one hell of a run over the last 3 weekends.  Memories I will never forget!  And being able to finally experience Salem in person just capped off a truly memorable season for me!  Especially seeing the throng of Wooster fans that turned the Salem Civic Center into Timken South over the weekend!  Props to the college for making this a special weekend for the fans with a nice reception on Friday and a tailgate party on Saturday.  They really went out of their way to treat the Wooster fans who made the journey to Salem.  I also got to meet Justin Warnes' dad and he was just blown away by the support this team gets from Wooster fans!  And I got to thank Nathan Balch's mother and father on our way out following the trophy presentation for Wooster and had the opportunity to tell them what a pleasure it's been to watch their son play for Wooster over the last 3 years. 

Congrats again to the accomplishments of this team and more specifically this senior class.  Congrats to Ian on being named 1st Team All-American.  He proved he deserved on that team with his performances in both games this weekend!  And lets not forget to send props to maybe the forgotten senior and captain, Kaleb Reed.  He may not have been filling up the stat sheet, but it takes a TON of dedication to stick it out like he has to stay a part of this team for four years without ever getting all that much playing time!  He truly proved you can be a leader without playing significant minutes!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 20, 2011, 09:55:22 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 18, 2011, 10:16:28 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.woosterathletics.com%2Fsports%2Fbsb%2F2008-09%2Fphotos%2F0002%2FMPD_1.jpg%3Fmax_width%3D150&hash=c3f5ddcefd9b8a9ea3244a35b6e1f824f42a7d68) (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/bsb/2008-09/photos/0002/index)

Get your revenge, Scots.

We need to stop seeing photos like this being taken by Matt Dilyard of UST celebrating in the background while Wooster players are in agony over defeat:

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.the-daily-record.com%2Fimages%2Fdr_media%2F20110319%2Fphotos%2FDR31911a1sadscots4col.jpg%3F1300577401&hash=26703de1edecf3c8ffe04ee1adb95b53d61d0042)

:(   :(   :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on March 21, 2011, 12:28:35 AM
Congrats to this Wooster Hoops Team on a tremendous season!

Franks is a special basketball player and he and all the Seniors on this team will be remembered for a long time.

Cheers again on a great season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on March 21, 2011, 07:59:20 AM
Congratulations to Wooster on a fine season.  If Wabash can't be there, can't think of a better NCAC representative.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash83 on March 21, 2011, 01:29:22 PM
Quote from: bashbrother on March 21, 2011, 12:28:35 AM
Congrats to this Wooster Hoops Team on a tremendous season!

Franks is a special basketball player and he and all the Seniors on this team will be remembered for a long time.

Cheers again on a great season.

I concur.  Congrats to Wooster on a job well done and to Ian and his classmates on impressive careers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on March 21, 2011, 09:33:02 PM
Congratulations on another great season for Wooster.
Does anyone besides me find it completely counter-intuitive that of all the NCAC teams that have claimed National Championships in basketball, one of them isn't Wooster?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 21, 2011, 09:48:06 PM
Quote from: drt on March 21, 2011, 09:33:02 PM
Congratulations on another great season for Wooster.
Does anyone besides me find it completely counter-intuitive that of all the NCAC teams that have claimed National Championships in basketball, one of them isn't Wooster?

Yes sort of, but I believe Ohio Wesleyan in 1988 is the only one that was a member of the NCAC at the time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 22, 2011, 12:09:09 AM
Quote from: drt on March 21, 2011, 09:33:02 PM
Congratulations on another great season for Wooster.
Does anyone besides me find it completely counter-intuitive that of all the NCAC teams that have claimed National Championships in basketball, one of them isn't Wooster?

No, because nothing is guaranteed as far as a national championship is concerned. Just because your team gets into the tourney consistently doesn't mean that a Walnut & Bronze will automatically be forthcoming someday. F'rinstance, Franklin & Marshall's history of coming close but always being the bridesmaid rather than the bride puts Wooster's to shame. Same thing with Augustana; like F&M, Augie's been to the Final Four four times without ever coming home with the Big Doorstop, although Augie may have lost the all-time heartbreaker of national championship games when in 1981 it lost the title game on its home floor (the Carver Center hosted the D3 men's Final Four throughout the late '70s and the early '80s), in overtime, no less ... and the only reason the game even got to overtime was because Potsdam State's Derrick Rowland hit a half-court desperation shot at the buzzer to force the tie.

Conversely, Ohio Wesleyan has only been in the tourney twice -- and one of those two appearances resulted in a national championship. So, while you can't win the national championship unless you have a great team (naturally), there's a certain amount of randomness connected with which schools have won it.

Quote from: sac on March 21, 2011, 09:48:06 PM
Quote from: drt on March 21, 2011, 09:33:02 PM
Congratulations on another great season for Wooster.
Does anyone besides me find it completely counter-intuitive that of all the NCAC teams that have claimed National Championships in basketball, one of them isn't Wooster?

Yes sort of, but I believe Ohio Wesleyan in 1988 is the only one that was a member of the NCAC at the time.

True dat. Wabash and Wittenberg won theirs prior to joining the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 22, 2011, 01:20:29 AM
The final Top 25 poll is out. (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2010-11/final)  Wooster claims the #2 spot with a healthy margin (33 pts.) over #3 Middlebury.  I was afraid that the respective margins of defeat to UST might keep Midd at #2, but I think the voters realized that the 24-pt. shellacking was not indicative of Wooster's season and especially their tournament run to that point.  In fact, the Scots' total of 593 is just seven points shy of a "perfect" second-place finish.  Wooster's tournament victims, apart from Benedictine (ORV with one vote) all ended up ranked: Manchester #18, Cabrini #19, Whitworth #5, and Williams #4.

Further down, Wittenberg makes a well-deserved reappearance in the poll, nabbing the #22 slot after downing ORV LaRoche and barely being nipped by #11 Marietta.

Wabash slips off the end of the poll, dropping to ORV and effective #27, a mere 12 points off the pace of #25 IWU.

Congratulations to all three squads on fine seasons, and thanks to all nine NCAC teams on another terrific and enjoyable season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HopeConvert on March 22, 2011, 03:30:35 PM
Has anyone here found any extensive collections of photos from the weekend? I'd like to see some, but CoW only has 5 on their website, and I couldn't find any on D3Hoops.

Will there be a video available of the Williams game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on March 22, 2011, 03:36:19 PM
Quote from: HopeConvert on March 22, 2011, 03:30:35 PM
Has anyone here found any extensive collections of photos from the weekend? I'd like to see some, but CoW only has 5 on their website, and I couldn't find any on D3Hoops.

Will there be a video available of the Williams game?

Scott Jones posted some really excellent photos from last weekend on Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/jonesy21/sets/72157626322892598/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HopeConvert on March 23, 2011, 11:56:37 AM
Quote from: woo91 on March 22, 2011, 03:36:19 PM
Quote from: HopeConvert on March 22, 2011, 03:30:35 PM
Has anyone here found any extensive collections of photos from the weekend? I'd like to see some, but CoW only has 5 on their website, and I couldn't find any on D3Hoops.

Will there be a video available of the Williams game?

Scott Jones posted some really excellent photos from last weekend on Flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/jonesy21/sets/72157626322892598/

Thanks. That had some of the shots I was hoping for.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 23, 2011, 09:49:31 PM
Belated, I'm writing about the gams from Salem.

Congratulations to the Fighting Scots and Ian Franks for all the reasons stated above. It was obviously frustrating to be so close to hanging a banner at Salem but it doesn't detract from the amazing run through the playoffs.

When I watched the second semi-final I was rooting for Middelbury simply because I thought the Scots would have better match-ups. Had they won (Middlebury), it might have been a Manchester/Wooster type final, instead of the blowout it became with St. Thomas. They are very deserving champions.

As a final comment, there was a story in the Canton Rep this week:

http://www.cantonrep.com/sports/x1777825182/Wooster-football-coach-47-600-a-year-for-schooling

Mike Schmitz, the College of Wooster football coach spoke at the Luncheon Club in Canton about how difficult it is to recruit with the very high tuition at Wooster and the relatively modest aid that can be offered.

Although it is not specifically mentioned, could this issue become a problem for the basketball team also?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 23, 2011, 11:08:06 PM

Congratulations to Kenyon Grad Shaka Smart who has coached VCU to the Sweet 16 in the Big Tourney! :)
Shaka Smart is a 1999 Kenyon Graduate and he was All-NCAC his senior year leading the conference in assists.

Here is a link to his bio on the VCU basketball website:
http://www.vcuathletics.com/information/directory/bios/Smart_Shaka
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 24, 2011, 10:26:54 AM
Nice find there wsf!  That's pretty cool stuff.  Smart has really climbed the ladder pretty quickly.  I'm guessing with what he's done with VCU, he's not done climbing that ladder yet either.

Quote from: goscots on March 23, 2011, 09:49:31 PM
Mike Schmitz, the College of Wooster football coach spoke at the Luncheon Club in Canton about how difficult it is to recruit with the very high tuition at Wooster and the relatively modest aid that can be offered.

Although it is not specifically mentioned, could this issue become a problem for the basketball team also?

I read this as well.  I think this could become a problem in terms of finding quality kids that could recieve scholarship offers at the DII or NAIA level and still getting them to forego those scholarships offers and come to Wooster. 

I will say, due to the large discrepancy in the numbers you need to fill a football roster compared to a basketball roster, I would think it would be less of a problem for the basketball program.  Thow in the fact that the basketball program can boast things to potential recruits like the 2nd winningest program all-time, the highest win percentage in the 2000's of all divisions, seven straight NCAC championships and 3 Final Four appearances in the last 8 years including this year's runner-up finish and I'd say Coach Moore and Coach Cline should be able to still lure in some pretty solid recruits.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 25, 2011, 08:59:56 PM
Quote from: goscots on March 23, 2011, 09:49:31 PM
Mike Schmitz, the College of Wooster football coach spoke at the Luncheon Club in Canton about how difficult it is to recruit with the very high tuition at Wooster and the relatively modest aid that can be offered.

I can imagine that it would be difficult, but it's worth noting that Wooster has the lowest tuition of the Ohio Five (which also includes Oberlin, Kenyon, Denison, and OWU).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on March 27, 2011, 04:39:48 PM
SHAKA the world!  Kenyon grad takes VCU to the Final Four!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 29, 2011, 05:09:28 AM
Any information on potential recruits for Wooster next year?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on March 29, 2011, 08:51:53 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 25, 2011, 08:59:56 PM
Quote from: goscots on March 23, 2011, 09:49:31 PM
Mike Schmitz, the College of Wooster football coach spoke at the Luncheon Club in Canton about how difficult it is to recruit with the very high tuition at Wooster and the relatively modest aid that can be offered.

I can imagine that it would be difficult, but it's worth noting that Wooster has the lowest tuition of the Ohio Five (which also includes Oberlin, Kenyon, Denison, and OWU).
Not exactly hotbeds of college football. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jpope2 on March 29, 2011, 08:57:30 PM
Quote from: woolax on March 29, 2011, 05:09:28 AM
Any information on potential recruits for Wooster next year?

The Daily Record has local Northwestern standout Brennan McKean mentioned his interest in COW and also Marietta.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on April 04, 2011, 02:49:29 AM
Kudos to Butler's Brad Stevens (DePauw '99) on leading the Bulldogs back to the finals of the DI tourney.  May the trajectory and rim be more kind in Houston.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on April 15, 2011, 12:24:48 AM
Any recruiting updates for the NCAC teams?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on April 22, 2011, 02:15:18 PM
Did not think I would be the first to post Wabash's coach hiring, but apparently.

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2011/04/wabash-names-coach
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on April 22, 2011, 06:29:46 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on April 22, 2011, 02:15:18 PM
Did not think I would be the first to post Wabash's coach hiring, but apparently.

It's football season, what do you expect?

Congratulations to Coach Carpenter.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on April 23, 2011, 02:41:58 PM
It isn't football season, but that has nothing to do with it.  Y'all have made it clear who's welcome in this forum and who isn't.  That's got more to do with it than what time of year it is. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on April 23, 2011, 02:46:49 PM
Eye-rolling. Like the opposite doesn't happen on the NCAC football board?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on April 23, 2011, 04:14:40 PM
Maybe so.  But there's no need for HoFers here to be taking shots at people for not posting.  Turn the page already. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Joe Wally on April 26, 2011, 08:47:12 AM
It is going to be strange to head to Bash games this winter and not see Mac Petty patrolling the sideline.

All good things come to an end...best of luck to Coach Carpenter!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on April 26, 2011, 02:09:18 PM
It will be interesting with no Mac.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Knightmare on April 27, 2011, 10:17:42 AM
Quote from: woolax on March 29, 2011, 05:09:28 AM
Any information on potential recruits for Wooster next year?

Traverse City Central's (Lower Northern Michigan area) Dylan Roe will apparently be heading to Wooster.  Not often a kid from these parts heads down to Ohio, usually they all head somewhere in the MIAA.

http://record-eagle.com/sports/x103914403/TC-Centrals-Roe-commits-to-Wooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on April 27, 2011, 03:23:01 PM
Quote from: Knightmare on April 27, 2011, 10:17:42 AM
Quote from: woolax on March 29, 2011, 05:09:28 AM
Any information on potential recruits for Wooster next year?

Traverse City Central's (Lower Northern Michigan area) Dylan Roe will apparently be heading to Wooster.  Not often a kid from these parts heads down to Ohio, usually they all head somewhere in the MIAA.

http://record-eagle.com/sports/x103914403/TC-Centrals-Roe-commits-to-Wooster

Thanks for this. Most of us can't see the whole article. Any insightful quotes from Roe, his coach or from Wooster?

May post more on this down the road, but note how the article says "first" recruit for Wooster. I'm pretty sure that is a literal term in this case.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Knightmare on April 27, 2011, 09:48:08 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on April 27, 2011, 03:23:01 PM
Quote from: Knightmare on April 27, 2011, 10:17:42 AM
Quote from: woolax on March 29, 2011, 05:09:28 AM
Any information on potential recruits for Wooster next year?

Traverse City Central's (Lower Northern Michigan area) Dylan Roe will apparently be heading to Wooster.  Not often a kid from these parts heads down to Ohio, usually they all head somewhere in the MIAA.

http://record-eagle.com/sports/x103914403/TC-Centrals-Roe-commits-to-Wooster

Thanks for this. Most of us can't see the whole article. Any insightful quotes from Roe, his coach or from Wooster?

May post more on this down the road, but note how the article says "first" recruit for Wooster. I'm pretty sure that is a literal term in this case.

That's the local paper and I can't see the whole article either, unless I pay and I'm not willing to do that ;-).  It'll at least give you a start and name to allow you to google him and see other info from AAU and other free publications.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo84 on May 16, 2011, 07:37:55 PM
I heard Wooster was showing interest in a kid from Akron Hoban, Evan Pannel, but I don't know what transpired. I haven't heard where he might be going. Does anybody know? I understand he is very good, a fine man, and an  :)excellent student.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on June 01, 2011, 11:57:21 AM
Denison has a new website, and more - a new assistant coach we are all familiar with! 
I never saw an announcement on this anywhere.  Any Tiger fans know about Chris Sullivan joining the Big Red coaching staff? 

http://denisonbigred.com/information/directory/bios/sullivan_chris

Congratulations and good luck to Chris in his coaching career!




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on June 02, 2011, 01:35:18 PM
Congrats to Chris - good luck to him and the Big Red!

OWU assistant coach Marcus Gill hired as head coach at Earlham.  
http://www.goearlham.com/news/2011/5/25/MBB_0525110337.aspx
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 04, 2011, 12:37:37 PM
Quote from: woo84 on May 16, 2011, 07:37:55 PM
I heard Wooster was showing interest in a kid from Akron Hoban, Evan Pannel, but I don't know what transpired. I haven't heard where he might be going. Does anybody know? I understand he is very good, a fine man, and an  :)excellent student.

With some internet sleuthing, here is information on some Wooster recruits:

Evan Pannell will be attending Wooster next year per Akron Hoban's website.  Evan Pannell is a 6'1" quick guard that led Akron Hoban this past season at 20.2 ppg.  Pannell was selected All District 1st Team and was also a Division II, All-Ohio Special Mention player.  Evan's best high school game this past season was 38 points and 13 rebounds vs. Lake Catholic.

Kendal Sherrod 6'4" was a leader on Columbus Bishop Hartley's Division II team that finished 22-2 and reached the State Final Four.  Sherrod averaged 11.4 ppg on a balanced squad and he was All District 3rd Team.

Dylan Roe 6'2" Michigan Class A All-State Mention.  Averaged over 20 PPG (previously posted)

T.J. Bretz 6'5" from West Carrollton High.  He averaged 11.0 ppg and 5.6 rpg this past season.

Jalen Goodwin 6'0" guard from Lakota East HS.  Averaged 8.8 ppg and was 2nd Team Greater Miami Conference

I have also heard some rumblings that Wooster may get a transfer from Tusculum College (TN) and a player from Bowling Green High School (OH) though I have not confirmed any specific names yet.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo84 on June 06, 2011, 04:38:24 PM
Sounds good for the Scots! I'm happy to see Pannell from Hoban going to Wooster. He is something special from what I understand. :)Thanks for the information!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on June 18, 2011, 11:50:10 AM
Wooster got one more commitment in the last few days:

Zach Baker 6'1" Guard from Milford HS.  Baker was Fort Ancient Valley Conference Player of the Year as he led his team to a conference title.  Averaged 13 ppg and shot 44% on three pointers.  SW All District Special Mention.

Here is a link to Baker's signing photo: http://www.milfordathletics.org/forms/1308072199-11_baker_signs.pdf
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo84 on June 18, 2011, 03:44:42 PM
Wooster has excellent guards coming in:Pannell, Roe, Baker, and Goodwin. The big men, Bretz and Sherrod, look good as well. I'm curious to see if we got any other committments from other states that we don't know about. We always get kids from Pa. or WVA. I'm anxious to see if we got any transfers. Wittenberg appears to have gotten some quality big men-ie, Levi Burns is one of them. Should be a lot of fun to see how the season plays out!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo84 on June 18, 2011, 03:49:44 PM
Allen Derosa, another big man, from St.Clairsville is another Witt recruit who looks good.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on June 25, 2011, 11:15:42 PM
Here is a local bit of news from some former Scot players....

Below is the lead in from the from the following link:
http://dawgdaysbasketball.com/tournament_recap_6_18_2011.htm


Good Ole Days Win Dawg Days 2011 Title  June 18, 2011

With many familiar faces participating in Dawg Days Basketball 2011, it was a newcomer that took home the grand prize. Good Ole Days was able to rally from a 1-0 deficit in the championship series to win the tournament when Tom Port drained a 23 foot three pointer to lift his team to a 30-27 victory over Team Zacour. Three of the winning team's members were first time participants in the event. Port, Rodney Overmyer, and Antwyan Reynolds joined tournament veteran Tim Vandervaart to form the winning foursome. Vandervaart was named the 2011 tournament MVP.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo84 on June 26, 2011, 06:34:27 PM
Good to see some former Scots playing basketball still. Port was a darn good player as were the others!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster15dad on June 28, 2011, 07:09:52 PM
  Just wanted to say my son will be attending The College of Wooster this fall and be playing basketball.

  He is very excited about being able to play ball at Wooster and is working hard in the summer to improve his game and his strength. 

  My family and I are all excited about this and look forward to experiencing basketball at Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Turner on June 28, 2011, 07:15:04 PM
Welcome to the boards, Wooster15Dad!

Enjoy the four years.  They will be gone before you know it.  (But I am not telling you anything.  It was just yesterday, he was playing "Little Dribblers".)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster15dad on June 28, 2011, 07:17:59 PM
  You are right.  The will fly by.  Just very excited about my son playing at Wooster and all the oppurtunity it brings with it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo84 on June 29, 2011, 09:13:50 PM
I cannot think of a better school, coach, or program than Wooster....I know I am biased, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster15dad on June 30, 2011, 06:17:07 PM
  When we went for our first visit to Wooster,  my son knew he was going to go there.  Coach Moore, coach Cline and the team did such a nice job of  showing us around and making us feel at home.

   My son loved the campus the academics and the basketball program.  He is really excited about playing at Wooster.  He is working hard on his game and is counting down the days before he arrives.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo84 on July 02, 2011, 01:39:56 PM
I'm glad to hear your son is very excited about Wooster! When I visited Wooster, I loved the campus and the proximity of it to my home. The campus is beautiful in the fall and seeing the pipers and the band playing at halftime at football games was great. The academics are excellent and very highly rated. We have a great fan-base and your son will have a wonderful experience.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 13, 2011, 05:11:00 PM
The National Association of Basketball Coaches (NABC) today named the members of its Honors Court (http://static.psbin.com/9/o/90rkhw0aaliufx/Release_-__2010-11_NABC_Honors_Court.pdf), "recognizing those collegiate basketball student-athletes who excelled in academics during the 2010-11 season."  The criteria for selection were as follows:
1. Academically a junior or senior and a varsity player.
2. Cumulative G.P.A. of 3.2 or higher at the conclusion of the 2010-11 academic year.
3. Students must have matriculated at least one year at their current institution.
4. Member of an NCAA Division I, II, III, or NAIA Institution.

The following NCAC players were accorded this honor:
Denison: Rob Deaton, Larry Farmer, Casey Stockton
Kenyon: Anthony Chun
Oberlin: Patrick Bernhard, James Tompsett
Ohio Wesleyan: Tim Brady
Wittenberg: Clayton Black, Alex Brandt, Michael Duffy, Sam Gardner, Jacob Weide
Wooster: Nathan Balch, Matt Fegan, Ian Franks

Congratulations to these 15 elite student-athletes!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on July 23, 2011, 09:35:37 AM
Continuing their recent trend of playing a Division 1 team in an exhibition game (Kent State, Ohio Univ. the last couple of years), Wooster will play D1 Bradley University in Peoria, IL on November 8th.

Here is the link to Bradley's schedule where Wooster is listed along with Michigan, Wisconsin, others :) ;D:
http://www.bradleybraves.com/SportSelect.dbml?&DB_OEM_ID=3400&SPID=1498&SPSID=19332
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on July 24, 2011, 03:07:05 PM
A few of Wooster's nonconference games this upcoming season are now clear from other teams' schedules.

For the Al Van Wie tourney, it will be a HCAC - NCAC challenge.  Wooster will host Defiance College on November 18th and Anderson University on November 19th.  Ohio Wesleyan is the other NCAC team that will also play the two HCAC teams on 11/18 and 11/19 at Wooster.

On January 4th, Wooster will play a road game at Geneva College in Beaver Falls, PA.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster15dad on July 25, 2011, 09:08:45 PM
Wooscotfan,

  My son will be a freshman and playing basketball this year at Wooster.  Do you know when the schedule for Wooster usually comes out?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on July 26, 2011, 07:11:54 AM
I would expect it to be any time.  You can get the NCAC games here...
http://www2.northcoast.org/sites/default/files/mbasketball/NCAC%20MBB%202011-12%20-%20Draft%209-16-10%20%28rev%203-4-11%29_0.pdf (http://www2.northcoast.org/sites/default/files/mbasketball/NCAC%20MBB%202011-12%20-%20Draft%209-16-10%20%28rev%203-4-11%29_0.pdf)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 26, 2011, 03:53:26 PM
Please welcome new assistant coach Jesse McClung (http://www.wabash.edu/news/displaystory.cfm?news_ID=9073) to Wabash College, the NCAC, and Division III.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster15dad on July 26, 2011, 07:22:21 PM
Thanks 50!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on July 27, 2011, 11:56:50 AM
If I had to guess, I would say that the Wabash and DePauw games would both be in the afternoon (for travel reasons) and all the rest in the evenings.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 03, 2011, 01:03:36 AM
Gonna be a fun year in the ol' NCAC...with the Dannies coming into the league. And the resumption of the Indiana two-step with Gheny and Hiram (this year going east).

Now, what's tossing in my head is the unfortunate chance that I may have to ROOT for the Dannies to beat Witt and Wooster in their last two games (OUCH, what a closing duo) in order for Wabash to gain seeding in the NCAC tourney.

But upgrading DePauw over Earlham? Priceless! Oh, you know it's true...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 06, 2011, 12:45:49 PM
Two more nonconference games for Wooster this season are now clear from other teams' schedules:

On Sunday November 27th, Wooster will play a 5pm afternoon game at Wilmington College

On Saturday December 3rd, Wooster will play a 3pm afternoon game at Adrian College (MI)

Still looking for the teams that will play in the Mose Hole Classic this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 08, 2011, 01:09:32 PM
Forbes Magazine, which seems to be all about lists these days, has released its Top Colleges list for this year. I admit on the front end that this list uses some suspect methodologies, but it's worth a look if only for the fun of it.

http://www.forbes.com/top-colleges/

The entire NCAC is within the top 226, roughly equivalent to the top 4% of all US colleges. Every school in the NCAC outranks the top-rated OAC school (John Carroll at #256) and, somewhat more surprisingly, Case Western Reserve (#253). In fact, the top 5 schools in Ohio are all NCAC schools, and all seven NCAC schools in Ohio are in the state's top 8, with only Xavier interrupting the parade. We also claim two of the top 3 schools in Indiana. DePauw (#50) is a big upgrade from Earlham (#376). Five NCAC schools crack the national top 100, a list that excludes such highly regarded institutions as Johns Hopkins, Washington U. in St. Louis, and the Universities of Washington, Illinois, Texas, Indiana (224!), and Wisconsin (316!!).

It looks like the NESCAC, whose entire membership (including Hamilton) is in the top 100, may be the only D3 conference whose lowest-ranked member (Trinity at #80) is higher than ours (OWU at #226).

Ah, it's all in good fun.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on August 10, 2011, 10:14:39 AM
Wooster's schedule is now posted...
http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/schedule (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/schedule)

Dec. 19-20 are listed as "TBA".  With 13 home games already, perhaps an away tournament full through?

Non-conference schedule
Anderson
Defiance
at Wilmington
at Adrian
Thiel
Heidelberg
Geneva
plus the two TBA's
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on August 11, 2011, 12:01:48 PM
2011-12 Wittenberg University Men's Basketball Schedule

Date            Opponent               Time
Nov. 15         IU-EAST               7:30 p.m.
Nov. 22          CAPITAL                7 p.m.
Nov. 29          at Marietta                7:30 p.m.
Dec. 3             OBERLIN*                3 p.m.
Dec. 7             at Wooster*                7:30 p.m.
Dec. 10          at Allegheny*                3 p.m.
Dec. 20          at Ohio Northern             7:30 p.m.
Dec. 22          OTTERBEIN                7:30 p.m.
Dec. 29          Charles B. Zimmerman Memorial Classic   TBA
Dec. 30          Charles B. Zimmerman Memorial Classic   TBA
Jan. 3             Maryville College Classic         TBA
Jan. 4            Maryville College Classic         TBA
Jan. 7             at Ohio Wesleyan*             3 p.m.
Jan. 11          at Kenyon*                7:30 p.m.
Jan. 14          DENISON*                3 p.m.
Jan. 18          WABASH*                7:30 p.m.
Jan. 21          at Hiram*                4 p.m.
Jan. 25          DEPAUW*                7:30 p.m.
Jan. 28          at Oberlin*                3 p.m.
Feb. 1             OHIO WESLEYAN*             7:30 p.m.
Feb. 4             ALLEGHENY*             3 p.m.
Feb. 8             at Wabash*                7:30 p.m.
Feb. 11          WOOSTER*                7:30 p.m.
Feb. 15          at DePauw*                7:30 p.m.
Feb. 18          HIRAM*                4 p.m.
Feb. 21          NCAC Tournament Quarterfinals      TBA
Feb. 24          NCAC Tournament Semifinals      TBA
Feb. 25          NCAC Tournament Finals         TBA
HOME GAMES IN CAPS
*North Coast Athletic Conference Games
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: OC_SID on August 11, 2011, 02:31:36 PM
Quote from: WAlum on August 11, 2011, 12:01:48 PM
2011-12 Wittenberg University Men's Basketball Schedule

Date            Opponent               Time
Nov. 15         IU-EAST               7:30 p.m.
Nov. 22          CAPITAL                7 p.m.
Nov. 29          at Marietta                7:30 p.m.
Dec. 3             OBERLIN*                3 p.m.
Dec. 7             at Wooster*                7:30 p.m.
Dec. 10          at Allegheny*                3 p.m.
Dec. 20          at Ohio Northern             7:30 p.m.
Dec. 22          OTTERBEIN                7:30 p.m.
Dec. 29          Charles B. Zimmerman Memorial Classic   TBA
Dec. 30          Charles B. Zimmerman Memorial Classic   TBA
Jan. 3             Maryville College Classic         TBA
Jan. 4            Maryville College Classic         TBA
Jan. 7             at Ohio Wesleyan*             3 p.m.
Jan. 11          at Kenyon*                7:30 p.m.
Jan. 14          DENISON*                3 p.m.
Jan. 18          WABASH*                7:30 p.m.
Jan. 21          at Hiram*                4 p.m.
Jan. 25          DEPAUW*                7:30 p.m.
Jan. 28          at Oberlin*                3 p.m.
Feb. 1             OHIO WESLEYAN*             7:30 p.m.
Feb. 4             ALLEGHENY*             3 p.m.
Feb. 8             at Wabash*                7:30 p.m.
Feb. 11          WOOSTER*                7:30 p.m.
Feb. 15          at DePauw*                7:30 p.m.
Feb. 18          HIRAM*                4 p.m.
Feb. 21          NCAC Tournament Quarterfinals      TBA
Feb. 24          NCAC Tournament Semifinals      TBA
Feb. 25          NCAC Tournament Finals         TBA
HOME GAMES IN CAPS
*North Coast Athletic Conference Games


Here's what I was given for the Zimmerman Tournament pairings:

Thursday, Dec. 29, 2011
    4:30 p.m.  Olivet College (MI) vs Marian University (IN)
    7:00 p.m.  Monmouth College (IL) vs Wittenberg University

Friday, Dec. 30, 2011
    2:15 p.m.  Men's Third Place Game
    7:00 p.m.  Men's Championship Game
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on August 12, 2011, 02:43:04 PM
OHIO WESLEYAN 11-12 SCHEDULE

Nov.  15     at Hanover                        
Nov.  18     at Wooster Al Van Wie Rotary Classic
                Anderson vs. Ohio Wesleyan      
                Defiance vs. Wooster              
Nov.  19     at Wooster Al Van Wie Rotary Classic
            Defiance vs. Ohio Wesleyan        
            Anderson vs. Wooster            
Nov.  22     FRANKLIN                          
Nov.  25     at Rhodes Thanksgiving Classic
            Ohio Wesleyan vs. Washington (Mo.)
            Principia vs. Rhodes              
Nov.  26     at Rhodes Thanksgiving Classic          
Dec.   3     ALLEGHENY*                        
Dec.   7     KENYON*                          
Dec.  10     at DePauw*                        
Dec.  28     at Otterbein Smokey Ballenger Classic            
Dec.  29     at Otterbein Smokey Ballenger Classic
                           
Jan.   2     CAPITAL                                
Jan.   7     WITTENBERG*                      
Jan.  11     at Denison*                          
Jan.  14     at Allegheny*                      
Jan.  18     HIRAM*                              
Jan.  21     at Wooster*                        
Jan.  25     WABASH*                          
Jan.  28     DE PAUW*                          
Feb.   1     at Wittenberg*                    
Feb.   4     at Oberlin*                      
Feb.   8     WOOSTER*                        
Feb.  11     at Hiram*                        
Feb.  15     at Wabash*                        
Feb.  18     DENISON*                          
Feb.  21     NCAC tournament quarterfinal      
Feb.  24     NCAC tournament semifinal        
Feb.  25     NCAC tournament championship      

Good non-league schedule for OWU:  Wash U, Hanover, Capital, Anderson, Defiance, and a few tournament TBA's.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on August 12, 2011, 02:47:38 PM
Allegheny Schedule

11/15/2011        Bethany    
11/18/2011        Pitt-Bradford    
11/19/2011        Point Park / Penn State-Fayette    
11/22/2011        Carnegie Mellon
11/26/2011        Elmira    
11/27/2011        Wells / Rochester    
11/30/2011        Baldwin-Wallace    
12/3/2011    *   Ohio Wesleyan    
12/7/2011        Case Western Reserve    
12/13/2011        Thiel    
1/6/2012    *           DePauw    
1/7/2012    *           Wabash    
1/11/2012        *   Oberlin    
1/14/2012        *   Ohio Wesleyan    
1/18/2012        *   Wooster    
1/21/2012        *   Denison    
1/25/2012        *   Hiram    
1/28/2012         *   Kenyon    
2/1/2012                *     Oberlin    
2/4/2012               *   Wittenberg    
2/8/2012           *   Hiram    
2/11/2012    *   Denison    
2/15/2012    *   Wooster    
2/18/2012    *   Kenyon    
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster15dad on August 23, 2011, 07:22:53 PM
We are dropping my son off tomorrow at Wooster and he is very excited about the school and becoming part of the Wooster family.  He will be playing basketball at Wooster and has worked really hard during the summer on improving his strength and working on his shot and he is ready to go!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on August 23, 2011, 08:45:04 PM
And all of us at Wooster are looking forward to the rest of the class (about a third of them are already here) arriving tomorrow.  The latest that I've heard is 573 members of the Class of 2015, plus about 15 incoming transfers.  With an army volunteers helping, move-in night should be as painless as possible, except for possible traffic jams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on August 24, 2011, 07:21:56 PM
Wooster15dad - we are aware your son will be on the roster at Wooster this year.  You've informed us three times.  We wish your son good luck at school and are glad you feel you've found the right place for him.  Let's move on, though. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on August 24, 2011, 08:39:19 PM
Wooster15dad,

Feel free to ignore BigRed. This is the same guy that said Wooster didn't have the composure or toughness to even win the NCAC last season. I thought a trip to the National Title game, which included maybe the greatest comeback in Div. III Final Four history might humble him a little bit, or at least cause him to put a little more thought before he posted something as ignorant and clueless as this and some of his other posts - but alas, I guess we are blessed to have his insightful comments again this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 25, 2011, 10:46:07 PM
Heck, if my daughters had a chance to play sports (or be in theater, or in the orchestra, or do top level research in biochemistry) I'd tell everyone about 50 bazillion times. Proud parents allowed!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on August 26, 2011, 12:38:25 PM
Looks like Allegheny College is going on the air (http://alleghenysports.com/news/2011/8/26/FB_0826115303.aspx) for basketball this season (other sports, too, including football.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nuscottsfan on August 26, 2011, 04:11:14 PM
Wooster15dad,

Be very sure that we all welcome your son and yourselves into the Wooster Hoops family...heck, we welcome you to Wooster period! It is a premier college that happens to have incredible life building offerings to young men and women to begin their adult lives.

A few years ago my son began the exact same trek that yours is now beginning and I am astounded at how he's become such a fine young man (I knew he had it in him lol!). From President Grant Cornwell to the Men's Basketball coaching staff to each and every one of his professors and student associates his journey into adulthood via the College of Wooster has been indescribably fortunate for us and for him. Be proud of your boy regardless of BidRed's misplaced irritations...they are presumably left over from the last few seasons.

So, now to basketball.....I get the feeling that the Fighting Scots are being perceived as less than the favorite in the NCAC this year which I think will be just fine with the boys. As with probably all teams throughout the league there is plenty of returning talent. What I think is being overlooked is, what was last year bench strength and, for this year, the recruiting class. I believe that there's a cautious optimism emanating from all the kids.

Regards to all and Let's Go Scots!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 26, 2011, 09:49:19 PM
The NCAC had four teams in the top 100 of Massey last year, and now adding DPU, which was down at 106 (down for them), means the NCAC isn't going to be an easy romp for anyone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 26, 2011, 09:55:22 PM
Wabash's Schedule:

http://sports.wabash.edu/schedule.aspx?path=mbball

11/19/2011    Calumet College of St. Joseph (Ind.)  H       
11/20/2011    University of Saint Francis (Ill.)     H   

Mike Rokicki Community vs. Cancer Classic @ Greencastle
11/26/2011    Elmhurst College   
11/27/2011    DePauw or Purdue - North Central

11/30/2011    Rose-Hulman Institute of Technology  A       
12/3/2011           Denison University                              A
12/6/2011           Millikin University                          H
12/10/2011    The College of Wooster                      H

Don Lane Tournament @ Lexington, KY
12/20/2011    Baldwin-Wallace College       
12/21/2011    Transylvania or Hendrix   

12/29/2011    Franklin College                           H
1/6/2012           Hiram College                               A
1/7/2012           Allegheny College                               A
1/11/2012           DePauw University                               H
1/14/2012          Oberlin College                               H
1/18/2012          Wittenberg University                       A
1/21/2012           Kenyon College                               H
1/25/2012          Ohio Wesleyan University                       A
1/28/2012          Denison University                               H
2/1/2012          DePauw University                               A
2/4/2012         The College of Wooster                       A   
2/8/2012         Wittenberg University                       H
2/11/2012         Kenyon College                               A
2/15/2012          Ohio Wesleyan University                       H
2/18/2012        Oberlin College                                       A

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on August 26, 2011, 10:17:05 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on August 24, 2011, 08:39:19 PM
Wooster15dad,

Feel free to ignore BigRed. This is the same guy that said Wooster didn't have the composure or toughness to even win the NCAC last season. I thought a trip to the National Title game, which included maybe the greatest comeback in Div. III Final Four history might humble him a little bit, or at least cause him to put a little more thought before he posted something as ignorant and clueless as this and some of his other posts - but alas, I guess we are blessed to have his insightful comments again this year.

Seinfeld: for the record, here's what I said:

"I don't think they have the heads for sweeping conference play and going deep in the tournament any more."

While my comments may irritate you, they are no more thoughtless nor more ignorant than yours .  Point of fact: the Scots didn't sweep conference play.  I concede I was wrong about them going deep in the tourney, but you have to admit, the run was wind assisted.  Home court advantage was a nice plus for them.   

I refrained from commenting after their performance in the final game knowing how painful it had to be.  Look at what happened, though.  Compare/contrast my comments and what I said I saw at Livingston versus the flow of the final game, their inability to hold the lead and the final margin.  I'm still surprised they went as deep as they did given the mindset I saw in Livingston when the pressure was on. 

As far as the parents' pride.  I understand it and also welcome it to a degree, but let's temper it. 

And I'll be around as long as the Witt and Wabash faithful hold on here too.

I see Witt on top next year.     
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 27, 2011, 10:22:05 AM
The Wooster team recently returned from a trip to Ireland and Scotland where they won 3 of 4 exhibition games.

Here is a link to the trip story on the Wooster website: http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/releases/20110826h1n2ag

Link to Senior Matt Fegan's trip journal: http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/releases/20110826mmmqc1
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on August 28, 2011, 05:22:48 PM
Quote from: GoRed on August 26, 2011, 10:17:05 PM


I refrained from commenting after their performance in the final game knowing how painful it had to be.  Look at what happened, though.  Compare/contrast my comments and what I said I saw at Livingston versus the flow of the final game, their inability to hold the lead and the final margin.  I'm still surprised they went as deep as they did given the mindset I saw in Livingston when the pressure was on. 


Exactly what was the mindset of the team that made the largest comeback in D3 Final Four history vs. a very good Williams team in the national semi-finals?   You're just digging yourself deeper into a hole with your flawed argument.  Why you're still trying to argue this point is beyond me?!

BTW, as a father of 3 myself, I see nothing wrong with being a proud papa!  Temper not your pride for your son's accomplishments!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on August 28, 2011, 07:42:20 PM
Quote from: GoRed on August 26, 2011, 10:17:05 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on August 24, 2011, 08:39:19 PM
Wooster15dad,

Feel free to ignore BigRed. This is the same guy that said Wooster didn't have the composure or toughness to even win the NCAC last season. I thought a trip to the National Title game, which included maybe the greatest comeback in Div. III Final Four history might humble him a little bit, or at least cause him to put a little more thought before he posted something as ignorant and clueless as this and some of his other posts - but alas, I guess we are blessed to have his insightful comments again this year.

Seinfeld: for the record, here's what I said:

"I don't think they have the heads for sweeping conference play and going deep in the tournament any more."

While my comments may irritate you, they are no more thoughtless nor more ignorant than yours .  Point of fact: the Scots didn't sweep conference play.  I concede I was wrong about them going deep in the tourney, but you have to admit, the run was wind assisted.  Home court advantage was a nice plus for them.   

Big Red, you said my comments were thoughtless and ignorant, but you just admitted you made a mistake that I pointed out. If I'm this thoughtless and ignorant, please, can I have more. And what was thoughtless? You more or less said Wittenberg and Wabash were better teams, or at least better composed teams, than Wooster. You were wrong about that. You said Wooster wouldn't go far in the tourney. You were wrong about that. The larger point is if you are going to come out of nowhere and make big statements or take shots at a team or player, when you are proven so unbelievably wrong, you'd think you'd either acknowledge that, or move on to a different subject. You obviously are incapable of either.

I do apologize for not recognizing that you were the moderator of this board and able to suggest when a topic should be moved on. Maybe that is what you were referring to when you said I was "thoughtless and ignorant."

P.S. - And by the way, it is pretty disingenuous for you to imply, or in your words, I was "thoughtless and ignorant" to state that you predicted Wooster wouldn't win the conference. While you may have never exactly typed these words, your comments about Wooster last season in general certainly indicated that sentiment, and in particular your comments after they lost to Wittenberg in February all but claimed where you stood on this. And to come back months after the season is over and take their performance in the national title game as evidence you were right about their composure, but in the same breath then say you did in fact pick them to win, that is some pretty good twisting of common sense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 28, 2011, 11:01:29 PM
Funny, complaining about Wooster's performance in the TITLE game is equivalent to complaining the Steelers lost the Super Bowl in a close game.

I'm not a Wooster booster (nor the...) but c'mon man, they made the TITLE GAME!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster15dad on August 29, 2011, 10:23:00 PM
Thanks for the nice words.  I was in no way talking about my son other then how excited all of us are for him to attend Wooster and to play ball for such a great program.  My son is thrilled to be there and I did not know saying that more then once would offend anyone. 

In my family we take pride in all the things we work hard at and accomplish.  We are proud of our son and proud that he was able to go to Wooster,  that is all I was saying. 

Go Scots!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on September 16, 2011, 01:40:49 PM
Anyone have any Pre-season predictions?  I will go with:
1. Wooster
2. Witt
3. DePauw
4. Ohio Wesleyan
5. Wabash
6. Denison
7. Hiram
8. Allegheny
9. Kenyon
10. Oberlin
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on September 21, 2011, 03:00:52 PM
Five Minutes with Denison senior Mike Garabedian (http://northcoastconference.blogspot.com/2011/09/five-minutes-with-mike-garabedian.html). Really good. His points about time management and the value of playing at the D3 level are spot-on.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on September 24, 2011, 10:49:38 AM
Sporting News Division III Season Preview is out.  Top 10 teams picked are:
1. Virginia Wesleyan
2. Marietta (OH)
3. Augustana (IL)
4. Williams (MA)
5. St. Mary's (MD)
6. Rochester (NY)
7. Frankin & Marshall (PA)
8. Oswego State (NY)
9. Wisconsin-Stevens Point
10. Cabrini (PA)  --- Hard to believe after Wooster overwhelmed them last year in the NCAA tourney.

Wooster, Wittenberg and John Carroll are listed as Possible Breakthrough teams.

On the All-America teams, the only NCAC players are Clayton Black of Wittenberg and Justin Hallowell of Wooster and they are both on the Honorable Mention list.  No NCAC players on the First or Second Teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nuscottsfan on September 25, 2011, 01:00:06 AM
wooscotsfan, Googled "Sporting News Division III Season Preview" and couldn't find that info. Could you post a link please?
Thanks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on September 25, 2011, 11:27:26 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on September 24, 2011, 10:49:38 AM
Sporting News Division III Season Preview is out.  Top 10 teams picked are:
1. Virginia Wesleyan
2. Marietta (OH)
3. Augustana (IL)
4. Williams (MA)
5. St. Mary's (MD)
6. Rochester (NY)
7. Frankin & Marshall (PA)
8. Oswego State (NY)
9. Wisconsin-Stevens Point
10. Cabrini (PA)  --- Hard to believe after Wooster overwhelmed them last year in the NCAA tourney.

What did you expect, vis-a-vis Cabrini? It's the Sporting News D3 preseason poll, which means that the expertise on display is minimal at best. They typically just look at last year's tourney teams, subtract the seniors, and make the picks from what's left. The only D3 preseason poll that shows any depth of knowledge of the division -- in other words, the only one that matters -- is the one put out by d3hoops.com.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on September 25, 2011, 02:41:37 PM
Quote from: nuscottsfan on September 25, 2011, 01:00:06 AM
wooscotsfan, Googled "Sporting News Division III Season Preview" and couldn't find that info. Could you post a link please?
Thanks!

There is no link because this a paid publication and not free info on the internet.  I bought this Sporting News issue because it also covers DI ball and I also follow the Ohio State Buckeyes which are picked #3 in this preview.

I have posted on D3Hoops for several years now and I fully understand the weakness of the Sporting News DIII preview.  The Cabrini comment was just my observation to indicate that there is limited credibility to this preview.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on September 27, 2011, 03:03:34 PM
Quote from: WAlum on September 16, 2011, 01:40:49 PM
Anyone have any Pre-season predictions?  I will go with:
1. Wooster
2. Witt
3. DePauw
4. Ohio Wesleyan
5. Wabash
6. Denison
7. Hiram
8. Allegheny
9. Kenyon
10. Oberlin

Its a little early, and its tough not knowing anything about recruits (outside of Wooster.)  But I think there will be jockeying between 3 different tiers of teams.  With Wooster and Wittenberg both losing a good portion of their scoring from last year maybe the league will be more competitive this season - but we've said that in the past with little variation for the last decade or so...

1. Wooster
2. Witt
Witt loses Hill and Sullivan. Wooster loses Franks, Balch, Wickliffe.  I've heard that the Scots have some good-looking recruits, but you never really know how those guys will develop and work into the system.  The early part of the season will be key to both teams.  Cooper and McKee will likely not be available or at least not in basketball condition by the Dec 7 game at Wooster, and the Tigers will be leaning heavily on Black in the early going.  The Scots will be trying to integrate at least 3 new starters into the lineup and could be relying very heavily on Hallowell until they figure out their rotation.  I'll go with Wooster if for no other reason than the guys on the end of the bench wearing suits.  I know that I'm biased toward Wooster, but its hard to believe that there are many coaching staffs better than Moore, Cline and Martin.
3.  OWU.  They were a good, young team last year and have an excellent coach.  If Wooster and Witt don't get things together early I think they could challenge for the title.  We'll get a good look at them early against Anderson and Defiance in Wooster.  They do have the misfortune of not drawing either Witt or Wooster until January when both should be rounded into mid-season form.

4 & 5 - Indiana.  I don't know much about DePauw except that it looks like they lost just about everyone from last year's team.  Wabash lost Wes Smith and Coach Petty, but they've got a good core left and should be pretty competitive.

6-10 - The rest.  I haven't looked too deeply at the rest of the league.  I'd probably rank Denison and Hiram at the top (of the bottom) and Oberlin bringing up the rear.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 01, 2011, 06:08:13 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on September 27, 2011, 03:03:34 PM
I'll go with Wooster if for no other reason than the guys on the end of the bench wearing suits.

You're picking Wooster because of Tom Love?  He's a good trainer, but...  Oh.  You meant the guys at the other end of the bench.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on October 04, 2011, 12:23:50 PM
Wooster's posted schedule has been updated with the December trip to the Puerto Rico Classic.

Dec 19 vs St. Mary's (MD)
Dec 20 at Sacred Heart, PR

http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/schedule
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 05, 2011, 12:09:57 AM
imderekpoe - thanks for the update on Wooster's schedule.

I don't know much about the University of Sacred Heart in Puerto Rico but St. Mary's (MD) is a quality D3 program.  St. Mary's has been to the Sweet Sixteen in 3 of the last 4 years.  Last season, St. Mary's made it to the Elite 8 in the NCAA tourney.  The Seahawks should give the Scots a very competitive game before the holiday break.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 18, 2011, 05:55:06 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on June 04, 2011, 12:37:37 PM
Quote from: woo84 on May 16, 2011, 07:37:55 PM
I heard Wooster was showing interest in a kid from Akron Hoban, Evan Pannel, but I don't know what transpired. I haven't heard where he might be going. Does anybody know? I understand he is very good, a fine man, and an  :)excellent student.

With some internet sleuthing, here is information on some Wooster recruits:

Evan Pannell will be attending Wooster next year per Akron Hoban's website.  Evan Pannell is a 6'1" quick guard that led Akron Hoban this past season at 20.2 ppg.  Pannell was selected All District 1st Team and was also a Division II, All-Ohio Special Mention player.  Evan's best high school game this past season was 38 points and 13 rebounds vs. Lake Catholic.

Kendal Sherrod 6'4" was a leader on Columbus Bishop Hartley's Division II team that finished 22-2 and reached the State Final Four.  Sherrod averaged 11.4 ppg on a balanced squad and he was All District 3rd Team.

Dylan Roe 6'2" Michigan Class A All-State Mention.  Averaged over 20 PPG (previously posted)

T.J. Bretz 6'5" from West Carrollton High.  He averaged 11.0 ppg and 5.6 rpg this past season.

Jalen Goodwin 6'0" guard from Lakota East HS.  Averaged 8.8 ppg and was 2nd Team Greater Miami Conference

I have also heard some rumblings that Wooster may get a transfer from Tusculum College (TN) and a player from Bowling Green High School (OH) though I have not confirmed any specific names yet.

The rumblings were correct and the Tusculum transfer is Kenny DeBoer 6'5" who played for Westerville North HS.  DeBoer averaged 12.3 ppg as a senior in high school and was an All Central District Division I Honorable Mention selection.  DeBoer was also recognized on the 2009-2010 Academic All-Ohio Division I team.

The player from Bowling Green High School is Xavier Brown 5'11"  Xavier Brown averaged 16.5 ppg and was a Northwest District Division I 3rd Team selection.

I have a paper copy of a Wooster preseason roster and will post it later tonight when I have time to type in all 24 names. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 18, 2011, 09:32:39 PM
Here are the 24 players on the Wooster preseason roster: ;D

Sr.  Mike Evans  Forward 6'4"
Sr.  Matt Fegan  Guard 6'1"
Sr.  Justin Hallowell  Forward 6'7"
Sr.  Gideon Mabeny  Center 7'0"
Sr.  Justin Warnes  Guard 6'3"
Jr.  Josh Claytor  Forward 6'6"
Jr.  Jake Mays  Center 6'8"
So.  Ryan Snyder  Guard 6'0"
So.  Scott Purcell  Forward 6'2"
So.  Jimmy Orie  Guard 6'2"
So.  Sam Runner  Forward 6'8"
So.  Doug Thorpe  Guard 5'9"
So.  Jack Counahan  Guard 5'11"
So.  Sam Schopler  Forward 6'3"
Fr.  Evan Pannell  Guard 6'1"  Akron Hoban HS
Fr.  Xavier Brown  Guard 5'11"  Bowling Green HS
Fr.  Kenny DeBoer  Forward 6'5"  Westerville North HS
Fr.  Dylan Roe  Guard 6'1"  Traverse City HS (MI)
Fr.  Kendal Sherrod  Forward 6'4"  Columbus Bishop Hartley HS
Fr.  T.J. Bretz  Forward 6'5"  West Carrollton HS
Fr.  Jon West  Forward 6'4"  Quaker Valley HS (PA)
Fr.  Zach Baker  Guard 6'1"  Milford HS
Fr.  Jalen Goodwin  Guard 6'0"  Lakota East HS
Fr.  Amadou Bah  Forward 6'6"  McNair HS (GA)

A few thoughts...interesting that Gideon Mabeny is back on the team as a Senior.  With 12 players returning who got some minutes last year, it will be difficult for any of the 10 freshmen to earn varsity playing time.

Of the freshmen, the best on paper look to be Evan Pannell, Xavier Brown and Dylan Roe if their scoring average is important.  As Wooster fans know, Coach Moore also emphasizes strong defense and it is not clear yet which freshmen will best meet that requirement.

Justin Hallowell will need to be Wooster's clutch scorer this year and hopefully some of the sophomores (Ryan Snyder?) will contribute more points.  Justin Warnes will continue to be the defensive stopper - still amazed at the job he did on Michael Taylor of Whitworth who was the D3 Player of the Year. :)  Sam Runner may be the 2nd big man off the bench this season getting some of the minutes available now with Wickliffe's graduation.  John Thompson is no longer on the roster even though he was on the recent Ireland trip but I don't have an explanation.

Likely Starters:  Justin Hallowell, Josh Claytor, Mike Evans, Matt Fegan, Justin Warnes

The roster also lists a new assistant coach:  Bryan Wickliffe :) (replacing Vandervaart who is not listed)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on October 19, 2011, 12:47:38 PM
Tim Vandervaart is now a graduate assistant men's soccer coach at Walsh University.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 19, 2011, 05:14:17 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on October 18, 2011, 09:32:39 PM
Here are the 24 players on the Wooster preseason roster: ;D

Sr.  Mike Evans  Forward 6'4"
Sr.  Matt Fegan  Guard 6'1"
Sr.  Justin Hallowell  Forward 6'7"
Sr.  Gideon Mabeny  Center 7'0"
Sr.  Justin Warnes  Guard 6'3"
Jr.  Josh Claytor  Forward 6'6"
Jr.  Jake Mays  Center 6'8"
So.  Ryan Snyder  Guard 6'0"
So.  Scott Purcell  Forward 6'2"
So.  Jimmy Orie  Guard 6'2"
So.  Sam Runner  Forward 6'8"
So.  Doug Thorpe  Guard 5'9"
So.  Jack Counahan  Guard 5'11"
So.  Sam Schopler  Forward 6'3"
Fr.  Evan Pannell  Guard 6'1"  Akron Hoban HS
Fr.  Xavier Brown  Guard 5'11"  Bowling Green HS
Fr.  Kenny DeBoer  Forward 6'5"  Westerville North HS
Fr.  Dylan Roe  Guard 6'1"  Traverse City HS (MI)
Fr.  Kendal Sherrod  Forward 6'4"  Columbus Bishop Hartley HS
Fr.  T.J. Bretz  Forward 6'5"  West Carrollton HS
Fr.  Jon West  Forward 6'4"  Quaker Valley HS (PA)
Fr.  Zach Baker  Guard 6'1"  Milford HS
Fr.  Jalen Goodwin  Guard 6'0"  Lakota East HS
Fr.  Amadou Bah  Forward 6'6"  McNair HS (GA)

A few thoughts...interesting that Gideon Mabeny is back on the team as a Senior.  With 12 players returning who got some minutes last year, it will be difficult for any of the 10 freshmen to earn varsity playing time.

Of the freshmen, the best on paper look to be Evan Pannell, Xavier Brown and Dylan Roe if their scoring average is important.  As Wooster fans know, Coach Moore also emphasizes strong defense and it is not clear yet which freshmen will best meet that requirement.

Justin Hallowell will need to be Wooster's clutch scorer this year and hopefully some of the sophomores (Ryan Snyder?) will contribute more points.  Justin Warnes will continue to be the defensive stopper - still amazed at the job he did on Michael Taylor of Whitworth who was the D3 Player of the Year. :)  Sam Runner may be the 2nd big man off the bench this season getting some of the minutes available now with Wickliffe's graduation.  John Thompson is no longer on the roster even though he was on the recent Ireland trip but I don't have an explanation.

Likely Starters:  Justin Hallowell, Josh Claytor, Mike Evans, Matt Fegan, Justin Warnes

The roster also lists a new assistant coach:  Bryan Wickliffe :) (replacing Vandervaart who is not listed)

That's amazing, and cool, that Mabeny is back on the team this season.  It begs the question as to why he chose not to play last year?

I'm not so sure I see Evans or Warnes as starters.  Evans has had much opportunity to improve since his freshman year and I've not seen it.  He offers little except a nice outside shooting touch; he's been a mediocre rebounder and poor defender.  He's not, either, someone that can help with the ballhandling chores under pressure.  Jake Mays may get this spot, making the Scots a little tougher inside.  Or, possibly, Scott Purcell.

Warnes made tremendous strides last season, becoming a premier defensive stopper.  He now understands the system, and even showed flashes of skill on offense.  But with he and Fegan on the court at the same time, you have no penetrators and a duo that isn't that strong against the full court press.  While I think Warnes should, and will, get more minutes this year, I think a lot of those will be at the three spot.  Heck, maybe he should start there, now that I think about it.

Thorpe, Fegan, Warnes, Claytor, Hallowell.  Thorpe more on the point than Fegan, where he can drive and dish.  Fegan as more of a spot-up shooter.  Mays, Snyder, and maybe Purcell off the bench.  Plus, of course, any freshmen that are ready to make the jump.  And, Mabeny still intrigues me, especially in a zone defense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 20, 2011, 01:44:24 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on October 18, 2011, 09:32:39 PM
Here are the 24 players on the Wooster preseason roster: ;D

Sr.  Mike Evans  Forward 6'4"
Sr.  Matt Fegan  Guard 6'1"
Sr.  Justin Hallowell  Forward 6'7"
Sr.  Gideon Mabeny  Center 7'0"
Sr.  Justin Warnes  Guard 6'3"
Jr.  Josh Claytor  Forward 6'6"
Jr.  Jake Mays  Center 6'8"
So.  Ryan Snyder  Guard 6'0"
So.  Scott Purcell  Forward 6'2"
So.  Jimmy Orie  Guard 6'2"
So.  Sam Runner  Forward 6'8"
So.  Doug Thorpe  Guard 5'9"
So.  Jack Counahan  Guard 5'11"
So.  Sam Schopler  Forward 6'3"
Fr.  Evan Pannell  Guard 6'1"  Akron Hoban HS
Fr.  Xavier Brown  Guard 5'11"  Bowling Green HS
Fr.  Kenny DeBoer  Forward 6'5"  Westerville North HS
Fr.  Dylan Roe  Guard 6'1"  Traverse City HS (MI)
Fr.  Kendal Sherrod  Forward 6'4"  Columbus Bishop Hartley HS
Fr.  T.J. Bretz  Forward 6'5"  West Carrollton HS
Fr.  Jon West  Forward 6'4"  Quaker Valley HS (PA)
Fr.  Zach Baker  Guard 6'1"  Milford HS
Fr.  Jalen Goodwin  Guard 6'0"  Lakota East HS
Fr.  Amadou Bah  Forward 6'6"  McNair HS (GA)

A few thoughts...interesting that Gideon Mabeny is back on the team as a Senior.  With 12 players returning who got some minutes last year, it will be difficult for any of the 10 freshmen to earn varsity playing time.

Of the freshmen, the best on paper look to be Evan Pannell, Xavier Brown and Dylan Roe if their scoring average is important.  As Wooster fans know, Coach Moore also emphasizes strong defense and it is not clear yet which freshmen will best meet that requirement.

Justin Hallowell will need to be Wooster's clutch scorer this year and hopefully some of the sophomores (Ryan Snyder?) will contribute more points.  Justin Warnes will continue to be the defensive stopper - still amazed at the job he did on Michael Taylor of Whitworth who was the D3 Player of the Year. :)  Sam Runner may be the 2nd big man off the bench this season getting some of the minutes available now with Wickliffe's graduation.  John Thompson is no longer on the roster even though he was on the recent Ireland trip but I don't have an explanation.

Likely Starters:  Justin Hallowell, Josh Claytor, Mike Evans, Matt Fegan, Justin Warnes

The roster also lists a new assistant coach:  Bryan Wickliffe :) (replacing Vandervaart who is not listed)

Thanks for the roster wsf.  I agree with you and WooBoo that it's nice to see Mabeny's name back on the roster.  I'm also curious as to why he chose not to play last season.

I also agree with you about Hallowell needing to be that clutch scorer.  He is Wooster's top returning point scorer by a wide margin as he averaged nearly 12 ppg and Matt Fegan was the next closest returning player at nearly 6 ppg.  So, IMO, Wooster is going to have to have a lot of newbies step up into scoring roles.  I'd like to see Matt Fegan get his shooting touch as well.  He's capable of averaging double figures if he can regain his shooting touch he displayed over his first 2 years at Wooster.  It will be interesting to see how some of last year's highly touted recruits step up as they are asked to contribute more as well. 

As for the preseason predictions, Wooster lost a TON of offensive production from last year's team.  They have to find a way to replace the 40 ppg from the 3 senior starters off of last year's team.  And those being asked to fill the void are all relatively unproven for the most part.  Due to this, I can't pick them as the preseason favorite.  I'd have to give the nod to either Witt or OWU at this point.  Furthermore, I know nothing about DePauw at the moment and I have to question how Wabash will fair without Wes, if I didn't drop 20+ on you it's because I was ill, Smith. 

Should be a fun year with what I would consider a wide open race at this point.  Can't wait for the hoops season to start! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on October 20, 2011, 08:10:36 PM
Preseason early look at Wabash, they are going to be solid.  Two good freshman, I see wabash starting 4 seniors...and by the way, they all can score, just did not need to with Wes taking most of the shots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rebounder club 03 on October 21, 2011, 11:17:09 AM
  Hallowell will be huge this year for Wooster.  We have enough returning players who received minutes last year to beat anyone.  Also have heard that four of the freshmen X. Brown, T.J. Bretz, E. Pannell and K. DeBoer all look really good.  Perhaps they will earn a few varsity minutes if their defense is up to Coach Moore's standards?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on October 21, 2011, 11:28:24 AM
Wooster and Witt will still end up at the top of the league.  OWU, DePauw, and Wabash are all right there and could jump into the top 2.  It should be a competitive year in the NCAC.  Denison has some talent to surprise and make the top 4 as well. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 21, 2011, 01:30:54 PM
Quote from: WAlum on October 21, 2011, 11:28:24 AM
Wooster and Witt will still end up at the top of the league.  OWU, DePauw, and Wabash are all right there and could jump into the top 2.  It should be a competitive year in the NCAC.  Denison has some talent to surprise and make the top 4 as well.

I just get the feeling with Wooster that we might get off to a bit of a rough start like we saw this team do 2 years ago.  Wooster struggled to find a rotation that worked and players struggled to figure out where they fit in over the first 9 games of the season and the result was that Wooster was just 5-4.  However, things came together just before the Holidays and Wooster finished the season winning 20 of their last 22 games and making it to the Sweet 16.

I just foresee similar growing pains for this team as they figure out who is going to step up and where players are going to fit in and as Moore figures out the rotations that work the best.  But I also see this team figuring a lot of that stuff out by the time conference play is full go.  I just feel that streak of 7 straight conference championships might be in jeopardy this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rebounder club 03 on October 21, 2011, 02:13:15 PM
Wooster may start a bit slow with the loss of the three seniors.  As the season goes on though,  I expect our boys to finish strong and perhaps suprise some by making the tournament. :)

I am telling everyone that Hallowell wil be an AA this year and that will be huge for Wooster! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 21, 2011, 06:50:46 PM
Wooster is going to have to come up with a team leader this season.  Three leaders have graduated, all accomplishing that important, and sometimes mysterious, attribute in different ways.  Of the returning players, none have yet come close to indicating that they can fill those shoes.  We'll just have to wait and see if that happens.

Where is Justin attending these meetings?  On campus?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rebounder club 03 on October 21, 2011, 07:01:50 PM
  I hope Justin doess all his AA work on the court.  LOL  You are correct,  Wooster has lost a lot of leadership.  Only time will tell who steps up this year as a leader/leaders.  It will happen though and Wooster will have a good chance to bring home another NCAC title!

  We have Hallowell and Fegan who are both seniors with a ton of minutes under their belts and I think that is where Wooster's leadership will come from.

  If what I am hearing about the four freshmen I mentioned in a past post is true and with all the returning players from last year,  not only is this year going to be a good one,  but the future of the program looks bright too.

  We all know coach Moore is an excellent coach and after a few games the Scots will be off and running.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 21, 2011, 08:00:27 PM
Hey rebounder.  Just wanted to welcome you to the board.  :)

I definitely think Hallowell has shown glimpses that he can step into that leadership role for the Scots.  I just think about that national semi-final game vs. Williams and he was the one showing the most fire and spirit even when the Scots were down big.  I thought he showed some good leadership traits in that game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rebounder club 03 on October 21, 2011, 08:50:01 PM
  I thought he  did too. Franks was such a strong leader last year along with Wickliffe that Justin didn't need to step up.  This year will be different for him and I am sure he will step into a strong leadership role.

  Glad I found this board.  Nice talking about Wooster basketball.   We will have a strong team this year and with the recruits we brought in this year Wooster is set for a while. 

  Will it be the same team as last year,  maybe not,  but Wooster will be there in the end.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on October 23, 2011, 06:38:48 PM
I"m ready for the season to start, hope to have good things from Witt. We know they have a ton coming back, but who will step up with the perimeter play is the big question.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 23, 2011, 06:43:01 PM
Wabash roster sans freshmen:

http://sports.wabash.edu/roster.aspx?path=mbball
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 23, 2011, 11:25:26 PM
Aaron Dorksen of the Wooster Daily Record has some comments about Scots basketball in his weekly column which can be found
at this link:  http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/5113595

Dorksen mentions that Coach Moore is optimistic about the upcoming season.  The three freshmen who are mentioned in the article as standouts are Xavier Brown, Evan Pannell and Kenny DeBoer.  There is also an explanation of why Wooster is traveling to D1 Bradley University for an exhibition game.  Geno Ford, the former Kent State coach, is now coaching Bradley and the Wooster coaches have a good relationship with Ford.  Many Wooster fans will recall that Coach Ford had his Kent State team play an exhibition game at Timken in 2009 to honor Doug Cline's late son, Corey.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 24, 2011, 09:56:22 AM
Preseason Top 25 is out!

http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2011-12/preseason

The highlights for the NCAC:

Wooster #9
Wittenberg #11
Wabash - ORV - #47

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 24, 2011, 10:39:50 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on October 23, 2011, 11:25:26 PMGeno Ford, the former Kent State coach, is now coaching Bradley and the Wooster coaches have a good relationship with Ford.
Geno also coached at Muskingum, where his father Gene is now the coach.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on October 24, 2011, 09:43:19 PM
Wabash roster not posted yet, there will be freshman and possibly one freshman starter.  I really hope everyone continues to overlook Wabash.  To have Witt and Wooster in the top 25 without Wabash....very interesting.  They will start 4 seniors and if no one pays attention, prepare to be surprised.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on October 25, 2011, 12:05:57 PM
Great start in the polls for the "W" teams.  Congrats to the Scots, Tigers, and Little Giants on the pre-season rankings.  Any NCAC teams scrimmaging this week?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 26, 2011, 10:27:51 AM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on October 24, 2011, 09:43:19 PM
Wabash roster not posted yet, there will be freshman and possibly one freshman starter. I really hope everyone continues to overlook Wabash.  To have Witt and Wooster in the top 25 without Wabash....very interesting.  They will start 4 seniors and if no one pays attention, prepare to be surprised.

Let's see.  You lost by far your best player and your head coach of how many years?  Is it really questionalble to not find Wabash in the preseason top 25?  Furthermore, we as fans are allowed to overlook teams.  But, I guarantee you Steve Moore and his staff are overlooking no one.  Wooster's record against the lesser teams in the conference under Moore should be a pretty good indicator that Moore won't allow his team to look past anyone, especially a program like Wabash...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 26, 2011, 10:40:33 AM
Of course, it could be stated that Wooster could have beaten most of the conference bottom-feeders on talent alone with a broom-handle as a coach. Still, I don't think Wabash will ever be overlooked.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on October 26, 2011, 11:14:27 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on October 26, 2011, 10:27:51 AM
...  Wooster's record against the lesser teams in the conference under Moore should be a pretty good indicator that Moore won't allow his team to look past anyone ...

I've always thought this has been a lot of the difference between Wooster, Witt and Wabash lately, as the Scots never seem to lose those games to the lower half of the conference.  I did what I thought was going to be a quick check to see when the Scots last lost a regular-season conference game to anyone except Witt, Wabash or OWU.  Turns out I had to go back to the 96-97 season when they lost 4 conference games including games to Denison and Allegheny (and 2 to Witt).  In the 14 seasons since then they've lost a total of 18 conference games - 3 to Wabash, 2 to OWU and 13 to Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on October 26, 2011, 12:18:02 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on October 26, 2011, 11:14:27 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on October 26, 2011, 10:27:51 AM
...  Wooster's record against the lesser teams in the conference under Moore should be a pretty good indicator that Moore won't allow his team to look past anyone ...

I've always thought this has been a lot of the difference between Wooster, Witt and Wabash lately, as the Scots never seem to lose those games to the lower half of the conference.  I did what I thought was going to be a quick check to see when the Scots last lost a regular-season conference game to anyone except Witt, Wabash or OWU.  Turns out I had to go back to the 96-97 season when they lost 4 conference games including games to Denison and Allegheny (and 2 to Witt).  In the 14 seasons since then they've lost a total of 18 conference games - 3 to Wabash, 2 to OWU and 13 to Witt.

Great research and information!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 26, 2011, 01:36:31 PM
Quote from: smedindy on October 26, 2011, 10:40:33 AM
Of course, it could be stated that Wooster could have beaten most of the conference bottom-feeders on talent alone with a broom-handle as a coach. Still, I don't think Wabash will ever be overlooked.

Talent has a lot to do with it, but I've seen plenty of talented Witt teams drop games to teams they have no business losing to and ending up costing them a conference championship.  And I've also seen Wabash teams with superior talent lose to the likes of the Oberlins and Kenyons of the world as well and even last year when they actually were fighting for a conference title, and lost to Kenyon and then to Hiram at home. 

I totally agree with derek in that Wooster's complete dominance over the teams Wooster should beat is a big reason as to why they are the 7 time defending NCAC regular season champs!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rebounder club 03 on October 26, 2011, 04:38:32 PM
  I agree Scotfan.  Wooster is the dominantteam in the NCAC.  Has been and will be with coach Moore roaming the bench. The recruiting classes also help keep Wooster as the dominant team in the NCAC.  Again this year I have heard good things about Brown, Bretz, Pannell and DeBoer.  Four more freshmen that will allow Wooster to be strong for the future.  I have heard that DeBoer is really about 6'3 maybe 4,  but is strong physically already.  Heard Bretz has a real nice touch from the outside, but will also score down low, and is a legit 6'5".  I hear Pannell is quick and can create his own shot and that Brown is a oustanding guard and could play the 1 or the 2 depending on need. 

Can't wait for the season to start.  Maybe with an upset of Bradley?   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 26, 2011, 09:04:33 PM
Quote from: rebounder club 03 on October 26, 2011, 04:38:32 PM
  I agree Scotfan.  Wooster is the dominantteam in the NCAC.  Has been and will be with coach Moore roaming the bench. The recruiting classes also help keep Wooster as the dominant team in the NCAC.  Again this year I have heard good things about Brown, Bretz, Pannell and DeBoer.  Four more freshmen that will allow Wooster to be strong for the future.  I have heard that DeBoer is really about 6'3 maybe 4,  but is strong physically already.  Heard Bretz has a real nice touch from the outside, but will also score down low, and is a legit 6'5".  I hear Pannell is quick and can create his own shot and that Brown is a oustanding guard and could play the 1 or the 2 depending on need.  Can't wait for the season to start.  Maybe with an upset of Bradley?   ;)

Well, considering the glaring need Wooster has at the point, I'd say it's a safe bet to see Brown starting out there...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 26, 2011, 09:21:22 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on October 26, 2011, 09:04:33 PM
Well, considering the glaring need Wooster has at the point, I'd say it's a safe bet to see Brown starting out there...  ;)

First off, Brown may well start, but I think that at least some part of that will be due to the injury to Doug Thorpe.  Secondly, I don't believe that Brown will immediately be given the point guard spot.  It might be their goal, something that the Scots will transition to by mid-season, but my guess is that in the beginning, when both Matt Fegan and Brown are on the floor at the same time, Fegan will do much of the running of the offense.  Ideally, Fegan would eventually be a two-guard, which is what he should have been all along, but that never happened because of the uniqueness of Ian Franks and the need to have the ball in his hands.  We'll see how it plays out, and I'm hoping that Thorpe's leg comes around so that he's available sooner than later.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 26, 2011, 09:24:27 PM
Quote from: rebounder club 03 on October 26, 2011, 04:38:32 PM
  I agree Scotfan.  Wooster is the dominantteam in the NCAC.  Has been and will be with coach Moore roaming the bench. The recruiting classes also help keep Wooster as the dominant team in the NCAC.  Again this year I have heard good things about Brown, Bretz, Pannell and DeBoer.  Four more freshmen that will allow Wooster to be strong for the future.  I have heard that DeBoer is really about 6'3 maybe 4,  but is strong physically already.  Heard Bretz has a real nice touch from the outside, but will also score down low, and is a legit 6'5".  I hear Pannell is quick and can create his own shot and that Brown is a oustanding guard and could play the 1 or the 2 depending on need. 

Can't wait for the season to start.  Maybe with an upset of Bradley?   ;)

Those freshmen didn't look tall to me at all.  Now, bear in mind that we had to watch from upstairs, as no one was of a mind to pull the bleachers out, and from such a Collinge-like location, everyone does tend to munchkin-up.

I'm setting the over-and-under for Wooster at Bradley at 44.  Any takers?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rebounder club 03 on October 26, 2011, 09:32:11 PM
  Bretz is the only one I would consider "tall" at 6'5".  Pannell and Brown are both gaurds,  so their going to munchkin up for sure.  DeBoer is a 3 in my opinion so I am sure he is around the 6'3' range.  You are right though,  being way up there everyone does tend to look smaller.  Closer to the floor would have made it eaisier to good a good idea on the size of the freshmen.  Like I said though, Bretz is the only one I would consider tall.  When i was able to get closer, he did look a legit 6'5".  DeBoer looked strong physically too. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rebounder club 03 on October 26, 2011, 09:33:31 PM
  I am not sure why they did not pull out the bleachers?  That is a good question?  I will take under on the 44.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rebounder club 03 on October 26, 2011, 09:42:48 PM
  I too hope Thorpe is back soon.  We need him healthy and in there.  Wonder if Schneider doesn't play before Brown?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 27, 2011, 11:58:12 AM
From my vantage point, if a guy is taller than your thumbnail, he's tall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 27, 2011, 03:27:35 PM
Quote from: rebounder club 03 on October 26, 2011, 09:42:48 PM
  I too hope Thorpe is back soon.  We need him healthy and in there.  Wonder if Schneider doesn't play before Brown?

After reading WB's opinion of Fegan probably getting the nod at point to start the season, I would have to say I would agree and it's doubtful we'll see Brown starting as a true freshman at first.  I'm guessing Fegan will start out at the point and Snyder will start as the 2 guard.  However, depending on how good Brown is, I wouldn't be surprised to see him crack the starting rotation by  season's end if he lives up to the praises he's been getting thus far.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rebounder club 03 on October 27, 2011, 04:10:49 PM
  I am not sure Brown will start this season,  but he will probably get some minutes on varsity because of the lack of depth at point. 

  With the future of the program looking good with this recruiting class having at least four good ones,  let's get the current season going!  Can't wait to watch Wooster win another NCAC title and make a run in the tourney. ;D  Wooster is not getting the respect they should for this year because of our player losses,  but don't sell this team short.  They will be there in the end.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rebounder club 03 on October 28, 2011, 03:39:34 PM
  Does anyone know if the Black and Gold game tomorrow is being streamed on the computer?  I can't make it to the game. >:(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on October 29, 2011, 05:25:33 PM
Quote from: rebounder club 03 on October 27, 2011, 04:10:49 PM
Wooster is not getting the respect they should for this year because of our player losses,  but don't sell this team short.  They will be there in the end.
Are you suggesting they should have been ranked higher than #9 pre-season or referring to something else?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on October 29, 2011, 08:52:13 PM
Quote from: GoRed on October 29, 2011, 05:25:33 PM
Quote from: rebounder club 03 on October 27, 2011, 04:10:49 PM
Wooster is not getting the respect they should for this year because of our player losses,  but don't sell this team short.  They will be there in the end.
Are you suggesting they should have been ranked higher than #9 pre-season or referring to something else?
9th seems more than fair to me
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 29, 2011, 09:49:32 PM
It's pre-season. Being ranked 9th means they have plenty of respect. Just look at the Top 25 board for some whining about not being ranked.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on October 29, 2011, 11:00:56 PM
Witnessed DePauw exhibition with Evansville tonight, also saw Wabash scrimmage University of Indianapolis.  Wabash definitely ahead of DePauw at this point.

Depauw's offense was more dribble than passing and cutting.  Haseley and Weekly did not get enough touches or looks at the basket .  Defense was very weak.

Wabash shooting the ball very well and their defense was solid.  Bailey, Zinnerman, Shelborne and Kurosh are solid seniors.  All have played since being freshman.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 29, 2011, 11:32:37 PM
To be fair to DPU (God, what am I doing...) they were playing a D-1 team that went to the post season last year. So the defense may look weak but consider the competition.

Of course, Evansville was part of the CBI, which will take a 15-15 team from the MVC. And hey, they beat Hofstra in it before losing to Boise State.

So, um...let's just hope DPU has weak defense anyway!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on October 30, 2011, 12:31:46 AM
Believe me U of E and U of I, both have problems in their respective DI and DII categories.  u of I plays IU next Saturday....that will show some of their issues. Wabash went inside at will...wait til IU has a crack at that...Evansville has Colt Ryan and Ned Cox, it will be long seasons for both of them.   DePauw was not out manned but they just did not move their feet on defense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rebounder club 03 on October 31, 2011, 03:25:03 PM
  Wooster is top 3 in the country IMHO.  The starting five is the best in the NCAC and the freshmen class is loaded.  I believe The JV team Wooster will put on the court ( Brown, Bretz, DeBoer, Pannell ) etc. would be most varsity teams in the NCAC.  Just my opinion.  I think Hallowell, Fegan, Claytor, Thorpe ( when healthy ) Schneider, etc. is a top 3 team and am anxious to see them got to work. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: jpope2 on October 31, 2011, 04:50:50 PM
Anyone know when and if the alumni game is?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 31, 2011, 10:49:18 PM
Quote from: jpope2 on October 31, 2011, 04:50:50 PM
Anyone know when and if the alumni game is?

There is a reliable rumor that Wooster will be scrimmaging at Walsh University in Canton this Wednesday evening 11/2.  The exhibition game at D1 Bradley University is on 11/8 and the Wooster varsity vs. Alumni game is on 11/12 at 5 pm. :)

The Wooster Black and Gold scrimmage was held this past weekend.  My dad watched the scrimmage and he reported that the leading scorer was not a returning starter but rather freshman Xavier Brown who put on an impressive performance with an estimated 20 points. ;)  Xavier Brown has exceptional quickness and is able to penetrate the defense with scoring drives so it looks like he should get plenty of varsity playing time this season (starter?).  Evan Pannell and Kenny Deboer were two other freshmen that also looked good in the scrimmage.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 01, 2011, 10:47:12 AM
Quote from: rebounder club 03 on October 31, 2011, 03:25:03 PM
  Wooster is top 3 in the country IMHO.  The starting five is the best in the NCAC and the freshmen class is loaded.  I believe The JV team Wooster will put on the court ( Brown, Bretz, DeBoer, Pannell ) etc. would be most varsity teams in the NCAC.  Just my opinion.  I think Hallowell, Fegan, Claytor, Thorpe ( when healthy ) Schneider, etc. is a top 3 team and am anxious to see them got to work. :)

I really don't know what to say to this.  I didn't even write it and I'm embarrassed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 01, 2011, 12:28:53 PM
WooBoo - speechless? Unpossible!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rebounder club 03 on November 01, 2011, 06:44:55 PM
  Sorry did not mean to embarrass anyone.  I will stop posting and just read the board. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 01, 2011, 07:34:59 PM
I haven't seen the Wittenberg Tiger 2011-2012 squad in person yet, but keep in mind we won't see their full potential until December when football is over and McKee and Cooper get into the mix. That being said, I am willing to challenge that Wooster is far ahead and above every other team. Wittenberg lost Sullivan who will hurt and be hard to replace but return a heck of a lot of scoring. I'd actually prefer to keep the under the radar label.

Not too happy to see a WEDNESDAY??????? night Wooster/Wittenberg matchup in the second week of December with the conference schedule this year. Definitely will be a different atmosphere as I don't see a big Witt crowd making that drive mid-week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 01, 2011, 07:58:48 PM
Quote from: rebounder club 03 on November 01, 2011, 06:44:55 PM
  Sorry did not mean to embarrass anyone.  I will stop posting and just read the board. :)

Please don't stop posting.  But, geeze.

Wooster had a very good ball club last year, no doubt.  I still feel, though, that they overachieved somewhat, thanks not only to having the good fortune of hosting the sectionals but also of having some very skilled and determined seniors on that squad.  Without them, they never get by Whitworth and have the chance to produce that remarkable comeback against Williams down in Salem.

Those three guys are gone, and Wooster will miss them dearly.  Bryan Wickliffe played his heart out in every game for four years.  Nathan Balch did the same for three.  And Ian Franks, well, there were many games that he just took over, period.

Wooster has but two returning starters.  Justin Hallowell is a very nice player who can shoot the bejesus out of the ball.  He's become a solid rebounder and a decent defender, too.  Matt Fegan can also shoot, and he's experienced, but he's really not too much better than an average DIII guard.  Of course Claytor, Mays, Warnes, Snyder, Thorpe, and a few of the freshmen give the Scots another chance to be a good squad.  But they're untested; they've yet to even scrimmage another team.  Their number nine rank on the DIII poll is generous, and based on tradition rather than much else.

I'd probably have them about fifteen slots lower.  Let's allow them to show us what they have before reserving seats for the Final Four.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 02, 2011, 10:26:43 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 01, 2011, 07:34:59 PM
I haven't seen the Wittenberg Tiger 2011-2012 squad in person yet, but keep in mind we won't see their full potential until December when football is over and McKee and Cooper get into the mix. That being said, I am willing to challenge that Wooster is far ahead and above every other team. Wittenberg lost Sullivan who will hurt and be hard to replace but return a heck of a lot of scoring. I'd actually prefer to keep the under the radar label.

Not too happy to see a WEDNESDAY??????? night Wooster/Wittenberg matchup in the second week of December with the conference schedule this year. Definitely will be a different atmosphere as I don't see a big Witt crowd making that drive mid-week.

I'm not one who believes Wooster is far ahead of every other team and I think you'd be hard-pressed to find many Wooster fans who think differently. 

It will be interesting to see if Witt can find someone who can shoot even remotely as well as Sullivan did from deep though.  With his threat from deep, opposing defenses always had to beware of him lurking beyond the arc so that limited how much they could double down on Black.  If Witt can't find someone who is a legit deep threat, that could make things a little more difficult for Black to get easy looks down low as opposing defenses will focus on trying to stop him.

And yes, what was the NCAC thinking scheduling a Witt/Woo game on a freaking Wednesday?   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 02, 2011, 11:57:46 AM
OWU Basketball Blog (http://owuhoops.blogspot.com/), including a brief overview of the team from the student newspaper and contributions from new assistant coach Scott Cooper (Allegheny '02 and former Gators assistant) and players Andy Winters (jr.) and Nick Felhaber (fr.) Mike DeWitt returns almost the entire '10-'11 squad, including five players who started at least 15 games, and now has three-count-'em-three assistant coaches. (I know I say this every year, but) watch out for the Bishops this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 02, 2011, 12:54:17 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 02, 2011, 10:26:43 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 01, 2011, 07:34:59 PM
I haven't seen the Wittenberg Tiger 2011-2012 squad in person yet, but keep in mind we won't see their full potential until December when football is over and McKee and Cooper get into the mix. That being said, I am willing to challenge that Wooster is far ahead and above every other team. Wittenberg lost Sullivan who will hurt and be hard to replace but return a heck of a lot of scoring. I'd actually prefer to keep the under the radar label.

Not too happy to see a WEDNESDAY??????? night Wooster/Wittenberg matchup in the second week of December with the conference schedule this year. Definitely will be a different atmosphere as I don't see a big Witt crowd making that drive mid-week.

I'm not one who believes Wooster is far ahead of every other team and I think you'd be hard-pressed to find many Wooster fans who think differently. 

It will be interesting to see if Witt can find someone who can shoot even remotely as well as Sullivan did from deep though.  With his threat from deep, opposing defenses always had to beware of him lurking beyond the arc so that limited how much they could double down on Black.  If Witt can't find someone who is a legit deep threat, that could make things a little more difficult for Black to get easy looks down low as opposing defenses will focus on trying to stop him.

And yes, what was the NCAC thinking scheduling a Witt/Woo game on a freaking Wednesday?   ::)

Well, seeing what the NCAC did to the football schedule this year, they weren't thinking.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: familyaffair on November 02, 2011, 04:03:27 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 02, 2011, 11:57:46 AM
OWU Basketball Blog (http://owuhoops.blogspot.com/), including a brief overview of the team from the student newspaper and contributions from new assistant coach Scott Cooper (Allegheny '02 and former Gators assistant) and players Andy Winters (jr.) and Nick Felhaber (fr.) Mike DeWitt returns almost the entire '10-'11 squad, including five players who started at least 15 games, and now has three-count-'em-three assistant coaches. (I know I say this every year, but) watch out for the Bishops this season.

...and they have 1 first team all conference and 2 second team all conference players returning, more than any other team. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 03, 2011, 07:10:12 PM
The coaches have tabbed Wooster a slight favorite ahead of Wittenberg, with OWU a solid third, in the poll released today. Wabash and DePauw are separated by a single point in 4th/5th. Denison is the favorite for first place in the second division, as it were, with a substantial margin on Hiram. Allegheny, Kenyon, and Oberlin bring up the rear.

Coaches' Poll (http://www2.northcoast.org/sites/default/files/mbasketball/bball%20poll%2011-12.pdf) (.pdf).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 03, 2011, 09:33:10 PM
Wooster has posted their season preview on the website. :)  The article discusses the 8 returning letterwinners (Hallowell, Fegan, Warnes, Snyder, Claytor, Mays, Evans, Thorpe) and two other potential contributors as Gideon Mabeny and Scott Purcell.

Only 6 freshmen are discussed in this preview as competing for playing time.  In the backcourt, the 4 freshmen noted are Xavier Brown, Zach Baker, Jalen Goodwin and Evan Pannell.  In the frontcourt, the 2 freshmen cited are Kenny Deboer and Kendal Sherrod.

Here is the link to the season preview: http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/releases/201111037izs08
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on November 04, 2011, 11:32:25 AM
This is going to be a fun year in the NCAC!  Can the W's finish where the coaches picked them or will DePauw or Denison slide into the top 4?  I see DePauw hosting a first round NCAC game.  Oberlin will once again finish at the bottom - any new recruits that could help them become more competitive? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 04, 2011, 02:47:22 PM
Can you imagine a first round NCAC game between Wabash and DPU? Oh...my....

When they play in the regular season at Chadwick you really can't hear yourself breathe. Just imagine if it's a tournament game for the right to advance to the NCAC final four?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nuscottsfan on November 04, 2011, 02:51:55 PM
A humble opined breakdown-

#4-Wabash with #'s 5-10 being left to those fans who know them better than I.

NCAC's 2011-12 top 1-3 (These are the teams that are usually in the mix so I keep up with how they've done and who they're returning this year)-Who gets off to the best start may very well be key in determining the League champs:

Witteneberg-Black is an unstoppable force in the paint. With a usually forgotten Alex Brandt helping, WU just may dominate the paint in almost all their games. Bring in Cooper and McKee post football and the Tigers have 4 potent Sr's ranging the court.

OWU-2 very good Jr's in post man Morris and PG Winters have already shown they can assist potential NCAC POY Brady. For the Battling Bishops it's all going to be about how quickly they get out of the gate and with a fast start will they be able to carry on strong down the stretch?

Wooster-Graduated 3 Sr starters and 41pts/game. It's enough to knock them down from being a preseason #3 (in some's eyes) ALL the way down to a #9 lol!! (Bring  your friends I'll be here all week! ;D) But seriously folks....the Fighting Scots return not just 2 starters but 4 other players who saw extensive action in all 34 games....none less than 300 minutes. As for the two remaining starters Fegan is rock solid steady and Hallowell is a leader not to mention a threat from anywhere on the floor. These 2 will obviously need to pick up some of the lost PPG. Claytor showed glimpses of inside dominance last season at which he'll have to become more consistent. Mays will be solid, Snyder will only be better and Warnes is arguably the most emotionally dynamic player in the NCAC. Let's not forget Purcell, Thorpe and Evans to round out the familiar names. There's so much talent at the 1 and 2 on this team that my main question is how will the inside rotation work? Defense/points in the paint and rebounding?????!! Last year we all watched the Scots knock off those guard dominant teams on their way to Salem. There hasn't been a Frosh starter since '08 but this Brown kid looks like he can be a very special player.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 04, 2011, 05:46:29 PM
The fortune, or fate, of this 2011-12 Wooster team is very difficult for me to grasp.  There just aren't many handles on the product.  I really feel that a lot of people are underestimating the value of the seniors that Wooster lost to graduation.  I know that, for a long time, I did so even while they were here.  But I don't anymore, not after seeing what they accomplished last season.

Nathan Balch, by his senior season, was an excellent, athletic, guard.  When he arrived as a sophomore, he had to learn to play without the ball.  Always a hustler and a three-point shooter, by his junior year he'd added an old-school mid-range game.  Last year, he become a terrific defender, a man who took pride in being able to shut down his opponent.

Bryan Wickliffe, who showed steady improvement for four years, was a warrior on the floor.  Night after night he competed, almost always against players that were bigger if not stronger than he was.  No Wooster player ever played harder.  He hustled for rebounds and loose balls, and took Wittenberg and Wabash scalps.  There were nights when he could score, but even on those nights when he didn't, he very rarely took bad shots.

In baseball, they'd call Ian Franks a five-tool player.  Translated to hoops, that means he could handle the ball, shoot from deep, penetrate, rebound, and defend.  He wasn't just a guy who could create his own shot, he was the man who could take over a game, and he did it often.

What I didn't understand at first, and even for a long time after that, was the toughness that these three guys brought to the court.  They really, really, wanted to win, and so they almost always did.

I just don't see how you can remove that package from a team and declare them to be in the preseason top ten.  There is potential there, but right now, that's all it is, potential.  The returning players, and the new guys, have a lot of growing to do.  I hope they do it, but I'm far from seeing it as a given that they do.

I'm wide open on predictions this year.  I can see Wooster being, when all is said and done, NCAC champs again and making a run deep into the NCAA's.  But my vision is vague enough to see an alternate possibility, that of them losing ten or twelve games.  I'll be there, though, rooting for the former, and being ruff on the refs, as usual.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 04, 2011, 07:02:33 PM
I agree with Booster. It seems to me that the only compelling reason to tab Wooster for your national top 10 or as your conference favorite is that it always seems to work out that way. As I remarked to someone else the other day, if Wooster wins 20 games they'll probably be a Top 10 team, and the last time Wooster didn't win 20 games we were all children (and some of us still are!) We can debate how good Fegan and Snyder really are, whether Mays & Claytor will live up to their ballyhooed potential, how much impact Brown will have, whether Hallowell will thrive or wilt under pressure, and so forth, but for me it all comes down to the guys with the neckties at the end of the bench. Steve, Doug, & co. have gone through class after class after class and they have always found a way to win, whether with dominant post play or up-tempo with hot shooters or anything in between. I'd be loath to bet against them now, even if on paper they look like perhaps the third best team in their own conference.

It sure looks like it might be an interesting season, though, with any of five squads a legitimate threat to win the regular season crown. And when was the last time you could say that about the NCAC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 04, 2011, 08:41:23 PM
It's no longer Witt and Wooster and then the others, that's for sure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 04, 2011, 11:29:57 PM
Great post David k+ -- you nailed the key point which is the excellent Wooster coaching staff.  Doug Cline and Bruce Martin could easily be head coaches at other programs but instead they provide incredible coaching depth for the Scots.  Steve Moore has one of the highest win %'s in Division III.

Wooster's current streaks: :)
- 7 NCAC regular season titles in a row
- 9 Years in a row in the NCAA tourney
- 15 consecutive 20 win seasons

Tremendous players graduate in 4 years so the common thread in these impressive streaks is the Wooster coaching staff.

As others have noted, it should be a very competitive race in NCAC this season but I believe that Wooster is still the favorite based on their excellent coaching staff.  Of course, I might have a slight bias. ;) :P

Wooster's roster was posted today and Sam Runner, Jimmy Orie, Dylan Roe and Jon West have left the team which is not surprising given the preseason roster had 24 players and some players have risen above others in the rotation.
Here is the link to the Scots roster:  http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/roster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 06, 2011, 08:36:13 AM
Quote from: smedindy on November 04, 2011, 08:41:23 PM
It's no longer Witt and Wooster and then the others, that's for sure.

my only thought though is that we try to make this argument year after year after year and it always still ends up being Witt and Wooster in the end.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 06, 2011, 09:28:03 AM
A. The difference between the top 5 or 6 is a lot smaller than it was.
B. In 2008, it definitely wasn't Wooster and Witt.
C. I can see the NCAC winner this year at 12-4 or 11-5, instead of 14-2 as in the past. Just my gut.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 07, 2011, 01:19:11 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 06, 2011, 09:28:03 AM
A. The difference between the top 5 or 6 is a lot smaller than it was.
B. In 2008, it definitely wasn't Wooster and Witt.
C. I can see the NCAC winner this year at 12-4 or 11-5, instead of 14-2 as in the past. Just my gut.

We've heard this prediction over the past several years as well and yet, Wooter's worst conference record was 14-2 over their 7 year reign as conference champs.  Not saying you aren't wrong in your thinking, just saying there's been years in the last 7 championship seasons where Wooster didn't appear as strong and yet the end result was the same.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 07, 2011, 02:11:45 PM
So we will play the games.  Wooster, for their part in opening the season, the exhibition portion of it anyway, should be either on their way to Illinois or already there.  The Bradley Braves, who beat DII Wisconsin-Parkside 87-77 in their first exhibition, await them tomorrow night at 7 CST.  It now appears that there might be radio coverage on Peoria's WMBD, here:

http://www.1470wmbd.com/Bradley-men-prepare-for-Wooster/11401719 (http://www.1470wmbd.com/Bradley-men-prepare-for-Wooster/11401719)

After further review of Bradley's recent history, I'm lowering the unofficial over-and-under to 24.  Bradley had serious trouble last year, a poor season which included dropping their first eleven games in the Missouri Valley Conference.   

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 07, 2011, 02:40:38 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 07, 2011, 01:19:11 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 06, 2011, 09:28:03 AM
A. The difference between the top 5 or 6 is a lot smaller than it was.
B. In 2008, it definitely wasn't Wooster and Witt.
C. I can see the NCAC winner this year at 12-4 or 11-5, instead of 14-2 as in the past. Just my gut.

We've heard this prediction over the past several years as well and yet, Wooter's worst conference record was 14-2 over their 7 year reign as conference champs.  Not saying you aren't wrong in your thinking, just saying there's been years in the last 7 championship seasons where Wooster didn't appear as strong and yet the end result was the same.

I hate to give credit, but now DPU's in the mix. DPU > Earlham. Another tough team Wooster will have to face, instead of dealing with the Quakers. Oh, you know it's true!!!

(don't care if Earlham's out of the league, love that callback...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 07, 2011, 07:15:01 PM
Earlham, on the road, always gave Wooster way more trouble than anyone would have expected.  They never won, but the scores were almost always reasonably close, and sometimes the games were nail-biters.  In Wooster, however, they always played horribly, and even their uniforms had a 1972 Polish Olympic team look about them.  No doubt DePauw will be tougher, and I'm looking forward to seeing them when they come to Timken.  They make the league stronger, a little more credible, and I think that's always a good thing.  Besides, I've heard rumors that they hate Wabash, and how can you not like that?  ;) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 07, 2011, 08:09:26 PM
But they're also TIGERS, which you know, is evil incarnate!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 07, 2011, 09:21:30 PM
At least William Blake thought so.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 08, 2011, 04:46:49 PM
Is this tournament at DePauw correct? Is there a possibility that Wabash and DePauw meet in the championship game?

http://www.depauw.edu/ath/mbasket/2012/rokicki.asp
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 08, 2011, 04:51:57 PM
I don't know, really. Last year Wabash hosted the Tip-off Classic with DPU, Earlham and Marian and Wabash and DPU just played the other two teams. Sometimes it's like that - sometimes it's not. And Wabash has a TBA on its site for the second game, so yeah it could be an actual tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 08, 2011, 07:18:04 PM
I don't think I've seen mention of this yet, but Witt has a pretty significant transfer this year, maybe even more so than DeBoer of Wooster. Zach Leahy played in 30 games at Toledo last year and averaged 18 minutes and nearly five points a game. Was the Northwest Ohio Div. II Player of the Year in 2010. May be their starting point guard:

http://www.utrockets.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=18000&ATCLID=205024452 (http://www.utrockets.com/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=18000&ATCLID=205024452)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 08, 2011, 07:53:27 PM
Surprise, surprise, the Bradley announcers can't pronounce Wooster.  Fer chrissakes, isn't that one of the first things you do when preparing to broadcast a game: learn how to correctly pronounce the name of the opposing school?  Geeze, now they're even calling us Wooster College.  How is it possible that these guys get these jobs?

Alright, so be it.  WQKT is going to get my input.  From now on, it's WHITE-en-berg, WAYbash, and KEANE-yon.

Ok (even as my karma drops), I just got off the phone with WMBD, the guy was very nice, and he promised to contact the announcers and correct them about both the name of the school and the pronunciation.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 08, 2011, 08:09:41 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 08, 2011, 07:53:27 PM
Surprise, surprise, the Bradley announcers can't pronounce Wooster.  Fer chrissakes, isn't that one of the first things you do when preparing to broadcast a game: learn how to correctly pronounce the name of the opposing school?  Geeze, now they're even calling us Wooster College.  How is it possible that these guys get these jobs?

I agree. That's absolutely unprofessional. And WMBD can't even hide behind the usual "they're just students" excuse; WMBD is a privately-owned and professionally-operated station that is not affiliated with Bradley or any other university.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 08, 2011, 08:16:19 PM
I've got to give them real credit, though.  The guy at the station worked with me to get the name correct, and the very next time the announcers said it, they had it right.  Now, if Wooster could just guard them.  Right now, they're on a pace to lose by 80.  :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 08, 2011, 08:20:13 PM
I haven't seen Wooster's game notes, perhaps a simple prono helper there would help in the section they list all of the other pronunciations. When I did PA, I checked the guide, but I always asked someone on the other team as well how to say some names.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 08, 2011, 08:22:10 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 08, 2011, 08:16:19 PM
I've got to give them real credit, though.  The guy at the station worked with me to get the name correct, and the very next time the announcers said it, they had it right.  Now, if Wooster could just guard them.  Right now, they're on a pace to lose by 80.  :-[

Hopefully Wooster will keep it closer than Morehouse did against Kentucky.

http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/9157/getting-mad-about-the-morehouse-rout
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 08, 2011, 08:33:16 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 08, 2011, 08:22:10 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 08, 2011, 08:16:19 PM
I've got to give them real credit, though.  The guy at the station worked with me to get the name correct, and the very next time the announcers said it, they had it right.  Now, if Wooster could just guard them.  Right now, they're on a pace to lose by 80.  :-[

Hopefully Wooster will keep it closer than Morehouse did against Kentucky.

http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-triangle/post/_/id/9157/getting-mad-about-the-morehouse-rout

That was appalling.  I don't think Bradley would do what Calipari did - even if they can.  Bradley coach is in his first year and needs to use games like this to assess his bench to the extent he can. 
 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 08, 2011, 09:05:30 PM
At the Half:  D1 Bradley University 38  Wooster 33

Scots had the game tied up at 33-33 before the Braves went on a 5-0 run to end the half.

Starting lineup for Wooster:  Xavier Brown, Matt Fegan, Justin Warnes, Josh Claytor, Justin Hallowell ... so the talented freshman got the starting nod at the point.

Wooster being led in the First Half by Xavier Brown 8 points, Josh Claytor 6 points and Justin Hallowell 5 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 08, 2011, 09:10:28 PM
Yeah, Wooster regrouped just when it seemed it might get away from them.  Brown got the nod to start and after some uneasy opening minutes seems to be playing well.  I'm really happy, and surprised, that Doug Thorpe was able to get some minutes.  If he's already healthy, that's a big plus for the Scots.  If the Scots can just cut their turnovers, they might stay close in this game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 08, 2011, 09:13:57 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 08, 2011, 08:20:13 PM
I haven't seen Wooster's game notes, perhaps a simple prono helper there would help in the section they list all of the other pronunciations. When I did PA, I checked the guide, but I always asked someone on the other team as well how to say some names.

In my experience, very few teams provide printed prono guides. As someone who is both a broadcaster and a PA announcer (for different sports, natch), I think that checking pronunciations -- especially of the school's name, if it's in doubt in any way -- is among the top priorities of anyone who sits behind a mic at a sporting event. I always do the checking myself, unless one of the other members of the NPU game staff has already done it for me. Honestly, if you can't be bothered to get pronunciations right, you have no business doing either the PA or a broadcast.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 08, 2011, 09:29:38 PM
They pronounce Claytor "Clay-TOR", as if he's some alien robot from The Day the Earth Stood Still.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eun7SmpNr1I (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eun7SmpNr1I)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 08, 2011, 10:01:25 PM
Final:  D1 Bradley University 81  Wooster 71

Wooster battled but too many turnovers (20) resulted in the loss.  Jake Mays led the Scots with 16 points, 8 boards.  Freshman Xavier Brown had 15 points, Josh Claytor added 12 points and Justin Hallowell had 9 points, 10 boards.

Good effort by the Scots on the road against a D1 team.  Xavier Brown is a real talent while Mays and Claytor should be a load this year for most D3 opponents.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 08, 2011, 11:30:42 PM
I agree, overall it was a good result by the Scots.  Claytor and Mays had nice games on the offensive end and on the boards.  Hallowell did fine, despite being a marked man.  Brown and Thorpe did nice jobs.

Turnovers almost always kill DIII teams when going against the big boys, and that was the major story tonight.  The difference in quickness was notable.  Some Wooster players struggled with that more than others.

It's impossible to know, listening on the radio, the reason for the Scots doing poorly from long range.  Maybe they missed open looks, maybe they had trouble getting shots off.  I'm leaning towards the former, because it didn't seem that they were taking these threes at the end of the shot clock.  Had three or four more gone in, this game could actually have gone down to the wire.  Remember, though, that Bradley has become a weak D1 team.  They'll have a rough time of it this year in the MVC.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on November 09, 2011, 10:28:32 AM
All--we're going to be continuing our interview show with Wooster head coach Steve Moore next week at 11 AM. Any of you have questions you'd like us to ask him?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 09, 2011, 11:44:58 AM
Nice effort by the Scots last night.  I didn't think they'd keep it that close to be honest. 

Couple of surprises from the game are 1) that Brown got the start last night and 2) that Brown led the team in scoring.  Not a bad way to cap off your first collegiate start (even though it was exhibition).

Was Brown playing the point right from the start?  If so, this is good news for Wooster as well as the news of Thorpe recovering nicely from his injury.  They will make a nice 1-2 combo at point for the Scots with Brown starting and Thorpe coming in off the bench.

Can't wait for the 18th to get my first look at the new look Scots! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 09, 2011, 08:36:45 PM
I watched all of Wittenberg's scrimmage last night against Bluffton. Pretty sloppy overall but Bluffton won the first half 32-29 and the second half 28-23. Wittenberg had a few mishaps on defense and overall was forcing shots on offense. It'll be hard to get a true read on Wittenberg until McKee and Cooper are back in full swing. I'd expect them back by December (just a guess).

The one thing that was constant and showed last night was that Wittenberg may take some time to get a full inside-out game established as Sullivan being gone and his replacement is a sophomore Zach Leahy, a transfer in. So essentially a brand new player to the program is replacing an all-conference selection. Never an easy transition.

Witt will be fine and I expect big things, that's why they call these things scrimmages, a change to fine tune some things.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 09, 2011, 09:26:12 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 09, 2011, 11:44:58 AM
Nice effort by the Scots last night.  I didn't think they'd keep it that close to be honest. 

Couple of surprises from the game are 1) that Brown got the start last night and 2) that Brown led the team in scoring.  Not a bad way to cap off your first collegiate start (even though it was exhibition).

A few other points from yesterday's Wooster - Bradley scrimmage.  On the post game show, Bradley Coach Geno Ford was very complimentary towards the Scots.  He stated that they are fundamentally sound and would probably win lots of games in D3 competition this season perhaps contending again for a title.  He also mentioned that Wooster was a tougher team than Bradley's first exhibition opponent which was D2 Wisconsin-Parkside.

Jake Mays was Wooster's leading scorer last night with 16 points and 8 boards (close to a double, double). ;)  One of the Bradley radio announcers described him as "the best looking big man on the floor... for either team."

Bradley came into the game determined to shut down Justin Hallowell and Matt Fegan -- Wooster's two returning starters from last year.  What was encouraging to see was the way that Jake Mays (16), Xavier Brown (15) and Josh Claytor (12) stepped up their offensive games when Bradley's defense focused on Hallowell and Fegan.  If this trend continues, Wooster should be able to pick up the scoring loss from the graduations of Franks, Balch and Wickliffe.  It is certainly positive that the Scots scored 71 points last night against a D1 team with some quick players.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 10, 2011, 09:28:47 AM
In the great inanity that is the NCAA.

On the 12th, Hiram travels to Akron to face the Zips in the 2K Sports Classic.

This game counts for Akron as it's part of an exempt tourney / classic. It doesn't for Hiram because it's before the 15th.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 13, 2011, 07:25:08 PM
Kenyon drops an exhibition at Wright St., 80-56. Sophomore guard Julian Pavlin drilled 5-of-5 treys to lead the Lords from the bench with 15 points. Box score (http://www.wsuraiders.com/ViewContent.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=27000&CONTENT_ID=170821)

Also: Akron 95, Hiram 65 story (http://www.gozips.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/releases/20111112a1565x)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 13, 2011, 08:35:12 PM
Hey! Guess what? The regular season starts on Tuesday! Funny how time flies. Seven of our ten teams will be in action:

Bethany at Allegheny
Marietta at Denison
Hiram at Mt. Union
Muskingum at Kenyon
Oberlin at Westminster
OWU at Hanover
IU-East at Wittenberg

DePauw and Wooster open up on Friday 11/18, Wabash on Sat. 11/19
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 13, 2011, 09:25:39 PM
Some of us will have our hoops interest bifurcated at the least, and solely tuned to the gridiron at the most, for a couple three weeks (probably until the matchup with the Purple...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 13, 2011, 11:05:18 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 13, 2011, 09:25:39 PM
Some of us will have our hoops interest bifurcated at the least, and solely tuned to the gridiron at the most, for a couple three weeks (probably until the matchup with the Purple...)

Smed - Good luck to the Little Giants in the NCAA football playoffs!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 13, 2011, 11:16:32 PM
Thanks!

BTW, LG's freshmen added to their roster.

http://sports.wabash.edu/roster.aspx?path=mbball

One frosh that won't be appearing until later is #2 - Houston Hodges. He's currently occupied in the defensive backfield!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 14, 2011, 12:19:36 AM
Occupy the Defensive Backfield, that's what I always say.  Take it back from the MAN! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 14, 2011, 08:52:57 PM
Quote from: rebounder club 03 on November 14, 2011, 03:16:13 PM
My dad told me another freshman had a good game against Mason College in their scrimmage.  He said Bretz had 18 points.  Said he had hit his three's and did well on the break too.  Another good freshman for the future.  Just thought I would pass it along.

Who is Mason College? Unless Wooster is now playing JV scrimmages, I don't quite follow how this scrimmage took place.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rebounder club 03 on November 14, 2011, 09:28:33 PM
  Think the name of the school must be wrong.  Sorry. :)  Will call my Dad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: rebounder club 03 on November 14, 2011, 09:40:43 PM
   Wooster starts it up Friday at the Al Van Wie on Friday.  Can't wait!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 14, 2011, 11:29:28 PM
Quote from: woo91 on November 09, 2011, 10:28:32 AM
All--we're going to be continuing our interview show with Wooster head coach Steve Moore next week at 11 AM. Any of you have questions you'd like us to ask him?

If you run out of serious questions to ask him, see if he'll verify the fact that Andy Van Horn and Rob McCarter had the scroungiest dorm room on campus during their freshman year. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 15, 2011, 03:51:28 PM
Denison has decided to waive all admission fees to men's and women's games this season, and instead will be accepting charitable donations for three different charities during the season. Read more here. (http://denisonbigred.com/sports/wbkb/2011-12/releases/20111115xmom04) Good show, Big Red!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 15, 2011, 08:40:08 PM
Witt opens up tongiht at home against IU-East (NAIA school). Somehow IU-East has amassed a 5-1 record so far. I wasn't able to attend as I had officiating duties, but am following it online and it looks like Witt left their defense at home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 15, 2011, 09:19:18 PM
IU - East looks to be a formidable NAIA team. Also, having several games under their belt (and an exhibition against IUPUI) definitely helps. I think the NAIA gets 30 games plus their post season, or something.

The IU-East web site has the Red Wolves winning 91-84.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 15, 2011, 10:55:15 PM
It actually ended up 92-84. I'll make this prediction, no other team this year in regulation will score 92 points against Wittenberg. In fact, if they score over 84 again in regulation I'd be surprised, that's just not their style.

A week to rebound and then back at it next week at Capital.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 15, 2011, 11:31:46 PM
Westminster 72 Oberlin 69

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 15, 2011, 11:49:55 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 15, 2011, 10:55:15 PM
It actually ended up 92-84. I'll make this prediction, no other team this year in regulation will score 92 points against Wittenberg. In fact, if they score over 84 again in regulation I'd be surprised, that's just not their style.

A week to rebound and then back at it next week at Capital.

Did IU-East just get Witt out of their element?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 16, 2011, 12:11:07 AM
Back from Kenyon where I watched a very, very young Lords squad open a substantial lead on a senior-dominated Muskingum team, then squander the whole thing in the sloppy last eight minutes on a barrage of Musky 3-pointers. However, the Lords never trailed, and prevailed in a very sloppy OT, 71-69. Kenyon has just one senior (Anthony Chun, who sat the entire second half and OT for reasons I do not know) and one junior (Marcus Healey, 15 points), and I figured they'd get hammered by a team that starts four seniors and a junior, but it was the Muskies who looked shaky in the early going. Kenyon led by 7 at the half and it should have been more, considering the fits their defense was giving Muskingum and considering how many bunnies failed to drop for the Lords. They extended the lead to 17 with 8:30 left, and still led by 13 with just 3:36 remaining. At this point, Kenyon (with PG Chun still on the bench) lost their way on offense, making bad passes and taking silly shots. Muskingum took advantage, draining their next five shots, four from beyond the arc, to draw within one with 0:32 left. Kenyon regained their poise in the final seconds, stopping a potential game-winning post play by the Fish but committing a foul with 0:01.1 left that forced the OT. The extra period began with sophomore post Brian Lebowitz, who had made some bad decisions with the ball down the stretch, forcing his way inside and scoring an old-fashioned three point play, giving the Lords a lead that held up for about two minutes before the Fish made enough free throws to tie the game. Then sophomore Julian Pavlin, who also was playing fairly sloppily, managed to worry in a short jumper with 1:29 left, and the Lords D prevented Muskingum from getting a decent shot attempt as the clock wound down.

Lebowitz led the Lords with a fairly impressive double-double, 24 points and a dozen rebounds. His defense in the paint left a little to be desired, but he had good post moves and played aggressively against (slightly) bigger, stronger Fish all evening.

Elsewhere:
Hanover 70, Ohio Wesleyan 58 (sheesh...)
Hiram 86, Mt. Union 72
Marietta 64, Denison 58 (looks like a good result for the Big Red against the sixth-ranked Pioneers)
Bethany 82, Allegheny 60
and as noted above,
IU-East 92, Wittenberg 84
Westminster 72, Oberlin 69

NCAC non-conference record: 2-5
Not a good start.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on November 16, 2011, 04:32:39 AM
wow the marietta-denison game was exciting at the end last night. Denison pushed them to the edge and the outcome was in doubt until late. Combination of Denison playing well and Marietta probably reading the press clippings too much. They obviously took the game too lightly. Maybe they were still looking forward to their game against Ohio next month. Whatever the case they were in danger of being upset late. Great job Big Red,wish you had won this one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 16, 2011, 07:29:25 AM
Former Wooster player Tim Vandervaart is now an assistant basketball coach at Mt. Union.  It might help their program if they can find a way to squeak one more year of eligibility out of him.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on November 16, 2011, 09:33:01 AM
If you're interested in listening to Wooster head coach Steve Moore talk about the upcoming season, listen in at 11 AM! http://woo91.wooster.edu
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on November 16, 2011, 11:57:29 AM
...aaaaand the podcast is up! Let me know what you guys think! Some nice quotes from coach in there. A real pleasure to interview.

http://i.mixcloud.com/CtDbN

-WOO 91
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 16, 2011, 04:51:29 PM
Another great job by you guys at WOO91.  Thanks for doing this; I'm already looking forward to this next one!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 17, 2011, 03:28:41 PM
Friday games:

Pitt-Bradford at Allegheny
Marygrove vs. DePauw (at Case Western Reserve)
Anderson vs. Ohio Wesleyan (at Wooster)
Defiance at Wooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 18, 2011, 07:08:00 AM
Good luck tonight Witt volleyball, shooting for a national championship run. First up is Cal Lutheran at 8:00 p.m. It helps that Witt is the second highest ranked team remaining at 4th nationally, but by Witt beating #1 Calvin and Washington U. #2 losing, their chance of winning has significantly increased.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 18, 2011, 08:33:53 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 35  Defiance 30

Wooster is being led by Jake Mays with 9 points and Xavier Brown with 8 points.  For Defiance, the leading scorers are Mason Roth with 10 points and Logan Wolfrum with 7 points.

Scots shot 48% in the half and held Defiance to 40%
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 18, 2011, 08:39:40 PM
Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 79  Anderson (IN) 64

In the opening game of the Al Van Wie Rotary Classic, the Bishops notched the win vs. their HCAC opponent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 18, 2011, 09:41:31 PM
Final:  Wooster 91  Defiance 67

Wooster dominated the 2nd half.  Scots had 4 players in double figures tonight.  Freshman point guard Xavier Brown led with 18 points, Ryan Snyder added 15 points, Justin Hallowell had 14 points and freshman Kenny Deboer chipped in 11 points.  Very impressive that two frosh were among the top four scorers. :)

Defiance was led tonight by Mason Roth with 14 points and Anthony Brown with 12.  Wooster held Defiance's leading scorer to only 7 points on 3 of 10 shooting.

Wooster shot 56% from the floor and held Defiance to only 39%.  Scots won the boards 45 to 27.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 18, 2011, 10:32:17 PM
It was a good night all around, with 4 double-digit victories:

Wooster 91, Defiance 67
OWU 79, Anderson 64
DePauw 98, Marygrove 67
Allegheny 79, Pitt-Bradford 53

NCAC non-conference record: 6-5

Saturday games, many involving HCAC teams:
Point Park at Allegheny
Hanover at Denison
DePauw at Case Western Reserve
Notre Dame (O) at Hiram
Kenyon vs. Methodist (at Marietta)
Earlham at Oberlin
Ohio Wesleyan vs. Defiance (at Wooster)
Calumet at Wabash
Anderson at Wooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 19, 2011, 01:42:11 AM
I'm going to wait until after Saturday night's game before putting forth an early analysis, but after tonight's dismantling of Defiance, it appears that Wooster has retooled nicely.  Despite a poor night shooting from the arc, and a sloppy few minutes after building a comfortable lead, all went pretty darned well.  But let's see how they come back in twenty-four hours against a team that surely will want a piece of them after last year's rout.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 19, 2011, 06:43:01 PM
Big day for Wabash. A home win in football and a home win in hoops. Wabash defeats Calumet College of St. Joseph 63-54. Aaron Zinnerman led Wabash with 16. Derek Bailey added 15.

From the roster, AJ Sutherlin is no longer with the program.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on November 19, 2011, 10:37:53 PM
The Wabash Brian Shelborne had 11 as well. Nice opener for Wabash, should be multiple scoring options on the floor all the time.  Looks like an 8 man rotation shaping up with the 4 seniors, Casey Oetting, Jordan Surencamp, Pete Nitsick and Colton Cragin (please excuse spelling ).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2011, 10:47:13 PM
Pretty good night overall:

Point Park 91, Allegheny 89
Hanover 64, Denison 62
Oberlin 76, Earlham 58
Hiram 84, Notre Dame (Ohio) 73
Wabash 63, Calumet Col. 55
Kenyon 79, Methodist 77
Ohio Wesleyan 82, Defiance 78 (OT)
DePauw 76, Case 59
Wooster 70, Anderson 54

That's 7-2, bringing us to 13-7 on the season.

Oh, and Wabash's football team advanced in the playoffs, the OWU men's soccer team has reached the Final Four, and the Wittenberg women's volleyball team is in the national championship match! (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fplanetsmilies.net%2Fhappy-smiley-8769.gif&hash=aeb289e67220f3813c231bcf5c375101dc1b9252)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2011, 11:14:11 PM
If the Al Van Wie/Rotary Classic was in fact the NCAC/HCAC Challenge, the NCAC was the hands-down winner with a 4-0 mark. OWU played a very shaky game tonight but still managed to grit out an overtime victory over Defiance, while Wooster played good defense all night and good offense in spurts, dumping Anderson by a score that was not indicative of how much in doubt the game really was. In fact, Wooster still had two starters and two key reserves on the floor at the final whistle; uncommon for a 16-point victory.

All-tournament team:
Brock Morrison, Sr., Anderson
Logan Wolfrum, Jr., Defiance
Andy Winters, Jr., OWU
Xavier Brown, Fr., Wooster
Matt Fegan, Sr., Wooster
Justin Warnes, Sr., Wooster--Defensive MVP
Tim Brady, Sr., OWU--Overall MVP
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2011, 11:33:42 PM
Four games left to close out the weekend.

Earlham at Denison
Kenyon at Marietta
Hanover at Oberlin
Univ. of St. Francis at Wabash

Two more HCAC/NCAC games. By my count the HCAC/NCAC tally stands at 5-2 in favor of the NCAC, and Hanover has both HCAC victories.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 19, 2011, 11:54:47 PM
Back from Timken where I watched the Scots knock off the Anderson Ravens in a game that was closer than the final score as David noted.  With 8 minutes remaining, Wooster led only 43-40 before stretching out the winning margin at the end of the game.

Freshman Xavier Brown was impressive again leading Wooster with 22 points while Matt Fegan nailed 6 three pointers and finished with 20 points.  Justin Hallowell had an off night shooting but the offense from the guards and Wooster's defense brought home the victory.

Wooster is now 2-0.  Next game at Wilmington on 11/27

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 20, 2011, 10:51:57 AM
As mentioned above, Wittenberg volleyball is in the National Championship match this afternoon at 5:00 p.m. I know this is a basketball board, but these ladies do not get the credit they deserve. I fully expect a win in convincing fashion today!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 20, 2011, 04:31:17 PM
Always a positive when the NCAC can represent nationally!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 20, 2011, 04:53:00 PM
Wabash now 2-0 on the year with a convincing 84-59 win over St. Francis. Shelbourne and Curosh lead the way with 17 each. Six Little Giants in double figures scoring, with Bailey adding 14, Zinnernan 12, Surenkamp 11, and freshman Kasey Oetting with 10.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2011, 07:33:04 PM
Ladies and Gentlemen, your 2011 Volleyball National Champions, the Wittenberg Tigers! Tiger Up!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2011, 07:35:03 PM
Back to basketball, where Hanover continues their run of dominance, but the NCAC still has a good day:

Hanover 74, Oberlin 55
Denison 72, Earlham 61
Wabash 84, St. Francis (IL) 59
Marietta 85, Kenyon 74

NCAC non-conference record: 15-9
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 20, 2011, 07:56:08 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 20, 2011, 07:33:04 PM
Ladies and Gentlemen, your 2011 Volleyball National Champions, the Wittenberg Tigers! Tiger Up!!!

Great to be a Wittenberg Tiger alum! Kudos to these ladies for their hard work paying off, lost one set the entire national tournament!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on November 21, 2011, 12:07:25 AM
Wabash looked very strong today with 6 players in double figures.  Team basketball with numerous scoring weapons.  Defense and rebounding was solid.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on November 21, 2011, 10:23:59 AM
What a great 6 months or so for the NCAC.  Wooster - Men's Basketball National Runner-up, Wittenberg - Volleyball National Champions, Ohio Wesleyan - Men's Soccer Final Four (and maybe more). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2011, 10:28:06 AM
Quote from: WAlum on November 21, 2011, 10:23:59 AM
What a great 6 months or so for the NCAC.  Wooster - Men's Basketball National Runner-up, Wittenberg - Volleyball National Champions, Ohio Wesleyan - Men's Soccer Final Four (and maybe more).
...and, of course, a 1-2 finish at the men's swimming and diving championships for Denison and Kenyon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on November 21, 2011, 10:36:02 AM
Thanks - I forgot about the swimming and diving!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Lee Wilson on November 21, 2011, 11:12:12 AM
While not quite as impressive, you can't forget Wabash getting 16th at the Cross Country nationals this past weekend, and Kevin McCarthy coming away with a 6th place finish.

As for basketball, I caught the first half of the Calumet game on Saturday and was pleased to see the Carpenter era start off strong with team basketball (no more Wes Smith show).  I'm looking forward to seeing what Oetting can do once he gets rid of the frosh jitters.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 21, 2011, 11:24:28 AM
Quote from: WAlum on November 21, 2011, 10:36:02 AM
Thanks - I forgot about the swimming and diving!

I do think we take the Kenyon (and Denison) swim programs for granted...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2011, 11:59:38 AM
Quote from: smedindy on November 21, 2011, 11:24:28 AM
Quote from: WAlum on November 21, 2011, 10:36:02 AM
Thanks - I forgot about the swimming and diving!

I do think we take the Kenyon (and Denison) swim programs for granted...
Yes, it hardly seems worth mentioning that these two also finished 2nd (DU) and 4th (KC) in the women's national meet. What, no championship? Ho-hum.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 21, 2011, 09:47:38 PM
Stepping in for Mr. Collinge

Tomorrow's games:

Denison (1-2) @ CWRU (1-2)
Franklin (1-1) @ OWU (2-1)
Allegheny (1-2) @ Carnegie - Mellon (1-1)
Kenyon (2-1) @ Grove City (2-1)
Hilbert (1-2) @ Oberlin (1-2)
Capital (2-0) @ Wittenberg (0-1)

None seem insurmountable, though Capital may be a tough one for Witt. Could the Tigers start 0-2? Will there be panic in Springfield over Thanksgiving?  ;)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2011, 11:47:38 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 21, 2011, 09:47:38 PM
Stepping in for Mr. Collinge

Thanks. I'd've gotten here eventually, just had to work late. Glad now I don't have to!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 22, 2011, 09:49:39 PM
Ohio Wesleyan 95, Franklin 74
Case Western Reserve 70, Denison 65
Wittenberg 69, Capital 63
Oberlin 67, Hilbert 56

Nothing yet from Kenyon and Grove City
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 22, 2011, 09:59:33 PM
Carnegie-Mellon 67, Allegheny 64
Grove City 84, Kenyon 75 (2 OT)

NCAC 3-3 this evening. By my count, NCAC is 18-12 non conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 22, 2011, 11:50:31 PM
We're off until Friday now (when OWU faces Wash. U.), so Happy Thanksgiving to all!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 23, 2011, 07:26:00 AM
NCAC vs:

HCAC 7-3 ... all three losses to Hanover
OAC 3-2 ... both losses to Marietta
President's AC 0-3
UAA 1-2
Other D3 3-0
Non-D3 4-2

I think that's correct.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on November 23, 2011, 12:45:02 PM
Hey guys, just finished another episode of "More with Moore": http://i.mixcloud.com/Ct573

Let us know what you think, and hope you all have a great Thanksgiving!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 23, 2011, 03:20:29 PM
Guys, your show just keeps getting better and better.  I think the comfort level has risen, on both sides, which has allowed you to ask more detailed and penetrating questions.  Coach Moore, for his part, is now a little more willing to answer them.  Really, really, good job, and I appreciate the fact that you also put up notification of the latest episode here on D3Hoops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 25, 2011, 08:06:37 PM
Ohio Wesleyan 70 Washington, Mo. 67
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 26, 2011, 01:12:10 AM
I guess all that turkey made me sleepy and I forgot there was a game today. Oh well. Go Bishops!

NCAC non-conference record improves to 19-12, and our record vs. the UAA evens up at 2-2.

Saturday's slate:
Allegheny vs. Elmira (at Rochester)
Purdue-North Central at DePauw
Hiram at Bluffton
Ohio Wesleyan at Rhodes
Wabash vs. Elmhurst (at DePauw)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 26, 2011, 08:50:53 PM
Today's results:

Bluffton 73, Hiram 68
Ohio Wesleyan 74, Rhodes 65
DePauw 63, Purdue-North Cent. 43
Allegheny 65, Elmira 48

Wabash leads Elmhurst 35-29 at the half.
UPDATE: Wabash wins, 67-59.

23-13 in non-conference action.

Sunday's games, including a rare intra-conference non-conference game:
Allegheny at Rochester
Denison at Capital
Wabash at DePauw (non-conference)
Wooster at Wilmington
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on November 27, 2011, 04:05:28 PM
Audio of Wabash & Depauw - 

http://www.ustream.tv/channel/depauw-athletics

Live Stats

http://www.depauw.edu/ath/live/men/xlive.htm

WAF!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on November 27, 2011, 04:51:44 PM
Wabash 24
Depauw 24

Halftime

Very close half of basketball statistically.... Wabash had 8 offensive rebounds in the 1st.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DPU3619 on November 27, 2011, 05:10:17 PM
Hey fellas.  Thanks for having me over here. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2011, 05:32:38 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 41  Wilmington 31

Wooster is being led by freshman Xavier Brown with 11 points.  Matt Fegan and Justin Hallowell each have 6 points (2 three pointers each).

Top scorers for Wilmington are Tyler White with 10 points and Malcolm Heard with 8 points.

Scots shot 52% from the floor in the first half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 27, 2011, 05:35:05 PM
Quote from: Wes Anderson on November 27, 2011, 05:10:17 PM
Hey fellas.  Thanks for having me over here.

Hey, in bball isn't this now also YOUR board?  (Or does DePauw not compete until next year in all sports - I thought it was only fball they were making you wait a year?)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on November 27, 2011, 05:44:37 PM
Wabash 62
Depauw 47

Final

D. Baily 19 pts on 8 for 10 shooting - 3 for 4 from beyond the arc....  A Zinnerman 13 pts.

Bravo!   WAF!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 27, 2011, 06:31:54 PM
DPU is live and in-person in the NCAC this year!

You do realize that Wabash and DePauw could play FOUR times this year now?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2011, 06:38:05 PM
Final:  Wooster 83  Wilmington 74

Wooster was led by freshman Xavier Brown with 20 points, Justin Hallowell with 15 (5 three pointers) and Matt Fegan with 13 (4 three pointers).  Ryan Snyder chipped in 8 points.

Malcolm Heard led the Quakers with 19 points.  RJ Leppert had 16 points and Tyler White added 12.

Scots made 11 of 19 three pointers which was a key factor in the victory.  Wooster also won the rebounding battle with a 36 to 29 advantage.

Wooster is now 3-0. :)  Next game is on Wednesday at Kenyon

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 27, 2011, 06:46:51 PM
Sunday's games, including a rare intra-conference non-conference game:

Rochester 99 Allegheny 75
Denison 90  Capital 76 - Nice win for the Big Red!
Wabash 62 DePauw 47
Wooster 83  Wilmington 74

2-1 NCAC in the non-conference. 25-14 overall non-conference (not counting Wabash / DPU)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2011, 06:52:17 PM
NCAC moves to 5-0 against OAC teams not named Marietta.

Next game: Tuesday, when Wittenberg travels to....Marietta.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 27, 2011, 07:15:41 PM
Perhaps OAC academics are on the rise?  ;)

That Wabash-Depauw game; was that a remnant of yesteryear's schedule-making that the powers-that-be just decided to, um, let be? (Keys up the Beatles tune)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 27, 2011, 07:31:01 PM
No. That's the annual tournament DPU hosts and Wabash has taken part in it more often than not. At times Wabash has also hosted part of it. A local insurance agent in Greencastle sponsors it. Sometimes they don't play each other on purpose (where it's a classic) but sometimes it is a strict tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DPU3619 on November 27, 2011, 09:57:14 PM
You're within a stone's throw of it, smed.

Mike Rokicki died of cancer in 2003.  It's kind of a memorial thing.  He was a huge in the community in Greencastle and at DePauw.  A lot of folks around here actually called him Mr. Greencastle.  I know a few years ago the proceeds from the tourney went to DePauw's Relay for Life effort.  I would assume they still do that, but I don't know.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 27, 2011, 10:03:31 PM
Ah, I knew he sponsored a lot of things when he was alive. Thanks for the clarification, Wes!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 28, 2011, 03:23:43 PM
Congrats to Wabash's Nick Curosh, the PotW in the NCAC:

http://sports.wabash.edu/news/2011/11/28/MBB_1128110858.aspx?path=mbball

Sunday's action doesn't count (why, I dunno, but still...). If it did, Derek Bailey may have been the PotW.

Through four games (again, not counting Sunday...) Curosh was shooting a Metzelaarsian 14-17 from the floor.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on November 29, 2011, 12:13:14 AM
The Week 1 rankings are out and the NCAC is well represented:
#6 Wooster
#17 Wittenberg
#26 Wabash
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2011, 05:02:52 PM
Battle of ranked teams tonight as #17 Wittenberg travels to #4 Marietta in a rematch of last year's NCAA tournament thriller.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2011, 05:16:45 PM
Congratulations to former Wabash head coach Mac Petty on his induction into the Indiana Basketball Hall of Fame (http://sports.wabash.edu/news/2011/11/28/MBB_1128110353.aspx?path=mbball).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on November 29, 2011, 07:32:46 PM
Maybe doesn't pertain to basketball directly, but here are some photos of the inside of the almost-completed Scot Center opening on January 14: http://flic.kr/s/aHsjx3SyeH
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 29, 2011, 08:44:19 PM
Marietta 63 Wittenberg 45 with 10 minutes to go in the game.  Not the Marietta team that only beat Denison by 6 in their opener.  Pioneers have been on fire from the field and Witt has turned the ball over 18 times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on November 30, 2011, 12:17:52 AM
Marietta over Witt 87-63.  Tigers now 1-2 on the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2011, 12:54:19 AM
Yeah, not such a good result considering that Marietta beat Denison and Kenyon by a combined 17 points. Maybe 'Etta is just finding their Trevor-Halter-less groove. Still, can't help but be concerned about Witt at this point, especially since both Cooper and McKee are back and playing significant minutes (Cooper 0 pts on 0/6 shooting in 22 minutes, McKee 8 points in 19 minutes, four turnovers apiece).

NCAC falls to 25-15-1 in non-conference play and 5-3 vs. OAC teams (0-3 vs. Marietta, 5-0 vs. everyone else).

Conference action (at least, conference games that count) starts tomorrow:
Wooster at Kenyon
Denison at Hiram
non-conference games, including two vs. former conference members:
Baldwin-Wallace at Allegheny
Earlham at DePauw
Oberlin at Case Western Reserve
Wabash at Rose Hulman
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 30, 2011, 05:43:16 PM
My question is if Witt is going to have another troubling season? Losing to IUF and Marietta in a manner that Witt normally treats its foes says that something may be amiss there.

Or it could be bad games against quality teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 30, 2011, 09:09:19 PM
Wabash does its part, cruising past Rose-Hulman on the road 58-44. Derek Bailey had 26 points to lead the LGs and Nick Curosh grabbed 12 boards, according to the live stats. Wabash still unbeaten, now 5-0 on the season.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 30, 2011, 09:11:33 PM
Wooster trailed by 2 at the half down in Gambier but it's been ALL Scots in the 2nd half as they now lead by 17 with eight minutes to go in the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 30, 2011, 09:19:23 PM
This just in.  Xavier Brown is pretty damn good!!! 

He's yet to be stopped short of 20 points in his young COW career as he's topped 20 points for the 4th straight game to start the season!  I wonder what the record is for consecutive games to start a career with 20+ points at Wooster?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 30, 2011, 09:26:17 PM
Final:  Wooster 84  Kenyon 68

Wooster had a monster 2nd half in scoring as ScotsFan noted and blew out the Lords. :)  Scots had 5 players in double figures with freshman Xavier Brown leading the way with 22 points, Justin Hallowell with 15 points, Josh Claytor with 13 points, Justin Warnes with 11 and Ryan Snyder also with 11.

Kenyon was led tonight by Ikenna Nwadibia with 17 points and Brian Lebowitz with 15 points.

Scots shot 59% from the floor tonight and won the rebounding battle 30 to 24.

Wooster is now 4-0. ;D  Next game on Saturday 12/3 at Adrian (MI)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 30, 2011, 09:32:02 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 30, 2011, 09:19:23 PM
This just in.  Xavier Brown is pretty damn good!!! 
Can't argue with that!


Quote
He's yet to be stopped short of 20 points in his young COW career as he's topped 20 points for the 4th straight game to start the season! 
However, he did only have 18 in the opener vs Defiance, followed by 22 against Anderson, 20 at Wilmington and 22 again tonight.  Not a bad start!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 30, 2011, 09:40:48 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on November 30, 2011, 09:32:02 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 30, 2011, 09:19:23 PM
This just in.  Xavier Brown is pretty damn good!!! 
Can't argue with that!


Quote
He's yet to be stopped short of 20 points in his young COW career as he's topped 20 points for the 4th straight game to start the season! 
However, he did only have 18 in the opener vs Defiance, followed by 22 against Anderson, 20 at Wilmington and 22 again tonight.  Not a bad start!

The great thing about Xavier is his ability to penetrate and break down the opponent's defense.

While he is averaging over 20 points per game, he is also a high percentage shooter (30 of 53 thru 4 games) for an incredibly high shooting percentage of 56.6% which is amazing for a guard!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 30, 2011, 09:41:46 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on November 30, 2011, 09:32:02 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 30, 2011, 09:19:23 PM
This just in.  Xavier Brown is pretty damn good!!! 
Can't argue with that!


Quote
He's yet to be stopped short of 20 points in his young COW career as he's topped 20 points for the 4th straight game to start the season! 
However, he did only have 18 in the opener vs Defiance, followed by 22 against Anderson, 20 at Wilmington and 22 again tonight.  Not a bad start!
Duh!  Why was I thinking he had gone over 20 in that game as well? ???

So much for my question about opening your career with consecutive 20 point games...  :P  Still, 20.5 per through the first 4 games of your collegiate career ain't too shabby...  8-)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 30, 2011, 09:55:08 PM
FYI, the game at Adrian on Saturday won't be broadcast on the interweb due to a local HS (Norwayne) playing in the state championship football game.  Us locals will be able to hear the game on AM 960.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 30, 2011, 10:58:30 PM
Shall we recap the evening? Let's...

Wooster 84 Kenyon 68 - as recapped above. Question is Brian Lebowitz' nickname "Fawn"? Well, it should be! Heh.

Denison 68 Hiram 46 - Big Red is emerging as a playah. Larry Farmer had 18 points and 14 boards.

Baldwin-Wallace 79 Allegheny 61 - Gators no match for the Yellow Jacket's front court.

DePauw 78 Earlham 74 - Tigers have a surprising struggle against a horrid Quakers squad. Barry Flynn leads the Tigers with 25 points and nine boards.

Case 81, Oberlin 66 - Yeomen outrebounded 45-23. Box out! 

Wabash 58 Rose Hulman 44 - Wabash surged ahead in the second half in a defensive battle.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2011, 11:19:17 PM
Kenyon is not at the level where they can compete with the Woosters and Mariettas yet, but they have the makings of a pretty good squad there. Wooster clearly underestimated them in the first half, and were shocked to be trailing at the break. Keep in mind that Kenyon is practically all freshman and sophomores. Give him whatever nickname you like, Brian Lebowitz is a pretty good player. His defense is lacking, and I think Claytor/Mays should have exploited that more tonight, but he's got some nice moves for an undersized 6'6" post on the offensive end, and he can also hit fadeaway, hooks, and pull-up jumpers. In the backcourt, Ikenna Nwadibia is very difficult to guard. Ask Justin Warnes, who drew Nwadibia as his assignment tonight and gave up 17 points on 5/8 shooting (it would have been worse if Nwadibia had made his free throws.) If these sophomores and their youthful teammates have a good shooting night (like tonight, 45%) and play reasonable defense, they're going to give the conference lead pack fits. That is, unless the conference lead pack team shoots 70% in the second half like the Scots did tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2011, 11:23:14 PM
NCAC non-conference record: 27-17-1
vs. HCAC: 9-4
vs. OAC: 5-4
vs. UAA: 2-4
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 01, 2011, 12:35:58 AM
Wabash did not play well tonight but owned the boards and played great defense.  Bailey with 26 points, Kurosh had 12 rebounds.  Rose was 4-0 but they will struggle in their conference play.  Their defense was solid but they have trouble creating a good shot other than an outside 3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 01, 2011, 12:55:20 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 30, 2011, 09:19:23 PM
This just in.  Xavier Brown is pretty damn good!!!

To me, the most impressive part of Brown's game is the pull-up jumper.  After shaking himself free with various quick moves, he's able to go straight up, completely on-balance, and launch a technically-perfect jumper that's as soft as Oberlin's defense.  I don't care what level of play you're talking about, this is a big-time offensive weapon.

I spent the eighties in San Francisco and had season tickets at USF games when they had Quintin Dailey.  He had the same soft accurate mid-range pull-up jumper, and despite his other problems, this skill eventually landed him in the NBA.  Mind you, I'm not projecting that path for X. Brown, as Dailey was 6'3" with terrific leaping ability.  But Brown has this exceptional tool in his box, one that I've not seen before in D3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 01, 2011, 01:42:30 AM
Impressive by Xavier Brown to date. It's been a while since the freshman days of James Cooper and it might even be too early to make comparisons but did James start his Wooster career as well as Xavier Brown has done so far? I'm just wondering.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2011, 08:49:01 AM
Whilst I and almost everyone else will have their eyes trained to Alliance (or in Alliance) (even though there's no video feed for the game, but alas...), the first conference match-up for Wabash is this Saturday and it seems to be a beaut.

The surprising, resurgent Big Red (I say that because they were within six of Marietta and smacked Capital a good one) play host to the LGs at 3PM. It is only the first conference game but it can set the tone for both squads. Wabash has looked quite a bit better than many had envisioned after Mac Petty retired and Wes Smith graduated. However, the cupboard was not barren, and Antoine Carpenter has looked like he has what it takes as coach and recruiter.

But Denison seems finally over the hump and squarely into contention for a home tournament game if early indications are to be believed. I know you don't like to compare scores, but Denison had clearly outplayed Witt in games against common opponents.

Should be a good one in Granville. Perhaps a few straggling alums will wander in for the second half!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 01, 2011, 12:58:19 PM
Quote from: WooMix on December 01, 2011, 01:42:30 AM
Impressive by Xavier Brown to date. It's been a while since the freshman days of James Cooper and it might even be too early to make comparisons but did James start his Wooster career as well as Xavier Brown has done so far? I'm just wondering.

Not even close.  Cooper did not start one game as as a freshman.  And Coop finished his freshman year averaging 10.1 ppg  which was good for 3rd best on that team.  Cooper really took off his sophomore year and beyond as he averaged nearly 20 ppg and led the team in scoring as a sophomore, junior, and senior.

The only player I can remember having a significant impact to the team upon arriving at Wooster in recent memory is Tom Port and Port was a transfer, not a true freshman.  Even recently departed 2 time NCAC POY started his freshman year on JV as a freshman...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2011, 04:54:46 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 01, 2011, 12:58:19 PM
The only player I can remember having a significant impact to the team upon arriving at Wooster in recent memory is Tom Port and Port was a transfer, not a true freshman.  Even recently departed 2 time NCAC POY started his freshman year on JV as a freshman...

Well, Justin Hallowell was the D3hoops.com national rookie of the year (http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-americans/men/2009) as a frosh in 2008-09. Also, Bryan Nelson was terrific as a frosh in 1999-2000.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2011, 04:56:17 PM
New rankings are out (http://www.thedailybeast.com/galleries/2011/12/01/druggiest-colleges-universities-photos.html?utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&utm_campaign=cheatsheet_morning&cid=newsletter%3Bemail%3Bcheatsheet_morning&utm_term=Cheat+Sheet), and the NCAC has three in the top 11. Denison is getting noticed, moving all the way up to #2. Duuuuuude!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 01, 2011, 05:41:03 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 01, 2011, 04:56:17 PM
New rankings are out (http://www.thedailybeast.com/galleries/2011/12/01/druggiest-colleges-universities-photos.html?utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&utm_campaign=cheatsheet_morning&cid=newsletter%3Bemail%3Bcheatsheet_morning&utm_term=Cheat+Sheet), and the NCAC has three in the top 11. Denison is getting noticed, moving all the way up to #2. Duuuuuude!

Ok, I can understand Wittenberg not making this list.  What with Springfield having a dive bar every fifty feet no one can even find their stash.  And at Wabash, there being no women, what's the use of having any bongs ready to go?  But Wooster?  OBERLIN?  Wherefore goeth THOU?  I mean, I've SEEN Oberlin women; you GOTTA be stoned just to say hello.  C'mon, you two schools, this is embarrassing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2011, 06:45:45 PM
I've worked at Oberlin. Their high is natural.

And lets not disparage the young women of these fine schools, lest one look in the mirror! Some of prefer the granola, librarian type over the vapid Mandy Pepperidge Barbie!

  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2011, 07:56:28 PM
Upcoming in the NCAC:

(Again, not trying to steal DC's thunder, but I'm marking time in a hotel in Charlotte before calling my kids, and I've ran out of pejoratives to hurl at the Mt. Union folks for not having a web stream  ;) )

Saturday, Dec. 3

Non-Conference:

Case Western Reserve (3-2) @ Hiram (2-2) - The Spartans are 2-1 vs. the NCAC and face a Terrier squad that was flat and outworked by the Big Red.  Hiram needs to see rapid improvement else they'll fall under .500.

Wooster (4-0) @ Adrian (4-2) - The consensus NCAC favorite travels to Michigan to face a Bulldogs squad that looks to be a mid-pack MIAA squad. FYI - Adrian lost to St. Francis (IL), a team Wabash beat 84-59.

Conference:

Wabash (0-0, 5-0) @ Denison (1-0, 3-3) - I spoke about this game before, but this is a good test for both squads. It's imperative that the Big Red keep its momentum, but also imperative Wabash wins games on the road like this in order to secure a high seed in the NCAC tourney.

DePauw (0-0, 4-1) @ Kenyon (0-1, 2-3) - We welcome the other set of Tigers to NCAC men's hoops play, officially. Can DPU recover from its throttling by the LGs and the uncomfortably close game against the Quakers? Can the Lords build on their first-half performance against Wooster? Kenyon's a good enough team, especially at home, to beat a team that's playing poorly or uninspired.

Allegheny (0-0, 2-5) @ Ohio Wesleyan (0-0, 5-1) - The Gators have been less than stellar in non-conference action, while the Bishops have recovered nicely from their season opening loss to Hanover. Both teams are trending in opposite directions and I think those trends continue.

Oberlin (0-0, 2-3) @ Wittenberg (0-0, 1-2) - Can you believe that the Yeomen have a better winning percentage than the original Tigers? Well, not after Saturday. While Witt isn't performing up to snuff, you'd have to think they'll get this figured out soon, right? Right?

Monday, December 5

IU - East (8-1) @ DePauw (4-1) - Maybe that Witt loss to the Red Wolves wasn't so bad after all. They're #11 in the latest NAIA - D2 poll.

Penn St. - New Kensington (3-2) @ Oberlin (2-3) - This game isn't on the schedule for Penn St. - New Kensington. I do know that PSU - NK beat PSU - Lehigh Valley 125-55 and lost to Mt. Aloysius 131-72 in back-to-back games. That's a WIDE point-differential swing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 01, 2011, 08:45:12 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 01, 2011, 04:56:17 PM
New rankings are out (http://www.thedailybeast.com/galleries/2011/12/01/druggiest-colleges-universities-photos.html?utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&utm_campaign=cheatsheet_morning&cid=newsletter%3Bemail%3Bcheatsheet_morning&utm_term=Cheat+Sheet), and the NCAC has three in the top 11. Denison is getting noticed, moving all the way up to #2. Duuuuuude!

After I said to myself ten times "what is he smokin'?", and I Googled every basketball ranking I could find for men and women, I realized the contrast on my computer was lower than optimal and noticed the link.  (You probably had to be there to see the humor).

Not the kind of ranking you want to be tops in, but maybe it explains a lot of the past?  Right now, though, it looks like the Big Red might have found a new drug! :o  Let's hope they don't run out of supply in Granville!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2011, 09:17:33 PM
No worries, smeds, and your version is way better than my plain list (notice I don't even include links to live stats/audio/video this year). I have no time for analysis, but I do have a composite schedule that makes for easy reference for upcoming games. I gladly cede habitual posting responsibilities to those who do it better than I ever could (see: Darry; Nester's "How They Fared" on the Top 25 page.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2011, 09:20:56 PM
Quote from: GoRed on December 01, 2011, 08:45:12 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 01, 2011, 04:56:17 PM
New rankings are out (http://www.thedailybeast.com/galleries/2011/12/01/druggiest-colleges-universities-photos.html?utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&utm_campaign=cheatsheet_morning&cid=newsletter%3Bemail%3Bcheatsheet_morning&utm_term=Cheat+Sheet), and the NCAC has three in the top 11. Denison is getting noticed, moving all the way up to #2. Duuuuuude!

After I said to myself ten times "what is he smokin'?", and I Googled every basketball ranking I could find for men and women, I realized the contrast on my computer was lower than optimal and noticed the link.  (You probably had to be there to see the humor).

No, I can see it just fine from right here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2011, 09:23:23 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 01, 2011, 09:17:33 PM
No worries, smeds, and your version is way better than my plain list (notice I don't even include links to live stats/audio/video this year). I have no time for analysis, but I do have a composite schedule that makes for easy reference for upcoming games. I gladly cede habitual posting responsibilities to those who do it better than I ever could (see: Darry; Nester's "How They Fared" on the Top 25 page.)

I started doing it for football and I suppose I could do this 2 times a week or so. My girlfriend hasn't moved to FL yet and I need to fill some times besides watching endless NCIS re-runs on my DVR!  ;)

The analysis is fun to do because I really learn the teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 02, 2011, 09:50:56 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 01, 2011, 04:54:46 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 01, 2011, 12:58:19 PM
The only player I can remember having a significant impact to the team upon arriving at Wooster in recent memory is Tom Port and Port was a transfer, not a true freshman.  Even recently departed 2 time NCAC POY started his freshman year on JV as a freshman...

Well, Justin Hallowell was the D3hoops.com national rookie of the year (http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-americans/men/2009) as a frosh in 2008-09. Also, Bryan Nelson was terrific as a frosh in 1999-2000.

Yes, Hallowell was rookie of the year, but I didn't get the same sense of impact that I've seen from Brown thus far this season.  If Brown keeps this pace up, I think he will be a slam dunk for another Scot to win national rookie of the year.  Of course, I realize the season is still very young and a lot can happen, but I think Brown has done a pretty good job of proving that he's going to be a force and he isn't going away.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 02, 2011, 12:11:59 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 01, 2011, 07:56:28 PM

Wooster (4-0) @ Adrian (4-2) - The consensus NCAC favorite travels to Michigan to face a Bulldogs squad that looks to be a mid-pack MIAA squad. FYI - Adrian lost to St. Francis (IL), a team Wabash beat 84-59.


Adrian is currently playing without 2 starters, Dennis Mason and Wesley Reed.  The Bulldogs are a young bunch and well coached.  They seem to have added a little scoring to their defensive minded tact.  They'll try to control the tempo and will defend and force you to defend for the duration of the shot clock.

It's early but I actually think Adrian is going to make a strong push for #2 in the MIAA, if things go well maybe even better.  I don't expect an Adrian win but its a compelling match-up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 02, 2011, 01:04:50 PM
Quote from: sac on December 02, 2011, 12:11:59 PM
I don't expect an Adrian win but its a compelling match-up.

Well, seeing as the game is at Adrian, that in and of itself should make things interesting.  The state of Michigan has not been too kind when the Scots make the trek up north to play MIAA foes. 

After a quick look over Wooster's past seasons, I count that Wooster is 0-4 in their last 4 trips up north dating back to the 96-97 season.  Three of those four losses were in the NCAA tournament starting at Hope in that 96-97 season and including losses at Calvin and at Albion.  Wooster lost 2 seasons ago at Albion in their only regular season loss in the streak.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 02, 2011, 02:07:57 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 02, 2011, 01:04:50 PM
Quote from: sac on December 02, 2011, 12:11:59 PM
I don't expect an Adrian win but its a compelling match-up.

Well, seeing as the game is at Adrian, that in and of itself should make things interesting.  The state of Michigan has not been too kind when the Scots make the trek up north to play MIAA foes. 

After a quick look over Wooster's past seasons, I count that Wooster is 0-4 in their last 4 trips up north dating back to the 96-97 season.  Three of those four losses were in the NCAA tournament starting at Hope in that 96-97 season and including losses at Calvin and at Albion.  Wooster lost 2 seasons ago at Albion in their only regular season loss in the streak.

While I'm probably higher than most on Adrian, 3 of those 4 games you mention were vs MIAA teams that went deep into the NCAA's.  I don't think Adrian is there yet, but they are making good progress the last 2 seasons.  Comparing them to Albion 2 years ago might not be such a bad comparison.  I think they'll finish better than Albion's 14-12 that year though.

Adrian is also a little kinder gentler place to play on most afternoons, I was at the NCAA games at Hope and Albion and those were tough atmosphere's.  Calvin is also a tough place to play in the tournament.

It's actually a game I'm considering attending.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 02, 2011, 06:13:49 PM
Quote from: sac on December 02, 2011, 02:07:57 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 02, 2011, 01:04:50 PM
Quote from: sac on December 02, 2011, 12:11:59 PM
I don't expect an Adrian win but its a compelling match-up.

Well, seeing as the game is at Adrian, that in and of itself should make things interesting.  The state of Michigan has not been too kind when the Scots make the trek up north to play MIAA foes. 

After a quick look over Wooster's past seasons, I count that Wooster is 0-4 in their last 4 trips up north dating back to the 96-97 season.  Three of those four losses were in the NCAA tournament starting at Hope in that 96-97 season and including losses at Calvin and at Albion.  Wooster lost 2 seasons ago at Albion in their only regular season loss in the streak.

While I'm probably higher than most on Adrian, 3 of those 4 games you mention were vs MIAA teams that went deep into the NCAA's.  I don't think Adrian is there yet, but they are making good progress the last 2 seasons.  Comparing them to Albion 2 years ago might not be such a bad comparison.  I think they'll finish better than Albion's 14-12 that year though.

Adrian is also a little kinder gentler place to play on most afternoons, I was at the NCAA games at Hope and Albion and those were tough atmosphere's.  Calvin is also a tough place to play in the tournament.

It's actually a game I'm considering attending.

Yeah, I was thinking Albion 2 years ago would be a fair comparrison.  But still, that was a game that Wooster should not have lost either.  Just like I would argue tomorrow is a game that Wooster should win...  :-\ 

And as for the tough environments, I remember watching that Woo/Calvin tournament game and thinking how Wooster's players must have been wondering what the hell they walked in to?  I just remember how overwhelmed they looked and Calvin just blitzed them and Wooster had no chance whatsoever.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 02, 2011, 06:54:14 PM
I did say "looks to be" without having most of the inside dope. I spent most of my time trying to figure out PSU - Kensington's record!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 02, 2011, 07:38:03 PM
Quote from: sac on December 02, 2011, 02:07:57 PM
Adrian is also a little kinder gentler place to play on most afternoons, I was at the NCAA games at Hope and Albion and those were tough atmosphere's.

"Albion is a tough atmosphere for an NCAA Tournament game" = understatement of the year. That game was crazy.

Quote from: ScotsFan on December 02, 2011, 06:13:49 PM
And as for the tough environments, I remember watching that Woo/Calvin tournament game and thinking how Wooster's players must have been wondering what the hell they walked in to?  I just remember how overwhelmed they looked and Calvin just blitzed them and Wooster had no chance whatsoever.

I was at that game (no doubt sac was too, that was before I knew him.) Wooster had a deer-in-the-headlights look about them right from the get-go. Wooster, despite being #3 in the poll at that time, was brand new to the national spotlight in those days; IIRC their trip to Hampden-Sydney the previous season was the program's first-ever Sweet Sixteen appearance. It didn't help that they were hopelessly out-classed by Calvin, the eventual national champs and one of the best D3 teams I've ever seen. (The Scots fared better at Sydney, losing by 8 to the Tigers, who reached the final game before losing in double OT.) They started flat and were out of the game lickety-split. Wooster has become much more comfortable in those situations since then.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 02, 2011, 09:24:15 PM
OWU has reached the men's soccer national championship match by blitzing Montclair St. 4-0 in the semis. Tomorrow the Bishops will play for the title against the winner of tonight's Oneonta St./Calvin semi.  http://backtheredandblack.owu.edu/

Here's a video of highlights from the sectionals last weekend at OWU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZexkGlLeVWY). Take notice of Travis Wall's brilliant GWG against Ohio Northern. Worth watching the video just for that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 03, 2011, 11:13:39 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 02, 2011, 07:38:03 PM

I was at that game (no doubt sac was too, that was before I knew him.) Wooster had a deer-in-the-headlights look about them right from the get-go. Wooster, despite being #3 in the poll at that time, was brand new to the national spotlight in those days; IIRC their trip to Hampden-Sydney the previous season was the program's first-ever Sweet Sixteen appearance. It didn't help that they were hopelessly out-classed by Calvin, the eventual national champs and one of the best D3 teams I've ever seen. (The Scots fared better at Sydney, losing by 8 to the Tigers, who reached the final game before losing in double OT.) They started flat and were out of the game lickety-split. Wooster has become much more comfortable in those situations since then.

This was the first season I really started following the Scots.  I had just moved back into the area the year before and it was actually Wabash and Josh Estelle that got me to my first Scots game that year.  I remember their clash in the NCAC championship and how Wooster took it to Wabash despite Estelle's fireworks and then, that ONU tournament game got me hooked on Fighting Scot basketball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2011, 03:25:33 PM
Um. The LG offensive issues have fled Alliance and are now in Granville.

Wabash down 19-5 with 7:15 left in the first. The LGs are just 2-17 from the field thus far.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2011, 04:01:39 PM
Wabash now down just 38-35 with 14:51 left. Freshman Austin Hawn has lit a spark with 11 points off the bench, bombing in three treys.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 03, 2011, 04:04:20 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 40  Adrian 24

Wooster is being led by Justin Hallowell with 10 points.  Josh Claytor has 6 points.  Missed one Wooster three pointer when an ad appeared on the live video. ::)

Brad Whitby is leading the Bulldogs with 10 points.

Wooster has a size advantage and has controlled the boards so far 20 to 16.  Scots shot 54% in the half and held the Bulldogs to only 26%.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2011, 04:13:42 PM
Wabash has pulled out to a 55-48 lead with 7:55 to go! Zinnerman with 17 and Hawn, the plucky frosh, has 16.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2011, 04:20:11 PM
Denison now back up 58-57. To the video stream!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 03, 2011, 04:26:06 PM
1:29 left in this game, and Denison has nobody in double figures. They do, however, have seven guys with 7, 8, or 9 points. Nice balance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2011, 04:37:16 PM
Wabash outlasts the egalitarian Big Red 71-65, storming back from a 17-point first-half deficit. Zinnerman led the way with 19, Hawn 17 (he hit four threes, but only 3-5 from the line), Bailey had 12 and Shelbourne 11. After clanking their way through most of the first half, the LGs wound up shooting 23-47 from the floor.

Denison was led by Alex Longi with 10. Four other Denison players tallied nine. The Big Red have a nice thing going, but they need to put away teams like Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 03, 2011, 05:01:41 PM
Final: Wooster 75  Adrian 50

Wooster was led by Justin Hallowell with 13 points, Justin Warnes with 11, Josh Claytor with 10 and Jake Mays with 9.

Scots made 10 three pointers and won the boards 50 to 31.

Wooster is now 5-0. :)  Next game is Wittenberg at home on Wednesday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 03, 2011, 06:45:32 PM
Wabash shoots 71 percent in the second half.  Nice, nice game from Austin Hawn. Great senior leadership, not panicking and just staying after it.  These guys believe in each other, they are fun to watch.  Is Hale injured? Has he always shot left handed?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2011, 08:30:34 PM
Results from Saturday:

Non-Conference:

Wooster 75, Adrian 50 - as recapped above

CWRU 80, Hiram 78 - Jamaal Watkins had 31 points and 10 rebounds but it wasn't enough. Alan "Astronaut" Sheppard (probably not his nickname, but what the heck) added 20 off the bench.

NCAC now 28-18 vs. non-conference and 1-3 vs. CWRU.

Conference:

Wabash 71, Denison 65 - as recapped above

Wittenberg 69, Oberlin 57 - I was expecting more of a beat-down, but the Yeomen hung around never falling behind by more than 17. Five Tigers in double figures, led by Josh McKee and Eric Brandt with 12. Josh Merritt led all with 24.

DePauw 60, Kenyon 59 - These Tigers came storming back from a nine-point deficit to nip the Lords. Tommy Weakley hit two three-pointers in the last minute for the win. Barry Flynn led DPU with 14 points and 10 boards. Julian Pavlin's 15 paced Kenyon, while Barry "Fawn" Lebowitz added 14 (and maybe a trip to see Otis Day & The Knights).

Ohio Wesleyan 82, Allegheny 70 - The Bishops sprinted out to a 51-26 halftime lead (fed by a 28-0 run) and then coasted home for the win. Tim Brady led OWU with 26, while Brandon Smith had 12 points and 11 rebounds for the Gators. OWU shot just 10-22 from the line. The Gators benched their starting five to start the second half and the second unit provided a spark. The writer of this piece should have read the entire recap.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on December 03, 2011, 08:34:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 02, 2011, 09:24:15 PM
OWU has reached the men's soccer national championship match by blitzing Montclair St. 4-0 in the semis. Tomorrow the Bishops will play for the title against the winner of tonight's Oneonta St./Calvin semi.  http://backtheredandblack.owu.edu/

Here's a video of highlights from the sectionals last weekend at OWU (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZexkGlLeVWY). Take notice of Travis Wall's brilliant GWG against Ohio Northern. Worth watching the video just for that.

Congrats to OWU on winning the D-III men's soccer championship today, 2-1 against Calvin!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 03, 2011, 08:58:58 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 03, 2011, 08:30:34 PMDePauw 60, Kenyon 59 - These Tigers came storming back from a nine-point deficit to nip the Lords. Tommy Weakley hit two three-pointers in the last minute for the win. Barry Flynn led DPU with 14 points and 10 boards. Julian Pavlin's 15 paced Kenyon, while Barry "Fawn" Lebowitz added 14 (and maybe a trip to see Otis Day & The Knights).

He would've scored more if it hadn't been for that kiln accident.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2011, 09:43:50 PM
Excellent showing for the NCAC all around:

Football Quarterfinals
Women's Volleyball Champs
Men's Soccer Champs
Top 15 in Nationals in Cross Country

did I miss any?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on December 03, 2011, 10:49:35 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 03, 2011, 08:58:58 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 03, 2011, 08:30:34 PMDePauw 60, Kenyon 59 - These Tigers came storming back from a nine-point deficit to nip the Lords. Tommy Weakley hit two three-pointers in the last minute for the win. Barry Flynn led DPU with 14 points and 10 boards. Julian Pavlin's 15 paced Kenyon, while Barry "Fawn" Lebowitz added 14 (and maybe a trip to see Otis Day & The Knights).

He would've scored more if it hadn't been for that kiln accident.

Yeah, I feel real bad about that --- guess there's only one thing to do --- ROAD TRIP!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 03, 2011, 11:02:19 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 03, 2011, 08:30:34 PM
Wittenberg 69, Oberlin 57 - I was expecting more of a beat-down, but the Yeomen hung around never falling behind by more than 17. Five Tigers in double figures, led by Josh McKee and Eric Brandt with 12. Josh Merritt led all with 24.

DePauw 60, Kenyon 59 - These Tigers came storming back from a nine-point deficit to nip the Lords. Tommy Weakley hit two three-pointers in the last minute for the win. Barry Flynn led DPU with 14 points and 10 boards. Julian Pavlin's 15 paced Kenyon, while Barry "Fawn" Lebowitz added 14 (and maybe a trip to see Otis Day & The Knights).

Ohio Wesleyan 82, Allegheny 70 - The Bishops sprinted out to a 51-26 halftime lead (fed by a 28-0 run) and then coasted home for the win. Tim Brady led OWU with 26, while Brandon Smith had 12 points and 11 rebounds for the Gators. OWU shot just 10-22 from the line. The Gators benched their starting five to start the second half and the second unit provided a spark.   

Witt vs Oberlin - the tigers were ready to blow it open several times but just couldnt get er done.  Oberlin is better than they have been but I still thought Witt would win bigger. The Tigers are still looking to find a deep ball threat with Sullivan now graduated and helping coach the Big Red.

Depauw vs Kenyon.  GReat finish for the new NCAC Tigers.  DePauw struggled this week, beating a winless Earlham by 4 and Kenyon by 1 but they found a way to get 2 wins.   Can they get it going soon?

OWU vs Allegheny - Sorry but you got bad info on this game as I watched some online between football games. The Gators didnt bench their starting five to start the second half.  I only watched the end of the first half and the start of the second half.  the Allegheny site and box shows the Gators bench outscored the bottom of the OWU bench 19-3 in the last five minutes. So OWU was up 79-51 with 5 minutes to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2011, 11:28:57 PM
That's what the Allegheny recap implied in the first few graphs, and I know that's been a tactic many coaches have used.

To wit:

"Second-year head coach Jim Driggs implemented a radical change to Allegheny's lineup in the second half on Saturday, and the shake-up nearly paid off against conference powerhouse Ohio Wesleyan, which withstood a tremendous rally by the Gators en route to an 82-70 victory at Branch Rickey Arena"

"Trailing 51-26 to start the second half, Driggs looked outside his normal group of starters to provide a spark for Allegheny's struggling performance." -

But I should have read on:

"Leading 79-51 with just over five minutes to play, the Gators young guns showed tremendous character by dominating the OWU bench down the stretch. DiBernardi buried back-to-back three's to ignite a 19-3 run to close out the game, while Allegheny orchestrated 10 fast-break points."

Ooperdy. My bad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 04, 2011, 01:36:34 AM
But I love the "To wit:".  Haven't seen one of those around here in a long time. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 04, 2011, 01:30:08 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 02, 2011, 01:04:50 PM

Well, seeing as the game is at Adrian, that in and of itself should make things interesting.  The state of Michigan has not been too kind when the Scots make the trek up north to play MIAA foes. 

After a quick look over Wooster's past seasons, I count that Wooster is 0-4 in their last 4 trips up north dating back to the 96-97 season.  Three of those four losses were in the NCAA tournament starting at Hope in that 96-97 season and including losses at Calvin and at Albion.  Wooster lost 2 seasons ago at Albion in their only regular season loss in the streak.

I may have missed some games in reviewing the Scots history in Michigan, but the last win that I found was 12/14/1973 when they beat Adrian 63 - 49.  Before yesterday they had lost their last 8 up north going 0 -3 at Calvin, 0-2 at Albion, 0 -1 each at Kalamazoo, Hope and Oakland.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 04, 2011, 02:35:24 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on December 04, 2011, 01:30:08 PM
I may have missed some games in reviewing the Scots history in Michigan, but the last win that I found was 12/14/1973 when they beat Adrian 63 - 49.  Before yesterday they had lost their last 8 up north going 0 -3 at Calvin, 0-2 at Albion, 0 -1 each at Kalamazoo, Hope and Oakland.
Clearly this is why Steve Moore has not been offered the job at Ohio State.  ;)

I missed the Scots game on the radio yesterday (Norwayne-Kenton took precedence!).  Steve Moore, in today's Daily Record, mentioned that Adrian was a little short-handed.  The DR did nothing to explain this comment.  Was this mentioned at all during the broadcast?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 04, 2011, 02:48:06 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 04, 2011, 02:35:24 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on December 04, 2011, 01:30:08 PM
I may have missed some games in reviewing the Scots history in Michigan, but the last win that I found was 12/14/1973 when they beat Adrian 63 - 49.  Before yesterday they had lost their last 8 up north going 0 -3 at Calvin, 0-2 at Albion, 0 -1 each at Kalamazoo, Hope and Oakland.
Clearly this is why Steve Moore has not been offered the job at Ohio State.  ;)

I missed the Scots game on the radio yesterday (Norwayne-Kenton took precedence!).  Steve Moore, in today's Daily Record, mentioned that Adrian was a little short-handed.  The DR did nothing to explain this comment.  Was this mentioned at all during the broadcast?

Coach Moore was referring to the fact that Adrian played without 2 players who were projected as starters this season - Dennis Mason and Wesley Reed.

They might have narrowed the final margin but their presence likely would not have changed the outcome.  Adrian is not a tall team even with the two missing players and Wooster dominated the boards 50 to 31 yesterday which was a key factor in the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 04, 2011, 03:28:56 PM
Sean Gallant is Adrian's tallest player, he did play yesterday and his stat-line was  0 points, 3 rebounds, and 1 turnover in 32 minutes.  Coming into yesterday he had been playing well and was the #2 leading scorer and leading rebounder.


What missing Dennis Mason and Wesley Reed does is make them younger and not nearly as good on defense.  Mason might be the best defensive player in the MIAA, Reed was their #2 scorer from last year.

Last year Adrian gave up only 57 points per game, so far this year 68.   Part of that is they've increased their offensive production with some of the new players so they probably feel less of a need to get in a back alley brawl to win.  For Adrian to win yesterday they had to keep the score in the low 60's, not sure if those two guys would have made that much of a difference for them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 04, 2011, 09:31:38 PM
Question for Big Red Fans....watching D Hale against Wabash shoot everything left handed Saturday, when did he change to shooting left-handed? Or is he injured? I went back and watched some film and he definitely shot right handed in past years.  Just curious....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2011, 09:00:09 AM
Two out-of-division games tonight, already noted on Smed's now pages-ago schedule:

IU-East at DePauw
PSUNK at Oberlin
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 05, 2011, 12:28:27 PM
Those are two very *odd* matchups just looking at the schools - regional branch university campuses versus national residential liberal arts colleges.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 05, 2011, 08:07:38 PM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on December 04, 2011, 09:31:38 PM
Question for Big Red Fans....watching D Hale against Wabash shoot everything left handed Saturday, when did he change to shooting left-handed? Or is he injured? I went back and watched some film and he definitely shot right handed in past years.  Just curious....

Wabash2011

First, let me congratulate you on the comeback win Saturday night.  While we Big Red fans have become accustomed over the years to being outcoached when in the lead, adjusting to a 17 point deficit and coming back to win against any team is no easy feat.  I was impressed with the LG's composure in the second half and their ability to execute. 

Hale is not hurt to my knowledge.  He is being reprogrammed to shoot FT's with his left hand in the hope of increasing his FT percentage.  While junior year is a bit late to be adjusting a player's form, it probably can't hurt in this case.  I just hope that he doesn't start thinking he should be shooting FG's outside of three feet. 

Rather than writing a new line of code for Hale, though, Denison should really start pricing out a new operating system. 
Wabash is the third lead of 14 or more already this season to dissolve into a loss for the Big Red (how the team held on against Capital I do not know but good for them!).  If it happens again, I would put new Assistant Chris Sullivan in the driver's seat right away and hope he didn't learn any bad habits in his first seven games on the bench.

A team like this year's Big Red should not be folding when they have big leads.  They have more talent and experience this year than ever before and have proven they can play against good teams.  So when the talent and experience are there, it comes down to coaching.  The coach's job is to understand the flow of the game and counter the other side's in-game adjustments.  For ten years now that has not come from the Big Red bench.  I see a lot of pointless substitution, head scratching and complaining about calls, but no great coaching moves. 

We should be a contender for hosting a tournament game this year.  Instead of being a possible 6-1, though, we are 3-4 and a .500 year may be only a pipedream.  I'm not ready to write off the season yet, but if Bob Ghiloni looks back at the end of February and sees only a mediocre season at best, he needs to look no further than his own mirror.  Blaming his players or lack of depth isn't an excuse this year.  The Big Red have the ability to get it done, but Ghiloni has to take his game to a different level, or get out of the way and let someone else get it done. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 05, 2011, 09:10:52 PM
One final to report:

Oberlin 74, PSU - New Kensington 50 - Andrew Fox led the Yeomen with 21, while Geoff Simpson added 15 and 11 rebounds. Oberlin played 15 players and no one was a member of club trillion (though Jacob Goldstein only had a turnover on his ledger in three minutes).

As of now, with 16:05 left in the game, IU-East has a 42-33 lead over DPU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 05, 2011, 09:24:05 PM
Oberlin beat somebody by 24 points?  Look, you know, if you're gonna fill in for Collinge, you gotta get these scores right.  Or was this not a basketball game but a re-run of an old GE College Bowl?  In which case, PSUNK definitely covered the spread. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 05, 2011, 10:43:34 PM
PSU-NK lost to Mt. Aloysius 131-72, as reported earlier. Those branch PSU schools can be, well, not good in basketball terms. They are USCAA members and for the most part D-3 squads roll over those.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 05, 2011, 10:47:02 PM
The other final:

IU - East 79, DePauw 66 - The Red Wolves went on a 15-2 run early in the second half and held off the Tigers. Sean Haseley led DPU with 21, while Barry Flynn continued his strong play with 17 points and 12 boards.

NCAC now 29-19 in non-conference if I added correctly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 06, 2011, 09:48:57 AM
New Top 25 (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/index):
Wooster inches up to #5 but is within 8 points of #3 Va. Wesleyan.
Wittenberg drops out and back to effective #27.
Wabash enters the poll at #25.
Ohio Wesleyan feels the love with three points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 06, 2011, 09:53:41 AM
One game tonight:
Millikin at Wabash
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 06, 2011, 10:40:22 AM
Here's a preview:

Millikin (0-6) @ Wabash (6-0) - CCIW vs. NCAC? Sounds like a good match-up? Not so fast my friends. Millikin is reeling, and some wags say they could be winless this year (though they may have a good chance at Cornell (IA) later in the month. Wabash is soaring, and now in the Top 25. I don't think first-year coach Antoine Carpenter allows the LG's to overlook the Big Blue even with Wooster coming to Chadwick this weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 06, 2011, 12:21:17 PM
Wednesday's NCAC action:

Non-Conference:

Case Western Reserve (4-2) @ Allegheny (2-6) - CWRU is 3-1 against the NCAC and unless the hangover from Allegheny's frenetic run against the OWU scrubs carries through, I bet they will be 4-1. I wouldn't quite call the Gators 'a mess', but they are struggling.

Conference:

Hiram (0-1, 2-3) @ Oberlin (0-1, 3-4) - The Yeomen have shown signs of life, in whapping PSU - New Kensington and not getting run out of the gym by Wittenberg. Hiram lost a close on to CWRU where they definitely showed improvement from the Denison game. This will be an interesting one to watch. A win for either team would be welcome for confidence.

Kenyon (0-2, 2-4) @ Ohio Wesleyan (1-0, 6-1) - The Lords lost a heartbreaker to DPU after staying with the Scots for a half. They're going to be decent, but the NCAC schedule makers didn't do them any favors as the probably will enter the holiday break 0-3 in league play. OWU cruised by Allegheny until it was bench-clearing time, and I'm sure coach DeWitt made that a teaching moment. The Bishops look like they will go to 2-0 here.

Wittenberg (1-0, 2-2) @ Wooster (1-0, 5-0) - Just a typical mid-week early-season NCAC game.  ;) I don't have a good read on the Tigers, still. IU-East and Marietta are quality teams but the Tigers really haven't impressed in their wins. I do have a read on the Scots. They look as strong as ever. This may be close because of the rivalry aspect, but I do see a Scots win. Frankly this should be a Saturday night game in late January, not thrown in here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 06, 2011, 01:00:17 PM
Current conference standings:

DePauw 1-0
OWU 1-0
Wabash 1-0
Wittenberg 1-0
Wooster 1-0
Denison 1-1
Allegheny 0-1
Hiram 0-1
Oberlin 0-1
Kenyon 0-2
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on December 06, 2011, 05:35:38 PM
Hey guys, we're going to be continuing our show with Wooster coach (and Wittenberg alum) Steve Moore tomorrow at 11. Do you guys have any burning questions you'd ask him?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 06, 2011, 06:09:41 PM
I'd really like to know who the jerk is that's attacking woo91.  He's a Wooster student who only peeks on here to announce their excellent radio show.  He's never voiced an opinion, at least in this room, nor even commented on the Scots' team.  And somebody feels the need to take swipes at him?  C'mon.  You wanna hit me, go at it.  But give the kid a break.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 06, 2011, 06:27:58 PM
Quote from: woo91 on December 06, 2011, 05:35:38 PM
Hey guys, we're going to be continuing our show with Wooster coach (and Wittenberg alum) Steve Moore tomorrow at 11. Do you guys have any burning questions you'd ask him?

Here's my question - not that I'd really expect an answer...

So far either Josh Claytor or Jake Mays has played every meaningful minute, and there doesn't really seem to be a viable option for a 3rd big man.  What's the plan for when they need someone else due to foul trouble or injury?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on December 06, 2011, 07:52:15 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 06, 2011, 06:09:41 PM
I'd really like to know who the jerk is that's attacking woo91.  He's a Wooster student who only peeks on here to announce their excellent radio show.  He's never voiced an opinion, at least in this room, nor even commented on the Scots' team.  And somebody feels the need to take swipes at him?  C'mon.  You wanna hit me, go at it.  But give the kid a break.

Didn't know that was happening, but OK. I'm actually on here all the time--you guys post some really great insight into NCAC basketball that doesn't exist anywhere else.

Quote from: imderekpoe on December 06, 2011, 06:27:58 PM
Quote from: woo91 on December 06, 2011, 05:35:38 PM
Hey guys, we're going to be continuing our show with Wooster coach (and Wittenberg alum) Steve Moore tomorrow at 11. Do you guys have any burning questions you'd ask him?

Here's my question - not that I'd really expect an answer...

So far either Josh Claytor or Jake Mays has played every meaningful minute, and there doesn't really seem to be a viable option for a 3rd big man.  What's the plan for when they need someone else due to foul trouble or injury?

Great question. I'll throw it into the pile. Thanks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 06, 2011, 09:01:25 PM
Wabash 58, Millikin 43. LGs led by just 3 at the break and game was tied with 6:14 left. Wabash ended on a 17-2 run and there's your ballgame.

NCAC non-conference record stands at 30-19.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 06, 2011, 09:31:02 PM
Wabash pulls it out after an ugly first half that saw the starters get some pine time.  17-2 run was a great 3 minutes of basketball.  Milliken has a big boy inside that has been injured, #21. Von Nordeck, he is a player.....they will win a few if they play through him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 06, 2011, 09:49:37 PM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on December 06, 2011, 09:31:02 PM
Wabash pulls it out after an ugly first half that saw the starters get some pine time.  17-2 run was a great 3 minutes of basketball.  Milliken has a big boy inside that has been injured, #21. Von Nordeck, he is a player.....they will win a few if they play through him.

I haven't seen them this season; you may be right, but Millikin is currently a favorite in the 'winless' contest, and CCIW scuttlebutt is that they may be the worst CCIW team in decades.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 06, 2011, 09:58:04 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 06, 2011, 09:49:37 PM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on December 06, 2011, 09:31:02 PM
Wabash pulls it out after an ugly first half that saw the starters get some pine time.  17-2 run was a great 3 minutes of basketball.  Milliken has a big boy inside that has been injured, #21. Von Nordeck, he is a player.....they will win a few if they play through him.

I haven't seen them this season; you may be right, but Millikin is currently a favorite in the 'winless' contest, and CCIW scuttlebutt is that they may be the worst CCIW team in decades.

I doubt Millikin will put double digit wins on the board, the big boy had 16 tonight and was impressive around the basket.  But, had this been an NCAC contest, we might have been in trouble.  Just cold shooting......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 06, 2011, 10:08:07 PM
Cold shooting in the first half of games looks to be a trend for Wabash. Thankfully this team can defend and rebound.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 06, 2011, 11:31:20 PM
I should add about Millikin that their new coach is well-respected in CCIW circles, and once he has a chance to get his recruits (and plans) in, will hopefully bring the Big Blue back to relevance in the CCIW.  For this season, it would require an upset not to go 0-14.  And they only have 4 more chances non-con to avoid an 0-25 season.

Wabash seems to be quite good, but a win over Millikin is NOT the proof. :P

[When I was an undergrad Titan, Millikin was THE enemy (and with Jesse Price, arguably the greatest college player ever in the CCIW, one helluva rival).  I'm actually sad that the rivalry has degenerated (in both bball and fball) more to pity than 'hatred'. :-\]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 06, 2011, 11:55:34 PM
Of course it's not the proof, Ypsi. Just as a home win over Oberlin isn't proof that Wabash is worthy of the #25 ranking.

The proof comes Saturday. I can't say Wabash will beat Wooster, but it will be in the game and have a chance to win at the end. That's all you want and need from a team.

I don't think the NCAC is a top-tier hoops conference, but they are holding their own this year except for some selected teams (Marietta and Case). You wonder, though, if CWRU is wondering about re-joining since they play pert-near everyone anyway!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 06, 2011, 11:57:36 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 06, 2011, 06:09:41 PM
I'd really like to know who the jerk is that's attacking woo91.  He's a Wooster student who only peeks on here to announce their excellent radio show.  He's never voiced an opinion, at least in this room, nor even commented on the Scots' team.  And somebody feels the need to take swipes at him?  C'mon.  You wanna hit me, go at it.  But give the kid a break.

If it's the smite thing, there are some serial smiters out there who revel in the anonymity of it. Whoop-de-damn-do (as the noted sage Derek Coleman said).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 07, 2011, 12:52:24 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 06, 2011, 09:49:37 PM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on December 06, 2011, 09:31:02 PM
Wabash pulls it out after an ugly first half that saw the starters get some pine time.  17-2 run was a great 3 minutes of basketball.  Milliken has a big boy inside that has been injured, #21. Von Nordeck, he is a player.....they will win a few if they play through him.

I haven't seen them this season; you may be right, but Millikin is currently a favorite in the 'winless' contest, and CCIW scuttlebutt is that they may be the worst CCIW team in decades.

That's not really true. People in the CCIW have been waiting for Brock Van Nordeck to get healthy so that they can make more of an assessment of this edition of Millikin. Last season the Big Blue went 1-23, the worst record ever posted by a CCIW team. If Van Nordeck turns out to be legit, Millikin will almost certainly be better than it was last season ... not that that's really saying anything.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 07, 2011, 12:06:05 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 06, 2011, 11:57:36 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 06, 2011, 06:09:41 PM
I'd really like to know who the jerk is that's attacking woo91.  He's a Wooster student who only peeks on here to announce their excellent radio show.  He's never voiced an opinion, at least in this room, nor even commented on the Scots' team.  And somebody feels the need to take swipes at him?  C'mon.  You wanna hit me, go at it.  But give the kid a break.

If it's the smite thing, there are some serial smiters out there who revel in the anonymity of it. Whoop-de-damn-do (as the noted sage Derek Coleman said).


Ya think?  ::) 

Apparently, wsf and myself have done something to be on the receiving end of some of those revelers...  ;D

Whoop-de-damn-do pretty much sums up how I feel about the whole karma/smite thing and those who think they are the karma police and smite you whenever you have a difference of opinion with them.  It's pretty lame if you ask me...  ::)

BTW, do I get some sort of new status when I reach the negative century mark on my karma count?  I'm guessing I should reach that plateau by the end of the hoops season at the rate I'm being smited by my dearest fans or maybe sooner if I can rile up the Wallies which we know doesn't take much...  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on December 07, 2011, 12:43:57 PM
Plenty of Witt info in the last episode of "More with Moore" this semester: http://i.mixcloud.com/CvuBj

Hope to see you guys at the game tonight! Stop by and say hello! If you're not in the Wooster area we'll have coverage beginning at 7:15 EST.

Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 07, 2011, 06:26:30 PM
Can someone remind me why this game being played on a Wednesday again?  Unfortunately, Wednesdays are my wife's night out with her co-teacher friend so I'm home with the kids who have swim practice until 7:30 and then have to eat and do their homework before bedtime.  Guess I'll just have to catch the replay on clear picture tonight...  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2011, 08:14:25 PM
Because it's the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 07, 2011, 09:03:08 PM
Tiger up witt! Always great to win on a buzzer beater ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2011, 09:04:54 PM
Wow! I was wondering why the phalanx of Wooster posters weren't in here gloating about leads, etc.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on December 07, 2011, 09:27:45 PM
Ugly, ugly ballgame tonight ... clearly both teams are down a bit.  About 20 turnovers by the Scots and woeful shooting by both teams.  Given the score, you might think that the defense was great, but it wasn't all that solid, either, as a lot of open shots were missed.  It was a very physical game, and there were a lot of fouls called, so there was very little flow to it.  After watching both teams struggle, I think the league is wide open this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 07, 2011, 09:29:54 PM
Wooster gym turned lucky for Witt, beat Wabash last year the similar buzzer beater at Wooster in tourney.  Have not seen 3 balls being chucked at that rate since Louie Dampier with the Kentucky Colonels!  Both teams launching them like they were on sale!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2011, 10:09:01 PM
Wow. An ABA reference! When talking about Dampier from way down town...BANG! don't forget about Darel Carrier, his running mate in the early days.

Of course, my favorite weird 3-point slinger in the ABA was the immortal Les Selvage of the 1967 Anaheim Amigos, who once took 26 three-pointers in a game. Yikes!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 07, 2011, 11:03:14 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2011, 10:09:01 PM
Wow. An ABA reference! When talking about Dampier from way down town...BANG! don't forget about Darel Carrier, his running mate in the early days.

Of course, my favorite weird 3-point slinger in the ABA was the immortal Les Selvage of the 1967 Anaheim Amigos, who once took 26 three-pointers in a game. Yikes!

Shot ball in the driveway pretending to be Louie, Dan Isael and Artis Gilmore....Indiana boy but followed the Colonels as a kid.

Anyway, the 3s were out of control in the Witt Wooster Contest tonight.  Can't wait until Saturday with the Scots coming in
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 07, 2011, 11:25:47 PM
In all honesty, Witt needed this win a lot more than Wooster. Witt needed a win/confidence booster/whatever you want to phrase it after having two setbacks against top teams. Hopefully a momentum booster for them.

Another oddity of the Wednesday matchup since I wasn't there, didn't watch online and only listened to the last 5 minutes or so, but how much did a quieter atmosphere comparative to a Saturday night crowd affect play? I doub tmuch at all, but both teams now have LONG trips Saturday to avoid let-downs.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 07, 2011, 11:27:27 PM
Back from Timken where I watched Wooster play an ugly, sloppy game that resulted in a loss.

Congratulations to Wittenberg on an important conference road victory.  They showed good effort tonight.

As fantastic50 noted, neither team played particularly well but Wooster committed a total of 19 turnovers and about half of them had nothing to do with Wittenberg's defense.  The Scots carried the ball several times, tried dumb passes and generally treated the basketball like a hot potato.  The 19th turnover was the nail in the coffin giving the ball back to Wittenberg with 27 seconds left which the Tigers converted into the winning basket.

Wittenberg only had 10 turnovers so they got off 60 shots compared to only 54 for the Scots.  The Tigers shot a lower percentage from the floor than Wooster and still won the game.  Wooster also missed 4 free throws (only shot 63% from the charity stripe) and 2 of them were critical misses in the last 3 minutes of the game.  Scots only had 6 assists tonight which shows that they need to improve their offense.

I think Wooster needs to feed the ball into the post more which Wittenberg did repeatedly tonight.  The Tigers two big men (Brandt and Black) were 2 of their top scorers tonight.  By comparision, Josh Claytor and Jake Mays only got 6 shots combined tonight and they made 3 of them.

Through 6 games, Jake Mays is Wooster's best FG shooter at 68% but he has only attempted 19 shots in the 6 games because the rest of the team doesn't feed him the ball in the post enough.  Mays has performed well and also deserves more playing time IMO.

Hope the Scots can rebound on Saturday though they will have a tough challenge at Wabash.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 07, 2011, 11:35:06 PM
It is hard to swallow a loss where you outrebound Wittenberg by 16 and your point guard had more rebounds than any Tiger frontcourt player. Really sloppy turnovers cost the Scots the game. As great as Brown is, and he is great, he still makes four or five really bad decisions during the game. But since he is the best freshman I have ever seen at Wooster (last 20 years) and maybe in the NCAC in the last decade or more, that can obviously be overlooked. What Wooster needs is more contributions from Snyder and DeBoer, who were not very good tonight. And they have to start playing Mays more. I was pleasantly surprised by how well Claytor played, but Mays is just a better player, period. He is certainly much more of a weapon on offense. If you knew nothing about any of the players before tonight's game, you'd come away thinking Mays is the equal of Black. There is no question he is more of a force on defense. There is no reason Mays should be playing 10 minutes in this game. None. And while this hasn't been Wooster's style in recent years, they have to get the ball inside more. They aren't going to get passing lanes for shooters if all they are relying on is Brown breaking everyone down off the dribble. Heck, if nothing else, being able to run the offense through the post every once in a while will take some pressure of Brown, who may actually possess the ball more than Ian Franks did last year, which I thought would never be possible.

Now it all depends on what happens Saturday. A win at Wabash and you can move past this. If not, then this game is really going to stick, because Wittenberg still isn't playing very well and Wooster let it get away.

By the way, I just watched the video of the last shot. Leahy had inside position on Brown, and when the shot didn't draw iron, there was nothing Brown could have done except push him to the ground. As it was, Leahy pushed off a little bit with his left arm and Brown fell, turning it into an uncontested layup at the buzzer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2011, 12:57:40 AM
There were other games in the conference tonight...

Hiram 83, Oberlin 73
OWU 96, Kenyon 65 ... zowie
CWRU 73, Allegheny 57

NCAC non-conference record stands at 30-20. Our next crack at Case Western Reserve comes on Friday when the Spartans host a Kenyon team that will be licking its significant wounds.

Updated conference standings:

OWU 2-0
Wittenberg 2-0
DePauw 1-0
Wabash 1-0
Denison 1-1
Hiram 1-1
Wooster 1-1
Allegheny 0-1
Oberlin 0-2
Kenyon 0-3
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 08, 2011, 01:38:59 PM
Well, as I said, I wasn't able to attend last night's game and after watching the replay last night, it made me glad I stayed home because it looked as though Wooster forgot to show up as well. 

What I saw last night was a team that seemed to forget this game was a rivalry game.  They seemed unfocused and almost uninterested.  They were slow, lacksadaisical, and were being outhustled by Witt on just about EVERY loose ball.  Witt came to play last night and fully deserved that win on Wooster's home court.  And outside of Brown (who had another outstanding game), I really would have a hard time picking out a Wooster player that stood out to me?!

As seinfeld noted, Brown did have some moments last night where he reminded us all that he is still just a freshman, but the good far exceeded the bad as has been the case most of the season with him.  He did have some costly turnovers (7 total) including the last one that resulted in Witt getting off their buzzer beater and he did have 2 costly missed ft's.  But he also came through to lead the team in points and was the ONLY Scot to reach double figures in points last night?!  To me, this is more alarming than the number of turnovers Brown had.  He was basically trying to take everything on all by himself  in last night's game and that is a lot to ask for from a true freshman playing in his first rivalry game.

Now Wooster has to remove this loss from the memory banks and move on in a hurry as things won't get any easier in their next game at Wabash.  They need to forget about this loss and move on to the next task at hand and that is going to C'ville and coming away with a win.  A win at Wabash would go a long way in erasing the pain of last night's loss to Witt and would go a long way to keep Wooster on track to win their 8th NCAC title in a row.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 08, 2011, 07:07:06 PM
The weekend in the NCAC. Last big bunch of games before the holiday break.

Friday, Dec. 9

Kenyon (2-5) @ Case Western Reserve (5-2) - The Spartans are 4-1 against the NCAC and probably will go 5-1. The Lords were run over by OWU and now face travel to Cleveland. The good news is that after this game, Keynon has a 10-day break before facing Earlham.

Saturday, Dec. 10

Non-Conference

Oberlin (3-5) @ Alma (2-5) - From the records, this may seem to be a pillow fight, but Alma played John Carroll pretty tough (before giving Spalding its first win the next day so go figure...) and Oberlin has definitely improved over last year. The Yeomen could sneak away with a win here.

Denison (3-4) @ Kalamazoo (2-3) - The Hornets upset Bluffton, while Denison had Wabash down but wasn't able to finish off the Little Giants. The Big Red needs to learn to finish, and this will be a good test to see if they can.

Conference

Wittenberg (2-0, 3-2) @ Allegheny (0-1, 2-7) - It doesn't get any easier for the Gators. After their win against Elmira, they've lost four in a row to stout competition. Make it five. The Tigers may have some let down over their big win against Wooster, but not enough of one to fall to Allegheny.

Ohio Wesleyan (2-0, 7-1) @ DePauw (1-0, 5-2) - This is an intriguing early season match-up. The new Tigers face a top-level NCAC team that seems to be firing on all cylinders. A win for either team will be welcome, as it could determine a home-court game for the NCAC tourney when all is said and done. I know there's a lot of season, left, but every game counts!

Wooster (1-1, 5-1) @ Wabash (1-0, 7-0) - Hoo-boy, the NCAC really has loaded its early season slate. This could be an ugly game. The LG's have won with defense, rebounding, and streaky offense. They're a blue collar team. The Scots lost an ugly game against Witt, and probably don't want to get into another slugfest. The team that controls the pace and style of play will prevail.

Sunday, Dec. 11

Denison (3-4) @ Albion (3-2) - The Big Red decides to make it a Michigan weekend as they drive across state to face the Britons. (Well, maybe the drove across state after the Kalamazoo game...) Albion's three wins are against a horrid Franciscan team, a bad Heidelberg and North Central. Both teams will be off of back-to-backs since Albion will be playing host to Carthage whilst the Big Red is across state.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 09, 2011, 10:49:33 PM
Case maintains their conference lead by...wait, what's that you say? They left the conference? Oh, too bad for them.

Case Western Reserve 84, Kenyon 67.

NCAC non-con record falls to 30-21.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 09, 2011, 11:20:55 PM
No discussion from the Wooster folks on the big game Saturday? Or is everyone just anxious...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 10, 2011, 12:42:00 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 09, 2011, 11:20:55 PM
No discussion from the Wooster folks on the big game Saturday? Or is everyone just anxious...

I'm Not feeling the usual love for the game that we normally get from Wooster Rooters.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 10, 2011, 01:48:36 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 08, 2011, 07:07:06 PM
Sunday, Dec. 11

Denison (3-4) @ Albion (3-2) - The Big Red decides to make it a Michigan weekend as they drive across state to face the Britons. (Well, maybe the drove across state after the Kalamazoo game...) Albion's three wins are against a horrid Franciscan team, a bad Heidelberg and North Central. Both teams will be off of back-to-backs since Albion will be playing host to Carthage whilst the Big Red is across state.

Kzoo and Albion are about 45 minutes apart on I-94.  Denison could stay in the same hotel over both nights and not be bothered.  :)

Live video feed for the Kzoo/Denison game.  http://kzoo.edu/sports/video.html
live stats http://kzoo.edu/sports/live/xlive.htm

Albion should have live video for Sunday, but the link is not up on the miaa.org site just yet.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on December 10, 2011, 08:48:04 AM
Quote from: sac on December 10, 2011, 01:48:36 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 08, 2011, 07:07:06 PM
Sunday, Dec. 11

Denison (3-4) @ Albion (3-2) - The Big Red decides to make it a Michigan weekend as they drive across state to face the Britons. (Well, maybe the drove across state after the Kalamazoo game...) Albion's three wins are against a horrid Franciscan team, a bad Heidelberg and North Central. Both teams will be off of back-to-backs since Albion will be playing host to Carthage whilst the Big Red is across state.

Kzoo and Albion are about 45 minutes apart on I-94.  Denison could stay in the same hotel over both nights and not be bothered.  :)

Live video feed for the Kzoo/Denison game.  http://kzoo.edu/sports/video.html
live stats http://kzoo.edu/sports/live/xlive.htm

Albion should have live video for Sunday, but the link is not up on the miaa.org site just yet.




Beat me to it, Sac... Team Table at Turkeyville? (legit place and not a "dig" at Denison for those unfamiliar with the backroad corridor around Marshall).  ;)  "Sloppy Toms" and pie all around.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 10, 2011, 10:45:24 AM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on December 10, 2011, 12:42:00 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 09, 2011, 11:20:55 PM
No discussion from the Wooster folks on the big game Saturday? Or is everyone just anxious...

I'm Not feeling the usual love for the game that we normally get from Wooster Rooters.

Sorry we're making you feel snubbed...  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 10, 2011, 11:13:31 AM
Quote from: cave2bens on December 10, 2011, 08:48:04 AM
Quote from: sac on December 10, 2011, 01:48:36 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 08, 2011, 07:07:06 PM
Sunday, Dec. 11

Denison (3-4) @ Albion (3-2) - The Big Red decides to make it a Michigan weekend as they drive across state to face the Britons. (Well, maybe the drove across state after the Kalamazoo game...) Albion's three wins are against a horrid Franciscan team, a bad Heidelberg and North Central. Both teams will be off of back-to-backs since Albion will be playing host to Carthage whilst the Big Red is across state.

Kzoo and Albion are about 45 minutes apart on I-94.  Denison could stay in the same hotel over both nights and not be bothered.  :)

Live video feed for the Kzoo/Denison game.  http://kzoo.edu/sports/video.html
live stats http://kzoo.edu/sports/live/xlive.htm

Albion should have live video for Sunday, but the link is not up on the miaa.org site just yet.




Beat me to it, Sac... Team Table at Turkeyville? (legit place and not a "dig" at Denison for those unfamiliar with the backroad corridor around Marshall).  ;)  "Sloppy Toms" and pie all around.  ;D

If Denison is smart they are staying in Marshall or Battle Creek, which would put Turkeyville about 15 minutes to 30 minutes away.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2011, 11:16:30 AM
Not really much chatter from either side about the "big game" today. At least not here. But if its provocation you're looking for....

Go Navy! Beat Army!

:)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 10, 2011, 12:03:09 PM
I've seen the future, and it's at Wabash!  Holy cow, they have their live streaming video going already, and the picture is wide screen HD!  The best clarity of image I've seen outside of MLB.  Hopefully, it'll work well during the game, with no buffering issues, but it sure looks great.  Kudos to Wabash for being the front runner on this.  Now if we can just ruin their party... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 10, 2011, 02:09:02 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 10, 2011, 12:03:09 PM
I've seen the future, and it's at Wabash!  Holy cow, they have their live streaming video going already, and the picture is wide screen HD!  The best clarity of image I've seen outside of MLB.  Hopefully, it'll work well during the game, with no buffering issues, but it sure looks great.  Kudos to Wabash for being the front runner on this.  Now if we can just ruin their party... ;)

Does anyone else's live feed look like some sort of stop motion gibberish?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 10, 2011, 02:42:32 PM
At the Half:  Wabash 33  Wooster 25

Wooster had at least 8 turnovers in the half and shot only 6 of 10 from the free throw stripe.  Xavier Brown is leading the Scots with 9 points.  Josh Claytor has 5 points.

For Wabash, Brian Shelbourne has 11 points, Aaron Zinnerman has 8 and Jordan Surenkamp has 7.

The Little Giants made 4 three pointers in the half while the Scots made only 1 three pointer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 10, 2011, 02:46:20 PM
Looked like another sloppy half from the Scots until about the last 3 minutes or so of the half.  Wabash built the lead up to 14 at 29-15 when Moore called a timeout.  And from there, the Scots looked a bit more determined finishing the half on a 10-4 run and making the deficit more manageable at the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 10, 2011, 02:52:58 PM
My picture is fine, for streaming.  It's not what I thought it was going to be when I first saw it, but it's wide screen with a decent resolution.  The distance shots are better, for some reason, than the closeups.  As for the announcers, what is it they do with incompetents in Indiana?  Ride them out of town on the Monan rail?

Wooster is in trouble.  The only real plus on this team is their defensive rebounding.  The box out very well, and all three bigs really control the glass.  Other than that, there's really not much to say for this team.  Sloppy and purposeless ball movement.  You never see the drive-and-kick for the open three which has been a staple of the offense for over a decade.  Claytor has missed a season's worth of bunnies.  I really don't see where the improvement will come from, because they're just not much of a passing team and only one of them is capable of getting his own shot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 10, 2011, 02:59:04 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 10, 2011, 02:52:58 PM
As for the announcers, what is it they do with incompetents in Indiana?  Ride them out of town on the Monan rail?


I have mine on mute...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2011, 03:00:05 PM
Claytor missed more bunnies in that half than Elmer Fudd.  :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 10, 2011, 03:02:31 PM
Josh must be getting updates of what's being said about him in here as he is 2-2 to start the second half scoring 4 of Woo's first 6 points to start the second half...  ;D

EDIT: Make that 6 of 8!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 10, 2011, 03:17:53 PM
"That's a play where Claytor thought he's an offensive star, but actually he's very limited." Huh? Screw you, broadcaster dude.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 10, 2011, 03:26:29 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 10, 2011, 03:17:53 PM
"That's a play where Claytor thought he's an offensive star, but actually he's very limited." Huh? Screw you, broadcaster dude.

Hence why I have mine on mute...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2011, 03:36:46 PM
Are they students? My sound doesn't work on this here laptop.

If so, I don't criticize student broadcasters because I've been there - and it's learning as you go. It looks so much easier than it is, when you have a headset, the ball in play and you have to actually say stuff.

And it's MONON!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 10, 2011, 03:38:49 PM
Nicely played game by Wabash as they have a 11 point lead with only 1:12 left.

Congratulations to the Little Giants as they remain undefeated.

For Wooster, committing 15 or more turnovers per game and shooting less than 42% equals a loss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2011, 03:43:52 PM
Bah, humbug.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 10, 2011, 03:49:35 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 10, 2011, 03:38:49 PM
For Wooster, committing 15 or more turnovers per game and shooting less than 42% equals a loss.

Going 2-9 from beyond the arc doesn't help either.  ::)  Also, if someone locates Justin Hallowell, please let me know.  He's been a non-factor in each of Wooster's last 2 games now.  If he can't find a way to get things going offensively, I don't look for much to change going forward when Wooster goes up against more talented teams.

Congrats to Wabash on a nice win today.  Wabash's veteran team proved to be too much for the Scots on this day.  Wooster has quite a few things to work on over their 9 days off before heading to Puerto Rico.  Starting off 0-2 in conference play isn't ideal, but at least it's still VERY early in the season and there is still a TON of basketball left to be played.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2011, 03:56:10 PM
Bashbro,

Wooster's Xavier Brown is just a frosh and he's their leading scorer (18.3 coming into Wabash). He's odds on for newcomer of the year.

But nice to see Hodges out on the court!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2011, 03:57:24 PM
When was the last time Wooster lost two in a row in conference?

They need to regroup, and fast, otherwise they could have to travel (gasp) in the first round. I don't think Witt, OWU or DPU will be intimidated by them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2011, 04:05:05 PM
I think I answered my question. In 1996-97, Wooster lost to Allegheny on January 15 and Witt on January 18.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2011, 04:09:07 PM
Relax, I didn't know. I don't know if Hodges will break into the starting lineup. I'm glad Carpenter worked him into the rotation, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2011, 04:16:10 PM
And about Carpenter, I think this team has taken the personality of its coach. Just a bunch of hard-nosed and hard working gentlemen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on December 10, 2011, 05:25:54 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 10, 2011, 02:59:04 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 10, 2011, 02:52:58 PM
As for the announcers, what is it they do with incompetents in Indiana?  Ride them out of town on the Monan rail?


I have mine on mute...  :P

If you're gonna paraphrase "Hoosiers," it's more akin to hide strap your old bones to a rail car and send you down the Monon line... other than that, and student announcers aside after GOK how many years listening to Timken drivel in the Wayne County cheese aisle of the Killbuck corridor, incompetence is a rather harsh word when the game is played on the court and not a mike. ;D  Be glad you're in your cozy environment with capability of a video feed and broadcast - some aren't.  8-)  Love and xxx's from freakin' Botswana... oh, and WAF!  ;)

Smite away - earned too much from the football threads and ego needs tempered
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 10, 2011, 05:47:16 PM
They ARE incompetent, and they aren't students.  They get the score wrong, mispronounce names (Varnes?), assign fouls to the wrong players, and whine about every call against Wabash.  They essentially called the Wooster players stupid three or four times.

Needs tempered?  Did they teach you that grammar at Wabash?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 10, 2011, 05:50:20 PM

Oberlin 74 Alma 66   Merritt with 33 to lead the Yeo's

Kalamazoo 75 Denison 66  -- Dimonde Hale with 24 for the Big Red
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2011, 05:56:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 10, 2011, 05:47:16 PM
They ARE incompetent, and they aren't students.  They get the score wrong, mispronounce names (Varnes?), assign fouls to the wrong players, and whine about every call against Wabash.  They essentially called the Wooster players stupid three or four times.

Needs tempered?  Did they teach you that grammar at Wabash?

Yes, they were students Woo Boo, at least the PBP guy (he's class of '12). And whine about every call? Pot, meet kettle (I can research this thread if you want me too...)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2011, 06:02:21 PM
Quote from: sac on December 10, 2011, 05:50:20 PM

Oberlin 74 Alma 66   Merritt with 33 to lead the Yeo's

Kalamazoo 75 Denison 66  -- Dimonde Hale with 24 for the Big Red

Thanks to our MIAA correspondent!

Other scores in league:

Wittenberg 65, Allegheny 54 - Michael Cooper led the Tigers with 16. James "Untouchable" Ness led all scorers with 17 for the Gators, who fell behind 13 at half.

Ohio Wesleyan 67, DePauw 60 - Big win for the Bishops. Tim Brady was a beast, scoring 33 for OWU. Tommy Weakley led DPU with 15 while Barry Flynn added 14.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 10, 2011, 06:05:01 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 10, 2011, 05:56:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 10, 2011, 05:47:16 PM
They ARE incompetent, and they aren't students.  They get the score wrong, mispronounce names (Varnes?), assign fouls to the wrong players, and whine about every call against Wabash.  They essentially called the Wooster players stupid three or four times.

Needs tempered?  Did they teach you that grammar at Wabash?

Yes, they were students Woo Boo, at least the PBP guy (he's class of '12). And whine about every call? Pot, meet kettle (I can research this thread if you want me too...)

As a fan of rivalries I appreciated the several references to the 'evil Tigers'. 

Not that it matters but as a neutral I thought the video was excellent, the replays spaceage compared to my only being able to follow livestats of my school.  And the announcers didn't bother me at all.  Its D3, not the NBA.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 10, 2011, 06:11:50 PM
Wabash senior leadership was huge today, they just let the game come to them.  Bailey and Kurosh in foul trouble, step up Zinnerman and Shelborne.  They have at least 6 guys capable of double digit scoring and they really don't care who does it, as long as they win.  Zinnerman showed what he is capable of off the dribble, Shelborne can score when he wants to, he just chooses to distribute the ball.   Bailey doesn't score much today but his defense was very good on Hallowell.  Kurosh takes a critical charge in second half.   And Hodges, Surenkamp and Nicksic played huge minutes and roles today!   Really like the team, prepare to climb in the polls.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 10, 2011, 07:48:07 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 10, 2011, 03:00:05 PM
Claytor missed more bunnies in that half than Elmer Fudd.  :(

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F4.bp.blogspot.com%2F-EFPYE_Q2_kY%2FTc8ghI-VDiI%2FAAAAAAAACOg%2FEANLTHo9xW8%2Fs1600%2Felmer%2Bfudd%2Bshh%2Bbe%2Bvery%2Bquiet.jpg&hash=4eed5b4d4b31bcc8e31b4a81d077ab9d8745f480)

Shhh! Be vewy quiet! We'w hunting Wabash!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2011, 09:53:56 AM
Updated conference standings:

OWU 3-0
Wittenberg 3-0
Wabash 2-0
Denison 1-1
DePauw 1-1
Hiram 1-1
Wooster 1-2
Allegheny 0-2
Oberlin 0-2
Kenyon 0-3

Non-conference record stands at 31-22, with one game today (Denison at Albion).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 11, 2011, 11:00:39 AM
It's early, but there are some trends to comment on:

The fight for the conference title, and even the home court for the conference tournament, will be intense. Adding DPU makes it even more compelling.

Denison, Hiram and Kenyon make a pretty decent 6-8 for the league. Even though Kenyon's 0-3, they've had a tough league schedule. The NCAC tourney probably won't have any 'automatics' - each team will have to earn its first round win.

Oberlin is trending upward too, but they may not have enough horses for a tourney bid.

And the Gators need help, and need it fast.

Of course, this is all subject to change due to injuries, academic indifference, or other factors that affect 18-22 year-old college students...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 11, 2011, 04:48:21 PM
Albion 69 Denison 63

Larry Farmer with 26 for the Big Red.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 11, 2011, 04:49:19 PM
Non-con 31-23.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 11, 2011, 09:45:40 PM
Quote from: sac on December 11, 2011, 04:48:21 PM
Albion 69 Denison 63

Article on the game below.  Headline could just as easily refer to the Denison trend.  Lost a lead of 10 points last night and the 9 point lead today. 

Brilliant moves again by the bench braintrust yesterday against Kzoo, like bringing in two untested freshmen, turned around that one.  To give two kids their first court time ever in a tight game is unthinkable and inexcusable.  Just stoopid!     

Sorry NCAC, but we still have two more non-conference games. 

http://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2011-12/contrib/20111211g6s82t


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 11, 2011, 09:55:26 PM
I think Denison needs to play through Farmer and not Hale to be successful.  Farmer made things happen when Wabash played them, yet Hale took the most shots.  Hale shooting left handed was wild, I thought he used to shot right handed.  Anyway, Farmer is a key to Big Red wins in my opinion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 11, 2011, 10:53:14 PM
Of course there may be other reasons to bring in those freshman, like practice habits, or some other shenanigans. Besides, these were non-conference road games. League games are key for Denison, so they can experiment in non-conference. Still, without knowing all of the story, while the sub pattern may be odd, there may be other reasons.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2011, 01:13:54 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 11, 2011, 10:53:14 PM
Of course there may be other reasons to bring in those freshman, like practice habits, or some other shenanigans. Besides, these were non-conference road games. League games are key for Denison, so they can experiment in non-conference. Still, without knowing all of the story, while the sub pattern may be odd, there may be other reasons.

I feel like we have been defending Bob Ghiloni with comments like these for many years now, perhaps too many. He's been given more benefit-of-the-doubt free passes than most coaches with five consecutive seasons of eight or fewer wins. In nine-plus seasons in Granville, his record is a dismal 73-166 (math done in my head; corrections appreciated.) He's reached the not-so-vaunted ten-win plateau just twice (both thanks to Dan Hodgkinson), and his only winning season was back in 2004-05...and that was just 13-12. He's got a new AD this year, one that has a bit more of a taste for winning, so maybe the time has come for Ghiloni to replace the whys with some Ws.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 12, 2011, 08:31:53 AM
Your math is correct, David. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on December 12, 2011, 08:41:03 AM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on December 11, 2011, 09:55:26 PM
I think Denison needs to play through Farmer and not Hale to be successful.  Farmer made things happen when Wabash played them, yet Hale took the most shots.  Hale shooting left handed was wild, I thought he used to shot right handed.  Anyway, Farmer is a key to Big Red wins in my opinion.
Maybe they need to sneak Sullivan in off the bench to pick up a few non-conference wins here and there. Doubt if they could fool anyone in conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 12, 2011, 09:49:14 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 12, 2011, 01:13:54 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 11, 2011, 10:53:14 PM
Of course there may be other reasons to bring in those freshman, like practice habits, or some other shenanigans. Besides, these were non-conference road games. League games are key for Denison, so they can experiment in non-conference. Still, without knowing all of the story, while the sub pattern may be odd, there may be other reasons.

I feel like we have been defending Bob Ghiloni with comments like these for many years now, perhaps too many. He's been given more benefit-of-the-doubt free passes than most coaches with five consecutive seasons of eight or fewer wins. In nine-plus seasons in Granville, his record is a dismal 73-166 (math done in my head; corrections appreciated.) He's reached the not-so-vaunted ten-win plateau just twice (both thanks to Dan Hodgkinson), and his only winning season was back in 2004-05...and that was just 13-12. He's got a new AD this year, one that has a bit more of a taste for winning, so maybe the time has come for Ghiloni to replace the whys with some Ws.

I wasn't exactly defending him. I was asking for some context. I looked at the box scores. Those freshmen played briefly, and from the numbers weren't horrid. So instead of focusing on those insignificant minutes, focus on the fact that Denison can't close out games this year. That's the compelling question, not the nit-picky stuff.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 12, 2011, 10:04:51 AM
Just three non-conference games before the weekend.

Tuesday, December 13:

Allegheny (2-8) @ Thiel (6-2) - Well, on paper this is a mis-match. A team that could be the worst in the NCAC against the leader of the PAC. (Cue motorcycle sound effects...) The Gators hung with Wittenberg, and maybe they could hang with the Tomcats. My crystal ball thinks its another loss for the gang from Meadville, though.

Wednesday, December 14:

Grove City (4-4) @ Hiram (3-3) - The Terriers broke their losing streak by defeating Oberlin. This mid-week clash against a mid-pack PAC team will be important for Hiram to regain some momentum. The Wolverines aren't exactly world beaters, and this is the type of game the NCAC must win to improve its reputation.

Mt. St. Joseph (4-3) @ Denison (3-6) - Here were are again, Big Red. The issue is closing out games, and not blowing leads. Is that coaching? Do the players have the confidence that when a team makes a 6-0 run that it won't be the 'SSDD' effect (same stuff, different day)? Denison is much better than 3-6, on paper. But this could be a lost season if they don't start closing teams out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2011, 07:49:21 PM
New poll: (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/index)

Wabash moves up 8 places to #17.
Wooster plummets to #19 from #5.
Wittenberg lurks right off the back end, effectively tied for #26 and just 3 points below #25 Stevens Point.
OWU moves closer to the poll with 27 points, effectively tied for #32.
Still no love for Denison.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 13, 2011, 09:24:22 PM
The story remains the same for Allegheny.

They fell behind 14 at the half, and trailed by 17 with 12:07 to go. The Gators cut the lead down to 10 before Thiel surged out ahead, and the Tomcats held on to beat Allegheny 88-78.

James "Untouchable" Ness led Allegheny with 16. Gabe Seidman added 15 for the 2-9 Gators.

NCAC is now 31-24 in non-conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 14, 2011, 12:19:49 PM
It seems that the Massey ratings no longer include DIII (or DII).  Or am I just missing it somehow?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 14, 2011, 12:25:07 PM
He normally doesn't post those for below D-1 until January or so, at least as far as I can remember.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: augie_superfan on December 14, 2011, 12:54:00 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 14, 2011, 12:19:49 PM
It seems that the Massey ratings no longer include DIII (or DII).  Or am I just missing it somehow?

He changed his website and the ease of finding it has diminished but here is the link:

http://masseyratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&sub=NCAA%20III (http://masseyratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&sub=NCAA%20III)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 14, 2011, 01:12:26 PM
Thanks! I noticed that Wabash is #3, so double thanks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 14, 2011, 04:00:45 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 14, 2011, 12:19:49 PM
It seems that the Massey ratings no longer include DIII (or DII).  Or am I just missing it somehow?

on this page  http://masseyratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&sub=NCAA%20I

click the 'CB' under  this:    Key & Description | Predictions | Matchups | Conferences | CSV | 2011 | 2013

in this line:   Using games from Monday, November 7, 2011 to Sunday, December 11, 2011
| CB |


It will take you to the page that allows you the option of choosing divisions.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 14, 2011, 08:32:58 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 14, 2011, 01:12:26 PM
Thanks! I noticed that Wabash is #3, so double thanks!
And here I always thought they were #2. [rimshot]

Thanks, folks. I'll be here until the end of fifth grade.

Anyway....

Hiram is presently kicking Grove City's butt. (76-50, 11:27 to go.) If they hold on, it will be the NCAC's first win against the, um, vaunted Presidents Athletic Conference in five tries this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 14, 2011, 09:06:19 PM
Denison 66, MSJ 54...maybe we struggle with the PrAC, but we own the HCAC, now 10-4, and three of the 4 losses are to Hanover
Hiram 94, Grove City 62

Non-con 33-24
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 14, 2011, 11:31:28 PM
Guys, thanks for showing me how to get to the DIII Massey stuff.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 15, 2011, 10:57:57 AM
We now have a little lull until Sunday, when the Terriers face the W&J Presidents and try to improve our record against the PrAC!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 16, 2011, 04:06:36 AM
What are the biggest surprises (team or individual) and biggest disappointments (team or individual) so far this season?
Wabash looks like the team to beat in the NCAC.
Wittenberg and Ohio Wesleyan are also off to a good start.
Oberlin has improved in the win column.
Denison has the talent but not the results so far.
Wooster loses 2 league games in a row for the first time since '96.  Scots won't roll over and die.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 16, 2011, 07:57:18 AM
Anytime Allegheny can be mentioned in the same breath with Oberlin as candidates to miss the tournament, it's a surprise. In fact, I can't recall that it has ever happened before. The Gators get no attention in here and no press in the real world, but they have been a consistently middling-to-good (and occasionally very good) program for many years. A 2-9 start is a real shock and easily the surprise of the early season for me. Even in last season's 7-19 nightmare they started 4-4.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 16, 2011, 09:49:31 AM
This may be the bottom-out year for Allegheny before rebuilding starts in earnest. I can't see them continuing to struggle like this. They have one senior and two juniors, and the lack of experience may be a huge factor.

Of course, the W's, DPU and OWU aren't going to feel sorry for those youngsters.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 16, 2011, 02:00:58 PM
I think it goes without saying that their decision to let Rob Clune go was a very bad one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 16, 2011, 02:26:08 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 16, 2011, 02:00:58 PM
I think it goes without saying that their decision to let Rob Clune go was a very bad one.

You may be onto something. There are only three holdovers from that era.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 16, 2011, 06:23:54 PM
Quote from: WAlum on December 16, 2011, 04:06:36 AM
What are the biggest surprises (team or individual) and biggest disappointments (team or individual) so far this season?
Wabash looks like the team to beat in the NCAC.
Wittenberg and Ohio Wesleyan are also off to a good start.
Oberlin has improved in the win column.
Denison has the talent but not the results so far.
Wooster loses 2 league games in a row for the first time since '96.  Scots won't roll over and die.

I think Ohio Wesleyan at home is a very tough game for all teams this year.  It is a tough place to shoot for visitors, the lighting and roof-line is tough...and they have some very talented scores themselves.  I believe by mid conference, OWU and Wabash will be the front-runners.

Also, I think DePauw will surprise one of the top teams with a good shooting night.  They have a couple of streak shooters that can fill it up if they get hot.

Lastly(and I hope it's not Wabash) but Oberlin will catch someone overlooking them too this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 16, 2011, 10:26:14 PM
It's a very odd Saturday with no NCAC action, but there's a smattering of hooping for league teams starting Sunday.

Sunday, December 18

Hiram (4-3) @ Washington & Jefferson (4-5) - The Terriers ran Grove City out of the gym, and there's a chance they'll do the same against the Presidents. Also, there is a chance that Hiram could revert back to how they played against Denison. They do have one common opponent in Notre Dame, where Hiram won by 11 and W & J won by just one. Hopefully the NCAC will win another against the PrAC.

Monday, December 19

Wooster (5-2) vs. St. Mary's (MD) (7-2) @ San Juan, PR - No there's no truth to the rumor that Wooster fans ran their squad out of town thanks to the two-game losing streak. But it's not like it's a pleasure trip down to the island. St. Mary's made the elite eight last year and their two losses, like Wooster's, were also to quality programs. I hope the Wooster faithful has a chance to follow this game - it looks to be a barnburner.

Earlham (0-10) @ Kenyon (2-6) - Finally out of the NCAC meat-grinder schedule they were given, the Lords get a break in their quest for a solid season. The Quakers are struggling, to say the least and the Lords should be able to get well against them. LATE NOTE: Earlham lost to Anderson, as expected, on Saturday.

Rose Hulman (8-2) @ DePauw (5-3) - None of the NCAC big guns are shying away from tough non-conference games. The Engineers only loss was an ugly, bruising battle against Wabash (their specialty) and DPU needs to be ready for a game like that. RHIT held Manchester to just 29 points earlier in the year, and DPU hasn't exactly been consistent on offense so far. LATE NOTE: Hanover thwapped RHIT Saturday. Rose's offense was stymied much of the game.

Tuesday, December 20

Wabash (8-0) vs. Baldwin - Wallace (6-2) @ Transylvania - Transylvania knows how to schedule a tourney. They schedule the weakling in the first round (Hendrix) and let two tough squads duke it out in the first game. The LGs have had time to recover from their dismantling of Wooster, but the Yellow Jackets thwacked Marietta earlier in the season and are coming off an upset loss to Wilmington. I hope the fans in Lexington show up early to watch this match-up. LATE NOTE: B-W eased past the 'Berg Saturday.

Wittenberg (4-2) @ Ohio Northern (6-2) - Not an easy game here, either. The Tigers seem to have recovered from their early season issues. The Polar Bears knocked off NCAC nemesis Hanover. However, by the time this game has been played ONU will have faced Marietta and so the Tigers may be in a good spot to sneak out with a win. LATE NOTE: ONU upset Marietta on Saturday.

Wooster (5-2) vs. Sacred Heart - PR @ San Juan -  I can't find much info on Sacred Heart, PR. I guess we will get a read on them after they play St. Mary's on the 18th.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 18, 2011, 04:42:49 PM
Hiram goes to 5-3 on the season with a convincing 85-66 win over Washington & Jefferson. Andrew Weigand came up huge with 29 points. Alan Sheppard added 17 and Jamaal Watkins netted 12 and grabbed eight boards. A good win for the Terriers.

Non-conference record now 34-24
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 18, 2011, 07:35:58 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 16, 2011, 10:26:14 PMWooster (5-2) vs. Sacred Heart - PR @ San Juan -  I can't find much info on Sacred Heart, PR. I guess we will get a read on them after they play St. Mary's on the 18th.

I think that Sally Field played for their women's team in the '60s. Apparently, she had quite a vertical.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 19, 2011, 12:02:00 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 18, 2011, 07:35:58 PM
I think that Sally Field played for their women's team in the '60s. Apparently, she had quite a vertical.

See?  This is what you get when you leave the doors to the room open.  Guys sallying forth with comments like this.  Geeze. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2011, 12:46:07 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 18, 2011, 07:35:58 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 16, 2011, 10:26:14 PMWooster (5-2) vs. Sacred Heart - PR @ San Juan -  I can't find much info on Sacred Heart, PR. I guess we will get a read on them after they play St. Mary's on the 18th.

I think that Sally Field played for their women's team in the '60s. Apparently, she had quite a vertical.

I also think she surfed all the way there from her home base.

You like me, you really like me...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 19, 2011, 01:24:33 PM
This St. Mary's game has a very similar feel to that national semi-final Wooster win over Williams.  Wooster was down 18 17 at the half and as many as 21 early in the 2nd half, but have managed to whittle away that lead to just 3 points with 7 to play!

Wooster was only 1-11 from deep in the first half and are 4-6 so far in the 2nd half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2011, 01:38:08 PM
Since the NCAC is no longer a true double-round-robin I wanted to see who was missing who in a game this year.

Wabash - Hiram, Allegheny
DPU - Hiram, Allegheny
Hiram - Wabash, DPU
Allegheny - Wabash, DPU

Denison- Witt, Wooster
Witt - Denison, Kenyon
Wooster - Denison, Oberlin
Kenyon - OWU, Witt
OWU - Kenyon, Oberlin
Oberlin _ Wooster, OWU

Denison, Hiram and Kenyon have advantages that they could exploit if they were so inclined to improve their seeding. Obviously, besides limiting the long road trip to just one jaunt, the NCAC did power ranking for the rest.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 19, 2011, 01:54:42 PM
And the comeback is complete!!!   8-)

Wooster comes all the way back to win 63-61 despite missing at least 6 ft's down the stretch!!!  BIG win for the Scots to get back on track!  Things didn't look too good for the Scots to avoid their first 3 game skid in forever.

Claytor led the Scots with 18 pts. including 16 in the second half!  :o  Again, can someone tell me why Wooster is being so stubborn at getting the ball inside and letting the offense run through Claytor and Mays?  Wooster struggles offensively in the first half and shoots just 23% and there was no effort to get the ball inside.  Then, Wooster starts to have success with Claytor inside in the 2nd half which led St. Mary's to start to collapse which then opened things up for the shooters.  I think it's time to just let the offense run through Wooster's bigs!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 19, 2011, 02:16:14 PM
Wow, that was some comeback.  Wooster was in the water neck deep, on their way to being routed, and then came halftime.  According to Mike Breckenridge the game was played in an "open air" gym, more like a picnic pavilion.  The backdrop at one end, which had a road and traffic going by, was a bear.  Wooster faced that during the first half and couldn't make a shot.  Things quickly changed after the intermission, as it was Wooster who then could see the basket while St. Mary's struggled.  All in all, a monster turnaround win for Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2011, 02:56:35 PM
Interesting on the 'gym', though it reminds me of some of the playgrounds I've played on where the shooting background was intriguing.

Good win for the Scots and the NCAC. Hopefully that karma rubs off on the other NCAC tilts tonight.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2011, 04:46:54 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 19, 2011, 02:16:14 PMThe backdrop at one end, which had a road and traffic going by, was a bear.

Lucky for the Scots that the bear decided to stay put for the whole game and not go looking for picnic baskets or anything.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 19, 2011, 06:02:58 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 19, 2011, 04:46:54 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 19, 2011, 02:16:14 PMThe backdrop at one end, which had a road and traffic going by, was a bear.

Lucky for the Scots that the bear decided to stay put for the whole game and not go looking for picnic baskets or anything.

Comic Rimshot (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=endscreen&NR=1&v=9CdVTCDdEwI)   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2011, 09:12:33 PM
Kenyon took care of business, sending Earlham back to Richmond with a 76-55 loss. Ikenna Nwadibia and Barry "No More Animal House Jokes" Liebowitz led the Lords with 21 each. Nwadibia grabbed 13 boards and Liebowitz nabbed 10. The Lords move to 3-6 on the year.

NCAC is now 36-24 non-conference on the year pending the outcome of DPU vs. RHIT.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2011, 09:17:24 PM
And make that 36-25. Rose-Hulman bested the new Tigers 67-59. DPU now 5-4 on the season.

DePauw sprinted out to a 36-26 halftime lead but the slow-starting Engineers kicked it into gear in the second half (as is their modus operandi this year) and outscored DPU 41-23 in the second half.

Sean Haseley was the only Tiger in double figures with 10. Barry Flynn, who had been playing well for DPU, had just six points (on 3-4 shooting).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 19, 2011, 09:40:03 PM
This DePauw team is very streaky, hot and cold in long stretches.  They will slip up on some teams if you don't play defense on the perimeter.  DePauw coach makes some weird substitutions at times...won't let a streaking team streak by subbing for scorers.

Wabash handled Rose Hulman with ease, I did not think they would win many HCAC games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 20, 2011, 02:45:30 PM
Wooster wins handily over the host school down in Puerto Rico today by a final of 78-50.  They led by as many as 30 in the 2nd half.  Nice way to end a successful holiday trip to the tropics.   8-)  Wooster is now off until the 29th when they host Thiel at the Mose Hole.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 20, 2011, 09:52:04 PM
Excellent win, to say the least, for the LGs!

And along with Houston Hodges, Wabash gained the services of a footballer, backup QB Andy Walsh. This Wabash team is deep and unselfish.

Nick Curosh led Wabash with 11, while Brian Shelbourne added 10. Grant Fairhurst was on fire for the Yellow Jackets, netting six three-pointers and leading everyone with 20 off the bench. But it wasn't enough.

Wabash will move on to play the host, Translyvania, tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 20, 2011, 09:56:03 PM
Wittenberg also shows the OAC who's the boss, besting Ohio Northern in Ada 75-66. Five of the old Tigers scored in double figures led by Michael Cooper's 17.

The NCAC is now 39-24 in non-conference play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 20, 2011, 10:51:51 PM
What these two wins tonight continue to show from the Wooster perspective is that despite how poorly we might have perceived the Scots playing in their two losses, they lost to two pretty good teams. B-W crushed Marietta, and ONU just beat Marietta in Marietta, the team expected to be the best in the region. I think, as Wooster fans, we should consider the fact that it isn't that the Scots aren't a very good team, it's that we have company near the top like we maybe haven't seen in a while. And that has to do with some really good seniors on Wabash, Witt and OWU. It is rare that Wooster's seniors aren't elite, but I think it's the case this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 20, 2011, 11:09:31 PM
I think this will be more the norm than the exception. Wabash, OWU and DPU have sustained programs now and the rest of the NCAC is improving. Wooster's reign as undisputed top dog may be over, but the Scots will always be in the conversation to be the champs.

This, of course, is great for the league as a whole - to have five teams capable of winning the title and having most of the rest of the league good enough to spring an upset.

I say this by acknowledging that DePauw isn't as good as I thought they would be - but their recent history is pretty stellar and you never can count out those rascals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 20, 2011, 11:33:37 PM
Some big games coming up before Christmas:

Wednesday, December 21

Wabash (9-0) @ Transylvania (8-0) - Two unbeaten teams enter. One leaves unblemished. Wabash has played a stout schedule and has won games in almost every permutation (coming back, holding on to big leads, blowing teams out, battling a tough opponent nip and tuck). Transylvania has coasted through many of their games, but their schedule hasn't been that stellar. According to Massey, even before beating B-W, Wabash was #3 in power and had the #42 SOS. Transylvania was #32 and the #196 SOS before Hendrix. I say that Wabash's toughness and schedule make it the favorite, even on the road. But it'll be a heck of a contest.

Thursday, December 22

Westminster (PA) (2-6) @ Hiram (5-3) - Hiram is our PrAC redeemer! Ok, so they haven't played the top teams and Westminster is no one's definition of a conference contender. But it still will be nice to see another win against that conference. Hiram definitely will need a good result before some tough games come calling.

Otterbein (3-5) @ Wittenberg (5-2) - The Tigers are feeling good, no doubt, after recent big wins. Both the Cards and Witt beat ONU, who beat Marietta. But Otterbein lost to Marietta and aside from that win against the Polar Bears have been rather meh all season long. I can see another NCAC win over the OAC, and that'll feel really good coming into Christmas!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 21, 2011, 12:24:19 AM
Wabash really had to work hard to grind out the win tonight against BW.  Key takeaways.....BW is the best team Wabash has played. (sorry Wooster and DePauw) and senior leadership on Wabash is huge.  Zinnerman and Bailey have a subpar game, enter Shelborne and Kurosh....along with Walsh and Oetting and Surenkamp...Balance is key for Wabash, very unselfish bunch. 

Another takeaway is..... These guys know not to panic and no one gets on anyone else, they leave that to Coach Carpenter, they just continue to work as a unit.  Defense is their staple.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kyballr on December 21, 2011, 05:42:51 PM
Don Lane Classic @ Transylvania   7 pm
Wabash (9-0) vs host Transy (8-0)

live stats
http://www.sidearmstats.com/transy/mbball/index.htm

live video
http://tupioneers.nmtvsports.com/main.php?eventId=21802
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 21, 2011, 08:49:55 PM
Bashbro's concern come to fruition. Even though Wabash dominated the glass (outrebounding Transy 44-26) they fell 66-61. Wabash shot just 34% from the floor and took 36 of their 64 field goal attempts behind the arc! Aaron Zinnerman had a tough night hitting just 4-16 from the floor (including 1-9 from three).

Brian Shelbourne led Wabash with 14. Transylvania was led by Brandon Rash with 25 and Ethan Spurling with 19.

Wabash is now 9-1 and has a few days for the holidays before playing host to Franklin on the 29th.

NCAC now 39-25 in non-conference action.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 21, 2011, 09:58:04 PM
That's not a combination of stats that you often see, a team owning the boards but not taking the ball inside.  Now that I think about it, though, Wooster has done the same thing on occasion.  Damn Bigs.  Call for the ball! :)

Bigs.  I like that term for inside players.  Pivotman has gone out of style, but the men's game has picked up some new words, and we have the women to thank.  We've always had "post up", but I think the women were first to call inside players "Posts", which I also like.  And "Wings" may have come from them, too.  Let's just not let the phrase "Quarter-court offense", as one overly-creative female announcer says, go viral.  Half-court offense.  Always has been, always will be. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 21, 2011, 10:11:09 PM
Shooting threes leads to long rebounds at times. Opportune teams can snatch those. Still doesn't make up for not being able to shoot it from two. But there is time to correct this. The fact is the offense was not stellar, yet they still were in the game with a darn good team on the road.

I think I'm seeing a trend in the NCAC this year - it won't be pretty basketball but it will be gritty.

Curosh had an interesting stat line. 0-2 from the floor. 10 boards, five offensive and four assists.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 21, 2011, 11:06:05 PM
Nick Curosh was injured (shooting wrist) in the BW game. By the second half (tonight)Nick could not handle the ball, thus the weird stat line, he owned the glass in the first half and really limited Rash in the first half.  But the injury limited his minutes in the second half.

Transylvania was the better team tonight, cold shooting night for Wabash.  Nice adjustment by Transylvania coach at half time, bringing Rash to perimeter on the offense.

BW game was very physical and it was taking its toll on Wabash in the second half.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 22, 2011, 05:31:01 PM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on December 21, 2011, 11:06:05 PM
Nick Curosh was injured (shooting wrist) in the BW game. By the second half (tonight)Nick could not handle the ball, thus the weird stat line, he owned the glass in the first half and really limited Rash in the first half.  But the injury limited his minutes in the second half.

Transylvania was the better team tonight, cold shooting night for Wabash.  Nice adjustment by Transylvania coach at half time, bringing Rash to perimeter on the offense.

BW game was very physical and it was taking its toll on Wabash in the second half.

Update, Nick will miss some time with a fractured hand....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ste24vie on December 22, 2011, 05:44:06 PM
Witt gotta shut down the inside game of Davis to win. Otterbein is not a good shooting team and seem to be continually losing more key players.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 22, 2011, 10:28:58 PM
Hope Curosh heals quickly. LG's need his inside presence.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 22, 2011, 10:34:43 PM
Not a good night for Wittenberg. Otterbein outscores them 43-34 in the second half and prevails over the old Tigers 64-61. The game was knotted at 61 with 2:15 to go but Witt couldn't find the bucket again.

RaNeal Ewing led all scores with 28 for the victors. Zach Leahy led Witt with 13 off the bench, Clayton Black added 11 and Michael Cooper netted 10. Witt is now 5-3 on the season.

Hiram, though, had a good night as they beat Westminster (PA) 91-75. Balanced scoring from the Terriers as Adam Stefanov led them with 24, draining six of nine from behind the arc. Andrew Wiegand added 20 points and 15 rebounds. Jamaal Watkins had 17 off the bench and Alan Sheppard also scored 17. Hiram is now 6-3 for the year.

By my count, the NCAC is 40-26 in the non-conference. Corrections gladly accepted.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on December 23, 2011, 01:57:43 PM
Can any Witt followers chime in on Browns distribution of playing time?

Maybe i'm off base but how can Cam Walton and Jacob Weide, two of the most battle test players of the Tigers roster be burried on the bench. STICK TO YOUR GUNS and trust your veterans.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 24, 2011, 07:26:35 PM
Happy Holidays to all, whichever NCAC program you worship. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 25, 2011, 09:55:11 AM
I'm not sure how long it's been there without my noticing, but the current homepage photo banner (or whatever you call it) has Wooster's Justin Warnes on it, driving around Hayden Rooke-Ley of Williams in last year's national semifinal game. Sweet!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 25, 2011, 01:18:43 PM
We did go with little (no) fanfare on changing the banner/masthead/etc. this year. It's been up about a month but depending on how users' browsers cache images, it might have taken a week or so to update.

If you are still seeing the old banner, let me know. But you can get it to show by doing a forced refresh, which on most browsers would be holding down the shift key while hitting the refresh button.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 26, 2011, 08:28:42 PM
It's a busy few days coming up in NCAC-land, so let's cover Wednesday and Thursday.

Wednesday, December 28:

Ohio Wesleyan (8-1) vs. Albion (4-5) @ Otterbein - The Bishops come back after a long, long break to face the Britons in the first game of the Smokey Ballenger tournament. The tip off is 3PM with the Otterbein / Platteville game tipping at 8. (Women's games tip at 1 and 6.) Albion recently bested Denison up in Michigan, but these Bishops know how to finish games and I don't think an 18-day break will affect them that much.

Thursday, December 29:

Ohio Wesleyan (8-1) vs. Otterbein (4-5) or UW - Platteville (7-4) @ Otterbein - Obviously, we won't know who plays who in this one until after Wednesday's contests. But props to Otterbein for putting together a pretty competitive field for a tournament. There's no 'gimme' amongst these four teams.

DePauw (5-4) vs. SUNY-IT (1-6) @ Tampa Prep School - Meanwhile, the New Tigers host a tournament in Tampa for the fifth year in a row. Not a bad gig, really. But DPU scheduled itself a nice gimme of a win in the first round. That's probably exactly what these Tigers need after their recent rough stretch of play. They will move on to face either Maryville or FDU - Florham in the finals. I just can't see SUNY-IT providing much resistance here.

Monmouth (2-6) vs. Wittenberg (5-3) - This is the opening round of the Charles B. Zimmerman memorial classic. The Scots are on the rebuilding trail after a few dreadful years and they'll run into a Witt squad who just dropped a winnable game to Otterbein. I think Bill Brown is going to make a point to his squad, and I pity poor Monmouth. The other teams here are a struggling Olivet team and Marian (IN) - an NAIA squad that's usually quite competitive.

Hiram (6-3) vs. Heidelberg (3-6) @ Wooster - Instead of a tournament, the Scots made this a classic when Hiram was tapped to play, so there won't be a chance of a non-conference conference game here. The Student Princes started out 1-5 and recently lost to Trine. Hiram has won four in a row and the Terriers look like they're going to be pretty stout competition for anyone. I think that Denison game woke them up.

Thiel (7-2) @ Wooster (7-2) - In part B of the "Mose" Hole Kiwanas Classic, the Scots look to keep the momentum they gained down in Puerto Rico. Thiel is already 4-0 in the PrAC and has only lost to Capital in D-3 competition. However, the Tomcats will learn there's a big leap from beating W&J and Westminster and facing Wooster.

Franklin (6-4) @ Wabash (9-1) - No tournaments, classics or shootouts here, it's just a normal ol' non-conference game between a couple of long-time rivals. The Grizzlies started out 1-3 but have had a nice course-correction. Wabash recently lost its first game of the season and Nick Curosh may be lost for a while with a broken hand. His inside presence will be missed.

Washington & Jefferson (4-6) @ Kenyon (3-6) - The Lords broke a six-game losing string in a convincing win against Earlham. Of course, most every win against the Quakers is convincing. The Presidents come calling after losing to Hiram, also in convincing fashion. Kenyon's 3-6 is deceiving, and I can see them gaining another win for the NCAC over the PrAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 26, 2011, 11:24:05 PM
Glad to say I"ll finally have some Witt insight after Thursday as I'll be in attendance for my first Witt game this year. That's almost embarassing to say, but officiating takes a lot of time.

I'm interested to see how Ohio Wesleyan does at the Otterbein tournament. I am hoping the Witt loss to Otterbein won't come back to haunt them, but Otterbein is a team that's hard to get a read on. They're the OAC version of Denison, not really quite sure what their rotation and team is doing but always a chance to be dangerous.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 28, 2011, 05:13:08 PM
OWU 78, Albion 66

41-26
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 28, 2011, 09:33:35 PM
For OWU, Marshall Morris had 22 rebounds. He grabbed seven offensive rebounds and 15 on the defensive end. Yeah, he shot 1-10 from the floor, but still, 22 boards! Tim Brady led the Bishops with 19.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 28, 2011, 09:49:14 PM
Meanwhile, Platteville hit a buzzer-beater three to tie the game and now Otterbein and UW-P are in OT.

Late Note: Otterbein outlasts UW-Platteville in OT and will face OWU in the championship game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2011, 11:58:21 PM
Final:  Wooster 78  Thiel 68

Back from Timken where I watched Wooster's deep roster notch a victory over a scrappy 7-2 Thiel squad.  Xavier Brown hurt his leg/knee midway through the first half and he sat the rest of the game though he appeared to be walking ok.

Game ball goes to Doug Thorpe who led the Scots and had a career game with 21 points including 3 of 6 on three pointers and 8 of 9 on FT's. :)  Thiel is a quick team that forces turnovers and Wooster had too many of them (19 total).  The Scots offset this weakness by dominating the boards with a 46 to 29 margin.  Both teams shot in the low 40% range and Wooster really won this game at the charity stripe because they drew more shooting fouls in addition to a few foul shots at the end when Thiel had to foul in the last 2 minutes.  The Tomcats cut the margin to 6 points several times late in the 2nd half but could draw no closer as the Scots maintained control.

Justin Warnes had some foul trouble and Ryan Snyder only played ~10 minutes tonight as the Wooster coaches gave the most playing minutes at guard to Doug Thorpe and Jalen Goodwin (Matt Fegan got his usual minutes as the starter).

Wooster is now 8-2.  ;D  Next up is Heidelberg tomorrow.  Hiram beat them by 11 points tonight in the opening game.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 30, 2011, 12:01:59 AM
Ohio Wesleyan 75 Otterbein 65
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 30, 2011, 01:09:23 AM
Wabash wins in OT over Franklin 75-68.  Houston Hodges with a bucket to tie it with a second left on the clock in regulation.  Wabash puts 5 guys in double figures, sharing the ball makes this team very good.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2011, 10:40:17 AM
Quote from: sac on December 30, 2011, 12:01:59 AM
Ohio Wesleyan 75 Otterbein 65

Congrats to the Bishops as they are now 10-1 with a nice win over the host Cardinals.  Great to see the NCAC notch another win over an OAC team!  :)

Props to Tim Brady who led OWU with 26 points vs. Otterbein and was named the Tournament MVP.

Ohio Wesleyan is a real threat to win the NCAC title this season, IMO.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2011, 10:45:23 AM
Time to recap the day! It was an NCAC SWEEEEEEEEP!

DPU 72, SUNY-IT 56 - Shawn Haseley led the New Tigers with 13 points and 12 rebounds. DPU galloped in front and cruised to the win, playing 15 players.

Hiram 88, Heidelberg 77 - Jamaal Watkins with 21 points and 12 boards led Hiram past the Student Princes. The Terriers put up 52 points in the second half.

Wabash 75, Franklin 68 - Great performance by Houston Hodges, as noted above. Zinnerman led the LG's with 15, with Pete Nicksic adding 14 while filling in for the injured Curosh.

Kenyon 79, Washington & Jefferson 64 - Ikenna Nwadibia led the Lords with 19, while Brian Lebowitz added 18 points and 11 rebounds and Marcus Healey tallied 17 points. Kenyon amassed a 12-point lead at halftime and didn't look back.

Wooster 78, Thiel 68 - As noted above.

OWU 75, Otterbein 65 - A tourney title for the Bishops! Tim Brady was stellar again, scoring 26 to lead Ohio Wesleyan.

Wittenberg 80, Monmouth 54 - The Old Tigers had no problem with the Scots. Josh McKee led Witt with 18 while Clayton Black added 15 points and 11 boards.

NCAC is 48-26 in non-conference competition! Not shabby, guys!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2011, 11:00:07 AM
Here are today's match-ups. No time for a preview. Busy day, busy day!

DePauw (6-4) vs. FDU - Florham (4-5) @ Tampa
Hiram (7-3) vs. Theil (7-3) @ Wooster
Heidelberg (3-7) @ Wooster (8-2)
Marian (IN) (9-4) @ Wittenberg (6-3)
Anderson (6-4) @ Oberlin (4-5) - You know the NCAC is having a blessed year if the Yeomen knock off the Ravens!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2011, 12:09:19 PM
One for tomorrow:

Denison (4-6) @ Washington & Jefferson (4-7) - Another chance for Denison to learn how to close games, and for the NCAC to win against the PrAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2011, 04:18:31 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 30, 2011, 12:09:19 PM
One for tomorrow:

Denison (4-6) @ Washington & Jefferson (4-7) - Another chance for Denison to learn how to close games, and for the NCAC to win against the PrAC.

...and for Denison to live up to their "anything Kenyon can do, we can do better" raison d'etre.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2011, 08:10:26 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 39  Heidelberg 27

Wooster is being led by Justin Hallowell with 10 points and Jalen Goodwin with 7.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2011, 08:47:02 PM
Now, let's not forget game one!

Hiram goes to 8-3 on the year (and now could be considered a contender to host an NCAC game) with an 89-75 win over Thiel. That's six wins in a row for the Terriers.

Alan Sheppard led Hiram with 25, with Jamaal Watkins adding 21 and Aaron Stefanov netting 17. Matt Roman was a perfect 5-5 from the floor off the bench.

The Wooster scorekeeper left one of the refs as "TBA", either that or it's a very much unusual name for a ref - more like a hip-hop artist.

Right now, the NCAC is 49-26 against the others in the basketball world.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2011, 09:06:32 PM
Final:  Wooster 73  Heidelberg 61  :)

Scots were led tonight by Josh Claytor with 18 points, Justin Hallowell with 17 points and Jalen Goodwin with 11.

Heidelberg's top scorers were Darion Capers with 19 points and Nate Davis with 16.

Wooster shot 46% from the floor compared to only 38% for the Student Princes.

Wooster is now 9-2.  Next game is Geneva College at home on 1/4.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2011, 09:22:03 PM
With Today's Results, here are the Overall Records for the Top 6 NCAC Teams:

Ohio Wesleyan 10-1
Wabash 10-1
Wooster 9-2
Hiram  8-3
Witt  7-3
DePauw 7-4

The NCAC is becoming a deeper Conference this year and the title race will be interesting!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2011, 10:05:08 PM
The rest of today:

DPU 69, FDU - Florham 65 - Balanced scoring for the New Tigers, with Sean Haseley leading the way with 14, Michael Wilkison added 13, Kevin Sullivan netted 11, and Barry Flynn added 10 points and 11 boards. The Devils fought back from an 11-point halftime deficit and took a four-point lead with 7:04 to go, but DePauw regained their composure and came away with the win.

Wittenberg 70, Marian (IN) 50 - Clayton Black scored 24 points to lead the Old Tigers. Witt was in control most of the game and coasted to the win. No Witt player played more than 28 minutes.

Anderson 89, Oberlin 87 (2 OT) - Ooooh, soooo close! Oberlin had a six-point lead with 1:05 in regulation by the Ravens tied it up. Josh Merritt led the Yeomen with 21, while Andrew Fox added 18 and Geoff Simpson contributed 17.

NCAC 52-27 in non conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2011, 10:06:49 PM
I don't want to throw cold water on anyone's enthusiasm, but Hiram's two victories this weekend were pretty unimpressive. They looked undisciplined, almost uncoached, both nights, and were the beneficiaries of a lousy game by a lousy team (Heidelberg) and a lousy game by a fairly good team (Thiel.) The Tomcats basically conceded tonight's game, walking through their game at half speed. Hiram played with a lot more verve tonight than last night, but I wouldn't want to put too much stock in these two wins.

Of course, Wooster's two wins were also unimpressive, but that's another story. They at least got a good effort from their two opponents. Wooster did play tonight without their most dynamic, if not their best, player, and as a consequence had some new and different combinations on the floor all night. Nonetheless, they should have put away a pretty marginal group of Student Princes with much more ease.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2011, 10:44:56 PM
Maybe that's their sneaky plan, David! To make people look unfocused. Perhaps they hyno-tized them!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 31, 2011, 10:45:45 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 30, 2011, 10:06:49 PM
I don't want to throw cold water on anyone's enthusiasm, but Hiram's two victories this weekend were pretty unimpressive. They looked undisciplined, almost uncoached, both nights, and were the beneficiaries of a lousy game by a lousy team (Heidelberg) and a lousy game by a fairly good team (Thiel.) The Tomcats basically conceded tonight's game, walking through their game at half speed. Hiram played with a lot more verve tonight than last night, but I wouldn't want to put too much stock in these two wins.

Hiram plays Wabash, DePauw and Wooster in their next 3 games so that should reveal their true character.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on December 31, 2011, 01:14:00 PM
Hiram is a tricky game for Wabash.  No doubt that Wabash is the better team.  But with the long bus ride, a girls game before their contest ( no shoot-around on actual court), questionable health of Wabash Seniors (no details to give other than Curosh could be used in a pinch) makes it a catch game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 31, 2011, 03:25:21 PM
A little more on the strong Non-Conference Record to date for NCAC Teams:

7 NCAC teams have a winning Non-Conference Record so far and even Oberlin is 4-4 in Non-Conference games

The NCAC's impressive record to date vs. other conferences:  :)

10-5 vs. the OAC
12-7 vs. the HCAC
6-5 vs. the PRAC (2 of those losses by Gheny)
3-2 vs. the MIAA
2-7 vs. the UAA (no losses by the top 5 NCAC teams, 3 losses by Gheny, OWU beat WashU)
2-0 vs. the CCIW (Wabash over Elmhurst, Millikin)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 31, 2011, 05:08:50 PM
Washington and Jefferson beats Denison by 2 today.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 31, 2011, 05:19:09 PM
Even were Earlham (0-7) still in the conference instead of Depauw, the NCAC would still be a nice 46-31.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 31, 2011, 07:10:01 PM
Denison committed 17 turnovers and shot less than 50% from the line. They lost on a last-second three pointer. Sounds like the problems are still there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 01, 2012, 09:03:34 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 31, 2011, 07:10:01 PM
Denison committed 17 turnovers and shot less than 50% from the line. They lost on a last-second three pointer. Sounds like the problems are still there.
There is no question that this should have been a win for the Big Red.  Free throws were a problem and 17 turnovers is particularly uncharacteristic of these players, who generally protect the ball pretty well. 

They are just more symptoms of a disease that has been spreading from class to class at Denison, though.  This year's patient, who appeared healthy when he entered the hospital, is deteriorating at an inopportune time.  Conference play is beginning and his defenses are low due to months of being prescribed the wrong treatment by an inept doctor.  There is a cure for the Big Red, but treatment requires a new team of specialists willing to look at modern treatments and the with the ability to instill in the patient some confidence and a willingness to fight.  A team that won't use the same stagnant offense game after game, year after year.  One that will use wing men as wing men, not play them with their backs to the basket trying to go over bigger players in the low post.  One that may switch defenses from time to time - and maybe even put on a press when they are behind or leads start to dwindle. 

There is still a chance to save this patient, but the problems won't go away until we find a new doctor.  I could go with Dr. Sullivan or Dr. Carney-Debord for the rest of the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 01, 2012, 06:38:33 PM
There are some games afoot for conference members.

Monday, January 2:

Kenyon (4-6) @ Roanoke (3-6) - The Lords go to Roanoke to participate in the Morris Cregger New Year's Classic. Kenyon has played well after a rocky NCAC patch, while the Maroons have struggled with a tough schedule. Home cooking may decide the outcome. The other teams in this tourney are Shenandoah (1-9) and Swarthmore (1-7).

Capital (5-5) @ Ohio Wesleyan (10-1) - Capital has a few good wins but a lot of tough losses (that loss to Denison looks more and more questionable as the season rolls on). The Bishops are playing well and will certainly want to be sure they are ready for conference play by dispatching an OAC foe.

Tuesday, January 3:

Kenyon (4-6) vs. Shenandoah (1-9) or Swarthmore (1-7) @ Roanoke - I like Kenyon's chances of at least garnering a split no matter what happens against Roanoke.

Wittenberg (7-3) vs. Huntingdon (1-7) @ Maryville - The football game between these two schools was quite anticipated. This game? Not so much. The Tigers will want to be sharp and crisp in their final tuneups before the heart of the NCAC season.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 01, 2012, 06:52:54 PM
Quote from: GoRed on January 01, 2012, 09:03:34 AM
There is still a chance to save this patient, but the problems won't go away until we find a new doctor.  I could go with Dr. Sullivan or Dr. Carney-Debord for the rest of the season.

Ooooohhh, now that's an idea I could get behind. I wonder if there's ever been a female head coach in D3 men's hoops?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 02, 2012, 07:19:37 PM
Good results for the NCAC!

Kenyon 80, Roanoke 67 - The Lords move to 5-6 on the season behind some strong play by Marcus Healey (20 pts) and a monster game by Ikenna Nwadibia (17 points, 18 rebounds!). The Lords outscored Roanoke 47-29 in the second half.

Ohio Wesleyan 76, Capital 55 - The Bishops roared out to a 15 point halftime lead and coasted to the win. Tim Brady led OWU with 14. Twelve Bishops got into the scoring column.

NCAC now 54-28 in non-conference play! (Forgot to add in Denison's 12/31 defeat)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2012, 12:46:00 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 02, 2012, 07:19:37 PM
Good results for the NCAC!
[...]
NCAC now 54-28 in non-conference play! (Forgot to add in Denison's 12/31 defeat)

I think we have just five non-conference games remaining, spread over the next four days including tonight. Here's our record against select conferences (corrections appreciated):
OAC: 11-5, and done...this gives great satisfaction
MIAA: 3-2, and done
PrAC: 6-5 with one to go...barring a HUGE upset (of Geneva over Wooster), we win this one after starting out 0-4
HCAC: 12-6, and done
UAA: 2-7, and done (thankfully)...our Achilles' heel, particularly Case, against whom we were 1-5 (thanks, DePauw!)
non-D3: 8-3 with one to go...I like Oberlin's chances against OU-Zanesville to close out the non-con season on Friday
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 03, 2012, 02:35:09 PM
New Top 25:

http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/index

Wooster up to 15th.
Wabash falls to 17th.
Witt and OWU ORV.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 03, 2012, 02:57:11 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 03, 2012, 02:35:09 PM
New Top 25:

http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/index

Wooster up to 15th.
Wabash falls to 17th.
Witt and OWU ORV.

I think OWU should be in the top 25, and Wabash should be higher.  The NCAC is hands down the strongest conference in the GL region, its not even close really.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 03, 2012, 03:21:12 PM
Quote from: sac on January 03, 2012, 02:57:11 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 03, 2012, 02:35:09 PM
New Top 25:

http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/index

Wooster up to 15th.
Wabash falls to 17th.
Witt and OWU ORV.

I think OWU should be in the top 25, and Wabash should be higher.  The NCAC is hands down the strongest conference in the GL region, its not even close really.

I never thought I would see those words in print...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 03, 2012, 03:40:06 PM
Quote from: sac on January 03, 2012, 02:57:11 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 03, 2012, 02:35:09 PM
New Top 25:

http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/index

Wooster up to 15th.
Wabash falls to 17th.
Witt and OWU ORV.

I think OWU should be in the top 25, and Wabash should be higher.  The NCAC is hands down the strongest conference in the GL region, its not even close really.

100 percent agree and granted I am a true Wabash fan, but OWU seems to be the team to beat, with Wabash a very close second.   If Wabash is healthy by the OWU game, that is the one to determine the number 1 seed. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bein_86 on January 03, 2012, 04:52:18 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 30, 2011, 10:45:23 AM
Time to recap the day! It was an NCAC SWEEEEEEEEP!

DPU 72, SUNY-IT 56 - Shawn Haseley led the New Tigers with 13 points and 12 rebounds. DPU galloped in front and cruised to the win, playing 15 players.

Hiram 88, Heidelberg 77 - Jamaal Watkins with 21 points and 12 boards led Hiram past the Student Princes. The Terriers put up 52 points in the second half.

Wabash 75, Franklin 68 - Great performance by Houston Hodges, as noted above. Zinnerman led the LG's with 15, with Pete Nicksic adding 14 while filling in for the injured Curosh.

Kenyon 79, Washington & Jefferson 64 - Ikenna Nwadibia led the Lords with 19, while Brian Lebowitz added 18 points and 11 rebounds and Marcus Healey tallied 17 points. Kenyon amassed a 12-point lead at halftime and didn't look back.

Wooster 78, Thiel 68 - As noted above.

OWU 75, Otterbein 65 - A tourney title for the Bishops! Tim Brady was stellar again, scoring 26 to lead Ohio Wesleyan.

Wittenberg 80, Monmouth 54 - The Old Tigers had no problem with the Scots. Josh McKee led Witt with 18 while Clayton Black added 15 points and 11 boards.

NCAC is 48-26 in non-conference competition! Not shabby, guys!

Tim Brady is probably the best player in NCAC, should be a AA candidate. Loved watching him at Otterbein.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2012, 08:43:48 PM
Wittenberg 75, Huntingdon 62...seems to be a news blackout from east Tennessee, but Clayton Black (NCAC POtW) is rumored to have had 16 points.

Kenyon 66, Shenandoah 63...Brian Lebowitz' straightaway three with 0:12 left was the difference. Lebo finished with 20 & 12, while last night's hero and tournament MVP Ikenna "Notgonnaworkhereanymore" Nwadibia tallied 17 and 9.

How about 56-28...that's .667, good enough to lead the Phillies by 3 1/2 games!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 04, 2012, 09:52:05 AM
Let's do some previews of tonight's action:

Non-Conference:

Wittenberg (8-3) @ Maryville (8-5) - The Scots have been enigmatic, losing some head-scratchers to FDU - Florham and Methodist (at home, no less). Wittenberg seems to be priming the pump for the NCAC conference season and I think this will be a good one for the league.

Geneva (3-8) @ Wooster (9-2) - Now no game is truly a 'gimme' in hoops. Weird stuff happens. But I think it would take a tremendous confluence of weird stuff for the Scots to falter in this game. Looks like a game where the reserves can get plenty of PT and stay sharp in case they are needed in conference play.

Conference:

Oberlin (0-2, 4-6) @ Denison (1-1, 4-7) - One the one hand, you have the Yeomen, which are playing better than most people expected. On the other hand, you have the Big Red, which always seemed to be on the precipice of good things but have not found a way to close out games. Oberlin lost a lead in the last minute against Anderson, and how they respond to that tough loss may tell the tale in this game.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 04, 2012, 08:56:04 PM
Final:  Wooster 100  Geneva 48  :o

Wooster led this game by 39 points at halftime (57 - 18).  ::)   Scots were led in scoring tonight by Justin Hallowell with 14 points, Kenny Deboer with 14, Josh Claytor with 13, Jake Mays with 13 and Xavier Brown chipped in 11 points.

Wooster shot 62% from the floor vs. only 31% for Geneva.  Scots took better care of the ball tonight with 12 turnovers compared to 23 turnovers for the Golden Tornadoes.  Geneva drops to 3-9 on the season.

Wooster is now 10-2. :)  Next game is Saturday at home vs. Oberlin
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 04, 2012, 08:59:08 PM
Wittenberg beat Maryville 77-70. Clayton Black led the Old Tigers with 22. Zack Leahy came off the bench and added 18 and won the MVP honors.

Wooster put the ever livin' hurt on Geneva, 100-48. Five Scots scored in double figures. I'm sure the Scot brigade will provide more details. NOTE: See above post!

NCAC is 58-28 in non-conference. One game left - Oberlin against Ohio - Zanesville.

Denison has opened up a 61-50 lead against Oberlin. Can they hold on?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 04, 2012, 09:30:51 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 04, 2012, 08:59:08 PM
Denison has opened up a 61-50 lead against Oberlin. Can they hold on?
Yes!  The Big Red hold on to win 72-63 by calling time out with 23 seconds left and up by nine.  Great move!

Why not call a time out when down 7-0 early in the game instead of subbing in for the starting five?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 04, 2012, 09:35:16 PM
I'm liking what I'm seeing out of Wittenberg the past two weeks. Although a tough in-region loss, the Otterbein game may be just what they were looking for to get that fighter-mentality going on the season.

HUGE HUGE HUGE HUGE HUGE game Saturday at Ohio Wesleyan. To me, its a prove-it game for Ohio Wesleyan. Of course they are very solid this year, but until they can consistently show they can beat the tough NCAC teams, they aren't the favorites in my mind yet. Saturday is huge for Witt as they can have a huge edge in the standings.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2012, 09:36:54 PM
Geneva is all kinds of awful. Amazingly, this team won 18 games last year, and returned three starters for this year. Wooster's first turnover was in the final minute of the first half. Those who have seen the Scots play this season will not believe that previous sentence, and it is completely indicative of the level of defensive "pressure" exhibited by the Golden Tornadoes. It was a sad spectacle.

For those who may be wondering why we still had rotation guys in the game at the end, there was no choice. The Scots have been playing a 10-man rotation lately, and tonight there were only 12 players available. Those last two guys (Baker and Sherrod) got in for the last five minutes or so. Also of note, Doug Thorpe started at the point tonight, with X. Brown starting at the 2 and Matt Fegan starting on the sidelines.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 04, 2012, 09:57:48 PM
Wooster probably headed to the Top 10 in next week's poll with this win.    ???  This kind of game can prove to be serious at this time of year.  I'm sure it is not what Wooster was looking for when they scheduled this game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 05, 2012, 07:42:52 AM
How could I forget to mention . . .

Denison Junior Dimonde Hale becomes the latest member of the 1,000 point club!  Congratulations, Dimonde.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 05, 2012, 11:39:30 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 04, 2012, 09:36:54 PM
Geneva is all kinds of awful. Amazingly, this team won 18 games last year, and returned three starters for this year. Wooster's first turnover was in the final minute of the first half. Those who have seen the Scots play this season will not believe that previous sentence, and it is completely indicative of the level of defensive "pressure" exhibited by the Golden Tornadoes. It was a sad spectacle.

For those who may be wondering why we still had rotation guys in the game at the end, there was no choice. The Scots have been playing a 10-man rotation lately, and tonight there were only 12 players available. Those last two guys (Baker and Sherrod) got in for the last five minutes or so. Also of note, Doug Thorpe started at the point tonight, with X. Brown starting at the 2 and Matt Fegan starting on the sidelines.

Why were only 12 dressed? Injuries? JV time? It seemed like the perfect game to make sure 15 or so are dressed for game experience.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 05, 2012, 02:08:27 PM
JV time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 05, 2012, 02:12:40 PM
I wasn't at the game, but the boxscore indicates that Evan Pannell and Jalen Goodwin did not play.  Goodwin received significent minutes at point guard during XB's injury.  Pannell has not been in the regular rotation, but has played ahead of Baker and Sherrod.  I don't know if these two guys were in attendance or not, or if they're injured.  Gideon Mabeny, the seven-footer, may have left the team again.  I don't know.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 05, 2012, 02:18:31 PM
Pannell and Goodwin were dressed and ready, but sat out because they have played too much JV ball and Steve Moore wants them to be available for varsity play the rest of the way. It goes without saying that they were not needed last night. Mabeny is no longer with the team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 05, 2012, 07:27:20 PM
It's time for the NCAC to get cookin'! We have a deep league and lots of great action from bottom to top.

Let's do this.

Friday, January 6

Non -Conference:

Ohio-Zanesville (record unknown) @ Oberlin (4-7) - Finding out info about ORCC teams is quite the challenge. Massey has them playing only two games, both early in the season. Some of the other ORCC have more games loaded into Massey, but I can't find a site or any current info. At any rate, I think the Yeomen will be prohibitive favorites, but you wonder if this was a last minute 'we need a game and I don't care who it is' situation or a 'we gotta get teams we can beat on the schedule' situation. Maybe both?

Conference:

Wabash (2-0, 10-1) @ Hiram (1-1, 8-3) - The conference season kicks off again with a good one. While some have been less than gung-ho about the Terriers when seeing them in person, they are 8-3 and won't be an easy win for any team, especially up at Hiram. The Little Giants need consistency on offense and make sure that they keep Jamaal Watkins and crew contained. A healthy Nick Curosh would be a big help, but he may or may not be ready.

DePauw (1-1, 7-4) @ Allegheny (0-2, 2-9) - DPU makes its initial long hoops slog to Meadville, but it looks like the trip won't be much of a hassle for the New Tigers. However, DePauw has had some head-scratchingly close games against weaker competition (hello, Earlham...) and the Gators could keep this too close for comfort.

Saturday, January 7:

DePauw (1-1, 7-4) @ Hiram (1-1, 8-3) - DPU will face a big test here. The madcap offense of the Terriers could force DPU into a game they're not totally comfortable with, and I can see this as a battle of wills and / or tempo.

Wabash (2-0, 10-1) @ Allegheny (0-2, 2-9) - Wabash also has kept some teams (Millikin) too close for comfort, but I really can't see the fuzzy-cheeked Gators keeping pace with the experienced Little Giants.

Denison (2-1, 5-7) @ Kenyon (0-3, 6-6) - Both programs need this game. The Lords need an NCAC win to make sure they don't fall too far behind in the quest for an NCAC tourney bid. The Big Red need a win for confidence's sake. Kenyon had a great tournament in Roanoke against some mediocre-at-best teams, so they may have the edge in momentum.

Oberlin (0-3, 4-7) @ Wooster (1-2, 10-2) - I don't quite get the Yeomen playing a game right before having to travel to Wooster. But they probably will have five wins going into this game, and five wins coming out of this game. However, Oberlin is scrappy and may hang with the Scots for a while.

Wittenberg (3-0, 9-3) @ Ohio Wesleyan (3-0, 11-1) - A huge game to start the new year. The Old Tigers slipped against Otterbein before Christmas, while the Bishops handled them at Otterbein's tourney. But Witt righted the ship and look to be in good shape to face the under-rated (nationally) OWU squad. The winner grabs a big edge in the quest to host the NCAC tourney, and if Witt steals one on the road, that'll be a huge advantage. The key will be for Witt to contain Tim Brady and not let the rest of the Bishops crew hurt them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 05, 2012, 09:07:54 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 05, 2012, 07:27:20 PM


Ohio-Zanesville (record unknown) @ Oberlin (4-7) - Finding out info about ORCC teams is quite the challenge. Massey has them playing only two games, both early in the season. Some of the other ORCC have more games loaded into Massey, but I can't find a site or any current info. At any rate, I think the Yeomen will be prohibitive favorites, but you wonder if this was a last minute 'we need a game and I don't care who it is' situation or a 'we gotta get teams we can beat on the schedule' situation. Maybe both?


I like their mascot, painted on the floor in the team photo  http://www.zanesville.ohiou.edu/students/student-life/mensbasketball.htm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 05, 2012, 11:58:11 PM
Quote from: sac on January 05, 2012, 09:07:54 PM
"Brunette girls. Every time we were like struggling in kicking, Coach tells me to think about girls on a beach or brunette girls."
Or brunette girls? What, do brunettes not frequent the beach? And what of blondes, are they so distracting to this kicker's imagination that his attempts continually sail wide to the right?  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 06, 2012, 10:17:37 PM
The Yeomen had no problems tonight, winning 78-30.

Oberlin played 13 players, held OU-Zanesville to 19.3% shooting, and led 39-9 at the half.

The NCAC finishes it's non-conference slate at 59-28. That'll do.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 06, 2012, 10:21:15 PM
DePauw topped Allegheny 60-56. The game was knotted at 56 with 1:47 left in the game but the Gators couldn't find the hoop again.

Barry Flynn led the New Tigers with 16 with Sean Haseley adding 15. James Ness led the Gators with 14.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 06, 2012, 10:28:47 PM
Wabash survives a madcap game against Hiram, beating the Terriers on the road 77-70.

The Little Giants shot 16-31 from three-point land. Derek Bailey all scorers with 28 with Aaron Zinnerman added 16. Andy Walsh came off the bench and hit four three-pointers.

Jamaal Watkins led the Terriers with 24 points and 11 rebounds. Andrew Wiegand added 16 points and 10 boards.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 06, 2012, 11:27:07 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 06, 2012, 10:28:47 PM
Wabash survives a madcap game against Hiram, beating the Terriers on the road 77-70.

The Little Giants shot 16-31 from three-point land. Derek Bailey all scorers with 28 with Aaron Zinnerman added 16. Andy Walsh came off the bench and hit four three-pointers.

Jamaal Watkins led the Terriers with 24 points and 11 rebounds. Andrew Wiegand added 16 points and 10 boards.

Look up "barn burner" in the Indiana basketball dictionary and there will be a note to see this game.  Both teams shooting the long ball and the gym was 100 degrees inside.  BIG turn of events was when Hiram came out of the huddle and put 6 men on the floor .  Wabash capitalized with 2 free throws followed by an Andy Walsh 3 to go from down 4 to up 1.   Big game to take home for Wabash, Hiram will be right there at the middle of the conference pack all season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 07, 2012, 12:30:12 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 05, 2012, 11:58:11 PM
Quote from: sac on January 05, 2012, 09:07:54 PM
"Brunette girls. Every time we were like struggling in kicking, Coach tells me to think about girls on a beach or brunette girls."
Or brunette girls? What, do brunettes not frequent the beach? And what of blondes, are they so distracting to this kicker's imagination that his attempts continually sail wide to the right?  ::)

Well if you've ever spent any amount of time wandering around the Univ. of Michigan campus you would note there is a much higher ratio of brunettes to blondes.  I'm not saying anything about a blondes ability to get into a fine academic institution as Michigan,  but I guess I am saying it.

Of course this comes from someone who went to a school where that blonde to brunette ratio is probably an exact polar opposite, so it was probably easier for me to notice.  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 07, 2012, 12:49:10 PM
leaving for the wittenberg-ohio wesleyan game. This should be a good one. I'll take Wittenberg. Of the two only seen owu once this year but despite their record they looked to have some holes, especially in the post. Albion killed them on the inside in the second half , if they had gone their sooner they might have won. I was surprised Otterbein wasn't able to take advantage of that. Oh well this should be a good one today, nothing like going to church to watch a basketball game.

david

P.S. I do hope I don't see any fans being thrown out today for being negative. I have seen that twice at owu and I still can't believe a school would do that. Hope the security guards never go to yost arena to watch a hockey game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 07, 2012, 02:45:18 PM
Wabash  61
Gheny 47

Final

D. Bailey tearing it up again.  32 pts.  12-22 from the field (8 of 16 from behind the arc)   not a bad two days for Bailey and this Little Giants team shooting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 07, 2012, 04:56:00 PM
Kenyon continues its hot streak and bests Denison 77-74.

Jonathan Amador led the Lords with 18 while Anthony Chun added 16. Dimonde Hale led all scorers with 20 for the Big Red.

Denison had a 41-38 lead at the half. For most of the second half the teams went back and forth until Kenyon took the lead for good with 4:37 to go.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 07, 2012, 05:00:19 PM
Witt derails OWU's chance to be ranked in the Top 25 (for now) with a 55-57 road win.

Clayton Black led Witt with 15, with Michael Cooper adding 13 and Zack Leahy netting 12. Tim Brady scored 15 for the Bishops with Reuel Rogers adding 13.

The Old Tigers had an 11-point halftime league before OWU came storming back. The Bishops took a short-lived 41-40 lead with 8:33 to go and then tied the game at 50 with 3:12 left. But Witt got their moxie back and held on the for the victory.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 07, 2012, 06:16:47 PM
Big Red led 33-20.  There is nothing I can say I haven't already said.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2012, 08:06:46 PM
At the Half:  Oberlin 31  Wooster 29

Wooster started the game shooting 2 of 13 from the floor and trailed most of the half.  Wooster is being led by Josh Claytor with 11 points and Xavier Brown with 8 points.

Oberlin's top scorers are Emmanuel Lewis with 11 points and Geoff Simpson with 7 points.

Yeomen shot 57% from the floor in the half while the Scots only shot 38% after the cold start.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 07, 2012, 09:08:45 PM
Final:  Wooster 70  Oberlin 58

Wooster shot better in the 2nd half and eventually took control for the win.  :)  Wooster was led tonight by Josh Claytor with 22 points (10 boards), freshman Xavier Brown with 18 points and freshman Evan Pannell with 16 points (4 three pointers).  Pannell really had a breakout game as he also looked good on defense with two nice blocks and some boards.

Oberlin's top scorers were Emmanuel Lewis with 13, Geoff Simpson with 12 and Andrew Fox with 10.

Wooster is now 11-2, 2-2 NCAC. ;D   Next game is at home vs. Hiram on 1/11

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 07, 2012, 09:48:49 PM
Wabash goes to 12-1.  Back on the bus and home to host a struggling DePauw team Wednesday.

http://sports.wabash.edu/news/2012/1/7/mbb_0107123402.aspx?path=mbball

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 07, 2012, 09:52:34 PM
Good reminder, we forgot a game!

Jamaal Watkins scored 27 as Hiram blasts DePauw 67-51. The Terriers led for most of the game, though the New Tigers cut the lead to four in the second half.

Barry Flynn was the only DPU in double figures with 11.

BTW - New poll...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 07, 2012, 10:06:47 PM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on January 07, 2012, 09:48:49 PM
Back on the bus and home to host a struggling DePauw team Wednesday.

Boy, I hate to be the resident Hiram Hater, but struggling doesn't begin to describe today's effort. Never having seen DePauw, I didn't know what to expect, but I at least expected a team with a 400+ career win coach to be able to take advantage of playing a team that has zero interior defense. But, no. DePauw seemed to go out of their way to find the worst possible shot time and time again. And they panicked in the face of Hiram's three-quarter court press, throwing the ball around like a hot potato. And they had no answer at all for Jamal Watkins. That all adds up to another fairly easy win for a Hiram squad that has failed to impress me in any of the three games I've seen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 08, 2012, 10:37:08 AM
But they are 3-0 in the games you have seen, right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 08, 2012, 01:58:52 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 08, 2012, 10:37:08 AM
But they are 3-0 in the games you have seen, right?

Hopefully, they will be 3-1 after David watches Wooster beat the Terriers on Wednesday!  ;) ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2012, 04:56:30 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 08, 2012, 10:37:08 AM
But they are 3-0 in the games you have seen, right?
Yes, they are, and actually they won all three games easily. I realize that that shoots holes in what little credibility I have. But "winning" does not automatically imply "good;" if you don't believe me, watch video of Wooster beating Oberlin last night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 08, 2012, 06:01:16 PM
I do realize that some people value presentation more than others. But they are #100 in Massey, which is in the first quartile. That ain't hay.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 08, 2012, 10:39:01 PM
Something David pointed out, Wittenberg's three good region wins (Wooster, OWU, Maryville) were all on the road. NONE of Witt's big games have been at home yet, and they are tough to beat at the HPER. I still think if Witt can manage to hold Kenyon this week that will set up a huge game coming up against Wabash.

From talking to someone I know that was closely involved in the game yesterday, he said it was one of the most competitive games he has seen in a while.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 09, 2012, 05:00:38 PM
New Top 25 out: http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2011-12/week6

Wabash now 14th.
Wooster now 16th.

Seems like voters self-corrected.

Witt (27th) and OWU (29th) ORV.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 09, 2012, 06:17:31 PM
Wabash Derek Bailey NCAC player of the week.

http://www2.northcoast.org/basketball/POTW/2011-12

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 09, 2012, 09:25:34 PM
Bailey's one of my favorite players in the conference.  His shooting style and stats are among the best and he seems to have a good demeanor.  Nice to see his numbers where I always thought they could be when I first saw his shot.  I have him on my short list for potential POY. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 10, 2012, 08:02:18 PM
Let's preview tomorrow's games!

DePauw (2-2, 8-5) @ Wabash (4-0, 12-1) - Another game in the vaunted rivalry takes places tomorrow. Wabash won the earlier matchup pretty handily, and tomorrow may not be different. The New Tigers haven't been consistent, and while Wabash has had some offensive issues (such as relying on the three-pointer too much) their defense and rebounding have helped them through the rockier times during a game. BTW, Wabash and DPU could still play four times this season!

Wittenberg (4-0, 10-3) @ Kenyon (1-3, 7-6) - Both teams have been on a roll lately, but the Old Tigers have played tougher competition with road wins at Maryville and OWU. Kenyon's had a nice run, and has some versatile weapons, so they can't be totally counted out. But I think Witt probably ekes this one out in the long run.

Allegheny (0-4, 2-11) @ Oberlin (0-4, 5-8) - Who wants their first NCAC win? I think both teams would want it, but I think the Yeomen get it. They played pretty well for a half against Wooster and haven't really been routed by anyone in conference play. The Gators are struggling for an identity and I don't think they'll find any answers tomorrow night.

Ohio Wesleyan (3-1, 11-2) @ Denison (2-2, 5-8) - Denison had another disappointing game Saturday and now they play host to one of the elite teams in the league. Can the Big Red stop the Bishops' Tim Brady? Can they play to the best of their ability for 40 minutes? It's going to take a huge effort for Denison to prevail. Is it in them?

Hiram (2-2, 9-4) @ Wooster (2-2, 11-2) - Rivalry game aside, this is probably the best and the most important game of the night. Hiram thrives on chaos, and the Scots like a bit of order. If the Terriers can get Wooster out of their comfort zone they'll have a chance to spring an upset.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 11, 2012, 01:56:54 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 10, 2012, 08:02:18 PM
BTW, Wabash and DPU could still play four times this season!
Five, right?  Three regular season, NCAC tournament, and, longest-of-shots, in the NCAA tournament!  That has to be illegal... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabco on January 11, 2012, 08:12:43 AM
And also feeding time at the zoo .... "New" Tiger meat.  Danny beatdowns .... very satisfying.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2012, 09:31:09 AM
BTW, Wabash found the national championship game back in 1982 and posted it on YouTube!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wSEQ-0vhq0&feature=youtu.be
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 11, 2012, 10:17:13 AM
Saw that in my YouTube feed this morning. Always wanted to get Pete Metzelaars on the front page of D3hoops.com. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on January 11, 2012, 11:40:25 AM
Wabash, Witt, Oberlin, Denison as my upset pick and Wooster as winners tonight:

Something about getting a huge win streak snapped in your first big-time conference game of the year ... I think will have lingering effects. OWU is in for another setback vs a dangerous Denison team who has been close to knocking off some quality teams at home already this year... but fell short. (Hanover, Marietta,Wabash)

Who you got?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 11, 2012, 11:53:02 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 11, 2012, 01:56:54 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 10, 2012, 08:02:18 PM
BTW, Wabash and DPU could still play four times this season!
Five, right?  Three regular season, NCAC tournament, and, longest-of-shots, in the NCAA tournament!  That has to be illegal... ;)

Hope and Calvin played 5 times in 2007, after playing 4 times in 2006.  Over about a 16 month span they played 9 times, which to be honest is way to many.  When trying to remember those games, they all sort of bleed together.

It's not illegal but it's not as much fun as you think it might be either. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 11, 2012, 01:41:23 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 11, 2012, 09:31:09 AM
BTW, Wabash found the national championship game back in 1982 and posted it on YouTube!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wSEQ-0vhq0&feature=youtu.be

I thought I saw you and Wally in the facepaint in the first few minutes of the footage?   :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Lee Wilson on January 11, 2012, 02:28:42 PM
Smed, I don't think my bosses should be too happy with you.  Unbeknownst to them, you caused me to do absolutely nothing for about 2 hours today.  An hour and a half was watching the game, and then at least a half hour of email commentary after I sent the video to a group of fellow Wallies.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2012, 04:32:15 PM
My issue with Denison is in almost every loss, they've had a lead and blown it. I can't trust them to finish games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 11, 2012, 07:49:52 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 11, 2012, 09:31:09 AM
BTW, Wabash found the national championship game back in 1982 and posted it on YouTube!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wSEQ-0vhq0&feature=youtu.be

Alright! A chance to see Merlin Nice in something other than black-and-white stripes!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2012, 09:02:07 PM
Well, nuts. It was different.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2012, 09:06:22 PM
DPU 64, Wabash 55 - It was a close game all the way until the end. Wabash could not find the range from long range (1-15) while the New Tigers certainly did (7-14). Barry Flynn led DPU with 15. Derek Bailey led all scorers with 17.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 11, 2012, 09:25:09 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 11, 2012, 01:41:23 PM
I thought I saw you and Wally in the facepaint in the first few minutes of the footage?   :P

I loved that.  Given that it was 1982, it brought back memories of the Baseball Furies from the great cult-movie "The Warriors"!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 11, 2012, 09:32:19 PM
Final:  Wooster 92  Hiram 64  :)

Wooster was led tonight by Josh Claytor with 18 points (9 of 10 FG's), Justin Hallowell with 14 points (3 three pointers), Matt Fegan with 11 points (3 three pointers), Xavier Brown with 11 points and Ryan Snyder with 10 points.

Scots shot 56% from the floor while holding the Terriers to only 38%.  Wooster won the Boards by 43 to 29 and the Scots made 10 of 21 three point shots for a healthy 48% from behind the arc.

Top scorers for Hiram were Jamaal Watkins with 17 points and Andrew Weigand with 14.

David nailed it when he said Hiram was not an impressive team and could be dominated inside as the Scots proved.

Wooster is now 12-2, 3-2 NCAC. ;D  Next game is At DePauw on Saturday 1/14.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 11, 2012, 09:37:29 PM
Wittenberg 71 Kenyon 63

I watched most of the game online and all I can say is Clayton Black pretty much dominated this game. Finished with 38 points, 11 rebounds but shot 11-15 from the field and 14-17 from the free throw line. Solid defensively too as the Witt front line wasn't letting too many easy shots go in from the paint.

Other than that, it was a close game throughout, Witt finally pulled away at the end. Never really had much going from the perimeter and Kenyon actually outrebounded Witt 41-40, which helped keep it close.

On to Denison before a big showdown a week from tonight
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 11, 2012, 09:41:50 PM
I've really just been lurking this year, but this is worth a post:

Final from Granville:

Denison 69, Ohio Wesleyan 66
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2012, 10:04:18 PM
Hiram pretty much lived up (i.e., down) to my expectations tonight. Wooster got 32 points out of the post tonight on 14 of 18 shooting and actually could have had more as there were several instances of too-fancy passes getting fumbled away underneath. (And the posts missed six free throws.) Hiram, for whatever reason, just doesn't play defense in the paint.

I know I will face ridicule when I say that Hiram probably played better overall tonight than in the other three games (all wins) I saw; at least tonight they did a good job of denying the dribble penetration. Wooster played out of their minds at both ends; it was a complete game for the Scots very reminiscent of the Geneva game. Jamaal Watkins still got his points (17) but had to work very hard for them against great defense chiefly provided by Josh Claytor (Watkins turned the ball over three times on fast breaks, very uncharacteristic), while Andrew Wiegand (14) was kept pretty much in check and Allen Sheppard (7) and Aaron Stefanov (5) were non-factors. And that's all it takes to beat these guys: the rest of the team can't score (21), and none of them can defend.

The Scots seem to be improving, and the untimely losses by two key rivals will surely buoy their spirits. (The Wabash/DPU final score was announced in the gym and received a big ovation.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 11, 2012, 10:07:13 PM
Witt 71 Kenyon 63......Clayton Black with 38 for the Tigers

http://livestats.kenyon.edu/basketball/xlive.htm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2012, 10:08:01 PM
Quote from: hotdawg on January 11, 2012, 11:40:25 AM
Wabash, Witt, Oberlin, Denison as my upset pick and Wooster as winners tonight:

Something about getting a huge win streak snapped in your first big-time conference game of the year ... I think will have lingering effects. OWU is in for another setback vs a dangerous Denison team who has been close to knocking off some quality teams at home already this year... but fell short. (Hanover, Marietta,Wabash)

Who you got?

Got 4 of 5 and nailed the Big Red shocker. +1.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2012, 10:08:55 PM
Elsewhere....
Oberlin 63, Allegheny 62
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 12, 2012, 08:30:00 AM


Got 4 of 5 and nailed the Big Red shocker. +1.
[/quote]

The Big Red hung in there this time and closed it out despite manic lineup changes and substitution patterns.  Denison played 12 players and had 39 subsitutions by my count.  The team on the court would just start to get into a groove and someone (or two or three) would be substituted out.  Three players got two minutes or less of playing time and with 11 minutes left and a 3 point lead, they put in a freshman ice cold for two minutes??  He's a good shooter, but if someone could explain to me why you might do that at a critical point in a critical game I would be eternally grateful.     

Shooters finally seem to be getting more playing time with Akpapunam being key in this one.  Great win for the Big Red and hopefully a confidence builder for the players for the rest of the season.   


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 12, 2012, 09:20:10 AM
The Wabash and OWU results make any early speculation moot. It's anyone's title to snatch now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 12, 2012, 02:00:06 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 12, 2012, 09:20:10 AM
The Wabash and OWU results make any early speculation moot. It's anyone's title to snatch now.

Was it not anyone's title to snatch before last night's results?  Wabash still has to play 2 against Witt and OWU as well as a game at Timken so they were far from being favored to maintain their top postition in the league.  OWU still has 2 games against both Wooster and Wabash.  If there is a team that might make a claim that the title isn't anyone's to snatch at the moment it is Witt as they are the lone unbeaten and already have road wins over Wooster and OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 12, 2012, 02:20:34 PM
I said that because Wooster was in a 2-loss hole to OWU and Wabash before NCAC play resumed, and Witt had been sporadically effective and ineffective. Wabash and OWU were playing the best, most-consistent ball and it was easy to think that OWU would have been able to handle Witt at home.

Now, Witt has the two-game lead over Wooster, Wabash lost a tough one to their rival and OWU has fallen to a 2-loss tie with Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 12, 2012, 04:43:45 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 12, 2012, 02:20:34 PM
I said that because Wooster was in a 2-loss hole to OWU and Wabash before NCAC play resumed, and Witt had been sporadically effective and ineffective. Wabash and OWU were playing the best, most-consistent ball and it was easy to think that OWU would have been able to handle Witt at home.

Now, Witt has the two-game lead over Wooster, Wabash lost a tough one to their rival and OWU has fallen to a 2-loss tie with Wooster.

OWU already lost to Witt at home...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 12, 2012, 05:00:33 PM
Again, my comment was related to the time BEFORE conference play re-started, my friend, as I said in the statement "before NCAC play resumed".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2012, 05:21:34 PM
Here's the up-to-the-minute conference standings:
                     NCAC    Overall
Wittenberg    5-0    11-3
Wabash    4-1    12-2
Wooster    3-2    12-2
Ohio Wesleyan    3-2    11-3
DePauw    3-2    9-5
Denison    3-2    6-8
Hiram    2-3    9-5
Kenyon    1-4    7-7
Oberlin    1-4    6-8
Allegheny    0-5    2-12
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 12, 2012, 05:57:05 PM
Not aligned as neatly as one of Kohl's Christmas sweater displays, but it'll do. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 12, 2012, 06:19:01 PM
I just wanted to throw out some props to Josh Claytor and his post holiday play!  He has been en fuego since after the holiday break.  He is shooting at an 80% clip (32-40) over the last 4 games and averaging almost 18 ppg over those 4 games. 

It seems to me that Wooster is becoming less and less of a perimeter oriented team basically since their losses to Witt and Wabash and have made a much more concerted effort of pounding the ball inside and having a post player shooting 80% and scoring 18 ppg doesn't hurt in that effort.   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 13, 2012, 10:04:31 AM
This weekend's NCAC slate. The Big 10 is emulating the NCAC, I feel, or at least it seems that way to me after seeing Minnesota beat IU last night. Sigh.

Oberlin (1-4, 6-8) @ Wabash (4-1, 12-2) - The Yeomen picked the wrong day to travel to Chadwick. I think the LG's use this game to exorcize their DPU demons. You can't take Oberlin lightly anymore, and I don't think Antoine Carpenter will let his charges do such a thing anyway.

Hiram (2-3, 9-5) @ Kenyon (1-4, 7-7) - Kenyon is a better team than their 1-4 conference mark, and some say Hiram's 9-5 record belies their actual performance. At any rate, this will be a great game and could be key in the scramble for the seeding at the bottom end of the NCAC tourney - not that any game there will be a cakewalk.

Ohio Wesleyan (3-2, 11-3) @ Allegheny (0-5, 2-12) - The Bishops desperately need to get back on the winning patch if they want to challenge for NCAC tourney hosting duties. A big win over the Gators will help, but I think few of us (with one exception) saw them losing to the Big Red. If OWU falters, then they're in deep trouble.

Denison (3-2, 6-8) @ Wittenberg (5-0, 11-3) - The Big Red finally closed out a game against a top-notch opponent and now face another in the Old Tigers. Wittenberg's right now in the pole position for the conference title, but they can't be complacent against Denison. The Big Red could make this uncomfortable.

Wooster (3-2, 12-2) @ DePauw (3-2, 9-5) - A huge game. Wooster has righted the ship and now is pounding the ball inside instead of relying on a perimeter game as noted below. The New Tigers have the ability to shoot, and they showed they could defend in beating the Little Giants. But was it rivalry adrenaline or an indicator of a defensive resurgence by DPU? This game will answer that question. The winner still has a chance to host the NCAC tourney, and the loser may have to scramble to host an NCAC first-round game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 14, 2012, 03:40:34 PM
Easy one for Wabash today...65 to 42 over Oberlin.  Coach Carp called off the dogs with 8 minutes left.  Merritt Held to 2 points.  Zinnerman with 15, Bailey 12 pts, 9 rebounds.  Oberlin lead by Simpson with 16.  Witt on Wednesday for LGs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2012, 03:43:36 PM
At the Half:  DePauw 32  Wooster 26

Wooster is being led by Xavier Brown with 12 points and Doug Thorpe with 5.

DePauw's top scorers are Michael Wilkison with 9 points, Tommy Fernitz with 6 and Sean Haseley with 6.

Tigers outrebounded the Scots 17 to 13 in the Half.  Wooster also had 8 turnovers.

Josh Claytor & Jake Mays combined only had 2 shot attempts so the Wooster guards did not feed the post. ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 14, 2012, 04:34:17 PM
Hiram beats Kenyon 77-67. Jamaal Watkins led the Terriers with 25 points and 11 rebounds. Ikenna Nwadibia led the Lords with 18 points and 15 boards.

OWU was up double digits against Allegheny with a minute to go, and then my live-stats feed went kaputsky.

Denison and Witt are tied at 55 with 4:15 to go!

DPU leads Wooster 62-57 with 2:03 to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 14, 2012, 04:41:49 PM
OWU beat the Gators 72-55.

DPU leading Wooster by 12 with 30 seconds to go.

Dension trailing by three with 1:24 to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 14, 2012, 04:45:46 PM
Final:  DePauw 75  Wooster 66

This game was tied at 57-57 (3:50 left) and then DePauw scored the next 11 points.  Congrats to the Tigers!

Wooster was led in scoring by Xavier Brown with 18 points, Doug Thorpe with 14 and Matt Fegan with 9.

DePauw's leaders were Michael Wilkison with 18, Sean Haseley with 15, Alex Payne with 14 and Barry Flynn 10.

Scots lost this game on the boards; they were outrebounded 31 to 25.  3 more turnovers than DePauw also hurt.

Wooster also failed to feed the post as Josh Claytor attempted only 5 shots in the game.

Wooster is now 12-3, 3-3 NCAC.  It is now very unlikely that Wooster will win the NCAC title this year, IMO.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 14, 2012, 04:51:16 PM
Witt closes out Denison 67-58. The Big Red stormed back from a 15-point deficit to tie the game, but couldn't get over the hump. Clayton Black led the Old Tigers with 15.

The results today set up this week's 'game of the year' in the NCAC. Wabash travels to Witt on Wednesday.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on January 15, 2012, 10:11:36 PM
The grand opening of Wooster's new Scot Center was this tonight, on the eve of the second semester starting.  What a great facility, for student-athletes and non-athletes alike!  http://www.woosterathletics.com/scotcenter/index (http://www.woosterathletics.com/scotcenter/index)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 16, 2012, 09:49:15 AM
Gorgeous facility!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 16, 2012, 10:38:02 AM
Looks like a pretty impressive facility, but just about all of us will never know, since we aren't allowed in. Unless you are currently a student, staff or faculty (or Emeriti), you can't use it. Even alumni, who were responsible for funding it (at least some of them), aren't eligible to use it.

http://www.woosterathletics.com/scotcenter/guidelines#Admission

Is this a similar policy at other schools?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 16, 2012, 10:47:31 AM
Yes, there are similar policies at other schools. At Wabash, they didn't want to compete against the private gyms in town, so they restricted access to the community, but I think (and it's been a while) that alumni are allowed to use it. However, it didn't seem that they abused the privilege.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on January 16, 2012, 11:44:55 AM
Alumni and their families have unlimited use of the Wabash facility.  Smedindy is correct in remembering that the facility is closed to those from outside the Wabash community, has been since the beginning, for the reason he states--competition with the local gyms, spas, etc.  There are, however, guest passes for student relatives, girlfriends, and others.  And Wabash does host indoor high school basketball shootouts, track meets, and other events.  Blood drives, cancer walks, and other special occasions--a location to gather gifts at Christmas for those in need--are several of many examples.  As a footnote, when the renovation/new construction was completed, quite a discussion about who could use the building took place.  Among considerations other than taking business away from local folks, wear and tear on the facility was an issue, even if there would have been a fee for outside users. Smedindy will recall that there were hard feelings among community people who had previously used the facility, among them quite a few noontime basketball players.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 16, 2012, 01:14:36 PM
Any Wabash fans making the drive Wednesday to Springfield for the huge showdown? In terms of who needs this game more, Wabash definitely does as a Wittenberg win would mean Witt would have a two game lead in conference play and as Coach Brown alluded to Saturday on the pregame show, a majority of the conference games have been on the road so far.

I'm interested to see what Wabash tries to do to neutralize Wittenberg on the glass. As results have shown, when Witt is dominant its cause they are getting on the offensive glass.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 16, 2012, 01:30:04 PM
Quote from: sigma one on January 16, 2012, 11:44:55 AM
Alumni and their families have unlimited use of the Wabash facility.  Smedindy is correct in remembering that the facility is closed to those from outside the Wabash community, has been since the beginning, for the reason he states--competition with the local gyms, spas, etc.  There are, however, guest passes for student relatives, girlfriends, and others.  And Wabash does host indoor high school basketball shootouts, track meets, and other events.  Blood drives, cancer walks, and other special occasions--a location to gather gifts at Christmas for those in need--are several of many examples. As a footnote, when the renovation/new construction was completed, quite a discussion about who could use the building took place.  Among considerations other than taking business away from local folks, wear and tear on the facility was an issue, even if there would have been a fee for outside users. Smedindy will recall that there were hard feelings among community people who had previously used the facility, among them quite a few noontime basketball players.

Wooster is pretty good about allowing use of Timken for local high school games as well as a holiday tournament hosted at Timken every year.  But, for some reason, Wooster doesn't seem to want to share their newly renovated football facilities for use by local high schools.  They have denied a couple of local high schools to play tournament games there because their fields were too muddy to play games on and Wooster's field turf and lighted field would have been a perfect place to host.  Wooster has even denied local high schools from practicing on their field turf.  Norwayne had to play games on field turf during their state championship run this past season and Wooster wouldn't even allow them to practice at the Papp to get acclimated to playing on field turf.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on January 16, 2012, 02:38:40 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 16, 2012, 01:14:36 PM
In terms of who needs this game more, Wabash definitely does as a Wittenberg win would mean Witt would have a two game lead in conference play and as Coach Brown alluded to Saturday on the pregame show, a majority of the conference games have been on the road so far.

I agree giving Witt 2 game lead in league play would be a huge blow to Wabash. But I would still argue that Witt needs this game more. A couple reasons why:1) Wabash is currently sitting prettier in terms of getting an NCAA at-large bid than Witt. 2) Witt has had a lot of trouble playing well @ Wabash (don't think they have won there since 07-08), therefore you got to believe they need to take care of business at home... to avoid getting swept in season series. (at least we have the LGS number in recent tourney games). I will predict a 6-8 point Witt victory behind my POY pick Clayton Black - he is an absolute force and is playing the best ball of his career -IMO  hes the best Tiger player since Dan Russ. (slightly edging out Dane Borchers).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 16, 2012, 03:39:04 PM
You could say Wabash needs this more, since they didn't hold home court against DPU and a road win against Witt would be crucial.

It's never wise to put your fate into the hands of the Pool "C" committee. Of course, the NCAC tourney will decide who passes through without having to wait on pins and needles.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 16, 2012, 04:48:49 PM
Quote from: hotdawg on January 16, 2012, 02:38:40 PM2) Witt has had a lot of trouble playing well @ Wabash (don't think they have won there since 07-08), [...]

Witt last won at Wabash on Jan. 30 2008, 54-52. The Tigers swept the season series that year. Wabash swept the regular season series in 2009-10, with the teams splitting home-and-home in '08-'09 and last season. Wittenberg has beaten their Indiana rivals each of the last two seasons in the NCAC semifinals on Wooster's court.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 16, 2012, 06:39:52 PM
http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2011-12/week7

Three NCAC teams in the Top 25, with OWU still ORV. Record performance for the NCAC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 16, 2012, 06:46:07 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 16, 2012, 06:39:52 PM
http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2011-12/week7

Three NCAC teams in the Top 25, with OWU still ORV. Record performance for the NCAC?

DePauw also received one vote for #25 on someone's ballot. That's one-half the conference appearing on at least one ballot. Without bothering to look it up, I can say without fear of correction that this is a high-water mark for the NCAC in the D3hoops.com Top 25. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 16, 2012, 09:14:27 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 16, 2012, 01:30:04 PMWooster is pretty good about allowing use of Timken for local high school games as well as a holiday tournament hosted at Timken every year.  But, for some reason, Wooster doesn't seem to want to share their newly renovated football facilities for use by local high schools.  They have denied a couple of local high schools to play tournament games there because their fields were too muddy to play games on and Wooster's field turf and lighted field would have been a perfect place to host.  Wooster has even denied local high schools from practicing on their field turf.  Norwayne had to play games on field turf during their state championship run this past season and Wooster wouldn't even allow them to practice at the Papp to get acclimated to playing on field turf.

While I think it would have been nice of the college to allow Norwayne to use Papp Stadium for practices during their playoff run, I can understand their reluctance to host actual games.  All of their stands are on the same side.  That might not a good situation make during intense playoff football competition.

As far as the Scot Center, it seems like a lot of venue for 1,800 some-odd students and staff.  Open it up to alumni, but not the public.  I, though, as a member of the latter, would certainly love to take a one-time tour of the place.  Do they sell sushi? ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 16, 2012, 09:27:59 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 16, 2012, 06:46:07 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 16, 2012, 06:39:52 PM
http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2011-12/week7

Three NCAC teams in the Top 25, with OWU still ORV. Record performance for the NCAC?

DePauw also received one vote for #25 on someone's ballot. That's one-half the conference appearing on at least one ballot. Without bothering to look it up, I can say without fear of correction that this is a high-water mark for the NCAC in the D3hoops.com Top 25. :)

Missed DPU, and I can say it was an intentional snub but I need to own up to my fecklessness.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 16, 2012, 09:31:49 PM
Quote from: hotdawg on January 16, 2012, 02:38:40 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 16, 2012, 01:14:36 PM
In terms of who needs this game more, Wabash definitely does as a Wittenberg win would mean Witt would have a two game lead in conference play and as Coach Brown alluded to Saturday on the pregame show, a majority of the conference games have been on the road so far.

I agree giving Witt 2 game lead in league play would be a huge blow to Wabash. But I would still argue that Witt needs this game more. A couple reasons why:1) Wabash is currently sitting prettier in terms of getting an NCAA at-large bid than Witt. 2) Witt has had a lot of trouble playing well @ Wabash (don't think they have won there since 07-08), therefore you got to believe they need to take care of business at home... to avoid getting swept in season series. (at least we have the LGS number in recent tourney games). I will predict a 6-8 point Witt victory behind my POY pick Clayton Black - he is an absolute force and is playing the best ball of his career -IMO  hes the best Tiger player since Dan Russ. (slightly edging out Dane Borchers).

Big match-up between Black and Curosh, if they let them play, advantage Curosh.  By the way,  Sullivan is who killed Wabash last year...twice, not Black.   It will be interesting and is a bigger game for Wabash, definitely in hopes of hosting the tourney.   Wabash seniors have not forgotten the tourney game last year......the no call on the rebound putback attempt by Curosh lead to the final basket.  This is certainly the game of the year so far.

Also, no excuses to the DePauw game, Depauw played very well....Wabash seniors in 3 intense days of comprehensive exams .  Wabash may want to look at the schedule related to playing that Wednesday.  These guys are students in D3, and those exams decide if you graduate.  I thought all the seniors showed the effects of exams and looked a little sluggish and also they did not practice one of those days as well.  Again props to DePauw for playing well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 17, 2012, 10:37:23 AM
It's an NCAC schedule. Part of being in a league is that you have to accommodate all 10 teams. If I recall, there was always a game during that week anyway. It's tough, but being a student / athlete is tough.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on January 17, 2012, 11:39:21 AM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on January 16, 2012, 09:31:49 PM
Big match-up between Black and Curosh, if they let them play, advantage Curosh. 

Not saying Curosh isn't capable of competing but I'll take Black everytime in this matchup no matter how the game is called.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 17, 2012, 07:00:20 PM
Some interesting games on tap tomorrow:

DePauw (4-2, 10-5) @ Denison (3-3, 6-9) - The suddenly energized New Tigers take a road trip to scenic Granville, Ohio to face a maddening Big Red squad. Denison is quite capable beating the Tigers and has shown they can play a full 40-minute game of late. DPU may look past the Big Red after two huge wins last week. I wouldn't be surprised about any result here.

Kenyon (1-5, 7-8) @ Oberlin (1-5, 6-9) - The Lords definitely look like the sixth-best team in the NCAC despite their 1-5 record. But looks are one thing, and the improved Yeomen will try to deal their first 'unexpected' loss of the conference season. Wabash handled Oberlin quite handily Saturday and that may mean either an inspired squad or one that's beaten down a bit. Again, I wouldn't be surprised about any result here, but I think the Lords will prevail.

Wooster (3-3, 12-3) @ Allegheny (0-6, 2-13) - The Gators are just the tonic to help the Scots recover from their loss at DPU. Wooster shouldn't have any problem with the struggling Allegheny squad. However, games are played on the court, and knowing Coach Moore, the Scots won't take Allegheny for granted.

Hiram (3-3, 10-5) @ Ohio Wesleyan (4-2, 12-3) - Huge game for both teams. With a win, Hiram plays itself back into a mix for hosting an NCAC tournament game. With a win, the Bishops position themselves to be back in the mix for the NCAC title if other teams falter. Like any game for the Terriers, it comes down to controlling the pace and tempo, but this one comes with a side order of controlling Tim Brady.

Wabash (5-1, 13-2) @ Wittenberg (6-0, 12-3) - You couldn't ask for a bigger January game. (OK, it'd be bigger if Wabash hadn't dropped a game, but still...). A Wabash win puts the two-loss teams back into serious play for the NCAC title, while a Old Tigers win gives them a two-game edge. Sure, there are a lot of games left, but a two-game bulge at any stage of the season is a big advantage. Wittenberg will want to make Wabash try and beat them from the outside, while hopefully maintaining some offensive consistency. This will be a grinder of a game, probably one that resembles an Illinois / Wisconsin Big 10 matchup. Not beautiful, but compelling in its own way...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on January 17, 2012, 09:48:57 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 16, 2012, 09:14:27 PM
As far as the Scot Center, it seems like a lot of venue for 1,800 some-odd students and staff.  Open it up to alumni, but not the public.  I, though, as a member of the latter, would certainly love to take a one-time tour of the place.

You'll be able to see quite a bit from the new lobby, and a lot more is visible from the main staircase (near the entrance) just by walking up/down one floor.  Come a little early to the next game, and spend a few minutes taking it in!

As far as the scope of the project, I think it will get a lot of use, and I don't think that it's out of line with facilities at some of the other schools in the conference, but perhaps others can comment on that.  The track and tennis teams will be able to host competitions in the facility (and the track team will no longer have to practice from 10 p.m. to midnight at WHS).  Other spring sports -- baseball, softball, and both lacrosse teams -- will be able to hold winter practices in a decent-sized indoor space.  It is my understanding that the intramural program and basketball camp have both been limited at times by court space, and this adds four new courts (or two bigger areas, for other sports).  A substantial portion of the faculty and staff (and their spouses) seem interested in using the facilities for their own fitness, especially now that the available hours are increased, with the additional space and equipment.  All of us in the campus community are grateful to the trustees, who generously donated the majority of the funds for this project.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 17, 2012, 10:35:33 PM
Quote from: hotdawg on January 17, 2012, 11:39:21 AM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on January 16, 2012, 09:31:49 PM
Big match-up between Black and Curosh, if they let them play, advantage Curosh. 

Not saying Curosh isn't capable of competing but I'll take Black everytime in this matchup no matter how the game is called.

Wasn't meaning scoring head to head, Curosh is rebounder, defender and a banger.  If he holds Black under his average, as he did last year, Wabash will have a good chance.  If Black gets 20, it will be tough on the LGs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 17, 2012, 10:47:14 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 17, 2012, 10:37:23 AM
It's an NCAC schedule. Part of being in a league is that you have to accommodate all 10 teams. If I recall, there was always a game during that week anyway. It's tough, but being a student / athlete is tough.

Don't think that has always been the case since I have been following Wabash.  The week prior had an open conference Wednesday....and since we played conference games in December, with enough planning, it can be done.  Wabash  President White is now VP of conference, I am pretty sure it will at least be discussed.  Again part of the solution can be controlled by Wabash as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 18, 2012, 09:20:26 AM
Well, it is a league-wide schedule. Even if President White is the VP, he can only do so much and the league has to approve all schedules. It's obvious that in the best interest of the league it makes sense to do the Hiram / Gheny two-step right as January begins, and also it's best for the league to have every team play conference games on the same day after the holiday break. It makes it easier to actually schedule and also makes it quite intriguing for fans.

I did take a look at the historical results on the Wabash site. In some years there was a week break early in January, and others there didn't seem to be a comps break. It wasn't consistent. Last year was odd because of the nine-team league. In 2010, there was a break between 1/2 and 1/8 but I didn't know if that was for comps or just scheduling reasons. In 2007 the break was between 12/30 and 1/6. In 2006 there was no real break. And so it goes...

It's probably wise to have a home game scheduled during comps. That may be the best compromise.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Lee Wilson on January 18, 2012, 11:44:56 AM
I think part of the issue this year is that Wabash has just recently tagged the oral comps at the end of written comps.  In earlier years (at least when I graduated in '07), oral comps were weeks later.  Final effect - a mushy brained senior-laden team.  Still should have won.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 18, 2012, 12:02:58 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 18, 2012, 09:20:26 AM
Well, it is a league-wide schedule. Even if President White is the VP, he can only do so much and the league has to approve all schedules. It's obvious that in the best interest of the league it makes sense to do the Hiram / Gheny two-step right as January begins, and also it's best for the league to have every team play conference games on the same day after the holiday break. It makes it easier to actually schedule and also makes it quite intriguing for fans.

I did take a look at the historical results on the Wabash site. In some years there was a week break early in January, and others there didn't seem to be a comps break. It wasn't consistent. Last year was odd because of the nine-team league. In 2010, there was a break between 1/2 and 1/8 but I didn't know if that was for comps or just scheduling reasons. In 2007 the break was between 12/30 and 1/6. In 2006 there was no real break. And so it goes...

It's probably wise to have a home game scheduled during comps. That may be the best compromise.

I knew I could count on you smed for the research....close enough to the current team to know I had a discussion with Coach Petty and it was an issue on his radar that he focused on....to whatever extent he could influence....And yeah Ralph, it is not an excuse, it is reality that 4 years of hard work rest on those exams and it does lead to mushy brains....and mushy brains lead to not the greatest execution on the court.  Nuff on this, on to whipping up on Witt tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 18, 2012, 12:15:11 PM
One last thing: Swimming had a meet on the 11th and the wrestlers traveled to PA to compete in the Whitehill duals in Williamsport, PA on the 13th and 14th. I do think the accelerated oral comps schedule may have the most affect.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 18, 2012, 07:54:39 PM
DPU holds off Denison 73-68. Barry Flynn with a monster game - 20 points, 14 rebounds. Sean Haseley added 16 for the New Tigers. Denison was balanced with five in double figures led by Dimonde Hale with 14.

The Big Red had a one-point lead, 19-16 with 8 1/2 minutes to go in the first, but DPU went on a 10-0 run, had a 10-point lead at the half, and kept Denison at bay the rest of the game.

Big win for DPU, keeping them at the two-loss plateau and in the mix for hosting a tourney game or even the title if things break their way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 18, 2012, 09:03:05 PM
Final:  Wooster 73  Allegheny 51

Wooster was led tonight by Josh Claytor with 16 points (8 boards), Xavier Brown with 15 points and Jake Mays with 14.

Top scorers for Allegheny were Devone McLeod with 11 points and Gabe Seidman also with 11.

Scots shot 59% from the floor compared to only 37% for the Gators.  Scots had 17 turnovers which is too many.

Wooster is now 13-3, 4-3 NCAC.  Next game is at home vs. Ohio Wesleyan this Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 18, 2012, 09:05:00 PM
Wittenberg now has a two-game lead in the conference after a dominating win over Wabash, 61-43. After a close first half of the first half, Witt surged ahead and took complete control in the second half. The LG's shot just 4-22 from downtown and the Old Tigers shot 29 free throws to Wabash's five.

Clayton Black led Witt with 16, while Kasey Oetting was the only Little Giants player in double figures with 14.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 18, 2012, 09:07:27 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 18, 2012, 09:03:05 PM
Final:  Wooster 73  Allegheny 51

Wooster was led tonight by Josh Claytor with 16 points (8 boards), Xavier Brown with 15 points and Jake Mays with 14.

Top scorers for Allegheny were Devone McLeod with 11 points and Gabe Seidman also with 11.

Wooster shot 59% from the floor compared to only 37%.  Scots had 17 turnovers which is too many.

And for the Gators, Devone McLeod and Gabe Seidman led them with 11.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 18, 2012, 09:26:10 PM
Wittenberg 61 Wabash 43

This is not the Wabash team I expected to see as they left their game and intensity back in Indiana. Wittenberg outplayed Wabash to some extent but Wabash played themselves out of the game. The 4-22 three point shooting was more of a Wabash settling for outside shots as very limited post touches occurred (minus the 4-5 wide open layups in the early part of the game)

Witt pounded it inside and thus shot 29 to 5 free throws. This wasn't an officiating disparity, just the way the game went.

HUGE 2 game lead now for Witt and if they can win Saturday at Hiram I will feel really comfortable with Witt's chances to win the league title this year. Reason being, at Hiram has been a tough game for Witt and is your cliche "trap game." I think we'll see how focused this team is on Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 18, 2012, 09:31:02 PM
Kenyon outlasts Oberlin 73-70. Brian Liebowitz had 17 points and 12 boards for the Lords, while Anthony Chun added 16. The Yeomen were led by Josh Merritt's 26 points and Andrew Fox with a true double double - 17 points and boards!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 18, 2012, 09:40:33 PM
And in the final game of the night, OWU beats Hiram 75-62. The Bishops were led by Tim Brady with 21, while Andrew Wiegand paced the Terriers with 18 points and 9 boards.

Standings:

Wittenberg 7-0
Wabash     5-2
OWU         5-2
DePauw     5-2
Wooster    4-3
Hiram        3-4
Denison     3-4
Kenyon      2-5
Oberlin      1-6
Allegheny   0-7

Going to be a fun month!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 18, 2012, 10:04:26 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 18, 2012, 09:26:10 PM
Wittenberg 61 Wabash 43

This is not the Wabash team I expected to see as they left their game and intensity back in Indiana. Wittenberg outplayed Wabash to some extent but Wabash played themselves out of the game. The 4-22 three point shooting was more of a Wabash settling for outside shots as very limited post touches occurred (minus the 4-5 wide open layups in the early part of the game)

Witt pounded it inside and thus shot 29 to 5 free throws. This wasn't an officiating disparity, just the way the game

HUGE 2 game lead now for Witt and if they can win Saturday at Hiram I will feel really comfortable with Witt's chances to win the league title this year. Reason being, at Hiram has been a tough game for Witt and is your cliche "trap game." I think we'll see how focused this team is on Saturday.

Ditto to everything in this post and totally agree.  This was not the Wabash team I have been watching.  Officiating was not the difference in the game, when you don't attack a zone you will not get fouled.   Wabash needs to retool a bit, props to Witts coach, he had this one figured out and they executed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 19, 2012, 09:15:39 AM
Wittenberg takes early command of the NCAC championship race with a big win over Wabash.  This is a great year for the NCAC with as much depth as we have seen in many years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2012, 06:21:48 PM
Now watch Hiram shock the Tigers this weekend and throw a monkey wrench into the works.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 19, 2012, 06:41:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 19, 2012, 06:21:48 PM
Now watch Hiram shock the Tigers this weekend and throw a monkey wrench into the works.

Hiram is the most dangerous Jekyll and Hyde team in the conference, especially at home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2012, 07:08:27 PM
This whole season has been a monkey wrench, hasn't it?

QuoteCarryin' the mail

Hello, Collinge!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 20, 2012, 03:34:52 PM
Let's preview!

Allegheny (0-7, 2-14) @ Denison (3-4, 6-10) - The Big Red played well in their two recent losses to DPU and Witt, and by all accounts should handle the Gators with ease. Of course, Denison has confounded its fans by playing down to the level of competition and not closing out teams they should beat. It's possible that Allegheny could sneak into Granville and knock off the Big Red. Possible.

Oberlin (1-6, 6-10) @ DePauw (5-2, 11-5) - The Yeomen are no automatic "W" for teams; you have to play ball. Playing ball is what the New Tigers are doing now, though. DPU should cruise by Oberlin, as it seems their penchant for letting weaker teams hang around has left them. But Oberlin is miles better than Earlham and you remember how close the Quakers came to a massive upset.

Wittenberg (7-0, 13-3) @ Hiram (3-4, 10-6) - Trap game for the Old Tigers? Witt pulls into Hiram flying high after demolishing Wabash, but they face a mad-cap bunch of Terriers that can discombobulate a team. Hiram's struggled on defense against teams with good post players, and their style can produce as much failure as success. Again, the key is if Witt can harness the game or if Hiram is allowed to make it a scramble.

Kenyon (2-5, 8-8) @ Wabash (5-2, 13-3) - Gut-check time for the Little Giants. They must win this game. For some reason, the Lords usually keep it very close against the LG's and in 2009 Kenyon swept Wabash in the series. The Little Giants needs to get their offense on track, and it has to start Saturday.

Ohio Wesleyan (5-2, 13-3) @ Wooster (4-3, 13-3) - Is this an elimination game? If Witt wins and OWU loses, then they're three games back halfway through the conference schedule. If Wooster loses and Witt, DPU and Wabash win, they're two games behind in the race to HOST a first-round tourney game. So, yeah, it's pretty huge. Can the Scots control Tim Brady? Can OWU force Wooster to a perimeter game? Will anyone not enter the gym through the main doors of the Scot Center? The answers to these questions and more on Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2012, 10:50:21 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 20, 2012, 03:34:52 PM
Let's preview!

Ohio Wesleyan (5-2, 13-3) @ Wooster (4-3, 13-3) - Is this an elimination game? If Witt wins and OWU loses, then they're three games back halfway through the conference schedule. If Wooster loses and Witt, DPU and Wabash win, they're two games behind in the race to HOST a first-round tourney game. So, yeah, it's pretty huge. Can the Scots control Tim Brady? Can OWU force Wooster to a perimeter game? Will anyone not enter the gym through the main doors of the Scot Center? The answers to these questions and more on Saturday.

Nice preview - this is really a "must win" game for Wooster tonight.  A 4th conference loss at this stage would clearly eliminate the Scots from the conference race (their chances are already low) especially since they still have road games to play later AT Witt and AT OWU.

IF Wooster doesn't win the NCAC race this season, they also need to minimize their remaining losses to have any chance of getting into the NCAA tourney with a Pool C at large bid.  A 4th in region loss this early would not be good.

Let's hope that the Wooster guards feed the ball into the post so Claytor and Mays can get some shots tonight.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 04:49:09 PM
The Yeomen simply don't like playing in Indiana. Another weekend trip to the Hoosier State, another thrashing. This time DPU lays a 69-37 throttling on Oberlin. Oberlin shot 11-52 from the floor and were out-rebounded 41-27.

Josh Merritt had 21 of the Yeomen's 37 points. Besides Merritt the rest of the bunch shot 5-37.

Barry Flynn led the New Tigers with 12 while Sean Haseley added 11 and Iannnnnn Rumppppppppppp had nine off the bench.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 04:54:43 PM
I can hear the grousing from Granville all the way down here. Allegheny wins its first NCAC game of the year, beating the Big Red 64-62. Dimonde Hale's 23 and nine weren't enough to beat a balanced Gators attack.

Denison held a 62-61 lead with 1:20 left, but the Devone McLeod hit a lay-up and Hale turned the ball over. Denison had to foul four times in the last minute to get Allegheny in the bonus, and the Big Red weren't in the bonus themselves. The refs had the whistle's clamped off, I guess.

Denison did steal the ball down one with 28 seconds left. Larry Farmer tried a three with nine seconds left, missed but Hale grabbed the rebound. He turned it over with six seconds left and Hale had to foul Kyle Murphy with two ticks left. Murphy made the first, missed the second and the Big Red had one last chance, but Farmer's three was no good.

Neither team had a lead larger than six.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 04:56:58 PM
Witt may not run away and hide. As I type this Hiram are leading the Old Tigers 48-30 with 11:22 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 21, 2012, 05:02:49 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 04:56:58 PM
Witt may not run away and hide. As I type this Hiram are leading the Old Tigers 48-30 with 11:22 left.

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ackbar.org%2Fimages%2Fackbar.jpg&hash=25e9b4c606a094a7e9d4e4406a17d872e71d1484)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 05:05:57 PM
Hold on Admiral, Witt's cut it to 13 with eight minutes left.

UPDATE - Witt's now carved it down to 56-47 with 3:11 and have the ball after a Hiram turnover.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 21, 2012, 05:22:24 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 04:54:43 PM
I can hear the grousing from Granville all the way down here.

Grousing?  Just because we gave Allegheny their first win at home?
We're still in contention for that pre-season number 6 spot!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 05:26:01 PM
It was a trap after all! Hiram does everyone a huge favor and beats Wittenberg 65-51. The Old Tigers clank it up at a 16-57 rate for the game including 5-27 from beyond the arc.

Jamaal Watkins had 22 points to lead the way for the Terriers. DPU, Wabash, OWU and Wooster are singing the Hiram fight song as we speak!

Josh McKee had 15 to lead Witt, but he was just 3-12 from the floor (including 2-10 from three).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 21, 2012, 06:10:29 PM
The Hiram Fight Song, presented to you by Wooster Booster.  Complete with lyrics and pep band photo.  Click on the link right above the lyrics to actually listen to the tune.

http://www.hiram.edu/athletics/fightsong.html

Okay, that's the worst fight song I've ever heard.  Actually, it sounds like a horrible rendition of some D1 school's music.  If Hiram ever upgrades it, watch out, they might win a lot more ballgames.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2012, 06:20:53 PM
That's "Our Director (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liay7mn7OuQ)," one of the classics of the repertoire.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Lee Wilson on January 21, 2012, 07:09:56 PM
this may have been brought up here before, but is the Wabash live stream shaky in a A Scanner Darkly way, or is it just my connection?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 07:12:39 PM
Mine looks good for now!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 07:33:08 PM
Wabash up 36-16 with 2:43 to go in the first half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 08:38:40 PM
Wabash pulls to within one game of Witt (tied with DPU) as they roll past Kenyon 83-59. The missing Wabash offense showed up big time. Aaron Zinnerman had 23 points to lead Wabash with Derek Bailey netting 18. Brian Shelbourne had a well balanced game - 12 points, 12 boards and four assists.

Brian Leibowitz led the Lords with 17.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 09:02:25 PM
I wish the Wooster vid stream could show the time left in the game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 21, 2012, 09:32:26 PM
There's no time left in the game now, and Wooster pulls out a thriller 72-68. Josh Claytor was 8 for 8 for 20 points, one of four Scots in double figures. Tim Brady has 22 to lead all scorers. Wooster scored the game's first 8 points, but then the game was more or less a series of runs, with Wooster going up by 10 then OWU answering to cut it to 2 or 0. They last cut a 10 point Scot lead with oh about 7 minutes to go, and took a couple of brief one-point leads, and it was neck and neck the rest of the way. Owu trailed by one but got the ball on a Wooster turnover with 0:35 to go and planned to play for a last shot, but the Scots (Ryan Snyder, specifically) forced a turnover with 0:11 left, and Justin Warnes (IIRC) sank 2 free throws to give Wooster a 3-point lead. On the ensuing final possession, the play seemed to have been drawn up for Tim Brady to take the 3, and he forced it and missed; it's not really his forte anyway, and OWU has a couple of better threats from the arc in Greg White (12 tonight) and Eric Easley (14), but they were passed over for whatever reason. A great game that leave the two teams tied for 4th.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 09:37:23 PM
Standings at the halfway point!

Wittenberg 7-1
Wabash     6-2
DePauw     6-2
OWU         5-3
Wooster    5-3
Hiram        4-4
Denison     3-5
Kenyon      2-6
Oberlin      1-7
Allegheny   1-7
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 21, 2012, 10:54:32 PM
Back from the Scot Center where I watched Wooster pull out a narrow win over Ohio Wesleyan.  The Scot Center is a tremendous new athletic facility with the indoor track, tennis/basketball courts, fitness center, aerobics room, new locker rooms for football/track/other sports and a large new conference center as well.  :)

As I had wished in my earlier post today, Wooster got the ball to Josh Claytor tonight and he delivered with 20 points, 7 boards.  Claytor is now shooting 68% from the floor so it should be a high priority to get him the ball in the post!  ;)

The key factor in the win was Wooster shooting 47% compared to only 41% for OWU.  Three pointers, free throws, turnovers and rebounds were all essentially even and the Scots won by making 2 more buckets than the Bishops.

Wooster is now 14-3, 5-3 NCAC.  Next game is Kenyon at home on Wednesday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 21, 2012, 10:57:53 PM
I see that DePauw is still listed as being in the South Region under the Teams section of D3hoops.com. I know they were when they were in their old conference, but are they still there? I don't know much about the South, but I guess this opens the possibility of there being five NCAC teams that could be regionally ranked at some point this year. Getting four in the Great Lakes is a little bit of a stretch, but if you look at the other conferences in the Region, the only real lock right now is Hope. The OAC might not have anyone, and Bethany has a good record but a poor strength of schedule.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on January 21, 2012, 11:15:07 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 21, 2012, 10:57:53 PM
I see that DePauw is still listed as being in the South Region under the Teams section of D3hoops.com. I know they were when they were in their old conference, but are they still there? I don't know much about the South, but I guess this opens the possibility of there being five NCAC teams that could be regionally ranked at some point this year. Getting four in the Great Lakes is a little bit of a stretch, but if you look at the other conferences in the Region, the only real lock right now is Hope. The OAC might not have anyone, and Bethany has a good record but a poor strength of schedule.

DePauw was moved to the GL Region this year when they joined the NCAC. Page 66 of the pre-championship manual. I'm guessing it's just a case of the link not being updated on d3hoops.com

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/4ec89880495d3147a8b7abd285abf5d2/2012_PreChamps_Book_Basketball.pdf?MOD=AJPERES&CACHEID=4ec89880495d3147a8b7abd285abf5d2

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 21, 2012, 11:23:54 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on January 21, 2012, 11:15:07 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 21, 2012, 10:57:53 PM
I see that DePauw is still listed as being in the South Region under the Teams section of D3hoops.com. I know they were when they were in their old conference, but are they still there? I don't know much about the South, but I guess this opens the possibility of there being five NCAC teams that could be regionally ranked at some point this year. Getting four in the Great Lakes is a little bit of a stretch, but if you look at the other conferences in the Region, the only real lock right now is Hope. The OAC might not have anyone, and Bethany has a good record but a poor strength of schedule.

DePauw was moved to the GL Region this year when they joined the NCAC. Page 66 of the pre-championship manual. I'm guessing it's just a case of the link not being updated on d3hoops.com

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/4ec89880495d3147a8b7abd285abf5d2/2012_PreChamps_Book_Basketball.pdf?MOD=AJPERES&CACHEID=4ec89880495d3147a8b7abd285abf5d2

That's what I figured, but with the NCAA, you never know. Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 22, 2012, 11:23:52 AM
The last half of the league season is going to be great fun to watch as the NCAC is so competitive and GOOD this year.  Big games every night.  This weeks biggest games:
Wabash @ Ohio Wesleyan       
DePauw @ Wittenberg    
DePauw @ Ohio Wesleyan       

DePauw and OWU could be eliminated from title contention this week or could make a large statement going into the last three weeks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 22, 2012, 03:20:50 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 09:37:23 PM
Standings at the halfway point!

Wittenberg 7-1
Wabash     6-2
DePauw     6-2
OWU         5-3
Wooster    5-3
Hiram        4-4
Denison     3-5
Kenyon      2-6
Oberlin      1-7
Allegheny   1-7
Had Wooster not lost in the last second to Wittenberg, there would be four teams tied at the top at 6-2.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 22, 2012, 04:58:59 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 22, 2012, 03:20:50 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 09:37:23 PM
Standings at the halfway point!

Wittenberg 7-1
Wabash     6-2
DePauw     6-2
OWU         5-3
Wooster    5-3
Hiram        4-4
Denison     3-5
Kenyon      2-6
Oberlin      1-7
Allegheny   1-7
Had Wooster not lost in the last second to Wittenberg, there would be four teams tied at the top at 6-2.

If a frog had wings he would not bump his butt on the ground when he jumps.  Just as relevant as the statement above.  Not a pollster or NCAA tourney official who put any weight on that piece of trivia.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 22, 2012, 05:16:20 PM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on January 22, 2012, 04:58:59 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 22, 2012, 03:20:50 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 21, 2012, 09:37:23 PM
Standings at the halfway point!

Wittenberg 7-1
Wabash     6-2
DePauw     6-2
OWU         5-3
Wooster    5-3
Hiram        4-4
Denison     3-5
Kenyon      2-6
Oberlin      1-7
Allegheny   1-7
Had Wooster not lost in the last second to Wittenberg, there would be four teams tied at the top at 6-2.

If a frog had wings he would not bump his butt on the ground when he jumps.  Just as relevant as the statement above.  Not a pollster or NCAA tourney official who put any weight on that piece of trivia.

You're right (I was gonna go with 'if my aunt had testicles, she'd be my uncle' ;)), but also rather rude.  While irrelevant, I found it quite interesting that the NCAC was THAT close to a 4-way tie this late in the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2012, 06:36:59 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 22, 2012, 05:16:20 PMWhile irrelevant, I found it quite interesting that the NCAC was THAT close to a 4-way tie this late in the season.

Which, of course, was the whole point of the comment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 22, 2012, 06:40:19 PM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on January 22, 2012, 04:58:59 PM


If a frog had wings he would not bump his butt on the ground when he jumps.  Just as relevant as the statement above.  Not a pollster or NCAA tourney official who put any weight on that piece of trivia.

We were going along pretty good this year, then comes this piece of junk comment. Please tell me you are smart enough to know WoosterBooster was inferring to how close the conference is, not some philosophical statement or saying the Scots should get bonus points for losing a close game. And if you were actually at the game he was talking about, you would know how it truly was a game Wooster gave away. It will be the game that haunts Wooster this year if it fails to make the NCAA tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 22, 2012, 06:53:41 PM
How many teams will go from the NCAC? Certainly, the front five will be regionally ranked in some order, but at what point does a team fall off of the "C" bubble?

I think each of the five have games they may regret come tourney time. But it's better to be sitting and waiting for a "C" than putting the gear away after an NCAC tourney loss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 22, 2012, 08:49:13 PM
Of course, Wooster can't ever lose a game by the other team just playing better, there's always some reason.............. 8-) (I'm kidding, sort of)

Big game for Depauw this Wednesday at Wittenberg. Witt coming off a loss is never easy to beat but most of Depauw's big wins have seemed to come at home, how can they handle a tough road atmosphere
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 22, 2012, 08:58:36 PM
They handled one at Wabash, unfortunately... :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on January 22, 2012, 09:18:28 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 22, 2012, 06:53:41 PM
How many teams will go from the NCAC? Certainly, the front five will be regionally ranked in some order, but at what point does a team fall off of the "C" bubble?

I think each of the five have games they may regret come tourney time. But it's better to be sitting and waiting for a "C" than putting the gear away after an NCAC tourney loss.

Obviously there's a lot of season remaining, but I think Wabash and Witt look pretty good for C's. Wooster looks smack in the middle of the bubble, and OWU has a fair amount of work left to do.

The name of the game will be staying in front of Thiel in the regional rankings (assuming Bethan wins the PrAC autobid). I doubt the PrAC gets two teams in, so you don't want to wait for them to come off the board. The sixth spot in the region looks close between Thiel, OWU, John Carroll, and DePauw at the moment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 22, 2012, 09:23:45 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 22, 2012, 06:40:19 PM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on January 22, 2012, 04:58:59 PM


If a frog had wings he would not bump his butt on the ground when he jumps.  Just as relevant as the statement above.  Not a pollster or NCAA tourney official who put any weight on that piece of trivia.

We were going along pretty good this year, then comes this piece of junk comment. Please tell me you are smart enough to know WoosterBooster was inferring to how close the conference is, not some philosophical statement or saying the Scots should get bonus points for losing a close game. And if you were actually at the game he was talking about, you would know how it truly was a game Wooster gave away. It will be the game that haunts Wooster this year if it fails to make the NCAA tourney.

Seiny, yes, smart enough to know. Yes saw game actually, you are right, Wooster truly gave it away.  Yes, game should haunt Wooster.  So hopefully that clears the air.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 22, 2012, 09:35:55 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on January 22, 2012, 09:18:28 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 22, 2012, 06:53:41 PM
How many teams will go from the NCAC? Certainly, the front five will be regionally ranked in some order, but at what point does a team fall off of the "C" bubble?

I think each of the five have games they may regret come tourney time. But it's better to be sitting and waiting for a "C" than putting the gear away after an NCAC tourney loss.

Obviously there's a lot of season remaining, but I think Wabash and Witt look pretty good for C's. Wooster looks smack in the middle of the bubble, and OWU has a fair amount of work left to do.

The name of the game will be staying in front of Thiel in the regional rankings (assuming Bethan wins the PrAC autobid). I doubt the PrAC gets two teams in, so you don't want to wait for them to come off the board. The sixth spot in the region looks close between Thiel, OWU, John Carroll, and DePauw at the moment.

Thiel going 0-2 in the Mose Hole tourney against the NCAC has to hurt them a bit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on January 22, 2012, 09:56:05 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 22, 2012, 09:35:55 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on January 22, 2012, 09:18:28 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 22, 2012, 06:53:41 PM
How many teams will go from the NCAC? Certainly, the front five will be regionally ranked in some order, but at what point does a team fall off of the "C" bubble?

I think each of the five have games they may regret come tourney time. But it's better to be sitting and waiting for a "C" than putting the gear away after an NCAC tourney loss.

Obviously there's a lot of season remaining, but I think Wabash and Witt look pretty good for C's. Wooster looks smack in the middle of the bubble, and OWU has a fair amount of work left to do.

The name of the game will be staying in front of Thiel in the regional rankings (assuming Bethan wins the PrAC autobid). I doubt the PrAC gets two teams in, so you don't want to wait for them to come off the board. The sixth spot in the region looks close between Thiel, OWU, John Carroll, and DePauw at the moment.

Thiel going 0-2 in the Mose Hole tourney against the NCAC has to hurt them a bit.

OWU's gotta beat someone too though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 22, 2012, 11:03:25 PM
I think the NCAC can get three teams in the NCAA's.  The level of play from the league in the non-conference from top to bottom and then the play of top 5 teams in particular has been been really good.  The top three teams SHOULD get in. 

Witt vs DePauw and Wabash vs OWU on Wednesday night.  Those games will either help separate or make an even bigger mess of the league standings.

Quick response on OWU beating someone.  The battling bishops website shows OWU has won at DePauw, at Rhodes (2nd in the SWAC), crushed OAC first-place Capital, and beat (UAA first place tie) Wash U.  And yes, the Bishops need to beat Wittenberg, Wooster, or Wabash as well as DePauw again.   ;D 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 22, 2012, 11:48:24 PM
Problem is for OWU that Rhodes and Wash U. aren't regional games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 22, 2012, 11:53:19 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 22, 2012, 11:48:24 PM
Problem is for OWU that Rhodes and Wash U. aren't regional games.

Rhodes should count under the administrative region rule I think.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 23, 2012, 12:30:41 AM
Yes, Rhodes is.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on January 23, 2012, 08:33:22 AM
Quote from: WAlum on January 22, 2012, 11:03:25 PM
Quick response on OWU beating someone.  The battling bishops website shows OWU has won at DePauw, at Rhodes (2nd in the SWAC), crushed OAC first-place Capital, and beat (UAA first place tie) Wash U.  And yes, the Bishops need to beat Wittenberg, Wooster, or Wabash as well as DePauw again.   ;D

None of the in-region teams are excellent position to be regionally ranked. Rhodes, Capital and DePauw still have plenty of work to do.

The Wash U win is good, but that would only come into play in the secondary criteria.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 23, 2012, 10:27:57 AM
I didn't see Rhodes marked on the schedule as a regional game, but of course that may be more of my hurried look-see than anything.

DPU I think has a good chance to be regionally ranked if they keep their play at this level.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 23, 2012, 10:48:29 AM
If DePauw beats Witt and OWU this week, they should soar up the rankings.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 23, 2012, 10:49:08 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 23, 2012, 10:27:57 AM
I didn't see Rhodes marked on the schedule as a regional game, but of course that may be more of my hurried look-see than anything.

DPU I think has a good chance to be regionally ranked if they keep their play at this level.

It wasn't but has since been fixed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashbrother on January 23, 2012, 12:53:48 PM
Quote from: WAlum on January 23, 2012, 10:48:29 AM
If DePauw beats Witt and OWU this week, they should soar up the rankings.

We are already seeing the upgrade in conference strength in a number of sports, with the addition of Depauw.   I think it is great.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 23, 2012, 05:39:54 PM
New poll....Wooster leapfrogs again....http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2011-12/week8

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 23, 2012, 07:01:58 PM
As a voter in the Poster's Poll, I put a blanket around Wabash / Witt / Wooster in the middle of my rankings. I can't complain if some voters put Wooster ahead, since Wabash looked bad against Witt and then Witt lost to Hiram. It's a tough, tough year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 23, 2012, 09:05:58 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 23, 2012, 07:01:58 PM
As a voter in the Poster's Poll, I put a blanket around Wabash / Witt / Wooster in the middle of my rankings. I can't complain if some voters put Wooster ahead, since Wabash looked bad against Witt and then Witt lost to Hiram. It's a tough, tough year.

I agree the parity is really tight but for a team to be behind in conference but ahead in poll, means those that don't follow NCAC polling on the history of program.  In the end doesn't matter, winner will be decided between the lines.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 23, 2012, 09:37:51 PM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on January 23, 2012, 09:05:58 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 23, 2012, 07:01:58 PM
As a voter in the Poster's Poll, I put a blanket around Wabash / Witt / Wooster in the middle of my rankings. I can't complain if some voters put Wooster ahead, since Wabash looked bad against Witt and then Witt lost to Hiram. It's a tough, tough year.

I agree the parity is really tight but for a team to be behind in conference but ahead in poll, means those that don't follow NCAC polling on the history of program.  In the end doesn't matter, winner will be decided between the lines.

Pollsters don't vote on the basis of only conference games, so conference standings are borderline irrelevant.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 23, 2012, 09:41:42 PM


Pollsters don't vote on the basis of only conference games, so conference standings are borderline irrelevant.
[/quote]

Can you please explain this statement?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 23, 2012, 09:46:38 PM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on January 23, 2012, 09:41:42 PM


Pollsters don't vote on the basis of only conference games, so conference standings are borderline irrelevant.

Can you please explain this statement?
[/quote]

Non-con games go into the 'full body of work' considered by voters.  Not having studied the teams, I don't know how that factors in.  Just saying that conference standings, per se, don't really matter.  (In the CCIW, Augie is currently two full games behind IWU, Wheaton, and NCC, but is just ahead of IWU and Wheaton, and NCC received ZERO votes.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 23, 2012, 10:03:51 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 23, 2012, 09:46:38 PM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on January 23, 2012, 09:41:42 PM


Pollsters don't vote on the basis of only conference games, so conference standings are borderline irrelevant.

Can you please explain this statement?

Non-con games go into the 'full body of work' considered by voters.  Not having studied the teams, I don't know how that factors in.  Just saying that conference standings, per se, don't really matter.  (In the CCIW, Augie is currently two full games behind IWU, Wheaton, and NCC, but is just ahead of IWU and Wheaton, and NCC received ZERO votes.)
[/quote]

Thanks, seems that when conference play starts in full across the country, how they are playing against each other in conference would be all the data available for half the season.  I assume by year end, it does.  With most conferences approaching half way, I'd think it would factor in naturally.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 23, 2012, 10:39:52 PM
It's also a factor of who is playing well at this instant in time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2012, 11:22:11 PM
Congratulations to Wooster's Josh Claytor who was named NCAC Player of the Week!  :)

In two wins over Allegheny and Ohio Wesleyan, Claytor had 36 points and 15 boards.  Josh also made 16 of 20 shots combined in those two games for 80% shooting from the floor!

Let's hope that the Wooster guards try to get him at least 10 shots every game for the rest of the season.  ;)

Here is a link to the story: http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/releases/20120123cwvdd0
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 24, 2012, 07:25:39 PM
The second half of the conference schedule begins tomorrow. Let's take a look!

Hiram (4-4, 11-6) @ Allegheny (1-7, 3-14) - Is this a trap for the Terriers? After the big win against Witt, Hiram moseys on to face the Gators who broke an 11-game losing streak by beating Denison on the road. For me, I think Hiram's style will give Allegheny fits but with a big game against Wooster on the horizon Saturday, they could overlook the Gators.

Denison (3-5, 6-11) @ Oberlin (1-7, 6-11) - A rematch. The Big Red won 72-63 at Denison earlier this month. At home (or at least not in Indiana) the Yeomen have the ability to keep it close. They definitely could sneak away with a victory here, and leave Denison's fans up in arms again over another mystifying loss against a team that they should beat on paper.

Kenyon (2-6, 8-9) @ Wooster (5-3, 14-3) - Another rematch. The Scots won the first matchup 84-68 in late November. I can't see the result changing much. The Lords have played better, but just don't have the horses to keep up with the now-revitalized Scots at home.

Wabash (6-2, 14-3) @ Ohio Wesleyan (5-3, 13-4) - Lots at stake for this game - tourney seeding, regional rankings and Pool "C" possibilities all will be impacted. Wabash's offense got on track against Kenyon Saturday, but now they face an OWU team that's hungry to get an impact NCAC win. The health of Derek Bailey will be key for Wabash, and OWU must have Tim Brady involved.

DePauw (6-2, 12-5) @ Wittenberg (7-1, 13-4) - Even more at stake here in the first Tiger v. Tiger contest of the season. First place in the NCAC is the prize. A road win by the New Tigers would be critical for them and welcomed by Wabash, OWU and Wooster as it tightens up the race gain. Witt could regain a two-game lead in the conference with a win and a Little Giants loss. The Old Tigers defense may be the key - DPU has played much better on offense lately and have a nice inside-outside game to contend with.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2012, 09:10:26 PM
OWU's Nick Felhaber's only basket of the game was a three with 13 seconds left, and that hoop propelled the Bishops past Wabash 66-64. Andy Walsh had a good look at a three with one tick left on the clock but missed. The Little Giants trailed most of the game, but edged ahead with 2:49 left on a Houston Hodges three. Brian Shelbourne had two big buckets for Wabash down the strech, but it wasn't enough.

The Bishops had an 11 point lead in the first half, and had Wabash down seven with 4:43 to go, but the LG's kept clawing back and almost got a big road win.

Tim Brady (who else) led everyone with 31 points, including 11-13 shooting from the line. Marshall Morris had 20 points for OWU.

Hodges led Wabash with 19, and Aaron Zinnerman had 17. Derek Bailey struggled, shooting 1-11 from the floor.

Both squads are now 6-3 in NCAC play and 14-4 overall. A great game in a tough league.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 25, 2012, 09:35:41 PM
Final:  Wooster 78  Kenyon 68  :)

Wooster was led tonight by Josh Claytor with 18 points, Justin Hallowell with 14, Xavier Brown with 12 and Matt Fegan with 11.

Top scorers for Kenyon were Ikenna Nwadibia with 17 points, Brian Lebovitz with 14 and Anthony Chun with 14.

Scots won this game by limiting their turnovers to 9 while the Lords had 15.  Wooster also wins the boards 38 to 36.

Wooster is now 15-3, 6-3 NCAC.  Next game is at Hiram on Saturday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 25, 2012, 09:43:12 PM
Final:  Wittenberg 66  DePauw 62

Wittenberg regains a 2 game lead in the conference with their record now at 8-1.

4 Teams tied for second place at 6-3 are DePauw, Ohio Wesleyan, Wabash and Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2012, 09:49:05 PM
In that Witt game Clayton Black led all with 19 points and eight boards. Sean Haseley led DPU with 14.

Allegheny upset Hiram 65-60 and the formerly woebegone Gators may sneak into the NCAC tournament. James Ness and Devone McLeod led Allegheny with 14 and Ryan Stanko netted 13. Jamaal Watkins paced the Terriers with 22 and Aaron Stefanov added 17, but Hiram had no depth and were outrebounded 40-33.

Denison holds off Oberlin 70-56. The Big Red won the rebound battle 39-25 as well. Dimonde Hale led the Big Red with 18. Brett Tiberi added four three-pointers for Denison with 14. Andrew Fox led the Yeomen with 19.

Josh Merritt played just four minutes, scoring three. Was he injured? Sick?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2012, 09:50:52 PM
Witt back to a 2-game lead and a huge knot at 2nd.

Wittenberg 8-1
Wabash     6-3
DePauw     6-3
OWU         6-3
Wooster    6-3
Hiram        4-5
Denison     4-5
Kenyon      2-7
Allegheny  2-7
Oberlin      1-8
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 25, 2012, 10:37:15 PM
Solid win for Wittenberg tonight 64-60 over DePauw. Of course it helps when you're making shots unlike Saturday at Hiram. Total effort by everyone on Wittenberg tonight. Congratulations to Clayton Black for 1,000 career points.

Big assist by Ohio Wesleyan to give Witt a big 2 game lead with 7 games to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 26, 2012, 07:13:44 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on January 25, 2012, 10:37:15 PMCongratulations to Clayton Black for 1,000 career points.

DePauw's Sean Haseley (http://www.depauw.edu/athletics/news/details/28112/) reached 1000 too, and in the same game. Also Denison's Larry Farmer (http://denisonbigred.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/releases/20120125eetkmn), on a dunk.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 26, 2012, 07:15:54 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 25, 2012, 09:49:05 PM
Josh Merritt played just four minutes, scoring three. Was he injured? Sick?

Merritt went down early in the first half with an injury to his left leg.  Not sure how bad it is, but he looked like he was in a lot of pain and sat out the rest of the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 26, 2012, 10:44:01 AM
What a great race in the NCAC this year.  Big game on Saturday as DePauw goes to OWU. Somebody will falling out of the 4-way tie for second.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 27, 2012, 06:41:24 PM
It's another Saturday full of NCAC action. What's on tap?

Allegheny (2-7, 4-14) @ Kenyon (2-7, 8-10) - The depth of the NCAC has hurt the Lords this year. In other years, they may have been contending for fifth or sixth, but this is a tough league. Kenyon has more talent than the Gators, but Allegheny has won two straight and now has confidence.

Wittenberg (8-1, 14-4) @ Oberlin (1-8, 6-12) - The Yeomen are in last place, but they're not a normal NCAC cellar-dweller. They played Witt pretty tough in the first meeting between the two but they may be without Josh Merritt. The Old Tigers are deep, talented, and I think after losing last week to Hiram they won't be candidates for a trap-game upset.

Denison (4-5, 7-11) @ Wabash (6-3, 14-4) - The Big Red play Wabash tough most of the time. The Little Giants, though, have had their way with the second division NCAC teams at home. The health of Derek Bailey is a question mark. He was ineffective on offense against OWU Wednesday.

Wooster (6-3, 15-3) @ Hiram (4-5, 11-7) - Could Hiram host another Admiral Ackbar game? Maybe not this time. Wooster had their way with the Terriers earlier in the season, and I think the Scots have the antidote for Hiram's pace.

DePauw (6-3, 12-6) @ Ohio Wesleyan (6-3, 14-4) - One of these teams won't be in second place anymore. Earlier in the year, the New Tigers fell at home to the Bishops 67-60. But DPU is playing better now, and OWU seems to have stalled. Of course, Tim Brady will be on the court, and that may be the difference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on January 28, 2012, 04:06:51 PM
After leading by as many as 9 late in the first half, Wooster now trails Hiram, 53-50, with 14:30 remaining in the game.  With only four points and one rebound, but three fouls, Josh Claytor has yet to factor heavily for the Scots.  Given his significant role in recent Wooster victories, his play could be key in how this one turns out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 28, 2012, 05:00:22 PM
Denison 72 Wabash 62

oh my!


Ohio Wesleyan 72  DePauw 61
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on January 28, 2012, 05:28:37 PM
Wooster 88, Hiram 73

Justin Hallowell and Matt Fegan each hit four 3's and have over 20 points, to lead the Scots.  Wooster went 11-for-26 from three-point range, and sophomore transfer Kenny DeBoer scored 15 points off the bench.

I suppose that the Scots won't look past their upcoming game at Denison, after what the Big Red did this afternoon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2012, 05:43:28 PM
Oh, my! Indeed. Brett Tiberi led the Big Red with 22. Dimonde Hale added 18. Aaron Zinnerman led the Little Giants with 18. Derek Bailey was ineffective again, 0-7 from the floor and one point.

Witt beat Oberlin 68-56.
Kenyon edged Allegheny 73-72.

Standings:

Wittenberg  9-1
Wooster      7-3
OWU          7-3
Wabash      6-4
DePauw      6-4
Denison      5-5
Hiram         4-6
Kenyon       3-7
Allegheny    2-8
Oberlin       1-9
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2012, 06:33:19 PM
Sounds like the Lords / Gators game was quite eventful at the end:

http://athletics.kenyon.edu/x42013.xml
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on January 28, 2012, 07:19:17 PM
Congrats to the Big Red on a big road win!!!!!
Coach G has the Big Red peaking at the right time.

I am not sure you want to face the Big Red in round one of the tournament!!!!!!
They may just surprise ya!!

Way too go BIG RED!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 28, 2012, 09:17:15 PM
A few more big games this week as teams battle down the stretch for the top few seeds in the tournament.  Wabash had a rough week going 0-2 with losses to OWU and Denison.  OWU goes 2-0 with big wins over Wabash and DePauw.  Wabash has another tough week, traveling to DePauw and to Wooster.
Wednesday:
Wabash @ DePauw       
Wooster @ Denison         
Ohio Wesleyan @ Wittenberg    

Saturday:   
Wabash @ Wooster    
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 28, 2012, 09:52:40 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on January 28, 2012, 07:19:17 PM
Congrats to the Big Red on a big road win!!!!!
Coach G has the Big Red peaking at the right time.

I am not sure you want to face the Big Red in round one of the tournament!!!!!!
They may just surprise ya!!

Way too go BIG RED!!!

BRF - please have your doctor send me the same prescription he wrote for you.  I could use the inspiration.  :D

The Denison offense still is far from peaking because the Ghiloni system is still very unproductive.  Without the hot hand of Tiberi from the outside this afternoon, the offense was still very anemic and mostly Dimonde Hale.  Thankfully, Ghiloni saved himself from the boneheaded move of the century by putting Tiberi back in the game after pulling him with 8 minutes left and watching the lead evaporate immediately.     

The difference maker in this game, other than the red-hot shooting of Tiberi, was the performance of the Big Red defense.  They contained the Wabash big men extremely well and kept Shelbourne from penetrating.  Kurosh did little damage inside against the smaller Big Red defenders and Bailey seemed to be a non-factor the entire game.  He didn't seem to be laboring, but I wonder if the injury kept him from going full speed. 

I will be interested to hear Wabash fans' take on the game.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 30, 2012, 05:51:01 PM
New poll (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/index):
Wooster up to #14
Wittenberg just barely off the bottom, 3 points behind #25
Wabash drops out but retains 5 points
OWU garners 9 points
DePauw loses what meagre support it had, but it's women's team sits solidly at #6.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on January 31, 2012, 12:30:18 AM
Quote from: GoRed on January 28, 2012, 09:52:40 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on January 28, 2012, 07:19:17 PM
Congrats to the Big Red on a big road win!!!!!
Coach G has the Big Red peaking at the right time.

I am not sure you want to face the Big Red in round one of the tournament!!!!!!
They may just surprise ya!!

Way too go BIG RED!!!

BRF - please have your doctor send me the same prescription he wrote for you.  I could use the inspiration.  :D

The Denison offense still is far from peaking because the Ghiloni system is still very unproductive.  Without the hot hand of Tiberi from the outside this afternoon, the offense was still very anemic and mostly Dimonde Hale.  Thankfully, Ghiloni saved himself from the boneheaded move of the century by putting Tiberi back in the game after pulling him with 8 minutes left and watching the lead evaporate immediately.     

The difference maker in this game, other than the red-hot shooting of Tiberi, was the performance of the Big Red defense.  They contained the Wabash big men extremely well and kept Shelbourne from penetrating.  Kurosh did little damage inside against the smaller Big Red defenders and Bailey seemed to be a non-factor the entire game.  He didn't seem to be laboring, but I wonder if the injury kept him from going full speed. 

I will be interested to hear Wabash fans' take on the game.

Wabash fan take on the game.....Tiberi was the key , Wabash continued to lose him off the ball and he was deadly.   Bailey is in an old fashioned shooting slump, growing up with Jordan Hulls and having a similar work ethic, I can guarantee his time in the gym has increased since Saturday, expect DePauw to bare the brunt of his work.  Could the knee injury have something to do with it, possibly altered his jump? Maybe but more likely a slump.   Too good to stay down long.  It wasn't that he was being defended too close, he was getting good shots.  And it is clear that Wabash needs Bailey to score to win.

  Curosh hand finally seems well.

  Also Wabash has tried to work to penetrate to the bucket more since the last DePauw game and that's good, but....abandoning / not looking for the 3 pointer in their offense as much..has left them with teams packing it in....the 3 pointer is what had them undefeated until Transylvania .... Lost that game not shooting well from 3 and immediately changed the style.  Not sure how that is going to play out....lots of good shooters on the team....might need to open the scope a little and free up the inside. 

Denison played about as well as I have seen them, outplayed us and deserved the win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2012, 09:47:19 PM
There are some important games afoot on Wednesday:

Oberlin (1-9, 6-13) @ Allegheny (2-8, 4-15) - Important? Well, not as important as other games on the slate. However, the winner still has a good chance to get the final slot in the NCAC tourney if Kenyon falters. The loser becomes a spoiler for anyone. The Gators have played pretty well in their past three games, while the Yeomen may not have Josh Merritt.

Kenyon (3-7, 9-10) @ Hiram (4-6, 11-8) - Hiram has lost three of four, and a promising season has hit the skids but a Terriers win can help with seeding. The Lords squeaked by Allegheny Saturday and look to distance themselves from #9 in the NCAC and can get to .500 with a road victory. This is a game that could have ripple effects throughout the league come tourney time.

Wooster (7-3, 16-3) @ Denison (5-5, 8-11) - The Big Red sprung a big upset Saturday, and frankly there is no reason to think they couldn't spring another shocker. However, they face a revitalized Scots squad that has taken care of their affairs after losing to DePauw. This has huge implications for both teams.

Ohio Wesleyan (7-3, 15-4) @ Wittenberg (9-1, 15-4) - The Bishops have recovered after a January swoon, winning huge games against the Indiana squads. They can do themselves (and others) a favor by stopping the Old Tigers on the road. Wittenberg beat OWU by two earlier in the season and with a win (and some help from Denison) can almost clinch the NCAC regular title.

Wabash (6-4, 14-5) @ DePauw (6-4, 12-7) - The Little Giants face another must win game. Not only is it the rubber game of the season series against the hated New Tigers, a loss could definitely mean a road first-round game. DPU has struggled a bit after their big upsets in January and they also need this game. There will be blood in Greencastle.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 31, 2012, 10:54:20 PM
I'll have my thoughts and analysis from the "PAM" tomorrow night as I"ll be in attendance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 01, 2012, 02:49:01 PM
The NCAC race could become VERY crazy tonight with an OWU win.  A Wittenberg win would almost surely give the Tigers a minimum of a share of the regular season championship.  DePauw or Wabash will be eliminated from title contention tonight. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 01, 2012, 08:57:18 PM
Wooster leading 79 to 61 over Denison with ~4 minutes remaining.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 01, 2012, 09:07:31 PM
OWU led Witt 34-27 at the half but Witt has outscored OWU by 15 in the 2nd half to win 66-58.  Witt is definitely sitting pretty now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2012, 09:08:25 PM
Hiram blows out Kenyon 96-79
Allegheny handling Oberlin 53-32 with 9:06 left
Wittenberg upends OWU 66-58 after trailing 28-11 after 16 minutes
Wabash and DPU in a nailbiter, LGs lead by 2 with 0:07 left, DPU ball; DPU missed the shot and Wabash wins 65-63
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 01, 2012, 09:08:44 PM
Final:  Wooster 89  Denison 70  :)

Wooster takes care of business with a convincing road win over the Big Red.  Top scorers for the Scots were Jake Mays with 16 points, Xavier Brown with 15, Josh Claytor with 12, Justin Hallowell with 10 and Doug Thorpe with 10.

Denison was led by Dimonde Hale with 25 points and Larry Farmer with 16 points.

Wooster is now 17-3, 8-3 NCAC. ;D  Next game is Wabash at home on Saturday afternoon.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 01, 2012, 09:11:16 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 01, 2012, 09:08:25 PMWabash and DPU in a nailbiter, LGs lead by 2 with 0:07 left, DPU ball; DPU missed the shot and Wabash wins 65-63

DPU misses a trey for the win at the buzzer so Wabash holds on for the win...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2012, 10:09:04 PM
Gheny wins 64-44. Josh Merritt did not play. Anyone have any word if he's done for the season?


Standings:

Wittenberg  10-1
Wooster      8-3
OWU          7-4
Wabash      7-4
DePauw      6-5
Denison      5-6
Hiram         5-6
Kenyon       3-8
Allegheny    3-8
Oberlin       1-10
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 01, 2012, 10:12:11 PM
Mays played a great game with Claytor on the bench and Claytor came back strong in the second half.  A well played game on both sides in general, but the turning point was very clearly at 51-49 when the Big Red bench dummies subbed three players when things were going well and it all fell apart.  Game over. 
 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 01, 2012, 10:22:05 PM
Wittenberg 66 Ohio Wesleyan 58

As noted before this was really a game of 2 halves. OWU dominated the first 1/3 of the game and Witt controlled the next 2/3. At one point it was OWU 30-11 but Wittenberg ended the half on a 16-4 run aided by 3 Josh McKee 3's in the last 2 minutes of the first half to pull within 7. Wittenberg finally started locking down on defense and eventually pulled away.

A couple things to take away: Ohio Wesleyan is a hell of a team, but just like everyone if they're not hitting shots they are very beatable. In fact, part of the reason they were up so much early was Wittenberg wasn't rebounding or defending and allowed virtually every point in the first half to be a free throw or shot within 10 feet of the basket. Once Wittenberg tightened up on defense (mainly through zone) you could see the results.

Tim Brady had an off game as he shot 4-19 shooting. Although he finished with 21 points, overall he was very inefficient. Also, OWU as a team shot 2-22 from 3-point range as they could get nothing going at all inside.

Wittenberg had an all around effort game as come expected as of late. They essentially control their own destiny for the conference race and its looking like a win vs Wooster next Saturday would most likely clinch the conference. Of course, Wabash could assist with a win at Wooster Saturday.

Tiger Up!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 02, 2012, 09:47:39 AM
As I noted last night, the conference is Witt's to lose but I thought I should add a, "Not so fast my friend" as well.  ;) There are 5 games left on the schedule and Witt has 2 tough road games in Indiana remaining against Wabash and DePauw and they also have a home game vs. a Hiram team that handled them at Hiram.  They do have the advantage of hosting Wooster, but Wooster has proven that they can win in Springfield in recent past.

Wooster's remaining 5 games aren't much easier though as they also have 2 tough roadies at OWU and as noted, at Witt.  And they also will be hosting the 2 Indiana schools who also happened to beat the Scots when Wooster made their trek into the Hoosier state.  If Wooster picks up one more loss, the race is essentially over.  However, if the Scots can somehow find a way to win out including winning down in Springfield, I think there is a good chance of Wooster coming back to claim their 8th consecutive regular season title.  Really though, if Witt can just manage a split in Indiana, they will end Wooster's reign atop the conference...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2012, 11:16:35 AM
Frankly, I think the intrigue in the NCAC will continue for years to come! Most all of the schools (*cough, cough Allegheny*) have maintained or increased their level of play, and the top schools have shown they can recruit to fill gaps without much degradation in play.

It's a good (yet stressful) time to be an NCAC hoops fan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 03, 2012, 07:49:10 PM
It's a preview:

Allegheny (3-8, 5-15) @ Wittenberg (10-1, 16-4) - This could have had the makings of a trap game if the Gators had more powerful jaws. The Old Tigers just have too much for the young Gators. It would be the upset of the year.

Ohio Wesleyan (7-4, 15-5) @ Oberlin (1-10, 6-14) - The Yeomen's season seem to have collapsed on itself after losing Josh Merritt. This will be a good game for the Bishops to get a breather before the final push to end the conference season.

Kenyon (3-8, 9-11) @ DePauw (6-5, 12-8) - DPU needs a win to get back into contention to host their first round NCAC tourney game. But this game won't be a cakewalk if the Lords play to their potential. The New Tigers should win, but need to play their game and not take Kenyon lightly.

Hiram (5-6, 12-8) @ Denison (5-6, 8-12) - This has a lot of downstream implications. The winner has a chance for fifth, depending on how DPU finishes out while the loser could be challenged by Kenyon for 7th if things break the other way. The Terriers have been quite inconsistent lately, and the Big Red have been playing better. We shall see if the trends continue.

Wabash (7-4, 15-5) @ Wooster (8-3, 17-3) - The game of the day has a 2:00 start, and in two hours the conference race could have a totally different look. A Little Giants win means Witt probably has the regular season crown, while a Scots victory could mean Wabash will have to scrap for a three-seed at best. Derek Bailey will be the key to this game - if he's fully back on track then Wabash will have their full arsenal.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 03, 2012, 09:46:04 PM
Lets go Wabash!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 04, 2012, 02:32:11 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 38  Wabash 27

Wooster was led in the half by Doug Thorpe with 11 points, Justin Hallowell with 7, Jake Mays with 7 and Josh Claytor with 6.

Top scorers for Wabash are Derek Bailey with 14 points and Nick Curosh with 8.

Scots shot 60% in the half compared to 31% for the Little Giants.

Great to check out this game from South Carolina...thanks to the internet connection.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 04, 2012, 03:25:51 PM
Final:  Wooster 77  Wabash 59

Excellent win for Wooster as they avenge an earlier loss to Wabash!  :)  Scots also stay in the NCAC title race though still 2 games behind Witt.

Wooster was led by Doug Thorpe with 18 points, Justin Hallowell with 14 and Jake Mays with 9.

Top scorers for Wabash were Derek Bailey with 18 points, Andy Walsh with 10 and Nick Curosh with 9.

Wooster is now 18-3, 9-3 NCAC.  ;D  Big upcoming week with games at OWU and at Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2012, 04:25:00 PM
Unfortunately for Wooster (and the rest), Witt avoided the trap that the Gators set. Allegheny closed to 71-70 with 1:39 left but the Old Tigers held on to win 79-72. Josh McKee and Zack Leahy had 15 for Witt, while Clayton Black added 14. Devone McLeod led everyone with 25.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2012, 05:10:39 PM
Denison continues its strong play, beating Hiram 81-74. Dimonde Hale led everyone with 23. Andrew Weigand led the Terriers with 21. The Big Red had a big lead but Hiram cut it to three late in the second half.

Ohio Wesleyan whaps Oberlin 81-57. No surprise there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 04, 2012, 05:34:26 PM
Jeez, I wonder what's suddenly gone right in Meadville? And why did it take 3 months for it to happen?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 04, 2012, 05:54:59 PM
Just back to Columbus from the game in Wooster.  Great performance by the Scots today!  I've gotta say that I LOVE the 5-man substitutions that they did today.  I ran some quick numbers and the '2nd team' scored more per minute than the first team, had fewer turnovers and rebounded at the same pace. Actually at one point with the Scot starters waiting to check in Carpenter called time out, and I commented that he probably wanted to get the Scots subs off the court.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 04, 2012, 07:00:22 PM
DPU outlasts Kenyon 92-82. Michael Wilkison led the New Tigers with 20, and Sean Haseley added 18. The Lords were led by Anthony Chun also with 20.

Standings:

Wittenberg  11-1
Wooster      9-3
OWU          8-4
Wabash      7-5
DePauw      7-5
Denison      6-6
Hiram         5-7
Kenyon       3-9
Allegheny    3-9
Oberlin       1-11
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 04, 2012, 07:24:02 PM
This doesn't have much relevance to the NCAC, other than it might be a team that is competing with an NCAC team for a Pool C bid, but what probably qualifies as the upset of the year, as Earlham ended a 36-game losing streak by beating Hanover, on the road no less. This is the same Hanover team that beat Ohio Wesleyan and Denison to start the season.

http://www.hanover.edu/athletics/news?a=2870
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2012, 05:45:45 PM
New poll: (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/index)
Wooster up to #13
Wittenberg re-enters at #22
OWU and Wabash with one vote apiece
Hope is the new #1 (making Middlebury the new #2 (http://rlv.zcache.com/the_new_number_2_button-p145310599993532645z745k_400.jpg)), no other GL teams ranked

DePauw women move to #4, trailing three unbeaten teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 06, 2012, 08:52:23 PM
Big game Wednesday for both Witt and Wooster. Needless to say I"ll be rooting for OWU, as an OWU win and Wittenberg win essentially clinches the NCAC for Wittenberg. Although it'd be nice to win the conference title by beating Wooster at home Saturday  ;)

I know, I"m sure my karma will drop with that comment  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 07, 2012, 11:28:44 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 06, 2012, 08:52:23 PM
Big game Wednesday for both Witt and Wooster. Needless to say I"ll be rooting for OWU, as an OWU win and Wittenberg win essentially clinches the NCAC for Wittenberg. Although it'd be nice to win the conference title by beating Wooster at home Saturday  ;)


Wednesday will definitely go a long way in determining who will take home the regular season championship.  Witt has to make the trek to C'ville where Wabash has won 3 straight over Witt and 4 of the last 6 that have been played in Chadwick.  Witt has proven that they can win on the road with impressive wins at Wooster and at OWU, but their lone NCAC loss also came on the road in that headscratching loss at Hiram.  If Witt wins at Wabash, I think it would pretty much clinch things for them as far as the regular season title goes.

Wooster hasn't had as rough of a time at OWU as Witt has had at Wabash, but the Bishops have always played Wooster tough in Branch Rickey.  Wooster has won the last 2 down in Delaware including last year's 26 point drubbing but outside of that game, Wooster's MOV in the Branch has been just over 6 ppg dating back to 2003 and they've also lost twice in that timespan down there.  This game will be far from a gimme for Wooster.  And likewise regarding a Witt win in C'ville, I think a Wooster loss in Delaware pretty much clinches things for the Tigers as well.

Could be a pivotal night in the NCAC.  A Wooster win and a Witt loss would place the pressure squarely on the shoulders of Witt clinging to a one game lead with Wooster coming to town Saturday night.  A Witt win or a Wooster loss could prove to be the clincher for breaking up the 7 year reign Wooster has had on the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2012, 08:03:34 PM
As many have said, tomorrow could practically cement Witt as the NCAC regular season title-holder, or could tighten the race up big time for a huge game Saturday. Let's see what's on tap:

Oberlin (1-11, 6-15) @ Kenyon (3-9, 9-12) - Big game for the Lords to see if they can qualify for the NCAC tournament. And even if they'll be a #8 seed, Kenyon won't be that easy of an out. The Yeomen are probably wishing for a quick end to the season. I would love to hear about a status on Josh Merritt, since he was a pretty good player and without him Oberlin slips back to the bad-old-days.

Allegheny (3-9, 5-16) @ Hiram (5-7, 12-9) - You may not think this, but this is a big game for both teams. The Gators could help themselves make the NCAC tourney with a win. The Terriers are playing for seeding and more importantly, to get back into a groove. Since beating Witt, Hiram is 1-3.

Denison (6-6, 9-12) @ DePauw (7-5, 13-8) - Another hidden big game. Both teams are now scrambling for a #5 seed, but DPU can fall back into a tie for the #4 (and hosting rights) if they win and Witt beats Wabash. After the turmoil of the season, it could happen that the Big Red could find its way into the final weekend of the tourney if it gets a good seed and keeps playing well. How about that?

Wooster (9-3, 18-3) @ Ohio Wesleyan (8-4, 16-5) - A huge game and a rematch of a very close and tense game earlier in the year. A Bishops win means they are back into a tie for second and makes a Witt championship almost a foregone conclusion. A Scots win tightens the race up, and with a little help it makes Saturday's game even more intense than a regular Witt / Wooster game. Can OWU keep Wooster from getting the ball inside? Can the Scots contain Tim Brady?

Wittenberg (11-1, 17-4) @ Wabash (7-5, 15-6) - Wabash's Derek Bailey is back on his game, but the Little Giants were over-matched at Wooster and really need to get their early season mojo back. Wittenberg hasn't exactly played like gangbusters recently, but they've won. This game will be over before the others unless there are multiple overtimes, so Wooster and OWU will know the exact implications of their game before it is over. Unless, of course, they observe radio silence in Delaware. Someone cut off the internet!



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 08, 2012, 07:28:18 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 07, 2012, 08:03:34 PM
Denison (6-6, 9-12) @ DePauw (7-5, 13-8) - Another hidden big game. Both teams are now scrambling for a #5 seed, but DPU can fall back into a tie for the #4 (and hosting rights) if they win and Witt beats Wabash. After the turmoil of the season, it could happen that the Big Red could find its way into the final weekend of the tourney if it gets a good seed and keeps playing well. How about that?

The Big Red are playing with more confidence.  The major difference has been that the seasoned players like Tiberi are playing looser and taking some of the offensive pressure off Hale and Farmer.  If they keep opening up the offense, Denison could get to the final weekend.  It will mean getting that 6 (or even 5) seed, though.  Tonight is important, but the next two against Allegheny and Kenyon have to be W's if they are going to be at least .500 in conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 08, 2012, 08:00:42 AM
Go Red - so Ghiloni's off your "hot seat?"   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 08, 2012, 08:57:53 AM
No.  We still need a change.  Over the long run, he hasn't demonstrated that he has the ability to coach at this level.     


 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 08, 2012, 09:17:22 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 07, 2012, 08:03:34 PM

Wooster (9-3, 18-3) @ Ohio Wesleyan (8-4, 16-5) - A huge game and a rematch of a very close and tense game earlier in the year. A Bishops win means they are back into a tie for second and makes a Witt championship almost a foregone conclusion. A Scots win tightens the race up, and with a little help it makes Saturday's game even more intense than a regular Witt / Wooster game. Can OWU keep Wooster from getting the ball inside? Can the Scots contain Tim Brady?


What exactly is a 'regular' Witt/Wooster game?  I didn't realize there was such a thing... (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.scout.com%2Fmedia%2Fforums%2Femoticons%2Fnoidea.gif&hash=d0853e7250ffe0f662a746329d301aa06dd4ee9f)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on February 08, 2012, 03:43:52 PM
I feel like making picks:

Woo @ OWU: Do or Die game IMO for the Bishops. I think the best player on the court T. Brady will respond with 25 plus and lead OWU to the win.

Witt @ Wabash: The hardest place for the Tigers to go play and win in the last 5-6 years - Harder than Wooster... I'm torn on this prediction but I like Witt to pull it out in a slugfest. I like Brandt to have a big game on the O glass and in the scoring column - playing second fiddle to Black.

Denison @ Depauw: ill go Depauw at home.

Allegheny @ Hiram: I was impressed by Allegheny vs Witt. Witt was lucky to survive with a win as they had no answer for Mccleod (until Coop checked him the last play) and recieved some fortunate calls down the stretch. Has nothing to do with this matchup but Ill go with Gheny.

Oberlin @ Kenyon: Kenyon in a must have.

Thoughts?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 08, 2012, 04:25:25 PM
Quote from: hotdawg on February 08, 2012, 03:43:52 PM
I feel like making picks:

Woo @ OWU: Do or Die game IMO for the Bishops. I think the best player on the court T. Brady will respond with 25 plus and lead OWU to the win.

Thoughts?


Do or die game for 2nd place?

There was an article in the Daily Mistake yesterday where Coach Moore commented on how good Brady is and he made a statement I thought was key.  Moore basically conceded that Brady would get his points but he felt the key would be to not let any other Bishops go off for big games.  I won't mind seeing Brady get 25 as long as he has to work hard for those 25 and no one else is contributing.  Heck, Brady had 22 in the last game, but the thing that kept OWU in the game was the fact that Easley and White came off the bench to contribute 14 and 12 respectively.  OWU will need contributions like that to beat Wooster.

A key for Wooster will be whether or not they can establish an inside game again as smeds alluded to above.  Claytor was a force and OWU seemed to have no answer to try and stop him in the first matchup as he was 8-8 from the field and scored 20.

Should be an entertaining game as most of them are when these 2 teams meet up in Delaware...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on February 08, 2012, 04:34:41 PM
Good Insight.

Do or Die for OWU - This game is huge for OWU's at-large bid resume. A win and they are sitting pretty - a loss and they are gonna be toeing the line.

BTW:

Great Lakes
1 Hope 12-0 20-1
2 Wittenberg 15-3 17-4
3 Wooster 16-3 18-3
4 Ohio Wesleyan 15-5 16-5
5 Wabash 13-6 15-6
6 Capital 13-6 14-7
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 08, 2012, 04:37:16 PM
How about 4 NCAC teams representing in the GL Regional Rankings!   8-)

Hypothetically speaking, I'm wondering how much ground Wooster could make up on Hope if they were to pick up 2 wins this week.  That would be 2 road wins vs. regionally ranked opponents.  And Wooster already has 2 wins vs. regionally ranked opponents on their resume, not to mention 2 of their 3 losses are to regionally ranked opponents.  That would be 4 wins total vs. regionally ranked opponents compared to Hope claiming just one win vs a regionally ranked opponent (Wheaton).

BTW, gotcha on the do or die for OWU.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 08, 2012, 04:38:32 PM
Quote from: hotdawg on February 08, 2012, 04:34:41 PM
Great Lakes
1 Hope 12-0 20-1
2 Wittenberg 15-3 17-4
3 Wooster 16-3 18-3
4 Ohio Wesleyan 15-5 16-5
5 Wabash 13-6 15-6
6 Capital 13-6 14-7

Those are the  first regional rankings (http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2012/02/08/2012-ncaa-regional-rankings-week-1/) for the 2011-12 season from the NCAA. At this stage, that's almost a perfect result for the NCAC in terms of hoping for Pool C bids down the line. Great to be slotted ahead of all the PrAC contenders...it looks like the committee gave significant weight to strength of schedule and results against regionally-ranked teams this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2012, 04:55:09 PM
This is excellent for the NCAC as any "C" contender will have 'results' against regionally ranked foes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 08, 2012, 05:44:18 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2012, 04:55:09 PM
This is excellent for the NCAC as any "C" contender will have 'results' against regionally ranked foes.

Yeah.  This is very good.  Not too many GL teams will have the all important 'wins vs. regionally ranked opponents' checked off in their column and certainly not to the extent that some NCAC teams will have at the end of the season.  Does this open the door to the possibility of the NCAC getting 3 teams into the tournament?

One question I have is, does the selection committee take into account wins vs. just final regionally ranked opponents or do they take into account wins vs. teams that may not be ranked in the final regional rankings, but were at one time?

kb, I too am happy to see no love being thrown the PrAC's way.  I'm so tired of seeing one dominant team coming from the PrAC or the AMCC and get a lofty regional ranking due to their gaudy win percentage vs. crap.  It is definitely refreshing to see the NCAA place more of an emphasis on SOS.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 08, 2012, 06:37:00 PM
My understanding is that the policy is now 'once ranked, always ranked'.  And the criterion is 'results' vs. ranked teams - it appears that # of ranked opponents is important, even for losses (i.e., a 3-4 team against ranked opponents may still outshine a 2-1 team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 08, 2012, 07:51:37 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 08, 2012, 05:44:18 PM
Does this open the door to the possibility of the NCAC getting 3 teams into the tournament?

I think this is definitely possible, especially if the NCAC continues to have 3 of the top 4 in the region.  Matt Snyder projects both Woo and OWU as Pool C teams right now, although with OWU on the (right side of the) bubble.
http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/2012/02/bracketology-262012.html (http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/2012/02/bracketology-262012.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2012, 08:05:01 PM
At the Half:  Wabash 26  Wittenberg 19
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 08, 2012, 08:11:39 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 08, 2012, 07:51:37 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 08, 2012, 05:44:18 PM
Does this open the door to the possibility of the NCAC getting 3 teams into the tournament?

I think this is definitely possible, especially if the NCAC continues to have 3 of the top 4 in the region.  Matt Snyder projects both Woo and OWU as Pool C teams right now, although with OWU on the (right side of the) bubble.
http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/2012/02/bracketology-262012.html (http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/2012/02/bracketology-262012.html)

I'll be interested to see his updates after taking into account the "results vs. regionally ranked teams" plus his estimation of how the committee is treating the split between SOS and winning %.

Also, since it looks like SOS is playing a larger role, the top NCAC teams should have the advantage of playing each other, so even with another loss or two they may stay more static in the rankings and be able to keep a hold on the top spots "at the table" come Pool C time...it'll be very interesting to see how this plays out in the coming weeks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2012, 08:53:11 PM
At the Half:  Ohio Wesleyan 37  Wooster 27

Ugly first half for the Scots with too much one on one basketball and bad shots forced.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2012, 09:07:42 PM
Final:  Wabash 55  Wittenberg 49
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2012, 09:11:57 PM
It was a tight, taut, tense battle. Neither team shot well but Witt had big-time struggles at the line (10-19). Wabash held the lead for most of the game, but Witt really pulled it tight in the second half. It was definitely like the early-season Wabash wins where defense and rebounding won out.

Andy Walsh came off the bench and hit big shot after big shot, including a dagger of a three with 1:34 to go to extend Wabash's lead to four. He had 18 points to lead all scorers. Derek Bailey added 15.

Alex Brandt was a perfect 6-6 from the floor and led Witt with 12.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2012, 09:34:35 PM
Hiram beat Allegheny 83-68. Jamaal Watkins led everyone with 26 while Aaron Stefanov added 22 as the Terriers get a big win for them. James Ness and Ryan Stanko each had 23 for the Gators. Hiram broke out to an 11-point lead at half and built it to 20 at one point.

Kenyon easily gets past Oberlin 69-42. Brian Leibowitz leads everyone with 24. No one from Oberlin scored in double figures. Josh Merritt did play, scoring five points in 21 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2012, 09:44:29 PM
The Big Rd get a big road win as they beat DePauw 78-69. Mike Garabedian led Denison 15. Sean Haseley and Kevin Sullivan led the New Tigers with 13. DPU held a 37-35 lead at the half but Denison stormed back and held on for the win. This result tightens up the middle of the NCAC race for certain.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2012, 09:51:27 PM
Final:  Wooster 54  Ohio Wesleyan 50

Wooster's 2nd half defense won this game! :)  Scots hold the Bishops to a total of 13 points in the 2nd half.

Scots were led by Justin Hallowell with 14 points (15 Boards) and Xavier Brown with 9 points.  Nice double double for Hallowell tonight!

Bishops were led by Andy Winters with 16 points and Reuel Rogers with 12.  Tim Brady was 1 of 16 from the floor.

Wooster is now 19-3, 10-3 NCAC ;D

Huge showdown on Saturday with first place at stake as Wooster visits Witt!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 08, 2012, 10:04:13 PM
So someone please educate me - IF Wooster were to win on Saturday - who has the tie breaker to host the tournament?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2012, 10:08:25 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 08, 2012, 10:04:13 PM
So someone please educate me - IF Wooster were to win on Saturday - who has the tie breaker to host the tournament?
All other things being equal, I believe it will depend on where DePauw and Hiram finish in the league standings. If DePauw finishes ahead of the Pups, Witt gets the tiebreaker. In that event, Witt would (likely choose to) host, making Wooster the #1 seed. Of course, this all changes if either team loses any of their other remaining games.

Hiram holds a tie-breaker advantage over DePauw, so if they finish tied, the advantage goes to the Terriers and thus to the Scots.

Corrections to this appreciated, it's all from memory.

Current/updated league standings:
NCAC    Overall
Wittenberg    11-2    17-5
Wooster    10-3    19-3
Ohio Wesleyan    8-5    16-6
Wabash    8-5    16-6
DePauw    7-6    13-9
Denison    7-6    10-12
Hiram    6-7    13-9
Kenyon    3-10    9-13
Allegheny    3-10    5-17
Oberlin    2-11    7-15
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2012, 10:15:56 PM
Kenyon beat Oberlin so they're 4-9, 10-12 and Oberlin's  1-12, 6-16.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2012, 10:17:03 PM
OWU's GOT to be kicking themselves. They went almost 10 minutes while scoring just two points. Everyone has a bad game, but they did so well with Brady's poor first half it's inconceivable that they all went pancake flat in the second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2012, 10:23:02 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2012, 10:17:03 PM
OWU's GOT to be kicking themselves. They went almost 10 minutes while scoring just two points. Everyone has a bad game, but they did so well with Brady's poor first half it's inconceivable that they all went pancake flat in the second half.

Wooster got outhustled and outrebounded badly in the first half.  Steve Moore noted that OWU had 12 offensive rebounds in the first half and many of Wooster's shots were forced on the offensive end.

In the second half, Wooster's defense switched on every screen and rarely gave the Bishops an open shot.  In all fairness, Tim Brady looked like he was under the weather tonight?  ....as he even missed a free throw down the stretch that would have made the final score closer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 08, 2012, 10:26:53 PM
Thanks David.

Hiram has OWU (h) and Wittenberg (a) and Depauw has Wooster (a) and Witt (h). Both have Oberlin as the 3rd game. Since Hiram is currently one game behind Depauw - I wouldn't count on Hiram finishing ahead of Depauw. At best I could see them pulling even by getting a home win versus OWU and Depauw losing both "W" games. It's all speculation becuase they all look like tough games. But what if that happened - whats the next tiebreaker?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on February 08, 2012, 10:28:21 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2012, 10:15:56 PM
Kenyon beat Oberlin so they're 4-9, 10-12 and Oberlin's  1-12, 6-16.

So NCAC site is wrong, has this score reversed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 08, 2012, 10:33:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2012, 10:17:03 PM
OWU's GOT to be kicking themselves. They went almost 10 minutes while scoring just two points. Everyone has a bad game, but they did so well with Brady's poor first half it's inconceivable that they all went pancake flat in the second half.

Someone at OWU needs to teach those kids how to finish a ballgame.  This is the 2nd time in a week where OWU jumped out to a big lead only to choke it away in the 2nd half.  The Bishops jumped out to a big leat against Witt last Wednesday only to see themselves be outscored by 15 in the 2nd half to lose that game.  And again tonight, Wooster outscores them by 14 in the 2nd half to beat the Bishops.

Well, thanks to Wabash doing their part, that noose just got a little tighter around Witt's neck.  Wooster is only a game back and they're coming to Springfield with a chance to even the standings.  The more things change...  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 09, 2012, 07:02:24 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 21, 2008, 01:03:04 PM
I finally found the official tiebreakers:

1. Head-to-Head competition (NCAC contests only – no restrictions regarding number of games and sites).
2. Combined win-loss record with all teams above tied teams (restricted to "like" games – any team played twice; and single games played at the same location, either home or away).
3. Record versus individual opponents examined in descending order of standings (restricted to "like" games – any team played twice; and single games played at the same location, either home or away).
4. Coin toss.

IF THREE OR MORE TEAMS ARE TIED, the combined records of the teams
involved versus each other are totaled and rankings are listed according to
the winning percentage. The best percentage will be given the highest
seed. If two or more teams tie for the highest percentage, the lowest team
will be seeded. Once the lowest team is clearly seeded the remaining
teams repeat the process until the tie is broken. If three or more
percentages are arrived in initial process, and no ties remain, then teams
shall be seeded according to their percentages.

LIKE GAMES: Defined as: games that are played under the same
traveling condition (either home or away). E.G.: OWU and ALL are tied.
ALL plays DEN once—at DEN. OWU plays DEN twice—once home and
once at DEN. In comparing the two schedules, only compare the games
at DEN, throw out the DEN at OWU game. All teams played home &
home are also "like" games (teams that play each other twice).


This was the tiebreak procedure in 2008, and I assume that it hasn't changed.
So the analysis is based on Wooster winning on Saturday with both Wooster and Witt winning their final 2 to finish 13-3 in conference.

1) Wooster and Witt would split so this is a wash.
2) Nobody would finish ahead.
3) As noted by David earlier, if DePauw finishes ahead of Hiram then Witt wins the tiebreaker. If Hiram ends up ahead of DePauw then Wooster wins.  Of course, it might be possible that DePauw and Hiram could end up tied with OWU, Wabash or Denison - OR ALL OF THEM - and that would have to be sorted out first.
4) Heads or tails!  The winner of the flip gets a choice - do they want the #1 seed or do they want to host the tourney? That choice would almost certainly be to host.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 09, 2012, 09:27:37 AM
BIG RED WINNING WHEN THEY HAVE 2!!
BIG RED PEAKING WHEN THEY NEED 2!!!

Congrats on another HUGE win!!!!!! 

I am still saying you DO NOT WANT the Big Red in the first round!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 09, 2012, 09:38:47 AM
The Big Red is hot right now and will be a tough out in the first round.  I can see several "upsets" in the first round occurring.  Credit to Witt and Wooster on the season so far and on setting up another premier matchup in the NCAC.  It should be fun to watch.  And imagine what this league race would be if OWU had not blown huge leads to Witt and Wooster.  Agree with Scots fan about the Bishops learning to finish games.  That is the difference between a 3 way race for the championship and another Witt/Wooster showdown as the top 2.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 09, 2012, 09:50:53 AM
For the first time in years, I can see a #8 team with an outside chance of beating the #1 seed, especially if that #8 team is Kenyon. They have some tools and if they shoot well, look out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 09, 2012, 09:55:22 AM
Quote from: Wabash2011 on February 08, 2012, 10:28:21 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2012, 10:15:56 PM
Kenyon beat Oberlin so they're 4-9, 10-12 and Oberlin's  1-12, 6-16.

So NCAC site is wrong, has this score reversed.

d3hoops had it right. It was a good ol' fashioned tail kickin'.

http://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2011-12/boxscores/20120208_m5jc.xml
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 09, 2012, 10:51:31 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2012, 10:23:02 PM
In the second half, Wooster's defense switched on every screen and rarely gave the Bishops an open shot.  In all fairness, Tim Brady looked like he was under the weather tonight?  ....as he even missed a free throw down the stretch that would have made the final score closer.

Under the weather or not, Wooster's defense has to be given a lot of credit for the performance they turned in in the second half of last night's game.  Coach Moore had pointed out earlier in the week that they had been working hard in practice at moving their feet in trying to defend Brady in an effort to limit the numerous trips to the line he gets.  In the first meeting between these two teams, Brady had 10 points from the line.  Last night he had 2 points from the line and only 3 attempts!  As wsf noted, Wooster did a great job of switching defenders coming off of screens and this frustrated the Bishops offensively.

Now it's on to Witt.  I'm really intrigued by this rematch.  When they first met, it was less than a month into the season and only Wooster's 6th game.  IMO, this is a different team than the one that lost to Witt on that buzzer beater in Timken.  And it's not like the Scots can't win at the HPER.  Just as Witt seems to have pretty good success on Wooster's home floor, the Scots have won 5 of their last 7 games down in Springfield.  Should be another good chapter written in this rivalry on Saturday night!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 09, 2012, 10:58:52 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 09, 2012, 07:02:24 AM
This was the tiebreak procedure in 2008, and I assume that it hasn't changed.
So the analysis is based on Wooster winning on Saturday with both Wooster and Witt winning their final 2 to finish 13-3 in conference.

1) Wooster and Witt would split so this is a wash.
2) Nobody would finish ahead.
3) As noted by David earlier, if DePauw finishes ahead of Hiram then Witt wins the tiebreaker. If Hiram ends up ahead of DePauw then Wooster wins.  Of course, it might be possible that DePauw and Hiram could end up tied with OWU, Wabash or Denison - OR ALL OF THEM - and that would have to be sorted out first.
4) Heads or tails!  The winner of the flip gets a choice - do they want the #1 seed or do they want to host the tourney? That choice would almost certainly be to host.

Thanks for digging this stuff up again this year derek!  You seem to be the resident tie-breaker expert of the board!   8-)



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 09, 2012, 11:17:48 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 09, 2012, 10:58:52 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 09, 2012, 07:02:24 AM
This was the tiebreak procedure in 2008, and I assume that it hasn't changed.
So the analysis is based on Wooster winning on Saturday with both Wooster and Witt winning their final 2 to finish 13-3 in conference.

1) Wooster and Witt would split so this is a wash.
2) Nobody would finish ahead.
3) As noted by David earlier, if DePauw finishes ahead of Hiram then Witt wins the tiebreaker. If Hiram ends up ahead of DePauw then Wooster wins.  Of course, it might be possible that DePauw and Hiram could end up tied with OWU, Wabash or Denison - OR ALL OF THEM - and that would have to be sorted out first.
4) Heads or tails!  The winner of the flip gets a choice - do they want the #1 seed or do they want to host the tourney? That choice would almost certainly be to host.

Thanks for digging this stuff up again this year derek!  You seem to be the resident tie-breaker expert of the board!   8-)

Yeah, yeah, yeah.  But that other Poe would have utilized trochaic octameter in his post, and quoted ravens and stuff.  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nuscottsfan on February 09, 2012, 12:16:44 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 09, 2012, 10:51:31 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2012, 10:23:02 PM

Now it's on to Witt.  I'm really intrigued by this rematch.  When they first met, it was less than a month into the season and only Wooster's 6th game.  IMO, this is a different team than the one that lost to Witt on that buzzer beater in Timken.  And it's not like the Scots can't win at the HPER.
ScotsFan I agree. Being a stats hungry kind of guy I dug up what may be the stat of the season so far for Wooster:
Although the TO bug bit Wooster Saturday night (15) it went mostly unnoticed as the Assists were there (13). Last night was a juxtaposition with only 4 Assists but a season low 7 T/O's. This seems to be the key to Wooster's turnaround and current run. In their 3 losses this season Wooster had a .45 A/TO ratio. In their wins it is .98. Looks like they are maturing into the typically solid, unselfish basketball team usually seen playing at Timken this time of year. KUDOS to Coach Moore and his staff for getting the underclassmen to settle down and be solid contributors AND game changers game in and game out. It will be interesting to see if they can continue the A/TO trend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on February 09, 2012, 08:56:32 PM
Fellow NCAC followers and Wooster Fan - I'm baaaack! Those that may remember from a few years back. I am Wooster Alum, former Bissman resident and former Voice sports columnist and Voice football/baseball/basketball beat writer.

I have been busy the past few years deployed with the US Navy as a Command Master Chief of a ship. I am back on shore duty in Virginia (right around VA Wesleyan and C.Newport). Thanks to this site, I was able to follow commentary about the NCAC and the Scots even thought I could not post. Dave (hope you remember me) - I am also in the final research and writing stages for my dissertation!

Well, I am back and excited about the end of the NCAC season for the Scots and the whole NCAC. Can we get some ESPN or FoxSports love for the best Division III hoops rivalry Witt v. Woo? I know that Gameday broadcast is out of the question but with twitter and Facebook, I think we should lobby for game day mention for the game on Saturday.

It is good to be back and look forward to my posts about the Div III hoops in this area as well as beloved Scott!

Go Bengals!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 09, 2012, 09:44:13 PM
Well, welcome back!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 10, 2012, 07:04:03 AM
The latest from Matt Snyder has Witt, Woo, and Wabash getting into the national field (either as Pool A or Pool C teams), with OWU on the wrong side of the bubble.  From the first regional rankings, it appears that the NCAA is emphasizing strength-of-schedule more this year, and that would help the LG's; obviously, beating Witt on Wednesday night also improves their profile.
http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/2012/02/bracketology-292012.html#more (http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/2012/02/bracketology-292012.html#more)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 10, 2012, 07:58:24 AM
Should be an awesome atmosphere at Witt tomorrow. I'm hoping the Scots can pull out a win.

Welcome back WoosterFAN!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2012, 09:20:28 AM
Welcome back WoosterFAN!  Glad to have you back!   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 10, 2012, 01:41:42 PM
Well, there's no time like the present to talk about tomorrow's games. All impact the various races and seeding scenarios in some way, shape or form.

DePauw (7-6, 13-9) @ Oberlin (1-12, 6-16) - For both teams, the second half of the NCAC season has been an ordeal. Of course, there are different levels of ordeals. DPU is suffering from a loaded schedule which wearied them before losing to a Denison team that's playing very well. Oberlin, well, they're just not into it right now. Losing Josh Merritt for a time took the wind out of them. He did play Wednesday but was lackluster. Every Yeoman was lackluster Wednesday, though. The New Tigers get back to winning and break their four-out-of-five losing streak.

Denison (7-6, 10-12) @ Allegheny (3-10, 5-17) - The Big Red are flying high after their win over DPU Wednesday. Suddenly they're in the conversation about hosting an NCAC tourney game and making the final weekend of the tournament. This game could be a quintessential 'trap' though. The Gators are playing much better than they have been and have gotten great performances from a variety of players lately. If they beat Denison, 'Gheny is back in the mix for the final tournament spot AND they greatly hurt the Big Red's chances to make noise.

Wabash (8-5, 16-6) @ Kenyon (4-9, 10-12) - Of all the teams to play after the big win over the Old Tigers, it had to be the Lords. Kenyon has played Wabash quite tough in Gambier in recent years. This is a huge trap game for the Little Giants, and they'll need the focus on defense and rebounding that they showed Wednesday to breathe easy.

Ohio Wesleyan (8-5, 16-6) @ Hiram (6-7, 13-9) - Whatever was affecting Tim Brady Wednesday against Wooster needs to be just a one-game thing. The Terriers need this game to claw back into the 5-seed discussion, and OWU needs this to keep up with a chance for a 3-seed and possibly a "C" bid. Because of the regional rankings, there's a decent chance that the NCAC gets 2 "C" bids but Wabash and OWU need to keep playing well and beating the un-ranked teams. Hiram's not going to make it easy, though.

Wooster (10-3, 19-3) @ Wittenberg (11-2, 17-5) - After all of the drama and the emergence of Wabash and OWU as true title contenders, it again comes down to THIS game against THESE teams. You wonder why the NCAC just doesn't always make this as part of the last weekend of games. Anyway, Wooster and Witt have survived their rough stretches (sometimes just so...) and now face off in the game of the year. Can Witt bounce back from their egregious FT shooting at Wabash? Can Wooster carry over their hard work on defense that they put forward in the second half against OWU? I think this is a great game to grab some popcorn and beverages and hook your computer to your TV. That's why God made HDMI cables...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoostAr on February 10, 2012, 04:31:02 PM
Wooster website just posted a preview with some pretty detailed history on the rivalry.

http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/releases/20120210rtleh5
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2012, 05:24:47 PM
Welcome back to both Fan and stAr! Good luck with that dissertation, Fan!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 11, 2012, 11:11:15 AM
Tiger Up Witt!

Game will come down to a few things IMO, these are from a Wittenberg standpoint as I haven't watched Wooster once this year
1 - control the rebounding stats. This will work in a few ways, if Wittenberg allows Wooster second chances and opportunities, it could be a long evening, but the rebounding numbers will also tell who is hitting shots.
2-Wittenberg needs to hit a few outside shots as we know Clayton Black will get his points, but in their games they've struggled Witt has shot very poorly outside of him.

Should be a great atmosphere, I know the students will be rowdy and hopefully another festive atmosphere for the greatest rivalry in D3 sports.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2012, 12:57:44 PM
As per your point #2, Mr. Black got just five points and had only four rebounds against Wabash Wednesday. So Clayton "getting his points" isn't a given.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 11, 2012, 03:45:50 PM
Hiram 38, OWU 33 (half)
Oberlin 26, DePauw 25 (half)

If these potential upsets hold up, that could be good for Wooster (because of tiebreaker implications, if the Scots beat Witt tonight), but an OWU loss would be bad for the conference's hopes of getting three teams into the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2012, 03:52:26 PM
I don't think an OWU loss would be that bad if Wabash keeps winning. Hiram's not heinous. OWU and Wabash will have a lot of 'results' against regionally ranked teams.

Wabash leading Kenyon 39-20 at the half. Gambier not the house of 'fun' that it usually is for Wabash.

Denison is leading Allegheny 31-26 at half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 11, 2012, 03:56:07 PM
You're probably right ... since OWU is only 4th-best in the league as an NCAA contender, this may only be an issue if Wabash struggles.  On the other hand, if OWU and Wabash both finished strong (and perhaps one won the conference tournament), could there be 4 NCAC teams in the NCAAs?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2012, 04:01:08 PM
That'll be a tall order I think because of how the "C"'s are allocated. The Wabash / OWU game Wednesday may be a "C" elimination game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2012, 04:34:01 PM
Wabash cruises to a 79-51 win over Kenyon. Andy Walsh is nails again with 20 off the bench. Aaron Zinnerman and Pete Nicksic (filling in for Nick Curosh) had 14 and Derek Bailey added 13.

Ikenna Nwadibia led Kenyon with 17.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2012, 04:44:12 PM
OWU avoids the upset and beats Hiram on the road 79-73. Tim Brady was back to his old tricks with 26. Jamaal Watkins and Alan Sheppard led the Terriers with 18 each.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2012, 04:51:05 PM
Maybe someone's preview inspired Oberlin, or maybe DPU has run out of gas, but the Yeomen beat the New Tigers 49-48 so says the DePauw twitter. I can't get the Oberlin live stats right now so I don't know any more details.

The 'Gheny live stats is down, but I have the video. Unfortunately there's not a scoreboard on the feed and my audio on this computer is fritzed out.

***UPDATE - I think Denison won by the way they acted at the end of the game. Details should follow, perhaps.

Up to the minute standings:

Wittenberg        11-2
Wooster            10-3     
Ohio Wesleyan    9-5 
Wabash             9-5
Denison             8-6
DePauw             7-7 
Hiram                6-8
Kenyon             4-10   
Allegheny          3-11   
Oberlin              2-12 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 11, 2012, 05:09:33 PM
Big Red won by 3 or 4.  Live stats went out early in the second half and the announcing was horrible.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 11, 2012, 05:14:23 PM
And thank you Yeomen!  Great win - and without Merritt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2012, 06:01:43 PM
Andrew Fox hit a three with 2:39 to go. Barry Flynn countered with a deuce and with 35 seconds left the New Tigers had the ball and a chance to win. But Flynn missed a jumper with five seconds left and that was that.

Denison beat the Gators 68-65. Dimonde Hale led the Big Red with 13 and they had four other players with nine points. Allegheny was led by Devone McLeod with 21 and James Ness with 18.

Now the stage is set...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2012, 07:00:35 PM
I wonder if the New Tigers are having trouble adjusting to the switch from comfortable flights to exotic locales to long bus rides to nowhereville. They escaped Gambier with a one-point victory, played poorly on their trip to Meadville and Hiram, winning by 4 and losing by 16, and crapped out again today in Oberlin. And who knows, maybe they got on a bus and drove around town for 14 hours before the Denison game....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2012, 08:08:44 PM
At the Half:  Wittenberg 34  Wooster 18

Very ugly first half for Wooster including 1 of 7 on free throws.  Wittenberg outrebounded Wooster 23 to 17 in the half and also made 5 three pointers compared to only 1 for the Scots.  Wooster also had 7 turnovers including one very sloppy pass that led to an easy bucket for the Tigers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2012, 09:06:34 PM
Wooster 56  Wittenberg 56  Going to Overtime!  :)

Scots fought all the way back in the 2nd half and Xavier Brown nails a shot just outside the foul line at the horn!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2012, 09:14:06 PM
This OT is some of the most ultra-intense hoops I've seen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2012, 09:15:53 PM
BTW, put a beard on Clayton Black and he could be Fabricio Oberto.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2012, 09:20:25 PM
Final:  Wittenberg 68  Wooster 62 OT

Wooster lost this game at the free throw line where they only made 6 of 15 shots (only 40% ::))

Congratulations to Wittenberg on essentially clinching the NCAC regular season title with this win.

Leading scorers for Wittenberg were Michael Cooper with 14, Josh McKee with 13 and Clayton Black with 10.

Wooster was led by Xavier Brown with 24 points and Justin Hallowell with 12 points.

Wooster is now 19-3, 10-4 NCAC.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2012, 09:24:11 PM
Remember, children, freedom isn't free, and neither are free throws.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 11, 2012, 09:26:22 PM
Foots on the other hand for Witt, since their lack of FT prowess cost them dearly against Wabash Wednesday.

Up to the minute standings:

Wittenberg        12-2
Wooster            10-4     
Ohio Wesleyan    9-5
Wabash             9-5
Denison             8-6
DePauw             7-7
Hiram                6-8
Kenyon             4-10   
Allegheny          3-11   
Oberlin              2-12 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 11, 2012, 09:32:21 PM
While tonight, I think, reinforces that Xavier Brown is Wooster's best player and going to be a great one, the one player that Wooster's fortunes seem to most revolve around are Hallowell. In their four losses he is 12-of-44 from the field (27%) and 5-24 (21%) from three in their four losses. That's compared to 49% from the field and 42% from three-point range in all Wooster's wins. And it looks like Claytor might be hitting a wall at the wrong time of the year. After scoring nine points in 11 out of 12 games, he has only broke that mark once in the last five games. In two games against Witt, he is now 2-of-8 for four points in 52 minutes.

Witt's deep senior class is paying off this year. Of course the year they get to host, the team they will play in the semifinals is probably the strongest any #1 seed has seen in a long time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wabash2011 on February 12, 2012, 12:17:48 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 11, 2012, 04:34:01 PM
Wabash cruises to a 79-51 win over Kenyon. Andy Walsh is nails again with 20 off the bench. Aaron Zinnerman and Pete Nicksic (filling in for Nick Curosh) had 14 and Derek Bailey added 13.

Ikenna Nwadibia led Kenyon with 17.

Not a game changer to tonight's game.....but a Top 10 candidate for d3hoops for this evening.  Aaron Zinnerman with shot clock at zippo....

http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=vCERV2JqL20
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 12, 2012, 08:08:09 AM
Xavier Brown's shot to send it to OT is on the buzzer-beaters page...
http://www.d3hoops.com/buzzerbeaters/2011-12/index (http://www.d3hoops.com/buzzerbeaters/2011-12/index)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 12, 2012, 10:11:33 AM
DING DING DING!!!!!
That's the sound of the BIG RED BAND WAGON pulling in!!!

You may just want to jump on!!! 

Congrats on yet another VICTORY!!!!!!

A quick look at the stats and the of the 12 losses....11 of them are by a TOTAL of 55 points!!!!!

Give me 5 of the 11 and the Big Red is 16-7!!!!!!! 

Our last two wins Hale has sub-par games and yet we find a way to win!!!  How long will that dog stay on the leash??????  I'm thinkin NOT LONG!!!

And then you have Farmer AKA "Windex"...........no one cleans the glass better!!!!! :-)

I am sure there are those fans who want to blame the coaching staff for these close losses.................last time I checked not one coach has taken a single free throw ALL YEAR!!!  Yet the team has missed 147!!!!!!  Do the math!!!

Regardless.......the Big Red is playing some good basketball when they need too!!!

Get on the WAGON NOW....it may be a crazy ride to the end!!!

GO BIG RED!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 12, 2012, 10:13:52 AM
Congrats to Witt on a well earned win last night and essentially sewing up the regular season NCAC championship and breaking up Wooster's 7 year reign on the conference championship. 

I really thought this game was Wooster's to win when Brown hit that shot at the buzzer to send it to OT.  Wooster had ALL the momentum on their side climbing all the way back from a 16 point hole.  But to Witt's credit, they didn't let that affect them in OT as they came out and did what they had to do to get the job done and pull out the 6 point win in OT.  As seinfeld noted, Witt's senior leadership really showed through BIG TIME in that extra session!

I don't know what Wooster's problem has been over the last couple of games, but this is the 2nd game in a row where Wooster has struggled coming out of the gates.  They were down by as many as 15 to OWU in the opening half before going into halftime down 10 and last night, the deficit at the half was even larger.  It would be nice to see Wooster come out from the opening tip with the kind of intensity we saw on both ends of the floor in the 2nd half of their last two games which resulted in coming back for a big win vs. OWU and nearly pulling off a Williams-esque come back last night.

So, Wooster's streak is now over.  I don't think we'll see a run like that again in this conference, especially seeing how competitive things were in the conference this year so props to the Scots for such an impressive run. 

BTW, this was the first season sweep Witt has completed over Wooster in 8 years.  Coincidentally, that was the last time Wooster didn't win the NCAC regular season title.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2012, 10:45:02 AM
It's nice to see Denison pumped up for their team. I wish we had some OWU posters. We have some good OWU football posters despite their football issues.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2012, 12:32:52 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 12, 2012, 10:13:52 AM
I don't know what Wooster's problem has been over the last couple of games, but this is the 2nd game in a row where Wooster has struggled coming out of the gates.

It goes back further than that. Just a few that immediately pop to mind: both games in Salem last year and that accursed Albion tournament game. This seems to be a Wooster meme.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2012, 01:12:34 PM
http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab-the-dagger-college-basketball-blog/division-iii-guard-sinks-no-look-over-head-153353267.html;_ylt=A2KLOzIe.TdPoScAwX1NbK5_

Zinnerman's shot!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 12, 2012, 03:56:05 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on February 12, 2012, 10:11:33 AM
I am sure there are those fans who want to blame the coaching staff for these close losses.................last time I checked not one coach has taken a single free throw ALL YEAR!!!  Yet the team has missed 147!!!!!!  Do the math!!!

Regardless.......the Big Red is playing some good basketball when they need too!!!

Get on the WAGON NOW....it may be a crazy ride to the end!!!

GO BIG RED!!!

BigRedFan,

I love your enthusiasm for the team and I'm on the BRBW with you.  They're playing good ball and finishing games better.  So while things are going well, I'll promise not to focus on the coaching.  It looks like the Big Red have a reasonable shot at hosting a first round NCAC game, and that's fantastic. 

I hate the fact that the Big Red have left 147 FT's at the line, but I did some math, and I don't think the free throws have really been that much of a factor.  Denison is shooting 67.0% from the line – certainly not good by any measure.  Hiram has the best FT% at 78.3% and Wabash is next best at 73.8%.  What would have changed if the Big Red had shot 75% in each game they lost?  We would have scored 27 more points, but the only outcomes that would have changed would have been the Kenyon and Washington & Jefferson losses.  And those two games are the only ones where it could be argued that missed FT's at the end might have been a factor in the outcome.

Now compare us to Wittenberg.  They have left 155 FT's at the line and are just slightly better than the Big Red at 67.7% from the line as a team.  Meanwhile, the Big Red have outshot Witt from both the field and from 3-pt range and have averaged more PPG for the season.  So how does Witt end up on top of the conference and with an 18-5 record?  The right players do the right things more often than not, which is what Denison has been doing of late.

Keep going BIG RED!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 12, 2012, 05:33:07 PM
big games for the big red this week. Would love to see them sweep. That Ohio Wesleyan game should be a good one. Is there a more Jackel and Hyde team this year then the big red though? Go Big Red.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2012, 06:03:15 PM
DePauw has beaten Wooster and Wabash and lost to Oberlin; tough to be much more Jekyll-Hydian than that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 12, 2012, 08:44:29 PM
When discussing missed free throws, it's important to remember that when the front end of a 1-and-1 is missed, so is a two-point scoring opportunity, even though that never-taken second shot isn't in the stats.  This has happened numerous times to Wooster this season, and it's cost them big time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 13, 2012, 12:57:13 PM
Matt Snyder's latest update has Wooster still solidly in (as the #8 Pool C team overall, and the first one in the GL region), Wabash as one of the last teams in, and OWU as one of the first teams out.  As others have said, the loser of Wabash-OWU may have to win the conference tournament to get in, while the winner would have a decent shot at a Pool C.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 13, 2012, 07:52:17 PM
dave, sorry for not following the ncac as close this year as the past. Work hasn't allowed me to know all the goings on or too watch as many games as in the past.. Losing too Oberlin, ouch. As for missed free throws I have noticed this year that the problem has crept down in division. It used to be that only in d1 did you consistently see poor free throw shooting. My Ohio Bobcats are a prime example of mastering the fine art of not just missing the shot but the entire basket. However it is amazing just how many teams now are having similar problems in d3. I know this is a ncac board but if you were too catch Otterbein games they have had a terrible  problem shooting ft's. The two losses to Capital were caused directly by their inability to make them. I am surprised their %'s especially those of  Chris Davis are as high as they are. This used to be a problem with d1 I used to write off because nobody bothered practicing anything but dunks there. Unfortunately that is no longer true.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2012, 06:28:48 AM
New poll: (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/index)
Wooster takes a hard fall to #22
Wittenberg gets a small boost up to #21
Wabash gain a few to 4 votes
OWU is AWOL

DePauw maintains a solid #4; the three ahead of them refuse to lose.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2012, 08:27:40 PM
There's some good games on tap tomorrow:

Oberlin (2-12, 7-16) @ Hiram (6-8, 13-10) - Well, I'm not totally writing off the Yeomen again after they upset DePauw last week but they are facing a Hiram squad that needs the win. The Terriers have been mercurial lately and need a win to gear up for the tourney and hopefully be in the conversation for the five or six seed.

Kenyon (4-10, 10-13) @ Denison (8-6, 11-12) - The Big Red have really charged up their fans of late and can sneak away with a four seed if OWU co-operates (by losing). The Lords' performance on Saturday was dismal, really, and they could be in danger of missing the tourney. Denison probably takes care of business, but they'll need to contain Brian Liebowitz much like Wabash did Saturday.

Allegheny (3-11, 5-18) @ Wooster (10-4, 19-4) - Normally I would pretty much write off this game as a win for the Scots, but then there was the Oberlin / DPU game which taught me a big time lesson. Never write off ANY team, especially in this year's NCAC. Realistically, though, unless the Scots are still mourning their loss on Saturday (with ashes and sackcloth perhaps and three of their closest friends to say how bad they screwed up), they should come away with the win.

Wittenberg (12-2, 18-5) @ DePauw (7-7, 13-10) - Just a couple weeks earlier, this had the hallmarks of a very important contest in the top of the NCAC. Now it's a trap game for the Old Tigers after their big win, and the New Tigers need a win or they may have trouble hanging on to the #6 seed much less trying for the #5. What a difference a couple of weeks makes.

Ohio Wesleyan (9-5, 17-6) @ Wabash (9-5, 17-6) - The game of the week in the NCAC. This probably decides the #3 seed and the loser will have to fight off Denison for the #4. Wabash has found another offensive threat in Andy Walsh off the bench and that's given the Little Giants a spark. Ohio Wesleyan needs a good game from Tim Brady and needs a good all-around defensive game.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 15, 2012, 09:17:34 AM
I'm too lazy to look it up, but if DU wins and OWU loses, who holds the tie-breaker for that 4 seed? 

With the addition of DePauw to the conference this season, who would have thought Denison would be competing for a 4 seed in the NCAC tournament? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2012, 09:40:32 AM
OWU swept DPU so they have the tiebreaker.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 15, 2012, 10:50:57 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 15, 2012, 09:40:32 AM
OWU swept DPU so they have the tiebreaker.

Sorry for the mixup but my DU was for Denison University, not DePauw University. 

I see that Denison and OWU play in the final game of the season in Delaware and that game could be for the four seed.  If both DU and OWU win on Wednesday and DU happens to beat OWU on Saturday, then I believe the 4 seed would go to a tie-breaker and I don't know who would come out on top of that given that DU and OWU would have split their head to head match-ups.  If OWU loses their last 2 games and DU wins out, DU is the 4 seed...  I think.  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2012, 11:15:23 AM
My bad, I think DePauw every time I see DU.

But it would be a three way tie if OWU beats Wabash, Wabash beats Oberlin and Denison wins out.

Here's the tie breaker as Derek posted earlier:

1. Head-to-Head competition (NCAC contests only – no restrictions regarding number of games and sites).
2. Combined win-loss record with all teams above tied teams (restricted to "like" games – any team played twice; and single games played at the same location, either home or away).
3. Record versus individual opponents examined in descending order of standings (restricted to "like" games – any team played twice; and single games played at the same location, either home or away).
4. Coin toss.

In a three way tie, Wabash would lose tiebreaker #1 in that scenario since they'd be 1-3 head to head (OWU would have swept Wabash if they win Wednesday)

Going to #2, it's record vs. Wooster and Witt. Denison 0-2, OWU 0-4. No matter how you slice it, it's the same.

Going to #3 - going in reverse, both teams beat Gheny and Oberlin. OWU played Kenyon just once, at home. The 'like game' is Wednesday, so the Denison loss at Kenyon is thrown out. Both Denison and OWU swept Hiram. The tiebreaker is broken by DPU. OWU swept DPU while Denison went 1-1.

Then I believe Denison and Wabash would be paired up, and Wabash's win over Witt trumps Denison.

So if it's a three-way tie, OWU is #3, Wabash #4, Denison #5.

Denison should root for a Wabash win over OWU to set up the showdown (providing it beats Kenyon).

Please, correct me if I'm wrong...


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 15, 2012, 01:39:15 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 15, 2012, 11:15:23 AM
My bad, I think DePauw every time I see DU.

But it would be a three way tie if OWU beats Wabash, Wabash beats Oberlin and Denison wins out.

Here's the tie breaker as Derek posted earlier:

1. Head-to-Head competition (NCAC contests only – no restrictions regarding number of games and sites).
2. Combined win-loss record with all teams above tied teams (restricted to "like" games – any team played twice; and single games played at the same location, either home or away).
3. Record versus individual opponents examined in descending order of standings (restricted to "like" games – any team played twice; and single games played at the same location, either home or away).
4. Coin toss.

In a three way tie, Wabash would lose tiebreaker #1 in that scenario since they'd be 1-3 head to head (OWU would have swept Wabash if they win Wednesday)

Going to #2, it's record vs. Wooster and Witt. Denison 0-2, OWU 0-4. No matter how you slice it, it's the same.

Going to #3 - going in reverse, both teams beat Gheny and Oberlin. OWU played Kenyon just once, at home. The 'like game' is Wednesday, so the Denison loss at Kenyon is thrown out. Both Denison and OWU swept Hiram. The tiebreaker is broken by DPU. OWU swept DPU while Denison went 1-1.

Then I believe Denison and Wabash would be paired up, and Wabash's win over Witt trumps Denison.

So if it's a three-way tie, OWU is #3, Wabash #4, Denison #5.

Denison should root for a Wabash win over OWU to set up the showdown (providing it beats Kenyon).

Please, correct me if I'm wrong...

Thanks for figuring all that out.  Just reading it gives me a headache so I can imagine what trying to figure it all out would have done...  :P

I had a feeling that a 3-way tie for 3rd was possible...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2012, 05:44:11 PM
I am wrong.

Wabash gets eliminated first in the three way tie scenario, but DENISON would have swept OWU and beaten Wabash once, thus a 3-1 record. Wabash would be 1-3 and OWU 2-2.

Then it would be an OWU / Wabash face-off four #4 and #5. And then I think Wabash wins the #4 based on their win over Witt. No, idiot, OWU wins that because of the season series sweep.

Hat tip to Wally Wabash on that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2012, 08:07:11 PM
OWU leads Wabash at the half 32-22. Wabash shooting poorly and losing the battle on the boards.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2012, 08:44:06 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 43  Allegheny 35

Wooster started slow again, trailed by 8 points early, and then rallied to take the lead.  Wooster is being led by Justin Hallowell with 14 points (4 three pointers), Doug Thorpe with 11 (3 three pointers) and Josh Claytor with 8.

Allegheny is being led by James Ness with 10 points and Devone McLeod with 10 points.

Scots made 8 of 13 three point shots in the half while the Gators were 4 of 12 from behind the arc.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2012, 09:06:49 PM
Congratulations to Wooster's Justin Hallowell who is now the NCAC leader in career three point shots made with 283...and still counting!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2012, 09:19:23 PM
Wabash and OWU now in OT. Kasey Oetting fired a three (after rebounding his own three that was blocked right back at him) with 5.8 seconds left to tie. The game is getting a bit chippy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2012, 09:31:37 PM
And now we go to DOUBLE OT! OWU and Wabash tied at 73.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2012, 09:34:32 PM
Final:  Wooster 91  Allegheny 61  :)

Wooster was led by Justin Hallowell with 28 points (8 three pointers), Xavier Brown with 13, Doug Thorpe with 11 and Josh Claytor with 10.

Allegheny's top scorers were Devone McLeod with 19 points, James Ness with 14 and Ryan Stanko with 10.

Wooster is now 20-4, 11-4 NCAC.  Next game is at home vs. DePauw on Saturday afternoon.


 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2012, 09:40:52 PM

Congratulations to Wooster on another 20 win season - now 16 consecutive seasons with 20 or more wins!

...and Wooster has been to the NCAA Final Four three times in the last 9 years!  It is great to be a Wooster Fan. :)

Special Thanks to Wooster Coaches Steve Moore and Doug Cline for their leadership of this top program!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 15, 2012, 09:45:39 PM
Wabash misses the last of 3 FTs with 1.2 seconds left in the second OT, to fall, 82-81.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2012, 09:48:46 PM
Heartbreak City at Wabash. As fantastic50 said, Jordan Surenkamp missed the final free throw of a three-shot opportunity as OWU outlasts Wabash 82-81.

OWU shot 42 free throws, and Wabash had three players foul out and two with four. OWU hurt their cause by not hitting foul shots. Tim Brady let the Bishops with 27. Derek Bailey led Wabash with 23.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2012, 09:52:15 PM
Final: Wittenberg 56  DePauw 55

Congratulations to the Wittenberg Tigers on their NCAC conference title!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2012, 09:55:51 PM
Wittenberg performs a great escape, beating DPU 56-55. The New Tigers had a chance after a Josh McKee turnover with 22 seconds left, but Sean Haseley missed a three and the Old Tigers escape Indiana with a win.

Michael Cooper likes rare beef (old school callback) and led Witt with 22. Barry Flynn led DPU with 13.

+++++++++++

Denison has no problem with Kenyon, winning 73-55. Fifteens were the number, as Dimonde Hale, Barry Liebowitz and Ikenna Nwadibia each had 15. Even though only the former was a Big Red player, they had enough balance for the win.


++++++++++++

Hiram beat Oberlin 77-66, despite Andrew Fox going off for 30 points. Jamaal Watkins, though, had 29 for the Terriers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 15, 2012, 09:57:20 PM
As already noted, Wittenberg holds off Depauw 56-55. Finally the NCAC title returns to Wittenberg! Michael Cooper goes for 22 points and makes six 3-pointers. Overall a rather sloppy game as Depauw jumped on Witt early with 9 first half turnovers by Witt but a senior-laden team once again comes through.

Hopefully a big crowd Saturday to wish off the seniors and keep the momentum running into next week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2012, 09:58:43 PM
Standings:

Wittenberg    13-2
Wooster        11-4
OWU            10-5
Wabash          9-6
Denison          9-6
Hiram             7-8
DePauw          7-8
Kenyon          4-11
Allegheny       3-12
Oberlin           2-13

I believe Wabash holds the tiebreaker over Denison due to their win over Witt.
Hiram holds the tiebreaker over DPU since Hiram beat the New Tigers in their only meeting.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2012, 10:03:20 PM
And I think I'm wrong, yet again. Since OWU swept Wabash, they would win the tiebreaker over Wabash. Denison would win the three way tie since they went 3-1 vs. Wabash and OWU. Yikes, I didn't know you needed my advanced calculus for the tiebreakers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 15, 2012, 10:08:59 PM
must have been an engineer who came up with that formula. Only they could construct such a system.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 15, 2012, 10:21:02 PM
DePauw could play at Wooster twice in four days ... potentially a lot of travel for the New Tigers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2012, 10:38:15 PM
Oh, and I missed this, but Andy Walsh of Wabash was the NCAC POW for his three-point marksmanship off the bench last week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 16, 2012, 08:00:33 AM
Sounds like two great games with Witt beating DePauw by 1 and OWU over Wabash by 1 in 2OT.   Congrats to the Tigers on their NCAC championship and breaking the Wooster dominance.  Amazing 7 year streak by the Scots!  Wabash' loss seems to drop them from Pool C consideration so the LG's need to win the tournament to get the automatic bid and play in the NCAA Tournament.  Denison beat OWU once, can they do it again and ruin the Bishops Pool C chances?  DePauw and Wooster play on Saturday and probably again on Tuesday at Wooster.  The first round of the NCAC tourney could be BRUTAL for the 1-4 seeds with the parity in the league this year! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2012, 09:56:57 AM
I got a note from the Wabash SID saying that the new interpretation would be that they would only look at games where each team played another twice, so Denison is ahead of Wabash thanks to OWU's sweep of Wabash.

At any rate, here is my look at tourney seeds:

1. Witt
2. Wooster
3. Denison or OWU
4. Denison, OWU, or Wabash
5. Denison, Wabash
6. Hiram, DPU
7. Hiram, DPU
8. Kenyon, Allegheny

If Wabash loses to Oberlin they are locked in fifth.
If OWU wins and Wabash wins, they are third, Wabash fourth and Denison fifth.
If Wabash wins, and Denison beats OWU, Denison is third, OWU fourth and Wabash fifth.
If DePauw wins and Hiram loses, DPU is 6th. Otherwise Hiram is 6th and DPU is 7th.
If Allegheny beats Kenyon, I think Allegheny is 8th. Both teams beat Denison once. Allegheny's next best win is Hiram. Kenyon's best wins are two over Oberlin.

Of course, I could be wrong.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 16, 2012, 11:05:05 AM
Wow.  Couple of surprises as we head closer to the conference tournament.  First, the fact that Denison could garner a 3 seed when it's all said and done?  That's quite amazing that they could sneak into that three seed after all the talk about how strong the top 4 were this season along with the addition of a 5th in DePauw!  Kudos to Coach Ghiloni on a pretty remarkable job in Granville this season.  He'd get my vote for coach of the year hands down this year!

The other surprise is at the bottom of the standings and the fact that Allegheny actually has a chance to get into the NCAC tournament as an 8 seed.  Might not sound all that impressive, but I don't think anyone thought the Gators would be even remotely competitive this year with the losses they suffered a year ago.  I certainly didn't have Allegheny in and Kenyon staying home, but given the way those two teams have been playing lately, I would not be surprised to see Allegheny knock off the struggling Lords and bring Kenyon's season to an end on Saturday.

Other than that, this is shaping up to be one entertaining NCAC tournament.  Looking at Wooster's possible first round opponents, having to pick between DPU and Hiram, I'd take Hiram in a heartbeat, but I don't see Wooster losing to DPU at home on Senior Day so it looks as though DPU will have the unenvialble task of making the 5+ hour bus ride from Greencastle to Wooster twice in 3 days!  Hope they have a comfy bus!   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 16, 2012, 12:10:26 PM
Congrats on ANOTHER Big Red VICTORY!!!

Setting up a crazy last weekend.

I think those early losses to Kenyon and Allegheny could end up biting them in the butt......

It won't be easy to beat OWU at OWU but never say never!!!!

Regardless they have put together a great run to put themselves in position!!!!

GO BIG RED!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 16, 2012, 05:27:08 PM
With all the seeding possibilities still alive, it proves why I dont like unbalanced schedules in league play.  The NCAC not playing a true round-robin format gives some teams a big scheduling advantage.  Looking only at the top 5 teams, Denison could end up with a 3rd seed because of playing a much easier schedule than Wabash or Ohio Wesleyan.   Look at how the unbalanced schedule can have a dramatic impact on the standings.   
Toughest to easiest of the top 5:
Ohio Wesleyan - OWU played Kenyon and Oberlin once each (combined league record of 6-24).   I am sure the Bishops would gladly take away a game with Witt and one with Wooster in exchange for another game each vs Kenyon and Oberlin.
Wooster - Scots play Oberlin and Denison once each (combined league record of 11-19).   
Wabash - The 'Bash played Allegheny and Hiram once each (combined record of 12-20).
Wittenberg -  Witt plays Kenyon and Denison once each (combined record of 13-17).
Denison - The Big Red only played Wittenberg and Wooster once each (combined league record of 24-6).   I am sure the Big Red is happy to play two games vs Kenyon and Oberlin and only one vs Witt and Wabash.

Unbalanced scheduling can give a potential 7 seed a 3 seed.   Curious to hear others thoughts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 16, 2012, 07:37:09 PM
Quote from: WAlum on February 16, 2012, 05:27:08 PM
With all the seeding possibilities still alive, it proves why I dont like unbalanced schedules in league play.  The NCAC not playing a true round-robin format gives some teams a big scheduling advantage.  Looking only at the top 5 teams, Denison could end up with a 3rd seed because of playing a much easier schedule than Wabash or Ohio Wesleyan.   Look at how the unbalanced schedule can have a dramatic impact on the standings.   
Toughest to easiest of the top 5:
Ohio Wesleyan - OWU played Kenyon and Oberlin once each (combined league record of 6-24).   I am sure the Bishops would gladly take away a game with Witt and one with Wooster in exchange for another game each vs Kenyon and Oberlin.
Wooster - Scots play Oberlin and Denison once each (combined league record of 11-19).   
Wabash - The 'Bash played Allegheny and Hiram once each (combined record of 12-20).
Wittenberg -  Witt plays Kenyon and Denison once each (combined record of 13-17).
Denison - The Big Red only played Wittenberg and Wooster once each (combined league record of 24-6).   I am sure the Big Red is happy to play two games vs Kenyon and Oberlin and only one vs Witt and Wabash.

Unbalanced scheduling can give a potential 7 seed a 3 seed.   Curious to hear others thoughts.

I completely agree with your sentiment that the unbalanced schedule creates the potential for unfairness, and this year is really exposing it. Nothing is a bigger joke than the NCAC football schedule, but there is no reason why the NCAC doesn't play a double round-robin in basketball. The OAC has been doing it for years. With 25 regular season games, 18 conference games still leaves seven non-conference games, which is plenty. I know there is more travel for the teams on the eastern and western edges of the NCAC than the OAC, but it can be made to work. If my memory serves me correctly, I believe the NCAC is having this discussion right now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2012, 08:08:56 PM
Well, football will be fixed after 2012 to a full round-robin.

But I don't think Denison is a 'potential' 7-seed. That's reputation and not this team this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2012, 09:40:36 PM
BTW, Denison's strength of schedule according to Massey (ranked 74) is better than DePauw's.

The issue was the Denison under-achieved earlier in the year. They had the talent and had leads but kept blowing games. I think the Big Red are finally playing like many thought they could. And really, there's no complaining about schedule - you play the games you have in front of you. In almost every Little Giants loss, you can definitely make a case that they should have won (the one big exception is the game at Wooster...)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 16, 2012, 10:19:11 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 16, 2012, 11:05:05 AM
Other than that, this is shaping up to be one entertaining NCAC tournament.  Looking at Wooster's possible first round opponents, having to pick between DPU and Hiram, I'd take Hiram in a heartbeat, but I don't see Wooster losing to DPU at home on Senior Day so it looks as though DPU will have the unenvialble task of making the 5+ hour bus ride from Greencastle to Wooster twice in 3 days!  Hope they have a comfy bus!   8-)

I can add another piece of motivation for the Senior Scots - a chance to win their 100th game. It would make a very special evening even more so. If successful it would be the 10th straight Senior class to achieve this mark. Note - I'm conceding that less than half of those seniors played in 100 wins - (Kyle Witucky's wins 109 will probalby never be matched), but I look at it as being part of the program.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 17, 2012, 10:20:18 AM
Well, this is it. The last regular season NCAC games of the year. Two of these teams won't be playing after Saturday.

Wabash (9-6, 17-7) @ Oberlin (2-13, 7-17) - Oberlin is one of those teams that will not be moving along. They've had a rough go of late, and with Josh Merritt basically out and only Andrew Fox stepping up. The Little Giants are bitterly disappointed with their loss, and now need help to host a first round NCAC game. You would think the Little Giants would close out strong and I think Oberlin's upset of DPU last weekend will send the message to Wabash that they can't just coast through this one.

DePauw (7-8, 13-11) @ Wooster (11-4, 20-4) - The New Tigers' season looked so promising a month ago but the realities of this version of the NCAC has hit home. The Scots are resigned to the second seed of the tourney but definitely want to keep their momentum strong entering the tournament. These two teams will probably meet on Tuesday in the first round right back at Wooster (unless DPU pulls an upset Saturday) and Wooster. I hope DPU's players get frequent bus miles.

Hiram (7-8, 14-10) @ Wittenberg (13-2, 19-5) - A revenge game for the Old Tigers, as the Terriers beat them back in January. Hiram can clinch the #6 seed and avoid Wooster in the first round with a win (or can back into it with a DPU loss) and that could give them motivation besides sweeping the NCAC champ. Wittenberg can't get caught looking ahead, but I don't think they will.

Kenyon (4-11, 10-14) @ Allegheny (3-12, 5-19) - The second biggest game of the final weekend is a battle for the #8 seed. Yawn? Well, not this year. The Lords have caught what Denison had early in the season - underachievement. They should, on paper, have no trouble with the Gators. Yet, here they are and if the Gators win, my calculation is that Allegheny goes to Wittenberg on Tuesday. That would be a bitter ending to a Kenyon season that seemed promising in the outset.

Denison (9-6, 12-12) @ Ohio Wesleyan (10-5, 18-6) - If I have calculated the tiebreakers correctly, the winner gets the #3 seed. Denison would fall to #5 with a loss and OWU would only fall to #4. This will be a whale of a game too. Denison is finally playing to their potential, and while there are quibbles about them only playing Wooster and Witt once - they are a legit team that has finally peaked. OWU has been up and down but the huge win at Wabash Wednesday has to give them some confidence. One troubling item is that recently, against Wooster and Wabash, Tim Brady sat out a lot of the first half due to fouls and the Bishops built a lead, only to surrender it when Brady was back on the floor in the second half. That's not dogging Brady - that may be due to the reliance on Brady that OWU has when he's on the floor. I think most NCAC fans will be glued to this game Saturday.






Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldtiger on February 18, 2012, 10:38:55 AM
Article on Witt's McKee and Cooper careers winding down:

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/springfield-oh-sports/wittenberg-university-tigers/cooper-and-mckee-a-wittenberg-success-story-1330497.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 18, 2012, 02:45:42 PM
When you shoot 9-44, you're not going to win. Oberlin shot 9-44 and lost to Wabash 69-32. It was a total dismantling by the Little Giants.

Josh Merritt scored half of the Yeomen's points with 16. Kasey Oetting led Wabash with 12 points and 11 rebounds. No Wabash player played more than 23 minutes. Colten Craigin had a career high of nine points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 18, 2012, 03:58:20 PM
Good news for Wabash fans - OWU leads 39-35 at the half.

Tim Brady has 15 at the half to leave the Bishops. Dimonde Hale has 13 for the Big Red.

Other scores:

Wooster leads DPU 33-28 at the half.

Allegheny is all over Kenyon 38-24 at the half. Wow. And that's despite Ikenna Nwadibia's 15 points.

Nwadibia is 5-6 from the floor and the line. The rest of the Lords? 4-22 from the floor and 0-4 from the line. Ulp.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 18, 2012, 04:59:53 PM
OWU clinches the third seed with an 83-77 win over Denison. Tim Brady scored 32 points for the Bishops, who will be the #3 seed. Dimonde Hale led the Big Red with 21, and they'll travel to Wabash as the #5 seed.


Kenyon trailed 40-24 early in the second half, and then stormed back to win 67-64 and clinch the #8 seed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 18, 2012, 05:32:11 PM
Wittenberg beat Hiram 72-50. The Old Tigers played pert near everyone with Alex Brandt and Scott Masin leading them with 12. Hiram was led by Aaron Stefanov with 13.

Wooster also won, beating DePauw 74-67. Surprised the Wooster contingent hasn't chimed in, so I'll wait for them to recap.

Final Standings:

Wittenberg 14-2
Wooster     12-4
OWU          11-5
Wabash      10-6
Denison       9-7
Hiram          7-9 *
DePauw       7-9
Kenyon       5-11
Allegheny    3-13
Oberlin        2-14

Hiram gets the #6 seed because of they beat DPU head to head.

Tourney matchup:

Kenyon @ Wittenberg
DePauw @ Wooster
Hiram @ OWU
Denison @ Wabash
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 18, 2012, 07:38:57 PM
Final:  Wooster 74  DePauw 67 :)

Back from Wooster where I watched a very gritty performance by the DePauw Tigers today as they shot 52% from the floor and still lost this close game.  It was a 2 point game with less than 2 minutes left when Wooster senior Matt Fegan hit a clutch 3 pointer to give the Scots a 5 point lead that DePauw could not overcome.

Wooster was led by senior Justin Hallowell with 22 points, Josh Claytor with 12, Xavier Brown with 11 and Evan Pannell with 10.

Barry Flynn had a great game for DePauw with 23 points, 8 boards.  Sean Haseley added 12 points and Kevin Sullivan had 10.

Wooster won this game because they had only 8 turnovers compared to 11 for DePauw.  Scots also made 8 three pointers while the Tigers only nailed 5.

Wooster is now 21-4.  Next game is DePauw again on Tuesday night.  Always tough to beat a team again in less than a week though the Scots will have the home court advantage.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 19, 2012, 10:18:29 AM
Denison at OWU was a great game.  All around very evenly played, with the one big difference being the Big Red's inability to stop Brady.  He was just outstanding and not to be denied one more opportunity to play in front of the home crowd

Congrats to the Big Red on the late season run to get the #5.  The rubber match with the LG's should be a great one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2012, 01:51:01 PM
Here's a look at the first round of the NCAC Tournament:

Kenyon (5-11, 11-14) @ Wittenberg (14-2, 20-5) - The Lords gave the Old Tigers a bit of a scare in their only meeting, falling 71-63 on January 11th. Kenyon had a lead with 10 minutes to go but Wittenberg eased past the Lords. That was an eternity ago, when the Lords were playing pretty well and the Old Tigers were just starting their finishing surge. Now, of course, Witt's the champs and Kenyon almost missed the tourney. It's not a good sign when you need a furious comeback to beat a 5-20 team to qualify for the post season. Witt should breeze past Kenyon, but I wouldn't be shocked if the Lords kept it somewhat close.

DePauw (7-9, 13-12) @ Wooster (12-4, 21-4) - Something about this match-up seems familiar. Oh, yeah, they just played Saturday and the Scots salvaged a season split with a win. The New Tigers have fallen on hard times, losing seven of eight after reaching the halfway point of the conference season 6-2. Four of those losses were by four points or less, including two squeakers to Witt. Still, you think that DPU's confidence is at low tide, and that Wooster should repeat it's Saturday performance. Of course, there's much more at stake here and the New Tigers can erase the memories of their swoon with a huge upset.

Hiram (7-9, 14-11) @ Ohio Wesleyan (11-5, 19-6) - The Bishops swept the Terriers during the regular season, with Tim Brady being the focal point (as always). Hiram's style of play can lead it to glory, but they are susceptible to runs and funks during the game and a team with some success in controlling the tempo will have success. OWU should move on to the weekend, yet the Bishops have also had moments where they disappear and need to avoid a long stretch of offensive invisibility.

Denison (9-7, 12-13) @ Wabash (10-6, 18-7) - The Little Giants were able to coast through their last game of the season, get some subs some PT and rest their starters for big chunks of the game. The Big Red were not afforded such luxury. Each team got a road win during the regular season, though in the game in Crawfordsville Derek Bailey was hampered by an injury which put him in a shooting slump. He's recovered now, but still the LG's need to focus and play their "A" game to get past the scrappy, feisty Big Red. This will probably be the game of the day, so get those web streams up and running!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2012, 01:53:55 PM
For the first time in years, probably ever, I think all four road teams have a legitimate chance to win tomorrow night. Okay, so maybe Kenyon is not better than a 1-in-10 bet in Springfield, but Wooster, OWU, and Wabash all had better bring their 'A' games or they may be staying home for the weekend. Denison and DePauw each split with their Tuesday hosts, Denison winning on Wabash's floor, and all four games were close. Hiram was swept by OWU, but only by 6 and 13 points.

Even Kenyon was within 8 of Wittenberg in the only game they played, although that was a while ago when Kenyon was riding a four-game winning streak and playing better ball. (That was the beginning of the end for the Lords, by the way; since that game they have only won 4 of 11 games, beating Oberlin and Allegheny twice each, with three of those wins by 3 or fewer points.)

Normally, only the 4/5 game looks competitive on paper. This is not your father's NCACsmobile.

Note: Cross-posted with smeds; +1 for another in a very helpful series of previews my friend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2012, 01:59:14 PM
Thanks, DC!

I didn't talk about Pool "C" chances, but the 'wags' have Wooster and Witt as having an excellent shot of getting in as a "C" and Ohio Wesleyan sneaking in as well, with Wabash 'on the table' as it stands now.

Of course, that logic can change as the tournament unfolds. If there's some significant carnage those equations could all change...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on February 20, 2012, 05:24:38 PM
Just a miscellaneous tidbit, NCAC friends...

I heard today that 6-9 center Randy Ollie from Evanston H.S. (north suburb of Chicago) has decided to attend Oberlin.  Illinois Wesleyan was on Ollie and I think IWU head coach Ron Rose liked him quite a bit.  Maybe a bit of a "project"...but a good project to have kind of kid.  Lots of upside as a very good D3 post player.

I was speaking to the father of an IWU player today and he said, "Oh, and (his son) said that the 6-9 kid from Evanston that visited is going to Oberlin."  I had never heard of IWU losing to basketball recruit to Oberlin!

So just thought I'd pass that along.  Better get on the Oberlin bandwagon before it leaves the station, folks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2012, 06:35:47 PM
Thanks Titan, I bet he's got an interest in music as well as hoops. 

This Oberlin team would have probably made the conference tourney a few years ago, but the NCAC has really stepped up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2012, 07:45:05 PM
I think Oberlin is well on their way to a top 10 conference finish next season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2012, 08:08:15 PM
Halftime scores:

Kenyon 29, Wittenberg 27
Wooster 26, DePauw 20
Wabash 31, Denison 22
Hiram 44, OWU 44
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2012, 08:18:43 PM
Could be some intriguing halftime speeches heard 'round the league.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 21, 2012, 08:27:08 PM
Four minutes into the second half, Kenyon leads Witt, 38-31.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2012, 08:36:59 PM
If Kenyon hangs on and Wooster wins, who hosts the final four?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2012, 08:38:34 PM
9:05 Left   Wooster 45  DePauw 34
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2012, 08:39:32 PM
Okay, Mike Breckenridge just answered my question.  It would be at Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 21, 2012, 08:41:03 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 21, 2012, 08:39:32 PM
Okay, Mike Breckenridge just answered my question.  It would be at Wooster.

Yup, highest remaining seed hosts.

Everything's close all over the conference right now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2012, 08:45:35 PM
I wonder if the top seed has ever lost a first-round game in the NCAC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 21, 2012, 09:03:43 PM
Final: Wooster 59  DePauw 51  :)

A cold spell by Wooster and a couple of questionable calls helped DePauw tie up the game at 51-51.  Justin Hallowell then hit a huge three pointer with 37 seconds left and Wooster got a stop to control the finish.

Wooster was led by senior Justin Hallowell with 25 points and senior Matt Fegan with 12 points.

Top scorers for DePauw were Connor Rich with 16 points and Barry Flynn added 15 points.

Like Saturday, three pointers were a factor as the Scots made 9 compared to only 4 for the Tigers.

Wooster is now 22-4.  :)  ....and hopefully they locked up at least a Pool C NCAA bid with tonight's win.

If Wooster can win the NCAC tourney, they might have a shot at hosting in the NCAA tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 21, 2012, 09:05:01 PM
Witt is up 11 in the final minute, so it looks like the Scots (and others) are headed to Springfield this weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2012, 09:12:38 PM
Denison really lays the wood to Wabash in the second half, winning the half 52-29 and the game 74-60.
Both Witt and OWU have late leads that they seem likely to hold.

Friday at the Pam:
Wooster vs. OWU
Denison vs. Wittenberg
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 21, 2012, 09:15:03 PM
Wabash's already-slim Pool C chances likely are gone with that loss, so the season ends sooner than expected for the LGs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2012, 09:15:51 PM
Wabash held a 39-26 lead with 15:21 left in the game. Denison then got to work, tied the game in less than four minutes, and then blew past the Little Giants 74-60.

Larry Farmer and Dimonde Hale did work. Farmer had 28 points and 11 boards. Hale, 21 and 10. Derek Bailey led Wabash with 18, while Aaron Zinnerman added 14.

It's a tough way to end what was a great season by the Little Giants. They end 18-8 on the year. Congrats to Denison for putting a hurt on Wabash in the second half and advancing to the semi-finals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2012, 09:18:44 PM
Wittenberg 73, Kenyon 61
OWU 96, Hiram 86...OWU shot 55% and Brady had 33, but that was against Hiram's "defense"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 21, 2012, 09:21:37 PM
Kenyon had a lead for the first half of the final 20 minutes, but Wittenberg finally asserted itself and eased past the Lords 73-61. Clayton Black led the Old Tigers with 21 and Zach Leahy added 16. Ikenna Nwadibia led Kenyon with 18 points and 10 boards.

Ohio Wesleyan and Hiram played no defense, or so it seemed, but it was entertaining. The Bishops defeated the Terriers 96-86. Tim Brady scored 33 points to lead OWU, including a 15-17 mark at the line. Marshall Morris added 18 points and 10 boards. Jamaal Watkins scored 32 points and grabbed 10 rebounds for Hiram. Alan Sheppard added 20.

So it's 1, 2, 3 and 5 on the final weekend, but the rest of the NCAC weren't pushovers tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 21, 2012, 09:51:36 PM
Wittenberg 73 Kenyon 61

Difference in this game was nothing really changed with Witt in the second half except better execution and playing a little more aggressively. The fact that Witt was able to pound it inside and get to the free throw line with ease helped as well. One of Kenyon's post players fouled out with 10+ minutes to go. The fact it was on a touch foul when banging was going on both ends had to upset Kenyon.

Should be a great weekend of basketball at "The Pam" Hopefully all teams bring their fan bases to have a great atmosphere. And hopefully Witt survives as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 22, 2012, 09:00:45 AM
CONGRATS TO THE BIG RED!!!!

You read it here FIRST when I said you DID NOT want to pull the Big Red in round one!!!!!

First tournament win since the 97-98 season!!!!!  HOW COOL IS THAT??????

This game can be summed up in two words............ LARRY FARMER!!!   What a game....he had his OWN 17-0 run in the second half. 

For all those fans who have visited Wabash knows that one of their favorite chants is............."OHIO SUCKS"

Well I guess it REALLY does SUCK now, because your season is OVER!!!!  Keep "fightin"!!!

Sorry.......just had to say that!!!!

Witt's next...........no easy task but then again....NEVER SAY NEVER!!!!

Keep the dream alive Big Red!!!! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 23, 2012, 12:42:03 AM
Quote from: BigRedFan on February 22, 2012, 09:00:45 AM
Sorry.......just had to say that!!!!

Pretty sure you actually didn't have to.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 23, 2012, 10:08:48 AM
OUCH!!

Why do I think Pat has NEVER been to a Wabash game????

GO BIG RED!!!!!! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 23, 2012, 03:06:34 PM
As a side note on the Denison vs. Wabash game, we saw something in the second half that we have rarely seen this year – relatively little substitution.  I think the fact that the players weren't subbed in and out as frequently allowed the team to get into more of a rhythm.  The result?  The Big Red had no turnovers for over 16 minutes of play and displayed better coverage on the defensive end since defenders had more time to get a feel for the player they were guarding.  Once Farmer went crazy and got the game back for us, that seemed to be a major factor in Denison's extending the lead and hanging on for the win.

Getting into a rhythm and staying loose will be keys to being able to beat Wittenberg in the next game.  Of course, we could always use another double, double-double by Farmer and Hale.  Regardless, I feel good about the Big Red's chances in the semis.  Their confidence is clearly high, and that's often all it takes.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 23, 2012, 04:58:24 PM
Just because Wabash lost doesn't mean there won't be previews. Oh, you know it's true.... ;)

Games at Wittenberg:

#5 Denison (9-7, 13-13) vs. #1 Wittenberg (14-2, 21-5) - The only upset of the first round featured the Big Red defeating the once-nationally ranked Little Giants on Wabash's home floor. Well, that is actually a mild upset because Denison did the same thing earlier in the season. Wittenberg struggled for 30 minutes before turning on their inside game and beating Kenyon - just like their regular season matchup. Is past prologue? If so, the Big Red will stay close before falling to the Old Tigers. But in that game Larry Farmer played just 19 minutes due to fouls. If he plays 30+ it may be a different game. Denison needs to contain and control Witt's inside game, and hope Farmer and Dimonde Hale repeate their Tuesday performance. I am excepting a close one.

#3 Ohio Wesleyan (11-5, 20-6) @ #2 Wooster (12-4, 22-4) - Both teams eased past their opponents in the second half of their first round games, but I don't think 'easing past' will be in the vernacular Friday. Wooster beat OWU by four in each matchup this season, but even then the four point margin was deceiving as both games had just a one-point margin with less than a minute to go. In the first game the Bishops fought back from a double-digit lead by the Scots to take a lead, only to hit an untimely offensive slump. In the second game, OWU had amassed a double-digit lead while Tim Brady was on the bench due to foul trouble. Wooster then stormed back for the win. OWU needs to have Tim Brady do his thing, have someone else step up and score some points and avoid the slumps. The Scots need consistent scoring, not foul Brady and prevent another Bishops player from emerging as a scoring threat. Bring the popcorn!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2012, 06:46:34 PM
You can see Larry Farmer's personal 17-0 run here (http://denisonbigred.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/releases/20120223934yaq).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 24, 2012, 07:05:47 AM
Should be some great games tonight, my prediction is Witt/Wooster III. If anyone is driving down, come say hello to me, I'll be across from the benches wearing a Wittenberg polo, usually in the first 3 rows.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2012, 06:49:09 PM
Wooster is up on OWU 41-34 at the half and quite frankly, OWU is fortunate to be this close.

Wooster is being led by Brown and Fegan with 10 points each and Claytor has 8.  Justin Hallowell, who has been on a tear for Wooster over the last 4 games was scoreless going 0-4 from the field and 0-3 from deep.

OWU is led by Morris and Dre White with 10 apiece.  White had 5 points combined in the Bishop's 2 previous meetings with Wooster.  Once again, Wooster is doing a number on Brady as he only has 3 in the half going 1-7 from the field! 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2012, 07:10:50 PM
Wow. Wooster's taken control, now up 68-50 with 10:41 to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 24, 2012, 08:43:24 PM
Denison leads Witt 39-19 at halftime!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2012, 08:53:59 PM
At the Half:  Denison 39  Wittenberg 19

It will be interesting to see if the Big Red can hold this lead in the 2nd half.

Congrats to Wooster on beating OWU for the 3rd time this season.  Always tough to beat a team three times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2012, 10:00:10 PM
Final:  Denison 66  Wittenberg 58

Wow, big upset by the Big Red and it is their first win in Springfield since 1950!

Congratulations to Denison on a very well played game as Wittenberg got no closer than 6 points in the 2nd half.

Tourney championship game tomorrow is Denison vs. Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 24, 2012, 10:44:42 PM
Wooster needs to avoid a slow start tomorrow night vs. Denison.  Witt never recovered after falling behind by 20.

Denison is a very hot team having won 6 of their last 7 games including a 14 point win at Wabash and a 8 point win at Wittenberg.  The key to beating Denison is slowing down Dimonde Hale and Larry Farmer.  Easier said then done.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 24, 2012, 11:53:39 PM
Big Red got off to a quick start and rebounded very well.  The key to tomorrow night will be to keep the Scots off the boards too, stop Brown from taking his little fade shots in the paint and pressure Claytor inside.  Could be a barn burner.  Who wouldn't love to see three NCAC teams in the big tournament?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 25, 2012, 12:22:35 AM
Random Observations, in no particular order:

1. Wooster got some very, very important minutes from Kenny DeBoer tonight, in his first game back from injury.  Not that he played particularly well, but he was a big body in there, and with Claytor obviously still hurt and Mays in foul trouble, the freshman saved the day.

2. As mentioned above, Claytor's injured ankle is clearly still bothering him.  He was slow around the basket, and is almost certainly going to be that way tomorrow night, too.  Somehow, Wooster is going to have to find a way to keep Denison off the offensive glass.

3. Wittenberg failed to guard on the perimeter early, and it immediately did them in.  That, and the fact that Clayton Black was taken out of the game early because, finally, he was called for the foot-shuffling that he's so often guilty of doing.  They got him twice, quickly (a third time, later, also), and he was suddenly gun shy about making any post moves.  The twenty-point hole was way too deep, and that was that.

4. While some players swing on the rim for show, most of the time it's done to get back on balance for dropping to the floor.  Although the technical called on the Denison player didn't hurt them, I thought it was a poor call.  He came in hard for the dunk from the left side, with Clayton Black on the right.  He swung forward, held on not wanting to fly into Black, swung back to vertical, then dropped down.  For that he got whistled, and I don't think he deserved it. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2012, 01:00:50 AM
We'll I'll be...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 25, 2012, 05:26:18 AM
congratulations Denison. Go Big Red.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 25, 2012, 10:00:28 AM
OMG!!!  Did that just happen????

Simon & Garfunkel, Fred Astaire & Ginger Rogers, Alphonse & Gaston, Martin & Lewis, Jordan & Pippen

And then you have what might be the best combination of ALL TIME  Farmer & Hale!!!!

Not since 1950 had Denison beat Witt at Witt!!!!!!!  HELLO!!! 

I think William Shakespeare said it best in Macbeth..."double double toil and trouble"

Hey Wooster don't punch that ticket yet!!!  :-)

What an awesome run by the Big Red Machine!!!!!!!!!

NEVER SAY NEVER!!!  GO BIG RED!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2012, 10:04:26 AM
Here are links to articles on yesterday's two NCAC tournament games:

http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/springfield-oh-sports/wittenberg-university-tigers/denison-upsets-wittenberg-1334076.html

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/5161058
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2012, 11:06:00 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 25, 2012, 12:22:35 AM
Random Observations, in no particular order:

1. Wooster got some very, very important minutes from Kenny DeBoer tonight, in his first game back from injury.  Not that he played particularly well, but he was a big body in there, and with Claytor obviously still hurt and Mays in foul trouble, the freshman saved the day.

2. As mentioned above, Claytor's injured ankle is clearly still bothering him.  He was slow around the basket, and is almost certainly going to be that way tomorrow night, too.  Somehow, Wooster is going to have to find a way to keep Denison off the offensive glass.



DeBoer's addition back into the rotation was HUGE last night for the Scots.  Claytor had just sat for a breather in the first half when Mays picked up his 3rd quick foul of the half and had DeBoer not been able to go, Claytor would have been logging a ton of minutes last night.  He may not have contributed that much statistically, but his 19 minutes were needed big time last night for Wooster to win.

Quote from: BigRedFan on February 25, 2012, 10:00:28 AM

Hey Wooster don't punch that ticket yet!!!  :-)


Trust me.  Denison has Coach Moore's and Wooster's full attention for tonight's game.  One of the reasons why Wooster has so many lengthy win streaks vs. so many conference foes is because Coach Moore doesn't allow his teams to overlook any opponent.  If Denison beats Wooster tomorrow it will not be because the Scots were looking ahead to the NCAA. 

BTW, Wooster seniors Matt Fegan and Justin Hallowell were quoted in that Daily Record article wsf linked where one of their goals they set 4 years ago upon arriving at Wooster was to win 8 NCAC championships (4 regular season and 4 tournament titles).  They already came up short on one of those goals and they don't want to fall short again tonight so they will be highly motivated to win their 4th conference tournament in a row!

I'm wondering how many Wooster fans will be in the stands for tonight's game.  It will be a weird and rare home court atmosphere for Wooster at the a Pam tonight.  Should we call the Pam Timken South tonight?   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 25, 2012, 11:24:46 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 25, 2012, 11:06:00 AM

DeBoer's addition back into the rotation was HUGE last night for the Scots.  Claytor had just sat for a breather in the first half when Mays picked up his 3rd quick foul of the half and had DeBoer not been able to go, Claytor would have been logging a ton of minutes last night.  He may not have contributed that much statistically, but his 19 minutes were needed big time last night for Wooster to win.

I had a chance to sit with Doug Cline for a few minutes after the game, and he said exactly the same thing.  It was huge to be able to sit Claytor for almost the entire 2nd half to rest his ankle and save him some for tonight's game. And DeBoer played pretty well for only being back for one practice.

Quote from: ScotsFan on February 25, 2012, 11:06:00 AM
I'm wondering how many Wooster fans will be in the stands for tonight's game.  It will be a weird and rare home court atmosphere for Wooster at the a Pam tonight.  Should we call the Pam Timken South tonight?   8-)

I thought that attendance was a little low (for Wooster) last night, but its hard to get from Wooster to Springfield for a 6:00 game.  I'd expect a larger Wooster crowd tonight.  There was a pretty good number of DU faithful last night, too.  Should be a good one tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2012, 11:27:50 AM
How about this streak btw.  Wooster has now reached the conference tournament final in 15 of the last 16 years.  Wabash beat them in the semis at Timken for the only time that Wooster failed to reach the final of the NCAC tournament in the last 16 years! 

Also, with Denison reaching the finals as a 5 seed, I can't recall in recent memory of a team outside of the top 4 seeds reaching the conference tournament final.  Outside of OWU's tournament championship in 2008 (they were either a 2 or 3 seed that year I believe) you have to go back to the 97-98 season to find a non-Witt or non-Woo tournament champion and that was Allegheny.   I'm pretty sure Denison would be the lowest seeded tournament champion if they won tonight.  I just don't know if there have been any lower seeds to play for the tournament championship.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 25, 2012, 11:40:45 AM
 
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 25, 2012, 11:24:46 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 25, 2012, 11:06:00 AM

Should we call the Pam Timken South tonight?   8-)

I thought that attendance was a little low (for Wooster) last night, but its hard to get from Wooster to Springfield for a 6:00 game.  I'd expect a larger Wooster crowd tonight.

If they can get their tractors started in this cold weather! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 25, 2012, 12:00:08 PM
Love it, nothing like a little old fashioned trash talking. It is a great day for the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 25, 2012, 12:34:13 PM
So, what's the consensus, now, on the NCAA situation?  If Wooster wins, I'm thinking that they have a good chance to host the first round.  Wittenberg is almost surely in.  Would there be a third team?  If Denison wins, Wooster is still in and Witt likely also, but who hosts from the NCAC, if anyone?  Can OWU sneak in as a fourth team?

As for tonight's game.  If Denison shoots lights out from the perimeter as they did last night, they'll likely win the game.  Heck, any team that can do that can pretty much beat anyone.  But it's probably not going to happen, and to be honest, I wasn't impressed with their ball movement or penetration ability.  If they're not hitting, they'll need to be all over the offensive glass, which they're very capable of doing.  Wooster, with Claytor dinged up and DeBoer just getting his game legs again, is just, well...short.

Denison is also a shot-blocking team now, so Wooster's offense might just have to come, again, from behind the arc along with Brown's pull-up jumpers.  They'll need to make their free throws, as they did last night.  I'm happy to be playing Denison over Wittenberg; not so much that I feel they're a weaker team, but I really prefer the idea of a neutral floor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2012, 01:46:54 PM
The number crunching wags have OWU pretty safely in, barring other carnage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 25, 2012, 02:16:18 PM
Disappointing loss last night, Witt didn't start the game with intensity that Denison did and ultimately a 20 point deficit was too much to overcome. Witt should be safely in, but will have to travel to probably either Hope or Transylvania.

For NCAC purposes and obviously the fact that I can't bring myself to root for Wooster, hopefully Denison will come through with the win tonight. Would it bring the NCAC participants up to 4 then? Wooster and Wittenberg are certainly in, but would a Denison win knock OWU out? Who knows with the NCAA committee. As Coach Brown said, he's not revolving his day around their decisions (he didn't say that but I surmised that).

A couple of points:

1-not sure who he is, but the gentleman that sits right behind Wooster's bench needs to refer to ncaa.com and read the actual rule of 3 seconds and the rule of verticality and then maybe he'll be a little quiet for once during the game.......jk!

2-the technical I disagree was a good call I thought. Denison's player didn't hang on the rim to prevent contact but to show boat as he was screaming the entire time he was doing that. I'm sure he wasn't too concerned with making contact with anyone, thus by interpretation of the rule it was justified.

3-Wittenberg couldn't hit free throws if their life depended on it. Which is ironic as that's how they have been successful, getting to the free throw line.

4-I was really impressed with Denison and know how Wabash fans feel concerning Farmer. He has the ability to go on a shooting streak.  At least Wittenberg had a moral victory as their assistant Chris Sullivan is a Witt grad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2012, 02:33:02 PM
Quote from: GoRed on February 25, 2012, 11:40:45 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 25, 2012, 11:24:46 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 25, 2012, 11:06:00 AM

Should we call the Pam Timken South tonight?   8-)

I thought that attendance was a little low (for Wooster) last night, but its hard to get from Wooster to Springfield for a 6:00 game.  I'd expect a larger Wooster crowd tonight.

If they can get their tractors started in this cold weather! ;D

The only "Farmer" that I know of plays for Denison!  ;) ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2012, 02:39:01 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2012, 02:33:02 PM
Quote from: GoRed on February 25, 2012, 11:40:45 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 25, 2012, 11:24:46 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 25, 2012, 11:06:00 AM

Should we call the Pam Timken South tonight?   8-)

I thought that attendance was a little low (for Wooster) last night, but its hard to get from Wooster to Springfield for a 6:00 game.  I'd expect a larger Wooster crowd tonight.

If they can get their tractors started in this cold weather! ;D

The only "Farmer" that I know of plays for Denison!  ;) ;D

Not to mention, we all know what a thriving metropolis Granville is...  :P   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 25, 2012, 02:47:46 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 25, 2012, 02:16:18 PM

2-the technical I disagree was a good call I thought. Denison's player didn't hang on the rim to prevent contact but to show boat as he was screaming the entire time he was doing that. I'm sure he wasn't too concerned with making contact with anyone, thus by interpretation of the rule it was justified.

I just watched a replay of the dunk and technical.  It happened with the score 44-30, directly off an in-bounds play.  Hale took the cross-court alley-oop off of a backdoor cut from the left side, totally unguarded.  Clayton Black, who was guarding someone else, came back to him, from underneath on the right side, but was too late to contest the shot.  He was, however, standing just off to the right of underneath the basket as Hale dunked the ball.  Had Hale not grabbed the rim, he'd have flown into Black on the way down.  He swung forward, then back, not quite to vertical, before dropping to the floor.  By doing so, he avoided any possible contact.  I don't know what he said, or yelled, if anything, but from looking at the video, there was absolutely no way he deserved a technical from his physical action.  If you don't believe me, go back and look at it yourself.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2012, 03:26:37 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 25, 2012, 11:06:00 AM
I'm wondering how many Wooster fans will be in the stands for tonight's game.  It will be a weird and rare home court atmosphere for Wooster at the a Pam tonight.  Should we call the Pam Timken South tonight?   8-)

Denison is offering a free bus ride for any students who want to attend. It'll be interesting to see how many take them up on it. In my day (at least), there was ALWAYS something better to do at DU on a Saturday night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2012, 07:09:08 PM
Weird situation just before the start of the Denison-Wooster game. There are light malfunctions at the arena, and they just sent the teams back to the locker room.

No word yet on when this game will get underway...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 25, 2012, 07:13:51 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2012, 07:09:08 PM
Weird situation just before the start of the Denison-Wooster game. There are light malfunctions at the arena, and they just sent the teams back to the locker room.

No word yet on when this game will get underway...

Pretty sure its a human malfunction. They usually turn off the lights over the stands here during the game. But looks like someone hit the wrong switch. Maybe the same guy that had so much trouble operating the clock last night? 

Looks like the teams are coming back on the court. Should be getting started in a few minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2012, 07:16:29 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 25, 2012, 07:13:51 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2012, 07:09:08 PM
Weird situation just before the start of the Denison-Wooster game. There are light malfunctions at the arena, and they just sent the teams back to the locker room.

No word yet on when this game will get underway...

Pretty sure its a human malfunction. They usually turn off the lights over the stands here during the game. But looks like someone hit the wrong switch. Maybe the same guy that had so much trouble operating the clock last night? 

Looks like the teams are coming back on the court. Should be getting started in a few minutes.

Yup, looks like we're about to go live from Springfield...Let's Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2012, 07:49:27 PM
At the Half: Wooster 28  Denison 26

Wooster is being led by Justin Hallowell with 9 points and Josh Claytor with 8.

Denison's top scorers are Dimonde Hale with 9 points and Mike Garabedian with 5.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2012, 07:55:51 PM
Denison was down nine with 2:15 left in the first half. It seems this Big Red squad is not intimidated and does not roll over for anyone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2012, 08:49:20 PM
Final: Wooster 53  Denison 51  :)

Scots win the NCAC tourney title and the automatic bid to the NCAA tourney.

Congratulation to Denison and their seniors on a very well played game.

Wooster's top scorers were Justin Hallowell with 14 points and Josh Claytor with 14 points.

Big Red was led by Dimonde Hale with 19 points, Alex Longi with 10 and Brett Tiberi with 9
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2012, 08:50:30 PM
Oh, my! Larry Farmer misses a bunny with three seconds left. Dimonde Hale missed two free throws with under a minute to go. Denison had their chances! NCAC will probably get three teams in, but wow, the Big Red could have turned the conference even more on its ear than it was all season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2012, 08:52:42 PM
Great game! Denison played very, very well--great NCAC tournament for them. I think their run reminds us all of the depth of the strength in the NCAC this year. Our teams in the big dance will be battle-tested and ready.

Congrats to the Scots on the automatic bid!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2012, 09:01:32 PM
Congratulations also to Wooster senior Matt Fegan who played in his 123rd career game tonight. :)  I believe that he has now surpassed Kyle Witucky for most career games....and hopefully, Matt has a few more to play in the NCAA's. ;)

With Wooster at 24-4 and the automatic bid, they may have a chance to host a couple of NCAA games.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2012, 09:04:34 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 25, 2012, 08:50:30 PM
Oh, my! Larry Farmer misses a bunny with three seconds left. Dimonde Hale missed two free throws with under a minute to go. Denison had their chances! NCAC will probably get three teams in, but wow, the Big Red could have turned the conference even more on its ear than it was all season.

Hale was more than due for those misses as he was only 57% on the season and had made 20-23 for the tournament up until those 2 misses. 

Game effort by the Big Red and congrats to the Scots for bringing home their 4th straight tournament title and 4th straight ticket to the dance.  It would have been nice to cut down the nets in the friendly confines of Timken, but there has to be just a little extra satisfaction when you get to cut down Witt's nets and take them back to Wooster!   ;D   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 25, 2012, 09:09:57 PM
Something tells me this here NCAC tourney hosting thing may rotate around a bit in the next few years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2012, 09:25:12 PM
Here are the last 10 years of winners in NCAC titles - season and tournament:

               Season          Tournament
2011-12   Wittenberg      Wooster
2010-11   Wooster          Wooster
2009-10   Wooster          Wooster
2008-09   Wooster          Wooster
2007-08   Wooster          Ohio Wesleyan
2006-07   Wooster          Wooster
2005-06   Wooster          Wittenberg
2004-05   Wooster          Wittenberg
2003-04   Wittenberg      Wooster
2002-03   Wooster          Wooster

Congratulations to Wooster Coaches Steve Moore, Doug Cline and the staff on a decade of great results!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2012, 09:52:07 PM
This just in... (http://www2.northcoast.org/mbasketball/NCACTournament/2012)
Justin Hallowell has been named MVP of the conference tournament, the aptly named Al Van Wie Award. He is joined on the all-tournament team by his teammate Matt Fegan, Denison's dynamic duo of Larry Farmer and Dimonde Hale, Wittenberg's Clayton Black, and OWU's Tim Brady.

Kind of a shame to see Denison's season end just when they were peaking. It might have been fun to see what they could have done in the early rounds of the NCAA's. Just goes to show that it's a 25-game season, and you have to show up in December as well as in February.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 25, 2012, 09:56:13 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2012, 09:01:32 PM
Congratulations also to Wooster senior Matt Fegan who played in his 123rd career game tonight. :)  I believe that he has now surpassed Kyle Witucky for most career games....and hopefully, Matt has a few more to play in the NCAA's. ;)

With Wooster at 24-4 and the automatic bid, they may have a chance to host a couple of NCAA games.

GO SCOTS!
Actually, Kyle Witucky also played in 123 games (109-14). He never missed a game in his Wooster career. The NCAA III record is 124—Tonton Balenga, Va. Wesleyan, 2005-08.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2012, 10:00:19 PM
Wittenberg is reporting attendance of 1048 (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/12mtrnystats/NCACM3.HTM) (i.e. 1/3 full) for tonight's game. If that's accurate, that's a fantastic crowd for a neutral-site game a long way away from the campuses of the competitors.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 25, 2012, 10:21:16 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 25, 2012, 10:00:19 PM
Wittenberg is reporting attendance of 1048 (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/12mtrnystats/NCACM3.HTM) (i.e. 1/3 full) for tonight's game. If that's accurate, that's a fantastic crowd for a neutral-site game a long way away from the campuses of the competitors.

And it was at least 50% Denison fans. It was great to see all the Denison students there supporting their team. Wooster gets tremendous community support, but has almost no student following.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 25, 2012, 10:42:19 PM
Which goes to show that while there is little to do in Wooster at night, there's less in Granville.  And say what you want about Springfield, Ohio, it's sure not hard to find a place to get a drink. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 26, 2012, 07:42:33 AM
I'll drink to that
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 26, 2012, 07:53:54 AM
The comment was made earlier about someone not knowing the rulebook. Forgive me for not remembering who made it. I must concur though about people who should look up the rules and I find it is usually parents or fans who have been watching all year. Case in point was last night. Unfortunately I was unable to drive from Columbus to Springfield so I went to The Wilmington-Capital game instead. The Wilmington crowd was great and the best visitors crowd I have seen there since since Wooster was there for the ncaa tournament game in 09.(sorry scott fans I know you don't like to remember that game but it was the best game I have ever been at.) However there were a few people you would think after an entire year would know just what the secondary defender rule is by now. Wilmington was clearly guilty of a block inside the half circle in the first half and you could could hear was complaining about what a bad call it was. Overall the refs in that game I thought did a good job as they have in most games I have been too this year. Since nobody has said anything about the refs at the ncac game(always a good thing not to hear about them, usually means they did a great job) I am guessing they did a fine job there also. I just hope by next year more people are familiar with not only that rule but other rules as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nuscottsfan on February 26, 2012, 08:29:06 AM
Props to Warnsey for holding Larry Farmer, probably the hottest player in the conference at this point, to 4 points last night. Say what you'd like about that last in bounds play...but #24's hand in the rim had a lot to do with Farmer's missed bunny. Wooster posters have been surprisingly quiet as the Scots have gone about their business of winning. This Senior class has done what others haven't. They won the Tournament title all four years. The first to do so according to The Daily-Record. Now comes March Madness!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2012, 10:06:38 AM
Here are links to articles on the NCAC tourney championship game:

http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/5161234

http://www.denisonbigred.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/releases/20120225pjhf3w

http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/releases/20120225o4xfvn
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2012, 10:28:55 AM
Quote from: nuscottsfan on February 26, 2012, 08:29:06 AM
Props to Warnsey for holding Larry Farmer, probably the hottest player in the conference at this point, to 4 points last night. Say what you'd like about that last in bounds play...but #24's hand in the rim had a lot to do with Farmer's missed bunny. Wooster posters have been surprisingly quiet as the Scots have gone about their business of winning. This Senior class has done what others haven't. They won the Tournament title all four years. The first to do so according to The Daily-Record. Now comes March Madness!

nuscottsfan - great point about Warnes' defense on Larry Farmer.   Senior Justin Warnes has been Wooster's defensive stopper the last couple of years and he will be missed next year.

IMO, best example of Warnes' contributions was the Elite 8 game last year against #1 Whitworth. ;D  Warnes shadowed Michael Taylor, the All American and D3 Player of the Year, and forced him into only shooting 40% for the game.  On the season, Taylor shot 53% from the floor so 40% was a big drop from his normal production.  Oh, and Justin also threw down a huge dunk in that game that got the momentum shifting towards the Scots when they trailed in the first half.  :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2012, 11:03:45 AM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 26, 2012, 07:53:54 AMSince nobody has said anything about the refs at the ncac game(always a good thing not to hear about them, usually means they did a great job) I am guessing they did a fine job there also.

I wasn't there, but Mike Breckenridge's perception on WQKT was that the refs were doing a lot of whistle-swallowing. There were only 26 fouls called, and Wooster was able to foul in the waning seconds (resulting in the inbounds play and the infamous "missed bunny") because they were only at 5 at the time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 26, 2012, 11:07:13 AM
Congrats to the Big Red on a terrific season and all the thrills!!!

Congrats to our fans for supporting the team....that was awesome!!!

Here's to the NCAC going deep in the tournament!!!

Congrats also to Wooster....showing once again they know how to get it done when they need to!!!!

Very exciting year!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 26, 2012, 11:07:29 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 26, 2012, 11:03:45 AM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 26, 2012, 07:53:54 AMSince nobody has said anything about the refs at the ncac game(always a good thing not to hear about them, usually means they did a great job) I am guessing they did a fine job there also.

I wasn't there, but Mike Breckenridge's perception on WQKT was that the refs were doing a lot of whistle-swallowing. There were only 26 fouls called, and Wooster was able to foul in the waning seconds (resulting in the inbounds play and the infamous "missed bunny") because they were only at 5 at the time.

I thought the officiating was worse than usual, and I'll leave it at that...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 26, 2012, 03:37:34 PM
The HCAC title game between Transylvania and Rose-Hulman is going to OT.  An upset win by Rose (which is the #3 seed, but was only 11-7 in league play) could help the Wooster's chances of hosting next weekend (although it could also push OWU closer to the bubble's edge).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2012, 03:41:48 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 25, 2012, 10:21:16 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 25, 2012, 10:00:19 PM
Wittenberg is reporting attendance of 1048 (http://www.northcoast.org/mb/12mtrnystats/NCACM3.HTM) (i.e. 1/3 full) for tonight's game. If that's accurate, that's a fantastic crowd for a neutral-site game a long way away from the campuses of the competitors.

And it was at least 50% Denison fans. It was great to see all the Denison students there supporting their team. Wooster gets tremendous community support, but has almost no student following.

This has always been disappointing to me that the Wooster students don't support the basketball team more than they have over the years.  Denison's large student contingent is a result of DU providing buses for them to make the trek from Granville to Springfield.  I'm wondering if the powers that be at Wooster even thought about offering buses for Wooster students or if they just figured there wouldn't be that much of an interest from the students so they didn't even offer them?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2012, 03:56:18 PM
Rose Hulman upsets Transylvania this afternoon to win the automatic bid from the HCAC.

This might help Wooster get a hosting nod for the first round of the NCAA tourney.  Rose Hulman will be sent somewhere to play (Wooster pod?) and Transy is now less likely to host because they will be a Pool C.

There is also one less Pool C slot available with Transy clearly getting one at 22-3 so it may hurt OWU's chances a bit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2012, 04:02:59 PM
Here are 7 teams now in the NCAA tourney that may be Wooster opponents in the first/second round of the NCAA's:

Hope - MIAA (very likely to host 3 other teams in a pod)
Bethany - PRAC
Capital - OAC
Wittenberg - Pool C lock
Rose Hulman - HCAC
Transylvania - Pool C lock
Medaille - AMCC

In addition, Maryville (TN) likely will get the Pool B bid and OWU could get a Pool C bid.

Could Wooster host any 3 of these teams in a first/second round pod?    Let's hope so!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2012, 04:03:39 PM
Well, that HCAC title game certainly was a good result for Wooster.  wsf, I agree that I don't see how Transy could be considered for hosting as a C.  Also, I don't think Trany's resume compares very well to Wooster's.  The HCAC is not even close in terms of strength top to bottom in comparison to the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 26, 2012, 04:06:20 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 26, 2012, 04:03:39 PM
Well, that HCAC title game certainly was a good result for Wooster.  wsf, I agree that I don't see how Transy could be considered for hosting as a C.  Also, I don't think Trany's resume compares very well to Wooster's.  The HCAC is not even close in terms of strength top to bottom in comparison to the NCAC.

There are plenty of instances where Pool C teams have hosted.  Being a Pool C team won't be what keeps Transylvania from hosting.

Criteria(ie seed) and geography are always the two biggest factors.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2012, 04:10:58 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2012, 04:02:59 PM
Here are 7 teams now in the NCAA tourney that may be Wooster opponents in the first/second round of the NCAA's:

Hope - MIAA (very likely to host 3 other teams in a pod)
Bethany - PRAC
Capital - OAC
Wittenberg - Pool C lock
Rose Hulman - HCAC
Transylvania - Pool C lock
Medaille - AMCC

In addition, Maryville (TN) likely will get the Pool B bid and OWU could get a Pool C bid.

Could Wooster host any 3 of these teams in a first/second round pod?    Let's hope so!

I think Hope is a lock to host and I could see Cap, RHIT and Witt being sent up to Holland.  That would leave Bethany, Transy and Medaille to come to Wooster.  This seems plausible to me...  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 26, 2012, 04:11:37 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 26, 2012, 04:03:39 PM
Well, that HCAC title game certainly was a good result for Wooster.  wsf, I agree that I don't see how Transy could be considered for hosting as a C.  Also, I don't think Trany's resume compares very well to Wooster's.  The HCAC is not even close in terms of strength top to bottom in comparison to the NCAC.

It's going to come down to geography. If either one hosts, they'll be one of the last couple of schools. FWIW, I have Transy as the #16 tournament team (theoretically the last hosting spot), and Wooster as the #18 team (with UW-River Falls, still playing, in between). And it's really close -- could be they both host, or could be neither hosts, or could be either one hosts over the other.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2012, 04:26:31 PM
Quote from: sac on February 26, 2012, 04:06:20 PM

There are plenty of instances where Pool C teams have hosted.  Being a Pool C team won't be what keeps Transylvania from hosting.

Criteria(ie seed) and geography are always the two biggest factors.

I'm not saying that Transy won't host solely because they are a C.  I just don't think they compare favorably to Wooster head to head.  Transy has one fewer regional loss, but none of their losses are to regionally ranked opponents.  Also, Transy has only one win over a regionally ranked opponent as far as I can tell.  Wooster, on the other hand, has one more regional loss than Transy, but 3 of their 4 losses are to regionally ranked teams.  Also, Wooster also has 3 wins over regionally ranked teams.  Also, Wooster will likely be ranked 2nd in the final GL regional ranking.  Meanwhile, Transy was already only 3rd in the last MW regional rankings and will likely drop in the final MW regional ranking.  To me, Wooster stacks up much better in a lot of areas than Transy does.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 26, 2012, 04:33:40 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 26, 2012, 11:07:29 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 26, 2012, 11:03:45 AM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 26, 2012, 07:53:54 AMSince nobody has said anything about the refs at the ncac game(always a good thing not to hear about them, usually means they did a great job) I am guessing they did a fine job there also.

I wasn't there, but Mike Breckenridge's perception on WQKT was that the refs were doing a lot of whistle-swallowing. There were only 26 fouls called, and Wooster was able to foul in the waning seconds (resulting in the inbounds play and the infamous "missed bunny") because they were only at 5 at the time.

I thought the officiating was worse than usual, and I'll leave it at that...

From the perspective that very few, very obvious fouls were whistled in the game, I agree - it was technically bad officiating.  But it seemed to be fairly unbiased whistle-swallowing and I think it worked to Denison's advantage for the most part.  If Mansfield and Garabedian weren't allowed to be as physical as they were with Claytor and Mays, I'm not sure the game would have been as close.  Yes, Farmer was hammered and so was Tiberi on the last shot, but if you're going to let rough play go, you have to let everything go.  In my view, the Big Red were tougher and outplayed Wooster, but just couldn't get a few shots to fall (any Woo fan comments in response will be ignored).

Congratulations to Wooster on a hard fought win.  Represent the NCAC well in the tournament.

Denison players,

That was one of the best finishes to a season I have ever seen.  In your late season run, you showed the talent we knew you had and that you could play with the best in Divison III.   

You just gave your fans and your school a tremendous thrill and it showed with the support they gave you at the game.  That is what Denison men's basketball needs to be and I hope this is just the start.  A heart-felt congratulations to every one of you, whatever your role on the team may have been.  And best of luck to the seniors in whatever you do.  You were quite a class and hopefully gave the program a new footing.  Juniors, sophs and frosh - keep it rolling.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2012, 04:49:13 PM
Transy could host over Wooster because of geography. We'll have to see how the die is cast.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2012, 05:35:07 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 26, 2012, 04:49:13 PM
Transy could host over Wooster because of geography. We'll have to see how the die is cast.

IMO, this is the only criteria Transy has going for them.  Guess we'll see just how big of a part geography is weighed in by the selection committee.  If Transy is selected to host over Wooster, we'll know it weighs pretty heavily...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 26, 2012, 05:50:19 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 26, 2012, 05:35:07 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 26, 2012, 04:49:13 PM
Transy could host over Wooster because of geography. We'll have to see how the die is cast.

IMO, this is the only criteria Transy has going for them.  Guess we'll see just how big of a part geography is weighed in by the selection committee.  If Transy is selected to host over Wooster, we'll know it weighs pretty heavily...

They also have winning percentage in their favor. No small piece of criteria there. And a 3-0 record versus regionally ranked.

IMO, these two teams are as even as you could make them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 26, 2012, 05:56:12 PM
Transy ranks ahead of Wooster in three of the five primary criteria (in-region winning percentage, in-region results versus regionally-ranked teams, and in-region results versus common opponents), with a fourth (head-to-head) not being applicable.

Wooster has the quantity in terms of vRRO (4-3), but Transy has the quality (3-0). In terms of common opponents, Transy is 5-1 (wins over Wabash, Anderson (3x), and Defiance, loss to Defiance), while Wooster is 3-1 (wins over Defiance, Wabash, and Anderson, loss to Wabash).

The chances of Transy being picked ahead of Wooster to host are better than you think they are, ScotsFan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 26, 2012, 05:57:14 PM
I don't think its a head-to-head who hosts question with Transy and Wooster.  It's more of a solving a geography problem question and merit.

Prior to the NCAC finals it was difficult seeing a pod in Lexington and one in Springfield.  With Wooster winning its gives the Ohio area a legitimate host site far enough away from Holland and Lexington where all 3 could be hosts and still have plenty of teams to choose from for all 3 sites.

They could very well take Transylvania and put them on the road to Wooster or Holland or Washington.  Its really about what 4 teams they select for the pods and who has the seed and the geographic location to host.  Lexington is a decent location.  Had  Centre made the field I think it might have been a lock to host but not now.


Recent NCAA pairing history has shown a willingness to move teams around and be somewhat creative.  I think there's a small chance Wooster gets put in a pod with teams like Medaille and a couple other from NY or PA.  In that case Wooster may not be the central location to host the pod and it may go to someone like Medaille.

Most times the NCAA does a good job making sure the higher seeds get the best possible opportunity to host.  But not always, sometimes geography is the key factor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 26, 2012, 06:17:45 PM
Using this:  http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=201288344535022760091.0004b9cf822bd1249d87b&msa=0

I count 27 teams West of Pennsylvania in the D3 tournament.  Even if we use 2 byes in this half of the country we would still need to pull 3 teams into the area to make a 30 team bracket.

Therefore imo, a couple teams are going to be paired with teams from NY and PA.  Wooster and Bethany are the logical choices here being the furthest East, but neither would be a good host site in that scenario because of geography.

This is really all I'm saying about Wooster and its chances for hosting.  For me it really has nothing to do with a comparison to Transylvania.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2012, 06:45:51 PM
Quote from: sac on February 26, 2012, 06:17:45 PM
Using this:  http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=201288344535022760091.0004b9cf822bd1249d87b&msa=0

I count 27 teams West of Pennsylvania in the D3 tournament.  Even if we use 2 byes in this half of the country we would still need to pull 3 teams into the area to make a 30 team bracket.

Therefore imo, a couple teams are going to be paired with teams from NY and PA.  Wooster and Bethany are the logical choices here being the furthest East, but neither would be a good host site in that scenario because of geography.

This is really all I'm saying about Wooster and its chances for hosting.  For me it really has nothing to do with a comparison to Transylvania.

sac - excellent point about the NCAA needing to fill out and balance the entire bracket...all while minimizing their travel costs.

It may not come down to Wooster vs. Transy for hosting if the geographic balancing is the overriding factor.  In fact, the MIAA champ in recent years has been paired with Midwest (Illinois, Wisconsin) teams probably for this very reason.

While you mention 27 teams west of Pennsylvania, I actually think that the NCAA has to come up with 15 or 16 teams in each region that balance geographically while minimizing travel.  Last year, the NCAA paired Whitworth with Wooster in the same region to balance the bracket.  It will be interesting to see how it plays out this year.

Each year, the NCAA has too many teams in the northeast part of the country (>16) so they have to "push" teams further west and/or south to balance the regions in the bracket all while minimizing flights.  Yes, there is also a chance that Wooster will have to travel east if they are not hosting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 26, 2012, 06:51:10 PM
Oh, I absolutely agree that geography (i.e., travel expen$e$ that're charged to the NCAA"s bank account) is the overriding concern of the committee when the bracket is assembled tomorrow. I was simply pointing out that ScotsFan's assertion that Wooster should get seeding priority over Transylvania is not the hands-down, cut-and-dried, slam-dunk case he thinks it is. The primary criteria actually slightly favor Transy, if anything ... although I agree with the Dean of KnightSlappy U. that the committee could go either way if it had to choose one or the other as a first-weekend host based strictly upon the merits.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 26, 2012, 07:15:14 PM
It seems to me, from observation, that there is another, if undisclosed, criteria.  Taking turns.  Wooster, unless I'm misremembering, was a host in both rounds last year.  I think it likely that if it's a close call, and it probably is, they will not get that chance this time around.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2012, 07:30:20 PM
I think you're confusing the NCAC and the NCAA.

The NCAC has everyone share POW and sing camp songs with smores and apple juice.

The NCAA is a cold, heartless, cruel master.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2012, 07:42:02 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 26, 2012, 07:30:20 PM
I think you're confusing the NCAC and the NCAA.

The NCAC has everyone share POW and sing camp songs with smores and apple juice.

The NCAA is a cold, heartless, cruel master.

Smed - you are correct.  Here is another factor on Wooster's side from the NCAA perspective - 3,330.  ;)

What is 3,330?  It was the attendance in Timken gym last season when Wooster hosted Whitworth.  The NCAA loves a larger gate for tourney games because it brings in more revenue to offset the travel costs that they have to fund!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 26, 2012, 07:59:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2012, 07:15:14 PM
It seems to me, from observation, that there is another, if undisclosed, criteria. Taking turns.  Wooster, unless I'm misremembering, was a host in both rounds last year.  I think it likely that if it's a close call, and it probably is, they will not get that chance this time around.

Before the pools stuff we used to alternate hosting sites between regions when we reached the Sweet 16 level.  Back then the brackets were exclusively by region.  One year one region would host regardless of seed, the next the other region would host regardless of seed.

GL-South
MW-West

Then a couple years later
GL-West
MW-South

It worked for the most part, but did produce some lengthy road trips and the odd occasion when a lower seed was hosting very high seeds from the other region.  Eventually the NCAA decided costs should be watched more closely and then instituted the 500 mile guideline for flights which made it pretty much impossible to rotate regions the way they had.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 26, 2012, 08:01:25 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2012, 06:45:51 PM
Quote from: sac on February 26, 2012, 06:17:45 PM
Using this:  http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msid=201288344535022760091.0004b9cf822bd1249d87b&msa=0

I count 27 teams West of Pennsylvania in the D3 tournament.  Even if we use 2 byes in this half of the country we would still need to pull 3 teams into the area to make a 30 team bracket.

Therefore imo, a couple teams are going to be paired with teams from NY and PA.  Wooster and Bethany are the logical choices here being the furthest East, but neither would be a good host site in that scenario because of geography.

This is really all I'm saying about Wooster and its chances for hosting.  For me it really has nothing to do with a comparison to Transylvania.

sac - excellent point about the NCAA needing to fill out and balance the entire bracket...all while minimizing their travel costs.

It may not come down to Wooster vs. Transy for hosting if the geographic balancing is the overriding factor.  In fact, the MIAA champ in recent years has been paired with Midwest (Illinois, Wisconsin) teams probably for this very reason.

While you mention 27 teams west of Pennsylvania, I actually think that the NCAA has to come up with 15 or 16 teams in each region that balance geographically while minimizing travel.  Last year, the NCAA paired Whitworth with Wooster in the same region to balance the bracket.  It will be interesting to see how it plays out this year.

Each year, the NCAA has too many teams in the northeast part of the country (>16) so they have to "push" teams further west and/or south to balance the regions in the bracket all while minimizing flights.  Yes, there is also a chance that Wooster will have to travel east if they are not hosting.

You could even take just the 27 teams and make 7, 4 team pods with one bye and pull 1 4 team pod from the 'east' to make your 1/2 of the bracket.  Recently though the NCAA has moved teams around nicely within the first couple rounds and I think they'll try to do that rather than take an easy route.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2012, 08:15:11 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 26, 2012, 04:26:31 PM
Quote from: sac on February 26, 2012, 04:06:20 PM

There are plenty of instances where Pool C teams have hosted.  Being a Pool C team won't be what keeps Transylvania from hosting.

Criteria(ie seed) and geography are always the two biggest factors.

I'm not saying that Transy won't host solely because they are a C.  I just don't think they compare favorably to Wooster head to head.  Transy has one fewer regional loss, but none of their losses are to regionally ranked opponents.  Also, Transy has only one win over a regionally ranked opponent as far as I can tell.  Wooster, on the other hand, has one more regional loss than Transy, but 3 of their 4 losses are to regionally ranked teams.  Also, Wooster also has 3 wins over regionally ranked teams.  Also, Wooster will likely be ranked 2nd in the final GL regional ranking.  Meanwhile, Transy was already only 3rd in the last MW regional rankings and will likely drop in the final MW regional ranking.  To me, Wooster stacks up much better in a lot of areas than Transy does.

FWIW, I'm completely unconvinced on this point. Here's the relevant information from Greek Tragedy's Pool C listings:

GL                                                           
   WK3   TEAM         CON.         REG/OVERALL         WL%         SOS         RvsRR         SCHEDULE   
   #2   Wittenberg*         NCAC         18-4, 20-5         0.818         0.539          6-1         WON vs Kenyon 73-61, LOST vs Denison 66-58   
   #3   Wooster         NCAC         19-4,21-4         0.826         0.522          3-3         WON vs DePauw 59-51, WON vs Ohio Wesleyan 89-80, WON vs Denison 53-51   

Let's look at the primary criteria:

1) in-region winning percentage: slight edge to Wooster
2) in-region SOS: edge to Wittenberg
3) in-region results vs. regionally ranked teams: huge edge to Wittenberg...not even close
4) head-to-head results: 2-0 Wittenberg, who swept Wooster this year; huge edge to Wittenberg...again, not even close
5) in-region results vs. common opponents: not sure, but probably roughly a wash; probably close to the overall in-region records

So Wittenberg has a distinct and significant advantage over Wooster in 2 categories, and has a clear lead in another, with Wooster having a small edge in one, and one category is probably a wash. Losing in your conference semifinal to a non-regionally ranked team isn't a criteria.

I don't see how Wooster gets slotted ahead of Wittenberg in the final GL regional ranking. The head-to-head and the vRRO is just too strong to ignore I think.

I think Wooster's only hosting rights would be if Wooster is geographically better than Wittenberg...I don't think the committee would see the Scots as the higher seed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 26, 2012, 08:39:28 PM
Here are some random observations of various decisions the NCAA has made during the selection process and after the first two rounds that I've witnessed from Wooster's perspective based on reliable information that may have some bearing on what happens this year

-- Wooster Booster is heading the right direction when he implies that hosting the previous season(s) may work against that same team hosting again. This was probably the #1 reason Wooster had to travel to St. John Fisher in 2007 for the Sectional Round instead of hosting. There was no criteria where St. John Fisher was ahead than Wooster. Throw in the fact that St. John Fisher had a gym about 1/3 the size of Wooster's, and it made even less sense. Having Brockport St. next door probably helped (although John Carroll was only an hour from Wooster and probably would have traveled back and forth). But the biggest reason was the fact that Wooster had hosted the Sectional in both 2003 and & 2004, and they wanted to allow another school to host. This isn't just speculation. This is one of the arguments that was given, since Wooster was pretty surprised by this decision.

-- The fact that we are discussing whether Transylvania or Wooster hosts probably means neither will. I can see Transy going to Witt, and maybe Wooster to Hope? I know this hasn't been the case for years now, but if OWU doesn't get in, I could see Wooster heading up there to play someone else in the first round.

-- If it comes down to Wooster and Transy to host, based solely on numbers, Transy probably has a slight edge. But the X-factor could be the way the committee looks at conference tournaments and their outcomes. I'm not holding this up as overwhelming evidence of how the committee looks at conference tournaments, since this only involves Wooster and it relates to seasons that happened six and seven years ago, but it seems to imply what you do in the conference tournament has more bearing than you might otherwise think.

In 2005, Wooster lost in the NCAC Tournament title game to Witt. It was only their second loss of the season - both coming against regionally-ranked Wittenberg. They entered the NCAA Tournament with a 26-2 record, and was ranked somewhere in the Top 5 before losing to Witt in the conference title game. The result? Wooster had to travel to play (yes, they did host a first-round game, but that was in essence a play-in game to meet Albion up in Michigan). The profiles of Wooster and Albion were pretty close, but Albion won their conference tournament, Wooster didn't.

In 2006, Wooster spent a number of weeks at No. 1 in the polls, and was No. 1 entering the final week of the regular season. They lost the final regular season game to Ohio Wesleyan and then lost the NCAC title game to Witt (a Top-5 team they beat twice during the regular season). The result? Traveling to Transylvania for the first two rounds of the NCAA Tournament. Wooster had a better profile than Transy, but Transy had won their conference tournament, Wooster didn't.

Compare this to 2004, when Wooster lost three games during the regular season, including twice to Witt, but won the conference tournament. Wooster not only got to host, but they also got a first-round bye. Their second-round opponent Potsdam St. was a much easier matchup than John Carroll, who Wittenberg got stuck with.

In summary, every year Wooster has won the conference tournament since 1999 they have hosted (with the exception of 2009, when Wooster had five Div. III losses heading into the tournament). Every year they haven't won (2002, 2005, 2006) they haven't hosted (or in 2002 didn't make it at all).

So what the hell am I trying to say? I'm trying to say it seems the committee puts a decent amount of stock in how you do in your conference tournament and how you finish down the stretch -- not unlike they do in Div. I. A more recent example of this occurred in 2010. Despite beating Wooster earlier that season and having a very similar profile to Wooster's, John Carroll was sent to Guilford for the first two rounds, while Wooster got to host (Wooster won their conference tournament). I stated at the time I thought Wooster should get to host, despite losing to JCU, because they won 18 of their last 19 games and were a different team entering the tournament than they were in December.

Jump ahead to this year. While Wooster and Transy didn't meet during the season, the rest of the scenario is very similar. Both teams have very similar profiles, with Transy holding a slight "formula" advantage. But if you step away from the "formula" for a minute, you can see something that might lean in Wooster's direction. Since losing back-to-back games in early December, Wooster finished the season winning 19-of-21 games, including a 4-1 record against regionally-ranked teams (5-1 if you count St. Mary's, who is ranked in the Middle Atlantic). This run was capped off by winning the conference championship on the road (on a neutral court in reality, but on the road by definition). Transy, while certainly not slumping, went 13-4 over its final 17 games, and lost two of its last three games, including the conference tournament on its home floor. They only played two games against a regionally ranked opponent (Hanover), winning both.

So in conclusion, if the committee uses the same judgement they have in the past in relation to how you fare in conference tournament and how you finish down the stretch, Wooster probably has a slight edge over Transy. If not, then it is probably the other way around.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 26, 2012, 08:47:14 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2012, 08:15:11 PM

FWIW, I'm completely unconvinced on this point. Here's the relevant information from Greek Tragedy's Pool C listings:

GL                                                           
   WK3   TEAM         CON.         REG/OVERALL         WL%         SOS         RvsRR         SCHEDULE   
   #2   Wittenberg*         NCAC         18-4, 20-5         0.818         0.539          6-1         WON vs Kenyon 73-61, LOST vs Denison 66-58   
   #3   Wooster         NCAC         19-4,21-4         0.826         0.522          3-3         WON vs DePauw 59-51, WON vs Ohio Wesleyan 89-80, WON vs Denison 53-51   

Let's look at the primary criteria:

1) in-region winning percentage: slight edge to Wooster
2) in-region SOS: edge to Wittenberg
3) in-region results vs. regionally ranked teams: huge edge to Wittenberg...not even close
4) head-to-head results: 2-0 Wittenberg, who swept Wooster this year; huge edge to Wittenberg...again, not even close
5) in-region results vs. common opponents: not sure, but probably roughly a wash; probably close to the overall in-region records

It should be pointed out that almost all of these numbers have not been updated. Wooster finished 22-4 in the region (.846), while Witt finished 19-5 (.792). Overall, Wooster finished 22-4, Witt 21-6. As for SOS, both teams finished at .522 (according to this (http://"http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4232.msg1407174#msg1407174")). Records vs. regionally ranked opponents end up 6-1 Witt, 4-3 to Wooster. So yes, I think Witt has a better profile than Wooster, but it isn't that wide. The head-to-head just can't be ignored. The only caveat is how much subjectivity the committee applies. Does it see that Witt beat Wooster by one point and then in overtime, coupled with Witt losing the conference tournament in the semifinals on its home floor, and somehow put Wooster ahead? Does it give Wooster credit for beating St. Mary's on a neutral floor and punish Witt for losing at home to Otterbein, who finished 9-17? I doubt it, but it's not impossible.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 26, 2012, 09:35:10 PM
Forgive me for asking this question but I am still rather new too the working of the ncaa and how they pick tournament sites. I have only been following d3 basketball for about 5 years so please bear with me. I understand the arguments for the 3 above mentioned schools, they are all good and they would all be worthy choices. However does the ncaa always make their choices based what was accomplished on the court or will may they make a choice based entirely on something else? What I am getting at is could they pick a school for a host site that is not ranked, lost quite a few games compared too the three above and clearly had a inferior year. A selection based entirely on different factors. I am sure some will guess I am speaking of Capital. I know it would not be right but Cap is located in a large metropolitan area, easy access to and from, lots of hotel and other services you might not find in smaller towns. Add to this the Cap center is one of the finest athletic facilities in d3(not the crystal palace of Kenyon but pretty good just the same)and you might have people looking favorably at them. I am not saying this as a Cap fan, believe I am not. I am a Denison and Otterbein fan just to be clear. Still they do have many things in their favor. If I am far off on this please correct me I don't mind. Once again I have not followed d3 long enough to know all the goings on. I do hope either Wooster or Wittenberg would be picked, nothing though surprises me anymore.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2012, 09:39:34 PM
Hosting has always been a reward - you may quibble a bit the hosting but it will always be one of the top teams in the bracket provided they apply to be a host and meet the criteria.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2012, 11:10:14 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 26, 2012, 08:47:14 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2012, 08:15:11 PM

FWIW, I'm completely unconvinced on this point. Here's the relevant information from Greek Tragedy's Pool C listings:

GL                                                           
   WK3   TEAM         CON.         REG/OVERALL         WL%         SOS         RvsRR         SCHEDULE   
   #2   Wittenberg*         NCAC         18-4, 20-5         0.818         0.539          6-1         WON vs Kenyon 73-61, LOST vs Denison 66-58   
   #3   Wooster         NCAC         19-4,21-4         0.826         0.522          3-3         WON vs DePauw 59-51, WON vs Ohio Wesleyan 89-80, WON vs Denison 53-51   

Let's look at the primary criteria:

1) in-region winning percentage: slight edge to Wooster
2) in-region SOS: edge to Wittenberg
3) in-region results vs. regionally ranked teams: huge edge to Wittenberg...not even close
4) head-to-head results: 2-0 Wittenberg, who swept Wooster this year; huge edge to Wittenberg...again, not even close
5) in-region results vs. common opponents: not sure, but probably roughly a wash; probably close to the overall in-region records

It should be pointed out that almost all of these numbers have not been updated. Wooster finished 22-4 in the region (.846), while Witt finished 19-5 (.792). Overall, Wooster finished 22-4, Witt 21-6. As for SOS, both teams finished at .522 (according to this (http://"http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=4232.msg1407174#msg1407174")). Records vs. regionally ranked opponents end up 6-1 Witt, 4-3 to Wooster. So yes, I think Witt has a better profile than Wooster, but it isn't that wide. The head-to-head just can't be ignored. The only caveat is how much subjectivity the committee applies. Does it see that Witt beat Wooster by one point and then in overtime, coupled with Witt losing the conference tournament in the semifinals on its home floor, and somehow put Wooster ahead? Does it give Wooster credit for beating St. Mary's on a neutral floor and punish Witt for losing at home to Otterbein, who finished 9-17? I doubt it, but it's not impossible.

Seinfeld- thanks for pointing that out--I hadn't realized they weren't up-to-date (I saw that the game results for the week were included and assumed the stats were updated).

Now I agree with you that it's more or less a push...Wooster has the winning percentage edge, but Witt retains the head-to-head and the results vs. regionally ranked. I think if I were looking at the five primary criteria I'd still probably slot Witt ahead, based primarily on the head-to-head.

I actually have no idea if the committee sees scores to the games (and so would know that both Witt-Woo games were close)...since margin of victory isn't included in any of the criteria I'd assume not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 10:03:00 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2012, 11:10:14 PM

Seinfeld- thanks for pointing that out--I hadn't realized they weren't up-to-date (I saw that the game results for the week were included and assumed the stats were updated).

Now I agree with you that it's more or less a push...Wooster has the winning percentage edge, but Witt retains the head-to-head and the results vs. regionally ranked. I think if I were looking at the five primary criteria I'd still probably slot Witt ahead, based primarily on the head-to-head.

I actually have no idea if the committee sees scores to the games (and so would know that both Witt-Woo games were close)...since margin of victory isn't included in any of the criteria I'd assume not.

I realize there are 5 primary criteria that the selection committee goes by and I realize wins vs. regionally ranked opponents are one of those 5 criteria.  But I just have a hard time wondering why losses aren't taken into consideration.  Yes, Witt has done well against regionally ranked opponents including winning 2 over Wooster.  But, Witt also has not done so well vs. non-regionally ranked opponents as 4 of their 5 losses were vs. non-ranked regional opponents and some of those could be considered bad losses (especially the loss to Ott). 

Another area I feel should not be overlooked by the selection committee is how teams finish.  If you look at the Div I tournament, teams on the bubble that struggle down the stretch are looked at less favorably than those that finish strong.  That said, I would think the committee should take into consideration that Transy lost 2 of their last 3 games to finish the season including losing on their home floor in the HCAC Championship game.  Same goes for Witt losing on their home floor in the NCAC semis.  Meanwhile, Wooster went on the road and won the NCAC Championship. 

With things supposedly as close as they are in terms of going by the 5 primary criteria between Witt, Woo and Transy, I think if you look at which of these teams has the worse regional losses combined with who stumbled the most down the stretch, I'd say the edge goes to Wooster.  Add to that the fact that both Wooster and Witt have a better SOS than Transy and I'd say the Pios are hoping geography plays a strong role in hosting. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Flying Dutch Fan on February 27, 2012, 12:22:05 PM
After all that wonderful debate, both Wooster and Transy are hosting (as is Hope)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 27, 2012, 12:24:10 PM
@ Wooster.  Wooster vs Maryville, Randy-Mac vs Capital
@ Transy.  Witt vs Birmingham-Southern, Transy vs Carroll
@ Cabrini.  OWU vs Hobart, Cabrini vs Castelton State
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 27, 2012, 12:47:54 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 27, 2012, 12:24:10 PM
@ Wooster.  Wooster vs Maryville, Randy-Mac vs Capital
@ Transy.  Witt vs Birmingham-Southern, Transy vs Carroll
@ Cabrini.  OWU vs Hobart, Cabrini vs Castelton State

OWU might be a smart pick as a cinderella to make the sweet 16.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2012, 12:50:02 PM
I guess Witt's swoon forced it on the road. Transylvania's not an easy place to play but I think the Old Tigers may have a chance there if they can get past BSC, which may have a chip on its shoulder.

OWU has a pretty favorable draw, since Cabrini is another team that many wags have as over-rated.

The ODAC is down, but Randy-Mac does have some talent and I'd never dismiss an ODAC squad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 01:54:31 PM
Congrats on the three teams from the NCAC making the NCAA Tournament!   :) 

Glad to see Wooster rewarded with hosting in the first round.   ;D  Overall, I like Wooster's draw.  Opening round battle of the Scots.  Witt played at Maryville in a holiday tournament and beat them 77-70, not that that means anything much.  Witt also played and beat Capital back in December 69-63 for another common opponent in Wooster's pod. 

Looking at Witt's and OWU's draw, they seem to be quite favorable as well.  That first round match-up between Witt and Birmingham-Southern should be quite intriguing.  The winningest college basketball program and one of the most storied D3 basketball programs going up against the new kids on the block from B-S. 

As for OWU's bracket, Cabrini did advance to the Sweet 16 a year ago where they were shipped to Wooster and lost by 17 points so take that for what it's worth.  I do remember reading about how tough they are to beat at home though.

It certainly isn't out of the realm of possibility to see all 3 teams from the NCAC advance to the Sweet 16 though...  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on February 27, 2012, 03:50:30 PM
Wooster being put in Hope's sectional is not a real favorable draw.  Odds are whoever wins out at Wooster will be traveling to Hope the next weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2012, 05:13:18 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on February 27, 2012, 03:50:30 PM
Wooster being put in Hope's sectional is not a real favorable draw.  Odds are whoever wins out at Wooster will be traveling to Hope the next weekend.

I agree it's tough, but it's also completely fair. If it comes to pass, Hope-Wooster looks like a perfect Sweet Sixteen level game in the tournament. By DIII hoops Top 25 that would be roughly #1 vs. #15/16/17 (depends on where Wooster is slotted this week).

Translated into bracket seeds, that would make Hope a #1 and Wooster around a #4...which is exactly the matchup you would expect in the Sweet Sixteen round in a fully seeded bracket.

I think this is a case of the NCAA doing a very good balance in the bracket, so my kudos to them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2012, 05:26:27 PM
Elsewhere...

The All-NCAC Team has been announced. (http://www2.northcoast.org/sites/default/files/mbasketball/All-NCACmbkb12.pdf) Congratulations to Tim Brady, the Player of the Year, Bill Brown, the Coach of the Year, and Xavier Brown, the Newcomer of the Year. No real surprises there.

Team by team honorees:
Allegheny: James Ness (2nd team)
Denison: Dimonde Hale (1), Larry Farmer (2)
DePauw: Sean Haseley (2), Barry Flynn (HM)
Hiram: Jamaal Watkins (1)
Kenyon: Ikenna Nwadibia (2), Brian Lebowitz (HM)
Oberlin: James Fox (HM)
Ohio Wesleyan: Tim Brady (1), Andy Winters (2)
Wabash: Derek Bailey (1), Aaron Zinnerman (2), Brian Shelbourne (HM)
Wittenberg: Clayton Black (1), Michael Cooper (2), Alex Brandt (HM)
Wooster: Justin Hallowell (1), Xavier Brown (1)


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: OldDanny on February 27, 2012, 06:53:34 PM
Scots...you like OWU's draw because Cabrini may be a bit overrated.  Hmm....looking at the bracket, I see that OWU doesn't play Cabrini.  They play Hobart from the Liberty League.  You should know not to overlook anyone this time of year!  The Statesmen are a talented team!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2012, 06:54:44 PM
Almost every team in the tourney is talented and no one should be overlooked. However, having parsed the numbers I'd say OWU would be a favorite over Hobart.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scottiedoug on February 27, 2012, 06:55:52 PM
I want to encourage Wooster to focus on who they will play after they win the first pod.  After all, y'all have no reason to take the South seriously!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 27, 2012, 07:44:44 PM
Congrats on all the NCAC teams to make it! I will hopefully be making the trip Friday to see some NCAA tourney action in Lexington. A few thoughts:

Although I completely understand how Wooster got hosting rights over Wittenberg, doesn't mean I necessarily agree. (This doesn't mean I need to hear that Wooster won the conference tourney, I get it) I just think too much focus is on the conference tourney when Wittenberg was 5-0 against Great Lakes regional teams to make the tourney. Oh well. Both teams have their arguing points that could go both ways. Whether it be regional, or rewarding Wooster for winning the conference tourney, the decision was made so move on. I think if Witt would have made the finals they probably would have hosted. But, I did call this early on in the season when I stated that their home loss to Otterbein would possibly hurt them later on in the year.

Great draw for NCAC teams. OWU can definitely advance, Wooster should as they can beat Capital and Maryville. Wittenberg probably has the toughest draw of the 3 as Transylvania is a tough place to play.

A dream Elite Eight would be Wittenberg, Wooster and Hope in a sectional together. We shall see!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 27, 2012, 07:49:17 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 27, 2012, 07:44:44 PM


A dream Elite Eight would be Wittenberg, Wooster and Hope in a sectional together. We shall see!

That would be a Sweet Sixteen ;)........and in this bracket could also include Washington Univ as the 4th team.

That would be something to see.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2012, 08:31:37 PM
Quote from: sac on February 27, 2012, 07:49:17 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 27, 2012, 07:44:44 PM


A dream Elite Eight would be Wittenberg, Wooster and Hope in a sectional together. We shall see!

That would be a Sweet Sixteen ;)........and in this bracket could also include Washington Univ as the 4th team.

That would be something to see.

And it would almost assuredly be at Hope, at one of the finest DIII facilities in the country. That would be an incredible atmosphere for some DIII tournament hoops, basically sold-out games in a final-four-quality facility.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 27, 2012, 08:54:41 PM
As ScotsFan noted, it is great to see 3 NCAC teams make the tourney. :)  Congratulations to Wittenberg and Ohio Wesleyan on receiving their well deserved at large bids.  Good luck to all three teams in the big dance!

I agree with other posts that the first 2 rounds look reasonable for all 3 NCAC squads.  If OWU plays well, they should be able to beat Hobart.  Cabrini is very thin in the post and they have a small lineup with only one 6'7" guy -- this is essentially the same lineup that Wooster outrebounded 39 to 20 last year in the NCAA's when the Scots beat them by 17 points.

Wittenberg does have a tougher task having to play 2 games at Transy but I think they are capable of winning that pod.  Witt's big men will need to play well and they should be able to control the paint vs. BSC and likely Transy in the second round.  I watched some video of Transy vs. Rose Hulman on Sunday and was not particularly impressed.

With Wooster hosting, they have a real home court advantage with the Timken crowd.  Maryville's schedule and 18-9 record do not suggest a strong team but after all they are "Scots" too so Wooster better take them seriously. ;D  Over the years, I have also  learned to respect both OAC and ODAC teams so IF Wooster advances to the second round, they cannot take either Cap or Randy Mac lightly.  Overall, Wooster has an excellent chance of winning its pod and advancing to the Sweet 16, IMO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 09:29:54 PM
Quote from: OldDanny on February 27, 2012, 06:53:34 PM
Scots...you like OWU's draw because Cabrini may be a bit overrated.  Hmm....looking at the bracket, I see that OWU doesn't play Cabrini.  They play Hobart from the Liberty League.  You should know not to overlook anyone this time of year!  The Statesmen are a talented team!

OD, where did I say Cabrini was overrated?  I was actually trying to point out why I didn't think OWU should take Cabrini lightly and buy into their reputation of being overrated as smeds indicated should the Bishops defeat Hobart and meet up with Cabrini in the 2nd round.  Also, as a fan, I think I can overlook an opponent if I choose to do so.  And I'm fairly certain that OWU isn't overlooking anyone.  Hobart may very well be a talented team but it is my opinion that OWU is going to be more than prepared to face your talented Hobart team due to the Bishops being battle tested in a very deep and competitive NCAC this season.  The fact that the NCAC was awarded two Pool C's speaks volumes as to how difficult our league was this season.

Quote from: scottiedoug on February 27, 2012, 06:55:52 PM
I want to encourage Wooster to focus on who they will play after they win the first pod.  After all, y'all have no reason to take the South seriously!

Again, because some fans may be looking ahead hardly translates to the coaches and players doing the same thing.  I guarantee Maryville will have Wooster's coaches and players full attention and focus.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2012, 09:32:06 PM
I mentioned that 'many wags' have Cabrini as overrated.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 09:50:18 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on February 27, 2012, 03:50:30 PM
Wooster being put in Hope's sectional is not a real favorable draw.  Odds are whoever wins out at Wooster will be traveling to Hope the next weekend.

Hope may have an easy first round opponent, but having to play the winner of traditional powerhouse programs IWU and UWSP will be no gimme for the Dutchmen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2012, 10:08:42 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 09:50:18 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on February 27, 2012, 03:50:30 PM
Wooster being put in Hope's sectional is not a real favorable draw.  Odds are whoever wins out at Wooster will be traveling to Hope the next weekend.

Hope may have an easy first round opponent, but having to play the winner of traditional powerhouse programs IWU and UWSP will be no gimme for the Dutchmen.

You're right; it won't be a gimme. However, IWU is a good-but-not-great team that comes stumbling into the tourney having gone 4-4 over its last eight games, while UWSP has lost its top scorer, Tyler Tillema (17.3 ppg) to a thumb injury.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 11:19:10 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2012, 10:08:42 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 09:50:18 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on February 27, 2012, 03:50:30 PM
Wooster being put in Hope's sectional is not a real favorable draw.  Odds are whoever wins out at Wooster will be traveling to Hope the next weekend.

Hope may have an easy first round opponent, but having to play the winner of traditional powerhouse programs IWU and UWSP will be no gimme for the Dutchmen.

You're right; it won't be a gimme. However, IWU is a good-but-not-great team that comes stumbling into the tourney having gone 4-4 over its last eight games, while UWSP has lost its top scorer, Tyler Tillema (17.3 ppg) to a thumb injury.

To be fair to IWU, those four losses were @ #24 Wheaton, @ orv Augie, home to # 23NCC and @Wheaton again in the CCIW semis, all teams that finished in the top 4 in the CCIW so they weren't bad losses by any means...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scottiedoug on February 27, 2012, 11:28:14 PM
"Again, because some fans may be looking ahead hardly translates to the coaches and players doing the same thing.  I guarantee Maryville will have Wooster's coaches and players full attention and focus."

I was thinking this would be the case.  After all, they are Scots too and thus wise and determined.
The Maryville Scots are young and better than they were earlier (when they lost to Witt) but still play freshmen a lot of minutes.  I wish I could be there to see how the Murvul Scots handle being in such a difficult environment for visitors.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2012, 11:34:46 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 11:19:10 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2012, 10:08:42 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 09:50:18 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on February 27, 2012, 03:50:30 PM
Wooster being put in Hope's sectional is not a real favorable draw.  Odds are whoever wins out at Wooster will be traveling to Hope the next weekend.

Hope may have an easy first round opponent, but having to play the winner of traditional powerhouse programs IWU and UWSP will be no gimme for the Dutchmen.

You're right; it won't be a gimme. However, IWU is a good-but-not-great team that comes stumbling into the tourney having gone 4-4 over its last eight games, while UWSP has lost its top scorer, Tyler Tillema (17.3 ppg) to a thumb injury.

To be fair to IWU, those four losses were @ #24 Wheaton, @ orv Augie, home to # 23NCC and @Wheaton again in the CCIW semis, all teams that finished in the top 4 in the CCIW so they weren't bad losses by any means...

No, not bad losses, but it's still a good-but-not-great team. Having seen both Hope and IWU this season, I can state with reasonable certainty that if IWU beats Hope at DeVos it'll be a considerable upset. I was fairly surprised that Wheaton made a late run and almost beat Hope at DeVos back before Christmas, since Hope's definitely a better team than Wheaton ... and Wheaton's definitely a better team than IWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 28, 2012, 12:17:56 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2012, 11:34:46 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 11:19:10 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2012, 10:08:42 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 09:50:18 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on February 27, 2012, 03:50:30 PM
Wooster being put in Hope's sectional is not a real favorable draw.  Odds are whoever wins out at Wooster will be traveling to Hope the next weekend.

Hope may have an easy first round opponent, but having to play the winner of traditional powerhouse programs IWU and UWSP will be no gimme for the Dutchmen.

You're right; it won't be a gimme. However, IWU is a good-but-not-great team that comes stumbling into the tourney having gone 4-4 over its last eight games, while UWSP has lost its top scorer, Tyler Tillema (17.3 ppg) to a thumb injury.

To be fair to IWU, those four losses were @ #24 Wheaton, @ orv Augie, home to # 23NCC and @Wheaton again in the CCIW semis, all teams that finished in the top 4 in the CCIW so they weren't bad losses by any means...

No, not bad losses, but it's still a good-but-not-great team. Having seen both Hope and IWU this season, I can state with reasonable certainty that if IWU beats Hope at DeVos it'll be a considerable upset. I was fairly surprised that Wheaton made a late run and almost beat Hope at DeVos  at Van Noord Arena at Calvin back before Christmas, since Hope's definitely a better team than Wheaton ... and Wheaton's definitely a better team than IWU.

Fixed it for you. ;)

Not to hijack the board, but that Wheaton game for Hope was weird because 3 Hope starters played less than 20 minutes due to foul trouble.  Wheaton's Aaron Garriot faced the same problem and he was the toughest matchup on the floor for Hope that day.  A full game from Aaron might have seen a different result.  Both teams were reaching deep for minutes.  At the end Wheaton just made an all out effort while Hope just couldn't finish off plays on their end and ended up having to steal the game away to win it.

Until this weekend it was really the closest full 40 minutes anybody has been with Hope all season(and Wheaton still included a double digit Hope lead).....at the games I saw.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2012, 09:23:24 AM
Quote from: scottiedoug on February 27, 2012, 11:28:14 PM
"Again, because some fans may be looking ahead hardly translates to the coaches and players doing the same thing.  I guarantee Maryville will have Wooster's coaches and players full attention and focus."

I was thinking this would be the case.  After all, they are Scots too and thus wise and determined.
The Maryville Scots are young and better than they were earlier (when they lost to Witt) but still play freshmen a lot of minutes. I wish I could be there to see how the Murvul Scots handle being in such a difficult environment for visitors.

The Wooster Scots are also young as we lost 3 key starters off of last year's national runner up team.  Arguably Wooster's best player this season is a freshman guard who just won NCAC Newcomer of the Year.  And then there are 3 other freshmen contributors that come off the bench and log around 15 minutes/game.

Wooster has their NCAA Tournament page up and here is the link to it:  Wooster to Host NCAA First- and Second-Round Action (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/ncaa/openingrounds/index)

There are links to all four teams available.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2012, 07:58:52 PM
Quote from: sac on February 28, 2012, 12:17:56 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2012, 11:34:46 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 11:19:10 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2012, 10:08:42 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 09:50:18 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on February 27, 2012, 03:50:30 PM
Wooster being put in Hope's sectional is not a real favorable draw.  Odds are whoever wins out at Wooster will be traveling to Hope the next weekend.

Hope may have an easy first round opponent, but having to play the winner of traditional powerhouse programs IWU and UWSP will be no gimme for the Dutchmen.

You're right; it won't be a gimme. However, IWU is a good-but-not-great team that comes stumbling into the tourney having gone 4-4 over its last eight games, while UWSP has lost its top scorer, Tyler Tillema (17.3 ppg) to a thumb injury.

To be fair to IWU, those four losses were @ #24 Wheaton, @ orv Augie, home to # 23NCC and @Wheaton again in the CCIW semis, all teams that finished in the top 4 in the CCIW so they weren't bad losses by any means...

No, not bad losses, but it's still a good-but-not-great team. Having seen both Hope and IWU this season, I can state with reasonable certainty that if IWU beats Hope at DeVos it'll be a considerable upset. I was fairly surprised that Wheaton made a late run and almost beat Hope at DeVos  at Van Noord Arena at Calvin back before Christmas, since Hope's definitely a better team than Wheaton ... and Wheaton's definitely a better team than IWU.

Fixed it for you. ;)

Sorry. I keep mixing up the two Master Plans. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HopeConvert on February 28, 2012, 09:08:30 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2012, 07:58:52 PM
Quote from: sac on February 28, 2012, 12:17:56 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2012, 11:34:46 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 11:19:10 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2012, 10:08:42 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2012, 09:50:18 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on February 27, 2012, 03:50:30 PM
Wooster being put in Hope's sectional is not a real favorable draw.  Odds are whoever wins out at Wooster will be traveling to Hope the next weekend.

Hope may have an easy first round opponent, but having to play the winner of traditional powerhouse programs IWU and UWSP will be no gimme for the Dutchmen.

You're right; it won't be a gimme. However, IWU is a good-but-not-great team that comes stumbling into the tourney having gone 4-4 over its last eight games, while UWSP has lost its top scorer, Tyler Tillema (17.3 ppg) to a thumb injury.

To be fair to IWU, those four losses were @ #24 Wheaton, @ orv Augie, home to # 23NCC and @Wheaton again in the CCIW semis, all teams that finished in the top 4 in the CCIW so they weren't bad losses by any means...

No, not bad losses, but it's still a good-but-not-great team. Having seen both Hope and IWU this season, I can state with reasonable certainty that if IWU beats Hope at DeVos it'll be a considerable upset. I was fairly surprised that Wheaton made a late run and almost beat Hope at DeVos  at Van Noord Arena at Calvin back before Christmas, since Hope's definitely a better team than Wheaton ... and Wheaton's definitely a better team than IWU.

Fixed it for you. ;)

Sorry. I keep mixing up the two Master Plans. ;)

Hope's is the first one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 28, 2012, 10:44:00 PM
Some information on Witt's first round opponent.  Birmingham Southern runs a 10 man rotation (#10 guy plays 14 minutes/game) which sounds impressive until you realize that their lineup is short and they are vulnerable in the paint.  Of their top 10 guys, only one player is 6'7" and one other player is 6'6".  The remaining 8 guys are all guards and wings.

How vulnerable is Birmingham Southern (BSC) inside?  Well, some Wooster fans will remember 6'5" freshman Greg Ross out of Cincinnati who transferred out of Wooster after his first year.  He transferred to Centre College and has been a starter there for the last 2 seasons.

This past weekend in the SCAC tourney semi-finals played AT Birmingham Southern, 6'5" Senior Greg Ross pounded BSC for 28 points, 9 boards in leading Centre to the win that pushed BSC into their Pool C bid.

So if Greg Ross can punish BSC inside, how much damage can 6'7" Clayton Black, 6'7" Alex Brandt and 6'6" Jacob Weide do in the paint vs. Birmingham Southern?  Attention Bill Brown - feed the post on every Witt possession!  ;) ;D

GO TIGERS!  Represent the NCAC! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 29, 2012, 10:17:20 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 28, 2012, 10:44:00 PM
Some information on Witt's first round opponent.  Birmingham Southern runs a 10 man rotation (#10 guy plays 14 minutes/game) which sounds impressive until you realize that their lineup is short and they are vulnerable in the paint.  Of their top 10 guys, only one player is 6'7" and one other player is 6'6".  The remaining 8 guys are all guards and wings.

How vulnerable is Birmingham Southern (BSC) inside?  Well, some Wooster fans will remember 6'5" freshman Greg Ross out of Cincinnati who transferred out of Wooster after his first year.  He transferred to Centre College and has been a starter there for the last 2 seasons.

This past weekend in the SCAC tourney semi-finals played AT Birmingham Southern, 6'5" Senior Greg Ross pounded BSC for 28 points, 9 boards in leading Centre to the win that pushed BSC into their Pool C bid.

So if Greg Ross can punish BSC inside, how much damage can 6'7" Clayton Black, 6'7" Alex Brandt and 6'6" Jacob Weide do in the paint vs. Birmingham Southern?  Attention Bill Brown - feed the post on every Witt possession!  ;) ;D

GO TIGERS!  Represent the NCAC! 

wsf, thanks for the rundown of B-S.  Witt's post players must be licking their chops in seeing those numbers Ross put up for Centre.  I mean, 28 points and 9 boards?   :o

I've taken a glance at Maryville's roster and stats and I'm not seeing anything that jumps off the pages at me.  I will say one thing that the northern Scots are going to have to guard against is turning the ball over.  The southern Scots are forcing nearly 16 to's per game.  Wooster has done a better job of taking care of the ball down the stretch and are actually only averaging 13 per game on the season.  If Wooster can handle the Maryville defensive pressure, that won't bode well for the southern Scots.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scottiedoug on February 29, 2012, 01:34:47 PM
Maryville has several players who can shoot well and if a couple of them are doing so, it might be interesting.  If you do not work hard at defense for Coach Lambert, you do not play much, and they have had spurts of being pretty good defensively.  For whatever it is worth, the Wittenberg game was closer than the score and the southern scots are better now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 29, 2012, 04:02:53 PM
The schedule strengths of the OWU bracket are something.  This is using masseyratings.com in BCS mode which takes out scoring margin.


Cabrini--#248
Castleton--#385
Hobart--#215
Ohio Wesleyan--#19

This doesn't make OWU the favorite, but I think it points out they have have played way better competition than the other 3 teams in this bracket.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 29, 2012, 04:06:15 PM
Quote from: scottiedoug on February 29, 2012, 01:34:47 PM
Maryville has several players who can shoot well and if a couple of them are doing so, it might be interesting.  If you do not work hard at defense for Coach Lambert, you do not play much, and they have had spurts of being pretty good defensively.  For whatever it is worth, the Wittenberg game was closer than the score and the southern scots are better now.

Wooster can play some pretty stifling defense as well and they have been since the post season started.  In 2 of Wooster's 3 conference tournament games, the northern Scots held their opponents to under 35% from the field and under 20% from beyond the arc.

A matchup to keep an eye on is Maryville's leading scorer, Milton Stanley, who is averaging 17 ppg against Wooster's defensive stopper, Justin Warnes.  Warnes has made a habbit of shutting down opponent's leading scorers over his career so we'll see if he can do it once again Friday against Stanley.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 29, 2012, 04:10:38 PM
Quote from: sac on February 29, 2012, 04:02:53 PM
The schedule strengths of the OWU bracket are something.  This is using masseyratings.com in BCS mode which takes out scoring margin.


Cabrini--#248
Castleton--#385
Hobart--#215
Ohio Wesleyan--#19

This doesn't make OWU the favorite, but I think it points out they have have played way better competition than the other 3 teams in this bracket.

Sort of backs up why some of us are of the opinion that this is a favorable draw for the Bishops...   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 29, 2012, 04:13:08 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 29, 2012, 04:10:38 PM
Quote from: sac on February 29, 2012, 04:02:53 PM
The schedule strengths of the OWU bracket are something.  This is using masseyratings.com in BCS mode which takes out scoring margin.


Cabrini--#248
Castleton--#385
Hobart--#215
Ohio Wesleyan--#19

This doesn't make OWU the favorite, but I think it points out they have have played way better competition than the other 3 teams in this bracket.

Sort of backs up why some of us are of the opinion that this is a favorable draw for the Bishops...   8-)

... and it makes me feel pretty darned good about having Tim Brady on my tournament fantasy team. 8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 29, 2012, 05:22:26 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 29, 2012, 04:13:08 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 29, 2012, 04:10:38 PM
Quote from: sac on February 29, 2012, 04:02:53 PM
The schedule strengths of the OWU bracket are something.  This is using masseyratings.com in BCS mode which takes out scoring margin.


Cabrini--#248
Castleton--#385
Hobart--#215
Ohio Wesleyan--#19

This doesn't make OWU the favorite, but I think it points out they have have played way better competition than the other 3 teams in this bracket.

Sort of backs up why some of us are of the opinion that this is a favorable draw for the Bishops...   8-)

... and it makes me feel pretty darned good about having Tim Brady on my tournament fantasy team. 8-)

... and now you know why I was pimping him on that board. I think he has a good chance to put up some big numbers and play in at least three games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 29, 2012, 06:27:02 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 29, 2012, 04:06:15 PM
Quote from: scottiedoug on February 29, 2012, 01:34:47 PM
Maryville has several players who can shoot well and if a couple of them are doing so, it might be interesting.  If you do not work hard at defense for Coach Lambert, you do not play much, and they have had spurts of being pretty good defensively.  For whatever it is worth, the Wittenberg game was closer than the score and the southern scots are better now.

Wooster can play some pretty stifling defense as well and they have been since the post season started.  In 2 of Wooster's 3 conference tournament games, the northern Scots held their opponents to under 35% from the field and under 20% from beyond the arc.

A matchup to keep an eye on is Maryville's leading scorer, Milton Stanley, who is averaging 17 ppg against Wooster's defensive stopper, Justin Warnes.  Warnes has made a habbit of shutting down opponent's leading scorers over his career so we'll see if he can do it once again Friday against Stanley.

Let's hope that the Maryville team doesn't pop in here and grab some bulletin board material.  :-X
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nuscottsfan on February 29, 2012, 07:09:04 PM
Wooster Booster,
The Fighting Scots should come out and "just be" the Fighting Scots. The NCAC is a tough conference and after this season of ups and downs the Scots' MIS (Men In Suits) will be singularly focused on this game and (I'm sure) will have the TEAM solely focused on this game regardless of individual accolades procured.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 29, 2012, 07:23:43 PM
When I was driving through campus this morning, Josh Claytor crossed in front of me...and he was limping (just a little bit though.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 01, 2012, 09:47:07 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 29, 2012, 06:27:02 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 29, 2012, 04:06:15 PM
Quote from: scottiedoug on February 29, 2012, 01:34:47 PM
Maryville has several players who can shoot well and if a couple of them are doing so, it might be interesting.  If you do not work hard at defense for Coach Lambert, you do not play much, and they have had spurts of being pretty good defensively.  For whatever it is worth, the Wittenberg game was closer than the score and the southern scots are better now.

Wooster can play some pretty stifling defense as well and they have been since the post season started.  In 2 of Wooster's 3 conference tournament games, the northern Scots held their opponents to under 35% from the field and under 20% from beyond the arc.

A matchup to keep an eye on is Maryville's leading scorer, Milton Stanley, who is averaging 17 ppg against Wooster's defensive stopper, Justin Warnes.  Warnes has made a habbit of shutting down opponent's leading scorers over his career so we'll see if he can do it once again Friday against Stanley.

Let's hope that the Maryville team doesn't pop in here and grab some bulletin board material.  :-X

While I'm flattered that you would think what I said warrants bulletin board material, I have one thing to say about that.  If Maryville needs banter from some fans on a hoops forum to post on their bulletin board as motivation to beat Wooster than they are in more trouble than I thought...  8-)   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scottiedoug on March 01, 2012, 10:59:21 AM
I can think of quite a few things that will motivate the southern scots and talk on this board is not one of them.  I do hope some of them are effective against a real good team playing at home.  This is a matchup between two coaches each with over 600 career wins, so preparation and motivation are most likely not problems.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 01, 2012, 12:01:55 PM
Quote from: scottiedoug on March 01, 2012, 10:59:21 AM
I can think of quite a few things that will motivate the southern scots and talk on this board is not one of them.  I do hope some of them are effective against a real good team playing at home.  This is a matchup between two coaches each with over 600 career wins, so preparation and motivation are most likely not problems.

Agreed!   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 01, 2012, 02:13:24 PM
Outside of the Wooster area, Steve Moore's method of game preparation is little known.  Within the inner circle of his program, however, the coach's M.O. is legendary.  Moore, over the years, has adopted the Zen-like philosophy of St. John's football coach, John Gagliardi.  Gagliardi's teams, famously, avoid hitting in practice and rarely even wear pads.  Steve Moore has not only transposed this premise to his sport, but expanded on it.

Pregame work this week has developed, as always, in stages.  On Monday mornings, the staff begins the day by removing all the hoops in the gym.  The results of all shot attempts are then determined by the honor system.  If the shooter truly feels that he had a good look, was on-balance, and had a good release, points are recorded.  Tuesdays take it a step further; the backboards are now also among the missing.

Practices on Wednesdays are a throwback to the old "Shadowball" days of Negro League baseball.  The spheres themselves are locked away; all drills and competition are done using only imaginary Wilsons.  The focus of the players is now extraordinary; as is their integrity.  No officials are necessary; players call their own fouls.

On Thursdays before game day, all of the windows in Timken are covered with black shades.  The lights are off, and stay off.  In the pitch black room, the players sit around the center circle.  A single clap of the hands by Doug Cline indicates that the ball has been tossed to open the game.  Experienced observers, watching the synchronous expressions on the faces of the players, can follow the movement of the mystical ball through their collective minds.  In this exercise, only a single opponent has yet to score; an inadvertent sneeze by Justin Warnes allowed Wittenberg's Chris Sullivan to bury a lucky three.

Printed with permission of the COW basketball program. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 01, 2012, 02:18:00 PM
Had me going there for a bit...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scottiedoug on March 01, 2012, 02:37:01 PM
Nice try!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 01, 2012, 03:02:26 PM
Let me just say good luck to all NCAC entrants into the tournament. May you live on past this weekend!

(Even Wittenberg, though if it was DePauw I would have to reconsider my abject loyalty to the NCAC. Perhaps I'd just say "don't embarrass us when you lose" to DPU!  ;) )
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 01, 2012, 06:57:49 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 01, 2012, 02:13:24 PM
Outside of the Wooster area, Steve Moore's method of game preparation is little known.  Within the inner circle of his program, however, the coach's M.O. is legendary.  Moore, over the years, has adopted the Zen-like philosophy of St. John's football coach, John Gagliardi.  Gagliardi's teams, famously, avoid hitting in practice and rarely even wear pads.  Steve Moore has not only transposed this premise to his sport, but expanded on it.

Pregame work this week has developed, as always, in stages.  On Monday mornings, the staff begins the day by removing all the hoops in the gym.  The results of all shot attempts are then determined by the honor system.  If the shooter truly feels that he had a good look, was on-balance, and had a good release, points are recorded.  Tuesdays take it a step further; the backboards are now also among the missing.

Practices on Wednesdays are a throwback to the old "Shadowball" days of Negro League baseball.  The spheres themselves are locked away; all drills and competition are done using only imaginary Wilsons.  The focus of the players is now extraordinary; as is their integrity.  No officials are necessary; players call their own fouls.

On Thursdays before game day, all of the windows in Timken are covered with black shades.  The lights are off, and stay off.  In the pitch black room, the players sit around the center circle.  A single clap of the hands by Doug Cline indicates that the ball has been tossed to open the game.  Experienced observers, watching the synchronous expressions on the faces of the players, can follow the movement of the mystical ball through their collective minds.  In this exercise, only a single opponent has yet to score; an inadvertent sneeze by Justin Warnes allowed Wittenberg's Chris Sullivan to bury a lucky three.

Printed with permission of the COW basketball program.

And here I thought they just played around with a Rubik's Cube during practice to get themselves ready...  :P 

COW Men's Basketball and the Rubik's Cube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w2KHqkwfFoE)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 01, 2012, 10:24:02 PM
Good luck to all of the NCAC teams tomorrow in the Dance!

I'm rooting for some NCAC wins all over my bracket, which has the three teams collectively picking up 7 wins in the tournament. I'd love to see that start with a 3-0 day tomorrow.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2012, 09:42:38 AM
I will echo those wishing good luck to the NCAC participants in the Dance starting tonight! 


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2012, 04:37:13 PM
Off to Timken in a few. Go (Wooster) Scots! Go Tigers! Go Bishops! and Go (Lady) Tigers! Let's have 4 wins tonight!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on March 02, 2012, 06:09:44 PM
OWU up 33-28 on Hobart at the half.  Up by nine, the Bishops let Hobart come back and tie at 28.  A quick bucket by Winters and Brady's first 3 pter of the day at the buzzer gave them the lead into the intermission.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 02, 2012, 06:19:52 PM
If anyone's wondering, apparently the games at Transylvania have been delayed because of weather that moved through the area. Wittenberg-BSC now set to tip at 7:30.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on March 02, 2012, 07:14:05 PM
Final - Hobart 64  OWU 60.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 02, 2012, 07:16:27 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 02, 2012, 06:19:52 PM
If anyone's wondering, apparently the games at Transylvania have been delayed because of weather that moved through the area. Wittenberg-BSC now set to tip at 7:30.

That weather was deadly. Lots of carnage in Southern Indiana, Kentucky and other states.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 02, 2012, 07:16:56 PM
Nuts. The late season gremlins that plagued OWU reared their head again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2012, 07:18:28 PM
Quote from: GoRed on March 02, 2012, 07:14:05 PM
Final - Hobart 64  OWU 60.

So much for my thoughts on a favorable draw for the Bishops...  ::) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2012, 07:22:10 PM
Ohio Wesleyan threw away their game...literally in the last 47 seconds at the end of the game. ::)  I watched the video.

OWU led 60 to 56 with 47 seconds left and they missed the front end of a 1&1 free throw that would have extended their lead.

After Hobart scored on its next possession to make it 60-58, OWU threw away the inbounds pass.  Hobart player was fouled, made first free throw and missed the second.  However, OWU let Hobart claim the rebound and they turned it into 2 more points for a 5 point trip down the floor!  It was Hobart 61-60 and Brady missed his next shot so OWU had to foul.  After Hobart made two free throws, there were 8 seconds left and Andy Winters panicked after crossing half court and threw up a wild shot/pass(?) that went out of bounds  So, OWU never even got off a reasonable three point shot to tie the game and Hobart nailed one more free throw for the final score.

I hate to say it but it was about the worst 47 seconds of basketball that I have seen a team play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 02, 2012, 07:38:51 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2012, 07:22:10 PM
Ohio Wesleyan threw away their game...literally in the last 47 seconds at the end of the game. ::)  I watched the video.

OWU led 60 to 56 with 47 seconds left and they missed the front end of a 1&1 free throw that would have extended their lead.

After Hobart scored on its next possession to make it 60-58, OWU threw away the inbounds pass.  Hobart player was fouled, made first free throw and missed the second.  However, OWU let Hobart claim the rebound and they turned it into 2 more points for a 5 point trip down the floor!  It was Hobart 61-60 and Brady missed his next shot so OWU had to foul.  After Hobart made two free throws, there were 8 seconds left and Andy Winters panicked after crossing half court and threw up a wild shot/pass(?) that went out of bounds  So, OWU never even got off a reasonable three point shot to tie the game and Hobart nailed one more free throw for the final score.

I hate to say it but it was about the worst 47 seconds of basketball that I have seen a team play.

Completely agree. OWU let a game they should've won get away from them through incredibly poor execution at the end. The last minute was a disaster, as wooscotsfan notes, but even before that OWU ran several bad offensive possessions with poor shot selection, poor clock management and poor execution. For example, with 5 minutes left and a 7 point lead, Andy Winters took an ill-advised shot after only taking 14 seconds off the shot clock; their next offensive possession was an unnecessary offensive foul by Greg White (throwing an elbow/lowering the shoulder). Later, with under three minutes to go and with a 6 point lead, Brady fired off a poor look at a 3 after again only expending 14 seconds off the shot clock.

Hobart ended the game on an OWU-enabled 10-0 run for the victory.

A very disappointing performance from the Bishops.   :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 02, 2012, 08:19:16 PM
We know how much better the NCAC is this year - but this OWU performance doesn't bode well to the thought that's it's "Witt and Woo and I Don't Know Who..."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2012, 08:31:03 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 33  Maryville 33

Wooster started off with ice cold shooting and trailed early 21 to 11.  Scots went on a 16-4 run to retake the lead.

Northern Scots are being led by Justin Hallowell with 12 points and Josh Claytor with 12 points.

Southern Scots are being led by Milton Stanley with 11 points and Wesley Lambert with 8 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2012, 09:34:19 PM
Final: Wooster 70  Maryville 63  :)

Wooster was led by Justin Hallowell with 23 points (10 boards), Josh Claytor with 15 (12 Boards) and Xavier Brown with 12.

Maryville's top scorers were Milton Stanley with 21 and Wesley Lambert with 12

Congratulations to Matt Fegan for tying the Division III record for most career games played at 124

Wooster is now 25-4.  ;D   Next up is Capital tomorrow in the NCAA 2nd round!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2012, 09:44:17 PM
Final: Wittenberg 63  Birmingham Southern 56   :)

Congratulations to the Tigers on a nice first round win!

Witt was led tonight by Josh McKee with 18 points, Alex Brandt with 14 and Clayton Black with 13.

Tigers play the winner of the Carroll - Transy game in the 2nd round.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on March 02, 2012, 10:07:26 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2012, 09:34:19 PM
Final: Wooster 70  Maryville 63  :)

Wooster was led by Justin Hallowell with 23 points (10 boards), Josh Claytor with 15 (12 Boards) and Xavier Brown with 12.

Maryville's top scorers were Milton Stanley with 21 and Wesley Lambert with 12

Congratulations to Matt Fegan for tying the Division III record for most career games played at 124

Wooster is now 25-4.  ;D   Next up is Capital tomorrow in the NCAA 2nd round!

GO SCOTS!

Gritty performance by Claytor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2012, 12:07:29 AM
Final: Carroll 84 Transylvania 74

Huge upset as Carroll knocks off host Transy.  So, it is Wittenberg vs. Carroll tomorrow on a neutral floor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 03, 2012, 07:45:16 AM
wow capital vs. wooster. Can this possibly match the great game in 09? Trying to talk my wife into making the drive from columbus. Does anyone know what the ticket situation is for tonights game? Would hate to make the drive and find it sold out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 03, 2012, 07:47:57 AM
No advance ticket sales, doors open at 5:30.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 03, 2012, 08:50:32 AM
thanks for the info. Will be making the trip(hopefully).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 03, 2012, 09:47:21 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2012, 12:07:29 AM
Final: Carroll 84 Transylvania 74

Huge upset as Carroll knocks off host Transy.  So, it is Wittenberg vs. Carroll tomorrow on a neutral floor.

I can imagine the weather and the delayed start probably threw everything into a tizzy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2012, 11:39:21 AM
Wooster vs Capital matchups:

Wooster 25-4 (NCAC automatic bid)
Starters:
5'11" Fr. Xavier Brown  12.8 ppg, 3.6 rpg, 103 FT attempts - 75% FT shooting
6'1"  Sr. Matt Fegan  7.6 ppg, 47% on three pointers (57 made)
6'3"  Sr. Justin Warnes  5.1 ppg, 4.1 rpg, best defender
6'7"  Sr. Justin Hallowell  13.8 ppg, 6.7 rpg, 40% on three pointers (69 made)
6'7"  Jr. Josh Claytor  11.1 ppg, 5.2 rpg, 62% FG shooting

Key Reserves:
5'9"  So. Doug Thorpe  6.3 ppg, 41% on three pointers (35 made)
6'0"  Fr. Jalen Goodwin  2.3 ppg, 1.6 rpg
6'2"  Fr. Evan Pannell  3.0 ppg, 65% FG shooting
6'5"  Fr. Kenny DeBoer  4.1 ppg, 2.4 rpg
6'8"  Jr. Jake Mays  6.2 ppg, 4.5 rpg, 57% FG shooting

Capital 19-9 (OAC automatic bid)
Starters:
6'0"  Jr. Mitch Westerheide  6.9 ppg, 2.8 rpg
6'1"  Sr. Kelly Winter  13.8 ppg, 181 FT attempts - 82% FT shooting
6'3"  Jr. Michael Sommer  11.8 ppg, 4.5 rpg, 38% on three pointers (52 made)
6'5"  So. Ben Danhoff  2.4 ppg, 2.3 rpg
6'6"  Jr. Spencer Niekamp  14.4 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 115 FT attempts - 77% FT shooting, (35 three pointers made)

Key Reserves:
5'10" Jr. Damon Dillard  2.3 ppg
6'0"  Jr. Tim Congrove  2.2 ppg
6'4"  Sr. Tyler Munro  5.1 ppg, 1.9 rpg, 36% on three pointers (28 made)
6'4"  Jr. Ben Jackson  6.8 ppg, 4.9 rpg, 54% FG shooting
6'8"  So. Jared Cashen  2.7 ppg, 1.2 rpg

Capital wins games by holding opponents to only 42.6% FG shooting and their aggressive defense won the Randy Mac game.

On offense, Kelly Winter and Spencer Niekamp both force you to foul.  Both of these guys play over 30 minutes per game and have more free throw attempts than anyone on Wooster's team (Xavier Brown has 103 FT attempts).  Wooster will need to defend Winter and Niekamp well without fouling them.

Wooster should have an advantage in the paint if Claytor can give another gritty performance tonight.  Hopefully, they can use their height advantage to win the rebound battle.  Wooster's team 47.3% FG shooting is also higher than Capital's 45.4% for the season.

GO SCOTS!   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 03, 2012, 11:58:52 AM
nice breakdown Scotsfan. This is shaping up to be another great game between these two. A little historical perspective of the last tournament meeting. Shortly after Cap defeated Wooster Wall Street bottomed out and now has doubled in the three years since. Did Wall Street see the Cap win as a good sign and what will happen Monday if Wooster wins? Could we see another Wall Street Collapse if the Scot's win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2012, 12:13:57 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2012, 11:39:21 AM
6'6"  Jr. Spencer Niekamp  14.4 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 115 FT attempts - 77% FT shooting, (35 three pointers made)

Is there a family relationship between Spencer and former Capital player Ross Niekamp? Younger brother or cousin?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2012, 12:46:53 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2012, 12:13:57 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2012, 11:39:21 AM
6'6"  Jr. Spencer Niekamp  14.4 ppg, 4.6 rpg, 115 FT attempts - 77% FT shooting, (35 three pointers made)

Is there a family relationship between Spencer and former Capital player Ross Niekamp? Younger brother or cousin?

Yes, Spencer is the younger brother of Ross.

Here is the link: http://www.capital.edu/Spencer-Niekamp.aspx     Family relationship under "personal" section.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2012, 01:40:32 PM
An impressive note from the Wittenberg-BSC write up (http://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2011-12/contrib/20120303o3hk68): Bill Brown's teams are a perfect 8-0 in NCAA first round action, and have advanced to the second round all 12 times they've made the tournament (including 4 times they had a first round bye).

I'm still bummed that OWU didn't make it a perfect 3-0 for NCAC teams yesterday, but good luck to both the Tigers and the Scots tonight!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 03, 2012, 02:25:17 PM
I noted on the map that St. Louis (Wash U.) and Wooster are over 500 miles apart, so if Hope goes down tonight but the other "seeds" advance, my guess is that Witt would be hosting the regional, based primarily on geography.  If Hope wins, I would certainly expect the regional to be up in Holland.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 03, 2012, 02:47:24 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2012, 01:40:32 PM
An impressive note from the Wittenberg-BSC write up (http://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2011-12/contrib/20120303o3hk68): Bill Brown's teams are a perfect 8-0 in NCAA first round action, and have advanced to the second round all 12 times they've made the tournament (including 4 times they had a first round bye).

I'm still bummed that OWU didn't make it a perfect 3-0 for NCAC teams yesterday, but good luck to both the Tigers and the Scots tonight!

The perfect first round performance by Wittenberg is very impressive. I looked in the media guide to see what Wooster has done under Steve Moore. Unfortunately I cannot tell if they received a first round bye (back when there were 48 teams in the tournament is certainly was more common). What I can tell is that in first game performances Wooster is 13-7 (including last night). Overall Coach Moore's Scots are now 25-20 in the NCAA tournament (18-5 @ home, 1-10 @ away, 6-5 @ neutral).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2012, 02:50:25 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 03, 2012, 02:25:17 PM
I noted on the map that St. Louis (Wash U.) and Wooster are over 500 miles apart, so if Hope goes down tonight but the other "seeds" advance, my guess is that Witt would be hosting the regional, based primarily on geography.  If Hope wins, I would certainly expect the regional to be up in Holland.

What is the probability of North Central, Wittenberg, Illinois Wesleyan and Wooster being the teams left in the sectional?  That scenario would likely have Wooster hosting and it would be a NCAC - CCIW showdown!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2012, 02:55:06 PM
The last 10 years in the NCAA tourney (including this year), Wooster is now 21-10 and they have been to the Final 4 three times during that span!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 03, 2012, 03:03:15 PM
Where were the Wooster fans during the season???  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HopeConvert on March 03, 2012, 03:29:47 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 03, 2012, 03:03:15 PM
Where were the Wooster fans during the season???  ;)
Italy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 03, 2012, 04:20:11 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2012, 01:40:32 PM
An impressive note from the Wittenberg-BSC write up (http://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2011-12/contrib/20120303o3hk68): Bill Brown's teams are a perfect 8-0 in NCAA first round action, and have advanced to the second round all 12 times they've made the tournament (including 4 times they had a first round bye).

I'm still bummed that OWU didn't make it a perfect 3-0 for NCAC teams yesterday, but good luck to both the Tigers and the Scots tonight!

I guess this is technically accurate if you are talking strictly "First Round" of the tournament. But if you are talking the first game, which is really what is at issue here, Witt has lost twice in its first game of the NCAA Tournament, both times to John Carroll (2004 & 2005). Witt had byes in the first round both of those years. Which should be an advantage.

Since 2009, Steve Moore is 11-2 in their first game of the tournament (8-1 in the "First Round), with their only losses coming to Carthage in 2001 (who went onto the Final Four) and Washington U. in 2008, which went on to win the national title.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2012, 07:04:03 PM
Wooster is really, really failing on video this weekend.

Yesterday's was terrible and tonight their doesn't appear to be anything at all. Thankfully Breckenridge is excellent on the radio call on WQKT.

This is really, really disappointing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 03, 2012, 07:23:10 PM
Wittenberg up 48-30 at halftime. Those who know Witt know for them to have 48 points at halftime is ridiculous, but when you are shooting 9-17 from 3 point range its understandable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2012, 07:32:22 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2012, 07:04:03 PM
Wooster is really, really failing on video this weekend.

Yesterday's was terrible and tonight their doesn't appear to be anything at all. Thankfully Breckenridge is excellent on the radio call on WQKT.

This is really, really disappointing.

It's more than disappointing, it's really pissed me off.  The fact that there is video is why I chose not to attend the game.  Clear Picture is going to get a huge piece of my mind on Monday.  How can they screw this up so often?  If you can do it once, you should be able do it every damned time.  I'm continually amazed at the incompetence of businesses in small towns.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on March 03, 2012, 07:51:07 PM
Granville's a small town and they don't seem to have any problems.

By the way, looks like Witt is pounding Carroll 48-30 right now according to live stats.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2012, 07:53:02 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 03, 2012, 07:32:22 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2012, 07:04:03 PM
Wooster is really, really failing on video this weekend.

Yesterday's was terrible and tonight their doesn't appear to be anything at all. Thankfully Breckenridge is excellent on the radio call on WQKT.

This is really, really disappointing.

It's more than disappointing, it's really pissed me off.  The fact that there is video is why I chose not to attend the game.  Clear Picture is going to get a huge piece of my mind on Monday.  How can they screw this up so often?  If you can do it once, you should be able do it every damned time.  I'm continually amazed at the incompetence of businesses in small towns.

I'm not sure the connections in Timken have ever been all that good--and I don't think they did any upgrades to them while building the Scot Center addition, unfortunately. Not sure what you need to be able to get a good stream, but no idea if the bandwidth is really there.

Still, terribly disappointing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2012, 07:57:16 PM
Hope leads IWU 38-36 at the half.

As consumers, it's not really our responsibility to identify whose fault this video FUBAR is. From our standpoint, it's CPI's product, so complaining to them is completely justifiable. It couldn't hurt to complain to the Dept. of Athletics (not Sports Information, mind you) and/or the college administration too; as has been pointed out by Seinfeld, they are big-time foot-draggers in the world of technology.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2012, 08:09:22 PM
Also too bad there's no video right now just because this sounds fun!   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2012, 08:27:59 PM
IWU by 3 with 10 to go!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2012, 08:41:47 PM
Wittenberg looks like a winner, leading by 17 with less than a minute left. We could be looking at a sectional with Wittenberg, Wooster, and Illinois Wesleyan, the top three winningest programs all-time in D3. Cool. And it would likely be at Wittenberg.

Update: Wittenberg shoots 54% and wins 87-70 to advance to the Sweet Sixteen. Tiger Up!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2012, 08:48:36 PM
Wooster also advances, 92-79. Go Scots!

Unfortunately, our 4th NCAA participant is out, as the DePauw women are upset on their home court by Carthage, 53-48.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2012, 08:50:59 PM
Hope and IWU tied going into the final minute of regulation. NCAC refs.

Update: Going to OT in Holland.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2012, 08:55:47 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 03, 2012, 08:50:59 PM
Hope and IWU tied going into the final minute of regulation. NCAC refs.
Overtime.  I thought I recognized one of those zebras.  Hopefully they won't be able to find their way home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2012, 09:03:15 PM
Oh yeah, NCAC refs, who just blew a shot clock violation and gifted Hope two points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2012, 09:12:34 PM
Going to double overtime.
In the fourth pod in this bracket, North Central leads Wash U. at the half, 36-28.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2012, 09:21:43 PM
Yeah, I recognize two of them now, the white guys.  Both absolutely lousy.  Does Wooster have any chance of hosting if IWU pulls this out in two or more overtimes?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2012, 09:23:07 PM
Any chance? Sure, especially (I guess) if NCC is the 4th participant. But I look for it to be at Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2012, 09:35:16 PM
And that's it! IWU wins 108-101 and advances to face the Scots somewhere in Ohio next weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 03, 2012, 09:37:09 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 03, 2012, 09:35:16 PM
And that's it! IWU wins 108-101 and advances to face the Scots somewhere in Ohio next weekend.

I vote for either Washington Court House or Chillicothe!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2012, 09:50:12 PM
North Central by three with under a minute.  And after watching these two games, I really appreciate Mike Breckenridge.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 03, 2012, 09:55:25 PM
Wooster may have the worst video feed but our announcer is pretty amazing compared to Hope and Washington announcers.. man oh man these guys are painful to listen to!

Nice dominant win for the Scots tonight!

Sweet 16 bound!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2012, 10:06:26 PM
The Hope announcers were obvious amateurs, probably students.  The girl doing color was actually much more tuned in to what was going on; she knew when guys fouled out, mentioned subs, understood some strategy. At least, though, while they were certainly rooting for Hope, they kept it under wrap.  They commended good plays by IWU and didn't complain about bad calls.  Those clowns from Washington were a totally different story.  I only watched the last five or six minutes, but they complained, continually, about everything that happened on the court.  And they weren't kids.  I expected more out of Washington U.

Of course, the two guys that do the video of Wooster's game, who couldn't even get their game on the air tonight, are no better.  They not only have scant knowledge of the game, and this after years and years of covering the Scots, but they complain all the time as well.

Breckenridge is a pro.  He could step in tomorrow and do an NBA game better than most.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo91 on March 03, 2012, 10:08:31 PM
Quote from: Cali-Scot on March 03, 2012, 09:55:25 PM
Wooster may have the worst video feed but our announcer is pretty amazing compared to Hope and Washington announcers.. man oh man these guys are painful to listen to!

Nice dominant win for the Scots tonight!

Sweet 16 bound!

Yeah! Go radio! I was squirming just listening to them. They also didn't know a thing about our side of the bracket...

Obviously would love to host next weekend, but Witt should get it, right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 03, 2012, 10:14:47 PM
I've seen several posts saying Witt should get to host next weekend.   

My question is does that have to do with geography or seeding or something else?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 03, 2012, 10:18:30 PM
It's my understanding that it is very rare for a school to host regionals two years in a row.  Last year, Wooster hosted (even though they weren't the top seed remaining).  I think that seeding is fairly close between Wooster and Witt (perhaps unofficially #4 and #5 in that region), so my guess is that Witt gets the regional this year, instead of Woo.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 03, 2012, 10:24:01 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 03, 2012, 10:18:30 PM
It's my understanding that it is very rare for a school to host regionals two years in a row.  Last year, Wooster hosted (even though they weren't the top seed remaining).  I think that seeding is fairly close between Wooster and Witt (perhaps unofficially #4 and #5 in that region), so my guess is that Witt gets the regional this year, instead of Woo.

Being the Wooster fan that I am I'd love to see the Scots playing at home next weekend.  But that rationale makes sense.  Has a team EVER hosted the sectionals two years in a row?  What if you are simply the best team in the region back to back years? Do they make you travel for sure?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 03, 2012, 10:26:00 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 03, 2012, 10:18:30 PM
It's my understanding that it is very rare for a school to host regionals two years in a row.  Last year, Wooster hosted (even though they weren't the top seed remaining).  I think that seeding is fairly close between Wooster and Witt (perhaps unofficially #4 and #5 in that region), so my guess is that Witt gets the regional this year, instead of Woo.

Amherst and Williams host pretty much every year. I mentioned last week that this was a factor for Wooster in 2007 in not hosting, and may come up again. But can someone site a specific example of a team NOT hosting the first two rounds, then hosting the Sectional, jumping over a team that had hosted the first two rounds and was still in the tournament?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 03, 2012, 10:31:24 PM
Quickly, Williams hosted both in 2010 and 2011, Amherst both in 2005, 2006, 2007 and 2008, Virginia Wesleyan in 2006 and 2007, Wooster in 2003 and 2004, Williams in 2003 and 2004.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on March 03, 2012, 10:38:17 PM
Seinfeld makes excellent points.  Wooster was chosen to host rounds 1&2 and won.  Ego Wooster ought to be the sectional host.  Wittenberg may make geographical sense now, but it got sent south for rounds 1&2.  That said the NCAA does some weird things, and we'll know tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2012, 10:52:01 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2012, 02:50:25 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 03, 2012, 02:25:17 PM
I noted on the map that St. Louis (Wash U.) and Wooster are over 500 miles apart, so if Hope goes down tonight but the other "seeds" advance, my guess is that Witt would be hosting the regional, based primarily on geography.  If Hope wins, I would certainly expect the regional to be up in Holland.

What is the probability of North Central, Wittenberg, Illinois Wesleyan and Wooster being the teams left in the sectional?  That scenario would likely have Wooster hosting and it would be a NCAC - CCIW showdown!  ;)

The probability is now 100%! ;D  As far as Wooster hosting, there is still a chance that the NCAA could pick another site but the Scots look like they have the inside track now with both Hope and Wash U. losing tonight!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2012, 11:02:36 PM
Saw at great game by Wooster at Timken tonight!  Scots shot the ball incredibly well at nearly 53% from the floor and they also won the boards 38-32.  Wooster also played excellent defense and contained 2 of Capital's top scorers - Winter and Niekamp were both held below their averages.

Senior Justin Hallowell was on fire in the 2nd half as he took 6 three point shots and made 5 of them to lead the Scots with 20 points.  Josh Claytor's ankle looked better tonight which is encouraging after back to back games.  Wooster will need strong performances from Claytor if they are going to advance further in the tourney.

Senior Justin Warnes played probably his best game of the season with 14 points, 8 boards, 4 assists and strong defense on Capital's best guard (Winter).

The OAC was down this year as Capital won their conference and they were beaten this season by Wooster, Wittenberg, Ohio Wesleyan and Denison as well.  Strength of the NCAC shows with 2 teams in the Sweet 16!

Congratulations to Wittenberg on a dominating win over Carroll tonight!

Great night to be a NCAC fan and a Wooster fan!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 03, 2012, 11:04:16 PM
If money is a factor, that might help Wooster, because (despite tonight's crowd of only about 2000 by my estimate)  a regional would draw 3000+ both nights.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 03, 2012, 11:05:06 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on March 03, 2012, 10:38:17 PM
Seinfeld makes excellent points.  Wooster was chosen to host rounds 1&2 and won.  Ego Wooster ought to be the sectional host.  Wittenberg may make geographical sense now, but it got sent south for rounds 1&2.  That said the NCAA does some weird things, and we'll know tomorrow.

I'd bet that North Central's Graduate Assistant Coach (http://northcentralcardinals.com/coaches.aspx?rc=400&path=mbball) would love for the sectional to be held at Wooster!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 03, 2012, 11:08:33 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 03, 2012, 11:05:06 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on March 03, 2012, 10:38:17 PM
Seinfeld makes excellent points.  Wooster was chosen to host rounds 1&2 and won.  Ego Wooster ought to be the sectional host.  Wittenberg may make geographical sense now, but it got sent south for rounds 1&2.  That said the NCAA does some weird things, and we'll know tomorrow.

I'd bet that North Central's Graduate Assistant Coach (http://northcentralcardinals.com/coaches.aspx?rc=400&path=mbball) would love for the sectional to be held at Wooster!

I can pretty much guarantee that Ian Franks would much, much rather have the sectional be held next weekend in the airplane hangar in "beautiful" downtown Naperville.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2012, 11:08:56 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 03, 2012, 11:04:16 PM
If money is a factor, that might help Wooster, because (despite tonight's crowd of only about 2000 by my estimate)  a regional would draw 3000+ both nights.

Yeah, especially now that we know we can't rely on the announced video.

I'm hoping for Wooster, but expecting Wittenberg.  My fear is the "two years in a row" thing for Sectionals.  It's just too close between the two schools as far as seeding, Wooster already hosted the first round, and Witt is also more geographically centered.  Plus, you can get a drink on any corner in Springfield.

By the way, Illinois Wesleyan looked pretty darned good.  North Central, I don't know, I didn't get to see that much of that game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2012, 11:28:52 PM
Congratulations to Wooster senior Matt Fegan who broke an NCAA Div. III career record with his 125th game played tonight! :)
The previous record was held by Virginia Wesleyan College's Tonton Balenga (124; 2005-08).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 03, 2012, 11:48:12 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2012, 11:28:52 PM
Congratulations to Wooster senior Matt Fegan who broke an NCAA Div. III career record with his 125th game played tonight! :)
The previous record was held by Virginia Wesleyan College's Tonton Balenga (124; 2005-08).

Justin Hallowell eclipsed 300 treys for his career tonight. It's nowhere near an NCAA III record (that belongs to - GASP! - John Grotberg of Grinnell - 526) but it is probably still a pretty rare milestone for a DIII player.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 04, 2012, 12:34:16 AM
I believe this is the first time the Scots have made the Sweet Sixteen in three consecutive seasons--at least in the Steve Moore era.

This year's seniors are now 10-3 all time in NCAA play. Pretty darn good.

Also, anyone know anything about home winning streaks in the NCAAs? The Scots have now won 10 straight NCAA home games. The last time the Timken faithful went home disappointed from an NCAA tournament game was the 2004 section final loss to John Carroll. Overall, I have the Scots as 15-1 at home in the NCAAs since 2003.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 04, 2012, 09:04:46 AM
congrats scots, hope you host next week. I saw a comment on the size of the crowd last night. Since I didn't make it and can only go on the poor video feed I am guessing the reason is because of cap. They have had poor attendance all year with only minimal support from the students and then only at a few games.  Last week at the oac finals Wilmington had a much better crowd there then the crusaders  had. The game between Wooster and Cap in 09 was a sellout but only because 2/3's of the crowd came from Wooster. Hopefully the lower turnout last night will have nothing to do with the selection.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2012, 11:37:14 AM
The reason I think Wittenberg will get to host is not because Wooster hosted last year, but rather because I think Wittenberg is the higher-seeded team due to their head-to-head sweep of the Scots. I think Wooster hosted in the regional phase only because of geography: that allowed Randolph-Macon to bus (464 miles to Wooster) rather than fly (507 to Wittenberg). With no geographical excuse, I think seeding comes back into play and Witt gets the nod this afternoon. We'll see shortly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 04, 2012, 11:44:25 AM
Per Pat Coleman via Twitter

Men's sectionals will be held at: Wooster, UWW, F&M, Middlebury.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2012, 12:04:19 PM
Happy to be wrong; I'd be displeased if I were Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on March 04, 2012, 12:17:38 PM
Seinfeld called it...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 04, 2012, 12:42:59 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 04, 2012, 12:04:19 PM
Happy to be wrong; I'd be displeased if I were Witt.

Agreed!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on March 04, 2012, 12:46:16 PM
Quote from: Cali-Scot on March 04, 2012, 11:44:25 AM
Per Pat Coleman via Twitter

Men's sectionals will be held at: Wooster, UWW, F&M, Middlebury.

All schools that hosted and won their rounds 1 & 2 games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 04, 2012, 01:01:31 PM
This is fantastic, although the competition is going to be very stiff.  Wittenberg will have their hands full with North Central, especially with the whole house backing Ian Frank's team!  Then, the Scots against what looked like a very tough Illinois Wesleyan squad.  Even being at home, Wooster will have to be at their best to get out of this group and move south.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2012, 01:27:59 PM
Great news that Wooster is hosting! :)  I agree that Wooster will have to play their best though to win this sectional with 3 very tough teams coming to the Scot Center and Timken Gym.

So, is everyone ready for the NCAC - CCIW Holiday Classic Challenge......er, I mean the NCAA sectional!  ;) ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2012, 01:47:19 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on March 04, 2012, 09:04:46 AM
congrats scots, hope you host next week. I saw a comment on the size of the crowd last night. Since I didn't make it and can only go on the poor video feed I am guessing the reason is because of cap. They have had poor attendance all year with only minimal support from the students and then only at a few games.  Last week at the oac finals Wilmington had a much better crowd there then the crusaders  had. The game between Wooster and Cap in 09 was a sellout but only because 2/3's of the crowd came from Wooster. Hopefully the lower turnout last night will have nothing to do with the selection.

From watching the replay of last night's game, surprisingly it looked as though Cap had quite a nice contingent of fans there.  It looked comparable to the Witt contingent that comes up every year.

I am glad to see Wooster is once again awarded the right to host!  I agree that Wooster is going to have to be at their best in order to advance out of this sectional.  Although, the competition was pretty stiff in last year's sectional as well with Whitworth being in it and all.

As for last night's game, I think that may have been the best all around game I've seen Wooster play all season.  Wooster did just about everything right last night.  They shot the ball well going 52% from the field and 43% from beyond the arc and even 77% from the charity stripe!   They rebounded well winning the battle of the boards 38-32.  They didn't win the turnover battle, but with only 11 to's, whose complaining?!  And they spread their scoring around landing 5 guys in double figures led by Wooster's top 2 scorers in Justin Hallowell (20) and Xavier Brown (18)!  If Wooster can continue that high level of play next weekend, they're going to be tough to beat!

Also, wrt last night's game, was it just me or did it seem like Cap may have just ran out of gas a bit in the 2nd half?  They expended a great deal of energy in their comeback from 12 down in the 2nd half to R-MC the night before and to me, it just looked like they were a step slower than the Scots, especially in the 2nd half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on March 04, 2012, 01:59:10 PM
Wooster friends, I'll be traveling from Lincoln, Nebraska Friday.  Is Cleveland the best place to fly into?  Thanks for the local knowledge!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2012, 02:01:52 PM
Titan Q - yes, either Cleveland (one hour drive south to Wooster) or Akron/Canton airport (40 minutes drive west to Wooster) are good choices.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 04, 2012, 02:03:35 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2012, 02:01:52 PM
Titan Q - yes, either Cleveland (one hour drive south to Wooster) or Akron/Canton airport (40 minutes drive west to Wooster) are good choices.

And sometimes you can get better fares through Columbus, but its about a 90 minute drive.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 04, 2012, 02:06:11 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 04, 2012, 02:03:35 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2012, 02:01:52 PM
Titan Q - yes, either Cleveland (one hour drive south to Wooster) or Akron/Canton airport (40 minutes drive west to Wooster) are good choices.

And sometimes you can get better fares through Columbus, but its about a 90 minute drive.

I often end up flying to Columbus--usually seems to be much cheaper when coming from the Washington DC area.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2012, 02:07:09 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2012, 02:01:52 PM
Titan Q - yes, either Cleveland (one hour drive south to Wooster) or Akron/Canton airport (40 minutes drive west to Wooster) are good choices.
Are you going to have any media credentials, or are you just coming as a fan and planning to sit in the IWU section? I'll keep an eye out for you, just gotta know where to look. Unfortunately I'm not likely to be there much before the first game tips on Friday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2012, 02:10:34 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 04, 2012, 02:03:35 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2012, 02:01:52 PM
Titan Q - yes, either Cleveland (one hour drive south to Wooster) or Akron/Canton airport (40 minutes drive west to Wooster) are good choices.

And sometimes you can get better fares through Columbus, but its about a 90 minute drive.

Pittsburgh is always an option as well and I've heard their fairs are lower than those from Cleveland, but it's a bit farther than any of the options given above.  If you take the scenic route, its a prettier drive than any of those options though...  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on March 04, 2012, 02:11:03 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 04, 2012, 02:07:09 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2012, 02:01:52 PM
Titan Q - yes, either Cleveland (one hour drive south to Wooster) or Akron/Canton airport (40 minutes drive west to Wooster) are good choices.
Are you going to have any media credentials, or are you just coming as a fan and planning to sit in the IWU section? I'll keep an eye out for you, just gotta know where to look. Unfortunately I'm not likely to be there much before the first game tips on Friday.

Just coming as a fan in the stands, David...I look forward to seeing you!

Thanks for the travel advice, all!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on March 04, 2012, 02:59:27 PM
Wooster Hosts again. I am not in favor of another iteration of Tigers v. Scots at Timken for a spot in the Final Four. My blood pressure may not be able to take it. This is quite a POD with the top 3 winningest Division III programs. The head coach at North Central is experienced having lost to Ill. Wesleyan in the 1997 National Championship game! Best perimeter player is coach's son. Looking forward to the CCIW/NCAC challenge for the final four!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 04, 2012, 03:14:55 PM
Hey, Pat, the last paragraph of the men's hosting article is wrong. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 04, 2012, 03:15:37 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2012, 03:14:55 PM
Hey, Pat, the last paragraph of the men's hosting article is wrong. :)

Oh well. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scottiedoug on March 04, 2012, 07:20:26 PM
Congratulations from a southern Scot fan who did not see the Scots' game in person or otherwise (I thought y'all northern Scots were technologically sophisticated....).  Good luck!  Did the southern Scots put up any resistance?  We are looking forward to a better year next year and hope the experience will help our big crop of freshman.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 04, 2012, 07:38:57 PM
Can't say I agree with the NCAA at all for awarding Wooster as the host site. I know Wooster has reasons, but can't justify it to any Wittenberg fan when Wittenberg beat Wooster twice this year and won arguably the toughest league in the country, but the NCAA has a history of making idiotic decisions. Oh well, at least Wittenberg plays well at Wooster but they definitely have their hands full.

I was in attendance friday at Transy but not Saturday. Very impressed with the facilities and student section from Transylvania. I'm glad Transy lost Friday as they would have been a tough matchup for Witt. The stands were not full Friday night, but the 10:15 start probably had something to do with that one.

Can we quit complaining about the officials for once? The officials that did the Hope/IWU game were actually pretty good. Its usually one school that does most of the complaining about them anyway......

Good luck to Witt this week! I won't be able to make it up to north Ohio as I'll be in Indy for the Big Ten tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 04, 2012, 08:08:20 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 04, 2012, 07:38:57 PM
Can't say I agree with the NCAA at all for awarding Wooster as the host site. I know Wooster has reasons, but can't justify it to any Wittenberg fan when Wittenberg beat Wooster twice this year and won arguably the toughest league in the country, but the NCAA has a history of making idiotic decisions. Oh well, at least Wittenberg plays well at Wooster but they definitely have their hands full.

I was in attendance friday at Transy but not Saturday. Very impressed with the facilities and student section from Transylvania. I'm glad Transy lost Friday as they would have been a tough matchup for Witt. The stands were not full Friday night, but the 10:15 start probably had something to do with that one.

Can we quit complaining about the officials for once? The officials that did the Hope/IWU game were actually pretty good. Its usually one school that does most of the complaining about them anyway......

Good luck to Witt this week! I won't be able to make it up to north Ohio as I'll be in Indy for the Big Ten tourney.

My guess that people will quit complaining about officiating about the same that time people quit complaining about NCAA hosting decisions!   ;)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 04, 2012, 08:20:06 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 04, 2012, 08:08:20 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on March 04, 2012, 07:38:57 PM
Can't say I agree with the NCAA at all for awarding Wooster as the host site. I know Wooster has reasons, but can't justify it to any Wittenberg fan when Wittenberg beat Wooster twice this year and won arguably the toughest league in the country, but the NCAA has a history of making idiotic decisions. Oh well, at least Wittenberg plays well at Wooster but they definitely have their hands full.

I was in attendance friday at Transy but not Saturday. Very impressed with the facilities and student section from Transylvania. I'm glad Transy lost Friday as they would have been a tough matchup for Witt. The stands were not full Friday night, but the 10:15 start probably had something to do with that one.

Can we quit complaining about the officials for once? The officials that did the Hope/IWU game were actually pretty good. Its usually one school that does most of the complaining about them anyway......

Good luck to Witt this week! I won't be able to make it up to north Ohio as I'll be in Indy for the Big Ten tourney.

My guess that people will quit complaining about officiating about the same that time people quit complaining about NCAA hosting decisions!   ;)

True! ;D

Actually, everyone I talked with agreed the IWU @ Hope game was poorly officiated, though most thought they were equal-opportunity poor.  Two incredible teams playing their hearts out, with officials well below what they deserved.

Since this is the NCAC board, I won't even bother commenting that NCC and IWU ALSO deserved consideration for hosting! :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 04, 2012, 08:45:43 PM
You gotta win 'em where you play 'em anyway. Just the same as you gotta overcome whatever the refs call or don't call.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2012, 09:01:40 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 04, 2012, 08:20:06 PM

Since this is the NCAC board, I won't even bother commenting that NCC and IWU ALSO deserved consideration for hosting! :P

I'm of the opinion that the NCAA's decision about Sectional hosts stemmed from schools that hosted the Regionals.  Of all the schools that hosted and won their regional pods, all of those schools are all hosting again next weekend.  My guess is, the main reason Wooster is hosting (besides being deserving to host  8-) ) is that they were hosting last weekend and won.  Witt, NCC and IWU all won their pods as visiting teams.  Had NCC been hosting instead of WashU, I'd say it may have been a toss-up between them and Wooster.  But because Wooster is the only school of the 3 in this Sectional that hosted, I believe that is the overriding factor that went in their favor for hosting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 04, 2012, 09:17:46 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 04, 2012, 09:01:40 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 04, 2012, 08:20:06 PM

Since this is the NCAC board, I won't even bother commenting that NCC and IWU ALSO deserved consideration for hosting! :P

I'm of the opinion that the NCAA's decision about Sectional hosts stemmed from schools that hosted the Regionals.  Of all the schools that hosted and won their regional pods, all of those schools are all hosting again next weekend.  My guess is, the main reason Wooster is hosting (besides being deserving to host  8-) ) is that they were hosting last weekend and won.  Witt, NCC and IWU all won their pods as visiting teams.  Had NCC been hosting instead of WashU, I'd say it may have been a toss-up between them and Wooster.  But because Wooster is the only school of the 3 in this Sectional that hosted, I believe that is the overriding factor that went in their favor for hosting.

It seems you may be right.  In the past, it seems that a team could very rarely make it to Salem never having left home.  Assuming that home court is a distinct advantage, I'm not sure I approve of this seeming trend.  I approve of hosting being a reward for quality work, but vanishingly few teams have 'earned' playing ONLY home games prior to Salem (and, this year, Wooster ain't one of them; I don't think any team probably is this year). ;)

Oh well, we already took out #1 Hope AT Hope; you're next on the list! ;D

(Geez, Mr. Y, aren't you starting the trash talk a bit early in the week?! 8-))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 04, 2012, 09:33:23 PM
I'm inclined to agree with you Ypsi.  If it's a close call to host the second round, I think that one of the road warrior teams from round one should get the nod.

Pennstghs, I'll complain about the officials any goddamned time that I want, especially in a game that doesn't involve Wooster.  They were miserable, if unbiased, and should be put out of work as soon as possible.  Good choice going to the Big Ten tourney, because Wittenberg's going to get their ass handed to them by North Central.  And outside of anyone that makes the trip from Springfield, there won't be a person in the house offering them any sympathy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2012, 09:33:27 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2012, 07:53:02 PM

I'm not sure the connections in Timken have ever been all that good--and I don't think they did any upgrades to them while building the Scot Center addition, unfortunately. Not sure what you need to be able to get a good stream, but no idea if the bandwidth is really there.

Still, terribly disappointing.

Yes, this is unfortunate.  IMO, I'm disappointed in Wooster's decision to completely ignore upgrading or even updating any part of the original PEC including Timken Gym and Timken Natatorium.  To build that beautiful new Scot Center and choose to leave the PEC basically untouched was a missed opportunity to me.  Especially Timken Gym (a facility I think should be the jewel of facilities at Wooster due to the tradition of basketball at the college). I shudder to think what kind of recruiting hauls Coach Moore could bring in if he had facilities even half as nice as what you see at other D3 programs like Hope and Calvin.  The bones of Timken Gym aren't that bad.  It is just well overdue for a facelift including new seats, new scoreboards, new lighting, and obviously, upgrades to their internet connectablity so we don't have the problems with live video feeds that we have seen now in the last two post-seasons.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2012, 09:51:15 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 04, 2012, 09:17:46 PM

It seems you may be right.  In the past, it seems that a team could very rarely make it to Salem never having left home.  Assuming that home court is a distinct advantage, I'm not sure I approve of this seeming trend.  I approve of hosting being a reward for quality work, but vanishingly few teams have 'earned' playing ONLY home games prior to Salem (and, this year, Wooster ain't one of them; I don't think any team probably is this year). ;)

Oh well, we already took out #1 Hope AT Hope; you're next on the list! ;D

(Geez, Mr. Y, aren't you starting the trash talk a bit early in the week?! 8-))

I totally agree that Wooster hasn't truly 'earned' the right to play at home for the chance to go to Salem, but as you said, I don't see any team left in the tournament that probably 'earned' that right.  Last year, I feel Wooster was totally deserving of hosting the first 2 rounds of the tournament, but this year...  Not so much.  An argument could have been made for Hope, but they didn't take care of their own business at home last weekend and they're not in the tournament anymore.  An argument could have been made for Amherst, but it's the Amherst girls' turn to host this year.  Witt could have 'earned' that right but they lost in the conference semis to a .500 basketball team at home.  IWU could have 'earned' that right but going 4-4 over your last 8 games doesn't help.  As you said, I don't see any team from this Sectional that clearly 'earned' the right to host over another team.  And it's not like Wooster just backed into being chosen for this.  They may have been swept by Witt, but they did find a way to finish second in a very competitive NCAC this year, they have gone 21-2 including winning the NCAC Tournament and last weekend's Regional since dropping back to back games to Wabash and Witt back before X-mas. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2012, 09:53:47 PM
Wooster's Sectional Website (http://wooster.prestosports.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/ncaa/sectional/index), which obviously will have more content as the week progresses.

I feel your pain, pennstghs. But one inescapable conclusion from the hosting decision is that, for whatever reasons, Wooster was higher-ranked than Wittenberg in the final, secret, Great Lakes regional ranking, so it's not like it was an arbitrary decision to send the Sectional teams up here. I guess we'll never see that final ranking.

Unlike at least one of my friends, I admit that I will be rooting for Wittenberg, at least on Friday. Tiger Up!
/ducks and runs from the room
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2012, 10:00:23 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2012, 09:33:23 PM

Pennstghs, I'll complain about the officials any goddamned time that I want, especially in a game that doesn't involve Wooster.  They were miserable, if unbiased, and should be put out of work as soon as possible.  Good choice going to the Big Ten tourney, because Wittenberg's going to get their ass handed to them by North Central.  And outside of anyone that makes the trip from Springfield, there won't be a person in the house offering them any sympathy.

I love how he complains about the hosting decision and then proceeds to call for people to stop complaining about the refs?!  (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmymorningjacket.com%2Fforum%2FSmileys%2Fyabb%2Fgrin.gif&hash=087153fa5f269f1125349a47807ef36b9456499b)

I have a couple of questions about the officiating this weekend.  First, regarding the NCAC refs up at Hope, I'm wondering if any of our MIAA contributors could tell us how they feel that crew compared to your own MIAA officials?  I know I've read plenty of unfavorable opinions regarding MIAA officiating on their board over the years and I've always been of the opinion that they can't possibly be any worse than some of the hacks we have to deal with in the NCAC.  And second, does anyone know where the officiating crews were for the Wooster Regional?  I thought they did a very good job overall and for the most part, let the players play and didn't make the games about the men in stripes like our NCAC officials seem to make a habit of doing...  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 04, 2012, 10:05:52 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 04, 2012, 09:53:47 PM
Wooster's Sectional Website (http://wooster.prestosports.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/ncaa/sectional/index), which obviously will have more content as the week progresses.

I feel your pain, pennstghs. But one inescapable conclusion from the hosting decision is that, for whatever reasons, Wooster was higher-ranked than Wittenberg in the final, secret, Great Lakes regional ranking, so it's not like it was an arbitrary decision to send the Sectional teams up here. I guess we'll never see that final ranking.

Unlike at least one of my friends, I admit that I will be rooting for Wittenberg, at least on Friday. Tiger Up!
/ducks and runs from the room

I will also be rooting for Witt and Wooster Friday night. From a conference loyalty point of view, it would be great to guarantee that there would be an NCAC team in Salem.  And I'd love nothing better than for Wooster to beat Witt to get there. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 04, 2012, 10:06:17 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 04, 2012, 09:51:15 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 04, 2012, 09:17:46 PM

It seems you may be right.  In the past, it seems that a team could very rarely make it to Salem never having left home.  Assuming that home court is a distinct advantage, I'm not sure I approve of this seeming trend.  I approve of hosting being a reward for quality work, but vanishingly few teams have 'earned' playing ONLY home games prior to Salem (and, this year, Wooster ain't one of them; I don't think any team probably is this year). ;)

Oh well, we already took out #1 Hope AT Hope; you're next on the list! ;D

(Geez, Mr. Y, aren't you starting the trash talk a bit early in the week?! 8-))

I totally agree that Wooster hasn't truly 'earned' the right to play at home for the chance to go to Salem, but as you said, I don't see any team left in the tournament that probably 'earned' that right.  Last year, I feel Wooster was totally deserving of hosting the first 2 rounds of the tournament, but this year...  Not so much.  An argument could have been made for Hope, but they didn't take care of their own business at home last weekend and they're not in the tournament anymore.  An argument could have been made for Amherst, but it's the Amherst girls' turn to host this year.  Witt could have 'earned' that right but they lost in the conference semis to a .500 basketball team at home.  IWU could have 'earned' that right but going 4-4 over your last 8 games doesn't help.  As you said, I don't see any team from this Sectional that clearly 'earned' the right to host over another team.  And it's not like Wooster just backed into being chosen for this.  They may have been swept by Witt, but they did find a way to finish second in a very competitive NCAC this year, they have gone 21-2 including winning the NCAC Tournament and last weekend's Regional since dropping back to back games to Wabash and Witt back before X-mas.

Hey, now, by the time they picked the sectional sites we were 6-2 in our last 8 games! ;D

I wasn't really expecting IWU to host anyway (I don't know if the men's and women's committees collaborate at all, but the women have hosting priority for the sectional round and the Titan women seemed potential hosts).  But NCC has won 13 of their last 14 games.

Oh well, given what happened in Naperville, I like our chances better in Wooster than Naperville anyway! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2012, 10:07:30 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 04, 2012, 09:53:47 PM

Unlike at least one of my friends, I admit that I will be rooting for Wittenberg, at least on Friday. Tiger Up!
/ducks and runs from the room
(http://wooster.prestosports.com/sports/mbkb/2011-12/ncaa/sectional/index)

David, you might be the only non-Witt fan in the building rooting for Witt on Friday you and derek might be the only non-Witt fans in the buliding rooting for Witt on Friday  :P.  First of all, most Wooster just flat out don't like Witt so conference loyalties be damned!  Secondly, with Ian Franks on the bench for NCC as a GA, you can bet most of the Wooster fans in attendance will be pulling for Cardinals!  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 04, 2012, 10:07:50 PM
Again, I wonder where the heck the Wooster fans were during the season? You all just spoiled and waiting for March??  ;)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2012, 10:12:23 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 04, 2012, 10:07:50 PM
Again, I wonder where the heck the Wooster fans were during the season? You all just spoiled and waiting for March??  ;)

POST season is the REAL season smeds!   8-)   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 04, 2012, 10:23:20 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 04, 2012, 10:00:23 PM

I have a couple of questions about the officiating this weekend.  First, regarding the NCAC refs up at Hope, I'm wondering if any of our MIAA contributors could tell us how they feel that crew compared to your own MIAA officials?  I know I've read plenty of unfavorable opinions regarding MIAA officiating on their board over the years and I've always been of the opinion that they can't possibly be any worse than some of the hacks we have to deal with in the NCAC.

As a basketball fan I was generally disappointed in the quality of the officiating this weekend.   I'm not usually one that gripes too much about officiating anyway and the officiating of any game is usually reflective of the quality of play to me.  Unfortunately Saturday night I thought the quality of play was excellent and the officials kept getting in the way of what was really an incredible effort by two teams.

I also don't necessarily share the same views as others about the MIAA's officiating, I thought this year was some of the best and most consistent we've seen, but maybe that bar is low.  That doesn't make me or any of us immune to questioning an effort or two during the season however.    What people usually gripe about is seeing the same officials over and over but this year the MIAA used a pool of over 50 different officials throughout the season, and some of those guys bounce around between NCAA II and lower level D1 games.


I see from the boxscore of the the Wooster/Maryville game that the 3 man crew was Mike Kavulich, Mike Brya, and Kendall Smith.  All 3 are well known MIAA officials, Kavulich did our MIAA Tournament Championship game.  Kendall Smith has done some D1 games.

Way to difficult to compare and contrast officiating based on just one game, so I'll leave it at I was disappointed in the quality.  I should also add the Hope/IWU game was about as physical a game I can recall.  Those two teams were just hammering each other, many times the officials had no choice but to call a foul.

I mean just look at this photo, it was pretty much like that all night long at both ends.
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.mlive.com%2Fgrandrapidspress%2Fphoto%2F2012%2F03%2F10642881-standard.jpg&hash=6de9185c7d2b481c6bfd075c2bf061d5122ffb08)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 04, 2012, 10:29:01 PM
I've seen quite a few different posts about Wooster hosting and the different theories.  I think there is one very simple reason Wooster is hosting, they are the highest remaining seed.

I'm confident this sections seeding went

#1 Hope
#2 Washington
#3 Transylvania
#4 Wooster
#5 Randolph-Macon--RM was probably not a true #5 but moved into the bracket for geographical balance and to separate Witt and Wooster.
#6 Wittenberg
#7 North Central
#8 UW-Stevens Pt.
#9 Illinois Wesleyan

Wooster is the highest remaining seed and all 3 of the other teams could get there by bus.  I don't even think another host site could have been debated.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 04, 2012, 10:57:13 PM
More like regional ranking, despite losing two to Wittenberg and despite not seeing the final regional rankings, I am of the opinion that Wooster moved ahead of Witt in the final rankings giving them the chance to host the first weekend and now the second.

Another reason I am confident Wooster was ranked ahead of Wittenberg in the final regional ranking was because Wittenberg went to Transylvania... and they wouldn't have had two #2's in that pod (Transylvania apparently did finish 2 in the Midwest from what I was told).

FYI - if Wash U had WON and beaten NCC... then Wittenberg would have been hosting because Wooster and Wash U are more than 500 miles from one another and the NCAA wouldn't have paid for that flight. Thus, the game would have been moved to Witt, who is inside that 500 mile rule.

Just something to consider.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on March 04, 2012, 11:10:54 PM
Illinois Wesleyan (21-7, 10-4 CCIW) @ Wooster (26-4, 12-4 NCAC)...

PG
(Wooster) Matt Fegan, 6-1/185 Sr - 7.5 ppg, 2.8 rpg, 2.7 apg, 1.6 A/TO (57-125 3-point, .456)
(IWU) Eliud Gonzalez, 5-9/170 Sr - 6.3 ppg, 3.7 rpg, 5.5 apg, 2.2 A/TO (55-131 FG, .420)

SG
(IWU) Jordan Zimmer, 6-5/190 Sr - 15.8 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 0.9 apg (96-229 3-point, .419)
(Wooster) Xavier Brown, 5-11/180 Fr - 13.0 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 1.6 apg (142-327 FG, .434)

G/F
(IWU) John Koschnitzky, 6-6/205 Sr - 9.4 ppg, 3.0 rpg (86-216 FG, .398)
(Wooster) Justin Warnes, 6-3/180 Sr - 5.4 ppg, 4.2 rpg (45-91 FG, .495)

F
(Wooster) Justin Hallowell, 6-7/210 Sr - 14.0 ppg, 6.8 rpg (74-182 3-point, .407)
(IWU) Victor Davis, 6-5/225 So - 10.6 ppg, 5.0 rpg (113-219 FG, .516)

F/C
(Wooster) Josh Claytor, 6-7/225 Jr - 11.1 ppg, 5.3 rpg (140-227 FG, .617)
(IWU) Kevin Reed, 6-7/225 Jr - 9.2 ppg, 6.0 rpg (112-183 FG, .612)

Bench
(Wooster) Jake Mays (F/C), 6-8/215 Jr - 6.2 ppg, 4.5 rpg
(Wooster) Doug Thorpe (G), 5-9/175 So - 6.1 ppg, 1.1 rpg
(Wooster) Evan Pannell (G), 6-2/175 Fr - 3.0 ppg, 0.9 rpg
(Wooster) Jalen Goodwin (G), 6-0/175 Fr - 2.7 ppg, 1.7 rpg

(IWU) Andrew Ziemnik (F), 6-5/225 So - 7.3 ppg, 4.1 rpg
(IWU) Stephen Rudnicki (G), 6-3/173 Sr - 6.0 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 2.2 apg
(IWU) Nick Anderson (C), 6-9/200 So - 4.5 ppg, 2.9 rpg
(IWU) Eric Dortch (F), 6-3/210 So - 3.1 ppg, 2.8 rpg


Team stats...

PPG
IWU - 77.0
Wooster - 75.2

Opp PPG
Wooster - 62.8
IWU - 66.8

FG
Wooster - .475
IWU - .467

Opp FG
Wooster - .390
IWU - .414

3-point
Wooster - .398
IWU - .360

Opp 3-point
Wooster - .282
IWU - .358

Reb. Margin
IWU - +6.2/game
Wooster - +5.8/game

FT
Wooster - .698
IWU - .678

A/TO
IWU - 1.1
Wooster - 1.0

Opp A/TO
IWU - 0.7
Wooster - 0.7
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 04, 2012, 11:18:20 PM
Quote from: sac on March 04, 2012, 10:23:20 PM
As a basketball fan I was generally disappointed in the quality of the officiating this weekend.   I'm not usually one that gripes too much about officiating anyway and the officiating of any game is usually reflective of the quality of play to me.  Unfortunately Saturday night I thought the quality of play was excellent and the officials kept getting in the way of what was really an incredible effort by two teams.

Way too difficult to compare and contrast officiating based on just one game, so I'll leave it at I was disappointed in the quality.  I should also add the Hope/IWU game was about as physical a game I can recall.  Those two teams were just hammering each other, many times the officials had no choice but to call a foul.

If I had to choose one theme to describe the bulk of NCAC officials, it would be that their tendency is to allow too much physicality.  Certain teams come into a gym and, possibly lacking the necessary basketball skills to win the ballgame, attempt to overwhelm the officials with the quantity of their bumping, reaching, and grabbing.  Some fouls are called, but never enough to keep the game under control.  Pretty soon, the more physical team has an advantage over the more skilled team.  I always look forward to the NCAA tournament, because then the NCAC clowns are gone (to be someone else's problem  :)), and we generally see much better officiated games, as we did this past weekend.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 04, 2012, 11:20:39 PM
For me, I think the difference between Witt and Wooster (and OWU and Wabash, really) were wafer thin most of the season and then Denison came in and started to play up to their potential. So I'm not shocked that Wooster is hosting because I think they moved ahead of Witt when Wooster won the NCAC tourney. I do think it came down to the NCAC tourney winner and that's why Witt went to Transylvania.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 04, 2012, 11:21:04 PM
Titan, somewhere around the middle of the season, Matt Fegan was returned to the point guard slot, moving X.B. to shooting guard.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 04, 2012, 11:22:05 PM
You know, WooBoo, I don't know how many fouls Nick Curosh received just for being big. So I think your analysis has a certain lens that may not be 100% in line with the perception of some of us. And this isn't a cotillion, it's hoops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 04, 2012, 11:31:21 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 04, 2012, 11:22:05 PM
You know, WooBoo, I don't know how many fouls Nick Curosh received just for being big. So I think your analysis has a certain lens that may not be 100% in line with the perception of some of us. And this isn't a cotillion, it's hoops.

You know, I don't give a rat's ass about the perception that "some of you" have.  My post stated MY opinion about NCAC officiating, an opinion that hasn't changed for years, and I'm standing by it.

You've asked several times where the Wooster fans have been all season.  I can speak for many of us.  We don't care for the company.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on March 04, 2012, 11:34:54 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2012, 11:21:04 PM
Titan, somewhere around the middle of the season, Matt Fegan was returned to the point guard slot, moving X.B. to shooting guard.

Corrected.  Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 04, 2012, 11:37:22 PM
Well, pardon me for trying to be fair to the entire league and  making sure every team was covered in here. It's an NCAC board, you know, not a one-team fan site for kool-aid drinkers.  :o

It also seemed that this year, the Wooster fans posted less than they have normally.It was a tough slog, and it will be a tough slog now going forward.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 05, 2012, 12:07:06 AM
Here is the NCAA tournament record from 2002 to 2011 for the top 8 conferences (from Gordon Mann's guide)

No. Conference  Tourney Games   Won-Loss   Winning %
1 Wisconsin Intercollegiate Athletic Conference (WIAC) 47  32-15  68.1%
2 University Athletic Association (UAA) 61  41-20  67.2%
3 Old Dominion Athletic Conference (ODAC) 66  44-22  66.7%
4 New England Small College Athletic Conference (NESCAC) 74  49-25  66.2%
5 North Coast Athletic Conference (NCAC) 45  29-16  64.4%
6 Ohio Athletic Conference (OAC) 39  25-14  64.1%
7 College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin (CCIW) 49  31-18  63.3%
8 Michigan Intercollegiate Athletic Association (MIAA) 33  20-13  60.6%

During this span, Wooster has been to the Final Four three times and Wittenberg once.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 05, 2012, 08:39:38 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 04, 2012, 09:33:27 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2012, 07:53:02 PM

I'm not sure the connections in Timken have ever been all that good--and I don't think they did any upgrades to them while building the Scot Center addition, unfortunately. Not sure what you need to be able to get a good stream, but no idea if the bandwidth is really there.

Still, terribly disappointing.

Yes, this is unfortunate.  IMO, I'm disappointed in Wooster's decision to completely ignore upgrading or even updating any part of the original PEC including Timken Gym and Timken Natatorium.  To build that beautiful new Scot Center and choose to leave the PEC basically untouched was a missed opportunity to me.  Especially Timken Gym (a facility I think should be the jewel of facilities at Wooster due to the tradition of basketball at the college). I shudder to think what kind of recruiting hauls Coach Moore could bring in if he had facilities even half as nice as what you see at other D3 programs like Hope and Calvin.  The bones of Timken Gym aren't that bad.  It is just well overdue for a facelift including new seats, new scoreboards, new lighting, and obviously, upgrades to their internet connectablity so we don't have the problems with live video feeds that we have seen now in the last two post-seasons.

Doing everything at once would have been prohibitively expensive, but Timken (bleachers, floor) and the state of the pool both come up frequently in discussions of campus facilities.  I suspect that it will become clearer within the next year or two where these rank in terms of institutional priorities.

On a different subject, have Wooster and Witt ever met on the hardwood in an NCAA tournament game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2012, 09:28:48 AM
Quote from: smedindy on March 04, 2012, 11:37:22 PM
It also seemed that this year, the Wooster fans posted less than they have normally.It was a tough slog, and it will be a tough slog now going forward.

Smeds- For me, at least, less posting throughout the season was directly related to me not just being able to watch/listen to many games because of work scheduling, etc. I've still only listened/watched the Scots about a dozen times this year--many fewer than most seasons for me. But I'm perfectly happy to get to watch/listen to at least one more Scots game this weekend!  :)

I was able to read the boards regularly, and I do thank you for your excellent previews throughout the season. +k
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 05, 2012, 09:40:57 AM
I was mostly trying to just poke a little needle. I know real life interferes with 'fun'.

Thanks for the karma!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 05, 2012, 09:50:21 AM
Who would have thought that one bracket would turn into an NCAC / CCIW challenge while the 'palace' in Holland is silent and the condiments will start to go flat?

I'd love to see a Witt / Wooster final game - having an NCAC team in the final four is a testament for the strength of the conference (this season) as a few weeks ago it was up for grabs whether Wooster would host a first round game in the NCAC tournament. It's a testament to them that they course corrected with aplomb. Also it was good to see Witt bounce back after their loss to Denison on their home court.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 05, 2012, 10:04:09 AM
Quote from: smedindy on March 05, 2012, 09:50:21 AM
Who would have thought that one bracket would turn into an NCAC / CCIW challenge while the 'palace' in Holland is silent and the condiments will start to go flat?

I'd love to see a Witt / Wooster final game - having an NCAC team in the final four is a testament for the strength of the conference (this season) as a few weeks ago it was up for grabs whether Wooster would host a first round game in the NCAC tournament. It's a testament to them that they course corrected with aplomb. Also it was good to see Witt bounce back after their loss to Denison on their home court.

Oh we're keeping the condiments on ice for the women's final 4.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2012, 10:08:55 AM
Quote from: smedindy on March 05, 2012, 09:50:21 AM
Who would have thought that one bracket would turn into an NCAC / CCIW challenge while the 'palace' in Holland is silent and the condiments will start to go flat?

I'd love to see a Witt / Wooster final game - having an NCAC team in the final four is a testament for the strength of the conference (this season) as a few weeks ago it was up for grabs whether Wooster would host a first round game in the NCAC tournament. It's a testament to them that they course corrected with aplomb. Also it was good to see Witt bounce back after their loss to Denison on their home court.

I almost picked the CCIW-NCAC challenge --the only thing I have wrong in this quadrant of the bracket was the Hope loss to IWU; that one I didn't expect. But I did fully expect Witt to be here, and I felt that NCC-Wash U was a pick 'em, even in St. Louis. I also think Wooster had the easiest slate to reach the Sweet Sixteen of any of the hosts in this bracket, and that may have played a role in why they're the only host still standing.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 05, 2012, 10:57:41 AM
Quote from: Titan Q on March 04, 2012, 11:10:54 PM
Illinois Wesleyan (21-7, 10-4 CCIW) @ Wooster (26-4, 12-4 NCAC)...

PG
(Wooster) Matt Fegan, 6-1/185 Sr - 7.5 ppg, 2.8 rpg, 2.7 apg, 1.6 A/TO (57-125 3-point, .456)
(IWU) Eliud Gonzalez, 5-9/170 Sr - 6.3 ppg, 3.7 rpg, 5.5 apg, 2.2 A/TO (55-131 FG, .420)

SG
(IWU) Jordan Zimmer, 6-5/190 Sr - 15.8 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 0.9 apg (96-229 3-point, .419)
(Wooster) Xavier Brown, 5-11/180 Fr - 13.0 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 1.6 apg (142-327 FG, .434)

G/F
(IWU) John Koschnitzky, 6-6/205 Sr - 9.4 ppg, 3.0 rpg (86-216 FG, .398)
(Wooster) Justin Warnes, 6-3/180 Sr - 5.4 ppg, 4.2 rpg (45-91 FG, .495)

F
(Wooster) Justin Hallowell, 6-7/210 Sr - 14.0 ppg, 6.8 rpg (74-182 3-point, .407)
(IWU) Victor Davis, 6-5/225 So - 10.6 ppg, 5.0 rpg (113-219 FG, .516)

F/C
(Wooster) Josh Claytor, 6-7/225 Jr - 11.1 ppg, 5.3 rpg (140-227 FG, .617)
(IWU) Kevin Reed, 6-7/225 Jr - 9.2 ppg, 6.0 rpg (112-183 FG, .612)

Bench
(Wooster) Jake Mays (F/C), 6-8/215 Jr - 6.2 ppg, 4.5 rpg
(Wooster) Doug Thorpe (G), 5-9/175 So - 6.1 ppg, 1.1 rpg
(Wooster) Evan Pannell (G), 6-2/175 Fr - 3.0 ppg, 0.9 rpg
(Wooster) Jalen Goodwin (G), 6-0/175 Fr - 2.7 ppg, 1.7 rpg

(IWU) Andrew Ziemnik (F), 6-5/225 So - 7.3 ppg, 4.1 rpg
(IWU) Stephen Rudnicki (G), 6-3/173 Sr - 6.0 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 2.2 apg
(IWU) Nick Anderson (C), 6-9/200 So - 4.5 ppg, 2.9 rpg
(IWU) Eric Dortch (F), 6-3/210 So - 3.1 ppg, 2.8 rpg


Team stats...

PPG
IWU - 77.0
Wooster - 75.2

Opp PPG
Wooster - 62.8
IWU - 66.8

FG
Wooster - .475
IWU - .467

Opp FG
Wooster - .390
IWU - .414

3-point
Wooster - .398
IWU - .360

Opp 3-point
Wooster - .282
IWU - .358

Reb. Margin
IWU - +6.2/game
Wooster - +5.8/game

FT
Wooster - .698
IWU - .678

A/TO
IWU - 1.1
Wooster - 1.0

Opp A/TO
IWU - 0.7
Wooster - 0.7

Hey Titan, thanks for the breakdown.  This looks like a mathup of two pretty even teams to me!  IWU has some size though and I will be interested to see what Coach Moore does in choosing defensive matchups.  Justin Warnes is usually the guy Moore calls on to defend the opponent's best offensive player, but with IWU starting 4 guys at 6'5" or better, this could cause some match-up problems for Wooster who usually employs a 3 guard line-up and sometimes a 4 guard line-up.  Should be interesting to see how this one plays out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: iwumichigander on March 05, 2012, 12:00:38 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 04, 2012, 10:57:13 PM
More like regional ranking, despite losing two to Wittenberg and despite not seeing the final regional rankings, I am of the opinion that Wooster moved ahead of Witt in the final rankings giving them the chance to host the first weekend and now the second.

Another reason I am confident Wooster was ranked ahead of Wittenberg in the final regional ranking was because Wittenberg went to Transylvania... and they wouldn't have had two #2's in that pod (Transylvania apparently did finish 2 in the Midwest from what I was told).

FYI - if Wash U had WON and beaten NCC... then Wittenberg would have been hosting because Wooster and Wash U are more than 500 miles from one another and the NCAA wouldn't have paid for that flight. Thus, the game would have been moved to Witt, who is inside that 500 mile rule.

Just something to consider.
Dave - I think a post on another board mentioned a distance issue between Wooster and Whittenberg that necessitated sending Whit to Translyvania?  As far as distance; despite the NCAA mileage tool; it seems to me IWU's bus driver clocked 499.5 the last trip to Wooster. It is also ironic the 4 CCIW teams get sent to Ohio - as on the Women's side IWU and Carthage are at Alliance 51 miles away
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on March 05, 2012, 12:04:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2012, 09:33:23 PM
Pennstghs, I'll complain about the officials any goddamned time that I want, especially in a game that doesn't involve Wooster.  They were miserable, if unbiased, and should be put out of work as soon as possible.  Good choice going to the Big Ten tourney, because Wittenberg's going to get their ass handed to them by North Central.  And outside of anyone that makes the trip from Springfield, there won't be a person in the house offering them any sympathy.

ScotsFan: It looks like I have been "granted" a redo on my previous post. Which is probably a good thing... either way I am sticking by and reaffirming my statement that I have read countless idiotic posts from WoosterBooster. After years of following this thread I have come to believe he is a miserable person, who has no real basketball insight. Most posters (ScotFan included) have the sense to actually admit when they are wrong or when the team they follow was outplayed/ out-executed but not Wooster Booster it's always the refs fault.

And most of all, the only reason I did make my 9th career post is this gem: "because Wittenberg's going to get their ass handed to them by North Central." ... which of course could be correct by sheer luck but most likely is just WooBoo again posting something with no substance.

If you do have any basketball knowledge WooBoo you have completely fooled me.

Good Luck to the Tigers. WHO U WITT!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 05, 2012, 12:24:23 PM
Quote from: iwumichigander on March 05, 2012, 12:00:38 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 04, 2012, 10:57:13 PM
More like regional ranking, despite losing two to Wittenberg and despite not seeing the final regional rankings, I am of the opinion that Wooster moved ahead of Witt in the final rankings giving them the chance to host the first weekend and now the second.

Another reason I am confident Wooster was ranked ahead of Wittenberg in the final regional ranking was because Wittenberg went to Transylvania... and they wouldn't have had two #2's in that pod (Transylvania apparently did finish 2 in the Midwest from what I was told).

FYI - if Wash U had WON and beaten NCC... then Wittenberg would have been hosting because Wooster and Wash U are more than 500 miles from one another and the NCAA wouldn't have paid for that flight. Thus, the game would have been moved to Witt, who is inside that 500 mile rule.

Just something to consider.
Dave - I think a post on another board mentioned a distance issue between Wooster and Whittenberg that necessitated sending Whit to Translyvania?  As far as distance; despite the NCAA mileage tool; it seems to me IWU's bus driver clocked 499.5 the last trip to Wooster. It is also ironic the 4 CCIW teams get sent to Ohio - as on the Women's side IWU and Carthage are at Alliance 51 miles away

The NCAA mileage tool does not recognize the odometer. It knows all and sees all!  ;)

(And it doesn't recognize the Mr. Ypsi Ferry 'Cross The Mersey Michigan.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 05, 2012, 12:36:37 PM
I used the NCAA mileage program and Wash U and Wooster are more than 500 miles... that would have forced Wittenberg to host.

As for last weekend... the fact that BSC as within 500 miles of Transy was the reason that worked for Transy's favor, along with the fact they apparently finished second in the MW Regional Rankings.

It has been alluded to that Witt traveled and Wooster hosted because Randolph-Macon could bus to Wooster, however I don't think that was the factor to make that decision... because RMC could have traveled to a MW pod or they could have had RMC at VWC with them playing in the second round (though, I hate that idea). In other words, there were other options for RMC... I don't think Wooster hosted just for that reason.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 05, 2012, 12:48:54 PM
The NCAA did something right with football this year, and hopefully soon it will award hosting to the most deserving teams and not be a total slave to the 500-mile rule.

However, I know they need to watch costs, but I think bracketing the tourney properly is the best way to go and if there are conflicts they're known in advance. Hosting should be the ultimate reward, not the result of happenstance based on a few miles.

/optimist
//not counting on change
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 05, 2012, 12:54:41 PM
Also... let's see if football does that next year... that will let us know if was a real change.

Also, with football it is one game per decision... basketball there are more teams involved making the decisions a little more challenging.

500 miles comes into play far more for hosting decisions in basketball... where in football it makes it a bracketing decision. In basketball they can move it to a different team for hosting if it keeps everything inside of 500 miles. Football they have to make those types of decisions before they release the bracket.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 05, 2012, 01:29:13 PM
First of all, I would just like to express my displeasure to the NCAA for NOT releasing the final regional rankings.  Why do they need to be so freaking top secret?  But then again, if they did release them, it might have ended all the speculation as to why Wooster was awarded the Sectional and then what would we have to talk about?   :P

Personally, I am of the opinion that Wooster has been hosting because they did in fact jump Witt in the final regional rankings.  And I also would tend to agree with Dave M. in that Transy got to host last weekend due to BSU travel issues moreso than those of R-MC's.  I agree that there seem to have been more options available as to where to send R-MC as opposed to BSU. 

I also agree that if WashU beats NCC, Witt would be hosting this weekend and not Woo. 

Quote from: iwumichigander on March 05, 2012, 12:00:38 PM
Dave - I think a post on another board mentioned a distance issue between Wooster and Whittenberg that necessitated sending Whit to Translyvania?  As far as distance; despite the NCAA mileage tool; it seems to me IWU's bus driver clocked 499.5 the last trip to Wooster. It is also ironic the 4 CCIW teams get sent to Ohio - as on the Women's side IWU and Carthage are at Alliance 51 miles away

Well, I checked Google Maps and Yahoo Maps and they both had the distance from Bloomington to Wooster at 440 miles.  Shorter than the 500 mile trip (Google Maps had it 500 on the nose and Yahoo Maps actually had it at 502) Wooster had to make in the opening round of the tournament several years ago when they had to travel to Rock Island and host Augie...  :P   8-)

And what is the irony of 4 CCIW teams playing in Ohio exactly?  DePauw was the top seed in that section of the women's bracket and they were knocked off by Carthage making UMU the top remaining seed in that section and thus they were justly awarded hosting rights.  Not sure where the irony is in that?  (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.scout.com%2Fmedia%2Fforums%2Femoticons%2Fnoidea.gif&hash=d0853e7250ffe0f662a746329d301aa06dd4ee9f)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2012, 01:36:56 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 05, 2012, 01:29:13 PM
First of all, I would just like to express my displeasure to the NCAA for NOT releasing the final regional rankings.  Why do they need to be so freaking top secret?  But then again, if they did release them, it might have ended all the speculation as to why Wooster was awarded the Sectional and then what would we have to talk about?   :P

Personally, I am of the opinion that Wooster has been hosting because they did in fact jump Witt in the final regional rankings.  And I also would tend to agree with Dave M. in that Transy got to host last weekend due to BSU travel issues moreso than those of R-MC's.  I agree that there seem to have been more options available as to where to send R-MC as opposed to BSU. 

I also agree that if WashU beats NCC, Witt would be hosting this weekend and not Woo. 

Quote from: iwumichigander on March 05, 2012, 12:00:38 PM
Dave - I think a post on another board mentioned a distance issue between Wooster and Whittenberg that necessitated sending Whit to Translyvania?  As far as distance; despite the NCAA mileage tool; it seems to me IWU's bus driver clocked 499.5 the last trip to Wooster. It is also ironic the 4 CCIW teams get sent to Ohio - as on the Women's side IWU and Carthage are at Alliance 51 miles away

Well, I checked Google Maps and Yahoo Maps and they both had the distance from Bloomington to Wooster at 440 miles.  Shorter than the 500 mile trip (Google Maps had it 500 on the nose and Yahoo Maps actually had it at 502) Wooster had to make in the opening round of the tournament several years ago when they had to travel to Rock Island and host Augie...  :P   8-)

And what is the irony of 4 CCIW teams playing in Ohio exactly?  DePauw was the top seed in that section of the women's bracket and they were knocked off by Carthage making UMU the top remaining seed in that section and thus they were justly awarded hosting rights.  Not sure where the irony is in that?  (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.scout.com%2Fmedia%2Fforums%2Femoticons%2Fnoidea.gif&hash=d0853e7250ffe0f662a746329d301aa06dd4ee9f)

SF: I think there is a simple explanation for IWUmichiganders distance errors. After careful review of the IWU itinerary and the NCAA mileage tool, it appears that 60-mile detours through Ohio's Amish Country for cheese (http://heinis.com/), pies (http://www.troyershomepantry.com/), and wood stoves (http://www.lehmans.com/) aren't accounted for in the official NCAA mileage tool.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 05, 2012, 01:47:21 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2012, 01:36:56 PM
SF: I think there is a simple explanation for IWUmichiganders distance errors. After careful review of the IWU itinerary and the NCAA mileage tool, it appears that 60-mile detours through Ohio's Amish Country for cheese (http://heinis.com/), pies (http://www.troyershomepantry.com/), and wood stoves (http://www.lehmans.com/) aren't accounted for in the official NCAA mileage tool.  :)

Aha!  That would definitely explain things!   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on March 05, 2012, 02:23:56 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2012, 01:36:56 PM

SF: I think there is a simple explanation for IWUmichiganders distance errors. After careful review of the IWU itinerary and the NCAA mileage tool, it appears that 60-mile detours through Ohio's Amish Country for cheese (http://heinis.com/), pies (http://www.troyershomepantry.com/), and wood stoves (http://www.lehmans.com/) aren't accounted for in the official NCAA mileage tool.  :)

True... a missed turn off US 30 and running to Shisler's (be kind - wifey's relatives  ;)) to turn-around (7 pt turn for bus in that lot) adds twenty-six miles alone, never mind a detour for fried bologna at Troyer's  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2012, 02:26:03 PM
Quote from: hotdawg on March 05, 2012, 12:04:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2012, 09:33:23 PM
Pennstghs, I'll complain about the officials any goddamned time that I want, especially in a game that doesn't involve Wooster.  They were miserable, if unbiased, and should be put out of work as soon as possible.  Good choice going to the Big Ten tourney, because Wittenberg's going to get their ass handed to them by North Central.  And outside of anyone that makes the trip from Springfield, there won't be a person in the house offering them any sympathy.

ScotsFan: It looks like I have been "granted" a redo on my previous post. Which is probably a good thing... either way I am sticking by and reaffirming my statement that I have read countless idiotic posts from WoosterBooster. After years of following this thread I have come to believe he is a miserable person, who has no real basketball insight. Most posters (ScotFan included) have the sense to actually admit when they are wrong or when the team they follow was outplayed/ out-executed but not Wooster Booster it's always the refs fault.

And most of all, the only reason I did make my 9th career post is this gem: "because Wittenberg's going to get their ass handed to them by North Central." ... which of course could be correct by sheer luck but most likely is just WooBoo again posting something with no substance.

If you do have any basketball knowledge WooBoo you have completely fooled me.

Good Luck to the Tigers. WHO U WITT!

From the Terms of Service (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=5787.msg1#new):
3. Posts that simply serve to bash another poster and do not discuss Division III sports will be removed.
I believe this one qualifies. There is no substance here, just ad hominems.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: iwumichigander on March 05, 2012, 02:43:17 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2012, 01:36:56 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 05, 2012, 01:29:13 PM
First of all, I would just like to express my displeasure to the NCAA for NOT releasing the final regional rankings.  Why do they need to be so freaking top secret?  But then again, if they did release them, it might have ended all the speculation as to why Wooster was awarded the Sectional and then what would we have to talk about?   :P

Personally, I am of the opinion that Wooster has been hosting because they did in fact jump Witt in the final regional rankings.  And I also would tend to agree with Dave M. in that Transy got to host last weekend due to BSU travel issues moreso than those of R-MC's.  I agree that there seem to have been more options available as to where to send R-MC as opposed to BSU. 

I also agree that if WashU beats NCC, Witt would be hosting this weekend and not Woo. 

Quote from: iwumichigander on March 05, 2012, 12:00:38 PM
Dave - I think a post on another board mentioned a distance issue between Wooster and Whittenberg that necessitated sending Whit to Translyvania?  As far as distance; despite the NCAA mileage tool; it seems to me IWU's bus driver clocked 499.5 the last trip to Wooster. It is also ironic the 4 CCIW teams get sent to Ohio - as on the Women's side IWU and Carthage are at Alliance 51 miles away

Well, I checked Google Maps and Yahoo Maps and they both had the distance from Bloomington to Wooster at 440 miles.  Shorter than the 500 mile trip (Google Maps had it 500 on the nose and Yahoo Maps actually had it at 502) Wooster had to make in the opening round of the tournament several years ago when they had to travel to Rock Island and host Augie...  :P   8-)

And what is the irony of 4 CCIW teams playing in Ohio exactly?  DePauw was the top seed in that section of the women's bracket and they were knocked off by Carthage making UMU the top remaining seed in that section and thus they were justly awarded hosting rights.  Not sure where the irony is in that?  (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.scout.com%2Fmedia%2Fforums%2Femoticons%2Fnoidea.gif&hash=d0853e7250ffe0f662a746329d301aa06dd4ee9f)

SF: I think there is a simple explanation for IWUmichiganders distance errors. After careful review of the IWU itinerary and the NCAA mileage tool, it appears that 60-mile detours through Ohio's Amish Country for cheese (http://heinis.com/), pies (http://www.troyershomepantry.com/), and wood stoves (http://www.lehmans.com/) aren't accounted for in the official NCAA mileage tool.  :)
Hum - the mileage I noted above could have come from our fan bus in which case the detours and diversions could apply easily!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on March 05, 2012, 03:22:55 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 05, 2012, 02:26:03 PMFrom the Terms of Service (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=5787.msg1#new):
3. Posts that simply serve to bash another poster and do not discuss Division III sports will be removed.
I believe this one qualifies. There is no substance here, just ad hominems.

Thats fine remove away! Thanks for policing - I'll surely read the terms and conditions more closely next time. Yep I bashed another poster; which is far worse than repeatedly bashing refs, opposing fans, opposing college athletes and opposing coaches i guess.

Who U Witt

- Although I would have really liked for Witt to have received the advantage of playing at home for the Sectionals. I think playing @ Woo favors Witt at almost at the same level as it favors Wooster. Witt is very familiar with the court and atmosphere Timken brings. Every game they have played there is a huge game, the pressure is comparable and they have quite a bit of experience winning big games @ Woo. This gives both Witt and Woo have a big advantage over the other two teams and I think an elite 8 showdown is coming.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 05, 2012, 03:38:40 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 05, 2012, 12:54:41 PM
Also... let's see if football does that next year... that will let us know if was a real change.

Also, with football it is one game per decision... basketball there are more teams involved making the decisions a little more challenging.

500 miles comes into play far more for hosting decisions in basketball... where in football it makes it a bracketing decision. In basketball they can move it to a different team for hosting if it keeps everything inside of 500 miles. Football they have to make those types of decisions before they release the bracket.

My take is that barring a conflict, they shouldn't have to make those decisions. #1 hosts, and if they are eliminated #2 hosts, etc. etc.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: iwumichigander on March 05, 2012, 03:45:27 PM
Quote from: hotdawg on March 05, 2012, 03:22:55 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 05, 2012, 02:26:03 PMFrom the Terms of Service (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=5787.msg1#new):
3. Posts that simply serve to bash another poster and do not discuss Division III sports will be removed.
I believe this one qualifies. There is no substance here, just ad hominems.

Thats fine remove away! Thanks for policing - I'll surely read the terms and conditions more closely next time. Yep I bashed another poster; which is far worse than repeatedly bashing refs, opposing fans, opposing college athletes and opposing coaches i guess.

Who U Witt

- Although I would have really liked for Witt to have received the advantage of playing at home for the Sectionals. I think playing @ Woo favors Witt at almost at the same level as it favors Wooster. Witt is very familiar with the court and atmosphere Timken brings. Every game they have played there is a huge game, the pressure is comparable and they have quite a bit of experience winning big games @ Woo. This gives both Witt and Woo have a big advantage over the other two teams and I think an elite 8 showdown is coming.
Setting aside home court for Woo and travel distance advantage for Woo and Witt; what advantages do you think Woo and Witt have over the other two teams?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Cali-Scot on March 05, 2012, 04:44:29 PM
As interesting as all the talk about travel, mileage and adventures in Amish country is, how about we start talking about how the 4 teams playing in Wooster this weekend match up?

I'd love to hear what people are thinking each teams strengths and weaknesses are relative to each other.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on March 05, 2012, 04:59:02 PM
Quote from: iwumichigander on March 05, 2012, 03:45:27 PM
Setting aside home court for Woo and travel distance advantage for Woo and Witt; what advantages do you think Woo and Witt have over the other two teams?
[/quote]

Honestly, I am not familiar enough to speak on behalf of North Central... have not seen them play. I think this is a Wittenberg team that is going to be a very tough out in this tournament. They have size, depth and senior leaders. Not many D3 teams can control a game with 2 quality senior posts as Witt (Brandt and Black are a handful). On the outside the seniors Mckee and Cooper can change games with their athleticism, competitiveness and spurtability from 3.
All four of these seniors and a fifth (Weide) have been getting significant minutes since they were Freshman. They are coming off maybe their best game of the year where they weren't really even challenged (same can be said for Wooster).

North Central looks like they have hit their stride after a shaky start. However after just looking at boxscores it seems they just barely got past Rose Hulman a team that I did see few times this year and did not think they were really a tournament caliber team. That being said its the tourney and they did advance which is always the bottom line. Should be a great weekend of bball... I think Witt and Woo have strong starts (familiar setting will make a difference) and they fight their way to Saturday night.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: iwumichigander on March 05, 2012, 06:03:27 PM
North Central did get off to a rough start in part due loss through graduation.  Only one senior on this young team.  I had posted pre-season that I thought Todd Raridon would find a way to put this team together but it might take a little time. I never expected, honestly, the Cards exceptional success this season in the CCIW.

Cardinals are anchored by 6' 6" 240 Soph - Landon Gamble who is a post handful;Derek Raridon Jr G/F really good and So CJ Goldthree who has come on strong in 2nd half (and Goldthree might be considered by some as the missing piece of the early season puzzle).

Cardinals are coached by Todd Raridon in his seventh year at North Central entered the season with a 106-75, with a winning percentage of .586. Prior to his arrival at North Central, Raridon spent 15 years as head basketball coach at Nebraska Wesleyan University and never experienced a losing season, despite being the only school not giving athletic scholarships in an NAIA conference. He took Nebraska Wesleyan to the NCAA Division III tournament seven times and won six conference titles. His career mark at Nebraska Wesleyan was 269-125 over 15 years.

Expect a well-prepared, disciplined, tough defensive team that can shoot the ball (.470 FG% / .402 3Pts%).  Weaknesses could be depth and youth. Cards are a really good team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on March 05, 2012, 06:44:26 PM
Quote from: Cali-Scot on March 05, 2012, 04:44:29 PM
As interesting as all the talk about travel, mileage and adventures in Amish country is, how about we start talking about how the 4 teams playing in Wooster this weekend match up?

I'd love to hear what people are thinking each teams strengths and weaknesses are relative to each other.
How can any legitimate talk about the sites and tourist activities around Wooster not include a mention of Coccia House?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 05, 2012, 07:14:40 PM
Witt has an advantage that they've spread around the scoring load. Even with Clayton "Get A Haircut Hippie  ;)" Black has an off game, McKee, Cooper and Leahy (among others) have picked up the slack.

(Seriously, give Black a beard and he could be someone like Marc Gasol from a couple of years ago or Fabricio Oberto).

Wooster needs to have their inside game working. When they struggled earlier in the year they were reliant on the perimeter game.

No team making it this far has a lot of weaknesses. Both squads make you earn every point you get - except for Hiram the NCAC was a defensive, patient, fundamental league. Witt and Wooster will be content if you just chuck three-pointers up all night, which hurt teams like OWU and Wabash at times during the year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 05, 2012, 08:13:31 PM
Quote from: iwumichigander on March 05, 2012, 06:03:27 PM
North Central did get off to a rough start in part due loss through graduation.  Only one senior on this young team.

The bigger reason was injuries. NCC only lost one senior from last year's team, although he was a good one (Brian Evans). In November and December NCC was plagued by a string of injuries that adversely impacted the depth-challenged Cardinals.

Quote from: iwumichigander on March 05, 2012, 06:03:27 PMI had posted pre-season that I thought Todd Raridon would find a way to put this team together but it might take a little time. I never expected, honestly, the Cards exceptional success this season in the CCIW.

Cardinals are anchored by 6' 6" 240 Soph - Landon Gamble who is a post handful;Derek Raridon Jr G/F really good and So CJ Goldthree who has come on strong in 2nd half (and Goldthree might be considered by some as the missing piece of the early season puzzle).

He left out NCC's best player, 6'6 junior PF Aaron Tiknis (11.1 ppg, 7.0 rpg). Tiknis was not only NCC's best rebounder, he also led the Cardinals in assists with 108, an eye-popping number for a power forward. He also shot over 50% (40-79) from downtown, finishing second in the CCIW in trey percentage (57% in league games). Tiknis started his career not too far away from Wooster, at D2 Wheeling Jesuit. This is his second year with the Cardinals.

The PG, Kevin Gillespie, is very solid. He's not a star by any means, but he's skilled and tough, and he's an ironman who may not leave the court at all this weekend. Superstar or not, there wasn't a single point guard in the CCIW who could dominate Gillespie.

Quote from: iwumichigander on March 05, 2012, 06:03:27 PMExpect a well-prepared, disciplined, tough defensive team that can shoot the ball (.470 FG% / .402 3Pts%).  Weaknesses could be depth and youth. Cards are a really good team.

Youth won't be a problem. North Central's starting five of Kevin Gillespie, C.J. Goldthree, Derek Raridon, Aaron Tiknis, and Landon Gamble has been together playing heavy varsity minutes for two full seasons now (Tiknis came off the bench last season, while the other four started), and the other two main players in the rotation, Charlie Rosenberg and Vince Kmiec, have plenty of minutes under their belts now as well.

Depth is NCC's most serious concern. The Cards go seven deep, and after that there is a huge dropoff. In fact, it's more than a dropoff; it's a cliff. If you get the eighth and ninth men for NCC on the floor for any protracted amount of time, you'll see that they're most likely in way over their heads at the sectional level of play. The Cards are superbly conditioned, and Todd Raridon has been very canny in his substitution patterns, so the Cards are usually able to get around issues of fatigue and foul trouble. But that depth issue is always looming for NCC as a potential Achilles heel.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 05, 2012, 08:34:17 PM
A few things to get to:

First, good to meet you D-Mac McHugh Friday night. I wouldn't ever expect to meet you in the circumstances we did but during a tornado warning in the bleachers at Transylvania!

As for WooBoo's comments, I don't think I directly called you out for questioning officiating (someone else did) but spoke about the board generally. I don't think the response you gave was respectful, deserving or even had any sort of valid points or substance whatsoever. To say I'd be better off seeing another tournament instead of my team getting their ass pounded???? Wow, glad we have some class at Wittenberg.

On to actual comments that have some substance and validity. Both NCAC teams will have their hands full no doubt. I expect Witt to have a good crowd on hand and obviously Wooster will have the house packed. Wittenberg needs to continue to play through the post and generate open 3's. I hope NCC watched film of this weekend as the 2-3 zone is not the way to play this Witt team. Hopefully the senior leadership and solid bench play continues for Witt.

Wooster has a great chance by being the home team, but for the few minutes I watched IWU-Hope, what I took away was that IWU has some solid mid-range shooters and will take a complete effort. From what I"ve seen from Wooster is that when they are tough to beat it's when their scoring is well-rounded versus Xavier Brown trying to do too much.

And don't worry guys, I'm over Wooster hosting over Wittenberg. I feel I had to vent and have some entirely valid points, but it is what it is. I'm not really disputing them hosting, moreso disputing them being ranked higher but its moot at this point.

Anyone want to volunteer to keep me updated Friday night and Saturday?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2012, 09:03:11 PM
Wooster posted a nice little highlight video from this weekend's action:

http://youtu.be/k4_ZubiM1qs

Enjoy!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2012, 09:37:49 PM
Quote from: Titan Q on March 04, 2012, 11:34:54 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2012, 11:21:04 PM
Titan, somewhere around the middle of the season, Matt Fegan was returned to the point guard slot, moving X.B. to shooting guard.

Corrected.  Thanks.

The move to bring Fegan back into the starting lineup as the point guard was coupled with increasing Jalen Goodwin's minutes off the bench to spell Fegan at point, and allowed both Xavier Brown and key reserve Doug Thorpe to slot into the shooting guard role.

Taking the ball out of Brown's hands has generally been good for the Scots offense, I think, because it took ball handling pressure off of the freshman and made for fewer possessions where he was just trying to create directly from the point. Plus Brown's offensive failing is that he was turnover-prone; both Fegan and Goodwin have been solid ballhandlers, and both help engage more of the Wooster offensive weapons than Brown did, I think. Goodwin may not get enough credit for just how well he's played in the supporting point guard role, actually.

Fegan returned to the Wooster lineup in the Jan. 18th game against Allegheny, which immediately followed the DePauw loss that made the Scots 12-3 on the year. Since then, the Scots are 15-1, and averaging (if I'm doing my math right!) nearly 4 fewer turnovers per game (from 14.7 to 11.0).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 05, 2012, 10:24:35 PM
For the record, the official NCAA mileage system has it as 513 miles from Wash U to Wooster campuses... any other software is honestly a moot point.

Now, the video from Wooster... are they allowed to post that since the video is actually owned by the NCAA ;) (joke for anyone understands the NCAA Tournament rules).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scottiedoug on March 06, 2012, 10:38:51 AM
I understand that Wooster fans are looking forward but I still am interested in reading whatever anyone who saw Wooster beat Maryville can offer about Maryville's game.  We return a lot of freshmen who played a lot of minutes and I, too, am looking to the future, albeit next year and not next weekend.  Thanks!

And good luck!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 06, 2012, 11:35:43 AM
Quote from: scottiedoug on March 06, 2012, 10:38:51 AM
I understand that Wooster fans are looking forward but I still am interested in reading whatever anyone who saw Wooster beat Maryville can offer about Maryville's game.  We return a lot of freshmen who played a lot of minutes and I, too, am looking to the future, albeit next year and not next weekend.  Thanks!

And good luck!

Sorry scottiedoug.  I had been meaning to answer your post.  Personally, I thought Maryville played pretty darn well against the northern Scots on Friday night.  They came out on fire and got out to an early 10 point lead but you had to question whether or not they would stay that hot.  They did cool off a bit which allowed Wooster to chip away at that 10 point deficit  and manage to get into the locker room with momentum and a tie score.  I thought Wooster would just come out of the locker rooms and just build on their momentum, but to Maryville's credit, they stayed right with the Scots for the majority of the second half.

As for the future of Maryville, they may be young, but it's going to be tough to replace a scorer like Milton Stanley.  I thought he was the best player on the court for both teams.  He was a very difficult matchup for the Scots to defend and ended the game with 21 points.  I didn't see anyone from Maryville that could step up and do what Stanley did for them in that game.  Your Scots may be young, but its just my opinion that it won't be easy for them to try and replace a talent like Stanley...

Hope that answers some of your questions for you.  Now, back to discussing this weekend...  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 06, 2012, 11:52:22 AM
Quote from: smedindy on March 05, 2012, 07:14:40 PM

Wooster needs to have their inside game working. When they struggled earlier in the year they were reliant on the perimeter game.


They were also struggling to find their identity.  Claytor REALLY stepped his game up as the season went along.  Coming into this season, I hadn't seen anything from Claytor in his first two years at Wooster that showed me he could carry the load inside for the Scots this season with the loss of Bryan Wickliffe to graduation.  So, early in the season, Wooster struggled to find their identity and as a result, struggled to win games.  Claytor then proved that he could be THE guy inside for Wooster and I think the results, since Wooster lost back to back games to Witt and Wabash back in December, speak for themselves.

There are still times when Wooster reverts to going away from Claytor and their inside game and you can see the offensive struggles follow.  So I agree that keeping Woo's inside game going will be a key for continued Wooster success this weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scottiedoug on March 06, 2012, 01:30:22 PM
Thanks, ScotsFan.  Last year it was not all that clear who would replace last year's best player, Eryk Watson.  Maybe someone will appear.  I hope we can schedule some NCAC team next year.  It helped to have played Witt this year when we had to try to deal with Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 06, 2012, 06:51:24 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 05, 2012, 07:14:40 PM
Witt has an advantage that they've spread around the scoring load. Even with Clayton "Get A Haircut Hippie  ;)" Black has an off game, McKee, Cooper and Leahy (among others) have picked up the slack.

(Seriously, give Black a beard and he could be someone like Marc Gasol from a couple of years ago or Fabricio Oberto).


Do you have something against long haired, bearded hippies?   :P  My hair is gaining on Black's (not quite as long but getting there) AND I have a beard, AND I like the Dead!   :-*  ;D  I let my hair grow out every winter a) because my wife likes me with long hair, and b) because I can!   8-)  I'm not a fan of Clayton Black, but it has more to do with the team he plays for and not the length of his hair...  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 06, 2012, 06:58:48 PM
Hah  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 07, 2012, 11:41:49 AM
Quote from: Titan Q on March 04, 2012, 11:10:54 PM
Illinois Wesleyan (21-7, 10-4 CCIW) @ Wooster (26-4, 12-4 NCAC)...

PG
(Wooster) Matt Fegan, 6-1/185 Sr - 7.5 ppg, 2.8 rpg, 2.7 apg, 1.6 A/TO (57-125 3-point, .456)
(IWU) Eliud Gonzalez, 5-9/170 Sr - 6.3 ppg, 3.7 rpg, 5.5 apg, 2.2 A/TO (55-131 FG, .420)

SG
(IWU) Jordan Zimmer, 6-5/190 Sr - 15.8 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 0.9 apg (96-229 3-point, .419)
(Wooster) Xavier Brown, 5-11/180 Fr - 13.0 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 1.6 apg (142-327 FG, .434)

G/F
(IWU) John Koschnitzky, 6-6/205 Sr - 9.4 ppg, 3.0 rpg (86-216 FG, .398)
(Wooster) Justin Warnes, 6-3/180 Sr - 5.4 ppg, 4.2 rpg (45-91 FG, .495)

F
(Wooster) Justin Hallowell, 6-7/210 Sr - 14.0 ppg, 6.8 rpg (74-182 3-point, .407)
(IWU) Victor Davis, 6-5/225 So - 10.6 ppg, 5.0 rpg (113-219 FG, .516)

F/C
(Wooster) Josh Claytor, 6-7/225 Jr - 11.1 ppg, 5.3 rpg (140-227 FG, .617)
(IWU) Kevin Reed, 6-7/225 Jr - 9.2 ppg, 6.0 rpg (112-183 FG, .612)

Bench
(Wooster) Jake Mays (F/C), 6-8/215 Jr - 6.2 ppg, 4.5 rpg
(Wooster) Doug Thorpe (G), 5-9/175 So - 6.1 ppg, 1.1 rpg
(Wooster) Evan Pannell (G), 6-2/175 Fr - 3.0 ppg, 0.9 rpg
(Wooster) Jalen Goodwin (G), 6-0/175 Fr - 2.7 ppg, 1.7 rpg

(IWU) Andrew Ziemnik (F), 6-5/225 So - 7.3 ppg, 4.1 rpg
(IWU) Stephen Rudnicki (G), 6-3/173 Sr - 6.0 ppg, 1.6 rpg, 2.2 apg
(IWU) Nick Anderson (C), 6-9/200 So - 4.5 ppg, 2.9 rpg
(IWU) Eric Dortch (F), 6-3/210 So - 3.1 ppg, 2.8 rpg


Team stats...

PPG
IWU - 77.0
Wooster - 75.2

Opp PPG
Wooster - 62.8
IWU - 66.8

FG
Wooster - .475
IWU - .467

Opp FG
Wooster - .390
IWU - .414

3-point
Wooster - .398
IWU - .360

Opp 3-point
Wooster - .282
IWU - .358

Reb. Margin
IWU - +6.2/game
Wooster - +5.8/game

FT
Wooster - .698
IWU - .678

A/TO
IWU - 1.1
Wooster - 1.0

Opp A/TO
IWU - 0.7
Wooster - 0.7

Also add to the bench for Wooster:
Kenny DeBoer (F), 6-5/215 Fr - 4.0 ppg, 2.3 rpg

I would think that DeBoer is likely to see some big minutes against the taller IWU lineup.  He was out with a knee injury for the last several games of the regular season, but was back for the conference semis.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 08, 2012, 04:56:21 PM
question about OWU fans. Are they always rude and obnoxious? I know this is a basketball board but last night I was at a lacrosse game at owu and the fans were terrible and an embarrassment to the school. They had ncac refs and are the dirtiest team I have seen in any sport other then the Wayne State football team. Still they were constantly and in a very rude way complaining they are being shafted by the refs. I know this is something that happens to some extent with just about all teams but they crossed the line. I hate too see what they will be saying when Denison kills them on the 31st. Now mind you this is at a school where I have seen the security throw opposing parents out for "negative"cheering. I thought Penn State and Ohio State  fans were bad but the Bishop fans were terrible, not so much the students but the older folks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 08, 2012, 07:21:57 PM
Hey, hey, you can't do that on here.  You're only allowed to criticize other posters.  ;)

Seriously, I've seen the OWU student section, in Delaware, be pretty obnoxious at Wooster games.  Their own security has had to settle them down.  At Kenyon, a couple of years ago, I watched as some of their students ripped into our cheerleaders, no less.  When they wouldn't stop, I had a talk with a staffer who spoke to them.  Allegheny's students, at baseball games in Meadville, used to bring a keg to the field and were downright rotten.  Unfortunately, here in Wooster, the kids are probably not much better, when they're there, which is unlikely this weekend due to the beginning of spring break.  The Wooster baseball players used to sit together at basketball games and were really bad until Steve Moore himself put and end to it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on March 08, 2012, 08:51:50 PM
What is this that I am hearing about Zimmer being hurt? From a basketball standpoint, post players can be defended from the perimeter buy pressure the guards and contesting passing lanes. That is text book Wooster Scot defense. Where we really struggle is with those athletic guards that can create their own shots and opportunities for others. Has IWU faced Scot level defense?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 08, 2012, 09:19:21 PM
IWU's schedule is ranked #2 in the Massey Ratings. Wheaton is ranked #5 in Massey's defensive rankings. Just an FYI.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 08, 2012, 09:33:11 PM
Jordan Zimmer broke his foot last year, and re-injured it last week.  On Friday he 'tweaked' it again, and after starting on fire (10 points in about 10 minutes), barely played after that.  Foolishly, believing my lyin' eyes and the word of his grandfather (sitting in front of me on Friday), I took him out of my starting lineup in the tourney fantasy contest (replacing him with Clayton Black of Witt) - he proceeded to score 28 (39 fantasy points to 13 for Black :P) and totally took over the second OT against Hope!  John Koschnitzky is also hurt, with back disc problems that will probably require surgery after the season (according to his dad).  Both are tough as nails and are seniors facing the end of their careers - you can bet that both will play and play as though they are 100% healthy! 8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 08, 2012, 11:31:00 PM
Quote from: WoosterFAN on March 08, 2012, 08:51:50 PM
What is this that I am hearing about Zimmer being hurt? From a basketball standpoint, post players can be defended from the perimeter buy pressure the guards and contesting passing lanes. That is text book Wooster Scot defense. Where we really struggle is with those athletic guards that can create their own shots and opportunities for others. Has IWU faced Scot level defense?

Zimmer doesn't create his own shot. Nor is he mostly a spot-up shooter, which is what he was during the earlier part of his career. Most of his perimeter shots this season have come off of screens. What that means is that IWU very consciously sets up its offense to constantly screen on the perimeter in order to spring Zimmer free -- and it also means that Zimmer himself is in constant furious motion around the perimeter, moving from screen to screen in an attempt to get the fraction of a second's opening that he needs to get off his shot.

That's really what made his performance against Hope so remarkable last weekend. His job on the offensive end requires perpetual movement on his part, as compared to his teammates, and it's tough enough to do that on an ailing foot -- but he was at his best in the second overtime, over 30 minutes of personal game time deep into his effort.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndOne on March 08, 2012, 11:48:06 PM
And to add to what GS said above, it should be noted that a large percentage of Jordan Zimmer's running through screens takes place along the baseline. Accordingly, the largest percentage of his 3 balls are launched from the corners, especially the left corner. Another spot the Wesleyan offensive flow and screen sets channels him to quite often is a spot a couple of feet to the left of a line straight out from the basket where he comes off the screen. receives the ball, and turns and fires a three, all in the same motion, often without even one dribble.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 09, 2012, 12:21:20 AM
Quote from: AndOne on March 08, 2012, 11:48:06 PM
And to add to what GS said above, it should be noted that a large percentage of Jordan Zimmer's running through screens takes place along the baseline. Accordingly, the largest percentage of his 3 balls are launched from the corners, especially the left corner. Another spot the Wesleyan offensive flow and screen sets channels him to quite often is a spot a couple of feet to the left of a line straight out from the basket where he comes off the screen. receives the ball, and turns and fires a three, all in the same motion, often without even one dribble.

Yeah, that may be the scouting report Hope had - IIRC, at least 4 of his 7 threes against them were from the right of the key! ;D

Bottom line - if he is 'on', if he gets open for even a split-second anywhere, your only defense is prayer! :P  He now tops the all-time 3-point list at IWU, and we've had some good ones.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 09, 2012, 12:31:50 AM
Recently graduated Wooster guard Nathan Balch got a lot of his shots, from the corners, by running the baseline.  It took him a season or two, but by his senior year, he was very comfortable playing without the ball.  Wittenberg's little Sullivan was in constant motion on the perimeter, always working to find an opening to get his shot off.  By his senior year, Wooster generally did a decent job on him, but it took a combination of Warnes and Balch to do it.  Sullivan, though, was much shorter than Zimmer, who I suspect will be able to shoot over the Wooster guards and possibly even Warnes.  Wooster does switch on almost every screen, which will help, but will also provide mismatches underneath for IWU.  Still, as always, I'm more concerned with Wooster's offense than their defense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 09, 2012, 12:49:31 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 09, 2012, 12:21:20 AMBottom line - if he is 'on', if he gets open for even a split-second anywhere, your only defense is prayer!

But it needs to be said again that, as Chuck alluded with his "on" comment, there is an element of streakiness to Zimmer. He is not a formidably high-percentage shooter like, say, his IWU predecessor Keelan Amelianovich. Zimmer's more of a 40-45% guy in this type of running-off-of-screens style, whereas Amelianovich was a 45-50% guy. What makes Zimmer more dangerous, though, is his lack of a conscience in terms of depth. He sees nothing wrong with firing up 25-footers, whereas lots of other high-volume perimeter shooters are uncomfortable firing 'em up at that range. That's really what makes Zimmer an ideal screen shooter, because shooting behind screens often means that you have to get off your shot a step or two further back than you'd get it either by spotting up or by creating your own shot. And, in fact, I've seen Zimmer even spot up from that deep; the first big triple that he hit in the second overtime at Hope looked like it was launched from about three or four feet behind the arc, and it did not come off of a screen. Hope simply didn't get out to guard him that far away from the basket.

As WB indicated, Zimmer's height also helps him as a screen shooter, because the screener's defensive man can't simply stop, jump, and block Zimmer's shot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: old scot on March 09, 2012, 05:59:04 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 08, 2012, 07:21:57 PM
Hey, hey, you can't do that on here.  You're only allowed to criticize other posters.  ;)

Seriously, I've seen the OWU student section, in Delaware, be pretty obnoxious at Wooster games.  Their own security has had to settle them down.  At Kenyon, a couple of years ago, I watched as some of their students ripped into our cheerleaders, no less.  When they wouldn't stop, I had a talk with a staffer who spoke to them.  Allegheny's students, at baseball games in Meadville, used to bring a keg to the field and were downright rotten.  Unfortunately, here in Wooster, the kids are probably not much better, when they're there, which is unlikely this weekend due to the beginning of spring break.  The Wooster baseball players used to sit together at basketball games and were really bad until Steve Moore himself put and end to it.
Woo Boo, Don't come down on only the baseball players. This was probably the doings of the Kappa Chi Fraternity. Although 40% of the frat was made up of baseball and hoopers others joined in on the agressive cheering. The bball and hoopers were a close knitt group.

It is sad in this age that fans have to be politically correct and not be hard on the visiting team. I guess the home field advantage no longer should exist. We should all have cupcakes and koolaid together after the game.
Most of todays atheletes grew up playing ball when score was not kept and everyone wins in the end. Well, life is not like that. The aggressive people succeed and the rest fall by the way side.
I have no problem with unruly fans. This is college level athletics. Players are trained to handle this environment. I think a team that can handle this reflects the discipline of the coaching that goes along with being a winning program.

Otherwise, GO SCOTS, make it to the finial four.

[formatting fixed]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: magicman on March 09, 2012, 06:14:58 PM
North Central leads Wittenberg 32-30 at the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DanTHEman67 on March 09, 2012, 06:41:55 PM
Tigers down by 8 and call a timeout.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DanTHEman67 on March 09, 2012, 06:43:32 PM
Less than 12 mins. left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DanTHEman67 on March 09, 2012, 06:49:43 PM
A glimmer of hope in that NCC has some foul trouble so Witt is taking it inside and manages to cuts it to four.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DanTHEman67 on March 09, 2012, 06:52:40 PM
Wittenberg takes the lead with just over 6 minutes remaining.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DanTHEman67 on March 09, 2012, 07:04:31 PM
Timeout for NCC with just over a minute left and Witt up 4.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DanTHEman67 on March 09, 2012, 07:11:23 PM
Wittenberg up by 3 with just seconds left and Cardinal ball. Time to...
Tiger up!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DanTHEman67 on March 09, 2012, 07:14:34 PM
WITTENBERG wins 58-55!
Very exciting game, including the ending.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on March 09, 2012, 07:46:03 PM
Great job, Witt!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 09, 2012, 07:48:01 PM
Congratulations to Wittenberg! Nice run!

Now I just hope the Scots get to meet you tomorrow! About to tip in Timken, Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 09, 2012, 08:07:55 PM
Good on you, Witt! Way to represent the NCAC against the semi-evil CCIW.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 09, 2012, 08:12:03 PM
"Semi-evil"?

Does that mean that we're only evil during sectional and national semifinals?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 09, 2012, 08:21:55 PM
You're not the OAC!!

Actually, I'd consider the CCIW more chaotic neutral than anything else.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 09, 2012, 09:36:45 PM
That's a rough way to lose. Claytor air-balls the first of two free throws with two ticks left and Wooster down two. Kudos for the Scots from clawing all the way back, but they used a lot of energy getting back to square.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 09, 2012, 09:39:53 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 09, 2012, 09:36:45 PM
That's a rough way to lose. Claytor air-balls the first of two free throws with two ticks left and Wooster down two. Kudos for the Scots from clawing all the way back, but they used a lot of energy getting back to square.

Agreed. Tough way to lose, but IWU gets credit for just executing better throughout and playing some excellent defense to force a lot of Scots turnovers.

Wooster found the gear in the second half that they were missing in the first half, but ended up just a bit short, having dug themselves a hole that was just a bit too deep.

Good luck to Witt tomorrow as they continue to represent the NCAC in the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DanTHEman67 on March 09, 2012, 09:47:11 PM
How odd for Witt to play in Timken twice and not play Wooster? I do think the loss may work to the Tiger's advantage by allowing them to escape having to play against the Scots with a home court advantage. Perhaps Wittenberg will even have a quasi-home court advantage themselves having had a lot of tournament level games in this very gym? Certainly more than their opponent. Anyway, great season Scots and let us hope the Tigers will continue to represent the NCAC well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 09, 2012, 09:52:19 PM
Probably as odd as Wooster playing Denison at Witt in the conference tourney !
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 09, 2012, 10:00:11 PM
Hot damn - both the men's and women's Titan teams are in the Elite Eight! ;D

Wooster fans, although we have survived both Hope @ Hope and Woo @ Woo, I'll appreciate it if you come out tomorrow night and boo Witt! ;)

What a trifecta we are two-thirds of the way to achieving: beating the #1 ranked team on their home court, beating the #2 all-time winningest program on their home court, then beating the #1 all-time winningest program in consecutive games!  I am SO up for tomorrow!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 10, 2012, 12:07:18 AM
Well, I guess I should have just stayed home tonight as my first game of the season didn't end well for the Scots...  :-\

Hats off to the Titans for hanging on for the win tonight.  The difference in the game, to me, was the around the last 8 minutes of the first half.  Wooster had fallen behind by 10 and clawed their way back to tie the score at 23 apiece and then had two possessions to take their first lead of the game.  And from there, things went all wrong for the Scots and the Titans ended the half on a 19-4 run for the 15 point half-time deficit. 

I'm damn proud of this team for nearly pulling off yet another improbable comeback in the NCAA tournament.  It looked like, to me anyways, that the IWU players almost had the look of victory in the first 4 minutes of the 2nd half before Wooster started to chip away at the lead.  One thing you can never do is count out the Fighting Scots!  I do I feel for Claytor for missing the front end of what could have been the game tying ft's, but he can't blame himself on the loss.  He played one hell of a game and Wooster wouldn't have been in the position they were without his play throughout the entire game!

Defensively, Wooster did a GREAT job on keeping Zimmer in check.  The problem for Wooster was, IWU got some monster efforts from a few players I don't think they would have expected it from.  Like Stephen Rudnicki dropping in 13 which is over twice his season average off the bench on blistering 6-8 shooting.  Also coming up big off the bench was Andrew Ziemnik who also dropped in 11 (3 over his season average).  And lastly, Victor Davis with a game high 18 (8 over his season avergae).

Hats off to Wooster on yet another successful season.  It sucks that it had to come to an end in the fashion that it did, but as Mike Breckenridge mentioned on the post game comments, I don't think anyone would have predicted this team would finish with 26 wins and come oh so close on making a return trip to the Elite 8.  The loss of Hallowell, Warnes and Fegan will certainly be felt, but with such a young nucleus returning, I can only be excited about what is to come next year.

I do have one award to hand out and that is Flop of the Game:  And the Academy Award goes to... Nick Anderson.  I think he missed his calling as a futballer...  :P

Lastly, I did want to add what a class act the entire IWU team is.  During the post-game handshakes, I saw several IWU players try and console Claytor in what I thought was a very classy move.  Especially, Victor Davis, who battled with Claytor all game long.  Nice to see...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nuscottsfan on March 10, 2012, 01:08:24 AM
http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/5165831 ........... 'nuff said.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2012, 08:35:38 AM
Exciting game at Timken last night but Wooster came up just short vs. a tough Illinois Wesleyan squad.

Link to the game story in the Wooster Daily Record: http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/5166348

Congratulations to Wooster seniors Justin Hallowell, Matt Fegan and Justin Warnes on 4 great years!  :)

It was nice to see Matt Fegan set the new career mark for most games played by a Divison 3 player.  :)

Excellent season for Wooster (26-5) reaching the Sweet 16 after graduating Franks, Balch and Wickliffe.

Good luck to the Wittenberg Tigers tonight!  Hopefully, they can punch their ticket to Salem.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 10, 2012, 10:07:28 AM
I was also proud of the Scots effort (especially the toughness to come back from a big deficit) against a taller, more physical team.  What a season in a "rebuilding year"! 

IWU was very impressive (and classy after the game, as well).  How in the world were they a bubble team?

Good luck to Witt tonight, representing the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCF on March 10, 2012, 10:29:47 AM
Quote from: smedindy on March 09, 2012, 08:21:55 PM
You're not the OAC!!

Actually, I'd consider the CCIW more chaotic neutral than anything else.
I think I'd rather be considered semi-evil than chaotic neutral.During football season, however, we are all out evil! LOL:):)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCF on March 10, 2012, 10:31:58 AM
Congrats to Witt on a nice win. It was a great game to watch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCF on March 10, 2012, 10:34:36 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 10, 2012, 10:07:28 AM
I was also proud of the Scots effort (especially the toughness to come back from a big deficit) against a taller, more physical team.  What a season in a "rebuilding year"! 

IWU was very impressive (and classy after the game, as well).  How in the world were they a bubble team?

Good luck to Witt tonight, representing the NCAC.
I wondered the same thing after watching that game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 10, 2012, 01:09:05 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 10, 2012, 10:07:28 AM
I was also proud of the Scots effort (especially the toughness to come back from a big deficit) against a taller, more physical team.  What a season in a "rebuilding year"! 

IWU was very impressive (and classy after the game, as well).  How in the world were they a bubble team?

Good luck to Witt tonight, representing the NCAC.

That is a good question.  If you look at their losses, while they had 7 L's on the season, 2 were to NCC (lost in the Sweet 16), 2 were to Wheaton (lost in the Sweet 16), one was to Augie (pre-season top 5) and one was to UW-Whitewater (advanced to the Elite 8 by beating Wheaton).  Hardly any losses to make you question how good of a team they are.  Couple that with the fact that they seem to be peaking at just the right time of the season and they are going to be a tough out. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 10, 2012, 02:12:36 PM
I think a lot of the bubble talk about IWU was speculation around IWU being ranked behind Lake Forest in the last poll.  Obviously that didn't happen.  Had they been behind Lake Forest in the last poll then they would certainly have been a bubble team whether deserving or not.

And I think any Titan fan will tell you they've played their best basketball in the last two weeks.  They've kept their turnovers to a minimum, or at least below their season avg in the tournament.  That alone can be enough to make a team 10 points better through the course a game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 10, 2012, 03:15:35 PM
As I'd suspected after seeing the last fifteen minutes of their win at Hope, IWU proved to be a very good team.  Watching them warm up, and then play in the first half, they reminded me of last season's version of Whitworth.  Size and athleticism.  A team with those skills, when their shots are dropping as they did in the first twenty minutes, is not going to lose to anyone in DIII.

Still, after intermission, Wooster got after them.  In the first half, it was the Scots' second unit that stemmed the IWU tide.  In the second half, Coach Moore and his staff came up with a mix-and-match six-person rotation that, with the help of the media timeouts, could compete.

Claytor and Hallowell remained in the game from the starting group and never came out.  Goodwin at the point had the quickness to force Gonzalez to back off a step, allowing him to run the offense.  Doug Thorpe, who has really become a player this season, gave Wooster another offensive weapon and showed his heart on defense.  Brown and Warnes were moved in and out, when possible, offensively and defensively.

It worked.  The first half hole was deep, and it took nearly the whole second stanza to fill in, but they did it.  With a couple of minutes to go, it was anyone's game, and not one that those in attendance will soon forget.

IWU had a lot of good performances, but in my mind, Gonzalez was the key.  His in-your-face defense in the first half disrupted the Wooster offense.  When IWU had the ball, he was poised and in control.  He won several battles for loose balls with his hustle.  He and Thorpe going at it on the floor was something to see.  And then he buried the pump-fake dagger to win the ballgame.

This Wooster club went further than I had ever expected.  Losing Franks, Wickliffe, and Balch appeared to me to be more than they'd be able to overcome.  But, after a mid-season repositioning, the team began to gel.  Their team play became better than the parts, just as it did last year.  I should have known that it would.

Looking forward to next year, once again three players will be lost.  This year's senior leadership will be missed.  But I see the program in good hands, as many of the younger players were able to play substantial minutes and will go into 2012-13 as experienced veterans.  Look out next year, NCAC, Wooster will be ready.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 11, 2012, 10:05:37 AM
Well, that was a great NCAC season. Parity from top to bottom, almost. Three teams in the dance, a fourth on the bubble and a fifth just a few seconds from a surprise ticket. New blood from DePauw, while the old blood in Springfield gets active again. Wooster far exceeding expectations. Denison giving us all a thrill ride. Just too bad that we won't be represented in Salem. Heck, everywhere west of Pennsylvania it was a thrilling year. Congratulations to all!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 11, 2012, 10:56:20 AM
It was a great year for the NCAC!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 11, 2012, 12:37:19 PM
Tough night for Witt last night as IWU continued it's hot streak in a convincing win over the Tigers.  Here are a couple of links to articles in the Springfield fish wrap:

Tigers' dream fades in Final 8 (http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/springfield-oh-sports/wittenberg-university-tigers/tigers-dream-fades-in-final-8-1341899.html)

Illinois Wesleyan's size gave Witt fits (http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/springfield-oh-sports/wittenberg-university-tigers/illinois-wesleyans-size-gave-witt-fits-1341867.html)


As I said with Wooster, Witt has nothing to hang their heads about in what will overall be viewed as a very successful season for Witt and their 7 seniors.  As was said in one of those articles, those 7 seniors went from being 13-13 as freshmen to getting to within a game of going to Salem for the first time since 2006.  Damn fine job by those 7 Witt seniors in leading their team to a great season.

And I echo David's comments on what a great season this was.  I LOVE the parity in the league.  It's because of that parity that allowed the NCAC to place 3 teams into the NCAA Tournament and nearly pulled off getting 4 or even 5 teams in?!   :o  The addition of DePauw definitely strengthened this league especially considering who they replaced in the EC. 

Is it too early to start looking ahead to next year yet?  :P  I'm just going out on a limb and will predict Wooster will be the pre-season favorite heading into next season...  8-)

Now it's time to turn my attention to the diamond where hopefully this spring will be more kind to the Scots than it was last spring in both playing and weather.  Looks like it should be a pretty competitive conference season as Wabash and Wooster were nearly in a dead heat at the top of the conference pre-season coaches' poll and OWU not far behind in 3rd.  Wooster will hope to rebound from a disappointing season that saw a streak of seventeen straight 30 win seasons come to an end...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on March 11, 2012, 07:49:56 PM
Great season for Witt and congratulations on Wooster as well. I wasn't able to make it to Wooster but am proud to be an alum and see the accomplishments this team put together. Although we lose a lot (7 seniors) Witt will return some key components from this year ready to take on larger roles and will have some impact freshman to fill in as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCF on March 12, 2012, 10:02:42 AM
Those were some great games between the NCAC and CCIW. Any chance for non-conference match ups in the future?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 12, 2012, 11:03:56 AM
I'm sure this isn't the right place to ask this, but what the heck.  Can anyone tell me who gets the gate receipts for DIII games?  Does the home team get it all?  Does the visitor get a percentage?  Does the visiting team get travel expenses?  Is nothing set in stone and it's worked out between the two schools beforehand on a case by case basis?  Are the answers to these questions the same for regular season games and during the NCAA tournament?  Anybody know?  Just curious.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 12, 2012, 02:22:38 PM
Nice final article on the 2011-12 Hoops season in the Wooster DR:

COW tradition never graduates (http://www.the-daily-record.com/news/article/5166483)

Loved hearing Fegan and Warnes giving props not only to the 3 departed seniors from a year ago, but gave the real props to the players that have passed down those leadership skills over the years from one class to the next.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 12, 2012, 03:22:14 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 12, 2012, 11:03:56 AM
I'm sure this isn't the right place to ask this, but what the heck.  Can anyone tell me who gets the gate receipts for DIII games?  Does the home team get it all?  Does the visitor get a percentage?  Does the visiting team get travel expenses?  Is nothing set in stone and it's worked out between the two schools beforehand on a case by case basis?  Are the answers to these questions the same for regular season games and during the NCAA tournament?  Anybody know?  Just curious.

I'm sure these answers are in the tournament manual.  I have no idea where to find that anymore.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2012, 04:38:30 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 12, 2012, 11:03:56 AM
I'm sure this isn't the right place to ask this, but what the heck.  Can anyone tell me who gets the gate receipts for DIII games?  Does the home team get it all?  Does the visitor get a percentage?  Does the visiting team get travel expenses?  Is nothing set in stone and it's worked out between the two schools beforehand on a case by case basis?  Are the answers to these questions the same for regular season games and during the NCAA tournament?  Anybody know?  Just curious.

Regular season:
Home team keeps the receipts, unless a special arrangement has been made in the contract to make a guarantee to the visitor. This is common in in-season tournaments. Mostly regular-season contracts are home and home with no special financial arrangements.

In general, there is no NCAA rule governing anything like this. It's not their purview. Similar to the way the NCAA doesn't dictate how media timeouts or officiating or anything else is done in the regular season.

NCAA Tournament:
NCAA gets all the money, reimburses visiting school for traveling expenses for the official traveling party (permitted maximum number of players, coaches and administrator). Host school reimbursed for some expenses, though I am not sure which ones/how much/etc.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 12, 2012, 04:54:20 PM
That's just the admission fees, right - not concessions (or condiments!) or anything extra like parking.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2012, 04:55:27 PM
I don't know about parking but I believe concessions goes to Indy also, minus expenses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: iwumichigander on March 12, 2012, 06:15:20 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on March 12, 2012, 04:55:27 PM
I don't know about parking but I believe concessions goes to Indy also, minus expenses.
I believe you are correct Pat on concessions also. I can't respond regarding Hope on paid parking. IWU (women's site last two seasons) has no area where paid parking an issue becuase none exists.  I think NCAA did work with IWU on designated areas for parking for NCAA personnel, officials, media, teams and team buses. 
For Final Four, the host site basically agrees with the NCAA that it has the right to take over the management and control of the entire facility (I believe it was one week prior) including agreed upon parking areas around the facility other than non-tournament designated areas (which are very few).  NCAA also gets all revenue and controls all 'trash and trinket sales' - no exception.  The NCAA has complete control from Wednesday of Final Four to the day after the Championship game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 13, 2012, 08:22:31 AM
Pat, thanks.  So, for events such as Christmas tournaments, in which some of the visiting teams are coming from a distance, it's possible, or likely, that the host would put forth some travel expense money out of the gate?  That makes sense to me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 13, 2012, 10:07:58 AM
If you peruse the Open Dates boards, you can get a sense for what gets offered by schools to attract tournament participants. For example, the latest post in the men's tournaments sections happens to be from Allegheny:
Quote from: AlleghenyGators on March 12, 2012, 05:40:09 PM
Allegheny College (Meadville PA) is looking for ONE team to play in our Tip Off Tournament Friday Nov 16 and Saturday Nov 17 of 2012. $750 guarantee plus a meal and tshirts for participants. Reduced rates and free breakfast available at the Hampton Inn. Please contact:
Jim Driggs
Head Men's Basketball
jdriggs@allegheny.edu
814-332-281
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 13, 2012, 10:15:47 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 13, 2012, 10:07:58 AM
If you peruse the Open Dates boards, you can get a sense for what gets offered by schools to attract tournament participants. For example, the latest post in the men's tournaments sections happens to be from Allegheny:
Quote from: AlleghenyGators on March 12, 2012, 05:40:09 PM
Allegheny College (Meadville PA) is looking for ONE team to play in our Tip Off Tournament Friday Nov 16 and Saturday Nov 17 of 2012. $750 guarantee plus a meal and tshirts for participants. Reduced rates and free breakfast available at the Hampton Inn. Please contact:
Jim Driggs
Head Men's Basketball
jdriggs@allegheny.edu
814-332-281

Wow.  Ok.  You and me, that's two.  Smedindy, you in?  Scotsfan?  Then we just need one other guy.  That's $150 cash each and if we all stay in one room, it'll be almost all profit.  Who's got a van?  We can beat them suckers, too, if they don't guard me in the corner...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on March 15, 2012, 12:23:52 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 13, 2012, 10:15:47 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 13, 2012, 10:07:58 AM
If you peruse the Open Dates boards, you can get a sense for what gets offered by schools to attract tournament participants. For example, the latest post in the men's tournaments sections happens to be from Allegheny:
Quote from: AlleghenyGators on March 12, 2012, 05:40:09 PM
Allegheny College (Meadville PA) is looking for ONE team to play in our Tip Off Tournament Friday Nov 16 and Saturday Nov 17 of 2012. $750 guarantee plus a meal and tshirts for participants. Reduced rates and free breakfast available at the Hampton Inn. Please contact:
Jim Driggs
Head Men's Basketball
jdriggs@allegheny.edu
814-332-281

Wow.  Ok.  You and me, that's two.  Smedindy, you in?  Scotsfan?  Then we just need one other guy.  That's $150 cash each and if we all stay in one room, it'll be almost all profit.  Who's got a van?  We can beat them suckers, too, if they don't guard me in the corner...

If they will play half court count me in.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 17, 2012, 03:34:49 PM
Congrats to Justin Hallowell of Wooster for making 3rd team D3hoops.com Men's All-American, and to Tim Brady of OWU for making the 4th team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 17, 2012, 05:30:18 PM
Also interesting to see Greg Ross from Centre on the All-American team. He was at Wooster for his freshman year, and the start of his sophomore year before transferring because of lack of playing time. Mostly it was due to the arrival of Claytor and Mays.

As for Cabrini-Whitewater, the last time these two teams lost in the NCAA tournament was against Wooster (Whitewater in 2010 and Cabrini in 2011). Whitewater is being led by probably the best player in Div. III, Chris Davis (http://host.madison.com/sports/college/state-and-regional/whitewater/ncaa-div-iii-men-s-basketball-chris-davis-went-from/article_c8fa7e68-6efe-11e1-a400-001871e3ce6c.html). I'm guessing that he wouldn't have been accepted at any of the NCAC schools -- with the exception of Oberlin, which is going all in hoops from what it looks like.

As a Wooster fan, seeing one of these two teams win the national title is a little irking, since we are still searching for our first.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 17, 2012, 07:09:47 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 17, 2012, 05:30:18 PMAs a Wooster fan, seeing one of these two teams win the national title is a little irking, since we are still searching for our first.

Well, so is Cabrini. In fact, this is the first-ever appearance in the Final Four for the Cavaliers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 17, 2012, 09:25:57 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 17, 2012, 07:09:47 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 17, 2012, 05:30:18 PMAs a Wooster fan, seeing one of these two teams win the national title is a little irking, since we are still searching for our first.

Well, so is Cabrini. In fact, this is the first-ever appearance in the Final Four for the Cavaliers.

I realize that, but Cabrini isn't the second-winningest team in Div. III history, nor the team with the best winning percentage in all of the NCAA since 2000, which I guess was underlying my point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 18, 2012, 01:25:07 PM
Davis is a great story about the redemptive power of college athletics and especially D-3 sports.

Plus, all it takes is for one admissions officer to want to take a chance on someone like him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 18, 2012, 05:04:09 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 17, 2012, 09:25:57 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 17, 2012, 07:09:47 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 17, 2012, 05:30:18 PMAs a Wooster fan, seeing one of these two teams win the national title is a little irking, since we are still searching for our first.

Well, so is Cabrini. In fact, this is the first-ever appearance in the Final Four for the Cavaliers.

I realize that, but Cabrini isn't the second-winningest team in Div. III history, nor the team with the best winning percentage in all of the NCAA since 2000, which I guess was underlying my point.

[puts on Professor Pedantic hat]

I've noticed that a number of Wooster, Wittenberg, and Illinois Wesleyan fans have made statements of this nature over the past few weeks, bringing up the voluminous numbers of wins that the three schools have tallied over the past century-plus. As admirable as that is, it's somewhat erroneous and misleading to characterize this as "D3 history," since the vast majority of the wins accumulated by those three schools were prior to their entrance into D3. Wittenberg and Wooster have only been D3 members since the inception of the division in 1974-75, and Illinois Wesleyan didn't become a functioning D3 member until nine years after that. Essentially, these statements should be worded as "winningest program among schools that are currently members of D3," or something to that effect. Of course, some school out there has won more D3 games than anybody else; we just don't seem to know who it is (and it would require looking at the year-by-year results of numerous schools since 1974-75 in order to figure it out).

[takes off Professor Pedantic hat]

As to your point, though, in this case -- as in most problems in life -- you can always be grateful that you're not as bad off as somebody else. Wooster's Sisyphean woes are nothing compared to those of Franklin & Marshall. The Diplomats are tied for third place in D3 tournament appearances (23) and Final Four appearances (5), and are in sole possession of third place in wins (43). Those numbers easily outdistance the comparative numbers of Wooster (21 appearances, 3 Final Fours, 27 wins). Yet F&M has never won a national championship. In their five Final Fours, the Diplomats have finished second once, third once, and fourth three times. Hope's also a little worse off than Wooster in the close-but-no-cigar department. Hope's been to more tourneys than the Fighting Scots (23, tied with F&M and Salem State for third place), an equal number of Final Fours (3), and has more wins (28). And the Dutch are still waiting on their first chance to cut down the nets.

(I'm sure that sac's just gonna love the fact that I brought this up.)

Quote from: smedindy on March 18, 2012, 01:25:07 PM
Davis is a great story about the redemptive power of college athletics and especially D-3 sports.

Plus, all it takes is for one admissions officer to want to take a chance on someone like him.

Both excellent points, smeds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 18, 2012, 05:57:22 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 18, 2012, 05:04:09 PM

As to your point, though, in this case -- as in most problems in life -- you can always be grateful that you're not as bad off as somebody else. Wooster's Sisyphean woes are nothing compared to those of Franklin & Marshall. The Diplomats are tied for third place in D3 tournament appearances (23) and Final Four appearances (5), and are in sole possession of third place in wins (43). Those numbers easily outdistance the comparative numbers of Wooster (21 appearances, 3 Final Fours, 27 wins). Yet F&M has never won a national championship. In their five Final Fours, the Diplomats have finished second once, third once, and fourth three times. Hope's also a little worse off than Wooster in the close-but-no-cigar department. Hope's been to more tourneys than the Fighting Scots (23, tied with F&M and Salem State for third place), an equal number of Final Fours (3), and has more wins (28). And the Dutch are still waiting on their first chance to cut down the nets.

(I'm sure that sac's just gonna love the fact that I brought this up.)


Thanks for the lesson professor...

And to your point, I'm sure that many Hope and F&M fans would share in seinfeld's opinion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 18, 2012, 06:11:09 PM
No doubt, ScotsFan. I can see why it'd be a little galling every time that you see a newbie in the Final Four. But keep in mind that, out of the 420-odd schools that participate in D3 men's basketball, only 70 have ever been to the Final Four. Therefore, the newbies are gonna keep on comin'.

In only one year out of the last twenty (2008) has the Final Four consisted entirely of programs that have been there before.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 18, 2012, 08:56:09 PM
Championships aren't 'lifetime achievement awards'!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 24, 2012, 03:37:41 PM
I started following this  mostly for D1 recruiting since both Michigan and Michigan State seem to be hitting Indiana hard lately.   http://indianarecruitingguide.com/     Brandon Ramsey, the guy who runs the thing says he's a sophomore at Hanover College.

Found this yesterday.......on his twitter account of all places.

Depauw got a great pickup by landing Muncie Central PG Adam Botts. Very good player, should make an instant impact.

and from Adam

Breaking my Twitter silence to say that I'll be playing basketball at Depauw University next year! Go TIGERS!!!



Adam Botts:  5'11" Point Guard, Muncie Central H.S.  (he lists himself as 6-1)

Offers:  Northwood (DII), St. Francis (NAIA)

Interest:  Southern Indiana (DII), Indianapolis (DII), Depauw (DIII), Wabash (DIII), Marian (NAIA)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on April 17, 2012, 10:59:19 PM
Daniel Purvlicis, a 6'7'' PF from Noblesville H.S. has committed to Wabash College (DIII). Nice get for the Little Giants  --Scouting Indiana
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on April 18, 2012, 11:56:05 AM
Size always helps!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on April 18, 2012, 04:01:18 PM
Quote from: smedindy on April 18, 2012, 11:56:05 AM
Size always helps!

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Flatimesblogs.latimes.com%2F.a%2F6a00d8341c630a53ef014e881cbe66970d-320wi&hash=58fedf1f7f8829169d92c28d38a089d61cb78a2c)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on April 18, 2012, 04:01:52 PM
6'1 G Quin Fields (2012) of Western H.S. has committed to DePauw University.  --scouting indiana
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on April 26, 2012, 05:31:49 PM
Marcus Mershon 6'8" C Plainfield (2012) has committed to play at Wittenberg University (OH)--scouting indiana



(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fd6673sr63mbv7.cloudfront.net%2Farchive%2Fx1690519224%2Fg25800000000000000015ac5d56fec35f56c2122b67330a30289f1b2e00.jpg&hash=f85cf8499d77bc8aebe181fe7ad0ad6a36ef8b06)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on April 27, 2012, 08:42:57 PM
6'1 G Riley Rapp (2012) of (2A) State Champion Guerin Catholic has committed to Wabash College.  - Scouting Indiana


I believe Jordan Rapp at WashU is related in some way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on May 03, 2012, 02:23:26 PM
Of course, I await deposits and actually showing up on campus and on pre-season rosters before I get all giddy!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: OhioRed17 on May 23, 2012, 02:30:37 PM
How is the NCAC shaping up for next season? What does recruiting look like throughout the league?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on May 29, 2012, 03:21:02 PM
Hiram's schedule is out, not much different from last season other than the Terriers are going to Vegas.

http://www.hiramterriers.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on May 29, 2012, 03:50:26 PM
Partial schedule for Wabash, some open dates yet.  Calvin is one of the other teams at the Elmhurst tournament.

http://sports.wabash.edu/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&schedule=26
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Flying Dutch Fan on May 30, 2012, 12:01:45 PM
Quote from: OhioRed17 on May 23, 2012, 02:30:37 PM
How is the NCAC shaping up for next season?

You can get sac's opinion on this from his blog:

http://scottsbbblog.blogspot.com/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on May 31, 2012, 12:07:38 PM
Hope you don't mind a break in the action, as it were, but I want to share a story the D3 community should know about. You actually may have seen the story on the front page of D3hoops.com, but just in case:

A Goucher basketball player has been paralyzed in a freak accident. He was wrestling around with a friend one morning in his dorm building when he landed on his neck. The entire story is here (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2012/05/goucher-player-paralyzed).

He was released from the hospital to the Kennedy Krieger Institute for rehab shortly after that article was posted last week. However, over the weekend he was sent back to the hospital when he apparently had trouble breathing. Now he awaits a return to the rehab facility, probably any day if he hasn't been released already.

Please keep Damone Brooks, his family, the Goucher basketball team(s), and Goucher community in your thoughts, hearts, and prayers. The family certainly needs help with medical bills as well, so if you feel inclined, please consider them as well.

To follow his progress online, click here (http://www.caringbridge.org/visit/damonebrooks).
And to consider a donation, click here (http://www.helphopelive.org/find-a-patient/profile/index.cfm/patient/FE0B84F4-C845-2122-B07EA3093EFAF336).

Thank you for taking the time to read this. Please feel free to contact me with any questions.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on June 18, 2012, 12:36:21 PM
From Geneva's schedule it looks like Wooster's late December tournament (a classic format) will be....

Dec 28.

Geneva vs John Carroll
Marietta vs Wooster

Dec 29.

Geneva vs Marietta
John Carroll vs Wooster

Wooster beat Geneva by 52 last year and things look pretty bleak for Geneva next season.  3 out 4 make this an interesting get together though, but JCU and Marietta both had big graduating Sr. classes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on June 19, 2012, 03:27:26 PM
I'm not a huge fan of four team 'classics' that only have two games. If you call it a classic, shouldn't it be round-robin? Just my nickel, keep the change.

Of course, I prefer 8-team shootouts with winners and losers brackets, but I know selling the sizzle of a 7th place game isn't exactly, well, inspiring.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on June 19, 2012, 04:11:03 PM
The classic has two advantages... you are playing just two games in two days... instead of potentially three in three. You also avoid conference opponents if you are stuck. You can also set-up games if any coaches are looking to play or avoid another team. You can also at least set-up who everyone is playing for scheduling.

The disadvantage to the 8-team shootout is the number of games in a span of a number of days and such. I can tell you that was the challenge with the Pride of Maryland... not easy to have three games in three days (though, they spread it out to play the first games Tuesday or Wednesday and finished with 8 games a day on the weekend). While having winners and losers of a "tournament" is a nice advantage and cool to "say" someone one the tournament... sometimes the logistics and scheduling are more complicated.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on June 27, 2012, 10:41:33 AM
Looks like Wooster will be playing at Transylvania's Don Lane Classic Dec 18/19.

12-18  Mt. St. Joseph vs  Franklin and Marshall
12-18  Transylvania vs Wooster


12-19  Mt. St. Joesph vs Wooster
12-19  Franklin and Marshall vs Transylvania
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on June 27, 2012, 10:46:38 AM
Ohio Wesleyan's schedule

http://www.battlingbishops.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&schedule=48

at the Marietta Tournament, OWU will play Defiance the first night, then winner/loser of Frostburg State/Marietta

no opponents listed for the Bluffton or Rochester Tournaments.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bob jones on July 02, 2012, 04:49:15 PM
Wooster commit from Cincinnati is Zach McCorkle a 6'6" 220# wing from Winton Woods High School.  He averaged about 12 points and 7 rebounds for a team that played an aggressive up tempo style.  Nice athletic addition for the Scots and he continues a line of Cincinnati area players (Josh Claytor, Scott Purcell, Jalen Goodwin and Zach Baker) who have found their way to Wooster in the past few years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on July 02, 2012, 11:09:34 PM
Quote from: sac on June 27, 2012, 10:46:38 AM
Ohio Wesleyan's schedule

http://www.battlingbishops.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&schedule=48

at the Marietta Tournament, OWU will play Defiance the first night, then winner/loser of Frostburg State/Marietta

no opponents listed for the Bluffton or Rochester Tournaments.

Another tough schedule for the Bishops.  ohio wes. assistant Mark Bollinger was named head coach at Piedmont College.  (Piedmontlions.com) Mike DeWitt continues to have assistants move on to be head coaches.  Any other staff changes or recruiting news in the NCAC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 06, 2012, 12:40:48 AM
Quote from: WAlum on July 02, 2012, 11:09:34 PM
Quote from: sac on June 27, 2012, 10:46:38 AM
Ohio Wesleyan's schedule

http://www.battlingbishops.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&schedule=48

at the Marietta Tournament, OWU will play Defiance the first night, then winner/loser of Frostburg State/Marietta

no opponents listed for the Bluffton or Rochester Tournaments.

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2012/06/piedmont-hires-ohio-wesleyan-assistant

Another tough schedule for the Bishops.  ohio wes. assistant Mark Bollinger was named head coach at Piedmont College.  (Piedmontlions.com) Mike DeWitt continues to have assistants move on to be head coaches.  Any other staff changes or recruiting news in the NCAC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on July 11, 2012, 10:10:48 AM
schedule links:

Allegheny:  http://www.alleghenysports.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball
Denison:
DePauw:
Hiram:  http://www.hiramterriers.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule
Kenyon:
*Oberlin:  http://www.goyeo.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball& 
Ohio Wesleyan:  http://www.battlingbishops.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&schedule=48
Wabash:  http://sports.wabash.edu/schedule.aspx?path=mbball
Wittenberg:  http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule12-13.html
Wooster:




*One highlighted game, Oberlin at Yale Jan. 12.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on July 11, 2012, 05:25:28 PM
Thanks sac!  Oberlin at Yale.  I like it!

Wabash has a really good non-conference schedule.

Allegheny looks like it wants some non-league W's!!!  Some very winnable games in there!

Hiram should have some early success as well.

Oberlin could be 2-1 after the first 3 games!  Great scheduling by the Yeo!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 12, 2012, 08:42:44 PM
Oberlin last played at Yale in January 2008 (can it really be that long ago?!), losing 92-41 (http://www.d3hoops.com/teams/Oberlin/men/2007-08/index). Oberlin head coach Isaiah Cavaco is an Eli. (http://www.goyeo.com/coaches.aspx?rc=388&path=mbball)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 12, 2012, 08:48:30 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on July 12, 2012, 08:42:44 PM
Oberlin last played at Yale in January 2008 (can it really be that long ago?!), losing 92-41 (http://www.d3hoops.com/teams/Oberlin/men/2007-08/index). Oberlin head coach Isaiah Cavaco is an Eli. (http://www.goyeo.com/coaches.aspx?rc=388&path=mbball)

Thanks for noticing the team pages! We are in the middle of a long project to surface these pages and make them visible for the first time since moving to the Presto platform.

We have finished most of the men's pages (should be all of them, so please flag me if you find something missing) and are in progress on the women's pages.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on July 13, 2012, 09:41:25 PM
Pat, when I click on the links to Wooster, from the Oberlin page, I get a "page not found" message.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 13, 2012, 10:27:27 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on July 13, 2012, 09:41:25 PM
Pat, when I click on the links to Wooster, from the Oberlin page, I get a "page not found" message.

Thanks. Taken care of.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on July 14, 2012, 09:35:47 PM
Wooster's schedule would have been posted over a month ago, but they've been waiting for a certain Div. I team (which begins with the letter "W" and played in the NIT last year) to announce their Exhibition game with the Scots. Hard to believe that a Div. I program hasn't announced their schedule yet.

Among the non-conference games for Wooster include B-W, Ohio Northern, John Carroll, Marietta, Mt. St. Joseph, Transylvania, and two of these three teams -- Adrian, Carnegie Mellon and Otterbein.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on July 15, 2012, 11:58:52 AM
It's not that hard to believe, actually. Deals are being made this summer for the annual bloodlettings of the low-majors. Those are usually one-year deals and everyone is negotiating now.

I just clicked on my local D-1 program (Florida Atlantic) and there's no mention of 2012-13.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: OhioRed17 on July 19, 2012, 03:11:32 PM
I see there is a new assistant at Denison - Matt Winters. Where is he from?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on July 20, 2012, 12:57:20 PM
Wooster's schedule is now posted...
http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule)

The only non-conference home games are in the Al Van Wie and Mose Hole events.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on July 20, 2012, 05:14:24 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on July 20, 2012, 12:57:20 PM
Wooster's schedule is now posted...
http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule)

The only non-conference home games are in the Al Van Wie and Mose Hole events.

The 4th team in the Mose Hole will be Geneva who will play Marietta and John Carroll......and will pick up two losses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on July 20, 2012, 07:53:57 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on July 20, 2012, 12:57:20 PM
Wooster's schedule is now posted...
http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule)

The only non-conference home games are in the Al Van Wie and Mose Hole events.

I don't see the schedule linked from the Wooster website anywhere. How did you find this?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on July 20, 2012, 10:26:23 PM
Ok, so the Wooster schedule says that they're playing their exhibition game at Wyoming.  My prior detective work had revealed that the "W" team, who had played in the NIT last year, was the University of Washington.  Wyoming did not, at least according to the bracket that I've seen at the NCAA site.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on July 21, 2012, 07:15:36 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on July 20, 2012, 10:26:23 PM
Ok, so the Wooster schedule says that they're playing their exhibition game at Wyoming.  My prior detective work had revealed that the "W" team, who had played in the NIT last year, was the University of Washington.  Wyoming did not, at least according to the bracket that I've seen at the NCAA site.

You're right, I messed that up. I saw they played a couple of games after their conference tournament and assumed it was the NIT. They played in the Collegiate Basketball Invitational, whatever that is.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on July 21, 2012, 12:33:29 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on July 20, 2012, 10:26:23 PM
Ok, so the Wooster schedule says that they're playing their exhibition game at Wyoming.  My prior detective work had revealed that the "W" team, who had played in the NIT last year, was the University of Washington.  Wyoming did not, at least according to the bracket that I've seen at the NCAA site.

Head Coach at Wyoming is Larry Shyatt who is a 1973 graduate of Wooster.  :)
Here is a link to his bio page: http://www.wyomingathletics.com/sports/m-baskbl/mtt/shyatt_larry00.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on July 21, 2012, 06:11:22 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on July 21, 2012, 07:15:36 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on July 20, 2012, 10:26:23 PM
Ok, so the Wooster schedule says that they're playing their exhibition game at Wyoming.  My prior detective work had revealed that the "W" team, who had played in the NIT last year, was the University of Washington.  Wyoming did not, at least according to the bracket that I've seen at the NCAA site.

You're right, I messed that up. I saw they played a couple of games after their conference tournament and assumed it was the NIT. They played in the Collegiate Basketball Invitational, whatever that is.

They have the NIT, the CBI and the CIT now. The CIT is usually a lot of mid-majors. The CBI plays a best-of-three series for the title (one game on each home court).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on July 21, 2012, 10:03:22 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on July 20, 2012, 07:53:57 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on July 20, 2012, 12:57:20 PM
Wooster's schedule is now posted...
http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule)

The only non-conference home games are in the Al Van Wie and Mose Hole events.

I don't see the schedule linked from the Wooster website anywhere. How did you find this?

I used the linked URL for last year's schedule, and just changed the year, on the chance that the schedule might be posted, but just not yet linked.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on July 22, 2012, 08:18:29 PM
Wooster is listed as having a road game against Sheridan College in Ontario, Canada.  They look to be pretty good, compiling a record of 24-10 last season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on July 24, 2012, 07:29:28 AM
Do Canadian Colleges play international rules?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on July 24, 2012, 10:22:35 PM
Canadian rules.  Ice.  Boarding.  Penalty boxes.  ;)

Seriously, that's a good question.  I didn't know, but found this on the Ontario Basketball website, of which Sheridan is a member:

"Ontario Basketball competes under International Basketball Federation (FIBA) rules."

The Wooster players, at least some of them, will at least have a bit of experience with them, given their trip to Ireland last summer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on July 25, 2012, 03:48:30 PM
I am pretty sure they play under international rules... I actually played high school ball against Canadian schools and I know they had the former trapezoid (which was done away with in October of 2010). And according to the CCAA website, they are governed by FIBA rules. Having experienced that in high school, that basically means that since the game is in Canada, it will be FIBA rules... if the game is in the US, it is US rules.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on July 26, 2012, 08:49:08 PM
The 2013 NCAA Tourney format has been released, and it will be interesting, with no pods (except in Salem)...
1st Round - Sat., March 2 (campus sites)
2nd Round - Sat., March 9 (campus sites)
3rd Round - Sat., March 16 (campus sites)
Quarterfinals - Fri., March 22 (Salem)
Semifinals - Sat., March 22 (Salem)
Championship - Sun., April 7 (Atlanta)

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/public/NCAA/Resources/Latest+News/2012/July/New+format+developed+for+2013+DIII+mens+basketball+tourney (http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/public/NCAA/Resources/Latest+News/2012/July/New+format+developed+for+2013+DIII+mens+basketball+tourney)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on July 26, 2012, 10:07:15 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on July 26, 2012, 08:49:08 PM
The 2013 NCAA Tourney format has been released, and it will be interesting, with no pods (except in Salem)...
1st Round - Sat., March 2 (campus sites)
2nd Round - Sat., March 9 (campus sites)
3rd Round - Sat., March 16 (campus sites)
Quarterfinals - Fri., March 22 (Salem)
Semifinals - Sat., March 22 (Salem)
Championship - Sun., April 7 (Atlanta)

I think this whole idea, because of the timing, stinks.  A fifteen-day gap between the semifinals and the finals is ridiculous.  Let DIII be DIII, it was working just fine.  I really hope this is just a one-time thing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on July 27, 2012, 11:27:46 AM
It will be a one time thing... I will be talking to the new men's basketball committee chair, Mike DeWitt of Ohio Wesleyan this weekend for a special Hoopsville On Demand podcast. We will be talking about a number of things like this format (which if you read the article the men's committee came up with a slightly different format), regional rankings, the committee structure, how regional rankings are actually voted on now, and other news and notes. If you have any questions you want possibly asked, leave a note here or email me at dave.mchugh@d3sports.com. You have until Sunday morning.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on July 27, 2012, 09:17:11 PM
Dave -

I actually kind of like the idea of having the quarterfinals in Salem.  I believe DII has such a format, bringing their Elite Eight to one location for the end of the tournament.  Maybe do a Thursday, Friday, Sunday thing, with the Quarterfinal games on Thursday being done in day and night sessions, with separate admissions.  The upside is that lots of fans would make the trip and home court advantage would be taken out of the equation earlier.  Downside, of course, is that four schools don't get to host, as they do know, the Sectionals.  But I think it would be cool to have an Elite Eight in Salem, as long as they got to finish it off with the semis and final.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 28, 2012, 08:58:23 PM
It hadn't occurred to me that, because the D1 tournament is played later than ours, playing our final during their Final Four weekend meant the whole tournament needed to be stretched out to (what I see now is) a ridiculous degree. I now feel qualified to vote on the front-page poll.

Re: Scots in Canada--Wittenberg played several pre-season exhibition games up there last season. Sheridan was not one of their opponents.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCF on July 29, 2012, 02:13:26 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on July 27, 2012, 09:17:11 PM
Dave -

I actually kind of like the idea of having the quarterfinals in Salem.  I believe DII has such a format, bringing their Elite Eight to one location for the end of the tournament.  Maybe do a Thursday, Friday, Sunday thing, with the Quarterfinal games on Thursday being done in day and night sessions, with separate admissions.  The upside is that lots of fans would make the trip and home court advantage would be taken out of the equation earlier.  Downside, of course, is that four schools don't get to host, as they do know, the Sectionals.  But I think it would be cool to have an Elite Eight in Salem, as long as they got to finish it off with the semis and final.
I  agree! I think it's going to  be a great experience for all those who get to Salem.Should be a great trounament!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on July 29, 2012, 03:16:08 PM
David - there are two things stretching out the D3 tournament this year... the first is moving it to Atlanta that would normally push it two more weeks... BUT because the Final Four would have sat on top of Easter weekend this coming year, D1 had already moved the tournament back a week... meaning it is three additional weeks to Division III this year.

I actually talked about the tournament format with Ohio Wesleyan coach Mike DeWitt today... we will post the interview later today on D3hoops.com.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on August 27, 2012, 02:15:07 PM
added Depauw to the schedule links:

Allegheny:  http://www.alleghenysports.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball
Denison:  http://denisonbigred.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule
DePauw:  http://www.depauw.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/schedule/
Hiram:  http://www.hiramterriers.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule
Kenyon:  http://athletics.kenyon.edu/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&
Oberlin:  http://www.goyeo.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball& 
Ohio Wesleyan:  http://www.battlingbishops.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&schedule=48
Wabash:  http://sports.wabash.edu/schedule.aspx?path=mbball
Wittenberg:  http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule12-13.html
Wooster:  http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule


**  Wittenberg's Zimmerman Tournament includes  Hanover, Bethany and Taylor.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: OhioRed17 on August 31, 2012, 01:42:51 PM
Denison ... http://denisonbigred.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule. Mostly usual suspects except they play in Washington DC at the Catholic University tournament on December 29-30 - the teams aren't listed but you know host Catholic U. is one of them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on August 31, 2012, 02:33:03 PM
added Denison to the schedule links:

Allegheny:  http://www.alleghenysports.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball
Denison:  http://denisonbigred.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule
DePauw:  http://www.depauw.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/schedule/
Hiram:  http://www.hiramterriers.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule
Kenyon:  http://athletics.kenyon.edu/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&
Oberlin:  http://www.goyeo.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball& 
Ohio Wesleyan:  http://www.battlingbishops.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&schedule=48
Wabash:  http://sports.wabash.edu/schedule.aspx?path=mbball
Wittenberg:  http://www4.wittenberg.edu/news/athletics/mbasketball/schedule12-13.html
Wooster:  http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule


**  Wittenberg's Zimmerman Tournament includes  Hanover, Bethany and Taylor.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on October 03, 2012, 11:22:40 PM
Any predictions?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 13, 2012, 11:42:37 AM
DIII News has released a preseason Top 25 ranking which has Wooster as #4 nationally and Ohio Wesleyan as #21 nationally.  Wittenberg is listed in the "others to watch" group.  Here is the link to the rankings on another website:

http://www.northcentralcardinals.com/documents/2012/10/12/D3N2012FactSheet.pdf?id=1848
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on October 15, 2012, 09:03:31 PM
Maybe I should post this in another forum, but does anyone know if the Championship game will be broadcast over the air on ESPNU or CBS Sports Network? Know that the game is being played at the same sight as the Div I Final Four and I assume the cameras will already be in place.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on October 15, 2012, 09:16:38 PM
Quote from: woolax on October 15, 2012, 09:03:31 PMKnow that the game is being played at the same sight as the Div I Final Four

Actually, IIRC, the site for the D3 championship game is different than the site for the D1 Final Four. Both are in Atlanta, but they're different venues.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 15, 2012, 09:44:53 PM
Got a paper copy of Wooster's pre-season roster and the 10 returning players all appear as expected:  :)

Josh Claytor Sr., Jake Mays Sr., Scott Purcell Jr., Doug Thorpe Jr., T.J. Bretz So., Xavier Brown So., Kenny DeBoer So., Jalen Goodwin So., Evan Pannell So. and Kendal Sherrod So.

There are 8 incoming freshmen recruits and 4 of them look good on paper:

Josh Kipfer 6'6" 225  Wadsworth HS, 19.2 ppg,  All District 2nd Team, All Ohio Division I Honorable Mention

Zach McCorkle 6'6" 205  Winton Woods HS (Cincy area), 12.4 ppg, 8.1 rpg, All District player in Division I

Geoff FuQuay 6'3" 175  Valley HS (Arnold, PA), ~24 ppg in WPIAL league

DeVaughn Wingard 6'4" Orange HS (Cleveland area), ~20 ppg, Chagrin Valley Conference 1st Team

Chris Logsdon, 6'1" 180  Hilliard Davidson HS, All District Honorable Mention, ~10 ppg, Son of a Coach

Marc McCuen, 6'6" 200  Galion HS, All District Special Mention

Joseph Whiston, 6'7" 190  Mt. Gilead HS

Nathan Mathewson, 6'4" 170  Panther Valley HS (Coaldale, PA)

Nice to see the Scots getting some taller recruits with both Claytor and Mays in their Senior years.

Justin Hallowell is listed as an Assistant Coach on the roster.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on October 15, 2012, 10:26:47 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on October 15, 2012, 09:16:38 PM
Quote from: woolax on October 15, 2012, 09:03:31 PMKnow that the game is being played at the same sight as the Div I Final Four

Actually, IIRC, the site for the D3 championship game is different than the site for the D1 Final Four. Both are in Atlanta, but they're different venues.

Plans are CBS Sports Network.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on October 17, 2012, 04:33:15 PM
The game will be on CBS Sports Network and the games will be a Phillips Arena...

The Preseason Top 25 is out: http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2012-13/preseason (http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2012-13/preseason)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 01, 2012, 06:33:50 PM
NCAC Pre-Season poll has been released, with Wooster tabbed for the top spot on the men's side.  http://www2.northcoast.org/basketball/pollrelease/2012-13
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on November 02, 2012, 11:49:39 AM
Wooster at Wyoming tomorrow night at 9:30 EDT. It appears that the Cowboys have live audio & live stats...
http://www.gowyo.com/sports/m-baskbl/wyo-m-baskbl-body.html (http://www.gowyo.com/sports/m-baskbl/wyo-m-baskbl-body.html)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 03, 2012, 09:21:09 PM
The Wooster-Wyoming audio doesn't seem to be free.  I hate to say it, AGAIN, but this pisses me off when there is no mention of this until you try to get it just before the game.

And, the Gametracker doesn't seem to be working, either.  JFC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on November 03, 2012, 09:53:26 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 03, 2012, 09:21:09 PM
The Wooster-Wyoming audio doesn't seem to be free.  I hate to say it, AGAIN, but this pisses me off when there is no mention of this until you try to get it just before the game.

And, the Gametracker doesn't seem to be working, either.  JFC.

GameTracker seems OK...

http://www.gowyo.com/gametracker/launch/gt_mbaskbl.html?event=1174715&school=wyo&
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 03, 2012, 09:55:52 PM
Yeah, it started late, about a minute and a half into the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 03, 2012, 10:03:10 PM
Jake Mays hasn't seen action yet, he must be injured.  Three freshmen have been in for Wooster.  The Scots were down 11-2 and have come back, but it's impossible to really tell what's going on from GameTracker.  Is Wyoming getting, but missing, good shots?  Who knows.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wallyworld12 on November 04, 2012, 09:53:08 PM
Sad to see that no Wabash folk have posted over here, probably still reeling over that loss to Oberlin....OUCH  :o

Will be quite the rebuilding year for Wabash with the loss of a strong senior class (Bailey, Zinnerman, Shelbourne, Curosh). Definitely need to get guys to step up the scoring end, and in a hurry. Will be nice to have Walsh, Hodges, Oetting, Surenkamp, and Nicksic back with good experience. Hopefully they surprise some people.

I will have a better idea of how the team will look after I get to see them on the 24th, great measuring stick kind of game against Illinois Wesleyan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 05, 2012, 08:06:56 AM
Wait until the Bell Game! (Outside shot, playoffs...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on November 05, 2012, 04:12:12 PM
I agree with the coaches pick that Wooster and Ohio Wesleyan are the top 2 teams.  I would make the Bishops the pre-season favorite with Wooster 2nd.  Witt and DePauw are next with Witt in 3rd, DePauw 4th, and Wabash 5th.  I think there is a serious gap in talent this year from the top half compared to the bottom half.  Someone could be a big surprise but I don't see it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on November 10, 2012, 10:03:47 AM
Wooster Season Preview is now up:   http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/releases/20121106cfya0c

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wallyworld12 on November 12, 2012, 11:35:31 AM
Wabash opened up their season on Saturday night with an exhibition game against Western Illinois, the Leathernecks won 71-39. Link to the game story is here:

http://www.goleathernecks.com/ViewArticle.dbml?SPSID=49946&SPID=4947&DB_LANG=C&ATCLID=205733168&DB_OEM_ID=12000

A couple of notes...

1. Wabash had difficulty scoring. We knew this would be a problem coming in to this season, with a lot of PPG being lost to graduation. Little Giants need to figure out who they can count on for buckets. They got 14 points from freshman Ross Sponsler and 13 points from sophomore Kasey Oetting.

2. Interesting starting lineup--Joining Oetting and Sponsler were Pete Nicksic, Daniel Purvlicis, and Evan Johnson. Senior Jordan Surenkamp had minimal minutes. Wabash needs to find ways to utilize players like Jordan and Austin Hawn if they are to be successful. Also will hopefully be getting Andy Walsh and Houston Hodges in the coming weeks with football over.

Wabash travels to Albion this weekend for the Mike Turner Tipoff Tournament, where they will play Manchester on Saturday and Albion on Sunday. First chance for Little Giant fans to see the team at home is on Saturday, November 23rd for an afternoon game against Illinois Wesleyan. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 12, 2012, 11:48:33 AM
Hey, you may not want to link to the Miami student portal web login page!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wallyworld12 on November 12, 2012, 12:22:47 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 12, 2012, 11:48:33 AM
Hey, you may not want to link to the Miami student portal web login page!

That's what I get for posting on here during work!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 15, 2012, 09:16:23 AM
Hey, we're starting. Here's what we got this weekend with last year's record showing (except for Pitt-Titusville). I don't have time to do the full-scale preview thanks to work. Darn work.

Only Hiram has the weekend off.

Thursday, November 15:

Washington & Jefferson (9-18) @ Denison (14-14)

Friday, November 16:

Wittenberg (24-7) vs. Johns Hopkins (15-11) @ Case Western Reserve
Ohio Wesleyan (20-8) vs. Defiance (13-13) @ Marietta
Kenyon (11-15) vs. Rowan (12-14) @ Gettysburg
Carnegie - Mellon (9-16) @ Wooster (26-5)
Pitt- Titusville (1-6) @ Allegheny (5-20) - BTW, Pitt-Titusville lost to Penn-State Dubois 107-49 last night. Yeowch!

Saturday, November 17:

Denison (14-14) @ Earlham (2-23)
Oberlin (7-18) @ Hanover (16-9)
Wabash (18-8) vs. Manchester (11-14) @ Albion
DePauw (13-13) vs. Thomas More (20-8) @ Mt. St. Joseph
Wittenberg (24-7) vs. Bluffton (16-10) OR CWRU (10-15) @ Case Western Reseve
Adrian (17-9) or Otterbein (9-17) @ Wooster (26-5)
Kenyon (11-15) vs. Gettysburg (11-14) or Keuka (5-18) @ Gettysburg
Wilmington (15-13) or McDaniel (13-13) @ Allegheny (5-20)
Ohio Wesleyan (20-8) vs. Frostburg State (13-13) or Marietta (17-9) @ Marietta

Sunday, November 18:

Wabash (18-8) @ Albion (11-14)
Denison (14-14) @ Hanover (16-9)
Oberlin (7-18) @ Earlham (2-23)
DePauw (13-13) @ Mt. St. Joseph (7-18)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wallyworld12 on November 15, 2012, 02:24:43 PM
Some interesting matchups in the coming days. Smed, will you be keeping track of the NCAC's non-conference record?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 15, 2012, 02:51:16 PM
I'll do what I can. The whole mega work thing is biting me right now. Ah, well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 15, 2012, 11:01:33 PM
The Dimonde Hale show is back in town! He had 35 points and eight rebounds, including shooting 19-21 from the line as Denison edged past Washington & Jefferson 79-74. The Big Red had a 14-point halftimne lead but saw the Presidents cut it to two with 53 seconds to go. Darius White scored 12 off the bench for Denison while Bret Woolard added 11.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 16, 2012, 09:57:01 PM
Final:  Wooster 79  Carnegie Mellon 67 :)

In the season opener, Wooster was led tonight by Xavier Brown with 16 points, Josh Claytor with 14 points, Evan Pannell with 14 and Jake Mays with 12.  Kenny DeBoer added 9 points.

Doug Thorpe did not play so perhaps he was out due to sickness/injury.  Three freshmen played significant minutes for the Scots -- Geoff FuQuay who had 6 points, Josh Kipfer who had 4 points and Devon Wingard who did not score.  FuQuay handles the ball well and he was in the game down the stretch.  Only major negative for Wooster was the large number of turnovers (20+) which is often the case in an opening game.

Wooster plays Adrian (MI) in the championship game of the Al Van Wie tourney tomorrow night.  Adrian beat Otterbein in the opener tonight.  I plan on making it to Timken tomorrow to see the Scots in action.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 16, 2012, 10:14:09 PM
Other Scores:

Ohio Wesleyan 69  Defiance 55
Wittenberg 61  Johns Hopkins 44
Allegheny 82  Pitt-Titusville 41
Rowan (NJ) 80  Kenyon 71
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 16, 2012, 11:39:58 PM
Good start for the NCAC then: 5-1 in non-conference play!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 17, 2012, 11:34:18 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 16, 2012, 09:57:01 PM

Doug Thorpe did not play so perhaps he was out due to sickness/injury.  Three freshmen played significant minutes for the Scots -- Geoff FuQuay who had 6 points, Josh Kipfer who had 4 points and Devon Wingard who did not score.  FuQuay handles the ball well and he was in the game down the stretch.  Only major negative for Wooster was the large number of turnovers (20+) which is often the case in an opening game.

Wooster plays Adrian (MI) in the championship game of the Al Van Wie tourney tomorrow night.  Adrian beat Otterbein in the opener tonight.  I plan on making it to Timken tomorrow to see the Scots in action.

GO SCOTS!

Moore mentioned Thorpe being out in the pregame interview.  He said he would have been available in an emergency but didn't disclose why he was out of the game but I'm assuming it's nothing that's going to keep him on the bench for an extended period of time. 

Very sloppy game last night for both teams as the total turnovers for the game was pushing 50.  Hard to watch at times but also I guess it was somewhat understandable being the first game and all and also having 3 frosh getting significant pt. 

It's only one game, but I'm wondering if this is going to be as much of a perimeter oriented shooting team as we have been accustomed to over the years.  Wooster only shot nine 3-pointers for the game.  That's usually about an average of made 3-pointers in a typical Wooster game.  And it looked for a time that they might go the entire game without making a single trey (wonder when the last time that's happened?).

Hopefully the Scots can clean up things a bit in the turnover department tonight against Adrian...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 17, 2012, 12:43:26 PM
Nice start for the NCAC overall last night - 5-1 feels pretty good. Also happy to see the Scots get the first 'W'.

Everyone except for Hiram is in action today. Seems to me like we could build on yesterday's success...6-3 or better in aggregate looks like it'd be a good result.

Keuka vs. Kenyon, 2 PM (@ Gettysburg)
Denison at Earlham, 3 PM
Manchester vs. Wabash, 3 PM (@ Albion)
Oberlin at Hanover, 5 PM
DePauw vs. Thomas More 6 PM (@ Cincinnati, Ohio)
Wittenberg at Case Western Reserve 7 PM
Ohio Wesleyan at Marietta, 7 PM
Wilmington at Allegheny, 8 PM
Adrian at Wooster, 8 PM
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on November 17, 2012, 05:35:20 PM
I'm surprised that no one has mentioned Evan Pannell's dunk, off an alley-oop from Xavier Brown. There aren't many guards at this level who can throw it down with authority, and that may be the most impressive dunk that I have seen in five seasons at Wooster. The Scots were a bit sloppy with the ball, but it's nice to start the season with a win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: OhioRed17 on November 17, 2012, 05:39:30 PM
Denison picks up another win at Earlham 78-49.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 17, 2012, 05:48:15 PM
Kenyon beat Keuka 73-62. (I was about ready to do a Keuka, Fran and Ollie joke but I think no one would get it. At. All.)

Wabash fell to Manchester 59-54 at Albion, but freshman Daniel Purvlicis scored 15 and added 10 boards.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on November 17, 2012, 09:53:21 PM
Adrian hits a buzzer-beater to beat the Scots, 57-56.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 17, 2012, 11:28:54 PM
So let's recap:

W - Denison 79, Earlham 49 
W - Kenyon 73, Keuka 62
L - Manchester 59, Wabash 54
L - Adrian 57, Wooster 56
W - Allegheny 76, Wilmington 70 : Good win for the Gators after a horrible 2011-12
L - Hanover 83, Oberlin 41 : Oof
L - Thomas More 80, DePauw 79 : DPU took the lead with 14 seconds left but fouled Thomas More two seconds later (!) and the Saints hit two free throws for the win.
W - Wittenberg 69, Case Western Reserve 52
W - OWU 76, Marietta 55

A 5-4 day puts the NCAC at 10-5 overall. Could have easily been better with two last-second losses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on November 18, 2012, 01:15:12 PM
Early but a few thoughts. Outstanding weekend for Denison and OWU. The Bishops are surely the favorites after two dominating performances this weekend.  Wooster will continue to get better as the year goes on.  Tough loss vs Adrian.  Good win for 'Gheny.  Will be interested to see how this Witt teams develops an identity.  Disappointing loss for DePauw. Oberlin going to be in for a long year again.  Can Wabash get it going and get to Wabash standards?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 18, 2012, 05:35:39 PM
Good result for the LGs! The transitive property does not stand, man.

Albion beat Manchester by 15 earlier in the week, but Wabash tops the Britons 53-51. Freshman Ross Sponsler's tip-in capped off a comeback and set the Wabash record at 1-1.

Bad news for Denison. They were edged by Hanover 87-84.

Earlham tops Oberlin 76-55. May be a very l-o-n-g season for the Yeomen.

DPU beats MSJ 59-39.

A 2-2 mark for the NCAC puts them at 12-7 thus far.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 18, 2012, 05:38:03 PM
Wabash 53  Albion 51
no boxscore yet

Was at this one, not the prettiest game I'll see this year.  Albion led most of the way all of the way but could just never pull far enough ahead.  Wabash kept themselves in it with some really good and timely 3 point shooting(5-9 2nd half).  Down the stretch they played their best defense of the day and kept Albion from scoring on several trips.

Up 7 with 6 to play, Albion had two straight trips with turnovers while Wabash scored at the other end, really gave Wabash the chance to steal it, which they did.  Wabash really came to life the last 5 minutes after Fr. Daniel Purvlicis' dunk to pull within 3.  Different team those last 5 minutes.

Wabash was the sloppier team most of the day(relatively sloppier), kind of a strange game since they seemed to really pull it together the last quarter of the game.

The boxscore will say Wabash won it on a jump shot but it was more a tip from 5 feet away off the backboard.  Albion's last shot to win was actually a pretty good look from maybe 25 feet or more.
---------------------------------
Wabash's starting 5 played the bulk of the game.

Ross Sponsler was the most impressive looking Fr, he played well today.  Fr. Purvlicis had a little trouble with a couple of Albion's bulkier F's. Wabash played without 6-7 C Kasey Oetting(injury, on the bench) and Houston Hodges who apparently didn't make the trip to Albion with an injury.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 18, 2012, 05:43:52 PM
Hodges is still recovering from football, I bet. Andy Walsh is the backup QB but Hodges played DB, WR and returned punts this year. He may have taken a day off after the Monon Bell game to rest up.

Here's yer box score:

http://sports.wabash.edu/boxscore.aspx?id=506
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 18, 2012, 09:54:40 PM
I've not yet seen Wooster play live, but caught the video replay of most of their game against Adrian.  It had little resemblance to Wooster basketball.  Very sloppy.  Disorganized.  Poor shooting.  Steve Moore, Doug Cline, and company have some serious work to do in order to turn this group into a contender.

Doug Thorpe is injured and his return will help.  But the freshmen played like freshmen, and unfortunately so did the sophomores.  Even with Thorpe, who can shoot it, the outside shooting will not be what it once was.  The gap between where Wooster is now to having organized ball movement is huge.  Wooster now goes on the road for a long stretch, and we'll see if they can learn some things before returning home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 19, 2012, 01:54:40 PM
We got a few games goin' on tomorrow before the teams get their turkey on. Still too early to get a read on some teams.

November 20

CWRU (1-1) @ Denison (2-1) - Denison looks to be starting out this year the same way they ended last year - competent and dangerous at times.

Wittenberg (2-0) @ Capital (1-1) - Lost amid the hubbub of the Old Tigers' stirring win over Heidelberg in football was how well the hoops team played this weekend. Witt looks like a team built for the long haul.

Carnegie - Mellon (0-2) @ Allegheny (2-0) - Sure, the first game was a win against one of those Pittsburgh branch campuses that are sub-optimal in hoops, but the Gators beat a legit OAC team also and a 3-0 start will put them more than halfway to last season's win totals.

Grove City (1-1) @ Kenyon (1-1) - You got me on this one. Grove City beat an OAC team (John Carroll) and lost to Wells, who lost to PSU - Behrend by a boatload. Kenyon beat perennial weak-sister Keuka (who is in the same conference as Wells) and lost to Rowan. Flip a coin? (BTW - Wells' nickname is "Express".)

Wooster (1-1) @ Baldwin - Wallace (1-0) - Oh, the rending of garments and the donning of sackcloth and ashes has already started for Wooster fans, since they had the temerity to lose to an MIAA team not named Hope or Calvin.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on November 19, 2012, 02:54:24 PM
Denison by 10+.
Capital by 10+.
Allegheny by 3.
Kenyon by 5.
BW by 3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 19, 2012, 03:55:45 PM
Quote from: sac on November 18, 2012, 05:38:03 PM
Fr. Daniel Purvlicis

I've been thinking about this name since I saw it on a recruiting twitter last spring.  It occurs to me this is a rare last name that seems to have not enough vowels and too many vowels all at once.

carry on.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on November 19, 2012, 04:05:44 PM
Quote from: sac on November 19, 2012, 03:55:45 PM
Quote from: sac on November 18, 2012, 05:38:03 PM
Fr. Daniel Purvlicis

I've been thinking about this name since I saw it on a recruiting twitter last spring.  It occurs to me this is a rare last name that seems to have not enough vowels and too many vowels all at once.

carry on.

Also it looks like it could be pronounced Perv-lick-us.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 19, 2012, 04:31:03 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on November 19, 2012, 04:05:44 PM
Quote from: sac on November 19, 2012, 03:55:45 PM
Quote from: sac on November 18, 2012, 05:38:03 PM
Fr. Daniel Purvlicis

I've been thinking about this name since I saw it on a recruiting twitter last spring.  It occurs to me this is a rare last name that seems to have not enough vowels and too many vowels all at once.

carry on.

Also it looks like is could be pronounced Perv-lick-us.

According the Albion sound system its  Dangarbble  Pergarbblegarbblegarbblegarbbleus
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on November 19, 2012, 05:38:15 PM
Quote from: sac on November 19, 2012, 04:31:03 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on November 19, 2012, 04:05:44 PM
Quote from: sac on November 19, 2012, 03:55:45 PM
Quote from: sac on November 18, 2012, 05:38:03 PM
Fr. Daniel Purvlicis

I've been thinking about this name since I saw it on a recruiting twitter last spring.  It occurs to me this is a rare last name that seems to have not enough vowels and too many vowels all at once.

carry on.

Also it looks like is could be pronounced Perv-lick-us.

According the Albion sound system its  Dangarbble  Pergarbblegarbblegarbblegarbbleus

+1
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 19, 2012, 06:57:21 PM
Quote from: sac on November 19, 2012, 04:31:03 PM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on November 19, 2012, 04:05:44 PM
Quote from: sac on November 19, 2012, 03:55:45 PM
Quote from: sac on November 18, 2012, 05:38:03 PM
Fr. Daniel Purvlicis

I've been thinking about this name since I saw it on a recruiting twitter last spring.  It occurs to me this is a rare last name that seems to have not enough vowels and too many vowels all at once.

carry on.

Also it looks like is could be pronounced Perv-lick-us.

According the Albion sound system its  Dangarbble  Pergarbblegarbblegarbblegarbbleus

I heard the exact same thing the last time I was on the Red Line in DC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 19, 2012, 09:39:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 19, 2012, 01:54:40 PM
Oh, the rending of garments and the donning of sackcloth and ashes has already started for Wooster fans, since they had the temerity to lose to an MIAA team not named Hope or Calvin.

I call 'em like I see 'em.  It wasn't the result, it was the visual message.  Watching them play hurt my eyes.  Maybe it wasn't them, but the fuzzy 1950's image that Clear Picture produces.  We'll know soon enough.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 20, 2012, 07:46:37 PM
Denison down 26-25 to Case Western at the half. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 20, 2012, 08:38:07 PM
The Big Red fall to Case 69-56.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 20, 2012, 08:41:10 PM
Wittenberg defeats Capital 66-54 to pick up another big road win and start the season 3-0. Let's go Witt!!

Unfortunately, its going to be a while until I can see the "new" Tigers in person as my officiating schedule conflicts with pretty much every home game and for the first time in probably 7 years I cannot make the Wooster game at home. Maybe the away game?

From what I've seen from boxscores is Witt is a pretty balanced team this year and even though they graduated a lot, they still play that sound Wittenberg defense making it hard for teams to score against them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 20, 2012, 08:51:23 PM
Witt are the "Old" Tigers since they were in the league first!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 20, 2012, 08:55:25 PM
Carnegie - Mellon eases past Allegheny 57-53.

The good news is Kenyon bested Grove City 62-50.

Wooster and B-W are tied at 67 with 4:32 to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 20, 2012, 09:07:28 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 20, 2012, 08:51:23 PM
Witt are the "Old" Tigers since they were in the league first!

How about "new" Old Tigers as they really are a new group this year? We can compromise!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 20, 2012, 09:15:41 PM
Final:  Wooster 81  Baldwin-Wallace 74  :)

Nice road win for the Scots.  Wooster was led tonight by Jalen Goodwin with 18 points, Jake Mays with 15 points, Xavier Brown with 13 points and Evan Pannell with 11.

Wooster outrebounded BW by a 40 to 27 count.  Scots also shot well tonight at 50% from the floor.

Wooster is now 2-1.  Next game is Sunday 11/25 at Oberlin
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 20, 2012, 09:17:22 PM
Quote from: pennstghs on November 20, 2012, 09:07:28 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 20, 2012, 08:51:23 PM
Witt are the "Old" Tigers since they were in the league first!

How about "new" Old Tigers as they really are a new group this year? We can compromise!

Well, yeah, but it's kind of set now to distinguish between Witt and DPU flavors of Tigers. It's a new team for the Old Tigers, but not as new as the Little Giants!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 20, 2012, 09:18:47 PM
With the Wooster win, that's a 3-2 day and 15-9 thus far.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoosterFAN on November 20, 2012, 09:18:55 PM
Wooster pulls away for a road victory at BW - 81-74. Scots paced by 4 in double figures Xavier Brown, Evan Pannell, Jake Mays, and Jalen Goodwin paced the visitors with 18 (4-4 3pt). Win despite 22 fouls and 16 TOs?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 20, 2012, 11:48:02 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 20, 2012, 09:17:22 PM
Well, yeah, but it's kind of set now to distinguish between Witt and DPU flavors of Tigers. It's a new team for the Old Tigers, but not as new as the Little Giants!

Behind closed doors, are the Little Giants known as the Oxymorons? ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on November 21, 2012, 03:42:18 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 19, 2012, 09:39:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 19, 2012, 01:54:40 PM
Oh, the rending of garments and the donning of sackcloth and ashes has already started for Wooster fans, since they had the temerity to lose to an MIAA team not named Hope or Calvin.

I call 'em like I see 'em.  It wasn't the result, it was the visual message.  Watching them play hurt my eyes.  Maybe it wasn't them, but the fuzzy 1950's image that Clear Picture produces.  We'll know soon enough.

It was good to see the sun rise in the east this morning.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 22, 2012, 09:32:32 PM
We've got some games going on this weekend, and one finally makes its debut. Plus, we have our first conference game of the year. Wait, what???  :o

Saturday, November 24:

Mt. Union (1-2) @ Hiram (0-0) - Terriers finally kick off their season with a game against a bleah OAC team.
Oberlin (0-2) @ Franciscan (0-3) - The "something's gotta give" game. The Yeomen have looked awful. The woebegon Barons have played better than last year's o-fer squad.
Illinois Wesleyan (3-0) @ Wabash (1-1) - The LG's will be scrappy, but this is a young team playing a potential national power. At least it's at home. Wait, I've seen how the Green Horde travel. Ah, well. Play hard, Wabash, and good things may happen.
Allegheny (2-1) @ Baldwin - Wallace (1-1) - The Gators do look improved, despite the loss to CMU. This will be a good test to see where they are truly at in the rebuilding process.
Purdue - North Central (3-4) @ DePauw (1-1) - Game one of the Mike Rokicki Community Versus Cancer Challenge. The Panthers have a lot of games under their belt already, and have seemingly improved from a God-awful 5-25 mark last year. The New Tigers can't look past them.
Ohio Wesleyan (3-0) vs. Otterbein (1-1) @ Rochester - Gotta love tourneys where two close-by rivals travel hundreds of miles to play, eh? The Bishops are looking very strong thus far, and should roll past the Cardinals.

Sunday, November 25:
Non - Conference

Case Western Reserve (2-1) @ Kenyon (2-1) - Case lost to Witt but beat Denison. Kenyon's loss is to Rowan, and they dispatched a couple of lesser opponents with relative ease. The Lords could give the Spartans a game, especially if Nwadibia and Lebowitz (they're still here - are they on a six-year plan??  ;) ) come to play.
Franklin (0-1) or Albion (1-1) @ DePauw (1-1) - Game two of the DPU tourney. Both the Grizz and the Britons are coming off of disappointing losses. The New Tigers may be able to pick up another win if they play well.
Ohio Wesleyan (3-0) vs. Rochester (3-0) or SUNY - Cobleskill (1-2) @ Rochester - Obviously, the powers that be want the Bishops to face the Yellowjackets. That could be one of the better early-season games out there - a real humdinger that will definitely give both clubs a read on how they stack up nationally. If the Bishops face the Fighting Tigers, it'll be a let down for everyone, but at least this writer won't have to give yet another adjective for a team named the "Tigers". Thank God for small favors, I suppose.

NCAC Game! No Really, And It's A Beauty!:

Wooster (0-0, 2-1) @ Oberlin (0-0, 0-2) - Dear Oberlin, you're winless including a loss to Earlham, of all teams. You just played a moribund Franciscan team the night before. So as a gift to you, your next game will be against the Scots. You're welcome, Yeomen. You're welcome.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 24, 2012, 05:28:32 PM
Oh, wow. Just wanted to peek in at the Oberlin / Franciscan game on-line and it cost $6!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 24, 2012, 05:32:05 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 24, 2012, 05:28:32 PM
Oh, wow. Just wanted to peek in at the Oberlin / Franciscan game on-line and it cost $6!

Yeah, they charge $8 for the local church-league games! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 24, 2012, 05:38:43 PM
A scrappy effort fell short for Wabash, as they lost to IWU 62-56 today. Kasey Oetting led the LG's with 19, while Marcus Kammrath added 10 off the bench along with seven rebounds (another double figure effort from another freshman). Kevin Reed had 12 points and 10 boards for the Titans.

Ross Sponsler didn't play today. I was focused on other things, so I don't know the story if he was hurt or something else.

Hiram out-sprinted Mt. Union 93-84. Aaron Stepanov scored 23 for the Terriers while Alan Sheppard added 21. Looks like Hiram will be up to their tricks again.

Thus far NCAC 1-1 on the day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 24, 2012, 06:24:45 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 24, 2012, 05:28:32 PM
Oh, wow. Just wanted to peek in at the Oberlin / Franciscan game on-line and it cost $6!

Quite a bargain.  Tickets for most live comedy acts, these days, go for $30 and up. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 24, 2012, 06:44:39 PM
Oberlin tops Franciscan 69-57. Score one for the NCAC, at least!

Andrew Fox leads the Yeomen with 19 points and 21 rebounds (20 defensive)! Franciscan dressed nine and had five players foul out.

DPU and OWU find themselves in tight games at the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 24, 2012, 09:17:50 PM
DPU knocks off Purdue - North Central 71-54.

OWU holds off Otterbein 66-59.

Bad news, B-W beats Allegheny 83-73.

4-2 for the NCAC today!

19-11 record for the NCAC thus far!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 25, 2012, 09:06:06 PM
Final:  Wooster 74  Oberlin 66

Wooster gets the NCAC road win over the Yeomen.  Scots were led by Xavier Brown with 24 points, Doug Thorpe with 12 points, Jake Mays with 10 points (12 boards - nice double-double) and Evan Pannell with 10 points.

Oberlin's top scorers were Geoff Simpson with 19 points, Emmanuel Lewis with 15 points and Andrew Fox added 12.  Oberlin played a solid game tonight and their 4th scorer with 9 points was Randy Ollie, a 6'9" freshman center who showed some ability around the basket.

Wooster is now 3-1, 1-0 NCAC. :)  Next game is Wednesday at Ohio Northern.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 25, 2012, 09:33:49 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 22, 2012, 09:32:32 PM
Ohio Wesleyan (3-0) vs. Rochester (3-0) or SUNY - Cobleskill (1-2) @ Rochester - Obviously, the powers that be want the Bishops to face the Yellowjackets. That could be one of the better early-season games out there - a real humdinger that will definitely give both clubs a read on how they stack up nationally. If the Bishops face the Fighting Tigers, it'll be a let down for everyone, but at least this writer won't have to give yet another adjective for a team named the "Tigers". Thank God for small favors, I suppose.

Rochester goes to 5-0 and wins its UR/Holiday Inn Airport Thanksgiving Invitational with a 83-68 victory over OWU. Wesleyan takes its first loss and falls to 3-1. Rochester seems likely to enter the Top 25 this week with the 5-0 start after being the "others receiving votes" for the preseason poll.

From the game story, it sounds like a pretty convincing win for the Yellowjackets, with the outcome never seriously in doubt. OWU fell behind 15-5 and never recovered, as the Yellowjackets enjoyed a 37-24 halftime advantage and pushed it to 61-35 midway through the second. Wesleyan never got closer than 15 the rest of the way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wallyworld12 on November 25, 2012, 10:47:32 PM
Just sitting down to write my review of the Little Giants game against Illinois Wesleyan yesterday. Was very impressed by Wabash's effort against a good IWU team. As Smed noted above freshman Ross Sponsler did not play, with what is rumored to be a sore knee. Without a key contributor, the LGs looked pretty good.

Was particulary impressed by the post play of Pete Nicksic. Glad to see him fill the footsteps of Nick Curosh. The Titans were very poor from the foul line until it mattered, and those shots along with a late game lane violation sealed the deal for them.

Wabash will play Rose-Hulman on Monday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 26, 2012, 08:22:27 AM
Also, in the league:

DePauw bested Franklin 72-55.

CWRU beat Kenyon 73-63.

A 2-2 slate in non-conference makes it 21-13 overall non-conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 26, 2012, 10:21:45 AM
Tonight there are two more non-conference games:

Allegheny (2-2) @ Geneva (0-4) - The Gators didn't embarrass themselves against either C-M or Baldwin - Wallace, and now they have a 'breather' against a reeling Geneva team that's finding life in the PrAC and D-3 not to their liking, record-wise. Geneva's lost to a couple of Penn State Hyphens and a Pitt Branch Campus, so struggling would almost be an understatement. Devone McLeod is putting up a nice season for Allegheny - averaging 19 a game while leading the team in assists.

Rose-Hulman (2-1) @ Wabash (1-2) - The plucky young Little Giants squad almost, not quite, but coulda pulled a huge upset Saturday against IWU. But there's no rest as a tough Rose-Hulman squad comes to town. The Engineers lost a tough one in OT to Carroll over the weekend, allowing 14 points in the OT when they only gave up 19 in the second half. The LG's will need to find ways to score as RH will make it darn tough to establish an offense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on November 26, 2012, 12:26:11 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 22, 2012, 09:32:32 PM
We've got some games going on this weekend, and one finally makes its debut. Plus, we have our first conference game of the year. Wait, what???  :o

Saturday, November 24:

Mt. Union (1-2) @ Hiram (0-0) - Terriers finally kick off their season with a game against a bleah OAC team.

Hiram took care of business against my Raiders.  They scored 90+ so no first game rust for the Terriers.  Gonna be a bumpy year on the hardwood in Alliance for the men.  Just have to hope playing the youngsters pays off next year.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 26, 2012, 12:59:31 PM
Hmmm...Wooster only beats Oberlin by 8. Oberlin lost to Earlham by 19.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on November 26, 2012, 03:46:21 PM
Miscellaneous thoughts:
Wooster / Oberlin game MUCH closer than expected.
OWU takes one on the chin at Rochester.
Wabash is getting better. Hoping for a win vs. RH
Allegheny cant get overconfident going into the Geneva game.
DePauw is going to be a tough team to deal with.  Good win over Franklin.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on November 26, 2012, 05:13:07 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 26, 2012, 12:59:31 PM
Hmmm...Wooster only beats Oberlin by 8. Oberlin lost to Earlham by 19.

Wooster trailed Oberlin at home, in January of last season, with 11 minutes to play and only won by 12. Went on to reach Sweet 16. Mark me down as someone who isn't worried in the least.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wallyworld12 on November 26, 2012, 08:58:02 PM
How do you spell ugly, at least for tonight? W-A-B-A-S-H

Little Giants take it on the chin at home to Rose-Hulman, 61-37. No offense. None. Played it close in the first half, but if you can't score more than 37 points in a game, you aren't gonna beat anybody.

Yuck.

Back in action on Saturday, NCAC-opener against the Big Red of Denison. Hopefully Coach Carpenter can get the ship righted, and we can get Sponsler back in the rotation, or it could be a LOOOONNNGGG year...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 26, 2012, 09:32:55 PM
I'm not surprised at Rose-Hulman's defensive abilities. They put the hurt on almost every team in this young season. A team as fuzzy-cheeked as Wabash (old sportswriter term...) would probably struggle against them. I have confidence that Wabash will turn it around.

Looks like Allegheny won over Geneva 86-66. Ryan Stanko led the Gators with 17

NCAC now 22-14 in the non-conference.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 26, 2012, 10:04:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 26, 2012, 09:32:55 PM
A team as fuzzy-cheeked as Wabash...

Note to Santa: Cancel order of Norelcos enroute to the Wabash players' Christmas stockings.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 26, 2012, 11:39:35 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 26, 2012, 12:59:31 PM
Hmmm...Wooster only beats Oberlin by 8. Oberlin lost to Earlham by 19.

You know, I watched that game (great video feed by Oberlin, btw), and what struck me was that while it was evident that Wooster enjoyed a talent advantage at nearly every position, it was also clear that the talent gap was necessary, but not sufficient, for this Wooster squad to be able to impose its will on a less-talented squad. Wooster just doesn't have that level of team flow/cohesion/dynamism (yet, at least) that can turn their individual talent advantages into additional team-wide advantages that would force a less-talented team like Oberlin out of sync.

So instead, I saw a game where Wooster's more skilled offensive players were able to create somewhat better chances for themselves offensively, and correspondingly make more of their shots, but who weren't able to force Oberlin to do a lot of things that Oberlin didn't want to do. Particularly in the first half, Oberlin firmly controlled the tempo, keeping it a slow-paced game, and was able to get decent looks out of their offensive sets more often than not. That they proceeded to then *miss* a lot of those shots thoughout the game speaks to the relative talent levels between the squads. I will give the Scots credit for making Andrew Fox work for his points though--they did a nice job of corraling him and forcing him into 8 3pt attempts of 16 shots, a good idea since he's now only 3-26 from there on the season.

Also, I would give some credit to the intense effort of the Yeomen in what may be their only meeting with the Scots this year - pretty sure they would *love* to nip the Scots someday, and the motivation might have been a bit higher for this one than the non-conference meeting with Earlham.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 27, 2012, 12:00:44 AM
Wooster drops to #16 in the first regular-season poll with 173 pts.
Wittenberg stays in others receiving votes (#30) with 46 pts.
OWU drops into others receiving votes (#31) with 39 pts.

As expected, 5-0 Rochester (responsible for OWU's loss) moves into the Top 25 at #17.
5-0 Adrian (responsible for Wooster's loss) also slips into the poll at #20. Not sure when the last time was that the Bulldogs were ranked (or started a season 5-0).

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 27, 2012, 11:36:51 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on November 26, 2012, 11:39:35 PM
Wooster just doesn't have that level of team flow/cohesion/dynamism (yet, at least) that can turn their individual talent advantages into additional team-wide advantages...

Exactly.  They're not yet a "firing on all cylinders" Hickory or UCONN women-type team, and they may never be.  At least, though, they're not Grinnell, and we can be thankful for that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on November 27, 2012, 01:59:56 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 27, 2012, 11:36:51 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on November 26, 2012, 11:39:35 PM
Wooster just doesn't have that level of team flow/cohesion/dynamism (yet, at least) that can turn their individual talent advantages into additional team-wide advantages...

Exactly.  They're not yet a "firing on all cylinders" Hickory or UCONN women-type team, and they may never be.  At least, though, they're not Grinnell, and we can be thankful for that.
Considering their relative youth in the backcourt I submit it may take a while.  There could very easily be some great games and some very poor games.  I have faith that by seasons end Steve will have them coached-up enough to be competitive. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 27, 2012, 08:33:18 PM
I think we missed a milestone posted earlier this month . . .

Congratulations to Andrew Fox of Oberlin for surpassing the 1,000 point mark!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 28, 2012, 08:33:16 AM
Quote from: GoRed on November 27, 2012, 08:33:18 PM
I think we missed a milestone posted earlier this month . . .

Congratulations to Andrew Fox of Oberlin for surpassing the 1,000 point mark!

What?  Wow!  That obliterates the Grinnell player's record!  How did he do it?  What was the game score?  Who...  Oh, wait, this is a career mark...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 28, 2012, 01:41:11 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 26, 2012, 12:59:31 PM
Hmmm...Wooster only beats Oberlin by 8. Oberlin lost to Earlham by 19.

Hmmm...Transitive scores mean what exactly?   ::)

Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 27, 2012, 11:36:51 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on November 26, 2012, 11:39:35 PM
Wooster just doesn't have that level of team flow/cohesion/dynamism (yet, at least) that can turn their individual talent advantages into additional team-wide advantages...

Exactly.  They're not yet a "firing on all cylinders" Hickory or UCONN women-type team, and they may never be.  At least, though, they're not Grinnell, and we can be thankful for that.

Yes.  Wooster is young and while they may not be playing up to the level of what we Wooster fans expect to see from a Steve Moore coached team (yet), I do think they will be there by season's end. 

As Seinfeld pointed out, close games with Oberlin don't translate to cause for concern.  And that loss to Albion isn't looking as bad as I originally thought seeing that they are currently 5-0 and ranked...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on November 28, 2012, 01:48:18 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 28, 2012, 01:41:11 PM
And that loss to Albion isn't looking as bad as I originally thought seeing that they are currently 5-0 and ranked...

It's actually Adrian, and we could talk that one in circles. It's not bad for Wooster because Adrian's ranked, but Adrian's ranked because they beat Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 28, 2012, 02:33:15 PM
Of course, I abhor transitive scores...so that was just a little poke at Wooster re: Oberlin keeping it within sight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 28, 2012, 03:44:54 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 28, 2012, 02:33:15 PM
Of course, I abhor transitive scores...so that was just a little poke at Wooster re: Oberlin keeping it within sight.

I knew you did, so that's why I was poking at you...  ;D

Quote from: KnightSlappy on November 28, 2012, 01:48:18 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 28, 2012, 01:41:11 PM
And that loss to Albion isn't looking as bad as I originally thought seeing that they are currently 5-0 and ranked...

It's actually Adrian, and we could talk that one in circles. It's not bad for Wooster because Adrian's ranked, but Adrian's ranked because they beat Wooster.

Adrian, Albion... Tomaytoe, Tomahtoe...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 28, 2012, 07:46:15 PM
We have a pretty full docket of games tonight. Only Wabash and Allegheny are sitting it out, and our second conference game of the year!

Non-Conference:

DePauw (3-1) @ Earlham (1-4) - The New Tigers come off a fairly impressive weekend and travel to the old-NCAC whipping post, Earlham. The Quakers have only beaten Oberlin this year and don't seem to put the fear into anyone. It may be a decent win for DPU, but we thought that last year the the New Tigers barely escaped with a 78-74 win.

Kalamazoo (1-1) @ Oberlin (1-3) - Transitive property anyone? K'zoo beat Earlham who beat the Yeomen. But Oberlin gave Wooster a bit of a scare (or at least a Hmmmm?) last weekend and the Hornets aren't world beaters in any sense of the imagination. If Oberlin has shaken off its early season malaise this could be a decent win pickup for the league.

Marietta (2-1) @ Wittenberg (3-0) - The Old Tigers have played sound hoops thus far in the season. They have another decent test in the Pioneers, who bounced back after their loss to OWU with a sound thrashing of Waynesburg. If Witt is looking ahead to their big matchup Saturday, Marietta may pip them. I don't think Wittenberg will allow that to happen, though. It should be a good one.

Wooster (3-1) @ Ohio Northern (4-1) - The posters have spoken - the Scots are inconsistent. On paper, the Polar Bears have a decent record and could prove to be another test for Wooster. However, ONU hasn't exactly faced a daunting schedule with their best win over Hood and a loss to Defiance.

Kenyon (2-2) @ Muskingum (0-4) - Yet another NCAC / OAC battle. The Lords have been up-and-down thus far but their 2-2 record could have been expected. They face a Musky team that has struggled mightily thus far. Could be another good win for the league over their arch-nemesis league.

Ohio Wesleyan (3-1) @ Capital (2-3) - The Bishops look to move past their weekend in Rochester (wouldn't we all) where they didn't play all that well and got their first loss of the year. Could Capital be a tonic? Perhaps. The Crusaders two wins were against C-M and Alma, not exactly top-flight teams. But it's a semi-backyard brawl so anything could happen.

Conference game:

Hiram (0-0, 1-0) @ Denison (0-0, 2-2) - This looks like a good game that could have impact down the line. The Terriers opened with a nice win over Mt. Union. The Big Red have dropped two in a row after two good wins to start the year, the last a 13-point home loss to Case. Hiram will try to discombobulate everything Denison will want to do, the question is will the Big Red fall for the bait?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 28, 2012, 07:48:20 PM
And we have our first final!

DPU got it going on in the second half and bested Earlham 77-65. Adam Botts led the New Tigers with 17. Nice balance for DPU with Michael Wilkinson adding 16 and Connor Rich and Barry Flynn chipping in 15.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 28, 2012, 08:04:49 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 28, 2012, 07:46:15 PM
If Witt is looking ahead to their big matchup Saturday, Marietta may pip them.

I'd pay good money to see Wittenberg get pipped.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 28, 2012, 08:32:24 PM
Got Oberlin and Kalamazoo on the video feed, tied at 50. The announcer sounds like he's imitating the old Roy Firestone character, Biff Barnes.

Kalamazoo beat Oberlin 55-53. The Yeomen had a lot of chances at the end, but it wasn't to be. Alas.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 28, 2012, 09:10:37 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 28, 2012, 08:04:49 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 28, 2012, 07:46:15 PM
If Witt is looking ahead to their big matchup Saturday, Marietta may pip them.

I'd pay good money to see Wittenberg get pipped.

Sorry guys, Wittenberg wins 73-63! End result never really in doubt, just like the first several games of the season Witt won the battle of the boards but played great defense and shot exceptionally well from the floor. REally like this team so far as they are balanced and force you to guard them all over the floor.

Unfortunately this is the first year in like 8 years I cannot attend the Witt-Wooster game. I will be reffing somewhere, but I blame the NCAC for making this game so early where I forgot to block my schedule. HOpefully another Witt win!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 28, 2012, 09:17:26 PM
Final:  Wooster 67  Ohio Northern 56  :)

Wooster notches another road win over an OAC team with a good game against the Polar Bears.

Scots were led tonight by Jake Mays with 17 points (8 boards), Xavier Brown with 15 points, Josh Claytor with 12 points and Doug Thorpe with 10 points

Ohio Northern's top scorers were Branden Rushton with 22 points and Isaiah Roux with 13 points.

Wooster is now 4-1, 1-0 NCAC  ;D   Next game is at Wittenberg on Saturday.

GO SCOTS!


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 28, 2012, 09:19:30 PM
Overall, another good night for the NCAC. Two more wins:

Kenyon beat Muskingum 67-63.
OWU topped Capital 64-53.

A 5-1 record and a sweep of the OAC tonight. I rechecked and it seems we're 26-15 overall non conference by my tally. I accidentally double counted wins earlier. Sigh.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on November 28, 2012, 09:26:10 PM
In looking at the boxscore, it appears that the post players led the way tonight for the Scots.  Mays was 8-for-9 from the field, and had 8 rebounds, while Claytor was 3-for-4 on field goals and hit 6 of 8 foul shots, along with adding 6 rebounds.  Xavier Brown did nearly all of his damage at the free-throw line, shooting 11-for-12 there, while hitting only 2 of 13 from the field; however, Brown did have 6 rebounds and 4 assists. 

This team again appears to still lack a perimeter shooter, with only a single three-pointer hit, in 9 attempts.  The Scots had 17 turnovers, while only forcing 9 by ONU.  However, Wooster held the Polar Bears to 33% shooting from the field, and 3-of-21 (14%) from beyond the arc, which is encouraging.

Now it's time to ... BEAT WITT!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 28, 2012, 09:40:08 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on November 28, 2012, 09:26:10 PM
In looking at the boxscore, it appears that the post players led the way tonight for the Scots.  Mays was 8-for-9 from the field, and had 8 rebounds, while Claytor was 3-for-4 on field goals and hit 6 of 8 foul shots, along with adding 6 rebounds.  Xavier Brown did nearly all of his damage at the free-throw line, shooting 11-for-12 there, while hitting only 2 of 13 from the field; however, Brown did have 6 rebounds and 4 assists. 

This team again appears to still lack a perimeter shooter, with only a single three-pointer hit, in 9 attempts.  The Scots had 17 turnovers, while only forcing 9 by ONU.  However, Wooster held the Polar Bears to 33% shooting from the field, and 3-of-21 (14%) from beyond the arc, which is encouraging.

Now it's time to ... BEAT WITT!

Sounded from tuning in and out of the game that OWU lacked any sort of post presence inside which might explain why Mays and Claytor had such good nights and also why Wooster didn't rely on their perimeter game all that much. 

I do agree that this team doesn't have the typical sharp shooters from beyond the arc, but they do have some guys that can fill it like Thorpe.  I just think the fact that they only shot it 9 times from deep had more to do with OWU's lack of a way to stop Wooster inside tonight than anything else...

As for Witt, does this game keep getting earlier and earlier???  I mean, it will be Witt's conference lid lifter and only Woo's 2nd conference tilt.  This just doesn't seem right to pit the best rivalry in the league up against each other so freaking early in the year?!  Maybe next year we can schedule Witt to come to play in the Al Van Wie Tip-Off Classic...  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 28, 2012, 09:43:48 PM
ScotsFan you mean ONU, right? Not OWU!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 28, 2012, 09:54:58 PM
Denison cruised past Hiram tonight 68-52. Dimonde Hale led the Big Red with 23 while Jon Akpapunam added 17.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 28, 2012, 11:38:38 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on November 28, 2012, 09:26:10 PM
Mays was 8-for-9 from the field, and had 8 rebounds.

Now it's time to ... BEAT WITT!
Jake Mays put those numbers up in 16 minutes!  I know he can be a somewhat erratic player, but in the last couple of years, at least, it really seems like he should be on the floor more.

And it's PIP WITT!  Gonna be a tough one, hoping there's video.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 28, 2012, 11:45:18 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 28, 2012, 09:40:08 PM
This just doesn't seem right to pit the best rivalry in the league up against each other so freaking early in the year?! 

Ahem....

Ding! Ding! Ding!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 29, 2012, 01:14:05 AM
Quote from: smedindy on November 28, 2012, 11:45:18 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 28, 2012, 09:40:08 PM
This just doesn't seem right to pit the best rivalry in the league up against each other so freaking early in the year?! 

Ahem....

Ding! Ding! Ding!

Yeah, really now, c'mon ScotsFan.  Don't go dissing that other game, the one they play somewhere out west of here.  They got railroads, and cannonballs, and even a few girls from one of the schools go to watch it.  Ray Meyer used to coach one of the teams, way back when.  Mark Aguirre, Terry Cummings.  George Mikan, even!  The other school got no chicks, but they make up for it with loads of guys wearing stripes.  They're the Waldos, or something like that.  Wouldn't miss it for anything, unless of course it was going up against the LFL or D,D, and D!

Ahem...  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on November 29, 2012, 08:46:30 AM
Wiittenberg ticket info for the Wooster game
http://www.wittenbergtigers.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/releases/1128 (http://www.wittenbergtigers.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/releases/1128)

Perhaps this is a response to Witt fans being nearly outnumbered by those clad in black and gold when these two played in Springfield last year?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 29, 2012, 09:02:30 AM
You know, there's seething antipathy in every Wabash / DPU game. Not just grudging disdain, but hot blooded hate.

It's good for the soul.  ;)

I'd say Wooster / Witt's hoops rivalry is very heated, and great for the league.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 29, 2012, 09:04:23 AM
BTW, I don't know if you hoopsters saw this from the NCAA:

http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/public/NCAA/Champion+Features/A+Tone+of+Tradition#sthash.R8D8bqVj.h2Jhy79S.dpbs

This carries over to every sport. Of course, there's not 10,000 fans, national TV deals or 60 alumni watch parties for every contest. Thanks to the wonder of streaming video, though, the hoops games will definitely get a lot of traffic.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 29, 2012, 09:43:04 AM
Seriously, dispatching Earlham for DePauw was a major coup for the NCAC.  DePauw brings very competitive teams in almost every sport.  Their rivalry with Wabash is great, steeped in far more tradition than Wooster-Witt.  Still, pipping the Old Tigers is foremost in my mind. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 29, 2012, 12:36:42 PM
Because I had time at lunch, here's where the NCAC stands vs. Other Conferences:

OAC 10-1
HCAC 5-5
PrAC 3-1
UAA 2-4
MIAA 1-2
CC 1-0
NEAC 1-0
AMCC 1-0
NJAC 0-1
CCIW 0-1
Non D-3 2-0
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 29, 2012, 12:43:27 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 29, 2012, 12:36:42 PM
OAC 10-1

Wow. Hadn't realized the record was quite that good vs. OAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 29, 2012, 12:53:49 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on November 29, 2012, 12:43:27 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 29, 2012, 12:36:42 PM
OAC 10-1

Wow. Hadn't realized the record was quite that good vs. OAC.

Yeah.  That one stood out to me as well!  NCAC is putting a thumpin' on the OAC this year...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 29, 2012, 12:54:59 PM
The only loss against the OAC thus far was Allegheny losing to B-W by 10.

Overall, the OAC is just 21-25 thus far.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 29, 2012, 12:57:36 PM
Whose the favorite to win that conference this year?  I can't seem to find any team that really stands out to me from that conference.  B-W might be the best team in that conference, but aren't they ineligible for the post season? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 29, 2012, 01:18:17 PM
Right. Their president nixed the post-season for every team at B-W.

Heidelberg is 4-1 but their best win is over Trine. Marietta may wind up the keeper in that bunch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 29, 2012, 01:46:17 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on November 29, 2012, 12:57:36 PM
Whose the favorite to win that conference this year?  I can't seem to find any team that really stands out to me from that conference.  B-W might be the best team in that conference, but aren't they ineligible for the post season?

Capital was the pre-season favorite by the coaches
1. Capital
2. Baldwin-Wallace
3. Marietta
4. Wilmington
5. John Carroll
6. Mt. Union
7. Ohio Northern
8. Heidelberg
9. Otterbein
10.  Muskingum

I think the league has lost every game against an opponent likely to finish in the top half of its conference except BW's win over Bethany.  Its been a rough start.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: djabs7 on November 30, 2012, 11:12:25 AM
For your viewing pleasure, I posted my highlight videos from the last 9 Witt-Wooster games at this link (5 Wooster wins, 4 Wittenberg wins). I only wish I could go back further.

http://wittwooster.blogspot.com/ (http://wittwooster.blogspot.com/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on November 30, 2012, 11:36:39 AM
Quote from: djabs7 on November 30, 2012, 11:12:25 AM
For your viewing pleasure, I posted my highlight videos from the last 9 Witt-Wooster games at this link (5 Wooster wins, 4 Wittenberg wins). I only wish I could go back further.

http://wittwooster.blogspot.com/ (http://wittwooster.blogspot.com/)
Nice - Thanks
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 30, 2012, 01:31:12 PM
Tomorrow's a big day with four conference tiles and two non-conference:

Non-Conference:

Hiram (1-1) @ Notre Dame (OH) (1-3) - The Terriers step up in class to face a team that just beat Kentucky whilst wearing hideous all-black uniforms...er....the D-2 Falcons that's coming off of a waxing by Findlay. Last year Hiram won 84-73 and the struggles of the Notre Dame to date means that a similar result could be likely.

CWRU (3-2) @ Oberlin (1-4) - The Spartans are 2-1 against the NCAC and will probably be 3-1 after the day is done. But the Yeomen showed a lot of pluck against Wooster and almost knocked off Kalamazoo. I wouldn't count 'em out, yet.

Conference:

Kenyon (0-0, 3-2) @ DePauw (0-0, 4-1) - A nice matchup to start the year for both teams. Both have some talented upperclassmen that certainly know how to play. Brian Liebowitz only played two minutes against Muskingum, so if he's not back it may make it rougher for the Lords. I can see a New Tigers' win for certain if he's out.

Denison (1-0, 3-2) @ Wabash (0-0, 1-3) - The Little Giants' inconsistency is definitely a hallmark of a young team. No player has shown consistency game-over-game yet and a lot of flaws were exposed against Rose-Hulman. Denison's got enough grit and talent to make things rough on the youngsters, especially if Wabash can't find a way to stop Dimonde Hale.

Ohio Wesleyan (0-0, 4-1) @ Allegheny (0-0, 3-2) - The Gators are certainly better than last year, but that won't be enough against the Bishops. OWU rebounded from its stumble against Rochester and put Capital away at the end. Look for an OWU win but it wouldn't surprise me if Allegheny keeps it rather close.

Wooster (1-0, 4-1) @ Wittenberg (0-0, 4-0) - It DOES seem a bit early for this, doesn't it? The NCAC really should schedule games like this at the end of the season on Saturday nights (same for Wabash / DPU in hoops) so that there's maximum impact and exposure. Right now, I'd say the Old Tigers have a definite advantage. They're playing better with more consistency. Yet, it IS a rivalry game and Wittenberg really hasn't had a 'stinker' yet. We'll see Saturday night for sure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2012, 05:21:35 PM
In early action:

Kenyon beat DPU 68-64 behind Julian Pavlin's 16 points. Barry Flynn netted 26 for the New Tigers but hit just 12-21 free throws on the day. Hack-a-Flynn?

OWU beat Allegheny 76-62. Taylor Rieger scorched the nets for 25 for the Bishops. Devone McLeod led the Gators with 16.

In a thriller, Denison came back from 56-43 deficit with 11:08 to take a lead at 64-63 with 3:36 to go. But the Little Giants showed some fortitude and came away with a 75-72 win. The Big Red thought they tied it with two seconds left, but after a video review Robby Weingart's shot was determined to be a two, not a three. Dimonde Hale was a beast for Denison with 29 points. Kasey Oetting and Ross Sponsler led Wabash with 15.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2012, 05:27:24 PM
I don't think someone at Notre Dame liked my preview of their game against Hiram. They're about to lay a century on the Terriers with six minutes left in the game.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 01, 2012, 05:54:57 PM
Oberlin comes close, again, but loses to Case 58-53. With Hiram losing by a badillion it's 0-2 for the NCAC today vs. non-conference and 26-17 overall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 01, 2012, 08:07:25 PM
30-16 in favor of the Scots at halftime. Wittenberg 8-30 from the field.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 01, 2012, 08:22:02 PM
Love being able to watch Woo-Wit from my hotel in Moscow!  Thank-you Al Gore!

I agree with those that have commented about the scheduling.  No reason that both games shouldn't be played in Jan-Feb.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 01, 2012, 09:04:52 PM
OK - who thought that Wooster's first bench-emptier would come at Witt?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 01, 2012, 09:16:23 PM
Wooster 60
Wittenberg 41

After Wittenberg took a 2-0 lead, Wooster scored the next 9 and Wittenberg never found an offensive rhythm all night, shooting a terrible 29% from the floor for the contest. Credit strong Wooster defense, but Witt also simply missed a number of their open looks. Meanwhile the Scots put together a balanced scoring effort with 10 scorers in the book, led by Xavier Brown with 12 and Jake Mays with 10 to go with a game-high 8 boards. Wooster was content to play a slow-tempo second half as Wittenberg never really threatened.

One stat that jumps out was Wooster's commanding rebounding advantage - not many Woo-Witt games where the Scots enjoy a +16 advantage on the glass (41-25).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 01, 2012, 09:37:07 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 01, 2012, 09:16:23 PM
One stat that jumps out was Wooster's commanding rebounding advantage - not many Woo-Witt games where the Scots enjoy a +16 advantage on the glass (41-25).

Including free throws, Wittenberg missed 43 shots.  Wooster corralled 31 of those, for around 72%.  Not a bad job, but nothing spectacular.  Wooster, at the other end, only missed 25 shots, but Wittenberg only pulled in 13 of those boards, for 52%, which is really bad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 01, 2012, 10:25:42 PM
Just got back from a holiday event and it is great to see that Wooster picked up a huge road win at Witt! :)

As KiltedBryan noted, this win was a combination of great shooting (51%), a big rebounding advantage and some good defense that held the Tigers in check.

Wooster is now 5-1, 2-0 NCAC (both road wins). ;D  Next game is Wabash at home next Saturday afternoon 12/8.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 01, 2012, 11:16:15 PM
HOLY WINTERS!  I mean Holy Batman or whatever super hero you want to call him. Andy Winters of Ohio Wesleyan goes off for the first ever triple double in OWU history today.  12 points, 11 rebounds, and 13 assists.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 02, 2012, 10:35:51 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 28, 2012, 11:38:38 PM

And it's PIP WITT!  Gonna be a tough one, hoping there's video.

Would last night's beatdown of Witt qualify as 'PIPPING' Witt?   8-)

I tuned in about 5 minutes into the second half and I couldn't believe the score when it came up?!   :o

That said, I don't think I could have taken those Witt announcers much more than what I did endure.  I mean, at one point in the 2nd half, Brown took all his starters out and made a whole sale substitution and the play by play person for Witt then proceeded to wonder why Steve Moore wasn't doing the same implying that he was trying to pour it on poor Witt?!  There was still 10+ minutes left and these weren't the the kids at the end of the bench that Brown was bringing in.  ::)

I think this is the first time since I really started closely following the Scots that I saw a Witt/Woo game where Wooster actually had an advantage down low.  And it was a pretty significant advantage at that!  I've never seen a Bill Brown team lacking so much size.

That was Woo's largest MOV down in Springfield since they hung a hundy on Witt in 29 point win in the 2004 NCAC Championship game.  Also, I think the play by play guys said this was the lowest point total by Witt vs. Wooster since a 51-44 Wooster win in 1996. 

Lastly, when I turned on the game, I saw what I thought was graduated Clayton Black.  Then I realized it wasn't Black, but it Mini Black.  And then came Mini Black jr...  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 02, 2012, 10:57:05 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 02, 2012, 10:35:51 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 28, 2012, 11:38:38 PM

And it's PIP WITT!  Gonna be a tough one, hoping there's video.

Would last night's beatdown of Witt qualify as 'PIPPING' Witt?   8-)

I tuned in about 5 minutes into the second half and I couldn't believe the score when it came up?!   :o

That said, I don't think I could have taken those Witt announcers much more than what I did endure.  I mean, at one point in the 2nd half, Brown took all his starters out and made a whole sale substitution and the play by play person for Witt then proceeded to wonder why Steve Moore wasn't doing the same implying that he was trying to pour it on poor Witt?!  There was still 10+ minutes left and these weren't the the kids at the end of the bench that Brown was bringing in.  ::)

I think this is the first time since I really started closely following the Scots that I saw a Witt/Woo game where Wooster actually had an advantage down low.  And it was a pretty significant advantage at that!  I've never seen a Bill Brown team lacking so much size.

That was Woo's largest MOV down in Springfield since they hung a hundy on Witt in 29 point win in the 2004 NCAC Championship game.  Also, I think the play by play guys said this was the lowest point total by Witt vs. Wooster since a 51-44 Wooster win in 1996. 

Lastly, when I turned on the game, I saw what I thought was graduated Clayton Black.  Then I realized it wasn't Black, but it Mini Black.  And then came Mini Black jr...  ;D

Witt was pipped.  Clayton Black was cloned.  I listened to WQKT while watching, so missed the Wittenberg announcers.  Or, I didn't miss them.  Whatever.  Some guy named Seth was doing the broadcast for WQKT.  The whole night was bizarre.  I've never seen a Wooster opponent, even named Oberlin, shoot so badly.  Bizarre and wonderful. :)

Xavier Brown does a lot of good things, but he's going to break the record for turnovers at Wooster.  Heck, he might set the NCAA record.  He needs to heed Dillon Panther's coach Taylor's advice to rookie quarterback Matt Saracen:

"What you do is you look before you throw the ball.  You look and see where the defense is, and you see where our guys are.  You with me?  Then you throw the ball to OUR guys.  You got that?" :)

Pip Wabash! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 02, 2012, 02:05:06 PM
One other note on last night's Woo-Witt game.  Congrats to Coach Steve Moore on his 600th career win! ;D

Can't think of a better way to pick up #600 than last night's convincing win against your biggest rival. :)

The article in today's Daily Record states that Coach didn't even tell his players before the game that there was an opportunity for win #600.  Josh Claytor didn't know until the reporter informed him after the game.

You can find the article on this page:
http://www.the-daily-record.com/local%20sports
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 02, 2012, 02:24:33 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 02, 2012, 02:05:06 PM
One other note on last night's Woo-Witt game.  Congrats to Coach Steve Moore on his 600th career win! ;D

Actually, his 600th win at Wooster...Moore's nearing in on 700 career coaching victories (I believe he's about 10 away now).

Also of note, if I heard the broadcast correctly, Bill Brown is sitting on 599 career coaching victories, so would've been a milestone either way for the coaches last night.

Elsewhere, Mike DeWittt earned his 200th win at the helm of the Battling Bishops with the win yesterday. Congrats to Coach DeWitt!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 02, 2012, 05:02:37 PM
Well, I'm back. I finally remembered my uid/pw, having heretofore relied on cookies for that. I really have nothing to say beyond congrats to Steve Moore and Mike DeWitt, but thought maybe ya'll missed me.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 02, 2012, 06:04:03 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 02, 2012, 05:02:37 PM
Well, I'm back. I finally remembered my uid/pw, having heretofore relied on cookies for that. I really have nothing to say beyond congrats to Steve Moore and Mike DeWitt, but thought maybe ya'll missed me.  :)

Welcome back, 'Memphis'. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 04, 2012, 08:31:16 AM
Upcoming games of the non-conference and conference variety:

Tonight:

Wabash (2-3) @ Trine (3-2) - After a good win Saturday, the LG's head up to the far north-eastern corner of Indiana to face the Thunder. Will the Denison win give the young LG's confidence that seemingly vanished during the Rose-Hulman game? I think so. Trine's decent but not a world-beater and this is a good chance for a road win.

Wittenberg (4-1) @ Otterbein (2-3) - Wow, that was a shellacking on Saturday. The Old Tigers really know how to put up a stinker, don't they? Can they rebound? I think so. The Cardinals got whapped by Marietta Saturday and while the transitive property isn't really useful most of the time, Witt did beat the Pioneers by 10. This is a good chance for the Old Tigers to erase the memory of the Wooster game, at least short term.

Tomorrow:

Non-Conference:

Allegheny (3-3) @ Case Western Reserve (4-2) - The Gators face the NCAC nemesis Spartans who are 3-1 against the conference this season. Allegheny is a better team, and a road win would be great for the club. I don't see it, though. While CWRU isn't a top-notch UAA program, they're still a decent club and could make it rough on the rebuilding Gators.

Denison (3-3) @ Marietta (3-2) - Another road trip for the Big Red, this time to an OAC contender. The Pioneers blasted Otterbein this weekend, and could prove to be a tough road test for Denison. Dimonde Hale will need help from his mates for the Big Red to prevail here.

Conference:

Ohio Wesleyan (1-0, 5-1) @ Kenyon (1-0, 4-2) - Both teams are off to good starts. The Bishops have played a tougher schedule and have some national recognition. However, the Lords are a veteran team that seems to be able to win close games. This should be a good game and a good early-season conference test.

Oberlin (0-1, 1-5) @ Hiram (0-1, 1-2) - It's been a lost couple of weeks for the Terriers after losing to Denison and then getting waxed, big time, by their D-2 foes from Notre Dame. Oberlin may be a good tonic, but the Yeomen have played a lot of close games and may just need a win in a close game to break through. However, Hiram's madcap style will probably be a bit much for Oberlin, and the Terriers could ease to a win based on fatigue on the Yeoman's part.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on December 04, 2012, 04:36:58 PM
My picks:
Wabash over Trine by 8.
Witt over Otterbein by 5.
Case over Allegheny by 3.
Marietta over Denison by 13.
Ohio Wesleyan over Kenyon by 15.
Hiram over Oberlin by 14.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Lee Wilson on December 04, 2012, 09:27:16 PM
Wabash loses 77-69 in what B Harris purported to be a mighty physical game.  I only heard parts on the audio stream, but it sounded like Wabash made a surge in the second half, but came up short.  Sponsler (frosh) started and co-lead Wabash scorers with Hodges (11 points each) after missing a few with a knee injury and making a strong contribution in the Denison game.  Yet another tough one to build on.  Sounds like they're all going through some Sphinx Club "character building".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 04, 2012, 09:31:18 PM
Tough night for the NCAC. Wabash fell as Ralph said, and Witt lost to Otterbein 85-80. Zach Leahy and Sam Collins led the Old Tigers with 20.

NCAC is now 26-19 against non-conference opponents.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 05, 2012, 08:52:23 PM
Good news for the league, Allegheny upset CWRU 84-76.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 05, 2012, 09:07:15 PM
But bad news too.  Big Red fall to Marietta 89-66.  After leading by one at the half 38-37, Denison gets shut down. The Pioneers shot 57% on the night and outrebounded the Big Red by 38-25.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 05, 2012, 10:49:10 PM
By my count, NCAC now 27-20 vs. Non-Conference foes. Not been a good few days.

In the conference:

OWU beat Kenyon 81-69.

Oberlin shocks Hiram 55-51. The Yeomen were up 30-11 at one point in the first half and held on as the Terriers cut the gap to two with less than two minutes to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2012, 11:25:51 AM
Saturday, in the league...I think it is December 8th! Denison's taking the weekend off.

Non-Conference:

Kenyon (4-3) @ Albion (3-4) - Definitely this is a winnable game for the Lords. It's also one that they could lose quite handily. Kenyon's getting some good play but at times their vets have been inconsistent. Albion doesn't really have a good win in its ledger thus far. It'd be great if the Lords could whap the Britons and restore some of the shine for the NCAC.

Alma (2-4) @ Oberlin (2-5) - The Yeomen finally broke through with a close win over Hiram, yet they almost blew a huge lead. Now they host the struggling Scots in a game that may not be so easy for Oberlin. Alma's beaten B-W and Heidelberg after starting 0-3. Oberlin's going to have to play like they did in the first half against Hiram in order to come out with a victory.

Hiram (1-3) @ Youngstown State (5-4) - This is EXACTLY what the struggling Terriers need - a game against an improving D-1 team that has beaten Georgia, Bowling Green and George Washington this season. Besides a guarantee what does Hiram get out of this game?

Conference Games:

Wabash (1-0, 2-4) @ Wooster (2-0, 5-1) - Welcome to the big leagues, Little Giants. Wabash has struggled putting together back-to-back good halves, much less good games. The Scots have had a week to rest on their laurels after the huge win over Wittenberg and it wouldn't surprise me if they kept up the momentum with a big win. Coach Carpenter's could have a definite teaching moment here - one that could pay off in the long run. And who knows, the youngsters may not have any fear and loathing of Wooster, yet, so they'll just play ball and not care about whatever voodoo happens in Ohio.

Allegheny (0-1, 4-3) @ Wittenberg (0-1, 4-2) - Well, so much for the good start by the Old Tigers. It thudded to the ground against Wooster and then slid off of the stage against Otterbein. Now they play host to a quite improved Allegheny squad. In football, this would be a game that Wittenberg would just set out to destroy their opponent mercilessly. I don't think they'll blow out the Gators, though. Their win over CWRU showed that they have improved a great deal.

DePauw (0-1, 4-2) @ Ohio Wesleyan (2-0, 6-1) - The Bishops are asserting themselves as a close pursuer of Wooster in the NCAC thus far, having rebounded nicely from their loss to Rochester. The New Tigers are enigmatic, eking out close wins over teams they should be blowing out, and then not winning some winnable games (such as their loss to Kenyon). The NCAC middle will be a muddle amongst four or five teams, and OWU will need to hold serve against that muddle to contend. They should on Saturday.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 07, 2012, 01:58:08 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2012, 11:25:51 AM

Kenyon (4-3) @ Albion (3-4) - Definitely this is a winnable game for the Lords. It's also one that they could lose quite handily. Kenyon's getting some good play but at times their vets have been inconsistent. Albion doesn't really have a good win in its ledger thus far. It'd be great if the Lords could whap the Britons and restore some of the shine for the NCAC.


I'm not familiar with whap, is this a technical term? :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2012, 02:16:13 PM
Quote from: sac on December 07, 2012, 01:58:08 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2012, 11:25:51 AM

Kenyon (4-3) @ Albion (3-4) - Definitely this is a winnable game for the Lords. It's also one that they could lose quite handily. Kenyon's getting some good play but at times their vets have been inconsistent. Albion doesn't really have a good win in its ledger thus far. It'd be great if the Lords could whap the Britons and restore some of the shine for the NCAC.


I'm not familiar with whap, is this a technical term? :)

HAH.

You could own some WHAP: http://www.okharris.com/current/press68p.htm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 07, 2012, 02:58:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2012, 02:16:13 PM
Quote from: sac on December 07, 2012, 01:58:08 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2012, 11:25:51 AM

Kenyon (4-3) @ Albion (3-4) - Definitely this is a winnable game for the Lords. It's also one that they could lose quite handily. Kenyon's getting some good play but at times their vets have been inconsistent. Albion doesn't really have a good win in its ledger thus far. It'd be great if the Lords could whap the Britons and restore some of the shine for the NCAC.


I'm not familiar with whap, is this a technical term? :)

HAH.

You could own some WHAP: http://www.okharris.com/current/press68p.htm

I'm sorry I don't have any stats on Albion's artistic abilities.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 07, 2012, 09:00:25 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2012, 11:25:51 AM
And who knows, the youngsters may not have any fear and loathing of Wooster...
Well, that's understandable.  Wooster: Fear and Loathing 101 being the most popular course on the Wabash campus, it certainly fills up early in the fall.  Lots of the new guys won't have it under their belts until their sophomore years.  Does Wally still teach this? :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 07, 2012, 09:05:02 PM
Quote from: sac on December 07, 2012, 01:58:08 PM
I'm not familiar with whap, is this a technical term? :)

I thought that everyone knew the technical term was pip.  ::)

Pip Wabash!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2012, 10:38:00 PM
Life would be boring if we all used the same modifiers...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 08, 2012, 03:22:29 PM
Just getting a chance to tune into Woo-Bash, and *my goodness* it's all Wooster in this one. 79-40 (!) with 9 minutes left.

Xavier Brown with an incredible game - 35 pts, 13-17 fg, 5-5 3pts, 4-4 fts plus 4 assists and 0 turnovers. Wow.

Anyone have any clue the last time that Wooster beat both Witt and Wabash by 15+?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 08, 2012, 03:46:59 PM
And it's Wabash 56, Wooster 97, final.

Great game for Xavier Brown, but I basically only saw the part of this one where the starters were sitting comfortably on the pine, so I'll let others provide insight and commentary.

Two stats stick out: Wabash only shot 29% (second straight opponent Wooster's kept under 30%) and Wooster only committed 5 turnovers against Wabash's 17. That's definitely a season-low for the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 08, 2012, 04:04:24 PM
Two quick thoughts:

1) I'm still in a little bit of disbelief that people were wondering if Wooster would come around this season. It's as if the previous 20+ of coach Moore at Wooster never happened.

2) I said this a couple of times last year, but Xavier Brown is the most TALENTED player (note there is a difference between most talented and most effective) I've ever seen play at Wooster, and that dates back to the early 1990s. It remains to be seen how is whole career pans out, and what he can do in the postseason, but I don't there is much of argument right now based on where he stands in just his 37th career game. I also think he is the most talented player the NCAC has seen in a long, long time. I'd say since at least Estelle played the one year in the NCAC with Wabash. Now, I'm sure some are going to scoff a little bit at this, but if you watch him consistently like I have, I don't think there is even a hesitation. And the one thing that doesn't get acknowledged is how hard he plays, including the defensive end. He also logs an incredible amount of minutes and never gets tired. His only problem so far has been turnovers, but hopefully today is the beginning of the end of those issues.

And by the way, today was maybe the best individual performance I have seen a Wooster player put on. I'm not saying most important, obviously, but just a pure performance, it was incredible. Not one of his 13 field goals came on a layup. He also would have had two or three more assists except guys either missed easy shots or got fouled in transition and therefore didn't score a field goal. And he did all of this in just 25 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 08, 2012, 05:00:19 PM
Two close ones in the other league matchups:

Allegheny 63
Wittenberg 67

DePauw 59
Ohio Wesleyan 61
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 08, 2012, 05:17:33 PM
Alma bested Oberlin 71-57. Now 27-21 vs. Non Conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 08, 2012, 10:10:11 PM
Kenyon beat Albion, 70-65.

As expected Hiram got blitzed by Youngstown State 71-44.

28-22 vs. Non-Conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 09, 2012, 10:04:27 AM
From this morning's Wooster Daily Record:

"The Fighting Scots could get even stronger for the second half of the season if 2011 Wooster High graduate Alex LaLonde joins the team as expected.  Word is that LaLonde, a 6-foot-5 small forward, plans to leave the Air Force Academy, where he played on their prep school team, and enroll at The COW.  Under NCAA Div. III rules, LaLonde would be immediately eligible to play for the Scots as soon as his application is accepted. Scots coach Steve Moore said he can't comment on any transfer until he's been accepted to enroll at the school."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2012, 09:50:04 AM
Many schools have finals this week, so it's slim pickings. There are two conference games and two non-conference games in the next three days:

Today (December 10):

Denison (1-1, 3-4) @ Oberlin (1-1, 2-6) - Both teams are coming off of tough non-conference losses. The Big Red was run out of the gym by Marietta while the Yeomen never got untracked against Alma. Denison, I think, has more to lose here because if they want to stay in the running for a mid-pack finish and a first-round home game they need to win games like this. Oberlin's kept a lot of their recent games close, and it wouldn't surprise me if they kept hanging around until the end.

December 11:

Kenyon (1-1, 5-3) @ Denison (1-1, 3-4) - What is this the NBA? When's the last time there was a non-tournament back-to-back, or conference teams playing back-to-back conference games? At any rate, another big early season matchup between teams in the muddled middle of the conference. The fight for the #4 seed is going to be fierce. Kenyon has won three of four so they have a little bit of momentum, but anything's possible. If this was a swim meet there'd be blood in the water, alas, just an early season hoops game.

December 12:

Thiel (6-1) @ Allegheny (4-4) - With one more win the Gators equal their 2011-12 total. Will it come against the Tomcats? Well, why not? Thiel has a gaudy record but the only really good team that they played (Bethany) whapped them a good one. The Tomcats could come into this game angry, but Allegheny's played pretty good ball over the first part of the year so it wouldn't be a total shock if they stunned Thiel.

Grove City (1-6) @ Oberlin (2-6) - This is a good chance of a win for the league. The Yeomen are struggling, yes, but so are the Wolverines with their only win against a dismal Waynesburg squad. The PrAC isn't know for good hoops, so for the NCAC to keep up their good non-conference record they need to take games like this.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 10, 2012, 10:52:54 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 08, 2012, 04:04:24 PM
Two quick thoughts:

1) I'm still in a little bit of disbelief that people were wondering if Wooster would come around this season. It's as if the previous 20+ of coach Moore at Wooster never happened.


I don't think it was a matter of people questioning 'if' Wooster would come around this year as much as when.  And I think it is because of Coach Moore and his ability to coach his teams up is why most people were not questioning if but rather how long it would take for Moore to be able to coach this team up.

I totally agree with you on Brown.  What an amazing performance he put on Saturday afternoon!  I swear, that basket must have seemed like the size of the ocean for Brown on Saturday!  Kid couldn't miss and he was just filling it every shot he took!

Interesing news on Wooster High Alum Alex LaLonde returning home to joing the Scots on the hardwood.  Although, looking at the Scots already deep, athletic and talented rotation, I'm wondering how much playing time he will actually see?  He'll definitely have to earn his spot in this deep and talented rotation.

And that brings me to a scary thought for the rest of the league.  I read where 13 of the 18 players on Wabash's roster are either freshmen or sophomores and their youth may have factored into the lopsided Wooster win.  Well, what about Wooster's youth?  Yes, the Scots have 2 senior starters, but outside of that, Doug Thorpe is the only major contributor on this team that isn't a freshmen or sophomore!  Woo's other 3 starters (Brown, Goodwin and Pannell) are all sophomores.  Of the other bench players, Kenny DeBoer is a sophomore and Geoff FuQuay and Josh Kipfer are both frosh.  So, 6 of Wooster's top 9 in their rotation are freshmen or sophomores!  Scary thought for the rest of the NCAC at just how young this team is and how much better they will become as they gain more experience and coaching! 

Oh, and I can't tell you how enjoyable it was watching Wooster run away and hide from Wabash!  After losing both of their early encounters with Witt and Wabash last season which put Wooster in a hole they couldn't climb out of in their bid for an 8th straight NCAC title, do you think Wooster just might have had these 2 games circled on their calendars?  I don't think it was any coincidence that these last two games were by far the most complete performances of the season from the Scots!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 10, 2012, 08:01:17 PM
Awesome video from Oberlin tonight!  High def and perfect clarity.  Will enjoy watching this game regardless of outcome (and I am concerned).

Congratulations to Oberlin for figuring out how to do it! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 10, 2012, 08:33:51 PM
And concerned for good reason.  Oberlin leading 30-22 at halftime.  Austin Little on fire with 13 and 4 of 5 from 3 pt. land, while Dimonde has yet to score.  Not a surprise when he's playing with his back to the basket and 6'9" Ollie is underneath. 

Ball's getting kicked out but long shots aren't dropping.  Big Red need to either start making the long ball or bring Dimonde out to win this one.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2012, 08:57:31 PM
Oberlin's videos are really nice this year and the announcers are good. I was fearing a broadcast like the OWU football team's crew.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 10, 2012, 09:32:27 PM
Have to commend Oberlin on the broadcast and their play.  Yeomen win 52-51.  Not a well-played game on either side, really, but Oberlin defended well and did what they needed to do to stop Hale and win the game.

I hope all the NCAC (and other D3) SID's get in touch with Oberlin to find out how they're connecting to the web.  Very nice video tonight!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fsant on December 10, 2012, 09:35:16 PM
Yeomen   3rd place!
Go Yeo!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2012, 09:40:34 PM
Quote from: GoRed on December 10, 2012, 09:32:27 PM
Have to commend Oberlin on the broadcast and their play.  Yeomen win 52-51.  Not a well-played game on either side, really, but Oberlin defended well and did what they needed to do to stop Hale and win the game.

I hope all the NCAC (and other D3) SID's get in touch with Oberlin to find out how they're connecting to the web.  Very nice video tonight!

It also helps when the best video locations are generally unencumbered by fans!  ;)

Good win in another close game for the Yeomen, and another tough loss for the Big Red. Did they use up all of their Cinderella dust last year?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 10, 2012, 10:56:08 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 10, 2012, 09:40:34 PM
Quote from: GoRed on December 10, 2012, 09:32:27 PM
Have to commend Oberlin on the broadcast and their play.  Yeomen win 52-51.  Not a well-played game on either side, really, but Oberlin defended well and did what they needed to do to stop Hale and win the game.

I hope all the NCAC (and other D3) SID's get in touch with Oberlin to find out how they're connecting to the web.  Very nice video tonight!

It also helps when the best video locations are generally unencumbered by fans!  ;)

Good win in another close game for the Yeomen, and another tough loss for the Big Red. Did they use up all of their Cinderella dust last year?

Yeah, Wabash could stick their cameras in the co-ed section! :)  It was Tinkerbell who used dust, tossing it in the eyes of the defender when she went to the hoop.  Since been outlawed in DIII.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 11, 2012, 05:45:11 PM
New Top 25 is out and the NCAC has two teams represented this week!

Wooster climbs to #12 up from #16 and OWU cracks the top 25 and checks in this week at #23.   :)

Btw, the only team to beat Wooster so far this year (Adrian) is up to #14 this week and are currently 7-0 on the young season...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 11, 2012, 09:42:48 PM
And of course Denison reverses course and beats Kenyon today 74-70, despite double / doubles for Nwadibia and Lebowitz. Kenyon shot 9-16 from the FT line and that seemed to be their undoing.

So the muddled middle of the NCAC is truly muddled. I have a feeling that positions 4-10 will be hotly contested...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 13, 2012, 07:49:29 PM
Hey, I got busy and missed the good news! NCAC went 2-0 yesterday!

Allegheny beat Thiel 86-75 in double OT! The Gators have matched their victory total from last year.
Oberlin bested Grove City 57-55.

2-0 vs. the PrAC (as it should be) and 30-22 overall vs. non-conference foes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 13, 2012, 08:03:04 PM
Another slight docket this weekend, as this is the real break before Holiday tourney action.

Tomorrow:

Wooster (3-0, 6-1) @ Kenyon (1-2, 5-4) - Wooster showed no quarter to Wabash Saturday, blasting the LG's back to C'ville with dispatch. After finals break they travel to Gambier for the rare Friday NCAC game with the Lords. Kenyon's been very inconsistent and they lost a tough one to Denison earlier in the week. Unless the Kenyon vets really step up and the supplemental cast contributes, the Scots should roll past the Lords with ease.

Saturday:

Waynesburg (2-6) @ Hiram (1-4) - This begins the PrAC tour for the Terriers. It comes at a good time, as Hiram is reeling, having lost four in a row. Waynesburg's not doing much better as they've dropped their past three contest including one to bottom feeder Grove City. Hiram has a great opportunity in these games to right the ship before their trip to Vegas after Christmas.

Ohio Christian (5-4) @ Wittenberg (5-2) - The Old Tigers steadied themselves a bit by beating a game Allegheny squad and now face the Trailblazers, an NCCAA power that went 27-10 last year. Of course, being an NCCAA power is probably not quite the same as being a D-3 power, so your mileage may vary. OCU faces Valor Christian tonight - the college run by Rod Parsley. I wonder if the basketballs at Valor are anointed with oil. If so, won't there be a lot of turnovers?



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 13, 2012, 10:00:43 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 13, 2012, 08:03:04 PMOhio Christian (5-4) @ Wittenberg (5-2) - The Old Tigers steadied themselves a bit by beating a game Allegheny squad and now face the Trailblazers, an NCCAA power that went 27-10 last year. Of course, being an NCCAA power is probably not quite the same as being a D-3 power, so your mileage may vary. OCU faces Valor Christian tonight - the college run by Rod Parsley. I wonder if the basketballs at Valor are anointed with oil. If so, won't there be a lot of turnovers?

Valor Christian is, I'm pretty sure, the only institution of higher learning in the U.S. whose men's basketball head coach is a woman. (http://www.valorcollege.com/Athletics/CoachBradley.aspx) I think that that's kinda cool, actually.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 13, 2012, 10:36:44 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 13, 2012, 10:00:43 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 13, 2012, 08:03:04 PMOhio Christian (5-4) @ Wittenberg (5-2) - The Old Tigers steadied themselves a bit by beating a game Allegheny squad and now face the Trailblazers, an NCCAA power that went 27-10 last year. Of course, being an NCCAA power is probably not quite the same as being a D-3 power, so your mileage may vary. OCU faces Valor Christian tonight - the college run by Rod Parsley. I wonder if the basketballs at Valor are anointed with oil. If so, won't there be a lot of turnovers?

Valor Christian is, I'm pretty sure, the only institution of higher learning in the U.S. whose men's basketball head coach is a woman. (http://www.valorcollege.com/Athletics/CoachBradley.aspx) I think that that's kinda cool, actually.

Very surprising, too!

I've never thought there was any reason a woman couldn't coach a men's basketball team, seriously.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 14, 2012, 07:12:55 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 13, 2012, 10:36:44 PM
I've never thought there was any reason a woman couldn't coach a men's basketball team, seriously.

Other than why would they want to lower themselves, I agree. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 14, 2012, 09:08:59 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 13, 2012, 10:36:44 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 13, 2012, 10:00:43 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 13, 2012, 08:03:04 PMOhio Christian (5-4) @ Wittenberg (5-2) - The Old Tigers steadied themselves a bit by beating a game Allegheny squad and now face the Trailblazers, an NCCAA power that went 27-10 last year. Of course, being an NCCAA power is probably not quite the same as being a D-3 power, so your mileage may vary. OCU faces Valor Christian tonight - the college run by Rod Parsley. I wonder if the basketballs at Valor are anointed with oil. If so, won't there be a lot of turnovers?

Valor Christian is, I'm pretty sure, the only institution of higher learning in the U.S. whose men's basketball head coach is a woman. (http://www.valorcollege.com/Athletics/CoachBradley.aspx) I think that that's kinda cool, actually.

Very surprising, too!

I've never thought there was any reason a woman couldn't coach a men's basketball team, seriously.
Pat Head Summitt's name used to come up in connection to men's jobs from time to time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 14, 2012, 09:12:43 PM
Final:  Wooster 89  Kenyon 62  :)

Scots had 4 scorers in double figures tonight - Xavier Brown 15, Jalen Goodwin 15, Doug Thorpe 15 and Kenny DeBoer with 11.  Wooster shot 47% from the floor while holding the Lords to only 39%

Wooster dominated the boards by a 52 to 35 count with Jake Mays 10 and Josh Claytor 9 leading the way.

Kenyon was led tonight by Ikenna Nwadibia with 21 points and John Bray who had 11 points.

Wooster is now 7-1, 4-0 NCAC with 3 of those wins on the road. ;D   Next game is at Transy on 12/18.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 16, 2012, 01:25:21 PM
Quote from: fsant on December 10, 2012, 09:35:16 PM
Yeomen   3rd place!
Go Yeo!

Excellent point - with Oberlin now at 2-1 in the NCAC and in sole possession of 3rd place, when was the last time that the Yeomen were this high in the conference standings? :)  I thought Oberlin also played a very solid game against Wooster (only lost by 8 points) and their talent level seems higher this year.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 16, 2012, 01:38:02 PM
Who likes these 4 team tournaments with all 4 games prescheduled?  Wooster has set up the Mose Hole tourney this year so they will definitely play both John Carroll and Marietta which are the two strongest teams invited to this tourney.  Wooster is being smart to avoid playing Geneva (now 1-8) which would only hurt the Scots' strength of schedule.

On the other hand, the Transylvania tourney where Wooster plays this Tuesday/Wednesday has the two best teams on paper not meeting each other due to the prescheduled format.  Both #7 Franklin & Marshall (7-0) and #12 Wooster (7-1) will be at Transy this week but cannot play each other because there is no true championship game.  >:(

Obviously, prescheduling occurs because teams often want more in-region games (for NCAA tourney selection) or because they either want to meet or avoid certain opponents (like not playing a conference team another time which is why Transy probably prescheduled their tourney).  Other thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 16, 2012, 02:17:51 PM
I always thought it was kind of 'phony' to call it a tournament and pre-schedule games, much like the mega-D1 tourneys that now invite scrubs to play at a major school site for the 'first round', advance the major automatically anyway, and then the scrubs play in their own little satellite tourney. FAU was 'in' the Maui Classic but were never, ever going to earn a trip to Maui.


I do think it's the regionality issue and the desire to improve SOS that is dictating these schedules. Used to be that a team like Geneva would be automatic first round fodder for a host.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 16, 2012, 02:19:25 PM
As expected, Hiram bests Waynesburg yesterday 74-62 and Wittenberg beats Ohio Christian 71-61. NCAC now 32-22 non-conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: dahlby on December 16, 2012, 02:22:04 PM
wooscotsfan:
I think you answered your own question in your closing paragraph.
In Southern California, where all teams are members of the same conference,
as well as the northwest, where you have the same situation, these four team/game pods
are great. For example, this week Chapman and Redlands host Whitworth and Willamette.
These type of pods happen several times during pre-conference play. It gives all teams involved
extra in-region games against quality opponents. Additionally, when the games
are scheduled in the same location it cuts down on the costs. Mosts pods become home and home
contests for the following year. This eliminates having to play a fellow conference member in a non-conference game.
This works well for the NW and SOCAL, but maybe not for other geographical areas where you might
have one or more conferences within the same geographical areas, such as Illinois, Iowa and Wisc.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 17, 2012, 12:09:45 PM
We have non-conference games this week involving five of the ten squads. Let's get to them!

Tonight:

DePauw (4-3) @ Rose-Hulman (9-1) - It's really hard to score on the Engineers. I mean, really hard. The most points R-H has given up this season is 61, against a pretty decent Hanover team. Ask Wabash about the Engineers' defense. DePauw has some offensive weapons, but they've been inconsistent lately. It could be a long night for the New Tigers in Terre Haute. Wait, I've been to Terre Haute. Every night's a long night there (ba-dum-ching...)

Washington & Jefferson (3-6) @ Hiram (2-4) - The Terriers are in their 'pillowy soft PrAC' portion of their non-conference schedule. This is a game they should, nay, must win to keep up momentum they regained against Waynesburg. Odds are good they will.

Hanover (5-3) @ Wabash (2-5) - Speaking of Hanover, the Panthers are decent but not world-beating. A young Little Giants squad that probably has been duly taught a lesson by Wooster could find redemption in a home win. It's been a long time since Wabash won a game (December 1) and I'm sure they're hungry for a W.

Tomorrow (Dec. 18)

Wooster (7-1) @ Transylvania (5-3) - A Scots team that is rolling travels to beautiful (?) Lexington to face the Pioneers in the Don Lane Classic. It's not easy to play down there, historically, but Transy was upset by Manchester at home on the 8th. I do not think Wooster will be fazed in the slightest by the trip down there and hopefully will bring glory for the league against the HCAC.

Wednesday (Dec. 19)

Kalamazoo (2-6) @ DePauw (4-3) - This is a 1P start, a 'businessman's special' as it were for the good folks in Greendingle. Those hooky-playing suit wearers will see a Hornets team mired in a five-game slide. As we've seen, though, the New Tigers always keeps bad teams close at hand and sometimes it bites them. I think this will be a good rebound for DPU's offense after the R-H game, though.

Wooster (7-1) vs. Mt. St. Joseph (5-3) @ Transylvania - Game two of the Don Lane Classic is another NCAC / HCAC brawl. The Lions are undefeated in conference play but haven't played anyone worth much in their league (except they did beat the Manchester team that upset Transylvania). Look for the Scots to scoot out of Kentucky with the league's pride intact (and a 2-0 record to boot).

Westminster (PA) (2-4) @ Hiram (2-4) - Game three of the "Bang the PrAC Bums Slowly" tour finds Hiram facing woe-begone Westminster. The Titans started out 2-0 and have fallen on hard times and may be in the midst of a five-game slide if they can't beat LaRoche tonight. Hiram could get to .500, which will do wonders for its confidence as it tries to recover in the muddled middle on the NCAC.

UC-Clermont (4-12) @ Wittenberg (6-2) - The Old Tigers face the Cougars, who spent the weekend getting obliterated by Bellarmine and Southern Indiana in the Bellarmine tournament. Did Wittenberg have trouble scheduling games to play? I can imagine UC-Clermont may think this is a respite after acting as a tomato can for NAIA-I and D-2 squads recently. However, we know the caliber of ball the Old Tigers can play if they put their mind to it. This may be interesting to watch.

Wabash (2-5) @ Franklin (4-4) - Another HCAC foe for the league, this time the Grizzlies. On the gridiron, this would be a must-see game, but on the hardwood it's two teams searching for an identity. The LG's would like nothing but to prove that their recent woes are gone for good, and that means playing two good games in a row against the HCAC. As mediocre as Frankin is, Wabash will need a decent effort to win.





Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 17, 2012, 09:22:48 PM
Wabash really wanted to give it away. After leading by double digits in the second half the LGs kept missing crucial FTs down the stretch. Yet, Hanover missed a shot at the end and the Wabash prevailed 61-59. Daniel Purvlicis had a double double with 18 points and 11 boards.

More good news for the league - Hiram beat W & J 79-69 behind Alan Sheppard's 19.

The New Tigers fell to Rose-Hulman, as expected, 52-39. Barry Flynn led DPU with 11.

34-23 in non-conference!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 18, 2012, 09:54:01 PM
Pretty quiet on the board tonight.  Wasn't there a game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 18, 2012, 10:37:50 PM
Quote from: GoRed on December 18, 2012, 09:54:01 PM
Pretty quiet on the board tonight.  Wasn't there a game?

I'm not sure, I'm still celebrating making you look like a fool for saying Wooster was no good in 2011 when they went to the national title game, which you then followed up by more less dismissing as a fluke.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 18, 2012, 10:41:41 PM
Quote from: GoRed on December 18, 2012, 09:54:01 PM
Pretty quiet on the board tonight.  Wasn't there a game?

For my part, I was working late and missed the game entirely, other than seeing that Wooster lost, which didn't surprise me that much. A quick look at the box indicates no single decisive factor, so I'm hoping a Scots fan that went or listened to it will provide more info. So far Wooster has managed to lose to the two best teams on its schedule, though both games could have gone either way.

The Beck Center at Transy has not been a kind location to the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 18, 2012, 10:58:28 PM
I didn't see the game either, but the foul shooting differential really jumps off the page. Turnovers, which has been a problem for the Scots, wasn't really tonight. The big problem was the foul trouble of Claytor and Mays. Claytor especially has had a number of games where his minutes have been limited because of fouls. Mays took a goose egg on rebounds in over 20 minutes tonight, which is reminiscent of previous years efforts, not this year. So hopefully it was just an off night.

What matters now for Wooster is the next three games. They have a chance to play three in-region teams that will likely finish at or above .500. If they can win all three, tonight's loss will be small blip, as they will have some nice non-conference wins under their belt when the regional rankings start to come out. Lose one more, then you are starting to cut into the margin of error for an at large bid if one is necessary later in the season. I expect a nice bounce back effort tomorrow and at the Mose Hole, but let's see what happens and who steps up their game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 18, 2012, 11:00:57 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 18, 2012, 10:41:41 PM
Quote from: GoRed on December 18, 2012, 09:54:01 PM
Pretty quiet on the board tonight.  Wasn't there a game?

For my part, I was working late and missed the game entirely, other than seeing that Wooster lost, which didn't surprise me that much. A quick look at the box indicates no single decisive factor, so I'm hoping a Scots fan that went or listened to it will provide more info. So far Wooster has managed to lose to the two best teams on its schedule, though both games could have gone either way.

The Beck Center at Transy has not been a kind location to the Scots.

I'd say there was quite a big foul disparity which was a pretty decisive factor in the game.  Wooster was whistled for 26 fouls compared to just 15 on Transy.  That translated into 36 ft attempts for Transy.  They only made 21 but still, Wooster only had 15 ft attempts for the game.

You are right though in that the Beck Center has not been friendly confines for Wooster. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 18, 2012, 11:14:16 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 18, 2012, 11:00:57 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 18, 2012, 10:41:41 PM
Quote from: GoRed on December 18, 2012, 09:54:01 PM
Pretty quiet on the board tonight.  Wasn't there a game?

For my part, I was working late and missed the game entirely, other than seeing that Wooster lost, which didn't surprise me that much. A quick look at the box indicates no single decisive factor, so I'm hoping a Scots fan that went or listened to it will provide more info. So far Wooster has managed to lose to the two best teams on its schedule, though both games could have gone either way.

The Beck Center at Transy has not been a kind location to the Scots.

I'd say there was quite a big foul disparity which was a pretty decisive factor in the game.  Wooster was whistled for 26 fouls compared to just 15 on Transy.  That translated into 36 ft attempts for Transy.  They only made 21 but still, Wooster only had 15 ft attempts for the game.

You are right though in that the Beck Center has not been friendly confines for Wooster.

I missed the foul differential (it was a *really* quick look at the box...) Tough for the Scots to have Claytor and Mays both in trouble...and I see now that Thorpe actually led the Scots with 7 boards. Probably won't happen that often this year.

The '06 NCAA loss at Transy has always really stuck with me. That was a Salem-capable team that beat eventual national runner-up Wittenberg 2 out of 3 times. If I remember the bracket correctly, had Wooster beaten Transy, we would've had Woo-Witt game #4 that year in the Sweet Sixteen. That would've been something.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 18, 2012, 11:18:19 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 18, 2012, 11:14:16 PM
The '06 NCAA loss at Transy has always really stuck with me. That was a Salem-capable team that beat eventual national runner-up Wittenberg 2 out of 3 times. If I remember the bracket correctly, had Wooster beaten Transy, we would've had Woo-Witt game #4 that year in the Sweet Sixteen. That would've been something.

Actually, it would have been the Elite 8. That's when Transy lost to Witt. I can't remember who Transy beat in the Sweet 16 (maybe Maryville?), but they won fairly convincingly.

It's a little curious that Xavier Brown went a combined 7-for-8 from three-point range against Wittenberg and Wabash (and leads the NCAC in three-point percentage), including 5-for-5 against the Little Giants, but hasn't taken a single three-point shot in the last two games, a combined 68 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 18, 2012, 11:24:33 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 18, 2012, 11:18:19 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 18, 2012, 11:14:16 PM
The '06 NCAA loss at Transy has always really stuck with me. That was a Salem-capable team that beat eventual national runner-up Wittenberg 2 out of 3 times. If I remember the bracket correctly, had Wooster beaten Transy, we would've had Woo-Witt game #4 that year in the Sweet Sixteen. That would've been something.

Actually, it would have been the Elite 8. That's when Transy lost to Witt. I can't remember who Transy beat in the Sweet 16 (maybe Maryville?), but they won fairly convincingly.

Transylvania beat Mississippi College, Wittenberg beat Hope in other sweet 16 game in Springfield. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 18, 2012, 11:27:15 PM
Quote from: sac on December 18, 2012, 11:24:33 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 18, 2012, 11:18:19 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 18, 2012, 11:14:16 PM
The '06 NCAA loss at Transy has always really stuck with me. That was a Salem-capable team that beat eventual national runner-up Wittenberg 2 out of 3 times. If I remember the bracket correctly, had Wooster beaten Transy, we would've had Woo-Witt game #4 that year in the Sweet Sixteen. That would've been something.

Actually, it would have been the Elite 8. That's when Transy lost to Witt. I can't remember who Transy beat in the Sweet 16 (maybe Maryville?), but they won fairly convincingly.

Transylvania beat Mississippi College, Wittenberg beat Hope in other sweet 16 game in Springfield. 


Sac's right (as per usual, with anything involving Hope). Here's the recap for the Hope-Witt game: http://www.wittenbergtigers.com/sports/mbkb/2005-06/releases/20120813qlb2sc

Looks like it was close - Hope came back and tied it with 5 mins to go but couldn't take a lead.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 18, 2012, 11:32:03 PM
The Witt/Hope game is one of two consecutive outs in the tournament where Hope had just a terrible time making shots they had made all season.  The next year against Wash U over in Stevens Point was just as memorable for the same reason.


I don't remember much of the Transylvania/Miss College game other than  Transy was clearly better esp on the defensive end.  I also remember thinking that with so many fans there in attendance (400/500 maybe) it amazed me that not one could find a computer and log on to D3hoops.com.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 18, 2012, 11:32:29 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 18, 2012, 10:37:50 PM
Quote from: GoRed on December 18, 2012, 09:54:01 PM
Pretty quiet on the board tonight.  Wasn't there a game?

I'm not sure, I'm still celebrating making you look like a fool for saying Wooster was no good in 2011 when they went to the national title game, which you then followed up by more less dismissing as a fluke.

Well, that's right neighborly...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 19, 2012, 01:01:16 AM
Due to not paying attention to the early start time, I missed the entire first half.  After the break, Wooster quickly fell further behind and had to play catch-up all game.  The Scots still don't enter the ball into the post very often, but tonight I'm not sure I blame them, as usually nothing good happened.  Transy's defense was generally very good, and Wooster had to work hard to get shots.  There were a few available threes, and they shot them well, but I don't remember Brown passing up any looks.

Really, there are only two ways to get an open three.  Help from your teammates (good in-and-out passing, high picks) or a defender that gets lax and sags off.  Creating your own three really doesn't work much; I mean, you have to be moving horizontally along the three-point line, then somehow squaring up, etc.

Even though the video was quite good, it's tough to determine from a stream if the calls were justified or not.  Claytor was pretty annoyed, though, and even picked up a technical while sitting on the bench after the game had been decided.

I'm rambling here; it's late and I'm mostly asleep.  But kudos to the Scots for making a nice comeback and almost pulling it out.  Transy helped by missing a lot of free throws down the stretch.  Wooster had some nice ball movement in the last minutes, although it still didn't involve the post guys much.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2012, 09:42:25 AM
NCAC now 34-24 non-conference with some big games tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2012, 11:15:32 AM
I'm flummoxed on how Transylvania lost to Manchester at home. Maybe they didn't get the 'home cooking' calls? Maybe none of the refs in the Wooster game were from Ohio?

I KID! I KID!!!  ;)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 19, 2012, 06:00:13 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 19, 2012, 01:01:16 AMReally, there are only two ways to get an open three.  Help from your teammates (good in-and-out passing, high picks) or a defender that gets lax and sags off.  Creating your own three really doesn't work much; I mean, you have to be moving horizontally along the three-point line, then somehow squaring up, etc.

You can create your own three if you've developed the jab-and-stepback. That's a skill that doesn't seem to be practiced by a lot of players nowadays, for reasons I can't fathom. Like the midrange pull-up and the up-and-under post move, it's not utilized nearly as much anymore as it should be. But the jab-and-stepback can be a devastating move for a shooter to use to get his own shot if he's good at it; NPU had a player back at the turn of the millennium, the late Rick Alspach (251 career treys), who turned it into an art form.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2012, 06:19:15 PM
Or you could do the ol' Les Selvage method. Just chuck it from way down town whenever or wherever.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 19, 2012, 08:27:06 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 19, 2012, 06:19:15 PM
Or you could do the ol' Les Selvage method. Just chuck it from way down town whenever or wherever.

I wish I'd seen that guy play.  In Terry Pluto's great book on the ABA, Loose Balls, Selvage is mentioned early on, I think by his own general manager in San Diego.  To paraphrase: "Yeah, I remember Les Selvage.  He took a lot of threes.  I don't remember a lot of them going in." :)

My favorite chucker of all time was 6'7" George Stone of Marshall University.  I saw him play in the mid-sixties, at the old Madison Square Garden in New York.  It was either in their ECAC Holiday Classic or the NIT.  Now, this was years before there were three-pointers in college.  At any rate, Stone started making some long jumpers, from the foul line-extended on the right side.  Twenty footers.  After he hit three or four of these, somebody started guarding him out there.  No problem, Stone simply backed up and made a few more.  He continued this strategy, retreating and heaving.  By halftime he was shooting from what I swear was thirty-five feet, right in front of the scorer's table, and they were STILL going in!  Somebody else must have taken note of this, because he ended up playing a few years in the ABA.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 19, 2012, 10:52:22 PM
Was there a game tonight? Why yes, there was. Wooster rebounds with a 65-52 win over Mt. St. Joseph.

http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/releases/20121219acg1h3

Jake Mays bounces back by leading all players with 16 points and 8 rebounds. Probably the biggest note from tonight's game is that Claytor didn't start. I guess the coaching staff is sending a little bit of a message that Claytor needs to elevate his level of play. Claytor has not played as well this season, and hopefully this gets him going.

The other interesting takeaway from tonight is that Transylvania is starting to live up to its preseason ranking, as it disposed of #9 Franklin & Marshall 86-73. I think the loss to Transy will be seen as a lost opportunity to post a really good in region win more than a bad loss. Hopefully Wingard, who absence has been overlooked, will be back in time for the Mose Hole. He is Wooster's best freshman and someone who can provide instant offense. Throw in LaLonde, who will likely start playing in early January, and the Scots should be getting more offensive reinforcements in the next few weeks. The key will be to continue to play solid defense and get Claytor to play with more passion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2012, 11:23:06 PM
There were other games as well, of course:

DPU cruised past Kalamazoo 76-46.
Hiram continued it's PrAC mastery in besting Westminster 81-62
Wittenberg easily handled UC-Clermont 89-47
Alas, Wabash didn't have much luck in stopping Franklin as the Grizzlies won 97-82.

38-25 non-conference thus far.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 20, 2012, 12:11:58 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 19, 2012, 10:52:22 PM
The other interesting takeaway from tonight is that Transylvania is starting to live up to its preseason ranking, as it disposed of #9 Franklin & Marshall 86-73. I think the loss to Transy will be seen as a lost opportunity to post a really good in region win more than a bad loss.

It did state in the DR writeup of the Transy game that the Pios had been without the services of their starting pg Barrett Meyer which may explain their losses to the likes of Manchester at home.  He was back for this tourney and, as you can see, the results speak for themselves as Transy not only handed Wooster their 2nd loss, but knocked F&M from the ranks of the undefeated.  I hardly think you could classify this as a bad loss considering this was a Transy team that was returning 4 starters from a team that finished 23-5 last season and made the NCAA Tournament. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 20, 2012, 06:59:44 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 19, 2012, 08:27:06 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 19, 2012, 06:19:15 PM
Or you could do the ol' Les Selvage method. Just chuck it from way down town whenever or wherever.

I wish I'd seen that guy play.  In Terry Pluto's great book on the ABA, Loose Balls, Selvage is mentioned early on, I think by his own general manager in San Diego.  To paraphrase: "Yeah, I remember Les Selvage.  He took a lot of threes.  I don't remember a lot of them going in." :)

My favorite chucker of all time was 6'7" George Stone of Marshall University.  I saw him play in the mid-sixties, at the old Madison Square Garden in New York.  It was either in their ECAC Holiday Classic or the NIT.  Now, this was years before there were three-pointers in college.  At any rate, Stone started making some long jumpers, from the foul line-extended on the right side.  Twenty footers.  After he hit three or four of these, somebody started guarding him out there.  No problem, Stone simply backed up and made a few more.  He continued this strategy, retreating and heaving.  By halftime he was shooting from what I swear was thirty-five feet, right in front of the scorer's table, and they were STILL going in!  Somebody else must have taken note of this, because he ended up playing a few years in the ABA.

John Rinka - Kenyon & Tom Dinger - Wooster each would have scored a lot more points had there been a three point line in the early 70s.  Both great shooters although Dinger had a better supporting cast and didn't have to put up as many from downtown.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 20, 2012, 10:25:55 AM
Non - Conference Records by Conference (in order of wins):

OAC 11-3
PrAC 8-1
HCAC 6-9
MIAA 3-3
UAA  3-5
NEAC 1-0
AMCC 1-0
CC 1-0
NJAC 0-1
CCIW 0-1
Non D-3 4-2

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 20, 2012, 10:36:10 AM
Just two upcoming games before the Holiday break:

Friday:

Hiram (4-4) @ Case Western (5-3) - The Spartans are 3-2 vs. the NCAC, beating Denison, Kenyon and Oberlin and losing to Witt and Allegheny. They'd be perfect for the middle muddle of the conference! The Terriers have turned it around by getting fat off of the dregs of the PrAC. Case is a big step up and a test to see if Hiram's early season troubles are truly behind it.

Saturday:

Anderson (4-4) @ Ohio Wesleyan (7-1) - I was surprised, a bit, when compiling the conference's record against other conferences on how poorly the NCAC has done against the HCAC. Here's one of the last chances at redemption, and it's a good matchup for us. The Bishops have been off for two weeks after their close win over DPU and they play host to a Ravens squad that's been winning games they're supposed to win and losing games they're supposed to lose. This is one they're probably supposed to lose.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 21, 2012, 11:10:27 PM
Good news for Hiram! They beat Case 90-87. Aaron Stefanov led the Terriers with 31.

39-25 non-conference!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 23, 2012, 10:59:58 AM
One last game before the break: OWU bests Anderson (and the pesky HCAC) 87-71. Reuel Rogers had 17 points and 12 boards for the Bishops.

That puts the NCAC at 40-25 in the non-conference slate. Not too shabby.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 27, 2012, 09:47:03 PM
Plenty of games on tap this weekend! Let's look at Friday's:

Friday, December 28:

Ohio Wesleyan (8-1) vs. Pitt-Greensburg (3-7) @ Bluffton - The first thing I though was, "Hey, isn't the host school supposed to play the cupcake?" But Bluffton faces Wright State - Lake so, yeah, this is the 'tough' one. The Bishops shouldn't have much trouble against the Bobcats, who have only beaten Franciscan, Geneva and Waynesburg this year (no titans they).

Bethany (9-1) @ Wittenberg (7-2) - Wittenberg's annual Charles B. Zimmerman Memorial Classic doesn't have a traditional cupcake. In fact, the Old Tigers didn't even draw the traditional 'weak' team, Hanover (not so weak, really), and instead are playing a pretty feisty Bethany squad. The Bison will probably run away with the PrAC (though St. Vincent may have something to say about it) and this tourney may be their best bet to up their SOS. The big question is if Witt is all the way back from their early December stumbles. The big win over Cincy Clermont was nice, but really, it wasn't much of a contest. This will be.

John Carroll (5-4) @ Wooster (8-2) - The Mose Hole Classic features the Scots facing two OAC squads, and avoiding the SOS killing Geneva squad. That's probably a wise move come tourney time. The Blue Streaks have been up-and-down, beating a good Birmingham Southern squad but also losing to Mt. Union and Penn St - Behrend. The Scots shook off their Transylvania loss against Mt. St. Joseph and will look to come out of the Holiday break firing against the OAC.

Hiram (5-4) vs. Hendrix (4-6) @ Las Vegas - The Terriers have recovered and now look to solidify their gains before the NCAC resumes play So why not go to Vegas, baby? They face a Warriors team that is trying to build a program that was a bottom feeder in the old SCAC. Hiram's style gives some teams fits, and Hendrix could be a victim to it.

Wabash (3-6) vs. Calvin (7-2) @ Elmhurst - Some schools with a young team play a pillowy soft schedule. Not Wabash. First Ilinois Wesleyan, then Rose-Hulman and now Calvin. Sure, the Knights may have had a couple of 'bum' years (for them) but Calvin's still not an easy game at all, and they've played well except when they've forayed towards the CCIW. The LG's will have had a long time to think about their defensive 'effort' against Franklin, so they could be raring to go.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 28, 2012, 02:03:50 AM
Tell me more about Hiram's style of play? Will be calling their games this weekend. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 28, 2012, 10:08:56 AM
In the past they've been a bit madcap in trying to force the tempo up. It seems they haven't been as sloppy recently.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 28, 2012, 11:27:24 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 19, 2012, 10:52:22 PM
Probably the biggest note from tonight's game is that Claytor didn't start. I guess the coaching staff is sending a little bit of a message that Claytor needs to elevate his level of play. Claytor has not played as well this season, and hopefully this gets him going.

The other interesting takeaway from tonight is that Transylvania is starting to live up to its preseason ranking, as it disposed of #9 Franklin & Marshall 86-73. I think the loss to Transy will be seen as a lost opportunity to post a really good in region win more than a bad loss. Hopefully Wingard, who absence has been overlooked, will be back in time for the Mose Hole. He is Wooster's best freshman and someone who can provide instant offense. Throw in LaLonde, who will likely start playing in early January, and the Scots should be getting more offensive reinforcements in the next few weeks. The key will be to continue to play solid defense and get Claytor to play with more passion.

Kudos to Transy for beating both Wooster and Franklin & Marshall in their tourney before Christmas.

Alex LaLonde, a 6'5" guard, is now listed on Wooster's roster (he is still listed on Air Force's roster as well ;)) and as Seinfeld notes, he could be a signficant contributor for Wooster in January.  LaLonde averaged 19.5 ppg as a Senior at Wooster HS and was All-Ohio Special Mention. :)  Here is a link to his Wooster HS highlights including lots of three pointers (good shooter) plus a few dunks: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m38pzewrjU8

So, will Josh Claytor be back in the starting lineup this evening?

Should be an interesting game tonight as John Carroll is still running Coach Moran's press system with 11 players averaging more than 12 minutes/game for the Blue Streaks.  Hopefully, Wooster can handle the pressure and beat JCU tonight at Timken.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 28, 2012, 08:49:08 PM
I'm watching my first Wooster game in a very long time. We've got to cut down on those turnovers if we are to make a run in the post-season. We have to do a better job of taking care of the ball. The score shouldn't be this close against this John Carroll team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 28, 2012, 09:38:22 PM
Back from watching another embarrassing performance by the referees in a game that John Carroll plays. I can only speak to the games against Wooster, but it absolutely remarkable the extent to which JCU gets away with pushing, grabbing and holding. They play that way the entire game, so the refs feel like they can't call it all the time. Instead, they almost never call it, allowing it to become the "normal" part of the flow of action. What they should be doing is calling it consistently right from the start, so as to send the signal that this type of play isn't going to be tolerated. If anyone who was at the game saw it differently than me, I'd be curious for their feedback. I don't think anyone would feel any differently. For the game, Wooster was whistled for three more fouls, which is absolutely remarkable if you watched the game in person. In a span of just under six minutes in the middle of the second half, the refs whistled Wooster for 7 fouls, grinding the game to a halt. Even though Wooster led the entire second half, and JCU was having to play extra physical to try and catch up, Wooster was whistled for 14 fouls, compared to 10 for John Carroll, in the second half.

Mays, who had a career night with 21 rebounds and five blocks, was getting hammered and pushed pretty consistently, yet made it to the foul line only five times.

Tomorrow's game with Marietta is huge. One of the bigger non-conference in-region games you are going to get. Looks like after a slow start to the season Marietta is playing more like the Sweet 16 team of two years ago than the one that underachieved last year. A win for the Scots and they will be in a real strong position in the region. A loss, and their margin for error outside of winning the NCAC will be very slim.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 28, 2012, 09:48:37 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 28, 2012, 09:38:22 PM
Back from watching another embarrassing performance by the referees in a game that John Carroll plays. I can only speak to the games against Wooster, but it absolutely remarkable the extent to which JCU gets away with pushing, grabbing and holding. They play that way the entire game, so the refs feel like they can't call it all the time. Instead, they almost never call it, allowing it to become the "normal" part of the flow of action. What they should be doing is calling it consistently right from the start, so as to send the signal that this type of play isn't going to be tolerated. If anyone who was at the game saw it differently than me, I'd be curious for their feedback. I don't think anyone would feel any differently. For the game, Wooster was whistled for three more fouls, which is absolutely remarkable if you watched the game in person. In a span of just under six minutes in the middle of the second half, the refs whistled Wooster for 7 fouls, grinding the game to a halt. Even though Wooster led the entire second half, and JCU was having to play extra physical to try and catch up, Wooster was whistled for 14 fouls, compared to 10 for John Carroll, in the second half.

Mays, who had a career night with 21 rebounds and five blocks, was getting hammered and pushed pretty consistently, yet made it to the foul line only five times.

Amen.  Exactly what I've been saying for years, and exactly what I was going to post.  JCU is the dirtiest college team that I've ever seen play.  Their players and coach are an embarrassment to the sport.  And, as you said, it's the referees that enable all of this to happen.  They're absolutely gutless, and totally ruin the game by allowing this continual thuggery.  I told them so tonight, loudly, and will do so to my last breath.

I mean, what does that coach do?  Does he recruit dirty players?  Or does he recruit normally and then teach them to play dirty?  I'd really like to know.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 28, 2012, 10:46:19 PM
At least it's another win for the good guys against the OAC.

In other action:

OWU ripped Pitt-Greensburg 90-50.
Witt got past Bethany 65-58.
Hiram just beat Hendrix 62-54 out in Viva Las Vegas.
Calvin was beating Wabash 59-40 per a tweet I saw.
* FINAL, it's 83-56 Calvin.

But a 4-1 slate for the NCAC.  44-26 in the non-conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2012, 02:59:36 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 28, 2012, 09:38:22 PM
Back from watching another embarrassing performance by the referees in a game that John Carroll plays. I can only speak to the games against Wooster, but it absolutely remarkable the extent to which JCU gets away with pushing, grabbing and holding. They play that way the entire game, so the refs feel like they can't call it all the time. Instead, they almost never call it, allowing it to become the "normal" part of the flow of action. What they should be doing is calling it consistently right from the start, so as to send the signal that this type of play isn't going to be tolerated. If anyone who was at the game saw it differently than me, I'd be curious for their feedback. I don't think anyone would feel any differently. For the game, Wooster was whistled for three more fouls, which is absolutely remarkable if you watched the game in person. In a span of just under six minutes in the middle of the second half, the refs whistled Wooster for 7 fouls, grinding the game to a halt. Even though Wooster led the entire second half, and JCU was having to play extra physical to try and catch up, Wooster was whistled for 14 fouls, compared to 10 for John Carroll, in the second half.

Mays, who had a career night with 21 rebounds and five blocks, was getting hammered and pushed pretty consistently, yet made it to the foul line only five times.

Tomorrow's game with Marietta is huge. One of the bigger non-conference in-region games you are going to get. Looks like after a slow start to the season Marietta is playing more like the Sweet 16 team of two years ago than the one that underachieved last year. A win for the Scots and they will be in a real strong position in the region. A loss, and their margin for error outside of winning the NCAC will be very slim.

Well stated and very accurate!  Of course, Coach Mike Moran of JCU only knows one way to play the game so he has played what I describe as the "Hack Attack" for as long as I can remember....20+ years?  By the way, this system requires 10-11 player rotations so the fouls get spread out over more players when the refs do call the game properly.

The result is a helter skelter basketball game and it is made worse when Coach Moran has the audacity also to complain loudly to the refs on any borderline call....which he did multiple times last night.

Major kudos to Jake Mays on 21 rebounds last night - most in the last 24 seasons for the Scots. :)

Agree also with Seinfeld that tonight's Wooster - Marietta contest is a very important in region game.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 29, 2012, 04:52:14 PM
JCU downed Geneva by 20.  Not the story.  What is, is that once again, unbelievably, JCU was called for fewer fouls than their opponent.  21 to 24.  I wasn't at this game (my vomit meter from watching JCU last night is still dangerously high), but noted from the stats that JCU had 15 steals.  My money says that they fouled 2-3 times on each of them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 29, 2012, 05:53:45 PM
Catholic totally dismantles Denison 76-35.  The Big Red only managed to shoot 28% from the field and were 3 for 23 from beyond the arc. 

Looks like either there was too much revelling over the holidays or some shooting drills are in order!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 29, 2012, 07:07:41 PM
Well they do refer to Moran's subbing patterns as bing hockey style line changes so it shouldn't be a surprise to see their style of play being hockey-esque either...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 29, 2012, 07:42:44 PM
Scots look good at the half.  The video is great however, where are the play by play guys?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 29, 2012, 08:26:52 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on December 29, 2012, 07:42:44 PM
Scots look good at the half.  The video is great however, where are the play by play guys?

You can try doing what I'm doing. Listen to the audio feed while watching the video feed. The video feed however is about four to five seconds behind the audio feed. Might be worth it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 29, 2012, 08:41:37 PM
Quote from: WooMix on December 29, 2012, 08:26:52 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on December 29, 2012, 07:42:44 PM
Scots look good at the half.  The video is great however, where are the play by play guys?

You can try doing what I'm doing. Listen to the audio feed while watching the video feed. The video feed however is about four to five seconds behind the audio feed. Might be worth it.
Good idea however....after a good first half the scots looked terrible in the second.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 29, 2012, 09:10:52 PM
Sorry about no preview. Busy day today with my girls. Early travel day tomorrow as well, so won't have a snapshot for tomorrow.

Around the league:

As noted, Denison got hammered by Catholic.
OWU dismantled Bluffton 75-51.
Wabash fell to Elmhurst at the Elmhurst tourney 80-66.
DPU waxed Connecticut College 79-45.
Allegheny beat CCNY 72-63.
Witt loses to NAIA Taylor 49-42.
Wooster slips past Marietta 59-57.
Hiram plays late against Ramapo.

4-3 slate thus far: 48-29 in the non-conference realm.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2012, 11:11:04 PM
Back from Timken where I watched Wooster nearly give away the game to Marietta in the last 3 minutes. :o

Wooster led 59 to 50 with 2:45 remaining and then never scored again.  The Scots defense won this game as they denied Marietta on its last two possessions in the last 30 seconds but the game should not have been this close.  Wooster spent too much time milking the clock near the end and never got good shots at the basket.  Scots also missed the front end of one and one free throw opportunities twice in the last minute so Marietta had one last shot to tie or win the game at the end. 

Still a win is a win and this victory now puts Wooster at 4-0 this year versus OAC teams (Marietta, JCU, Ohio Northern, Baldwin Wallace).  It is also interesting that Marietta is 4-0 in the OAC with only 3 losses this year (all to NCAC teams - Woo, Witt and OWU).  Shows the strength of the NCAC this year as Smed has also tracked with the strong non-conference record of NCAC teams. :)

Wooster is now 10-2, 4-0 NCAC.  Next game is at Sheridan (Canada) on January 4th.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 30, 2012, 01:30:33 AM
Just to second what wooscotsfan said, the play in the final 3 minutes by Wooster was just uninspiring. I don't wanna say awful because that may be very harsh seeing that they also did a fairly decent job of defending. Like I said yesterday, we've got to start making free throws and taking better care of the ball. The turnovers were in double digits again today. Here's to hoping that they get better on the line and on minimizing the turnovers as the season progresses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 30, 2012, 07:39:24 AM
In defense of the Scots, there were a couple of amazing calls that enabled Marietta to make things close.  Defending against a 2-on-1 break, Doug Thorpe had perfect position as one of the Marietta guards came in from the right side.  Thorpe was there in time, stationary, and got absolutely run over.  So, of course, they called a block on him, and the layup went in, as did the ensuing free throw.  This was one major swing.

The other was when Jake Mays, trailing the play, blocked the layup attempt of another Marietta guard.  Wooster was coming up court, and that guard, chasing back from behind and frustrated, grabbed the arm of a Wooster player and stole the ball.  An obvious foul, in front of everybody at mid-court, and ignored by yet another bunch of incompetent officials.  Marietta came back and scored on that play, too.

Stuff like this is driving fans away.  One of my friends chose to not come to last night's game after watching the officiating debacle vs John Carroll.  I'm moving towards that camp myself.

In D1 women's basketball over the last few years we're finally hearing the top-level coaches, and former name players, denounce the officiating for being too lax, for not allowing their sport's offensive players to perform.  Connecticut's Geno Auriemma and Notre Dame's Muffet McGraw have been very outspoken about this.  In my mind, DIII men's basketball has the same problem.  Lazy officials that allow far to much physicality on the court.  Yeah, the game's faster than it used to be, and so on, but it doesn't need to be the constant backyard brawl that it's become.

At the D1 men's level, it's not.  Those players do far, far less of the reaching, grabbing, holding, and hard slapping that's become a staple at the level we love.  It's not the DIII coaches' fault, directly, but for this to be corrected it's they that need to lead the charge, to put forth an organized campaign to clean up the game.  Because if it's not done soon, there won't be anyone left around who remembers the way basketball used to be when it was still an athletic but artistic endeavor rather than a street brawl. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2012, 11:52:07 AM
As expected, Ramapo beat Hiram 99-87. 48-30 non conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 30, 2012, 05:56:39 PM
Denison loses 69-66 to Delaware Valley College in Maryland.  Shooting percentage was better than last night, but their 17 turnovers did them in. 

These holiday road trips haven't been very good to Bob and the Big Red.  Since 2005, they have mustered just two wins when traveling out of Ohio for the holidays.  Maybe we should stay put.  Record now 4-7 heading into conference play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2012, 07:37:12 PM
Good news on the other two non-conference games that are completed:

DPU beats LaGrange (how, how, how, how...) 83-63
Kenyon beats Earlham 74-68.

Allegheny plays Berkeley College in NJ tonight.

50-31 non conference pending Allegheny.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 31, 2012, 12:22:32 PM
Gheny lost 57-54 to Berkeley (NJ). Now 50-32.

By my count, here are all of the non-conference games left pending the NCAA tournament:

Jan 2 - Kenyon @ Washington & Lee
Jan 3 - Kenyon vs. Emory & Henry @ W&L
Jan 3 - Oberlin @ Elmira
Jan 3 - Capital @ Denison
Jan 4 - Wooster @ Sheridan
Jan 7 - Denison @ UC Clermont
Jan 12 - Oberlin @ Yale
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 31, 2012, 09:43:07 PM
Does anyone know the story as to why Wooster is going to Canada?  I love when they take a Holiday, or pre-or-post-Holiday, trip.  But, you know, usually it's to the Bahamas, Florida, or Southern California.  It's winter.  It's winterer in Canada.  Not only that, this game doesn't count at all.  Did Wittenberg or Wabash trick them into this?  Did Sheridan, at the point of scheduling, deceive the Scots, telling them that they were moving their campus to Arizona, and everything would be completed by now?  What's up here?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 01, 2013, 07:45:25 PM
Let's take a quick peek at the next two days of games:

January 2:

Kenyon (6-5) @ Washington & Lee (5-4) - The Lords travel to the great state of Virginia for a couple of games. The first finds them face the Generals on their home court. As Kenyon is part of the muddled middle of the NCAC, W & L is part of the same of the ODAC. Thing is, the ODAC is usually a tougher league than the NCAC, but the Generals wins aren't exactly against top notch competition. Well, neither have Kenyon's either. I'm giving this one a shrug and a who knows, really?

January 3:

Kenyon (6-5) vs. Emory & Henry (2-5) @ Washington & Lee - Now, this is a game that favors Kenyon. The Wasps have won two in a row, but their best win is against Berry and they've been traditionally a weak sister in the ODAC. If the Lords' experience comes to play, they should at least have one win coming out of Virginia. 

Oberlin (4-6) @ Elmira (0-10) - Some of us who frequent the "Undefeated & Winless" board were pointing to this game as a chance for Elmira to get off the schneid. Probably not. The Yeomen have been pretty darn competitive and have won three of four. Oberlin did lose to Earlham, though (albiet early) so this is one that isn't lock stock and barrel cinch. The Soaring Eagles will need a great game and the Yeomen a stinker for this one to go against the NCAC.

Capital (7-4) @ Denison (4-7) - Welp, it was a lost weekend for the Big Red in Washington DC. They got run out of the gym by Catholic (expected) and lost to Delaware Valley (not as expected). Now, they face a Capital squad that has jumped out to an undefeated start in the OAC. The teams that the Crusaders have lost to have a combined record of 39-6, with Wittenberg taking credit for three of those losses. So it's going to be a tall order for Denison Thursday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 01, 2013, 09:06:25 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 31, 2012, 09:43:07 PM
Does anyone know the story as to why Wooster is going to Canada?  I love when they take a Holiday, or pre-or-post-Holiday, trip.  But, you know, usually it's to the Bahamas, Florida, or Southern California.  It's winter.  It's winterer in Canada.  Not only that, this game doesn't count at all.  Did Wittenberg or Wabash trick them into this?  Did Sheridan, at the point of scheduling, deceive the Scots, telling them that they were moving their campus to Arizona, and everything would be completed by now?  What's up here?

The name escapes me, but a former Scot basketball player (a really good one) is in some type of important capacity there.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 01, 2013, 11:28:40 PM
Ok, that hint was all that it turned out I needed to find this on the Sheridan basketball page:

Blue notes: Former head coach Wayne Allison graduated from Wooster in 1978 after an illustrious career that saw him named All-Ohio Athletic Conference twice and All-American once. He was inducted into the Wooster Athletic Hall of Fame in 1988.

He's well before my time, but that answers my question.  Sheridan has a nice record, and they've been playing since September, but I suspect that their competition is suspect.  They lost to Daemen College by the score of 113-53.  I wonder what Canadian referees are like.  Do they use any, or is it chainsaws and axes to the death?

By the way, Kenny DeBoer attempted a triple-Vandervaart against Marietta and stayed on the beam.  Missed the shot, though, or maybe still didn't get one off.  Still, fun to watch, as he develops his inside offensive game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 02, 2013, 10:32:39 AM
Does anyone know why OWU is short a game this year?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 03, 2013, 07:52:39 AM
Kenyon lost to W & L 57-53. 50-33 in the non-conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 03, 2013, 09:52:53 AM
And because I'm waiting for a client to get back to me, I looked up the NCAC as they stand in Massey:

Ohio Wesleyan - 10, SOS 30
Wooster - 14, SOS 37
Wittenberg - 39, SOS 34
DPU - 66, SOS 103
Allegheny - 166, SOS 201
Kenyon - 176, SOS 153
Hiram - 199, SOS 202
Wabash - 235, SOS 21
Denison - 243, SOS 185
Oberlin - 306, SOS 263

411 teams ranked.

As for my LGs, the question is this: Will the schedule they played prepare them for the NCAC fight this season despite the lumps they've taken thus far? Let's hope.

I am glad that most all of the teams are playing reasonable schedules, and that the elite teams are playing elite schedules. I can't really complain about Oberlin's schedule, either - that's perfect for them.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 03, 2013, 08:51:10 PM
Capital dominates Denison in the second half and cruises to a 68-45 win.  Halftime score was only 31-25.  Spencer Niekamp played a great game, scoring 22 and ruling the lane on defense.  Westerheide contributed 15.  The Big Red had no offensive threat the entire second half and ended the game shooting just 31%. 

Hard to believe the shooting percentages are as bad as they are when we have shooters like Akpapunam, King, Weingart and White and defenses are keying on Hale.  Something is amiss with the Big Red.  They should be better than this. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 03, 2013, 09:45:51 PM
And Oberlin lost to winless Elmira. Yikes.

Kenyon did get a win over Emory & Henry 68-66.

51-35 in the non-conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 04, 2013, 11:59:12 AM
Crap. I previewed this weekends games, but it got all eaten up for some reason when the site went down.

At any rate:

Wooster goes to Sheridan up north, eh? Sheridan's having a great year, with only one conference loss. I found a couple of US teams Sheridan played, both USCAA, and they barely beat Maine  - Ft. Kent (winless) and got poleaxed by Daemen (who beat Taylor, so they're pretty decent). Wooster should win.

OWU and Wittenberg face off Saturday. The Old Tigers needs this win to have a legit chance at a #1 seed if things break right. OWU needs this game to maintain a claim that they are the true contenders to knock off Wooster. Huge game for January.

DPU and Wabash host Allegheny and Hiram. Big games for all four clubs. The New Tigers, Gators and Terriers are all 0-2 in the league and you don't want to start out 0-4 and hope to make the tournament. Wabash has taken lumps lately but have played a very tough schedule. All four teams could either sweep or get swept, though the New Tigers have a very nice recent win against LaGrange.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 04, 2013, 08:01:21 PM
Wow.  I'd forgotten that Wooster will be playing under international rules: 24-second clock, 8 seconds to get to mid-court, wide lane, extra step, 10-minute quarters, etc.  Plus, they just said that starting point guard Jalen Goodwin is out with an injured ankle.  And, that Sheridan uses a full-court zone press the whole game!  Should be interesting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 04, 2013, 09:38:17 PM
Final:  Wooster 72  Sheridan (Canada) 62  ;D

Wooster nation had 100+ fans in the Toronto area tonight to watch the Scots notch the road win.  Apparently, the Scots had more fans in the gym than the home team. ;)

Wooster was led in scoring tonight by Doug Thorpe with 19 points including two big three pointers in the last 3 minutes of the game.  Jake Mays had 12 points (10+ boards), Josh Claytor with 10 and Xavier Brown added 9 points.

Alex LaLonde saw his first action as a Scot tonight and played well with 5 points in limited minutes.

For the Sheridan Bruins, the top scorers were Dylan Periana with 14 points and Jamal McQueen with 10 points.

Wooster is now 11-2, 4-0 NCAC.  Next game is at Hiram on 1/9.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 04, 2013, 09:54:07 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 04, 2013, 09:38:17 PM
Final:  Wooster 72  Sheridan (Canada) 62  ;D

Wooster nation had 100+ fans in the Toronto area tonight to watch the Scots notch the road win.  Apparently, the Scots had more fans in the gym than the home team. ;)

Wooster was led in scoring tonight by Doug Thorpe with 19 points including two big three pointers in the last 3 minutes of the game.  Jake Mays had 12 points (10+ boards), Josh Claytor with 10 and Xavier Brown added 9 points.

Alex LaLonde saw his first action as a Scot tonight and played well with 5 points in limited minutes.

For the Sheridan Bruins, the top scorers were Dylan Periana with 14 points and Jamal McQueen with 10 points.

Wooster is now 11-2, 4-0 NCAC.  Next game is at Hiram on 1/9.

GO SCOTS!

I'm not completely sure this game even counts towards Wooster's record, or even if the stats count. Maybe someone who knows the NCAA rule book can answer this question for sure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: OC_SID on January 04, 2013, 10:06:38 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 04, 2013, 09:54:07 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 04, 2013, 09:38:17 PM
Final:  Wooster 72  Sheridan (Canada) 62  ;D

Wooster nation had 100+ fans in the Toronto area tonight to watch the Scots notch the road win.  Apparently, the Scots had more fans in the gym than the home team. ;)

Wooster was led in scoring tonight by Doug Thorpe with 19 points including two big three pointers in the last 3 minutes of the game.  Jake Mays had 12 points (10+ boards), Josh Claytor with 10 and Xavier Brown added 9 points.

Alex LaLonde saw his first action as a Scot tonight and played well with 5 points in limited minutes.

For the Sheridan Bruins, the top scorers were Dylan Periana with 14 points and Jamal McQueen with 10 points.

Wooster is now 11-2, 4-0 NCAC.  Next game is at Hiram on 1/9.

GO SCOTS!

I'm not completely sure this game even counts towards Wooster's record, or even if the stats count. Maybe someone who knows the NCAA rule book can answer this question for sure.

I am guessing it won't count. I believe the rule for games against Canadian schools to count is the Canadian school has to play a certain percentage of its games against NCAA schools. Looking at their schedule (http://sheridanbruins.com/sports/mens-basketball/schedule/), I doubt they meet any kind of minimum.

Also, why I am thinking it's an exhibition game because it does not even show up on Wooster's schedule on d3hoops (http://www.d3hoops.com/teams/Wooster/men/2012-13/index). As well as Wooster has added the win to the game on its schedule on its website but the record at the top has stayed at 10-2.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 04, 2013, 11:11:28 PM
It does not count. No games against Canadian schools count other than Simon Fraser, which is a new member of NCAA Division II.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 05, 2013, 11:56:42 AM
Hiram beat Wabash 69-61 after the LGs fell behind by 20. Chris Zurowski had a double double for the Terriers (16-10). Ross Sponsler had 29 to lead Wabash, but it wasn't enough. Hiram and Wabash now 1-2 in the NCAC.

Alleghney beat DPU 69-67 in OT. Ryan Stanko had 18 for the Gators, whilst Barry Flynn added 19 for the New Tigers. Allegheny is now 1-2 and now DPU is 0-3.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 05, 2013, 01:57:42 PM
And this is the time of year where I lament there are no OWU and Witt hoops posters. This is a HUGE game today!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 05, 2013, 05:41:39 PM
Wabash outlasts Allegheny in triple OT 95-87. There were some, ahem. issues with charging calls and the usual NCAC ref tomfoolery, but Wabash got the win.

Ross Sponsler led the LGs with 21. Daniel Purvlicius had 18 points and 16 boads. Andy Walsh had 19 off the bench including some huge threes late. Houston Hodges added 15 off the bench.

Devone McLeod had 34 for the Gators.

DPU gets off the schneid in the conference season and beats Hiram 65-59.

In the big game for the top of the standings, OWU beats Wittenberg 72-60. Huge road win for the Bishops.

The NCAC standings just got even more interesting:

Wooster 4-0
OWU 4-0
Oberlin 2-1
Denison 2-2
Wabash 2-2
Witt 1-2
Allegheny 1-3
DPU 1-3
Hiram 1-3
Kenyon 1-3
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 05, 2013, 11:11:48 PM
Smeds, how did your alma mater manage to play both Hiram and Allegheny today?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 05, 2013, 11:45:02 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 05, 2013, 11:11:48 PM
Smeds, how did your alma mater manage to play both Hiram and Allegheny today?

The games were Friday night and today - Smeds just posted about both of them today. The NCAC always does one weekend where the two easternmost NCAC teams (Allegheny & Hiram) play the westernmost teams (Wabash & DePauw...used to be Earlham I believe) in one weekend in early January while school's out to minimize the travel impacts. Basically a weekend where those four teams do their best UAA "travel pair" impression. They alternate years on who travels to whom.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 05, 2013, 11:57:55 PM
Ah, yes. Should've figured that out from the late-morning time stamp on his first post. Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 06, 2013, 05:33:59 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 05, 2013, 11:45:02 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on January 05, 2013, 11:11:48 PM
Smeds, how did your alma mater manage to play both Hiram and Allegheny today?

The games were Friday night and today - Smeds just posted about both of them today. The NCAC always does one weekend where the two easternmost NCAC teams (Allegheny & Hiram) play the westernmost teams (Wabash & DePauw...used to be Earlham I believe) in one weekend in early January while school's out to minimize the travel impacts. Basically a weekend where those four teams do their best UAA "travel pair" impression. They alternate years on who travels to whom.

I think it should be noted here that the state of Ohio benevolently allows three of these four rather uncivilized teams to pass through its domain with neither the requirement of passports or any fees other than the normal tolls.  It's understood by most that the campus of the fourth school is actually within the Buckeye state, but the government seems to be fine with this, as the location is secluded and for the most part, ignored by the populace.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 06, 2013, 01:46:30 PM
I am missing from posting about Wittenberg as I have only attended one game all year; I saw them lose to Taylor in thier championship of the holiday tournament last Saturday. My high school officiating schedule has me working every day they have a game. Otherwise I'd be throwing my two cents in.

My two cents so far is that they are a young team that is missing 4 seniors that graduated from an Elite Eight team. Wittenberg's main struggles have been rebounding and scoring this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 07, 2013, 10:36:10 AM
For those of you not caring about some football game thing deal bit, there are a couple of games going on tonight:

Non-Conference:

Denison (4-8) @ UC- Clermont (4-16)  - Wittenberg blasted the Cougars 89-47 back in December, but the Big Red isn't Wittenberg, obviously. However, since their last win (against Wright Patterson Air Force Base - well, OK) they've lost seven straight by an average of 35.6 points per game. This may be a great chance for Denison to right the ship after the past three tough games and get back to being a competitive player in the middle muddle of the NCAC.

Conference:

Wittenberg (1-2, 8-4) @ Oberlin (2-1, 4-7) - Yeah, the Yeomen are ahead of the Old Tigers in the standings, but that's just an anomaly. At times, Oberlin has played much better than one would have guessed coming in to the year, yet someone they lost to then winless Elmira over the break. I'm not seeing anything but a Wittenberg win, and this could be the typical Witt "we just lost and the next game is against a weak sister so we're going to crush them like Conan the Barbarian". I mean, they do that in football all the time, so why not hoops?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 07, 2013, 02:12:38 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 07, 2013, 10:36:10 AM
Wittenberg (1-2, 8-4) @ Oberlin (2-1, 4-7) - Yeah, the Yeomen are ahead of the Old Tigers in the standings, but that's just an anomaly.

Anomaly, rah!  Anomaly, rah!  Rah!  Rah!  Rah!! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 08, 2013, 07:53:26 AM
Oberlin did keep it close (closer than ND did), losing only 59-47 to Witt.

Denison, however, lost to UC - Clermont 69-64. I'm kind of flabbergasted.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 08, 2013, 08:22:07 PM
Some interesting matchups tomorrow night.  Unfortunately, DU vs. OWU is not one of them.

Really bad loss for the Big Red vs UC-Clermont.  We've lost 7 out of the last 8.  At this point, the rest of the season is looking very bleak.  The next three (OWU, Witt and DPU) are certain losses.  After that, I see the possibility of a maximum of three wins.   

Year 11 of the current coaching regime, and by my estimation, last year's finish bought him another two after this.  Beleaguered Denison fans can only hope that 13 is a lucky number.     



     

   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 09, 2013, 10:33:15 AM
A full slate of conference games tonight:

Kenyon (1-3, 7-6) @ Wittenberg (2-2, 9-4) - It's interesting to look at the middle muddle of the NCAC. The teams at the bottom of the conference standings all have winning records, whilst, save Wittenberg, the teams at 2-2 are all stuck on four wins. Hmmm. I don't know why Kenyon's been as mercurial as they have been this season - I thought they'd be stronger. But they'll have to get stronger another day. Even though the Old Tigers have been a tad disappointing this year, it's still going to be really tough for anyone but the elite to knock them off.

Wooster (4-0, 10-2) @ Hiram (1-3, 7-6) - The Scots have been off for a while after they didn't quite whelm their fans against Marietta. Now they travel to Hiram to meet the Terriers in a contest that could be interesting. Hiram had a couple of bad losses early (it can be safely said that perhaps Denison is going to be a 'bad' loss, alas) and dropped one against DPU Saturday that could have really helped them in the conference battle. But the Indiana two-step is always tough on the travelers. It could be closer than the uninformed would believe.

Denison (2-2, 4-9) @ Ohio Wesleyan (4-0, 11-1) - Oof. The Big Red have lost four in a row and seven of eight. Last year's Cinderella story is now in the grim distance. And instead of an Oberlin to face after an inexcusable loss to a really bad Clermont team, they face #1A in the conference. The power rankings all love the Bishops, and with good reason. They've played a tough schedule and played it well. Denison should be a mere bump in the road.

Oberlin (2-2, 4-8) @ Allegheny (1-3, 7-6) - Both teams are better than everyone thought they would be at the start of the year, though in the end the Yeomen's W/L record won't be that stellar. This is a big game for Allegheny - the Gators can't afford to lose this one if they want to keep abreast in the race for the conference tournament and even an outside shot at hosting a first round game.

Wabash (2-2, 4-9) @ DePauw (1-3, 8-5) - Throw out the records, etc. Yeah, it's not the same on the hardwood as on the gridiron, but take it from me, the Wabash / DPU basketball matches have quite of bit of bile and antipathy. It's comprehensive exam week at Wabash, so the seniors will no doubt take a study break to trudge down to Greencastle for one of their last glimpses of the rivalry. What would really cheese off the New Tigers is a Wabash win, since that puts them in a big hole for the conference tourney and makes it really hard for them to claw back to host a game. Couldn't happen to a nicer bunch of kitties. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on January 09, 2013, 08:07:15 PM
http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/tow/2012-13/week7   

Ross Sponsler from Wabash was named to the d3hoops team of the week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 09, 2013, 08:47:56 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 42  Hiram 27

Wooster is being led by Doug Thorpe with 13 points and Xavier Brown with 10 points.  Aaron Stefanov has 10 for Hiram.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 09, 2013, 08:48:14 PM
Great post and comments Smed.  You are on the money!

OWU and Wooster are far and away the elite.  Then its a huge mess.  As long as Woo or OWU win the conference tournament title, it looks like those 2 will be the only NCAA Tournament representatives for the NCAC.  Denison is the biggest disappointment in my eyes.  I also thought DePauw, Kenyon, and Wabash would be stronger than they have shown so far.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 09, 2013, 09:09:23 PM
Final: Wittenberg 71  Kenyon 64

Witt gets the narrow home win as this was a 64-62 game with about 2 minutes left before Witt hit closing FT's.

Tigers were led by Scott Masin with 21 points and the Lords were led by Julian Pavlin with 16 points.

Witt is now 3-2 in the NCAC and Kenyon drops to 1-4.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 09, 2013, 09:26:16 PM
OWU shellacks Denison 94-68. Wow. The Big Red are stumbling.

Allegheny outlasted Oberlin 79-75. Once again the Yeomen are close but come up short.

Looks like the New Tigers are going to beat my LGs. Sigh.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 09, 2013, 09:41:36 PM
Final:  Wooster 78  Hiram 62  :)

Wooster played sloppy defense in the 2nd half (giving up layups) and Hiram cut the lead to 6 points with 8 minutes left before the Scots stretched out the margin again to double digits.

Wooster was led tonight by Doug Thorpe with 19 points, Xavier Brown with 16 points (10 rebounds), Jake Mays with 8 points, Josh Claytor with 8 and DeVaughn Wingard also with 8.

Hiram's top scorers were Aaron Stefanov with 19 points, Alan Sheppard with 10 points and Steve Zivoder with 9 points.

Wooster is now 11-2, 5-0 NCAC. ;D  4 of those 5 wins have been on the road.  Next game is DePauw at home on Sat.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 10, 2013, 08:20:47 AM
Standings:

OWU 5-0
Wooster 5-0
Witt 3-2
DPU 2-3
Allegheny 2-3
Denison 2-3
Oberlin 2-3
Wabash 2-3
Hiram 1-4
Kenyon 1-4

Middle muddle, indeed...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2013, 03:05:17 PM
There are games afoot in the NCAC. The last non-conference game of the year (and with that we can do a final analysis early next week), plus four other conference games. Wabash has the day off.

Non-Conference:

Oberlin (4-9) @ Yale (5-11) - Hiram ventured into D-1 land and was seriously rebuked by Youngstown State. Yale is a few pegs down from Youngstown Sate, but the Elis were within 10 of Nevada and Iowa State (who just took Kansas to OT) and wasn't totally blitzed by Florida. This game will be a good chance for Yale to say hello to a former player (Cavaco played four years of varsity ball for Yale) and perhaps get PT for some of the players that haven't seen much time. Hello, Khaliq Bedart-Ghani!

Conference:

Wittenberg (3-2, 10-4) @ Denison (2-3, 4-10) - Wow, the Big Red's season has taken the express train to stink-town. Losers of eight of nine, Denison is in grave danger of missing out on the tourney a year after almost shocking the world (well, the NCAC world at least). Wittenberg rebounded with two wins after their loss to OWU, and can solidify a claim on third place with a win. The Old Tigers look prime to sweep through the rest of January in preparation with their OWU rematch on the 30th.

Allegheny (2-3, 8-6) @ Ohio Wesleyan (5-0, 12-1) - One thing the Gators have done all year has been keeping their games close. Except for a couple of blowouts they administered to weaker foes, they've been hanging around in every game this year. That includes their 14-point loss to the Bishops in December. (Yes, we've already got a rematch in NCAC-land). OWU has been delivering flying suplex monkey stomps of late, though, and I don't think they'd let up on Allegheny if given the chance.

DePauw (2-3, 9-5) @ Wooster (5-0, 11-2) - Just when the New Tigers think they've righted the ship and can begin a run to get a #3 or #4 seed in the tourney, along comes the dreaded trip to Wooster. Ulp. DPU has potential, and could make it a game, but the Scots have been letting some teams hang around for way too long for their fan base. Is it time that Wooster sweeps the leg? That may not happen tomorrow, DPU's got some skills.

Kenyon (1-4, 7-7) @ Hiram (1-4, 7-7) - Two teams, two identical records, and it's kind of a sort of must win for both, already. With the middle muddle and an Oberlin team that isn't going to curl up and die, it's imperative for both teams to avoid a 1-5 start if they want to make the NCAC post-season. But only one will. The Lords played darn good basketball against the Old Tigers Wednesday, and their body of work is just a bit better IMHO. We shall see, of course.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 11, 2013, 04:26:21 PM
Re: Oberlin @ Yale.  Nationally-ranked Albertus Magnus played Yale a couple of weeks ago (AM is also in New Haven); it did not go well!  AM received their only loss of the season - by 49 points!

It's a nice opportunity for Oberlin, and if they stay within 50, they can 'claim' Top 25 qualifications! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 12, 2013, 03:42:43 PM
Well:

Yale 104, Oberlin 39
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 12, 2013, 03:45:08 PM
Checked in to a couple of games before I have to run out, and we have things brewing:

Denison leads Witt 31-28 with 5:31 left in the first half.

Allegheny leads OWU 31-27 at the half. Gators shooting 52%, OWU shooting 26%
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 12, 2013, 06:13:59 PM
Courtesy of northcoast.org, here's the scores:
Wooster 68, DePauw 58
Wittenberg 79, Denison 78
OWU 79, Allegheny 73
Hiram 74, Kenyon 63
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 12, 2013, 06:41:41 PM
Wooster began their game playing well, opening up a small double-digit lead.  They moved the ball inside-out and were getting really good looks.  Then it all just stopped.  Mediocre semi-contested jump shots, only 10-15 seconds into the shot clock.  They weren't going in.  Yeah, Mays and Claytor were stuck on the bench with two fouls each, but still, you don't need to take those "fair" shots until late in the clock.  Work the ball a little more, be patient, and they never would have let DePauw back into this game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 12, 2013, 07:36:19 PM
A couple of great escapes...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 13, 2013, 02:30:36 PM
great game at denison yesterday. Big Red gave them a run for their money. Nice crowd also, too bad it has too take either wooster or wittenberg to bring a good crowd(most from the visitor's).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 14, 2013, 12:33:25 AM
Wow!  Who knew this was going on?  Not me.  Check out this site, and this clip. :)

http://woosterbasketballfilm.com/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 14, 2013, 07:53:22 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 14, 2013, 12:33:25 AM
Wow!  Who knew this was going on?  Not me.  Check out this site, and this clip. :)

http://woosterbasketballfilm.com/

Hadn't heard about this either - seems very cool. Looks like the filmmakers are taking a very "Why D3" attitude - in keeping with the "#whyD3" hashtag on twitter used by Pat and others - where they emphasize the uniqueness/charm/advantages of the DIII game (and, often, the DIII educations that go with it). Will have to keep an eye on this project as it progresses.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 15, 2013, 12:28:59 PM
NCAC is well represented in the top 10 of the new top 25 poll this week with Wooster making the jump from 15 to 8 and OWU right behind them at 9 setting up a top 10 showdown this Saturday in Delaware!  8-)

Is this OWU's highest ascension in the D3hoops Top 25 Poll?  I believe this would also be the first non-Witt/Woo top 10 showdown in the NCAC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 15, 2013, 01:17:14 PM
By my count, the league was 51-37 in the non-conference!

By Team:

OWU 7-1
Witt 7-2
DPU 7-2
Wooster 6-2
Gheny 6-3
Hiram 6-3
Kenyon 6-3
Denison 2-7
Wabash 2-7
Oberlin 2-7

By Conference (in number of wins against):

OAC 13-4
PrAC 9-1
HCAC 9-9
UAA 4-5
MIAA 3-4
SAA 1-0
NEAC 1-0
AMCC 1-0
CC 1-0
NESCAC 1-0
CUNYAC 1-0
USAC 1-0
ODAC 1-1
LAND 0-1
MACF 0-1
E8 0-1
NJAC 0-2
CCIW 0-2
Non D-3 4-6


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 15, 2013, 01:19:48 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 15, 2013, 12:28:59 PM
NCAC is well represented in the top 10 of the new top 25 poll this week with Wooster making the jump from 15 to 8 and OWU right behind them at 9 setting up a top 10 showdown this Saturday in Delaware!  8-)

Is this OWU's highest ascension in the D3hoops Top 25 Poll?  I believe this would also be the first non-Witt/Woo top 10 showdown in the NCAC?

In a quick scan, it didnt look like OWU threatened the Top 10 in 2007-08, the year they went 22-8 and lost in the Sweet 16 at Hope. I think that's the only other year OWU was consistently ranked that I remember.

However, how quickly you forget ScotsFan, that #1 Wooster handed #7 Wabash its first loss just two seasons ago, 67-65 in Crawfordsville. Wabash didn't actually drop in the poll with the loss. Wooster met Wabash on Jan. 8, 2011 - here's the poll from immediately after that game was played: http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2010-11/week6

As far as I know, this is the only non-Woo/Witt Top 10 NCAC matchup in the D3hoops poll era.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 16, 2013, 10:43:24 AM
Before we get to Saturday's affair, we have some games to play tonight:

Wittenberg (4-2, 11-4) @ Wabash (2-3, 4-10) - The Old Tigers are rival #2 in the NCAC for the LG's, no matter what the sport. I think there's something to the nickname. Wabash will be ready for this game and Witt should be ready for a fight. Sure, on paper the Old Tigers have the goods to coast past the LG's, but this isn't paper and the vets on the Wabash squad should definitely remind the young in's that this is Witt and that means they should give no quarter. Hopefully.

Allegheny (2-4, 8-7) @ Wooster (6-0, 12-2) - Before the big matchup Saturday, the Scots need to dispatch the Gators. Again, on paper, this shouldn't be an issue. But Allegheny keeps hanging around and hanging around in almost every game they play. They hung around again Saturday and almost knocked off the Bishops. I can see them lingering around again, for sure, just in case Wooster is peeking ahead to the OWU game. (That's not likely, of course, as Wooster is very focused on the game ahead, but still it's a bit of human nature to look forward to the big events and not notice the small events in our way.)

Oberlin (2-3, 4-10) @ Kenyon (1-5, 7-8) - The Lords loss to Hiram elevates this game into a definite must win for them. A loss to the Yeomen would just be devastating as they try to scramble for a place in the tourney, much less a seed that would allow them to bypass Wooster or OWU. Oberlin's just happy to be playing a D-3 team, no doubt, and a win over Kenyon would help their psyche. It's not out of the question, either.

Ohio Wesleyan (6-0, 13-1) @ Hiram (2-4, 8-7) - This looks like a trap and smells like a trap. The Bishops can't really show up and coast by the Terriers - they're too talented. Hiram plays well at home and looked pretty decent against Kenyon. I think OWU will be ready for this game but they'll need to focus and not get sucked into the trap-game pitfall.

Denison (2-4, 4-11) @ DePauw (2-4, 9-6) - Oh, Denison. What are we gonna do with you? Just when this scribe basically counted them out for the season they almost pull of a huge upset. Does this mean they're refreshed and ready to start winning again? Well, um...probably not. The New Tigers, while still enigmatic at times, definitely has the horses to curtail the Big Red, but they can't just coast and expect to win.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 16, 2013, 11:32:07 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 16, 2013, 10:43:24 AM
Before we get to Saturday's affair, we have some games to play tonight:

Wittenberg (4-2, 11-4) @ Wabash (2-3, 4-10) - The Old Tigers are rival #2 in the NCAC for the LG's, no matter what the sport. I think there's something to the nickname. Wabash will be ready for this game and Witt should be ready for a fight. Sure, on paper the Old Tigers have the goods to coast past the LG's, but this isn't paper and the vets on the Wabash squad should definitely remind the young in's that this is Witt and that means they should give no quarter. Hopefully.

Allegheny (2-4, 8-7) @ Wooster (6-0, 12-2) - Before the big matchup Saturday, the Scots need to dispatch the Gators. Again, on paper, this shouldn't be an issue. But Allegheny keeps hanging around and hanging around in almost every game they play. They hung around again Saturday and almost knocked off the Bishops. I can see them lingering around again, for sure, just in case Wooster is peeking ahead to the OWU game. (That's not likely, of course, as Wooster is very focused on the game ahead, but still it's a bit of human nature to look forward to the big events and not notice the small events in our way.)

Oberlin (2-3, 4-10) @ Kenyon (1-5, 7-8) - The Lords loss to Hiram elevates this game into a definite must win for them. A loss to the Yeomen would just be devastating as they try to scramble for a place in the tourney, much less a seed that would allow them to bypass Wooster or OWU. Oberlin's just happy to be playing a D-3 team, no doubt, and a win over Kenyon would help their psyche. It's not out of the question, either.

Ohio Wesleyan (6-0, 13-1) @ Hiram (2-4, 8-7) - This looks like a trap and smells like a trap. The Bishops can't really show up and coast by the Terriers - they're too talented. Hiram plays well at home and looked pretty decent against Kenyon. I think OWU will be ready for this game but they'll need to focus and not get sucked into the trap-game pitfall.

Denison (2-4, 4-11) @ DePauw (2-4, 9-6) - Oh, Denison. What are we gonna do with you? Just when this scribe basically counted them out for the season they almost pull of a huge upset. Does this mean they're refreshed and ready to start winning again? Well, um...probably not. The New Tigers, will still enigmatic at times, definitely has the horses to curtail the Big Red, but they can't just coast and expect to win.
Smeds (if I may call you that), Although I'm generally a lurker here and can't follow the NCAC as closely as I'd like to, I always enjoy your perspectives.  Thanks
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 16, 2013, 12:42:34 PM
Thanks, Buford!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 16, 2013, 04:13:10 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 15, 2013, 01:19:48 PM
However, how quickly you forget ScotsFan, that #1 Wooster handed #7 Wabash its first loss just two seasons ago, 67-65 in Crawfordsville. Wabash didn't actually drop in the poll with the loss. Wooster met Wabash on Jan. 8, 2011 - here's the poll from immediately after that game was played: http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2010-11/week6

As far as I know, this is the only non-Woo/Witt Top 10 NCAC matchup in the D3hoops poll era.

Ah, you're right kb.  I guess I forgot because of the fact that Wabash finished that season unranked and failed to even get an at large bid to the tournament...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 16, 2013, 04:36:48 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 16, 2013, 10:43:24 AM
Allegheny (2-4, 8-7) @ Wooster (6-0, 12-2) - Before the big matchup Saturday, the Scots need to dispatch the Gators. Again, on paper, this shouldn't be an issue. But Allegheny keeps hanging around and hanging around in almost every game they play. They hung around again Saturday and almost knocked off the Bishops. I can see them lingering around again, for sure, just in case Wooster is peeking ahead to the OWU game. (That's not likely, of course, as Wooster is very focused on the game ahead, but still it's a bit of human nature to look forward to the big events and not notice the small events in our way.)

Ohio Wesleyan (6-0, 13-1) @ Hiram (2-4, 8-7) - This looks like a trap and smells like a trap. The Bishops can't really show up and coast by the Terriers - they're too talented. Hiram plays well at home and looked pretty decent against Kenyon. I think OWU will be ready for this game but they'll need to focus and not get sucked into the trap-game pitfall.


Both of these games have the potential to be trap games for Wooster and OWU as they look forward to their big showdown on Saturday.  However, if there is one thing, among many, that Coach Moore does well it is preparing his teams against trap games and winning the games they are supposed to win.  I'm not saying this is a guaranteed win by any means.  I'm just saying that if Wooster happens to lose tonight it's because the Gators outplayed them and not because Wooster was caught looking ahead to Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 16, 2013, 06:00:19 PM
There's also, now, another possibility.

It would make for great theater for Wooster to throw the next half dozen games, giving themselves no chance at the NCAA's save to win the conference tournament.  During this time a psuedo-inebriated Doug Cline will wander onto the court and receive a technical.  Some of the losses will feature brawls and players getting thrown into glass trophy cabinets.  Coach Moore will nearly be dismissed, only to be saved by the miraculous reappearance of Tim Vandervaart, who, with somehow another year of eligibility, will spout, "I play, coach stays. Coach goes, I go."

At this point the Scots, with the eighth and final seed in the NCAC tournament, will go on a rampage of barn-burner wins.  Wooster's last-second shots will drop for victories, while those of their opponents will actually deflate on the rim before falling awry.  Enroute to the championship game at OWU, the Scots bus will get get stuck in a blizzard.  The players and coaches will walk the final twenty-five miles, some carrying the children of other roadside victims of the storm.  Wooster will go on to win that game on a buzzer-beating 70-foot heave by Jake Mays, a strike reminiscent of his days pitching in the Little League World Series.

I can't wait for the sequel, the trip to the NCAA's!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 16, 2013, 08:53:24 PM
Final:  Wooster 92  Allegheny 68  :)

Impressive win by the Scots as they shot 51% from the floor and outrebounded the Gators 43 to 23.  Wooster was led tonight by Doug Thorpe with 24 points (4 three pointers), Josh Claytor with 14 points (8 boards), Kenny DeBoer with 12 points (7 boards) and Jake Mays with 10 points (9 boards).  Scots made 9 of 18 three point shots and only had 5 turnovers.

Top scorers for Allegheny were Josh Valentic with 19 points, Chris Milon with 18 and Ryan Stanko with 12.

Wooster is now 13-2, 7-0 NCAC  ;D  Big showdown this Saturday as Wooster plays at Ohio Wesleyan

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 16, 2013, 09:06:26 PM
Final:  Hiram 78  Ohio Wesleyan 65
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 16, 2013, 10:04:42 PM
Updated NCAC Standings:

Wooster 7-0
Ohio Wesleyan 6-1
Wittenberg 5-2
DePauw 3-4
Hiram 3-4
Oberlin 2-3
Wabash 2-4
Allegheny 2-5
Denison 2-5
Kenyon 1-5
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MIAA in Exile on January 16, 2013, 10:07:10 PM
Kenyon is 2-5 after their in over Oberlin....Oberlin is 2-4.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 16, 2013, 10:21:45 PM
Nice 2nd half for the Scots tonight.  They only led by 8 at the half and blew the game open in the 2nd half.

How about Doug Thorpe's play since he cracked the starting line up due to Goodwin's injury!  I think Moore is going to have a tough time taking Thorpe out of the starting line up once Goodwin returns.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 16, 2013, 10:25:09 PM
Quite a stunning result at Hiram. Not a complete shock that OWU would lose up there, as it has happened before, but by that score, very surprising.

Very odd game at Wooster. The Scots went over 31 minutes without having a foul called on them, and for the game, the two teams combined for just 10 total fouls. But it's because neither team played physical in any way. Allegheny was absolutely MIA on the defensive end, allowing 20 offensive rebounds. All the easy put backs for Wooster masked the fact that they still are missing a lot of make-able shots. One player who isn't missing anything is Thorpe. He has gone from a key bench player to the Scots best player, supplanting Xavier Brown in that role. He has been dynamic now for several games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on January 17, 2013, 05:46:18 AM

[/quote]

Both of these games have the potential to be trap games for Wooster and OWU as they look forward to their big showdown on Saturday.  However, if there is one thing, among many, that Coach Moore does well it is preparing his teams against trap games and winning the games they are supposed to win.  I'm not saying this is a guaranteed win by any means.  I'm just saying that if Wooster happens to lose tonight it's because the Gators outplayed them and not because Wooster was caught looking ahead to Saturday.
[/quote]

Good call.  Bishops go down to Hiram.  This makes Saturday even bigger as the Scots could take serious command of the league race with a win at OWU.  I say its over if Woo wins Saturday. the middle muddle and poor teams at the bottom (only 3 league teams over .500 in the standings) make for wins for the Scots and OWU still has to head to Timken.  An OWU win and the big 3 of woo, Witt, and owu are all alive in the hunt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 17, 2013, 07:47:10 AM
Quote from: WAlum on January 17, 2013, 05:46:18 AM

Good call.  Bishops go down to Hiram.  This makes Saturday even bigger as the Scots could take serious command of the league race with a win at OWU.  I say its over if Woo wins Saturday. the middle muddle and poor teams at the bottom (only 3 league teams over .500 in the standings) make for wins for the Scots and OWU still has to head to Timken.  An OWU win and the big 3 of woo, Witt, and owu are all alive in the hunt.

I think Witt is all but out of it.  Witt already has 2 league losses and both were at home.  They would have to win @ OWU and @ Woo to have a chance and I don't se that happening.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 17, 2013, 07:52:35 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 16, 2013, 09:06:26 PM
Final:  Hiram 78  Ohio Wesleyan 65

Cue the Admiral! IT'S A TRAP!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 17, 2013, 07:54:56 AM
Other scores:

Wabash falls to Witt 50-45 after holding a lead for the entire first half. However, the offense totally died in the second.

Kenyon bests Oberlin 67-56.

DPU beats back Denison 79-65.

The middle is truly muddled, again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on January 17, 2013, 11:01:08 AM
It has been a another LONG season following the Big Red this year!!!!

Is there some reason Hale isn't given a chance to display his talents!!!  Pre-season POY

The Big Red are 1-10 over the last 11 games....if you look at results of the year they have lost 6 games by a TOTAL of 16 points!!
Hale shoots the ball not even 12 times a game!!  At 52.2%!!  Does that mean if he shot it only six more time a game he adds another 6 points to his average and Denison wins ALL those games........obviously it is not that easy...but come on!!!  The kid is a great player, a team player!! Give him the ball!!!!!!!! Leave him in the game!!!  There is NO upside to having that kid on the bench!!!

For instance...last night at DePauw...Big Red is down 41-37 with 16 minutes to go........ALL THE STARTERS ARE ON THE BENCH!!!  DePauw has 3 of their 5 starters on the floor!!!!  Why is our team on the bench???????  They are the starters!!!!!!!  PLAY EM!!!!  Next thing you know we are down 10 and never got close from there!!!

Well it was last year at this time the Big Red got hot and made a terrific run!!!!  Here is hoping history repeats itself!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 17, 2013, 01:18:26 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 16, 2013, 10:25:09 PM
Quite a stunning result at Hiram. Not a complete shock that OWU would lose up there, as it has happened before, but by that score, very surprising.

It got Hiram on the cover page of D3Hoops.  Now that's something that doesn't happen too often...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 17, 2013, 05:00:56 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 17, 2013, 01:18:26 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 16, 2013, 10:25:09 PM
Quite a stunning result at Hiram. Not a complete shock that OWU would lose up there, as it has happened before, but by that score, very surprising.

It got Hiram on the cover page of D3Hoops.  Now that's something that doesn't happen too often...  :P

Yes, but who don't know the answer to that infamous Jeopardy question of yesteryear: "What is the most well-hidden small college in northeast Ohio?"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 18, 2013, 04:27:42 PM
We got some games this weekend, and a back-to-backer to boot!

DePauw (3-4, 10-6) @ Oberlin (2-4, 4-11) - The New Tigers took care of business against Denison at home, but now they jaunt to Ohio. Yes, it's against the Yeomen, but Oberlin's played pretty well at home, despite their record. DPU is now in the mix for a #4 seed and an outside shot at #3, so they'll need to win on the road against the lower ranking teams, like Oberlin.

Denison (2-5, 4-12) @ Allegheny (2-5, 8-8) - The Big Red have lost seven in a row, but man, they almost pulled off the upset of the season last Saturday. Alas, not to be (and no offense to Hiram's win, but this Denison team beating Witt would have been epic). Can they bounce back after yet another loss Wednesday and top the Gators? Perhaps. Allegheny hangs around and hangs around, but that also means they don't really run away from teams, either. This could be a pretty tight game in Meadville, with the stakes being a more secure place in the middle muddle.

Wabash (2-4, 4-11) @ Kenyon (2-5, 8-8) - The stakes are pretty clear for Wabash. A win solidifies their claim to make the NCAC tourney. A loss puts them in to the mix of exclusion and / or a matchup against Wooster or OWU. The stakes are the same for Kenyon, especially after their loss to Hiram. With the carnage thus far in the middle pack of the NCAC, every game has implications.

Hiram (3-4, 9-7) @ Wittenberg (5-2, 12-4) - Fresh off of their win over league-leading OWU, the Terriers now travel to Wittenberg to face the Old Tigers. Hiram's road to another upset is a bit steeper. They're not going to sneak up on Witt, and they're on the road this time. While the Terriers certainly have a shot at winning this game, it's going to be a tough road for them to claim two big upsets in a row.

Wooster (7-0, 13-2) @ Ohio Wesleyan (6-1, 13-2) - While the Bishops' loss Wednesday may have diminished the luster of this contest a skosh, it's still quite vital. An OWU win puts the race for #1 back to all-square, while a Wooster win puts them in command of the race and gets them a huge road win to boot. The Scots clearly didn't mess around against Allegheny, so the question will be if OWU can bounce back and defend their home turf.

Sunday:

Wabash (2-4, 4-11) @ Oberlin (2-4, 4-11) - Depending on what happens on Saturday, this game could mean that one program is in last place with a 2-6 record, or it could mean that the middle is muddled again. Whatever mojo Wabash had in the first half against Witt needs to re-appear, or even the Yeomen will have a chance of beating them. While many are going to be watching the NFL Playoffs, some hoop fans will cast an eye on this to see which team could sink below the middle muddle.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 19, 2013, 11:51:56 AM
Hiram may be hard to find(I found that out one time trying to go to a football game there) but the legend of professor garfield still lives on today.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 19, 2013, 11:52:47 AM
scott-bishop game is going to be a good one today. Always fun watching a game in the church at owu.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2013, 03:46:16 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 42  Ohio Wesleyan 40

Wooster is being led by Xavier Brown with 12 points and Kenny DeBoer with 10 points.

Ohio Wesleyan's top scorers are Taylor Rieger with 11 points and Marshall Morris with 10 points.

Both teams shot 52% from the floor in the half so whoever plays stronger defense in the 2nd half will probably get the victory in this game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2013, 04:42:51 PM
Well, the video stream from OWU crashed in the first half and never came back on.

Now with 5 minutes left in the game, live stats have frozen so there is no information from Delaware! >:(

Live stats back on:  Wooster up 74-70 with 2:27 left
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 04:43:19 PM
I've had the video stream on since halftime, wooscotsfan....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 04:46:18 PM
In scores from the league:

DPU beats back Oberlin 67-49.

Denison tips Allegheny 65-61.

Kenyon eased past Wabash 72-55. Wabash shot 32.7% from the floor. Ulp.

Wittenberg is up 25-20 at the half over Hiram.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 05:03:06 PM
Wooster tops OWU 88-82 to gain a two-game edge in the NCAC. Huge road win for the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 19, 2013, 05:09:20 PM
Andy Winters had a monster game for OWU: 29 points on 12-16 from the field (including 2-2 from deep), but Wooster had three guys go for 20, 20,and 19 to more than compensate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 19, 2013, 05:17:35 PM
Scots win a good game. Any chance for it to be a great game was destroyed by the officials. How you call 54 fouls in that game is beyond me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 05:22:11 PM
Hiram may have two in a row in them after all! Up 45-41 with 5:43 to play against Witt!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 19, 2013, 05:29:09 PM
The Wooster-OWU game was another testament to the total incompetency of the NCAC officials.  Moreover, it showed unbelievable hometown bias.  In a four words: Wooster got robbed blind.  Had the game been called fairly, Wooster wins by 15 or 20.  If OWU doesn't make half a dozen circus shots, it's 25.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 05:30:37 PM
That's not the game I saw said the unbiased viewer. I did see the NCAC refs call way too many fouls, but I don't have a dog in the hunt. Both sides benefited and were cursed by the refs. So go easy on the hypotheticals.

Oh, and if Wooster's starting five had a spleenectomy before the game, OWU would win easily....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 19, 2013, 05:38:41 PM
I'll bet that even the OWU announcers, who did a very nice job, would back up my statement.  Many times they questioned the calls when Wooster defenders had position, were bumped hard by the offensive player, and then were called for a block.

Nice work, OWU guys, on rooting for OWU but keeping the PBP unbiased.  Thanks, apparently, to David Collinge, you even pronounced Wooster correctly.  Now, one more thing.  Dump the International Waters thing.  It was cool once or twice, but...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 05:39:58 PM
Well, alrighty then. Hiram DOES have it in them! They beat Witt 62-57.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 05:42:05 PM
Yeesh. I didn't think it was a robbery, and neither did they.

Of course, you know, if Wooster's entire team was transformed into 4th graders, OWU wins easily.

If Wabash kidnapped Kenyon's shoes and made them play in spats, Wabash wins easily.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 05:44:17 PM
Up to the second standings:

Wooster 8-0
OWU 6-2
Witt 5-3
DePauw 4-4
Hiram 4-4
Denison 3-5
Kenyon 3-5
Wabash 2-5
Oberlin 2-5
Allegheny 2-6
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 19, 2013, 06:15:04 PM
I enjoyed the game but too many foul calls that is for sure. Even worse the ft shooting. Neither team has anything too complain about that with their poor performances at the line.  I believe #20 for wooster is the one who missed all three ft's on one trip to the line. Good thing he hit the big three late. Oh well good game but could have been better.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 19, 2013, 06:40:20 PM
Dave, that wasn't the same guy.  The freshman Lalonde missed the three free throws.  It was sophomore point guard Jalen Goodwin who hit the big three from the corner.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 19, 2013, 06:48:03 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on January 19, 2013, 06:15:04 PM
...Even worse the ft shooting. Neither team has anything too complain about that with their poor performances at the line.  ...

I'm not sure what's considered average, but the Scots shot 74.4% from the line, slightly better than their season average of 73.6%.  OWU only shot 68.4% today, but that was 6 points higher than their season average. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 19, 2013, 07:50:13 PM
thank you for the correction, I guess it seemed worse then it was, sorry about that. Must have been confusing the game with the heidelberg-otterbein game I saw last week. Now that was bad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 19, 2013, 07:52:06 PM
thank you also for the correction on who hit the three. I took what I thought was a pretty good picture of it. If it did come out okay I will post it somewhere.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 19, 2013, 08:01:22 PM
Get any good mug shots of the officials so we can get them up on post office walls?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 19, 2013, 08:33:43 PM
well I didn't zero in on any officials but I have uploaded some pictures of the game at d3's facebook page. Sorry they are not as clear as a pro(I am not one)I don't have professional equipment. I do much better at football and auto racing. However the three pointer from the corner near the end did come out pretty well. Good luck too both the scots and bishops the rest of the way.

P.S. this sure beats watching a oac game, especially if otterbein is involved.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2013, 08:53:03 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 05:44:17 PM
Up to the second standings:

Wooster 8-0
OWU 6-2
Witt 5-3
DePauw 4-4
Hiram 4-4
Denison 3-5
Kenyon 3-5
Wabash 2-5
Oberlin 2-5
Allegheny 2-6

In addition to the two game lead, Wooster is in great shape in the NCAC conference race for two other reasons: ;D

1. Wooster has already won AT both OWU and Witt, so they play both rematch games at home.
2. Wooster has already played and won 5 NCAC road games.  They only have 3 NCAC road games left.


Congrats to Kenny DeBoer on a career high game with 19 points on 6 of 6 shooting including 3 three pointers! :)  Kenny also had 3 boards and 3 assists to help the Scots get the big road win this afternoon.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2013, 11:19:27 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 05:30:37 PM
That's not the game I saw said the unbiased viewer.

Personally, I'd say you are far from unbiased when it comes to your feelings towards Wooster basketball... ::)

My take on the officiating is inconsistent.  Wednesday in Timken we hardly heard a whistle from the officials and that was quite refreshing.  Today in a high profile conference game the officials seemed to want to be the spotlight instead of allowing the players playing to be the spotlight.  Too bad that the poor officiating (both ways) is more of a talking point than a very good game between to good teams battling for a conference championship...



Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 19, 2013, 08:53:03 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 05:44:17 PM
Up to the second standings:

Wooster 8-0
OWU 6-2
Witt 5-3
DePauw 4-4
Hiram 4-4
Denison 3-5
Kenyon 3-5
Wabash 2-5
Oberlin 2-5
Allegheny 2-6

In addition to the two game lead, Wooster is in great shape in the NCAC conference race for two other reasons: ;D

1. Wooster has already won AT both OWU and Witt, so they play both rematch games at home.
2. Wooster has already played and won 5 NCAC road games.  They only have 3 NCAC road games left.

GO SCOTS!

You took my thoughts exactly wsf!

Add in that one of those 5 NCAC road wins was at Hiram who has now beaten Witt and OWU in back to back games it makes their spot on top look even more secure.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 11:35:10 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 19, 2013, 11:19:27 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 05:30:37 PM
That's not the game I saw said the unbiased viewer.

Personally, I'd say you are far from unbiased when it comes to your feelings towards Wooster basketball... ::)


No, I am biased against unvarnished Kool-Aid drinkers who always think it's a conspiracy against their team or think their team and coaches can do no wrong ever. I'm pretty consistent in that, even against some Wabash posters at times.

"Someone may have slightly disagreed with the Hawk Harrelson-esque homer take of Wooster basketball! SMITE AND DESTROY HIM! HE MUST BE SILENCED! WE CANNOT HAVE THIS TREASON!"  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2013, 10:57:34 AM
Y'know, not being in here as often as in the past, I don't miss it very much.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2013, 12:46:57 PM
Hard to believe that was Wooster's 10th win in a row over the Battling Bishops.  I would never have guessed that Wooster's streak was that big over OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on January 20, 2013, 12:58:11 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 05:30:37 PM
That's not the game I saw said the unbiased viewer. I did see the NCAC refs call way too many fouls, but I don't have a dog in the hunt. Both sides benefited and were cursed by the refs. So go easy on the hypotheticals.

Oh, and if Wooster's starting five had a spleenectomy before the game, OWU would win easily....

I pulled up the video for the last 10 minutes.  I couldn't believe what I was seeing, with whistles on every single possession - at least that is what it seemed like.  Honestly, in the time I was watching, I don't remember that many possessions where a foul was not called.  It was just hard to watch.

I only saw those 10 minutes, but there didn't seem to be any bias at all.  It was just bad both way, with any type of contact called a foul.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 20, 2013, 02:44:45 PM
Quote from: Titan Q on January 20, 2013, 12:58:11 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 19, 2013, 05:30:37 PM
That's not the game I saw said the unbiased viewer. I did see the NCAC refs call way too many fouls, but I don't have a dog in the hunt. Both sides benefited and were cursed by the refs. So go easy on the hypotheticals.

Oh, and if Wooster's starting five had a spleenectomy before the game, OWU would win easily....

I pulled up the video for the last 10 minutes.  I couldn't believe what I was seeing, with whistles on every single possession - at least that is what it seemed like.  Honestly, in the time I was watching, I don't remember that many possessions where a foul was not called.  It was just hard to watch.

I only saw those 10 minutes, but there didn't seem to be any bias at all.  It was just bad both way, with any type of contact called a foul.

Well, it seemed to me that very often the Wooster guys had early position and were bumped or shoved by the offensive guy making a move.  Invariably, the foul was called on the stationary Wooster player.  At the other end, my enduring vision is of Thorpe driving, pump-faking, and having the defender fly into him.  Fouls called on the defense at both ends, but usually not at all the same.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 20, 2013, 03:42:12 PM
Wabash comes back from their drubbing yesterday and bests Oberlin on the road 62-54. No matter the opponent, that's a good result for this young squad.

Wooster 8-0
OWU 6-2
Witt 5-3
DePauw 4-4
Hiram 4-4
Denison 3-5
Kenyon 3-5
Wabash 3-5
Oberlin 2-6
Allegheny 2-6
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 23, 2013, 07:59:53 PM
Best team, worst video.  Embarrassing.  I can't even make it through a half anymore without it screwing up so badly that it's either totally offline or unwatchable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 23, 2013, 08:53:38 PM
But how's the officiating?   :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2013, 08:59:01 PM
Final:  Wooster 86  Kenyon 52  :)

This game was over at halftime when Wooster had a 27 point lead.  Scots were led tonight by Kenny DeBoer with 15 points, Doug Thorpe with 13 points, Xavier Brown with 11 points and Alex LaLonde with 9 points.

Ikenna Nwadibia led the Lords with 16 points.  Wooster shot 53% from the floor and held Kenyon to 33%.

Wooster is now 15-2, 9-0 NCAC  ;D  Next game is at home vs Hiram on Saturday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2013, 09:10:58 PM
Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 77  Wabash 53  nice road win for the Bishops

OWU led by Marshall Morris with 20 points, Andy Winters with 16 and Reuel Rogers with 16.  Bishops shot 54% from the floor and held the Little Giants to 38% shooting.

For Wabash, top scorers were Andy Walsh with 11 points and Pete Nicksic with 10.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 23, 2013, 09:17:45 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 23, 2013, 07:59:53 PM
Best team, worst video.  Embarrassing.  I can't even make it through a half anymore without it screwing up so badly that it's either totally offline or unwatchable.

You're right. Easily ten times worse than Hope's video.

;) ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2013, 09:46:38 PM
Final:  Allegheny 75  Hiram 71   good road win for the Gators

DePauw and Witt tied at 55-55 and now going to Overtime.  Barry Flynn hit 2 FT's with 1 second left to tie it up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2013, 10:02:37 PM
Final:  Denison 77  Oberlin 62

Final:  DePauw 68  Wittenberg 66 OT   Alex Payne hit the game winner just before the buzzer
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 23, 2013, 10:07:28 PM
NCAC Standings with 1/23 Results:

Wooster 9-0
Ohio Wesleyan 7-2
DePauw 5-4
Wittenberg 5-4
Hiram 4-5
Denison 4-5
Allegheny 3-6
Kenyon 3-6
Wabash 3-6
Oberlin 2-7
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 23, 2013, 11:17:05 PM
Out of pocket today with work at a client site both during hours and after hours. Fun....

Thanks for updates!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 23, 2013, 11:19:01 PM
It's obvious that the real race will be for 3rd through 8th. The muddled middle.

You want to be 3rd through 6th because you avoid Wooster and OWU in the first round and I don't think anyone has real fear and loathing of playing at any of the contenders for the 3rd through 6th spot. Yet, you want to be in 7th or 8th because at least you get a game - you get that chance to make history.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2013, 05:28:03 PM
The Daily Record reports today that the NCAA has ruled that Wooster's victory over Sheridan (Can.) on Jan. 4 *will* be counted as an official game. No link since TDR is a subscription-only service. Wooster's official record moves to 16-2 with Tuesday's decision.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: OhioRed17 on January 24, 2013, 06:39:50 PM
The muddled middle ... is it a case of everyone in the NCAC save Wooster and OWU being bad or is it something else? I've seen several NCAC games this year and it seems to me that no one is all that good save for the teams I mentioned. I can't figure out half the teams from game to game or week to week. Any thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 24, 2013, 10:48:27 PM
It would seem that way except that the NCAC has enjoyed some of it's best non-conference records in the past two years. Is it just parity that makes it look so?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2013, 12:48:34 PM
I think we're seeing parity amongst the teams and the sustaining of improvement for teams like Kenyon and Hiram, and a great improvement in Allegheny. Denison, Witt and Wabash are disappointing this year but Witt's issues seem to be in-conference and not during the non-conference season.

I'd much rather have the conference be a slog, where even the elite teams have to work for wins against everyone and the conference does well outside of its boundaries (especially against the OAC, HCAC and PrAC) instead of having a dominate two or three and everyone else be mediocre or worse.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2013, 12:55:15 PM
In Massey, the NCAC is the 8th best conference behind: UAA, WIAC, CCIW, ODAC, IIAC, MAC and MIAC.

In the Massey power ratings (out of 412 teams):

6. Wooster
21. OWU
74. Witt
80. DePauw
132. Hiram
174. Allegheny
189. Kenyon
254. Denison
261. Wabash
344. Oberlin
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2013, 02:30:51 PM
Got back way way way late last night (thanks American Airlines!)

Most interesting game I see today is OWU @ DePauw. Kenyon @ Allegheny could provide more clarity, or more muddle, for the middle.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 26, 2013, 02:43:07 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 26, 2013, 02:30:51 PM
Got back way way way late last night (thanks American Airlines!)

Most interesting game I see today is OWU @ DePauw. Kenyon @ Allegheny could provide more clarity, or more muddle, for the middle.

Other games are:
Oberlin at Witt
Wabash at Denison
Hiram at Wooster

I think everything is an afternoon tilt, except for Hiram-Wooster.

The biggest chance for an upset of note will be OWU at DePauw.  Might be a little tough for the Bishops making a second trip to Indy this week after a tough home loss to the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2013, 04:07:29 PM
I just wanted to point out that Oberlin was beating Wittenberg with under 10 minutes to go in the game.

UPDATE: It's 39-37 Oberlin with 6:41 to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2013, 04:33:00 PM
Oberlin had a chance to tie the game with less than 10 seconds to go, but air-balled a three. Wittenberg wins 51-47.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2013, 04:35:47 PM
OWU was called for intentional and technical fouls with less than a minute to go - and now OWU and DPU are in OT.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 26, 2013, 04:36:50 PM
Vaughn Spalding had a bad last minute for OWU at DePauw, in OT now tied at 61.

00:15   OWUM   FOUL by Vaughn Spaulding
00:15   OWUM   FOUL by Vaughn Spaulding
00:55   OWUM   FOUL TECHNCL by Vaughn Spaulding
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2013, 04:37:35 PM
Great games all around! Kenyon edges past Allegheny 71-69 on a jumper by Nwadibia at the buzzer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2013, 04:39:37 PM
Denison beats Wabash 70-63. Wabash had it cut to four with two minutes to go. Alas.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2013, 04:41:33 PM
Quote from: sac on January 26, 2013, 04:36:50 PM
Vaughn Spalding had a bad last minute for OWU at DePauw, in OT now tied at 61.

00:15   OWUM   FOUL by Vaughn Spaulding
00:15   OWUM   FOUL by Vaughn Spaulding
00:55   OWUM   FOUL TECHNCL by Vaughn Spaulding

I think they cleaned it up.


00:54   OWUM   FOUL by Vaughn Spaulding
00:55   OWUM   FOUL TECHNCL by Vaughn Spaulding
00:55   DPU   GOOD! FT SHOT by Kevin Sullivan   DPU 61 - OWUM 61   Tied
00:55   DPU   GOOD! FT SHOT by Kevin Sullivan   OWUM 61 - DPU 60   (OWUM by 1)
00:55   DPU   GOOD! FT SHOT by Michael Wilkison   OWUM 61 - DPU 59   (OWUM by 2)
00:55   DPU   GOOD! FT SHOT by Michael Wilkison   OWUM 61 - DPU 58   (OWUM by 3)
00:55   OWUM   FOUL by Claude Gray
00:56   DPU   STEAL by Kevin Sullivan
00:57   OWUM   TURNOVR by Andy Winters

Looks like Gray committed an intentional foul, and Spaudling protested too much, getting a "T" which is also a personal foul.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2013, 04:49:02 PM
It's a final and an 'upset' - DPU bests OWU 65-63 in OT.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2013, 04:53:25 PM
Standings as of now:

Wooster 9-0
OWU 7-3
DePauw 6-4
Wittenberg 6-4
Denison 5-5
Hiram 4-5
Kenyon 4-6
Allegheny 3-7
Wabash 3-7
Oberlin 2-8

That's a big win for DePauw as it shakes up the #2 seed race. Too early to break out the tiebreakers?

Big win for Kenyon as well as it moves them into a potential 6th place tie with Hiram. Allegheny's loss right now has them out of the tourney as Wabash, which has a win in the only H2H, will get #8.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 26, 2013, 08:02:41 PM
At the Half: Wooster 26  Hiram 26

Neither team shot well in the half with Wooster at only 34% and Hiram at 31%.  The Terriers did make 4 three pointers while the Scots were 1 of 13 from behind the arc.

Wooster is being led by Kenny DeBoer with 8 points.  Alan Sheppard is leading Hiram with 13 (3 three pointers).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 26, 2013, 09:08:18 PM
Final:  Wooster 68  Hiram 63  :)

Wooster was led by Jake Mays with 13 points, Kenny DeBoer with 10, Xavier Brown with 10 and Doug Thorpe with 10.

Hiram's top scorers were Alan Sheppard with 22 points and Aaron Stefanov with 16 points

Scots won this game despite making only 10 of 30 free throws.  ::)

Wooster has beaten Hiram twice this season which OWU and Witt were unable to achieve. ;)  Coach Moore noted on the post game show that Wooster's defense won this game as they held Hiram to only 34% shooting.

Wooster is now 17-2, 10-0 NCAC ;D  Next game is Denison at home on 1/30

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on January 26, 2013, 09:17:47 PM
The Scots survive three Hiram chances to tie the game in the closing seconds on 3-point attempts. Wooster sealed it by making a pair of free throws. It wasn't pretty, but it's a win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 26, 2013, 09:19:20 PM
10-30 on FT's and 4-18 on 3's - wow. Those are games that can show the fortitude of a team. On the good side Wooster had only 8 TO's.

Looking forward to Wednesday as coach Moore is now at 699 wins (and the senior class is at 99 wins).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 26, 2013, 09:23:10 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on January 26, 2013, 09:17:47 PM
The Scots survive three Hiram chances to tie the game in the closing seconds on 3-point attempts. Wooster sealed it by making a pair of free throws. It wasn't pretty, but it's a win.

And that's pretty much the key to the Scots dominance the last several years. They win the games they should.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 26, 2013, 09:30:53 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 26, 2013, 09:23:10 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on January 26, 2013, 09:17:47 PM
The Scots survive three Hiram chances to tie the game in the closing seconds on 3-point attempts. Wooster sealed it by making a pair of free throws. It wasn't pretty, but it's a win.

And that's pretty much the key to the Scots dominance the last several years. They win the games they should.

True.  But another way to look at this is that they won a game that they shouldn't (have).  Geeze-Oh-Pete!  20 free throws missed!  Why, my grandmother...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2013, 10:01:15 PM
Standings as of now:

Wooster 10-0
OWU 7-3
DePauw 6-4
Wittenberg 6-4
Denison 5-5
Hiram 4-6
Kenyon 4-6
Allegheny 3-7
Wabash 3-7
Oberlin 2-8
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 27, 2013, 09:24:18 AM
wow, kenyon has two big games this week, hiram and depauw. I am going to the depauw game. Shouuld make for a interesting saturday. A little bit of swimming and diving, with basketball at kenyon followed at mt. vernon nazarene added. Maybe the lords can repeat the success of the football team this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 27, 2013, 09:36:18 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 26, 2013, 10:01:15 PM
Standings as of now:

Wooster 10-0
OWU 7-3
DePauw 6-4
Wittenberg 6-4
Denison 5-5
Hiram 4-6
Kenyon 4-6
Allegheny 3-7
Wabash 3-7
Oberlin 2-8


Looks like the coaches did a pretty good job in their pre-season poll this year.
1. Wooster
2. OWU
3. DePauw
4. Wittenberg
5. Wabash
6. Denison
7. Kenyon
8. Hiram
9. Allegheny
10. Oberlin
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 27, 2013, 10:58:22 AM
So, with 20 missed ft's is it fair to say that Wooster might be spending a bit of time at the ft line this week in practice?  Good grief, that was one of the worst ft shooting performances I've seen in my life?!  Not too often that you see a team go 10-30 from the charity stripe and still come away with a win.

Still, it was a win and now Wooster enjoys what appears to be an insurmountable 3 game lead with 6 games to play including home dates with Witt and OWU.   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 27, 2013, 11:04:58 AM
guess I shouldn't be so hard on otterbein with their problems at the line. It seems like it wasn't that long ago if you wanted to see good ft shooting you had to go to a d3 game. For some reason it seems that d3 has lowered themselves to d1 level at the line the last couple of years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 27, 2013, 02:50:42 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 26, 2013, 09:30:53 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 26, 2013, 09:23:10 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on January 26, 2013, 09:17:47 PM
The Scots survive three Hiram chances to tie the game in the closing seconds on 3-point attempts. Wooster sealed it by making a pair of free throws. It wasn't pretty, but it's a win.

And that's pretty much the key to the Scots dominance the last several years. They win the games they should.

True.  But another way to look at this is that they won a game that they shouldn't (have).  Geeze-Oh-Pete!  20 free throws missed!  Why, my grandmother...
While I'm not willing to call this Scot team great, I would say that winning the games you should and winning a share of the games you shouldn't is the mark of a really great program.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 27, 2013, 02:57:15 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on January 27, 2013, 11:04:58 AM
guess I shouldn't be so hard on otterbein with their problems at the line. It seems like it wasn't that long ago if you wanted to see good ft shooting you had to go to a d3 game. For some reason it seems that d3 has lowered themselves to d1 level at the line the last couple of years.

The median in D3 is around 68 this year the average will probably be just over 69%.   8 teams in the OAC shoot over that number, including Otterbein.  The NCAC appears to be positively dreadful at the line with only 2 teams over what will be the avg.  The D3 average was a touch over 69% last season.  FT shooting in the college game has leveled off in recent years and has come up 2% points from the early/mid 90's.


The NCAA keeps lots of historical trend stats.
http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/public/ncaa/resources/stats/m+basketball/trends.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 27, 2013, 05:00:00 PM
Sac: I put up 10,000 posts.
Wooster Booster: Nobody can put up 10,000 posts.
Sac: I done it, right here.
Wooster Booster: My boy says he put up 10,000 posts, he put up 10,000 posts.
Scotsfan: Yeah, but in how long?
Sac: A hour.

:)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 27, 2013, 10:27:47 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 27, 2013, 05:00:00 PM
Sac: I put up 10,000 posts.
Wooster Booster: Nobody can put up 10,000 posts.
Sac: I done it, right here.
Wooster Booster: My boy says he put up 10,000 posts, he put up 10,000 posts.
Scotsfan: Yeah, but in how long?
Sac: A hour.

:)

I'd have 12,000 but the refs suck.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 28, 2013, 08:59:37 AM
Quote from: sac on January 27, 2013, 10:27:47 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 27, 2013, 05:00:00 PM
Sac: I put up 10,000 posts.
Wooster Booster: Nobody can put up 10,000 posts.
Sac: I done it, right here.
Wooster Booster: My boy says he put up 10,000 posts, he put up 10,000 posts.
Scotsfan: Yeah, but in how long?
Sac: A hour.

:)

I'd have 12,000 but the refs suck.  :)

Damned straight. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2013, 01:59:48 PM
We got stuff happening tonight!

Allegheny (3-7, 9-10) @ Oberlin (2-8, 4-15) - The Gators nipped the Yeomen by four in their first meeting, at Allegheny. Oberlin has played a lot better than their 4-15 record indicates, and this could be a tough one for Allegheny. Then, every game seems like a tough one for the Gators, since almost every game comes down right to the end.

Hiram (4-6, 10-9) @ Kenyon (4-6, 10-9) - A big game for conference standings and seedings, this contest is a rematch of a game where the Terriers took care of the Lords 74-63. Hiram's on a two game losing streak now, dropping a tough one to Allegheny last week before the requisite loss to Wooster but that was only by five. Kenyon beat the Gators Saturday and were blown out by Wooster earlier. So, this is a big ol' tossup I suppose with no clear trends either way to forecast who has the definitive advantage. It may be the most entertaining game of the night, though.

Denison (5-5, 7-12) @ Wooster (10-0, 17-2) - On paper, no contest. In reality, it should be, yet...Denison has won three in a row after their long losing streak. The Scots also survived a scare from Hiram Saturday. I still don't think Wooster will be challenged by the Big Red, but we'll just wait until the ball is in the air to really fin out.


DePauw (6-4, 13-6) @ Wabash (3-7, 5-14) - News flash...these teams don't like each other. Prepare for a battle.

Wittenberg (6-4, 13-6) @ Ohio Wesleyan (7-3, 14-4) - This is a compelling matchup. An Old Tigers win means that second in the conference is going to be dragged into the muddled middle. A win by the Bishops gets their program back on the right course after hitting some doldrums. I think OWU needs this more since they're still a quite viable "C" and would have more to gain by being the #2 seed. Face it, neither team is playing well right now


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on January 30, 2013, 08:12:00 PM
Wooster was up 19-2 after 5 minutes, and leads Denison 51-32 at the break.

OWU leads Witt, 36-33 at half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2013, 08:17:34 PM
Hiram is up 32-30 at the half.

DPU is ahead at Wabash 28-22 in a game that resembles a rugby scrum at times. Apt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2013, 08:44:30 PM
Wabash now up 48-42 with 4:37 to go!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2013, 09:00:05 PM
OWU rights the ship, beats Witt 63-51.

Wooster with no problems over Denison 94-64.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2013, 09:03:15 PM
WABASH ALWAYS FIGHTS! Down six at half, the Little Giants come back and win 52-48. Makes the rest of the season go down easier, for sure!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2013, 09:13:42 PM
Kenyon surges ahead in the second half and beats Hiram 76-68.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2013, 09:17:45 PM
Oberlin upends Allegheny 67-59. So some stability at the top and some further muddling of the middle.

Standings as of now:

Wooster 11-0
OWU 8-3
DePauw 6-5
Wittenberg 6-5
Denison 5-6
Kenyon 5-6
Hiram 4-7
Wabash 4-7
Allegheny 3-8
Oberlin 3-8
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 30, 2013, 09:28:21 PM
I watched this one for about the first 10 minutes on the internet then had to leave the house. A very impressive start by the Scot's. They were very focused on both ends of the court.

Congratulations to coach Steve Moore on his 700th career win. The consistency of his accomplishment can be reflected on the list below:

First 100:    Feb  13, 1988  CWRU           100-74 (includes Muhlenberg)
2nd  100:    Jan  20, 1993  Denison         100-29
3rd   100:    Nov 29, 1997 Mount Union   100-27
4th   100:    Dec  8, 2001 Kenyon           100-17
5th   100:    Nov 18, 2005 Kalamazoo      100-17 (includes first Final Four)
6th   100:    Mar  6, 2009 Gettyburg        100-20 (tournament win, includes second Final Four)
7th   100:    Jan 30, 2013 Denison           100-17 (includes third Final Four)

Those last four sets are just about as consistent as can be...


In addition, for the 11th straight season we have a senior class with 100 wins (100-16)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on January 30, 2013, 09:41:49 PM
Wooster's hot shooting continued in the second half tonight, as the Scots finish with five players in double figures, including De Vaughn Wingard, who scored 14 off the bench in just 14 minutes. Also, Wooster had only 4 turnovers tonight, but got out-rebounded 41-40.  The Scots' intensity was impressive throughout.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 30, 2013, 09:49:43 PM
Quote from: goscots on January 30, 2013, 09:28:21 PM
I watched this one for about the first 10 minutes on the internet then had to leave the house. A very impressive start by the Scot's. They were very focused on both ends of the court.

Congratulations to coach Steve Moore on his 700th career win. The consistency of his accomplishment can be reflected on the list below:

First 100:    Feb  13, 1988  CWRU           100-74 (includes Muhlenberg)
2nd  100:    Jan  20, 1993  Denison         100-29
3rd   100:    Nov 29, 1997 Mount Union   100-27
4th   100:    Dec  8, 2001 Kenyon           100-17
5th   100:    Nov 18, 2005 Kalamazoo      100-17 (includes first Final Four)
6th   100:    Mar  6, 2009 Gettyburg        100-20 (tournament win, includes second Final Four)
7th   100:    Jan 30, 2013 Denison           100-17 (includes third Final Four)

Those last four sets are just about as consistent as can be...


In addition, for the 11th straight season we have a senior class with 100 wins (100-16)

Wow.  Those numbers are ridiculous!  Congrats to Coach Moore on yet another milestone!

Also, I wonder if there is any sort of record keeping of how many consecutive senior classes to collect 100 wins. 

Consistent is definitely the word to describe Moore's tenure as head coach at Wooster!

Btw, Moore may not have the most wins among active coaches, but i heard it mentioned on the radio broadcast that he is #1 all time in winning percentage!   8-)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 30, 2013, 10:21:19 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 30, 2013, 09:17:45 PM
Oberlin upends Allegheny 67-59. So some stability at the top and some further muddling of the middle.

Standings as of now:

Wooster 11-0
OWU 8-3
DePauw 6-5
Wittenberg 6-5
Denison 5-6
Kenyon 5-6
Hiram 4-7
Wabash 4-7
Allegheny 3-8
Oberlin 3-8

I believe that Wooster can now wrap up the #1 seed with a win next Wed at home vs OWU, no matter what happens in Saturday's games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2013, 10:42:22 PM
I believe you are correct, since they'll be 12-0, and if they slip and go 12-4 only OWU can tie them. They'll have tiebreakers against OWU. So Wooster hosts again.

Now, as for the OTHER seven spots.... :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on January 30, 2013, 10:59:11 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 30, 2013, 10:42:22 PM
I believe you are correct, since they'll be 12-0, and if they slip and go 12-4 only OWU can tie them. They'll have tiebreakers against OWU. So Wooster hosts again.

Now, as for the OTHER seven spots.... :o

The Scots final stretch is no easy schedule:
at Wabash
Ohio Wesleyan
Wittenberg
at Allegheny
at DePauw

Considering that three of those opponenets defeated Wooster last year and OWU is second in the standings.... 12-4 is not unbelievable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2013, 10:27:58 AM
Ok, Lou Holtz!  ;)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 01, 2013, 11:19:23 AM
Tomorrow the middle will either get more or less muddled. Since it's the NCAC in 2013, expect the former.

Wooster (11-0, 18-2) @ Wabash (4-7, 6-14) - Wooster is Public Enemy #3 in the eyes of Wabash fans, and the trip there is never 'fun' for the Scots. This season it looks to be a bit more fun as the Little Giants are coming off of a big win that may have sapped them a bit emotionally. However, Wabash will be looking to put a "1" on the loss column for the Scots and the fan base will be raucous and ready for them. Put away the knitting and cheer!

Oberlin (3-8, 5-15) @ Ohio Wesleyan (8-3, 15-4) - The Bishops are probably a big favorite here, but the Yeomen have been sneaky close in many games and the Bishops at times play down to their level of competition. The win over Wittenberg was a big boost, no doubt, for OWU's confidence and a big win over Oberlin could mean a solid #2 seed for the Bishops later this month.

Wittenberg (6-5, 13-7) @ Allegheny (3-8, 9-11) - Ah, what to make of the Old Tigers? Gone is the heady optimism of November and December. In is the harsh reality of a potential .500 conference season and a road trip in the first round of the tournament if they don't get their act together. Allegheny's stumbled a bit, but they'll play hard and compete with Wittenberg. Who knows what can happen here.

DePauw (6-5, 13-7) @ Kenyon (5-6, 11-9) - The rivalry loss to Wabash was a killer for the New Tigers. They lost a chance to put themselves in third place, and now they're going to be scrambling to stay over .500. The Lords beat DPU in Greendingle earlier this season, so they'll have confidence and a little momentum on their side. This is a very important game for seeding and hosting purposes.

Denison (5-6, 7-13) @ Hiram (4-7, 10-10) - Hiram's cratering right now, having lost three straight (including two quite winnable games). Is a visit from the Big Red the tonic they need? Well, um...no. Despite getting crushed by Wooster on Wednesday, Denison's on a much better path than they were around the first of the year. A loss by the Terriers will send them into a dangerous place of potential relegation from the conference tourney, so they need this win.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 02, 2013, 09:27:03 AM
Quote from: goscots on January 30, 2013, 09:28:21 PM
I watched this one for about the first 10 minutes on the internet then had to leave the house. A very impressive start by the Scot's. They were very focused on both ends of the court.

Congratulations to coach Steve Moore on his 700th career win. The consistency of his accomplishment can be reflected on the list below:

First 100:    Feb  13, 1988  CWRU           100-74 (includes Muhlenberg)
2nd  100:    Jan  20, 1993  Denison         100-29
3rd   100:    Nov 29, 1997 Mount Union   100-27
4th   100:    Dec  8, 2001 Kenyon           100-17
5th   100:    Nov 18, 2005 Kalamazoo      100-17 (includes first Final Four)
6th   100:    Mar  6, 2009 Gettyburg        100-20 (tournament win, includes second Final Four)
7th   100:    Jan 30, 2013 Denison           100-17 (includes third Final Four)

Those last four sets are just about as consistent as can be...


In addition, for the 11th straight season we have a senior class with 100 wins (100-16)

Congratulation to Wooster Coach Steve Moore on his 700th career win! :)  It was also nice to see that he was interviewed on Hoopsville and recognized for this accomplishment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 02, 2013, 02:45:00 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 27  Wabash 17

Wooster is being led by Doug Thorpe with 8 points, Jake Mays with 6 and Jalen Goodwin with 6.

Top scorers for Wabash are Ross Sponsler with 6 points and Andy Walsh with 3 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: DadofBashWarrior.. on February 02, 2013, 02:50:16 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 02, 2013, 09:27:03 AM
Quote from: goscots on January 30, 2013, 09:28:21 PM
I watched this one for about the first 10 minutes on the internet then had to leave the house. A very impressive start by the Scot's. They were very focused on both ends of the court.

Congratulations to coach Steve Moore on his 700th career win. The consistency of his accomplishment can be reflected on the list below:

First 100:    Feb  13, 1988  CWRU           100-74 (includes Muhlenberg)
2nd  100:    Jan  20, 1993  Denison         100-29
3rd   100:    Nov 29, 1997 Mount Union   100-27
4th   100:    Dec  8, 2001 Kenyon           100-17
5th   100:    Nov 18, 2005 Kalamazoo      100-17 (includes first Final Four)
6th   100:    Mar  6, 2009 Gettyburg        100-20 (tournament win, includes second Final Four)
7th   100:    Jan 30, 2013 Denison           100-17 (includes third Final Four)

Those last four sets are just about as consistent as can be...


In addition, for the 11th straight season we have a senior class with 100 wins (100-16)
Extremely impressive.

Congratulation to Wooster Coach Steve Moore on his 700th career win! :)  It was also nice to see that he was interviewed on Hoopsville and recognized for this accomplishment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 03:39:38 PM
Wittenberg beat Allegheny 81-64.

However, our attention is somewhere else!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 02, 2013, 03:47:03 PM
Final:  Wabash 55  Wooster 48

Congratulations to the Little Giants on a big upset!

Wooster was led by Jake Mays with 10 points and Jalen Goodwin with 9 points.

Ross Sponsler led Wabash with 20 points and Andy Walsh had 7 points.

Wooster lost this game by shooting only 32% and having 15 turnovers.

Wooster is now 18-3, 11-1 NCAC.  Next game is Ohio Wesleyan at home on 2/6

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 02, 2013, 03:51:22 PM
Credit Wabash with pretty good defense throughout, but man, Wooster looked just simply terrible against the zone. Didn't seem like they ever had a workable game plan to counteract it. Obviously making a couple more of their open looks at 3s would've helped, but the ball movement was simply lackluster throughout and made it too easy for Wabash to force Wooster into 1) the shots 'Bash wanted Wooster to be taking, and 2) the pace of play that Wabash wanted.

Also, awaiting obligatory WoosterBooster post about how the officiating lost the game for the Scots (it didn't).   :) :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 03:51:40 PM
Wow! Huge, impressive win for Wabash. They had to win with defense, and things were looking rough early on, but Wabash put on a defensive clinic and held Wooster to 31.9% shooting.

Sure, it wasn't pretty, but anyone who say the Wabash / DPU game Wednesday at Chadwick knew how this game was going to be. What's even more surprising is that Wooster was up 15-2 at one point in the first half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 03:52:35 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 02, 2013, 03:51:22 PM

Also, awaiting obligatory WoosterBooster post about how the officiating lost the game for the Scots (it didn't).

HAH! :D

You can't complain about a slog when you allow the game to become a slog.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 02, 2013, 03:59:42 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 03:52:35 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 02, 2013, 03:51:22 PM

Also, awaiting obligatory WoosterBooster post about how the officiating lost the game for the Scots (it didn't).

HAH! :D

You can't complain about a slog when you allow the game to become a slog.

Honestly, I didn't think it looked too much like a slog from a physical contact perspective - there was definitely more contact in the second half overall, but to me the "sloggiest" parts of the game was just in the overall pace that it was played at - both teams working pretty deep into the shot clock, not too much offensive flow from either side. Even when the Scots were establishing the 15-2 lead, they didn't really look *good* on offense - I mean they had like 15 points but 8 turnovers(!) in those first 8 or 9 minutes!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 04:01:20 PM
For the most part, that's what I meant. The pace was definitely what Wabash wanted. That's what they did against DPU Wednesday as well - take the rhythm out of the game and make it a half-court battle. With that, you're going to have physical play inside if you can't hit the outside shots.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 04:03:55 PM
OWU seems to be taking care of business against Oberlin.

Meanwhile, Kenyon is making life hard for the New Tigers. The Lords lead DPU 42-33 with 11:40 to go.

And as soon as I flip on the video, it's now 42-39, just like that...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 02, 2013, 04:05:54 PM
The Scots final stretch is no easy schedule:
at Wabash
Ohio Wesleyan
Wittenberg
at Allegheny
at DePauw

Considering that three two of those opponenets defeated Wooster last year and OWU is second in the standings.... 12-4 is not unbelievable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 04:16:05 PM
Kenyon now up by 11 with 5:11 to go. More muddle...

DPU now cuts it to four with under three to play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 04:22:54 PM
OWU blasts Oberlin 68-40.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 02, 2013, 04:24:09 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 02, 2013, 03:51:22 PM
Credit Wabash with pretty good defense throughout, but man, Wooster looked just simply terrible against the zone. Didn't seem like they ever had a workable game plan to counteract it. Obviously making a couple more of their open looks at 3s would've helped, but the ball movement was simply lackluster throughout and made it too easy for Wabash to force Wooster into 1) the shots 'Bash wanted Wooster to be taking, and 2) the pace of play that Wabash wanted.

Also, awaiting obligatory WoosterBooster post about how the officiating lost the game for the Scots (it didn't).   :) :D

Must be that rookie coach Wooster's got! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 04:29:16 PM
Huge steal and lay-up by Flynn of DPU. Liebowitz commits the foul and fouls out for Kenyon. Yikes for the Lords. DPU commits a lane violation on the FT, though. It's 63-62 Kenyon with 41 seconds to go.

UPDATE: Kenyon hits one of two, then Flynn goes baseline for a bucket, ties the game, and hits a FT. DPU up 1.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 04:32:39 PM
Denison leads Hiram 36-29 at the half. Ye Gods, Terriers, what happened?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 04:36:07 PM
Ikenna Nwadibia hits an inside bucket to give Kenyon a lead 66-65 with three seconds to go. DPU travels in the backcourt with .3 seconds left. The Lords exhale and win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 02, 2013, 04:36:46 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 02, 2013, 03:51:22 PM
Credit Wabash with pretty good defense throughout, but man, Wooster looked just simply terrible against the zone. Didn't seem like they ever had a workable game plan to counteract it. Obviously making a couple more of their open looks at 3s would've helped, but the ball movement was simply lackluster throughout and made it too easy for Wabash to force Wooster into 1) the shots 'Bash wanted Wooster to be taking, and 2) the pace of play that Wabash wanted.

Also, awaiting obligatory WoosterBooster post about how the officiating lost the game for the Scots (it didn't).   :) :D

Fiddlesticks. :)  The refs had nothing to do with this debacle.  Wabash, although they played hard as always, didn't have much to do with it either.  Wooster doesn't lose many games, and when they do seldom can any of the blame be put on the coaching staff.  Today, though, geeze.  The Scot's momentum was lost early on when they went out of rotation and mass-substituted.  It was as if they felt the game, if not already in hand, was one that couldn't possibly be lost.  From that point on, though, even after the regulars slowly filtered back onto the court, Wabash had hope and Wooster never had an offense.

They looked totally lost against the zone.  One can only wish that the video of this game will somehow get misplaced or destroyed so no future opponents can see it.  No plan, no idea, no concept of what to do.  And also, when they did get some penetration, or Wabash would miss an assignment, the Wooster players just never seemed to spot their open guys.  This team, I just don't know.  Today they were totally nowhere.

(All refs stink.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on February 02, 2013, 04:45:50 PM
Sorry Wooster Booster. Highlights will be posted shortly and the entire game will be available Monday on the Wabash College YouTube Channel. http://www.youtube.com/wabashcollege (http://www.youtube.com/wabashcollege)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 04:50:18 PM
HA!

Hiram seemed to listen to my criticism and has cut the lead to two in less than three minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 02, 2013, 04:50:49 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 02, 2013, 04:36:46 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 02, 2013, 03:51:22 PM
Credit Wabash with pretty good defense throughout, but man, Wooster looked just simply terrible against the zone. Didn't seem like they ever had a workable game plan to counteract it. Obviously making a couple more of their open looks at 3s would've helped, but the ball movement was simply lackluster throughout and made it too easy for Wabash to force Wooster into 1) the shots 'Bash wanted Wooster to be taking, and 2) the pace of play that Wabash wanted.

Also, awaiting obligatory WoosterBooster post about how the officiating lost the game for the Scots (it didn't).   :) :D

Fiddlesticks. :)  The refs had nothing to do with this debacle.  Wabash, although they played hard as always, didn't have much to do with it either.  Wooster doesn't lose many games, and when they do seldom can any of the blame be put on the coaching staff.  Today, though, geeze.  The Scot's momentum was lost early on when they went out of rotation and mass-substituted.  It was as if they felt the game, if not already in hand, was one that couldn't possibly be lost.  From that point on, though, even after the regulars slowly filtered back onto the court, Wabash had hope and Wooster never had an offense.

They looked totally lost against the zone.  One can only wish that the video of this game will somehow get misplaced or destroyed so no future opponents can see it.  No plan, no idea, no concept of what to do.  And also, when they did get some penetration, or Wabash would miss an assignment, the Wooster players just never seemed to spot their open guys.  This team, I just don't know.  Today they were totally nowhere.

(All refs stink.)

I don't get to say this often, Wooster Booster, but I entirely agree with you about the above.  :) Except maybe the "all refs stink."  ;D

But yes, "totally lost against the zone," there I completely agree with you. Just simply no cohesive approach to attacking it.

All in all, a bit rough for this Scots fan's first chance to watch a game all the way through in weeks.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 02, 2013, 04:51:46 PM
Quote from: wabashsid on February 02, 2013, 04:45:50 PM
Sorry Wooster Booster. Highlights will be posted shortly and the entire game will be available Monday on the Wabash College YouTube Channel. http://www.youtube.com/wabashcollege (http://www.youtube.com/wabashcollege)

ZING! +k

Also - great broadcast! Love the multiple camera angles and score bar/shot clock/game clock graphic. Very helpful!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on February 02, 2013, 05:05:08 PM
Kilted Bryan --- thanks. Totally produced by our students. They have done a fantastic job all season long with the broadcasts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 02, 2013, 05:07:24 PM
Quote from: wabashsid on February 02, 2013, 04:45:50 PM
Sorry Wooster Booster. Highlights will be posted shortly and the entire game will be available Monday on the Wabash College YouTube Channel. http://www.youtube.com/wabashcollege (http://www.youtube.com/wabashcollege)

YouTube is now called the Wabash College YouTube Channel?  Wow, talk about a hostile takeover!  Will all the videos now be altered to include guys in Wally-style striped pants? :)

Seriously, yeah, it was a very nice broadcast, although I must admit I was listening to the WQKT audio which managed to stay almost completely in sync.  Sports streaming has come a long way at most schools, and thankfully much of it is still free.  Still, I'll bet that in ten years everything will be in HD and and will make today's work look like fifties tv.  Which I remember. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 05:12:39 PM
I'm spoiled by the good work done at Wabash in streaming games. Wabash has one of the best productions especially since you need to remember that these are students (and there's not even a broadcasting major at Wabash, even).

I'm glad most schools have some video - some better than others but it's all getting better.

Hiram, however, hasn't joined the streaming brigade. That's sad, because I'd be watching as they just took a 54-53 lead over Denison with five minutes to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 05:28:26 PM
Denison came back, and survived some horrid free throw shooting  to beat Hiram 70-64.

With this result and Kenyon's win over DPU (and the Wabash upset), we're really mired in the middle muddle.

Standings:

Wooster 11-1
OWU 9-3
Wittenberg 7-5
DePauw 6-6
Kenyon 6-6
Denison 6-6
Wabash 5-7
Hiram 4-8
Allegheny 3-9
Oberlin 3-9
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on February 02, 2013, 05:29:53 PM
Wooster Booster --- just part of the Wabash plan to rule the world!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2013, 07:52:21 PM
A note about Kenyon: I was pretty impressed with them in fits and starts and think they have the makings of being a good team. They have NO seniors, so they're going to be a sleeper next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 02, 2013, 08:05:29 PM
Quote from: wabashsid on February 02, 2013, 05:29:53 PM
Wooster Booster --- just part of the Wabash plan to rule the world!  :D

Well, if next week I find myself bidding on items on eWabash and checking my newsfeed on Wabashbook (or would it be Facebash?), I'm moving to Argentina. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 02, 2013, 08:31:55 PM
I believe this was the first time the Scots had been held under 50 points since the 47-45 win over Manchester in the second round of the 2011 NCAA tournament. The game recap (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/ncaa/rounds1and2/index) from that one indicates that those 47 points were the lowest output for the Scots since a 46-43 loss to Wittenberg back in 1996.

So you don't hold Wooster under 50 all that often. Anyone know if Wabash had ever done it before?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on February 02, 2013, 09:03:06 PM
No. Lowest total for Wooster versus Wabash prior to today was the 58 points in last year's 72-58 win by the Little Giants. Wabash also won 75-58 at home in 2009.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 02, 2013, 09:28:49 PM
Wooster led 8-0 at the 17:19 mark in the first half, less than three minutes into the ballgame.  This was the high water mark for their offense, not the 15-2 score.  That didn't happen until almost five minutes later, when there was 12:41 on the clock, and was mostly helped by back-to-back threes from Jalen Goodwin.  So, Wooster only scored 40 points in the final 37:19 of the ballgame.  Yes, it was a low-possession game, but Wooster was seriously ineffective.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 02, 2013, 09:32:13 PM
darn, I really was looking forward to going to watch the kenyon game today but had to drive a state  salt truck all day. Seems like every time I miss a game because of snow it winds up being a great one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 03, 2013, 10:42:27 AM
Just though I'd throw my two cents in on a few things:

I do have to agree, kudos to Wabash as their game coverage is next to none in the conference, although Wittenberg isn't too bad itself  ;)

Also, not ALL refs stink, I happen to be quite a good one  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 03, 2013, 11:24:53 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 03, 2013, 10:42:27 AM
Also, not ALL refs stink, I happen to be quite a good one  ;D

Even all second-story-men claim to be good at what they do. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 03, 2013, 11:36:16 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 03, 2013, 11:24:53 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 03, 2013, 10:42:27 AM
Also, not ALL refs stink, I happen to be quite a good one  ;D

Even all second-story-men claim to be good at what they do. :)

Can you imagine games with NO refs?  Multiple murders come to mind?  General rioting?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 03, 2013, 11:55:05 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 03, 2013, 11:36:16 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 03, 2013, 11:24:53 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on February 03, 2013, 10:42:27 AM
Also, not ALL refs stink, I happen to be quite a good one  ;D

Even all second-story-men claim to be good at what they do. :)

Can you imagine games with NO refs?  Multiple murders come to mind?  General rioting?

I getcha.  You're saying it would be like John Carroll's games are now.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 04, 2013, 01:07:49 PM
I know what you mean about John Carroll's games, the coach does know how use his entire bench. It usually isn't pretty but normally effective.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 06, 2013, 11:59:01 AM
We have a big one tonight, and the rest of the contest will either clear the gridlock or mire the middle muddle worse.

DePauw (6-6, 13-8) @ Denison (6-6, 8-13) - Think back to the first of January. Did you even think that these two teams would be tied in the conference standings? Didn't think so. The Big Red have rebounded nicely after seemingly having the vapors, whilst the New Tigers have confounded most observers. How can a team that beat Wittenberg and OWU lose to Wabash (a rival, for sure, but still...) and Kenyon? Well, the answer is SPORTS! of course (h/t to Charlie Pierce), but still, DPU should be better than this.

Kenyon (6-6, 12-9) @ Oberlin (3-9, 5-16) - The Yeomen were absolutely trounced in their last effort against OWU, but they do seem to play better at home. This sets up as a 'trap' for the Lords, who have a big contest at home against Wabash on Saturday (for seeding in the NCAC tourney) and a loss would send them reeling back into the pack. Kenyon has won three straight, and seem to finally be playing up to par.

Hiram (4-8, 10-11) @ Allegheny (3-9, 9-12) - Oh, you Terriers. What the heck is going on? After their big win over Witt, they've dropped four straight including home losses to Allegheny and Denison, and now they travel to Gator land. Hiram better not lose this one if they want to make the tournament. Allegheny's lost three straight as well, though, after beating Hiram. This is a must-win game for both squads with the loser perhaps being excused from further play after Feb. 16th.

Wabash (5-7, 7-14) @ Wittenberg (7-5, 14-7) - The Little Giants' best week of the season was last week as they dispatched DPU and Wooster. Many Wabash fans are still grinning after whomping on the evil Dannies and one of the most storied D3 hoops programs. What's the encore? A trip to their #2 rival, the Old Tigers. Can they pull off the trifecta? Welp...um...it's gonna be tough. Sure, Witt's not WITT but they're still good and it's at home, where they may get an extra call or 10. But this team only beat Oberlin by four, and certainly Wabash can give them as good of a fight as that, right? If gambling were legal in FL and this was on the board, I'd take the points and put a sawbuck on Wabash's money line (depending on the odds, of course).

Ohio Wesleyan (9-3, 16-4) @ Wooster (11-1, 18-3) - Well, now, the coronation of the Scots seems to have hit a rut in the road. Yes, I think it's inevitable that Wooster will wear yet another regular season crown (despite the Lou Holtzing of some Wooster fans), but this could tip the scale from 'inevitable' to 'well, now...'. The Bishops regained their poise after some recent burbles of mediocrity and seem to be ready for a Wooster onslaught. And I bet there will be an onslaught. If there's one thing the Scots don't like to do, it's lose, and I'm sure practice this week wasn't kind and gentle.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 06, 2013, 08:04:24 PM
The Old Tigers are angry. They're up on Denison 39-13 with 2:16 to go in the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 06, 2013, 08:30:04 PM
At the Half:  Ohio Wesleyan 40  Wooster 31

OWU being led by Andy Winters with 10 points and Taylor Rieger also with 10 points.

Wooster's top scorers are Josh Claytor with 7 points, Xavier Brown with 5 and Doug Thorpe with 5.

The Bishops shot 49% in the half while the Scots only hit 41% of their shots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 06, 2013, 08:42:30 PM
Hiram leads Allegheny 31-24 at the half.

Oberlin and Kenyon tied at 27 at the half.

DPU is still up on Denison by a ton, 57-36 with 9:33 to go.

Wabash is making the game a slog again - Witt leads just 24-17 with 3:53 to go in the first.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 06, 2013, 09:21:25 PM
Wooster 60 Ohio Wesleyan 60  going to Overtime!

OWU led 58 to 45 and Wooster went on a 15-2 run to force the Overtime!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 06, 2013, 09:25:00 PM
DePauw holds on to whap Denison 77-56.

Witt's starting to put Wabash away, up 48-31 in the second.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 06, 2013, 09:32:52 PM
Hiram holds on and beats Allegheny 63-59.

Kenyon put it together in the second half and bests Oberlin 65-50.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 06, 2013, 09:36:13 PM
Final:  Wooster 74  Ohio Wesleyan 67 OT  ;D

Wooster clinches the NCAC regular season title :) ... as they control the tiebreaker versus OWU.

Wooster was led tonight by Josh Claytor with 17 points, Xavier Brown with 17, Doug Thorpe with 14 and Evan Pannell with 11.

OWU's top scorers were Taylor Rieger with 18 points, Andy Winters with 15 and Reuel Rogers with 10.

Wooster's defense won this game as they held the Bishops to only 2 points in the last 9 minutes of regulation.

Wooster is now 19-3, 12-1 NCAC ;D   Next game is Wittenberg at home on Saturday

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 06, 2013, 09:48:06 PM
Wittenberg blasts Wabash 64-47.

Up to the second standings, in what I think are the seeding order:

Wooster 12-1
OWU 9-4
Witt 8-5
Kenyon 7-6
DePauw 7-6
Denison 6-7
Hiram 5-8
Wabash 5-8
Allegheny 3-10
Oberlin 3-10
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 06, 2013, 10:07:19 PM
I was going to comment on the game (and may still), but the NCAA finally decided to release the regional rankings, and quite a shock. Wooster is No. 1, and Calvin is No. 4. Again, it's a reminder that the NCAA puts a bigger emphasis on SOS than I think some people realize, or tend to forget every year. And Wooster's SOS will go even higher this week by playing OWU and Witt.

http://www.ncaa.com/rankings/basketball-men/d3/regional_rankings
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 06, 2013, 10:31:49 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 06, 2013, 10:07:19 PM
I was going to comment on the game (and may still), but the NCAA finally decided to release the regional rankings, and quite a shock. Wooster is No. 1, and Calvin is No. 4. Again, it's a reminder that the NCAA puts a bigger emphasis on SOS than I think some people realize, or tend to forget every year. And Wooster's SOS will go even higher this week by playing OWU and Witt.

http://www.ncaa.com/rankings/basketball-men/d3/regional_rankings

I can never figures those guys out. Mike DeWitt goes on Hoopsville and says all primary criteria are considered equally while also no so subtly suggesting that WP is very important. Then these rankings come out.

Calvin has a serious SOS problem, but they also haven't lost. I would think it harder to hold a weak SOS against a team when they haven't slipped up a single time.

Against common opponents, Calvin is 3-0 while Wooster is 1-2.

The only thing I can figure is that the committee came up with their teams but didn't actually rank them until adjusting for results vs. regionally "ranked". That gives Wooster another advantage over Calvin.

How Calvin is also behind OWU and Thomas More, I have no idea.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2013, 10:51:46 PM
Calvin's SOS numbers: 0.371     0.499     0.414

Wooster:                  0.565     0.525      0.552
Thomas More:           0.463     0.498      0.475
Ohio Wesleyan:         0.555     0.511      0.541

I can probably see an argument for Thomas More since the numbers are closer... but they should be undefeated when their SOS is that poor compared to the other two.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 06, 2013, 11:04:19 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2013, 10:51:46 PM
Calvin's SOS numbers: 0.371     0.499     0.414

Wooster:                  0.565     0.525      0.552
Thomas More:           0.463     0.498      0.475
Ohio Wesleyan:         0.555     0.511      0.541

I can probably see an argument for Thomas More since the numbers are closer... but they should be undefeated when their SOS is that poor compared to the other two.

That's a weighty statement, the magnitude of which I'm not sure you realize.

Given a 95% win probability in each of 15 in-region games, the statistical probability of winning all 15 is less than 50-50. Keep in mind that many of Calvin's wins were in games that had win probabilities much less than 95%. Tonight's matchup at Alma, for instance, was at 85% per Massey. The statistical probability of winning all 15 games like that is less than 9%.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2013, 11:05:39 PM
When you mention Massey... you lose me. Calvin's schedule has not been a challenging schedule... so if they are that good they should be undefeated... but that doesn't mean they will be rewarded for that weakness.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 06, 2013, 11:19:27 PM
Why does Massey "lose" you Dave. He was quoting the win probability which is a great measure of what should be 'expected'. Don't hold a bias against it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2013, 11:21:02 PM
I think Massey is flawed and as a result I don't give it too much credence... so I don't follow arguments that use that to figure out if a team will win or not or anything else for that matter.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 06, 2013, 11:24:25 PM
State your objections, then. Is that algorithm flawed? What about the calculations bother you. Or do you prefer coach voo-doo and old wives tales?

The win probability is an excellent gauge - must like Nate Silver's calculations in baseball (PECOTA) and at .538

It's unbiased and does the best job in D-3 bringing all the results to bear in a statistical manner. I wish Sagarin or Pomeroy would do D-3 as well. In my D-1 ranking matrix I use Sagarin, Pomeroy and Massey together.

I don't like Wolfe because it doesn't use MOV and I haven't studied the David Wilson system enough. It looks good though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2013, 11:33:12 PM
I have posted them in so many places... but the fact Massey can't eliminate games against D1, D2, NAIA, and other teams(or for that matter understand what is an exhibition game and what isn't) gives some teams too much boost and too little for others; the ratings also seem to be centralized in Wisconsin (per Pat's analysis) and unfairly gives too much influence for schools in that region versus anywhere else in the country; I used to weigh the numbers more heavily until I just kept seeing the imbalances.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 06, 2013, 11:36:38 PM
My point is less about Massey and more about probability.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2013, 11:44:51 PM
But the probability is based on flawed data.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 06, 2013, 11:48:45 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2013, 11:44:51 PM
But the probability is based on flawed data.

So what's the correct probability? There must be an answer to this question to make a claim like they "should be undefeated". ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2013, 11:53:46 PM
Maybe there isn't one for Division III. Maybe it is based on what people can deduce when they look at games online or in person plus box scores and overall stats for teams competing against one another plus factors like where the game is being played.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on February 07, 2013, 12:05:33 AM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2013, 11:53:46 PM
Maybe there isn't one for Division III. Maybe it is based on what people can deduce when they look at games online or in person plus box scores and overall stats for teams competing against one another plus factors like where the game is being played.

You're confusing win probability with picking winners. If I'm going through Calvin's in-region schedule I would pick them to win every game. I would do the same for Wooster. However, win probability acknowledges that while a team may be a favorite, even a heavy favorite, there is a chance that they lose. And even with just a small chance in each individual game, over the course of a 15 or 20-game schedule that adds up to the point where a loss actually is expected.

Good night!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 07, 2013, 12:09:20 AM
No I understand probability as a Management major and a number cruncher in my day... I am just saying that since there really isn't a system in place, the other idea is our best bet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2013, 07:43:21 AM
Exhibition games I'll give you, but I don't understand the reluctance to include other divisional games. Massey tracks the entire UNIVERSE of college hoops and excluding them would eliminate data points not just for D-3, but for ALL teams. And I think the exhibition games are because of the NCAA's totally screwed up awful rule about what counts and what doesn't. Don't hate the playa...

Box scores, etc. are all well and good but they give you no idea how to compare Birmingham Southern to Buena Vista. How can you compare Redlands to MIT without data and some baseline? The data ISN'T that flawed. It tracks pretty darn well with my perceptions, etc. Some teams still don't have video. So there's no WAY to see that. You just gonna, "oh, well" those teams?

Also, there are more human biases. People either overrate their region, or underrate them. A solid algorithm is region neutral. And remember, Massey deals with the entire UNIVERSE of college hoops.

And I'll give you a hint - Massey and Pomeroy DO factor in offense, defense and where the game is played. I think it's solid and reasonable, and that's what you need from a ratings system.

See how well the pundits did in November who were anti-data and probability model?



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 07, 2013, 04:03:59 PM
My problem is when a team plays a D1... then that D1's schedule is taken into account and all the data that in provides. That in turn boosts a team that is simply being paid to play the game and doesn't mean they are any better for it. It also sways the data for any team that played the team that played the D1. If you can isolate the D3 data to itself you can have a fair representation of the division. Furthermore, Massey seems to be in love with Wisconsin even though we know there is plenty of good basketball teams around the country, but Massey doesn't account accordingly.

So if everyone wants a probability system... build one :).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 07, 2013, 04:09:05 PM
I can't imagine why the WIAC would rate so high every year.  Probably because they play good basketball?

National Champions
2012  UW-Whitewater
2010  UW-Stevens Point
2005  UW-Stevens Point
2004  UW-Stevens Point
1999  UW-Platteville
1998  UW-Platteville
1995  UW-Platteville

7 out of the last 17 seems like a good ratio to me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 07, 2013, 04:18:22 PM
Quote from: sac on February 07, 2013, 04:09:05 PM
I can't imagine why the WIAC would rate so high every year.  Probably because they play good basketball?

National Champions
2012  UW-Whitewater
2010  UW-Stevens Point
2005  UW-Stevens Point
2004  UW-Stevens Point
1999  UW-Platteville
1998  UW-Platteville
1995  UW-Platteville

7 out of the last 17 seems like a good ratio to me.

I don't mind the WIAC being rated highly, but it seems other teams get a big boost for touching the WIAC and I'm not sure that always makes a lot of sense. Maybe that part of the algorithm works for D1, but I'm not sure it does for D3. I made a point about the 2011 MIAC on the Pool C (I believe) board last week about this.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2013, 04:25:33 PM
Not necessarily, not at all. I think you're perception is skewed.

1. Massey doesn't INTENTIONALLY have a bias pro-Wisconsin. There's nothing in his algorithm that adds X points for a team from Wisconsin, especially at this stage. That's ludicrous as an argument and points to ludditism. The WIAC schedules are pretty robust in the non-conference. Massey's lowest rated WIAC team was at 1230 overall and at #185 in D-3. Can you say that UW-Oshkosh is clearly worse than Maryville, or Heidelberg or Olivet or Bowdoin? Those are teams in that neighborhood. The idea of a clear BIAS towards the WIAC is ridiculous. The data points it to Wisconsin because they do well in non-conference.

That's born out in the other rating systems. - Wolfe had the lowest WIAC team rated at #1110 out of #1553. They're around Allegheny and East Texas Baptist in that rating system, but that doesn't use MOV. Wilson also had the WIAC as the top conference over the UAA and CCIW. Funny, that's what Massey had too. The lowest WIAC team was #186 tied with Gettysburg, Clark and Lawrence. Can you say that UW-Oshkosh would get trounced by any of those teams.

Maybe the data DOES point to the WIAC being worthy of the top mark and there is NO bias. NONE.

2. If you look at the data, then Albertus Magnus was in no way rewarded for being thumped by Yale. It's one game in a data set and their SOS is still abysmal and their power ranking is #166 with an SOS of #380. Oberlin also played Yale and the NCAC got NO benefit from that.

So this argument is ludicrous as well.

Both of those arguments are flawed and faulty, based on the evidence I've seen. Show me the Wisconsin bonus in Massey, show me how Albertus and Oberlin (and others) were boosted by playing D-1s outside of the norm. Show me data and proof, not anecdotal yammering.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2013, 04:26:54 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 07, 2013, 04:18:22 PM
Quote from: sac on February 07, 2013, 04:09:05 PM
I can't imagine why the WIAC would rate so high every year.  Probably because they play good basketball?

National Champions
2012  UW-Whitewater
2010  UW-Stevens Point
2005  UW-Stevens Point
2004  UW-Stevens Point
1999  UW-Platteville
1998  UW-Platteville
1995  UW-Platteville

7 out of the last 17 seems like a good ratio to me.

I don't mind the WIAC being rated highly, but it seems other teams get a big boost for touching the WIAC and I'm not sure that always makes a lot of sense. Maybe that part of the algorithm works for D1, but I'm not sure it does for D3. I made a point about the 2011 MIAC on the Pool C (I believe) board last week about this.

Pat,

If there was a bias in Massey it wouldn't show in the other systems. Those other systems also have the WIAC up and over other conferences. Where I can see it is that there is limited non-conference games in the MIAC and the proximity to the WIAC may help IF (and a big IF) they keep the games close against the WIAC (because MOV is a factor). Otherwise, I don't think touching the WIAC matters a ton otherwise Albertus Magnus would be a lot higher on the charts because they 'touched' a D-1 team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 07, 2013, 04:28:56 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 07, 2013, 04:18:22 PM
Quote from: sac on February 07, 2013, 04:09:05 PM
I can't imagine why the WIAC would rate so high every year.  Probably because they play good basketball?

National Champions
2012  UW-Whitewater
2010  UW-Stevens Point
2005  UW-Stevens Point
2004  UW-Stevens Point
1999  UW-Platteville
1998  UW-Platteville
1995  UW-Platteville

7 out of the last 17 seems like a good ratio to me.

I don't mind the WIAC being rated highly, but it seems other teams get a big boost for touching the WIAC and I'm not sure that always makes a lot of sense. Maybe that part of the algorithm works for D1, but I'm not sure it does for D3. I made a point about the 2011 MIAC on the Pool C (I believe) board last week about this.

I think it could be argued strongly the MIAC would have an outstanding tournament history if wasn't in the same region the WIAC. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 07, 2013, 04:32:05 PM
OK... I said Wisconsin and that region... I did not say WIAC. Don't confuse the two.

The WIAC is a very strong conference and I say it year in and year out it is one of the top five in Division III basketball. However, I did not say that Massey weighs too heavily the WIAC... I said it is centralized towards Wisconsin and that region... and Pat has pointed out why it then skews other data and other teams - check out the MIAC board for Pat's thoughts on that.

Again... I said at the beginning that I have talked about this on numerous boards and because I have... please search Pat's and other comments out... I can't just keep rehashing things as much as I would like to boost my posts :). I have a show tonight and have lost the main broadcasting computer - I am a little stressed LOL.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2013, 04:34:23 PM
How can data be centralized around a region? The data flows to where it flows. See my rebuttal. I think it's a perception, not reality.

And pardon me for not seeing your other posts because I would have rebutted the heck out of them then. Just because you didn't get a response doesn't mean your arguments are golden and can't be challenged NOW. I have posted back and forth with Pat on this in the past as well and I think I see the data differently.

And to be honest, when you say Wisconsin you ARE saying the WIAC. I don't think the NathCon or Carthage or the Midwest Conference matters a whit here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 07, 2013, 04:44:08 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 07, 2013, 04:34:23 PM
How can data be centralized around a region? The data flows to where it flows. See my rebuttal. I think it's a perception, not reality.

And pardon me for not seeing your other posts because I would have rebutted the heck out of them then. Just because you didn't get a response doesn't mean your arguments are golden and can't be challenged NOW. I have posted back and forth with Pat on this in the past as well and I think I see the data differently.

Just because I don't get a response??? Seriously?! I never think my arguments are golden... and it is my opinion just as it is yours! But as Pat has shown in the past, when schools in the MIAC are boosted by Massey for no reason other than they are close to other schools like those in the WIAC it is flawed... and I don't trust it.

Seriously, if you can't come up with a system that actually shows the strengths of teams across the country that isn't saturated and infected with data that means nothing to a vast majority of the other schools being ranked... it is flawed. Transylvania has a game against Kentucky now yearly... you don't think their SOS number is clearly boosted by such a game? But does that say Transylvania's schedule is stronger than Wooster's just because Kentucky is in that data flow? No! Is Randolph-Macon's schedule boosted in Massey by their game against Richmond versus Hampden-Sydney's who doesn't have a D1 team to play? Of course!

Design a system like Massey that only uses games in Division III... because we can't get a sense of a school's SOS when we are comparing games and teams that have nothing to do with Division III. And if that data is used it unfairly boosts the SOS for many schools whose SOS isn't really that high to begin with.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 07, 2013, 04:49:00 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 07, 2013, 04:32:05 PM
OK... I said Wisconsin and that region... I did not say WIAC. Don't confuse the two.

The WIAC is a very strong conference and I say it year in and year out it is one of the top five in Division III basketball. However, I did not say that Massey weighs too heavily the WIAC... I said it is centralized towards Wisconsin and that region... and Pat has pointed out why it then skews other data and other teams - check out the MIAC board for Pat's thoughts on that.

Again... I said at the beginning that I have talked about this on numerous boards and because I have... please search Pat's and other comments out... I can't just keep rehashing things as much as I would like to boost my posts :). I have a show tonight and have lost the main broadcasting computer - I am a little stressed LOL.

I'm not following this supposed 'in love with Wisconsin thing'.  There is only one other Wisconsin school not in the WIAC rated in Massey's top 50.  St. Norbert has been one of the two top teams in their conference. 

So if there's a bias where are the other Wisconsin centered teams?

If its biased, its biased towards good basketball teams.  For the most part year after year the best basketball in D3 has been played in the Midwest, and year after year massey's ratings reflect that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 07, 2013, 04:52:02 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 07, 2013, 04:44:08 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 07, 2013, 04:34:23 PM
How can data be centralized around a region? The data flows to where it flows. See my rebuttal. I think it's a perception, not reality.

And pardon me for not seeing your other posts because I would have rebutted the heck out of them then. Just because you didn't get a response doesn't mean your arguments are golden and can't be challenged NOW. I have posted back and forth with Pat on this in the past as well and I think I see the data differently.

Just because I don't get a response??? Seriously?! I never think my arguments are golden... and it is my opinion just as it is yours! But as Pat has shown in the past, when schools in the MIAC are boosted by Massey for no reason other than they are close to other schools like those in the WIAC it is flawed... and I don't trust it.

Seriously, if you can't come up with a system that actually shows the strengths of teams across the country that isn't saturated and infected with data that means nothing to a vast majority of the other schools being ranked... it is flawed. Transylvania has a game against Kentucky now yearly... you don't think their SOS number is clearly boosted by such a game? But does that say Transylvania's schedule is stronger than Wooster's just because Kentucky is in that data flow? No! Is Randolph-Macon's schedule boosted in Massey by their game against Richmond versus Hampden-Sydney's who doesn't have a D1 team to play? Of course!

Design a system like Massey that only uses games in Division III... because we can't get a sense of a school's SOS when we are comparing games and teams that have nothing to do with Division III. And if that data is used it unfairly boosts the SOS for many schools whose SOS isn't really that high to begin with.

Kentucky and Transylvania did not count in the Massey ratings either of the last two years because it was an exhibition game for both schools.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 07, 2013, 05:06:05 PM
Actually... it wasn't an exhibition for at least Kentucky... they played it in their regular season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 07, 2013, 05:09:39 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 07, 2013, 05:06:05 PM
Actually... it wasn't an exhibition for at least Kentucky... they played it in their regular season.

http://www.ukathletics.com/sports/m-baskbl/sched/kty-m-baskbl-sched.html
http://www.ukathletics.com/sports/m-baskbl/archive/kty-m-baskbl-sched-2011.html

the little # sign which says 'exhibition event' from both seasons is pretty clear
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 07, 2013, 05:14:42 PM
Yep... noticed that as well. I am sorry then for the mistake. At one point those games were being counted or at least in the stats they were counting for Kentucky as this was a conversation that was made on some of the boards earlier this year. Either something changed or whatever... but clearly they are exhibition games now. Sorry for screwing that up for everyone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 07, 2013, 05:18:40 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 07, 2013, 04:26:54 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 07, 2013, 04:18:22 PM
Quote from: sac on February 07, 2013, 04:09:05 PM
I can't imagine why the WIAC would rate so high every year.  Probably because they play good basketball?

National Champions
2012  UW-Whitewater
2010  UW-Stevens Point
2005  UW-Stevens Point
2004  UW-Stevens Point
1999  UW-Platteville
1998  UW-Platteville
1995  UW-Platteville

7 out of the last 17 seems like a good ratio to me.

I don't mind the WIAC being rated highly, but it seems other teams get a big boost for touching the WIAC and I'm not sure that always makes a lot of sense. Maybe that part of the algorithm works for D1, but I'm not sure it does for D3. I made a point about the 2011 MIAC on the Pool C (I believe) board last week about this.

Pat,

If there was a bias in Massey it wouldn't show in the other systems. Those other systems also have the WIAC up and over other conferences. Where I can see it is that there is limited non-conference games in the MIAC and the proximity to the WIAC may help IF (and a big IF) they keep the games close against the WIAC (because MOV is a factor). Otherwise, I don't think touching the WIAC matters a ton otherwise Albertus Magnus would be a lot higher on the charts because they 'touched' a D-1 team.

I don't spend a lot of times delving into the other systems, but if that's the case, it doesn't make Massey more accurate for Division III, just in line with others.

Listen, I like Massey for what it is, good for broad comparisons across Division III. But I don't think it's perfect at any time of the year, and that's why I don't buy into it the way the rest of you do. I am sure that when these guys tweak their formula, they do it based on how it affects the Division I rankings, and whether that provides greater accuracy further down the line, they don't have any real way of knowing. I think those of you who follow our preseason football rankings know that we/I do think it is very possible for one particular conference to have a lot of highly ranked teams, right? I'm not opposed to the concept, but I don't like seeing it rub off on a neighboring conference that just has some head-to-head overlap.

I'm more of a fan than Dave, though, clearly!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 07, 2013, 05:51:35 PM
I notice that there isn't any discussion about the officials in last nights scot-bishop game. Was the crew the same as the first or possibly being a wednesday night game not as many people noticed?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2013, 06:13:07 PM
I never said Massey was perfect. But it's a good neutral observer of the universe of all of college basketball WITH NO WISCONSIN BIAS that's outright. It's a data point I use and I get passionate about good, neutral data instead of eyes-only based ratings. I guess that started when I first started to read Bill James in the 80's.

To just flippantly discount it, especially as a probability model? I got problems with that because whatever the biases are, when dealing with that aspect of it, it's pretty solid.

And one or two games for a handful of schools is not 'infecting' the data, Dave. Heck, one game for one school doesn't really 'infect' that team with this many games in their model. It's noise, not a signal. (See Nate Silver again...)

Sorry to get things off track.

Anyway, this all started as a discussion on the GL ratings, and how Calvin was going to run the table. Which has implications for the NCAC.

Right now, I see the league getting two bids IF OWU can make the semi-finals (if things go according to plan in most every conference) or the finals. However, if Calvin or Thomas More loses in their conference tourney and some other carnage happens, OWU may be in trouble.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 07, 2013, 06:48:19 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 07, 2013, 05:51:35 PM
I notice that there isn't any discussion about the officials in last nights scot-bishop game. Was the crew the same as the first or possibly being a wednesday night game not as many people noticed?

I didn't see the first game but I was in attendance last night. I thought the referees were pretty good - namely because they didn't call the ticky-tacky fouls (it took well into the overtime before either team got to the penalty). There was clearly contact on most shots around the basket throughout the game. The one call that got discussion going around me was when the Wooster player tried to call timeout as he was falling out of bounds. I know the rule has changed but I believe the only requirement is that you have both feet on the floor - which he had. Anybody know the specifics to this?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 07, 2013, 06:57:12 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 07, 2013, 06:48:19 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 07, 2013, 05:51:35 PM
I notice that there isn't any discussion about the officials in last nights scot-bishop game. Was the crew the same as the first or possibly being a wednesday night game not as many people noticed?

I didn't see the first game but I was in attendance last night. I thought the referees were pretty good - namely because they didn't call the ticky-tacky fouls (it took well into the overtime before either team got to the penalty). There was clearly contact on most shots around the basket throughout the game. The one call that got discussion going around me was when the Wooster player tried to call timeout as he was falling out of bounds. I know the rule has changed but I believe the only requirement is that you have both feet on the floor - which he had. Anybody know the specifics to this?

I don't know what the rule is now, exactly, but Mike Breckenridge, the Wooster radio guy, was pretty sure that Thorpe should have gotten the timeout.  He said that it appeared that neither of the officials in the vicinity were able to see the play clearly.

By the way, I love the international rule on this, which I was unfamiliar with until listening to the Scots' game in Canada.  In international rules, only the coach can call timeout, and even then, only when there is already a stoppage of play.  Ball out of bounds, held ball, foul, etc.  So simple, so easy.  And, I'll bet, in accordance with the original concept of timeouts.  I doubt that the original idea was ever for a player to be able to get out of a jam by calling time.  You should have to play your way out of those situations.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on February 07, 2013, 10:53:17 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 07, 2013, 06:57:12 PM


By the way, I love the international rule on this, which I was unfamiliar with until listening to the Scots' game in Canada.  In international rules, only the coach can call timeout, and even then, only when there is already a stoppage of play.  Ball out of bounds, held ball, foul, etc.  So simple, so easy.  And, I'll bet, in accordance with the original concept of timeouts.  I doubt that the original idea was ever for a player to be able to get out of a jam by calling time.  You should have to play your way out of those situations.

Resounding agreement - +k. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 07, 2013, 11:04:57 PM
Quote from: cave2bens on February 07, 2013, 10:53:17 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 07, 2013, 06:57:12 PM


By the way, I love the international rule on this, which I was unfamiliar with until listening to the Scots' game in Canada.  In international rules, only the coach can call timeout, and even then, only when there is already a stoppage of play.  Ball out of bounds, held ball, foul, etc.  So simple, so easy.  And, I'll bet, in accordance with the original concept of timeouts.  I doubt that the original idea was ever for a player to be able to get out of a jam by calling time.  You should have to play your way out of those situations.

Resounding agreement - +k.

Yeah but then Chris Webber couldn't have become an eternal butt of jokes for his calling a timeout they didn't have! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 07, 2013, 11:11:52 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 07, 2013, 04:44:08 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 07, 2013, 04:34:23 PM
How can data be centralized around a region? The data flows to where it flows. See my rebuttal. I think it's a perception, not reality.

And pardon me for not seeing your other posts because I would have rebutted the heck out of them then. Just because you didn't get a response doesn't mean your arguments are golden and can't be challenged NOW. I have posted back and forth with Pat on this in the past as well and I think I see the data differently.

Just because I don't get a response??? Seriously?! I never think my arguments are golden... and it is my opinion just as it is yours! But as Pat has shown in the past, when schools in the MIAC are boosted by Massey for no reason other than they are close to other schools like those in the WIAC it is flawed... and I don't trust it.

That's not the only reason, Dave. It also has to do with the fact that the MIAC is a huge league whose double round-robin leaves very little room for non-conference games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2013, 10:05:34 AM
That's right - the limited n/c opportunities can affect the data early on, but by now it should all be washed through. Good teams will show themselves, bad teams will be exposed, no matter who they have 'touched'.

Same with football, by week 8 or so it normalizes itself.

And yes, it's possible that a 'mediocre' team could be rated highly, but most likely the 'mediocrity' is a perception. Still, using an algorithm based rating system that uses elements of offense / defense, home / road, SOS and MOV is the best way to determine how good team A from the NE is compared to team B in the west.

Take time to understand the data and the reasons behind what the data shows, just don't pooh-pooh it out of hand like out-of-work political pundits.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2013, 10:30:17 AM
And now, back to the action:

Allegheny (3-10, 9-13) @ Denison (6-7, 8-14) - Big game for both squads. For Denison, a win keeps them in the hunt for a 4/5 game (and at worst, a 6 seed). A loss puts them in the range of a 7/8 seed, which, well, won't be good, since both Wooster and OWU have performed clock-cleaning services on the Big Red. The Gators are win-or-else right now. Allegheny has improved quite a bit this year - but so has the league.

Hiram (5-8, 11-11) @ Ohio Wesleyan (9-4, 16-5) - If OWU keeps winning, they're the second seed. They really don't have cushion over Witt so they need to keep playing hard (not that they wouldn't, but...). Hiram has no cushion. They just broke a four-game losing streak, but the Terriers really have to keep winning to make the tourney much less avoid the 8 seed and a trip to Wooster. I can't see Hiram breaking through. They've had the pieces to have an 8-5 record instead of 5-8 - just didn't play like it for most of January.

Oberlin (3-10, 5-17) @ DePauw (7-6, 14-8) - On paper, no-brainer. This should be a lock for the New Tigers. The Yeomen seem to have worn out as well. The team that took Wittenberg to the edge seemingly has vaporzied with two big losses of late. Yet there's something about this DPU that keeps me from running to put bucks on their money line. Not that I would anyway, being a Wabash man...

Kenyon (7-6, 13-9) @ Wabash (5-8, 7-15) - "Stakes is high" as De La Soul would opine. Are they ever. The Lords have a pretty favorable slate to finish the year, which means 10-6 isn't out of the question. With that record, they could be a 4 seed (or even sneak a 3 if something happens to Witt but Witt holds the tiebreaker). Yet a trip to Chadwick isn't easy, and the Wabash defense will be ready for the Lords. Yet in Kenyon's earlier win, the guards were the key to victory. Can Wabash shut them down and hold down Kenyon's front court? A 6 seed could be in the balance for the LGs. Anything to avoid Wooster or OWU on the first night of conference play.

Wittenberg (8-5, 15-7) @ Wooster (12-1, 19-3) - It seemed like an eternity ago that these two teams met. In the context of this season, it was. While not the turning point (Witt's stumbles were post-holiday), the earlier matchup definitely was blatant foreshadowing on how the season went. The Old Tigers have somewhat rebounded, taking care of Wabash with some classic "Witt at home" defense. The Scots, again, staved off what looked like defeat and outlasted OWU in OT Wednesday. They find a way to win most days. I think they'll find a way Saturday, for sure, mucking up the middle muddle again and making for a very...interesting...last week of the season.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 08, 2013, 10:40:06 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2013, 10:05:34 AM
That's right - the limited n/c opportunities can affect the data early on, but by now it should all be washed through. Good teams will show themselves, bad teams will be exposed, no matter who they have 'touched'.

Same with football, by week 8 or so it normalizes itself.

And yes, it's possible that a 'mediocre' team could be rated highly, but most likely the 'mediocrity' is a perception. Still, using an algorithm based rating system that uses elements of offense / defense, home / road, SOS and MOV is the best way to determine how good team A from the NE is compared to team B in the west.

Take time to understand the data and the reasons behind what the data shows, just don't pooh-pooh it out of hand like out-of-work political pundits.

What do you think of the case I cited on the Pool C board last week, then? Not Week 8 but the end of the season, where 14-11, 10-10 St. John's was rated 30th two years ago? I understand St. Thomas won the title out of that league but six MIAC teams in the top 30 is more than excessive.
http://masseyratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&yr=2011&sub=11620
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2013, 11:15:44 AM
The MIAC was a meat-grinder and had a great non-conference record. The Johnnies took care of the teams they could and beat a team that beat Mankato. Yes, it's D-2 but that shows quality and distinction. Their only bad loss was Macalester.

What this also shows is a house effect of St. Thomas winning it all, since it's a post-season rating. I wonder where the Johnnies were before the Tommies began their run? Since everything is interlocked, the Tommies results help the MIAC, especially the teams like St. John's which had a very very close loss to St. Thomas earlier in the year. Post-season power rankings always show this effect, but in 'perception' others also will tend to lift up the conference of the winner, anyway. So I can't say it's unexpected to see St. John's this high with those data points coming from St. Thomas. Again, everything is inter-related. It's a universe of hoops.

I also tend to shy away from looking at the power rankings after I do my tourney projections. The NCAA tourney is a fickle-beast - the one and done aspect of it hurts and helps teams. However, a total picture of the entire season is a really good measure. I again wonder where St. John''s was before the MIAC tourney, or right after it?

This is also a result of the MIAC having limited non-conference games. Yet every measure would also show the same effect, including the 'official' rankings the NCAA uses. But winning these non-conference games, or staying in the neighborhood of very good teams, isn't an aberration. It shows quality and distinction, even if early in the year, even if they're .500 in conference. As it is in football, you take a mid-pack OAC or WIAC team and plop them in most every other conference, they win or compete. Who is to say that this St. John's team, plopped into most every other D-3 conference, couldn't have competed or won it? This was a big ol' slog that year.

If they're over-rated it may be by just a few points. Can you be so certain St. John's couldn't beat Emory six times out of 10 that year? Remember, it's SPORTS! Things happen!

This all reminds me of the early debates of perception vs. data when Bill James started his abstracts. The Enos Cabell debates, as it were. I guess the debates on Derek Jeter's defense at short in the 2000's were also the same, since the data flew in the face of perception, and the starry-eyed didn't see the flailing on the dives to balls a good shortstop would get. Because, you know, narrative!

Ken Pomeroy has Belmont, Middle Tennessee, SF Austin and ND State rated ahead of Illinois even after their win last night? Perception says that's false, since Illinois has beaten a lot of really good teams. Reality is that the data shows it thus, because Illinois hasn't been super-spectacular in other games. He also has a 14-11 Northern Iowa team at 66, but that's where the data points.

At any rate, again, it's just a tool. The probability measure for each game on Massey are fun (and pretty accurate), and of course, because of SPORTS! things happen. Like Wabash beating Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 08, 2013, 11:42:13 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2013, 11:15:44 AM
Because, you know, narrative!

Guy in the cube next to me is probably wondering why I'm laughing. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 08, 2013, 11:48:26 AM
smedindy... I get your points and I actually enjoy your breakdown of things - even if some of it needs rereading to keep it from going over my head :). However, you do point out where there could be flaws... there are times when teams are rated below teams we all know from watching games is not the case. Sure, the data says that this is how it should be - but the reality and the actual watching of games says otherwise.

For example, Massey has UW-Whitewater #3 in Division III and UW-Stevens Point #4 despite the fact the Pointers have beaten Whitewater twice by an average of 9.5 points. (Yes, I know that isn't a gross example, but it still shows some questions.)

This example is a bit more abstract, but when I talked to Mark Edwards on Hoopsville the other night, he stated that Rochester was the best team they had played this year. However, Rochester is rated behind Illinois Wesleyan - who Wash U has also played.

(By the way, can someone tell them at Massey that it hasn't been Salisbury St. in a long time :)).

I get that Massey is just a place for information and I do glance at it when I need some extra information as I look at teams for my Top 25 ballot or otherwise. But while this doesn't apply to you, smedindy, there are many people who put so much stock in Massey that the ratings are used as the only source for an argument or to try and prove a team is better than others think. This drives me a bit crazy for many reasons.

Yes, Massey has certainly improved, but as Pat points out, it isn't infallible. I just hope others will appreciate that instead of telling those like me that we are crazy for not putting more stock in the numbers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2013, 11:59:35 AM
But Dave, we watch A game and get a perception. We don't watch EVERY game. When a coach says "X" team is the best they've faced it also has quite a bit to do with matchups and style of play and how well his team played on that day. Coach-speak is kind of noise to me anyway. Gotta cut through it.

Also, like any sporting event, there's luck involved at times.

Head to head's not as important over a universe of games. Take my Northern Iowa example in D-1. Their two worst losses were to Evansville (they were swept). But all of the data, and in fact reality, shows Evansville's not as good as UNI. It's just matchups and style and luck. In the UW-W and UW-SP example, how do you reconcile that UW-SP, while sweeping WW, lost to teams WW beat? It's not transitive at all.

As for Rochester, their ratings slip is due to the 14-pt loss at NYU. Not a horrible loss, but still, losing by 14 to that team, after beating them by 15 earlier, probably set some data points in a tizzy.

Besides, how much of a difference is being ranked 6th versus 3rd when we're dealing with a 400 team universe? Not much...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on February 08, 2013, 12:25:38 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 08, 2013, 11:48:26 AM
This example is a bit more abstract, but when I talked to Mark Edwards on Hoopsville the other night, he stated that Rochester was the best team they had played this year. However, Rochester is rated behind Illinois Wesleyan - who Wash U has also played.

But two things...

1) IWU played Wash U without starting SG Pat Sodemann (11.7 ppg, 3.2 rpg, 25-26 FT) and starting PF Victor Davis (10.8 ppg, 5.2 rpg) - those two will probably both be all-CCIW players this year.  (Those are CCIW stats.)

2) Teams evolve from December 1 to February.  IWU is a great example.  The Titans graduated their entire perimeter from last year (Eliud Gonzalez, Jordan Zimmer, John Koschnitzky, Stephen Rudnicki) and replaced with completely new guys - JV players and a transfer.  November and December was truly a "work in progress" as they say.  IWU's perimeter is dramatically different right now than it was on 12/1 -- in fact, most would agree it's second in the CCIW now to only Wheaton.


So I'm not sure that's a great example at all, Dave.  And I'd say that's an example where Massey filters out that subjective perspective that might be a little flawed.  In other words, it just knows opponents, scores, and margins over the course of the entire season.  It doesn't know that the team Mark Edwards saw way back on Dec 1 is playing much better now - actually playing about as well an anyone (11-0 in CCIW) - and is healthy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2013, 01:13:09 PM
IWU's improvement is definitely shown in it's ratings, rankings and perception. Over time, teams will find their true levels. You can't really hide after 16 games or so.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 08, 2013, 02:40:00 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2013, 11:59:35 AM
Besides, how much of a difference is being ranked 6th versus 3rd when we're dealing with a 400 team universe? Not much...

It's like WAR in baseball -- a fairly terrible metric to cite if you're trying to prove Robinson Cano was better than Miguel Cabrera (7.8 fWAR to 7.1 last season, a relatively small difference), but pretty solid if we're comparing Mike Trout (10.0 fWAR) to Cabrera.

Massey won't be good at perfectly sorting out a clump of relatively equally talented teams (and as others have pointed out, perception isn't either), but it does put teams in the right neighborhood better than any human could. There will be some outliers from time to time, but 2011 St. John's shouldn't cause us to throw out the entire system.

I haven't investigated the 2011 MIAC very closely, but I would think that leagues with larger round-robins have a higher potential for variance in their Massey rating. If a number of teams "randomly" perform well in their few pre-conference games, the whole league will see a boost (or the latin phrase for the other way around). The bottom six teams in the league standings were 21-10 in the non-con that year and then went 40-81 in league play. That likely served to squish the bottom MIAC teams closer to the top MIAC teams (relative to D3 overall) than we might otherwise expect. Fewer non-conference games means there are fewer scores to link them back to the rest of the division which means we're likely so see more noise in their specific rankings.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 08, 2013, 02:47:04 PM
St. John's beat D2 St. Cloud St. that year in a real game.   Any D3 win over a higher level opponent will greatly improve their rating in massey.


These 3 games pulled the highest rated D3's up the ladder more than normal.

St. Johns beat St. Cloud
UW-SP beat St. Johns  ---the very next game for St. John's
St. Thomas beat UW-SP


This was probably a once in a decade scenario.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2013, 02:49:27 PM
Oh, and then St. Cloud beat Mankato who was 25-2 so that yanked the whole chain, including St. John's, up even more! It's an entirely connected universe.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 08, 2013, 03:11:25 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2013, 02:49:27 PM
Oh, and then St. Cloud beat Mankato who was 25-2 so that yanked the whole chain, including St. John's, up even more! It's an entirely connected universe.

Exactly, not only did St. John's beat a D2 but they beat one with a winning record that went on and beat other good D2's.

How often has that really happened for a D3 school?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AO on February 08, 2013, 03:23:47 PM
Quote from: sac on February 08, 2013, 03:11:25 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2013, 02:49:27 PM
Oh, and then St. Cloud beat Mankato who was 25-2 so that yanked the whole chain, including St. John's, up even more! It's an entirely connected universe.

Exactly, not only did St. John's beat a D2 but they beat one with a winning record that went on and beat other good D2's.

How often has that really happened for a D3 school?
The only bias I see in this discussion is of the East Coast variety.   >:(   

well I suppose in Pat's case maybe it's an attempt to mask his Minnesota bias.  like that ref that is buddy buddy with a particular head coach and to prove his lack of bias makes a lot of bad calls in favor of the other team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: John Gleich on February 08, 2013, 03:28:03 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 08, 2013, 11:48:26 AM
For example, Massey has UW-Whitewater #3 in Division III and UW-Stevens Point #4 despite the fact the Pointers have beaten Whitewater twice by an average of 9.5 points. (Yes, I know that isn't a gross example, but it still shows some questions.)

Interesting you brought this one up... Because I certainly think that Whitewater is playing better basketball right now than UWSP, especially in the last 3 (Point is 1-2, Loss at Platteville #31, Loss at La Crosse #33 Win vs. Eau Claire #177; Whitewater is Win vs. La Crosse #33, Win vs. St. Norbert #24, Win vs. Platteville #31).

The injury bug has hurt Stevens Point even more than you and Coach Semling alluded to last night on Hoopsville... Stevens Point dressed 9 guys on Wednesday vs. Eau Claire and one of them (Ritchay) got hurt right before halftime and didn't play in the 2nd half. So of UWSP's 14 guys on the roster, 6 of them were/are hurt, including Tillema and two ADDITIONAL starters (Ryf and Ritchay).

Hopefully with the week off, a few of these injured guys will be back... but in many respects, if they're not, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense to my why Tillema would come back just for a few unguaranteed games (lose once and you're done), especially if he's only at about 80%. Now, certainly, Tillema at 80% is better than probably 90%+ of the players out there and would certainly help... but would it be enough help for a deep run? I'm not so convinced.

And I'm also not convinced that Point can't made a fairly deep run even WITHOUT Ty Tillema. Lost in all of the shuffle of injuries and the two setbacks last week is the fact that Point is only letting up fewer than 57 points per game in WIAC play this year, only turning the ball over 10 times per game (though that was up to about 13 without PG Ryf against EC) and they shoot 77% from the FT line. Those are all ingredients for success...

But without the players, it'll be really tough... as shown with recent results.

Quote
Yes, Massey has certainly improved, but as Pat points out, it isn't infallible. I just hope others will appreciate that instead of telling those like me that we are crazy for not putting more stock in the numbers.

This is a bit of a straw man here though... because nothing is infallible. How many upsets do we see of top 25 teams every week?

The top 25 takes a subjective look at the teams. Massey attempts to be more objective, based on certain criteria.

The great thing about basketball, though, is that, on any given night, a team like Illinois can beat #1 Indiana or TCU can beat #5 Kansas. Does it mean that Illinois is better than Indiana or that TCU is better than Kansas?

No, it doesn't. All it does is muddy the waters in terms of where Indiana or Kansas really should be. There's underachieving and there's overachieving... and it's possible for any team to do either.

Anybody can come out like Edgewood did last year at River Falls in the first round of the NCAA tournament last year and just shoot the lights out and win a game. The final score doesn't tell the tale of how Edgewood took a tie game with 7 minutes left in the first half to 7 at halftime... and then extend it all the way to 24 in the second half.  UWRF made a run and actually cut it to 5 with :30 left in the game, but the upset was not averted.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 09, 2013, 07:19:51 PM
Well, we have had some interesting results:

OWU beats Hiram 63-61 on a three pointer with 4.4 seconds left.

Denison beat Allegheny 90-75.

Wabash belted Kenyon 58-45, hitting 28 free throws.

Oberlin (!) shocked DPU 51-49 on a last second layup by Randy Ollie.

Wow. The middle is now totally mired in muddle.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Lee Wilson on February 09, 2013, 08:26:33 PM
Wabash should have won by one more, but the ref decided to grant Kenyon an extra free throw after a rhynie waved a towel behind the basket.  The ref said (and I quote) "I already told you no!". Needless to say, the ref was booed by all Wabash fans for the rest of the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 09, 2013, 09:18:33 PM
Wooster beat Witt 75-71. I'm sure there will be more later.

But I wanted to get the standings up here:

Wooster 13-1
OWU 10-4
Witt 8-6
Kenyon 7-7
DePauw 7-7
Denison 7-7
Wabash 6-8
Hiram 5-9
Oberlin 4-10
Allegheny 3-11

I haven't thought about how to sort out the 3 way tie for 4th. We should game some scenarios up this week to see where everyone could fall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 09, 2013, 09:27:28 PM
An old post from the board, but so far as I know the tiebreaker scenarios haven't changed in the NCAC. Haven't sorted through the possible implications here, but thought I'd bring this forward...

Quote from: imderekpoe on February 21, 2008, 01:03:04 PM
I finally found the official tiebreakers:

1. Head-to-Head competition (NCAC contests only – no restrictions regarding number of games and sites).
2. Combined win-loss record with all teams above tied teams (restricted to "like" games – any team played twice; and single games played at the same location, either home or away).
3. Record versus individual opponents examined in descending order of standings (restricted to "like" games – any team played twice; and single games played at the same location, either home or away).
4. Coin toss.

IF THREE OR MORE TEAMS ARE TIED, the combined records of the teams
involved versus each other are totaled and rankings are listed according to
the winning percentage. The best percentage will be given the highest
seed. If two or more teams tie for the highest percentage, the lowest team
will be seeded. Once the lowest team is clearly seeded the remaining
teams repeat the process until the tie is broken. If three or more
percentages are arrived in initial process, and no ties remain, then teams
shall be seeded according to their percentages.

LIKE GAMES: Defined as: games that are played under the same
traveling condition (either home or away). E.G.: OWU and ALL are tied.
ALL plays DEN once—at DEN. OWU plays DEN twice—once home and
once at DEN. In comparing the two schedules, only compare the games
at DEN, throw out the DEN at OWU game. All teams played home &
home are also "like" games (teams that play each other twice).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on February 09, 2013, 09:37:39 PM
Listened to the last 10 minutes on the radio on my way home from a bball game-good job as always to Witt's play by play guy Scott Leo!

Anyway, good effort from Witt to fight back from a deficit. As discussed this week, Witt tried to go zone and the percentages were in their favor, but just like in blackjack sometimes it just doesn't go your way and Witt never recovered after the three 3's in a row from Wooster. They fought back but never could get over that hump.

BIG game for seeding purposes on Wednesday vs Depauw for Witt. I know Depauw won the first time, but since I've been MIA all year, Coach Brown referenced a call at the end of the first meeting at Depauw by stating that it would be disappointing if that one call decides the fate of several teams for tiebreaker purposes. Can anyone fill me in?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 09, 2013, 10:33:46 PM
What a difference a week makes. Last week, Wabash's upset of Wooster may have been the biggest upset under Coach Moore, at least in terms of the difference in records at the time of the meeting and the result of the first game. Seven days later, and the Scots gut out wins over their two nearest NCAC competitors, and give themselves some breathing room atop the Great Lakes regional rankings.

As compared to the Wabash game, where the Scots seemingly lost their way down the stretch, Wooster has elevated their game in the final minutes of games when it mattered. Against Witt, the obvious turning point was after giving away a 13-point second-half lead (by getting outscored 14-0 over a seven minute stretch), Wooster hit three straight three-pointers, with two coming from Doug Thorpe. But just as important were the two three-pointers by Jalen Goodwin in the last three minutes, as each came when the Tigers had cut the lead back down to three points. Then, after a rather ridiculous foul call on a three-point attempt by Leahy with 21 seconds left (he proceeded to make all three free throws), Goodwin, who missed two free throws in a similar spot against Hiram, made them both, more or less sealing the game.

Thorpe, who after was riding a 6-for-33 streak after missing his first two shots against Wittenberg, finally had the law of percentages turn in his favor, as he proceeded to make six of his last eight shots and scored 15 points in the second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 09, 2013, 11:29:20 PM
I don't know if I've ever seen a Scot improve his outside shooting as dramatically as Jalen Goodwin has between last season and this one.  He was a bricklayer last year.  A rebounder's dream.  But, somehow, from then to now, he's become not just a decent shooter but a good one.  Fewer nerves, lots of practice, good coaching: probably parts of all of these.  But as his accuracy has risen sharply, so has his value to the team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 09, 2013, 11:42:27 PM
Back from Wooster where over 3,000 fans watched Wooster complete the sweep of Wittenberg and secure the outright NCAC season title. :)

I agree with Seinfeld and Wooster Booster that Jalen Goodwin was clutch tonight down the stretch with the big three point shots and 2 late free throws that secured the win.

It should also be noted that Kenny DeBoer had another terrific game with 20 points (7 of 10 shooting) and 6 boards as he tied Doug Thorpe for scoring honors.  It was impressive how DeBoer, Thorpe and Goodwin carried the scoring load tonight and Wooster won despite Xavier Brown having an off night.  Josh Claytor was also productive in the post with 8 points and 11 boards.  Nice to see Josh Claytor and Jake Mays getting the big rivalry win over Witt on their Senior Night.

Wooster is now 20-3, 13-1 NCAC  ;D  Next game is at Allegheny on 2/13.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2013, 12:05:34 AM
Congratulations to Wooster on another 20 win season - now 17 consecutive seasons with 20 or more wins! :)

Special Thanks to Wooster Coaches Steve Moore and Doug Cline for their leadership of this top program!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: LGHistorian on February 10, 2013, 04:41:42 AM
Quote from: Ralph Lee Wilson on February 09, 2013, 08:26:33 PM
Wabash should have won by one more, but the ref decided to grant Kenyon an extra free throw after a rhynie waved a towel behind the basket.  The ref said (and I quote) "I already told you no!". Needless to say, the ref was booed by all Wabash fans for the rest of the game.

I was at the game...actually what happened was there was about 10-12 rhynies on the endline off to the left side of the basket all down on their knees slapping the floor with their hands.  After the Kenyon player missed the free throw the ref gave the player another shot.  So, the rhynies went up into the stands DIRECTLY BEHIND the basket and basically did the same thing by slapping their hands on the bleachers, MAKING EVEN MORE NOISE, but the Kenyon player made the shot.  My guess is that the ref would have given the Kenyon player another shot if he had missed that one...and probably kicked the rhynies out of the gym.

I have followed Wabash basketball for 43 years and high school basketball for even longer than that. I have never seen as many people (fans) admonished or thrown out of the gym for causing distractions (which, like it or not, has become commonplace throughout all levels of the sport) since Wabash joined the North Coast conference.  Can anyone tell me if this has happened elsewhere in the NCAC?  Or is it because the conference administrators believe that those mean Indiana fans say and do hurtful things to our Ohio boys?  :D  Maybe it's just time that the referees get back to paying attention solely to what goes on in the field of play and not the sidelines and bleachers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 10, 2013, 08:55:20 AM
Quote from: LGHistorian on February 10, 2013, 04:41:42 AM
Quote from: Ralph Lee Wilson on February 09, 2013, 08:26:33 PM
Wabash should have won by one more, but the ref decided to grant Kenyon an extra free throw after a rhynie waved a towel behind the basket.  The ref said (and I quote) "I already told you no!". Needless to say, the ref was booed by all Wabash fans for the rest of the game.

I was at the game...actually what happened was there was about 10-12 rhynies on the endline off to the left side of the basket all down on their knees slapping the floor with their hands.  After the Kenyon player missed the free throw the ref gave the player another shot.  So, the rhynies went up into the stands DIRECTLY BEHIND the basket and basically did the same thing by slapping their hands on the bleachers, MAKING EVEN MORE NOISE, but the Kenyon player made the shot.  My guess is that the ref would have given the Kenyon player another shot if he had missed that one...and probably kicked the rhynies out of the gym.

I have followed Wabash basketball for 43 years and high school basketball for even longer than that. I have never seen as many people (fans) admonished or thrown out of the gym for causing distractions (which, like it or not, has become commonplace throughout all levels of the sport) since Wabash joined the North Coast conference.  Can anyone tell me if this has happened elsewhere in the NCAC?  Or is it because the conference administrators believe that those mean Indiana fans say and do hurtful things to our Ohio boys?  :D  Maybe it's just time that the referees get back to paying attention solely to what goes on in the field of play and not the sidelines and bleachers.

From the office of the commissioner, North Coast Athletic League:

Section 23, Part 4: Furthermore, it shall be deemed against the rules for spectators wearing striped pants to conglomerate beneath or behind the baskets in groups larger than four.  Penalty: Said spectators will be dispatched from the facility and guided towards the nearest Gap in order to upgrade their fashion sense.

Just out of curiosity, why are these guys called Rhynies when they're dressed like Wallies?

And, seriously, I'm just having fun here.  I come from the days when gyms went silent during free throws, but I have no problem with kids getting behind the basket, in the stands, and harassing the opponent's shooters.  Except in Indiana, of course. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 10, 2013, 09:04:20 AM
Rhynies are the pledges for the Sphinx Club. But back in the day, Rhynies were the derogatory term used for all freshmen at Wabash back when many colleges had freshmen rituals.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 10, 2013, 09:57:24 AM
I went to the cap-otterbein game last night and at halftime I was ready to come on here and tell you how good the crusaders looked and that if they play wooster in the tournament it might be a close one. Well after Cap almost gave away a 23 point halftime lead(26 at one point in the first half) I kind of changed my mind. It would still be a tough game but even if it was at cap I think wooster would win by 7 or 8. Cap was hot in the first half though and if they get their 3 point shooting going watch out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 10, 2013, 10:37:17 AM
As for the knot in the muddled middle:

Right NOW. Kenyon gets fourth as they are 2-1 against the others. DPU would get fifith since they swept Denison. But Kenyon plays Denison on Wednesday.

DPU plays Witt and Wooster.
Kenyon faces Denison and Gheny
Denison plays Kenyon and OWU.

Lurking in the shadows? Wabash, who faces OWU and Oberlin.

Kenyon's got the easiest schedule. DPU's got to be kicking themselves. They've lost to Allegheny and Oberlin, at HOME and were swept by Kenyon. If the New Tigers would have taken care of business at home, they'd be in the mix for 2/3, not 4/5/6...

And Hiram, on the verge of 8th, had the talent to be 4th.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 10, 2013, 11:45:20 AM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 10, 2013, 09:57:24 AM
I went to the cap-otterbein game last night and at halftime I was ready to come on here and tell you how good the crusaders looked and that if they play wooster in the tournament it might be a close one. Well after Cap almost gave away a 23 point halftime lead(26 at one point in the first half) I kind of changed my mind. It would still be a tough game but even if it was at cap I think wooster would win by 7 or 8. Cap was hot in the first half though and if they get their 3 point shooting going watch out.

I don't see Cap being in a position to host any NCAA Tournament games fwiw... 

As for last night's game, does anyone else think Wooster will be seeing a healthy dose of zone from here on out?  I read an article from the Wooster fish wrap on Friday where Brown noted Wabash's success against Wooster in the zone, but insisted they would stick with man to man.  Yeah right... ::)

It didn't take Brown long to make the switch in the first half and they stuck with it in the 2nd half and held Wooster scoreless for 7 minutes while erasing a 13 point deficit.  Lucky for Wooster, they were able to hit some big 3's and escape with a win, but they need to do some work in figuring out how to beat the zone offensively if they have any aspirations of making a deep tournament run.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2013, 11:48:40 AM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 10, 2013, 09:57:24 AM
I kind of changed my mind. It would still be a tough game but even if it was at cap I think wooster would win by 7 or 8. Cap was hot in the first half though and if they get their 3 point shooting going watch out.

4 of Capital's 6 losses this season were to Wittenberg (at Cap), Ohio Wesleyan (at Cap), Marietta and Baldwin-Wallace.  Wooster has beaten all 4 of those teams (Witt twice, OWU twice) ... so I think that your change of mind was probably correct.  ;)

However, games are not played based on transitive results and on paper, Wooster should not have lost recently at Wabash but they did. :o  So, it will be interesting to see which teams get into the NCAA tourney (Wooster, Capital, others) and what upsets occur during the tournament.  Capital probably needs to win the OAC tourney and get the automatic NCAA bid because a Pool C bid looks unlikely with 7 losses and Cap not in the top 6 of this week's NCAA regional rankings.  If Wooster does play Capital in the NCAA tourney, it would be AT Wooster given the team records as they stand today.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2013, 12:00:31 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 10, 2013, 11:45:20 AM
Lucky for Wooster, they were able to hit some big 3's and escape with a win, but they need to do some work in figuring out how to beat the zone offensively if they have any aspirations of making a deep tournament run.

ScotsFan - great point about Wooster needing to work on their offensive scheme against the zone. k+   Bill Brown's teams have played very little zone over the years but they did last night for a definite reason (I bet that he watched the Wooster-Wabash video ;)).  If Wooster goes scoreless for 7 minutes in a NCAA tourney game, there is a high probability of a loss.

Wooster needs to get a guy in the middle of the lane against the zone and then penetrate to the basket or kick back out for the open three pointer if the defense collapses.  Kenny DeBoer did a nice job of penetrating last night and Doug Thorpe did as well so they need to increase that and make accurate quick passes as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 11, 2013, 07:21:36 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 09, 2013, 11:42:27 PM
Back from Wooster where over 3,000 fans watched Wooster complete the sweep of Wittenberg and secure the outright NCAC season title. :)

GO SCOTS!
As it should be.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 11, 2013, 08:47:39 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2013, 12:00:31 PM


ScotsFan - great point about Wooster needing to work on their offensive scheme against the zone. k+  Bill Brown's teams have played very little zone over the years but they did last night for a definite reason (I bet that he watched the Wooster-Wabash video ;)).  If Wooster goes scoreless for 7 minutes in a NCAA tourney game, there is a high probability of a loss.

Wooster needs to get a guy in the middle of the lane against the zone and then penetrate to the basket or kick back out for the open three pointer if the defense collapses.  Kenny DeBoer did a nice job of penetrating last night and Doug Thorpe did as well so they need to increase that and make accurate quick passes as well.

Yeah, Brown is like Moore in terms of sticking almost exclusively with man to man on the defensive end of the floor.  That is what worries me about Wooster figuring the zone out.  Because if Brown saw enough of what he needed to see in how affective Wabash was in shutting Wooster down with the zone to make him go to it against the Scots, and then to see Witt shut Wooster down for a 7 minute stretch of the game in the zone has to be a little cause for concern for the Scots moving forward...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 11, 2013, 08:53:23 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 11, 2013, 08:47:39 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 10, 2013, 12:00:31 PM


ScotsFan - great point about Wooster needing to work on their offensive scheme against the zone. k+  Bill Brown's teams have played very little zone over the years but they did last night for a definite reason (I bet that he watched the Wooster-Wabash video ;)).  If Wooster goes scoreless for 7 minutes in a NCAA tourney game, there is a high probability of a loss.

Wooster needs to get a guy in the middle of the lane against the zone and then penetrate to the basket or kick back out for the open three pointer if the defense collapses.  Kenny DeBoer did a nice job of penetrating last night and Doug Thorpe did as well so they need to increase that and make accurate quick passes as well.

Yeah, Brown is like Moore in terms of sticking almost exclusively with man to man on the defensive end of the floor.  That is what worries me about Wooster figuring the zone out.  Because if Brown saw enough of what he needed to see in how affective Wabash was in shutting Wooster down with the zone to make him go to it against the Scots, and then to see Witt shut Wooster down for a 7 minute stretch of the game in the zone has to be a little cause for concern for the Scots moving forward...

I think it's a major cause for concern.  Wooster pulled out the Witt game because of some clutch three-point shooting at the end.  By and large, though, they're only decent from that range, not good.  Their movement of the ball against Witt's zone was only marginally better than against Wabash.  And, I think at least some of that has to do with Wabash's zone being better.  The Scots need to quickly learn how to reverse ball, use the skip pass, work inside-outside, and all that stuff.  Otherwise, somebody is going to shock them hard in post-season play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 11, 2013, 12:19:33 PM
What a mess in the middle muddle of the NCAC.  There could be lots of moving in the standings this week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 11, 2013, 02:07:38 PM
depauw at wittenberg sure looks like a good one this week. Wish I could go to the Denison-Kenyon game though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2013, 09:29:58 PM
Because Wooster has for many years relied exclusively on man-to-man, they probably do not have a zone defense in the playbook, and the players have no experience with it since high school (if then.) That makes it hard if not impossible to practice against zones. Do you quickly teach the zone to your jayvees for use in practice? How motivated will they be, knowing it's not a useful game skill?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 11, 2013, 10:48:59 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 11, 2013, 09:29:58 PM
Because Wooster has for many years relied exclusively on man-to-man, they probably do not have a zone defense in the playbook, and the players have no experience with it since high school (if then.) That makes it hard if not impossible to practice against zones. Do you quickly teach the zone to your jayvees for use in practice? How motivated will they be, knowing it's not a useful game skill?

Bah, new guy. :)  Wooster teams have faced many zones over the years, usually with success.  It's hard for me to believe that they didn't spend a fair amount of practice time against them when they knew their opponent would be deploying one.

And, Wooster did utilize a 2-1-2 or 2-3 a couple of years ago with the 7-footer Gideon Mabeny in the game.  I vaguely remember him blocking eleven shots in a minute and a half.  So what if six were against his own team...  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2013, 10:01:24 AM
Tonight could either clear up the middle muddle a bit, or make it worse.

Wooster (13-1, 20-3) @ Allegheny (3-11, 9-14) - First place meets last place in a game that Wooster does not need (except for regional ranking and ultimately seeding purposes for the tourney) but Allegheny desperately does if they want any chance of playing beyond Saturday. Allegheny's dropped five in a row and may just be wanting to play out the string. Yet the Gators may want to show they can compete and give the Scots a game.

Hiram (5-9, 11-12) @ Oberlin (4-10, 6-17) - Wow, who would have thought it would come to this for these squads. A loss to the Yeomen and Hiram is cast out of the tourney, as Oberlin would have swept the Terriers on the year. Every time you think Oberlin's done for, they somehow steal a game. If they steal this one, they'll make the post-season unless Allegheny does the unthinkable and beats Wooster and Kenyon (and then it's subject to tiebreakers). I think the last time Oberlin was in the post-season bash was 2008.

Wabash (6-8, 8-15) @ Ohio Wesleyan (10-4, 17-5) - Big game for Wabash, of course. If they can sneak away with a win they have a chance at a .500 conference record and will be part of the mix gunning for the 4/5 piece of the bracket. The calculus there is crazy right now. But this is big for the Bishops too, as a loss will really hurt their "C" profile and their regional ranking chances. The Bishops throttled Wabash by 24 at Chadwick earlier in the year, but the LG's have really stepped up their game since then.

Denison (7-7, 9-14) @ Kenyon (7-7, 13-10) - Denison really needs this one, since they close out with OWU. A win clinches a .500 conference record which may be good enough for the 4/5 game depending on what else goes on around the league. Kenyon needs this as well, though, since a loss would mean the Big Red swept the Lords, which negates the Lords sweeping of DePauw in a three-way tie calculation for the H2H tiebreaker. This is one to watch if you can only watch one.

DePauw (7-7, 14-9) @ Wittenberg (8-6, 15-8) - Tigers, Old and New, battle for a possible #3 seed and the chance NOT to face Wooster until the NCAC final. For the Old Tigers, that's incentive enough. They no doubt want to have a Denison or Wabash come to town instead of the New Tigers. DPU beat Witt earlier in the year but now are fighting for their life. They could finish anywhere from #3 to #6 depending on what else happens.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2013, 08:14:04 PM
Kenyon's not leaving any doubt, leading Denison 46-25 at the half.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 13, 2013, 08:18:29 PM
Kenyon playing inspired and Denison totally unprepared and unreactive.  The Lords are up 46-25 at the half and the Big Red have a huge hole to dig out of.  Coming in, I would have thought the opportunity to host a first round tourney game, which has always been a huge goal for the Denison team, would have created some fire. 

No ball movement and no positioning for rebounds on the Denison side - very lazy ball.  In contrast, Kenyon is playing like this is the NCAA finals.  They are doing everything right and looking like a team that deserves to host.
Denison can close, but guards need to move the ball and big men need to get a LOT stronger underneath.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2013, 08:20:36 PM
Wooster's only up 44-41 at the half over the Gators in 'Gheny land.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 13, 2013, 08:28:47 PM
Kenyon coming out of the half a little sloppy with a few fouls and turnovers.  Denison can creep back into this, but have to remember that DEFENSE is part of the game too.  Especially when your shots aren't dropping! 
50-32 Kenyon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 13, 2013, 08:38:10 PM
PENN-el?  La-LOND-e?  C'mon, Allegheny broadcasters, do a little pregame work and get the pronunciations right.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2013, 08:47:17 PM
Surprise: DePauw's all over Wittenberg 32-20 at the half. New Tigers shooting well. Old Tigers are not.

Surprise: Oberlin's up 26-25 over Hiram at the half.

Not a surprise: OWU is leading Wabash 40-28 at the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 13, 2013, 09:00:53 PM
Final:  Wooster 86  Allegheny 64 :)

Wooster shot well tonight (56%) to notch the easy road win over Allegheny.  Scots were led by Josh Claytor with 16 points, Xavier Brown with 16 and Doug Thorpe with 13.

Wooster made 11 of 23 three point shots and outrebounded Allegheny 39 to 27.

Top scorers for the Gators were Ryan Stanko with 21 points and Devone McLeod with 11 points.

Wooster is now 21-3, 14-1 NCAC  ;D  Next game is at DePauw on Saturday afternoon.

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2013, 09:01:18 PM
Wooster takes care of Allegheny 86-64. Here endeth any chance for Allegheny to make the NCAC tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2013, 09:07:42 PM
Kenyon beats Denison 73-61, taking a bit of the muddle out of that logjam.

HOWEVER, DPU is giving Witt the business 42-24 AT Wittenberg with 14:44 left.

OWU is taking care of Wabash 53-38.

Hiram is losing at Oberlin, 34-28. Gut check time for the Terriers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2013, 09:20:54 PM
Hiram's Steve Zivoder just fouled out via technical foul. Hiram's losing 42-30 with 7:59 to go.

The Terriers are on a six minute scoreless streak. Not a way to get into the tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 13, 2013, 09:36:54 PM
Wabash cut the lead to five, but OWU went on a run late in the game and eased past Wabash 79-64.

HUGE win for Oberlin, beating Hiram 59-50. That's crushing for the Terriers.

DPU takes care of Witt 70-62.

The middle muddle moves up to the 3-5 line...

Standings:

Wooster 14-1
OWU 11-4
DePauw 8-7
Witt 8-7
Kenyon 8-7
Denison 7-8
Wabash 6-9
Oberlin 5-10
Hiram 5-10
Allegheny 3-12
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 13, 2013, 10:32:44 PM
Well - Alleghany utilized the zone tonight and you might think it worked with a mere three 3 point Wooster lead at half time but the issue was not offense but rather good shooting by Alleghany. But the Gators miss all 10 3's in the second half to create the easy victory.

In the post game interview Coach Moore did acknowledge that the continue to work on their zone offense. Wabash probably has done the Scots a huge favor by exposing thir weakness with enough time in the season to correct.

With his 703rd victory Coach Moore has now moved into sole possession of 3rd place for All time coaching victories at the Men's Division III level. Given #1 and #2 are still coaching, not sure if he would ever catch them (or want to catch them).

Finally - Since Alleghany defeated Wooster in Feb. 1998, Wooster has now won 167 consecutive games against non "w" NCAC teams (ya - I'm cheating by putting DePauw in the "w' group). It's a cherry pick statistic but still amazing. Only 17 of those victories have been by less than 10 points - Including that game in Gambier in '09 that they had no business winning).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 14, 2013, 12:27:25 AM
Wooster has been quite impressive FOR YEARS in league play.  Dominant!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 14, 2013, 09:16:47 AM
Quote from: goscots on February 13, 2013, 10:32:44 PM
Finally - Since Alleghany defeated Wooster in Feb. 1998, Wooster has now won 167 consecutive games against non "w" NCAC teams (ya - I'm cheating by putting DePauw in the "w' group). It's a cherry pick statistic but still amazing. Only 17 of those victories have been by less than 10 points - Including that game in Gambier in '09 that they had no business winning).

What about the home game against Denison about three or four years ago, in which Justin Hallowell hit a 30-footer at the buzzer to send it into overtime, and then the Scots went on to win?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 14, 2013, 10:21:31 AM
Yes  -I forgot about that game - I wasn't there that night. it's not in the list of 17 becuase Wooster ended up winning by 10 in OT. Another game was in Dec. '05 at Earlham. Kyle Witucky hit a running floater down the lane to give Wooster the win by 2 in OT. The critical point was one the previous Earlham possession when Wooster had only a 1 point lead but Earlham had the ball for the last shot. I believe it was Terrell Brown who got fouled on a drive and could have put Earlham into the lead and made any Wooster shot more tense. Instead he hit 1-2.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2013, 10:40:24 AM
There's so much that can happen this weekend, but one nightmare (!) scenario is this

Wooster beats DPU as expected
Denison upsets OWU
Hiram upsets Witt
Gheny upsets Kenyon

All four of those teams would finish tied for third at 8-8

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 14, 2013, 02:04:35 PM
well if the nighmare you mention does happen I hope the tie breakers are a little more understandable then we had in football this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 14, 2013, 03:54:25 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 14, 2013, 10:21:31 AM
Yes  -I forgot about that game - I wasn't there that night. it's not in the list of 17 becuase Wooster ended up winning by 10 in OT.

A ten-point overtime win is a closer game than a one-point win in regulation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 14, 2013, 04:57:27 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 14, 2013, 10:40:24 AM
There's so much that can happen this weekend, but one nightmare (!) scenario is this

Wooster beats DPU as expected
Denison upsets OWU
Hiram upsets Witt
Gheny upsets Kenyon

All four of those teams would finish tied for third at 8-8

I wish I could be as confident in Wooster winning at DePauw, but I'm not. Wooster has lost the last three times it has traveled to Indiana, including a 9-point loss to DePauw there last year. And if it wasn't for Thorpe going off over the last four minutes of the first meeting, Wooster would have lost that game as well. And even in Wooster's two wins over DePauw last year, they had to hang on in the final minute just to win at home. It seems the Tigers get up for Wooster more than they do Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 14, 2013, 05:14:20 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 14, 2013, 03:54:25 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 14, 2013, 10:21:31 AM
Yes  -I forgot about that game - I wasn't there that night. it's not in the list of 17 becuase Wooster ended up winning by 10 in OT.

A ten-point overtime win is a closer game than a one-point win in regulation.

Agree - I should have included that game.  But even more to your point - I conveniently picked <10 point difference because there are many games in the 10-12 point difference and the "story" wouldn't have sounded as good. It is no different than a baseball analyst saying a batter is "3 for his last 15", which means he is also "4 for his last 16". Selectively picking statistics happens everywhere.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 14, 2013, 06:40:45 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 14, 2013, 05:14:20 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 14, 2013, 03:54:25 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 14, 2013, 10:21:31 AM
Yes  -I forgot about that game - I wasn't there that night. it's not in the list of 17 becuase Wooster ended up winning by 10 in OT.

A ten-point overtime win is a closer game than a one-point win in regulation.

Agree - I should have included that game.  But even more to your point - I conveniently picked <10 point difference because there are many games in the 10-12 point difference and the "story" wouldn't have sounded as good. It is no different than a baseball analyst saying a batter is "3 for his last 15", which means he is also "4 for his last 16". Selectively picking statistics happens everywhere.
Not sure how 3 last 15 means he is also 4of last 16 but it could mean he is 3 for his last 100.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 15, 2013, 11:06:31 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 14, 2013, 06:40:45 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 14, 2013, 05:14:20 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 14, 2013, 03:54:25 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 14, 2013, 10:21:31 AM
Yes  -I forgot about that game - I wasn't there that night. it's not in the list of 17 becuase Wooster ended up winning by 10 in OT.

A ten-point overtime win is a closer game than a one-point win in regulation.

Agree - I should have included that game.  But even more to your point - I conveniently picked <10 point difference because there are many games in the 10-12 point difference and the "story" wouldn't have sounded as good. It is no different than a baseball analyst saying a batter is "3 for his last 15", which means he is also "4 for his last 16". Selectively picking statistics happens everywhere.
Not sure how 3 last 15 means he is also 4of last 16 but it could mean he is 3 for his last 100.

Because if the hitter was 3 for his last 16 (or certainly 3 for his last 100), that's the stat that they would mention.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 15, 2013, 11:24:51 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 15, 2013, 11:06:31 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 14, 2013, 06:40:45 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 14, 2013, 05:14:20 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 14, 2013, 03:54:25 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 14, 2013, 10:21:31 AM
Yes  -I forgot about that game - I wasn't there that night. it's not in the list of 17 becuase Wooster ended up winning by 10 in OT.

A ten-point overtime win is a closer game than a one-point win in regulation.

Agree - I should have included that game.  But even more to your point - I conveniently picked <10 point difference because there are many games in the 10-12 point difference and the "story" wouldn't have sounded as good. It is no different than a baseball analyst saying a batter is "3 for his last 15", which means he is also "4 for his last 16". Selectively picking statistics happens everywhere.
Not sure how 3 last 15 means he is also 4of last 16 but it could mean he is 3 for his last 100.

Because if the hitter was 3 for his last 16 (or certainly 3 for his last 100), that's the stat that they would mention.

Speaking of MLB, my favorite thing I hear the Indians' announcers is throw out some stat in Sept. when the Indians are 20 games under .500 and 15 games out of first, but just happen to be playing good ball at the moment, they always throw out some arbitrary date and say the Indians are one of the best teams in baseball since August 3rd or something like that?!  I'm always like, too bad the season started in freaking April.  Who gives a rat's ass what the Indians' record is since August or whatever???   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 15, 2013, 11:29:57 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 15, 2013, 11:24:51 AM
Speaking of MLB, my favorite thing I hear the Indians' announcers is throw out some stat in Sept. when the Indians are 20 games under .500 and 15 games out of first, but just happen to be playing good ball at the moment, they always throw out some arbitrary date and say the Indians are one of the best teams in baseball since August 3rd or something like that?!  I'm always like, too bad the season started in freaking April.  Who gives a rat's ass what the Indians' record is since August or whatever???   ::)

Who cares what the Indians' record is, ever?  That's minor league baseball.  It's a Giants' world, baby, and we're gonna pick up three in a row this year! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2013, 11:53:23 AM
Well, here we go. The finale of the season, and things are still, well, up in the air. Not #1, nor #2, nor #10. But #3 to #9 could all swap places.

The tiebreakers? As we know them:

1. Head-to-Head competition (NCAC contests only – no restrictions regarding number of games and sites).
2. Combined win-loss record with all teams above tied teams (restricted to "like" games – any team played twice; and single games played at the same location, either home or away).
3. Record versus individual opponents examined in descending order of standings (restricted to "like" games – any team played twice; and single games played at the same location, either home or away).
4. Coin toss.

CAVEAT: I MAY NOT GET THE CALCULATIONS RIGHT! Please correct me if I don't!

Let's get to it:

Oberlin (5-10, 7-17) @ Wabash (6-9, 8-16) - Not long ago, it was conceivable that these teams could be looking outside of the tourney looking in, but here they are. Wabash is in, and a win edges them toward the #6 seed which should be theirs with a win and a Denison loss. The Yeomen seemingly have the last slot salted away as even if they win over Wabash the LG's have the tiebreaker advantage UNLESS Hiram wins as well (see below for correction). Thanks to playing Hiram and Gheny just once Wabash has amassed a lot of results against teams higher than them in the pecking order. But the only way Oberlin loses #8 is if they lose and Hiram beats Wittenberg.

Wooster (14-1, 21-3) @ DePauw (8-7, 15-9) - The Scots really don't NEED this game, except to protect a good seed in the NCAA tourney. But they're not going to roll over for the New Tigers. A DPU win keeps them in the hunt for #3. They have the tiebreaker with Witt, lose the tiebreaker to Kenyon, and would be 4th in a three-way tiebreaker with Witt and Kenyon. (Advantage Kenyon for only playing Witt once this season). DPU could benefit from the four way tie nightmare since they'd have the best H2H against the other three (4-2 vs. Kenyon's 3-2 vs. Witt 2-2 vs. Denison 1-4).  So they could win for losing! How about that!

Ohio Wesleyan (11-4, 18-5) @ Denison (7-8, 9-15) - The Bishops are locked into #2, but need to avoid a bad loss to keep their "C" hopes alive. That's incentive enough. As for the Big Red, I think they're pretty much stuck at sixth with a win (the tiebreakers don't look good since they were swept by DPU and even with a split vs. the Lords they will lose out to Kenyon on tiebreaker #2 or #3, depending) and depending on Wabash / Oberlin could be 7th with a loss.

Allegheny (3-12, 9-15) @ Kenyon (8-7, 14-10) - The Gators could jam the Lords out of any chance of third with a loss and if DPU beats Wooster could move them down to fifth. But Kenyon's sweep of DePauw and the fact they only played the Old Tigers once helps them in a tiebreaker with those teams. But if Witt and Kenyon are tied solo with DPU out of the picture, then Witt has the tiebreaker thanks to their one win and so the Lords move to 4th. Kenyon's going to root for the New Tigers, for sure!

Wittenberg (8-7, 15-9) @ Hiram (5-10, 11-13) - By the time this tips, Hiram will know if they have any chance to make the tourney. If Oberlin wins, they're cooked. CORRECTION: A three way possibility at 6-10 can put Hiram in the tourney, so all is not lost if Oberlin beats Wabash. If the LG's beat the Yeomen, the Terriers have a chance to play Tuesday by beating the Old Tigers. For Witt, they want Wooster to beat DPU so they have a solo tiebreaker with Kenyon for third. A loss could secure them in 5th as they'd lose a solo tiebreaker with DPU and a three-way 8-8 tiebreaker with Denison and DPU.

Corrections, please!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2013, 11:55:39 AM
So, to boil this down:

1- Wooster
2- OWU
3 - Kenyon, Witt, DPU
4 - Kenyon, Witt, DPU
5 - Kenyon, Witt, DPU
6 - Denison, Wabash
7 - Denison, Wabash, Oberlin
8 - Oberlin, Hiram

Fixed to show that Oberlin could get the #7 seed in the case of a three-way tie with Wabash and Hiram. Corrections, of course, welcome.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2013, 12:54:37 PM
I failed to account for a possible three way 6-10 tie between Wabash, Hiram and Oberlin. Yikes!

I think then Oberlin could get 7th as they'll be 3-1 vs. Wabash and Hiram. Wabash then would be at the mercy of H2H vs. the Terriers. Oops. LGs go home if they lose and Hiram upsets Witt.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 15, 2013, 11:27:49 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 15, 2013, 12:54:37 PM
I failed to account for a possible three way 6-10 tie between Wabash, Hiram and Oberlin. Yikes!

I think then Oberlin could get 7th as they'll be 3-1 vs. Wabash and Hiram. Wabash then would be at the mercy of H2H vs. the Terriers. Oops. LGs go home if they lose and Hiram upsets Witt.

Thanks for the season long game previews. I have enjoyes reading them. I know how long it takes to put them together. If I had a vote I'd give you a +k.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 16, 2013, 12:11:02 AM
As that was your 200th post; you now DO have a vote on karma!

(Just hit 'applaud' under smedindy's name on any of his posts.)

(And if he later pisses you off, the 'smite' button is right next to it! ;))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 16, 2013, 12:02:34 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 16, 2013, 12:11:02 AM

(And if he later pisses you off, the 'smite' button is right next to it! ;))

Be wary of pissing off the folks from the all boys school in Indiana that wear striped overalls and yamakas or you'll end up with a karma count that looks like mine...  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2013, 01:43:26 PM
Well, I don't smite....

Thanks for the kind words, goscots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 16, 2013, 01:57:15 PM
I was not recommending any particular course of action - just informing a newly karma-empowered poster how the system works.  How he chooses to use it is his business. ;)

I'm with smedindy - I can't say I NEVER smite, but it is extremely rare compared to my use of 'applaud'.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2013, 01:57:33 PM
Oberlin leading Wabash 34-28 with 13 1/2 minutes to go. Uh-oh!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2013, 02:30:20 PM
Ross Sponsler with a big three with five seconds left. Oberlin and Wabash tied at 51 going to OT!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2013, 02:53:24 PM
Wabash Always Fights! The LG's downed Oberlin 64-57 in OT.

Wabash is now 7-9 and if Denison loses, I believe Wabash will be #6 seed.

They split H2H, so it goes to tiebreaker #2, record against team above in like games (so for this we look at Wooster road games and Witt home games, since Denison played those teams just once...)

Denison's record against Wooster, Witt, OWU, DPU and Kenyon would be 1-7
Wabash record against those teams (with Wooster road only and Witt home only) - 2-6

Oberlin now 5-11. If Hiram wins, they're out. If Hiram loses, they're in since they swept the Terriers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 16, 2013, 03:42:27 PM
Big Red are up 26-20 on OWU with 3 minutes left in the 1st half on poor 28% shooting by the Bishops and great defense by Denison. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 16, 2013, 03:52:11 PM
Halftime score at Livingston: 30-24 in favor of the Big Red.  Denison shooting 6-15 from beyond the arc while OWU is 2-10 from three point range and 8-28 overall.  OWU with a 23-18 rebound advantage.

No one in double figures on either side.  Winters high for OWU with 6 points.  Weingart with 8 for Denison two treys. 

If Denison had this much energy against Kenyon on Wednesday, they would be looking at a 4 or 5 seed rather than hoping to hang on to the 6 slot.  How they come out at the half is always a crapshoot, but this could be an interesting second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 16, 2013, 04:01:41 PM
DePaul 42 - Wooster 30 at the half.  For nearly two decades I've enjoyed the style as much as the success of Wooster basketball.  I can no longer make that statement.  One-on-one just doesn't do it for me.

Defensively, this team hustles and plays hard; DePauw's 42 points are the result of an incredibly hot-shooting half.  But on the other end of the court, Wooster is again nowhere.  Quick shots, me first, ignore the open man and the heck with getting the ball inside.  Maybe it's fun for them to play, but it's not fun to watch.  And it won't be successful.  Unfortunately, time is running out for them to change.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 16, 2013, 04:24:55 PM
Nine minutes left at Livingston and the Big red holding on to a 2 point 51-49 lead.  Hale held to only 2 points in the first half has gone to
work and has 13 for the game now. 

Winters just hit with his 4th foul, though.  A barn burner!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 16, 2013, 04:52:48 PM
Not to be for the Big Red.  Winters ties the game at 59 with two minutes to go and extends that to a 65-59 lead after Longi misses the front end of a 1-and-1 and then gets a 3-pt attempt blocked on the next possession. 

Darius White hit a three with 38 seconds left and OWU gave the Big Red two more chances to tie on missed FTs in the final minute, but OWU pulled out a 67-64 win in the end. 

Winters finishes with 20 points.  Hale had 15 and Weingart 14. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2013, 05:44:33 PM
Finals all around:

Witt just beat Hiram 68-62 after trailing most of the game.
Kenyon beat Allegheny 83-74.
DePauw beat Wooster 68-52.

Final Standings:

Wooster 14-2
OWU 12-4
Kenyon 9-7
DePauw 9-7
Wittenberg 9-7
Wabash 7-9
Denison 7-9
Oberlin 5-11
Hiram 5-11
Allegheny 3-13.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2013, 05:49:24 PM
I believe Kenyon wins the third place tiebreaker due to H2H with DePauw and Witt (Kenyon 2-1. DPU 2-2, Witt 1-2). The unbalanced NCAC schedule did the Old Tigers in. (Well, that and losing games they should have won, too...)

DePauw gets fourth due to H2H vs, Witt. (See above. Sorry, Witt)

So if I have this right:

Oberlin @ Wooster
Denison @ OWU
Wabash @ Kenyon
Wittenberg @ DePauw
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 16, 2013, 05:54:46 PM
I just checked the NCAC website.  They have Denison vs. Kenyon as the 3 vs 6 game and Wabash vs. OWU as the 2 vs 7. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2013, 05:55:33 PM
Yeah, I saw that too. Did I do the tiebreaker wrong? Or did they shift the tiebreakers???

UPDATE: They corrected the bracket. I'm NOT going nuts!

http://www2.northcoast.org/mbasketball/NCACTournament/2013
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 16, 2013, 06:12:32 PM
I don't know if my Twitter question to the NCAC caused them to change the bracket, but they fixed it. Good to get it right, but kind of embarrassing to publish a bad bracket in the first place...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 16, 2013, 06:15:43 PM
I couldn't understand how Denison would have been in front of the LGs either. 

Nice job on calling all the possibilities, smedindy.  You nailed it!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 16, 2013, 10:54:53 PM
The Indiana trips for Wooster have gone from a problem to a disaster, at least by Wooster standards. That's four losses in a row out there, and none of them did they play even remotely well. Today DePauw was just simply better. No one has played well for Wooster in these games, but the play of Doug Thorpe really sticks out. Thorpe, who has single-handily won a couple of real important games this year, has been miserable at Wabash and DePauw. Combined, he is 2-for-21 from the field and 1-for-13 from three-point range this season. If you take out his stat line, Wooster has actually shot better from the field (38.9% to 38.6%) and three-point range (34.8% to 33.3%) in the two games.

Regardless, these teams may be meeting again in just six days.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 17, 2013, 11:02:44 AM
Both the Wittenberg squads, men and women, earned a #5 seed and both will travel this week, the men west to DePauw and the women to disappointing #4 Denison. Unless I am very much mistaken, this is the first time since joining the NCAC in 1989 that Wittenberg will not host a quarterfinal match in either bracket.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 17, 2013, 01:19:38 PM
I wonder if Denison has it in them for another effort against the bishops like yesterday? Nice to see Kenyon earn a home date in the tournament. Someone made a comment over in the oac board that they liked the oac tournament system. I believe the MAC has a similer system but I am not sure if it is a two game bye for the top two or just a one. I do like the two bye system because it does reward play during the regular season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 17, 2013, 03:01:52 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 17, 2013, 01:19:38 PM
I wonder if Denison has it in them for another effort against the bishops like yesterday? Nice to see Kenyon earn a home date in the tournament. Someone made a comment over in the oac board that they liked the oac tournament system. I believe the MAC has a similer system but I am not sure if it is a two game bye for the top two or just a one. I do like the two bye system because it does reward play during the regular season.

I'm up for Wooster getting byes instead of making road trips to Indiana.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 17, 2013, 03:19:40 PM
I don't like the byes into the conference semis. In fact, if you HAVE to do a conference tourney then invite everyone. Though a 7-10, 8-9 game won't exactly be thrilling, but that's the way it goes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 17, 2013, 03:21:21 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 16, 2013, 10:54:53 PM
The Indiana trips for Wooster have gone from a problem to a disaster, at least by Wooster standards. That's four losses in a row out there, and none of them did they play even remotely well. Today DePauw was just simply better. No one has played well for Wooster in these games, but the play of Doug Thorpe really sticks out. Thorpe, who has single-handily won a couple of real important games this year, has been miserable at Wabash and DePauw. Combined, he is 2-for-21 from the field and 1-for-13 from three-point range this season. If you take out his stat line, Wooster has actually shot better from the field (38.9% to 38.6%) and three-point range (34.8% to 33.3%) in the two games.

Regardless, these teams may be meeting again in just six days.

To me, poor shooting in of itself isn't playing badly. I only got to listen to the game yesterday but I heard many plays where Wooster just flat out made poor decisions (fouls with <5 seconds on the shot clock, turnovers on passes, not blocking out, ....). I'd like to strike this up to DePauw having more to play for than Wooster, but at this point I think we are all a bit nervous.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo84 on February 18, 2013, 07:27:56 PM
Wooster does not have a go to guy like the last three years. Last year we could count on Hallowell, the previous two, Ian Franks. I see Xavier Brown inheriting this role but he is mistake-prone. Nevertheless, I like our chances in the tourney. We are hard to beat at home. I think tomorrow vs. Oberlin is a win(I hope), then we get the winner of Witt and DePauw. I hope we get DePauw to avenge this recent loss, because I know we are capable of playing better than what we showed. The team that scares me is Ohio Wesleyan. However, first things first-beat Oberlin, then get some revenge and show people why we are! GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 19, 2013, 10:52:59 AM
The talk about tournament bye's has me remembering the past. I'm 58 so if you are not close to my age and don't remember the d1 tournament before 1975 you may not know this. How many remember when there were only 24 teams in the d1 tournament? At least two teams in each regional were put in the reional semi's every year without a first round game. Oh conferences such as the MAC and Independents(they existed then) had to play round one. Power conferences such as the Big Ten, SEC, ACC and others like the pac 8(there were only 8 then) never had to play a first round game.  Add to this that your league was always in the same regional back in those days. If you were in a weak region you might always have a easy trip to the final four. Can anyone say UCLA? Is it any wonder that one team was able to dominate all those years? After reflecting on this I am starting to change my mind about preferring the OAC system. Bring on the NCAC tournament tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 19, 2013, 12:48:38 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 19, 2013, 10:52:59 AM
After reflecting on this I am starting to change my mind about preferring the OAC system. Bring on the NCAC tournament tonight.

I am in favor of byes because I just don't feel like the reward of home court is enough for the team that won the regular season title.  Under the current system, a team can get hot for a 3 game stretch and wash away what the regular season champ accomplished over the entire season.  That's why I don't have a problem with seeing lower seeded teams have to play one or two more games to truly earn their auto bid if they can make a run in the conference tourney...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 19, 2013, 01:02:58 PM
Well, the obvious answer is to get rid of the conference tourney! That's what I advocate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 19, 2013, 04:44:28 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 19, 2013, 01:02:58 PM
Well, the obvious answer is to get rid of the conference tourney! That's what I advocate.

I agree, but that's not going to happen so rewarding the team that won the regular season title for a conference tournament seems to me like the next best thing...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 19, 2013, 04:52:52 PM
Sorry, no time to preview. I think we all know the scenarios: Win or Else!

I think Wooster handles Oberlin with some ease unless Fox and the boys shoot lights out.

Which Denison shows up? That's the big question. Playing back to back games against an opponent is tough, but they were pasted at OWU earlier.

Which Wabash team (or conversely which Kenyon squad) hits the floor. Two games, two locations, two very different results.

DPU beat Witt twice by a total of 10 points. It's hard to beat a team a third time when they're matched pretty closely.

Intrigues all around!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 19, 2013, 07:43:54 PM
Wabash proves ALWAYS means ALWAYS as the LGs storm back to cut it to three late after trailing by double digits most of the second half. Kenyon holds off Wabash 77-72.

Witt escapes DPU 63-62 as the New Tigers' last shot is well defended by the Old Tigers and Witt corrals the rebound.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 19, 2013, 08:04:44 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 32  Oberlin 25

Posting from South Carolina where I watched the online video of the first half.  Wooster is being led by Doug Thorpe with 14 points.

Oberlin is staying in the game with a slow down tempo and back door cuts.  Geoff Simpson is leading the Yeomen with 18 points.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 19, 2013, 08:38:49 PM
10 minutes remaining:  Wooster 53  Oberlin 31

Wooster started the second half on a 21-3 run and this game is essentially over.  Friday semi-final game will be Woo vs. Witt for the third time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 19, 2013, 08:57:47 PM
Final:  Wooster 74  Oberlin 47  :)

Wooster was led tonight by Doug Thorpe with 18 points, Xavier Brown with 13 and Josh Claytor with 9.

Oberlin was led by Geoff Simpson with 27 points and no one else had more than 5 points.

Scots won the rebounding battle 32 to 20 and had only 9 turnovers vs. 20 for the Yeomen.

Wooster is now 22-4.  ;D  Next game is the NCAC tournament semi-final on Friday night vs. Witt.

GO SCOTS!



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 19, 2013, 09:01:38 PM
Denison 56
OWU 77

Kenyon vs. OWU in the first semifinal on Friday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: 02 Warhawk on February 20, 2013, 02:53:32 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 19, 2013, 09:01:38 PM
Denison 56
OWU 77

Kenyon vs. OWU in the first semifinal on Friday.

what happened to Rogers? He only played 4 minutes in before getting pulled for the entire game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 21, 2013, 08:30:42 AM
The result from Delaware was not unexpected given the effort the Big Red expended in coming up short on their own home court just a few days before. The end to another up and down year for Denison.  After losing last year's senior class, there wasn't much chance we would have improved on 2012's performance.  The addition of some good three point shooters into the rotation held out some promise, but a mid-season meltdown by the Big Red led them to another single-digit win season. 

So we say goodbye to Dimonde Hale, who ended his career Tuesday night with 1,726 points and 702 rebounds in his four years at Denison.  Despite being double and triple teamed most of his career, he became the 11th most prolific scorer in NCAC history and is now 4th on the Big Red all-time list.  He was one of the most dedicated players Denison has ever seen, spending hours and hours in the gym after his freshman year to correct an awkward free throw stroke by switching hands and perfecting a new form.  How many players would do this?  He helped lead his team to the NCAC championship game last year and carried the team on his back for most of this year. 

Best of luck to Dimonde and also to fellow senior Jon Akpapunam, a solid player whose athleticism, speed and shooting touch often provided a needed spark for the Big Red over the last two years.  Congratulations to both on their four year careers on the floor at Livingston!   

   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 21, 2013, 12:10:55 PM
Some random thoughts/notes on Wooster:

-- Wooster and Wittenberg, at least while Steve Moore has been the coach, have never faced each other in the NCAC Tournament other than in the title game.
-- In the Steve Moore era, Wooster has only swept Wittenberg in three games in one season – the 1994-95 season. Wittenberg has only done it once as well, in 2001-02.
-- While you'd expect a little better shooting numbers at home vs. away, the spread for Doug Thorpe is rather large. At home he is shooting 50% from the field and 46.9% from three-point range. On the road he is shooting just 40.7% from the floor and 38.6%. He is also averaging over three points per game more at home vs. away (15 ppg vs. 11.8 ppg).
-- Xavier Brown averaged 22.5 ppg, shooting 53% from the floor and 60% from three-point range in two games against Witt last year. This year, he is averaging just 8 ppg, shooting 32% from the field in two against Witt. On the positive side, Brown has significantly cut down on his turnovers. In the first 13 games, he committed 41 turnovers. In the last 13 games, just 25.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 21, 2013, 10:09:09 PM
well capital probably will not be a first or second round opponent now. They were beaten tonight by Mt. Union.  Mt. outplayed and outcoached them, a well deserved win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 22, 2013, 01:10:30 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 21, 2013, 10:09:09 PM
well capital probably will not be a first or second round opponent now. They were beaten tonight by Mt. Union.  Mt. outplayed and outcoached them, a well deserved win.

So,  seeing as Cap has been ranked ahead of Calvin in the last 2 regional rankings, if Calvin loses in the MIAA Championship game, do the Knights stay ranked below Cap for the Pool C bid?  Something to think about...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2013, 01:51:27 PM
We may never know. I think these last ratings are the 'secret' ones...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on February 22, 2013, 02:48:45 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 22, 2013, 01:10:30 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on February 21, 2013, 10:09:09 PM
well capital probably will not be a first or second round opponent now. They were beaten tonight by Mt. Union.  Mt. outplayed and outcoached them, a well deserved win.

So,  seeing as Cap has been ranked ahead of Calvin in the last 2 regional rankings, if Calvin loses in the MIAA Championship game, do the Knights stay ranked below Cap for the Pool C bid?  Something to think about...

They (i.e. Calvin) will almost surely end up ahead of Capital in the final (secret) rankings. In that scenario Hope would enter the rankings and Calvin would get "credit" for 1-2 versus regionally ranked opponents. We'd be looking at:

Calvin .905 WP / .461 SOS / 1-2 vRRO
Capital . 792 WP / .490 SOS / 1-2 vRRO
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2013, 04:13:11 PM
Rematches, of course, in the NCAC tourney tonight:

Wooster, of course, blew Wittenberg away (at Witt, no less) way back in December, but had to fight hard to keep from blowing a double-digit second half lead and won just 75-71 at Wooster on the 9th.

Kenyon faced OWU just once, losing 81-69 back in December when OWU was on a roll. Kenyon's won seven of eight, though, (and nine of 11) and I think the previous result may be thrown out the window. I had not realized Kenyon was on such a streak, but there. you. go.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 22, 2013, 04:40:09 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 22, 2013, 04:13:11 PM
Rematches, of course, in the NCAC tourney tonight:

Wooster, of course, blew Wittenberg away (at Witt, no less) way back in December, but had to fight hard to keep from blowing a double-digit second half lead and won just 75-71 at Wooster on the 9th.

Kenyon faced OWU just once, losing 81-69 back in December when OWU was on a roll. Kenyon's won seven of eight, though, (and nine of 11) and I think the previous result may be thrown out the window. I had not realized Kenyon was on such a streak, but there. you. go.


This little gem from my blog last summer

8. Kenyon 11-15, 5-11

Good gravy how did Kenyon win so many games with 13 underclassmen, nine of them Freshmen?  Kenyon loses 1 Senior, only their 3rd leading scorer and then return everyone else.

Unlike Allegheny I see reasons to be a little optimistic in Gambier.   They might hover around the .500 mark and pick off a pretender or two along the way. Maybe next year's Denison?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 22, 2013, 06:57:18 PM
Wow!  Kenyon was doubled up at 36-18 near the end of first half and now they're about to tie it up!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 22, 2013, 07:32:57 PM
Kenyon keeps it close into the final minutes, but OWU pulls away late to win,  77-64.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 22, 2013, 08:41:01 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 40  Wittenberg 37

Wooster is missing Kenny DeBoer who is out with a knee injury.  Scots are being led by Evan Pannell with 13 points and Doug Thorpe with 11.

Wittenberg's top scorers in the half were Zach Leahy with 14 points and Sam Collins with 9.

Witt shot 63% in the half compared to only 42% for Woo but the Tigers committed 8 turnovers (vs. only 2 for the Scots) and were outrebounded 15 to 12.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 22, 2013, 09:41:19 PM
Final:  Wooster 78  Wittenberg 66

Wooster beats its rival for the 3rd time this season! ;D  Scots were led by Evan Pannell with a career high 21 points, Doug Thorpe with 17 and Xavier Brown with 9.

Wooster's depth showed tonight with freshman Alex LaLonde starting in place of the injured Kenny DeBoer.  LaLonde hit two big three pointers in the last 6 minutes of the game and also pulled down 8 boards to go with his 8 points.

Wittenberg's top scorers were Zach Leahy with 16 points, Scott Masin with 14 and Sam Collins with 12.

Wooster is now 23-4 and will face Ohio Wesleyan tomorrow night for the NCAC tourney championship.  Witt finishes the year at 17-10.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 23, 2013, 12:31:02 AM
Tonight's game in one sentence:

Wittenberg played very well; Wooster played better.

In a few more sentences:

Probably the overall best game I saw Wooster play this year (sadly, I haven't seen all that many). Perhaps also one of Wittenberg's best, as well. I really thought the Tigers looked pretty good in nearly all phases of the game. Their two weaknesses were defensive rebounds (only 19 total; Wooster had 14 offensive boards) and turnovers from the guards, a few of which were quite unforced (twice stepping out of bounds on the wing, for example). Those extra offensive opportunities for Wooster proved decisive at Timken tonight.

Credit the Scots' guards for proving themselves to be a step ahead of Witt tonight - guard play was a key strength for the Scots tonight. Thorpe, Goodwin, Brown, Wingard and Pannell (give the man a game ball!) were all very good throughout. I especially thought that their offensive decision-making was excellent, which was reflected in the season-low 4 turnovers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2013, 09:13:50 AM
Tonight's Woo-OWU game is likely a very important game for NCAA tournament seeding purposes.

If Wooster wants a chance to host a couple of games in the NCAA tourney, they need to secure the win and the NCAC automatic bid.  In past years when Wooster entered the NCAA's only as a Pool C at large team, they have ended up playing NCAA tourney games at road sites like Rock Island, Albion, Transy, etc.

Wooster's defense will be tested again tonight in trying to slow down OWU's guards.  Taylor Rieger has become OWU's leading scorer and he is shooting 43% on three pointers with 64 now made on the season.  Andy Winters is a close second in scoring for OWU and he continues to excel (as Kenyon discovered last night) at penetrating drives to the basket.  Hopefully, Wooster's "D" can contain Rieger and Winters tonight.

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on February 23, 2013, 11:43:37 AM
Looks like it was a great game last night in Wooster between Woo and Witt.  Another great matchup tonight between the top two teams in the NCAC as Woo and OWU meet for the NCAC title.  I will take the Scots by 8.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 23, 2013, 01:06:17 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 23, 2013, 12:31:02 AM
Tonight's game in one sentence:

Wittenberg played very well; Wooster played better.

In a few more sentences:

Probably the overall best game I saw Wooster play this year (sadly, I haven't seen all that many). Perhaps also one of Wittenberg's best, as well. I really thought the Tigers looked pretty good in nearly all phases of the game. Their two weaknesses were defensive rebounds (only 19 total; Wooster had 14 offensive boards) and turnovers from the guards, a few of which were quite unforced (twice stepping out of bounds on the wing, for example). Those extra offensive opportunities for Wooster proved decisive at Timken tonight.

Credit the Scots' guards for proving themselves to be a step ahead of Witt tonight - guard play was a key strength for the Scots tonight. Thorpe, Goodwin, Brown, Wingard and Pannell (give the man a game ball!) were all very good throughout. I especially thought that their offensive decision-making was excellent, which was reflected in the season-low 4 turnovers.

Well said.  How disheartening must it have been for Witt to play arguably their best half of basketball of the season (save for the 8 turnovers) in that first half, only to look up at the scoreboard as the half time buzzer went off and saw that they were trailing by 3?  Despite shooting nearly 20 percentage points better than Wooster, the Scots still led at the break. 

Wooster did step up their defense in the second half holding Witt to just 10-30 shooting, but the Tigers still wouldn't go away as it was still tied at 61's late in the game before Wooster took over and put the game away!

What is the severity of the injury to DeBoer?  I really thought his absence was going to kill us last night especially when Mays and Claytor had to go to the bench early in the first half after both picked up 2 fouls.  But as wsf noted, Lalonde stepped up big in starting for DeBoer.  What a nice addition that turned out to be.  Josh Kipfer also came in and played well as Moore was forced to go to the freshman as there were no other options at the big spot once both Claytor and Mays both had to go to the bench.  The fact that Witt couldn't capitalize on this was a key as Wooster actually went on a nice run with Claytor and Mays on the bench as opposed to Witt seizing the opportunity and increasing their lead...

Now it's on to Woo/OWU part 3.  Both of the regular season games could have gone either way and especially the last one in Timken where the Bishops blew a double digit lead over the last few minutes allowing Wooster to come back to win in OT.  I still think, win or lose tonight, the Scots should remain the top ranked team to come out of the GL Region.  OWU has already lost to the Scots twice and as they have remained in the two spot, I don't think one win would vault them ahead of the Scots.  But this is the NCAA selection committee we're talking about so throw out any rationale when it comes to how they come to their decisions.  Wooster wins and I think you can guarantee Wooster will host at least the first round of tournament games...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo84 on February 23, 2013, 01:55:02 PM
I heard DeBoer had an inflamed knee but I don't know the severity of it. I know he had surgery on it during the off-season. Could be he just needs rest and ice. Nevertheless, we need him against OWU. I hope we play defense like we did the second half last night. If we can put the clamps on Rieger and Winters, I like our chances.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 23, 2013, 01:58:42 PM
In regards to whether Wooster or OWU would be ranked first in the region if OWU wins tonight, let's review the primary criteria for each:

(Records assume OWU victory tonight; SOS is through last Sunday)

1. In-region winning %: Wooster 22-5 (.814), OWU 22-4 (.846) - Advantage OWU
2. SOS: Wooster .554, OWU .537 - Advantage Wooster (OWU is getting the multiplier benefit of a road game tonight though)
3. In-region head-to-head: Wooster 2-1 - Advantage Wooster
4. In-region results vs. regionally-ranked opponents: Wooster 3-2, OWU 3-2 - Advantage even

The only one I'm not sure about is the in-region results vs. common regional opponents - but I think it's even because both of them were 12-2 in NCAC play when excluding the games against each other, they're both 2-0 in the NCAC Tournament so far, and I only saw one other common opponent (Marietta), who they both beat. So I think both are sitting at 15-2 vs. in-region competition vs. common opponents.

So if OWU wins, I think we'd see them as even on two criteria, OWU holding the edge in one, and Wooster holding the edge on two. If SOS is basically at parity as well, then really head-to-head competition would seem to be the primary criterion differentiator, and Wooster will still have that edge. That could be enough to keep the Scots at #1 in the GL.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 23, 2013, 06:33:50 PM
Looks like Goodwin is out with a hand injury tonight. DeBoer is warming up so he may be available tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2013, 07:32:16 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 30  Ohio Wesleyan 29

Wooster is being led by Doug Thorpe with 8 points and Josh Claytor with 5.

OWU's top scorers in the half were Marshall Morris with 7 points and Reuel Rogers with 6.

Good defense in the half as both teams shot less than 40% from the floor.  Wooster with a 23-19 rebounding advantage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2013, 08:34:42 PM
Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 76  Wooster 66

Congratulations to Ohio Wesleyan on winning the NCAC Tourney and the NCAA automatic bid.

The Bishops were led by Marshall Morris with 19 points (4 three pointers), Andy Winters with 17 and Taylor Rieger with 14.

Wooster's top scorers were Doug Thorpe with 24 points, Evan Pannell with 11 and Josh Claytor with 12 points, .
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 23, 2013, 08:59:15 PM
Congrats to the Bishops. Wooster should be in the tourney as well, so let's hope they represent well!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 23, 2013, 10:32:05 PM
First off, credit to OWU. They are a really good team who can score quickly. Winters is the best point guard I've seen in the NCAC in a number of years.

While DeBoer and Goodwin aren't superstars, they are key players, and their absence (or in DeBoer's case not nearly 100%) made the Scots' margin of error even that much smaller than it would have been otherwise.

As for the game itself, from Wooster's standpoint, two things jump out. One, the big men for Wooster left about 8-10 points on the floor, the vast majority of them in the first half. If they (in particular Mays) convert what should have been close to automatic shots right near the rim, Wooster would have led at half by six to eight points instead of one. When the inevitable OWU run came in the second half, there would have been a cushion. When the game was starting to get away from Wooster, Mays & Claytor were 5-for-15 from the floor. They improved that a little bit with some garbage points.

The other issue is the shooting of Brown. When your leading scorer for the vast majority of the season goes 2-for-10 and scores four points, you are in trouble. Unfortunately for Wooster, this isn't an isolated game lately. Since Brown carried Wooster to an overtime victory over the Bishops Feb. 6, he is just 24-for-64 (37.5%) from the field and 4-for-16 (25%) from three. In the NCAC Tournament it was even worse (9-for-30/2-for-12). On the bright side, his shooting can only get better.

As for the tournament, Wooster is obviously in. As to whether the Scots will host next weekend, I think the answer is yes. In fact, I think both Wooster and OWU will host next Saturday. After that is much more of a question.

It would be interesting to know how the committee would look at Wooster and OWU. The Bishops have a slightly better in-region W-L % (22-4 vs. 22-5), and the fact that they won the conference tournament (this isn't a criteria, but if we remember the discussion from last year, the committee has consistently shown that they give this significant weight). On Wooster's side, they own the head-to-head vs. Ohio Wesleyan (2-1), and have a better win % (probably over 56% after today). Both teams are 3-2 against regionally-ranked teams. You could probably flip a coin as to which team is considered a higher seed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 23, 2013, 10:38:10 PM
There are at least three reasons that Wooster lost tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 23, 2013, 10:41:48 PM
Jerry beat me to the punch with our nearly-simultaneous posts.  And, he hit my third point right on the head.  With me, though, it's not both of the big men, it's just one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2013, 04:04:26 PM
Wow.  Marshall Morris had only made 10 3-pointers ALL season.  Last night he hit on 4-5...  :o

Is Goodwin's injury season ending?  That's a big loss heading into the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2013, 01:39:00 PM
Well, both NCAC teams fall into the same 8-team bracket:

Pod 1:
Penn-State Behrend at Wooster
Marietta at Dickinson

Pod 2:
Cabrini at Hampden-Sydney
St. Vincent at Ohio Wesleyan

Based on this draw, it seems like the GL Regional Committee kept the Scots ahead of OWU in the final regional rankings. Wooster and Hampden-Sydney look like the 1/2 seeds here, with OWU as the 2/3 seed.

I think Wooster's draw, in particular, is quite favorable. By this implied seeding, I think the only road trip the Scots could face before Salem would be to go to Hampden-Sydney; I think if OWU comes out of that bottom foursome, Wooster would still host that potential OWU-Wooster Sweet Sixteen tilt. Obviously, cart before the horse for now...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 25, 2013, 01:46:38 PM
Agreed.  A terrific draw for Wooster, and I think we're a pretty sure thing to get two home games.  Now for the injury situation.  DeBoer's knee needs to get better, and Goodwin needs to join the ranks of shooting coaches. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 25, 2013, 01:47:26 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2013, 01:39:00 PM
Well, both NCAC teams fall into the same 8-team bracket:

Pod 1:
Penn-State Behrend at Wooster
Marietta at Dickinson

Pod 2:
Cabrini at Hampden-Sydney
St. Vincent at Ohio Wesleyan

Based on this draw, it seems like the GL Regional Committee kept the Scots ahead of OWU in the final regional rankings. Wooster and Hampden-Sydney look like the 1/2 seeds here, with OWU as the 2/3 seed.

I think Wooster's draw, in particular, is quite favorable. By this implied seeding, I think the only road trip the Scots could face before Salem would be to go to Hampden-Sydney; I think if OWU comes out of that bottom foursome, Wooster would still host that potential OWU-Wooster Sweet Sixteen tilt. Obviously, cart before the horse for now...

I agree!  This is a much better draw for the Scots than I anticipated.  I really thought that they would not be in line for more than 1 home game, and was afraid that they might get sent to Whitworth!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 25, 2013, 01:58:38 PM
In unofficial final national rankings, based on a formula intended to mirror the selection criteria, Wooster and OWU are both in the top 15 nationally, while Hampden-Sydney is #50.  With that in mind, I see the two NCAC teams as the top two seeds in this group of 8, in some order, with Hampden-Sydney and Dickinson below them.  I think that both get two home games, provided they advance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2013, 01:59:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 25, 2013, 01:46:38 PM
Agreed.  A terrific draw for Wooster, and I think we're a pretty sure thing to get two home games.  Now for the injury situation.  DeBoer's knee needs to get better, and Goodwin needs to join the ranks of shooting coaches. :)

As to the injury situation, the stretched out tournament format could be a real blessing here, especially for DeBoer nursing that knee. The full weeks between games for the first three weeks, and only one game day instead of the back-to-back setup of a "pod" should help maximize his recovery time and minimize the game-level intensity time. Still haven't heard anything on whether Goodwin will be back at all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2013, 02:07:57 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 25, 2013, 01:58:38 PM
In unofficial final national rankings, based on a formula intended to mirror the selection criteria, Wooster and OWU are both in the top 15 nationally, while Hampden-Sydney is #50.  With that in mind, I see the two NCAC teams as the top two seeds in this group of 8, in some order, with Hampden-Sydney and Dickinson below them.  I think that both get two home games, provided they advance.

Yes I agree with you on the relative rankings nationally; but I'm not sure the committee looks at it this way - my sense has always been more that the committee looks at each regional ranking relatively equally - e.g. GL #1 = South #1, GL #2 = South #2, and doesn't rank all teams nationally to then decide seeding.

In other words, it feels like the bracket is seeded more as "OK, Wooster is GL#1, then OWU and Hampden-Sydney are both regional #2s" (as a example; not sure if H-S would've been South #2 in the final rankings). And that the bracket is not seeded as "Wooster and OWU overall rank in the Top 15, H-S ranks in the Top 50, so thus Woo-OWU-Hampden."

Could be totally off, but I seem to remember feeling this way back when Wooster got sent to St. John Fisher the one year - I think they both ended up as Regional #1s coming into the tournament (or maybe Woo was even the GL#2), so the committee saw them as roughly equal even though I remember thinking that Wooster looked like they were clearly higher "nationally."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2013, 02:24:35 PM
Current Massey Rankings in parentheses:

Pod 1:
Penn-State Behrend (174) at Wooster (27)
Marietta (56) at Dickinson (79)

Pod 2:
Cabrini (70) at Hampden-Sydney (5)
St. Vincent (66) at Ohio Wesleyan (25)

Wooster and Hampden-Sydney look like pretty strong favorites in their first round match-ups. Marietta-Dickinson looks like a pick'em since it's at Dickinson. OWU should be a reasonable favorite at home against St. Vincent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 25, 2013, 02:25:43 PM
Okay, but Hampden-Sydney is unofficially 7th in their region...
http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/p/2010-2011-d3-mens-regional-rankings.html (http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/p/2010-2011-d3-mens-regional-rankings.html)

Also, I'm not concluding that Wooster is necessarily #1 in their 8-team group just because of placement as the first team listed.  St. Thomas and Williams appear to be clear #1 seeds in their groups, but aren't listed first in the bracket.  I'm really not sure who would host a 3rd round Wooster/OWU rematch...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2013, 02:36:58 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 25, 2013, 02:25:43 PM
Okay, but Hampden-Sydney is unofficially 7th in their region...
http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/p/2010-2011-d3-mens-regional-rankings.html (http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/p/2010-2011-d3-mens-regional-rankings.html)

Also, I'm not concluding that Wooster is necessarily #1 in their 8-team group just because of placement as the first team listed.  St. Thomas and Williams appear to be clear #1 seeds in their groups, but aren't listed first in the bracket.  I'm really not sure who would host a 3rd round Wooster/OWU rematch...

But, Hampden-Sydney was #2 last week in the actual NCAA regional rankings: http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/category/ncaa-stuff/regional-rankings/

Since those rankings they had a win and a loss, so obviously they may have moved - but maybe not, as well. I really don't know the teams in the South well at all, and didn't follow the conference tourneys down there, so not sure how H-S may have moved in the final, unseen, NCAA rankings.

And I agree that trying to read the tea leaves of bracket placement is a frustrating science, at best. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 25, 2013, 02:40:38 PM
this should make for a fun day at ohio wesleyan saturday. Lacrosse in the afternoon(hampton-sydney as a matter of fact) and basketball that evening.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 25, 2013, 02:44:51 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2013, 02:36:58 PM
And I agree that trying to read the tea leaves of bracket placement is a frustrating science, at best. :)

100% agreed!  Having actual seeds would be nice, particularly this year, when the lack of four-team pods doesn't lead to weird hosting situations (like when national #1 Whitworth had to travel to Wooster). 

In March, every opponent is one that's capable of ending your season, so I guess we'll just take it one week at a time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: algernon on February 25, 2013, 03:34:26 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 25, 2013, 02:25:43 PM
Okay, but Hampden-Sydney is unofficially 7th in their region...
http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/p/2010-2011-d3-mens-regional-rankings.html (http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/p/2010-2011-d3-mens-regional-rankings.html)

The site you cite ...  ;D ... is not only unofficial, but has no real relationship to the NCAA rankings or tournament "seeding". 

Last NCAA South ranking:
1 Virginia Wesleyan    16-5    19-6
2 Hampden-Sydney    18-3    22-3
3 Mary Hardin-Baylor    21-4    21-4
4 Christopher Newport 17-5    18-5
5 Emory                       17-6    17-6
6 Concordia (Texas)   18-4    20-5
7 Texas-Dallas              19-6    19-6
8 Randolph                  14-5    20-5

My own bet on the final ranking used by the NCAA:
1 Virginia Wesleyan    18-6    21-7  (Lost ODAC final to Randolph-Macon.  Pool C)
2 Hampden-Sydney    19-4    23-4   (Lost ODAC semifinal to Randolph-Macon.  Pool C)
3 Mary Hardin-Baylor  23-5    23-5  (Lost ASC final to Concordia-TX.  Pool C)
4 Concordia (Texas)   21-4   23-5   (Won ASC title, defeating Mary Hardin-Baylor)
5 Emory                     17-6    17-6   (Won 2 games, including a win over Rochester.  No UAA tourney.  Pool C)
6 Christophr Newport 20-5    21-5  (Won USA South title against weak competition)
7 Randolph-Macon     18-9   19-9  (Won ODAC title, defeating Guilford, Hampden-Sydney, and Virginia Wesleyan)
8 Randolph                14-5    20-5  (Defeated Lynchburg, but lost semifinal to Virginia Wesleyan.  Pool C)

It's certainly not altogether clear, but it appears that Wooster gets 2 home games, and possibly a third.

I'm really unclear about who would host an Ohio Wesleyan / Hampden-Sydney 2nd round game.  And I'm also unclear whether either of these teams might host a 3rd round game against Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 25, 2013, 06:58:29 PM
A very good draw for Wooster, all things considered. But it doesn't really matter if they don't start to shoot better. The defense has been there all year, and it should keep Wooster in every game. But unless guys start knocking down shots, a long run seems very unlikely to me.

Over the last month (8 games) Wooster has shot just 43.4% from the field and 31.5% from three-point range. The areas they struggled with earlier in the year (free-throw shooting and turnovers) is actually better now than at any point in the season, so that is something to hang your hat on.

I know coach Moore has cited shot selection and patience as issues in some of their recent losses, and no doubt that is part of it. But to me, it's simply a matter of guys  just making shots they are capable of (or seem capable of making based on talent). When Marshall Morris takes five three-pointers in one game, you can say that's a lack of patience and poor shot selection. Except he makes four of them. Wooster took plenty of shots quickly during it's 11-game win streak, they just made them. You can be as patient as you want, but when guys simply miss shots they need to make, you don't look very good.

To me, three guys hold the key to any kind of run -- Mays, LaLonde and Brown. At some point, Mays has to decide if he wants to be the dominant player his talent says he should be. Something has to make him play angry. The number of easy shots he misses because he doesn't attack the rim is becoming a real problem. For LaLonde, it's a matter of finding the stroke that made him a Div. I recruit. He was a scorer in high school, with excellent three-point range. Now he simply can't make a shot unless it's a layup or a dunk. He is playing much better defense than I think anyone expected, but his "potential" shooting from the outside can really help break the zone Wooster has been seeing.

As for Brown, he has done much better with cutting down on his turnovers and having better shot selection than he did last year. He just isn't making shots. In the offseason he needs to work on shooting the ball with his fingertips more. The ball gets too far down in his hand. He has a nice release and squares his shoulders well. He should be a better shooter. Another thing I've noticed in comparison to how he started last year (and this year as well), is that he doesn't get deep enough into the shooting area. He needs to get a few feet closer when he makes his one-on-one moves. He can get by people, he just needs to get in closer. If nothing else it would draw the defense to him, allow him to dump the ball down to Mays to make those easy layups we just talked about :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 26, 2013, 11:21:31 AM
FYI - from what I have learned about the final regional rankings... Wooster was #1... Hampden-Sydney was 5.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 26, 2013, 07:22:34 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2013, 02:07:57 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 25, 2013, 01:58:38 PM
In unofficial final national rankings, based on a formula intended to mirror the selection criteria, Wooster and OWU are both in the top 15 nationally, while Hampden-Sydney is #50.  With that in mind, I see the two NCAC teams as the top two seeds in this group of 8, in some order, with Hampden-Sydney and Dickinson below them.  I think that both get two home games, provided they advance.

Yes I agree with you on the relative rankings nationally; but I'm not sure the committee looks at it this way - my sense has always been more that the committee looks at each regional ranking relatively equally - e.g. GL #1 = South #1, GL #2 = South #2, and doesn't rank all teams nationally to then decide seeding.

In other words, it feels like the bracket is seeded more as "OK, Wooster is GL#1, then OWU and Hampden-Sydney are both regional #2s" (as a example; not sure if H-S would've been South #2 in the final rankings). And that the bracket is not seeded as "Wooster and OWU overall rank in the Top 15, H-S ranks in the Top 50, so thus Woo-OWU-Hampden."

Could be totally off, but I seem to remember feeling this way back when Wooster got sent to St. John Fisher the one year - I think they both ended up as Regional #1s coming into the tournament (or maybe Woo was even the GL#2), so the committee saw them as roughly equal even though I remember thinking that Wooster looked like they were clearly higher "nationally."

Based upon what Mike DeWitt said on Hoopsville yesterday, I don't think that your read is necessarily going to be accurate. The odd format created by the extended tournament schedule is going to allow the committee to re-evaluate after the first round in order to assign hosting privileges for the second round, and they may or may not add in the first-round games to the extant statistical profiles of the teams in question. In other words, it's a whole new ballgame as far as seeding is concerned from the way that it was done in the past when the tournament was on a 2-2-2 basis over three weekends.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on February 27, 2013, 08:39:21 AM
Just a quick note for everyone. Pat Coleman will receive the Jake Wade Award from the College Sports Information Directors of America this June at the organization's annual convention in Orlando, Florida. The award is presented to a member of the media for their significant contributions in the field of intercollegiate athletics. A well-deserved award for the outstanding work Pat provides in the coverage of Division III student-athletes. I will be pleased to be able to congratulate him in person later this year, but thought I would pass this along. You can read more about the award here:

http://www.cosida.com/news.aspx?id=3977 (http://www.cosida.com/news.aspx?id=3977)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 27, 2013, 09:37:01 PM
Congratulations to OWU Senior Guard Andy Winters on being named the NCAC Player of the Year!

NCAC First Team:
Xavier Brown - Wooster (So.)
Barry Flynn - DePauw (Sr.)
Dimonde Hale - Denison (Sr.)
Scott Masin - Wittenberg (Jr.)
Ikenna Nwadibia - Kenyon (Jr.)
Doug Thorpe - Wooster (Jr.)
Andy Winters - Ohio Wesleyan (Sr.)

Second Team:
Andrew Fox - Oberlin (Sr.)
Alex Longi - Denison (Jr.)
Devone McLeod - Allegheny (Sr.)
Taylor Rieger - Ohio Wesleyan (Jr.)
Alan Sheppard - Hiram (Sr.)
Ross Sponsler - Wabash (Fr.)
Aaron Stefanov - Hiram (Jr.)

Honorable Mention:
Josh Claytor - Wooster (Sr.)
Kenny DeBoer - Wooster (So.)
Zack Leahy - Wittenberg (Jr.)
Brian Lebowitz - Kenyon (Jr.)
Marshall Morris - Ohio Wesleyan (Sr.)

Newcomer of the Year: Ross Sponsler, Wabash
Coach of the Year: Dan Priest, Kenyon
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2013, 01:51:51 PM
Penn State Behrend Profile

20-8 Record, Won the AMCC conference tournament and NCAA automatic bid

Common Opponents with Wooster (2):  PSB beat John Carroll by 2 points and Wooster beat them by 14.  PSB beat Carnegie Mellon by 13 points and Wooster beat them by 12.

PSB Starters:
6'9" Russ Conley Sr.  19.6 ppg, 8.1 rpg, 61% FG, 79% FT
6'0" Nick DeLisio So.  11.7 ppg, 3.3 apg, 41% on three pointers, 82% FT
6'0" Keith Wallace So.  7.4 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 47% FG, 62% FT
6'2" Pat St. Andrews Sr.  5.1 ppg, 2.5 apg, 33% on three pointers
6'2" Adam Palcic Sr.   5.0 ppg, 5.3 rpg, 51% FG, 70% FT

Key Reserves:
6'9" Shane Skelly Jr.  6.1 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 52% FG, 80% FT
5'11" Casey Courneen Jr.  6.0 ppg, 48% FG, 44% on three pointers, 75% FT
6'6" Mike Knoll Fr.  1.3 ppg, 1.0 rpg
6'7" Chris Dudzenski So.  1.1 ppg, 1.1 rpg

Obviously, slowing down 6'9" Russ Conley and their guard Nick DeLisio will be key for Wooster to get the win.  Facing two guys that are 6'9", Wooster needs to keep Mays and Claytor out of foul trouble and on the floor.  It will be interesting to see if either Kenny DeBoer (knee issue) or Jalen Goodwin (hand issue) get any playing minutes tonight?

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2013, 07:54:34 PM
Wooster's up at the break 37-25.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2013, 11:07:23 PM
Final:  Wooster 62  Penn State Behrend 44  :)

Wooster cruises to a comfortable win by going on a 7-0 run to start the second half that was punctuated by a Evan Pannell alley oop dunk that forced a PSB timeout.  Xavier Brown led Wooster with 17 points (3 three pointers) while Doug Thorpe added 10 points (3 three pointers) and Kenny DeBoer also looked good with 10 points.

Wooster next faces Dickinson which registerd a home win vs. Marietta tonight by a 80-65 score.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2013, 11:18:46 PM
Final: Ohio Wesleyan 84  St. Vincent (PA) 75  :)

Good night for the NCAC as the Bishops also get a first round win knocking off St. Francis.  Andy Winters led OWU with 21 points while Taylor Rieger had 16 points and Reuel Rogers added 10.

Ohio Wesleyan next faces Cabrini which pulled an upset win over Hampden Sydney tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 02, 2013, 11:23:09 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2013, 11:18:46 PM
Final: Ohio Wesleyan 84  St. Vincent (PA) 75  :)

Good night for the NCAC as the Bishops also get a first round win knocking off St. Francis.  Andy Winters led OWU with 21 points while Taylor Rieger had 16 points and Reuel Rogers added 10.

Ohio Wesleyan next faces Cabrini which pulled an upset win over Hampden Sydney tonight.

I believe NCAC teams are 13-5 in their last 18 NCAA tournament games (2011, 2012 and 2013 tournament to-date).

Also the third straight year that multiple NCAC teams have won an NCAA tournament game.

Not too shabby for the conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2013, 11:39:19 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2013, 11:07:23 PM
Final:  Wooster 62  Penn State Behrend 44  :)

Wooster cruises to a comfortable win by going on a 7-0 run to start the second half that was punctuated by a Evan Pannell alley oop dunk that forced a PSB timeout. Xavier Brown led Wooster with 17 points (3 three pointers) while Doug Thorpe added 10 points (3 three pointers) and Kenny DeBoer also looked good with 10 points.

Wooster next faces Dickinson which registerd a home win vs. Marietta tonight by a 80-65 score.

GO SCOTS!

That alley oop from Brown to Pannell was sweet.  Nice to see Evan back in the lineup tonight as his absence really hurt the Scots against OWU in the NCAC championship game.  Also, DeBoer looked to be much healthier tonight as well than he did in that loss to OWU a week ago.  It looks like the week off really benefited the Scots from a healing standpoint...

Now, it's time to start reading up on Dickinson who I know absolutely nothing about other than the fact that tonight's NCAA tournament win was their first NCAA tournament win since 1980?  :o

Just wagering a guess, but I'm going to assume that Wooster and OWU should be hosting next weekend as well?  Cabrini upstet H-SC on the road so I would assume they would now travel to OWU next and Wooster is a higher seed than Dickinson as well. 

However it shakes out, the Scots now have another week to get even healthier as they prepare for Dickinson!   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2013, 12:08:43 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 02, 2013, 11:39:19 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2013, 11:07:23 PM
Final:  Wooster 62  Penn State Behrend 44  :)

Wooster cruises to a comfortable win by going on a 7-0 run to start the second half that was punctuated by a Evan Pannell alley oop dunk that forced a PSB timeout. Xavier Brown led Wooster with 17 points (3 three pointers) while Doug Thorpe added 10 points (3 three pointers) and Kenny DeBoer also looked good with 10 points.

Wooster next faces Dickinson which registerd a home win vs. Marietta tonight by a 80-65 score.

GO SCOTS!

That alley oop from Brown to Pannell was sweet.  Nice to see Evan back in the lineup tonight as his absence really hurt the Scots against OWU in the NCAC championship game.  Also, DeBoer looked to be much healthier tonight as well than he did in that loss to OWU a week ago.  It looks like the week off really benefited the Scots from a healing standpoint...

Now, it's time to start reading up on Dickinson who I know absolutely nothing about other than the fact that tonight's NCAA tournament win was their first NCAA tournament win since 1980?  :o

Just wagering a guess, but I'm going to assume that Wooster and OWU should be hosting next weekend as well?  Cabrini upstet H-SC on the road so I would assume they would now travel to OWU next and Wooster is a higher seed than Dickinson as well. 

However it shakes out, the Scots now have another week to get even healthier as they prepare for Dickinson!   8-)

Pannell played against OWU; he hasn't been hurt.  I think you're confusing him with Jalen Goodwin, who is out for the season with a broken finger.  The Scots played a very nice game tonight.  Excellent throughout on the defensive end and the boards, and pretty good against a tough zone until they got up twenty and went a bit sloppy.  They'll be tough to beat next week if they can repeat that performance.  Hopefully it'll be at Timken.

Dickinson appears to be better than advertised.  They had two guys shoot the lights out from three-point land.  Big guys, too, as both shooters had eight rebounds.  Cabrini appears to be tough just like last year, and will be a load for OWU to handle wherever that game is played.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 03, 2013, 12:58:10 AM
Dickinson's tourney win was so long ago it was in the old regional consolation games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2013, 09:33:55 AM
Hey, Pat, do you have an idea what time the host schools will be announced today?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2013, 10:59:22 AM
The schedules on both the Wooster and Dickinson websites show next Saturday's game to be at Timken at 7 PM.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 03, 2013, 11:00:55 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 03, 2013, 10:59:22 AM
Wooster's schedule lists Dickinson next Saturday at 7 PM in bold letters, which indicates a home game.  There is as yet no article or other announcement, but it looks like it's a done deal.

And Dickinson's lists it at Wooster...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 03, 2013, 11:14:31 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 03, 2013, 12:08:43 AM

Pannell played against OWU; he hasn't been hurt.  I think you're confusing him with Jalen Goodwin, who is out for the season with a broken finger. 

Oops.  I was confusing the two.  Thanks WB. 

OWU and Cabrini both have TBA still listed on their schedules btw...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 03, 2013, 12:07:21 PM
I don't believe the hosts are official... but Dickinson and Wooster should be obvious... Cabrini at OWU should also be obvious. I know the call has been done... announcements later this afternoon most likely.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 03, 2013, 12:40:43 PM
does anyone know the capacity of ohio wesleyan's gym? I was going to go yesterday but I decided not too since it was so late. Good thing from watching on the web it looked sold out. Standing room on the west side of the gym. Nice to see the turnout there. If I go next week  I better look in to buying tickets early. Naturally I am assuming OWU will host next week. We all know what assumption is the mother of though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 03, 2013, 01:44:28 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on March 03, 2013, 12:40:43 PM
does anyone know the capacity of ohio wesleyan's gym? I was going to go yesterday but I decided not too since it was so late. Good thing from watching on the web it looked sold out. Standing room on the west side of the gym. Nice to see the turnout there. If I go next week  I better look in to buying tickets early. Naturally I am assuming OWU will host next week. We all know what assumption is the mother of though.

dave, it has a capacity of 2300.  Attendance was listed at 1850 for last night's game btw.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 03, 2013, 02:19:35 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 03, 2013, 12:08:43 AM

Dickinson appears to be better than advertised.  They had two guys shoot the lights out from three-point land.  Big guys, too, as both shooters had eight rebounds.  Cabrini appears to be tough just like last year, and will be a load for OWU to handle wherever that game is played.

Really, only one guy from Dickinson shot lights out from 3-point range.  Adam Honig is a 6' guard who was basically unconscious last night when compared to his season stats.  He went off for 32 total points going 5-7 from deep and 12-15 overall.  On the season he's shooting 37% from deep and averaging 14 ppg.  The big you were referring to is 6'7" F Gerry Wixted and he did go 2-4 from deep last night and 7-11 overall and finished with 20 points.  He's their leading scorer at 17 ppg and he does have range with 26 made treys on the season. 

Btw, here is what they said about traveling to Wooster in their recap of their first round win:

QuoteDickinson will likely travel to what is rumored to be one of the loudest gyms in Division III, Wooster College in Ohio.

8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2013, 02:30:37 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 03, 2013, 12:07:21 PM
I don't believe the hosts are official... but Dickinson and Wooster should be obvious... Cabrini at OWU should also be obvious. I know the call has been done... announcements later this afternoon most likely.

I really doubt that either Dickinson or Wooster would have posted the location on their respective schedules without having been given notification.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 03, 2013, 02:32:06 PM
I don't agree.. but considering no school posted until the official notice was sent to schools... it was interesting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo84 on March 03, 2013, 02:40:57 PM
It's official- Wooster will host Dickinson College next Saturday at 7pm.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 03, 2013, 03:26:52 PM
Sigh.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 03, 2013, 09:05:36 PM
OWU is hosting Saturday as well...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2013, 11:18:20 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 02, 2013, 11:39:19 PM

Now, it's time to start reading up on Dickinson who I know absolutely nothing about other than the fact that tonight's NCAA tournament win was their first NCAA tournament win since 1980?  :o


Did a little reading up on Dickinson this morning.  As mentioned, Saturday was their first NCAA Tournament win in 33 years.  Clearly Dickinson has not been a dominant program in recent years.  This year they have set their school record for wins in a season when they hit the 20 win total in the CC tournament championship game win.  Contrast that to Wooster who routinely puts up 20 wins in a season as the Scots reached the 20 win plateau this season for the 17th year in a row!   :o

Clearly, post season experience and also the tradition of winning basketball is on the side of the Scots for this 2nd round matchup as evidenced by Dickinson's lack of tournament wins over the last 3 decades.  Compare that to the Scots making the NCAA tournament 18 of the last 19 seasons including making it to the Final 4 three times in the last decade. 

Oh, and if that wasn't enough, the Scots are playing at home in the friendly confines of Timken where they had won 10 straight NCAA Tournament games before last year's 2 piont loss to IWU in the Sweet 16. 

But, with all that said, history and tradition don't win games and that is why the games are played on the hardwood, so anything can happen when the Red Devils come rolling into Timken Saturday night...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 05, 2013, 09:23:26 AM
Another Dickinson tidbit...

The Red Devils' head coach, Allen Seretti, is a graduate of Allegheny ('99).  He was a member of the NCAA Tournament qualifying team that won the NCAC Tournament in '99 so he will have some familiarity with Wooster and Coach Moore.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 05, 2013, 09:29:58 AM
I've attached a link to video of the Marietta-Dickinson game.  Hard to tell if Dickinson is the real deal since Marietta played defense as if they'd been nailed to the ground.  And if you want to know what student announcers sound like after drinking 42 Jolt Colas, here's your chance. :)

http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/29683578
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: OldRedBuckeye on March 07, 2013, 03:15:33 PM
I realize that it is NCAA tourney time. Best wishes to OWU and Wooster.

But as I watch the NCAA tourney unfold, I keep asking myself a question that I think Denison administrators need to be asking themselves right now: Does Denison care about putting a winning product on the floor in men's basketball? If the answer is no then the rest of this post is entirely moot.

I ask this question because I watch a program that flounders continually. I am not smart enough to know all the reasons but I do know as Bill Parcells once said you are what your record says you are. Under the current coaching regime, Denison has had one winning record in 11 seasons (13-12)!!!!! The current coach has a career record of 93-191 or a .327 winning percentage. Now again, I'm not smart enough to know all the reasons for this but I do know that you could count on less than one hand in all divisions of college basketball all the coaches with a record like that at one school over the same number of years that are still coaching at the same school.

I recognize that Denison is successful in other sports. I also recognize that Denison had two all-conference performers this season but couldn't muster a better record than 9-17. Denison lost seven games by more than 20 points!

At some point, someone at Denison has to have a light bulb go off and say what are we doing here? From all accounts, coach Ghiloni is a nice guy, cares about his players and is invested in the University. But and it's a big but ... somehow that hasn't been good enough especially in the NCAC with teams like Wooster, OWU, DePauw, Wabash, Witt and others who are playing for tournament bids most years.

So I hope some Denison administrators read this board and at least consider the facts. If the answer is we're not interested in winning and playing for NCAAs, then there is really no reason to change course. But if the answer is that you are not satisfied with the present course and want better, what would make you think the 12th year would be any different from the past 11 years? I don't want to see anyone lose their job. But I also know that it is well past time for Denison to decide whether or not they want to compete for NCAAs or not. Other than catching lightning in a bottle last season and making it to the NCAC championship, an NCAA bid hasn't been a real possibility for far too long at Denison.

It's your choice Denison. But make no mistake about it, there is a choice here. And the message you send to current and former players, alumni, students, prospective recruits and opponents alike will be unmistakeable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 07, 2013, 07:30:55 PM
I know what you are saying Old Red. When I have been too sporting events at Denison I have heard others mention the same concerns about the basketball program.(Who knows I may have spoke to you one). Basketball certainly seems to take a back seat too Lacrosse, Football and Swimming. Since I am not a grad but just a fan of Denison sports I have no idea what the thinking behind athletics at Denison is. I would love to see them do well though as I enjoy all spors at Denison. Still on the top of my list for most beautifull campus. (Kenyon, and John Carroll are pretty nice also)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 08, 2013, 08:29:38 AM
After reading the news out of Akron today about the zips program I really know why I love d3 sports over d1. You don't have to worry about your "student" athletes getting in trouble with the law being right now the biggest reason. Akron's starting point gurard arrested and suspended from the team for drug dealing.(arrested by police recieving a shipment of 5 pounds of weed). Thank goodness this is not something we have to read about with the fine young men and women who go too d3 schools.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on March 08, 2013, 11:40:37 AM
Quote from: davepi2 on March 08, 2013, 08:29:38 AM
After reading the news out of Akron today about the zips program I really know why I love d3 sports over d1. You don't have to worry about your "student" athletes getting in trouble with the law being right now the biggest reason. Akron's starting point gurard arrested and suspended from the team for drug dealing.(arrested by police recieving a shipment of 5 pounds of weed). Thank goodness this is not something we have to read about with the fine young men and women who go too d3 schools.

You must have missed the Hamline story from earlier this year.

http://www.twincities.com/sports/ci_22313746/hamline-suspends-basketball-coach-forfeits-game-disciplines-players

I don't think students getting into trouble is necessarily a D1 vs. D3 thing, it's more about how much exposure each division garners when the kids mess up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 08, 2013, 01:06:14 PM
thank you for the info and the correction.

david
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 09, 2013, 07:51:02 PM
Halftime scores:
Wooster 47, Dickinson 23 ... Thorpe hits 55 footer at buzzer
OWU 39, Cabrini 37 ... Spalding with 3 first-half fouls, picks up his 4th with 15:48 left and Bishops up 5.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 09, 2013, 08:11:47 PM
Cabrini goes on a 10-3 run following Spalding's departure, leads 55-53 at the under-12.

Now lead is 5 with just under 10 left.

6:49 left, Cavs still up 5. Wooster leaking oil but still cruising.

OWU in real trouble now, down 8 inside 5 mins. Spalding back in.

A couple of threes bring the Bishops back to with 4 at the under-4 at 3:05.

Spalding fouls out at 2:51. Cavs by 1 at 2:03. Nailbiter!

0:35 left, OWU ball, down 3. Wooster wins 80-54, will surely host next week.

Knowles steals from Winters at 0:09, hits the fts to put OWU in a 4 point hole.

Winters hits 2 fts at 0:05, fouls, McDaniels makes 1 of 2, but Winters misses the desperation 3 and Cabrini survives 84-81. Cabrini will play Wooster next week, almost certainly at Wooster. Congratulations to the Bishops on a great season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 09, 2013, 10:38:47 PM
Another NCAA DIII travesty at Wooster.  It has really gotten old watching the Scots' players get beaten up.  Screw Dickinson and their cheap shots, and screw the officials for doing absolutely nothing to control this event.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 09, 2013, 10:46:17 PM
Excellent game by the Scots. Probably the best game they've played this year. Too many turnovers in the second half, but these came when guys try to be too unselfish, for the most part. Dickinson simply couldn't handle Wooster's athleticism. And it's clear that Wooster coaching staff was able to do more with the week to prepare than Dickinson. The Scots were all over them from the start, and had no trouble with any defense they played. Wixted was completely ineffective, and was definitely affected by the pace of the game.

It was good to see the old Xavier Brown back. The shot looked much better and he was attacking the basket.

Now if we can just get Mays to realize he doesn't need to shy away from contact on offense and stop losing the ball to guards. I have no idea about Cabrini's interior defense this year, but two years ago when these two teams met in the same round, Wooster abused them inside. Wickliffe went 10-for-11 from the field for 23 points, while Claytor came off the bench to go 5-for-5 and 15 points. But can Wooster's big men even take advantage of a weakness like this? To get at what I'm talking about with Mays, he has gone three straight games without attempting a foul shot, and if you take away a one-and-one he shot near the end of the Wittenberg game, he has gone about 100 minutes (of his playing time) since he actually drew a foul while trying to score. This is ridiculous from a guy who is 6'8" and plays around the basket. Instead of attacking the basket and forcing the defense to attempt to block his shot (and almost always foul him) he shies away from contact, even right under the basket, causing him to consistently miss shots he should either be making, or at least getting to the foul line.

This hasn't mattered the last two games, but it will matter next week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 09, 2013, 11:19:23 PM
A couple of articles on Cabrini's Mr. Everything Aaron Walton-Moss.

http://d3hoops.com/playoffs/men/2012/from-open-gym-to-salem

http://www.d3hoops.com/columns/around-the-nation/2012-13/cabrini-gets-its-stud-back
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 09, 2013, 11:24:36 PM
A question - has Wooster won 24 or 25 games? I thought I heard mid season that the NCAA counted the Sheridan game. The relevant point that is if the Scots have played 30 official games so fr this season, then when Josh Claytor steps on the court aganst Cabrini he will break Matt Fegan's NCAA record of games played in a career (125).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 09, 2013, 11:26:57 PM
Great game by the Scots tonight as their defense was excellent holding Dickinson to only 36% from the floor.  As Seinfeld noted, Wooster completely shut down Dickinson's top scorer, Wixted, who was only 1 of 12 from the floor.

On the offensive end, Wooster was just quicker than Dickinson at almost every position and the Scots shot 53% from the floor.  Doug Thorpe with 19 points and Xavier Brown with 18 points sliced up the Dickinson defense with their quickness.  Kenny DeBoer was effective tonight with 11 points and Josh Claytor added 9 points.  I agree with Seinfeld that Jake Mays needs to be more aggressive on the offensive end if Wooster is going to keep advancing in the tournament.

How about Doug Thorpe's incredible 3 point shot from behind half court right before the half!  :o ;D  It made the halftime score 47-23 and the game was essentially over at that point.

Congrats to Ohio Wesleyan on a great season!  Cabrini looks like a tough opponent for Wooster next Saturday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on March 09, 2013, 11:44:20 PM
Wooster wins by 26 and we still have to hear the inevitable complaint that the refs suck?  ::)
Really?  How classy.  What a gracious winner......
Go Scots!   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 10, 2013, 12:50:11 AM
You breathe on a Wooster player and to some people it's should be a capital offense.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 10, 2013, 05:34:11 AM
Quote from: drt on March 09, 2013, 11:44:20 PM
Wooster wins by 26 and we still have to hear the inevitable complaint that the refs suck?  ::)
Really?  How classy.  What a gracious winner......
Go Scots!

Yeah?  Tough.  Were you at the game?  The ref's sucked, period.  Dickinson got away with murder both inside and out.  The ref's allowed it to happen, and that's just the way it was. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 10, 2013, 05:50:59 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 09, 2013, 10:46:17 PMNow if we can just get Mays to realize he doesn't need to shy away from contact on offense and stop losing the ball to guards. I have no idea about Cabrini's interior defense this year, but two years ago when these two teams met in the same round, Wooster abused them inside. Wickliffe went 10-for-11 from the field for 23 points, while Claytor came off the bench to go 5-for-5 and 15 points. But can Wooster's big men even take advantage of a weakness like this? To get at what I'm talking about with Mays, he has gone three straight games without attempting a foul shot, and if you take away a one-and-one he shot near the end of the Wittenberg game, he has gone about 100 minutes (of his playing time) since he actually drew a foul while trying to score. This is ridiculous from a guy who is 6'8" and plays around the basket. Instead of attacking the basket and forcing the defense to attempt to block his shot (and almost always foul him) he shies away from contact, even right under the basket, causing him to consistently miss shots he should either be making, or at least getting to the foul line.

This hasn't mattered the last two games, but it will matter next week.

I thought that last night was one of the best games that Mays has ever played.  Didn't get to the foul line?  You know why?  One of the officials has to have the balls to blow the whistle or it won't happen.  Mays was mauled underneath all night and those little punks just ignored it.

The officiating was a joke from the opening tipoff.  A fake toss gets both jumpers half in the air.  Then before they can even reset, it's tossed low, crooked, and right above the Dickinson player's head.  It should have been an obvious re-toss, but no, PLAY ON, Dickenson ball.  And it just went downhill from there.

This game was the same old story.  Wooster player's being held or pushed every time they went to the basket.  This is apparently totally legal, especially once a team is down 15-20 points.  At the other end, Dickenson's player's initiated the contact when driving and the fouls were called on Wooster.

Anybody doesn't like these posts?  Shove it.  This is the way it was, and too often the way it is.  DIII officials are absolutely lousy, they allow far, far, too much mayhem, and it always favors the team with the least skill that has no option except to turn the game into a brawl.

Congrats to the Wooster players for once again fighting through this.  It was one of the best first halves I've ever seen Wooster play.  Many, many players contributed with strong performances, and if this keeps up, Wooster will be tough to beat.     
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 10, 2013, 11:39:47 AM
More on next weekend's matchup between Wooster and Cabrini. :)  Two years ago in the Sweet 16, Wooster beat Cabrini by a 94-77 score on their way to knocking off #1 Whitworth and Wooster's eventual National Runnerup finish.

So, Cabrini may have a bit of revenge on their mind next Saturday.  Four Cabrini players, including two of their starters (Fran Rafferty, Jon Miller), were on the losing squad in 2011 and Cabrini's coach knows what to expect when they visit Timken.  Cabrini's star player from 2011, Corey Lemons, has graduated but they replaced him with another star guard in Aaron Walton-Moss who nearly had a triple double last night vs. Ohio Wesleyan.  Will Coach Moore defend Walton-Moss with Xavier Brown or Evan Pannell to start the game?

Cabrini was the National Runnerup last year so they are an experienced squad.  Both Wooster and Cabrini have very quick guards so this will be an interesting game next Saturday.  Wooster may have an edge with their big men but can they space the floor and exploit it without Cabrini double teaming and stealing the ball?

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 10, 2013, 11:51:23 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 09, 2013, 11:26:57 PM
Great game by the Scots tonight as their defense was excellent holding Dickinson to only 36% from the floor.  As Seinfeld noted, Wooster completely shut down Dickinson's top scorer, Wixted, who was only 1 of 12 from the floor.

On the offensive end, Wooster was just quicker than Dickinson at almost every position and the Scots shot 53% from the floor.  Doug Thorpe with 19 points and Xavier Brown with 18 points sliced up the Dickinson defense with their quickness.  Kenny DeBoer was effective tonight with 11 points and Josh Claytor added 9 points.  I agree with Seinfeld that Jake Mays needs to be more aggressive on the offensive end if Wooster is going to keep advancing in the tournament.

How about Doug Thorpe's incredible 3 point shot from behind half court right before the half!  :o ;D  It made the halftime score 47-23 and the game was essentially over at that point.

Congrats to Ohio Wesleyan on a great season!  Cabrini looks like a tough opponent for Wooster next Saturday.

GO SCOTS!

You aren't kidding wsf.  Thorpe mentioned something about how he and Brown are possibly the toughest guard tandem in the country in post game comments after last weekend's win over Behrend, and he completely backed that statement up last night.  This quote from Coach Seretti summed it up:
Quote from: Coach Seretti
"We're okay if just Thorpe or Brown's in the game, but you can't deny them both," he explained. "We don't have a guy that can stay in front of them 35 feet away from the basket. That's not a knock on our guys -- it's because they're really good players."

Too bad he couldn't get his wish to have just one of the two in the game at the same time...  8-)

Defense was the story last night.  WB questioned whether Dickinson was the real deal because of how poorly Marietta played defense in their game last week.  Well, I think we saw what happens when Dickinson goes up against a team that plays defense.  Really impressed with how the Scots defended Dickinson's best player (Wixted) holding him to just 4 points and only one fg in 12 attempts!   :o

Now it's on to Cabrini.  The last time the Cavs came to Wooster I think they may have been a bit overwhelmed by the moment as they reminded me a lot of the Dickinson team we played last night as far as not having a lot of tournament experience.  Well, that won't be the case this year as Cabrini is a year removed from playing for the NC in Salem and they've already won both tournament games on the road this year.  Also, Cabrini has only lost twice in 2013 having won 17 of their last 18 games including a current 13 game winning streak.  Wooster has won their first two tournament games by an average of 22 points, but I don't expect things to be so easy next week.

Lastly, I wasn't sure about this drawn out format for the tournament this season, but Coach Moore is taking advantage of it.   As if it wasn't clear what a great coach he is, give him a week to prepare for an opponent and he is lethal.  Will we see more of the same as he now sets his sights on Cabrini?   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 10, 2013, 01:42:48 PM
As expected, Wooster will be hosting this coming weekend for the rights to go to the quarterfinals in Salem. All the other hosts have been announced as well, here's the updated bracket:

http://static.psbin.com/f/7/5bfwfppwjzli3w/2013-mbb-bracket.pdf
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 11, 2013, 01:43:41 PM
This isn't really a response to Wooster Booster's comment on officiating. I think one of the plays he was referring to occurred when Dickinson's #3 threw the ball at DeBoer after DeBoer took a charge on him. The refs saw it, and talked with him, but didn't give out a technical.

But there were two absolutely horrendous calls near the end of the first half – one against each team – that were so bad it probably merits attention as to whether these officials (or at least one in particular) should work a playoff game anytime soon. In watching the replay of the game online, the charge call on DeBoer with about three minutes left in the first half was brutal. I think the whole crowd thought it was brutal at the time, and they were correct. In watching it again, the only person DeBoer made contact with as he took his shot was a guy who was turned sideways and moving. There was another player that was on the ground in the lane, but he fell on his own. He was covering Brown, who dished the ball to DeBoer from about the foul line. DeBoer even made the shot. The guy who called the foul couldn't have been more than three feet from the play.

Then shortly after that, the refs blew a call that helped lead to Thorpe's 50-foot three at the buzzer. Dickinson threw a length-of-the-court pass with two seconds left in the first half. It was knocked out of the air and out of bounds by Thorpe in front of Wooster's bench. I was on the other side of the floor and had no doubt that is what happened. Thorpe went so far as to be quoted in the paper the next day saying the same thing. Yet they gave the ball to Wooster (the ref who blew the charging call was the ref on the baseline behind where the ball went out of bounds and should have been in position to make the right call). Thorpe then hit his shot.

But now on to what matter now, which is Cabrini. First, I wonder when the last time (if ever) the last two Div. III runner-ups have met in the NCAA Tournament? Not quite as noteworthy as the last two national champions, but interesting nonetheless.

Again, this is coming completely from the dark, as I've not seen Cabrini play at all. But with Aaron Walton-Moss, it reminds me somewhat of the 2010 tournament game against Wis.-Whitewater and the 2011 game against Whitworth. In both those games, former Div. I players or guys who were recruited by Div. I schools (and respectable ones at that) led their teams into Wooster.

In 2010, it was Whitewater's Dupree Fletcher, who has kicked out of a couple Div. I programs (including Valparaiso). He went for 20 points, but it took 18 shots and he committed five turnovers. The man marking him was Brandon Johnson, and he did about as well as you could do to slow him down.

In 2011, it was Div. III National Player of the Year Michael Taylor (and Montana transfer). He went for 25 points, but it took 20 shots, and he committed seven turnovers. Marking him was Justin Warnes.

The question is, who marks Walton-Moss, and can they be the kind of stopper that Johnson and Warnes were? I'm guessing some combination of Pannell and Brown will mark him. I know Cabrini has other guys that can score, but based on what we saw against OWU, and considering his seemingly Div. I basketball talent, Walton-Moss is the key.

And to get a sense of how highly thought of Walton-Moss was in high school, check out the names of other guards he competed with at an AAU Super Showcase. His coach also called him the best player in New Jersey.

http://www.slamonline.com/online/college-hs/high-school/2009/07/the-name-game/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 11, 2013, 01:58:46 PM
Quote from: davepi2 on March 03, 2013, 12:40:43 PM
does anyone know the capacity of ohio wesleyan's gym? I was going to go yesterday but I decided not too since it was so late. Good thing from watching on the web it looked sold out. Standing room on the west side of the gym. Nice to see the turnout there. If I go next week  I better look in to buying tickets early. Naturally I am assuming OWU will host next week. We all know what assumption is the mother of though.

Hey dave, just wondering if you were able to make it to Delaware to see the OWU/Cabrini game and if so, if you could share some firsthand insight on what we can expect from the Cavs when they come to Timken on Saturday?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 11, 2013, 02:10:03 PM
seinfeld,

Is Walton-Moss a DI transfer as well?  Didn't Cabrini have a DI transfer the last time they came to Timken?

The BIG difference between the last two times the Scots have faced a talented offensive player is that they've had a defensive stopper to put on them in Johnson and Warnes.  This year, Pannell might be as close to one as the Scots have.  I do agree that I think you will see defense by committee on Walton-Moss.  Also, I don't think it's a big deal if W-M goes off.  The key will be to make sure that no one else from Cabrini goes off as well.  Fran Rafferty actually worries me more as he's second on their team in scoring but shooting over 50% from 3-point range and he's 6'4" so he could be a tough matchup for us as well.  He had 19 last Saturday vs. OWU...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 11, 2013, 02:17:45 PM
Agreed ScotsFan. They don't seem to be relient on one player like the other two schools I mentioned, although he seems to have the talent to be that. He techically never went Div. I, but it had to do with his grades, not his skills. Sounds like he was probably going to LaSalle if he was eligible.

He must be doing something right. He only played half a season as a freshman, but was still the D3hoops.com Freshman of the Year. And he was named his conference's player of the year this year despite not playing until the last game of December.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on March 11, 2013, 02:43:33 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 11, 2013, 02:17:45 PM
Agreed ScotsFan. They don't seem to be relient on one player like the other two schools I mentioned, although he seems to have the talent to be that. He techically never went Div. I, but it had to do with his grades, not his skills. Sounds like he was probably going to LaSalle if he was eligible.

He must be doing something right. He only played half a season as a freshman, but was still the D3hoops.com Freshman of the Year. And he was named his conference's player of the year this year despite not playing until the last game of December.

Call me naïve.  He had the skills but not the grades to go Div. 1.  Not the D3 I know. ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 11, 2013, 03:54:55 PM
This from the Princeton Review:

The average SAT score for an incoming Cabrini student is a combined Math and Verbal score of 935.

Unbelievable.  I just don't know what to say, except that other websites also indicate that this school must be a total joke.  Here's the link to the webpage:

http://www.princetonreview.com/schools/college/CollegeBasics.aspx?iid=1023826
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoostAr on March 11, 2013, 04:46:42 PM
Don't be too quick to judge:

"Within 10 months of graduation, 97 percent of Cabrini graduates are employed or in graduate school."

If they're doing that with students that have low SAT scores, they must be doing something right in their education process.



Cabrini coach comments from last match-up against wooster.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ST1V67MPTI
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: iwumichigander on March 11, 2013, 05:08:48 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on March 11, 2013, 02:43:33 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 11, 2013, 02:17:45 PM
Agreed ScotsFan. They don't seem to be relient on one player like the other two schools I mentioned, although he seems to have the talent to be that. He techically never went Div. I, but it had to do with his grades, not his skills. Sounds like he was probably going to LaSalle if he was eligible.

He must be doing something right. He only played half a season as a freshman, but was still the D3hoops.com Freshman of the Year. And he was named his conference's player of the year this year despite not playing until the last game of December.

Call me naïve.  He had the skills but not the grades to go Div. 1.  Not the D3 I know. ???
http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=639.3360 (http://www.d3boards.com/index.php?topic=639.3360)
Here is a story D3Hoops.com did on Walton-Moss last year.  Does he have D1 skills - IMHO seeing him only once in person - yes.  Can you defend him? Also, yes if you have the right on the ball one on one defender.

Defensively, Cabrini I saw last year very comparable to Wooster.  It should be a battle.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 11, 2013, 08:50:53 PM
Quote from: WoostAr on March 11, 2013, 04:46:42 PM
Cabrini coach comments from last match-up against wooster.  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ST1V67MPTI

Love hearing Coach Kahn's description of the atmosphere being unlike anything he's ever seen at the DIII level!  He mentioned the bag pipers and then he mentioned when he was trying to rally his team and then he has to go up against 3000 fans trying to rally the home team and its like 3000 against 1.  Let's hope for some more of that type of rallying from the home fans this weekend!   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 11, 2013, 11:18:09 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 11, 2013, 03:54:55 PM
This from the Princeton Review:

The average SAT score for an incoming Cabrini student is a combined Math and Verbal score of 935.

Unbelievable.  I just don't know what to say, except that other websites also indicate that this school must be a total joke.  Here's the link to the webpage:

http://www.princetonreview.com/schools/college/CollegeBasics.aspx?iid=1023826

Well not everyone can be rocket scientists in high school. If their mission is to take those students and provide them with an education and get them to grad schools or high paying jobs, then more power to them. We shouldn't be so elitist as to think only competitive liberal arts colleges can turn out top quality graduates.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 12, 2013, 12:00:36 AM
Smeds, if you really wanted to take a whiz in WooBoo's Cheerios, you would've added that Cabrini turns out more basketball referees than any other D3 school. :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on March 12, 2013, 01:23:45 AM
Quote from: smedindy on March 11, 2013, 11:18:09 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 11, 2013, 03:54:55 PM
This from the Princeton Review:

The average SAT score for an incoming Cabrini student is a combined Math and Verbal score of 935.

Unbelievable.  I just don't know what to say, except that other websites also indicate that this school must be a total joke.  Here's the link to the webpage:

http://www.princetonreview.com/schools/college/CollegeBasics.aspx?iid=1023826

Well not everyone can be rocket scientists in high school. If their mission is to take those students and provide them with an education and get them to grad schools or high paying jobs, then more power to them. We shouldn't be so elitist as to think only competitive liberal arts colleges can turn out top quality graduates.

I did not take his comment as an "elitist" one but rather I think he was making an observation about the ability of this DIII school to have a much larger pool of athletes to choose from compared to 99% of the others when the academic requirements to get in are lower than what exists at the D1 level.   I dont want to speak for him but that was my interpretation.


(modified by GS for formatting)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 12, 2013, 01:56:00 AM
Quote from: WAlum on March 12, 2013, 01:23:45 AM
Quote from: smedindy on March 11, 2013, 11:18:09 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 11, 2013, 03:54:55 PM
This from the Princeton Review:

The average SAT score for an incoming Cabrini student is a combined Math and Verbal score of 935.

Unbelievable.  I just don't know what to say, except that other websites also indicate that this school must be a total joke.  Here's the link to the webpage:

http://www.princetonreview.com/schools/college/CollegeBasics.aspx?iid=1023826

Well not everyone can be rocket scientists in high school. If their mission is to take those students and provide them with an education and get them to grad schools or high paying jobs, then more power to them. We shouldn't be so elitist as to think only competitive liberal arts colleges can turn out top quality graduates.

I did not take his comment as an "elitist" one but rather I think he was making an observation about the ability of this DIII school to have a much larger pool of athletes to choose from compared to 99% of the others when the academic requirements to get in are lower than what exists at the D1 level.   I dont want to speak for him but that was my interpretation.


So, 99% of d3 schools have higher admission requirements than Stanford (or Duke or Michigan or Virginia or ...)??!!

Both d1 and d3 have a tremendous range of schools and with different missions.  There is a role for academically-elite schools.  There is also an important role for schools who take more marginal students (academically) and give them a future well beyond what they otherwise would have had.

I know essentially nothing about Cabrini (for all I know, that '97% ... employed or in graduate school' may include those who are flipping burgers, though some have jumped to the conclusion that they are all now professionals or at least 'high-paying jobs'), but no reason to put them down.  And 3% unemployed is pretty damned impressive, even if it does include those saying 'would you like fries with that'!

(modified by GS for formatting)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on March 12, 2013, 08:27:27 AM
Ypsi - I was not giving my opinion.  I was explaining what I thought Wooster Booster in the original post, was intending to say.  I am sure he will explain once he gets on here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 12, 2013, 10:15:09 AM
You have to have schools that accept the mid-level students around. It IS elitist to bemoan that they're in D3, when they are as much of D3 as Bates or Wisconsin - River Falls.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 12, 2013, 02:32:39 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 12, 2013, 12:00:36 AM
Smeds, if you really wanted to take a whiz in WooBoo's Cheerios, you would've added that Cabrini turns out more basketball referees than any other D3 school. :D

What?  Cabrini has supplanted Wabash in the top spot?  But wait, surely this would lower their 97% employment rate... ;)

Funniest remark I've ever seen on here, Greg.  But that would be Honeynut Cheerios... :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 12, 2013, 02:49:59 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 12, 2013, 10:15:09 AM
You have to have schools that accept the mid-level students around. It IS elitist to bemoan that they're in D3, when they are as much of D3 as Bates or Wisconsin - River Falls.

My post never mentioned athletic divisions.  It was strictly a comment on the admissions requirements at Cabrini.  If it's true that their average incoming student has an SAT score (verbal and math) of 935, I find that amazing.  I mean, half of the student body is then below that number.  Why, Sarah Palin would have been a catch for them. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 12, 2013, 03:00:26 PM
It isn't like state schools in Division III have much higher acceptances based mainly on the fact they are state schools (though, St. Mary's (Md.) and others are honors schools so they are state, but have higher standards).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on March 12, 2013, 08:06:51 PM
Every college/university has a mission.  As long as they are fulfilling that mission, who are we to judge.  If you want to have a DIII for "high achievers" or "top SATers", then I thought someone already floated that ball some years ago when a few NCAC president snobs tried to gather together enough schools to be a "DIV" or whatever.  That proposal was rejected.  I don't know a thing about Cabini except that they are a school playing Division III basketball.  This, and I hope that NCAC College of Wooster beats them to confirm to those paying attention that young men from a conference made up of entirely Phi Beta Kappa institutions can play at a high level. 
     By the by, let's not get too uppity lest there be a full disclosure of the grades and scores of all athletes in our own conference. Cheers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 13, 2013, 09:45:55 AM
Congrats to Doug Thorpe and Xavier Brown for making D3hoops.com All Great Lakes Region 2nd Team.  Thorpe had quite the breakout season going from 1st off the bench to being Wooster's leading scorer and making All-Conference and All-Region!

Also congrats to Andy Winters from OWU (1st Team), Dimonde Hale from Denison (2nd Team), Ikenna Nwadibia from Kenyon (3rd Team) and Scott Masin from Wittenberg (3rd Team) for being chosen to the All-Region Team as well!

The NCAC had the most representatives on the All-Region team with 6!  (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fforum.mymorningjacket.com%2FSmileys%2Fyabb%2Fthumbsup.gif&hash=9b6a98b78f0432fb9e0155b0f356b4d6f3dcb99c)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 13, 2013, 09:51:21 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 13, 2013, 09:45:55 AM
Congrats to Doug Thorpe and Xavier Brown for making D3hoops.com All Great Lakes Region 2nd Team.  Thorpe had quite the breakout season going from 1st off the bench to being Wooster's leading scorer and making All-Conference and All-Region!

Also congrats to Andy Winters from OWU (1st Team), Dimonde Hale from Denison (2nd Team), Ikenna Nwadibia from Kenyon (3rd Team) and Scott Masin from Wittenberg (3rd Team) for being chosen to the All-Region Team as well!

The NCAC had the most representatives on the All-Region team with 6!  (https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fforum.mymorningjacket.com%2FSmileys%2Fyabb%2Fthumbsup.gif&hash=9b6a98b78f0432fb9e0155b0f356b4d6f3dcb99c)

Winters was also the (very well-deserved) Player of the Year for the region.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: OldRedBuckeye on March 13, 2013, 10:59:26 AM
Props to Dimonde Hale for the region honors. Tough to believe he and Longi and the rest of the Big Red were only good enough for 9 wins. But as I said before, Denison administration has to decide whether it wants to win or not and if so, whether the current coaching staff is going to help them do that. History clearly says no and that is difficult for this old Denisonian to accept.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 13, 2013, 05:47:43 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 12, 2013, 02:49:59 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 12, 2013, 10:15:09 AM
You have to have schools that accept the mid-level students around. It IS elitist to bemoan that they're in D3, when they are as much of D3 as Bates or Wisconsin - River Falls.

My post never mentioned athletic divisions.  It was strictly a comment on the admissions requirements at Cabrini.  If it's true that their average incoming student has an SAT score (verbal and math) of 935, I find that amazing. I mean, half of the student body is then below that number.  Why, Sarah Palin would have been a catch for them. :)

I find it ironic that these statements conflate the term "average" with "median."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 13, 2013, 06:49:55 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 13, 2013, 05:47:43 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 12, 2013, 02:49:59 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 12, 2013, 10:15:09 AM
You have to have schools that accept the mid-level students around. It IS elitist to bemoan that they're in D3, when they are as much of D3 as Bates or Wisconsin - River Falls.

My post never mentioned athletic divisions.  It was strictly a comment on the admissions requirements at Cabrini.  If it's true that their average incoming student has an SAT score (verbal and math) of 935, I find that amazing. I mean, half of the student body is then below that number.  Why, Sarah Palin would have been a catch for them. :)

I find it ironic that these statements conflate the term "average" with "median."

Poetic license; allowing Cabrini students to follow along. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 13, 2013, 07:19:51 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 13, 2013, 06:49:55 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 13, 2013, 05:47:43 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 12, 2013, 02:49:59 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 12, 2013, 10:15:09 AM
You have to have schools that accept the mid-level students around. It IS elitist to bemoan that they're in D3, when they are as much of D3 as Bates or Wisconsin - River Falls.

My post never mentioned athletic divisions.  It was strictly a comment on the admissions requirements at Cabrini.  If it's true that their average incoming student has an SAT score (verbal and math) of 935, I find that amazing. I mean, half of the student body is then below that number.  Why, Sarah Palin would have been a catch for them. :)

I find it ironic that these statements conflate the term "average" with "median."

Poetic license; allowing Cabrini students to follow along. :)

And, actually, SAT scores for Cabrini students would (I would guess) have a positive skew (400 is the minimum - I would assume there are few if any below 700, but surely there are at least a handful with 1400+); if so, a mean of 935 would indicate a median even lower than that.

But the more important point is that there IS an important role for schools whose mission is to accept less academically talented students and give them a good education - which would appear to be the case if it is true that 97% of recent graduates are in grad school or employed.  The world needs Cabrinis as well as MITs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 13, 2013, 09:41:51 PM
How about this article/column or whatever you call it from a local writer from Cabrini's part of Pa. He was so fired up he has Wooster losing to four times in the last 10 games instead of three.

http://www.delcotimes.com/articles/2013/03/10/sports/doc513d580de0450249935435.txt
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 13, 2013, 09:44:59 PM
Yeah, sounds like a terrible place ::)

Mission

    Education of the Heart
    Cabrini College is a Catholic institution of higher education dedicated to academic excellence, leadership development, and a commitment to social justice. The College welcomes learners of all faiths, cultures, and backgrounds and prepares them to become engaged citizens of the world.

http://www.cabrini.edu/About/Mission/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 14, 2013, 01:53:57 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 13, 2013, 06:49:55 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 13, 2013, 05:47:43 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 12, 2013, 02:49:59 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 12, 2013, 10:15:09 AM
You have to have schools that accept the mid-level students around. It IS elitist to bemoan that they're in D3, when they are as much of D3 as Bates or Wisconsin - River Falls.

My post never mentioned athletic divisions.  It was strictly a comment on the admissions requirements at Cabrini.  If it's true that their average incoming student has an SAT score (verbal and math) of 935, I find that amazing. I mean, half of the student body is then below that number.  Why, Sarah Palin would have been a catch for them. :)

I find it ironic that these statements conflate the term "average" with "median."

Poetic license; allowing Cabrini students to follow along. :)

Unnecessary. Go to D3academics.com with that crap.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 14, 2013, 12:31:37 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on March 13, 2013, 09:41:51 PM
How about this article/column or whatever you call it from a local writer from Cabrini's part of Pa. He was so fired up he has Wooster losing to four times in the last 10 games instead of three.

http://www.delcotimes.com/articles/2013/03/10/sports/doc513d580de0450249935435.txt

Thanks for the laugh seinfeld!   :D

Guess this guy, in his lame attempt to prove Cabrini worthy of hosting, also failed to mention that Wooster also SWEPT the regular season series from OWU.  Oh, and that's great and all that Cabrini is on such an impressive streak, but the reality is, who is that streak against?  Oh, that's right.  It's ALL against a weak CSAC.  Wonder what Wooster's record would have been in the CSAC or whether we'd see Cabrini reel off 13 straight in the NCAC?    ::)

Oh and one more thing?  That writer might want to look up regional rankings while he's at it when questioning why Wooster is hosting over Cabrini this weekend or why Cabrini  is making their 3rd straight road trip.  Wooster was #1 in the GL's final public rankings and we've come to find out was #1 in the secret rankings as well.  Where was Cabrini ranked in the final public rankings of the Mid-Atlantic Region?  What?  They weren't even ranked?   :o  That might help answer some of his questions!   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 15, 2013, 08:24:33 AM
The Hoopsville guys discuss the Wooster-Cabrini game at about the 1:05 mark in Thursday's show.

http://www.ustream.tv/recorded/29978087
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dark Knight on March 16, 2013, 11:34:24 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 13, 2013, 05:47:43 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 12, 2013, 02:49:59 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 12, 2013, 10:15:09 AM
You have to have schools that accept the mid-level students around. It IS elitist to bemoan that they're in D3, when they are as much of D3 as Bates or Wisconsin - River Falls.

My post never mentioned athletic divisions.  It was strictly a comment on the admissions requirements at Cabrini.  If it's true that their average incoming student has an SAT score (verbal and math) of 935, I find that amazing. I mean, half of the student body is then below that number.  Why, Sarah Palin would have been a catch for them. :)

I find it ironic that these statements conflate the term "average" with "median."

Actually, wooboo's usage is correct here. Average can mean median, according to Webster. It will only sometimes mean mean.

Quote
Definition of AVERAGE

1
a : a single value (as a mean, mode, or median) that summarizes or represents the general significance of a set of unequal values
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woo84 on March 16, 2013, 01:50:10 PM
This Cabrini coach rubs me the wrong way, telling the media that it "will be sweet revenge" in reference to playing Wooster. If there is one game that I wish we could win-besides all of them- this is the one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 16, 2013, 04:51:54 PM
Quote from: woo84 on March 16, 2013, 01:50:10 PM
This Cabrini coach rubs me the wrong way, telling the media that it "will be sweet revenge" in reference to playing Wooster. If there is one game that I wish we could win-besides all of them- this is the one.

I don't really see anything wrong with the Cabrini coach.  He had nothing but good things to say about Wooster after they got handled the last time they came to Wooster.  He's a good young coach as evidenced by his impressive record he's already compiled at Cabrini including this, the Cavs 3rd straight appearance in the Sweet 16 and coming off of a national runner-up finish last year. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 16, 2013, 06:55:37 PM
Once you get to the Stretch Internet page for the Wooster video, it claims there are no current events.  I really hope they get this fixed before the game starts.

Now they have it, two minutes before game time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: mailsy on March 16, 2013, 07:20:44 PM
Is anybody having issues with the sound?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 16, 2013, 07:38:39 PM
I'm having issues with the whole thing.  MCTV is completely bush league.  Buffering, then stopping completely.  Then jumping ahead a few minutes in the broadcast, missing all of Wooster's comeback from down nine to down one.

I pay these clowns $160 a month.  That's going to end on Monday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 16, 2013, 08:42:36 PM
Cabrini 70, Wooster 63.

Congrats to Cabrini - they certainly earned the trip to Salem with three straight tough road wins in the tournament.

Wish I could've seen it; Wooster's feed didn't work at all in the second half for me, so I just gave up on that. Luckily, a great WQKT radio broadcast as normal.

Good luck to Cabrini in the rest of the tournament!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoostAr on March 16, 2013, 08:47:37 PM
Cabrini's talent level is insane...Wooster's jump shot contests didn't bother their shooters.  Pull up jump shots...moving either direction...hard to tell on screen who was who, but the whole team seemed like they shot lights out.

Wooster didn't help itself ... wide open shots that didn't go in...28.6% from 3...that won't win too many games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 16, 2013, 10:06:25 PM
Hard-fought physical contest, played in front of an unusually vocal black-and-gold crowd. Cabrini stayed composed when they fell behind early, and Aaron Walton-Moss is a great player, possibly an All American candidate. However, I wasn't impressed when he appeared to skip out on the post-game handshakes. 

This was another fine season for Wooster, and the Scots graduate only the two big men, Claytor and Mays. If someone steps up (perhaps Josh Kipfer or an incoming freshman) in the post, Wooster should be even better next season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: drt on March 16, 2013, 10:43:59 PM
Very sorry to see the Scots go down and the NCAC out of the hunt.
I bet the refs sabotaged the feed........
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 16, 2013, 11:11:20 PM
Officiating wasn't great, but didn't really have an impact on the outcome. Maybe others see this differently, but I've never seen a player talk to the officials as much as Walton-Moss. Without exaggeration, he probably had at least 10 conversations with the referees, including during game action. He even walked across the court before the start of the second half to talk with the refs. One time the ref held up the start of play as Walton-Moss talked with the ref instead of taking the ball for an inbounds play. To me, I don't care if Walton-Moss was telling the refs how great they looked for their age. At a certain point, at least to me, the refs need to tell the player in question to either be quiet, or get a technical. Otherwise, you get what you had tonight -- a player who appeared to be "special," and by special I mean he seemed to be in charge of what was happening, and I'm not talking about play on the floor. It's obvious that not every player could be allowed to do this, as the game would be chaos. So why special treatment for one player?

As for the game itself, broadly speaking, Cabrini worked hard to take Wooster out of its comfort zone, while frankly, the Scots didn't really try that hard to do the same. By that, I mean they willingly let Walton-Moss isolate his defender (usually DeBoer) and just break him down off the dribble. Wooster also let Walton-Moss set up shot at the top of the circle and just go to work. No effort to deny him the ball. No effort to ever double him to make him get rid of it. I realize there were other guys on the floor that can beat you, but at some point, don't you want to make some effort to take away the other team's strength and see if other guys can beat you? That's what Cabrini did. After a slow start defensively, Cabrini figured out that they needed to pinch Wooster's guards, especially Thorpe. They came way out on him, forcing him to have to give up the ball. The result was other guys had to shoot the ball, and that produced 8-for-35 shooting from everyone other than Thorpe and Brown.

During the crucial part of the game, which was after Wooster took an early 5-point lead in the second half, the vast majority of Wooster's shots came from guys outside of Thorpe and Brown -- in fact, 11 of the next 15 shots from the field came from other players -- until there was less than a minute left. Brown made the first two shots of the second half that Wooster took, then only shot the ball three more times the rest of the game.

Of course, other factors that you simply can't overcome is shooting only 6-for-11 from the foul line, most of which came from Claytor. Then you have Mays more or less going awol, not collecting a single rebound in 12 minutes and absolutely fumbling an easy pass that would have led to a layup that helped end Wooster's early second-half run. Then you had your wing players, who if you want to win at an elite level, need to make shots, particularly from three-point range. Pannell seemed afraid to shoot the ball, and then when he did finally take a three-pointer, he shot an air ball. And LaLonde, who made his mark in high school as a shooter, went 0-for-5 and finished the year shooting 32% from the field and 24% from three-point range.

In terms of physical talent, Wooster had a ton this year. But a failure for the two senior post players to elevate their game, and inconsistent outside shooting, the Scots went about as far as their regular-season play merited. There is a lot of talent coming back, and they should be in the mix again. It's a matter of whether they can develop a modest inside threat, and someone can step up from the wing position. Pannell, Wingard and LaLonde are elite physical talents, but one of them, or a freshman, need to pose some sort of consistent threat of the outside for them to be a top-10 team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 16, 2013, 11:18:20 PM
Larry Martin, Mike Brya, Kendal Smith  -- MIAA guys, as were 2 of the 3 last weekend.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 16, 2013, 11:20:02 PM
First things first.  The video streaming provided by The College of Wooster and MCTV is pathetic.  Even were it ten years ago, it would be a joke.  Tonight I maybe saw 25 of the 40 minutes of action.  The rest was buffering or blank dark screen.  Then the game would start up and I'd have missed several minutes of play.  Even during the stretches when it was working correctly, the image was very poor.  And, tonight wasn't unusual, it's pretty much the norm, both before and after they went to Stretch Internet.  That doesn't seem to have made a lick of difference. 

I can't think of another school that streams that isn't much, much better at this now.  And almost all of the small schools stream.  I've been paying these guys a lot of money for a lot of years, and I don't feel that I'm getting much value in return.  On Monday I begin seriously looking at new options.

On to the game.  Most of the Scots gave it their all.  There were one or two exceptions.  Obviously Cabrini was fast and physical.  I think Wooster did a very good job of keeping them in a half-court offense.  Unfortunately, they had a good night making mid-range jumpers and with their quickness, those are awfully hard to defend.

I agree that Wooster will have a very good nucleus coming back in the fall.  They'll probably be better at the guard positions than they've ever been.  Thorpe and XB are terrific on both ends of the court.  Jalen Goodwin makes a very nice third guard, and there are others.

The three position is solid with Pannell.  His defense is very good, he can get down the floor, makes few mistakes, and occasionally he'll hit a three or find a lane to the hoop.  A very nice role player.

DeBoer has been a terrific surprise this season; so much development so quickly was unexpected.  He's kind of become a Tom Port-like player, who can shift between the 3 & 4 spots, while giving you the option of having a "semi-big" bring the ball up court, something the Scots haven't had since Marty Bidwell and Port before him.  DeBoer can shoot it, get it to the hoop, set picks, rebound, and play D.  I didn't see all of these skills coming last season, but they're here now, after just two seasons.

That's four starters for next season.

There are other guys that can contribute next season if they some things happen.  Alex LaLonde needs two things: strength and a new-found shot.  Three pizzas a day, with pepperoni and sausage, combined with many hours in the weight room might just do it.  Ten pounds of muscle would help.  Twenty would be better.  As for the shot, it's not like he never had one; he did.  Maybe it's still sitting in a dorm room in Colorado; I don't know.  But he needs to get it back.

DeVaughn Wingard, in the last several games, has shown that he can do more than put up quick ill-advised threes.  He's calmed down on the floor, done some rebounding, and worked within the offense.  There's room for him out there as a two or three if he continues to develop.

The big guys are gone, and the cupboard may be bare next season.  But there were many times these last few weeks that it already seemed that way.  Hopefully Wooster can somehow find a post player that can compliment the level of talent that the rest of the team has.     

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 17, 2013, 09:23:11 AM
Interesting comments from Cabrini's head coach regarding their star guard...
http://www.the-daily-record.com/local%20sports/2013/03/17/cabrini-gets-best-of-great-guard-matchup.modal (http://www.the-daily-record.com/local%20sports/2013/03/17/cabrini-gets-best-of-great-guard-matchup.modal)

I did a bit of reading on Walton-Moss's background, and here's what I found:
- He was a high school star in Camden, NJ, and received interest from some Philly-area mid-major Division I programs
- Academic and personal issues kept him from being able to play at the D-I level
- His daughter was born in summer 2010
- He was discovered at an open gym session held by Cabrini, and joined the team in January 2012
- Making an immediate impact on Cabrini's squad, he was the D3 national freshman of the year last spring, at the age of 21
- After being academically ineligible at the start of this season, he rejoined the team in January, and was named first-team all-region

Also notable is that Cabrini's other guard who put up a pile of points last night spent this fall at a local community college.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 17, 2013, 10:03:23 AM
I'm mum on the officiating since I missed 3/8 of the game completely and only saw the rest on 1990's-level video.  But there was one call that was totally ridiculous, when Walton-Moss bowled over DeBoer who was called for a block.

What I'd really like to know is what happened to DeBoer earlier, at the other end, when he was suddenly in real pain and half ran off the court behind the bleachers.  Couldn't have been his knee, because he wouldn't have been moving at that speed.  Did anybody at the game see the play?  He was around the baseline in a crowd; maybe a collision or took a hard shot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: mailsy on March 17, 2013, 10:15:03 AM
Wooster Booster from what I think I saw on the video is maybe he got hit in the "family jewels" area. But not sure considering the game kept buffering.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 17, 2013, 10:29:47 AM
Quote from: mailsy on March 17, 2013, 10:15:03 AM
Wooster Booster from what I think I saw on the video is maybe he got hit in the "family jewels" area. But not sure considering the game kept buffering.

That was my first thought, but most people can barely stand-up when that happens, let alone jog.  But it did seem like that kind of thing; he was gone for some time, but then came back seemingly unhurt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on March 17, 2013, 04:34:56 PM
Congratulations to Wooster on another fine season and solid representation in the tournament.  I am impressed at the way the Fighting Scots reload every year behind a hall-of-fame coach.
     Years ago I did some officiating, and little bothered me more that a player who wanted to carry on a conversation or talk about this and that, thinking that the he might gain some advantage (or just being extroverted).  I sometimes told that player to let his coach speak for his team.  I did not mind an occasional question, comment, or remark in the heat of competition, but it was easy to tell when a player was looking for more than a friendly hello.  I may have been blind, but I wasn't stupid.  On the observation about the Cabrini player talking up the ref at every opportunity:  I'm guessing based on the description, but I've seen and been around players who do those kinds of things to remind everyone how good and special they are:  "See me, I can  . . ."  If this was the case, that's too bad, particularly in a situation where a young man has the chance to change his life, support his child, etc.
     On a not unrelated topic,  I attend quite a few college games and about 20 high school games a year in Indiana, where, well, you know--it's Indiana.  And in recent years both college and high school coaches have driven me nuts.  The gesticulating, cajoling, pacing, yelling, and (in my view) overcoaching (particularly in h.s.) has filtered down from the NBA, where the coach is part of the entertainment.  For all the skill and dedication of athletes in college and high school,  coaches contesting almost every call, barking at the refs about every foul, slowing the pace and scripting every pass and shot does the game and the players no service. I've seen too many games in the 30s (h.s) and 40s (h.s. and college) where a cloying coach has taken the fun and a lot of the competitiveness away in a effort, to maintain his idea of control.
     I suppose that for the coach, and increasingly for many of the players in his "system," this is offset by the big number in the left-hand column.  But it's hard to watch.
     Lastly, on Cabrini:  it does appear that this year's team is built on the foundation of several excellent players with unusual resumes.  On the one hand, good for those young men being in college; on the other, I understand why the success of such a team  troubles supporters of teams who lose to them.  In the wake of the Cabrini win, good for the Wooster fans who got past those players as an excuse for losing to a team whose players I'm sure look at themselves as worthy college students.   
             
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 21, 2013, 04:56:34 PM
Proof regarding what I've been saying for over a decade, that Wooster gets screwed at home because A) they aren't a hack and shove team, and B) they're usually in the lead at home.

http://newsinfo.iu.edu/news/page/normal/12590.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on March 21, 2013, 10:41:05 PM
I don't even know why I'm jumping  in here.  Wooster Booster, you see many (if not all) of the Wooster home games, I'm sure.  You are a "Wooster Booster."  I see Wooster once a year when they come to Wabash (and a few years once at Wooster)..  I don't really have a dog in this hunt.
     The Wooster statistics for this year show that Wooster averaged 17.3 fouls per game; their opponents averaged 17.5.  How's that for the refs making the number of fouls close?  You can say that becasue Wooster was usually in the lead and the opponents having to be aggressive, particularly late in some games, that Wooster was not getting enough calls.  Or that the refs consistently allowed opponents to manhandle Wooster players (the Wooster Booster theory, I think).  This based on the assumption that the losing team has to foul if the game is close in order to play the odd or that the only way to stay close v. Wooster's superior talent is to clutch and grab.  But Wooster didn't play a lot of close games, either at home or on the road.  Where does that leave us?  Are they even that much better than the teams they play? 
     When Wooster was at home, opponents were called for more fouls than they in 10 regular-season games.  But only once did that number really become skewed:  Kenyon 26 fouls; Wooster 13 fouls.  You could say that opponents were not called for ENOUGH fouls, that they fouled and the refs let them go.  I don't know.  As an observer, Wooster Booster, you
  think so.      Interestingly, in playoff games the fouls were Penn St 13, Wooster 18; Dickinson 15, Wooster 16; Cabrini 17, Wooster 16.  kDid the officials let the other team foul because they were behind and on the road and, they actually would have had fewer fouls if this did  not occur?  Pretty far fetched 
     On the road, opponents were called for more fouls in 5 games.  Two games both teams had an equal number.  At Kenyon, the Lords were called for 18 fouls, the Fighting Scots for 25.  At Transy, it was 15 to 26.   (I'm leaving out Wyoming and Sheridan.)  For the year, only Claytor averaged more than two fouls per game, at 2.6.   
     Here are the foul counts for Wooster home games with the visitors number first:  23/16, 21/18, 20/20, 18/21, 21/19, 21/16, 6/4 (Allegheny, wow), 26/13, 19/14, 13/13, 14/10, 16/21, 18/17, 18/17, 13/19.  And the playofs:  13/18, 15/16, 17/16. 
     On the road (home team 1st):  22/21, 16/16, 26/20, 12/15, 18/25, 15/26, 17/15, 13/11, 27/27 (OWU), 17/21, 12/16, 18/16 (DPU, a loss). Sorry if I missed a few, but the point is that in most games, home and away, the calls were remarkably even.
     I don't know what all this means.  Basketball fans have thought forever that home teams get calls because of the fans, etc. and that "their" team was getting hosed.  I'm not surprised in the Wooster numbers to see how closely are the foul counts in most games, even when Wooster was winning by a bunch. 
I remember back in the day watching the Hoyas and Razorbacks (40 minutes of hell) hack and grab on the theory that the refs won't call them all or even very many of them. (As a thought-provoking look at the topic of refs, look up the chapter entitled "So, What Is Driving the Home Field Advantage" in SCORECASTING:  THE HIDDEN INFLUENCES BEHIND HOW SPOTS ARE PLAYED AND GAMES ARE WON BY Moskowitz and Wertheim, where they try to measure "ref bias.")
        From my side, I've thought that in Wooster games in Chadwick Court v. the Little Giants the refs didn't make enough calls on Wooster.  It's never seemed to me that Wabash was more physical v. Wooster than v. othr teams, and we've occasionally lamented the Little Giants not being more physical. Some fans even believe Wabash doesn't get enough calls because so many of the officials travel from Ohio.  Hogwash (I think).   Some Wabash fans thought, and think even now, that the Fighting Scots get special treatment, unconsciously (benefit of doubt) because of their consistent excellence.  Maybe so.  maybe not.  Probably not. I still think the pitch my kid threw in a championship game was clearly a strike, but the umpire said otherwise, walking in the winning run in the state semi-finals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 22, 2013, 11:49:31 AM
Quote from: sigma one on March 21, 2013, 10:41:05 PM
I don't even know why I'm jumping  in here.  Wooster Booster, you see many (if not all) of the Wooster home games, I'm sure.  You are a "Wooster Booster."  I see Wooster once a year when they come to Wabash (and a few years once at Wooster)..  I don't really have a dog in this hunt.
     The Wooster statistics for this year show that Wooster averaged 17.3 fouls per game; their opponents averaged 17.5.  How's that for the refs making the number of fouls close?  You can say that becasue Wooster was usually in the lead and the opponents having to be aggressive, particularly late in some games, that Wooster was not getting enough calls.  Or that the refs consistently allowed opponents to manhandle Wooster players (the Wooster Booster theory, I think).  This based on the assumption that the losing team has to foul if the game is close in order to play the odd or that the only way to stay close v. Wooster's superior talent is to clutch and grab.  But Wooster didn't play a lot of close games, either at home or on the road.  Where does that leave us?  Are they even that much better than the teams they play? 
     When Wooster was at home, opponents were called for more fouls than they in 10 regular-season games.  But only once did that number really become skewed:  Kenyon 26 fouls; Wooster 13 fouls.  You could say that opponents were not called for ENOUGH fouls, that they fouled and the refs let them go.  I don't know.  As an observer, Wooster Booster, you
  think so.      Interestingly, in playoff games the fouls were Penn St 13, Wooster 18; Dickinson 15, Wooster 16; Cabrini 17, Wooster 16.  kDid the officials let the other team foul because they were behind and on the road and, they actually would have had fewer fouls if this did  not occur?  Pretty far fetched 
     On the road, opponents were called for more fouls in 5 games.  Two games both teams had an equal number.  At Kenyon, the Lords were called for 18 fouls, the Fighting Scots for 25.  At Transy, it was 15 to 26.   (I'm leaving out Wyoming and Sheridan.)  For the year, only Claytor averaged more than two fouls per game, at 2.6.   
     Here are the foul counts for Wooster home games with the visitors number first:  23/16, 21/18, 20/20, 18/21, 21/19, 21/16, 6/4 (Allegheny, wow), 26/13, 19/14, 13/13, 14/10, 16/21, 18/17, 18/17, 13/19.  And the playofs:  13/18, 15/16, 17/16. 
     On the road (home team 1st):  22/21, 16/16, 26/20, 12/15, 18/25, 15/26, 17/15, 13/11, 27/27 (OWU), 17/21, 12/16, 18/16 (DPU, a loss). Sorry if I missed a few, but the point is that in most games, home and away, the calls were remarkably even.
     I don't know what all this means.  Basketball fans have thought forever that home teams get calls because of the fans, etc. and that "their" team was getting hosed.  I'm not surprised in the Wooster numbers to see how closely are the foul counts in most games, even when Wooster was winning by a bunch. 
I remember back in the day watching the Hoyas and Razorbacks (40 minutes of hell) hack and grab on the theory that the refs won't call them all or even very many of them. (As a thought-provoking look at the topic of refs, look up the chapter entitled "So, What Is Driving the Home Field Advantage" in SCORECASTING:  THE HIDDEN INFLUENCES BEHIND HOW SPOTS ARE PLAYED AND GAMES ARE WON BY Moskowitz and Wertheim, where they try to measure "ref bias.")
        From my side, I've thought that in Wooster games in Chadwick Court v. the Little Giants the refs didn't make enough calls on Wooster.  It's never seemed to me that Wabash was more physical v. Wooster than v. othr teams, and we've occasionally lamented the Little Giants not being more physical. Some fans even believe Wabash doesn't get enough calls because so many of the officials travel from Ohio.  Hogwash (I think).   Some Wabash fans thought, and think even now, that the Fighting Scots get special treatment, unconsciously (benefit of doubt) because of their consistent excellence.  Maybe so.  maybe not.  Probably not. I still think the pitch my kid threw in a championship game was clearly a strike, but the umpire said otherwise, walking in the winning run in the state semi-finals.

Sigma, even after reading the article, you're still standing by the old party line that if the number of fouls called on the two teams was close that the game must have been called fairly.  One of the major conclusions of the article was that this is not so.  And why should it be?  Is it not possible that some teams commit more fouls than others?  I'm not talking about fouls called, but actually committed on the court.

Two things that I've been saying for many years:

1. There are teams out there that are overly physical.  Their style of play is to push, and in most cases to exceed, the parameters of the rules.  They overload the officials with fouls that should be called.  The officials are left with choices.  Call all the fouls as they see them, or don't.  Option one is only very rarely taken, because the refs are not wont to slow the game down to a crawl.  So they opt for option two, allowing this overly-physical team that is consistently breaking the rules to dictate how the game is played.  The other team is then victimized, in one of two ways.  They can also play physical, leveling the playing field, but this style of play is usually detrimental to them because it's often they who have the more skilled players who are being hampered by the uncalled holding and shoving.  Or, two, they can continue to play a normal, not-overly-physical game, but in that case, according to the study in the article, they're going to get called for ticky-tack fouls anyway, as the refs try to "even things out".  It's a no-win situation.

2.  When one team acquires a decent-sized lead, maybe 12-15 points or more, the officials seem to lean towards aiding the losing team with their calls.  I don't think this is done on purpose; I think it's a natural reflex.  But it can have a dramatic effect.  The team that is down, seeing that they're not getting called for fouls as much as they were, will begin to up their aggressiveness, putting the game back into situation 1 above.  The game is kept closer than it should be, and once in a while the team that's down, due to this "score bias" in the officiating, will creep back into the game.  Plus, when you get a team playing ultra-physical because they're getting away with it, injuries can and do occur. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on March 22, 2013, 08:17:57 PM
Woster Booster:  not at all.  I don't mean to give the impression that if the number of fouls is about equal, the the refs must think that they are calling games fairly.  I hope I understand your point:  putting it in the context of Wooster, I believe you are saying that opponents commit far more fouls in an attempt to stop the Fighting Scots than the officials are willing to call.  And for unknown reasons, human nature--whatever--they feel that they should keep the number of fouls about equal.  As a result, Wooster is penalized for its excellence and style of play v. teams of lesser ability (or sometimes of equal ability) that like to bang and hope that by being physical they can compete. 
     I agree that officials call about the same number of fouls on both teams in most games.  Just see the Wooster numbers this year.  Where you and I respectfullly disagree, I think, is that I am not convinced that officials discriminate against Wooster, that there is a bias (likely, probably, almost certainly) that leads to a lot of fouls not being called, thus penalizing the Fighting Scots.  I actually think this might happen to a lot of good teams, not just to Wooster (and this is unfortunate if it is so)--see the end of my discussion below.
    I know you have been arguing for a long time that Wooster just is, what, picked on, unfortunate, victimized--it's hard for me to find the correct word.  Your observations are the observations of a rabid fan:  Jeez, he's getting mugged; how could the ref let that happen---not "miss that;" they are two different things. Many fans, really strong ones, think the way you do. I watch Wabash games, most of them at Wabash, and almost always see the opposing team commit more fouls that are not called than Wabash commits that are not called.  Or so I am certain.  I am biased in favor of Wabash, although I don't want to easily admit that bias.  I would rather think I am objective, and everyone else can't see what I see.
     I  think that officials do what the article says.  The statistics are there.  So, they even out the calls most of the time. This hurts the stronger team and rewards the weaker.  That's the way it is, and Wooster likely suffers from being the stronger team most of the time. I'm willing to accept that just might be the cost of being so good, perhaps a mark of respect even though better teams "suffer."  If what you believe is true, Wooster, being the better team most of the time, adapts to the situation.  That's what good teams do.  Is it right?  Is it fair?  Well, . . .It just is.
      Now for the part that's interesting to me as a matter of how games are officiated.  On another day, I might want to argue that the better team is the one that often gets the breaks because (unbiased but human) officials know they are good and think they can't possibly be commiting fouls because they are so skilled.  So, the fans of weaker team point out that player X seldom gets called for a foul even though he is undressing an opponent, or never shoves to get a rebound, or (in a non-foul situation) never travels.  Maybe, then, that's the reward for being good--getting fewer foul calls, more consideration.  At the same time, the opponents who barely breath on the good guys get called--let's say it's the Michael Jordan syndrome.  "How can you let him get away with that?"  'My guy didn't lay a finger on him."  "How can you not see the obvious when I can?" 
     Anyway, interesting debate. I refer you againto the chapter in SCORECASTING for a more sophisticated of what those authors try to explain, with some conviction, as the reasons for officials' bias.  By the way, they think there is officials', umpires', judges', bias in all sports hooked to a number of factors. 
     
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 22, 2013, 09:54:58 PM
Sigma One, I think that we're actually pretty much on the same page.  Because I'm a Wooster fan, they are more often than not my example.  But I don't for a minute think that they're the only not-too-physical-but-very-skilled team that often gets the short end against the mugging teams.  There are quite a few Wooster-like teams out there that certainly suffer the same fate.

I just don't like the overly-physical play that some teams use as their motus-operandi.  John Carroll is a classic example.  They put the officials into a situation where they can't win.  It's either call all the fouls against John Carroll and have it appear to the casual fan that they're biased against them, or allow them to get away with it and have the game turn into a brawl.  Too many officials, in my opinion, choose the latter.  I think if they'd just stand up to these teams, for a matter of weeks, that they'd be forced to adjust their style of play.

This isn't just a DIII men's thing.  I watch a lot of DI women's basketball and have heard, time and again, the announcers and coaches rail against the overly physical play.  It's a detriment to the game when the skilled ballhandler or shooter can't exhibit his or her skills or help their team because they're constantly being held, hacked, or shoved.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on March 23, 2013, 03:36:59 PM
Wooster Booster:  we agree on the overly-physical play.  The officials have supervisors.  They are examined, graded on their performance.  Coaches have the chance to express opinions to the supervisors.  It must be that those supervisors have decided that the officials are doing at least a passable job; otherwise, they would not continue to work games in that league. 
     One could speculate that there are so few officials that leagues and supervisors are in a bind.  I don't know if this is so.  If it is true that "officially" supervisors and conferences ignore overly-physical play, then by definition it is not by today's standards overly-physical whatever you and I think.  You can tell I go back quite a ways.  The way I learned the game, played the game, understood (understand) the game is outdated I suppose.  I still have difficulty reconciling myself to the way players dribble (that's got to be palming), arrange their feet (that's got to be travelling), and are overcoached to the point that much of the creativity of the game I knew is lessened.   
    Either as a coaching strategy or as a flashpoint response to another team, physical play has been around forever. Bullies exist.  More physical teams sometimes win with their style of play. More skilled teams sometimes suffer while still winning.
     I love the game and its variety:  matchups make strange bedfellows. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 23, 2013, 11:34:22 PM
There have been complaints about physical play since the game began. It's nothing new. The truth is that basketball has always had its physical teams and its finesse teams. Heck, they used to have fisticuffs in games without repercussions except fouls.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on April 16, 2013, 01:57:31 PM
Michigan's Law school put together a nice piece about OWU's Branch Rickey, worth your time.  Video starts about 1:15 in.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zSwM-rqv11s&feature=player_embedded#
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAlum on April 29, 2013, 01:59:46 PM
Fannelly is going to Wooster.

http://www.ohio.com/news/green-s-dan-fanelly-set-to-play-basketball-for-college-of-wooster-1.393625
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on June 21, 2013, 04:09:33 PM
Ohio Wesleyan will be taking part in the 2nd Annual Hoopsville National Invitational Classic: http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2013/06/hoopsville-classic-features-three-elite-eight-teams (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2013/06/hoopsville-classic-features-three-elite-eight-teams)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on July 01, 2013, 11:56:00 PM
Wooster's 2013-2014 schedule can be found here: http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2013-14/schedule

There are only 7 non-conference games listed currently so it will be interesting to see if any get added before the schedule gets formally posted up on the website.

Al Van Wie Rotary Classic features Baldwin Wallace as the opening game and then either Spalding or Wheaton (IL) on the second night.  I would love to see the Scots play Wheaton which is traditionally one of the best CCIW teams.

Wooster has a tough road game at Marietta on 11/27 followed by their road trip to OWU on 12/4.

The Scots are making a trip to Phoenix, Arizona to play Westmont (CA), strong NAIA team, and Arizona Christian on 12/16-17.

The Wooster Mose Hole Classic is prescheduled with the Scots playing Thiel on 12/29 and Hanover (IN) on 12/30.  So, on paper this looks like a challenging non-conference schedule with B-W, Wheaton, Marietta, Westmont and Hanover as the top opponents.  :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kenyonfan on July 05, 2013, 08:46:05 AM
As I understand it, the NCAC has switched to a full round robin for basketball -- so 18 games, which only leaves 7 non-conference games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on July 05, 2013, 11:53:03 AM
Quote from: kenyonfan on July 05, 2013, 08:46:05 AM
As I understand it, the NCAC has switched to a full round robin for basketball -- so 18 games, which only leaves 7 non-conference games.

Yes, men's basketball will join women's basketball and field hockey as the only NCAC sports which currently play a double-round-robin schedule.  I'm not sure about the limit on regular-season games (or on whether exhibitions against D-I or Canadian teams and/or the  first-round conference tournament game count against that number).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on July 05, 2013, 03:39:23 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on July 05, 2013, 11:53:03 AM
Quote from: kenyonfan on July 05, 2013, 08:46:05 AM
As I understand it, the NCAC has switched to a full round robin for basketball -- so 18 games, which only leaves 7 non-conference games.

Yes, men's basketball will join women's basketball and field hockey as the only NCAC sports which currently play a double-round-robin schedule.  I'm not sure about the limit on regular-season games (or on whether exhibitions against D-I or Canadian teams and/or the  first-round conference tournament game count against that number).

Don't worry, the NCAA will rule on it about...March or so!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on July 11, 2013, 11:43:20 AM
Indiana Dabney? Oh, my... :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hopefan on July 11, 2013, 01:52:21 PM
Quote from: smedindy on July 11, 2013, 11:43:20 AM
Indiana Dabney? Oh, my... :o

Seems like a great place to go if you're over 21, work full time, want evening classes, and want a degree in nursing or business....   AND want to play hoops!!!! ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on July 16, 2013, 12:37:17 PM
It's really disappointing, on several levels, to see that Wooster is travelling to Phoenix to play two NAIA Christian schools.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 16, 2013, 05:07:15 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on July 16, 2013, 12:37:17 PM
It's really disappointing, on several levels, to see that Wooster is travelling to Phoenix to play two NAIA Christian schools.

Agreed. Out of character for Wooster, too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on July 16, 2013, 10:28:30 PM
Pat, as this is probably the first time you've ever agreed with me, I gave you a karma point.  Welcome to the dark side. :)

Seriously, the rules are still the same, right?  These games are completely wasted as far as tournament credentials, aren't they?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on July 17, 2013, 10:09:12 AM
I gave you one too, but not sure it would be noticeable.

Agreed, a game outside of D-III is basically wasted. The only *possible* benefit it could have would be if those schools are common opponents between Wooster and somebody else competing for seeding or an at-large selection. Those odds are pretty long.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on July 18, 2013, 04:08:45 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on July 16, 2013, 12:37:17 PM
It's really disappointing, on several levels, to see that Wooster is travelling to Phoenix to play two NAIA Christian schools.

Maybe there is a team dinner at Bianco involved...in which case, Wooster wins.  Again. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on July 18, 2013, 08:24:55 PM
My brother lives in Phoenix.  He told me that the wait at Pizzeria Bianco runs two to three hours!  He's never felt like dealing with that, but his son has, and says the pizza is fantastic.  No doubt, given their reputation, the Fighting Scots would be moved to the front of the line. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on July 19, 2013, 08:38:53 AM
I got extremely lucky when I went and only had to wait about 15 minutes...but yeah, I would wait a long time for that pizza.  It has a well earned reputation. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on August 27, 2013, 01:01:50 PM
Bryan Wickliffe was hired as an assistant at Heidelberg along with Joe Puch from Marietta

http://www.heidelberg.edu/athletics/teams/mbasketball/news/20130805
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on August 27, 2013, 01:09:32 PM
8/27  added Allegheny, DePauw, Oberlin and Wittenberg

2013/14 schedules

Allegheny:  http://www.alleghenysports.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball
Denison:
DePauw:   http://www.depauw.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/schedule/
Hiram:  http://www.hiramterriers.com/sports/mbkb/2013-14/schedule
Kenyon:  http://athletics.kenyon.edu/schedule.aspx?schedule=74&path=mbball
Oberlin:   http://www.goyeo.com/schedule.aspx?path=mbball&
Ohio Wesleyan: http://www.battlingbishops.com/schedule.aspx?schedule=97&path=mbball
Wabash:   http://sports.wabash.edu/schedule.aspx?path=mbball
Wittenberg:  http://www.wittenbergtigers.com/sports/mbkb/2013-14/schedule
Wooster:  http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2013-14/schedule

Notes:  DePauw with 3 nice marquee games (or potential)  North Central, Washington U and Rose-Hulman.

Oberlin is playing at Cornell, NY

Wittenberg is playing at Wheaton's tournament against UW-River Falls, a win and its a probably juicy match-up with Wheaton, loss and its likely Blackburn.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on August 29, 2013, 03:41:55 PM
What is it with the Yeomen acting as a punching bag for the Ivy League???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on September 01, 2013, 06:59:53 PM
Quote from: smedindy on August 29, 2013, 03:41:55 PM
What is it with the Yeomen acting as a punching bag hackey sack for the Ivy League???

Fixed it for you, smeds.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on September 11, 2013, 11:52:37 PM
 Just saw in Sporting News preview publication that the two Arizona schools Wooster is playing are listed under the possible breakthroughs title( the equivalent of also receiving votes) Also in the D3 preseason ranking SN has Wooster coming in at # 4.
Quote from: Pat Coleman on July 17, 2013, 10:09:12 AM
I gave you one too, but not sure it would be noticeable.

Agreed, a game outside of D-III is basically wasted. The only *possible* benefit it could have would be if those schools are common opponents between Wooster and somebody else competing for seeding or an at-large selection. Those odds are pretty long.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on September 17, 2013, 04:54:34 PM
Sporting News has Arizona Christian and Westmont as possible breakthroughs in the D-III preview or in the NAIA preview?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on September 17, 2013, 11:25:32 PM
NAIA
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on September 18, 2013, 04:42:53 PM
Former College of Wooster basketball coach and athletic director Al Van Wie passed away earlier today.  We'd become friends in the last few years.  He was a fellow Democrat and San Francisco Giants fan.  What a good, and active, guy he was.  My condolences to his wife Judy and the rest of his family.

http://www.woosterathletics.com/general/vanwie

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on September 19, 2013, 09:13:37 AM
http://www.the-daily-record.com/local%20news/2013/09/19/al-van-wie-was-much-more-than-a-great-basketball-coach (http://www.the-daily-record.com/local%20news/2013/09/19/al-van-wie-was-much-more-than-a-great-basketball-coach)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on October 12, 2013, 09:32:46 AM
Is Wooster going west because they are having trouble finding teams to play them nearer to home?  Or are they going because a trip to an "exotic" location is something they can use in recruiting?  Or a combination of both?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on October 16, 2013, 12:57:43 PM
Quote from: sigma one on October 12, 2013, 09:32:46 AM
Is Wooster going west because they are having trouble finding teams to play them nearer to home?  Or are they going because a trip to an "exotic" location is something they can use in recruiting?  Or a combination of both?

I think it has more to do with the later than the former.  Wooster seems to go on long trips to "exotic" locations every other year or so.  Two years ago they went to Puerto Rico, and they've also made trips in recent years to Cali, the Bahamas, Florida and even Hawaii. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on October 17, 2013, 01:29:07 AM
Any news on what Wooster's Frosh are like? http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2013-14/roster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on October 18, 2013, 12:48:50 PM
Quote from: woolax on October 17, 2013, 01:29:07 AM
Any news on what Wooster's Frosh are like? http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2013-14/roster

I haven't seen too much on any of the recruits.  However, I did notice a few things on that roster:

1) Ryan Snyder is back after not playing last year
2) Kenny DeBoer is listed as a Senior (was listed as a Soph last year)
3) Ian Franks is an assistant coach.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 19, 2013, 11:14:09 AM
I'm really hoping that DeBoer thing is a typo.  I mean, he was listed as a freshman two years ago and a sophomore last season.  Snyder may have a tough time returning, given that the Scots have eleven guards listed, along with three guard/forwards.  Who's Ian Franks?  Is he someone we should know?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 19, 2013, 11:57:41 AM
The freshmen are all now listed on Wooster's roster.  Here is info on some of them:

Dan Fanelly 6'6" Green High School
Fanelly is the star recruit in this class as he was All-Ohio Division I First Team this past season.  Fanelly was also selected as the Inland District Division I Player of the Year.  This past season for Green, Fanelly averaged 19.6 points/game, 9.2 rebounds/game, 2.5 blocks and 2.8 steals.  He will get significant playing time and may even crack the starting lineup.

Milt Davis 6'1" Cincinnati Colerain
This past March, Colerain guard Milton Davis helped secure a close win with his effort for the West squad in the Division I District 16 Boys' East/West All Star Game by a score of 115-112. Davis scored a game-high 25 points for the West squad.  This past season, Milt averaged 17.6 ppg, 3.9 rpg while shooting 42% on field goals and 35% on three pointers.  Davis was an All District Special Mention selection.

Nick Nossaman  Olentangy Liberty
Senior guard Nick Nossaman averaged 9.6 points and five assists and made 55 of 131 (42 percent) 3-pointers and 32 of 38 free throws (84.2 percent). He was honorable mention All District and second-team all-league.  Nick Nossaman appears to be the son of Greg Nossaman who is the coach of Olentangy Liberty.  Nathan Balch is a graduate of Olentangy Liberty.

Hunter Debo 6'1" Anthony Wayne
Hunter's JV Coach was Blake Mealer and he appears to be a good shooter.  Hunter had a hip injury his senior year but did average 9.0 ppg, 2.9 rpg and shot 49% on three pointers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on October 20, 2013, 01:38:09 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on October 19, 2013, 11:14:09 AM
I'm really hoping that DeBoer thing is a typo.  I mean, he was listed as a freshman two years ago and a sophomore last season.

Kenny has begun his Senior Independent Study thesis, in business economics.  This likely means that he is expecting to graduate next spring, so perhaps he is being treated as a senior for athletic purposes, even if he still has another year of eligibility remaining.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 20, 2013, 07:12:15 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on October 20, 2013, 01:38:09 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on October 19, 2013, 11:14:09 AM
I'm really hoping that DeBoer thing is a typo.  I mean, he was listed as a freshman two years ago and a sophomore last season.

Kenny has begun his Senior Independent Study thesis, in business economics.  This likely means that he is expecting to graduate next spring, so perhaps he is being treated as a senior for athletic purposes, even if he still has another year of eligibility remaining.

Clearly this student needs to take a course in the art of procrastination while also learning the value of old-fashioned partying.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on October 20, 2013, 07:32:38 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on October 20, 2013, 07:12:15 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on October 20, 2013, 01:38:09 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on October 19, 2013, 11:14:09 AM
I'm really hoping that DeBoer thing is a typo.  I mean, he was listed as a freshman two years ago and a sophomore last season.

Kenny has begun his Senior Independent Study thesis, in business economics.  This likely means that he is expecting to graduate next spring, so perhaps he is being treated as a senior for athletic purposes, even if he still has another year of eligibility remaining.

Clearly this student needs to take a course in the art of procrastination while also learning the value of old-fashioned partying.  ;)

Kenny PM'ed me: if you're willing to pay for his fourth year, he's agreeable to procrastinating and partying! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 21, 2013, 10:55:19 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on October 20, 2013, 07:32:38 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on October 20, 2013, 07:12:15 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on October 20, 2013, 01:38:09 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on October 19, 2013, 11:14:09 AM
I'm really hoping that DeBoer thing is a typo.  I mean, he was listed as a freshman two years ago and a sophomore last season.

Kenny has begun his Senior Independent Study thesis, in business economics.  This likely means that he is expecting to graduate next spring, so perhaps he is being treated as a senior for athletic purposes, even if he still has another year of eligibility remaining.

Clearly this student needs to take a course in the art of procrastination while also learning the value of old-fashioned partying.  ;)

Kenny PM'ed me: if you're willing to pay for his fourth year, he's agreeable to procrastinating and partying! ;D
No problem, I have no problem procrastinating on paying tuition bills. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on November 05, 2013, 12:10:25 PM
Long, long time reader, first time poster. The lack of Wittenberg representation on this board has caused me to emerge from the anonymity and preview the upcoming season for the Tigers. I understand everyone's eyes are justifiably focused on the football game this weekend, but with Western Carolina looming on Thursday, I thought the time was appropriate for this post.

Overview: The Tigers should be an NCAA tournament team this year. They certainly are not as deep as the 2012 Elite Eight team, but their starting 5 is equally talented (indeed, I believe Leahy and Newell were starters, at times, for that team). The Tigers, who return all five starters, will need some increased offensive creativity and consistency in order to make a push for their first outright NCAC regular season title in years, but this group appears to have the talent.

Starters:

PG: Steven Newell 5'10" 170 SR- Newell is a major question mark for this team.  He's been a mainstay in Bill Brown's rotation since his freshman year, but you have to wonder whether he has really become the player the coaches hoped he would be by his senior year.  Newell is a quick guard who shot 39% from 3 last year.  But he only averaged 2.3 APG and 6.6 PPG.  I find it hard to believe those numbers represent his ceiling because he appears to have all the tools necessary to be a quality DIII point guard, but I think it's fair to say he's underperformed so far. Those numbers also likely don't represent the complete impact he has on the game, but the Tigers will need more consistent play from Newell this year. At the least, the Tigers will need Newell to be a credible threat from behind
the arc again this year.

SG: Zack Leahy 6'0" 190 SR- Like Newell, an argument can be made that Leahy has failed to fully live up to whatever proverbial "hype" preceded his arrival on campus.  The Toledo transfer is a crafty guard who can score in a variety of ways (12.0 PPG), but Leahy seems to struggle with quicker guards and often relies on generous referees to create FT opportunities when his shot isn't falling. Leahy can build on his Honorable Mention season with some improved shooting (only 37% from the field).  He's going to play big minutes this year and the Tigers are going to need him to have some dominate senior performances. He's more than capable, but he's got to be more than slasher. Don't be surprised if the Tigers' offense features more sets highlighting Leahy's skills.

SF: Sam Collins 6'4" 185 JR- There were games last year where Collins was the best player on the floor.  Unfortunately, there were also games where Collins was arguably one of the most detrimental players on the floor.  Collins is long, athletic, and fast and can be a serious match-up problem for smaller or slower teams.  Collins started last year on fire, but when the second round of NCAC games rolled around, teams had Collins figured out. He can't go left, he resorts to the spin move in times of trouble, and he can't shoot from 17+ feet. However, his energy and completive nature allows him to mask many of these decencies.  Collins can affect the game in so many ways (10 PPG, 5.7 RPG, 2.6 APG) that it's hard to fault what he does wrong.  If he can develop a second (or third) move, he has the potential to be an all-conference type of player. If not, the Tigers may struggle to score again this year.

PF: Alex Fultz 6'5" 200 SO- An argument can be made that Cole Bond, a senior, may end up as the starting 4 this year, but I believe Futlz will end the year as the starter. Both Bond and Fultz are stretch 4s with the ability to spread defenses with their 3 point shooting abilities. But Fultz (41% from 3) shot it a little better than Bond last year and Bill Brown is often infatuated with young talent. I like what Fultz brings to the team because so many of Wittenberg's players are slashers and penetrators that need a consistent shooter to keep defenses honest and keep driving lanes open. However, Fultz does need to be more aggressive on the glass (3.3 RPG) as a sophomore.  Futlz ended the year with some strong games, and the Tigers will need similar performances to hang with some of their tougher non-conferance opponents.

C: Scott Masin 6'5" 240 SR- Masin has transformed himself into one of the premiere big men in the league. He's simply too big to guard with one player. He finally developed a countermove to pair with his drop step which helped him become a First Team All-NCAC selection last season.  Masin creates second and third chances for the offense, and runs the floor impressively for player of his size. His defense occasionally leaves something to be desired, and he has a tendency to over-dribble, but he is the best player on this team. Bill Brown tends to run his offense through  the post, so don't bee surprised to see the offense focus on Masin this year.

I believe that the team will go as Leahy and Masin go, with Collins as an X-factor. You essentially know what you are getting out of Newell and Fultz, but if Leahy and Masin can carry this team and Collins can come up with some 20 point 10 rebound performances, this team will be tough. There are certainly question marks (the offense was atrocious at points last year and the team lost offensive-minded coach Matt Croce to Capital, and there is very little quality depth at numerous positions), but I think the team, and its fans, will be disappointed if this team does not make the NCAA tournament this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 05, 2013, 04:44:03 PM
Thanks for posting, UFP, and welcome aboard! As soon as football is over, a few Wabash posters will make themselves known here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on November 06, 2013, 07:58:44 AM
Wooster's first exhibition game is tonight at 6:30, against Athletes in Action, a team of former college players sponsored by Campus Crusade for Christ.  Here is the blog of the AIA team, which appears to be formidable: http://teamblogs.athletesinaction.org/2013-teams/2013/basketball---fall-tour (http://teamblogs.athletesinaction.org/2013-teams/2013/basketball---fall-tour)
Title: Coach's preseason poll
Post by: kenyonfan on November 07, 2013, 09:19:52 AM
1. Wooster (8).............................................. 98
2. Wittenberg (2).......................................... 88
3. Ohio Wesleyan  ........................................ 74
4. Kenyon.................................................... 71
5. Wabash................................................... 58
6. DePauw................................................... 55
7. Hiram...................................................... 34
8. Denison................................................... 33
9. Allegheny................................................. 23
10. Oberlin................................................... 16

http://www2.northcoast.org/basketball/preseasonpoll/2013-14 (http://www2.northcoast.org/basketball/preseasonpoll/2013-14)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 08, 2013, 02:21:15 PM
I was only able to watch the first half of the Athletes In Action vs Wooster scrimmage.  AIA was very big, but I was impressed with the Scots' ability to rebound with them.  Wooster was off and on offensively, but seemed to shoot the ball well, and they played very hard for the twenty minutes.  Lots of people saw the court.  Does anyone know how this scrimmage turned out?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 08, 2013, 03:19:35 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 08, 2013, 02:21:15 PM
I was only able to watch the first half of the Athletes In Action vs Wooster scrimmage.  AIA was very big, but I was impressed with the Scots' ability to rebound with them.  Wooster was off and on offensively, but seemed to shoot the ball well, and they played very hard for the twenty minutes.  Lots of people saw the court.  Does anyone know how this scrimmage turned out?

The Scots ended up winning the scrimmage on a last second 3 by Thorpe.  I thought that AIA played much better defense in the 2nd half and the Scots had some trouble getting their offense going.  And AIA did a better job of keeping the Scots off of the boards as well. But I agree that the Scots looked pretty good overall. I do think that they could be vulnerable to a team with a strong interior game, but outside the paint they've got to be as good as anybody, especially if Wingard shoots like he has in the first couple of scrimmages.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 15, 2013, 10:15:57 PM
Don't mind me..just cruising in quickly in preparation for THE game tomorrow. Wabash lost to Franklin in OT 96-91 to kick off their hoops season.

Senior Pete Nicksic led Wabash with 20 points and eight boards. Freshman Kyle Aiton had 18, and fellow frosh Ryan Gross added 17. Freshman Gary Ulrich had five assists and five steals.

As you can see, the LGs are a bit fuzzy cheeked...and will be until Houston Hodges and Andy Walsh come back from football.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on November 18, 2013, 06:22:55 AM
Let the games begin.  Go SCOTS :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wallyworld12 on November 18, 2013, 08:53:39 AM
I had the opportunity to see Wabash play against Franklin last Friday night. Some of my observations, after a long Monon Bell weekend:

1. As Smed mentioned above, the Little Giants are young. Very young. They started two freshmen, Kyle Aiton and Gary Ulrich, a pair of guards from Castle and Rockville, Indiana. Aiton and Ulrich are pretty good players, but Wabash looked guard-heavy, especially against a Franklin team that was small. Which brings me to my second point...

2. Why not spend more time pounding the ball inside? Nicksic had 20, which was great, but they should have spent more time in the post, especially late in the game, when their tallest player on the floor was 6' 2".

3. Franklin had some kids hit some big shots late, and it seemed like 3s were falling all night. They will be an interesting team to watch in the HCAC.

4. Wabash will definitely benefit from the returns of Hodges and Walsh. Wabash is in action next on Saturday against Albion. A good, early season test to see if Wabash learned any lessons from the OT loss to Franklin.

Finally, a big congrats to DePauw for knocking off the #6 ranked North Central Cardinals! Game story here: http://www.depauw.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/news/details/30505/

Hey Smed, lets get those non-conferences records updated  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on November 18, 2013, 10:52:43 AM
I took in most of Wooster's alumni game on Friday night.  The "Old Scots" included several key players from the 2007 and 2011 final four teams (Franks, Hallowell, Port, etc.)  The current Scots rotated quite a few players in, and still pulled away after the intermission (and were leading by 20 when I left midway through the second half); sometimes this happens in alumni games due to (lack of) conditioning, but there were 13 former Scots playing, so I don't think that was the major cause. 

Backcourt leaders Doug Thorpe and Xavier Brown struggled a bit in the first half, but started really clicking after the break.  Senior guard Scott Purcell hit several 3's, so he might get in more off the bench, despite the team's clear depth at guard (Pannell, Goodwin, FuQuay).  The sophomores are coming along well, with forward DeVaughn Wingard continuing to improve, and a couple of interior players (McCorkle and Kipfer) also getting better.  While a lot will be asked of senior forward Kenny DoBoer, I was very impressed by the post play of freshman Dan Fannelly, who found ways to score against bigger, stronger defenders; he seems likely to make an immediate impact.  Despite the season-ending injury to sophomore guard Alex LaLonde (who was a key player down the stretch last year, after transferring in from USAFA), this team appears to be ten or twelve players deep.

Interior depth and teamwork seem likely to get tested right away, against OAC favorite Baldwin-Wallace on Friday night, with the winner probably facing #5 Wheaton on Saturday.  This will be the first Al Van Wie Rotary Classic since the passing of its namesake former coach.  Game time is 8:00 on Friday for the Scots, and I heard (but haven't confirmed) that Saturday's games will be at 4 and 6, perhaps so that the out-of-state teams can get on the road a bit earlier?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 18, 2013, 02:10:36 PM
Quote from: wallyworld12 on November 18, 2013, 08:53:39 AM
Finally, a big congrats to DePauw for knocking off the #6 ranked North Central Cardinals! Game story here: http://www.depauw.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/news/details/30505/

There's less to that win than meets the eye.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on November 18, 2013, 02:55:49 PM
Wittenberg went 1-1 in Illinois over the weekend. The Tigers beat UW-River Falls 69-62 Friday night after leading for the majority of the game. Four players were in double figures led by Leahy (16 points, but on 3-10 shooting) and freshman Brock Kiesler (13 points, 8 rebounds).  The Tigers then fell to #5 Wheaton in OT the following night 73-62. Newell and Masin led the team with 14 and 13 points respectively. Nice to hang in with a nationally ranked team, but disappointing that the Tigers couldn't pull out the win on Wheaton's court. The Tigers went only 2-8 from the field and 0-6 from the 3 in OT. Masin and Leahy were voted to the All-Tournament Team.

Leahy and Newell both played 30+ minutes each night, and Collins was close. First games of the season, so it may not mean much, but it doesn't look like there is much depth beyond Fultz and Kiesler on this team. Witt takes the floor against Cap on Wednesday. Witt has won the last two years. Former Wittenberg assistant coach and Kenyon head coach Matt Croce is now with Capital.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 18, 2013, 06:54:31 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 18, 2013, 02:10:36 PM
Quote from: wallyworld12 on November 18, 2013, 08:53:39 AM
Finally, a big congrats to DePauw for knocking off the #6 ranked North Central Cardinals! Game story here: http://www.depauw.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/news/details/30505/

There's less to that win than meets the eye.

Greg - could you elaborate? Does NCC have injury issues? Or do you see them as overrated at #6 in the preseason poll? Or maybe just because it's game #2, weird results happen as teams shake off the rust?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 18, 2013, 07:06:52 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on November 18, 2013, 06:54:31 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 18, 2013, 02:10:36 PM
Quote from: wallyworld12 on November 18, 2013, 08:53:39 AM
Finally, a big congrats to DePauw for knocking off the #6 ranked North Central Cardinals! Game story here: http://www.depauw.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/news/details/30505/

There's less to that win than meets the eye.

Greg - could you elaborate? Does NCC have injury issues? Or do you see them as overrated at #6 in the preseason poll? Or maybe just because it's game #2, weird results happen as teams shake off the rust?

This.

NCC lost fourth-team All-American Derek Raridon and the team's most versatile player, two-time All-CCIW selection Aaron Tiknis, to graduation. They also lost one of their three reserves from last year's eight-man rotation, Charlie Rosenberg. The Cards still have first-team All-American Landon Gamble and a very solid and experienced shooting guard in Vince Kmiec, but they lost far too much -- in every phase of the game, not just scoring -- with the departure of Raridon and Tiknis to be considered anywhere close to #6.

They probably should've appeared in the Others Receiving Votes category, which seems about right for them. I think that the Cards will be OK this year, but they won't come within a country mile of being a Final Four team again. Most everybody who follows the CCIW sees NCC as a middle-of-the-pack team this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 18, 2013, 07:27:57 PM
This is why I hate pre-season polls. No offense, Pat.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 18, 2013, 07:31:53 PM
In all fairness, having seen St. Norbert on Saturday night, I'd say that the pollsters got that particular preseason pick (#24) just right.

Sometimes they're spot-on, or at least somewhere in the ballpark, with preseason picks. But, yeah, the NCC pick was an absolute head-scratcher.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 18, 2013, 09:27:52 PM
More importantly, North Central lost assistant coach Ian Franks, who has returned home to the familiar black and gold.  Rumor has it that he has a year of eligibility left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wallyworld12 on November 18, 2013, 09:49:25 PM
Those dreaded early season rankings...I can remember when Wabash knocked off 4th ranked Randolph-Macon a couple of years ago, and, while that Wabash team was good, I also think it was a stretch to believe that RMC was the 4th best team in the country. Methinks early season rankings are based a lot on pedigree.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 19, 2013, 09:03:20 PM
Final:  Wooster 77  Oberlin 58   :)

Wooster gets its opening win of the season on the road at Oberlin.  Scots were led in scoring tonight by DeVaughn Wingard with 18 points (4 three pointers), Doug Thorpe with 14 points, Josh Kipfer with 11 points and freshman Dan Fanelly also with 11 points.  Starters in this game for Wooster were Doug Thorpe, Xavier Brown, Scott Purcell, Kenny DeBoer and freshman Dan Fanelly.

Next game for Wooster is at home on Friday night vs. Baldwin Wallace in the Al Van Wie Tourney.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 19, 2013, 10:53:58 PM
Some observations based solely on the box score of Oberlin - Wooster (e.g., advance disclaimer that I didn't see the game at all)

1. The Scots didn't shoot all that well. Less than 42% overall and 35% from 3pt land. Oberlin actually out-shot the Scots, at 44.4%, even while shooting a terrible 22% from 3pt. I'm guessing a blend of early season rust + some decent perimeter defense both ways contributed.

2. Compensating for the mediocre shooting was the Scots 20 extra shot attempts - predominately, it appears, the result of a +15 turnover margin. That's fantastic - a great early indicator for the Scots of both defensive quickness (15 steals) + excellent ball control.

3. The Scots had 37 bench points...Oberlin had 9. That depth is going to be a huge strength for the Scots. Also, while I realize the game wasn't in question for most of the second half, it does appear that Moore is planning on a 9-man rotation with 9 guys getting 15+ minutes tonight.

4. Great game from DeVaughn Wingard for Woo with the 18 pts in 15 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 20, 2013, 01:36:56 AM
Wooster was outrebounded by Oberlin, 35-34.  However, the disparity in shots had something to do with that.  Wooster had 11 ORBs compared to Oberlin's 30 DRBs.  So, the Scots pulled down 27% of the rebounds at that end of the court.  On the other hand, Oberlin had only 5 ORBs against Wooster's 23 DRBs.  Oberlin grabbed only 18% of the rebounds at the Scots' defensive end.

I know that NCAA women's games are going to be called a lot tighter this season.  Both on the perimeter and when the offensive player is driving.  Defenders will be allowed one light touch to measure up; a second touch will draw a whistle.  I've seen this in action several times already (although not so much in UCONN's games), and I love it.  Players are finally able to utilize their offensive skills without the stronger more physical player having a huge advantage.  The girls learned quickly how to defend with their feet, and the coaches have adjusted to get more weak side help come to cut off penetration.  Fouls are up, but I think that for most teams, they'll soon be down to prior levels.

Does anyone know if the officials have been instructed to deal with this in the same way in the men's game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 20, 2013, 10:04:09 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 20, 2013, 01:36:56 AM

I know that NCAA women's games are going to be called a lot tighter this season.  Both on the perimeter and when the offensive player is driving.  Defenders will be allowed one light touch to measure up; a second touch will draw a whistle.  I've seen this in action several times already (although not so much in UCONN's games), and I love it.  Players are finally able to utilize their offensive skills without the stronger more physical player having a huge advantage.  The girls learned quickly how to defend with their feet, and the coaches have adjusted to get more weak side help come to cut off penetration.  Fouls are up, but I think that for most teams, they'll soon be down to prior levels.

Does anyone know if the officials have been instructed to deal with this in the same way in the men's game?

I know in D1, the officiating is supposed to clamp down on the hand checking and rough physical nature that defending has turned into in an effort to help increase scoring which was at it's lowest point in 31 years last year.

Here is a link to an article that shows the numbers from the opening weekend in D1 hoops:

Assessing the impact of the new rules after college basketball's opening weekend (http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/ncaab-the-dagger/assessing-impact-rules-college-basketball-opening-weekend-133040518--ncaab.html)

Not sure about how these rule changes will impact things at the D3 level.  I didn't watch the game last night, but looking at the box score, it doesn't appear to be much different from a foul calling perspective as both teams combined for 36 pf's and 38 ft attempts which doesn't seem out of the ordinary to me...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 20, 2013, 11:09:26 AM
Some early D1 games were foul fests, causing an over-reaction. I'm sure it'll normalize soon.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on November 20, 2013, 08:06:41 PM
Wittenberg up 49-28 on Capital at halftime. Masin has been strong down low and Fultz has shot the ball very well. Capital seems down, but this Wittenberg team could be fun to watch this year.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 21, 2013, 09:48:51 AM
Quote from: Urban For Prez on November 20, 2013, 08:06:41 PM
Wittenberg up 49-28 on Capital at halftime. Masin has been strong down low and Fultz has shot the ball very well. Capital seems down, but this Wittenberg team could be fun to watch this year.

Bill Brown picked up career win #500 with Witt's win over Cap last night.  Congrats to Coach Brown on becoming the 14th active DIII coach to reach the 500 win plateau.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 21, 2013, 10:09:32 AM
Hello everybody! Sorry for being missing for so long! ScotsFan beat me to it but congratulations to Coach Brown on career win number 500! Quite an accomplishment.

I unfortunately won't be able to physically see a lot of games this year due to my officiating, but will definitely keep my inputs current and observations.

I was able to attend the game vs Capital last night until halftime and that's all I really needed to see as the game was in hand early. Wittenberg has a veteran starting 5 and I'm not sure what the issue was but Capital could not get a stop at all. Wittenberg had lots of open 3 point shots and I didn't see the final numbers but completely out-mannded Capital on the boards, mostly offensive. Lots of new faces on the Wittenberg depth chart so I wish I could have seen more to get an idea of what talent is to come!

Also, I did watch online the tournament game from past weekend vs Wheaton. Great game, Witt actually had control in the second half but once overtime hit they just could not get anything going. Still an impressive showing; I'll be interested to see how Wooster compares vs them.

Good luck to the Witt football team in their playoff game this weekend!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 22, 2013, 08:38:38 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 39  Baldwin Wallace 38

Tight game between two strong teams.  Wooster is being led by Xavier Brown with 15 points and freshman Dan Fanelly with 11 points.

Kyle Payne is leading the Yellow Jackets with 10 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on November 22, 2013, 09:36:10 PM
Let's see. Should I go to Springfield to watch the Wittenberg football game or Granville to watch the Marietta-Denison basketball game? Tough choice.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 22, 2013, 09:39:11 PM
Final: Wooster 76  Baldwin Wallace 71  :)

Scots get a big win over a strong OAC team!  Wooster was led tonight by Xavier Brown with 31 points, Doug Thorpe with 18 points and freshman Dan Fanelly with 13 points.

Wooster is now 2-0.  Scots face Wheaton (IL) in the Al Van Wie tourney championship game tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on November 23, 2013, 07:05:17 AM
Quote from: ohiofan1954 on November 22, 2013, 09:36:10 PM
Let's see. Should I go to Springfield to watch the Wittenberg football game or Granville to watch the Marietta-Denison basketball game? Tough choice.
[/so??????????? where you going?quote]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on November 23, 2013, 12:30:47 PM
Witt is up 14-3 on Lebanon Valley right now.  If it's a blowout, he can leave early and make the whole game in Granville. 

If not, he can make the second half in Granville.  (Check the score before leaving, though, to make sure it's not over by then).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 23, 2013, 12:40:57 PM
Really wish I could see Wheaton vs. Wooster tonight but unfortunately won't be able to. It's probably the best game on Wooster's schedule this year. Even though its so early, the winner of this one could have a leg up all the way until postseason selection time, since you're looking at two teams that are likely to be ranked in their regions at some point.

My only critique with how the Scots played last night was that the offense, especially in the second half, felt stagnant. Ball movement suffered as guards tended to go a bit too much one-on-one and I think the Scots' 9 assists on 28 made baskets is testimony to that.

Even though Brown dropped 31 points, I think he was clearly the biggest offender in terms of missing opportunities to use his offensive skills (and defensive attention) to free up shots for his teammates (his zero assists on the night agree with me). I dislike seeing him try to create but then pulling back or settling for semi-contested 16-18 footers. Much better would be to see him try to a) continue the drive and look for an inside pass to the post or b) a kick out for an open three, or c) feed the player rolling off the pick on the high pick and roll. I remember times last night where all of these options looked available but instead Brown seemed to choose to force up a tough shot. Several times he was bailed out by getting foul calls (and credit is due for him going 11-11 on FTs)...but I'm not convinced that's always going to happen.

Also, continuing a theme from last year, the Scots didn't seem to handle B-W's 2-3 zone very well for the limited time that the Yellow Jackets ran it.

Just some issues to monitor with the Scots offense early this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 23, 2013, 01:13:49 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on November 23, 2013, 12:40:57 PM
Really wish I could see Wheaton vs. Wooster tonight but unfortunately won't be able to. It's probably the best game on Wooster's schedule this year. Even though its so early, the winner of this one could have a leg up all the way until postseason selection time, since you're looking at two teams that are likely to be ranked in their regions at some point.

My only critique with how the Scots played last night was that the offense, especially in the second half, felt stagnant. Ball movement suffered as guards tended to go a bit too much one-on-one and I think the Scots' 9 assists on 28 made baskets is testimony to that.

Even though Brown dropped 31 points, I think he was clearly the biggest offender in terms of missing opportunities to use his offensive skills (and defensive attention) to free up shots for his teammates (his zero assists on the night agree with me). I dislike seeing him try to create but then pulling back or settling for semi-contested 16-18 footers. Much better would be to see him try to a) continue the drive and look for an inside pass to the post or b) a kick out for an open three, or c) feed the player rolling off the pick on the high pick and roll. I remember times last night where all of these options looked available but instead Brown seemed to choose to force up a tough shot. Several times he was bailed out by getting foul calls (and credit is due for him going 11-11 on FTs)...but I'm not convinced that's always going to happen.

Also, continuing a theme from last year, the Scots didn't seem to handle B-W's 2-3 zone very well for the limited time that the Yellow Jackets ran it.

Just some issues to monitor with the Scots offense early this year.

I think XB is what he is.  It's not selfishness, he just doesn't see the court that well, and that hasn't really changed in two years.  His one-on-one skill set is very high, but that kind of thing works much better against a man-to-man.

I thought the level of the Scots play really dropped when they went to their bench.  Ball movement seemed to have no purpose.  Kipfer was a McHale-like black hole without Kevin's skills.  When the ball went in, it wasn't coming out, and he struggled to score.  He needs to see the floor when he has the ball down low.

Fanelli was impressive inside despite his looks-more-like-a-wing body.  He has a nose for the ball and seems to be able to finish.  He was the victim of some rough calls last night, especially the last one, but that will happen.

Doug Thorpe is one of my favorite players to have come through the Wooster system.  Even beyond his very credible skills, he's super focused in the clutch and has a heck of a heart.  The Scots will miss him when he's gone.

Tonight will be an interesting match-up.  Number 50 for Wheaton, Nate Haynes, is one heck of an athlete.  His downfall last night was the inability to finish.  Hopefully that's the norm for him, but who knows?  Wooster will also need to cut off Wheaton's penetration, but the Scots are pretty good at that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on November 23, 2013, 07:42:30 PM
I see Wooster beat #5 Wheaton tonight 77-73. What did people think of the game? How was Wooster's post play?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 23, 2013, 11:23:51 PM
Back from Timken where I saw Wooster knock off a strong Wheaton team. :)

Wheaton's starting lineup is 6'3" and 6'4" guards and a front line that is 6'6", 6'6", 6'6".  They are a tall team by D3 standards.

I was concerned that Wooster would lose the battle of the boards but their quickness and overall team hustle offset Wheaton's height advantage.

Wooster's post players are not very deep this year especially because Alex LaLonde is missing this season due to shoulder surgery.  Freshman Dan Fanelly is a great talent and very mobile at 6'6" but he only played 10 minutes tonight because he was in foul trouble.  6'6" Josh Kipfer was a warrior playing 30 minutes with Fanelly on the bench and Kipfer with 7 boards held his own against Wheaton's big front line.   Kenny DeBoer at 6'5" was also a force inside and once again, he will be a key player for the Scots this year.  After Fanelly, Kipfer and DeBoer, the next biggest player who has seen minutes this year is DeVaughn Wingard who is 6'4".  Wingard nailed 3 three pointers tonight and played good defense, along with DeBoer, against Tyler Peters who is Wheaton's best player and a big guard at 6'4".

Wooster won this top 10 matchup game tonight for 3 reasons:
1. Scots matched Wheaton on the boards and it was a 28-28 draw
2. Wooster's guards (Doug Thorpe, Xavier Brown) were too quick for the Thunder.  Scots also made 13 three pointers and several made by Thorpe were huge shots in the last 5 minutes of the game
3. Wooster took care of the ball with only 8 turnovers while Wheaton had 18 TO's

Another big OAC opponent is next as Wooster plays at Marietta next Wednesday.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 23, 2013, 11:47:38 PM
Wheaton's very thin up front, too, wooscotsfan, and "tall team" is a relative term. Wheaton probably is a tall team when the over 400 teams in D3 are considered as a whole, particularly in terms of the backcourt; but by their own competitive standards (i.e., the CCIW), Wheaton is not notably tall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on November 24, 2013, 08:24:18 AM
Wooster beat team picked to win OAC. Considering it was another OAC team that beat Miami it really was a good win for Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 24, 2013, 12:47:29 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 23, 2013, 11:47:38 PM
Wheaton's very thin up front, too, wooscotsfan, and "tall team" is a relative term. Wheaton probably is a tall team when the over 400 teams in D3 are considered as a whole, particularly in terms of the backcourt; but by their own competitive standards (i.e., the CCIW), Wheaton is not notably tall.

Agreed.  It's more that Wooster is a short team.  Looking around at the match-ups during various times in the game, the Scots were giving away several inches at every position, especially at the guard spots.

Some observations:

1. How good Dan Fanelli is, or will be, is still in question.  The problem is, it all becomes moot if he can't stay on the court.  Friday night he drew some dubious calls.  Last night was his own fault, particularly the second call, when he reached around a Wheaton player to try to steal a rebound.  You just can't do that when the chances of a reward are so slight and the penalty so steep.  His free throw shooting scared me, too, as he left two attempts well short, barely drawing iron.

2. Josh Kipfer doesn't have much in the way of skill or quickness.  But he was a warrior inside last night, pulling down boards that he had no right to get.  He even found a couple of open shooters on the perimeter.  A job well done, that had to be done or Wooster loses.

3. Evan Panell played like the Evan Panell of last year.  Not afraid to shoot or penetrate, he came up big when needed.

4. If it's at all possible, XB's shooting seems to have improved from last season.  The textbook pull-up jumper remains, and he's not missing many at all.  The big difference is that he's now taking his three-pointers with the same pure form and making them.  Another important weapon added.

5. XB deservedly received the tourney MVP.  But I think it should have been shared with Doug Thorpe.  Thorpe is so tough down the stretch, and he's the man that Steve Moore gives the ball to when the shot clock, and game clock, are winding down.  In twenty years of watching, he's the best Scot I've seen at that job.

6. This Scot team will go as far as their big men, both the fours and fives, can take them.  They don't need all that much out of the five spot; just rebounding and the ability to find open shooters from the post.  Scoring is gravy.  Another tough test on Thanksgiving Eve down at Marietta.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on November 24, 2013, 06:49:02 PM
I wanted Mount to get Fanelly after watching him in HS.  He looked like a really nice player.  He'd look nice next to Ruffin.  Any chance the Raiders could offer up a couple football players and cut a deal for a big man?   ;D  I don't blame the kid one iota for going to Wooster though.  Great tradition and a great school.  Tough to beat that combo.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on November 24, 2013, 08:57:35 PM
Wittenberg beat Oberlin 85-69 in an early conference matchup.  Not much to say about this one, other than that Sam Collins had the type of efficient scoring night he will need to have if the Tigers want to have a chance at winning the NCAC.  Witt moves to 3-1 overall and 1-0 in the conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on November 25, 2013, 01:16:48 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 24, 2013, 12:47:29 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 23, 2013, 11:47:38 PM
Wheaton's very thin up front, too, wooscotsfan, and "tall team" is a relative term. Wheaton probably is a tall team when the over 400 teams in D3 are considered as a whole, particularly in terms of the backcourt; but by their own competitive standards (i.e., the CCIW), Wheaton is not notably tall.

Agreed.  It's more that Wooster is a short team.  Looking around at the match-ups during various times in the game, the Scots were giving away several inches at every position, especially at the guard spots.

Some observations:

1. How good Dan Fanelli is, or will be, is still in question.  The problem is, it all becomes moot if he can't stay on the court.  Friday night he drew some dubious calls.  Last night was his own fault, particularly the second call, when he reached around a Wheaton player to try to steal a rebound.  You just can't do that when the chances of a reward are so slight and the penalty so steep.  His free throw shooting scared me, too, as he left two attempts well short, barely drawing iron.

2. Josh Kipfer doesn't have much in the way of skill or quickness.  But he was a warrior inside last night, pulling down boards that he had no right to get.  He even found a couple of open shooters on the perimeter.  A job well done, that had to be done or Wooster loses.

3. Evan Panell played like the Evan Panell of last year.  Not afraid to shoot or penetrate, he came up big when needed.

4. If it's at all possible, XB's shooting seems to have improved from last season.  The textbook pull-up jumper remains, and he's not missing many at all.  The big difference is that he's now taking his three-pointers with the same pure form and making them.  Another important weapon added.

5. XB deservedly received the tourney MVP.  But I think it should have been shared with Doug Thorpe.  Thorpe is so tough down the stretch, and he's the man that Steve Moore gives the ball to when the shot clock, and game clock, are winding down.  In twenty years of watching, he's the best Scot I've seen at that job.

6. This Scot team will go as far as their big men, both the fours and fives, can take them.  They don't need all that much out of the five spot; just rebounding and the ability to find open shooters from the post.  Scoring is gravy.  Another tough test on Thanksgiving Eve down at Marietta.
Great comments Wooster Booster.  With your permission (or without) I'll add a couple of thoughts.
1. Let's not forget that Fanelli is a freshman.  A couple of bad fouls yes.  He will learn that he's no longer the big dog but just one of many talented players on the court and as such, he can't get away with what he did in high school.  Let's hope he takes the coaching he's sure to get to heart and learns to temper his enthusiasm.  As far as the free throws go, again when you consider a freshman playing the third game of his college career against the 5th best team in the country in a highly emotional game; I think hitting the rim at all was an accomplishment.  With time and seasoning I think he'll develop into a heck of a D3 player.
2.  While I agree that a lot of the Scot's success this season will depend on the big men the most impressive thing I saw this weekend was XB and Doug T putting the Scots on their backs and bringing home the victory against BW.  There will be nights when the threes don't fall and to have two guards as capable as these two will present problems to any opponent. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 25, 2013, 04:03:03 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on November 25, 2013, 01:16:48 PM
2.  While I agree that a lot of the Scot's success this season will depend on the big men the most impressive thing I saw this weekend was XB and Doug T putting the Scots on their backs and bringing home the victory against BW.  There will be nights when the threes don't fall and to have two guards as capable as these two will present problems to any opponent.

Hey, Pat!  Somebody posted without my permission! ;)

About the guards, exactly.  My point was that Thorpe and XB are very, very good and we know what we're going to get from them.  The big men (and I'm not counting DeBoer in this discussion, he's already a solid known commodity) are new and untested.  If they can develop as hoped, that will give Wooster what they need to possibly be one of the elite teams.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 25, 2013, 05:48:30 PM
Meanwhile, since this is an NCAC board, let's talk about the rest of the league.

Looking good: DPU (3-0)
Probably as expected: Wooster (3-0), Witt (3-1)
Head scratching loss: OWU (2-1) - loss to LaVerne, Allegheny (2-2) - loss to Geneva
Not So Good: Kenyon (1-3)

Um...Hiram (0-2), Denison (0-2), Wabash (0-3), Oberlin (0-5)

As good as we were last year in non conference - we're, well, um....10-15.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on November 26, 2013, 01:01:29 AM
#3 Wooster plays at #23 Marietta on Wednesday night. How well do these teams match up? Predictions?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 26, 2013, 11:39:00 AM
Quote from: smedindy on November 25, 2013, 05:48:30 PM
Meanwhile, since this is an NCAC board, let's talk about the rest of the league.


Give me a break...  ::)

Is this really an NCAC board???  Thanks for the reminder?!   ::)

Quick question.  Is the football board still an NCAC football board as well???

As if Wabash fans taking over the football forum isn't bad enough, they then have to come in here and whine about how Wooster is the prevailing topic of conversation??? 

Again, give me a break...  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 26, 2013, 11:43:11 AM
WOW! Dude, can you dial back the persecution complex?

Look at the football board now - we're all in on Witt now.

Over there, we welcome and encourage (well, most of us) posters from all teams. We've received some good discussion from a couple of Allegheny posters. We always try to discuss, at least a bit, each team in the league, if you go back a couple of months you'll see that's the case. We've discussed OWU's issues - the hope for Hiram - Denison and Wooster having some decent teams this year. Yeah, lots of Wabash talk - but most all of us are open and do chime in on the other teams in the league.

All I was trying to do was bring updates on the OTHER teams in OUR league, especially now since I live on the west coast and don't have much access to information, or time.

So, please, leave your martyr act by the wayside. It's unbecoming, petulant, and enhances the perception that there shall be no other talk but Wooster talk here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 26, 2013, 12:13:25 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 26, 2013, 11:43:11 AM
WOW! Dude, can you dial back the persecution complex?

Look at the football board now - we're all in on Witt now.

Over there, we welcome and encourage (well, most of us) posters from all teams. We've received some good discussion from a couple of Allegheny posters. We always try to discuss, at least a bit, each team in the league, if you go back a couple of months you'll see that's the case. We've discussed OWU's issues - the hope for Hiram - Denison and Wooster having some decent teams this year. Yeah, lots of Wabash talk - but most all of us are open and do chime in on the other teams in the league.

All I was trying to do was bring updates on the OTHER teams in OUR league, especially now since I live on the west coast and don't have much access to information, or time.

So, please, leave your martyr act by the wayside. It's unbecoming, petulant, and enhances the perception that there shall be no other talk but Wooster talk here.

Please.  Lose the holier than thou bs.  If you are so righteous, why the need to snidely point out that this is an NCAC board???  That's all I was pointing out?!  Your little comment came off as a tad snide to say the least.  Especially given the history of some of your fellow Wabash followers and how much you all seem to get bent when your team doesn't dominate the discussion.   ::)

And I'm sorry, but sifting through 10 pages of Wabash drivel on the Wabash Football, errrrrrrr, NCAC Football Forum to find a couple of comments on other teams doesn't really strike me as encouraging other posters of other teams.  Precisely why I can count on two fingers the number of times I've posted in that forum in the last 2-3 years?!  Oh, and I'm sure some of your Wabash brethren would have not taken any offense had I made some similar snide comment reminding everyone that the football forum is an NCAC forum either...  ::)  I would probably see my smite count increase by about 100 in less than 5 minutes...  :-*
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 26, 2013, 01:00:00 PM
It wasn't a snide remark...at all. You should know better from me. I'm appalled and flabbergasted.

And don't denigrate the football board if you haven't been over there recently and seen the ebb and flow of the conversation during the season. There's definitely a crew that's talking about other teams a lot. We've gotten good OWU discussion and others have chimed in. I did see one post from you - and a reply was from a Wabash man saying the WITT guy (of all things) should be COY. Except for a rogue or two (and they always get slapped down by most of us), it's a lot more welcoming to others than it used to be.

I think you should be the same here - and not be a smarmy, sarcastic one. We have OWU posters there and not here. We have Gheny posters there and not here. We actually had a Hiram poster there for a while until their season went asunder. Not here. Hmmm...

Don't put us all in the same boat - because I can really unload about some biases and pretentions over here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 26, 2013, 02:19:34 PM
I felt no sarcasm in Smedindy's remark.  Personally, I'm happy with the comparative peace that has settled in here in the last season or two.  (Once we finally got rid of that Collinge... ;))  I just wish that we had more posters, across the spectrum of the conference.  Instead of gaining contributors, we seem to slowly be losing them, and that's unfortunate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 26, 2013, 09:10:00 PM
Final: #25 DePauw 80  Mt. St. Joseph 74

Nice win for the DePauw Tigers as they advance to 4-0 on the season.  DePauw was led tonight by Pat Haggin with 26 points, Adam Botts with 17 and Tommy Fernitz with 17.

Mt. St. Joes was 3-0 and had beat Wilmington which knocked off D1 Miami University so this is a quality win for DePauw.

Always nice to see a NCAC team pick up another quality non-conference win!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 26, 2013, 09:26:42 PM
6:51 Left at the Shirk in Bloomington, IL:  #7 Illinois Wesleyan 53  Wabash 49

Little Giants are hanging tough on the road late in the 2nd Half against Illinois Wesleyan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 26, 2013, 09:45:22 PM
Final: #7 Illinois Wesleyan 68  Wabash 57

Little Giants played a competitive road game tonight against the #7 team (?) in the country.  Wabash trailed by only 6 points (59-53) with less than 5 minutes to play.  Titans made some late free throws for the final margin of 11 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on November 26, 2013, 10:21:04 PM
Glad to see the LGs play a competitive game with IWU but 0-4 feels pretty bad. The next 4 games for Wabash are RHIT, Witt, Oberlin, and Wooster. Wabash's best case there seems to be 1-3, for a 1-7 start. Ouch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 26, 2013, 10:49:24 PM
Yeah, the big question is how the LGs can come back from being 0-4, though the result tonight seems encouraging.

Good win for DPU. I can't believe I just said that...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2013, 08:13:40 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 39  Marietta 37

Close game at Marietta with Wooster holding a narrow lead.  Scots being led by Doug Thorpe with 14 points and Xavier Brown also with 14 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2013, 09:17:25 PM
Final:  #3 Wooster 81  #23 Marietta 78  :)

Huge road win for Wooster as they knock off a 4-0 Marietta team!

Scots were led tonight by Doug Thorpe with 21 points, Xavier Brown with 20 points, freshman Dan Fanelly with 10 points and Josh Kipfer also with 10 points.  Kenny DeBoer also made a critical driving layup with 20 seconds left in the game to put Wooster up by 4 points.

Wooster took good care of the ball with only 11 turnovers vs. 15 for the Pioneers.  Scots also made 85% of their free throws which was key in this tight game where the biggest lead all night was only 6 points.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 27, 2013, 09:20:11 PM
Nice video, Marietta.  Early Black Friday on 1200 baud modems?  Worst image I've seen in a decade; blurry, artifacts all over.  Then, with seconds to go in the game, Marietta with the ball and down three, you GO OFF THE AIR?  Wow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 27, 2013, 09:20:30 PM
I'm still here, every once in a while.

Anyone notice that we have three top 25 teams this week? Wooster is at #3 (and just won at #23 Marietta), Wittenberg is #21, and DePauw is #25. OWU got 5 votes as well. Go us!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 27, 2013, 09:24:02 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 27, 2013, 09:20:11 PM
Nice video, Marietta.  Early Black Friday on 1200 baud modems?  Worst image I've seen in a decade; blurry, artifacts all over.  Then, with seconds to go in the game, Marietta with the ball and down three, you GO OFF THE AIR?  Wow.

worked fine for me.  Are you saying you missed the final shot hit the backboard and rim out?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 27, 2013, 09:26:28 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2013, 09:17:25 PM
Final:  #3 Wooster 81  #23 Marietta 78  :)

Huge road win for Wooster as they knock off a 4-0 Marietta team!

Really good finish with some clutch shots by both teams.  None bigger than Kenny DeBoer's layup with :20 left to put Wooster up 4.  Some great denial defense by Marietta kept the ball out of X. Brown's hands and in a little desperation DeBoer drove all the way out from beyond the 3 point line for the critical basket in traffic.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 29, 2013, 12:45:16 AM
Quote from: sac on November 27, 2013, 09:24:02 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 27, 2013, 09:20:11 PM
Nice video, Marietta.  Early Black Friday on 1200 baud modems?  Worst image I've seen in a decade; blurry, artifacts all over.  Then, with seconds to go in the game, Marietta with the ball and down three, you GO OFF THE AIR?  Wow.

worked fine for me.  Are you saying you missed the final shot hit the backboard and rim out?

Yes.  With about five seconds to go in the game, after one three-point attempt had been blocked, the video stopped, the Marietta logo appeared, and the OFF AIR indicator came on.  Apparently that didn't happen to you?  Plus my stream quality was horrible all game long.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 29, 2013, 12:48:33 AM
A nice doubleheader coming up at Wooster on Saturday, December 6th.  The opponent is DePauw; first the women, then the men.  1 PM and 3 PM.  The Wooster women are off to a 5-0 start, for the first time since the Wright brothers had a bicycle shop in Dayton.  Their schedule has been weak, but that has never stopped them from losing before.  If they can stay within 15-20 points of DePauw, that will be quite an accomplishment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 29, 2013, 11:05:25 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 27, 2013, 09:20:30 PM
I'm still here, every once in a while.

Anyone notice that we have three top 25 teams this week? Wooster is at #3 (and just won at #23 Marietta), Wittenberg is #21, and DePauw is #25. OWU got 5 votes as well. Go us!

This is definitely a 'have' and 'have-not' season in the NCAC - may not have the middle muddle as in the past more like "the race to stay in the tournament".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on November 29, 2013, 01:20:55 PM
After trailing at halftime, Wittenberg ended a three year drought against Otterbein, winning 77-97. Four starters scored 12+ points, with Zack Leahy leading the way with 18.  Scott Masin posted another double-double with 17 points and 10 rebounds. The Tigers shot an efficient 62 percent from the field in the second half.

Wittenberg moves to 4-1 on the season, but Wabash is next for the Tigers. Wittenberg never seems to play very well at Chadwick, and it looks like Wabash may have turned a corner. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 29, 2013, 02:34:55 PM
Quote from: Urban For Prez on November 29, 2013, 01:20:55 PM

Wittenberg moves to 4-1 on the season, but Wabash is next for the Tigers. Wittenberg never seems to play very well at Chadwick, and it looks like Wabash may have turned a corner. 


I agree that Chadwick can be a tough place to play, but a lot of that has to do with the teams that the LG's have fielded and its not looking like this year's squad is there yet. I don't think that I'd look for them to pick up win #1 against Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 03, 2013, 02:22:40 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on November 29, 2013, 02:34:55 PM
Quote from: Urban For Prez on November 29, 2013, 01:20:55 PM

Wittenberg moves to 4-1 on the season, but Wabash is next for the Tigers. Wittenberg never seems to play very well at Chadwick, and it looks like Wabash may have turned a corner. 


I agree that Chadwick can be a tough place to play, but a lot of that has to do with the teams that the LG's have fielded and its not looking like this year's squad is there yet. I don't think that I'd look for them to pick up win #1 against Witt.

Wabash fell 77-68 at RHIT last night to slip back to 0-5 for the season.  From what I've seen so far this year:
- Turnovers are even and not really out of control, blocks are high, rebounds aren't terrible given Wabash has missed 40 more shots than their opponents (-3.5 margin), steals are high, and despite a pretty significant disadvantage in FG%, the LGs are only making one less FG per game than their opponents.  So how do you get beat by 14.4 points per game?

- Holy moly Wabash is having a whale of a time defending without fouling.  Wabash opponents are shooting about 12 more foul shots per game than Wabash is and not surprisingly Wabash is getting outscored 24-11.8 every game at the foul line.  When you're not a great shooting team (and right now Wabash isn't), you just can't give away 12 points per game at the stripe.  A teeny bit of that discrepency is due to Wabash fouling late in a game a couiple of times, but in both of the games that I've watched start to finish (vs. RHIT and vs. Hanover) Wabash opponents were in the bonus very early in one or both halves.  Wabash is committing 26.4 fouls per game.  The next highest number in the conference is 21.4 fouls per game...five more fouls per game than anybody else in the league. 

I thought the offense looked a little more settled last night with Hodges back in the lineup and hopefully Wabash finds a little more efficiency on that end of the floor.  It's going to be tough for Wabash to find a lot of league wins shooting 40%.  0-5 stinks, but the good news is that they're still 0-0 in league play and have a chance to press the reset button a bit tomorrow night at home against Wittenberg and get to 1-0.  Here's hoping the LGs can build and improve and be relevant in February. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 04, 2013, 01:31:08 AM
I think the kids need to learn how to defend. Hopefully the shots will fall for Wabash, but if they don't - you can always win by playing good defense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 04, 2013, 08:12:57 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 39  Ohio Wesleyan 27

Good first half for the Scots in this road game!  Wooster is being led by Doug Thorpe with 10 points and Scott Purcell with 8 points.  Strong defense as the Scots held the Bishops to 39% shooting.  Wooster also made 5 three pointers in the first half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 04, 2013, 09:14:22 PM
Final:  Wooster 79  Ohio Wesleyan 71  :)

Terrific road win for Wooster at OWU.  Scots were led in scoring by Doug Thorpe with 18 points, freshman Dan Fanelly with 15 points (career high) and Kenny DeBoer with 13 points.  Wooster shot 51% from the floor and also made 10 of 20 three point shots.

Wooster is now 5-0, 2-0 NCAC.  ;D

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 04, 2013, 09:16:53 PM
Wabash falls to Witt 60-46.

Masin has 17 points and 9 boards for the Old Tigers. No Wabash player scored in double figures. The LGs shot just 29.4% from the floor and shot under 50 percent from the line. Oof.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 04, 2013, 09:18:20 PM
The other result that we have is that the New Tigers of DPU bested Denison 66-51. The Big Red are 2-0 in Washington State and o-fer in the Midwest!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2013, 09:30:28 PM
OWU was just 3 for 22 from the arc. Woeful three-point shooting has been the Bishops' Achilles heel for quite a while, it seems. I wonder why? You might blame the awful sight lines in Rickey, but Wooster hit ten threes tonight, as wsf has noted.

Without the bad outside shooting, OWU shot nearly 59% (27/46) and outrebounded the Scots 37-31 despite there being significantly more rebounds available on the Wesleyan end of the floor (OWU took 68 shots, missing 38, to Wooster's 47 and 23). On the Wooster offensive glass, OWU was dominant, grabbing 21 of 25 available caroms, whereas on the other end, OWU snatched 16 offensive boards (possible many of them being long caroms from errant threes) to Wooster's 27. All of this adds up, on paper, to a game OWU could have won if they could just hit threes with any regularity.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 04, 2013, 09:34:12 PM
A fairly sloppy game over in Greencastle with DPU pulling ahead on late shooting and rebounding.
Denison needs to finish better and keep up the defensive pressure through the end of the game to produce wins this season.  DPU could have utilized their height advantage a lot better.  Really a closer game than the score shows, but we have a long way to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 04, 2013, 09:38:13 PM
Watched my first Wooster game of the year today. Always good to see the Scots win but those final ten minutes were not pretty. The season is early. I'm sure the Scots will work out the kinks.

Shout out to the OWU cheerleaders. I thought they put on a decent show at the interval.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 04, 2013, 11:32:45 PM
For as good as Wooster was offensively in the 1st half, they may have been equally bad in the 2nd half.  They were allowing OWU far too much penetration resulting in a ton of easy looks.  Not to mention, as David touched on, they gave up way too many offensive boards which also resulted in far too many 2nd chance points. 

I think it could be argued that just as badly as OWU's perimeter shooting prevented them from winning, their offensive rebounding may have more than made up for their poor shooting.  Wooster was on the verge of breaking the game wide open flirting with a 20 point lead and if they do a better job of keeping the Bishops off of the offensive glass, I don't think the ending would have been as close as it was. 

Credit OWU for not quitting and fighting back from a big deficit.  But this was yet another nice win for the Scots in this young season.  They have been racking up some nice regional wins that should look real nice on their resume come tournament time. 8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 05, 2013, 11:01:27 AM
Kenyon edged Oberlin 64-63 and Hiram eased past Gheny 67-61 to complete last night's slate.

Wabash is now the only winless team in the NCAC (sigh...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoostAr on December 06, 2013, 05:52:57 PM
May have missed this topic at some point (if so I apologize for the rehashing)...does anyone know why Wooster is playing 2 GSAC schools in AZ??  Are they being paid??...if not, I don't understand why they would play non-NCAA opponents...these games certainly won't help with regional rankings at the end of the season. 

If they don't win the conference tourney these two games could cost them a national tourney bid.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 06, 2013, 06:11:00 PM
If Wooster takes care of business I think they're fine for a "C". They beat B/W and Wheaton, so that'll probably be two regional ranked wins (if those teams TCB, of course...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 06, 2013, 07:32:47 PM
I can't answer WoostAr's question with any authority, but I feel confident that the scheduling choice was some combination of a) wanting to have a "reward" trip for the team, which also helps with (basketball) recruiting down the line, b) pressure, or suggestion at least, from the administration to use a trip to help the college's national profile, which helps with (academic) recruiting down the line, and c), given a) and b), the difficulty of finding suitable D3 opposition who happen to be in the same snowbird locale at the same time, especially one willing to take on a very tough foe. Plus, as smeds points out, the Scots have a strong D3 non-conference schedule otherwise (Marietta, Hanover, and Thiel, in addition to Wheaton and B-W) and the general tide of quality within the NCAC is rising, so they could have reasoned that they could afford to not worry too much about those two particular dates.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 06, 2013, 08:07:47 PM
Regional Score of Interest:  Wheaton (IL) 80  Hope 61   Game was played at Calvin College in Michigan

Wooster's win over Wheaton is looking better with each additional win by the Thunder.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoostAr on December 06, 2013, 08:09:17 PM
Since when is Arizona a reward for anything? :)....at least play Westmont in Santa Barbara.

Administration (partially) dictating the schedule would make sense...but just pretend they had lost to either (or both) B/W and/or Wheaton (and those games were not gimmies), their schedule going forward would seem pretty bad right now. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 06, 2013, 11:52:27 PM
I know the two Arizona games don't count, but these opponents are no patsies and will give the Scots some nice experience.  Arizona Christian is 8-0 while Westmont is 5-2.  With the excellent pizza available in the area, I see the trip as a positive.  I'm still trying to convince my brother to make the five-minute drive to see the games, but his interest seems to be moderate at best.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 07, 2013, 12:01:44 AM
Quote from: WoostAr on December 06, 2013, 08:09:17 PM
Since when is Arizona a reward for anything? :)....at least play Westmont in Santa Barbara.

Or come to the D3hoops.com Classic. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2013, 06:52:10 PM
Wooster drops DePauw 64-48, behind a double-double (15/10) from frosh Dan Fannelly. Scots shot 42%, hitting just 5 threes, but once again was the recipient of miserable long-range shooting from their opponent, as the New Tigers hit a sickly 9%, 2/23, from the arc. DPU shot just 29% overall, hitting 14/32 (44%) inside the arc, and also missed 8 free throws (64%.) Wooster led by 13 at the half and never trailed in the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 07, 2013, 07:49:49 PM
Back from Timken where I watched Wooster lay some serious defense on the DePauw Tigers.  As David noted, DePauw only shot 29% from the floor but it was mostly due to Wooster players being in their face the entire game.  Several times, Wooster forced DePauw into off balance shots as the shot clock was winding down.

Freshman Dan Fanelly led the Scots this afternoon with his double/double and he is a special talent.  His 15 points included two big dunks (one after a steal that he made) that pumped up the crowd and the Wooster bench.  :)

Nice win by Wooster vs. the #24 ranked Tigers and DePauw is a team that should be a NCAC title contender.

Wooster is now 6-0, 3-0 NCAC  ;D  Next game is at Wabash on 12/14.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on December 07, 2013, 07:54:15 PM
 That was a exciting game at Denison today. Big Red gave the Bishops all they could handle and came up short at the end.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2013, 08:56:00 PM
Meanwhile,

Witt crunched Allegheny 86-58
Kenyon bested Hiram 73-66

And... :-[

Oberlin beat Wabash 79-62. The Yeomen were up 44-21 at the half. That's not going to get it done LG's. Wabash is 0-7 for the first time in, well, a long time. I wonder if the Snowy Simpson teams went 0-7.

But hey, our wrestling team won Little State!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 07, 2013, 10:39:00 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2013, 08:56:00 PM
Oberlin beat Wabash 79-62.

Wow.  Not exactly Cannonballs this season.  What's happened to them?  Young?  Disorganized?  I mean, the Yeoman don't lay that kind of a beating on anyone.  It's disconcerting.  If it provides any solace, I wasn't very impressed with this year's edition of DePauw either.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 09, 2013, 12:59:59 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 07, 2013, 10:39:00 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2013, 08:56:00 PM
Oberlin beat Wabash 79-62.

Wow.  Not exactly Cannonballs this season.  What's happened to them?  Young?  Disorganized?  I mean, the Yeoman don't lay that kind of a beating on anyone.  It's disconcerting.  If it provides any solace, I wasn't very impressed with this year's edition of DePauw either.

Young, can't shoot, trouble defending, and two of their best players joined late because of football.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 10, 2013, 11:34:54 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 09, 2013, 12:59:59 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 07, 2013, 10:39:00 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2013, 08:56:00 PM
Oberlin beat Wabash 79-62.

Wow.  Not exactly Cannonballs this season.  What's happened to them?  Young?  Disorganized?  I mean, the Yeoman don't lay that kind of a beating on anyone.  It's disconcerting.  If it provides any solace, I wasn't very impressed with this year's edition of DePauw either.

Young, can't shoot, trouble defending, and two of their best players joined late because of football.

I believe that they have players that can shoot.  Sponsler we know can score.  Oetting is a good player offensively.  Nicksic has picked up his offensive game this season.  I think they shoot such a low percentage because they have extreme difficulty getting good shots.  I don't see Wabash taking many shots that aren't either way out of range, challenged, or both. 

Wabash is also now -84 from the free throw line for the season...holding steady at -12 points per game from the stripe.  That's a lot of points to try and make up. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashgiant on December 11, 2013, 12:20:35 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 10, 2013, 11:34:54 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 09, 2013, 12:59:59 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 07, 2013, 10:39:00 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2013, 08:56:00 PM
Oberlin beat Wabash 79-62.

Wow.  Not exactly Cannonballs this season.  What's happened to them?  Young?  Disorganized?  I mean, the Yeoman don't lay that kind of a beating on anyone.  It's disconcerting.  If it provides any solace, I wasn't very impressed with this year's edition of DePauw either.

Young, can't shoot, trouble defending, and two of their best players joined late because of football.

I believe that they have players that can shoot.  Sponsler we know can score.  Oetting is a good player offensively.  Nicksic has picked up his offensive game this season.  I think they shoot such a low percentage because they have extreme difficulty getting good shots.  I don't see Wabash taking many shots that aren't either way out of range, challenged, or both. 

Wabash is also now -84 from the free throw line for the season...holding steady at -12 points per game from the stripe.  That's a lot of points to try and make up.

Surprised Woods isn't playing(Didn't see his name on the roster anyway) he was dunking as a freshman in high school at 6' tall and was probably the best defensive player in his high school league. Use to love watch him play basketball as he was very intense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 11, 2013, 02:11:20 PM
Quote from: bashgiant on December 11, 2013, 12:20:35 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 10, 2013, 11:34:54 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 09, 2013, 12:59:59 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 07, 2013, 10:39:00 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2013, 08:56:00 PM
Oberlin beat Wabash 79-62.

Wow.  Not exactly Cannonballs this season.  What's happened to them?  Young?  Disorganized?  I mean, the Yeoman don't lay that kind of a beating on anyone.  It's disconcerting.  If it provides any solace, I wasn't very impressed with this year's edition of DePauw either.

Young, can't shoot, trouble defending, and two of their best players joined late because of football.

I believe that they have players that can shoot.  Sponsler we know can score.  Oetting is a good player offensively.  Nicksic has picked up his offensive game this season.  I think they shoot such a low percentage because they have extreme difficulty getting good shots.  I don't see Wabash taking many shots that aren't either way out of range, challenged, or both. 

Wabash is also now -84 from the free throw line for the season...holding steady at -12 points per game from the stripe.  That's a lot of points to try and make up.

Surprised Woods isn't playing(Didn't see his name on the roster anyway) he was dunking as a freshman in high school at 6' tall and was probably the best defensive player in his high school league. Use to love watch him play basketball as he was very intense.

Justin Woods, I'm guessing?  He's obviously a great athlete and I'm sure he played all kinds of sports in high school.  That's what athletes do in high school...they play sports.  All of them.  It looks like Woods had one HS letter in basketball which is pretty light for college players.  The two guys playing football and basketball at Wabash now- Walsh and Hodges- had 4 and 3 HS basketball letters, respectively. 

Not at all saying that Justin couldn't play basketball or wouldn't be good at the game if he wanted to play it, but I'm not sure he totally fits the profile of a guy that winds up playing college basketball.  Especially when he's going to miss preseason camp and a part of the season for football, plus whatever academic commitments he may have...a second varsity level sport might not be his thing.  Or at least basketball.  A lot more guys from the football team are involved with Wabash's excellent T&F program. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 11, 2013, 03:04:04 PM
A little article about Arizona Christian, one of Wooster's opponents in Arizona, who is #6 in the first NAIA D1 poll.  It looks as if there will be video of this game.  The link is on the Arizona Christian schedule page.

http://www.acufirestorm.com/news/2013/12/10/MBB_1210135912.aspx
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 11, 2013, 03:38:10 PM
One d3hoops poll voters view

5 – Wooster – UP 3
I did make a big move with the Scots and moved them ahead of some teams because Wooster is clearly playing very good basketball. Wooster has failed to live up to expectations often, but the start to this season is worth noting. They have beat four teams who have been or are in the Top 25 or getting votes. In other words, they are beating good competition. They have another tough game against Wabash this week which will tell us plenty more before they head to Arizona for a few puff games.[/b]

0-7  Wabash ='s "tough game"

Nationally ranked NAIA I program ='s  "puff games"


PS  Westmont made the NAIA I National Tournament last season, they may not be quite that good this year but they are probably far from "puffy"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bashgiant on December 11, 2013, 06:45:34 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 11, 2013, 02:11:20 PM
Quote from: bashgiant on December 11, 2013, 12:20:35 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 10, 2013, 11:34:54 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 09, 2013, 12:59:59 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 07, 2013, 10:39:00 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2013, 08:56:00 PM
Oberlin beat Wabash 79-62.

Wow.  Not exactly Cannonballs this season.  What's happened to them?  Young?  Disorganized?  I mean, the Yeoman don't lay that kind of a beating on anyone.  It's disconcerting.  If it provides any solace, I wasn't very impressed with this year's edition of DePauw either.

Young, can't shoot, trouble defending, and two of their best players joined late because of football.

I believe that they have players that can shoot.  Sponsler we know can score.  Oetting is a good player offensively.  Nicksic has picked up his offensive game this season.  I think they shoot such a low percentage because they have extreme difficulty getting good shots.  I don't see Wabash taking many shots that aren't either way out of range, challenged, or both. 

Wabash is also now -84 from the free throw line for the season...holding steady at -12 points per game from the stripe.  That's a lot of points to try and make up.

Surprised Woods isn't playing(Didn't see his name on the roster anyway) he was dunking as a freshman in high school at 6' tall and was probably the best defensive player in his high school league. Use to love watch him play basketball as he was very intense.

Justin Woods, I'm guessing?  He's obviously a great athlete and I'm sure he played all kinds of sports in high school.  That's what athletes do in high school...they play sports.  All of them.  It looks like Woods had one HS letter in basketball which is pretty light for college players.  The two guys playing football and basketball at Wabash now- Walsh and Hodges- had 4 and 3 HS basketball letters, respectively. 

Not at all saying that Justin couldn't play basketball or wouldn't be good at the game if he wanted to play it, but I'm not sure he totally fits the profile of a guy that winds up playing college basketball.  Especially when he's going to miss preseason camp and a part of the season for football, plus whatever academic commitments he may have...a second varsity level sport might not be his thing.  Or at least basketball.  A lot more guys from the football team are involved with Wabash's excellent T&F program.

Yes, Justin Woods. Well I know he didn't play 2 years because of football injuries and I'm confident he would have lettered his senior season. Anyway he was fun to watch play, not many work as hard as he does on the court. Reading some of the post over time it sounds like studies could be a full time job at Wabash, so who knows.
Does Wabash have a red squad team in basketball like they do in football?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 11, 2013, 09:49:30 PM
It takes a special person to try to play both football and basketball. I remember Dustin Huff and Mike Russell tried and it didn't totally work out in the end. Spring sports are more likely to have dual sport athletes, and now that there's indoor track athletes can participate in that as well.

Some linemen back in the day used to wrestle as well as play football. I think that's easier to do.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 11, 2013, 09:51:44 PM
Traditionally, there is a JV program at Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 11, 2013, 11:29:27 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 11, 2013, 09:49:30 PM
Some linemen back in the day used to wrestle as well as play football. I think that's easier to do.

Big Daddy Lipscomb did it on the professional level. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on December 12, 2013, 08:53:10 AM
Remember Ryan Short starting on the  basketball team at Wabash as well as being an All-American tight end (well, that's how they listed him even though he was not a classic TE.)  At 6-5, 230 he threw some weight around on the hardwood.  Couldn't shoot though.  The best example ever at Wabash is Big Pete Metzelaars.  No doubt that he could do the same nowadays.
    Tre Taylor, a starter on the offensive line, and Patrick Tuck-Snelling,  who played a lot as a defensive lineman, are wrestling this year.  Taylor recently finished 3rd at heavyweight in the Little State meet, which Wabash won.   
     Alex Karras as a pro wrestler back in the day.   
     
     
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 12, 2013, 09:41:08 AM
Quote from: sigma one on December 12, 2013, 08:53:10 AM
Alex Karras as a pro wrestler back in the day.   

Karras' book, Mad Ducks and Bears, was hilarious.  I still remember one anecdote.  Both Karras and his best buddy, offensive lineman John Gordy, were noted for having horrible eyesight.  At the beginning of a game on a cold and snowy day, when both were injured and unlikely to play, the two took seats near the end of the bench.  After several minutes, Karras turned to Gordy and asked, "Hey, John, do you think we're facing the right way?"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2013, 07:05:18 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 12, 2013, 09:41:08 AMTraining dogs to deal with those pesky mailmen.

Hey!

Seriously, thanks to all for the civil conversation these past few days. It gives one hope.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on December 12, 2013, 09:45:09 PM
congrats Big Red, great win tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2013, 11:09:26 PM
Quote from: ohiofan1954 on December 12, 2013, 09:45:09 PM
congrats Big Red, great win tonight.
Denison 87, Capital 82

Earlier this week:
CWRU 78, Oberlin 68 (Mon)
Kenyon 80, Allegheny 75 (Tue)
Oberlin 63, Grove City 50 (Wed)
OWU 70, Anderson 59 (Wed)
RHIT 64, DePauw 61 (Wed)

Later this week:
Albion at Kenyon (Fri)
Wooster at Wabash (Sat)
OWU at Hiram (Sat)
Wittenberg at Denison (Sat)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 12, 2013, 11:11:26 PM
NCAC is 21-25 thus far in the non-conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 13, 2013, 08:24:59 PM
Quote from: sigma one on December 12, 2013, 08:53:10 AM
Remember Ryan Short starting on the  basketball team at Wabash as well as being an All-American tight end (well, that's how they listed him even though he was not a classic TE.)  At 6-5, 230 he threw some weight around on the hardwood.  Couldn't shoot though.  The best example ever at Wabash is Big Pete Metzelaars.  No doubt that he could do the same nowadays.   

In my day Kim King played both hoops and football for Wabash. He was pretty good at both. I think that was the last time it worked well for a Wabash player playing those two sports until Hodges and Walsh.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 13, 2013, 09:44:54 PM
Kenyon 76  Albion 71
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 14, 2013, 02:36:33 PM
What a horribly-played basketball game.  Any new viewers will be turned off to DIII basketball forever.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 14, 2013, 02:36:46 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 21  Wabash 20

Miserable shooting by both teams in the first half.  Doug Thorpe and Scott Purcell each with 5 points leading the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 14, 2013, 03:06:08 PM
DeBAUER?  PURSE-ell?  "Thorpe MIGHT BE the leading scorer on Wooster?"  Don't these two-bit idiots have ANY notes in front of them?  Not a chance.  Too busy formulating their stupid opinions to do even the tiniest bit of actual research.  Not to pick on Wabash, it's this way across all of DIII, including Wooster, with the exception of WQKT's Mike Breckenridge.  Totally amateurish, with no seeming desire to even approach professionalism.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 14, 2013, 03:29:57 PM
Final:  Wooster 54  Wabash 41  :)

Wooster played better in the second half especially freshman Dan Fanelly who was the leading scorer with 15 points (13 in the second half).  Scott Purcell added 12 points (3 three pointers) and Xavier Brown had 8 points.  Purcell was the only Wooster player to make a three pointer.  Scots won this game despite Thorpe and Brown both finishing with less than 10 points.

Wooster is now 7-0, 4-0 NCAC ;D  Next game is on Monday vs. NAIA Westmont in Phoenix on a neutral court.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 14, 2013, 03:54:02 PM
The difference in the ballgame was that Wooster had several fast break baskets off steals.  Most of these did come in the second half.  Otherwise, I saw no improvement.  Wooster's defense, or rebounding, was never the problem.  Their offense was a disaster.  The undefeated number two ranked team in the nation was held to a standstill by the zone defense of a winless Wabash team.  This version of the Scots still has no concept of how to attack a zone.  They hardly ever even tried to get the ball inside.  They had darned few good looks at the hoop, which is reflected in their shooting percentage.  They were very lucky they weren't playing a competent opponent tonight or they would have picked up their first loss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 14, 2013, 04:16:25 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 14, 2013, 03:06:08 PM
DeBAUER?  PURSE-ell?  "Thorpe MIGHT BE the leading scorer on Wooster?"  Don't these two-bit idiots have ANY notes in front of them?  Not a chance.  Too busy formulating their stupid opinions to do even the tiniest bit of actual research.  Not to pick on Wabash, it's this way across all of DIII, including Wooster, with the exception of WQKT's Mike Breckenridge.  Totally amateurish, with no seeming desire to even approach professionalism.
Mike Breckenridge is an exception, with very few peers nationwide (Rochester and Whitworth come to mind as having professional announcers.) We're SO lucky to have him here. But even WQKT is not entirely immune; the halftime news reader thought Wooster was playing a team called "Wuh-BASH." ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on December 14, 2013, 04:25:32 PM
Wittenberg is up big on Denison, 92-65, with three minutes left to go.  Amazing stat(s) of the day: Sam Collins and Scott Masin combined to go 15 for 15 from the field.  Masin scored 21 and Collins added 19.  Masin is shooting an astounding 67 percent from the field this year.  I thought he would be good, but he has exceeded my expectations. 

Wittenberg will travel to Thomas More to play the Saints in a week.  It's a shame they aren't having a better year; I assume Coach Brown scheduled the game believing they would be a quality non-conference opponent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 14, 2013, 05:12:30 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 14, 2013, 04:16:25 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 14, 2013, 03:06:08 PM
DeBAUER?  PURSE-ell?  "Thorpe MIGHT BE the leading scorer on Wooster?"  Don't these two-bit idiots have ANY notes in front of them?  Not a chance.  Too busy formulating their stupid opinions to do even the tiniest bit of actual research.  Not to pick on Wabash, it's this way across all of DIII, including Wooster, with the exception of WQKT's Mike Breckenridge.  Totally amateurish, with no seeming desire to even approach professionalism.
Mike Breckenridge is an exception, with very few peers nationwide (Rochester and Whitworth come to mind as having professional announcers.) We're SO lucky to have him here. But even WQKT is not entirely immune; the halftime news reader thought Wooster was playing a team called "Wuh-BASH." ::)

Yeah, there is no doubt that that guy is somebody's nephew.  Listening to him try to read is painful.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on December 14, 2013, 08:05:59 PM
how did #22 for Denison do today? He was big draining threes against capital that helped bring the big red back Thursday night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on December 14, 2013, 08:09:09 PM
A win is a win and I accept them all but that first half of the Wooster/Wabash game was ugly to put it lightly. The second half was slightly better but as we saw today, Wooster must figure out how to attack the zone quickly if we are to remain among the leaders in D3 basketball. Had Wabash matched Wooster from the charity stripe, we might be having a different conversation today.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 14, 2013, 09:00:49 PM
Meanwhile...

Ohio Wesleyan outlasts Hiram in OT 69-67. Hiram had a six point lead with just under four to go but didn't score again in regulation. Tough Terrier loss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 15, 2013, 10:48:25 PM
Wooster faces a strong team tomorrow night in Phoenix when they will play NAIA D1 Westmont College from California.  The Westmont Warriors are 8-2 on the season and have now won 7 games in a row after a 1-2 start.  Included in their 7 game win streak are victories over the only two D3 teams (Claremont Mudd Scripps & Pomona) that they have played.

Westmont is outrebounding their opponents by +13 per game due to their front line of 6'9", 6'7" and 6'5" players so Wooster will have to hit the boards hard.

Westmont Starters:
6'0" Billy Keller  9.9 ppg, 2.5 rpg
5'9" Brendan Hill 3.7 ppg, 2.9 rpg
6'7" Chris "CJ" Miller 18.3 ppg, 6.9 rpg
6'9" Daniel Carlin 10.6 ppg, 8.4 rpg
6'5" Jason Ritchey 12.2 ppg, 5.0 rpg

Westmont Key Reserves:
6'4"  Mantas Drungys  7.3 ppg, 3.4 rpg
6'4"  Kyle Gordon  5.4 ppg, 2.2 rpg
6'3"  Nate Marsing  4.5 ppg, 2.3 rpg
6'3"  Jared Wilson  3.1 ppg, 2.1 rpg

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on December 15, 2013, 11:28:38 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 15, 2013, 10:48:25 PM
Wooster faces a strong team tomorrow night in Phoenix when they will play NAIA D1 Westmont College from California.  The Westmont Warriors are 8-2 on the season and have now won 7 games in a row after a 1-2 start.  Included in their 7 game win streak are victories over the only two D3 teams (Claremont Mudd Scripps & Pomona) that they have played.

Westmont is outrebounding their opponents by +13 per game due to their front line of 6'9", 6'7" and 6'5" players so Wooster will have to hit the boards hard.

Westmont Starters:
6'0" Billy Keller  9.9 ppg, 2.5 rpg
5'9" Brendan Hill 3.7 ppg, 2.9 rpg
6'7" Chris "CJ" Miller 18.3 ppg, 6.9 rpg
6'9" Daniel Carlin 10.6 ppg, 8.4 rpg
6'5" Jason Ritchey 12.2 ppg, 5.0 rpg

Westmont Key Reserves:
6'4"  Mantas Drungys  7.3 ppg, 3.4 rpg
6'4"  Kyle Gordon  5.4 ppg, 2.2 rpg
6'3"  Nate Marsing  4.5 ppg, 2.3 rpg
6'3"  Jared Wilson  3.1 ppg, 2.1 rpg

GO SCOTS!

I'm interested to see how this one turns out.  Most matchups with NAIA D1 teams are tough, but especially those against a strong program like Westmont, from a strong NAIA D1 league.  Wooster vs Westmont on a neutral court sounds like about a "pick 'em" to me.

Then Wooster faces NAIA D1 #6 Arizona Christian the next night.  If Arizona Christian is really one of the best 10 teams in NAIA D1, the Scots are probably a 7-8 point underdog in that one.

These are great games but I'm not sure the D3 population here will recognize it.  It seems like most on the boards here either, a) don't know much about NAIA basketball, or b) kind of look down on it for some reason.  I wish we had more cool D3 vs NAIA matchups like these.


http://www.naia.org/ViewArticle.dbml?DB_OEM_ID=27900&ATCLID=209338061
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 16, 2013, 12:19:32 AM
Ok, yeah, so Westmont's bringing in Billy Keller.  Figured they might pull something like that.  Dude was tough, but he's gotta be in his sixties by now.  Thorpe can handle him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on December 16, 2013, 02:38:03 PM
Wooster Booster --- If Westmont brings Artis Gilmore or Dan Issel off the bench to play with Keller, the Scots could have some trouble....  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 16, 2013, 07:36:32 PM
Is anyone able to get the video feed of Westmont and Wooster? :(  I can only get the Live Stats, and even that's screwed up.  The level of incompetency in the workforce in this country is at an unbelievable level.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 16, 2013, 08:40:13 PM
It's coming in fine for me.  Ten minutes left and Westmont up 38-31.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 16, 2013, 09:02:32 PM
Since 38-31, Westmont forgets how to shoot and hang onto the ball, letting Wooster go on a 15-1 run.  Game is pretty much over with two minutes left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 16, 2013, 09:06:36 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 16, 2013, 07:36:32 PM
Is anyone able to get the video feed of Westmont and Wooster? :(  I can only get the Live Stats, and even that's screwed up.  The level of incompetency in the workforce in this country is at an unbelievable level.

Works fine for me, maybe your perceived incompetency isn't where you think it is?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 16, 2013, 09:08:04 PM
Final:  Wooster 53  Westmont 47  :)

Nice win by Wooster over a 8-2 NAIA D1 squad.  Scots played some good defense and were able to score down the stretch to notch the win.  Xavier Brown led Wooster with 21 points and Doug Thorpe added 8 points.  Scots were outrebounded by 11 but held Westmont to 15 of 40 shooting from the floor.

Wooster is now 8-0.  Tough opponent tomorrow night in Arizona Christian which is undefeated and ranked #6 nationally in NAIA D1, as Titan Q noted.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 16, 2013, 09:15:15 PM
Quote from: sac on December 16, 2013, 09:06:36 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 16, 2013, 07:36:32 PM
Is anyone able to get the video feed of Westmont and Wooster? :(  I can only get the Live Stats, and even that's screwed up.  The level of incompetency in the workforce in this country is at an unbelievable level.

Works fine for me, maybe your perceived incompetency isn't where you think it is?

The video did not work for the first ten minutes or so of the game, then it came on.  Shortly before it came on, they ran a trailer saying they were having technical difficulties then followed that with another apologizing for the delay.  So, I'm quite sure my perception of the incompetent party was correct.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 16, 2013, 09:21:05 PM
As was stated, Wooster was down 38-31 midway thru the 2nd half and then proceeded to go on a HUGE 17-1 run to put the game away!

Nice win over a very good NAIA opponent!

BTW, was it just me or did anyone else see #15 for Westmont as kind of a liability?  He was their point and he just seemed very stiff to me.  He turned the ball over at least 3 or 4 times alone during that run by the Scots including one where he was called for a 5 second violation by being guarded by just one man?  He didn't even have the where with all to call a freaking time out?  It was kind of amusing to watch...  8-)

Also Titan Q, thanks for the info on both Westmont and AC.  Count me in with the crowd that doesn't know much about NAIA.  After reading your post, and watching much of the game, I wasn't too confident the Scots would pull that one out tonight.  Honestly, with the size advantage Westmont enjoyed, they had no business letting the Scots go on such a huge run like they did.  I can't figure out why they didn't feed their big man the ball more inside.  Oh well, it ended up costing them and benefiting the Scots with a nice win. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 16, 2013, 09:23:27 PM
The video never came on for me, and the crawl never stopped apologizing for the technical difficulties.

I blame myself.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoostAr on December 17, 2013, 02:44:01 AM
Little bit of round about perspective.

Westmont has beaten Claremont McKenna and Pomona pitzer this year. Pomona took down st Thomas (I'm sure we're all familiar with them) and then Claremont took down Pomona. Both great NCAA teams.

For Wooster to beat them this year is quite an achievement.

Arizona Christian has played a couple softies out west that I'm familiar with (Bethesda and chapman).  They won those games handily. Tomorrow should be fun!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 17, 2013, 10:17:39 AM
AC is looking like they are going to be a very tough out for Wooster tonight.  They have size with a 6'10" center shooting 78% from the field.  And believe it or not, he's not their leading scorer.  In fact, he's not even averaging double digits in scoring.  In fact, AC has only ONE player averaging double digits in scoring and that is Talib Uqdah.  He is a sharp soothing guard Whois shooting over 50% from beyond the arc.

I think the Scots are going to have to play close to flawless to win tonight...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 17, 2013, 10:43:18 AM
The one consistent factor with this Wooster team of the last two-three seasons has been defense.  It's almost always good or very good, and sometimes it's excellent.  Last night, in the second half, it was the latter.  It wasn't just that Westmont cooled off, Wooster cooled them off.  The turnovers were forced turnovers, and often led directly to points.  That's a good thing, because Wooster's offense is still very dicey even against teams that are struggling.  (See Wabash, Giants, Little.)

Wooster has also been the recipient of some rather amazing good fortune.  Their opponents are shooting a whopping 59.4% from the line!  Eh?  Yep, true enough.  That includes the Little Giants' 6-18 and Westmont's 12-26.  Those are abysmal numbers even for middle schools.  Keep it up!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 17, 2013, 11:27:28 AM
I grew up around NAIA hoops.  The team from my hometown, Oregon Tech, has been a very good team over the last 15 or so years now having won three national championships since 2004 and having played for one more in 1998 or somewhere thereabouts.  My sense of NAIA vs. D3 is that bad D3s will probably get smacked around by even the bad NAIAs but the good-to-very-good D3s can play with just about anybody in NAIA.  During the Estelle/Latham/Tabor late 90s years at Wabash my sense was that Wabash vs. Oregon Tech would have been a very good game.  Not so much since then as Oregon Tech has continued to excel and Wabash hasn't acheived nearly as much as those teams in the late 90s (with the exception of the 10-11 and 11-12 LG squads which I think were very good teams that unfortunately just missed out on the tournament). 

For Wooster, if they are a top 5-ish D3 team (and the pollsters think they are), then they aren't out of their league in these games down in the desert despite all of the Holtzing happening here.  It's a very good challenge for sure, but we're not talking about crazy wicked upsets if Wooster completes the sweep.  The unfortunate thing is that, as has been alluded to, there aren't a whole lot of people that will recognize the quality of those wins.  Aside from upcoming games with Wittenberg, these are probably two of the better wins Wooster can get this season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 17, 2013, 11:53:38 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 17, 2013, 11:27:28 AM
I grew up around NAIA hoops.  The team from my hometown, Oregon Tech, has been a very good team over the last 15 or so years now having won three national championships since 2004 and having played for one more in 1998 or somewhere thereabouts.  My sense of NAIA vs. D3 is that bad D3s will probably get smacked around by even the bad NAIAs but the good-to-very-good D3s can play with just about anybody in NAIA.  During the Estelle/Latham/Tabor late 90s years at Wabash my sense was that Wabash vs. Oregon Tech would have been a very good game.  Not so much since then as Oregon Tech has continued to excel and Wabash hasn't acheived nearly as much as those teams in the late 90s (with the exception of the 10-11 and 11-12 LG squads which I think were very good teams that unfortunately just missed out on the tournament). 

For Wooster, if they are a top 5-ish D3 team (and the pollsters think they are), then they aren't out of their league in these games down in the desert despite all of the Holtzing happening here.  It's a very good challenge for sure, but we're not talking about crazy wicked upsets if Wooster completes the sweep.  The unfortunate thing is that, as has been alluded to, there aren't a whole lot of people that will recognize the quality of those wins.  Aside from upcoming games with Wittenberg, these are probably two of the better wins Wooster can get this season.

I completely agree with your assessment of NAIA teams vs DIII teams.  Not so sure I agree with the pollsters that now have Wooster second in the country.  I see them as more in the 8-12 range.  One big physical post player capable of scoring 10-12 a game would change my opinion, but they don't have that.

I see Arizona Christian as a 7-10 point favorite on their court.  Beating them would be an upset, but not above-the-fold in the Times.  Still, this might be the toughest match-up Wooster has all season, unless they're fortunate enough to reach the elite eight in the tournament.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: realist on December 17, 2013, 01:04:34 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 16, 2013, 09:23:27 PM
The video never came on for me, and the crawl never stopped apologizing for the technical difficulties.

I blame myself.
Don't beat yourself up too much.  I have learned over the past years when I encounter this type of difficulty to switch browsers.  Sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't, but some of the streams don't like IE, and they really don't like some isp's like aol.  A word of caution is be careful when you log into these sites if they "advise/require" you to download a "program update".   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 17, 2013, 01:40:46 PM
Quote from: realist on December 17, 2013, 01:04:34 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 16, 2013, 09:23:27 PM
The video never came on for me, and the crawl never stopped apologizing for the technical difficulties.

I blame myself.
Don't beat yourself up too much.  I have learned over the past years when I encounter this type of difficulty to switch browsers.  Sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't, but some of the streams don't like IE, and they really don't like some isp's like aol.  A word of caution is be careful when you log into these sites if they "advise/require" you to download a "program update".
Thanks. I took a different approach--when it failed to load, I quickly stopped caring.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 17, 2013, 04:17:57 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 17, 2013, 11:53:38 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 17, 2013, 11:27:28 AM
I grew up around NAIA hoops.  The team from my hometown, Oregon Tech, has been a very good team over the last 15 or so years now having won three national championships since 2004 and having played for one more in 1998 or somewhere thereabouts.  My sense of NAIA vs. D3 is that bad D3s will probably get smacked around by even the bad NAIAs but the good-to-very-good D3s can play with just about anybody in NAIA.  During the Estelle/Latham/Tabor late 90s years at Wabash my sense was that Wabash vs. Oregon Tech would have been a very good game.  Not so much since then as Oregon Tech has continued to excel and Wabash hasn't acheived nearly as much as those teams in the late 90s (with the exception of the 10-11 and 11-12 LG squads which I think were very good teams that unfortunately just missed out on the tournament). 

For Wooster, if they are a top 5-ish D3 team (and the pollsters think they are), then they aren't out of their league in these games down in the desert despite all of the Holtzing happening here.  It's a very good challenge for sure, but we're not talking about crazy wicked upsets if Wooster completes the sweep.  The unfortunate thing is that, as has been alluded to, there aren't a whole lot of people that will recognize the quality of those wins.  Aside from upcoming games with Wittenberg, these are probably two of the better wins Wooster can get this season.

I completely agree with your assessment of NAIA teams vs DIII teams.  Not so sure I agree with the pollsters that now have Wooster second in the country.  I see them as more in the 8-12 range.  One big physical post player capable of scoring 10-12 a game would change my opinion, but they don't have that.

I see Arizona Christian as a 7-10 point favorite on their court.  Beating them would be an upset, but not above-the-fold in the Times.  Still, this might be the toughest match-up Wooster has all season, unless they're fortunate enough to reach the elite eight in the tournament.

Thanks for the added NAIA insight Wally.  I'm not trying to suggest that tonight's matchup is a David vs. Goliath type of matchup as I think Wooster is more than capable of playing with AC.  I just feel like it will take them playing one of their best games to date if they have any chance of winning this game.

And good point about Wooster's defensive prowess over the past few seasons WooBoo.  No question it was Wooster's defense that keyed that run last night and if they hope to win tonight, they may need to bring that defensive intensity for the full 40 minutes.

Oh, and I also agree with WooBoo's take on Wooster's ranking.  I see them about where they were to start the season in the 8-10 range.  But to be fair, Wooster has played one of the toughest non-conference schedules out there which includes wins over 2 teams currently ranked in the top 25 and 3 wins over teams receiving votes in the top 25.  And one could argue that Westmont may have been the best team Wooster has beaten thus far as well so that win should not be diminished because of the fact that they are NAIA.  So you certainly can't argue that the Scots haven't earned their ranking at least.  And if Wooster somehow finds a way to pull off the upset tonight, I may just start buying into their lofty ranking... 8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 17, 2013, 04:27:49 PM
Quote from: realist on December 17, 2013, 01:04:34 PM
Don't beat yourself up too much.  I have learned over the past years when I encounter this type of difficulty to switch browsers.  Sometimes it works, and sometimes it doesn't, but some of the streams don't like IE, and they really don't like some isp's like aol.  A word of caution is be careful when you log into these sites if they "advise/require" you to download a "program update".

Agreed about the switching browsers.  I rarely use IE anymore when trying to stream live video.  IE just seems like too much of a PITA when trying to stream videos, especially live ones.  Most of the time I'm on Safari and it seems to work fine.  Lately, if I'm motivated enough, I hook up our USB adaptor to our MacBook and watch the streams on the flat screen.  Or if I'm not motivated, I'll just watch it on our iPad.  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 17, 2013, 04:51:06 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 17, 2013, 10:17:39 AM
AC is looking like they are going to be a very tough out for Wooster tonight.  They have size with a 6'10" center shooting 78% from the field.  And believe it or not, he's not their leading scorer.  In fact, he's not even averaging double digits in scoring.  In fact, AC has only ONE player averaging double digits in scoring and that is Talib Uqdah.  He is a sharp soothing guard Whois shooting over 50% from beyond the arc.

I think the Scots are going to have to play close to flawless to win tonight...

Talib Uqdah is 31 years old, he graduated high school in 2000
http://www.acufirestorm.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=564&path=mbball
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 17, 2013, 05:49:56 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 17, 2013, 11:27:28 AM
I grew up around NAIA hoops.  The team from my hometown, Oregon Tech, has been a very good team over the last 15 or so years now having won three national championships since 2004 and having played for one more in 1998 or somewhere thereabouts.  My sense of NAIA vs. D3 is that bad D3s will probably get smacked around by even the bad NAIAs but the good-to-very-good D3s can play with just about anybody in NAIA.  During the Estelle/Latham/Tabor late 90s years at Wabash my sense was that Wabash vs. Oregon Tech would have been a very good game.  Not so much since then as Oregon Tech has continued to excel and Wabash hasn't acheived nearly as much as those teams in the late 90s (with the exception of the 10-11 and 11-12 LG squads which I think were very good teams that unfortunately just missed out on the tournament). 

For Wooster, if they are a top 5-ish D3 team (and the pollsters think they are), then they aren't out of their league in these games down in the desert despite all of the Holtzing happening here.  It's a very good challenge for sure, but we're not talking about crazy wicked upsets if Wooster completes the sweep.  The unfortunate thing is that, as has been alluded to, there aren't a whole lot of people that will recognize the quality of those wins.  Aside from upcoming games with Wittenberg, these are probably two of the better wins Wooster can get this season.

I think it depends on if they are NAIA-I or NAIA-2. Westmont is NAIA-1 as is Arizona Christian.

Currently, D-3 as a whole are 10-12 vs. NAIA-1 and 42-43 vs. NAIA-2. It's tracked on the D3 vs. D1/D2/NAIA/NCCAA board.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 17, 2013, 06:20:05 PM
Quote from: sac on December 17, 2013, 04:51:06 PM
Talib Uqdah is 31 years old, he graduated high school in 2000
http://www.acufirestorm.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=564&path=mbball
What an interesting dude. I bet his biography is fascinating. More power to him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 17, 2013, 08:32:21 PM
Arizona Christian beat Spring Arbor (5-8) last night by 10. Spring Arbor, a frequent opponent of Hope and Calvin (but not this year, for whatever reason), lost at Albion in November, 51-50. The Britons stand at 5-3 (about to be 6-3 when they finish murdering Earlham tonight) including a five-point loss at Kenyon.

Which is another way of saying, meh.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 17, 2013, 08:45:55 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 17, 2013, 08:32:21 PM
Arizona Christian beat Spring Arbor (5-8) last night by 10. Spring Arbor, a frequent opponent of Hope and Calvin (but not this year, for whatever reason), lost at Albion in November, 51-50. The Britons stand at 5-3 (about to be 6-3 when they finish murdering Earlham tonight) including a five-point loss at Kenyon.

Which is another way of saying, meh.

Calvin and Spring Arbor have played very infrequently, in fact I can't remember the last time that happened. 

Spring Arbor typically plays Albion which is about 10 miles away and founded by practically the same people.  You are more accurate about Hope/Spring Arbor.   To further your 'meh' point, SAU is in a rebuilding year after graduating a good chunk of last years team.

Carry on!    ;) :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 17, 2013, 08:52:31 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 17, 2013, 08:32:21 PM
Arizona Christian beat Spring Arbor (5-8) last night by 10. Spring Arbor, a frequent opponent of Hope and Calvin (but not this year, for whatever reason), lost at Albion in November, 51-50. The Britons stand at 5-3 (about to be 6-3 when they finish murdering Earlham tonight) including a five-point loss at Kenyon.

Which is another way of saying, meh.

LOL!   :)

Westmont is up 19 on SAU btw.  Also, I think that final score of the AC/SAU game wasn't as close as the final score indicated.  Westmont was up by almost 20 at one point and led by 14+ the majority of the game. 


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 17, 2013, 09:11:55 PM
Maybe I was confusing Spring Arbor with Cornerstone. Those southern Michigan NAIAs are all the same to me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 17, 2013, 10:12:57 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 40  Arizona Christian 26

Wooster played a very crisp first half with strong defense.  Scots also hit a number of three point shots.  Live Stats don't appear to be working but I believe that Xavier Brown led the Scots in scoring for the half and he also had a nice steal for a breakaway layup.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 17, 2013, 10:25:02 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 17, 2013, 10:12:57 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 40  Arizona Christian 26

Wooster played a very crisp first half with strong defense.  Scots also hit a number of three point shots.  Live Stats don't appear to be working but I believe that Xavier Brown led the Scots in scoring for the half and he also had a nice steal for a breakaway layup.

I also have been unable to get live stats working - too bad because they were working last night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 17, 2013, 10:55:59 PM
Sure wish I could see the clock...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 17, 2013, 11:11:27 PM
Heckuva comeback for ACU, who were down 19 at one point of the second half. Nothing dropping for the Scots right now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 17, 2013, 11:14:13 PM
Final:  Arizona Christian 62  Wooster 60

Tough road loss for Wooster against a strong NAIA team.  Key stretch in the second half when Arizona Christian outscored Wooster 20-3 (score went from 50-31 Wooster to 53-51 Wooster).  Scots had too many possessions in the second half when they came up empty.  Wooster only scored 20 points total in the second half and missed a number of free throws that could have made a difference in the outcome.

Wooster is now 8-1.  Next game is against Thiel in the Wooster Mose Hole Classic on 12/29.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 17, 2013, 11:18:58 PM
Jesus, these media people are idiots.  Can you please show the clock ONCE besides during halftime?  And how does Arizona Christian get away with having twenty or thirty CLEAN BLOCKS on the inside IN THE SECOND HALF?  It's no wonder these schools aren't in the NCAA, it's because they get away with murder on the court.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 17, 2013, 11:35:23 PM
Tough loss, but it could be a good thing in the end.  Brings them back down to Earth a bit?  If you're going to lose, might as well be a game that means absolutely nothing in the eyes of the NCAA.  Needless to say though, that loss is gonna make for a loooong flight home as blowing a 19 point 2nd half lead is a very tough pill to swallow regardless of how talented ACU was.

One concern I have for this team so far this season is their ability to close a game out.  They had HUGE 2nd half leads vs. Wheaton, OWU and now tonight vs. ACU and those are just off the top of my head as there may have been others.  And in each of those games, Wooster struggled down the stretch allowing each of those teams back in the game late. Hell, I was waiting for the 2nd half collapse when they played DePauw, but it never came.  The Socts were fortunate to come out on the winning end vs. Wheaton and OWU, but their luck ran out tonight as ACU's only lead of the game came at the end of the game.  They've got to figure out how to finish and put teams away when they have the chance.  It's almost like they forget what they were doing to build the lead they had and go into some sort of shell where they're just settling for poor shots.  Not good...

Back to tonight's game, correct me if I'm wrong, but did Wooster even make a fg over the last 5 minutes or so?  Of course it could have been more as I'm guessing on the time because we never got to see the clock  >:(, but it seemed like they ended the game on a significant drought in fg's made.  The only scoring they were doing that I could tell was at the line.  Bad time to go cold from the field and it was punctuated with Thorpe's missed 3 at the end that was more than halfway down and rimmed out?!   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 17, 2013, 11:39:17 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 17, 2013, 11:18:58 PM
Jesus, these media people are idiots.  Can you please show the clock ONCE besides during halftime?  And how does Arizona Christian get away with having twenty or thirty CLEAN BLOCKS on the inside IN THE SECOND HALF?  It's no wonder these schools aren't in the NCAA, it's because they get away with murder on the court.

I'm guessing those were NAIA officials?  Yet another advantage of playing at home for ACU as I don't see them getting away with most of that crap had that game been played at Timken with NCAA officials for the game...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 18, 2013, 05:23:39 PM
I think it is worth considering the week that the Scots have had, it may have played a role in last night's second half collapse.
(I'm assuming some of this, but it must be pretty close to accurate.)

Friday: the long, snowy drive to Crawfordsville.
Saturday: Game at Wabash, followed by the long, snowy drive back to Wooster
Sunday: Bus to airport, fly to Phoenix, doubtless an all-day affair with a layover somewhere
Monday: Game vs. Westmont
Tuesday: Game at ACU

I wouldn't be surprised if they were pretty tired by the second half last night. Tired legs can kill your defense, and tired arms can kill your jumpshot, and when that happens against a good, better-rested team, bad things can happen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 18, 2013, 07:28:53 PM
I agree with you, David.  I watched the Westmont game and thought they were very sluggish on defense.  They mustered the energy and torqued up the defense in the last ten minutes of the game to get the win, but up until then, they weren't challenging the ball like they normally would. 

I turned off the ACU game thinking they had it in the bag, but they must have lost their legs at the end.  Lets see what impact their first loss has on them . . .
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 18, 2013, 08:35:52 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 18, 2013, 05:23:39 PM
I think it is worth considering the week that the Scots have had, it may have played a role in last night's second half collapse.
(I'm assuming some of this, but it must be pretty close to accurate.)

Friday: the long, snowy drive to Crawfordsville.
Saturday: Game at Wabash, followed by the long, snowy drive back to Wooster
Sunday: Bus to airport, fly to Phoenix, doubtless an all-day affair with a layover somewhere
Monday: Game vs. Westmont
Tuesday: Game at ACU

I wouldn't be surprised if they were pretty tired by the second half last night. Tired legs can kill your defense, and tired arms can kill your jumpshot, and when that happens against a good, better-rested team, bad things can happen.

Good point.  Not to mention, the week before the Wabash game was finals week for Wooster which can be quite grueling in and of itself.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on December 18, 2013, 10:09:30 PM
Quote from: sac on December 17, 2013, 08:45:55 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 17, 2013, 08:32:21 PM
Arizona Christian beat Spring Arbor (5-8) last night by 10. Spring Arbor, a frequent opponent of Hope and Calvin (but not this year, for whatever reason), lost at Albion in November, 51-50. The Britons stand at 5-3 (about to be 6-3 when they finish murdering Earlham tonight) including a five-point loss at Kenyon.

Which is another way of saying, meh.

Calvin and Spring Arbor have played very infrequently, in fact I can't remember the last time that happened. 

Spring Arbor typically plays Albion which is about 10 miles away and founded by practically the same people.  You are more accurate about Hope/Spring Arbor.   To further your 'meh' point, SAU is in a rebuilding year after graduating a good chunk of last years team.

Carry on!    ;) :)

Spring Arbor came to the Calvin tipoff tournament in the fall of 2008 (they beat Baldwin Wallace then lost to Calvin). I think they played maybe one other time in the last ten years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 19, 2013, 12:22:40 AM
I don't think there's much of a difference, if any, between refs at NAIA and NCAA D-3 level (or D-2 even). May be from the same pool. I really can't tell the difference between NCAC refs and GNAC refs in ANY sport.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 19, 2013, 08:20:24 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 19, 2013, 12:22:40 AM
I don't think there's much of a difference, if any, between refs at NAIA and NCAA D-3 level (or D-2 even). May be from the same pool. I really can't tell the difference between NCAC refs and GNAC refs in ANY sport.  ;)

So you're saying they're all equally bad?   :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on December 19, 2013, 03:13:38 PM
That would be correct (smedindy that is). I know several officials who work Heartland Collegiate Athletic Conference basketball games one night and will work Marian University (Indianapolis NAIA school) games the next night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 21, 2013, 10:14:05 PM
Wittenberg, up to #11 in the D3hoops.com poll, drops Thomas More 87-70.
Wabash gets off the schneid, squeaking past Trine 67-65 in overtime.
No time to celebrate for the LGs, as they must gear up for IU-Dabney tomorrow. The Fighting Colemans are reputed to usually have a sour disposition and a sarcastic demeanor.
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fecx.images-amazon.com%2Fimages%2FI%2F41k4Imsi6ML.jpg&hash=241096ce1d829a784179c498ee0a5a58bee878a0)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on December 21, 2013, 11:29:11 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 21, 2013, 10:14:05 PM
Wittenberg, up to #11 in the D3hoops.com poll, drops Thomas More 87-70.
Wabash gets off the schneid, squeaking past Trine 67-65 in overtime.
No time to celebrate for the LGs, as they must gear up for IU-Dabney tomorrow. The Fighting Colemans are reputed to usually have a sour disposition and a sarcastic demeanor.
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fecx.images-amazon.com%2Fimages%2FI%2F41k4Imsi6ML.jpg&hash=241096ce1d829a784179c498ee0a5a58bee878a0)

I made a Dabney Coleman joke offline earlier. Great minds, eh?

I don't believe this "Indiana Dabney" is related in any way to IU, however. It appears to be a private nursing school for "non-traditional" students. Which makes me think of the "Florence Nightengale" reference in the water-volleyball game in "Meet the Parents".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 22, 2013, 12:18:21 AM
Yep, not related in any way to Indiana University.

My favorite Dabney movie quote: "He's got balls the size of church bells..."

Fernando Bowie is the head coach for the men. Insert ABBA jokes here.

No truth to the rumor that Wabash tried to schedule Greendale. The Human Beings were too busy trying to prank City College to grab another game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Joe Wally on December 26, 2013, 02:14:04 PM
What happened with the Fighting Dabneys?  No Contest?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on December 26, 2013, 05:52:43 PM
Lost in transit.  Word is they showed up in Wabash, Indiana, looking for the College.  No Dabs at game time.  No Dabs during the next hour.  Nor the next.  Referees from Ohio thought they waited long enough and decided to go home.  Game declared no contest after discussion with Wabash.  Refs, team, fans dispersed.  One guess who walked through the front doors of the Allen Center not long after.
     Folks, there is a Wabash College; there is a Wabash, Indiana; there is a Wabash River; there is a Wabash Valley College (two year).  None of them are all that close to one another.  For future reference:  Wabash College is in Crawfordsville, Indiana.
     I was there to see the game, sat and stood around, said my holiday greetings to the fans and players I know, and was walking out of the building when the Dab's came in.  I didn't stick around to hear or see the rest of the story. 
     
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 26, 2013, 06:01:26 PM
Wow. Not sure what the home state of the refs has to do with anything, but otherwise...wow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Joe Wally on December 27, 2013, 08:24:25 AM
Quote from: sigma one on December 26, 2013, 05:52:43 PM
Lost in transit.  Word is they showed up in Wabash, Indiana, looking for the College.  No Dabs at game time.  No Dabs during the next hour.  Nor the next.  Referees from Ohio thought they waited long enough and decided to go home.  Game declared no contest after discussion with Wabash.  Refs, team, fans dispersed.  One guess who walked through the front doors of the Allen Center not long after.
     Folks, there is a Wabash College; there is a Wabash, Indiana; there is a Wabash River; there is a Wabash Valley College (two year).  None of them are all that close to one another.  For future reference:  Wabash College is in Crawfordsville, Indiana.
     I was there to see the game, sat and stood around, said my holiday greetings to the fans and players I know, and was walking out of the building when the Dab's came in.  I didn't stick around to hear or see the rest of the story. 
     

When I attended Wabash in the late '80s there was a story about a similar thing having happened to to a football team coming down to play the Little Giants and getting lost somewhere in Wabash County.

In the pre-internet era I suppose that I could see it happening, but in this day and age with all of the different on-line mapping capabilities, it makes no sense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 27, 2013, 11:18:11 AM
Quote from: sigma one on December 26, 2013, 05:52:43 PM
Lost in transit.  Word is they showed up in Wabash, Indiana, looking for the College.  No Dabs at game time.  No Dabs during the next hour.  Nor the next.  Referees from Ohio thought they waited long enough and decided to go home.  Game declared no contest after discussion with Wabash.  Refs, team, fans dispersed.  One guess who walked through the front doors of the Allen Center not long after.
     Folks, there is a Wabash College; there is a Wabash, Indiana; there is a Wabash River; there is a Wabash Valley College (two year).  None of them are all that close to one another.  For future reference:  Wabash College is in Crawfordsville, Indiana.
     I was there to see the game, sat and stood around, said my holiday greetings to the fans and players I know, and was walking out of the building when the Dab's came in.  I didn't stick around to hear or see the rest of the story. 
     

Without referencing any sort of map, let me put forth a conjecture.  All things Wabash have to do with the river.  The valley, the town, the colleges, even the Cannonball.  So, if one were to put in at the headwater on some floatation device, eventually you'd see men running around in red and white striped pants.  Voila. Wabash College.  How hard is that?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 27, 2013, 12:34:13 PM
Except Crawfordsville isn't near the river. It's by Sugar Creek, a tributary (which is bigger than many things called rivers out in the plains...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on December 27, 2013, 03:08:06 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 27, 2013, 11:18:11 AM

Without referencing any sort of map, let me put forth a conjecture.  All things Wabash have to do with the river.  The valley, the town, the colleges, even the Cannonball.  So, if one were to put in at the headwater on some floatation device, eventually you'd see men running around in red and white striped pants.  Voila. Wabash College.  How hard is that?

Make sure that device is USCG-approved.  Other options (if truly starting at the headwaters  ;)) would be punctured before reaching the annual, bridge abutment logjam at the US 127 bridge in Mercer County, OH.   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on December 27, 2013, 05:31:11 PM
David et al.  My mention of the refs being from Ohio was included because they had a long trip home.  If the game had begun on time, then it would have been over when they finally decided to talk to Wabash officials about declaring no contest. 
     No refs are ever "on the clock."  But it was clear that their patience was exhausted by the no show.  How long should they have stuck around with no clear indication that the Dabs would ever show up, even in this time when one would think that cell phones would clarify the status of the missing team?  I don't know what Wabash and the refs knew about where the Dabs were after such a long wait.  (Heck, I don't know if the Dabs knew where they were.)  I don't know the conference rule, but it seems to me the head official might/could have the latitude to decide when a game should be called off (on his own or in consultation with the home team) when conditions merit. 
    Wabash and Crawfordsville are about thirty miles from the Wabash River, which runs southwest dividing Lafayette and West Lafayette and then flows very near to the Indiana/Illinois border.   Wabash College is roughly two good hours from Wabash, Indiana.   
         
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 27, 2013, 06:43:05 PM
Quote from: sigma one on December 27, 2013, 05:31:11 PM
David et al.  My mention of the refs being from Ohio was included because they had a long trip home.
Got it, thanks. And thanks for giving us the story. +1

Gotta wonder what this game was doing on the schedule in the first place. This smells more like an emergency schedule-filler than a first-choice opponent. I wonder if Wabash had an opponent pull out at the last scheduling minute, or simply couldn't find a suitable (date, location) 25th game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on December 27, 2013, 11:16:14 PM
Guessing a bit, but I think it is a fill the schedule game.  Wabash used to have a home tourney close to Christmas, but that has gone away.  Dabney has played several Indiana teams this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 28, 2013, 10:47:15 AM
Quote from: sigma one on December 27, 2013, 11:16:14 PM
Dabney has played several Indiana teams this year.

All home games, I assume? ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on December 28, 2013, 03:06:02 PM
Quote from: sigma one on December 26, 2013, 05:52:43 PM
Lost in transit.  Word is they showed up in Wabash, Indiana, looking for the College.  No Dabs at game time.  No Dabs during the next hour.  Nor the next.  Referees from Ohio thought they waited long enough and decided to go home.  Game declared no contest after discussion with Wabash.  Refs, team, fans dispersed.  One guess who walked through the front doors of the Allen Center not long after.
     Folks, there is a Wabash College; there is a Wabash, Indiana; there is a Wabash River; there is a Wabash Valley College (two year).  None of them are all that close to one another.  For future reference:  Wabash College is in Crawfordsville, Indiana.
     I was there to see the game, sat and stood around, said my holiday greetings to the fans and players I know, and was walking out of the building when the Dab's came in.  I didn't stick around to hear or see the rest of the story. 



This almost happened to my wife's parents. Back in the day they did not have a cell phone but fortunately we called them just before they were to leave to attend the game. They were going to head to Wabash, Indiana, a four drive for them. We corrected their destimation and they made the game on time.
     


Modified by dc to fix formatting
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 28, 2013, 10:23:04 PM
Wittenberg continues to roll, dumping Grove City 79-40 yesterday and Kean 91-75 today to win their own Zimmerman Classic for the, like, billionth time. Scott Masin had a double double-double (12 and 11 today, 11 and 14 yesterday) to win MVP honors.

Elsewhere, Hiram drops Olivet, 95-87, at Mt. Union. The Terriers take on Adrian tomorrow in this classic-format tournament.

DePauw (vs. Drew in the Tampa Bay Shootout), OWU (vs. Marietta at Defiance), and Wooster (vs. Thiel at the Mose Hole Classic) also return to action tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 29, 2013, 12:03:04 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 28, 2013, 10:23:04 PM
Wooster vs. Thiel at the Mose Hole Classic.
I'm saving you a seat.  Bring the popcorn.  The game is at The College of Wooster in the town with the same name.  Nowhere near the river.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 29, 2013, 05:55:04 PM
Ohio Wesleyan 42 Marietta 34 at halftime in a key GL region game.
http://defianceathletics.com/media/LiveStats/MensBasketball/xlive.htm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 29, 2013, 07:12:00 PM
No video from Wooster due to technical difficulties.  Unbelievable.  How is it that these schools are continually so incompetent at this?  Are those responsible even reprimanded?  Does anybody even care?  I'm definitely caring less and less about this program and DIII in general.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on December 29, 2013, 07:37:30 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 29, 2013, 07:12:00 PM
No video from Wooster due to technical difficulties.  Unbelievable.  How is it that these schools are continually so incompetent at this?  Are those responsible even reprimanded?  Does anybody even care?  I'm definitely caring less and less about this program and DIII in general.

You are caring less about Wooster basketball because some video equipment is not working?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2013, 07:38:27 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 39  Thiel 24
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2013, 08:15:10 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 29, 2013, 07:12:00 PM
No video from Wooster due to technical difficulties.  Unbelievable.  How is it that these schools are continually so incompetent at this?  Are those responsible even reprimanded?  Does anybody even care?  I'm definitely caring less and less about this program and DIII in general.

Wait, you're not there? Who's that eating my popcorn?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2013, 08:27:11 PM
Final:  Wooster 88  Thiel 53   :)

Wooster was led tonight by Xavier Brown with 19 points, Scott Purcell with 15 points (5 three pointers), Josh Kipfer with 12 and Kenny DeBoer added 10.  Scots made 14 three pointers compared to only 3 by Thiel.  Wooster also outrebounded the Tomcats by 49 boards vs. only 29.

Wooster is now 9-1, 4-0 NCAC   ;D    Next game is tomorrow vs. Hanover College in the second night of the Mose Hole Tournament

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2013, 08:36:19 PM
Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 79  Marietta 74

Nice win by the Bishops over the OAC leader, Marietta, on a neutral court.  OWU was led by Claude Gray with 22 points and Reuel Rogers with 13.

Both teams are now 8-2 and both have also lost to Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2013, 08:57:41 PM
Other NCAC Final Scores:

DePauw 68  Drew 64  (DePauw improves to 6-3 on the season)
Adrian 64  Hiram 59  (Hiram drops to 3-7 on the season)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2013, 11:07:06 AM
Quote from: Titan Q on December 29, 2013, 07:37:30 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 29, 2013, 07:12:00 PM
No video from Wooster due to technical difficulties.  Unbelievable.  How is it that these schools are continually so incompetent at this?  Are those responsible even reprimanded?  Does anybody even care?  I'm definitely caring less and less about this program and DIII in general.

You are caring less about Wooster basketball because some video equipment is not working?

I know I'd be upset about a thing that's free that didn't exist 15 years ago and is sometimes at the whim of bandwidth, equipment, power, and weather.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 30, 2013, 12:28:46 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 30, 2013, 11:07:06 AM
Quote from: Titan Q on December 29, 2013, 07:37:30 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 29, 2013, 07:12:00 PM
No video from Wooster due to technical difficulties.  Unbelievable.  How is it that these schools are continually so incompetent at this?  Are those responsible even reprimanded?  Does anybody even care?  I'm definitely caring less and less about this program and DIII in general.

You are caring less about Wooster basketball because some video equipment is not working?

I know I'd be upset about a thing that's free that didn't exist 15 years ago and is sometimes at the whim of bandwidth, equipment, power, and weather.

When I was growing up, walking 3 miles to school (in the snow and uphill each way) we'd hover around the radio and listen to games on a very crackly AM station.  You know what, we didn't bitch about it either.  Sometimes, after the game, we'd meet on the party line (old telephone) and discuss the game.  Good memories.  Anything above that is a bonus.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2013, 12:44:49 PM
Heck, we used to gather in the town square to watch a re-creation of the game on a big board with the results wired in from Western Union.

And a Coke was a nickel.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 30, 2013, 02:32:57 PM
I get that.  I really do.  I'm older than almost all of you.  I've been there, back in the day.  I loved it, and I miss it.

My point is this.  If you say you're going to produce something, such as video, you should be able to do it, better than 99% of the time.  I understand technical difficulties and acts of god.  But webcasts from these smaller schools have a failure rate well above what should be tolerated.  And even when the video is provided, it's often with some guy on the camera who fails to show the scoreboard and clock.  Or announcers who fail to put in the tiniest bit of research so they can even pronounce the names of the players and visiting school.  Or who feel that their well-biased but unknowledgeable opinions are actually what the listener wants to hear.

Maybe some of you don't think that this reflects poorly on the school.  I happen to think it does.  Colleges and universities should be at the forefront of competency in what they do, not bringing up the rear.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 30, 2013, 04:06:59 PM
I don't know what the exact error or error message was last night but I believe the local cable crew that does these games for free typically don't like to work sundays
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 30, 2013, 04:14:32 PM
Many times the announcers are students who volunteer and are learning. Most of them just have a small college radio station and don't even have a journalism or radio program - just a station for recreation that doesn't have much if any professional staff guiding and mentoring them. Trust me, I've been there. I've heard 'professionals' butcher things as well.

As for the camera, many times they're volunteers as well and perhaps they're also filming for the coach and have specific marching orders.

You get what you get - don't throw a fit!

Seriously, back before I had much of a weekend life and was on EST I tried to watch a Kenyon / Chicago football game and the UC camera angle was at the track and far away from the action. I don't know if they had issues getting into the press box or what. But it was maddening and I commented on it here - and made it kind of a running thing anytime an NCAC team played at UC. But I understand that different schools have different priorities based on what their alumni wants / needs / expects and what the school can deliver. Technological infrastructure can be expensive and time-consuming to install - and the priorities have to be in the academic areas first.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 30, 2013, 05:33:17 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 30, 2013, 04:06:59 PM
I don't know what the exact error or error message was last night but I believe the local cable crew that does these games for free typically don't like to work sundays
Well, the message certainly didn't reference anything like that.  The link for the video was up until a few minutes AFTER game time.  I was never able to connect.  At a few minutes after 7 PM, the Wooster website said there would be no difficulty due to technical difficulties.  If they'd known in advance that they weren't going to have people to do it, then the video link should have been down beforehand.  It definitely influenced my decision to not attend the game live.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 30, 2013, 09:11:06 PM
Well, Wooster did play a game tonight and there WAS video although I didn't watch the entire thing. 

Wooster came out on top 63-53 in what appeared to be a somewhat underwhelming performance.  I only tuned in for a few minutes of the 2nd half when Hanover had cut the Wooster lead to 4 and Wooster quickly bumped the lead back out to 7 or 8 and then it was dinner time. I'm guessing Hanover implemented some zone defense in the 2nd half to stymie the Scots' offense?  Or maybe it was just the fact that Wooster went from shooting 6-10 from deep in the 1st half which can help break down a zone defense. But only 1-4 from deep in the 2nd half?  Not so much...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on December 30, 2013, 10:08:29 PM
No DeBoer and Wingard for Wooster, so any type of win was a good win. Fanelly didn't score either. Wingard may be done because of academics, but nothing is certain right now. I think Brown's immense value to the Scots, as if it ever needed to be defended, is without question this year, especially in recent games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2013, 10:42:40 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on December 30, 2013, 10:08:29 PM
No DeBoer and Wingard for Wooster, so any type of win was a good win. Fanelly didn't score either. Wingard may be done because of academics, but nothing is certain right now. I think Brown's immense value to the Scots, as if it ever needed to be defended, is without question this year, especially in recent games.

I was also at the game tonight and will add a couple of observations.  Kenny DeBoer sat on the bench in street clothes so I am guessing that he was resting his knee which can give him additional pain if he plays back to back nights?  Dan Fanelly had a significant ankle sprain in the first half and limped off the court in serious pain.  He did return after the halftime break but Kipfer started in his place for the 2nd half and Fanelly only played a total of maybe 3-4 minutes in the second half before he sat out of the rest of the game...probably as a precaution because his ankle was clearly not 100 percent.  Fanelly only had a total of 12 minutes played in the entire game.

Seinfeld is correct that this was a good win since Wooster played most of this game without 2 starters and a key bench player in Wingard.  Xavier Brown was red hot to start the game and made 4 three pointers in a row.  He actually scored 14 of Wooster's first 19 points in the opening 7 minutes of the game.

Xavier Brown led the Scots with 19 points, Doug Thorpe had 14 points (11 came in the 2nd half including a big shot with ~3 minutes remaining that iced the game) and Josh Kipfer controlled the lane with 12 points and 9 boards.

Wooster is now 10-1, 4-0 NCAC.   Next game is Denison at home this Saturday 1/4.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2013, 10:50:45 PM
Other NCAC Final Scores:

Ohio Wesleyan 75  Defiance 62  Nice win by the Bishops over an 8-1 Defiance team whose only previous loss was to a D1 team.  OWU now 9-2.

DePauw 81  Kalamazoo 80  2OT's   DePauw improves to 7-3 on the season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2013, 11:11:32 PM
and...

Denison 80, Earlham 76
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 30, 2013, 11:38:29 PM
I heard that DeBoer came down with a stomach ailment overnight. Hopefully from something he ate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 31, 2013, 12:19:50 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 30, 2013, 09:11:06 PM
Well, Wooster did play a game tonight and there WAS video although I didn't watch the entire thing. 

Wooster came out on top 63-53 in what appeared to be a somewhat underwhelming performance.  I only tuned in for a few minutes of the 2nd half when Hanover had cut the Wooster lead to 4 and Wooster quickly bumped the lead back out to 7 or 8 and then it was dinner time. I'm guessing Hanover implemented some zone defense in the 2nd half to stymie the Scots' offense?  Or maybe it was just the fact that Wooster went from shooting 6-10 from deep in the 1st half which can help break down a zone defense. But only 1-4 from deep in the 2nd half?  Not so much...

Actually I don't recall Hanover playing any zone tonight. Generally just some unimpressive ball movement and icky shot selection for the Scots that led to the "meh" offensive performance. You can probably chalk some of that up to the weird Wooster rotations due to essentially missing three players, but some credit also to pretty good defensive pressure from Hanover.

Defensively I thought the Scots did quite well. Especially Kipfer, who collected 9 boards and - critically - avoided foul trouble so that the Scots were able to keep some size on the floor.

Breckenridge said that DeBoer's issue was illness, likely some food poisoning. After the game Doug Cline indicated that the trainer's initial report on Fannelly's ankle is that it's a mild strain. But not presently clear if he'll be available for Denison on the 4th.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 31, 2013, 04:04:06 PM
Missing 2 starters and a key bench player explains a lot in the closer than expected final result.  Like I said, I caught about 2 minutes of the video feed in the 2nd half so I had no idea DeBoer and Wingard were out and Fanelly went down with an injury.  Definitely changes my opinion on the win...

Seinfeld, when will we know if Wingard did or did not make the grades?  I'm assuming he won't be playing on Saturday vs Denison?

As for DeBoer's food poisoning, one of my good friends is the GM of Campus Dining at the COW so I will have to get on her about poisoning the boys on the hoops team...  :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on December 31, 2013, 06:31:49 PM
I thought I'd try my hand at offensive and defensive efficiency measures for the NCAC teams. A few notes: 1) this includes all games, so includes some games against non-DIII opponents 2) this relies on my ability to type correct figures into Microsoft Excel, 3) this is my first time running calculations like this, so accuracy not guaranteed.

Offensive measure is points per 100 possessions; defensive measure is points allowed per 100 possessions. Possessions estimated by the generally accepted formula of: Possessions = FGA-OR+TO+.475*FTA. Kudos to members of these boards (especially sac) for making me aware of such a measure in the first place.


Team OffenseDefenseDifferential
Wittenberg120.795.125.7
Wooster107.190.216.8
OWU105.295.89.5
DePauw103.795.68.1
Kenyon109.8108.31.5
Hiram102.7105.5-2.9
Allegheny103.3108.5-5.2
Oberlin98.6105.3-6.6
Denison100.0112.1-12.1
Wabash92.2110.2-18.0

Some observations:
1. Wittenberg's offense is excellent - just a huge gap above the rest of the league. I think a 120ish mark is usually among the elite in all of DIII. Credit the seemingly unstoppable force that is Scott Masin and his 65.5% shooting from the floor.
2. As I expected, Wooster has the best defensive mark, but the gap over the other top contenders is smaller than I expected.
3. Speaking of the top four, there's a major drop-off between DePauw and Kenyon. When the NCAC round-robin is done, it seems unlikely that any of the bottom six will challenge for a top-four finish.
4. Denison is likely not as bad as this metric makes them look, as they've played a tougher schedule than most. In addition to facing Marietta, they've opened conference play with DePauw, OWU and Witt with Wooster next on the calendar. Ouch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 01, 2014, 11:21:53 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 31, 2013, 06:31:49 PM
I thought I'd try my hand at offensive and defensive efficiency measures for the NCAC teams. A few notes: 1) this includes all games, so includes some games against non-DIII opponents 2) this relies on my ability to type correct figures into Microsoft Excel, 3) this is my first time running calculations like this, so accuracy not guaranteed.

Offensive measure is points per 100 possessions; defensive measure is points allowed per 100 possessions. Possessions estimated by the generally accepted formula of: Possessions = FGA-OR+TO+.475*FTA. Kudos to members of these boards (especially sac) for making me aware of such a measure in the first place.


Team OffenseDefenseDifferential
Wittenberg120.795.125.7
Wooster107.190.216.8
OWU105.295.89.5
DePauw103.795.68.1
Kenyon109.8108.31.5
Hiram102.7105.5-2.9
Allegheny103.3108.5-5.2
Oberlin98.6105.3-6.6
Denison100.0112.1-12.1
Wabash92.2110.2-18.0

Some observations:
1. Wittenberg's offense is excellent - just a huge gap above the rest of the league. I think a 120ish mark is usually among the elite in all of DIII. Credit the seemingly unstoppable force that is Scott Masin and his 65.5% shooting from the floor.
2. As I expected, Wooster has the best defensive mark, but the gap over the other top contenders is smaller than I expected.
3. Speaking of the top four, there's a major drop-off between DePauw and Kenyon. When the NCAC round-robin is done, it seems unlikely that any of the bottom six will challenge for a top-four finish.
4. Denison is likely not as bad as this metric makes them look, as they've played a tougher schedule than most. In addition to facing Marietta, they've opened conference play with DePauw, OWU and Witt with Wooster next on the calendar. Ouch.

Nice work on those numbers kb.  One thing to note wrt Witt's impressive numbers offensively is that they haven't really played the most challenging schedule.  To date, only 2 of their 11 games have been against a team with a winning record and they're only 1-1 in those two games.  And one could argue that Witt's next game vs OWU a week from today will be their toughest game they've played since losing to Wheaton.  On the flip side, Wooster has played a far more difficult schedule with only 2 of their 11 games coming against teams with losing records. 

IMO, I'd say Wooster's numbers might be more impressive than Witt's numbers given the difficulty of the Scots' schedule. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 01, 2014, 12:35:44 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 31, 2013, 04:04:06 PM
Seinfeld, when will we know if Wingard did or did not make the grades?  I'm assuming he won't be playing on Saturday vs Denison?

I don't know for sure, but I'm guessing Monday, Jan. 6. If he doesn't play again this year, it will mean the Scots will be without two guys (Alex LaLonde being the other) who I thought going into the season could be big keys in addressing the one weakness that was exposed last year -- three-point shooting from the wing. This really showed up against Cabrini (and OWU in the NCAC Tournament). Both have the length and the range to be zone busters (accuracy is still in question). They were also two very athletic guys who could guard both small forwards and big men as well. Wooster has the depth to overcome their absence, but I think it definitely makes a postseason run more challenging.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 01, 2014, 02:49:59 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on December 31, 2013, 06:31:49 PM
I thought I'd try my hand at offensive and defensive efficiency measures for the NCAC teams. A few notes: 1) this includes all games, so includes some games against non-DIII opponents 2) this relies on my ability to type correct figures into Microsoft Excel, 3) this is my first time running calculations like this, so accuracy not guaranteed.

Offensive measure is points per 100 possessions; defensive measure is points allowed per 100 possessions. Possessions estimated by the generally accepted formula of: Possessions = FGA-OR+TO+.475*FTA. Kudos to members of these boards (especially sac) for making me aware of such a measure in the first place.


Team OffenseDefenseDifferential
Wittenberg120.795.125.7
Wooster107.190.216.8
OWU105.295.89.5
DePauw103.795.68.1
Kenyon109.8108.31.5
Hiram102.7105.5-2.9
Allegheny103.3108.5-5.2
Oberlin98.6105.3-6.6
Denison100.0112.1-12.1
Wabash92.2110.2-18.0

Some observations:
1. Wittenberg's offense is excellent - just a huge gap above the rest of the league. I think a 120ish mark is usually among the elite in all of DIII. Credit the seemingly unstoppable force that is Scott Masin and his 65.5% shooting from the floor.
2. As I expected, Wooster has the best defensive mark, but the gap over the other top contenders is smaller than I expected.
3. Speaking of the top four, there's a major drop-off between DePauw and Kenyon. When the NCAC round-robin is done, it seems unlikely that any of the bottom six will challenge for a top-four finish.
4. Denison is likely not as bad as this metric makes them look, as they've played a tougher schedule than most. In addition to facing Marietta, they've opened conference play with DePauw, OWU and Witt with Wooster next on the calendar. Ouch.

Wittenberg's offensive efficiency will surely come down some.  With the rule changes I'm seeing higher numbers all around.  In the past I viewed Wooster's 90.0 defensive efficiency an excellent number, I think now that's probably in elite territory.

This blog entry is a couple weeks old, but I've attempted to factor in strength of schedule for a couple years.  Using a strength of schedule has Witt/Woo very close.
http://scottsbbblog.blogspot.com/2013/12/a-peak-at-efficiencies.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 02, 2014, 02:23:35 PM
With just a few non-conference games left (two for Kenyon, one for Allegheny, and two for Oberlin) - the NCAC is 37-28 in non-conference - a pretty good recovery.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 04, 2014, 06:47:55 PM
1/3 Final Score:
Kenyon 76  Merchant Marine 73   Lords improve to 6-4, play at 8-1 NYU tonight

1/4 Final Scores:
DePauw 61  Allegheny 49   DePauw now 8-3, 3-1 NCAC; Gators now 3-7, 0-4

Wabash 63  Hiram 56    Bash now 2-8, 1-3;  Terriers now 3-8, 1-3

Oberlin 101  Cairn 69   Yeomen rout winless Cairn and are now 4-8
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 04, 2014, 08:05:15 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 50  Denison 29

Wooster is being led by Xavier Brown with 11 points and Scott Purcell (3 three pointers) also with 11.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 04, 2014, 09:04:33 PM
Final:  Wooster 100  Denison 75   :)

Wooster was led tonight by Evan Pannell with 19 points, Xavier Brown with 15 points, Scott Purcell with 14 points, Kenny DeBoer with 12 and Josh Kipfer also with 12.  Scots shot 62% from the floor and took care of the ball with only 11 turnovers.

Denison's top scorers were Brad Woolard with 24 points and Alex Longi with 16 points.

Wooster is now 11-1, 5-0 NCAC.  Next game is at Kenyon on 1/8.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 05, 2014, 02:14:59 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 04, 2014, 06:47:55 PM
1/3 Final Score:
Kenyon 76  Merchant Marine 73   Lords improve to 6-4, play at 8-1 NYU tonight

Kenyon 44, NYU 60.

Kenyon falls to 6-5, NYU improves to 9-1, though against a pretty weak schedule (Massey rates it #309 in DIII).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 05, 2014, 05:06:18 PM
1/5 NCAC Final Scores:
DePauw 90  Hiram 89  2 OT's   DePauw squeaks out a key road win to stay in the title race with only 1 NCAC loss so far.
Wabash 73  Allegheny 70   3rd Win a Row for the Little Giants

Current NCAC Standings with 1/5 Results:
1. Wooster 5-0 (11-1)
2. Wittenberg 4-0 (10-1)
3. DePauw 4-1 (9-3)
4. Ohio Wesleyan 3-1 (9-2)
5. Kenyon 3-1 (6-5)
6. Wabash 2-3 (3-8)
7. Oberlin 1-4 (3-8)
8. Hiram 1-4 (3-9)
9. Denison 0-4 (4-7)
10. Allegheny 0-5 (3-8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hopefan on January 06, 2014, 06:53:48 AM
Hope I'm not repeating old news...

Steve Thompson, former captain of Wooster's B-Ball team in early 2000's, named AD at Eureka College, Eureka, Il... member of the SLIAC... St Louis Intercollegient  Athletic Conference...

I'm always happy to see someone come into the SLIAC that has the kind of background Steve Thompson has...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 06, 2014, 09:02:49 PM
Quote from: hopefan on January 06, 2014, 06:53:48 AM
Hope I'm not repeating old news...

Steve Thompson, former captain of Wooster's B-Ball team in early 2000's, named AD at Eureka College, Eureka, Il... member of the SLIAC... St Louis Intercollegient  Athletic Conference...

I'm always happy to see someone come into the SLIAC that has the kind of background Steve Thompson has...

hopefan -- thanks for the update on Steve Thompson.  :)  Great to see that he is the new AD at Eureka College whose most famous alum is none other than Ronald Reagan.  Steve Thompson was a major contributor on several successful Wooster teams and he was a team captain his senior year.

Here is a link to the news release which includes a photo of Steve Thompson:  http://www.sliac.org/Releases/2013-14/eurekaAD

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 06, 2014, 09:19:06 PM
New D3Hoops Top 25 poll was released today and the NCAC is well represented with 3 teams:  :)

Wooster remains at #2 by a slim margin, just 5 votes ahead of #3 IWU which has one loss to a D3 team

Wittenberg moves up to #9 after a couple of wins

Ohio Wesleyan enters the poll at #22 after two very strong road wins over Marietta and Defiance.  Marietta is still slightly ahead of OWU at #19 despite identical 9-2 records and the head to head loss to the Bishops.  Marietta is the only other Great Lakes team in the top 25 as Calvin dropped out.

DePauw also appears in the "other receiving votes" group essentially at #40 with 10 votes in the poll.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 08, 2014, 03:20:29 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 01, 2014, 12:35:44 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 31, 2013, 04:04:06 PM
Seinfeld, when will we know if Wingard did or did not make the grades?  I'm assuming he won't be playing on Saturday vs Denison?

I don't know for sure, but I'm guessing Monday, Jan. 6. If he doesn't play again this year, it will mean the Scots will be without two guys (Alex LaLonde being the other) who I thought going into the season could be big keys in addressing the one weakness that was exposed last year -- three-point shooting from the wing. This really showed up against Cabrini (and OWU in the NCAC Tournament). Both have the length and the range to be zone busters (accuracy is still in question). They were also two very athletic guys who could guard both small forwards and big men as well. Wooster has the depth to overcome their absence, but I think it definitely makes a postseason run more challenging.

Wingard is officially out of school for this semester.

Hopefully Thorpe can get his shooting touch back tonight. For the season he has only hit 50% or more of his field goal attempts in one game, and over the past six games, he is shooting just 28.8% from the field and 25% from three-point range, averaging just 8.5 ppg during that stretch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 08, 2014, 08:03:09 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 44  Kenyon 23

Wooster's post players are leading the scoring as Dan Fanelly has 8 points and Josh Kipfer has 7.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 08, 2014, 08:55:44 PM
Final:  Wooster 92  Kenyon 52  :)

Scots were led tonight by Doug Thorpe who had 16 points on 7 of 12 shooting (over 50% as Seinfeld requested  ;)).  Also in double figure scoring for Wooster was Dan Fanelly with 12 points, Kenny DeBoer with 11 and freshman Milt Davis with 12.  Wooster made 9 three pointers vs. only 2 made by the Lords.

Wooster is now 12-1, 6-0 NCAC  ;D

GO SCOTS!  
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 08, 2014, 09:04:49 PM
Witt and OWU are headed to OT.

The Bishops were up 22 with 16 minutes left and allowed Witt to come all the way back and force OT.  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 08, 2014, 09:17:38 PM
Final:  Witt 62  OWU 60  OT

Ugly shooting as both teams shot less than 35% from the floor.  Scott Masin led Witt with 24 points and 16 boards.

Witt is now 11-1, 5-0 NCAC

OWU is now 9-3, 3-2 NCAC

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 08, 2014, 09:23:24 PM
And the comeback was completed by the Tigers in OT.

OWU led 45-22 with 16:19 left in the game and scored just NINE points the rest of the way.  Then OWU scored the first 6 points in OT only to watch Witt finish OT with an 8-0 run. Tough loss for the Bishops and it will be real interesting to see how they bounce back from this one.  And on the flip side, huge win for Witt as you need to hold the home court if you have aspirations of winning a conference championship. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 09, 2014, 09:32:41 AM
The other conference game saw Denison beat Oberlin 71-60.

Going back a few days, congrats to the LGs for the weekend sweep. And to reward their efforts, they were stuck in Richmond coming back from Gheny!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on January 09, 2014, 02:15:26 PM
How do Wooster and Wittenberg match up against each other?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2014, 06:34:31 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on January 08, 2014, 03:20:29 PM
Wingard is officially out of school for this semester.
Seinfeld, or anyone else in a position to have insight, what do you think happens to Wingard next? Do you think he will re-enroll at Wooster, and if so, might he play next season? Perhaps he will resurface somewhere else with a less demanding academic regimen? I hope he finds a way to get back into college and earn a degree, whether he plays again or not.

EDIT: I heard offline from someone who is pretty well-informed that we are unlikely to see Wingard re-enroll at Wooster. I wish him the best.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 11, 2014, 06:32:10 PM
1/11 NCAC Final Scores:

Witt 80  Hiram 79  Surprisingly close since this game was at Witt
DePauw 62  Kenyon 54  Road win for the Tigers
Ohio Wesleyan 76  Allegheny 64  Road win for OWU and Gators still winless in NCAC
Denison 71  Wabash 54  Two wins this week for the Big Red
Cornell (NY) 77 Oberlin 55
Wooster was idle


Current NCAC Standings with 1/11 Results:

1. Witt 6-0 (12-1)
1. Wooster 6-0 (12-1)
3. DePauw 5-1 (10-3)
4. Ohio Wesleyan 4-2 (10-3)
5. Kenyon 3-3 (6-7)
6. Denison 2-4 (6-7)
6. Wabash 2-4 (3-9)
8. Oberlin 1-5 (4-9)
8. Hiram 1-5 (3-10)
10. Allegheny 0-6 (3-10)


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 11, 2014, 06:37:20 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 11, 2014, 06:32:10 PM
Witt 80  Hiram 79  Surprisingly close since this game was at Witt

Witt was ahead by 18 with about 13 minutes left I think. Hiram took a late lead, but Witt managed to pull it out again.  They've certainly had an interesting set of 2nd halves this week!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 11, 2014, 06:41:21 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 11, 2014, 06:37:20 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 11, 2014, 06:32:10 PM
Witt 80  Hiram 79  Surprisingly close since this game was at Witt

Witt was ahead by 18 with about 13 minutes left I think. Hiram took a late lead, but Witt managed to pull it out again.  They've certainly had an interesting set of 2nd halves this week!

Yes, play by play shows that Hiram actually led 75-74 with just over 1 minute remaining in the game!  Let's hope that Witt plays sloppy again next Saturday when Wooster visits Springfield but somehow I doubt that will be the case.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 11, 2014, 10:21:11 PM
Update on the Wheaton team that Wooster beat earlier in the season:

Final Tonight:  Wheaton 66  #12 Augustana 63  OT    Wheaton is now 3-0 in the CCIW (1st place) and 10-4 overall
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 15, 2014, 07:49:14 PM
Remarkable early result: Witt 46, DePauw 72.

New Tigers simply dominate old Tigers at Neal Fieldhouse. Wittenberg only scored eight points in the final 14 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2014, 08:39:33 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 50  Hiram 23   :)

This game is essentially over at the half as Wooster has played tough defense and Hiram has played virtually none.  ;)

Wooster is being led by Xavier Brown with 12 points, Scott Purcell with 9, Kenny DeBoer with 8 and Doug Thorpe also with 8.  Scots shot 52% in the first half and made 6 three pointers while the Terriers shot 26% overall and made only 3 three pointers

It is hard to believe that this same Hiram team played Witt to a 1 point margin in Springfield last Saturday?  ???

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 15, 2014, 09:04:54 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2014, 08:39:33 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 50  Hiram 23   :)

It is hard to believe that this same Hiram team played Witt to a 1 point margin in Springfield last Saturday?  ???

Not after seeing that Witt/DePauw score...   :o

I've kind of felt all along Witt has been the beneficiary of a relatively soft OOC schedule and I think DePauw exposed that tonight.  Heck, OWU was exposing it last Wednesday until they forgot how to score in the 2nd half of that game...  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2014, 09:38:29 PM
Final:  Wooster 94  Hiram 71  :)

Wooster was led tonight by Scott Purcell with 18 points (career high), Doug Thorpe with 18, Xavier Brown with 17 and Kenny DeBoer with 17.

Wooster is now 13-1, 7-0 NCAC  ;D   Next up is a big rivalry game at Witt on Saturday evening.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2014, 09:44:06 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 15, 2014, 09:04:54 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2014, 08:39:33 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 50  Hiram 23   :)

It is hard to believe that this same Hiram team played Witt to a 1 point margin in Springfield last Saturday?  ???

Not after seeing that Witt/DePauw score...   :o

I've kind of felt all along Witt has been the beneficiary of a relatively soft OOC schedule and I think DePauw exposed that tonight.  Heck, OWU was exposing it last Wednesday until they forgot how to score in the 2nd half of that game...  ::)

ScotsFan -- good points made in your post.  Hiram played a better second half vs. Wooster but the Terriers are not a team that you should struggle to beat on your home floor.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2014, 09:54:46 PM
All the NCAC 1/15 Final Scores:

DePauw 72  Wittenberg 46
Wooster 94  Hiram 71
Kenyon 73  Denison 61
Oberlin 67  Allegheny 58
Ohio Wesleyan 80  Wabash 62
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 15, 2014, 09:55:48 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 15, 2014, 09:04:54 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2014, 08:39:33 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 50  Hiram 23   :)

It is hard to believe that this same Hiram team played Witt to a 1 point margin in Springfield last Saturday?  ???

Not after seeing that Witt/DePauw score...   :o

I've kind of felt all along Witt has been the beneficiary of a relatively soft OOC schedule and I think DePauw exposed that tonight.  Heck, OWU was exposing it last Wednesday until they forgot how to score in the 2nd half of that game...  ::)

Massey has Wittenberg's schedule at 48th in DIII, which is actually rather respectable...but I assume that is counting Witt's exhibition game against Western Carolina, which the Catamounts count as a regular season game though Wittenberg lists it as an exhibition. I wonder where it would rank with that game removed, since without it, Wheaton (L) and Kean (W) were the sum total of Witt's non-cupcake out-of-conference schedule.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2014, 10:00:42 PM
Current NCAC Standings with 1/15 Results:

1. Wooster 7-0 (13-1)
2. DePauw 6-1 (11-3)
2. Wittenberg 6-1 (12-2)
4. Ohio Wesleyan 5-2 (11-3)
5. Kenyon 4-3 (7-7)
6. Denison 2-5 (6-8)
6. Wabash 2-5 (3-10)
6. Oberlin 2-5 (5-9)
9. Hiram 1-6 (3-11)
10. Allegheny 0-7 (3-11)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 15, 2014, 10:32:31 PM
Since the top four are 20-0 against the bottom six, feels like the standings are bit more like this:

1. Wooster 7-0 (13-1)
2. DePauw 6-1 (11-3)
2. Wittenberg 6-1 (12-2)
4. Ohio Wesleyan 5-2 (11-3)


---------------------------------


5. Kenyon 4-3 (7-7)
6. Denison 2-5 (6-8)
6. Wabash 2-5 (3-10)
6. Oberlin 2-5 (5-9)
9. Hiram 1-6 (3-11)
10. Allegheny 0-7 (3-11)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 15, 2014, 11:27:13 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 15, 2014, 10:32:31 PM
Since the top four are 20-0 against the bottom six, feels like the standings are bit more like this:

1. Wooster 7-0 (13-1)
2. DePauw 6-1 (11-3)
2. Wittenberg 6-1 (12-2)
4. Ohio Wesleyan 5-2 (11-3)


---------------------------------


5. Kenyon 4-3 (7-7)
6. Denison 2-5 (6-8)
6. Wabash 2-5 (3-10)
6. Oberlin 2-5 (5-9)
9. Hiram 1-6 (3-11)
10. Allegheny 0-7 (3-11)

Nicely edited! k+  That 20-0 stat is very revealing.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 16, 2014, 07:36:59 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 15, 2014, 10:32:31 PM
Since the top four are 20-0 against the bottom six [...]

The NCAC. The more things change, the more they stay the same.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 16, 2014, 09:39:56 AM
A couple good tidbits from Wooster's game recap (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2013-14/releases/20140115hjyfgj):

- Xavier Brown scored his 1,000th point for the Scots, becoming the 38th Wooster player to reach that milestone. Congrats Xavier!

- Scott Purcell's career high 18 pts included a perfect 12-12 mark at the FT line. Best single-game performance from the charity stripe for Wooster since some guy named Ian Franks went 13-13 on Dec. 30, 2008.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on January 16, 2014, 09:59:03 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 16, 2014, 09:39:56 AM

- Scott Purcell's career high 18 pts included a perfect 12-12 mark at the FT line. Best single-game performance from the charity stripe for Wooster since some guy named Ian Franks went 13-13 on Dec. 30, 2008.

I can't say enough about what Scott has meant to the team this year.  He's had very limited opportunities his first 3 seasons due to injuries, but when he did play he never really gave us any reason to believe that he'd be a consistent double-digit scorer.  Add in his excellent defense and his leadership and IMO he's one of the most important players on the team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 16, 2014, 11:11:17 PM
Updated NCAC offensive and defensive efficiency ratings* through games of 1/15:


   Team      Offense      Defense      Margin      SOS Rank   
   Wooster      112.1      90.5      21.6      10   
   Wittenberg      115.2      97.5      17.8      50   
   DePauw      105.9      91.7      14.2      70   
   OWU      105.4      95.0      10.4      51   
   Kenyon      101.6      105.3      -3.7      149   
   Oberlin      98.6      102.7      -4.0      184   
   Hiram      102.6      108.3      -5.7      177   
   Allegheny      100.0      106.7      -6.7      172   
   Denison      99.6      109.1      -9.5      67   
   Wabash      94.5      109.3      -14.9      45   

I have not tried to weigh these ratings by strength of schedule but I have provided each teams current SOS rank according to Massey so that you can make whatever adjustments you desire in your head. See Sac's excellent blog post (http://scottsbbblog.blogspot.com/2013/12/a-peak-at-efficiencies.html) for his ratings from December where he did perform a SOS-weighted version of these efficiency measures for the top GL Region teams.

I find it somewhat notable that Oberlin's NCAC-worst SOS is still in the top half of DIII schedules according to Massey (55th percentile, to be precise).

*As a reminder, the offense measure is points/100 possessions; defensive measure is points allowed/100 possessions. Possessions estimated as: Poss = FGA - Off Reb + TO + .475*FTA.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 17, 2014, 02:32:54 AM
We're not shying away from anyone, which is good for the league. It showed in the results in non-conference, though. However, even though the bottom isn't doing that well I think the league is well positioned for a couple of "C" bids as long as anarchy and chaos don't truly reign.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 17, 2014, 09:45:04 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on January 16, 2014, 09:59:03 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 16, 2014, 09:39:56 AM

- Scott Purcell's career high 18 pts included a perfect 12-12 mark at the FT line. Best single-game performance from the charity stripe for Wooster since some guy named Ian Franks went 13-13 on Dec. 30, 2008.

I can't say enough about what Scott has meant to the team this year.  He's had very limited opportunities his first 3 seasons due to injuries, but when he did play he never really gave us any reason to believe that he'd be a consistent double-digit scorer.  Add in his excellent defense and his leadership and IMO he's one of the most important players on the team.

Well said poe and I couldn't agree more...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 17, 2014, 10:05:26 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 16, 2014, 11:11:17 PM
Updated NCAC offensive and defensive efficiency ratings* through games of 1/15:


   Team      Offense      Defense      Margin      SOS Rank   
   Wooster      112.1      90.5      21.6      10   
   Wittenberg      115.2      97.5      17.8      50   
   DePauw      105.9      91.7      14.2      70   
   OWU      105.4      95.0      10.4      51   
   Kenyon      101.6      105.3      -3.7      149   
   Oberlin      98.6      102.7      -4.0      184   
   Hiram      102.6      108.3      -5.7      177   
   Allegheny      100.0      106.7      -6.7      172   
   Denison      99.6      109.1      -9.5      67   
   Wabash      94.5      109.3      -14.9      45   

I have not tried to weigh these ratings by strength of schedule but I have provided each teams current SOS rank according to Massey so that you can make whatever adjustments you desire in your head. See Sac's excellent blog post (http://scottsbbblog.blogspot.com/2013/12/a-peak-at-efficiencies.html) for his ratings from December where he did perform a SOS-weighted version of these efficiency measures for the top GL Region teams.

I find it somewhat notable that Oberlin's NCAC-worst SOS is still in the top half of DIII schedules according to Massey (55th percentile, to be precise).

*As a reminder, the offense measure is points/100 possessions; defensive measure is points allowed/100 possessions. Possessions estimated as: Poss = FGA - Off Reb + TO + .475*FTA.

Thanks for putting this up, kb.  You really don't have to peel back too many layers here to see why things are the way they are in the league this season.  +k
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 17, 2014, 01:05:42 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 16, 2014, 07:36:59 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 15, 2014, 10:32:31 PM
Since the top four are 20-0 against the bottom six [...]

The NCAC. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

At least there is a third and fourth team in this group, which wasn't always the case.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 18, 2014, 01:02:41 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 17, 2014, 01:05:42 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 16, 2014, 07:36:59 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on January 15, 2014, 10:32:31 PM
Since the top four are 20-0 against the bottom six [...]

The NCAC. The more things change, the more they stay the same.

At least there is a third and fourth team in this group, which wasn't always the case.

Excellent point Pat because in past years if was often just Woo and Witt battling it out.

....and today we have the Top 4 NCAC teams matched up in two huge games:   ;D

#2 Wooster 13-1 (7-0) is at #9 Wittenberg 12-2 (6-1)

#22 Ohio Wesleyan 11-3 (5-2) is at #31 DePauw 11-3 (6-1)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 18, 2014, 02:37:04 PM
Final:  #22 Ohio Wesleyan 75  DePauw 64

Huge road win for OWU as the Bishops stay in the title race and are now 6-2 in the NCAC.  DePauw also drops to 6-2 in the NCAC.

Seth Clark led OWU with 18 points and Taylor Rieger added 12.  Both Tommy Fernitz and Adam Botts had 16 points for the Tigers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 18, 2014, 08:09:54 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 34  Wittenberg 19

In the half, Wooster was led by Xavier Brown, Doug Thorpe and Evan Pannell each with 8 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2014, 08:14:48 PM
After starting fairly raggedy, Steve Moore calls a timeout, and the Scots come out with a 13-0 run that blossoms to a 26-6 half-ending run.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2014, 08:16:45 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 18, 2014, 08:09:54 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 34  Wittenberg 19

In the half, Wooster was led by Xavier Brown, Doug Thorpe and Evan Pannell each with 8 points.

Witt led 13-8 at one point in the first half before Wooster closed out the half on a HUGE 26-6 run.  To be honest, Witt is fortunate to only be down 15 in this one...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2014, 09:00:20 PM
Anyone else having issues watching Witt's live feed?  Mine is constantly buffering and it is quite maddening?!   ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 18, 2014, 09:03:36 PM
I'm watching, links been working fine but I'm probably going to have to shower to get all this hyperbole off.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2014, 09:05:30 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 18, 2014, 09:00:20 PM
Anyone else having issues watching Witt's live feed?  Mine is constantly buffering and it is quite maddening?!   ::)
Same here. I finally gave up and switched to WQKT.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2014, 09:07:06 PM
Quote from: sac on January 18, 2014, 09:03:36 PM
I'm watching, links been working fine but I'm probably going to have to shower to get all this hyperbole off.

I have it on mute.  I can't take Witt's broadcasters...

Plus I was watching Michigan pick up their first win at the Kohl Center in Madison since 1999...  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 18, 2014, 09:12:11 PM
Final:  Wooster 69  Wittenberg 62  ;D

Terrific road win for Wooster!  :)  Scots were led by Scott Purcell with 14 points, Doug Thorpe with 12, Xavier Brown with 12,  Evan Pannell with 11 and Kenny DeBoer with 10.

Wooster is now 14-1, 8-0 NCAC  ;D  Wooster now has a 2 game lead and only 1 very tough road game left at DePauw

Stat of the Game:  Wooster only had 10 turnovers and forced Wittenberg into 20 turnovers
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2014, 09:18:23 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 18, 2014, 09:07:06 PM
Quote from: sac on January 18, 2014, 09:03:36 PM
I'm watching, links been working fine but I'm probably going to have to shower to get all this hyperbole off.

I have it on mute.  I can't take Witt's broadcasters...

Plus I was watching Michigan pick up their first win at the Kohl Center in Madison since 1999...  8-)
I think Scott Leo does a pretty good job, actually. He's not impartial, but I don't expect him to be. He's well-informed and well-spoken, and respectful of the opponent. He's no Mike Breckenridge, but there have been many worse broadcasters, both at Witt and elsewhere.

Oh, and Go Blue!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2014, 09:21:43 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 18, 2014, 09:12:11 PM
Final:  Wooster 69  Wittenberg 62  ;D

Terrific road win for Wooster!  :)  Scots were led by Scott Purcell with 14 points, Doug Thorpe with 12, Xavier Brown with 12,  Evan Pannell with 11 and Kenny DeBoer with 10.

Wooster is now 14-1, 8-0 NCAC  ;D  Wooster now has a 2 game lead and only 1 very tough road game left at DePauw

Stat of the Game:  Wooster only had 10 turnovers and forced Wittenberg into 20 turnovers

Wooster having a 2 game lead with road wins over arguably their 2 toughest competitors @Witt and @OWU is big!

Witt made a valiant effort in coming back in the second half after being down by as many as 19.  I thought I was watching Witt/OWU part 2 at one point.  But Wooster was able to do just enough down the stretch to hold off the Tigers and come away with the big road win!  :)

And how about 5 Scots finishing the game scoring in double figures!  :o  That is some serious balance in scoring by the Scots!  This is what makes them so difficult to defend because they don't really have any one player they rely on in scoring the basketball.  You take away one threat and they have several others who can step up to pick up the slack.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 18, 2014, 09:23:20 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2014, 09:18:23 PM

I think Scott Leo does a pretty good job, actually. He's not impartial, but I don't expect him to be. He's well-informed and well-spoken, and respectful of the opponent. He's no Mike Breckenridge, but there have been many worse broadcasters, both at Witt and elsewhere.

Oh, and Go Blue!

I suppose you're right regarding Witt's broadcasters.  I wasn't tryin to say that they do a poor job, I just can't stand the homer slant and I'm sure that has a lot to do with the fact that I can't stand anything Witt related.  :P  And I'm sure Witt fans would probably have a similar opinion of Breck who I think is one of the best in D3.

And yes, Go Blue!   8-)  Nice to see Michigan, who struggled through a very tough non-conference schedule, get off to a great start in the B1G and seeing OSU and Wisky now lose 3 and 2 in a row respectively after waltzing through relatively weak non-conference schedules...  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 18, 2014, 10:54:15 PM
All the NCAC 1/18 Final Scores:

Wooster 69  Wittenberg 62
Ohio Wesleyan 75  DePauw 64
Denison 55  Allegheny 46
Hiram 73  Oberlin 71
Wabash 61  Kenyon 52


Current NCAC Standings with 1/18 Results:

1. Wooster 8-0 (14-1)
2. Wittenberg 6-2 (12-3)
2. Ohio Wesleyan 6-2 (12-3)
2. DePauw 6-2 (11-4)
5. Kenyon 4-4 (7-8)
6. Denison 3-5 (7-8)
6. Wabash 3-5 (4-10)
8. Hiram 2-6 (4-11)
8. Oberlin 2-6 (5-10)
10. Allegheny 0-8 (3-12)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 18, 2014, 11:07:29 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 18, 2014, 09:23:20 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 18, 2014, 09:18:23 PM

I think Scott Leo does a pretty good job, actually. He's not impartial, but I don't expect him to be. He's well-informed and well-spoken, and respectful of the opponent. He's no Mike Breckenridge, but there have been many worse broadcasters, both at Witt and elsewhere.

Oh, and Go Blue!

I suppose you're right regarding Witt's broadcasters.  I wasn't tryin to say that they do a poor job, I just can't stand the homer slant and I'm sure that has a lot to do with the fact that I can't stand anything Witt related.  :P  And I'm sure Witt fans would probably have a similar opinion of Breck who I think is one of the best in D3.

And yes, Go Blue!   8-)  Nice to see Michigan, who struggled through a very tough non-conference schedule, get off to a great start in the B1G and seeing OSU and Wisky now lose 3 and 2 in a row respectively after waltzing through relatively weak non-conference schedules...  ;D

Leo's your standard B-Grade DIII announcer.  It's the other guy that I can't tolerate.  The color guy that Scott Leo calls "Coach".  What a clown.  There was one play fairly late where Scott Masin just ran over Kipfer down low.  The charge was called, and this COACH starts yelling out "That's AWFUL!"  Unbelievable.  And this coming after Masin had hit Kipfer at least twice in the face with hard elbows.

Everything about Wittenberg stinks.  Always has, always will.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: enjoymoreradio on January 19, 2014, 01:12:42 AM
What a great win for the Scots. Got a little close there in the second half, but Coach Moore knows how to keep his players calm. Having a two game edge is huge, looking forward to the NCAC Tourney. My hatred for Witt knows few bounds.

Also an introduction is due to the other Scots fans on the boards. I'm a Wooster alumnus, class of 2012, and a columnist for d3hoops for ODACcess. Pleased to meet you all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 19, 2014, 09:50:19 AM
Welcome to the board radio...  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on January 19, 2014, 02:55:48 PM
Smart enough to avoid falling into the trash-talking trap, especially after a loss.  However, I have to agree that Scott Leo's counterpart on Witt's broadcasts is atrocious. Based on his commentary, I seriously question whether he has spent much time around basketball. Leo's not great, but he would be better served covering the game on his own.

Now about the game: First, credit Wooster for doing what they needed to do to win. They built an early lead through creating 12 first-half turnovers, and hit big shots down the stretch to seal the victory.  I felt Witt should have come out of the zone after they cut the lead to to five without about ten minutes left. Their zone became too stagnant late in the game, allowing Wooster to run their sets against only little resistance.  It's hard to dictate the pace of the game and create turnovers in a zone.  When Wittenberg desperately needed a stop with about five minutes left, Wooster ran the exact same play twice in a row (sending a cutter to the deep corner near the Wooster bench and reversing the dribble for a pitch to that shooter) and scored on both possessions.  You have to hand it to Coach Brown for benching his starters early in the second-half and letting his bench carry the team back into contention, but his inability to make in-game adjustments hurts the Tigers. The game may have been different if Leahy had been able to play at full-speed.

More importantly, Wittenberg now finds themselves on a costly two-game losing streak, which has me wondering if this team may have been slightly overrated.  A look at their last four games shows a team struggling to put together two solid halves:

Home v. OWU- Down by 22 before rallying for an OT win.
Home v. Hiram- 1 point victory after giving up 52 points in the second half.
@Depauw- 26 point drubbing after shooting 23% in the second half.
Home v. Wooster- Seven point home loss after committing 20 turnovers in the first half.

Final comments: Ben Bowen and Justin McDowell bring energy every time they are in the game.  They are limited offensively, but they epitomize what I love about D3 basketball. You can tell they love the game. Bad couple of weeks for me as both my Buckeyes and Tigers are struggling.  Here's to better times ahead.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 19, 2014, 04:24:01 PM
Posted on the Wittenberg Athletics Facebook page today, having been sent via email to the campus community:
QuoteTo all Students and other Wittenberg campus community members who were a part of the great environment of enthusiasm in Pam Smith Arena last evening:

THANK YOU for the turnout and "over the top" show of ENTHUSIASM and SUPPORT shown the men's basketball program.

YOU literally PUT US "on your backs" in providing the energy and a never give up mindset which enabled players to make the long trek back in the second half to make it a game going into the final minute.

Thanks to all again!

Sincerely,

Wittenberg Mens' Basketball Program members

Pretty cool.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on January 20, 2014, 08:29:36 AM
Everything about Wooster Booster is old and senile.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: scott_leo on January 21, 2014, 12:20:13 PM
Hi all,

I was told there was a discussion about our broadcast on here and I guess curiosity got the best of me.

Thanks David for your kind words, hopefully most folks enjoy the coverage. I wouldn't expect many Wooster fans to be glowing about it, considering it's a Wittenberg broadcast intended primarily for Tigers fans. I do plenty of "network" assignments (i.e. high school state championships for the OHSAA Radio Network) that are intended to be completely impartial and focus on the storylines/perspective of both teams equally. This is a different scenario.

Although, even when I'm broadcasting for a specific team, I'd like to think I stay fairly low on the "homer-meter".  :)

Quote from: Urban For Prez on January 19, 2014, 02:55:48 PM
However, I have to agree that Scott Leo's counterpart on Witt's broadcasts is atrocious. Based on his commentary, I seriously question whether he has spent much time around basketball. Leo's not great, but he would be better served covering the game on his own.

My broadcast partner is "The Coach" Jim Scoby. He's been an assistant coach at the University of Dayton, Wittenberg, and spent 25+ years in high school coaching. Say what you will about his broadcasting style/ability, but his basketball resume speaks for itself.

Anyway, thanks to all that tuned in and congrats to the Scots on another win in the series.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 22, 2014, 08:26:48 PM
Scott,

You and Jim have to consider the source of the comments.  No broadcaster can ever hope to please everyone, so most hope to offend the fewest.  I think you do as good a job as any I listen to and are certainly more tolerable to me than the Wooster broadcasters. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 22, 2014, 08:38:06 PM
Quote from: GoRed on January 22, 2014, 08:26:48 PM
Scott,

You and Jim have to consider the source of the comments.  No broadcaster can ever hope to please everyone, so most hope to offend the fewest.  I think you do as good a job as any I listen to and are certainly more tolerable to me than the Wooster broadcasters.

I hope you're referring to Wooster's video play by play guys and not their radio guy.  Wooster's video play by play broadcasters leave MUCH to be desired and I mute them as well.   That said,  I think Mike Breckenridge is 2nd to none in D3 doing the radio broadcasts...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 22, 2014, 08:45:38 PM
Yes, I was referring to the video broadcasts.  I can't recall ever tuning into any radio Wooster radio broadcasts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 22, 2014, 09:45:25 PM
Final:  Wooster 73  Allegheny 68

Just got home from a work related evening meeting so I can't provide much context.  Heard the last 5 minutes on the radio and Wooster actually led by 12 points then allowed the Gators to close the gap in the last 2 minutes of the game.

Wooster is now 15-1, 9-0 NCAC  ;D  Next game is AT DePauw on Saturday afternoon where Wooster has lost games in the last 2 seasons.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 22, 2014, 09:50:30 PM
Quote from: GoRed on January 22, 2014, 08:45:38 PM
Yes, I was referring to the video broadcasts.  I can't recall ever tuning into any radio Wooster radio broadcasts.

If you get the opportunity, you should. WQKT.com --> Listen Live (active during games) with Mike Breckenridge on the call is a true pleasure. Heck, usually the student crews on the college's Woo91 station are better than the local cable broadcasts.

The extreme homerism of the Wooster TV/video broadcasts (has any Scot ever committed a justified foul?!? or traveled?) bothers me, as does the lack of play-by-play quality especially when talking about the visitors. Sometimes entire possessions go by without any mention of opposing players by name - "he passes to the wing, he passes down low, turns, shoots, he missed it, rebound by Brown of Wooster". Sometimes they don't announce substitutions. All of which makes it really, really hard as a viewer to learn who's who on the visiting side, and suggests a lack of prep work by the broadcasters.

Breckenridge, by comparison, is simply excellent. For years my strategy for watching Wooster games has been to stream the video on mute and listen to Breck's call over top of it. Unfortunately this season the lag between the two has been 30+ seconds and it's simply untenable to watch the video be a full possession ahead of the radio call.

In these cases, I generally nix the video and listen to Breckenridge. He's just that much better and more pleasant.

Also, Scott - I have nothing to add to this debate (I was unable to listen or watch the broadcast Saturday) but I've listened to the Witt feed in the past and always found it to be a pretty good broadcast. I'll also say that I think those of us (like me) who have never broadcast anything forget that broadcasting is *hard*. Mostly I simply try to appreciate that I can regularly watch the Scots now from wherever I am, which is nearly always a couple hundred miles away from the state of Ohio, much less the Wooster or Wittenberg campuses. So kudos to you for the work you guys do to provide these broadcasts!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 22, 2014, 09:58:03 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 22, 2014, 09:45:25 PM
Final:  Wooster 73  Allegheny 68

Just got home from a work related evening meeting so I can't provide much context.  Heard the last 5 minutes on the radio and Wooster actually led by 12 points then allowed the Gators to close the gap in the last 2 minutes of the game.

Wooster is now 15-1, 9-0 NCAC  ;D  Next game is AT DePauw on Saturday afternoon where Wooster has lost games in the last 2 seasons.

GO SCOTS!

I can't provide much context either, as I could only watch live stats, but Wooster was down 7 at half and I was told that they were lucky it wasn't more. Allegheny hit everything (58%) while the Scots missed everything (35%) during the first 20.

In the second half the Scots held the Gators scoreless for nearly 8 minutes (from 14:56 to 7:43) and the resulting 10-0 run moved the Scots from down 2 to up 8, and then they held off the Gators at the end, as WSF indicates.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 22, 2014, 10:08:54 PM
All the NCAC 1/22 Final Scores:

Wooster 73  Allegheny 68
Wittenberg 66  Kenyon 54
Ohio Wesleyan 81  Oberlin 72
DePauw 70  Wabash 60
Denison 83  Hiram 77

Current NCAC Standings with 1/22 Results:

1. Wooster 9-0 (15-1)
2. Wittenberg 7-2 (13-3)
3. Ohio Wesleyan 7-2 (13-3)
4. DePauw 7-2 (12-4)
5. Kenyon 4-5 (7-9)
5. Denison 4-5 (8-8)
7. Wabash 3-6 (4-11)
8. Hiram 2-7 (4-12)
8. Oberlin 2-7 (5-11)
10. Allegheny 0-9 (3-13)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 22, 2014, 10:31:25 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 22, 2014, 10:08:54 PM
All the NCAC 1/22 Final Scores:

Wooster 73  Allegheny 68
Wittenberg 66  Kenyon 54
Ohio Wesleyan 81  Oberlin 72
DePauw 70  Wabash 60
Denison 83  Hiram 77  note:  appears to be the final score with live stats stuck on 4 seconds left

So the top four make it through the first half of the conference schedule at a perfect 6-0 apiece, 24-0 overall against the bottom six. Odds are that someone will get a W against those four in the second round-robin, but they really do seem to be a solid step above this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 23, 2014, 09:53:06 AM
Could this have been a bit of a trap game for the Scots last night?  Coming off a huge road win over arch rival Witt and looking ahead to Saturday's big roadie at DePauw?  Wooster may have been caught looking ahead just a bit...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 23, 2014, 12:48:35 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on January 23, 2014, 09:53:06 AM
Could this have been a bit of a trap game for the Scots last night?  Coming off a huge road win over arch rival Witt and looking ahead to Saturday's big roadie at DePauw?  Wooster may have been caught looking ahead just a bit...

Not sure it was a trap but in the first half they were just plain lazy in the paint.  No weak side defense and no effort on the boards.  I'm sure there was an old fashioned arse chewing at halftime.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 24, 2014, 12:42:05 AM
Updated offense and defense efficiency ratings for the NCAC, through games of 1/22:


   Team      Offense      Defense      Margin      SOS Rank (Massey)   
   Wooster      111.2      90.5      20.7      4   
   Wittenberg      112.9      96.6      16.2      31   
   DePauw      105.9      93.4      12.6      40   
   OWU      106.2      95.2      10.9      41   
   Kenyon      99.2      104.4      -5.2      130   
   Oberlin      99.2      103.4      -4.2      164   
   Hiram      102.8      108.5      -5.7      185   
   Allegheny      98.4      106.0      -7.6      182   
   Denison      100.1      107.0      -6.9      71   
   Wabash      95.1      108.5      -13.3      42   


I have to say that Massey *really* likes the schedule strength of the OAC, CCIW and WIAC this year. The three leagues have 12 of the 20 highest ranking schedules on Massey right now:

Massey Schedule Rank Top 20:

1. Wilmington
2. Hope
3. Wheaton - played Wooster, Wittenberg
4. Wooster
5. Heidelberg
6. Augustana
7. UW - Stevens Point
8. Salisbury St
9. Illinois Wesleyan
10. UW - Whitewater
11. UW-LaCrosse
12. Carthage
13. Marietta - played Ohio Wesleyan, Wooster
14. Southwestern (TX)
15. Wash U - played DePauw
16. Pacific Lutheran
17. Manchester
18. UW - Platteville
19. Baldwin Wallace - played Wooster
20 Louisiana College

Ohio Wesleyan and Wittenberg also played Capital, rated 29th. OWU also played Trinity (TX), rated 27th. DePauw played Mount St. Joseph, rated 24th.

It's pretty clear that the top four NCAC teams are benefiting from having some of these teams on their non-conference schedules. Good for the league and good for our tournament prospects.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2014, 07:39:52 PM
Got curious about how Arizona Christian is doing. They are currently 15-3 and ranked 13th in the latest NAIA-1 coaches poll. They were ranked #7, but dropped their first two GSAC games, at 8th ranked Concordia and in double OT at The Master's College (13-4). Massey has the Eagles ranked 9th in NAIA-1 and #523 overall (Wooster is #309). (Disclaimer: I'm never sure I'm reading the Massey stuff right. If I am, I guess Massey really doesn't like the NAIA.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 25, 2014, 10:33:14 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 24, 2014, 07:39:52 PM
Got curious about how Arizona Christian is doing. They are currently 15-3 and ranked 13th in the latest NAIA-1 coaches poll. They were ranked #7, but dropped their first two GSAC games, at 8th ranked Concordia and in double OT at The Master's College (13-4). Massey has the Eagles ranked 9th in NAIA-1 and #523 overall (Wooster is #309). (Disclaimer: I'm never sure I'm reading the Massey stuff right. If I am, I guess Massey really doesn't like the NAIA.)

NAIA is his ratings weakness as he often doesn't have complete results for NAIA schools.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 25, 2014, 01:06:23 PM
Nice crowd at Depauw; must be an even dozen :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 25, 2014, 01:16:05 PM
And around and around we go.  Another pair of announcers that can't pronounce names.  Do some blankin' research.  It's  not FAN-el-y.  Who would even think that one would pronounce that name like that?  And it's not PAN-el!  I'm sorry, but this is EVERY TIME Wooster goes on the road, these kids are too lazy to do any pregame work.  Not to mention that they can't even say Wooster correctly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 25, 2014, 01:38:21 PM
At the Half: DePauw 37  Wooster 35

Back and forth first half with several lead changes and no margin bigger than 4 points.  Michael Wilkinson of DePauw hit a 35-40 foot shot right before the halftime buzzer. Wilkinson is leading the Tigers with 12 points and Xavier Brown is leading the Scots with 8 points.

DePauw shot 60% in the first half and made 6 of 9 three point shots.  If they keep that up, Wooster will a difficult time getting the win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 25, 2014, 02:28:05 PM
Wooster getting killed on the boards and it will probably cost them this game.  DePauw has 32 boards vs. 12 for Wooster (if stats are correct).

....and DePauw's video stream is fading...fading...buffering....buffering..buffering....probably just as well as Wooster is losing this game.

Student announcers for DePauw are fairly inept.  Goodwin has been "Goodwill" most of the game.  Pannell just hit a three pointer but they credited it to Milt Davis so they apparently can't read the number on a player's jersey.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 25, 2014, 02:41:40 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on January 25, 2014, 02:28:05 PM
Wooster getting killed on the boards and it will probably cost them this game.  DePauw has 32 boards vs. 12 for Wooster (if stats are correct).

With very few fans in the gym its possible the Wooster players were thrown off their game by hearing their names mispronounced by the radio/video guys.


Its been my observation over the years Wooster almost never gets beat on the glass and rarely if ever has been dominated on the boards like DePauw did today.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 25, 2014, 02:51:08 PM
Final:  DePauw 78  Wooster 74

Very nice win for the DePauw Tigers keeping them in the NCAC race and in consideration for a NCAA bid.  Congrats to the Tigers!

Wooster was outrebounded by DePauw 37 to 16 which is the biggest reason for the loss today.

Scots have now lost in Greencastle three years in a row so credit DePauw for playing tough at home.

Wooster is now 15-2, 9-1 NCAC.  Next game is Ohio Wesleyan at home on 1/29

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 25, 2014, 02:55:29 PM
If I were DePauw's Bob Dillon walking through the hand shake line

<shakes hand>"how does it feel?"
<shakes hand>"how does it feel?"
<shakes hand>"how does it feel?"
<shakes hand>"how does it feel?"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 25, 2014, 03:28:24 PM
Nice win by DePauw.  Some interesting things going on in Delaware right now too.  Big Red have been in front by as much as 12 points late in the first half . . .
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 25, 2014, 03:42:01 PM
Kind of surprising that this Denison team is putting up points the way it is this year, and now against a strong OWU team.  At the half, the Big Red lead 42-36.  Let's see if they can hold it.  They will have to keep finding the hoop from long range.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on January 25, 2014, 04:10:30 PM
Wasn't able to listen or watch the Wooster-DePauw game today (and have never been to DePauw), but always figured that their fans were a big part of their homecourt advantage against the Scots...wouldn't think they were today though because the boxscore lists attendance as 325.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 25, 2014, 04:37:53 PM
Well, as you might expect, Mike DeWitt makes the right defensive adjustments at halftime.  OWU shuts down the Big Red long shots and creates the turnovers needed to turn the game around.  Rieger, White and Gray take over on offense.  Solid second half play and good comeback by the Bishops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 25, 2014, 05:51:24 PM
Quote from: nicevilledave on January 25, 2014, 04:10:30 PM
Wasn't able to listen or watch the Wooster-DePauw game today (and have never been to DePauw), but always figured that their fans were a big part of their homecourt advantage against the Scots...wouldn't think they were today though because the boxscore lists attendance as 325.

Could have counted by twos and not got near 325.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2014, 06:25:36 PM
That's the third straight time that Wooster has lost in Greencastle.

Elsewise,
Wittenberg 61, Allegheny 43
OWU 83, Denison 75
Wabash 57, Oberlin 52
Kenyon at Hiram, PPD...I'm sure Hiram is buried today.

I believe Wooster now has a one-game lead on the triumverate of OWU, Witt, and DPU. Wooster is done with the New Tigers, and has the Old Ones and the Bishops at home. Witt has DPU at home and has to travel to Delaware. OWU gets both Tigers at home. [All of this is from memory, so corrections are appreciated.] Disregarding the remaining games against the Little Six (which is folly, since there will be some upsets before all is said and done), that gives Wooster a large advantage, with just two games against contenders, both at home, in addition to the one game cushion. DePauw has just two games, but both on the road. Witt is in the worst position with two roadies in three games vs. contenders.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 25, 2014, 06:30:16 PM
Quote from: sac on January 25, 2014, 10:33:14 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 24, 2014, 07:39:52 PM
Got curious about how Arizona Christian is doing. They are currently 15-3 and ranked 13th in the latest NAIA-1 coaches poll. They were ranked #7, but dropped their first two GSAC games, at 8th ranked Concordia and in double OT at The Master's College (13-4). Massey has the Eagles ranked 9th in NAIA-1 and #523 overall (Wooster is #309). (Disclaimer: I'm never sure I'm reading the Massey stuff right. If I am, I guess Massey really doesn't like the NAIA.)

NAIA is his ratings weakness as he often doesn't have complete results for NAIA schools.

The NAIA isn't as stringent about a lot of things, unlike the NCAA. Of course, we're spoiled because of this site and Pat and crew's dogged perseverance on getting the results. I think almost every comprehensive rating system has missing NAIA stuff.

But you can look at his NAIA ratings here: http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cb&sub=NAIA
As well as D3: http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?s=cb2014&sub=11620
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 25, 2014, 06:35:25 PM
David posted all of the 1/25 results

Updated NCAC Standings with 1/25 results:

1. Wooster 9-1 (15-2)
2. Wittenberg 8-2 (14-3)
2. Ohio Wesleyan 8-2 (14-3)
2. DePauw 8-2 (13-4)
5. Kenyon 4-5 (7-9)
6. Denison 4-6 (8-9)
6. Wabash 4-6 (5-11)
8. Hiram 2-7 (4-12)
9. Oberlin 2-8 (5-12)
10. Allegheny 0-10 (3-14)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 25, 2014, 06:38:27 PM
Quote from: athletics.kenyon.eduDue to Level 2 snow emergencies in Knox and surrounding counties, the Kenyon College basketball teams, as well as the track and field teams, will not participate in road contests today. Women's and men's basketball were originally scheduled to play at Hiram College with respective start times of 2 and 4 p.m. The track teams were scheduled to compete in a quad meet at The College of Wooster at noon. The meet will go on without Kenyon and Allegheny College present. The basketball games at Hiram have yet to be rescheduled.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 25, 2014, 06:54:28 PM
Remaining games among the NCAC's Top 4: H = Home, A = Away

Wooster (2):  OWU - H 1/29, Witt - H 2/15

Wittenberg (3):  OWU - A 2/5, DePauw - H 2/12,  Wooster - A 2/15

OWU (3):  Wooster - A 1/29, Witt - H 2/5, DePauw - H 2/22

DePauw (2):  Witt - A 2/12,  OWU - A 2/22

As David noted, Wooster has the easiest remaining schedule now with two home games.  Ohio Wesleyan has the next easiest schedule and they would be in great shape if they pull the upset at Wooster next Wednesday because they have two home games after playing at Wooster.

Of course, it is also possible that one of the bottom six teams pulls a big upset which impacts the title race.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 25, 2014, 07:02:02 PM
Wooster's two post players, Fanelly and Kipfer, played a combined total of 25 minutes in this game, instead of the usual 40.  I don't know why, amazingly it's not mentioned in the article on the Wooster website.

Fanelly played 18 minutes before fouling out.  0 rebounds.  Are you kidding?  Kipfer, who always spells him, played 7 minutes instead of the 22 that should have been warranted.  He had three boards in that time, which is an excellent pace.  Likely he was hurt, but nobody's talking.

This would go at least some distance towards explaining the crazy slaughter on the boards.  More than that, I have to believe that Kipfer would have done a better job guarding DePauw's big Fernitz, who shot 8-12 from the floor from point-blank range.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on January 25, 2014, 08:35:54 PM
Fanelly has a lot of talent and promise, but if he can't figure out how to stay out of foul trouble, the Scots are not going to advance very far when it matters. He has now fouled out of four games this year, including three of the past six, and had four fouls in six other games. And he is averaging less than 20 minutes a game. Over the course of the season, he's averaging one foul every 5.7 minutes played, meaning it's almost impossible to count on him to play more than half the game. Plus, when he gets in foul trouble, he becomes even less of a factor defensively and on the boards.

While Wingard and LaLonde don't play the post, their length and athleticism would have helped in games like this. They had the ability to come in from the wing and out jump people for the ball. They don't really have that now other than Evan Pannell.

This isn't meant to panic, as Wooster is still in real good shape and nearly won despite the bad rebounding effort. But when trying to picture how they might fare in the tournament, this is a pretty glaring problem that has to be figured out to some degree if they want to beat elite teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gobash83 on January 27, 2014, 11:38:26 AM
While I am not one who normally defends DePauw, I will just point out that students were not on campus Saturday as they were on a break between the end of January term and the start of the second semester.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 27, 2014, 12:14:15 PM
Meanwhile, the back half of the NCAC is fluid as well - jockeying for seeding and Hiram and Oberlin trying to make it into the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 27, 2014, 06:48:57 PM
Quote from: gobash83 on January 27, 2014, 11:38:26 AM
While I am not one who normally defends DePauw, I will just point out that students were not on campus Saturday as they were on a break between the end of January term and the start of the second semester.

And the weather was horrific.

Quote from: smedindy on January 27, 2014, 12:14:15 PM
Meanwhile, the back half of the NCAC is fluid as well - jockeying for seeding and Hiram and Oberlin trying to make it into the tournament.

Which reminds me...from the Kenyon website:
Quote from: athletics.kenyon.eduUPDATE: The men's basketball game at Hiram College has been rescheduled for Sunday, February 2 at 2 p.m.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 27, 2014, 07:11:12 PM
You used to say that you weren't smart enough to have an avatar.  Now that you do, I'm apparently not smart enough (or, as some would say, too senile) to know who it is. :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 27, 2014, 07:30:54 PM
O my god, you're kidding, right? It's Lewis Black (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cx9s3ZyJcV0) (nsfw, which could be his middle name), and quite frankly, since I've never seen the two of you in the same room at the same time...

The quote is from his third season appearance on The Big Bang Theory, in the episode entitled The Jiminy Conjecture (http://bigbangtheory.wikia.com/wiki/The_Jiminy_Conjecture).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 28, 2014, 01:29:01 PM
Heady times for the NCAC, with the top 4 all ranked in this week's Top 25 + all currently inside Massey's Top 30.

D3hoops Top 25
#5 Wooster
#17 Ohio Wesleyan
#18 Wittenberg
#23 DePauw

Massey
#3 Wooster
#16 Ohio Wesleyan
#23 Wittenberg
#27 DePauw

Have we ever had 4 teams in the actual ranking (and not just, say, 3 ranked + 1 ORV)?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2014, 06:03:31 PM
Furthermore, our Big Four are the only Great Lakes teams ranked. No OAC, no MIAA, no PrAC, but FOUR NCAC teams.

And of course we have the unanimous #1 on the women's side.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2014, 06:37:03 PM
Tonight's agenda:
DePauw at Denison (DPU leads 39-29 at the half)
Wabash at Wittenberg
Allegheny at Hiram
Oberlin at Kenyon
oh yes and...
OWU at Wooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2014, 07:42:40 PM
DePauw holds off a determined Denison comeback effort, 68-63. Denison, which never led and trailed by 13 moments before the half, got as close as 3 with 0:16 left but couldn't get over the hump.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2014, 08:10:16 PM
Witt leads Wabash 30-24 at the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 29, 2014, 08:41:00 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 34  Ohio Wesleyan 27

Wooster is being led by Doug Thorpe with 14 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2014, 09:05:12 PM
Wittenberg turns on the second-half jets and wins 70-50.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 29, 2014, 09:36:41 PM
Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 62  Wooster 60

Congratulations to Ohio Wesleyan on a huge road win.

When will Wooster learn how to run an offensive set against a zone defense??  ???   Wooster scored only 3 points in the last 6 minutes of the game!

Wooster is now 15-3, 9-2 NCAC.  Four way tie for the NCAC lead as OWU, Witt and DePauw are also 9-2
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2014, 09:40:48 PM
Very nice comeback from down 10 midway through the second half for the Bishops. Now we enjoy a 4-way tie for the conference lead, all at 9-2.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 29, 2014, 09:57:17 PM
This season is suddenly so much more interesting . . .
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 30, 2014, 10:17:20 AM
Quote from: GoRed on January 29, 2014, 09:57:17 PM
This season is suddenly so much more interesting . . .

We definitely have a barn burner of a title race on our hands.

We've also got quite the NCAA tournament chase on our hands, too. I have to imagine that someone from Wooster, Wittenberg, DePauw and Ohio Wesleyan will be on the outside looking in come March 3rd - I could see the NCAC being a 3-bid league this year but 4 seems like a stretch. Right now Wittenberg has the weakest position - see KnightSlappy's rankings on the Great Lakes boards - and the other three look to be in decent shape. But you aren't going to want to be one of the two teams losing the presumptive NCAC tournament semifinal games between these four...

Lots of basketball to play yet. Should be fun.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 30, 2014, 10:30:03 AM
The Wooster teams have officially reached the half-cycle point.  Fifteen years ago, their strengths were always inside.  Scoring, rebounding, defense.  They always had post men, good ones, and even some of the freshmen that came in contributed strongly in their first years.

That's no longer the case.  They now have two premier guards and several solid backups.  The three and four spots are handled capably.  But post play has become a real problem.

Offensively, the bigs have little to offer against quality opposition.  Fanelly doesn't yet have an offensive game.  His points come in transition or off stick-backs.  Kipfer can bull his way to the hoop, but that only works if the guy guarding him is smaller, which isn't always the case.  Opponents don't need to double down, which means that against a zone, Wooster's perimeter players find it hard to get open.  Most outside shots are contested.

Defensively, Fanelly just isn't big or strong enough.  That may come in a year or two, but it's not there now.  Kipfer is stronger, but doesn't have the foot speed.

DePauw, Wittenberg, and OWU each have a post that Wooster has been nearly unable to stop.

I can't find his name on the internet.  So, I don't know how to spell it.  But Dan Haviland (sp) needs to retire.  His lack of understanding and ridiculous home-team bias is an embarrassment to the college.  His new color man (and I can't remember his name) has to continually correct and set him straight.  Give this guy a chance to be the lead man, or to work with John Finn.  Either way would be a spectacular improvement.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on January 30, 2014, 11:09:00 AM
Some thoughts on the regular-season title race, taking a number-cruncher's point-of-view...

If we look only at head-to-head games among the top four (as if they win out against the other six), here are the standings:
WOO 3-2 (vs WIT left)
OWU 2-2 (vs WIT, vs DPU)
DPU 2-2 (at WIT, at OWU)
WIT 1-2 (at OWU, vs DPU, at WOO)

The remaining schedule looks easiest for WOO & OWU. Aggregate net score (WOO +25, OWU +3, DPU +3, WIT -31) favors WOO, but the Scots' two recent losses certainly don't.

Remaining big games:
WIT @ OWU (Feb. 5)
DPU @ WIT (Feb. 12)
WIT @ WOO (Feb. 15)
DPU @ OWU (Feb. 22)

The perhaps-unbreakable four-way tie occurs if those big games are won by OWU, WIT, WIT, and DPU, respectively, and all four continue to win against the other teams.  Every team would be 3-3, having split against each of the other top teams.  Unless there is something about away record in the tiebreakers, this one might come down to a draw for the top four conference tournament seeds.

If no major upset occurs, the most likely scenario is that the home teams win each of the big games, leading to this situation...
1&2) OWU & WOO 14-2 (split, 3-1 vs DPU & WIT), 3&4) WIT & DPU 12-4 (split, 1-3 vs OWU & WOO)

Other fairly likely possibilities (home teams win all but one of the big games) include
(WIT wins at OWU) 1) WOO 16-2, 2) WIT 15-3 (sweep of OWU), 3)OWU 15-3, 4) DPU 14-4
(DPU wins at WIT) 1) OWU 16-2 (sweep of DPU), 2) WOO 16-2 (split with DPU), 3) DPU 15-3, 4) WIT 13-5
(WIT wins at OWU) 1) OWU 16-2, 2&3) WIT & WOO 15-3 (split with all), 4) DPU 14-4
(DPU wins at OWU) 1) WOO 16-2, 2&3) DPU & OWU 15-3 (split with all), 4) WIT 14-4

Less likely (2 home teams win) possibilities include WIT winning the league outright, a WOO/DPU tie for first, and the four-way tie.

The tournament seems unlikely to be played in Greencastle, as the New Tigers have a pair of tough road games remaining, and won't have a sweep of either OWU or Wooster to help in the tiebreakers.  They likely need to win both at Witt and OWU, and ideally also a Witt win at Wooster.

All of that being said, it's still likely that one of the top four will lose a game to one of the other six.  There are 20 such games left, and even if you give the top teams a 95% chance of winning a particular game, the chance that they run the table is only about one-in-three.  Winning at Denison, Kenyon, Hiram, or Wabash isn't that easy, and Wooster got a scare at home from Allegheny last week.

Based on KnightSlappy's numbers, I think that OWU, Woo, and Depauw are all in pretty good shape to make the national tournament.  The only way I see all four going is if Witt wins the conference tournament after struggling down the stretch (so that the others are all in good position for Pool C berths.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2014, 05:29:17 PM
Getting four into the tournament is going to be tough. The ODAC got that number in a few years ago but their middle pack teams were of greater quality and distinction than the NCAC's current bunch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 01, 2014, 04:55:11 PM
Well, it is getting even more interesting this afternoon.  The Big Red take down the Tigers by three 63-60 and the Yeomen pull the big upset over the New Tigers in Oberlin!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 01, 2014, 05:01:18 PM
Quote from: GoRed on February 01, 2014, 04:55:11 PM
Well, it is getting even more interesting this afternoon.  The Big Red take down the Tigers by three 63-60 and the Yeomen pull the big upset over the New Tigers in Oberlin!

February basketball
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2014, 06:32:13 PM
I don't know what it is about Denison, but they certainly seem to have Wittenberg's number.

Denison 63, Wittenberg 60
Oberlin 62, DePauw 60
Wooster 75, Wabash 68
OWU 88, Hiram 61
Kenyon 61, Allegheny 53 (OT)

1. Wooster 10-2
1. OWU 10-2
3. DPU 9-3
3. Witt 9-3
5. Kenyon 6-5
6. Denison 5-7
7. Wabash 4-8
8. Hiram 3-8
9. Oberlin 3-9
10 Allegheny 0-12

Only "Big Four" game this week is Witt at OWU, Wednesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 01, 2014, 07:06:50 PM
Dan Fanelly played all of six minutes for Wooster.  No fouls, so I'm suspecting that he got hurt.  Anybody who watched the game know anything about this?  The Scots are thin enough in the post already.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 01, 2014, 07:21:18 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 01, 2014, 07:06:50 PM
Dan Fanelly played all of six minutes for Wooster.  No fouls, so I'm suspecting that he got hurt.  Anybody who watched the game know anything about this?  The Scots are thin enough in the post already.

Steve Moore described it as a bump or bruise in his postgame interview. He said that Fanelly first bumped the knee in practice yesterday, then it got hit again early in the game today. Moore said the training staff evaluation indicated there were no ligament or tendon concerns, just a bruise, but it was causing Fanelly enough discomfort that it didn't make sense to push it today. Sounds like it'll be a day-to-day thing with Dan in the coming week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 01, 2014, 07:33:29 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 01, 2014, 07:06:50 PM
Dan Fanelly played all of six minutes for Wooster.  No fouls, so I'm suspecting that he got hurt.  Anybody who watched the game know anything about this?  The Scots are thin enough in the post already.

I saw Wooster play a very average game this afternoon.  Scots led by 13 points at halftime but then allowed the Little Giants to come all the way back take a 3 point lead (57 to 54) with only 6 minutes left in the game.  Evan Pannell then nailed consecutive three pointers on the next two possessions to give a Wooster a 60-57 lead that they stretched out to the final margin of 7 points.  Wabash played tough all afternoon and Wooster only played well in spurts which leads me to believe that these Scots are not capable of a deep run in the NCAA tournament this year (I hope that I am wrong ???).

As Wooster Booster noted, Dan Fanelly played only 6 minutes because he appeared to bump/bruise his left knee.  He limped off the court and was rubbing his knee on the bench midway through the first half.   Fanelly did sit on the bench during the second half but he never played another minute in the game.  Hopefully, he will be able to play in upcoming games or Wooster will have significant issues in the post.  Josh Kipfer played virtually all of the second half because Kenny DeBoer also got into foul trouble and had to sit out an extended period.  Zach McCorkle played ~3 minutes in the second half to give Kipfer a chance to rehydrate and catch his breath before returning to the floor.

Two huge upsets by Oberlin and Denison today so Wooster and Ohio Wesleyan clearly have a big edge in the conference race with only home games left against the other top teams (Wooster has 1, OWU has 2).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2014, 01:11:27 PM
Quote from: sac on February 01, 2014, 05:01:18 PM
Quote from: GoRed on February 01, 2014, 04:55:11 PM
Well, it is getting even more interesting this afternoon.  The Big Red take down the Tigers by three 63-60 and the Yeomen pull the big upset over the New Tigers in Oberlin!

February basketball

So much for the big four being undefeated against the struggling six.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2014, 02:09:23 PM
Wooster struggled mightily against Wabash, as well. Only OWU seems to have had an easy day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 02, 2014, 03:41:56 PM
Kenyon dumps Hiram at the Doggie Dome, 84-75. Two road wins for the Lords this weekend makes it almost worth missing Puppy Bowl X.

KC now has a 2-game cushion on rival Denison for 5th place, while Hiram sinks into an 8th-place tie with Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 05, 2014, 05:03:03 PM
Maybe this is the game we see a little bit of Milt Davis again, since he went for 12 points and four rebounds in just 13 minutes of action against Kenyon last time. As soon as Wingard left the team, Davis filled at least some of his minutes in the rotation. For the five immediate games after Wingard left, Davis averaged nearly 11 minutes a game, averaging 4.6 ppg while shooting 7-of-13 from the field and 3-of-6 from three. Then they just stopped playing him. I know this is a small sample, but Davis has the high school pedigree that this is the kind of production that we should expect, if not more. And if Purcell and Goodwin were playing better, then I'd understand, but they aren't. After leading the NCAC in three-point field-goal percentage last year, Goodwin is shooting 23% from three and just 28% from the field. Defenses can completely ignore him. Purcell's overall numbers are pretty solid, but lately his shooting has been erratic, as he's riding an 1-for-11 streak from three-point range.

I guess my larger point is that the Scots need/should have done a better job of developing other offensive options outside of Thorpe and Brown. It's hard to imagine them making any kind of deep run in the tournament when you rely on two players so heavily, especially in the second half of games. And with that, they need to at least make defenses defend the paint once in a while. Even when teams were playing man-to-man, Wooster almost never throws the ball into the post, even if to try to get the defense to sag off the guards. When teams play zone, Kipfer and Fanelly might as well just stay on the defensive end for as many touches they are going to get. Wooster's offense runs through its guards, and that can be a winning formula. But if you don't even make the other team defend the paint, the perimeter defense can extend itself even farther out on the three-point shots, which is part of the reason Wooster's three-point shooting has been lagging lately.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2014, 06:48:39 PM
New poll (http://d3hoops.com/top25/index)...
OWU flying, up four slots to #13
The other three sinking; Wooster down 6 to #11; Wittenberg down 5 to #23; DePauw down to nowheresville, barely clinging to 5 measly points. Losing to Oberlin will do that to you.

Still no non-NCAC Great Lakes teams in the poll, although Calvin is getting close.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on February 05, 2014, 07:42:51 PM
Tigers come out hot...for once and force an OWU timeout.  Up in Delaware 14-5 in the early going.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on February 05, 2014, 08:05:36 PM
Nice pace to the game here at OWU.  Leahy and Rogers playing well for the Tigers and Bishops, respectively.  Witt leads 34-26 at half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 05, 2014, 08:31:13 PM
Holy cow, listening to the Wooster video broadcast tonight is an unexpected pleasure.  A professional duo.  I wish I knew the name of the lead man, but I don't.  He, along with color man John Finn, are doing a terrific job.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 05, 2014, 08:36:31 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 48  Kenyon 30

Hot shooting by the Scots who are being led by Xavier Brown with 15 points and Doug Thorpe with 10.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 05, 2014, 09:12:37 PM
Final:  Wittenberg 66  Ohio Wesleyan 55

Tigers with the big road win at Delaware.  Both Witt and OWU are now 10-3 in the NCAC.  Zach Leahy led Witt with 27 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 05, 2014, 09:26:51 PM
Final:  Wooster 86  Kenyon 56

Wooster with a convincing win over Kenyon tonight.  Scots were led by Xavier Brown with 21 points, Doug Thorpe with 15, Evan Pannell with 10 and Scott Purcell also with 10.  Scots shot 52% from the floor and made 9 three pointers.  Wooster also outrebounded Kenyon 41 to 30.

Wooster takes over sole possession of first place in the NCAC with this win.

Wooster is now 17-3, 11-2 NCAC  ;D   Next game is at Denison on Saturday afternoon 2/8.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2014, 07:38:33 AM
The only other scheduled game, Denison at Oberlin, was postponed until tonight. DePauw, Wabash, Hiram, and Allegheny were idle as they prepare for the semi-annual Long Trip this weekend, this time in Indiana.

aside: yes, I believe in the Oxford comma.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 06, 2014, 11:08:14 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 06, 2014, 07:38:33 AM
aside: yes, I believe in the Oxford comma.

Hear! Hear! Harumph!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 06, 2014, 12:28:05 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 06, 2014, 07:38:33 AM
aside: yes, I believe in the Oxford comma.

Dog bites man.  The question is, do you believe in the Oxnard comma?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2014, 09:10:41 PM
Denison 81, Oberlin 75. Appears to be final.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 07, 2014, 08:10:19 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 05, 2014, 09:26:51 PM
Final:  Wooster 86  Kenyon 56

Wooster with a convincing win over Kenyon tonight.  Scots were led by Xavier Brown with 21 points, Doug Thorpe with 15, Evan Pannell with 10 and Scott Purcell also with 10.  Scots shot 52% from the floor and made 9 three pointers.  Wooster also outrebounded Kenyon 41 to 30.

Wooster takes over sole possession of first place in the NCAC with this win.

Wooster is now 17-3, 11-2 NCAC  ;D   Next game is at Denison on Saturday afternoon 2/8.

Saw the game but late to the discussion.  Good to see Coach Moore letting them run a little bit.  When they're running the whole team seems to be more engaged and by not giving the opponent time to get set in their zone, rebounding improves.  Additionally, assists were up and turnovers remained the same.  Hope to see this trend continue.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2014, 07:16:06 PM
I think DePauw may have peaked against Wooster. As if losing at Oberlin wasn't bad enough, the New Tigers are threatening to top that achievement tonight, struggling with 3-16 Allegheny at home. Presently the Gators and Tigers are tied at 53 with just over 9:00 remaining.

Video link (http://www.depauw.edu/athletics/mens/basketball/schedule/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2014, 07:39:34 PM
65-64 Gheny, 0:31 left. Warning: before you click the video link, be prepared for some really bad basketball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2014, 07:51:40 PM
Final: Allegheny 69, DePauw 66. Gheny made their free throws when they had to to grab their first conference win in thirteen outings. DePauw, well, you can stick a fork in them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 07, 2014, 07:57:15 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 07, 2014, 07:51:40 PM
Final: Allegheny 69, DePauw 66. Gheny made their free throws when they had to to grab their first conference win in thirteen outings. DePauw, well, you can stick a fork in them.

Well put and it is likely two forks.....this ugly loss by DePauw eliminates them from the NCAC title race and it also blows up any slim chance they had at a Pool C bid into the NCAA tourney.  DePauw will need to win the NCAC tournament (and the automatic bid) if they hope to play in the NCAA tournament this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2014, 09:15:15 PM
Elsewise, Wabash 70, Hiram 68. Hiram led by a dozen at the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 08, 2014, 10:07:36 AM
hope the Wooster-Denison game today is a good one. Any one have any thoughts today. Would love to see a repeat of the big win the big red had last week. This is a crazy year in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2014, 03:34:50 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 43  Denison 31

Big Red led 25-22 with 6:30 left in the half then Wooster finished the half on a 21 to 6 run.  Scots being led by Kenny DeBoer with 12 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2014, 04:34:50 PM
Final:  Wooster 78  Denison 73

Whew! ::)  Wooster let Denison come back in the 2nd half and take the lead before the Scots regained control and got the road win.

Scots were led by Doug Thorpe with 20 points, Xavier Brown with 19 and Kenny DeBoer with 14.

Wooster is now 18-3, 12-2 NCAC ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2014, 04:40:11 PM
Final: Ohio Wesleyan 68  Kenyon 65

Nick Felhaber of OWU hit a three pointer with 6 seconds left in the game to break the 65-65 tie and the Lords could not match it.  Reuel Rogers led the Bishops with a double double of 20 points and 11 boards.

OWU moves to 11-3 in the NCAC
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2014, 04:53:09 PM
Another cigar-free result in Oberlin:
Wittenberg 70, Oberlin 63
This was a 3-point game inside the final minute. The final margin is attributable to Witt hitting free throws.

Meanwhile in Indiana,
DePauw 84, Hiram 71
Wabash 72, Allegheny 56
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 08, 2014, 07:46:33 PM
Current NCAC Standings with 2/8 Results:

1. Wooster 12-2 (18-3)
2. Wittenberg 11-3 (17-4)
2. Ohio Wesleyan 11-3 (17-4)
4. DePauw 10-4 (15-6)
5. Kenyon 7-7 (10-11)
6. Denison 6-8 (10-11)
6. Wabash 6-8 (7-13)
8. Oberlin 3-11 (6-15)
8. Hiram 3-11 (5-16)
10. Allegheny 1-13 (4-17)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 08, 2014, 10:19:18 PM
great game today at Denison. Easy to tell who had the experience in that situation. Good luck the rest of the way Wooster(unless you play Denison in the tournament). Oh I went to see the Mt. Union-Otterbein game this evening. There is a huge difference between the quality of play between the two leagues. Yes the quality of mt's opposition wasn't much but still the ncac is miles ahead of the oac if mt. is the best in the conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 09, 2014, 08:38:29 PM
Just popped into my head today that Kenny DeBoar at this time last year was a sophomore (athletically), but decided before this season that this would be his last year (paying another year of tuition will do that to you), since he attending a Div. II school for one year before coming to Wooster. Would be nice to see him in a Scot uniform next year along the front line.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2014, 06:37:25 PM
New poll (http://d3hoops.com/top25/men/2013-14/week10)
Wooster ascends to #9 by virtue of Wesley and WPI dropping past them.
OWU hovers at #14 while Wittenberg moves up strongly to #15, 20 points in arrears of the Bishops. Now, of course, they have the same records, and Wittenberg swept OWU this year, so it is a little odd to have them juxtaposed in this way, especially with a fairly dominant Witt win at Rickey within the past week. I guess the rationale is that, while each team has one "forgettable" loss among its 4 setbacks, Witt's is recent and at home (Denison 2/1) while OWU's is ancient and at a neutral site (LaVerne 11/22).
DePauw shed the few votes they still clung to last week.

Once again, the NCAC giants are the only Great Lakes teams in the poll. Mt. Union and Marietta are within the "next 5" teams receiving votes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 11, 2014, 04:24:50 PM
I would love to see the Denison-Kenyon game tomorrow but the weather I think will keep me from making the trek to Gambier. Have to check out Marietta tomorrow night and see if they can give someone for the ncac a good game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 11, 2014, 05:26:16 PM
Quote from: ohiofan1954 on February 11, 2014, 04:24:50 PM
I would love to see the Denison-Kenyon game tomorrow but the weather I think will keep me from making the trek to Gambier. Have to check out Marietta tomorrow night and see if they can give someone for the ncac a good game.

http://d3hoops.com/teams/Marietta/men/2013-14/index
Wooster 81 Marietta 78
Ohio Wesleayan 79 Marietta 74

Yes!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2014, 06:53:23 PM
Quote from: sac on February 11, 2014, 05:26:16 PM
Quote from: ohiofan1954 on February 11, 2014, 04:24:50 PM
I would love to see the Denison-Kenyon game tomorrow but the weather I think will keep me from making the trek to Gambier. Have to check out Marietta tomorrow night and see if they can give someone for the ncac a good game.

http://d3hoops.com/teams/Marietta/men/2013-14/index
Wooster 81 Marietta 78
Ohio Wesleayan 79 Marietta 74

Yes!

Yes, Marietta is a very competitive team in the Great Lake region and they could be a factor in the NCAA tournament this year.  It is also worth noting that the two results posted by Sac both occurred on Marietta's home floor.

So, the NCAC teams notched solid road wins in those matchups.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MIAA in Exile on February 11, 2014, 08:34:32 PM
OWU Marietta was at Defiance, not at Marietta
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 11, 2014, 10:48:07 PM
Quote from: MIAA in Exile on February 11, 2014, 08:34:32 PM
OWU Marietta was at Defiance, not at Marietta

Good correction -- thanks.  I looked quickly at Marietta's schedule and did not see the "at" next to OWU and assumed that the game was played at Marietta.  Should have checked the full stats tab. ::)

By the way, Marietta is 9-1 at home this season (from their season stats) so Wooster is obviously responsible for that sole home loss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 12, 2014, 03:31:46 PM
thanks for the info on Marietta games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2014, 08:40:18 PM
Halftime in Springfield:
DePauw 30, Wittenberg 25
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 12, 2014, 08:43:12 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 41  Hiram 33

Xavier Brown leading the Scots with 20 points in the half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2014, 08:59:11 PM
Wabash leading OWU 64-59 with 2:22 remaining.  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2014, 09:18:12 PM
Wabash shocks OWU 77-66. The final score is inflated by 7 technical free throws with 0:11 left after a nasty fracas involving a body slam and two ejections, including Coach DeWitt. But they were going to win anyway.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2014, 09:19:34 PM
Meanwhile, DePauw is hammering Wittenberg, 59-41 at some indeterminate time in the 2nd half.

Update: DePauw wins 71-49. Wooster will remain in 1st regardless of the outcome of their game with Hiram. Which, by the way, is very much in doubt, as the Scots lead by just 2 within the last 2 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 12, 2014, 09:42:30 PM
Final:  Wooster 76  Hiram 71

Wooster squeaks out the road win over a Hiram team that shot ~50% from the floor.

Wooster top scorers:
Xavier Brown 28
Doug Thorpe 17
Scott Purcell 11 (three 3 pointers including a big one with 1:45 left)

For Hiram, Aaron Stefanov had 27 points and Chris Zurowski added 20 points.

Wooster is now 13-2 NCAC and has a 2 game lead over Witt, OWU and DePauw who are all 11-4  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2014, 09:53:33 PM
Just for completeness' sake

Denison 75, Kenyon 68...you may not know that this is a huge backyard rivalry; a big statement win for the Big Red
Allegheny 73, Oberlin 61
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 12, 2014, 10:04:47 PM
Current NCAC Standings with all 2/12 Results:

1. Wooster 13-2 (19-3)
2. Wittenberg 11-4 (17-5)
2. Ohio Wesleyan 11-4 (17-5)
2. DePauw 11-4 (16-6)
5. Denison 7-8 (11-11)
5. Kenyon 7-8 (10-12)
5. Wabash 7-8 (8-13)
8. Oberlin 3-12 (6-16)
8. Hiram 3-12 (5-17)
10. Allegheny 2-13 (5-17)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2014, 11:52:02 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 12, 2014, 09:18:12 PM
Wabash shocks OWU 77-66. The final score is inflated by 7 technical free throws with 0:11 left after a nasty fracas involving a body slam and two ejections, including Coach DeWitt. But they were going to win anyway.

I missed it. Was it the NCAC refs being NCAC refs or was it a legit hard foul and shenanigans? The Wabash highlights online didn't have that play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 13, 2014, 06:49:46 AM
Oh, it's a shame the replay isn't available. It started at midcourt, where (evidently) a very hard screen set by (I think) Reuel Rogers sent a Wabash player to his knees in agony. No call on that, and Rogers goes into the lane, jostles with Marcus Kammrath for rebound position, then simply grabs him by the waist and hurls him to the floor, WWE-style. The Wabash announcers correctly described it as a takedown; "if this were wrestling, he'd have just scored two points." Rogers ends up on top of him, evidently going for the pin. Other Wabash guys intercede, small fracas breaks out but no general fight. Remarkably, Rogers is not ejected (but does get both personal and technical fouls), but Claude Gray is for coming off the bench, and DeWitt is for getting two T's while arguing with the refs about god-knows-what. Kammrath was also T'd up, according to the box score, but OWU did not get any free throws.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 13, 2014, 05:48:13 PM
Another episode of Hoopsville is slated for tonight and #15 Wittenberg MBB coach Bill Brown joins us along with the following guests:

- Pomona-Pitzer MBB coach Charles Katsiaficas
- #2 Hope WBB coach Brian Morehouse
- Stevenson WBB coach Jackie Boswell
- Maryville WBB coach Darrin Travillian
- Trinity (TX) WBB coach Cameron Hill
- Nazareth MBB coach Kevin Broderick
- St. Mary's (Md.) MBB coach Chris Harney

Show starts at 7 PM EST and will run at least 2:30 tonight.

You can tune in here: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2013-14/feb13 (http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2013-14/jan12)

You can also follow us on social media
- Twitter (@d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) and #Hoopsville)
- Facebook (www.facebook.com/Hoopsville (http://www.facebook.com/Hoopsville))
- Email (hoopsville@d3hoops.com)

Thanks and enjoy the show!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 13, 2014, 09:42:36 PM
Wittenberg's Bill Brown was on hoopsville, about the 35 minutes mark
http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/index

"DePauw's just better than us", quote for the type setters.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kenyonfan on February 14, 2014, 07:47:51 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 13, 2014, 06:49:46 AM
Oh, it's a shame the replay isn't available. It started at midcourt, where (evidently) a very hard screen set by (I think) Reuel Rogers sent a Wabash player to his knees in agony. No call on that, and Rogers goes into the lane, jostles with Marcus Kammrath for rebound position, then simply grabs him by the waist and hurls him to the floor, WWE-style. The Wabash announcers correctly described it as a takedown; "if this were wrestling, he'd have just scored two points." Rogers ends up on top of him, evidently going for the pin. Other Wabash guys intercede, small fracas breaks out but no general fight. Remarkably, Rogers is not ejected (but does get both personal and technical fouls), but Claude Gray is for coming off the bench, and DeWitt is for getting two T's while arguing with the refs about god-knows-what. Kammrath was also T'd up, according to the box score, but OWU did not get any free throws.

The full replay is here: http://new.livestream.com/wabashcollegelive/events/2765147/ (http://new.livestream.com/wabashcollegelive/events/2765147/) with the events in question at around the 1:53 mark.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on February 14, 2014, 09:38:33 AM
Thanks for this KenyonFan. Wabash has a perfect view of the Rogers take down from the baseline. I would like to think if the Refs saw it as clearly as the camera, he would have been ejected. Would an ejection mean an automatic one-game suspension? I have no idea.

I know Wooster has company with the other top teams in the NCAC right now in terms of struggling during the second half of their schedule in comparison to the first go around, but the point differential between teams Wooster has played twice this year is quite striking. There are six teams that Wooster has played a second time this year. In the first six games, which were all victories, the Scots were outscoring their opponents by 21 points per game, and five of the games were decided by 13 points or more. The next time Wooster played  these same six teams, two of which were losses, the Scots were outscoring their opponents by just over 5 points per game, and only one game was decided by more than seven points. So Wooster has seen a 16-point drop in their offensive output in comparison to their opponent. That is a pretty striking turn of events. If you take away the second Kenyon game, which was a 20-point win, the difference drops to just 2.2 points per game. I would say that part of this can be explained by the fact that some of the lower half teams are playing better now than they did before. But I also think Wooster has kind of hit a wall with their overall play, if not lost a little bit from where they were several weeks ago. The Scots need to make some adjustments to get better, as other teams are making adjustments to them and it's showing.

So based on the average margin difference of 16 points we've seen, Wittenberg should win Saturday by nine points, since they lost by seven points the first time :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 14, 2014, 11:36:56 AM
Just saw it.

It was a clean, hard screen. CALL OUT THE SCREENS!

But then, disaster for OWU. I don't know what went through Rogers' head. Thankfully Wabash didn't retaliate more than it did. And I think DeWitt must have had issues all game with the refs - he's normally not like that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 14, 2014, 06:31:28 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 14, 2014, 09:38:33 AM
Thanks for this KenyonFan. Wabash has a perfect view of the Rogers take down from the baseline. I would like to think if the Refs saw it as clearly as the camera, he would have been ejected. Would an ejection mean an automatic one-game suspension? I have no idea.

I know Wooster has company with the other top teams in the NCAC right now in terms of struggling during the second half of their schedule in comparison to the first go around, but the point differential between teams Wooster has played twice this year is quite striking. There are six teams that Wooster has played a second time this year. In the first six games, which were all victories, the Scots were outscoring their opponents by 21 points per game, and five of the games were decided by 13 points or more. The next time Wooster played  these same six teams, two of which were losses, the Scots were outscoring their opponents by just over 5 points per game, and only one game was decided by more than seven points. So Wooster has seen a 16-point drop in their offensive output in comparison to their opponent. That is a pretty striking turn of events. If you take away the second Kenyon game, which was a 20-point win, the difference drops to just 2.2 points per game. I would say that part of this can be explained by the fact that some of the lower half teams are playing better now than they did before. But I also think Wooster has kind of hit a wall with their overall play, if not lost a little bit from where they were several weeks ago. The Scots need to make some adjustments to get better, as other teams are making adjustments to them and it's showing.

So based on the average margin difference of 16 points we've seen, Wittenberg should win Saturday by nine points, since they lost by seven points the first time :)

I'll take the Scots plus 8 1/2
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 14, 2014, 07:44:37 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 14, 2014, 09:38:33 AM
Thanks for this KenyonFan. Wabash has a perfect view of the Rogers take down from the baseline. I would like to think if the Refs saw it as clearly as the camera, he would have been ejected. Would an ejection mean an automatic one-game suspension?

No, not unless the ref who called the foul reported it to the NCAC head of officials as a flagrant 2 technical, which is the tech assessed for fighting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 14, 2014, 09:15:32 PM
I missed the Wednesday results so I'm late pointing out the four year seniors of Doug Thorpe and Scott Purcell experienced their 100th Wooster win (100-17). They represent the 12th consecutive senior class to achieve that feat.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 15, 2014, 11:37:51 AM
Quote from: seinfeld on February 14, 2014, 09:38:33 AM

So based on the average margin difference of 16 points we've seen, Wittenberg should win Saturday by nine points, since they lost by seven points the first time :)

This would be true if Wooster were playing a team outside of the top 4, but the reality is, Witt hasn't exactly been playing lights out as they've had two bad losses at home no less recently...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 15, 2014, 03:06:29 PM
Kenyon 75 DePauw 67
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nicevilledave on February 15, 2014, 04:49:27 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 14, 2014, 09:15:32 PM
I missed the Wednesday results so I'm late pointing out the four year seniors of Doug Thorpe and Scott Purcell experienced their 100th Wooster win (100-17). They represent the 12th consecutive senior class to achieve that feat.

To strap-hang on goscots' post, Wooster goes for their 20th win tonight and with a win, will have their 18th consecutive season of 20 or more wins.  Pretty awesome basketball program.  And, by my count, Wooster's next win will give Steve Moore 726 career wins.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2014, 05:40:54 PM
Quote from: sac on February 15, 2014, 03:06:29 PM
Kenyon 75 DePauw 67
Remember when the Top 4 were 24-0 against the Little 6? Yeah, me neither.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 15, 2014, 05:54:19 PM
While Denison spanked Wabash at Livingston 92-57, Kenyon kept up with them in the race for the fifth seed by downing DePauw in Greencastle 75-67.  The Big Red seem to have a leg up on the Lords and the Little Giants schedule-wise for the fifth spot, with their final two games home against Hiram and @ Allegheny.  Kenyon has games @ Witt then home versus Wabash.  The last game versus the Little Giants may very well be a fight for the 6/7 spots.

Oberlin had to win at Hiram today to keep their chances for the 8th seed alive and did.  Their last two games are against OWU and Wooster, but Hiram has Denison and Witt and Allegheny has Wooster and Denison.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 15, 2014, 06:00:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 15, 2014, 05:40:54 PM
Quote from: sac on February 15, 2014, 03:06:29 PM
Kenyon 75 DePauw 67
Remember when the Top 4 were 24-0 against the Little 6? Yeah, me neither.

Since beating Wooster DePauw is just 3-3 with those 3 losses coming against lowly Allegheny, Oberlin and Kenyon.  And two of those 3 losses came in Greencastle?!   :o. And how to you go from giving Witt an 18 point beatdown in Springfield to losing to Kenyon at home?  ???

T-minus 90 minutes to tip-off at Timken for Witt/Woo round 2!  GO SCOTS!!!  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2014, 06:23:06 PM
At the end of January, assuming I counted right, the quartet of DePauw, OWU, Wittenberg, and Wooster was a combined 29-0 against the other six. So far in February, the Big 4 are 9-5, including today's results (which also include OWU's overtime win today at home over Allegheny.) Back out Wooster's 4-0 mark and the other Big 3 are just .500 on the month against the second division.

It's been pointed out in here before, but I think it is worth repeating: what really separates the Wooster program from the rest of the conference is that they almost never lose the games they should win. They will sometimes lose to Witt or OWU or whoever else is in vogue that year, but they have winning records against the Hirams, Oberlins, and Kenyons that stagger the imagination. And they win championships when, inevitably, the other contenders slip up against the bottom half. Take this year for example: if they lose to Wittenberg tonight (perish the thought!), the Scots will have split with each of the other title contenders and yet will still have a one-game lead over Witt and OWU, and two over DPU, and will clinch another regular season title with wins next week over Allegheny and Oberlin--wins you can already pretty much bank on.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2014, 07:51:28 PM
Wooster's being badly outhustled so far in the first half. Wittenberg is playing like they want to win more than anything; Wooster looks disinterested. And Fannelly hasn't yet showed me any reason to be in the game.  :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2014, 08:05:56 PM
wooscotsfan must be at the game.
Halftime: Wooster 30, Wittenberg 27
Masin has 12; Brown and Purcell have 10 and 9, respectively.
Witt leads in both rebounds (22-17) and turnovers (9-4).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2014, 09:08:00 PM
Scots played better in the second half, win 60-55 and clinch a share of the regular season conference title for, what, the 87th straight year?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2014, 09:59:59 PM
1. Wooster 14-2 (at Allegheny, vs. Oberlin)
2. OWU 12-4 (at Oberlin, vs. DePauw)
3. DePauw 11-5 (vs. Wabash, at OWU)
3. Wittenberg 11-5 (vs. Kenyon, at Hiram)
5. Denison 8-8 (vs. Hiram, at Allegheny)
5. Kenyon 8-8 (at Wittenberg, vs. Wabash)
7. Wabash 7-9 (at DePauw, at Kenyon)
8. Oberlin 4-12 (vs. OWU, at Wooster)
9. Hiram 3-13 (at Denison, vs. Wittenberg)
10. Allegheny 2-14 (vs. Wooster, vs. Denison)

You can pencil in two losses for Oberlin (they will clinch 8th place with a win in either game), who split their series with Hiram. Hiram really needs to win both of their games to reach the tournament, as a quick glance suggests that Oberlin holds a strong tiebreaker advantage. (Basically, I believe Hiram would have to beat Witt, have Witt beat Kenyon, and have DePauw get swept, for them to win a tiebreaker with Oberlin. This all presumes that 'Gheny loses at least one of their games to prevent a three-way tie.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2014, 11:21:36 PM
Back from Timken where along with over 3,000 fans (great crowd) I watched Wooster essentially wrap up another NCAC regular season title!  ;D

Tonight's game was an offensive struggle as both teams hustled on defense and there were a limited number of open shots.  Wooster's defense won this game tonight because Doug Thorpe was 1 of 13 from the floor and Evan Pannell was 1 of 8.  On the positive side, Scott Purcell was extremely efficient in scoring 11 points on just 3 shots (3 of 3 on three pointers) and 2 free throws.  Xavier Brown had another big game with 19 points and he deserves the NCAC player of the week award with 47 points in 2 games.  Rebounds and turnovers were basically even tonight so the difference was slightly better shooting by Wooster on three pointers (7 made vs. only 5 for Witt) and free throws.

Wooster is now 20-3, 14-2 NCAC. :)  With 6 losses already, Witt is in danger of missing the NCAA tourney unless they win the NCAC automatic bid.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 15, 2014, 11:26:29 PM
I think that Wooster also clinches the #1 seed in the tourney with the win tonight. The Scots and Bishops could end up tied, but Wooster would win the tie breaker based on their respective records vs Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 15, 2014, 11:32:26 PM
Congratulations to Wooster Coaches Steve Moore and Doug Cline on another 20 win season!

Wooster has now had 18 consecutive seasons with 20 or more wins :)...which is extremely impressive and the result of excellent coaching!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2014, 11:56:15 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 15, 2014, 11:26:29 PM
I think that Wooster also clinches the #1 seed in the tourney with the win tonight. The Scots and Bishops could end up tied, but Wooster would win the tie breaker based on their respective records vs Witt.
Not so fast my friend. For Wooster and OWU to finish tied, OWU would have to win out, including a second win over DePauw. Should that happen, and should DPU finish tied with or ahead of Witt in the standings, OWU would secure the tiebreaker.

Unlikely, I know, especially as it presupposes Wooster losses to both Allegheny and Oberlin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 16, 2014, 12:11:14 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 15, 2014, 11:56:15 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 15, 2014, 11:26:29 PM
I think that Wooster also clinches the #1 seed in the tourney with the win tonight. The Scots and Bishops could end up tied, but Wooster would win the tie breaker based on their respective records vs Witt.
Not so fast my friend. For Wooster and OWU to finish tied, OWU would have to win out, including a second win over DePauw. Should that happen, and should DPU finish tied with or ahead of Witt in the standings, OWU would secure the tiebreaker.

Unlikely, I know, especially as it presupposes Wooster losses to both Allegheny and Oberlin.

Good catch David.  My faulty memory had me thinking that DePauw had won that first meeting with OWU! 

So for the Scots NOT to get the #1 seed they would have to lose to Allegheny and Oberlin, OWU would need to beat Oberlin and DePauw, and Witt would need to lose to Kenyon or Hiram (or both if DePauw loses to Wabash on Wednesday).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 16, 2014, 12:49:26 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 14, 2014, 11:36:56 AM
Just saw it.

It was a clean, hard screen. CALL OUT THE SCREENS!

But then, disaster for OWU. I don't know what went through Rogers' head. Thankfully Wabash didn't retaliate more than it did. And I think DeWitt must have had issues all game with the refs - he's normally not like that.

Agree, totally legal screen.  But for the rest of it, after watching the replay, I was surprised.  After reading the accounts on here, I had expected far worse.  Yeah, it was a foul, but that was no body slam, nobody was ever off the ground.  They were tangled up and Rogers pulled the other guy down.  When he ended up on top, it didn't look like he did anything at all.  Then somebody came to pull him off and that was it.  Lots of other players overreacted, it seemed to me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 17, 2014, 11:32:23 AM
Reprising my occasional series checking in on NCAC offensive/defensive efficiency numbers:

Updated through games of Feb. 15:

   Team      Offense      Defense      Margin      SOS Rank   
   Wooster      112.5      94.5      18.0      13   
   Wittenberg      109.8      96.6      13.2      26   
   DePauw      109.0      97.4      11.6      47   
   OWU      105.8      96.6      9.1      38   
   Denison      103.9      106.7      -2.8      34   
   Kenyon      99.6      103.9      -4.3      77   
   Oberlin      100.5      104.9      -4.4      130   
   Allegheny      98.8      105.6      -6.8      110   
   Hiram      103.1      112.3      -9.2      178   
   Wabash      97.3      108.6      -11.2      39   

Notes/Observations:

- Wooster has now established itself as both the most efficient offense and stingiest defense in the league, against the toughest schedule to boot. Another way to say this is that Wittenberg's offensive rating has regressed far enough to now be below the Scots.

- Denison continues to improve their overall rating/margin, and now seems to have emerged as the proper NCAC #5 seed. Massey also rates the Big Red's schedule as quite challenging.

- 5 teams (Woo, Witt, OWU, Denison, 'Bash) have SOS ranks that are in the top tenth of all DIII; the entire league is within the top third. (Oberlin's 130th-ranked schedule is in the 31st percentile) A good showing from the league this year on the SOS front.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 17, 2014, 05:19:54 PM
One thing that doing those off/def ratings has reminded me this year, is that the strength of this year's Wooster squad might just be in the way in which they will "out-fundamental" opponents - specifically via making free throws and not turning the ball over.

Free throws: Wooster sits 7th in all of DIII with a 78.4% made FT percentage. It's their best FT campaign since the 2002-03 final-four bound team - led by Bryan Nelson at 88.5% - connected on 79.3% of FTs. And it's a dramatic improvement over the rather pedestrian 71.4% last year and 69.8% of the year before. An advantage at the line might only add up to a few points a night, but every point matters and there have been several games this season where the charity stripe has been a difference maker for the Scots.

Turnovers: Wooster sits 10th in all of DIII with 10.1 turnovers/game - easily the Scots' best mark in the past dozen years. And this is true whether you look at the nominal figure - 10.1/game - or the percentage of possessions that result in a turnover (15.3% this year), which helps adjust the turnover stat for differences in pace of play between different teams.

Here's a table of turnover data for the Scots, going back to the 2002-2003 final-four bound campaign:

   Year      TO/gm      TO%   
   2013-2014      10.1      15.3%   
   2012-2013      12.3      18.5%   
   2011-2012      12.9      19.1%   
   2010-2011      12.7      19.1%   
   2009-2010      14.0      21.0%   
   2008-2009      13.7      19.6%   
   2007-2008      13.7      18.9%   
   2006-2007      13.2      18.3%   
   2005-2006      12.5      16.1%   
   2004-2005      13.8      20.4%   
   2003-2004      11.4      17.8%   
   2002-2003      14.7      21.7%   

It's a pretty noticeable change for the better this season and again, those extra productive possessions can only help the Scots. The Scots also *force* turnovers on 22.4% of opponents' possessions this year - and that positive turnover differential means more possessions and more chances for the Scots in an average game.

Some of my optimism about what this team might be able to accomplish in March comes from seeing these data points and realizing that this is a team that generally won't beat itself, and that what they sometimes lack in offensive creativity/movement they make up for by being really good at some other basics and fundamentals.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 17, 2014, 07:39:12 PM
One thing about turnover stats this year is the rule changes have decreased turnovers across all divisions.  Woosters 15.8% is still very good, probably top quarter of D3, but part of the improvement over last year can be attributed to the rule changes.  Just something to consider.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 17, 2014, 09:22:46 PM
Quote from: sac on February 17, 2014, 07:39:12 PM
One thing about turnover stats this year is the rule changes have decreased turnovers across all divisions.  Woosters 15.8% is still very good, probably top quarter of D3, but part of the improvement over last year can be attributed to the rule changes.  Just something to consider.

Thanks sac, a good point. One thing I did notice is that Wooster's 15.3% turnover rate is second in the NCAC to OWU, whose rate was 15.0% - which, small sample size, etc - would be the top 20% of the NCAC, suggesting your "top quarter" estimate is plausible.

In some ways, actually, Wooster was more anomalous for forcing turnovers on 22% of possessions - no one else in the NCAC is above 19%.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 17, 2014, 11:06:53 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 17, 2014, 09:22:46 PM
Quote from: sac on February 17, 2014, 07:39:12 PM
One thing about turnover stats this year is the rule changes have decreased turnovers across all divisions.  Woosters 15.8% is still very good, probably top quarter of D3, but part of the improvement over last year can be attributed to the rule changes.  Just something to consider.

Thanks sac, a good point. One thing I did notice is that Wooster's 15.3% turnover rate is second in the NCAC to OWU, whose rate was 15.0% - which, small sample size, etc - would be the top 20% of the NCAC, suggesting your "top quarter" estimate is plausible.

In some ways, actually, Wooster was more anomalous for forcing turnovers on 22% of possessions - no one else in the NCAC is above 19%.

Trine is right around 14% and they are the national leader with the fewest turnovers per game.  Wooster is #10.  14% is also pretty close to leading D1.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 18, 2014, 01:24:51 AM
Quote from: sac on February 17, 2014, 07:39:12 PM
One thing about turnover stats this year is the rule changes have decreased turnovers across all divisions.  Woosters 15.8% is still very good, probably top quarter of D3, but part of the improvement over last year can be attributed to the rule changes.  Just something to consider.

Sac, it's really late and probably my mind has already gone to bed.  Wooster's turnovers/game of 10.1 is 10th best in all of DIII.  Wikipedia says there are 449 DIII schools.  Given that, it's hard for me to imagine that they'd be down as far as the 20-25th percentile in either turnover stat.  Certainly they're within the top 5%, right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 18, 2014, 10:49:41 AM
kb, not to dampen your optimism but I heard Mike Breckenridge run off a stat during one of their recent games that was quite alarming regarding this Wooster team.  And that is, their current FG % on the season of 44% is the lowest of any team Steve Moore has coached in his tenure at Wooster!!!   :o

Big part of this is because Wooster is lacking a true scoring presence inside and are too perimeter oriented.  This is why I'm having a tough time believing this team can make a run for Salem come March.  All it takes is one off shooting night and they are done. 

Another concern I have regarding this team is how they seem to have trouble finishing games.  They built a 12 point 2nd half lead on Saturday and then failed to score a single point for over 4 minutes allowing Witt to come all the way back to nearly tie the game.  Against OWU, they led by 10 with 10 to go at home and lost.  At OWU, they led by almost 20 and let OWU come back to within 6 at one point. At Witt, the Scots led by 21 early in the 2nd before letting Witt come all the way back to within 4 on several occasions.  Hosting Wabash, Wooster led by 15 at the start of the 2nd half and then allowed the Lil Giants to come all the way back to take the lead before rallying to win by 7. 

I could go on, but I think the point has been made.  At least they seem to know this is a problem as Xavier Brown was quoted after the Witt game saying they need to do a better job finishing games as they seem to be playing not to lose as opposed to playing to win.  We shall see if they can do something to rectify this problem but it has been a season long thing so I'm not hopeful this is something that is fixable at this point of the season... :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 18, 2014, 11:11:47 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 18, 2014, 01:24:51 AM
Quote from: sac on February 17, 2014, 07:39:12 PM
One thing about turnover stats this year is the rule changes have decreased turnovers across all divisions.  Woosters 15.8% is still very good, probably top quarter of D3, but part of the improvement over last year can be attributed to the rule changes.  Just something to consider.

Sac, it's really late and probably my mind has already gone to bed.  Wooster's turnovers/game of 10.1 is 10th best in all of DIII.  Wikipedia says there are 449 DIII schools.  Given that, it's hard for me to imagine that they'd be down as far as the 20-25th percentile in either turnover stat.  Certainly they're within the top 5%, right?

The number that play men's basketball is a little over 400, but still.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 18, 2014, 11:28:48 AM
Well top 5 would be top quarter, wouldn't it. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 18, 2014, 12:41:05 PM
Quote from: sac on February 18, 2014, 11:28:48 AM
Well top 5 would be top quarter, wouldn't it. :)

I'm still laughing.  You've been applauded.  If I remember (fat chance), I'll do it again in 24 hours. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 18, 2014, 12:51:20 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 18, 2014, 10:49:41 AM
kb, not to dampen your optimism but I heard Mike Breckenridge run off a stat during one of their recent games that was quite alarming regarding this Wooster team.  And that is, their current FG % on the season of 44% is the lowest of any team Steve Moore has coached in his tenure at Wooster!!!   :o

Oh, I totally agree about Wooster's a crummy shooting team this season, at least by their own typically lofty standards. Which is part of why I went looking for other areas where the Scots have excelled - and FTs and turnovers stand out.

So this year's Scots team compensates for mediocre shooting in part by making FTs, not turning the ball over much, and forcing lots of turnovers. Hopefully those skills translate to tournament play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 18, 2014, 02:32:35 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 18, 2014, 12:51:20 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 18, 2014, 10:49:41 AM
kb, not to dampen your optimism but I heard Mike Breckenridge run off a stat during one of their recent games that was quite alarming regarding this Wooster team.  And that is, their current FG % on the season of 44% is the lowest of any team Steve Moore has coached in his tenure at Wooster!!!   :o

Oh, I totally agree about Wooster's a crummy shooting team this season, at least by their own typically lofty standards. Which is part of why I went looking for other areas where the Scots have excelled - and FTs and turnovers stand out.

So this year's Scots team compensates for mediocre shooting in part by making FTs, not turning the ball over much, and forcing lots of turnovers. Hopefully those skills translate to tournament play.

Something else needs to be pointed out here, while we're talking about pertinent stats.  While your Applaud/Smite ratio of 53-11 may appear lofty on the surface, it's been achieved with relatively few possessions.  Try upping your tempo and improving your S.O.S.  Schedule the Wittenberg and Wabash posters more often, and we'll see how you stand then. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 19, 2014, 08:03:13 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 45  Allegheny 29

Wooster made 7 three pointers in the first half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2014, 08:16:58 PM
Both Witt and DePauw lead their games by 12 at the half, while OWU scored the first 12 points of their game. Hoyle would be pleased.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2014, 08:42:26 PM
Kenyon is making it interesting in Springfield, down just 50-49 with 11:10 left.

Oberlin isn't, down 51-22 to OWU at the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 19, 2014, 08:52:23 PM
Final:  Wooster 89  Allegheny 57 :)

Wooster gets the decisive road win and clinches the outright regular season title for the NCAC.  Wooster was led tonight by Doug Thorpe with 20 points, Xavier Brown with 17 and Dan Fanelly with 16.

Wooster is now 21-3, 15-2 NCAC  ;D  Last game of the regular season is at home this Saturday vs. Oberlin
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2014, 09:11:39 PM
Wittenberg 80, Kenyon 71
DePauw 75, Wabash 74
OWU 93, Oberlin 60
Hiram 68, Denison 53
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2014, 10:01:10 PM
1. Wooster 15-2 (vs. Oberlin)
2. OWU 13-4 (vs. DePauw)
3. DePauw 12-5 (at OWU)
3. Wittenberg 12-5 (at Hiram)
5. Denison 8-9 (at Allegheny)
5. Kenyon 8-9 (vs. Wabash)
7. Wabash 7-10 (at Kenyon)
8. Oberlin 4-13 (at Wooster)
8. Hiram 4-13 (vs. Wittenberg)
10. Allegheny 2-15 (vs. Denison)

Wooster is the top seed. The winner of the OWU/DePauw game will be the #2 seed. A three-way tie at 13-5 would fall DePauw, Witt, then OWU, based on head-to-head. DePauw swept Witt, so Witt is the #4 seed if they both lose Saturday. Kenyon holds the tiebreaker over Denison unless DePauw loses and Witt wins, then it goes to Denison. A Wabash win at Kenyon would give them the season sweep and thus the tiebreaker. A three-way tie at 8-10 would favor Denison, then Wabash, then Kenyon, based on head-to-head results. Oberlin's win over DePauw (or over Wooster, if both Oberlin and Hiram win Saturday) gives them the tiebreaker over Hiram. Allegheny has been eliminated.

Okay, I'm done editing. I think that's right.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 20, 2014, 12:48:49 AM
Still not as complicated as last year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on February 20, 2014, 08:45:25 AM
This conference tournament is shaping up to be as entertaining as any in recent memory.  I think even the most ardent fans have to admit that any of the top 4 teams have a shot at winning this year's tournament and securing the NCAC's automatic bid.  Yet, those 4 teams moving on to the weekend is certainly not guaranteed.

If the tournament started today, or--more relevantly--if the standings stay the same after this weekend, we would see OWU v. Wabash, DePauw v. Kenyon, and Wittenberg v. Denison.  Denison beat Wittenberg @ Wittenberg 63-60 on 2/1, Kenyon beat DePauw 75-67 last weekend, and Wabash beat OWU 77-66 on 2/12. 

Wooster has to be favorite, but it looks like we may be in for a fun week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2014, 09:22:49 AM
Well, wouldn't you know that right after I criticize Wooster on their poor shooting percentage, they go out and shoot 53% keyed by post man Dan Fanelly's 7-9 effort...  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 20, 2014, 09:26:59 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 20, 2014, 09:22:49 AM
Well, wouldn't you know that right after I criticize Wooster on their poor shooting percentage, they go out and shoot 53% keyed by post man Dan Fanelly's 7-9 effort...  8-)

Did you watch any of that game? It almost looked like a shoot around! Its pretty easy to hit your shots when nobody's on defense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 20, 2014, 09:48:14 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 20, 2014, 09:26:59 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 20, 2014, 09:22:49 AM
Well, wouldn't you know that right after I criticize Wooster on their poor shooting percentage, they go out and shoot 53% keyed by post man Dan Fanelly's 7-9 effort...  8-)

Did you watch any of that game? It almost looked like a shoot around! Its pretty easy to hit your shots when nobody's on defense.

No. But I figured Allegheny's defense, or lack thereof, may have played a part in it.  But, with that said,  Wooster did only manage to shoot just 42% in their first meeting with Allegheny in Wooster.  I'll take what I can get at this point...  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 20, 2014, 09:46:36 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 20, 2014, 09:26:59 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 20, 2014, 09:22:49 AM
Well, wouldn't you know that right after I criticize Wooster on their poor shooting percentage, they go out and shoot 53% keyed by post man Dan Fanelly's 7-9 effort...  8-)

Did you watch any of that game? It almost looked like a shoot around! Its pretty easy to hit your shots when nobody's on defense.

imderekpoe -- very well described as a shoot around! ;D

It was so obvious that the Gators were not playing defense, the Allegheny student announcers started making comments like "Wooster is too good of a team to leave their shooters wide open!"  and "Doug Thorpe hits another wide open three point shot."  ;) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2014, 07:28:09 PM
We've got a pretty exciting day on tap for tomorrow; every game has meaning, at least as of now (if Wittenberg beats Hiram, the Wooster/Oberlin game, which tips after the game in Hiram will have ended, would lose its import).

Denison at Allegheny, 3:00
DePauw at Ohio Wesleyan, 3:00
Wabash at Kenyon, 3:00
Wittenberg at Hiram, 4:00
Oberlin at Wooster, 7:30
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 22, 2014, 05:02:39 PM
Seniors at Allegheny playing their last game take down the Big Red 76-72.  Gators hit 15 for outside the arc and hold on despite dismal free throw shooting down the stretch.  A nice final win for those seniors.

Denison now heads into the tournament on a down note with losses in their final two games of the regular season to the bottom teams in the conference.  They will need some inspiration to win their first round game regardless of who their opponent will be.  A week ago it looked like Coach Ghiloni would eke out the second winning season of his career.  Now the only way that is possible is if the Big Red win the tournament. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 22, 2014, 05:14:32 PM
And Kenyon beats Wabash 75-64 to earn the 5th seed.  It appears the Lords will go to Greencastle and the Big Red will play in Springfield.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 22, 2014, 05:30:32 PM
Final:  DePauw 64  Ohio Wesleyan 63     Impressive road win for DePauw and OWU may be on the bubble for the NCAA's

Final:  Wittenberg 86  Hiram 60

So, the NCAC seedings for the conference tourney should be:

1. Wooster
2. DePauw 13-5 (3-1 in head to head with Witt & OWU)
3. Wittenberg 13-5 (2-2 in head to head with OWU & DePauw)
4. Ohio Wesleyan 13-5 (1-3 in head to head with Witt & DePauw)
5. Kenyon 9-9
6. Denison 8-10
7. Wabash 7-11
8. Oberlin

Hiram and Allegheny are eliminated.

Quarterfinal games in the NCAC tourney should be:
Oberlin at Wooster
Wabash at DePauw
Denison at Wittenberg
Kenyon at Ohio Wesleyan
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2014, 05:58:52 PM
Wittenberg 86, Hiram 60

1. Wooster 15-2 (vs. Oberlin)
2. DePauw 13-5
2. Wittenberg 13-5
2. OWU 13-5
5. Kenyon 9-9
6. Denison 8-10
7. Wabash 7-11
8. Oberlin 4-13 (at Wooster)
8. Hiram 4-14
10. Allegheny 3-15

Even if Oberlin loses tonight, they hold the tiebreaker with Hiram by virtue of their "best win" (DePauw) being better than Hiram's (Denison).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2014, 06:29:52 PM
But folks, here's your headline:

Women's basketball: Ohio Wesleyan 65, DePauw 64, Final.

:o :o :o :o

Congratulations to the Bishops, handing the Tigers their first loss since we were in short pants.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 22, 2014, 06:44:09 PM
DePauw (men's #2, women's #1) and OWU (men's #4, women's #2) will host quarterfinal doubleheaders on Tuesday. Game times will be announced tomorrow, but I anticipate 6pm women, 8pm men.

Wooster (men's #1), Wittenberg (men's #3), Denison (women's #3), and Kenyon (women's #4) will probably tip their quarterfinal games at 7:30 Tuesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 22, 2014, 08:07:59 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 41  Oberlin 31

Kenny DeBoer with 12 points and Doug Thorpe with 9 led the scoring for Wooster in the first half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 22, 2014, 08:40:32 PM
There's hope for Wabash after all! I have no doubt they can give the New Tigers a game, and after that...

Well, strange things HAVE happened!  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 22, 2014, 09:08:10 PM
Final:  Wooster 82  Oberlin 53 :)

Good balanced scoring for Wooster with Kenny DeBoer with 17, Dan Fanelly with 14, Doug Thorpe with 11, Xavier Brown with 11 and Evan Pannell with 10.

Wooster is now 22-3, 16-2 NCAC  ;D  Next up is Deja Vu!....Oberlin again on Tuesday at Timken in the conference tourney.

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2014, 07:06:39 PM
As anticipated, the tip times for the single-game sites (Wooster, Wittenberg men, Denison, Kenyon women) will be 7:30, while at the doubleheader sites (DePauw, OWU), the women tip at 6:00 and the men go afterward, approximately 8:00. Tickets for Tuesday's games are $7 ($5 under 18 and non-NCAC students, NCAC member institution students get in free), and that gets you into both games at Greencastle and Delaware (great deal!).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2014, 07:22:27 PM
The new poll is out, (http://d3hoops.com/top25/index) and the NCAC ends their regular season with two ranked teams. #8 Wooster stays exactley where they were, as did all of the Week 11 top 10. Wittenberg stays at #22 but gained 55 points, equivalent to two spots on the average ballot. OWU drops just off the bottom of the ranking from #18; they are just 2 points shy of new #25 Richard Stockton. Despite their buzzer-beating win at OWU and second-place conference finish, DePauw still receives no votes from any of the 25 voters.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2014, 11:39:20 AM
Who ya got?

Wooster is winning. 

Denison did split with Witt and won their game in Springfield, but then Denison wrapped up the regular season by losing to the two teams that won't be participating this week.  That's maybe not the kind of momentum you like to carry in to a quarterfinal game at Witt. 

Maybe we should keep an eye out for the Kenyon Lords at OWU.  OWU is coming off of a tough loss at home that would have kept them off of Wooster's half of the bracket.  Kenyon has a recent road win at DePauw, but beyond that nada vs. the top four.  I like OWU here. 

And then Wabash/DePauw.  Bonus rivalry games are fun.  These two teams meet up just six days after a 1-point game in the same gym.  After a horrid start to the season, Wabash has been much better over the back half of the schedule and now they've got a chance to end DePauw's season (doubt DePauw has a chance at an at-large if they lose tonight...they probably need two wins and some help anyway) and take one more trip back out to Wooster to see if the slipper fits.  Why not?  This is probably the one game that Wabash could have drawn for the first round that I think they have a reasonable chance to win.  First, because I think the rivalry aspect raises their level of play.  Second because Wabash's final home game was 2/12 and after two straight weeks of travel, I don't know that another mid-week roadie out to central Ohio was going to end well. 

I think I'm liking OWU to win this tournament.  Just a hunch and a tough choice because Wooster has picked up their play again after a couple of weeks of so-so ball (by Wooster standards).  OWU/Wooster on Friday might be the game of the tournament. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 25, 2014, 01:16:57 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 25, 2014, 11:39:20 AM
Who ya got?

Wooster is winning. 

Denison did split with Witt and won their game in Springfield, but then Denison wrapped up the regular season by losing to the two teams that won't be participating this week.  That's maybe not the kind of momentum you like to carry in to a quarterfinal game at Witt. 

Maybe we should keep an eye out for the Kenyon Lords at OWU.  OWU is coming off of a tough loss at home that would have kept them off of Wooster's half of the bracket.  Kenyon has a recent road win at DePauw, but beyond that nada vs. the top four.  I like OWU here. 

And then Wabash/DePauw.  Bonus rivalry games are fun.  These two teams meet up just six days after a 1-point game in the same gym.  After a horrid start to the season, Wabash has been much better over the back half of the schedule and now they've got a chance to end DePauw's season (doubt DePauw has a chance at an at-large if they lose tonight...they probably need two wins and some help anyway) and take one more trip back out to Wooster to see if the slipper fits.  Why not?  This is probably the one game that Wabash could have drawn for the first round that I think they have a reasonable chance to win.  First, because I think the rivalry aspect raises their level of play.  Second because Wabash's final home game was 2/12 and after two straight weeks of travel, I don't know that another mid-week roadie out to central Ohio was going to end well. 

I think I'm liking OWU to win this tournament.  Just a hunch and a tough choice because Wooster has picked up their play again after a couple of weeks of so-so ball (by Wooster standards).  OWU/Wooster on Friday might be the game of the tournament. 

I'll go with Woo, Witt, OWU tonight.  I don't see Denison sneaking up on the Tigers again, but I'm also not convinced that the Tigers are all that great.  I'm pretty sure OWU is the 2nd best team in the conference and Kenyon isn't. 

I'm really up in the air on DePauw / Wabash.  I only saw DePauw once (at Wooster) and wasn't too impressed, and I haven't see Wabash at all.  DePauw has been incredibly inconsistent with several really good wins, but also some really bad losses and close calls.  Wabash is certainly better than they were early in the year, but I guess I'll have to go with the Tigers.

I agree that a Scots / Bishops game would probably be the highlight of the tournament, and I'll pick Wooster to win Friday and against the Old Tigers Saturday. However, any of the big men for the other 3 could give the Scots a hard time and make things interesting.

Should be an interesting week!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 25, 2014, 04:59:39 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 25, 2014, 11:39:20 AM
I think I'm liking OWU to win this tournament.  Just a hunch and a tough choice because Wooster has picked up their play again after a couple of weeks of so-so ball (by Wooster standards).  OWU/Wooster on Friday might be the game of the tournament.

A month ago, I would have strongly agreed that OWU was the team to beat, however, they did stumble a bit down the stretch.  Since their come from behind win at Woo last month, OWU has stumbled to a 4-3 finish with losses to Witt, Wabash and DePauw.  And 2 of their 4 wins were less than impressive with a 3 point win at Kenyon and a 5 point win vs. Allegheny.  Wooster, while they haven't played great basketball down the stretch either, did manage to finish the season 7-0 after struggling through a 3 game stretch with narrow win over Allegheny at home and back to back losses to DePauw and OWU. 

I still feel OWU is the 2nd best team in the tournament, but don't sleep on DePauw.  The New Tigers have to be one of the biggest head scratchers in the league this year with wins over Witt (sweep), OWU and Wooster and losses to the likes of Oberlin, Allegheny, and Kenyon.  Take away those losses and they would have been every bit in the mix to win the conference title.  So, if they can get by Wabash tonight in the first round, they could be a tough out the rest of the way.  That said, I just have a hard time picking against a Wooster team that finished 7-0 to finish the season.  After Wooster lost back to back to DePauw and OWU, the NCAC race was very much in doubt.  But Wooster finished 7-0, while DePauw and OWU stumbled down the stretch going 5-3 and 4-3 respectively since their wins over Wooster. 


As for the 1st round, I'll take the home teams.  I think Woo, Witt and OWU should win easily and I wouldn't be surprised in the least to see Wabash knock off DePauw in the rivalry matchup.  DePauw should win, but then again, they should have won their games with Oberlin, Allegheny and Kenyon as well. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2014, 06:22:49 PM
Just to stir things up a bit, I'll take Wooster and Kenyon in the top half and Wabash and Witt in the bottom, with Witt emerging as the tourney champ.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 07:18:44 PM
I think OWU, Witt and DePauw all badly need a win tonight to keep their NCAA tourney hopes alive.  OWU could get a Pool C bid but they will probably put even that scenario at serious risk if they can't win a NCAC quarterfinal game.

So, I will be boring and take all the home favorites tonight -- Woo, OWU, Witt and DePauw.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 08:03:12 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 34  Oberlin 28

Wooster's top scorers in the first half were Doug Thorpe with 10 points and Kenny DeBoer with 9.

Congratulations to Doug Thorpe who has reached 1,000 points in his Wooster career!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 08:08:22 PM
At the Half:  Wittenberg 27  Denison 22

DePauw hits their first 5 shots of the game and leads Wabash 13-0.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2014, 08:09:37 PM
13-0 DPU.  This probably could have started better. 

DePauw leads 38-28 at the half down in the G'dingle.  Wabash reeled this thing back to within four at one point, but DePauw went on a mini-run in the last few minutes there to stretch it back out to double digits.  Going to need a big half for Wabash to wipe out that deficit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 08:51:12 PM
At the Half:  Ohio Wesleyan 38  Kenyon 24

At the Half:  DePauw 38  Wabash 28
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:06:34 PM
Final:  Wooster 89  Oberlin 56  :)

NCAC Semi-Finals will be played at Wooster on Friday night.

Wooster was led in scoring tonight by Xavier Brown with 17, Dan Fanelly with 16 points (8 boards), Kenny DeBoer with 11 and Doug Thorpe with 10.

Wooster is now 23-3. ;D   Next game is probably Ohio Wesleyan on Friday night.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:08:07 PM
Final:  Wittenberg 64  Denison 49

Wittenberg was led by Zach Leahy with 17 and Scott Masin with 16.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 25, 2014, 09:11:20 PM
OWU has been ahead of Kenyon by 15 for a lot of the game.  14 to play
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:12:16 PM
~12 minutes left:  DePauw 50  Wabash 37

~3 minutes left now:  DePauw 71  Wabash 56   New Tigers will play the Old Tigers in Round 3 on Friday night! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:33:05 PM
`3 minutes left:  Ohio Wesleyan 65  Kenyon 51    Bishops will play Wooster in Round 3 on Friday night! ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2014, 09:34:44 PM
All four favorites win (or winning). What a drag.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2014, 09:35:28 PM
And my video cut out.  Just as well with DePauw leading by 18.  Not exactly how I was hoping this game tonight would go. 

So ends a pretty rough campaign for the Little Giants.  I'm not really sure what happens next.  I haven't been able to see as much Wabash hoops this year as I normally do, but what has been pretty consistent from what I've seen this season is that Wabash struggles mightily to get good shots.  Everything seems to be guarded or off balance or out of range.  This year's team just doesn't get good looks.  I'm not sure what the offseason holds here, but I do think that this team could benefit enormously from an offensive coordinator type on the staff. 

The top four are headed off to Wooster for the weekend which is fitting given the split in the standings this season.  Should be a good pair of semis on Friday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2014, 09:38:37 PM
The four top seeds won on the women's side, too. What a boring conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2014, 09:39:49 PM
DePauw 73, Wabash 59
OWU 78, Kenyon 67
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:48:32 PM
NCAC Tourney Semi-Final Matchups on Friday night at Wooster:

Wooster 23-3 vs. Ohio Wesleyan 20-6

Wittenberg 20-6 vs. DePauw 19-7

Should be two very competitive and interesting games on Friday. :)  Top 4 teams in the NCAC have all had good seasons -- three 20 game winners and a fourth knocking on the door.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 25, 2014, 09:50:51 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:48:32 PM
NCAC Tourney Semi-Final Matchups on Friday night at Wooster:

Wooster 23-3 vs. Ohio Wesleyan 20-6

Wittenberg 20-6 vs. DePauw 19-7

Should be two very competitive and interesting games on Friday. :)  Top 4 teams in the NCAC have all had good seasons -- three 20 game winners and a fourth knocking on the door.

DePauw has whipped Wittenberg twice  72-46, 71-49
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:53:52 PM
Quote from: sac on February 25, 2014, 09:50:51 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:48:32 PM
NCAC Tourney Semi-Final Matchups on Friday night at Wooster:

Wooster 23-3 vs. Ohio Wesleyan 20-6

Wittenberg 20-6 vs. DePauw 19-7

Should be two very competitive and interesting games on Friday. :)  Top 4 teams in the NCAC have all had good seasons -- three 20 game winners and a fourth knocking on the door.

DePauw has whipped Wittenberg twice  72-46, 71-49

Yes...and it is always hard to beat an opponent 3 times in a season...especially when Witt needs the win badly to stay in the Pool C discussion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2014, 09:52:28 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:53:52 PM
Quote from: sac on February 25, 2014, 09:50:51 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:48:32 PM
NCAC Tourney Semi-Final Matchups on Friday night at Wooster:

Wooster 23-3 vs. Ohio Wesleyan 20-6

Wittenberg 20-6 vs. DePauw 19-7

Should be two very competitive and interesting games on Friday. :)  Top 4 teams in the NCAC have all had good seasons -- three 20 game winners and a fourth knocking on the door.

DePauw has whipped Wittenberg twice  72-46, 71-49

Yes...and it is always hard to beat an opponent 3 times in a season...especially when Witt needs the win badly to stay in the Pool C discussion.

??? Both parts of this confuse me, WSF. I don't think it's any harder to beat an opponent for the third time as compared to the previous two times. I think that's basically a fallacy that covers for the notion that it's simply hard to beat *good teams* teams any number of times in a season. I mean, if it really were particularly hard to win the third time, why aren't we all really surprised to see that OWU, Wooster and DePauw all managed to do so last night, with both Wooster and DePauw winning by their largest margin out of their three contests this year?

And also, DePauw obviously needs to win on Friday just as badly as Witt does to stay in the Pool C discussion.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 26, 2014, 10:21:53 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2014, 09:52:28 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:53:52 PM
Quote from: sac on February 25, 2014, 09:50:51 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:48:32 PM
NCAC Tourney Semi-Final Matchups on Friday night at Wooster:

Wooster 23-3 vs. Ohio Wesleyan 20-6

Wittenberg 20-6 vs. DePauw 19-7

Should be two very competitive and interesting games on Friday. :)  Top 4 teams in the NCAC have all had good seasons -- three 20 game winners and a fourth knocking on the door.

DePauw has whipped Wittenberg twice  72-46, 71-49

Yes...and it is always hard to beat an opponent 3 times in a season...especially when Witt needs the win badly to stay in the Pool C discussion.

??? Both parts of this confuse me, WSF. I don't think it's any harder to beat an opponent for the third time as compared to the previous two times. I think that's basically a fallacy that covers for the notion that it's simply hard to beat *good teams* teams any number of times in a season. I mean, if it really were particularly hard to win the third time, why aren't we all really surprised to see that OWU, Wooster and DePauw all managed to do so last night, with both Wooster and DePauw winning by their largest margin out of their three contests this year?

And also, DePauw obviously needs to win on Friday just as badly as Witt does to stay in the Pool C discussion.

There are three question marks sitting atop your smiley-face icon.  What else is on your mind? :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2014, 10:24:55 AM
Well, we can close the 2013-2014 book on games between the NCAC top 4 and the bottom 6.

Overall, the top 4 were 47-5 (.904) against the bottom 6, with the three good Ws - Wooster, Wittenberg, and Wesleyan - going 37-2 (.949).

Hiram was the only team without a top 4 win, though they came oh-so-close, with single-digit losses to each member of the top 4 (Wesleyan 69-67, DePauw 90-89, Wittenberg 80-79, and Wooster 76-71). Each other member of the bottom 6 had exactly one win against a first-division club.

Top 4 vs. bottom 6 records by team:
Wooster - 13-0
DePauw - 10-3 (losses at Oberlin, to Allegheny and Kenyon)
Wittenberg - 12-1 (loss to Denison)
Ohio Wesleyan - 12-1 (loss at Wabash)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kenyonfan on February 26, 2014, 11:46:46 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:33:05 PM
`3 minutes left:  Ohio Wesleyan 65  Kenyon 51    Bishops will play Wooster in Round 3 on Friday night! ;)

I was at the OWU / Kenyon game last night, and OWU did look good. Kenyon fell into a big hole (which included what must have been 5 rim outs). The Lords played super hard until the final whistle to try and get back in the game but OWU's big inside presence, and excellent foul shooting, was too much for them to overcome.

OWU / Wooster figures to be quite a game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2014, 12:22:57 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2014, 09:52:28 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:53:52 PM
Quote from: sac on February 25, 2014, 09:50:51 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:48:32 PM
NCAC Tourney Semi-Final Matchups on Friday night at Wooster:

Wooster 23-3 vs. Ohio Wesleyan 20-6

Wittenberg 20-6 vs. DePauw 19-7

Should be two very competitive and interesting games on Friday. :)  Top 4 teams in the NCAC have all had good seasons -- three 20 game winners and a fourth knocking on the door.

DePauw has whipped Wittenberg twice  72-46, 71-49

Yes...and it is always hard to beat an opponent 3 times in a season...especially when Witt needs the win badly to stay in the Pool C discussion.

??? Both parts of this confuse me, WSF. I don't think it's any harder to beat an opponent for the third time as compared to the previous two times. I think that's basically a fallacy that covers for the notion that it's simply hard to beat *good teams* teams any number of times in a season. I mean, if it really were particularly hard to win the third time, why aren't we all really surprised to see that OWU, Wooster and DePauw all managed to do so last night, with both Wooster and DePauw winning by their largest margin out of their three contests this year?

And also, DePauw obviously needs to win on Friday just as badly as Witt does to stay in the Pool C discussion.

kiltedbryan -- sorry if I confused you.  ;)

I should have said that it is very difficult to beat a good team three times in one season.  Obviously, with a 20-7 record Witt is a good team and it will be difficult for DePauw to beat them again.  I won't be shocked if DePauw wins again, but Witt will be highly motivated to get some revenge.

On the other point, I agree that both teams desparately need the win on Friday to remain in consideration for a Pool C bid if they don't win the automatic bid.  Whichever team wins the Friday game will likely be ranked above the other in the NCAA's final ranking and will get to the table faster for a Pool C opportunity.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 26, 2014, 12:28:01 PM
I don't think the loser of the Witt/DePauw game makes it as a Pool C.  The winner is still pretty bubbly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2014, 01:36:42 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 26, 2014, 12:22:57 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2014, 09:52:28 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:53:52 PM
Quote from: sac on February 25, 2014, 09:50:51 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 25, 2014, 09:48:32 PM
NCAC Tourney Semi-Final Matchups on Friday night at Wooster:

Wooster 23-3 vs. Ohio Wesleyan 20-6

Wittenberg 20-6 vs. DePauw 19-7

Should be two very competitive and interesting games on Friday. :)  Top 4 teams in the NCAC have all had good seasons -- three 20 game winners and a fourth knocking on the door.

DePauw has whipped Wittenberg twice  72-46, 71-49

Yes...and it is always hard to beat an opponent 3 times in a season...especially when Witt needs the win badly to stay in the Pool C discussion.

??? Both parts of this confuse me, WSF. I don't think it's any harder to beat an opponent for the third time as compared to the previous two times. I think that's basically a fallacy that covers for the notion that it's simply hard to beat *good teams* teams any number of times in a season. I mean, if it really were particularly hard to win the third time, why aren't we all really surprised to see that OWU, Wooster and DePauw all managed to do so last night, with both Wooster and DePauw winning by their largest margin out of their three contests this year?

And also, DePauw obviously needs to win on Friday just as badly as Witt does to stay in the Pool C discussion.

kiltedbryan -- sorry if I confused you.  ;)

I should have said that it is very difficult to beat a good team three times in one season.  Obviously, with a 20-7 record Witt is a good team and it will be difficult for DePauw to beat them again.  I won't be shocked if DePauw wins again, but Witt will be highly motivated to get some revenge.

On the other point, I agree that both teams desparately need the win on Friday to remain in consideration for a Pool C bid if they don't win the automatic bid.  Whichever team wins the Friday game will likely be ranked above the other in the NCAA's final ranking and will get to the table faster for a Pool C opportunity.

Phew! Glad to have that cleared up.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2014, 01:44:33 PM
Quote from: sac on February 26, 2014, 12:28:01 PM
I don't think the loser of the Witt/DePauw game makes it as a Pool C.  The winner is still pretty bubbly.

Agree. NCAC pool C chances seem about like this:

Wooster - absolute, air-tight lock
OWU - edge of bubble with loss to Wooster; probably in good shape with loss in final
Witt - out with loss to DePauw; edge of bubble with loss in final
DePauw - out with loss to Witt; edge of bubble with loss in final

So if you're rooting for a two-bid NCAC, you're rooting for a Wooster loss this weekend to guarantee a different Pool A champion and give Wooster a C. I think the only likely three-bid scenario is OWU beats Woo then loses in the final. In that case I think both Woo and OWU would look pretty good for Pool C and obviously one of Witt/DPU would take the Pool A.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2014, 02:27:43 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2014, 01:44:33 PM

NCAC pool C chances seem about like this:

Wooster - absolute, air-tight lock
OWU - edge of bubble with loss to Wooster; probably in good shape with loss in final
Witt - out with loss to DePauw; edge of bubble with loss in final
DePauw - out with loss to Witt; edge of bubble with loss in final

So if you're rooting for a two-bid NCAC, you're rooting for a Wooster loss this weekend to guarantee a different Pool A champion and give Wooster a C. I think the only likely three-bid scenario is OWU beats Woo then loses in the final. In that case I think both Woo and OWU would look pretty good for Pool C and obviously one of Witt/DPU would take the Pool A.

I agree with this.  If OWU beats Wooster on Friday and then loses in the final, I think they should get a serious look for a C giving the NCAC 3 bids. I feel like this is the only scenario that this conference has a chance to get 3 teams in the dance.

I think the only way Witt or DePauw get a C is if Wooster wins out and the loser in the NCAC finals would get consideration for a C. And I think OWU must win at least one game as I feel if they lose on Friday, they might find themselves on the outside looking in...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 26, 2014, 04:15:24 PM
Witt or DPU better hope there's no further carnage in "A" besides Bethany.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2014, 04:18:10 PM
Well, new regional rankings  (http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2014/02/26/2014-ncaa-regional-rankings-week-3/)suggest that I had my order wrong, as the rankings have DePauw 5th, Wittenberg 6th, and Ohio Wesleyan 7th in the Great Lakes. (Though Bethany will obviously fall after their loss this week)

Wooster's still an absolute, air-tight lock.
Wesleyan's in a really tough spot. Lose to Wooster and they're done - they'd probably still slot behind DPU and Witt in the final rankings - just too many teams ahead of them. Win against Wooster and lose the final and then they probably get above the DPU/Witt loser at the table, but are still the very edge of the bubble.

I'd expect the Witt/DPU winner to be out. If the winner loses in the final against Wooster, then they become the top NCAC Pool C candidate and have a shot, still near the edge of the bubble probably. If the winner loses the final against OWU, then they're in basically the same situation except that Wooster's claiming a Pool C spot ahead of them, pushing them just that much more to the edge of the bubble.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2014, 06:54:55 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2014, 10:24:55 AMEach other member of the bottom 6 had exactly one win against a first-division club.

KB, you are nowhere near old enough to use this terminology. Leave the old timey baseball references to Wooster Booster and me. Oh, and get off my lawn!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2014, 12:17:24 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 26, 2014, 06:54:55 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2014, 10:24:55 AMEach other member of the bottom 6 had exactly one win against a first-division club.

KB, you are nowhere near old enough to use this terminology. Leave the old timey baseball references to Wooster Booster and me. Oh, and get off my lawn!

Yeah.  What he said.  But DC, exactly how old were you when the bigs first split into divisions?  I'll pardon you if you can explain what a double-switch is and why it's used. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2014, 06:58:27 AM
I was 8, which means I had been an active baseball fan for 5 years.

Actually, as an Indians fan in the 1960s, I never learned what "first-division" meant. All I knew was "second-division."

A double switch is where a manager thinks it is wise to corrupt his defense so someone other than a pitcher can strike out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2014, 09:39:46 AM
Haha, probably just a result of me growing up as a totally old-school baseball fan. Blame my father's baseball book collection (heavily tilted toward the 1940s-1970s era) and the fact that we had an APBA Baseball game in the house. :)

David - love that description of a double-switch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2014, 11:37:27 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2014, 09:39:46 AM
Haha, probably just a result of me growing up as a totally old-school baseball fan. Blame my father's baseball book collection (heavily tilted toward the 1940s-1970s era) and the fact that we had an APBA Baseball game in the house. :)

David - love that description of a double-switch.

I grew up playing APBA, starting in 1961!  I now work for Diamond Mind Baseball, which produces a great statistical baseball simulation.  My new hobby, though, is playing Skeetersoft, which is a much improved version of APBA.  Great card and dice game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 28, 2014, 06:32:29 PM
DPU and Wittenberg playing each other - a Wabash fan's worst nightmare. Actually, no, if they were playing in the conference finals that would be our worst nightmare... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 28, 2014, 06:35:24 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 28, 2014, 06:32:29 PM
DPU and Wittenberg playing each other - a Wabash fan's worst nightmare. Actually, no, if they were playing in the conference finals that would be our worst nightmare... ;)

Smed -- does this mean that you are rooting for Wooster to win the tourney?  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2014, 06:36:04 PM
Halftime, Tigers 35, Tigers 35.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2014, 07:36:17 PM
Tigers win, 63-61. Tiger Up!

(That's Witt, for the uninitiated.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 28, 2014, 07:57:34 PM
That's probably it for DePauw but they'll be sitting somewhere near the edge of the bubble. They go into the selection with an 18-8 (.692) with a good SOS and (probably) a 4-5 vRRO mark.

If they aren't selected, pretty easy to point to the losses to Oberlin, Allegheny and Kenyon. Win 2 of those 3 and they're 20-6 (.769) with the same peripherals; win all three and it's 21-5 (.808) and they'd probably be almost a lock.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 28, 2014, 08:39:22 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 39  OWU 35

Scots finish the half on a 6-0 run....back to back three pointers by Doug Thorpe and Evan Pannell
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2014, 09:28:59 PM
Video is great, no problems at all...until 3:22 left, then I go to buffering hell. Grrrrrrr.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 28, 2014, 09:37:28 PM
Final:  Wooster 78  Ohio Wesleyan 67 :)

Wooster was led tonight by senior Kenny DeBoer who had a double double of 22 points and 11 boards.  DeBoer hit a huge three pointer with less than 1 minute left to put the game out of reach.  Other top scorers for the Scots were Xavier Brown 15, Doug Thorpe 13, freshman Dan Fanelly also with a double double of 10 points, 13 boards and Evan Pannell with 10.

Key factor in the win for Wooster was the rebounding advantage of 44 to 31.  Scots had 12 offensive boards (DeBoer especially with 2nd chance points).

Ohio Wesleyan is now 20-7 and barely on the bubble for a Pool C bid.

Wooster is now 24-3. ;D  Next game tomorrow night is round #3 of Woo vs. Witt for the NCAA automatic bid.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2014, 09:49:03 PM
After a season of ups and downs, of four ranked teams, of upsets and blowouts, we end up with a regular season title in Wooster and a tournament final between Wittenberg and the Scots.

Everything old is new again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 28, 2014, 09:55:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 28, 2014, 09:49:03 PM
Everything old is new again.

Yup, tomorrow we'll be partying like it's 2010-11, the last time the Scots and Old Tigers met to decide the NCAC Tournament Championship.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 28, 2014, 10:14:15 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 28, 2014, 09:28:59 PM
Video is great, no problems at all...until 3:22 left, then I go to buffering hell. Grrrrrrr.

I had video issues at about the same point, but was able to reload it and see the end of the game fine.

It was nice to be able to watch the first semifinal as well, though it's weird to watch a completely silent broadcast. I kinda wish that there were an ambient mic so you could hear the sounds of the game and crowd even if there's no actual play-by-play broadcast.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2014, 10:23:15 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 28, 2014, 09:55:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 28, 2014, 09:49:03 PM
Everything old is new again.

Yup, tomorrow we'll be partying like it's 2010-11, the last time the Scots and Old Tigers met to decide the NCAC Tournament Championship.

Wooster and/or Wittenberg have won or shared every NCAC regular season title since 1989, and one or the other (or both) have played in every NCAC Tournament championship game in that span excepting 2008 (OWU def. Wabash), winning all but 3 of those games (OWU 2013, Allegheny 1998, Kenyon 1994.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 28, 2014, 11:02:45 PM
Yawn.  Go Tigers.

Until next year . . .
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 28, 2014, 11:54:57 PM
Wooster has beaten 3 teams this season that are all one win away from securing a NCAA bid.  ;)  .....and they are:

Wheaton (IL) is 18-8 and the Thunder play at #4 Illinois Wesleyan tomorrow for the CCIW bid.  Wheaton has a strong SOS and also could get a Pool C bid.

Hanover (IN) is 19-8 and the Panthers play at Rose-Hulman tomorrow for the HCAC bid.  Hanover has a weaker SOS and is not a viable Pool C candidate.

Wittenberg is 21-6 and the Tigers play at Wooster tomorrow for the NCAC bid.  Wittenberg will be considered for a Pool C bid if they lose tomorrow.

There was nearly a 4th team in this category... if Marietta could have defended Malcolm Heard of Wilmington yesterday, they would still be alive for the OAC bid.

Summary:  Wooster played a tough schedule this year and hopefully it has prepared them for the NCAA tourney.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 01, 2014, 01:31:13 AM
Here are my $0.02 on potential All-NCAC selections, which have not yet come out from the league, though they must be coming soon. Apologies in advance for anyone I mislabel positionally.

Player of the Year: Scott Masin, Wittenberg (runner-up Tommy Fernitz, DePauw)
Newcomer of the Year: Seth Clark, Ohio Wesleyan (runners-up Dan Fanelly, Wooster and David Meurer, Denison)

FIRST TEAM
G - Aaron Stefanov, Hiram (Sr.)
G - Alex Longi, Denison (Sr.)
G - Doug Thorpe, Wooster (Sr.)
G - Xavier Brown, Wooster (Jr.)
F/C - Brian Lebowitz, Kenyon (Sr.)
F/C - Tommy Fernitz, DePauw (Jr.)
C - Scott Masin, Wittenberg (Sr.)

SECOND TEAM
G - Ryan Stanko, Allegheny (Sr.)
G - Taylor Rieger, Ohio Wesleyan (Sr.)
G - Zach Leahy, Wittenberg (Sr.)
G/F - Pat Haggin, DePauw (Sr.)
F - Kenny DeBoer, Wooster (Sr.)
F/C - Reuel Rogers, Ohio Wesleyan (Sr.)
C - Geoff Simpson, Oberlin (Sr.)

HONORABLE MENTION
G - Kyle Aiton, Wabash (Fr.)
G - Seth Clark, Ohio Wesleyan (Fr.)
G/F - Dre White, Ohio Wesleyan (Sr.)
F - Brad Woolard, Denison (Jr.)
C - Randy Ollie, Oberlin (So.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 01, 2014, 07:02:20 PM
Classic.  The Wooster video feed won't load.  No longer surprising.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 01, 2014, 07:06:28 PM
I'm experiencing the same issue. Thankfully the WQKT.com feed with Mike Breckenridge is working great.

Edit: video feed seems to be up now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 01, 2014, 07:17:37 PM
Will somebody please fire John Haviland?  Or tell him that gold has been discovered on some property of his in Idaho?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2014, 07:31:35 PM
[in my best wooscotsfan voice; I'm assuming he's at the game]

At the half: Wooster 36, Wittenberg 30

Scots being led by Evan Pannell's 10 points off the bench. Sam Collins has 7 for the Tigers. Dan Fanelly has 8 for the Scots, and has held Scott Masin to 0 points and 2 fouls.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2014, 07:57:06 PM
Kenny DeBoer is really having an excellent weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2014, 08:01:58 PM
Wooster, especially their defense, is totally dominating this second half. Scots lead by 21 about halfway through.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 01, 2014, 08:08:00 PM
These last two games, Fanelly isn't playing like Fanelly.  He's staying on the court.  He's successfully guarding bigger guys.  He's mostly making shots, and he's rebounding.  All of these are good things.  Might this be the winter of our content? ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2014, 08:12:31 PM
Witt has cut the lead in half (more or less), and trail by just 11 with 4:30 left.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2014, 08:15:10 PM
This Wooster announcer incessantly complains about the officiating. Wooster Booster, how can you find time to post in here while you are on the air? :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2014, 08:22:32 PM
Up 12 with a minute and change left, the Scots just forced Witt into a 28 second possession which culminated in a missed layup. Like I said, Wooster's defense has been dominant tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 01, 2014, 08:29:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 01, 2014, 08:15:10 PM
This Wooster announcer incessantly complains about the officiating. Wooster Booster, how can you find time to post in here while you are on the air? :)

Ok, now, that's about more of an insult than any one man can stand. :)

Yay, Scots!  Two really nice games put together on consecutive nights.  Bring on the Whitworths of yesteryear, we're ready for them!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 01, 2014, 08:42:33 PM
Extremely impressive defense tonight for the Scots. I was also very glad to see that Kenny DeBoer took home NCAC tournament MVP honors - he was simply a beast both nights.

Wooster will enter the NCAA Tournament on a ten-game win streak, their longest of the year.

Now we wait and see who comes to Timken next week and whether the NCAC bubble teams get the Pool C bid.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 01, 2014, 09:08:12 PM
So, NCAA-wise, are we back to the format of two years ago?  Byes aside, will the first round be four-team pods at one school?  Then, down to sixteen teams, four more four-team pods, called sectionals?  With finally the Final Four at Salem, right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2014, 09:17:29 PM
As far as I know, yes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 01, 2014, 10:48:09 PM
From the Wittenberg press release, as posted to D3hoops.com (http://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2013-14/contrib/201403015qwkx7):
"Wooster completed a three-game sweep of the season series with the Tigers for the second straight year and evened the all-time series between the two winningest NCAA Division III men's basketball programs at 54-54."
I knew that the six-game winning streak was the longest (for Wooster, at least) since the Tigers joined the NCAC. I did not know, however, that the Scots and Tigers were now even in the all-time series. Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on March 01, 2014, 11:20:09 PM
If Wittenberg and Wooster played 10 times this year, I am not sure that Wooster wouldn't win all 10.  They seem to have an answer for every Wittenberg punch.  Kenny DeBoer was a stud this weekend, certainly deserving of the MVP honors.  That being said, I really admire the fight in this year's Wittenberg team, and there appear to be some promising young players in the program.

Given the strength of the NCAC this year, it would be a shame for the conference to only get one representative. Still not sure I feel great about Witt's chances though.  If the Tigers aren't fortunate enough to move on, congratulations to Masin, Leahy, Newell, Bond, and McDowell on a solid season and careers. Talented players, but better kids.  Made it easy to be a fan this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 01, 2014, 11:28:18 PM
Back from Wooster where I watched a fine defensive effort by the Scots as they challenged Wittenberg on every possession and held the Tigers to less than 40% shooting from the floor.  Congratulations to Wooster on evening the all time series with Witt! :)

Balance was the key word for the Scots offensively as I am sure that Wittenberg was concerned about Xavier Brown and Doug Thorpe when the game started.  So to surprise Witt, Evan Pannell dropped 21 points on them (tied his career high) and freshman Dan Fanelly played very well (as Wooster Booster noted) with 12 points and a nice job of defending Witt's top scorer Scott Masin.

If Dan Fanelly and Evan Pannell continue to make these kind of contributions, I do think that Wooster could make some noise in the NCAA tourney.

As kiltedbryan observed, Kenny DeBoer was very deserving of the Tourney MVP award as he had back to back great games vs. OWU and Witt.  DeBoer had 2 points at halftime tonight but then he scored 13 in the 2nd half including 3 three pointers that kept Wooster in complete control of the game.

Wooster is now 25-3.  ;D  Next up is a home game in the NCAA tourney vs. ...Wilmington?.... Penn St. Behrend?...St. Vincent?....Hope?....Rose-Hulman?

Better stop guessing and wait for the full bracket on Monday! ;)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2014, 11:47:05 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 01, 2014, 09:08:12 PM
So, NCAA-wise, are we back to the format of two years ago?  Byes aside, will the first round be four-team pods at one school?  Then, down to sixteen teams, four more four-team pods, called sectionals?  With finally the Final Four at Salem, right?

Yes... back to the normal process.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on March 02, 2014, 03:14:16 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2014, 11:47:05 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 01, 2014, 09:08:12 PM
So, NCAA-wise, are we back to the format of two years ago?  Byes aside, will the first round be four-team pods at one school?  Then, down to sixteen teams, four more four-team pods, called sectionals?  With finally the Final Four at Salem, right?

Yes... back to the normal process.

Too bad...I liked last years format.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2014, 03:21:23 PM
LOL no one else did... too many weeks and too much time off. That is the reason the MBB committee is struggling to get Presidents and the like to approve going back to the D1 Final Four.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 02, 2014, 03:26:25 PM
I liked having all those games on all those campuses -- that was my favorite part about it. Well, and the student-athlete experience at the D1FF.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2014, 06:56:32 AM
Pat and co. have finished their bracket projections (http://d3hoops.com/playoffs/men/2014/projected-mens-bracket). They have DePauw in (and hosting a first round game), and Wittenberg out. Evidently they don't believe that OWU will be in the secret final ranking, which eliminates two vRROs (both wins) from Witt's resume. Wooster hosts a pod that includes Wheaton (Ill.). You'll see how it all pans out in about 5 1/2 hours; me, I gotta wait until I get home at about 6 tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2014, 12:50:44 PM
Wooster, Wittenberg and Ohio Wesleyan make the field. DePauw is out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2014, 12:54:48 PM
NCAC team pods:

@Wooster vs. St. Vincent
Geneseo St. vs. Dickinson

@Illinois Wesleyan vs. Webster
St. Norbert vs. Ohio Wesleyan

@Wash U vs. Wilmington
Calvin vs. Wittenberg

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 03, 2014, 01:24:34 PM
The bottom half of this region is brutal, with #3 IWU, #4 Wash. U and #5 St. Norbert.  In the top half (with Wooster), the only other ranked team is #24 Hope (which would probably fall out of a new poll after losing this weekend to rival Calvin).

My guess is that IWU will host the regional rounds.  If both Wooster and either St. Norbert or Wash. U. advance, then neither can host the regional, as they are more than 500 miles apart, so it could end up at Wheaton, Hope, or Calvin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2014, 01:33:40 PM
If Wooster and Wash U advance they're geographic problems too, I believe. Google maps gives 515 miles between campuses.

IWU/Hope are pretty clear geographic compromise options for second weekend hosting sites, I think.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 03, 2014, 01:42:19 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2014, 01:33:40 PM
If Wooster and Wash U advance they're geographic problems too, I believe. Google maps gives 515 miles between campuses.

IWU/Hope are pretty clear geographic compromise options for second weekend hosting sites, I think.

Which presumably means IWU, since assuming Hope's women (still undefeated) make it to the sectional, they have hosting priority the second weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 03, 2014, 01:51:09 PM
What would get really interesting is if Geneseo were to advance out of Wooster's pod.  They're too far away not only from St. Norbert and Wash U, but also from IWU and Wheaton.  If Hope is out as a hosting site, too, that could force the NCAA to fly Geneseo somewhere, unless Calvin or one of the other NCAC teams advances.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2014, 01:51:45 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 03, 2014, 01:42:19 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2014, 01:33:40 PM
If Wooster and Wash U advance they're geographic problems too, I believe. Google maps gives 515 miles between campuses.

IWU/Hope are pretty clear geographic compromise options for second weekend hosting sites, I think.

Which presumably means IWU, since assuming Hope's women (still undefeated) make it to the sectional, they have hosting priority the second weekend.

Sure, or Rose-Hulman, or Wheaton, or Wittenberg...we all can't get too ahead of ourselves on who will win! :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 03, 2014, 02:00:59 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 03, 2014, 01:51:09 PM
What would get really interesting is if Geneseo were to advance out of Wooster's pod.  They're too far away not only from St. Norbert and Wash U, but also from IWU and Wheaton.  If Hope is out as a hosting site, too, that could force the NCAA to fly Geneseo somewhere, unless Calvin or one of the other NCAC teams advances.

They took a risk with that bracket whether it was realized or not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: iwumichigander on March 03, 2014, 03:00:35 PM
Quote from: sac on March 03, 2014, 02:00:59 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 03, 2014, 01:51:09 PM
What would get really interesting is if Geneseo were to advance out of Wooster's pod.  They're too far away not only from St. Norbert and Wash U, but also from IWU and Wheaton.  If Hope is out as a hosting site, too, that could force the NCAA to fly Geneseo somewhere, unless Calvin or one of the other NCAC teams advances.

They took a risk with that bracket whether it was realized or not.
I agree; however, do you really see Geneseo getting by Wooster?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2014, 03:59:49 PM
Pods with NCAC teams, adding current Massey Ratings:

@Wooster (6) vs. St. Vincent (100)
Geneseo St. (31) vs. Dickinson (41)

@Illinois Wesleyan (4) vs. Webster (168)
St. Norbert (5) vs. Ohio Wesleyan (35)

@Wash U (2) vs. Wilmington (18)
Calvin (17) vs. Wittenberg (32)

Really tough route for either Ohio Wesleyan or Wittenberg to advance to the second weekend. Probably will require beating back-to-back top twenty teams, with the second one likely to be a true road game.

Wilmington is a tough draw for Wash U - could give them a real challenge.

For Wooster, Massey suggests that comparable teams to St. Vincent would be Baldwin-Wallace (83rd) or Hanover (88th), both Wooster wins from this year. Obviously Geneseo or Dickinson would basically be equivalent to facing Witt or Ohio Wesleyan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pointlem on March 03, 2014, 09:00:16 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 03, 2014, 01:42:19 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2014, 01:33:40 PM
If Wooster and Wash U advance they're geographic problems too, I believe. Google maps gives 515 miles between campuses.

IWU/Hope are pretty clear geographic compromise options for second weekend hosting sites, I think.

Which presumably means IWU, since assuming Hope's women (still undefeated) make it to the sectional, they have hosting priority the second weekend.
But if Hope and DePauw both win their regionals, they meet in the next game . . . and which of them would more likely host that?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 03, 2014, 09:16:57 PM
After 8 years at Hiram, Steve Fleming has resigned to run a family-owned business.

http://news.hiram.edu/?p=9528
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2014, 09:25:49 PM
Best wishes to Coach Fleming. He took Hiram from, really, a joke, to a solid mid-pack team with an "any given Sunday" chance every in every game. He made men's basketball relevant again in Hiram.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 03, 2014, 09:33:22 PM
Quote from: pointlem on March 03, 2014, 09:00:16 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 03, 2014, 01:42:19 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2014, 01:33:40 PM
If Wooster and Wash U advance they're geographic problems too, I believe. Google maps gives 515 miles between campuses.

IWU/Hope are pretty clear geographic compromise options for second weekend hosting sites, I think.

Which presumably means IWU, since assuming Hope's women (still undefeated) make it to the sectional, they have hosting priority the second weekend.
But if Hope and DePauw both win their regionals, they meet in the next game . . . and which of them would more likely host that?

Good point, and I don't know the answer - Hope is still undefeated, while DePauw has a loss, but I'd guess DePauw is higher in both SoS and vRROs.

I've mostly lost interest in the women's tourney since IWU, despite the third highest SoS in D3 and a ridiculous 6-5 vRROs, got snubbed.  I guess 8 losses, when women have still to achieve anywhere near the parity of the men, and even 6 losses is almost the 'kiss of death', was just too much to overcome despite the overwhelming other criteria.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kenyonfan on March 03, 2014, 09:37:35 PM
Is there an easy answer to why D3 mens basketball has a 62 team field? It's such an awkward number.  Even the women's bracket is a more logical 64. What's magic about 62?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pointlem on March 03, 2014, 09:39:21 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 03, 2014, 09:33:22 PM
Quote from: pointlem on March 03, 2014, 09:00:16 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 03, 2014, 01:42:19 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2014, 01:33:40 PM
If Wooster and Wash U advance they're geographic problems too, I believe. Google maps gives 515 miles between campuses.

IWU/Hope are pretty clear geographic compromise options for second weekend hosting sites, I think.

Which presumably means IWU, since assuming Hope's women (still undefeated) make it to the sectional, they have hosting priority the second weekend.
But if Hope and DePauw both win their regionals, they meet in the next game . . . and which of them would more likely host that?

Good point, and I don't know the answer - Hope is still undefeated, while DePauw has a loss, but I'd guess DePauw is higher in both SoS and vRROs.

I've mostly lost interest in the women's tourney since IWU, despite the third highest SoS in D3 and a ridiculous 6-5 vRROs, got snubbed.  I guess 8 losses, when women have still to achieve anywhere near the parity of the men, and even 6 losses is almost the 'kiss of death', was just too much to overcome despite the overwhelming other criteria.
But then Hope could offer a bigger house and revenue, and DePauw will have had an opportunity to host the first weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 03, 2014, 09:42:22 PM
Quote from: kenyonfan on March 03, 2014, 09:37:35 PM
Is there an easy answer to why D3 mens basketball has a 62 team field? It's such an awkward number.  Even the women's bracket is a more logical 64. What's magic about 62?
It's the result of a ratio; I believe it is one tournament participant for every 6.5 teams. There are more women's teams than men's in D3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2014, 11:24:24 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 01, 2014, 11:28:18 PM
Wooster is now 25-3.  ;D  Next up is a home game in the NCAA tourney vs. ...Wilmington?.... Penn St. Behrend?...St. Vincent?....Hope?....Rose-Hulman?

GO SCOTS!


Well, I guessed one of the 3 teams correctly but sure didn't predict that Geneseo and Dickinson would be visiting Timken Gymnasium.  :)

Good draw for Wooster as they have a reasonable path to the Sweet 16 if they can win their opening weekend games at home.  Bad draw for Wooster if they get to the Sweet 16 or Elite 8 because their quarter of the bracket includes Wash U., IWU, St. Norbert, Hope, Wheaton --- a number of tough teams so the Scots will certainly have to beat two very tough teams in the 3rd/4th rounds if they hope to reach Salem.

It is also not a good draw because if Wash U. wins their pod (highly likely), Wooster will not host the Sectional due to the 500 mile travel rule as others have noted in earlier posts today.  In that scenario, the Scots would likely travel to Illinois or Michigan for the Sweet 16 game if they got that far.

Great to see the NCAC get 3 teams in the tourney! ;D  Tough draws for both OWU and Witt but very nice that their seniors get to play in the NCAA tourney.

GO SCOTS, TIGERS, BISHOPS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 04, 2014, 12:22:27 AM
Personally, I think the most fun outcome would be the "MIAA-NCAC Challenge" sectional with Calvin vs. Ohio Wesleyan and Hope vs. Wooster at Timken Gym.

That would be a fun weekend of basketball and would stretch Timken's 3,400 capacity to the limits.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 04, 2014, 12:44:45 AM
One thing that stands out to me about the Wooster/Witt/OWU bracket is the number of teams in the bracket that are battle-tested. For example, Massey rates Ohio Wesleyan's schedule as the 35th-best in all of DIII, but it's only 8th best in this bracket! And four of the top-ten schedules are among these 16 teams.

Massey SOS ratings:
Wheaton - 1 (best sched in DIII)
Ill. Wesleyan - 6
Wash U - 7
Wilmington - 8 (likely boosted by playing DI Miami (OH) )
Hope - 17
Wooster - 19
Wittenberg - 24
Ohio Wesleyan - 35

These 8 teams all have schedules rated in the top 10% of all DIII schedules. Basically, lots of teams in this bracket have faced numerous NCAA-tournament quality teams throughout the regular season. I think there could be some simply fantastic DIII tournament games out of this bracket in the next two weekends.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 04, 2014, 01:52:30 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 03, 2014, 11:24:24 PM
It is also not a good draw because if Wash U. wins their pod (highly likely), Wooster will not host the Sectional due to the 500 mile travel rule as others have noted in earlier posts today.  In that scenario, the Scots would likely travel to Illinois or Michigan for the Sweet 16 game if they got that far.

Of the teams hosting in our half of the bracket, I think Washington got a really tough draw, maybe the toughest.  Wilmington is no pushover followed by Calvin/Wittenberg.  That's tough for a regional #1 ranked team I think.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 04, 2014, 09:30:05 AM
It's ironic that Washington University, a school that flies more than 500 miles many times during its regular season schedule, might be, because of the 500 mile limitation, the roadblock to Wooster hosting in the second round.  (Just pointing out the irony, not complaining.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on March 04, 2014, 09:35:20 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2014, 09:30:05 AM
It's ironic that Washington University, a school that flies more than 500 miles many times during its regular season schedule, might be, because of the 500 mile limitation, the roadblock to Wooster hosting in the second round.  (Just pointing out the irony, not complaining.)

If Wash U to Wooster fell within 500 miles, the sectional pod would be down in St. Louis (unless the Wash U women get to host, but they're potentially looking at a sectional pod with Hope and DePauw).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 04, 2014, 02:19:24 PM
Hey - there's a familiar face on the Saint Vincent roster!

http://athletics.stvincent.edu/roster.aspx?rp_id=3755&path=mbball
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on March 04, 2014, 02:32:26 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2014, 09:30:05 AM
It's ironic that Washington University, a school that flies more than 500 miles many times during its regular season schedule, might be, because of the 500 mile limitation, the roadblock to Wooster hosting in the second round.  (Just pointing out the irony, not complaining.)

Between Wash U, IWU, and Wooster, the Bears are clearly the highest seed.  After that, there is a good chance IWU is the next highest...

* Washington U.: .920/.588/9-2
* Illinois Wesleyan: .852/.560/8-3
* Wooster: .923/.543/7-2

(IWU vs Wooster seeding is close.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 04, 2014, 02:44:15 PM
Quote from: Titan Q on March 04, 2014, 02:32:26 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2014, 09:30:05 AM
It's ironic that Washington University, a school that flies more than 500 miles many times during its regular season schedule, might be, because of the 500 mile limitation, the roadblock to Wooster hosting in the second round.  (Just pointing out the irony, not complaining.)

Between Wash U, IWU, and Wooster, the Bears are clearly the highest seed.  After that, there is a good chance IWU is the next highest...

* Washington U.: .920/.588/9-2
* Illinois Wesleyan: .852/.560/8-3
* Wooster: .923/.543/7-2

(IWU vs Wooster seeding is close.)

Bracket suggests Wooster is the highest seed.   ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: iwumichigander on March 04, 2014, 02:48:22 PM
Quote from: sac on March 04, 2014, 02:44:15 PM
Quote from: Titan Q on March 04, 2014, 02:32:26 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2014, 09:30:05 AM
It's ironic that Washington University, a school that flies more than 500 miles many times during its regular season schedule, might be, because of the 500 mile limitation, the roadblock to Wooster hosting in the second round.  (Just pointing out the irony, not complaining.)

Between Wash U, IWU, and Wooster, the Bears are clearly the highest seed.  After that, there is a good chance IWU is the next highest...

* Washington U.: .920/.588/9-2
* Illinois Wesleyan: .852/.560/8-3
* Wooster: .923/.543/7-2

(IWU vs Wooster seeding is close.)

Bracket suggests Wooster is the highest seed.   ???
Highest seed in their bracket not necessarily higher than WashU or IWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HOPEful on March 04, 2014, 02:50:22 PM
I think will most likely be at IWU... However, if St. Norbert can knock them off, then it seems that it will be at Hope/Wheaton... (assuming Wooster and Washington move on)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: iwumichigander on March 04, 2014, 02:54:00 PM
Quote from: sethteater on March 04, 2014, 02:50:22 PM
I think will most likely be at IWU... However, if St. Norbert can knock them off, then it seems that it will be at Hope/Wheaton... (assuming Wooster and Washington move on)
And, Hope/Wheaton could be dependent on the outcome on the Hope women does it not?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 04, 2014, 02:54:56 PM
Championship manual states, highest side in the bracket should be at the top.  Looking at all the brackets it looks like maybe they failed to do that properly.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 04, 2014, 02:55:51 PM
All-league teams (http://www2.northcoast.org/sites/default/files/mbasketball/All-NCACmbkb14.pdf) for those interested.  Congrats to all honored this season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 04, 2014, 02:56:18 PM
Quote from: iwumichigander on March 04, 2014, 02:54:00 PM
Quote from: sethteater on March 04, 2014, 02:50:22 PM
I think will most likely be at IWU... However, if St. Norbert can knock them off, then it seems that it will be at Hope/Wheaton... (assuming Wooster and Washington move on)
And, Hope/Wheaton could be dependent on the outcome on the Hope women does it not?

Yes and no, despite Hope fans wishes I think their women are behind Washington and DePauw in hosting the next round.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HOPEful on March 04, 2014, 02:57:14 PM
Quote from: sac on March 04, 2014, 02:56:18 PM
Quote from: iwumichigander on March 04, 2014, 02:54:00 PM
Quote from: sethteater on March 04, 2014, 02:50:22 PM
I think will most likely be at IWU... However, if St. Norbert can knock them off, then it seems that it will be at Hope/Wheaton... (assuming Wooster and Washington move on)
And, Hope/Wheaton could be dependent on the outcome on the Hope women does it not?

Yes and no, despite Hope fans wishes I think their women are behind Washington and DePauw in hosting the next round.

Agreed. Nothing has changed really since the last NCAA regional rankings (the public ones) and they had a one loss DePauw ahead of Hope...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on March 04, 2014, 07:05:29 PM
Information on NCAC opponents for the first round: 

St Vincent:
Homepage:
http://athletics.stvincent.edu/index.aspx?path=mbball
Roster:
http://athletics.stvincent.edu/roster.aspx?path=mbball
Season Stats:
http://athletics.stvincent.edu/custompages/stats/mbb/2013-14/TEAMCUME.HTM

Calvin:
Homepage:
http://www.calvin.edu/sports/mens/basketball/
Roster:
http://www.calvin.edu/sports/mens/basketball/roster.htm
Season Stats:
http://www.calvin.edu/sports/mens/basketball/results/2013-14/teamstat.htm


St. Norbert
Homepage:
http://www.snc.edu/athletics/basketballm/
Roster
http://www.snc.edu/athletics/basketballm/roster.html
Season Stats
http://www.snc.edu/athletics/basketballm/stats.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: blindwatchmaker on March 04, 2014, 07:29:10 PM
Wash U Tourney Site:
http://bearsports.wustl.edu/Sports/Content/Pages/2014NCAABasketballRegional.aspx

IWU Tourney Site:
http://www.iwusports.com/sports/2014/3/4/MBB_0304144832.aspx?path=mbball
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2014, 10:34:58 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 04, 2014, 02:19:24 PM
Hey - there's a familiar face on the Saint Vincent roster!

http://athletics.stvincent.edu/roster.aspx?rp_id=3755&path=mbball

I wondered where Geoff FuQuay ended up and thanks to your eagle eye...we now have the answer. :)  Doesn't look like he has made much of an impact though as he is averaging less than 3 points per game and he didn't even get on the floor in the last two games played by Saint Vincent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 05, 2014, 01:34:13 AM
Quote from: sac on March 04, 2014, 02:54:56 PM
Championship manual states, highest side in the bracket should be at the top.  Looking at all the brackets it looks like maybe they failed to do that properly.

I'm shocked...shocked and stunned.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on March 05, 2014, 08:41:18 AM
Quote from: sac on March 04, 2014, 02:54:56 PM
Championship manual states, highest side in the bracket should be at the top.  Looking at all the brackets it looks like maybe they failed to do that properly.

The highest-seeded team that meets all selection criteria (and after a review of the submitted host materials) will be selected
as the host institution, provided geographic proximity is maintained. It is the intent of the committee to create competition
brackets with a maximum of eight teams competing in each bracket. Flights will be kept to a minimum. The host institution
will play the second game when applicable.

The higher-ranked team will be listed at the top of the competition bracket. The top team on the bracket is the designated
home team and will wear the light- (white-)colored jersey in contrast with the visiting team’s dark uniform.

I don't really know what the point of this is, but they seem to be calling "brackets" half of what we might call a bracket region. So what they're saying is Wooster is above Hope and Wash U. is above IWU.

(Would also mean Emory was above UWSP? And Texas-Dallas above UW-Whitewater?)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 05, 2014, 08:45:54 AM
Quote from: KnightSlappy on March 05, 2014, 08:41:18 AM
Quote from: sac on March 04, 2014, 02:54:56 PM
Championship manual states, highest side in the bracket should be at the top.  Looking at all the brackets it looks like maybe they failed to do that properly.

The highest-seeded team that meets all selection criteria (and after a review of the submitted host materials) will be selected
as the host institution, provided geographic proximity is maintained. It is the intent of the committee to create competition
brackets with a maximum of eight teams competing in each bracket. Flights will be kept to a minimum. The host institution
will play the second game when applicable.

The higher-ranked team will be listed at the top of the competition bracket. The top team on the bracket is the designated
home team and will wear the light- (white-)colored jersey in contrast with the visiting team's dark uniform.

I don't really know what the point of this is, but they seem to be calling "brackets" half of what we might call a bracket region. So what they're saying is Wooster is above Hope and Wash U. is above IWU.

(Would also mean Emory was above UWSP?)

It was Emory and Purchase that made me question if they really did it correctly, though I suppose its possible they believe Purchase is a #1 seed.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on March 05, 2014, 10:48:23 PM
A few notes about the upcoming game between Wittenberg and Calvin:

1. The usual starting lineup for the Knights is, as it always seems to be, HUGE. 6'3", 6'3", 6'7", 6'8", 6'9". You just don't see that kind of size and, presumably, length in D3 basketball very often. I think that's why Calvin generally seems to have success in the National Tournament.  Most teams simply aren't used to playing against players of that size.  Adjusting is not easy, and teams can't afford to fall behind too far in National Tournament games. I think the Tigers are going to have to shoot the ball well from the perimeter and really pressure Calvin's guards to have a chance in this game (by numerous accounts on the MIAA board this seemed to work for Hope).

2. If you give Coach Brown time to game plan and strategize, he does pretty darn well.  Some quick research revealed that Witt has won 5 of its last 7 first-round NCAA Tournament games, with the only two losses coming in consecutive years to good John Carroll teams.  I have no doubt that Coach Brown will have the boys ready to play on Friday night. I don't envy his job this weekend though.

Should be a great atmosphere in St. Louis this entire weekend. If I didn't have to work, I would certainly be at the game on Friday. If the Tigers are fortunate enough to pull out the victory, I plan on driving over on Saturday to catch the sectional final.  Good luck to the Bishops and Scots as well.  Would love to see three NCAC teams advance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: oldknight on March 05, 2014, 11:34:28 PM
Quote from: Urban For Prez on March 05, 2014, 10:48:23 PM
A few notes about the upcoming game between Wittenberg and Calvin:

1. The usual starting lineup for the Knights is, as it always seems to be, HUGE. 6'3", 6'3", 6'7", 6'8", 6'9". You just don't see that kind of size and, presumably, length in D3 basketball very often. I think that's why Calvin generally seems to have success in the National Tournament.  Most teams simply aren't used to playing against players of that size.  Adjusting is not easy, and teams can't afford to fall behind too far in National Tournament games. I think the Tigers are going to have to shoot the ball well from the perimeter and really pressure Calvin's guards to have a chance in this game (by numerous accounts on the MIAA board this seemed to work for Hope).

2. If you give Coach Brown time to game plan and strategize, he does pretty darn well.  Some quick research revealed that Witt has won 5 of its last 7 first-round NCAA Tournament games, with the only two losses coming in consecutive years to good John Carroll teams.  I have no doubt that Coach Brown will have the boys ready to play on Friday night. I don't envy his job this weekend though.

Should be a great atmosphere in St. Louis this entire weekend. If I didn't have to work, I would certainly be at the game on Friday. If the Tigers are fortunate enough to pull out the victory, I plan on driving over on Saturday to catch the sectional final.  Good luck to the Bishops and Scots as well.  Would love to see three NCAC teams advance.

Some good points made here. I've looked at the season box scores for Calvin and Wittenberg and just based on that look, the two teams seem remarkably similar. Calvin shoots the ball slightly better, both overall and from the arc, but the difference isn't significant. Neither team seems to force a high number of turnovers. The biggest difference seems to be that Calvin blocks a lot more shots than Witt (141 vs. 49). Calvin's Tyler Dykstra blocked 52 by himself, more than the entire Wittenberg team. Both teams seem to hang their hat on beating their opponent on the boards and have exactly the same rebounding differential at +8.5. To me that is the key stat to watch Friday night. Calvin has been outrebounded four times this season and lost each time that happened. In Calvin's two regular season losses to Hope the Knights were outrebounded by a combined total of 18 boards, a remarkable differential for a team I think is a very good rebounding team. On Saturday, Calvin was +1 on the boards and ran away from the Flying Dutchmen in the second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HOPEful on March 06, 2014, 07:55:28 AM
Quote from: oldknight on March 05, 2014, 11:34:28 PM
Quote from: Urban For Prez on March 05, 2014, 10:48:23 PM

Neither team seems to force a high number of turnovers. The biggest difference seems to be that Calvin blocks a lot more shots than Witt (141 vs. 49). Calvin's Tyler Dykstra blocked 52 by himself, more than the entire Wittenberg team. Both teams seem to hang their hat on beating their opponent on the boards and have exactly the same rebounding differential at +8.5. To me that is the key stat to watch Friday night. Calvin has been outrebounded four times this season and lost each time that happened. In Calvin's two regular season losses to Hope the Knights were outrebounded by a combined total of 18 boards, a remarkable differential for a team I think is a very good rebounding team. On Saturday, Calvin was +1 on the boards and ran away from the Flying Dutchmen in the second half.

In the three games that Calvin played Hope, the rebound differential was -10, -8, +1... guess which one they won?

In the three games that Calvin played Hope, they turned the ball over 15, 13, and 7 times... guess which one they won?

Kruis and Brink will get their points, but I agree that Wittenberg needs to watch out for Tyler Dykstra and Mickey DeVries, blocking shots and pounding the boards...

On the other end, watch sophomores Jordan Daley and Austin Parks and wheather they make good decisions passing the ball, as well. Calvin will be a very tough to team to beat, for Wittenberg or Washington/Wilmington, if their guards make good decisions and their bigs play aggressive and stay out of foul trouble.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 06, 2014, 08:30:00 AM
Quote from: Urban For Prez on March 05, 2014, 10:48:23 PM
2. If you give Coach Brown time to game plan and strategize, he does pretty darn well.
Unless the opponent is Wooster.

This is something that has been gnawing at me for a while. Wittenberg is pretty good every year, winning 17-20 games, getting a top-four seed in the conference tournament, and qualifying for the NCAAs every other year or so. That's the kind of resume that would be very exciting to at least 97% of D3 schools.

But Wittenberg is not 97% of D3 schools. Wittenberg is, or used to be, accustomed to success at the very highest levels, and apart from one magical tournament run eight years ago, Coach Brown has just not achieved that level of success. I would like to believe that winning one NCAC (regular season) title in 10 years and losing to Wooster game after game would be wearing pretty thin in Springfield by now. They've got to be looking up at Wooster, going to the NCAAs in 19 of the past 20 seasons and winning at least 20 games for 18 straight seasons, and thinking, "that should be happening here."

I wonder if I'm alone in wondering this.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 06, 2014, 09:00:07 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 06, 2014, 08:30:00 AM
Quote from: Urban For Prez on March 05, 2014, 10:48:23 PM
2. If you give Coach Brown time to game plan and strategize, he does pretty darn well.
Unless the opponent is Wooster.

This is something that has been gnawing at me for a while. Wittenberg is pretty good every year, winning 17-20 games, getting a top-four seed in the conference tournament, and qualifying for the NCAAs every other year or so. That's the kind of resume that would be very exciting to at least 97% of D3 schools.

But Wittenberg is not 97% of D3 schools. Wittenberg is, or used to be, accustomed to success at the very highest levels, and apart from one magical tournament run eight years ago, Coach Brown has just not achieved that level of success. I would like to believe that winning one NCAC (regular season) title in 10 years and losing to Wooster game after game would be wearing pretty thin in Springfield by now. They've got to be looking up at Wooster, going to the NCAAs in 19 of the past 20 seasons and winning at least 20 games for 18 straight seasons, and thinking, "that should be happening here."

I wonder if I'm alone in wondering this.

I don't wonder about it much, but when I do it makes me happy.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 06, 2014, 11:37:47 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 06, 2014, 08:30:00 AM
Quote from: Urban For Prez on March 05, 2014, 10:48:23 PM
2. If you give Coach Brown time to game plan and strategize, he does pretty darn well.
Unless the opponent is Wooster.

This is something that has been gnawing at me for a while. Wittenberg is pretty good every year, winning 17-20 games, getting a top-four seed in the conference tournament, and qualifying for the NCAAs every other year or so. That's the kind of resume that would be very exciting to at least 97% of D3 schools.

But Wittenberg is not 97% of D3 schools. Wittenberg is, or used to be, accustomed to success at the very highest levels, and apart from one magical tournament run eight years ago, Coach Brown has just not achieved that level of success. I would like to believe that winning one NCAC (regular season) title in 10 years and losing to Wooster game after game would be wearing pretty thin in Springfield by now. They've got to be looking up at Wooster, going to the NCAAs in 19 of the past 20 seasons and winning at least 20 games for 18 straight seasons, and thinking, "that should be happening here."

I wonder if I'm alone in wondering this.

Interesting thought.  What I've bolded here, I think, ought to be the thought process of every team in the league- not just Wittenberg.  If you're not thinking "that should be happening here", then you're doing it wrong. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 06, 2014, 12:40:59 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 06, 2014, 11:37:47 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 06, 2014, 08:30:00 AM
Quote from: Urban For Prez on March 05, 2014, 10:48:23 PM
2. If you give Coach Brown time to game plan and strategize, he does pretty darn well.
Unless the opponent is Wooster.

This is something that has been gnawing at me for a while. Wittenberg is pretty good every year, winning 17-20 games, getting a top-four seed in the conference tournament, and qualifying for the NCAAs every other year or so. That's the kind of resume that would be very exciting to at least 97% of D3 schools.

But Wittenberg is not 97% of D3 schools. Wittenberg is, or used to be, accustomed to success at the very highest levels, and apart from one magical tournament run eight years ago, Coach Brown has just not achieved that level of success. I would like to believe that winning one NCAC (regular season) title in 10 years and losing to Wooster game after game would be wearing pretty thin in Springfield by now. They've got to be looking up at Wooster, going to the NCAAs in 19 of the past 20 seasons and winning at least 20 games for 18 straight seasons, and thinking, "that should be happening here."

I wonder if I'm alone in wondering this.

Interesting thought.  What I've bolded here, I think, ought to be the thought process of every team in the league- not just Wittenberg.  If you're not thinking "that should be happening here", then you're doing it wrong.

Though you need to baby-step it. I don't think Oberlin or Allegheny right now can say that at all. I think Hiram, Kenyon and Denison need to say, "We should be in the top 4 of the NCAC" right now, because they're in that state where they compete, then fall back, then compete.

No reason for OWU, DPU or Wabash not to be in the championship chase every year - and that makes Wabash's struggles this year frustrating.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on March 06, 2014, 05:35:09 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 06, 2014, 08:30:00 AM
Quote from: Urban For Prez on March 05, 2014, 10:48:23 PM
2. If you give Coach Brown time to game plan and strategize, he does pretty darn well.
Unless the opponent is Wooster.

This is something that has been gnawing at me for a while. Wittenberg is pretty good every year, winning 17-20 games, getting a top-four seed in the conference tournament, and qualifying for the NCAAs every other year or so. That's the kind of resume that would be very exciting to at least 97% of D3 schools.

But Wittenberg is not 97% of D3 schools. Wittenberg is, or used to be, accustomed to success at the very highest levels, and apart from one magical tournament run eight years ago, Coach Brown has just not achieved that level of success. I would like to believe that winning one NCAC (regular season) title in 10 years and losing to Wooster game after game would be wearing pretty thin in Springfield by now. They've got to be looking up at Wooster, going to the NCAAs in 19 of the past 20 seasons and winning at least 20 games for 18 straight seasons, and thinking, "that should be happening here."

I wonder if I'm alone in wondering this.

First let me clarify my initial point, which is substantiated only by my previously cited basic research, the sentiments of those closer to the program than I, and my direct observations.  I think Coach Brown's strength lies in his ability to break down another team's tendencies and prepare his team accordingly.  I think he is able to game plan generally better than his coaching counterparts.  Thus, when he has this extended time (i.e. basically five days before the first round NCAA tournament game) to look at film and digest it, I believe he prepares his team better than his opposing coach's prepare their respective teams.  However, the counterpoint is that when time to prepare is limited (i.e. one night before an NCAC championship game or a second-round NCAA Tournament game), I don't think he's quite as effective.  I think most who are familiar with the program know that his strength is not his in-game adjustments. Again, that's based only on my own observations and what I have gathered from those in and around the program.  I'm currently at work and cannot check to see if that proposition is supported by the results.  I meant my initial post to be a compliment to Coach Brown and his staff, so I hate to take anything away from that, but this is how I see it.

To your point David- I am not sure how much Wooster's recent success is weighing on the Tiger faithful. Wooster's recent success is undeniable, and there has certainly been grumblings in the stands during the last few games.  I think Witt's recent Elite Eight run and sweeping of the Scots in 2011-2012 likely helped ease some of the pain for the Tigers fans, but I, too, wonder for how long. I hope this weekend and upcoming weekends help to alleviate some of these concerns.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2014, 08:14:32 PM
Two-thirds of the NCAC standard bearers are heading home after the first round. Wittenberg fell hard in U.City at the hands of volleyball nemesis Calvin, 66-51, while OWU gave a spirited effort but were unable to head off #5 St. Norbert 87-79. Conference pride is now in the hands of the conference champion, Wooster, who trailed by 10 early in their game but who have come back to regain a 6-point lead on PAC champion St. Vincent with 1:20 to go before the half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 07, 2014, 08:17:58 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 39  Saint Vincent 29

Doug Thorpe hit a big three pointer 10 seconds before the end of the half and he is leading the Scots with 10 points.  Xavier Brown made 3 three pointers in a row to rally Wooster when they were down 25 to 16.  Brown with 9 points in the half while Dan Fanelly has 6 points and 7 boards.

Wooster finished the first half with a 23 to 4 scoring run.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2014, 09:09:25 PM
Wooster is in a real battle, leading 61-57 with 4:28 left. These St. Vincent guys sure can hit the three when they are even a little open. The refs are, putting it kindly, letting them play in the second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 07, 2014, 09:26:10 PM
Final:  Wooster 76  Saint Vincent 67  ;D

Xavier Brown led Wooster with 15 points.  Good balanced scoring for the Scots as they had 5 players with double figure points tonight.  Doug Thorpe had 14, Dan Fanelly had a double double with 12 points (11 boards), Kenny DeBoer had a double double with 12 points (10 boards) and Evan Pannell also had 12.

Wooster is now 26-3. :)  Next up is Dickinson tomorrow night in the 2nd round

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 07, 2014, 09:49:37 PM
Final: Penn St. Behrend 70  Hope 66 OT

Surprising win for PSB as they upset the Dutchmen on Hope's home court.  PSB now plays Wheaton in the 2nd round.

IF Wooster gets past Dickinson tomorrow night, they would play the PSB - Wheaton winner in the 3rd round.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 08, 2014, 12:54:57 PM
Dickinson starts a even bigger team than the one that lost to Wooster last year.  Here are their starters:

6'1" Adam Honig
6'4" Brandon Angradi
6'5" Tucker Landy
6'8" Gerry Wixted
6'10" Steve Collins

Angradi and Collins did not start last year so Dickinson is even taller this season.  Honig and Angradi have each made >60 three pointers this year.

Last year, Wooster outrebounded Dickinson but over 20 combined boards for the Scots were from Claytor, Mays, LaLonde & Wingard.  None  of those guys will see the floor for Wooster tonight so the Scots are going to need to fight hard on the boards this evening.  Let's hope that Josh Kipfer has recovered from the elbow to his head yesterday and is ready to play some tough minutes tonight.

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 08, 2014, 03:02:44 PM
Feels like it could be a tough matchup for the Scots tonight - thanks for the scouting report, WSF. From the parts of Geneseo-Dickinson that I watched last night, it seemed like they were very comfortable in the half-court set, with lots of ball movement and in particular a higher-than-normal amount of skip passes as part of the offense. Wooster will need to be very alert with its help-side defense and defensive rotations in the man-to-man sets tonight to avoid being broken down by Dickinson's offense.

Scots will also face the size challenge down low, and will be especially weak if Kipfer can't provide his regular minutes. I didn't think the Scots rebounded very well last night, but some of that was related to very few fouls being called on any rebound attempts last night (in either direction). We'll see how the whistle is tonight.

I watched a pretty good chunk of PSU-Behrend and Hope, and while it is a surprise win in the sense that Behrend has maybe 1/100th of the national reputation of the Dutchmen, it was no fluke win. Everything I watched felt very evenly matched. If they played 10 times, the series might go 5-5.

I'm also a Calvin and IWU fan tonight. I think if those teams advance, Wooster very likely hosts next weekend as everyone would be within 500 miles of the Scots and Wash U's loss would leave the Scots as the highest remaining seed. Still several outcomes that would force the NCAA to pay for a flight next weekend, and a couple outcomes that would force two!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2014, 07:01:42 PM
Very first moment of the game, the opening tip, and Jon Heavilin complains about how it is officiated.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2014, 07:38:52 PM
Scots not playing D, not hitting threes, not rebounding on the offensive end...and thus down 8 at the half. Going to have to step it up if they want to advance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 08, 2014, 07:46:36 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 08, 2014, 07:01:42 PM
Very first moment of the game, the opening tip, and Jon Heavilin complains about how it is officiated.  ::)

Beyond that, three times in about two minutes, he confused Dan Fanelly with Josh Kipfer.  Fanelly has dark shorter hair, Kipfer has blonde locks longer than any of the Wooster cheerleaders.  Yesterday, when trying to figure out how to pronounce Geneseo, he tried it a couple of times and then just decided that was the way it was going to be.  No research, nothing that would actually take any work.  Can we please put this guy in a home already?  I mean, how can I complain about other team's announcers when we have one that's as bad or worse?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2014, 08:52:08 PM
Well, damn. A pretty disappointing end to what was a great year for the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 08, 2014, 09:14:31 PM
Just incredibly disappointing, but Dickinson was the better team throughout the night. They earned it, good luck to them later in the tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on March 08, 2014, 10:19:19 PM
I'm not so sure that Dickinson was the better team.  And, by saying that, I mean no disrespect to them.  It was just one of those nights when Wooster just couldn't get any jumpers to drop.  Not mid-range, not threes.  These things happen, and if they happen against a mid-level team such as a Denison or Kenyon, the Scots have enough talent that they can find another way to win.  But not against a pretty good team such as Dickinson.  A very tough loss, though, at home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 08, 2014, 10:43:04 PM
Congratulations to the Dickinson Red Devils on the win at Wooster.  They played some tough defense and made 11 three pointers which was the difference.

As others have noted, Wooster did not shoot well tonight and you won't win many NCAA tourney games shooting only 35% from the floor.  Freshman Dan Fanelly played a great game tonight with 15 points and 8 boards -- it will be exciting to watch him develop further next season.

Congrats to seniors Doug Thorpe, Kenny DeBoer and Scott Purcell on finishing their Wooster careers with a NCAC title and a NCAC tourney title!  :)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 10, 2014, 10:53:19 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 08, 2014, 10:19:19 PM
I'm not so sure that Dickinson was the better team.  And, by saying that, I mean no disrespect to them.  It was just one of those nights when Wooster just couldn't get any jumpers to drop.  Not mid-range, not threes.  These things happen, and if they happen against a mid-level team such as a Denison or Kenyon, the Scots have enough talent that they can find another way to win.  But not against a pretty good team such as Dickinson.  A very tough loss, though, at home.


Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 08, 2014, 09:14:31 PM
Just incredibly disappointing, but Dickinson was the better team throughout the night. They earned it, good luck to them later in the tourney.

I think we agree, based on the bolded sections. My premise was that Dickinson was better than Wooster on Saturday night, and yours seems to be that Wooster was worse than Dickinson that night. Seems like po-TAY-to, po-TOT-to to me. :-)

This is the worst I've felt about a Wooster tourney exit since the '05-'06 team that lost in the second round at Transylvania. I really thought, especially once I saw the bracket, that the Scots could make a serious push for Salem this year. Alas.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 26, 2014, 12:04:56 PM
Any news next year's newcomers at Wooster, whether it be freshman or transfers? It will be nice to hopefully have LaLonde back and healthy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on March 29, 2014, 03:05:14 PM
Quote from: countyroad on March 26, 2014, 12:04:56 PM
Any news next year's newcomers at Wooster, whether it be freshman or transfers? It will be nice to hopefully have LaLonde back and healthy.

Wooster's top "recruit" for next year is already on the team now (DeBoer). We need to see an article about him like was written about Richard Barnes today (http://www.the-daily-record.com/local%20sports/2014/03/29/barnes-coming-back-to-finish-business). It's not as much of a pipe dream as you might think. The other top "newcomer" for next year is also already on the team (LaLonde). Considering he has only played 18 varsity games in three years of college, and none this past year, he is more or less like getting a new recruit.

As for players not currently on the team, if they can land a true post player and preferably a point guard who can run the offense in two years, then this will have been a successful offseason. But that is a lot of ifs.

Wooster might actually be more athletic next year, but will they be able to shoot well enough? That's what has sent them home each of the past two seasons, and right now I don't see an obvious reason to think that they will be a better shooting team next year either.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 29, 2014, 09:18:55 PM
I saw Kenny in the annual I.S. Monday parade (of seniors) last week (and he was carrying a senior teammate on his shoulders!)  Particularly given that basketball spans both semesters, I would be really surprised if he comes back next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on April 02, 2014, 01:32:56 PM
6'4 SF Ryan Wobbe (2014) of South Bend's Saint Joseph H.S. has committed to the College of Wooster

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mKpPWsZ3X54
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on April 05, 2014, 01:45:16 PM
6-1 guard  Taylor Graffa  Detroit Country Day will attend Wooster College.

Jr. year highlights, #20
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omzazVLYN8U
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on April 05, 2014, 07:49:03 PM
Sac,

Man, you are on top of this stuff. If I didn't know better, I'd think you were the Wooster SID. Are these guys showing up on a recruiting commit list somewhere?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on April 06, 2014, 01:26:11 PM
Quote from: seinfeld on April 05, 2014, 07:49:03 PM
Sac,

Man, you are on top of this stuff. If I didn't know better, I'd think you were the Wooster SID. Are these guys showing up on a recruiting commit list somewhere?

Just random twitterz
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on April 07, 2014, 04:13:30 PM
Trifecta for DePauw

Jack VandeMerkt   6-7 C Riverside-Brookfield HS (Chicago burb) 
"will choose between DePauw University, Illinois Wesleyan and University of Wisconsin-Oshkosh among others"

Mason Hankins  5-11 PG  Hamilton Southeastern HS
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-jmwbFbv1M

David Vogel  6-4  G/F  Norwell HS, Ossian, In
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIE-UEX-ESU
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Lee Wilson on April 17, 2014, 09:53:03 PM
Update via the Journal Review:
Antoine Carpenter resigns and the search for a new coach starts immediately. Interesting interesting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on April 18, 2014, 12:38:36 PM
Intriguing. The results for the LGs haven't been there the last two seasons. However, Wabash doesn't just roll through coaches - they're really patient. Hmmm....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on April 18, 2014, 02:01:54 PM
So....I've kind of been waiting to see if something would happen with the basketball position or not and I had actually reached the point of thinking that no changes would be made here as it's been quite awhile now since the season has wrapped up.  I've got some numbers to present here, but before any of that I do need to say that I'm really bummed that this didn't work out for Coach Carpenter.  I really wanted to see him pick up where Coach Petty left off seamlessly and continue the upward swing Wabash had been on from about 2008-2011. 

And now for some cold hard facts and why things like this come to pass.  In the '11-'12 season, Coach Carpenter inherited a senior-laden and really talented group.  That group started 12-1, ranked #14, and was fresh off of a total boatrace job against Wooster.  The rest of the season was marked by really inconsistent play, a 6-7 record and a first round NCAC tournament loss at home to Denison and if any one game was responsible for keeping the LGs out of the big bracket that year, it was that one.  18-8, 10-6 were the final tallies there.

On to '12-'13...this was always going to be a rough season having graduated more or less all of the team's offense and rebuilding with two players who miss all of preseason camp for football, an improving center, and then a ton of freshmen.  It's the textbook definition of a rebuilding year.  Final tally here was 9-17, 7-9- good enough for 7th place and another first round tournament exit.  Also noteworthy is that Wabash ranked 9th or 10th in the league in the following categories: Scoring O, Scoring Margin, FG%, 3FG%, and Assists.  Even with an adequate defense (which that group turned into by the end of the year), you can't win if you can't score. 

'13-'14...like I said, '12-'13 was always going to be hard.  But now you've got all of those players back, including the 2013 NotY AND the guy that will become the 2014 NotY and the record doesn't improve one game.  8-17, 7-11, 7th place again, and again one and out in the league tournament.  And tracking the above statistical categories from '12-'13 to this past season: Wabash was still 9th or 10th in every one of those same categories.  And ultimately I think it is this lack of improvement with a group of talented players (now with a year of experience) that maybe creates the need for a change. 

And again, I'm not celebrating this at all.  But when you look at the year-over-year results, I think it isn't too hard to see why there might be a change made there.  Look around this league right now.  There are some really REALLY good coaches up and down this league.  And not just good, but experience and success out the wazoo.  Steve Moore is obviously a master and his record speaks for itself.  Bill Brown is tremendous and has been to the Final Four.  Bill Fenlon has been to a Final Four.  Mike DeWitt has that thing at OWU humming along.  Bob Ghiloni over at Denison has a ton of experience in the business and has done a pretty good job (especially against Wabash over the last few years).  The point being, this is a really rugged group of coaches to compete against and try to learn this trade for the first time while also having/expecting success. 

It'll be an interesting handful of weeks coming up to see which direction AD Maklin decides to take the program. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on April 26, 2014, 02:56:00 PM
Quote from: sac on April 05, 2014, 01:45:16 PM
6-1 guard  Taylor Graffa  Detroit Country Day will attend Wooster College.

Jr. year highlights, #20
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omzazVLYN8U

Sac -- thanks for the posts on the new Wooster recruits. k+

Great to see that Wooster beat out Wittenberg, Hope and Washington University among others for Taylor Graffa's recruitment. ;D  Here is a link to an article where he answers questions about his recruitment:  http://theprepballreport.com/2014/04/09/country-days-taylor-graafa-talks-college-of-wooster-commit/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on May 15, 2014, 06:15:00 PM
Wabash has today announced its new basketball coach.  He is Kyle Brumett, formerly head coach at Defiance, and at one time an assistant at DePauw.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: cave2bens on May 16, 2014, 10:39:53 PM
Quote from: sigma one on May 15, 2014, 06:15:00 PM
Wabash has today announced its new basketball coach.  He is Kyle Brumett, formerly head coach at Defiance, and at one time an assistant at DePauw.

Good, young coach - excellent pick up for Wabash and certainly a major loss for Defiance!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on June 14, 2014, 11:24:59 AM
I saw in the local paper that Alex Belinsky from my alma mater, Lake, is headed to Wooster.  He's a 6'3" shooter who was a key player (and hit some big shots) for a Lake team that fell one bucket short of the DI regional title and won back to back Federal League titles.  He was 1st team All-District and a very good student it sounds like.  As I always say, obviously I want everyone to pick Mount, but great program and great school in Wooster.  A wise choice I'm sure.  Best of luck to the young man.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on June 20, 2014, 04:06:12 PM
For those who may not know... Wittenberg will be participating in the Hoopsville Classic on November 21-23. Here is more information and the pairings: www.d3hoops.com/notables/2014/06/hoopsville-classic-pairings-announced (http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2014/06/hoopsville-classic-pairings-announced)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on July 06, 2014, 05:56:09 PM
Confirmation Hope will be playing at Wooster's Mose Hole Classic

http://athletics.hope.edu/sports/mbkb/2014-15/schedule
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 12, 2014, 10:11:18 PM
While Wooster's upcoming schedule is not yet posted on their site, I have pieced together most of Wooster's 7 non-conference games from 2014-2015 schedules posted by other teams:

11/15 Cabrini (H) -- tough opening game with D3 Player of the Year Aaron Walton-Moss visiting Timken again

11/21 Mt. Union (H) -- one of the top OAC teams (looks like the first game in the Al Van Wie tourney)

11/22 St. Vincent (H) -- top PAC team and Wooster's opponent in the NCAA tournament last year

11/29 Hanover (A) -- one of the top HCAC teams on the road, returning a visit that Hanover made to Wooster last season

12/17 Pitt-Bradford (A) -- road game with an AMCC team and probably the easiest non-conference opponent?

12/29 & 12/30  Hosting the Mose Hole Classic with both Hope (MI) and Wisconsin La Crosse invited.  Still searching for the 3rd team and the actual game matchups.

Overall, it looks like Wooster will have another very challenging non-conference schedule!  :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on August 13, 2014, 10:27:29 AM
Here's what we have so far of Wooster's schedule:
http://www.d3hoops.com/teams/Wooster/Men/2014-15/index
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on August 13, 2014, 10:34:00 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on August 12, 2014, 10:11:18 PM

12/29 & 12/30  Hosting the Mose Hole Classic with both Hope (MI) and Wisconsin La Crosse invited.  Still searching for the 3rd team and the actual game matchups.

GO SCOTS!

Wooster's master schedule has Hope playing Spalding University(Ky) and UWL playing Wooster
https://connectdaily.wooster.edu/ViewCal.html?month=1&year=2015&calendar_id=33&dropdown=1&integral=0&approved=1&show_stop=1&show_resources=0   click the link on the schedule for the matchups and times
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on August 13, 2014, 07:51:15 PM
That's a good OOC slate for the Scots.  I'm glad Mount Union is playing at Wooster this year.  If they want to take the program to a higher level they need to start playing more teams that are already there to push themselves. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 13, 2014, 08:36:50 PM
Quote from: sac on August 13, 2014, 10:34:00 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on August 12, 2014, 10:11:18 PM

12/29 & 12/30  Hosting the Mose Hole Classic with both Hope (MI) and Wisconsin La Crosse invited.  Still searching for the 3rd team and the actual game matchups.

GO SCOTS!

Wooster's master schedule has Hope playing Spalding University(Ky) and UWL playing Wooster
https://connectdaily.wooster.edu/ViewCal.html?month=1&year=2015&calendar_id=33&dropdown=1&integral=0&approved=1&show_stop=1&show_resources=0   click the link on the schedule for the matchups and times

Sac,
Thanks for locating the 3rd team and the matchups for the Mose Hole...I should have thought to check the master schedule.  ::)

It would be great if Hope and Wooster can both win the first night so the Dutchmen and the Scots play for the tourney title.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on August 13, 2014, 09:57:48 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on August 13, 2014, 08:36:50 PM
Quote from: sac on August 13, 2014, 10:34:00 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on August 12, 2014, 10:11:18 PM

12/29 & 12/30  Hosting the Mose Hole Classic with both Hope (MI) and Wisconsin La Crosse invited.  Still searching for the 3rd team and the actual game matchups.

GO SCOTS!

Wooster's master schedule has Hope playing Spalding University(Ky) and UWL playing Wooster
https://connectdaily.wooster.edu/ViewCal.html?month=1&year=2015&calendar_id=33&dropdown=1&integral=0&approved=1&show_stop=1&show_resources=0   click the link on the schedule for the matchups and times

Sac,
Thanks for locating the 3rd team and the matchups for the Mose Hole...I should have thought to check the master schedule.  ::)

It would be great if Hope and Wooster can both win the first night so the Dutchmen and the Scots play for the tourney title.  ;)

... thereby causing AndersDY to have a crisis of some sort involving a possible personal meltdown. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on August 14, 2014, 05:48:09 PM
Quote from: sac on August 13, 2014, 10:34:00 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on August 12, 2014, 10:11:18 PM

12/29 & 12/30  Hosting the Mose Hole Classic with both Hope (MI) and Wisconsin La Crosse invited.  Still searching for the 3rd team and the actual game matchups.

GO SCOTS!

Wooster's master schedule has Hope playing Spalding University(Ky) and UWL playing Wooster
https://connectdaily.wooster.edu/ViewCal.html?month=1&year=2015&calendar_id=33&dropdown=1&integral=0&approved=1&show_stop=1&show_resources=0   click the link on the schedule for the matchups and times

That is a huge find, Thanks for posting that!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on August 14, 2014, 06:41:05 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on August 14, 2014, 05:48:09 PM
Quote from: sac on August 13, 2014, 10:34:00 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on August 12, 2014, 10:11:18 PM

12/29 & 12/30  Hosting the Mose Hole Classic with both Hope (MI) and Wisconsin La Crosse invited.  Still searching for the 3rd team and the actual game matchups.

GO SCOTS!

Wooster's master schedule has Hope playing Spalding University(Ky) and UWL playing Wooster
https://connectdaily.wooster.edu/ViewCal.html?month=1&year=2015&calendar_id=33&dropdown=1&integral=0&approved=1&show_stop=1&show_resources=0   click the link on the schedule for the matchups and times

That is a huge find, Thanks for posting that!

No problem, some schools have master schedules that are easy to access, others are harder to find.  They come in handy when you get impatient and start prodding around to fill in your own schedule blanks. :-\

Some aren't always accurate and up to date if a change has taken place.  I think Albion made a switch late last year and their published schedule didn't match their master schedule until the night before the season started.  So they aren't always reliable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: enjoymoreradio on August 22, 2014, 05:09:27 PM
No word on the Scot's winter roadtrip yet?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HCAlum86 on August 30, 2014, 09:33:43 PM
Hello all again! Hiram got a win over Hanover in the game simulation scrimmage today. Good to see! The offense looked great but the defense struggled a bit. Look for the Terriers to put up some points this year at least! Very pleased with what I saw.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on September 03, 2014, 03:10:49 PM
Quote from: enjoymoreradio on August 22, 2014, 05:09:27 PM
No word on the Scot's winter roadtrip yet?

The entire schedule is now posted and it doesn't look like there's a winter trip this year.

With the 18 conference games, 2 home tourneys, and the early game against Cabrini it would be really tough to fit in their normal winter trip.  As a result they have a 12-day break between the Bradford game and the Mose Hole!

http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2014-15/schedule
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on October 13, 2014, 09:24:06 PM
There is no winter trip, but evidently there was a fall one.

From the Scots' Facebook feed (https://www.facebook.com/woosterbasketball?fref=nf):
QuoteThe Scots have returned from a nine-day trip to Spain that was a success on all fronts. Great experience, and three wins in four games. More details about the trip in the coming days.

Less than five weeks until the season opener.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on October 18, 2014, 09:11:51 PM
If a basketball game is played in the heart of football season, is it really played at all? Wittenberg officially (or maybe it's unofficially) began its 2014-2015 season with an 80-69 loss to the University of Guelph in Canada.  No video, so all insight comes straight from the box score.  The Tigers lost every quarter (FIBA rules people) except the 4th, but mostly hung close with the Gryphons, who were playing their fourth game of the season. Sam Collins and Brock Kiesler were the only two Tigers in double figures. 

Some interesting notes: Jaelin Williams, a sophomore from nearby Shawnee HS, started the game and played a near-team high 20 minutes.  But he wasn't the only underclassmen to see playing time.  Not even close.  In fact, 11 of the 14 players who played tonight were underclassmen, with 5 of those players seeing their first "varsity" action.  Ben Bowen appears to be the early starter at PG, but certainly much can change before Wittenberg opens the season at Oberlin.  I was somewhat surprised to see John Albertson getting the start over Kiesler.  I really liked the potential Kiesler showed last year, and his stat line tonight suggests he might deserve some further consideration for that starting role. Of course, this could also just be a case of Coach Brown giving deference to seniors early in the season. Missing from the box score was Alex Fultz, who started 3 games and played in 23 last season.  Need to figure out whether he's yet another Tiger lost to attrition or whether he's missing the trip for another reason. Different looking team without Masin, Leahy, and Newell, but excited for the future of the program.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 19, 2014, 12:07:47 AM
That has to be an exhibition....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on October 19, 2014, 10:36:44 PM
The Wittenberg team went to Canada?  And we let them back IN?  (Sorry, just stretching a bit before the season starts.)  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on October 22, 2014, 09:01:37 AM
Quote from: smedindy on October 19, 2014, 12:07:47 AM
That has to be an exhibition....

Yes, definitely an exhibition.  For both Wittenberg and the Canadian teams, as I understand.  I merely meant this was the official beginning of Wittenberg's season. 

The Tigers returned to Springfield (sorry WoBo) yesterday afternoon with a 1-2 record, but also with some apparent optimism for the upcoming season.  Following their loss to Guelph, Wittenberg defeated York University on a last-second three pointer, and ended the trip with a seven-point loss at Windsor--a team that recently beat IPFW.  It's hard to discern much from an out-of-country trip in which all 14 Tigers played in each game.  However, this much is clear: Wittenberg will be very young this year.  You're going to see plenty of sophomores and freshmen in the usual 10-man rotation.  And maybe that's not bad.  At times, I think Brown has been overeager to play freshmen in the past. Given the roster composition this year, however, I think his hand might be forced.  If the group is as talented as promised, this year may mark the beginning of an exciting 3-4 years.  If not, at least the young players will get needed experience. If nothing else, it sounds like Brown is encouraged from the team's play in Canada.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Lee Wilson on November 06, 2014, 03:12:52 PM
I just looked through Wabash's roster and saw that Ross Sponsler wasn't there.  I know he was injured, but is he out for good?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on November 10, 2014, 06:16:26 PM
Lost in the shuffle of last week's decisive football game (congrats to Coach Fincham and the Tigers) was the NCAC's preseason basketball poll.  Here's how the coaches voted on the men's side: 

1- Wooster
2- DePauw
3- Wittenberg
4- OWU
5- Wabash
6- Denison
7- Kenyon
8-Oberlin
9- Hiram
10- Allegheny

What's surprising?

DePauw's rank, although I think it's deserved.  The New Tigers return a legitimate POY candidate (if not the POY frontrunner) in 6'9" senior center Tommy Ferentz.  Collectively, the league's big men aren't nearly as strong as they've been in the past 8-9 years.  Ferentz is simply going to overpower some teams in the NCAC, Wittenberg possibly included.  That combination of size and skill can be troublesome at this level.  Be prepared to see plenty of his left-handed drop-step hook shoot.  And be prepared to see it go in.  DePauw's guards are still a question mark and Coach Fenlon is still waiting to make his mark in the NCAC, but I wouldn't be surprised to see the New Tigers in the NCAA tournament this year.

Wabash's rank, although I also think it's deserved.  Last year's Little Giant team finished with losing records overall and in the NCAC, making their preseason rank somewhat suspect.  But their roster boasts as much young talent as any in the league. Kyle Alton is a good scorer, and Purvilicius showed signs of genuine promise last year.   The most persuasive justification of their relatively high ranking, however, is the new coach in town.  The Antoine Carpenter experience simply didn't work out.  Coach Brummet was one of the top coaches in the HCAC, and should lead Wabash back into contention.  If Sponsler is out, that definitely changes the picture, but I still expect Wabash to take a Giant step forward this year.

Oberlin outside of the cellar.  Coach Cavaco has definitely changed the atmosphere surrounding the program in recent years, even if his records haven't always indicated that intangible shift.  I didn't catch too many Oberlin games last year, so I don't have much else to offer regarding this season's outlooks.  Perhaps the other coaches recognized that a 6'9" junior averaging 9 and 7 may spell success for the Yeomen in the future. 

What's not surprising?

Wooster and the other top three teams.  It pains me to say it, but the league goes through Wooster until someone proves otherwise.  Their recent success is undeniable, and while they lost some key contributors from last year's team, they bring back Xavier Brown.  And that's enough to warrant the spot atop the poll.  Similarly, I would put Wooster, DPU, Witt, and OWU in a tier ahead of the remaining six teams.  Wabash and Dension may be able to pull off a couple "upsets" at home, but I expect those four teams to finish at the top of the league again this year. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 10, 2014, 06:49:37 PM
I'm just shocked at how far Allegheny has fallen in hoops and in football...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 10, 2014, 06:58:00 PM
DePauw shouldn't be that much of a surprise at two.  They handled Witt twice in the regular season last year easily and were in line to be the NCAC's at-large bid for the NCAA tournament, but for some reason lost to Witt in the NCAC tournament and consequently didn't make the tournament.  Witt lost far more to graduation than DePauw.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on November 10, 2014, 09:58:57 PM
Quote from: sac on November 10, 2014, 06:58:00 PM
DePauw shouldn't be that much of a surprise at two.  They handled Witt twice in the regular season last year easily and were in line to be the NCAC's at-large bid for the NCAA tournament, but for some reason lost to Witt in the NCAC tournament and consequently didn't make the tournament.  Witt lost far more to graduation than DePauw.





No arguments that DePauw owned Wittenberg during the regular season.  And no argument that Wittenberg lost more than DePauw in the offseason.  In fact, I would have had no issue with the coaches ranking Wittenberg last out of the current "Power 4" given the letter winners they graduated last May.  Perhaps "surprising" was a poor word choice, but I do think DePauw's preseason rank is somewhat unexpected.  I would have said the same if the coaches had picked Wittenberg to finish second as well.  DePauw has never finished higher than fourth in the league.  Picking them to finish second is predicting them to accomplish unprecedented success.  But, as I said, I think these expectations are warranted given their roster this year.  So, admittedly, maybe "surprise" wasn't the most accurate way to describe DePauw's ranking. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 10, 2014, 11:02:58 PM
DPU's never finished higher than fourth, but they haven't been in the league that long.

I personally hope my LG's stop DPU from finishing highly this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on November 12, 2014, 04:42:16 PM
Xavier Brown listed as a First Team Preseason All-American.

http://www.d3hoops.com/awards/all-americans/men/preseason-2015
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 15, 2014, 07:32:12 PM
Ummm, what?

Oberlin 65 Wittenberg 63
http://www.wittenbergtigers.com/sports/mbkb/2014-15/boxscores/20141115_12j7.xml
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 15, 2014, 07:50:15 PM
I....I just don't know...

Wittenberg was 74-6 against Oberlin all time. The last time Oberlin beat Wittenberg? Feburary of 1979....

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 15, 2014, 09:02:28 PM
Just as I was going to reason why the COW should never again invite the thugs of Cabrini to Ohio, Wooster's video goes out.  Why am I not surprised?  The least technically adept crew on the face of the earth, topped off by the poorest announcer.  Same old, same old.  As is my complaining, but I'm just so sick of this incompetence.

Yea, Oberlin!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on November 15, 2014, 09:10:40 PM
Looks like Wooster gets the victory over Cabrini 97-81. But as Wooster Booster mentioned audio and video goes out around 5 minute mark of 2nd half. Very disappointing production, but at least Scots got the victory.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 15, 2014, 11:54:06 PM
Back from Wooster where I watched the #10 Scots dismantle #20 Cabrini!   :)  Great win!

Wooster won this game in convincing fashion 97 to 80 by playing excellent team basketball.  When you shoot 51% from the floor with 18 assists, your team is going to win virtually all of those games.

If you had told me before the game that Dan Fanelly would only play 14 minutes due to foul trouble and that Xavier Brown would only score 4 points, I would have predicted a Wooster loss.  :o  The most pleasant surprise tonight for Wooster was the excellent team depth that they displayed.  Josh Kipfer stepped up big with Fanelly in foul trouble and dominated the paint with 26 points, 15 boards.  Evan Pannell nailed 4 of 4 three point shots and finished with 23 points.  Fanelly did manage to notch 14 points in only 14 minutes of playing time.  Freshman Spencer Williams was extremely quick, an excellent ball handler and scored 12 points in his first collegiate game!  Freshman Ari Stern also played significant guard minutes with good ball handling and very solid defense.  So, Wooster was 9 players strong in their rotation which should factor well for the rest of the season.  Scots played well as a team passing the ball and they played defense which is a word that is absent from Cabrini's vocabulary despite all the excessive trash talking done by Aaron Walton-Moss.  ;)

Wooster is now 1-0.  ;D  Next game is at home vs. Mount Union on 11/21 in the Al Van Wie tourney.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 16, 2014, 08:38:01 AM
Quote from: Urban For Prez on November 10, 2014, 06:16:26 PM
What's surprising?

Oberlin outside of the cellar.  Coach Cavaco has definitely changed the atmosphere surrounding the program in recent years, even if his records haven't always indicated that intangible shift.  I didn't catch too many Oberlin games last year, so I don't have much else to offer regarding this season's outlooks.  Perhaps the other coaches recognized that a 6'9" junior averaging 9 and 7 may spell success for the Yeomen in the future. 


Maybe after last night's win over Witt, Oberlin outside of the cellar isn't so surprising after all...   :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 16, 2014, 08:59:32 AM
Nice re-cap wsf!  Watched the re-play (muted btw  ;)) on MCTV and I must say, Wooster looked good!  Cabrini really has some issues inside as not only did Kipfer have far and away a career night with 26 points, but Fanelly added 14 in just 14 minutes of work. 

As wsf noted, a couple of Wooster's newcomers looked good as well in Spencer Williams and Ari Stern.  Williams is super quick and it was nice to see a Wooster guard slashing to the basket time after time with success and Stern was solid in his time playing the point.

I was also impressed with how the Scots played defensively.  They held 1st Team AA Aaron Walton-Moss to just 16 points and seemed to get in his head as he was fairly ineffective all game long shooting just 5-15 and fouling out with over 6 minutes left in the game!

Good win for the Scots and now its on to UMU Friday night which should be another good test vs. an OAC opponent...

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 16, 2014, 11:53:26 AM
Wooster did look good in the blurry MCTV webcast, which eventually chose total darkness as per their norm.  I'm glad to hear from on-the-spot accounts that the Scots won the actual game also.

The team moved the ball well and nearly everything seemed to work at the offensive end.  To be sure, Cabrini had a hand in that, but there was a nice mixture of outside shooting, slashing to the hoop, posting up, and transition.  Very, very few bad shots were taken.

I'd say that Wooster's defense was also very good, given how difficult it is to defend against the Philadelphia bull-rush style of play when the officials are bending over backwards to help them.  Not nearly enough charging fouls were called, so often the Wooster players were forced to just back off to avoid whistles on themselves.  For a stretch in the second half, when Wooster had a big lead, it got ridiculous, the Scots being called for four or five non-fouls in a row.  But that's what happens in Timken Gym when you're Wooster and up 15 or more.

The only negatives: Fanelly picking up so many fouls, although some were surely very iffy calls.  The point guards not getting any assists; they're distributors of the ball, but rarely for scores.  LaLonde's shot looks way too much like it did last year; hopefully that won't be an ongoing concern.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on November 16, 2014, 04:53:09 PM
Oberlin hanging on against D-I Youngstown State, down 29-22 at the Half, and close to within one (32-31) early in the second.

The Penguins pull away down the stretch and win 71-53.  Still, a game effort by the Yeomen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 16, 2014, 07:47:57 PM
In 2015-16, Oberlin will enter the transition process to make the jump to D-II.  Basketball competence seeming to no longer be an issue, the only remaining problem will be to downgrade the academics.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Urban For Prez on November 19, 2014, 08:58:26 AM
Capital 63 Wittenberg 43

I made my way over to Bexley last night to watch the Tigers live after watching them on that strange sideline-cam feed at Oberlin over the weekend. I wish I had stayed at home to watch the Buckeyes instead.  Other than a brief lead to open the game, Wittenberg was never in this one. Capital outplayed and out-hustled Witt on both ends of the floor for most of the night. I am particularly troubled by the Tigers' offensive woes to start the year. As a team, they are shooting 36 percent from the field and an eye-opening 18 percent from the 3.  Even behind a good defense, which Witt had occasionally last night, it's tough to win with those numbers offensively.  Right now, they simply don't have any playmakers.  I think freshmen Chad Roy and sophomore Brock Kiesler have the chance to develop into decent, if not really good, D3 players, but both struggled last night.  Sam Collins, presumably the leader of this team, has been a non-factor so far.  There's talent on this roster, but it's young.  I think they'll get it figured out eventually, but they are going to take their lumps along the way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2014, 09:11:44 PM
OWU 95, Kenyon 86

Season-opening win for the Bishops; Lords drop to 0-3.
http://www.battlingbishops.com/news/2014/11/18/MBB_11182014.aspx?path=mbball (http://www.battlingbishops.com/news/2014/11/18/MBB_11182014.aspx?path=mbball)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCACfan22 on November 19, 2014, 11:19:17 PM
Oberlin handled Muskingum tonight on the road 71-55...looked really solid defensively and had some guys knocking down shots from the outside all game long. Could we be seeing the Oberlin program turning the corner!?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 21, 2014, 07:35:48 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 33  Mount Union 28

Josh Kipfer with 9 points, Xavier Brown with 8 points and freshman Spencer Williams also with 8 points are leading the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 21, 2014, 08:39:54 PM
Final:  Wooster 80  Mount Union 73  :)

Wooster gets a nice win over a Mount Union team that has been picked to win the OAC conference this year.  Scots were led tonight by Josh Kipfer with 16 points, freshman Spencer Williams with 14, Dan Fanelly with 13 and Evan Pannell with 11.  In addition, freshman Ari Stern nailed 3 three pointers in the second half to help Wooster take control of this game.

Scots shot 49% from the floor and held the Purple Raiders to only 41%

Wooster is now 2-0.  ;D  Next game is St. Vincent at home tomorrow night.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2014, 08:51:36 PM
Scots had something like a 23-6 run in the middle of the second half to erase a 5 point Raider lead, then held on despite missing a ton of free throws down the stretch. UMU, by comparison, barely saw the free throw line at all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on November 21, 2014, 11:04:03 PM
Considering Mount isn't even ranked I'm pretty happy with their effort.  They were competitive with a top 10 squad on the road.  Wooster is obviously better, but I think Mount is making progress.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 22, 2014, 12:03:44 AM
I think Wooster is better, but not by too much, and it didn't seem all that obvious to me.  Mount had more first downs and gained a bit more yardage on the ground.  They're very physical, like all of the good OAC teams.  Tonight the officials were calling the fouls and that helped Wooster.  At another time, with another set of officials, it could have gone a bit differently.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on November 22, 2014, 07:52:09 AM
Thanks for the input, WB.  Being even remotely relevant is new to us so I'm always skeptical right now.  Not knowing Wooster's roster, but knowing Mount's very well my concern would be matching up in the post.  Ruffin is very athletic and skilled, but the rest of Mount's bigs struck me as more bruisers than skilled guys.  In my mind Wooster usually has skilled bigs (plural). 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on November 22, 2014, 08:02:36 AM
I saw the Wittenberg game at Cap.  I see the Tigers lost again last night.  What is going on in Springfield?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on November 22, 2014, 09:03:36 AM
Quote from: Dr. Acula on November 21, 2014, 11:04:03 PM
Considering Mount isn't even ranked I'm pretty happy with their effort.  They were competitive with a top 10 squad on the road.  Wooster is obviously better, but I think Mount is making progress.

I'm not really sure why Mount isn't ranked.  They are the favorites to win the OAC. Surely that warrants at least a spot in the OTR portion of the rankings. I was actually quite surprised when I saw not one OAC team anywhere in the rankings.  Anyways, even in a loss, I think Mount proved that they may have been overlooked a bit. At the same time, it is a pre season poll so if Mount plays well, it won't be long to see them showing up in the poll.

As for the game, thank god for the bench.  Wooster's bench scored 39 while the starters out scored them by just 2!  Wooster's bench seemed to be a spark for the Scots all night long and were crucial to that 23-6 second half run David pointed out.

Lastly, I know it's early, but Xavier Brown isn't even close to playing like a 1st team pre-season AA.  He had just 4 points and 2 assists in the opener and followed that up with a whopping 8 points and 1 assist last night and he all but disappeared in the 2nd half being held scoreless. I guess one way to look at it is that Wooster has looked good despite Brown's struggles so if/when he does get going, that only bodes better for the Scots!   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 22, 2014, 11:32:32 AM
Only 25 teams out of 400+ get ranked. It's not easy to get on that list, and there are a plethora of good teams out there...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on November 22, 2014, 01:22:15 PM
They absolutely didn't deserve to be ranked or even receive votes in the poll IMO.  I think they will get some votes now though. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 22, 2014, 03:00:59 PM
Quote from: Dr. Acula on November 22, 2014, 07:52:09 AM
Thanks for the input, WB.  Being even remotely relevant is new to us so I'm always skeptical right now.  Not knowing Wooster's roster, but knowing Mount's very well my concern would be matching up in the post.  Ruffin is very athletic and skilled, but the rest of Mount's bigs struck me as more bruisers than skilled guys.  In my mind Wooster usually has skilled bigs (plural).

Both of Wooster's bigs are playing really well.  Josh Kipfer, coming off the bench last year as a sophomore, was a pleasant surprise.  This season he's even more confident, especially as a scorer.  He's developed some moves to go along with his strength, and would now start on 80-90% of the DIII teams out there.  The starting post, sophomore Dan Fanelly, has shown improvement in every area this year.  He's very athletic, sees the court, and can finish.  He's also beginning to look like a leader out there.

The best thing about all of this is that it's clear now that these two guys can be on the court at the same time, with Fanelly moving along the baseline or to the high post.  I'm not sure that the starting lineup shouldn't include this tandem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 22, 2014, 09:06:52 PM
Final:  Wooster 91  St. Vincent 53  :)

Back from Timken where I watched Wooster absolutely dismantle St. Vincent.  This game was over at halftime 49-27 so the second half was rather uneventful.  It is hard to believe that St. Vincent was picked to win the PAC and they won't unless that conference is incredibly weak this season.  ::)

Wooster was led tonight by Dan Fanelly who had 25 points, 10 boards, 6 assists and Xavier Brown who had a excellent game with 21 points.  Fanelly was on fire tonight with at least 2 big dunks and also nailing 3 three point shots.  Milt Davis had 10 points and Evan Pannell just missed a double double with 9 points and 13 boards.  Freshman Spencer Williams had another nice game with 9 points.

As a team, Wooster shot 54% from the floor including 9 of 18 from three point range.  Scots' defense held St. Vincent to only 28% shooting.

Wooster is looking very strong this season with excellent play by all 9 players in the regular rotation.  It will be very interesting to see how Wooster handles their next 3 games which include 2 road games in Indiana.

Wooster is now 3-0  ;D  Next game is on the road at Hanover (IN) on 11/29

GO SCOTS!





Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on November 22, 2014, 09:20:37 PM
OWU beats d3hoops 6th rank Calvin 85-71.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 22, 2014, 09:24:15 PM
Quote from: Bishopleftiesdad on November 22, 2014, 09:20:37 PM
OWU beats d3hoops 6th rank Calvin 85-71.

Tremendous win by the Bishops!  Top teams in the NCAC (Wooster, DePauw and Ohio Wesleyan) are all undefeated and looking very strong as the season gets rolling.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on November 22, 2014, 09:59:07 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 22, 2014, 09:24:15 PM
Quote from: Bishopleftiesdad on November 22, 2014, 09:20:37 PM
OWU beats d3hoops 6th rank Calvin 85-71.

Tremendous win by the Bishops!  Top teams in the NCAC (Wooster, DePauw and Ohio Wesleyan) are looking very strong as the season gets rolling.  :)

And . . . Oberlin?  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 22, 2014, 10:34:11 PM
Quote from: Schwami on November 22, 2014, 09:59:07 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 22, 2014, 09:24:15 PM
Quote from: Bishopleftiesdad on November 22, 2014, 09:20:37 PM
OWU beats d3hoops 6th rank Calvin 85-71.

Tremendous win by the Bishops!  Top teams in the NCAC (Wooster, DePauw and Ohio Wesleyan) are looking very strong as the season gets rolling.  :)

And . . . Oberlin?  :)

Well, Oberlin's signature win this year is over a Wittenberg squad that is now 0-4 to start the season.  :o

Let's see how the Yeomen play in the next 5 games before we talk about them as a top team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 23, 2014, 12:27:05 AM
Don't rain on the Yeomen's parade! :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 23, 2014, 07:15:57 PM
By the way, kudos given when deserved.  The Wooster video feed had but one announcer on Saturday night.  It was the guy who usually does the color, and he was very good flying solo.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 23, 2014, 07:29:51 PM
When was the last time, if ever, that Wittenberg started the season 0-4?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 23, 2014, 07:32:01 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 22, 2014, 09:06:52 PMIt is hard to believe that St. Vincent was picked to win the PAC and they won't unless that conference is incredibly weak this season.

St, Vincent turned around and defeated Mt. Union today, 71-65. Hmmmmm.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 23, 2014, 08:56:51 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 23, 2014, 07:29:51 PM
When was the last time, if ever, that Wittenberg started the season 0-4?

Sac had them last at 0-4 in 1955.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on November 23, 2014, 11:43:09 PM
NCAC Early Season REport:
Great early season victories for Wooster and OWU over highly ranked teams Cabrini and Calvin. North Coast Ath. Conf. is 20-7 in non-conference games with three of the 7 losses being, gulp, Wittenbergs.   OWU, DePauw, Wooster, Denison, Hiram, and Wabash are a combined 16-0.  Allegheny and Oberlin are both over .500.  Kenyon is 1-3 and Witt is the lone winless team in the league at 0-4.  Tigers play Otterbein so win #1 SHOULD come Tuesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 23, 2014, 11:50:07 PM
Go Otters!  Or are they the Beins?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on November 24, 2014, 03:55:34 PM
 :) This is my first post and my first use (possibly last!) of emoticoms. As a Class of '78 Wooster graduate, I'm totally unbiased ( ;) ).  Ha ha!  I confess that my stomach still gets in a knot when the Scots hit the court against tough opponents  :-[.  I live in Maine, so I'm unable to get to Timken Gymnasium for most of the games (or Coccia Pizza House for a post-game pie!).  :'(   However, I'm a rabid fan and spend as much time on Massey Ratings as I do watching the games live on the video broadcasts ( ??? Not sure why they won't provide archived video for all the games?  ???)  BTW, are there any other good ratings systems that folks go to regularly other than Massey?

In any event, I've travelled to Salem to see the Scots come close   ;D :(, and have great hopes for this promising new season!   
8-)

Now that the season is underway, one of my big questions has been answer in the most delightful manner: Spencer Williams and Ari Sterns are the latest the Scots' (read: Moore, Cline & Co.) ability to annually reload vs. rebuild.  Williams is a gem with moves and strength that I'd only hope for in a veteran Junior.  If Ari can continue to pump in the tres "on-demand" like he did against Mount Union -- look out NCAC opponents!  Whew! Two solid Frosh! 

Returning, Kipfer cut his hair and has also shed any shyness to shine!  So great to see his power and intensity so soon this year.  Lalonde (from my high school WHS Alma Mater!) seems to have largely healed and able now to contribute and realize his potential.  Last year's hope, Dan Fannelly, has filled that promise nicely and he's asserting himself with more consistency and finesse.  I love watching him dunk and generally assert himself!  I hope Evan continues to grow into his role/position and was thrilled by his output in the first two games.  Still hoping Milt and Galen grow more comfortable in their roles and their own inherent abilities. 

Looking ahead to the next three games, I think these will be the second real test of the Scots potential.  OWU at home (fortunately) could be a barnburner (look out for OWU next year, too, as three of their top players are only Juniors! Yipes!) and DePauw will be an opportunity to exorcise the curse of the annual trek to Indiana.  Even Oberlin is looking good this year.  At the same time, I'm baffled by Witt's early sag?!  Their coach is much better than that and they always get up for us (as we do for them).  We need to watch for a let down given the Tigers' early travails, but having watched them against Stevenson for some of the game, they have a fair amount of growing to do... 

Unabashedly, I'm hoping for some serious blow-outs this year where seven or eight reach double figures in all the categories.  I'd love to see a game like that (or several!) just 'cause I'm a Scot -- what can I say?!

One final thing for now, when viewing the Scots games from afar, I'm encouraged by seeing all the fans in Timken.  Dheer numbers are imp[ortant in that cavernous place.  Still, at the same time, there's a lot of grey and white hair in the audience and I hope they will: Pump. It. Up. more than they seem to.  Despite some hot moments, the fans seem generally too passive and quiet.  Having attended games there since around when it opened decades ago, the players will respond when the fans start a-rockin'!  So, Rock On, Scots' Fans!  These are unique and special times that Moore, Cline, & CO. and the players are giving us as fans.  Let's return some of the love with constant screaming, tub-thumping, flag-waving, and otherwise making ourselves nicely and politely obnoxious!

Gooooooooooo Scots!

Eco-manblue
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on November 24, 2014, 04:03:22 PM
Yikes, I just realized that I forgot to mention Xavier Brown!  THat's what's amazing about this edition of the Scot's Men's basketball team:  we are blessed with abundance, talent, and true grit.  I'm relieved that Brown "rebounded" with 21 points against St. Vincent.  Does anyone know what the story is about his foot injury.  Is it chronic?  Does he need more time to heal?  What's up with that?  I wish the Daily Record sports writers (and the COW pr staff would provide more info!).  Needless to say, I'm holding my breath for Xavier's good health and complete recovery.  What a treat to have him on the court and watch his fluid, quick skill manifested time after time!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on November 25, 2014, 03:12:34 PM
Welcome to the board! Glad to see you're a real person and not a spammer. I had some trepidation about approving your registration. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 25, 2014, 08:22:35 PM
Eco-manblue, weren't you here before, perhaps several years ago? I swear I remember you, maybe without the hyphen? Anyway, welcome (back).

Wooster moves up to #5 this week with a #1 vote, while both OWU (#21) and DePauw (#22) enter the poll. (http://d3hoops.com/top25/index) No votes for Wittenberg, or for Oberlin for that matter.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on November 25, 2014, 10:10:30 PM
Hi David (Pat & others!),

Yes, I may have been on this chat room before.  There was also a Wooster chat room that existed for awhile but died out. 

Delighted about Wooster's upward mobility in the poll.  It was bound to shake out and good to see how Wooster and the rest of the NCAC teams were assessed.  OWU and Depauw are evidently the obvious challengers to Wooster within the conference this year.  We'll know soon how they'll shape up against the Scots.  Hope the Scots keep the intensity up.  My guess is that the Spain trip did a world of good for both the tangibles (i.e- getting prepared to play) and the intangibles (i.e.- team bonding, trust development, communication, leadership, etc.).  Hey, do you know of any other credible, solid ratings sites besides Massey?

When did you graduate, BTW!

Happy Thanksgiving,

Scott Denman (aka Eco-manblue)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on November 26, 2014, 12:00:05 AM
Another good night in non-conference play for the NCAC as the teams go 6-1 on the evening with Allegheny suffering the only loss.  Denison, Wabash, Ohio Wesleyan, DePauw, Hiram, and Oberlin all win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 26, 2014, 06:51:36 AM
Quote from: Eco-manblue on November 25, 2014, 10:10:30 PMThere was also a Wooster chat room that existed for awhile but died out.
Oh yeah, I had forgotten about that. That's where I remember you from.

Quote from: Eco-manblue on November 25, 2014, 10:10:30 PMWhen did you graduate, BTW!
From Wooster, 1982.

Quote from: Eco-manblue on November 25, 2014, 10:10:30 PMHappy Thanksgiving,
Back atcha.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 27, 2014, 09:50:32 AM
As a Wooster fan, I am very Thankful for Coaches Steve Moore, Doug Cline and their staff!  :)

Coach Steve Moore has a 33-year career record of 732-209, including an extraordinary mark of 645-144 the past 27 seasons at The College of Wooster, which puts him No. 3 in wins among Div. III coaches all-time.  With 3 more wins this year, I think those win totals are now 735 and 648 respectively.

Coach Moore has led Wooster to 22 NCAA Tournament berths and a league-high 16 North Coast Athletic Conference championships, while compiling a winning percentage of .817.

Happy Thanksgiving to all NCAC posters!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on November 28, 2014, 09:47:36 AM
NCAC off to an impressive 27-8 non-league start.  Denison, Wabash, OWU, Hiram, Allegheny, and Wooster in action this weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 29, 2014, 03:44:25 PM
At the Half:  Hanover 32  Wooster 27

Wooster shot only 39% in the first half.  Refs awarded Hanover 15 foul shots in the half while Wooster shot only 2 free throws.  ::)

Wooster had 9 turnovers in the half and they need to take better care of the ball.

Scots are being led by freshman Spencer Williams with 6 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 29, 2014, 04:46:09 PM
Final:  Hanover 70  Wooster 57

Wooster lost this game for several reasons:
-Shot only 39% from the floor
-Had 17 turnovers in the game
-Wooster shot only 4 free throws in the entire game while Hanover shot 32
-Scots did not drive the lane enough and fouled late but the officiating was still very lopsided

Wooster is now 3-1.  Next game is at home vs. Ohio Wesleyan
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on November 29, 2014, 06:47:52 PM
OWU beats defiance 77-63.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 29, 2014, 08:29:02 PM
Today, anyway, Hanover looked like the better team.

Neither Wooster's offense or defense was up to their norm, and Hanover had plenty to do with that.  The Scots got little going inside, either from their post players or on penetration.  Hardly any transition.  Their offense was usually limited to mid-range jumpers or partially-defended threes.  At the other end, their defense wasn't terrible, but not good enough to beat a pretty decent team.

One real bright spot was, at long last, the return of the shooting touch of Alex Lalonde.  Despite being called LaDomme all game by the Hanover announce, he drained 3-4 threes.

Wooster played nine players.  Three of the names were mispronounced.  Three of the four names that could possibly be mispronounced, were.  FANelly.  LaDomme.  Kiper instead of Kipfer.  He finally corrected himself on that one after hearing the P.A. guy say it properly.  Nearly all of people that do these games are lazy as all hell.  If you can't find out how to correctly pronounce the players' names, you don't belong behind the mic.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 29, 2014, 10:19:23 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 29, 2014, 04:46:09 PM
Final:  Hanover 70  Wooster 57

Wooster lost this game for several reasons:
-Shot only 39% from the floor
-Had 17 turnovers in the game
-Wooster shot only 4 free throws in the entire game while Hanover shot 32
-Scots did not drive the lane enough and fouled late but the officiating was still very lopsided

Wooster is now 3-1.  Next game is at home vs. Ohio Wesleyan

I'm very surprised by the result of this game, because Hanover's starting PG, senior Tim Bass, recently left the team for unknown reasons. He's been the leading scorer of the Panthers for the past two seasons as well as their primary playmaker.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 30, 2014, 12:28:35 PM
Addition by subtraction?

Did Hanover use student announcers?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 30, 2014, 02:35:33 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 30, 2014, 12:28:35 PM
Addition by subtraction?

That was my first thought as well, but Hanover went 19-9, 13-5 last season and 18-9, 14-4 the season before ... so, as the leader of those teams, Bass must've been doing something right.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 30, 2014, 02:47:05 PM
Right. Though sometimes teams rally for a while due to adversity. And perhaps the confluence of adversity AND "it's Wooster, we gotta give it everything we've got and more" paid off.

I am loathe to think the "Ewing effect" is a real thing, but...

(I also find it funny that Wooster fans complain about home cookin' officials... ;) )
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 30, 2014, 02:51:16 PM
We forgot to mention Wittenberg blasted Otterbein a few days ago for win #1. So, hooray?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2014, 08:10:30 PM
Well, the combination of 39% shooting, including 5 for 17 from your go-to guy, and 17 turnovers, and just 4 free throws, is not a winning combination almost regardless of who does or doesn't suit up for the other team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on November 30, 2014, 10:42:58 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 30, 2014, 12:28:35 PM
Did Hanover use student announcers?

No.  The camera was on him during the pregame.  Just one guy, looked to be in his fifties, maybe sixties.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on December 01, 2014, 01:25:44 AM
Same guy has been calling games at Hanover for as long as there have been online broadcasts.

Wooster Booster -- I'm not a big fan of the name-calling and, frankly, abusive language you use in your posts. I'm going to delete more of them if I see them (and I saw the first version of your surviving post before you edited it last night). Larry Duke isn't on the board but that doesn't mean you can call him names.

Not the way you want to start the basketball season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 01, 2014, 12:00:58 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on December 01, 2014, 01:25:44 AM
Same guy has been calling games at Hanover for as long as there have been online broadcasts.

Wooster Booster -- I'm not a big fan of the name-calling and, frankly, abusive language you use in your posts. I'm going to delete more of them if I see them (and I saw the first version of your surviving post before you edited it last night). Larry Duke isn't on the board but that doesn't mean you can call him names.

Not the way you want to start the basketball season.

Good thing the audio and video were working.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on December 02, 2014, 10:25:28 AM
NCAC has 3 teams in the D3 Hoops top 25 poll:
http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/index
10. Wooster
14. Ohio Wesleyan
18. Depauw
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 03, 2014, 08:16:33 PM
Halftime: OWU 43, Wooster 37. Wooster already has 10 turnovers leading to 14 OWU points, and the Bishops are +15 from the arc (6 of 15/40% vs. just 1 of 8 for Wooster.) The battle of the POY candidates is tilting toward Claude Gray, who has 15 points and is 3 of 3 from the arc. Xavier Brown has 11 but also 2 fouls.

--------------------------

All OWU early in the second. 67-46, 14:10. OWU overall shooting 57% and 52% from the arc. On fire.

--------------------------

Lead was as high as 26 with 12:15 left. Wooster is now trying to get back in the game, down 76-58 with 10:13 to go. Can they maintain the comeback?

---------------------------

Scots on a 20-4 run, down 78-68, timeout OWU with 8:16 left. I imaging Timken is rockin'.

---------------------------

OWU seems to have stabilized, as the lead has drifted between 8 and 11 for the last several minutes. Now 85-75, 5:09 left.

---------------------------

aaaaaaaaaaand, it's 89-82 with 2:10 left, and there's been 2:10 left for a very long time. Probably Live Stats has become Dead Stats. Maybe I've missed a miracle, but I kinda doubt it.

---------------------------

Then again....switched to radio, and I find it is 89-87 with 30-some-odd seconds left, OWU ball.

---------------------------

Gray hits two FTs, 91-87. Gray has 33.
Spencer Williams gets fouled, with shoot the bonus. 0:22. Hits one, hits both. 91-89.
Bishops beat the press, Orr fouled with 0:15 and will attempts his first two free throws. Missed the first...it's a one-possession game. Made the second, 92-89.
Pannell misses a 3, Gray rebounds and OWU survives 92-89.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2014, 09:08:17 PM
Wooster overrated? OWU underrated?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on December 03, 2014, 10:16:38 PM
In Springfield, the final:  Wabash 52, Wittenberg 50.  Regardless of Witt's slow start this year, a good win for Wabash on the road in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2014, 10:21:17 PM
 :D :D :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 03, 2014, 11:11:43 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 03, 2014, 09:08:17 PM
Wooster overrated? OWU underrated?

Wooster trims a 26 point deficit to two in just over 10 minutes and was a Panell missed 3 pointer from coming all the way back in what would have been one of the greatest comebacks in Wooster history and they're overrated?  Yeah, that's it exactly...  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on December 03, 2014, 11:37:34 PM
Plus it is not as if OWU has played hasn't beat anybody else. Remember  they also beat then sizth place Calvin. What we saw were two very good teams playing. I think both teams belong in the top 10.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 03, 2014, 11:45:08 PM
Quote from: Bishopleftiesdad on December 03, 2014, 11:37:34 PM
Plus it is not as if OWU has played hasn't beat anybody else. Remember  they also beat then sizth place Calvin. What we saw were two very good teams playing. I think both teams belong in the top 10.

Exactly right!  Gray had one hell of a game for the Bishops as did Panell for the Scots! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 04, 2014, 12:12:41 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 03, 2014, 11:11:43 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 03, 2014, 09:08:17 PM
Wooster overrated? OWU underrated?

Wooster trims a 26 point deficit to two in just over 10 minutes and was a Panell missed 3 pointer from coming all the way back in what would have been one of the greatest comebacks in Wooster history and they're overrated?  Yeah, that's it exactly...  ::)

This is Wooster's second loss, though. We've been talking about all of the carnage in the Top 25 over at the Top 25 board. It's a legit question. Sorry it's not part of your narrative.

I also was bucking up OWU to be ranked higher than #14. They seem to be taking care of business with a good schedule. The discussion there is that Amherst will be defacto #1 even though they've played hacks and frauds...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on December 04, 2014, 09:26:12 AM
The back-to-back Wooster losses got me doing a bit of "when was the last time" sleuthing at http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/results/index (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/results/index), in response to a question on the top 25 board, so I thought that I would post it here, too.

- In November 2008, Wooster lost three of four (L vs W&J, W vs Mesiah, L at Carnegie Mellon, L neu UW-Platteville).
- In 1989-90, the Scots lost four of six at two different points in the season (including their most recent to Oberlin)
- In Steve Moore's first season, 1987-88, Wooster closed the season with a 5-7 stretch.

However, the last time Wooster lost more than two consecutive games was in 1987, in Lu Wims final season coaching the Scots, when they dropped five in a row, late in an 8-18 campaign.

The Scots early schedule is certainly a trial-by-fire, with three teams picked to win other leagues, a road trip to Indiana, and then two nationally-ranked conference opponents, including a long road trip the weekend before finals.  I suspect that the less-experienced guys will grow up a lot as a result, though, and that Wooster will be very tough in late February and March.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 04, 2014, 12:32:57 PM
Until Wooster began their amazing-but-just-too-late comeback, OWU was deadly from three-point range.  Sometimes they had good looks.  Lots of times, especially on Gray's shots, there was a guy right there with a hand in a face.  Still they buried them as if they were three-foot jumpers.

Wooster's ball movement against a zone has improved a little, but is still mediocre.  One way to successfully attack a zone is to get the ball to a big mobile guy like a Fanelly on the high post.  From there, all sorts of options open up.  (See Nebraska vs Duke, the women's game, last night.)

Evan Pannell, on the offensive end, was remarkable during Wooster's big run.  Kudos to the senior, whose play during is career has been so steady with continual improvement.

The Wooster video stream was fine, the two announcers more than competent and professional. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 04, 2014, 06:14:46 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 03, 2014, 11:11:43 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 03, 2014, 09:08:17 PM
Wooster overrated? OWU underrated?

Wooster trims a 26 point deficit to two in just over 10 minutes and was a Panell missed 3 pointer from coming all the way back in what would have been one of the greatest comebacks in Wooster history and they're overrated?  Yeah, that's it exactly...  ::)

Two sides to that response, though, SF. Yeah, it was a great comeback ...  but the other side of the coin is that Wooster found itself down by 26 in the first place.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 04, 2014, 06:51:57 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 04, 2014, 06:14:46 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 03, 2014, 11:11:43 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 03, 2014, 09:08:17 PM
Wooster overrated? OWU underrated?

Wooster trims a 26 point deficit to two in just over 10 minutes and was a Panell missed 3 pointer from coming all the way back in what would have been one of the greatest comebacks in Wooster history and they're overrated?  Yeah, that's it exactly...  ::)

Two sides to that response, though, SF. Yeah, it was a great comeback ...  but the other side of the coin is that Wooster found itself down by 26 in the first place.

Rule change in the NCAC this season, Greg, which being an outlander you can be forgiven for missing.  There is now, in league games, a handicap system imposed based upon the preseason poll.  The underdog in this particular game, OWU, playing on the road, was started at +26 on the scoreboard.  Hence Wooster's comeback deserves Scotfan's acclaim, and no kudos are issued to OWU for creating the lead, as it was given gratis.

At least this is what Collinge told me; I personally missed the beginning of the game...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 04, 2014, 07:00:49 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 04, 2014, 06:51:57 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 04, 2014, 06:14:46 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 03, 2014, 11:11:43 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 03, 2014, 09:08:17 PM
Wooster overrated? OWU underrated?

Wooster trims a 26 point deficit to two in just over 10 minutes and was a Panell missed 3 pointer from coming all the way back in what would have been one of the greatest comebacks in Wooster history and they're overrated?  Yeah, that's it exactly...  ::)

Two sides to that response, though, SF. Yeah, it was a great comeback ...  but the other side of the coin is that Wooster found itself down by 26 in the first place.

Rule change in the NCAC this season, Greg, which being an outlander you can be forgiven for missing.  There is now, in league games, a handicap system imposed based upon the preseason poll.  The underdog in this particular game, OWU, playing on the road, was started at +26 on the scoreboard.  Hence Wooster's comeback deserves Scotfan's acclaim, and no kudos are issued to OWU for creating the lead, as it was given gratis.

At least this is what Collinge told me; I personally missed the beginning of the game...

Ah, then let that be a lesson to me, then: Always read the fine print in a league's rulebook before commenting upon the league's outcomes. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 04, 2014, 07:46:00 PM
You didn't really think Oberlin beat Wittenberg fair and square, did you?  ;)

Unreported here is that Denison took advantage of their league-mandated handicap to defeat #18 DePauw last night, 67-65. Also, Allegheny dropped Hiram from the ranks of the unbeaten (yes, Virginia, Hiram was 5-0), 76-59. That leaves OWU (2-0, 6-0) as the last remaining unbeaten (overall) team in the NCAC, holding a 1/2 game lead on Denison, Wabash, and Allegheny in the early league standings. At the other end of the table, Wittenberg (1-5, 0-2) is solely in last place, with Wooster tied with Hiram and DePauw for next-to-last place. When was the last time THAT happened?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 05, 2014, 07:37:17 AM
Haven't had a chance to see any Wooster action this year ???  That said, doesn't a team of Wooster's quality have to get more out of their two guard than 4.6 points and 1.8 assists.  What am I missing?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 05, 2014, 10:52:14 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on December 05, 2014, 07:37:17 AM
Haven't had a chance to see any Wooster action this year ???  That said, doesn't a team of Wooster's quality have to get more out of their two guard than 4.6 points and 1.8 assists.  What am I missing?
I think you're looking at the wrong stats column for Xavier Brown.  The 4.6 is Field Goals/Game.  His Points/Game number is 12.4.   The other thing is that, at least early on, he was playing with a bad ankle.  That may be better now, but I don't know.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 05, 2014, 03:40:33 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 05, 2014, 10:52:14 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on December 05, 2014, 07:37:17 AM
Haven't had a chance to see any Wooster action this year ???  That said, doesn't a team of Wooster's quality have to get more out of their two guard than 4.6 points and 1.8 assists.  What am I missing?
I think you're looking at the wrong stats column for Xavier Brown.  The 4.6 is Field Goals/Game.  His Points/Game number is 12.4.   The other thing is that, at least early on, he was playing with a bad ankle.  That may be better now, but I don't know.

I guess I should have been clearer.  I thought Xavier was playing point guard as opposed to the two guard (old terminology).  I was referring to Jalen Goodwin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on December 06, 2014, 08:02:58 AM
Wooster vs. DePauw and OWU vs. Denison.  Thats two early season big games in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 06, 2014, 02:53:15 PM
Final:  Allegheny 69  Wittenberg 56

Allegheny is now 5-3, 2-0 NCAC.  Witt is now 1-6, 0-3 NCAC.  :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 06, 2014, 03:52:32 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 43  DePauw 35

Wooster played a solid half with Dan Fanelly leading the Scots with 13 points.  Xavier Brown and Alex LaLonde each with 9 points and LaLonde hit a big three pointer from the corner right before the halftime buzzer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 06, 2014, 04:21:20 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 06, 2014, 02:53:15 PM
Final:  Allegheny 69  Wittenberg 56

Allegheny is now 5-3, 2-0 NCAC.  Witt is now 1-6, 0-3 NCAC.  :o

If ever there was a time for one of these...

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fduanekrip.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2011%2F12%2FPanic-Button-300x290.jpg&hash=1536b4447d928dac7bc2297cbe7e0eeaadfc35fe)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on December 06, 2014, 04:35:11 PM
OWU gets by Denison to remain undefeated. The score 76-74.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 06, 2014, 04:37:29 PM
Watching Wooster play at DePauw, and listening to these biased announcers, is like watching Hickory get screwed by home-town refs in Hoosiers.  It's total garbage.  They continually complain about every foul committed by DePauw, yet Wooster has been called for nearly 30 fouls to this point.  Total garbage.  No wonder Wooster can't win in Indiana.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 06, 2014, 04:56:05 PM
Final:  Wooster 76  DePauw 63  :)

Wooster notches a win in Indiana! ;)  Scots were led by Dan Fanelly with 17 points, Josh Kipfer with 13, Xavier Brown with 13, Alex LaLonde with 11 points, 8 boards and Jalen Goodwin also with 11.

Scots won this game by:
Shooting 51% from the floor while holding DePauw to only 35%
Outrebounding the Tigers 32 to 29
Getting to the Free Throw line for 25 points and making 83% of FT shots

Wooster is now 4-2, 1-1 NCAC.  Next game is Wabash at home on 12/13

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on December 06, 2014, 05:02:03 PM
Wabash 82------Oberlin 59
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 06, 2014, 05:39:04 PM
I caught the last 8 minutes or so of Wooster/DePauw on my drive home from work today. Owing, presumably, to Wooster Radio's commitment to broadcast all of the OHSAA football championship games, they had no crew to send to Greencastle, but WKVX thoughtfully picked up the WGRE broadcast. The DPU student broadcasters, if that is what they were, did a credible job. They knew the Wooster players from one another, and pronounced their names correctly (even LaLonde, which is somewhat counter-intuitive), stayed reasonably impartial and kept us up on the action (score, time, etc.) It was fairly clear that they were frustrated with the officiating and disappointed in the result, but like pros they swallowed their angst and soldiered on. Also to their credit, they discussed both teams and both coaches fairly equally, and did not just natter on about their home team, which is not only professional but suggests that they did some research and/or were familiar with Wooster. All around good job to WGRE!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 06, 2014, 07:09:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 06, 2014, 05:39:04 PM
I caught the last 8 minutes or so of Wooster/DePauw on my drive home from work today. Owing, presumably, to Wooster Radio's commitment to broadcast all of the OHSAA football championship games, they had no crew to send to Greencastle, but WKVX thoughtfully picked up the WGRE broadcast. The DPU student broadcasters, if that is what they were, did a credible job. They knew the Wooster players from one another, and pronounced their names correctly (even LaLonde, which is somewhat counter-intuitive), stayed reasonably impartial and kept us up on the action (score, time, etc.) It was fairly clear that they were frustrated with the officiating and disappointed in the result, but like pros they swallowed their angst and soldiered on. Also to their credit, they discussed both teams and both coaches fairly equally, and did not just natter on about their home team, which is not only professional but suggests that they did some research and/or were familiar with Wooster. All around good job to WGRE!

Kudos to them, I suppose, for getting the names right.  But isn't that something that's very near the top of the list on things that you're expected to do?  As far as being balanced, I wish you had been able to listen to the whole broadcast.  The color guy was constantly complaining about the officiating.  Bad foul and/or turnover calls against DePauw.  Missed fouls and turnovers against Wooster.  This happened at least fifteen times, and many times he went on and on with lengthy rants.

The Wooster players were beside themselves, unable to figure out how to find a place to stand on the court and not be called for a foul.  It was homer-ball from the get-go, both down on the court and at the mic.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 06, 2014, 08:08:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 06, 2014, 07:09:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 06, 2014, 05:39:04 PM
I caught the last 8 minutes or so of Wooster/DePauw on my drive home from work today. Owing, presumably, to Wooster Radio's commitment to broadcast all of the OHSAA football championship games, they had no crew to send to Greencastle, but WKVX thoughtfully picked up the WGRE broadcast. The DPU student broadcasters, if that is what they were, did a credible job. They knew the Wooster players from one another, and pronounced their names correctly (even LaLonde, which is somewhat counter-intuitive), stayed reasonably impartial and kept us up on the action (score, time, etc.) It was fairly clear that they were frustrated with the officiating and disappointed in the result, but like pros they swallowed their angst and soldiered on. Also to their credit, they discussed both teams and both coaches fairly equally, and did not just natter on about their home team, which is not only professional but suggests that they did some research and/or were familiar with Wooster. All around good job to WGRE!

Kudos to them, I suppose, for getting the names right.  But isn't that something that's very near the top of the list on things that you're expected to do?  As far as being balanced, I wish you had been able to listen to the whole broadcast.  The color guy was constantly complaining about the officiating.  Bad foul and/or turnover calls against DePauw.  Missed fouls and turnovers against Wooster.  This happened at least fifteen times, and many times he went on and on with lengthy rants.

The Wooster players were beside themselves, unable to figure out how to find a place to stand on the court and not be called for a foul.  It was homer-ball from the get-go, both down on the court and at the mic.

Absolutely - but an amazing number of announcers don't realize that!  All it takes is talking to a visiting team asst. coach (or other staff member) and going down the roster name by name - and be careful about skipping over the 'obvious' pronunciations: sometimes there turns out to be a 'family surprise'! :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on December 06, 2014, 08:55:46 PM
Homer-ball.  Right, the Indiana bias, and despite the crookedness the Scots prevail.  What more could you ask for?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on December 06, 2014, 09:26:38 PM
Yeah, let's see --- personal fouls: DePauw 25, Wooster 24.  What a home job.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 06, 2014, 10:52:25 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 06, 2014, 08:08:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on December 06, 2014, 07:09:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 06, 2014, 05:39:04 PM
I caught the last 8 minutes or so of Wooster/DePauw on my drive home from work today. Owing, presumably, to Wooster Radio's commitment to broadcast all of the OHSAA football championship games, they had no crew to send to Greencastle, but WKVX thoughtfully picked up the WGRE broadcast. The DPU student broadcasters, if that is what they were, did a credible job. They knew the Wooster players from one another, and pronounced their names correctly (even LaLonde, which is somewhat counter-intuitive), stayed reasonably impartial and kept us up on the action (score, time, etc.) It was fairly clear that they were frustrated with the officiating and disappointed in the result, but like pros they swallowed their angst and soldiered on. Also to their credit, they discussed both teams and both coaches fairly equally, and did not just natter on about their home team, which is not only professional but suggests that they did some research and/or were familiar with Wooster. All around good job to WGRE!

Kudos to them, I suppose, for getting the names right.  But isn't that something that's very near the top of the list on things that you're expected to do?  As far as being balanced, I wish you had been able to listen to the whole broadcast.  The color guy was constantly complaining about the officiating.  Bad foul and/or turnover calls against DePauw.  Missed fouls and turnovers against Wooster.  This happened at least fifteen times, and many times he went on and on with lengthy rants.

The Wooster players were beside themselves, unable to figure out how to find a place to stand on the court and not be called for a foul.  It was homer-ball from the get-go, both down on the court and at the mic.

Absolutely - but an amazing number of announcers don't realize that!  All it takes is talking to a visiting team asst. coach (or other staff member) and going down the roster name by name - and be careful about skipping over the 'obvious' pronunciations: sometimes there turns out to be a 'family surprise'! :o

Precisely. It appears to me, in fact, that somewhere close to half (at least) of D3 PBP announcers don't check pronunciations -- and that's not just true of student announcers, either.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2014, 01:09:25 AM
Shocked, shocked I am about the complaints regarding fouls and announcers...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2014, 12:10:12 PM
Time to take notice of Denison, off to a 5-2/1-1 start. Their two losses were at 7-0 OWU by 2 yesterday, and a head-scratcher to Bethany (4-3) at the U. of Chicago. They beat St. Vincent (5-3), who did beat Mt. Union (as well as Bethany, by 18) after being humiliated by Wooster, and of course they also have a win over DePauw (4-2). They are also responsible for CWRU's only loss in a 6-1 start. Things are fairly easy for the Big Red for the rest of the semester, with conference games at Oberlin and Witt and holiday dates vs. Berry (3-5) and winless Earlham before hosting the Scots on Jan. 3. They're shooting 46% from the field, while holding opponents to 41%, and their fairly woeful shooting from the arc (29%) and stripe (67%) has not hurt them thus far. They are averaging an outstanding 15 assists on 27 field goals per game, led by sophomore David Meurer at 5.3, who is also the leading scorer (16.6) and stealer (1.9). They outrebound their opponents by 7 1/2 (40.4-33.0) (Woolard brothers average 12.0 between them) and are the recipients of even-handed officiating (17.7 PF/G vs. 17.9), but of course they have yet to play a game in Indiana.  :-* They appear to go 9 deep with Meurer and sophomore wing Matthew Bauer the only underclassmen in the rotation. Interesting to see how they do against resurgent Oberlin Wednesday and versus a wounded Tiger team in Springfield on Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 07, 2014, 12:46:26 PM
Quote from: Schwami on December 06, 2014, 09:26:38 PM
Yeah, let's see --- personal fouls: DePauw 25, Wooster 24.  What a home job.

Well, 6 DePauw fouls came in the last 2 minutes so just listing the fouls as you did doesn't really paint an accurate picture...  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 07, 2014, 01:29:13 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 07, 2014, 12:46:26 PM
Quote from: Schwami on December 06, 2014, 09:26:38 PM
Yeah, let's see --- personal fouls: DePauw 25, Wooster 24.  What a home job.

Well, 6 DePauw fouls came in the last 2 minutes so just listing the fouls as you did doesn't really paint an accurate picture...  ::)

And.  And.  It should not be necessary, after all these years, to point out that the number of fouls called on each team has little bearing on the equity of the officiating.

20 fouls called on team A, but perhaps 7 of those were bad calls.  20 fouls called on team B, but perhaps 10 more should have been called.  Suddenly a very unfair situation.  Far too often, that's how it works.
 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2014, 01:57:45 PM
Especially from gold and black tinted Ohio glasses!  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 07, 2014, 02:12:55 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 07, 2014, 01:57:45 PM
Especially from gold and black tinted Ohio glasses!  :D

Says the man wearing his red-and-white Sunday dress pants. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 07, 2014, 02:26:31 PM
Wooster released a preview of next years schedule


NOV 15  THUGS
Nov 18   Blind officials
Nov 19   Terrible Announcers
Nov 26   THUGS and VILLIANS
Dec  3    Gentlemen of Questionable Character
Dec  9    That lousy team from Springfield
Dec 18   FUTURE CRIMINALS
Dec 19   ASSAULT AND BATTERY
Dec 27   OFFICIALS WITH AGENDAS
Dec 28   SCREWED AGAIN
Jan  4    BANDITOS
Jan  8    Incompetent Technical Support
Jan 12   The lights will probably go out
Jan 17   1 official and two Witt grads
Jan 22   Terrorists
Jan 27   LaCosa Nostra
Jan 30   LONDON TOUGHIES
Feb 2    3 guys with Glaucoma
Feb 6    Barbarians
Feb 10  Thanks Obama
Feb 14  YAKUZA
Feb 18  James Gandolfini
Feb 22  CELEBRATE 25th CONSECUTIVE NCAC CHAMPIONSHIP DESPITE BIASED OFFiCIALS
Feb 25  THUGS WITH BRAINS


Obviously they play Wabash on Dec 3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 07, 2014, 02:30:43 PM
I LOL'd.... :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 07, 2014, 03:29:51 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.pandawhale.com%2F41397-Picard-clapping-applause-gif-vX3R.gif&hash=dbd1d94844f3b697b6de42c2e539c9abd4e77d03)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 07, 2014, 03:33:56 PM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F4.bp.blogspot.com%2F-BTeTB1tfWgc%2FUygl8qCcUSI%2FAAAAAAAAF1M%2FTd17sEDZnQI%2Fs1600%2Fapplause-gif-3.gif&hash=bf5d56ef1d0c9d512f85a281f46cbd63a2f2ce09)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 07, 2014, 04:02:07 PM
Quote from: sac on December 07, 2014, 02:26:31 PM
Wooster released a preview of next years schedule

NOV 15  THUGS
Nov 18   Blind officials
Nov 19   Terrible Announcers
Nov 26   THUGS and VILLIANS
Dec  3    Gentlemen of Questionable Character
Dec  9    That lousy team from Springfield
Dec 18   FUTURE CRIMINALS
Dec 19   ASSAULT AND BATTERY
Dec 27   OFFICIALS WITH AGENDAS
Dec 28   SCREWED AGAIN
Jan  4    BANDITOS
Jan  8    Incompetent Technical Support
Jan 12   The lights will probably go out
Jan 17   1 official and two Witt grads
Jan 22   Terrorists
Jan 27   LaCosa Nostra
Jan 30   LONDON TOUGHIES
Feb 2    3 guys with Glaucoma
Feb 6    Barbarians
Feb 10  Thanks Obama
Feb 14  YAKUZA
Feb 18  James Gandolfini
Feb 22  CELEBRATE 25th CONSECUTIVE NCAC CHAMPIONSHIP DESPITE BIASED OFFiCIALS
Feb 25  THUGS WITH BRAINS

Obviously they play Wabash on Dec 3.

I love it!  Several of these opponents can easily be deciphered.

NOV 15  THUGS (John Carroll)
Nov 18   Blind officials
Nov 19   Terrible Announcers (DePauw followed by Wittenberg, a doubleheader)
Nov 26   THUGS and VILLIANS (Capital)
Dec  3    Gentlemen of Questionable Character (Hiram)
Dec  9    That lousy team from Springfield (Missouri?  Kidding.)
Dec 18   FUTURE CRIMINALS (Cabrini JV)
Dec 19   ASSAULT AND BATTERY (Cabrini)
Dec 27   OFFICIALS WITH AGENDAS
Dec 28   SCREWED AGAIN
Jan  4    BANDITOS (Arizona Christian)
Jan  8    Incompetent Technical Support (Wooster - Intrasquad game)
Jan 12   The lights will probably go out (Any school in the Tennessee Valley?)
Jan 17   1 official and two Witt grads (There are Witt grads?)
Jan 22   Terrorists (Ramapo)
Jan 27   La Cosa Nostra (Rowan)
Jan 30   LONDON TOUGHIES
Feb 2    3 guys with Glaucoma
Feb 6    Barbarians (Whitworth)
Feb 10  Thanks Obama
Feb 14  YAKUZA
Feb 18  James Gandolfini (What, now we're playing teams of zombies?)
Feb 22  CELEBRATE 25th CONSECUTIVE NCAC CHAMPIONSHIP DESPITE BIASED OFFiCIALS
Feb 25  THUGS WITH BRAINS (Emory)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 08, 2014, 12:00:51 AM
Quote from: sac on December 07, 2014, 02:26:31 PM
Wooster released a preview of next years schedule


NOV 15  THUGS
Nov 18   Blind officials
Nov 19   Terrible Announcers
Nov 26   THUGS and VILLIANS
Dec  3    Gentlemen of Questionable Character
Dec  9    That lousy team from Springfield
Dec 18   FUTURE CRIMINALS
Dec 19   ASSAULT AND BATTERY
Dec 27   OFFICIALS WITH AGENDAS
Dec 28   SCREWED AGAIN
Jan  4    BANDITOS
Jan  8    Incompetent Technical Support
Jan 12   The lights will probably go out
Jan 17   1 official and two Witt grads
Jan 22   Terrorists
Jan 27   LaCosa Nostra
Jan 30   LONDON TOUGHIES
Feb 2    3 guys with Glaucoma
Feb 6    Barbarians
Feb 10  Thanks Obama
Feb 14  YAKUZA
Feb 18  James Gandolfini
Feb 22  CELEBRATE 25th CONSECUTIVE NCAC CHAMPIONSHIP DESPITE BIASED OFFiCIALS
Feb 25  THUGS WITH BRAINS

Obviously they play Wabash on Dec 3.

Sac - hilarious, you nailed it!  ;D  k+
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 08, 2014, 11:13:32 AM
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F25.media.tumblr.com%2Ftumblr_m5210otkEJ1rofxqqo1_400.gif&hash=95d243e31305bc8a998ea1eb8282df4e8d153e3e)

I just wanted to add to the clapping gifs...  :P

Oh, and this one is a personal favorite of mine as well...

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fstream1.gifsoup.com%2Fview5%2F3732441%2Fkurt-cobain-clapping-o.gif&hash=36d6fbea47e38f3cd119413c418d669ad8d52f44)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 08, 2014, 01:08:06 PM
(https://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mb5v1znxDE1r3j5ra.gif)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on December 09, 2014, 02:33:25 PM
OWU moves to 6 in the D3 poll
Wooster is in at 17
Depauw drops out of the top 25 and lands in the ORV's with a 23 pts.

http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2014-15/week3
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 09, 2014, 04:06:57 PM
Some early Wabash observations...I know the competition to this point hasn't been overwhelming, but with a staff transition and all of the upheaval that goes along with that, getting some early wins is a really good thing. 

- 3FGAs are down from nearly 20 per game in 2013-14 to a more palatable 14 per game this season.  Consequently the make percentage on 3FGAs is up from 31.6% to 38.1%.  Picky shot selection = better make percentages. 

- FG% is up from 39.6% (last in the league in 13-14) to 47.0% (2nd in the league to Wooster).  Again, fewer 3s being tried, Wabash is getting better shots closer to the basket- and assists are up 3.5 per game over 13-14 which tells me Wabash has some semblance of an offensive plan this year.  Guys are working to get open, handlers are looking for those open players, and the result is buckets. 

- FG% defense is also improved...from 44.1% allowed in 13-14 (8th) to 35.6% (1st) in 14-15. 

I know Wabash hasn't played world beaters so far, but these kinds of improvements are encouraging as we get set to launch feet first into league play.  Biggest test of the season so far for Coach Brummett on Saturday.  I think he's doing a great job through the first few weeks here. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on December 10, 2014, 12:13:30 AM
 :o OWU loses for the first time this season!  In its last two games against conference teams (Wooster and Denison), OWU flirted with disaster, but escaped.  The BBs couldn't pull it out a third time against lowly Trine, however, losing 87-82.  Massey Ratings has OWU ranked third overall, while Trine is waaaaaaaay down the list at 155.  Prior to the OWU win, Massey also projected Trine to lose more games than it wins for the rest of the season.  The same new D3Hoops Poll poll that has OWU in the top ten this week gives zip nada zero votes for Trine.  As noted elsewhere, there have been more than a few loses among the D3Hoops poll's top 25 this year already.  OWU has now joined those ranks.

The plot thickens...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 10, 2014, 12:20:07 AM
Nobody should pay any attention to Massey this early in the season, Eco-manblue. There simply isn't enough data present after 5-to-7 games per team for Massey's HAL 9000 supercomputer to sort out anything useful.

Don't pass judgment upon Trine or anybody else this early based upon Massey numbers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2014, 01:57:52 AM
Right. Teams aren't all 'connected' yet. Wait until December's holiday tourneys, then we'll see power numbers that make sense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 10, 2014, 08:25:09 AM
Trine's low rating in massey was largely due to the very poorly rated schedule they had played up until last night.  Four of their previous 6 opponents are a combined 2-26.


Trine was the only MIAA to play last night yet everyone from the MIAA but Adrian moved up in massey's ratings this morning.  Ohio Wesleyan only dropped 4 spots. 

Trine +59
Albion +53
Hope +26
Kalamazoo +22
Alma +8
Calvin +2
Olivet  +1
Adrian -6
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on December 10, 2014, 02:17:21 PM
So Eco, Using your logic. Trine beats OWU, so they must not be that Good. We would the transitory properties then be applied to the teams that OWU beat? I wonder who that can could be?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 10, 2014, 04:19:02 PM
Quote from: Bishopleftiesdad on December 10, 2014, 02:17:21 PM
So Eco, Using your logic. Trine beats OWU, so they must not be that Good.
I did not see that logic in his post. I saw, rather, the opposite: that like other top 10 teams, a very good OWU team was upset by a team they should have beaten.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on December 10, 2014, 05:33:53 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 10, 2014, 04:19:02 PM
Quote from: Bishopleftiesdad on December 10, 2014, 02:17:21 PM
So Eco, Using your logic. Trine beats OWU, so they must not be that Good.
I did not see that logic in his post. I saw, rather, the opposite: that like other top 10 teams, a very good OWU team was upset by a team they should have beaten.
ok David, thanks for that view point. I guess I can see that. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on December 10, 2014, 09:53:49 PM
Be careful about reading too much into my post.  As David noted, I was simply observing that OWU (the better team) fell to a lesser team.  Massey and the D3Hoops poll were used -- as what little documentation there is right now in the season -- to underscore the observation.  OWU and Wooster are far from being alone in this regard, hence, my comment: the plot thickens.  Overall, I'm excited about the fluidity so far.  I like the dymanic nature what's happening, finding it much more stimulating and intriguing than some previous years. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 10, 2014, 10:16:44 PM
You called Trine "lowly," and that's an adjective that's not warranted.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on December 10, 2014, 10:23:02 PM
Indeed, the beat goes on -- last night rendered another example of an un-ranked team (Brandeis) knocking off a seemingly better, high-ranked team (Amherst) 78 to 58 at Amherst.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on December 10, 2014, 10:29:00 PM
No offense intended.  Lowly was simply a short-hand for ranking position.  But thanks for pointing that out; I want to be precise, not unintentionally pejorative. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 13, 2014, 02:10:19 PM
Is anyone getting the video from the Wabash-Wooster game?  They had the pregame thingy up a while ago, but then it went to just a blank black screen with no audio.  Sigh.

Finally the video came on, after missing more than half of the first half.  Why is it that so often it seems that they must re-invent the wheel?

The Wallies are in red shorts.  Seriously, I think it would be cool if they wore striped shorts, ala WW.

Wooster with a 12-point lead, but unfortunately I wasn't able to see enough of the game to comment on it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 13, 2014, 04:13:03 PM
Final from Timken today:

Wooster - 81
Wabash - 52

Xavier Brown led the way today with 24 points and he was 11-19 shooting despite going 0-5 from deep but going 11-14 from inside the arc ain't too shabby.  8-)

Evan Panell and Spencer Williams were the only other Scots in double figures chipping in 14 apiece. 

In other league action, OWU is trailing at home to Hiram 52-50 with about 14 minutes left in the game. 

Denison is hanging with Witt in Springfield trailing by 2, 48-46 midway thru the 2nd half.

Oberlin continues to surge and DePauw continues their losing streak as the Yeomen knock off the Tigers 67-63!  :o

Kenyon and Allegheny were off today...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 13, 2014, 04:51:40 PM
Back from Timken and Good Summary of the Wooster win by ScotsFan

To add some color, Wooster won this game because they:
-Shot 46% from the floor and held Wabash to only 37%
-Wooster had only 5 turnovers while Wabash had 19 turnovers (net, Wooster took 11 more shots than Wabash and made a higher %)
-Scots made 8 three pointers vs. only 4 for the Little Giants

Great play in the second half where Evan Pannell got the ball in transition, drove the length of the floor and jammed home the dunk!  ;D

Only negative was Dan Fanelly's leg injury.  He did return to the bench in the second half with an ice bag on his leg and he walked off (unaided) at the end.  Hopefully, some rest will help and Fanelly will be able to play next week.

Wooster is now 5-2, 2-1 NCAC.  Next game is at Pitt Bradford next week

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 13, 2014, 06:57:30 PM
OWU held off Hiram, 92-84.
Wittenberg upset Denison, 59-57. Witt pulls out of the cellar, which now belongs to....DePauw.  :o

1. OWU 4-0
2. Wabash, Wooster, Allegheny 2-1
5. Denison, Kenyon 2-2
7. Oberlin 2-3
8. Hiram 1-2
9. Wittenberg 1-3
10. DePauw 0-3

Next conference games are on Jan. 3 (Wooster at Denison, Hiram at Wabash, Allegheny at DePauw)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCACfan22 on December 13, 2014, 07:02:59 PM
Oberlin continues a bizarre season...follows up a 40 point drubbing against Denison by coming out and beating Depauw. Poyle is one of the better guards in the conference, but he does not have much consistent help around him. Oberlin's center, Randy Ollie, did a great job holding Fernitz on Depauw in check today. He is the key to Oberlin's success in my mind, gives them their only real post presence. Looking forward to rest of the season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on December 14, 2014, 12:57:25 PM
Anxious moment yesterday: During the home game with Wabash, Wooster Scots' talented and energetic post jack-in-the-box, Dan Fannelly, collapsed to the floor after twisting his knee.  According to the Wooster Daily Record story, "Wooster trainer Tom Love said the initial prognosis, fortunately, was a sprain and that Fanelly may only miss the Scots' upcoming game at Pitt-Bradford Wednesday".  Soooo glad he appears to not have had a more serious injury.  Having destroyed my left ACL (skiing), it's a phenomenally painful and difficult recovery process, post-surgery.  In addition to being happy for Dan if this prognosis is correct, I'm relieved for the Scots and their potential this year.  Stay healthy out there, everybody!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 15, 2014, 01:34:47 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 13, 2014, 06:57:30 PM
OWU held off Hiram, 92-84.
Wittenberg upset Denison, 59-57. Witt pulls out of the cellar, which now belongs to....DePauw.  :o

1. OWU 4-0
2. Wabash, Wooster, Allegheny 2-1
5. Denison, Kenyon 2-2
7. Oberlin 2-3
8. Hiram 1-2
9. Wittenberg 1-3
10. DePauw 0-3

Next conference games are on Jan. 3 (Wooster at Denison, Hiram at Wabash, Allegheny at DePauw)

I mean, is this fun or what?  A conference tournament that doesn't include Witt OR DePauw?  Somebody's been reading my diary. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 15, 2014, 10:27:03 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 15, 2014, 01:34:47 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 13, 2014, 06:57:30 PM
OWU held off Hiram, 92-84.
Wittenberg upset Denison, 59-57. Witt pulls out of the cellar, which now belongs to....DePauw.  :o

1. OWU 4-0
2. Wabash, Wooster, Allegheny 2-1
5. Denison, Kenyon 2-2
7. Oberlin 2-3
8. Hiram 1-2
9. Wittenberg 1-3
10. DePauw 0-3

Next conference games are on Jan. 3 (Wooster at Denison, Hiram at Wabash, Allegheny at DePauw)

I mean, is this fun or what?  A conference tournament that doesn't include Witt OR DePauw?  Somebody's been reading my diary. 

Bought the Kindle version just last week.  You should have asked more than $2.49.  Are there illustrations in the hard copy?

Seriously, we're definitely in agreement with Wittenberg.  If they're shut out, drinks are on me -- er, Collinge -- if the final four is in Wooster. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 17, 2014, 09:18:07 PM
Final:  Wooster 89  Pitt-Bradford 67  :)

Wooster gets the easy road win with a balanced scoring attack that has 5 players in double figures.  Scots were led by freshman Spencer Williams with 15 points, Jalen Goodwin with 14, Alex LaLonde with 12, Milt Davis with 12 and Evan Pannell with 11.  Josh Kipfer chipped in 8 points and led Wooster in rebounds with 13.  Dan Fanelly did not dress for this game as he is obviously rehabbing his knee sprain.  Kipfer was the replacement starter.

Wooster won this game by:
Shooting 48% while holding Pitt-Bradford to only 39%
Nailing 10 three pointers vs. only 4 by Pitt-Bradford
Winning the rebound battle 37 to 30

Wooster is now 6-2, 2-1 NCAC.  ;D  Next game is Wisconsin La Crosse at home on 12/29 in the first round of the Mose Hole Classic

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 18, 2014, 07:09:48 AM
Still waiting Wooster Booster's critique of the Pitt-Bradford announcers.  Absolutely horrible however I did fall off the chair laughing when they described Spencer Williams "as intense as a rabid hyena."   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on December 18, 2014, 01:18:43 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on December 18, 2014, 07:09:48 AM
Still waiting Wooster Booster's critique of the Pitt-Bradford announcers.  Absolutely horrible however I did fall off the chair laughing when they described Spencer Williams "as intense as a rabid hyena."   ;D

I thought they were pretty middle-of-the-pack.  They sounded like kids, but after listening to some of their comments, I don't think they were.  They had the normal bias with the officials but did compliment Wooster's play quite a bit while often criticizing that of their own team.  Hardly anyone seems to be able to come close to pronouncing LaLonde.  The weird thing is that so many change that second L to a completely different letter.

They also had me confused for a while with the coaches.  Turns out both of them are named Moore.

My favorite line was at the very beginning of the game.  The lead guy was explaining, to the home fans, where Wooster was in Ohio.  I was surprised to learn that our town has moved to within 95 miles of Cincinnati!  (Wally's diary, which doubles as a World Atlas, correctly notes the distance as around 200.) :)

As to the game, when Wooster shoots the three ball that well they're obviously going to be a tough out.  I was disappointed in their defense, though, as especially in the first half Bradford was getting to the hoop too easily.

I know Fanelly didn't dress.  Does anyone know any details concerning his leg injury?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on December 18, 2014, 09:12:13 PM
 :( The bad news is that Fannelly has a MCL sprain (according to the Wooster newspaper report on the Pitt-Bradford game).   ;DThe good news is that not only is it not an MCL or ACL tear, but it's "just" sprained.  Coach Moore hopes he'll be healthy enough to play in the Mose Hole tournament.  Until he starts playing on it again, we're not likely to know just how it is.  Fingers and toes crossed!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on December 21, 2014, 10:55:50 AM
http://www.battlingbishops.com/mobile/index.aspx?story=2897

OWU defeats Ott, 92-81.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2014, 07:32:17 PM
At the Half:  UW La Crosse 26  Wooster 24

Wooster played a sluggish first half and shot the ball poorly at only 31% from the floor.  Scots look like they haven't played in 12 days.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2014, 07:42:33 PM
NCAC Final Scores:
DePauw 73  Washington College 63
Hiram 72  Grove City 64
Denison 91  Berry 82
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2014, 08:32:13 PM
Final:  Wooster 66  UW La Crosse 58  :)

Wooster picked up the tempo in the 2nd half and showed some offensive aggressiveness in driving to the basket more.

Scots were led tonight by Xavier Brown with 18 points, freshman Spencer Williams with 16, Evan Pannell with 11 and Dan Fanelly with 12.

Great to see Dan Fanelly back on the floor tonight and he was aggressive with his 12 points notched in only 19 minutes of playing time.

Wooster is now 7-2.  ;D  Big regional game tomorrow night in the Mose Hole Championship with the Scots facing the Hope Dutchmen.

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2014, 09:14:10 PM
Other NCAC Final Scores:

Waynesburg 77  Wittenberg 69  Tigers lose on their home floor to a 4-5 weak team.  Hard to see Witt getting above .500 this season?  Witt now 3-7

Chapman 72  Oberlin 50  game played on the west coast and Chapman is now 8-0.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 29, 2014, 10:35:09 PM
Looking forward to seeing Hope and Wooster tangle on the floor.  It will be the first time since the 2nd round of the NCAA Tournament in 1997, 18 seasons ago. Hope won 67-56 in Holland at our back-up gym on campus.   Neither Wooster or Hope had much in the way of NCAA tournament history back then, not like today anyway.

Since that last meeting, not including this year

Hope is 364-123, 9 MIAA Championships, 8 MIAA Tournament Championship, 11 NCAA appearances, Final Fours in 1998 and 2008
Wooster is 434-85, 13 NCAC Championships, 11 NCAC Tournament Championships,  16 NCAA appearances, Final Fours in 2003, 2007 and 2011

That's a lot of winning.




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HOPEful on December 30, 2014, 02:25:58 PM
Quote from: sac on December 29, 2014, 10:35:09 PM
Hope is 364-123, 9 MIAA Championships, 8 MIAA Tournament Championship, 11 NCAA appearances, Final Fours in 1998 and 2008
Wooster is 434-85, 13 NCAC Championships, 11 NCAC Tournament Championships,  16 NCAA appearances, Final Fours in 2003, 2007 and 2011

That's a lot of winning.

Very much looking forward to this game!! It's rediculous that these two teams haven't played each other since 1997!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2014, 07:45:14 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 43  Hope 39

Entertaining game so far with two high quality teams trading baskets in the first half.  Both teams shot the ball well in the half.

Big men led the scoring in the half as Dan Fanelly had 12 points for the Scots and Brock Benson led the Dutchmen with 17.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2014, 08:30:12 PM
You know, I can never get any of the media links at Wooster.edu to work properly. Not the video, not the live stats, nothing. Frustrating.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2014, 08:51:44 PM
Final:  Wooster 78  Hope 75

Terrific regional win for the Scots! :)  Great game between two excellent teams!

Wooster was led tonight by Dan Fanelly with 28 points, Xavier Brown with 14, Evan Pannell with 13 and Alex LaLonde with 10.

Scots won this close game by outrebounding the Dutchmen 41 to 35 which resulted in 2 more made baskets and they also outshot Hope 45% to 43%.

Hope was led in scoring by Brock Benson with 26 points and Ben Gardner with 21 points.

Wooster is now 8-2. ;D  Next game is this Saturday at Denison

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 30, 2014, 09:52:42 PM
Tremendous game at Timken tonight.   Pleasure to be there.  I imagine video did little justice to how hard those teams played and the injuries and fatigue guys played through for both teams at the end. 

Let's do that again.  Sooner than 18 years. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 30, 2014, 10:09:37 PM
After watching a strong Hope team that may win their conference, I started reflecting on Wooster's first 10 opponents this year:
-8 of the 10 teams currently have winning records
-Only Pitt Bradford (4-5) and UW La Crosse (5-6) have losing records and they are just each 1 game below .500
-10 Wooster opponents have a combined cumulative record of 63 wins and 37 losses to date so Wooster has played a tough schedule
-Wooster's 8 wins are included in the 37 combined losses....so 63-29 combined record excluding games vs. the Scots

Excluding NCAC opponents, Wooster has now played 5 teams (and beat 4 of them) who may win their respective conferences this season:
Hope (MIAA)
Cabrini (CSAC)
Mount Union (OAC)
St. Vincent (PAC)
Hanover (HCAC) Scots lost at Hanover

It will be interesting at the end of the season to see how many of these teams do win their conferences and/or end up in the NCAA tourney.

Just checked Massey ratings--prior to tonight's game, Hope had the #5 toughest strength of schedule and Wooster's SOS was #19 in D3.  With the win over Hope, Wooster's SOS number should climb higher.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on December 30, 2014, 11:21:38 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 30, 2014, 08:30:12 PM
You know, I can never get any of the media links at Wooster.edu to work properly. Not the video, not the live stats, nothing. Frustrating.

Too bad - you missed a good game!  I was able to get both the Live Stats and Video from my hotel in Vegas!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 31, 2014, 12:17:28 AM
NCAC is 44-21 in Non-Conference. That's even with Wittenberg's stink, stank, stunk of a year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on December 31, 2014, 01:30:25 AM
Wittenberg is 3-8.   Shocking for a team picked 3rd in the NCAC.  Have they had significant injuries?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 31, 2014, 06:47:17 AM
I see that Witt lost to Alma (2-9) yesterday to finish 4th in the Zimmerman Classic. First last-place finish in 32 years of Zimmerman history. Looks like Wittenberg is becoming the Michigan to Wooster's Ohio State. Maybe there's another Harbaugh brother who coaches basketball...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 31, 2014, 09:26:58 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on December 30, 2014, 11:21:38 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 30, 2014, 08:30:12 PM
You know, I can never get any of the media links at Wooster.edu to work properly. Not the video, not the live stats, nothing. Frustrating.

Too bad - you missed a good game!  I was able to get both the Live Stats and Video from my hotel in Vegas!

Only question I have is what are you doing listening to a D3 hoops game in your hotel room when you're in Vegas?   :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 31, 2014, 10:16:54 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on December 31, 2014, 09:26:58 AM
Only question I have is what are you doing listening to a D3 hoops game in your hotel room when you're in Vegas?   :P

Well, it was the first time that Wooster played Hope in 18 years so give him full credit --- he clearly has his priorities straight!  :) ;D ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 31, 2014, 11:27:01 AM
Massey ratings today which include Wooster's win over Hope now show the Scots with the #12 SOS in D3.  Hope's SOS also moved up to #3.

Massey is showing Wooster today as the #7 team nationally.  Massey ratings clearly reward teams that schedule tough opponents.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 31, 2014, 12:29:33 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 31, 2014, 11:27:01 AM
Massey ratings today which include Wooster's win over Hope now show the Scots with the #12 SOS in D3.  Hope's SOS also moved up to #3.

Massey is showing Wooster today as the #7 team nationally.  Massey ratings clearly reward teams that schedule tough opponents.

Technically Hope should be #2,  massey is including an exhibition against D1 ULL for Louisiana College.  Also  Howard Payne is #2 but only because they've played 3 D1's.


Interesting that both Hope and Wooster moved up massey's ratings after last night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 31, 2014, 01:03:05 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 31, 2014, 06:47:17 AM
I see that Witt lost to Alma (2-9) yesterday to finish 4th in the Zimmerman Classic. First last-place finish in 32 years of Zimmerman history. Looks like Wittenberg is becoming the Michigan to Wooster's Ohio State. Maybe there's another Harbaugh brother who coaches basketball...

Well, the Indiana U. bball coach is Jim and John's brother-in-law - does that count? :D

Unfortunately there are no regular posters from Witt.  Anyone have a clue on how they have fallen so far so fast?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 31, 2014, 01:29:02 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 31, 2014, 01:03:05 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 31, 2014, 06:47:17 AM
I see that Witt lost to Alma (2-9) yesterday to finish 4th in the Zimmerman Classic. First last-place finish in 32 years of Zimmerman history. Looks like Wittenberg is becoming the Michigan to Wooster's Ohio State. Maybe there's another Harbaugh brother who coaches basketball...

Well, the Indiana U. bball coach is Jim and John's brother-in-law - does that count? :D

Unfortunately there are no regular posters from Witt.  Anyone have a clue on how they have fallen so far so fast?

Tom Crean was an assistant at Alma.    Symmetry!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 31, 2014, 01:38:34 PM
I was poking around Wittenberg's boxscores earlier this week, it appears they are very very young.   They just have trouble scoring shooting under 40% as a team.  Even worse they've struggled at the stripe and have lost a few close ones because of it.  For instance, against Alma they lost by 6 and missed 16 FT's.  Yikes!


Bill Brown has been starting  Sr., So, So. So. Fr  with a bench of  Fr, Fr, Jr, Sr, Jr.  He has only had 6 guys play in all 11 games.  Perhaps injuries have played a part.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 31, 2014, 06:00:56 PM
There's any number of Witt lurkers and occasional posters out there reading this. But it's not so easy to step up and answer the question "why does your team suck?", especially when most of your readership is at least mildly pleased by the suckage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 01, 2015, 01:26:07 PM
Count me in as one of the mildly pleased readers...  8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on January 02, 2015, 07:17:15 PM
I like the synchronicity of OWU & Hope locking horns tomorrow just days after the Scots close victory over Hope in the Moles Hole Tournament.  Seldom does one get such an opportunity for comparison in close proximity date-wise.  Major difference of course is OWU is on the road & Woo was at home.  Add to that, the Scots travel to Denison and play tomorrow afternoon.  OWU recently beat the Big Red by only 2 points.  As we all know, anything can happen on any given game, but these games will give us some statistical tea leaves to mull over until the Main Event in late January when Wooster ventures down to OWU for the teams' second showdown of the season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 03, 2015, 10:51:57 AM
Wooster needs to be highly focused today and play their best ball to get a win at Denison.

Denison is now 8-3 on the season and the Big Red already have wins against:
-Case Western Reserve 8-2
-DePauw 7-3
-St. Vincent 7-4
Denison also played AT Ohio Wesleyan and lost that game by only 2 points.  It looks like the Big Red will be a top 4 team in the NCAC this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 03, 2015, 03:02:11 PM
Denison's video just came on, in HD!  Here's hoping it has the stamina to last two hours, and that Dan FAN-el-y, Josh Kuiper, and Evan PAN-el are not on the premises.

Seems the game will be starting a bit late (the teams are still warming up) due to the women's-men's doubleheader.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 03, 2015, 03:27:52 PM
Wooster leads early at Denison, both teams playing on an excellent HD court with decent announcers that are correctly pronouncing all the names!  Kudos to them!  The video feed is integrated with the Live Stats; far ahead of all other systems that I've seen.  Just get rid of that white font on a yellow background... :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 03, 2015, 03:43:49 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 46  Denison 36

Wooster was led in the half by Alex Lalonde with 12 points, Spencer Williams with 10 and Xavier Brown with 8.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on January 03, 2015, 03:55:07 PM
The WQKT-AM announcer at least knows how to pronounce Wooster.  Denison announcer rhymes it with "rooster".  Ugh!  But common mispronunciation.  Anyway, nice shooting by the Scots in the first half (50+%).  Only downside (besides not being able to get a steady video feed!) were the 3 or 4 penetrations by the Big Red for easy baskets.  Hope they come out after the break and tighten down on the inside.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on January 03, 2015, 04:06:53 PM
Action around the NCAC today:

Randolph 74  Kenyon 60 (Final)
Wabash 36  Hiram 23 (Half time)
Allegheny vs. DePauw (just starting)
OWU vs. Hope (7:00 PM Eastern time start)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 03, 2015, 04:37:20 PM
Final:  Wooster 95  Denison 72 :)

Solid road win for the Scots as they shot very well against the Big Red and made 14 of 29 three points shots.  Shot over 57% from the floor.

Leading players for Wooster:
Spencer Williams 22 points, 6 assists
Alex Lalonde 22 points
Milt Davis 12 points
Josh Kipfer 10 points, 8 boards
Xavier Brown and Dan Fanelly 8 points each.  Fanelly had 8 assists

Coach Moore on the post game show was very pleased that the Scots had 24 assists today.

Wooster is now 9-2, 3-1 NCAC  ;D  Next game is Kenyon at home on 1/7

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on January 03, 2015, 05:27:48 PM
 8-) Finally got through the video problems and saw the Scots play some well-oiled basketball in the 2nd half.  Crisp passing, aggressive offensive and defense, nice pressure and moves throughout the contest.  Fine tuning: concentrate on shutting down those easy inside baskets the Big Red got away with and foul shooting (5 of 10 for 50%?! Yipes!).  Pleasurable game to watch.  Scots were efficient, workmen-like, and relentless in dismantling the Big Red today.  Keep it up, big guys!  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 03, 2015, 05:30:49 PM
LGs got past Hiram 89-78 in two overtimes.  Hiram erased a big halftime lead and Wabash needed the final bucket in regulation and the first overtime in order to get to the second extra session- which they firmly controlled.  Wabash shimmies up to 7-3 overall, 3-1 in league play.  They'll get Allegheny tomorrow on the second day of the east/west back-to-back. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 03, 2015, 05:48:58 PM
Final:  DePauw 85  Allegheny 71

Current NCAC Standings through 1/3 Games:
1. Ohio Wesleyan 4-0
2. Wooster 3-1
2. Wabash 3-1
4. Allegheny 2-2
4. Kenyon 2-2
6. Denison 2-3
6. Oberlin 2-3
8. DePauw 1-3
8. Hiram 1-3
8. Wittenberg 1-3
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 03, 2015, 06:39:25 PM
Quote from: Eco-manblue on January 03, 2015, 03:55:07 PM
The WQKT-AM announcer at least knows how to pronounce Wooster.  Denison announcer rhymes it with "rooster".  Ugh!  But common mispronunciation.  Anyway, nice shooting by the Scots in the first half (50+%).  Only downside (besides not being able to get a steady video feed!) were the 3 or 4 penetrations by the Big Red for easy baskets.  Hope they come out after the break and tighten down on the inside.

Hardly anyone knows how to pronounce Wooster, and that includes many of the students at the college itself.  There is at least one word that rhymes with the correct pronunciation of Wooster, but my memory isn't helping me out here.

I like when Wooster goes big and plays Fanelly and Kipfer together.  It works well, and is something that they may need to do more often come tournament time, providing both bigs stay out of foul trouble.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 03, 2015, 08:17:13 PM
Oh, great now we have TWO high and mighty lords of announcing critiques on this board....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on January 03, 2015, 08:24:51 PM
Hey that's what you get for growing up in Woo: an acute sensitivity to hometown pronunciation.  But who cares about that this evening as this Hope is demolishing OWU 83 - 61 with 2:40 left in the game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on January 04, 2015, 07:47:26 AM
Wooster Booster:  How about this in an attempt to be helpful.  Wooster (WUST-er or WUS-ter), as in Woof (WUF, not WOOF), the barking sound a proud Scottie dog makes  Thus, Wooster and Woof, keeping in the tradition of the Fighting Scots.  Or in my personal case, the sound my West Highland White Terrier makes when the UPS driver delivers a package to my front door.
    Does this makes sense as a way to help people learn the correct pronunciation of the College and the town? 
    Now, let's help those who can't pronounce Wabash (WAU-bash) correctly.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2015, 10:50:27 AM
It doesn't help that even locals like me call the place "Woo" (rhymes with "Boo").

I lived for a time in New Orleans, which is in Orleans Parish. There are any number of acceptable ways to pronounce the city's name, ranging from "Noo ORR-lee-uns" to "NAW-lins" to "NOY-uhns." In fact, the only completely unacceptable way is "Noo Orr-LEENS"--and yet that is the ONLY acceptable way to pronounce the name of the Parish. (And don't get me started on "Louisiana.")
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 04, 2015, 11:00:42 AM
Quote from: sigma one on January 04, 2015, 07:47:26 AM
    Now, let's help those who can't pronounce Wabash (WAU-bash) correctly.

Now, hold on.  WAU-bash?  Wouldn't that be about the same as WOW-bash?  It's not pronounced WAH-bash?

And here it is, how to pronounce Wooster:

http://firstyearwooster.blogspot.com/2011/07/pronunciation-and-woo-town-lingo.html

It's like "wood", only with a "ster" instead of a "d".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on January 04, 2015, 11:32:06 AM
So much for trying to help.  Wooster Booster, you yourself confuse the issue for the uninitiated because one could easily assume that Woo and Boo rhyme.  And there's only one way to pronounce Boo.  And, yes, it is WAU-bash, or in an alternate transcription WAH-bash.  Not WOW-bash.  WOW and WAU/WAH are not pronounced the same.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 04, 2015, 11:47:13 AM
*I* confuse the issue?  Sheesh.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on January 04, 2015, 12:15:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 04, 2015, 10:50:27 AM
It doesn't help that even locals like me call the place "Woo" (rhymes with "Boo").

I lived for a time in New Orleans, which is in Orleans Parish. There are any number of acceptable ways to pronounce the city's name, ranging from "Noo ORR-lee-uns" to "NAW-lins" to "NOY-uhns." In fact, the only completely unacceptable way is "Noo Orr-LEENS"--and yet that is the ONLY acceptable way to pronounce the name of the Parish. (And don't get me started on "Louisiana.")

Think of Baltimore -- maybe we can get Dave in here to talk more about how the locals pronounce it. But I prefer the "Balmer" sound. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 04, 2015, 12:58:04 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on January 04, 2015, 12:15:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 04, 2015, 10:50:27 AM
It doesn't help that even locals like me call the place "Woo" (rhymes with "Boo").

I lived for a time in New Orleans, which is in Orleans Parish. There are any number of acceptable ways to pronounce the city's name, ranging from "Noo ORR-lee-uns" to "NAW-lins" to "NOY-uhns." In fact, the only completely unacceptable way is "Noo Orr-LEENS"--and yet that is the ONLY acceptable way to pronounce the name of the Parish. (And don't get me started on "Louisiana.")

Think of Baltimore -- maybe we can get Dave in here to talk more about how the locals pronounce it. But I prefer the "Balmer" sound. :)

Aw, anybody who watched "The Wire" not only knows how to pronounce the name of that city but, thanks to Stringer Bell, can probably run a viable drug ring.  Omar not withstanding.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 04, 2015, 01:28:37 PM
Then there's Louisville...or Pittsburgh and their Stillers...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2015, 01:32:48 PM
Louisville is easy if you remember that it has only two syllables and that there is no vowel sound in the second syllable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 04, 2015, 03:29:54 PM
Hope 87, OWU 61 (http://www.battlingbishops.com/news/2015/1/3/MBB_01032014.aspx)

Hope led 60-57 with 9:02 left, then closed on a flabbergasting 27-4 run.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 04, 2015, 03:53:18 PM
Wabash leading Allegheny 41-35 at the break.  Another solid start for Wabash after yesterday's double OT game. 

Also, Stringer failed epically.  Avon was right- not hard enough for the game, not smart enough for the suits.  The co-op was fun while it lasted, but it was always doomed.  Crisis of leadership, I believe Joe said.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 04, 2015, 05:32:49 PM
1/4 NCAC Final Scores:

Allegheny 75  Wabash 63
DePauw 66  Hiram 58

Gheny and Wabash now tied for 3rd, both at 3-2
DePauw moves up to a tie for 6th place at 2-3
Terriers drop to last place at 1-4
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Flying Dutch Fan on January 04, 2015, 05:49:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 04, 2015, 10:50:27 AM
It doesn't help that even locals like me call the place "Woo" (rhymes with "Boo").

I lived for a time in New Orleans, which is in Orleans Parish. There are any number of acceptable ways to pronounce the city's name, ranging from "Noo ORR-lee-uns" to "NAW-lins" to "NOY-uhns." In fact, the only completely unacceptable way is "Noo Orr-LEENS"--and yet that is the ONLY acceptable way to pronounce the name of the Parish. (And don't get me started on "Louisiana.")

During our visit to Wooster Monday and Tuesday, we were discussing the proper pronunciation of the town/school.  We were all settled on what we thought was the proper pronunciation (Wus ter) but then noticed the name on the banner for the student section - is that the Wuh Cruh?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on January 04, 2015, 07:29:31 PM
Updated Standings
4-0 Ohio Wesleyan
3-1 Wooster
3-2 Wabash
3-2 Allegheny
2-2 Kenyon
2-3 DePauw
2-3 Denison
2-3 Oberlin
1-3 Wittenberg
1-4 Hiram
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 04, 2015, 07:32:36 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 04, 2015, 01:32:48 PM
Louisville is easy if you remember that it has only two syllables and that there is no vowel sound in the second syllable.

Like "Gran vul"?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 04, 2015, 08:57:14 PM
As I walked into Timken I asked an old man and his wife how they pronounced Wooster, even though I already knew.  He seemed rather serious about it being pronounced Wus-ster.


He and his wife once lived in Cheboygan, Michigan while he was serving on the Coast Guard ice breaker Mackinac.  Funny the things you learn from people in a small minute or two conversation.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 05, 2015, 08:52:04 AM
Quote from: GoRed on January 04, 2015, 07:32:36 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 04, 2015, 01:32:48 PM
Louisville is easy if you remember that it has only two syllables and that there is no vowel sound in the second syllable.

Like "Gran vul"?

You mean that little college town just outside Nerk Ahia? You betcha.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 07, 2015, 10:29:34 AM
Bit of a palate cleanser for Wabash tonight as they host Illinois Tech.  If you're scoring at home, that's an in-season home and home with IIT (Wabash won 69-35 in November at IIT) and I'm not really sure why, but such is life.  It's not really about SOS for Wabash this year in any case.  Big game at Denison on Saturday...Wabash is going to have to win a couple of these league games away from home to stay in the top four. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 07, 2015, 11:13:38 AM
IIT needs games, and maybe they made an offer Wabash couldn't refuse!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 07, 2015, 07:45:38 PM
Halftime in the 'Ville: Wabash leads IIT 39-15.  The outcome tonight probably wasn't going to be in doubt, but I'm looking to see if Wabash cleans some things up from the weekend, turnovers specifically.  LGs had 26(!) vs. Hiram and 16 vs. Allegheny.  Just four through the first 20 minutes tonight.  Also looking to see if Wabash keeps it up in the second half.  They really had flat second periods in both games over the weekend.  I expect a big second half here- IIT is already way overmatched and they've already got two players with three fouls, one with four, and I'm not sure what kind of quality is still on the bench for them.  No real surprise here, but Wabash's leading scorer is Daniel Purvlicius with 11 points.  He's having an excellent season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 07, 2015, 08:07:08 PM
They have a player named Colt Scroggins now. We need more Colt Scroggins....

(I'm surprised he's not a LAX player...)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 07, 2015, 08:22:53 PM
Five weeks until Wabash's first lax game! 

It's 62-20 now, under 6 to go.  Wabash is deep into their bench now and this thing has devolved into Wabash chucking 3s over the IIT zone.  Pretty efficient work from the first 8-10 for Wabash which was the objective tonight.  On to Denison Saturday!

71-25 is the final just to complete the thread.  Everybody got a good sweat in, nobody got hurt.  Solid evening of work for the LGs. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 08, 2015, 06:37:21 AM
Elsewise,
at Wooster 77, Kenyon 63
at OWU 75, Wittenberg 63
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 08, 2015, 07:57:45 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 08, 2015, 06:37:21 AM
Elsewise,
at Wooster 77, Kenyon 63
at OWU 75, Wittenberg 63

5 more losses and Witt clinches a losing record for the first time since 1956.  4 if they don't make the NCAC tournament and win it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on January 08, 2015, 10:04:22 AM
I looked at the Witt schedule and they still have Wooster twice, DePauw twice, and OWU once.  That is shocking for a team picked second in the pre-season. They are Witt and could turn this thing around and go on a winning streak at any time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 10, 2015, 07:04:11 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 07, 2015, 08:22:53 PM
Five weeks until Wabash's first lax game! 

It's 62-20 now, under 6 to go.  Wabash is deep into their bench now and this thing has devolved into Wabash chucking 3s over the IIT zone.  Pretty efficient work from the first 8-10 for Wabash which was the objective tonight.  On to Denison Saturday!

71-25 is the final just to complete the thread.  Everybody got a good sweat in, nobody got hurt.  Solid evening of work for the LGs.
Thought I saw on Denison's lacrosse schedule Wabash was making a visit this year. Great to see Wabash is joining the lacrosse revolution. Good luck 4/18 in Granville. Going to see the Little Giants today against Denison.  When I think of these two playing I still remember the player for Denison scoring 7 points in 5 seconds a few years back. Sorry Wabash fans but still one of the greatest moments I have seen in sports.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 10, 2015, 02:24:17 PM
Wait a minute.  When Wally said it was five weeks until Wabash's first lacrosse game, I thought he was referring to the start of the season.  He meant the first match EVER?  A brand new program?  Wow.  Good luck to them!

However, I'd thought the LAX revolution had been over for several decades.  In looking at last year's NCAC standings, it turns out that Allegheny doesn't have a team either.  I had no idea.  I mean, beer pong preceded lacrosse as a sport at these two schools?  Yikes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 10, 2015, 04:05:23 PM
Is anyone getting any sound at all from the Oberlin-Wooster non-contest?  Video is fine, but either the announcers failed to show up or yet more technical incompetence has shown its head.  Unbelievable.  Scots up 9-0.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on January 10, 2015, 06:00:47 PM
Wooster has a million dollar team and dime store video/audio system.  :-[  No audio today and at one point the video looked like it was literally melting down!  They've consistently had problems over the past four or five years and while it's somewhat improved (crisper picture), the technical snafus happen way too often.  Wabash, for example, has a much better system, camera angles, etc.  8-)

Anyway, the Scots played tough today against a very scrappy, aggressive Oberlin team.  Very physical game with seemingly lots of fouls (have to review the box score as there was no audio to follow the foul situation).  Both teams never let up, and Woo pulled away at the end to finish 91 to 71.  Glad to see the Scots getting their offensive output into the nineties.  ;D

From what I've seen, at this point in the season, the NCAC teams are bringing their best/most intense game against the Scots.  I was worried about a let up or lag period between the Moses Hole Tournament and the second OWU game, but the mid-season conference play so far is more intense and competitive than I would have predicted.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on January 10, 2015, 06:25:03 PM
Hmmmmm... an observation on how the D3 round ball bounces in interesting ways...

OWU def. Calvin by 16 (85-71)

Calvin def. Hope by 24 (88 to 64)*

Hope def. OWU by 26 (87 to 61)

* Granted, this list is out of chronological sequence and OWU's victory over Calvin was the third game of the season, but none the less, it's intriguing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCACfan22 on January 10, 2015, 10:53:55 PM
@all first off I agree about the Wooster stream today...video was absolutely horrible at times and made the stream unwatchable.

As an Oberlin fan, I was really pleased with how they looked today. They came out extremely flat and got behind 15-1 early...but then turned it around, and really IMO outplayed Wooster up until around the 7 minute mark in the second half (I believe it got as close as 55-50 there in the 2nd half). One question I have for Wooster fans...where has Xavier Brown much of the season? I see he's "still" averaging 13 points a game, but I would have expected him to be putting him much bigger numbers for Woo this season (who is such a deep team with Brown, Pannell, Lalonde, and Fanelly...really tough to stop all of them, maybe it's just a case that Brown is sharing scoring load with other stars)

When Ollie (Oberlin's big man) plays well and Oberlin shoots the ball decently from the outside (they are extremely guard-heavy) I really do think they are a Top 5-6 team in the NCAC. Obviously a big if there....but they already have wins over Depauw and Witt, and I could easily see them taking down Gheny and Hiram as well. Will be interesting to watch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 10, 2015, 11:49:42 PM
Quote from: NCACfan22 on January 10, 2015, 10:53:55 PM
@all first off I agree about the Wooster stream today...video was absolutely horrible at times and made the stream unwatchable.

As an Oberlin fan, I was really pleased with how they looked today. They came out extremely flat and got behind 15-1 early...but then turned it around, and really IMO outplayed Wooster up until around the 7 minute mark in the second half (I believe it got as close as 55-50 there in the 2nd half). One question I have for Wooster fans...where has Xavier Brown much of the season? I see he's "still" averaging 13 points a game, but I would have expected him to be putting him much bigger numbers for Woo this season (who is such a deep team with Brown, Pannell, Lalonde, and Fanelly...really tough to stop all of them, maybe it's just a case that Brown is sharing scoring load with other stars)

When Ollie (Oberlin's big man) plays well and Oberlin shoots the ball decently from the outside (they are extremely guard-heavy) I really do think they are a Top 5-6 team in the NCAC. Obviously a big if there....but they already have wins over Depauw and Witt, and I could easily see them taking down Gheny and Hiram as well. Will be interesting to watch.

I just don't understand the issues with Wooster's attempts at streaming.  Other schools occasionally have problems, but nearly all are getting better and better at it.  Wooster just seems to be getting worse.

The Scots did have a great start, and early on the game appeared as if it would be a rout.  Then Oberlin crept back in, and until the last minutes neither team could stop each other.  Oberlin had no post-up game, but mixed up making threes and driving to produce a nice offense.

XB had a slow start due to an ankle injury, which has kept his scoring average down.  Plus, as you mentioned, there are a lot of other weapons this season.  LaLonde is now showing the skills that he played with in high school.  The freshman Spencer Williams, although only putting up two points today, can put up points.  Plus an improved Fanelly, Pannell, etc.  I thought Wooster did a very nice job of sharing the ball today, with Williams himself leading the way with five assists.

LOTS of fouls called in today's game; 20 on Wooster and 28 on Oberlin.  Watching the video, it's very hard to determine if these are deserved or not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 10, 2015, 11:59:44 PM
A new college ranking is out; something called Niche has ranked the top 100 liberal arts colleges in the USA. In that top 100, ranging from #28 (Kenyon) to #99 (Allegheny), eight of the ten NCAC member institutions are listed. Wabash is not ranked, for some data reason that I was not interested in following up, but they get an overall "grade" of B+, which is the same "grade" as Denison at #73. Only Hiram (#165 of #190, eek) is wholly absent. NCAC pride!

https://colleges.niche.com/rankings/best-liberal-arts-colleges/ (https://colleges.niche.com/rankings/best-liberal-arts-colleges/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 11, 2015, 12:08:42 AM
Around the NCAC today:
Wooster 91, Oberlin 71
Hiram 65, Wittenberg 59
DePauw 53, Kenyon 37
OWU 89, Allegheny 72
Wabash 66, Denison 62

Current standings:
1. OWU 6-0 (11-2)
2. Wooster 5-1 (11-2)
3. Wabash 4-2 (9-4)
4. DePauw 3-3 (10-3)
4. Allegheny 3-3 (6-7)
6. Denison 2-4 (8-5)
6. Hiram 2-4 (8-5)
6. Oberlin 2-4 (6-7)
6. Kenyon 2-4 (4-9)
10. Wittenberg 1-5 (3-10)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 11, 2015, 09:18:28 AM
Wow, when Wabash goes on a run , they go on a run. 33 points with 13 minutes left in the game and finish with 66. Denison was looking good for a couple of minutes then boom.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 12, 2015, 10:20:43 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 10, 2015, 02:24:17 PM
Wait a minute.  When Wally said it was five weeks until Wabash's first lacrosse game, I thought he was referring to the start of the season.  He meant the first match EVER?  A brand new program?  Wow.  Good luck to them!

Yes!  First varsity match ever for the Little Giants.  I had a lot of good friends who played a big part in getting the club team started in earnest in 1999 and when Wabash moved to the NCAC where lacrosse was actually a thing (did not and does not exist in the HCAC), it seemed like an obvious add for Wabash and while it took a little longer than I thought it would, I'm really excited that the day has come.  And I'm really excited especially for those guys back in 1999 who had never touched a lacrosse stick before, practiced without gloves for way too long, learned the game on the fly and laid the foundation for Wabash Lacrosse to become a reality.  And part of the reason why you add lacrosse is already evident- the roster has kids from nine different states which is as geographically diverse an athletic roster as I've seen at Wabash. 

Quick note on Wabash/Denison: The second half started like some recent second halves in Wabash games, with Wabash's opponent starting off on a run, but this time Wabash responded.  Denison goes up 40-33, Coach Brumett gets a timeout, Oetting and Aiton go bonkers for about five minutes and Wabash turns that deficit into a five point lead, and then they stretched it out from there.  The lead got out to 13 before Denison pulled it back a bit in the last 90 seconds.  My favorite part of this game might be that the Wabash found a way to win on the road on a day when Purvlicis got locked down (just one point for Daniel).  I hope that we don't see a repeat of a one point game from Purvlicis again this year, but it's nice to know that Wabash can find another way to win if the other side takes him away. 

Big one on Wednesday at Chadwick with OWU.  Would be fun for everybody to steal one from the Bishops. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 12, 2015, 12:34:29 PM
I'll be rooting for Wabash against OWU for obvious selfish reasons.  But when the lacrosse season opens, I'll be rooting for them because I'm glad to see them enter the fray in a new sport.  Now, mind you, hoping that Wabash does well is treacherous ground for me, so someone please set up one of those circus nets to break my fall.

I enjoyed playing lacrosse as a novelty, a diversion, but never really loved it.  Too much running, not enough jump shots, and rules nearly equaling the purposeful anarchy of rugby.  My high school on Long Island was one of the few that didn't have a team even way back in the day.  Still, we had all the equipment, and played the game in gym class and intramurals while waiting for summer and baseball to arrive.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on January 13, 2015, 10:29:29 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 12, 2015, 10:20:43 AM
Yes!  First varsity match ever for the Little Giants.  I had a lot of good friends who played a big part in getting the club team started in earnest in 1999 and when Wabash moved to the NCAC where lacrosse was actually a thing (did not and does not exist in the HCAC), it seemed like an obvious add for Wabash and while it took a little longer than I thought it would, I'm really excited that the day has come.  And I'm really excited especially for those guys back in 1999 who had never touched a lacrosse stick before, practiced without gloves for way too long, learned the game on the fly and laid the foundation for Wabash Lacrosse to become a reality.  And part of the reason why you add lacrosse is already evident- the roster has kids from nine different states which is as geographically diverse an athletic roster as I've seen at Wabash. 

I was on that original club team and we always hoped it would turn into a varsity sport at some point. It's something we've wanted to see for a long time and I'm glad it's finally here. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 14, 2015, 09:18:26 PM
There's your result.  Wabash picks off OWU 75-70 in C'ville. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 14, 2015, 09:18:51 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 12, 2015, 10:20:43 AM
Big one on Wednesday at Chadwick with OWU.  Would be fun for everybody to steal one from the Bishops.

Ohio Wesleyan 70, Wabash 75

The rest of the conference thanks you kindly, LGs.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 14, 2015, 09:39:12 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 14, 2015, 09:18:26 PM
There's your result.  Wabash picks off OWU 75-70 in C'ville.

Tonight they are indeed Giant!  Still, they oughta be the "Cannonballs"!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 14, 2015, 09:57:01 PM
old and new Tigers going to OT
http://portal.stretchinternet.com/wit/portal.htm?eventId=158330&streamType=video
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 15, 2015, 07:35:30 AM
nice win Giants. Was looking at your lacrosse schedule. It is a tough task ahead for the first year, just ask the folks at Hiram and DePauw. Good mixture at the beginning though of similar teams I believe(might be wrong on that). If you were in the OAC you might have better prospects for this year as Otterbein is the only established team(6th year) and Mt. Union is the only other team with at least 3 years. Still in the NCAC you are in the best so although there may more lumps at the start it will be better for recruiting and within a few years be a much stronger program. Good luck this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 15, 2015, 09:27:10 AM
I'll do a quick substitute for David here just to put a bow on last night's results:

Around the NCAC yesterday:
Wooster 85, Hiram 60
Witt 65, DePauw 56 (OT)
Kenyon 72, Denison 69
Allegheny 62, Oberlin 59
Wabash 75, OWU 70

Current standings:
1- Ohio Wesleyan 11-3 (6-1)
2- Wooster 12-2 (6-1)
3- Wabash 10-4 (5-2)
4- Allegheny 7-7 (4-3)
5- DePauw 10-4 (3-4)
6- Kenyon 5-9 (3-4)
7- Denison 8-6 (2-5)
7- Hiram 8-6 (2-5)
7- Oberlin 6-8 (2-5)
7- Wittenberg 4-10 (2-5)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 15, 2015, 10:00:41 AM
The last thing I want to see is Wittenberg creeping into the tournament as a first-round match-up for Wooster.  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 15, 2015, 10:11:10 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 15, 2015, 10:00:41 AM
The last thing I want to see is Wittenberg creeping into the tournament as a first-round match-up for Wooster.  :-\

Really?  I would think thwacking Witt for a third time would be good sport for you guys.  I'd sign up for that in a minute. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 15, 2015, 05:10:58 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 15, 2015, 10:11:10 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 15, 2015, 10:00:41 AM
The last thing I want to see is Wittenberg creeping into the tournament as a first-round match-up for Wooster.  :-\

Really?  I would think thwacking Witt for a third time would be good sport for you guys.  I'd sign up for that in a minute. 

Let's see how this weekend's Witt/Woo matchup goes before we start talking about Wooster thwacking them 3 times...  ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on January 17, 2015, 10:34:23 AM
Pre-season top 4 go at it today with Witt vs. Wooster and OWU vs. DePauw.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 17, 2015, 12:32:33 PM
I can only hope the video stream works well tonight. Figure the odds :'(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on January 17, 2015, 05:22:48 PM
DeWitt gets his 300th win with a OWU's win over DePauw. 76-64.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 17, 2015, 08:07:23 PM
Wittenberg vs Wooster, featuring the return of the partisan hack calling the video.  He's been gone for several games and the announcing had improved dramatically.  Tonight, not so much.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 17, 2015, 08:13:46 PM
Elsewhere, fourth-place Allegheny continues their remarkable resurgence, upending Denison 68-65. Denison is now 5-3 in the conference; the 5 wins are the most since their 11-win campaign five seasons ago, and the season is only at the halfway mark. Also, Wabash wins at Kenyon 60-56, and Hiram drops Oberlin 80-63. As you have no doubt been informed while I am typing this, Wooster leads Wittenberg at the half by the NBA-like score of 57-50.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 17, 2015, 10:17:52 PM
The team Wooster is going to have to watch out for is Marietta in the NCAA tournament. I know Marietta has had soft opponents the last two games but that is one good team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on January 17, 2015, 10:57:18 PM
:o Wooster 104 Wittenberg 97  Whew!  Witt was anything but it's record (4-10) in its matchup with the Scots.

Holy COW!  I'm still breathless.  That tired, boring cliche "throw out the record books" when these to teams collide was certainly apropos tonight at Timken Gym.  Oh, did I forget to say -- throw out defense while you are at it.  Witt's 57.6% edged Woo's 55.2% for field goals.  Both teams bombarded the other with dizzying displays of successive and relentless 3-pointers: Woo shot 58.3% (14 of 24) while Witt nailed 56.3% from downtown (13 of 23). 

The Tigers repeatedly confounded the Scots in the first half with seemingly endless penetrations for easy layups, although the Scots filled the breaches a little better in the second half.  Indeed, super aggressive defense during the last 6 or 7 minutes sealed the win for the Black & Gold.  On the other hand, Witt nudged out Woo on the boards (30 to 28) and nearly doubled the Scots' points in the paint (40 to 22) while matching Wooster's second half points output (47 to 47). 

If this is game is an indication of what the second half of the season looks like for Witt, look out NCAC!  Wooster now holds the barest of victory margins in their 102 year-old rivalry, 55 to 54.  Grab a hold of something secure, folks, the second half of the season could be a real Nantucket sleigh ride!  And then... there's the next three years considering how strong Witt's youth brigade is coming on!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 17, 2015, 11:50:41 PM
Evan Pannell had an athletic dunk over a poor Wittenberg player in the first half of Wooster's win tonight.  ;D  :)  The Wooster bench went nuts after the dunk!  ;)

Here is a link to a video clip of the dunk:  www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUMhSGtD_xE   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 18, 2015, 12:23:37 AM
Quote from: Eco-manblue on January 17, 2015, 10:57:18 PM
:o Wooster 104 Wittenberg 97  Whew!  Witt was anything but it's record (4-10) in its matchup with the Scots.

Holy COW!  I'm still breathless.  That tired, boring cliche "throw out the record books" when these to teams collide was certainly apropos tonight at Timken Gym.  Oh, did I forget to say -- throw out defense while you are at it.  Witt's 57.6% edged Woo's 55.2% for field goals.  Both teams bombarded the other with dizzying displays of successive and relentless 3-pointers: Woo shot 58.3% (14 of 24) while Witt nailed 56.3% from downtown (13 of 23). 

The Tigers repeatedly confounded the Scots in the first half with seemingly endless penetrations for easy layups, although the Scots filled the breaches a little better in the second half.  Indeed, super aggressive defense during the last 6 or 7 minutes sealed the win for the Black & Gold.  On the other hand, Witt nudged out Woo on the boards (30 to 28) and nearly doubled the Scots' points in the paint (40 to 22) while matching Wooster's second half points output (47 to 47). 

If this is game is an indication of what the second half of the season looks like for Witt, look out NCAC!  Wooster now holds the barest of victory margins in their 102 year-old rivalry, 55 to 54.  Grab a hold of something secure, folks, the second half of the season could be a real Nantucket sleigh ride!  And then... there's the next three years considering how strong Witt's youth brigade is coming on!

In the last few minutes, Wittenberg did a John Carroll, hitting threes from DEEP and even banking one in, keeping themselves just barely in the ballgame.  Then, they pulled a Wittenberg, fouling hard with just seconds left and the game clearly over.

Wooster had lots of trouble with them inside, at both ends.  This is why I said last week that I'd hate to see Witt end up matching up with Wooster in the first round.  It would be far from a piece of cake, as they're clearly a better team than their record indicates.

Pannell's dunk was amazing, although it might have been an offensive foul.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2015, 10:16:07 AM
I hope this performance by the Auld Tigers brings the Witt supporters out of the woodwork on here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on January 18, 2015, 07:31:04 PM
I watched the video several times of Pannell's lovely smash dunk against the Witt defender.  I too thought the defender may have planted his feet.  Anybody know the precise NCAA rule on this?  A friend is a ref at the high school level here in Maine; I may look on-line, too.  I wonder if the same rule applies at the collegiate and high school level?  Obviously, it's going to be viewed and interpreted by the ref and she/he is the final judge, but now I'm curious.  Anybody have insight on this?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 19, 2015, 09:40:39 AM
Quote from: Eco-manblue on January 18, 2015, 07:31:04 PM
I watched the video several times of Pannell's lovely smash dunk against the Witt defender.  I too thought the defender may have planted his feet.  Anybody know the precise NCAA rule on this?  A friend is a ref at the high school level here in Maine; I may look on-line, too.  I wonder if the same rule applies at the collegiate and high school level?  Obviously, it's going to be viewed and interpreted by the ref and she/he is the final judge, but now I'm curious.  Anybody have insight on this?

There's nothing that college basketball is more inconsistent about and gets wrong more often than block/charge.  I'm inclined to call nothing on that play because it was so close either way and I don't really want to take that dunk away from Pannell and I don't need to pile on that poor kid who just got abused.  But that's a cop out on my part- there was contact, it was outside the restricted area, so it's a foul one way or the other.  Slowed down, maybe you can see the defender plant before Pannell takes off.  In real speed, it looks like the defender is still sliding.  I don't know what the right call is.  I do know that dunk was nasty.  You don't see that kind of thing very often in D3. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: KnightSlappy on January 19, 2015, 10:24:59 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 19, 2015, 09:40:39 AM
Quote from: Eco-manblue on January 18, 2015, 07:31:04 PM
I watched the video several times of Pannell's lovely smash dunk against the Witt defender.  I too thought the defender may have planted his feet.  Anybody know the precise NCAA rule on this?  A friend is a ref at the high school level here in Maine; I may look on-line, too.  I wonder if the same rule applies at the collegiate and high school level?  Obviously, it's going to be viewed and interpreted by the ref and she/he is the final judge, but now I'm curious.  Anybody have insight on this?

There's nothing that college basketball is more inconsistent about and gets wrong more often than block/charge.  I'm inclined to call nothing on that play because it was so close either way and I don't really want to take that dunk away from Pannell and I don't need to pile on that poor kid who just got abused.  But that's a cop out on my part- there was contact, it was outside the restricted area, so it's a foul one way or the other.  Slowed down, maybe you can see the defender plant before Pannell takes off.  In real speed, it looks like the defender is still sliding.  I don't know what the right call is.  I do know that dunk was nasty.  You don't see that kind of thing very often in D3.

Rule 4-17.4:
When the opponent with the ball is airborne, the guard shall have attained legal guarding position before the opponent begins his upward motion with his hands/arms to shoot or pass.

(emphasis mine)

I believe this rule was modified prior to the 2013-14 season. I heard Calvin's coach Kevin Vande Streek explain the interpretation to mean the defender must be set/planted when the offensive player begins his gather (which could occur even step before his feet leave the ground). It seems clear to me the defender was still sliding his trailing foot when Pannel was "beginning his upward motion with his hands/arms". I think the referees called it correctly in this case.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on January 21, 2015, 09:57:30 PM
 ;D Wooster hiccuped at the onset of the it's game with Allegheny tonight.  Down 22 to 21 or so, the Scotts shifted gears, hit the groove, and the gas, and it was bye-bye.  Halftime was 54 to 31 and the final topped the century mark for the second time in two games, 104 to 73.  The Black and Gold shot 58% or 34 of 59 field goals for the game (61% in the first half).  55% on tres and 89% from the foul line (25 of 28).  The Scots jumping jacks out bounded the Gators, 45 to 30. 

Worst thing about the game:  Yes, you guessed it: The AV system.  This time, I assume it was Allegheny's Rube Goldberg clunker-of-a-system.  It died out completely before the start of the second half.  Only audio from WQKT-AM in Wooster.   :-[ :P :( >:(  Allegheny's video commentary in the first half was straight out of Wayne's World -- inane, always stating the obvious, a waste of time and space.  Where do they get these guys?  The play-by-play announcer was tolerable; the "color commentator" was colorless and clueless.  If EPA had been on the job, he would have been fined for polluting the air(waves). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 21, 2015, 10:27:57 PM
They are probably students.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashcpa on January 21, 2015, 11:40:05 PM
I think guarding Luke Lattner might be a good idea.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 22, 2015, 05:23:35 PM
DePauw 75, Wabash 58...nothing like a good rivalry game to right the ship
Denison 72, Hiram 63
OWU 86, Oberlin 61
Wittenberg 73, Kenyon 62
Wooster 104, Allegheny 73

1. OWU 8-1/13-3
1. Wooster 8-1/14-2
3. Wabash 6-3/11-5
4. Allegheny 5-4/8-8
5. DePauw 4-5/11-5
6. Denison 3-6/9-7
6. Hiram 3-6/9-7
6. Kenyon 3-6/5-11
6. Wittenberg 3-6/5-11
10. Oberlin 2-7/6-10

Coming up Saturday:
Wabash at Oberlin
Hiram at Kenyon
Allegheny at Wittenberg
DePauw at Wooster
OWU at Denison
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 22, 2015, 10:37:07 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 22, 2015, 05:23:35 PM
DePauw 75, Wabash 58...nothing like a good rivalry game to right the ship

Yeah...Luke Lattner played like Laettner (Duke Laettner, not Atlanta Laettner) and there's not a whole lot you can do when a team is willing to settle for perimeter shots all day and they make a high percentage.  It happens...wasn't Wabash's day. 

I believe that brings us to the halfway point of the league season, yes?  Everybody has played each other once?  Quickie first half thoughts- Wabash and Allegheny have been pleasantly surprising, I think.  Wabash/Allegheny/DePauw- one of these three won't host a quarterfinal game.  Allegheny has the hammer here hosting both of the Indiana schools when they go east. 

Wooster and OWU are playing to expectations, I think.  Wooster is solid as always.  I'm a little confused at how OWU can shoot 30 3FGS per game and be 8-1.  That's a tough way to win consistently.  I think they'll drop a couple of more games in the second half and Wooster will win the league. 

And then there's the lower five in the league.  Witt's best game of the year might have been their loss at Wooster, coming on the heels of consecutive wins.  They might be figuring some things out,  I think you have to figure that it takes at least 8-8 to be in play for the fourth spot and a home game...seems like a tall order, although I think we can probably squash the idea that Witt might not make the league tournament. 

Interesting league race this season.  The home stretch here is going to be fun to watch. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on January 22, 2015, 11:59:33 PM
Wally - I agree that Allegheny and Wabash are the biggest successful surprises on the season.  DePauw (with 5 league losses) and Witt (with 6 league losses) are the biggest "disappointments" thus far as they were picked 2nd and 3rd in the league.  OWU has exceeded expectations so far and Wooster is always Wooster and at the top.  The biggest surprise is the disparity in wins half way through the schedule.  OWU and Wooster having 4 game leads in the race to host a quarterfinal game is shocking.  I expected multiple teams to be battling for the #2 spot behind the Fighting Scots!  I also think the league is Woosters to lose.  Wooster at OWU is coming up in the next few weeks. 

Bigger question, what are the NCAC's chances of getting multiple teams in the NCAA Tournament?  The OAC has several high quality teams that will be competing for at-large berths, as does the MIAA.  If OWU loses a few more as you predict, will they need a conference tourney championship to get in? Can DePauw or anyone else (other than OWU and Wooster) make a run at an at-large bid or are they eliminated?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 23, 2015, 12:29:04 AM
OWU and Wooster all have SOS over .500, which is good. I think they're both in barring a massive collapse. I think they'll do well in the regional rankings...

The other 8 have to win the tourney to get in.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 23, 2015, 06:46:26 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 23, 2015, 12:29:04 AM
OWU and Wooster all have SOS over .500, which is good. I think they're both in barring a massive collapse. I think they'll do well in the regional rankings...

The other 8 have to win the tourney to get in.

Still a long way to go of course.  Knightslappy has his regional rankings on his blog  http://tomaroonandgold.blogspot.com/p/division-iii-mens-regional-rankings.html

At present time Ohio Wesleyan is about the #17 Pool C, firmly on the bubble.  No one else from the GL is in position for a C at this time. :-\   But there are some goofy things going on out East, a lot of higher ranked teams on KS's chart aren't leading their conferences.

Its fluid, but traditionally the GL has been pretty average to below average grabbing Pool C's.  Almost all of them have been teams that won their regular season conference title and lost in their tournament.  Marietta will almost be a lock by the first regional ranking, the NCAC is too strong to call Wooster or OWU a lock at this point imo.


These teams are all in the top 70 on KS's chart and with strong finishes would be Pool C material.
Marietta
Wooster
Ohio Wesleyan
Mt. Union
St. Vincent
PSU-Behrend
Case Reserve
Calvin
John Carroll
Hope

Behrend and Case Reserve don't have strong SOS numbers right now.  Case will go up as they ply through the meat of their UAA schedule the next 4 weeks.

After that group

Mt. St. Joseph, despite being 12-3 right now would be a poor Pool C candidate due to SOS
Medaille, low SOS
Trine, work to do
Baldwin Wallace, work to do


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 23, 2015, 09:45:59 AM
At-large talk...now we're talking.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 23, 2015, 10:44:46 AM
OWU at Denison could be interesting this weekend. Yes OWU should win but Denison finally put a good game together the other night and being a rivalry you never know. Very much looking forward to next Wednesday night's game between Wooster and OWU. It will be interesting who has more fans at the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 24, 2015, 04:48:16 PM
Quote from: ohiofan1954 on January 23, 2015, 10:44:46 AM
OWU at Denison could be interesting this weekend. Yes OWU should win but Denison finally put a good game together the other night and being a rivalry you never know. Very much looking forward to next Wednesday night's game between Wooster and OWU. It will be interesting who has more fans at the game.

Denison leads wire-to-wire, including being up by as much as 21, and the survives OWU's second half charge to notch a 73-70 over OWU.

After being down much of the afternoon, Wooster escapes at home against DPU thanks to a Evan Pannell 3 with 20 seconds left to give the Scots a 63-62 win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 24, 2015, 05:21:43 PM
The struggles were not limited to the top 2. Third-placed Wabash fell at last-place Oberlin, 75-67. Fourth-placed Allegheny got flattened at resurgent Wittenberg, 59-38; Witt is now just one game out of fourth place.  Elsewhere, homestanding Kenyon drops Hiram 85-74.

Losses by four of the top five teams today: Carnage. That Pannell three-pointer is looking like the shot of the season right now.

1. Wooster 9-1/15-2
2. OWU 8-2/13-4
3. Wabash 6-4/11-6
4. Allegheny 5-5/8-9
5. DePauw 4-6/11-6
5. Denison 4-6/10-7
5. Kenyon 4-6/6-11
5. Wittenberg 4-6/6-11
9. Hiram 3-7/9-8
9. Oberlin 3-7/7-10

Wednesday's games, four big games led by the battle for #1.
Wooster at OWU
Wittenberg at Wabash
Hiram at Allegheny
Denison at DePauw
Kenyon at Oberlin
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on January 24, 2015, 05:57:41 PM
Yes, Pannell's Tres was huge -- as were the three preceding 3 ptrs -- the only points for the Scots in the last 6:50 of the game.  I'm thanking the stars for Wooster's age old tradition of being an high percentage FT shooting team.  If Woo won it on its outside shooting at the end, DePauw lost the game on FTs, cashing in on a comparatively ice cold 43.8% (7-16) on a day when the Scots went efficiently about their task at the foul line, nailing 80% (16-20) in a workman-like manner.

Wooster was horrendous in the paint: only 6 pts. in the valley of the jolly green giant, 6'9" Tommy Fernitz.  On the other hand, Depauw virtually waltzed through that zone for 24 of their 62 pts.  Depauw also snared twice as many offensive rebs (11-5) and capitalized on those, ringing up 14 second-chance pts. vs. only 3 for the Scots.

One bright spot: Wooster treated DePauw to a "block party"-- slapping down 9 shots while the Tigers only stuffed two.

Crossing my fingers crossed, knocking on wood, and saying my prayers to the Great Gods & Goddesses of The Game In The Sky that Coach Moore & Co. can help right the ship before Wednesday's "all-in" showdown at OWU! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 24, 2015, 08:31:23 PM
Wooster was very fortunate to get the "W" today as they played a miserable first half vs. DePauw.  Scots shot only 28.6% in the half with 9 turnovers.  Most high school teams don't win their games when they score only 21 points in a half.  ::)   On the other hand, 42 points in the second half was just enough!  ;)

As Eco-manblue noted, Wooster's last four made shots of the game were all huge three pointers:
Jalen Goodwin three pointer to get the Scots to 54 points...
Ari Stern three pointer to get them to 57...
Another Ari Stern three pointer to get them to 60...  This was a huge shot by the freshman as Wooster was down 4 points with ~39 seconds left
Evan Pannell three pointer to get them to 63 and ultimately the win when DePauw did not convert on their last possession.

Very impressed with Ari Stern.  He takes good care of the ball, plays aggressive defense and nails shots when he is open.  :)

Next Wednesday's game at Ohio Wesleyan will be very important in deciding who wins the NCAC regular season title.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 24, 2015, 11:41:05 PM
Fannelly's defense on Fernitz in the last 15 minutes or so really changed the game.  Given a little more help, he was very active and used his quickness to deny the entry pass.  Excellent work against a considerably bigger guy.

Sometimes it's actually a positive to have a guard on the court who isn't looking to score.  A Jalen Goodwin, an Ari Stern.  Somewhat similar players, although Goodwin can on occasion get to the hoop.  With one of these guys on the court, the other more prolific scorers get more shots.  And, neither can be left completely unguarded, because they are both able to bury a three.

On a side note, over the last few weeks I finally got around to watching the last two and a half seasons of The Wire.  Fantastic show, right up there with The West Wing, The Sopranos, Breaking Bad, and Friday Night Lights.  Bunk and Lester are good police.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on January 25, 2015, 09:44:43 PM
 :o  So I watched a video replay of Saturday's Denison-OWU game and IF the Big Red can consistently stitch together 2 halves like their first half against OWU, look out opponents!  Denison did everything right in dismantling OWU (granted, OWU's defense is not generally the best but it's not shabby either).  Regardless the Big Red shot 62% in the first half and whether it was inside or outside shots, they got open and flushed them down. OWU had no answer as the lead built inexorably to 47-27 at the half.  Yeah, even poor teams occasionally pull together terrific halves but frankly, I think Wooster or some of the other better D3 teams would have been flummoxed last night against them. 

Couple of other interesting notes:  Denison got 25 pts. from its bench -- OWU got... 0 (not a typo, that's zero!). On the other hand, Freshman Nate Alexrod (22 pts. and 7 rebs.) was the one bright flash for OWU on an otherwise dim evening.  He's an energizer bunny with the skills to penetrate and pump them in from downtown.  I imagine (read: hope) Coach Moore & Co. have taken note in preparation for Wednesday's NCAC headliner against the Bishops...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 25, 2015, 10:54:06 PM
Two best freshmen in the NCAC:

Player #1
15.8 points/game   53.2% FG   49.2% 3PT   82.2% FT   2.3 RPG   5.6 APG
#4 in NCAC Scoring, #1 in Three Point Shooting %, #1 in Assists per Game

Player #2
10.8 points/game   46.3% FG   44.7% 3PT   72.2% FT   2.4 RPG   3.5 APG
#21 in NCAC Scoring, #4 in Three Point Shooting %, #3 in Assists per Game

Player #1 is OWU Freshman Nate Axelrod
Player #2 is Wooster Freshman Spencer Williams

Any other year, Spencer Williams would be NCAC freshmen of the year.  It will be Nate Axelrod this season given his terrific stats and 17 games starting.
Among the NCAC freshmen, #3 in scoring is Kelvin Jones of Hiram at 8.1 points/game and #4 is Chad Roy of Witt at 7.1 points/game

As Eco-manblue noted, slowing down Nate Axelrod is a key factor for Wooster on Wednesday night.

However, Wooster also needs to contain Claude Gray who leads all NCAC players (#1 in Scoring) at 18.9 points/game.  Ohio Wesleyan is undefeated at home this season (7-0) with all of their losses on the road.  Tough task to get a road win in Delaware.

Should be a great game Wednesday as Wooster will be trying to avenge their only NCAC loss to date.  ;)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 26, 2015, 10:08:15 AM
Quote from: Eco-manblue on January 25, 2015, 09:44:43 PM
Couple of other interesting notes:  Denison got 25 pts. from its bench -- OWU got... 0 (not a typo, that's zero!). On the other hand, Freshman Nate Alexrod (22 pts. and 7 rebs.) was the one bright flash for OWU on an otherwise dim evening.  He's an energizer bunny with the skills to penetrate and pump them in from downtown.  I imagine (read: hope) Coach Moore & Co. have taken note in preparation for Wednesday's NCAC headliner against the Bishops...

A little behind the numbers on this- OWU's starters played 184 of the available 200 minutes in the game, including all 100 minutes of the second half (that's right- no substitutions in the second half for OWU).  The bench can't score if the bench isn't in the game.  And I'll say it again- they shoot too many 3s.  They are going to shoot 800 3s this year, you guys.  It's great when you make half of them and you score 85 points, but when you make a third of those shots, you're in trouble.  It got them at Wabash, it got them at Denison, and I don't think that's the last time we'll get a "wow, really OWU?" result before the postseason.  Especially if Mike DeWitt doesn't think he has anybody on the bench who can help, and apparently he doesn't. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 26, 2015, 03:14:45 PM
Darn, I passed up a great wind for the Big Red just to watch my Bobcats?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on January 26, 2015, 04:22:28 PM
I would really like to make the 10 minute drive up 23 to see the Scots take on OWU, but I have a work engagement that night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 26, 2015, 04:39:16 PM
If you make 1/3 of your threes, it's just as good as shooting 50% from two point land, though.

Shoot 12 thees, hit four - that's 12 points. Shoot 12 twos, hit six - that's 12 points.

The key is to rebound those missed threes...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 28, 2015, 10:12:16 AM
Quote from: smedindy on January 26, 2015, 04:39:16 PM
If you make 1/3 of your threes, it's just as good as shooting 50% from two point land, though.

Shoot 12 thees, hit four - that's 12 points. Shoot 12 twos, hit six - that's 12 points.

The key is to rebound those missed threes...


This is all true mathematically...I don't want get too deep into the basketball analytics because that's not an area I know a ton about.  There's a quality of shot component in play here and if you don't shoot 50% on your 2s, you're still in a position to score points through drawing fouls and what not.  Yes, three point shooters get fouled occasionally (very occasionally), but when you're that reliant on that shot, you're counting on makes in a way that you don't always have to count on if you're playing through the post. 

Really, really interesting set of midweek games tonight.  Things could get real bunchy under the top 2 after tonight. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 28, 2015, 08:16:30 PM
Claude Gray has now made nine three-pointers against Wooster with a defender all over him.  He's either the best shooter since Chip Hilton or the luckiest son of lumberjack that ever lived.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on January 28, 2015, 10:11:50 PM
OWU 92, Wooster 85.....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2015, 10:25:40 PM
DePauw 69, Denison 68
Oberlin 62, Kenyon 50
Allegheny 69, Hiram 59
Wittenberg 67, Wabash 51

All the home teams prevailed, except at Wabash, where Wittenberg moved within one game of third place.

1. OWU 9-2/14-4
1. Wooster 9-2/15-3
3. Wabash 6-5/11-7
3. Allegheny 6-5/9-9
5. DePauw 5-6/12-6
5. Wittenberg 5-6/7-11
7. Denison 4-7/10-8
7. Kenyon 4-7/6-12
7. Oberlin 4-7/8-10
10. Hiram 3-8/9-9

Saturday:
OWU at Hiram
Wooster at Wabash
Oberlin at DePauw
Wittenberg at Denison
Allegheny at Kenyon
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on January 28, 2015, 10:46:07 PM
OWU 92, Wooster 85.....

:'(
I'll have a blue Christmas without Woo.
I'll be so blue just thinking about Woo.
Palpitations bled, Woo's loss has gone my head.
Won't be the same, dear, as OWU makes another 3, oh me.

And as those blue baskets started falling
That's when those blue memories started calling
OWU'll be doin' all right with Woo's Christmas of white
But I'll have a blue, blue, blue, blue Christmas
OWU'll be doin' all right with Woo's Christmas of white
But I'll have a blue, blue, blue, blue Christmas   :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 28, 2015, 11:00:32 PM
Wittenberg's gonna screw around and host a game and then make trouble in the tourney, aren't they??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 28, 2015, 11:02:20 PM
Please Scots, can  you just please hit a ft? By my count you hit 1 of 7 in the second half. Tell #22  to stop crying if you can't make shots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 28, 2015, 11:09:40 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 28, 2015, 11:00:32 PM
Wittenberg's gonna screw around and host a game and then make trouble in the tourney, aren't they??

Sounds about right.  Someone neglected to drive the spike thru Dracula's heart when he was down! ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 28, 2015, 11:21:09 PM
That must have been the Denison game. The Big Red had them on the ropes at half and the Tigers took it too them after that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on January 28, 2015, 11:55:32 PM
Wooster had an early opportunity to open a 10-15 point lead and failed to do so.  OWU had open threes, very good looks, but nothing was going down.  Meanwhile, Wooster decided to continually turn the ball over.  So, when Claude Gray finally went off, it was problematic for the Scots.

Wooster's second half free throw shooting was abysmal, and it wasn't just one guy.  About four players in a row missed very short off the front rim.  That was the killer, as it was because of this that the game got out of hand.

The Scots still struggle against good zones.  Their ball movement is still mostly around the perimeter and predictable; very little inside-outside.  In the end, it's usually a few guys taking turns trying to beat two or three defenders off the bounce.  Never a good idea.

Wooster is in some trouble now.  Tied with OWU for the lead, but the tiebreaker belongs with the BeeBees.  Tough games left for Wooster would be at Wabash and Wittenberg.  OWU also has Witt on the road, along with DePauw in Indiana and Wabash in Branch Rickey Arena.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 29, 2015, 07:38:37 AM
Props where they're due.  OWU's video feed was outstanding.  Additionally their software didn't block my ability to Chromecast the game to my big screen which made the game that much more enjoyable.  Wooster could / should learn something here.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 29, 2015, 09:29:46 PM
Clearly, barring some unprecedented collapse, OWU and Wooster will finish 1-2 in this league, and OWU is in the driver's seat. However, with seven games remaining, there's still lots of wiggle room. It boils down to one simple formula: OWU needs to win at least as many of those seven as Wooster does. Over the years, and continuing into this year, Wooster's strength has been to win the games they are "supposed" to win. They are tied with OWU because OWU has lost two of those games while the Scots have not. As WB notes, Wooster's toughest games remaining are this Saturday at Wabash and two weeks later at Wittenberg. I would say it is highly likely that Wooster wins at least 5 and probably 6 more games. OWU will thus have to step up and also win 5 or 6 (or maybe even seven) games, which means they probably need to win two of the the three games WB points out (Witt, DPU, Wabash) AND not slip up against the Alleghenys and Hirams. This race could come down to the final Saturday, when Wooster plays at Oberlin, a team they haven't lost to in something like 25 years, while OWU goes to DePauw, one of the toughest venues in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 29, 2015, 11:31:12 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 29, 2015, 09:29:46 PM
Clearly, barring some unprecedented collapse, OWU and Wooster will finish 1-2 in this league, and OWU is in the driver's seat. However, with seven games remaining, there's still lots of wiggle room. It boils down to one simple formula: OWU needs to win at least as many of those seven as Wooster does. Over the years, and continuing into this year, Wooster's strength has been to win the games they are "supposed" to win. They are tied with OWU because OWU has lost two of those games while the Scots have not. As WB notes, Wooster's toughest games remaining are this Saturday at Wabash and two weeks later at Wittenberg. I would say it is highly likely that Wooster wins at least 5 and probably 6 more games. OWU will thus have to step up and also win 5 or 6 (or maybe even seven) games, which means they probably need to win two of the the three games WB points out (Witt, DPU, Wabash) AND not slip up against the Alleghenys and Hirams. This race could come down to the final Saturday, when Wooster plays at Oberlin, a team they haven't lost to in something like 25 years, while OWU goes to DePauw, one of the toughest venues in the NCAC.
great info David , points certainly worth considering. Anything can happen down the stretch. Would be interesting to see the NCAC championships at OWU this year. Make it easier for me to get there also.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on January 30, 2015, 06:36:59 AM
OWU is in the drivers seat but I would still put my money on Wooster winning the league and hosting the NCAC tournament.   And I don't think anybody wants to play a hard-charging Witt. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 30, 2015, 10:44:37 AM
For whatever reason, OWU seems to have Wooster's number at the moment.  That said, I don't think Wooster is losing again in the regular season.  I do think OWU is going to have a night where they shoot 6-30 on 3s and lose to Hiram or something ridiculous like that.  That'll put OWU in a spot where they need to win the NCAC tournament on Wooster's floor to get into the dance.  THAT is a fun game. 

In any case, despite OWU's 2-0 h2h against Wooster, I still prefer Wooster's consistency to OWU's live by/die by 3FG game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 30, 2015, 11:12:40 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 30, 2015, 10:44:37 AM
For whatever reason, OWU seems to have Wooster's number at the moment.  That said, I don't think Wooster is losing again in the regular season.  I do think OWU is going to have a night where they shoot 6-30 on 3s and lose to Hiram or something ridiculous like that.  That'll put OWU in a spot where they need to win the NCAC tournament on Wooster's floor to get into the dance.  THAT is a fun game. 

In any case, despite OWU's 2-0 h2h against Wooster, I still prefer Wooster's consistency to OWU's live by/die by 3FG game.
While I agree OWU depends too much on the three Wooster had no answer for that guard the other night driving and beating guy a foot taller.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on January 30, 2015, 12:20:02 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 30, 2015, 10:44:37 AM
For whatever reason, OWU seems to have Wooster's number at the moment.  That said, I don't think Wooster is losing again in the regular season.  I do think OWU is going to have a night where they shoot 6-30 on 3s and lose to Hiram or something ridiculous like that.  That'll put OWU in a spot where they need to win the NCAC tournament on Wooster's floor to get into the dance.  THAT is a fun game. 

In any case, despite OWU's 2-0 h2h against Wooster, I still prefer Wooster's consistency to OWU's live by/die by 3FG game.

OWU does seem to have the Scots number this year.  I think OWU still gets in even if they lose one more regular season game and get to the NCAC title game, even if they lose there as well.   I don't see Wooster losing another regular season game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 30, 2015, 04:19:22 PM
I still disagree with the notion that OWU is rather all-or-nothing. They're 69th in 3PT FG percentage and 72nd in overall FG percentage in the nation. They don't shoot threes in an abnormal manner to how they shoot twos.

What is the key to OWU, I would say, is their ability to hang on to the ball. They're 5th in the nation in turnovers and 4th in assist / turnover ratio.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 31, 2015, 07:20:50 AM
Good interview with coach Moore on the marathon today.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 31, 2015, 05:03:48 PM
Things got a lot easier for OWU today. And somebody please explain Wittenberg to me.

DePauw 51, Oberlin 50
Denison 75, Wittenberg 72
Allegheny 59, Kenyon 56
Wabash 68, Wooster 65
OWU 70, Hiram 64

1. OWU 10-2/15-4
2. Wooster 9-3/15-4
3. Wabash 7-5/12-7
3. Allegheny 7-5/10-9
5. DePauw 6-6/13-6
6. Denison 5-7/11-8
6. Wittenberg 5-7/7-12
8. Oberlin 4-8/8-11
8. Kenyon 4-8/6-13
10. Hiram 3-9/9-10

Next up (Wednesday unless otherwise indicated):
OWU at Wittenberg
Oberlin at Denison
Wooster at Kenyon
Wabash at Hiram (Friday)
DePauw at Allegheny (Friday)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 31, 2015, 05:43:55 PM
David, not even Martin Luther would be able to explain Wittenberg! ;D  And they will now probably blow out OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on January 31, 2015, 06:17:25 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 31, 2015, 05:03:48 PM
Things got a lot easier for OWU today. And somebody please explain Wittenberg to me.

DePauw 51, Oberlin 50
Denison 75, Wittenberg 72
Allegheny 59, Kenyon 56
Wabash 68, Wooster 65
OWU 70, Hiram 64

1. OWU 10-2/15-4
2. Wooster 9-3/15-4
3. Wabash 7-5/12-7
3. Allegheny 7-5/10-9
5. DePauw 6-6/13-6
6. Denison 5-7/11-8
6. Wittenberg 5-7/7-12
8. Oberlin 4-8/8-11
8. Kenyon 4-8/6-13
10. Hiram 3-9/9-10

Next up (Wednesday unless otherwise indicated):
OWU at Wittenberg
Oberlin at Denison
Wooster at Kenyon
Wabash at Hiram (Friday)
DePauw at Allegheny (Friday)
Wittenberg run started with Denison. It ends with Denison.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2015, 07:55:50 PM
Good win, LGs! Way to compete and hopefully host a game!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 31, 2015, 07:58:20 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 31, 2015, 05:43:55 PM
David, not even Martin Luther would be able to explain Wittenberg! ;D  And they will now probably blow out OWU.

Is Wittenberg going to capitulate this year?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on January 31, 2015, 11:46:45 PM
Quote from: smedindy on January 31, 2015, 07:58:20 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 31, 2015, 05:43:55 PM
David, not even Martin Luther would be able to explain Wittenberg! ;D  And they will now probably blow out OWU.

Is Wittenberg going to capitulate this year?

As weird as their year has been, I expect they'll lose a couple more head-scratchers, then sweep the NCAC tourney and end up in Salem! ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 01, 2015, 11:19:54 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on January 31, 2015, 05:43:55 PM
David, not even Martin Luther would be able to explain Wittenberg! ;D  And they will now probably blow out OWU.
Luther might just wonder if he stands and can't do otherwise if he saw what has happened at both Wittenberg and Capital this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 02, 2015, 11:20:10 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 31, 2015, 05:03:48 PM
3. Wabash 7-5/12-7
3. Allegheny 7-5/10-9
5. DePauw 6-6/13-6

Huge, huge, huge back-to-backs this weekend for the teams at the geographic extremes.  Allegheny can seal up h2h over Wabash, DePauw can play their way into a top 4 spot, Wabash can solidify a top 4 spot.  Lots of possibilities here- and Hiram lurks as a wild card- Wabash needed some buzzer beating heroics and a couple of overtimes to get by the Terriers the first time around.  Getting into crunch time here and these head-to-heads amongst the teams bunched up there around the top 4 cut line will be fun to track this weekend. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 02, 2015, 01:37:56 PM
There's no patsy in the NCAC this year. Anyone can surprise and win a game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 03, 2015, 04:02:31 PM
The Columbus Dispatch has actually taken some time to cover the Bishops. They released this piece about Axelrod.

http://buckeyextra.dispatch.com/content/stories/2015/02/03/cbk-ohio-insider-2-3-art-gni10a2a7-1.html
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 04, 2015, 07:14:35 AM
Quote from: Bishopleftiesdad on February 03, 2015, 04:02:31 PM
The Columbus Dispatch has actually taken some time to cover the Bishops. They released this piece about Axelrod.

http://buckeyextra.dispatch.com/content/stories/2015/02/03/cbk-ohio-insider-2-3-art-gni10a2a7-1.html
That is amazing. Any space they give to anyone other then A&M is very surprising. Axelrod deserves it. As I mentioned in a earlier post it was fun watching him blow by guys a foot taller then him at the Wooster game leaving them wondering just what happened.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 04, 2015, 09:16:00 PM
OWU squeeks by witt 49-47
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2015, 10:05:02 AM
Quote from: Bishopleftiesdad on February 04, 2015, 09:16:00 PM
OWU squeeks by witt 49-47

That's a tough result for Witt.  When you hold that crew to under 50 and have a shot to basically take a game back on the field, you really need to lock that up. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 05, 2015, 12:05:57 PM
Wittenberg has to win out and make the Championship game of the NCAC Tournament to avoid its first losing season in almost 60 years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 05, 2015, 12:41:12 PM
Meanwhile:

Wooster SQUEAKED by Kenyon 93-91.  No comments from the Scots gallery?

Denison pounded Oberlin 90-68.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 05, 2015, 12:41:38 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 05, 2015, 10:05:02 AM
Quote from: Bishopleftiesdad on February 04, 2015, 09:16:00 PM
OWU squeeks by witt 49-47

That's a tough result for Witt.  When you hold that crew to under 50 and have a shot to basically take a game back on the field, you really need to lock that up.

The ship be sinking...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on February 05, 2015, 02:48:37 PM
Although it is not a fun result for the 14-15 Wittenberg team, what an amazing program accomplishment to go that long without a losing season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 05, 2015, 02:59:20 PM
I had to checkout the boxscore for OWU/Witt:  http://www.battlingbishops.com/boxscore.aspx?path=mbball&id=3427

OWU attempted 31 3-point shots and Witt had an 18 offensive rebounds to 4 advantage and still lost.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 05, 2015, 04:05:36 PM
Quote from: sac on February 05, 2015, 02:59:20 PM
I had to checkout the boxscore for OWU/Witt:  http://www.battlingbishops.com/boxscore.aspx?path=mbball&id=3427

OWU attempted 31 3-point shots and Witt had an 18 offensive rebounds to 4 advantage and still lost.

Claude Gray is really key for the Bishops and he's really hit the skids here over the last few weeks.  He was pedestrian in the losses to Wabash and Denison.  He was dynamite against Wooster.  And then last night he piped in a 2-11 performance in a game that OWU by all means probably should have lost (I don't suggest they limit their scoring to 49 points again this season if they want to win).  If OWU is going to win this league, he's going to have to get back to December Claude. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 05, 2015, 04:08:47 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 05, 2015, 12:41:12 PM
Meanwhile:

Wooster SQUEAKED by Kenyon 93-91.  No comments from the Scots gallery?

Denison pounded Oberlin 90-68.
This section of the Wooster (peanut) gallery missed the game.  Prepared to watch it, but then my senior memory chose to ignore my wishes.  I'm amazed.  As much as a 27-point lead, and to give that all away?  Wooster did something like that last year in Phoenix, but that was a good team; this was Kenyon.  No answers here, and it's sure looking more and more like the tournament will be played beneath the eyes of Branch Rickey.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 05, 2015, 04:10:38 PM
Claude Gray against Wooster is like Stan Musial hitting in Ebbets Field against the Brooklyn Dodgers.  Except Stash was pretty good versus the rest of the National League too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2015, 06:05:02 PM
Kenyon had 62 second-half points and in one stretch scored on 18 of 19 possessions, taking them from 27 points down (13:35) to tied (1:29). Jumpin' Jehosephat. That kind of defense will not fly in March.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 06, 2015, 10:46:03 PM
Condensed version of Wabash/Hiram tonight....Wabash jumped out to a 30-15 lead.  Hiram wiped that out to make it 33-33 at halftime.  Hiram led for all of the second half, by as many as 8, and then Austin Burton threw in a 70-footer (not a typo) at the horn to give Wabash a 73-72 win.  That shot may have saved Wabash's home game in the quarters.  On to Meadville tomorrow! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on February 06, 2015, 10:59:24 PM
VIDEO!

Sorry -- hope someone will have the video clip. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 06, 2015, 11:23:57 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on February 06, 2015, 10:59:24 PM
VIDEO!

Sorry -- hope someone will have the video clip. :)

I'm sure one is coming soon. We have a guy. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on February 07, 2015, 12:05:58 AM
Should have it soon Pat. I think I am that guy....  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on February 07, 2015, 12:07:40 AM
And here we go....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OhGwdoa_pI&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OhGwdoa_pI&feature=youtu.be)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2015, 08:19:32 AM
Wow! What a shot!

and

Wow! Are those Hiram uniforms terrible!

Elsewhere, in the aforementioned Meadville, DePauw nipped Allegheny 60-56.

Current:
1. OWU 11-2/16-4
2.Wooster 10-3/16-4
3. Wabash 8-5/13-7
4. DePauw 7-6/14-6
4. Allegheny 7-6/10-10
6. Denison 6-7/12-8
7. Wittenberg 5-8/7-13
8. Oberlin 4-9/8-12
8. Kenyon 4-9/6-14
10. Hiram 3-10/9-11

Today:
Wabash at Allegheny
DePauw at Hiram
Denison at Wooster
Oberlin at Wittenberg
Kenyon at OWU
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2015, 12:59:10 PM
Hiram could miss the tourney thanks to that shot.

Which serves them right - those SHORTS! UGH!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 07, 2015, 03:12:16 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 07, 2015, 12:59:10 PM
Hiram could miss the tourney thanks to that shot.

Which serves them right - those SHORTS! UGH!

My least favorite uniforms, in any sport, are those that are all one color.  Especially bright colors.  I have nothing against bright red, yellow, purple, orange, or whatever.  But I much prefer when those colors are paired with either white or black tops or bottoms.  Just my opinion.  So, c'mon Hiram, fight back into the tournament, and help the 'cause to  keep Witt out of the NCAA dance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ettaexpress on February 07, 2015, 07:09:34 PM
Quote from: wabashsid on February 07, 2015, 12:07:40 AM
And here we go....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OhGwdoa_pI&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OhGwdoa_pI&feature=youtu.be)

Should that have counted? Looks very close, and the horn would be after the lights.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2015, 07:28:15 PM
Quote from: ettaexpress on February 07, 2015, 07:09:34 PM
Quote from: wabashsid on February 07, 2015, 12:07:40 AM
And here we go....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OhGwdoa_pI&feature=youtu.be (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4OhGwdoa_pI&feature=youtu.be)

Should that have counted? Looks very close, and the horn would be after the lights.

I think that's just a low quality A/V situation. Didn't see anybody there question that shot when it happened.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ettaexpress on February 07, 2015, 07:31:04 PM
LOL well that doesn't say anything.

Just watched it several more times and I don't think there's any way he got that off even before the horn sounded. Sounded like it went off when it was still at his hip, even, not even close.

That ref in the foreground was probably already thinking about dinner.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 07, 2015, 07:58:17 PM
Quote from: ettaexpress on February 07, 2015, 07:31:04 PM
That ref in the foreground was probably already thinking about dinner.

I'm sure he wanted to get out of there but it wasn't headed to OT if the shot didn't count. The game would have ended one way or the other. No need to make the shot count to make a speedy exit.

My first view of the video I questioned if it was late, too. After viewing it a few times I just think the video is just choppy. The ball goes from his hands to the half court logo faster than Andrew Luck would have gotten it there. If you asked me to decide based on that video to overturn a call either way, I would say I couldn't. I'll take it, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ettaexpress on February 07, 2015, 08:06:46 PM
If you stop the video as soon as you hear the horn, I think it's pretty evident the ball's still in his hands.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2015, 08:18:52 PM
Quote from: ettaexpress on February 07, 2015, 08:06:46 PM
If you stop the video as soon as you hear the horn, I think it's pretty evident the ball's still in his hands.

Again, you're looking at a poor quality webstream clip (I'm being nice).  I watched that thing for about two hours.  The a/v sync isn't reliable. If the shot was clearly late in reality, I think you would have seen some protestations from players, coaches, fans...somebody. But there's none of that.  The shot must have been clean to those watching it live.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ettaexpress on February 07, 2015, 08:24:43 PM
Well I guess if no one noticed, it didn't happen.

Interesting logic.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2015, 08:25:39 PM
The Hiram announcer never questioned it....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2015, 08:30:17 PM
Quote from: ettaexpress on February 07, 2015, 08:24:43 PM
Well I guess if no one noticed, it didn't happen.

Interesting logic.

You're not real good with contexual clues, are you?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ettaexpress on February 07, 2015, 08:33:55 PM
You're not real good with video evidence are you? Unless you're suggesting that the video and audio are coming from different sources, what you're saying makes no sense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 07, 2015, 08:48:39 PM
Just to get my two cents in, it took me three looks to even figure out who got the rebound and shot the ball.  I could hardly follow the flight of the shot, even after several views, to know if it actually went in.  To make any determination based on that video, at least how it played out on my stream, would be just guessing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ettaexpress on February 07, 2015, 09:14:10 PM
Get glasses or something if you have that much trouble. It's not that bad a video, seen much worse.

I think the Wabash guy just doesn't want to admit the shot was late, as if it matters now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 07, 2015, 09:16:25 PM
You've done something, etta, you've united the biggest Wooster partisan and the Wabash fans. Good job, good effort.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on February 07, 2015, 09:26:02 PM
My oh my.  Looks like Delaware will be the site this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ettaexpress on February 07, 2015, 09:31:50 PM
Yeah well the truth does strange things sometimes.

As the video goes from 20 to 21, the horn goes off and the ball is still in his hands. Believe it or not, I really don't care.

At this point i'm really just laughing about Wooster losing to Denison at home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2015, 09:34:05 PM
Quote from: GoRed on February 07, 2015, 09:26:02 PM
My oh my.  Looks like Delaware will be the site this year.

That's worth a whoa. I believe that's three out of four for Wooster and I can't really remember the last time that's happened in league play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2015, 10:04:44 PM
Has Wooster played themselves on the bubble here?  If they don't win the automatic bid here, they're going to have six losses and the best win they'll have will be....looks like Mount Union.  Is that enough? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 07, 2015, 10:07:00 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 07, 2015, 10:04:44 PM
Has Wooster played themselves on the bubble here?  If they don't win the automatic bid here, they're going to have six losses and the best win they'll have will be....looks like Mount Union.  Is that enough?

Wins over St. Vincent, Hope and Mt Union should keep them in the middle of the GL rankings.  Enough so that they should be at the table.  They're in a big pack of teams now with 5 in-region losses but they still probably have the best criteria of those 5-loss teams.

Their margin for error has narrowed for sure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: iwumichigander on February 07, 2015, 10:40:25 PM
Quote from: sac on February 07, 2015, 10:07:00 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 07, 2015, 10:04:44 PM
Has Wooster played themselves on the bubble here?  If they don't win the automatic bid here, they're going to have six losses and the best win they'll have will be....looks like Mount Union.  Is that enough?

Wins over St. Vincent, Hope and Mt Union should keep them in the middle of the GL rankings.  Enough so that they should be at the table.  They're in a big pack of teams now with 5 in-region losses but they still probably have the best criteria of those 5-loss teams.

Their margin for error has narrowed for sure.
I think Woo still above the bubble.  In most years, probably not, but too many teams with 5,6,7 losses. I do think Woo has another loss, it better be the conference tournament final.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 07, 2015, 10:45:05 PM
For the record, the score was Denison 76, Wooster 72. The wheels are officially off in Wooster.
Elsewhere,
DePauw 75, Hiram 61
Wabash 63, Allegheny 49
Wittenberg 71, Oberlin 53
OWU 102, Kenyon 93

1. OWU 12-2/17-4
2. Wooster 10-4/16-5
3. Wabash 9-5/14-7
4. DePauw 8-6/15-6
5. Denison 7-7/13-8
5. Allegheny 7-7/10-11
7. Wittenberg 6-8/8-13
8. Oberlin 4-10/8-13
8. Kenyon 4-10/6-15
10. Hiram 3-11/9-12

First round matchup if nothing changes: Witt at Woo.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ettaexpress on February 07, 2015, 11:11:02 PM
Quote from: sac on February 07, 2015, 10:07:00 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 07, 2015, 10:04:44 PM
Has Wooster played themselves on the bubble here?  If they don't win the automatic bid here, they're going to have six losses and the best win they'll have will be....looks like Mount Union.  Is that enough?

Wins over St. Vincent, Hope and Mt Union should keep them in the middle of the GL rankings.  Enough so that they should be at the table.  They're in a big pack of teams now with 5 in-region losses but they still probably have the best criteria of those 5-loss teams.

Their margin for error has narrowed for sure.

Why is St. Vincent a quality win for them, but part of a "weak" schedule for other teams that shall not be named?

Seems like Wooster is somewhere between 5-8 in a pack with JCU and Mount among others. At the beginning of the year they were probably better, not sure now. They're really dependent on 3 guys from what I saw tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2015, 12:49:35 AM
It's not the St. Vincent game. It's the collective. And remember, the regional rankings follow some criteria, while other rankings do not. Wooster's SOS in Massey is 50. Marietta is 52.

There's also a leap between ranking a team #1 and then ranking them in the mid-pack. The regional ranking watchers know the criteria (or at least follow the bouncing ball whilst games count or don't). I applaud them...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 08, 2015, 12:57:35 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 07, 2015, 09:34:05 PM
Quote from: GoRed on February 07, 2015, 09:26:02 PM
My oh my.  Looks like Delaware will be the site this year.

That's worth a whoa. I believe that's three out of four for Wooster and I can't really remember the last time that's happened in league play.
No worries.  Wooster has just announced that Proposition Joe has been hired as an assistant coach.  Around tournament time, ringers will be arriving from the Terps and Hoyas.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ettaexpress on February 08, 2015, 01:02:47 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2015, 12:49:35 AM
It's not the St. Vincent game. It's the collective. And remember, the regional rankings follow some criteria, while other rankings do not. Wooster's SOS in Massey is 50. Marietta is 52.

There's also a leap between ranking a team #1 and then ranking them in the mid-pack. The regional ranking watchers know the criteria (or at least follow the bouncing ball whilst games count or don't). I applaud them...

Well you absolutely can't rank them higher than 4. That's just out of the question now. After that it's parsing a number of similar teams. I think Mount would beat them if they played again and Jackson was able to play.

None of that addresses why St. Vincent is a quality win but isn't talked about as such for other teams. Seems like having it both ways, or trying to.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2015, 01:10:25 AM
Citation please.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 08, 2015, 08:27:20 AM
Quote from: ettaexpress on February 08, 2015, 01:02:47 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2015, 12:49:35 AM
It's not the St. Vincent game. It's the collective. And remember, the regional rankings follow some criteria, while other rankings do not. Wooster's SOS in Massey is 50. Marietta is 52.

There's also a leap between ranking a team #1 and then ranking them in the mid-pack. The regional ranking watchers know the criteria (or at least follow the bouncing ball whilst games count or don't). I applaud them...

Well you absolutely can't rank them higher than 4. That's just out of the question now. After that it's parsing a number of similar teams. I think Mount would beat them if they played again and Jackson was able to play.

None of that addresses why St. Vincent is a quality win but isn't talked about as such for other teams. Seems like having it both ways, or trying to.

I never called it a quality win, but in the eyes of the committee its probably considered one.  Its a head-to-head win, something that's part of the criteria.  In the group of teams in this region that will be selected between 4-9 Wooster has 3 of them against other teams in the same group.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on February 08, 2015, 09:38:47 AM
It appears the semi-finals and finals may be in Delaware IF OWU wins the quarterfinal game.  The way the NCAC has been this year, I can see several upsets occurring in those quarterfinals games.  I believe it is very possible for a 3 seed or below to win the tournament and the automatic bid.  I can also see a desperate Wooster team, thinking it needs to win the tournament to get in the NCAA's, come back to life and roll through the NCAC Tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 08, 2015, 11:33:27 AM
GO BIG RED
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 08, 2015, 01:13:37 PM
HISTORIC VICTORY for the Big Red!!!!
Way to go!!!!

Not since Feb 1, 1997 has the Big Red beat Wooster!!!!!!

The Big Red are rolling at the right time to maybe make some noise come tournament time.

Coach G MUST be considered for the Coach of the Year!!!!

Well done!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 08, 2015, 02:34:45 PM
Quote from: ettaexpress on February 08, 2015, 01:02:47 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2015, 12:49:35 AM
It's not the St. Vincent game. It's the collective. And remember, the regional rankings follow some criteria, while other rankings do not. Wooster's SOS in Massey is 50. Marietta is 52.

There's also a leap between ranking a team #1 and then ranking them in the mid-pack. The regional ranking watchers know the criteria (or at least follow the bouncing ball whilst games count or don't). I applaud them...

Well you absolutely can't rank them higher than 4. That's just out of the question now. After that it's parsing a number of similar teams. I think Mount would beat them if they played again and Jackson was able to play.

None of that addresses why St. Vincent is a quality win but isn't talked about as such for other teams. Seems like having it both ways, or trying to.

While I would root for this to be true...even as a Mount fan I can't find any way Wooster is behind them currently when Wooster won head-to-head AND their other two common opponents (Hope and St. V) were both Mount losses and Wooster wins.  Now do I think Mount would beat Denison?  Of course.  I think they'd beat them easily.  And I think they'd beat Wabash too.  But unless they play that's just speculation.  Based on the results Wooster is still ahead of the OAC outside of Etta IMO.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 08, 2015, 03:09:46 PM
Basketball is weird. The best team doesn't always win, because it's hard to shoot a round ball into a round hoop at times.

Baseball and softball are variable based on how the pitcher is throwing, etc. Sports with goalies can turn on its head based on how that player performs.

Football is about the closest sport we have to where the best team prevails, and even that's sketchy many times.

Sports!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 08, 2015, 03:41:58 PM
Let's not get too carried away about Denison. After all, Wooster did beat them by 23 five weeks ago. Denison is playing well and having a great season, but they're not Marietta. They may or may not be a better team than Wooster at this moment; I don't think you can say--and that alone is a feather in DU's cap.

Wooster is clearly going though some serious issues, mostly on the defensive end, and they are very vulnerable right now, especially with Wittenberg on the immediate horizon. The fact that they could not pull out a close game, at home, against an opponent they "should" beat, with the conference race in a critical situation, is almost unprecedented in the Steve Moore era and really gives me pause. Suddenly Hiram -- Hiram! -- is a huge game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 09, 2015, 10:36:15 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 07, 2015, 10:45:05 PM
1. OWU 12-2/17-4
2. Wooster 10-4/16-5

As noted earlier, the race for the title is essentially over.  OWU is up two games in the standings, plus they hold the h2h sweep over Wooster which effectively makes their lead three games with four to play.  It's difficult to see a scenario where OWU can't scratch out the one win they need to lock up home court advantage in the tournament. 

Quote from: David Collinge on February 07, 2015, 10:45:05 PM
3. Wabash 9-5/14-7
4. DePauw 8-6/15-6
5. Denison 7-7/13-8
5. Allegheny 7-7/10-11
7. Wittenberg 6-8/8-13

This is where the intrigue lies.  Five teams in play for the other two home games.  Giant week for Wittenberg with games at DePauw and home against Wooster.  DePauw probably has the toughest slate left with games against a desperate Witt team, at Wabash, and against OWU.  Wabash has a roadie at OWU this week, then play their final three games at home (Denison, DePauw, Kenyon) which is a nice bit of scheduling serendipity. 

On the side- If Wabash catches Wooster in the standings, do they get the #2 seed thanks to the records vs. OWU?  I'm not sure I necessarily want Wabash as the #2 seed (I think I'd prefer a Wabash game against Denison or Allegheny to a game against Wittenberg), but it's fun to know that a #2 seed is in play here at the end of the season.  Quite a job by Coach Brumett this season. 

Quote from: David Collinge on February 07, 2015, 10:45:05 PM
8. Oberlin 4-10/8-13
8. Kenyon 4-10/6-15
10. Hiram 3-11/9-12

I feel like Oberlin has a slight advantage here thanks to their wins over Wabash and DePauw.  The Yeomen also close with OWU and Wooster.  I think Oberlin makes the field if they can get one win this week. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 09, 2015, 04:28:40 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2015, 03:09:46 PM
...it's hard to shoot a round ball into a round hoop at times.
WABASH MAN PROPOSES CHANGES TO GAME
UNCLEAR ON WHETHER DESIRE IS FOR SQUARE HOOP, BALL, OR BOTH

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 09, 2015, 05:04:49 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 09, 2015, 10:36:15 AM
On the side- If Wabash catches Wooster in the standings, do they get the #2 seed thanks to the records vs. OWU?

Yes, I believe that is correct.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 09, 2015, 05:10:35 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 09, 2015, 04:28:40 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2015, 03:09:46 PM
...it's hard to shoot a round ball into a round hoop at times.
WABASH MAN PROPOSES CHANGES TO GAME
UNCLEAR ON WHETHER DESIRE IS FOR SQUARE HOOP, BALL, OR BOTH

Remember, the hardest thing to do is the hit a round ball with a round bat, and hit it square!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 09, 2015, 06:47:29 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 09, 2015, 05:10:35 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 09, 2015, 04:28:40 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 08, 2015, 03:09:46 PM
...it's hard to shoot a round ball into a round hoop at times.
WABASH MAN PROPOSES CHANGES TO GAME
UNCLEAR ON WHETHER DESIRE IS FOR SQUARE HOOP, BALL, OR BOTH

Remember, the hardest thing to do is the hit a round ball with a round bat, and hit it square!
is a bat round or cylindrical?  ;)
and I completely agree.  Baseball starts in less than a month in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 11, 2015, 02:41:39 PM
Regional Rankings are out: http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2015/02/11/first-regional-rankings-released-today/ (http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2015/02/11/first-regional-rankings-released-today/)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2015, 09:15:59 PM
Two Claude Grey free throws with :10 left cinches an 81-80 OWU victory over Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 11, 2015, 09:21:24 PM
Wooo (he says while wiping his brow)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on February 11, 2015, 09:22:27 PM
Wabash got a better shot off at the end of the Hiram game  :-\
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 11, 2015, 09:33:20 PM
Despite ending the game with a thunderdunk, Hiram falls to Wooster 79-44. Merciless.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 12, 2015, 11:10:16 AM
Last night's scores:
 
44 Hiram
79 Wooster
54 Wittenberg
53 DePauw

56 Allegheny
79 Oberlin (!!)

66 Kenyon
62 Denison

80 Wabash
81 OWU

Standings:
Ohio Wesleyan 18-4/13-2
Wooster 17-5/11-4
Wabash 14-8/9-6
DePauw 15-7/8-7
Denison 13-9/7-8
Allegheny 10-12/7-8
Wittenberg 9-13/7-8
Oberlin 9-13/5-10
Kenyon 7-15/5-10
Hiram 9-13/3-12

- Witt picks up a game on Wabash, DePauw, Denison, and Allegheny.  With the rest of the middle of the pack there losing last night, Wabash narrowly missed a shot to wrap a home game.  As it stands, I think a win on Saturday against Denison will do the trick. 

- OWU clinches home court advantage through the NCAC tournament.  This is omitted from their game recap  which I found strange because it's kind of a big deal.  Counting sometimes isn't my thing. 

- Oberlin remains in the driver's seat for the 8th spot.  Hiram isn't quite out of it, but they need three wins plus an additional spin to play beyond next weekend.   

- Hard to see a scenario at this point where sorting out seeds 4-7 doesn't involve a bunch of messy tiebreaks. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 12, 2015, 11:48:14 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 12, 2015, 11:10:16 AM

Standings:
Ohio Wesleyan 18-4/13-2
Wooster 17-5/11-4
Wabash 14-8/9-6
DePauw 15-7/8-7
Denison 13-9/7-8
Allegheny 10-12/7-8
Wittenberg 9-13/7-8
Oberlin 9-13/5-10
Kenyon 7-15/5-10
Hiram 9-13/3-12


- OWU clinches home court advantage through the NCAC tournament.  This is omitted from their game recap  which I found strange because it's kind of a big deal. 



Not quite yet!  There are still 3 games left!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 12, 2015, 06:33:54 PM
How can Denison win at Wooster and then turn around and lose at home to Kenyon? What a wacky sport.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 12, 2015, 06:41:35 PM
My boss said it best when he refused to bet on a college bowl game this year: "Never underestimate the power of 18-22 year old kids to screw up..."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on February 12, 2015, 08:46:44 PM
I am convinced there will be chaos in the league tournament this year.   How long has it been since Wooster has not been the league champion?  It appears OWU is going to win it outright with a 2 game cushion and only 3 games left.  The 4-7 spots are going to be a mess.  What is the tie-breaker criteria in the NCAC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 13, 2015, 09:26:35 AM
Quote from: Ohigy on February 12, 2015, 08:46:44 PM
I am convinced there will be chaos in the league tournament this year.   How long has it been since Wooster has not been the league champion?  It appears OWU is going to win it outright with a 2 game cushion and only 3 games left.  The 4-7 spots are going to be a mess.  What is the tie-breaker criteria in the NCAC?
I hope the tie breaker for basketball isn't anything like football went through in 2012.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 13, 2015, 09:53:59 AM
You know what the tie breaker in Baseball has been? A coin flip. Alleghenny lost out on the NCAC tourney several times because a coin flip.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 13, 2015, 10:28:53 AM
Quote from: Bishopleftiesdad on February 13, 2015, 09:53:59 AM
You know what the tie breaker in Baseball has been? A coin flip. Alleghenny lost out on the NCAC tourney several times because a coin flip.

Four game weekend series will do that.  Hard to wind up with difficult ties if you play three 9s over a weekend like adults.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 13, 2015, 10:56:43 AM
I would have no problems with 3 9's for baseball. I also would like to go back to round robin. But thats a discussion for another board.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 13, 2015, 12:53:03 PM
Quote from: Bishopleftiesdad on February 13, 2015, 10:56:43 AM
I would have no problems with 3 9's for baseball. I also would like to go back to round robin. But thats a discussion for another board.
I would think 3 9's would also be better for your pitching staff as well as you don't have to kill your pitchers with doubleheaders back to back. At times the last game if not both Sunday games start to look like mid-week non-conference games when that guy Wholestaff is on the mound.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 13, 2015, 01:41:06 PM
Not to derail the baseball thread, but I believe the tiebreakers for hoops are (or were):
1) Head-to-Head
2) Record vs conference opponents beginning at the top of the standings
3) Coin flip
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 13, 2015, 01:45:52 PM
Yes so the coin flip is still a possibility.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2015, 07:09:18 PM
As OWU closes in on on the outright NCAC regular season title, it bears mentioning that Wooster, Wittenberg, or both have won or shared this title in each of the last 27 seasons. The last time the "W"s failed to perch atop the final standings was 1988, when OWU shared the crown with Allegheny at 11-1. This was OWU's fourth consecutive championship, two shared with the Gators (1986 and 1988*) and two outright with Allegheny in second. The following season, Wooster shared the title with Allegheny, then in the 1989-90 season, Wittenberg left the OAC for the NCAC, which split into a two-division format for two seasons. In each season, Wooster won the North Division and Wittenberg the South. Since then, the two programs won 21 outright titles between them (Wooster 14, Witt 7) and shared one title (1991-92), with only Allegheny able to break the unanimity, sharing the 1992-93 crown with the Tigers.

In other words, what OWU is about to accomplish is really extraordinary.

And it's time for the other six, especially charter members Oberlin, Kenyon, and Denison, to step up and get some banners for themselves.

*Of course, you don't need me to tell you that OWU won the national championship in 1988.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2015, 07:22:58 PM
Today's results:
OWU 80, Allegheny 66
Wabash 68, Denison 66
Oberlin 83, Hiram 58
DePauw 66, Kenyon 61

Wooster tips at Wittenberg in a few minutes. A Tiger win would give OWU that outright title mentioned above. Regardless, the Bishops' win today clinches a share of the title and home-court advantage in the NCAC tournament. Congratulations!

Current standings, pending the Woo/Witt outcome:
1. OWU 14-2
2. Wooster 11-4
3. Wabash 10-6
4. DePauw 9-7
5. Wittenberg 7-8
6. Denison 7-9
6. Allegheny 7-9
8. Oberlin 6-10
9. Kenyon 5-11
10. Hiram 3-13

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2015, 09:29:06 PM
Wooster holds off Wittenberg, 63-59, an absolutely putrid game filled with offensive fouls and bricked free throws (or so Mike's radio call would suggest.) Eighth straight Scot victory over the Tigers, who now at 9-14 realistically cannot avoid their first losing season in my very long lifetime.

Current standings:
1. OWU 14-2
2. Wooster 12-4
3. Wabash 10-6
4. DePauw 9-7
5. Wittenberg 7-9
5. Denison 7-9
5. Allegheny 7-9
8. Oberlin 6-10
9. Kenyon 5-11
10. Hiram 3-13
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 15, 2015, 11:48:18 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 14, 2015, 09:29:06 PM
Wooster holds off Wittenberg, 63-59, an absolutely putrid game filled with offensive fouls and bricked free throws (or so Mike's radio call would suggest.) Eighth straight Scot victory over the Tigers, who now at 9-14 realistically cannot avoid their first losing season in my very long lifetime.


Only way they avoid a losing season is to win out, win the NCAC Tournament and advance to the NCAA Sweet 16 or past. 16-15
or
win out, win the NCAC Tournament and advance to the second round of the NCAA. 15-15

1956 was Wittenberg's last losing season in men's basketball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 15, 2015, 02:28:58 PM
Quote from: sac on February 15, 2015, 11:48:18 AM
1956 was Wittenberg's last losing season in men's basketball.

That's absolutely incredible.  This is unquestionably a historically awful season for Witt, but what a tradition of consistency.  Witt and Wooster never have down years.  Quite a testament to both programs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2015, 04:38:34 PM
Wooster's last losing season was in 1986-87, when they went 8-18. Cost Lu Wims his job. 28 straight winning season is very impressive ... and Wittenberg's non-losing streak is more than twice as long.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 15, 2015, 04:50:28 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 15, 2015, 04:38:34 PM
Wooster's last losing season was in 1986-87, when they went 8-18. Cost Lu Wims his job. 28 straight winning season is very impressive ... and Wittenberg's non-losing streak is more than twice as long.

In the two 'major' sports, the only comparable streak would be Linfield football, currently 57(?) straight winning seasons (at least I think it is not even 'non-losing' seasons).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 15, 2015, 04:58:54 PM
We use the caveat "non-losing" for Wittenberg because they were 13-13 in both 1967-68 and 2008-09.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 15, 2015, 06:04:27 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 15, 2015, 04:58:54 PM
We use the caveat "non-losing" for Wittenberg because they were 13-13 in both 1967-68 and 2008-09.

Understood.  IIRC, Linfield has not even had a .500 season over that stretch.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 15, 2015, 06:19:15 PM
Despite their record, I fear them more than any other NCAC team.  I'll not shed a tear if they fail to make the tournament, or if someone else knocks them out of it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 15, 2015, 06:26:31 PM
+1 Wooster, I will shed no tears for Witt, I wouldn't for Wooster, by the way either. It has to be tough to beat any good team 3 times in one season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 15, 2015, 08:21:49 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 15, 2015, 06:04:27 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 15, 2015, 04:58:54 PM
We use the caveat "non-losing" for Wittenberg because they were 13-13 in both 1967-68 and 2008-09.

Understood.  IIRC, Linfield has not even had a .500 season over that stretch.

If I looked right, they were 3-6 in 1955. That's the last one I saw...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 15, 2015, 09:40:47 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 15, 2015, 08:21:49 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 15, 2015, 06:04:27 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 15, 2015, 04:58:54 PM
We use the caveat "non-losing" for Wittenberg because they were 13-13 in both 1967-68 and 2008-09.

Understood.  IIRC, Linfield has not even had a .500 season over that stretch.

If I looked right, they were 3-6 in 1955. That's the last one I saw...

3-6 in 1955?  Why so few games?  Was the school founded mid-season that year?  Did they get lost travelling to many of the road venues?  Or did most schools just refuse to play them because, as now, they were pu...  Oh, wait, you're talking about Linfield...  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 15, 2015, 09:44:35 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 15, 2015, 09:40:47 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 15, 2015, 08:21:49 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 15, 2015, 06:04:27 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 15, 2015, 04:58:54 PM
We use the caveat "non-losing" for Wittenberg because they were 13-13 in both 1967-68 and 2008-09.

Understood.  IIRC, Linfield has not even had a .500 season over that stretch.

If I looked right, they were 3-6 in 1955. That's the last one I saw...

3-6 in 1955?  Why so few games?  Was the school founded mid-season that year?  Did they get lost travelling to many of the road venues?  Or did most schools just refuse to play them because, as now, they were pu...  Oh, wait, you're talking about Linfield...  ;D

Being on the NW 'island', Linfield nearly(?) always has only a 9-game schedule (which would also explain a lack of .500 seasons, at least since OT came into effect).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 15, 2015, 10:03:24 PM
The big ten didnt even start playing 10 games until 1964.  9 games was standard.

Not all d3 conferences went to 10 game schedules.  The miaa didn't do 10 games until 2002.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 16, 2015, 10:04:20 AM
 ::)

Well, at least I got the joke, WB.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 16, 2015, 10:19:15 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 16, 2015, 10:04:20 AM
::)

Well, at least I got the joke, WB.

Bad as it was, thank you. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCACfan22 on February 16, 2015, 10:18:39 PM
Oberlin will most likely play their next three games against OWU,Wooster, and then OWU/Wooster again in the playoffs...call me a homer, but I think they'll win one of those games ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 16, 2015, 11:29:34 PM
Quote from: NCACfan22 on February 16, 2015, 10:18:39 PM
Oberlin will most likely play their next three games against OWU,Wooster, and then OWU/Wooster again in the playoffs...call me a homer, but I think they'll win one of those games ;)

Gave you some karma, because you and Oberlin will need all the help that you can get. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 18, 2015, 07:53:21 PM
From the Wooster website: Video unavailable due to technical difficulties.

The people that deal with the streaming video at Wooster need to be fired.  If it's Wooster staff, fire them.  If it's MCTV, send them packing.  What a joke this has become.  Every game it's something, and this time it's everything.  What an embarrassment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on February 18, 2015, 08:16:45 PM
 >:( No freakin' s%#t.  I've complained directly to both the Athletic Department and the Alumni Dept.  To no avail.  They Wooster hierarchy simply doesn't get it that the video system is the best vehicle for enabling prospective student players to see the style, coaching, talent, team-play, etc. of Wooster basketball?  It's almost as if they don't care.  It's the cheapest advertising the Scots could do and they piss it away, year after year.  I don't get why Coach Moore & CO. don't demand a decent, reliable system.  Want a good example -- look no further than Wabash.  This is not rocket science.  This is another critical component of building a fan base and smart recruitment.  :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 18, 2015, 09:13:43 PM
Wabash's superb broadcast is never better than when it captures a win over DePauw. LGs beat the bad guys 72-62 and seal up third place in the NCAC.  Going to be an interesting Saturday to see who comes to Chadwick next Tuesday.

Hiram clips Denison which puts DU and Allegheny both at 7-10. They'll play Saturday and if I'm reading it right, the winner will go to Wabash on Tuesday while the loser goes to Timken. Unless Witt loses to Hiram and then we'd get a tiebreak for 5th/6th. 

One more interesting piece- s Witt win over Hiram and a DePauw loss to OWU (both expected results) would bump Witt into a 9-9 tie with DePauw and the season sweep puts that 4/5 matchup in Springfield. That's quite a turnaround from where Witt was at six weeks ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Eco-manblue on February 18, 2015, 09:15:33 PM
 :o  The technical acuity of Wooster's audio partner, WQKT, also sucks.  The audio transmission cut out every 15 seconds or so in the second half and then go worse toward game's end.  What a pile.  WQKT is the podunkiest of podunk stations and doesn't have the juice, genius, or common sense to know that they have a problem.  No communication or apology to the listening audience (however few of us there were -- refugees from the Scots video desert otherwise known as the infamous "Big Wooster No Signal Zone").   What a way to close out the home season...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 18, 2015, 11:44:30 PM
Tonight's scores:
Wabash 72, DePauw 62
Witt 80, Kenyon 75
Wooster 80, Allegheny 63
Hiram 72, Denison 67
OWU 106, Oberlin 76

Standings - bolded teams are locked into their seeds:
1. OWU 15-2
2. Wooster 13-4
3. Wabash 11-6
4. DePauw 9-8
5. Wittenberg 8-9
6. Denison 7-10
6. Allegheny 7-10
8. Oberlin 6-11
9. Kenyon 5-12
10. Hiram 4-13

Kenyon and Hiram are eliminated.  Oberlin will play at OWU.  The other three quarterfinals are TBD. 

Saturday's games:
OWU @ DePauw
Allegheny @ Denison
Wooster @ Oberlin
Kenyon @ Wabash
Hiram @ Witt   

Scenarios as best I can tell:
- DePauw clinches the 4th seed with a win over OWU.  If not...
- Witt clinches the 4th seed with a win over Hiram and would host DePauw in the quarters. 
Meanwhile...
- The loser of Allegheny/Denison will be the 7th seed and play at Wooster in the quarters.
- The winner would play at Wabash unless Witt loses in which case...
   - Denison wins a tiebreak with Witt (h2h split, Denison 1-1 vs. OWU, Witt 0-2 vs. OWU) so Denison @ DePauw, Witt @ Wabash
   - Witt wins a tiebreak with Allegheny (h2h split, both 0-2 vs. OWU and Wooster, both 1-1 vs. Wabash, Witt 2-0 vs. DPU, Allegheny 0-2 vs. DPU) so we get Witt @ DePauw and Allegheny @ Wabash

Corrections appreciated.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on February 19, 2015, 08:56:22 AM
Congrats to OWU for winning the NCAC regular season title.   As good as OWU has been all year, any of 6 teams could win the tournament. OWU, Wooster, Wabash, DePauw, Denison, or Witt.  Allegheny and Oberlin are in the tournament but don't have the ability to reel off 3 straight wins against the best teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 19, 2015, 09:51:45 AM
Quite a season in the NCAC. Congratulations indeed to OWU.

Hopefully Wooster can make a run. I would really like to see Wooster get another shot vs OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 19, 2015, 11:17:25 AM
Quick prediction here- I don't think OWU wins the league tournament.  They have 4 guys that play 30+ minutes.  Barring a walkthrough in the semis (which I think is unlikely), do they have the legs to shoot and make enough 3s to beat Wooster or Wabash on the second day of a tough back-to-back?  I say no.  I think the winner of the tournament comes out of the first semi on Friday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on February 19, 2015, 11:19:55 AM
I maintain my position from earlier in the season.  Wooster wins the league tournament and the automatic bid.  OWU gets an at-large big to the NCAA Tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 19, 2015, 12:12:34 PM
I've not been to a Wooster game all year, so consider that any opinions I put forth on the team come from further away than the Collinge-Nosebleed-Section of Timken Gymnasium.  Still, I find it amazing that Coach Moore is still, with the regular season nearly toast, fiddling with the minutes of his players.  I've never seen this so deep into a Wooster season, and it obviously indicates that there is serious concern in the Scots' camp.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 19, 2015, 12:18:33 PM
If things break weird and odd over the rest of the country, and especially if the favored (RRd) teams bomb out in the tourney and / or lose Saturday, the NCAC may be a one-bid league. OWU and Wooster's SOS, while not bad, isn't lights out. I do think a few "A" upsets will have to happen, but the way the year has gone, welp...

I do think there will be a "C" out of the NCAC but there's not a lock yet. What we need to do is hope Marietta wins the OAC first and foremost.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 19, 2015, 02:02:23 PM
I'm hoping Wooster can advance as I would really like to have the opportunity to drive the 15-20 minutes up 23 and see them play for once.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2015, 05:44:51 PM
I think Kyle Brumett has done an amazing job in his first season in C'ville, leading no-expectations Wabash from nowhere to a strong third-place finish. In any other year, he's the Coach of the Year in the NCAC. But there is no way that award goes to any trophy case beside Mike DeWitt's this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 19, 2015, 05:53:53 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 19, 2015, 05:44:51 PM
I think Kyle Brumett has done an amazing job in his first season in C'ville, leading no-expectations Wabash from nowhere to a strong third-place finish. In any other year, he's the Coach of the Year in the NCAC. But there is no way that award goes to any trophy case beside Mike DeWitt's this season.

What if Wabash wins the tournament?  Or are votes for this award taken before the tourney starts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 19, 2015, 05:55:52 PM
I think all of the of-the-Year awards, as well as the all-conference teams, are voted on before the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 20, 2015, 09:22:08 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 19, 2015, 05:55:52 PM
I think all of the of-the-Year awards, as well as the all-conference teams, are voted on before the tournament.

Are we looking at an OWU sweep on the otY awards?  I think Axelrod the only choice for Newb otY.  I think you're spot on about CotY- most years, Brumett is an obvious choice, but most years somebody other than Wooster or Witt doesn't win the league.  I could be pleasantly surprised by the coaches choosing Coach Brumett here, but I'm with you- I don't think it is happening. 

That leaves PotY.  I would say Claude Gray is the favorite, but he's not the slam dunk choice.  Pannell has been excellent for Wooster, Purvlicis has had a tremendous season, as has Fernitz at DePauw.  I think those are your top four candidates. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 20, 2015, 02:58:22 PM
I can't comment on who should win the ncac awards but I will say the following. Axelrod is better then any guard that is playing in Athens right now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on February 20, 2015, 08:36:01 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 19, 2015, 05:44:51 PM
I think Kyle Brumett has done an amazing job in his first season in C'ville, leading no-expectations Wabash from nowhere to a strong third-place finish. In any other year, he's the Coach of the Year in the NCAC. But there is no way that award goes to any trophy case beside Mike DeWitt's this season.

I agree.

Quote from: wally_wabash on February 20, 2015, 09:22:08 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 19, 2015, 05:55:52 PM
I think all of the of-the-Year awards, as well as the all-conference teams, are voted on before the tournament.

Are we looking at an OWU sweep on the otY awards?

I think we are and I think that's appropriate.

My uneducated guess is that Wally is right about OWU not winning the tourney. I think Wooster wins the tourney and I think OWU will get an at large.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 21, 2015, 05:24:25 PM
Alright Wabash gets by Kenyon 68-67 in OT.  WEIRD game.  Also had nothing to do with the standings or tournament so we'll move on.  In other action of little consequence, Wooster beat Oberlin 58-45. 

OWU beats DePauw 86-77 and Allegheny comes back from a big second half deficit to beat Denison 60-59. 

Witt and Hiram like suspense, so they'll play tomorrow instead. 

Up to the moment, things look like this:
Standings - bolded teams are locked into their seeds:
1. OWU 16-2
2. Wooster 14-4
3. Wabash 12-6
4. DePauw 9-9
5. Wittenberg 8-9
6. Allegheny 8-10
7. Denison 7-11
8. Oberlin 6-12
9. Kenyon 5-13
10. Hiram 4-13

The only if/then scenario left determines the site of the 4/5 game and quite simply, Witt hosts if they beat Hiram tomorrow.  If not, they travel to DePauw on Tuesday. 

Your matchups for Tuesday are:
Oberlin (8) @ OWU (1)
Witt (4/5) vs. DePauw(4/5)
Denison (7) @ Wooster (2)
Allegheny (6) @ Wabash (3)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCACfan22 on February 21, 2015, 05:38:15 PM
Watched Wooster play Oberlin today, and was quite honestly not very impressed with the Scots. Obviously, Wooster has a ton of talent (most in the conference IMO) but something looked out of sync between Brown, Fanelly (who I think is the most skilled big in the conference), Panelly (who hit a huge three when Oberlin threatened to within 6 with 1:30 to go) and LaLonde. I don't know if it's just too much talent that collides when put together or what, but Wooster sure seems to be playing beneath their potential level.

Also, worth mentioning, part of the reason Steve Moore has been so successful is because he has had the refs in his back pocket for years. Wooster got absolutely ALL the calls today against Oberlin, and easily could have lost that game if things had gone differently. I don't see them winning the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2015, 05:41:06 PM
Quote from: NCACfan22 on February 21, 2015, 05:38:15 PM

Also, worth mentioning, part of the reason Steve Moore has been so successful is because he has had the refs in his back pocket for years. Wooster got absolutely ALL the calls today against Oberlin, and easily could have lost that game if things had gone differently. I don't see them winning the NCAC.

Kind of cool that you threw that last paragraph in there.  Made it easy to clarify your credibility, or actually lack of same.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 21, 2015, 05:44:28 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 21, 2015, 05:24:25 PM
Alright Wabash gets by Kenyon 68-67 in OT.  WEIRD game.  Also had nothing to do with the standings or tournament so we'll move on.  In other action of little consequence, Wooster beat Oberlin 58-45. 

OWU beats DePauw 86-77 and Allegheny comes back from a big second half deficit to beat Denison 60-59. 

Witt and Hiram like suspense, so they'll play tomorrow instead. 

Up to the moment, things look like this:
Standings - bolded teams are locked into their seeds:
1. OWU 16-2
2. Wooster 14-4
3. Wabash 12-6
4. DePauw 9-9
5. Wittenberg 8-9
6. Allegheny 8-10
7. Denison 7-11
8. Oberlin 6-12
9. Kenyon 5-13
10. Hiram 4-13

The only if/then scenario left determines the site of the 4/5 game and quite simply, Witt hosts if they beat Hiram tomorrow.  If not, they travel to DePauw on Tuesday. 

Your matchups for Tuesday are:
Oberlin (8) @ OWU (1)
Witt (4/5) vs. DePauw(4/5)
Denison (7) @ Wooster (2)
Allegheny (6) @ Wabash (3)

So after all the rigmarole of the regular season, it appears that either all, or almost all of the regular suspects will make it to the final four.  The venue won't be the same, at Oh Woo rather than Woo, but so what?  I think this will be a four-team tournament, with the favorite having no more than a one in three shot to win it.  As to who that favorite might actually be, I have no idea.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 21, 2015, 06:20:52 PM
Wooster has a prospective tournament path that features three teams that beat them (Denison, then Wabash, then OWU). This may be a first.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 21, 2015, 06:25:08 PM
What's been Denison's deal this year, why so inconsistent?  They have some great stats and metrix but the W/L record doesn't match what it probably should be.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 21, 2015, 07:28:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 21, 2015, 05:44:28 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 21, 2015, 05:24:25 PM
Alright Wabash gets by Kenyon 68-67 in OT.  WEIRD game.  Also had nothing to do with the standings or tournament so we'll move on.  In other action of little consequence, Wooster beat Oberlin 58-45. 

OWU beats DePauw 86-77 and Allegheny comes back from a big second half deficit to beat Denison 60-59. 

Witt and Hiram like suspense, so they'll play tomorrow instead. 

Up to the moment, things look like this:
Standings - bolded teams are locked into their seeds:
1. OWU 16-2
2. Wooster 14-4
3. Wabash 12-6
4. DePauw 9-9
5. Wittenberg 8-9
6. Allegheny 8-10
7. Denison 7-11
8. Oberlin 6-12
9. Kenyon 5-13
10. Hiram 4-13

The only if/then scenario left determines the site of the 4/5 game and quite simply, Witt hosts if they beat Hiram tomorrow.  If not, they travel to DePauw on Tuesday. 

Your matchups for Tuesday are:
Oberlin (8) @ OWU (1)
Witt (4/5) vs. DePauw(4/5)
Denison (7) @ Wooster (2)
Allegheny (6) @ Wabash (3)

So after all the rigmarole of the regular season, it appears that either all, or almost all of the regular suspects will make it to the final four.  The venue won't be the same, at Oh Woo rather than Woo, but so what?  I think this will be a four-team tournament, with the favorite having no more than a one in three shot to win it.  As to who that favorite might actually be, I have no idea.
A one in three chance. Here is the question who do you pick to be the winner? If your pick wins it's first game will you then find it is better to switch your pick.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 21, 2015, 08:22:36 PM
Quote from: sac on February 21, 2015, 06:25:08 PM
What's been Denison's deal this year, why so inconsistent?  They have some great stats and metrix but the W/L record doesn't match what it probably should be.

In 12 Denison losses this season, one was bad- 95-72 vs. Wooster.  The margins in the other 11 are all five points or less.  Seven of those games are 1, 2, or 3 point margins.  Denison is literally just a handful of buckets away from being something like 18-7. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on February 21, 2015, 09:59:21 PM
Which makes the Big Red dangerous, although there is only a hope and a prayer that they can beat the Scots in Scot-town.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 22, 2015, 08:31:48 AM
Quote from: sigma one on February 21, 2015, 09:59:21 PM
Which makes the Big Red dangerous, although there is only a hope and a prayer that they can beat the Scots in Scot-town.
Did Denison not already beat Wooster at Wooster this year? Maybe that was their hope and prayer for the year but still, GO BIG RED.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 22, 2015, 09:54:26 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 21, 2015, 05:41:06 PM
Quote from: NCACfan22 on February 21, 2015, 05:38:15 PM

Also, worth mentioning, part of the reason Steve Moore has been so successful is because he has had the refs in his back pocket for years. Wooster got absolutely ALL the calls today against Oberlin, and easily could have lost that game if things had gone differently. I don't see them winning the NCAC.

Kind of cool that you threw that last paragraph in there.  Made it easy to clarify your credibility, or actually lack of same.

My thoughts exactly. I mean, we all know Coach K got to 1000 wins by having the refs in his back pocket too...  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 22, 2015, 05:38:07 PM
Not sure what kind of voodoo Hiram uses when they play Wittenberg, but it has worked again. The Terriers knock off Witt 55-53 which sends Witt out to Greencastle on Tuesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 23, 2015, 01:27:42 PM
With 8:40 to go the score was 58-44 and the Gators outscored the Big Red 16-1!!!  The Big Red scored ONE point in the last 8:40.
The Big Red lost their last four games by a total of 12 points.............

It was like a season that could have been!!!!!  They can't make a free throw to save their lives...........

Not sure I have King in the game in crunch time shooting 49% from the line!!!!  :o Oh well.....I am pretty sure Wooster will be waiting for them tomorrow night!!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 24, 2015, 08:08:58 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 22, 2015, 09:54:26 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 21, 2015, 05:41:06 PM
Quote from: NCACfan22 on February 21, 2015, 05:38:15 PM

Also, worth mentioning, part of the reason Steve Moore has been so successful is because he has had the refs in his back pocket for years. Wooster got absolutely ALL the calls today against Oberlin, and easily could have lost that game if things had gone differently. I don't see them winning the NCAC.

Kind of cool that you threw that last paragraph in there.  Made it easy to clarify your credibility, or actually lack of same.

My thoughts exactly. I mean, we all know Coach K got to 1000 wins by having the refs in his back pocket too...  ::)
You mean he doesn't :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on February 24, 2015, 08:09:14 AM
Quote from: BigRedFan on February 23, 2015, 01:27:42 PM
With 8:40 to go the score was 58-44 and the Gators outscored the Big Red 16-1!!!  The Big Red scored ONE point in the last 8:40.
The Big Red lost their last four games by a total of 12 points.............

It was like a season that could have been!!!!!  They can't make a free throw to save their lives...........

Not sure I have King in the game in crunch time shooting 49% from the line!!!!  :o Oh well.....I am pretty sure Wooster will be waiting for them tomorrow night!!!
Sorry to hear that big red fan, was hoping for better from Denison after some of their victories this year. I have seen some pretty bad foul shooting myself this year. Wooster at OWU and Akron missing all their foul shots(they did only shoot 6) against Ohio. Maybe tonight will be monumental upset #2 for the Big Red.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 24, 2015, 02:47:50 PM
Good Luck to all teams!!Hard to remember a tournament that really a whole bunch of teams can win it!!!

GO BIG RED!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 24, 2015, 04:23:28 PM
Quote from: ohiofan1954 on February 24, 2015, 08:09:14 AM
Maybe tonight will be monumental upset #2 for the Big Red.

Anything can happen, but it had been 18 years since the Big Red was in the W column against Wooster so color me skeptical to think it will happen twice in the span of a month...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2015, 04:48:59 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on February 24, 2015, 02:47:50 PM
Good Luck to all teams!!Hard to remember a tournament that really a whole bunch of teams can win it!!!

GO BIG RED!!!

I guess it depends on what we count as a whole bunch.  My sense here is that three teams can legitimately win:
OWU- they've been the best team all year and they have the home court advantage

Wooster - Such a weird year for the Scots...doesn't seem like they've really clicked for more than a game or two in a row all season.  Inconsistency aside, Wooster is king of the mountain here until somebody shows otherwise. 

Wabash - Why not?  They destroy everybody on the boards- something that nearly manifested itself into a season sweep of OWU.  Since a weird hiccup at the end of January, Wabash has won 6 out of 7 with the one loss being the one-point loss at OWU and including wins against Wooster, both sides of the eastern back-to-back, and a thumping of DePauw.  The only team "hotter" right now would be OWU. 

As for the rest, I have a hard time seeing a scenario where DePauw, Witt, Allegheny, or Denison can win their next three games.  All of those teams have just been so inconsistent that it's tough to see them winning three in a row here at the end.  Denison has to win at Timken- again.  Tough.  Witt or DePauw are going to get OWU at OWU on full rest- really tough draw.  The time to get OWU is on Saturday.  So I'm sticking with the tournament winner coming out of the first semi on Friday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2015, 06:49:37 PM
The catfight in Greencastle is tied at 23-23 at the half.  Tight game through the first 20 minutes as both teams have each led by only 4 points.  Second half just underway now. 

40 minutes not enough in Greencastle.  Tied at 53-53 going to OT.

They're just going to keep going at DePauw.  61-61 after the first OT.

And it's all over in Greencastle. DePauw finishes off Wittenberg 79-74 and they'll advance to play OWU.


Meanwhile, Wabash is up early on Allegheny 17-11 with 14:04 left in the 1st period.   

At the half in Crawfordsville, Wabash leads Allegheny 33-25. 

Strong open for Allegheny in the second half.  The Gators have tied the game at 41-41 with 13 minutes to play. 

Trading buckets....Wabash leads 51-50 with 8:48 to play.  Big moment here as Oetting looked to roll his ankle pretty severely.  Return is questionable I'd say. 

Squeaky bum time in C'ville.  We're under one minute to play, Wabash is at the line leading 63-60.  We're in a Gator timeout. 

68-60 now with 20 seconds to go.  Kyle Aiton capped his big night with a steal and runout to give Wabash a 66-60 lead a moment ago.  Wabash looking good to advance right now. 

And that's a final from Chadwick.  Wabash defeats Allegheny 69-60. 


Wooster is up 29-9 on Denison and I'm calling that one over. 


Nearing halftime, OWU is up 46-34 on Oberlin.

54-39 OWU at the half.  Bishops scoring points in bunches which is what they do.  They shot 20(!!) free throws in the first half.  Egads. 

Oberlin had been hanging around, but OWU is now out to a 70-51 lead with under 10 minutes to play.  I don't think Oberlin has the offense to get that back. 

83-66 is the final from OWU.  Weekend hoops at Branch Rickey is official. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2015, 07:47:45 PM
Wooster scored the first 10 points of the game, and led 24-5 with just over 5 minutes gone. I guess they didn't like losing at home to Denison.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 24, 2015, 07:58:40 PM
Witt/DePauw in double-overtime

http://portal.stretchinternet.com/depauw/portal.htm?eventId=203368&streamType=video
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2015, 08:18:26 PM
OWU has a 54-point half, while Wooster rings up 62. The best defense is a good offense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 24, 2015, 08:23:32 PM
DePauw 79  Wittenberg 74  2OT

The DePauw color man put the caper on this one by reminding us all "its hard to beat a team 3 teams in the same season"
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2015, 08:32:32 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2015, 08:18:26 PM
OWU has a 54-point half, while Wooster rings up 62. The best defense is a good offense.

...then, of course, it takes Wooster 3:45 just to get on the board after halftime.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 24, 2015, 08:33:01 PM
Quote from: sac on February 24, 2015, 08:23:32 PM
DePauw 79  Wittenberg 74  2OT

The DePauw color man put the caper on this one by reminding us all "its hard to beat a team 3 teams in the same season"

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fvignette4.wikia.nocookie.net%2Fpowerlisting%2Fimages%2F2%2F27%2FFacepalm_2.jpg%2Frevision%2F20140320061438&hash=bf3fcfd76265fc7b1b009f315dc0f0bbe354c1f5)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 24, 2015, 09:02:14 PM
Realize I've basically been demoted to a lurker this year (lots of other life activities functioning as distractions!), and realize that Witt's impending losing season has been well noted throughout the year, but still wanted to put my own two cents on how incredible Witt's consecutive non-losing season streak has been.

Witt ends this year at 10-16 (.384). As noted, Witt's most recent losing season was 1955-1956. So, the 2014-15 season is literally the first losing season Witt has had since the creation of the Interstate Highway System (June, 1956), the re-election of President Eisenhower (Nov, 1956) and the launch of Sputnik (Oct, 1957). Just mind-boggling to me that Witt's run essentially predates the Space Race.

This Scots fan gives a tip of the cap to the arch-rivals; that's one hell of a run of success.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2015, 09:09:41 PM
Vengeance is mine, sayeth the Scots, 106-68.
Wooster will next try to avenge a loss to Wabash, who is putting the finishing touches to Allegheny as I type this.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2015, 09:10:37 PM
The home teams held serve tonight.  Friday's semis are set:

#3 Wabash vs. #2 Wooster
#4 (but #10 in our hearts) DePauw vs. #1 OWU

Should be a great weekend in Delaware. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 24, 2015, 09:15:51 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 24, 2015, 09:02:14 PMSo, the 2014-15 season is literally the first losing season Witt has had since the creation of the Interstate Highway System (June, 1956)

So what you're saying is, the last time the Tigers had a losing season, Springfield was just a podunk town in the middle of nowhere, instead of today, when it is a podunk town in the middle of I-70.

I kid, I kid. Good thoughts, and I share the sentiment and congratulations to Wittenberg.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 24, 2015, 09:27:26 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2015, 09:15:51 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 24, 2015, 09:02:14 PMSo, the 2014-15 season is literally the first losing season Witt has had since the creation of the Interstate Highway System (June, 1956)

So what you're saying is, the last time the Tigers had a losing season, Springfield was just a podunk town in the middle of nowhere, instead of today, when it is a podunk town in the middle of I-70.

I kid, I kid. Good thoughts, and I share the sentiment and congratulations to Wittenberg.

Actually, Springfield is a arguably more podunk now. Mid-1950s population was somewhere around 80,000 residents, but by the 2010 census that had fallen to about 60,000.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 24, 2015, 09:31:51 PM
Here's some food for thought...if you're hosting the conference semis/finals, why wouldn't you want to play the first game on Friday?  You get an extra couple of hours of rest, you can sit and watch the next night's opponent when you're done, you avoid going really late if the first game stretches out through an overtime or two.  If I were coaching the top seeded team, I'd want those extra couple of hours in my pocket when I'm looking at a tough back-to-back. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2015, 10:23:09 PM
I don't know how BIG of an advantage that is; compared to how they used to do the Regional, Semi-State and State Finals in Indiana, where you played two games on Saturday. (10A and Noon, I think) and then the final at 7 or so. If you went OT or 2OT in game two, well, forget it...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 24, 2015, 10:30:04 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 24, 2015, 09:15:51 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 24, 2015, 09:02:14 PMSo, the 2014-15 season is literally the first losing season Witt has had since the creation of the Interstate Highway System (June, 1956)

So what you're saying is, the last time the Tigers had a losing season, Springfield was just a podunk town in the middle of nowhere, instead of today, when it is a podunk town in the middle of I-70.

I kid, I kid. Good thoughts, and I share the sentiment and congratulations to Wittenberg.

Totally agree.  Congrats to Wittenberg on a losing season.  Ahem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 24, 2015, 11:48:36 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2015, 09:31:51 PM
Here's some food for thought...if you're hosting the conference semis/finals, why wouldn't you want to play the first game on Friday?  You get an extra couple of hours of rest, you can sit and watch the next night's opponent when you're done, you avoid going really late if the first game stretches out through an overtime or two.  If I were coaching the top seeded team, I'd want those extra couple of hours in my pocket when I'm looking at a tough back-to-back.

I follow your logic -- heck, you might be right when it comes to purely basketball considerations -- but I think it's pretty clear why no one actually does this.

I just think you wouldn't get the fan base there and wouldn't have nearly the same atmosphere. It seems so ingrained in the host fan bases that the home team plays the late game, with the neutral court game acting, quite literally, as an opening act during which the home fans are expected to straggle in slowly mid-game.

If I'm the home team, I want the best atmosphere I can get for that semifinal. I absolutely put a huge value on that. For many teams, that conference semifinal game might be the biggest game they have played on-campus in several seasons (most teams aren't Wooster, where they're hosting it + NCAA games almost annually). You want as much of your student body, campus community, and local community at that game as you can get. Especially because you're only guaranteed that first semifinal game. I think there's just going to be a really strong bias toward putting that game in "prime time" (relatively speaking) vs. the earlier time slot.

Remember, local fans aren't traveling - they're balancing going to this game with the rest of their regular Friday routine. Start with the home team at a 5:30 or 6 pm game time on a Friday night and a pretty big chunk of your student body is probably still in the dining hall (or barely out of class) and your faculty and staff are home putting dinner on the table along with other local community fans. A 7:30 or 8 pm start is just going to draw better, period - and that's a big deal. It's a big deal for the school, the athletic department, and - not for nothing - your players, too. I'm pretty sure most coaches put a high value on giving his players that special experience of maybe the most packed, energized gym and crowd they have (and may ever) play in front of.

All in all, I think it's pretty obvious that the possible benefits of a bit of extra rest are more than countered by the perceived benefits of holding the better, later, time slot.

Also, what a weird visual it would be to have something like 80% of the assembled fans leave in between the two games...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 25, 2015, 01:27:46 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 24, 2015, 11:48:36 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 24, 2015, 09:31:51 PM
Here's some food for thought...if you're hosting the conference semis/finals, why wouldn't you want to play the first game on Friday?  You get an extra couple of hours of rest, you can sit and watch the next night's opponent when you're done, you avoid going really late if the first game stretches out through an overtime or two.  If I were coaching the top seeded team, I'd want those extra couple of hours in my pocket when I'm looking at a tough back-to-back.

I follow your logic -- heck, you might be right when it comes to purely basketball considerations -- but I think it's pretty clear why no one actually does this.

I just think you wouldn't get the fan base there and wouldn't have nearly the same atmosphere. It seems so ingrained in the host fan bases that the home team plays the late game, with the neutral court game acting, quite literally, as an opening act during which the home fans are expected to straggle in slowly mid-game.

If I'm the home team, I want the best atmosphere I can get for that semifinal. I absolutely put a huge value on that. For many teams, that conference semifinal game might be the biggest game they have played on-campus in several seasons (most teams aren't Wooster, where they're hosting it + NCAA games almost annually). You want as much of your student body, campus community, and local community at that game as you can get. Especially because you're only guaranteed that first semifinal game. I think there's just going to be a really strong bias toward putting that game in "prime time" (relatively speaking) vs. the earlier time slot.

Remember, local fans aren't traveling - they're balancing going to this game with the rest of their regular Friday routine. Start with the home team at a 5:30 or 6 pm game time on a Friday night and a pretty big chunk of your student body is probably still in the dining hall (or barely out of class) and your faculty and staff are home putting dinner on the table along with other local community fans. A 7:30 or 8 pm start is just going to draw better, period - and that's a big deal. It's a big deal for the school, the athletic department, and - not for nothing - your players, too. I'm pretty sure most coaches put a high value on giving his players that special experience of maybe the most packed, energized gym and crowd they have (and may ever) play in front of.

All in all, I think it's pretty obvious that the possible benefits of a bit of extra rest are more than countered by the perceived benefits of holding the better, later, time slot.

Also, what a weird visual it would be to have something like 80% of the assembled fans leave in between the two games...

I keep thinking that Wooster actually did do this once, maybe 12-15 years ago.  I'm not at all sure though, and if they did it, it may not have been in the league tournament; possibly it was in either the Al Van Wie or Mose Hole Tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2015, 06:46:48 AM
I'm too lazy to look it up, but I think it is in the conference tournament handbook that the home team plays in the second game.

And the atmosphere this year will be markedly different from the usual Timken/Pam Smith vibe. Because Branch Rickey is so (relatively) small, they will be clearing the gym between semifinals, with separate tickets required. So no half-full-of-the-locals-drifting-in first semifinal, although since it is Wooster in that game, it should be fairly well attended.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 25, 2015, 09:06:53 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 25, 2015, 06:46:48 AM
I'm too lazy to look it up, but I think it is in the conference tournament handbook that the home team plays in the second game.

And the atmosphere this year will be markedly different from the usual Timken/Pam Smith vibe. Because Branch Rickey is so (relatively) small, they will be clearing the gym between semifinals, with separate tickets required. So no half-full-of-the-locals-drifting-in first semifinal, although since it is Wooster in that game, it should be fairly well attended.

I was just going to ask about the clearing-the-gym thing, because I noticed that the game times are 5:50 and 8:30.  I suppose they have to do this due to their capacity, but I think that it has to raise the question about whether there need to be certain facility standards in order to host this tournament.  Wittenberg and Wooster have had it for so long that it hasn't been a question.  Is Branch Rickey the third largest gym in the NCAC?  If so, what happens if some other school suddenly becomes a power? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2015, 11:02:18 AM
I should have prefaced by saying that I understand why they schedule the games in the order they do...I was just thinking out loud about how maybe it isn't necessarily the best way strategically for the top seed.  I understand the "early" start time maybe being a problem, but if you had a 6/8:30 set, I think most people that really, really wanted to be at that 6:00 pm game would be there.  The folks that are aware that there is a game happening but are generally indifferent, probably aren't coming because now there's going to be a ticket cost involved whereas during the regular season there probably isn't.  That, I think, would deter your casual fan more than a 6 pm start time would. 

Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 25, 2015, 09:06:53 AM
Is Branch Rickey the third largest gym in the NCAC?  If so, what happens if some other school suddenly becomes a power? 

No, but it is by far the darkest gym in the league.   :)
These are the gym capacity numbers that I yanked off of d3hoops.com:
Allegheny   960
Denison     3000
DePauw     2800
Hiram        2000
Kenyon      2000
Oberlin      1800
OWU         2300
Wabash     1800
Wooster    3400
Witt          3000

I was surprised at the Allegheny number so I looked that one up independently.  Allegheny's site says 1200 for the Wise Center.  Either way, really small space and if there is anyplace that would maybe struggle to host championship weekend, that's the one.  I think the rest could do it fairly comfortably. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 25, 2015, 11:15:59 AM
I'm glad the Scots only won by 38.  Had it been 40 someone would have said Coach Moore had the referees in his pocket. ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 25, 2015, 12:44:24 PM
Looking at the different athletic websites I had different numbers than Wally, at some of the arena's.
TeamcapacityURL
Wooster3400http://woosterathletics.com/facilities/files/timken.html
Wittenberg3044http://www.wittenbergtigers.com/information/facilities/Pam-Evans-Smith-Arena/index
Depauw2400http://depauwtigers.com/facilities/Lilly_PERC_Neal
Hiram2000http://www.hiramterriers.com/facilities/price
Wabash1800http://sports.wabash.edu/sports/2011/7/24/MBB_0724110922.aspx?path=mbball
Kenyon1600http://athletics.kenyon.edu/sports/2012/7/16/GEN_0716120709.aspx?tab=kenyonathleticcenter
Denison1500http://denisonbigred.com/facilities/mitchell_center
OWU1450http://www.battlingbishops.com/sports/2011/10/31/Branch%20Rickey%20Arena.aspx?&tab=3
Allegheny1200http://alleghenygators.com/sports/2012/5/25/GEN_0525121852.aspx?id=198

I could not find a capacity on Oberlins site. http://www.goyeo.com/sports/2010/8/11/GEN_0811100953.aspx?id=242

Edited to update proper website and upadte link For Branch Rickey arena
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 25, 2015, 06:05:32 PM
Unless Denison updated their gym when they did the pool, the capacity is nowhere near 3000. 1500 is more like it, and even that may be a stretch.

Not sure I could visualize 2000 in the Doggie Dome either.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: monsoon on February 25, 2015, 11:59:31 PM
This is what OWU's website says:

Branch Rickey Arena seats 1450 for basketball and has been the site for NCAA Division III playoff games for both genders as well as several North Coast Athletic Conference and Ohio Athletic Conference tournaments.

That's quite a difference from 2300. I've not been there, but it looks like quite a place.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 26, 2015, 11:59:19 AM
Quote from: monsoon on February 25, 2015, 11:59:31 PM
This is what OWU's website says:

Branch Rickey Arena seats 1450 for basketball and has been the site for NCAA Division III playoff games for both genders as well as several North Coast Athletic Conference and Ohio Athletic Conference tournaments.

That's quite a difference from 2300. I've not been there, but it looks like quite a place.

From my memory, the 1450 number sounds more realistic.  Each side is a single level of no more than fifteen rows, stretching from end line to end line.  There is no end seating.  Do we have any rocket scientists who can produce a number from this? :)

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-F7ye86sL9hY/UWgdHCzEIZI/AAAAAAAAC1M/38aK1Lx9LRo/s1600/Branch_Rickey_Arena_2013_dt.jpg

As Wally pointed out, it is a dark arena.  Especially so when Wooster plays there and the lights at the Scots end of the court are dimmed.  OWU: has the Ohio electricians union in its pocket. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 26, 2015, 12:55:44 PM
The link I originally posted at 2300 is not longer active so I have to believe the statement by Monsoon is accurate.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 26, 2015, 12:56:14 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2015, 11:59:19 AM
Quote from: monsoon on February 25, 2015, 11:59:31 PM
This is what OWU's website says:

Branch Rickey Arena seats 1450 for basketball and has been the site for NCAA Division III playoff games for both genders as well as several North Coast Athletic Conference and Ohio Athletic Conference tournaments.

That's quite a difference from 2300. I've not been there, but it looks like quite a place.

From my memory, the 1450 number sounds more realistic.  Each side is a single level of no more than fifteen rows, stretching from end line to end line.  There is no end seating.  Do we have any rocket scientists who can produce a number from this? :)

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-F7ye86sL9hY/UWgdHCzEIZI/AAAAAAAAC1M/38aK1Lx9LRo/s1600/Branch_Rickey_Arena_2013_dt.jpg

As Wally pointed out, it is a dark arena.  Especially so when Wooster plays there and the lights at the Scots end of the court are dimmed.  OWU: has the Ohio electricians union in its pocket. 
So will both ends be dimmed in the first game ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wallyworld12 on February 26, 2015, 02:58:42 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2015, 11:59:19 AM
Quote from: monsoon on February 25, 2015, 11:59:31 PM
This is what OWU's website says:

Branch Rickey Arena seats 1450 for basketball and has been the site for NCAA Division III playoff games for both genders as well as several North Coast Athletic Conference and Ohio Athletic Conference tournaments.

That's quite a difference from 2300. I've not been there, but it looks like quite a place.

From my memory, the 1450 number sounds more realistic.  Each side is a single level of no more than fifteen rows, stretching from end line to end line.  There is no end seating.  Do we have any rocket scientists who can produce a number from this? :)

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-F7ye86sL9hY/UWgdHCzEIZI/AAAAAAAAC1M/38aK1Lx9LRo/s1600/Branch_Rickey_Arena_2013_dt.jpg

As Wally pointed out, it is a dark arena.  Especially so when Wooster plays there and the lights at the Scots end of the court are dimmed.  OWU: has the Ohio electricians union in its pocket.

The lights aren't "dimmed," rather one end of the gym is a cinder block wall and the other is an arch that goes to the ground.  Lights on white surface = bright.  Lights near shadows = dark.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 26, 2015, 03:46:45 PM
For anybody wondering what the environment is like in Branch Rickey, for a playoff game, Here is an article from a St. Vincent supporter from a couple years ago when OWU hosted St. Vincent in a Regional:

http://pacsportsnetwork.blogspot.com/2013/03/ncaa-first-round-saint-vincent-at-ohio.html

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCAC4Life on February 26, 2015, 04:47:34 PM
I heard rumors that the baskets are ten feet two inches tall and the free throw line is really 16 feet from the basket. The rims are anti-dunk and will project a player into the ceiling if they try to hang on the rim. Then again, it could all just be rumors.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2015, 05:52:02 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2015, 11:59:19 AM
As Wally pointed out, it is a dark arena.  Especially so when Wooster plays there and the lights at the Scots end of the court are dimmed.  OWU: has the Ohio electricians union in its pocket.

LOL +1
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2015, 12:20:27 AM
My off-the-cuff probabilities to win the tournament:

Wooster: 33%
OWU: 29%
Wabash: 23%
Depauw: 15%
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ralph Lee Wilson on February 27, 2015, 02:32:03 PM
Off the cuff probabilities to fight:
Wabash: 100%
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 27, 2015, 02:55:12 PM
So Ralph, your predicting the other team wont.  ;) +1 by the way.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 27, 2015, 02:56:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 27, 2015, 12:20:27 AM
My off-the-cuff probabilities to win the tournament:

Wooster: 33%
OWU: 29%
Wabash: 23%
Depauw: 15%
I do not know nearly enough to make a prediction, So I will go with Boosters, with the slight change in flipping Wooster and OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 27, 2015, 06:18:36 PM
An ugly first half.  The Wooster guards can't come close to making a shot yet continue to fervently avoid getting the ball inside.  The one time that they did, to third-string post Derek Schwarz, he made a nice pass back out for a good three by Pannell.  Clearly that was too easy, because they've never attempted it again.  Sigh.com
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2015, 06:24:03 PM
Alternate take- tough defense both ways in the first half.  Wooster got a little something going in the last handful of minutes to get a quick lead.  Wabash got the last three points of the half to get a 25-23 lead at the break.  Offensive rebounding, oddly enough, is really keeping Wooster right in the game- 9 offensive rebounds in the first half for the Scots.  This is usually an area that Wabash dominates.  Set up for a tight second half here. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2015, 07:30:33 PM
Wooster proves to be a tad more clutch than Wabash tonight as the Scots get a 68-55 win in the first semi.  This was a tight game until about 3:30 to go when Fannely and Williams hit a pair of three pointers.  Wabash didn't have the answer and the Scots pulled away with free throws.  The Scots did a tremendous job of smothering Purvlicis specifically and denying the post in general.  Against this iteration of Wabash, if you keep the ball out of the painted area, you win. 

Wabash was outrebounded 41-34 which never happens.  Kasey Oetting's absence really shows up here.  Credit to Wooster's big guys for an outstanding rebounding effort tonight. 

Wabash finishes the season 18-9...a whale of a bounce back season.  Wabash had won a total of 17 games over the last two seasons, so the turnaround here can't be understated.  Wabash is one of two teams in the league to have beaten every other team in the league this year (OWU is the other) and it seems clear that Wabash is back to being a very relevant piece of this league.  As sad as I am to see this thing end, 2014-2015 has been really refreshing.  Wabash hoops is back...and I think the end of Wabash's NCAA drought is coming soon. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 27, 2015, 10:10:06 PM
Well rats. DePauw just beat OWU. Could have done without that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 28, 2015, 01:17:31 AM
I think OWU is OK with a C. But if DPU beats Wooster, I dunno if we get three.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 28, 2015, 01:24:04 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 28, 2015, 01:17:31 AM
I think OWU is OK with a C. But if DPU beats Wooster, I dunno if we get three.

Why wouldn't you get three? I don't see Wooster or OWU falling behind Mount Union or John Carroll.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2015, 09:16:14 AM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 28, 2015, 01:24:04 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 28, 2015, 01:17:31 AM
I think OWU is OK with a C. But if DPU beats Wooster, I dunno if we get three.

Why wouldn't you get three? I don't see Wooster or OWU falling behind Mount Union or John Carroll.

This is what I was wondering about after the Depauw win last night: Does a loss tonight knock Wooster out?  I was going to ask the rocket scientists on here, but apparently it's already been considered by at least some.

Let me ask another question, then: With a Wooster win, is there any chance that they would host in the first round?

By the way, a personal pox should be placed on the official that called a T on Evan Pannell after his dunk.  Ridiculous.  There was a trailing defender, and anytime that's the case, hanging on the rim a bit is the safest play for all concerned.  You're not the show, zebra.  Step to the dimly lit corners of the B.R.A.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on February 28, 2015, 09:18:14 AM
If DePauw beats Wooster, I think Wooster would be the third team since OWU swept the Scots head to head. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 28, 2015, 11:59:55 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2015, 09:16:14 AM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 28, 2015, 01:24:04 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 28, 2015, 01:17:31 AM
I think OWU is OK with a C. But if DPU beats Wooster, I dunno if we get three.

Why wouldn't you get three? I don't see Wooster or OWU falling behind Mount Union or John Carroll.

This is what I was wondering about after the Depauw win last night: Does a loss tonight knock Wooster out?  I was going to ask the rocket scientists on here, but apparently it's already been considered by at least some.

Let me ask another question, then: With a Wooster win, is there any chance that they would host in the first round?

By the way, a personal pox should be placed on the official that called a T on Evan Pannell after his dunk.  Ridiculous.  There was a trailing defender, and anytime that's the case, hanging on the rim a bit is the safest play for all concerned.  You're not the show, zebra.  Step to the dimly lit corners of the B.R.A.

Watching live I thought it was wrong too, until I rewound it and watched it again.  If Pannell just hangs on the rim he's fine, but he pulled himself up, that's a no-no every time unless someone is directly under them.  The trailing player stopped at the FT line.  In retrospect a pretty easy call I thought.  Pretty sure two refs called the T.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2015, 12:07:01 PM
Quote from: sac on February 28, 2015, 11:59:55 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2015, 09:16:14 AM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 28, 2015, 01:24:04 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 28, 2015, 01:17:31 AM
I think OWU is OK with a C. But if DPU beats Wooster, I dunno if we get three.

Why wouldn't you get three? I don't see Wooster or OWU falling behind Mount Union or John Carroll.

This is what I was wondering about after the Depauw win last night: Does a loss tonight knock Wooster out?  I was going to ask the rocket scientists on here, but apparently it's already been considered by at least some.

Let me ask another question, then: With a Wooster win, is there any chance that they would host in the first round?

By the way, a personal pox should be placed on the official that called a T on Evan Pannell after his dunk.  Ridiculous.  There was a trailing defender, and anytime that's the case, hanging on the rim a bit is the safest play for all concerned.  You're not the show, zebra.  Step to the dimly lit corners of the B.R.A.

Watching live I thought it was wrong too, until I rewound it and watched it again.  If Pannell just hangs on the rim he's fine, but he pulled himself up, that's a no-no every time unless someone is directly under them.  The trailing player stopped at the FT line.  In retrospect a pretty easy call I thought.  Pretty sure two refs called the T.

How would Pannell, going forward, know how far back the defender is?  Hmm, tried to find the video, but can't.  Not on the OWU site (I don't think) or YouTube.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 28, 2015, 12:14:17 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2015, 12:07:01 PM
Quote from: sac on February 28, 2015, 11:59:55 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2015, 09:16:14 AM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 28, 2015, 01:24:04 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 28, 2015, 01:17:31 AM
I think OWU is OK with a C. But if DPU beats Wooster, I dunno if we get three.

Why wouldn't you get three? I don't see Wooster or OWU falling behind Mount Union or John Carroll.

This is what I was wondering about after the Depauw win last night: Does a loss tonight knock Wooster out?  I was going to ask the rocket scientists on here, but apparently it's already been considered by at least some.

Let me ask another question, then: With a Wooster win, is there any chance that they would host in the first round?

By the way, a personal pox should be placed on the official that called a T on Evan Pannell after his dunk.  Ridiculous.  There was a trailing defender, and anytime that's the case, hanging on the rim a bit is the safest play for all concerned.  You're not the show, zebra.  Step to the dimly lit corners of the B.R.A.

Watching live I thought it was wrong too, until I rewound it and watched it again.  If Pannell just hangs on the rim he's fine, but he pulled himself up, that's a no-no every time unless someone is directly under them.  The trailing player stopped at the FT line.  In retrospect a pretty easy call I thought.  Pretty sure two refs called the T.

How would Pannell, going forward, know how far back the defender is?  Hmm, tried to find the video, but can't.  Not on the OWU site (I don't think) or YouTube.

You could rewind the game while watching live.  You are correct that Pannel couldn't know where the defender is, again though if he just hangs on the rim he's fine, no harm no foul.  But he doesn't, he pulls himself up and that will get a T  unless there's a player directly beneath.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 28, 2015, 01:27:55 PM
I'd be fine if refs weren't concerned about what kind of gymnastics players do on the rim when they dunk. If you get a runout dunk and want to do chin ups, fine. You earned it.  But that's not how it is and they say you can't pull up on the rim when you dunk. He did, so he got the technical foul. This is one where I fault a dumb rule and not the refs. They called it the way they were supposed to.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 28, 2015, 01:46:18 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 28, 2015, 01:27:55 PM
I'd be fine if refs weren't concerned about what kind of gymnastics players do on the rim when they dunk. If you get a runout dunk and want to do chin ups, fine. You earned it.  But that's not how it is and they say you can't pull up on the rim when you dunk. He did, so he got the technical foul. This is one where I fault a dumb rule and not the refs. They called it the way they were supposed to.

I agree its a dumb rule, but he's been called for this a few times in his career at Wooster and he really should know better. But man, he's fun when he has an open court like that!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2015, 05:19:12 PM
Did anyone notice what happened on the women's side yesterday? League champion and tournament host DePauw was thunderstruck by #5 seed OWU. The final this evening, between OWU and #2 Wittenberg, will be played in a largely empty gym.

All of this is like a mirror image of the men's. Although I am sure the OWU women and DePauw men are thrilled with their upset victories, on balance I bet the two schools would trade their victories.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2015, 07:43:32 PM
$100 to anyone who can get the color man off the air for the second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woosterbooster on February 28, 2015, 08:26:42 PM
**** THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!  Shove this up your ****ing ass, DIII!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 28, 2015, 08:52:12 PM
Sigh. You had one job, Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2015, 08:54:31 PM
I guess the CW is that the NCAC will now get three teams into the NCAA tournament. That's great, but I'm betting there'll be zero remaining in short order.

Congratulations to DePauw on their first championship.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on February 28, 2015, 09:34:58 PM
DePauw beats Wooster???  Is Wooster on the bubble?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 28, 2015, 10:06:56 PM
At least DePauw got done what they probably deserved last year as an at-large... going to the NCAAs :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 01, 2015, 09:14:04 AM
Has the NCAC ever had 3 teams in the tournament before? It is hard to see 3 coming from one league. Wooster's reputation may help but I have to think they are the odd man out this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MIAA in Exile on March 01, 2015, 09:37:11 AM
1995 for certain as Wooster, Witt, and Kenyon all qualified.  It was the first of a few years of 64 teams.  If I remember correctly, all three won in the first round, then Kenyon beat Wooster and BW beat Witt in the second round.  Kenyon then lost to eventual Runner-Up Manchester, coached by Steve Alford in the Sweet 16.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 01, 2015, 09:41:13 AM
Last year, Wooster, Wittenberg, Ohio Wesleyan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 01, 2015, 11:13:55 AM
Quote from: sac on March 01, 2015, 09:41:13 AM
Last year, Wooster, Wittenberg, Ohio Wesleyan.
Wow, thank you for the info, now that is a short memory.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on March 01, 2015, 01:55:43 PM
Witt, Wooster, and OWU all made it in 2012 as well.  This could be the 3rd time in 4 years the NCAC gets 3 bids to the tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on March 01, 2015, 04:48:42 PM
Thank you very much for that information. I believe at least one of those years the OAC had two schools in. That is a good sign.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 02, 2015, 09:52:02 AM
Pat and Dave mocked up a pretty favorable draw for the NCAC schools, I thought.  It'll be interesting to see what the NCAA has done and if the NCAC schools can avoid pods of doom on the opening weekend. 

After listening to the mock selection show last night, it doesn't seem like there's much doubt that both OWU and Wooster will receive invitations. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2015, 11:27:47 AM
I will be flabbergasted if either Wooster or DePauw are still alive a week from today, regardless of the draw. And I am not much more optimistic about OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2015, 01:00:31 PM
...and with the draw released, I am even less optimistic about OWU. I guess I don't understand why they get sent halfway across the country for a game they probably won't win (and if they should, then a game that they can't win), while Wooster, certainly and deservedly ranked below the Bishops, gets a nearby game they probably should win, followed by a game they could win.

Oh, and never mind about DePauw. Good on them for winning the NCAC tournament, and see you next year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ohigy on March 02, 2015, 01:06:38 PM
Wow!  Wooster gets a great draw and OWU gets a horrible draw.  I agree with David.  I really question why the Bishops were given the situation they received compared to a lower ranked (and 0-2 in head to head vs OWU) Scots team.  DePauw is going to be done quickly as well.  Tough day for the NCAC other than Wooster.  I think Coach Moore has the committee in his back pocket!   ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 02, 2015, 01:10:29 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 02, 2015, 01:00:31 PM
...and with the draw released, I am even less optimistic about OWU. I guess I don't understand why they get sent halfway across the country for a game they probably won't win (and if they should, then a game that they can't win), while Wooster, certainly and deservedly ranked below the Bishops, gets a nearby game they probably should win, followed by a game they could win.

OWU is within 500 miles of Wash. U., while Wooster is not, so Wooster couldn't get sent there without an extra flight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2015, 01:14:56 PM
It's not really an either/or situation. But yes, Wooster has benefited from its relatively eastern geography in the past, and maybe has done so again today. Still doesn't mean OWU deserves the brutal draw it received.

Anyway, the Scots, should they advance, will be decided underdogs at Marietta.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 02, 2015, 01:40:04 PM
How devastating was that semifinal loss for OWU?  Win that game and they probably get host, even if they had lost to Wooster in the final.  Lose and now you're a road team at the mercy of the bracketing.  As kind as the mock bracket was, the real deal was just the opposite.  The instinct is to say tough break for OWU, but the reality is that you kind of make your own breaks here- and losing your semifinal game on your own floor to a .500 conference team is an easy way to lose control of the situation. 

Brutal draw for DePauw, but that was probably always going to be the case. 

Wooster seems to have a decent draw, but I'm not sure how much that matters.  Something is off with the Scots.  Not sure what it is, but you can't be off in the tournament.  So even though Wooster seems to have a clearer path to the second week than our other two conference teams, I'm just not seeing this team playing the way they have winning more than one game (and that's maybe one game). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 02, 2015, 02:27:50 PM
OWU wasn't going to host, and in looking at geography that may have been the only option without having something else tip over all together.

Mt Union makes out like a bandit thanks to OWU!

If only we could have a geography-free tournament. Alas...

But, to be the champ you gotta beat 'em all anyway, no matter what round.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 02, 2015, 02:58:35 PM
Maybe not with a loss in the final, but had OWU won the league tournament, I think they'd have hosted instead of Marietta.  Maybe not.  What's for sure is that as soon as they lost to DePauw, they lost their home court next weekend and are stuck going wherever the bracket tells them to go.  Don't lose on your home floor in the league tournament...that's the take home message. 

And you're right, you have to win six games to win this thing no matter what and almost none of the games are going to be easy for anybody.  OWU just probably could have avoided a quartet of doom for one weekend had not blown it in the league tournament. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2015, 03:30:37 PM
Yes, you need 6 wins (absent a bye) to win the Doorstop, but that's not really the goal for OWU (despite what Mike DeWitt would certainly tell you, and his team.) Heck, they hang banners in gyms for Final Four appearances, and Sweet Sixteen beats going out in the first round.

I think a better performance by OWU in the NCAC tournament might have displaced Mt. Union before Marietta. I think the Pios were set for a home date regardless of the NCAC.

Despite my ongoing Negative Nancy routine, I do want to wish all three NCAC teams the best of success, and to congratulate the Scots on their 13th consecutive NCAA tournament bid. This will be their 24th appearance, pulling them into a third-place tie for all-time bids with Illinois Wesleyan (who also received a Pool C bid) and Hope (who did not), trailing only Scranton (26) and, of course, Wittenberg (27).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 04, 2015, 04:22:29 PM
2014-2015 All NCAC Men's Basketball (http://static.psbin.com/h/5/9ps4k98gqgp7ye/All-NCACmbkb15.pdf) announcement.  The board had the otY awards nailed.  Congrats to all of the honorees! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCACZip on March 04, 2015, 04:40:51 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 02, 2015, 01:10:29 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 02, 2015, 01:00:31 PM
...and with the draw released, I am even less optimistic about OWU. I guess I don't understand why they get sent halfway across the country for a game they probably won't win (and if they should, then a game that they can't win), while Wooster, certainly and deservedly ranked below the Bishops, gets a nearby game they probably should win, followed by a game they could win.

OWU is within 500 miles of Wash. U., while Wooster is not, so Wooster couldn't get sent there without an extra flight.

Why does this matter?..OWU plays in Wisconsin, Depauw is the one playing at Wash. St Louis...Wooster could of been sent to Wisconsin, its under 500 miles.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCACZip on March 04, 2015, 04:45:44 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 02, 2015, 01:14:56 PM
It's not really an either/or situation. But yes, Wooster has benefited from its relatively eastern geography in the past, and maybe has done so again today. Still doesn't mean OWU deserves the brutal draw it received.

Anyway, the Scots, should they advance, will be decided underdogs at Marietta.

I could see Marietta getting beat first round, I also see Woo getting past Miser..Marietta hasn't beat anyone great-great, only "good" teams, and they lost twice to a Mount Union team that got beat by Woo...With Marietta being 2 hours away from Wooster, First round will be a home game for the Scots. I see them rolling through the first two round, something changes for them come tournament time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 04, 2015, 05:00:46 PM
Quote from: NCACZip on March 04, 2015, 04:45:44 PM
I could see Marietta getting beat first round, I also see Woo getting past Miser..Marietta hasn't beat anyone great-great, only "good" teams, and they lost twice to a Mount Union team that got beat by Woo...With Marietta being 2 hours away from Wooster, First round will be a home game for the Scots. I see them rolling through the first two round, something changes for them come tournament time.

Maybe.  I'm not saying that Wooster won't flip a switch or something now that it is the NCAA tournament, but we've kind of been waiting for Wooster to really put it together all year and they haven't.  Getting pantsed by DePauw on Saturday isn't a strong indicator of what's to come. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2015, 06:38:55 AM
So, who can tell us anything at all about Misericordia?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on March 05, 2015, 08:36:18 AM
Quote from: NCACZip on March 04, 2015, 04:45:44 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 02, 2015, 01:14:56 PM
It's not really an either/or situation. But yes, Wooster has benefited from its relatively eastern geography in the past, and maybe has done so again today. Still doesn't mean OWU deserves the brutal draw it received.

Anyway, the Scots, should they advance, will be decided underdogs at Marietta.

I could see Marietta getting beat first round, I also see Woo getting past Miser..Marietta hasn't beat anyone great-great, only "good" teams, and they lost twice to a Mount Union team that got beat by Woo...With Marietta being 2 hours away from Wooster, First round will be a home game for the Scots. I see them rolling through the first two round, something changes for them come tournament time.

I'm failing to see much difference between the Etta and Woo resumes.  Neither one has beat any "great-great" teams.  They both beat Mount at home.  Honestly the only real difference I see is in their losses.  The Pios have no "bad" losses.  When your only losses are on the road at 2 NCAA tourney teams and in your conference title game that's not a team that seems to have lapses in their level of play.  I don't think the same can be said for the Scots this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: EttaFan1 on March 05, 2015, 10:54:48 AM
A "home game" for the scots?  That's rich.  Marietta has been selling out regularly this season.  Doubt Wooster has much in the way of a crowd advantage for that matchup. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 05, 2015, 11:18:51 AM
Quote from: EttaFan1 on March 05, 2015, 10:54:48 AM
A "home game" for the scots?  That's rich.  Marietta has been selling out regularly this season.  Doubt Wooster has much in the way of a crowd advantage for that matchup. 

Easy now...

Quote from: NCACZip on March 04, 2015, 04:45:44 PM
I could see Marietta getting beat first round, I also see Woo getting past Miser..Marietta hasn't beat anyone great-great, only "good" teams, and they lost twice to a Mount Union team that got beat by Woo...With Marietta being 2 hours away from Wooster, First round will be a home game for the Scots. I see them rolling through the first two round, something changes for them come tournament time.

Nobody was taking shots.  The first round neutral court game probably won't be very neutral. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: EttaFan1 on March 05, 2015, 01:51:54 PM
My bad....completely misread that post. 

I do expect Wooster to travel well (though our weather could impact that a little).  they do for baseball....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2015, 05:31:14 PM
I would expect several hundred Wooster fans at least to show. The question is, how many Marietta fans will pay the extra admission to root for Misericordia?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCACZip on March 05, 2015, 08:17:22 PM
Quote from: EttaFan1 on March 05, 2015, 01:51:54 PM
My bad....completely misread that post. 

I do expect Wooster to travel well (though our weather could impact that a little).  they do for baseball....

Quote from: David Collinge on March 05, 2015, 05:31:14 PM
I would expect several hundred Wooster fans at least to show. The question is, how many Marietta fans will pay the extra admission to root for Misericordia?

What is the weather down there now? and what is expected tomorrow?
I guarantee the first game will be a home game for the Scots, I've never seen a team travel as well as the Scots.
I highly doubt Etta fans would pay to root against the Scots, either team could beat them. If they make past first round.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GerryMeyer1966 on March 05, 2015, 10:37:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 05, 2015, 06:38:55 AM
So, who can tell us anything at all about Misericordia?
Misericordia, Regular Season and Tournament Champions of the Freedom Conference, School of about 1300 students in Dallas, PA (North of Wilkes-Barre
Record 21-6, 11-3 in Conference, Only faced one D-III Tournament team, Richard Stockton, loss 64-67 at home in November, Won Conference tournament on home court
Team is led by two Senior players
Joe Busacca, 5-10 Guard, POY in Freedom, 15.6 ppg, 2.9 apg, Scored
Steve Ware, 6-4 Forward,  14.7 ppg, 8.4 rpg
Griffin Sponaugle, 6-1 So Guard, 8.6 ppg, 3 pt shooter 40.7%
James Hawk, 6-10 So Center, 7.1 ppg, 5.1 rpg, only plays 18 minutes per game
Jamie Egan, 6-1 So Guard, 4.5 ppg
Jessie Urick, 5-10 So Guard, 5.1 ppg

Team Averages 67.3 ppg, Opponents average 60.7 ppg

Wooster will obviously need to defend Busacca and Ware well and shut down the 3 point shotter.

Go Scots, Will be in Marietta to see the game or games
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2015, 10:54:06 PM
Stunner in U. City:

DePauw 83, #14 Washington 73

Third straight win for DePauw over a ranked opponent, two of them on the opponent's home court. DPU advances to face #6 Augustana.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 05, 2015, 10:56:40 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 05, 2015, 10:54:06 PM
Stunner in U. City:

DePauw 83, #14 Washington 73

Third straight win for DePauw over a ranked opponent, two of them on the opponent's home court. DPU advances to face #6 Augustana.

DePauw was in the lead and generally in control throughout the game. Great result for the Tigers and the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: lefty2 on March 06, 2015, 06:18:06 AM
Pretty accurate info on Misericordia.

Misericordia is 1-1 against NCAA Tourney teams - they beat Scranton.

Team has ranked among national leaders in fg% defense and scoring defense throughout the year.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 06, 2015, 07:30:41 AM
Nicely done DePauw. I hope they can keep it going.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: EttaFan1 on March 06, 2015, 09:47:41 AM
Weather down here:

Yesterday we got 9-11" of that white global warming stuff.  Roads in town are still a mess (they closed one of the bridges and a state route south of town due to ice this morning). 

We aren't getting much of a warm up today, but Saturday and Sunday should improve that. 

I don't venture out to the interstate very often (no need to), so I have no idea how the conditions are there. 

Most Marietta fans will not be at the first game. 

And as a Marietta fan, I would much rather play Wooster than Misercordia.  It really doesn't matter who the better matchup would be, I would much prefer facing the "power school" (and the baseball fan in me carries over to help shape my ever lasting love for the Scots). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCACZip on March 06, 2015, 11:07:15 AM
Quote from: EttaFan1 on March 06, 2015, 09:47:41 AM
Weather down here:

Yesterday we got 9-11" of that white global warming stuff.  Roads in town are still a mess (they closed one of the bridges and a state route south of town due to ice this morning). 

We aren't getting much of a warm up today, but Saturday and Sunday should improve that. 

I don't venture out to the interstate very often (no need to), so I have no idea how the conditions are there. 

Most Marietta fans will not be at the first game. 

And as a Marietta fan, I would much rather play Wooster than Misercordia.  It really doesn't matter who the better matchup would be, I would much prefer facing the "power school" (and the baseball fan in me carries over to help shape my ever lasting love for the Scots).

Thanks for the information! #GoScots
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on March 06, 2015, 12:22:56 PM
Congrats to the Tigers!!!

DO NOT MESS WITH THE NCAC!!!!!

Good luck to OWU and the Scots......
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 06, 2015, 01:00:18 PM
I want to feel sorry for the midwest, because our ski season and ski resorts are struggling. We've had hardly any snow here, and the mountains haven't had much snow. The jet stream and the CA issues with warming and drought have hit here. Rain, yes, some but no snow.  And before you say Seattle, if you go over the Cascades it's a much different climate. We don't get much rain in the summer. I fear our fire season will be hellish with dry conditions and maybe more heat.

But having lived in Indiana and Minnesota, I emphasize, but I'm not crying.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 06, 2015, 06:35:22 PM
Axelrod is rocking an Adam Morrison stache.  Presented without further comment. 

More Axelrod- he's getting layups any time he wants it.  And I mean Any. Time.  I know it's OWU's game, but he's doing Olaf a favor when he kicks it out to a 3 shooter. 

This tournament timing format really helps the Bishops.  They aren't super deep and they shoot a ton of jumpshots- these extra media timeouts are a huge bonus for them. 

Good half here.  OWU led all half until actually after the buzzer.  Axelrod was great, but did make a freshman mistake at the end of the half by fouling an Olaf player shooting a 40 footer at the horn.  Olaf made two of the three foul shots and have a 37-36 lead at the break. 

Doesn't look good for the league champs.  Down 12 with 2 minutes to play.  Olaf has beaten OWU up inside, which you can do.  Gray hasn't been great, and they needed him to be great.  OWU will really rue losing that game to DPU.  They aren't in this brutal pod if that doesn't happen. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 06, 2015, 06:38:27 PM
Very nice result for Wooster.  Good bounce back from the NCAC final. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 06, 2015, 07:21:01 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 06, 2015, 06:38:27 PM
Very nice result for Wooster.  Good bounce back from the NCAC final. 

They sure played great tonight, but I'm pretty sure a good part of that had to do with level of the competition. Misericordia was supposed to be strong on defense, but it sure didn't show tonight.

Looks like a good one going between St Olaf and OWU!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 06, 2015, 08:14:56 PM
OWU goes down, 90-78.  :(

Next season, I think they should consider opening a branch campus in, say, Steubenville, and using that as their home base. Then maybe they could get into an Atlantic/Mid-Atlantic pod instead of the West/Central meatgrinder they always seem to draw.

Still, congratulations to Mike and the Bishops on a great, great season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 06, 2015, 10:13:56 PM
Prediction: If Marietta gets 120 tomorrow, they'll win. 

Also happening, the team that Kyle Brumett built at Defiance is about to take out the defending national champs in their own building.  There's a lot to like about that. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCACZip on March 07, 2015, 09:07:37 AM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 06, 2015, 10:13:56 PM
Prediction: If Marietta gets 120 tomorrow, they'll win. 

Also happening, the team that Kyle Brumett built at Defiance is about to take out the defending national champs in their own building.  There's a lot to like about that.

Yes, Very Impressive win by Defiance. Got home from the Woo game and watched that game online.
After watching some of the Etta game, I'm hoping my Scots can hang in there with them. But, I believe Etta just had an easier opponent. The team Etta played got beat by Pitt-Bradford. And if anyone knows anything about them..they would know they're not competition at all..probably should not base a team's strength off who they lose or win too, but seriously...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCACZip on March 07, 2015, 11:29:19 AM
Read two articles from the hometown of Miseracordia today.

Before the game: "But I'll tell you what. I wouldn't bet against those two seniors. I think they'll give somebody a run for their money. Big time." Speaking on the two Miser seniors...

After the game: Misericordia eliminated by dominant Wooster. . . Wooster was the only team all season to score 80 points on the Cougars. No one else had topped 77.
"(In the second half), they kinda punched us in the face," said senior Joe Busacca, who led the Cougars with 17 points in his final game. "And we just couldn't get back.
"That just speaks to our opponent. I think we're a pretty good team and they just handled us tonight."
"That's just a great team. ... They always made the extra pass. They had my head spinning on defense. You're just thinking, 'How are they finding these guys open?' "

and then Coach Moore makes the comment of the night, "Maybe they got a little tired," long-time Scots coach Steve Moore said.




Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 07, 2015, 12:33:39 PM
I wonder how much it cost coach Moore to have the refs call his team for 9 fouls more than Mis.
;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: NCACZip on March 07, 2015, 01:19:55 PM
Quote from: countyroad on March 07, 2015, 12:33:39 PM
I wonder how much it cost coach Moore to have the refs call his team for 9 fouls more than Mis.
;D
Whooh now, there will be none of that.  ;D I was very pleased with the refs last night, they were fair to both sides and let them play for the most part. I'd take those three any game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 07, 2015, 07:43:06 PM
Was Steve Moore checking texts there? Did you guys catch that?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 07, 2015, 07:48:55 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 07, 2015, 07:43:06 PM
Was Steve Moore checking texts there? Did you guys catch that?

Maybe the Browns general manager is at the game??

I didn't see him checking his phone this game, but I thought I had seen that at a game earlier this season.  Seems somewhat out of character for him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2015, 08:51:35 PM
Marietta's last three baskets were practically uncontested. Still an exciting game, and generally a good effort from the Scots. Congratulations to Marietta and good luck going forward.

So now we're all DePauw fans......right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on March 07, 2015, 08:54:17 PM
I was surprised how easily Ewing blew by the Woo defense down the stretch.  That layup against Brown to go up 3 was waaaay too easy.  He just went right and blew past him for an easy score.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 07, 2015, 09:47:19 PM
Lost in the shuffle of DePauw's magical run is that the NCAC semifinal victory over OWU was Bill Fenlon's 500th career win. Belated congratulations to Coach Fenlon! Let's make it 503 tonight!

-----------------

Alas, no; Augustana survives the Tiger menace 68-66. The NCAC season officially draws to a close. But it was a good ride.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 07, 2015, 09:50:13 PM
Epic NCAA tournament heartbreak for the NCAC tonight.

Great effort by both Wooster and DePauw, great season to watch in the league.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on March 08, 2015, 11:39:27 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 07, 2015, 07:48:55 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 07, 2015, 07:43:06 PM
Was Steve Moore checking texts there? Did you guys catch that?

Maybe the Browns general manager is at the game??

I didn't see him checking his phone this game, but I thought I had seen that at a game earlier this season.  Seems somewhat out of character for him.

Definitely looked like he was checking his phone when he left the court at halftime. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MrsBethG on March 09, 2015, 09:27:18 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on March 08, 2015, 11:39:27 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 07, 2015, 07:48:55 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on March 07, 2015, 07:43:06 PM
Was Steve Moore checking texts there? Did you guys catch that?

Maybe the Browns general manager is at the game??

I didn't see him checking his phone this game, but I thought I had seen that at a game earlier this season.  Seems somewhat out of character for him.

Definitely looked like he was checking his phone when he left the court at halftime.

Coach Moore was setting a timer/stopwatch on his phone. He does this at halftime to be sure he knows how much time is left before 2nd half when in the locker room with his team. Not checking texts :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 18, 2015, 07:00:37 PM
So Xavier Brown was named to the all-NCAC first team (for the fourth year, by the way, becoming just the second ever 4-time first teamer, joining Travis Schwab) and the D3hoops.com all-Region second team. Congratulations. But.....now, I freely admit that I have not been paying close attention this year like I have in years past, but were these honors well-deserved? I know he had good numbers when all was said and done, but during the season it seemed to me as often as not that he was either a non-factor or even a disappointment in games. Just how far off base am I?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 18, 2015, 07:32:48 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 18, 2015, 07:00:37 PM
So Xavier Brown was named to the all-NCAC first team (for the fourth year, by the way, becoming just the second ever 4-time first teamer, joining Travis Schwab) and the D3hoops.com all-Region second team. Congratulations. But.....now, I freely admit that I have not been paying close attention this year like I have in years past, but were these honors well-deserved? I know he had good numbers when all was said and done, but during the season it seemed to me as often as not that he was either a non-factor or even a disappointment in games. Just how far off base am I?

I'll admit that I was just as surprised as you with Brown's post-season awards. There were certainly times that he took over games, but he didn't play with nearly the consistency that he'd had in the past.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 18, 2015, 08:13:32 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 18, 2015, 07:32:48 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 18, 2015, 07:00:37 PM
So Xavier Brown was named to the all-NCAC first team (for the fourth year, by the way, becoming just the second ever 4-time first teamer, joining Travis Schwab) and the D3hoops.com all-Region second team. Congratulations. But.....now, I freely admit that I have not been paying close attention this year like I have in years past, but were these honors well-deserved? I know he had good numbers when all was said and done, but during the season it seemed to me as often as not that he was either a non-factor or even a disappointment in games. Just how far off base am I?

I'll admit that I was just as surprised as you with Brown's post-season awards. There were certainly times that he took over games, but he didn't play with nearly the consistency that he'd had in the past.

I suspect it may have been partly reputation/lifetime achievement award.  He was (deservedly) a pre-season AA, but I thought he was surpassed on his own team by Dan Fanelly.  (Kind of how on UWW, KJ Evans was the pre-season AA, but Quardell Young emerged as the PoY candidate.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 18, 2015, 09:20:55 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on March 18, 2015, 08:13:32 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on March 18, 2015, 07:32:48 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 18, 2015, 07:00:37 PM
So Xavier Brown was named to the all-NCAC first team (for the fourth year, by the way, becoming just the second ever 4-time first teamer, joining Travis Schwab) and the D3hoops.com all-Region second team. Congratulations. But.....now, I freely admit that I have not been paying close attention this year like I have in years past, but were these honors well-deserved? I know he had good numbers when all was said and done, but during the season it seemed to me as often as not that he was either a non-factor or even a disappointment in games. Just how far off base am I?

I'll admit that I was just as surprised as you with Brown's post-season awards. There were certainly times that he took over games, but he didn't play with nearly the consistency that he'd had in the past.

I suspect it may have been partly reputation/lifetime achievement award.  He was (deservedly) a pre-season AA, but I thought he was surpassed on his own team by Dan Fanelly.  (Kind of how on UWW, KJ Evans was the pre-season AA, but Quardell Young emerged as the PoY candidate.)

I was puzzled on what to do with him on my all-region ballot. I think I might have had him somewhere around 10th-11th. Definitely seemed like he was less of a factor. But he also has name recognition, to be sure, which probably helped him with voters.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 21, 2015, 04:12:07 PM
The honors keep rolling in for OWU. Congratulations to Nate Axelrod, the D3hoops.com national Rookie of the Year!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on July 15, 2015, 02:35:24 PM
Wittenberg schedule:  Wittenberg schedule:   http://www.wittenbergtigers.com/sports/mbkb/2015-16/schedule
The 4th team at the Zimmerman Classic will be WashU.  We'll all be looking forward to that WashU vs Earlham game.

DePauw schedule:  http://depauwtigers.com/sports/mbkb/2015-16/schedule
highlight at WashU's Lopata Classic:  WashU, Johns Hopkins and Pomona-Pitzer
Tampa shootout:  Coast Guard, Trinity, Tx. Buena Vista
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on July 15, 2015, 02:53:37 PM
Wabash schedule:  http://sports.wabash.edu/schedule.aspx?path=mbball
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on August 16, 2015, 07:55:39 AM
There were some updates in the Wooster Daily Record this morning on the Scots recruits for this year.  I didn't want to copy and paste as they require a subscription, but here's the list of newcomers:

Eric Bulic, 6-7, Brunswick
Jordan Stock, 6-5, Massilon
Simon Texidor, 6-1, Cleveland Villa Angela-St Joseph
Mitch Balser, 6-1, Centerburg
Reece Dupler, 6-1, Hebron Lakewood

Alex Baptiste: 6-7 transfer from Cincinnati State
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 18, 2015, 11:29:07 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on August 16, 2015, 07:55:39 AM
There were some updates in the Wooster Daily Record this morning on the Scots recruits for this year.  I didn't want to copy and paste as they require a subscription, but here's the list of newcomers:

Eric Bulic, 6-7, Brunswick
Jordan Stock, 6-5, Massilon
Simon Texidor, 6-1, Cleveland Villa Angela-St Joseph
Mitch Balser, 6-1, Centerburg
Reece Dupler, 6-1, Hebron Lakewood

Alex Baptiste: 6-7 transfer from Cincinnati State

Yes, Sports Fans - Outstanding recruiting class for the Scots.  :)  ;D  Dupler, Texidor and Stock are definitely the All Ohio headliners in this class!

Reece Dupler 6'2" Guard  All Ohio Division II  Third Team 19.5 ppg
Rated as the #50 Player in Ohio by Prep Hoops Ohio.  Played on the same AAU Team as Carlton Bragg (Kansas D1 Recruit)

Simon Texidor 6'2" Guard  All Ohio Division III  Honorable Mention  13.9 ppg
Rated as the #84 Player in Ohio by Prep Hoops Ohio.  Played on the same Cleveland VASJ High School Team as Carlton Bragg.  Team won the 2015 State Division III title

Jordan Stock 6'4"  Forward/Wing  All Ohio Division I  Honorable Mention  20.7 ppg
Rated as the #116 Player in Ohio by Prep Hoops Ohio.  Scored over 1,100 points in his career at Massillon High School

Here is a link to the Prep Hoops Ohio 2015 Basketball Rankings that list Dupler, Texidor and Stock:  http://www.prephoopsohio.com/2015-rankings

6'7" Alex Baptiste looks like a very nice transfer for a Post Player based on an internet video.  Eric Bulic from Brunswick was listed as 6'5" on the Brunswick HS Basketball website so not sure if he has grown or if the Wooster Daily Record misprinted his height?

One other commit not mentioned in the WDR article: Hunter Coia, 5'11" Point Guard from St. Petersburg, FL,  19.2 ppg last season (shot 70% from the floor)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on August 19, 2015, 07:13:16 PM
Wooster still hasn't posted the entire schedule for the upcoming season, but this year's Mose Hole Tourney will include Marietta, Mt. St. Joseph and Pitt-Bradford.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 19, 2015, 09:21:16 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on August 19, 2015, 07:13:16 PM
Wooster still hasn't posted the entire schedule for the upcoming season, but this year's Mose Hole Tourney will include Marietta, Mt. St. Joseph and Pitt-Bradford.

imderekpoe -thanks for the Mose Hole participants.  :)  I also found on the internet that Wooster is playing St. Mary's (MD) Seahawks in a Puerto Rico Tournament on December 19th.  Wooster usually plays a second team when they go to Puerto Rico and I have not located that opponent yet.

Also, the Wooster master calendar shows the Scots hosting Skidmore College on Saturday afternoon November 21st in the Al Van Wie tourney.  The calendar does not list any Friday 11/20 game(s) (yet) so it is not clear if the Al Van Wie tourney will be 4 teams or only 2 teams this year.  By the way, Skidmore returns most of their team from a squad that won 20 games and went to the NCAA tournament 2nd round last season.

Wooster will likely play only 7 non-conference games and 18 NCAC games for a regular season schedule total of 25.  So with the 2 Mose Hole opponents, St. Mary's and Skidmore, we are only missing 3 non-conference opponents.  Any other posters have the missing 3?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on August 20, 2015, 11:52:45 AM
Wooster is also playing Salisbury the day after the St. Mary's game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 20, 2015, 08:50:06 PM
Quote from: Pat Coleman on August 20, 2015, 11:52:45 AM
Wooster is also playing Salisbury the day after the St. Mary's game.

Thanks Pat, always appreciate your excellent work with this website as well!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on September 02, 2015, 06:37:31 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on August 19, 2015, 09:21:16 PM

Wooster will likely play only 7 non-conference games and 18 NCAC games for a regular season schedule total of 25.  So with the 2 Mose Hole opponents, St. Mary's and Skidmore, we are only missing 3 non-conference opponents.  Any other posters have the missing 3?


The Scots will travel to Cabrini on Nov 24.  I think that I've pretty much got the scheduled sorted out.  Still missing one opponent, presumably for the season opening Al Van Wie Rotary Classic.  I also don't have the dates for sure for the Denison games as neither Wooster or Denison has schedules posted yet, but I've made a guess.

11/20 Al Van Wie Rotary Classic
11/21 Al Van Wie Rotary Classic - Skidmore
11/24 @ Cabrini
12/02 @ OWU
12/05 DePauw
12/09 Denison or @Denison 
12/12 @ Wabash
12/19 St Mary's (MD) @ Puerto Rico
12/20 Salisbury @ Puerto Rico
12/28 Mose Hole (Marietta, St. Joseph, Pitt-Bradford)
12/29 Mose Hole (Marietta, St. Joseph, Pitt-Bradford)
1/06 @ Kenyon
1/09 @ Oberlin
1/13 Hiram
1/16 @ Wittenberg
1/20 Allegheny
1/23 @ DePauw
1/27 OWU
1/30 Wabash
2/03 Kenyon
2/06 Denison or @Denison
2/10 @ Hiram
2/13 Wittenberg
2/17 @ Allegheny
2/20 Oberlin

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on September 02, 2015, 09:22:43 PM
imderekpoe - I actually found the 2015-2016 Wooster schedule on the internet today though it is not yet linked to the Scots basketball page.  You have the schedule 98% correct and I can provide two minor adjustments.  :)

The other non-conference opponent is Silver Lake College out of Manitowoc, WI and Wooster will host them on November 19th.  It is not clear from the schedule if this is considered another game in the Al Van Wie tourney or just a separate game?  Silver Lake's head basketball coach is a Canton native, a graduate of Malone University and some of his coaching career has been in Ohio so he may have some type of connection with the Wooster coaches?

Wooster's schedule does show them playing at Cabrini on November 24th.  I think it is good that the Scots will play both Skidmore and Cabrini (two decent opponents) before they travel down to Delaware to play at Ohio Wesleyan on December 2nd.  Tough opening NCAC game on the road especially because OWU returns most of their team.

The other minor adjustment is that the Wooster schedule shows them playing Pitt-Bradford in the first round Mose Hole game on 12/29.  The Scots will then obviously play either Marietta or Mt. St. Joe's on 12/30 depending on the first night's results.  Would be great to see another Woo-Marietta matchup!

Wooster hosts Denison on 1/3 and plays at Denison on 2/6.

GO SCOTS
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on September 16, 2015, 08:18:17 PM
Wooster looking for an assistant coach
http://hoopdirt.com/job/assistant-coach-college-of-wooster-part-time/

any scoop out there?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on September 16, 2015, 08:43:34 PM
Quote from: sac on September 16, 2015, 08:18:17 PM
Wooster looking for an assistant coach
http://hoopdirt.com/job/assistant-coach-college-of-wooster-part-time/

any scoop out there?

I think that last year's JV coach was Casey Kaufman, who is the interim head coach this year at Malone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on September 28, 2015, 06:26:34 PM
Wooster's schedule has been posted.
http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2015-16/schedule
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on October 01, 2015, 09:23:24 PM
This can't be a good sign, right?
http://alleghenygators.com/news/2015/10/1/MBB_1001155800.aspx
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on October 02, 2015, 08:44:22 PM
Depends upon your point of view, Wally. If you're a fan of a different NCAC team, then that sign might turn out to read, "Free Cupcakes in Meadville!" I guess it depends upon whether or not you like cupcakes.

Allegheny just hired a new head coach, Bob Simmons, at the horrifyingly late date of July 28. (His predecessor, Jim Driggs, had resigned on June 10.) Classes started at Allegheny on August 25. You tell me what level of magic (or skullduggery) would've been necessary for a newly-hired coach to locate, observe, vet, persuade, and enroll a recruit in less than a month on the job, let alone a bunch of them, at a school that has very respectable admissions standards.

The Gators had eleven players from last season who would've been eligible to return this season. Those eleven constituted most of last season's rotation and two of the three double-digit scorers that the Gators had in 2014-15. Given the coaching change and the lackluster (albeit hardly disastrous) 11-15, 8-10 record of a year ago, it's a fair guess that some of those eleven will not be Gators again this coming season. I suspect that the best-case scenario is that Coach Simmons has to bring in a few warm bodies via the dreaded open-tryout route to fill out the 2015-16 roster for practice purposes and as injury insurance. Of course, the worst-case scenario is that enough of those eleven possible returnees declined to come back to force Coach Simmons to hold open tryouts for potential players who will actually see the floor in 2015-16.

Without knowing which and how many of those eleven players are back, it's hard to say just how dire are the straits that Coach Simmons faces. Open tryouts are never a good thing. But the pertinent questions are how many roster slots those open tryouts need to fill, and whether or not those slots are for team roles that are more than practice fodder.

I wish him well. This is an ugly situation to have to face in a brand-new job.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on October 02, 2015, 08:50:09 PM
I definitely understand that it can be a tough situation with a coaching change so late in the game.  But maybe I would have gone with some flyers around the rec center or an email to the student body as opposed to a full fledged story on alleghenygators.com. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on October 02, 2015, 08:51:16 PM
Good point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on October 02, 2015, 11:05:13 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on October 02, 2015, 08:50:09 PM
I definitely understand that it can be a tough situation with a coaching change so late in the game.  But maybe I would have gone with some flyers around the rec center or an email to the student body as opposed to a full fledged story on alleghenygators.com.
Quote from: Gregory Sager on October 02, 2015, 08:51:16 PM
Good point.

Yeah, although probably every coaching staff in the conference would have heard of it, it still might not be wise to publicly advertise that 'we are dead meat'. ::)

Probably won't help attendance either!  Unless there are a whole lot of 'freeway accident' gawkers or Rudy fans in the target audience. :o

[Or, despite being the furthest school from Indiana, a boatload of Hoosiers fans!]
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on October 04, 2015, 12:41:20 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on October 02, 2015, 08:50:09 PM
I definitely understand that it can be a tough situation with a coaching change so late in the game.  But maybe I would have gone with some flyers around the rec center or an email to the student body as opposed to a full fledged story on alleghenygators.com.

That may be done as well... and they may be using the website for those who want more information.

Late coaching hires of programs struggling tend to do this. You never know if there are players on campus who didn't have an interest in playing prior and now you can get access to them because they figured why not. Only 10% of high school players play any kind of college level sports - there are bound to be good players just sitting in their dorm room who previously didn't have an interest in playing. For a late-hire coach, getting a sense of what talent you have on the entire campus isn't a bad idea.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoostAr on October 08, 2015, 05:29:33 PM
College of Wooster with an interesting tie to Coach Popovich of the Spurs:

http://grantland.com/features/nba-gregg-popovich-san-antonio-spurs-history-coach-division-three-pomona-pitzer-college-sagehens/

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 18, 2015, 12:59:16 PM
Wooster's website now lists the 2015-2016 returning 9 letter winners:

Seniors:  Alex LaLonde, Josh Kipfer, Chris Logsdon

Juniors: Dan Fanelly, Milt Davis, Nick Nossaman

Sophomores: Spencer Williams, Ari Stern, Derek Schwarz
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on October 20, 2015, 12:40:25 PM
I know that in Baseball most of the NCAC teams have fall ball. Usually the first day of that Fall ball is open tryouts. Is this different in Basketball because it being a winter sport?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on October 20, 2015, 12:55:54 PM
I'm pretty sure there isn't a non-traditional season for the winter sports in general, basketball specifically.  Not sure about the open tryout thing.  I imagine it happens some places and doesn't in most others. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on October 20, 2015, 02:15:52 PM
There is no non-traditional season, or practice season for basketball (or ice hockey, or the rest of the winter sports)... though, I've heard of at least one suggestion of having a ten-day period in September to help welcome everyone back and get new students on board earlier (especially meeting with coaches) that would then cut the one-month period at the beginning down to more like two or so weeks (the one-month pre-season needs to be addressed, IMHO).

As for try outs... up to the school and the program. There are hundreds of reasons to conduct them or not... and those reasons are usually all based on the situation, program, school, etc.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 26, 2015, 01:14:19 PM
FWIW, Allegheny's roster has 6 seniors, 2 juniors and 2 sophomores listed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on October 26, 2015, 07:42:39 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on October 02, 2015, 08:44:22 PM
Depends upon your point of view, Wally. If you're a fan of a different NCAC team, then that sign might turn out to read, "Free Cupcakes in Meadville!" I guess it depends upon whether or not you like cupcakes.

Allegheny just hired a new head coach, Bob Simmons, at the horrifyingly late date of July 28. (His predecessor, Jim Driggs, had resigned on June 10.) Classes started at Allegheny on August 25. You tell me what level of magic (or skullduggery) would've been necessary for a newly-hired coach to locate, observe, vet, persuade, and enroll a recruit in less than a month on the job, let alone a bunch of them, at a school that has very respectable admissions standards.

The Gators had eleven players from last season who would've been eligible to return this season. Those eleven constituted most of last season's rotation and two of the three double-digit scorers that the Gators had in 2014-15. Given the coaching change and the lackluster (albeit hardly disastrous) 11-15, 8-10 record of a year ago, it's a fair guess that some of those eleven will not be Gators again this coming season. I suspect that the best-case scenario is that Coach Simmons has to bring in a few warm bodies via the dreaded open-tryout route to fill out the 2015-16 roster for practice purposes and as injury insurance. Of course, the worst-case scenario is that enough of those eleven possible returnees declined to come back to force Coach Simmons to hold open tryouts for potential players who will actually see the floor in 2015-16.

Without knowing which and how many of those eleven players are back, it's hard to say just how dire are the straits that Coach Simmons faces. Open tryouts are never a good thing. But the pertinent questions are how many roster slots those open tryouts need to fill, and whether or not those slots are for team roles that are more than practice fodder.

I wish him well. This is an ugly situation to have to face in a brand-new job.

Quote from: smedindy on October 26, 2015, 01:14:19 PM
FWIW, Allegheny's roster has 6 seniors, 2 juniors and 2 sophomores listed.

IOW, ten of the possible eleven returnees came back to play for the Gators this season, despite the coaching change. That's almost the entire 2014-15 Allegheny rotation, so the Gators should be just fine this coming season. The question is whether the four incoming freshmen are holdover recruits who decided to stick with their college choice despite the change in coaches over the summer, or true walk-ons who made the team at the open tryout and will function as "program players" (i.e., warm bodies who fill out the roster for practice purposes), or some combination thereof.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on October 26, 2015, 09:12:02 PM
I know that at least one of the Allegheny freshmen is not a true walk-on; he chose Allegheny specifically because he could play both football and basketball, and made his commitment before the coaching change.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ruysdael on November 04, 2015, 10:32:09 AM
Did anyone get a chance to take in Wooster's Black and Gold scrimmage yesterday?  If so, how did the Scots look?  I'm particularly interested to hear about the incoming class of recruits.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 04, 2015, 11:35:51 AM
http://www.northcoast.org/sports/mbkb/2015-16/releases/coachespoll
OWU is the favorite of the coaches, followed by Woo, Witt, wab, and DPU.
I wonder who besides Mike DeWitt voted for the Scots?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 12, 2015, 11:07:14 AM
http://events.lls.org/pages/coh/honoringcoachgoodwin (http://events.lls.org/pages/coh/honoringcoachgoodwin)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on November 12, 2015, 12:23:29 PM
Owu's season preview.

http://www.battlingbishops.com/news/2015/11/12/MBB_201516pre_1.aspx
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on November 12, 2015, 07:28:22 PM
Here's Wooster's:
http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2015-16/releases/20151105gb81i9

The season kicks off in less than a week!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashcpa on November 17, 2015, 11:40:24 PM
A "Welcome to Wabash" for Johnny Jager - 19 pts in his first game for the LG's in their win over Illinois Tech.  Think we got us a good one here!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 18, 2015, 12:00:05 AM
Quote from: wabashcpa on November 17, 2015, 11:40:24 PM
A "Welcome to Wabash" for Johnny Jager - 19 pts in his first game for the LG's in their win over Illinois Tech.  Think we got us a good one here!

18 and 14 for Purvlicis as well.  Solid opener for those two.  Things will escalate quickly this weekend as Wabash heads up to Wheaton for a game with Defiance.  Host Wheaton and George Fox (bit of a roadie for those guys) are the other pair for the weekend. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 18, 2015, 09:38:15 AM
The NCAC-OAC Challenge, which admittedly did not feature the best the OAC had to offer, was a clean sweep for our boys. On Saturday at Otterbein, Wittenberg dumped Capital 87-78, after which Ohio Wesleyan squeezed past the hosts 80-75. Last night in Springfield, the reversal of the matchups produced similar results, victories for OWU, 72-59 over Capital, and for Witt, 71-41 over the Cards.

Elsewhere the conference recorded wins for DePauw, Oberlin, and Wabash, offset by losses for Allegheny and Kenyon (to D1 Miami of Ohio), bringing the conference's aggregate record to 8-4. Of those losses, two were to D1 competition (Hiram got smacked around by MAC favorite Akron on Monday), while the other two belong to Allegheny. Denison begins its campaign tonight at Washington & Jefferson, and Wooster, last to start on Thursday, hosts Silver Lake College, a USCAA squad from Manitowoc WI off to a 3-6 start but coming off back-to-back losses (to Grinnell and UW-Parkside) by a combined 85 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2015, 05:07:39 PM
Denison 78, W&J 63
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 19, 2015, 07:42:15 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 56  Silver Lake 14  :)

Wooster played 11 players in the half and 9 got into the scoring column.  Scots being led by Milt Davis with 10 points, Spencer Williams with 8, Alex LaLonde with 8 and freshman Jordan Stock with 7 points.

Starting lineup for Wooster was Dan Fanelly, Alex LaLonde, Spencer Williams, Ari Stern and freshman Eric Bulic.

The initial 3 subs off the bench were Alex Baptiste, Milt Davis and freshman Mitch Balser.  Next 2 subs were freshmen Reece Dupler and Jordan Stock.  Josh Kipfer was the 11th sub into the game.

Wooster looks incredibly deep in talent this year but obviously Silver Lake is not the best measuring stick.  ::)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on November 19, 2015, 07:45:16 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 19, 2015, 07:42:15 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 56  Silver Lake 14
I know they're a USCAA team, but I'll still really impressed with how Wooster's playing
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 19, 2015, 07:55:11 PM
Quote from: WooClone15 on November 19, 2015, 07:45:16 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 19, 2015, 07:42:15 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 56  Silver Lake 14
I know they're a USCAA team, but I'll still really impressed with how Wooster's playing

Silver Lake has not updated their basketball record since 2012.  That probably tells you all you need to know.

I'm really kind of shocked that as quality a program as Wooster would sink this low - did someone else pull out at the last minute?  Even being boys against men, there are MANY high school teams that could whip Silver Lake.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on November 19, 2015, 08:23:16 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 19, 2015, 07:55:11 PM

Silver Lake has not updated their basketball record since 2012.  That probably tells you all you need to know.

I'm really kind of shocked that as quality a program as Wooster would sink this low - did someone else pull out at the last minute?  Even being boys against men, there are MANY high school teams that could whip Silver Lake.
No idea, but on the other hand. It isn't just Wooster who's playing them. There are several d1 and d2 teams who are playing them as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 19, 2015, 08:35:37 PM
Final:  Wooster 89  Silver Lake 48  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoostAr on November 19, 2015, 08:38:49 PM
Quite a few blowouts on Silver Lakes schedule, none quite this bad -- weird for Wooster to schedule a cupcake like that -- in the recent past when they've gone outside the NCAA it was to play tough teams.  (GSAC schools in 2013 come to mind)

Guess it was an opportunity to see the whole team play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 19, 2015, 10:15:33 PM
Yeah, who knows. Clearly Wooster couldn't hope to get much out of this game, and Steve Moore has said many times that he prefers a tough non-con schedule. Off the top of my head, I know they have Skidmore (next), Cabrini, and Marietta ahead, so it gets better.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 20, 2015, 12:10:19 PM
My guess is that Silver Lake initiated the contact. They play tonight at Ashland and tomorrow at Ohio Dominican, so they probably were contemplating a Scenic Ohio road swing all along. Probably they wanted to educate their Wisconsinite players about how really GOOD cheese is made.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2015, 01:17:56 AM
The non-Allegheny portion of the NCAC fell off the "undefeated vs. D3" wagon in a big way tonight, as Kenyon, Oberlin, Denison, Wabash, and DePauw all lost to D3 opponents. (Allegheny got drubbed again as well, 84-51 at the hands of Adrian. Guess those open tryouts didn't work out so well.) Denison's was especially bad, losing by 2 to an Otterbein squad that had just been humiliated at Witt. At least OWU was an easy winner, and Hiram won a tight game over Thiel, bringing the conference to 12-10 overall, 11-8 vs. D3 (including Wabash's win over IIT, a provisional member of D3.)

Everyone but Wittenberg is teeing it up again on Saturday; hopefully the Tigers will use their day off to cheer on their volleyball team, who takes on Cal Lutheran tomorrow night at Calvin College, with nothing less than the national championship trophy at stake. Tiger Up!
http://www.northcoast.org/sports/wvball/2015-16/releases/WIT-Nationals
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 21, 2015, 01:39:10 PM
At the Half:  Skidmore 34  Wooster 26

Not a good shooting performance by Wooster in the first half as they missed several open shots.  Scots shot only 31% from the floor and were 1 of 10 on three point shots.  Dan Fanelly got in early foul trouble with two quick fouls and Jordan Stock sprained his ankle shortly after entering the game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on November 21, 2015, 01:43:30 PM
Great video feed  :) but who is the motor mouth. Need to tell him a little dead air isn't a bad thing ???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 21, 2015, 02:30:25 PM
Wooster has no offensive flow in this game.  The Scots are not running any offensive plays to get an open shot -- too much dribbling and too many bad forced shots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 21, 2015, 02:46:55 PM
Final:  Skidmore 72  Wooster 63

Wooster shot less than 37% from the floor overall and only 2 of 20 on three point shots. ???  Those stats translate to a loss vs. a solid opponent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2015, 06:42:50 PM
So far today, everyone except Wooster has won; the list includes Kenyon (first win of the season), Hiram, Denison, OWU, and Oberlin. Winless Allegheny trails CWRU by 13 late, Wabash is just underway, and DePauw tips in a few minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on November 21, 2015, 07:22:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 21, 2015, 06:42:50 PM
So far today, everyone except Wooster has won; the list includes Kenyon (first win of the season), Hiram, Denison, OWU, and Oberlin. Winless Allegheny trails CWRU by 13 late, Wabash is just underway, and DePauw tips in a few minutes.
Well we might have then ruined the perfect cake today. whoops
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 21, 2015, 08:51:56 PM
Quote from: WooClone15 on November 21, 2015, 07:22:21 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 21, 2015, 06:42:50 PM
So far today, everyone except Wooster has won; the list includes Kenyon (first win of the season), Hiram, Denison, OWU, and Oberlin. Winless Allegheny trails CWRU by 13 late, Wabash is just underway, and DePauw tips in a few minutes.
Well we might have then ruined the perfect cake today. whoops
Naw, Allegheny can always be counted on to lose, and lose they did, by 17. DePauw also lost, as did the Wittenberg volleyball team, alas. Wabash won. All games were vs. D3 opposition, so 18-13 / 17-11.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 24, 2015, 09:02:09 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 35  Cabrini 26

Wooster's offense looked better in the first half thanks mostly to Spencer Williams who kept driving to the hoop.  Williams had 11 points in the half.  Dan Fanelly had 7 points in the half (including a 4 point play) before picking up two fouls and going to the bench.  Scots made 6 three point shots in the first half.

Josh Kipfer sprained his ankle and was getting it iced during the game.  Freshman Jordan Stock has a high ankle sprain and did not make the trip -- may be another 1-2 weeks before he returns to the court.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 24, 2015, 09:26:19 PM
Wittenberg has raced out to a one-game lead over the field, besting Oberlin 80-68 in the conference lidlifter. OWU destroyed Trine 70-53, keeping them and the Tigers as the Clemson-and-Iowa of the NCAC. Elsewhere, we saw three close wins and one Allegheny:
CMU 60, Alleghopeless 43
Wabash 65, RHIT 63
Denison 80, CWRU 79
DePauw 80, Earlham 74

Pending the Wooster result, we sit as 22-13 non-conference overall, 21-11 vs. D3. (These are correct, or at least match the standings at northcoast.org. Evidently my numbers in my previous post were wrong.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 24, 2015, 09:59:30 PM
Wooster will get the win tonight as they lead 75-56 with only 1:39 left in the game.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 24, 2015, 10:03:18 PM
Final:  Wooster 79  Cabrini 59  ;D

Nice road win for the Scots as they looked much better offensively tonight.  Wooster was led by Spencer Williams who penetrated the lane often and notched 18 points, 6 boards.  Freshman Mitch Balser ran the point well and contributed 14 points.  Dan Fanelly added 13 points and Alex LaLonde chipped in 11.

Wooster shot much better tonight (48% from the floor) and made 10 three pointers for the game.  Scots controlled the 2nd Half with Cabrini only cutting the lead to 7 points once.

Wooster is now 2-1.  Next game is at Ohio Wesleyan in a tough NCAC opener on 12/2.

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 24, 2015, 10:10:59 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 24, 2015, 10:03:18 PM
Final:  Wooster 79  Cabrini 59

If Cabrini still had Aaron Walton-Moss I'd be much more impressed. ;)

Don't really know, but I doubt they are much this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 24, 2015, 10:16:52 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 24, 2015, 10:10:59 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 24, 2015, 10:03:18 PM
Final:  Wooster 79  Cabrini 59

If Cabrini still had Aaron Walton-Moss I'd be much more impressed. ;)

Don't really know, but I doubt they are much this year.

Cabrini did get a solid road win at #21 Dickinson College to open the season so this was a good win for Wooster even if doesn't impress a CCIW fan.   ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 24, 2015, 10:21:46 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 24, 2015, 10:10:59 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 24, 2015, 10:03:18 PM
Final:  Wooster 79  Cabrini 59

If Cabrini still had Aaron Walton-Moss I'd be much more impressed. ;)

Don't really know, but I doubt they are much this year.

God, I hope Steve Moore doesn't read this page. He'd be inconsolable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 24, 2015, 10:39:52 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 24, 2015, 10:16:52 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 24, 2015, 10:10:59 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 24, 2015, 10:03:18 PM
Final:  Wooster 79  Cabrini 59

If Cabrini still had Aaron Walton-Moss I'd be much more impressed. ;)

Don't really know, but I doubt they are much this year.

Cabrini did get a solid road win at #21 Dickinson College to open the season so this was a good win for Wooster even if doesn't impress a CCIW fan.   ;)

This IWU fan is properly chastened.  We are not only #3 in the CCIW (Augie #1, Elmhurst #8), we are #3 among the Wesleyans (Va Wes #2, OWU #13) (we're #24).  We lost in the national semis in 2012, when Walton-Moss was only the #2 guy as a freshman.  Cabrini is currently 2-3 on the season.  WAY too early to declare them good or bad, but I suspect they have lost the two best players they will ever have, and are now so-so at best, but I don't really follow them.

David, caught your post before I hit 'post' - I doubt I said anything Steve Moore didn't already believe, and that he would care what I said! :D

Saturday it is OWU @ IWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 24, 2015, 11:13:54 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 24, 2015, 10:39:52 PM

David, caught your post before I hit 'post' - I doubt I said anything Steve Moore didn't already believe, and that he would care what I said! :D


Don't sell yourself short, Chuck. I happen to know that Coach Moore values your unsolicited opinions exactly as much as we all do.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 24, 2015, 11:23:51 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 24, 2015, 11:13:54 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 24, 2015, 10:39:52 PM

David, caught your post before I hit 'post' - I doubt I said anything Steve Moore didn't already believe, and that he would care what I said! :D


Don't sell yourself short, Chuck. I happen to know that Coach Moore values your unsolicited opinions exactly as much as we all do.

Just so I can know HOW much to cringe, is that 'zero' or 'less than zero'? ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 25, 2015, 02:07:24 PM
In now way am I offering an opinion one way or the other its just not often an opportunity to post a relevant Robert Downey Jr. picture presents itself.
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fheritagetalon.org%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2015%2F10%2Fless-than-zero-475x318.jpg&hash=782a8073ae5dbb322d03081851c9a99406cf777b)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Schwami on November 25, 2015, 02:15:24 PM
Quote from: sac on November 25, 2015, 02:07:24 PM
In now way am I offering an opinion one way or the other its just not often an opportunity to post a relevant Robert Downey Jr. picture presents itself.
(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fheritagetalon.org%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2015%2F10%2Fless-than-zero-475x318.jpg&hash=782a8073ae5dbb322d03081851c9a99406cf777b)

Now that's cringeworthy!  ;D 8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 25, 2015, 02:58:40 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 24, 2015, 11:23:51 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 24, 2015, 11:13:54 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 24, 2015, 10:39:52 PM

David, caught your post before I hit 'post' - I doubt I said anything Steve Moore didn't already believe, and that he would care what I said! :D


Don't sell yourself short, Chuck. I happen to know that Coach Moore values your unsolicited opinions exactly as much as we all do.

Just so I can know HOW much to cringe, is that 'zero' or 'less than zero'? ::)

Let's ask the huddled masses, yearning to breathe free. Cast your vote within the next seven days, no photo ID necessary.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 25, 2015, 11:32:45 PM
You didn't have i as an option.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pointlem on November 26, 2015, 07:21:24 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 25, 2015, 02:58:40 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 24, 2015, 11:23:51 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 24, 2015, 11:13:54 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 24, 2015, 10:39:52 PM

David, caught your post before I hit 'post' - I doubt I said anything Steve Moore didn't already believe, and that he would care what I said! :D


Don't sell yourself short, Chuck. I happen to know that Coach Moore values your unsolicited opinions exactly as much as we all do.

Just so I can know HOW much to cringe, is that 'zero' or 'less than zero'? ::)

Let's ask the huddled masses, yearning to breathe free. Cast your vote within the next seven days, no photo ID necessary.
Woops . . . I value Mr. Ypsi's contributions . . . and thot I was voting "more than zero" (but misread the option)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 28, 2015, 06:09:35 PM
Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 94  Illinois Wesleyan 85   ;D  Game played AT Illinois Wesleyan

Hmmm....I wonder if Mr. Ypsi considers this to be a significant road win for the NCAC??!! ;) 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2015, 08:33:33 PM
Denison acquitted themselves quite well at D1 Davidson today, dropping an 83-70 decision. The Big Red canned 15 three-pointers, allowing them to play two close halves (trailed 45-37 at the break) against the 4-0 Wildcats. Davidson's leading scorer on the afternoon, with 23, was DU alum and assistant coach Chris Sullivan's younger brother Brian. The win was Davidson's Bob McKillop's 500th in his career.

Elsewhere, Hiram bested Otterbein (Wednesday), unbeaten Wittenberg topped Millikin at Rhodes College in Memphis, and Allegheny (drumroll please..........) lost, this time to Behrend by 13.

Non-conference 26-16, 25-13 vs. D3, 26-10/25-7 excluding Allegheny.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 28, 2015, 08:34:36 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 28, 2015, 06:09:35 PM
Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 94  Illinois Wesleyan 85   ;D  Game played AT Illinois Wesleyan

Hmmm....I wonder if Mr. Ypsi considers this to be a significant road win for the NCAC??!! ;)

Two words: Jack Sikma.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 28, 2015, 10:04:39 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 28, 2015, 08:34:36 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 28, 2015, 06:09:35 PM
Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 94  Illinois Wesleyan 85   ;D  Game played AT Illinois Wesleyan

Hmmm....I wonder if Mr. Ypsi considers this to be a significant road win for the NCAC??!! ;)

Two words: Jack Sikma.

You're forgetting that Pat is now chastising me for referencing Keelan Amelianovich too often! ;D

I had hoped to attend the OWU @ IWU game earlier today (it is sorta on the way home from Thanksgiving), but I was out-voted.  Assuming my presence would not have changed the outcome (probably a safe assumption :P), that at least preserves my record of only personally witnessing ONE Titan loss in any sport in the last 45+ years.  (Admittedly, that is only a total of 12-14 bball and fball games. :()

wsf, pretty sure that is a significant road win for the NCAC - how significant depends on whether IWU is as good as I hope or as mediocre as I fear! ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 29, 2015, 07:28:07 PM
Wittenberg falls from the ranks of the unbeaten, dropping a nailbiter to Simpson, 69-67, in the championship game of the Rhodes College tournament, just down the street from where I used to live in Memphis. (But I digress.) OWU is now the last undefeated NCAC squad, but if they can get by Wooster at home Wednesday, they may stay unbeaten for a good long time.

Elsewhere Oberlin trounced Earlham, Kenyon trounced Muskingum, and DePauw, uh, lost to Rose-Hulman. A 2-2 day brings us to 28-18, 27-15 vs. D3, unless I'm very much mistaken.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on November 30, 2015, 09:12:15 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on November 28, 2015, 08:33:33 PM
Denison acquitted themselves quite well at D1 Davidson today, dropping an 83-70 decision. The Big Red canned 15 three-pointers, allowing them to play two close halves (trailed 45-37 at the break) against the 4-0 Wildcats. Davidson's leading scorer on the afternoon, with 23, was DU alum and assistant coach Chris Sullivan's younger brother Brian. The win was Davidson's Bob McKillop's 500th in his career.

Elsewhere, Hiram bested Otterbein (Wednesday), unbeaten Wittenberg topped Millikin at Rhodes College in Memphis, and Allegheny (drumroll please..........) lost, this time to Behrend by 13.

Non-conference 26-16, 25-13 vs. D3, 26-10/25-7 excluding Allegheny.
Chris played and graduated from Witt not Denison :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on November 30, 2015, 10:37:36 PM
Oops. Of course that's right. Sucks to get old. I did, however, get the other part right. (http://www.denisonbigred.com/information/directory/bios/sullivan_chris)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 01, 2015, 08:36:33 PM
Wabash beat the snot out of someone called Boyce College last night, 80-31. The Bulldogs are a USCAA team, so that moves us to 29-18 but doesn't push the peanut on the vs. D3 racetrack.

Tomorrow Wittenberg puts their week-old sole possession of first place on the line in the first full night of NCAC play. The highlight is, of course, Wooster's trip to Delaware to face the #6 Bishops, but only slightly less intriguing are the matchups of Denison at DePauw, Wittenberg at Wabash, and Kenyon at Oberlin, while Hiram at Allegheny is intriguing in its own pathetic way. (Good thing there's no Gator fans around anymore to smite me.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on December 01, 2015, 09:35:19 PM
I'll take all the teams on the road for tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 02, 2015, 12:19:23 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 01, 2015, 08:36:33 PM
Wabash beat the snot out of someone called Boyce College last night, 80-31. The Bulldogs are a USCAA team, so that moves us to 29-18 but doesn't push the peanut on the vs. D3 racetrack.

Boyce did take Capital to overtime at Sewanee's tournament, so take that for what little it might be worth.   :)

Looking forward to a big one at Chadwick tomorrow night vs. Wittenberg.  Going to be a big test for what has turned out to be a very young Wabash team this season.  Should be a fun season inside the league this year.  Looks like we have some nice depth of quality here. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 02, 2015, 02:00:33 PM
Well, I guess the NCAC is blowing the lid right off as far as lid lifters go for the first full night of conference action with the top 4 teams in the media poll all going against one another on night one...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 02, 2015, 04:00:48 PM
Taking into account pointlem's miscast vote, Mr. Ypsi has gutted out a plurality in our little election with 7 votes, as the anti-Ypsi forces split their votes between zero (4 votes) and less than zero (5). Thanks to all for participating in our peaceful demonstration of democracy in action.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gordonmann on December 02, 2015, 04:10:44 PM
It's someone's birthday so I hope Wooster wins for his sake. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on December 02, 2015, 06:27:32 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 02, 2015, 04:00:48 PM
Taking into account pointlem's miscast vote, Mr. Ypsi has gutted out a plurality in our little election with 7 votes, as the anti-Ypsi forces split their votes between zero (4 votes) and less than zero (5). Thanks to all for participating in our peaceful demonstration of democracy in action.
Even though I voted for zero, I'd like to think I'm not anti-Ypsi. I just don't think any of our opinions really matter all that much (or whatever the actual wording was), but I still think his points are pretty good
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 02, 2015, 07:14:22 PM
Thanks, WC15.  I missed seeing the poll, so didn't even get to participate in my own demise! :D

Happy Birthday, Memphis. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 02, 2015, 08:05:54 PM
At the Half:  Ohio Wesleyan 44  Wooster 40

Wooster is being led by Dan Fanelly with 8 points and Josh Kipfer also with 8.  OWU is being led by Ben Simpson with 17 points, Nate Axelrod with 14 and Claude Gray with 7.

OWU shot 55% in the half while Wooster was at 50%.  The real difference in the half was turnovers with Wooster having 9 and OWU having only 5.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 02, 2015, 08:23:52 PM
Halftime at Chadwick:
Witt 39
Wabash 42

74 fouls called in the first half (unofficially).  Purvlicis had to sit the last 15:30 with two fouls.  Wabash's young bench really had a great half picking up for starters in early foul trouble.  LGs have six players with two fouls at the break.  Witt has four players with two fouls.  This is going to matter in the last 10 minutes of this game.  Johnny Jager leads Wabash with 13 points at the break.  No surprise that Jaelin Williams is the top scorer for Wittenberg with 11 points. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 02, 2015, 08:30:25 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on December 02, 2015, 07:14:22 PM
Thanks, WC15.  I missed seeing the poll, so didn't even get to participate in my own demise! :D

Happy Birthday, Memphis. ;D
Thanks, cabonney. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 02, 2015, 08:38:21 PM
Wooster has now given up two open layups midway through the 2nd half.  Is anyone playing defense?  ???  Game getting out of control for Wooster?

OWU 63  Wooster 50  with about 12 minutes left

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 02, 2015, 08:47:52 PM
Wooster doesn't have the Offensive Firepower to keep up with Ohio Wesleyan.  If you can't score CONSISTENTLY, you will not beat the Bishops because they are an offensive machine.  Scots go 3-4 minutes without scoring and meanwhile Ohio Wesleyan nails 2 or 3 three pointers during the same timeframe.

Ohio Wesleyan 77  Wooster 55  6 minutes left

Wooster has stopped defending and is now letting OWU shoot (and make) wide open three pointers.  ::)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 02, 2015, 08:56:05 PM
Final:  Ohio Wesleyan 88  Wooster 75

Final score is actually misleading because Wooster hit a few three pointers near the end of the game to narrow the final margin.

OWU scored the first 5 points after halftime, took a 9 point lead and never looked back.  After that, Wooster never got the margin under 10 points the entire second half. ::)

Here is the key stat for NCAC coaches to reflect on:  OWU is 7-0 and AVERAGING 84 points per game so you must score consistently to compete with them.

Wooster is now 2-2.  NCAC 0-1.  Next game is at home vs. DePauw on Saturday 12/5

GO SCOTS!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 02, 2015, 09:24:08 PM
Final from Chadwick:
Witt 74
Wabash 64

Witt outscored Wabash 27-7 over the last 12 minutes or so.  Tough one for Wabash here as they were in control and just went ice cold over the final ten minutes.  Gritty win for Witt.  Hopefully can take some positives from this one tonight and close these guys out next time around. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 02, 2015, 09:51:01 PM
The other finals:
Denison 80, at DePauw 67...DU announces itself as a threat, hosts OWU Saturday
at Oberlin 72, Kenyon 64
at Allegheny 71, Hiram 67...no, seriously
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2015, 11:44:48 AM
Allegheny's playing rope-a-dope with the NCAC... :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on December 03, 2015, 03:00:57 PM
Nearly three weeks into the college basketball season and there is plenty to talk about. Conference action is also starting for many programs while others are still getting up to speed in their out-of-conference schedules. On the women's side, not a lot of upsets; on the men's side, no one seems safe to an unforeseen loss. Tonight on Hoopsville, Dave talks to several teams who are still working off last season's success and battling expectations this season and others who may quietly change the conversation in their regions.

Hoopsville hits the air at 7PM ET - www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2015-16/dec3 (http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2015-16/dec3)

Guests include:
- Mike Miller, Messiah women's coach
- Nancy Fahey, No. 11 Washington Univ. women's coach
- Stephen Brennan, No. 11 Babson men's coach
- Mike DeWitt, No. 6 Ohio Wesleyan's men's coach

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com (http://www.d3hoopsville.com)
Twitter: @d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville (http://www.facebook.com/Hoopsville)
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville (http://www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville)
SoundCloud (podcast): www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville (http://www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville)

AND our podcast as been approved for iTunes!!! You should be able to find it... but here is a link, just in case: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087 (https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 03, 2015, 06:32:29 PM
OWU is studly.  I can't believe all of those dudes from last year are back.  They're going to be really, really tough to beat this season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 03, 2015, 08:52:33 PM
It's a new day here in the NCAC. I think Mike DeWitt and OWU have cleared the final hurdle and can banked on as a contender every year, right alongside Wooster. The recruiting is there, the coaching is there, the institutional support is in place. They're legitimate, as much as the Scots. Throw in some subset from among Wittenberg, Wabash, DePauw, and Denison, and you have a very solid top 4 or 5 that can contend in any given year, with 3 or 4 below them that are a threat on any given night and should be above .500 in the non-con. It's become a legitimately deep and talented league, topped by national contenders. Took a long time to get here, but it's nice to enjoy the sunshine.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 05, 2015, 05:23:48 PM
Allegheny guys.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 05, 2015, 05:39:10 PM
Allegheny indeed. The Gators go to Wittenberg and drop the conference co-leaders by 10. Allegheny now leads Witt, Woo, Wabash, DePauw, and almost everyone else in the standings at 2-0, tied only with OWU, also 10 point road victors today. In the words of the Wicked Witch, "what a world, what a world."

Elsewhere, Wooster took out some frustration on DePauw, 85-56; Hiram joined the 10 point road victors club at Kenyon, and Oberlin, who is better than you probably think, moved to 5-2 with a 59-50 win over Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 08, 2015, 10:37:52 PM
Kenyon shocks :o first-place Allegheny 74-62.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 09, 2015, 09:27:31 PM
Oberlin pushes homestanding Denison to overtime, but the Big Red guts it out 89-81.

Wabash outruns Greenville 115-96. New totals 30-18 overall, 28-15 vs. D3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on December 09, 2015, 09:51:26 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on December 09, 2015, 09:27:31 PM
Oberlin pushes homestanding Denison to overtime, but the Big Red guts it out 89-81.

Wabash outruns Greenville 115-96. New totals 30-18 overall, 28-15 vs. D3.

Greenville just started 'the System' this year, so will take their lumps as they learn it (IWU put up 150 on 'em earlier this season).  Additionally, they are apparently missing two of their better players right now, so may simply not have the personnel for the System.  I'll be fascinated to see what happens when they face SLIAC competition.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabndy on December 10, 2015, 10:31:30 AM
A little gift for Wittenberg fans.  My local paper runs reprints of old news photos from its archive every month.  This month's batch included three photos from Wittenberg's 1965 basketball game against Vanderbilt - which was the first game in a remodeled Memorial Gym.  Enjoy.

Original captions are from The Tennessean:
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/765/23545833562_3ee8a3c079_o.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/BSExZC)
With the new balconies in place, the largest crowd ever to see Vanderbilt play in Nashville, 9,212 fans, are watching the Commodores open their 1965-66 campaign by defeating Wittenberg 87-59 Dec. 1, 1965.
(https://farm6.staticflickr.com/5763/23358710410_d430e49ea5_o.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/BSExZC)
With the new balconies and press box serving as a backdrop, Vanderbilt's Kenny Gibbs is tossing an underhand pass to a teammate after diving for a loose ball. The Commodores open their season with an 87-59 win over Wittenberg at Memorial Gym Dec. 1, 1965.
(https://farm1.staticflickr.com/652/23628318756_6e0558e7c6_o.jpg) (https://flic.kr/p/BA8uNo)
Vanderbilt guard Jerry Southwood (24) is gliding toward the basket on an underhand layup past the grasp of Wittenberg's Bob Logan (11). The Commodores open their season with an 87-59 win over Wittenberg at Memorial Gym Dec. 1, 1965. (https://flic.kr/p/BZXiY9)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashcpa on December 10, 2015, 03:59:47 PM
Saw Butler play Vandy there a few years ago - cool gym!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 12, 2015, 03:35:40 PM
Final:  Hiram 74  Ohio Wesleyan 72

Terriers pull the big upset over the Bishops.  Hiram has a number of athletic players this year and will not be an easy opponent.

Ohio Wesleyan shot only 32% and still nearly won the game.  For Hiram, J.J. Woodson had 29 points and Kelvin Jones had 14 boards.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 12, 2015, 03:38:28 PM
Final:  Wooster 74  Wabash 52   :)

Wooster gets the road win in Crawfordsville.  Scots were led by Spencer Williams with 18 points, Dan Fanelly with 15 and freshman Reece Dupler added 12.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 12, 2015, 04:52:29 PM
Also,
DePauw 75, Oberlin 66
Wittenberg 75, Denison 68
Allegheny and Kenyon were idle

Wittenberg moves into a half game lead at 3-1, ahead of OWU, Hiram, Wooster, and Allegheny at 2-1. Kenyon plays at OWU next Saturday in the final conference game of the calendar year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 13, 2015, 06:10:50 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 12, 2015, 03:35:40 PM
Final:  Hiram 74  Ohio Wesleyan 72


Luke, I feel a disturbance in the Force.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 19, 2015, 08:29:33 PM
OWU bounces back, bounces Kenyon 96-62.
Hiram 88, LaRoche 81. 31-18/29-15.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 20, 2015, 10:50:51 PM
Wooster 49, St. Mary's (MD) 35. Not a halftime score. 32-18 / 30-15.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 21, 2015, 10:45:04 PM
Wabash 92, Franklin 76
Salisbury 67, Wooster 50. Wooster is not off to a great start this season.
33-19 / 31-16
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 22, 2015, 09:19:15 PM
OWU 96, Transylvania 72
Heidelberg 73, Wittenberg 70 ... nice last-minute comeback spoiled by a 'Berg buzzer beater
34-20 / 32-17

Everyone rests now for a week; next games 12/29. Merry Christmas or other Holiday of Choice to all!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 29, 2015, 09:32:00 PM
:::crickets:::

Anyway, just another ho-hum 4-0 night for Our Boys.
Wooster 79, Pitt-Bradford 59
Wittenberg 74, Earlham 58
Hiram 71, Illinois College 64
DePauw 82, Coast Guard 71

38-20 / 36-17
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pops33 on December 30, 2015, 12:55:54 PM
Tough match-up for Wooster tonight in the championship of the Mose Hole Classic.  They take on #8 Marietta tonight at 7:00.  It will be interesting to see if the young rotation that Steve Moore is using will be up for the challenge.  Video can be seen here  http://portal.stretchinternet.com/wooster/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on December 30, 2015, 08:55:19 PM
Tough matchup, indeed...too tough.

Marietta 72, Wooster 57
MVNU 96, Kenyon 75
Denison 79, ONU 67
Wittenberg 72, Wash U. 61
DePauw 81, Buena Vista 79
Grove City 61, Allegheny 58
Hiram 91, Bluffton 71

42-23 / 40-20

Happy New Year, next games Saturday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2016, 02:18:11 PM
Kent St. 104, Oberlin 58...just (snaps fingers) THAT close
Roanoke 84, Kenyon 76

42-25 / 40-21

Four games today, including three conference matchups.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on January 03, 2016, 08:34:54 PM
Glad to see Wooster won today!
Also, was Wabash supposed to struggle this year? I was surprised to see they're at 0-4 in the conference right now
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 03, 2016, 09:39:54 PM
Wooster 83, Denison 67
DePauw 67, Allegheny 64
Hiram 80, Wabash 64
Kenyon 91, Montclair St. 87

Non-con 43-25 / 41-21 vs. D3, with as best as I can figure 2 D3 games left (Denison vs. Capital Wed., Oberlin at IIT in a couple of weeks.)

Conference standings as we swing into full-time league play:
1. Hiram, OWU, Wittenberg, Wooster...3-1
5. Allegheny, DePauw...2-2
7. Denison, Oberlin...2-3
9. Kenyon...1-3
10. Wabash...0-4
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 04, 2016, 02:50:38 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 03, 2016, 09:39:54 PM
10. Wabash...0-4

Blargh.  What's a bummer about this is that I think Wabash is better than what you'd expect from an 0-4 NCAC team.  Totally blew the opener against Witt at home.  Not sure what the heck happened at Oberlin.  But for whatever reason Wabash historically stinks at Oberlin.  It's a mystery.  Anyway, LGs turn the thing over almost 18 times per game which is too many and they miss 10 free throws per game.  Those things are hard to overcome.  Hopefully the LGs can get in the left column this afternoon at Allegheny. 

LGs do indeed get a win today.  63-61 at Allegheny.  Wabash led 49-33 with 12:45 to play.  The Gators actually came back and snatched a 57-56 lead with 3:03 to play.  16 points...gonzo in under 10 minutes.  Johnny Jager hit two clutch foul shots with 6 seconds left to give Wabash the 63-61 lead, which they held to win.  Second halves have been an issue.  Gotta close, gentlemen. 

In the other East/West game, Hiram drilled DePauw 91-60.  Hiram's not bad, you guys.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 04, 2016, 05:35:08 PM
Wabash lists 13 Freshmen on its varsity roster.  In addition to losing 4 Seniors Wabash lost So. Kyle Aiton their 2nd leading scorer.  Aiton is now at Southern Indiana  http://www.gousieagles.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=2550&path=mbball    They also lost another So. and 3 other Fr from last years team.

That's a lot of turnover from one year to the next.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 04, 2016, 07:51:54 PM
Quote from: sac on January 04, 2016, 05:35:08 PM
Wabash lists 13 Freshmen on its varsity roster.  In addition to losing 4 Seniors Wabash lost So. Kyle Aiton their 2nd leading scorer.  Aiton is now at Southern Indiana  http://www.gousieagles.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=2550&path=mbball    They also lost another So. and 3 other Fr from last years team.

That's a lot of turnover from one year to the next.

All good points.  Wabash has really felt the absence of Aiton and Scofield this season.  Scofield added depth to a pretty big Wabash frontcourt, and Aiton was an excellent outside compliment to the inside offense of Purvlicis- which would help open up the post a bit which has been a problem for Wabash at times this year.  Hopefully today's road win lights the fuse for these last six weeks of conference play and the LGs can claw their way back up into top-4 contention and play for a home game in the league tournament. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 06, 2016, 10:00:32 PM
OWU 77, Wittenberg 70...Tigers slowed 'em down but couldn't top 'em
Wooster 91, Kenyon 78...despite early season turmoil, Scots still in first (with Terriers and BBs)
Denison 92, Capital 76...44-25 / 42-21
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoostAr on January 07, 2016, 02:04:45 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 06, 2016, 10:00:32 PM

Wooster 91, Kenyon 78...despite early season turmoil, Scots still in first (with Terriers and BBs)


Hard to tell from a distance since I can't get out of work in time to watch the feed -- it seems like their offense is coming around??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 07, 2016, 11:51:46 AM
Quote from: WoostAr on January 07, 2016, 02:04:45 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 06, 2016, 10:00:32 PM

Wooster 91, Kenyon 78...despite early season turmoil, Scots still in first (with Terriers and BBs)


Hard to tell from a distance since I can't get out of work in time to watch the feed -- it seems like their offense is coming around??

54 points in the second half. They only had 37 in the first, on 32% shooting. They shot 41 for the game, vs. 47 for KC, but got off 16 more shots than the Lords. Wooster won because of that (built off rebounds and turnovers, I suppose; didn't see the game or boxscor) and free throw shooting -- Kenyon was within 5 under 4:00 but Wooster hit 14 of 15 FTs thenceforward.

I haven't seen them this year, but it seems like they have problems and haven't found solutions yet. Steve Moore changed his rotation, including two new starters, for the Denison game, very uncharacteristic this late in the season, and they've been handled pretty easily by the really good teams they've played. They need to find a way to beat Wittenberg and maybe even OWU if they want to continue their streaks of 20-win seasons and NCAA appearances.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 07, 2016, 02:58:21 PM
We are back to our normal Sunday and Thursday Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) shows tonight! Now that we are getting back into our routine, we get back into the habit of featuring the East, Mid-Atlantic, Great Lakes, and West Regions on Thursday night shows (Northeast, Atlantic, Central, and South Regions on Sunday nights). Tonight, Dave McHugh talks with coaches who are succeeding so far this season thanks to a bit of a youth movement. How those squads are either exceeding early expectations or reloading pretty nicely. Dave also gets an assist from Pat Coleman to help cover the much anticipated men's basketball game between No. 1 Augustana at No. 5 Elmhurst which needed overtime to be decided. And Dave talks about the latest Hoopsville partner - the WBCA. With the WBCA coming onboard with the NABC there needed to be some branding changes. You will hear the change almost immediately.

Watch Hoopsville tonight at 7pm ET: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2015-16/jan7 (http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2015-16/jan3) - a show that had to be pre-recorded tonight due to other commitments.

Guests and/or topics include (in order):
- Pat Coleman, coverage of No. 1 Augie vs. No. 5 Blue Jays
- Ron Rohn, No. 10 Muhlenberg women's coach
- Lindsay Goldblatt, Cal Lutheran women's coach
- Fajri Ansari, Buffalo State men's coach
- Chris Kibler, Hiram men's coach

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Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 09, 2016, 06:15:11 PM
Hiram 72, (at) Wittenberg 68...statement win for the first place Terriers
OWU 89, Allegheny 77
Wooster 86, Oberlin 76...OWU and Woo keep pace with road wins
Wabash 80, Denison 66...LGs get good win at home
Kenyon 82, DePauw 75...who can predict this league anymore?

1. Hiram, OWU, Wooster...5-1
4. Wittenberg...3-3
5. Everyone Else...2-4
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 11, 2016, 02:46:05 PM
I think it's great for the league to be unpredictable. It may not be good for the NCAA seed. However, we should be getting more respect out there as we build our non-conference chops.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 13, 2016, 08:40:27 PM
Trap games? Wooster plays at Wittenberg Saturday. Both have tough matchups tonight, where just a small amount of looking ahead could be disastrous. So will that happen?

SPOILER ALERT: No.
@ Wooster 100, Hiram 69 (final)
Wittenberg 65, @ DePauw 42 (final)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 13, 2016, 10:13:34 PM
Additionally
Oberlin 68, Allegheny 53
Kenyon 74, Denison 58
OWU 88, Wabash 76

1. OWU, Wooster...6-1...Ev'rything Old is New Again
3. Hiram...5-2
4. Wittenberg... 4-3
5. Kenyon, Oberlin...3-4
7. Et Alii...2-5
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 14, 2016, 08:36:00 AM
Looks like Coach Moore is figuring out what to do with all that talent.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on January 14, 2016, 09:47:37 AM
Wooster sounded really good last night. I was hoping for a win but wasn't expecting that.
Go Woo! Beat Witt!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on January 14, 2016, 01:15:26 PM
Is Witt good this year?  I didn't think they were their normal level just from box score watching.  But playing in Springfield is never easy so it'd definitely be a solid win regardless.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 14, 2016, 05:13:57 PM
If you mean it'd be a solid win for Wooster, I agree; it doesn't matter who's good and who isn't, any win is a good win in that rivalry, doubly so on the road.

I haven't seen Wittenberg this season, but from scoreboard watching, I'd say they're reasonably good, about the same level they've been at for several years now. They beat Wash U. by 11, beat Capital, have 4 solid NCAC wins, and have close losses to OWU (7) and Hiram (4) at home. Not exactly a Pool C resume, but at 9-5, respectable. But when it comes to the Wooster game, all bets are off, even with Wooster having won the last 6 or however many games in the series.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on January 16, 2016, 11:01:21 AM
Game day. Go Woo beat Witt
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 16, 2016, 01:45:01 PM
Quote from: WooClone15 on January 16, 2016, 11:01:21 AM
Game day. Go Woo beat Witt
xHopefully the Internet feed will be better than it was from Wooster Tuesday night. It continues to amaze me that a school with the assets of Wooster can't get the Internet right.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 16, 2016, 02:41:14 PM
Wittenberg's video feeds have generally been good in my experience. I just wish they could place the camera closer than the Goodyear blimp.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on January 16, 2016, 04:00:23 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on January 16, 2016, 01:45:01 PM
Quote from: WooClone15 on January 16, 2016, 11:01:21 AM
Game day. Go Woo beat Witt
xHopefully the Internet feed will be better than it was from Wooster Tuesday night. It continues to amaze me that a school with the assets of Wooster can't get the Internet right.
Yeah, it was choppy. I just ended up listening to it on the radio
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 16, 2016, 05:38:11 PM
Early games are in the books:
OWU 74, DePauw 67
Denison 75, Allegheny 59
Oberlin 75, Hiram 67...Dogs and cats living together...mass hysteria!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 16, 2016, 08:02:50 PM
Not sure what's going on with the camera operator (if there is one -- almost seems like it's being operated remotely) but it's panning so slowly that we frequently get a beautiful view of the unoccupied end of the floor. This is a great hoops conference but not the most tech savvy one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 16, 2016, 08:03:52 PM
Kenyon wins at Wabash, 80-75.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 16, 2016, 08:13:56 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 16, 2016, 08:02:50 PM
Not sure what's going on with the camera operator (if there is one -- almost seems like it's being operated remotely) but it's panning so slowly that we frequently get a beautiful view of the unoccupied end of the floor. This is a great hoops conference but not the most tech savvy one.
Qualudes. On another note; I hope Mollie is not a communications major.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on January 16, 2016, 08:26:06 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 16, 2016, 08:02:50 PM
Not sure what's going on with the camera operator (if there is one -- almost seems like it's being operated remotely) but it's panning so slowly that we frequently get a beautiful view of the unoccupied end of the floor. This is a great hoops conference but not the most tech savvy one.
I'm just wondering who's putting in the score because there's a big delay. I wonder if it's the announcers. Not that it really matters. They tell you the score and I'm just happy to see the game
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on January 16, 2016, 08:36:14 PM
Ugh. Brutal start to the second half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 16, 2016, 08:43:34 PM
Just noticed that neither school has cheerleaders in action tonight. Can't recall the last Woo/Witt game without at least Tiger cheerleaders in attendance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on January 16, 2016, 09:27:07 PM
Good job getting it to ot. You can do it Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on January 16, 2016, 09:41:19 PM
Well crap. Still, that was a good game
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 16, 2016, 09:42:05 PM
Wittenberg 82, Wooster 77 (OT)...they couldn't do it.

1. OWU...7-1
2. Wooster...6-2
3. Hiram, Wittenberg...5-3
5. Kenyon, Oberlin...4-4
7. Denison...3-5
8. Allegheny, DePauw, Wabash...2-6
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 17, 2016, 05:15:40 AM
Can't remember Wooster playing as bad as they did the first 16 minutes of the second half yet still got ot to OT. Not sure how 9 players can all go stone cold at the same time but it happened. Did Jordan Stock get injured? He only played 13 minutes. Oh well, keep fighting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on January 17, 2016, 10:11:48 AM
I think Witt did a great job controlling the pace for most of the game. Wooster sped up the game with full court man to man denial late in regulation. Witt seemed to tighten up due to the pressure of Wooster Defense (and maybe the pressure of seeing a lead dwindle). I was surprised Wooster didn't keep the full-court pressure on to start the OT period... instead they elected to play Witt straight up from the half-court. Great win Witt.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 18, 2016, 05:40:40 PM
Oberlin 81, Illinois Tech 61
I believe this is the final non-conference game of the season, and I forget whether we're counting IIT as D3 or not (I believe they are a provisional), but the final tally is 45-25 overall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on January 18, 2016, 06:14:33 PM
Illinois Tech is a second-year provisional member of D3, so that game does not count towards Oberlin's overall D3 record. This is actually the third year that IIT has been in the provo pipeline, but the school was held back a year by the D3 Grand Council of Ruling Poobahs because the previous IIT AD slipped up in a few places. Had IIT been a third-year provo, that game would've counted towards the D3 record of the Yeomen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 20, 2016, 09:21:55 PM
Wooster 89, Allegheny 60
Wittenberg 78, Kenyon 70
Wabash 80, DePauw 75
OWU 81, Oberlin 69
Hiram and Denison in a barnburner..scratch that, an 18-0 DU run in crunchtime put an end to that
Denison 77, Hiram 61

1. OWU...8-1
2. Wooster...7-2
3. Wittenberg...6-3
4. Hiram 5-4
5. Denison, Kenyon, Oberlin...4-5
8. Wabash...3-6
9. Allegheny, DePauw...2-7
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 21, 2016, 09:43:29 AM
Gritty, gutty rivalry win for Wabash last night at Chadwick Court .  Down 10 early in the second half, Wabash chipped away at the DPU lead until finally taking the lead for good with 90 seconds left on a Johnny Jager three point play.  Jager had 31 in the game to lead all scorers and I'm psyched about this kid's last 3.5 seasons at Wabash.  Really fun player. 

Looking ahead to the second half, I think Wabash probably needs to turn that 3-6 around to 6-3 over the last half of the league season which gets the LGs up to 9-9 and 9 wins might be enough to get up to #4.  Going to have to do some work on the road to get there (last three games are @Denison, @DePauw, and @Kenyon), but it's not too crazy to find six wins in these last nine for Wabash I think. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 21, 2016, 12:06:41 PM
Looks like Wooster will live and die with the 3 pointers.  I was glad to see Balser start last night.  As much as I like Stern's hard-nosed defense you need to get more offensive production out of a starting guard than he's been providing.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 21, 2016, 05:49:09 PM
It isn't easy to coach at any level. It is a joy to coach Division III says many a coach. Some enjoy it on their way up the ladder, others on their way closer to retirement, and others as their passion.

Tonight on Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) we talk to many coaches in different aspects of their careers with varying teams who are succeeding on the court and off of it because of what coaching has taught them including facing the challenges no one should face especially off the court.

Hoopsville hits the air tonight at 7:00 pm ET with a jam packed show. Talking to programs who are leading their conferences or in the hunt facing the challenge that not everyone expect them to be competitive. We also talk to a few coaches who are taking care of more than Xs and Os. They are taking care of their team after a horrific circumstance of a player's murder or looking out of their own battling cancer.

You can watch the show starting at 7pm ET tonight right here: http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2015-16/jan21 (http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2015-16/jan21)

Guests include (in order):
- Scott Hemer, SUNY Geneseo women's coach
- Chris Downs, St. Lawrence men's coach
- Dan Priest, Kenyon men's coach (NABC Coach's Corner)
- Guy Rancourt, Lycoming men's coach
- Amanda Bailey, Luther women's coach
- Jacquie Hullah, Carngie Mellon women's coach

You can also tune into the podcast(s) after the show has aired:
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville (http://www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville)
iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087 (https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087)

And don't forget you can always interact with us:
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Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 23, 2016, 02:46:19 PM
Scots have a lot of perimeter talent. Good win without Fanelly. Anyone have any idea what his situation is? One of the announcers implied he didn't show up which would be hard to believe.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ruysdael on January 23, 2016, 05:58:58 PM
In the post game show Coach Moore indicated that Dan Fanelly was sick. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 23, 2016, 06:07:47 PM
Quote from: Ruysdael on January 23, 2016, 05:58:58 PM
In the post game show Coach Moore indicated that Dan Fanelly was sick.
thanks
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 23, 2016, 07:54:10 PM
Wooster 73, DePauw 56...a little blown away by the terrible season the Tigers are having
Oberlin 71, Wabash 54...Oberlin sweeps the LGs; Wally has pointed out on many occasions that the Yeo have Wabash's number
OWU 82, Denison 76...another close one, but it'll look like a line drive in the boxscore
Hiram 92, Kenyon 74...big time bounceback, especially since KC has been playing pretty well lately
Wittenberg 67, Allegheny 52...gotta win these games to keep pace, and Witt did without too much difficulty

1. OWU...9-1
2. Wooster...8-2
3. Wittenberg...7-3
4. Hiram...6-4
5. Oberlin...5-5
6. Denison, Kenyon...4-6
8. Wabash...3-7
9. Allegheny, DePauw...2-8
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 25, 2016, 10:20:22 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 23, 2016, 07:54:10 PM
Oberlin 71, Wabash 54...Oberlin sweeps the LGs; Wally has pointed out on many occasions that the Yeo have Wabash's number

Not sure how you go from the kind of clutch second half to win your rivalry game on Wednesday to laying this kind of egg 72 hours later.  LGs couldn't buy a bucket and now everything I said earlier about getting six wins in the back half of the league season is pretty much caput.  Kinda had to have that home game vs. Oberlin to make that happen.  Ah, the joys of young team inconsistency. 

¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on January 27, 2016, 11:52:08 AM
Wooster at #7 OWU tonight, what are people's thoughts? Do the Scots have a chance at pulling off the upset?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 27, 2016, 12:39:35 PM
Quote from: woolax on January 27, 2016, 11:52:08 AM
Wooster at #7 OWU tonight, what are people's thoughts? Do the Scots have a chance at pulling off the upset?

I would argue that there is always a chance, especially in this season/era of parity. However, I think OWU is a far better team and I sincerely doubt they would be overlooking the Scots coming into their own gym on the road (the game is AT Wooster). Mike will have them ready.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 27, 2016, 09:51:13 PM
Oberlin 76, Kenyon 59
Wabash 69, Wittenberg 54
Hiram 67, Allegheny 62
Denison 81, DePauw 60
Wooster 91, OWU 90

1. OWU, Wooster...9-2
3. Hiram, Wittenberg...7-4
5. Oberlin...6-5
6. Denison...5-6
7. Kenyon, Wabash...4-7
9. Allegheny, DePauw...2-9

I wouldn't even know where to begin breaking that first-place tie, since OWU lost to Hiram and Wooster lost to Wittenberg. Fortunately, with 5 games left, it's likely to work itself out.

Tonight's results could only have been better for Hiram and Oberlin if the other had lost. Otherwise a solid night for the northeast Ohioans, both still solidly in the mix for third place.

At the other end, only a miracle can save DPU and Gheny at this point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 27, 2016, 10:08:59 PM
Heck of a finish with OWU and Wooster - FTs and pure guts. Love watching teams who play well and take it to the end.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 27, 2016, 10:39:13 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on January 27, 2016, 09:51:13 PM
Wabash 69, Wittenberg 54

Pretty sweet win for Wabash tonight at Wittenberg, which is a place that has been brutally hard for Wabash to win.  And it was a game that Wabash controlled from the start.  Witt missed a 3FGA with about 6 minutes left that would have cut what was a 20 point lead down to 9...could have got interesting from there, but the shot missed, Wabash pushed the lead back out to 16 or so and Witt didn't have another run in them. 

Really stark contrast tonight from Wabash's disaster game Saturday with Oberlin, but that's how it's going to go with this group.  Interesting game coming on Saturday at Wooster.  If we get good Wabash vs. an exhaling Wooster team, who knows.  Never know what you're going to get game to game with Wabash. 

I'm going to slowly back away from my hope for a top 4 finish, but stealing one tonight at Witt could help Wabash get out of the 7/8 spot by the time we're done, which would be preferable to catching a first round game against OWU or Wooster. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2016, 07:31:43 PM
Mike DeWitt on Wooster senior Alex LaLonde, who had 23 points:
"Alex LaLonde, he's not played well against us in the past and he played a great game. He was a big difference, and being a senior and a really good kid, I'm happy for him. He really gave his team a lift."

Keep in mind these comments were made immediately after a nailbiting defeat that knocked his team out of sole possession of first place, whereas a win would have given OWU what amounts to a 3-game lead with 7 to play, virtually clinching a second consecutive title.

Mike is really quite a guy.

quote excerpted from The Daily Record, original article hidden behind a paywall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 28, 2016, 09:00:59 PM
Mike is always a top-notch guy and I have never heard him speak ill of anyone or any team. He is soft-spoken, but I love the chances I get to chat with him either on the show or in person, especially with a beer in hand. He is one of the reasons the Great Lakes Region has such great basketball and good men playing it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 28, 2016, 09:14:42 PM
Looking at the remaining schedule for the top 5:
OWU: Hiram, Wittenberg, Allegheny, DePauw (home), Kenyon, Wabash, Oberlin (away)
Wooster: Wabash, Kenyon, Wittenberg, Oberlin (home), Denison, Hiram, Allegheny (away)
advantage: pretty even, but OWU's arguably the better, and certainly more more consistent, team
Wittenberg: Denison, DePauw, Kenyon (home), OWU, Oberlin, Wooster, Hiram (away)
....yikes!
Hiram: Wooster, Oberlin, Wittenberg (home), OWU, Wabash, DePauw, Denison (away)
Oberlin: DePauw, Denison, Wittenberg, OWU (home), Allegheny, Hiram, Wooster (away)
advantage: first, Hiram's toughest games are at home (except OWU), while Witt's are on the road, and Hiram already has a win over Witt. Wittenberg has a one game advantage over Oberlin, and a win over the Yeo, but Oberlin's home/road splits are better. Of note: Hiram's next three games are on the road in tough venues, while Oberlin's next three are at home.
Ridiculously early prediction:
1. OWU
2. Wooster
3. Hiram
4. Winner of Wittenberg at Oberlin (2/6)
...and watch out for Denison sneaking up; they're done with OWU and get Wooster at home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on January 30, 2016, 06:42:05 PM
Couple of take-your-breath-away scores today:
OWU 123, Hiram 95 !!!
DePauw 64, Oberlin 53 (@ Oberlin!)
Kenyon 79, Allegheny 61
Wooster 90, Wabash 66
Denison 69, Wittenberg 59 (@ Witt)

1. OWU, Wooster...10-2
3. Hiram, Wittenberg...7-5
5. Denison, Oberlin...6-6
7. Kenyon...5-7
8. Wabash...4-8
9. DePauw...3-9
10. Allegheny...2-10

The lead pair move out to a full three-game lead with 6 to play, while Denison gets a big road win that vaults them into a favorite for a top 4 seed. Wittenberg has now lost 5 home games (out of 7 losses in total, only one of which was a true road game), including back-to-back home losses twice. In fact, they've lost four of their last five at the Smith Center; the one win was over Wooster, of course. DePauw gets the miracle they needed, snapping a 7-game losing streak on Oberlin's admittedly not very intimidating home court. I wonder when the last time was that Hiram scored 95 and lost, much less by 4 touchdowns? Ouch!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 01, 2016, 01:03:44 PM
With all the young talent Wooster has I can't help but wonder where there's a somewhat talented 6'10" guy that wants to put a ring on in the next few years. :P
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2016, 07:53:36 PM
Don't get your hopes up. Guys that tall almost never work out at the D3 level. If you can find a big, athletic guy at 6'8" or 6'9" that somehow gets overlooked by the higher divisions, probably because he matured while in college, he can take you far.  But much bigger than that and someone with scholarship dollars will be willing to take a chance. I'd settle for a couple of good 6'7" guys.

IIRC, Dan Russ was 6'9", and he was a genuine All-American. Dane Borchers was a very scrawny 6'10", but was a matchup problem because of Russ. (And when he grew into his body as a senior, and was great, Russ was gone.) And still Wittenberg came up a basket short of the title.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 01, 2016, 08:10:02 PM
I can think of a couple of guys off the top of my head that would prove that point wrong: Ben Strong and Tyler Sanborn. Both played for Guilford with a year or two cross over. There have been many a tall player do well in Division III... but the point they tend to be found and picked up by higher divisions is an accurate one. However, to say they almost never work out in Division III I don't feel is accurate at all.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 01, 2016, 08:24:45 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 01, 2016, 08:10:02 PM
I can think of a couple of guys off the top of my head that would prove that point wrong: Ben Strong and Tyler Sanborn. Both played for Guilford with a year or two cross over. There have been many a tall player do well in Division III... but the point they tend to be found and picked up by higher divisions is an accurate one. However, to say they almost never work out in Division III I don't feel is accurate at all.

IIRC, Tyler was already 6'10 (or whatever) as a frosh (and must have been overlooked for other reasons), but didn't Ben shoot up several inches just before or during his freshman year?  hasanova is our Guilford poster, if anyone wants to query him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 01, 2016, 08:26:37 PM
Ben shot up in high school - I think junior or senior year(s). He came to Guilford already tall. Tyler didn't grow at school... already tall his freshman year... I saw him that year and called the two of them the Twin Towers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 01, 2016, 09:39:12 PM
You have a better national perspective than I do, Dave, but I still think dominant big men have been few and far between. In the NCAC, I can't recall anyone dominating in the past 15 or so seasons, apart from the aforementioned Russ and Borchers, but I can recall numerous very tall young men who didn't amount to much.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 02, 2016, 12:08:32 AM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 01, 2016, 08:26:37 PM
Ben shot up in high school - I think junior or senior year(s). He came to Guilford already tall. Tyler didn't grow at school... already tall his freshman year... I saw him that year and called the two of them the Twin Towers.

I wonder if he shot up senior year too late to really be noticed by recruiters?  Or perhaps the lack of any American Indian basketball stars?  I've read in several sources that (despite such obvious athletes as Jim Thorpe and Billy Mills) there is a feeling that Native Americans just don't really 'get' basketball.  Some scholarship university certainly dropped the ball on him! :o ;D

Or maybe he was just like Jack Sikma.  Major colleges were all over him his senior year (before which he had not really adjusted into his height), but he had already given his word to Coach Bridges, and he kept his word. ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 02, 2016, 11:30:39 AM
Just an FYI, Ben is still playing... currently in the D League: http://dleague-dev.nba.com/player/ben-strong/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 03, 2016, 04:39:28 PM
For the third consecutive year, Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) will air for 12 hours as the regular season enters the final four weeks. Dave McHugh will chat with coaches, administrators, student-athletes, and others involved in Division III basketball from around the country. Other guests will include those who have Division III roots or appreciate the division and the game along with the student-athletes who play the sport.

Hoopsville will air from 10 a.m. to 10 p.m. (and maybe later) on Thursday, February 4 live from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can see what guests are scheduled, get more information, and watch the show here: http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2015-16/feb4

You can also read the press release about the show: http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/hoopsville-marathon-2016

Here is the guest list as we speak. All times are Eastern and subject to change. Additional guests to be added if and when necessary:


   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
   
TimeGuestSchool
10:15amConnie TilleySt. Norbert (WBB) - WBCA Center Court
10:40amJamie PurdyPeidmont (WBB)
11:00amKeri CarolloUW-Whitewater (WBB) - Nat'l Committee Chair
11:20amBrent PollariSaint Mary's (Minn.) (WBB)
11:40amKent MadsenNo. 21 Wheaton (Ill.) (WBB)
12:00pmRussell LoydRose-Hulman (MBB)
12:20pmKevin BroderickNazareth (MBB)
12:40pmJustin ScottArcadia (MBB)
1:00pmSam HargravesNo. 12 Alma (MBB)
1:20pmLenny ReichMount Union (SID)
1:40pmMaureen WebsterClarkson (WBB)
2:00pmBetsy WitmanYork (Pa.) (WBB)
2:20pmSara LeeDenison (WBB)
2:40pmKlay KneuppelWisconsin Lutheran (MBB)
3:00pmBrian Van HaaftenBuena Vista (MBB) - Nat'l Committee Chair
3:30pmSydney MossNo. 1 Thomas More (WBB)
3:45pmAaron RousellBucknell (WBB) - former Chicago coach
4:00pmTim ShanahanStaten Island (WBB)
4:20Pat CunninghamTrinity (Texas) (MBB) - NABC Coach's Corner
4:50pmBubba SmithSewanee (MBB)
5:15pmBen StrongFormer Guilford All-American
5:30pmKevin ConnorsESPN SportsCenter Anchor - Ithaca alumnus
6:00pmKristen DowlingClaremont-Mudd-Scripps (WBB)
6:20pmAllison ColemanSage (WBB)
6:40pmLandry KosmalskiSwarthmore (MBB)
7:00pmDave NilandNo. 23 Penn State-Behrend (MBB)
7:20pmAaron GallettaLasell (MBB)
7:40pmJohn BaronGwynedd-Mercy (MBB)
8:00pm
8:20pm
8:40pmMelissa HodgdonWheaton (Mass.) (WBB)
9:00pmG.P. GromackiNo. 2 Amherst (WBB)
9:20pmJames Wagner
9:40pmHAPPY HOURFree-for-all of calls, tweets, and fun!

We hope to get at least the full show on a podcast, or several podcast, during the on Friday. You can find it here:
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville
iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville

And a reminder the Hoopsville Fundraising Project has begun yet again. Please consider helping us cover Division III basketball the way it deserves to be covered. If you can not donate, please don't worry about - we understand. At least share the campaign with anyone you think might be interested: http://igg.me/at/hoopsville-fundraiser/x/6029509

Also, if you know any advertisers interested in promoting their company or products on the show, send them our way: hoopsville@d3hoops.com

Thanks!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 03, 2016, 08:03:57 PM
Because this is East-West weekend, there's only three games tonight. Updates as available.

OWU 87, Wittenberg 66 ... dominant second half for the BBs
Denison 69, Oberlin 65
Wooster 101, Kenyon 88... COW blew open a 2 point game with 11 minutes left with a 22-6 run

1. OWU, Wooster...11-2
3. Hiram...7-5
4. Denison, Wittenberg...7-6
6. Oberlin...6-7
7. Kenyon...5-8
8. Wabash...4-8
9. DePauw...3-9
10. Allegheny...2-10
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 05, 2016, 08:13:22 PM
Allegheny 69, DePauw 64...Tigers just can't help themselves
Hiram 84, Wabash 72

1. OWU, Wooster...11-2
3. Hiram...8-5
4. Denison, Wittenberg...7-6
6. Oberlin...6-7
7. Kenyon...5-8
8. Wabash... 4-9
9. Allegheny, DePauw...3-10
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 05, 2016, 08:19:23 PM
Hiram's shorts are like maritime navigation lights, you can always tell which direction they are going.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 06, 2016, 11:54:45 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 01, 2016, 09:39:12 PM
You have a better national perspective than I do, Dave, but I still think dominant big men have been few and far between. In the NCAC, I can't recall anyone dominating in the past 15 or so seasons, apart from the aforementioned Russ and Borchers, but I can recall numerous very tall young men who didn't amount to much.

Several years ago Wooster hosted a team in Timken Gym that had THREE seven-footers!  A set of twins, and a third guy.  They weren't stiffs, but certainly not all that good.  I think it was one of the Wisconsin state schools.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2016, 06:22:35 PM
From the top:
OWU 72, Kenyon 57
Wooster 82, Denison 75
Hiram 72, DePauw 65
Wittenberg 63, Oberlin 43
Wabash 81, Allegheny 58

1. OWU, Wooster...12-2
3. Hiram...9-5
4. Wittenberg...8-6
5. Denison...7-7
6. Oberlin...6-8
7. Kenyon, Wabash...5-9
9. Allegheny, DePauw...3-11
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 06, 2016, 07:03:42 PM
 Nice balanced win for the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2016, 09:06:51 PM
This week, OWU travels to Wabash and hosts Allegheny; Wooster travels to Hiram and hosts Wittenberg. Could we see some separation at the top? Given that the BBs have no games remaining against a team in the top half of the standings, these are must-win games for the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 06, 2016, 09:32:36 PM
OK, I can never remember the tiebreaker after head-to-head.  Is it record against the other teams from top to bottom?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 06, 2016, 10:35:51 PM
Yes, I believe so; we've always called that "best win." What I am not sure of is what to do when teams below tied teams are also tied. A short time back, OWU and Wooster were tied for first while Hiram and Witt were tied for third. If those were the final placements, supposing OWU and Wooster both win out, who wins? OWU and Wooster split, OWU split with Hiram and swept everyone else, including Wittenberg, Wooster split with Witt and swept everyone else, including Hiram. No way to break that tie, short of a coin toss, unless you break the third place tie first, but I don't think the rules provide for that. Wooster needs to win out (because OWU will be heavily favored to do so) and hope Hiram remains ahead of Wittenberg.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 10, 2016, 01:56:47 PM
Regional Rankings: http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2016/02/10/first-2016-regional-rankings-released-today/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 10, 2016, 05:14:49 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 06, 2016, 10:35:51 PM
Yes, I believe so; we've always called that "best win." What I am not sure of is what to do when teams below tied teams are also tied. A short time back, OWU and Wooster were tied for first while Hiram and Witt were tied for third. If those were the final placements, supposing OWU and Wooster both win out, who wins? OWU and Wooster split, OWU split with Hiram and swept everyone else, including Wittenberg, Wooster split with Witt and swept everyone else, including Hiram. No way to break that tie, short of a coin toss, unless you break the third place tie first, but I don't think the rules provide for that. Wooster needs to win out (because OWU will be heavily favored to do so) and hope Hiram remains ahead of Wittenberg.

Maybe you would look at combined record vs. those teams that are tied?  So maybe OWU is 4-0 vs. Hiram/Witt and Wooster is 3-1 vs. Hiram/Witt, and OWU wins the tiebreak. 

Definitely seems easier to break that third place tie first (hopefully cleanly with h2h results).  I think that's the logical thing to do.  But if the h2h is split and you've got a situation where the 3rd/4th place tiebreak depends on the 1st/2nd place tiebreak and vice versa, well, then you've probably got to move on down the standings OR punt entirely on that particular tiebreak and look at records vs. teams starting at the bottom and working your way back up. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2016, 06:57:48 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 10, 2016, 05:14:49 PM

Maybe you would look at combined record vs. those teams that are tied?  So maybe OWU is 4-0 vs. Hiram/Witt and Wooster is 3-1 vs. Hiram/Witt, and OWU wins the tiebreak. 

Definitely seems easier to break that third place tie first (hopefully cleanly with h2h results).  I think that's the logical thing to do.  But if the h2h is split and you've got a situation where the 3rd/4th place tiebreak depends on the 1st/2nd place tiebreak and vice versa, well, then you've probably got to move on down the standings OR punt entirely on that particular tiebreak and look at records vs. teams starting at the bottom and working your way back up.

I think what you say in the first paragraph is in fact how it works, but it doesn't really help. OWU is done with Witt and Hiram, and went 3-1 (lost to Hiram.) Wooster still has games with Hiram (tonight) and Witt (Saturday); if they lose either of them, chances of a first-place tie are remote, but if they win out, both will be 3-1 vs. Witt/Hiram (5-1 if you throw in Denison, swept by both OWU and Woo.) That's why OWU wants Witt to finish ahead of Hiram, while Woo wants the opposite.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2016, 09:38:06 PM
And just like that, it's all up in the air:

Wabash 76, OWU 71

But Wooster fails to benefit, falling at Hiram 70-69. Hiram closed on a 13-6 run over the last 5:00. OWU not only maintains a share of first, but now owns the tiebreaker. Hiram's victory snaps a 36 game losing streak at the hands of the Scots.

Oy vey.

Downballot results:
Wittenberg 85, DePauw 53
Denison 71, Kenyon 67
Oberlin 74, Allegheny 56

1. OWU, Wooster...12-3
3. Hiram...10-5
4. Wittenberg...9-6
5. Denison...8-7
6. Oberlin...7-8
7. Wabash...6-9
8. Kenyon...5-10
9. Allegheny, DePauw...3-12
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 10, 2016, 10:26:29 PM
With 3 games remaining, Hiram is still alive in the title hunt, but just barely. They could win it outright with 3 wins coupled with 3 losses apiece from the co-leaders. They could also finish tied with Wooster, or OWU, or both (and maybe Wittenberg too, see below.) Hiram, Wooster, and OWU are all 1-1 with each other. Both Wooster and Hiram have a game left with Wittenberg, who Hiram beat earlier (Wittenberg beat Wooster.) Versus Denison, Hiram has a loss while both Wooster and OWU have sweeps. Consequently OWU owns tiebreakers with Hiram and Wooster. Hiram's best bet is a two-way tie with Wooster, including a sweep of Wittenberg, a game ahead of OWU. Not too likely, but possible.

Wittenberg is still technically alive too, although the best they can do is tie with OWU, Wooster, and maybe Hiram at 12-6. OWU wins that tiebreaker--OWU would be 4-2 within the 4-team group, as would Wittenberg (Wooster and Hiram each 2-4), but OWU's sweep of the Tigers would give the BBs the title. In a three-way tie sans Hiram, OWU still prevails with a 3-1 aggregate vs. 2-2 for Wittenberg and 1-3 for Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 11, 2016, 10:12:29 AM
We might see some movement in the league's lower half as well.  Wabash finishes with Denison, DePauw, and Kenyon...all winnable games, but all on the road for the LGs.  Oberlin is going to finish @Hiram, vs. OWU, and @Wooster and with all of those teams playing for a league title, that's gonna be rough for the Yeomen.  0-3 is a likely scenario I think.  Wabash kind of needs all three, but two would get them clear of Oberlin (presuming Oberlin does not win another game) and up to sixth place. 

Now, should Wabash get all three of these games and Denison goes just 1-2 (games left vs. Wabash, vs. Hiram, @Allegheny), I think Wabash's OWU win is going to be the hammer.  What an important win that was last night.  That scenario would get Wabash into a 4-5 game at Witt, who I think Wabash matches up with very well. 

And that's Wally's Bottom Four Breakdown™.   I suspect that Wabash will be back amongst the top half of the league starting next year and I can refocus on championship scenarios.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 13, 2016, 08:09:15 PM
Wait 'til next year? Wabash seems to have found its sea legs this season.

Wabash 86, Denison 61 (@ Denison, where the Big Red were doubtless distracted by the conference swimming and diving championships)
Hiram 78, Oberlin 68
OWU 105, Allegheny 84...Wittenberg is officially eliminated
Kenyon 81, DePauw 79
Wittenberg leads Wooster by 8 with 11:00 left, outscoring Woo 24-11 since the half; Scots fight back to tie with 1:53 left, going to OT (again); OT underway but live stats seems to have fouled out, Wooster by 6 with 1:21 left; Wooster extends to win 99-86

1. OWU, Wooster...13-3
3. Hiram...11-5
4. Wittenberg...9-7
5. Denison...8-8
6. Oberlin, Wabash...7-9
8. Kenyon...6-10
9. Allegheny, DePauw...3-13
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 14, 2016, 12:23:06 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 13, 2016, 08:09:15 PM
Wait 'til next year? Wabash seems to have found its sea legs this season.

Good time to get hot.  We saw DePauw get hot at the end of last season.  They won the league tournament, won a first round tournament game at WashU and nearly beat #1 in the second round.  So who knows what might happen in the next couple of weeks. 

Wabash was outstanding offensively this afternoon at Livingston.  Purvilicis has been a monster during the three game win streak and that'll have to continue for the duration.  In addition to Purv's 24 (on 11-13 shooting!) and 14, Johnny Jager hit a Wabash single game record with 13 assists today. 

Side note on Purvlicis during this win streak.  In addition to his 11-13 shooting today, he was 9-11 (23 points) vs. OWU and 13-15 (28 points) vs. Allegheny.  Don't have a PER calculator in front of me, but that's crazy efficiency. 

Wabash runs their Senior Day win streak to 2 (their own vs. OWU and today at Denison).  Up next is going to be Senior Night at DePauw on Wednesday and one more Senior Day next Saturday at Kenyon.  Both winnable games, but Senior Days are tough so it's going to take two more great efforts to get these last two games. 

Also, DePauw is officially eliminated from the postseason.  That's too bad.    :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2016, 12:03:11 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 14, 2016, 12:23:06 AM
Also, DePauw is officially eliminated from the postseason.  That's too bad.    :)

'Gheny too, obviously. So the field is set, and all that remains is the seeding. Without actually running the numbers, I think OWU has clinched the top seed. I know they own a two-way tiebreaker with Wooster (unless, somehow, Wittenberg and Wabash end up tied for 4th, ahead of Denison; then #1 goes to a coin toss), and they win a three-way tiebreaker so long as Witt and Denison remain in the top 5. I'm not sure what adding Oberlin and/or Wabash to the top 5 mix does to the equation, and I'm not motivated to run the scenarios since OWU is not going to lose their last two games (Oberlin and DePauw), and one win eliminates Hiram.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 14, 2016, 05:36:35 PM
I put Massey's win probabilities and the season-to-date results into my HSFB engine, to simulate the rest of the season (and tiebreakers) many times.  Here are the seed probabilities...

OWU - 84% #1, 16% #2 (control own destiny for #1 seed, own tiebreaker over Woo)
Wooster - 16% #1, 84% #2 (need an OWU loss, or lots of help, to get #1 seed)
(There is very slight chance of either of these falling to the #3 seed, with 2 losses, plus 2 Hiram wins, etc.)
Hiram - 0.2% #2, 99.8% #3 (own tiebreaker over Witt)
Witt - 92% #4, 6% #5, 2% #6
Denison - 5% #4, 70% #5, 24% #6, 1% #7
Wabash - 3% #4, 23% #5, 46% #6, 14% #7, 14% #8
Oberlin - 1% #5, 22 % #6, 72% #7, 5% #8
Kenyon - 0.4% #5, 6% #6, 12% #7, 81% #8

So, the best guess is...
(8) Kenyon at (1) OWU
(5) Denison at (4) Witt
(7) Oberlin at (2) Wooster
(6) Wabash at (3) Hiram

That makes for potential OWU/Witt and Hiram/Wooster semis at Branch Rickey Arena if the seeds hold up.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 14, 2016, 08:15:26 PM
Haha, yeah, I completely forgot about the scenario where Wooster wins the title outright. D'oh!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 17, 2016, 08:33:02 AM
Yeah, I know this season is just hitting the home stretch, but I was poking around on the NCAC site and found the future schedules. For the next two seasons Wooster and Witt will play the final weekend!

http://northcoast.org/mediacenter/Future_Schedules/Basketball/2016-17_-_2019-20_NCAC_Basketball_Schedules_-8-19-15-.pdf

Also, per Tuesday's Daily Record David had the tiebreaker basically correct.  "TIEBREAKER -- According to the NCAC office, the following tiebreakers will be used in the event there are any ties in the standings: 1. Head-to-Head competition; 2. Combined win-loss record with all teams above tied teams; 3. Record versus individual opponents examined in descending order of standings; 4. Coin toss."  As of now, OWU holds the edge over Wooster and is likely to be the host team next weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 17, 2016, 09:57:13 PM
Someone else can do the update tonight, if anyone beyond me cares. Work destroyed me today and I'm too damn tired. OWU and Wooster won, Hiram (to Denison) and Witt (to Kenyon) lost, and Wabash and DePauw are in 2OT when I last checked. Denison is now tied with Witt for 4th.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 17, 2016, 10:09:16 PM
DePauw won in 3 OT.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 17, 2016, 10:30:29 PM
Ohio Wesleyan 93, Oberlin 75
Wooster 92, Allegheny 74
Denison 86, Hiram 77
Kenyon 67, Wittenberg 58
DePauw 114, Wabash 110 (3OT)

1) OWU 14-3 (holds tiebreaker on Wooster, based on sweep of Wittenberg)
1) Wooster 14-3 (gets #1 seed only with a win over Oberlin plus an OWU loss)
3) Hiram 11-6 (locked into #3 seed)
4) Wittenberg 9-8 (gets #4 seed with a win over Hiram, as tiebreaker at 10-8 would be win over Wooster)
4) Denison 9-8 (gets #4 seed with a Witt loss, as tiebreaker at 9-9 would be Denison's two wins over top three teams)
6) Oberlin 7-10 (wins all tiebreakers, due to sweeps of Wabash & Kenyon; #6 seed with a win over Wooster, #7 with a loss)
6) Wabash 7-10 (#6 or #7 seed with a win over Kenyon, depending on Oberlin; #8 with a loss)
6) Kenyon 7-10 (#6 or #7 seed with a win over Wabash, depending on Oberlin; #8 with a loss)
9) DePauw 4-13
10) Allegheny 3-14
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 18, 2016, 10:48:29 AM
Wild game down in Greencastle last night.  Definitely one of the all-timers in the Wabash-DePauw series.  Have to give a hat tip to DePauw's Luke Lattner who scored 55 points in the game, breaking the single game NCAC record previously held by Scott Tedder.  And when you're breaking Scott Tedder records, you've done something special.  DPU needed every bit of that record performance to get the win last night, too. 

Wabash wraps up at Kenyon on Saturday, which will have some seeding implications now thanks to Kenyon's big win at Witt. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 18, 2016, 02:47:09 PM
Remember when Wittenberg would never even think of being down in the standings with Hiram, Denison and Kenyon. I think that went away with Artie Taylor's red suits.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 18, 2016, 02:56:18 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 18, 2016, 02:47:09 PM
Remember when Wittenberg would never even think of being down in the standings with Hiram, Denison and Kenyon. I think that went away with Artie Taylor's red suits.

Its such a shame to see them fall on hard times!  (Realizing of course, that Witt's "hard times" is still better than most.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2016, 06:15:21 PM
Welcome to page 1000!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 18, 2016, 07:21:28 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 18, 2016, 06:15:21 PM
Welcome to page 1000!

Well done, David.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 18, 2016, 09:15:32 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 17, 2016, 10:30:29 PM
4) Wittenberg 9-8 (gets #4 seed with a win over Hiram, as tiebreaker at 10-8 would be win over Wooster)
4) Denison 9-8 (gets #4 seed with a Witt loss, as tiebreaker at 9-9 would be Denison's two wins over top three teams)
Just wanted to clarify this in my own mind, even though all that is at stake is home court advantage in the 4/5 game...and the home team lost both games in the season series! The tiebreaker in question is #2: composite record vs. all teams ahead of tied teams; in either case (both win or both lose) that's OWU, Wooster, and Hiram. Denison was 2-4 vs. this trio, having swept Hiram. Wittenberg is 1-4 so far, with a win over Wooster and a game left at Hiram. If Wittenberg loses, they lose this tiebreaker with Denison (who plays at Allegheny Saturday.) If they (both) win, tiebreaker #2 is a wash, and we move to #3: record vs. individual teams starting at the top. Both were swept by OWU, but Witt beat Wooster whereas Denison did not.

Quote from: smedindy on February 18, 2016, 02:47:09 PM
Remember when Wittenberg would never even think of being down in the standings with Hiram, Denison and Kenyon. I think that went away with Artie Taylor's red suits.
I think it's great that Oberlin has been safely in the field for some time, and Hiram has a home game, while DePauw (the defending champion, fer chrissakes) is on the outside looking in, and Allegheny, who used to be fairly good, is basically the new Oberlin. This is the league we've all been waiting for, except maybe for the Wooster-always-on-top part.

I'd have to guess that the alumni and donors are getting pretty tired of finishes outside the top 2 in Springfield, to say nothing of losing to Wooster over and over again. At one point during the most recent Woo/Witt contest, WQKT's Mike Breckenridge made note of Bill Brown's out-of-character calm demeanor in a tense situation, and openly speculated that Matt Croci was not just his assistant but the "coach in waiting." Not that Mike would be in any position to know such things, but you have to wonder how long this can continue.

BTW I see that Artie is no longer at Ohio Dominican. He's been the head coach at the Wellington School (http://www.wellington.org/athletics/coaches/), a private Columbus high school, since 2014. Red is not one of their colors, evidently.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 19, 2016, 11:23:05 AM
Wellington school is in my neck of the woods. Just a few blocks from me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 20, 2016, 11:46:21 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 18, 2016, 09:15:32 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 17, 2016, 10:30:29 PM
4) Wittenberg 9-8 (gets #4 seed with a win over Hiram, as tiebreaker at 10-8 would be win over Wooster)
4) Denison 9-8 (gets #4 seed with a Witt loss, as tiebreaker at 9-9 would be Denison's two wins over top three teams)
Just wanted to clarify this in my own mind, even though all that is at stake is home court advantage in the 4/5 game...and the home team lost both games in the season series! The tiebreaker in question is #2: composite record vs. all teams ahead of tied teams; in either case (both win or both lose) that's OWU, Wooster, and Hiram. Denison was 2-4 vs. this trio, having swept Hiram. Wittenberg is 1-4 so far, with a win over Wooster and a game left at Hiram. If Wittenberg loses, they lose this tiebreaker with Denison (who plays at Allegheny Saturday.) If they (both) win, tiebreaker #2 is a wash, and we move to #3: record vs. individual teams starting at the top. Both were swept by OWU, but Witt beat Wooster whereas Denison did not.

Yes, this is what I came up with on the 4/5 tiebreaker.  Given the relatively short distance between the two schools, and that neither is likely to draw a big crowd for a Tuesday night quarterfinal, I don't think that home-court advantage will matter much.


Today's games...
DePauw (8-16, 4-13) at Ohio Wesleyan (21-3, 14-3), 3:00 - Bishops look to clinch the top seed, but an upset would take some of the sting off of a rough season for the New Tigers
Denison (14-10, 9-8) at Allegheny (3-21, 3-14), 3:00 - The Big Red might be looking ahead, and it's Senior Day for the Gators
Wabash (13-11, 7-10) at Kenyon (10-14, 7-10), 3:00 - The winner likely avoids a trip to OWU; will the LG's have anything left after Wednesday's marathon at DePauw?
Wittenberg (14-10, 9-8) at Hiram (17-7, 11-6), 4:00 - The Old Tigers are playing for a Tuesday home game, while the Terriers try to rebuild momentum
Oberlin (12-12, 7-10) at Wooster (18-6, 14-3), 7:30 5:00 - The Yeo can avoid a rematch with an upset, but the Scots need this one, too


NCAA Tournament outlook
- Barring back-to-back losses, OWU looks to be in good shape for a Pool C berth.  If the Bishops win out, they likely would host the first weekend.
- Wooster is in decent position for Pool C, but may need to reach the conference final; a semifinal loss would mean sweating out Selection Monday.
- Hiram has the weakest SOS among Great Lakes contenders, so even reaching the conference final (with wins over Witt and Wooster) likely won't be enough.
- So, anyone other than the Bishops or Scots likely needs the Pool A berth that comes with winning the conference tournament
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 20, 2016, 04:58:36 PM
Early results...
OWU 81, DePauw 56
Kenyon 82, Wabash 76
Allegheny 67, Denison 63

The 1/8 game Tuesday will be Wabash at OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2016, 05:45:23 PM
Hiram holds off Wittenberg 64-60. The 4/5 game will be at Denison, despite their loss to the last-place team. (Allegheny actually caught DePauw today; they finished tied for 9th.) Wooster nips Oberlin 97-56.

Tuesday quarterfinals:
8 Wabash at 1 OWU
7 Oberlin at 2 Wooster
6 Kenyon at 3 Hiram
5 Wittenberg at 4 Denison
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 20, 2016, 07:29:41 PM
http://northcoast.prestosports.com/sports/mbkb/2015-16/releases/TRNY-Announce

There's several potential complications mentioned in this article. If OWU hosts the weekend, as seems likely, the championship game will be at 5 Saturday due to the NCAC indoor t&f meet on campus. If anyone else hosts, it'll be at 4...unless it is Denison, and the DU women are also hosting. In that case, the women play at 3 Saturday, then, after clearing the gym, the men play at 7. The DU women are the conference champs, but for the men to host, OWU, Wooster, and Hiram all have to lose Tuesday. Ain't a-gonna happen.

Since OWU (and other potential hosts Hiram and Denison) is a "low capacity gym," the semifinals will be at 5:30 and 8:30, clearing the gym in between. In the unlikely event that Wooster (or even less likely event that it's Wittenberg) is hosting, the semis are at 6 and 8 and one ticket works for both games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 23, 2016, 09:10:18 PM
OWU downs Wabash, 100-80, and will host the weekend festivities. Wooster will be attending, having dropped Oberlin 78-63 for their 20th win, extending their streak of 20-win seasons to, like, 87 years or something. Hiram will also be there, holding off Kenyon 95-87 to keep their slim Pool C hopes alive. Denison completes the all-top-seeds quartet, ousting Wittenberg 81-75.

Friday semifinals:
Hiram vs. Wooster, 5:30
Denison vs. Ohio Wesleyan, 8:30
Reminder that each game requires a separate admission.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 24, 2016, 02:14:36 PM
Final public regional rankings are out: http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2016/02/24/third-ncaa-regional-ranking/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 24, 2016, 02:18:24 PM
If Hiram beats Wooster, and makes the final, do they have a chance? Does that knock Wooster out? Is there any way to get three NCAC teams in? I'm assuming OWU is 'safe'.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Fifth and Putnam on February 24, 2016, 02:21:21 PM
Quote from: smedindy on February 24, 2016, 02:18:24 PM
If Hiram beats Wooster, and makes the final, do they have a chance? Does that knock Wooster out? Is there any way to get three NCAC teams in? I'm assuming OWU is 'safe'.

Slim chance, but not impossible. Hope as many conference tournament favorites win their auto bids as possible not sucking up a lot of those Pool C slots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 25, 2016, 02:13:13 PM
I see where Alex LaLonde didn't play Tuesday night.  Any word on his injury / status for the weekend?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 25, 2016, 02:43:53 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 25, 2016, 02:13:13 PM
I see where Alex LaLonde didn't play Tuesday night.  Any word on his injury / status for the weekend?

He has a blood clot and is out for the year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 26, 2016, 05:53:24 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 25, 2016, 02:43:53 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 25, 2016, 02:13:13 PM
I see where Alex LaLonde didn't play Tuesday night.  Any word on his injury / status for the weekend?

He has a blood clot and is out for the year.
Sad way for a senior to end a great career.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 26, 2016, 06:19:20 PM
Nice run at the end of the half by the Scots to take an 11 point lead. No idea what the stats are as OWU's live stats has been wrong the whole game and now has it as a 6-point game. Kipfer has been a monster for the Scots this far.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 26, 2016, 07:25:20 PM
Big Josh, What a game. :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 26, 2016, 08:05:07 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 26, 2016, 07:25:20 PM
Big Josh, What a game. :o

No doubt! I hope he's got something left in the tank for tomorrow night.  OTOH, Fanelly should be well-rested!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2016, 09:41:08 PM
Denison is giving OWU all they want, down 3 with 12:00 left.

Denison now up 9 inside 4:00.

It's Denison with the upset, 95-85. OWU moves on to the NCAAs, but as a Pool C and possibly on the road.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2016, 10:15:03 PM
So, is this good for Wooster or what?  First of all, Denison looked pretty darned good.  But let's just say, on the upside, that the Scots now have an easier route to the NCAC Tournament championship, if for no reason other than the final is now a neutral-court game.  However, if they lose, do they still get a Pool C bid, with OWU also in the running for one?  Is this now a more dangerous situation for the Scots?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 26, 2016, 10:16:35 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2016, 10:15:03 PM
So, is this good for Wooster or what?  First of all, Denison looked pretty darned good.  But let's just say, on the upside, that the Scots now have an easier route to the NCAC Tournament championship, if for no reason other than the final is now a neutral-court game.  However, if they lose, do they still get a Pool C bid, with OWU also in the running for one?  Is this now a more dangerous situation for the Scots?
The consensus is that both OWU and Wooster are locks at this point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on February 26, 2016, 10:44:45 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 26, 2016, 10:16:35 PM
The consensus is that both OWU and Wooster are locks at this point.
So dumb question, but d-3 functions kind of like d-1 right? So if wooster wins tomorrow they're in because they get the auto bid. If Denison wins, then Denison, OWU, and Wooster would all get in, right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 26, 2016, 10:49:50 PM
OWU was already in very solid position, and (if there was doubt) Wooster now also appears to be going.  If Denison beats Wooster to get the automatic ("Pool A") bid, then all three will go, and some other team's bubble will burst.

Tonight was a bit of deja vu of 2015, with #2 Wooster advancing to the final before the 4th seed eliminated OWU at home.  Last year, DePauw finished the job by pulling back-to-back upsets to win the conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2016, 07:35:39 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 26, 2016, 10:49:50 PM
OWU was already in very solid position, and (if there was doubt) Wooster now also appears to be going.  If Denison beats Wooster to get the automatic ("Pool A") bid, then all three will go, and some other team's bubble will burst.

Tonight was a bit of deja vu of 2015, with #2 Wooster advancing to the final before the 4th seed eliminated OWU at home.  Last year, DePauw finished the job by pulling back-to-back upsets to win the conference.
And this is just about the extent of D3 "functioning like D1." But yeah, conference champions get auto bids. D3 has a LOT more conferences than D1. If Denison wins tonight and the NCAC gets three bids, no other conference will have more NCAA participants (the MIAA is in a similar situation and may get three, and there may be others; the NESCAC has been known to get 4 in I believe.) Contrast that to the Big Ten, who I suppose will get 7 or 8 in.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 27, 2016, 01:16:15 PM
Quick timeout in the tourney talk.  I was perusing the NCAC site (http://northcoast.org/inside_ncac/about) and noticed this.  "Consisting of 10 academically selective colleges and universities in Ohio, Indiana and Pennsylvania — Allegheny College, Denison University, DePauw University, Hiram College, Kenyon College, Oberlin College, Ohio Wesleyan University, Wabash College, Wittenberg University, The College of Wooster, along with affiliate member Earlham College  — the NCAC believes that high-level athletic programs need not be sacrificed in order to meet rigid academic standards." 

Does anyone know what Earlhan's 'affiliate' status entails??
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 27, 2016, 01:35:36 PM
Earlham plays field hockey (only) in the NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 27, 2016, 06:49:41 PM
Congratulations to Denison! Wittenberg, Ohio Wesleyan, then Wooster -- not a bad week's work.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2016, 10:00:20 AM
Looking at where our three likely participants may end up next weekend:
Ohio Wesleyan may host or may go on the road, but either way they are likely to avoid Alma, who they defeated(by 19 points) in November. The "dream" matchup is a second-round meeting at Marietta, pitting mentor (Mike DeWitt) against student (Jon VanderWal), although two such highly-ranked teams should meet later in the draw. Marietta has to avoid Wooster, who they beat (by 15 at Wooster) in December; Wooster also has to miss Salisbury, who toppled the Scots (by 17) in Puerto Rico at Christmastime. Denison has no potential rematch problems, but a big resume problem that will probably make them a first-round opponent of a highly ranked team.

Considering all that, my guess is that Denison opens up at John Carroll, OWU goes to Marietta to play some team from the south or east, and Wooster gets shipped far away, to Benedictine or even Augustana, to play in a 2/3 game (maybe vs. Alma.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Fifth and Putnam on February 28, 2016, 10:11:56 AM
I was just thinking about what to do with the NCAC teams myself this morning. Wooster could go to JCU as they have already played Marietta. Denison could easily get to Marietta. The wild card here is OWU. I don't think they host but they are a landmine for any host they see. I would hate to see them get send to JCU or Etta as that would be a terrible first weekend match up for everyone involved. Their central Ohio geography means they can probably get to a lot of places. OWU very well may get shipped out somewhere out of the region but I am not sure where.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2016, 11:00:36 AM
My experience, if you can call it that, is that the committee's view of things doesn't always match the conventional wisdom, they stick to the numbers. So looking at a team like OWU, we might say they shouldn't draw Augustana or Benedictine or Marietta or JCU in the second round, that they should be sent further east or south to play on the floor of someone not quite so "good." (I don't know who the hosting candidates are or whether they are within 500 miles of Delaware; maybe Rochester or Emory?) But chances are those teams have numbers (SOS, vRRO, WP except for Benedictine) comparable to those of the Central/GL powers. That's why I like the OWU/Marietta pairing, especially since, of the four C/GL hosts, 'Etta is probably#4 at this point.

Denison is going to meet one of those 4 on Friday, and I doubt they can reach Rock Island (IIRC, Wooster was within a mile or two of the limit when they went to Augie several years ago.)

Wooster can get to Rochester in the east and Augie in the west, since they've done it before. For OWU and DU, those might be too far.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 28, 2016, 12:52:01 PM
Seeding pods 1-4 I have Denison as a 3 right now which would avoid JCU, Marietta, Benedictine, Augustana in round one.  They could and probably will get pushed to a 4 depending on the quality of teams  pulled in from the East, Mid-Atlantic or South.

I think Denison should be a higher seed than Hilbert or the HCAC Champion (Mt. St. Joe or Rose-Hulman) but its pretty close.  From the Central and West Regions, Westminster, Central and either Northwestern or No Central(Minn) would be weaker than Denison.  I figure St. Thomas, Benedictine and Augustana are going to draw those 3 since I don't think you can get any of them to Ohio.

As a 3, they'd be looking at teams like North Central, Alma, Elmhurst, Hope in round 1 so still pretty tough.


Denison is 508 miles to Augustana
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2016, 01:20:04 PM
As usual, hardly any of the conversation on this forum involves the games themselves.  Every year it's about figuring out who's going to make the conference tournament, who's going to play who.  Then the same thing, on a larger scale, with the NCAA tournament.  Who's in, who's out, who might go where and why.

They just had some really good ballgames down at OWU and there's barely a mention of them.  I guess I just don't get it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 28, 2016, 03:09:37 PM
Feel free. I didn't see any of the games, I was at work.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 29, 2016, 01:04:30 AM
I had senior night last night and followed on Twitter as best I could, being behind 3 hours and all. Stunned and happy for Denison!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 29, 2016, 01:07:08 AM
BTW, remember a few seasons ago when there was a disgruntled Denison poster who was really laying the wood on Ghiloni, especially for his substitution patterns?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 29, 2016, 10:24:13 AM
Quote from: smedindy on February 29, 2016, 01:07:08 AM
BTW, remember a few seasons ago when there was a disgruntled Denison poster who was really laying the wood on Ghiloni, especially for his substitution patterns?
Yes, I do. For a while there we had two Denison posters (DenisonFan and one other) and I think neither were Ghiloni fans. Heck, I've been around so long now that I remember when we had Allegheny posters! But, like so many other posters, they're all gone now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 29, 2016, 10:47:34 AM
Pretty nice turnaround for Denison.  They got drilled by 25 on their senior day by Wabash, then lost their regular season finale to 4-win Allegheny.  So obviously they're going to turn around and run the Witt/OWU/Wooster gauntlet to qualify. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 29, 2016, 11:04:55 AM
Giving it some thought, I think there's been regular or semi-regular basketball posters from every program (including Earlham, you know it's true) at one time or another, except for Oberlin, Kenyon (although I have met numerous Kenyon lurkers), and, somewhat surprisingly, DePauw. You'd think New Tiger fans would at least have turned up on the women's side, but that was my private echo chamber for years before I forsake it.

Of course, my memory has become seriously impaired, so if I've forgotten any New Tiger, Lord, or Yeo fans, I apologize.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 29, 2016, 12:53:42 PM
Wooster gets into the NCAA tourney as expected and will face undefeated Lancaster Bible in the first round on a neutral court.

If Wooster gets to the second round, they will likely face Catholic who is hosting that pod.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 29, 2016, 12:55:46 PM
Great news for OWU and for central Ohio basketball fans: OWU gets to stay at home to face Pitt-Greensburg. Denison goes to JCU but avoids the Streaks for at least one night; they have to get by Alma first. Wooster gets a trip to DC to try to pin loss #1 on Lancaster Bible. Good luck to all!

One nice, rather unexpected feature of this bracket is that OWU can't meet Denison until the sectional final, and Wooster can't meet either until the championship game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on February 29, 2016, 01:43:55 PM
How well does Wooster match up with Lancaster Bible? And assuming they advance Catholic or Endicott?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 29, 2016, 01:57:17 PM
Lancaster Bible is the great unknown in this tournament. The consensus of opinion seems to be that, at 26-1, LBC would NOT have earned a Pool C bid, and I believe that a Wooster team that's had a somewhat subpar season will be the best team they've faced. But maybe they're good enough to have beaten tougher opponents, had they faced any. It's a fascinating draw.

Using Matt Snyder's data, available here (http://detroitjockcity.com/division-iii-mens-basketball-regional-rankings-data/), it looks to me like Catholic is very slightly stronger than Wooster but it shapes up as a good game if it happens. Catholic looks like a solid favorite over Endicott, who Matt has as the 23rd best team in the Northeast alone.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 29, 2016, 02:24:47 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 29, 2016, 01:57:17 PM
Lancaster Bible is the great unknown in this tournament. The consensus of opinion seems to be that, at 26-1, LBC would NOT have earned a Pool C bid, and I believe that a Wooster team that's had a somewhat subpar season will be the best team they've faced. But maybe they're good enough to have beaten tougher opponents, had they faced any. It's a fascinating draw.

Lancaster Bible 94  Franklin & Marshall 66   :o  Game was played back in November.  Lancaster Bible's best win this season.

Franklin & Marshall is now 22-5 and is in the NCAA tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 29, 2016, 02:27:21 PM
It's tough to get a read on the quality of a team that hasn't played anyone notable in months.  However, for what it's worth, Massey has Wooster a one-point favorite over Lancaster Bible, and would be a three-point underdog to Catholic if both advance.  This is far preferable to getting shipped to Augustana, and while it's a long trip to DC, perhaps offers a better chance to advance than being the "2nd seed" at either JCU or Marietta.

OWU gets a very favorable draw, and will be a substantial favorite to move on to the sectionals (likely at Benedictine).

Denison plays an Alma team that is of comparable quality to the ones they upset this weekend, and avoids facing a host on Friday.

Overall, it seems that the NCAC teams all got draws that were at least as expected, arguably better.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 29, 2016, 02:27:38 PM
5 of Wooster's 7 losses were to teams that are now in the NCAA tourney:  Skidmore, Salisbury, Marietta, Ohio Wesleyan & Denison
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 29, 2016, 02:44:10 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 29, 2016, 02:24:47 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on February 29, 2016, 01:57:17 PM
Lancaster Bible is the great unknown in this tournament. The consensus of opinion seems to be that, at 26-1, LBC would NOT have earned a Pool C bid, and I believe that a Wooster team that's had a somewhat subpar season will be the best team they've faced. But maybe they're good enough to have beaten tougher opponents, had they faced any. It's a fascinating draw.

Lancaster Bible 94  Franklin & Marshall 66   :o  Game was played back in November.  Lancaster Bible's best win this season.

Franklin & Marshall is now 22-5 and is in the NCAA tournament.
That's the only game they've played this year against a regionally ranked team. One quarter of Wooster's schedule was vRRO (3-4.) Their SOS is .439, which I suspect is the lowest of the 62 teams in the field; by contrast, Wooster's is .563. But they won all of their games, so who knows what they are capable of.

Take note of the poll on the front page, though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 29, 2016, 02:50:05 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 29, 2016, 02:27:21 PM
OWU gets a very favorable draw, and will be a substantial favorite to move on to the sectionals (likely at Benedictine).

Ohio Wesleyan is very good.  I don't think Ohio Wesleyan is a very good tournament team.  I can't find D3 stats for rebound rates which I would prefer to look at, but they are -5.3 on rebound margin- dead last in the conference, 372nd in D3, and the next closest 20-win team to OWU in that category is Salisbury (-0.9, 248th).  That's a really, really poor number for a really good team.  For all of their offensive might, OWU is pretty average defensively and just needs one night when they do something like 8-30 on 3FGAs and they're out.  There's really no plan B for the Bishops. 

I'd look at Wooster to be the last NCAC team standing in this year's tournament. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 29, 2016, 02:55:05 PM
An interesting note about Wooster's opponent, LBC. Their leading scorer, Bryce Williams, appears to be on his 3rd team in as many seasons.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 29, 2016, 03:23:58 PM
Quote from: countyroad on February 29, 2016, 02:55:05 PM
An interesting note about Wooster's opponent, LBC. Their leading scorer, Bryce Williams, appears to be on his 3rd team in as many seasons.

Is there a story behind that or what?  I'm missing something. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on February 29, 2016, 03:30:06 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 29, 2016, 03:23:58 PM
Quote from: countyroad on February 29, 2016, 02:55:05 PM
An interesting note about Wooster's opponent, LBC. Their leading scorer, Bryce Williams, appears to be on his 3rd team in as many seasons.

Is there a story behind that or what?  I'm missing something.

I don't know the story. I was reading his bio which states this is his first year with the team, yet he was a Jr. I did a little Googling and found he played for two other teams prior to arriving @ LBC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on February 29, 2016, 05:22:45 PM
Scranton pulled into a tie with Wittenberg with their Pool C bid this season; each will now have 27 appearances in the NCAA tournament in the D3 era. Wooster remains tied for third with Hope at 25, but this, the Scots' 14th straight bid, is a D3 record.
http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2015-16/releases/20160229kh6dy9
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 29, 2016, 05:49:46 PM
I haven't watched Wooster play much this year, but thought they actually played an excellent game against Denison.  They were totally dominant inside, with their bigs both scoring and controlling the boards.  Then Denison decided that they were the Golden State Warriors and it was over.

The Lancaster Bible College Department of Arts and Sciences offers no degrees in, um, any sciences.  Why is it that I always feel I need a shower after going to the websites of these Christian schools?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 29, 2016, 07:16:03 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 29, 2016, 05:49:46 PM
I haven't watched Wooster play much this year, but thought they actually played an excellent game against Denison.  They were totally dominant inside, with their bigs both scoring and controlling the boards.  Then Denison decided that they were the Golden State Warriors and it was over.

The Lancaster Bible College Department of Arts and Sciences offers no degrees in, um, any sciences.  Why is it that I always feel I need a shower after going to the websites of these Christian schools?

This made me laugh!  +k

Also, am I losing my mind or hasn't there been a "Wooster Booster" on here for years?? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 29, 2016, 07:31:51 PM
Quote from: Dr. Acula on February 29, 2016, 07:16:03 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 29, 2016, 05:49:46 PM
I haven't watched Wooster play much this year, but thought they actually played an excellent game against Denison.  They were totally dominant inside, with their bigs both scoring and controlling the boards.  Then Denison decided that they were the Golden State Warriors and it was over.

The Lancaster Bible College Department of Arts and Sciences offers no degrees in, um, any sciences.  Why is it that I always feel I need a shower after going to the websites of these Christian schools?

This made me laugh!  +k

Also, am I losing my mind or hasn't there been a "Wooster Booster" on here for years??

I'm the same WooBoo.  Took a long break. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 29, 2016, 07:52:50 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 29, 2016, 07:31:51 PM
Quote from: Dr. Acula on February 29, 2016, 07:16:03 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 29, 2016, 05:49:46 PM
I haven't watched Wooster play much this year, but thought they actually played an excellent game against Denison.  They were totally dominant inside, with their bigs both scoring and controlling the boards.  Then Denison decided that they were the Golden State Warriors and it was over.

The Lancaster Bible College Department of Arts and Sciences offers no degrees in, um, any sciences.  Why is it that I always feel I need a shower after going to the websites of these Christian schools?
t

This made me laugh!  +k

Also, am I losing my mind or hasn't there been a "Wooster Booster" on here for years??

I'm the same WooBoo.  Took a long break. :)

You just wanted to reset your negative karma...   :P   8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 29, 2016, 08:15:08 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 29, 2016, 07:52:50 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 29, 2016, 07:31:51 PM
Quote from: Dr. Acula on February 29, 2016, 07:16:03 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 29, 2016, 05:49:46 PM
I haven't watched Wooster play much this year, but thought they actually played an excellent game against Denison.  They were totally dominant inside, with their bigs both scoring and controlling the boards.  Then Denison decided that they were the Golden State Warriors and it was over.

The Lancaster Bible College Department of Arts and Sciences offers no degrees in, um, any sciences.  Why is it that I always feel I need a shower after going to the websites of these Christian schools?
t

This made me laugh!  +k

Also, am I losing my mind or hasn't there been a "Wooster Booster" on here for years??

I'm the same WooBoo.  Took a long break. :)

You just wanted to reset your negative karma...   :P   8-)

Eh?  I was +4329/-110.  Hang on, I have it written down somewhere... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 01, 2016, 12:01:04 AM
Don't read too much into things like "if Lancaster Bible went 26-1 they weren't making the tournament" as they aren't that good a team. That is criteria stuff. LBC's SOS was bad and you can learn a lot more about why here: http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2016/02/26/go-undefeated-or-go-home/

LBC is a very good team. I have seen them in person and was pretty impressed. Their offense isn't necessarily half-court, but they can play half-court if they want or need. I was actually more surprised with their defense: stingy, aggressive, fast, and smart. They have size inside, almost all of them have a great first step with tremendous speed, and they clearly adjust well in the open floor. What really surprised me in the game on Saturday that I was at was how many other gears they have. They shifted to higher gears several times in the game and ended up shooting 57% in the second half.

I think the match-up with Wooster is a perfect one for LBC who is as good as their game against F&M indicates. They are not with a player who was key off the bench in the first half of the season (apparently thought classes were optional), but they have adjusted well without him. As for the player found at his third year, LBC isn't the kind of school trying to game the system like Green Mountain clearly did. The head coach, Zach Filzen, got the job during the summer after the previous coach who had laid the groundwork left (along with a bad out-of-conference schedule). Filzen's mother is iconic coach in MIAC women's history - so he learned from one of the best.

This is a game LBC can prove they are as good as advertised. Wooster can use to prove they are able to have a good season even when they are "off." And both teams will have a very good test against Catholic (most likely) in the next round.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on March 01, 2016, 02:54:24 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 29, 2016, 08:15:08 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 29, 2016, 07:52:50 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 29, 2016, 07:31:51 PM
Quote from: Dr. Acula on February 29, 2016, 07:16:03 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 29, 2016, 05:49:46 PM
I haven't watched Wooster play much this year, but thought they actually played an excellent game against Denison.  They were totally dominant inside, with their bigs both scoring and controlling the boards.  Then Denison decided that they were the Golden State Warriors and it was over.

The Lancaster Bible College Department of Arts and Sciences offers no degrees in, um, any sciences.  Why is it that I always feel I need a shower after going to the websites of these Christian schools?
t

This made me laugh!  +k

Also, am I losing my mind or hasn't there been a "Wooster Booster" on here for years??

I'm the same WooBoo.  Took a long break. :)

You just wanted to reset your negative karma...   :P   8-)

Eh?  I was +4329/-110.  Hang on, I have it written down somewhere... ;)
Hope to see you on the baseball boards. I believe you were once a regular poster. I believe you and a certain poster, had quite a few discussions over the years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on March 02, 2016, 08:17:55 AM
Can we expect a live feed even if we have to pay for it?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 02, 2016, 10:56:19 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on March 02, 2016, 08:17:55 AM
Can we expect a live feed even if we have to pay for it?

They're not allowed to charge for video feeds in NCAA Tournament games.

Catholic has a video feed -- watched a little bit of the conference championship game. Students doing the broadcast but they did a good job. One camera shoot, no replay.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on March 02, 2016, 11:44:10 AM
I'm in DC this weekend- Friday night is definitely out but there's a 50/50 shot that I can get over to CUA for the Saturday night game. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 02, 2016, 07:02:37 PM
Anyone with a Facebook account, an interest in Steve Moore, and 32 minutes to kill might want to search for the account of "Rich Siegel Author." He posted a long video called A Lifetime of Winning on his Facebook page. I am not bright enough to figure out how to link to it here, or to find it on the (non-FB) web, so I'm sorry.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 02, 2016, 11:23:14 PM
Hi all - I guess the NCAA tournament has a way of bringing loooooooong dormant posters out of the woodwork. Very excited to have the Scots visit my neck of the woods this weekend.

A note I wanted to pass along for anyone attending Friday night's game: the Wooster Alumni office and W Association will be hosting a post game reception at the Brookland location of Busboys & Poets (625 Monroe St. NE) from roughly 7:30-9:30 pm. Busboys & Poets is about a ten-minute walk across campus from Catholic's DuFour Center, near the Brookland-Catholic University metro station. Totally informal - just a chance for anyone and everyone related to Wooster to hang out and socialize after the game. It'll be a cash bar with the College I believe providing some light appetizers.

Go Scots!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MrsBethG on March 03, 2016, 07:48:06 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 02, 2016, 07:02:37 PM
Anyone with a Facebook account, an interest in Steve Moore, and 32 minutes to kill might want to search for the account of "Rich Siegel Author." He posted a long video called A Lifetime of Winning on his Facebook page. I am not bright enough to figure out how to link to it here, or to find it on the (non-FB) web, so I'm sorry.

https://www.facebook.com/richsiegelauthor/

Here is the link. I believe the page is public so it can be viewed without an account. Rich Siegel was on Coach Moore's first team at Muhlenberg in 1981-82 and is author of the book "You Can't Do Both".



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 03, 2016, 11:36:15 AM
Quote from: MrsBethG on March 03, 2016, 07:48:06 AM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 02, 2016, 07:02:37 PM
Anyone with a Facebook account, an interest in Steve Moore, and 32 minutes to kill might want to search for the account of "Rich Siegel Author." He posted a long video called A Lifetime of Winning on his Facebook page. I am not bright enough to figure out how to link to it here, or to find it on the (non-FB) web, so I'm sorry.

https://www.facebook.com/richsiegelauthor/

Here is the link. I believe the page is public so it can be viewed without an account. Rich Siegel was on Coach Moore's first team at Muhlenberg in 1981-82 and is author of the book "You Can't Do Both".

I watched this yesterday.  Nice video, but I wish the interviewer had allowed Coach Moore to speak more freely during the talks.  He'd ask questions and then answer them himself.  Kinda took away from what I was expecting to be a great piece.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on March 03, 2016, 01:57:07 PM
Folks, just five more hours to enter the men's D-III bracket challenge before tonight's tipoff!
https://d3challenge.com/login/register.php
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2016, 06:14:56 PM
Wooster 41, Lancaster Bible 31 at the half.  Wooster's doing a very good job on the boards, and defensively with just a few glitches.  Fanelly and Spencer Williams with most of the scoring.  LBC, as expected, plays a pressure-gambling defense.  For the most part, it's not working well.  We'll see how the Scots do in the second half, as this is similar to where they had Denison before the Big Red went ballistic from long distance.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2016, 07:03:54 PM
Denison goes down to defeat at the hands of Alma, 74-60. Congratulations to Coach Ghiloni and the Big Red on a great championship season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2016, 07:30:39 PM
Final:  Wooster 96  Lancaster Bible 83  :)

Scots were led by Dan Fanelly who had a monster game with 45 points, 12 boards.  Milt Davis had 18 points and Spencer Williams added 14.

Wooster shot 59% from the floor and outrebounded Lancaster Bible 40 to 30.

Next up is a 2nd round game against the winner of Catholic and Endicott
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 04, 2016, 08:12:19 PM
Fannelly ties the D3 Tournament record with 21 FG (on just 24 FGA), including making a couple of 3s, but mostly lay-ups and other close-range shots, to finish with 45 points. He is the first Scot to score 40 in a game since All-American Tom Dinger in 1970.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2016, 08:13:55 PM
Monster game is an understatement.  I really doubt that Wooster has ever had a player with such a stat line.  The dude only missed three shots all game.  21-24!  2-4 from past the arc.  A dunk.  Several stick-backs.  Tons of drives.  Six assists.  Twelve boards.  And only THREE fouls!  There's a lesson to be learned here, if one is paying attention.

Lancaster Bible was able to apply very good pressure.  Too often, though, when Wooster broke it, it led to an easy hoop at the other end.  Plus, LBC turned the ball over quite a bit themselves, leading to several fast-break points.  They're a good team, but IMHO not a legit top-twenty club.  Not enough scorers, too many long three attempts, little inside game by their bigs.  Don't let the final score fool you, Wooster was up by over twenty for most of the second half.

The announcers were kids, with little understanding of what was happening on the court.  Wooster was playing very good, physical defense.  Controlling their defensive board.  They kept thinking LBC was going to break loose, even after they only had about fifteen points in the first ten minutes.  Wooster didn't let them run, and when that happens to a running team, they're going to be in trouble.  They were.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2016, 08:14:12 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2016, 07:30:39 PM
Final:  Wooster 96  Lancaster Bible 83  :)

Scots were led by Dan Fanelly who had a monster game with 45 points, 12 boards.  Milt Davis had 18 points and Spencer Williams added 14.

Wooster shot 59% from the floor and outrebounded Lancaster Bible 40 to 30.

Next up is a 2nd round game against the winner of Catholic and Endicott

I thought this number would be an even greater disparity in favor of Wooster.  It seemed like Wooster was getting offensive rebounds and easy putbacks off of about every missed shot in the 2nd half.

What a night from Fanelly.  If he plays like this, the Scots will be a tough out for anyone... 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2016, 08:18:42 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on March 02, 2016, 11:23:14 PM
Hi all - I guess the NCAA tournament has a way of bringing loooooooong dormant posters out of the woodwork. Very excited to have the Scots visit my neck of the woods this weekend.


LOL!  March Madness will do that won't it! 8-)

Three girls has a way of taking up much of my free time so unfortunately I just don't have the time to contribute to this forum like I did.  I'm more of a lurker these days.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 04, 2016, 08:31:37 PM
Just got home from the game here in DC and I have to say WoosterBooster's assessment is spot on. Lancaster had just not played a team with the quality of execution that Wooster showed. It should be an interesting matchup with I assume Catholic tomorrow. Also of note I was incredibly impressed with the Wooster fan contingent. I had forgotten how well my alma mater's supporters travel. With Catholic up six at the half while I am writing this post, if they can hold on it will b an interesting matchup tomorrow night at the DuFour Center.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2016, 09:03:41 PM
Endicott leads Catholic 62-53 with about nine minutes to go.  It would be great for the Scots to have a neutral court game tomorrow.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2016, 09:21:42 PM
Quote from: woolax on March 04, 2016, 08:31:37 PM
Also of note I was incredibly impressed with the Wooster fan contingent. I had forgotten how well my alma mater's supporters travel.
That's true, but it also must be said that Wooster has a large alumni base in and around DC, maybe the largest outside Ohio.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2016, 09:23:20 PM
OWU is destroying UPG, up 100-66 with over 3:30 left.
UPDATE: OWU 114, UPG 68. OWU will host Lynchburg tomorrow night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2016, 09:31:50 PM
84-76, Endicott hangs on.  Wooooooooooster (as clearly it should be pronounced, since all announcers outside of Wayne County say it that way) will take them on tomorrow at 7 PM.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2016, 09:32:58 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2016, 09:03:41 PM
Endicott leads Catholic 62-53 with about nine minutes to go.  It would be great for the Scots to have a neutral court game tomorrow.

Your wish is granted  ;)

Final: Endicott 84  Catholic 76
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 04, 2016, 09:48:21 PM
Good season, Big Red, and nice for Wooster and OWU to play tomorrow with good chances of moving on!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 04, 2016, 09:49:30 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2016, 09:32:58 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2016, 09:03:41 PM
Endicott leads Catholic 62-53 with about nine minutes to go.  It would be great for the Scots to have a neutral court game tomorrow.

Your wish is granted  ;)

Final: Endicott 84  Catholic 76

Be careful what you wish for. This didn't work out too well for the Scots last weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 04, 2016, 10:14:41 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 04, 2016, 09:49:30 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2016, 09:32:58 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 04, 2016, 09:03:41 PM
Endicott leads Catholic 62-53 with about nine minutes to go.  It would be great for the Scots to have a neutral court game tomorrow.

Your wish is granted  ;)

Final: Endicott 84  Catholic 76

Be careful what you wish for. This didn't work out too well for the Scots last weekend.

I was thinking the same thing.  But I'm still quite happy that the Scots avoid the home team tomorrow night and, given the large contingent of Scots fans in attendance tonight, they should be the pseudo home team tomorrow night.    8-)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 04, 2016, 10:19:34 PM
Interesting Final Score:  Gwynedd Mercy 86  Marietta 85   #6 Pioneers are upset on their home floor.

IF Wooster can make it to the Sweet 16, they would face the winner of Gwynedd Mercy vs. Oswego State
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 04, 2016, 10:28:03 PM
If that happened, it would likely be a true road game, unless perhaps if NYU upsets Christopher Newport. With three of the four hosts in this bracket going down, the NCAA might have some geographic conplications for where to put the regional sectional. 

(the regionals are what's happening now.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooMix on March 04, 2016, 11:57:12 PM
Greetings from Africa! Bet you there's never been a post from Harare, Zimbabwe on this board? :)

Congratulations to both Wooster and OWU on progressing to the next round. I would love to watch both our NCAC teams in action online tonight but the seven-hour time difference is brutal on old me. So best of luck to our teams. Hopefully I'll wake up to another 45-point game tomorrow morning!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 05, 2016, 02:33:59 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 04, 2016, 10:28:03 PM
If that happened, it would likely be a true road game, unless perhaps if NYU upsets Christopher Newport. With three of the four hosts in this bracket going down, the NCAA might have some geographic conplications for where to put the regional sectional. 

(the regionals are what's happening now.)

I mix them up all the time because in Indiana it's sectional > regional > semi-state > state
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 05, 2016, 03:40:31 PM
Pretty much the same thing (sectional to regional to state final 4) in Ohio HS sports. Plus, the NCAA D1 basketball tournament calls the sites for the rounds of 16 and 8 "regionals."  Confusing!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 05, 2016, 06:15:19 PM
After downing Catholic, Endicott moved up 25 spots in the Massey Ratings.  That puts them at number 198!  For perspective, Kenyon is 153, Wittenbert is 99, and Hiram is 61.

Endicott's SOS is a very weak -9.97, which is, however, not as poor as LBC's -14.91.

Wooster is now ranked 21st and has an SOS of -0.28.

All of which is to say that Wooster is a very solid favorite in tonight's game.  As was Catholic last night.



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 05, 2016, 07:09:43 PM
Anyone else having trouble with the audio or video broadcast of the Wooster v Endicoit from the Catholic website?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2016, 07:21:02 PM
Quote from: woolax on March 05, 2016, 07:09:43 PM
Anyone else having trouble with the audio or video broadcast of the Wooster v Endicoit from the Catholic website?
I'm listening on WQKT and they're having technical problems too. Probably something site-related.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 05, 2016, 07:26:21 PM
Quote from: woolax on March 05, 2016, 07:09:43 PM
Anyone else having trouble with the audio or video broadcast of the Wooster v Endicoit from the Catholic website?

No, it's working fine for me.  What isn't working fine is Wooster's game.  Flat.  Ugly first half by both teams.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2016, 08:53:32 PM
OWU advances to the Sectionals, holding off a late Lynchburg challenge to prevail, 97-94.

Wooster joins the BBs in the Sectional, 91-83 in OT. Wooster will face Oswego St., champions of the Marietta regional.

Two teams in the final 16 -- pretty sweet.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on March 05, 2016, 09:14:04 PM
So, next week is likely to be hosted by Oswego State?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 05, 2016, 09:20:17 PM
It seems to be the only one-flight possibility (the other teams are Keene St. from New Hampshire and Christopher Newport of Newport News), and they have a 3500 seat arena, so I'd guess Oswego gets the nod. Although they are the top seed, CNU is more than 500 miles from each of the other three. Both Wooster and Keene are within 500 miles of Oswego, but not each other. Hence, Oswego.

OWU can count on visiting suburban Chicago, as Benedictine pounded the Hardened Sinners. The other game in Lisle will be Alma, vanquishers of first Denison and then JCU, vs. St. Norbert.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 05, 2016, 10:53:54 PM
Great to see both Wooster and Ohio Wesleyan in the Sweet 16!  :)

When Wooster lost to Marietta by 15 points in December and their record dropped to 6-4. I had serious doubts that they would win 20 games and make the NCAA tourney.  Kudos to Coaches Moore and Cline for adjusting the lineup and getting the Scots to go 17-3 since then.

Terrific performances tonight by Fanelly (8 in OT), Williams and Dupler (18 points, 8 boards and a big steal late).  Huge three pointer by Milt Davis with Wooster down 4 and less than 40 seconds left in regulation.  Scots showed great determination to get the win!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: countyroad on March 06, 2016, 06:58:38 AM
I couldn't agree more with wooscotsfan.

I was following the game via LiveStats last night. For whatever reason LiveStats did not list Fanelly at all. I don't know why, but I figured it had to be an error. The box score this morning and story confirmed my suspicions of an error.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 06, 2016, 03:28:00 PM
As expected, Wooster is headed to Oswego while OWU travels to Benedictine in the western suburbs of Chicago. Both will face the host school on Friday, meaning both will play in the second game. Good luck to both teams!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 06, 2016, 04:15:38 PM
Quote from: countyroad on March 06, 2016, 06:58:38 AM
I couldn't agree more with wooscotsfan.

I was following the game via LiveStats last night. For whatever reason LiveStats did not list Fanelly at all. I don't know why, but I figured it had to be an error. The box score this morning and story confirmed my suspicions of an error.

The Scots have been playing musical numbers.  I believe Ari Stern is now wearing Alex Lalonde's 33.  Fanelly, who usually wears number 40, donned 42 last night.  The broadcaster was confused for a while, too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2016, 01:03:26 PM
Long article in today's Daily Record about Wooster freshman Mitch Balser and his father, Fred Balser '79. Fred was a member of the last great team coached by Al Van Wie, and I spent a lot of my first winter on the Hill rooting for him and Sam Dixon and their teammates, especially at a very memorable OAC championship at Wittenberg, won by the Tigers 52-50 in near riot conditions, mentioned in the article. Funny that I never recognized the family connection until now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 08, 2016, 06:20:25 PM
Wooster fans, please go to the Multi-Region Topics section and look for the board titled "longest losing streaks" and see if you can help answer a question. Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 08, 2016, 11:00:05 PM
The Oswego State gym is really nice looking, but I can see why almost all the fans are sitting on the far side.

http://oswegolakers.com/sports/2010/5/27/GEN_0527100034.aspx?id=113
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2016, 03:18:11 PM
Not sure what you are trying to say... but the gym is a nice one, but old school to be sure. The side fans are sitting in in that picture is the main side. The near side doesn't usually have a lot of fans because it is the alternate side. However, I am sure this weekend there will be fans in those seats. It actually is about three or four gym in total. Neat place to see games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 10, 2016, 06:23:11 PM
It is hard work just to get into the NCAA tournament in the first place. It is even harder to get out of the second two rounds. But which eight teams of the 32 left can get the job done and march on to the championship weekends?

Thursday night on Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave McHugh chats with some of those who have already surprised and those who hope to keep their tournament dreams reality.

Hoopsville hits the air at 7pm ET. You can watch the show here: http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2015-16/mar10

Guests include (in order of appearance):
- Ryan Cain, Keene State men's coach
- Jim Scheible, No. 16 Rochester women's coach
- Kendra Hassel, No. 6 UT-Tyler women's coach
- Jason Zimmerman, Emory men's coach (NABC Coach's Corner)
- Dave Hixon, No. 15 Amherst men's coach
- Steve Moore, Wooster men's coach

You can also tune into the podcast(s) after the show has aired:
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville
iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 10, 2016, 07:15:28 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2016, 03:18:11 PM
Not sure what you are trying to say... but the gym is a nice one, but old school to be sure. The side fans are sitting in in that picture is the main side. The near side doesn't usually have a lot of fans because it is the alternate side. However, I am sure this weekend there will be fans in those seats. It actually is about three or four gym in total. Neat place to see games.

I was just referring to the fact that on the far side, opposite the benches, the front row of the stands seems to be only about five feet from the court.  Close.  On the near side the seats are set will back, with a wide walkway behind the benches and scoring tables.  Sitting in the first couple of rows on that side would provide somewhat blocked vision.  Hence, that's why it seems to me that most of the people in the picture opted for the far side.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 10, 2016, 07:42:12 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 10, 2016, 07:15:28 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 09, 2016, 03:18:11 PM
Not sure what you are trying to say... but the gym is a nice one, but old school to be sure. The side fans are sitting in in that picture is the main side. The near side doesn't usually have a lot of fans because it is the alternate side. However, I am sure this weekend there will be fans in those seats. It actually is about three or four gym in total. Neat place to see games.

I was just referring to the fact that on the far side, opposite the benches, the front row of the stands seems to be only about five feet from the court.  Close.  On the near side the seats are set will back, with a wide walkway behind the benches and scoring tables.  Sitting in the first couple of rows on that side would provide somewhat blocked vision.  Hence, that's why it seems to me that most of the people in the picture opted for the far side.

That picture is deciving... there is more room there than it appears. If you look at the right side, you will see people sitting on the sideline with room before the bleachers start. When I was there, I never sensed the bleachers were on top of the court. Pretty much the same room on the side as most Division III gyms. Yes, the bleachers are a bit further back on the near side, but that is to allow for the benches. Yes, a bit back from the court, but still a pretty good view of the game. With the size of that building, they can control the bleachers a bit more. There is a ton of room as a result.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 11, 2016, 07:45:28 PM
The Wooster - Oswego State game seems to be running about half an hour behind schedule, according to their video feed.  They're still in the pre-game and it's 7:45.  Anybody know if that's true, or I not getting a "live" stream?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pg04 on March 11, 2016, 07:47:30 PM
The previous game between CNU and Keene had to complete, and that started at 5:30. They usually give 30 minutes in between games so I think it should be starting relatively soon (sorry I don't remember when the first game ended)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 11, 2016, 09:37:43 PM
To everybody at Oswego State who was involved in the streaming video broadcast of tonight's game: You are a bunch of little Trumps.  Facts apparently mean nothing to you.  You say whatever comes into your tiny, biased minds.  I never in my life heard such an unprofessional broadcast.  You will never, ever gets jobs in any area of sports broadcasting.  Enjoy your pathetic little fratboy lives while your team goes home and cries.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 11, 2016, 09:38:31 PM
Final: Wooster 66  Oswego State 65   ;D  Scots go to the Elite Eight!

Wooster was led by Dan Fanelly with 26 points and 11 boards.  Fanelly scored the final 5 points of the game for the Scots.  Milt Davis had 12 points and Reece Dupler added 8 points.

Next Game:  Wooster vs. Christopher Newport tomorrow night with a trip to the Final Four on the line!  :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Wooster vs Christopher Newport
Post by: woolax on March 11, 2016, 09:40:00 PM
Good match-up for a trip to the Final 4. What are people's thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 11, 2016, 09:45:56 PM
Christopher Newport is 29-1 and is ranked as the #4 team in the country.  They have a pair of very quick guards that Keene State could not stop.

Wooster will have a big challenge tomorrow night but at least the Scots get to play this game on a neutral floor and will likely have more fans cheering for them than Christopher Newport.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pg04 on March 11, 2016, 09:57:49 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 11, 2016, 09:37:43 PM
To everybody at Oswego State who was involved in the streaming video broadcast of tonight's game: You are a bunch of little Trumps.  Facts apparently mean nothing to you.  You say whatever comes into your tiny, biased minds.  I never in my life heard such an unprofessional broadcast.  You will never, ever gets jobs in any area of sports broadcasting.  Enjoy your pathetic little fratboy lives while your team goes home and cries.

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1.kym-cdn.com%2Fphotos%2Fimages%2Fnewsfeed%2F000%2F353%2F279%2Fe31.jpg&hash=39c40c5fd17b2492d4717328a76aed36dcb2a9d8)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 11, 2016, 09:58:21 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 29, 2016, 02:50:05 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 29, 2016, 02:27:21 PM
OWU gets a very favorable draw, and will be a substantial favorite to move on to the sectionals (likely at Benedictine).

Ohio Wesleyan is very good.  I don't think Ohio Wesleyan is a very good tournament team.  I can't find D3 stats for rebound rates which I would prefer to look at, but they are -5.3 on rebound margin- dead last in the conference, 372nd in D3, and the next closest 20-win team to OWU in that category is Salisbury (-0.9, 248th).  That's a really, really poor number for a really good team.  For all of their offensive might, OWU is pretty average defensively and just needs one night when they do something like 8-30 on 3FGAs and they're out.  There's really no plan B for the Bishops. 

I'd look at Wooster to be the last NCAC team standing in this year's tournament.
Benedictine is absolutely dominating OWU on the glass, +27 as I write this. Benedictine has more offensive rebounds than OWU has in total. Wesleyan is shooting over 54% but Benedictine has gotten 19 more shots off and lead by 10 in the waning moments. Props to Wally on this one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 11, 2016, 10:14:20 PM
Yeah, while I was watching the second half of this game (which was back-and-forth in the first half), I recalled that quote and was actually going to hunt it up myself, DC. Good call, Wally.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 11, 2016, 10:44:27 PM
I wasn't watching the Wooster game, but going by Mike Breckenridge's call, I really liked Oswego's last second play call. Down one with 4.x seconds left, and in the double bonus, inbound the ball off the made free throw and not give the defense a chance to set up their own play, then run straight at the defense with your nearly perfect free throw shooter. Props to Milt Davis for sniffing it out and not taking the bait. Even so, it was a gutsy and yet fairly high-percentage call that just didn't pan out, luckily for the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 11, 2016, 10:56:18 PM
There was some contact on the final play but it appeared to be initiated by the Oswego guard Brian Sortino in an attempt to draw foul shots.  Milt Davis didn't reach in and he was holding his ground so, while acknowledging my bias, I thought the refs made the proper non-call.  Sortino was also near the three point line (not near the basket) and he did not appear to be in a shooting motion.

Brian Sortino was crashing into Wooster players throughout the entire game and drawing fouls -- he shot 14 free throws in the game so he certainly got his fair share of calls overall as he was by far the player with the most free throw attempts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on March 11, 2016, 11:10:03 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on March 11, 2016, 10:56:18 PM
Sortino was also near the three point line (not near the basket) and he did not appear to be in a shooting motion.
If he'd gotten the call he was evidently going for, this wouldn't have mattered; they were in the double bonus. Really, Wooster only had one way out on this play, which was to impede Sortino enough to prevent a layup or other high percentage shot, but not foul and send him to the line where he was not going to miss both shots. Fortunately, Milt Davis provided exactly what the Scots needed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 11, 2016, 11:18:37 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on March 11, 2016, 10:44:27 PM
I wasn't watching the Wooster game, but going by Mike Breckenridge's call, I really liked Oswego's last second play call. Down one with 4.x seconds left, and in the double bonus, inbound the ball off the made free throw and not give the defense a chance to set up their own play, then run straight at the defense with your nearly perfect free throw shooter. Props to Milt Davis for sniffing it out and not taking the bait. Even so, it was a gutsy and yet fairly high-percentage call that just didn't pan out, luckily for the Scots.

It was at precisely that time that the video decided to flutter.  It appeared that there was some contact, but really impossible to tell.  Their coach, team, and the whole crowd went ballistic.  It really seemed as if there might be punches thrown during the handshake line.  It seemed as if there might be a riot.

You're lucky you didn't watch it.  They had a whole crew of student announcers.  Three doing the game, three others doing a pregame, halftime, and postgame show.  Another stationed on the floor.  I just don't understand how the faculty members that are supposed to train these kids allow them to act as they do.  One guy, the leader of the halftime show group, was fine.  Everybody else just spouted ridiculous stream-of-thought idiocies.  It was Fox News, it was the Trumpettes, all in their best sportscaster-voice imitations.

It was FANely and KITner all night long.  They stated that Wooster outscored their opponents by 1,000 points this season.  That Steve Moore routinely used all thirteen players on his bench.  That Wooster is the winningest team all-time in DIII.

Every foul against them was a "questionable call".  The video was stretched horizontally so that the players were all thick and the jumpshots looked completely flat. 

Single-sentence contradictions like this kept coming out of their mouths.

(A Wooster player had just missed an open three from the deep elbow area) "That's a shot that Oswego can live with.  But they'd better get out there and defend it because Wooster will begin to make them all night long."

Nobody seems to be able to do this anymore with any preparation, skill, and some sense of neutrality.  It's scary, actually. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 12, 2016, 08:18:04 AM
Congrats to the Ohio Wesleyan Bishops and Coach DeWitt on another terrific season as they finished at 25-5 after their road loss at Benedictine.

OWU Seniors who played in their last game yesterday are Claude Gray, Matt Jeske, Joey Kinsley and Zak Davis.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on March 12, 2016, 11:07:48 AM
Quote from: pg04 on March 11, 2016, 09:57:49 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 11, 2016, 09:37:43 PM
To everybody at Oswego State who was involved in the streaming video broadcast of tonight's game: You are a bunch of little Drumpfs.  Facts apparently mean nothing to you.  You say whatever comes into your tiny, biased minds.  I never in my life heard such an unprofessional broadcast.  You will never, ever gets jobs in any area of sports broadcasting.  Enjoy your pathetic little fratboy lives while your team goes home and cries.

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi1.kym-cdn.com%2Fphotos%2Fimages%2Fnewsfeed%2F000%2F353%2F279%2Fe31.jpg&hash=39c40c5fd17b2492d4717328a76aed36dcb2a9d8)

Yeah, it really did. Wooster Booster, obviously they're going to be a little biased, but what were they saying which was so past the line?

And really glad to see Wooster could pull this out, though tonight's going to be very difficult
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 12, 2016, 12:03:53 PM
NCAC Teams in the Elite Eight since 2000:

2003 Wooster
2004 Wooster
2006 Wittenberg
2007 Wooster
2011 Wooster
2012 Wittenberg
2016 Wooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 12, 2016, 08:51:27 PM
Final:  #4 Christopher Newport 81  Wooster 61

Wooster gave a great effort and cut the lead to 6 points with ~7 minutes left but ran out of energy at that point.

Congratulations to the Scots and Coaches Moore & Cline on a terrific season that exceeded expectations.  It was a great accomplishment for Wooster to reach the Elite Eight!

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on March 12, 2016, 09:08:10 PM
And just when WoosterBooster thought it couldn't get worse 😂

Congrats to the Scots on another quality season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 12, 2016, 09:29:59 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on March 12, 2016, 09:08:10 PM
And just when WoosterBooster thought it couldn't get worse 😂

Congrats to the Scots on another quality season.

Well, the ineptitude of the media crew remained the same.  For the second night in a row it was FANely, Kipner or Kuiper, and tonight, Blaser instead of Balser.  These kids not only don't do any research, but they make things up, and they can't read.

Tonight, the officials decided to join the chorus.  I can't find a boxscore yet, but the live stats say Wooster was called for 26 fouls in the game.  I'll bet they had 14-16 in the first half.  It took them right out of the game.  Neutral court, my ass, that was total garbage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 12, 2016, 09:41:52 PM
You could just mute the broadcast.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 16, 2016, 01:04:02 PM
Well, they did have 12 fouls called in the first half. But I think 8-28 shooting and 2-6 from the line in the first half had WAY WAY WAY more to do with it than any perceived zebra bias.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: seinfeld on April 04, 2016, 11:10:42 PM
Danyon Hempy of River Valley has committed to Wooster:

http://www.marionstar.com/story/sports/high-school/basketball/boys/2016/03/16/boys-basketball-all-ohio-danyon-hempy-dick-hempy/81854008/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on April 19, 2016, 07:17:44 AM
Sad to report the passing of Frank Knorr yesterday. Frank, a former Director of Development at the College of Wooster, was a great supporter of Scots basketball and logged many miles traveling with the team. Frank was also a long-time lurker on this page who knew of and respected all of the veteran posters here, regardless of affiliation. And he was a great guy, fun to be around. I am sad this day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on April 22, 2016, 08:32:23 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on April 19, 2016, 07:17:44 AM
Sad to report the passing of Frank Knorr yesterday. Frank, a former Director of Development at the College of Wooster, was a great supporter of Scots basketball and logged many miles traveling with the team. Frank was also a long-time lurker on this page who knew of and respected all of the veteran posters here, regardless of affiliation. And he was a great guy, fun to be around. I am sad this day.

To echo David's comment, Frank Knorr was a terrific man and a huge supporter of Wooster Athletics.  Frank was one of the lead organizers of the Wooster Rebounders, the local group of fans, that supports Scots Basketball including trips to some of the road games.  Frank Knorr had lots of energy and enthusiasm so his leadership will be greatly missed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on June 02, 2016, 05:58:36 PM
Wittenberg's Bill Brown has resigned.
http://www.wittenbergtigers.com/sports/mbkb/2015-16/releases/20160602phq8s8
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on June 02, 2016, 10:45:44 PM
Matt Croci is tagged as the interim head coach, but surely that's just a formality. I can't imagine a better candidate than the Tiger legend. Best of luck to Matt in his new role.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gordonmann on June 07, 2016, 08:43:32 AM
Speaking of which...

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2016/06/wittenberg-brown-life-cycles

Some fun tidbits in here for Wooster fans, too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Fifth and Putnam on June 07, 2016, 08:58:36 AM
Wonderful article Gordon. Really enjoyed it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gordonmann on June 07, 2016, 12:32:35 PM
Thanks!

It's fun when you have a good material. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on June 07, 2016, 08:29:12 PM
Great piece, Gordon!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gordonmann on June 08, 2016, 01:57:35 PM
Thanks, Greg.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Flying Dutch Fan on July 05, 2016, 02:38:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on June 02, 2016, 10:45:44 PM
Matt Croci is tagged as the interim head coach, but surely that's just a formality. I can't imagine a better candidate than the Tiger legend. Best of luck to Matt in his new role.

I see you were right (no surprise there) as the interim part of his title has been removed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: David Collinge on July 05, 2016, 09:37:43 PM
Quote from: Flying Dutch Fan on July 05, 2016, 02:38:17 PM
Quote from: David Collinge on June 02, 2016, 10:45:44 PM
Matt Croci is tagged as the interim head coach, but surely that's just a formality. I can't imagine a better candidate than the Tiger legend. Best of luck to Matt in his new role.

I see you were right (no surprise there) as the interim part of his title has been removed.

http://m.springfieldnewssun.com/news/sports/matt-croci-named-basketball-coach-of-wittenberg-ti/nrr9X/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Valley on July 08, 2016, 12:51:54 PM
http://www.springfieldnewssun.com/news/sports/wittenberg-tigers-announce-mens-basketball-recruit/nrtjC/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on July 28, 2016, 08:58:17 AM
Less than a month until classes resume.  Any recruiting news in the NCAC?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on July 28, 2016, 02:20:46 PM
Not recruiting news per se, but Johnny Jager is transferring to walk on and be a part of the program at IU (http://scoop.hoosiershq.com/2016/07/former-bloomington-south-guard-johnny-jager-will-walk-on-at-iu-iubb/).  Awesome opportunity for Johnny, big time bummer for Wabash.  This is the second summer in a row that Wabash has lost their top guard to higher divisions.  Kind of puts in a kink in the progress Coach Brum is making, but you can hardly blame a kid from Bloomington, IN for jumping at the chance to be a part of the Hoosiers.  He's literally living THE dream that kids out here have.  Wish Johnny the best of luck.  It was awesome watching him play last season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on July 29, 2016, 10:02:39 AM
Thanks Wally,  Sounds like the kid has a great head on his shoulders.  Best of luck to him.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 21, 2016, 10:23:17 AM
Two different sources on the internet indicating that a new Wooster recruit will be Sherack Malokwu who is a 6'8" post player from Coral Springs Christian Academy in Florida.  Nice to see a legitimate post player as a new recruit given that the Scots lost both Josh Kipfer and Alex LaLonde to graduation.

Still believe that Danyon Hempy 6'5" is the star in Wooster's recruiting class.  Hempy was All Ohio First Team and averaged ~28 ppg as a high school senior. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 21, 2016, 11:09:46 AM
Wooster usually plays 7 non-conference games on their schedule.  Through internet sources, I have found 6 of the non-conference opponents for 2016-2017.

11/19  Defiance - Al Van Wie tourney
11/22  At Marietta
12/18  At Whitman (WA)
12/21  At Lewis & Clark (OR)
12/29  Washington University (MO) - Mose Hole tourney
12/30  Hobart (NY) - Mose Hole tourney

Oberlin will be the other game in the Al Van Wie tourney so there is probably one more non-conference road game on the 2016-2017 schedule.

Defiance, Marietta, Whitman and Washington University should all be tough opponents so this is a fairly challenging schedule.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 29, 2016, 11:25:30 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on August 21, 2016, 11:09:46 AM
Wooster usually plays 7 non-conference games on their schedule.  Through internet sources, I have found 6 of the non-conference opponents for 2016-2017.

11/19  Defiance - Al Van Wie tourney
11/22  At Marietta
12/18  At Whitman (WA)
12/21  At Lewis & Clark (OR)
12/29  Washington University (MO) - Mose Hole tourney
12/30  Hobart (NY) - Mose Hole tourney

Oberlin will be the other game in the Al Van Wie tourney so there is probably one more non-conference road game on the 2016-2017 schedule.

Defiance, Marietta, Whitman and Washington University should all be tough opponents so this is a fairly challenging schedule.

The one additional non-conference game for Wooster will be St. John Fisher on 11/27 and it is actually a home game.

Wooster's full 2016-2017 schedule can be found here:  http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2016-17/schedule
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on August 30, 2016, 08:51:07 AM

That's a strong Wooster schedule - I have pretty high expectations for them this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on October 14, 2016, 11:15:57 PM
Here are the newcomers listed on the Scot's Pre-Season Roster

Blake Blair (Soph), 6'1 235 Forward, Dover
Hunter Coia (Soph), 5'11" 175 Guard, Oldsmar, Fl
Wynn Miller (Soph), 6'2" 180 Guard, Ft. Washington, MD
Jack Petrecca (Soph), 6'5" 175 Forward, Willowick
Raymond Rhone (Soph), 6'2" 160 Guard, Reynoldsburg
John Roberts (Soph), 5'11" 170 Guard, Euclid
Petey Zaremba (Soph), 6'1" 165, Parma Hts
Danyon Hempy 6'5" 180 Guard, Waldo
Peter Jefferys 6'0" 200 Guard, Erie, PA
Sherack Malokwu, 6'7" 210 Center, Lagos Nigeria
Nedas Matulionis, 6'4, 210 Forward, Vilnius Lithuania
Nico Sansotts, 6'5" 180 Forward, Marion
Blake Southerland, 6'0" 155 Guard, Cincinnati
Trenton Tipton, 6'5" 190 Forward, St. Clairsville
Devin Zagar, 6'11" 215 Center, Oil City, PA

I'm not sure what's with all the sophomores. Perhaps they were on the JV squad last year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 23, 2016, 05:16:50 PM
imderekpoe -- thanks for the Wooster pre-season roster.  :)

Besides Danyon Hempy and Sherack Malokwu, a couple of other freshman pop out as possibilities for some playing time:

Trenton Tipton 6'5" Belmont Union Local H.S.  All-Ohio Division III Second Team.  17 ppg as a senior and over 1,000 points in his H.S. career

Nico Sansotta, 6'5" Marion Pleasant H.S.  All-Ohio Division III Special Mention  17.6 ppg, 7.1 rebounds, 2.3 steals, first team Central District
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ruysdael on October 23, 2016, 08:24:02 PM
Looks like another strong freshman class for the Scots.  Did all of the underclassmen letter winners from last year's team return?  If so, this should be a deep and talented team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on October 26, 2016, 09:38:45 PM
Quote from: Ruysdael on October 23, 2016, 08:24:02 PM
Looks like another strong freshman class for the Scots.  Did all of the underclassmen letter winners from last year's team return?  If so, this should be a deep and talented team.

Wooster's top 4 scorers from last season all return.  All letter winners are returning with the exception of Jordan Stock who is not listed on the returning letter winners list linked here:  http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2016-17/roster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pops33 on October 31, 2016, 03:58:17 PM
The NCAC - Wooster (7) and Ohio Wesleyan (8) - gets some respect in the pre-season TOP 25 poll.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pops33 on November 03, 2016, 12:13:43 PM
Does anyone else find it odd that Wooster's first official game is a conference game?  Also, that it is 2 weeks before anyone else plays a conference game?  They open the season with Oberlin on 11/16 and they also play the second conference game on 11/30 vs. Denison before the entire conference gets going on Saturday 12/3.  Seems like an odd way to set up the schedule. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on November 03, 2016, 01:11:53 PM
When I saw that, I suspected either team needed to move one or both of their contests for whatever reasons. I am quite sure the conference didn't set it up that way. It screams of something else going on this season for one or both of them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 03, 2016, 01:20:33 PM
The rest of the NCAC is playing a Dec 3 conference game.   Oberlin is scheduled to play D1 Youngstown State that day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 03, 2016, 07:22:36 PM
Quote from: sac on November 03, 2016, 01:20:33 PM
The rest of the NCAC is playing a Dec 3 conference game.   Oberlin is scheduled to play D1 Youngstown State that day.

Hiram doesn't play a conference game until the 7th.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on November 03, 2016, 10:01:35 PM
Quote from: smedindy on November 03, 2016, 07:22:36 PM
Quote from: sac on November 03, 2016, 01:20:33 PM
The rest of the NCAC is playing a Dec 3 conference game.   Oberlin is scheduled to play D1 Youngstown State that day.

Hiram doesn't play a conference game until the 7th.

I was looking at Oberlin's schedule without checking everyone's pairings that day. 

It appears the NCAC has conference games slated for Dec 17 and 18, but Wooster is out West playing Whitman and Lewis & Clark.   Oberlin is off, so Wooster going out West appears to be the reason for the adjustment.   

It also looks like they did something weird with the Hiram and Allegheny trips to Western Indiana.  Hiram does it that Dec 17,18 while Allegheny does it at the start of January.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on November 04, 2016, 10:28:40 AM
Quote from: sac on November 03, 2016, 10:01:35 PM

It also looks like they did something weird with the Hiram and Allegheny trips to Western Indiana.  Hiram does it that Dec 17,18 while Allegheny does it at the start of January.

The Dec. 17-18 weekend is in the middle of finals at Allegheny, while Hiram's finals are before Thanksgiving, due to an uncommon calendar structure of academic terms.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on November 05, 2016, 12:14:24 AM
Wooster appears to have been in a bizarre exhibition game against Ashland tonight, in which they lost 85-81 in overtime.  68 fouls were called, 35 on Wooster.  The Scots had three guys foul out, naturally including Fanelly.  Wooster outrebounded Ashland 65-41, but committed 25 turnovers.  They shot only 25-71, and 5-25 from downtown.  They missed 11 free throws.  Ashland missed 19!.  Alex Baptiste had 18 boards and 5 blocks for Wooster but was only 3-9 from the floor and 5-10 from the line.  Craziness.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on November 05, 2016, 07:18:32 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on November 05, 2016, 12:14:24 AM
Wooster appears to have been in a bizarre exhibition game against Ashland tonight, in which they lost 85-81 in overtime.  68 fouls were called, 35 on Wooster.  The Scots had three guys foul out, naturally including Fanelly.  Wooster outrebounded Ashland 65-41, but committed 25 turnovers.  They shot only 25-71, and 5-25 from downtown.  They missed 11 free throws.  Ashland missed 19!.  Alex Baptiste had 18 boards and 5 blocks for Wooster but was only 3-9 from the floor and 5-10 from the line.  Craziness.

Yeah I didn't know what to make of that box score - other than Dupler showed up, which is a positive.  He was very impressive potential-wise when I saw them in the NCAAs last season.  Consistency will be key.  I wasn't sure which guys were newcomers, though - how did they contribute?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on November 13, 2016, 04:46:10 PM
Believe it not, the 2016-17 basketball season is just days away. But the season can't start without Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) hitting the air!

Tune in tonight starting at 7pm as Dave talks to the two preseason numbers one teams, finds out how the offseason went for the two defending national championships, and touches bases with the men's and women's basketball committee chairs.

Guests include:
- Kevin Vande Streek, men's basketball committee chair and head coach for Calvin
- Bobbi Morgan, women's basketball committee chair and head coach for Haverford
- John Tauer, head coach for No. 10 St. Thomas men
- Dave Hixon, head coach for No. 1 Amherst men
- Jeff Hans, head coach for No. 4 Thomas More women
- Carla Berube, head coach for No. 1 Tufts women

You can watch the show here: http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2016-17/nov13

You can also tune into the podcast(s) after the show has aired:
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville
iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gordonmann on November 15, 2016, 12:13:43 AM
On Thursday John Rinka of Kenyon will be inducted into the Small College Basketball Hall of Fame. If you're not familiar with his story, we put this together:

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2016/11/rinka-kenyon-journey
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 15, 2016, 11:34:56 PM
Quote from: gordonmann on November 15, 2016, 12:13:43 AM
On Thursday John Rinka of Kenyon will be inducted into the Small College Basketball Hall of Fame. If you're not familiar with his story, we put this together:

http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2016/11/rinka-kenyon-journey

John Rinka was an amazing basketball player who was impossible to guard because he had an incredible shooting range.  If the defender slacked off the least bit, he would pull up and nail a jumper from 30 to 35 feet.  Yes, that was the range that he had developed on his shot.

I attended a unbelievable shootout game in 1969 between Wooster and Kenyon that was played at Wooster's Timken Gym.  John Rinka and Wooster's all time leading scorer Tom Dinger went back and forth scoring buckets.  John Rinka registered his all time career high in a college game with 69 points.  Tom Dinger who had over 2,300 points in his Wooster career finished that game with 40 points.  Kenyon won the shootout 118 to 112 in a game where there was no three point shot.

Congratulations to John Rinka on the well deserved honor of being inducted into the Small College Basketball Hall of Fame!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 16, 2016, 01:26:16 PM
A Wabash team with one junior, one senior (who didn't play) and a whole bunch of sophomores and freshmen lost to Blackburn 75-66 last night in C'ville. May be a rough start for the LG's.

They shot 7-23 from the free throw line.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 17, 2016, 10:25:23 AM
Reports from my dad at Timken Gym last night + the game story and box score suggest that Wooster showed little-to-no early season rust in a methodical 104-65 dispatching of Oberlin last night. Shooting 63% from the field and out rebounding a team 2:1 will help.

I know it's Oberlin, but super-positive early indications on the strength/depth of Wooster's bench and overall team balance. The bench actually outscored the starters 54-50 and 9 players had 10+ minutes, with 5 players in double-figures. Also freshman Danyon Hempy led Wooster in scoring, netting 12 points in his debut.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on November 19, 2016, 06:07:26 PM
Is anyone else watching the Defiance at Wooster video?  Or trying to?  My audio is fine, but the video is a just a bunch of stills.  All these years, and this school just cannot do right.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on November 19, 2016, 06:27:27 PM
This game certainly looked better on paper than its been so far. Either the Scots are incredibly good or Defiance is somewhat less than competitive. Or maybe some of both.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 19, 2016, 06:44:05 PM
At the Half:  Wooster 52  Defiance 22   ;D

Game is essentially over as Scots jumped out to a 17-0 lead before the Yellow Jackets even scored.  Dan Fanelly led Wooster in the half with 17 points.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on November 19, 2016, 10:42:07 PM
Final:  #17 Marietta 74  #2 Christopher Newport 50   :o

Marietta wipes the floor against the same CNU lineup that knocked Wooster out of the NCAA tourney last spring.

Scots will have their hands full when they play AT Marietta next Wednesday
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on November 20, 2016, 02:05:01 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 19, 2016, 10:42:07 PM
Final:  #17 Marietta 74  #2 Christopher Newport 50   :o

Marietta wipes the floor against the same CNU lineup that knocked Wooster out of the NCAA tourney last spring.

Scots will have their hands full when they play AT Marietta next Wednesday

Scary thing is Etta didn't even have a big turnover advantage (+3) or shoot well either (35%)!  I figured one of those two things probably happened...a "just one of those nights" game, if you will. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on November 20, 2016, 06:40:17 PM
Congrats to Matt Croci and his first win as a Witt head coach! After a close loss Friday to Alvernia it was nice to see them bounce back. Witt has both an experienced and young team this year, and will also be interesting as their offense and defense will moderately look a little different than under Coach Brown. I'm excited to see what this team has in store and continue the winning tradition!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on November 21, 2016, 11:28:04 AM
Wooster at Marietta this Wednesday, how do people see this matchup playing out? Both teams are coming in undefeated, and Marietta just drilled #2 Christopher Newport, who knocked the Scots out of the Trny last year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on November 21, 2016, 01:38:23 PM
Quote from: woolax on November 21, 2016, 11:28:04 AM
Wooster at Marietta this Wednesday, how do people see this matchup playing out? Both teams are coming in undefeated, and Marietta just drilled #2 Christopher Newport, who knocked the Scots out of the Trny last year.

I think Marietta will win, maybe not easily, but solidly.  I like the Wooster team a lot, but I don't think they're on the same level.  Of course, that's pretty close to what I would've said about CNU and Marietta before Saturday, so don't listen to me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Fifth and Putnam on November 21, 2016, 02:12:42 PM
It's really hard to say at this point having only played a couple of games. Marietta has looked really good this year and shined against CNU. I think Wooster is going to have a great year, but I am not sure anyone knows at this point what they have as they've blown out two teams that probably won't be very good this year. Marietta is certainly the favorite going in and playing at Ban Johnson surely helps...but a Wooster win wouldn't surprise me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on November 21, 2016, 02:34:19 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on November 19, 2016, 10:42:07 PM
Final:  #17 Marietta 74  #2 Christopher Newport 50   :o

Marietta wipes the floor against the same CNU lineup that knocked Wooster out of the NCAA tourney last spring.

Scots will have their hands full when they play AT Marietta next Wednesday

Not entirely accurate... Weatherall and Burrows - both of whom started most of last season and against Wooster - graduated. Not a ton of points, but certainly good defenders for the Captains. Now you have Daly and others adjusting to starting positions instead of coming off the bench and CNU is looking to fill the role guys with more depth.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 22, 2016, 10:28:03 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on November 21, 2016, 01:38:23 PM
Quote from: woolax on November 21, 2016, 11:28:04 AM
Wooster at Marietta this Wednesday, how do people see this matchup playing out? Both teams are coming in undefeated, and Marietta just drilled #2 Christopher Newport, who knocked the Scots out of the Trny last year.

I think Marietta will win, maybe not easily, but solidly.  I like the Wooster team a lot, but I don't think they're on the same level.  Of course, that's pretty close to what I would've said about CNU and Marietta before Saturday, so don't listen to me.

Agree. Nice to see both Marietta and Wooster coming into this game in good form. Wooster in particular has seemed to be slow to find their rotations and mid-season form some seasons but seemed to be hitting on all cylinders last week.

For a game being played before Thanksgiving, it could have an awful lot to say about end-of-season playoff positioning. This is the type of game each of these teams would *love* to have as a head-to-head win later down the road when we get into regional ranking territory.

Marietta-Wooster has turned into quite a nice little rivalry, with tomorrow's game representing the completion of a second home-and-home series since Marietta ascended to regional/national competitiveness in the 2010-11 season. Nice to see these two programs not be afraid to schedule one another on a regular basis.

'12-'13: Marietta 57, Wooster 59 (at Woo)
'13-'14: Wooster 81, Marietta 78 (at Marietta)
'14-'15: Wooster 86, Marietta 88 (at Marietta, NCAA second round)
'15-'16: Marietta 72, Wooster 57 (at Woo)
'16-'17: TBD (at Marietta)

Last year's game is the only one that hasn't gone right down to the wire, and even it was tight and competitive for the first 30 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 22, 2016, 10:33:34 PM
Capital 82
Ohio Wesleyan 76

Ohio Wesleyan takes the home loss. The box score (http://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2016-17/boxscores/20161122_z40y.xml) suggests the story was that Capital simply outshot OWU. Cap hit at 56% for the game and 63% (7-11) from 3pt vs. OWU's rather paltry 36% and 22% (8-35) from 3pt.

Capital is off to a 4-0 start. OWU falls to 2-1 with the loss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gordonmann on November 23, 2016, 01:38:02 PM
In anticipation of tonight's big game between Wooster and Marietta, our first Around the Great Lakes (http://www.d3hoops.com/columns/around-the-region/greatlakes/index) column focuses on the Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on November 23, 2016, 06:53:51 PM
At the half Marietta is up 51-29 on Wooster. Marietta's 2nd chance points, and defense have allowed them to establish a comfortable halftime lead over Wooster 51-29.  Wooster only shooting 16% from 3, while Marietta has 19 pts off turnovers to the Scot's 6.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 23, 2016, 06:54:16 PM
Marietta thoroughly outplays Wooster in basically all dimensions of the game in the first half en route to a 51-29 halftime advantage.

Scots have their work cut out for them to get back in this one in the second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 23, 2016, 08:21:42 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on November 23, 2016, 06:54:16 PM
Marietta thoroughly outplays Wooster in basically all dimensions of the game in the first half en route to a 51-29 halftime advantage.

Scots have their work cut out for them to get back in this one in the second half.

Scots did not get back into it.

Wooster 70
Marietta 99

Going 1-14 from 3pt while your opponent goes 12-18 is not going to win you a lot of ballgames. But Marietta earned most of those looks and contested Wooster's. The Pios really out shined the Scots tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on November 23, 2016, 09:39:59 PM
WOW!!  Marietta (preseason #17) whupped preseason #2 CNU by 24, now whups preseason #7 Wooster by 29.  I'd certainly expect them to jump into the top 5; wonder if they will get some #1 votes?

These sort of results are why when I started the Fan Poll, we didn't begin voting until January!  Preseason polls make for fun speculation, but they bear only a fun-house mirror resemblance to reality.  The correlation between the preseason and final d3hoops.com polls is WAY above zero, but not real close to perfection.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on November 24, 2016, 08:11:50 AM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on November 23, 2016, 09:39:59 PM
WOW!!  Marietta (preseason #17) whupped preseason #2 CNU by 24, now whups preseason #7 Wooster by 29.  I'd certainly expect them to jump into the top 5; wonder if they will get some #1 votes?

These sort of results are why when I started the Fan Poll, we didn't begin voting until January!  Preseason polls make for fun speculation, but they bear only a fun-house mirror resemblance to reality.  The correlation between the preseason and final d3hoops.com polls is WAY above zero, but not real close to perfection.

I mentioned it in my first ATN column, but I keep being reminded of my interview with CNU's John Krikorian last year.  I talked about how most of his production would be back this season and asked about expectations.  Obviously, as a good coach, he was focused on last year, but he did say, effectively, "You just don't know how chemistry will shake out from one year to the next.  Seniors are leaders, whether they play a lot or not and without them, it's a different team."

We can analyze all we want on paper, but having some real games really helps to judge a team's performance.  I like to prioritize floor results against strong opponents in my voting, so I'm certainly considering Marietta - I already had them #9 anyway.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on November 27, 2016, 12:58:59 PM
Wooster looks to rebound from defeat at Marietta vs St John's Fisher, people's thoughts on this match-up?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on November 27, 2016, 02:46:02 PM
Quote from: woolax on November 27, 2016, 12:58:59 PM
Wooster looks to rebound from defeat at Marietta vs St John's Fisher, people's thoughts on this match-up?

SJF has been subpar this year.  Wooster should win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on November 27, 2016, 04:41:57 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on November 27, 2016, 02:46:02 PM
Quote from: woolax on November 27, 2016, 12:58:59 PM
Wooster looks to rebound from defeat at Marietta vs St John's Fisher, people's thoughts on this match-up?

SJF has been subpar this year.  Wooster should win.

That isn't how people in the East Region have read SJF this season. Many have liked what they have seen. And considering this game is close in the final minutes, I think those opinions may have something to them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on November 27, 2016, 07:17:36 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on November 27, 2016, 04:41:57 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on November 27, 2016, 02:46:02 PM
Quote from: woolax on November 27, 2016, 12:58:59 PM
Wooster looks to rebound from defeat at Marietta vs St John's Fisher, people's thoughts on this match-up?

SJF has been subpar this year.  Wooster should win.

That isn't how people in the East Region have read SJF this season. Many have liked what they have seen. And considering this game is close in the final minutes, I think those opinions may have something to them.

I realized later that "subpar" was not the right word.  I meant to say they're probably not yet the kind of team we remember being tough in the tournament in the last decade.  Not that they're a bad team.  I think the result today was about what I expected.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on November 30, 2016, 11:35:55 PM
Denison continues mastery over Wooster, wins 65-59 at Timken. Thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 01, 2016, 10:16:13 AM
Quote from: woolax on November 30, 2016, 11:35:55 PM
Denison continues mastery over Wooster, wins 65-59 at Timken. Thoughts?
Can't speak to the Denison problem but it's clear that the Scots need some inside help. As hard as he tries Fanelly can't carry the post offense all by himself.  On the outside Milt Davis needs to be more assertive.  And where is Mitch Balser?  Haven't heard.  I didn't see the game however my question is; who guarded Speelman?   He scores 25 and Baptiste and Bullock only have 3 fouls between them.  Have to put a body on someone that talented; even at the cost of a few fouls.   

Just my thoughts and nobody has ever given me a penny for them.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pops33 on December 01, 2016, 05:18:50 PM
The only two Scots that could make a basket in the second half were Fanelly & Williams.  Fanelly & Williams were 11-18 in the second half, but the rest of the team was 3-18 during that period.  They need someone else to consistently step up and help the team out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 03, 2016, 06:59:12 PM
The young Little Giants came close to the upset, losing to Wooster 66-62.

Wooster may be overrated a tad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 09, 2016, 10:46:51 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 03, 2016, 06:59:12 PM
The young Little Giants came close to the upset, losing to Wooster 66-62.

Wooster may be overrated a tad.

I feel like we've been saying "young Little Giants" for maybe one year too many.  I know there are good players there and I know Brum can coach 'em up, but I'm ready for Wabash to have experience and compete for a league championship and a tournament spot.  20 years is a long time to go between tournament games, so the LGs are due. 

Hiram also got Wooster this week, so the Scots have some soul searching to do.  They'll get it figured out and be good before this thing is done, but yeah.  We're not seeing peak Wooster at the moment. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2016, 10:33:15 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 09, 2016, 10:46:51 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 03, 2016, 06:59:12 PM
The young Little Giants came close to the upset, losing to Wooster 66-62.

Wooster may be overrated a tad.

I feel like we've been saying "young Little Giants" for maybe one year too many.  I know there are good players there and I know Brum can coach 'em up, but I'm ready for Wabash to have experience and compete for a league championship and a tournament spot.  20 years is a long time to go between tournament games, so the LGs are due. 

Hiram also got Wooster this week, so the Scots have some soul searching to do.  They'll get it figured out and be good before this thing is done, but yeah.  We're not seeing peak Wooster at the moment.

Hopefully this group of LG's will stick around and shine in the next two years. I think they have the talent.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 10, 2016, 10:42:19 PM
I wish we had regular Denison posters. This has been a pretty solid year for them athletically.

They won the All-Sports trophy last year and had a solid football year and made the NCAA tournament in women's soccer.

Now, their men's hoops teams are undefeated. Their women have a 2-1 record in the NCAC and looks like they played a murderer's row in non-conference (three ranked teams).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on December 12, 2016, 04:30:25 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 10, 2016, 10:42:19 PM
I wish we had regular Denison posters. This has been a pretty solid year for them athletically.

They won the All-Sports trophy last year and had a solid football year and made the NCAA tournament in women's soccer.

Now, their men's hoops teams are undefeated. Their women have a 2-1 record in the NCAC and looks like they played a murderer's row in non-conference (three ranked teams).

Is there a shifting in the balance of power in the NCAC?  The Big Red are #16 in the latest D3hoops Top 25 and they are the lone NCAC rep in the poll.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on December 12, 2016, 06:56:24 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 10, 2016, 10:42:19 PM
I wish we had regular Denison posters. This has been a pretty solid year for them athletically.

We have entered into another dimension from which we are unable to communicate.   :D

Enjoying it, though, and hope we can stay here!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on December 13, 2016, 12:26:58 PM
Denison has a real nice team. Speelman and Meurer played together in HS and know each other well. They have a fairly strong bench. Coach Ghiloni and Sullivan work very well together and the players seem to respond well to them. It should be a fun Year!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 13, 2016, 01:36:42 PM
In the NCAC tournament in 2012, Denison won its first game at Wittenberg in 62 years

In Springfield since
2012  Denison 66  Wittenberg 58
2013  No game at Witt
2014  Denison 63  Wittenberg 60
2014  Wittenberg 64  Denison 49
2015  Wittenberg 59  Denison 57
2016  Denison 75  Wittenberg 72
2017  Denison 72  Wittenberg 68 OT

Denison has won 4 of its last 6 games at Wittenberg


Overall since that first win in 62 years at Wittenberg
2013  Wittenberg 79  Denison 78
2014  Wittenberg 97  Denison 69
2014  Denison 63  Wittenberg
2014  Wittenberg 64  Denison 49
2015  Wittenberg 59  Denison 57
2015  Denison 75  Wittenberg 72
2016  Wittenberg 75  Denison 68
2016  Denison 75  Wittenberg 72
2016  Denison 81  Wittenberg 75
2017  Denison 72  Wittenberg 68 OT
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 13, 2016, 02:31:53 PM
Is that more indicative of the rise of Denison or of the decline of Wittenberg?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 13, 2016, 02:56:59 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 13, 2016, 02:31:53 PM
Is that more indicative of the rise of Denison or of the decline of Wittenberg?

Yes and yes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 18, 2016, 11:43:49 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 10, 2016, 10:33:15 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 09, 2016, 10:46:51 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 03, 2016, 06:59:12 PM
The young Little Giants came close to the upset, losing to Wooster 66-62.

Wooster may be overrated a tad.

I feel like we've been saying "young Little Giants" for maybe one year too many.  I know there are good players there and I know Brum can coach 'em up, but I'm ready for Wabash to have experience and compete for a league championship and a tournament spot.  20 years is a long time to go between tournament games, so the LGs are due. 

Hiram also got Wooster this week, so the Scots have some soul searching to do.  They'll get it figured out and be good before this thing is done, but yeah.  We're not seeing peak Wooster at the moment.

Hopefully this group of LG's will stick around and shine in the next two years. I think they have the talent.

They're definitely scrapping this year.  Near misses with league favorites Wooster and at OWU last week...road win at Kenyon and a home win over Hiram this week.  Some good momentum here heading into the winter break. 

Also noticed a bit of quirky scheduling here.  Wabash and DePauw will do the east coast back-to-back in February, but they aren't doing the same at home.  Hiram swung through Indiana this weekend for a back-to-back (lost both).  Allegheny will do the same after the new year.  So you've got Allegheny and Hiram doing double back-to-backs in league play, while Wabash and DePauw are just doing one (and I presume the rest of the league can avoid this hassle). 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoostAr on December 21, 2016, 09:06:17 PM
Watched the Wooster feed today against Lewis and Clark -- Lewis and Clark finished 4-20 last year and was 3-7 going into tonight and likely will finish in the cellar of their conference --  Wooster did not look good at all -- since I haven't watched any other games yet this year I wonder if this is how they have looked so far this year?  Transition seemed to be their only effective way of scoring -- they got some good looks out of the half court but did not convert. 

Out-rebounded -- defense gave up 56% shooting -- some lost players on the floor -- not sure I've ever seen a game like this out of Wooster....one off or chronic problems??

 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 22, 2016, 11:31:48 AM
Quote from: WoostAr on December 21, 2016, 09:06:17 PM
Watched the Wooster feed today against Lewis and Clark -- Lewis and Clark finished 4-20 last year and was 3-7 going into tonight and likely will finish in the cellar of their conference --  Wooster did not look good at all -- since I haven't watched any other games yet this year I wonder if this is how they have looked so far this year?  Transition seemed to be their only effective way of scoring -- they got some good looks out of the half court but did not convert. 

Out-rebounded -- defense gave up 56% shooting -- some lost players on the floor -- not sure I've ever seen a game like this out of Wooster....one off or chronic problems??


They just don't appear to be very good this year which is hard to understand given their talent.  Should have beat No. 2 Whitman three days earlier and then this.  Don't know.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on December 23, 2016, 08:16:36 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on December 22, 2016, 11:31:48 AM
Quote from: WoostAr on December 21, 2016, 09:06:17 PM
Watched the Wooster feed today against Lewis and Clark -- Lewis and Clark finished 4-20 last year and was 3-7 going into tonight and likely will finish in the cellar of their conference --  Wooster did not look good at all -- since I haven't watched any other games yet this year I wonder if this is how they have looked so far this year?  Transition seemed to be their only effective way of scoring -- they got some good looks out of the half court but did not convert. 

Out-rebounded -- defense gave up 56% shooting -- some lost players on the floor -- not sure I've ever seen a game like this out of Wooster....one off or chronic problems??


They just don't appear to be very good this year which is hard to understand given their talent.  Should have beat No. 2 Whitman three days earlier and then this.  Don't know.

If you recall, they weren't the most impressive team most of last year, and really turned a couple of disciplined performances down the stretch into a decent tourney run.  Maybe we had them ranked too high, but I don't think they're a bad team; they may just be one more prone to take losses.  It comes with the style they're playing right now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 23, 2016, 12:36:10 PM
I don't think Wooster fans are used to .500 records or losing to a backmarker in another conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoostAr on December 23, 2016, 10:04:57 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on December 23, 2016, 08:16:36 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on December 22, 2016, 11:31:48 AM
Quote from: WoostAr on December 21, 2016, 09:06:17 PM
Watched the Wooster feed today against Lewis and Clark -- Lewis and Clark finished 4-20 last year and was 3-7 going into tonight and likely will finish in the cellar of their conference --  Wooster did not look good at all -- since I haven't watched any other games yet this year I wonder if this is how they have looked so far this year?  Transition seemed to be their only effective way of scoring -- they got some good looks out of the half court but did not convert. 

Out-rebounded -- defense gave up 56% shooting -- some lost players on the floor -- not sure I've ever seen a game like this out of Wooster....one off or chronic problems??


They just don't appear to be very good this year which is hard to understand given their talent.  Should have beat No. 2 Whitman three days earlier and then this.  Don't know.

If you recall, they weren't the most impressive team most of last year, and really turned a couple of disciplined performances down the stretch into a decent tourney run.  Maybe we had them ranked too high, but I don't think they're a bad team; they may just be one more prone to take losses.  It comes with the style they're playing right now.

The games I watched last year it seemed like the defense was weak, they just don't get stops -- I thought the same of this game -- but again I'm on the West coast and see very few games. 

Quote from: smedindy on December 23, 2016, 12:36:10 PM
I don't think Wooster fans are used to .500 records or losing to a backmarker in another conference.

A bit about the games I usually watch -- I work at Caltech and watch most of their games since I know many of their players and alums -- very accustomed to watching bad basketball over the years. :) 

Some food for thought via comparison: L & C beat Caltech by 20 a few days before the Wooster game, they shot 43% against Caltech's defense.  (Caltech is ~400 in Massey Rankings) L&C shot 56% against Wooster's defense.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on January 04, 2017, 05:23:25 PM
Learn it.  Live it.  Love it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVs3R77wxAo#t=204.0033541 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVs3R77wxAo#t=204.0033541)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GoRed on January 07, 2017, 02:28:45 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on January 04, 2017, 05:23:25 PM
Learn it.  Live it.  Love it.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVs3R77wxAo#t=204.0033541 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RVs3R77wxAo#t=204.0033541)

Very helpful, thanks.  Do you happen to have one for pronouncing "Worcestershire" too?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 07, 2017, 05:30:51 PM
That's better.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 13, 2017, 12:28:18 AM
Usually I make sure to alert people of who is on Hoopsville prior to the show. Unfortunately, Thursday was a challenge production wise and I was a bit distracted. So, I hope you don't mind finding out after the fact considering you can watch the show On Demand or listen to the podcast(s).

As the season turns from the first to the second half, we are starting to see which teams are doing more than just getting off to good starts. Now conference races are starting to take shape and we get an idea of how the rest of the season may play out.

On Thursday's edition of Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave chatted with several coaches whose teams are either leading their conferences or in the battle for first place. Are these teams going to still be near the top come late February? What do they have to do to maintain their level of success. Dave even hit the road to Washington, DC to chat with several of his guests.

Dave also talked to a coach who now has the second-most wins in Division III history. Wooster's Steve Moore won his 787th (700th at Wooster) Wednesday night. Moore joined Dave in the NABC Coach's Corner to discuss the incredible milestone and all the milestones along the way.

You can watch Hoopsville On Demand or listen to the podcast by downloading it from SoundCloud and iTunes by clicking here: http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2016-17/jan12

And don't forget about the Hoopsville Mailbag segment! Email questions you may have to the show at hoopsville@d3hoops.com and we will answer them on a future show.

Guest appearances (in order):
- Steve Moore, Wooster men's coach - NABC Coach's Corner
- Kevin Kovacs, Gallaudet men's coach
- Matt Donohue, Catholic women's coach
- Chuck Winkelman, Calvin women's coach
- Dale Wellman, Nebraska Wesleyan men's coach

You can also tune into the podcast(s) after the show has aired:
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville
iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on January 14, 2017, 12:29:06 PM
Wooster at Wittenberg this evening. While this match up may lack some of its regular luster since neither team is ranked it is a rivalry game so I am sure both teams will be fired up. What are people's thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on January 14, 2017, 11:01:07 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 13, 2017, 12:28:18 AM
Usually I make sure to alert people of who is on Hoopsville prior to the show. Unfortunately, Thursday was a challenge production wise and I was a bit distracted. So, I hope you don't mind finding out after the fact considering you can watch the show On Demand or listen to the podcast(s).

As the season turns from the first to the second half, we are starting to see which teams are doing more than just getting off to good starts. Now conference races are starting to take shape and we get an idea of how the rest of the season may play out.

On Thursday's edition of Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave chatted with several coaches whose teams are either leading their conferences or in the battle for first place. Are these teams going to still be near the top come late February? What do they have to do to maintain their level of success. Dave even hit the road to Washington, DC to chat with several of his guests.

Dave also talked to a coach who now has the second-most wins in Division III history. Wooster's Steve Moore won his 787th (700th at Wooster) Wednesday night. Moore joined Dave in the NABC Coach's Corner to discuss the incredible milestone and all the milestones along the way.

You can watch Hoopsville On Demand or listen to the podcast by downloading it from SoundCloud and iTunes by clicking here: http://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2016-17/jan12

And don't forget about the Hoopsville Mailbag segment! Email questions you may have to the show at hoopsville@d3hoops.com and we will answer them on a future show.

Guest appearances (in order):
- Steve Moore, Wooster men's coach - NABC Coach's Corner
- Kevin Kovacs, Gallaudet men's coach
- Matt Donohue, Catholic women's coach
- Chuck Winkelman, Calvin women's coach
- Dale Wellman, Nebraska Wesleyan men's coach

You can also tune into the podcast(s) after the show has aired:
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville
iTunes: https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/hoopsville/id1059517087

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) or #Hoopsville
Facebook: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
Email: hoopsville@d3hoops.com
YouTube: www.youtube.com/user/d3hoopsville
I listened to both Coach Moore's and Coach Kovacs' interviews. That's for having them on!

Quote from: woolax on January 14, 2017, 12:29:06 PM
Wooster at Wittenberg this evening. While this match up may lack some of its regular luster since neither team is ranked it is a rivalry game so I am sure both teams will be fired up. What are people's thoughts?
I wasn't able to listen to it, and have just looked at the final score, but winning like that gives me a bit for confidence that they can build something in conference play. And it's a good win because regardless of how the teams are doing, those rivalry games are always tough, like you said.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 20, 2017, 05:18:22 PM
It's been a while since I chimed in on things in here and it's been awfully quiet of late so I just thought it'd be a nice time to share some of my thoughts regarding Wooster hoops.

I'm of the opinion that this Wooster team wasn't nearly as bad as their 6-6 record they brought home from the West Coast indicated.

The Scots have played arguably one of the toughest schedules in the country if you ask me, as 4 of their 6 losses are to the #2, #10, #11 and #18 ranked teams in this weeks Top 25.  And only one of those 4 losses was lopsided as they lost by only 1 point at #2 Whitman in a game they very easily could have and should have won.  They also lost in OT to #11 Wash U in another game they very easily could have and should have won.  And they lost by only 6 to #10 Denison.

I'm hoping that the Scots have started to figure some things out and their tough schedule will have hardened them for the stretch run of the season and on into the post season if they are fortunate enough to make it that far.  Four wins in a row with a dominating win over OWU and a convincing rivalry win at Witt is hopefully just the start of a strong finish to what looked to be a disappointing season!

My question is, if Wooster runs the table but comes up short in gaining the automatic bid, would they be in the conversation for a C bid considering how tough their schedule has been?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on January 21, 2017, 01:03:59 PM
If they ran the table that'd put them at 19-6 heading into the NCAC tourney with road wins at Denison and OWU (a season sweep).  I don't know enough about the SOS and selection process, but my common sense tells me if they made it to, say, the NCAC finals and lost to Denison?  I'd think that feels like someone that's an at-large.  Or at least in the discussion anyway.  If they could have pulled out even one of those games against ranked teams earlier I'd feel better though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Fifth and Putnam on January 21, 2017, 08:09:13 PM
21-7 might be enough to get them in...I don't think they run the table though and get to that point.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 22, 2017, 10:10:03 AM
I think Wooster needs to win the conference regular season or the tournament to get in.  You can sell me on one, maybe two, "good losses" but not four.

Just my thoughts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on January 22, 2017, 02:36:28 PM

As I said in the OAC - I think an 8 loss team has a chance with a good SOS, but you have to make sure to win enough post-season games to get to that magic .667 winning percentage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 22, 2017, 02:44:55 PM
Very general thoughts........
7 losses with a good SOS should get you in the tournament.
8 losses with a good SOS is dependent year to year on how many other 8 loss teams there are or if 8 losses even makes it to the final table
9 losses and you're looking at being one of the last Pool C spots and only in years where 9 losses gets to the table and that's only happened twice I think.

There is an extra Pool C slot or two from previous seasons so it should go a touch deeper this year.

At some point Wooster is going to have to beat Denison to get in either by Pool A or Pool C for sure.  And probably avoid losing to anyone else.


The Great Lakes is probably going to have 3 or 4 Pool C candidates with 5, 6 and 7 losses and bad SOS's, while having 3 or 4  7 and 8 loss teams with really good SOS's.


Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 23, 2017, 08:16:01 AM
Quote from: Dr. Acula on January 21, 2017, 01:03:59 PM
If they could have pulled out even one of those games against ranked teams earlier I'd feel better though.

Quote from: bufordscot on January 22, 2017, 10:10:03 AM
I think Wooster needs to win the conference regular season or the tournament to get in.  You can sell me on one, maybe two, "good losses" but not four.

Just my thoughts.

Agreed on both points.  I'd definitely be feeling better about Wooster's Pool C chances had they actually pulled out one of those tough losses to a ranked opponent.  However, if they can find a way to beat DU in Granville, that would certainly help their cause...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gordonmann on January 24, 2017, 10:48:48 PM
Hey, speaking of Denison...

http://www.d3hoops.com/columns/around-the-region/greatlakes/2016-17/denison-locals
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoostAr on January 25, 2017, 12:47:58 PM
Full Disclosure: Haven't been able to watch these games

Since the Washington St. Louis game the stats seem to indicate that Wooster's defending the three point line (and in general) much better.  They have been able to score with just about everyone they've played this year -- if they can continue the defensive pressure when they play some higher level teams, they could have a shot at tipping the scales in those games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 26, 2017, 07:45:02 PM
Quote from: gordonmann on January 24, 2017, 10:48:48 PM
Hey, speaking of Denison...

http://www.d3hoops.com/columns/around-the-region/greatlakes/2016-17/denison-locals

Also speaking of Denison, next 3 games for them will go a long way to settling the NCAC race.

1-28   Wittenberg
2-1    at Ohio Wesleyan
2-4    Wooster

NCAC standings
Denison                    11-0   17-1
Ohio Wesleyan       9-2   12-6
Wooster                      9-2   12-6
Wittenberg              6-5   12-6
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on January 29, 2017, 02:43:24 AM
Here's the last play of the Wiitenberg/Denison game

https://twitter.com/WittenbergHoops/status/825476700171563009
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 29, 2017, 09:07:51 AM
Watched the Wooster/DePauw double OT thriller yesterday and I must say that was a gut check effort by the Scots.

I was listening to part of the first half in my car and heard the stat that Luke Lattner from DePauw was leading the league by far in ft attempts and after watching most of the 2nd half and both OT's, he might want to switch his number to 23 with the number of touch fouls he draws.  To put it in perspective, Lattner nearly had more points at the line than he did from the floor as he had 21 points at the line on 26 attempts?!  It seemed like no matter what Wooster did, DePauw ended up giving him the ball on offense and he would inevitably draw a foul and go to the line for ft's.  That was pretty much DePauw's offense the entire 2nd half?! 

Lucky for Wooster, DePauw didn't play much defense either as Wooster pretty much had their way inside as Fanelly, Williams and Dupler made it look easy at times driving to the basket for easy layups.

Wooster finally got Lattner to foul out in the 2nd OT and that pretty much ended DePauw's chances as their go to offensive threat was no longer on the floor and the Tigers had no one to answer for the loss of Lattner.

Nice win for the Scots who remain undefeated in 2017!  And with Witt upsetting DU yesterday, the Scots and the Bishops are now just one game back of the Big Red.  Wooster makes the trek to Lewiston next Saturday where the Scots will get another shot at avenging an earlier loss.  They already avenged one loss with their 103-85 thumping of Hiram.  I will say as I said for the Hiram game, this will be a different Wooster team than the one that lost to the Big Red in Timken back in late November.  Chemistry and confidence are both much improved on this team!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 29, 2017, 11:18:59 AM
Something to be said for surviving when you shoot 14% from beyond the arc however; you did shoot 14% from beyond the arc :(
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 30, 2017, 09:02:07 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on January 29, 2017, 11:18:59 AM
Something to be said for surviving when you shoot 14% from beyond the arc however; you did shoot 14% from beyond the arc :(

It could also be said that it's nice to see that Wooster can adapt when the 3 ball isn't falling for them as opposed to being a live by the 3, die by the 3 sort of team.  Wooster struggled from beyond the arc, but they also had things going inside scoring 62 points in the paint and they also shot a healthy 56% inside the arc.  I like seeing that they can adapt as opposed to not having an option if the 3 ball isn't falling.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 01, 2017, 09:25:45 PM
Wooster brought a 48-game winning streak against Oberlin (dating back to 1990) into tonight's game against the Yeomen, who had lost 17 in a row since beating Alfred State before Thanksgiving.  Both streaks very nearly ended, but Wooster escaped by a 69-68 score.  In the last minute, Oberlin was called for charging and missed make-able shots on two possessions, including one just before the buzzer. 

Oberlin's scores suggest that they are much better than their record would indicate, with close defeats to #12 Denison (72-69), #15 Claremont-Mudd-Scripps (60-57), Witt, OWU, DePauw, and now Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TheOsprey on February 01, 2017, 09:43:20 PM
OWU about to take down Denison.

Three way tie on top. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on February 02, 2017, 04:13:26 PM
This Saturday Wooster goes to Denison who is coming off a mid-week loss to OWU. What are people's thoughts on the matchup?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 02, 2017, 05:42:20 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 01, 2017, 09:25:45 PM
Wooster brought a 48-game winning streak against Oberlin (dating back to 1990) into tonight's game against the Yeomen, who had lost 17 in a row since beating Alfred State before Thanksgiving.  Both streaks very nearly ended, but Wooster escaped by a 69-68 score.  In the last minute, Oberlin was called for charging and missed make-able shots on two possessions, including one just before the buzzer. 

Oberlin's scores suggest that they are much better than their record would indicate, with close defeats to #12 Denison (72-69), #15 Claremont-Mudd-Scripps (60-57), Witt, OWU, DePauw, and now Wooster.

They're 1-19.  Aren't they probably just really bad this year?  Occam's razor.  If they weren't they'd have won an NCAC game or 3.  It's not like the bottom half is a meat grinder.  I'd say those close scores would more likely be teams being asleep at the wheel against them.  But Oberlin has appeared to play their best ball recently.  Hopefully they can notch a few conference W's down the stretch.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 02, 2017, 06:19:08 PM
Quote from: Dr. Acula on February 02, 2017, 05:42:20 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 01, 2017, 09:25:45 PM
Wooster brought a 48-game winning streak against Oberlin (dating back to 1990) into tonight's game against the Yeomen, who had lost 17 in a row since beating Alfred State before Thanksgiving.  Both streaks very nearly ended, but Wooster escaped by a 69-68 score.  In the last minute, Oberlin was called for charging and missed make-able shots on two possessions, including one just before the buzzer. 

Oberlin's scores suggest that they are much better than their record would indicate, with close defeats to #12 Denison (72-69), #15 Claremont-Mudd-Scripps (60-57), Witt, OWU, DePauw, and now Wooster.

They're 1-19.  Aren't they probably just really bad this year?  Occam's razor.  If they weren't they'd have won an NCAC game or 3.  It's not like the bottom half is a meat grinder.  I'd say those close scores would more likely be teams being asleep at the wheel against them.  But Oberlin has appeared to play their best ball recently.  Hopefully they can notch a few conference W's down the stretch.

Occam's Razor is a good way to describe a series of close shaves. ;)

Seriously, though, one consolation for the Yeomen is that they're probably among a tiny percentage of college basketball players who would understand a reference to Occam's Razor.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 05, 2017, 12:17:23 PM
Quote from: sac on January 26, 2017, 07:45:02 PM


Also speaking of Denison, next 3 games for them will go a long way to settling the NCAC race.

1-28   Wittenberg
2-1    at Ohio Wesleyan
2-4    Wooster

NCAC standings
Denison                    11-0   17-1
Ohio Wesleyan       9-2   12-6
Wooster                      9-2   12-6
Wittenberg              6-5   12-6

Well, Denison had a 2 game lead in the NCAC prior to that 3 game stretch and now sit a game back having lost all 3 games...

Wooster used a 20-0 run in the 2nd half to pull away for the easy win over the Big Red!  Wooster seemed in control most of the first half only to see DU grab a bit of momentum to start the 2nd half and actually pulled within 2 and had the crowd back in the game.  But a little over 5 minutes later, the lead was 22 for the Scots and Wooster was never really threatened the rest of the way.   

With OWU and Wooster now tied atop the standings, Saturday's showdown in Delaware is a HUGE game in deciding the regular season conference title.

Wittenberg will also have a chance to factor in the outcome of the conference title in the role of spoiler as OWU has to travel to Springfield and Wooster will host Witt on the final game of the regular season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 11, 2017, 05:09:44 PM
OWU wins 81-72 against Wooster at Branch Rickey. They have Witt and Allegheny left to play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 11, 2017, 05:42:15 PM
Nice win for the Bishops.  Here's the update...

Based on simulations (including tiebreakers), here are the tourney seed probabilities, coming into the day

1) OWU(14-2, split with Woo & Den) - 66% #1, 24% #2, 10% #3
2) Wooster(13-3) - 26% #1, 41% #2, 23% #3
3) Denison(13-3) - 8% #1, 35% #2, 57% #3
4) Witt (11-5) - 0.3% #2 or #3, 99.7% #4
5) Wabash(7-9, swept Hiram) - 60% #5, 12% #6, 28% #7
6) Hiram(7-9) - 33% #5, 55% #6, 12% #7
7) DePauw(6-10) - 7% #5, 32% #6, 60% #7, 1% #8
8) Allegheny(4-12, split with Kenyon) - 1% #7, 59% #8, 40% out
9) Kenyon(4-12) - 41% #8, 59% out
10) Oberlin(1-15) - 100% out
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 11, 2017, 08:06:56 PM
Obviously, OWU would be the top seed with two more wins, but here are the applicable tiebreakers.

If an OWU loss to Witt led to ties for first at 15-3, then Wooster would win any tiebreakers. OWU, Denison, and Wooster all split against each other, and Wooster would be the only one to sweep Witt.  A tie between only OWU and Denison in this scenario would come down to a coin flip, as both would have lost to the same three opponents.

An OWU win over Allegheny locks up the top seed for the Bishops, as even if they lost to Allegheny, OWU would hold the tiebreaker over Denison by sweeping Witt, and over Wooster by sweeping Hiram.

Wabash holds the tiebreaker over Hiram based on a head-to-head sweep. If Wabash finishes the sweep of DePauw on Wednesday night, they would hold that tiebreaker as well. However, if DePauw beats Wabash, then the Tigers win the tiebreaker (split head-to-head, both 0-6 vs top three, DePauw would have the only win over 4th-place Witt.) Hiram would win a tiebreaker over DePauw, because of beating Wooster.

A Kenyon/Allegheny tie for 8th is more uncertain, and might come down to the results of other games this week.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 18, 2017, 07:31:34 PM
With their win over the Gators, OWU, takes the NCAC regular season title , and the 1 seed for the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 18, 2017, 10:20:19 PM
Saturday's scores
OWU 110, Allegheny 55
Denison 76, Wabash 65
Hiram 58, Kenyon 55
DePauw 71, Oberlin 68
Wooster 99, Wittenberg 71

Quarterfinals - Tuesday evening
#8 Kenyon (5-20, 4-14) at #1 Ohio Wesleyan (19-6, 16-2)
#5 Hiram (11-14, 8-10) at #4 Wittenberg (17-8, 11-7)
#6 DePauw (12-13, 8-10) at #3 Denison (21-4, 15-3)
#7 Wabash (11-14, 7-11) at #2 Wooster (18-7, 15-3)

Assuming that OWU wins their quarterfinal, they will host the weekend games.  Due to the relatively small capacity of Branch Rickey Arena, Friday night would be a split session, with games at 5:30 and 8:30, and the gym cleared in between.  Saturday's championship will be a 4:00 tip.

The only likely way that the NCAC gets multiple bids in the national tournament is if Wooster loses the final, and even that is no guarantee.  OWU and Denison might have an outside chance at a Pool C berth by losing the final, but that seems unlikely.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: TheOsprey on February 21, 2017, 07:35:47 PM
 Why is Fanelly not in lineup?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 21, 2017, 09:12:38 PM
Quote from: TheOsprey on February 21, 2017, 07:35:47 PM
Why is Fanelly not in lineup?

I just came on here to hopefully find out the same thing. :)  Wooster won 89-68 and Fanelly didn't play at all.  The story, which surely will provide some information, isn't up yet.  Most likely an injury in practice, but we'll know for sure soon.  Wooster started four guards and a forward!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 22, 2017, 07:07:27 AM
To whomever wrote the story on the Wooster website about last night's game.  Did you not think it was news that Dan Fanelly did not play?  Really?  To not even mention that he did not play isn't bad journalism, it's a joke.  Go get a job in the Trump administration, Kellyanne.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 22, 2017, 07:42:28 AM
Per The Daily Record it was a coaches decision and his status for Friday isn't known.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 22, 2017, 08:09:35 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 22, 2017, 07:42:28 AM
Per The Daily Record it was a coaches decision and his status for Friday isn't known.

Sounds like a disciplinary issue?

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: iwumichigander on February 22, 2017, 09:37:35 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 22, 2017, 07:07:27 AM
To whomever wrote the story on the Wooster website about last night's game.  Did you not think it was news that Dan Fanelly did not play?  Really?  To not even mention that he did not play isn't bad journalism, it's a joke.  Go get a job in the Trump administration, Kellyanne.
WooBoo - I would guess the write up by SID office.  And no respectable SID is going to mention Fanelly did not play nor why he did not play.  Otherwise, he or she would need to apply to the Trump administration.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 22, 2017, 10:21:10 PM
Quote from: iwumichigander on February 22, 2017, 09:37:35 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 22, 2017, 07:07:27 AM
To whomever wrote the story on the Wooster website about last night's game.  Did you not think it was news that Dan Fanelly did not play?  Really?  To not even mention that he did not play isn't bad journalism, it's a joke.  Go get a job in the Trump administration, Kellyanne.
WooBoo - I would guess the write up by SID office.  And no respectable SID is going to mention Fanelly did not play nor why he did not play.  Otherwise, he or she would need to apply to the Trump administration.

Fair enough.  Although if it was an injury, I'll bet that it would have been mentioned.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 23, 2017, 09:15:26 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 22, 2017, 10:21:10 PM

Although if it was an injury, I'll bet that it would have been mentioned.

That was my thought as well...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 23, 2017, 11:54:36 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 23, 2017, 09:15:26 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 22, 2017, 10:21:10 PM

Although if it was an injury, I'll bet that it would have been mentioned.

That was my thought as well...

I don't think Mount's SID mentions injuries.  They have a kid who is averaging 17 ppg who has missed 5 straight games due to injury and I only know that because of his personal twitter.  I can't recall anything out of the SID referencing injuries in any sport.  The newspaper guys are another story, but not from the SID.  I wonder if student privacy laws don't allow the school to disclose it? 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Fifth and Putnam on February 23, 2017, 02:13:09 PM
I'll be honest, I can't remember seeing a game recap from the school at the D3 level that included bits of news as to why someone didn't play. I see it at the D1 level quite a bit though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 23, 2017, 08:30:05 PM
I can understand a college sports program that desires to keep player disciplinary actions, as the Fanelly situation seems to be, in-house. (If he indeed did not play due to injury, keeping quiet about it is only fueling the speculation in other directions, which he would certainly not deserve.)  But injuries?  I don't get it.

I follow the DII Ashland University women's team.  They're ranked #1 nationally and are undefeated at 28-0.  Laina Snyder, a post and arguably their best player, has missed the last two games.  It took a lot of searching to find out that she was injured, with no information at all coming from their website.  Even the newspaper article failed to mention any details as to what it is, or the severity, or when she might be expected to return.

I find this unbelievable.  Their regular season is finished, with the league tournament next on the agenda.  After that, Ashland will be contending for a national championship.  If their best player is hurt, this is NEWS, not some state secret.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 24, 2017, 06:24:28 AM
Fanelly will in the starting lineup tonight according to this morning's preview in The Daily Record.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 24, 2017, 10:31:37 PM
To whoever worked the camera during the Denison-Wooster game tonight.  All you had to do was traverse a single camera, the only one in operation during the game, and you couldn't do it.  Whenever there was a fast break, we were left looking at the wrong end of the court, often after it had emptied out of players.

It's a job that a five-year old could do, and you were too lazy and inattentive to keep up.  Thanks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 25, 2017, 08:54:53 AM
^^^ That's a far too common occurrence during NCAC/OAC I've watched this year.  It's maddening.  Every time it happens I'm picturing some hungover student playing on his phone then looking up like "Oh sh!t they're down there now".
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 25, 2017, 11:22:04 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 24, 2017, 10:31:37 PM
To whoever worked the camera during the Denison-Wooster game tonight.  All you had to do was traverse a single camera, the only one in operation during the game, and you couldn't do it.  Whenever there was a fast break, we were left looking at the wrong end of the court, often after it had emptied out of players.

It's a job that a five-year old could do, and you were too lazy and inattentive to keep up.  Thanks.

Could've been worse.  The Ramapo guy missed a halfcourt buzzer beater to win the NJAC title last night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Smitty Oom on February 25, 2017, 12:49:29 PM
Quote from: Dr. Acula on February 25, 2017, 08:54:53 AM
^^^ That's a far too common occurrence during NCAC/OAC I've watched this year.  It's maddening.  Every time it happens I'm picturing some hungover student playing on his phone then looking up like "Oh sh!t they're down there now".

See Dave's rant on this earlier this month... For the life of me I can't remember the Conference board it was in but this was the very subject. I would say the CCIW, but that is probably just because Sager was involved in the convo. Hopefully somebody can provide some more insight here.

Buut SportsCenter still got a good view of the Buzzer Beater shot!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 25, 2017, 01:58:37 PM
Good memory.  It was in the CCIW thread.

Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 19, 2017, 10:18:05 PM
I have found that when the camera operator stops moving the camera with the action, two things have happened: he/she has stopped remembering they are an employee and have become a fan; they have found their cellphone and somehow things are more interesting there. In either case, it is training that needs to be done or improved (I don't want to assume anything about Carroll or anyone's set-up and employment practices), cellphone needs to be removed (I have done that at two locations now), and the student needs to remember that this is an actual job and not a hobby. Wherever I have been hired to oversee or train, I remind those students that college is to prepare them for their future especially in employment. No excuse for not doing the job properly and if they can't do it... the door is that way.

Again, don't want to assume anything about Carroll's set-up. I can appreciate an SID who has to wear extra hats. I don't like it, but every situation is different. From what I saw on the video, the student was a fan or a cellphone addict... either way, easily fixed. I have had ADs tell me they have "reminded" students of their roles in a manner that solved the problem.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 25, 2017, 02:13:22 PM
And I agree with Dave's point.  I will say that I am far more forgiving if they forgot because they're in "fan" mode.  They probably have buddies playing so you might get caught up in the action.  It shouldn't happen, but I won't crucify them for it.  But the cell phone, which was my first thought, is unacceptable. 

Unfortunately regardless of the work environment you are battling the cell phone issue.  I walk around our office (a CPA firm) and I can't tell you how many people are sitting at their desk staring at their phone.  And it's not just young staff.  It's all ages.   
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 25, 2017, 04:28:18 PM
29-18 right now.  The Scots are looking good so far.  OWU looks a little out of control at times.  They could use a little spurt before half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on February 25, 2017, 04:54:07 PM
39-30 at half. Come on Scots, one more half to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 25, 2017, 05:05:30 PM
OWU looks terrible.  They are at risk of this one getting ugly.  Axelrod and Clark have been way, way off.  Axelrod has taken some questionably long 3's.  Woo on the other hand looks sharp and under control. 

Woo pushed it out to 20, OWU was shooting below 30% until under 10 min to go in the game...and somehow it's a 68-63 game now. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on February 25, 2017, 05:30:48 PM
I haven't really been watching, but OWU now down six with 4:43 left in the game. Come on Woo, you have to stop them
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 25, 2017, 05:33:31 PM
Quote from: WooClone15 on February 25, 2017, 05:30:48 PM
I haven't really been watching, but OWU now down six with 4:43 left in the game. Come on Woo, you have to stop them

Woo has been struggling on offense outside of Fanelly.  Someone else needs to step up.

Good job by Dupler (baseline floater) and Williams (mid range J) to do just that down the stretch. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on February 25, 2017, 05:39:37 PM
damn that was a good 3 by OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on February 25, 2017, 05:45:06 PM
And Wooster pulled it out. But wow that was close. Great job by OWU
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 25, 2017, 05:50:30 PM
Quote from: WooClone15 on February 25, 2017, 05:45:06 PM
And Wooster pulled it out. But wow that was close. Great job by OWU

Very good game.  I couldn't believe OWU got the steal and layup off the Woo in bound down 4 with under a minute.  And he got fouled (but missed the FT).  Crazy.  The Bishops had the go ahead 3 go in and out with 13 seconds left.  I did NOT think they'd be in that position.  Fun game to watch!  Congrats, Scots. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 25, 2017, 05:56:54 PM
Blessed. :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 25, 2017, 06:08:03 PM
Congratulations to the Wooster Scots on qualifying for the NCAA tournament and Coach Moore on his 800th career win.

A great game to watch. Wooster builds a BIG lead as OWU shot poorly from 3 and turned it over at a much higher rate than season average. But I had that feeling that they were not going to go away.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2017, 08:42:21 AM
Congrats to the Scots on their 16th NCAC tournament title and their NCAA record 15th straight trip to the NCAA tournament and lastly on Coach Moore's 800th win!!! 

Hard to believe this team was once 6-6 albeit against some pretty good competition.  They've gone 15-1 since then and now with the automatic bid, only have to wait to see who and where they play and not if they play!  8-)


BTW, why was the championship game not held later?  I was assuming the game was tipping off around 7 and when I when to check out the tip time, the game was final?!  Don't get why they had to play the game so early?! 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 26, 2017, 08:28:13 PM
The NCAC Tournament final is now set at 4:00, regardless of the teams involved. I assume that it had to do with travel, in situations where the visiting team has a long trip home (for example, Wabash at Wooster a few years back.)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2017, 07:57:03 AM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 26, 2017, 08:28:13 PM
The NCAC Tournament final is now set at 4:00, regardless of the teams involved. I assume that it had to do with travel, in situations where the visiting team has a long trip home (for example, Wabash at Wooster a few years back.)
Thanks for the reply. 
Title: Wooster's pod
Post by: woolax on February 27, 2017, 01:02:15 PM
Wooster takes on North Central (IL) in a pod that includes Westminister and Hanover as host. Thoughts?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2017, 01:05:38 PM
No at-large selection for Ohio Wesleyan or Denison, as expected. First time in a while (I think?) that the NCAC has been a one-bid league.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 27, 2017, 01:08:40 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2017, 01:05:38 PM
No at-large selection for Ohio Wesleyan or Denison, as expected. First time in a while (I think?) that the NCAC has been a one-bid league.

Last time was 2007, the year Wooster went to the Final Four for the second time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 27, 2017, 01:25:36 PM
North Central, then at Hanover if they win, and potentially vs Wash. U. or Hope (likely in Whitewater) if they advance. That's a favorable draw, compared to other possibilities.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2017, 01:32:23 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 27, 2017, 01:25:36 PM
North Central, then at Hanover if they win, and potentially vs Wash. U. or Hope (likely in Whitewater) if they advance. That's a favorable draw, compared to other possibilities.

I'll take that over going to 'Etta! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 27, 2017, 02:16:09 PM
Can someone tell me how many at large bids that are?
I am having a real hard time trying to figure how Denison is not in....

They are ranked all season....last week at #14!!

And they take seven teams at 17-10!!!!

Are they ALL conference winners?????????
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Fifth and Putnam on February 27, 2017, 02:24:22 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on February 27, 2017, 02:16:09 PM
Can someone tell me how many at large bids that are?
I am having a real hard time trying to figure how Denison is not in....

They are ranked all season....last week at #14!!

And they take seven teams at 17-10!!!!

Are they ALL conference winners?????????

Denison's strength of schedule was their undoing. It wasn't just bad, it was really bad.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 27, 2017, 02:27:25 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on February 27, 2017, 02:16:09 PM
Can someone tell me how many at large bids that are?

There are 21 Pool C bids.

Quote from: BigRedFan on February 27, 2017, 02:16:09 PMI am having a real hard time trying to figure how Denison is not in....

They are ranked all season....last week at #14!!

Completely irrelevant. The d3hoops.com poll has no bearing whatsoever upon the NCAA's selection process.

Quote from: BigRedFan on February 27, 2017, 02:16:09 PMAnd they take seven teams at 17-10!!!!

Are they ALL conference winners?????????

No, but Fifth and Putnam's told you everything you need to know about why Denison wasn't selected for a Pool C berth.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: realist on February 27, 2017, 02:28:34 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on February 27, 2017, 02:16:09 PM
Can someone tell me how many at large bids that are?
I am having a real hard time trying to figure how Denison is not in....

They are ranked all season....last week at #14!!

And they take seven teams at 17-10!!!!

Are they ALL conference winners?????????

Calvin is 17-10, and won the MIAA tournament, and the AQ.  That is why they play the games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 27, 2017, 02:33:58 PM
Thanks soooooooooo much for the reasons....

So why does Denison rank as high as 9th if we play nothing but
crap teams?  The ranking is only based on record alone?

So of those 21 at large bids they ALL played tougher schedules?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Fifth and Putnam on February 27, 2017, 02:49:38 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on February 27, 2017, 02:33:58 PM
Thanks soooooooooo much for the reasons....

So why does Denison rank as high as 9th if we play nothing but
crap teams?  The ranking is only based on record alone?

So of those 21 at large bids they ALL played tougher schedules?

The D3hoops poll is a collection of 25 voters (media, SID, ect.) from across the country. While it's a fun discussion starter, it does not have any bearing on selecting teams for the NCAA Tournament. Denison had a nice lofty ranking a few weeks back but there was a lot of discussion that when looking at their criteria numbers, they really needed to win the automatic bid because it's nearly impossible to get an at-large with a sub .500 SOS. I don't have the numbers in front of me but I tend to remember Denison being around .450 or .460..significantly lower than .500 and that showed up when they got buried in the regional rankings a bit despite their W-L record.

To your second question, yes all 21 at large bids had a better SOS than Denison.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on February 27, 2017, 02:50:06 PM
Quote from: woolax on February 27, 2017, 01:02:15 PM
Wooster takes on North Central (IL) in a pod that includes Westminister and Hanover as host. Thoughts?
I don't know too much about Illinois Central, but all I know is I wish they had been the hosts. I'm in Madison, Wisconsin now, so I could have gone watch Wooster play if that was the case.

Quote from: BigRedFan on February 27, 2017, 02:33:58 PM
Thanks soooooooooo much for the reasons....

So why does Denison rank as high as 9th if we play nothing but
crap teams?  The ranking is only based on record alone?

So of those 21 at large bids they ALL played tougher schedules?
Yeah, the ranking probably is based a lot on record. It's a different division, but look at D-I. Do you really think that Gonzaga would be number 1 and only have one loss if they were playing in the big 10 or big 12?

And they might have all played tougher schedules, that's for the selection committee and the people who know a lot more then I do to decide, but in all the discussion on here, it looks like Denison has pretty much never been in play (or at least not recently). And considering how numbers-based the selection seems to be, I think all those teams probably had better numbers
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on February 27, 2017, 03:01:48 PM
Also, remember what the NCAA calls SOS isn't really a "Strength of Schedule" - they have criteria that's based around OWP and OOWP.

What killed Denison was Washington & Jefferson, Case Western, Brooklyn, Mt. St. Vincent, and Otterbein all having horrible records. That's the breaks; had maybe 2-3 of those teams got to .500, then we may have a different story.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2017, 03:19:19 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on February 27, 2017, 02:33:58 PM
Thanks soooooooooo much for the reasons....

So why does Denison rank as high as 9th if we play nothing but
crap teams?  The ranking is only based on record alone?

So of those 21 at large bids they ALL played tougher schedules?

Go read thru the 'Great Lakes Region' thread and you might get a better understanding as to why Denison was left out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on February 27, 2017, 03:29:04 PM
Tough time to be a team in the Great Lakes Region ... only 1 at large bid for the whole 60 team region.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: goscots on February 27, 2017, 04:13:32 PM
Quote from: hotdawg on February 27, 2017, 03:29:04 PM
Tough time to be a team in the Great Lakes Region ... only 1 at large bid for the whole 60 team region.

....and had Hope won their tournament it might have been zero unless that next spot was going to go to OWU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on February 27, 2017, 04:17:39 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 27, 2017, 04:13:32 PM
Quote from: hotdawg on February 27, 2017, 03:29:04 PM
Tough time to be a team in the Great Lakes Region ... only 1 at large bid for the whole 60 team region.

....and had Hope won their tournament it might have been zero unless that next spot was going to go to OWU.

We got 4 last year so time might be relative.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on February 27, 2017, 04:31:53 PM
Quote from: sac on February 27, 2017, 04:17:39 PM
Quote from: goscots on February 27, 2017, 04:13:32 PM
Quote from: hotdawg on February 27, 2017, 03:29:04 PM
Tough time to be a team in the Great Lakes Region ... only 1 at large bid for the whole 60 team region.

....and had Hope won their tournament it might have been zero unless that next spot was going to go to OWU.

We got 4 last year so time might be relative.

Tough Time Year*
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 27, 2017, 04:44:04 PM
Quote from: Fifth and Putnam on February 27, 2017, 02:24:22 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on February 27, 2017, 02:16:09 PM
Can someone tell me how many at large bids that are?
I am having a real hard time trying to figure how Denison is not in....

They are ranked all season....last week at #14!!

And they take seven teams at 17-10!!!!

Are they ALL conference winners?????????

Denison's strength of schedule was their undoing. It wasn't just bad, it was really bad.

Denison's .478 SOS puts them off the left of this chart.  http://imgur.com/a/7TgdF
The lowest SOS of any at-large team was Endicott's .523, though in some years, teams around .500-.505 with good records have gotten an at-large.

At 25-2 or 24-3, they might have had a chance, with the soft bubble this year, but not at 22-5.  The NCAC was down this year, and Denison's non-conference schedule included only one team with a winning record.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: BigRedFan on February 28, 2017, 10:45:50 AM
Thanks everyone....

Just a real tough pill to swallow....

And I will always put the NCAC up against any conference!!

Best of luck to the Scots....do us proud.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndOne on February 28, 2017, 03:13:33 PM
Quote from: BigRedFan on February 27, 2017, 02:33:58 PM
Thanks soooooooooo much for the reasons....

So why does Denison rank as high as 9th if we play nothing but
crap teams?  The ranking is only based on record alone?

So of those 21 at large bids they ALL played tougher schedules?

BRF,

I know this probably won't ease the pain, but perhaps provide a little perspective.
Since 2009-10, Denison has won 7, 8, 14, 9, 12, 13, 17, and 22 games.
Since 2009-10, St. Norbert has won 23, 20, 16, 20, 25, 24, 25, and 19 games. Since 2012-13 their (Midwest) Conference record has been 15-3, 18-0, 18-0, 18-0, and 16-2 this year. They were ranked #4 in the pre-season poll. They win both their regular season conference title and conference tourney championship about every year. They consistently rank high in the D3Hoops poll. With their high number of wins every year, this is understandable-high win totals = a high ranking. However, they, in large part, chalk up those high win totals because they play in a very weak conference. And last year's second best team even transferred to another conference this season. Because of so many weak opponents, their strength of schedule (SoS, which the NCAA views as a major consideration, is low. However, they haven't had to worry about it because they win their conference tournament and get the conference automatic qualifier. But this season they didn't, and without that AQ, they are sitting home despite their fine record. The barrier to their inclusion in the national tournament--a low SoS. It unfortunately appears your team is home for the same reason. I see some of the teams that Denison beat had 4, 8, 7, 5, 3, 6, 7, 7, 11, and 11 wins which doesn't make for a high SoS. Absent of that, the key to a ticket to the Big Dance was to win the conference tourney. Had that been accomplished, you would be dancing on Friday.
Again, neither a very nice looking W/L record nor a high D3Hoops ranking, are guarantees of selection for the national tournament. 😟
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndOne on February 28, 2017, 05:28:51 PM
Quote from: WooClone15 on February 27, 2017, 02:50:06 PM
Quote from: woolax on February 27, 2017, 01:02:15 PM
Wooster takes on North Central (IL) in a pod that includes Westminister and Hanover as host. Thoughts?
I don't know too much about Illinois Central, but all I know is I wish they had been the hosts. I'm in Madison, Wisconsin now, so I could have gone watch Wooster play if that was the case.


WooClone,

Perhaps the reason you don't know too much about Illinois Central is because there is no such team. A little surprised you don't know that being only 2 hours away.  :o
However, there is a team traveling to Hanover College Friday named North Central.
The Cardinals bring a very pedestrian looking 17-10 record into their battle with Wooster. On the surface, it looks like a fairly easy time for Wooster, an annually good team. However, NCC is on a bit of a hot streak right now. Ranked #13 in the pre-season poll, and rising as high as #6 early in the year, many thought their season was down the tubes when they lost their probable best all around player, a D3Hoops pre-season All-American, for the season in their 7th game. Finishing up their non conference schedule and playing in the very competitive CCIW conference, they went 9-8 over their next 17 games. That brought them to their last conference game of the year at Illinois Wesleyan who is 91-15 at home since 2009-2010, including 11-2 this year. A loss in that game would have ended their season. However, their win in that game got them fourth place in the final conference standings, and the final spot in the conference tournament where they beat the conference champ on their home court Fri night, and the #3 seed Sat night to get the CCIW AQ.
North Central knows they will have to again be at the top of their game to add any more Ws this weekend. They may be a 17-10 team, but they aren't playing at that level. Win or lose you can bet they'll leave it all out on the court Fri (and Sat) night.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 28, 2017, 06:43:11 PM
AndOne, actually there IS an Illinois Central - it is a Community College just east of Peoria!  Since I haven't lived in Peoria for the last fifty years, I don't know whether or not they have athletic teams. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on February 28, 2017, 06:52:04 PM
Andone,

Sorry, my mistake; I meant North Central. And surprisingly, we don't hear too much about a d3 team from Illinois up in Madison.

I'm sure it will be a good game, and if they got in they must be pretty good, but I'm hopeful that Wooster take care of business this weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndOne on February 28, 2017, 07:17:03 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 28, 2017, 06:43:11 PM
AndOne, actually there IS an Illinois Central - it is a Community College just east of Peoria!  Since I haven't lived in Peoria for the last fifty years, I don't know whether or not they have athletic teams. ;)

Well, I ASSumed the discussion concerned the D3 scene.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndOne on February 28, 2017, 07:39:40 PM
Quote from: WooClone15 on February 28, 2017, 06:52:04 PM
Andone,

Sorry, my mistake; I meant North Central. And surprisingly, we don't hear too much about a d3 team from Illinois up in Madison.

I'm sure it will be a good game, and if they got in they must be pretty good, but I'm hopeful that Wooster take care of business this weekend.

Wooster has been one of D3's upper echelon teams for an extended period.

** Wooster fans might remember that former Wooster star Ian Franks was a graduate assistant at North Central during the 2011-2012 and 2012-2013 seasons. In 2012 the Cardinals were a Sweet Sixteen team, and in 2013 they advanced to the Final Four losing their semifinal game to eventual champ Amherst.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2017, 08:31:16 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 28, 2017, 06:43:11 PM
AndOne, actually there IS an Illinois Central - it is a Community College just east of Peoria!  Since I haven't lived in Peoria for the last fifty years, I don't know whether or not they have athletic teams. ;)

They have outstanding athletic teams, Chuck. ICC has won numerous NJCAA national championships in women's basketball, volleyball, and softball.

NCAC fans who root for the Cleveland Indians might also be interested in knowing that Jim Thome played baseball and basketball for Illinois Central College before he was drafted by the Tribe.

Quote from: WooClone15 on February 28, 2017, 06:52:04 PM
Andone,

Sorry, my mistake; I meant North Central. And surprisingly, we don't hear too much about a d3 team from Illinois up in Madison.

Well, then, you're not following local D3 sports, because the D3 school in Madison -- Edgewood College -- plays in a league that includes five Illinois-based institutions. And, as Mark pointed out, North Central was: a) the school where former Wooster star Ian Franks was an assistant coach; and b) a participant in the 2013 Final Four.

Quote from: AndOne on February 28, 2017, 05:28:51 PM
Quote from: WooClone15 on February 27, 2017, 02:50:06 PM
Quote from: woolax on February 27, 2017, 01:02:15 PM
Wooster takes on North Central (IL) in a pod that includes Westminister and Hanover as host. Thoughts?
I don't know too much about Illinois Central, but all I know is I wish they had been the hosts. I'm in Madison, Wisconsin now, so I could have gone watch Wooster play if that was the case.


WooClone,

Perhaps the reason you don't know too much about Illinois Central is because there is no such team. A little surprised you don't know that being only 2 hours away.  :o
However, there is a team traveling to Hanover College Friday named North Central.
The Cardinals bring a very pedestrian looking 17-10 record into their battle with Wooster. On the surface, it looks like a fairly easy time for Wooster, an annually good team. However, NCC is on a bit of a hot streak right now. Ranked #13 in the pre-season poll, and rising as high as #6 early in the year, many thought their season was down the tubes when they lost their probable best all around player, a D3Hoops pre-season All-American, for the season in their 7th game. Finishing up their non conference schedule and playing in the very competitive CCIW conference, they went 9-8 over their next 17 games. That brought them to their last conference game of the year at Illinois Wesleyan who is 91-15 at home since 2009-2010, including 11-2 this year. A loss in that game would have ended their season. However, their win in that game got them fourth place in the final conference standings, and the final spot in the conference tournament where they beat one of the three the conference co-champs on their home court Fri night, and the #3 seed Sat night to get the CCIW AQ.
North Central knows they will have to again be at the top of their game to add any more Ws this weekend. They may be a 17-10 team, but they aren't playing at that level. Win or lose you can bet they'll leave it all out on the court Fri (and Sat) night.  :)

FTFY, Mark. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndOne on February 28, 2017, 09:05:56 PM
Where they beat the #1 tourney seed Friday, and the #3 seed Saturday, thus becoming the first #4 seed to win the CCIW conference tournament since it's inception in 2006.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2017, 09:17:51 PM
And that's fine. But after waiting for 30 years for my alma mater to win a conference championship, I'm not going to allow it to be forgotten a week later. ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on February 28, 2017, 09:29:40 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on February 28, 2017, 08:31:16 PM

Well, then, you're not following local D3 sports, because the D3 school in Madison -- Edgewood College -- plays in a league that includes five Illinois-based institutions. And, as Mark pointed out, North Central was: a) the school where former Wooster star Ian Franks was an assistant coach; and b) a participant in the 2013 Final Four.
No, you're right, I don't really follow D-3 sports all that much outside of the NCAC. Plus, I didn't get to Wooster until the fall of 2011, and didn't really follow them at all before that, so Ian Franks doesn't mean much to me.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 28, 2017, 09:35:14 PM
Greg, thanks for the info on ICC, and especially on Jim Thome.  I didn't ever hear that he was an ICC player.  I've long admired him not only as a Peorian, but as one of the very few power hitters during the steroid era who (so far as I know) was NEVER even hinted as being a juicer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 02, 2017, 11:33:28 AM
Hanover pod

Offensive efficiency or Points per possession
Hanover         1.12
Westminster  1.06
Wooster         1.12
North Cent.   1.06

Wooster and Hanover right in-line with tournament avg.  North Central maybe struggle a little, Westminster's come from a conference full of teams that really can't stop anyone.


Deffensive efficiency
Hanover              .997
Westminster     1.01
Wooster              .987
North Central      .929

North Central might actually be one of the strongest defensive teams in the field, they certainly have not played a soft schedule.


Pace or possessions per game
Hanover          69.65
Westminster   69.7
Wooster         69.95
North Cent     65.95

I've got the d3 avg right around 73, so all of these teams are a little slower than avg with North Central playing the slowest.


Four Factors

eFG%          Off             Def
Hanover           57.8                48.4
Westminster     51.9               48.5
Wooster           54.1                47.2
North Central    49.9               48.9

Hanover can really score.


Rebounding
          %Off rebounds   Opp%Off rebounds

Hanover                31.5                24.1
Westminster         35.3               31.4
Wooster                36.6               28.4
North Central        35.3               25.8

Hanover and North Central are really good on the defensive glass, while everyone but Hanover is above avg on their own.



FT Rate
Hanover             39.8          27.0
Westminster      33.9         26.8
Wooster             34.4         36.3
North Central     33.1         36.5

Wooster/No. Central is a rare match-up between teams who put their opponents on the line a lot while also being pretty good at getting to the line.  Uh, expect a lot of FT's maybe.   Hanover must be near the top in the field at getting to the line


Turnover Rate or Turnover per possession
                      TO rate          Opp TO rate
Hanover                 18.28                17.62
Westminster          18.13                20.48
Wooster                17.9                  19.34
North Central        17.78                15.65

Westminster comes in with a positive turnover rate, but I fear some of that might be SLIAC related.  North Central is very negative and despite looking like a pretty good defensive team they don't create much in the way of turnovers but also play in a low turnover league in the CCIW.  Hanover is surprisingly slightly negative here too.



This pod is full of history problems for Hanvoer and Westminster.  The SLIAC has generally not done well in the tournament and I would probably dial back some of Westminster's good looking stats based on SLIAC competition.   Hanover has a lot of good looking numbers but history is not on their side.  The HCAC reps have failed to advance past the first weekend every year since Transylvania in 2006.  Of course, Transylvania beat Wooster that year to advance.  Also of note an HCAC school hosting a pod is pretty rare thing, hosting advantages can't be discounted so maybe this is the year.

I think this Hanover team is good, I saw them play at Hope last year and its basically the same group a year older.  But getting by Wooster and North Central seems like a tall order, if I were leaning any direction in this pod I might pick Wooster to advance but could just as easily see North Central moving on. 

Saturday's game should end up being pretty good.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 02, 2017, 01:19:32 PM
Quote from: sac on March 02, 2017, 11:33:28 AM
Hanover pod

Offensive efficiency or Points per possession
Hanover         1.12
Westminster  1.06
Wooster         1.12
North Cent.   1.06

Wooster and Hanover right in-line with tournament avg.  North Central maybe struggle a little, Westminster's come from a conference full of teams that really can't stop anyone.


Deffensive efficiency
Hanover              .997
Westminster     1.01
Wooster              .987
North Central      .929

North Central might actually be one of the strongest defensive teams in the field, they certainly have not played a soft schedule.


Pace or possessions per game
Hanover          69.65
Westminster   69.7
Wooster         69.95
North Cent     65.95

I've got the d3 avg right around 73, so all of these teams are a little slower than avg with North Central playing the slowest.


Four Factors

eFG%          Off             Def
Hanover           57.8                48.4
Westminster     51.9               48.5
Wooster           54.1                47.2
North Central    49.9               48.9

Hanover can really score.


Rebounding
          %Off rebounds   Opp%Off rebounds

Hanover                31.5                24.1
Westminster         35.3               31.4
Wooster                36.6               28.4
North Central        35.3               25.8

Hanover and North Central are really good on the defensive glass, while everyone but Hanover is above avg on their own.



FT Rate
Hanover             39.8          27.0
Westminster      33.9         26.8
Wooster             34.4         36.3
North Central     33.1         36.5

Wooster/No. Central is a rare match-up between teams who put their opponents on the line a lot while also being pretty good at getting to the line.  Uh, expect a lot of FT's maybe.   Hanover must be near the top in the field at getting to the line


Turnover Rate or Turnover per possession
                      TO rate          Opp TO rate
Hanover                 18.28                17.62
Westminster          18.13                20.48
Wooster                17.9                  19.34
North Central        17.78                15.65

Westminster comes in with a positive turnover rate, but I fear some of that might be SLIAC related.  North Central is very negative and despite looking like a pretty good defensive team they don't create much in the way of turnovers but also play in a low turnover league in the CCIW.  Hanover is surprisingly slightly negative here too.



This pod is full of history problems for Hanvoer and Westminster.  The SLIAC has generally not done well in the tournament and I would probably dial back some of Westminster's good looking stats based on SLIAC competition.   Hanover has a lot of good looking numbers but history is not on their side.  The HCAC reps have failed to advance past the first weekend every year since Transylvania in 2006.  Of course, Transylvania beat Wooster that year to advance.  Also of note an HCAC school hosting a pod is pretty rare thing, hosting advantages can't be discounted so maybe this is the year.

I think this Hanover team is good, I saw them play at Hope last year and its basically the same group a year older.  But getting by Wooster and North Central seems like a tall order, if I were leaning any direction in this pod I might pick Wooster to advance but could just as easily see North Central moving on. 

Saturday's game should end up being pretty good. 

Thanks for putting that together Sac! 

That year Transy advanced, they were the host site as well!  That said, Wooster's fans should be well represented though.  Last weekend at the NCAC championships at OWU, it looked as though at least 40% of the crowd were Wooster fans!  And that's counting a large student section of OWU students.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 02, 2017, 08:06:48 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 02, 2017, 01:19:32 PM
That year Transy advanced, they were the host site as well!  That said, Wooster's fans should be well represented though.  Last weekend at the NCAC championships at OWU, it looked as though at least 40% of the crowd were Wooster fans!  And that's counting a large student section of OWU students.

On Saturday, the Scot fans easily outnumbered the the OWU crowd, but that game was only a little over an hour away.  It's four or five hours' drive from Wooster to Hanover.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 02, 2017, 10:00:37 PM
Last year Wooster fans traveled fairly well to Washington DC for their first and second round games at Catholic and that distance was over 7 hrs. Hopefully a similar contingent will make its way to Hanover this coming weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 02, 2017, 10:42:35 PM
Quote from: woolax on March 02, 2017, 10:00:37 PM
Last year Wooster fans traveled fairly well to Washington DC for their first and second round games at Catholic and that distance was over 7 hrs. Hopefully a similar contingent will make its way to Hanover this coming weekend.

I love that you'd describe it as "fairly well."  There were a ton of Wooster folks there, maybe 150.  Lancaster Bible had a two hour trip and might've had 200.  I was duly impressed given the distance, although, from my conversations, the chance to tour DC was a big draw for many.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 03, 2017, 05:35:36 PM
I knew I needed Silverlight to watch the video.  I already have it. The website gives no option that I can find to watch the video if you already have it.  I tried installing it again, and it tells me, correctly, that I already have it.  But I see no way to watch the video.  God****ingdamn these DIII schools.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 03, 2017, 05:48:36 PM
This has really ticked me off.  I can't be that stupid to not be able to get to the video.  There is just no link on the video page to actually see the video.  Unbelievable.  All day I've been waiting to watch this.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on March 03, 2017, 06:08:46 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 03, 2017, 05:48:36 PM
This has really ticked me off.  I can't be that stupid to not be able to get to the video.  There is just no link on the video page to actually see the video.  Unbelievable.  All day I've been waiting to watch this.
I couldn't get it to work, so I've just been listening to it on the radio. Everything needs to improve in the second half. Our defense has not been great, and we couldn't hit anything early in the first half
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on March 03, 2017, 06:15:46 PM
Good job by Wooster fighting back to only make it a 2 point game going into half time
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on March 03, 2017, 06:41:02 PM
Quote from: WooClone15 on March 03, 2017, 06:15:46 PM
Good job by Wooster fighting back to only make it a 2 point game going into half time
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: zander on March 03, 2017, 06:42:34 PM
Quote from: WooClone15 on March 03, 2017, 06:15:46 PM
Good job by Wooster fighting back to only make it a 2 point game going into half time
try clicking on smart phone user. It worked for me on the desk top
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WooClone15 on March 03, 2017, 07:18:06 PM
Quote from: zander on March 03, 2017, 06:42:34 PM
Quote from: WooClone15 on March 03, 2017, 06:15:46 PM
Good job by Wooster fighting back to only make it a 2 point game going into half time
try clicking on smart phone user. It worked for me on the desk top
Thanks, I tried that but it still didn't work, so I just listened to it on the radio.

And crap, Wooster could just never get over the hump.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 03, 2017, 07:40:18 PM
Quote from: zander on March 03, 2017, 06:42:34 PM
Quote from: WooClone15 on March 03, 2017, 06:15:46 PM
Good job by Wooster fighting back to only make it a 2 point game going into half time
try clicking on smart phone user. It worked for me on the desk top

I had tried that earlier and it didn't work.  After seeing your post I tried it again and it did.  Thanks for the info, I got to see the last few minutes.

Appreciate it, though, Hanover, you incompetent slackers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 03, 2017, 08:24:59 PM
Wooster couldn't  overtake North Central, coming within one with eight minutes left, but North Central just seemed to make timely threes at every turn. Also while Fanelly had 23 pts, only two other starters even reached double figures, and as a team Wooster shot 4-18 for 22% from 3. Disappointing end to the season. Good news I guess is they return three of five starters, with Fanely and  Davis graduating.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 03, 2017, 08:54:14 PM
Davis and Fanelly are the only seniors.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndOne on March 04, 2017, 02:34:56 PM
Quote from: woolax on March 03, 2017, 08:24:59 PM
Wooster couldn't  overtake North Central, coming within one with eight minutes left, but North Central just seemed to make timely threes at every turn. Also while Fanelly had 23 pts, only two other starters even reached double figures, and as a team Wooster shot 4-18 for 22% from 3. Disappointing end to the season. Good news I guess is they return three of five starters, with Fanely and  Davis graduating.

Two of the major points of North Central's game plan were to harass Fanelly as much as possible, and to prevent dribble penetration and easy layup baskets. Worked pretty well as, while he did have 23 points, he committed NINE turnovers. In effect then, he gave many of those 23 points back in the form of lost possessions. Also, preventing the penetration forced Woo into all those outside shots on which they were successful only on a low percentage of their attempts.

While he doesn't have 800 wins, Cardinals coach Todd Raridon does have just short of 500. He is one of only two D3 coaches in the country who has taken two different teams to the Final Four. He has been around quite awhile, and usually has a few good tricks up his sleve.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 05, 2017, 07:58:43 AM
I felt like NC's first possession of the 2nd half set the tone for how this game finished.  NC had 4 offensive rebounds and it looked like Wooster's players were standing in cement as NC outhustled them to every one of those rebounds.  And then it culminated with a NC basket.  In the end, NC ended up with 14 offensive rebounds that led to 17 second chance points.  Credit to Wooster to keep it close, but you're not going to win many games when you're giving up that many offensive rebounds.   Oh and it didn't hurt that NC was 10-22 from deep compared to only 4-22 for the Scots. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndOne on March 06, 2017, 05:21:35 PM
I remember exactly the sequence you are referring to with regard to the multiple O rebounds and the ultimate putback. And yes, they certainly were hot from downtown that night. After beating the Woo guys Fri, expectations were very high against Hanover the next night, but the Cardinals forgot how to make layups which killed them.
After they lost their best all-around player, a pre-season All-American, for the season in only their 7th game, many thought they would have a hard time even finishing 4th in the highly competitive CCIW and qualifying for the conference tournament. However, several other guys stepped up and they collectively found a new identity and rallied late to get that 4th spot. Then, in the conference tourney they defeated the #1 and #3 seeds to get the AQ and go on to beat Woo. Truth is, they should have won Sat night too. With only losing one senior, NCC should have a strong presence next season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on March 06, 2017, 08:08:00 PM
Quote from: AndOne on March 06, 2017, 05:21:35 PM
I remember exactly the sequence you are referring to with regard to the multiple O rebounds and the ultimate putback. And yes, they certainly were hot from downtown that night. After beating the Woo guys Fri, expectations were very high against Hanover the next night, but the Cardinals forgot how to make layups which killed them.
After they lost their best all-around player, a pre-season All-American, for the season in only their 7th game, many thought they would have a hard time even finishing 4th in the highly competitive CCIW and qualifying for the conference tournament. However, several other guys stepped up and they collectively found a new identity and rallied late to get that 4th spot. Then, in the conference tourney they defeated the #1 and #3 seeds to get the AQ and go on to beat Woo. Truth is, they should have won Sat night too. With only losing one senior, NCC should have a strong presence next season.

Strong, yes, but the OTHER pre-season AA on the team is graduating.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: AndOne on March 06, 2017, 09:10:10 PM
Yes he is, but in 2018, NOT this year.
So next season, it looks like NCC having 2 All-Americans is a very real possibility.  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on March 07, 2017, 08:39:53 AM
Quote from: AndOne on March 06, 2017, 05:21:35 PM
I remember exactly the sequence you are referring to with regard to the multiple O rebounds and the ultimate putback. And yes, they certainly were hot from downtown that night. After beating the Woo guys Fri, expectations were very high against Hanover the next night, but the Cardinals forgot how to make layups which killed them.
After they lost their best all-around player, a pre-season All-American, for the season in only their 7th game, many thought they would have a hard time even finishing 4th in the highly competitive CCIW and qualifying for the conference tournament. However, several other guys stepped up and they collectively found a new identity and rallied late to get that 4th spot. Then, in the conference tourney they defeated the #1 and #3 seeds to get the AQ and go on to beat Woo. Truth is, they should have won Sat night too. With only losing one senior, NCC should have a strong presence next season.

To Say NC 'should' have won is a stretch. They did miss a ton of layups... many in transition when Hanover had at least one guy back playing smart defense and not fouling. NC (Henry especially) kept forcing up contested layups instead of pulling the ball out and working some offense when no advantage was to be had. NC looked to me like a team with a few very good players and not much depth - I think Hanover has the better team and wins that game more times than not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: nuscottsfan on March 12, 2017, 10:26:15 AM
hello all and to Scotts fans in particular. i haven't been on the boards since '12 but still follow the Scotts with my son. the reason i'm posting today is that i was wondering if anyone knows how to get a hold of/purchase game videos of Wooster Men's Basketball? in particular the 2011 National Semi Final game vs Williams? (preferably with sounds, etc.) i've googled and searched online and can't come up with anything so i thought i'd pick the brains of Wooster Nation
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Joe Wally on May 27, 2017, 04:13:50 PM
Parker Manges, a 6'3, 190lb, SG from Homestead High School in Fort Wayne, will be playing basketball for Wabash this winter.

https://www.hudl.com/profile/4880779/parker-manges (https://www.hudl.com/profile/4880779/parker-manges)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on May 27, 2017, 08:52:16 PM
Any insight as to the decision of Mitch Balser to transfer from Wooster to Wittenberg? Seems like a rare transfer decision. Wittenberg has a great recruiting class coming in so needless to say Balser will help Witt with some backcourt and point guard experience to offset some graduations.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on August 10, 2017, 07:59:23 PM
Wooster has posted (most of) their schedule for 2017-18.

The Scots again open with Oberlin as part of the Al Van Wie/Wooster Rotary Classic.
The teams for the Mose Hole tournament Dec 29-30 are not yet listed.
There will be the usual December trip, this year to Orlando for the Mauro Panaggio Tournament. They will play St Joseph's (ME) then Brockport or Whittier.
Other non-conference games are Medaille, at St John Fisher, and Hanover.

http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2017-18/schedule

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pops33 on August 17, 2017, 09:16:33 AM
Wooster is scrimmaging Ohio State on Sunday, November 5th, according to Ohio State's website.  http://www.ohiostatebuckeyes.com/sports/m-baskbl/sched/osu-m-baskbl-sched.html

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on October 14, 2017, 01:43:44 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on May 27, 2017, 08:52:16 PM
Any insight as to the decision of Mitch Balser to transfer from Wooster to Wittenberg? Seems like a rare transfer decision. Wittenberg has a great recruiting class coming in so needless to say Balser will help Witt with some backcourt and point guard experience to offset some graduations.

I have no idea why he left but I'm happy that he's gone.  One less Republican in Wayne County.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on October 19, 2017, 05:40:26 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on August 10, 2017, 07:59:23 PM
Wooster has posted (most of) their schedule for 2017-18.

The Scots again open with Oberlin as part of the Al Van Wie/Wooster Rotary Classic.
The teams for the Mose Hole tournament Dec 29-30 are not yet listed.
There will be the usual December trip, this year to Orlando for the Mauro Panaggio Tournament. They will play St Joseph's (ME) then Brockport or Whittier.
Other non-conference games are Medaille, at St John Fisher, and Hanover.

http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2017-18/schedule




The Scots will be playing WPI on Dec 29 as part of the Mose Hole/Wooster Kiwanis Classic. 
The Dec 30 game will be against either Alma or Emory & Henry.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on November 13, 2017, 07:18:01 PM
http://northcoast.org/sports/mbkb/2017-18/releases/coachespoll
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 13, 2017, 11:01:56 PM
Wabash 5th out of 10. Not bad - let's get a home game for the NCAC Tourney!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on November 17, 2017, 04:13:29 PM
Wittenberg beats Mount St Joseph 78 to 74 to start the Season. Nice win over MSJ who was picked 2nd in the HCAC coming off a 20 win season.

Big three from Mitch Balser when MSJ cut the lead to 2 late in the game. Welcome to Witt Mitch!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on November 17, 2017, 05:11:14 PM

Witt looked pretty good.  Having the foreign trip, I think, helped them be ready to go early.  Those sophomores are something - this will certainly be a team to watch moving forward, and maybe this year.  They get Birmingham Southern tomorrow, much, much bigger team - so we'll see how they respond.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on November 18, 2017, 10:02:23 PM
OWU beats Trine and Albion to start season 2-0.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 18, 2017, 11:54:01 PM
Wabash went 0-2, losing today to Webster in OT. Stachowski was injured, I heard, and played just 15 minutes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on November 25, 2017, 05:48:17 PM
Wooster with a nice victory over #4 Hanover 87-79.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on November 26, 2017, 06:45:12 AM
Scot's lack of size is concerning however when they shoot well, they'll be tough.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WoostAr on December 01, 2017, 09:38:11 PM
The glaring stat for me for Wooster to start the season: 

3 pt%: 30.2%

In their two losses: 16% and 16.7% respectively.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 04, 2017, 12:13:08 AM
Little Giants upset Wooster on the road! 85-72. Eberhard had 20, Hallstrom and Davidson with 17. Great job LGs!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 04, 2017, 09:27:10 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 04, 2017, 12:13:08 AM
Little Giants upset Wooster on the road! 85-72. Eberhard had 20, Hallstrom and Davidson with 17. Great job LGs!

I believe that was just Wabash's 4th win all time vs. Wooster at Timken.  Pretty heady stuff for that young group to go into that gym and get a win.  Would be nice to get back to back top 25 wins with OWU coming to C'ville on Wednesday! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on December 04, 2017, 12:01:18 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 04, 2017, 09:27:10 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 04, 2017, 12:13:08 AM
Little Giants upset Wooster on the road! 85-72. Eberhard had 20, Hallstrom and Davidson with 17. Great job LGs!

I believe that was just Wabash's 4th win all time vs. Wooster at Timken.  Pretty heady stuff for that young group to go into that gym and get a win.  Would be nice to get back to back top 25 wins with OWU coming to C'ville on Wednesday!

That win was without three key players due to injuries, too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 04, 2017, 12:08:21 PM
Quote from: smedindy on December 04, 2017, 12:01:18 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on December 04, 2017, 09:27:10 AM
Quote from: smedindy on December 04, 2017, 12:13:08 AM
Little Giants upset Wooster on the road! 85-72. Eberhard had 20, Hallstrom and Davidson with 17. Great job LGs!

I believe that was just Wabash's 4th win all time vs. Wooster at Timken.  Pretty heady stuff for that young group to go into that gym and get a win.  Would be nice to get back to back top 25 wins with OWU coming to C'ville on Wednesday!

That win was without three key players due to injuries, too.

Yeah, depth is going to be a thing at some point.  Wabash has 6 active guys right now getting 20+ minutes.  I don't know how sustainable that is, so hopefully guys get healthy and back into the rotation soon.  That Hiram/Allegheny road trip is coming soon and that's a tough weekend to be on a short rotation. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on December 05, 2017, 05:38:37 PM
OWU ranked 19 in latest d3 hoops poll.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on December 07, 2017, 10:42:39 AM
Pretty good game at Chadwick last night.  OWU got the first 8 points of the game and it took Wabash over 5 minutes to finally score.  Undeterred by the slow start, the LGs chipped away and took a lead with about 9:30 minutes to play.  The Bishops answered with a short run, Wabash answered back to tie the game at 72-72 with 4 minutes to play.  Then OWU's experience and poise down the stretch carried the day.  Nate Axelrod didn't have his best night, but he consistently made the shots OWU needed at the times they needed it.  He's just outstanding, as you would expect a 7-year league veteran to be.   :)

I was really impressed with the way Wabash rebounded (outrebounded OWU 48-32) and did so without a lot of fouling (just 13 personal fouls for the game).  This team really scraps on the glass, which is nothing new for Wabash, but this group seems to be a little cleaner about it.  There's also some really nice offensive talent  here.  FR Jack Davidson went over 20 again last night.  You can tell this young team is still developing offensive cohesion, which is only going to improve game by game..there's a lot of reasons for optimism when we get into 2018 and the last half of the season.  Brum's got some really good stuff cooking in C'ville. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on December 12, 2017, 05:22:35 PM
OWU up to 17 in the d3 hoops poll
http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2017-18/week3
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 13, 2017, 09:26:33 PM
Another example of how the Top 25 rankings can be misleading. Wittenberg is not ranked (yet), but most likely would be 1 or 2 in the regional rankings currently. Regardless, some tough matchups for Witt coming up with a home date vs Marietta an excellent test in the holiday tournament in a few weeks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on December 14, 2017, 07:13:18 AM
Quote from: pennstghs on December 13, 2017, 09:26:33 PM
Another example of how the Top 25 rankings can be misleading. Wittenberg is not ranked (yet), but most likely would be 1 or 2 in the regional rankings currently. Regardless, some tough matchups for Witt coming up with a home date vs Marietta an excellent test in the holiday tournament in a few weeks.
Witt is just outside the top 25. With Marietta listed, and if they win that game, they will easily get in.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on December 16, 2017, 08:14:52 PM
OWU wins against Kenyon, 82-60.
http://battlingbishops.com/news/2017/12/16/MBB_12162017.aspx
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on December 29, 2017, 12:41:11 PM
#14 ranked OWU defeats #6 Ramapo 98-69.
http://www.battlingbishops.com/news/2017/12/28/MBB_12282017.aspx

Bishops go up against #1 Whitman tonight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on December 31, 2017, 05:15:38 PM
Let's see if the predictions were correct - Witt should be welcomed to the Top 25 after their win last night vs Marietta!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on December 31, 2017, 10:26:40 PM
Owu lost to whittman 92-90.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on January 03, 2018, 10:58:51 AM
OWU moves up to 9 and witt debuts at 17.
http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/men/2017-18/week5
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on January 06, 2018, 04:29:17 PM
Nate Axelrod really - Is he a seventh year senior?  Seems like he's been there forever.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on January 06, 2018, 06:33:49 PM
Wooster takes down #9 OWU 73-70
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on January 08, 2018, 08:50:33 AM
Quote from: woolax on January 06, 2018, 06:33:49 PM
Wooster takes down #9 OWU 73-70

Didn't see that coming.  Woo led wire to wire as well.  The Scots have now won 7 in a row with the last 2 coming over 12-1 Emory & Henry who are tied for the ODAC lead and now OWU.  Wooster's last loss was at home to Wabash which dropped them to 1-2 in the NCAC.  They're now 4-2 and right back in the mix for the NCAC with the big road win at the Branch yesterday!

One of the keys for Woo's turnaround this season is the continued improved health of Alex Baptiste who has been put back in the starting lineup right at the end of 2017 portion of the schedule.  In Woo's last 2 games, Baptiste has been dominating on the boards with 20 rebounds vs. E&H and 11 more yesterday including 9 offensive rebounds!

Wooster's win sets up a showdown with undefeated Witt this Saturday at Timken!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 11, 2018, 06:00:35 PM
It is always an exciting and surprising point in the season. The midway point. We are already halfway through another thrilling Division III basketball season. The best part, we have plenty more basketball to come. The hard part, we are also closer to the season coming to a close.

On Thursday night's Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), Dave will try and pull out his crystal ball and read the tea leaves on who can sustain their momentum, who may fall off, and which teams could make a run to the end. While we won't have all the answers, some of Dave's guests will be able to give us their insight on their own squad's chances.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch the show LIVE starting at 7pm here: http://bit.ly/2D3pOrw.

A reminder the Thursday edition of Hoopsville primarily covers the East, Mid-Atlantic, Great Lakes, and West regions, but we will answer any questions about all of Division III throughout the show. You can also send your questions to the show and have them featured on the Hoopsville Mailbag segment. Email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com.

Guests include (in order of appearance):
- Matt Croci, No. 10 Wittenberg men's coach
- Jim Scheible, No. 7 Rochester women's coach
- Lori Kerans, Millikin women's coach (WBCA Center Court)
- Danny Young-Uhrich, No. 17 Juniata women's
- Pat McKenzie, No. 15 St. John's men's coach

You can also tune into the podcast(s) after the show has aired:
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Don't forget you can always interact with us:
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Title: #10 Wittenberg @ Wooster
Post by: woolax on January 13, 2018, 04:03:47 PM
What are peoples thoughts on this match up tonight? Do the Scots stand a chance?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on January 13, 2018, 07:27:02 PM
Jesus, Jon Hevlund, could you possibly be more biased in your broadcasting?  Absolutely embarrassing to the program, the college, and the industry.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: pennstghs on January 21, 2018, 05:41:45 PM
I was thinking that too while watching online, but thought well every team is biased. I was particularly annoyed by every single call that went against Wooster being a "terrible" call. The officiating was actually pretty great in this game.

The young Wittenberg guards are going to be a handful for the NCAC to deal with for the foreseeable future. Excellent balance on this team as you can't key in one on guy and they play the hot hand well. If Witt can stay out of the upset kingdom until the gauntlet final 3 games of @Hiram, @Ohio Wesleyan, vs Wooster then I think they have a Pool C bid locked up.

Looking forward to attending some home NCAC tourney games for the first time in a while in Springfield later this year!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 05, 2018, 01:05:11 PM
The big game is over, so now it's time to focus only on basketball. Division III basketball to be exact.

Join Dave and a number of guests on this special Monday edition of Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com). There is plenty to talk about including another crazy weekend of results that will have Top 25 voters scratching their heads and maybe pulling hair off their head as well. Plus, the first regional rankings come out later this week. While predictions are hard, there at least will be some reminding of how this all works.

And maybe even a preview of what this evening's Top 25s look like.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch the show starting at 2:00 p.m. ET here: http://bit.ly/2FOQ7hX

If you have questions, be sure to email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or interact with the show via the social media.

Guests include (in order of appearance):
- Marc Edwards, No. 2 WashU men's coach
- Chris Harvey, Salem State men's coach
- Bill Fenlon, DePauw men's coach (NABC Coach's Corner)
- Caitlin Hadzimichalis, King's women's coach
- Cameron Hill, Trinity (Texas), women's coach

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Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gordonmann on February 05, 2018, 11:30:41 PM
Hey look who's back in the Top 25:

http://d3hoops.com/top25/men/2017-18/week10
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 07, 2018, 05:45:04 PM
Men's first regional rankings this season: http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2018/02/men-regional-rankings-first
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 14, 2018, 02:04:30 PM
Week 2 Regional Rankings are out: http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2018/02/men-regional-rankings-second
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 14, 2018, 03:00:23 PM
Does Witt have the NCAC locked up even if Wooster wins out?  I can never remember how the tie breaker works?!

If Wooster wins out and OWU finds a way to beat Witt tonight, both would sit at 15-3 with a season split between the two teams.  Does the tiebreaker go by best win or worst loss.  If it's best wins then Woo would win having swept OWU.  If it's worst loss, then Witt would win with Woo's loss to Wabash...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 14, 2018, 03:11:53 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 14, 2018, 03:00:23 PM
Does Witt have the NCAC locked up even if Wooster wins out?  I can never remember how the tie breaker works?!

If Wooster wins out and OWU finds a way to beat Witt tonight, both would sit at 15-3 with a season split between the two teams.  Does the tiebreaker go by best win or worst loss.  If it's best wins then Woo would win having swept OWU.  If it's worst loss, then Witt would win with Woo's loss to Wabash...


I'm pretty sure its best win.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 14, 2018, 10:02:59 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 14, 2018, 03:13:44 PM

If Wooster wins tonight and Witt loses, then Saturday's game is for the top seed. 

<emerges from hibernation / lurking>

Kenyon 79
Wooster 81

Wittenberg 80
Ohio Wesleyan 85

:o :o :o

Saturday's for all the marbles!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 14, 2018, 11:03:26 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 14, 2018, 10:02:59 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 14, 2018, 03:13:44 PM

If Wooster wins tonight and Witt loses, then Saturday's game is for the top seed. 

<emerges from hibernation / lurking>

Kenyon 79
Wooster 81

Wittenberg 80
Ohio Wesleyan 85

:o :o :o

Saturday's for all the marbles!

Wooster's victory tonight gives them 20+ wins again!  I believe that is the 22nd season in a row.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 15, 2018, 12:45:57 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 14, 2018, 11:03:26 PM
Wooster's victory tonight gives them 20+ wins again!  I believe that is the 22nd season in a row.

That is correct.  Wooster is tied with Duke for the 2nd longest streak of 20 win seasons.  Kansas leads the way with 29 straight such seasons...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 17, 2018, 09:25:11 PM
To whomever was working the camera and online scoreboard during the Wooster-Wittenberg game, you are just another lazy incompetent bum that failed to do this simple job.  Unbelievable.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 17, 2018, 09:40:50 PM
And then they lose the video at the very end of the game so we miss the final choke by Wooster?  Holy ****, Wittenberg. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Valley on February 18, 2018, 10:54:02 AM
Here's an update: you lost.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 18, 2018, 05:38:47 PM
The final week of the 2017-18 season is upon us. In a week's time, the topic will be who has punched their tickets to the NCAA tournaments and who is hoping to get selected. This week... we don't know many of the answers and some questions have yet to be considered.

url=http://www.d3hoopsville.com]Hoopsville[/url] returns to the air LIVE this Sunday night with a jam-packed, and super-sized, edition. Dave welcomes guests from around the country and looks at a lot of the conference tournaments which are getting underway. Can some of the top teams take advantage of home-court advantage? Who may surprise? Who do some NOT want to see lose if they hope to make the tournament themselves?

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch the show LIVE starting at 7:00 p.m. ET here: http://bit.ly/2EyN7G9

If you have questions, be sure to email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or interact with the show via the social media avenues located to the right.

Guests include (in order of appearance):
- Tom Glynn, Nichols men's coach
- Anne Crutchfield, Emory & Henry women's coach
- Kevin Broderick, Nazareth men's coach
- Zach Otto-Fisher, UW-Superior interim women's coach
- Jon Prevo, No. 24 Rose-Hulman women's coach
- Brendan Gulick, Baldwin Wallace broadcaster (Great Lakes recap)
- Ryan Scott, "Top 25 Double-take"

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Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 21, 2018, 03:44:30 AM
Where's Reece Dupler?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on February 21, 2018, 08:17:21 AM
The Wooster broadcast said he has an injured ankle. It was suggested on Last night's call that he would probably be able to play on Friday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 21, 2018, 08:22:26 AM
Missed the broadcast.  Thanks
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 21, 2018, 09:50:52 AM
Quote from: hotdawg on February 21, 2018, 08:17:21 AM
The Wooster broadcast said he has an injured ankle. It was suggested on the Last night's call that he would probably be able to play on Friday.

Dupler injured the ankle early in the second half against Kenyon last week (right after scoring his 1,000th career point for the Scots) and didn't play against Wittenberg on Saturday, either.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 21, 2018, 02:44:42 PM
The NCAA men's basketball regional advisory committees released their third set of rankings, and as expected, the Atlantic Region was among those getting shuffled. Here's the full list: http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2018/02/men-regional-rankings-third

(https://www.d3boards.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fcdnak1.psbin.com%2Fimg%2Fmw%3D600%2Fmh%3D600%2Fcr%3Dn%2Fd%3D4ima3%2Fdinflo07zg1qa2ww.jpg&hash=686d8e036c15a7019bc8f4723e2af35008adc158)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 24, 2018, 10:05:13 AM
OWU beats Wooster in OT.
http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2017-18/releases/20180223yw192r
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 24, 2018, 10:52:19 AM
 - Wooster had made 9-straight NCAC tournament finals, and yesterday's loss was only its 4th ever in the NCAC semis (25-4).

- Per the NCAC conference website, despite 26 combined NCAC finals appearances between the two teams (Witt 16, OWU 10), tonight will be just the second time they've played each other for the crown, with the other one coming a generation ago in 1990. Wittenberg won that game 86-62 on a neutral court at Denison.

- OWU has now played in 3 of the past 6 NCAC title games. OWU's first back-to-back appearances since the 2007-08 finals.

- Witt has lost the last three NCAC finals they've played (2014, 2011, 2010; all to Wooster). Amazingly, the Tiger's last tournament title was in 2006.

- NCAC will crown a different tournament champion for the 4th year in a row: DePauw (2015), Denison (2016), Wooster (2017), and Witt/OWU (2018). I believe this is the longest such streak of different winners in conference history.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 25, 2018, 08:01:31 AM

I tweeted this and mentioned it in the recap, but I think it's worth repeating.  Nate Axlerod went over 2,000 points and 650 assists in the game yesterday.  We don't have a searchable database, but I don't believe anyone who's had 650 assists has ever had 2,000 points before.  It's a truly remarkable accomplishment.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on February 25, 2018, 09:54:11 AM
Yup, Nate is a reason I am disappointed, that OWU's season is probably over. I was hoping him and the other seniors, would get one more trip to the post season. They had some really good wins this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 26, 2018, 11:53:34 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 25, 2018, 08:01:31 AM

I tweeted this and mentioned it in the recap, but I think it's worth repeating.  Nate Axlerod went over 2,000 points and 650 assists in the game yesterday.  We don't have a searchable database, but I don't believe anyone who's had 650 assists has ever had 2,000 points before.  It's a truly remarkable accomplishment.

Well, it's easy to amass those stats when you've been playing for 10 years...  I kiiiiid, I kiiiiid!!!  :P

Seriously, it only seems like Axlreod has been there 10 years because he's been so good for them over his 4 years at OWU.  Sad he doesn't get to continue his career at least a week or two more by OWU not making the tournament...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on February 26, 2018, 01:34:19 PM
Wooster in John Carroll Pod with Wooster playing Illinois Wesleyan and Thomas More playing John Carroll in first round match ups. Who is coming out of this pod?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 26, 2018, 02:29:07 PM
Quote from: woolax on February 26, 2018, 01:34:19 PM
Wooster in John Carroll Pod with Wooster playing Illinois Wesleyan and Thomas More playing John Carroll in first round match ups. Who is coming out of this pod?

Well, I'm certainly hoping it is my Titans ;), but I suspect it is either Wooster or JCU, with a very slight edge to JCU due to home court.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2018, 03:14:16 PM
I haven't seen JCU play in many years.  Do they still make hockey line changes while committing 200 fouls/game and getting called for only 25?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on February 26, 2018, 03:25:00 PM
Quote from: Mr. Ypsi on February 26, 2018, 02:29:07 PM
Quote from: woolax on February 26, 2018, 01:34:19 PM
Wooster in John Carroll Pod with Wooster playing Illinois Wesleyan and Thomas More playing John Carroll in first round match ups. Who is coming out of this pod?

Well, I'm certainly hoping it is my Titans ;), but I suspect it is either Wooster or JCU, with a very slight edge to JCU due to home court.

JCU is talented, no doubt, having gone 6-1 against the top of the league.  However, they are very susceptible to an upset.  Of their 5 losses, one was to a non-conference NCAA tournament (but no overly impressive) team Hope but the 3 of the other 4 losses were to the bottom half of the OAC (losses to Muskingum, Capital and Mount Union).   I agree with your assessment.  Wooster is probably just as likely to come out of the pod but JCU is unbeaten at home.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on February 26, 2018, 03:31:30 PM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2018, 03:14:16 PM
I haven't seen JCU play in many years.  Do they still make hockey line changes while committing 200 fouls/game and getting called for only 25?


In short, yes. JCU still plays 10-12 players per game and does sub five for five many times throughout the game after x number of possessions.  That said, this season  Pete Moran was hired as JCU head coach, taking the place of his father, Mike Moran.  Mike developed the system in the early to mid 2000s.  While Pete is utilizing it, he does sub out one-for-one WAY more often than his dad did and seems to mix up the "units" a lot more than his dad did.  He also calls occasional time outs which was really rare for Mike (unless you count "rolling timeouts" which are called simply to get subs into the game . . .he used those frequently).

JCU "out-fouled" its opponents 569-501 this past season or an average of about 20 fouls to 18 fouls per game.  They are aggressive but the OAC is aggressive.  It will be interesting to see how the game is called with neutral officials and a high level non-league opponent on the court.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2018, 03:40:12 PM
The combined tournament resumes for Wooster and Illinois Wesleyan must be among the most substantial for any possible tournament pairing in terms of appearances, games, overall wins/record, etc.

Across all those games, though, the Scots and Titans have only mixed it up in March twice before, both times in the Sectional Semifinals (Sweet 16) at Wooster.

In 2012, a Titans team that entered the tournament at <checks notes, gulps> 19-7, got the best of the Scots in a 69-67 victory, denying a possible Wooster-Wittenberg Sectional Final.* IWU proceeded to blow out Wittenberg 70-49 the next night to claim a spot in the 2012 Final Four.

In 2004, host Wooster beat IWU 58-53 in the Sectional Semifinals in a pod that also included JCU - a very similar make-up to this year's pod. In the Sectional Final, JCU beat a Wooster team trying to make its second-consecutive Final Four run by a tally of 70-64.

*Notably, Wooster and Wittenberg have never played one another in the NCAA tournament, despite several bracket opportunities over the years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on February 26, 2018, 04:09:56 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2018, 03:40:12 PM
In 2004, host Wooster beat IWU 58-53 in the Sectional Semifinals in a pod that also included JCU - a very similar make-up to this year's pod. In the Sectional Final, JCU beat a Wooster team trying to make its second-consecutive Final Four run by a tally of 70-64.

Fun game . . . first, last and only Final Four for the Blue Streaks.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2018, 01:56:48 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2018, 03:40:12 PM
The combined tournament resumes for Wooster and Illinois Wesleyan must be among the most substantial for any possible tournament pairing in terms of appearances, games, overall wins/record, etc.

Across all those games, though, the Scots and Titans have only mixed it up in March twice before, both times in the Sectional Semifinals (Sweet 16) at Wooster.

In 2012, a Titans team that entered the tournament at <checks notes, gulps> 19-7, got the best of the Scots in a 69-67 victory, denying a possible Wooster-Wittenberg Sectional Final.* IWU proceeded to blow out Wittenberg 70-49 the next night to claim a spot in the 2012 Final Four.

In 2004, host Wooster beat IWU 58-53 in the Sectional Semifinals in a pod that also included JCU - a very similar make-up to this year's pod. In the Sectional Final, JCU beat a Wooster team trying to make its second-consecutive Final Four run by a tally of 70-64.

*Notably, Wooster and Wittenberg have never played one another in the NCAA tournament, despite several bracket opportunities over the years.

Great stats KB!

I, for one, will be pulling for a Wooster-JCU rematch.  Wooster is only 2-3 vs. JCU in the tournament, but both of their wins were en route to Wooster reaching the Final 4!!!  Maybe history can repeat itself this year!!!  8-)

Couple of things to add, Wooster is making their NCAA Division III record 16th straight NCAA Tournament appearance!  That is the 6th longest streak all time behind Kansas, Duke, MSU, Gonzaga and Wisconsin (whose streak will end at 18 straight this year btw).  Wooster is also 3rd in overall D3 Tournament appearances with 27 only trailing Wittenberg and Scranton with 28 each!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 02:15:25 PM
Wooster-Illinois Wesleyan at 5:30 p.m
John Carroll-Thomas More at 7:30 p.m. (or 30 minutes after the conclusion of the first game).

Interestingly enough, John Carroll will not have advanced ticket sales but the other three schools will have advanced ticket sales.  From the JCUsports.com website: "John Carroll will sell tickets the day of the game beginning at 4:00 p.m." So, Wooster will fill the gym for the first game and JCU fans will struggle to find seats for the second game - great home court advantage!! ::)

Championship is Saturday at 7:00 p.m.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 27, 2018, 02:20:31 PM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 02:15:25 PM
Wooster-Illinois Wesleyan at 5:30 p.m
John Carroll-Thomas More at 7:30 p.m. (or 30 minutes after the conclusion of the first game).

Interestingly enough, John Carroll will not have advanced ticket sales but the other three schools will have advanced ticket sales.  From the JCUsports.com website: "John Carroll will sell tickets the day of the game beginning at 4:00 p.m." So, Wooster will fill the gym for the first game and JCU fans will struggle to find seats for the second game - great home court advantage!! ::)

Championship is Saturday at 7:00 p.m.

Not quite... each school is allotted a certain amount of tickets. Wooster will get X amount, JCU will actually probably get close to twice that amount since they are the home team. Wooster won't be able to take tickets JCU has allotted and thus keep JCU fans from getting into the game.

The only restriction is that JCU won't be able to sell all of the tickets for just their fans.. but Wooster or any other team won't be able to sell out the building.

Also - each school's fans will have a specific section to sit in as well. They can't just sit anywhere usually.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 02:24:50 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 27, 2018, 02:20:31 PM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 02:15:25 PM
Wooster-Illinois Wesleyan at 5:30 p.m
John Carroll-Thomas More at 7:30 p.m. (or 30 minutes after the conclusion of the first game).

Interestingly enough, John Carroll will not have advanced ticket sales but the other three schools will have advanced ticket sales.  From the JCUsports.com website: "John Carroll will sell tickets the day of the game beginning at 4:00 p.m." So, Wooster will fill the gym for the first game and JCU fans will struggle to find seats for the second game - great home court advantage!! ::)

Championship is Saturday at 7:00 p.m.

Not quite... each school is allotted a certain amount of tickets. Wooster will get X amount, JCU will actually probably get close to twice that amount since they are the home team. Wooster won't be able to take tickets JCU has allotted and thus keep JCU fans from getting into the game.

The only restriction is that JCU won't be able to sell all of the tickets for just their fans.. but Wooster or any other team won't be able to sell out the building.

Also - each school's fans will have a specific section to sit in as well. They can't just sit anywhere usually.

So, let me make sure I am clear . . . each of the other three schools gets about 17% of the tickets and JCU gets 50% of the tickets.  Then they take that 17% of the tickets and have an assigned area for each school.  So, if JCU chooses, they can keep the first game attendance to just 1/3 of the gym's capacity and not sell any more tickets?  How will they know where someone is from?  I would think the logistics of keeping Wooster people from buying tickets would be nearly impossible.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 27, 2018, 02:49:58 PM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 02:24:50 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 27, 2018, 02:20:31 PM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 02:15:25 PM
Wooster-Illinois Wesleyan at 5:30 p.m
John Carroll-Thomas More at 7:30 p.m. (or 30 minutes after the conclusion of the first game).

Interestingly enough, John Carroll will not have advanced ticket sales but the other three schools will have advanced ticket sales.  From the JCUsports.com website: "John Carroll will sell tickets the day of the game beginning at 4:00 p.m." So, Wooster will fill the gym for the first game and JCU fans will struggle to find seats for the second game - great home court advantage!! ::)

Championship is Saturday at 7:00 p.m.

Not quite... each school is allotted a certain amount of tickets. Wooster will get X amount, JCU will actually probably get close to twice that amount since they are the home team. Wooster won't be able to take tickets JCU has allotted and thus keep JCU fans from getting into the game.

The only restriction is that JCU won't be able to sell all of the tickets for just their fans.. but Wooster or any other team won't be able to sell out the building.

Also - each school's fans will have a specific section to sit in as well. They can't just sit anywhere usually.

So, let me make sure I am clear . . . each of the other three schools gets about 17% of the tickets and JCU gets 50% of the tickets.  Then they take that 17% of the tickets and have an assigned area for each school.  So, if JCU chooses, they can keep the first game attendance to just 1/3 of the gym's capacity and not sell any more tickets?  How will they know where someone is from?  I would think the logistics of keeping Wooster people from buying tickets would be nearly impossible.

To some degree you have it. I am not sure if the percentages are right. I honestly don't know the specifics on percentages, though I have been under the impression the home team gets a few more seats. But it could be 40-20-20-20 for what I know.

As for Wooster buying more tickets... basically as I understand it, Wooster fans buy from their school. THe only way they can buy more is from general sale tickets (i.e. the tickets each school didn't purchase and returned) at walk-up time. That still won't allow them from purchasing JCU's tickets unless JCU decides to release their unsold tickets for general sale.

As for sitting... there are signs posted as to where fans are to sit. I have been to many an event at many a location (including JCU on several occasions) where fans who clearly weren't in that group were asked to move ... or chose to since they were surrounded by another fan group.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2018, 03:01:05 PM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 02:24:50 PM
I would think the logistics of keeping Wooster people from buying tickets would be nearly impossible.

Unless JCU sells out their allotment, is there is nothing to keep Wooster fans from showing up and purchasing tickets at the gate on game-day? 

Wooster fans travel very well and I would expect a large contingent of Wooster fans there on Friday considering many COW alums are already in the Cleveland area and it's also an easy trek from Wooster.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 27, 2018, 03:03:32 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2018, 03:01:05 PM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 02:24:50 PM
I would think the logistics of keeping Wooster people from buying tickets would be nearly impossible.

Unless JCU sells out their allotment, is there is nothing to keep Wooster fans from showing up and purchasing tickets at the gate on game-day? 

Wooster fans travel very well and I would expect a large contingent of Wooster fans there on Friday considering many COW alums are already in the Cleveland area and it's also an easy trek from Wooster.

If there are tickets available. If each school sells it allotment out... there wouldn't be any tickets available. Have the rules coming in another post.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 27, 2018, 03:08:26 PM
Ticket Distribution (Preliminary-Round Sites Only).
In addition, the committee recommends that hosts refrain from selling tickets until after the mandatory conference call for hosts the Monday prior to the start of each round of competition.

Four-Team Sites.
   a. During first round, the host will receive 50% of the facility seating capacity and the remaing 50% shall be divided equally amongst the other three teams. During second round, the home team will receive two-thirds (2/3) of the facility seating capacity. The visiting institution is guaranteed a minimum of one-third (1/3) of the facility seating capacity.
   b. Each section should have its own clearly identifiable tickets (separate color than home supporter or walk-up tickets) in suitable locations. Seating locations for the competing teams should be equally distributed by number and location.
   c. The visiting institution must notify the host institution in writing (via e-mail) of any of its ticket allotment it has not sold by the following dates/times:
      • First/Second-round Friday contests: Thursday, noon local time of the host;
      • First/Second-round Saturday contests: Friday, noon local time of the host;
      • Sectional-round Friday contests: Thursday, noon local time of the host;
      • Sectional-round Saturday contests: Friday, noon local time of the host.

NOTE: If the host is not notified by the visiting team by the prescribed times, the visiting team shall be financially accountable for its total ticket allotment. Experience has proven that it is best not to allow students of the host team immediately behind an opponent's bench. Hosts shall provide a buffer zone between such students and the opponent, either with adults or fans of the visiting team.

The host institution shall make available to each winning teams their ticket allotment after the completion of each institution's contest. Winning teams may distribute their tickets or allow the host institution to distribute the tickets. If the host is to distribute the tickets, they may set the distribution schedule.

All Session, Single Session Sales.
Tickets shall be for all sessions for a single day, unless the men's basketball committee approves a plan for split session tickets.

Seating. A special seating section shall be reserved for members of the competing teams when they are not playing. The location of all team tickets and seating for bands and cheerleaders must be approved by the committee representative. Seating for media representatives must be designated and away from the scorer's table.

In order to avoid potential conflicts, the men's basketball committee recommends that hosts designate distinct seating sections within the playing facility for the following groups: a) home supporters; b) visiting supporters and c) walk-up general admission.

Home Supporters Section.
• Shall not be behind the visiting team bench.
• Should be available to advance ticket customers.
• Should have a distinct ticket (different from visitor supporters and walk-up sections) for admittance.
• Can be reserved seating or general admission seating within the section.

Visiting Supporters Section(s).
• Should be directly behind the visiting team bench(es).
• Should have a distinct ticket (different from that for home supporters and walk-up sections) for admittance.
• Can be reserved seating or general admission seating within the section.

Walk-up General Admission Section.
• Should have a distinct ticket (different from home/visitor supporters sections).
• Should be available to supporters from all institutions.
• Should have visible security personnel in the area.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 03:21:08 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 27, 2018, 02:49:58 PM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 02:24:50 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 27, 2018, 02:20:31 PM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 02:15:25 PM
Wooster-Illinois Wesleyan at 5:30 p.m
John Carroll-Thomas More at 7:30 p.m. (or 30 minutes after the conclusion of the first game).

Interestingly enough, John Carroll will not have advanced ticket sales but the other three schools will have advanced ticket sales.  From the JCUsports.com website: "John Carroll will sell tickets the day of the game beginning at 4:00 p.m." So, Wooster will fill the gym for the first game and JCU fans will struggle to find seats for the second game - great home court advantage!! ::)

Championship is Saturday at 7:00 p.m.

Not quite... each school is allotted a certain amount of tickets. Wooster will get X amount, JCU will actually probably get close to twice that amount since they are the home team. Wooster won't be able to take tickets JCU has allotted and thus keep JCU fans from getting into the game.

The only restriction is that JCU won't be able to sell all of the tickets for just their fans.. but Wooster or any other team won't be able to sell out the building.

Also - each school's fans will have a specific section to sit in as well. They can't just sit anywhere usually.

So, let me make sure I am clear . . . each of the other three schools gets about 17% of the tickets and JCU gets 50% of the tickets.  Then they take that 17% of the tickets and have an assigned area for each school.  So, if JCU chooses, they can keep the first game attendance to just 1/3 of the gym's capacity and not sell any more tickets?  How will they know where someone is from?  I would think the logistics of keeping Wooster people from buying tickets would be nearly impossible.

To some degree you have it. I am not sure if the percentages are right. I honestly don't know the specifics on percentages, though I have been under the impression the home team gets a few more seats. But it could be 40-20-20-20 for what I know.

As for Wooster buying more tickets... basically as I understand it, Wooster fans buy from their school. THe only way they can buy more is from general sale tickets (i.e. the tickets each school didn't purchase and returned) at walk-up time. That still won't allow them from purchasing JCU's tickets unless JCU decides to release their unsold tickets for general sale.

As for sitting... there are signs posted as to where fans are to sit. I have been to many an event at many a location (including JCU on several occasions) where fans who clearly weren't in that group were asked to move ... or chose to since they were surrounded by another fan group.

Thanks, Dave.  Unfortunately, on its website, JCU is indicating that they are not selling pre-sale tickets to their people.  Everything will be on sale at 4:00 on the day of the game.  In short, John Carroll's entire allotment will be part of the "general sales tickets." Maybe they are taking care of parents and season ticketholders ahead of time but no pre-sale for the public.  I do not think, with that plan in place, they can control who buys the tickets.

The only upside I can think of is that they plan to release a number of tickets after the first game when some of the fans of Woo and IWU clear out.  So instead of selling 1600 seats ahead of time, they will sell 1800-2000 seats to account for the additional capacity once the (I assume many) Wooster fans and handful of IWU fans clear out.  Just speculation on my part - I have no idea.  I just do not understand not selling pre-sale tickets but they must have a good reason/rationale.

Should be a fun atmosphere, regardless.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 27, 2018, 03:22:33 PM
I suspect JCU has a plan in place. Lot of times you need a student ID or proof of JCU ties... but you are welcome to ask them, honestly.

I don't know how Spring Break plays a roll (did the two times I've been at JCU), but that could have been a reason for their decisions as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 03:23:08 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2018, 03:01:05 PM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 02:24:50 PM
I would think the logistics of keeping Wooster people from buying tickets would be nearly impossible.

Unless JCU sells out their allotment, is there is nothing to keep Wooster fans from showing up and purchasing tickets at the gate on game-day? 

Wooster fans travel very well and I would expect a large contingent of Wooster fans there on Friday considering many COW alums are already in the Cleveland area and it's also an easy trek from Wooster.

JCU will not sell out their allotment because it appears they are not selling tickets at all. Wooster should be able to pack the place unless JCU starts discriminating against Wayne County residents and people wearing black and gold.  :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 03:24:54 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 27, 2018, 03:22:33 PM
I suspect JCU has a plan in place. Lot of times you need a student ID or proof of JCU ties... but you are welcome to ask them, honestly.

I don't know how Spring Break plays a roll (did the two times I've been at JCU), but that could have been a reason for their decisions as well.

Maybe I will call up and see what I can find out.  I am afraid I do not have anything to prove my ties to JCU.  I assume I could bring my diploma but that seems cumbersome. ;D

UPDATE:  JCU is not answering the phone.  Wooster told me they are not selling pre-sale (I assume they will dispatch of their 250 by taking care of parents and some of their season ticket holders without public sale).  TMC and IWU have no ticket information on their websites yet and I did not call.

As for Spring Break, it starts Friday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 27, 2018, 05:31:35 PM
My guess for Wooster would be they will easily use up their allotment on parents and also for their Downtown Rebounders Club which is basically their Boosters. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on February 27, 2018, 06:31:12 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2018, 05:31:35 PM
My guess for Wooster would be they will easily use up their allotment on parents and also for their Downtown Rebounders Club which is basically their Boosters.

That sounds right — take care of those groups and no one can complain. But 250 isn't enough, I assume, to take care of all their season ticket holders. Every time I've been to Timken Gymnasium, it appeared to be well attended with regulars.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 28, 2018, 03:30:10 PM
Wooster's website says nothing about pre-game day ticket sales.  Only that tickets go on sale at JCU at 4 on Friday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 28, 2018, 04:13:49 PM

A lot of teams just hold tickets for players and staff, maybe students if they're doing a bus/ticket/hotel deal, but often just give most of the allotment back for general distribution.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on February 28, 2018, 05:18:17 PM
The last time I traveled for a tournament game was back in the '08-'09 season when Wooster played at Cap.  We went to both nights and purchased tickets at the Cap gate.  I do remember for the Wooster-Cap game in the 2nd round it seemed close to capacity but the crowd was nearly a 50-50 split for Wooster and Cap fans.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: iwumichigander on February 28, 2018, 07:55:44 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 28, 2018, 03:30:10 PM
Wooster's website says nothing about pre-game day ticket sales.  Only that tickets go on sale at JCU at 4 on Friday.
The info I got today was tickets will be sold at the door starting at 4:00 pm.  No tickets sold at the schools.  The consensus among the schools was selling tickets in this manor would cause no problems.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Fifth and Putnam on February 28, 2018, 07:58:23 PM
Quote from: iwumichigander on February 28, 2018, 07:55:44 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 28, 2018, 03:30:10 PM
Wooster's website says nothing about pre-game day ticket sales.  Only that tickets go on sale at JCU at 4 on Friday.
The info I got today was tickets will be sold at the door starting at 4:00 pm.  No tickets sold at the schools.  The consensus among the schools was selling tickets in this manor would cause no problems.

???
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on March 01, 2018, 08:28:06 AM
Quote from: Fifth and Putnam on February 28, 2018, 07:58:23 PM
Quote from: iwumichigander on February 28, 2018, 07:55:44 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 28, 2018, 03:30:10 PM
Wooster's website says nothing about pre-game day ticket sales.  Only that tickets go on sale at JCU at 4 on Friday.
The info I got today was tickets will be sold at the door starting at 4:00 pm.  No tickets sold at the schools.  The consensus among the schools was selling tickets in this manor would cause no problems.

???
Thus ensuring a large Wooster contingent  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 01, 2018, 09:11:20 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on March 01, 2018, 08:28:06 AM
Quote from: Fifth and Putnam on February 28, 2018, 07:58:23 PM
Quote from: iwumichigander on February 28, 2018, 07:55:44 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 28, 2018, 03:30:10 PM
Wooster's website says nothing about pre-game day ticket sales.  Only that tickets go on sale at JCU at 4 on Friday.
The info I got today was tickets will be sold at the door starting at 4:00 pm.  No tickets sold at the schools.  The consensus among the schools was selling tickets in this manor would cause no problems.

???
Thus ensuring a large Wooster contingent  ;)

It might just be that they asked the schools to estimate attendance and it didn't rise to capacity in total.  When Wooster was in DC a few years ago, they might've brought 150 or so - even if they quadruple that for a closer game, it might not be too large for the site to manage.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 09:16:52 AM
Quote from: iwumichigander on February 28, 2018, 07:55:44 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 28, 2018, 03:30:10 PM
Wooster's website says nothing about pre-game day ticket sales.  Only that tickets go on sale at JCU at 4 on Friday.
The info I got today was tickets will be sold at the door starting at 4:00 pm.  No tickets sold at the schools.  The consensus among the schools was selling tickets in this manor would cause no problems.

Now I am really confused . . . I assumed that Wooster said they were not selling them because all of the tickets were "spoken for" through their parents and key boosters.  If they got 275 tickets (their allotment), I assumed they would use them all.  I also assumed that IWU and TMC would not so they would have tickets available to the public.  I guess that is not the case. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 01, 2018, 09:30:41 AM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 09:16:52 AM
Quote from: iwumichigander on February 28, 2018, 07:55:44 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 28, 2018, 03:30:10 PM
Wooster's website says nothing about pre-game day ticket sales.  Only that tickets go on sale at JCU at 4 on Friday.
The info I got today was tickets will be sold at the door starting at 4:00 pm.  No tickets sold at the schools.  The consensus among the schools was selling tickets in this manor would cause no problems.

Now I am really confused . . . I assumed that Wooster said they were not selling them because all of the tickets were "spoken for" through their parents and key boosters.  If they got 275 tickets (their allotment), I assumed they would use them all.  I also assumed that IWU and TMC would not so they would have tickets available to the public.  I guess that is not the case.

This is what I was trying to say - schools often just keep enough of the allotment to satisfy their VIPs and give the rest back to avoid the hassle of selling to the public themselves.  The host school has to deal with people complaining about the process and they can pass the buck.  Not saying that's what's happening here, just that it's a pretty common way of dealing with the process.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 09:33:24 AM
Quote from: iwumichigander on February 28, 2018, 07:55:44 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 28, 2018, 03:30:10 PM
Wooster's website says nothing about pre-game day ticket sales.  Only that tickets go on sale at JCU at 4 on Friday.
The info I got today was tickets will be sold at the door starting at 4:00 pm.  No tickets sold at the schools.  The consensus among the schools was selling tickets in this manor would cause no problems.

I don't think it causes a single issue for three of the teams which are part of this doubleheader -- Wooster, IWU and TMC.  In fact, it works to the great advantage of Wooster. Instead of having a pre-sale doubleheader sell-out (or clearing the gym) in which 275 Wooster fans would be there, Wooster fans will be able to line up at 4:00 . . in fact, all the way up until l their tip-off and easily buys seats in the gym. I would think they will have 500 fans, at least, with the only limiting factor that it is a Friday late afternoon game (people have jobs).

The fan base this works against is John Carroll.  Instead of having 900 JCU fans with tickets in hand and being able to resell tickets as the Wooster-IWU game clears out and, inevitably shows pockets of seats available which can be resold, they run the risk of the gym being overtaken by Wooster fans before JCU fans even leave their houses.  This is not a guarantee and the Wooster fold may not travel that well but if they do, you are going to have a lot of angry Carroll fans.

Remember Wooster and Carroll are both annually in the top 20 in attendance in the country. Carroll is had a capacity crowd on Saturday night and is averaging about 1050 over the past 8 home games.  Wooster is only one hour away.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 09:37:36 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 01, 2018, 09:11:20 AM
Quote from: bufordscot on March 01, 2018, 08:28:06 AM
Quote from: Fifth and Putnam on February 28, 2018, 07:58:23 PM
Quote from: iwumichigander on February 28, 2018, 07:55:44 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 28, 2018, 03:30:10 PM
Wooster's website says nothing about pre-game day ticket sales.  Only that tickets go on sale at JCU at 4 on Friday.
The info I got today was tickets will be sold at the door starting at 4:00 pm.  No tickets sold at the schools.  The consensus among the schools was selling tickets in this manor would cause no problems.

???
Thus ensuring a large Wooster contingent  ;)

It might just be that they asked the schools to estimate attendance and it didn't rise to capacity in total.  When Wooster was in DC a few years ago, they might've brought 150 or so - even if they quadruple that for a closer game, it might not be too large for the site to manage.

I hope you are right Ryan.  But remember DC is a long trip - you're committing to meals, a hotel, 14 hours in a car.  Wooster to JCU involves a commitment to drive back and forth from your home where you can be having a late dinner at 8:30 or so if you want.  I think Wooster fans will be numerable at JCU tomorrow night.

But, I will stand corrected if Wooster only brings 600 fans.  If that is the case, they will have 600 and I estimate TMC and IWU will only have 250 combined.  That is 850.  That leave 900 or so tickets for JCU fans which is just about the 50% of capacity JCU is allow to reserve for themselves.  In short, it would be a wash.  If Wooster exceeds that number, however, that is when you have started to disadvantage your own fans and I would hate to see that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 09:42:45 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 01, 2018, 09:30:41 AM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 09:16:52 AM
Quote from: iwumichigander on February 28, 2018, 07:55:44 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on February 28, 2018, 03:30:10 PM
Wooster's website says nothing about pre-game day ticket sales.  Only that tickets go on sale at JCU at 4 on Friday.
The info I got today was tickets will be sold at the door starting at 4:00 pm.  No tickets sold at the schools.  The consensus among the schools was selling tickets in this manor would cause no problems.

Now I am really confused . . . I assumed that Wooster said they were not selling them because all of the tickets were "spoken for" through their parents and key boosters.  If they got 275 tickets (their allotment), I assumed they would use them all.  I also assumed that IWU and TMC would not so they would have tickets available to the public.  I guess that is not the case.

This is what I was trying to say - schools often just keep enough of the allotment to satisfy their VIPs and give the rest back to avoid the hassle of selling to the public themselves.  The host school has to deal with people complaining about the process and they can pass the buck.  Not saying that's what's happening here, just that it's a pretty common way of dealing with the process.

My apologies.  I misunderstood you.  It really comes down to whether or not the three other schools (and Wooster would be the main factor due to the proximity and fan base) bring in excess of 50% of the fans and use up in excess of 50% of the available tickets.  If that happens, JCU has made a strategic error and diminished their environment/home court as well as alienated its core fans by potentially denying them access to the gym tomorrow night.  If that does not happen, all is well and it is no different than any other NCAA game where you have to give half the capacity to the other schools whether you can sell it out or not.

Wooster is the wild card here.  Frankly, there are not many Division III colleges in the country where you have to worry about them "travelling well."  However, Wooster is one of them.  Take this pod and put it at Wooster with its 3500 seats and it is not a problem as JCU would bring more than the other two but there would be NO chance they would be bring 500+.

Time will tell.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Fifth and Putnam on March 01, 2018, 09:57:34 AM
Wooster has come to Marietta in years past for tournament pods. It always amazes me the support they receive from their fan base and it shows in the amount of people who travel to follow Scots basketball. They have to be Top 5 in the country (Hope is another school where large hordes of fans will travel large distances because they live and breath Hope basketball) in terms of fan engagement. Wooster will bring plenty of fans to JCU Friday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 01, 2018, 10:12:33 AM

Yeah, it might be a wash.  Is JCU on spring break this week?  I know a lot of schools are and it's making ticket issues less problematic for hosts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 10:50:05 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 01, 2018, 10:12:33 AM

Yeah, it might be a wash.  Is JCU on spring break this week?  I know a lot of schools are and it's making ticket issues less problematic for hosts.

School is in session this week but Spring Break begins after final classes on Friday.  It will definitely impact student attendance but, traditionally (previous hosting years), not enough to notice or enough to not feel "packed."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 11:03:04 AM
Quote from: Fifth and Putnam on March 01, 2018, 09:57:34 AM
Wooster has come to Marietta in years past for tournament pods. It always amazes me the support they receive from their fan base and it shows in the amount of people who travel to follow Scots basketball. They have to be Top 5 in the country (Hope is another school where large hordes of fans will travel large distances because they live and breath Hope basketball) in terms of fan engagement. Wooster will bring plenty of fans to JCU Friday.

I tend to agree with you, F&P.  It is enviable how well they travel.  I have never had the opportunity to witness Hope's fan base in person but I will trust what you (and others) are telling me. 

The only time(s) I ever felt like Carroll was travelling well was just over to the west side.  We played Capital in an OAC Championship at BW (BW lost in the semifinals and the top seeded hosted the semis and the finals at that time) in 2003, I think, and it was pretty much a capacity crowd and very pro-JCU.  Maybe you could throw in our Elite Eight game at Wooster in 2004 but, while we had a good amount of fans, we were at Wooster and it was very partisan in favor of the Scots. . . as you would expect. Even then, again, it was just a 60-90 minute trek for most Carroll fans.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 01, 2018, 11:49:13 AM
Wooster travels very well, but I don't think that JCU will have an issue with their fans being turned away.  Last year's average attendance in Timken was 1150 (5th in D-III), the lowest in recent memory, as compared to 1500-2000 (usually 2nd to Hope) a few years back.  Some of that difference has to do with more post-season NCAC & NCAA games being on the road, but my sense is also that the Scots don't draw as wide a segment of the local community as was once the case.  This year's home game against Witt (on a Saturday) drew "only" 2427 and the OWU game (senior day) had 1752, both of which are relatively modest numbers by Wooster's standards for big games. 

That being said, the Rebounders club includes many retirees, so they will have no issue arriving for a 5:30 tip-off out of town.  I think that 500 Scot fans tomorrow night is a believable number, maybe more on Saturday night if Wooster advances.  However, if JCU's facility seats 2500, that should leave plenty of seats for everyone who wants to attend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 11:52:09 AM
Unfortunately, JCU only seats about 1750.

Wooster's fan based is likely mirroring the decline of high school followings in northeast Ohio.  That is, the older fans are passing away and there is no one there to replace them.  The reasons are many but the results are the same - falling attendance. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 11:55:49 AM
Some links to articles about the game:

http://www.news-herald.com/sports/20180228/john-carroll-men-rolling-ready-to-host-ncaa-division-iii-tournament

http://www.cleveland.com/sports/college/index.ssf/2018/02/john_carroll_basketball_and_ma.html#incart_river_index

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on March 01, 2018, 11:58:43 AM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 11:52:09 AM
Unfortunately, JCU only seats about 1750.

Ok, perhaps the listed capacity includes putting chairs on the floor (for speakers, graduation, etc.)
https://www.jcusports.com/sports/2007/11/28/Facilities%20at%20John%20Carroll.aspx (https://www.jcusports.com/sports/2007/11/28/Facilities%20at%20John%20Carroll.aspx)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ScotsFan on March 01, 2018, 12:07:44 PM
FWIW, IWU is also one of the top programs in terms of fan followings.  I'd put them right up there with Hope and Wooster.  They were well represented each time they came to Wooster.  I wouldn't be surprised to see 200+ making the trek from Illinois...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 02:04:06 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 01, 2018, 11:58:43 AM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 11:52:09 AM
Unfortunately, JCU only seats about 1750.

Ok, perhaps the listed capacity includes putting chairs on the floor (for speakers, graduation, etc.)
https://www.jcusports.com/sports/2007/11/28/Facilities%20at%20John%20Carroll.aspx (https://www.jcusports.com/sports/2007/11/28/Facilities%20at%20John%20Carroll.aspx)

That could be capacity with floor seating but that is likely just a carry over number from the old set-up of the gym.  It used to seat 2500+ with bleacher seating upstairs and downstairs.  In fact, I think the floor bleachers went all the way to the balcony level and you actually entered them from the top.  They renovated in 2004 or so, reducing capacity, replacing bleachers (new ones included aisles and railings and more leg room), putting chair backs in the lower level and adding the student section behind the basket. Regardless of where the 2500 comes from, I can tell you that JCU's gym feels full at about the 1300 number and is packed at 1700. They can stand another 50-100 (on the steps going from the upstairs to the lower level) if they want but that is about it.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 02:07:08 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 01, 2018, 12:07:44 PM
FWIW, IWU is also one of the top programs in terms of fan followings.  I'd put them right up there with Hope and Wooster.  They were well represented each time they came to Wooster.  I wouldn't be surprised to see 200+ making the trek from Illinois...

Correct.  They ranked 9th nationally in Division III attendance in 2017 (Wooster ranked 5th and JCU was 19th).  I thought the geographic distance would put them at a more reasonable number but if you are right that will further complicate things.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 01, 2018, 02:13:07 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 01, 2018, 12:07:44 PM
FWIW, IWU is also one of the top programs in terms of fan followings.  I'd put them right up there with Hope and Wooster.  They were well represented each time they came to Wooster.  I wouldn't be surprised to see 200+ making the trek from Illinois...

Illinois Wesleyan's attendance figures have been in decline in recent years, probably for the same reasons that Wooster's has. IWU still travels better than any other program in the CCIW, but a huge chunk of that traveling contingent consists of elderly fans. The negative is that they're not being replaced as they die off, a la Wooster. The positive is that they have no commitments that constitute an impediment to their traveling a long distance this weekend for basketball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: iwumichigander on March 01, 2018, 02:49:33 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 01, 2018, 02:13:07 PM
Quote from: ScotsFan on March 01, 2018, 12:07:44 PM
FWIW, IWU is also one of the top programs in terms of fan followings.  I'd put them right up there with Hope and Wooster.  They were well represented each time they came to Wooster.  I wouldn't be surprised to see 200+ making the trek from Illinois...

Illinois Wesleyan's attendance figures have been in decline in recent years, probably for the same reasons that Wooster's has. IWU still travels better than any other program in the CCIW, but a huge chunk of that traveling contingent consists of elderly fans. The negative is that they're not being replaced as they die off, a la Wooster. The positive is that they have no commitments that constitute an impediment to their traveling a long distance this weekend for basketball.
Right and add the aforementioned "double headers" - with IWU for example,  hosting the women's tournament pod I can assure you many IWU fans will stay in Bloomington.  With a win Friday, some are considering driving over for a Saturday contest.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 03:48:01 PM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 02:04:06 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on March 01, 2018, 11:58:43 AM
Quote from: Onward on, John Carroll on March 01, 2018, 11:52:09 AM
Unfortunately, JCU only seats about 1750.

Ok, perhaps the listed capacity includes putting chairs on the floor (for speakers, graduation, etc.)
https://www.jcusports.com/sports/2007/11/28/Facilities%20at%20John%20Carroll.aspx (https://www.jcusports.com/sports/2007/11/28/Facilities%20at%20John%20Carroll.aspx)

That could be capacity with floor seating but that is likely just a carry over number from the old set-up of the gym.  It used to seat 2500+ with bleacher seating upstairs and downstairs.  In fact, I think the floor bleachers went all the way to the balcony level and you actually entered them from the top.  They renovated in 2004 or so, reducing capacity, replacing bleachers (new ones included aisles and railings and more leg room), putting chair backs in the lower level and adding the student section behind the basket. Regardless of where the 2500 comes from, I can tell you that JCU's gym feels full at about the 1300 number and is packed at 1700. They can stand another 50-100 (on the steps going from the upstairs to the lower level) if they want but that is about it.

Found the updated capacity number - 1354 - in the JCU Athletics Visitors Guide:
http://jcusports.com/documents/2017/8/11//JCU_Visitor_Guide_updated_AUGUST_10_2017.pdf?id=1674
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Flying Dutch Fan on March 01, 2018, 04:40:18 PM
There is something to be said for the home fans being there before the 5:30 game as well - getting their tickets and seats.  It always bothers me that people will show up 20 minutes before their game and expect to 1) get in easily, and 2) sit in their seats.  The school and team have done what they can do to secure a home game, time for the fans to step up and ensure that full advantage is taken of the opportunity. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 01, 2018, 08:06:30 PM
Quote from: Flying Dutch Fan on March 01, 2018, 04:40:18 PM
There is something to be said for the home fans being there before the 5:30 game as well - getting their tickets and seats.  It always bothers me that people will show up 20 minutes before their game and expect to 1) get in easily, and 2) sit in their seats. The school and team have done what they can do to secure a home game, time for the fans to step up and ensure that full advantage is taken of the opportunity.

You're still saving me a seat though right?  :-\ :-[
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 01, 2018, 08:28:36 PM
BTW - something else I've seen a lot is when buying tickets they ask who they are fans for to make sure they go into particular sections.

I honestly think you guys are putting more into this than it needs. I bet there will be tickets available and I really don't see Wooster selling the place out.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 02, 2018, 12:10:50 AM
Quote from: ScotsFan on February 27, 2018, 01:56:48 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 26, 2018, 03:40:12 PM
The combined tournament resumes for Wooster and Illinois Wesleyan must be among the most substantial for any possible tournament pairing in terms of appearances, games, overall wins/record, etc.

Across all those games, though, the Scots and Titans have only mixed it up in March twice before, both times in the Sectional Semifinals (Sweet 16) at Wooster.

In 2012, a Titans team that entered the tournament at <checks notes, gulps> 19-7, got the best of the Scots in a 69-67 victory, denying a possible Wooster-Wittenberg Sectional Final.* IWU proceeded to blow out Wittenberg 70-49 the next night to claim a spot in the 2012 Final Four.

In 2004, host Wooster beat IWU 58-53 in the Sectional Semifinals in a pod that also included JCU - a very similar make-up to this year's pod. In the Sectional Final, JCU beat a Wooster team trying to make its second-consecutive Final Four run by a tally of 70-64.

*Notably, Wooster and Wittenberg have never played one another in the NCAA tournament, despite several bracket opportunities over the years.

Great stats KB!

I, for one, will be pulling for a Wooster-JCU rematch.  Wooster is only 2-3 vs. JCU in the tournament, but both of their wins were en route to Wooster reaching the Final 4!!!  Maybe history can repeat itself this year!!!  8-)

Couple of things to add, Wooster is making their NCAA Division III record 16th straight NCAA Tournament appearance!  That is the 6th longest streak all time behind Kansas, Duke, MSU, Gonzaga and Wisconsin (whose streak will end at 18 straight this year btw).  Wooster is also 3rd in overall D3 Tournament appearances with 27 only trailing Wittenberg and Scranton with 28 each!

For what it's worth, I re-looked at Wooster's tourney history. With those five meetings, John Carroll is Wooster's most frequent tournament opponent. With the game tomorrow, IWU will join Ohio Northern as the only other teams Wooster has faced more than twice in NCAA play.

You see lots of different teams in March: Wooster has played 45 different teams across 61 NCAA tournament games.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on March 02, 2018, 09:20:28 AM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 01, 2018, 08:28:36 PM
BTW - something else I've seen a lot is when buying tickets they ask who they are fans for to make sure they go into particular sections.

I honestly think you guys are putting more into this than it needs. I bet there will be tickets available and I really don't see Wooster selling the place out.

I don't think Wooster will sell the place out, either.  But I do think that a strong Wooster crowd could leave some JCU fans out and think that it will be a real cluster%&*$ during the period of time toward the end of the Woo game/start of the JCU game. I would have cleared the gym the minute they assigned Wooster to JCU to protect the home court advantage, take care of as many fans of mine as possible and make for a more pleasant experience for everyone - my opinion.

All that said, I sure hope you are right, Dave.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on March 02, 2018, 11:14:46 AM
Cleveland Plain Dealer:  Great article on JCU coach Pete Moran and his first season at the helm at JCU after taking over for his father, the legendary Mike Moran, who had been head coach for 25 years:
http://www.cleveland.com/pluto/index.ssf/2018/03/john_carroll_basketball_is_the.html

Wooster's Daily Record:

http://www.the-daily-record.com/sports/20180301/div-iii-national-tournament-capsules

http://www.the-daily-record.com/sports/20180226/wooster-scots-men-earn-bid-extend-streak

From Bloomington's (Illinois) The Pantagraph:

http://www.pantagraph.com/sports/college/basketball/men/reborn-wesleyan-draws-wooster-in-ncaa-first-round/article_348852bf-efa3-5540-a998-b643b5fd5835.html

http://www.pantagraph.com/sports/college/basketball/men/bonnett-pushes-health-issues-aside-to-excel-for-iwu/article_b7f2122b-2e56-51e9-bbc2-97ad32a670d6.html

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 02, 2018, 07:43:59 PM
Wooster 72
Illinois Wesleyan 68

Brady Rose is really, really good. But despite his best efforts (game leading 31 pts), the Scots played a poised and complete game tonight to hold off Rose's Titans and earn a solid NCAA tournament victory.

I thought Wooster's depth and balance (5 players with 9+ points) helped them to keep having options throughout the game as compared to IWU that got 53 of 68 points from Rose (31), Bonnett (11), and O'Neill (11).



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: woolax on March 03, 2018, 08:01:08 PM
John Carrol doing a good job throwing Williams off his game, as Wooster down 33-40 at the half too John Carroll.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 03, 2018, 11:56:28 PM
Wooster 85
John Carroll 91

UW-Oshkosh 68
Wittenberg 60

And just like that, the NCAC's run in the 2018 NCAA Tournament is over. I suspect the Scots are disappointed, and have to wonder what might have happened if they had a better NCAC tournament showing that would've allowed them to host JCU in their own gym. For Wittenberg, a stellar season comes to an abrupt, shocking and surely exceptionally disappointing end.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mike Rejniak on March 12, 2018, 11:27:51 AM
​Dear D3 Faithful ;D,
     I have read many of your posts throughout the years and even met some of you in person, but for those who I haven't met, let me introduce myself: my name is Michael Rejniak and I have spent over 14 years coaching Division 3 basketball and love what our division has done and continues to do for  the sport of basketball. One of the greatest things about Division 3 basketball is the brotherhood that we all have with one another (coaches and players alike). My wish is to showcase the talents of D3 on a national stage in The Basketball Tournament (TBT).  You may have heard me speak about this on the Hoopsville Marathon with Dave McHugh of D3hoops.com (at the 6:11 mark). The TBT is a national tournament that is televised in July/August on ESPN after the NBA season is over. My goal is to put forth an all-star D3 team (current players are ineligible) and have them compete in this tournament to take on Former D1 / semi-pro's to prove that D3 deserves the same respect as other NCAA divisions. The team is mostly complete with former student-athletes from all over the country competing. Once the roster is complete we will be sure to release it through d3hoops. Former Babson College National Champion Matthew Droney '17 will also be assisting me on this journey.

How YOU can help our former elite D3 basketball players

While the end prize of this tournament is a monetary prize, being a D3-lifer, the goal is not the money (we all know that's not why we get into coaching), the goal is to bring an end to the stigma of Division 3 basketball, an awareness of how talented our student-athletes are and that we can compete (and win) against the best. We do need to raise funds for an entry fee, travel, meal and housing expenses for the athletes. In order to do this, we are conducting a crowd-funding campaign through GoFundMe to help make this a reality. These athletes need your support! Just think -- if every Division 3 school donated just $10, we will have raised over $4,000!!!! The link to the GoFundMe Page is below and please SPREAD THE WORD and email me with any questions/concerns at WeAreD3TBT@gmail.com. Thank you in advance for your support and Dave and I look forward to this "D3 Dream Team" taking the court this summer.-Mike Rejniak

Support "We Are D3" In The TBT
https://www.gofundme.com/WeAreD3TBT (https://www.gofundme.com/WeAreD3TBT)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on March 18, 2018, 11:53:53 AM
Axelrod wins Jostens
https://youtu.be/f03L8R8jAyU
True D3 player...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 19, 2018, 06:23:37 PM
Quote from: Bishopleftiesdad on March 18, 2018, 11:53:53 AM
Axelrod wins Jostens
https://youtu.be/f03L8R8jAyU
True D3 player...

And D3hoops.com Player of the Year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 19, 2018, 06:42:02 PM
Saw a woman today who had a Wooster cell phone case.  I asked, "Did you go to Wooster?" She looked at me incredulous and said, "You know where that is?"

I said, "they've got a very good basketball team," which already elicited another strange look.  I half wish I would've answered my original thought, which was, "Yes, and I also know a whole bunch of schools within 499 miles of Wooster, too."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 20, 2018, 11:34:28 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 19, 2018, 06:42:02 PM
Saw a woman today who had a Wooster cell phone case.  I asked, "Did you go to Wooster?" She looked at me incredulous and said, "You know where that is?"

I said, "they've got a very good basketball team," which already elicited another strange look.  I half wish I would've answered my original thought, which was, "Yes, and I also know a whole bunch of schools within 499 miles of Wooster, too."

Done this a few times... stopped myself many more times... never know how it comes across to others, "are you a stalker of some weird kind?" LOL
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on March 20, 2018, 12:13:44 PM
I have to restrain myself in the company of others when I spot a D3 window sticker or license plate on cars.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on March 20, 2018, 12:47:16 PM
Quote from: sac on March 20, 2018, 12:13:44 PM
I have to restrain myself in the company of others when I spot a D3 window sticker or license plate on cars.
My wife has gotten used to it. She sees me pull out my phone and take a picture of a strange cae, she usually realizes it is probably an obscure D3 for our area.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 20, 2018, 02:13:07 PM
Whenever I meet somebody new and find out that he or she attended a D3 school, I typically startle them by blurting out the school's location, sports nickname and colors, and, if it's relevant, the sport or sports in which the school does well. It's always fun to watch their reaction to this.

My favorite incident in this vein happened several years ago, when I happened to be in a bar that was showing an Illinois basketball game. The guy who was sitting next to me attempted to make small talk by asking me if I was an Illini fan. I responded:

"Nah, I don't really have a favorite D1 team. I went to a D3 school."

"Really? I did, too."

"Which one?"

"A school back east you've never heard of."

"Humor me. What's your alma mater?"

"Franklin & Marshall."

"You went to Eff And Em? That's where Glenn Robinson coaches. The man's a legend. He's been there forever, and he's taken the Diplomats to five D3 Final Fours. They've just never been able to win the big one."

I got a big kick out of seeing the guy's jaw drop to the floor. I got an even bigger kick out the fact that he later bought me a beer for knowing his school's nickname and basketball history.  ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 20, 2018, 02:33:22 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 19, 2018, 06:42:02 PM
Saw a woman today who had a Wooster cell phone case.  I asked, "Did you go to Wooster?" She looked at me incredulous and said, "You know where that is?"

I said, "they've got a very good basketball team," which already elicited another strange look.  I half wish I would've answered my original thought, which was, "Yes, and I also know a whole bunch of schools within 499 miles of Wooster, too."

I would have asked about the marching band's show at football games, too!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 20, 2018, 03:34:06 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 20, 2018, 02:13:07 PM
Whenever I meet somebody new and find out that he or she attended a D3 school, I typically startle them by blurting out the school's location, sports nickname and colors, and, if it's relevant, the sport or sports in which the school does well. It's always fun to watch their reaction to this.

My favorite incident in this vein happened several years ago, when I happened to be in a bar that was showing an Illinois basketball game. The guy who was sitting next to me attempted to make small talk by asking me if I was an Illini fan. I responded:

"Nah, I don't really have a favorite D1 team. I went to a D3 school."

"Really? I did, too."

"Which one?"

"A school back east you've never heard of."

"Humor me. What's your alma mater?"

"Franklin & Marshall."

"You went to Eff And Em? That's where Glenn Robinson coaches. The man's a legend. He's been there forever, and he's taken the Diplomats to five D3 Final Fours. They've just never been able to win the big one."

I got a big kick out of seeing the guy's jaw drop to the floor. I got an even bigger kick out the fact that he later bought me a beer for knowing his school's nickname and basketball history.  ;)

Done something similar... just unfortunate when I happened to run into someone who ... doesn't know about the athletics at their school.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 20, 2018, 04:13:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 20, 2018, 02:33:22 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 19, 2018, 06:42:02 PM
Saw a woman today who had a Wooster cell phone case.  I asked, "Did you go to Wooster?" She looked at me incredulous and said, "You know where that is?"

I said, "they've got a very good basketball team," which already elicited another strange look.  I half wish I would've answered my original thought, which was, "Yes, and I also know a whole bunch of schools within 499 miles of Wooster, too."

I would have asked about the marching band's show at football games, too!

The problem is, I don't know which schools have football and which ones don't.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Smitty Oom on March 21, 2018, 11:43:08 AM
Quote from: Bishopleftiesdad on March 20, 2018, 12:47:16 PM
Quote from: sac on March 20, 2018, 12:13:44 PM
I have to restrain myself in the company of others when I spot a D3 window sticker or license plate on cars.
My wife has gotten used to it. She sees me pull out my phone and take a picture of a strange cae, she usually realizes it is probably an obscure D3 for our area.

Yup I do the very same! In fact this weekend I was in Colorado this past weekend with my girlfriend and on our way from Denver to Colorado Springs we saw a Dension and WashU window sticker, which I was very giddy about. We walked around Colorado College for about 45 minutes. What a beautiful campus at the foot of the rocky mountains, and it seems to be a wonderful school as well. We then went to Rocky Mountain National Park the next day where we saw a Wheaton window sticker and a Tufts Swimming and Diving sweatshirt. I should have asked her about the Jumbo swim team looking back on it.

Luckily my girlfriend is a fellow d3 basketball alumnus and has some interest in seeing the different D3 memorabilia. She knows the big hitters, like Tufts and WashU so that was fun she is able to recognize those, instead of me just geeking out by myself!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 21, 2018, 11:50:25 AM
Quote from: Smitty Oom on March 21, 2018, 11:43:08 AM

Luckily my girlfriend is a fellow d3 basketball alumnus and has some interest in seeing the different D3 memorabilia. She knows the big hitters, like Tufts and WashU so that was fun she is able to recognize those, instead of me just geeking out by myself!

My wife isn't a D3 alumnus (really, the only draw back LOL)... but she has no choice. This year was the first year she ever experienced me being home the second weekend of March! LOL

She does help with the memorabilia, though. More stuff to add to the mix/wall in the off season!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 21, 2018, 11:50:43 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 20, 2018, 04:13:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 20, 2018, 02:33:22 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 19, 2018, 06:42:02 PM
Saw a woman today who had a Wooster cell phone case.  I asked, "Did you go to Wooster?" She looked at me incredulous and said, "You know where that is?"

I said, "they've got a very good basketball team," which already elicited another strange look.  I half wish I would've answered my original thought, which was, "Yes, and I also know a whole bunch of schools within 499 miles of Wooster, too."

I would have asked about the marching band's show at football games, too!

The problem is, I don't know which schools have football and which ones don't.

Psst...another part of the Pat Coleman empire deals with football   ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 21, 2018, 11:52:15 AM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 21, 2018, 11:50:25 AM
Quote from: Smitty Oom on March 21, 2018, 11:43:08 AM

Luckily my girlfriend is a fellow d3 basketball alumnus and has some interest in seeing the different D3 memorabilia. She knows the big hitters, like Tufts and WashU so that was fun she is able to recognize those, instead of me just geeking out by myself!

My wife isn't a D3 alumnus (really, the only draw back LOL)... but she has no choice. This year was the first year she ever experienced me being home the second weekend of March! LOL

She does help with the memorabilia, though. More stuff to add to the mix/wall in the off season!

My wife did undergrad at Northern Michigan and grad at Michigan State - anytime I use some upscale vocabulary she rolls her eyes and says "Those are Wabash words..."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 21, 2018, 12:06:20 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 21, 2018, 11:50:43 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 20, 2018, 04:13:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 20, 2018, 02:33:22 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 19, 2018, 06:42:02 PM
Saw a woman today who had a Wooster cell phone case.  I asked, "Did you go to Wooster?" She looked at me incredulous and said, "You know where that is?"

I said, "they've got a very good basketball team," which already elicited another strange look.  I half wish I would've answered my original thought, which was, "Yes, and I also know a whole bunch of schools within 499 miles of Wooster, too."

I would have asked about the marching band's show at football games, too!

The problem is, I don't know which schools have football and which ones don't.

Psst...another part of the Pat Coleman empire deals with football   ;D ;D ;D

Ryan has admitted many times... he just can't get into the football side. Doesn't have time for that. Considering my time... I respect that decision. LOL
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 21, 2018, 12:22:27 PM
Quote from: Smitty Oom on March 21, 2018, 11:43:08 AMLuckily my girlfriend is a fellow d3 basketball alumnus

Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 21, 2018, 11:50:25 AM
My wife isn't a D3 alumnus

Alumna, not alumnus. A male who is a former student is an alumnus. A female who is a former student is an alumna. Multiple female former students are alumnae. Multiple male former students, or, collectively, former students that include both males and females, are alumni.

The other nice thing about D3 is that its schools pride themselves upon prioritizing academics ... the downside of which is that it encourages free rein for pedants such as myself on d3boards.com. ;)

Quote from: smedindy on March 21, 2018, 11:52:15 AM
My wife did undergrad at Northern Michigan and grad at Michigan State - anytime I use some upscale vocabulary she rolls her eyes and says "Those are Wabash words..."

See what I mean? :D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 21, 2018, 12:27:03 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 21, 2018, 12:06:20 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 21, 2018, 11:50:43 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 20, 2018, 04:13:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 20, 2018, 02:33:22 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 19, 2018, 06:42:02 PM
Saw a woman today who had a Wooster cell phone case.  I asked, "Did you go to Wooster?" She looked at me incredulous and said, "You know where that is?"

I said, "they've got a very good basketball team," which already elicited another strange look.  I half wish I would've answered my original thought, which was, "Yes, and I also know a whole bunch of schools within 499 miles of Wooster, too."

I would have asked about the marching band's show at football games, too!

The problem is, I don't know which schools have football and which ones don't.

Psst...another part of the Pat Coleman empire deals with football   ;D ;D ;D

Ryan has admitted many times... he just can't get into the football side. Doesn't have time for that. Considering my time... I respect that decision. LOL

I think that he deserves a pass based upon the fact that Eastern Nazarene doesn't have football. I don't expect Calvin (or Goucher, for that matter) students and/or alumni to hold any interest in D3 football, either.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 21, 2018, 12:27:26 PM
I know Greg... doing a ton today (you will have to wait to see why)... and was flying through it.

I know the monikers more than most... I belong to the first, and now one of two I believe, schools that has an Alumnae and Alumni Office (House) ... because us males aren't good enough for the 70's alumnae and their money. SMH
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 21, 2018, 12:29:19 PM
Yeah, I keep forgetting that Goucher used to be a women's school. I recall your mentioning on the boards at one point what an ongoing headache that is for your alma mater.

Is your cryptic remark concerning your busy day somehow related to UWSP?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 21, 2018, 12:30:58 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 21, 2018, 12:29:19 PM
Yeah, I keep forgetting that Goucher used to be a women's school. I recall your mentioning on the boards at one point what an ongoing headache that is for your alma mater.

Is your cryptic remark concerning your busy day somehow related to UWSP?

I normally wouldn't say... but on this occasion, I will let you off the hook: no. I'm not holding my breathe on that one.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on March 21, 2018, 02:07:47 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 21, 2018, 12:06:20 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 21, 2018, 11:50:43 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 20, 2018, 04:13:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 20, 2018, 02:33:22 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 19, 2018, 06:42:02 PM
Saw a woman today who had a Wooster cell phone case.  I asked, "Did you go to Wooster?" She looked at me incredulous and said, "You know where that is?"

I said, "they've got a very good basketball team," which already elicited another strange look.  I half wish I would've answered my original thought, which was, "Yes, and I also know a whole bunch of schools within 499 miles of Wooster, too."

I would have asked about the marching band's show at football games, too!

The problem is, I don't know which schools have football and which ones don't.

Psst...another part of the Pat Coleman empire deals with football   ;D ;D ;D

Ryan has admitted many times... he just can't get into the football side. Doesn't have time for that. Considering my time... I respect that decision. LOL

Didn't they tell you in improv school not to step on the joke!  ;D ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Smitty Oom on March 21, 2018, 02:08:20 PM
Greg, I definitely did not know that, learn something new everyday!

Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 21, 2018, 11:50:25 AM
She does help with the memorabilia, though. More stuff to add to the mix/wall in the off season!

I was excited to get something from the Colorado College bookstore, but it was closed due to inventory since it was a Friday spring break... :(

Excited to see what you add to your collection next year!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 21, 2018, 02:11:31 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 21, 2018, 12:30:58 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 21, 2018, 12:29:19 PM
Yeah, I keep forgetting that Goucher used to be a women's school. I recall your mentioning on the boards at one point what an ongoing headache that is for your alma mater.

Is your cryptic remark concerning your busy day somehow related to UWSP?

I normally wouldn't say... but on this occasion, I will let you off the hook: no. I'm not holding my breathe on that one.

Greg... you paying attention? :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 21, 2018, 02:35:33 PM
Yep. I'm actually not terribly surprised, considering his age. I think that he's already turned 70, or he'll turn 70 this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 21, 2018, 02:37:18 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 21, 2018, 02:35:33 PM
Yep. I'm actually not terribly surprised, considering his age. I think that he's already turned 70, or he'll turn 70 this year.

Yes. Not surprised myself. I've had a couple of sources telling me it was coming... just didn't know when. Finally got word this morning it was coming soon, so we've been distracted. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 21, 2018, 03:00:22 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 21, 2018, 12:27:03 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 21, 2018, 12:06:20 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 21, 2018, 11:50:43 AM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 20, 2018, 04:13:41 PM
Quote from: smedindy on March 20, 2018, 02:33:22 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 19, 2018, 06:42:02 PM
Saw a woman today who had a Wooster cell phone case.  I asked, "Did you go to Wooster?" She looked at me incredulous and said, "You know where that is?"

I said, "they've got a very good basketball team," which already elicited another strange look.  I half wish I would've answered my original thought, which was, "Yes, and I also know a whole bunch of schools within 499 miles of Wooster, too."

I would have asked about the marching band's show at football games, too!

The problem is, I don't know which schools have football and which ones don't.

Psst...another part of the Pat Coleman empire deals with football   ;D ;D ;D

Ryan has admitted many times... he just can't get into the football side. Doesn't have time for that. Considering my time... I respect that decision. LOL

I think that he deserves a pass based upon the fact that Eastern Nazarene doesn't have football. I don't expect Calvin (or Goucher, for that matter) students and/or alumni to hold any interest in D3 football, either.

I've never attended a school with a football team in my life. In fact, the last football game I attended in person was probably when my brother played tight-end for one season when he was 9 or 10.  He's 31 now.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 21, 2018, 08:13:14 PM
Wooster's off-season will include $5M worth of renovations to Timken Gym (https://www.wooster.edu/news/releases/2018/march/timken-renovation/index.php). The project includes a complete replacement of the gym floor and the 50-year-old bleachers, as well as HVAC, scoreboard, and sound system upgrades. Accessibility and seating for persons with disabilities will be improved, as well.

Total seating capacity will shrink from today's ~3400 to 2,600 with the new bleacher renovation. The downsizing should help the gym feel more full for your standard game, with Wooster probably only wishing to have those extra seats for Woo-Witt rivalry games and NCAA home games.

A subsequent phase in 2019 will focus on locker room renovations. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: JFPIV on July 16, 2018, 10:56:28 AM
Over the weekend on its twitter feed Wabash Hoops identified two kids from Roncalli and one kid from Cathedral (Indy Catholic High Schools for those that might not know) and a kid from Tri-West who will be joining the program this winter.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on July 31, 2018, 08:33:03 PM
Anyone know how some of the school's rosters shaped up over the offseason? I see Wabash brought in a couple solid players as did DePauw. Last I heard Wooster was going to have a few guys come in that were solid as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on August 14, 2018, 04:10:53 PM
Article by David Jablonski on Witt's recruiting class :  https://www.springfieldnewssun.com/sports/wittenberg-basketball-recruiting-class-includes-two-players/vuL7ntAgN4CPSRlnTfULLL/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on September 18, 2018, 07:30:23 AM
Wooster's schedule has been posted.
http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2018-19/schedule

Non-conference games this year:
Home: Muskingum, Mount St. Joseph, New Jersey City
Road: Hanover, Ohio Northern
Neutral: Whitman, Sul Ross State (at Phoenix)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hopefan on October 04, 2018, 05:29:54 AM
Wittenberg Classic lists invitees as Wabash, Wilmington, and Bryant and Stratton (Wisc.)

Bryant and Stratton Wisconsin site shows it as a 2 year junior College, member of the NJCAA   (Bryant and Stratton has numerous campuses, SOME of which are in the USCAA and are 4 year programs... the Wisconsin campus does not appear to be a 4 year school)...

So I ask.. Witt?  a JC in your Tourney?   Please correct me if I'm wrong....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on October 04, 2018, 09:47:45 AM
They've probably just listed the wrong Bryant and Stratton.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on October 04, 2018, 12:43:03 PM
This is just jarring for me to read, because I remember that when I was a teenager the local Bryant & Stratton in the Syracuse area was a for-profit trade school that was located in a mall and ran ads on late-night TV designed to lure those who were looking for fast-paced and exciting work in the fields of computer repair, cosmetology, and broadcasting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on October 04, 2018, 01:04:57 PM
It still seems to be, at least the for-profit part.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hopefan on October 04, 2018, 01:12:46 PM
Their various campuses are dotting D3 schedules

Witt Classic           12/28/2018   Wittenberg      Bryant and Stratton (Wisc.)
Witt  Classic           12/29/2018   Wabash      Bryant and Stratton (Wisc.)
alfred/alf st tourney   11/16/2018   Alfred State      Bryant and Stratton Buffalo
alfred/alf st tourney   11/17/2018   Alfred      Bryant and Stratton Buffalo
                            2/1/2019            Pine Manor      Bryant and Stratton Buffalo
alfred/alf st tourney   11/16/2018   Alfred      Bryant and Stratton Rochester
alfred/alf st tourney   11/17/2018   Alfred State      Bryant and Stratton Rochester
                            2/15/2019   Pine Manor      Bryant and Stratton Rochester
                           12/13/2018   Cazenovia      Bryant and Stratton Syracuse
                             2/16/2019   Pine Manor      Bryant and Stratton Syracuse
                             1/11/2019   Valley Forge      Bryant and Stratton ?

The Rochester, Buffalo, an Syracuse campuses are listed on the USCAA site as members.... The Wisc Bryant and Stratton site lists them as NJCAA
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Pat Coleman on October 11, 2018, 03:03:47 PM
Preseason men's Top 25 is out!
http://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2018/10/preseason-mens-top-25
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 12, 2018, 11:17:49 AM
I tried to find the corresponding tourney on several B&S sites and couldn't - including Wisconsin.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on October 15, 2018, 11:37:35 AM
B&S in New York competes in the USCAA. All others are in the  NJCAA
https://www.bryantstratton.edu/admissions/get-started/high-school/athletics

A lot of the programs seem relatively new.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 15, 2018, 11:41:28 AM
Are they the Fighting Small Engines?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on October 16, 2018, 12:35:24 PM
Quote from: smedindy on October 15, 2018, 11:41:28 AM
Are they the Fighting Small Engines?
Bobcats. Maybe they mean the small construction tractors?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hopefan on October 16, 2018, 12:45:12 PM
Seriously.. why would Witt schedule a junior college for their tourney???  Did someone screw up???  Is it an error on the schedule, not yet corrected?

This is one of the two major scheduling mysteries out there, along with the "do they really exist" Ohio Midwestern team in the Bluffton Tourney...

Come on you Hamilton Bergers out there, prove the guilt!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on October 17, 2018, 03:09:42 PM
Quote from: hopefan on October 16, 2018, 12:45:12 PM
Seriously.. why would Witt schedule a junior college for their tourney???  Did someone screw up???  Is it an error on the schedule, not yet corrected?

This is one of the two major scheduling mysteries out there, along with the "do they really exist" Ohio Midwestern team in the Bluffton Tourney...

Come on you Hamilton Bergers out there, prove the guilt!!!
Ohio Midwestern is a small school associated with the NCCAA. They used to be named Temple Baptist. I cannot find a site for the school or the athletics program. Looks like the schools website might have been hosted by WiX, but is no more. They belong to the Ohio Collegiate Athletic Conference. WHich does not have a websight however here is the Wiki about the conference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ohio_Collegiate_Athletic_Conference
Here is the site for their football program:
http://omwfootball.yolasite.com/ However it is out of date.
Here is the school profile from ncsa: https://www.ncsasports.org/athletic-scholarships/mens-basketball/ohio/ohio-midwestern-college4#
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hopefan on October 17, 2018, 05:36:44 PM
Quote from: Bishopleftiesdad on October 17, 2018, 03:09:42 PM
Quote from: hopefan on October 16, 2018, 12:45:12 PM
Seriously.. why would Witt schedule a junior college for their tourney???  Did someone screw up???  Is it an error on the schedule, not yet corrected?

This is one of the two major scheduling mysteries out there, along with the "do they really exist" Ohio Midwestern team in the Bluffton Tourney...

Come on you Hamilton Bergers out there, prove the guilt!!!
Ohio Midwestern is a small school associated with the NCCAA. They used to be named Temple Baptist. I cannot find a site for the school or the athletics program. Looks like the schools website might have been hosted by WiX, but is no more. They belong to the Ohio Collegiate Athletic Conference. WHich does not have a websight however here is the Wiki about the conference: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ohio_Collegiate_Athletic_Conference
Here is the site for their football program:
http://omwfootball.yolasite.com/ However it is out of date.
Here is the school profile from ncsa: https://www.ncsasports.org/athletic-scholarships/mens-basketball/ohio/ohio-midwestern-college4#

You have duped exactly what I found... I'm going to call several of the other schools listed as members of the Ohio Coll.AC to see if they can provide info...  The thing that is really bothering me is that I have emailed several appropriate personnel at Bluffton each several times, very politely, and have received no response.... hey returning an email and saying yes they exist or thanks, they don't exist, would take 10 seconds... they are very busy at Bluffton, I guess....
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hopefan on October 18, 2018, 10:53:31 AM
Regarding Ohio Mid-Western College on Bluffton Schedule

Per the Sharonville, Ohio town office... no one has ever heard of Ohio Mid-Western College.... the address I found, 19 Triangle Park Drive, Sharonville, Ohio is a small business park, numerous small businesses have come and gone....Definitely not an active college campus....

So what gives with this still on the Bluffton Schedule? And why won't the Bluffton AD, Coach or SID send me a simple reply to emails?

Keep working on it Lefty!!!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on October 18, 2018, 12:12:08 PM
It never had much more than 100 students matriculating, there. Their web presence is non-existent. This is not the first time this team has crossed my path. Not too long ago they did have a web site, however it was not very professional. If I remember correctly, they did have offices and classes in the business park. With less than 200 students, they probably do not need a full fledged campus.
As per Crunchbase, it is closed.
https://www.crunchbase.com/organization/ohio-mid-western-college#section-overview
According to College Factual, it is either closed or stopped reporting Info.
https://www.collegefactual.com/colleges/ohio-mid-western-college/
As per International Student it is accredited by Transnational Association of Christian Colleges and Schools
https://www.internationalstudent.com/school-search/3189/usa/ohio/ohio-mid-western-college/
However I cannot find them on TRACS web site.
http://www.tracs.org/TRACS_Members_new.html
So if it still exists, it is not operating with any sort of accreditation I can find. So I am not sure how much any degree from them would be worth.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on October 18, 2018, 12:22:47 PM
The address I find for it at the BBB, is 11965 Kenn Rd, Cincinnati, OH 45240-1313. this is the address of the International Baptist Church and Calvary Academy.
https://www.bbb.org/us/oh/cincinnati/profile/college-and-university/ohio-midwestern-college-0292-10002054
http://church.ibcweb.org/
http://www.thecalvaryacademy.org/
However neither site has any mentions of Ohio Mid-Western. But the International Baptist church may have some answers. Depending on how far ahead the tournament was scheduled. It is possible that the school closed after scheduling this.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hopefan on October 18, 2018, 12:42:41 PM
Great work.... +1... hoping someone from Bluffton is reading this!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on October 19, 2018, 12:06:04 PM
I'll get about seven randos together, call them a school, and get scheduled!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on October 19, 2018, 01:39:19 PM
Quote from: hopefan on October 18, 2018, 12:42:41 PM
Great work.... +1... hoping someone from Bluffton is reading this!!!
Don't know why they would read the NCAC board, however you never know. Looks to me like the school is closed. None of the College websites have any info on them anymore. Cappex, college confidential, etc... I believe I found them on those sites in the past.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on October 29, 2018, 11:30:34 AM
Quote from: hopefan on October 04, 2018, 05:29:54 AM
Wittenberg Classic lists invitees as Wabash, Wilmington, and Bryant and Stratton (Wisc.)

Bryant and Stratton Wisconsin site shows it as a 2 year junior College, member of the NJCAA   (Bryant and Stratton has numerous campuses, SOME of which are in the USCAA and are 4 year programs... the Wisconsin campus does not appear to be a 4 year school)...

So I ask.. Witt?  a JC in your Tourney?   Please correct me if I'm wrong....

Bryant and Stratton is a JUCO in Ohio. Not sure why they brought them into the tournament.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on November 11, 2018, 05:46:34 PM
For anyone with interest: Wabash College is playing Northern Kentucky at 6EST tonight on ESPN+.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on December 08, 2018, 08:18:42 PM
Wabash took down #15 Wooster 62-60 on a last second lay-up by Kellen Schreiber to end the game.

https://twitter.com/NCAC/status/1071523837131530243
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sac on December 09, 2018, 03:13:54 AM
Quote from: CollegeGolf18 on December 08, 2018, 08:18:42 PM
Wabash took down #15 Wooster 62-60 on a last second lay-up by Kellen Schreiber to end the game.

https://twitter.com/NCAC/status/1071523837131530243

Watching that live I thought Wooster kind of fell asleep but now that I've seen it a few times this is a really clever in-bounds play.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on December 09, 2018, 12:39:22 PM
Quote from: sac on December 09, 2018, 03:13:54 AM
Quote from: CollegeGolf18 on December 08, 2018, 08:18:42 PM
Wabash took down #15 Wooster 62-60 on a last second lay-up by Kellen Schreiber to end the game.

https://twitter.com/NCAC/status/1071523837131530243

Watching that live I thought Wooster kind of fell asleep but now that I've seen it a few times this is a really clever in-bounds play.

I talked to the coaching staff after the game and this wasn't really the play that the staff drew up. Schreiber was supposed to set the down screen for Jack, and they felt like Wooster would come up and cheat so high that Jack would instead roll to the basket. The play was always going to the basket, but Schreiber saw that they were already cheating up so high that he just kept running and no one thought about him because literally EVERYONE was looking at Davidson.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hotdawg on December 10, 2018, 08:19:54 AM
Looked to me like one Wooster player thought they were switching screens and the other didn't.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on December 10, 2018, 04:21:04 PM
Quote from: hotdawg on December 10, 2018, 08:19:54 AM
Looked to me like one Wooster player thought they were switching screens and the other didn't.
For sure, I think 32 was supposed to drop (or even their big man) and no one really moved.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on December 27, 2018, 10:10:16 AM
Anyone know why Donte Williams had zero minutes in last game.  Injury or Dog House?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on December 27, 2018, 07:42:30 PM
Quote from: bufordscot on December 27, 2018, 10:10:16 AM
Anyone know why Donte Williams had zero minutes in last game.  Injury or Dog House?

Hurt. - Not sure what it is though.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Fifth and Putnam on January 10, 2019, 03:11:55 PM
Wooster to Host Third Annual Great Lakes Invitational this December

http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2018-19/releases/20190108hilehm
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on January 10, 2019, 03:35:45 PM
Well, I think there's a reasonable chance someone not named Wooster or Wittenberg will win the NCAC this year!

Obviously the LGs have roadies against Witt and Wooster, and that pesky DPU rivalry can always cause angst, but there is hope that the NCAC tourney will be played outside of Ohio.

A chance...



Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 10, 2019, 04:13:11 PM
Dude soooo many games left!  And the last 11 games here for Wabash are road heavy including Witt and Woo and the Allegheny/Hiram back-to-back which is never easy.

I do think this is Wabash's best chance at the top seed since probably their first year in the league ('99-00).  Definitely doable if they stay consistent.  Wabash's per 100 stats are ludicrous.  It's not just that they have an elite scorer (they do, which is obviously awesome), they just don't take bad shots.  Almost everything they shoot is either a layup, an open three, or a free throw.  It's analytically ideal basketball and good gracious it is fun to watch. 

Senior Ben Stachowski is on with Dave McHugh on Hoopsville tonight.  You know your team is really on one when you get invited to the H'ville.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 10, 2019, 06:18:51 PM
To prove the point ...

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The grind of conference play is in full gear. Nothing beats a team up or reveals how good one is like the grind of conference play.

Thursday night on Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) we take a look at the grind and how teams are surviving, surprising, and even impressing as the holidays and the break quickly become a distant memory in the rear view mirror.

The first of the season's "WBCA Center Court" segments also debuts with the dedication of one coach off the court and with her family. UW-Platteville women's coach Megan Wilson talks about her daughter's battle with cancer and the decision to step away from coaching to help her daughter fight.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Thursday's show, LIVE, starting at 7:00 p.m. ET here: http://bit.ly/2D0Qd7t

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or use any of the social media options below.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Pat McKenzie, No. 11 St. John's men's coach
- Ben Stachowski, No. 20 Wabash men's senior guard
- Alyssa Polosky, No. 14 SUNY Geneseo women's head coach
- Megan Willson, UW-Platteville women's head coach (WBCA Center Court)
- Trevor Woodruff, No. 3 Scranton women's head coach

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Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 17, 2019, 09:14:45 AM
Everybody has played everybody once...some observations:
- Wabash swept the first trip through the league, which is a program first.  Well done.  The back half is road heavy with games at Wooster, at Witt, at DPU (who, as we learned last night, seems to match up well with Wabash), and the Hiram/Allegheny trip.  Not out of the woods by any stretch, but getting the front 9 is a pretty nice accomplishment for this team.
- Wooster's back half includes hosting Wabash and Wittenberg, so the schedule is favorable for the Scots.  It definitely feels like the race to host the league tournament is between Wabash and Wooster because...
- It's hard to see how Wittenberg makes up three games here in the last four weeks.  The loss to Denison (2-7 in league play) is one the Tigers are going to want back because that's probably the one that keeps them out of the the chase for the top seed.  There's not really a big difference between being #2 or #3 in the tournament (unless, for Witt at least, they catch Hiram in the QF). 
- In the big surprise column, how about Oberlin?  They dropped a tough one last night, but they are in 4th place position right now and I don't recall Oberlin ever hosting a conference tournament game.  I think they were close in one of the Chris Ikpoh years, but didn't quite get there.  I do think Oberlin is going to stay competitive for that #4 seed - they've already won road games at DePauw, at Denison, at Hiram, and at OWU(!).  That's how you get into the top 4. 
- OWU is a huge surprise and not in a good way.  I think you knew they would come back to the pack a bit post-Axelrod, but the Bishops are 3-6 in the league (in the 7/8 spot with Allegheny, one game ahead of Denison on the cut line), lost three in a row, and kind of fishing for answers. 

The last month of the regular season should be fun in the North Coast. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: URBAN4PREZ on January 17, 2019, 10:59:27 PM
Love seeing some real analysis on this board again.  And there's no sitting at the table if you're bringing nothing to it, so here's my not-so-scientific guess for the remainder of the season:: 

1- I think Wooster ends the season as the top seed and hosts the conference tournament.  As you noted, they have the most favorable schedule down the stretch, playing Wabash, Wittenberg, and Oberlin (i.e. the top 3 remaining teams) at home.  Plus, Hempy and Dupler seem to be playing their best basketball lately. 

2- I think Wabash finishes as the second seed. They have six road games remaining, including @ Wooster, @ Wittenberg, and @ rival DPU.  Right or wrong, I'm not sure Davidson is going to get a favorable whistle in some of those away gyms - a potential problem for a guy who has shot nearly 50 more FTs than the next closest player in the conference.  I can't put my finger on the reason, but I'm not quite sold on Wabash despite their excellent start.  Next weekend's game @ Wooster will be a big test.

3 - I think Wittenberg finishes third, but they've done little to inspire any confidence over the past 2 weeks.  If they can find a way to make the national tournament, they'll owe a thank you to the ref who made the call at the end of regulation last night.  It was probably the right call, but most officials swallow their whistles in that situation. A loss there might have been fatal to any Pool C hope. Witt seems to have the most talented roster, but they haven't quite put all the pieces together yet. 

4- My surprise choice: I think DePauw finishes 4th and hosts a game.  No knock on Oberlin or Hiram, but the Tigers look to be turning a corner after somewhat underperforming early. 

Just my guesses.  Agree that the rest of the year will be fun.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 18, 2019, 08:58:25 AM
It's a good point there about Davidson getting whistles on the road.  On Wednesday, the officials were letting them play so to speak and it definitely frustrated Davidson.  Early in the second half, Davidson was fouled on a fast break drive, did not get a call, said something out of frustration, got T'd up, and then got subbed out.  This all happened with 15 minutes left in the game and (after the techincal foul shots) Wabash down 3.  Davidson did not re-enter the game (strong move by Brumett, really, to keep the league's top scorer on the bench in a tight rivalry game with eyes on winning the league) and Davidson's teammates picked him up and found a way to win. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on January 18, 2019, 09:33:43 PM
As we kick off the back half of NCAC play (and since I watch most of the games) I am gonna give a little analysis, along with a standings update each night there are games. This is for me to ramble (basically) and others can jump in where they see fit.

Friday, January 19th scores
Wabash 84 vs. Denison 74
Ohio Wesleyan 98 vs. Allegheny 84

#14 Wabash vs. Denison
Big win for Wabash today. After struggling for the first half they separated themselves in the second. I never felt like Wabash had lost control of the game, but Denison was hot early on and stayed with them. Davidson came out angry after his performance on Wednesday and hit 3 or 4 really deep 3-pointers. He scored 26 in the first half and set a new career high with 43 points. Really solid performance from Wabash and good on Denison for staying with them. Thought they played pretty well but just got cold in the second half. 8/18 3FG in the first half and then 2/15 3FG in the second half just isn't going to win many games, especially like a team such as Wabash. https://d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190118_bjo4.xml?view=boxscore (https://d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190118_bjo4.xml?view=boxscore)

Ohio Wesleyan vs. Allegheny
This was one of the highest paced games that I have watched in a long time. OWU just could not miss anything and pulled away. Allegheny looked solid and freshman guard Brian Roberts Jr. was a bright spot for them. I thought him and junior Jordan Rawls played really well but they weren't enough to keep pace with OWU who had 3!! 20+ point scorers in the game. Freshman Ethan Stanislawski played probably the best game of the season for him. Junior Grant Gossard and freshman Gabe Johnson both played great underneath and Allegheny just was not able to score at the rim efficiently. I think OWU is starting to turn a corner and the game at Wabash next week is huge for them. https://d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190118_bw5b.xml?view=boxscore (https://d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190118_bw5b.xml?view=boxscore)

Standings are below. I will soon start to "eliminate" teams as they are unable to get to the tournament or as soon as they "clinch".

Edit: If anyone can tell me how to put the URL of the box scores in a hyperlink that says just plainly "Box" I will give you a thank you.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on January 19, 2019, 04:54:22 PM
Saturday, January 20th scores
Wittenberg 92 vs. Oberlin 84 - OT
Kenyon 54 vs. DePauw 62

#25 Wittenberg vs. Oberlin
In a matchup of the third and fourth place teams, Oberlin almost came away with the huge win at home. Wittenberg is just struggling a bit since the turn of the year. They are 3-3 and two of those wins have come in OT. I have to think that they'll fall out of the poll, even though they secured two wins this week. Wittenberg won this game on the back of Connor Siepel who scored 33 points in the game. Both teams shot the ball well as both FG% were >55%. Balser had a look to win it in regulation, but missed. In OT, Oberlin went on a quick 6-2 run to make it 84-80 but then it was all Witt. Two Oberlin turnovers turned into six points for Witt and the game was over. Big game here for Witt as they have an easier stretch coming up that they can accumulate some conference wins. https://d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190119_x4nj.xml?view=boxscore

Kenyon vs. DePauw
Wow. This was one of the ugliest first halves of basketball I have ever seen. Kenyon missed five point blank shots and DePauw couldn't hit a jumper. It was ugly. DePauw held a 22-21 edge at the end of 1H and the teams combined for 18/61 FG, 2/16 3FG, and DePauw had 9 turnovers. DePauw finished the game 2/18 from behind the arc. That isn't going to win many games in this conference. Period. DePauw won the game via their rebounding as they had a 49-31 rebounding edge. 15 offensive rebounds led to 13 second chance points and there was the difference in the game. Fouls were a big story for Kenyon as DePauw was in the bonus with 15:32 LEFT IN THE GAME. Not going to win games letting opponents shoot 23 second half free throws. Ugly win, but a win. https://d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190119_oflu.xml?view=boxscore
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 20, 2019, 05:13:50 PM
Quote from: CollegeGolf18 on January 18, 2019, 09:33:43 PM
Edit: If anyone can tell me how to put the URL of the box scores in a hyperlink that says just plainly "Box" I will give you a thank you.

I got your boxscores (https://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190118_bjo4.xml?view=boxscore) right here.   :)

If you quote this post, you'll see the coding that you want that lets you hyperlink.  Also a quick help page here (https://wiki.simplemachines.org/smf/Url) if you want. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on January 20, 2019, 07:55:38 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 20, 2019, 05:13:50 PM
Quote from: CollegeGolf18 on January 18, 2019, 09:33:43 PM
Edit: If anyone can tell me how to put the URL of the box scores in a hyperlink that says just plainly "Box" I will give you a thank you.

I got your boxscores (https://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190118_bjo4.xml?view=boxscore) right here.   :)

If you quote this post, you'll see the coding that you want that lets you hyperlink.  Also a quick help page here (https://wiki.simplemachines.org/smf/Url) if you want.

AWESOME. Thank you!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on January 20, 2019, 08:13:11 PM
Sunday, January 20th scores
Hiram 80 vs. Wooster 106

Hiram vs. #21 Wooster
This one was over quickly. Wooster was hot the entire game and once it got to 9-2 within the first three minutes of the game, I knew it was all but over. Danyon Hempy scored his 1000th point with his first basket and then added a few more in the first half to give him 17 first half points. Wooster KILLED Hiram in bench points, and it was all due to two guys. Their second and third leading scorer came off the bench. Four players for Wooster had 17 or more points in this one. When Wooster hits 18 3-pointers, they won't be beat by anyone in this league. Hiram didn't look bad, Wooster just played a great game. Box Score (https://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190120_tkks.xml?view=boxscore)

Standings are attached. Right now, Oberlin would have the tiebreaker. I think that it's a four team race for that four seed. I believe that Witt will be the 3 seed and it's a two team race for the conference crown. No one has been eliminated, or locked into their spot.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on January 23, 2019, 09:45:43 PM
Big night throughout the NCAC tonight as all 10 teams were in action.

Wednesday, January 23rd scores
Denison 89 vs. Hiram 91
Wittenberg 75 vs. DePauw 77 - OT
Wooster 81 vs. Allegheny 72
Ohio Wesleyan 68 vs. Wabash 80
Oberlin 66 vs. Kenyon 57

Denison vs. Hiram
This was a little bit of a weird game. Hiram got off to a quick five point lead early, but that was the biggest lead they had all game. Denison then went on a 15-3 run to take a 7 point lead, but that was the biggest lead anyone had all game. Both teams shot the ball really well from deep as Hiram shot over 50% and Denison hit 44% from deep. The sole reason Hiram was able to hang on and win this game (even though Kirksey did make two FTs with 11 seconds left in the game), was the play of Antonio McQueen, a 6'6 freshman forward who was playing his fifth game of the year. McQueen scored 26 (17 in 2H) and grabbed 11 rebounds (7!! offensive). I would have to imagine he was either hurt or academically ineligible? Not sure, but he is a huge addition as this was his second 20 point game in five games. Nice win for Hiram here. Box Score (https://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190123_t4re.xml?view=boxscore)

#24 Wittenberg vs. DePauw
This was a bit of a weird game for Wittenberg. DePauw isn't going to come out and win a shootout, but their defense keeps getting better. Wittenberg was awful offensively as they had an uncharacteristic 21 turnovers. Witt shot 49% from the floor and DePauw shot 39% from the floor. DePauw had more 2nd chance points and points off of turnovers in this one so they definitely took advantage. Nick Felke hit a huge 3-pointers in OT to go up one and thn Wittenberg just couldn't get the lead back. Nolan Ginther led DePauw with 18 points but as a post player to take 21 shots, that's not really a recipe to win but when you play as bad as Witt did, you could. DePauw now has a little momentum. I said last week that I thought Wittenberg would fall out of the top 25 with two OT wins, but this really drops them out and not to be back again I would assume. Box Score (https://d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190123_eibq.xml?view=boxscore)

#18 Wooster vs. Allegheny
Wooster escaped in this one. Despite scoring 81 points, they could just not manage their offense. They grabbed 18 offensive rebounds which led to 23 2nd chance points. They were 5/24 from deep and 15/24 from the line. It was just an ugly shooting night for everyone. Danyon Hempy, their leading scorer with 25, shot 9/20 from the floor to get those points. They also turned the ball over just seven times compared to 22! for Allegheny. When you outrebound a team on the offensive glass 18-7 and have a +15 turnover margin you should win every game, no matter how you shoot. Gotta give it to Jordan Rawls for Allegheny though as he had 33 points on 11/15 shooting. Big game for him and kept Allegheny in it. Just a weird showing for Wooster in this one as they just completely could not shoot. Box Score (https://d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190123_l7ue.xml?view=boxscore)

Ohio Wesleyan vs. #11 Wabash
Well, if you're Allegheny and Wabash you're happy you don't have to play OWU again. They are a young team, but as I noted a few games ago, I think they are starting to come around and play some good basketball. They held a three point lead at the half 36-33 but they Wabash came out shooting the ball quite a bit better. Wabash was 3/18 from deep in the first half, but in the second half they were 5/9 from deep. Harry Hallstrom was a beast for Wabash as he scored 20 points on 9/12 shooting. He really got going in the second half early on and OWU didn't have an answer for him. Grant Gossard was a pain to contend with and ended with 17 points as he was in foul trouble all game long. OWU threw a full court press, a 1-3-1, 2-3, and a 3-2 zone at Wabash and did a really good job defending what Wabash likes to do. Wabash only hit 8/27 3-pointers and scored 80 points, that is scary for teams in the league. OWU is going to be a tall task coming up for every team in this league. Two starters were also missing for Wabash in this one as Rotterman and Stachowski did not play. Box Score (https://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190123_t4re.xml?view=boxscore)

Oberlin vs. Kenyon
The late game of the night might have been the one that was the least notable. Kenyon just isn't good (despite almost beating DePauw on the road last week *what?*). The leading scorer for both teams had just 14 points. All ten players who played for Oberlin had at least three points...weird. Nothing much notable here as I watched the second half. Both teams missed a bunch of shots and nothing really stood out. Just a game against two teams that struggled a lot. The box isn't posted yet so you can just look at this instead. (https://portal.stretchinternet.com/kenyon/stats.htm?eventId=494911&streamType=video)

No change in the standings although Wittenberg pulled closer to the middle of the pack with their loss.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: URBAN4PREZ on January 23, 2019, 10:23:18 PM
Simply put, Wittenberg is just not a good team currently.  They consistently seem out of sorts offensively. They've never had a particularly imaginative offense, but last year's team was so talented and meshed so well that they made that potential concern a non-factor.  This year's team is still a work in progress, but the season is only so long.

I still think this team could make a run and win the conference tournament based on their personnel.  However, today's loss likely cost them any outside shot at a Pool C bid. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on January 23, 2019, 11:18:21 PM
Quote from: URBAN4PREZ on January 23, 2019, 10:23:18 PM
Simply put, Wittenberg is just not a good team currently.  They consistently seem out of sorts offensively. They've never had a particularly imaginative offense, but last year's team was so talented and meshed so well that they made that potential concern a non-factor.  This year's team is still a work in progress, but the season is only so long.

I still think this team could make a run and win the conference tournament based on their personnel.  However, today's loss likely cost them any outside shot at a Pool C bid.

Totally agree, although after the loss to Denison I think that knocked them out. Losing Roy last year was a huge loss for them. I still expect them to be able to compete vs. Wabash and @ Wooster but definitely aren't favored in either of those. I could see them falling to not even hosting a game, although I still think they will stick at #3.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 24, 2019, 09:42:55 AM
Quote from: CollegeGolf18 on January 23, 2019, 09:45:43 PM
Ohio Wesleyan vs. #11 Wabash
Well, if you're Allegheny and Wabash you're happy you don't have to play OWU again. They are a young team, but as I noted a few games ago, I think they are starting to come around and play some good basketball. They held a three point lead at the half 36-33 but they Wabash came out shooting the ball quite a bit better. Wabash was 3/18 from deep in the first half, but in the second half they were 5/9 from deep. Harry Hallstrom was a beast for Wabash as he scored 20 points on 9/12 shooting. He really got going in the second half early on and OWU didn't have an answer for him. Grant Gossard was a pain to contend with and ended with 17 points as he was in foul trouble all game long. OWU threw a full court press, a 1-3-1, 2-3, and a 3-2 zone at Wabash and did a really good job defending what Wabash likes to do. Wabash only hit 8/27 3-pointers and scored 80 points, that is scary for teams in the league. OWU is going to be a tall task coming up for every team in this league. Two starters were also missing for Wabash in this one as Rotterman and Stachowski did not play. Box Score (https://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190123_t4re.xml?view=boxscore)

I think Wabash is going to see a lot more of this going forward.  OWU's constantly changing zone defenses definitely had an impact in that Wabash took a lot of really poor 3FGAs in the first half.  Wabash tried to shoot over the zone(s) and it just didn't work out.  One positive is that Wabash didn't turn it over a bunch, so OWU wasn't constantly racing to the other end for easy buckets, but it did take a half of basketball for Wabash to adjust, commit to Hallstrom and Eberhard inside, and wear out the Bishops from the inside out.  Good coaching, good adjustments, good execution. 

Another thing that keeps popping up over the last couple of weeks is the depth Wabash has.  You mentioned two high-minutes guys that didn't play last night.  FR Jayden Edwards gave Wabash huge effort minutes in this game with 7 rebounds and 3 steals.  Edwards really defended the post well against some bigger dudes last night.  Until last night, Edwards was a guy that was getting the bulk of his minutes at the end of lopsided games.  It's great to see him come in and play so well.  It's a huge luxury for Brumett to be able to go, what, 10 deep(?) and not have to hide that guy when he's out there. 

Looking foward to Saturday afternoon at Timken.  Outside of the few conference tournament championship games Wabash has been a part of, it's hard to think of a bigger NCAC game than this one coming on Saturday. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WLGHistorian on January 25, 2019, 06:50:39 PM
Let me just add my 2 cents worth.

I have seen all games in person or online.

Wabash operates at a "higher gear" when Rotterman and Davidson both start. Davidson missed the Kenyon game. Although the final score does not indicate it, Wabash did not start to pull away until towards the end of the 1st half.  It was 29-20 with 7:41 left in 1st half...37-26 at 3:57...and 44-30 at the half.


Wednesday night there was a bit of hesitation by the offense...caused both by OWU and 2 starters missing (out for the game...Rotterman and Stachowski).  OWU is tough to handle as indicated by their results recently but I still wonder how Rotterman would have altered the game.


I hope Wabash is at full strength against Wooster.  Both Wooster and Wabash struggled with their shooting Wednesday night, both teams play great defense and have some players than can turn the tide of a close game.


Looking forward to see what happens with a huge crowd and an early preview of "tournament atmosphere."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on January 26, 2019, 01:08:51 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on January 24, 2019, 09:42:55 AM
Quote from: CollegeGolf18 on January 23, 2019, 09:45:43 PM
Ohio Wesleyan vs. #11 Wabash
Well, if you're Allegheny and Wabash you're happy you don't have to play OWU again. They are a young team, but as I noted a few games ago, I think they are starting to come around and play some good basketball. They held a three point lead at the half 36-33 but they Wabash came out shooting the ball quite a bit better. Wabash was 3/18 from deep in the first half, but in the second half they were 5/9 from deep. Harry Hallstrom was a beast for Wabash as he scored 20 points on 9/12 shooting. He really got going in the second half early on and OWU didn't have an answer for him. Grant Gossard was a pain to contend with and ended with 17 points as he was in foul trouble all game long. OWU threw a full court press, a 1-3-1, 2-3, and a 3-2 zone at Wabash and did a really good job defending what Wabash likes to do. Wabash only hit 8/27 3-pointers and scored 80 points, that is scary for teams in the league. OWU is going to be a tall task coming up for every team in this league. Two starters were also missing for Wabash in this one as Rotterman and Stachowski did not play. Box Score (https://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2018-19/boxscores/20190123_t4re.xml?view=boxscore)

I think Wabash is going to see a lot more of this going forward.  OWU's constantly changing zone defenses definitely had an impact in that Wabash took a lot of really poor 3FGAs in the first half.  Wabash tried to shoot over the zone(s) and it just didn't work out.  One positive is that Wabash didn't turn it over a bunch, so OWU wasn't constantly racing to the other end for easy buckets, but it did take a half of basketball for Wabash to adjust, commit to Hallstrom and Eberhard inside, and wear out the Bishops from the inside out.  Good coaching, good adjustments, good execution. 

Another thing that keeps popping up over the last couple of weeks is the depth Wabash has.  You mentioned two high-minutes guys that didn't play last night.  FR Jayden Edwards gave Wabash huge effort minutes in this game with 7 rebounds and 3 steals.  Edwards really defended the post well against some bigger dudes last night.  Until last night, Edwards was a guy that was getting the bulk of his minutes at the end of lopsided games.  It's great to see him come in and play so well.  It's a huge luxury for Brumett to be able to go, what, 10 deep(?) and not have to hide that guy when he's out there. 

Looking foward to Saturday afternoon at Timken.  Outside of the few conference tournament championship games Wabash has been a part of, it's hard to think of a bigger NCAC game than this one coming on Saturday.

I agree. I wonder if Wooster will throw anything different at Wabash today. Rott and Stak are back today so that will be a plus, although I would imagine that Edwards does get a little more time than usual today still. I do think that this is the de facto championship if Wabash wins.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on January 26, 2019, 10:33:05 PM
Final: #18 Wooster 91  #11 Wabash 84

Saw a great game at Timken this afternoon as Wooster led the entire game and beat Wabash to force a first place tie in the NCAC. :)  Both teams now 11-1.

The two best players in the NCAC rose to the challenge with Jack Davidson scoring 34 points for the Little Giants and Danyon Hempy led the Scots with 31.  Keonn Scott provided a big lift for Wooster off the bench scoring 18 and hitting 6 of 6 free throws late to ice the game when Wabash was forced to foul.  Very competitive game as Wabash cut the lead to one point in the second half and it was still a 3 point game with ~30 seconds remaining.  Yes, WAF so kudos to the Little Giants.  Wooster had a slight edge on the boards (39 to 37), made 9 three pointers compared to 4 for Wabash and the Scots had fewer turnovers that converted to an edge in transition points.

Wabash has 2 home games left (Kenyon, Oberlin) and 4 road games (Allegheny, Hiram, DePauw, Witt)

Wooster has 3 home games left (Kenyon, Oberlin, Witt) and 3 road games (OWU, Denison, DePauw)

Both squads looked like NCAA tourney teams today and they could easily meet again in the conference tournament championship game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on January 28, 2019, 09:36:54 AM
It's always tough to win at Wooster and it's nearly impossible to do if you don't score for the first six minutes of the game and work back from a 14-0 deficit.  In some previous seasons or maybe even if this game had happened in December, I think Wabash would take a lot of positives away from it, but with where this team is at this point in the season, I think this was a big time missed opportunity and one that these Little Giants can kick themselves over for a couple of days.  The scoring drought at the top of the game and a few really lazy passes around the perimeter that led to runouts for Wooster were really uncharacteristic of this team and something they'll correct going forward.  In any case, all kinds of credit to Wooster for this win.  It was a must win for the Scots if they intend to host the league tournament (of course they do) and they answered the bell as they've done for so long in this league. 

Quick prediction on how this affects the polling- I think  Wooster will jump Wabash, but they'll be lumped together somewhere in the 13-14-15 area.  We'll see how that plays out later today. 

No Wednesday game for Wabash as they gear up for the Allegheny-Hiram double this Friday-Saturday.  Gotta get that sweep this weekend. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on January 28, 2019, 09:54:36 AM
Give Wabash a lot of credit.  After a very rough start, they kept their composure and quieted the crowd, and fought all the way to the buzzer.  I was more impressed by the LGs in this game than in their win over Wooster.  The Scots are playing better basketball now, and the game was on the road, yet Wabash wasn't that far from coming away with another win.

The remaining schedule favors Wooster slightly, but either way, I expect a terrific third game between these teams in the conference final.  Both teams are physical and talented, and each has the potential of making it to the second weekend of the NCAAs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on January 28, 2019, 07:03:45 PM
As Wally predicted, Wooster is #13  and Wabash #14 in this week's poll.  As expected, Wittenberg, last week #24, dropped out of the Top 25.    I think the remaining schedule favors Wooster by more than a little.  Road trip this week with back to back games;  at Witt; DePauw in Greencastle on the horizon for the LGs.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 30, 2019, 01:47:05 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=m5lxl/o3h5z2xs7txn530n.jpg)

The Hoopsville Marathon Show ... is tomorrow!

Tune in starting at 12:00 p.m. ET as we talk to guests from around the country about nothing but #d3hoops.

It is all about celebrating the season, student-athletes, coaches, and an exciting season.

For more information, click here: http://bit.ly/2HGx0N3

We will share more about the show a little later.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 01, 2019, 03:11:14 PM
Interesting weekend in the North Coast.  Wabash has the tricky road back-to-back starting with Allegheny this evening and then a matinee at Hiram tomorrow.  Wooster travels to OWU where the Bishops have been playing better ball as of late.  They've won three of four, losing at Wabash in a game that they were in until the very late stages.  Wabash won the game by 12, but that was a late separation.  They also lost an OT game to Wittenberg prior to this four game stretch, so Coach DeWitt has his team figuring some things out.  Quality stuff as we hit the home stretch of the regular season. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 01, 2019, 08:41:45 PM
Final: Allegheny 80  Wabash 68

Allegheny pulls the big upset knocking off #14 Wabash in Meadville.  Shooting percentage was the difference in this game as the Little Giants only shot 36.6% from the floor including a cold second half where they only made 10 of 33 shots.  Jack Davidson led Wabash again with 27 points but he was only 7 of 20 from the field.  Jordan Rawls was unstoppable for the Gators with 31 points and overall, Allegheny shot 41.7% to register the win.

Wooster at 12-1 now has a one game conference lead on Wabash who is now 11-2.  Scots at OWU tomorrow.  Little Giants at Hiram.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 02, 2019, 05:01:55 PM
Final: Wooster 76  Ohio Wesleyan 74

Wooster escapes from Delaware with a tough road win as OWU misses a three pointer at the buzzer that would have won the game.  Scots were actually down 72-66 and rallied to win the game.  Danyon Hempy had 23 points, Dontae Williams had 16 and Trenton Tipton had 13 points including a huge three pointer near the end that put Wooster back into the lead.  Dontae Williams had an ankle sprain/injury near the end of the game so it will be interesting to see if he is able to play next week.

Scots retain a one game lead over the Little Giants as Wabash knocked off Hiram today.

Wooster is now 18-3, 13-1 NCAC  :)

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on February 02, 2019, 05:48:11 PM
Just noticed that Wabash's Jack Davidson is working on a string of 59 straight free throws made.  He's 98/100 on FTs since late December. And 77 of his last 78. Seriously, some streak.  For the season his FT% is .926.  Wabash as a team is shooting .811.  I hope I'm not jinxing anybody.
      Good comeback today for the LGs with a win v. Hiram.  They have to finish out and let the chips fall.  Wooster is not likely to lose again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 03, 2019, 12:24:23 PM
Quote from: sigma one on February 02, 2019, 05:48:11 PM
Just noticed that Wabash's Jack Davidson is working on a string of 59 straight free throws made.  He's 98/100 on FTs since late December. And 77 of his last 78. Seriously, some streak.  For the season his FT% is .926.  Wabash as a team is shooting .811.  I hope I'm not jinxing anybody.
      Good comeback today for the LGs with a win v. Hiram.  They have to finish out and let the chips fall.  Wooster is not likely to lose again.

Single season FT streak record for d3 is 66, so he's not far off.  The career record (over multiple seasons) is 84.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on February 04, 2019, 09:24:03 AM
Davidson's actual streak is 67 consecutive free throws made. He finished the Wilmington game making 17-of-18 free throws, but he closed out the game making eight of his last eight attempts after going 1-2 from the line with 10:21 remaining in the game. The 67 (and counting heading into Wednesday's game at DePauw) would eclipse the NCAA Division III record.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 04, 2019, 09:50:54 AM
Quote from: wabashsid on February 04, 2019, 09:24:03 AM
Davidson's actual streak is 67 consecutive free throws made. He finished the Wilmington game making 17-of-18 free throws, but he closed out the game making eight of his last eight attempts after going 1-2 from the line with 10:21 remaining in the game. The 67 (and counting heading into Wednesday's game at DePauw) would eclipse the NCAA Division III record.

Quote from: sigma one on February 02, 2019, 05:48:11 PM
Just noticed that Wabash's Jack Davidson is working on a string of 59 straight free throws made.  He's 98/100 on FTs since late December. And 77 of his last 78. Seriously, some streak.  For the season his FT% is .926.  Wabash as a team is shooting .811.  I hope I'm not jinxing anybody.
      Good comeback today for the LGs with a win v. Hiram.  They have to finish out and let the chips fall.  Wooster is not likely to lose again.

I had counted 59 also, but upon further inspection, the Wooster game on 1/26 isn't located in the right sequence when I click on Davidson's game-by-game lines.  So going backward:
2/2 vs. Hiram: 5-5 (5)
2/1 vs. Allegheny: 10-10 (15)
1/26 vs. Wooster: 8-8 (23)
1/23 vs. OWU: 7-7 (30)
1/18 vs. Denison: 13-13 (43)
1/16 vs. DePauw: 0-0 (43)
1/12 vs. Kenyon: 0-0 (DNP) (43)
1/9 vs. Wittenberg: 8-8 (51)
1/5 vs. Oberlin: 8-8 (59)
12/29 vs. Bryant & Stratton: 0-0 (59)
12/28 vs. Wilmington: made the last 8 attempts after missing at 10:21 2H (67)

I think this is certified.  And impressive. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 04, 2019, 11:48:41 AM
Keep in mind that Jack Davidson has broken the single-season consecutive FTM record previously set at 66 by James Jones of Delaware Valley eight seasons ago. The career all-time consecutive FTM streak in D3 belongs to Dirk Rhinehart of Kalamazoo, who made 84 in a row spanning the 2000-01 and 2001-02 seasons.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 04, 2019, 12:02:07 PM
I feel like I'm underselling this.  Jack Davidson just did a thing that has never, ever been done in D3 men's basketball.  Wow doesn't quite cover it. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on February 04, 2019, 01:02:13 PM
Yes, I was wrong on my count.  I did just as Wally did, leading to a miscount.  Wow, 67 straight.  Keep it going, Jack.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: URBAN4PREZ on February 06, 2019, 09:42:26 AM
Big game tonight in Greencastle.  I thought DPU played Wabash tough in the season's first matchup, and I would expect a rowdy crowd for tonight's game.  I'm not ready to predict a victory for the Tigers, but a Wabash loss could push Wooster further out of reach and could give Wittenberg a shot at the 2 seed.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 06, 2019, 10:30:50 AM
Quote from: URBAN4PREZ on February 06, 2019, 09:42:26 AM
Big game tonight in Greencastle.  I thought DPU played Wabash tough in the season's first matchup, and I would expect a rowdy crowd for tonight's game.  I'm not ready to predict a victory for the Tigers, but a Wabash loss could push Wooster further out of reach and could give Wittenberg a shot at the 2 seed.

They're all big for Wabash at this point.  Friday's Allegheny result probably puts the 1 seed out of reach for Wabash unless they get some serious help elsewhere (OWU nearly did it on Saturday).  The top seed isn't what I'm looking at now.  These games over the next two weeks are huge for Wabash to bolster/preserve their at-large profile.  The goal, certainly, is to qualify automatically but games like this one tonight have to end up in the W column for Wabash to stay on the right side of the bubble should they require an invitation. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 06, 2019, 04:17:59 PM
Here are the first rankings for the men this season: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2019/02/men-regional-rankings-first
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 06, 2019, 11:07:26 PM
Final:  Wooster 73  Denison 63    Wooster shot poorly in first half and got back on track in the second.  Dupler & Hempy combined for 50 points.

Wooster is now 19-3 overall, 14-1 NCAC

Final:  DePauw 94  Wabash 79   Jack Davidson had 40 points but DePauw shot 63.5% from the floor and made 11 of 17 three point shots!

Wabash is now 18-4 overall, 12-3 NCAC

Securing wins in the remaining games is critical for both teams to be considered for a Pool C bid and/or a NCAA hosting site in the first round.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 07, 2019, 07:44:50 AM
Any update on the status of Dontae Williams for the Scots? It looked like he was being helped back to the locker room (favoring an ankle) after the OWU game, and he didn't play against the Big Red. It would be a big loss not to have him available against the Tigers (both of them) and in the post-season. I think we saw last night that the Scots don't have great depth inside and were struggling when Bulic was out with foul trouble.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: URBAN4PREZ on February 07, 2019, 08:31:08 AM
Don't look now, but Wittenberg is quietly working it's way back into the conversation.  Four straight wins by double-digits, and two straight by more than twenty-five points.  The next two games (@ Wooster and vs. Wabash) will be season-determining.  A Pool C bid still seems like a very remote possibility, but I think they could make a run in the conference tournament if they stay hot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on February 07, 2019, 08:39:10 AM
In the Wabash loss at DePauw last night Jack Davidson was 13/13 free throws.  This extends his NCAA DIII record to 80 straight from the foul line.  The previous record was 67 straight  within a single season.  Davidson is closing in on the all-time (over two seasons) record of 84. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 07, 2019, 08:54:43 AM
Quote from: URBAN4PREZ on February 07, 2019, 08:31:08 AM
Don't look now, but Wittenberg is quietly working it's way back into the conversation.  Four straight wins by double-digits, and two straight by more than twenty-five points.  The next two games (@ Wooster and vs. Wabash) will be season-determining.  A Pool C bid still seems like a very remote possibility, but I think they could make a run in the conference tournament if they stay hot.

I believe that Witt even still has a chance to be the #1 seed in the NCAC tourney, as I think they would hold the tie-breaker if they win out and the Scots lose out. Although it seems unlikely that the Scots will lose to Oberlin, but stranger things have happened!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 07, 2019, 09:40:49 AM
Last night concludes a four game road swing for Wabash which definitely could have gone better.  Wabash dropped three of these four games and are spinning out a little bit here with the NCAA tournament just right there in front of them.  This is eerily reminiscent of 2010-2011 when Wabash raced out to a 13-0 record, earned a top 10 ranking, then alternated wins and losses for about six weeks, lost to Wittenberg in the league semis and finished just outside of the NCAA tournament.  In that stretch, Wabash lost games to Denison and Hiram- the kinds of "bad" losses that are exceedingly hard to shake when they come at the tail end of the season when people are paying attention.  The Allegheny and DePauw losses this time around have a similar feel to me.  I think Wabash is going to need to win at Wittenberg next week (3-22 all time in Springfield) and make the NCAC final to be in Pool C.  A sixth loss was one too many in 2011 and it might be one too many in 2019 as well.

A couple of things have stood out to me on this four game patch. 
- The balance that Wabash thrived with through the first 17-ish games has gone missing.  Davidson can go get his points whenever he wants, but it's been the contributions of others that have elevated Wabash to Top 25 material.  Hallstrom has been solid in the post, but a lot of other guys that were chipping in are in funks right now.  Gotta shake that off. 
- Wabash gave up 91, 80, 80, and 94 in these games.  That's putting an enormous amount of pressure on the offense which is not running at optimal efficiency as previously noted.
- Against Wooster and DePauw, the LGs started extremely slow, got behind big, and just couldn't get all the way back.  They did get within 1 in the second half against Wooster and were in a 1 possession game late there.  Last night Wabash cut a 16-point halftime deficit down to 9 pretty quickly in the second half, but couldn't get any closer as the Tigers blacked out and turned into the Warriors for 40 minutes.  It's just really, really difficult to get down 15+ points and figure out a way to win.  Particularly against above average to good teams. 

So Wabash has a couple of weeks here and hopefully six more games to get right and earn the right to play more games.  They'll need to get back to starting games better and somebody other than Davidson and Hallstrom are going to have to make a shot.  Those things haven't happened and that's how you drop three out of four at a critical time.  There's absolutely not a better time ever for a home game against Kenyon and hopefully Wabash can use Saturday afternoon to get right again. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 07, 2019, 12:06:38 PM
I have Wabash squarely on the bubble at the moment.  They don't necessarily have to beat Witt next Wednesday AND in an NCAC tourney semifinal, but the LGs certainly cannot afford to lose both of those games.

Witt is quietly getting back into the conversation.  If they were to get three big wins over the next two weeks (at Woo, vs Wabash, & Wabash again in the semis), I think they're certainly in.  Winning two of those three might be enough for Witt to earn a Pool C berth.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on February 09, 2019, 06:12:53 PM
Davidson was 9/9 FTs today in Wabash's win over Kenyon.  He now at 89 in a row.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 09, 2019, 06:18:22 PM
Quote from: sigma one on February 09, 2019, 06:12:53 PM
Davidson was 9/9 FTs today in Wabash's win over Kenyon.  He now at 89 in a row.

Which is the all-time D3 record, even across seasons.  Anyone know if he has yet attained the all-time all-divisions record?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on February 09, 2019, 06:28:47 PM
The all-time NCAA record is 94 free throws made in a row by Paul Cluxton from Northern Kentucky University (DII). Davidson surpassed the DI mark of 85 owned by Darnell Archey from Butler University.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Mr. Ypsi on February 09, 2019, 06:51:52 PM
Quote from: wabashsid on February 09, 2019, 06:28:47 PM
The all-time NCAA record is 94 free throws made in a row by Paul Cluxton from Northern Kentucky University (DII). Davidson surpassed the DI mark of 85 owned by Darnell Archey from Butler University.

Thanks.  I once made 27 in a row in my driveway, and thought I was really hot sh*t!  I'm just in awe of such a streak under game conditions, where sometimes you're exhausted!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 09, 2019, 08:51:16 PM
Final:  Wittenberg 84  Wooster 74

Congrats to Wittenberg on a well played game.  Wooster played a terrible first half shooting only 30% from the floor which meant that they trailed by 13 points at the half.  Scots also played poor defense giving up far too many layups and some wide open three point shots to the Tigers.  The result of this poor defense was Wittenberg shooting 51% for the game compared to only 44% for Wooster.

Wooster is now 19-4, 14-2 NCAC.  Scots have a one game NCAC lead with 2 games left to be played.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 13, 2019, 03:25:20 PM
The second week Regional Rankings have been released: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2019/02/men-regional-rankings-second
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 13, 2019, 03:44:51 PM
Not real great news for the LGs here, but not a death sentence either.  There's (probably) two games left with Wittenberg so Wabash is in control of their positioning here.  Tonight's game is massive.  I don't think you can slide to third in the league and then climb back up over Wittenberg in the RRs even with a semifinal win on a neutral floor.  It's got to be tonight. 

I had been concerned with Wilmington lurking around in the rankings last week and sure enough, that oddball December game is haunting the LGs a little bit today.  As if there were ever any doubts- all the pieces matter. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 13, 2019, 04:06:31 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 13, 2019, 03:44:51 PM
Not real great news for the LGs here, but not a death sentence either.  There's (probably) two games left with Wittenberg so Wabash is in control of their positioning here.  Tonight's game is massive.  I don't think you can slide to third in the league and then climb back up over Wittenberg in the RRs even with a semifinal win on a neutral floor.  It's got to be tonight. 

I had been concerned with Wilmington lurking around in the rankings last week and sure enough, that oddball December game is haunting the LGs a little bit today.  As if there were ever any doubts- all the pieces matter.

As we always say ... a game in November means as much as a game in February.

And an entire resume absolutely matters. Those who not-so-great out of conference schedules have to realize how much those things matter.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 13, 2019, 04:27:48 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 13, 2019, 03:44:51 PM
Not real great news for the LGs here, but not a death sentence either.  There's (probably) two games left with Wittenberg so Wabash is in control of their positioning here.  Tonight's game is massive.  I don't think you can slide to third in the league and then climb back up over Wittenberg in the RRs even with a semifinal win on a neutral floor.  It's got to be tonight. 

I had been concerned with Wilmington lurking around in the rankings last week and sure enough, that oddball December game is haunting the LGs a little bit today.  As if there were ever any doubts- all the pieces matter.

I think Wabash likely needs the 3-0 sweep of Wittenberg, reaching the NCAC final, to have a good shot at a Pool C berth.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 13, 2019, 09:49:15 PM
Final:  Wooster 94  Oberlin 86

Wooster knocks off Oberlin who shot very well in this game.  Scots led by Reece Dupler with 26 points, Trenton Tipton with 16, Danyon Hempy with 15 and Keonn Scott also with 15.

With Wabash losing at Wittenberg tonight, Wooster clinches their 18th NCAC regular season title!  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 13, 2019, 09:52:21 PM
With the win tonight, Wooster is now 20-4 on the season.

Congratulations to Wooster Coaches Steve Moore, Doug Cline and their staff on 23 consecutive seasons of 20 wins or more!  :)

Amazing streak which is a Division III record!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 14, 2019, 06:38:30 AM
I can't remember the entire list of tiebreakers, but I was able to find these:

1) Head to head
2) Combined record against all teams above the tied teams
3) Record versus individual opponents examined in descending order of standings

For Witt and Wabash, if they both win on Saturday then Witt gets the #2 seed based on their sweep of Allegheny. If they both lose, I have no idea what would happen. They would still be tied, but now the first teams that they have a different record against would be Hiram or Oberlin, whichever is higher in the standings.  But Hiram and Oberlin would also be tied, and it would seem that their tiebreaker would be dependent on whether Witt or Wabash is #2. I'm not sure how that circular situation is resolved, but maybe it is addressed in other tiebreaker rules.

And its still possible for there to be a 3-way tie with DePauw, Hiram, and Oberlin for 4 - 6.

Anyway, we do know that Wooster will host Allegheny on Tuesday, and that OWU will be the #7 seed and play at Witt or Wabash.  Seems like the Scots have played the Gators frequently in the first round of the tourney and that those games are usually much closer than anticipated.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on February 14, 2019, 09:33:49 AM
Davidson was 3/3 FTs last night.  He is now at 92 straight--and counting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 14, 2019, 11:08:02 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 14, 2019, 06:38:30 AM
I can't remember the entire list of tiebreakers, but I was able to find these:

1) Head to head
2) Combined record against all teams above the tied teams
3) Record versus individual opponents examined in descending order of standings

For Witt and Wabash, if they both win on Saturday then Witt gets the #2 seed based on their sweep of Allegheny. If they both lose, I have no idea what would happen. They would still be tied, but now the first teams that they have a different record against would be Hiram or Oberlin, whichever is higher in the standings.  But Hiram and Oberlin would also be tied, and it would seem that their tiebreaker would be dependent on whether Witt or Wabash is #2. I'm not sure how that circular situation is resolved, but maybe it is addressed in other tiebreaker rules.

And its still possible for there to be a 3-way tie with DePauw, Hiram, and Oberlin for 4 - 6.

Anyway, we do know that Wooster will host Allegheny on Tuesday, and that OWU will be the #7 seed and play at Witt or Wabash.  Seems like the Scots have played the Gators frequently in the first round of the tourney and that those games are usually much closer than anticipated.

This is what was published this fall for the football tiebreak situation (h/t to David Jablonski for tracking this down and printing it):
Quote
1. Head-to-Head result(s) between tied teams.
2. Result(s) versus individual opponents examined in descending order, individually, until tie is broken. The first team to have beaten a higher ranked team that is a common opponent wins the tiebreaker. If the tie is not broken in the descending order review, start from the bottom of the standings and examine opponents in ascending order. The first team to have lost to a lower-ranked team loses the tiebreaker.
3. Number of conference wins by the conference opponents you defeated. Team whose opponents they defeated had the highest number of wins breaks the tie.
4. Number of conference wins by the conference opponents you lost to. Team whose opponents they lost to had the highest number of wins breaks the tie.
5. The team with the longest active winning streak in conference games at the end of the season.
6. The team with the best overall record.
7. Coin Toss.

So, assuming this list applies to all sports and is not football-specific, Allegheny does indeed break the tie (assuming Witt and Wabash win on Saturday). 

Whether Wabash ends up seeded 2 or 3 in the tournament, I do think the LGs have to win 3 games next week to keep playing. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 15, 2019, 03:20:50 PM
Quote from: sigma one on February 14, 2019, 09:33:49 AM
Davidson was 3/3 FTs last night.  He is now at 92 straight--and counting.

That is absolutely incredible.  I wouldn't have made 92 straight lay ups alone in the gym when I was playing hoops!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on February 16, 2019, 03:53:37 PM
Jack Davidson made his first 3 FTs today, giving him 95 in a row, and the all-time, all-division NCAA record.  He missed his fourth attempt and ended the day 10 of 12.  (He missed again in the second half.)  He was 99 of 100 at one point.   Not to put too fine a point on it, but Davidson just did something no NCAA player--ever--has achieved.  (The NBA FT record is 97 straight.)  Think about that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 16, 2019, 04:42:55 PM
Final: Wooster 81  DePauw 70

Nice road win by Wooster as they pick up a regionally ranked win vs. DePauw.  Wooster was led by Danyon Hempy with 29 points and Reece Dupler with 20 points.

Wooster is now 21-4, 16-2 NCAC  :)

Next up is Allegheny at home on Tuesday in the first round of the NCAC tourney.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 16, 2019, 06:25:29 PM
He missed twice today- time to get that kid a shot doctor.  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashsid on February 16, 2019, 06:51:33 PM
Jack made his last two attempts. He's now 93 away from tying the record set by.....  :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 17, 2019, 03:50:49 PM
One man's quick tourney preview...

This really looks like its going to be another Witt - Woo final, with a possibility that the winner might get to host the first weekend of the NCAA tourney.


First round games:

Allegheny at Wooster – 7:00 PM
Previous results
12/5 Wooster 101 – 84 at Wooster
1/23 Wooster 81 – 72 at Allegheny

The Scots haven't lost a first-round game since ??? and its hard to see it happening this year.


Ohio Wesleyan at Wittenberg – 6:00 PM
Previous results
1/16 Wittenberg 98 – 94 (OT) at OWU
2/6 Wittenberg 91 – 58 at Wittenberg

Witt has been the best team in the league the last month, and OWU is not the team that they've been the past few years.  Witt should take this one, but it feels like it might be close.


Hiram at Wabash – 7:00 PM
Previous Results
12/21 Wabash 102 – 61 at Wabash
2/2 Wabash 95 – 80 at Hiram

Which Wabash team will show up – the one that ran through the first half of the league schedule unscathed, or the one that played .500 the second half? Or does it matter? Tough draw for Hiram to have to go all the way to Wabash for a Tuesday night game.


Oberlin at DePauw – 6:00 PM
Previous Results
12/8 – Oberlin 66 – 58 at DePauw
1/26 – DePauw 68 – 57 at Oberlin

DePauw has been pretty good the second half of the season, beating Wabash and Witt in Greencastle, but they also lost to OWU and Hiram. They mostly stayed in the game with the Scots on Saturday and it could have been more interesting if they could have stayed out of file trouble. Oberlin hasn't won a tourney game since at least 1999 – and this might their best chance in all that time.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 17, 2019, 04:35:06 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 17, 2019, 03:50:49 PM
One man's quick tourney preview...

This really looks like its going to be another Witt - Woo final, with a possibility that the winner might get to host the first weekend of the NCAA tourney.

imderekpoe - thanks for the tourney preview.  It sure would be nice for Wooster to use their newly renovated gym to host the first weekend of the NCAA tourney. :)  If Hempy, Dupler and Williams play some solid games, the Scots could advance a few rounds in the NCAA tourney.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 17, 2019, 11:00:07 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 17, 2019, 03:50:49 PM
Allegheny at Wooster – 7:00 PM
Previous results
12/5 Wooster 101 – 84 at Wooster
1/23 Wooster 81 – 72 at Allegheny

The Scots haven't lost a first-round game since ??? and its hard to see it happening this year.

1996. 7th-seeded OWU beat 2nd-seeded Wooster 71-62. The Scots have never lost an NCAC quarterfinal game as a #1 seed.

First time since 2011 that Wooster and Allegheny meet in the quarterfinals. That one was quite a scare -- the Scots escaped with a 62-57 victory (http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2010-11/releases/20110222u6lp9i) after being down 9 points with under 6 minutes to go.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 19, 2019, 02:33:27 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 17, 2019, 03:50:49 PM
One man's quick tourney preview...

This really looks like its going to be another Witt - Woo final, with a possibility that the winner might get to host the first weekend of the NCAA tourney.


First round games:

Allegheny at Wooster – 7:00 PM
Previous results
12/5 Wooster 101 – 84 at Wooster
1/23 Wooster 81 – 72 at Allegheny

The Scots haven't lost a first-round game since ??? and its hard to see it happening this year.


Ohio Wesleyan at Wittenberg – 6:00 PM
Previous results
1/16 Wittenberg 98 – 94 (OT) at OWU
2/6 Wittenberg 91 – 58 at Wittenberg

Witt has been the best team in the league the last month, and OWU is not the team that they've been the past few years.  Witt should take this one, but it feels like it might be close.


Hiram at Wabash – 7:00 PM
Previous Results
12/21 Wabash 102 – 61 at Wabash
2/2 Wabash 95 – 80 at Hiram

Which Wabash team will show up – the one that ran through the first half of the league schedule unscathed, or the one that played .500 the second half? Or does it matter? Tough draw for Hiram to have to go all the way to Wabash for a Tuesday night game.


Oberlin at DePauw – 6:00 PM
Previous Results
12/8 – Oberlin 66 – 58 at DePauw
1/26 – DePauw 68 – 57 at Oberlin

DePauw has been pretty good the second half of the season, beating Wabash and Witt in Greencastle, but they also lost to OWU and Hiram. They mostly stayed in the game with the Scots on Saturday and it could have been more interesting if they could have stayed out of file trouble. Oberlin hasn't won a tourney game since at least 1999 – and this might their best chance in all that time.

I think what makes this tournament particularly intriguing is that while there are clear favorites in each of tonight's games, I don't think any result would be crazy because:

- While Wooster is the top seed, Allegheny isn't far away from having beaten Wabash and Jordan Rawls can be the best player on the floor on any game.  He isn't always the best player on the floor, but he can be.  He's one of the more overlooked players in the league, IMO.  Roberts has been playing well lately also for Allegheny.  If they can not get knocked out in the first half tonight at Timken, and they can play a two man game with those two well then, who knows. 

- OWU has gone in fits and starts in the year 1 A.N (After Nate) and have scuffled their way to the #7 seed.  They're playing the hottest team in the league tonight, BUT Mike Dewitt is a really good coach and maybe he can find 40 minutes of brilliance tonight.  Not out of the question. 

- As noted, Wabash hit a hard road stretch in the second half of league play and didn't fare so well.  The LGs are undefeated at home this year and it's a long trip for Hiram, but man, Hiram has some dudes and if Wabash can't get scoring from Davidson + Eberhard + one other guy (from my viewpoint, it's been the disappearance of a third scoring option that has tripped Wabash up in the last 3 weeks), Hiram is going to have a shot tonight. 

- Oberlin and DePauw seem to be trending in different directions and Oberlin is making the trip all the way back out to Indiana for the second time in four days.  That's tough.  But, Oberliln has won at DePauw this season so duplicating that December result wouldn't be crazy. 

I do think the home teams are all winning tonight, but I don't think any of these games are gimmes for the favorites.  Looking forward to a fun night of tournament hoops. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 19, 2019, 03:21:56 PM
If Dontae Williams ever chooses to assert himself in the post I believe Wooster could be a very good team.  Probably a player or two away from a great team but very good nonetheless. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 19, 2019, 07:32:04 PM
Naturally, Scots go into the break down 8, 48-40 Gators. Allegheny ended the half on a 10-0 run. Gators have looked good on offense, and Roberts with 18, Rawls with 14. For the Scots, Hempy has 16.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 19, 2019, 08:28:51 PM
Wooster escapes, 91-89. Dupler with the game-winning bucket with 3 seconds to go, Rawls missed a 30-footer at the buzzer. Impressive performance from the Gators -- we'll see more from them in the NCAC next year I suspect.

Wooster was down as many as 13 in the second half (66-53) and trailed 75-65 before going on a 17-6 run to take their first second-half lead at 82-81 with 4 minutes left. That one could've gone either way. As it is, Scots survive and advance and will host this weekend's NCAC semifinals and final.

Elsewhere:
Oberlin 62
DePauw 66

OWU 51
Wittenberg 73

Hiram 76
Wabash 87 (Jack Davidson had 47!)  :o :o

Friday games from Timken Gym in Wooster:
#3 Wabash
#2 Wittenberg

#4 DePauw
#1 Wooster
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 19, 2019, 08:50:10 PM
Escapes is an understatement!  They pulled a hat out of a rabbit!  What a defensive effort down the stretch!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 19, 2019, 08:55:42 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 19, 2019, 08:28:51 PM
Hiram 76
Wabash 87 (Jack Davidson had 47!)  :o :o

Davidson went 15-16 from the line, what a slacker. What's gotten into him?!?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 20, 2019, 03:40:10 PM
The third public NCAA Division III regional rankings are out: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2019/02/men-regional-rankings-third
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 21, 2019, 09:43:50 AM
A programming note: Friday's schedule has Wooster-DePauw playing the first game at 5:30, followed by Wabash-Wittenberg at 7:30. Winners will play at 4 pm on Saturday.

http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2018-19/releases/20190218g79dzi
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 21, 2019, 09:59:12 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 21, 2019, 09:43:50 AM
A programming note: Friday's schedule has Wooster-DePauw playing the first game at 5:30, followed by Wabash-Wittenberg at 7:30. Winners will play at 4 pm on Saturday.

http://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2018-19/releases/20190218g79dzi

Have they always done it this way?  It feels weird to lead off the double header with the home team.  Also wouldn't have minded some partisan support from Scot fans vs. Wittenberg.   :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 21, 2019, 10:00:50 AM
Question for any Wabash fans... Who are you pulling for on Friday?  I assume that you'd rather not play Wooster (esp at home) if you make it to the finals, but would you ever root for DePauw?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 21, 2019, 10:01:44 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 21, 2019, 10:00:50 AM
Question for any Wabash fans... Who are you pulling for on Friday?  I assume that you'd rather not play Wooster (esp at home) if you make it to the finals, but would you ever root for DePauw?


My understanding is that it was Wooster's option and they chose to play the early game.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 21, 2019, 10:33:32 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 21, 2019, 10:00:50 AM
Question for any Wabash fans... Who are you pulling for on Friday?  I assume that you'd rather not play Wooster (esp at home) if you make it to the finals, but would you ever root for DePauw?

Definitely not rooting for DePauw, but if they win, they win.  The bigger issue is going to be Friday night against a team that has morphed into the Dan Russ era Tigers.  I'd be happy to see Wabash playing anybody on Saturday with a chance to win a championship. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 21, 2019, 01:17:24 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 21, 2019, 10:01:44 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 21, 2019, 10:00:50 AM
Question for any Wabash fans... Who are you pulling for on Friday?  I assume that you'd rather not play Wooster (esp at home) if you make it to the finals, but would you ever root for DePauw?


My understanding is that it was Wooster's option and they chose to play the early game.

When the conference moved up the start time of the Saturday championship game from 7:00 to 4:00 (just a couple of years ago), it was also agreed that the home team would have the choice of whether to play in the first or second semifinal on Friday evening.  I recall that host Wittenberg also chose the early game last year, to allow a little more recovery time before the final.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 21, 2019, 02:39:29 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 21, 2019, 01:17:24 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 21, 2019, 10:01:44 AM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 21, 2019, 10:00:50 AM
Question for any Wabash fans... Who are you pulling for on Friday?  I assume that you'd rather not play Wooster (esp at home) if you make it to the finals, but would you ever root for DePauw?


My understanding is that it was Wooster's option and they chose to play the early game.

When the conference moved up the start time of the Saturday championship game from 7:00 to 4:00 (just a couple of years ago), it was also agreed that the home team would have the choice of whether to play in the first or second semifinal on Friday evening.  I recall that host Wittenberg also chose the early game last year, to allow a little more recovery time before the final.

Feels like overthinking it, but I've won about 800 fewer games than Steve Moore so ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Would be interesting to see the stats on this across the division- what's the tournament finals W/L record of the team that wins the late semifinal the night before?  Probably very little, if any, correlation.  The correlation is probably going to be stronger with variables like which team was seeded higher and who is playing at home. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: HopeConvert on February 21, 2019, 09:19:45 PM
Six ball screens. Awesome. 

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 22, 2019, 05:31:38 PM
There's a video link on Depauw's website
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 22, 2019, 06:09:37 PM
At the half,

DePauw 21
Wooster 44

It's been all Scots from the jump ball in this one. The shooting stats tell the story: Scots shot 17-30 (56%) for the half while holding the Tigers to 9-35 (25%) including 1-12 from long-range.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 22, 2019, 09:13:16 PM
Final: Wooster 73  DePauw 52

Final: Wittenberg 89  Wabash 75

Ohio teams win the semi-finals setting up a Witt-Woo third game this season for the NCAC tourney title and the NCAA automatic bid.

GO SCOTS! 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: bufordscot on February 23, 2019, 05:48:47 PM
Would have liked a different outcome but that was a classic D3 basketball game.  Appreciate the way Donte asserted himself in the second half.  Good things to come.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2019, 10:00:50 PM
Final: Wittenberg 79  Wooster 75

Back from Wooster where I saw a high intensity D3 classic game this afternoon.  Congratulations to the Wittenberg Tigers on a very well played game and securing the automatic bid into the NCAA tourney.  They may end up hosting in the first weekend due to this impressive win.

Major kudos to Wooster Senior Reece Dupler who had 33 points on 13 of 19 shooting and by himself kept Wooster in this game to the very end.

As a Wooster fan, I attribute this loss to two major factors:
1. If you allow the other team to shoot 55% from the floor and score 79 points, you will not win most of the games.  Too many layups given to Witt.

2. If your best player spends 45% of the game on the bench, you will not win most of the games.  Danyon Hempy has 50% of the responsibility for this stat because he committed some dumb fouls.  He must play 75% of the game for Wooster to have a good chance at a victory.  The Wooster coaches bear the other 50% of the responsibility because they only played him 9 minutes in the 2nd half and HE DID NOT FOUL OUT OF THE GAME.  Making Hempy sit for over 8 minutes after his 4th foul and then only reinserting him with ~4 minutes left in the game and Wooster down by 4 points was a bad decision.  Hempy should have been reinserted with 7-8 minutes left so he could have more time to impact the outcome of the game.

Newsflash: if Wooster is going to make any noise in the NCAA tourney, then both Hempy and Dupler need to play more than 30 minutes in each game!

Regardless of how many fouls either star player accumulates, PLAY THEM because there is no next game in the NCAA's when you lose with them sitting on the bench.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: MUC57 on February 24, 2019, 02:10:00 PM

wooscotsfan

I feel your pain. Baldwin-Wallace 79, Mount Union 75. Score sound familiar? But life goes on - so will The Scots and The Purple Raiders! We'll get 'Em next time. 🏀  ;D
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2019, 08:14:58 AM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on February 23, 2019, 10:00:50 PM
Back from Wooster where I saw a high intensity D3 classic game this afternoon.  Congratulations to the Wittenberg Tigers on a very well played game and securing the automatic bid into the NCAA tourney.  They may end up hosting in the first weekend due to this impressive win.

I think they've earned that.  After a weird January (lost at home to Denison, played four overtime games against bottom half teams) that culminated in an OT loss at DePauw, Wittenberg flipped a switch.  In the four weeks since that last loss, they're on a ten game shredder wherein they've won twice at Wooster and kicked the crap out of everybody else they've played.   They are playing as well as anybody in the division right now and I'm not sure they shouldn't be the top ranked team in the region when we see those final rankings. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2019, 01:10:27 PM
Wittenberg draws Emory...on a neutral court at Guilford, who hosts Sewanee. I must say that's quite surprising. Perhaps the Tigers didn't file to host?

Wooster hosts a pod, facing Baruch, with Wheaton (Il) and Hanover in the other game. A surprise hosting assignment for Timken Gym, and the Scots first hosting duties since 2014 I believe.

Other hosts in Wooster's quadrant are Augustana, Oswego St, and Marietta. As fantastic50 pointed out on twitter, if hosts swept the first weekend, neither Marietta nor Oswego could make it to overall top-seed Augustana. In that case, Wooster or Marietta could serve as a second-weekend geographical host.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 25, 2019, 02:46:02 PM
Augustana can't get to Marietta, as even there to Wooster is right at the 500-mile limit.  I think they will need to fly someone if Augustana & either Marietta or Oswego advance but Wooster does not.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: imderekpoe on February 25, 2019, 02:48:12 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 25, 2019, 02:46:02 PM
Augustana can't get to Marietta, as even there to Wooster is right at the 500-mile limit.  I think they will need to fly someone if Augustana & either Marietta or Oswego advance but Wooster does not.

Wasn't there a conversation (on another board) that Wooster to Augustana is 500 miles, but Augustana to Wooster was over 500?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on February 25, 2019, 03:02:32 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2019, 01:10:27 PM
Wittenberg draws Emory...on a neutral court at Guilford, who hosts Sewanee. I must say that's quite surprising. Perhaps the Tigers didn't file to host?

That's a terrible draw for the Tigers. Emory is very, very good, much better than the Eagles' #23 ranking indicates.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: URBAN4PREZ on February 25, 2019, 05:22:49 PM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2019, 01:10:27 PM
Wittenberg draws Emory...on a neutral court at Guilford, who hosts Sewanee. I must say that's quite surprising. Perhaps the Tigers didn't file to host?

Wooster hosts a pod, facing Baruch, with Wheaton (Il) and Hanover in the other game. A surprise hosting assignment for Timken Gym, and the Scots first hosting duties since 2014 I believe.

Other hosts in Wooster's quadrant are Augustana, Oswego St, and Marietta. As fantastic50 pointed out on twitter, if hosts swept the first weekend, neither Marietta nor Oswego could make it to overall top-seed Augustana. In that case, Wooster or Marietta could serve as a second-weekend geographical host.

I have it on pretty solid authority that Wittenberg did not apply to host due to a gym conflict.  Take that for what you will as there was no guarantee they would have hosted anyway.  But that may have been costly scheduling conflict considering their draw. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 25, 2019, 06:31:07 PM
Wow.  I mean...just.  Wow.  Would love to know what Croci has to say (off the record) about that. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 25, 2019, 06:55:13 PM
 A gym conflict?  What could possibly trump the team that plays in that gym hosting NCAA tourney games??  It has to be a camp or something that can't be moved. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 25, 2019, 07:27:38 PM
Quote from: imderekpoe on February 25, 2019, 02:48:12 PM
Quote from: fantastic50 on February 25, 2019, 02:46:02 PM
Augustana can't get to Marietta, as even there to Wooster is right at the 500-mile limit.  I think they will need to fly someone if Augustana & either Marietta or Oswego advance but Wooster does not.

Wasn't there a conversation (on another board) that Wooster to Augustana is 500 miles, but Augustana to Wooster was over 500?

Yep, has to do with the one-way circular driveway going into the parking lot at Timken Gym...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 25, 2019, 08:31:57 PM
Not sure what the NCAA chart says, but I got 495 or 499 (depending on the particular route) via Google Maps.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 25, 2019, 08:45:30 PM
Thinking about this more, this is really the most favorable draw (relative to seeding/resume) I can remember for the Scots. Unexpectedly hosting, with a fair and winnable pod, then with possible second weekend hosting chances thanks to bracket geography. Lots to do before worrying about that, of course, but for a team that is 22-8 all time at home in the NCAAs and 13-20 everywhere else, lucking into a home pod is a tremendous draw.

About those pods: by fantastic50's "best team" rankings:

Wooster #15
Baruch #99

Wheaton #31
Hanover #69

Meanwhile, Wittenberg not only doesn't host even though they ended up GL#1, they get a much tougher draw:

Guilford #24
Sewanee #67

Wittenberg #11
Emory #16

Wittenberg may have to beat two of fantastic50's top #25, one in a true road game, to reach the Sweet Sixteen, while the Scots wouldn't face a team of that caliber until the second weekend.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 25, 2019, 09:19:38 PM
To any Wooster fans:

Prior to the renovation of Timken Gym, the whole side opposite the team benches was general admission seating.  Can anyone tell me if that's still the case, or have some of the lower seats on that south half become reserved during the regular season?  And what about Friday night, all GA on that side, or for that matter, in the whole gym?

Thanks, WB

PS - With no advanced sales, they must be confident that they won't sell out, because they wouldn't want to leave fans at the door, right?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: hasanova on February 25, 2019, 10:28:13 PM
Congratulations to Wittenberg on your NCAA berth!  Being in the tournament is always a good thing.

At today's watch party on Guilford's campus, most of us were expecting to travel to Atlanta and face an all Southern field. 

With that said, however, GC is obviously happy to host and would like to welcome the Emory Eagles, the Sewanee Tigers and the Wittenberg Tigers to Greensboro, NC, Guilford College and Ragan Brown Fieldhouse.  As a Guilford alumnus, long time Greensboro resident and President of the Quaker Club (boosters), I'd be happy to answer questions about logistics, parking, restaurants and lodging.  The college and on-campus fieldhouse are located at 5800 W. Friendly Ave, Greensboro, NC 27410.  The campus is in suburban west Greensboro and is easily accessible via I-40, I-73, I-85 and US 220.

Safe travels!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on February 26, 2019, 08:33:02 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on February 25, 2019, 09:19:38 PM
To any Wooster fans:

Prior to the renovation of Timken Gym, the whole side opposite the team benches was general admission seating.  Can anyone tell me if that's still the case, or have some of the lower seats on that south half become reserved during the regular season?  And what about Friday night, all GA on that side, or for that matter, in the whole gym?

Thanks, WB

PS - With no advanced sales, they must be confident that they won't sell out, because they wouldn't want to leave fans at the door, right?

I believe that it's all GA (though with sections designated for fans of each visiting team) during all post-season play.  Regarding the regular season, the center section on the south side was designed (with nicer seats) to allow for reserved seats there, but I am unsure of whether any were actually sold as season tickets.  The Rebounders are graying, as is our core fan base more broadly, just like in many other D3 hotbeds, so attendance is lower than it was a decade ago.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 26, 2019, 01:31:05 PM
Each school is alloted a certain number of tickets. I have to check the breakdown again, as I don't have that memorized, but schools are given a certain number of tickets for the arena - and their seats designated in the gym. If a school doesn't use all their tickets, they are returned and sold to general admission. Yes, the home team usually gets a little bit more seats, but not a lot.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 26, 2019, 01:54:30 PM
With the amount of winning Wittenberg has done in Timken in the last two weeks, they should have let Witt host a pod there and put Wooster on a bus to Guilford.   :o
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 26, 2019, 02:06:48 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 26, 2019, 01:54:30 PM
With the amount of winning Wittenberg has done in Timken in the last two weeks, they should have let Witt host a pod there and put Wooster on a bus to Guilford.   :o

Should have let? Wally ... it is understood Witt didn't put in to host.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 26, 2019, 02:12:02 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 26, 2019, 02:06:48 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 26, 2019, 01:54:30 PM
With the amount of winning Wittenberg has done in Timken in the last two weeks, they should have let Witt host a pod there and put Wooster on a bus to Guilford.   :o

Should have let? Wally ... it is understood Witt didn't put in to host.

Funniest thing said on this site in 25 years and you missed the humor, thinking he was being serious?  Geeze. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 26, 2019, 02:27:05 PM
I know Wally pretty well ... I usually pick up on his humor. I wasn't sure he was kidding. :)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 26, 2019, 03:14:33 PM
I'm so dry that even the googly eye emoji didn't land.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 26, 2019, 04:31:15 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on February 26, 2019, 03:14:33 PM
I'm so dry that even the googly eye emoji didn't land.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

I missed that the emoji represented that. Sorry.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2019, 11:24:58 AM
All-NCAC Honors have been announced:

First Team
Jack Davidson, Wabash
Reece Dupler, Wooster
Danyon Hempy, Wooster
Jordan Rawls, Allegheny
Connor Seipel, Wittenberg

Player of the Year: Jack Davidson, Wabash
Top Defensive Player: Mitch Balser, Wittenberg
Newcomer of the Year: Ethan Stanislawski, Ohio Wesleyan
Coach of the Year: Steve Moore, Wooster

Second Team
Mitch Balser, Wittenberg
Eric Bulic, Wooster
Harrison Hallstrom, Wabash
Eli Silverman-Lloyd, Oberlin
Ethan Stanislawski, Ohio Wesleyan

Honorable Mention
Matt Doyle, Denison
Christian Fioretti, Oberlin
Nolan Ginther, DePauw
Marcel Rice, Hiram
Brian Roberts, Jr., Allegheny
Carter Powell, Kenyon

http://northcoast.org/sports/mbkb/2018-19/files/All-NCACmbkb19.pdf

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on February 28, 2019, 09:29:06 AM
For antsy Wooster fans, here's a three-week old video of the Barookadookas playing at Brooklyn College.  I looked at their stats and found them to be a poor-shooting team, across the board, but one that looks like they can rebound and play some D.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gYD9slPw5sY
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on February 28, 2019, 11:44:33 AM
Quote from: kiltedbryan on February 27, 2019, 11:24:58 AM
All-NCAC Honors have been announced:

First Team
Jack Davidson, Wabash
Reece Dupler, Wooster
Danyon Hempy, Wooster
Jordan Rawls, Allegheny
Connor Seipel, Wittenberg

Player of the Year: Jack Davidson, Wabash
Top Defensive Player: Mitch Balser, Wittenberg
Newcomer of the Year: Ethan Stanislawski, Ohio Wesleyan
Coach of the Year: Steve Moore, Wooster

Second Team
Mitch Balser, Wittenberg
Eric Bulic, Wooster
Harrison Hallstrom, Wabash
Eli Silverman-Lloyd, Oberlin
Ethan Stanislawski, Ohio Wesleyan

Honorable Mention
Matt Doyle, Denison
Christian Fioretti, Oberlin
Nolan Ginther, DePauw
Marcel Rice, Hiram
Brian Roberts, Jr., Allegheny
Carter Powell, Kenyon

http://northcoast.org/sports/mbkb/2018-19/files/All-NCACmbkb19.pdf

4 out of 5 first teamers are underclassmen.  Many others on 2nd team and HM are as well.  This is going to be a very fun and very good league next year. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on March 01, 2019, 07:13:20 PM
Wittenberg advances with a fairly business-like 100-88 win over Emory. Witt maintained a fairly stable 8-10 point lead through most of it, I think Emory cut it to 5 once or twice in the second half.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 01, 2019, 09:13:43 PM
It's a good thing that Baruch is a team of very limited ability, because Wooster is playing a version of basketball with which I am not familiar.  Unforced turnovers, poorly-advised shots taken by the wrong people.  It goes on and on, but will end tomorrow night unless there are big improvements.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 01, 2019, 09:20:35 PM
Wooster has upgraded their gym, but they still have the blurriest video feed on the internet.  They no longer even have replay.  I won't mention the lead announcer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2019, 12:58:31 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 01, 2019, 09:20:35 PM
Wooster has upgraded their gym, but they still have the blurriest video feed on the internet.  They no longer even have replay.  I won't mention the lead announcer.

It is clearly a bad, or antiquated, camera.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on March 02, 2019, 01:11:52 PM
Final:  Wooster 81  Baruch 57

Wooster played well enough to win in a sloppy NCAA tourney game.  Stout defense held Baruch to 33% from the floor and Wooster's rebounding advantage was +9 (40 vs. 31)  However, the Scots had 19 turnovers which will be a recipe for a loss if they do this against Wheaton tonight.

Aston Francis of Wheaton leads D3 in scoring because he is automatic at the free throw line and deadly from three point range.  Francis had 42 points, 13 rebounds and made 8 of 16 three point shots to lead the Thunder past Hanover.  He is an impressive player to watch and Wooster will have to play their best game if they are going to get past Wheaton tonight.

Congrats to Wittenberg on their win over Emory.  NCAC was 2-0 in the first round.  OAC was 3-0 so 5 Ohio teams are in the 2nd round.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 02, 2019, 04:30:01 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2019, 12:58:31 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 01, 2019, 09:20:35 PM
Wooster has upgraded their gym, but they still have the blurriest video feed on the internet.  They no longer even have replay.  I won't mention the lead announcer.

It is clearly a bad, or antiquated, camera.

It's high-def compared to Webster's video feed, which I likened in the SLIAC room to someone jiggling a Picasso painting in front of the camera.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on March 02, 2019, 06:25:56 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on March 02, 2019, 04:30:01 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 02, 2019, 12:58:31 AM
Quote from: Wooster Booster on March 01, 2019, 09:20:35 PM
Wooster has upgraded their gym, but they still have the blurriest video feed on the internet.  They no longer even have replay.  I won't mention the lead announcer.

It is clearly a bad, or antiquated, camera.

It's high-def compared to Webster's video feed, which I likened in the SLIAC room to someone jiggling a Picasso painting in front of the camera.

I always thought that the key to bringing a Picasso painting into focus would be to jiggle it... ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 26, 2019, 05:32:39 PM

http://wooster.prestosports.com/sports/mbkb/2018-19/releases/20190326pdfkcd
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on August 26, 2019, 02:00:51 PM
Wooster's 2019-2020 Seven Non-Conference Games are now evident:

Home Games (5)
11/12 - Medaille (NY)
11/23 - Wilmington (2nd game of Al Van Wie tourney, Hiram on 11/20 is the 1st game)
11/27 - Mount Union
12/28 - Keene State (NH) (Mose Hole Kiwanis Classic/Great Lakes Invitational)
12/29 - Whitworth (WA) (Mose Hole Kiwanis Classic/Great Lakes Invitational)

Neutral Games (2)
12/15 - Mauro Panaggio Tourney in Daytona Beach, FL (Brockport State, NY is the official host)
12/16 - Mauro Panaggio Tourney in Daytona Beach, FL (not clear yet who are the 2 other teams at this tourney besides Wooster & Brockport)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: fantastic50 on September 03, 2019, 08:59:17 AM
https://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2019-20/schedule (https://www.woosterathletics.com/sports/mbkb/2019-20/schedule)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on October 21, 2019, 03:44:36 PM
Thought I would just throw this on here:

Wabash should be solid again this season.

Returning starters:
G: Jack Davidson, JR., 25.1 PPG - 26 GS
G: Connor Rotterman, JR. 7.3 PPG - 15 GS (stopped starting at midyear)
G: Tyler Watson, So. 9.4 PPG - 11 GS (started to start at midyear)
F: Alex Eberhard, Sr. 6.7 PPG - 27 GS
F: Harry Hallstrom, Sr. 12.6 PPG - 26 GS
W: Kellen Schrieber, So. 8.9 PPG - 5 GS (started in place of injuries)

Wabash averaged 86.2 points a game last year and only lose 8.7 PPG to graduation/transfers.
Senior wing Ben Stachowski started 24 games and scored 3.8 points a game
Senior post Logan White played in 26 games scoring 2.1 a game
Sophomore Conner Brens played in 25 games scoring 1.9 a game (not playing)
Freshman Niah Williamson played in 4 games scoring 0.8 a game (transfer, I believe for football)

The starting 5 will likely be

PG: Jack Davidson - JR
SG: Tyler Watson - SO
SF: Kellen Schreiber - SO
PF: Alex Eberhard - SR
C: Harry Hallstrom - SR

First couple guys off the bench will likely be (freshmen below could change it): Connor Rotterman - JR, Jayden Edwards - SO, Colten Garland - SR, Jack Hegwood - SO
Players who can easily come off the bench but not likely in the top 9 are: Matt Chinn - JR, Parker Manges - SR

All of the above is based off of last year.

HOWEVER

Wabash has a very, very good freshman class and I would not be surprised in the least to see these first two freshmen play minutes. They all were highly sought after among various levels.

Justin Hensley - 6'4 G
Ahmoni Jones - 6'4 G/W
Reis Thomas - 6'3 W/F (football player so he'll be working his way in)
Cam Chadd - 6'2 G (transfer in, sophomore)

They also have as incoming freshmen who likely won't play a ton:

Jeremy Norvell - 5'10 G
Ty Bever - 5'11 G
Nate Butts - 5'9 G
Tristan Bufkin - 6'5 F
Trey Waddups - 6'1 G (I believe is a sophomore who didn't play last season)

This is going to be a team that plays very fast as they only have one true post player. They have a ton of guys who can slide down and play the five, however. Going to be a great year in Crawfordsville.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Li'l Giant on October 29, 2019, 11:35:35 AM
I miss anything here over the last......several years? Besides Wabash getting good enough to be ranked in the preseason poll?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on October 31, 2019, 04:26:27 PM
The preseason NCAC coaches poll has been released.

http://www.northcoast.org/sports/mbkb/2019-20/files/2019-20_NCAC_Men-s_Basketball.pdf
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on October 31, 2019, 11:26:00 PM
IWU scrimmages #14 Wabash tomorrow in Bloomington.  Possible starters...

IWU (18-9)
G - Grant Wolfe, 5-11/185 Jr.   6.5 ppg, 2.1 rpg, 2.8 apg
G - Keondre Schumacher, 5-11/175 So.
G - Pete Lambesis, 6-4/195 So.  3.7 ppg, 1.8 rpg
F - Doug Wallen, 6-5/210 Jr.  7.9 ppg, 4.4 rpg
C - Alex O'Neill, 6-9/245 Sr.  6.9 ppg, 3.9 rpg

Wabash (21-6)
G - Jack Davidson, 6-1/170 Jr.    25.1 ppg, 3.3 rpg, 2.5 apg
G - Tyler Watson, 6-2/185 So.    9.4 ppg, 2.8 rpg
F - Kellen Schreiber, 6-5/210 So.   8.9 ppg, 2.9 rpg
F - Alex Eberhard, 6-6/190 Sr.   6.7 ppg, 4.1 rpg
C - Harry Hallstrom, 6-8/220 Sr.   12.6 ppg, 8.1 rpg
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on November 02, 2019, 12:04:54 AM
A small recap of the Wabash/Illinois Wesleyan scrimmage:

I was told both of the following scores - 90-90 and 90-89 in favor of Wabash (who cares anyhow)

Harry Hallstrom scored 24
Tyler Watson scored 24
Kellen Schrieber scored 18
Ahmoni Jones scored 16

Jack Davidson got hurt 12 minutes in after scoring 5 points.


That's all I've got.

I'm sure TitanQ will have more.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 02, 2019, 01:58:28 AM
It wasn't Wabash vs. Wheaton. It was Wabash vs. Illinois Wesleyan.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 02, 2019, 02:24:59 AM
Quote from: CollegeGolf18 on November 02, 2019, 12:04:54 AM
A small recap of the Wabash/Wheaton scrimmage:

I was told both of the following scores - 90-90 and 90-89 in favor of Wabash (who cares anyhow)

Harry Hallstrom scored 24
Tyler Watson scored 24
Kellen Schrieber scored 18
Ahmoni Jones scored 16

Jack Davidson got hurt 12 minutes in after scoring 5 points.


That's all I've got.

I'm sure TitanQ will have more.

This is Olympic level lede-burying. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on November 02, 2019, 01:31:44 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 02, 2019, 02:24:59 AM
Quote from: CollegeGolf18 on November 02, 2019, 12:04:54 AM
A small recap of the Wabash/Wheaton scrimmage:

I was told both of the following scores - 90-90 and 90-89 in favor of Wabash (who cares anyhow)

Harry Hallstrom scored 24
Tyler Watson scored 24
Kellen Schrieber scored 18
Ahmoni Jones scored 16

Jack Davidson got hurt 12 minutes in after scoring 5 points.


That's all I've got.

I'm sure TitanQ will have more.

This is Olympic level lede-burying. 

That was intentional, too. ;)
Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 02, 2019, 01:58:28 AM
It wasn't Wabash vs. Wheaton. It was Wabash vs. Illinois Wesleyan.

Good call. I had Wheaton on my mind for some reason.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on November 02, 2019, 01:32:58 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 02, 2019, 02:24:59 AM
Quote from: CollegeGolf18 on November 02, 2019, 12:04:54 AM
A small recap of the Wabash/Wheaton scrimmage:

I was told both of the following scores - 90-90 and 90-89 in favor of Wabash (who cares anyhow)

Harry Hallstrom scored 24
Tyler Watson scored 24
Kellen Schrieber scored 18
Ahmoni Jones scored 16

Jack Davidson got hurt 12 minutes in after scoring 5 points.


That's all I've got.

I'm sure TitanQ will have more.

This is Olympic level lede-burying.

LOL!

"The Titanic's orchestra entertained passengers and officers this evening in a gala event in the ship's main ballroom. Following a dinner of prime rib and lobster Newburg, all in attendance were treated to splendid renditions of traditional Strauss waltzes and an array of orchestral adaptations of various European folk dances. Titanic Captain Edward Smith was heard to remark that it was the most magnificent musical performance that he had ever heard in his eight years as commodore of the White Star Line."

paragraph two

paragraph three

paragraph four

paragraph five

"In other news, at 11:40 pm ship's time the Titanic struck an iceberg. The ship sank at 2:20 am, and of the 2,224 passengers and crew aboard over 1,500 are feared lost."
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on November 02, 2019, 01:41:49 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on November 02, 2019, 01:32:58 PM
Quote from: wally_wabash on November 02, 2019, 02:24:59 AM
Quote from: CollegeGolf18 on November 02, 2019, 12:04:54 AM
A small recap of the Wabash/Wheaton scrimmage:

I was told both of the following scores - 90-90 and 90-89 in favor of Wabash (who cares anyhow)

Harry Hallstrom scored 24
Tyler Watson scored 24
Kellen Schrieber scored 18
Ahmoni Jones scored 16

Jack Davidson got hurt 12 minutes in after scoring 5 points.


That's all I've got.

I'm sure TitanQ will have more.

This is Olympic level lede-burying.

LOL!

"The Titanic's orchestra entertained passengers and officers this evening in a gala event in the ship's main ballroom. Following a dinner of prime rib and lobster Newburg, all in attendance were treated to splendid renditions of traditional Strauss waltzes and an array of orchestral adaptations of various European folk dances. Titanic Captain Edward Smith was heard to remark that it was the most magnificent musical performance that he had ever heard in his eight years as commodore of the White Star Line."

paragraph two

paragraph three

paragraph four

paragraph five

"In other news, at 11:40 pm ship's time the Titanic struck an iceberg. The ship sank at 2:20 am, and of the 2,224 passengers and crew aboard over 1,500 are feared lost."

I was a stringer for newspapers for six years. I am surprised and happy that you guys caught that. LOL
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on November 04, 2019, 09:10:47 AM
Davidson injured.  Anyone know how badly?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on November 04, 2019, 05:35:52 PM
Quote from: sigma one on November 04, 2019, 09:10:47 AM
Davidson injured.  Anyone know how badly?

He should be good for the Centre game, not playing in Wednesday's scrimmage though. Neither is Eberhard.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wally_wabash on November 04, 2019, 10:12:35 PM
Quote from: CollegeGolf18 on November 04, 2019, 05:35:52 PM
Quote from: sigma one on November 04, 2019, 09:10:47 AM
Davidson injured.  Anyone know how badly?

He should be good for the Centre game, not playing in Wednesday's scrimmage though. Neither is Eberhard.

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Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 05, 2019, 11:41:23 AM
If you're gonna have injuries, have 'em now.

The CWU women has a 14 player roster. In our exhibition against Whitworth, we dressed 8 due to ankle sprains, bad backs, and a concussion. One of the 8 was on a minutes limit due to an ankle problem. If it was a regular season game I think 12 would have dressed out.

Our men beat Idaho in an exhibition. We have a roster of 15, but dressed out 10 due to various injuries as well (broken finger, ankle issues, a minor knee injury, and 'off court shenanigans').

Here's to healthy regular seasons!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on November 06, 2019, 06:10:15 PM
Hiram plays Kent State tonight. Will be interested to see how they do -- they return all but one player from a decent but inconsistent team last year. I think Antonio McQueen is set for a huge year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Smitty Oom on November 12, 2019, 10:09:10 PM
Wooster 110-100 over Medaille... when did they start running the system and how did I miss that!?  ;D ??? ;)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on November 14, 2019, 06:32:45 PM
Wabash gets their season underway tonight vs. a very solid Centre squad that is senior-laden.

Look for the starters to be

Jack Davidson (Jr.)
Tyler Watson (So.)
Alex Eberhard (Sr.)
Kellen Schrieber (So.)
Harry Hallstrom (Sr.)

First guys off the bench will likely be Jack Hegwood (So.), Ahmoni Jones (Fr.), Justin Hensley (Fr.), Colten Garland (Sr.), Conner Rotterman (Jr.). Look for Wabash to play a small lineup at times this year too. I'll be interested to see how Coach Brum plays with Harry off the floor as he is the only true post on the team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on November 14, 2019, 08:17:13 PM
Quote from: CollegeGolf18 on November 14, 2019, 06:32:45 PM
Wabash gets their season underway tonight vs. a very solid Centre squad that is senior-laden.

Look for the starters to be

Jack Davidson (Jr.)
Tyler Watson (So.)
Alex Eberhard (Sr.)
Kellen Schrieber (So.)
Harry Hallstrom (Sr.)

First guys off the bench will likely be Jack Hegwood (So.), Ahmoni Jones (Fr.), Justin Hensley (Fr.), Colten Garland (Sr.), Conner Rotterman (Jr.). Look for Wabash to play a small lineup at times this year too. I'll be interested to see how Coach Brum plays with Harry off the floor as he is the only true post on the team.

Starters were actually:

Davidson
Watson
Garland
Schrieber
Hallstrom
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on November 14, 2019, 08:42:01 PM
Wabash loses a heartbreaker to Centre, but as I said before, Centre is a good squad. Definitely a case of first-game jitters for Wabash both in the first half and in the last five minutes of the game.

I'll have a little more later this evening as the live stats get posted.

Quick hits:

Wabash turned the ball over 11 more times than Centre and shot 69% from the FT line.
Jack Davidson could have *likely* iced the game up by 3 with 17 seconds left, but missed the front end of the 1-and-1.
Kellen Schrieber also missed a FT up by 1 with less than 10 seconds left.
Davidson is still one of the best players in the country.

They'll learn from this one and get better for sure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on November 15, 2019, 04:19:32 PM
I knew coming in that it would be a tough game and one that Wabash could easily lose. Centre is a solid team, however, Wabash played really badly besides a stretch of about 15 minutes in the second half. Centre really gritted it out and stuck together for the win. You could definitely tell that Centre had played two games already and Wabash had played none.

Wabash had 10 more turnovers than Centre and they were 9 of 13 at the line. Jack Davidson (set the NCAA record for most FT makes in a row with 95 last year) had a FT attempt with 15 seconds remaining to put it to a two possession game but missed the front end of a 1-and-1.

Centre made more winning plays than Wabash down the stretch and they came out with a great win.

I'll also say I have never seen more charge calls called in a basketball game in my life. There were 10 charges called amongst both teams.

Here is the box score for those wondering: https://sports.wabash.edu/sports/mens-basketball/stats/2019-2020/centre-college/boxscore/10843
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: econboy87 on November 18, 2019, 01:04:32 PM
Oberlin has looked impressive in their first three games. 6-8 Freshman Dorde Otasevic is an outside threat and also clogs up the middle good on defense. The rest of their team is senior laden with good chemistry. Look for a top five NCAC finish this year and 15-17 wins very possible. The league has not had this much talent from top to bottom for years.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 19, 2019, 03:20:10 PM
Quote from: econboy87 on November 18, 2019, 01:04:32 PM
Oberlin has looked impressive in their first three games. 6-8 Freshman Dorde Otasevic is an outside threat and also clogs up the middle good on defense. The rest of their team is senior laden with good chemistry. Look for a top five NCAC finish this year and 15-17 wins very possible. The league has not had this much talent from top to bottom for years.

That's an interesting development if we see the Yeomen build on their 12-14 (6-12 NCAC) campaign from last year. The coaches poll put Oberlin 6th, sorta by themselves (OWU 10 points higher at #5, Hiram 7 points lower at #7). I do see that Otasevic has slotted in as a starter adding 12 ppg / 6 rebs per game in the early going.

If Oberlin wants to make some real noise, perfect opportunity coming up fast: they host Wittenberg next Tuesday. Interestingly...that will already be Oberlin's 6th game, but only Witt's 3rd.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on November 19, 2019, 04:14:22 PM
Quote from: econboy87 on November 18, 2019, 01:04:32 PM
Oberlin has looked impressive in their first three games. 6-8 Freshman Dorde Otasevic is an outside threat and also clogs up the middle good on defense. The rest of their team is senior laden with good chemistry. Look for a top five NCAC finish this year and 15-17 wins very possible. The league has not had this much talent from top to bottom for years.

I'll second the love for Oberlin.  They looked good early, but it is a long season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 19, 2019, 07:47:25 PM
Quote from: CollegeGolf18 on October 31, 2019, 04:26:27 PM
The preseason NCAC coaches poll has been released.

http://www.northcoast.org/sports/mbkb/2019-20/files/2019-20_NCAC_Men-s_Basketball.pdf

The talk of Oberlin took me back to the Coaches' Poll and I don't think there's ever been one this close among three teams at the top. I looked through the past several years' polls and this was the first time since 2011-12 season that three teams received #1 votes, and I'm willing to guess it might be the only time in conference history three teams each got multiple #1 votes.

2019-20 North Coast Athletic Conference
Preseason Men's Basketball Coaches' Poll
(first-place votes in parentheses, followed by total points)
MEN
1.    Wittenberg (3)    91
2.    Wooster (4)      90
3.    Wabash (3)    89
4.    DePauw        62
5.    Ohio Wesleyan    55
6.    Oberlin    45
7.    Hiram    38
8.    Allegheny    37
9.    Denison    28
10.    Kenyon    15
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on November 20, 2019, 08:42:47 PM
Hiram 70
Wooster 98

It was a 7-point game at the half (39-32), but Wooster piled in 59 second half points on 64% shooting to win going away. Hempy with 27, Tipton 14, Jaylen Franklin 13, Donate Williams 12, and 13 Scots put points on the board tonight.

For Hiram, Brodgie Gordon with 24, Jalen Kirksey 18.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on November 24, 2019, 06:30:32 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=1i7wp/9iy83jvzxctpweb0.jpg)

Each season there are a few teams that get out to starts that makes everyone turn their heads. There are always a few "wait, what?!" "They beat who?!" And even a, "are they seriously (say record)?!"

Yes, they are. And thus we should talk to them.

On Sunday's Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), hear from a few coaches who have their teams out to blazing starts. UW-Platteville women are undefeated with wins over No. 18 Chicago and No. 4 Wartburg. William Peace women have equaled their win total from last season and defeated No. 15 Christopher Newport. And Oberlin men started undefeated and off to one of the program's best starts.

Hear from each of their coaches on what is working so well early in the season and if they can continue to surprise and steal headlines the rest of the season.

Plus, Bob Quillman and Ryan Scott return with a look at where the Top 25 now sits with the first in-season poll coming up on Monday. Find out who Bob, Ryan, and Dave select for their Dubious, Deep Dive, and Debatable selections are ahead of the Week 1 poll.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Sunday's show LIVE starting at 7:00 p.m. ET here: www.d3hoopsville.com or http://bit.ly/34fV7IZ.

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or use any of the social media options.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Kelly McNiff, UW-Platteville women's coach
- Grahm Smith, William Peace women's coach
- Isaiah Cavaco, Oberlin men's coach
- Bob Quillman & Ryan Scott, Top 25 Double-Take

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
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Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on November 26, 2019, 12:06:04 PM
Quote from: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on November 24, 2019, 06:30:32 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=1i7wp/9iy83jvzxctpweb0.jpg)

Each season there are a few teams that get out to starts that makes everyone turn their heads. There are always a few "wait, what?!" "They beat who?!" And even a, "are they seriously (say record)?!"

Yes, they are. And thus we should talk to them.

On Sunday's Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com), hear from a few coaches who have their teams out to blazing starts. UW-Platteville women are undefeated with wins over No. 18 Chicago and No. 4 Wartburg. William Peace women have equaled their win total from last season and defeated No. 15 Christopher Newport. And Oberlin men started undefeated and off to one of the program's best starts.

Hear from each of their coaches on what is working so well early in the season and if they can continue to surprise and steal headlines the rest of the season.

Plus, Bob Quillman and Ryan Scott return with a look at where the Top 25 now sits with the first in-season poll coming up on Monday. Find out who Bob, Ryan, and Dave select for their Dubious, Deep Dive, and Debatable selections are ahead of the Week 1 poll.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Sunday's show LIVE starting at 7:00 p.m. ET here: www.d3hoopsville.com or http://bit.ly/34fV7IZ.

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or use any of the social media options.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Kelly McNiff, UW-Platteville women's coach
- Grahm Smith, William Peace women's coach
- Isaiah Cavaco, Oberlin men's coach
- Bob Quillman & Ryan Scott, Top 25 Double-Take

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
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As always, great show Dave. Really glad there's a podcast I can listen to on my drives.

NCAC posters: The NCAC and particularly Wabash was discussed for a few minutes in the Top 25 Talk portion with Bob, Dave, and Ryan. Worth a listen.
And you also have the obvious portion of the show with Cavaco -- great interview and insight.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 07, 2019, 03:50:40 PM
Final:  Wooster 79  Wabash 74

Key win for Wooster as they beat the Little Giants. :)  Scots were led by Danyon Hempy with 21 points and Dontae Williams with 19 points.  Wooster held Jack Davidson to only 13 points on 4 of 14 shooting from the floor.

Wooster is now 5-1, 3-0 NCAC.  Next game is vs. St. John Fisher at the Dayton Beach tournament

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wooster Booster on December 07, 2019, 07:15:41 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 07, 2019, 03:50:40 PM
Final:  Wooster 79  Wabash 74

Wooster is now 5-1, 3-0 NCAC.  Next game is vs. St. John Fisher at the Dayton Beach tournament

GO SCOTS!

Cool that they now have beaches in Dayton, but I'm surprised that they're open in December.  (Working hard here to avoid a payback typo. :))
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2019, 10:01:20 PM
Final: #24 Wooster 87  #14 Whitworth 82  :)

Just returned from Wooster where I watched the Scots knock off #14 Whitworth in a well played game.  Wooster shot 55% from the floor and outrebounded the Pirates 32 to 29 to win this very competitive game.

Wooster was led by Keonn Scott with 29 points, Dontae Williams with 20 and Danyon Hempy with 18.  Keonn Scott was selected as the Great Lakes Invitational MVP and Dontae Williams also made the All Tournament team.

Wooster has now beaten two solid teams, in Whitworth and Brockport State, that will probably each win their respective conferences.

Wooster is now 9-1, 3-0 NCAC.  Next game is at Ohio Wesleyan on 1/4.

GO SCOTS!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on December 29, 2019, 10:05:05 PM
Quote from: wooscotsfan on December 29, 2019, 10:01:20 PM
Final: #24 Wooster 87  #14 Whitworth 82  :)

Just returned from Wooster where I watched the Scots knock off #14 Whitworth in a well played game.  Wooster shot 55% from the floor and outrebounded the Pirates 32 to 29 to win this very competitive game.

Wooster was led by Keonn Scott with 29 points, Dontae Williams with 20 and Danyon Hempy with 18.  Keonn Scott was selected as the Great Lakes Invitational MVP and Dontae Williams also made the All Tournament team.

Wooster has now beaten two solid teams, in Whitworth and Brockport State, that will probably each win their respective conferences.

Wooster is now 9-1, 3-0 NCAC.  Next game is at Ohio Wesleyan on 1/4.

GO SCOTS!

Not having Isaiah Hernandez really hurt Whitworth.  College did a beyond admirable job trying to do everything, just not enough.  Full strength or not, it'll be a good win for Wooster's resume for sure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 31, 2019, 12:42:56 PM
Checked Massey Ratings this morning to see which NCAC team has played the toughest schedule so far.

Here is the current Strength of Schedule ranking for the NCAC teams with winning records:

Ohio Wesleyan #19
Wabash #55
Wooster #68

Oberlin #110
Allegheny #214
Wittenberg #225

Witt is undefeated but they have played some real cupcakes and only one team ranked by Massey in the top 100 (Hanover).  By comparison, OWU has played 5 teams ranked in the top 100, Wabash has played 4 and Wooster has played 4.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wooscotsfan on December 31, 2019, 01:58:20 PM
Looked at two other season to date metrics for how the best NCAC teams are playing vs. their opponents -- Rebounding Margin and Opponents' Assists to Turnovers ratio:

On the Rebounding Margin metric, Wittenberg has the best number:

Wittenberg +8.4
Wabash  +7.5
Wooster +3.5
Allegheny +3.4
OWU  +3.1
Oberlin +2.0

On the Opponents Assist to Turnover ratio, Wooster has the best number: (a number below 1.0 means that your opponents have more turnovers than assists)

Wooster 0.69
Wittenberg 0.79
Allegheny 0.91
Oberlin 1.05
Wabash 1.14
OWU 1.23
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 09, 2020, 05:35:26 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=3v0vj/6gxukfnazjaz94k1.jpg)

If you look at the calendar, we are midway through the 2019-20 regular season. While there are probably more games ahead than behind for many teams, we now find ourselves looking at the half of the campaign.

What have we learned so far? Anything?

We may not be able to answer all of those questions, but we will see if we can turn over a few more rocks to find more clues on Thursday night's Hoopsville.

We will chat with a men's program that has gone from obscurity to at least being in the conference and regional conversation (if not national). Another men's program is about as high as they can go in the national convo, but do we really know how good they are and is there pressure to win it all? Plus a women's team many of you might not be talking about now, but probably will be chatting about come tournament time.

Tonight is also the season debut of the WBCA Center Court segment. We talk to Randy Tuggle, the head coach at Greensboro, on why the season is the perfect distraction for a far bigger priority. Tuggle chats with us about his battle with pancreatic cancer and how his team (and family) have been there every step of the way.

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Sunday's show LIVE in the following ways:
- Main page: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville
- Show page: http://bit.ly/2QZpezb (or www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2019-20/jan9)
- Facebook Live Simulcast: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville (only the first 45 minutes aired; may have had a copyright problem haha)
- YouTube Simulcast: www.youtube.com/d3hoopsville
- Team1 Sports: www.team1sports.com/Hoopsville/
- Team1 Sports app (https://team1sports.com/) (Android TV, Amazon Fire, Apple TV, Roku) - you will either find it under the "live" section or search for the Hoopsville channel

Thursday's show primarily covers the East, Great Lakes, Mid-Atlantic, and West Regions while also featuring a women's coach in the WBCA Center Court segment. All men's coaches appear in the NABC Coach's Corner. And all guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline.

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to hoopsville@d3hoops.com or use any of the social media options.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Rich Murphy, Redlands women's coach
- Randy Tuggle, Greensboro women's coach (WBCA Center Court)
- Sean Coffey, Utica men's coach
- Matt Croci, No. 2 Wittenberg men's coach

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
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Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 18, 2020, 05:57:31 PM
Wittenberg 86
Wooster 98

Scots put forth a shooting master class in front of 2,500+ at Timken gym in what could be Steve Moore's final home game against Wittenberg. Scots hit 63% overall and 54% from 3 to run away and hide from the Tigers.

Final score is closer than it was: Scots led 52-33 at half and maintained a 20+ point lead until the final 2 minutes when a couple turnovers and missed foul shots let Wittenberg narrow the final margin.

Wittenberg falls to 14-1, 7-1 NCAC. Scots improve to 13-2, 7-1 NCAC.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: kiltedbryan on January 28, 2020, 08:40:54 PM
Some unfortunate news out of Wooster, via twitter (https://twitter.com/ScotsBasketball/status/1221873230299852800):

"Some sad news to share. As some of you already know, Justin Warnes '12 passed away on Thursday. "Warnesy" was a 3-year letterwinner, a key member of our 2011 national runner-up team, and a dear friend to many associated with our program." Obituary: https://www.newcomertoledo.com/Obituary/180687/Justin-Warnes/Toledo-OH

Justin Warnes was a tenacious defender, perhaps the best and most utilized defensive specialist Steve Moore ever had. His assignment was the opposition's best offensive player, and his strategy was to make that player earn every single point all night long, nothing easy. He knew his role and executed it to perfection.

Undoubtedly his signature game was in one of the best DIII games I've ever watched: the NCAA Elite Eight against Whitworth in 2011. Warnes's job? Contain Whitworth's consensus DIII National Player of the Year Michael Taylor. Taylor got his points that night, netting 25, but on 8-20 shooting (40%) vs. his 53% season average, and Taylor committed an uncharacteristic seven turnovers. Warnes was a huge part of making Taylor work all night. For added measure, Warnes himself went 4-5 from the field for 11 points, including one electrifying dunk early in the first half. (If you follow the link to Wooster's twitter account, the image in their post is of that dunk). It was one of only two games that season where Warnes touched double figures.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on February 03, 2020, 07:24:41 PM
Wow, taken far too young.  It sounds like he was a great young man.  Prayers for his family. 
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 12, 2020, 03:16:19 PM
First Regional Rankings are out: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2020/02/men-regional-rankings-first
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on February 16, 2020, 07:38:02 AM
The Little Giants have won seven in a row after a win yesterday at Kenyon.

HUGE game at home against Witt. this coming Wednesday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 19, 2020, 01:15:16 PM
Week 2's Regional Rankings are out: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2020/02/men-regional-rankings-second
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 25, 2020, 02:39:45 PM
The Week 3 men's regional rankings are out: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2020/02/men-regional-rankings-third
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: econboy87 on March 03, 2020, 11:08:15 AM
I have seen several Division III games this year and the talent level continues to impress. What people sometimes overlook is that these student athletes are paying to play at this level because of their love for the game and for some a chance to be a big fish in a small pond. There are your Duke and Carolinas in Division III too, but just as impressive are that the majority of D3 teams never take a night off. They are constantly fighting to stay with and play with the more tradition laden teams. The NCAC saw that this year with every team either upsetting a top tier program or at the least fighting to the final horn. Wooster and Wittenberg are reaping the awards, but they would not be the teams they are without the others pushing them to perform the best each night. I wish good luck to the Scots led by potential 1st team All-American Danyon Hempy and the Senior dominated Tigers and look forward to 2021 when the others continue to close the gap.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on March 05, 2020, 04:09:09 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=6qldo/d0hc2yt7zhtbhulo.jpg)

The Division III Men's and Women's Basketball Tournaments are set to get going. It all starts at 1:00 p.m. ET on Friday with the first men's game.

However, before you get fully wrapped up in the games make sure you go into it fully informed.

That means tuning into Hoopsville on Thursday night for our tournaments preview episode. We will not only take a fresh look at the brackets, but we will also talk to a number of coaches getting their teams ready for first-round games. From a Conference Cinderella, to a couple of Conference Champions, and a coach looking to finish his career with a bang.

Guests Schedule (order subject to change):
- Kevin Jaskiewicz, Coast Guard men's coach
- Steve Moore, Wooster men's coach
- Brian Lane, Transylvania men's coach
- Carissa Sain, No. 18 Chicago women's coach
- Mike Miller, No. 19 Messiah women's coach

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch Thursday's show LIVE starting at 7:00 p.m. ET in the following ways:
- Main page: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville
- Show page: http://bit.ly/2TTWFVp (or www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2019-20/mar5)
- Facebook Live Simulcast: www.facebook.com/Hoopsville
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- Team1 Sports: www.team1sports.com/Hoopsville/
- Team1 Sports app (https://team1sports.com/) (Android TV, Amazon Fire, Apple TV, Roku) - you will either find it under the "live" section or search for the Hoopsville channel
Monday's show primarily covers the Atlantic, Central, South, and Northeast Regions. All men's coaches appear in the NABC Coach's Corner. And all guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline

Men's coaches appear in the NABC Coach's Corner. And all guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline.

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to hoopsville@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options.

Please also consider helping us out. We are accepting donations to the show - which many of you have asked about. The goal is to raise $7,500. We are approximately at $4,600 at the time of this posting.

To donate, click our PayPal link here: https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr?cmd=_s-xclick&hosted_button_id=BSRFLPUJQ9MKL&source=url

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Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Bishopleftiesdad on April 14, 2020, 07:45:13 AM
Branch Rickey getting renovated.
The Columbus Dispatch: Ohio Wesleyan to begin $4 million renovation of Branch Rickey Arena.
https://www.dispatch.com/sports/20200413/ohio-wesleyan-to-begin-4-million-renovation-of-branch-rickey-arena
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: GLbball on April 18, 2020, 01:07:16 PM
According to Hoop Dirt, Hiram is hiring Rochester assistant Taylor Roth as their next head coach. Says a current D3 head coach in NY turned the job down.

https://hoopdirt.com/d3-dirt-hiram-set-to-tab-uaa-assistant-as-next-head-coach/
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on May 15, 2020, 04:37:17 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=ae2e5/6bam6n5k2dg094d2.jpg)

With the number of significant retirements on the men's side of Division III basketball, there is plenty to talk about in the month of May. Thus, we needed a "Part 2" this month.

On this "Hoopsville Podcast: May Edition (Part 2)", we talk about what is arguably one of the most significant retirement classes of coaches in the history of Division III - especially on the men's side of things.

Pat Coleman, Ryan Scott, and Bob Quillman join Dave McHugh to chat about those who retired, the number of wins and the high-level of success they had, and even if trying to have a Mt. Rushmore of DIII coaching who might be considered (some coaches you may have forgotten about are mentioned).

Plus - if not for the number of significant retirements, the biggest news in Division III off-season so far would likely be Eric Bridgeland picking up and moving to Southern California. Bridgeland joins Dave to talk about his Whitman program, the success, and the decision to start anew at Redlands and the SCIAC.

You can listen to the podcast here: https://bit.ly/2zGESua

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) broadcasts from the WBCA/NABC Studio. All guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline. The offseason plan is to do a podcast each month. The shows will be audio-only leading up to the start of the 2020-21 when we will restart the video shows.

If you have questions, ideas, or want to interact with the show, feel free to send them to hoopsville@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options in the right-hand panel.

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville


 
   
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We also have the podcast now on Tune-In (https://tunein.com/podcasts/Sports--Recreation-Podcasts/Hoopsville-p1153539/) and others coming. We will update them once we have better abilities to do so.

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
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Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Fifth and Putnam on July 22, 2020, 03:26:38 PM
The NCAC has suspended all athletics until at least December 31, 2020.

https://sports.wabash.edu/news/2020/7/22/general-Wabash-NCAC-Fall-Sports-Announcement.aspx
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on August 10, 2020, 05:06:07 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=ev7hd/sv26ba99wwms5530.jpg)

The off season has hit August and with it has come news of Division III Fall Championships being canceled for the same reason Winter Championships were derailed and Spring Championships pulled earlier this year: COVID 19 Pandemic.

The decision came on the heals of a vast majority of DIII institutions curtailing fall sports and many pushing winter sports starts on their campuses until January at the earliest.

What does this mean for the 2020-21 season of college basketball? Specifically what does it mean for Division III? Will there be a basketball season? Will it be a six-week-or-so-sprint? Or is there a way to adjust things?

On the Mid-Summer edition of the Hoopsville Podcast, we try and get some answers to those questions. We talk to one coach who actually has put together a proposal to start the season in January, with some changes to make it work including crowning a champion in April. And we talk to an administrator who also serves on the DIII Management Council to better under stand the decisions made to cancel championships and if shift a season like basketball is even possible.

Plus, we honor the best of the best in the last decade of Division III women's basketball. Gordon Mann joins us to discuss how the 2nd D3hoops.com Women's All-Decade came together (and hints of work on the men's list).

Guests include:
- Philip Ponder, Oglethorpe men's coach
- Jason Fein, Bates Athletics Director and DIII Management Council member
- Gordon Mann, D3hoops.com Senior Editor

And of course, there is always the Hoopsville Notebook. A few things we take note of that have made headlines since the beginning of July. We also tip our hat to a few of those who have always helped the show be it's best.

You can listen to the podcast here: https://bit.ly/3kGZ962

Hoopsville (http://www.d3hoopsville.com) broadcasts from the WBCA/NABC Studio. All guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline. The offseason plan is to do a podcast each month. The shows will be audio-only leading up to the start of the 2020-21 when we will restart the video shows.

If you have questions, ideas, or want to interact with the show, feel free to send them to hoopsville@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options available.

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville


 
   
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We also have the podcast now on Tune-In (https://tunein.com/podcasts/Sports--Recreation-Podcasts/Hoopsville-p1153539/) and others coming. We will update them once we have better abilities to do so.

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) or #Hoopsville
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Hoopsville Season Archive: www.team1sports.com/Hoopsville
YouTube: www.youtube.com/d3hoopsville
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Titan Q on October 16, 2020, 04:20:30 PM
NCAC shutting down winter sports.  Ugh.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: gordonmann on October 19, 2020, 04:39:07 PM
SUNYAC does, too.

https://sunyacsports.com/general/2020-21/releases/20201019lptsbh
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on October 20, 2020, 02:35:42 PM
Quote from: Titan Q on October 16, 2020, 04:20:30 PM
NCAC shutting down winter sports.  Ugh.

Just conference play ... individual schools can continue.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 29, 2021, 07:17:06 PM
(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=npmg3/t0vp4323yzpeajt8.jpg)

The Division III basketball season technically started nearly three months ago, but it has taken until the end of January for it to start feeling like the season is really underway. Even so, only about a quarter of the division has played just a single game. Another quarter of the division will never take to the court. And in between is wide gulf of different options.

On the first video-version of Hoopsville this season, Dave McHugh is joined by much of the D3hoops.com crew, Pat Coleman and Ryan Scott, to react to what has been one of the more unique seasons ... to say it lightly.

We react to the challenges schools are facing, what coaches are grappling with on a daily basis - especially beyond games and practices, and why schools are making so many different decisions.

We also discuss what is likely the future of this season's NCAA Championship Tournaments and, more importantly, when the decision on those tournaments will be made.

Plus, will there be a Top 25? No. Well, yes. Kind of. Tune in to learn more on what's coming. Plus a lot more including Dave spinning off Pat's thoughts on those wishing to attend games.

Hoopsville is presented by D3hoops.com and airs from the WBCA/NABC Studio. You can watch the show by clicking on the video player above. Or you can listen to the podcast available on any of the service options in the right panel.

If you have questions about Division III basketball, feel free to send them and we will answer them on a the show. Email them to hoopsville@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options to the right.

You can WATCH the show or listen to the podcast here: https://bit.ly/3oASGKl or https://www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2020-21/january

Hoopsville broadcasts from the WBCA/NABC Studio. All guests are featured on the BlueFrame Technology Hoopsville Hotline.

If you have questions, ideas, or want to interact with the show, feel free to send them to hoopsville@d3sports.com or use any of the social media options available.

If you enjoy the show via the podcasts, choose your favorite avenue to listen and/or subscribe via the the following four avenues (click on the images when necessary):
SoundCloud: www.soundcloud.com/hoopsville


 
   
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We also have the podcast now on Tune-In (https://tunein.com/podcasts/Sports--Recreation-Podcasts/Hoopsville-p1153539/) and others coming. We will update them once we have better abilities to do so.

Don't forget you can always interact with us:
Website: www.d3hoopsville.com
Twitter: @d3hoopsville (http://www.twitter.com/d3hoopsville) or #Hoopsville
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Hoopsville Season Archive: www.team1sports.com/Hoopsville
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Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 03, 2021, 07:46:50 PM
DIII Championships are official canceled: https://www.d3hoops.com/notables/2021/02/committee-decides-championships-fate
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: wabashcpa on November 05, 2021, 02:42:48 PM
Wabash opens their season tomorrow at Centre.  Most players back from last season, good incoming freshman class, plus return of Davidson leads me to believe this team will be one to watch this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on January 16, 2022, 06:32:30 PM
Yesterday Wabash senior guard Jack Davidson passed Pete Metzelaars to go into second place in all-time scoring for the Little Giants with 1981 career points. Next milestone is 2,000 points.  The Wabash career scoring record is held by Josh Estelle with 2065.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on January 20, 2022, 08:25:37 AM
Davidson scored his 2,000th point last night in the Little Giants 96-70 victory over depauw.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on January 25, 2022, 04:41:50 PM
Quote from: Martindale on January 20, 2022, 08:25:37 AM
Davidson scored his 2,000th point last night in the Little Giants 96-70 victory over depauw.

Wow.  That's an incredible feat in less than 4 seasons.  Looking at his stats the consistency year to year is staggering.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on January 27, 2022, 11:47:24 AM
Today on Hoopsville - we are once again hitting the air at 1:00 PM ET.

(https://cdn.prestosports.com/action/cdn/img/mw=710/cr=n/d=6dmac/jtwpsl5ygo0p9rya.jpg)

We will try and due justice to the crazy night that was in DIII basketball. We will look back at the results from Wednesday night in men's and women's play.

Plus we continue to chat with some teams that are flying a bit under the radar. Guests include:
Tune into the show here: www.d3hoops.com/hoopsville/archives/2021-22/jan27 - an On Demand version and a podcast are available after the show gets off the air.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on January 31, 2022, 08:52:56 AM
With 31 points against the College of Wooster, your new Wabash College career scoring leader is Jack Davidson. 

Some Little Giant!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on February 10, 2022, 09:57:31 AM
Don't look now, but the Little Giants have won 14 consecutive.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dave 'd-mac' McHugh on February 15, 2022, 03:52:25 PM
Week 2 Regional Rankings - which are ranked now: https://d3hoops.com/notables/2022/02/men-regional-rankings-first
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on February 25, 2022, 10:45:08 AM
The Little Giants tip against Denison at Chadwick Court tonight at 7:30 in the NCAC semi.

This game may be delayed as we have to clear the Court after the dannies play Wooster in the other semi at 5:00.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on March 01, 2022, 10:14:22 AM
The Little Giants head to Atlanta to play Berry College on Friday.  If they win, a potential rematch against Emory awaits.  They beat Emory in November but that wasn't the playoffs and the game was played in Ohio, not Emory's home gym.  Still, I won't put anything past these Little Giants right now.

Wabash Always Fights!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 02, 2022, 07:36:29 AM
Quote from: Martindale on March 01, 2022, 10:14:22 AM
The Little Giants head to Atlanta to play Berry College on Friday.  If they win, a potential rematch against Emory awaits.  They beat Emory in November but that wasn't the playoffs and the game was played in Ohio, not Emory's home gym.  Still, I won't put anything past these Little Giants right now.

Wabash Always Fights!!!

That's the thing.  This Emory team is loads better than they were in November, but I think Wabash has improved quite a bit as well.  I'm rooting for that matchup, because it'll be a great game regardless.  I wonder if two guys have every scored 40 in the same NCAA tournament game?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on March 02, 2022, 08:15:23 AM
I can't speak to Emory's development over the year.  I can say that members of the Wabash squad have seen some extraordinary growth over the year.  Everyone knew that Davidson would be Davidson.  The development of kids like Watson and Schreiber and Jones has been fun to watch.  Have to beat Berry first!!!

It's a good group of kids.  I hope they have a nice run.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on March 02, 2022, 02:23:56 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on March 02, 2022, 07:36:29 AM
Quote from: Martindale on March 01, 2022, 10:14:22 AM
The Little Giants head to Atlanta to play Berry College on Friday.  If they win, a potential rematch against Emory awaits.  They beat Emory in November but that wasn't the playoffs and the game was played in Ohio, not Emory's home gym.  Still, I won't put anything past these Little Giants right now.

Wabash Always Fights!!!

That's the thing.  This Emory team is loads better than they were in November, but I think Wabash has improved quite a bit as well.  I'm rooting for that matchup, because it'll be a great game regardless.  I wonder if two guys have every scored 40 in the same NCAA tournament game?

I'm pretty sure that that's never happened before. The late Gerald Reece of William Penn scored 47 and Michael Thomas of North Park scored 38 in a 1981 tournament game, but, unless I'm way off, that's as close as any duo has ever come to tandem 40s in a single D3 tourney game. It's interesting to note that both Reece and Thomas were guards, and they tallied those big numbers in a game played six years prior to D3 adding the three-pointer to men's basketball.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on March 05, 2022, 07:38:08 AM
The Little Giants are still dancing after beating Berry 91-79.  Wabash was down ten early but got their heads together and led the game throughout the second half.  We converted turnovers well, and kept Berry off the offensive glass.  They bottled up Davidson from deep, so he drove and made his points in the paint.  The kid is really something special.

Play Emory at their gym tonight. 

Impossible not to notice that on the other side of our regional #11 Mount was beat yesterday.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on March 07, 2022, 09:44:58 AM
Little Giants versus Purple Cows, Friday in Bloomington.

A stranger pairing of mascots has never been seen.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Whitecarrera on March 11, 2022, 07:05:58 PM
That Williams guard needs to dribble between his legs a few more times, because that's really cool when you're down by twenty!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 14, 2022, 08:52:08 AM
Quote from: Whitecarrera on March 11, 2022, 07:05:58 PM
That Williams guard needs to dribble between his legs a few more times, because that's really cool when you're down by twenty!!

That's pretty funny.

Anyway, congratulations to Wabash advancing to the Final Four.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on March 18, 2022, 12:03:37 PM
It's Game Day!

LET'S GO WABASH!!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 19, 2022, 07:34:44 AM
A lot of talk on Twitter about Schreiber the last 2 weekends. Curious if this has been his M.O. throughout his career. I figured someone on this board would have an opinion since you'd be familiar with him and Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on March 25, 2022, 08:56:12 AM
Wabash College senior guard Jack Davidson earned the Jostens Trophy Award as the NCAA Division III Most Outstanding Men's Basketball Player for the 2021-2022 season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on March 25, 2022, 09:24:46 AM
Obviously Wabash loses Watson and Davidson. So how does the NCAC look for next season? Is it back to the Woo and Witt show?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on March 25, 2022, 10:34:17 AM
We recruited a 6'8 kid, so along with Ahmoni Jones we will have good size.  Replacing those senior guards and ALL the points they scored will be no easy feat.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on March 26, 2022, 12:52:02 PM
Quote from: Martindale on March 25, 2022, 10:34:17 AM
We recruited a 6'8 kid, so along with Ahmoni Jones we will have good size.  Replacing those senior guards and ALL the points they scored will be no easy feat.
6'8 and 6'11 freshmen incoming. Will need to still get an impact guard - probably going hard after Randy Kelley of Sullivan (IN).
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WABCOL86 on April 04, 2022, 11:30:51 AM
Color me confused, what team are you referring to?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on April 04, 2022, 07:17:51 PM
Quote from: WABCOL86 on April 04, 2022, 11:30:51 AM
Color me confused, what team are you referring to?

Wabash.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Next Man Up on April 21, 2022, 07:48:21 PM
Oberlin will be naming SUNY Canton coach Shiva Senthil as their new head coach.
He has been at Canton the last 3 years during which he compiled a record of 29-25. In 2019-2020 his team won the North Atlantic Conference championship and went to the NCAA Tournament for the first time ever. They played only one game in 2020-2021 due to Covid. Senthil had previously coached at U of Chicago, Clarkson, and SUNY Purchase.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on October 28, 2022, 10:33:17 AM
Wabash all-time leading scorer Jack Davidson has earned himself a spot on the roster for Greensboro Swarm of the NBA G-League.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on October 30, 2022, 04:50:06 AM
And Davidson was waived last night.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on October 30, 2022, 08:38:28 PM
Well that hurts.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: smedindy on November 01, 2022, 02:05:11 AM
That's the way it goes on the fringes.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on November 01, 2022, 09:23:59 AM
Any word on the other D3 guys? Flory, Nolan, Turell?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on November 12, 2022, 10:05:43 AM
Wabash took down #16 WashU last night. Looks like they'll score by committee this year as they have a few guys who can go for 15+ any night as shown by their first two games. Defensively, they'll be really stout on the perimeter.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on November 17, 2022, 10:03:03 AM
I was looking at some stats and was surprised to see Ahmoni Jones is not starting and is averaging about five minutes played less per game than last season. Was not expecting that. Any insight into that situation? Was he really jumped on the roster by guys who were behind him last season?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on November 23, 2022, 12:37:22 AM
Quote from: ziggy on November 17, 2022, 10:03:03 AM
I was looking at some stats and was surprised to see Ahmoni Jones is not starting and is averaging about five minutes played less per game than last season. Was not expecting that. Any insight into that situation? Was he really jumped on the roster by guys who were behind him last season?
Jones had some off-season knee procedures and was eased into the season minutes-wise. He didn't start the first 3 games of the year but has since started the last three games and will continue to do so, although likely at 20-25 minutes a game this season until he's back to 100%.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Crawford on December 02, 2022, 08:12:25 PM
Interesting to see Wabash schedule Bellarmine U.  BU has played Louisville, Duke, UCLA and Kentucky already this season.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on December 14, 2022, 09:03:12 AM
Does anyone know where in Nashville Denison will be playing after Christmas? All I can find listed is Nashville. My family will just happen to be in Nashville on a Civil War trip at the same time and that would make a nice end to a day.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on December 14, 2022, 11:18:56 AM
Denison is participating in a D3 tournament called the Music City Classic, but, contrary to its name and what the various participating schools indicate on their websites (including Denison's), the Music City Classic isn't held in Nashville at all. Instead, it's held at Welch College in Gallatin, which is about thirty miles northeast of Nashville.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ohiofan1954 on December 14, 2022, 06:16:04 PM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on December 14, 2022, 11:18:56 AM
Denison is participating in a D3 tournament called the Music City Classic, but, contrary to its name and what the various participating schools indicate on their websites (including Denison's), the Music City Classic isn't held in Nashville at all. Instead, it's held at Welch College in Gallatin, which is about thirty miles northeast of Nashville.
Thank you very much, it is appreciated.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Wildcat on February 24, 2023, 11:14:55 AM
 I'm trying to find out about a Wabash recruit. The young man's last name is Roache. He committed to Wabash last spring, he is listed at 6-11 but I don't see him on the roster. Anybody have any information on him?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: sigma one on February 26, 2023, 08:25:11 AM
As far as I know, he started practice last fall, but is no longer with the team.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on February 27, 2023, 02:41:18 PM
The Little Giants play Whitewater in Cleveland.  Another tough bracket, just like last year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Shamrock on March 04, 2023, 09:54:11 AM
Great season Little Giants. More to come from this talented young group.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on October 10, 2023, 03:38:06 PM
Anyone hearing anything about any of the NCAC teams this year? Should be another solid year for the conference.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on October 10, 2023, 09:02:13 PM
I don't know much, but I'm guessing it's Wabash and Wooster again.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WABCOL86 on October 18, 2023, 07:53:48 PM
Well, I hope for entertaining basketball from all the NCAC teams.  Wabash has a seven foot transfer from Northern Kentucky.  That ought to be interesting.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Gregory Sager on October 18, 2023, 11:31:19 PM
Quote from: WABCOL86 on October 18, 2023, 07:53:48 PM
Well, I hope for entertaining basketball from all the NCAC teams.  Wabash has a seven foot transfer from Northern Kentucky.  That ought to be interesting.

Not just a seven-foot transfer -- Noah Hupmann is a 7'2", 240 transfer. He's gotta be the biggest player in D3, easily, and I wouldn't be surprised if he's the biggest player in all of college basketball outside of D1.

However, he scored a grand total of 16 points in 30 games spread out across three seasons for the Norse. Last year he got into three games, played a combined five minutes in them, and scored a single point. Suffice it to say that he didn't exactly set the world on fire at NKU.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on October 19, 2023, 06:28:46 AM
Quote from: Gregory Sager on October 18, 2023, 11:31:19 PM
Quote from: WABCOL86 on October 18, 2023, 07:53:48 PM
Well, I hope for entertaining basketball from all the NCAC teams.  Wabash has a seven foot transfer from Northern Kentucky.  That ought to be interesting.

Not just a seven-foot transfer -- Noah Hupmann is a 7'2", 240 transfer. He's gotta be the biggest player in D3, easily, and I wouldn't be surprised if he's the biggest player in all of college basketball outside of D1.

However, he scored a grand total of 16 points in 30 games spread out across three seasons for the Norse. Last year he got into three games, played a combined five minutes in them, and scored a single point. Suffice it to say that he didn't exactly set the world on fire at NKU.

Are we talking biggest or tallest, because I believe Connor Williams is still playing at St. John Fisher.

Greenville also has a 7 foot freshman, but I think he's pretty skinny.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on October 20, 2023, 11:46:40 AM
Carthage's Julian Campbell is only 6'8", but he's 279 lbs. Has a real nice soft shooting touch too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on November 03, 2023, 02:33:47 PM
Interesting that Wooster's Elijah Meredith isn't on the roster. He was listed as a junior last year. 2nd leading scorer.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: w00lax on November 14, 2023, 11:47:08 AM
What are the chances Wabash repeats as champion? Do people see Wooster or any other teams having a strong chance of challenging for the NCAC title?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAF 89 on November 22, 2023, 01:21:37 PM
Happy Thanksgiving!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on November 22, 2023, 07:34:33 PM
Watching this Wooster at Mount game the only thing I'm confident saying is there's no way Wooster is a contender to win the NCAC.  They are very very limited offensively.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on November 23, 2023, 07:17:22 AM
Prior to the loss to the Mount, they were averaging over 75 pts a game. Last year they averaged 75 a game. Billings is off to a slow start, but they have Ashton Price, a transfer from BW lighting up, scoring almost 16 a game. They had to replace 3 starters. I think they'll come around.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: WAF 89 on November 30, 2023, 12:02:22 PM
A bit of order restored to the universe:
Wabash 62 - DePauw 61
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on February 20, 2024, 02:34:42 PM
Wabash won the NCAC after being 8-8 midway through the season. The LG's host the tournament now and should have an inside track back to the postseason. They lose a lot of talent after this year so it might be their best shot in a bit.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on February 20, 2024, 10:12:03 PM
Chalk first round of the NCAC tournament tonight across the four games.

#1 Wabash over #8 Kenyon 84-65
#2 Wooster over #7 DePauw in OT 83-80 - Wooster almost choked it away after being up 7 with 3 minutes left.
#3 Wittenberg over #6 Ohio Wesleyan 71-59
#4 Denison over #5 Oberlin 78-62

Wabash hosts the remaining 3 games starting on Friday.

Wooster v Wittenberg at 5:30 on Friday
Denison @ Wabash at 7:30 on Friday

It's a one bid league this year.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: w00lax on February 21, 2024, 02:49:39 PM
Im predicting another Wabash vs Wooster final, with the Little Giants unfortunately getting the auto bid over my Scots.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on February 21, 2024, 03:31:20 PM
Quote from: w00lax on February 21, 2024, 02:49:39 PMIm predicting another Wabash vs Wooster final, with the Little Giants unfortunately getting the auto bid over my Scots.

It should certainly be Wabash/Wooster. Wabash always plays better at home and are on a 10 game winning streak. However, Denison has caused Wabash some issues this year and and I would not be surprised if they tripped up on Friday night...and if they don't...I'm not sure I'd put the money on Wabash to beat Wooster. Tough to beat a team three times.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on February 24, 2024, 01:45:36 AM
Anyone know where to locate the Wabash/Denison VOD? It's not on Team One or uploaded to the NCAC site either.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on February 24, 2024, 06:25:15 PM
Wabash takes down Wooster 75-64 to advance to the NCAA tournament once again.

Wabash has been hot from behind the arc and continued that today hitting 14-24 from beyond the arc. Very good defensive effort as well and Wooster just couldn't get shots to fall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Little Giant 89 on February 26, 2024, 01:34:01 PM
The Little Giants take on the Coehawks at Trine University in Angola, Indiana.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 26, 2024, 01:47:15 PM
Quote from: Little Giant 89 on February 26, 2024, 01:34:01 PMThe Little Giants take on the Coehawks at Trine University in Angola, Indiana.

I don't know if its good luck or bad luck, but I suspect I'll pick Wabash to win that one in the d3hoops tournament preview.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Crawford on February 26, 2024, 03:30:41 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 26, 2024, 01:47:15 PM
Quote from: Little Giant 89 on February 26, 2024, 01:34:01 PMThe Little Giants take on the Coehawks at Trine University in Angola, Indiana.

I don't know if its good luck or bad luck, but I suspect I'll pick Wabash to win that one in the d3hoops tournament preview.
ya Ryan, you have to pick them just because of their mascot,The Little Giants !
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 26, 2024, 04:17:22 PM
Quote from: Crawford on February 26, 2024, 03:30:41 PM
Quote from: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on February 26, 2024, 01:47:15 PM
Quote from: Little Giant 89 on February 26, 2024, 01:34:01 PMThe Little Giants take on the Coehawks at Trine University in Angola, Indiana.

I don't know if its good luck or bad luck, but I suspect I'll pick Wabash to win that one in the d3hoops tournament preview.
ya Ryan, you have to pick them just because of their mascot,The Little Giants !

Almost as good as the Fighting Quakers.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on March 01, 2024, 11:47:58 AM
Excited for the game today. Not sure how they'll fair but I suspect that they will keep it within single digits. Crowd will be great.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Crawford on March 01, 2024, 08:57:32 PM
Proud of our Little Giants.  Congratulations to Coe.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on March 18, 2024, 10:30:46 AM
Unbelievable that Trine ran the table this year. What a good challenge up there for Wabash against Coe. Will be a different team next year, that's for sure.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Little Giant 89 on April 12, 2024, 08:20:52 AM
https://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2023-24/contrib/20240411vgk9oj (https://www.d3hoops.com/seasons/men/2023-24/contrib/20240411vgk9oj)

A tough loss for the Little Giant program.  Coach Sully has been an outstanding representative of the program and the College.  He will do well at Allegheny.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Little Giant 89 on May 29, 2024, 12:32:49 PM
https://sports.wabash.edu/news/2024/5/29/thompson-takes-wabash-assistant-basketball-coaching-position.aspx (https://sports.wabash.edu/news/2024/5/29/thompson-takes-wabash-assistant-basketball-coaching-position.aspx)

There's a new Liam Thompson on the Wabash College campus.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Little Giant 89 on May 29, 2024, 02:00:11 PM
...and a new Sizemore as well.

https://sports.wabash.edu/news/2024/5/28/sizemore-joins-wabash-basketball-program-as-assistant-coach.aspx (https://sports.wabash.edu/news/2024/5/28/sizemore-joins-wabash-basketball-program-as-assistant-coach.aspx)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: w00lax on June 10, 2024, 05:59:27 PM
Any information on incoming Wooster players this Fall?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Little Giant 89 on June 21, 2024, 03:02:39 PM
The Wabash schedule has been released.  We start the year in Angola, Indiana, participating in the Trine University Classic.  It appears that we are also participating in the Don Lane Classic in Lexington, but there are no games listed.

https://sports.wabash.edu/sports/mens-basketball/schedule (https://sports.wabash.edu/sports/mens-basketball/schedule)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on June 21, 2024, 05:34:35 PM
Transylvania doesn't have their schedule up yet, so no idea who the other two teams are in the Don Lane Classic. That Wash U. game is gonna be a great game too.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Flying Dutch Fan on August 09, 2024, 07:28:23 AM
Pretty shocking news from Wittenberg - escpecially this close to a new school year beginning:

https://www.wittenbergtigers.com/sports/mbkb/2024-25/releases/CrociResigns
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on August 09, 2024, 03:03:34 PM
Yeah. That's not convenient! I presume they'll just have an interim coach for the upcoming season...
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Little Giant 89 on October 22, 2024, 04:32:00 PM
The Wabash roster has been updated to include five freshmen.  I only know about one of them, Robert Sorensen from Guerin Catholic.  He's a talented young man, who could be the team's point guard of the future.

Only two seniors on the roster, including 7'2 Noah Huppmann, whose skills have continued to develop in his time on the Little Giant roster.

First game is in 17 days against Heidelberg as part of the Trine Invitational.

https://sports.wabash.edu/sports/mens-basketball/roster?sort=class (https://sports.wabash.edu/sports/mens-basketball/roster?sort=class)

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Flying Dutch Fan on October 23, 2024, 08:18:51 AM
Quote from: Little Giant 89 on October 22, 2024, 04:32:00 PMOnly two seniors on the roster, including 7'2 Noah Huppmann, whose skills have continued to develop in his time on the Little Giant roster.


Gotta love a 7'2 guy who is a Little Giant!!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: ziggy on October 23, 2024, 08:58:17 AM
Quote from: Flying Dutch Fan on October 23, 2024, 08:18:51 AM
Quote from: Little Giant 89 on October 22, 2024, 04:32:00 PMOnly two seniors on the roster, including 7'2 Noah Huppmann, whose skills have continued to develop in his time on the Little Giant roster.


Gotta love a 7'2 guy who is a Little Giant!!

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: CollegeGolf18 on October 28, 2024, 11:52:01 PM
He really progressed throughout the year last year. He showed some flashes early on but by the end of the year was pretty consistent. Got over the fouling a bit and learned to defend the basket.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Greek Tragedy on October 31, 2024, 06:32:01 PM
https://northcoast.org/news/2024/10/29/wooster-preseason-favorite-in-2024-25-mens-basketball-poll.aspx

1. Wooster (6)
2. Denison (1)
3. Wabash (2)
4. Wittenberg
5. Oberlin
6. DePauw
7. Ohio Wesleyan
8. Kenyon
9. Hiram
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Little Giant 89 on November 01, 2024, 04:07:00 PM
Looking ahead to next year, I assume that JCU would have received all of those first place votes.  Going to be a tougher road in the North Coast starting next fall.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: w00lax on November 05, 2024, 04:11:56 PM
JCU addition to the NCAC is an absolute positive. It increases internal competition and could lead to multiple bids come tournament time.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: D3 Poster on November 14, 2024, 08:00:21 PM
JCU will be inteteresting to see what they have next year...losing all ? the transfer ins after this year?  Time to restock.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: w00lax on December 15, 2024, 11:45:07 AM
Wooster up to #8 in D3 Poll and #9 in the Massey rankings with a game vs DePauw today and then a trip to Hawaii later in the week. Who in the NCAC do we see competing with Wooster for the AQ? Denison and Wabash?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: deiscanton on December 23, 2024, 10:19:16 AM
My thoughts on Wooster win vs DII Hawaii Pacific--

1.)  I got to see the D3DataCast episode this morning.   I know Wooster counted this win and the game stats as an official win in their overall record and counted the game stats vs Hawaii Pacific as part of their official season stats, so it was fair to ask how this win would be treated on NPI if Hawaii Pacific were a D3 opponent and not a D2 opponent.

If Hawaii Pacific were in DIII, they would not be in the top 25. The Sharks would probably not be receiving votes, either.   However, the NPI of Hawaii Pacific would probably be over 53, so Wooster would get quality bonus win points for the win in the NPI, in my opinion.

However, since Hawaii Pacific is not a D3 opponent, Wooster does not get a boost in NPI for the win.

2.)  The game was overpriced at $26.99 a month for streaming video for all the games in the Hoops in Hawaii Classic.  Pass the Ball Live would have done D3 fans a better service by allowing FloSports to stream the game-- then, it would have been part of the FloCollege $19.95/month streaming package deal, and it may have made sense to bite the bullet for a month to watch the game.

3.)  For a fair streaming fee for this game, you have to know that Hawaii Pacific charges $10 for an in-person game ticket for each home basketball game.

For this game, the streaming price should have been no more than $4.99, 50% of the in person price to watch a Hawaii Pacific home game.   I would have paid that price to watch the Wooster vs Hawaii Pacific game, not the $26.99 that Pass the Ball Live was asking for. 

4.)  For Hawaii Pacific, it is a good opportunity to play another college basketball opponent from another area of the country, no matter what the division.   Hawaii Pacific is in the West Region of D2, and did not make the D2 tournament last year, nor are the Sharks ranked in the D2 Top 25 currently.   

The Sharks are restricted by NCAA D2 rules to play primarily West Region opponents in their regular season schedule.   They would not get a chance to play a D2 team from the Midwest unless they won both the PacWest title and made it to the Elite Eight by winning the D2 West Region Championship.

PS-- Hawaii Pacific would probably struggle against Quad 4 DI teams as well.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on January 10, 2025, 12:15:26 AM
Quote from: D3 Poster on November 14, 2024, 08:00:21 PMJCU will be inteteresting to see what they have next year...losing all ? the transfer ins after this year?  Time to restock.

I have concerns. This coaching staff had a great first season with the talent brought in and developed by the former coach. They then struggled mightily for several years and showed no ability to identify, attract and retain top-notch high school talent. Two years ago, the HC's nephew transferred from a D1 school and several other D1 and D2 transfers joined him for what has been a very very good three-year run. Those guys, for the most part, are gone after this season. I question the ability to reload at any level.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on January 10, 2025, 10:59:11 AM
I only learned about the uncle/nephew relationship this season.  I somehow was oblivious and missed that before.
 Previously I had thought maybe hitting the transfer portal hard was going to be Moran's MO but it sounds like that may have been a perfect storm as opposed to a long-term strategy.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan) on January 10, 2025, 12:12:39 PM

Yeah, there were a couple of interviews about it the last year or two.  I believe all or all but one of the transfers came to JCU, rather than being recruited, although I think most of them were recruited out of HS and went elsewhere.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on January 10, 2025, 01:30:26 PM
There is nothing wrong, especially at the division three level, in reminding student athletes who take a division one or division two scholarship, that they always have a place in your program if they want to return home. In fact, I think it is an excellent strategy at a school in a metropolitan area like John Carol. However, your life blood will still be recruiting high quality high school athletes right out of high school. He has failed to show an ability to do that.
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Dr. Acula on January 10, 2025, 02:32:28 PM
For sure.  Mount benefitted from that when Gurley transferred to YSU then transferred back.  A coach would be foolish to not make sure good players know the door is always open.

Is the HS recruiting issue lack of landing high quality players or lack of developing kids once they're on campus?
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Onward on, John Carroll on January 13, 2025, 10:08:32 AM
Quote from: Dr. Acula on January 10, 2025, 02:32:28 PMFor sure.  Mount benefitted from that when Gurley transferred to YSU then transferred back.  A coach would be foolish to not make sure good players know the door is always open.

Is the HS recruiting issue lack of landing high quality players or lack of developing kids once they're on campus?

I'm not smart enough to know the answer to that question. While development is important, I think the raw talent is necessary to allow for any development to manifest itself in wins and quality teams. I just feel like other than the nephew and his buddies, the talent is less than what it was during the previous regime. But I could be wrong and I could be just grumpy!! Six wins in a row have been nice - admittedly.

Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Little Giant 89 on January 30, 2025, 08:00:42 AM
Tom Bambrey would have been pleased.

https://sports.wabash.edu/news/2025/1/29/basketball-three-point-barrage-leads-wabash-to-season-sweep-of-depauw.aspx (https://sports.wabash.edu/news/2025/1/29/basketball-three-point-barrage-leads-wabash-to-season-sweep-of-depauw.aspx)
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Little Giant 89 on February 05, 2025, 03:49:50 PM
Denison versus Wabash at Chadwick Court tonight for the number one spot in the North Coast!

Wabash Always Fights!
Title: Re: MBB: North Coast Athletic Conference
Post by: Little Giant 89 on February 05, 2025, 08:46:36 PM
Final
Denison 53 Wabash 51
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